# Multi-IEM Review - 352 IEMs compared (Pump Audio Earphones added 04/03/16 p. 1106)



## ljokerl (Feb 25, 2020)

[size=medium]Intro:[/size]

 This thread contains my sound quality-focused reviews of In Ear Monitors (IEMs) in my possession. It is meant to be a quick reference for those in need of earphone recommendations or a start-off point for research into IEMs. 

*A more up-to-date, interactive, sortable version of this thread can now be found here.*

*An abridged buyer's guide containing my some of my favorite earphones by sound signature, can be found here.*

*A guide to my favorite sub-$50 earphones can be found here.*

*A few of my favorite custom monitors can be found in the CIEM Buyer's Guide here.*



Other Useful Links

 My running comparison of portable and semi-portable headphones:
Portable Headphones Review List 
 A brief overview of IEM fitment:
How to Insert In-Ear Monitors
 Head-Fi Glossary: concise definitions of some common sound terminology:
Describing Sound - A Glossary
 A brief introduction to Bluetooth audio:
Wireless fidelity: making sense of Bluetooth headphone technology
 For an overview of custom earphones, by average_joe:
Custom IEM Review List
 Info on hearing safety and why IEMs can be safer than headphones:
MP3 Players: How Loud Is Too Loud?
 In-depth information on various types of balanced armature receivers:
CHART | Balanced Armature-Based In-Ear Monitors & Technical Characteristics

Ratings:

The quantities tested, as I define them, are:

*Accessories*: How useful and complete the bundled set of accessories is. Depends on the quantity and quality of the accessories, as well as on how well-suited they are for the earphone they come with.
*Build Quality:* Depends choice of materials, assembly quality, structural design, and overall feel. Also includes any observations on the durability of the earphones while in my care.
*Isolation:* Amount of passive reduction in ambient noise provided by the IEM. All IEMs isolate external noise by virtue of sealed ear coupling, but some are better than others. The better-isolating IEMs are capable of providing is upwards of 30db of attenuation, an 8-fold reduction in ambient noise volume (enough to reduce the volume of a vacuum cleaner to a whisper).
*Microphonics:* Susceptibility to cable noise (a.k.a. microphonics), a common malady affecting in-ear earphones. Mitigating factors such as the inclusion of a shirt clip or cable cinch and the ease of wearing the IEMs over-the-ear are taken into account.
*Comfort:* How easy the earphone is over long stretches of time. Typically tip- and ear-dependent, but general trends still apply. 
*Sound:* Possibly the most subjective of the categories, the sound rating is an evaluation of the relative merits of the audio performance, scaled to the best earphone I have heard.
*Value:* How all of the earphone’s flaws and merits compare to the competition at and above its price point.


Table of Contents:

 Every IEM review in this thread is paired with a search marker. The search function of your browser can be used to navigate to each. Please also note that my tier demarcations are *not* representative of sound or any other qualities of an earphone, only of the US street price at the moment of this writing.

*Tier 3C ($0-15)*
 (3C1) Kanen MD-51
 (3C2) MEElectronics SX31
 (3C3) Skullcandy Ink’d
 (3C4) MEElectronics M2
 (3C5) JVC HA-FX34 “Marshmallows”
 (3C6) Q:Electronics Earbuds
 (3C7) Dealextreme Orange IEMs
 (3C8) AudioSource IEBAS / IEWAS
 (3C9) Kanen KM-948
 (3C10) Coby CVEM79 Jammerz Platinum
 (3C11) Sentry HO470 Wooden
 (3C12) JVC HA-EBX85
 (3C13) elago E3
 (3C14) Earsquake CRO
 (3C15) Earsquake Fish
 (3C16) Earsquake SHA
 (3C17) MaiKe MK-EL5031
 (3C18) Sentry HO642
 (3C19) Skullcandy Smokin' Buds
 (3C20) Section 8 Earbuds 
 (3C21) Monoprice 8320 (MEP-933) 
 (3C22) Ultimate Ears 100
 (3C23) Nuforce NE-600X

*Tier 3B ($15-30)* (Open)
 (3B1) MEElectronics M6
 (3B2) Head-Direct RE2
 (3B3) MEElectronics M9
 (3B4) MEElectronics R1
 (3B5) Soundmagic PL21 / M21
 (3B6) JVC HA-FXC50 “Micro HD”
 (3B7) JLAB JBuds J3 Micro Atomic
 (3B8) Lenntek Sonix Micro
 (3B9) Soundmagic PL30
 (3B10) JVC HA-FX66 “Air Cushion”
 (3B11) Beta Brainwavz Pro
 (3B12) ECCI PR100
 (3B13) Sennheiser CX300
 (3B14) Sennheiser CX250
 (3B15) JVC HA-FX67 "Air Cushion"
 (3B16) Fischer Audio Toughstuff TS-9002
 (3B17) Yamaha EPH-20
 (3B18) Koss KE29
 (3B19) Earjax Tonic
 (3B20) Sony MDR-EX082 / MDR-EX85
 (3B21) dB Logic EP-100
 (3B22) Xears Bullet XB120PRO
 (3B23) MEElectronics M16
 (3B24) MEElectronics RX11
 (3B25) H2O Audio Flex
 (3B26) Kozee E100 
 (3B27) Fischer Audio Daleth 
 (3B28) ECCI PG100
 (3B29) Fischer Audio FA-788
 (3B30) Brainwavz Beta
 (3B31) Koss KEB70 
 (3B32) Sunrise Aodia i100
 (3B33) VSonic GR99 
 (3B34) JVC HA-FX40
 (3B35) Rock-It Sounds R-10
 (3B36) Rock-It Sounds R-11
 (3B37) JVC HA-FX101
 (3B38) Astrotec DX-60
 (3B39) TDK MT300
 (3B40) Etymotic Research ETY-Kids 5 / 3
 (3B41) NarMoo R1M
 (3B42) Xiaomi Piston 2
 (3B43) Fidue A31s
 (3B44) Xiaomi Piston 3
 (3B45) Popclik Evolo - Added 11/10/2015

*Tier 3A ($30-60)* (Open)
 (3A1) RadiopPaq Jazz
 (3A2) Nuforce NE-7M / NE-6
 (3A3) JVC HA-FX300 BiMetal
 (3A4) MEElectronics M11
 (3A5) Soundmagic PL50
 (3A6) Cyclone PR1 Pro
 (3A7) Skullcandy TiTan
 (3A8) Apple Dual-Driver IEMs (ADDIEM)
 (3A9) Maximo iMetal iM-390 / iP-HS3
 (3A10) Maximo iMetal iM-590 / iP-HS5
 (3A11) Zune Premium Headphones V2
 (3A12) Klipsch Custom 1
 (3A13) VSonic R02ProII
 (3A14) Music Valley SP1
 (3A15) Lear Le01
 (3A16) Lear Le01+
 (3A17) Ankit Stay True
 (3A18) ECCI PR200
 (3A19) Audio-Technica ATH-CK6
 (3A20) ViSang R02 / Brainwavz ProAlpha
 (3A21) Woodees IESW101B / IESW100B
 (3A22) Thinksound TS01
 (3A23) Brainwavz M1
 (3A24) Klipsch Image S2 / S2m
 (3A25) Arctic Sound E361
 (3A26) RadioPaq Classical
 (3A27) JVC HA-FXC80 "Black Series"
 (3A28) H2O Audio Surge
 (3A29) ViSang R01
 (3A30) ECCI PR300
 (3A31) Xears TD100
 (3A32) Hippo Shroom
 (3A33) Yamaha EPH-50
 (3A34) Pioneer SE-CLX50
 (3A35) Sennheiser CX280
 (3A36) Sennheiser CX281
 (3A37) TDK EB900
 (3A38) Sony MDR-XB40EX
 (3A39) Skullcandy FMJ
 (3A40) Hippo Boom
 (3A41) Hippo Pearl
 (3A42) MEElectronics CX21
 (3A43) MEElectronics CW31 
 (3A44) MEElectronics M21
 (3A45) MEElectronics M31
 (3A46) Xears TD-III Blackwood v2
 (3A47) PADACS Aksent
 (3A48) Denon AH-C360
 (3A49) H2O Audio Surge Pro mini
 (3A50) Xears Resonance
 (3A51) Xears PS120PRO 
 (3A52) Xears XR120PRO II 
 (3A53) Skullcandy Holua
 (3A54) Soundmagic E30 
 (3A55) Blue Ever Blue 866B 
 (3A56) Soundmagic E10 
 (3A57) Xears Nature N3i
 (3A58) Xears XE200PRO
 (3A59) Dunu DN-12 Trident
 (3A60) Xears Communicate CP100iP
 (3A61) Ultimate Ears 350 / 350vi 
 (3A62) Fischer Audio Ceramique 
 (3A63) Fischer Audio FA-977 Jazz
 (3A64) Fischer Audio Paradigm v.3 
 (3A65) Sony MDR-EX300LP
 (3A66) id America Spark 
 (3A67) Altec Lansing UHP336 / Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 3
 (3A68) Astrotec AM-90 
 (3A69) VSonic GR02 Bass Edition 
 (3A70) Philips O'Neill Tread SHO2200
 (3A71) Klipsch Image S3
 (3A72) Rock-It Sounds R-20 
 (3A73) Brainwavz M5
 (3A74) ViSang VS-K1
 (3A75) RHA MA-350
 (3A76) Spider TinyEar
 (3A77) VSonic VC02 
 (3A78) VSonic R02 Silver
 (3A79) Dunu DN-22M Detonator
 (3A80) Sony MH1C
 (3A81) LG Quadbeat HSS-F420
 (3A82) Signature Acoustics Elements C-12
 (3A83) SteelSeries Flux In-Ear
 (3A84) Fidue A63
 (3A85) T-Peos Tank
 (3A86) T-Peos Popular
 (3A87) T-Peos D200R 
 (3A88) NarMoo S1 
 (3A89) Brainwavz S1 
 (3A90) T-Peos Rich200
 (3A91) Tekfusion Twinwoofers
 (3A92) JVC Xtreme Xplosives HA-FR301
 (3A93) Brainwavz S0
 (3A94) Zipbuds PRO
 (3A95) HiFiMan RE300h
 (3A96) JVC XX Elation HA-FR100X - Added 03/13/2016
*(3A97) Pump Audio Earphones - Added 04/03/2016*

*Tier 2C ($60-100)* (Open)
 (2C1) Head-Direct RE0
 (2C2) Ultimate Ears MetroFi 220
 (2C3) Klipsch Image S4 / S4i
 (2C4) V-Moda Vibe II
 (2C5) Auvio Armature
 (2C6) Klipsch Custom 2
 (2C7) ViSang R03 / Brainwavz M2
 (2C8) JAYS j-JAYS
 (2C9) Thinksound Rain
 (2C10) Rockford Fosgate Punch Plugs
 (2C11) Sleek Audio SA1
 (2C12) Hippo VB 
 (2C13) Fischer Audio Eterna 
 (2C14) Grado iGi 
 (2C15) Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO
 (2C16) MEElectronics M11+
 (2C17) Phiaton PS210
 (2C18) JAYS t-JAYS Three
 (2C19) Fischer Audio Silver Bullet
 (2C20) Thinksound TS02
 (2C21) Earjax Lyrics
 (2C22) Sunrise SW-Xcape
 (2C23) Brainwavz M3 / ViSang R04
 (2C24) Monster Lil' Jamz
 (2C25) Nuforce NE-700X / NE-700M
 (2C26) MEElectronics A151
 (2C27) ECCI PR401
 (2C28) MEElectronics SP51
 (2C29) MEElectronics CC51
 (2C30) Phiaton PS 20
 (2C31) Pioneer SE-CLX60
 (2C32) Woodees IESW100L Blues
 (2C33) Monster Jamz
 (2C34) Etymotic Research MC5 / MC3
 (2C35) Beyerdynamic DTX 71 iE
 (2C36) Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE / MMX 101 iE 
 (2C37) Dunu DN-11 Ares 
 (2C38) Dunu DN-13 Crius
 (2C39) Spider Realvoice 
 (2C40) Dunu DN-16 Hephaes
 (2C41) Shure SE215
 (2C42) HiSoundAudio Crystal 
 (2C43) Fischer Audio Consonance 
 (2C44) Phonak Audéo Perfect Bass 012
 (2C45) Dunu DN-17 Crater
 (2C46) Dunu DN-18 Hawkeye 
 (2C47) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 4 / 4vi 
 (2C48) Hippo 10EB 
 (2C49) Velodyne vPulse 
 (2C50) Ultimate Ears 500 / 500vi
 (2C51) VSonic GR06
 (2C52) Rock-It Sounds R-30 
 (2C53) Thinksound MS01
 (2C54) HiFiMan RE-400 Waterline
 (2C55) Astrotec AM-800 
 (2C56) Audio-Technica CKM500
 (2C57) Dunu DN-23 Landmine
 (2C58) Ultimate Ears 600 / 600vi
 (2C59) Nuforce NE-700X / NE-700M (2013 version)
 (2C60) Moe Audio MOE-SS01
 (2C61) HiSoundAudio BA100
 (2C62) Astrotec AX-35
 (2C63) Rock Jaw Alfa Genus 
 (2C64) UBSOUND Fighter
 (2C65) Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear - Added 03/26/2015
 (2C66) NHT SuperBuds - Added 05/05/2015
 (2C67) Alpha & Delta AD01 - Added 09/25/2015
 (2C68) Philips Fidelio S1 - Added 10/04/2015

*Tier 2B ($100-150)* (Open)
 (2B1) Monster Turbine
 (2B2) Digital Designs DD DXB-01 EarbuDDs
 (2B3) Denon AH-C710
 (2B4) Westone 1
 (2B5) HiFiMan RE262 
 (2B6) Monster Beats Tour by Dr. Dre
 (2B7) Etymotic Research HF5 / ACS Custom Tips 
 (2B8) Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99
 (2B9) Fischer Audio Tandem
 (2B10) Fischer Audio SBA-03 / MEElectronics A161P
 (2B11) Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3
 (2B12) PureSound ClarityOne
 (2B13) JVC HA-FXT90
 (2B14) Sony MDR-EX600 
 (2B15) Paradigm Shift E3m
 (2B16) Yamaha EPH-100 
 (2B17) JVC HA-FXD80
 (2B18) HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2
 (2B19) Dunu I 3C-S 
 (2B20) Dunu DN-19 Tai Chi
 (2B21) Rock-It Sounds R-50 
 (2B22) T-Peos H-100
 (2B23) VSonic VC1000
 (2B24) SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro
 (2B25) RBH EP1 / EP2
 (2B26) RHA MA750/MA750i
 (2B27) Brainwavz R3 (ver. 2) 
 2B28) Philips Fidelio S2 - Added 10/04/2015

*Tier 2A ($150-250)* (Open)
 (2A1) Etymotic Research ER-4S
 (2A2) Phonak Audéo PFE 122
 (2A3) Head-Direct / HiFiMan RE252
 (2A4) Panasonic RP-HJE900
 (2A5) Monster Turbine Pro Gold
 (2A6) Yuin OK1
 (2A7) Radius HP-TWF11R Pro "DDM"
 (2A8) Future Sonics Atrio M8
 (2A9) Phiaton PS200
 (2A10) Audio-Technica ATH-CK90Pro
 (2A11) JAYS q-JAYS
 (2A12) Fischer Audio DBA-02
 (2A13) Westone 2 
 (2A14) Earsonics SM2 DLX
 (2A15) Kozee Sound Solutions Infinity X1 Executive
 (2A16) VSonic GR07 
 (2A17) Munitio Teknine SITi Nine Millimeter 
 (2A18) Future Sonics Atrio MG7 
 (2A19) Bowers & Wilkins C5 
 (2A20) HiFiMan RE272
 (2A21) ACS T15
 (2A22) JVC HA-FX500
 (2A23) Klipsch Image X10 / X10i 
 (2A24) TFTA-2100-2V1S / 1V 
 (2A25) Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII 
 (2A26) VSonic GR01
 (2A27) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5 Pro
 (2A28) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5 EB
 (2A29) Sennheiser CX980
 (2A30) VSonic GR07 Bass Edition
 (2A31) Dunu DN-1000
 (2A32) TDK BA200
 (2A33) RHA T20 / T20i* -* Added 01/31/2016

*Tier 1C ($250-400)* (Open)
 (1C1) Audio-Technica ATH-CK10 
 (1C2) Ortofon e-Q7
 (1C3) Klipsch Custom 3 
 (1C4) Sennheiser IE8
 (1C5) Westone UM3X
 (1C6) Monster Turbine Pro Copper
 (1C7) Monster Miles Davis Tribute
 (1C8) Westone 3
 (1C9) EarSonics SM3
 (1C10) JVC HA-FX700
 (1C11) Radius HP-TWF21
 (1C12) Ortofon e-Q5
 (1C13) j-phonic K2 SP 
 (1C14) Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200
 (1C15) Sony XBA-4SL / XBA-4iP
 (1C16) Monster Miles Davis Trumpet
 (1C17) Final Audio Design FI-BA-SB “Heaven S”
 (1C18) Final Audio Design FI-BA-SA “Heaven C”
 (1C19) Ultimate Ears UE 900
 (1C20) Sennheiser IE7
 (1C21) EarSonics SM64
 (1C22) Custom Art Music One
 (1C23) Fidue A83
 (1C24) DUNU DN-2000
 (1C25) FLC Technology FLC 8
 (1C26) LIFE Headphones - Added 12/30/2015

*Tier 1B ($400-600)* (Open)
 (1B1) Audio-Technica ATH-CK100
 (1B2) 1964EARS 1964-T
 (1B3) Westone 4
 (1B4) Shure SE530 
 (1B5) Shure SE535
 (1B6) Sony MDR-EX1000
 (1B7) Alclair Reference 
 (1B8) Phonak Audéo PFE 232
 (1B9) 1964EARS 1964-V3 
 (1B10) InEar StageDiver 2 (SD-2)
 (1B11) InEar StageDiver 3 (SD-3)
 (1B12) Olasonic Flat-4 Nami TH-F4N
 (1B13) LEAR LUF-4F / LUF-4B / LUF-4C

*Tier 1A ($600-1500)* (Open)
 (1A1) Final Audio Design FI-BA-SS
 (1A2) Unique Melody Miracle 
 (1A3) AKG K3003i
 (1A4) Spiral Ear SE 3-way Reference 
 (1A5) FitEar To Go! 334
 (1A6) Ultrasone IQ 
 (1A7) Hidition NT 6
 (1A8) Lime Ears LE3
 (1A9) Lime Ears LE3B
 (1A10) Sensaphonics 3MAX
 (1A11) JH Audio JH13 Pro
 (1A12) 1964EARS V6-Stage
 (1A13) Noble 4S
 (1A14) Clear Tune Monitors WLS-5
 (1A15) Gorilla Ears GX-4b
 (1A16) EarSonics Velvet - Added 09/02/2015

*(000) Conclusions & Summary Table* (Open)
 (001) Interactive Table
 (002) Upcoming Reviews
 (003) Buyer's Guide
 (004) Acknowledgements 
 (005) FAQs


Testing Note:

 On-the-go listening is done using a Cowon J3 and HiFiMan HM-901 portable players. A wide range of tracks in FLAC and mp3 file formats is used. Critical listening is done via an optical-fed iBasso D10 and the HiFiMan HM-901 using only WMA and Flac lossless files.



Reviews:


*[size=medium]Tier 3C ($0-15)[/size]*


*(3C1) Kanon (Kanen) MD-51*


Reviewed Nov 2009

 Current Price: *$4* from dealperfect.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω _| Sens: _100 dB_ | _Freq: 20-20k Hz_ | _Cord: 4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(1/5)* – All plastic build. Chrome paint tends to chip and there are gaps between the plastic parts. Cloth-wrapped cable is decent enough but lacks proper strain reliefs. Driver flex is a major annoyance
 Isolation *(1.5/5)* – Below average
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Not too bad when worn over-the-ear; bothersome otherwise
 Comfort *(2/5)* – Hard to wear over-the-ear, short nozzle, some sharp molding artifacts

 Sound *(2/10)* – Listenable but not special in any way. Poor treble extension and clarity, with some harshness lower down. The mids are veiled and dry but not too bad for $5. Soundstaging is nonexistent. The bass has more impact than most stock Earbuds but lacks control. Not an offensive sound, but not something I would listen to by choice.

 Value: *(4/10)* – The Kanen MD-51 is similar in sound to many stock buds but with slightly more bass impact. It’s not easy to find better options for the penny price but adding another $5 on top can yield a far better earphone.

*Pros: Cheap, nice cables, reasonable isolation, may be an upgrade from stock buds*
*Cons: Awful build quality, driver flex, no real strengths to the sound*


*(3C2) MEElectronics SX-31*


Reviewed Nov 2009

 Details: Entry-level Meelec IEM
 Current Price: *$8* from Newegg.com (MSRP: $14.99)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _96 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2/5)* – Cheap-feeling all-plastic build; thin rubbery cable with hard plastic strain reliefs on housing entry and heatshrink over 3.5mm plug
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Average
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Pretty good when worn over-the-ear; just passable otherwise
 Comfort *(3/5)* – Hard to wear over-the-ear; plastic housings are lightweight but large and have long stems

 Sound *(3.2/10)* – Competent all-rounder, with nothing shining or missing. The bass and mids are present in roughly equal quantities, with the treble slightly recessed and rolled-off. Extension is mediocre on both ends but the bass is controlled and the top end isn’t harsh. An improvement over most stock buds.

 Value: *(5.5/10)* – The SX-31 is a competitive entry-level in-ear from MEElectronics. Though not shining in any particular aspect, the earphones are better than most stock earbuds, at least in sound quality. Construction could be better, but of course a higher price would be justified then.

*Pros: Cheap, competent all-around sound*
*Cons: Feels cheap, large housings*


*(3C3) Skullcandy Ink’d*


Reviewed Nov 2009

 Details: Skullcandy’s Entry-level IEM
 Current Price: *$11 *from Amazon.com (MSRP: $19.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges; Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2/5)* – Housings are plastic and feel quite cheap. Nozzle filters are metal and the cable is nicely rubberized and thicker than much of the competition. Driver flex is annoying
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Isolation is a little below average as far as straight-barrel dynamic IEMs go; Comply tips help but cost more than the earphones
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Low when worn over-the-ear; bothersome otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings are very light and the small strain reliefs make these easy to wear cord-up or cord-down

 Sound *(3.2/10)* – Compared to my other sub-$15 IEMs the Ink’d buds impress with the deep, smooth bass that is more controlled than one might expect. The rest of the sound signature is fairly boring but the layered bass adds a badly needed dimensional quality. There is not much warmth and the sound is a bit thin in general. The treble is reasonably extended but definitely lacks the smoothness of the low end – it is quite harsh and often bright.

 Value *(5.5/10)* – Surprisingly balanced for a Skullcandy product, and can be enjoyable for a $10 earphone. The Ink’ds make great disposable earphones that can be purchased at electronics stores and gas stations alike.

*Pros: Easy to find, fairly inoffensive sound, reasonably comfortable and isolating*
*Cons: Poor build quality, harsh treble, no L/R indicators (note: these have been added on later versions)*

 Full review can be found here


*(3C4) MEElectronics Ai-M2 / M2*


Reviewed Nov 2009

 Details: New revision of the first Meelec IEM to be recognized on head-fi
 Current Price: *$10* from Overstock.com (MSRP: $14.99); $17.99 for M2P with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Soundmagic PL30 bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1.5/5) *– Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The conical housings are metal and feel quite solid. Like all of Meelec’s re-designed IEMs the current M2 has some of the best cabling in the realm of budget-fi. Strain reliefs are replaced with some clear heatshrink but I expect the cabling to hold up
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The massive port in the rear of the conical housing prevents these from isolating significantly
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – The cable is identical to the one on the the M9/M6/M11. Very slightly microphonic when worn cord-down
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* - Typical straight-barrel IEMs. They are quite light and can easily be worn cord-up or down

 Sound *(4/10)* – While Meelec’s other $10 IEM, the SX-31, sounds good for the bargain bin, the M2 sounds canbe  genuinely fun to listen to. They have a medium-sized soundstage, the bass, mids, and treble are all there, and they can put out a good bit of detail. The bass has a fair bit of punch but can be too boomy for my liking. The midrange is fairly forward and quite smooth. Treble is recessed and rolls off a bit at the top but is but also smooth and not at all unpleasant.

 Value *(8/10)* – Despite the booming bass and lack of high-end sparkle the M2s are solid IEMs in their own right. The build quality easily makes up for most minor sonic failings at the price point.

*Pros: Solid build quality, comfortable, mostly good sonic characteristics*
*Cons: Boomy bass*


*(3C5) JVC HA-FX34 “Marshmallows”*


Reviewed Dec 2009

 Details: JVC’s Entry-level IEM, one of the veteran bang/buck favorites of Head-Fi
 Current Price: *$12 *from Amazon.com (MSRP: $19.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _8-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5mm _| Preferred tips: _Marshmallows_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Marshmallow tips
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Housings are plastic and not very well-molded but feel very solid; cabling is similar to all of the other JVC IEMs – thick and sturdy
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Marshmallow tips isolate a surprising amount, even when old and stale
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Low when worn cable-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Light, soft, easy to wear cord-up or cord-down. Rounded housings can make them a bit difficult to grip for insertion/removal

 Sound *(4.2/10)* – The overall sound is on the warm side and fairly smooth. Bass is strong and punchy, albeit lacking some control. Low-end extension is surprising for a $10 earphone. Treble extension could be better but it’s still quite decent for the price. The Kramer mod (replacing the paper filter in the nozzle with a ball of foam) helps with treble quantity and overall balance – unmodded FX34’s are biased towards the low end. The midrange is obscured slightly by the bass at the low end but clarity isn’t too bad overall. Don’t expect $50 sound out of these, but they are good for what they cost. Their arch nemesis (at least in retail stores) are the similarly-priced Skullcandy Ink’d buds, which have similar clarity and better upper-end extension but lack the dimensionality and smoothness of the Marshmallows.

 Value *(8/10)* – Though not without competition as they once were, the Marshmallows are still a contender in their price category. Their biggest selling point is user-friendliness – they don’t suffer from fit issues or microphonics and a good seal is easy to get with the marshmallow tips. My marshmallow tips have gone somewhat stale after a year, but they still work just fine. The earphones themselves are durable too, still going strong after with thousands of hours of use. The everyday usability of these is what gives them the upper hand over the Skullcandies for the price.

*Pros: Very comfortable, low microphonics, above-average isolation, durable, decent sound*
*Cons: Poor bass control and treble extension, cable may be too short for some*


*(3C6) Q:Electronics Earbuds*


Reviewed Dec 2009

 Details: noise-isolating IEM from Q:Electronics
 Current Price: *$6 *from Buy.com (MSRP: $14.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _3.6’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Metal housings that are rather light and similar in style to the RE0s’; nice strain relief on 3.5mm plug, not so nice on housing entry. Cables are thin and have a bit of memory character
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Surprisingly good with the stock silicone tips. I can see why these are marketed as ‘noise-isolating’
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Present when worn cable-down; very low otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Typical for a straight-barrel IEM; housings are very light and insertion/removal is easy

 Sound *(3.3/10)* – The sound signature is quite similar to that of the Skullcandy Ink’d buds but more refined overall. The impactful, ear-shaking bass that these put out makes the Skullcandys sound boring in comparison. As expected for the price the sound is lacking in dimensionality and smoothness – they sound slightly metallic and flat. The bass is also lacking in speed and control but on slower tracks it’s extremely pleasant. I wouldn’t recommend these for dense metal tracks but I enjoyed them very much for soft rock, pop, and hip-hop, especially with the low end equalized down 3-6 dB. Clarity and detail are quite good when the bass isn’t creeping up and the treble has a bit more liveliness than anything else for the price. For me these are a very good compromise between the signatures of the Ink’d buds and JVC Marshmallows and remind me of JVC’s higher-end HA-FX300.

 Value *(6.5/10)* – The Q:Electronics IEMs are a competitive entry in the low-budget IEM category. The isolation is better than anything else in the price range and the sound is very tolerable. I like the rumbling bass on slower tracks and found these very enjoyable overall with a bit of equalization. For anyone looking for an isolating IEM that costs less than a good lunch, the Q:Elecs are the ticket.

*Pros: Comfortable, above-average isolation, enjoyable sound*
*Cons: Poor bass control, gets overwhelmed with faster tracks*


*(3C7) Dealextreme Orange IEMs*


Reviewed Dec 2009

 Details: Generic earphone from popular HK bargain site
 Current Price: *$3 *from Dealextreme.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _3.6’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 colors)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Generic metal housings seen on dozens of other OEM earphones feel pretty solid. Cabling is plastic with a metal plug; hard metal stems; no strain reliefs
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Square-edged stock tips are pretty useless but with most other tips isolation is passable
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Surprisingly low
 Comfort *(2/5)* – Stock tips are shallow and useless. Sharp edge of housing contacts ear if these are inserted too deep

 Sound *(1/10)* – Just like the PartsExpress mini headphone is a statistical baseline in my portable headphones review, so the DX Orange is the baseline for IEMs. It does nearly everything worse than the stock earbuds from my Sansa, producing sound that's flat, muddy, and very boring.

 Value *(2/10)* – These generic Chinese earphones compete on price and price alone. Even at $3, buying them for any other reason than to replace stock earphones with something better-looking and more isolating is not recommended.

*Pros: Handsome metal housings, isolate better than conventional earbuds*
*Cons: Everything else*


*(3C8) AudioSource IEBAS / IEWAS*


Reviewed Dec 2009

 Details: Ultrabudget IEM from cable manufacturer AudioSource
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $9.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.6’ I-plug *J-cord*_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories *(0/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips
 Build Quality *(1.5/5)* – Completely plastic housings with molding artifacts. Cabling is plastic as well.
 Isolation *(1.5/5)* – Below average
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Low
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – Light housings, very generic fit. J-cord can make them difficult to wear over-the-ear

 Sound *(0.5/10)* – The less said about the way these sound, the better. The drivers really cannot cope with anything more than a simple piano progression. They get overwhelmed very easily and end up sounding like a muddy mess. I thought they would clear up with burn-in but there seems to be no change whatsoever at 100 hours - I still can’t stand them.

 Value *(1/10)* – AudioSource is a well-known name in cables and audio accessories. From Monster’s example we know that it is possible for such a company to successfully transition into making proper earphones. However, Monster’s R&D budget is obviously much bigger. The IEBAS earbuds feel generic and cheap. Worse than that, sound quality is really not up to the par set by my other $10 earbuds. Avoid at all costs.

*Pros: None*
*Cons: Sound*


*(3C9) Kanen KM-948*


Reviewed Mar 2010

 Details: Utilizing a shell similar to JVC HA-FXC50, the KM-948 a huge step up from my previous Kanen IEMs
 Current Price: *$5 *from FocalPrice.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _90 dB_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 4mm _| Preferred tips: _Jays Single-flange Silicones_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2/5)* – Plastic housings with molded strain reliefs, thin cabling with Sennheiser-style Y-split, and heatshrink-covered 3.5mm plug do no inspire confidence but will last if not abused routinely
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Impressive isolation with the right tips, especially when worn over-the-ear
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Microphonics are bothersome when worn cable-down but fairly low when worn cable-up
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Due to having a longer nozzle than JVC’s FXC-50, the KM-948 can be worn over-the-ear with the extrusion of the shell pointing outward. They may look a little odd when worn this way, but comfort is greatly improved

 Sound *(3.7/10)* – The sound of the KM-948 is surprisingly tolerable for a $5 earphone. The bottom end boasts impressive extension and good impact. Insertion depth is key in achieving good bass response with these – when inserted shallowly bass impact is too sharp and drums can be downright painful. When inserted too far the bass can be a touch boomy, obscuring other frequencies. However, with the right insertion depth treble comes forward and the bass stays controlled, if a bit hollow. The midrange is articulate and smooth, boasting good clarity for the price but sounding a little thin at times. Treble response is a bit spiky, rolls off early, and lacks information compared to pricier earphones. With a shallow seal they can sound shrill and I found them somewhat tiring, but only after very long listening sessions and not with the Jays silicone tips that I ended up using in the long run. They do one thing very right, though – the $5 KM-948 have better separation and an airier presentation than most other earphones in the <$20 range.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The KM-948 is an all-around improvement over the older MD-51. At the $5 price they are an extremely competitive product, providing good isolation, comfort, and sound quality. For those willing to experiment with the fit, the KM-948 can be an even more rewarding experience, coming close in certain aspects of their performance to some much more expensive earphones. 

*Pros: Very reasonable sound quality, quite comfortable, solid isolation*
*Cons: Mediocre build quality, stock tips are not ideal*

 Special thanks to *jant71* for lending me the KM-948


*(3C10) Coby CVEM79 Jammerz Platinum*


Reviewed Apr 2010

 Details: Surprisingly fun-sounding low-end IEM from Coby with cheerful color schemes to match
 Current Price: *$9.95* from bhphotovideo.com (MSRP: $24.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _96 dB_ | Freq: _12-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(2/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes) and miniature velour carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Aluminum shells are extremely light and contain metal filters both at the front (nozzle) and the rear (vent). The cable is excellent – soft, tough, and flexible, similar to the Meelectronics cables but a bit thinner and missing a cord cinch. There are strain reliefs on housing entry but strangely none whatsoever on the metal 3.5mm plug
 Isolation *(2/5)* – The massive rear-facing vent betrays a surprising lack of isolation for an IEM
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low in a cable-down configuration, nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Even among straight-barrel IEMs the CVEM79 stand out in comfort. The housings are short and very light, with flexible strain reliefs and a very compliant fit. I’ve managed to sleep on my side with these with no issues on several occasions

 Sound *(3.7/10)* – The sound of the CVEM79 is decidedly warm and leans slightly toward the dark side. The bass is impactful and extended, albeit lacking in definition – in low end clarity the Jammerz are somewhere between the CX300 and Meelec M9. Drums can sound somewhat hollow as a result but bass bleed is low and the mids are in good balance with the low end. Vocals have warm undertones and good presence. The midrange transitions smoothly into treble, which rolls off gradually at the top end. The overall balance is better than bass-heavy earphones like the Lenntek Sonix Micro and Senn CX300 but still not quite up there with class leaders. Detail and clarity are about what one would expect from earphones with a $25 MSRP, no worse than the JVC Marshmallows/AirCushions, but not better. The soundstage is small and instrument separation is mediocre at best but the overall signature is quite enjoyable in an up-close-and-personal way.

 Value *(7/10)* – The Coby CVEM79 ‘Jammerz Platinum’ are another high bang/buck competitor in the ultra-low-budget category, offering solid build quality and a comfortable form factor in a variety of colors for a bargain-basement price. Though the sound does not impress with detail or clarity, the overall signature is enjoyable enough. Personally, I’ve found my perfect napping IEMs in the Jammerz with their comfortable fit and warm, easy-going sound. 

*Pros: Fun, warm, and impactful sound, many color options, very comfortable, minimal microphonics*
*Cons: Poor isolation, no strain relief on plug*


*(3C11) Sentry HO470 Wooden*


Reviewed May 2010

 Details: Dimestore wooden IEM seemingly related to the Kanen KM92
 Current Price: *$5* from Big Lots (MSRP: $9)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Wooden housings with plastic nozzles feel very cheaply made, though metal mesh filters are present in the nozzles. Wood has a tendency to splinter. The cable is slightly rubberized and not too thin, with proper strain reliefs all around
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Massive rear vents severely limit isolation
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Bothersome when worn cord-down; unobtrusive otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Very lightweight but otherwise perfectly generic straight-barrel fit

 Sound *(2.7/10)* – The signature of the HO470 reminds me of the pricier Meelectronics R1 Woodees. Both earphones are bass cannons, with the HO470 appearing to be even bassier due to the veiled mids and recessed treble. Both earphones are quite warm and exercise disappointingly poor bass control, causing them to sound muddy and lack texture and detail. The bass of the Sentries is overwhelming and seems to come at the listener from all directions. The low end and midrange of the HO470 are extremely smooth but the top end exhibits some harshness despite being severely rolled off. 

 Value *(5/10)* – I really cannot recommend the HO470 for listening to music without some serious equalization in the midrange and treble. For a basshead on a (tiny) budget and with an excellent equalizer, the HO470 might be a viable option. There’s a chance that some of the other cheap earphones out there can be equalized to match the HO470s in bass quantity with fewer sacrifices in the mids and treble, but I would expect them to distort the bass at that point. Either way, the $5 wooden sentries have some value but I would not recommend them as general-purpose IEMs next to the similarly-priced Kanen KM-948.

*Pros: Extremely lightweight and quite comfortable*
*Cons: Lots and lots of mediocre bass, the rest of the signature drowns in the bass, $5 build quality*


*(3C12) JVC HA-EBX85*


Reviewed Aug 2010

 Details: Exercise-friendly IEM from JVC’s made-for-women series
 Current Price: *$15* from jr.com (MSRP: $19.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB _| Freq: _10-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The EBX85 is designed with active use in mind. The housings and earhooks are made of a flexible rubberized plastic with a harder material used for the inner shell and glittery JVC nameplate. The thin plastic cable is similar to that used on JVC’s budget-level earbuds and inferior to the thicker cords used on the Marshmallow and AirCushion IEMs. The 2”-long earhooks act as a strain relief on housing entry and the 3.5mm I-plug is similarly well-relieved
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Isolation is quite typical for a low-end dynamic. The large shells prevent deep insertion, however, and the stock tips aren’t very good
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Slight microphonics are present despite the native over-the-ear configuration but aren’t bothersome once the music starts playing
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The ergonomic form factor and soft earhooks make the EBX85 a comfortable IEM to use but may not fit smaller ears snugly

 Sound *(3.6/10)* – The sound of the HA-EBX85 is quite typical of a low-end JVC earphone and reminds me greatly of the once-ubiquitous Marshmallows. The earphones are warm and bassy, providing greater rumble but less impact than the similarly-priced Yamaha EPH-20. The bass is very full but slightly washed-out. Low-end control is lacking on bass-heavy tracks, resulting in slight muddying up of the midrange. The mids are fairly even, increasing in presence towards the upper midrange/treble. Lower treble is accented and results in a fair amount of sparkle and a more balanced sound than the bass quantity would indicate. For a low-end set the treble is actually decently extended and sounds neither dull nor excessively edgy. Treble detail is mediocre but for the price I’m willing to live with that. Clarity is also lacking compared to the best penny-pinching sets from Meelectronics. In addition, the earphone lacks dynamics, sounding a bit ‘shouty’ at all times, but a lack of dynamic range is nothing unexpected for a low-end product. The EBX85 does, however, do one thing surprisingly well for the price – it has a great sense of soundstaging and separation. The positioning isn’t accurate by any means but the little JVCs actually managed to surprise me once or twice even when compared directly to the Meelec M6s that I normally use as a benchmark for ‘active-use’ IEMs.

 Value* (7/10) *– The JVC HA-EBX85 is a low-end ‘earhook’ IEM from JVC’s designed-for-women series. Available in a variety of colors and geared towards active use, the EBX85 is a capable budget-minded set that does a few things very well for the price. Unfortunately, like so many mainstream budget earphones, it sounds as if the engineers turned the bass up to 11 while at the same time limiting the output of the driver, which resulted in lots of mediocre-quality bass. The sound is bass-heavy but not attention-grabbing – perfect for distraction-free use while exercising. It should be noted that the EBX85 does work exceedingly well for active use in general, offering moderate isolation, low microphonics, and a stable fit. Unfortunately, the stock tips don’t really work with the relatively small 4mm nozzle but for those in search of a bargain-beater IEM for exercising or general use, the EBX85 is a solid choice, especially if decent tips (e.g. Sony Hybrids) are available.

*Pros: Stable fit, low microphonics, surprising soundstaging & separation*
*Cons: Stock eartips don’t stay on the nozzles, lacks clarity & detail*


*(3C13) elago E3*


Reviewed Aug 2010

 Details: Entry-level earphones from California-based design firm elago
 Current Price: *$9.99 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _90 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4.3’ I-plug_
  Nozzle Size: _4.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single Flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5) *– Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The unique shells of the E3 are plastic but seem very well-put together. The stems are slightly rubbery but not flexible enough to be called strain reliefs. The cabling is excellent for an earphone in the lowest price bracket, keeping up with the renowned JVC IEM cables in thickness and flexibility, and the metal-encased 3.5mm plug and y-split feature short rubber sleeves to protect the cable
 Isolation *(**2.5**/5)* – Quite good but the ergonomic design of the E3 prevents deep insertion when worn in the conventional manner, limiting isolation slightly
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Very low when worn cord-down; nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The angled-nozzle design is wonderfully ergonomic, with the shell of the earphone resting snugly against the antitragus of the wearer’s ear when worn cable-down. The E3 can be worn over-the-ear as well but the nozzles are angled in the wrong direction for cord-up wear, causing the earphones to stick out slightly. With the channels reversed, however, the featherweight elagos compete with the likes of the Phonak PFE in overall comfort

 Sound *(4.1/10)* – The sound signature of the elago E3 is undoubtedly bass-centric. The low end is smooth and extremely powerful, reminding me of JVC Marshmallows and Sennheiser CX300s. The low end is quite well-extended by any standards, continuing to rumble all the way down to around 30 Hz, and carries impressive impact. At high volumes the bass has a tendency to crowd out the lower midrange and generally sounds a bit overbearing for my tastes. It is at moderate listening volumes, however, that the E3 shines. The bass becomes far less intrusive and the otherwise recessed midrange and treble step forward to reveal surprising clarity and a fairly realistic tone. Expectedly, the earphones are a bit warm and dark in nature, but not in a way that is capable of putting me to sleep  (a-la Coby CVEM79). The midrange and treble of the E3 are smooth and roll off gently at the top and the earphones present a small soundstage. Though leaning towards intimacy, especially at high volumes, they don’t sound overwhelmingly narrow. Aside from the ever-present bass, instrumental separation is actually quite decent. On the whole, while the elago E3s don’t have the clarity or detail of higher-end sets such as the Meelec M9 or Soundmagic PL30, they are surprisingly capable of providing an enjoyable listening experience that puts mainstream sets such as the Yamaha EPH-20 and JVC HA-EBX85 to shame.

 Value *(8/10)* – The elago E3 is a well-designed and comfortable entry-level earphone. The ergonomic shells are a welcome change from the generic straight-barrel housings used by the vast majority of the competition and the sound signature, while not nearly as unique, fares very well in the price bracket. Powerful bass slightly overshadows the competent midrange and treble but the earphones balance themselves out at lower volumes and respond well to equalization. All in all, the elago E3 is yet another earphone showing that decent sound doesn’t necessarily need to have a hard-to-swallow price tag. For bass lovers on a tight budget, this definitely isn’t one to miss.

*Pros: Ergonomic design, low microphonics, solidly-built, pleasant midrange and treble*
*Cons: Bass can be slightly overbearing at times, stock tips can be difficult to change*


*(3C14) Earsquake CRO*


Reviewed Sep 2010

 Details: Entry-level model from Earsquake
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $9)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω _| Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 5.5mm | Preferred tips: Stock single-flanges
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2/5)* – The housings of the CRO are made out of lightweight plastic and seem fairly typical in build. The nozzle is protected by a metal mesh filter but the hard plastic stems lack strain relief. The cable is very plasticky and the chin slider won’t stay in place as a result
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Surprisingly good for a vented dynamic
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Very low when worn cable-down, nonexistent cable-up
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The shells are extremely lightweight and very easy to get fitted. They are rounded at the front but the stem has sharp edges that can contact the ear upon deep insertion, which is not a problem when the earphones are worn cord-up

 Sound *(4.2/10)* – Earsquake clearly went for the ‘tell it like it is’ approach with the CRO, imbuing it with clarity worthy of far more expensive earphones but at the same time stripping it of the only way in which entry-level earphones can mask their flaws – the veil. The sound of the CRO is raw – hard-hitting bass, somewhat dry mids, and touchy but very prominent treble. I compared them mostly to the elago E3, which are my <$10 benchmark. While the elagos are far smoother and quite a bit easier on the ears overall, they sound extremely muffled and veiled next to the CRO. The bass impact of the CRO is sharper and more defined and the relative bass quantity seems greater despite the E3 actually having more bass weight.

 The midrange of the CRO is in good balance with the bass and treble and generally impresses with detail and clarity. The treble, on the other hand, is very edgy and can be fatiguing at higher volumes. It’s a bit grainy and there are narrow spikes here and there in the response, making it sibilant with certain tracks. On the upside, top-end extension is decent. The presentation is airy and well-spaced. Due to the excellent clarity, the barrier between the listener and the music very commonly present in low-end earphones is absent with the CRO, adding to the raw, transparent sound signature. There’s not much of a soundstage but I still found myself enjoying this $9 IEM far more than I expected. For more laid-back listening I would definitely pick up one of the other good <$10 earphones but if clarity is a prime concern, the CRO is a hard one to beat.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – For those who can handle the lack of refinement in the bass and treble, the CRO represents one of the best ways to spend $10 on an earphone. I’m a big fan of smooth sound but the clarity of the CRO won me over in the end, wiping the floor with the vast majority of my entry-level IEMs. Add to that isolation that’s surprisingly good for an entry-level dynamic, low microphonics, and lightweight and comfortable shells and a contender for the best <$10 earphone emerges.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable, good isolation, low microphonics, good clarity*
*Cons: Very raw sound, can be harsh/sibilant*


*(3C15) Earsquake Fish*


Reviewed Sep 2010

 Details: Bass-heavy earphone oriented at PSP users
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $15)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or* straight down*_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Medium single-flange silicone tips (2 colors)
 Build Quality* (2.5/5) *– The housings of the Fish are just as plasticky as those of the cheaper CRO but the cable is thicker and far more rubbery. The cord cinch actually works and there is some strain relief to be found on the y-split but aside from that the Fish still feels like a $15 earphone
 Isolation *(**2.5/5)* – Quite decent for a vented dynamic
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Very low when worn cable-down, nonexistent cable-up
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells are quite light and the long stems don’t lead to any problems with over-the-ear fitment but the housings are not rounded at the front like those of the CRO. As a result, the Fish fits more like the average straight-barrel in-ear

 Sound *(3/10) *– Though the Fish was not designed for music, it would be unfair for me to make a special exception for the earphones and stray from my usual review regimen. That said, the Fish clearly works better for films or games than it does for music. As advertised, the earphones are quite bassy, with a low end that tends towards ‘rumbly’ rather than ‘punchy’ and better low end extension than the other Earsquake models. Sadly, while quite appropriate for movies and gaming, the low end weight of the Fish makes it sound muffled when used for music. The earphones are quite a bit smoother than the CRO as a result, which covers up their other shortcomings somewhat. Still, the mids are recessed, sometimes overshadowed by the upper bass, and generally a little too thick and slow for my taste. Tonally, the Fish are warm but not excessively so. The treble is quite smooth compared to the CRO but not as prominent or extended. In terms of presentation, the Fish sounds distant and has a tunnel-like soundstage, with some left-right separation but not much else in the way of imaging or positioning.

 Value *(6.5/10)* – The Earsquake Fish was designed with a purpose in mind, and that purpose was not music listening. As a result, it holds little interest for me. Those who do game on the move may find a good match with the Fish as ‘gaming’ IEMs are a rare crop. Fit, microphonics, and build quality are all fine for the price though I wish Earsquake included the full 3-size tip set with these. The sound is thick and bassy and the presentation is spacious but distant overall – on par with many of the mainstream cheap-o earphones but not nearly as good as some of my budget hi-fi champs. If music is your game and bucketloads of bass don’t hold much appeal, buy the SHA instead.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable, good isolation, low microphonics, smooth sound, lots of bass*
*Cons: Lots of bass, lacks in clarity & resolution, stock tips in only 1 size*


*(3C16) Earsquake SHA*


Reviewed Sep 2010

 Details: Music-oriented earphone from Taiwanese OEM Earsquake
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $15)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5) *– Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5) *– Like the other Earsquake earphones, the SHA is plastic in construction but the build is fairly high-rent compared to the others. The metallic paint is especially impressive and the colorful earphones look wonderful in person. The nozzles are protected by a metal filter and proper strain reliefs are utilized on the housings. The cords differ by earphone color – the green and red models come with a slightly more rubbery cord than the Fish; the silver and black units have a meelec-style clear cord that is smoother and has less memory character
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Surprisingly good for a vented dynamic
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Fairly low when worn cable-down, nonexistent when worn cable-up for green/red models; a bit better for the black/gray earphones
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are lightweight and very comfortable. They are a bit slimmer towards the front than those of the Fish and can be inserted fairly deeply, for example for sleeping, but still sound fine with a shallow seal

 Sound *(4.9/10)* – Unlike the similarly-priced Fish, the SHA was designed for listening to music and music alone, and it shows. The overall sound of the SHA is balanced but quite forward and aggressive. As with the entry-level CRO, the SHA is a bit rough around the edges, but that’s part of its charm.

 The bass of the SHA is tight and controlled but goes surprisingly deep when the track calls for it. The impact is not as full-bodied as that of the Meelec M9 or Sennheiser CX280 but it is quite accurate, well-layered, and natural-sounding, at least at reasonable listening volumes. Indeed, the sound of the SHA does begin to degrade at higher volumes, losing balance and clarity and becoming more hard-edged and fatiguing.

 The mids are strong and fairly smooth, if a little dry. For the money, it’s a very good sound with plenty of clarity and detail - those who can’t handle the somewhat recessed midrange of the M9 will find a good budget set with the SHA. The treble is prominent and accurate but a little edgy. The dry mids and hard-edged treble together remind me of the Hippo VB though of course the Hippos are far more detailed and have much better dynamics. Top-end extension is average but the treble is very crisp and extremely satisfying in a budget set.

 The presentation is spacious – next to the elago e3 or JVC Marshmallows, the SHA sound ‘big’ but not distant. Still, typical of a budget set, the SHA are not particularly resolving and imaging begins to break down somewhat when things get busy. I think part of the problem might be the limited dynamic range, which is hardly noticeable next to the other Earsquake earphones but shows really well next to the Meelec M9 or a pricier earphone. 

 Value *(8.5/10) *– The Earsquake SHA is a properly good earphone for the price. It is easy to use, with a compliant straight-barrel fit, solid isolation, and low microphonics. The hand-painted look works very well and the color schemes are quite welcome in the drab world of budget and mid-range earphones. And of course the sound is nothing to sneer at, either – the SHA is balanced and very direct. It may lack the detail and dynamic range of the Meelec M9 or other budget-minded head-fi favorites but it sounds very even-footed and true to source. Highly recommended for those limited to the very lowest price tier but still seeking the best possible audio experience!

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable, good isolation, low microphonics, good clarity, plenty of color options*
*Cons: Slightly dry sound, poor dynamic*


*(3C17) MaiKe MK-EL5031*


Reviewed Mar 2011

 Details: Entry-level earphone from China-based electronics firm MaiKe
 Current Price: *$7 *from hdaccessory.com (MSRP: $29.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges, Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2/5)* – The all-plastic shells of the EL5031 don’t inspire a whole lot of confidence – while the plastic itself should hold out, the same cannot be said for the glue that holds the shell together. I do quite like the cable, though – it’s soft, flexible, and well-relieved all around
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Not only is the MaiKe vented, but the vertical-driver form factor prevents deep insertion (a-la Radius DDM)
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – The cable noise itself s very low due to the shallow fit but the cable anchors make some noise when the cord is tugged
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – The fit is similar to that of the Radius DDM but the MaiKe is a bit larger and the driver bulge constantly presses against my ears. As with the DDM, the fit of the EL5031 never feels particularly secure to me and will require some experimentation to figure out

 Sound *(3.5/10)* – The sound of the MK-EL5031 is big, bottom-heavy, and very smooth. The bass is deep and powerful but sounds a bit sluggish, lingering longer than with all of my pricier earphones – a common issue with cheap, bass-heavy in-ears. There’s a characteristic mid-bass lift, which gives the low end extra weight and warmth. The midrange, too, is warm, thick, and smooth. Clarity trails Meelec’s pricier M9 quite badly and even falls slightly behind my similarly-priced Sentry HO642. On the positive side, the generally smooth response and gentle treble roll-off make the sound very inoffensive and easy-going for long listening sessions. 

 The most surprising aspect of the EL5031 is the sense of space it provides. Both the soundstage and headstage are above-average in size and give the sound a convincingly ‘open’ feel. The thick, viscous sound does not allow for great instrumental separation or imaging but the sheer volume of the soundstage is impressive for an entry-level product. There is some reverb in the housings, which may or may not appeal to everyone but, considering that the EL5031 is not exactly a paragon of accuracy in the first place, I find its reverberant nature quite fun, especially with kick drums and the like. 

 Value *(6.5/10)* - Though the sound signature of the MaiKe MK-EL5031 is decidedly mainstream and the large housings don't exactly shine when it comes to fit and isolation, the $7 earphone does surprise with the vastness of its presentation and the reverberant nature of its sound. Not a stellar performer by any means but it gets the job done.

*Pros: Big bass, smooth sound, spacious soundstage; low microphonics*
*Cons: Large housings limit comfort and isolation; plasticky build; clarity could be better*


*(3C18) Sentry HO642*


Reviewed Mar 2011

 Details: Entry-level earphone from bargain-bin electronics brand Sentry
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $7.98)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Single-flange (one size) and double-flange silicone tips and vinyl carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(1.5/5)* – The housings of the HO642 are completely plastic and lack strain reliefs and nozzle filters. The plastic-sheathed cable is quite thin above the y-split but not too bad below. The nickel plating on the 3.5mm plug tends to cause audible static when the plug is disturbed. The stock tips are of decent quality and seal well; unfortunately, this results in severe driver flex – quite possibly the worst I’ve encountered
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Quite decent with the included double-flange tips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Slightly bothersome when worn cable-down; not bad otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells are extremely lightweight and rounded at the front for an inoffensive fit

 Sound *(4/10)* – In contrast to the decidedly bass-heavy sound of the similarly-priced MaiKe MK-EL5031, the signature of the HO642 foregoes bass response for balance and clarity. The bass is actually rolled-off quite noticeably at the bottom but provides adequate mid-bass punch for my tastes. Low-end control is good and the bass usually makes itself apparent only when called for. On bass-heavy tracks, the low end sounds just a touch boomy but not bloated. There is not much bass bleed but the lower midrange is slightly recessed. Nevertheless, the mids impress with clarity and detail but are quite thin and dry. With a little more fullness, the midrange would compete well with Meelec’s pricier M9 but as it stands the HO642 just doesn’t render most instruments realistically. Still, for the price, the clean and crisp mids are impressive.

 Towards the top of the midrange, the HO642 gains authority, culminating in several response peaks in the lower treble. As a result, the earphones tend to sound sharp and shrill with most tracks despite narrowly missing sibilance-inducing frequencies. Depending on the track, mild harshness and sibilance are still present at times but they aren’t nearly as offensive as they would be if the treble spikes occurred a bit lower. Top-end extension is moderate. The presentation of the earphones tends towards intimacy. Soundstage width is average while the height and depth are nothing to brag about at all. Separation is mediocre, albeit helped along by the lack of muddiness at the bottom. Tonally, the HO642 leans towards ‘cold and bright’ – not excessively so, but definitely north of neutral to my ears.

 Value *(6/10)* – At the $8 suggested retail price, the HO642 is a decent option for the budget-minded clarity lover. The biggest complaint aside from the hit-or-miss sonic flavor of the Sentrys is the driver flex, which can be quite severe with a good seal. Still, fit, comfort, microphonics, and isolation are all average on the large scale and quite impressive for an entry-level product, putting the HO642 right up there with the better earphones $8 can buy.

*Pros: Surprising clarity*
*Cons: Terrible “carrying pouch”; heavy driver flex; aggressive and uneven treble response, sub-bass roll-off*


*(3C19) Skullcandy Smokin’ Buds*


Reviewed Sep 2011

 Details: Aging Skullcandy earphone with a familiar form factor
 Current Price: *$13* from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _18-20k H_z | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _generic single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (3/5)* – The plastic housings are similar to those found on the VSonic R02ProII and Grado iGi. The rubber strain reliefs are long and soft but the cable itself is thin and plasticky. An in-line volume control is present below the y-split
 Isolation *(3/5)* – More than adequate for an entry-level dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Low with cable-down wear; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort* (3.5/5)* – Typical of a lightweight straight-barrel in-ear and similar to the other IEMs utilizing the same housing

 Sound *(3.1/10)* - Like the lower-end Ink’d model, the Smokin sounds decent but hardly impresses even next to the age-old JVC Marshmallows and MEElec M2s. The bass is reasonably impactful but tends to sound boomy and has poor depth. Detail resolution is average – about on-par with the MEElec M2. The M2 sounds warmer and fuller, however, so it is more difficult to fault for not offering up much detail.

 Bass bleed into the midrange is minimal but the Smokin’ can hardly be called ‘controlled’. The midrange boasts mediocre clarity and a fairly thick veil but isn’t particularly bothersome on the whole. The top end is similarly inoffensive but again neither the clarity nor the detail impress. Overall balance is decent. Noticeable top-end roll-off leads to a darker overall tone and a slight lack of air. The soundstage is small, causing congestion. Though not fair from a price perspective, there is really no comparison between the presentation of these and a decent entry-level set from a Hi-Fi brand, such as the Sennheiser CX300 or Ultimate Ears 350.

 Value* (6/10)* – One of Skullcandy’s first in-ear models, the Smokin’ was originally slotted above the Ink’d in the lineup but has since dropped to a similar price point, more in line with the quality of sound it produces. With proper strain reliefs and a generic, reliable housing design, the Smokin’ is better-built, better-isolating, and less microphonic than the Ink’d. The sound is a bit more colored but at this level it really doesn’t matter – there are worse earphones out there and there certainly are better ones. 

*Pros: Low cable noise, lightweight and comfortable*
*Cons: Mediocre sound quality*


*(3C20) Section 8 Earbuds*


Reviewed Nov 2011

 Details: bargain-bin earphones with endorsements ranging from Elvis to Tupac
 Current Price: *$10 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $19.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _N/A _| Freq: _20-20k Hz _| Cable: 3.9’ I-plug
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _generic single-flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1/5) *– Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5) *– The metal housings and nylon-sheathed cables are impressive at the price point but the lack of strain reliefs says little for long-term durability
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Typical for a straight-barrel dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Mild when worn cable-down; very low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– Typical for a straight-barrel IEM. Housings are very lightweight and the housing lacks sharp edges, which helps.

 Sound *(3.7/10) *– The Section 8 Earbuds are by no means Hi-Fi but they do sound surprisingly decent for the asking price. Clarity is vastly superior to that of the similarly-priced Skullcandy Smokin’ buds and the bass is deeper and less washed-out. The muddiness and warmth of the Smokin’ are gone as well, leaving a low end that, while not particularly detailed, doesn’t crowd out the midrange.

 The mids are clean and clear, on the cold side in tone and a bit distant. There is a tinge to the upper midrange that makes the Section 8 buds sound metallic and the earphones tend to distort more quickly than higher-end sets as the volume is turned up. The treble is prominent enough down low and rolls off towards the top. The soundstage is below average in size but the relatively decent bass control keeps it congestion-free compared to that of entry-level Skullcandy products. Layering, as expected for the price, is nearly nonexistent, making the earphones sound quite flat.

 Value *(7/10) *– The Section 8 Earbuds are a competent bargain-bin product with a generic form factor and surprisingly clear sound. Available in a number of celebrity flavors, they put similarly-priced Skullcandy earphones to shame and can be a genuinely inoffensive listen, though those looking for fidelity will want to keep on saving up.

*Pros: decent clarity, comfort, and isolation*
*Cons: distant sound with a metallic edge*



*(3C21) Monoprice 8320 (MEP-933)*


Reviewed Feb 2012

 Details: 14.2mm dynamic-driver IEM from cable vendor Monoprice
 Current Price: *$7* from monoprice.com (MSRP: $7.11)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _96 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids, Meelec long single-flanges, Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(0/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (1 size)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Large housings containing the sizeable drivers are plastic but feel well put-together. Strain reliefs are present all around but the nylon-sheathed cord is fragile, tangle-prone, and lacks a cinch
 Isolation *(2/5) *– Large, vented housings and short nozzles greatly limit isolation
 Microphonics* (3/5)* – Annoying when worn cable-down, not much of an issue with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – The plastic housings are lightweight but large, thick, and complete with sharp ridges. They seem to be designed for over-the-ear wear but don’t fit those with small/medium-sized ears well. With the cable exit point pointed forward, the cable can be worn straight down or looped over the ear. The nozzle is shallowly angled and not very long, which may make the stock tips useless for some

 Sound *(7.5/10) *– Monoprice specializes in sourcing cheap, high quality parts and offering reasonably-priced alternatives to brand-name products. When it comes to audio quality, the MEP-933 does exactly that, rivaling far more expensive earphones in traits such as balance, detail, and clarity. The bass of the MEP-933 is punchy but far from overblown - I would even hesitate to call the earphone ‘bass-heavy’. Bass quantity is more in line with sets such as the Brainwavz Beta and MEElec CW31 than bassy IEMs like the Dunu Trident and Soundmagic E10. The low end offers good speed and resolution but doesn’t have the greatest depth. Sub-bass lacks texture and fails to portray individual notes well compared to higher-end sets, especially at lower volume levels. Partly to blame are the MEP-933’s average dynamics, which result in a mild case of ‘one-note’ bass. There is also a bit of reverb audible in the plastic housings, not unlike what I experience with Sennheiser's IE-series earphones.

 The midrange of the MEP-933 is crisp and clean - not just for the asking price, but even next to high-end sets. Detail levels are good and though the bass is slightly boosted, the mids are not notably recessed considering that the presentation is distancing on the whole. Vocals are prominent, if a bit thin – those who prefer a thick or lush sound will probably be better off saving up for a Dunu Trident or Xears set. The MEP-933 is still slightly thicker than the Brainwavz Beta and lacks a bit of the detail and transparency of the latter. It is much smoother, however, especially moving up into the treble region.

 The top end of the MEP-933 is low on sparkle and not very revealing, but not laid-back enough for the earphones to sound dark. Resolution is decent and the MEP-933 is smooth and reasonably well-extended – more so than many pricier earphones. There is a bit of smearing when things get fast and heavy on the cymbals but nothing to complain about with a lower-tier product. Indeed, minute issues with the bass and treble being noteworthy is a testament to how solid a performer the Monoprice is on the whole.

 What’s more interesting is the earphones’ presentation. In contrast to most budget IEMs, which tend to have a congested, in-the-head presentation, the MEP-933 has a wide, airy, and open sound to it. There’s good width to the soundstage but nearly no depth or layering, resulting in poor imaging and a distinct lack of centering ability. The heightened left-right separation gives the MEP-933 a more laid-back, headphone-like feel but also means that imaging and overall positioning ability lags behind not-so-budget sets such as the Soundmagic E10 and Brainwavz M1. 

 Value *(9/10)* – Budget IEMs typically follow a simple formula – cheap, straight-barrel housing, high-sensitivity driver, and massively enhanced bass. The Monoprice MEP-933 shrugs such convention - its gigantic shells and equally enormous 14.2mm transducers, over-the-ear fit, and balanced sound signature make for one atypical budget option. There is no doubt that you are getting much more than your money’s worth in sound quality – the MEP-933 is clear, balanced, and detailed unlike anything I’ve heard in or near its price range. Simply put, it has no business sounding as good as it does. Unfortunately, the same can’t be said for user-friendliness – the ergonomics are questionable and the fabric cable is noisy and tangle-prone. Aftermarket tips are likely a necessity as well, and even then the MEP-933 simply won’t work for some users. In the end, it isn’t likely to be the end-all earphone for most, but at least it’s cheap enough to try without any regrets.

*Pros: Fantastic sound quality for the price*
*Cons: Noisy, tangle-prone cable; large housings with sharp ridges won’t be comfortable for many*

 Thanks to *nmxdaven* and *randomZash* for the MEP-933!


*(3C22) Ultimate Ears 100*


Added Aug 2012

 Details: UE’s entry-level set available in several striking color schemes
 Current Price: *$14* from amazon.com (MSRP: $19.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.8' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Plastic housings and plastic cabling are typical of UE’s entry-level models. The 3.5mm L-plug lacks strain relief and driver flex is a major annoyance
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Long, angled nozzles and sealed housings provide good isolation
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Very low
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The rectangular housings are small and quite ergonomic, with long angled nozzles and rounded edges. They should fit all but the smallest ears when worn cable-down and can be worn cord-up fairly easily as well.

 Sound *(4.9/10) *– Clearly oriented at the consumer market, the UE100 is nevertheless a fairly well-balanced earphone with good bass and midrange presence. The low end has good extension and decent impact, though it is not as voluminous as that of the pricier UE350. It lacks crispness, detail, and texture but sounds much less boomy compared to a MEElectronics M2 or Skullcandy Smokin’. The bass-midrange balance is good, with the mids prominent enough even on bass-heavy tracks.

 The midrange tends to lack crispness and clarity next to higher-end sets such as the Brainwavz Beta but for the price the UE100 has nothing to be ashamed of – it is fuller, warmer, and smoother than the similarly-priced Section 8 earbuds and far clearer than the Skullcandy Smokin’. The treble has decent extension and rolls off rather gently at the top. For the most part the top end is smooth, albeit lacking in detail. The presentation is farther back compared to most entry-level sets but has decent air. Next to higher-end IEMs it lacks depth and separation but does give a sense of space that differentiates it from the in-the-head presentation achieved by most cheap earphones. All in all, while the UE100 can hardly be called Hi-Fi, for $10 one could do much worse.

 Value* (7.5/10)* – The UE100 is a cheap-and-cheerful set with an unusual but very user-friendly form factor, low cable noise, good isolation, and sound that - for the asking price – is decently balanced and surprisingly competent all around. It’s a good backup set or kid earphone to pick up for $10-12 but do make sure the warranty is intact as the driver flex on some pairs can utterly ruin the experience.

*Pros: Consumer-friendly sound with good clarity; comfortable form factor; low cable noise*
*Cons: Significant driver flex*



*(3C23) Nuforce NE-600X*


Added September 2013

 Details: entry-level model from one of the companies that popularized budget in-ears on Head-Fi

MSRP: $29.9
 Current Price: *$14* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.6′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(1/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The construction of the NE-600X is good for the price, with aluminum housings and tangle-resistant flat cables. I especially like the low-profile L-plug. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average for an in-ear of this type
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Decent when worn cable-up; bothersome otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Here, the NE-600X is actually superior to the higher-end NE-700 – its housings are a little wide, but also more lightweight and rounded at the front for comfort. The earphone does not require a deep seal in the ear. I still prefer the conventional cable of the NE-700, but over-the-ear wear is possible with the flat cord on the NE-600X, especially when using the cable cinch

Sound* (7/10)* – The Nuforce NE-600X follows a bass-heavy sound signature with a slightly v-shaped profile. The bass is deep and powerful, with impact and rumble reaching what I consider “basshead” levels. Compared even to the Sony MH1C and Philips SHE3580, which are by no means lean at the low end, the NE-600X is simply a bass monster. Bass control is good considering the large quantity of it– slightly better than with NarMoo S1, for example, but short of the RHA MA350 and Dunu Landmine.

The v-shaped sonic profile of the NE-600X works to its advantage – while its midrange is less warm, thinner, and more recessed compared, for example, to the NarMoo S1 and Dunu Landmine, the Nuforce’s clarity is better. Though not quite up there with the Sony MH1C and Philips SHE3580, for such a bass-heavy set the clarity and detail resolution are very impressive, especially considering the low price of the NE-600X.

The tone of the NE-600X is warm on the whole, but its v-shaped signature makes treble energy ample. The result is a bit of harshness compared to the NarMoo S1, Dunu Landmine, and Sony MH1C, all of which sound smoother on the whole. Treble quality is similar to RHA’s MA350, though on the whole the NE-600X is a little more energetic, but not harsher.

The NE-600X also has a surprisingly capable presentation – for a budget in-ear it sounds nice and out-of-the-head. This helps the heavy bass appear less boomy than it otherwise would be. The RHA MA350, for instance, actually sounds more congested despite technically being less mid-bassy and clearer. Another thing to be said for the NE-600X – it is a very efficient earphone. Sensitivity is not something I normally place a lot of importance on, but it matters for budget earphones because purchasers so often equate loudness with quality.

*Select Comparisons*

NarMoo R1M (black ports) ($25)

NarMoo’s R1M earphone features a sound adjustment system with three pairs of interchangeable tuning ports. These ports most strongly affect the bass quantity of the earphones. The R1M matches the bass of the NE-600X most closely with its bassiest tuning (black ports).

With the R1M in this configuration, both earphones have enormous bass that should satisfy even die-hard bassheads, and yet despite their deep, booming bass, both still offer pretty good clarity and avoid the sort of congestion that often plagues entry-level basshead earphones. The differences are subtle – the NE-600X is warmer while the R1M is a little more neutral. Vocals are a bit more intelligible on the R1M, likely due to slightly greater midrange presence, but overall the NE-600X is a little clearer and more crisp, though also a little more harsh.

Dunu Trident ($28)

Dunu’s entry-level Trident model follows a warm and smooth sound signature while the NE-600X is more v-shaped. The NE-600X is bassier, but its bass quality is still on-par with the Trident, which is impressive. The Nuforce unit is clearer and more crisp than the Trident, too, thanks to the treble emphasis of its v-shaped signature. The Trident is smoother and arguably a little more natural tonally, but the clarity gap makes me favor the NE-600X very slightly. Lastly, the NE-600X is more efficient, which is quite important for an earphone in this price range if it’s to appeal to casual listeners.

Fidue A31s ($30)

Fidue’s entry-level A31s model is a tiny dynamic-driver earphone with a warm and smooth signature akin to that of the Dunu Trident. It has less bass than the NE-600X but more than the Trident, and sounds a little more boomy as well. The tonal character of the A31s is very warm and it is a very smooth earphone, but the extra treble energy of the Nuforce makes it sound significantly clearer. As with the Trident, the smoother sound of the A31s can sound more natural from a tonal standpoint but it is entirely too muffled for my liking compared to the more v-shaped NE-600X. The NE-600X is again more efficient than the Fidue.

T-Peos Tank ($30)

The Tank is the most bass-heavy of the entry-level T-Peos sets and as such made for the most logical comparison for the NE-600X. It still couldn’t match the NE-600X in bass volume, and while its bass is not as tight as that of the T-Peos Rich200 and Popular, it is still significantly less bloated than that of the NE-600X. The Tank is also a lot clearer, at the expense of some of the warmth and note thickness of the Nuforce set. However, the treble of the Tank is harsher and it suffers from a smaller soundstage and significantly less spacious presentation compared to the Nuforce.

Nuforce NE-700X ($65)

For two earphones with a pretty substantial price gap, the NE-600X and NE-700X sound quite similar – the tuning can easily be pegged as belonging to the same family. The higher-end model does sound a little clearer and more controlled overall, which gives it a more Hi-Fi sound. The bass of the NE-600X is a bit less tight and it sounds a little more v-shaped, with slightly harsher treble compared to the NE-700X. The NE-600X is also more efficient. Overall, while I prefer the sound of the NE-700X, there is no denying that the lower-end model is a stronger value.

Value *(9.5/10)* – The budget-minded Nuforce NE-600X draws on the tuning of the company’s higher-end earphones to deliver an unabashedly bass-heavy sound without sacrificing overall performance, as so many inexpensive enhanced-bass IEMs do. With the recent price drop, this makes it one of the best values around not only for fans of big bass, but also for casual listeners in need of an inexpensive everyday earphone.

*Pros: Basshead earphones with good overall performance*
*Cons: Cable can be a bit noisy when worn straight down*


----------



## ljokerl

*Tier 3B ($15-30)*
  
*(3B1)* *MEElectronics M6 / M6P*
  

Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: Sports-style earphone from MEElectronics
 Current Price: *$22* from Amazon.com (MSRP: $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4.6’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids, De-Cored Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Hard clamshell carrying case, shirt clip, silicone single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and tri-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips
 Build Quality* (4/5)* - Solid-feeling plastic housings are coupled with Meelec's excellent new cabling terminated with a low-profile L-plug. Two inches of memory wire provide additional strain relief
 Isolation *(3/5)* – By design they cannot be inserted too deeply, but still provide average levels of isolation
 Microphonics *(5/5)* Over-the-ear fit and excellent cables, coupled with an included shirt clip, make microphonics nonexistent
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Comfort itself is quite good but getting them fitted initially can be difficult due to the memory wire. Luckily, memory wire can be removed with a bit of knifework

 Sound *(5.7/10)* – Despite sharing a basic signature with the Meelec M9, the M6 are superior in every way except airiness. They just don’t sound as breathy as the M9. They are, however, more detailed and have good extension on both ends. Soundstage and positioning are good for the price. Clarity across the range is also impressive, with decent bass control and crystal-clear sparkle at the top of the range. There is a mid-bass hump but it’s hardly distracting and doesn’t detract much from the overall balance. Treble is also quite pronounced, leading to a somewhat V-shaped signature. Still, they provide a very good all-around sound at the price point and can please both the detail freak and the casual listener.

 Value *(9/10)* – Taken as a total package, the Meelec M6 is a steal - Techno/Trance and Electronica listeners need not look any further, but nearly everyone is sure to be impressed with the combination of sound and comfort at the price point. One of my favorites in its class.

*Pros: Well-built, comfortable, great sound
 Cons: Can be an epic pain to get fitted*
  

*(3B2) Head-Direct RE2*






Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Old ($99) version of the RE2 IEM
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cord: _5’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Soundmagic PL30 bi-flanges, stock small bi-flanges, De-Cored Olives._
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Spare filters, a nice selection of silicone tips (single- and bi-flanges), and a shirt clip. A nice leather-wrapped wooden case was included with my version but is no longer provided.
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – completely plastic shell, some reports of splitting; Cables are thick and sturdy but very plasticky and tangle easily. Hard plastic stem can damage cables
 Isolation *(2/5)* – ported. Bi-flange tips help, but still below average isolation
 Microphonics *(2/5)* Rather poor and cannot be worn over-the-ear well. New cables are improved
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – cannot be worn over-the-ear; regular straight-barrel IEM otherwise

 Sound *(6.1/10)* – The overall sound surprises with its clarity. The highs are detailed and sound extended, but roll off earlier than I expected and can sometimes be overly bright and a little forward. The mids have good clarity and detail. The smoothness is very impressive for the price, as well. The low frequencies roll off quickly but what is there is detailed and precise. Amping helps.

 Amping: Likes a warm amp for a more well-rounded sound. Excessive power is not necessary. Bass boost helps with raising the low-end response.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – At $39, it was easy to recommend the RE2s for lovers of genres that benefit from a neutral/analytical presentation and high level of detail, such as classical. At the new $29 price, they are an absolute steal.

*Pros: Great detail and clarity, smooth mids & highs
 Cons: Mediocre isolation, cannot be worn over the ear, poor low-end extension, not much bass quantity, can be bright*
  
  
*(3B3) MEElectronics M9*





Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Meelec’s high bang/buck contender in the $20 range
 Current Price: *$17* from amazon.com (MSRP: $24.99); $23 for M9P with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4’ 45-degree plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Hard clamshell case, shirt clip, single-(3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – While the old version had known build issues, the new M9s are very solidly constructed out of metal using the same cables as rest of the range – striped silver on the silver version; dark grey on the black version
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Longer housings and included bi-flange help achieve deeper insertion and greater isolation despite the vented design
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cable down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)*– Shallow insertion and fairly light weight make these quite comfortable for long term use but bi-flanges may be required for the best sound. The sound is very sensitive to insertion depth so all of the tips are worth trying

 Sound *(5.3/10)* – The M9 share their general signature with the Meelec M6, which happen to be my favorites from the entire Meelectronics lineup. The soundstage is fairly wide and they sound quite airy – much more so than the top-of-the-range M11. They have great extension at the top end and very strong bass. The bass is sometimes excessive in quantity and tends towards ‘boomy’. The mids are slightly recessed and a bit dry, just like the M6. Though clarity is great all-around, they can be overwhelmed a tiny bit by busy tracks and there is some upper-end harshness. Treble is strong and sparkly, boasting surprising detail and extension for a $20 earphone. Of note, the sound they put out is very fit-dependent; experimentation with different tips may be necessary to get the best out of them.

 Value *(9/10)* – The sound of these is easily worth the price of admission. Clarity and detail are superb and the sound is more airy than any of Meelec’s other models. It’s very hard to compete with the detail these are capable of producing at such a low price point. Meelectroncs’ excellent customer service deserves a nod here too.

*Pros: Excellent accessory pack, excellent sound at the price point, good build quality, very low microphonics
 Cons: Can be difficult to wear over-the-ear, bass may be too strong/boomy for some*


*(3B4) MEElectronics R1*
  

Reviewed Nov 2009 / Updated Jan 2011
  
 Details: MEElectronics first “woody” IEM
 Current Price: *$28* from Amazon.com (MSRP: $39.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Freq:_ 20-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4.6’ L- plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock Single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear _

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Single-flange (3-sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, cord wrap, airplane adapter, shirt clip, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Housing is made of a light-colored wood and sealed with a clear lacquer. The cable is similar to the new M6 and M11 cables but in a dark grey color. L/R markings rub off way too easily.
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The bulge on the housing which holds the driver prevents deep insertion with single-flange tips. Bi-flange tips just don’t sound quite right.
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Surprisingly bad considering the cable is similar to the (stellar) one on the M11. Wearing them over-the-ear with the shirt clip helps
 Comfort *(3/5)* – The driver bulge on the housing prevents these from being truly comfortable the way the M11s are. Also makes it more difficult than I would like to wear the cables over the ear.

 Sound *(4.2/10) *– Warm. Very warm. These can almost make the RadioPaq Jazz sound cold in comparison. While the warmth makes them feel full and intimate, it really gets in the way of hearing detail, especially at the low end. There is very little texture to the bass, but a whole lot of power. As a result, it sounds poorly controlled, albeit rather smooth. The same warm intimacy really messes with the soundstage and positioning as well, which these severely lack. The treble extension is also harmed by the warmth – they just have too much low-end bias. The mids are definitely there, but they sound a little hollow. If the JVC HA-FX300 “BiMetals” sound metallic, these definitely sound “woody”.

 Value *(5/10) *– At $26, the R1 is an earphone to be considered only by true lovers of warm and bassy sound. While still providing good value for money, it just isn’t good enough otherwise to compete against Meelec’s other offerings. It should be noted that there are variances between individual production units of Meelectronics earphones in my experience. The fact that my R1 cables are very microphonic is a testament to this.

*Update (01/11)*: An updated version of the R1 was released several months ago, with the ambient vent relocated from the side of the housings to the rear. While the original R1 was nauseatingly warm and slightly de-emphasized at the top, the new version is a bit more balanced, with prominent lower treble and more neutral overall tonality. The sound signature of the still hinges on the huge bass – though slightly less controlled than that of the M9, the bass of the R1 is softer in character and more pleasant on the whole. The depth and power of the bass are quite good for an entry-level in-ear and give music a characteristic underlying rumble. There is still not a whole lot of texture to the low end and the bass is felt more than it is heard but on the whole the relaxed low end is a welcome change from the explosive aggressiveness of the Meelec M9 or the tight-and-controlled presentation of something like the Sennheiser CX200.

 The midrange is slightly recessed but not as much as that of the M9. It is, however, less clear and detailed than the dryer, thinner-sounding mids of the M9. There’s a bit of a veil present and the sub-bass rumble additionally blankets the midrange on some tracks. On the upside the lower mids are smooth, full, and liquid. The upper midrange, on the other hand, is quite strident. There are noticeable response spikes, resulting in mild harshness and sibilance on certain tracks. Lower treble response is hard-edged – even more so than that of the M9 – but becomes softer and more smooth towards the top and extends higher than that of the 1st-gen R1. Presentation-wise the R1 is fairly airy but not as wide-sounding as the M9. The omnipresent bass leads to issues with positioning but on the whole the new R1 sounds less confined than the old one. Combined with the somewhat harsh treble, this makes the R1 a better earphone for movies and games than it is for music but it is an improvement over the old model either way.

*Pros: Interesting design, good build quality
 Cons: L/R identifiers come off too easily, disappointing microphonics, not particularly comfortable, sound is too warm*


*(3B5) Soundmagic PL21 / MP21*

Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: The latest budget earphone from Soundmagic
 Current Price: *$18* from focalprice.com; $28 for MP-21 (with microphone)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _VSonic foamies, stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5) *– Silicone single-flange (4 sizes) and foam (3 sets) tips, pleather carrying pouch, set of rubber cable guides, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The shells are aluminum and feel well-machined. Cables are rubberized and feature articulated strain reliefs. Not as thick as the PL50 cabling or Meelctronics’ cables, but still very functional
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Isolation is about average; foam tips help
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – present when worn straight-down. Can be eliminated entirely by wearing them over-the-ear. Shirt clip and gable guides are included.
 Comfort *(4/5)* – They are extremely light and the driver bulge is smaller and farther from the nozzle than on the Meelec R1 or Skullcandy Titans so they are far more comfortable

 Sound *(4.8/10)* – The sound produced by the PL21s is massively different from their PL30 and PL50 brethren. While the latter two are the more neutral and accurate earphones, the PL21 is a lot more fun. It produces a dark, bassy, and aggressive sound. The bass is impactful but occasionally lacking restraint (i.e. boomy). The midrange is recessed compared to the lows but still plenty lively. The treble is okay but high-end extension could be better. Soundstage is good but not as wide and airy as the older PL30s. They also lose out to the Meelec Ai-M9 in treble quality, quantity, and detail. Still, the entire signature is coherent and very enjoyable for a budget IEM and they are still one of my favorites in their class

 Value *(8/10)* – The Soundmagic PL21s offer a much more mainstream sound than the PL30 and PL50 at a bargain price. They are not perfect by any means, but they offer a very lively signature as part of a complete entry-level package and have no glaring faults – the build quality is good, the accessories are good, the comfort is good. There is really very little fault I can find with these for $21.

*Pros: Rich sound, decent soundstage, comfortable
 Cons: Bass is a sometimes boomy, not as airy or detailed as the PL30 or Ai-M9*

 Full review can be found here


*(3B6) JVC HA-FXC50 “Micro HD”*





Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: JVC’s unique IEM utilizing a microdriver positioned at the tip of the nozzle
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $39.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _10-24k Hz_ | Cable: _3.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(2/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes) and carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Plastic housing with molded strain reliefs. I like the design and the beveled JVC logo but I’ve had two pairs of these where one of the channels went out so I’m wary of the build quality. Cabling is thinner than on the other JVC IEMs and more prone to tangling
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Much better than I expected. I think the fact that the driver is at the very tip of the nozzle helps with the isolation
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – These are meant to be worn cable-down; the microphonics aren’t particularly bothersome but definitely present
 Comfort *(3/5)* – This driver of the earphone is right inside the nozzle and the housing is completely empty. JVC could’ve shaped it any way imaginable, but after the impossibly comfortable aircushions, the FXC50s are a disappointment. They are nearly impossible to wear over-the-ear and while it does hold them in place well, the rubber-padded plastic bit on the side causes the strain relief to put unpleasant pressure on the bottom of my ears

 Sound *(5.8/10)* – The HA-FXC50 is characterized by the 5.8mm “Micro HD” driver positioned at the very tip of the nozzle, right inside your ear. The overall signature is bright and detailed. They remind me of the Head-Direct RE2s but with less smoothness and more bass. Due to the peculiar positioning of the drivers their sound is extremely sensitive to the seal. Without a proper seal they sound tinny, flat, and distant. With a good seal, however, they are quite balanced and intimate. The soundstage is small but they still mange to convey depth. The bass is punchy and slightly above average in quantity. Mids are fairly present, though not a forward as the treble. The treble is bright and at times slightly harsh, but no worse than some much higher-end earphones. Overall the signature is pretty unique at the price point and can be quite enjoyable.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – At the current market price the FXC50s are excellent budget earphones. They offer superior detail and clarity to JVC’s other budget earphones and are quite good performers all around. I just wish JVC had made these as practical as the Marshmallows and AirCushions. Better QC, thicker cabling, and a way to wear them over-the-ear comfortably would truly make these top contenders.

*Pros: Very detailed, good balance and clarity
 Cons: QC issues, brightness can be tiring*


*(3B7) JLAB JBuds J3 Micro Atomic*





Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Newly released IEM from Jlabs touted as being less mainstream-oriented than the old J2
 Current Price: *$20 *from Amazon.com (MSRP: $79.95); $25 for J3M (with microphone) (MSRP: $89.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _88 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (4 sizes) and hard clamshell case
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The housings are metal and quite nice to the touch. They feel like they will last. The cord is especially nice – it seems to be Teflon-coated and is very soft with a bit of memory character. The biggest problem for me is driver flex and pop. They can be very annoying when a good seal is achieved and the driver may not ‘pop’ back to its normal shape for several minutes.
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Above-average isolation; perfectly reasonable for my commute
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Present when worn straight down; very low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are very small – only slightly bigger than those on the Meelectronics M11s. A good fit and seal are very easy to achieve either cord-up or cord-down. One small annoyance is the Left/Right identification, which takes the form of a small “L” stamped in the strain relief of the left earpiece. It can be located by touch, but I prefer easily visible identifiers

 Sound *(4.7/10)* – The J3s are surprisingly balanced earphones that offer tight, well-controlled bass and impressive treble extension. The treble-focused signature may make them seem treble-biased, but it isn’t quite so. The bass is definitely present but not emphasized like JLabs previous model, the J2. With a proper seal the bass has more impact than tone but stays out of the midrange’s way. Treble is very harsh out of the box but evens out significantly over time. They are still quite cold-sounding and slightly metallic even after significant burn-in, but enjoyable in their own right. Soundstage is a bit smaller than average but the detail put out by the microdriver is very reasonable.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The J3s offer a revolutionary, rather than evolutionary, step up from the J2, moving away from the crowd-pleasing bass-centric sound of its predecessor and towards a more balanced signature. While not everyone will be pleased with the somewhat cold and analytical presentation, those looking for a way to get more out of their music for less will be impressed. The tiny slim housings and nice cables add to the appeal.

*Pros: Good cabling, comfortable, impressive treble quality
 Cons: Massive driver flex; ridiculous MSRP, cold signature*


*(3B8) Lenntek Sonix Micro*
  

Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Updated version of Lenntek’s Sonix model
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $39.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.6’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (4 sizes in black + extra set of Medium tips in white), 2’ extension cable, and velvet snap-close pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The housings are metal and very well-built. Nylon-sheathed cabling is thick and sturdy. Housing strain reliefs could be better but the overall build is excellent.
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Above-average isolation; perfectly reasonable for my commute
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Present when worn straight down; very low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Tiny housings make these about as comfortable as straight-barrel in-ears can get

 Sound *(4.4/10)* –The Sonix are bass-biased but don’t sound particularly unbalanced. The signature is warm and intimate. The Soundstage is rather narrow but boasts good positioning and above-average depth. The bass is impactful with a hint of bloat. It can be excessive at times but is also hugely fun on dance and other beat-heavy tracks. The slight bass bloat does not significantly affect the midrange, which is warm and dynamic, if a bit muddy. The treble is recessed compared to the bass and mids, but still present. Expectedly, they lack the clarity and detail of some higher-priced products, but overall the sound of the Sonix Micro compares favorably to other earphones in the price range and has something a lot of the competition lacks – the fun factor.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The Lenntek Sonix offer a mainstream, bass-heavy sound at an excellent price point and without sacrifice in other areas. Bass-lovers from all walks of life will be impressed. Though not sonically perfect, the Sonix Micro make up for their shortfalls by offering great build quality, above-average isolation and comfort, and a lifetime warranty. They feel first and foremost like a quality product, and that is their main strength.

*Pros: Excellent build quality; fun, mainstream, bass-heavy sound
 Cons: Can be a bit muddy*

 Full review can be found here


*(3B9) Soundmagic PL30*





Reviewed Jan 2010
  
 Details: Soundmagic’s first widely acknowledged success, the PL30 redefined the attitude towards budget IEMs at Head-Fi
 Current Price: *$25* from focalprice.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _12 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-22k Hz_ | Cord: _4’ L-plug (old revision shown)_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single-flanges, Stock foamies_
 Wear Style: _over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(5/5) *– Silicone single-flange (3 sizes, 2 sets), bi-flange, and foam tips, hard clamshell carrying case, cable winder, set of rubber cable guides, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The PL30 is my oldest fully functional IEM. The plastic shells (rubberized in the black version) are well made and feature proper strain reliefs. Cabling is rubberized and similar to that found on the PL21s but terminates in a simplistic I-plug rather than the L-plug used on the PL21/PL50. The only real (small) flaw I can think of are that the bass knobs can become loose if fiddled with often and the paint rubs off over time
 Isolation *(1.5/5)* – Shallow insertion and a ported design mean that the PL30s don’t shine in isolation
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent. Shirt clip eliminates them entirely
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – With properly-fitting tips these are some of the most comfortable IEMs out there. Wearing them over-the-ear is a must but they’re light, low-profile, and very easy to forget about

 Sound *(5.2/10)* – The PL30 produce a very pleasant and balanced sound characterized by a slightly forward midrange and a very soft/smooth presentation all around. The low end is tight and accurate, but not particularly impactful. Switching to the bass-heavy setting bumps up the bass very little. Treble is rather tame as well, without a hint of harshness or sibilance (granted my PL30s may have an advantage here in being my oldest working IEM and probably having close to 1k hours on them). The one area where the PL30s undoubtedly triumph over the competition is the lateral width of the soundstage. It is truly massive, beaten only by the Cyclone PR1 Pro under the $100 mark. With the large soundstage comes excellent instrumental separation and good positioning. Another interesting property of the PL30s is the transparency – they are extremely revealing of both source and source material and by far the cheapest IEM that allows me to distinguish between 192k and 320k mp3 files played straight from my Fuze. Worth noting is that the low impedance leads to some very slight hiss with some sources and amps (though the Fuze headphone out remains nearly silent).

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The aging Soundmagic PL30 offers a whole lot of bang for your buck with its stellar accessory pack, lack of microphonics, and comfortable form factor. The sound may not be for everyone – they are quite laid back overall, lack low-end ‘oomph’ and some high-end extension and sparkle, and aren’t particularly forgiving of poor recordings - but for a wide, airy, and well-balanced sound these are unbeatable at their price point.

*Pros: Outstanding accessory pack, comfortable form factor, balanced and wide sound
 Cons: Can hiss with some sources/amps*


*(3B10) JVC HA-FX66 “Air Cushion”*





Reviewed Jan 2010
  
 Details: JVC’s follow-up to the well-received HA-FX33 ‘Marshmallows’
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $29.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _10-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Soundmagic PL30 BiFlanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), foam tips, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Housings are rubber-covered plastic and feel like they will last. Cabling is similar to that found on the HA-FX34 and HA-FX300 – thick and flexible
 Isolation *(1.5/5)* – The Air Cushion fitting system makes for a very shallow insertion. Isolation is a tradeoff for comfort with these
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Fairly low but the FX66 cannot be worn cord-up. A shirt clip would have been nice
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The Air Cushion fitting system leaves a space between the earphone housing and the ear; combined with the angled nozzles and soft rubber-covered housings this results in a completely unobtrusive fit

 Sound *(4.5/10)* – Like the Marshmallows, the overall sound of the Air Cushions is on the warm side and fairly smooth. Bass is strong and punchy, albeit lacking control. Low-end extension is still surprising for a $20 earphone. The midrange is obscured slightly by the bass at the low end and recessed overall but clarity and detail are superior to unmodded marshmallows and on-par with my Kramered set. Still nothing to brag about compared to the current crop of budget earphones. There is just a tiny bit of sibilance in the treble but it is still less sharp than that of the marshmallows. The overall sound is wider and more open than the marshmallows. It is also brighter but at the same time less tiring. From memory, I like these better than my marshmallows when they were stock but not better than my Kramered marshmallows, which have a more forward midrange and better treble detail.

 Value *(8/10)* –The Air Cushion is still a very good buy at the current street price for someone looking for an extremely comfortable and decent-sounding set of IEMs without the need for modification. Though definitely not as suitable for critical listening as the Ai-M9, PL30, or even PL21, the FX66 is a balanced and smooth-sounding earphone with ‘user-friendly’ written all over it.

*Pros: Very comfortable, low microphonics, durable, decent sound
 Cons: Arguably poorer sound than (cheaper) Kramered marshmallows, cable may be too short for some, subpar isolation*


*(3B11) Beta Brainwavz Pro*





Reviewed Feb 2010
  
 Details: Flagship earphone from mp4nation’s Brainwavz line
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $34.50)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _24 Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _8-28k Hz _| Cable: _4.3’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_4.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Silicone ‘cone’ (2 sets) and bi-flange tips, Ety-style orange foamies, Soundmagic-style black foamies (3 sizes), Mofi carrying pouch, shirt clip, clip-on cable winder, silicone ear guides, and a pair of bass filters
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Plastic housings look a bit cheap but the metal nozzles, heatshrink strain reliefs, and rubberized cabling the Betas feel like they will cope well with abuse
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Adequate for a ported dynamic IEM
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Non-existent when worn cord up and nearly unnoticeable when worn cord-down
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are very light and easy to wear cord-up or cord down. The ‘cone’ tips are useless but with Sony Hybrids or the included orange foamies they are extremely comfortable

 Sound *(5/10)* – As with the Phonak PFEs, the sound signature of the Beta Brainwavz can be altered by installing the included ‘bass filters’, which tightens the low-end response and tones down the upper mids and treble. However, a chunk of much-needed treble resolution is lost in the process so I preferred them without the filters. It should be noted that the overall sound is rather bright in the filter-less configuration; adding the filters brings it closer to neutrality. The bass is reasonably tight and quite fast, accurately hitting distinct notes whether the filters are installed or not. The low end is not integrated into the overall sound as much as I would like and lacks raw impact, but truthfully is about as good as it gets for the price. The midrange is neither forward nor recessed but the whole signature seems slightly distant, causing the mids to sound hollow at times. There also seems to be some emphasis on the upper midrange, which gives certain vocals an ‘edgy’ quality and cuts down significantly on upper midrange/lower treble clarity. As a result the upper mids of the betas can sound run-together and lacking in detail. The treble has a bit of sparkle but rolls off near the top. Denser tracks are clearly are not the Betas’ forté as instruments such as high-hats can get downright lost. For pop and soft rock, however, they work quite well.

 Value *(8/10)* – Though it may seem like I dislike the Betas, I will admit to being overly critical of them partly because I reviewed them side-by-side with some far more expensive offerings and partly because they just don’t work all that well with my preferred music genres. But the sound really is quite good for the asking price – among their similarly-priced peers the Betas surprise most with their speed and lack of low-end bleed. Build and comfort are above par as well, making the Betas quite easy to use and well-worthy of consideration for a budget set.

*Pros: Lots of accessories, comfortable, almost no microphonics; sound is fast and tight
 Cons: Stock tips are mostly useless, lack of clarity in the upper mids/lower treble, no cord cinch*

 More impressions and a comparison to several competitors can be found here


*(3B12) ECCI PR100*





Reviewed Mar 2010
  
 Details: Budget IEM developed in-house by Cyclone and released under the company’s new ECCI brand
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $32)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock (wide-tube) single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Narrow-tube (3 sizes) and wide-tube (3 sizes) single-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and oversize clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Sturdy two-piece metal shells feel solid and are finished in a handsome gunmetal color with the model name etched on the front. The dark-grey TPE (Thermoplastic Elastomer) cable is thick and sturdy, with proper strain reliefs on cable entry and a functional cord cinch. Sadly, the translucent hard plastic sheath on the 3.5mm plug is more likely to damage to the cord than protect it, tainting an otherwise excellent build
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The extra long nozzles allow for deep insertion of the earphones, boosting isolation above what one would expect for a ported straight-barrel dynamic. On the downside, the bottom-facing vents make the earphones more susceptible than most to wind noise
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – bothersome when worn cord-down; good otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The extra-long sound tube allows the earphones to be inserted deeply without pressing the wearer’s ear into the housings - a good thing as the front edges of the shells are rather sharp. Short strain reliefs and elongated bodies make the earphones easy to wear cord-up as well as cord-down. Either way they are quite comfortable for prolonged listening sessions

 Sound *(5.6/10)* – The PR100 goes after a more mainstream market while still maintaining the balance emphasis of the older PR1 Pro model. The bass of the PR100 extends to 30Hz or so before dropping off, not reaching into the sub-bass quite as well as the PR1, but performing respectably for the asking price. There is a tiny hint of mid-bass emphasis but the overall response of the ECCIs is surprisingly linear. Bass is tight and punchy but not particularly powerful - low notes are heard more than they are felt. The transition to the midrange is smooth and with no bleed. The midrange is obscured by neither the bass nor the treble – it’s really quite pleasant but not the focus of the presentation the way it is with, for example, the Soundmagic PL50. Detail is very good for the price though they are notably lacking in resolving power compared to higher-end IEMs. Same goes for clarity – good for the price but not class-leading. The treble of the ECCIs is fairly accurate and rolls of gently near the top. There is some peakiness in the lower treble and they will accentuate sibilance already present in recordings. I personally found the treble perfectly pleasant on properly-recorded material. Soundstaging is good – not as wide as with the PR1s, but there is space around each instrument and a good sense of air in the overall sound. Positioning and instrumental separation, going hand-in-hand, are both quite decent.

 Value *(8/10)* – For as long as I’ve owned them, the Soundmagic PL30 have been my favorite budget headphones when it comes to over balance. But the $30 PR100 is aiming straight for the PL30 throne, offering a similarly impeccable balance and a slightly meatier overall sound. For those looking for a well-built all-rounder that does nearly everything right, the PR100 is right up there with the best earphones I’ve heard in its class.

*Pros: Good isolation and build quality, comfortable, balanced sound
 Cons: Microphonics can be bothersome*

 Full review can be found here.


*(3B13) Sennheiser CX300*





Reviewed Apr 2010
  
 Details: Sennheiser’s aging mid-range model, quite possibly more popular than any other IEM currently in production
 Current Price: *$29 *from Amazon.com (MSRP: $49.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _18-21k Hz_ | Cable: _3.3’ L-plug, j-cord_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Plasticky housings with rubber strain reliefs all-around. The relief on the 3.5mm L-plug is not molded but at least the cables are rubberized and not too thin
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Very shallow insertion leads to average isolation
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Quite poor when worn cord-down; just passable otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Short housings with short nozzles mean that deep insertion is difficult with stock tips. J-cord configuration can also make over-the-ear wear awkward

 Sound *(4.8/10)* – The CX300s are known around here mostly for their bass, which is usually cast in a negative light. The low end does offer a whole lot of grunt but lacks in detail and rolls off steeply below 35Hz. There is some mid-range bleed, coloring the sound and obscuring lower-midrange detail. The lack of definition also causes drums to sound ‘hollow’ at times. But there are upsides: compared to a lot of bottom-tier offerings the sound of the CX300s is dimensional and well-spaced. Clarity is quite decent in the rest of the range. The midrange isn’t recessed and the treble boasts decent extension; there’s just not enough of it. The overall balance is very reminiscent of the Lenntek Sonix Micro, with a slightly better sense of space but also poorer bass control. The sound is very pleasant for pop, rap, and soft rock, though it starts deteriorating on fast and dense tracks.

 Value *(4/10)* – With current prices hovering around $25, the CX300 loses terribly in value to the majority of competing models. The pricing of earphones such as the Lenntek Sonix Micro and the “younger sibling” CX250 render the CX300 inexcusably mediocre in today’s crowded marketplace. Their popularity is easy to explain – the powerful bass works well with the dimensionality and clarity of the rest of the range. Plus the CX300s were one of the only IEMs in their price range upon release, building up fame and a loyal following rather quickly. I do think that much of the distaste for the CX300 around the forum is exaggerated - they really aren’t offensive to my ears. But as a whole package, this one is best left to the history books.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable, decent build quality
 Cons: Microphonic, j-corded, lacks bass control and treble presence*


*(3B14) Sennheiser CX250*





Reviewed Apr 2010
  
 Details: Fairly obscure and surprisingly competent budget entry from Sennheiser
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $59.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Jays Single-flange Silicones_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes) and carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are entirely plastic but seem well-made and feature proper strain reliefs. MX-style Y-split and hard rubber L-plug sheath make them feel rather solid but the earbud-sourced cable has no sliding cinch. The cable features a sliding volume pot. Slight driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Longer nozzles and rounded housings mean these can be inserted far more deeply than the CX300, leading to better isolation
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – bothersome when worn cord-down; good otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Very light housings that can achieve a proper insertion depth. Very easy to wear cord-up or cord-down

 Sound *(5.1/10)* – It is unclear just where in Sennheiser’s CX range the CX250 belongs. To my ears they are clearly superior to the older but still popular CX300s, as the slightly higher MSRP indicates. The street price of the CX250, however, has historically been much lower than that of the CX300s. What, then, of the sound? Well, the CX250 follows in its predecessors footsteps in terms of bass quantity, providing plenty of punch to a deep 30Hz (unlike the CX300, which rolls off steeply past 35). The impact is much tighter and the mid-bass hump seems a good bit shallower, leading to greatly reduced bloat and mid-range bleed. The bass isn’t quite as visceral as with my $20 bass fave, the Meelec M9s, but also not at all boomy. The mids are still fairly laid back and boast good clarity, similar to how the CX300 midrange should sound if the bass bloat were eliminated. Soundstage width is nothing to brag about but the sound is well-spaced and dimensional. The treble is more forward than on the CX300s, though not as present and sparkly as on the Meelec M9. Treble smoothness is compromised only slightly. The overall sound is the most balanced of the three, which makes the CX250 a great all-rounder more similar to the rarely-mentioned Soundmagic PL21s.

 Value *(8/10)* – The sound of the CX250 is exactly what I would have wanted Sennheiser to do with the CX300 – tighten up the bass and boost the treble while retaining the midrange clarity and fun factor. Combined with a smaller price tag and superior all-around usability, the CX250 comes out as one of the best all-around $20 IEMs out there.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable, good build quality, fairly isolating, solid sonic characteristics
 Cons: Microphonics can be bothersome*
  
  
*(3B15) JVC HA-FX67 “Air Cushion”*
  

Reviewed Jun 2010
  
 Details: Second generation of JVC’s comfort-oriented budget IEM
 Current Price: *$17* from buy.com (MSRP: $19.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _10-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_
  
 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), foam tips, and double-sided shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Housings are rubber-covered plastic and feel like they will last. Cabling is soft and flexible, with decent relief on either end
 Isolation *(2/5)* – The Air Cushion fitting system makes for a very shallow insertion but the FX67 seems to isolate slightly more than the FX66
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Fairly bothersome and exacerbated by the fact that the FX67 cannot be worn cord-up. However, the new shirt clip helps
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The Air Cushion fitting system leaves a space between the earphone housing and the ear; combined with the angled nozzles and soft rubber-covered housings this results in a completely unobtrusive fit
  
 Sound *(4.5/10)* – The HA-FX67 use the same drivers as the older HA-FX66. The sound they produce is basically identical – slightly warm and fairly smooth. Bass is strong and impactful but a bit slow and lacking in control. Low-end extension is quite impressive. The lower midrange is obscured slightly by the bass end and the mids are recessed overall. Clarity and detail are fine, though they can’t compete with the Meelec M9s or Soundmagic PL30s. A tiny bit of sibilance is present in the treble but it’s not nearly bothersome enough to be a con. The treble is bright and not as recessed as the midrange but lacking in detail and extension. The overall sound is fairly spacious but the poorly controlled bass makes the low end sound more boomy and closed than would otherwise have been possible. Overall it’s a fun, tap-your-toes type of sound that can be both engaging and relaxing. Not audiophile by any means but perfectly tolerable for a budget set.
  
 Value *(8/10)* – Though it may seem like JVC has made nearly no changes to the AirCushion in the three and a half years since the FX66 was released, there is one major difference between the FX67 and FX66 – the price. In 2007 the AirCushion was very difficult to find for less than $35. The FX67, however, is retailing for under $20 at the outset – the market price of this level of performance has fallen twofold, which is about what I would have expected. Because of that, the AirCushions remain a decent set of earphones for the price, especially for those concerned primarily with comfort.
  
*Pros: Very comfortable, durable, decent sound*
*Cons: Subpar isolation*


*(3B16) Fischer Audio Toughstuff TS-9002*
* *
**
Reviewed Jul 2010
* *
 Details: Budget-oriented IEM from Fischer Audio’s Toughstuff line, which emphasizes build quality and durability over all else
 Current Price: $27.50 from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $27.50)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _91 dB_ | Freq: _20-22k Hz_ | Cable: 4’_L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 5_mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single flanges, stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
* *
 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and soft denim carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The finely-machined metal shells are rock-solid and the thick, flexible cables are identical to those used by the Meelectronics IEMs. The nozzles are metal but, like most budget IEMs, contain paper filters. By far the biggest weakness of the TS-9002 is the lack of strain reliefs, both on the metal stems of the housings and the plastic 3.5mm L-plug. On the upside, the shells can actually be unscrewed quite easily and the earphones can probably be recabled should the need arise
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The Toughstuffs are shallow-insertion earphones but the wide bodies seal well and isolation is quite decent
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low when worn cord-down, nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(3/5)* – The TS-9002 housings are quite large and have very short nozzles. Their fit is similar to that of the Ortofon e-Q7 but with housings that are rounded at the front. They are a bit weighty but not as heavy as Monster Turbines or HJE900s and are easy to wear cord-up or cord-down. The overall fit will be similar to most other straight barrel IEMs for all except those with the smallest ears
* *
 Sound *(5.4/10)* – For a mainstream budget-oriented earphone, the TS-9002 is surprisingly well-balanced and competent. The bass is fairly deep and very impactful but relatively well-controlled right out of the box and tightens up a bit more over time. Some mid-bass emphasis is present but it would be unfair to call the TS-9002 bloated. The sub-bass rumble that the Meelec M9 is capable of is absent but so is the slightly boomy nature of the Meelecs – a fair trade-off in my book. However, the Fischers also lack some of the texture and detail present in bass of the M9s.
  
 The midrange of the TS-9002 is slightly warm and quite clear. Compared to the dry and slightly de-emphasized mids of the Meelec M9, the midrange of the TS-9002 sounds well filled-out and balanced, if not quite as crisp. The treble is in good balance with the rest of the sound and rolls off mildly at the very top. Compared to that of the Meelec M9, the treble of the TS-9002 is less detailed and lacks sparkle and extension but also boasts better refinement and control. Soundstaging is adequate but not great. The Toughstuffs carry decent air and a spacious sonic image but calling them open-sounding would be a huge overstatement. Soundstaging is just adequate - no more, no less. Overall the sound is very respectable for a budget-oriented earphone and offers a good alternative to those who may find the Meelec M9 too aggressive, especially in the treble.
  
 Value *(8/10)* – The Fischer Audio Toughstuff TS-9002 is another capable and well-built budget entry from the Russian audio firm. The unique metal shells look and feel like they should cost quite a bit more than the asking price and the sound isn’t far behind in terms of value for money. The lack of strain reliefs all around is slightly disheartening and the large housings with short nozzles may not fit absolutely everyone, but the TS-9002 is still one of the better sub-$30 earphones I’ve encountered, beating out some far more expensive units when it comes to sounding and looking like a quality product.
  
*Pros: Housings are sturdy and pleasant to the touch, low microphonics, surprisingly capable sound*
*Cons: No strain reliefs, rather large shells*
* *
* *
*(3B17) Yamaha EPH-20*
* *
**
Reviewed Jul 2010
* *
 Details: Diminutive earbud-style IEM from Yamaha’s new EPH line
 Current Price: *$19* from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _17 Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _20-21k Hz_ | Cable: 4_’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_
  
 Accessories *(1/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The housings are made completely out of plastic and, except for the nozzles, look like conventional earbuds. The rubberized cabling is fairly sturdy but prone to tangling. However, though the 3.5mm L-plug is downright excellent, a hard plastic stem takes the place of a proper strain relief on housing entry
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Like the higher-end EPH-50, the EPH-20 is a shallow-insertion earphone and is also vented. Isolation is rather average with the stock tips and a bit better with aftermarket biflanges
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Some cable noise is present and the EPH-20 cannot be worn over-the-ear, exacerbating the problem
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The strength of the EPH-20 is their absolutely tiny size – they are dwarfed by my stock Sansa earbuds and weigh absolutely nothing. The angled-nozzle design is ergonomically perfect and really puts the straight-nozzle Yuin OK1 to shame. The only issue with the EPH-20 is that the hard plastic stem of the earphones is square in cross section and has sharp corners, which means I cannot sleep on my side in these without serious discomfort
  
 Sound *(3.5/10)* – The sound of the EPH-20 is quite typical for a budget dynamic IEM. The earphone has a low-end bias, extending into the sub-30Hz regions of bass and sacrificing overall range at the top. The bass is full and warm, a bit muddy at times but overall rather pleasant. It intrudes a good amount on the lower midrange, making the IEMs sound rather warm and a bit veiled. The slightly recessed midrange doesn’t help and the earphones don’t have the clarity of the similarly-priced JVC HA-FX67. There is also a small amount of grain/scratchiness toward the upper mids, giving these a grungy texture. On the upside, unlike the JVCs, the Yamahas never sound harsh or sibilant while maintaining the same level of treble presence and detail. Despite the lack of brightness, the treble of the EPH-20 stands out over the midrange and isn’t drowned out by the bass. The soundstage is average in size but surprisingly airy. Separation and positioning could certainly be better but for $18 retail I didn’t expect much of either. The overall signature is smooth and a bit boomy, dark but not excessively so, and generally quite listenable.
  
 Value *(6/10)* – The Yamaha EPH-20 is another sub-$20 IEM that is quite passable in terms of sound, very easy to use, reasonably well-built, and extremely light and comfortable. No, these won’t displace the Soundmagic PL30s and Meelec M9s as my favorite sub-$20 earphones, but as a product that is readily available all over the web, comes in a variety of color options (I happen to think they look excellent in “red berry brown”), and produces a mainstream, bass-heavy sound without much sacrifice in other areas, the little Yamahas make a good introduction into the world of IEMs.
  
*Pros: Very lightweight and comfortable, user-friendly, inoffensive sound*
*Cons: Plasticky build*
  
  
*(3B18) Koss KE29*
  

Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Budget IEM from Koss notable for being covered under the manufacturer’s no-questions-asked lifetime warranty
 Current Price: *$19 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _15-20k Hz_ | Cable: 4_’ I-plug j-cord with volume control_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down *or over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(2/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(2/5)* – The housings are made completely out of plastic and visible molding imperfections abound. The short hard stems pose a danger to plastic cabling but the 3.5mm I-plug is well-relieved. A volume control is located about halfway down the j-cord and the low-quality potentiometer can result in channel imbalance at low volumes
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Despite being ported dynamic-driver IEMs, the KE29s isolate a surprising amount and can easily be used in loud environments
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low due to j-cord setup and plastic cabling
 Comfort *(3/5)* – Though the KE29s are very light, their nozzles are extremely short. To achieve a proper seal I therefore have to push the housings, including the fat driver bulge, deep into my ear, which becomes uncomfortable after some time. Some may find the j-cord bothersome as well
  
 Sound *(4.1/10)* – Like the similarly-priced Yamaha EPH-20, the KE29 is a mainstream earphone with a mainstream sound. Its signature is bass-centric, with low reach and a good amount of bloat, smooth midrange, and rolled-off treble. The bass itself is somewhat muddy and intrudes on the lower midrange, not unlike that of the Sennheiser CX300, but carries decent detail. Impact is not too sharp but quite powerful – not as tooth-rattling as that of the TDK EB900, but not too far off, either. The bass bloat results in a slightly veiled midrange. On bass-light tracks or with the low end dropped several dB on the equalizer, the midrange has nice clarity and transitions smoothly into the treble. The treble has some inoffensive unevenness and rolls off quite early – 14k is notably de-emphasized compared to the similarly-priced Soundmagic PL30. The soundstage is capable of surprising air but for the most part the KE29 keeps sonic cues closer to the center for a decidedly in-your-head feel.
  
 Value *(5/10)* – The KE29 is an inexpensive and readily available budget earphone that offers plenty of bass, a smooth and slightly veiled midrange, and laid-back treble. It competes well with mainstream budget earphones such as the Yamaha EPH-20 and JVC HA-FX34/FX67. Compared to head-fi favorites such as the Soundmagic PL21 and Meelec M9, however, the KE29 shows its age with unimpressive build quality and less-than-ideal ergonomics. On the upside, microphonics are notably low and the inline volume control and J-cord may actually make them appealing for active use. Those with the luxury of ordering online can easily do better for the $20 asking price. Those who just need to grab something off the shelf at Radioshack can do much, much worse than the KE29.
  
*Pros: Bass-heavy but unfatiguing sound, low microphonics, decent isolation*
*Cons: Plasticky build, J-corded, integrated volume control may cause channel imbalance at low volumes*
  
  
*(3B19) Earjax Tonic*
  

Reviewed Nov 2010
  
 Details: Entry-level dynamic-driver earphone from Earjax
 Current Price: *$27* from earshack.com (MSRP: $37.50)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
  
 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (6 sets in 3 sizes), triple-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and metal capsule carrying case with detachable lanyard
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The shells are made entirely of metal and feel solid. The cable is slightly rubbery and strain relief is sufficient all-around. Interestingly, the Tonic is missing conventional Left/Right markers - different-color nozzle filters are used instead (red for right, black for left). A bit of driver flex can be coerced from the earphones but not so much that it can be bothersome
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Rear vent results in fairly average isolation
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – The rubber cords bounce around a bit when the included shirt clip is not used but wearing the earphones over-the-ear solves the problem
 Comfort *(3.5/5*) – The fit is pretty conventional for a straight-barrel in-ear. The nozzles are fairly long and the shells are rounded at the front so fairly deep insertion is possible. The strain reliefs are short enough that the earphones can be worn over-the-ear comfortably and the shells aren’t too heavy despite being metal
  
 Sound *(5.1/10)* – The Tonic is a mid-range earphone with a popular, fun sound signature. Its bass is deep and thumping, with decent extension and a fair amount of mid-bass emphasis. At the very bottom the bass stays strong up to around 45Hz and is still audible at 30. Impact is generally hard and heavy. The Tonic is not the most controlled earphone and the bass can definitely step out of line but the aggressive low end works well for a lot of modern music. The earphones also exhibit slightly forward mids, which keeps vocals, guitars, and other instruments relatively free of bass bleed. Midrange clarity is quite impressive, especially at lower volumes, and with the bass equalized down can match that of the Meelec M9 and Hippo Boom. The midrange is warm, full, and very easy to listen to. The Tonic stays smooth into the upper midrange and lower treble, introducing no harshness or sibilance and even masking some that may be present on the track. Indeed, the Tonic lacks just enough resolution to make my 192kbps mp3s sound good.
  
 The treble is a recessed slightly in comparison to the bass and mids, making the Tonic a dark-sounding earphone. It can be a bit grainy and rolls off a slightly earlier than with the M9. There really isn’t much sparkle but at the very least the treble is inoffensive and portrays what’s on the track. The vented earphones possess a decent soundstage, too, both in width and depth, but the aggressive presentation tends to center things rather than spread them out in the sonic space. On busy tracks the bass-heavy nature of the earphones can act as a detriment to separation and positioning but for an entry-level set the Tonic performs well enough on both counts. Listening to the Tonic I can’t help but be reminded of the Sennheiser CX300 – it really has a similar overall sound signature, albeit with less mud at the bottom end, more prominent mids, and a slightly airier presentation.
  
 Value *(8/10)* – Though the Earjax Tonic is fairly typical of a budget earphone when it comes to sound quality, it is a solid all-around performer and will appeal to those who like deep, thumping bass. The slightly dark tonality and treble that’s mostly smooth but still carries a bit of grain and texture gives the earphones some character compared to the similar-sounding Senn CX300. The build quality and accessory pack are both quite good for the price as well. Those in the market for a budget earphone and worried that the Meelectronics M9 may be too harsh in the treble or too recessed in the midrange would do well to check out the Tonic.
  
*Pros: Well-built; plenty of tips included; fun sound signature*
*Cons: Mild driver flex; bass can be overpowering at times; slightly dark*
  
 Full review can be found here
  
  
*(3B20) Sony MDR-EX082 / MDR-EX85*
  

Reviewed Dec 2010
  
 Details: Aging ergonomic canalphone bundled with a few of Sony’s portable players and reportedly identical to the EX85
 Current Price: *$16* from accessoryseek.com (MSRP: $69.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _5-24k Hz_ | Cable: _3.6’ I-plug J-cord_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(2/5) *– Single-flange (3 sizes) silicone tips and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The MDR-EX082 is almost completely plastic and doesn’t feel all that solid. The cable is thin and very prone to tangling, which is made worse by the asymmetric cord lengths
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Low due to shallow-insertion design and front-facing vents
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low due to j-cord and shallow ear coupling
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The MDR-EX082 is a half in-ear canalphone similar in design to the Phiaton PS210 and Yamaha EPH20/50. Featuring 13.5mm driver units, the Sony earphones are quite a bit larger than the Yamahas and have more steeply raked nozzles, resulting in a drop in comfort. Longer tips are recommended for a more secure fit – generic bi-flanges work well for me

 Sound *(4.7/10)* – Unlike the Sony XB40EX, the older and cheaper EX082 is a reasonably balanced and generally very enjoyable earphone. In stark contrast to the XB40, the bass of the EX082 does not dominate the rest of the frequency range. The low end lacks extension but is generally more controlled and textured that of the XB40. Impact, depth, and fullness trail the Meelec M9 as well but the EX082 sounds cleaner as a result - the Meelecs are definitely capable of pumping out more low-end detail but the sheer quantity of their bass can sometimes hinder the detail level.

 The midrange of the EX082 is warm and slightly recessed but generally competent in comparison to most of the similarly-priced sets. Compared to the Meelec M9 the Sonys are actually less recessed in the midrange, though they also lag behind in detail level and clarity. Compared to the XB40EX, the EX082 sounds dry and grainy but doesn’t gloss over detail or get overwhelmed by the bass. The treble of the EX082 is not particularly noteworthy, appearing smooth and well-defined but ultimately a bit rolled-off and lacking sparkle. For an entry-level earphone it’s not very flawed and generally pretty competent but really nothing to brag about in the grand scheme of things. On the whole, the sound signature of the EX082 lacks a bit of refinement but I still like it better than the XB40EX by a fair margin. The presentation, too, is quite enjoyable for a budget set. The slightly warm EX082 is fairly spacious and has decent air, resulting in a pleasant overall feel. It lacks the air of the Meelec M9 and positioning is not very precise but taken as a whole it’s surprisingly convincing and about as competent as anything I’ve heard in the price range.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The MDR-EX082 is an old design and as such it is extremely overpriced in its retail incarnation (the MDR-EX85). The bundled version, however, can be purchased for much less and even comes as a stock earphone with several Sony mp3 players. For a stock earphone, the EX082 is unreasonably good. Impressive comfort and low microphonics make up for the low isolation and mediocre build quality and the sound, while not great from a technical standpoint, is generally very enjoyable. In that respect, the EX082 is the complete opposite of something like the Meelec M9, which is a technically proficient but very polarizing earphone. One potential issue for Sony users is that a true upgrade to the EX082 may be difficult to find among budget earphones but I doubt anyone will be serious in complaining about that.

*Pros: Good air and sense of space, quite controlled and pleasant overall
 Cons: Low isolation, plasticky build, may be uncomfortable for some*
  
  
*(3B21) dB Logic EP-100*


Reviewed Dec 2010
  
 Details: Tiny dynamic-driver IEM with an integrated volume limiter
 Current Price: *$30* from dblogic.com (MSRP: $34.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _19Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Bi-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and UE-style hard plastic carrying case
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The positively tiny EP-100 is made entirely out of plastic and resembles the Soundmagic PL50 in size and construction. Unfortunately the plasticky cable is thin and stringy, though the 3.5mm I-plug is well-relieved. The bulbous y-split houses the volume limiting circuitry and can sometimes be slightly unwieldy
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – With the stock bi-flange tips or Shure Olives the isolation is excellent – the tiny EP-100 can be inserted very deeply and blocks out a lot of noise
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Fairly annoying when worn cable-down and still slightly noticeable with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(5/5)* – It is very difficult to convey just how small the EP-100 really is – it is by far the tiniest dynamic-driver earphone I’ve ever encountered. The 9mm dynamic driver is mounted vertically and the chamber is much smaller than that of my ATH-CK10. It is very difficult to imagine an ear for which the EP-100 itself won’t be a good fit, though the deep-sealing bi-flange tips may take some getting used to for those accustomed to conventional canalphones. Shure Olives are a perfect fit, however, and make for one of the most comfortable listening experiences among all IEMs

 Sound *(5/10)* –The main selling point of dB Logic’s headphones and earphones is the proprietary volume-limiting circuitry (dubbed Sound Pressure Level Limiting, or SPL2), which is intended to maintain safe volume levels at all times. Though the company won’t reveal the underpinning principle of the technology, the intended result is clear – distortion-free damping of the output when the input power becomes high enough to produce sound pressure levels considered dangerous for the human ear. To test this claim I matched the low-volume sensitivity of the earphones to a variable-impedance set – a Sennheiser CX281. At a relative volume of 10 on my Fiio E7, I matched the output of the EP-100 and CX281 by ear and verified it using an SPL meter. From there I donned the CX281 and increased the volume until my ears started bleeding (so to speak). At a relative volume of 30 I had to stop. The dB Logic set increased in output volume much more slowly than the CX281 even with a matching starting point and actually hit a full-stop limiter at 40. Turning the E7 up between 40 and 60 volume units had no effect on the output of the EP-100 and - far as I can tell - maxing out the SPL limiter introduced no clipping or distortion to the signal. Impressive, but what about the quality of the sound itself?

 The dB Logic EP-100 is quite clearly a consumer-class pair of earphones. There is a slight bit of added kick to the bass and an overall smoothness and warmth typical of mid-range consumer-class earphones. The signature of the EP-100 fits right in with sets like the Sennheiser CX281 and JVC HA-FX67. The bass is smooth and powerful. With sufficiently deep insertion there is surprising depth and rumble to be found at the low end. The bass leans slightly towards the softer and fuller side of the spectrum (as opposed to crisp/tight) but remains perfectly enjoyable at all times. Bass quantity is very close to the CX281 – the EP-100 has slightly slower attack, resulting in a sound with less ‘punch’, but slightly better sub-bass presence.

 The midrange is slightly warm but not overshadowed by the low end in the least. Clarity and detail are decent – a hair below the Meelec M9 but not as poor as with the Skullcandy FMJ or Sony XB40EX. The tradeoff is note thickness – the SPL2 fleshes midrange notes out a bit better than the M9 and doesn’t sound nearly as dry. The midrange isn’t particularly forward but then the SPL2 doesn’t have the monstrous low end of aggressive treble of the M9, either, so the overall balance is quite good. In fact, it seems that dB Logic went to great lengths to make the SPL2 as inoffensive as possible – there is nearly no unevenness in the upper mids and treble, resulting in a smooth sound that is low on both sparkle and harshness. Treble extension is solid for a set of budget-class in-ears and the response remains crisp and clear, albeit not particularly authoritative or energetic.

 The presentation is competent but not quite outstanding. Airiness, which is derived in part from treble emphasis, is lacking compared to the Meelec M9 and the soundstage, though 3-dimensional, is fairly confined. It extends far enough outward for a $30 earphone but doesn’t portray intimacy very well. Imaging and positioning are a little vague but the earphones are convincing enough on the whole. Tonally the EP-100 is hardly neutral but the coloration is pleasant and works well for modern music. In fact, I would venture to say that the EP-100 was tuned for the type of Top 40 music popular among those most likely to be in danger of self-induced hearing loss. Most of my heavy metal, however, still sounds better with the MEE M9s.

 Value *(8/10)* – For some reason I expected that I’d be able to hear the SPL-limiting circuitry at work in the dB Logic EP-100 but they sound like ‘normal’, albeit not very sensitive, entry-level earphones – and that’s a good thing. There is no distortion or clipping at the volume limits and clarity is about where I’d expect it to be for the price. The sound is well-rounded and goes well with pop- and soft rock-type music. Add in the variety of color options, high isolation, and impossibly tiny form factor and the EP-100 comes out looking like a winner for the price. Those interested in risking early-onset hearing loss may want to give these a pass but for everyone else the EP-100 is a solid option for the money.

*Pros: Excellent noise isolation; impossibly tiny design; volume-limiting; easy-going sound signature
 Cons: Cable could be better; chunky y-split; deep-insertion tips will take some getting used to*
  
* *
  
*(3B22) Xears Bullet XB120PRO *
  
  

Reviewed Jan 2011
  
 Details: Bullet-shaped budget earphone from Xears/Playaz
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: 24.95€)
 Specs: Driver: Dynamic | Imp: N/A | Sens: _125 dB_ | Freq: _6-28k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug j-cord_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple-flanges, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and padded soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The metal shells are similar in appearance to those of the Fischer Audio Silver Bullets but feel lighter and a bit less solid. The j-cord is thick and soft – identical to that found on the TD100 – but lacks articulated strain reliefs on housing entry just like the Silver Bullet. Some driver flex is present but the XB120 seems to be less offensive in that regard than the TD100
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Limited by short nozzles and wide housings but still decent
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Fairly low but the j-cord is a two-edged sword – it reduces cable travel and therefore microphonics but at the same time makes the earphones more difficult to wear over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The housings of the XB120 are not tapered at the front like those of the Fischer Silver Bullets and the sharp edges prevent deep insertion but comfort is fine with shallow insertion. The light weight of the earphones means that the long shells don’t torque the tips loose, even while walking

 Sound *(6.3/10)* – The sound of the XB120PRO is both quite impressive from a technical standpoint and easily likeable, especially with the price factored in. The bass has good depth and impact. Extension is solid and the mid-bass hump is quite shallow. The Bullets definitely aren’t bass monsters – even the Brainwavz M2 is a bit more impactful - but they aren’t lacking, either. However, the bass is a bit soft of note and can sound a little hazy and slow at times. It’s not muddy but the Brainwavz M2 that I used as a benchmark sounds noticeably tighter. On the whole the bass reminds me of the Thinksound TS02 but with slightly rounder notes.

 The midrange is smooth, clean, and clear. Clarity is on-par with the better $60 sets and detail isn’t far behind, either – very impressive for an earphone costing less than lunch for two. The soft and voluminous bass leaves the midrange slightly warm and the roundness of note carries over to vocals and guitars. Compared to the similarly-priced Meelec M6, the XB120Pro lacks crispness and a bit of bite but sounds smoother, more forward, and more cohesive on the whole. Timbre is quite natural as well and the open presentation helps make up for the lack of crispness. So far, then, my experience with bullet-shaped earphones has been two for two in terms of genuinely excellent midranges.

 The treble is similar to the midrange in smoothness and clarity but emphasized a bit less on the whole. Still, it is neither forward nor recessed and has decent detail. There is minimal sparkle and extension is not quite up there with many pricier sets but again the XB120PRO is extremely impressive for the asking price. The overall balance is actually quite good, with a slight bass dominance counterbalanced in part by impressive midrange and treble clarity. The presentation, too, is impressive – the XB120 generally sounds big and spacious. The soundstage doesn’t have the greatest depth but sounds quite open. Separation is decent but positioning and imaging are somewhat vague – partly due to the softness of the sound the XB120 can sound a bit ‘smeared’, especially with fast and busy tracks. Still, for the money, the XB120 is incredibly adept at making the competition sound tinny and ‘in-the-head’ in comparison.

 Value *(9/10)* – The Xears Bullet XB120PRO is yet another high bang/back contender from Xears that sacrifices a bit of build quality and isolation to offer more sonic performance per dollar. In some ways the XB120 is an improvement over the older (and pricier) TD100 – the included tips are better, the carrying case has been improved, and driver flex is inoffensive most of the time. It still carries the j-cord of the TD100 and lacks real strain relief on housing entry but for sound this good at the price point. I’m willing to overlook that. Those looking for a sturdy <$30 earphone to abuse be better off with something like the Earjax Tonic. Looking purely at audio performance, however, the XB120 is clearly a top contender in its price bracket.

*Pros: Class-leading performance, lightweight housings*
*Cons: J-corded, tubular shells may be a bit too large for those with smaller ears*
  
  

*(3B23) MEElectronics M16 / M16P*
  

Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: Slim-shelled budget-oriented earphone from Meelec
 Current Price: *$25* from meelec.com (MSRP: $24.99); $30 for M16P with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _92 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Like the pricier M21/M31 models, the M16 is mostly metal but the strain relief isn’t as convincing and the stubby nozzles lack filters. The build quality is still very good for the price but it won’t be putting Meelec’s older M9 to shame
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good but limited by the earphones’ rear vent
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Reasonably low when worn cable-down, nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings of the M16 are similar in size to the M21 model but the nozzles are shorter and the strain reliefs are oddly angled. They can still be worn over-the-ear but the M11 housings are just a bit more convenient

 Sound *(5/10)* – Competing directly with Meelec’s legendary M9 model as well as the RX11 from the new ‘Rhythm’ series, the M16 is an interesting earphone with a somewhat uncharacteristic sound signature. The bass is tight but impactful. Extension is average and so is detail. In general, the bottom end of the M16 borrows heavily from the pricier M21, with similar mid-bass emphasis and a touch of softness. However, the mids of the M16 are slightly recessed compared to those of the M21, making the bass appear more prominent. As with the M21, bass bleed really isn’t an issue.

 The midrange recession of the M16 bears a similarity to the aging M9 but is less striking due to the more intimate presentation of the former. The mids are slightly veiled but not offensive on the whole. There is some unevenness towards the top of the midrange and the M16 boasts the most prominent treble of the recent M-series additions (the others being the M21 and M31). As a result, there is a bit of sibilance and harshness on some tracks. Treble roll-off is somewhat more noticeable than with the M9 but there is a good bit of treble sparkle and the high end doesn’t seem lacking. In terms of presentation, too, the M16 doesn’t quite sound as spacious or airy as the M9 but it is more precise in terms of positioning. The soundstage has good width but generally sounds a bit tubular next to the more spherical stages of the M9 and RX11. Next to the pricier M21, the M16 has slightly poorer separation and the timbre is less natural to my ears. The M16 is also a bit more fatiguing as a result of the greater treble emphasis. When all is said and done, however, its sound is still quite impressive for an entry-level earphone and makes for an interesting alternative to the more v-shaped M9 and the more bottom-heavy RX11.

 Value *(8/10)* – Rounding off the latest batch of additions to Meelec’s M-line, the M16 is a slightly v-shaped contrast to the more balanced (and pricier) M21. With a slight emphasis on bass and a more significant one on the lower treble, the M16 can alternate between sounding well-rounded and tiring, depending on the track. As usual, the build quality, fit, and day-to-day usability of the M16, while not as exemplary as those of the M11+, are more than adequate for the asking price so what it comes down to is the sound. For those worried about the heavy bass or recessed midrange of the M9, the M16 is a safer option. However, despite its flaws, I still find the M9 a bit more agreeable on average.

*Pros: Good build quality and fit; decent isolation
 Cons: Treble can be a bit too prominent*


*(3B24) MEElectronics RX11*
  

Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: First model in Meelec’s Rhythm series
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $24.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _99 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The housings are made entirely of plastic and the short nozzles are protected by metal mesh filters. Sadly, the hard plastic stems of the earphones lack proper strain relief and the cable cinch is a bit too loose on the smooth, plastic-sheathed cord
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The fat housings and wide nozzles limit the insertion depth of the RX11 and the rear vents keep the isolation average
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low when worn cable-down, nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are small and light and the nozzles are angled for increased comfort (though not nearly steeply enough to be called ‘ergonomic’)

 Sound* (4.7/10) *– As the ‘Rhythm series’ moniker implies, the RX11 is a bass-heavy earphone but the nature of its bass is different from that of the classic M9 model. Whereas the bass of the M9 is deep and hard-hitting, the RX11 is conventionally bassy, with gobs of mid-bass and moderate bottom end extension. It is competition for the likes of the Sennheiser CX300 and JVC Marshmallows – mainstream earphones with decent presence across the range and boosted bass.

 The mids of the RX11 are slightly laid-back next to the aggressive mid-bass but the overall balance isn’t bad for a budget product. The budget nature of the drivers does show in the more minute aspects of the sound, such as with clarity and detail that don’t quite keep up the aging Meelec M9. There is also some unevenness in the lower treble response, most likely added to balance out with the bass of the earphones. The treble of the earphones is not offensive but it does make them sound a bit sharp on some notes. Truth is, the RX11 is less shrill than the M16, less of the time but still has moments of slight treble sharpness on occasion. Top-end extension is moderate, as it is with the older M9 and M2 models.

 The budget nature of the earphones shows through again in the presentation, which is quite intimate next to the M9, M16, and M21. Indeed, the RX11 is not only more forward-sounding than the other earphones but also tends to cluster instruments together for a somewhat less layered presentation. On the upside, this makes the soundstage of the RX11 seem less tubular and more spherical compared to that of the M16 and the bassy signature works reasonably well with this sort of presentation. On the whole, it is pretty clear that the RX11 targets the mainstream consumer and not the audiophile, which makes me all the more glad that the M9 was kept in the lineup.

 Value *(7/10) *– As part of Meelec’s new Rhythm series, the RX11 was designed to focus in equal measure on sound and style – and to an extent it is successful. However, while the smooth red cable is indeed quite pleasant in everyday use, the overall build quality of the earphones lags behind Meelec’s M-series models. The sound, too, is more in line with budget-level mainstream offerings from brands such as JVC and Sony than the technically impressive, though not always likeable, performance of Meelec’s M-series models. Still, for those in search of something aesthetically ‘different’, the RX11 is still at least as good as most <$30 earphones. It just isn’t as clear-cut an alternative to the M9 as I was hoping for.

*Pros: Lightweight & comfortable; low microphonics
 Cons: Not as well-built or well-accessorized as most of Meelec’s other models*
  
  
*(3B25) H2O Audio Flex*
  

Reviewed Jan 2011
  
 Details: Entry-level waterproof earphones from H2O Audio
 Current Price: *$19* from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) & H2O SealTight adapter (for use with H2O Audio waterproof mp3 player cases)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The colorful shells of the Flex are made entirely out of plastic but feel quite solid overall. The cable entry point is protected by a flexible rubber sleeve and the strain relief on the angled 3.5mm stereo plug is one of the most impressive I’ve seen on an entry-level earphone. The cable itself, however, is a real letdown – far too thin for my liking and very rubbery compared to that of the higher-end Surge. On the upside, the Flex is waterproof. I can’t say how long the earphones will last with constant underwater use but for the occasional sweaty workout they should work just fine
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Quite decent due to small housings and thicker silicone tips
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Bothersome with cable-down wear but easily tolerable when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The plastic shells of the Flex are small and exceptionally light. The spherical shape allows for very comfortable fitment with the right tips and I’ve even managed to sleep in them with no discomfort whatsoever

 Sound *(5.9/10)* – H2O Audio’s original waterproof IEM, the Surge, surprised me last year with the likeable and reasonably refined sound produced by its waterproof transducers. The new Flex is just as impressive, pursuing a sound signature rarely found among budget-level earphones – one that is balanced and spacious rather than intimate and bass-heavy. The bass of the Flex is easily the most mundane aspect of its sound signature – controlled and fairly accurate but lacking in depth and impact. The Flex, with its slight mid-bass boost and fair amount of roll-off, is definitely not one for the basshead but for those who prefer a more balanced sound the low-end response should be adequate.

 The midrange of the earphone is more impressive – free of bass bleed and surprisingly clear. As with the Surge, the transducers of the Flex aren’t the quickest in existence and as a result detail and texture lag slightly behind most mid-range earphones but the impressive clarity makes up for it. Compared to the de-emphasized bass and treble of the Flex, the midrange is slightly forward though it can seem distant when compared to the more intimate-sounding earphones usually found in the entry-level price bracket. The smoothness and laid-back presentation make the sound of the Flex quite likable and easy-going - good traits for an exercise earphone to have. Sibilance and harshness are absent from the lower treble response but a bit of treble sparkle is present nonetheless. Treble clarity and detail are both reasonably good in the context of the smooth sound signature and extension is decent as well.

 It is the sonic presentation of the Flex, however, that is most interesting – the soundstage is wide and extends farther in every direction than with most other entry-level earphones. The space is relatively spherical in nature and positioning is quite convincing on the whole. Layering and separation are lacking slightly and the Flex isn’t as adept at separating a track’s background and foreground as most higher-end sets but for a $30 earphone the presentation is very impressive nonetheless. Aside from the aging Soundmagic PL30, really aren’t any entry-level earphones out there with the spaciousness and airiness of the Flex – and that alone makes it worth the asking price.

 Value *(8/10)* – The Flex may not be particularly pretty or as well-built or well-accessorized as the Meelectronics M9, but it does several things very well – it is extremely comfortable, sounds surprisingly good, and shrugs off water and sweat. While those in search of deep, thumping bass will be unimpressed, the Flex can match far pricier models when it comes to clarity and space. Will it survive daily underwater use as advertised? I really don’t know, but there are (pricier) waterproof sets that are likely better-suited for the purpose. However, as a reasonably-priced everyday earphone for music and movies that can also survive a sweaty workout, the Flex very difficult to beat.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable; Water- and sweat-proof; Balanced, spacious, and surprisingly refined sound
 Cons: Not much in the way of pack-ins; Rubbery cable can be noisy; Bass lacks depth and rumble*
  
  

*(3B26) Kozee E100*
  

Reviewed June 2011

 Details: Sole universal IEM from Kozee Sound Solutions
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $24.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _N/A_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(1.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips and microfiber carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(2/5) *- The housings of the E100 are made completely out of plastic with a metal mesh filter used in the nozzle and a metal grille at the front of the earphones. The cable is a fairly generic plastic-sheathed affair. It has no memory and is quite easy to live with. Strain relief is fine at the earphone end but far too stiff at the plug end
 Isolation *(1/5)* - The E100 is incapable of sealing due to the front-facing earbud-style grille. Isolation is very low as a result
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *- The cable is relatively quiet and the consistent lack of a good acoustic seal with the E100 means that bone conduction is reasonably low. However, the earphones are difficult to wear cord-up and lack a cable cinch
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* - The E100 uses a half in-ear design with a form factor very similar in size and shape to the Hippo 10. However, it only comes with one size of eartips which will pose a problem for some users

 Sound *(0.5/10)* - The horror! I am not usually swayed by emotion when it comes to reviewing earphones but remaining positive while using the E100 is has proven difficult. Most of the problems stem from a fundamental flaw in the design of the earphone; namely - the fact that the front of the IEM has fully functional earbud-like grilles. Functionally, the E100 is just an earbud with a nozzle but, unlike proper half in-ear designs, the housing is not sealed at the front. The result is tragic - the E100 is guaranteed never to achieve an acoustic seal with the listener's ear.

 With a design oversight of this magnitude, the Kozee E100 probably was not a stellar-sounding earphone to start with. However, the fact that it never seals means that all of the issues that normally stem from poor fit hold true for the E100 all of the time. Its sound is tinny, harsh, and rolled off on both ends. It sounds worse than most stock earbuds. I could probably declare this review finished at this point but the E100 is a truly fascinating insight into the importance of an acoustic seal. There is no deep bass and what little mid- and upper bass there is sounds hollow and lacks body and weight – basically, the same as with any other IEM used without a seal. Cranking up the volume does bring up the bass but listening fatigue settles in very quickly as the mids and highs are brought up as well.

 The midrange is relatively clear and crisp but tends to be grainy and unrefined. The treble is harsh and rolled off at the top. Worse still, the lack of a seal affects the presentation of the earphones negatively or, in this particular case, mortally. Because of its design, the E100 lacks the ability to image. There is no single, cohesive soundstage. Those who are unfamiliar with higher-end earphones may consider this sort of presentation normal but the H2O Audio Flex, which is pretty much the cheapest earphone I own, shows that some modicum of a cohesive, three-dimensional presentation can be delivered at almost any price point. Really, the sound of the E100 is difficult to justify on any level.

 Value *(1/10)* – In stark contrast to the Infinity X1 customs, the E100 is a definite miss for Kozee. I almost feel that with its sizable design flaw, the E100 shouldn't be rated alongside proper in-ears. Though the pricier E300 earbud shows that Kozee can make a decent universal earphone, the only positive thing I can say about the E100 is that Kozee has obviously been paying far, far more attention to the sound of their customs.

*Pros: Comfortable half in-ear form factor; fairly low cable noise
 Cons: Flawed design results in poor sound quality*
  
  
*(3B27) Fischer Audio Daleth*


Reviewed Jun 2011

 Details: Entry level wooden earphone from Fischer Audio
 Current Price: *$27* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $29)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _26-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Like the wooden earphones from Woodees and Thinksound, the shell of the Daleth is split into two parts – the driver chamber, finished in reddish-looking wood, and a metal front bit with a slim, filterless nozzle. The rubbery cable is thin and has a bit of memory character. Though the strain relief on the L-plug is quite beefy, the other strain reliefs are made of hard plastics. A sliding cable cinch is nowhere to be found and mild driver flex is present on insertion
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The slim nozzles contribute to fairly decent isolation but the stock tips are too flimsy to seal well
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Very noticeable when worn cable-down; fine otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The slim housings and long nozzles of the Daleth allow for comfortable insertion but the stock tips could be better

 Sound *(5/10)* – The sound signature of the Fischer Audio Daleth is, if nothing else, unique and ambient. The bass is nothing special – less extended and a bit less controlled than that of the pricier wooden earphones from Thinksound and Woodees but not offensive in any major way. Most of the impact comes from the slight mid-bass lift but the Daleth is nowhere near as muddy as the bassier Skullcandy Holua. There is less bleed and less warmth than with the Holua and the mids are less veiled. However, the Daleth has a strange way of presenting music – though the vocals are clear and nicely-centered, there seems to be no point source in the soundstage from which they originate. The resulting sound is enveloping and yet strangely lacking in focus – veiled, but without a drop in clarity. The best I can do to describe it is say that it lacks crispness and sounds a tiny bit ‘smeared’ and too soft of note.

 There is a bit of emphasis on the upper mids and lower treble – not so much as to limit the smoothness of the earphones but enough to balance out the tone – the Daleth is only slightly warmer than neutral and noticeably cooler than most of my other wooden earphones. For the most part the treble is not lacking in clarity or detail but, like the midrange, could stand to be crisper. On the upside, the Daleth does have a fairly ‘large’ sound, which is made extremely obvious via juxtaposition with the intimate-sounding Holua. Despite the above-average soundstage size, the Daleth tends to cluster elements closer to the center. There’s no doubt that it can portray distance well, but much of the time it refuses to. The layering and positioning of the Daleth really don’t compete well with higher-end models either. All in all, “big but vague” describes the presentation of the Daleth quite well – for the money it is a fairly impressive performer and, potentially, a good match for vocal-centric music. However, its unique voicing will make the signature hit-or-miss with listeners.

 Value *(6.5/10)* – The Fischer Audio Daleth is a decent entry-level earphone with a number of caveats. Its sound, slightly mid-centric and lacking crispness, won’t please everyone but offers up a good enough performance for the asking price. The accessory pack, build quality, and microphonics all leave a bit to be desired as well. All in all, the Daleth is hardly hi-fi but there are far poorer ways to spend $30, especially if the cosmetics of the earphone are to one’s liking. Those looking for solid build quality and an easier-to-digest sound signature may want to check out the Fischer Audio TS-9002 instead of the Daleth.

*Pros: Comfortable; well-balanced for a wooden earphone
 Cons: Mild driver flex, thin and tangle-prone cabling*

 A longer review with comparisons against the Skullcandy Holua, Thinksound TS02, Woodees Blues, and Xears TD-III can be found here
  
  
*(3B28) ECCI PG100*
  

Reviewed June 2011
  
 Details: angled-nozzle earphone designed to replace the PR100 as ECCI's entry-level model
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $27)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: 104 dB | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _N/A (oval) _| Preferred tips:_ Stock single-flanges, generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories* (3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and oversize hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The housings are plastic though the molding quality is quite nice. The cable is plasticky and average in thickness. Unfortunately, there is no strain relief on the plastic stems and no sliding cable cinch on the cord
 Isolation* (2.5/5)* – The PG100 is a vented, shallow-insertion earphone. Isolation is rather average with the stock tips and a bit better with aftermarket biflanges
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down and the earphones are difficult to wear over-the-ear, exacerbating the problem
 Comfort* (4.5/5)* – The PG100 is very small and weighs next to nothing. The housing are meant to be worn like conventional earbuds with the oval nozzles angled for comfortable insertion into the ear canal. The stems are rounded and angled away from the ear – ECCI has clearly done more homework than Yamaha did with their similarly-tiny EPH-20
  
 Sound *(5.2/10) *– ECCI’s previous entry-level model, the PR100, was a balanced and neutral affair, performing similarly to the pricier PR200 on the whole. The new PG100 is a bit of a departure from the higher-end ECCI earphones, offering a slightly darker and more bass-heavy sound. The bass of the PG100 beats the Soundmagic PL30 and H2O Audio Flex easily in quantity but stops short of the power and depth offered by the bass-monster MEElec M9. The low end is punchy and a touch boomy. There is slight bottom-end roll-off but it’s quite inoffensive. Bass bleed is minimal although the midrange does lack some clarity next to the H2O Flex, sounding veiled and a bit muffled. The overall balance is good – the midrange is not nearly as recessed as with the MEElec M9 but not as forward as with the PL30 or H2O Flex.
  
 A bit of grain is present in the midrange and treble but the PG100 is still smoother than the sparklier, peakier MEElec M9. Indeed, the sound of the M9 is a good bit more v-shaped on the whole so those looking for flat-and-level will be better off with the ECCIs. Top-end extension is moderate – similar to the M9 and many other budget sets. The presentation of the PG100 is average in size, leaning towards the intimate side of things. The Soundmagic PL30 sounds far more open and spacious. The M9, too, has more air to its sound, as well as a bit more width. The slightly veiled midrange of the PG100 doesn’t do its presentation any favors but the earphone still presents a coherent sonic image. The overall tone is slightly dark.
  
 Value* (8/10)* – Unlike the PR100 model it replaces, the ECCI PG100 sets itself apart from the higher-end PR200 and PR300 models by offering a slightly more consumer-friendly sound in a very different form factor. The compact half in-ear design is lightweight and comfortable and the sound is well-balanced with a slight bias towards the low end. It’s not going to embarrass the other solid entry-level sets on the market but it does provide a very viable alternative.
  
*Pros: Small, lightweight, and comfortable; sounds good for the money*
*Cons: Mildly microphonic, not as well-built as previous PR100 model*
  
  
*(3B29) Fischer Audio FA-788*


Reviewed Sep 2011
  
 Details: Entry-level half-in-ear earphone from Fischer Audio
 Current Price: N/A (est. $23)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k H_z | Cable: _4.1’ -plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges;* generic bi-flanges*_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The housings are a combination of metal, rubber, and plastic. None of the bits are glued together particularly well but for the price the construction is reasonably good. Metal bits are used at the I-plug and y-split as well but the strain reliefs are too hard and the cable itself is a bit thin
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Not bad for a half in-ear earphone but nothing to brag about
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – the FA-788 can only be worn cable-down and the cable noise can be bothersome
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The half in-ear housings of the FA-788 are lightweight and sit well in the ear. The long stems provide something to grip while inserting or removing the earphones but I wouldn’t use them in that capacity too often for durability reasons

 Sound *(6/10) *– The FA-788 is one of Fischer’s numerous entry-level models but that’s not what makes it special; what sets this one apart from most other sets I’ve heard in the sub-$25 bracket is the analytical nature of its sound. The bass is not very rumbly but it is punchy and extremely well-controlled. Extension is good and the note thickness being slightly on the lean side helps keep the low end quick and resolving. Clarity is excellent across the range, accentuated by the bright top end but still very impressive without the treble emphasis.

 The midrange is free of bass bleed and tends to err on the cool side tonally. It lacks the fullness and warmth of sets such as the Klipsch S3 and UE350 but isn’t recessed next to the bass. The FA-788 makes the similarly-priced H2O Audio Flex sound a bit muddy but lacks the more realistic note thickness of the H2O. The sound of the Fischers is very clean – almost clinical – and runs into some of the problems common to analytical entry-level earphones. The treble is slightly emphasized over the midrange and not entirely smooth. It is well-extended but sounds a touch sharp and edgy on some tracks. Harshness is not left completely out of the equation either and as a result the FA-788 works best at lower volumes. Plenty is sacrificed for class-leading clarity so those looking for a smooth, forgiving in-ear for relaxed listening won’t find it here. That said, the closest sets to these in sound signature would probably be JVC’a FXC-series microdriver monitors, which I quite like as well.

 When it comes to presentation, the FA-788 is a bit of a mixed bag. On the one hand it sounds airy and spacious, with good soundstage width and impressive instrument separation. On the other hand the stage lacks a bit of depth, the layering isn’t class-leading, and the sound isn’t really fleshed out enough to fill the sonic space. The earphones end up sounding a bit cavernous and – oddly – seem to place the sonic image a bit higher up than I’m accustomed to, as if the listener is underneath the stage. The similarly-priced H2O Audio Flex has a larger headstage and gives a better sense of 3-D space, though its sound is not as clean and accurate as that of the FA-788. Ditto on the pricier Soundmagic E10. On the whole, the presentation of the FA-788 is for those who want the coherence of an in-ear earphone with the lateral width and air of a conventional earbud.

 Value *(8/10)* – The Fischer Audio FA-788 is an entry-level earphone that offers the comfort of a shallow-insertion IEM along with surprisingly crisp and accurate sound. Good end-to-end extension and a very clean note presentation complete the picture and make the FA-788 worth recommending on sound quality alone. It may not be particularly well-built and there are certainly sets with less cable noise and better isolation but it sounds as good as anything else I’ve heard in the price range.

*Pros: comfortable half-in-ear form factor; clean, spacious, and controlled sound
 Cons: mediocre build quality, isolation, and microphonics*
  
  
  
*(3B30) Brainwavz Beta*


Reviewed Nov 2011

 Details: half in-ear earphone with a good price/performance ratio
 Current Price: *$29* from amazon.com (MSRP: $28.50)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock Comply foams, generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(1.5/5) *– Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and comply foam tips
 Build Quality *(2.5/5) *– The construction of the Beta is similar to Sony IEMs of yesteryear, with plastic housings and long strain reliefs. The cable is thin and somewhat tangle-prone, similar to what is found on Fischer’s FA-788
 Isolation *(2.5/5) *– Decent for a shallow-insertion design, especially with the included Comply eartips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Surprisingly mild despite the earphones having to be worn cable-down
 Comfort* (4/5)* – The half in-ear housings of the Beta are lightweight and sit well in the ear. The design mandates shallow insertion and the included Comply tips help comfort further, though replacing them can be a costly affair

 Sound *(6.7/10) *– The Beta is an accurate earphone with fairly neutral tone and surprising range. For a half in-ear design, its bass has impressive depth and impact, both vastly superior to Fischer Audio’s similarly-priced FA-788. It is also punchier than the higher-end M1 model and the pricier Hippo 10EB. The bass is very clean and articulate and maintains impressive resolution for an earphone in the Beta’s price range – those not expecting a bass monster are sure to be pleased.

 The mids of the Beta are recessed slightly compared to the bass and come across sounding a touch distant next to the M1 model. Clarity is excellent, however, and exaggerated further by the prominent treble. Detail resolution, too, is impressive for the price and the sound produced is clean, crisp, and edgy. The Beta is not something I would recommend for vocal-centric genres over the M1 but its reproduction of guitars has just the right amount of bite and texture. Whereas the M1 is refined and extremely smooth, the Beta is raw and full of energy.

 There is a downside to the wild sound, however – at times the upper midrange and lower treble can come across wildly uncontrolled. The top end can be a touch splashy and sibilance ranges from mild to moderate depending on track, fit, and tips used. The included Complys do a good job of taming most of the treble but the Beta can still be fatiguing at higher volumes. Those who listen with the volume turned down, though, will find sparkly, clear, and moderately extended treble well worth the asking price.

 In terms of presentation, the Beta is airy and open-sounding. Soundstage width is excellent and depth isn’t bad, either. Fischer’s FA-788 sounds much smaller and more congested in comparison and even the similarly open-sounding Hippo 10EB can’t match the soundstage size of the Beta. That said, the beta isn’t the most resolving earphone and doesn’t separate quite as well as the Brainwavz M1 does once things get busy. In addition, the space is not quite as cohesive and the imaging lags a little behind the M1. For its price, however, the Beta performs more than adequately and the sheer size of its soundstage is certain to impress.

 Value *(9/10) *– While the old Beta Brainwavz Pro was a great value as an overall package, the new Beta gets by on sound quality alone. Like most entry-level half in-ear designs, it is not the best-built or most isolating set of earphones but for the asking price – and with sound quality this good – it is easy enough to forgive. Simply put, aside from a bit of sibilance the Beta may just be the best-sounding earphone in its price bracket. If that matters more than the functional nuances – as it should to many here at Head-Fi – there is no reason not to buy one.

*Pros: comfortable half in-ear design; best-in-class sound quality
 Cons: tangle-prone cabling; can be sibilant*
  
  
*(3B31) Koss KEB70*


Reviewed Jan 2012

 Details: Aluminum-shelled in-ear from Koss
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $44.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp:_ 16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _15-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style:_ *Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (3.5/5)* – The machined shells of the KEB70 look and feel very sturdy but are attached to a thin, tangle-prone cloth cable that has a tendency to fray. Strain reliefs are a bit hard and there is no cable cinch. L/R markings can be tough to see
 Isolation* (3/5)* – Decent
 Microphonics* (4/5)* – Surprisingly low in the cloth cable
 Comfort* (3/5)* – The shells are smooth and rounded at the front but slightly heavy in the ear. Long strain reliefs and lack of a cable cinch can make over-the-ear wear tricky. The stock tips are strange – short and thick

 Sound *(5.4)* – The KEB70 is a budget-minded earphone with a consumer-friendly sound signature. The low end offers sizeable mid-bass lift with moderate sub-bass extension left over. The deep bass is not emphasized as it is with the MEElectronics M9 and tends to be subdued slightly by the mid-bass hump of the Koss but the low end is decently clean and controlled on the whole. The bass tends to be a little slow but not smeared – just a bit ‘fat’. The midrange is warm and surprisingly detailed for an entry-level product. It is placed just behind the mid-bass in emphasis but not quite as recessed as that of the M9. The M9 is clearer and more neutral in tone but not as smooth as the KEB70.

 At the top, the KEB70 is laid-back and slightly rolled-off. There are no significant spikes to cause harshness or sibilance. The M9 has similarly mediocre top-end extension but tends to be harsher and grainier. The KEB70 sounds slightly darker, however, and lacks a bit of detail and resolution in comparison. In terms of presentation, the Koss offers surprisingly decent layering and space, sounding reasonably open but not very airy due to the laid-back treble. The soundstage has good width but not much depth – par for the course as far as budget-minded in-ears go.

 Value* (8/10)* – At the current sub-$30 prices, Koss offers a good-sounding budget earphone with surprisingly solid shells in the KEB70. There are a number of minor quirks that might cause one to think twice before picking one up in place of a MEElec M9 or other established entry-level earphone but the smooth, impactful sound is well worth the price of admission.

*Pros: low microphonics; smooth and pleasant sound
 Cons: poor stock eartips; heavy; tangle-prone cable*

 Thanks to *kidcharlemagne* for the KEB70 loan


*(3B32) Sunrise Aodia i100*


Reviewed Jan 2012

 Details: Entry-level headset in the common Sennheiser CX300 form factor
 Current Price:* $23* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $23)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _N/A_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or* over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Plastic housings are fairly well put together. Standard Sunrise cabling with metal hardware feels nice and sturdy but probably isn’t. A bit of driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Moderate with the conventional straight-barrel housings
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Bothersome when worn over-the-ear; decent otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– Tiny, lightweight housings seemingly identical to those used by the Sennheiser CX300 disappear when worn. Easy IEMs to sleep in

 Sound* (5.9/10) *– Sunrise’s entry-level headset model, the i100 utilizes a conventional sound signature – boosted bass with relatively balanced mids and highs. The bass is full and impactful, with good depth and power. There is a bit of mid-bass emphasis but nothing overblown – the Soundmagic E10 is easily bassier, for example. Bass control is good – not as impressive as with the higher-end Sunrise sets but only a touch on the boomy side considering overall the bass quantity of the i100.

 The midrange is warm and pleasant. It tends to be a bit dry but clarity and detail are quite good - a bit better than with the ECCI PG100, for example, but not quite on-par with the Soundmagic E30. In terms of emphasis, the midrange is a half-step back compared to the bass but not particularly out of balance compared to the mid-recessed MEElec M9 or mid-forward Fischer Audio Jazz. The treble transition is smooth – the top end is not perfectly even but sparkle is minimal and it is balanced well with the midrange. Top-end extension is average and with its copious bass the i100 is slightly dark on the whole next to more balanced sets such as the E30 and MEElec CX21. The presentation is agreeable – soundstage size is average but has depth in addition to width and the separation is good – better, for example, than with the MEElec M9s and ECCI PG100s.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The Sunrise Aodia i100 is a well-rounded entry-level headset, scoring points not only for sound quality but also good long-term comfort and above-average isolation. The consumer-oriented sound signature is rather well-executed, with punchy, robust bass, warm mids, well-controlled treble, and a decent presentation. The generic build and moderate cable noise would be problematic in a higher-end set, but can be excused considering he price of the i100. Those looking for a cheap and cheerful way to listen to music and take calls on the go will get their money’s worth.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable; easy-going sound
 Cons: Generic housings; cable can be noisy*
  
  
*(3B33) VSonic GR99*
  

Reviewed June 2012

 Details: Entry-level model from VSonic
 Current Price: *$28 *from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est $28)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 24Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB _| Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (3/5) *- Single-flange UE-style (medium) and hybrid-style (7 sizes) silicone tips, shirt clip, and soft drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The GR99 is constructed very well, with solid-feeling housings featuring metal nozzles, filters, and rear grilles. Strain reliefs are strong and flexible and the cable is sturdy despite being thinner than the cords on other VSonic IEMs. Attention to detail is good - colored rings around the rear grilles act as L/R designations and a small bump is present ton the right strain relief for identification in the dark. No cable cinch is present
 Isolation* (3/5)* – Good for a vented dynamic-driver IEM
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Tolerable when worn cable-down; very low with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort* (4/5) *– The straight-barrel housings are larger than average but smooth and comfortable in the ear. Tip selection is less generous compared to higher-end VSonics but still greater than expected for the price

 Sound* (7.3/10)* – The entry-level model in VSonic’s growing lineup, the GR99 was tuned to retain the hallmark clarity and natural sound of the higher-end models while emphasizing deep bass for a consumer-friendly ‘wow’ factor. The low end of the GR99 is not the tightest or most controlled, giving up some definition and detail to the higher-end models, but it has great depth and power. Mid-bass punch is strong as well – the GR99 easily matches the Soundmagic E10 in impact and calling it ‘bassy’ is not a stretch.

 There is a bit of bass bleed and the overall tone is on the warm side. The mids are clear and positioned well – not as recessed as one might expect with the amount of bass the GR99 can crank out. Detail and clarity do lag slightly behind the pricier GR02 and the id America Spark, as well as the far more balanced-sounding Monoprice 8320, but considering the price and sound signature the GR99 is difficult to fault on either count.

 At the top the GR99 is smooth and pleasant. It is the darkest-sounding of all of the VSonic IEMs I’ve heard but treble presence is still sufficient. The occasional predisposition of the GR07, GR06, and even GR02 towards slightly hot treble and accentuating the sibilance is all but absent with the GR99. It is also less bright than the Soundmagic E10, which follows a more v-shaped response. The presentation, too, is pleasant all around – the soundstage is average or slightly above average in size – the Soundmagic E10 and E30, for example, are more spacious. However, the GR99, while not as dynamic as the GR02, has decent enough instrument separation and conveys both depth and width for a fairly well-rounded sonic image.

 Value* (10/10) *– The GR99 is yet another heavyweight offering from VSonic, this time in the bargain sub-$30 category. Its emphasis on sub-bass and smooth treble differentiate it from the higher-end VSonic models while making it well-suited for the consumer market. Good build quality and overall usability, as well as a generous selection of tips, make the GR99 even more difficult to beat as a total package.

*Pros: Well-built, impressively functional, great sound for the money
 Cons: N/A*
  
  
*(3B34) JVC HA-FX40*
  

Added Sep 2012

 Details: First carbon nanotube earphone on the US market
 Current Price: *$22* from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq:_ 8-24k Hz _| Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec trimmed triple-flange; UE bi-flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips, and shirt clip
 Build Quality* (3/5) *– The housings are mostly plastic, with paper nozzle filters and no strain reliefs on cable entry. The cables are thinner compared to higher-end JVC IEMs but still soft and flexible. The 3.5mm I-plug is nicely relieved
 Isolation *(2.5/5) *– Good for a shallow-fit earphone
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Low in the soft and flexible cable
 Comfor*t (3/5)* – The housings are small and ergonomic except for the plastic stabilizing arm shooting off the side of the housing, which can push against the ear and cause soreness after a while. They can be worn over-the-ear, with the stabilizer pointing outward, for better comfort

 Sound* (7.2/10) *– The HA-FX40 is built around an 8.5mm carbon nanotube driver, the first such transducer available in the US. Billed as the ‘high clarity’ model in JVC’s extensive earphone lineup, the FX40 follows a v-shaped sound signature with strong bass and even stronger treble. It certainly delivers the clarity, but does so at a cost.

 The carbon nanotube drivers found at the heart of the FX40 are most impressive in the bass region – the bass is definitely enhanced but far from overbearing. It lacks the absolute extension of sets such as the VSonic GR99 and Philips SHE3580 but still digs plenty deep without jeopardizing control. The treble-heavy nature of the earphones can diminish the relative emphasis placed on the low end but the bass of the FX40 is not to be underestimated – it is quick and impactful, forming a solid backbone for the sound.

 Bass bleed is quite low – the Philips SHE 3580 and Brainwavz Beta, two competing v-shaped IEMs, have stronger upper bass response and sound warmer than the FX40. The JVCs are recessed through much of the midrange, though the response picks up towards the upper mids. Vocals, especially male vocals, are too far back in the mix on many tracks. High levels of clarity and detail are probably the most impressive aspect of the mids, though some of the perceived clarity comes from emphasis in the upper midrange and treble. This effect is similar to using a treble booster EQ setting (e.g. BBE’s “Crystal Clear” preset) and highly reminiscent of the far pricier PureSound ClarityOne earphones.

 The resolution of the FX40 is still very good but there is another similarity to the PureSound Clarity One – the note presentation is on the thin side. The Philips SHE3580 and id America Spark, for example, both give up a bit of resolution to the FX40 but have a thicker, more fleshed-out note. While both of these earphones also sound colored, their note presentation seems a bit more natural than that of the FX40. The treble of the FX40 is emphasized overall and not entirely smooth but it is not as harsh or sibilant as one may expect from an earphone with enhanced treble response – a little splashy and fatiguing over long listening sessions, but generally tame. The tone is on the bright side, with plenty of energy and a tendency to emphasize cymbal crashes and the initial ‘crack’ of drums. The result of all this coloration, combined with the thinner note presentation, is that the fidelity of the FX40 can swing widely from great to poor depending on track.

 Similarly, there are some issues with the presentation – while the FX40 tends to sound nice and open, the high left-right separation is reminiscent of Sony’s higher-end EX-series earphones and the Monoprice 8320 in providing little in the way of a central image. Depth and layering leave some to be desired as well, especially compared to JVC’s higher-end FXT90 model. On the upside, separation is good and there isn’t any of the boomy, closed-in feel that can be such a deal breaker with certain low-end IEMs.

 Value *(9/10) *– JVC’s entry-level clarity-oriented model delivers exactly what it promises – a bright, clarity-oriented signature that doesn’t sacrifice the one must-have trait of a successful entry-level earphone – solid bass. The form factor leaves a little to be desired and the sound signature won’t work for everyone but the FX40 is one of the better treble-heavy earphones in the lower price tiers.

*Pros: Minimal cable noise; great clarity and detail
 Cons: No strain relief on housing entry; recessed lower mids; treble energy may be excessive for some*
  
 Thanks to *dweaver* for the HA-FX40 loan!
  
  
*(3B35) Rock-It Sounds R-10*
  

Added Oct 2012
 Details: Entry-level earphone from Rock-It Sounds
 Current Price: *$20* from rockitsounds.com (MSRP: $19.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens:_ 105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _N/A (oval)_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), airline adapter, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The R-10 utilizes a plastic housing with a rubber bumper, integrated strain relief, oval nozzles with metal filters, and a plastic-sheathed cable. The molding is a little rough around the edges but durability should be excellent for an entry-level product
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Isolation is limited by the shallow fit but is sufficient for general use
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Cable noise can be coerced with cord-down wear but is nonexistent in the intended over-the-ear configuration
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings are lightweight and highly ergonomic. The rounded shells and rubber bumpers are reminiscent of the highly-acclaimed JVC AirCushions but the over-the-ear fit makes the R-10 more secure and reduces cable noise

 Sound *(4.7/10)* – The sound signature of the R-10 is a warm and consumer-friendly one, with enhanced bass and relaxed treble. Bass extension is decent but the low end is a little boomy compared to similarly-priced sets such as the UE100. Impact is similar to the MEElectronics M9, though the M9 has more subbass and less upper bass for a less bloated sound. Midrange bleed is noticeable but the R-10 displays mids very prominently and could even be called mid-centric. Detail and clarity lag slightly behind the more balanced-sounding UE100 and are no match for the higher-end Rock-It models.

 The treble is laid-back and lacking in both sparkle and extension. There’s not a whole lot of air to the sound as a result and the R-10 gets congested easily. Still, the presentation is forward overall and the strong, upfront midrange prevents the earphones from sounding distant and uninvolving as some other entry-level IEMs, such as the Panasonic HJE120, can.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – Priced at just $20, the R-10 is a decent-sounding and very well-designed option for the general consumer. The lightweight, over-the-ear form factor allows the R-10 to be comfortable, secure in the ear, and low on cable noise and the bass- and midrange-heavy sound is non-fatiguing, if somewhat muddy. First-time IEM owners will be happy with the bass and the R-10 makes a great disposable set for the gym. Just don’t expect it to deliver the refinement of Rock-It’s higher-end models.

*Pros: Comfortable over-the-ear fit; nearly no cable noise, well-built and accessorized for the price
 Cons: Lackluster sound heavy on the bass and midrange*


*(3B36) Rock-It Sounds R-11*


Added Oct 2012

 Details: Entry-level earphone from Rock-It Sounds
 Current Price: *$25* from rockitsounds.com (MSRP: $24.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), removable rubber bumpers (3 sizes), airline adapter, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– The R-11 utilizes plastic housings with a trio of removable rubber bumpers that slide onto the nozzle before the eartip. The cable is twisted, identical to those found on Rock-It’s higher-end models and the MEElectronics A151 – very impressive for an entry-level set
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Isolation is improved compared to the R-10 model. A deeper fit is possible with the front bumpers removed (shown)
 Microphonics* (5/5) *– Cable noise is nonexistent with the excellent twisted cable
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The housings are lightweight and highly ergonomic. Over-the-ear fitment makes the R-11 secure and the twisted cable is a pleasure to use. The rubber bumpers can be used for stability with a shallow fit or removed entirely for a deeper seal

 Sound* (4.2/10) *– The sound of the R-11 is reminiscent of the cheaper R-10 model, but while the housings of the R-10 are vented, the R-11 appears to be sealed. This has a negative effect on the sound – the R-11 is still a warm, bass- and mid-focused earphone but its sound isn’t as clear and well-defined as that of the R-10. The bass is noticeably heavier but also boomier and more prone to bleeding up into the midrange. Bass extension is improved but the cost to the overall sound quality is too great.

 The heavier bass bleed causes the midrange to sound more muffled compared to the R-10 and sacrifices even more of the clarity. Treble response seems to be less affected by the sealed housings of the R-11 but is still drowned out more by the heavier bass of the R-11. The presentation is intimate and the R-11 has the same tendency towards becoming congested as the R-10.

 Value *(7/10)* – While the R-11 improves on the R-10 in several areas, its non-vented housings result in sound that is less suitable for the discerning listener. The bass is deeper and heavier at the expense of clarity and accuracy and the entire experience becomes more muddy and bloated. The interchangeable front bumpers and excellent twisted cable – a definite luxury in this price bracket - are worthy of a thumbs-up but aren’t quite enough to make the R-11 worth recommending over the R-10.

*Pros: Comfortable over-the-ear fit; excellent cable; no cable noise, well accessorized for the price
 Cons: Audio quality lags behind cheaper R-10 model*
  

*(3B37) JVC HA-FX101*


Added Feb 2013

 Details: Bass-heavy budget earphone from JVC’s Xtreme Xplosives line
 Current Price:* $18* from amazon.com (MSRP: $19.95); $29.95 for HA-FR201 model w/mic
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic _| Imp:_ 16Ω _| Sens:_ 101 dB_ | Freq:_ 5-20k Hz _| Cable:_ 3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down *or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The design of the FX101 resembles the older FX1X and features plastic housings with rubber bumpers, paper nozzle filters, and a thin, plasticky cable. The cord lacks a sliding cinch but carries minimal noise and terminates with a well-relieved I-plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good for an angled-nozzle design
 Microphonics* (5/5) *– Low in the soft and flexible cable
 Comfort* (4/5) *– The fit is generally similar to JVC’s higher-end FX500 model but the rubber-sheathed housings may be a little large for over-the-ear wear for those with smaller ears. Cord-down wear is very comfortable with the angled-nozzle form factor and the shells are smaller compared to the older FX1X

 Sound *(6.2/10) *– JVC’s follow-up to the popular FX1X model, the FX101 has no trouble delivering on promises of copious bass despite its smaller 8.5mm drivers. Its low end is not as loose as that of the older FX1X model and yet the FX101 sacrifices nothing in the way of impact or bass depth. Its bass puts it among the hardest-hitting in-ears on the market, though as usual the low end grunt comes at a price. The bass is on the boomy side compared to sets such as the Philips SHE3580 and can be very intrusive. Happily, the FX101 probably won’t be purchased by those looking for anything less than a bass monster.

 The real strength of the FX101 is in retaining good overall sound characteristics despite its massive low end and miniscule price tag. The clarity is quite good for something so bassy – it lags behind the JVC FX40, Brainwavz Beta, and Soundmagic E10 but easily beats the MEElectronics M9 and most other entry-level sets. The sound tends to be a little warm and dark. The signature is v-shaped, with strong bass emphasis and a milder treble boost. Bass bleed helps the FX101 sound a bit less recessed in the midrange compared to the Brainwavz Beta and JVC HA-FX40. As with the FX40, the colored signature of the FX101 works especially well with electronic music and can be hit or miss with recorded instruments.

 Treble is somewhat harsh and not very refined compared to higher-end sets. It can accentuate sibilance and doesn’t extend all the way up, resulting in a darker sound compared to sets such as the Soundmagic E10 and Brainwavz Beta. The presentation is above average in its price class – not as wide as that of the Brainwavz Beta but better compared to the MEElectronics M9. The darker tone of the FX101 also prevents it from sounding as open and airy as the Soundmagic E10, which also boasts a better sense of space. Still, the FX101 has nothing to be ashamed of for the price and has another piece of mass appeal up its sleeve – efficiency. The FX101 plays louder than just about anything I put it up against and will crank out the bass even at low listening volumes.

 Value *(9.5/10) *– Comfortable, well-built, and not at all microphonic, the FX101 is a bargain that should cause the bass-obsessed to salivate profusely. The bass-heavy sound means that these are far from the most neutral or natural-sounding earphones, but they deliver on the fun factor without sounding offensive - a definite win for their intended audience.

*Pros: Well-built; comfortable; minimal cable noise; tons of bass
 Cons: Treble can be harsh; tons of bass*
  
 Thanks to *mcnoiserdc* for the HA-FX101 loan!
  
  
*(3B38) Astrotec DX-60*
  

Added Mar 2013

 Details: Entry-level headset featuring flat cables and 13.5mm drivers
 Current Price: *$20* from lendmurears.com (MSRP: est $20)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and TRRS smartphone adapter
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– In contrast to Astrotec’s higher-end sets, the DX-60 is mostly plastic save for some metal inserts with the Astrotec logo. The two-tone flat cables are tangle-resistant and feels trong but the strain reliefs are stiff and there’s no sliding cable cinch
 Isolation* (2/5) *– Low due to the shallow fit
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low in the textured flat cable
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The plastic housings are ergonomically designed for cable-down wear. They’re a little big due to the 13.5mm drivers but overall quite manageable. Those with smaller ears may have trouble with the cable exit point at the bottom of the housings.

 Sound* (4.9/10)* – Astrotec’s entry-level in-ear pursues a consumer-friendly sound signature that reminds me of Sennheiser’s now-defunct CX300. The mid-bass of the DX-60 is hyped up to the point of overshadowing parts of the midrange and draws attention away from the rather good subbass. The low end is boomy, but I wouldn’t call the DX-60 a bass monster – it’s not as bassy as the JVC FX101, for example. Instead, it competes with the likes of the MEElectronics M9 and UE100, though it lacks deep bass emphasis compared to the former and control compared to the latter. Next to Astrotec’s higher-end AM-800 model, too, the DX-60 clearly sounds bloated and sloppy at the low end.

 The midrange of the DX-60 lacks some clarity due to the uncontrolled bass but has a pleasant smoothness to it. Despite the slight veil, the mids sound more open and natural than the recessed mids of the MEElec M9 or the more congested midrange of the UE100. The treble of the DX-60 is not as energetic as I would have liked, which enhances the warm and bass-heavy character of the earphone but also makes it very forgiving of poor source material. It’s not as harsh as the MEElec M9, for example, and remains less critical of poor-quality recordings than Astrotec’s higher-end AM-800 model. With its shallow-sealing housings, the presentation of the DX-60 is also surprisingly “big” and uncongested. Aside from the mid-bass bloat the only issue seems to be a relative lack of depth. Expectedly, the higher-end AM-800 has far better imaging, but for the price the DX-60 isn’t half bad.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – While not as refined in sound or design as Astrotec’s higher-end in-ears, the DX-60 is an affordable smartphone headset with a warm, easy-going sound signature. It competes well against similarly-priced headsets from the likes of Soundmagic and MEElectronics, especially impressing with its noise-free, tangle-resistant flat cable.

*Pros: Almost no cable noise; ergonomic design
 Cons: Lacks clarity; low isolation*
  
  
*(3B39) TDK MT300*
  

Added Jun 2013

 Details: Entry-level earphone from TDK
 Current Price: *$24* from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _89 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5) *– The metal housings of the MT300 are solid but the thin, plasticky cable is a reminder of the earphone’s low price
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Good, but limited by the shallow insertion of the earphones
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Tolerable, but the MT300 is difficult to wear cable-up to eliminate cable noise entirely
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The small, angled-nozzle housings are lightweight and very comfortable, though wearing the MT300 over-the-ear can be tough.

 Sound *(5.5/10) *– The MT300 is an entry-level earphone with a bass-heavy, consumer-oriented sound. It impresses with the depth and power of its sub-bass response, though there is also mid-bass to match. The bass emphasis of the MT300 gives it a full-bodied, albeit boomy, sound. The Philips SHE3580, which is also rather bass-heavy, keeps its bloat to a minimum due to its thinner, quicker note presentation but the MT300 is not quite so capable, sounding thicker and more bloated.

 The weighty low end of the MT300 dominates the sound, producing a veil over the midrange and treble. Comparing the MT300 to the aging MEElectronics M9 reveals a lack of mid-bass bloat - and veiling - with the MEElecs but at the same time shows that the MT300’s mid-bass gives it a warmer, fuller sound with thicker, more natural mids. The midrange of the MT300 is recessed compared to the bass, but not too much so. The mids of the Philips SHE3580, for example, appear more recessed, likely due to its thinner sound and slightly more v-shaped response.

 The tone of the MT300 has a dark tilt due to a lack of treble energy. The benefit is a nicely non-fatiguing sound – although the treble is not entirely smooth, its features are masked at lower volumes. It is of better quality than the treble of the MEElec M9 but not nearly as refined as that of the pricier Sony MH1C.

 While the MT300 is no MH1C when it comes to presentation, its soundstage is wide for an entry-level set. Size-wise, it is about on-par with the M9 and would probably be even more impressive were it not for the mild congestion resulting from the bass emphasis - something the MH1C manages to do a better job of avoiding. As for the extremely low sensitivity figure in the manufacturer specs of the TDKs, it does not seem to correspond very well to reality in this case – the MT300 reaches high volumes rather easily.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The TDK MT300 is a capable earphone, performing better than entry-level sets from such big audio brands as Sennheiser and Ultimate Ears. At $25, it is a solid but not entirely outstanding budget earphone that is nonetheless worthy of recommendation due to its pleasant sound, great comfort, and good overall usability. Interestingly, it seems to be pricier and more limited in availability in the US than in Canada, for example, so those outside of the States might find a better deal still in the MT300.

*Pros: Good bass response; smooth at reasonable volumes; very comfortable
 Cons: Lacks a bit in the way of clarity and bass control*

 Huge thanks to* inline79 f*or sending in the MT-300 and making this review happen!
  
  
*(3B40) Etymotic Research ETY-Kids 5 / 3*


Reviewed Aug 2013

 Details: Etymotic’s volume-limiting safe listening earphones
 Current Price: $30 from amazon.com (MSRP: $49); $79 for ETY-Kids 3 with 3-button remote and microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _300Ω _| Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple-flanges, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Triple-flange silicone tips (2 sizes), Etymotic Glider tips, shirt clip, and zippered soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* –Though the ETY-Kids are lightweight and made of plastic, the cords are Kevlar-reinforced and well-relieved all around. The cabling is very flexible and doesn’t stick or tangle, making the entry-level Etys feel like a quality product
 Isolation* (4/5) *– Typical of Ety earphones, isolation doesn’t get much better than this
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Quite low when worn cable-down, nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* –The slim housings don’t put pressure on the outer ear and the cable exit angle works well for over-the-ear wear. The included assortment of tips is on the smaller side but it should fit most listeners comfortably as long as they don’t mind the deeper fit of Etymotic earphones

 Sound *(7.6/10)* – The ETY-Kids are the second dynamic-driver earphone from Etymotic Research and the company’s most budget-friendly set yet, marketed to parents as a child-friendly safe hearing model. Volume-limiting earphones are not a novel concept - we’ve previously seen similar designs from brands such as Ultimate Ears and Harman-owned dB Logic. The ETY-Kids achieve this with their 300Ω impedance, which makes it difficult to power the earphone to dangerous volume levels. Unlike headphones with dB Logic’s SPL2 technology, the Etys will still hit high volumes when driven with a powerful enough source, but they do a good job limiting output with conventional mp3 players.

 The limited volume of the Etys should be sufficient for most Head-Fiers. At worst, it is a minor inconvenience to turn up the volume, and on more powerful sources such as my desktop amp and HiFiMan HM-901, it is barely noticeable that the volume pot needs another ¼ turn. More importantly the ETY-Kids, low price and all, sound very much like an Ety should. The bass is tight and clean, albeit a touch rolled-off at the bottom. This means the ETY-Kids won’t produce the type of deep, rumbling bass the Beats by Dre generation may be expecting, but it also keeps the tone neutral and midrange free of bleed. In comparison, the VSonic VC02 has slightly punchier bass but keeps it just as clean and controlled as the Etys while the warmer, bassier VSonic VSD1 sounds a bit more bloated.

 The midrange of the ETY-Kids is likewise clear and neutral, bumped slightly in presence to make vocals more prominent and intelligible. Due to this, and because of the lack of bass and treble emphasis, the Etys can sound a bit mid-centric – more so, for example, than the VSonic VC02. On the other hand, the fantastic midrange clarity means there is no need to turn the earphones up to discern vocals, which fits nicely in with the whole “safe hearing” push. The ETY-Kids are clearer even than the balanced armature Astrotec AM-90, though they lack some of the warmth and fullness of the Astrotecs as well.

 The treble of the ETY-Kids is nicely filled in, though it seems to lack a bit of extension and presence next to the higher-end armature-based Ety models. It is smoother than the treble of the VSonic VC02 and VSD1 but not as smooth as the similarly-priced balanced armature sets from Astrotec and Rock-It sounds. The overall tone of the Etys is a bit on the cool side and the presentation tends to be a little laid-back. Soundstage depth and overall dynamics could be better, but for the price the junior Etys do a great job.

 Value *(9.5/10)* – The ETY-Kids name may be off-putting to some but there is nothing childish about the design or sound of these earphones. Like all things Etymotic, the ETY-Kids are well-built, highly isolating, and boast sound that is clear, accurate, and neutral, though for some listeners perhaps lacking in desired bass presence. They promote hearing safety with a combination of immense noise isolation and volume-limiting impedance. All in all, the ETY-Kids are a great entry-level audiophile IEM that – we can only hope – will help introduce the next generation to Etymotic’s signature sound.

*Pros: Stellar noise isolation; solid build quality; clear, balanced, and accurate sound
 Cons: Deep-insertion form factor can take some getting used to for new users. Volume-limiting design may be undesirable for some*
  
  
  
*(3B41) NarMoo R1M*
  
  

Reviewed July 2013
  
Details: First earphone model from NarMoo, tunable via interchangeable rear ports
MSRP: $69.99 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$24* from NarMoo.com with coupon code “*THL”*; $25 from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug w/ mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Narrow-channel single-flange eartips (e.g. Dunu or MEElectronics M6)_
 Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, tuning ports (3 pairs), and oversize zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The body of the R1M is aluminum, quite solidly made, and features screw-in rear tuning ports (three pairs are included). Semi-flexible strain reliefs are fitted over the housings, protecting the sturdy flat cable. A mic and single-button remote unit is mounted on the right earpiece and the cable is terminated with a low-profile L-plug. Some driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – About average for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Noticeable when worn cable-down but the thick flat cable is not particularly energetic, which helps. Over-the-ear wear is a little difficult but makes microphonics negligible
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings of the R1M are on the large side, but light enough to still be comfortable. The flat cable, long strain reliefs, mic position, and lack of cable cinch don’t lend themselves well to over-the-ear wear, but it is not impossible to wear the R1M cable up

Sound* (7.6/10)* – The main feature of the NarMoo R1M is the sound adjustment system with interchangeable screw-in tuning ports. This concept, right down to the color coding of the screws, should be familiar to owners of the MEElectronics SP51. The sound tuning of the R1M follows the same scheme – the black ports are the bassiest by far, followed by the darker silver (metallic) ones and then the light silver ones. In short, the tuning screws are configured as follows:

Silver ports: most balanced sound; slightly v-shaped signature with solid bass punch and ample upper midrange/treble presence
Metallic ports: less balanced, borderline “bassy” sound but for the most part maintains bass control and clarity close to those of the silver ports
Black ports: maximum bass setting. Cranks up both the sub-bass and mid-bass for an experience that will please even serious bassheads, but gives up bass tightness in the process

The R1M looks to be the next generation of sound tuning earphones, with ports that are nice and large in contrast to similar designs I’ve seen in the past, making them easier to use and harder to misplace.

With the black ports in place, the sound of the R1M is suitable for fans of heavy bass. Bass depth is excellent but the mid-bass region is boosted more, resulting in slight masking of the sub-bass. The bass is often too boomy for me in this configuration.

With both the metallic and silver ports the low end is much more manageable – not quite as tight as that of my pricier VSonic VSD1S benchmark, but close. The metallic ports are bassier than the silver ones but still manage to maintain good quality. The midrange and treble are remarkably unaffected when swapping the ports, aside from the effects of the bass quantity differences.

The silver ports being the more balanced – and the most impressive technically – led me to use them for the review. Unless otherwise noted, the rest of this review is based on the R1M with the silver ports installed.

With the silver ports, the bass of the R1M is only slightly enhanced – quantity is similar to one of my favorite budget earphones, the VSonic VSD1S. The R1M has less of a mid-bass boost than the VSonics and less recessed mids, which gives it a cooler overall tonal character.

The most impressive aspect of the silver ports, however, is the overall clarity, which falls only a bit behind the pricier VSD1S but easily beats similarly-priced sets from Dunu, MEElectronics, Ultimate Ears, and the like. This is in part due to strong presence in the upper midrange and treble, which also contributes to the somewhat cool tonal character of the earphones. It’s not the most natural midrange presentation, but it works well in the case of the R1M.

The prominent upper mids of the R1M can sound a little edgy and the earphone doesn’t have the smoothest or most extended treble. It lacks a bit of crispness and instruments like hi-hats can sound a little too distant and vague compared pricier sets. However, despite the strong upper midrange presence, the R1M is surprisingly tolerant of sibilance. Compared to the VSD1S, for example, it’s quite a lot more forgiving.

Presentation is another definite strong suit of the R1M, one that impressed me at first listen. There are previous few budget earphones that sound as spacious, airy, and open as the R1M. The aforementioned lack of crispness takes away from their imaging ability a bit, making the soundstaging a touch vague, but overall the earphones simply provide a great sense of space.

*Select Comparisons* (Note: in each comparison the port with the best signature match was selected)

Nuforce NE-600X ($15) (black ports)

The sound of the NE-600X is very close to the R1M with the black tuning ports installed. Both have enormous bass that should satisfy even die-hard basshead, and yet despite their deep, booming bass, both earphones still offer pretty good clarity and avoid the sort of congestion that often plagues entry-level basshead earphones. The differences are subtle – the NE-600X is warmer in tone while the R1M is a little more neutral despite having similar bass impact. Vocals are a bit more intelligible on the R1M, likely due to slightly greater midrange presence, but overall the NE-600X is a little clearer and more crisp, especially up top. The NE-600X is a little harsher, however.

RHA MA350 ($40) (black ports)

Though the MA350 doesn’t quite have the bass impact of the NE-600X, its bass quantity is still closer to the black ports of the R1M than the metallic ones. Overall performance is again extremely close between the two earphones – they have similar bass control and clarity, though switching over the metallic or silver ports gives the advantage to the R1M on both counts. The largest difference between them is treble quality – the MA350 tends to be somewhat harsh and grainy compared to the NarMoo unit whereas the R1M, while less crisp, has smoother and more forgiving treble. The R1M also has a small advantage in soundstage size and airiness.

VSonic GR02 Bass Edition ($36) (metallic ports)

VSonic’s enhanced-bass GR02 model finds its match in the R1M with the metallic tuning ports in place. The GR02 BE has always impressed me with its balance of bass quantity and quality, and it still beats the R1M slightly in bass control. However, while bass impact and depth are similar between the two earphones, the R1M is more balanced overall. It makes the GR02 BE sound overly v-shaped and mid-recessed. The GR02 BE is a little bit clearer, however, partly due to its greater treble energy. It makes the R1M appear a little dull at the top in comparison, but is also more harsh and sibilant. On the whole, the sound of the R1M is more natural through the midrange and treble. The R1M also has a better presentation, sounding more open and spacious than the GR02 BE.

T-Peos D200R ($35) (silver ports)

With the silver tuning ports, the NarMoo R1M is technically at its best and capable of going up against T-Peos’ limited edition D200R model. The D200R has slightly less bass quantity than even the silver ports of the R1M but, like all of the T-Peos sets I’ve tried, still maintains excellent extension and is capable of very solid punch on tracks that call for bass. The R1M is a little heavier in the mid-bass region, which makes its low end appear stronger and at times more intrusive. The bass of the D200R is tighter. The midrange of the D200R is more prominent and clear, but the T-Peos also tend to sound harsher at times. The R1M is less crisp overall, but boasts a wider presentation and more open sound next to the more forward and closed-in D200R.

Fidue A63 ($60) (silver ports)

The mid-forward Fidue A63 is opposite in signature to the R1M, making for an excellent sound contrast. Even with the silver ports in place, the R1M is bassier than the A63 and its low end is more prone to sounding boomy and bloated. The tighter bass of the A63, combined with its prominent midrange, gives vocals better clarity and intelligibility compared to the R1M. The tone of the Fidue set is warmer overall and its treble is smoother. The R1M is more v-shaped in sound signature and brighter in tone. It also has a wider presentation. However, the smaller soundstage of the A63 is actually slightly more coherent and imaging is more precise.

Value *(9/10)* – The NarMoo R1M is an excellent first effort, offering pretty much everything one could want from a budget earphone – a solid construction, built-in mic and remote, and the ability to select between three levels of bass ranging from “basshead” to “mild enhancement”. The tuning port idea is not new, but it is well-executed, with ports that are easy to change by hand and provide clearly audible differences in sound. At the current sub-$30 price, these features make the R1M a great value.

*Pros: Good clarity; very spacious and open sound; tuning ports make a difference*
*Cons: Some driver flex is present; bass boomy with the black tuning ports; treble could stand to be more refined*

  

*(3B42) Xiaomi Piston 2*
  


Added August 2014
  
  
Details: 2nd generation of China-based Xioami’s popular Piston earphones, called the 2.0 or 2.1 depending on included accessories
 MSRP: approx. $16 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$25 from Amazon.com *(note: due to abundance of fakes, exercise caution when purchasing the Piston. There are legitimate eBay sellers, such as* bigbargainsonline*, but if a deal seems too good to be true it probably is)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: <=_16Ω_ | Sens: _93 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug with mic & 3-button Android remote __(still has limited functionality with other devices)_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec M6 single-flanges, Generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes); plastic box doubles as storage case with integrated cable wrap (Note: newer 2.1/IF version comes with updated eartips and adds a shirt clip)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The finely-ridged aluminum housings of the Piston 2 are a magnet for grime but the build is solid, with ample strain relief all around. There are many design improvements compared to the original Piston – the L/R markings are easier to see, there is virtually no driver flex, and the cable is no longer cloth-sheathed above the y-split, which makes the Piston 2 less tangle-prone and reduces cable noise
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Average, about the same as with the original Piston despite the addition of a large rear vent on the Piston 2
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down but much better compared to the original Piston; good with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3/5)* – The housings of the Piston are rather wide and remind me of the LG Quadbeat. They have squared-off edges at the front, which may create pressure points for those with small outer ears. The Piston can be worn both cable-down and cable-up, for which the positioning of the microphone/remote at the Y-split is perfect

Sound* (8.1/10)* – The Xiaomi Piston 2 makes all the right steps forward compared to the first-generation Piston, tightening up the bass response and clearing up the mids. The low end of the Piston 2 is slightly boomy, but without comparing it to a tighter-sounding earphone – which generally means one that is either much more expensive or much lighter in the bass department – it’s really not that noticeable.

The Piston 2 features enhanced bass, delivering both good extension and strong mid-bass presence. It is similar to the Sony MH1C and the pricier RHA MA750 in overall bass quantity, though both of those place a bit less weight on mid-bass. The extra mid-bass emphasis of the Piston 2 – which still pales in comparison to that of the original Piston – gives it a very visceral punch. When comparing the Piston 2 to higher-end earphones, it can be hard to get over the difference in bass control, but against similarly-priced sets it continuously impresses.

The bass of the Piston 2 grants it a warm tone and full-bodied sound. Overall, while the Piston 2 is a v-shaped earphone, the fullness prevents its midrange from sounding overly recessed. Clarity is good considering the bass quantity – even earphones with significantly more forward mids, such as the Fidue A63 and T-Peos D200R, don’t have a clarity advantage over the Piston 2. The only ones that do are brighter, thinner (and also harsher)-sounding sets with more recessed lower mids, for example the Philips TX2, MOE-SS01, and T-Peos Rich200.

The Piston 2 is not your typical v-shaped earphone in one other way – its upper midrange and treble are surprisingly smooth and refined. The top end has some sparkle, but is still sufficiently forgiving. Maybe not as much as the Sony MH1C, Fidue A63, and HiFiMan RE-400, which all have more laid-back treble, but more than a $25 earphone should be. Tonally, the Piston 2 can’t even be called “bright”, though it does have a little more treble energy than the Sony MH1C. Ditto on the T-Peos D200R – the Piston 2 has more of both sparkle and upper treble presence, which gives it an airier sound.

Thanks to its ample treble presence and generally good clarity, the Piston 2 has a wide and open presentation. It is similar in soundstage size to the brighter-sounding MOE-SS01 and superior to sets such as the SteelSeries Flux and T-Peos D200R. At the same time, the presentation has good depth and is capable of sounding quite forward when necessary. The Sony MH1C, for example, has a pretty good soundstage but sounds consistently laid-back compared to the Piston 2.

*Select Comparisons*

Xiaomi Piston 1.0 (discontinued)

Xiaomi responded to the popularity of the original Piston earphones with a number of improvements. In addition to fixing many of the design issues, the sound was re-tuned and a much larger port was opened up on the back of the Piston 2 in place of the small bottom-facing vent on the old Piston.

The result of the new tuning is significantly less bloated bass – the Piston 2 makes its predecessor sound boomy, and while it is not in any way bass-light, it won’t tickle bassheads’ fancy the way the original might have. Thanks to the tighter bass of the Piston 2, its midrange is nowhere near as muffled and the treble is a little more prominent, though also a touch less forgiving. The presentation is more open, too, although the original Piston already did an excellent job in that regard. All in all, with the exception of having less bass quantity, the Piston 2 is a clear step forward from the outgoing model.

VSonic VSD1S ($50)

In the world of portable Hi-Fi, the VSD1S from VSonic is a budget earphone, but it still costs twice as much as the Piston. It’s also an extremely solid set for the price, so the fact that the Piston 2 can go toe-to-toe in sound quality is a paradigm shift of sorts.

The Piston 2 is bassier and warmer than the VSD1S, thanks in large part to its greater deep bass presence. The two are pretty evenly-matched in mid-bass impact, but the VSD1S can appear punchier at times thanks to the more recessed mids. The bass quality of the Xiaomi lags behind the VSonic unit a bit – while more extended, the low end of the Piston 2 is a little bloated and can appear somewhat intrusive next to the VSD1S.

The midrange of the VSD1S is a little thinner and more recessed compared to the warmer mids of the Piston 2. It is also clearer, however, and does a better job of staying free of bass bleed, especially on complex tracks. Moving up, the VSD1S is more peaky, which makes it brighter and a touch more sibilance-prone. The Piston is smoother and more forgiving, though not by a large margin. In terms of presentation, both sound nice and airy but the VSD1, like VSonic’s higher-end models, tends towards a wider, less intimate soundstage.

RBH EP1 ($149)

Looking for a higher-end earphone to compare to the Piston 2, I came across the RBH EP1, which provides a rather different variant of warm, bassy sound. The EP1 impressed me originally with the prominence and clarity of its midrange, and that certainly hasn’t changed. Compared to the Xiaomi unit, its midrange is much more forward and quite a bit clearer. Its bass is also much more controlled in comparison.

The Piston is bassier than the EP1, but also more bloated and boomy. This makes its midrange – which is already less forward than that of the EP1 – sound veiled. The tone of the Piston is warmer and its sound is more full-bodied, making the EP1 sound thin in comparison. The EP1 also has more presence in the upper midrange and lower treble, but not in a good way – it still isn’t particularly well-balanced, and sounds rather more harsh than the Xiaomi to boot. Impressively, the Piston’s soundstage is as big as that of the EP1, though on tracks with lots of bass it tends to become congested more quickly.

Dunu DN-2000 ($315)

Just for fun, I pitted the Piston 2 against an earphone approximately 12 times more expensive, a flagship in-ear monitor with a hybrid driver setup that utilizes a dynamic driver for bass and two balanced armatures for the midrange and treble. This comparison is highly unfair, but also interesting because it is the only one I  made where the Piston was clearly outclassed – an extremely impressive showing for the $25 Xiaomi.

Next to the DN-2000, with its 3-way crossover and independent subwoofer, the bass of the Pistons sounds boomy and has way too much mid-bass bloat. The DN-2000 has a focus on sub-bass rather than mid-bass and sounds much tighter and more controlled. It is also much clearer – the bass bleed of the Xiaomi makes its mids sound overly thick and muffled. This, in turn, causes it to gloss over a good bit of detail in comparison to the faultlessly resolving DN-2000.

The Piston has a more full-bodied sound, but lacks crispness. Especially in the treble, it seems like parts of the spectrum are so timidly reproduced that they are almost missing. The DN-2000, while much less forgiving, makes for a better reference earphone by far. The soundstage of the Piston seems congested while the DN-2000 has a wider, more open, more out-of-the-head sound.  Tonality, however, is one area where I can see some listeners preferring the warmer Piston 2 to the brighter DN-2000.* *

Value *(10/10)* – Making sizable performance gains over its predecessor, the Xiaomi Piston 2 offers a solid construction, 3-button Android remote, and sound that’s all but flawless for the price and purpose. While higher-end in-ears can point out where the audio quality of the Piston 2 falls slightly short, in the age of internet radio this really may be all the fidelity many users need. With the dearth of choices among full-featured Android headsets at this time, the Xiaomi Piston 2 is a bargain, and a must-have for any Android user.

*Pros: Fantastic sound quality for the price; 3-button Android remote; many usability improvements over Piston 1.0*
*Cons: Wide housings not ideal for small ears; flimsy stock tips; mediocre isolation*

 

*(3B43) Fidue A31s*
  

 Reviewed May 2015

Brief: Ultra-comfortable entry-level headset from Fidue
MSRP: approx. $40 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$30* from amazon.com; *$30* from ebay.com; Canada: $39 from CTC Audio
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _19Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug w/mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Shure Olives; Stock double-flanges; Comply T-100_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and double-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, over-the-ear cable guides (1 pair), and excellent slim plastic carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The Fidue A31s features compact plastic housings and cabling identical to that of the higher-end A63 model – internally braided and covered in a smooth, glossy sheath. It’s a little stiff and lacks a cable cinch but in my experience these cables tend to be quite durable. Strain relief on the I-shaped 3.5mm plug is average, and there is no external relief on the housings. There are no external L/R markings, either, but the mic makes the right side of the earphones easy to identify
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – With the stock bi-flange tips or Shure Olives the isolation is very good – the tiny A31s fits in the ear canal very snugly
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; low when worn cable-up
 Comfort *(5/5)* – It is very difficult to convey just how tiny the A31s is – its disc-shaped housings are barely large enough for a small dynamic driver, making it one of the smallest earphones in my collection. I found that the included eartips run a size small as well – normally I use mediums, but in this case only the largest tips sealed. The design of the stock single-flange tips is somewhat similar to the Westone STAR tips, which is good, but the deep-sealing bi-flange tips may take some getting used to for those not accustomed to IEMs. Aftermarket Shure “Olive” memory foam tips also fit on the A31s’ nozzles and make for one of the most comfortable listening experiences among all IEMs.

Sound* (7/10)* – The Fidue A31s is a warm and smooth earphone – something along the lines of a (less bassy) Beats by Dre Tour 2.0. Its sound has little in common with Fidue’s higher-end A63 and A71 models, opting instead for heavier lows, a less forward midrange, and even less prominent treble.

The bass is impactful and extended, but suffers from mild bloat, with room for improvement in both texture and control. The bass of the A31s – especially the subbass – is more powerful than that of the Soundmagic E10, but quality is about on-par due to the more pronounced mid-bass hump of the E10.

Still, the A31 is not quite a basshead IEM – its low end is not as deep and powerful as that of the UBSOUND Fighter or the ridiculously bassy JVC HA-FR301. It is warmer than both, however, due to its less prominent treble.

The midrange of the A31s is not at all forward, as the mids of the higher-end A63 and A71 models tend do be. The rolled-off treble and large bass quantity result in some veiling, but also give the sound a very warm and rich tonal character. Neutral-sounding earphones near this price range invariably sound thinner and colder. Even the Astrotec AM-90 – a smooth earphone by balanced armature standards – sounds harsh and bright in comparison to the A31s.

In its price range, the clarity of the A31s is about mid-pack, maybe a touch below average, lagging slightly behind the Soundmagic E10 and the more mid-forward Brainwavz M1. Likewise, despite having more powerful bass, the pricier UBSOUND Fighter is a little clearer too, due in large part to being less rolled-off up top than the A31.

The treble of the A31 is very smooth and laid-back, but somewhat deficient in presence and extension for my taste. It lacks the brighter, crisper character of earphones such as the E10 and even the Brainwavz M1, the latter of which is not a bright-sounding earphone by any stretch. Treble-boosted earphones such JVC’s HA-FR301 Xtreme Xplosives are enormously harsher, bordering on unpleasant when used back-to-back with the more rolled-off A31.

The presentation is adequate, but hindered somewhat in width and dynamics by the rolled-off treble, tending to sound quite soft and lacking the air and openness of many higher-end sets. Soundstage width also lags behind sets with more treble presence, such as the E10 and UBSOUND Fighter.

*Select Comparisons*

Nuforce NE-600X ($15)

Nuforce’s entry-level NE-600X is a budget-minded bassheads’ delight. The Fidue A31s has less bass than the NE-600X, but bass quality is similar – both earphones sound a bit boomy. The A31s is tonally warmer and its sounds much smoother overall, whereas the NE-600X has greater treble presence and is more v-shaped in response. The extra treble energy of the Nuforce makes it sound clearer, but the A31s is smoother and can appear more natural as a result.

Tekfusion Twinwoofers ($40)

While definitely bass-heavy, the A31s has nowhere near the same amount of depth and impact as the appropriately-named Twinwoofers. The bass of the Twinwoofers is a touch more boomy, but still better than could be expected considering its sizable quantity boost. Despite the more emphasized bass, the midrange of the Twinwoofers is more forward and a little clearer. The A31s is muddier, but its treble is smoother. Tonally, the A31s may actually be more natural than the Twinwoofers, but the clarity gap is not easy to look past.

Fidue A63 ($60)

Fidue’s $60 A63 model is one of my recommended sets for a warmer sound in its price range. It’s an interesting earphone, providing a slight bass boost but still keeping its mids center-stage. The A31s is significantly bassier, boasting greater bass depth and impact, but less control. The tone of the A31s is even warmer than that of the A63, but its midrange is overshadowed somewhat by the low end. The A63 has significantly more midrange presence, resulting in more upfront vocals and instruments. It sounds clearer overall and its treble presence and extension are better, too. The A63 is still not a neutral earphone by any means, but compared to the warm and bassy A31s, it is pretty balanced.

Value *(8/10)* – Jumping into the competitive mid- and high-end in-ear earphone markets with their first few releases, the folks at Fidue have now taken a step back with the more consumer- (and wallet-) friendly A31s. The A31s offers a well-executed consumer sound signature – bassy, warm, smooth, and very non-fatiguing, albeit lacking somewhat in clarity and treble energy. Its largest asset is its small size, which, with the right eartips, makes it one of the most comfortable IEMs available at any price. Add to that the headset functionality, decent noise isolation, and the excellent easily-pocketable carrying case (one of my favorite cases, period), and the sum value is very good.* *

*Pros: Good noise isolation; impossibly tiny design is extremely comfortable, especially with foam eartips; warm, bassy, non-fatiguing sound*
*Cons: Deep-insertion tips may take some getting used to; rolled-off treble results in somewhat muddy audio*

 

*(3B44) Xiaomi Piston 3*
  

Reviewed June 2015

Brief: Third generation of Chinese electronics giant Xiaomi’s hit in-ear

MSRP: 99 RMB (approx. $16)
 Current Price: *$16 *from geekbuying.com 
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1′ I-plug w/mic & 3-button Android remote_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes); plastic box doubles as storage case with integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– The Piston 3 uses more plastic in its construction than the Piston 2 but still feels very solid and boasts various small usability improvements such as easier-to-see L/R markings and lower driver flex. The cable is similar to that of the older model – rubbery above the y-split and sheathed in nylon below to provide some resistance to tangling. The new remote is nice-looking but the narrow buttons are actually bit harder to use without looking compared to the previous version’s
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Isolation is average thanks to the shallow fit of the earphones
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Audible, but not bothersome when music is playing
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The Piston 3 is a large step forward in ergonomics over the older model, moving to a compact angled-nozzle design with strain reliefs that fully clear the outer ear, leading to a very comfortable fit

Sound* (8.2/10)* – The Xiaomi Piston 2 quickly became one of my favorite budget in-ears thanks to its ability to deliver good clarity, soundstaging, and overall refinement despite its plentiful bass. Combined with an extensive feature set (especially for Android users) and a very low price, this made the previous-gen Piston an unbeatable value.

The jump in sound quality from the original Piston to the Piston 2 was sizable – the first-gen model was bassier and had significantly poorer fidelity. Though the gap in overall sound quality between the 2nd and 3rd-gen Pistons is not as great, the new model maintains the trend toward a more balanced, less consumer-oriented sound. You will notice that aside from the Piston 2, the sets I compare the Piston 3 with are mostly in the $50-100 range – a fact that is itself a testament to the performance of the Xiaomi in-ears.

The bass of the Piston 3, while less enhanced than that of the Piston 2, remains quite punchy. Mid-bass impact is slightly lower than with some of the other not-quite-reference-flat earphones such as the VSonic VSD3S and Ostry KC06, but enhanced compared to flatter-sounding sets like the HiFiMan RE-400 and Etymotic MC5. Bass depth is pretty good as well, though sub-bass reach and presence lag a bit behind the VSD3S and VSonic’s higher-end GR07.

Like the previous model, the 3rd-gen Piston is tuned for a v-shaped sound. However, thanks to the tighter, less bloated bass, its mids are clearer despite not being very forward. With that said, they are still somewhat recessed and a touch muffled compared to higher-end, less v-shaped sets such as the KC06, RE-400, and GR07.

The Piston 3 picks up presence in the upper midrange and lower treble, giving it a cooler tone. It is a little less bright than the KC06, but more so than the RE-400, which tends to be very smooth and laid-back. Harshness and sibilance are generally not a problem – the Piston 3 is not as forgiving as the warmer-sounding models that preceded it, but it’s not as sibilant as any of the popular VSonic earphones, either.

The spaciousness of the Piston 2 is also preserved, though the lower bass quantity and cleaner, brighter sound of the Piston 3 makes its capable and precise presentation less surprising.

*Mini Comparisons*

Xiaomi Piston 2 ($20)

The Piston 3 offers a more balanced, less consumer-oriented sound than the model it supersedes. Its bass is significantly less enhanced and much tighter. In comparison, the bass of the Piston 2 is deeper and has more rumble and slam, but also sounds boomier. Cleaner bass with almost no bloat is actually the Piston 3’s biggest asset, though with the loss of bass quantity it also sacrifices some of the Piston 2’s appeal to the average listener.

On the whole, the sound of the Piston 3 is less colored than that of the older model. The upper midrange and treble are smoother. Clarity is better due to the tighter, less bloated bass, though it is still limited by the not-too-forward midrange positioning. The Piston 3 is also less sensitive than the older model, which fits with its less consumer-oriented sound because a non-audiophile listener is more prone to put value in both emphasized bass and the ability reach higher volumes more easily.

Technically, the Piston 3 is the better earphone – it is clearer, tighter, and more neutral. The Piston 2 is warmer and boasts bass that is deeper and more powerful which, admittedly, also helps it sound very dynamic and delivers a “wow” factor. As a result, it’s hard to call the Piston 3 a straight upgrade from the Piston 2 – it’s a more Hi-Fi earphone for sure, but I will still be recommending the Piston 2 in many situations and for certain genres. There are parallels here to the DUNU DN-1000 / DN-2000 situation, albeit with a greater magnitude of difference. There, the older DN-1000 model also provides a bassier sound and in many cases remains recommendable over the more expensive DN-2000.

Zipbuds PRO ($35)

The Zipbuds PRO are a surprisingly capable consumer-class earphone with a v-shaped sound profile. The main thing they do well is balance high bass quantity and good overall clarity. Indeed, the Piston 3 has significantly less bass but doesn’t gain any clarity over the Zipbuds. Its bass is tighter, however, and its highs are less bright and more smooth, making the Zipbuds appear overly harsh in comparison. On the whole, the Piston 3 is the more balanced and accurate-sounding earphone.

SteelSeries Flux In-Ear ($50)

The Flux In-Ear is the closest match I could find for the Piston 3 when balancing sound quality and sound signature. The SteelSeries unit is warmer and has smoother treble and a slightly wider presentation. It’s more sensitive, too. The Piston 3 is a bit more v-shaped and has a cooler, brighter tonal character. It sounds thinner, but also a little clearer. It’s hard to say one outperforms the other, but that in itself is a big win for the Xiaomi – only two years ago the Flux was one of the absolute best in-ears one could get for $50. Now, the Piston 3 offers the same level of performance – albeit with a slightly brighter tonal tilt – for 1/3 of that, with better build quality and a 3-button remote to boot.

Havi B3 Pro I ($60)

The dual-driver B3 Pro I is notable for having an even less consumer-friendly sound signature than the Piston 3, with lower bass impact and much lower sensitivity. The overall sound of the B3 is more balanced compared to the v-shaped Piston 3. The Piston is bassier, but the low end of the B3 is tighter and cleaner. The midrange of the Havi is clearer and more prominent while its upper midrange and treble are a bit more forgiving. The presentation is a bit more well-rounded on the B3 as well. Especially for those in search of balanced sound, the Havi is better than the Piston 3, but its low sensitivity and lack of bass enhancement limit its appeal in the mainstream.

Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear ($100)

The Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear is one the few earphones with 3-button Android remotes on the market besides the Piston line. It is also fairly similar to the Piston in how it fits in the ear, albeit with a slimmer profile and longer nozzles providing slightly better noise isolation. In terms of sound, the Momentum has a more colored, arguably more “fun” tuning than the Piston 3 but isn’t too far ahead in technical ability.

Both earphones have sound signatures on the v-shaped side of “flat” but the Momentum In-Ear unit offers up a warmer tone with better bass. Its bass delivers more depth and resolution while also making the Piston 3 seem a touch boomier in comparison. The mids of the Sennheiser unit are slightly clearer but it is a little more prone to sibilance and less forgiving on the whole. The Momentum’s presentation is slightly wider and more spacious.

Value *(10/10)* – The latest evolution of Xiaomi’s venerable Piston line once again succeeds in delivering outstanding sound quality with a solid construction and 3-button Android remote, all at a very low price. The biggest improvement this time around is in ergonomics – the new model is significantly more comfortable and unobtrusive than the previous Pistons.

Xiaomi has come a very long way since the original piston in terms of fidelity, too – while not a direct upgrade from the Piston 2 due to how different the tuning of the two earphones is, the Piston 3 provides a clearer, tighter, more balanced audio experience for those willing to trade away some of the previous model’s warmth and bass power. Going forward I can see myself recommending either of the two Piston variants, depending on the situation.

*Pros: Very comfortable fit; fantastic sound quality for the price; 3-button Android remote*
*Cons: Remote is a bit less user-friendly than previous generation; mediocre noise isolation*

 



*(3B45) Popclik Evolo*



Brief: The pricier of two in-ear earphones from Florida-based Popclik

MSRP: $29.99
 Current Price: *$30* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _95 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug w/mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear (preferred)*_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The first thing I noticed about the Evolo is the excellent size-to-heft ratio of the metal earpieces – they are just weighty enough to feel solid, yet still very unobtrusive in the ear, and wouldn’t be out of place on a pricier earphone. The narrow flat cable holds a single-button remote and terminated with a nice L-shaped plug. There is a bit of driver flex, however, and the cable doesn’t have a cinch
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good, very much usable outside and while commuting
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– The flat cable is relatively low in microphonics and doesn’t bounce around too much. Wearing the Evolo over-the-ear makes cable noise a non-issue
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings of the Evolo are lightweight, compact, and have smooth, rounded edges. For a straight-barrel, “bullet”-shaped earphone, this is about as ergonomic as it gets

Sound* (7.4/10)* – In the past year I’ve passed on reviewing most of the new earphones I’ve come across in the $30-and-under bracket simply because they don’t measure up in performance. I understand why, too – first, those shopping for an earphone in this price range likely won’t be audio enthusiasts. Second, every sub-$30 earphone boasts the same claims of “great bass” and/or “clear sound” regardless of actual performance. Combined with customers who simply don’t know good sound from “good” sound, this makes tuning earphones for better sound quality than the other guys a no-win proposition for manufacturers. To compete for shelf space against mainstream, high-volume products from the likes of Philips, Sony, and JVC, it makes more sense to focus on “tangible” things like packaging, features, and design, as well as various marketable gimmicks – Swarovski crystals, zipper cables, wooden housings, and so on.

The two earphones I’ve tried from Popclik, the Evolo and the String, do come in rather expensive-looking packaging and boast nice, well thought-out designs, but also don’t neglect performance, following a consumer-friendly “v-shaped” sound tuning that emphasizes the bass and treble. The Evolo is the more balanced of the two, but its bass quantity is still plentiful. It falls short of the Nuforce NE-600X, my basshead recommendation in this price range, but is greater compared to the Philips SHE3580, one of my typical recommendations for “v-shaped” sound. The bass of the Philips set is a little more linear and detailed while the Evolo has more of a conventional mid-bass emphasis. It’s a little light on texture, but not too bad, and easily recommendable as a more impactful alternative to the Philips.

The Evolo is on the whole more v-shaped than the SHE3580, as well as the warmer, more full-bodied Xiaomi Piston 2 and the newer, more balanced Piston 3. Midrange presence and clarity are not a strong suit but are sufficiently good for the price. Treble energy is good as well – similar to the SHE3580 in being energetic, but not excessive. The Evolo is not very tolerant of harshness, but I prefer this type of approach over the dull, rolled-off treble delivered by many other enhanced-bass sets in this price range. The presentation is alright as well – a little more forward and less spacious compared to the more balanced Piston 3, but pretty good compared to other in-ears with similar levels of bass boost.

*Select Comparisons*

Popclik String ($25)

The String and Evolo are similarly-priced and arguably differ more in form factor and design than they do in sound, with the Evolo being metal-shelled and outfitted with a flat cable and L-shaped plug, and the String being plastic with a conventional cable, angled nozzles, and an I-plug.

Both earphones follow v-shaped sound signatures, with elevated bass and treble providing a lively, energetic sort of sound. The pricier Evolo is a little more balanced on the whole, trading off some of the String’s extra bass for a flatter, marginally less v-shaped sound. The String offers stronger and slightly deeper bass, warmer tone, and more full-bodied sound. It has a bit more treble energy as well, but its highs are less forgiving and a touch more sibilance-prone. The brighter sound helps the String sound clearer than the Evolo despite the slightly more recessed mids, and the overall presentation is more dynamic and engaging. All in all, the combination of greater clarity and more bass offered by the String is very impressive, but the two Popclik earphones are close enough in performance that the design differences between them can be the deciding factor, and the Evolo certainly has the more refined design.

Brainwavz S0 ($45)

The S0 and Evolo are remarkably similar IEMs, from the size, shape, and fit of their housings to the metal construction and flat cables, right down to the flatter sound each earphone offers compared to its siblings (the S1 and S5 in the case of the S0, and the String in the case of the Evolo).

When compared to the S0, the Evolo follows a more v-shaped sound tuning with the bass quantity being the biggest difference. The Popclik unit offers significantly deeper and more powerful bass, making the Brainwavz sound a little gutless in comparison – not a huge surprise as bass really isn’t the S0’s strong suit. However, the Evolo also becomes muffled and congested more easily on bass-heavy tracks, giving the S0 a small edge in clarity.

Value *(8/10)* – Though based in Florida, Popclik was until recently focused largely on the Latin America market, which does not enjoy the variety of IEM options we have in the US, for marketing and sales. That may seem like a great excuse for mediocrity, but the performance and design of the Popclik IEMs are anything but.

The Evolo offers a conventionally “v-shaped” sound signature that offends with neither excessive bass emphasis nor overly bright and harsh treble. The design is quite handsome, too, and the overall package is much more refined than I expect to see at this price, from the fancy box to the compact and comfortable metal housings and two-tone flat cable. All in all, it is priced very well for a metal-shelled IEM with headset functionality and good sound.

*Pros: Nice, giftable packaging; solid performance for the price; comfortable earpiece design*
*Cons: Mild driver flex; sound of less expensive String model has more “wow” factor*


----------



## ljokerl

*Tier 3A ($30-60)*
  
  
*(3A1) RadioPaq Jazz*


Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: One of the four RadioPaq IEMs ‘acoustically tuned’ for different genres
 Current Price *£30* from AdvancedMp3Players.co.uk (MSRP: £60.00)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _120 dB_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cord: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock tips, VSonic $2 foamies_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Metal housings have a very solid feel and classy looks. Metal nozzle is very sturdy although the lack of filters is pretty odd-looking. Cabling is strong but plasticky and a cable cinch is nowhere to be found
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Fat housings make it difficult to get a deep seal but they can isolate well even with stock tips if a good fit is achieved
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Pretty average when worn cord-down, much better over-the-ear
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – Shells are quite large and weighty. Insertion is shallow and they can sometimes break seal or even fall out, requiring re-insertion. If inserted deeply enough the edges of the housings can hurt ears

 Sound *(6.8/10)* – Sound is warm and dynamic. Definitely cannot be called analytical, but can be more fun than the proverbial barrel of monkeys. Soundstage is just a bit wider than average but instrumental separation is quite good. The high end boasts good extension and plenty of detail for a budget-oriented dynamic IEM but has some peaks. The mids also boast good detail and clarity but are somewhat recessed compared to the bass and treble. They need a very good seal for the optimal bass experience, but can be incredibly deep and smooth. Bass often feels layered over the mids rather than integrated, yielding a pretty unique sound signature. The treble can be slightly hot-tempered on some tracks but remains sibilance-free nevertheless.

 Amplification – not required to enjoy the smooth, easy-going sound. However, a good neutral amp will bring out more detail and make the Jazz more accurate and balanced all-around performers.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The Jazz is a very interesting earphone at its price point. It provides a big, powerful, smooth, and warm sound that keeps it true to its name, and does all this at a bargain-basement price. Should be especially high on the short-list for European Head-Fiers who may have an easier time acquiring one of these than, say, a Nuforce or Maximo product. Price fluctuates wildly, so adjust accordingly. At the lowest-to-date £27 price, these are nothing short of unbeatable.

*Pros: Good looking, sturdy, lots of fun, excellent bass and very smooth-sounding overall
 Cons: Lacks accessories, large size can lead to fit issues*
  
  
*(3A2) Nuforce NE-6 / NE-7M*


Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: Long-time head-fi favorite budget dynamic earphone
 Current Price*: *N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $39); $49 for NE-7M with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _12 Ω _| Sens:_ 100 dB_ | Freq: _20-22k Hz_ | Cord: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Comply T400, Soundmagic Bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Pleather carrying pouch and silicone single-flange tips (three sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Shell is made out of plastic with a metal insert. It feels fairly solid but there are numerous reports of shell splitting at the metal/plastic interface, which happened to my set as well
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Fairly deep fit for solid isolation. Comply tips help further
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Very low when worn over-the-ear, but still not too bad otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Straight-barrel IEM with a fairly long body. Stemless design very conducive to over-the-ear fit

 Sound *(6.1/10)* – Not always pitch-perfect but still lots of fun, the NE-7M is smooth, with slight treble roll-off and a voluminous bottom end. Despite the good overall balance, somewhat long decay times at the bottom end give the impression of greater bass quantity. The low end does extend quite deep, though with a noticeable mid-bass emphasis. The midrange is smooth and enjoyable, boasting good clarity and realistic tone. The highs are not too detailed but also not at all fatiguing, rolling off gently near the very top. Overall the sound is a little too colored for my liking but I am sure there are many head-fiers who will find their perfect budget earphone in the NE-6.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – Though not in a field of its own like it was a year ago, the Nuforce NE-6 and NE-7M are still safe choices in the $50 range. They do nearly everything right and manage to retain the fun factor without significant sacrifices to SQ. And let’s not forget Nuforce’s excellent customer service.

*Pros: Comfortable, low microphonics, very solid sound characteristics
 Cons: May be too colored for some, not too strong in the highs, common build issues*


*(3A3) JVC HA-FX300 “Bi-Metals”*
  

Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: JVC’s mid-range IEM featuring a bi-metal construction
 Current Price: *$50* from Amazon.com (MSRP: $99.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _8-25k Hz _| Cord: _3.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T400_
 Wear Style:_ Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Egg-shaped hardcase and asymmetric silicone single-flange tips (three sizes)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Very solid all-metal housing; cabling is identical to the low-end JVC models, which is a bit disappointing at this price point
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Not designed for deep insertion but the included asymmetric tips do a good job of compensating for the shallow fit. Foamies work better still.
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low due in part to forced over-the-ear design. Same cabling as other JVC models
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Shells sit in the ear nicely, but could be too large for some. Insertion can be challenging due to the round housing and the way the nozzle is angled

 Sound *(4.3/10)* – Medium-size soundstage with very good positioning. Sound is slightly cold and metallic, but very dimensional and can be quite fun. Unfortunately, it can also be very tiring with hard rock and metal. Good high-end extension and detail, but treble can sound artificially sharp, especially with silicone tips. I believe the proper term is ‘edgy’. The mids also boast good detail and clarity but are somewhat hollow-sounding and metallic, making the whole midrange sound recessed. The bass is punchy, but not very powerful, missing the ‘oomph’ of some other phones. Accuracy is good but extension could be better.

 Value *(6.5/10)* – At $50, the FX300s are another solid earphone from JVC, but as with the lower-end models better options can sometimes be had for the price. Sound can be characterized as somewhat bright and aggressive, sometimes harsh. Foam tips help tone down the timbre a bit. Not recommended for hard rock and metal listeners.

*Pros: Solid construction, comfortable, low microphonics, good detail and clarity
 Cons: Slightly bright with odd peaks in frequency response, can be tiring*


*(3A4) MEElectronics M11*


Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: New MEElectronics flagship. A version with a microphone is also available.
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $44.99)
 pecs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω _| Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4.6’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock Bi-flanges, Soundmagic PL30 Foamies_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or Straight down_

 Accessories* (4.5/5)* – Hard clamshell carrying case, cord wrap, airplane adapter, shirt clip, and single- (three sizes), bi-, and tri-flange silicone tips
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – For the price, the build is sublime. Housing is all-metal and has a very solid and weighty feel while at the same time maintaining a feel of being delicately machined. The cable is the same thick and flexible design found on all Meelec IEMs. The only issue with my (silver) set is that the L/R markings printed in a tiny white font are nearly impossible to see under certain lighting.
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The housing is very narrow and they lend themselves well to deep insertion. However, they sound better inserted shallowly with the bi-flanges or foam tips and still isolate quite well
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nearly non-existent whether worn cord-up or cord-down
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – This is about as good as conventional straight-barrel IEMs get. The housing is tiny but easy to grip when inserting/removing

 Sound *(4.4/10)* – A more conventional sound signature than the M6 and M9, the M11 is smooth, thick, and intimate but lacks the detail and refinement of the M6. Sound is very dependent on the tips used. Soundstage is lacking but positioning is precise. Certain tips (e.g. Comply foams) can make it sound distant and uninvolving. Good high-end extension but too laid back for my taste. The mids are a little warm, but still very pleasant. Bass is smooth and powerful with a fair amount of reach and decent definition. Overall, they are smoother, warmer, and darker compared to the M6. They would be an interesting alternative but some of the detail and all of the sparkle is lost in the differences.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – At $36, the M11 is a competitive entry. While slightly below the older M6 SQ-wise, its extreme user-friendliness and stellar build quality make it worth a look. It is one of the most well-designed IEMs I have encountered, and we can only hope that MEElectronics can keep improving their lineup to breed even more well-rounded earphones.

*Pros: Outstanding build quality, no microphonics, good bass
 Cons: Not as resolving or detailed as the M6*


*(3A5) Soundmagic PL50*
  

Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: Soundmagic’s flagship IEM and first Armature-based design
 Current Price: *$55 *from Focalprice.com (MSRP: $55)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _ 55.5 Ω_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq: _15-22k Hz _| Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 4mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Hard carrying case, a set of over-the-ear cable guides and a large selection of single-flange silicone and foam tips
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Housings are tiny and very, very light. The cables are fairly thick, rubberized, and feature articulated strain reliefs at the y-joint and an L-plug. An early batch had problems with removing the stock foam tips, which sometimes resulted in splitting, but this has been resolved.
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Not bad at all but the design does not allow a very deep fit
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent
 Comfort *(5/5)* – With properly-fitting tips these are some of the most comfortable IEMs out there. The tiny size and low profile make it easy to forget about them

 Sound *(6.9/10)* – The sound signature of these is a little different from most of the other IEMs I’ve tried in the price range. Instead of focusing specifically on the bass, the highs, or both, the PL50’s single balanced armature surprises with the smoothness and evenness of response across its entire (rather wide) frequency range. Extension on both ends is quite a bit better than average – on par, if not better than, the better dynamics, which is surprising for a single armature setup, especially at such a low price point. I can see some people finding them bass light, and truly they don’t have any significant humps in the low-end response, but it is very detailed and can be felt as well as heard. Same goes for the highs – just a tiny bit of sparkle, no emphasis. If I had to attribute a term to these, I would call them mid-centric just because nothing draws attention away from the silky-smooth, liquid midrange. Soundstage is above average, but not as airy as the lower-end PL30. Imaging, however, is superb – easily as good as it gets for the price. Overall, the sound they produce is very, very effortless. They are one of the least tiring earphones to listen to in my experience and also very forgiving of poor source material.

 Amping: Good if it can be used as a hardware equalizer (i.e. a Fiio E5 with bass boost for those craving more bass), but these are quite efficient and don’t need one in general. They do respond very well to software equalization and can be molded to fit individual preferences quite well.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – With their unbeatable comfort, excellent accessory set, low microphonics, good build quality, and smooth sound I find very hard to find any cons whatsoever in these for the price. The sound may not be for everyone, but for what they offer they are incredible. I do recommend using them with Sony Hybrid tips, which add about $10 on top of the price but color the sound less than stock foamies and seal better than stock silicone tips.

*Pros: Astonishingly comfortable, useful accessory pack, very practical, excellent sound
 Cons: Laid back, mid-centric sound signature may be boring to some*

 More Impressions can be found here


*(3A6) Cyclone PR1 Pro*
  

Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: Discontinued IEM from Chinese manufacturer Cyclone, succeeded by the PR100 and PR200 under their new ECCI brand
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $55)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq: _20-22k Hz _| Cable: _4.3’ I-plug *j-cord*_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange tips, small clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Housing is made of metal and sturdy plastic. Metal filters are nice but the lack of strain reliefs is a cause for concern
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Ported but still adequately isolating, especially with bi-flange tips; slightly susceptible to wind noise
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nearly non-existent
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Very typical of straight barrel IEMs. I find them light and comfortable. J-cord can be a bother

 Sound *(7.4/10)* –These have a very natural presentation. The soundstage is very wide and airy, with good positioning and separation. They have tremendous clarity across the range and the level of detail they put out, though not on-par with the RE0, is impressive. They have very gradual roll-off at both ends, which results in well-controlled high and low notes. No harsh treble or bass bloat here. I like the bass especially – it can go down pretty deep, but it never imposes and always stays musical. Their unique, gentle signature really agrees with me and works especially well with live recordings, acoustic music, and anything else that can take advantage of the incredible soundstage.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The PR1 Pro is stellar value for money when it comes to audio quality. The unique sound signature alone makes them worth the price of admission = there is nothing else in their category that can match the wide open feel of these Unfortunately, the j-cord can be bothersome and many similarly-priced sets offer better build quality.

*Pros: Wide, airy sound, great clarity and instrumental separation, comfortable
 Cons: Lack strain reliefs on the cords, j-corded*

 Full review can be found here

 More impressions and a comparison to several competitors can be found here


*(3A7) Skullcandy TiTan*


Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: Skullcandy’s latest creation hailed by HeadRoom as a 5-star value
 Current Price: *$30* from amazon.com (MSRP: $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz _| Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Mesh clamshell case, single flange silicone tips (Medium), and 2 pairs of Comply T400 foamies. I don’t understand the case since it protects from neither significant impact nor dust
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Housings are metal and look pretty solid but still somehow feel cheap. The biggest problem is the “strain reliefs” on housing entry – they are made out of a hard, sharp-edged plastic that’s bound to damage cables over time. The strain relief on the plug isn’t much better. Cabling is a little thin but nicely rubberized and doesn’t tangle much.
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Ported; comply tips help isolation quite a bit
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Very microphonic when worn straight-down. Over-the-ear is fine though
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – The big metal bulge on the housings hurts my ears after I wear them cable down for more than an hour. Over-the-ear is much better but I still prefer straight-barrel designs

 Sound *(4.1/10)* – The sound is tolerable. As expected, bass is their focus. I don’t mind big bass when it’s done right, but the Titans are only halfway there. While an improvement over the Ink’d, the bass is still fairly muddy, fat, and slow. The treble is harsh with the stock silicone tips but can be toned down a little with the (included) Comply T400 foamies. The mids are somewhat dry and can boast some clarity but very little detail. Though terms such as “soundstage” and “positioning” are not applicable here, these don’t sound anywhere near as flat as the Ink’d buds – in fact, they are quite full-sounding and dimensional with that massive bass impact - but they are still very confused about where and how far away things are.

 Value *(5/10)* – They may well be the best-sounding earphone Skullcandy has ever made, but in pure sound quality they are easily beaten by other manufacturers’ similarly-priced offerings. Still, they are a step in the right direction from the Ink’d and FMJ and I am sure that like any Skullcandy product these will often receive massive markdowns, raising their relative value. Do keep in mind that they sound much better with the included Comply tips, replacing which can become costly very quickly.

*Pros: Big bass, included Comply tips
 Cons: Big bass, harsh treble, painful and microphonic when worn cable-down, longevity concerns*

 Full review can be found here


*(3A8) Apple Dual-Driver IEMs (ADDIEM)*


Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Apple’s ‘premium’ earphone; one of the cheapest dual-armature IEMs on the market
 Current Price: *$57 *from bhphotovideo.com (MSRP: $79.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _23 Ω_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq: _5-21k Hz_ | Cable: _4.6’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_4 mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids, Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes) and plastic case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The front parts of the housings are metal while the rear parts are plastic. Earphones feel well-put together but the cabling is thin and generic. Attention to detail is impressive – Filters can be removed for cleaning, L/R markings are easier to read than most, and the three sets of tips are labeled with their sizes
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Average isolation; quite reasonable for my commute
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Slightly present when worn straight down; very low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are very small and light. The long stem makes it a little awkward to wear them cord-up but the fit is absolutely effortless cord-down

 Sound *(6.5/10)* – The sound is analytical and highly detailed. The dual armatures can really dissect a piece of music into fine details and still manage to maintain coherency. The clarity is outstanding for the price and the whole signature is a bit relaxed. I really like the sound these put out – the treble and upper mids are very crisp, the bass is fairly tight and doesn’t creep up, and instrumental separation is good. The mids are nowhere near as liquid as those produced by the other budget BA phone in my possession – the Soundmagic PL50 – and soundstaging is pretty average. They might sound a little “thin” to some but that’s inherent to the signature – for an analytical signature on a budget I can’t find much fault with them.

 Value *(8/10)* – At the MSRP there are certainly other options out there. However, at the common ebay price of ~$35 these are an excellent earphone to be had. They make a lot of the competition sound muddy and congested but at the same time aren’t cold enough in tone to turn off the average listener. The well-thought-out, tiny housings make these a pleasure to use and the functionality doesn’t lag far behind the ergonomics.

*Pros: Nice design touches, very comfortable, some of the crispest sound to be had, iPhone controls may be handy for apple users
 Cons: Included case can be a pain to use, hard to wear over-the-ear, may be bass-light for some*


*(3A9) Maximo iMetal iM-390 / iP-HS3*


Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Maximo’s entry-level earphone
 Current Price: *$33 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $39.99); $35 for iP-HS3 with mic
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _18-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Hard carrying case with cable winder, 3.5mm to 2.5mm adapter, 2’ extension cable, airline adapter, and single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Housings are metal and feel pretty solid. The biggest problem is the lack of strain relief on housing entry. The cabling itself is on the plasticky side as well, but doesn’t seem too thin. A cable cinch is auspiciously missing and driver flex often rears its ugly head.
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Slightly above average isolation even with stock silicone tips
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Present when worn straight-down but much better over-the-ear
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – The big metal bulge on the housings hurts my ears after I wear them cable down for more than an hour. Over-the-ear is much better but I still prefer straight-barrel designs

 Sound *(4.6/10)* – The sound of the iM-390 is fairly run-of-the-mill as far as budget dynamic-driver IEMs go. It is lively, punchy, and warm. The warmth can sometimes cause the tonality of instruments to be a bit unrealistic and the overall lack of detail doesn’t help, but other than that I don’t find them lacking in anything. The tight, impactful bass is fun; the soundstage is about average and features decent positioning; the balance doesn’t seem biased much in any direction, though the treble is slightly recessed. An enjoyable signature overall, and one that bests the similarly-priced and similar-looking Skullcandy Titans in my book.

 Value *(6/10)* – With a solid set of accessories, decent build quality, and good overall sound the Maximo iM-390 is a competitive earphone in its category. However, the $33 street price is too close to that of Maximo’s higher-end earphone, the iM-590, which bests the iM-390 in every way. I can’t help but feel that the iM-390 would be better off competing at a lower price point, not because it can’t run with the big dogs, but because it’s being pummeled by its own big brother.

*Pros: great accessory pack, good sound
 Cons: driver flex, can be uncomfortable when worn cable-down*


*(3A10) Maximo iMetal iM-590 / iP-HS5*


Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Maximo’s current flagship and one of my long-time favourite sub-$50 IEMs
 Current Price: *$42 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $59.99); $55 for iP-HS5 with mic
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _18-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5mm _| Preferred tips: _stock fused bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Hard carrying case with cable winder, 3.5mm to 2.5mm adapter, 2’ extension cable, airline adapter, shirt clip, and fused bi-flange silicone tips (4 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The metal housings, nylon-sheathed cable, and molded rubber strain reliefs all give the iM-590 a quality feel. There is a bit of driver flex and the rubber molding could potentially become detached from the metal, but overall the iM-590s really feel like a quality product. The cable has a tendency to kink (even more than most nylon cables) but doesn’t tangle much
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Quite decent with the fused bi-flanges and can be improved slightly with a simple mod (all credit to ClieOS)
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Microphonics are present when worn straight-down but nearly unnoticeable when worn over-the-ear. The included shirt clip helps as well
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The driver-containing bulge on the housing is smaller and farther from the nozzle than on the lower-end iM-390. It is also concealed by the unique fused bi-flange silicone tips and as a result does not cause discomfort. Aside from the bulge they are relatively thin straight-barrel IEMs and are fittingly comfy

 Sound *(6.6/10)* – The iM-590 first impressed me many months ago when I used a set as my primary day-to-day IEMs. I am glad to say that despite my now having a much larger IEM stable and far more experience under my belt, the iM-590 still sounds just as good today. The sound is smooth, natural, and very detailed. The neutrality of the iM-590 is uncanny when compared to the majority of the competition, yet they still manage to remain fun and involving. The bass is tight, precise, and just right in quantity. It is also quite deep and will go below 40Hz rolling off only slightly. Actually, extension on both ends is quite impressive – nearly as good as the RE0 on the bottom and pretty respectable at the top. The mids are realistic and well-positioned. The entire sound is quite wide and airy, with impressive clarity and good separation. The highs are fairly crisp and as clear as the rest of the range. If there’s one bone to pick with these is that they can be a tiny bit sibilant at high volumes due to some spikes in the upper mids/lower treble, but other than that they are an excellent choice for anyone looking for a more analytical sound from an IEM.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – With an excellent accessory pack, solid build quality, and an extremely balanced and enjoyable sound the Maximo iM-590 remains one of my favorite sub-$50 in-ears. They are a downright stellar value for money and have only small flaws – a bit of driver flex, a kink-prone cable, and slight microphonics – that keep them from beating out the Meelectronics earphones and the Soundmagic PL50s in user-friendliness. What I like most, though, is the innovation that went into the design of the iM-590s – from the unique housings to the fused biflange tips to the combined split-slider/shirt clip, the iM-590s seem anything but formulaic in the crowded land of budget earphones.

*Pros: great accessory pack, great sound quality, solid build quality and comfort
 Cons: some driver flex, need to be worn over-the-ear due to microphonics, cable can kink*


*(3A11) Zune Premium Headphones V2*


Reviewed Dec 2009
  
 Details: Microsoft’s answer to the ADDIEMs – a ‘premium’ earphone for the Zune
 Current Price: *$40 *from Radioshack (MSRP: $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Velvet carrying pouch and single flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The housings are made of a lightweight matte plastic. While there are no technical flaws in the molding, I struggle not to call them downright cheap-feeling. The magnets in the housings are a nice touch and help keep the earphones neat. The cloth-wrapped cords are a redeeming factor but the lack of proper strain reliefs makes one wonder how long they will last
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Surprisingly good for a low-end dynamic IEM
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Present when worn straight-down but unnoticeable when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3/5)* – The hous/iings are extremely light and can be worn either cord-up or cord-down. People with smaller ears may have trouble getting a good seal with these, but I like them just fine

 Sound *(4.2/10)* – The most surprising thing about the sound produced by the Zune buds is just how nondescript the signature is. The sound is quite balanced and neutral – really very inoffensive. The bass is there and neither lacking nor excessive. The treble is neither shrill nor sparkly. I like the fact that these aren’t mainstream-oriented bass cannons but still manage to be fun at times. Clarity is quite good but they could certainly be more detailed. The presentation is also a bit two-dimensional (not much depth), sometimes resulting in a ‘flat’ sound, but the stereo cues are still very easy to grasp. Overall the Zune buds are good performers but lack a musical ‘personality’ that would differentiate them from the competition.

 Value *(5/10)* – While the Zune buds are respectable performers as far as low-end aftermarket earphones go, the $50 MSRP is not justified by the mediocre build and plain sound. At $20 the Zune buds would be top competitors. At the current price, the magnets just feel like a gimmick designed to drive up the value of an otherwise mediocre product.

*Pros: Inoffensive, balanced sound; magnets are handy for storage
 Cons: currently overpriced, mediocre build*


*(3A12) Klipsch Custom 1*


Reviewed Jan 2010
  
 Details: Klipsch’s budget single-armature earphone
 Current Price: *$60 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $129.99)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _30 Ω_ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _12-19k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 3.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) tips, cleaning tool, and hard carrying case
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The housings are rubber-covered plastic and quite well-made. The memory wire acts as a strain relief and the y-split and L-plug are both very impressive. The cabling, however, is atrocious. It kinks and tangles endlessly and would be the bane of my existence if these were my primary earphones
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The long, steeply angled nozzles allow the C1 to be inserted quite deeply with smaller tips, resulting in impressive isolation.
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Quite unpleasant despite these being worn over-the-ear and having a ‘memory wire’ configuration
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Can’t fault the Customs here – they fit in the ear rather snugly and unobtrusively, not unlike the JVC AirCushions. Persons with smaller ears may find them harder to wear

 Sound *(4.7/10)* –If the frequency response rating of the Custom 1 is to be believed, the single armature is tuned slightly towards the low end to combat the usual bass-light nature of single-armature setups. Bass is indeed present and fairly extended but lacks punch and texture. It’s very tight but too cold for my liking and lacks presence. The midrange is where the strengths of the Custom 1 lie – it’s clear, articulate, smooth, and very musical. Vocals are airy, have good tonal balance, and are well-positioned in the medium-sized stage. Getting up into the high end, though, the C1s again stray away from my expectations. The treble lacks detail and sparkle, as well as dimensionality - the high end is where these quite literally fall flat for me. They can also be unpleasantly bright and edgy, bringing out harshness/sibilance in some tracks. The low impedance of these also results in high amounts of hiss with some amps and sources when running them without an adapter.

 Value *(6.5/10)* – The current price point of the Klipsch is about right for them to be mildly competitive. The MSRP is excessive for the lackluster sound these single armatures put out. The atrocious cabling helps seal their place in earphone mediocrity but the quirky treble is the real downfall for me. While by no means bad earphones, they just don’t stack up to my many of the dynamics in the price range and can be extremely fatiguing with much of my hard rock and metal. Lovers of vocal genres may want to give these a go but the rest of us would likely do better to pass.

*Pros: Comfortable, well-isolating, lush and airy midrange
 Cons: Downright awful cabling, excessive microphonics, presence of hiss, lackluster bass & treble*


*(3A13) VSonic R02ProII*


Reviewed Feb 2010
  
 Details: The last earphone released by large Chinese OEM VSonic before the company split
 Current Price: *$40* from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _24 Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _12-25k Hz _| Cable: _4.3’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, pleather carrying pouch, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The bare housings are shared with the Cyclone PR1 Pro and Lear LE01+ but with an additional rubber strain relief on cord entry. The cabling is different as well – the Teflon-coated silver cable is soft, smooth, tangle-resistant, and has just enough memory character to make it easy to manage
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Very adequately isolating for a ported dynamic IEM, especially with bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – The silver cable doesn’t conduct much noise and the included shirt clips helps
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Quite comfortable when worn straight down but the long strain reliefs prevent over-the-ear wear. Can be inserted fairly deeply with the biflange tips.

 Sound *(6.4/10)* – The R02ProII is the last revision of VSonic’s flagship released before the company split up. Though VSonic is an OEM for quite a few earphones in this lineup, the sound signature of the R02 is unique, featuring an intimate soundstage and a decidedly in-head sound. The low end is impactful and surprisingly extended. Mid-bass is emphasized slightly but doesn’t throw off the balance. It does creep up slightly on the lower midrange, giving the sound some coloration. The mids are slightly warm and quite full. Both the midrange and treble are extremely smooth – definitely no sibilance here. Extension at the high end is better on the Cyclone PR1 and the Head-Direct RE2, but not by much. The smoothness also ends up glossing over some of the fine detail but the overall sound is very ‘likeable’, beating the far more popular Nuforce NE-6 and Head-Direct RE2 in my book.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The R02ProII falls in the same price category as the Cyclone PR1 but offers a very different sound – intimate, bassy, and slightly warm. It’s a very dynamic and likeable earphone and the revised build addresses the issues I had with the PR1, with proper strain reliefs all around and excellent cabling. For those in search of an all-around budget earphone with a slightly warm midrange and solid bass punch the R02ProII should be in the running.

*Pros: Balanced, intimate, and slightly warm sound; excellent cabling
 Cons: L/R markings hard to see, no cord cinch, susceptible to wind noise*

 More impressions and a comparison to several competitors can be found here


*(3A14) Music Valley SP1*


Reviewed Feb 2010
  
 Details: First model from Chinese manufacturer Music Valley, promisingly dubbed ‘Silver Prologue One’
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $55)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _39 Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _10-26k Hz _| Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Soundmagic Single Flange, Faux Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Imitation Sony Hybrid tips (3 sizes), Soundmagic-style foamies, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Made completely out of plastic and with a cheap-feeling plasticky cable the SP1 does not impress. Lack of strain reliefs does not help
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Oddly-shaped housings make isolation somewhat mediocre. Nozzle is not angled as it is on the similarly-shaped JVC HA-FXC50
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Can be bothersome when moving about
 Comfort *(3/5)* – My problem with these is the same as with the JVC HA-FXC50 – when the plastic process on the side of the housing is hooked into the antitragus of my ear the plastic strain relief hurts the bottom of my ear quite badly. I find them hard to wear for more than an hour at a time unless I use longer tips and flip the housings upside down

 Sound *(6.6/10)* – The sound of the SP1 does not disappoint - it is a very detailed and well-balanced earphone that falls just short of the Cyclone PR1 in overall clarity. Soundstaging is average but the sonic images are all where they need to be, with the vocals upfront and drums at the back. Bass is extended and tight with the right tips (fit is the limiting factor as the stock single-flange tips sound great but don’t seal for me). Low-end texturing is impressive and the quantity of bass makes low-end detail easier to distinguish than with the Cyclones. The mid-range is recessed slightly compared to the bass and on the dark side, but still quite lush and rich. Compared again to the Cyclones the midrange sounds thicker and more liquid at the expense of some of the clarity and instrumental separation, making them sound just a bit more congested. The treble is less extended and lacks sparkle. Overall, the SP1 are smooth and non-fatiguing, quite detailed, and with very punchy and well-behaved bass.

 Value *(6/10)* – Though the MV SP1 offer a wider soundstage and a bit more detail than the VSonic R02ProII, they lack the usability factor of the R02. I would prefer a more conventional housing, which would alleviate the mediocre comfort and isolation issues. A nicer cable would do wonders as well. With rumors of a new Music Valley model on the horizon, the sound of the Silver Prologue One makes me quite anxious to hear the successor.

*Pros: Smooth, dark, non-fatiguing sound
 Cons: hit-or-miss comfort, tangle-prone cable, no cord cinch, may sound too dark for some*

 More impressions and a comparison to several competitors can be found here


*(3A15) Lear Le01*


Reviewed Feb 2010
  
 Details: Entry-level earphone branded as a Lear and OEM’d by VSonic
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $35)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _20 Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _12-26k Hz _| Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(2/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(2/5)* – All-plastic version of the Cyclone PR1 Pro housing. No strain reliefs and the thin rubberized cable is quite tangle-prone
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Very adequate for a ported dynamic IEM, especially with bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nearly non-existent when worn over-the-ear; very low otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – All-plastic housing is weightless and can easily be worn cord-up or cord-down

 Sound *(5.8/10)* – The signature is quite flat and neutral but the tonal balance and texturing could be better. The Le01 are not bass-heavy earphones and lag slightly behind the Cyclones and other higher-end models in control and accuracy, sounding just a little boomy. Low-end extension isn’t quite on par with the VSonics and the Music Valleys. The midrange is forward in the average-sized soundstage and boasts good clarity, falling slightly behind the Cyclones. The treble is quite accurate and fairly extended, if somewhat grainy. All things considered I like the sound of the Le01. Considering the fact that it is a bottom-of-the-range earphone from a little-known Chinese company, the Le01 is a stellar performer.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – Despite the low-rent plastic build, the Lear Le01 is a good all-around earphone that lacks the smoothness and refinement of higher-end models. It is one of the better-balanced earphones in the price range and a clear upgrade from the usual Soundmagic/JVC budget crop. Despite the lack of emphasis on bass and/or treble the Le01 still manages to sound fun and full, which alone makes it worthy of consideration in this price range.

*Pros: Balanced and clear sound, very competent all-around
 Cons: tangle-prone cabling, no cord cinch, mediocre construction*

 More impressions and a comparison to several competitors can be found here


*(3A16) Lear Le01+*


Reviewed Feb 2010
  
 Details: ‘Pro’ version of the Le01, boasting better build quality and enhanced bass
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $50)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _40 Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _12-26k Hz _| Cable: _4.3’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, Soundmagic-style black foamies, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Same plastic/metal housing as the PR1 Pro and R02ProII but with half-length strain reliefs and the same thin, tangle-happy cord as the Le01
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Very adequate for a ported dynamic IEM, especially with bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nearly non-existent when worn over-the-ear; very low otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Just a bit heavier than the all-plastic Le01, the Le01+ is still a very comfortable IEM whether worn cord-up or cord-down

 Sound *(5.3/10)* – The Le01+, besides offering a better build than the Le01, “improves” on the sound by adding a large mid-bass hump to the sound signature. Though the mid-bass is downright overpowering at times, the tuning also improves low-end extension and the Le01+ can drop below an impressive 25Hz. The boom found in the bass of the Le01 is magnified by the hump, which is also large enough to creep up on the lower midrange and makes them sound a good amount warmer and darker than the Le01. The resulting sound smoothes over some fine detail and causes a loss in the crispness of the Le01 but provides for a less grainy and ‘plasticky’ overall sound. The change from the Le01 is personally not to my liking but the signature of the Le01+ is certainly a more popular one.

 Value *(6/10)* – The Le01+ is recommended only for die-hard bassheads. Tuned for the maximum possible mid-bass response, the resulting mountain of bass negatively affects mid-range detail, clarity, and separation. Though the sound becomes fuller and smoother, the drop in resolution is detrimental to my personal enjoyment of the earphones. I feel like the Le01 is more of an audiophile set despite its small flaws while the pricier and better-built Le01+ is geared toward the mainstream market.

*Pros: Bassy, smooth, and more organic-sounding than the Le01
 Cons: Mid-bass can be excessive, sound is not as clear and detailed as the Le01, tangle-prone cabling, no cord cinch*

 More impressions and a comparison to several competitors can be found here


*(3A17) Ankit Stay True*


Reviewed Mar 2010
  
 Details: New line of fashion-conscious IEMs from Ankit
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: N/A | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_3mm_| Preferred tips: _Jays Single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down*_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Weighty housings made of a thick, sturdy plastic with metal designs attached. Cable is fairly thick and rubberized to reduce tangling but lacks strain relief
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Insertion depth is quite good due to angled nozzles, yielding reasonable isolation
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nearly nonexistent
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Angled-nozzle design makes them quite comfortable for prolonged stretches

 Sound *(5.5/10)* – Ankit’s marketing mumbo-jumbo lauds something called ‘G-Bass Technology’, which is said to reduce low-end clipping and provide deep, clear bass. Unexpectedly, I found these claims to be true to a surprising extent. The bass response can occasionally be slightly boomy, but no more than certain head-fi favorites and certainly not enough to make the Ankits sound unbalanced, remaining taut and dynamic most of the time. Sub-bass extension is very reasonable although there is a mid/upper-bass emphasis that gives a small amount of coloration to the midrange. Vocals are slightly on the warm side of neutral. Clarity is good and the mids are lush and thick, though some microdetail is glossed over. Treble presentation is soft, almost timid, but at least they steer far clear of sibilance. There are some peaks in the lower treble but not enough to cause harshness. Soundstaging is average, with adequate width and depth and decent separation. Drums are sometimes brought too far forward for my liking, but for the most part everything is positioned properly in the sonic stage. Overall, the sound is natural and boasts good dynamics and a surprising amount of clarity, definitely an enjoyable signature, even if it is not one to be used for monitoring purposes.

 Value *(7/10)* – The Ankit Stay True earphones offer an ergonomic design, above-average isolation, solid build quality, and four unique visual styles. With sound quality to match their practicality, the Ankit earphones should not be dismissed as another blingy piece of jewelry for the Skullcandy generation. Smooth, natural, and very enjoyable, the sound is refined enough for these to be among IEMs to consider in the sub-$50 range. If turning heads is a priority alongside all of the usual concerns, the Ankit earphones might just beat out the best of the rest in the crowded market.

*Pros: Comfortable, reasonable isolation, almost zero microphonics, unique looks, engaging and natural sound
 Cons: Meager accessories, poor strain reliefs on cable*

 Full review can be found here


*(3A18) ECCI PR200*


Reviewed Mar 2010
  
 Details: The pricier of the two ECCI models currently on the market, the PR200 is related very closely to its lower-end PR100 sibling
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $45)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _55 Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock (wide-tube) single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Narrow-tube (3 sizes) and wide-tube (3 sizes) single-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and oversize clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Sturdy two-piece metal shells feel solid and are finished in a handsome gunmetal color with the model name etched on the front. The dark-grey TPE (Thermoplastic Elastomer) cable is thick and sturdy, with proper strain reliefs on cable entry and a functional cord cinch. Sadly, the translucent hard plastic sheath on the 3.5mm plug is more likely to damage to the cord than protect it, tainting an otherwise excellent build
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The extra long nozzles allow for deep insertion of the earphones, boosting isolation above what one would expect for a ported straight-barrel dynamic. On the downside, the bottom-facing vents make the earphones more susceptible than most to wind noise
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* –bothersome when worn cord-down; good otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The extra-long sound tube allows the earphones to be inserted deeply without pressing the wearer’s ear into the housings - a good thing as the front edges of the shells are rather sharp. Short strain reliefs and elongated bodies make the earphones easy to wear cord-up as well as cord-down. Either way they are quite comfortable for prolonged listening sessions

 Sound *(5.9/10)* – The sound of the PR200 is extremely similar to that of the lower-end PR100. It is similarly-balanced with tight bass, smooth mids, and relaxed treble. The differences between the two models are actually rather minute – the higher-impedance PR200 boasts better clarity, a smoother and more balanced frequency response, slightly better imaging, and deeper bass extension. It is also expectedly difficult to drive, requiring several more volume notches from my mp3 player and tightening up better with a portable amp than the PR100. The PR200 also exhibits no hiss with my netbook’s not-too-clean HPO while the 16Ω PR100 hisses slightly.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The ECCI PR200 is best summarized as a slightly-more-refined version of the cheaper PR100. Whether the price premium is justified is a personal preference. Make no mistake – the PR200 is the sonically superior earphone, but the competition is a bit stiffer at its price point than that of the PR100. If using the earphones with a not-so-clean source like a laptop or hissy DAP (e.g. Amp3), the PR200 is easily worth the extra money. But if the PR200 didn’t fit in my budget, I would not fret settling for the PR100.

*Pros: Good isolation and build quality, comfortable, balanced sound
 Cons: Microphonics can be bothersome*

 Full review can be found here.


*(3A19) Audio-Technica ATH-CK6*


Reviewed Apr 2010
  
 Details: Mid-range dynamic-driver earphone from Audio-Technica
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $59.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _15-28k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_N/A (Oval)_| Preferred tips: _Stock Single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), detachable ear inserts (3 styles), and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Housings are made of metal with oval-shaped plastic nozzles and paper filters. Though strain reliefs are excellent all-around, the cabling itself is hugely disappointing (especially coming from the excellent cables on the ATH-CK10) – thin, rubberized, and prone to kinking. The cable tangles itself into a ball of knots if you so much as think about it
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Poor due to shallow insertion and vented design
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Cable is too energetic and tends to bounce around a lot. Lack of cord cinch and shirt clip means these have to be worn over-the-ear to be usable
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Small, light housings make them very easy to wear. The rubber ear inserts can be used to further stabilize them but aren’t necessary

 Sound *(3.9/10)* – Unfortunately the ATH-CK6 is decidedly underwhelming when it comes to sound quality. The bass lacks extension, is boomy, and becomes somewhat muddy on dense tracks. There is no definite moment of impact, which results in drums sounding too soft and at times hollow. The midrange is veiled and vocals lack both presence and smoothness. Treble is harsh and tiring. The entire signature lacks clarity and resolution. On the upside, they don’t sound closed and soundstaging is better than average. A small consolation but it made listening to them for a few days bearable.

 Value *(3.5/10)* – I wanted to like Audio-Technica’s mid-range offering, I really did. But the ATH-CK6 suffers from mediocrity on all fronts, from isolation to sound to build quality. All things considered it’s just not a very strong competitor in an increasingly crowded field. The line is due for a refresh anyway and hopefully Audio-Technica will apply at least some of the design principles of their top-tier entries to the mid-range earphones.

*Pros: Very small, light, and comfortable
 Cons: Poor isolation, awful cable, no cable cinch, non-standard nozzle shape, mediocre sound*
  
  
*(3A20) ViSang R02 / Brainwavz ProAlpha*


Reviewed May 2010
  
 Details: ViSang’s budget-oriented model, familiar in both sound and appearance
 Current Price: *$40* from ebay.com (MSRP: $45)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _20 Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' I-plug __(note: latest version carries __45°-plug)_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock biflanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear *or straight down_
  
_Note: The mp4nation Brainwavz ProAlpha is identical to the R02 in every way except the 3.5mm plug (45-degree plug identical to that on the Beta Brainwavz is used on the ProAlpha)_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single- (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Generic IEM housings used by Cyclone/Lear/VSonic but with short functional strain reliefs. Cable is identical to that of the ViSang R03 – a twisted Cu-Ag alloy cord that is tough yet flexible but lacks a cable cinch and has some long-term memory character
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Very adequate for a ported dynamic IEM, especially with bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Slightly noticeable when worn cord-down, negligible otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Lighter than the R03 and very unobtrusive despite the slightly larger housings. Can easily be worn cord-up or cord-down. Work best with a relatively shallow fit

 Sound *(6.7/10)* – Like the R03, the R02 boast a full-bodied and weighty low end with an emphasis on mid- and upper bass. The low end is very smooth and calm, completely unobtrusive until called for. The tonal balance is slightly dark, with a warmed-up midrange and treble that is devoid of sparkle. The midrange is right where it needs to be, clean and clear and with no lack of emphasis. Detail is very good for the price, though the R02 is certainly no RE0, especially in the treble. Soundstage width is quite good and seems to be one of the areas in which the R02 has the R03 beat by a very narrow margin. Depth is similarly average, though instruments are very well-separated and imaged.

 The midrange transitions effortlessly into the treble becoming a bit more laid-back along the way. Treble smoothness is very impressive and extension is perfectly tolerable, though not class leading. The treble is never fatiguing – harshness and sibilance are terms the R02 is not familiar with. Overall, the treble of both ViSang earphones takes a backseat to the bass and mids, though I wouldn’t go so far as to call them recessed at the top. Like the R03, the R02 also surprise with their speed, which is very close to the much more expensive and very fast Monster Turbines, and natural timbre, which really puts most of the other sub-$50 earphones to shame.

 As for the differences between the two ViSang models, they are minute and most likely resulting from the different acoustic properties of their respective housings. The R03 sounds a little bit thicker and more ‘concentrated’ in tone, with the R02 sounding slightly more diffuse in comparison, with less immediate bass punch and more ethereal positioning. The R03 seems to place instruments with slightly more precision than the R02 but again the differences are extremely minute. I am sure there are head-fiers out there who would be able to tell the two apart without a direct comparison but I am not among them and the average consumer probably isn’t either.

 Value *(9/10)* – The ViSang R02 is more than just another high bang/buck contender for the best sub-$50 IEM title. With the release of the R02, ViSang has nearly undercut their own higher-end R03 model and really taken the sub-$50 bang/buck crown from the defunct Cyclone PR1 Pro. The sonic differences between the two ViSang models are small. What it comes down to is the generic housings used on the R02 versus the excellent metal shells of the R03. The R02 housings are slightly larger in volume and look a bit bigger in the ear. There are other small differences – such as the R02 being slightly susceptible to wind noise – but for many users I would expect the R02 to be the better deal. 

*Pros: Time-tested design, solid build quality, bi-flange tips included (unlike R03), solid sound quality
 Cons: Cord has a bit of memory character*
  
  
*(3A21) Woodees IESW101B*
  

Reviewed May 2010
  
 Details: Budget wooden earphone from Canadian car audio firm iConnects
 Current Price: *$42* from Amazon.com (MSRP: $69.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T/Tx400_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), shirt clip, and black velour drawstring pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The light housings don’t feel particularly solid next to other wooden earphones. The painted-on logos and L/R markings tend to rub off and the metal mesh filters are too small to cover the entire nozzle opening. The cable is thick and decently relieved but has a tendency to tangle
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Fairly average due to shallow fit
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Present when worn cord-down, very low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – While very light, the housings of the Woodees are actually rather large. Those with smaller ears may have trouble getting a good fit. Despite the long strain reliefs they can be worn comfortably over-the-ear

 Sound *(6.6/10)* – The sound of the IESW101B is quite similar to the Thinksound TS01. Compared head-to-head, the IESW101B are the more analytical earphone of the two. The bass is accented slightly but remains tight and punchy, with less extension but better linearity than the TS01. A slight bit of warmth is added to the midrange but bass bleed is kept to a minimum. Overall the mids are lush and smooth, not forward but not recessed, either. Detail and clarity are both on par with other sub-$50 IEMs and a bit more apparent on the Woodees than the Thinksounds. Towards the upper midrange/lower treble, the Woodees exhibit mild harshness/sibilance, accented by the brightness of the treble. Comply foam tips can help attenuate some of the treble peaks and bring a bit more balance to the sound. The upper-end extension of the Woodees is quite decent and the bright sound gives the illusion of even greater clarity and air. Soundstage width is quite good and instruments are evenly distributed, as opposed the competing Thinksounds, which boast better depth but a more intimate overall presentation.

 Value *(7.5/10) *– The IESW101B are excellent earphones in their price bracket. Though the build could be better, they still feel like a quality product and compete well against other sub-$50 earphones. The lively sound signature is a good compromise between the more analytical sound of earphones like the ADDIEM and Head-Direct RE2 and the ‘fun’ signatures of the Thinksound TS01, Nuforce NE-6, and Meelec M6. Best of all, the sound qualities ascribed to the Woodees by the iConnects marketing team are not fluff – wooden housings or not, these earphones deliver.

*Pros: Solid performance
 Cons: Sloppy build quality, large housings, slightly harsh-sounding*

 For a more in-depth review and comparisons to the Thinksound TS01 see here.


*(3A22) Thinksound TS01 / Thunder*


Reviewed May 2010
  
 Details: The cheaper of Thinksound’s two wooden IEMs, the TS01 boasts enhanced bass response over the higher-end Rain
 Current Price: *$45* from Amazon.com (MSRP: $74.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T/Tx400_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), shirt clip, and unbleached cotton drawstring pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The wooden housings are accented by machined-aluminum nozzles. Combined with the etched L/R markings and general attention to detail, the Thinksounds have a very upmarket feel. The short strain reliefs are functional and the rubberized cable, despite being rather thin, doesn’t tangle much. The 3.5mm I-plug is well-relieved and sturdy. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Fairly average due to massive rear vent
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Slightly bothersome when worn cord-down, very low worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings of the TS01 are very small and taper towards the rear, cradling snugly in the ear. The TS01 is one of the few straight-barrel IEMs I can actually sleep in, which says quite a lot. The short strain reliefs are conducive to cord-up fitment

 Sound *(6.5/10)* – Like the slightly cheaper Woodees IESW101B, the sound of the Thinksound TS01 is lush and full, with accented bass and warmed-up mids. The TS01 have better low-end extension, more convincing timbre, and better texturing than the Woodees, resulting in an even more full-bodied low end response. The hefty low end imparts a bit of coloration and warmth on the midrange, making it sound lush and sweet. The midrange is a bit veiled compared directly to the flatter and more even-sounding Woodees but in the context of the Thinksounds sound it is nothing to complain about. Like the Woodees, the Thinksounds exhibit some unevenness in the upper midrange and lower treble, leading to mild sibilance and a tiny bit of harshness. Occasionally the crack of a drum is really jarring with the TS01, more so due to the contrast with the extremely smooth and liquid nature of the bass and lower mids. Using foam tips helps soak up some of the roughness in the upper reaches. The treble is fairly prominent on the Thinksounds but not as bright as with the Woodees. The Thinksounds also boast impressive soundstage depth, resulting in a more ‘layered’ sound and greater dimensionality, but overall the TS01 is definitely an intimate-sounding earphone, which actually works rather well with the sound signature.

 Value *(8/10)* – Though retailing for full MSRP at their inception, the Thinksounds have since fallen to a much more reasonable price. With their enhanced bass response, warm midrange, and intimate presentation the TS01 present a very coherent sonic picture that’s sure to appeal not only to audiophiles but to casual music listeners as well. Very comfortable and surprisingly well-built, the TS01 also compete well on the functionality front. Thinksound’s environmental angle adds value to the proposition but even those who don’t care are still getting a great set of earphones at a reasonable price.

*Pros: Great aesthetics and attention to detail, solid performance, environmentally-friendly design & packaging
 Cons: Mild driver flex, can be slightly sibilant with silicone tips*

 For a more in-depth review and comparisons to the Woodees IESW101B see here.


*(3A23) Brainwavz M1*


Reviewed May 2010
  
 Details: Latest budget offering from mp4nation’s house brand
 Current Price: *$40* from mp4nation.net (MSRP: $40)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic biflanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear *or straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and hard clamshell case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* - Housings are identical to those used by the Cyclone PR1 Pro – light and sturdy but lacking strain relief. The cable is identical to that of the ViSang R02/R03 – a twisted Cu-Ag alloy cord that is tough yet flexible. Unlike the ViSang earphones, however, the Brainwavz are terminated with a sturdy 45-degree plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Very adequate for a ported dynamic IEM, especially with bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* - Slightly noticeable when worn cord-down but wearing them over-the-ear is easy and a shirt clip is included
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Lighter than the R03/M2 and very unobtrusive despite the slightly larger housings. Can easily be worn cord-up or cord-down. Work best with a relatively shallow fit

 Sound *(7/10)* – The sound of the Brainwavz M1 builds on the shared sound signature of the ViSang R03 and R02, which I’ve already reviewed at length. The 32Ω impedance of the M1 seems to be the major change from the R03/R02 specs. Aside from needing a bit of extra volume to achieve the same SPL as the R02/R03, the most noticeable thing about the sound of the M1 is that the bass is rather underemphasized compared to the ViSang earphones. They are by no means bass-light but the lack of as great of an artificial boost means that the M1 lacks the bass impact and extension of the R02/R03. The nature of the low end is more punchy and less boomy than with the R03/R02, though the difference is small. The R03/R02 are simply a little more powerful and immediate when it comes to reproducing bass, especially hard bass on rap and D&B tracks. The M1 is more laid back, more balanced. Vocals are placed a bit farther back and so are the drums, which is good in a way – drums tend to step out of line with the R03/R02. However, the treble is also slightly less sparkly despite the fact that the R03/R02 are nearly devoid of sparkle to start with. Still, the more laid-back presentation at the bottom does make the M1 sound more balanced.

 The midrange is similar between the three. Smooth and non-fatiguing, it allows for a mellow but engaging listening experience. The R03 sounds a bit thicker than the R02/M1 and both ViSang earphones are warmer than the M1. In terms off presentation, the M1 has a wider left-right soundstage but a smaller range of depth (meaning it doesn't convey intimacy quite as well as the R02/R03). Distance is conveyed properly but I don't think the imaging is as good as the R03 – closer to the more ethereal positioning of the R02 but less intimate and a bit less accurate.

 Value *(9.5/10)* – The Brainwavz M1 are another very strong contender for the bang/buck crown. Like the ViSang R02, the M1s are a steal at the $40 mp4nation plans to ask for them. They are neither better nor worse than the similarly-priced ViSang R02 – simply different. The slightly more balanced signature is not as heavy-hitting as the ViSang earphones and Brainwavz M2 tend to be. The warmth of the earphones is reduced and some of the thickness is gone but the soundstage is more evenly spaced and distance is relayed quite well. The lack of a strain relief is slightly disheartening but the cable is extremely solid and the new 45-degree plug is excellent. Comfort, isolation, and microphonics are all what I’ve come to expect from earphones of this caliber. Listening to the M1 makes it perfectly clear to me that we are moving in the right direction – and any earphone that makes me feel this way is well-worth my hard-earned money.

*Pros: Class-leading sound quality, great all-around usability
 Cons: Cord has a bit of memory character, no strain reliefs on cable entry*

 Full review can be found here.


*(3A24) Klipsch Image S2 / X1*


Reviewed May 2010
  
 Details: Entry-level dynamic IEM from Klipsch
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18 Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq: _12-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _Klipsch oval gels_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear *or straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* - Single-flange Klipsch oval gels (3 sizes) and cloth carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* - The tubular plastic housings feel sturdy. The strain reliefs feel a bit too hard to be protective but the plastic cabling is thicker than that found on the S4 and the 3.5mm L-plug is well-relieved
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* - Tubular housings can be inserted rather deeply and the Klipsch ovals provide a good seal
 Microphonics *(3/5)* - Annoying when worn cord-down; fine otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *- Quite light and comfortable but fairly long and not entirely trivial to wear over-the-ear for those with smaller ears

 Sound *(5.4/10) *– Like that of their big brother, the Image S4, the sound of the S2 is very impressive at the outset; the flaws of the signature set in only with prolonged exposure. At their core the S2 are bottom-heavy earphones. They extend quite deep at the low end and provide gobs of impact with a proper seal. The impact has a softer character than that of the S4, making it sound slightly wooly and imprecise. Sub-bass is present but mid-bass is the dominant range and tends to cut into other frequencies when aggravated. The low end lacks the speed of something like the ViSang R02 but for the price it is quite lively and informative. The midrange is slightly warm and very smooth, positioned a bit too far back for an earphone with such a hefty low end but still boasting good presence. Midrange detail is impressive and clarity is quite competitive at the price point. The lower treble seems boosted for balance but is still slightly laid-back overall, lacking the sparkle and brightness of some of the competitors. As a result the S2 can’t quite keep up with the crispness and top-end detail present in earphones such as the Head-Direct RE2 and ADDIEM. For those bothered by hot treble, though, the S2 is a perfect match.

 In terms of presentation the S2 come across as slightly confused and confusing. The soundstage is large in width but feels lacking in depth. The somewhat laid-back midrange results in a lack of intimacy so the presentation is hardly linear. Positioning precision could be better and instrumental separation is sub-par next to the ADDIEMs and Maximo iM-590. The S2 still do a good job of conveying a sense of space but never sound particularly airy. There are certainly genres they excel at – soft rock and jazz, for example, sound excellent. But when things start getting busy, the flaws of the sonic signature start to shine through the smooth veneer. A point to note is that despite boasting similar specs to Klipsch’s Custom line, the S2 are actually a bit harder to drive not nearly as prone to hissing.

*Value (7.5/10) *– The Klipsch S2 are capable IEMs, no doubt about that, but the competition is stern at the $50 price point. Not all music genres benefit from their peculiar presentation and treble junkies in general will probably be left wanting a little more balance out of them. Purely in terms of sound quality, they are hardly disappointing but in my opinion not particularly noteworthy at regular price. As a total package, however, the S2 might be the ticket for those in search of a well-built IEM with impressive isolation and a smooth, dynamic sound signature.

*Pros: Solid build quality, impressive isolation, smooth and impactful sound
 Cons: Slightly prone to wind noise, can be microphonic*


*(3A25) Arctic Sound E361*


Reviewed Jun 2010
  
 Details:Flagship IEM from Swedish PC components manufacturer Arctic Cooling
 MSRP: *$32* from amazon.com; $35 for E361-WM/BM with microphone (E361-BM shown)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _18-26k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear *or straight down_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), hard clamshell carrying case, shirt clip, Arctic Cooling sticker, and PC headset/microphone adapter
 Build Quality *(3/5) *The front part of the earpiece is encapsulated in an aluminum shell while the rear part, nozzle, and strain relief are plastic. Sadly, the cable is quite thin and the hard strain reliefs are unlikely to relieve any strain
 Isolation* (3/5) *- Quite impressive for a ported dynamic-driver IEM. The angled nozzles help with insertion depth and the thick stock tips seem to isolate more than most
 Microphonics *(4/5)* - Very low when worn cord-down and absent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The ergonomic angled-nozzle design and light housings make them very comfortable for prolonged use and easy to wear cable-up or cable-down. The included silicone ear cushions are smaller than average, making the E361 quite friendly toward those with smaller ears

 Sound *(4.4/10)* – The arbitrary 10-point ratings on the Arctic Sound website give the E361 a 9/10 rating in bass, a 10/10 in the treble, and a 9/10 for clarity. Though it is unclear what scaling factor is used for these ratings, on a universal scale the E361 clearly falls short of such lofty claims. The E361 are bass-heavy IEMs, extending quite far down when the music calls for it. The bass tends to be boomy rather than punchy and occasionally intrudes on the lower midrange. This is a small detriment for rap, pop, soft rock, and similar genres but for music that benefits from balance and control, such as instrument-heavy rock and jazz tracks, the bass bloat is bad news. On the upside, the midrange is very smooth and not at all fatiguing, though it does gloss over a good amount of detail and clarity is slightly sub-par for the price. Treble extension is impressive and the upper end is quite natural-sounding. The E361 are neither warm nor cold in tonality and have a fairly natural timbre with most instruments. The soundstage is lacking in width but has decent depth, resulting in a fairly dimensional but not overly spacious sound. Overall these are definitely a stomp-your-foot kind of earphone – they manage to be bassy and impactful without sounding contrived or artificial. There is an added bonus to the relatively high impedance and low sensitivity of the E361 – they do a great job of cutting out hiss with noise-prone sources.

 Value *(6/10)* – Light, comfortable, and well-isolating, the E361 provides reasonable sound quality when used for music. The earphones crank out plenty of bass at the expense of clarity and overall resolution but still manage to be enjoyable nearly all of the time. Though they won’t win any awards for absolute fidelity, the E361 are easily on-par with most earphones put out by mainstream manufactures such as Sony and Skullcandy. Plus, they play nice with 128kbps mp3 files and sources that don’t normally jive with sensitive in-ear earphones. If you like your music heavy-handed and need an iPhone headset with a VOIP adapter, by all means give the iPhone versions of the E361 a second look. Purely for music, they aren’t quite up to snuff.

*Pros: Headset version includes Skype adapter for use with PC, very light and comfortable, low microphonics, bass-heavy sound with impressive extension on either end
 Cons: Mediocre build quality, sound lacks clarity and detail*


*(3A26) RadioPaq Classical*


Reviewed Jun 2010
  
 Details: One of RadioPaq’s four acoustically-tuned IEMs
 Current Price:* £30* from AdvancedMp3Players.co.uk (MSRP: £60.00)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: 120 dB | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cord: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The small metal housings are very sturdy in feel. As with the Jazz, the off-size nozzles lack filters and the cabling is plasticky and kink-prone. Unfortunately, no cord cinch is present and the strain relief on the 3.5mm plug is all but completely useless
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The smaller housings of the Classicals make deeper insertion possible, raising isolation significantly over the Jazz
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Slightly bothersome when worn cord-down, almost non-existent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The smaller housings of the Classical make them friendlier in fit than the Jazz. Deep insertion is still recommended, however, which compromises long-term comfort somewhat

 Sound *(6.5/10)* – Compared to the warm and lush Jazz, the Classical are noticeably more neutral and balanced. The low end is tight and accurate. When inserted shallowly they can sound somewhat anemic. With a deep seal, however, the bass is very impressive, providing more impact than note but maintaining smoothness. Because of the high-impact, low-texture nature of the bass, it can feel layered over the sound rather than integrated, which is a very unique and engaging way to present music. Impact drops off and texturing picks up towards the upper bass regions, transitioning smoothly and neatly to the midrange. As with the Jazz, the midrange of the Classical is not the focus of the presentation - it is clear, detailed, controlled, and has a very neutral tone but the treble is the most exciting aspect of the Classical’s signature, boasting a great amount of sparkle and clarity, coupled with impressive extension. The high end can be a little hot-tempered, as with the Jazz, but the added treble emphasis pushes the Classical over the line on occasion, especially on sibilant recordings. The soundstage of the Classical is wider than average and instrumental separation is quite good. However, despite not being particularly thick-sounding earphones, the Radiopaqs don’t sound airy and have a decidedly in-your-head feel. Still, they do a decent job of conveying both distance and direction; just don’t expect them to emulate full-size cans in presentation.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– The RadioPaq Classical provides a colder, more treble-happy alternative to the warm and deep sound of the Jazz. With average-sized housings that are slightly more friendly towards those with smaller ears than the monstrous shells of the Jazz and surprisingly impressive isolation, the Classical performs admirably as a day-to-day all-rounder. Those with treble sensitivities will really want to give these a pass but for the rest, the Classicals offer an interesting sound signature and a great all-around performance for the price.

*Pros: Impressive isolation, excellent and rather unique sound
 Cons: No accessories, plastic cabling, deep insertion crucial for proper sound*


*(3A27) JVC HA-FXC80 “Black Series”*


Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Mid-range earphone from JVC’s new ‘Black Series’ utilizing a high-definition micro driver
 Current Price: *$43* from amazon.com (MSRP: $59.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω _| Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _8-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _6mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes), over-the-ear cable guides, and oval hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The carbon housings feature the usual touch of solidity higher-end JVC products share. The metal accents and mesh-covered vents look quite good and the nozzle holds the carbon microdriver. Cabling is typical JVC as well – average in thickness but very soft and flexible and terminated with the usual straight plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Quite good despite large rear vents
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cord-down, nonexistent with the cord worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3/5)* – As with the other earphones containing JVC’s dynamic microdriver, the transducer of the FXC80 sits in the nozzle of the earphone. The housing shape is therefore not dictated by driver size or design. Though the odd pyramidal housings JVC chose are rather lightweight and can easily be worn cord-up or cord-down, the shape rules them out for smaller ears, at least with the stock tips. A conventional straight-barrel design would’ve actually been more ear-friendly

 Sound *(6.5/10)* – The sound of the HA-FXC80 is an evolutionary step up from the signature of the older FXC50. The 5.8mm “Micro HD” transducer is capable of extraordinary clarity and detail, which seem to be the driving forces behind the FXC80’s signature. The bass is very tight but surprisingly well-layered and full. The FXC80s are definitely not bass-heavy earphones but they have solid impact and a surprising amount of air at the low end. There is no mid-range bleed and the mids, while slightly underemphasized, are very smooth, clear, and detailed. They could stand to be a bit thicker next to the forward treble but remain very enjoyable nonetheless. Overall balance, while treble-leaning, is definitely impressive. The treble is crisp, bright, and carries an immense amount of sparkle. Despite this, the JVCs are mostly free of harshness or sibilance and lack the top-end extension of some of the pricier treble-focused earphones.

 In terms of presentation, the JVCs are far from spacious – the soundstage is average in size – bigger than that of the FXC50 but not up there with the ViSang R03 or even Meelec M6. Instrumental separation is decent but the vast amount of treble detail, aggressive nature of the top end, and relative lack of air up top make them somewhat congested nonetheless. I really can’t think of a better way to describe the treble of the FXC80 than to call it ‘concentrated’ – the JVC HA-FXC80 has very concentrated treble. Combined with the class-leading clarity and detail afforded by the micro HD drivers, this makes listening to the FXC80 is a remarkably intense experience. I can’t say that the FXC80 is necessarily hotter up top than something like the ATH-CK10 but the much pricier Audio-Technicas are so much more spacious and resolving that the experience is richer for it. The JVCs have a stronger tendency to fatigue, though earphones with the opposite skew (monster bass, average treble) tire me out even quicker.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The JVC HA-FXC80 is to the older HA-FXC50 what the Meelectronics M6 is to the M9 – a more refined sound with the same general signature and better all-around usability. The FXC80 really is quite good for the money – it is well-built, isolating, and not particularly microphonic – but the bell-like clarity and brightness will not appeal to everyone. This is an earphone for those who truly like their treble – a good upgrade to the FXC50 or Head-Direct RE2 without dropping the $80 on an RE0 or importing a RadioPaq Classical. Taken as such, the FXC80 is another competitive product from JVC’s audio division but one potentially limited to a niche target audience in the hi-fi crowd.

*Pros: Amazing detail and clarity, solid but controlled bass, well-built, low microphonics
 Cons: Housing design will not suit everyone, bright, can sound slightly congested*


*(3A28) H2O Audio Surge*


Reviewed Aug 2010
  
 Details: Workout-oriented waterproof earphones with enhanced bass
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $59.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB _| Freq: _18-20k Hz _| Cord: _3.7’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _6mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single Flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single flange rubber tips (5 sizes), foamhybrid tips (2 sizes), and zippered carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are made out of a tough plastic and feel solid but the dark blue L/R markings can be hard to see on the glossy black shells. Filters are absent from the nozzles as they would likely be ruined by water contact anyway. The cable is medium in thickness and sheathed in blue plastic. Small rubber sleeves take the place of strain reliefs on cord entry and a 2” long strain relief, designed to work with waterproof mp3 player cases, protects the 3.5mm plug. And yes, they will survive prolonged exposure to sweat and/or water as evidenced by perfect functionality after weeks of me bathing them in both (sorry!)
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The supplied thick rubber tips provide excellent isolation despite being rather shallow-sealing
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite low when worn cable-down due to smooth plastic cabling; nearly nonexistent in over-the-ear configuration
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The Surge comes with five sizes of u Comfort nusually thick rubber tips which require some getting used to for those of us accustomed to silicone. Getting a good seal with them takes careful selection of the right size as well as a bit of fidgeting but once sealed the earphones will stay in surprisingly well even during intense physical activity. They may not be as comfortable as a similarly-shaped earphone with silicone tips (e.g. Sennheiser CX300) but the stable fit is hugely welcome in a ‘sports’ earphone. Several days may be required for the cables to break in for over-the-ear wear

 Sound *(5.5/10)* – The sound of the Surge is what surprised me most about the earphones – marketing phrases such as ‘bass amplified sound’ are usually the harbinger of doom when it comes to mainstream earphones. The bass of the H2O Surge, however, despite not being ruler-flat, is quite controlled and not at all intrusive. On bass-light tracks it stays completely out of the way and even with extremely bassy music it is still not particularly muddy or bloated. Low-end extension is average and the bass is not terribly impactful, meaning that it is heard more than felt. On the upside, the bass rarely intrudes on the midrange, which is slightly forward in nature, reminding me of the ViSang R02/R03. Vocals come across powerfully and smoothly. The 8mm drivers produce sound with surprising clarity though detail lags behind competitors like the Meelec M6 and Yamaha EPH-50. A few extra volume notches are enough to fix this – the waterproof drivers seem to require a bit more juice for optimum travel and speed.

 The treble is equally smooth but slightly de-emphasized in comparison to the midrange. Harshness and sibilance are absent completely and the high end does roll off as expected from an in-ear in this price range, resulting in an unfatiguing sound. The general presentation is slightly distant, with vocals generally appearing more intimate and instruments placed farther back. Positioning is a bit vague but the earphones do at the very least give a sense of space. No, the Surge will not win any hi-fi awards this year, but keeping in mind the intended application both the sound signature and presentation are more impressive than I expected and compete easily with similarly-priced mainstream-sounding earphones such as the Sennheiser CX300 and UE MetroFi 220.

 Value *(8/10)* – The H2O Audio Surge follows its intended application through and through. A variety of rubber and foam tips are included so that the perfect fit - which is crucial for stability, isolation, and sound quality – is easy to attain after the first few trials. The build quality is quite good and the crown jewel of the earphones – the ability to survive underwater – is in fact not a marketing trick of any sort. Being able to come home from the gym and simply rinse off my earphones under running water is an extremely liberating experience and one that I am likely to repeat over and over because the Surge really doesn’t sound bad at all. The mid-forward presentation works especially well for low-volume listening as the vocals remain plenty coherent without being distracting but the entire signature is competent and pleasant. The surge can be considered a good all-around earphone that just happens to be waterproof or a waterproof earphone that just happens to be a good all-rounder. Either way, it’s pretty darn good value for money for anyone who may run the risk of ruining their IEMs with moisture of any sort.

*Pros: Waterproof, reasonably well-built, secure fit, smooth and competent sound
 Cons: 2” strain relief may not work well with tiny players such as the Shuffle/Clip, rubber tips can take some getting used to*
  
  
*(3A29) ViSang R01*


Reviewed Aug 2010
  
 Details: Entry-level model from ViSang
 Current Price: *$32* from ebay.com (MSRP: $32)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _20 Ω_ | Sens: _112 d_B | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cord: _4.2' I-plug __(note: latest version carries __45°-plug)_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock biflanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single- (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, foamhybrid tips, and shirt clip
 Build Quality* (3.5/5)* – Same generic IEM housings as the higher-end R02 and a handful of other earphones. However, the twisted Cu-Ag alloy cable used by the R02/R03 is replaced with a more conventional rubbery cord, which is thinner and more tangle-prone. Cable cinch is missing as with all other ViSang models
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Very adequate for a ported dynamic IEM, especially with bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Slightly noisy when worn cord-down, almost nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Same as with the R02 model – light and unobtrusive. Can easily be worn cord-up or cord-down. Work best with a relatively shallow fit

 Sound *(6.3/10)* – The general sound signature of the R01 is similar to the two higher-end ViSang models, which should not come as a surprise since it shares most of the hardware (with the obvious exception of the Cu-Ag alloy cable) with them. The bass is smooth and full-bodied, with a mid/upper-bass hump and a tendency to warm up the rest of the sound signature. Bass depth, texture, and detail are certainly not on level with heavyweights such as the FA Eterna but beat most budget in-ears quite easily. The midrange is smooth and clear, slightly forward in positioning but still very well-separated and yet extremely coherent. The treble transition happens with no harshness or sibilance and the treble is laid-back and extremely smooth. The very top is rolled off and treble ‘sparkle’ is nowhere to be found but the highs of the R01 are certainly extremely competent, if not particularly aggressive or exciting, for an earphone of its caliber. Soundstage width is quite good and depth is adequate, though once again the R01 performs far better than the asking price would indicate. Compared to most budget in-ears, even great ones like the Meelectronics M9 and Fischer Audio TS-9002, the R01 is effortlessly spacious and presents music in a believable way.

 But the sound of the ViSang R01 is not identical to that of the higher-end R02. In terms of signature the two earphones are extremely similar but the R02 is just that little bit better all-around, putting it head and shoulders above the competition. The R01 sounds like a softened and more relaxed version of the R02, but it is hard to imagine anyone finding the R02 too aggressive in the first place. The overall sound of the R02 is slightly crisper and clearer, with marginally better bass control and a bit more treble presence. As a result of the superior clarity, the R02 also seems to have more air and a more separated sound. The soundstage of the R02 is not huge but manages to be very believable while the R01 sounds a tad more constrained. The R02 also carries a bit more detail and I found myself pushing the volume of the R01 up a few notches to get the same level of detail out of it. Again, the differences are not great by any means but they are enough to make the R02 one of the best earphones in the <$100 range and the R01 merely above-average in the same category (though do keep in mind that the R01 costs a measly $30). Having both, I found myself reaching for the R02 every time without hesitation, but I would be far from unhappy if 'stuck' with just the R01.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The ViSang R01 promises the sound of the higher-end ViSang R02 in an even more reasonably-priced package. The ~$10 difference between the two accounts for the exclusion of the hard clamshell carrying case and Sony Hybrid knockoff tips from the accessory pack of the R01 as well as for the replacement of the Cu-Ag alloy cord with a more standard one. There are also minor sonic differences between the two which leave the pricier R02 a step above the R01 in overall sound quality. If you absolutely must only spend $30 on an earphone, the R01 is still the best way to do so. However, if tossing in the extra $10 to make the jump to the R02 won’t put you in the red for next month’s rent, I would recommend the upgrade. With the nicer cable and carrying case the earphones will last longer and the sonic differences, though probably not noticeable except in a direct comparison, are present nevertheless. At the end of the day either earphone provides great value for money but a few minor quibbles prevent the R01 from out-pacing its older brothers in bang/buck.

*Pros: Time-tested design, class-leading sound quality
 Cons: Not quite as stellar of an all-rounder as the R02 and only $10 cheaper*

 Full review can be found here.
  
  
*(3A30) ECCI PR300*


Reviewed Aug 2010
  
 Details: Flagship earphone from ECCI, the earphone division of Chinese amp manufacturer Storm
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $52)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-22k Hz_ | Cord: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Narrow-tube stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Narrow-tube (3 sizes) and wide-tube (3 sizes) single-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and large clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The gray metal shells are smaller and much lighter than those of the lower-end PR100/PR200 and feel a bit less solid. The sound tubes are protected by the same fine mesh filters as on the older earphones but the cable is a definite downgrade from the excellent silver cord used by the PR100/PR200. It is thinner, more rubbery, and far more prone to tangling. In addition, the sliding cord cinch is missing completely. The PR300 does feature larger and more flexible strain reliefs on either end of the cable but just doesn’t have the same ‘wow’ effect as the rock-solid construction of the ECCI’s two cheaper models
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average at best as the PR300s are shallow-fitting and vented at the rear for increased airflow. Wind noise can be an issue in extremely windy conditions
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Not bothersome when worn over-the-ear but quite annoying otherwise. The included shirt clip helps
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings of the PR300 are extremely light. They are also quite small and tapered towards the rear. Wearing them either cord-up or cord-down is very comfortable and the soft and thin cord conforms easily in either configuration

*Sound (6.5/10)* – The two previous models released by ECCI – the PR100 and PR200 – were balanced and capable all-rounders – mid-centric if anything. As such, they were a bit bland and boring despite the slight bass boost and strong midrange presence. In a nutshell, the PR300 is a slightly V-Shaped version of the PR100/PR200 sound with a bit more clarity and air thrown in. As such, the new model reminds me of the company’s former glory, finally delivering some of the spark that made the PR1 Pro so endearing to me.

 The bass of the PR300 is tight and punchy – not particularly powerful but very accurate and quite impactful. Extension is good and bass is tight and controlled. The midrange is free of bass bleed and quite smooth and pleasant overall. The older ECCI earphones had mids that were thick and somewhat buttery. The PR300 sounds much more airy and resolved without becoming thin or dry a-la RE0/Hippo VB. The treble of the new ECCI earphones is quite accurate and sounds much livelier than that of the PR100/PR200. Top-end roll-off is reduced and the listener is faced with plenty of sparkle. Those who find treble tiring in large quantities may want to give these a pass but for the average listener the PR300 provides a good alternative to the similarly-sparkly Brainwavz M1, which is slightly more mid-forward and boasts better extension on either end but has even more vigorous bass and treble response. In terms of presentation, the PR300 mimics the reasonably-sized soundstages of the PR100/PR200 models. The improved sense of air, however, helps the PR300 image better than the older models do. The presentation isn’t perfect and doesn’t quite give the same overall sense of space as the similarly-priced Brainwavz M1 and ViSang R02 but it is very good for the asking price.

*Value (8/10)* – The ECCI PR300 is the company’s latest and most convincing attempt at offering hi-fi sound for lo-fi money. Those who have heard the PR100 or PR200 will find the general signature of the PR300 quite familiar but should note improved treble response and better all-around clarity and resolution. While the new housings are not quite as impressive to the touch and the eye as the shiny shells of the older ECCI models, they are smaller, lighter, and tapered towards the rear, offering a more compliant and unobtrusive fit. All things considered, the PR300 is a noteworthy entry in the increasingly crowded and amazingly competitive <$100 price bracket. Highly recommended for those in search of a balanced IEM with a bit of bass punch and energetic treble.

*Pros: Small and comfortable, lively but accurate and controlled sound
 Cons: Cabling is a step down from the PR100/PR200, presentation not as spacious as some of the competitors*

 Full review can be found here.


*(3A31) Xears TD100*


Reviewed Aug 2010
  
 Details: Current flagship of the Xears earphone line from Playaz
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: est $60)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: _124 dB_ | Freq: _6-28k Hz_ | Cord: _4.2’ I-plug j-cord_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sennheiser short bi-flanges, generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and tri-flange silicone tips, foamhybrid tips (2 pairs), and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The metal shells are quite obviously modeled after the Monster Turbines. The construction is quite good but the Xears don’t feel quite as solid as the Monsters. Mild driver flex is present as well
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – For some reason Turbine-style housings just work well for me when it comes to isolation, the TD100 being no exception. Aside from the mediocre stock tips, the isolation is nearly on par with the Turbine Pros
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite low but the j-cord is a two-edged sword – it reduces cable travel and therefore microphonics but at the same time makes the earphones more difficult to wear over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Very similar to Monster Turbines. The straight-barrel housings are average in size and rounded at the front. Unfortunately the stock tips are rather poor. In addition, the j-cord may be annoying for some

 Sound *(7.5/10)* – The TD100, along with several other Xears/Playaz earphones, has a cult following here at Head-Fi, and after several weeks with it I can see why. It is an extremely lush and sweet-sounding earphone. Those in search of analytical sound should quite clearly look elsewhere but as an alternative to the similarly-colored Fischer Audio Eterna or ViSang R03, the TD100 holds its own very well. Its bass is deep and full-bodied and plentifully impactful. The low end can match the ViSang R03 in quantity but runs closer to the subbass-heavy Hippo VB in extension. Despite the copious grunt, however, the low end of the TD100 carries lots of detail and very good resolution. Individual notes never run together and bass bloat/bleed are almost completely absent. The bass heft of the TD100 will surely be excessive for some, but from a technical standpoint it is very well-done.

 The midrange is warmed up by the weighty low end and sounds lush and full. It is slightly forward but not as forward as the mids of the ViSang R03. Detail is quite good but the TD100 has a certain thickness to it that causes clarity to lag slightly behind the R03 and Hippo VB. It still sounds a bit less veiled than my rev2 Eterna; however, the Eterna is ‘handicapped’ by a larger soundstage and is generally a more distant-sounding earphone than the somewhat intimate TD100. The treble of the TD100 is smooth but relatively clear and detailed, though it won’t keep up with the Hippo VB, Brainwavz M1, or ECCI PR300 in crispness. It is laid back but not quite enough so to be called recessed. Like the midrange, the treble is a bit thick and lacks the air of some of the more analytical earphones. It is far from dull, however, and manages to keep my attention quite easily when necessary. All in all, for an earphone with the bass power of the TD100, the overall sound is surprisingly well-balanced and enjoyable. It is colored and exciting and I rather like it despite all of my analytical biases.

 When it comes to presentation, the TD100 again performs above expectations. The soundstage has good width and depth and instrumental separation is quite decent for a mid-range dynamic. The earphone is also capable of delivering an excellent sense of distance but leans slightly towards intimacy. The fact that the notes it produces are usually a little thick makes it more musical and satisfying but reduces air. Tonally, the TD100 is not a dark earphone, nor does it sound ‘stuffy’ like certain bass-heavy competitors, but I wouldn’t call it bright, either. As far as fun-sounding earphones go, the presentation of the TD100 is just right.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – At its usual ~$60 retail price point, the TD100 is a stellar deal. The earphone is rather handsome and well-designed, though the budget-oriented nature shows through in the j-cord setup, driver flex, and poor quality of stock tips. More important, however, is that the sound quality of the Xears earphones far exceeds the asking price, putting them on-level with some of the absolute best IEMs I’ve heard in the <$100 bracket – the ViSang R03, Fischer Audio Eterna, and Hippo VB. The sound signature of the TD100 sounds like a cross of the VB and R03 – deep and powerful bass, smooth and slightly forward mids, and competent but neither overly edgy not completely sunk treble. It is true that the R03, Eterna, and VB feel like higher-tier products all things considered, but in terms of absolute audio enjoyment the TD100 holds its own very easily.

*Pros: Very capable performance, comfortable with aftermarket tips
 Cons: J-cord may be bothersome, mild driver flex, stock tips are rather poor*
  
  
*(3A32) Hippo Shroom*


Reviewed Sep 2010
  
 Details: Micro-driver earphone from Jaben’s house brand, Hippo
 Current Price: *$57 *from unclewilsons.com (MSRP: $57.00)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _95 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _6mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Black (3 sizes) and color-coded (3 sizes) single flange silicone tips and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The slim housings of the Shrooms are mostly made of metal and the micro-driver is positioned at the tip of the nozzle. The cable is rubberized and resists tangling well but feels a bit cheap. The low-profile L-plug is quite nice, however
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Quite good due to the slim housings and forward driver placement
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; not too bad otherwise. The omission of a shirt clip doesn’t help
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The tiny housings of the Hippos are light and fit quite well but are let down by the huge 6mm nozzle, which holds the driver. Those with smaller ear canals might have trouble getting the Shroom to fit comfortably

 Sound *(6.4/10)* – The Hippo Shroom is my third micro-driver earphone, the other two being the budget-oriented JVC HA-FXC50 and the slightly more upmarket HA-FXC80. The Shroom, like the two JVCs, is a light on the bass, heavy on the treble earphone with a few aces up its sleeve. In general, the sound of the Hippos amazes most with its quickness and transparency. The bass is tight and accurate but low on impact. Extension is good but the miniscule quantity of sub-bass put out by the drivers results in a lack of low-end rumble, which some may find disconcerting. The midrange is slightly forward and boasts great clarity. Transparency is excellent and the tonal character is quite realistic. Though a small amount of sibilance is present on certain tracks, for the most part the Shroom’s midrange is silky-smooth and extremely pleasant. As with the older Head-Direct RE2, the smooth, clear, and detailed mids are the real strength of the Shroom despite the treble being most gripping and vociferous element of the signature. The detail carried by the microdriver won’t quite compete with the Head-Direct RE0 but gets far closer than a $60 dynamic-driver earphone should.

 The treble itself is sparkly, crisp, and extended. There is some unevenness lower down which results in mild sibilance with certain tracks and can make the treble somewhat piercing at times - those who are sensitive to treble artifacts will probably want to give the Shroom a pass as it can be a bit fatiguing. In terms of presentation, the overall brightness of the Shroom makes it sound airy and lightweight. The soundstage boasts surprisingly good width but lacks slightly in depth, which results in a wide but not particularly well-spaced sonic image. All in all, while the Shroom certainly won’t be a perfect match for every listener and music genre, it is a very impressive implementation of the typical microdriver sound signature and comes highly recommended as an upgrade for earphones such as the JVC HA-FXC50 and Head-Direct RE2.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – Yet another impressive midrange entry from Jaben’s house brand, the Hippo Shroom is a small-and-slim earphone that should be comfortable and well-isolating enough for most users. Its top-heavy sound signature and capacity for clarity and detail put it on-level with the likes of the JVC HA-FXC80 and RadioPaq Classical. In a nutshell, the Shroom is all about combining strong and smooth vocals with crisp and sparkly treble. The usual caveats are, of course, in full effect and those sensitive to strong treble need not apply. Taken for what it is, however, the Shroom is an impressive earphone and a good budget buy.

*Pros: Impressive clarity and detail, small and comfortable, good isolation
 Cons: Microphonics can be bothersome, distinctive sound signature not for everyone*
  
  
*(3A33) Yamaha EPH-50*


Reviewed Sep 2010
  
 Details: Top-of-the-line IEM from electronics giant Yamaha, boasting large 14mm drivers in an half in-ear form factor
 Current Price: *$38* from amazon.com (MSRP: $99.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _20-21k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(1.5/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and ¼” adapter
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are made completely out of plastic and, except for the nozzles, look like conventional earbuds. The rubberized cabling is fairly sturdy and well-relieved but prone to tangling
 Isolation *(2.5/5) *– Like the cheaper EPH-20, the EPH-50 is a shallow-insertion earphone and is also vented. However, the EPH-50 is larger and seems to isolate slightly better, especially with aftermarket dual-flange tips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Cable noise is present and the EPH-50 cannot be worn over-the-ear, exacerbating the problem
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Unlike the miniscule EPH-20, the EPH-50, built around gigantic 14mm drivers, is a large but equally ergonomic earphone. Due to its greater size it doesn’t have a tendency to disappear when donned but remains very comfortable for those with ears large enough to accommodate the 15mm housings

 Sound *(5.9/10)* – The first question I usually ask myself when faced with two differently-priced IEMs from the same model line is whether the higher-end set is worth the price premium over the cheaper offering. With the two Yamaha IEMs, it’s a no-contest “yes” for the EPH-50. While the EPH-20 is a decent earphone for what it costs, it is by no means hi-fi and loses both clarity and detail to the out-of-control bass. The EPH-50 is by no means bass shy, but it manages to impress in other areas as well. A familial resemblance between the two phones is most notable in the way the low end is presented – it is deep and full, boasting plentiful impact and a pleasant warmth. The EP-50 are still bass monsters but the 14-mm drivers seem to be more precise than the tiny transducers used by the EPH-20 and the bass is generally cleaner and better-controlled on the larger earphones.

 Midrange bleed is also reduced, though not eliminated completely. The big bass can still make detail harder to hear but the midrange itself is more forward, more neutral, and far more clear than it is on the EPH-20. The clarity is actually quite impressive, especially on bass-light tracks, beating out the Apple dual-drivers and Sleek SA1. The earphones also lack the upper midrange dip of the EPH-20s, giving them slightly more pronounced treble at the expense of slight harshness and a bit of graininess. Treble extension is quite reasonable and the high end sounds surprisingly realistic. Though sparkle is still nearly nonexistent, the EPH-50s generally sound more crisp and energetic than the EPH-20s do. The presentation of the earphones is surprisingly wide and airy. Compared to the similarly-priced Sleek SA1 and TDK EB900, the EPH-50s sound well-separated and quite spacious, though they don’t have particular accuracy in imaging or positioning. Overall, the sound is well-layered and avoids congestion, which is a must for the bottom-skewed balance of these earphones.

 Value *(7.5/10) *– Sound-wise, the EPH-50 is a competitive mid-range entry. Like the lower-end EPH-20, it boasts a large amount of very visceral bass but adds to it a fairly clear midrange and crisp, natural-sounding treble. Yes, the bass is excessive at times, but as a general rule it manages to be fun yet controlled – a tough order as far as budget-oriented in-ears go. The earphone is also quite pleasing aesthetically and very comfortable to wear for those with large enough ears. Sadly, the build quality, isolation, and microphonics are merely average for the price, but the sound should be enough to justify a purchase for those in search of moderately-isolating in-ears with hugely impactful bass. Of note, a set of bi-flange silicone tips off of eBay may be worth picking up along with these.

*Pros: Very lightweight and comfortable, fun and dynamic sound
 Cons: Bass can be excessive and negatively affects the rest of the spectrum


 (3A34) Pioneer SE-CLX50*


Reviewed Sep 2010
  
 Details: Half in-ear IEM from Pioneer boasting a ‘flex nozzle’ design
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: 89.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _5-24k Hz _| Cable: _3.3’ I-plug + 1.6’ L-plug extension_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), 1.6’ extension cable, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The metal inner housings of the CLX50s are similar to conventional earbuds. A rigid silicone sleeve with a plastic nozzle makes them into IEMs with some success. The silicone part can be rotated and reshaped slightly for a more comfortable fit but has some limitations - angling it too much can cause it to slip off the earphone and there’s a vent hole that can be obscured, leading to muffled bass response and high end roll-off. In addition, changing tips can sometimes forcibly remove the entire silicone sleeve from the earphones. On the upside, the thick cable is rubberized to reduce tangling and terminated with a standard 3.5mm I-plug, though it does carry some annoying memory character
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Not bad for a half in-ear design when a proper seal is achieved
 Microphonics (*4/5) *– Quite low in the thick and rubbery cable but hard to avoid completely as the CLX50 cannot be worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – Though the CLX50 boasts a ‘flex-nozzle’ design, getting a good seal with it can be unreasonably difficult, especially with the stock tips. The odd disk-shaped silicone bulge near the nozzle is angled incorrectly for my ears and the housings themselves are far too large and heavy. The Phiaton PS210, which is similar in size and weight, is far more ergonomic and the Yamaha EPH-50 is a featherweight in comparison

 Sound *(6.7/10)* – Pioneer claims that the 13mm dynamic driver and silicone in-ear adapter of the CLX50 were designed to provide the type of bass response that isn’t usually attributed to conventional earbuds. The biggest iss Microphonics ue with basimg alt=s, however, is that a proper seal is required to hear it and for the life of me I couldn’t make the CLX50 work with the stock tips. Large Sony hybrids, large bi-flanges, or foam tips were required for me to get any sort of bass out of them. With a proper seal, bass quantity was somewhere between the heavy-handed Yamaha EPH50 and light and agile Phiaton PS210s – deep and rumbly, yet controlled and accurate. I wouldn’t call the CLX50s bass monsters but they do have a very nice full-bodied punch to them – quite enough to please the moderate basshead. Nonetheless, it is a realistic sort of bass that doesn’t draw too much attention to itself, which is how I like it.

 The midrange is quite clean and almost completely free of interference from the low end. It lacks a bit of emphasis but is generally smooth and competent. The 13mm drivers are quick and detail is surprisingly good, as is the clarity. Tonally the Pioneers are slightly bright despite the deep and powerful low end. The mids are sweet and work especially well for female vocals, which are given just the right amount of edginess and polish by the CLX50. The treble, too, is clear and very detailed. There’s plenty of sparkle but I doubt anyone would find the CLX50 fatiguing – there’s just so much clarity and resolution that the sparkle sounds well-appropriated. With a mediocre seal they can be a bit piercing but not using stock tips fixes that for me. Top-end extension is good – a bit better than the laid-back ViSang R03 but not quite up there with the Hippo VB or Head-Direct RE0.

 Perhaps some psychology is in play here but I really hear a resemblance in presentation between the CLX50 and the Phiaton PS210, which shares the half in-ear form factor. Both are quite wide-sounding and have decent soundstage depth. Both position instruments surprisingly well and sound quite airy. The CLX50 even seems to separate instruments out a bit better than the PS210 does, though the Phiatons still present performances I’m familiar with in a more convincing way. On the whole, the CLX50 really is a competitive earphone for the asking price - all it is missing compared to the much pricier PS210 is a bit of ambience and a chunk of refinement.

 Value *(6/10)* – Though the sound quality of the CLX50 is well above average for the current asking price, I simply cannot recommend them due to the design. Plain and simple, the ergonomics of the CLX50 will either be a complete hit or complete miss, based on the individual. My ears, which are usually quite compliant when it comes to new and unfamiliar earphones, rebelled unequivocally against the CLX50. Aside from the fit, the CLX50 is a very usable earphone – well built and not very microphonic. For those who have the ability to return the earphones and are willing to take a chance on the fit, the CLX50 may be worth a shot but my pair is definitely going back to Pioneer.

*Pros: Full-bodied bass, sparkly and atmospheric sound, decent build
 Cons: Hit-or-miss fit, odd cable lengths*
  
  
*(3A35) Sennheiser CX280*


Reviewed Sep 2010
  
 Details: Latest addition to Sennheiser’s long-running CX in-ear earphone line
 Current Price: *$50* from amazon.com (MSRP: $69.95)
 Specs: Driver: Dynamic | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _120 dB_ | Freq: _19-20.5k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and leather carrying pouch
 Build Quality (*4/5)* – At first glance, the CX280 is an enlarged version of the older CX150/200/250 housing but it isn’t quite so – the construction consists of two types of plastic and feels a bit sturdier overall. Cabling is average in thickness, well-relieved at either end, and terminated with a sturdy 3.5mm L-plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – About average for conventional in-ears due to large vent slit
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Somewhat bothersome when worn cord-down, good when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are larger than those of the older CX250 but rounded at the front for an agreeable fit. The earphones are quite lightweight and the stock tips work well with the medium insertion depth

 Sound *(5.8/10)* – As with many of the other CX-series Sennheisers, the 280 is claimed to have ‘bass-driven sound’. Quite often a phrase like that would scare me but having heard the CX250 and CX300 in the past, I had a decent idea of what to expect. The CX280 does appear to be a step in the right direction from the CX250, which itself was a more enjoyable earphone than the ever-popular CX300. The bass of the CX280 falls between the CX250 and CX300 – there is a bit of mid-bass emphasis but not much bloat. Compared to the Meelec M9 the CX280 seriously lacks sub-bass weight and sounds slightly tamer overall. The low end of the CX280 is not thin by any means but it just doesn’t have the same well-rounded fullness as the rumbly and visceral bass of the M9.

 The mids are smooth and in good balance with the bass and treble. As with the older CX-series earphones, the CX280 is a bit laid-back in the midrange. Clarity and detail are good though on the whole the CX280 lags behind the Meelec M9 on both counts. There is a bit of unevenness towards the upper midrange and the CX280 has much more prominent treble than the CX300 and slightly more sparkle and detail than the CX250 (though still not as much as the M9). At higher volumes the treble can be a bit fatiguing but during normal listening I found it perfectly pleasant – less harsh than that of the M9 but not rolled-off as with the CX300.

 In terms of presentation, the CX280 is quite wide-sounding and airy. Depth is average in comparison to the width, resulting in a sound that’s well-distanced but relatively flat in the soundstage. Positioning is good and the CX280 has a somewhat harder time portraying intimacy than distance, though its soundstage has clear outer limits as well, not unlike that of the far-pricier IE7. Those who like a more intimate sound would probably find a better match with the similarly-priced CX281, which doesn’t sound as big as the CX280 does but is also more cohesive in its intimacy. Nearly everyone else will be impressed by the spacious presentation.

 Value* (7/10)* – Sennheiser’s latest foray into the ranks of entry-level in-ears takes us one step further from the bloated and boomy sound of low-end Sennhaiers of years past. The sound is fairly balanced and competent all-around. I don’t expect the CX280 to be as polarizing as the Meelec M9 – it lacks the amazing detail and clarity of the Meelecs but doesn’t sound as harsh or boomy, either. With good comfort and isolation as well as build quality that, while not as impressive as that of the CX281, puts the old CX300 to shame, the CX280 is a very agreeable earphone that manages to appeal both to the consumer and the (budget-minded) audiophile. Though the retail price is, as usual, excessive, the street value fluctuates quite a bit and any dips below $30 have the potential to make the CX280 a very competitive earphone.

*Pros: Comfortable, rather wide-sounding and all-around competent
 Cons: Can be microphonic*
  
 Special thanks to *kjk1281* for offering to lend me the CX280 upon hearing that I had the CX281 on-hand

  
*(3A36) Sennheiser CX281*


Reviewed Sep 2010
  
 Details: Budget in-ear from Sennheiser’s “designed for women” line
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $69.95)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _120 dB_ | Freq: _19-20.5k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), 3.5mm splitter, and leather carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The asymmetrical housings are made of solid plastics and feel fairly sturdy. Strain reliefs are short but the silver cable is identical to that used on the MX/OMX471 earbuds – thick, soft, and very flexible. A fairly large volume pot hangs not far below the y-split and the 3.5mm L-plug has a long and soft strain relief
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good enough for daily use though the fit of the CX281 is rather shallow
 Microphonics* (3.5/5)* – Merely alright when worn cord-down, good when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are curved in an attempt at ergonomic design but really just aren’t small enough for the target market. The front edges are squared off and facilitate shallower insertion unlike the rounded housings of the older CX200/250 earphones. Comfortable, but not game-changing

 Sound *(5.6/10)* – Following hot on the heels of the new CX280, the designed-for-women CX281 follows pretty much the same formula. Like the CX280, the CX281 is advertised as having ‘bass-driven sound’ and like the CX280 it is rather controlled and delicate in nature. The CX281 is just a touch warmer and bassier than the CX280 but still falls squarely between the older CX300 and CX250 models in bass quantity. Mid-bass is expectedly emphasized but the extension of earphones such as the Meelec M9 is lacking in the CX281.

 The midrange is probably the most agreeable aspect of the CX281, being almost identical to that of the CX280. Clarity and detail are quite good though the CX281 does sound just a touch more grainy than the CX280. The treble is prominent and can be fatiguing at high volumes but rolls off later than that of the CX300 and carries more detail throughout. In presentation the CX281 once again follows in the footsteps of the CX280 but lacks the soundstage width, opting instead for a slightly more intimate sound to match the slightly warmer tone of the earphones. Personally I find the presentation of the CX280 to be slightly more realistic despite the tone and timbre of the two earphones being nearly identical.

 Value* (7/10)* – Though not quite as impressive as the ‘mainline’ CX280, the CX281 is a competent budget IEM with an agreeable signature and great all-around usability. Sennheiser did source the excellent silver cable, including the notched-wheel volume control, for the CX281 from the MX471, giving it a leg up over the CX280 in microphonics and overall feel. Comfort and isolation are also quite reasonable for a budget-minded set. The sound signature is a bit less realistic than that of the CX280 but arguably more enjoyable, especially for the average listener. Like most of the CX-series earphones, the CX281 fluctuates wildly in street price but anything under $30 would make them a pretty good deal in my book.

*Pros: Well-built and comfortable, low microphonics, all-around competent sound
 Cons: No ‘wow’ factor, overpriced at MSRP*
  
 Special thanks to *jant71 *for lending me the CX281
  
  
*(3A37) TDK EB900*


Reviewed Sep 2010
  
 Details: Mid-range earphone from Japanese electronics giant TDK
 Current Price: *$50 *from bestbuy.com (MSRP: $69.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _101.5 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply T400 foam tips (1 set), and soft synthetic carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The curved shells are made out of a matte plastic with a glossy finish over the TDK logo. Both the nozzles and rear vents of the earphones are protected by metal grilles. The cable exit points on the underside of the shells feature short rubber strain reliefs and the cable is sheathed in black-and-white striped nylon. The cord is extremely light and terminates in a straight 3.5mm plug with a hard rubber strain relief. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Average for a dynamic-driver in-ear
 Microphonics* (3/5) *– Cable noise is bothersome when worn cable-down and the weight of the cable is not sufficient to keep it planted behind the ear during physical activity. Not recommended for jogging or exercise
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The light weight of the earphones, combined with the tapered housing shape, makes the EB900 completely unobtrusive. Unfortunately, despite the short strain reliefs, wearing the EB900 over-the-ear is not as easy as I would like due to the weightless cord

 Sound *(4.9/10) *– The sound signature of the EB900 is decidedly bass-heavy, with enough low-end grunt to rattle loose teeth and a small dip in the upper midrange that results in a loss of the artificial clarity usually brought about by bright treble. The response curve of the EB900 sounds ‘enhanced’ by a wholesome 12-15 decibels in the 50-100Hz range, resulting in a large mid-bass hump and minimal roll-off all the way down to 25Hz. The low-end resolution of the EB900 is negatively affected by the gargantuan bass and the lower midrange is heavily veiled. When the bass is dropped by 10-12 dB on the equalizer, the veil lifts and midrange clarity quite reasonable for a $70 dynamic earphone shines through. As it stands, the bass, imparts a fairly dark character on the sound. Luckily, the midrange isn’t particularly recessed and generally sounds full and pleasant, if a bit dry. The pleasantness extends in to the upper midrange, which exhibits a small dip in response, likely meant to reduce harshness and/or sibilance, which gives the EB900 a very smooth sound all the way up. Compared to the voluminous bass, the treble of the EB900 is notably deemphasized but boasts decent, though not class-leading, extension and detail.

 Despite the lack of treble emphasis and narrow soundstage, the earphones sound rather airy, possibly due in part to the massive rear vents. The fullness of the midrange and heavy bass notes give the earphones a sense of dimensionality that is often lacking in low-end products. They don’t position sonic cues with particular precision but have a certain evenness and consistency to the imaging. There are earphones out there that have a wide soundstage but never seem to take advantage of it. The TDK EB900 has a relatively narrow stage but manages to fill in every nook and cranny with sound, making them quite enveloping and well-suited for music that benefits from the intimate but dimensional presentation.

 Value *(6/10)* – The EB900 sounds as if TDK started with a fairly balanced and natural-sounding mid-range earphone and cranked up the bass. It remains a nice option for lovers of deep and impactful bass but is more difficult to recommend as an all-rounder. The sound is dark and a bit dry but quite full and conveys a nice, if slightly undersized, sonic image. From a usability standpoint, too, the EB900 are competent but not outstanding. Isolation, build quality, and microphonics are all average, with extra comfort points earned for the light weight of the earpieces and included Comply eartips. For those in search of a light and comfortable in-ear with lots of bass, the TDK EB900 is a solid option. Otherwise, the market is chock-full of better options.

*Pros: Light and comfortable, ships with Comply foam eartips, very bass-heavy but generally competent sound
 Cons: Loses out in balance, clarity, and detail to much of the competition, carries a good amount of cable noise, mild driver flex*
  
  
*(3A38) Sony MDR-XB40EX*


Reviewed Dec 2010
  
 Details: Mid-range in-ear from Sony’s Extra Bass line
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $59.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: 16Ω | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _4-24k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Single-flange (3 sizes) Sony Hybrid silicone tips and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are made of plastic with metal Sony badges running along the spine of the earphones. The flat cable has average strain relief at the stems and no cable cinch but is terminated with a flexible 3.5mm L-plug. Cable quality is quite good – soft, sturdy, and with no memory character
 Isolation* (2.5/5)* – Average for a dynamic-driver canalphone
 Microphonics* (4/5)* – Very low in the flat, tangle-free cable but it can be tricky to route over-the-ear to eliminate cord noise completely
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – The XB40EX has vertically-mounted drivers and is not meant to be inserted very deeply. However, the earphones are a bit too large and heavy for shallow-insertion canalphones and often stay in only by virtue of the eartip seal while still putting pressure on the outer ear. In addition, the extra-large metal Sony badge running along the height of the earphones can get in the way of wearing them over-the-ear

 Sound *(4.8/10)* – Being part of Sony’s Extra Bass (XB) series, the XB40EX was bound to be a bass-heavy earphone; the question was – how bass-heavy? Answer: very. I’ve owned one of the full-size headphones from the XB line – the MDR-XB500 – until very recently and thought they were surprisingly decent with the exception of the frequency balance, which put bass up front and recessed the mids and treble quite severely. However, if the balance of the XB500 is (+2 bass, -1 mids, -1 treble), the XB40EX is more like (+3,-2,-2). It really is very biased in favor of the low end. The result is that the XB40EX warrants lower listening levels as equating the output levels of the midrange and treble of the XB40 with those of a more balanced earphone makes the bass nauseating. Unfortunately, the 13.5mm drivers really aren’t resolving enough to maintain reasonable levels of detail and texturing at lower volumes. Balance aside, the drivers put on a good show for an earphone tuned the way the XB40EX is. Bass impact is enormous in quantity but still slightly more controlled than something like the Sennheiser CX300. Most of the bass comes in fairly high but sub-bass is not missing altogether, though it can be hard to distinguish from the ever-present blanket of mid/upper-bass.

 Expectedly, some of the bass bloat affects the midrange, which is generally warm and smooth. Truth be told, there’s simply not much to be said about the midrange until the bass hump is equalized away since it is recessed to the point of being irrelevant. Even with the bass dropped to what I consider near-flat level with a parametric EQ, the mids are nothing special – the clarity doesn’t quite match the Meelec M9 detail trails (distantly) the ViSang R01 and the Brainwavz models. Still, I’ve definitely heard worse – at least the XB40EX is not as tiring to listen to as the metallic-sounding Skullcandy Titans or as muddy as the Earsquake FISH at reasonable volumes.

 The treble is competent but far from outstanding. It reminds me of the high end of the Sennheiser CX250, which I rather like. Trouble is – the CX250 doesn’t have bass that crowds out everything else and costs about 2x less than the Sonys. There is a bit of hard-edginess to the treble and a spot of vocal sibilance is present on some tracks but such nuances are usually swallowed up by the bass and therefore don’t detract from the overall experience. The presentation, too, is quite decent – especially compared to the similarly-priced and similarly consumer-friendly Skullcandy FMJ – but not quite competitive with earphones such as the Brainwavz M1 and Meelectronics M6. The soundstage has good depth and ok width but for the most part stays concentrated in the center. The omnipresent bass can once again detract greatly from the realism of the experience, especially with live recordings.

 Value *(5.5/10)* – Head-Fi is quite clearly not the target audience of the Sony XB40EX – to say that these earphones are bass-heavy is a major understatement. In terms of overall frequency balance, the only earphones that even come close to offering the sort of bass dominance exemplified by the XB40EX are the TDK ‘Extra Bass’ EB900s. The EB900s are admittedly grainier and edgier but at the same time they are more manageable with a bit of equalization and have a more easy-going fit. Those interested in spending $40 on nothing but bass should concentrate on these two. For everyone else, better choices abound, though of course certain genre preferences may make the XB40EX a more appealing option. Personally I’d rather be listening to the MDR-EX082 (aka EX85), which comes as a stock earphone with many Sony players.

*Pros: User-friendly cable, generally smooth sound, decent sense of space
 Cons: Large; will be uncomfortable for some; bass dominates mids & treble*
  
  
*(3A39) Skullcandy FMJ*


Reviewed Dec 2010
  
 Details: One of Skullcandy’s pricier – and more popular - models
 Current Price: *$36* from amazon.com (MSRP: $69.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _16-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) silicone tips, Comply foam tips, and soft carrying pouch (note: 2010 version ships with clamshell case instead)
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The shells are metal but feel very light and a little cheap. Strain relief is nonexistent on housing entry and at the y-split. The clear cable resembles Meelec cables externally but is thinner and has a tendency to kink. In addition, the 3.3’ cable length is far too short for the average adult
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Low since the earphones are ported and the driver bulges prevent deep insertion. The included Comply tips help a bit
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Very low
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – Though the FMJs are straight-barrel earphones, the big metal bulge housing the drivers can get in the way of wearing them comfortably for more than an hour or two. Wearing them over-the-ear is more comfortable but made needlessly difficult by the short cable

 Sound* (3.6/10*) – The FMJ is my third experience with Skullcandy earphones, following the entry-level Ink’d buds and the mid-range TiTans, which had somewhat similar sound signatures – powerful and forward bass, thin and dry mids, and prominent but harsh treble. The FMJ surprised me, not only by being so **** dreadful that I considered giving up on this review but also by taking on a different sound signature than the other Skullcandy IEMs. The FMJs are generally mid-forward but the bass certainly makes its presence known. Unlike the TiTans, which have fairly good, if overdone, low end extension, the FMJs carry a massive amount of mid- and upper- bass and little sub-bass. The extremely forward midrange makes the FMJ sound more balanced than the other Skullcandy earphones but at higher volumes the bass still reveals itself to be fat and muddy – certainly not as accurate or controlled as on the JVC Marshmallows or Sony MDR-EX082. In addition, drum crackle can be unpleasantly sharp, sometimes startlingly so – an issue of tuning rather than technical capability as the higher-end Grado iGi exhibits this as well.

 One upside of the forward midrange is that the bass fails to overpower it at reasonable listening volumes. There is also an illusion of clarity brought about by the peculiar balance of the midrange – vocals come across powerfully and intelligibly. The natural clarity of the FMJs, however, is at best on par with the much-cheaper Earsquake SHA or Meelec M2. Detail is similarly underwhelming, though again the forward mids act to force what little detail there is on the listener. Those who have never before owned good earphones will be tricked into thinking that the FMJs are reproducing parts of the music stock earphones do not while in reality they are simply terrible at differentiating between a track’s background and foreground (more on this later).

 The treble is admittedly better than the slightly harsh highs of the Ink’d buds and the metallic high end of the TiTans. The FMJs are slightly smoother and roll off later than the Ink’d buds. They are also warmer in tone and more natural-sounding than the TiTans. That’s where the good new ends, however – the presentation of the FMJs is one of the most congested I have ever heard from a >$20 pair of earphones. The biggest problem is that they have no soundstage – zip, zilch, nada. I’ve heard some narrow-sounding earphones before but the FMJ has the sonic space of a Porta Potty. Expectedly, most tracks sound at least slightly congested (just imagine cramming a four-piece band into said Porta Potty). Instrumental separation, imaging, and positioning are all quite poor – everything just sounds in-your-face forward. There are certainly listeners who like a more forward presentation but I can’t help but think that the FMJs are better suited for audiobooks and voice calls than music or movies.

 Value *(4/10)* – Let’s face it - Skullcandy products are not very well-regarded around Head-Fi for reasons beyond simple audiophile snobbishness. Still, the entry-level Ink’d buds prove that even Skullcandy products can be good value for money when priced low enough. The FMJ, however, is undoubtedly one of the least enjoyable listening experiences I’ve had in the history of this thread. It is not the lowest-scoring earphone in this review because frankly, it isn’t that bad from a technical standpoint, but even those in search of an extremely forward sound heavy on both the lows and mids can do better for the money. Unless, of course, a nonexistent soundstage and mediocre fit, build quality, and isolation are the other requirements.

*Pros: Not bass monsters, come with Comply tips, low cable noise
 Cons: Short cable; will be uncomfortable for some; poor clarity, no soundstage*
  
  
*(3A40) Hippo Boom*


Reviewed Jan 2011

 Details: Budget basshead-oriented earphone from Jaben’s in-house brand
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $43)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _20-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Like the other Hippo earphones, the Boom feels rather sturdy with its metal shells, rubbery cables, and low profile 3.5mm L-plug. Mild driver flex is present but not problematic
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Fairly typical of sealed-back straight-barrel dynamics
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Can be quite annoying when worn cable-down; fine otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The Boom is a little tubby in shape but is tapered in the front and quite comfortable to insert. The weighty housings may be an issue for some and the non-removable shirt clip is very annoying but the fit is good overall

 Sound *(4.8/10)* – The sound signature of the Hippo Boom is a far cry from the treble-heavy Hippo Shroom and subbass-heavy VB, both pricier models in the company’s lineup. There is no mistaking the Boom for a high-end earphone but for a budget set it does quite a few things properly. True to the name, the Boom is an impactful earphone with a full-bodied low end. Unlike the VB, the Boom has its bass come in mostly above 40Hz but extension is still good for a budget set. The bass is a bit boomy and slightly muddy but a step tighter than that of the cheaper Meelec M9. There is a bit of resonance within the housings and the tone is quite dark overall but for lovers of bass the low end of the Boom will fall in that happy range beween ‘added kick’ and ‘bass monster’.

 The midrange of the Boom is clear and detailed but a bit dry and slightly recessed in comparison to the low end. There is very little warmth carried over from the bass and the liquidity of the smoother Hippo Pearl just isn’t there. The treble is not recessed but not quite as prominent as the low end and can be a bit harsh and overbearing at times. It’s a little grainy and somewhat sharp/edgy, not unlike that of the Hippo VB. Extension is good – the smoother Pearl seems to roll off a bit earlier than the Boom. The presentation is decent but the Boom is neither open-sounding nor very spacious. The bass and treble are both fairly aggressive and the sonic space never quite feels three-dimensional or out-of-the-head – just the usual three-blob (left, right, center) soundstage. Layering is decent, however, and things never really sound congested but the similarly-priced Pearl sounds both larger and more enveloping.

 Value *(7/10)* – The Hippo Boom is a well-built and comfortable budget earphone designed to provide ample bass for all but the most die-hard bassheads without sacrificing midrange clarity or treble energy. To an extent it is successful, exhibiting plentiful bass impact, a clear - if somewhat recessed – midrange, and edgy treble. At the same time, the balance and refinement of the higher-end Hippo VB just isn’t there and the Boom lacks the spaciousness and musicality of the similarly-priced Hippo Pearl as well as the Brainwavz M1 and ProAlpha. Unless the Boom’s signature is exactly what is sought, it isn’t difficult to do better for the money on the whole.

*Pros: Solid construction, impactful bass, good clarity
 Cons: Shirt clip not removable, edgy treble*


*(3A41) Hippo Pearl*


Reviewed Jan 2011

 Details: Hippo Boom alternative from Jaben’s in-house brand
 Current Price: *$43* from unclewilsons.com (MSRP: $43)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Like the other Hippo earphones, the Pearl feels rather sturdy with its metal shells, rubbery cables, and well-relieved 3.5mm L-plug. Driver flex is a bit worse than with the Boom but not too bad
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Fairly typical of sealed-back straight-barrel dynamics
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Can be quite annoying when worn cable-down; fine otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The Pearl is smaller than the Boom and can be inserted more deeply without discomfort. The housings are lighter and rounded at the rear – very unobtrusive on the whole

 Sound *(6.4/10)* – If the hippo Boom is the budget-oriented equivalent of the higher-end Hippo VB, the Pearl is the budget version of the Brainwavz M3. Its bass is softer and rounder than that of the Boom but equally impactful. It’s not the deepest or tightest but very pleasant on the whole – warm, full, rumbly, and engaging. The low end of the Pearl can creep up a bit on the midrange but generally isn’t as forward as that of the Boom. The overall balance is better with the Pearl and as a result and the midrange, despite being no more forward than that of the Boom, carries more emphasis. The mids are a bit thicker and not as clear as those of the Boom but sound more full-bodied as a result. The Pearl is unquestionably the warmer and smoother of the two earphones but it’s so much more than that – compared to dry and dark Boom, the Pearl sounds natural and organic – a sidestep from the signatures of the Boom, Shroom, and VB.

 The high end retains the smoothness of the midrange, giving up the edginess of the Boom for a softer, more easy-going sound. The treble is still fairly lively but not nearly as harsh or aggressive. Detailing is surprisingly good and the timbre is quite natural for a budget earphone. The presentation, too, steps away from the confined feel of the Boom in favor of a more spacious sound. The Pearl has good presence across a larger sonic area and a fairly spherical presentation. Being slightly less dark than the Boom, it also seems to have more air, which does wonders for the overall experience. Interestingly, it is also quite a bit less efficient than Boom, requiring a half-dozen more volume notches from my Cowon J3, and doesn’t perform at its best at low output volumes.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – Despite its modest price and austere appearance, the Hippo Pearl packs quite a sonic punch, beating out its siblings – the Boom and Shroom – in balance and musicality. The Pearl isn’t the most proficient earphone from a technical standpoint but it is surprisingly balanced, musical, and easy-going. As with the other Hippo earphones, microphonics can be a problem with cable-down wear but in all other aspects the Pearl is an extremely competent product, picking up a few extra points along the way for the diminutive size and comfortable fit. As a practical and pleasant all-rounder, the Pearl is a very impressive entry in its price category.

*Pros: Solid build quality, comfortable fit, musical & well-balanced sound
 Cons: Mild driver flex*
  
  
*(3A42) MEElectronics CX21*


Reviewed Jan 2011

 Details: Entry-level model from Meelec’s new ‘clarity’ series of IEMs
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $39.99; $44.99 for CX21P with mic)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _15-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.4’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Stock bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5) *– Single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and triple-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings of the CX21 are made completely out of plastic and feel a bit cheap next to the older M-series models. The cable is quite nice and completely identical to the one used on the higher-end CW31, down to the low-profile 45°-plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Isolation is good with an over-the-ear fit and longer tips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nearly absent with over-the-ear wear, low otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The angled housings of the CX21 resemble old Shure models (of the E3/E4 generation) and fit similarly. With an over-the-ear fit and longer tips the housings actually clear my ears completely and remain comfortable for hours

 Sound *(6.6/10)* – While the consumer-oriented ‘M’-series of Meelec’s lineup is moving closer and closer to basshead heaven with the latest releases, the CX21 represents a move in a different direction. As a part of the new clarity series, the CX21 pursues a brighter, more balanced sound, competing with the likes of the Maximo iM-590 and Brainwavz M1. The CX21 has less bass than any of Meelec’s other dynamics but still narrowly beats the armature-based A151 in impact and depth and delivers more punch than the similarly-priced Brainwavz M1. When it comes to texture and detail the Brainwavz, unburdened by the need to deliver sizeable impact, still win out but the CX21 doesn’t lag far behind.

 Expectedly, there is no midrange bleed, which allows the CX21 to stay true to its name and provide impressive clarity across the range. The mids are in good balance with the bass - neither as forward as those of the Brainwavz M1 nor as recessed as those of the Meelec M9 or M6 – and can be characterized as crisp and detailed. The CX21 does sound thinner in the mids than the Brainwavz M1, sacrificing the lush smoothness of the Brainwavz mids for a dryer sound with slightly more upper midrange emphasis. Despite this, the treble of the CX21 is neither harsh nor sibilant unless the track calls for it. It lacks the sparkle of the Maximo iM-590 and the softness of the Brainwavz M1, appearing a bit hard-edged and, at times, lacking fine detail. Top-end extension is good for the asking price – about on-par with the Brainwavz M1 and lagging just a tad behind the iM-590.

 In terms of presentation, the CX21 is merely competent – the average-sized soundstage has plenty of air and good separation and positioning, partly due to the excellent clarity, but it doesn’t portray distance as well as the higher-end A151. The timbre is a touch less natural than that of the higher-end CW31 and the Brainwavz M1/M2 and the dynamic range is also a bit poorer than that of the Brainwavz earphones. Tonally, the CX21 is quite neutral, sounding more like the RE-ZERO or Etymotic MC5 than the brighter Maximo iM-590 or darker Meelec A151. Such neutrality is rare among budget IEMs, which makes the CX21 arguably more unique in sound signature than the higher-end CW31 and puts it in good company with sets such as the Apple Dual-Driver in-ears and ECCI PR200.

 Value *(8/10) *– The CX21 is Meelec’s first attempt at a neutral sound signature and, for the money, it hits the nail square on the head. With a slight bit of added bass kick and good presence throughout, the CX21 accompanies the pricier CW31 in filling out the middle third of Meelec’s model range and competes well with the other entry-level all-rounders. The angled housings make the CX21 comfortable for over-the-ear use and microphonics are impressively low, making up for the plasticky construction of the earphones. Those looking for warmth or powerful bass will vastly favor the CW31 (or one of the M-series models) but I quite like the slightly analytical tilt of the lower-end earphone.

*Pros: Low microphonics, comfortable, balanced and neutral sound
 Cons: Least impressive build quality of all Meelec products*


*(3A43) MEElectronics CW31*


Reviewed Jan 2011

 Details: Wooden ergonomically-shaped earphone from Meelec
 Current Price: *$50* from meelec.com (MSRP: $49.99); $55 for CW31P with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _99 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.4’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _7mm *oval*_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and triple-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The housings of the CW31 are lightweight and quite small, made partly out of a light-colored wood and partly out of plastic. The nozzles are oval in shape (which I’ve only seen once before on the ATH-CK6) and protected by a fine mesh filter. The cable is well-relieved, smooth, flexible and terminated with a new lower-profile 45°-plug
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The design of the CW31 allows only the nozzle to be inserted into the ear canal but the included bi-flange tips provide reasonable isolation
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Typically low but the CW31 cannot be worn over-the-ear so cable noise is difficult to eliminate completely
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The fit of the CW31 is fairly similar to the other half in-ear earphones but it is smaller and lighter than most. In addition, the tapered housings prevent the CW31 from putting pressure on the outer ear, making it very easy to wear for prolonged periods

 Sound *(6.7/10)* – As the middle earphone in Meelectronics’ clarity series, the CW31 really doesn’t differ a whole lot from the lower-end CX21. In a nutshell, the CW31 adds extra bass and a noticeable bit of warmth to the balance of the lower-end model. The bass is still quite controlled but the CW31 has better depth and power at the low end. The bass is more full-bodied and the notes are given a pleasant warmth and roundness compared to the cooler-sounding CX21. In terms of impact, the CW31 still lags behind Meelec’s M-series models but falls closer to the Brainwavz M2 than it does to the M1. As with the CX21, there is a bit of bass detail and texture missing compared to the higher-end A151 and CC51 models but for the price the bass performance is quite competitive.

 The small increase in bass quantity over the CX21 results in some warm overtones being added to the midrange of the CW31. Clarity is still very good, however, and the midrange is no more recessed than that of the CX21. Detail and texture are similar as well – just a tad below what the Maximo iM-590 and Brainwavz M1 are capable of but a bit better than with the Meelec M6 or Dr Dre Beats Tour. On the whole, the warmer CW31 sounds a little thicker and more fluid than the CX21 but the difference likely won’t be noticeable unless the two are compared head-to-head. The treble of the CW31 is neither harsh nor sibilant unless the track calls for it and appears to be just a tad softer than that of the CX21. Fine detail is still missing at times but top-end extension is quite good.

 In terms of presentation, the CW31 is slightly more well-rounded compared to the lower-end model. While the CX21 has better separation and a bit more width, the CW31 seems a touch more spherical and enveloping. Neither earphone has the positioning accuracy of the A151 but the CW31 does seem to have a little more depth to it, partly as a result of the fuller, more powerful low end. The timbre and tone of the CW31 seem a little more natural as well though the earphones really aren’t radically different on that count.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The CW31 is yet another solid entrant in the sub-$60 market segment, offering a minimalistic design, comfortable form factor, decent build quality, and a microphone option all for not very much money. For those who don’t mind sacrificing some isolation and like a bit of warmth and bass boost to their sound, the CW31 is likely worth the price premium over the lower-end CX21 but both earphones deliver clear, accurate sound and the kind of real-world usability we’ve come to expect from Meelectronics products.

*Pros: Small & comfortable, low microphonics, all-around solid sound quality
 Cons: Mediocre isolation*
  
  
*(3A44) MEElectronics M21*


Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: Entry-level earphone from Meelec’s M-series available in a variety of colors
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $34.99); $40 for M21P with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _92 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The build is similar to the older M11/M11+ models although the M21 is a bit larger. The housings are all-metal, the cabling is sturdy and well-relieved, and paper filters protect the nozzles. The low-profile L-plug is a welcome change from the 45-degree plug of the M11
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Fairly average due to large rear-facing vent
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low when worn cord-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The M21 is a bit larger than the older M11+ and the fit kit isn’t as extensive but it’s still a very comfortable straight-barrel earphone. With deep-sealing tips I even managed to sleep in them, which I can’t say for the larger M31 model

 Sound *(5.9/10)* – The sound of the M21 carries a slight emphasis on bass consistent with the other models in Meelec’s M-series but the overall balance of the earphones wouldn’t put them out of place in the clarity series, either. In terms of quantity, the bass of the M21 falls closer to the balance-oriented CX21 and CW31 models and lags noticeably behind the significant amounts of bass boost offered by the M6, M11+, and M31. There is some sub-bass roll-off and most of the emphasis is on the mid- and upper bass regions. The bass is rumbly and a bit soft in character – much like that of the M31 but not nearly as voluminous and less ‘boomy’ as a result. The M6 and M11+ sound quite a bit more aggressive in comparison. Overall, I would say that bass control is decent-to-good and mid-range bleed is not significant enough to be distracting.

 There is no significant drop in emphasis when moving from the bass to the midrange, which gives the M21 a leg up in balance on the bass-monster M11+ and the v-shaped M6. If the M6 is recessed in the mids, the M21 is recessed (or, to put it in more positive terms, laid-back) across the range. The mids are similar in quality to the M11+ - a bit dry and thick in character and not as clear or detailed as those of the CX21 but still quite adequate in the context of the sound signature. To be fair, the CX21 does emphasize its midrange more than the M21 does and needs the extra bit of detail and clarity to avoid appearing muffled.

 As is the case with the M11+, the treble of the M21 is not notably harsh or sibilant but doesn’t ooze smoothness, either, especially at high volumes. On some tracks the earphones appear a bit edgy but much of the time the treble is a bit laid-back, which provides a nice contrast to the more aggressive treble of the M6 and M11+. Compared to the M6 there’s a drop in sparkle and airiness as a result of the slightly more relaxed treble presentation but extension is still decent. The overall presentation falls somewhere between the M6 and M11+ - the M21 can be quite wide and airy-sounding but still doesn’t quite keep up with the large headstage and immersive 3D feel of my M6. On a couple of tracks the M21’s ability to portray distance threw me off guard but in general its presentation is best described as ‘well-rounded’. In fact, I think ‘well-rounded’ describes the whole earphone rather well. It should be noted that as with all of the M-series earphones I have heard, the M21 sounds best at lower volumes. It’s also, as far as I can tell, less sensitive than any of the other M-series earphones.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– The Meelectronics M21 took me by surprise as a bit of a sidestep from the generally more bass-heavy M6, M11+, and M31 models. While the bass is definitely above baseline on the M21, the earphone still possesses decent balance and really doesn’t do a whole lot wrong for a set aimed at the mainstream market. Though it doesn’t have the wide headstage of the M6 or the midrange clarity and detail of the M11+, the more well-rounded M21 may just be my favourite M-series model regardless.

*Pros: Well-built and easy-to-use; sound signature is solid all around
 Cons: Yields to other Meelec models in specific sonic traits*
  

*(3A45) MEElectronics M31*


Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: Bass-heavy earphone from Meelec’s M-series available in a variety of colors
 Current Price: *$45* from meelec.com (MSRP: $44.99); $50 for M21P with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _96 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The build is similar to the older M11/M11+ models although the M31 is quite large in comparison. The housings are all-metal, the cabling is sturdy and well-relieved, and paper filters protect the nozzles. The low-profile L-plug is a welcome change from the 45-degree plug of the M11
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Fairly average due to large rear-facing vent
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low when worn cord-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The M31 is a large earphone and is best worn with a shallower seal despite being tapered at the front for deeper insertion. It’s fairly light and the fit is quite inoffensive but doesn’t quite disappear the way the smaller M11 and M21 models do

 Sound *(5.7/10)* – If the M21 is the most balanced M-series earphone I’ve heard so far, the M31 is the bassiest. It delivers gobs of head-pounding impact at the slightest indication of bass on a track. As one might guess, the bass boost does bring with it great sub-bass extension. However, that’s a bit of a hollow victory as the drivers don’t do a great job of texturing sub-bass response. More often than not, the bass is felt rather than heard. As with the M21, the low end of the M31 tends towards ‘boomy’. Expectedly, there’s a fair bit of midrange bleed and the mids of the M31 are slightly warmer than those of the M21 as a result. Aside from the differences brought about by the bass balance, however, the two earphones are fairly similar – the midrange of the M31 is not as clear or detailed as that of the CX21 and not as recessed as that of the M6. The heavy bass does make the mids sound a bit less emphasized than with the M21 but those seeking perfect balance probably won’t be looking a the M31 in the first place.

 The treble transition seems a touch smoother with the M31, mostly because the bass is far more dominant, but the clarity, detail, and extension are all fairly similar to the M21. One major difference is in the presentation – while the M21 sounds spacious, well-rounded, and sometimes downright open, the boomier nature and more bass-heavy balance of the M31 reduces the airiness of the earphones. The presentation of the M31 is by no means offensive but it’s definitely closer in size to the M11+ than the M21 or M6. The peculiar balance of the earphones also gives them a darker overall tonality compared to the (fairly neutral) M21. Though none of these differences are particularly noticeable individually, they do add up to a different sort of sound en masse. It should be noted that at lower volumes the bass of the M31 isn’t as intrusive and they sound more balanced and natural. However, I still think that those who are not bass-obsessed need not apply as the M31 really isn’t better than the M21 from a technical standpoint – just bassier.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – Yet another well-built and user-friendly design from Meelectronics, the M31 is an earphone with many strengths. At the same time, it is an unrelentingly bass-heavy take on the M-series sound signature and will not appeal to those looking for balance or accuracy. Its mainstream sound signature is competition for the likes of the Sony XB40EX and TDK EB900, and that’s how it should be viewed. For those looking for the most bass to be had under $50 with minimal sacrifices elsewhere, the M31 is a good option. For overall sound quality, I just don’t see myself picking it over the M21.

*Pros: Huge bass response; solid build quality
 Cons: Huge bass response; physically larger than M21 and M11+*


*(3A46) Xears TD-III v2*


Reviewed Mar 2011 / updated Aug 2011

 Details: Latest revision of one of Xears’ flagship in-ears
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: 42€)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: _124 dB_ | Freq: _6-28k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges, stock foamies, generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, foamhybrid tips, and padded carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The TD-III is a wooden take on the Xears’ Turbine-inspired TD100/TD100-II design. As with the other Xears models the nozzles are made of metal and the black finish on the wooden part has a hand-painted feel to it. The strain relief is a bit too hard for my liking but should do the job. The current TD-III revision (v2) comes with a nylon-sheathed j-cord, much like the pricier N3i model. It feels sturdier and carries less noise than the old plastic cord but tends to tangle more. One thing that bothers me about the TD-III is the driver flex, which is similar or perhaps a bit greater than that of the old TD100 (The discontinued TD-III v1 came with a smooth, memory-free plastic-sheathed cable in a standard y-cord configuration)
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Quite good, especially with the included bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Surprisingly low for a cloth cable and helped further by the j-cord configuration
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The fit is similar to that of the Monster Turbine earphones with straight-barrel housings rounded at the front for comfort. The TD-III shells have a weight advantage while Turbines come with nicer eartips. The j-cord may be annoying for some users and tends to make over-the-ear wear a bit of a hassle

 Sound *(7.6/10) *– From memory, the new TD-III sounds quite similar to the Xears TD100 – the now-discontinued metal model I fell in love with back in August of 2010. Like the TD100, the TD-III has deep, full-bodied, and very impactful bass. The overall bass quantity of the TD-III is just a touch ahead of the Thinksound TS02 and Skullcandy Holua. Texture and detail are on-par with the (noticeably dryer-sounding) TS02 – an impressive feat for an earphone that sounds as smooth as the TD-III does. The attack and decay times are on-par with the Thinksounds as well - enjoyable even on fast-paced electronic tracks but still conducive to a slight thickness of note and faintly ‘lingering’ bass. Like the TD100, the TD-III will be a bit too bass-heavy for some but, as with the Monster Turbine, I really don’t find the quality of its bass offensive in the least.

 There is a touch of bass bleed but nothing too bad – the Skullcandy Holua fares far worse and even the significantly leaner-sounding Woodees Blues don’t exactly shame the TD-III when it comes to resolution and control. The mids are warm, slightly forward, and extremely lush and sweet. Detail is good but the thickness does reduce the clarity ever so slightly compared to more analytical sets such as the RE0. The treble is, for the most part, very smooth and easily competes with the Woodees Blues in clarity and detail. Compared to the Woodees, the TD-III is a tiny bit less sparkly but still has very good treble presence. Like the midrange, the treble is a bit thick and lacks the air of some of the more analytical earphones. It is far from dull, however, and manages to keep my attention quite easily when necessary.

 When it comes to presentation, the TD-III, like the TD100, manages to impress yet again. Soundstage width and depth are very good – easily the best among all of the reasonably-priced woodies I’ve heard - and instrumental separation is quite decent for a mid-range dynamic. The earphone is capable of delivering an excellent sense of distance but leans slightly towards intimacy. As a result, the musical experience provided by the TD-III is spacious but cohesive. The characteristic note thickness of the TD-III makes it more musical and satisfying but reduces air slightly. Imaging is still good, however, and the overall tone of the earphone is not made darker because of it. All in all, for an earphone with the bass power of the TD-III, the overall sound is surprisingly well-balanced and enjoyable. It is colored and exciting and I quite like it despite all of my analytical biases.

 Value *(9/10)* – Right out of the box the TD-III annoys with moderate driver flex and perhaps offers up more bass power than I would like. Its accessory pack and general build quality don’t shame the competition, either, but it has one ace up its sleeve – the sound. A year or so ago, the sound quality of the TD-III would have been so completely out of place in its price bracket that the competition would be rendered irrelevant. Even today, the TD-III sets itself apart from the competing Woodees and Thinksound models by offering better top-to-bottom extension, a more spacious soundstage, and seductively liquid mids. For those who prioritize sound quality by a large margin as I do, the TD-III is easily the reasonably-priced wooden IEM to buy.

*Pros: Very capable all-rounder with a bass-happy sound sig
 Cons: **J-cord may be an issue for some; m**oderate driver flex, not gift-able for lack of packaging*

 For a longer review of the Xears TD-III, complete with comparisons to the Thinksound TS02, Woodees Blues, Skullcandy Holua, and Fischer Audio Daleth, see here
  
  
*(3A47) PADACS Aksent*


Reviewed Mar 2011

 Details: Unique-looking metal earphone from iPad accessory manufacturer PADACS
 Current Price: *$50* from padacs.com (MSRP: $49.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq:_ 20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock foamhybrids, generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Foamhybrid tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The gigantic metal housings are finished in glossy gunmetal paint and feel very sturdy. Paper filters protect the nozzles from earwax. At the other end, a rear vent provides increased airflow to the large dynamic driver and beefy strain reliefs protect the rubbery cable. The cable is of average thickness and terminates in a 3.5mm I-plug. A large unit holding the integrated microphone, 1-button remote, and sliding analogue volume control is positioned at the y-split
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The foam tips provide a good seal and isolate well but the earphones are still vented dynamics and isolate accordingly
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Noise made by the rubberized cable is slightly below average and the included shirt clip helps lower it further. In addition, because the mic is integrated into the y-split, the Aksent can be worn over-the-ear much more easily than headsets with cable-mounted microphones
 Comfort *(3/5)* – Though the housings are quite large, they weigh no more than those of the average metal-shelled earphone. The oversize foam tips are soft and compress quite easily, expanding to provide a stable seal even with shallower fitment. I do wish that the spacing between the tip set sizes were smaller, with maybe a fourth pair included to bridge the gap between the current ‘Medium’ and ‘Large’

 Sound *(6.6/10)* – The Aksent is a decidedly bass-heavy earphone, with the powerful sound signature befitting the enormous housings of the earphones. The bass is about as impactful but slightly more rumble-prone than that of the Fischer Audio Eterna. Low-end extension is very good – again on-par with the Eterna – and the balance of the Aksent very nearly matches its bass quantity to the true bass-monster earphones in the <$50 range – sets such as the TDK EB900, Sony XB40EX, and MEElectronics M31. The bass is full-bodied and has a bit more impact than texture. In a way, the character and quantity of the bass actually work for the Aksent since its foam tips require a bit more fiddling to form an airtight seal than the silicone tips commonly used by most other manufacturers. Even with a poor seal, the Aksent is highly unlikely to elicit any complaints of insufficient bass. With a good seal, on the other hand, the Aksent may elicit complaints of excessive bass from those who prefer a more analytical sound. However, unlike the bass-heavy sets from Sony and TDK, the bass quality of the Aksent doesn’t suffer much in favor of quantity, though it isn’t quite as textured, controlled, or detailed as that of the pricier Eterna.

 Expectedly, the huge bass boost of the Aksent does bleed slightly into the midrange, warming it up and coloring the sound signature. However, the midrange is not nearly as recessed as that of the Eterna, making the Aksent sound more balanced and allowing the volume to be kept lower without sacrificing midrange articulation. Generally, the mids are smooth, rich, and a little thick. Clarity and detail are decent for a bass-heavy earphone but the leaner-sounding midrange and treble of the Eterna are more technically proficient. Still, the Aksent performs very well considering its price and bass-heavy inclinations. The treble transition is extremely smooth and emphasis doesn’t drop off until well into the treble region, providing solid presence across the range. Top-end extension is decent as well, especially considering that the Aksent’s closest competitors in the headset realm are the MEElec M31P and Nuforce NE-700M, neither of which has a significant advantage in balance.

 The presentation, similarly, is well-rounded and competent. The soundstage is average in size but layering is good. The huge bass has a tendency to be omnipresent in the sonic stage but that’s true of most reasonably-priced bassy earphones. The slight thickness of note also detracts slightly from instrumental separation though it is still easily as good as with Meelec’s similarly-priced M31 and M11+ models. On the whole, the Aksent doesn’t so much wow with anything in particular but impresses more with how little of a hit it takes in overall sound quality despite producing a copious amount of bass.

 Value *(8/10)* – The Padacs Aksent in-ear earphones offer a unique blend of style, sound, and functionality at their (very popular) price point. The Aksent is the only reasonably-priced set I can think of to provide a smartphone mic and remote as well as a built-in analogue volume control. The large gunmetal housings are similarly unique and, while probably not ideal for those with small ears, remain quite comfortable with the provided foamhybrid eartips. The sound signature of the Aksent puts it closest to truly bass-heavy mid-level IEMs without sacrificing a whole lot in the mids and highs. While not at all revolutionary, the sound is sure to appeal to the mainstream consumer and, combined with the generally good build quality and isolation, makes for a solid mid-range headset.

*Pros: Well-built and attractive; integrated microphone and analogue volume control; bass-heavy but still competent sound
 Cons: Only foam tips included; large spacing between stock tip sizes; very large housings*

 For a full review of the PADACS Aksent please see here. 
  
  
*(3A48) Denon AH-C360*


Reviewed Apr 2011

 Details: Entry-level angled-nozzle earphone from Denon
 Current Price: *$49* from amazon.com (MSRP: $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _99 dB_ | Freq: _5-24k Hz_ | Cable: _2’ I-plug + 2.5’ L-plug extension_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), 2.5’ extension cable, shirt clip, and zippered clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are plastic and the thin cable does not inspire a whole lot of confidence but the nozzles use mesh filters and the integrated strain reliefs work well
 Isolation *(2.5/5) *– The housings are vented but the angled nozzles still allow for decent isolation
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Not too high in the smooth, plastic-sheathed cable but some may have difficulty wearing the C360 over-the-ear to eliminate cable noise completely
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The angled-nozzle housings are extremely light and fit beautifully. The off-center cable exit point and rubbery housings further illustrate Denon’s attention to detail when it comes to ergonomics and convenience

 Sound *(4.7/10)* – While the tuning of the AH-C360 is very indicative of their consumer-oriented nature, the somewhat v-shaped overall balance does stay true to the signature of the flagship AH-C710. The bass of the AH-C360 is big and somewhat bloated, though not quite as offensive as that of the Sennheiser CX300. Bass impact is fairly good and the low end is quite tactile and well-extended. Speed, texture, and detail, however, are all somewhat lacking, as one might expect from a budget-level earphone with this much bass. ‘Tight’ simply isn’t a word I would use to describe the low end of the C360.

 The midrange is slightly warm and tends to be overshadowed by the bass. The upper midrange, while clear of bass bleed, is noticeably recessed. The resulting sound is slightly dull and lacks the fullness of sets such as the Meelec M21 and Brainwavz M1. Detail and clarity are, on the whole, decent but don’t break any barriers in the price tier. The similarly-priced Klipsch S3, despite similarly enhanced bass, has noticeably cleaner and crisper sound. Even the cheaper H2O Audio Flex walks all over the C360 when it comes to clarity and articulation.

 The treble of the AH-C360 is hyped up in an attempt to balance out the sound signature. It does not, however, as the earphones still sound slightly dark on the whole. The top end of the AH-C360, instead of being laid-back and smooth as it is with most other budget bass monsters, is quite prominent at times and definitely runs the risk of listening fatigue for those sensitive to it. Surprisingly, the treble emphasis of the C360 manages to add edginess to the top end without any sparkle or air. Indeed, the entire sound is slightly stuffy despite the average-sized soundstage and decent imaging. If not for the strained and bloated bass, the AH-C360 could be a very good entry-level earphone, but it simply doesn’t offer enough refinement over other mainstream offerings to stand out from the crowd.

 Value *(6/10)* – The Denon AH-C360 is one of the many bass-heavy entry-level earphones offered by mainstream manufacturers. While it is less bloated than the ever-popular Sennheiser CX300 and Skullcandy TiTans, the overall sound quality of the C360 is really nothing to write home about. Neither are the isolation or build quality – both are merely adequate – and, while the angled-nozzle housings are extremely comfortable, the modular cable and low y-split may annoy some users. Further price cuts may bring the AH-C360 down into ‘must buy’ territory but as it stands, Denon’s budget model really doesn’t have a leg up on the competition.

*Pros: Superb comfort
 Cons: Modular cable can be frustrating; sub-par frequency balance*


*(3A49) H2O Audio Surge Pro Mini*


Reviewed Apr 2011

 Details: BA-based waterproof earphone from H2O Audio
 Current Price: *$51* from jr.com (MSRP: $99.99)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _56Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _6mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style:_ Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2/5) *– Single-flange conical silicone tips (5 sizes) & foamhybrid tips (2 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are made out of a tough plastic and feel solid. The cable is medium in thickness and sheathed in blue plastic. Small rubber sleeves take the place of strain reliefs on cord entry and a 2” long strain relief, designed to work with waterproof mp3 player cases, protects the 3.5mm plug. And yes, they will survive prolonged exposure to sweat and/or water
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Quite good, especially with longer tips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Bothersome when worn cord-down; tolerable with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The Surge comes with five sizes of unusually thick elastomer tips, which require some getting used to for those of us accustomed to silicone. Getting a good seal with them takes careful selection of the right size but once sealed the earphones will stay in surprisingly well even during intense physical activity. The housings are also very small and light – on par with the entry-level Flex model. Several days may be required for the cables to break in for over-the-ear wear

 Sound *(6.2/10) *– H2O Audio’s dynamic-driver Surge and Flex models both managed to impress me with the competency of their sound despite the waterproof coating applied to the drivers. The single balanced armature transducer used by the Pro Mini is a bit less fortunate, losing speed, clarity, and articulation compared to all but the cheapest armature-based competitors, but still performs very well next to the other waterproof earphones I’ve had the pleasure of hearing. At the bottom end the Pro Mini lacks a bit of extension – those looking for sub-bass rumble and slam will probably want to stay away. On the whole, however, the bass is quite tight and punchy. Impact is decent for a single BA, falling just a hair behind the pricier Meelec A151 and Westone 1. Don’t expect Ety-like control out of these but they fare about as well as a consumer-oriented sub-$100 BA should.

 Expectedly, the midrange is completely free of bass bleed. Detail and texture are decent but the clarity seems to drop a notch compared to my armature-based Apple Dual-Drivers and Meelec A151s as well as some of the more analytical dynamics in the price range. As a result, the mids of the Surge Pro Mini sound just a tad muffled. Balance-wise I would call the earphones slightly mid-centric in that no part of the frequency spectrum takes attention away from the midrange and the treble and bass both roll off gently at the very top/bottom. Both the midrange and treble are quite smooth even next to the darker-sounding Meelec A151. There is just a bit of sparkle at the top end but nothing that would make them harsh or sibilant except at the highest of volumes (which itself are impractical for reasons outlined below). Top-end extension isn’t the greatest either but quite reasonable for a single-armature design.

 The presentation of the earphones is competent but far from outstanding. The soundstage is slightly below-average in width and depth. Arguably, soundstage size benefits from a shallower seal although using the earphones in their waterproof capacity rules out shallow fitment. Separation is generally good but the drivers seem to run out of steam on very fast and busy tracks. They are still quicker and more resolving than the dynamic drivers used in the Surge and Flex models but the spread in favor of the Pro Mini is smaller than I expected. Tonally, the earphones are fairly neutral – more so than the dark-ish A151s or the brighter Apple Dual-Drivers. There is one more thing worth mentioning – the Surge Pro Mini exhibits some sort of driver flex when inserted. Since it is an armature-based earphone, the effect cannot be driver flex in the traditional sense but the sound put out by the earphones does change dramatically if a lot of pressure is applied on them while maintaining an airtight seal. In their normal, non-pressurized configuration, the Minis are also extremely difficult to drive to high volumes. While they don’t benefit from a dedicated amp from an SQ perspective, they really are very quiet at my normal listening volumes. With the Cowon J3 – a relatively powerful device as far as portable players go – I often found myself cranking the volume to 25/40 or higher just to get reasonable volume out of these.

 Value *(8/10)* – The H2O Audio Surge Pro Mini is a purpose-built underwater listening device that, like H2O’s lower-end models, sacrifices surprisingly little in the way of functionality and sound quality for the sake of shrugging off moisture. The single balanced armature produces balanced and neutral sound and performs remarkably well on all but the busiest tracks. The earphones do require a lot of power to get up to listening volume and the accessory pack is more modest than that of the cheaper Surge model but other than that I have no real complaints about the Pro Mini. For those in search of earphones that can withstand a large amount of moisture and still maintain a focus on accuracy and realism over thumping bass and tonal coloration, these are the ones to get.

*Pros: Waterproof, reasonably well-built, secure fit, balanced and competent sound
 Cons: 2” strain relief may not work well with tiny players, elastomer tips can take some getting used to, likes power*

 Big thanks to *Marcus_C* for loaning me the Surge Pro Mini
  
  
*(3A50) Xears Resonance Black*


Reviewed May 2011

 Details: Angled-nozzle earphone from Xears slotting in below the TD-III in the product line
 Current Price: *est $45* (30€) from xears.com with coupon code KLANGFUZZIS (MSRP: 35€)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: _6-28k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and padded carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The Resonance features tubby angled-nozzle housings with an aluminum rear chamber and plastic at the front. The slightly stiff rubbery cable is shared with TD-III and other Xears models and lacks a sliding cinch
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The design of the resonance prohibits deep insertion but the isolation is still quite good with well-sealing tips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Tolerable but the Resonance is difficult to wear cable-up so the cable noise cannot be eliminated completely
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The angled-nozzle housings of the resonance are wider at the front than the rear, preventing deep insertion. The form factor is reminiscent of the Denon C710 - over-the-ear fitment can be difficult and larger-than-usual tips may be required for a good seal

 Sound *(7.2/10)* – The sound signature of the Resonance falls fairly close to that of the now-defunct Xears TD100 and the higher-end Xears TD-III – emphasized mid-bass, smooth mids, and competent treble with some sparkle. The bass of the Resonance is powerful but controlled and sounds cleaner and crisper than that of the TD-III on sparse tracks. However, the TD-III is generally quicker and maintains composure better as things get busy. The bass of the TD-III also carries slightly more emphasis overall compared to the Resonance, though low-end extension is similarly impressive on both.

 Not surprisingly, the Resonance is not quite as warm, full-bodied, or forward in the midrange as the TD-III. Its midrange is leaner and a bit crisper, with similar clarity and slightly more aggressive detailing. The upper midrange and treble are less laid-back with the Resonance, making it a touch less forgiving of sibilant recordings. On the whole it is still a very smooth and non-fatiguing earphone. Treble sparkle is low-to-moderate in quantity and top-end extension is decent – similar to the Brainwavz M2 with its gently rolled-off treble. The balance of the Resonance is undoubtedly better, however, with the slightly recessed midrange being far less distracting compared to the powerful, forward mids of the M2.

 The presentation of the Resonance is solid as well – the soundstage is smaller than that of the TD-III but the feel of the earphone is, in general, less intimate, putting a greater amount of space between listener and music. Sonic cues are laid out in a convincing manner and the superior treble presence of the Resonance adds a bit of air as well. Separation lags slightly behind the higher-end model but isn’t too bad on the whole. An interesting note – the Resonance is generally a touch less sensitive than the TD-III, achieving lower volumes at the same output level, but still works far better with ‘clean’ sources such as portable amps and players.

 Value* (8/10)* – Giving up a couple of points here and there to the higher-end TD-III model, the Xears Resonance nevertheless holds up quite well in its price range. Though the TD-III stays cleaner when things get busy and provides more of a ‘wow’ factor in casual listening, I actually prefer the slightly less bottom-heavy signature of the Resonance and its more distancing presentation. In terms of usability, the angled-nozzle housings give up a bit of isolation for a comfortable, shallow-insertion form factor and allow the Resonance to exhibit less driver flex than any of the other Xears models. In conjunction with the lower price tag, that makes it worth a look in my book.

*Pros: Solid sound quality with a popular signature; ergonomic form factor
 Cons: Difficult to wear over-the-ear*


*(3A51) Xears Power Systems PS120PRO*


Reviewed May 2011

 Details: Bass-oriented IEM from Xears
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: 38€)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and padded carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The PS120PRO features black-and-blue metal housings with a filtered rear vent. Metal mesh screens protect the nozzles and an inch-long piece of flexible tubing acts as a strain relief. The cord is rubbery and a bit stiff. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Slightly below that of the TD-III but quite passable overall
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Not too bad but the PS120PRO is difficult to wear cable-up due to the long rubber strain relief
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housing shape of the PS120PRO is not all that different from that of the TD-III and the fit is quite similar overall. One major difference is the clear tubing that acts as a strain relief on the PS120PRO, which is actually detrimental to over-the-ear fitment, causing the cable to pop out from behind the ear on occasion. The lack of a cable cinch does not help

 Sound *(6.7/10)* – The PS120PRO is yet another Xears earphone following the heavy-bass, laid-back treble approach to audio. The balance of the PS120 combines the powerful low end of the higher-end TD-III with the slightly recessed midrange of the similarly-priced Resonance to create an even more bottom-heavy sound than the other two earphones. Bass depth and impact are impressive, keeping up with the TD-III, but the bass hump of the PS120 actually reaches higher up the frequency spectrum. Both the Resonance and TD-III are quicker, cleaner, and more detailed when it comes to bass presentation, though the difference is not night-and-day. The PS120 carries slower attack and decay times, resulting in the illusion of even greater bass quantity.

 Expectedly, the PS120PRO is warmer and fuller-sounding than the Resonance. The midrange lacks a little bit of focus as a result of the bass dominance and can sound a touch muddy on tracks with lots of bass. The note presentation of the PS120 is soft and slightly thick, leaning away from the more crisp-sounding Resonance towards a fuller, weightier sound. The midrange of the PS120 is very smooth, as is the treble. Overall treble emphasis is similar to the TD-III – laid-back but not really lacking. That said, the TD-III has a bit more sparkle and extension. Presentation-wise, the PS120 leans towards intimacy, like the TD-III, but is a bit less airy and not as spacious. Indeed, soundstage size is about average for an earphone in the price range although layering is still good. On the point of general usability, the sensitivity of the PS120 is similar to that of the TD-III and the earphone is not particularly tolerant of poorly matched sources.

 Value* (7.5/10)* – The Xears PS120PRO offers a competent, fairly inoffensive take on the warm and bass-heavy sound so popular with the mainstream consumer. It can be thought of as a natural all-around upgrade to something like the Sennheiser CX300 – a commendable earphone with few flaws and an overall ‘likable’ sound signature. However, those looking for a quicker earphone with above-average detail and resolution will probably want to shell out the extra 12€ for the TD-III.

*Pros: Competent take on a bass-heavy sound signature; user-friendly overall
 Cons: A bit difficult to wear over-the-ear; mild driver flex*
  

*(3A52) Xears XR120PRO II*


Reviewed June 2011

 Details: Deep-insertion dynamic-driver IEM from Xears
 Current Price: *est $45* (30€) from xears.com with coupon code KLANGFUZZIS (MSRP: 40€)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _10-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug *J-cord*_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, sony hybrids_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) silicone tips, bi-flange silicone tips, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– The XR120PRO II features black-and-silver metal housings with metal mesh nozzle screens and adequate strain relief on housing entry. The j-cord is rubbery and a bit stiff. Moderate driver flex is present
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Slightly above that of the TD-III and quite good overall
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Not bad due to the j-cord setup
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The XR120 is a straight-barrel earphone with elongated nozzles and tapered housings. It likes smaller tips and deep insertion but is generally quite comfortable. The j-cord may be annoying for some

 Sound *(7.7/10)* – The XR120 is the first Xears earphone I’ve heard that places no emphasis on the lower half of the frequency spectrum. Instead, its bass is tight, quick, and controlled. There is no mid-bass hump and the low end rolls off gently below 50Hz - those in search of bass depth and rumble will definitely be better off with one of the other Xears earphones. Mediocre extension aside, the accuracy and detail of the XR120’s low end are very difficult to fault. The note presentation is leaner than with the other Xears earphones but on the whole the bass is still more visceral than that of higher-end analytical earphones such as the RE-ZERO or Etymotic MC5. There really is a bit of a two-faced nature to the XR120’s bass – it is able to alternate between powerful and subdued depending on the track, balancing fun and accuracy in a single earphone.

 The midrange is crisp and clear, beating out the similarly-priced Maximo iM-590 and all of the other Xears models I’ve tried. The mids are balanced well with the rest of the spectrum and exhibit rather neutral tonality – the XR120 is warmer than the new Sunrise Xcited but cooler than the HiFiMan RE-ZERO. Microdetail and resolution lag very slightly behind models like the RE-ZERO, Xcited, and CC51 but for a cheaper earphone the XR120 is extremely competitive on both counts. One thing it does well is discriminate between background and foreground detail – many of the cheaper analytical earphones can push detail on the listener indiscriminately but only a few have the ability to create nuanced and convincing sound approaching the level of higher-end sets like the RE0 and Brainwavz M3.

 The treble of the XR120 is clear and sparkly. While not as effortless or extended as the RE0, the XR120 lacks neither treble quantity nor quality and is clearly more extended at the top than the other Xears models. Again breaking from the mold set by its siblings, the XR120 is quite unforgiving of harshness and sibilance on tracks but stops short of being overly edgy. Transparency and refinement are not top-tier but they are impressive considering the price and contribute to the XR120’s lively yet accurate sound. The presentation, similarly, is well-rounded and convincing. While there is definitely more width than height or depth to the presentation of the XR120, the tubular nature of the soundstage is not nearly as pronounced as it is with the Sunrise Xcited. Instrument separation is quite good but the XR120 doesn’t keep up with the layering and imaging of something like the RE-ZERO. Clearly the more three-dimensional earphone, the RE-ZERO has the upper hand when it comes to soundstaging but the XR120 still fares better in width and airiness.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– Great sound at the expense of packaging, accessories, and sometimes build quality is what I’ve come to expect from Xears earphones. With the XR120PRO II, however, the disparity between performance and presentation is greater than ever. The host of potential caveats this time around is fairly long – the earphones are j-corded, prone to driver flex, and require a deep seal – but the sonic performance is on par with the very best I’ve heard at the price point. I wouldn’t gift the XR120 to a non-audiophile but those who are willing to live with the minor quirks may just be very, very pleasantly surprised with the sound quality.

*Pros: Clear, detailed, and enjoyable sound; balanced without sounding dull
 Cons: J-cord may be bothersome; moderate driver flex; deep bass roll-off; likes deep insertion*
  
  
*(3A53) Skullcandy Holua*
  

Reviewed Jun 2011
  
 Details: Wooden in-ear from Skullcandy
 Current Price: *$46* from amazon.com (MSRP: $99.95); $49 for mic-and-remote version
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
  
 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips, and hemp clamshell carrying case with mesh lid
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Skullcandy clearly took the wood theme close to heart with the Holua – not only is the driver chamber made of wood, but so are the nozzles and stems. The housings feel reasonably solid but the nylon-sheathed cable tends to kink. In addition, the hideous plastic mic/remote unit looks like it came out of a cereal box and there are no strain reliefs anywhere on the earphone. Left/right markings are missing as well and moderate driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The rounded housings contribute to fairly decent isolation and the included Comply tips are always a plus for isolation
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; fine otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The housings of the Holua are very lightweight and rounded at the front for comfortable fitment. Stock tips are of good quality and a set of Comply foamies is included. One slight issue with over-the-ear wear is the nylon cable popping out from behind the ear due to a lack of shirt clip and cable cinch/p>
  
 Sound *(4.5/10) *– The Holua feels right at home competing against bass-heavy wooden earphones from Thinksound and Xears. Quantitatively, the Holua has a bit less bass than the Xears TD-III but its low end is slower and more boomy in character. Next to the competition the Holua suffers from a relative lack of bass control, which causes it to sound slightly muddy and lacking in resolution. Expectedly, the bass does bleed into the midrange, which otherwise has good presence and decent clarity. The Holua is a warm earphone but usually manages to keep up with the cheaper Fischer Audio Daleth in clarity, if only just. In terms of balance, the mids are a touch forward but still manage to be somewhat veiled at all times. On the upside, the midrange and treble are very smooth – more so than with the metallic-sounding Skullcandy TiTans or the entry-level Ink’d buds. The lower treble is balanced well with the mids, mostly by virtue of several flattened peaks, but upper treble is slightly recessed. Treble extension and resolution are average.
  
 The presentation of the Holua is good for a Skullcandy product but really doesn’t keep up with the other earphones in its price bracket. The soundstage is below average in width and depth and fails to escape the mild congestion that plagues most mainstream entry-level earphones. Instrumental separation is mediocre as well, especially when a track is muddied up by the bass though, to be fair, the cheaper FMJ model fares far worse. The Holua is still the best Skullcandy earphone I’ve heard and puts up a decent, if uninspired, performance. It is not quite the shift towards sound quality that I was hoping for from one of Skullcandy’s priciest in-ears but, at the very least, I can easily listen to the Holua for any length of time without losing the will to live (which can’t be said for the FMJ).
  
 Value *(5.5/10)* – The Skullcandy Holua is not a bad product per se – the accessory pack, fit, isolation, and even build quality (with Skullcandy’s lifetime warranty factored in) are on-par with the most of the big-brand IEMs in its price range. However, similar sound quality can easily be had for less money and even those looking specifically for a wooden in-ear with mic should be able to pick up a Woodees IESW100B for less. What it comes down to, then, is the looks and the warranty – the only two factors making the Holua stand in a very busy market segment.
  
*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable; Comply tips included; lifetime warranty*
*Cons: Moderate driver flex; frustrating nylon cable; sub-par sound quality*
  
 A longer review with comparisons against the Fischer Audio Daleth, Thinksound TS02, Woodees Blues, and Xears TD-III can be found here
  
  
*(3A54) Soundmagic E30*


Reviewed Jul 2011

 Details: Soundmagic’s follow-up to one of Head-Fi’s favourite budget IEMs
 Current Price: *$40* from miccastore.com.com (MSRP: $40)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _12Ω_ | Sens: _94 dB_ | Freq: _15-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, cable guides, shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – My old PL30 is still going strong after 2.5 years of near-constant use so I expected nothing less from the E30. However, the construction of the E30 is more similar to the PL50 with its glossy finish and short plastic strain reliefs. The cable seems identical to the old PL30 cord, being rubbery and a little thin, but Soundmagic have added a strain relief to the y-split and a metal shell to the 3.5mm I-plug. The bass switch, which was of no real use on the PL30, is gone
 Isolation *(2/5)* – better nozzle angle means slightly more isolation than with the PL30
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Pretty much non-existent, especially with cable guides or shirt clip in place
 Comfort *(5/5) *– The E30 is slimmer and smaller than the PL30 and boasts a more ergonomic nozzle angle. I do miss the foam tips that came with the PL30 but otherwise the E30 is about as comfortable as any in-ear

 Sound *(7.1/10)* – The old Soundmagic PL30 was one of my favourite budget earphones due to a uniquely spacious and balanced sound with a slight mid-range emphasis – not a signature commonly found in the lower price brackets. With the new E30, the dynamic-driver monitor has been bumped to a higher price category. Fortunately, the sound quality seems to have kept up with the price increase, and then some.

 The low end of the E30 has been emboldened, receiving a more prominent role in the overall soundscape compared to the old PL30. Next to the midrange, the bass is emphasized only mildly but compared to the laid-back bottom end of the PL30, the difference is quite large. Extension has been improved and the low end now sounds fuller and more impactful. Bass notes have more realistic weight and more drawn-out attack and decay times. Though I don’t mind the balance of the PL30 in the least, I’ll be the first to admit that the low end of the E30 sounds more natural in comparison. Still, the new earphone is by no means a bass monster and those who were previously in the PL30 camp will enjoy it much more than adherents of bass-heavy budget sets such as the MEElec M9.

 The midrange of the E30 is just a touch less forward than that of the PL30 but seems more laid-back due to the greater bass emphasis of the new earphone. Despite its balance, the E30 actually manages to sound a little cooler in tone, and closer to what I would consider neutral. As with the PL30, the clarity will be enviable for the vast majority of similarly-priced IEMs, but the E30 also makes gains in detail and texture compared to its predecessor, sounding smooth and refined without major sacrifices in resolution.

 The treble of the E30 is balanced well with the midrange, taking at most a half-step back in emphasis. It sounds clean and clear but not overly crisp as with the similarly-priced MEElec CX21. Top-end extension is sufficient – on par with the CX21 and Brainwavz M1. Music, as presented by the E30, generally sounds airy and open, helped along by better dynamics compared to the PL30 and a similarly large soundstage. Though it may not sound quite as wide as the PL30 in absolute terms, imaging and positioning are slightly improved and the whole presentation is more convincing and refined. Lastly, Soundmagic has managed to drop the sensitivity of the earphone a bit, which makes it far less likely to hiss heavily with a poorly matched source.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – As well-liked as the old PL30 was in its price bracket, it is no competition for the modern sub-$50 heavyweights from the likes of MEElec and Brianwavz. The new E30, however, is a different matter. Making far fewer sacrifices to obtain the clarity and spaciousness many found so impressive about its predecessor, the E30 sounds more natural and refined. I see very few people preferring the old model to the new one in signature and even fewer arguing that they are similar in technical performance. I do have a couple of reservations worth voicing – the accessory pack, for one, has taken a dip into mediocrity with the new soft pouch and exclusion of foam tips, and the glossy plastic housings look slightly cheap next to the rubberized finish of my PL30. Barring these small complaints, the E30 is clearly one of the better overall performers at its price point.

*Pros: Lightweight and extremely comfortable, spacious sound with slight bass emphasis
 Cons: Mediocre isolation*


*(3A55) Blue Ever Blue 886B*


Reviewed Jul 2011

 Details: HDSS earphone from Blue Ever Blue, the new earphone division of the BioLinks brand
 Current Price: *$40* from amazon.com (MSRP: $40)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _92 dB_ | Freq: _22-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _*Sony hybrids*, stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5) *– The machined aluminum housings are lightweight, sturdy, and not bad to look at. The nozzles are protected by metal mesh filters and the housings generally feel well-made. Sadly, things go downhill from there as the generic, rubbery cable and minimal strain reliefs inspire little confidence
 Isolation *(2.5/5) *– About average for vented, straight-barrel earphone
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Slightly worse than average and not helped by the lack of a cable cinch and shirt clip; tolerable with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The tapered housings of the 886B are lightweight and comfortable. The earphone does not require a deep seal to sound good and the cables are soft and flexible. The stock tips are quite decent as well

 Sound *(6.1/10)* – The 886B, like all Blue Ever Blue earphones, utilizes ETL technology to absorb the energy of reflected waves in the driver chamber, preventing resonance and distortion. Or at least, that’s what theory dictates. The technology was originally used in speaker cabinets and its application to portable audio is fairly new. It is difficult to say, therefore, what the exact effect of ETL implementation is on the Blue Ever Blue earphones – much as with manufacturer claims of resonance being affected by choice of housing materials, the effect of ETL would need to be tested against a proper control to verify the manufacturer’s lofty claims.

 Regardless of the technology’s mode of action and end goals, there is little doubt that for an entry-level product, the 866B sounds quite good. I don’t know about the claims of “smooth, layered sound” and “pure tone”, but the earphone is fairly neutral and quite enjoyable, if not technically flawless. The bass is probably its weakest point for me – it’s got good depth and impact but lacks a bit of definition and can overpower the rest of the range. The ability of the bass to step forward and crowd out the (prominent) midrange of the earphones despite the 866B not being a bass monster can be slightly off-putting at first but the balance works most of the time. It really is only in direct comparisons with some of the better earphones in the price range that the 866B starts losing ground in low-end clarity and control.

 The 866B performs more consistently in the midrange, which is prominent and slightly full. There is a mild thickness of note and the clarity and detail still lag behind competing sets such as the Soundmagic E30 but one the whole the mids are quite realistic for the price. The tone of the earphones is very slightly on the dark side of neutral and doesn’t seem to suffer from the bass boost. The treble is, for the most part, inoffensive, with a very slight bit of roughness and a small amount of presence missing at the very top. It’s not as crisp as that of the MEElec CX21, but it’s not wooly or overly soft, either.

 The presentation is a bit less impressive than the midrange and treble performance but still quite good. The slight thickness of the 866B causes it sound a little congested and the earphone lacks the wide-open feel of the Soundmagic E30. Layering is good but the size of the stage is average, with the presentation leaning towards intimacy. The dynamics of the earphone lagging behind the competition from Soundmagic and Brainwavz don’t help matters much. With a leaner-sounding earphone, the presentation of the 866B would likely work much better. As is, it just comes across sounding slightly ‘concentrated’ and lacking a bit of refinement compared to the real heavy-hitters in the price range.

 Value *(7/10) *– The Blue Ever Blue 866B performs well enough for the asking price and offers a very user-friendly, if basic, design. Several years ago the 866B would have scored very highly as an overall package but lovers of budget IEMs have been spoiled not just by the ridiculous performance offered by some of today’s earphones, but also by the build quality and overall attention to detail, which are being taken further still by the likes of Dunu. The entire earphone seems to be as much a proof of concept as a finished product and while I do appreciate the claims made by the HDSS standard, for the purposes of this review the technology is only worth as much as the end result. The sound of the earphone is cohesive and enjoyable for an entry-level product but there are options that sound just as good without the generic construction and barebones accessory pack.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable; nice midrange and treble
 Cons: Mediocre cabling; could be tighter at the low end*
  
  
*(3A56) Soundmagic E10*


Reviewed Jul 2011

 Details: Straight-barrel Soundmagic IEM slotted just below the E30 in the lineup
 Current Price: *$35* from miccastore.com (MSRP: $34.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _15-22k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or* over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (3.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and soft carrying bag
 Build Quality* (3.5/5) *– The E10 is available in a variety of color options and features two-tone metal shells with metal nozzle filters and Soundmagic’s usual color-coded strain reliefs. The materials of the strain reliefs and cable look a bit cheap but do the job. The rubbery cabling and well-relieved y-split and I-plug are similar to those on the E30 model
 Isolation *(2.5/5) *– Being a more conventional straight-barrel design, the E10 isolates slightly more than the E30 does
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Surprisingly low when worn cable-down considering how rubbery the cord is. Nearly nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– The E10 uses a conventional straight-barrel design. The housings are a bit wide at the front and have short nozzles, preventing deep insertion. The stock tips aren’t particularly great, either, but switching to softer single-flanges allowed for good long-term wearing comfort

 Sound *(7/10) *– If Soundmagic’s new E30 is the long-awaited upgrade to the balanced and neutral PL30 model, the E10 is a spiritual successor to Soundmagic’s bass-heavy entry-level sets of old. More forward and aggressive than the E30 on the whole, the E10 offers up gobs of bass power and impact on cue. The low end of the E10 is well-extended, reaching deep and hitting hard. It stops just short of the impact offered up by the MEElec M9 but boasts greater clarity, control, and resolution. The nature of the bass is slightly soft and the punch is diminished by the rounded note presentation but, as with the E30, the notes have good weight. The low end of the pricier E30 is a bit leaner and bleeds a touch less but on the whole the E10 does a good job of preserving the quality despite much greater bass quantity.

 The midrange of the E10 is slightly less prominent than the low end but it is still more forward than that of the E30. The bassier nature of the E10 brings on a slightly warmer tonality but on the whole the two earphones share more similarities than differences in the mids and treble. Despite the bass emphasis, midrange clarity of the E10 is good and resolution nearly matches that of the E30. Treble extension is again highly reminiscent of the higher-end model, as is the nature of the treble – clean and clear but not hard or edgy. The top end is not entirely smooth but nothing offends which, with rare exceptions, seems to be the norm for the better earphones in the price range.

 The E10 is a fairly forward earphone but that doesn’t stop it from possessing a surprisingly spacious soundstage. Compared to the E30, it sounds a touch narrower and less airy but still manages to impress. Though leaning towards a more intimate presentation on the whole, the E10 retains the ability to throw sonic cues a good distance and sounds more convincingly layered than almost all of my other reasonably-priced bass-heavy IEMs. The Blue Ever Blue 866B, for example, seems very small and congested compared to the E10. Lastly, it is worth noting that the E10 is more sensitive than the higher-end E30 and will reach louder output volumes. At extreme listening levels the bass does begin to distort very slightly, but one would have to either be deaf or highly interested in becoming deaf to turn them up that loud. Background hiss is slightly more noticeable than with the E30 but still nowhere near as much of an issue as it was with the old PL30.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – Soundmagic has been in the business long enough to know what works and what doesn’t. It is no surprise, then, that the E10 complements the pricier E30 model perfectly, pairing a more consumer-friendly form factor with a more consumer-friendly sound signature. The bass grunt of the E10 is impressive and yet has little negative effect on the overall performance. Likewise the aggressive presentation does not completely sacrifice the spaciousness that has made certain Soundmagic IEMs so popular in the past. There are earphones that offer a bit more for your money in the way of accessories, build quality, and isolation but few can compete with the E10 when it comes to providing impactful and enjoyable sound at a very reasonable price.

*Pros: Low cable noise; pleasant, bass-heavy sound
 Cons: Tubby housings may be difficult to fit for some; stock eartips could be better*
  
  
*(3A57) Xears Nature N3i*
  

Reviewed Aug 2011

 Details: In-ear headset from Xears
 Current Price: *est $45* (30€) from xears.com with coupon code KLANGFUZZIS (MSRP: 89,90€)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _N/A_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _6-28k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug j-cord_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _generic single-flange; stock foam_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3/5)* –Single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and tri-flange silicone tips, foamhybrid tips, and padded carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Like the other high-end Xears models, the N3i uses painted wood and metal housings and metal nozzle filters. The sturdy nylon-sheathed cord does not kink the way some of the thinner ones do but can tangle a bit compared to the old Xears cables. Some driver flex is present
 Isolation *(**2.5**/5)* – Moderate with silicone tips and a bit better with the foamies. The large housings prevent deep insertion
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Surprisingly low for a cloth cable and helped further by the j-cord configuration
 Comfort* (3/5)* – The housings are lightweight but quite large in diameter and clearly designed for a shallow fit. Unfortunately, the combination of j-cord and inline mic integrated into the y-split makes the N3i impractical to wear over-the-ear and the stock silicone tips leave a bit to be desired

 Sound *(7.8/10) *– The sound of the Xears Nature N3i bears a resemblance to that of Xears’ previous higher-end woody, the TD-III Blackwood, with the major differences being a slightly larger soundstage and less mid-forward balance. The bass of the N3i is the most powerful and prominent of Xears in-ears I’ve heard, narrowly beating out the PS120 and TD-III. The sub-bass is more powerful than with the XE200 and the entire low end is boomier and more full-bodied. Part of the reason is longer note sustainment – the N3i tends to have longer decay times than the other Xears in-ears. Impact is very sizeable and will probably be excessive for some but the N3i still manages to sound clean and resolving compared to the majority of bass-heavy mid-range earphones.

 The mids are very smooth, as with the TD-III, but the N3i is slightly less forward in the midrange, which is partly responsible for the greater prominence of its bass. The midrange is by no means recessed but bass bleed is slightly more noticeable and the whole sound signature is richer, warmer, and thicker compared to the TD-III. Texture lags slightly behind the XE200PRO and is about on par with the TD-III, as are detail and clarity. For an earphone with a sound signature that places so much emphasis on the low end, the overall cleanliness of the N3i is enviable but unfortunately the clarity can be difficult to appreciate with all of that bass drawing attention to itself. In direct comparisons to other bass-heavy sets, however the clarity of the N3i shines and even the far more balanced Spider Realvoice could not beat the clarity or detail of the Xears on tracks where the bass did not overwhelm.

 The treble of the N3i is low on sparkle but has good clarity and detail. It is not the sort of crisp, clinical treble found on some of my favourite analytical earphones but it works well to compliment the bass and midrange. It extends well enough upward and easily matches the other Xears models in overall proficiency. Presentation, on the other hand, is what most certainly sets the N3i apart from the already-spacious TD-III and lesser Xears models. The TD-III is already well above average in terms of the space it produces but the N3i sounds bigger still. The soundstage extends farther in all directions and whereas the TD-III leans very slightly towards intimacy, the N3i images more evenly across the sonic space. It can be fairly intimate when necessary but is also capable producing very good ambience. Instrumental separation is moderate, as with the TD-III, and airiness lags slightly behind the XE200 and XR120 models. On the whole it is a very solid presentation with a headphone-like feel and even well-tuned competitors like the Spider Realvoice sound a bit small next to the N3i.

 Value *(9/10) *– The suggested retail price for the N3i is quite high but the current sale price drops it right in the midst of the overpopulated mid-range bracket. For that price the build quality of the N3i is quite good and the day-to-day usability passable for those who can live with the j-cord and gargantuan housings. Signature-wise, the N3i is the most impactful of the three high-end wooden Xears models but still retains impressive technical ability and a large, engrossing presentation. It gives a sense of limitless power and makes no compromises and no attempts at civility with its signature. Quite simply, if you really like bass and can live with the form factor, the current price makes the N3i one of the best deals in portable audio.

*Pros: Great overall sound quality; low cable noise
 Cons: Large housings; moderate driver flex; not giftable for lack of packaging; j-cord may be an issue for some; bass can be too prominent


 (3A58) Xears XE200PRO*
  

Reviewed Aug 2011

 Details: Flagship in-ear from Germany-based Xears
 Current Price: *est $45* (30€) from xears.com with coupon code KLANGFUZZIS (MSRP: 89,90€)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: _6-28k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _generic single-flange; stock foam_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and tri-flange silicone tips, foamhybrid tips, and padded carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– Like the other high-end Xears models, the XE200PRO uses painted wood and metal housings and metal nozzle filters. The sturdy nylon-sheathed cord does not kink the way some of the thinner ones do but can tangle a bit compared to the old Xears cords. The strain reliefs are ample and driver flex is low compared to the other Xears earphones
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Moderate with silicone tips and a bit better with the foamies. The large housings prevent deep insertion
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Surprisingly low for a cloth cord and even better with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings are lightweight but quite large in diameter and clearly designed for a shallow fit. The stock silicone tips still leave a bit to be desired

 Sound *(7.8/10)* – Whereas the similarly-priced N3i model pulls out all the stops in the pursuit of visceral bass and head-turning ambience, the XE200PRO is a slightly more level-headed take on the consumer-friendly sound common to the Xears earphones. Its bass is lower in impact and flatter than that of the N3i, with a punchier, crisper sound and slightly quicker note presentation. Sub-bass power and rumble are also reduced and the bass doesn’t bleed into the midrange as much as with the N3i or TD-III. In typical Xears fashion the low end is still anything but lacking but on tracks with plenty of bass the XE200PRO edges ahead of the N3i in resolution and clarity.

 The midrange is smooth and detailed. It is similar in both emphasis and technical proficiency to the N3i model but there is not as much bass to get in the way with the XE200PRO. As a result, while the XE200 is not as warm and rich as the N3i, it textures notes slightly better and sounds more level overall. The overall clarity competes with the far more analytical XR120PRO and the timbre is quite good, as with the other higher-end Xears models.

 The top end appears to be slightly more prominent than with the N3i and TD-III but still is not a focus of the sound signature. It sounds a tiny bit edgy next to the softer and slower N3i but doesn’t have any major adverse effects on the sound. Top-end extension is decent as with the other Xears models. Soundstage size is similar to the N3i but, while the N3i has the ambience of a large but enclosed space, the XE200PRO sounds a bit more open. It is not the most well-separated presentation but the layering is good and the positioning yields no surprises. It’s a well-rounded presentation to match a well-rounded sound signature.

 Value *(9/10)* – Completing the triumvirate of higher-end Xears wooden IEMs, the XE200PRO provides a slightly more balanced alternative with all of the technical capability of the N3i. Above all else, the XE200PRO is a well-rounded, relaxing listen that sacrifices a bit less fidelity compared to the N3i and TD-III models. It is much the same story with usability – the fit is less fidgety than with the N3i and the driver flex is less noticeable. The housings are still very large at the front but for this level of performance at the current asking price, I’m willing to live with far greater discomfort than that.

*Pros: Great sound quality with a consumer-friendly signature
 Cons: Large housings; not giftable for lack of packaging*
  
  
*(3A59) Dunu DN-12 Trident*


Reviewed Aug 2011

 Details: Entry-level dynamic-driver model from DUNU
 Current Price: *$35* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: $40)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _95 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz _| Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flange _
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange narrow-channel (3 sizes) and wide-channel (2 sizes) silicone tips, bi-flange silicone tips, soft carrying pouch, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality* (4.5/5)* – Like the sturdy metal shells of the Hephaes, the flared housings of the DN-12 feel like they’ve been machined from a solid piece of metal. Attention to detail throughout the construction is superb as usual although Dunu did attempt to give the pricier models a leg up by using plastic and rubber hardware in place of aluminum on the cheaper DN-12. While this makes the DN-12 less fancy in appearance, the overall build quality is no worse for it. As before, the cable is the only part that could stand some improvement as it’s a bit stiff and rubbery
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5) *– Surprisingly good, as with the other Dunu earphones
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The flared housings of the DN-12 are skinny at the front so insertion is not an issue. However, the large diameter at the rear can be a problem for those with smaller outer ears as the outside edge can become uncomfortable after resting on the ear for a while. The earphones being a bit on the heavy side doesn’t help matters

 Sound* (6.7/10) *– The dynamic-driver Trident conforms to the mold set by Dunu’s armature-based Ares and Crius models, offering up a bass- and midrange-heavy sound that impresses with its smoothness and power. The bass of the Trident certainly is punchier and deeper than that of the armature models but it’s not a bass monster in the way the MEElec M31 and Sony XB-series earphones are. There is still plenty of impact but it doesn’t overwhelm. The note presentation is a touch on the soft side but the bass generally comes off rather well-controlled and pleasant.

 The midrange is warm and rich. Bass bleed is minimal and the notes are very slightly on the thick side. Detail retrieval is good but the Trident lacks a bit of clarity next to the similarly-priced Soundmagic E10 and E30. As with the pricier Ares and Crius, the clarity of the Trident oscillates between reasonably good and somewhat disappointing, depending on track. At its worst it is still a bit better than with the Blue Ever Blue 886B and UE 350 but not by as a large a margin as one would hope. Aside from clarity, the midrange is good – smooth, level, and slightly ahead of the treble for a fatigue-free sound. Even next to the consumer-oriented Sony EX300 the treble of the Trident sound relaxed and forgiving. Top-end extension is good despite the lack of treble emphasis.

 The Trident’s soundstage is average in size but the presentation leans towards intimacy despite the slightly laid-back nature of the sound. The relaxed top end results in a mild lack of air compared to sets like the Soundmagic E10 and the overall sense of space is not nearly as impressive. The Trident also sounds just a touch dark compared to my other favourite sets in the price range. The layering, however, is surprisingly good and the DN-12 generally sounds less congested than the Blue Ever Blue 866B and similarly-priced brand-name sets like the Klipsch S3 and UE 350. Intimate or not, you certainly won’t get performance this good grabbing a similarly-priced product off the shelf in a retail store.

 Value *(9/10)* – More so than the pricier Ares and Crius models, the Dunu DN-12 Trident aims straight for the segment leaders in its price bracket and - in most ways – scores a direct hit. It is well-packaged, well-designed, and well-built, showcasing great attention to detail, functionality, and performance on the part of Dunu’s development team. Priced below $40, the Trident offers more sound quality per dollar than the other Dunu models I’ve heard and one-ups just about all of its competition when it comes to build quality. It is both a great earphone and a great product – not a so-called ‘giant killer’, but well worth the money in my book.

*Pros: Very well-built, great attention to detail, great sound quality for the asking price
 Cons: Cable can be noisy when worn straight down; flared housings may be uncomfortable for some*
  
  
*(3A60) Xears Communicate CP100iP*


Reviewed Aug 2011

 Details: Entry-level single-button headset from Xears
 Current Price: est *$35* (24€) from ebay.de (MSRP: 39,95€)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock foamies, stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5) *– Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, foamhybrid tips, and padded carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The build quality of the aluminum CP100iP is similar to the older XR120 model with its long strain reliefs and somewhat stiff rubbery cable but the housings seem to come apart more readily and the appearance is let down by the somewhat cheap-looking paper filters. Driver flex is mild
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good with silicone tips and a bit better with the foamies
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Tolerable when worn cable-down, good when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The CP100iP is very lightweight and has longer nozzles and a smaller housing diameter than most of the other Xears earphones, resulting in good long-term comfort

 Sound* (7.1/10)* – The sound of the CP100iP follows the usual Xears mold – plentiful bass, smooth mids, and competent treble. The low end is powerful but not quite as deep and hard-hitting as that of the similarly-priced Dunu Trident. There is a larger mid-bass hump than with the Trident and more bass body but the CP100iP is still not as much of a bass beast as Xears’ boomier-sounding PS120, TD-III, or N3i models, reminding me more of the Xears Resonance. The low-end detail retrieval lags slightly behind the Dunu sets but the CP100iP is quicker and cleaner overall.

 The midrange of the CP100iP is crisp and fairly open-sounding. It’s a bit less warm and full-bodied compared to the pricier N3i and XE200 models and also lacks some of the detail but still has good presence, beating out the Resonance in emphasis. The treble, as usual, is smooth and a bit laid-back. Top-end extension is decent and overall sparkle quantity is low-to-moderate.

 The soundstage is above average in size - not as large as that of the XE200PRO or Resonance but still quite spacious for an entry-level in-ear. The XE200 also images more consistently across its stage whereas the CP100iP seems to have more of a left-right-center presentation. Instrumental separation is good, however, and the overall sound is airy and open without sacrificing cohesiveness. A point worth noting – the sensitivity of the CP100iP is relatively high and may hiss or buzz a bit with poorly-matched sources.

 Value *(8/10) *– The CP100iP entry-level headset model delivers more of the Xears goodness in a reasonably-priced, smartphone-compatible package. As usual, the audio quality is well above average, the build quality is mediocre, and the nonexistent packaging leaves much to be desired. That said, the smooth and bass-heavy sound signature is not too different from that of the pricier Resonance model and those looking specifically for a stereo headset will be hard-pressed to find anything that sounds better for the money.
  
*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable; solid sound quality with a popular signature
 Cons: Mediocre build quality*
  
  
*(3A61) Ultimate Ears 350 / 350vi*


Reviewed Oct 2011

 Details: consumer-oriented dynamic-driver IEM from UE
 Current Price: *$40* from bhphotovideo.com (MSRP: $49.99); $59.99 for 350vi with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.8’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (5 sizes), shirt clip, and plastic clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality* (3.5/5) *– The lightweight housings are made of black and chromed plastic, as with most of UE’s other recent releases. The cable is soft and flexible and the housing entry strain reliefs are impressive. The strain relief on the plastic-shelled 3.5mm L-plug, however, isn’t
 Isolation* (3/5) *– Good for an entry-level dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite low in the soft and flexible cable. Can be eliminated completely with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The housings are small and lightweight, tapering slightly at the front. The long strain reliefs do not pose a problem for over-the-ear wear and an impressive five sizes of eartips are included

 Sound *(5.9/10)* – Priced below the $50 mark, the UE350 is a consumer-oriented dynamic-driver model with a bass-heavy sound signature. By UE’s own admission, the 350 was tuned to provide a club feel, which shows through in the depth and power of the bass. Though not a bass monster in the same way a Sony XB40EX or MEElec M31 may be, the UE350 is unlikely to leave anyone wanting for rumble or power. The Dunu Trident, which has a similar frequency balance, is slightly more controlled at the low end and tends to sound tighter and punchier but the overall bass quantity is comparable between the two. That said, the note presentation of the UE350 is even softer than that of the Trident, causing the bass to sound a touch flabby and muddy, though not offensively so as was the case with many older dynamics of this sort.

 The midrange is warm and full, with occasional bass bleed and average detail resolution. Clarity can be slightly disappointing and vocals occasionally sound a touch muffled next to the similarly-priced Dunu Trident and Klipsch Image S3. Smoothness is very impressive, however, making the UE350 much easier to listen to in the long run than the S3 and much more forgiving. The top end is slightly laid-back to avoid listening fatigue and performs similarly to the midrange in clarity and detail resolution. Top-end extension is good but the overall tone is still a touch dark - those looking for more neutral sound with crisp, sparkly treble should invest in the pricier UE500.

 The presentation of the UE350 is surprisingly competent – soundstage width is above average and the earphones - while not as well-layered or resolving as the Dunu Trident or pricier UE500 - give a good sense of space for an entry-level product. Klipsch’s similarly-priced Image S3 sounds significantly smaller and more constrained despite boasting better detail and clarity. The note thickness is a little too great for the UE350 to sound as clean and airy as the UE500 does but on the whole the presentation is quite competent.

 Value* (7.5/10)* – Back in the pre-Logitech days, UE released a couple of entry-level dynamic-driver earphones under the MetroFi badge which - while not bad to listen to - were simply priced too ambitiously to be very good value. With the UE350, Ultimate Ears has retained the consumer-friendly sound signature of the old MetroFi earphones while improving the overall usability and lowering the asking price. There are still minor issues such as the new clamshell carrying case - which is small and frustrating to use compared to the old one - but on the whole the UE350 is a solid entry-level product with a clear target audience; audiophiles are clearly expected to save up for the UE500.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable; deep and powerful bass; easy-going sound signature
 Cons: Frustrating carrying case, no strain relief on L-plug, slightly underwhelming clarity & detail*
  

*(3A62) Fischer Audio Ceramique*


Reviewed Dec 2011

 Details: Oversize ceramic in-ear
 Current Price: *$57 *from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $57)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens:_ 99 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4.1' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _8mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec CC51 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories* (2/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (2 sets), cord wrap, and small leatherette carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* - The hefty ceramic shells and metal driver enclosures are solid but for an earphone that weighs as much as the Ceramique the cable thickness is disappointing. The cord is reminiscent of stock Apple earbuds, just more rubbery. The lack of strain reliefs on the cord is cause for concern
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5) *- Above average with well-sealing tips (not included)
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *- Fairly average in the thin, rubbery cable; over-the-ear wear is difficult
 Comfort* (2/5)* - Large, heavy housings are problematic, as are the wide nozzle and single size of hard rubber eartips. Getting a seal proved impossible with stock tips and some may not be able to fit the Ceramique at all. Physical activity is out of the question - the earphones are easily dislodged by their own weight

 Sound* (7.9/10) *- Despite its significant ergonomic shortfalls, the sound of the Ceramique is impressive, provided a seal can be maintained. Since stock Ceramique tips won't seal for me, this review was done using tips from MEElec's ceramic earphone, the CC51, which will fit the Ceramique without too much trouble. As expected, a poorly-sealed Ceramique sounds bright and lacking in bass. A properly sealed one is much more balanced, with well-measured bass response and prominent treble. The bass is soft and mellow - compared to the more v-shaped CC51, the Ceramique is less forward and less punchy at the bottom end but still manages slightly better bass depth. It also avoids the mildly mid-recessed profile of the CC51 but yields to the MEElecs in control and dynamics.

 Mids are a definite strength of the Ceramique - balanced well with the low end they are slightly warm and very smooth. While the midrange is not recessed, the Ceramique is a laid-back earphone overall and those who prefer an intimate vocal presentation or in-your-face guitar aggression will want to give it a pass. The mids are clean, liquid, and well-detailed, reminding me more of the Spider Realvoice than the CC51. The treble transition is smooth but, in contrast to the pricier Tandem, the Ceramique loses no emphasis at the top. Treble extension is good but the top end is not too high on sparkle - the CC51 again shows off its comparatively v-shaped nature with more sparkly treble that is also crisper and edgier. For its livelier sound, the CC51 is slightly more fatiguing than the Ceramique.

 The presentation of the Ceramique suits the balanced signature nicely - the soundstage is spacious, with decent width and depth, and good clarity and detail levels work towards a clean, nicely separated sound. The earphone tends to be quite laid-back on the whole and doesn't deliver great imaging, especially when a track calls for intimacy, partly due to the mediocre dynamics. Compared to the CC51, the Ceramique sounds distant at times but also easily wins in terms of sheer soundstage size.

 Value* (6.5/10) *- The Ceramique is a textbook lesson in form over function. While it combines balanced sound and a spacious presentation with smooth, polished looks, it makes too many usability sacrifices to be a viable alternative to the established segment leaders. The biggest issue is that the large, heavy housings are tricky to fit and even more difficult to keep in place. Add sub-par eartips in only one size and thin cables with no strain reliefs and it becomes clear that some of the sound quality and aesthetics probably should have been sacrificed for better usability.

*Pros: Solid sonic characteristics
 Cons: One size does not fit all; large and heavy; thin cable lacks strain relief*
  
  
*(3A63) Fischer Audio FA-977 Jazz*


Reviewed Jan 2012

 Details: Wooden IEM from Fischer Audio
 Current Price: *$55* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $55)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18__Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq:_ 5-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4.1' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges, stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (2/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (3.5/5) *– The large wooden housings of the FA-977 are trimmed in gold, as are the y-split and I-plug. The brown cable is plasticky and of average thickness, with no cable cinch and hard plastic strain reliefs. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation* (3/5)* – Large housings prevent deep insertion but isolation is easily above average
 Microphonics* (3.5/5)* – Can be bothersome when worn cord-down but lower than with Fischer’s cloth cord. Low when worn cord-up
 Comfort* (3/5)* – Straight-barrel housings are lightweight but surprisingly large. Sizeable diameter prevents deep insertion and may make them uncomfortable for those with smaller outer ears.

 Sound* (6.4/10) *– Quite possibly the most unique of Fischer’s mid-tier models, the Jazz provides a forward yet spacious sound that works surprisingly well when taken as a total package. The bass has decent depth and good impact, lagging only a little behind the Sunrise i100 on both counts. It is punchy but not particularly tight or crisp – mediocre resolution leaves the low end somewhat muddy and ill-defined. Other than the mediocre control, the bass is pleasant – punchy, full, and smooth. Bass depth is average – the pricier Consonance model offers significantly more sub-bass in addition to better detail and texture.

 The mids of the Jazz are smooth and prominent. Vocals are forward, balancing well with the impactful low end, and the tone is warm overall. Clarity and detail again suffer due to the mediocre resolution - all of the higher-end Fischer models I’ve tried are superior to the Jazz in this regard. The Ceramique especially sounds much cleaner and more refined, though it lacks some of the fullness of the Jazz. The similarly-priced Brainwavz M2 also offers up better clarity while the cheaper Sunrise i100 falls behind only a little.

 The treble transition is smooth and the top end is laid back in comparison to the midrange. The Jazz does a good job of cutting out sibilance but sounds just a hair dark compared to the Ceramique. It also lacks energy with cymbals compared to the Consonance or even the Paradigm v.3. The presentation is wide and spacious despite the forward midrange. The earphones sound airy and open – more so than a Brainwavz M2, for example – but suffer from mediocre dynamics and average separation. The similarly-priced Paradigm v.3 has a smaller soundstage but easily surpasses the separation of the Jazz.

 Value* (7/10)* – With dozens of wooden earphones on the market, Fischer Audio’s FA-977 Jazz stands out mostly with its sound signature, combining a fairly large soundstage with intimate, forward mids and hard-hitting but not overbearing bass response. Competitors with this type of sound signature are few and far between, making the Jazz a good buy for some, but those who are not looking for this particular signature may want to pay a bit more for a Paradigm v.3 or Consonance instead.

*Pros: Unique mid-forward sound with good bass punch
 Cons: Large housings; Clarity and detail not as impressive as with other Fischer IEMs


 (3A64) Fischer Audio Paradigm v.3*


Reviewed Jan 2012

 Details: angled-nozzle earphone from FA
 Current Price: *$58* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $58)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq: _6-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1' 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories* (2/5)* - Single-flange (2 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips; soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The construction of the Paradigm v.3 is similar to that of the similarly-priced Consonance. The housings are plastic but seem to be put together well. The nozzle filters are metal and the strain reliefs are sturdy yet flexible all around. The nylon-sheathed cables are somewhat tangle-prone
 Isolation* (2.5/5)* – Large, vented housings prevent deep insertion but isolation is still decent
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Quite bothersome when worn cord-down and cable-up wear is made difficult by the driver bulge and angled-nozzle housings
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are lightweight but large and fit more like the half-in-ear FA-788 model than slimmer angled-nozzle sets such as the JVC FX500 and Denon C710. Sizeable housing diameter also prevents deep insertion and may make them slightly uncomfortable for those with smaller outer ears

 Sound *(7.2/10) *– The Fischer Audio Paradigm v.3 takes on a fairly well-balanced sound signature, contrasting sharply with the more v-shaped Consonance and the more mid-forward Jazz. The bass has decent depth and good punch – the Paradigm is not constantly bass-heavy as the Consonance tends to be but is more than capable of belting out low notes when necessary. Impact is generally similar to the Jazz and while the Paradigm does have similarly average detail levels, its superior dynamics and bass control result in a more realistic low end.

 The midrange of the Paradigm v.3 is clearer and less forward than that of the Jazz but is by no means recessed or distant. The mids are crisp and well-defined, with the Paradigm being quicker and more resolving. With its lesser bass depth, slightly thinner note presentation, and minimal bloat, the Paradigm also lacks the warmth of the Jazz, sounding more neutral and closer to the similarly-priced Ceramique.

 The treble is fairly detailed and has some sparkle. It is not as smooth as that of the Ceramique, instead boasting some unevenness reminiscent of the Consonance and Soundmagic’s E10. Top-end extension is average and the Paradigm sounds a touch dark next to the Ceramique. The presentation is fairly average as well – the soundstage is not as large as that of the Jazz even though the Paradigm tends to sound more laid-back on the whole and instrument separation is quite good. Layering, however, isn’t particularly impressive and the Paradigm can’t quite match the more versatile 3-D imaging of the Consonance.

*Value (7.5/10)* – The Paradigm v.3 is yet another impressive mid-range earphone from Fischer, combining a balanced sound signature with a comfortable form factor and well thought-out build. Those who require high isolation or tend to be active while wearing earphones may want to look for a deeper-fitting earphone that can be worn cable-up more easily but on the whole the Paradigm is a worthy all-rounder.

*Pros: Comfortable and well-built; balanced and capable sound
 Cons: Tough to wear over-the-ear; microphonics can be annoying*
  
  
*(3A65) Sony MDR-EX300LP*


Reviewed Feb 2012

 Details: One of Sony's original vertical in-ear monitors
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $89.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq:_ 4-28k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug j-cord_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids (stock)_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Single-flange Sony Hybrid silicone tips (3 sizes), cable winder, and hard-shell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3/5)* - The plastic housings of the EX300 seem well-constructed but the cabling is a major letdown - while soft and well-relieved, the thin j-cord is tangle-prone and inspires little confidence
 Isolation *(2/5) *- Mediocre at best due to shallow-insertion form factor
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* - The soft, flexible j-cord and shallow seal keep cable noise to a minimum
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* - The EX300 is a vertical-driver earphone with a straight nozzle. The housings fit partly into the outer ear and tend to protrude less than those of the pricier EX600 model but are also less secure due to the lack of a memory wire section on the cable. Those with smaller outer ears may find the driver bulge to interfere with the fit

 Sound* (6.8/10)* - The sound of the MDR-EX300 is a compromise between Sony's popular consumer and audiophile signatures but falls closer to the higher-end EX600 and EX1000 than entry-level sets such as the EX85 and the XB series. The bass of the EX300 is enhanced but not overblown. It is punchy but not quite as powerful s that of the Soundmagic E10. Extension is decent enough but the mid-bass hump causes the entire low end to sound bloated and boomy compared to the pricier EX600. The Sonys sound fuller than some of the more analytical sets such as the HiFiMan RE0 and Etymotic MC5 but it's not as thick-sounding as a Dunu Trident or Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE.

 The midrange of the EX300 is warm but clear. Detail is decent enough and the mids sound open and airy. Naturally, the pricier EX600 is much more neutral, clear, and detailed, making the EX300 sound boomy and unrefined, but for a midrange earphone the clarity of the EX300 is more than reasonable. The Soundmagic E10 is a bit clearer and more crisp, giving guitars a bit more bite and making vocals sound a touch more intelligible, but lacks the balance and liquidity of the EX300 and doesn't quite have as big a soundstage.

 Towards the top of the midrange, the EX300 picks up some emphasis and with it a bit of sibilance on tracks prone to it. The E10 is a little more forgiving but both earphones have moderate treble sparkle, slightly laid-back upper treble, and mediocre extension at the top. The presentation of the EX300 is wide and well-layered. Though the MDR-EX600 is significantly more spacious still, the EX300 is one of the more open-sounding entry-level earphones. Soundstage depth could be better and the imaging and dynamics lag far behind the EX600 but both are more than reasonable for the asking price. Clearly the EX300 was one of the better earphones in its price category upon release back in 2008.

 Value *(7.5/10)* - The Sony MDR-EX300 impresses with its punchy bass, warm and liquid mids, and spacious presentation, especially considering the age of the earphones. What betrays them is the overall usability, mediocre isolation, and hit-or-miss form factor. The biggest gripe, however, is the thin and frustrating j-cord used by the earphones. For pure sound quality, the EX300 is an easy set to recommend but much of the modern competition simply offers a better value proposition on the whole.

*Pros: Punchy, clear, and open sound; almost no cable noise
 Cons: J-corded; very thin & tangle-prone cable*
  

*(3A66) id America Spark*


Reviewed Feb 2012

 Details: Metal-shelled headset styled after a spark plug
 Current Price: *$60 *from idamericany.com (MSRP: $59.95)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _96 dB_ | Freq:_ 20-20k Hz _| Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style:_ Straight down or* over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and tubular carrying case
 Build Quality* (4/5)* – The two-piece housings are aluminum and feel very well-made. Cabling is of average thickness but resistant to tangling and protected by soft rubber strain reliefs at the y-split and I-plug, as well as on housing entry. A single-button mic/remote unit is located on the left side
 Isolation* (3/5)* – Good for a vented dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Present when worn cable-down; very low with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort* (3.5/5)* – The sparkplug-inspired housings are lightweight and can be inserted comfortably due to the long nozzles but sharp rear edges make them less suitable for those with smaller outer ears. Stock tips are of surprisingly good quality

 Sound* (7.4/10)* – The Spark is a bass-heavy earphone with surprisingly solid sonic characteristics. The Bass is deep and powerful, with plenty of punch and good texture throughout. Both the subbass depth and overall bass quantity are slightly greater compared to the Soundmagic E10 and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 and on par with the Fischer Audio Consonance. Bass control is good – the Spark is neither the quickest nor the most resolving earphone out there but for a set bassy enough to please the mainstream listener, it performs very well.

 There is a bit of bass bleed but the mids are still strong and clear. The Spark manages to be mildly v-shaped in response without placing the midrange too far back, partly as a result of its overall presentation being fairly aggressive. In this way it is reminiscent of the pricier PureSound ClarityOne, albeit thinner and more dry-sounding. In comparison, the similarly-priced Fischer Audio Consonance is more mid-recessed, but thicker and smoother. The mids of the Spark are still not nearly as forward as those of the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 or Brainwavz M2 but compared to most other bass-heavy sets its balance is rather good.

 Moving upward, the Spark boasts some emphasis and mild unevenness in the lower treble, giving it a little sparkle without risking significant sibilance. There is a bit of edginess to the treble but the only real complaint I have is its mediocre extension, which results in a darker tonal slant and slight lack of air in the upper registers. Aside from the last bit of top end extension, the Spark satisfies with good treble energy, detail, and crispness.

 The presentation of the Spark is pretty standard for a mid-range dynamic earphone. It is slightly aggressive and doesn’t have the largest soundstage but is well-rounded, with decent depth and good layering. The Soundmagic E10, with its sparkly, well-extended treble, has a larger, more open presentation but the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 and Dunu Trident lack layering and sound less three-dimensional in comparison to the Spark. Instrument separation and dynamics are on similarly even footing with competing sets from Head-Fi’s favorite brands. A final point to note – the Spark is surprisingly efficient and, despite the conservative stated figures, reaches listening volume more quickly than any of the sets I put it up against.

*Value (8.5/10) *– The id America Spark is a solid choice for those seeking a bass-heavy headset at a reasonable price. True to its name, the Spark is energetic, with excellent bass impact, good clarity, and a well-rounded presentation making it an easy choice over popular mainstream sets such as the Beats by Dre Tour and Klipsch Image S4. Add native headset functionality, a striking design, and good build quality and the Spark should strike up interest not only in the car buffs, but all music lovers.

*Pros: Solid build quality; bass-heavy sound with good clarity and layering
 Co/strongns: Sharp rear edges maybe be uncomfortable for some*

 A full review of the Spark with more images can be found here
  

*(3A67) Altec Lansing UHP336 / Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 3*


Reviewed Mar 2012

 Details: Altec Lansing re-badge of UE's discontinued SuperFi 3
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $129.95)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _13Ω_ | Sens:_ 115 dB_ | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _3.8' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: Sony Hybrid
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips, cleaning tool, and soft zippered carrying case
 Build Quality* (4/5)* - Quite similar to the higher-end UE models - thick plastics, detachable cables with two inches of memory wire, and standard I-plug
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5) *- Quite good with well-fitting tips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* - Low due to over-the-ear fit but not absent completely
 Comfort* (3.5/5)* - The shells are similar in shape to those of the TF10 and SF5Pro but slimmer towards the front and lend themselves to insertion much easier. Maintaining a seal can be difficult with stock UE tips but Hybrids work fine. Comply foams seal well also but soak up some of the SF3's already-scarce treble intensity and make them even warmer

 Sound *(6.9/10)* - Introduced a number of years ago as Ultimate Ears' entry-level model, the single-armature SF3 was tuned as a do-it-all earphone to compete with Etymotic's ER6 and Shure's E2C. Like most single-armature earphones from that time period, the SF3 doesn't do a great job of covering the entire frequency spectrum. The bass rolls off significantly and lacks detail near the limit. Poor sub-bass presence aside, the bass is smooth and level, flowing without bleed into the midrange.

 The mids are slightly forward - not to the same degree as with the newer SuperFi 5 but definitely more so than the low end and treble. Overall balance is still very good, however, and the note thickness is neither excessive nor lacking. Resolution and detail are not quite on-par with the Etymotics of the period, partly because the SF3 at times seems to gloss over fine detail and texture to maintain its silky-smooth response, but the earphone performs no poorer than most dynamic-driver sets in its bracket. The clarity, too, is quite good but not accentuated by brightness as it is on the Ety ER6i.

 Treble sparkle is completely nonexistent, resulting in a smooth, non-fatiguing curve. The top end of the SF3 is a bit laid-back in terms of emphasis and lacks some energy and a bit of extension, much like the low end. The somewhat subdued treble response means that the SF3 is not airy or open-sounding but it does provide a very decent sense of space with good depth and width. An additional consideration - the SF3 can be quite hissy with many sources as a result of its high sensitivity. I would not recommend it at all unless it was to be used with a dedicated audio player.

 Value *(8/10)* - Introduced in 2006, the Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 3 is a single-armature earphone that still manages to impress at the sub-$60 price usually fetched by the Altec Lansing rebrand. The sound is smooth, clean, and balanced - if slightly mid-focused - and the relatively high isolation, low microphonics, and detachable cable only sweeten the deal. As an overall package, the Super.Fi 3 is very much on par with many modern designs and puts many of the entry-level models UE has produced since to shame.

*Pros: High isolation; low microphonics; detachable cable; smooth and balanced sound
 Cons: Extremely sensitive; not the best performer at the limits*
  
  
*(3A68) Astrotec AM-90*


Reviewed May 2012

 Details: One of the least expensive BA-based earphones on the market
 Current Price: *$44* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $44)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _25Ω_ | Sens: _109dB_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable:_ 3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid, Stock silicone, Stock foam_
 Wear Style:_ Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* - Single-flange (3 sizes) silicone tips, foam tips, and soft carrying pouch (original version also came with triple-flange eartips and clamshell carrying case)
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– Construction is solid, with all-metal housings and nozzle filters. Strain reliefs are flexible and the soft cable is above average in thickness and covered with a translucent sheath. It is one of the best cables I’ve seen in a while – quiet, flexible, and tangle-resistant
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The tapered housings and inclusion of triple-flange and foam tips allow the AM-90 to isolate quite well
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Cable noise is low when worn cable-down and nearly nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort* (4.5/5) *– The tapered housing design makes for one of the better straight-barrel form factors, with an elongated body that flares out gradually. The shells of the AM-90 are less likely to contact the outer ear than those of the Dunu Trident and narrower at the front than those of almost all other straight barrel earphones, allowing for a deeper seal. They might be a bit long for those with steeply-angled ear canals but for most they should be very comfortable

 Sound *(7.4/10)* – The AM-90 is a smooth-sounding BA-based earphone that falls on the warmer side of things in terms of tone. It uses a Knowles SR (Siren) armature and – not surprisingly – doesn’t sound all that different from the SR-based MEElec A151. Both are some of the better such setups I’ve heard and the sonic differences between them are no greater than what one would instead anticipate from two revisions of the same product.

 The sound signature of the AM-90, while slightly warm, is not unbalanced. Bass depth is decent enough – no match for dynamic-driver sets such as the id America Spark or VSonic GR99 but good for a single armature. Mid-bass impact is a hair lower than that of the A151 but control and detail are similarly good. The low end can be classified as punchy, but also not lacking in body and fullness for a BA-based earphone – seemingly a hallmark of the SR armature.

 The midrange of the AM-90 is on the warm side but seems to be a bit more level compared to that of the A151. The AM-90 is a touch less mid-forward (but still more so than a Brainwavz M1, for example) and sounds fuller and smoother than the A151. The MEElec set is a bit thinner-sounding and also more dry but maintains clarity better on busy passages. The differences are small, however, and the two earphones are still far more similar to each other than they are to competing sets. Neither earphone has the crispness of a higher-end BA-based earphone and both lack the perception of added clarity that comes with emphasized treble.

 The top end of the AM-90 is a touch more extended than that of the A151 and also less grainy but neither earphone can be recommended to fans of sparkly, prominent highs. Rather, the earphones are laid-back at the top and very, very smooth, doing a great job of cutting out harshness and sibilance. The VSonic GR06, for example, manages significantly better extension and energy at top but is also more fatiguing than the AM-90. Soundstage size, similarly, is not too impressive – the space is average and there’s not a whole lot of air compared to sets such as the GR06. However, as with the A151, the presentation is well-rounded, with some depth and height in addition to the width, good separation, and versatility in portraying intimacy as well as distance.

 Value* (10/10) *– The sound signature of the AM-90 may be nothing new next to other entry-level, single-BA earphones but it is the most reasonably-priced – and one of the best-sounding - SR-based sets I’ve heard. In addition, Astrotec’s OEM expertise shows in the excellent design – the solid isolation, sturdy housings, outstanding cables, and comfortable form factor. For a value-oriented product the AM-90 is not stingy on accessories, either, with a very nice hard case and good-quality tips included to make them work even for first-time IEM users. They are remarkably easy to get a seal with compared even to the A151 and therefore make an excellent stepping-off point into BA-based monitors.

*Pros: Well-balanced, slightly warm Knowles SR sound; good build quality; great cable; comfortable tapered design
 Cons: N/A*
  
  
*(3A69) VSonic GR02 Bass Edition*
  

Reviewed June 2012

 Details: Bass-oriented VSonic earphone based on the aging R02ProII
 Current Price: *$36* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est $36)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 24Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _12-25k Hz _| Cable: _4.3' 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm_ | Preferred tips:_ stock bi-flanges; MEElec “balanced” bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* - Single-flange (3 sizes), hybrid-style (7 sizes), foam-stuffed hybrid (3 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and padded spring-clasp carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (4.5/5) *– The GR02 Bass Edition utilizes the same plastic-and-metal housings as the old R02ProII model and a number of other earphones. The construction is very good – the shells feel well put-together and the strain reliefs are strong and flexible. The cabling is similar to that of the R02ProII – thicker than that of the GR99, strong, and tangle-resistant
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good, especially with the included thick bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cable-down; very low with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The familiar housings are small and fit well. Long strain reliefs may pose an issue for some with over-the-ear wear but a cable cinch is present to help out. Tip selection is very generous

 Sound* (7.6/10) *– Despite its ominous moniker, the GR02 Bass Edition doesn’t add a whole lot of low-end grunt to the sound of the older R02ProII model, which, admittedly, was hardly bass-shy to begin with. The low of the GR02 is punchy, but not inaccurate and the earphone is not quite a bass monster. There is a similar amount of deep bass compared to the cheaper GR99 but the mid-bass is dominant source of power with the GR02. Despite this, the Bass Edition also gains a bit of detail, control, and dynamics and can be more impactful than the GR99 when pressed.

 The GR02 is also bassier than the higher-end GR06 and its low end can overshadow the midrange on occasion compared to the more mid-forward GR06, the more subbass-focused GR99, and more balanced-sounding sets such as the Monoprice 8320. The note presentation of the GR02 is thinner compared to the GR06 and the midrange clarity is a bit better. The mids are less liquid and intimate compared to the GR06 but warmer, cleaner, and a touch more forward compared to the GR99.

 The top end of the GR02 bears some resemblance to the GR06 and GR07 models, with good presence and extension but a slight predisposition towards pointing out sibilance on tracks. For the price there are very few sets that do treble this well without sacrificing brightness as the lower-end GR99 does. Similarly, soundstaging prowess lags a little behind the higher-end models but is more than acceptable for the price. The soundstage is average in size and lacks the separation and layering of the GR06 but still provides a well-rounded sonic image for a satisfying experience.

 Value* (10/10) *– VSonic’s new lineup continues to impress with this re-tuned take on the aging R02ProII model. An impressive performer with a focus on mid-bass punch, the GR02 Bass Edition provides unexpected bang for not very much buck and - from the durable, time-tested housings to the tangle-resistant cable and 28-piece tipset - doesn’t feel one bit outdated.

*Pros: Very well-built, great sound for the money, generous tip set
 Cons: N/A*
  
  
*(3A70) Philips O'Neill Tread SHO2200*
  

Added Sep 2012
  
 Details: Sport-oriented earphones from Philips designed for maximum durability
 Current Price:* $40 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $39.99); $50 for SHO2205 with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω _| Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _6-23.5k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec M6 bi-flanges, Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality* (5/5) *– The Tread has clearly been designed with extreme durability in mind - the earpieces boast aluminum inner shells protected by a rubber sheath and are said to survive up to 300 lbs of impact. The nozzles are protected by metal filters and the cables - by long, flexible strain reliefs. The Kevlar-reinforced cord is thicker than average and surprisingly tangle-resistant. It is sheathed in cloth below the y-split and features an exceptionally beefy L-plug and rock-solid Y-split
 Isolation *(3/5)* - Isolation is good for a dynamic-driver earphone – more than reasonable for the typical daily commute
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Low when worn cable-down; nearly nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort* (3/5) *– Though it was designed with sports in mind, the Tread is conventional straight-barrel in-ear earphone. The housings are slightly on the heavy side and the stock eartips are a little stiff. Comfort is average but at least the earphones can be worn over-the-ear quite easily due to the flexible strain reliefs and soft cable

 Sound *(6/10) *- Philips has focused mostly on style and durability with the O’Neill line but the sound quality of the Tread is still respectable for the asking price. While the marketing materials promise good bass depth, in reality the Tread puts out mostly mid-bass and suffers from mild low-end roll-off. The low end is punchy, however - impact is about on-par with the similarly-priced Klipsch Image S3 and lags just behind Philips’ cheaper SHE3580 model. The SHE3580 also has better sub-bass presence and sounds fuller and warmer. The MEElectronics M9, on the other hand, also has greater bass quantity but lags behind the Tread in quality, sounding boomy and muddy in comparison.

 The midrange of the Tread is clear and prominent. There is more emphasis on the bass but vocals don’t sound too recessed and there is no bass bleeding into the mids. The tone is on the cool side compared to most entry-level sets, which tend to be warm and bassy. Moving up into the treble, the Tread is a touch uneven but not excessively so - the Klipsch Image S3, for example, is harsher and far more sibilant. The Tread also derives some extra intelligibility with vocals from its prominent treble and has decent top-end extension compared to the MEElectronics M9 and Dunu Trident. The presentation is respectable as well – soundstage size is average but the instrument separation is good and the earphones don’t sound congested. The Tread still doest’t sound anywhere near as large and spacious as the Soundmagic E10 but keeps up with the popular mainstream sets in its price bracket.

 Value *(8/10)* – The Philips O’Neill Tread delivers exactly what it promises – a bulletproof construction that puts most earphones – no matter the price – to shame. Passive noise isolation is also good for an in-ear of its type and cable noise is respectably low. There are more comfortable earphones out there and certainly better-sounding ones - the clean, slightly cold sound of the Tread may not appeal to mainstream listeners and won’t win over many audiophiles – but on the whole the Tread is sure to be a success with those who are simply tired of replacing broken earphones.

*Pros: Extremely solid construction; low cable noise; decent clarity
 Cons: Slightly cold and thin-sounding; sound does not measure up to cheaper SHE3580 model*


*(3A71) Klipsch Image S3*


Added Sep 2012

 Details: Younger, less elegant sibling of the popular Image S4
 Current Price:* $39* from amazon.com (MSRP: $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB _| Freq: _12-18k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Klipsch gels_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (3.5/5) *- Single-flange (2 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips; compact zippered carrying case
 Build Quality* (3.5/5)* - Housings are plastic but sturdy and well-relieved on cable entry. No nozzle filter is present and the cable is thin and lacks a cinch
 Isolation* (3/5) *– Above average for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Very low with over-the-ear wear; tolerable otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– The angled-nozzle housings are lightweight and unobtrusive, though slightly larger than those of the S4. They also have sharper front edges, which can become uncomfortable for extended wear

 Sound *(5.9/10)* – The Image S3 is reminiscent of the pricier S4 not only cosmetically, but also sonically. Like the design, which is a simplified, cheaper-looking, and less ear-friendly take on the S4, the sound borrows both the positive and not-so-positive traits of the higher-end model.

 The S3 is v-shaped in signature, with strong bass and treble. As with the S4, the low end is rarely boomy considering the enhanced bass quantity but lacks some rumble in the sub-bass region. Both the Soundmagic E10 and MEElectronics M9 extend better at the bottom. The cheaper M9 sounds a bit loose next to the S3 but those looking purely for bass ‘slam’ will still be better off with an M9 or Sony XB-series earphone. For quick and punchy bass, the S3 performs rather well.

 Bass bleed is minimal but as with the S4 the midrange is somewhat recessed compared to the bass and treble. Clarity is quite above average for the price but note presentation is on the thin side – the Soundmagic E10 sounds significantly fuller and more realistic with its warmer, smoother sound signature. The S3 comes across cold and harsh, in large part due to the peaky treble. As with the S4, the top end can be downright unpleasant at times, with occasional bouts of sibilance and a tendency make drums and snares sound unnecessarily sharp and edgy.

 Soundstaging is also average at best – the S3 has a typical in-the-head budget in-ear presentation and lacks depth. The Soundmagic E10 sounds much more spacious and ambient, portraying both width and depth better than the Image S3. Even next to the MEElectronics M9 the S3 sounds a bit compressed and congested, though it is helped along by better resolution and clarity as well as slightly better treble extension.

 Value* (7/10)* – The Klipsch Image S3 boasts good clarity and punchy bass but is let down by the hot treble and mediocre presentation. Like the S4, it is a decent earphone for those looking to stay with a name brand but far from the best-sounding set for the price. In the world outside of retail stores, this “S4 light” has some very stiff competition.

*Pros: Good clarity and bass; very low cable noise with cable-up wear; 2-yr warranty
 Cons: Treble quality lacking; can be uncomfortable due to sharp housing edges*
  
  
*(3A72) Rock-It Sounds R-20*
  

Added Sep 2012

 Details: One of the most reasonably-priced BA-based IEMs on the market
 Current Price: *$40* from rockitsounds.com (MSRP: $39.99); *$49.99* for R-20M with mic and 1-button remote
 Specs: Driver:_ BA_ | Imp: _31Ω @ 500 Hz_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq:_ 20-18k Hz _| Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; Shure gray flex_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), airline adapter, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The R-20 utilizes plastic housings with filterless nozzles. The strain reliefs are a bit too hard for my liking but the twisted cable is excellent, identical to those found on the R-11, R-30, and R-50, as well as the MEElectronics A151. The molded L/R markings can be hard to discern but luckily the earpieces are asymmetric and easy to tell apart
 Isolation *(3.5/5) *– Isolation is good even though only single-flange tips are included
 Microphonics* (5/5)* – Cable noise is nonexistent with the excellent twisted cable
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The R-20 is clearly designed for over-the-ear wear but the nozzles are angled opposite of the convention used by nearly all other earphone manufactures, which makes cable-down wear impractical. The only sets with the same design are old UEs such as the TF10. In addition, the cord of the R-20 is advertised as a regular cable with memory wire but actually uses a twisted cable with no memory wire. The cable is soft and flexible, however, and the lack of memory wire causes no issues

 Sound *(7.4/10)* – The sound of the R-20 is highly reminiscent of other IEMs utilizing the Knowles SR driver. The bass is tight and clean, a huge improvement over Rock-It’s lower-end dynamic models. There’s slightly less bass depth, impact, and fullness compared to the MEElec A151 but the R-20 is still on the warm and punchy side for an armature-based earphone. There is no bleed into the midrange, which is clean and a touch forward.

 Looking at the market as a whole, the differences between the R-20 and A151 are small and the two earphones are far more similar than they are different. However, whereas the A151 has a darker, smoother sound with more laid-back upper mids resulting in a duller vocal presentation, the R-20 is thinner-sounding and emphasizes the upper midrange more. As a result it is brighter and more energetic. It is also a bit less forgiving of sibilance than the A151, but still more so than the higher-end R-30 model. The treble of the R-20 is laid-back on the whole and top-end extension isn’t great. Neither the R-20 nor the A151 has the crispness of higher-end BA earphones, and both lack the perception of added clarity that comes with emphasized treble.

 Soundstage size is not too impressive either – the space is average and there’s not a whole lot of air compared to the higher-end R-30 and competing dynamic-driver sets such as the Soundmagic E30. However, as with the MEElec A151, the presentation is well-rounded, with some depth and height in addition to the width, good separation, and the ability to portray intimacy as well as distance.

 Value *(10/10) *– Although the R-20 is among the cheapest BA-based IEMs on the market, Rock-It Sounds has taken no shortcuts when it comes to design or construction. The cable is excellent and the over-the-ear fit is secure and comfortable over long listening sessions. The sound, too, is competitive with other entry-level single armature earphones and makes the R-20 a great introduction to the world of balanced armatures at a rock-bottom price.

*Pros: Comfortable; excellent cable; no cable noise, good clarity and detail
 Cons: Unusual nozzle angle forbids cable-down wear; strain reliefs could be more flexible*
  
  
*(3A73) Brainwavz M5*
  

Added Oct 2012
  
 Details: Brainwavz’ fifth M-series in-ear
 Current Price: *$40* from amazon.com (MSRP: $49.50); $54.50 for M5 with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _16-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock (wide channel) single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
  
 Accessories *(4.5/5)* - Single-flange wide channel (3 sizes), single-flange narrow channel (3 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips, Comply foam tips, shirt clip, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality* (4/5) *- The M5 features lightweight aluminum shells with metal nozzle filters. The rubbery cabling is a bit thin above the y-split but strain relief is excellent all around and the new L-plug seems very durable
 Isolation* (2.5/5)* – Isolation is about average for a dynamic-driver earphone and can be increase slightly with the included Comply tips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Cable noise is bothersome when worn cable-down. Cable-up wear is recommended
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are lightweight and compact, tapering at the rear to provide a compliant, non-intrusive fit. Flexible strain reliefs and cable cinch allow for over-the-ear wear, though this may not be desirable when a mic/remote is present
  
 Sound* (7.6/10) *– The newest M-series earphone from Brainwavz, the M5 seems to combine some of the best aspects from the M1 and M2 into a competent and coherent audio package. At the core of the sound is ample bass—the low end of the M5 boasts good depth, plenty of impact, and a mild mid-bass focus. Compared to the older M1, M2, and M3, the bass of the M5 is deeper, more powerful, and more dynamic. It is noticeably more detailed and effortless, and even next to the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition the M5 more than holds its own, providing a deeper, more fleshed-out low end. 
  
 Despite the powerful bass, the M5 does a reasonable job of minimizing bass bleed and bloat. Part of the reason is the prominent lower midrange of the M5 – unlike many other bass-heavy earphones the M5 isn't notably mid-recessed. The lower mids are emphasized and the entire midrange is smooth, dropping gradually in forwardness towards the top. The treble takes a small step back and clarity is pretty much the only aspect of the M5 that doesn’t surpass other earphones in its price range. Still, despite its warmer tone, the M5 is about as clear as the older M1 model. Vocal clarity and intelligibility, especially with female vocals, take a hit compared to the M1 and M2 as well as competing sets like the pricier VSonic GR06. Detail levels are better than average, however, with the M5 sounding more refined and realistic than the M2. The top end doesn’t offer up a whole lot of sparkle but extension is good for a warmer earphone. Harshness and sibilance are nonexistent – in fact, the M5 cuts down on sibilance
  
 The presentation is affected by the laid-back treble but offers a substantial improvement over the older Brainwavz models. The M5 isn’t very airy and can get slightly congested on busy tracks but has better layering and sounds much more enveloping than the M1 and M2.  The M2 especially sounds exceedingly flat and two-dimensional next to the M5. The pricier VSonic GR06, on the other hand, despite its more forward midrange, is capable of portraying a wider and more open sonic space.
  
 Value* (9/10)* – The Brainwavz M5 is a well-built, well-accessorized, and comfortable earphone with sound that puts it at the top of its game. Its sonic signature won’t do for those looking to maximize clarity but it is sure to please fans of warmer, smoother sound. Better still, the M5 improves in many ways on the older M1, M2, and ProAlpha models without hiking up the price – an amazing accomplishment considering how far ahead of the competition the original Brainwavz earphones were upon release just a few short years ago.
  
*Pros: Good build quality; deep bass and full, smooth sound*
*Cons: Average clarity*
  

*(3A74) ViSang VS-K1*
  

Added Jan 2013
  
 Details: Compact metal-shelled earphone from ViSang
 Current Price: *$50* from ebay.com (MSRP: est. $49.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 5.5mm | Preferred tips: Stock single-flanges, generic single-flanged
 Wear Style: Straight down or over-the-ear

 Accessories* (4/5) *- Single-flange hybrid-style silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips, shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality* (4/5) *– The VS-K1 features aluminum shells with metal nozzle filters. The cabling is identical to my older ViSang and Brainwavz models – internally braided and a little stiff. No cable cinch is present
 Isolation* (2.5/5) *- Isolation is about average for a shallow-fit dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics* (4/5) *– Present when worn cable-down; very low otherwise
 Comfort* (4/5) *- The housings are compact and taper at the rear to provide a compliant, non-intrusive fit. The K1 is happy with a relatively shallow seal and can be worn over-the-ear easily

 Sound* (7.6/10) *– The sound of ViSang’s latest and greatest harkens back to the R01, R02, and R03 models of old but provides a more mature and refined experience. The sound signature is reasonably balanced, with a slight mid-bass lift and mild treble roll-off. The bass has decent depth and good overall presence but the earphones are far from bass-heavy. They don’t have the bass boost of the old R03 model (perhaps better known by its Brainwavz M2 rebrand) but there is more body and fullness compared to the Brainwavz M1 and similarly-priced armature earphones such as the Astrotec AM-90. It’s not the tightest low end out there, but the control is respectable and the overall presentation will appeal to those who enjoy a softer, smoother sound.

 The ViSang products of old--even the bass-heavy ones--have always had clean, articulate mids, and the VS-K1 is no exception. The midrange is prominent and the earphones could potentially be called mid-centric if not for the decent amount of bass. As is, the sound is rather well-balanced overall. There is no bass bleed; Brainwavz’ new M5 model is significantly bassier and more subdued in the midrange compared to the VS-K1. Clarity is good for the asking price – not quite up there with the armature-based Astrotec AM-90 or the thinner-sounding Brainwavz M1, but very close.

 Starting with the upper midrange, the VS-K1 follows a smooth and forgiving approach reminiscent of the Brainwavz M5. The top end is laid-back but not enough so to make the earphones sound dark and lacking in balance. Sets such as the Astrotec AM-90 have more upper midrange presence and energy while the VS-K1 sounds more smooth and relaxed. This goes for the presentation as well – the VS-K1 is not as forward as the AM-90 or Brainwavz M1. It has very decent depth, which is noticeable next to the older ViSang R03/Brainwavz M2, but doesn’t sound as big and enveloping as the pricier VSonic GR06. Overall, the relaxed presentation fits the sound signature well.

 Value* (9/10) *– The ViSang VS-K1 is a budget earphone that offers strong performance across the board. Fans of the older ViSang models will be pleased with the more mature sound and the smooth yet reasonably balanced tuning should appeal to an even wider audience. The solid construction and comfortable, shallow-fit housings round the VS-K1 out as an easy recommendation.

*Pros: Solid construction, smooth sound
 Cons: No cable cinch*
  
  
  
*(3A75) RHA MA-350*
  

Added Jan 2013
  
 Details: First in-ear earphone from Scotland-based Reid & Heath Audio
 Current Price:* $35* from amazon.com (MSRP: $39.95)
 Specs: Driver: Dynamic | Imp:_ 16Ω _| Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _16-22k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or * over-the-ear* _

 Accessories* (2.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (4.5/5) *– The MA-350 boasts solid-feeling machined aluminum housings, metal nozzle filters, and fabric cables with flexible strain reliefs. The cable is a little tangle-prone but the overall feel is one of a higher-end product. The 3-year warranty is very impressive as well
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5) *– The housings are narrow at the front, allowing relatively deep insertion with good isolation
 Microphonics* (3.5/5) *– Moderate in the cloth-sheathed cable; can be greatly reduced with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort* (4/5)* – The earphone housings have a familiar flared shape a-la Dunu Trident but are compact and light. The small diameter at the front affords a comfortable, unobtrusive fit

 Sound* (6.8/10) *– The MA-350 pursues a consumer-friendly sound and delivers on its promise of “a deep, full bass response” in spades, pumping out plenty of powerful sub-bass. It delivers more low bass than either the Brainwavz M5 or Dunu Trident, two solid and bass-heavy sub-$50 in-ears. Though the sub-bass is not very informative, the low end of the MA-350 genuinely impresses with its depth and rumble. The response stays strong well into the mid-bass region, resulting in a warm—but not overly so—tone.

 The powerful bass of the MA-350 makes the mids sound slightly overshadowed and at times a touch muddy. This is far from uncommon for bass-heavy entry-level earphones – there are a few that manage better overall clarity (e.g. VSonic GR02 BE) and many more that can’t compete with the MA-350. Note thickness is good and the overall sound is rich and full.

 The treble is in balance with the midrange and generally smooth. At reasonable volumes the top end is very inoffensive. The MA-350 is smoother overall than the popular VSonic GR02 BE and doesn’t introduce sibilance to a track. A little grain can become apparent at higher volumes—the Dunu Trident behaves better here even though it is not as crisp and extended as the MA-350. Top-end roll-off is present, but gradual. No surprises for an entry-level set.

 In terms of presentation, the MA-350 is again par for the course. It is not the most spacious earphone and, like most budget sets, generally has an intimate, in-the-head presentation. It can get a touch congested but is more than acceptable for the asking price—better, for example, than the more closed-in sounding Dunu Trident.

 Value* (9/10) *– RHA’s first in-ear earphone is a solid entry-level offering. There is quite a lot to like here but ultimately the MA-350 stands out in two ways – excellent build quality and deep, subwoofer-like bass. This is definitely the one earphone to show those claiming that in-ears can’t deliver adequate bass across the spectrum and, hopefully, is just the first of many in-ear products from RHA.

*Pros: Solid build quality; 3 year warranty; powerful subbass
 Cons: Cable noise can be bothersome unless worn cord-up*
  
  
  
*(3A76) Spider TinyEar*


Added Feb 2013

 Details: Spider’s light-and-comfortable entry-level earphone
 Current Price:* $35* from amazon.com (MSRP: $39.99)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens:_ 104 dB _| Freq:_ 18-22k Hz_ | Cable: 3.9' I-plug
 Nozzle Size:_ 4mm _| Preferred tips:_ Stock single-flanges; MEElec M6 single flanges_
 Wear Style:_ Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* - Single-flange (2 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips; plastic carrying case with integrated cable winder
 Build Quality* (3/5) *– The TinyEar uses two-piece plastic housings with hard stems, no strain reliefs, and a rubberized cable of average thickness. The L/R markings stamped into the housings can be hard to see
 Isolation* (3/5)* – The slim housings allow for good isolation
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; low otherwise
 Comfort* (4.5/5) *– The TinyEar is claimed to be the smallest in-ear headphone on market, and while that’s not exactly true, the housings are quite small and very lightweight. Stems are short and it’s easy to get a seal even though only 2 smaller sizes of single-flange tips are included

 Sound* (6.6/10) *– The sound of the TinyEar is well-balanced with an emphasis on treble. The bass is medium in quantity – punchy but not really enhanced and much flatter overall than the boosted bass of a JVC FX101 or Dunu Trident. Sub-bass drops off rather quickly - both low-end extension and impact are lacking compared to Spider’s pricier Realvoice model.

 The midrange is mildly recessed but the balance is good overall – better, for example, than with comparably-priced JVC and Klipsch models. Clarity is decent, helped along by the treble emphasis. Note thickness is on the low side – the TinyEar is not nearly as thick as the warmer, weightier Realvoice. The tone overall is cooler and brighter compared to most sets in the price range. The treble is energetic but seems to be enhanced rather evenly, without any major spikes. The TinyEar is definitely brighter and more treble-heavy overall than the JVC FX101 but still remains smoother and easier to listen to than the harsher JVCs.

 The soundstage of the TinyEar is average in size. Good treble extension provides decent air but soundstage width and depth are only moderate. The similarly-priced Soundmagic E10 provides a more open, out-of-the-head presentation and even the Dunu Trident has better depth and layering. Worth noting also is how inefficient the TinyEar is – despite the advertised 104dB sensitivity, it required more power to reach listening volume than any of the earphones I put it up against.

 Value *(7.5/10) *– While not as impressive as Spider’s higher-end Realvoice model, the TinyEar provides clean and balanced sound in an extremely compact form factor. Clearly designed for those with smaller ears, the TinyEar will fit pretty much anyone comfortably, which is good because many will enjoy its clarity and energetic – but surprisingly non-fatiguing – treble.

*Pros: Small and lightweight; clean & clear sound
 Cons: Microphonic when worn cable-down*
  
 Thanks to *mcnoiserdc *for the TinyEar loan!
  
  
*(3A77) VSonic VC02*
  

Reviewed Feb 2013

 Details: Dynamic microdriver earphone from VSonic
 Current Price: *$40* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $40)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _10-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3/5)* - Single-flange (3 sizes), hybrid-style (7 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips; shirt clip, drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The VC02’s form factor is of the slim, straight-barrel variety. The construction is very similar to that of the pricier GR01, albeit with detachable cables and fixed nozzles. The cable is smooth but on the thin side and lacks a sliding cinch. It utilizes a conventional 2-pin socket, though it detaches a little more easily than I’d have liked. A bump on the inside of the right strain relief differentiates the left and right connectors.
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Similar to the pricier GR06 and GR07 models
 Microphonics *(4/5)* - Cable noise is bothersome when worn cable-down but becomes low with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The housings are very slim and easy to insert deeply for a good seal. The sheer variety of included eartips should allow the fit to work for anyone, though earphones with slimmer nozzles provide more fitment options still. The cable exits at an angle so those with smaller ears may have trouble wearing the VC02 cable-up

 Sound *(8.1/10)* – The VC02 is undoubtedly the most balanced sub-$100 model I’ve heard from VSonic thus far. It pursues an accurate, uncolored sound that continuously impresses with its crispness and clarity. The low end of the VC02 is tight and punchy, though fans of enhanced bass will be disappointed by its linear nature. The impact is slightly greater compared to the HiFiMan RE0 but not at the level of VSonic’s GR06 model. Bass depth is good and bass detail and texture are excellent due to the lack of mid-bass bloat – easily among the best I’ve heard in the sub-$100 range.

 The mids are clean and crisp. Midrange presence is excellent, with no recession but also less warmth and thickness compared to sets that would normally be considered “balanced” in the budget realm, such as the Brainwavz M1 and Monoprice 8320. The VC02 is clearer than these, and clearer also than the armature-based Rock-It Sounds R-30, falling just behind the far more expensive HiFiMan RE-ZERO and MEElec A161P. It is slightly thin-sounding and the tonality is on the cool side, which will still make the GR06 a better choice for some listeners.

 The top end of the VC02 is extended and just as crisp as the rest of the signature, but still has some of the slightly hot character that all higher-end VSonic dynamics seem to share. It is a little less sibilant than my GR07 mkI but still doesn’t quite have the refinement of HiFiMan’s dynamic-driver earphones. The presentation is spacious but not particularly enveloping – the GR07 and GR06 both seem to present a more well-rounded sonic image. Soundstage width is good, however, and the balanced, clear sound leaves no room for any sort of congestion. In fact, the VC02 makes the armature-based Rock-It R-30 sound a little congested and vague when it comes to imaging. All in all, it has nothing to be ashamed of for the price. It may be worth noting the lower-than-average sensitivity of the VC02, which will leave those who gauge sound quality by volume level wanting.

 Value *(10/10)* – I wrote and scrapped this section several times trying to convey the scope of the VC02’s brilliance. While VSonic’s GR-series earphones have simply been at the top of their game, the VC02 seems to transcend competing altogether. There are a few nitpicks but there’s so much more to like. I like the detachable cables with the common 2-pin connector – something I haven’t seen on a budget earphone since Altec Lansing stopped selling UE models at huge discounts. I like the tiny 3mm dynamic driver, the slim form factor, and the resulting comfort and noise isolation. I like the fact that VSonic includes a ton of tips despite the small sizing gaps between them. And I especially like fact that the VC02 boasts what has to be the clearest, tightest, and most detailed sound this side of the HiFiMan RE0 – a model that was originally considered well-priced at $239 and remained a Head-Fi favorite for years. The VC02 does all that at an astonishingly low price point. Enough said.

*Pros: Small, lightweight, and comfortable; very balanced and articulate sound
 Cons: Lacks cable cinch; detachable cables can come off too easily*
  
  
  
*(3A78) VSonic R02 Silver*
  

Reviewed May 2013

 Details: Latest version of VSonic's popular R02 model
 Current Price:* $49 f*rom lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est $49)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _24Ω _| Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq:_ 8-28k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4.1' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 5.5mm | Preferred tips:_ stock bi-flanges; MEElec “balanced” bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down *or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* - Bi-flange silicone tips (3 pairs in 2 sizes), shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The R02 Silver is similar to VSonic’s other -02 models in appearance but actually has a smaller nozzle diameter and all-plastic housings. The earphones are still very robust, however, and the cable is strong and flexible
 Isolation *(3.5/5) *– Good, especially with the included thick bi-flange tips
 Microphonics* (4/5) *– Low when worn cable-down; very low with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort* (4/5)* – The familiar housings are small and fit well. Long strain reliefs may pose an issue for some with over-the-ear wear but a cable cinch is present to help out

 Sound* (8/10)* – The R02 Silver is the latest iteration of VSonic’s long-running R02 model. The last one I tested – the GR02 Bass Edition – had a rather v-shaped sound to it, complete with strong bass and prominent, occasionally sibilant treble. The R02 Silver pursues the opposite signature – smooth and almost mid-centric in nature. It reminds me of a Brainwavz M1 with punchier bass and all-around better clarity.

 The most prominent feature of the R02 Silver is the midrange – it is far more forward than with the GR02 bass edition and a little more so than with the pricier GR06. The bass quantity, on the other hand, is diminished compared to the GR02 Bass Edition, appearing less impactful but also less prone to bleeding up into the midrange. Bass punch is similar to the pricier GR06, though the latter is a touch quicker. The mids sound clear and open – a little thicker and less nuanced than with the VSonic VC02 and many of the pricier armature-based earphones, but nonetheless very clean and natural.

 The top end is smooth, but not recessed. There is less treble brilliance than with VSonic’s other dynamic-driver earphones, but also no sibilance. This is especially noticeable next it the Bass Edition of the GR02, which tends to be hotter and more harsh in the treble. The presentation of the R02 Silver is fitting, with a large, out-of-the-head sound. The imaging is not the most precise but still on-par with the better earphones in its price range.

 Value* (10/10) *– The aging VSonic R02 continues to impress with its latest tuning, eschewing the v-shaped signature of the GR02 Bass Edition for a more mid-centric sound with surprisingly good clarity and bass quality. The only downside here is the limited tip selection compared to the GR02 bass edition, but even having to pick up a few extra tips fails to diminish the value of what VSonic has here.

*Pros: Well-built, great sound for the money
 Cons: Lacks in tip selection compared to GR02 Bass Edition*
  
  
*(3A79) Dunu DN-22M Detonator*
  

Added Jun 2013

 Details: Entry-level headset model from Dunu
 Current Price: N/A (MSRP: $45)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω _| Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Hybrid-style single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange regular (3 sizes), hybrid-style (3 sizes), bi-flange, and triple-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, soft carrying pouch, clamshell carrying case, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(5/5) *– Overall construction is excellent. The cable is similar to the one on the old Trident model – a little rubbery but mostly soft and flexible. The housings are metal and feel very solid, boasting also a very nice finish. A single-button mic and remote – the first I’ve seen from Dunu – is located on the left-side cable
 Isolation *(3.5/5) *– Very good for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Quite tolerable when worn cable-down; over-the-ear wear may be restricted by mic position
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings are one the heavy side but rounded at the front for comfort. The fit is typical of a straight-barrel earphone

 Sound *(6.7/10) *– The sound of the Detonator is decidedly explosive, underpinned by the enhanced bass response. The low end has good extension but also quite a lot of mid-bass emphasis, which gives the earphone a slightly boomy and bloated sound. Overall, the bass is a little too enhanced for my tastes, with more impact compared to Dunu’s popular Trident model as well as the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition.

 The mids are warm and smooth – not as recessed as with the GR02 Bass Edition or RHA MA-350, but still not too prominent due to the bass emphasis. Clarity is similar to the Dunu Trident and lags behind the pricier DN-23 Landmine model. The earphones remain very smooth up into the treble and roll off at the top, giving up the energy – but also the potential for harshness and sibilance – of sets such as the GR02 Bass Edition.

 Although the pricier DN-23 manages to be almost as bassy with less bloat, the bass of the DN-22M intrudes on the midrange at times. This causes the earphone to sound more congested than and less natural than the DN-23. Other than that, the presentation is quite good – a little wider compared to the Trident but otherwise similarly competent.

 Value *(8/10) *– While the Detonator is not an upgrade to the popular DN-17 Trident, it does offer a slightly bassier sound with better accessories. Plus, it boasts an inline microphone and remote – the first I’ve seen from Dunu – and retains the fantastic build quality Dunu has become known for. For those in search of a bulletproof entry-level smartphone headset, it’s a tough one to beat. Purely for audio quality, the less expensive DN-17 Trident is still my recommendation.

*Pros: Fantastic build quality; well-accessorized
 Cons: Not as accurate as the DN-17 Trident*
  
  
*(3A80) Sony MH1C*
  

Added Jun 2013
  
 Details: Sony headset designed for the Xperia line of smartphones 
 Current Price:* $35* from ebay.com (bulk packaging) (MSRP: $79.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _15 Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB/V_ | Freq: _1-20k Hz _| Cable: _3.9' L-plug J-cord_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_
  
 Accessories *(1.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes) and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– The MH1C is rather well-made, with a metal housing, flexible strain reliefs, and a sturdy flat cable. However, it is this rubbery, j-style (asymmetric) cable that can also make the earphones very to use. The 4-button remote is designed for Sony Xperia phones but offers partial functionality with many other devices
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Isolation is quite good
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– J-corded IEMs typically manage to avoid microphonics but the rubbery flat cable in the MH1C still carries a lot of noise 
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The skinny housings and flexible tips of the MH1C provide a comfortable fit but the j-cord makes it difficult to wear the earphones cable-up
  
 Sound* (8.1/10) *– Designed for smartphone users in search of great audio quality, the MH1C provides a warm, clear, and smooth sound only made more impressive by the reasonable price of the headset. The bass is deep and full, with an emphasis on sub-bass rather than mid-bass. Generally speaking, the MH1C has rather good bass quality with less mid-bass bloat than the Audio-Technica CKM500, for example. Considering the bass quantity, control is rather good although it’s still not as tight as the bass of the VSonic VC02 or the pricier Philips Fidelio S1.
  
 The mids of the MH1C are not as prominent as the low end, but they are pleasantly warm and smooth. The treble, likewise, is very inoffensive without sacrificing overall refinement. I did sometimes wish for better overall balance as the bass emphasis of the MH1C results in occasional veiling, but the clarity is generally very good.
  
 Better still is the high volume performance of the MH1C – the earphone remains very composed when played loud and its silky-smooth signature is conducive toward high-volume listening. Compared to the Brainwavz M5, for instance, the MH1C has less prominent mids and highs but is also smoother and more natural. Whereas the M5 can begin to distort slightly at high volumes, the MH1C produces no audible distortion.
  
 The soundstage of the MH1C is a little narrower compared to the half in-ear ATH-CKM500 and the pricier Philips Fidelio S1 but the overall presentation is very good, providing a moderately airy and open sound despite the warm tone with good soundstage width and depth.
  
*Select comparisons:*
  
LG Quadbeat HSS-F420 ($32)
  
 Not unlike the MH1C, the Quadbeat is a stock headset included with many LG smartphones. The sound signature of the Quadbeat is on the v-shaped side compared to the MH1C and its bass, especially subbass, is lower in quantity. The low end of the Quadbeat is a little tighter but the difference isn’t drastic. The LGs also sacrifice some of the warmth and fullness of the Sonys, giving up the excellent note thickness of the MH1C for a bit of added clarity, aided also by the extra treble energy of the Quadbeat. Next to the warm and smooth MH1C, the treble of the Quadbeat sounds brighter and harsher overall.
  
 I ended up preferring the sound of the MH1C, which overall sounded more natural and convincing despite the extra bass. On a user-friendliness note, while I found the cable of the Quadbeat to be a lot more tolerable than that of the MH1C, its extra-soft stock eartips did not work for me and had to be replaced with a set of standard bi-flanges of the MEElectronics variety. The Quadbeat was also more sensitive, reaching loud volumes very easily.
  
VSonic VC02 ($49)
  
 The VC02 is one of clearest and most balanced sub-$100 earphones I’ve ever heard, with a tiny 3mm dynamic driver providing a uniquely delicate, yet punchy sound. Unsurprisingly, the MH1C has a lot more bass and much warmer overall tone than the VC02. Its mids and treble are recessed in comparison to its bass whereas the VSonic set is rather well-balanced. The VC02 sounds brighter and thinner overall than the MH1C. It is clearer and more accurate, but the treble is harsher in comparison. The bass of the VC02 is surprisingly punchy considering its commitment to an accurate sound but remains tighter than that of the Sony.
  
 In terms of overall usabilit, both sets can be a little frustrating – the VC02 sounds best with a rather deep fit and has detachable cables that are not connected to the housings as securely as I’d like. It really is an enthusiast’s IEM, requiring some care in use and storage. The MH1C is easier to fit and has a built-in remote and mic but also utilizes a cable that is rubbery and microphonic in comparison to the soft and flexible cord of the VC02.
  
VSonic VSD1 ($43)
  
 The VSD1 was released as a budget version of VSonic’s popular GR07 model, providing a less analytical sound than the VC02 but retaining its technical performance. In comparison to the MH1C, the VSD1 is less bassy, boasting better overall balance and more neutral tone. Bass quality is similar between the two but the VSD1 is a touch clearer overall and boasts more treble presence. As with the pricier GR07, its treble does have a slight predisposition towards sibilance in comparison to the buttery-smooth MH1C. The soundstage is a touch wider with the VSD1 and again the VSonic is noticeably more sensitive than the Sony.
  
 Value *(10/10) *– Despite my issues with its j-style cable, microphonics, and proprietary remote, the MH1C offers fantastic sound quality for the asking price, and beyond. The bass is deep and full, and the overall sound is smooth and inviting. As long as its skew towards bass is not an issue, this is a fantastic mid-range earphone for beginners and veterans alike, and one that offers as much audio quality per dollar as anything else I’ve come across.
  
*Pros: Great deep bass & outstanding overall sound quality; comfortable form factor; good noise isolation*
*Cons: Rubbery, flat, j-style cable can be aggravating*
  
 Big thanks to *scootsit* for the MH1C unit!
  

*(3A81) LG Quadbeat HSS-F420*


Added Jun 2013

 Details: Stock headset for several LG smartphones; also sold separately
 Current Price: *$32* from ebay.com (MSRP: est $35)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _24Ω _| Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5) *- Single-flange (2 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Much like the Sony MH1C, the Quadbeat utilizes aluminum housings and lightweight, tangle-resistant flat cables. There is a single-button mic and remote on the right-side cable
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Good when well-sealing eartips are used
 Microphonics* (3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down but tolerable with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells of the Quadbeat are on the large side and the nozzles are extremely short. The stock tips are longer than average, designed to offset the issue with the housing shape, but are very soft and don’t provide a great seal for me. Those with small outer ears may have an issue finding a comfortable fit due to the housing shape 

 Sound *(7.9/10) *– The sound of the Quadbeat takes on a slightly v-shaped character with present but not overbearing bass and crisp, bright highs. Overall, it strongly reminds me of the Sunrise Audio Xcited. The low end has good extension and slight mid-bass boost for a punchy, yet clean sound. The Quadbeat lacks the depth and thickness of the Sony MH1C, so it won’t be a good match for those who prefer a fuller, weightier low end. However, its bass competes well with more neutral VSonic VC02, which has slightly less bass quantity.

 The midrange of the Quadbeat is clear and detailed, cleaner of bass bleed than the mids of the Philips SHE3580 and Astrotec AM-800, for example. Note thickness is similar to the VSonic VC02 and again lacking some of the fullness of sets like the Sony MH1C and VSonic VSD1.

 The treble is energetic, giving the overall tone a slightly bright tilt. Though the VSonic VC02 and VSD1 are slightly more predisposed towards sibilance, the Quadbeat has more overall energy in the upper midrange and lower parts of the treble, which gives it a brighter, slightly splashy sound. Next to the silky-smooth MH1C, it sounds a bit harsh but on its own the treble quality is decent enough. The presentation of the Quadbeat is wide and uncongested, as tends to be the case with other earphones with similar signatures. It is more out-of-the-head than that of the Sony MH1C and even the VSonic VSD1 and retains good separation and imaging.

 Value *(10/10) *– The LG Quadbeat provides a clean and detailed, yet minimally offensive sound with a slightly v-shaped signature. It’s also rather user-friendly, boasting flat cables that are less annoying than those on the Sony MH1C and a universal single-button remote. Not all is ideal - the wide, straight-barrel housings won’t work for all ear shapes and the stock tips may need replacing, but even with the cost of new tips factored in the Quadbeat offers great value for money. It also means that owners of certain LG phones will have to spend a good chunk of change to upgrade from their stock headsets. Whether this is a curse or a blessing, I’m not quite sure.

*Pros: Great audio quality
 Cons: Wide housings not ideal for small ears; flimsy stock tips*

 Big thanks to *Fernito *for the LG Quadbeat loan!
  
  
*(3A82) Signature Acoustics Elements C-12*
  

Added Aug 2013

  
 Details: Entry-level earphone from the first Indian IEM manufacturer 
 Current Price: est. *$50 *from ebay.com (MSRP: est. $60)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _17-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), replacement filters, shirt clip, and genuine leather zippered carrying pouch (limited first run also comes with heavy screw-top brass case)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The wooden housings of the C-12 are a little plain but well put-together. The earphones feature replaceable filters, which is a rarity these days. The textured cable is nice and sturdy, reminding me of the cords on the Brainwavz M1/M2/M3 earphones. No cable cinch is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Shallow fit results in average noise isolation
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Good with cable-down wear; even better when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The wooden housings are very lightweight and not overly large, allowing for a comfortable fit
  
 Sound *(7.2/10)* – The C-12 is an unabashedly bass-heavy earphone that focuses on presenting listeners with a big and impactful low end. The midbass region is hyped up, resulting in a slightly boomy sound and making the deep bass appear less prominent. Earphones such as the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition and Dunu Trident, which are by no means lacking in bass, both yield to the C-12 in overall impact, offering a more linear response better balanced between midbass and subbass. Suffice it to say that no one will find the bass of the C-12 deficient. 
  
 As a result of the bass boost, the mids of the C-12 are mildly veiled but at the same time maintain a warm and rich tone. Note thickness is rather good, though for my tastes the earphones could use more midrange presence and clarity. Clarity and detail levels are about on-par with the Brainwavz M2 and the older bass-heavy Xears models. The top end rolls off gently for a slightly dark overall tone and has a smoother character than, for example, VSonic earphones and the Astrotec AM-800. This makes it less fatiguing and more tolerable at high volumes. At the same time, the C-12 has a bit more sparkle than the aging Brainwavz M1 and M2 models, which is a plus.
  
 The presentation of the C-12 is nice and spacious, making competitors such as the Dunu Trident sound closed-in and congested in comparison. It’s not quite at the level of the pricier Astrotec AM-800 but comes very close, which is all the more impressive considering the more bass-heavy balance and darker tone of the C-12. Combined with the powerful bass, the spacious presentation makes for a very enjoyable listening experience.
  
 Value *(8/10)* – The Signature Acoustics Elements C-12 is a very capable earphone from the first India-based IEM manufacturer. A solid all-rounder with even more solid bass response, the Elements C-12 boasts slightly rolled-off treble and a spacious, reverberant presentation. The wooden housings are lightweight and comfortable in the ear while the twisted cables are strong and non-microphonic, making for convenient listening while out and about. Minor details such as packaging are slightly rough around the edges but one thing is certain: the Elements C-12 doesn’t look – or sound – like a freshman effort. 
  
*Pros: Lightweight housings & strong cables; impactful bass; good sense of space*
*Cons: Somewhat veiled midrange*
  
  
*(3A83) SteelSeries Flux In-Ear*
  

Added September 2013

Details: dynamic-driver headset from Denmark-based manufacturer of gaming peripherals SteelSeries
 MSRP: $49.99 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price:* $49.99* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _19Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug w/ mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and zippered carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The metal-and-plastic housings of the Flux remind me of the HiSoundAudio Crystal in both size and shape. The strain reliefs are not flexible enough for my liking but the narrow, rubbery flat cable works rather well. It holds a single-button inline remote and microphone.
 Isolation* (4/5)* – Good, thanks to slim form factor and well-sealing stock tips
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; good otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings are compact and lightweight, providing an unobtrusive fit that is comfortable for extended listening. The stock tips are of very good quality. The earphones can be worn cable-up as well as cable-down, though the microphone position suffers with over-the-ear wear

Sound *(8.2/10)* – The first dynamic-driver earphone from SteelSeries, the Flux In-Ear uses 6mm transducers and delivers a lively, well-rounded sound that impressed me from the very first listen. The bass has excellent extension and delivers good punch with no bloat. I would put the overall bass quantity on-par with the VSonic GR07 Bass Edition – like the VSonics, the Flux offers more impact than strictly neutral earphones such as the HiFiMan RE-400 but retains better accuracy than properly bass-heavy sets. The bass is not enhanced enough for the Flux to sound bloated – in fact, it is only a touch more boomy compared to the pricier and more neutral-sounding RE-400 and VSonic GR07.

The midrange of the Flux is among clearest I’ve heard in the price range and maintains a neutral-to-warm tone. The mids are a little recessed compared to sets such as the RE-400 and Dunu’s Tai Chi model, as well as the pricier Flux In-Ear Pro. This is not to say the Flux sounds severely v-shaped – rather, it is balanced-sounding with just a bit of a bass enhancement and crisp, prominent treble. The top end is extended, has good energy, and sounds mostly smooth, with just a bit of grain compared to higher-end sets such as the Flux In-Ear Pro, UE 600, and HiFiMan RE-400. It’s not nearly as prone to sibilance as many of the popular VSonic models and makes sets that are more laid-back at the top, such as the Dunu Tai Chi, sound dull and smoothed-over in comparison.

The presentation of the Flux fits in with the overall signature, being neither as forward and mid-centric as that of the HiFiMan RE-400, not as wide and out-of-the-head as that of the VSonic GR07. The good top-to-bottom extension, bass control, and overall balance of the Flux all help make sure that no elements of the sound are lost, in keeping with SteelSeries earphones being marketed for gaming as well as music.

*Select Comparisons*

Sony MH1C ($38) 

Last year, Sony’s MH1C model took the audiophile scene by storm as one of the best bang-per-buck in-ears on the market, making it a great benchmark for the new SteelSeries earphones. The MH1C offers a little more bass impact and a warmer tone than the Flux at the expense of greater bass bloat. The Flux has tighter bass compared to the Sony, and less of it, but still maintains great extension and good impact. The Flux also has more treble presence whereas the MH1C is a little smoother up top and a touch more spacious. From a user-friendliness perspective, the appeal of the MH1C is limited slightly by the annoying j-cord setup and Sony Xperia remote whereas the Flux has a universal one-button remote and standard y-type cable.

HiSoundAudio Crystal ($99) 

The Crystal may be significantly more expensive than the Flux, but the two earphones have quite a lot in common. They are similar in size and shape, similar in fit, and, as it turns out, similar in audio quality as well. I’ve always considered the Crystal to be a very solid earphone – a more balanced but similarly well-isolating alternative to the popular Shure SE215. Happily, the Flux offers all that at a fraction of the price. Compared to the Crystal, it has a warmer tone and more bass presence. The midrange of the Flux is a little less prominent, making it sound a touch more v-shaped, and its treble – slightly smoother. The Crystal, on the hand, is brighter and boasts more prominent mids. It has a slight advantage in midrange clarity but also sounds more harsh and prone to exposing sibilance.

SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro ($130) 

SteelSeries’ two in-ear monitors are both impressive performers but the sound quality difference between them isn’t as great as the price suggests. The armature-based Flux In-Ear Pro is flatter and more accurate, with more prominent mids, less bass, and smoother treble compared to the dynamic-driver Flux. It is also more sensitive, requiring less power to reach listening volumes.

The cheaper Flux model, on the other hand, boasts more bass and appears to have better bass depth. In terms of clarity the two are very close, with the more prominent treble of the Flux sometimes giving it an edge in vocal intelligibility. That same treble can sound a little grainy compared to the Flux In-Ear Pro but overall the two aren’t far apart. The soundstages of both earphones are similarly well-rounded but the Flux can be a little more dynamic at times.

Value *(10/10) *– The SteelSeries Flux In-Ear headset is one of the very best mid-range earphones I’ve heard to date, delivering fantastic sound quality per dollar with  punchy, extended bass, good treble energy, and excellent clarity. SteelSeries’ freshman effort beats many higher-priced products from brands that have had years to refine their in-ear offerings, making its performance all the more impressive. The only shortcoming is the cable, which could use better strain relief and tends to be noisy when the earphones are worn cord-down, but it’s a small caveat on what is undoubtedly one of the best-performing earphones in its class.

*Pros: Excellent sound quality; small & comfortable design*
*Cons: Cable is noisy when worn straight down*


*(3A84) **Fidue A63*


Reviewed March 2014

 Details: One of the first IEM releases from China-based Fidue
 MSRP: est. $65 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$60* from amazon.com; $59 from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _18-21k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges, MEElec M6 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips; soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The A63 features aluminum shells and cabling identical to my older ViSang and Brainwavz earphones – internally braided and covered in a smooth, glossy sheath. It’s a little stiff and lacks a cable cinch but in my experience these cables tend to be quite durable. I also like the soft strain reliefs where the cables enter the housings, as well as on the aluminum I-plug and y-split. A raised dot on the right strain relief makes the earpieces easy to tell apart in the dark
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Isolation is about average for this type of earphone
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Present when worn cable-down; low otherwise
 Comfort *(3/5)* – While the A63 is lightweight and not too large, I did have an issue with the housings – the metal ridges at the rear are quite tall and sharp. The corners hurt after a while unless I either switch to bi-flanges and position the housings farther in the ear, or simply wear them cable-up. Not a deal breaker, but I would have preferred smoother housings nonetheless

Sound* (8.2/10)* – If there was one sound signature I could single out as being unpopular with manufacturers of reasonably-priced in-ears, it would be mid-forward sound. There are a few good earphones with forward mids, but the vast majority of budget in-ears are either bass-focused or v-shaped. A solid mid-forward set is a rarity, which is why I was intrigued by the Fidue A63 from the start.

The A63 is a punchy earphone, but not downright bass-heavy, and presents a mild mid-bass “hump”. On the whole it has less bass, especially deep bass, compared to the popular Sony MH1C, but bass control is similar between them due to the more midbass-oriented nature of the A63. Next to the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition, however, the low end of the A63 is significantly tighter and cleaner. That’s not to say that the bass is in any way lacking in quantity – the similarly-priced Astrotec AM-800, another capable dynamic-driver earphone, is rather light on impact compared to the A63.

The Fidue A63 sounds quite clear and impressively detailed through the midrange. The prominent mids provide absolutely fantastic vocal clarity compared to most mid-range IEMs. The Sony MH1C, for example, sounds mid-recessed and has poorer vocal intelligibility next to the stronger midrange of the A63. The rather v-shaped GR02 Bass Edition, likewise, has very recessed mids and misses out on much of the clarity (the GR02 is, generally speaking, the inverse of the A63 in sound signature). Only the brighter-sounding Astrotec AM-800 manages to keep up with the A63 in midrange clarity at the expense of sounding more harsh and sibilance-prone.

At the top, the A63 is pretty smooth and inoffensive. It’s not quite as forgiving and refined as the Sony MH1C, but the Sony is more an exception than the rule. The A63 definitely has an upper hand in treble quality on brighter earphones such as the VSonic GR02 BE and Astrotec AM-800. Maybe it isn’t for fans of energetic, sparkly top ends but I much prefer this approach to treble that brutalizes bad recordings and sensitive ears. The soundstage is as one would expect – the A63 is a spacious earphone that presents a good soundtage without compression or congestion, but the forward mids pretty much guarantee that it won’t sound as out-of-the-head as, say, a VSonic GR07 or Fidue’s higher-end A81 model. That said, for the price there’s certainly nothing wrong with the presentation of the A63.

*Select Comparisons*

VSonic VSD1S ($45)

Like so many of the best-performing budget sets, the VSD1S emphasizes both its bass and treble for a lively, v-shaped sound. It has more bass impact than the A63 and presents a warmer tonal character and more full-bodied sound. The A63 has less bass and more prominent mids, which at times give vocals greater intelligibility compared to the VSonics. The VSD1S is brighter and more sibilant compared to the A63, which has smoother, less prominent treble. Both earphones impress on the soundstage front and are as spacious and well-layered as anything I’ve heard in the price bracket.

SteelSeries Flux ($50)

These two earphones lean only slightly on different sides of “balanced”, with the Flux coming out just a touch v-shaped and the A63 going the opposite way. They have similar bass quantity overall but the Flux boasts better extension and more subbass presence. Its mids, however, are a little recessed while those of the Fidue A63 are prominent. At times, this gives the A63 better vocal clarity and intelligibility. The A63 also places more emphasis on its upper midrange while the Flux is a touch smoother all the way through the treble. As a result, it tends to be a bit more forgiving when it comes to harshness and sibilance. There is also a large difference in efficiency between the two earphones, with the A63 being significantly more sensitive.

MOE-SS01 ($65)

The somewhat v-shaped MOE-SS01 makes for a strong contrast to the mid-forward Fidue A63. The SS01 impresses most with its bass depth, which is superior to the A63, and clarity, which is about on-par with the Fidue set. The A63 has similar bass punch to the SS01 but is more midbass-oriented and warmer in tone. Despite this, its strong mids manage to avoid veiling quite well and maintain good vocal clarity. The SS01 has more upper midrange and treble presence and sounds more harsh and splashy than the relatively smooth A63.

Dunu DN-23 Landmine ($69)

Dunu’s mid-range Landmine model is a warm, bass-heavy earphone that also has good presence in the midrange. Compared to the Fidue A63, the bass of the Landmine is noticeably more powerful, but also more bloated. The low end of the A63 is tighter and cleaner, though perhaps less well-suited for bass lovers. The mids of the Landmine are prominent, but still sound veiled thanks to the plentiful bass. The A63 sounds clearer and more balanced. The two earphones differ less in the treble region, with the DN-23 being only a touch smoother.

Value *(8.5/10)* – The Fidue A63 may be the company’s first mid-range in-ear monitor, but it ticks pretty much all the boxes for sound quality. Solid bass impact and strong midrange presence are complemented by an uncongested soundstage and treble that is neither harsh nor sibilant. I like the construction, as well. The only downside is that the sharp edges of the housings necessitate some fiddling to find a truly comfortable fit, especially for those with small outer ears – a small concession as there are precious few IEMs that can hope to keep up with the A63 in intelligibility, but it takes away slightly from what is otherwise an outstanding design.

*Pros: Excellent sound quality and solid construction*
*Cons: Housings have sharp corners*


*(3A85) T-Peos Tank*


Reviewed March 2014

Details: Entry-level headset from Korea-based T-Peos
 MSRP: est. $40 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: $30 from mp4nation.net; $33 from HiFiNage.com (India only)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2′ L-plug with mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips (1 pair), shirt clip, and velvet drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – True to its name, the Tank feels quite sturdy, with metal housings, narrow flat cables, and a well-relieved L-plug. It also boasts an inline mic with a 1-button remote, but no cable cinch
 Isolation *(3/5)* – On par with other earphones of this type
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Bothersome with cable-down wear; good when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The 8mm driver of the Tank permits a slim and compact design. The earphones can be worn comfortably both cable-down and cable up, though the flat cable can be a bit resistant to over-the-ear wear and the lack of a cable cinch doesn’t help

Sound* (7.7/10)* – The T-Peos Tank is a dynamic-driver earphone with an enhanced-bass sound signature and warm tonal character. It has significantly more bass than the VSonic VSD1, for example, but a bit less than the Sony MH1C, especially in the sub-bass region. Bass quality is good – it is tighter compared to both the less bassy Soundmagic E10 and the more impactful Dunu Landmine.

Its mids manage to avoid veiling quite well, and don’t sound as recessed as those of the Sony MH1C. Clarity is very good, beating out the similarly-priced VSonic GR02 Bass Edition and Soundmagic E10, as well as the pricier but more veiled-sounding Dunu Landmine.

There is a bit of elevation in the treble region, which is shared by the other dynamic-driver T-Peos earphones I’ve tried recently. At times it results in mild harshness and can accentuate sibilance some, but overall the Tank is pretty composed. Tonally, it is darker and warmer than, for example, the Soundmagic E10.

The presentation is good, not great, with only average depth and a bit of congestion. It is less spacious than the Soundmagic E10, for example, and even the Dunu Landmine. The enhanced bass also hurts the imaging a touch compared to T-Peos’ similarly-priced but less bassy Popular model.

*Select Comparisons* 

T-Peos Popular (~$40)

These sibling earphones from T-Peos are cut from the same cloth but have distinctive sound signatures. The Tank is warmer and bassier, while the Popular is brighter and sounds more v-shaped. The greater bass quantity of the Tank makes it a little boomy in comparison while the more neutral Popular model is clearer. The treble of the Tank is a little smoother while the Popular is more harsh and splashy, but also more crisp. The soundstage presentations of the two earphones are extremely similar. Lastly, the Tank also has a bit of driver flex while the Popular seems immune to the phenomenon.

VSonic GR02 Bass Edition ($35)

The GR02 Bass Edition is a v-shaped, enhanced-bass earphone. Overall bass impact is pretty similar between the GR02 and Tank but the latter boasts a slightly tighter low end. Its mids are also less recessed compared to the VSonics and sound warmer and more natural overall. At the top, the Tank is a little smoother while the more v-shaped GR02 has a greater tendency towards sibilance. The GR02 has a wider soundstage, however, and sounds a little more airy.

VSonic VSD1S ($50)

VSonic’s newer budget set, the VSD1S, is a more balanced earphone compared to the GR02 Bass Edition but still maintains a somewhat v-shaped sound signature. Compared to the Tank, its bass is less enhanced and the tone is not as warm. The VSD1S sounds clearer and has a brighter, more energetic top end that makes the Tank seem somewhat dark in comparison. The Tank also appears a bit congested next to the wide and airy soundstage of the VSD1S.

Sony MH1C ($60)

Sony’s MH1C is a warm and smooth-sounding earphone that’s tonally similar to the Tank. It has a bit more subbass presence and less mid-bass bloat than the Tank, but both earphones have plenty of bass. The MH1C sounds more recessed in the midrange but is smoother in the treble region, while the Tank is a little more peaky and energetic at the top. The presentation of the MH1C also has an upper hand.

Value *(8.5/10)* – There aren’t many sub-$50 sets that perform on the level of the new T-Peos Tank, and fewer still also offer headset functionality and a sturdy construction. The signature of the Tank is a bassy one, but it manages to maintain control over its bass and good clarity elsewhere, especially in the midrange. As it is a new release, international pricing hasn’t stabilized quite yet, but anything at or below ~$40 makes the Tank a solid buy.

*Pros: Enhanced-bass sound signature with good clarity; compact and comfortable housings; solid construction*
*Cons: Treble could be smoother; cable can be noisy when worn cord-down*

Thanks to *abhijollyguy** *for the chance to try the T-Peos Tank!

 

*(3A86) T-Peos Popular*
  

Reviewed April 2014

Details: Budget IEM from Korea-based T-Peos similar to their Tank model
 MSRP: est. $40 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: $30 from mp4nation.com; $28 from HiFiNage (India only)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(1.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The construction of the Popular is very similar to T-Peos’ similarly-priced Tank model. It uses metal housings akin to those of the higher-end D200 and H-100 models, narrow flat cables, and a well-relieved L-plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Isolation is on par with other earphones of this type
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Average with cable-down wear; good when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The small dynamic driver permits a compact housing design. The earphones can be worn comfortably both cable-down and cable-up, though the flat cable with no cable cinch can be a bit resistant to over-the-ear wear

Sound *(7.8/10)* – The T-Peos Popular is similar to the Tank in price and construction, and also uses 8mm dynamic drivers, but delivers a more balanced and neutral sound compared to the warmer, bassier Tank. The less dominant low end actually benefits the Popular, allowing the bass quality to go from _great_ to _outstanding_. The earphones are still not bass-light by any stretch – bass impact is only a hair below the VSonic VSD1S, for example, and greater than with the Astrotec AM-800 and the dual-driver MOE-SS01. Despite this, bass control is excellent, resulting one of the best bass quality/quantity ratios I’ve heard among budget earphones.

The Popular has a slightly v-shaped overall signature but its midrange doesn’t appear notably recessed – less so than with the VSD1S and especially the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition, for example. There’s no veiling of the midrange, which helps the Popular also achieve fantastic clarity, nearly on par with the MOE-SS01.

At the top, the Popular has a similar character to the Tank, with a treble peak or two resulting in a sound that is a touch harsher than I would like, especially at higher volumes. This is more noticeable with the Popular than the Tank thanks to its less bassy sound signature. It can accentuate sibilance some as well. In comparison, the MOE-SS01 has a slightly less edgy treble character whereas the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition fares similarly to the T-Peos unit.

The Popular is a little more spacious and images better than the bassier Tank, though it still offers only average soundstage depth and is less spacious than the VSonic VSD1S, for example, or the MOE-SS01.

*Select Comparisons* 

T-Peos Tank (~$40)

These sibling earphones from T-Peos are cut from the same cloth but have distinctive sound signatures. The Tank is warmer and bassier, while the Popular is brighter and sounds more v-shaped. The greater bass quantity of the Tank makes it a little boomy in comparison while the more neutral Popular model is clearer. The treble of the Tank is a little smoother while the Popular is more harsh and splashy, but also more crisp. The soundstage presentations of the two earphones are extremely similar, though the Popular is less congested. Lastly, the Tank also has a bit of driver flex while the Popular seems immune to the phenomenon.

VSonic VSD1S ($50)

VSonic’s VSD1S holds its own against any earphone in the price range, but the T-Peos Popular is remarkably adept at highlighting the its few weaknesses. The VSD1S has a hair more mid-bass presence than the Popular, which give it a warmer tone but also makes its mids sound more recessed and even somewhat veiled. It has a more full-bodied sound while the Popular has an edge in overall clarity but also more presence in the upper midrange and lower treble, which makes it harsher compared to the VSonic unit. The VSD1S is a little more sibilant than the T-Peos and has a wider, more spaced-out presentation.

Astrotec AM-800 ($50)

The AM-800 is a bright, mildly v-shaped earphone that makes a pretty decent signature match for the Popular. It has less bass than the T-Peos unit and sounds a touch more v-shaped courtesy of its brighter treble. The Popular has both greater bass quantity and superior bass depth, with more slam and rumble. The top-end emphasis of the AM-800 seems to enhance its clarity, however, akin to a treble-boost equalizer setting. The Astrotec also has a wider soundstage, sounding more distant, while the Popular is less spacious, but more cohesive.

Fidue A63 ($60)

The A63 is a mid-forward earphone that makes for an interesting contrast to the Popular. Naturally, the mids of the somewhat v-shaped Popular are noticeably recessed in comparison, but the T-Peos also offers less mid-bass, sounding tighter and making the A63 appear somewhat bloated in comparison. The sound of the Popular is brighter, and though its treble is harsher and more splashy, it is a little clearer overall. However, the A63 is warmer more natural from a tonal standpoint, thanks in part to the smoother treble, and has a more spacious and uncongested presentation.

Value *(8.5/10)* – The Popular is my favorite of the three new dynamic-driver sets from T-Peos (the other two being the Tank and Spider models) thanks to its clearer, more neutral sound. The Popular is also a standout in bass quality, and though its treble can be somewhat harsh, overall performance is very impressive for the price. As with the other T-Peos earphones I’ve tried, it boasts a sturdy construction and is comfortable in the ear—there’s really not much more to ask of an IEM priced below $40.

*Pros: Punchy, well-controlled bass and good clarity; compact and comfortable housings; solid construction*
*Cons: Treble could be smoother; cable can be noisy when worn cord-down*

Thanks to *abhijollyguy** *for the chance to try the T-Peos Popular!
  

 

*(3A87) T-Peos D200R*
  

Reviewed August 2014

Details: One of several sub-$50 headset models from Korea-based T-Peos
 MSRP: est. $35
 Current Price: *$35* from mp4nation.net
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4′ L-plug with mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – As with the other T-Peos earphones I’ve tried, the construction of the D200R is well above average, utilizing metal housings and a sturdy cable that’s nylon-sheathed below the y-split and terminated with an angled plug. The D200R boasts an inline mic with a 1-button remote, but no cable cinch
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good, on par with other earphones of this type
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Present with cable-down wear; very good when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The 8mm driver allows a slim and compact housing design and the earphones are not heavy despite the metal construction. Due to the soft and flexible cable, the D200R can be worn very comfortably both cable-down and cable up

Sound* (7.9/10)* – The T-Peos D200R is the latest in a long line of sub-$50 T-Peos earphones I’ve had the pleasure of listening to, the others being the Tank, Popular, Spider, and Rich200. While they all share a familial resemblance in sound signature, the D200R is the most balanced of the lot by a margin – it has the least bass enhancement, the smoothest treble, and the strongest midrange.

The bass of the D200R is still emphasized, however, and the tonal character is on the warm side of neutral. Its bass quantity is lower compared to the other T-Peos earphones but impact is still on par with sets like VSonic’s VSD1S. Bass quality is good – there is just a touch of “boom” compared to the T-Peos Popular and Rich200, both of which impressed me to no end with the quality of their bass, as well as the pricier SteelSeries Flux.

The midrange of the D200R is in good balance with its bass – not forward, like that of the Fidue A63, but not recessed. It is more prominent and full-bodied compared to the other T-Peos earphones I’ve tied, which tend to be more v-shaped. In the case of the D200R, the v-shape is so mild that calling the overall sound “balanced” is hardly a stretch. Clarity is very good, again lagging just behind the Popular, Rich200, and SteelSeries Flux.

There is a small amount of elevation in the treble region, but the D200R is smoother and less treble-heavy than the other T-Peos sets. It’s still not as smooth as the HiFiMan RE-400 or Fidue A63, for example, but its treble presence is excellent in my book – enough to convey the energy of cymbals, but not quite enough to be consistently harsh or sibilant. It teeters right on the edge of what I would call unforgiving, but more often than not stays on the right side of that line.

The presentation is good, with decent depth and better width. Thanks to more balanced sound, the D200R has better imaging and less congestion than the other entry-level T-Peos earphones I’ve tried so far.

*Select Comparisons*

T-Peos Rich200 ($33)

The T-Peos D200R and Rich200 boast similar audio performance but differ in sound signature, with the Rich200 offering up a slightly more v-shaped response. Its bass is a bit more impactful but impresses greatly with its quality – it is very tight and extended. The D200R, on the other hand, boasts more presence in the midrange and has a more full-bodied sound. The mids of the Rich200 are a touch more recessed, but also clearer. Part of the clarity comes from the stronger treble, which also causes it to be somewhat more harsh and sibilance-prone than the D200R.

The similarities in price, form factor, and even feature set make choosing between these two earphones more difficult than it should be, but what it comes down to is this: the Rich200 has better bass while mids are a toss-up – fuller and more forward on the D200R, more recessed but clearer on the Rich200. Treble is better with the D200R and its less v-shaped sound grants it a slightly more natural tone.

NarMoo R1M ($30) (silver ports) 

NarMoo’s entry-level R1M model features interchangeable tuning ports which give it three different sound signatures. The R1M is at its best with the (least bassy) “silver” tuning ports. Even in this configuration, the D200R has slightly less bass quantity but still maintains excellent extension and is capable of very solid punch. The low end of the R1M appears stronger and at times more intrusive while the bass of the D200R is tighter and its midrange is more prominent and clear. However, the T-Peos also tends to sound harsher at times. The R1M is significantly less crisp, but boasts a wider soundstage and more open sound next to the more forward D200R.

Astrotec AM-90 ($44)

The Astrotec AM-90 is one of the most affordable Balanced Armature earphones on the market and a decent enough example of BA sound. Several years ago, a BA earphone would in this price range would have been a no-brainer, but dynamic-driver sets have come a long way, which the D200R illustrates perfectly. As expected, the T-Peos unit boasts significantly more bass than the AM-90 – its low end has greater depth and body, delivering more of both sub-bass rumble and mid-bass impact.

In the midrange, the AM-90 sounds thinner, but surprisingly not any clearer than the D200R. The D200R also boasts greater treble energy while the AM-90 is smoother and more forgiving. Personally, I find the D200R’s greater treble presence to be more realistic. It is also the more dynamic and engaging of the two earphones and images better, making the AM-90 sound a little too flat and forward in comparison.

VSonic VSD1S ($50)

VSonic’s VSD1S is more v-shaped in response than the T-Peos D200R. Its bass is similar in impact to the T-Peos but a bit tighter, and its midrange is more recessed and a little clearer, more like that of the T-Peos Rich200. The D200R has more midrange presence and sounds thicker and more full-bodied than the VSD1S. It is also smoother up top, though still far from forgiving. The VSD1S can be a touch more sibilant at times. Both earphones are quite capable on the presentation front, but the VSonic unit is a bit more spacious.

T-Peos H-100 ($120)

T-Peos’ higher-end H-100 model is a hybrid earphone – that is, it uses a combination of dynamic and balanced armature drivers, in this case one of each. Despite the H-100 having a dynamic driver dedicated to producing bass, the D200R is bassier. It offers up more impact, but its bass sounds boomy in comparison to the tight low end of the H-100. It seems that the woofer of the H-100 is tuned for quality over quantity.

Thanks to the boomier bass, the D200R also sounds muddier in the midrange. The mids of the H-100 are significantly clearer and more detailed, but also somewhat thin-sounding and a little withdrawn. The tone of the D200R is warmer, whereas the H-100 is fairly bright. The more crisp and energetic treble of the H-100 is also less tolerant of sibilance, though not as much so as one may expect from such a bright earphone. Thanks to its more recessed mids, the H-100 has a wider, somewhat more distant sound whereas the D200R is more forward.

Value *(9.5/10)* – As far as reasonably-priced earphones go, the T-Peos D200R has a lot going for it – sturdy build, headset functionality, and a sonic signature that makes all the right concessions. It might not have the tightest bass or clearest sound, but it avoids recessed mids and is smoother up top compared to its siblings. Its round cables make it easier to wear over-the-ear compared to the flat-cabled T-Peos sets, and it is less microphonic. For all these reasons, the D200R gets our “Recommended” badge.

*Pros: Good bass and excellent all-around performance; compact and comfortable housings; solid construction
 Cons: Bass quality not quite as impressive as with the T-Peos Rich200*

Thanks to *abhijollyguy** *for the chance to try the T-Peos D200R!

 

*(3A88)** NarMoo S1*
  

Reviewed Sep 2014

Details: NarMoo’s second release and one of the most reasonably-priced dual-dynamic earphones on the market
 MSRP: $89.99 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$40* from amazon.com; *$36* from NarMoo.com with coupon code “THL”
 Specs: Driver: _Dual Dynamic (10 + 6mm) _| Imp: _10Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _5-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec “balanced” bi-flanges, stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and oversize zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The shells of the S1 are aluminum, with build quality as good as any in the price segment. The strain reliefs are soft and flexible, protecting a glossy, internally-braided cable. This type of cable can lose some of its flexibility with time and exposure to sweat, but otherwise tends to be very reliable. As with the lower-end R1M model, mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Quite noticeable when worn cable-down; can be improved with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – As with NarMoo’s R1M model, the housings of the S1 are on the large side, but light enough to still be comfortable. With its conventional cable and soft strain reliefs, the S1 is easier to wear over-the-ear than the R1M

Sound* (7.7/10)* – While NarMoo’s entry-level R1M model features three different sound tunings, the dual dynamic driver S1 only has one configuration – enhanced bass. The 10mm woofers produce large amounts of both mid-bass and subbass – enough to satisfy even die-hard bassheads. Even when compared to other bass-heavy earphones such as the Sony MH1C and Nuforce NE-700X, the S1 sounds bassier, though also more boomy. Bass extension is excellent, but the mid-bass steals the show most of the time (the double-flange eartips I ended up using help a little in keeping it under control). As a result, earphones with similar low end power but less mid-bass – the RHA MA750 and Sony MH1C, for example – appear to have more prominent sub-bass than the S1.

The powerful low end gives the S1 a warm and rich tonal character. The midrange, surprisingly, is not significantly recessed and not at all thin-sounding. In comparison, the Nuforce NE-700X is less warm in tone and more mid-recessed. The low end of the S1 can be intrusive and sometimes bleeds into the midrange, reducing clarity. NarMoo’s entry-level R1M model, for instance, has better clarity when used on its less bassy settings, as do the pricier Nuforce NE-700X and Sony MH1C. However, the S1 is clearer and more natural in both tone and note thickness than the similarly-priced RHA MA350.

Strictly speaking, the S1 is a v-shaped earphone with more bass and treble than midrange. However, its top end doesn’t sound bright and remains smooth, especially at low-to-moderate volumes. Some harshness can be coaxed out at high volumes, but the S1 is still best characterized as a smooth earphone. The presentation, likewise, is capable and uncongested, especially considering how much bass the S1 has. Overall, it performs very well, sounding more spacious and three-dimensional than the pricier Nuforce NE-700X.

*Select Comparisons*

NarMoo R1M (black ports) ($25)

NarMoo’s first earphone, the R1M features a sound adjustment system with three pairs of interchangeable tuning ports. These ports most strongly affect the bass quantity of the earphones. The R1M matches the bass of the S1 most closely with its bassiest tuning (black ports). In this configuration, the R1M has bass quality comparable to the S1, though bass depth still seems just a hair better with the dual-driver model. The mids of the S1 are not as recessed, sounding more natural and maintaining clarity much better when the bass attempts to intrude. The S1 is a little brighter than the R1M, which has less treble presence and crispness. In the more balanced gunmetal and silver configurations, the R1M has a more neutral sound than the S1, with much less bass and a thinner note presentation.

Tekfusion Twinwoofers ($50)

Tekfusion’s Twinwoofers are among the bassiest earphones I’ve tried this year, but arguably go a step too far in the direction of warm and smooth sound compared to the S1. The Twinwoofers have a darker tonal character and sound a bit less clear in the midrange. Their bass is comparable in quantity to that of the S1 but seems more powerful still thanks to the more laid-back treble. The Twinfoors have a smoother top end while the S1 is brighter and thinner, but in a good way, delivering more detail and better clarity.

Brainwavz S1 ($60)

The identically-titled Brainwavz model is, like the NarMoo S1, a bass-heavy earphone. What’s surprising is just how similar these earphones sound – through the bass and lower midrange, the S1 matches the S1 almost note for note. The NarMoo unit is a hair bassier and bleeds slightly more up into the midrange as a result, but the difference is small. The NarMoo S1 does sound warmer overall and has a thicker, more full-bodied sound. The Brainwavz S1 has a thinner midrange with a brighter tonal tilt. It sounds clearer and has more treble sparkle than the NarMoo S1. However, its treble tends to be more sharp and sibilant, especially at higher volumes compared to the smoother, more laid-back highs of the NarMoo.

RHA MA600 ($80)

Another enhanced-bass option, the MA600 from RHA was downright disappointing in this comparison. The significantly more expensive MA600 has slightly tighter mid-bass with similar depth. However, its bass still gets in the way of its mids, which are thinner and more recessed compared to those of the NarMoo S1. The S1 has more full-bodied, more prominent, less veiled mids. Its warmer tone doesn’t stop it from matching the clarity of the MA600, which has more upper midrange presence, brighter tone, and thinner sound. The treble of the MA600 is also grainier compared to the smoother S1, and the presentation is not as spacious.

Value *(8.5/10)* – The NarMoo S1 is a dual dynamic driver earphone with a powerful, smooth, likable sound signature. While bass control and clarity are limited by the bass quantity, both still impress in comparison to other sets with similar tuning. The housings are on the large side, but very solidly built and comfortable except in small ears. Combined with a sub-$50 price tag, this makes the S1 an easy recommendation among bass-heavy IEMs.

*Pros: Bass-heavy sound with surprisingly robust midrange and smooth treble*
*Cons: Some bass bloat/boom; mild driver flex *

 

*(3A89)** Brainwavz S1*
  

Reviewed August 2014

Details: Flat-cable enhanced-bass earphone from Brainwavz
 MSRP: $79.50 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$60* from mp4nation.net; *$60* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _93 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock gray single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Black single-flange (3 sizes), double-flange, and triple-flange silicone tips, gray single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply S400 foam tips, airline adapter, and sturdy zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The S1 is well-made, with metal housings and almost comically chunky strain reliefs protecting its flat cable. The cable is rather long at ~4.3ft but resists tangling very well. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Good, especially with deeper-sealing tips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Surprisingly decent for a flat-cable earphone; noticeable when worn cable-down but improved with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The S1 uses a fairly conventional angled-nozzle housing design, which keeps its large housings more flush in the ear when worn cable-up. What’s unconventional is the angled strain relief, which makes it easier to route the flat cable over-the-ear. It still works cable-down, too, and I actually managed a more secure fit that way

Sound* (7.8/10)* – Brainwavz has produced a lot of great earphones over the years, from the original M1 model, which remains one of my top recommendations in its class, to the reference-grade (yet very inexpensive) B2. The unifying factor is good performance for the price, and that’s the case with the S1 as well.

The S1 is a bass-heavy earphone with a v-shaped sound signature. The bass is powerful and extended, with a good balance of mid-bass impact and sub-bass depth. The low end is not the most controlled, but it is less muddy compared to most other in-ears that are similarly well-endowed when it comes to bass.

Despite its v-shaped balance, the midrange of the S1 doesn’t sound heavily recessed, partly due to the fullness of the sound and partly because of the prominent upper mids. Strong upper midrange presence also helps with the clarity, reducing the effect of the powerful low end occasionally intruding on the lower mids. Ultimately, this gives the S1 good vocal intelligibility and better clarity compared to other sets with similar bass quantity such as the NarMoo S1 and Tekfusion Twinwoofers.

The strong top end of the Brainwavz does come with some caveats – the earphone sounds a little peaky and has a tendency towards harshness and sibilance. Far from a deal breaker – in fact, the sibilance is in good company with the likes of the popular – and much more expensive – VSonic GR07 in the way it is presented. Also, while the S1 has plenty of treble energy, its tone is not particularly bright thanks to the heavy bass. Similarly, the energetic top end is a tolerable – even beneficial – as a way of counterbalancing the bass, especially at low-to-medium volumes.

On the point of volume, the S1 has above-average sensitivity despite the rather low stated figure. Its overall tonality is hard to characterize – the energetic treble prevents the earphones from sounding particularly warm, but they also don’t sound bright because of the strong bass. To provide some comparisons, the MOE-SS01, a similarly-priced dual-dynamic earphone, sounds colder (and harsher) next to the Brainwavz S1 thanks to its flatter, even more upper midrange-heavy sound. The T-Peos Rich200, on the other hand, is downright brighter – its signature is v-shaped, but biased less towards the low end than that of the S1. The SS01 is more spacious than the S1, whereas the Rich200 has a smaller, more in-the-head presentation.

*Select Comparisons*

NarMoo S1 ($40)

The identically-titled NarMoo model is, like the Brainwavz S1, a bass-heavy earphone. What’s surprising is just how similar these earphones sound – through the bass and lower midrange, the S1 matches the S1 almost note for note. The NarMoo unit is a hair bassier and bleeds more up into the midrange as a result, but the difference is small. The NarMoo S1 sounds warmer overall and has a thicker sound. The Brainwavz S1 has a thinner midrange with a brighter tonal tilt. It sounds clearer and has more treble sparkle than the NarMoo S1. However, its treble tends to be more sharp and sibilant, especially at higher volumes, compared to the more laid-back highs of the NarMoo.

VSonic VSD1S ($50)

The VSD1S follows the sound signature of VSonic’s higher-end models, delivering a mildly v-shaped sound with punchy bass. Brainwavz’ similarly-priced S1 model is more powerful at the low end, offering up more of both impact and depth. The bass of the S1 tends to be a little more intrusive. However, despite its tighter, less powerful bass, the VSD1S still sounds a little more distant and veiled in the midrange. The S1 has more presence in the upper midrange and lower treble, which makes its mids sound more clear, crisp, and intelligible.

The VSD1S has less upper midrange emphasis than the S1, sounding smoother overall up until the mid-upper treble, where a couple of narrow peaks make the VSD1S somewhat sibilant. The S1 is similarly unforgiving of sibilants and offers up even more treble energy overall. From a tonal standpoint, the VSD1S is more neutral and accurate. Worth noting is that the bassier, livelier S1 is more sensitive than the VSD1 and will definitely have more of a “wow” factor for casual listeners than the flatter VSonic unit.

Brainwavz R3 ($130)

The R3 is a dual-dynamic monitor with a balanced and refined sound, serving a very different purpose than the S1. The S1 provides an upgrade to popular mainstream sets such as the Klipsch S4 and Beats by Dre Tour while the R3 channels the signatures of higher-end earphones such as the $500 Shure SE535 and $250 Sony MDR-7550. It is flatter and more neutral than the S1, with tighter bass and more refinement all around. The S1 has heavier bass, but also sounds more bloated and a little dark in tone. The treble of the S1 is peaky in comparison, making it sound harsher and more metallic next to the smooth and natural R3. However, the clarity of the S1 is on-par with the pricier R3, likely due to the stronger treble. Indeed, the R3 can sound a little dull and smoothed-over up top at times. The S1 is also a touch more coherent, while the pricier R3 has a wider, more spaced-out presentation.

Value *(8/10)* – The Brainwavz S1 combines plentiful bass and strong treble to deliver a lively, engaging sound with a popular v-shaped sound signature. Its tuning is like an improved version of the best-selling Klipsch S4, for not much more money. Sure, it could stand to be smoother and the bass can get intrusive at times, but with a price tag well south of $100, good build quality, and a housing design that’s surprisingly comfortable when worn cable-down, the S1 is a good buy.

*Pros: tangle-resistant cable, strong bass*
*Cons: over-ear wear not easy for those with small ears*

 

*(3A90) T-Peos Rich200*


Reviewed Sep 2014

Details: Entry-level headset from Korea-based T-Peos

MSRP: est. $35 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$33* from mp4nation.net
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2′ L-plug with mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; MEElec M6 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(1.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The Rich200 is built similarly to T-Peos’ other earphones, with metal housings, narrow flat cables, and a well-relieved low-profile L-plug. It also has an inline mic with a 1-button remote, but no cable cinch
 Isolation *(3/5)* – On par with other earphones of this type
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Average with cable-down wear; good when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The 8mm driver permits a slim and compact design. The earphones can be worn comfortably both cable-down and cable up, though the flat cable can be a bit resistant to over-the-ear wear and the lack of a cable cinch doesn’t help

Sound* (7.9/10)* – The Rich200 is yet another budget set from T-Peos, sister earphone to the Tank, Popular, and D200R models that I’ve already reviewed. It is priced similarly to the others but – in some ways, at least – is the best of the bunch. It sounds tighter and clearer than the slightly bassier Tank, smoother than the Popular, and more controlled at the low end (but also more mid-recessed) than the D200R.

The most impressive thing about the Rich200 is the bass – the earphones have an outstanding balance of bass quality vs. quantity, perhaps the best I’ve ever encountered with a budget earphone. The low end is punchy and extended, but also very controlled.

The second most impressive characteristic of the Rich200 is its clarity. The overall sound signature is a touch v-shaped but the bass quality allows the midrange to avoid veiling. Clarity lags just a touch behind the more mid-recessed VSonic VSD1S and the colder, brighter-sounding MOE-SS01, both of which are pricier than the Rich200.

There is some treble elevation, similar to what I’ve encountered with the other T-Peos sets I have tried. At times it results in mild harshness and can accentuate sibilance some, but overall the Rich200 is rather composed. The MOE-SS01, for example, has more upper midrange/treble presence than the Rich200, and the VSonic VSD1S sounds more sibilant. Soundstaging is, as with other entry-level T-Peos earphones, nothing to write home about. The presentation has average depth and width. Imaging is pretty good thanks to the clarity but there’s just not much sonic space for the earphones to play with.

*Select Comparisons* 

T-Peos D200R ($35) 

The T-Peos D200R and Rich200 boast similar audio performance but differ in sound signature, with the Rich200 offering up a slightly more v-shaped response. Its bass is a bit more impactful but impresses greatly with its quality – it is very tight and extended. The D200R, on the other hand, boasts more presence in the midrange and has a more full-bodied sound. The mids of the Rich200 are a touch more recessed, but also clearer. Part of the clarity comes from the stronger treble, which also causes it to be somewhat more harsh and sibilance-prone than the D200R.

The similarities in price, form factor, and even feature set make choosing between these two earphones more difficult than it should be, but what it comes down to is this: the Rich200 has better bass while mids are a toss-up – fuller and more forward on the D200R, more recessed but clearer on the Rich200. Treble is better with the D200R and its less v-shaped sound grants it a slightly more natural tone.

Xiaomi Piston 2 ($25)

The Xiaomi Piston 2 is warm and bassy, but nonetheless a very capable earphone priced similarly to the Rich200, making for a worthwhile comparison. In short, the Rich200 has an advantage in bass quality (but not quantity) and clarity, but loses out in treble quality and soundstaging.

Compared to the Piston 2, the bass quality of the Rich200 is significantly better – it is less mid-bassy, resulting in an overall tighter and cleaner sound, but still has similarly good depth. The Rich200 is also clearer – but thinner-sounding – compared to the warmer and more full-bodied Piston 2. The Piston 2 is smoother and more forgiving up top, however, making the Rich200 sound harsh in comparison. It also has a wider, more spacious, more out-of-the-head presentation.

Astrotec AM-800 ($40)

Astrotec’s dynamic-driver AM-800 boasts a clear, slightly v-shaped sound, but deviates quite a bit from the listening experience provided by the T-Peos Rich200. The AM-800 is notable for its wide, open, and airy sound, and that’s where it differs most from the T-Peos unit – the AM-800 sounds like an open-back headphone, while the Rich200 sounds like a sealed one, both in presentation and bass impact. The bass of the Rich200 is more authoritative –deeper and punchier, whereas the AM-800 lacks depth and sounds lighter and less weighty.

Tonally, the Rich200 is warmer while the AM-800 is brighter, lending a more treble-heavy tilt to its v-shaped signature. This results in the Astrotec unit appearing a bit clearer, but the difference is minute. In addition, while the Rich200 has greater bass quantity, the quality of its low end doesn’t suffer – it is just as tight as the AM-800. The presentation of the T-Peos is smaller, more closed-in, and more in-the-head, however.

Brainwavz S1 ($60)

Brainwavz’ S1 model is yet another v-shaped in-ear earphone, this one with an unabashedly bass-heavy sound signature. It pumps out significantly more bass than the Rich200, but sounds boomier as well. Its bass tends to be more intrusive, resulting in more veiled mids in comparison to the tight and controlled T-Peos unit. The tone of the S1 is warmer and it sounds more full-bodied overall while the Rich200 sounds thinner, but also clearer. The Rich200 is brighter, thanks mostly to having much less bass than the S1, but still a touch smoother. One area where the S1 does win is presentation – while it doesn’t image much better than the Rich200, it sounds more spacious and unconstrained. It is also more efficient.

Value *(9/10)* – With its comfortable form factor, sturdy construction, and headset functionality, the T-Peos Rich200 offers excellent practicality and matching audio performance. Its sound is notable for clean, impactful, extended bass and good clarity, though those with different priorities may prefer its sister model, the D200R. For under $35, the Rich200 is an easy recommendation.

*Pros: Great bass quality and clarity; compact and comfortable housings; solid construction*
*Cons: Cable can be noisy when worn cord-down*

 

*(3A91) **Tekfusion Twinwoofers*
  

 Reviewed October 2014

Details: Enhanced-bass earphone from India-based Tekfusion
 MSRP: $49.99 for Twinwoofers; $69.99 for Twinwoofers M with mic & 1-button remote
 Current Price: *$50* from amazon.com for Twinwoofers; *$70 *from amazon.com for Twinwoofers M
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _113 dB_ | Freq: _19-21k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and triple-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, shirt clip, and velvet spring-clasp carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The construction of the Twinwoofers is par for the course, with sturdy-feeling metal housings coupled to a pretty conventional cable. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Above average for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Moderate when worn cable-down; very good otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The Twinwoofers look bulkier than they really are. The housings are long, but relatively slim and not too heavy. They are just a touch bigger than similarly-priced T-Peos models such as the D200R and Popular, and I’ve always thought those very comfortable

Sound* (7.2/10)* – Tekfusion’s Twinwoofers are bass-heavy in-ears with a warm and rich tonal character. The deep bass is strong, but outpaced still by the mid-bass hump of the Twinwoofers, which results in well above-average impact. Compared, for example, to Nuforce’s bass-heavy NE-700X model, the Twinwoofers have more mid-bass presence and as a result sound “bassier” in the conventional sense. The side effect of the mid-bass boost is, of course, some bass bloat, with sets such as the NE-700X and the pricier Brainwavz S1 sounding less boomy in comparison.

Possibly the greatest asset of the Twinwoofers is the midrange, which is quite strong for an earphone with so much low end presence. IEMs with the bass power of the Twinwoofers, especially at this price point, tend to have more recessed mids. Here, however, the prominent midrange keeps the sound natural and cohesive. For instance, the mids are warmer and more natural compared to the Nuforce NE-700X and NE-600X, with the Twinwoofers sounding a little more balanced and less mid-recessed. Also, while the clarity of the more v-shaped Nuforce units is technically greater, vocal intelligibility was better with the more forward Twinwoofers, except on tracks with very prominent bass.

The Twinwoofers are quite smooth up through the treble, again benefitting from their sound being less v-shaped than much of the competition. The earphones do an excellent job of avoiding harshness and sibilance. There’s not a whole lot of energy here, but it’s doubtful purchasers of mid-range basshead earphones will mind. The presentation could be more open as well, but it is quite uncongested considering the bass power of the Twinwoofers, reminding me of NarMoo’s dual-driver S1 model.

*Select Comparisons*

Fidue A31s ($30)

Fidue’s tiny A31s headset is comfortable and inexpensive, but not very good-sounding. While definitely bass-heavy, it has nowhere near the same amount of depth and impact as the Tekfusion Twinwoofers. The bass of the Twinwoofers is a touch more boomy, but not proportionally so considering the greater bass quantity. The midrange of the Twinwoofers is more forward and a little clearer despite its greater bass quantity. The A31s is muddier, and while its treble is smoother, the lack of clarity is just too great to get past.

JVC HA-FR301 ($40)

The flagship of JVC’s enhanced-bass “Xtreme Xplosives” line has one of the most v-shaped sound profiles I’ve ever encountered, with greatly boosted bass and treble. It is actually bassier than the Twinwoofers but lacks the fullness and smoothness of the Tekfusion. The midrange of the FR301 is much more recessed, though also a bit clearer, and its top end is way harsher, making its sound less natural tonally. The Twinwoofers do sound a little muddy in comparison to the FR301, but on the whole I found them more natural.

NarMoo S1 ($40)

While the NarMoo S1 is no slouch, Tekfusion’s Twinwoofers are among the bassiest earphones I’ve tried this year, providing an even warmer and smoother sound. The Twinwoofers have a darker tonal character and sound a bit less clear. Their bass is comparable in quantity to that of the S1 but seems more powerful still thanks to the more laid-back treble. The Tekfusion unit also has a smoother top end, while the S1 is brighter and thinner, delivering a bit more detail and slightly better clarity as a result.

Signature Acoustics Elements C-12 ($50)

As the only product I have from the only other India-based IEM manufacturer I know, the Signature Acoustics Elements C-12 made for a logical comparison with the Twinwoofers. The two are actually quite close in performance, with similar bass impact but with the Twinwoofers boasting a slightly less mid-recessed, more balanced sound. The midrange of the Tekfusion sounds warmer and more natural, whereas the C-12 is a little more mid-recessed. The C-12 is more v-shaped as well, and while the extra top-end energy makes it sound slightly harsher, it also gives the C-12 a more neutral tone and at times permits it to sound clearer/less muddy in the midrange.

Value *(7.5/10)* – The Tekfusion Twinwoofers are competent bass-heavy earphones that suffer from a spot of bass bloat but still offer up good midrange presence and a smooth, inoffensive top end. The large-ish housings are more comfortable than they look, too, and deliver above-average noise isolation. In the US market, the Twinwoofers are faced with stiff competition, but much of the low pricing that we enjoy here simply isn’t available overseas, making the Twinwoofers an even stronger proposition.

*Pros: Basshead sound with good mids; good noise isolation*
*Cons: Some bass bloat; mild driver flex*
  

 

*(3A92) JVC Xtreme Xplosives HA-FR301*
  

 Reviewed March 2014

Details: Flagship of JVC’s Xtreme Xplosives line of bass-heavy in-ear earphones

MSRP: $39.95
 Current Price: *$40* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _5-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug with mic & 1-button remote and CTIA/OMTP switch_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T400,_ _Stock single-flanges; generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and plastic carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The HA-FR301 is built like the other Xtreme Xplosives models and features plastic housings with rubber bumpers, paper nozzle filters, and the usual PVC cable. The cord lacks a sliding cinch and terminates with a well-relieved I-plug. A 1-button remote with mic is positioned at the y-split. On the back of the remote is a switch that toggles between the two common headset wiring configurations – CTIA and OMTP – which differ in where the microphone and ground leads are on the plug. A few other IEMs do this with adapter cables, but a switch is a much neater solution. There aren’t many OMTP phones in the US these days, but this feature does add flexibility for users of some older and/or imported devices
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics *(5/5) *– Pretty much nonexistent
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The fit is similar to the other XX models – the tubby housings with their rubber bumpers may be a little large for over-the-ear fitment in smaller ears but cord-down wear is very comfortable thanks to the steeply angled nozzles

Sound* (6.8/10)* – JVC’s Xtreme Xplosives line has always been known for abundant bass, and the HA-FR301 model is no exception – it is the bassiest earphone I’ve heard all year and follows a very pronounced “v-shaped” sound signature with powerful lows and highs.

A prominent mid-bass hump gives the FR301 its enormous impact, which easily beat all of the sets I compared it to, from the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition to the Nuforce NE-700X, in quantity. Extension is great, too, though the sub-bass is not the focus here.

As is usually the case with earphones that have emphasized mid-bass, the low end of the FR301 sounds somewhat boomy. However, the midrange is not thick, which helps the earphones maintain excellent clarity. That’s not to say the mids aren’t noticeably recessed – they are – but thanks to a relatively lean note presentation and plenty of presence in the upper midrange and lower treble, clarity is pretty good, lagging just behind the more balanced VSonic GR02 BE and beating sets such as the Nuforce NE-700X and Fidue A31s. The bass does still bleed up, but not as much as can be expected give the sheer amount present.

The FR301 is a v-shaped earphone, and like many it can sound pretty harsh up top. This is especially noticeable on cymbal hits, which tend to be overly energetic and quite splashy. Sibilance, however, is not bad at all – better than with the VSonic GR02 BE, for instance. The presentation, likewise, can get a touch congested when the heavy bass steps in but is otherwise quite well-rounded. The v-shaped sound sig is an advantage here and keeps the soundstage size above average, whereas bass-heavy earphones with prominent mids and laid-back treble tend to sound more thick and congested.

*Select Comparisons*

_Note: I could have included more head-to-head comparisons but they all came out pretty much the same – compared to the other sub-$50 bass-heavy earphones in my collection, which tend to be either full-bodied and smooth or v-shaped with a low end bias, the FR301 invariably sounds bassier, clearer but more recessed in the midrange, and harsher up top. _

Tekfusion Twinwoofers ($50)

The Twinwoofers are bass-heavy but rather smooth-sounding earphones – a contrast to the significantly v-shaped JVC HA-FR301. In comparison to the Twinwoofers, the low end of the JVCs is more powerful, the mids are much more recessed and not as full-bodied, though also clearer, and the top end is harsher. The warm and smooth Twinwoofers are perhaps more natural tonally, but also quite muddy-sounding in comparison. Overall they are two very different takes on bass-heavy sound; which is better really depends on what the bigger dealbreaker is - lack of clarity or harsh highs.

Brainwavz S1 ($60)

Brainwavz’ S1 model is similar to the FR301 in the general sense of being v-shaped and bass-heavy, but the greater mid-bass power of the FR301 affects its overall sound quite a bit. The S1 is very capable of producing deep, powerful bass but still falls significantly short of the FR301 in sheer slam. The low end of the S1 is tighter, as expected considering the quantity difference. The mids are a little more detailed and nuanced with less bass to get in the way, and the top end is not as harsh as that of the FR301.

Beats by Dre Tour 2.0 ($150)

The latest version of the Beats by Dre Tour is not exactly a top performer in its price bracket, but the warm and smooth sound holds its own against other basshead earphones. Indeed, the Tour 2.0 was probably the closest to the JVC HA-FR301 in bass quantity out of everything I tried. The FR301 is still a touch more impactful, and overall more v-shaped with significantly brighter treble. It sounds harsher, but also quite a bit clearer than the somewhat muffled Beats.

I found that both sound best with music that relies on bass and is sparsely instrumental, such as Hip-Hop and EDM. This tends to mask the shortcomings with the clarity of the Beats, the harsh treble and recessed mids of the FR301, and the overpowering bass of both. With complex tracks the smoother sound of the Tour 2.0 pulls ahead slightly.

Value *(8/10)* – The JVC Xtreme Xplosives HA-FR301 is an earphone for bassheads, pure and simple. Its v-shaped sound signature keeps muddiness to a minimum and maintains impressive clarity for such a bassy earphone, though it is not without drawbacks. Still, considering the solid build quality, amazingly quiet cable, and remote with a universal smartphone switch, I expect I’ll be recommending these often to bass lovers all over the world.

*Pros: Cable has no microphonics; comfortable fit; extremely heavy bass; dual-mode remote compatible with all smartphones*
*Cons: Extremely heavy bass; sharp highs*

 

*(3A93) Brainwavz S0*
  

Reviewed May 2015

Brief: New entry-level IEM model in Brainwavz’ S series

MSRP: $49.50 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$45 *from amazon.com; $50 from mp4nation.net
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _18-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2′ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Hybrid-style single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Standard single-flange (3 pairs), hybrid-style single-flange (3 pairs), double-flange, and triple-flange silicone tips; Comply S400 foam tips; and sturdy zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The S0 is well-made, with metal housings and sizable strain reliefs protecting its tangle-resistant flat cable. The y-split is less bulky than on the higher-end S1 and S5 models, but doesn’t seem any less protective
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average, but more than sufficient for day-to-day use
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; improved with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The S0 uses a conventional straight-nozzle design and has average-sized, lightweight housings. Despite the flat cable, it can still be worn cable-up comfortably

Sound* (7.5/10)* – Slotted below the S1 and S5 models in the company’s extensive IEM lineup, the Brainwavz S0 is a mid-range earphone with a mildly v-shaped sound signature. The bass is boosted, but by a more moderate amount compared to the Brainwavz S1 and S5, both of which pack greater bass impact and depth. The S0 has more reasonable bass quantity, which allows it to maintain pretty good quality. For instance, it is neither as bassy nor as boomy as the pricier UBSOUND Fighter or the Nuforce NE-600X (one of my top picks among entry-level bass-heavy IEMs).

Bass depth is good, too – much better than with the similarly-priced Brainwavz M1. There is a bit more mid- and upper bass than I would like, however, which doesn’t do the performance any favors – it doesn’t create a ton of impact, yet affects clarity in the midrange. The S0 is still not as warm and muffled as the UBSOUND Fighter and its midrange tends to be clearer and more detailed compared to both the Fighter and Nuforce NE-600X. However, the clarity difference is smaller than may be expected considering how much bassier the Nuforce unit is. Clarity ends up being similar to the older Brainwavz M1, a smoother, darker, more mid-centric earphone, and doesn’t quite keep up with the brighter, more v-shaped S1 and S5 models.

At the top, the balance of the S0 again falls between the more v-shaped S1 and S5, and the smoother M1. The S1 and S5 are both brighter and slightly less forgiving, but the highs of the S0 are still a little sharp and metallic despite not being overly bright. On the whole, treble quality is similar to the Nuforce NE-600X – both have some treble edginess, and just which earphone is smoother varies from track to track.

The presentation of the S0 is quite capable – a good-sized soundstage that’s well-rounded in terms of width and depth. Separation is good as far as the clarity allows – the M1 model, for example, lacks the soundstaging prowess of the S0 thanks to its more mid-forward tuning, which makes its presentation seem a little compressed in comparison. The Brainwavz S5, on the other hand, is significantly more dynamic, with its deeper bass and more extended treble, and has superior depth and imaging as a result.

*Select comparisons*

T-Peos Popular ($30)

The strengths of the Popular – as well as T-Peos’ numerous other entry-level earphones – are clarity and bass control. On both counts it is ahead of the Brainwavz S0, which is tuned for a warmer and more bass-heavy sound. The Popular is more balanced on the whole, largely thanks to its tighter, less emphasized low end. The Popular lacks the mid-bass boost of the S0, which in turn makes its deep bass seem a little more prominent. Its sound is thinner overall, however, and the brighter treble is more prone to harshness and sibilance than that of the Brainwavz.

Brainwavz S1 ($55)

The S1 is the next model up from the S0 in Brainwavz’ lineup. In this case, the lower-end earphone sounds more balanced while the pricier S1 suffers from more recessed mids and stronger, harsher treble. The S1 has noticeably more bass depth and impact and a more v-shaped sound signature with sharper treble and more withdrawn, less full-bodied mids.

At first glance it seems that the S0 should be the more Hi-Fi earphone of the two – it has lower overall bass quantity, less midrange recession, and smoother highs. However, the S0 also has a more audible mid-bass hump, which negates all benefits of a less bass-heavy sound signature and results in slightly boomier bass and mids that are more veiled compared to the S1, making the higher-end model preferable, at least to me.

Rock Jaw Alfa Genus (balanced setting) ($70)

The Alfa Genus is a variable-sound earphone with three sets of interchangeable nozzle filters supplying the different sound tunings. I chose the more balanced-sounding “gold” filters for this comparison, as the bass-heavy black filters are similar in sound to the Brainwavz S1.

With the gold nozzles in place, the Alfa Genus sounds flatter and more balanced than the slightly v-shaped S0. The Brainwavz’ mid-bass boost is very noticeable, making it sound bassier and boomier in comparison. However, even without the extra bass, the Alfa Genus doesn’t sound thin or lacking in body in comparison. It is clearer and smoother, though, while the S0 is more veiled through the midrange and harsher up top.

Value *(8/10)* – The entry-level model in Brainwavz “S” series, the S0 is a more balanced-sounding alternative to the slightly pricier S1 model. Like the S1, it boasts metal housings and flat cables, but with a more conventional form factor that should be friendlier towards first-time IEM users. The dynamic drivers deliver a mildly v-shaped sound signature with ample bass, treble that’s neither too bright nor too dull, and a well-rounded presentation. With that said, for those who don’t mind a more v-shaped sound signature I’d recommend making the jump to the higher-end S1 model for only a couple more bucks.

*Pros: Nice carrying case and eartip selection; solid construction*
*Cons: Some microphonics when worn cable-down; not quite as clear as the higher-end Brainwavz models*

 

*(3A94) **Zipbuds PRO*
  

Added August 2015

Brief: Tangle-resistant IEMs with a built-in “zipper” in place of a conventional cable cinch

MSRP: $39.99
 Current Price: *$35* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _99 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug w_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(2/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and built-in “zipper” cable cinch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The housings of the Zipbuds PRO are plastic – well-made, but nothing out of the ordinary. The earphones have ample strain relief and a nylon sheath on the cable below the y-split. The mic is well-positioned, too. The distinguishing characteristic, of course, is the zipper, which starts at the y-split and goes right up to the microphone, replacing the cable cinch. The teeth of the zipper are plastic while the slider is metal. It works well and I never got myself or my clothes caught in it, though I am not convinced of its superiority to a good cable cinch. The cable is terminated with a metal-jacketed I-plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good for this type of earphone
 Microphonics *(2.5/5) *– The cloth-covered cable and plastic zipper teeth don’t do the Zipbuds any favors when it comes to cable noise. The earphones are meant to be worn cable-down, and in this configuration cable noise can be bothersome. Adjusting the zipper while wearing them creates additional noise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The Zipbuds are rather well-designed when it comes to comfort, with an angled-nozzle housing that’s smooth and rounded at the front. The driver chamber is rather large, and on the whole the fit is similar to a “half in-ear” earphone – snug in the outer ear, but comfortable

Sound* (7.9/10)* – The sound signature of the Zipbuds PRO is pretty much perfect considering the relatively low price and consumer-oriented nature of the earphones, pushing the bass and treble slightly ahead of the midrange for a punchy, clear, and exciting sound – a “v-shaped” frequency response.

There’s plenty of bass with a mild mid-bass hump, but the Zipbuds are surprisingly free of bloat. The moderate bass enhancement never left me wanting for impact and extension is surprisingly good at both ends. At the same time, the tone is not very warm and avoids the clarity penalty overly warm earphones in this price range tend to have (see, for instance, the Fidue A31s or HiFiMan RE300h).

Clarity and detail are pretty impressive and midrange recession is minor for a v-shaped earphone. The upper mids and treble are accented, with both carrying plenty of energy. As expected, this gives the Zipbuds PRO a tendency towards harshness and sibilance, especially at high volumes, but it is very mild and the gain in clarity and overall energy is worth the tradeoff. Good treble extension also results in a decently wide presentation and a rather open, airy, and dynamic sound compared to other similarly-priced and similarly-tuned earphones.

*Select Comparisons*

Xiaomi Piston 2 ($25)

The Piston 2 from China-based Xiaomi took the audiophile world by storm with its warm, capable sound, becoming a popular budget choice very quickly. The Zipbuds PRO boasts comparable performance with a slightly more v-shaped sound signature.

While the Piston 2 is tonally warmer and has more of a deep bass focus, the Zipbuds have a touch more mid-bass instead. Bass control and overall clarity are generally similar between the two earphones, but the Zipbuds have a more v-shaped tuning with more presence in the upper midrange and treble. This makes for a brighter sound and also raises vocal intelligibility a bit compared to the Piston 2. On the whole, the Zipbuds are more sparkly and lively but have a greater tendency towards harshness and sibilance, especially at higher volumes. The Piston 2 sounds smoother and more refined in comparison, and also has a slightly more “open” presentation.

T-Peos Popular ($30)

The T-Peos Popular and Zipbuds PRO make for an interesting matchup, being two rather different takes on a v-shaped sound tuning – one bassier, and the other brighter. The brighter T-Peos model is more balanced and neutral, with a shallower “v-shape” to its sound. It has less mid-bass, which makes its low end tighter and allows for more deep bass emphasis. The Zipbuds, on the other hand, sound bassier and more boomy. Their tuning has a more pronounced v-shape with more midrange recession. Surprisingly, despite having a thinner and brighter sound, the Popular isn’t clearer than the bassier Zipbuds. It does, however, have a slightly wider soundstage. In the end, it’s very hard to say which is better – at times I preferred the more balanced Popular, and at times the bassier and more dynamic Zipbuds.

Brainwavz S0 ($45)

The entry-level model in Brainwavz’ popular S-series, the S0 is a relatively well-balanced earphone compared to the bassier, more mid-recessed Zipbuds. Despite their more powerful bass and slightly more recessed mids, however, the Zipbuds sound clearer. The upper midrange is more forward, resulting in more intelligible vocals, and the sound is more dynamic and lively on the whole. The S0, on the other hand, is a little less clear and makes vocals sound more distant. It also has weaker bass and lacks some dynamics in comparison to the Zipbuds.

Brainwavz S1 ($60)

The Brainwavz S1 makes for a better sound signature match for the Zipbuds than does the S0. While the S0 is flatter/more balanced than the Zipbuds, the tuning of the S1 is the opposite, increasing the bass and recessing the mids slightly for an even more “v-shaped” sound signature. This makes the v-shape more audible – and at times more bothersome – than the milder coloration of the Zipbuds.

The bass of the S1 is deeper and marginally tighter than that of the Zipbuds. However, the Zipbuds have less recessed mids and a more neutral tone compared to the darker S1. The brighter treble of the Zipbuds is a little more harsh, but it also makes them a touch clearer and more open-sounding – and preferable to the S1 for me.

Value *(8.5/10)* – Microphonics aside, the Zipbids PRO is my favorite kind of earphone – one with unexpectedly strong audio performance that took me entirely by surprise (the previous such set being the Flux In-Ear from PC accessories manufacturer SteelSeries).

While the zipper cable cinch is a bit of a gimmick, the Zipbuds cover the basics very well with excellent sound quality and a comfortable angled-nozzle design. With a v-shaped sound signature emphasizing bass and treble and satisfying clarity, dynamics, and even soundstaging, the Zipbuds PRO is a winner in sound – and easily recommendable overall.

*Pros: Comfortable angled-nozzle design; does resist tangling; nice mic; very good sound quality*
*Cons: Cable noise (microphonics)*

 

*(3A95) **HiFiMan RE300h*
  

Reviewed August 2015
  
Brief: HiFiMan’s first sub-$50 IEM in several years
  
MSRP: $49 
 Current Price: *$49* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _15-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock double flanges; generic double-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(2/5)* – Long single-flange and short bi-flange silicone tips; replacement nozzle filters (5 pairs)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The tiny housings of the RE300h are plastic and feature replaceable nozzle filters and decent strain relief. The cables are plastic and not nylon-sheathed below the y-split like the higher-end HiFiMan models. A nice L-plug terminates the cable
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The RE300h is a shallow-fit earphone but the included tips isolate surprisingly well and aftermarket tips can increase isolation a bit further
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Decent even when worn cable-down thanks to the soft cable
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings of the RE300h are designed for cable-down wear and unusually-shaped, but very small and lightweight. The small footprint in the ear and shallow fit makes them extremely comfortable, though I can see some users – especially those with larger ears – having to find alternatives to the two included eartips to get a proper seal

Sound* (7.9/10)* – The RE300h takes the HiFiMan house sound and makes it more consumer-friendly by skewing the usual near-neutral balance in a warmer, bassier direction. In 2009 – three generations back in HiFiMan terms – the RE1 model attempted something similar but it was pricier and suffered from relatively low efficiency, which made it less well-suited for the mainstream consumer. The RE300h has no such problems – it’s easy to drive and the bassy and forgiving sound signature feels right at home at $50.

The RE300h places more emphasis on bass compared not only to any other HiFiMan product I’ve heard in years, but also other high-performing ~$50 sets such as the SteelSeries Flux and Fidue A63, stopping just short of the Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear. It is not intended to please bassheads, but rather to deliver enough punch and body to avoid any accusations of sounding flat or lean, as often happens with higher-end HiFiMan models. Unfortunately bass control typically decreases as bass quantity goes up, and the bass of the RE300h is not as tight as that of higher-end HiFiMan IEMs and the aforementioned Fidue, SteelSeries, and Sennheiser sets.

The lower midrange of the RE300h is just as prominent as the bass. Indeed, the lack of midrange recession is what keeps the earphone grounded in the HiFiMan house sound. The RE300h ends up sounding warmer and not at all v-shaped compared to sets like the SteelSeries Flux, Xiaomi Piston 2, and Sennheiser Momentum.

However, together with the prominent bass, the warm and somewhat thick mids limit clarity. Other earphones mitigate this by providing bright, emphasized treble but the smooth and relaxed highs of the RE300h are no help here.  As a result, clarity lags slightly behind the abovementioned earphones. Treble smoothness, on the other hand, is superb. The RE300h is less bright/energetic and more forgiving than the Flux, Piston 2, and especially the Momentum In-Ear. It kills harshness and sibilance on tracks like very few IEMs can, especially at lower listening volumes.

Like the higher-end RE-400, the presentation of the RE300h is not at all laid-back, in part due to the forward midrange. However, the soundstage still has pretty good width and ends up surprisingly well-rounded – certainly an enjoyable presentation well ahead of most others in this price range. It’s also worth noting the high sensitivity of the RE300h – the earphone is well above average in that regard, too.

*Select Comparisons*

HiFiMan RE-400 ($79)

The RE300h’s older sibling is well known for its balanced and accurate sound. Compared to the pricier RE-400, the lower-end model sounds warmer and more bass-heavy. It is also more sensitive. The changes towards “louder” and “bassier” make sense when moving downmarket and targeting consumers rather than audiophiles. Unfortunately, with the tuning change the RE300h also loses some of what has made the RE-400 one of the best audiophile earphones on the market for the past 2½ years.

The extra bass of the RE300h is intrusive compared to the RE-400’s tighter, more well-measured low end. It is boomy and makes the earphones sound muddier. The RE-400 has more of a midrange focus but still sounds more tonally correct and natural, especially with vocals. It is clearer, more accurate, and more refined. The highs are brighter and crisper. Detail comes through better as well.

The one thing the RE300h does have going for it besides greater bass impact and better sensitivity is a more dynamic presentation, which makes its soundstage appear a little less flat and intimate than that of the RE-400. Soundstaging has never been one of the RE-400’s strengths, and it really shows here.

VSonic VSD3S ($45 – $60)

The RE300h is reminiscent of other HiFiMan in-ears with its lack of midrange recession and forgiving treble. The VSD3S, likewise, follows the VSonic house sound through and through, and is tuned very differently from the RE300h. Its sound is slightly v-shaped, with more bass punch and brighter treble compared to the HiFiMan set. The VSD3S is clearer and slightly more resolving, but suffers from sharper, more sibilance-prone highs and mild midrange recession. Despite its lower bass quantity, the RE300h has more bass bloat. It is also warmer, smoother, and more full-bodied than the VSD3S, and has a slightly more well-rounded soundstage.

Sony MH1C ($25 -$80)

Sony’s warm and smooth-sounding MH1C follows a less balanced sound tuning than the RE300h, placing more emphasis on bass (especially deep bass) and less on the midrange. However, the less forward mids of the Sony unit are also a bit thinner, which helps the MH1C achieve better clarity compared to the RE300h despite its more powerful bass. The presentation of the MH1C is more laid-back and spacious, too, while the RE300h is more forward and intimate. Lastly, the HiFiMan unit is significantly more sensitive.

Value *(8.5/10)* – The HiFiMan RE300h is an earphone for those who above all else favor a warm and forgiving sound. It maintains forward mids and smooth treble for that quintessential HiFiMan flavor, but provides more bass than the higher-end models. The result is a sound profile dominated by the bass and lower midrange, and somewhat limited in clarity and bass control. These are not positive traits for critical listening, but there’s plenty to like here as well – the lack of midrange recession despite strong bass, the soundstage, and the smoothness, which kills off harshness and sibilance better than the vast majority of competing earphones. I also like the tiny low profile housings – HiFiMan’s been pretty good at giving us IEMs that fit well in smaller ears lately. All in all, while it is not going to dethrone HiFiMan’s higher-end RE-400 model in bang for your buck, the RE300h offers a unique sound tuning in a unique form factor, both of which make it a compelling offering.

*Pros: Compact & comfortable housings; plentiful bass with prominent mids and very smooth treble*
*Cons: Clarity and bass control could be better*

 

*(3A96) JVC XX Elation HA-FR100X*
  

 Reviewed October 2015

Brief: latest entry in JVC’s enhanced-bass XX line

MSRP: $59.95
Current Price: *$59* from amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _8-25xk Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug with mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Narrow-channel single-flanges (DUNU, MEElec M6, etc)_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and velvet carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The FR100X foregoes the rubber bumpers of JVC’s previous XX-series models for an all-plastic construction. The housings are large but lightweight and JVC’s usual low-noise PVC cable is now terminated with a very nice L-shaped plug. Unusually, the microphone element and remote button are built into the right earpiece. This works quite well, thanks in part to the size of the earpiece – I actually had an easier time locating the button quickly compared to cord-mounted remotes
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics *(5/5) *– Pretty much nonexistent
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The XX Elation utilizes the usual angled-nozzle design of JVC’s previous XX-series earphones but the large housings with the somewhat unusual rhomboid cross-section just aren’t as comfortable in the ear as, for instance, the smaller HA-FX101

Sound* (7.2/10)* – The XX Elation line is the latest in JVC’s long-running Xtreme Xplosives series of bass-heavy (and sometimes _extremely_ bass-heavy) headphones and earphones. The HA-FR100X is the in-ear XX Elation mode and has both wired and wireless on-ear counterparts.

The sound of the HA-FR100X is a clear improvement over the XX earphones of old such as the HA-FR301 I reviewed last year. That earphone was overwhelmingly boosted in the bass and treble regions, which made its sound very uniquely suited to a particular type of listener but also had many drawbacks.

The new HA-FR100X sacrifices a portion of that huge bass, as well as some of the treble brightness, for a more balanced and natural sound tuning. It still carries very good bass impact that will be plentiful for the majority of listeners. However, it is no longer true basshead earphone in my book – the bass is simply not _that_overwhelming.

The FR100X has a warm tone and v-shaped overall sound signature – just not as v-shaped as the preceding HA-FR301 model. The sound is heavy on mid-bass, which causes the sub-bass to appear more subdued compared to earphones with similar bass quantity but less mid-bass bias – earphones such as the Nuforce NE-600X, Popclik String, UBSOUND Fighter, and Brainwavz S1. The bass is also a little less tight and more boomy, compared especially to the String and S1, but more controlled than that of the similarly mid-bassy Tekfusion Twinwoofers.

The FR100X’s mid-bassy sound creates a midrange that is fairly full-bodied despite the v-shaped response of the earphones. Compared to leaner-sounding sets like the aforementioned Popclik String and Brainwavz S1, the HA-FR100X is more veiled, but also richer and less recessed in the midrange. It goes both ways, however, as the JVCs are also clearer compared to less v-shaped earphones such as the UBSOUND Fighter and Twinwoofers.

Moving on up, the FR100X is slightly prone to harshness, much like other v-shaped earphones in its price range including the Brainwavz S1. Treble energy is good – the FR100X is brighter and more natural in this regard than the somewhat dull-sounding Twinwoofers, though also not as smooth. The treble presence and overall v-shaped sound signature help the FR100X sound spacious and relatively airy – definitely more so than the Twinwoofers and the pricier UBSOUND Fighter.

*Select Comparisons*

_Below are several head-to-head comparisons between the HA-FR100X and earphones that either perform on a similar level or have somewhat analogous sound tuning (or both). These comparisons may play a direct role in someone’s purchasing decision, but more importantly they help contextualize the earphone’s performance based on the other options currently on the market. _

JVC XX HA-FR301 ($40)

Pitting the HA-FR100X against one of its predecessors highlights the improvements JVC has made to the overall fidelity and “sonic realism” of the XX line. The older HA-FR301 is a much, MUCH more v-shaped earphone, with both bass and treble boosted significantly compared to the HA-FR100X.

The newer XX Elation is undoubtedly the more balanced earphone. Its bass quantity may not be as well-suited for bassheads but is still plentiful for general listening and doesn’t come at the expense of severely recessed mids and unnatural, metallic-sounding treble. Thanks to its bright tone the HA-FR301 does sound mildly clearer, but the more natural treble level of the HA-FR100X makes for a better overall experience – the extra brightness and harshness of the older model just aren’t worth the clarity gain.

ADV.SOUND M4 ($40)

The HA-FR100X is smoother and more balanced compared to its predecessors but still has quite a bit of bass emphasis and sonic coloration. The ADV.SOUND M4, while still not flat/neutral, is an even more balanced take on v-shaped sound tuning. It lacks the sheer power and energy of the JVC unit, but the extra bass boost of the HA-FR100X makes it sound more muffled in comparison to the M4, especially in the midrange. The treble of the JVCs is also sharper and less natural than that of the M4 and their lows are more mid-bassy and not quite as well-controlled.

Beats Tour 2.0 ($149)

Perhaps the most well-known and least-appreciated of the bass-heavy in-ear earphones on the market, the Beats Tour 2.0 is actually a pretty solid performer. Its biggest issue is the price tag – most other bass-heavy, consumer-oriented headphones of this sort, JVC’s XX series included, come in under $100.

The Beats do have an advantage over the HA-FR100X in bass depth, as well as overall impact and power – their bass is simply more prominent. The midrange of the Beats, on the other hand, is more recessed, yet still a touch clearer compared to that of the JVCs despite the Tour 2.0’s warmer tone.

The HA-FR100X has a more prominent midrange but its sound still appears more v-shaped thanks to the brighter treble. The top end of the Beats Tours is extremely smooth and forgiving. The HA-FR100X’s is more sparkly, but also more prone to harshness. The JVC unit has a slight advantage in airiness, however, as well as a wider presentation.

Value *(7.5/10)* – JVC’s new XX Elation HA-FR100X earphones are much more balanced and natural-sounding than previous XX-series models. While still tuned for a bass-heavy, v-shaped sound and lacking a bit in the way of bass control, they provide a warmer, more rich-sounding midrange and more toned-down, realistic treble than the preceding model.

As a side effect of the more balanced tuning, the FR-100X does lose the extreme degree of bass emphasis that would qualify it as a basshead earphone – something JVC’s old XX-series models were well-known for. This makes the new earphone’s sound is more accurate and proficient, but less unique. It also means that the new model faces far more competition than previous Xtreme Xplosives sets. It should be just bassy enough to still do well in the mainstream market, and just well-rounded enough to be accepted by audio enthusiasts, but only time will tell with certainty.

*Pros: More balanced and capable sound than previous models; extremely low cable noise; truly integrated mic/remote*
*Cons: Bulky housings; still not free of bass bleed and harshness*

 



*(3A97) Pump Audio Earphones*


Reviewed November 2015

 Brief: Kickstarter-backed enhanced-bass earphones from the UK
 MSRP: £69.00 / approx. $105 
 Current Price: *$50* from amazon.com; £69 from Amazon UK
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _16-24k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug w/mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_
  
 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and zippered clamshell carrying case (Note: latest version also adds 3 pairs of foam eartips)
 Build Quality* (3.5/5) *– The construction of the Pump is pretty generic – lightweight metal housings and a wide, flat cable. The Pump has its microphone and single-button remote at the y-split. The few minor downsides are (very mild) driver flex, lack of a cable cinch, and straight plug cable termination. Pump Audio offers an impressive 5-year warranty on these, but weirdly it seems to apply only when purchasing them from the manufacturer’s own website
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Pretty standard for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics (4/5) – Surprisingly low for a flat-cable earphone
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The Pump uses conventional straight-barrel earpieces, but they are very lightweight and I like the quality of the included silicone eartips, which are soft and seal quite well
  
 Sound *(7.7/10)* – The Pump is yet another Kickstarter-backed portable audio product but unlike the two last two I’ve covered (the LIFE Headphones and the ADV.SOUND M4), this project is based out of the UK rather than the US and the Kickstarter campaign has long since ended.
  
 The Pump Audio Kickstarter predicated on the earphones sounding “world-class” based on the majority of listeners preferring them to a set of Beats in-ears – hardly a high standard to start with – in a listening test with a sample size of 50 participants. As I’ve stated before, however, I don’t put much weight on what manufacturers have to say about their own product. Ultimately, the only thing that matters is performance.
  
 What the marketing materials can do is help provide some context for the design and tuning of a set of earphones. With the Pump IEMs, there are certainly gleams of reason in the marketing madness – for instance, it claims that they are “developed for lovers of dance music”. Can’t argue with that – the sort of bass-heavy, V-shaped sound delivered by the Pump is popular with EDM listeners.
  
 The bass of the Pump Earphones is quite heavy, but I like the balance of mid-bass and sub-bass. Neither overshadows the other, which is more than I can say for many other basshead earphones – the NHT SuperBuds, for instance, are definitely skewed in favor of mid-bass, while the HiSoundAudio Wooduo2 has little mid-bass and tons of low bass.
  
 The Pump IEMs are slightly boomy at the bottom end, which results in mild veiling of the midrange. Nothing surprising there – bass quantity and quality are almost always a trade-off, especially in lower price ranges. For instance the popular Xiaomi Piston 2 has slightly lower bass quantity and higher bass quality –  i.e. the bass is not quite as impactful, but tighter and more controlled in comparison to the Pump. The Pump is a more stereotypical consumer-friendly enhanced-bass earphone and provides a more full-bodied sound and warmer tone.
  
 This sort of theme carries through the treble – the overall balance, clarity, and detail are not as good as, for instance, the pricier RHA MA750. However, the Pump also offers much more bass impact than the RHA and pretty much any other in-ear on its performance level – the MA750 won’t satisfy bassheads, but the Pump will. The mildly v-shaped sound signature of the Pump and the resulting treble emphasis work in the earphones’ favor, adding some crispness and energy to what would otherwise be an overly warm sound. The treble extension also prevents the earphones from sounding overly intimate and “stuffy” – the Pump actually has a decently wide and spacious soundstage.
  
*Select Comparisons *
  
_Below are several head-to-head comparisons between the Pump Audio Earphones and other sets that either perform on a similar level or have somewhat analogous sound tuning (or both). These comparisons may play a direct role in someone’s purchasing decision, but more importantly they help contextualize the earphone’s performance based on the other options currently on the market. _
  
Pump Audio Earphones vs JVC XX Elation HA-FR100X ($60)
  
 The HA-FR100X is the latest entry in JVC’s long-running XX enhanced-bass headphone line. JVC XX earphones tend to be v-shaped with a strong bass bias – the same way I would describe the Pump IEMs. The XX Elation is less bass-heavy than all the previous XX-series earphones I’ve tried, and ends up with lower bass quantity compared to the Pump. This is especially true for sub-bass – the Pump has lots more of it. Surprisingly, the Pump earphones also have better clarity, though their more powerful bass also tends to become more intrusive on tracks with lots of bass.
  
 The bass of the JVCs is a little tighter, but the balance of the midrange and treble isn’t any better for it. JVC’s smoothest XX-series earphone and the Pump have similar treble quality and reach, and the Pump is more spacious overall. With both companies emphasizing performance with EDM music, it really seems that, for sound at least, the Pump Audio IEMs are what the XX Elation should have been.
  
Pump Audio Earphones vs UBSOUND Fighter ($70)
  
 While the Pump hails from the UK and the Fighter – from Italy, these earphones have lots in common when it comes to design, construction, and even sound tuning. Both are lightweight metal earphones utilizing ribbon-like flat cables. Both are bass-heavy, and both make compelling, lower-priced alternatives to Beats in-ears.
  
 The tuning of the Pump is more v-shaped, with greater mid-bass boost and a brighter, more energetic top making it sound a little clearer and providing more treble sparkle. The Fighter, on the other hand, has a warm and smooth sound. Its bass has a little less mid-bass impact and appears a bit less bloated and intrusive but still has plenty of depth. The Fighter is smoother-sounding, but the brighter Pump has a wider, more airy presentation.
  
Pump Audio Earphones vs NHT SuperBuds ($70)
  
 Though both the Pump Audio Earphones and the SuperBuds are bass-heavy IEMs, the NHT unit is bassy to a different degree. Its low end is even more full-bodied and impactful, lacking any semblance of subtlety and making the overall sound very thick, rich, and warm.
  
 The Pump is not as bass-heavy, and clearer overall. It has a more v-shaped sound tuning with mids that are more recessed and brighter, less forgiving treble. The SuperBuds are smoother, and remain so even at high volumes, allowing those so inclined to turn the volume up high enough to rattle teeth, but the brighter Pump is more balanced and boasts a wider soundstage and more airy presentation.
  
Pump Audio Earphones vs Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear ($100)
  
 Both the Pump Audio IEMs and the Momentum have v-shaped sound signatures but differ in balance. The “v-shape” of the Pump is biased more towards the low end. It has warmer tone and more powerful bass, but is also more bloated, which results in a slightly muddier sound. The Momentum is thinner and its midrange is more recessed. However, its bass is tighter and, thanks to its better clarity, resolution, and bass control, the Momentum sounds more accurate despite the deeper v-shape of its tuning.
  
Pump Audio Earphones vs Beats Tour 2.0 ($150)
  
 The original Beats Tour seems to be the earphone Pump Audio was benchmarking, and the new, more refined Beats Tour 2.0 makes for an interesting comparison. Beats has matured the sound of this earphone between the first and second generations, making it smoother and more balanced. The Pump Audio Earphones, in comparison, are more v-shaped, pushing the bass and treble forward and presenting mids that are slightly recessed – and a bit hollow-sounding – compared to the smoother, more full-bodied Beats Tour 2.0.
  
 The bass of the Pump IEMs is more intrusive and a little boomier while the Beats carry more of a deep bass focus and less mid-bass boost. On some tracks the brighter Pump set can sound a little clearer, but whenever moderately powerful bass is present, the tighter low end of the Tour 2.0 turns the tables, maintaining its composure better and delivering cleaner sound. On balance, the Beats are more level thanks to a less recessed midrange, and their overall sound a little more natural. At the same time, the Pump is the better choice for fans of heavy bass and those looking for a more fun and energetic listening experience, with accuracy being a secondary concern.
  
 Value *(8/10*) – Whatever can be said for Pump Audio’s marketing approach, the earphones speak for themselves. The sound may lack finesse and nuance, but it has the exact sort of wow factor many listeners crave, with gobs of bass and just enough clarity and treble sparkle to stop it from sounding as bloated as the Fidue A31s or the pricier NHT SuperBuds. It’s not a unique tuning by any means, but the Pump gets the proportions of all the elements right for many listeners. This is what the first-gen Beats Tour in-ear wishes it could be, and what JVC’s XX series should have evolved into.
  
 Not all is great – the construction of the earphones is pretty generic and the packaging of the original Pump felt cheap for the price of the earphones, but the recent release of an updated version with improved accessories has made it a more well-rounded package and an easy recommendation for fans of big bass.
  
*Pros: Fun, bass-heavy sound; lightweight and comfortable for a conventional-fit IEM
 Cons: Cheap packaging on the 1st version; very bass-heavy sound*


----------



## ljokerl (Feb 25, 2020)

*Tier 2C ($60-100)*



*(2C1) Head-Direct RE0*



Reviewed Nov 2009

 Details: Summer 2009 version of the RE0 IEM (cloth cable).
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $239)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _64 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _16-22k Hz _| Cord: _4.1' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Soundmagic PL30 foamies, De-Cored Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* - Spare filters, a nice selection of silicone tips (both single- and bi-flanges), and a shirt clip
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Classy-looking metal shell feels sturdy, but there are occasional reports of splitting. Cabling is properly relieved and features an L-plug in the current version
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Typical for a sealed straight-barrel IEM
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Low when worn over-the-ear, and still not bad when worn straight down
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Housings are small and light. Comfort hugely dependent on tips but is generally very good

 Sound *(8.3/10)* – The overall sound is natural and boasts incredible clarity and top-notch separation in the average-sized soundstage. The high-end is incredibly detailed and seems to extend upwards endlessly. The detailing is close to the best I have heard. Very impressive also is the apparent flatness of response. The mids have good clarity and are also incredibly detailed. They are very neutral with maybe just a hint of warmth, but lack lushness or liquidity. The lows are not huge in quantity, but very good in detail, extension, and control. These can drop below 35Hz and individual notes can be distinguished all the way down. Overall, it is a sound signature that makes it easy to both tune them into the background and pick out fine details, whichever strikes your fancy at the moment.

 Amping: Like being amped, but don’t require it explicitly. High impedance rating is deceiving. Warm amp (e.g. T4) will make these more well-rounded for those who prefer a warmer, darker sound. 

 Value *(10/10)* – At $79, it is easy to recommend the RE0s as what is probably the best-value all-around earphone for the detail freak and accuracy lover. The RE0s’ sound signature is definitely not for everyone, but those looking for the absolute best accurate sound reproduction to be had in the realm of reasonably-priced IEMs will not be disappointed.

*Pros: Top-tier sound quality for mid-fi money; superb detail, accuracy, separation, and clarity
 Cons: May sound thin, boring, or bright to some, some reported durability issues*


*(2C2)  Ultimate Ears MetroFi 220*





Reviewed Nov 2009

 Details: Newer (2008) version of one of UE’s entry-level IEMs
 Current Price: *$69.99 *from B&H.com (MSRP: $79.99); $89.99 for 220vi with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18 Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _20-16k Hz _| Cable: _3.8’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes) and a very convenient plastic carrying case
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – Housings are completely plastic and feel somewhat cheap. Cable is sturdy but lacks strain reliefs on housing entry. Of note are the colored nozzles – red for right, gray for left
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Ported and shallow-insertion might sound like a bad combination, but they isolate surprisingly well
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Not too bothersome even when worn straight down. A shirt clip would help.
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Housing is too fat for deep insertion and the stems make it hard to wear them over-the-ear. Still very light & comfortable for me, but buyers with small ears beware

 Sound *(5.7/10)* – Overall, the sound is smooth and slightly warm. The soundstage is wider than average, with decent separation and positioning. The mids and highs are present, although the top end is rolled off. The definite selling point of these is the bass – it is smooth, deep, and very powerful. It creeps in on the lower mid-range but I definitely wouldn’t call it bloated, just a bit muddy. There is a mid-bass hump typical of middle-of-the-road earphones. The bass sounds full without being overwhelming.. These are a good gateway drug for the budget-minded bass lover.

 Value *(5.5/10)* – At the $80 MSRP I feel that Ultimate Ears overshot the actual value of these a bit. They’re a very fun, tap-your-toes type earphone, delivering a dynamic sound signature with an emphasized low end and are quite competent all-around; it’s just too bad that the lower-tier entries by the likes of Nuforce and Meelectronics can do the same at a much lower price.

*Pros: Very solid bass, fun sound, nice carrying case, shiny
 Cons: Can be uncomfortable for some, hard to wear over-the-ear, mediocre build*


*(2C3) Klipsch Image S4 / S4i*


Reviewed Nov 2009

 Details: Klipsch’s latest mid-range model that has received overwhelmingly positive reviews both here at head-fi and in the mainstream press
 Current Price: *$79.99 *from Amazon.com (MSRP: $79.99); $99.99 for S4i with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18 Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _10-19k Hz _| Cable: _4.2’ I-plug (S4i); 4.2’ L-plug (S4)_
 Nozzle Size:_ 3mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange tips, and metal carrying case (S4i instead includes a velvet carrying pouch and shirt clip)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Housings are plastic but seem plenty sturdy and have articulated strain reliefs. Cable is a little thin for my liking but very flexible and doesn’t tangle much
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Block out an above-average amount of external noise
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nonexistent when worn over-the-ear. Noticeable but not too bad otherwise. Included shirt clip helps further
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Easier to insert when worn cord-down. When worn over-the-ear fit is very similar to the JVC HA-FX300

 Sound *(6.7/10)* – Coming from the RE0 these seem colored and very heavy at the low end, lacking in clarity and behind slightly in detail as well. After some solitary time with the S4, I think that they are interesting earphones that deliver heavy bass impact, clean mids, and decent treble. The bass can be too powerful and boomy for my liking, but that’s more of a personal issue - at least they don’t give me bass headaches. It’s not quite as tight as I would like, but can’t really be called bloated either. I can see why this bass has mass appeal – it can easily satisfy the bass junkie without being totally offensive. There is some bleed into the midrange, which is smooth and articulate, if a little thin and recessed. The treble that the S4s put out is the weak point for me – it lacks the smoothness of the RE0 and (even after 200 hours) still sounds somewhat harsh and sibilant. Soundstaging is decent enough but can hardly be called spacious and individual instruments can sometimes be harder to pick out than I would like.

 On a final note, I had a small issue with the relatively low impedance and high sensitivity of these - they have a tendency to hiss slightly even with normally dead-silent Sansa Fuze, and the hiss with other devices can be borderline unbearable. 

 Value *(7/10)* – With a sound signature that can be appreciated by bass junkie, audiophile, and casual listener alike – and practicality to match – the S4s don’t lack in any area. However, as is often with FOTM earphones, the hype is excessive. For me, in terms of sound, the S4 lack the “wow” factor of the RE0, Phonak PFEs, and many others. That said, I still consider these good value for money despite the several issues I have with their sound.

*Pros: Competent build, fit, and finish
 Cons: Cables don’t inspire confidence, can be too bass heavy for some, hint of harshness/sibilance, prone to hissing*


*(2C4) V-Moda Vibe II *





Reviewed Nov 2009

 Details:Metal-shelled earphone from V-Moda
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $119.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: _12-22k Hz _| Cable: _3.8’ 45°-plug _
 Nozzle Size:_ 5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Two sets of silicone single-flange tips (4 sizes each) in clear and black, over-the-ear cable guides, and soft leather carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Housings are made of what feels like steel. Cables are thick and wrapped in cloth but tend to tangle and knot. Combined with the metal mic and remote, the whole construction weighs too much. Left/Right markings are printed in silver (on the silver shells) on the inside of the housing, under the edge of the tip, and are absolutely impossible to see , though there is a microphone on the right-side cable to aid in identifying the right channel
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Quite good for a straight-barrel dynamic IEM
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – The cloth cable transmits quite a lot of cable noise unless they are worn over-the-ear. The included cable guides are a nice touch
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – Too heavy. I can’t wear them cord-down because of the weight of the earphones. Wearing them cable up works better but is impractical due to the mic

 Sound *(5.6/10)* – These are, to be quite honest, what I expected originally from the Monster Turbines. They are bass-centric and start rolling off pretty much right after the upper midrange. The bass is strong and smooth, but lacking in definition and control, which is surprising because the Turbines actually have more of it. They are also lacking slightly in detail and instrumental separation across the range. Clarity is not quite on-par with the Turbines or Klipsch S4s either. The midrange is smooth and well-positioned while the treble is slightly recessed and a little too laid back for my liking. They do sound quite dynamic, not unlike the UE MetroFi 220s, and can be extremely fun at times, but I wish they had a tighter low end.

 Value *(6/10)* – The V-Moda Vibe II are another one for the bass lover. With their unique styling and rock-solid construction they definitely stand out in a crowded market segment, but it seems that in the pursuit of originality V-Moda left sound quality on the sidelines. They don’t sound half bad by any means – on a scale set by some of the best universal IEMs in existence they place respectably. There are just too many lower-priced IEMs that set aside all the crowd-pleasing gimmicks and shoot straight for sq.

*Pros: Solid build, fun sound signature
 Cons: Tangle/kink-prone cabling, heavy, lack low-end control, treble roll-off*


*(2C5) Auvio Armature*





Reviewed Jan 2010

 Details: Flagship IEM from RadioShack’s in-house electronics manufacturer Auvio
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $79.99)
 Specs: Driver:_BA_ | Imp: _55.5 Ω_ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cord: 4_’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T400, Soundmagic PL30 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), comply T400 tips (3 sizes), and a pleather carrying case with magnetic flap and inner pocket
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are in two parts, the rear being nicely machined metal and the front – plastic. The plastic feels a bit rough and cheap. Cabling is fairly thick but somewhat tangle-prone. Strain reliefs are functional on the 3.5mm plug end but not molded on earphone entry.
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Isolation is quite good with the stock silicone tips and improves further with the included Complys. Angled nozzle is conducive to deep insertion.
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low when worn cord-down and non-existent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The nozzles are angled as on the Klipsch S4 and the fit is very similar. Can easily be worn cord-up or cord-down.

 Sound *(5/10)* – The Auvios produce a very flat and neutral sound that falls just short of expectations on a few levels. Extension on the low end is rather average, with the bass rolling off quickly past about 35 Hz. What is there is quite tight and accurate, though with little impact. The mids are slightly recessed and the soundstage is just a bit wider than average. Separation is mediocre and for the $80 MSRP I would also expect better clarity and detail in the mids and treble. The high end is devoid of sparkle and excitement, resulting in a slightly dark sound. Really, they aren’t bad at all, but I expect more from earphones with a list price of $80.

 Value: *(6/10)* – Though the Auvios really excel on the usability front, the sound isn’t quite something I could get excited about. While they perform admirably from a technical standpoint, they lack a certain musical quality that keeps me coming back to earphones such as the Soundmagic PL50. I was actually originally convinced that the Auvios utilized the same armatures as the Soundmagic PL50 (both are Chinese OEM single armature earphones with similar impedance and sensitivity specs). Having listened to both side by side, I can say that the sound signatures are pretty different. Needless to say I prefer the PL50.

*Pros: Comfy, decent build quality, almost zero microphonics
 Cons: Bland sound, optimistic MSRP*


*(2C6) Klipsch Custom 2*





Reviewed Jan 2010

 Details: Klipsch’s mid-range dual-armature earphone; one of the cheapest such setups on the market
 Current Price: *$75 *from TigerDirect.com (MSRP: $199.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _10-19k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 3.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) tips, cleaning tool, airplane adapter, and oversize hard carrying case
 Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The housings are rubber-covered plastic and quite well-made. The memory wire acts as a strain relief and the y-split and L-plug are both very impressive. The nylon cabling, however, is atrocious. It kinks and tangles endlessly, ruining an otherwise competent build
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The long, steeply angled nozzles allow for deep insertion, resulting in impressive isolation
 Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Quite unpleasant despite these being worn over-the-ear and having a ‘memory wire’ configuration
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Can’t fault the Customs here – they fit in the ear rather snugly and unobtrusively, not unlike the JVC AirCushions. Persons with smaller ears may find them harder to wear

 Sound *(6/10)* – The dual-driver Custom 2 improves on the single armature Custom 1 by offering a wider dynamic range - the C1s’ lack of presence in the bass and quirky treble characteristics were my major gripes with them. With the C2s, low-end response is much improved with fuller-sounding, warmer, and more impactful bass that’s still just as tight as on the C1s. The midrange is similar to that found on the C1s – lush, airy, and clear. The treble is much tamer although it still carries some of the edginess and brightness of the Custom 1. Still, I managed to survive my 3-day evaluation of the C2 without listening fatigue (which I can’t say for the C1). The soundstage is slightly wider and deeper than with the C1s and detail is improved all-around, especially at the extremes of the frequency range. Like the C1, the C2 is an extremely sensitive earphone and added impedance cuts down on the hiss and makes the whole signature more coherent, so an attenuator is recommended.

 Value *(7/10)* – As with the Custom 1, the MSRP of the Custom 2 is a bit of a stretch. Even at the current $75 price point, Klipsch’s own dynamic-driver S4 are a better buy for most genres. Though I wholeheartedly recommend the Custom 2 over the Custom 1, I can’t help but feel that Klipsch put on the brakes when engineering the sound of the C2 so that it would not compete with the higher-end C3 and the Image line.

*Pros: Comfortable, well-isolating, detailed and smooth midrange
 Cons: Downright awful cabling, excessive microphonics*


*(2C7) ViSang R03 / Brainwavz M2*





Reviewed Mar 2010

 Details: heavyweight bang/buck contender from one of VSonic’s daughter companies Current Price: *$65* from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _20 Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug (note: latest version carries __45°-plug)_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

_Note: The mp4nation Brainwavz M2 is identical to the R03 in every way except the 3.5mm plug (45-degree plug identical to that on the Beta Brainwavz is used on the M2) and the accessory pack (M2 does not include foamhybrid tips)._

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case (foamhybrid tips no longer included with mp4nation version)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Sturdy aluminum housings, metal filters, and tough yet flexible cables. Strain reliefs are not molded but do the job and the cords lack a cable cinch and have some long-term memory character. Left/Right markings are a bit hard to see in direct sunlight
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Typical of a ported dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Present when worn cord-down but wearing them over-the-ear is possible and a shirt clip is included
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are light but wearing them over-the-ear can initially be a bit tricky because of the long strain reliefs and resistive cable. The sizable driver bulge on the housing prevents particularly deep insertion

 Sound *(7.2/10)* – Though I wouldn’t quite call them bass-heavy, the R03 certainly boast added low-end emphasis. Despite the boost, the bass is very smooth and calm. It stays completely out of the way when uncalled for and steps up in bass-heavy tracks. The bass also has a softness and delicacy to it that is rather rare and reminds me of my Monster Turbine Pro Gold as opposed to the hard-hitting low end of earphones such as the Klipsch S4 and Panasonic HJE900. The overall tonality of the R03 leans slightly towards darkness. The mids are front and center right where they should be, except when drums step out of line and too far forward on rare occasions. This is a positioning issue rather than a balance issue and is rarely distracting. Soundstage depth is actually one of the few areas in which the R03 could stand improvement before they take down some of the big players in the mid-range segment. Soundstage width is about average, around the level of the RE0, and imaging is rather good for what they cost, though they can’t quite keep up with the hologram-esque spacing of the Soundmagic PL50 and HJE900. Midrange clarity is superb and detail is equally impressive. The treble is smooth and moderately extended. It is not the focus of the presentation but instead a compliment. It is neither harsh nor bright nor sibilant. The R03 are also quite fast, at least on-par with the original Monster Turbines, and surprisingly transparent. Lastly, they have a very natural timbre, which is something a lot of budget IEMs struggle with.

 Value *(9/10)* – The ViSang R03 is an incredible performer - a wholesome combination of build quality, comfort, and sound at a price well south of $100. In terms of coherency of sound signature they are up there with the best sub-$100 earphones I have heard. The combination of impactful bass, clear mids, and crisp treble give the R03 a very agreeable sound that can be enjoyed by both the audiophile and the casual listener in equal measure. And that fact alone makes them highly recommended earphones with a sound signature geared slightly towards the mainstream market compared to much of the gear talked about on head-fi. Do I personally still prefer a more analytical sound? Yes. But that does not prevent me from enjoying the R03 in the least. They are not perfect, but they are unreasonably good for what they cost.

*Pros: Great build and sound quality
 Cons: Mediocre isolation, L/R markings hard to see, cords have some memory character*

 Full review can be found here.


*(2C8) JAYS j-JAYS*





Reviewed Apr 2010

 Details: Entry-level earphone from Swedish manufacturer JAYS
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $70)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq: _50-20k Hz_ | Cable: _2’ I-plug + 3’ extension_
 Nozzle Size:_ 3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock Single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange silicone (4 sizes) and foam tips, 4 sets of replacement filters, 3.5mm splitter, airplane adapter, extension cord, and leatherette carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Sturdy plastic housings feature proper strain reliefs though the relief on the 3.5mm plug is a bit hard. The cables are thin but behave well and don’t tangle
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Insertion depth is quite good due to rounded housings, yielding reasonable isolation
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Very low when worn over-the-ear, but still not too bad otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Extremely light housings make them very easy to wear. Flexible strain reliefs allow for easy cord-up use

 Sound *(3.9/10)* – The sound put out by the j-JAYS is dark and warm. Low-end extension is rather average, rolling of smoothly past 35Hz. The bass could be tighter but there’s certainly a good amount of it. The midrange is in balance with the bass but lacks articulation. Clarity is poor and some vocals can sound downright muffled, which is a shame because the tonality is very natural, as good as any mid-range earphone I have heard. The treble is recessed, adding to the warmth of the sound. It is completely devoid of sparkle, but also of harshness and sibilance. Indeed, the j-JAYS are as smooth as earphones can get but the loss in clarity and detail is not a fair trade-off in my book.

 Value *(5/10)* – Though the sound signature of the JAYS is typical of a low-end dynamic IEM, the price tag is not. From the way they are designed and packaged it is obvious that Jays puts user-friendliness first, and I applaud that - the j-JAYS certainly have an upmarket feel and make a beautiful gift. I just wish they had an upmarket sound signature to match.

*Pros: Incredibly complete package, very comfortable, user-friendly
 Cons: Where’s the clarity? Cable is too short without extension, too long with it*


*(2C9) Thinksound Rain*


Reviewed May 2010

 Details: Thinksound’s pricier “crisp and balanced” wooden IEM
 Current Price: *$64.99* from Amazon.com (MSRP: $99.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T/Tx400_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), shirt clip, and unbleached cotton drawstring pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The wooden housings are accented by machined-aluminum nozzles. Combined with the etched L/R markings and general attention to detail, the Thinksounds have a very upmarket feel. The short strain reliefs are functional and the rubberized cable, despite being rather thin, does not tangle much. The 3.5mm I-plug is well-relieved and sturdy
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average due to massive rear vent
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Slightly bothersome when worn cord-down, very low worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings of the Thinksound Rain are longer and thinner than those of the TS01. Wearing comfort is just as good since the housings are still light and easy to wear over-the-ear. However, sleeping in the Rains is not a good idea due to the length of the shells

 Sound *(7/10)* – I reviewed Thinksound’s lower-end TS01 head to head with another wooden earphone, the Woodees IESW101B, and found them to be different interpretations of a very similar sound signature, each unique strengths and weaknesses. The sonic signature of the higher-end Thinksound Rain seems to offer a blend of the positive traits of the other wooden earphones while downplaying the flaws. Unlike the enhanced-bass TS01, the Rain is advertised as having a crisp and balanced sound, which is true - the low end of the Rain is significantly lighter than that of the TS01 and the treble is tamer. The slightly flatter bass allows the Rain to relay more fine detail at the bottom of the range. They are still far from bass-light and can hit quite hard when prodded but the low end extension suffers noticeably in comparison to the Thunder. The bass on the Rain is full-bodied, no doubt, but the rumble of the Thunders is lacking.

 Moving on to the midrange, the Rain, unlike the TS01, doesn’t drop off at all, sounding more forward and natural than the TS01 does. Detail and clarity are noticeably better and everything just sounds crisper. The tamer low end imparts little warmth on the midrange but the lush liquidity that’s so pleasant with the TS01 is not lost. Unlike the TS01, however, the Rain does not exhibit stridency towards the upper midrange. As a result, they sound smoother overall despite the lack of warmth. Musical elements like the crack of drums or snares never sound jarring the way they can with the TS01, even with silicone tips. Unlike bass extension, which suffers as the result of the flatter low-end response of the Rain, treble extension doesn’t seem to be affected by the flatter top end. The treble is crisp and clear, with a bit of sparkle and natural reverb. The Rain don’t exactly manage the delicacy or effortlessness of the RE0 but will satisfy a treble lover more than, say, a ViSang R03 or Soundmagic PL50.

 Finally, presentation is another area in which the Rain surpasses the TS01 in my book. The soundstage of the Rain is significantly broader. It’s not a wide-sounding earphone like the Cyclone PR1 Pro but it is well-spaced and conveys both intimacy and distance fairly well. Imaging is better and orchestral pieces sound more natural and less dense. Like the TS01, the Rain also has a good sense of timbre, whether with guitars or woodwinds. It’s not perfect, but then for the price it’s not expected to be. In my weeks with the Rain I’ve also learned something else – the Rain is a very good IEM for movies. Something about the way it positions audio is very believable and the highly detailed nature of the mids and treble helps bring out intricacies that may otherwise have been missed. And of course the impactful bass helps complete the overall experience.

 Value *(8/10)* – On the grand scale, the Rain is not radically different from the TS01 in sound. It is the little improvements, however, each changing the sound slightly but in the right direction, that come together to make a product that is significantly more capable overall. The Rain is more balanced, more neutral, and more natural-sounding than that TS01. It is smoother overall and boasts a more lifelike presentation. Both Thinksound earphones put up a good fight on the usability front as well – their design is simple but functional. And of course Thinksound’s environmentally-friendly approach to product design is a value-added proposition for those who sleep better at night knowing that the earth is just a little bit greener because companies like Thinksound and Ankit are doing business.

*Pros: Great aesthetics and attention to detail, solid performance, environmentally-friendly design & packaging
 Cons: Not as sleep-friendly as the TS01*


*(2C10) Rockford Fosgate Punch Plugs*


Reviewed Jun 2010

 Details: Dynamic-driver IEM from car audio firm Rockford Fosgate
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $99.99); $129.99 for PP15mmi with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _24 Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB _| Freq: _10-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _S__traight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The large, ergonomically-designed housings are made out of plastic with the exception of the Rockford Fosgate badges and the metal-mesh filters in the nozzle. While not exactly high-rent, the housings do feel solid enough for everyday use. The flat cable is soft, flexible, and feels rather sturdy. However, the cord lacks strain relief on housing entry as well as at the Y-split
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Reasonable but far from class-leading due to the vented design. The vents also make the Punch Plugs susceptible to wind noise in breezy conditions
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – The rubberized flat cable found on the Punch Plugs is not very energetic and generally carries almost no noise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The body of the Punch Plugs is designed around the sizable bulge that contains the gargantuan 15mm drivers. Ideally, the bulge itself rests inside the wearer’s ear and the long plastic nozzle is inserted into the ear canal. The ergonomics suit me well but make no mistake – the housings of the Punch Plugs are huge and could easily swallow a few of the smaller in-ears whole. Those with small ears or narrow ear canals will likely want to give the Punch Plugs a pass if long-term comfort is a priority. Additionally, the Punch Plugs cannot be worn with the cord looped over the ear unless the Left/Right earpieces are reversed. The flat cable is rather prohibitive of such use as well

 Sound *(6.8/10)* – The advertising materials for the Punch Plugs claim that the earphones transport the “Power, Clarity, and Ground Shaking Bass” of Rockford Fosgate subwoofers directly into the listener’s ear. The bass produced by the Punch Plugs is indeed very powerful and yet surprisingly accurate and controlled. They aren’t the most bass-heavy earphones out there but they are very hard-hitting, especially at higher volumes. The low end of the Punch Plugs carries quite a lot of information and always sounds well-integrated into the music. Predictably, though, the sub-bass does roll off and midrange bleed occurs in small quantities. The midrange of the Punch Plugs is slightly veiled but still quite dynamic and involving. Though the earphones tend to gloss over fine detail, they impart a unique grungy texture on the midrange, making it sound raw and slightly rough. This tendency is related to the fact that the gigantic drivers of the Punch Plugs have a rather small dynamic range and don’t relay subtlety very well.

 Despite the raw-sounding midrange, the treble produced by the Punch Plugs is never harsh. Upper-end presentation is slightly recessed but crisp and accurate, rolling off gradually but a bit too early for my liking. Because of the recessed treble and aggressive bass, the Punch Plugs take on a very dark tone. In fact, the tone of the Punch Plugs contends with the FutureSonics Atrio M8 for the title of the darkest earphone I own. Can the dark tone be a negative? Certainly, but it depends on personal preference more than anything else. For listeners who favor bright and sparkly sound, the Punch Plugs require some heavy equalization in the mids and treble, to which they respond fairly well.

 In terms of presentation, the Punch Plugs boast decent soundstage width and depth. The sonic image is slightly blurred resulting in a less separated and more blended sound and contributing to the ‘garage band’ feel of the earphones. The Punch Plugs also need a good amount of volume to bring out detail – those who like to keep the volume minimal will likely find them a touch boring. All in all the signature of the Punch Plugs is very unique and, while not technically perfect, is sure to find its fans.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The Punch Plugs compete well with other earphones in their price bracket, providing that the listener enjoys the particular flavor they bestow on music. Their sound signature lacks compromise – it is dark, raw, and powerful. Low notes hit hard, the midrange is grungy and thick, and the treble is crisp but recessed. The construction utilizes no exotic materials or flashy design elements but the aesthetics are far from forgettable – while I was initially disappointed with the sheer quantity of plastic that went into the Punch Plugs, the design grew on me just as the sound signature did. The Punch Plugs are neither audiophile earphones nor studio monitors – they are tuned purely for rocking out, and on that count they do deliver.

*Pros: Nearly no microphonics, ergonomic design, unique and coherent presentation
 Cons: Lack of strain relief on cable entry, fit is problematic for those with small ears, slightly prone to wind noise, love-it-or-hate-it sound signature*


*(2C11) Sleek Audio SA-1*


Reviewed Jun 2010

 Details: Mid-range entry from Sleek Audio, notable for the wooden housings, a sonic tuning system, and detachable cables
 Current Price: *$74.99* from soundearphones.com (MSRP: $79.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _25 Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: *Straight down*_ or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (3 sizes) silicone tips, treble tuning filters (2 sets), and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The wood-and-metal housings look and feel quite solid. Detachable cables are a huge plus and the connectors are identical to those used by the Panasonic HJE900. The cord itself is a bit thin and plasticky but flexible, properly relieved, and, of course, replaceable
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The isolation is quite adequate, helped by the slim, easy-to-insert housings
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Cable noise is low when worn cable-down and nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are long, slim, and rounded at the front for a more unobtrusive fit. The cable exit point is angled a bit awkwardly for over-the-ear use but general wearing comfort is very good. It should be noted that the SA1 sounds best with a very shallow seal despite being well-suited for a deep fit

 Sound *(5.9/10) *– First off – the tuning system. The SA1 features a simplified version of the VQ tuning system utilized in Sleek’s flagship SA6 earphone – all that the user is allowed to do is choose between two treble ports. To my ears (and I freely admit to liking my treble bright) there is no inherent disadvantage in using the silver treble-heavy ports. The earphones do not lose much bass quantity or quality and the lower midrange is unaffected by the filters. The upper midrange and lower treble are emphasized slightly by the silver ports and, to my ears, sound more balanced than with the black ports. I want to stress that the difference is small and in the big picture the Sleeks are bright earphones either way – those who are offended by brightness will not find solace in the black filters.

 The general sound signature of the SA1 emphasizes smoothness over clarity. The bass is tight and punchy but lacking in body, rumble, and extension. In fact, the bass put out by the 6mm drivers of the SA1 reminds me of bass produced by certain balanced armatures – quick and accurate but not particularly realistic or informative. On the upside, the lower midrange is clear of bass bleed and generally sounds quite smooth. Detail and clarity are quite impressive at first listen. However, part of the perceived clarity as a result of the bright treble – comparing the SA1 side-by-side with earphones such as the Grado iGi or Yamaha EPH-50 reveals the actual clarity of the Sleeks to be a step below both - around the level of the cheaper Meelec M9 and Nuforce NE-6 to my ears. The slightly thick sound works well for stringed instruments and vocals and, combined with the slightly emphasized treble, gives the SA1 a ‘shiny’ signature that reminds me of the Audio-Technica ATH-CK100, though the timbre of the $400 Audio-Technicas is noticeably more realistic. The treble is quite smooth and, despite being slightly forward, suffers from neither harshness nor sibilance. Top-end extension is decent and treble detail is impressive for the money without sounding aggressive in the least.

 Presentation is where the sound of the SA1 goes slightly wrong for me. Granted, the comparably-priced earphones I have been using lately (the ViSang R03/R02, Hippo VB, Yamaha EPH-50, Brainwavz M1, etc) are all high bang/buck contenders when it comes to sound and have unreasonably good instrument separation. However, in a field of these five <$80 earphones, the SA1 sounds notably congested and quite narrow. Instrumental separation is sub-par compared to the others, which is why I would not recommend them for complex rock and metal recordings, big-band jazz, or orchestral music despite the excellent rendition of stringed instruments. Using the earphones with an extremely shallow seal helps alleviate the problem somewhat – with the largest Sony Hybrid eartips and a very shallow fit, soundstage width is about average to my ears. However, isolation takes an expected hit and they don’t feel quite as secure to wear. On the whole, as long as soundstage size is not a prime concern, the SA1 is a solid mid-range earphone.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The Sleek Audio SA1 offers a combination of features not usually found at its price point. Wooden housings, detachable cables, and tuning systems are all quite rare to begin with and finding them on a single earphone – one with an $80 price tag – is notable in itself. The Sleeks do look and feel like a quality product but have a few drawbacks in functionality and performance. The tuning system does not have a radical effect on the sound and will likely only be used once - those who like to switch off different-sounding earphones often will find no solace in the SA1. The sound signature is quite pleasant and coherent, with the major flaw for me being the narrow soundstage. Though this can be fixed to an extent by using an extremely shallow seal, isolation and fit suffer in the process. As a total package, the SA1 is worth the asking price. For the best bang/buck in sound quality alone, better options abound.

*Pros: Well-built, comfortable, low microphonics, detachable cables*
*Cons: Optimal sound quality and isolation are mutually exclusive, not trivial for over-the-ear use, tuning system useless in the long run*


*(2C12) Hippo VB*


Reviewed Jul 2010

 Details: Mid-range dynamic IEM from Jaben’s house brand, Hippo, boasting ‘Variable Bass’ technology
 Current Price: *$79 *from unclewilsons.com (MSRP: $79)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _18-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single flanges_
 Wear Style: straight down or *over-the-ear*

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, hard clamshell carrying case with wrist strap, and bass tuning ports (3 sets)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Metal shells with screw-in bass ports in the rear and filterless nozzles. The cable is properly relieved and doesn’t tangle much but feels a bit cheap – sort of like the new Head-Direct cable found on the RE-ZERO and RE252. The L-plug is excellent
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Quite decent for day-to-day use with well-sealing tips
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Rather bothersome when worn cord-down; average otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The VBs are typical straight-barrel IEMS when it comes to fit but the housings aren’t small or rounded at the front, resulting in fairly shallow fit. The cord is rather flexible and wearing them over-the-ear is easy

 Sound *(7.7/10) *– The Hippo VB gets its designation from the ‘Variable Bass’ tuning system, which consists of three interchangeable screw-in bass ports/plates that are fitted at the rear of the shells. The high-bass, medium-bass, and low-bass plates are marked with zero, two, and three white dots, respectively (and, unless I’m reading it wrong, the packaging actually has the markings listed backwards). The changes resulting from swapping the plates are small but noticeable. With the medium (two dot) plate, bass quantity is just a bit short of  the Sennheiser IE8 (on minimum bass setting) and about on par with the Monster Turbine Pro Gold. Compared to the medium setting, the high-bass plate sounds a bit less controlled and slightly darker. The low-bass plate makes the sound brighter and seems to exacerbate the sibilance towards which the VB can be prone while offering no improvements in control or clarity over the medium plate. Needless to say, after initial testing I left the two-dot bass plate on for the duration of my listening.

 With the medium tuning plate in place, the bass of the VB is nothing short of superb. It is well-textured, full-bodied, and extremely deep, matching the Future Sonics Atrios in extension and offering even better linearity. The sub-bass has great rumble and is very controlled - mid-bass bloat common to mid-range earphones with lots of bass is completely absent. As a result, the bass of the VB sounds rather different from that of midbass-heavy earphones like the Sennheiser CX300 – the VB offers plenty of sub-bass rumble with a bit of punch. The resulting sound is extremely layered and well-separated as opposed to the more blended and integrated sound offered by earphones like the FA Eterna and ViSang R03. The peculiar presentation is enjoyable in its own right but may surprise those expecting CX300-like midbass. Expectedly, midrange bleed is completely absent, giving way to clear and accurate mids. The midrange reminds me of the Head-Direct RE0 with less microdetail and overall refinement. It is controlled and detailed but tends to sound a tad thin and quite dry compared to the similarly-priced ViSang R03 and Fischer Audio Eterna. The midrange is quite adequate, but it’s neither a strength nor a weakness of the VB - the dryness, combined with the powerful subbass, does give the VB a certain garage band feel that works well with certain tracks but I think the more lush and liquid mids of the R03 and Eterna work better with bass-heavy earphones.

 If the midrange of the VB reminds me of the RE0 in several ways, the treble is antithetical to that of Head-Direct’s mid-range heavyweight. Though very crisp and extended, it is fairly forward and quite aggressive. The earphones tend slightly towards sibilance, though the reports I’ve read seem somewhat exaggerated - compared to something like the Grado iGi or Klipsch S4, the sibilance of the VB is quite mild. However, the high end of the VB does lack the delicacy and refinement of the RE0s, instead appearing very edgy and a bit metallic. If I had to pin it down, the edgy nature of the VB’s treble reminds me of a certain lower-end Grado that had surprisingly hard treble – namely the older SR80. 

 As for presentation, the VBs do have a fairly wide soundstage with good separation but tend to stray little towards the extremes. They can portray both distance and intimacy but the Eterna does it better, and has a wider dynamic range to boot. Still, the overall sound of the VB is quite uncolored, which is usually a plus in my book, and the VB is less sensitive than the Eterna when it comes to source matching. Lastly, the unique balance of the VB aids in low volume listening as the bass detail, which is usually the first thing to go when the volume of a dynamic earphone is reduced, stays very strong with the VB even at low listening volumes.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – Easily one of the top earphones in its price bracket, the Hippo VB offers a unique sound signature with unparalleled bass depth and sub-bass power, no mid-bass bloat, a crystal-clear but dry midrange, and extended but edgy treble. Listening to the VB is an intense experience and won’t suit everyone’s tastes – it is not the earphone to use while enjoying a glass of fine whiskey in front of the fireplace. For the same reason, the VB is not an easy earphone to recommend for hi-fi newcomers looking for bass-heavy sound – it has neither the warmth nor the thickness usually associated with fun and bassy sound. Both the ViSang R03 and FA Eterna fit the expectations of a fun-sounding IEM better and make better everyday companions for those who value isolation and durability. But for those in search of a raw and visceral sound with maximum bass depth, the VB is very hard to beat no matter the budget.

*Pros: Deep bass, great clarity*
*Cons: Microphonics can be bothersome, strangely thick stock tips, mostly useless tuning system, edgy treble*


*(2C13) Fischer Audio Eterna*


Reviewed Jul 2010

 Details: Mid-range dynamic IEM from Russia-based Fischer Audio
 Current Price: *est $68 *from frogbeats (MSRP: $67.49)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic |_ Imp:_ 18 Ω | _Sens:_ 110 dB | _Freq: _8-22k Hz | _Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single flanges_
 Wear Style: _over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange (2 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, over-the-ear cable guides, cloth carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The housings of the Eterna are fully plastic but feel quite solid despite showing some molding artifacts. The nozzles feature metal mesh filters and the cabling is properly relieved. The cables, while thick and tough, possess some annoying memory character and aren’t as soft as I would like. For me, cable guides are a must to keep the cord in place
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Surprisingly high with stock single- or bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low since over-the-ear fit is compulsory
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Ergonomic angled-nozzle housings are very comfortable for prolonged use, not unlike higher-end Shure and Westone models. However, the Eterna is rather bulbous and as a result not nearly as friendly towards those endowed with less aural real estate as smaller earphones

 Sound *(7.7/10) *– The Eterna is the last earphone in my small group of bottom-heavy test subjects, and arguably the most distinctive. The driving force behind the Eterna’s signature is the bass, which is quite vociferous even when compared to the Hippo VB and ViSang R03. The Eterna’s low end is more conventional in nature than that of the VB, with much of the bass coming in above 100Hz. Though the mid-bass hump of the R03 comes in even higher, the Eterna’s is bigger and gives nearly as much warmth to the midrange while at the same time reaching lower into the sub-bass (though not as low as the VB, IE8, or Atrios). The bass is fairly forward, not immensely accurate, and sounds a bit ponderous on certain tracks but bleeds far less than expected into the midrange and generally remains very enjoyable.

 The midrange of the Eterna is warmed up by the mid-bass hump and sounds a bit veiled and recessed in comparison to the aggressive low end. However, it is still more forward than the mids of the VB/IE8 - two earphones that generally sound more distant than the Eterna does. Like the bass, the midrange has good body and sounds rather lush and sweet, especially compared to the dry and colorless VB, but also lacks the clarity and fine detail of the Hippos and many higher-end earphones. Transparency is at least on-par with other earphones in the price bracket and emotion in vocals is conveyed to the listener adroitly. Similarly, the treble of the Eterna is competent but not outstanding. It is not at the forefront of the sound signature but remains in excellent balance with the midrange. Though the highs are rather clean, they do lack the crystal clarity of more analytical earphones as well as more treble-focused budget entries such as the JVC HA-FXC80 and don’t quite have the extension of the VB or IE8 (but fare better than the rolled-off treble of the ViSang R03). Most importantly, the Eterna's treble is smooth and non-fatiguing in nature, remaining very likable despite the lack of sparkle and microdetail.

 In terms of presentation, the Eterna is a spacious-sounding earphone that loses a bit of air due to the general thickness of the sound. The soundstage is quite wide and has decent depth. It doesn’t have the out-of-the-head feel of the IE8, but for an IEM it is very spatial and engaging - more so than the Atrios, for example. Separation is hindered ever so slightly by the thickness but still quite good for a bass-driven earphone. Imaging is solid and the sound is properly layered. Like most mid-range dynamic IEMs, the Eterna needs a bit of volume to reach its technical best. Personally, I found that my enjoyment of the Eterna’s presentation varies greatly from track to track, perhaps more so than with any other IEM. On extremely fast and busy tracks, I found myself wishing for a bit more clarity and resolution. On slower and/or less complex tracks, the musicality of the Eterna's sound signature starts to show and gives one of the most enjoyable listening experiences in the its price range.

 Lastly, a note on the differences between the two Eterna revisions. The review above is based on the 2nd revision of the Eterna, which is the model currently stocked by Fischer retailers. However, the question on everyone’s mind seems to be whether the rev.2 Eterna is actually a step backwards from revision 1 of the earphone. Luckily, I was loaned a rev.1 model by a fellow Head-Fier for comparative purposes. To my ears the two revisions of the Eterna are extremely similar in sound – they have far, far more in common with each other than either one has with any earphone I’ve previously heard. However, even just noticeable differences can manifest en masse.  My impression of the differences as a whole is that the rev.1 Eterna is something of a rev.2 Eterna gone wild. It is very clear that Fischer Audio attempted to ‘fix’ the significant mid-bass hump of the rev.1 by evening out the response of the rev.2. However, despite being even bassier than the 2nd revision, the rev.1 earphone actually has slightly superior low-end clarity and resolution. It is also not quite as thick-sounding, leading to slightly better air and separation and making the soundstaging seem even more impressive. The newer Eterna does have some advantages of its own – the evened-out response helps bring the treble into focus, making detail easier to pick out, and the midrange has slightly better presence. And then there’s the background hiss, which is quite noticeable with the older model but almost nonexistent with the newer one. Yes, I personally like the Rev.1 earphone a little better still – it just sounds more unique, more special. But the fact that only the new revision is currently available will not stop me from recommending the Eterna in the least.

 Value *(9/10)* – The Fischer Audio Eterna is not a balanced earphone. Its sculpted response was not designed for absolute fidelity and it would make a pretty poor studio monitor. What the Eterna does best is deliver the fun factor in a completely unadulterated form. The sound of the Eterna is big, smooth, and powerful, but at the same time it is both reasonably detailed and quite forgiving. The Eterna makes a great earphone for movies, for the gym, or just for being out-and-about - it doesn’t fatigue and never becomes boring. Truth be told, the Eterna has become one of my favorite bass-heavy sub-$100 IEMs, alongside the ViSang R03 and Hippo VB, despite being oh so very far from my preferred sound signature. Just as importantly, the Eterna does not disappoint in the usability department – it is comfortable, well-built, and highly isolating. If I had one complaint, it would be that the cables don’t stay behind my ears without the cable guides, but I expect that to straighten itself out over time. Either way, having to use ear guides is a small price to pay for a highly enjoyable listening experience at a bargain price.

*Pros: Big, smooth, and powerful sound, good isolation, low microphonics*
*Cons: Voluminous housings, cable guides required to keep cord in place, not for lovers of analytical sound*

 Special thanks to mvw2 for the rev.1 Eterna loan


*(2C14) Grado iGi*


Reviewed Jul 2010



 Details: First budget-oriented IEM from Grado Labs
 Current Price: *$89* from Amazon.com (MSRP: $89)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _24 Ω_ | Sens: _105dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ 45-degree plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-langes_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1.5/5)* – Large bi-flange silicone tips (2 pairs), conical silicone tips, and foamhybrid tips
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The generic housings are similar to those used on the VSonic R02ProII but made completely out of plastic. A rubber sheath covers the rear of the housings and extends into a long strain relief at the cable entry point. The cord is flexible and rubberized but quite thin and very prone to tangling
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Adequate for a ported dynamic IEM, especially with bi-flange tips Slightly prone to wind noise due to side-facing vents

 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Not particularly bothersome but still present when worn cable-down. Sadly neither a cable cinch or shirt clip are present to reduce microphonics
 Comfort *(3/5)* - Since the iGi are missing the usual slew of single-flange tips, they are not very friendly toward those with smaller ear canals. The conical tips are the closest thing to small single-flanges Grado chose to include with the iGi but getting a proper seal with them is tricky. Aftermarket Sony Hybrid tips are highly recommended for anyone having trouble getting a seal with the stock selection. Wearing them over-the-ear can be a bit tricky at first due to the long rubber strain reliefs. The thin and flexible cable compensates for this to an extent

 Sound *(6/10)* – Since I first heard the SR60 several years ago, I’ve been hooked on the Grado house sound and my headphone collection has contained at least one example of the Grado signature. Much of my listening, however, is done on the move – an application for which open-back Grados are particularly unsuited. The idea of a reasonably-priced Grado in-ear - the iGi was particularly attractive to me as a fan of both IEMs and the Grado house sound. Fast forward several months after the release of the iGi and there they were - on my desk and immaculately packaged. What came next were months of agonizing attempts to like the sound. Don't get me wrong - the iGi do several things very well for a reasonably-priced in-ear. But those hoping for SR60-like value for money will be sorely disappointed.

 The bass response is tight and quick, with little rumble but plenty of impact. Low end extension is good but the emphasis is on mid- and upper bass. The bass transitions into the lower midrange with no bleed and the lower mids are quite smooth and natural. Clarity and detail are both good across the range and the iGi manage to reproduce a sense of space, something many in-ears struggle with. The soundstage boasts impressive width and mediocre depth, resulting in a spacious but poorly separated sound.

 The upper midrange is where it all starts to go wrong, however. Despite the significant break-in time give to my set, the iGi are overly harsh and quite sibilant to my ears. I will admit that I have a very low tolerance for such phenomena - even the generally well-liked Klipsch Image S4 lack treble refinement to my ears. Tolerance aside, the iGi simply lack smoothness. There are several very noticeable spikes in the frequency response, which negatively affect the reproduction of certain instruments and vocals. The upper-midrange spikes can cause the crack of snare drums to sound very sharp. Uneven treble around 10kHz causes cymbals on some tracks to be downright piercing. All of this is even more puzzling considering that the promotional materials for the earphones claim an “ultra-smooth top end”, the exact opposite of what I hear. As a result, the iGi are poorly suited for rock and metal, genres usually considered to be the calling card of Grado products. They actually sound best with trance and electronica – vocal-light genres with minimal natural harmonics that benefit greatly from the tight bass, overall clarity, and extended upper treble that the earphones deliver. It should also be said that the innate flaws of the iGi wreak havoc when combined with low bitrate tracks and the earphones are very sensitive when it comes to source matching.

 Value *(5/10)* – The Grado iGi are the company’s first attempt at a reasonably-priced in-ear earphone. Unfortunately, their mediocrity in build quality, comfort, isolation, and microphonics makes it difficult to justify the $90 price tag. However it is sound quality, the eternal centerpiece of the Grado philosophy, where the iGi should fare best against the competition. Sadly, the lack of control in the upper midrange and lower treble makes them sound harsh and sibilant. Don’t get me wrong - there is much to like when it comes to the clarity, detail, and bass. I just wish I could enjoy them for more than an hour before listening fatigue settles in.

*Pros: Good bass control, spacious and detailed sound*
*Cons: Generic design, tangle-prone cabling, poor tip selection, mediocre isolation, harshness and sibilance in the upper mids/lower treble*


*(2C15) **Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO*


Reviewed Aug 2010

 Details: Limited edition TRRS-balanced earphone from HiFiMan/Head-Direct
 Current Price: *$99* from Head-Direct.com (MSRP: $99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω _| Sens: N/A | Freq: _15-22k Hz_ | Cord: _4' L-plug_ + 3” TRS adapter (L-plug)
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single Flanges, De-Cored Shure Olives, Meelec M11+ Short Bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: Straight down or *over-the-ear*

 Accessories *(3/5)* - Single flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sets) silicone tips, shirt clip, spare filters (5 sets), 3” soft balanced->TRS adapter, hard balanced->TRS adapter
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Shells are made of sturdy-feeling metal and identical to those used by the RE0 except for the dark silver finish. Long rubber sleeves protect the cable and the 3.5mm L-plugs on both the standard cable and soft TRS adapter are identical to the one used by the higher-end RE252
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Above average and potentially higher with the right tips, typical for a sealed straight-barrel IEM
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Low when worn over-the-ear, and still not too bad when worn straight down
 Comfort* (4/5) *– Housings are fairly small and light. Fit is quite unobtrusive in either configuration

 Sound *(8.4/10)* – Released to commemorate the three-year anniversary of Head-Direct’s RE line of on-ears, the limited edition RE-ZERO is meant to be an easier-to-drive alternative to the slightly cheaper RE0 with a touch more bass. However, the most unique feature of the ZERO is the fact that it’s wired in a fully balanced configuration utilizing a 3.5mm TRRS plug for use with balanced amplifiers and sources. Not having a balanced source on hand, all of my listening was done in the usual manner (Sansa Fuze, iBasso T4, mini3) using the included soft adapter. Clearly Head-Direct delivered on two of their promises – the 16-Ohm RE-ZEROs are no more difficult to drive than many mainstream IEMs though they do have a bit of scaling headroom left over and they are, indeed, balanced.

 Whether the ZEROs have more bass than the RE0, however, is open to interpretation. I have not heard the RE0s in a long time but still have a pretty good idea of how they compare to my CK10s, which have similar overall balance minus the low-end roll-off. For me, the difference in bass quantity and power between the RE0 and RE-ZERO is little more than barely noticeable – both lag behind the BA-based CK10 in quantity of impact, with the ZERO sounding slightly more filled-out. The ZERO is just as tight and punchy as the RE0s were with a low end that is slightly fuller but make no mistake - the RE252 is fuller still and the folks over at Head-Direct are in no way endangering their flagship with these. While very accurate and fairly detailed, the RE-ZERO presents bass (and indeed everything else) with a delicacy that is lacking in most of the competition and which may or may not appeal to the individual listener.

 Moving on to the midrange, the RE-ZERO greets the listener with the usual clarity and detail of RE-series earphones. The mids are very slightly warm and transparency is good. The midrange of the RE-ZERO is generally extremely competent – I can’t call it forward or recessed, thin or full, wet or dry. I remember finding the mids of the RE0 a bit thin but the RE-ZERO has none of that. Like the bass and treble, the midrange lacks the satisfying crispness of armature-based earphones and sounds all the more relaxed for it. Harshness is also imperceptible to my ears all the way up into the treble. The treble itself is very clear and detailed but rather gentle as far as analytical earphones go. I remember the RE0 being quite effortless and energetic when it comes to treble reproduction and the RE-ZERO doesn’t really make me feel quite the same way – it is more like the RE252 in that regard. An interesting side effect is that the RE-ZERO is affected less strongly by the treble-taming qualities of open-cell (e.g. Comply) foam tips – welcome news for those who find silicone cushions offensive.

 In terms of presentation, the RE-ZERO is again as competent as the RE0 but doesn’t quite run with the top-tier big boys. Its soundstage is only slightly bigger than average and while it does convey both intimacy and space well, it is not the best earphone for those who must be able to pinpoint the source of every sound in the soundscape. The somewhat relaxed presentation of the RE-ZEROs results in relatively hazy positioning despite good overall separation. One last thing to note is that I don’t consider the tonality of the RE-ZERO impeccably realistic compared to truly high-end sets – it reminds me a bit of a grayscale image in that regard – all of the detail is present and everything is instantly recognizable and yet confusing it with reality would take an effort.

 Value *(10/10)* – The Head-Direct RE-ZERO is not an up-and-out upgrade over the legendary RE0. Instead, it is a somewhat more versatile take on the same design with a new-but-not-unfamiliar angle on the Head-Direct house sound. So what does the extra $20 buy over the RE0? Well there’s the obvious – pretty silver shells and a spot in the limited 1000-unit run of the earphone. There’s also the lower impedance, which reduces the power dependence of the earphones, if only slightly, and of course the possibility of running the IEMs in balanced mode should such an opportunity arise. Most important, however, is the sound signature. The RE-ZERO is clearly not designed to appeal to current RE0 owners as an upgrade. Those who were unimpressed with the RE0 or RE252 should probably keep away from the RE-ZERO as well. However, anyone who’s ever heard the RE0 and found them to be slightly too energetic or even piercing at the top or a bit too thin or laid-back in the midrange should like the RE-ZERO more. New users should likewise choose between the two sound signatures but keep in mind that the differences between the two earphones are quite minute.

*Pros: Top-tier sound quality for mid-fi money; compatible with balanced amps/sources
 Cons: Sound signature not for everyone, TRS adapter required for use with most 3.5mm jacks*


*(2C16) Meelectronics M11+*


Reviewed Sep 2010

 Details: Updated version of Meelec’s tiny flagship
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.6’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock short bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Standard single-flange (3 sizes), elongated single-flange (3-sizes), short bi-flange (3 sizes), and standard bi-flange silicone tips, cord wrap, airplane adapter, shirt clip, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – Unchanged from the old M11, and with good reason – the build of the M11 earphones is sublime. The housings are all-metal and feel very solid. The cabling is typical Meelec – long, thick, and flexible, and the hockey stick-shaped 3.5mm plug is adequately protected
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Slim housings lend themselves well to deep insertion and the new fit kit makes getting the perfect seal easier than ever before
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low when worn cord-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – About as good as conventional straight-barrel IEMs get. The housing is tiny but easy to grip when inserting/removing and the extensive fit kit should make finding the right tips quite easy for almost anyone

 Sound *(5.8/10)* – Despite the excellent design and functionality, the sound quality of old Meelec M11 was always just a bit disappointing when juxtaposed with the physical attributes. With the M11+, Meelec attempted to finally give the M11 housings the drivers they’ve always deserved. Though the overall tone of the M11+ is similar to the popular M9 and M6 models, the signature has undergone some drastic changes. First off, the M11+ is rather bass-heavy. The low end is controlled and extended but carries enough impact to rattle the brain loose. When bass is present on a track, it is nearly always dominant with the M11+. The small drivers don’t move much air, which makes the bass impact all the more jarring, and the motion of the driver itself can be carried through the housing on certain tracks. Occasionally I found myself bumping down the lower bands of my equalizer to evaluate the midrange properly, which isn’t to say that the mids are recessed – the M11+ is less V-shaped than the M6 tends to be – but the low end really draws attention to itself and, on rare occasions, can almost completely overshadow the lower mids.

 Though the M11+ is slightly more balanced than the M9/M6, the midrange still gives some emphasis up to the bass and treble (but not enough to be called recessed). It is strong and smooth and the tone is quite neutral, if not particularly natural. I wouldn’t call the mids of the M11+ transparent, either, as they have a thickness to them that may or may not appeal to the individual listener. Clarity and detail, on the other hand, are very good and easily one-up Meelec’s renowned M6 model. Especially on bass-light tracks, the mids and treble of the M11+ impress with their crispness and overall competence. That said, the treble of the M11+, while not often harsh or sibilant, sounds a bit edgy to my ears, not unlike that of the Hippo VB. A lack of dynamic range exhibited by the small drivers doesn’t help and the earphones sound ‘shouty’ on certain tracks. Not a bad sound for pop or electronica but a few of my rock and jazz tracks made me wish for more subtlety. Top-end extension is quite decent and the treble detail stays strong all the way to the roll-off point (in contrast to the Westone 1 I’ve been using lately). The M11+ is definitely no RE0 but it does compete well with the majority of <$80 dynamics when it comes to detail and clarity.

 Much like the sound signature itself, the presentation of the M11+ is not technically perfect but has its own appeal. While the M11+ simply lacks the sheer expanse of something like the Fischer Audio Eterna, soundstage width and depth are both adequate. Stereo separation is excellent and the sound is mostly well-layered, though the bass can step out of line on occasion. I had the chance to switch between the M11+ and the similarly-bassy but slightly cheaper Sennheiser CX281 and the Senns just sound completely flat in comparison, as if all of the instruments are equidistant from the listener. Positioning and imaging suffer slightly from the thickness of the M11+ but I wouldn’t call the earphones congested. Airiness is lacking slightly compared to the entry-level M9 model as well. Tonally, the M11+ is hard to place. It doesn’t sound all too dissimilar from the M6, though the heavier bass balances out the treble brightness better on the M11+. Some instruments don’t sound entirely realistic but using the M11+ exclusively for a couple of days ‘fixes’ this.

 It should also be noted that the specs of the M11+ are deceivingly mild – in reality, the M11+ likes power far more than an earphone with a mere 16Ω of impedance should. Hooking them up to an amp really loosens the drivers up – dynamics and soundstaging undergo the biggest improvements but the whole spectrum becomes just a little bit cleaner and tighter with my mini3 and Music Valley RC-2. I am still vehemently opposed to the idea of purchasing a mid-range amp for entry-level earphones but if you have on lying around, might as well try running the M11+ through it. The difference won’t be night-and-day but it’s noticeable.

 Value *(8/10) *– Engineered to correct the sub-par sound quality of Meelec’s flagship, the M11+ competes well with the aging M6 model in sound quality and boasts the superb ergonomics and aesthetics of the original M11. The sound of the M11+ is best described as ‘concentrated’ – hard-hitting bass, smooth and thick mids, and crisp and edgy treble. For those who really like their bass impact, the sound of the M11+ should be plenty enticing but the earphones just can’t quite match the realism of the pricier competitors from brands such as Head-Direct and Fischer Audio. Those who do settle on the M11+ should be pleased with the massive fit kit as well as the comfort and build of the earphones. As a total package, the M11+ is a worthwhile buy but, being priced into a much more competitive tier than any of Meelec’s previous earphones, it just doesn’t shame the competition with audio prowess the way the M9 and M6 did upon release.

*Pros: Extensive fit kit, excellent build quality, very small & comfortable, high isolation, low microphonics, powerful sound
 Cons: Quite bass-heavy, not entirely realistic tonality*


*(2C17) Phiaton PS210*


Reviewed Sep 2010

 Details: Phiaton’s ‘half in-ear’ dynamic offering designed to sacrifice isolation for a less intrusive fit
 Current Price: *$99* from amazon.com (MSRP: $119.00)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω _| Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _10-27k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sennheiser short bi-flange, Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (4 sizes) and semi-rigid cylindrical carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The PS210 housings resemble a cross between the higher-end Phiaton PS200 and the Yamaha EPH-50. The rear halves of the shells are metal and look similar to the PS200 shells except for the ‘turbine blades’, which are not articulated in the PS210. The driver bulges and nozzles are plastic but feel quite sturdy. The strain reliefs on housing entry are a bit too long and rigid for my liking but do the job. The cable is identical to that of the PS200 and features a metal Y-split and short but flexible molding on the plastic 3.5mm I-plug casing
 Isolation *(2/5) *– As expected, the half in-ear design drops isolation down into mediocrity, though aftermarket biflange tips can be used for a deeper seal
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite low but hard to avoid completely as the PS210 cannot be worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The driver housings are rather large and the earphones aren’t nearly as light as the all-plastic Yamaha EPH-50 but the ergonomic design still works rather well and the four sizes of silicone tips are a welcome inclusion

 Sound *(7.5/10)* – The Phiaton PS210 shares its half in-ear fitment style with the Yamaha EPH-50, which is similarly-priced on paper but can be found far below MSRP in the wild. Listening to both side by side reveals why – the EPH-50 is a decent budget-oriented earphone but it lacks the refinement and technical capability to compete with my top picks in the $60-100 range. The PS210, however, is another story. Keeping in mind that the EPH-50 is a bass-heavy earphone in the grand scheme of things, the PS210 simply has so much more finesse and control that picking between the two is a no-contest proposition. The low end of the PS210 is tight and well-defined. Impact quantity lags far behind the EPH-50 (though not quite far enough for the PS210 to be called bass-light) but the quality is excellent. The bass is quick but rather soft, boasting little rumble or slam but good accuracy and realistic attack and decay.

 The midrange is quite clear, with decent detailing but not much texture. The resulting sound is extremely smooth and quite transparent. The far sweeter mids of the PS210 make the EPH-50 sound like a screaming child – the Yamahas really aren’t capable of great subtlety. The treble is also very smooth and quite well-resolved. The highs are detailed enough to keep up with the better sub-$100 earphones (RE0 being the exception) but never sound sharp or aggressive. Softness is really a recurring theme of the PS210’s presentation. Top end extension is impressive, making the PS210 a rather well-rounded earphone, much to my liking. The way the PS210 presents sound is quite fitting of the half in-ear design. The soundstage is fairly wide and has good depth of positioning and excellent air. Separation is quite decent though these clearly weren’t designed as studio monitors. What they are is an excellent set of relaxation earphones that offer surprising refinement of sound and a very pleasant overall presentation. Lastly, the PS210 is a rather inefficient earphone so hiss out of laptop jacks is not a problem. A dedicated amp is not necessary, however, though the earphones do scale up somewhat.

 Value *(8/10)* – The Phiaton PS210 is a rather unique offering from the Korean audio giant. Designed to fall somewhere between an IEM and a conventional earbud in both fit and isolation, the PS210 is otherwise an extremely competent mid-range earphone. The build quality is quite solid though the earphones are larger than my other half in-ear earphones, the Yamaha EPH-50, and absolutely dwarf the tiny EPH-20. However, those with smaller ears may have some trouble getting a seal. The sound is balanced, refined, and spacious. Those who like an aggressive sound should look elsewhere – perhaps at the EPH-50 – but for a relaxing and yet highly proficient listening experience the PS210 is among the best earphones in its class.

*Pros: Well-designed and comfortable, balanced and spacious sound
 Cons: Low isolation*


*(2C18) JAYS t-JAYS Three*


Reviewed Jul 2010

 Details: Ergonomically-designed mid-range dynamic from Swedish audio house JAYS
 Current Price: *$100 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $99.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq:_ 15-25k Hz _| Cable: _2’ I-plug + 3’ extension_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock Single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories* (4.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (5 sizes), 3.5mm splitter, airplane adapter, extension cord, and plastic protective carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The matte-black rubberized plastic housings are very pleasant to the touch and feel rather solid. The paper filters used by the old j-JAYS have been replaced with a permanent metal mesh and the cable has undergone a slight improvement as well, though it remains somewhat plasticky and still carries a bit of memory character. Strain reliefs are short on cable entry and nonexistent on the y-split but the modular cord provides extra protection from snags and tears
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The ergonomically-styled t-JAYS are shallow-insertion earphones and isolation is only average
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Microphonics are present in the cable and can be bothersome. Though JAYS claims that the t-JAYS can be worn over-the-ear, channels have to be swapped in order to do so. Admittedly, microphonics are nearly non-existent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The t-JAYS are very light but the design leaves a bit to be desired. Though the shells are some of the most ergonomic I’ve seen on a longitudinally-mounted dynamic-driver earphone, the cable exit points on the bottom of the earphone prevent them from being flush and can cause a fair amount of discomfort over time. Over-the-ear comfort is much better but requires stereo channels to be swapped

 Sound* (6.6/10) *– Right out of the box the t-JAYS gave me a small reminder of the signature of my previous JAYS dynamics, the j-JAYS. Like the j-JAYS, the t-JAYS are slightly dark and a bit warm, with good low-end extension and big, hard-hitting bass. Happily, the t-JAYS don’t suffer from a lack of clarity and easily outpace the j-JAYS in overall sound quality from the get-go. The large drivers provide deep and plentiful bass without a loss in clarity. Though the bass tends towards ‘boomy’ rather than ‘punchy’ on certain tracks, the t-JAYS exercise impressive control over their voluminous low end most of the time. Compared to the bass-monster Fischer Audio Eterna, the t-JAYS sound cleaner and more restrained but lack the texture and articulation, as well as the sheer bass weight, that all make the Eterna’s low end so engaging. Compared to the cheaper Sony XB40EX, the low end of the t-JAYS is better in every way except impact and rumble quantity, making the bass of the XB40EX sound like a runaway train on a downhill incline.

 The midrange of the t-JAYS is warmed up slightly by the bass but remains in focus at all times, which is always a pleasant surprise for a bass-heavy earphone. The midrange emphasis of the t-JAYS lags slightly behind the mid-forward ViSang R03 but makes the XB40EX and even the Eterna sound a bit recessed in comparison. The mids are full and very smooth, boasting great detail and clarity. In fact, though the mids are not as thick or sweet as those of the R03, the clarity is arguably better, helped along by the prominent treble lending an extra bit of air to the sound.

 The treble itself is crisp, clear, and in good balance with the midrange and low end. It is a bit hyped-up and can sometimes make already-sibilant tracks more sibilant, though it won’t add any artifacts to well-mastered recordings. Detail and sparkle are not class-leading but competitive in both quality and quantity. Unlike the warmed-up midrange, the treble can sound a bit hard-edged and sterile but softness of note is something only a few budget-oriented dynamics get right,and the t-JAYS are generally very inoffensive, unlike the Hippo VB or and other treble-heavy dynamics in the price range. Upper-end extension is solid and only misses the smallest bit of information at the very top, much like the ViSang R03.

 The presentation of the t-JAYS is best classified as ‘competent’, along with the rest of the sound signature. They are warm earphones but the prominent treble gives a bit of much-needed air to the sound. The soundstage is moderately wide and seems a bit tubular in nature – nothing out of character for mid-range dynamics. It isn’t as enveloping as the 3-dimensional space of the R03 or wide-open presentation of the Thinksound TS02 but does give a good sense of both distance and direction when it comes to sonic cues. Instrumental separation is again not exactly class-leading but perfectly adequate for the type of consumer-oriented sound JAYS seem to be pursuing with their dynamics.

 Value *(7/10)* – After my disappointing experience with the entry-level (and now defunct) j-JAYS, I was really hoping that the t-JAYS would sacrifice some of the style for substance. Happily, JAYS managed to pack in more of both. The t-JAYS Three are mainstream earphones with a mainstream sound signature but the aesthetics and presentation simply go above and beyond. While I’m in equal measure a fan of the no-frills approach to product packaging taken by companies like Thinksound and RadioPaq, opening a package from JAYS for the first time is an experience in itself. The one attribute I will complain about is the over-the-ear fitment – though the t-JAYS are claimed to be designed for both cord-down and over-the-ear wear, the latter, while far more comfortable, requires a swap of the left and right earpieces. Ergonomically-designed dynamic-driver earphones are fairly difficult to come but the t-JAYS are just a tease without a Left/Right channel swap adapter of some sort. Aside from that, the t-JAYS seduce with a wholesome accessory pack, decent build quality, and competent sound, not to mention the 2 year warranty. For those who have ears large enough to accommodate the t-JAYS in the cord-down configuration (or don’t mind reversing channels) and aren’t bothered the modular cord, the t-JAYS have plenty to offer. And, like all of the other JAYS products I’ve come across, they make a great gift.

*Pros: Incredibly presentable package, solid sound quality
 Cons: Over-the-ear wear requires channel reversal; cable is a bit too thin, microphonic, and tangle-prone*


*(2C19) Fischer Audio Silver Bullet*


Reviewed Oct 2010

 Details: Mid-range dynamic from Fischer Audio styled after a bullet casing
 Current Price: *$60* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $67.50)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _12-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(2/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and fabric carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Though the metal shells of the Silver Bullet are extremely sturdy, they have a tendency to oxidize over time from contact with skin oils – a purely cosmetic issue but an issue nonetheless. The plasticky cable is mediocre – though relatively thick and flexible below the Y-split, it is quite thin above the split, hardens over time, and has no sliding cord cinch. Housing-entry strain reliefs take the form of small rubber grommets which may be a threat to the cable over time. The one big positive is the 3.5mm L-plug, which is large and very well-relieved. Lastly, the Silver Bullet can exhibit moderate driver flex with well-sealing tips so those easily annoyed by such noise may want to stay away
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Isolation can be decent with longer tips but the large housings prevent deep insertion with single-flanges, at least for those with smaller ears, resulting in isolation that’s only slightly above average
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – The plastic cable carries quite a bit of noise when worn straight-down but remains silent with over-the-ear fitment
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The metal shells aren’t particularly heavy but the weight is noticeable in the ear. The design is tapered very slightly toward the front but those with smaller ears will still only get a shallow fit. The lack of strain reliefs makes it easy to route the cables over-the-ear and aside from the weight the SB fits like a conventional straight-barrel in-ear

 Sound *(8.1/10)* – Let me start off by saying that the Silver Bullet I got to audition had had its stock filters replaced with those from the Head-Direct RE-ZERO, not for any modding purpose but simply because the stock ones came loose. According to the owner the original Silver Bullet filters are similar to the Head-Direct RE0/RE-ZERO filters in thickness and composition so the sound shouldn’t be substantially affected by the swap. A point to note – we also tried the (mesh) RE252 filters in place of paper ones and the results were horrifying – the Silver Bullets became bright and shrill in the treble and somewhat hollow-sounding in the midrange. Perhaps a bit of foam in the nozzle could be used to balance them out with mesh filters but RE0/RE-ZERO filters work much better.

 As is obvious from the score above, the SB is one heck of a performer as far as sound quality goes. It doesn’t have a particularly distinctive sound signature but what it does, it does very well. The low end of the Silver Bullet is powerful and refined – two qualities that rarely go hand-in-hand in budget-oriented earphones. For my tastes the overall amount of bass that the SB produces is plentiful but the nature of the bass is rather delicate. Impact is well-defined but soft – the bass sort of rolls from one note to the next. The SB is neither the quickest nor the punchiest earphone in its price bracket. It is, however, very well-controlled and not at all muddy. Compare to Fischer Audio’s own Eterna model, the Silver Bullet boasts better bass clarity and superior overall balance, never allowing the bass to step out of line or produce a note out of turn.

 The midrange is warmed up slightly by the soft yet impactful bass but never overshadowed – the low end is maybe a quarter-step ahead of the midrange on the SB but the midrange recession is not as noticeable as with the Eterna. Much more obvious is just how liquid and rich the midrange of the Silver Bullet sounds next to the somewhat terse Eterna (and, by extension, the similarly-priced Hippo VB). The mids are very smooth but still very clear and detailed – easily on par with the other good $60-100 dynamics. The treble, too, impresses with its smoothness (as long as paper filters are in place) and clarity. It carries just the right amount of sparkle without coming across as harsh or sibilant. The last bit of top-end extension isn’t as strong as it is with the Hippo VB or Head-Direct RE0 but the Silver Bullet easily keeps up with its other competitors. On the whole I wouldn’t call the treble of the SB laid-back but it really doesn’t draw attention to itself – ‘wholly pleasant’ is how I can best characterize it.

 The presentation of the Silver Bullet, I feel, deserves a separate mention. The SB is a spacious-sounding earphone that never feels exceedingly distant. The instrumental separation is quite excellent and there’s lots of air around individual instruments. The soundstage not only has good width and depth but also some height, which is rather rare for budget-minded in-ears. It really sounds surprisingly realistic and involving - the presentation of the Silver Bullet is more immediately likeable than that of the Eterna, which has the immersion factor but lacks the cohesiveness of the SB and can take some time for a listener to come to terms with. Overall, the Silver Bullet really doesn’t do much of anything wrong as far as sub-$100 in-ears go. It’s one of the very few budget earphones out there I can’t imagine anyone hating - and that says quite a lot about every aspect of its sound.

 Value *(8/10)* – Taking into consideration only sound quality, the Fischer Audio Silver Bullet is quite simply one of the best bang-for-the-buck sets out there. With impressive bass depth and impact, slightly warm and very clear mids, smooth and sparkly treble, and a well-separated and spacious presentation, there’s a lot to like and very little to dislike about the Silver Bullet. As a total package, however, it is let down by durability and usability issues, the cable being the principal offender. Looking at the build quality of several Fisher Audio earphones, it’s difficult to believe that the SB is in the same price tier as the Eterna and more than twice as expensive as the TS-9002. Those planning to use the SB as day-to-day IEMs would really need to be extra careful with the cord. The sound of the SB is worth the trouble, at least in my book, but in order for it to become the one mid-range earphone that stands above them all, Fischer really needs to re-think the cable and include hard case with the next revision.

*Pros: Incredibly airy and three-dimensional sound, very good all-rounder
 Cons: Mediocre cabling, moderate driver flex, no cable cinch*

 Special thanks to *Inks* for the extended Silver Bullet loan!


*(2C20) Thinksound TS02+mic*


Reviewed Oct 2010

 Details: Latest eco-friendly creation from “Green” IEM manufacturer Thinksound
 Current Price: *$90 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $89.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges, Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), shirt clip, and cotton carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The TS02 is similar in construction and appearance to the two other Thinksound models. Like those of the TS01 and Rain, the housings of the TS02 are made out of wood and aluminum. The rubbery cable, long strain reliefs, and beefy 3.5mm plug are all sourced from the other Thinksound earphones as well. Worth noting is the lack of a sliding cable cinch and mild driver flex exhibited by the TS02
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Again, the isolation of the TS02 is very similar to that of the other Thinksound earphones – limited by the rear vent of the earphones and moderately shallow fit. In addition, mild wind noise is present in windy conditions
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low as the PVC-free cable doesn’t bounce around a whole lot. Wearing them over-the-ear eliminates microphonics but may be undesirable for those who use the microphone
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The fit of the TS02 is very similar to that of the Thinksound Rain as the earphones are very similar in size. They are unobtrusive and remain comfortable for hours but I wouldn’t recommend sleeping in them – the shorter shells of the TS01 are better-suited for that

 Sound *(7.1/10)* – Thinksound promises a warm and balanced sound with the TS02, which is slightly counterintuitive on a technical level since ‘warmth’ implies a certain emphasis on lower harmonics. Pedantry aside, however, the TS02 is a very musical and enjoyable earphone - not a paragon of clarity by any means (at least compared to the similarly-priced RE-ZERO and Ety MC5) but an excellent set for relaxed listening. The bass is deep, full-bodied, and very smooth. They aren’t bass monsters but they provide a weighty punch that reminds me of my much-pricier Monster Turbine Pro Gold. Texture and detail are quite good – not obscured by excessive impact or lack of body. They don’t extend unflinchingly into the sub-bass the way Hippo VBs and FS Atrios do but there’s no lack in rumble or tactility, at least not for my tastes. In addition, the reverb of the TS02 is surprisingly realistic, which may or may not have something to do with the wooden housings.

 The midrange is warm and liquid and lags slightly in emphasis behind the bass. The mids aren’t recessed like those of the FA Eterna, nor are they as forward as those of the ViSang R03. Clarity and detail are good but not class-leading. Like the other Thinksound earphones the TS02 has a certain inimitable lushness to its mids that always keeps me entertained. Other earphones carry more air in the mids but the TS02 doesn’t lag too far behind most at its price point. Moving towards the upper mids, the TS02 remains smooth and controlled – a big improvement over the TS01. Even straight out of the box there’s almost none of the TS01’s harshness and unevenness, just smooth and competent treble with plenty of sparkle and definition. Those who like a more laid-back presentation may want to look at the ViSang R03 or even the Eterna since the TS02 is quite crisp but anyone coming from a Panasonic HJE900 or even Klipsch S4 should feel right at home with the treble quantity.

 The presentation is broad and quite engrossing overall. The soundstage has good depth and width. There’s a thickness of note that prevents them from being as precise as the Ety MC5 or RE-ZERO but positioning and imaging are still pretty good. The TS02 is not the widest or most three-dimensional earphone in its price range but it is one of the most coherent – it never sounds disjointed, which again makes it a good all-rounder with a popular but nevertheless enjoyable sound signature. As a sidenote, I really liked the Rain for movies because of its frequency balance and ‘big’ sound and the TS02 is even better-suited with its rumbly sub-bass and spacious presentation. Many of the highly-detailed in-ears simply draw too much attention to background noise when it comes to movies and gaming but the TS02 balances things out just right and manages to remain absorbing but not distracting, which says something about the earphone’s overall SQ as well.

 Value *(8/10)* – The TS02 is a very pleasant earphone that borrows quite heavily from both of Thinksound’s older models - the TS01 and Rain. The bass impact, weight, and rumble, as well as the warmth and musicality, come straight from the TS01. The smoothness and soundstage come from the Rain. These qualities are exactly what I originally liked about the Thinksound earphones and all make the TS02 a competitive entry among sub-$100 in-ears. Sure, $100 is a bit more than most of the bass-heavy earphones in its class, but it is also the only one that ships with a mic and a cleaner conscience.

*Pros: “Green”; aesthetically pleasing; plenty of bass, sparkly treble
 Cons: No cable cinch, mild driver flex, slightly susceptible to wind noise, a touch pricier than comparable (mic-less) models*

 Full review with comparisons to a multitude of other earphones can be found here


*(2C21) Earjax Lyrics*


Reviewed Nov 2010

 Details: Ergonomically-styled dynamic-driver earphone from US-based manufacturer Earjax
 Current Price: *$80* from earshack.com (MSRP: $119.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 24Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _15-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, stock heat-activated foamies_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (6 sets in 3 sizes), triple-flange silicone tips (2 sizes), heat-activated foam tips, shirt clip, carabiner, 3’ extension cord, and hard clamshell carrying case with removable cord winder
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The distinctive shells of the Lyrics are made of a matte, rubberized plastic and, though some molding artifacts are evident, generally feel quite sturdy. The cable used by the Lyrics is unique as well - sheathed in smooth, clear plastic above the y-split and woven nylon below. The casing on the straight 3.5mm plug is metal, which I’m not usually a fan of, but a flexible rubber grommet protects the cord from its sharp edges
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The Lyrics are vented at the front and don’t lend themselves too well to deep insertion when worn cable-down but isolation is still sufficient
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* –Low when worn cable-down, nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells are fairly bulbous in shape and not quite flush with the ear when worn in the intended, cable-down manner. They aren’t uncomfortable but they don’t just disappear, either. Worn cable-up the Lyrics stay comfortable much longer

 Sound *(6.4/10)* – The flagship of Earjax’s product line, the Lyrics is a ‘pleasant’–sounding earphone: slightly bassy, a bit warm, and quite spacious. Signature-wise the Lyrics sound like a slightly more laid-back JAYS t-JAYS Three. The first and foremost thing noticeable when comparing the Lyrics to the lower-end Earjax Tonic is how much tighter and cleaner the bass is. The Lyrics has far less mid-bass bloat as well as better sub-bass extension. Naturally, more bass detail is revealed by the Lyrics. The bass remains punchy and tactile but never becomes overwhelming, reminding me of the Brainwavz M2 and M3, both in impact and tone.

 The midrange of the Lyrics is free of bass bleed and quite clear. It is laid-back almost to the point of sounding veiled, in stark contrast to the Brainwavz earphones, but still carries good detail. The clarity is compromised slightly by the veil but the smoothness and fullness of the mids are impressive. Treble extension is good and the slightly veiled mids of the Lyrics make the high end seem a bit more prominent. Again, the sound of the Lyrics is ‘safe’ more than anything.

 Perhaps the biggest strength of the Lyrics is the ambient presentation – it’s an earphone with a ‘big’ sound – the soundstage has good width, depth, and even height. The soundstage depth of the mid-forward Brainwavz M2 is clearly inferior and even the higher-end M3 is given a run for its money. Positioning and imaging are good as well, though the laid-back presentation does mean that you won’t get the ‘intimate’ moments with the performer that you may get with more forward sets. It’s a good sound for music that doesn’t hinge on vocals and benefits from a spacious presentation.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – Like the lower-end Tonic, the Earjax Lyrics is a very well-packaged earphone with solid build quality and great overall usability. It is much more refined in sound than the lower-end model but at the same time is pitted against far more serious competition by its price tag. The laid-back sound signature brings about a slight drop in clarity compared to similarly-priced sets such as the FA Silver Bullet but the Lyrics is still a good earphone for those in search of a smooth, balanced, and spacious sound and a good alternative to the pricier JAYS t-JAYS.

*Pros: Excellent accessory pack; balanced, smooth, and spacious sound
 Cons: Slight midrange veil, not the best at portraying intimacy*

 Full review can be found here


*(2C22) Sunrise SW-Xcape v. 1*

Reviewed Nov 2010

 Details: First IEM released by Hi-Fi OEM Sunrise under their own brand
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $79.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: 4’ I-plug
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The shells used by the Xcape are quite similar to the ones on the RE0/RE-ZERO. They are metal and have non-replaceable filters and decent-length strain reliefs. The cable is slightly thinner but also smoother and more flexible than those used by the newer HiFiMan earphones
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – They are comfortable enough when inserted fairly deeply and isolate about as well as a straight-barrel vented IEM can
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cable-down, nonexistent cable-up
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The metal housings are longer than those used by the HiFiMan earphones but tapered towards the front, allowing for deeper fitment and more comfortable insertion (wonder why more manufacturers don’t do this). Comfort is about as good as is possible with straight-barrel in-ears

 Sound *(8.4/10)* – The Xcape doesn’t just share aesthetic themes with the HiFiMan RE0 and RE-ZERO but quite a few aspects of its sound as well. All of the things that made the RE0 a brilliant mid-range earphone are present in the Xcape – clarity, detail, separation, and cohesiveness are all up there with the very best in the price range. As with the RE0, nothing is out of place with or missing from the sound of the Xcape but Sunrise did tune the earphone to set it apart from the HiFiMan models, giving it a warmer and thicker sound and tilting the balance slightly away from the treble.

 The resulting signature is arguably even more balanced than that of the RE0. The bass is quite well-extended, dropping off gently past about 40Hz but still audible at 25. The lows are tight, clean, and very accurate – the bass of the Xcape isn’t particularly impactful or rumbly but it is punchy and well-textured. Up until it begins to roll off the response of the Xcape is fairly linear so those looking for bass quantity over quality will be sorely disappointed, though not quite as much so as with the HiFiMan RE0. The Xcape is still a lean-sounding earphone in the grand scheme of things but in an accurate way that armature lovers will probably find pleasing. In a way its bass reminds me of the crisp and well-measured low-end response of the Klipsch Custom 3 – an impressive feat for a mid-range dynamic.

 The midrange of the Xcape is free of bass bleed but still slightly warm in nature. It is neither forward nor recessed in balance, sounding a bit less intimate than the RE-ZERO, in part due to the ZERO having a smaller soundstage overall. The Xcape is a dry-sounding earphone on the whole but the terseness is most noticeable in the midrange with crisper, cleaner, and less reverberant notes than those produced by the RE-ZERO or similarly-priced Brainwavz M3. The detail retrieval of the Xcape is difficult to fault and it keeps up with the ZERO, beating out the M3 and nearly anything else in the price tier, but the ZERO and M3 both sound softer and more fluid than the Xcape. The ZERO, which has a more upward-tilted midrange balance, gives guitars more bite and female vocals more energy but the highly textured – almost too much so – sound of the Xcape, combined with a more downward-tilted balance, works well with male vocals. The high levels of texturing result in a sound that is almost ‘etched’ but the earphone remains smooth and free of vocal sibilance well into the upper midrange. One odd thing about the midrange of the Xcape is that despite being slightly less forward than that of the RE-ZERO, it is the Xcape’s mids that are more likely to overshadow higher and lower notes on a track and not the ZERO’s.

 The treble of the Xcape is quite a bit more straightforward than the midrange. It is crisp, clear, and detailed – about on-par with the HiFiMan earphones in quality. The Xcape manages to sound analytical but at the same time neither cold nor bright – something very few other budget-minded earphones are able to accomplish. Admittedly, the RE-ZERO is slightly smoother but the difference isn’t great. Presentation-wise the Xcape is a bit more spacious than the RE0/RE-ZERO, which have more well-defined soundstage limits, but still falls within the confines of ‘average’ as far as higher-end in-ear earphones go. In addition, the RE-ZERO still sounds ‘bigger’ and more headphone-like on some tracks. The reason, I think, is that the soundstage of the Xcape, with its greater width and depth, is more tubular in nature while the RE-ZERO manages to cover more area on a plane (i.e. has better front-to-rear and top-to-bottom presence). Separation is very impressive and the crisp, clear treble gives the Xcape plenty of air.

 One last point worth noting regarding the Xcape – though the earphone doesn’t require an amp, it is fairly inefficient and cuts hiss very well. Normal listening levels with the Xcape require 3-4 extra volume notches on my Cowon compared to the Head-Direct RE-ZERO and Brainwavz M3. An amp, even a relatively powerful one, can therefore easily be used to modify the sound signature of the earphones though I can’t recommend purchasing one just for the Xcape. Since the earphone is so well-balanced, a V-shaped amp will result in the earphone attaining a slight v-curve in its sound signature and vice versa.

 Value *(10/10)* – The Sunrise SW-Xcape is a very impressive IEM any way you look at it. In terms of value-for-money it is clearly competition for the RE0/RE-ZERO crowd, not obviously displacing the HiFiMan earphones but rather offering a different flavor of the analytical dynamic signature. The slimmer housings of the Xcape are slightly friendlier towards those with smaller ears (though the RE0 shells are already difficult to fault) and the smooth, low-energy cable stays out of the way, just as it should. The Xcape also proves that the balance of the universe is not upset when a nice carrying case is included with an already high-bang/buck earphone (take note, HiFiMan!). Of course the most important factor is still the sound and on that front I can see personal preferences leaning a listener either way. Personally I still like the more liquid signature of the RE-ZERO better by a hair but could happily live with either earphone – and that’s something I don’t see myself saying about any two other midrange dynamics at the moment.

*Pros: Comfortable; user-friendly; very clear, detailed, and well-separated sound
 Cons: May be too dry or analytical for some*


*(2C23) Brainwavz M3 / ViSang R04*


Reviewed Nov 2010

 Details: The flagship of mp4nation’s Brainwavz line, also known as the ViSang R04
 Current Price: *$90* from mp4nation.net (MSRP: $89.50)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _20Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: Generic bi-flanges, stock single-flanges
 Wear Style:_ Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The shells used by the M3 are very similar to the ones used by the aging Music Valley SP1 with two major exceptions – a metal nozzle is used by the M3 in place of the SP1’s plastic one and the cable doesn’t feel like it will fall apart at any moment. There are still no soft strain reliefs but the thicker, sturdier cable should hold up well nonetheless
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The odd housing shape of the M3 prevents it from being inserted deeply and the earphone is vented at the rear. The resulting isolation is average
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cable-down, nonexistent cable-up
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The plastic process on the side of the housing is meant to hook into the antitragus of the ear but for me it just digs into it painfully. Mercifully they can be worn over-the-ear with longer tips (the housings ‘arms’ will end up pointing outward) and are quite comfortable in that configuration

 Sound *(7.7/10)* – The long-delayed flagship of mp4nation’s Brainwavz line bears a definite sonic resemblance to the lower-end models but leaves little doubt regarding its position in the lineup. Fitting issues aside, I have to admit that the M3 is a very pleasant earphone to use – balanced, poised, and non-fatiguing. The lack of any real sonic flaws is probably its greatest strength – whereas the M2 is a fairly colored earphone with forward mids and mediocre soundstage depth, the M3 manages to steer clear of the more polarizing sound signature elements of its sibling.

 The bass of the M3 is very much to my liking – it is well-weighted and full-bodied but remains under control at all times in contrast to the M2, which can overemphasize mid-bass frequencies on occasion. The low end of the M3 is a bit more substantial than that of the M1 but retains the softer character and roundness of note, at least when compared to high-impact sets such as the Klipsch S4 or crisper, tighter earphones such as the Sunrise Xcape. Compared to the M2, the low end of the M3 is more extended and has a significantly smaller mid-bass hump, resulting in a more linear bass presentation. Those who found even the M2 to be bloated but aren’t willing to move to a ‘flat’ earphone such as the RE-ZERO or Xcape should be satisfied with response of the M3, which is quite natural without sounding lifeless or analytical. Reverb and decay are especially impressive and a fair tradeoff for the slightly relaxed bass.

 The midrange of the M3 is warm and full. The reduced mid-bass intensity of the M3 means that the midrange of the M2 is warmer still but neither earphone makes the other sound ‘off’. The M2 does have the more forward midrange of the two earphones, which gives it more energy as well as some added ‘clarity’ in the vocal range – a good thing since the natural clarity of the M2/M3 isn’t quite on-level with the RE0 or Xcape. The M3 also lacks the texture and microdetail of the Xcape, both in the midrange and treble, but performs admirably next to more mainstream in-ears such as the Thinksound TS02. For the price its mids are undoubtedly competent, however, and the top-tier clarity of the Xcape bartered fairly for a more lush and liquid sound. One similarity that the M3 does share with the Xcape, for better or for worse, is the slight downward tilt in balance as opposed to the more treble-biased RE0 and RE-ZERO.

 Expectedly, the treble of the M3 is deemphasized slightly in comparison to the bass and midrange. It is not absent entirely, however, and detail actually pops out better with the M3 than the M1 and M2. Extension, too, is better with the M3 despite the treble being completely inoffensive and non-fatiguing on the whole. As with the rest of the M3’s signature, the treble is very smooth but not as clear or crisp as that of the more treble-biased earphones out there. The RE-ZERO, for example, has significantly more sparkle at the top and even my FA Eterna comes out ahead for the type of treble response I personally find appealing.

 Presentation, on the other hand, is a definite strength of the M3 and the one area where neither the M1 nor M2 can hold a candle to the flagship. From the very first listen, the M3 sounds ‘big’ – spacious, full-bodied, and quite realistic for an IEM. The soundstage of the M3 has pretty decent width and, unlike that of the M2, good depth. I do feel that the M1 carries more air due to the increased treble emphasis, but imaging and separation are still improved slightly with the M3. Tonally the M3 is not a far cry from the M2 but it is less colored on the whole. Like the M2, the M3 also doesn’t mind a bit of extra impedance and an amp, tightening up slightly and developing better resolution when matched with my 68Ω adapter and mini3. Obviously I still can’t recommend spending $20 on an adapter and $80 on an amp to get a touch more performance out of a $90 earphone but the potential is there despite the low impedance and high sensitivity of the earphones.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – Being partial to the other Brainwavz/ViSang models, I expected to like the M3 but had reservations about its price tag and physical design. In a way, the M3 falls in line with my expectations – it is an earphone to be purchased purely for the sound. There is little doubt that the M3 is on the whole a better-sounding earphone than M2 and M1, but not necessarily better in every specific case. Despite their few flaws, the M1 and M2 are magical, musical, user-friendly and, best of all, reasonably cheap (by Head-Fi standards), and for the non-Head-Fi crowd, the gains made by the M3 may be too subtle to make up the price difference. In the context of this review, however, the M3 competes on a whole different level quite successfully and offers some of the purest audio enjoyment in its price class.

*Pros: Lush, balanced, and spacious sound
 Cons: Average isolation; cable-down fit may not work for some; bassheads and analytical listeners need not apply*


*(2C24) Monster Lil’ Jamz*


Reviewed Dec 2010

 Details: Entry-level dynamic-driver earphones from Monster Cable
 Current Price: *$60* from amazon.com (MSRP: $99.95); $100 for ControlTalk version w/mic
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear *or straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (3/5)* – While very solid at first glance, the Lil’ Jamz really aren’t as well-thought-out as the higher-end Turbine line. The metal housings are quite heavy and rock-solid but the strain reliefs aren’t flexible and have sharp edges. The cable cinch takes the form of a thin piece of metal and seems like it may sever the cable if pulled on. The cord itself is extremely pleasant to use – soft, rubbery, and flexible – but not as thick as those used on the Turbine earphones. The metal casing of the 3.5mm plug has a tendency to come loose but a drop of super glue should fix it
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – As with the Turbines and MD Tributes, the isolation is surprisingly good for a dynamic-driver in-ear
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; very low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings are heavy but very small and tapered at the rear for a comfortable fit. The flexible cable makes it easy to wear the earphones cord-up or cord-down. Unfortunately, tip selection is not comparable to that of the Turbine earphones with only Monster’s narrow-channel single-flanges included. The Lil’ Jamz are also much more sensitive to insertion depth than the Turbines, requiring a deep seal to sound their best

 Sound *(5.9/10) *– Being very familiar with Monster’s higher-end Turbine line, I was expecting the cheaper Lil’ Jamz to take the sound of the $179 Turbine “Originals” in an even more mainstream direction, adding bass and warmth. Imagine my surprise when instead I heard something cold, clear, and bright to the point of shrillness. The surprising nature of the sound is due in part to the included tips – Monster’s narrow-channel silicone single-flange tips work fine with the bass-heavy Turbines but accentuate the treble peaks present in the response of the Lil’ Jamz. With the stock tips, the Lil’ Jamz always sound as if they are sealed improperly – bass-light, piercing, and boasting excessive stereo separation. The solution is to use thicker, shorter tips with a deeper insertion to make the Jamz sound a warmer, smoother, and more intimate – stock Soundmagic PL30 or Meelec tips worked fine for me. Open-cell foam can be used to the same effect but also cuts down on treble extension very slightly. With generic single-flange tips and a deeper seal, the Lil’ Jamz become usable and, at times, enjoyable. The bass is clearly several notches above baseline in quantity but the Lil’ Jamz aren’t bass monsters. Low notes are impactful but soft and rounded – not particularly tight but not flabby, either. Extension is impressive, easily dropping below 30Hz, and there is no mid-bass bloat but the low end of the Lil’ Jamz still yields to the Turbines as well as direct competitors such as the Thinksound TS02 and ViSang R03 in fullness, texture, and detail. However, more mainstream competitors such as the Sennheiser CX300 and Skullcandy FMJ show the appeal of the Lil’ Jamz to the general populace as a fully-fledged upgrade from these consumer-grade in-ears.

 The bass imparts a very slight bit of warmth on the lower midrange but is counterbalanced by the bright and prominent treble. On the whole, the earphones still possess a fairly cool tone. The midrange is slightly recessed and surprisingly clear – perhaps even more so than that of the Turbines – but lacks weight and texture. On the whole the Lil’ Jamz sound fairly thin for a Monster earphone. There is noticeable stridency towards the top of the midrange, which is alleviated slightly with aftermarket tips and putting some hours on the drivers. On occasion the earphones still hit a note jarringly hard for my liking, especially on female vocals.

 The treble, too, exhibits some odd traits, namely ringing and resonance that I haven’t heard from an IEM since I sold my Grado iGi. I found the response so uneven that I ran them through a tone generator. I generally only trust my ears to about 6dB so in order for me to call something a ‘spike’ or ‘hump’ it has to be pretty noticeable, and there are definitely several of those between 4 and 12 kHz, giving the Lil’ Jamz an odd ‘nasal’ quality. On the upside, treble extension is decent with the earphones staying strong into the upper 14 kHz range – on-par with the ViSang R03 and a bit poorer than the Fischer Audio Eterna.

 In terms of presentation the Lil’ Jamz sound distant and overly separated with the stock tips – like two point sources outside of one’s head. With proper tips they can be made intimate enough to be enjoyable but still don’t have the three-dimensional immersion of something like the ViSang R03 - their sound is more tunnel-like in nature: wide but lacking in height and depth. It is well-separated and the excellent clarity helps with the imaging and air. Overall not a bad presentation that reminds me of the Meelectronics M6 but with a more intense coloration - partly the result of the greater ‘sparkle’ of the Lil’ Jamz.

 Value *(7/10)* – Contrary to my expectations, the Lil’ Jamz are not a low-budget version of the Monster Turbine earphones, offering instead a heavily colored, sparkly sound signature closer to something I’d expect from Denon or JVC. To be honest, I’m very surprised at the positive press that the Lil’ Jamz enjoy on sites like CNET and Amazon – the signature is not what I would consider ‘mainstream’. Regardless, the Lil’ Jamz are another decent, if slightly overpriced, earphone from Monster. The discreet design, unobtrusive form factor, and soft cable make them a pleasure to use while out and about and, while the weak plug casing and poor stock tips detract from the value somewhat, Monster does provide a generous 3-year warranty for the Lil’ Jamz and aftermarket tips really aren’t that difficult to find.

*Pros: Comfortable, handsome and understated design, user-friendly cable, impressive clarity & sparkle, 3-year warranty
 Cons: Minor construction issues, needs aftermarket tips, heavily colored sound*


*(2C25) Nuforce NE-700X / NE-700M*


Reviewed Jan 2011

 Details: Flagship in-ear from one of Head-Fi’s favorite brands
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $65); $79 for NE-700X version w/mic
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16__Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.8’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 4.5mm | Preferred tips: Stock single-flanges
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and triple-flange silicone tips, soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The metal housings are very solid and there are no visible seams – a welcome change from the original Nuforce NE-7M, which had a tendency to come unglued. The unique strain reliefs grip the circumference of the shell but can probably be damaged if tugged hard enough. A small red ring around the right strain relief takes the place of L/R indicators. The cable is rubbery, uncharacteristically long, and equipped with beefy metal-and-rubber y-split and an equally beefy metal-jacketed 3.5mm plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The bulky housings prevent deep insertion and are vented like most dynamics, resulting in average isolation
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Annoying when worn cable-down; not bad with over-the-ear fitment
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells are surprisingly large for an earphone with 8mm drivers and won’t work for everyone, at least not with single-flange tips. The rear edge of the shells can push against the outer ear and the edges are fairly sharp but comfort is still decent on the whole

 Sound *(7.3/10)* – Nuforce first entered the IEM arena more than two years ago with the NE-7M and NE-8 models – one a conventional-fit iPhone-compatible earphone with a bass-heavy sound signature and intense tonal coloration and the other an ‘audiophile’ over-the-ear model with impressive clarity and anemic bass. While the NE-8 all but faded into obscurity, the NE-7M thrived, giving rise to a microphone-less offspring (the NE-6) and gaining a large following. It is no surprise, then, that the NE-700X, as the model numbering implies, borrows far more heavily from the NE-7 than the NE-8. Its bass is nice and full, placing plenty of weight on individual notes and contending with the best of the rest in impact and power. Extension is quite good, with a solid bit of rumble at the bottom and nearly as much depth as the Fischer Audio Eterna – enough to satisfy all but the most serious bassheads without losing resolution. Low-end detail and texture are solid as well – the bass of the NE-700X really isn’t the quickest in the realm of <$100 dynamics but it’s not downright bloated, either, and the impact doesn’t obscure low-end detailing. It can be a little excessive at times for my taste but switching to a slightly shallower fit helps balance the NE-700X out.

 There’s a tinge of bass bleed to the midrange but nothing offensive – just enough to give the NE-700X a bit of coloration and warmth. The mids are generally smooth and a bit thick. Overall balance is good but the bass of the NE-700X makes the mids and treble sound slightly recessed. As with the Eterna and the new Meelectronics CC51, the clarity of the NE-700X is good for a thicker-sounding, bass-heavy set but not as striking as that of the mid-forward M2 or treble-heavy RE0 despite the decent overall balance and highly resolving nature of the Nuforces. Detail and texture are good but I feel that the Xcape still reveals more microdetail at the expense of sounding slightly more etched than the NE-700. The treble transition is mostly free of harshness and sibilance once the drivers have a few hours on them. In terms of emphasis the high end is about even with the midrange but treble presentation is slightly laid-back. There is a small amount of sparkle and extension is very reasonable but the NE-700X is softer-sounding at the high end than the Xcape or Eterna and slightly dark on the whole.

 When it comes to presentation, the NE-700X impresses with its consistency and well-roundedness. It doesn’t have the spaciousness of the Eterna or the airiness of the Phiaton PS 20 but still sounds fairly natural. The soundstage has good width and good depth, beating out the similarly-priced Brainwavz M2 and keeping up with the pricier M3. Combined with the smooth and crisp sound signature, the soundstage of the NE-700X makes for an involving, if not very aggressive, experience. That said, I still feel that like the old NE-7M, the NE-700X puts the fun factor first and absolute accuracy second – not that there’s anything wrong with that. Interestingly, the NE-700X is still engaging and enjoyable at lower listening volumes, which is not something I can say for the Dre Beats Tour or even Monster Turbines. Lastly, while the NE-700X does not need an external amplifier, it is a bit less efficient than the average mid-range dynamic - the Brainwavz earphones, Phiaton PS 20, and Eterna all reach high output levels more easily that than the Nuforces.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – Taking the general formula of the ever-popular NE-7M and improving on it in pretty much every way, the Nuforce NE-700X is an extremely competitive earphone, with build quality and all-around usability to match the impressive sound quality, all at a very reasonable price. While the NE-700X doesn’t break any barriers sonically, it combines many positive traits – traits that wouldn’t have scored as highly on their own - in a single and very coherent package, all the while sounding more natural on the whole compared to its predecessor. Personally, I find the NE-700X a bit too bassy for its own good but, as an earphone aimed at the consumer market, perhaps the NE-700X is better off not appealing to me at all.

*Pros: Well-built; deep, impactful bass; well-rounded presentation
 Cons: May be uncomfortable for those with smaller ears; not for those in search of neutrality or balance*

 Special thanks to *slntdth93* for the NE-700X audition


*(2C26) MEElectronics A151 / A151P*


Reviewed Jan 2011

 Details: First armature-based earphone from MEElec
 Current Price: *$75* from meelec.com (MSRP: $74.99); $80 for A151P w/mic & 1-button remote
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: 27Ω | Sens: _111 dB_ | Freq: _15-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flange, stock tri-flange, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and tri-flange silicone tips and zippered clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The housings are plastic but seem quite sturdy. A short sleeve protects the braided cable, which is by far the best thing about the earphones. The cord soft, flexible, and very light – a pleasure to use while out and about. The straight plug is quite generic but has adequate strain relief
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The nozzles are thinner than those of the other Meelec earphones and despite the bulbous housings, the A151 can be inserted pretty deeply. Isolation is very impressive with the bi- and tri-flange tips
 Microphonics *(5/5)* – The flexible braided cable carries very little noise when worn cord-down and none with over-the-ear wear

 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Though the A151 was designed for comfortable over-the-ear wear, it can be worn cable-down as well. Either way the nozzles are angled and of adequate length and the housings are rounded at the front for comfortable insertion. The light and unobtrusive cables helps make the A151 a pleasure to wear

 Sound *(7.4/10)* – The mid-range IEM market has undergone some drastic changes in the past year and half, not the least of which has been the rapid influx of high-performance dynamic-driver earphones. Back when the <150 segment was dominated by the likes of the Westone UM1, Shure E3, UE SuperFi 3, and Ety ER6, single-armature was the de-facto standard in the price range. Despite the relatively high cost and some inherent limitations of single-armature designs, there is still much to like about such setups. Armature-based earphones are rarely lacking in control or clarity and have some practical advantages, such as the ability to function in a fully sealed chamber. All this can be said about the new A151 from MEElectronics, a single-armature design priced to compete with the likes of the Soundmagic PL50, Westone 1, and Ultimate Ears SuperFi 5.

 Starting at the low end, the A151 immediately takes on typical armature characteristics – speed, control, and clarity to match the best earphones in the price bracket. Bass impact is just ahead of the Head-Direct RE0 and on-par with the Sunrise Xcape. Bass depth and extension aren’t competitive with bass-heavy dynamics like the Eterna, Nuforce NE-700X, or MEElec’s own CC51 but control and texture are very impressive. As with most single armatures, the driver struggles to remain detailed at the limit of its sub-bass response but, as with the pricier Westone 1, there is a bit of added mid-bass punch compared to the Soundmagic PL50 or UE SuperFi 5. The slight bit of added punch makes the A151 somewhat warm for an armature and there is a very slight lower-midrange bias. Despite this, the A151 sounds very accurate and carries good detail and texture through both the bass and the midrange. The mids are fairly well-balanced – not too forward, but definitely not recessed. Clarity is similar to the Head-Direct earphones but the A151 lacks the added bit of brightness resulting from the emphasized treble of the RE0 and RE-ZERO. It is also a touch less crisp, producing smoother, thicker, slightly less transparent notes.

 The treble transition is smooth and neither harshness nor sibilance is present. The treble itself is clean, clear, laid-back, and low on sparkle. The detail is there but it presented in a very non-fatiguing way. Compared to the brighter RE-ZERO, the darker A151 is less airy but also less fatiguing. Treble extension is mediocre and treble emphasis is no match for higher-end, more balanced armature-based sets such as the Ety HF3. There is also a bit of grain at the very top, likely resulting from the armature running out of steam at the very limit of its response range, but on the whole the A151 is rather soft-spoken for an armature-based earphone. The soundstage is similar in size to the Sunrise Xcape and Head-Direct RE-ZERO – not large but well-rounded and coherent. Instrumental separation and positioning are similarly good without being unnaturally exaggerated. Looking at the entire hierarchy of BA-based IEMs, the A151 reminds me most of the Klipsch Custom 3 – both have that slightly thick, dry, and full-bodied sound with an aversion to brightness and listening fatigue and a well-balanced presentation.

 Value *(9/10)* – MEElec’s first armature-based earphone may not break any new sonic ground with its dry and accurate sound signature, but it delivers a very wholesome package of sound quality and functionality at a very reasonable price. The cable may just be the best I’ve seen on a sub-$100 earphone and the isolation, microphonics, and comfort all make the A151 a direct competitor of the much-pricier but similarly well-designed Westone 1. Fans of bassy, trebly, v-shaped, or mid-forward sound signatures would probably want to pick something else as the A151 is none of those things but if accuracy and low listening fatigue are priorities, the A151 competes with some of the better earphones in its price range.

*Pros: High isolation, very comfortable with the right tips, excellent cable, solid sonic characteristics
 Cons: N/A*


*(2C27) ECCI PR401*


Reviewed Jan 2011

 Details: Flagship earphone from China-based hi-fi manufacturer ECCI
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $75)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.5’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and large clamshell carrying case (extra Sony Hybrid tips included when purchased from lendmeurears.com)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – As with all of the other ECCI earphones, the housings of the PR401 are made of aluminum and feel quite sturdy. In terms of size, the shells of the PR401 are surprisingly shallow – a bit more than two times smaller than those of the Nuforce NE-700. The thin and narrow flat cable is lightweight and strong enough but slightly more tangle-prone than the thicker flat cables of the Sony XB40EX or Dre Beats Tour
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The short shells of the PR401 may hinder deep insertion for some but I get pretty good isolation for a vented dynamic with the ECCIs
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – The thin and flat cable carries a good bit of noise when worn straight-down but isn’t as difficult to route over-the-ear as with other flat-cable earphones. The included shirt clip helps as well
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are lightweight and quite small. They are also quite short and not at all conducive to deep insertion but the PR401 sounds fine with a shallower fit

 Sound *(7.7/10)* – I’ve been a big fan of the PR-series earphones since before the ECCI brand split off from its parent company, well-known Chinese amp manufacturer Cyclone. After the rebrand, ECCI immediately released the PR100 and PR200 which, while very solid all-rounders, never impressed me as much as the old PR1 and PR2 when it came to overall refinement. The PR300 came later and spiced up the sound of the PR200 by adding a slight bit of boost in the bass and treble regions. Still, the PR300 failed to capture the spacious feel and incredible detail of the old PR1 Pro. The PR401, however, as the model number indicates, adds another level of performance to the PR300 plus a little something on top – a ‘wow’ factor, if you will.

 At the bottom end the PR401 resembles the PR300, offering punchy, emphasized mid-bass falling between the Fischer Silver Bullet and Brainwavz M2 in quantity. The bass response is full-bodied and impactful but at the same time well-controlled and quite accurate. As with the PR300, bass is not the sole focus of the PR401 but there is more than enough to make for a fun listening experience. The bass emphasis does give a very slight bit of warmth to the lower mids but the bright treble acts as a good counterbalance. The midrange itself is slightly recessed next to the bass and treble but is free of bass bleed and retains good detail and clarity. Instruments sound crisp and natural and vocals have decent energy even next to the mid-forward M2. Unlike the even more v-shaped Klipsch S4, the PR401 never sounds thin and remains smooth throughout the upper midrange and lower treble. There is still a good bit of treble emphasis and sparkle is plentiful. The treble is clear, crisp, and detailed, with surprisingly good (though not RE0-good) extension up top.

 My favourite aspect of the PR401, however, is the presentation, which finally re-captures the spaciousness and realism of the old PR1 Pro. The soundstage has great depth and good width and the added treble emphasis gives the PR401 a slightly bright overall tone and an airy feel. As with the old PR1, the PR401 does a good job with layering and positioning, tracking multiple instruments very well for a mid-range earphone without sounding thin or disjointed. On the whole, I would say that the PR401, in both balance and presentation, is the mid-range equivalent of JVC’s much-pricier HA-FX700 woody. Sure, the PR401 doesn’t quite keep up in detail or refinement and lacks both the convincing timbre and incredible positioning precision of the $350 JVCs, but there certainly isn’t a more logical top-tier upgrade to the PR401 than the FX700.

 Value *(9/10)* – The ECCI PR401 is another one for the growing list of truly excellent mid-range earphones coming out of the increasing competition in the market segment. In contrast to the Brainwavz line and Fischer Audio earphones, the PR401 is faintly v-shaped in response, emphasizing bass and treble slightly over the midrange. It also borrows a trick or two from the old Cyclone earphones, bringing to the table a spacious and airy presentation with good separation and impressive imaging. With comfort, isolation, and build quality to match, the PR401 is a very impressive package and a fairly unique alternative to the multitude of excellent choices already on the market.

*Pros: Impressive sound quality & presentation, compact form factor, great all-around usability
 Cons: Cable can be tangle-prone*


*(2C28) MEElectronics SP51*


Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: Mid-range dynamic IEM from Meelectronics boasting ‘Sound Preference’ tuning technology
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _15-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, hard clamshell carrying case, and Sound Preference tuning ports (3 sets)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The SP51 uses metal housings with screw-in rear ports identical to those of the Hippo VB, though Meelec chose to add a mesh filter to the nozzle. The clear cabling is typical Meelec – more supple and yet thicker than the rubbery cords used by Hippo and terminated with a nice L-plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Fairly average due to large rear vent but good enough for daily use
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite good with cable-down wear, nonexistent with over-the-ear fitment
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The SP51s are typical straight-barrel IEMS but the housings aren’t small or rounded at the front, resulting in relatively shallow fitment. The cord is rather flexible and wearing them over-the-ear is easy enough

 Sound *(6.9/10)* – Though the SP51 uses the same housings as the Hippo VB, the 10mm drivers chosen by Meelec are unrelated to those selected by Hippo and result in a substantially different sound signature. The ‘Sound Preference’ tuning system is analogous to Hippo’s ‘Variable Bass’ tuning and consists of three interchangeable screw-in rear ports. Unlike the 1-dot, 2-dot, and 3-dot ports used by the VB, the ports of the SP51 are characterized by their color – black (“extreme bass”), gun metal (“enhanced bass”), and silver (“balanced”). The black port is an open vent and provides the maximum amount of bass (though not as much as leaving the earphones open at the rear, which is not recommended as it hurts definition across the range). I am not a huge fan of the ‘extreme bass’ configuration as it takes away much of the bite of the SP51, reducing bass definition as well as crispness in the other frequencies. The silver and gun metal ports both feature the same vent as the black port but with a different acoustic filter placed in front of it. The silver port, dubbed ‘balanced’ by Meelec, is my favourite of the three. The gun metal one, dubbed ‘enhanced bass’, hypes up the bass and adds some emphasis to the lower treble, The gun metal port will appeal to those looking for more of an M6/M9-type sound from the SP51 and may as well have been called the ‘fun’ port. I feel that it is the silver and gun metal ports that best exemplify the technical capabilities of the SP51 while the black port sacrifices too much resolution to deliver huge amounts of soft-edged impact.

 As with so many mainstream earphones, the SP51 was designed to first and foremost satisfy the bass lover. Even in the balanced, silver-port configuration, the bass of the SP51 is above baseline and slightly more prominent than with the lower-end CX21 model. With the gun metal and black ports, the bass quantity of the SP51 competes with Meelec’s M-series earphones as well as sets like the Sennheiser IE6 and Thinksound TS02 – earphones that I can call ‘bass-heavy’ without thinking twice. Most of the emphasis is on the mid-bass frequencies but low end extension is quite good as well. What’s more interesting is the character of the SP51’s bass. It is soft and round rather than sharp and punchy, giving up a bit of speed and quick attack/decay times for smoothness. It also tends towards ‘boomy’ as the amount of air allowed to escape form the rear vent is increased. In the ‘balanced’ configuration there is slightly more impact to the bass than there is texture and note but since the bass is kept well in check, this isn’t a problem. However, the bass-heavy configuration seems to amplify both aspects equally, resulting in a whole lot of air being moved but only moderate levels of texture. On extremely fast tracks this kind of presentation can get the best of any earphone and the SP51 is no exception – the huge amount of impact can get smeared with the black filters.

 In the balanced configuration, the midrange of the earphones is ever so slightly recessed but the laid-back nature of the bass makes this a non-issue. With the ‘fun’ and ‘bass-heavy’ filters, the midrange recession becomes slightly more noticeable and bass bleed – slightly more likely. However, next to sets such as the Fischer Audio Eterna, the SP51 is still a well-balanced earphone. The boost in the lower midrange with the black and gun metal filters results in vocals being given a bit of extra fullness and microdetail is slightly smoothed-over on the whole. Next to Meelec’s own CC51, the SP51 sounds somewhat distant and lacks most of the warmth and thickness that make the CC51 sound so ‘creamy’. It’s no surprise, then, that the cheaper SP51 can keep up with the CC51 in clarity, though the 6mm microdriver used in the ceramics has better detail and resolution.

 It’s worth noting that that out of the box my pair of SP51s was unpleasantly sibilant – bad enough for me to forego using the earphones completely for the first 50 hours. I can still hear a touch of sibilance out of them on certain tracks with the gun metal-colored rear port but not with the silver one, which I prefer, or the bass-heavy black one. With the silver plate in place, the treble of the SP51 is clear and articulate. It won’t keep up with the armature-based A151 in detail but performs fairly well for a mid-range dynamic-driver earphone, much like that of the UE500 or Thinksound TS02. Extension is reasonably good and the earphones tend to sound airy no matter which tuning ports are used. The overall presentation of the SP51 is spacious and competent. Though the SP51 has better soundstage width than the CC51, it is slightly more vague when it comes to positioning. The CC51, while a bit intimate on the whole, presents music more coherently and three-dimensionally. The SP51, on the other hand, is reminiscent of Meelec’s aging M9 - airy and spacious but wider than it is deep and not pinpoint-accurate. It’s a fitting presentation for the type of smooth, slightly boomy sound that the SP51 puts out but competing with the higher-end CC51 and A151 in accuracy was obviously not on the agenda when the earphone was tuned.

 Value *(8/10)* – Though the Hippo VB may seem like the most natural point of comparison for Meelec’s new tunable earphone, it is quite obvious that the SP51 pursues a slightly different signature – one that emphasizes mid-bass at its bassiest and nothing at its most balanced. Though the ports of the SP51 seem more potent at shaping its sound signature than those of the hippo VB, it still is not quite the 3-in-1 earphone many budget-minded music lovers might hope for. Still, rather than simply pick one port and stick with it, I imagine some may alternate between two of the three. For me, the silver “balanced” port edges out the gun metal “enhanced bass” port slightly, though many will find the SP51 to be lacking impact in this configuration. With the “enhanced bass” port, the SP51 can be considered a less v-shaped and more refined upgrade to the popular M9 and M6 models but the black “extreme bass” port sacrifices too much tightness in favor of bass ‘boom’ in my opinion. Ultimately, the SP51 makes a good entry-level set for those curious to play with the balance of an earphone and, while it won’t quite keep up with the Hippo VB when both earphones perform at their best, the SP51 is cheaper, more readily available, and backed by Meelec’s excellent warranty and customer service. Add to that the superior cable of the Meelec version and the option of having the iPhone-compatible SP51P for $10 more and the SP51 starts to make sense in terms of value-for-money.

*Pros: Tunable sound signature
 Cons: Mediocre isolation, bass tends towards 'boomy' on extreme bass setting*


*(2C29) MEElectronics CC51*


Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: Ceramic-shelled flagship of Meelec’s ‘clarity’ series
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $79.99); $90 for CC51P with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: 18-20k Hz | Cable: _4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _6mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The CC51 uses ceramic housings – a first for an earphone readily available in the US (Nakamichi’s ceramics have been available overseas for quite some time). Slightly resembling those of Apple’s dual-driver monitors, the shells of the CC51 are slim and ergonomic. The 6mm driver sits right in the nozzle (as with the JVC and Hippo microdriver earphones) and is protected by a fine mesh filter. Very mild driver flex is present on occasion. The shells have a nice weight to them and the cable is protected by a short strain relief (which has hard-to-see L/R markings stamped into it). The cable is different from the other Meelec earphones and more similar to the one found on the HT-21 headphone. It’s supple and tangle-resistant but thinner than the usual clear-coated Meelec cords. An L-plug completes the picture. Warning: the earphones ship with a shirt clip already on the cord. Extreme care should be taken when it is removed as its sharp edges can shear the cord quite badly
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – The housings are vented on the side but allow for relatively deep insertion and isolation is quite good overall
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Decent when worn cable-down but the curved shells are less than ideal for over-the-ear wear so microphonics aren’t as easy to eliminate completely as I would like
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The slim, angled shells are very ergonomic and quite unobtrusive. The 6mm drivers of the earphones do need to be inside the ear canal for the CC51 to sound their best so those with extremely narrow canals may want to give these a pass but for everyone else they should be quite comfortable

 Sound *(7.7/10)* – The CC51 is the pinnacle of Meelec’s new ‘clarity’ series and - judging by the MSRP – of the company’s entire model range. From the get-go the earphones exhibit the type of smooth and well-balanced sound that I found so easy to like with the Xears TD100. The bass is tight but impactful, boasting good depth and speed along with realistic attack and decay times. Impact quantity and bass body beat out the lower-end CW31 but fall a tad behind the ECCI PR401 and Xears TD-III, allowing the CC51 to maintain impressive resolution at the low end without being labeled lean or anemic.

 The midrange is warm and very smooth. Like the Xears TD100 and TD-III, the CC51 has a slight thickness of note and generally sounds lush and full-bodied. Though the signature of the earphones may make it seem like the CC51 is a misuse of the ‘clarity’ label on Meelec’s part, the natural clarity of the tiny dynamic drivers is surprisingly good, as it has been with all of the microdriver earphones I’ve tried. Whereas the thickness of the TD100 put its clarity just below competitors from Brainwavz and Hippo, the CC51, despite similar note thickness, ranks just above them. It is also slightly clearer than the entry-level CX21 without sounding nearly as lean – an impressive feat considering that clarity is the CX21’s main focus. Detail and texture are good as well – for a warm-and-smooth earphone the CC51 is quite crisp and resolving. Harshness and sibilance are absent from the upper midrange and lower treble, though with a couple of tracks I felt that they could be pushed over the line at very high volumes. Again reminding me of the Xears TD100, the CC51 is very slightly laid-back at the top – not enough for it to be called recessed or for the overall tone to become dark but enough that the earphone derives no artificial clarity or airiness from the top end.

 The presentation of the CC51 is slightly on the intimate side but very enveloping and coherent. Soundstage width and depth are about average but the CC51 can also portray a bit height – something most earphones struggle with. Layering and imaging are not pinpoint-accurate but still quite precise for a mid-range earphone. Instrumental separation is also good and the CC51 never sounds congested. There’s a slight lack of air and openness in the upper registers due to the laid-back nature of the treble but this is only noticeable next to something like the RE-ZERO – on its own the CC51 does not sound stuffy in the least. The timbre and dynamics of the earphones are also worth mentioning as both are above-average for models in the price range and remind me of the Brainwavz M3 or even Panasonic HJE900s. Overall, I feel that the sound signature of theCC51 is a little better than the sum of its parts, being a clear and yet strangely musical experience. As always, I cannot attribute the timbre, dynamics, clarity, or any other aspect of the signature to the ceramic housings (not unless I had an identical earphone made out of plastic to use as a control) but it just so happens that the CC51 is a solid all-around performer regardless.

 Value *(9/10)* – Over the past three years, we have watched the transformation of Meelectronics from a small electronics supplier with a single decent $20 earphone to one of Head-Fi’s favourite budget IEM manufacturers. The company’s new ceramic flagship, priced to compete directly with some very serious mid-fi performers from companies such as HiFiMan, ViSang, and ECCI, aims higher still. Happily, the 6mm microdrivers used in the CC51 are impressive in their own right, offering plenty of clarity and resolution on top of a smooth, warm, and well-balanced sound signature. The ceramic housings are pleasant to touch, sturdy, and quite comfortable, though perhaps not for those with extremely narrow ear canals, and the earphones are generally quite user-friendly. Those who can live with their few minor quirks are sure to be impressed.

*Pros: Impactful bass, good natural clarity, smooth & balanced sound signature
 Cons: Very mild driver flex; not for those with very narrow ear canals; removing shirt clip may be hazardous to the cable; L/R markings can be hard to see under low light*


*(2C30) Phiaton PS 20*


Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: Phiaton’s mid-range ‘half in-ear’ model
 Current Price: *$79* from amazon.com (MSRP: $99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _31Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _15-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The design of the PS 20 is an interesting one, with a bit of unprotected cable showing between the metal bits past the beefy strain relief and ergonomically-angled asymmetric shells. There is a second, smaller strain relief on the 3.5mm plug but none on the cable’s metal y-split. The cable itself is average in thickness but doesn’t tangle much and handles kinks well
 Isolation *(2/5)* – As with the PS 210, the half in-ear design of the PS 20 drops isolation down into mediocrity, though aftermarket biflange tips can be used for a deeper seal. Phiaton does offer a pricier active noise-cancelling version, the PS 20 NC
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Very low but the PS 20 cannot be worn over-the-ear very easily so cable noise is difficult to eliminate completely
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The Phiaton PS 20 is a ‘half in-ear’ design, meaning that the earphone fits like a conventional earbud but has a nozzle protruding into the ear canal. The earpieces are ergonomic and relatively lightweight but the sheer size of the drivers will make them uncomfortable for those with smaller outer ears. Those who generally find in-ear earphones unpleasant, however, may actually be able to tolerate the PS 20 due to the shallow fit of the earbud-inspired form factor

 Sound *(7.6/10) *– Each model of Phiaton’s in-ear range is unique in its own way. The flagship PS 200 is fast, accurate, and bright. The mid-range PS 210 is spacious, ambient, and very well-balanced. What was missing until now is the opposite end of the spectrum – a warm and bass-heavy in-ear earphone – the new PS 20. The bass of the PS 20 is robust yet pleasant. Low notes are full-bodied and well-weighted, with plenty of impact and a tiny bit of ‘boom’ to the bass. Extension on the low end is moderate, with the otherwise extremely competent bass presentation missing a bit of rumble at the lowest of lows. On tracks that call for it, the bass of the PS 20 can be quite aggressive – easily on-par with the popular Klipsch S4 and Sennheiser IE6 earphones in impact but missing a tiny bit of depth. What’s impressive, however, is how small an effect the punchy bass has on the midrange. The midrange one of the most enthralling aspects of the PS 20’s sound - clean, smooth, and articulate, it is neither too forward nor too recessed in the overall presentation. The bass weight does impart a small amount of warmth on the mids but overall transparency is still impressive – a trait the PS 20 shares with the older PS 210. Vocals come through with authority and surprising clarity for such a large driver – absolutely no veil is present with the PS 20. The texture and microdetail, on the other hand, suffer slightly in comparison to the similarly-priced RE-ZERO and Sunrise Xcape but the greater smoothness of the PS 20 is likely a worthy tradeoff for most users.

 The treble is laid-back and inoffensive. Harshness and sibilance are absent altogether but those looking for a bright and sparkly sound will want to look elsewhere – overall the PS 20 leans towards a darker tonal balance. There is nothing missing from the top end of the PS 20 – detail, clarity, and extension are all reasonably good for the asking price - but compared to the similarly-priced Etymotic Research MC5, RE0, or Xcape treble energy is lower by a significant amount. On the upside, those who find themselves easily fatigued by prominent treble will love the PS 20.

 We come now to the presentation – quite possibly the most impressive trait of the PS 20. Being a half in-ear design, the PS20 doesn’t sound as ‘in-the-head’ as most entry-level in-ears. Instead, the presentation is spacious and more earbud-like in nature. The soundstage has good width and depth and – surprisingly –good height as well. Whereas other in-ears have a tendency to sound ‘tubular’ – i.e. portraying left-right distance well but staying near the horizontal axis at all times – the PS 20 sounds immersive and engrossing. It is neither too intimate nor too distant and the excellent clarity helps it separate out individual instruments. Positioning and imaging are not as precise as with the flagship PS 200 but reasonably good for the price – it can sometimes be difficult to place instruments in the sonic space but the basic distance-and-direction cues are there - it really takes a very congested track to throw the PS 20 off balance.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The PS 20 is yet another impressive entry from the upmarket audio firm, retaining the overall sound quality of the pricier PS 210 but heading in a more mainstream direction with the signature. Aside from having the strongest and most full-bodied bass of Phiaton’s in-ear range, the PS 20 impresses with the clear, transparent midrange and spacious, engrossing presentation. The size of the housings may be an issue for those with smaller ears and the isolation is expectedly mediocre but those who do not mind the form factor are sure to be impressed.

*Pros: Well-weighted and punchy bass; very immersive presentation
 Cons: May be uncomfortable for those with smaller outer ears; mediocre isolation


 (2C31) Pioneer SE-CLX60*


Reviewed Feb 2011

 Details: Mid-range IEM from Pioneer commonly mis-advertised as a ‘Flex Nozzle’ design
 Current Price: *$95* from iheadphones.co.uk (MSRP: $99.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _5-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4.4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down *or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes) and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Though Pioneer advertises the CLX60 as having ‘aluminum housings’, it is only the rear part of the shells that is aluminum. The front half, including the nozzle, is plastic and the protrusion on the side of the housings is made of hard rubber. In addition to conventional L/R markings and the asymmetric design, the CLX60 also has a red filter on the right-side nozzle (a-la Earjax Tonix) for easy identification. The cable is reasonably sturdy and very well-relieved but feels plasticky and has a bit of memory character
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average due to large size and vented housings
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite low with cable-down wear; nonexistent when worn cord-up
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Though Pioneer advertises the CLX60 as a ‘Flex Nozzle’ design (a-la CLX50), the nozzles are actually fixed-angle and don’t flex at all. The only thing that flexes (barely) is the rubber extension on the side of the housings, which is designed to hold the earphones in place and cannot be removed by design. The shells of the CLX60 are quite large (about 40% larger than those of the RE0 in every dimension) but light and not uncomfortable. Though the ear hook does keep the CLX60 in place quite well, my ears get sore in 2-3 hours from the pressure exerted by the housings, partly due to the nozzles not being angled enough for my liking

 Sound *(7.2/10)* – Though the general sound signature of the CLX60 is not all that different from the lower-end CLX50, there is one marked difference between the two – the amount of bass boost present. While the CLX50 can easily be called bass-heavy, the bass of the CLX60 is on-par with reasonably balanced sets such as the Meelec CC51 and Fischer Audio Silver Bullet. I find it interesting that Pioneer chose the CLX50 to be its flagship in the US market and not the more balanced CLX60 but perhaps the decision had nothing to do with the earphones’ sonic characteristics. In general, the low end of the CLX60 is tight and punchy. Compared to the lower-end model, the CLX60 is missing a bit of bass body, sounding leaner and thinner both at the low end and in the midrange. As a result, the overall bass quantity of the CLX60 seems to be only slightly greater than with the HiFiMan RE-ZERO despite the noticeably greater impact.

 On the upside, the bass does not bleed into the midrange, which is crisp, smooth, and very clear. Though the entire midrange is slightly forward compared to the bass, the upper midrange is particularly strong and the overall balance reminds me of the Maximo iM-590. Guitars are given ample bite and most vocals come across with authority. The accentuated upper midrange gives the headphones a bright overall tone and draws more attention to the clarity. Transparency is quite decent as well and there is absolutely no veil over the mids. Unlike the iM-590, which can be a tiny bit sibilant, the treble of the CLX60 smoothes out before sibilance can become an issue all the while maintaining a high level of treble sparkle. Treble clarity and extension are again quite good just as they are with the cheaper CLX50.

 The presentation, too, is reminiscent of the CLX50 – the earphones sound very airy and the soundstage has good width and decent depth. Instrumental separation and positioning are both quite impressive for a mid-range dynamic though there seems to be an inner limit to the soundstage. On the whole, the CLX60 is a competent performer – not neutral by any means but fun in a bright-and-colored way. The sound signature can get tiring after a while and the timbre is a tad off to my ears, putting the CLX60 in the same boat as the Denon AH-C710 and Monster Lil’ Jamz, but after listening to more conventional dynamic-driver earphones, the Pioneers are at the very least unique and refreshing. Also worth mentioning is the bit of background hiss exhibited by the CLX60 with most portable amps and DACs – in daily use the CLX60 appears a bit more sensitive than the specs imply.

 Value *(7.5/10) *– With the SE-CLX60 boasting superior ergonomics, solid overall sound quality, and a more unique sound signature compared to the lower-end CLX50, I can only assume that Pioneer made the CLX50 their US flagship by some freak clerical error. Though the CLX60 has little going for it in terms of accessories, the build quality is good and microphonics are quite low, making the earphone well-suited for day-to-day use. The sound signature is interesting as well – well-balanced and spacious with emphasis on the upper midrange and a brighter overall tone. It's worth noting that the sheer size of the shells may lead to fit problems for some and there are ergonomically-designed earphones with better nozzle angles out there. As a total package, however, the CLX60 is quite good for an earphone from a mainstream manufacturer and may be worth a look for those who don’t have to import it.

*Pros: Far less asinine in design than CLX50; well-built; low cable noise; interesting sound signature and competent sound quality
 Cons: Quite large; meager accessories*

 Big thanks to *jant71 *for the SE-CLX60 loan



*(2C32) Woodees IESW100L Blues*


Reviewed Mar 2011

 Details: Woodees' follow-up to the IESW101B model, featuring updated construction and a 3-button iPhone remote
 Current Price: *$80* from amazon.com (MSRP: $129.99)
 Specs: Driver: Dynamic | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), shirt clip, and velour drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* - Though the housings of the Blues are still the same size and shape as those of the original Woodees, the cheap-looking orange accents have been replaced with sturdier-looking gold-plated metal bits and the wooden part of the housings has been painted black. The Woodees logo, which rubbed off far too easily on the old model, has been moved to the strain relief and L/R markings have been left out completely. The striped nylon-sheathed cord is one of the better cloth-type cords I’ve come across – soft and flexible but prone to neither kinking nor tangling. The cable is protected by long rubber sleeves and features a sliding cinch and gold-plated Y-split and 3.5mm plug. Mild driver flex is present upon insertion
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Limited by the size of the housings but quite decent for everyday use
 Microphonics *(4/5) –* Very mild when worn cord-down, nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings of the Blues are rather large and heavier than those of the old model. Those with smaller ears may have trouble getting a good fit but the earphones can be worn comfortably over-the-ear despite the longer strain reliefs

 Sound *(6.9/10)* – The sound signature of the Woodees Blues is on the balanced side of things – a contrast to the bass-heavy sound produced by the majority of most wooden earphones. The bass trails the similarly-priced Thinksound TS02 noticeably when it comes to depth and rumble, which is not to say that the Woodees are anemic in the least. Their bass is still very present and full-bodied – even a bit boomy at times - with plenty of impact and good clarity and articulation. The TS02 simply has an easier time portraying great quantities of bass due to its longer attack and decay times, which make its low end sound softer and fuller than that of the Woodees. On the other hand the bass of Blues is tighter and punchier – enhanced, but never blown out of proportion. Aside from the balance-oriented Meelec CW31, the bass of the Woodees it is the most linear and arguably the most true-to-source among all of the mid-range wooden earphones I’ve heard.

 The midrange of the Blues is warm, lush, and sweet. Due to their leaner low end, bass bleed is less significant with the Woodees than with the Thinksound TS02, Xears TD-III, and Skullcandy Holua. The detail and clarity are impressive as well, competing well with the Xears TD-III and Brainwavz earphones. The treble transition is quite smooth, with only a touch of unevenness and very mild sparkle. Treble clarity is not quite as spectacular as midrange clarity, especially next to more treble-heavy earphones such as my Sunrise Xcape, but the Woodees do sound nearly as effortless as the TD-III when it comes to extension and really don’t lack treble quantity by my standards.

 The soundstage of the Blues is above-average in size and quite airy. They lack the sheer space and depth of the TD-III but seem to have a cleaner, more well-separated sound due to the greatly diminished bass quantity and leaner presentation. Positioning and instrumental separation are adequate and the Woodees strike a good balance between the more intimate sound of the Skullcandy Holua and the overly-ambient presentation of the Fischer Audio Daleth. On the whole, I find the signature of the Blues to be the ‘safe’ choice among wooden in-ears as they are so unlikely to offend with their balance or voicing. Interestingly, despite being said to share drivers with the new Blues model, the older IESW100B had very noticeable treble harshness to my ears and the new model does not. I can’t be sure whether the difference is attributable to the differences in the design & construction between the two or to variances between individual drivers but the point stands – the grating treble of the IESW100B is not an issue with the IESW100L.

 Value *(7.5/10) *– Though not radically different from the cheaper IESW100B model, the Woodees Blues offer improvements in build quality and aesthetics, as well as a standard mic and 3-button remote. The price increase puts the Blues in direct competition with Thinksound’s TS02+mic model. Indeed, the two earphones perform similarly enough from a functional standpoint but pursue slightly different sound signatures. The Woodees are leaner-sounding and quite balanced next to the bottom-heavy Thinksounds, offering a bit more clarity and airiness to counteract the more impressive bass depth, smooth and lush midrange, and convincing timbre and dynamics of the Thinksounds. The 3-button remote might be a deal-breaker for some but from a sound signature standpoint it will come down to personal preference between the two.

*Pros: Tangle-free cloth cable; good overall build quality; low cable noise, 3-button remote standard, clear and relatively balanced sound
 Cons: No dedicated L/R markings*

 For a longer review of the Woodees Blues, complete with comparisons to the Thinksound TS02, Xears TD-III, Skullcandy Holua, and Fischer Audio Daleth, see here



*(2C33) Monster Jamz*


Reviewed Mar 2011

 Details: Dynamic-driver earphones from Monster Cable slotted below the Turbine and Beats Tour in the Monster range
 Current Price: *$90* from amazon.com (MSRP: $119.95); $100 for ControlTalk version w/mic
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _N/A _| Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (6 sizes), shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – While very solid at first glance, the Jamz really aren’t as well-thought-out as the higher-end Turbine line. The metal housings are heavy and rock-solid but the strain reliefs aren’t flexible and have sharp edges. The cable cinch takes the form of a thin piece of metal and seems like it may sever the cable if pulled on. The cord itself, however, is extremely pleasant to use – soft, rubbery, and flexible. The metal casing of the 3.5mm plug has a tendency to come loose but a drop of super glue should fix it
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – As with the Turbines and MD Tributes, the isolation is surprisingly good for a dynamic-driver in-ear
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; very low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings are larger and heavier than those of the Lil’ Jamz and have a tendency to come loose during physical activity. Fitment depth is very important but the Jamz benefit from a shallower seal compared to the Lil’Jamz and Beats Tour

 Sound *(6.0/10)* – While the cheaper Lil’ Jamz sound like a dilute version of Monster’s Beats by Dr Dre Tour, the Jamz are more reminiscent of the Turbine line with their warm, mid-bassy antics. Unfortunately, the Jamz don’t have the combination of bass depth, detail, and refinement that makes the Turbine earphones special. The bass of the Jamz rolls off earlier than that of the Turbines, resulting in a distinct lack of sub-bass rumble to go with the sizeable mid-bass hump of the Jamz. Interestingly, the Jamz do not benefit from a particularly deep seal, in direct contrast to the Dr Dre Beats Tour. When pushed too far into the ear canal, the Jamz lose bass quantity and body, becoming tinny and slightly anemic in terms of impact. Optimal bass response is achieved with a moderately shallow seal and I actually found myself using larger tips than usual to coax that last bit of impact out of the Jamz. Even when sealed properly, the bass of the Jamz, like that of the Lil’ Jamz lacks a bit of texture and detail. At lower volume levels all that the Jamz produce is a basic mid-bass thump, only differentiating low notes with the volume turned up a bit.

 For an earphone with a fair large amount of mid-bass boost, the Jamz have expectedly warm and ever so slightly muffled-sounding lower mids. In contrast to the Lil’ Jamz, there is no bright and prominent treble to counteract the bassy warmth of the Jamz and the mids are thicker and not as recessed. Fine detail is masked slightly by the thickness – the Turbine does a better of job of keeping its low end in check. Treble response is easily the most laid-back among all of the Monster in-ears, with absolutely no harshness, sibilance, or even sparkle present and noticeable roll-off at the top. Depending on the track, the sound of the Jamz alternates between slightly relaxed and downright dull. The nondescript presentation doesn’t help either – the Jamz are neither as forward as the Beats Tour nor as spread-out as the Lil’ Jamz. Again, excessively deep fitment can affect the Jamz negatively, collapsing the soundstage and making them sound less natural, but even with the best fit I was able to find, the presentation is still a bit vague compared to competing earphones such as the Fischer Silver Bullet and ECCI PR401.

 Value *(6.5/10) *– It would seem that the midbass-heavy balance of the Jamz should appeal to the non-audiophile much in the same way the ever-popular Sennheiser CX300 does – the Jamz are not nearly as aggressive as the Beats by Dr Dre Tour and not as bright or tinny as the Lil’ Jamz. Closer examination, however, reveals that the Jamz commit the worst crime of all – complete blandness. Personally, I still like the Jamz better than the more colored Lil’ Jamz and downright offensive Beats Tour, but there is no denying that their sound signature, light on both treble and sub-bass, has a dull, lifeless quality to it. What gives the Jamz some value is the 3-year warranty and their forgiving nature when it comes to poor recordings and low-bitrate rips. If neither of those things are a priority, I would highly recommend looking elsewhere.

*Pros: User-friendly cable, 3-year warranty, sound is very relaxed and non-fatiguing
 Cons: Minor construction issues, very sensitive to insertion depth, bland-sounding*



*(2C34) Etymotic Research MC5 / MC2 / MC3*


Reviewed Apr 2011

 Details: First dynamic-driver earphone from the pioneer of universal in-ear monitors
 Current Price: *$79* from amazon.com (MSRP: $79); $99 for MC3 with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple-flanges, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Triple-flange silicone tips (2 sizes), Etymotic foam tips, Etymotic Glider tips, replacement filters (1 set), filter replacement tool, shirt clip, and zippered soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* –Though the MC5 is lightweight and for the most part plastic, the outer (colored) bits of the housings are aluminum and the cables are Kevlar-reinforced and well-relieved all around. The slightly rubbery cabling is very flexible and doesn’t stick or tangle and the entry-level Etys really feel like a quality product all around
 Isolation *(4.5/5)* – Typical of Ety earphones, isolation just doesn’t get much better than this
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite low when worn cable-down, nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort* (4/5) *– Depends on the eartips used but the included assortment should fit most people. With a good fit the slim housings don’t contact the ear and the cable exit angle actually works for over-the-ear wear, making the MC5 very comfortable for those who can handle deep-insertion earphones

 Sound *(7.8/10)* – First, a note on tip choice – though the included foamies and Glider tips were very comfortable for me, I settled on the triple-flange silicones and my trusty Shure olives for sonic reasons. The Gliders, though comfortable, seem to accentuate the weaknesses of the MC5 and the stock foamies simply have no comfort advantages over Olives and muffle the top end more.

 Though the dynamic driver used in the MC5 is a departure for Etymotic, the audio engineers managed to develop a moving coil transducer that, for the most part, conforms to the Ety mold. The MC5 really does its best to emphasize no one frequency range above others and covers enough of the frequency spectrum to compete with most earphones in its class. The dynamic transducers move more air than the balanced armatures used in other Etymotic earphones and as a result the low end of the MC5 is more punchy and tactile but not as microdetailed or textured as that of the higher-end ER4 and HF5 sets. The bass is tight, controlled, and reasonably quick for a dynamic driver but lacks the reverb and sheer presence of some of the more energetic-sounding dynamic earphones in the price range. Extension is quite linear down to about 40Hz and drops off gradually beyond that, though the earphones do respond well to equalization. Naturally, the low end of the MC5 is never intrusive and imparts no coloration on the midrange – the MC5 invariably remains calm and composed no matter how bassy the track.

 The midrange of the MC5 comes with fewer caveats than the bass. Due to the extremely balanced nature of the MC5, they can seem a bit mid-centric at times but in reality there’s no particular emphasis on any part of the middle registers. The mids produced by the MC5 are clear, and detailed but not as crisp as those of armature-based Etys. They are not overly defined but still just a touch grainy and quite dry. With a poor or shallow seal, the upper mids can step out of line on occasion, bringing with them bouts of vocal sibilance but with well-fitting tips sibilance is minimal. Moving on up, the treble of the MC5 is accurate and prominent but not hyper-detailed as it tends to be on analytical armature-based earphones such as the Etymotic HF5 and Phonak PFE. Compared to the HF5 and even the RE0, the treble of the MC5 is not nearly as crisp, bright, or energetic, instead appearing softer and more controlled. Like the midrange it can be just a touch grainy and yet isn’t what I would call ‘sparkly’. Still, the MC5 is definitely not for the treble-sensitive.

 Etymotic earphones usually do a good job of separating out individual instruments but aren’t known for providing the most three-dimensional presentation in the world of high-end in-ears, and the MC5 is no exception. The soundstage has good width but only average depth. Soundstage height is also something many in-ears struggle with and the MC5 is no exception - there are earphones that provide a more immersive experience for the money, such as the Fischer Audio Silver Bullet and Head-Direct RE-ZERO. The RE-ZERO is especially interesting since that is the one dynamic most likely to be compared to the MC5 and for me, despite sounding more intimate on the whole, the RE-ZERO has the more natural presentation by a margin – better height, better depth, slightly better positioning and imaging – the presentation of the RE-ZERO is simply bigger and more true to life. The RE-ZERO also has better dynamic range to my ears, though not by much.

 Tonally, the MC5 is not as cold-sounding as the higher-end armature-based Etys, not as clinical. It is also slightly more forgiving of low-bitrate rips and poor mastering but the whole garbage in = garbage out adage still applies on the whole. Clipping, distortion, sibilance – any and all mastering artifacts will be made apparent by the MC5 but not to the same degree as with the HF5 and ER4. It should be noted also that the MC5 is not a very efficient earphone – much less so than the higher-end HF5 or the HiFiMan RE-ZERO. On the bright side, the MC5 cuts hiss well when used with sources that have a high noise floor.

 Value* (9/10)* – The Etymotic MC5 is a capable dynamic-driver earphone from a company that doesn’t normally do dynamics. Like all things Etymotic, the MC5 is well-built, well-packaged, and highly isolating but requires deep insertion to sound its best, which may take some getting used to for those new to Ety earphones. The sound is clear, accurate, and neutral but for many the MC5 will lack the desired bass presence and treble energy. Even those who like a highly analytical sound may find the MC5 slightly boring, slightly inept at conveying energy and excitement. The MC5 is easily more consumer-friendly than the higher-end Etymotic earphones but I can’t help feeling ever so slightly underwhelmed every time I use them. Unless isolation is a priority, I will keep picking the RE-ZERO up out of the drawer every time.

*Pros: Stellar noise isolation; solid build quality; fairly clear, balanced, and accurate sound
 Cons: Deep-insertion form factor takes getting used to; can be slightly boring/lifeless*



*(2C35) Beyerdynamic DTX 71 iE*


Reviewed May 2011

 Details: Entry-level model from Beyer’s recently-refreshed IEM line
 Current Price: *$69* from beyerdynamic.com (MSRP: $69)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _12Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _20-22k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm _| Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and zippered soft carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The housings of the DTX 71 are all-plastic but the molding quality is very good. Strain reliefs are fully integrated and the rubbery cable is sturdy and fairly flexible. The 3.5mm L-plug and y-split are both very well-relieved
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Good for a straight-barrel dynamic
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; nearly nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The DTX 71 is a lightweight straight-barrel in-ear and doesn’t require particularly deep insertion to sound its best. As a result it remains quite comfortable even for lengthy listening sessions

 Sound *(7.2/10)* – The sound of the DTX 71 is mainstream in nature but quite good on a technical level and pleasant overall. The balance is skewed slightly towards the low end, with weighty and impactful bass that is nevertheless not quite as prominent as with the higher-end DTX 101. Bass depth is impressive and control is retained for the most part. If anything, the low end of the DTX 71 actually does a better job of staying out of the way than that of the DTX 101, appearing only slightly boomy next to tight-and-fast dynamics such as the RE-ZERO and Sunrise Xcited. While clearly not intended for analytical listeners, the DTX 71 manages to draw as much attention to the sub-bass than the mid-bass, which helps the midrange stay veil-free.

 The midrange of the DTX 71 is slightly forward, falling just short of the low end in relative emphasis. The mids of the similarly-priced Xears TD-III are slightly more prominent while those of the Xears Resonance are more recessed. Clarity and detail are good though some of the more analytical earphones around the price point have an advantage here. Texture levels are quite good as well and the DTX 71 leans towards a slightly dryer, grittier sound compared to the TD-III. The tone of the earphones leans slightly towards darkness though there isn’t a significant lack of upper midrange emphasis. In fact, my two Beyerdynamic IEMs both boast impressive presence and smoothness across the spectrum.

 Top end extension is moderate – similar to the Brainwavz M2 and Sunrise Xcape IE but not as impressive as with the RE0. Treble presence is quite good but the DTX 71 definitely holds a bias towards the midrange and low end. The presentation is competent – average soundstage size and good layering mean that the sonic cues are all laid out quite well for a dynamic-driver in the DTX 71’s price range. Part of the reason that the presentation is not a definite strong suit of the earphone is the average dynamics – the Sunrise Xcape IE, for example, is noticeably more adept at conveying softness and delicacy. The Beyer IEMs are both slightly shouty in nature, though by no means to a degree where the dynamics become a distraction.

 Value* (8.5/10)* – The DTX 71 iE is a consumer-class earphone from a large Hi-Fi manufacturer. Expectedly, it does very little wrong both when it comes to sound quality and usability. More surprising is that the DTX is priced in accordance with its performance – something I’ve given up on when it comes to mid-level earphones from brands with a full-sized headphone focus. AKG, Grado, and even Sennheiser could learn a thing or two from the DTX 71 iE.

*Pros: Lightweight, well-built, easy to live with; sound quality competent all around; less bass than DTX 101
 Cons: Mesh carrying pouch is underwhelming; cable noise can be annoying with cable-down fitment


 (2C36) Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE / MMX 101 iE*


Reviewed May 2011

 Details: Mid-range model from Beyer’s recently-refreshed IEM line
 Current Price: *$89* from beyerdynamic.com (MSRP: $89);* $125* for MMX 101 iE with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _12Ω_ | Sens:_ 102 dB_ | Freq:_ 10-23k Hz _| Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 5mm | Preferred tips: stock single-flanges
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), cable clip, VOIP/Skype adapter, and zippered soft carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The housings of the DTX 101 are slightly smaller in size than those of the DTX 71 and boast a metal outer shell. Strain reliefs are fully integrated and the rubbery cable is sturdy and fairly flexible. The 3.5mm L-plug and y-split are both very well-relieved
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5) *– Good for a straight-barrel dynamic
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; nearly nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort* (4/5)* – The DTX 101 is slightly heavier than the DTX 71 but the housings are slimmer. Like the lower-end model, it doesn’t require particularly deep insertion to sound its best and remains quite comfortable even for lengthy listening sessions as a result

 Sound* (7.4/10) *– If the low end of the DTX 71 is merely ‘emphasized’ compared to a balanced in-ear such as the RE-ZERO, the DTX 101 can definitely be characterized as a bass-heavy earphone. The bass isn’t quite as authoritative as that of the Fischer Audio Eterna or a well-sealed Nuforce NE-700X but it is at the very least on-par with the Monster Turbine and Thinksound TS02 and can definitely be excessive for my taste. The low end of the DTX 101 is deep and powerful, providing impressive sub-bass presence. It is at least as controlled as that of the DTX 71 but is disadvantaged slightly by the relatively greater bass emphasis of the higher-end model. Next to more analytical presence the bass does sound a touch boomy, as expected, but for the quantity of bass to be contained, the DTX 101 performs quite well.

 The midrange is warmed up by the emphasized low end and comes off slightly more colored than that of the DTX 71. It is also more recessed relative to the low end, though the mids of the Fischer Audio Eterna are more recessed still. The clarity of the Eterna wins out by a hair while detail levels are quite evenly matched between the two. The earphone remains smooth moving into the lower treble. The treble itself is a bit more extended compared to that of the lower-end model and the entire sound signature is a touch cleaner and more airy as a result. The difference is very small, however, and doesn’t affect the tone of the earphone – the greater bass presence ensures that the DTX 101 sounds a bit darker than the DTX 71.

 The presentation of the earphones is similar to that of the DTX 71 with a slightly larger soundstage side and a marginally better layering. Due to improved treble extension, the DTX 101 sounds a bit more open than the 71 but again the difference is small. Darker tone aside, the DTX can also compete in timbre with some of the better dynamics in the price range. Worth noting is the low impedance of the DTX 101 – like the DTX 71, the higher end model was obviously designed with portable devices in mind and an impedance adapter does help with the severe impedance mismatch when plugging either earphone into a computer or full-size amp.

 Value *(9/10)* – Better than any press release or marketing material, the design of the DTX 101 iE shows that Beyerdynamic has taken their new in-ear line very seriously. The engineers obviously did their homework regarding what works and what doesn’t creating an earphone that – save for some cable noise when worn cable-down – provides excellent real-world usability. Though no fancy materials or innovative cabling solutions are used in its construction, the DTX 101, like the similarly-priced Etymotic MC5, should be able to withstand considerable abuse. Sonically, the DTX 101 is not a large step up from the cheaper DTX 71 model, but it is the little differences that help the 101 remain a competent performer despite the bass-biased balance. Personally, I prefer the balance of the DTX 71, but that hasn’t stopped me from enjoying the DTX 101 while out and about.

*Pros: Very well-built; good overall sound quality with heavy bass; skype adapter included
 Cons: Mesh carrying pouch is underwhelming; cable noise can be annoying with cable-down fitment; not as balanced as DTX 71 iE*



*(2C37) Dunu DN-11 Ares*


Reviewed June 2011

 Details: Mid-range earphone out of China clearly inspired by the design of the Monster Turbine Pro Gold
 Current Price: *$75* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est $93)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _N/A_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5) *– Single-flange narrow-channel (3 sizes) and wide-channel (3 sizes) silicone tips, bi-flange silicone tips, zippered carrying case, magnetic-clasp soft carrying pouch, drawstring carrying bag, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– Modeled after Monster’s Turbine Pro Gold, the Ares is surprisingly well-built, with sturdy metal shells, mesh filters, aluminum cable cinch and y-split, and good strain relief all-around. The rubberized cable is a bit stiff for my liking but the attention to detail is very good on the whole
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Quite good with the right tips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The Ares fits much like the Monster Turbine earphones but its rounded shells are smaller and slightly more ergonomic on the whole. While the tip selection is not as impressive as with the Monster models, finding a comfortable fit was not a problem at all

 Sound *(6.8/10) *– The general signature of the Ares is balanced with a bit of roll-off on either end. Overall bass quantity falls north of the Brainwavz M1 but south of the Brainwavz M2, into the range of what I would call ‘slightly enhanced’. The character of the bass is tight-and-punchy more than it is full-and-boomy – quite well-measured for an earphone in its price category but far from analytical. The Ares does lack a bit of bass depth – extension drops off quickly below 40 Hz or so - and sub-bass rumble is oftentimes all but imperceptible but on the whole its bass should satisfy most listeners.

 The midrange of the Ares is a bit on the dry side but offers up surprising clarity and resolution. It is a touch forward in the overall soundscape but clearly not sufficiently so to call the Ares a mid-forward earphone. Bass bleed is nearly nonexistent although the midrange derives a touch of warmth from the bass. Next to the Xears TD-III, the Ares doesn’t appear warm at all. Detail and texture levels are quite good as well and the Ares generally sounds smooth and level. Interestingly, while the midrange clarity of the Ares can easily keep up with established segment leaders from the likes of Xears and Brainwavz on sparsely populated tracks, it tends to break down on busier passages. As a result, the earphones are not particularly well-suited for rock and metal but sound great with acoustic pieces, r&b, soft rock, etc.

 The treble of the earphones is smooth and forgiving. There are no notable treble peaks and about as much sparkle as with a Brainwavz M1, which is to say not a whole lot. Treble quantity is not lacking by my standards but there is a bit of roll-off up top. All in all, the signature of the Ares may not be particularly interesting or unique but it is a good all-rounder. The presentation, similarly, is merely competent. The Xears TD-III is more spacious but the Ares is no slouch, providing pretty good width and average depth. Imaging is quite good on sparse tracks but the earphones get a touch congested as things get busy. An additional factor is timbre realism – the TD-III, among other dynamic-driver earphones, simply sounds more natural than the Ares does.

 Value *(7.5/10) *– Over the past couple of years we’ve seen many great earphones come out of the China’s thriving audio scene. Most of the ones that have achieved prominence on Head-Fi have done so by offering great sound quality for the asking price but the Dunu Ares and Crius take a slightly different approach. These earphones offer nearly unprecedented attention to detail - when it comes to build quality, packaging, and accessories very few competing offerings compare to the Dunu models. It’s a refreshing take on providing value to the end consumer that, unfortunately, is limited by the derivative nature of the design. However, there are few earphones I am looking forward to more than Dunu’s upcoming releases – with slightly different tuning Dunu could easily provide a great value, not just a good one.

*Pros: Well-built, well-accessorized, great attention to detail, competent sound
 Cons: Cable can be noisy when worn straight down, not the best at handling complexity*

 Thanks to *jant71* for the Dunu Ares & Crius loans!


*(2C38) Dunu DN-13 Crius*


Reviewed June 2011

 Details: Mid-range earphone out of China clearly inspired by the design of the Monster Jamz
 Current Price: *$65* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $82)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _N/A_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange narrow-channel (3 sizes) and wide-channel (3 sizes) silicone tips, bi-flange silicone tips, zippered carrying case, drawstring carrying bag, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – Styled much like a squashed Monster Jamz, the Crius is surprisingly well-built, with sturdy metal shells, mesh filters, aluminum cable cinch and y-split, and good strain relief all-around. The rubberized cable is a bit stiff for my liking but the attention to detail is very good on the whole
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Quite good with the right tips but the housings of the pricier Ares can be inserted a bit deeper and provide slightly better isolation
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The Crius fits like most other straight-barrel earphones but the shells are wider and shorter than those of the real Monster Jamz. Since the Crius weighs about the same, the weight distribution is more favorable to the Dunu earphones staying in the ear

 Sound *(6.8/10)* – While its sound is extremely similar to that of the Ares on the whole, the Crius is a touch lighter on the low end than the higher-end model. The mid-bass quantity is a bit closer to neutral and the sub-bass roll-off is slightly more noticeable. As with the Ares, the bass is more tight-and-punchy than full-and-boomy – well-measured but not quite analytical and lacking some depth. The diminished bass quantity means the midrange is less warm and more prominent in the overall balance. Detail and texture levels are good and the midrange is smooth and pleasant. Similarly derived from the Ares are the issues the Crius has with busier tracks – despite being cleaner and more balanced overall, the Crius gets overwhelmed a bit too easily

 The treble of the earphones is smooth and forgiving, just like that of the Ares. There are no notable treble peaks and similarly low levels of treble sparkle. A bit of top-end roll-off is still noticeable but the slightly more balanced sound of the Crius focuses more on the midrange and treble and less on the bottom end. The presentation is a little airier as a result and the sense of space is increased very slightly. Congestion is still an issue as the separation tends to collapse as things get busy. One thing is certain, however - the Crius sounds way better than real Monster Jamz.

 Value *(8/10)* – Priced just below the Ares, the Dunu Crius offers a slightly different sonic flavor on the same overall competency level. Personally, I prefer the more balanced sound of the cheaper Crius but the earphones share far more similarities than differences. As with the Ares, much of the value of the Crius lies in the care taken with the design, construction, packaging, and accessories and of course those looking to compare it to a ‘real’ Monster Jamz may just be very pleasantly surprised.

*Pros: Well-built, well-accessorized, great attention to detail, competent sound
 Cons: Cable can be noisy when worn straight down, not the best at handling complexity*

 Thanks to *jant71 *for the Dunu Ares & Crius loans!



*(2C39) Spider Realvoice*


Reviewed June 2011

 Details: Dynamic-driver earphone from Spider Cable promising realistic audio reproduction for acoustic and vocal tracks
 Current Price: *$78* from buy.com (MSRP: $89.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _5-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down *or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, demo CD, hard clamshell carrying case, and carabiner
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The large housings of the realvoice are made of plastic, though molding quality is quite good. The cable is plasticky and average in thickness. It has a bit of memory and is outfitted with a metal-shelled 3.5mm I-plug, cable cinch, and y-split
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – The realvoice is a shallow-insertion, vented earphone. Isolation is average
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Slightly bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The earphones are similar in design to the Sony XB40EX and work best with a shallow fitment. The plastic housings make the realvoice lighter than the Sonys and the longer nozzle allows them to stay comfortable longer. Worn cable-down they can still come loose on occasion but cable-up with the cord kept in place by the sliding cinch works for me. The large spine of the earphones also makes them easy to insert and remove in a hurry but may make over-the-ear wear tricky for those with smaller ears

 Sound *(7.8/10)* – As the name implies, the realvoice was tuned to correctly reproduce vocal elements in music. In the pursuit of realistic vocal reproduction, Spider Cable created a well-balanced and lively-sounding earphone that works across a variety of genres. The low end of the realvoice is punchy and reasonably controlled. The bass is boosted but the earphones are hardly bass-heavy – overall quantity falls below the Xears TD-III but above the Xcape IE. The Shure SE215 has similar bass quantity overall but its low end sounds slightly more dominant due to the laid-back treble and flatter midrange. Bass depth is good and the presentation strikes a respectable balance between speed and presence. Any more speed and the realvoice would begin to sound lean; any less and it would approach the more lingering note presentation of bass monsters such as the Xears TD-III and Beyerdynamic DTX 101. Is it as clean or resolving as some of the more analytical earphones once things get busy? Not quite, but it doesn’t get washed out, either.

 Meant to be the focal point of the sound signature, the midrange of the realvoice is clear and surprisingly neutral in tone. It is strong but does not dominate the sound signature, taking a step back compared to mid-forward sets such as the TD-III and Brainwavz M2. There is a bit of warmth but it is far from overbearing - the Shure SE215 and Xcape IE both sound warmer than the realvoice. Midrange clarity is quite good – the realvoice is not the most detailed earphone in its price range but it manages to maintain good resolution throughout without sounding dry or grainy. The mids have a slight downward tilt, losing a bit of emphasis towards the top. The mild lower midrange emphasis gives the vocal presentation some fullness – the earphone had to have been tuned this way by design and makes few passes at absolute accuracy. For the types of acoustic and vocal-based music in which the realvoice is said to excel, however, the balance works well enough. The smoothness in the midrange and at the bottom end doesn’t hurt, either.

 The treble carries some sparkle and has good extension at the top, putting it on par with the similarly-priced Shure and Sunrise sets. Compared to the more laid-back SE215, the realvoice sounds crisp and lively at the top. At very high volumes it can get slightly fatiguing due to its mildly peaky nature but during regular listening the earphones remain reasonably smooth and inoffensive. Because the realvoice is not the most transparent earphone, it also tends to be fairly forgiving of mediocre rips and recordings and performs consistently across sources.

 The presentation of the earphones matches up well with their sound signature. The soundstage is well-rounded but gives up some positioning precision to the Shure SE215. The SE215 also boasts a slightly wider space but yields a bit of depth and height to the realvoice. Tonally, the realvoice is a touch darker than the HiFiMan RE-ZERO and Sunrise Xcited but brighter than the SE215, Xcape IE, and Xears TD-III. Worth noting is that the well-rounded nature of the realvoice makes it very well-suited for movies and general use. I like to have a universal earphone in my laptop bag and the realvoice has been a great companion over the past few weeks.

 Value *(8/10)* – Despite being Spider Cable’s very first attempt at tuning a portable audio device, the realvoice in-ear is an impressive all-around performer. Its balanced-yet-lively signature positions its sound quality fairly close to the best sets in the price bracket and the vertical-driver design yields surprisingly decent ergonomics and user-friendliness. The form factor is still far from ideal for active use and the passive noise isolation is average but on the whole there’s not much wrong with the realvoice as an alternative to the established segment leaders. It may not be the most  impressive set from a technical standpoint but it provides a very enjoyable listen for not very much money.

*Pros: Solid all-around performance, inline mic & 3-button remote standard
 Cons: Large housings can be unwieldy*



*(2C40) Dunu DN-16 Hephaes*


Reviewed Aug 2011

 Details: Flagship dynamic-driver model from DUNU
 Current Price: *$95* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: $99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5mm_ | Preferred tips: stock single-flanges
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5) *– Single-flange narrow-channel (3 sizes) and wide-channel (6 pairs in 3 sizes) silicone tips, bi-flange silicone tips, zippered carrying case, soft carrying pouch, cable guides, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– As with all things Dunu, the construction quality is fantastic. The two-tone metal housings feature articulated flames and the finish is excellent all around. Like the Ares and Crius, the Hephaes features metal mesh filters, aluminum cable cinch and y-split, and a beefy right-angle plug. The cable again underwhelms just a bit, being a touch rubbery and stiff and featuring very short strain reliefs on housing entry
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5) *– Very good for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– The metal housings of the Hephaes are not small and a bit on the heavy side but still fit well, helped by the large eartip selection. One potential issue, interestingly, spans from the articulated flames, which have sharp edges and can irritate the outer ear after a while. Wearing them cord-up helps and is necessitated anyway by the microphonics

 Sound *(7.1/10) *– The sound signature of the Hephaes is highly reminiscent of Dunu’s cheaper dynamic-driver model, the Trident. The bass is deep, punchy, and forward. The impact outpaces the rumble compared to the similarly bass-heavy Nuforce NE-700X and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE but there’s plenty of both. Like the Trident, the Hephaes will please bassheads without fully sacrificing fidelity in favor of its hefty low end. The bass could stand to be a touch quicker and, as with the Trident, does bleed up into the midrange a tiny bit but is still pleasant on the whole.

 The midrange is warm and smooth but not as rich and liquid as that of the Trident. Instead it is drier and more crisp, which does help the clarity a little. Still, the clarity doesn’t quite do it for the price of the earphone and lags behind both the Fischer Audio Eterna and the Beyer DTX 101 iE, never mind the RE-ZERO and MEElec CC51. Detail retrieval is good but the note presentation is again just a bit too thick for my liking, hindering resolution slightly. The top end is smooth on the whole but takes less of a step back in comparison to the midrange than that of the Trident. Upper-end extension is good – the Dunu dynamics have no trouble covering the audible frequency spectrum.

 The soundstage is average in size but the Hephaes takes advantage of the available space a bit better than the more intimate Trident does. It is still by no means wide-sounding or airy but the layering is good and elements are well-positioned. Unfortunately, the competition is also much stiffer in the DN-16’s price bracket. The Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE, for example, sounds more open, more airy, and more effortless than the Hephaes and the Sennheiser IE6 has a much larger soundstage. The slightly constrained dynamics of the Hephaes don’t do it any favors on the presentation front, either. The presentation should be satisfactory for most listeners but soundstage junkies will want to look elsewhere for their fix.

 Value *(7/10) *– Offering mostly minor sound quality improvements over the cheaper DN-12 model, Dunu’s mid-range dynamic just doesn’t maintain the same bang/buck ratio with its barely-sub-$100 price tag. While I appreciate the unique styling and superb fit and finish of the earphones, the performance doesn’t really impress next to some of the competition from Spider, Xears, Brainwavz, Sunrise, and even Shure. The inoffensive sound signature of the DN-16 seems forced and sculpted and technical performance suffers as a result. As an overall package, the Hephaes is still good value for money but the price segment is a crowded one and Dunu’s much-cheaper Trident model is already good enough to compete. As it stands, the DN-16 simply isn’t as hot a deal as its appearance may indicate.

*Pros: Very well-built; great attention to detail; well-accessorized; good isolation
 Cons: Cable can be noisy when worn straight down; clarity lags behind segment leaders; not a huge upgrade from cheaper Trident model; may be uncomfortable for some*


*(2C41) Shure SE215*


Reviewed Aug 2011

 Details: Shure’s mid-range dynamic-driver earphone, featuring the same detachable cable system as the rest of the new lineup
 Current Price: *$100* from bhphotovideo.com (MSRP: $99.99); $40 more for Shure CBL-M+-K mic/remote accessory
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _20Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _22-17.5k Hz _| Cable: _5.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Shure gray flex, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Olive foam tips (3 sizes), cleaning tool, and soft clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality* (4.5/5)* – The design and build of the SE215 mimic Shure’s newly-redesigned flagship SE535. The plastic housings are complimented by a beefy detachable cable with a locking and swiveling connector
 Isolation* (4/5) *– As with most ergo-fit monitors, the SE215 isolates a lot with the included Olive and flex sleeves and even more with aftermarket triple-flanges
 Microphonics* (4.5/5)* – The SE215 can only be worn cable-up and microphonics are nearly nonexistent
 Comfort* (3.5/5)* – While the SE215 is ergonomically-designed, fairly small, and quite lightweight, it suffers from the same issue as the SE535 to an even larger degree - the cable connectors are big, bulky, and angled too far forward for my liking and the memory helps make the earphones more difficult to position comfortably. I’m sure they will be comfortable for many but I find the fit awkward compared to the similarly-shaped Westone monitors

 Sound* (8/10)* – Up until a recent month-long trial of the SE530 and SE535, my experience with Shure’s earphones was limited to the old SE115, E3, and E4C models, every single of one of which failed to impress when the time came to gauge sound quality against asking price. Shure’s aging mid-range models simply weren’t keeping up with products from many of the smaller Hi-Fi brands so well-liked around Head-Fi. With the dynamic microdriver used in the SE215, however, things are different – Shure has seemingly decided to attack the competition head-on. Of course, the engineers realized that the $100 SE215 is likely also going to be the model most popular in consumer-oriented retail environments and gave it an impressively consumer-friendly sound signature to boot.

 Clearly emphasized over ‘flat’, the bass of the SE215 is powerful and carries good depth and detail. From memory, the older mid-range Shure models I’ve tried all yield to the SE215 in bass quantity and impact. Impact is plentiful on the whole, though the SE215 is not quite a bass monster. Compared to the Spider Realvoice, for example, the low end of the SE215 is a touch punchier and more detailed but less lush-sounding and liquid. The bass is quite well-controlled compared to bass-heavy competitors such as the Xears TD-III but sounds flabby and slow next to more hi-fi sets such as the VSonic GR07 and Sunrise Xcape v1.

 The midrange of the SE215 is slightly warm and a little dry. It is balanced well enough with the bass, avoiding the mid-forward presentation of Shure’s flagships. Compared to the Xears TD-III and N3i, too, the midrange of the SE215 lacks a bit of authority and forwardness. On the whole, it sounds smooth, textured, and detailed – definitely a strong suit of the earphone. The SE215 surpasses the Spider Realvoice in detail and can be compared favorably to the MEElec CC51, with the Shures coming across slightly thicker and less fluid and the CC51s sounding cleaner and crisper, but not as warm or fleshed-out. The upper midrange of the Shures reveals a bit of grain but nothing distracting or even unpleasant. Really, aside from the balance, the biggest concession of the SE215 to the top-tier SE535 is a complete lack of the open feel of the latter.

 The lower treble of the SE215 is plentiful but the earphone rolls off slightly at the very top and runs out of steam even earlier than that – lack of upper-end resolution and refinement is slightly more noticeable than with the old SE530. Like the SE530, the SE215 lacks a bit of energy and sparkle and can sound dull with some material. What’s there, however, is clean and inoffensive, though the SE215 does lose more resolution still as things get busy. Sibilance and harshness are usually left out of the equation but the signature of the SE215 does seem to encourage higher-volume listening in order to extract all of the detail the earphones have to offer - a problem I don’t have with the similarly-priced HiFiMan and Sunrise in-ears.

 The presentation of the SE215 is pleasant – reasonably wide and with a good overall sense of distance, space, and position. There less depth and height to the stage than with the Spider Realvoice or Xears N3i but the presentation is generally sufficient. The Xears and Spiders tend to be more enveloping and 3D-sounding but the SE215 is by no means flat. The only real limiting factor is a perceived lack of air resulting from the laid-back treble and the subsequently underwhelming imaging. Still, instrument separation is decent and it is doubtful many will be disappointed with the presentation considering the price of the earphones.

 Value *(9/10) *– Perhaps Shure’s most competent mid-range model to date, the SE215 is a thoroughly modern earphone in every sense. Highly isolating for a dynamic-driver set and boasting a smooth and detailed sound signature with an emphasis on bass and mids, the SE215 is poised to be a high-value in the consumer market. However, there are a few issues aside from the dullness of the signature that may make potential buyers wary. One is the unusually high defect rate with early-batch units - Shure doesn’t seem to have all of the bugs of the cable connectors worked out quite yet although complaints about the higher-end SE535, which uses the same connectors, seem far less common. The other caveat has to do with the ergonomics – the stiff memory wire and bulky connectors can get in the way of achieving the perfect fit. Anyone willing to look past these potential issues will be rewarded by a surprisingly competent brand-name earphone at a price that’s almost too reasonable.

*Pros: High isolation, solid sound quality with consumer-friendly signature*
*Cons: Detachable cable can be unwieldy, may be uncomfortable for some users*


*(2C42) HiSoundAudio Crystal*


Reviewed Oct 2011

 Details: First mid-range IEM from Hi-Fi DAP manufacturer HiSound
 Current Price: est. $100 from frogbeats.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: N/A | Freq: _13-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.8’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; trimmed MEElec triple-flanges_
 Wear Style:_ Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (2.5/5)* – Assorted single-flange (3 sizes), Hybrid-style single-flange (3 sizes), and triple-flange (3 sizes) silicone eartips; shirt clip (note: hard clamshell carrying case is included by frogbeats)
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The Crystal may look like a miniature Nuforce NE-6 but it is quite well-constructed, with a 2-piece aluminum shell, rear-mounted strain reliefs, and a sturdy, internally-braided cable a-la ViSang. There is no cable cinch and the cable is terminated with an I-plug but on the whole these really feel like they will go the distance
 Isolation* (4/5)* – Very good, especially with some longer aftermarket tips such as trimmed MEElec triple-flanges
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Not bad when worn cable-down; very low otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The Crystal is one of the smallest straight-barrel dynamic-driver IEMs I’ve come across, rivaling the MEElec M11+, and is extremely easy to fit. The eartip selection is much more modest than with the MEEs and there’s no cable cinch but it is still easy to wear both cable-up and cable-down and remains comfortable for hours on end

 Sound* (8/10)* – In some ways the sound of the Crystal reminds me of my first experience with the brand well over a year ago in the form of the PAA-1 earbuds. I liked the smooth and warm sound provided by the PAA-1, and I like the Crystal even better. The low end of the Crystal is emphasized but well-controlled, falling a bit above the Sunrise Xcape IE on the bass spectrum. There is no lack of presence but the Crystal is no bass cannon - competitors such as the Sennheiser IE6 and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE easily offer up more slam at the expense of sounding bloated and boomy next to the Crystal. While very punchy, the Crystal manages to strike a good balance between impact and control. The 7mm dynamic drivers used by the Crystal are quick and there is no bass bleed, yet most listeners should be pleased with the bass punch and weight the tiny earphone can deliver.

 The midrange of the Crystal is recessed slightly next to the low end but not so much as to throw off the overall balance. It is warm and textured in moderation, with the overall refinement near but not quite at the top among earphones in its price range. The Crystal is no RE-ZERO when it comes to clarity and microdetail, either, but it performs better than most. Similarly, though smooth and pleasant, the sound is not quite as liquid as with the Xcape IE or Fischer Audio Tandem. Clearly it is not for those in search of an extremely crisp and analytical listening experience, nor will it please listeners in search of the most lush and seductive sound available. As a middle ground between the two, however, it works rather well.

 The treble is reasonably crisp and prominent but usually remains smooth and ends up being a bit laid-back at the very top. There is a touch of grain but it is not particularly harsh or unpleasant. That said, it will reveal sibilance present in tracks, unlike the far more forgiving Xcape IE and Fischer Tandem. The presentation is not huge but it is nicely laid out with good separation and decent but not quite pinpoint-accurate positioning. In terms of size, the soundstage is not as large as with the VSonic GR07 or Sony EX600, nor is the sonic space as well-rounded as it is with the Xcape IE, but it competes well with the likes of the Shure SE215 and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE. The presentation is certainly more than good enough for the asking price but I wouldn’t recommend them on its strength alone. Rather, it is as an overall package that the sound of the Crystal makes sense – friendly towards both the mainstream listener and the audiophile with ample warmth and good overall balance but no overblown bass or analytical edge.

 Value* (9/10)* – The HiSoundAudio Crystal is an impressive mid-level in-ear from a company that clearly focuses on more than just sound quality. Simply put, the earphones boast one of the best form factors among all dynamic-driver IEMs, offering excellent ergonomics, high levels of noise isolation, and a well thought-out construction. The performance, too, is nothing to be ashamed of, competing very well with consumer favorites such as the Shure SE215. It is possible to find something that sounds slightly better than the Crystal, especially with a particular sound signature in mind, but as an all-rounder this tiny in-ear is one of the better ones I’ve come across.

*Pros: Small, lightweight, and comfortable; good isolation; very well-built; good overall sound quality
 Cons: N/A*



*(2C43) Fischer Audio Consonance*



Reviewed Oct 2011

 Details: Bass-heavy mid-range earphone from Fischer Audio
 Current Price: *$64* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $64)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1’ 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges; stock single-flanges; *generic bi-flanges*_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or _*over-the-ear*

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Single-flange (5 sizes), bi-flange, and tri-flange silicone tips; hard plastic carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The lightweight shells of the Consonance are plastic but seem like they will hold together well. The nozzle filters are metal and the strain reliefs are sturdy and yet flexible all around. As with the pricier Tandem model, the nylon-sheathed cables are somewhat tangle-prone
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The Consonance is vented at the rear and can’t be inserted too deeply due to the large housings but still manages good isolation for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Bothersome when worn cord-down; good when worn cable-up. The lack of a shirt clip does not help
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The straight-barrel housings are on the large side but the Consonance is lightweight and sounds fine with a shallow fit

 Sound *(7.6/10)* – At the heart of the Consonance is bass, and plenty of it. In terms of low-end power the Consonance is similar to the famed Eterna. It is deep and powerful, elevated most in the mid-bass region and providing tons of impact on demand. Like that of the Eterna, the bass of the Consonance is neither the quickest nor most resolving but it is immensely enjoyable. There is slightly more mid-range bleed compared to the Eterna and a warmer overall sound. The Consonance also sounds a tad thicker and yet the midrange still remains fairly detailed and clean-sounding. The Eterna, as well as the thinner-sounding HiSound Crystal and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE, all have the clarity of the Consonance beat by a hair but the latter two haven’t got as much bass to contend with. The Eterna, meanwhile, sounds a bit less lush and liquid than the Consonance.

 The overall sound profile of the Consonance is slightly v-shaped, with a lot of bass lift and some treble emphasis. The Eterna is flatter through the mids and treble but lacks the sparkle of the newer model. Sparkle is a two-edged sword, however, and the Consonance is slightly more prone to harshness than the Eterna. In terms of presentation, the Consonance manages good width and very decent depth. Despite a tendency to be the warmer and more intimate counterpart to the more open-sounding and refined Eterna, the Consonance can almost match the soundstage size of the older model. It easily beats the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE in soundstaging proficiency and offers better front-to-rear and top-to-bottom space than the HiSound Crystal. Imaging is decent and instruments are well separated and properly layered. The high efficiency of the Consonance doesn’t hurt, either, and it’s not a picky earphone when it comes to sources. This is fun, carefree sound at its very best.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The Fischer Audio Consonance combines booming bass, warm mids, and a touch of top-end sparkle for a powerful, lively sound capable of competing with the renowned Eterna. The more conventional form factor of the Consonance, complete with a lightweight but durable shell and a soft, albeit microphonic, nylon cable makes them friendlier towards a larger portion of IEM users and the inclusion of a hard carrying case – a first for any Fischer model to fall into my hands – is very welcome (though the cable management system can be a bit time-consuming). All in all, the Consonance runs in the same vein as the Eterna and Panasonic HJE900 – fun first, accuracy second. The amazing thing is that by today’s standards, it is merely a very good earphone. Several years ago, this would have been a world beater at the asking price.

*Pros: fun, bassy sound signature with few shortfalls
 Cons: tangle-prone cable; microphonic when worn cord-down*


*(2C44) Phonak** Audéo **Perfect Bass 012*


Reviewed Dec 2011

 Details: Audéo's follow-up to the PFE model, promising a more consumer-friendly sound at a lower price point
 Current Price: *$99* from amazon.com (MSRP: $99); $119 for 022 with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _5-17k Hz_ | Cable: _3.8' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _Jays single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(4/5) *- The plastic housings are just as lightweight as with the old model but the cable has reportedly been improved to prevent the cracking issues common in the first-gen PFE. The build is well thought-out and the cord is smooth and tangle-free
 Isolation* (3/5)* - Isolation is a bit above average with the silicone tips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *- Very low, partly because they must be worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *- The housings are ergonomically-designed and light as a feather. Though neither foam tips nor cable guides are included with the PB, the earphones still simply disappear when worn. As with the old model, the design may prevent the single-flange tips from forming a deep enough seal for some users

 Sound* (8/10) *- The only physical difference between the Perfect Bass and the older PFE model is in the nozzle-mounted acoustic filter - the 012 uses a new green-colored filter while the old PFE shipped with gray filters, which provided a more trebly sound, and black filters, which fleshed out the midrange a bit at the expense of some top-end sparkle and detail. The green filters offer a significantly different take on the Phonak sound signature - the bass, as promised, is markedly accentuated and the entire sound signature undergoes a subtle but noticeable shift. At the low end, the green filters offer sizeable impact - stereotypically light on rumble but well-extended and slightly soft of note for a single-BA setup. Out of the similarly-priced armature-based sets I've heard, only the Dunu Ares and Crius come to mind as bassier options.

 The midrange is smooth and quite a bit warmer than that of the gray-filter PFEs. It tends to sound a bit veiled in comparison and the slight analytical edge that made the smoothness of the old PFEs so special is gone. Similarly, while the green-filtered Phonaks are still quite detailed, they are not at all aggressive in presenting the detail. The difference between them and the Etymotic HF5 is striking, with the Etys sounding much sharper, crisper, and more forward. The Phonaks, on the other hand, are very smooth and extremely non-fatiguing. Towards the top of the spectrum, the sparkle of the gray-filtered Phonaks is gone and so is some of the detail. The overall sound is a touch dark for me despite reasonably good treble extension. Similarly, while the new Phonaks are quite accurate, they just don't sound lively or energetic enough on the whole.

 The presentation afforded by the green filter is similarly refined but not particularly impressive. The soundstage size is average or maybe even a bit below average - the gray filters sound more spacious to me. Separation is still good and imaging is sufficient, suffering slightly from the poorer resolution of the green filters. The biggest issue, however, is the sensitivity of the earphones which appears to be even lower with the green filters than it is with the gray ones. It just doesn't pick up detail as easily as some of the better earphones in the price range and isn't well-suited for those who prefer low listening volumes. With proper amplification it sounds a bit quicker and cleaner but, seeing as it clearly was meant to be used without an amp, I still feel that the low sensitivity will be an issue for some.

 Value *(8/10)* - Phonak's first attempt at a sub-$100 earphone, the Perfect Bass, presents itself as a stripped-down, consumer-friendly version of the PFE at an attractive price point. The new green filters are surprisingly potent in changing the sound but much of the magic of the original PFEs is lost in the pursuit of bass and smoothness. With the improved cable, excellent long-term comfort, and low microphonics, the Perfect Bass is still worth the asking price but they don't quite preserve enough of the armature resolution and clarity of the PFEs to pull clear of dynamic-driver competitors such as the Sunrise Xcape IE. That said, they are pretty much unbeatable value as far as tunable IEMs go when purchased together with a set of the gray filters from the old PFE.

*Pros: Comfortable; low microphonics; 2-year warranty
 Cons: No accessories; gives up much of the wow factor of the PFE; lacks sensitivity*

 Thanks to *monoglycer* for the Phonak 012 loan!


*(2C45) Dunu DN-17 Crater*


Reviewed Feb 2012

 Details: Vented, vocal-oriented earphone from Dunu
 Current Price: *$76* from ebay.com (MSRP: $76)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens:_ 102 dB_ | Freq: _16-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid-style single-flange (stock)_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5)* - Single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and Sony Hybrid-style (4 pairs in 3 sizes) silicone tips, airline adapter, ¼” adapter, shirt clip, cleaning cloth, soft pleather carrying pouch, crushproof metal carrying case, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(5/5) *– The new Dunu earphones continue to amaze with their build quality – solid metal housings boast excellent fit and finish and the new silver cables are terminated by a heavy-duty L-plug. Proper strain relief is present all around. The cable itself is softer and more supple than previous cords but the sheath is somewhat sticky and tangle-prone
 Isolation *(3/5)* - Good for a vented dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *- Bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– The housings are moderately large and on the heavy side. Nozzles are stepped to allow for a deeper insertion but the front edges are wide, sharp, and potentially problematic for those with smaller ears

 Sound* (6.8/10) *– The DN-17 Crater is a vented earphone tuned specifically for vocal performances. It is not surprising, then, that it is the least bass-dominant of all the Dunu models I’ve tried. The low end of the Crater offers good depth and punch, lagging slightly behind sets such as the DN-16 Hephaes, DN-12 Trident, and Brainwavz M2 in overall bass quantity. It is about as controlled as that of the cheaper Trident, sounding a bit bloated at times, but has a slightly more linear curve with less mid-bass emphasis. Note presentation is slightly on the soft side, resulting in a slight lack of crispness and resolution. There is some texture missing as well, giving the bass a somewhat ‘hollow’ feel with more impact than information.

 The midrange of the Crater is prominent and very full-bodied. The balance and presentation are very different from most competing sets - the Crater can easily be called mid-centric despite the ample bass punch and vocals are always upfront, as advertised. Nearly any other earphone sounds thinner in comparison. As with the bass, texture and detail levels are mediocre and the sound has a dull nature, partly due to the underemphasized treble. Indeed, the Crater altogether lacks the increased clarity attained as a result of treble emphasis, relying entirely on natural clarity for intelligibility. The results of not having a very dark background are mixed, sounding excellent on vocal-centric tracks but reverting to an ‘AM radio’ feel with genres relying on heavy instrumentation.

 The top end of the Crater is dull and lacks emphasis compared even to the similarly-priced DN-16 Hephaes. Treble extension isn’t bad but detail levels are only on-par with the cheaper DN-12 Trident and there isn’t much crispness or sparkle to the top end. Harshness and sibilance are absent but the treble clearly take a back seat, resulting in a distinct lack of energy. Despite this the Crater has good air that compliments its full, fluid sound well.

 The presentation of the Crater is generally forward, especially in the midrange, but the softer note character prevents it from sounding aggressive. The headstage is larger than average and while the positioning is on the vague side, the Crater never sounds congested. Compared to the Dunu Hephaes, the Crater sounds large and full, more of an ‘in-ear speaker’ to the Hephaes’ ‘in-ear earphone’. Interestingly, the Crater is also more sensitive than the previous Dunu dynamics and has a tendency to pick up electrical noise.

Updated January 2013* (7.2/10)*

 An updated version of the Crater has replaced the one I originally reviewed, boasting the same design with improved sound tuning. The new tuning is a major step forward, in essence applying a v-shaped filter over the somewhat mid-centric sound of the original Crater. The resulting sound very different from the original – dynamic and engaging in ways that make the old tuning seem dull and muffled.

 The bass, for one, no longer sounds sluggish and uninformative; instead, it is punchy and dynamic, with better extension compared to the original Crater. The overall sound is more balanced and less mid-centric. Clarity is improved and vocals boast better intelligibility despite the lack of midrange emphasis. Added treble presence creates more natural treble energy for a more realistic sound. The less relaxed top end does cause the new Crater to sound less smooth and forgiving, but the slight increase in the potential for sibilance is a worthy tradeoff.

 The presentation is where the biggest gains are made – the new Crater is more dynamic and has better soundstage depth and layering. The presentation is now very good overall – broad, yet boasting decent imaging. All in all, the new Crater is notably more competitive when it comes to audio quality – unquestionably an all-around improvement that justifies the price tag.

 Value *(8/10) *– The DN-17 Crater carries on Dunu’s trend of offering unparalleled build quality and attention to detail at a low price, but does so with a new, more restrained design. While the original tuning was best suited for those who usually listen with a ‘vocal’ EQ preset applied, the new (as of late 2012) tuning makes the Crater easy to recommend over its DN-18 Hawkeye counterpart.

*Pros: Very well-built and well-accessorized; full and spacious sound
 Cons: Cable can be noisy when worn straight down*


*(2C46) Dunu DN-18 Hawkeye*


Reviewed Feb 2012

 Details: Sealed sibling of the DN-17 Crater
 Current Price:* $60* from ebay (MSRP: $60)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω _| Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid-style single-flange (stock)_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5) *- Single-flange (3 sizes), bi-flange, and Hybrid-style (4 pairs in 3 sizes) silicone tips, airline adapter, ¼” adapter, shirt clip, cleaning cloth, soft pleather carrying pouch, zippered clamshell carrying case, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(5/5) *- The new Dunu earphones continue to amaze with their build quality – solid metal housings boast excellent fit and finish and the new silver cables are terminated by a heavy-duty L-plug. Proper strain relief is present all around. The cable itself is softer and more supple than previous cords but the sheath is somewhat sticky and tangle-prone
 Isolation *(3/5)* - Good, somewhat limited by the shallow insertion depth
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* - Bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *- The housings are moderately large and on the heavy side. Nozzles are stepped to allow for a deeper insertion but the front edges are wide, sharp, and potentially problematic for those with smaller ears

 Sound *(6.9/10) *– Dunu’s DN-18 Hawkeye is the closed-back sibling of the DN-17 Crater. Unsurprisingly, the two earphones are very similar in overall performance,/strong with the Hawkeye’s being a compromise between the uniquely vocal-centric sound of the Crater and the more consumer-oriented sound of Dunu’s previous dynamic-driver models. While the bass of the Crater is nice and punchy, the Hawkeye offers better depth and more rumble, as well as a touch more impact overall. Note presentation is still a bit soft, resulting in a slight lack of crispness, texture, and resolution, but the greater bass quantity of the Hawkeye makes this less unusual.

 The midrange of the Hawkeye, like that of the Crater, is forward and full-sounding. There is more warmth as a result of slightly greater bass bleed but on the whole the bass-midrange balance of the Hawkeye is more even. Detail levels and clarity are average at best but the Hawkeye seems to be a bit more resolving and a touch more crisp, especially when things get busy. There is less upper midrange emphasis with the Hawkeye, though the top end is just as laid-back overall as it is with the Crater. Treble extension is decent but there just isn’t much crispness or sparkle to the top end, resulting in a lack of energy and realism.

 The presentation of the Hawkeye, too, is similar to that of the Crater, which is actually more impressive coming from its sealed-back form factor. The soundstage is still rather large and never congested, though the Crater has a touch more air and space. The Hawkeye still sounds ‘bigger’ than the DN-16 Hephaes and most other sealed IEMs, especially those normally found at its price point. Like the Crater, it is also oddly predisposed towards picking up electrical noise - a potential annoyance with sub-par sources such as laptops.

Updated January 2013* (7/10)*

 An updated version of the Hawkeye has replaced the one I originally reviewed. As with the Crater, the new tuning strives for a more balanced sound, though the changes are not as drastic with the Hawkeye. While I originally preferred the Hawkeye to the pricier, vented Crater model, it has undergone less dramatic improvement with the revision and the tables have turned.

 The bass of the new Hawkeye is noticeably tighter but also gives up some of the impact of the original tuning. With this latest revision, the Crater is the bassier of the two earphones, though the Hawkeye still has slightly better extension. Clarity is improved slightly next to the original tuning and the overall sound is more refined and natural. The difference is slight, however – compared to the new Crater the Hawkeye still falls short in detail resolution. It does have smoother and more forgiving treble but at the expense of some of the air and clarity.

 All in all, the Hawkeye is now the more mid-centric earphone while the Crater emphasizes the bass and treble more for a more balanced overall signature. This means that there is more room for both sets in the lineup but also makes it easy for me to recommend the Crater as the better choice for most genres. 

 Value *(7.5/10) *– The Dunu DN-18 Hawkeye provides spacious, mid-forward sound with enhanced bass punch and a warmer tone. With excellent build quality and well thought-out accessory pack, the DN-18 is a great earphone for those interested in rock-solid build quality with a sound signature focused mostly on the bass and midrange for not very much money.

*Pros: Very well-built and well-accessorized; full sound; good bass
 Cons: Cable can be noisy when worn straight down; sound lacks some texture and detail; dull treble*



*(2C47) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 4 / 4vi*


Reviewed Feb 2012

 Details: Consumer-oriented BA earphone from UE
 Current Price: *$60* from amazon.com (MSRP: $129.99); $90 for Super.Fi 4vi w/mic
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp:_ 29Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-15k Hz _| Cable: _3.8' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flange_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories* (4/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips (2 sets), cleaning tool, and hard plastic carrying case
 Build Quality *(3/5) *- The build of the SF4 is typical of mid-range UE earphones - thin but soft and flexible cables, minimal strain relief, and notched, filter-less nozzles. The shells themselves are rather sturdy and very good-looking in all of their matte metallic glory
 Isolation* (3/5)* - Above average at their best but the housings don't lend themselves to deep insertion easily
 Microphonics *(4/5) *- Quite low in the soft and flexible cable. Can be eliminated completely with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3/5) *- The barrel-like shells and relatively short nozzle mean that not everyone will be able to maintain a seal with shorter tips. The stock tips are the same ones included with the MetroFi earphones and simply aren't very good. The included Complys are nice but will require replacement. On the upside, over-the-ear wear is quite easy due to short strain reliefs and flexible cable

 Sound *(6.5/10) *- Announced nearly three years ago, the SuperFi 4 was originally designed to slot in between the aging SuperFi 3 and SuperFi 5 Pro/EB models in UE's lineup. The current SuperFi 5 (UE 600) would not yet be announced for nearly a year so the single-armature design was not yet ubiquitous to the SuperFi line and the SF4 fit in just fine. To differentiate it sonically from the SuperFi 3, the SF4 was tuned for a thicker, slightly bottom-heavy sound. The bass is not particularly powerful, rumbly, or well-extended but it is punchy, full-bodied, and very well-textured for an armature-based earphone. It is accurate but not particularly lean, lacking the control and clarity of the newer SuperFi 5 and UE 700, at times sounding a bit sluggish.

 Like the low end, the midrange of the SF4 sounds thick and full for an armature-based earphone despite being slightly recessed in comparison to the low end (in stark contrast to that of the SF5). At the same time, a bit of crispness and resolution is missing compared to some of the better similarly-priced dynamics and the pricier SuperFi 5. Detail is still good but due to the slightly bottom-tilted balance of the SF4, it performs better with male vocals than female ones. There is a narrow spike that can make the SuperFi 4 very sibilant with the rare poorly-mastered track but for the most part the treble is reasonably smooth. A bit of texture is missing at the high end and the very top bit of extension isn't there but on the whole the treble of the SF4 is well-detailed and pleasant.

 Presentation-wise the SF4 is surprisingly spacious. Though leaning slightly towards a darker tone, the SF is a balanced earphone and carries a moderate amount of air. The soundstage is oblong in shape but at least has good width. Separation is better with the SF4 compared to the older SF3, though the positioning and imaging are less precise. An interesting characteristic of the SF4 is that it is less efficient than the rest of the UE range and can be a touch more difficult to drive. It is still more suitable for low-volume listening than the older SuperFi 5 Pro, however, which struggles to produce fine detail at lower output levels.

 Value* (7/10)* - The modestly-sized SF4 is a welcome design change from the classic UE designs, though the company has taken the 'chrome' theme a bit too close to heart since the release of the SF4. The short nozzles and tubby shells are unusual for a single-armature earphone and may lead to fitting issues with single-flange silicone tips (the fit of the SF4 reminds me of a handicapped Hippo Boom) and the build quality is typical of lower-end UE products but on the whole the SF4 is a solid consumer-oriented single-armature setup with capabilities well in line with the rapidly-dropping street price.

*Pros: Convenient carrying case, **low microphonics, generally capable sound
 Cons: Can be uncomfortable*


*(2C48) Hippo 10EB*


Reviewed Mar 2012

 Details: Short-lived half-in-ear model from Hippo
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $70)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _20-23k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips:_ stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (4.5/5)* – Well-made plastic-and-metal housings, supple strain reliefs, a smooth and flexible cable, and heavy-duty 3.5mm L-plug all make the 10 an impressively well-constructed monitor
 Isolation *(2.5/5) *– Not bad for a shallow-fit IEM
 Microphonics* (2.5/5)* – Quite bothersome and difficult to avoid with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort* (4/5) *– Half-in-ear design with a shallow fit makes the 10 very comfortable

 Sound *(7.3/10)* – The Hippo 10EB is a very well-balanced earphone with a neutral tonality and impressive resolution. The low end has decent depth and no discernable mid-bass lift. It is quick and punchy - low on body but high on resolution and detail. The mids are in balance with the low end and again offer great clarity and detail at the expense of a bit of note thickness. Those looking for a full, warm sound definitely won’t find it with the 10EBs. The response is rather flat overall and the tone is neutral or even slightly on the cool side. There is a small amount of treble sparkle but nothing like what a Brainwavz Beta produces. The top end is smooth and extended – perfectly pleasant for a mid-level dynamic.

 The soundstage has good air and conveys a sense of space well. Instruments are well-separated and clearly distinguishable. However, the presentation is much wider than it is deep, resulting in minimal layering and rather poor imaging. The 10EB does not fare well at portraying intimacy and doesn’t offer much of a center image – a common theme with many half in-ear designs I’ve tried. Its presentation is laid-back and distancing. Worth noting also is that the specs can be a bit misleading – though it doesn’t need to be amped, the Hippo 10EB is not a particularly sensitive earphone and requires several volume notches above most similarly-priced sets to reach listening volume.

 Value* (7/10)* – The Hippo 10EB is a solid mid-level monitor with a flat sound profile and a wide, airy presentation. Its low note thickness and cooler tonality mean that accuracy is emphasized over musicality and the heavy-duty build indicates a studio application. The only real complaint is that the ergonomic shells can make over-the-ear wear tough, which in turns leads to problems mitigating cord contact noise.

*Pros: Well-built and comfortable; clean and balanced sound
 Cons: High microphonics; difficult to wear cord-up*


*(2C49) Velodyne vPulse*


Reviewed Mar 2012

 Details: In-ear headset from subwoofer manufacturer Velodyne
 Current Price: *$89* from amazon.com (MSRP: $89)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _99 dB_ | Freq:_ 20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.7' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; short bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories* (4/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (10 pairs in 4 sizes), shirt clip, and carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* - The design of the vPulse is highly derivative but the earphones are well-built and user-friendly. The flat cable is smooth and tangle-free, with a sturdy feel and nice matte finish. It lacks heavy-duty strain reliefs but includes a cable cinch and shirt clip, both rare among flat-cable models. Some of the plastic parts show molding artifacts, which detracts from the otherwise premium feel of the product. A 3-button apple remote and in-line mic are present on the left side
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Very good for a vented, angled-nozzle design
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Low when worn cable-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort* (4/5)* - The vPulse uses an angled-nozzle design for ergonomic fitment. The housings are light and the stock tips are quite decent. Wearing the earphones cord-up is a bit tricky due to the flat cable but the cable cinch and shirt clip help. The vPulse does appreciate a deeper seal for best sound so longer aftermarket tips may be required for some

 Sound* (7.4/10)* - The tagline developed by Velodyne for the vPulse is simply “bring the bass”, a promise the earphones keep in a big way. The bass is deep, reaching down below 30Hz effortlessly and offering pretty good texture all the way down. There is significant sub-bass emphasis but not much of a mid-bass hump, which allows the vPulse to avoid the boomy, bloated sound of mid-bassy sets such as the TFTA 1V and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE. The bass does tend to linger a bit and there are definitely times when the vPulse is overwhelmingly bassy but for the amount of bass contained, the control is very impressive.

 The midrange of the vPulse takes a step back in emphasis compared to the subbass but sounds clear and detailed, giving up just a bit of resolution and crispness to the MEElec CC51, VSonic GR06, and higher-end sets. The laid-back nature is especially apparent next to the Dunu Trident and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE, both of which try to keep their mids free of bass bleed by pushing them forward. With the vPulse it is instead the lack of mid-bass bloat that keeps the midrange clean, allowing the response to remain more level all the way up. The mids are smooth but a bit on the dry side, reminding me of the HiSound Crystal, and lack some delicacy and refinement, as well a bit of transparency.

 At the top the vPulse is again laid-back and not at all bright – the balance is clearly skewed towards the lows. Next to the more v-shaped sound of sets such as the id America Spark and Klipsch S4, the Velodynes come across a bit dull but avoid all harshness and sibilance, delivering a smooth, non-fatiguing sound. They are also more forgiving of lower-bitrate tracks – likely a positive considering the iPhone-wielding target audience of the vPulse.

 The presentation of the Velodynes is rather wide but the soundstage doesn’t have great depth or layering, resulting in sound that feels a bit ‘flat’. This is due in part to the somewhat constrained dynamics - the MEElec CC51 and id America Spark, for example, both sound more dynamic and provide more well-rounded – albeit smaller – presentations. The vPulse lacks good on-center feel and separation, and while its sound is more spacious and less closed-in next to cheaper IEMs such as the Dunu Trident, the mediocre dynamics also cause it to sound a bit dull and uninvolving at lower listening volumes.

 Value *(9/10)* – The first in-ear earphone from the bass experts at Velodyne, the vPulse does a good job of combining user-friendliness and functionality in a single package. While the design is derivative in many ways, the vPulse has a lot going for it - tangle-resistant cables, low microphonics, comfortable angled-nozzle earpieces, and a 3-button remote are all standard features. The sound combines solid bass rumble and depth with slightly subdued – but still clean and detailed – mids and highs. The bass can be a touch overpowering on some tracks but normally remains well-behaved for such a bassy earphone, making the vPulse highly suitable for anyone in search of a reasonably-priced headset with plentiful rumble and power.

*Pros: Comfortable and well-designed; deep, powerful bass; good clarity and all-around performance
 Cons: Bass can occasionally be overwhelming*


*(2C50) Ultimate Ears 500 / 500vi*


Reviewed Apr 2012

 Details: UE's priciest dynamic-driver model
 Current Price: *$60* from amazon.com (MSRP: $69.99); $79.99 for 500vi with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq:_ 20-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 3.8' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or* over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (3.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (5 sizes), comply foam tips, shirt clip, and plastic clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3/5) *- As with most of UE's recent releases, the lightweight housings of the UE500 are made mostly of chromed plastic. The flat cable is soft and flexible but could really use better strain reliefs on housing entry and the 3.5mm L-plug. The paint on the housings rubs off over time
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* - Very good for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics* (4/5)* - Reasonably low in the soft and flexible flat cable. Can be reduced further with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5) *- The housings are small and lightweight, tapering slightly at the rear. The nozzles are reasonably long and angled slightly for comfort. The flat cord can make over-the-ear wear slightly more troublesome but with the cable cinch it is still very much possible

 Sound *(7.4/10)* - In stark contrast to the UE350 and UE600 models, the signature of the UE500 is very mildly v-shaped, with punchy bass and crisp, sparkly treble attracting the most attention. The low end of the UE500 is weaker than that of the UE350 but unlike the cheaper model, which is bassy all the time, the 500 can be impactful when it needs to be and balanced when it doesn't. The bass is reasonably well-extended and has good impact for an earphone that can still be called balanced on the whole. It is not the tightest or quickest and there is slight mid-bass emphasis, giving the sound a very small amount of warmth and slight fullness compared to sets such as the RE-ZERO, but no discernible bloat or bleed. Those seeking Klipsch S4 or Beats by Dre-like bass power will want to look elsewhere.

 The midrange is slightly laid back and possesses good detail and clarity. Compared to the UE350, the UE500 sounds significantly cleaner, though it trades off some of the fullness and forwardness of the cheaper model. The top end is crisp and sparkly and the earphones would sound slightly bright overall if not for the mid-bass emphasis. Top-end extension is good but those who prefer laid-back treble might find the UE500 just a bit too energetic. The overall balance reminds me of the Sunrise Xcited - both earphones are spacious and reasonably balanced, with the Xcited being slightly clearer and more detailed but also brighter, edgier, and more aggressive. The UE500, on the other hand, offers more impact and a smoother sound.

 The presentation of the UE500 is spacious and airy. The sonic space is wider than it is deep or tall - not as well-rounded as something like the Sunrise Xcape IE or MEElec CC51. As a result, the UE500 has a bit of a tough time portraying intimacy compared even to the Sunrise Xcited, which has a similarly wide presentation, but is still very enjoyable overall. Instrument separation and overall resolution trail the Xcited slightly but the dynamics of the UEs are good and the layering is a touch more convincing than with the older BA-based SuperFi 4. One thing that surprised me knowing that the UE500 is a consumer-oriented earphone is the relatively low sensitivity - there will undoubtedly be complaints of low volume in the general populace, though the UE500 is still plenty loud next to the Phonak 012.

 Value *(8.5/10) *- The UE500 differs both from UE’s lower-end dynamic-driver models and the old armature-based SuperFi line in offering a mildly v-shaped signature with impactful bass and sparkly treble. Thanks to its clean and detailed sound, it competes well with Head-Fi's favorite mid-range IEMs, which is in itself is impressive for an earphone so readily available to the general public. The flat cable is rather poorly relieved for my liking and the frustrating plastic carrying case puts style above convenience but neither of these will stop me from recommending the UE500.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable; clear and articulate sound
 Cons: Frustrating carrying case; poor strain relief*


*(2C51) VSonic GR06*


Reviewed Apr 2012

 Details: VSonic’s mid-range dynamic monitor
 Current Price: *$63* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: $63)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _24Ω_ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _*Stock single-flanges*, bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* - Single-flange (3 sizes), hybrid-style (7 sizes), foam-stuffed hybrid (3 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips, foam tips, over-the-ear cable guides and padded spring-clasp carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* - Designed for over-the-ear wear, the GR06 features adjustable-angle metal nozzles coupled and ergonomically-shaped housings. The cable is sturdy and smooth but can be somewhat resistant to staying behind one’s ears without the included guides
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5) *– Despite the ergonomic form factor the GR06 isolates rather well with the right tips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *- Cable noise is very low as the GR06 can only be worn in the over-the-ear configuration
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The GR06 works very well for prolonged listening - the angle of the nozzle is adjustable in every direction by ~40º due to a unique swivel mechanism and the sleek, lightweight housings are even smaller than those of the GR07

 Sound *(8.1/10) *– While the higher-end GR07 model presents itself as a dynamic-driver take on a professional monitor, the GR06 offers a more consumer-friendly signature while showcasing just how far the sound quality of IEMs in the sub-$100 range has come in the past couple of years.

 The bass of the GR06 is impactful and well-rounded. Compared to the GR07, the GR06 has less bass depth and more emphasis on the mid-bass region, resulting in a fuller, softer note presentation and warmer tone. In fact, the GR06 is more reminiscent of the Yamaha EPH-100 through the bass and midrange, albeit not as clear, hard-hitting, or resolving. It is not as tight or quick as the GR07 but competes extremely well in its price range, making solid mid-level sets such as the Spider Realvoice and MEElec CC51 sound boomy and bloated. The pricier HiSound Crystal, on the other hand, is a touch cleaner and quicker at the expense of slightly dryer sound.

 The midrange of the GR06 is smooth, warm, and forward. The mids sound clean and have decent detail but are limited by the same slightly soft note presentation as the bass. As a result, the GR06 doesn’t sound quite as crisp, clean, and transparent as the GR07 or – to a lesser extent - the HiFiMan RE-ZERO or HiSound Crystal, but competes very well with pretty much everything else in its price bracket. The MEElec CC51 and Soundmagic E10 both sound mid-recessed in comparison while the Spider Realvoice and Brainwavz M2 lack detail and resolution. The pricier Sennheiser IE6 also sounds less refined than the GR06, with an edgier note presentation but no gain in clarity or detail.

 At the top, the GR06 is clean and detailed but comes across a bit less aggressive than the GR07, which sounds hotter and has more sparkle. While the GR06 is generally smoother, it’s still not quite as smooth as a Sunrise Xcape IE or HiFiMan RE-ZERO. Like the GR07, the lower-end model has a slight tendency to point out sibilance and good – but not class-leading - extension. There are competing sets that sound a little crisper and more resolving – the RE-ZERO and HiSound Crystal, for example - but none of them get far ahead of the cheaper and smoother-sounding GR06.

 The presentation of the GR06 is perhaps its most impressive aspect – soundstage size is above average and retains good instrument separation. The GR06 really makes similarly-priced sets such as the Brainwavz M2, MEElec A151, and even HiSound Crystal sound small and intimate. The presentation is more on-par with the far more expensive Sennheiser IE6 and IE7. Some nitpicks - there is decent air to the presentation but the more forward-sounding GR06 doesn’t have the sheer expanse of the GR07. Like the GR07, it also doesn’t have the best soundstage depth or the most 3-dimensional sonic image and the dynamics could be better. For the price, however, none of these should elicit any complaints.

 Value *(10/10)* – The VSonic GR06 does to the sub-$100 market what last year’s release of the GR07 did to top-tier earphones, embarrassing quite a few of its competitors by combining a comfortable over-the-ear form factor, great build quality, and excellent sound at an unreasonably low price point. While some nitpicks that do make their way into its evaluation, most of them are normally reserved for upper-tier products, itself a compliment to the GR06. This is yet another VSonic product punching well above its weight.

*Pros: Well-built and well-designed; warm, spacious, slightly mid-forward sound
 Cons: N/A*


*(2C52) Rock-It Sounds R-30*


Added Sep 2012

 Details: Single BA earphone from Rock-It Sounds
 Current Price: *$70* from rockitsounds.com (MSRP: $69.99); *$75.99* for R-30M with mic and 1-button remote
 Specs: Driver:_ BA _| Imp:_ 29Ω_ | Sens: _114 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; Shure gray flex; Shure olives_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories* (3.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), rubber housing covers (3 sizes), airline adapter, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The R-30 utilizes plastic housings with three pairs of removable rubber sheaths included to aid in fitment. The sheaths differ in size and shape and can be removed entirely to make the housings smaller (shown). The twisted cable is identical to those found on other Rock-It products and the MEElectronics A151
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Isolation is good even though only single-flange tips are included
 Microphonics *(5/5)* – Cable noise is nonexistent with the excellent twisted cable
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The R-30 utilizes a familiar over-the-ear design and fits much like the Westone IEMs. The housings are on the large side with the silicone sheaths in place but may offer a more stable fit. Removing the sheaths entirely is an option, though the shells are somewhat elongated and may not fit smaller ears still

 Sound *(7.7/10)* – The overall sound signature of the R-30 is a balanced one, with a hint of warmth and impressive bass for an entry-level BA earphone. The low end is punchy and only slightly rolled off, with a rather full-bodied presentation for a single armature. Bass control and extension lag slightly behind higher-end sets such as the MEElec A161P and Rock-It’s own R-50, resulting in a softer, slightly boomy note and more deep bass drop-off. In this way and others, the R-30 reminds me of the pricier Westone 1. Compared to the lower-end R-20 model, however, the sound of the R-30 is more balanced and the bass is more natural – fuller and deeper with no reduction in tightness.

 The midrange of the R-30 is forward and a bit warm in tone. Clarity is better compared to the R-20 but not quite as good as with the A161P or R-50 – about on-par with the VSonic GR06 and Monoprice 8320. The mids of the R-30 are quite smooth and note thickness is greater than with the more Ety-like A161P, which sounds thinner but also more crisp than the R-30.

 The top end of the R-30 is slightly laid back on the whole – low on sparkle and not as extended as the treble of the A161P. The R-30 still has better sparkle and extension than the R-20, but also filters out less sibilance In fact, sibilance on tracks is about as exposed as with the R-50 despite the crisper, more prominent treble of the higher-end dual-armature earphone.

 The soundstage of the R-30 is above average – larger and airier than that of the R-20, for example. There is some depth and height as well as good separation, and the ability to portray intimacy as well as distance. In addition, the R-30 is quite sensitive – more so than the lower-end R-20 and other Siren-based armature earphones.

 Value* (10/10) *– The R-30 is an impressive performer, improving noticeably on the sound of most entry-level BA earphones while competing with them directly on price. The color scheme and odd-looking outer sheaths of the R-30 may be a turn-off for some but as a whole the R-30 is one of the most well-rounded packages south of $100.

*Pros: Comfortable; excellent cable; no cable noise, great sound for the price
 Cons: May not fit those with smaller ears well*


*(2C53) Thinksound MS01*


Added October 2012

 Details: Eco-friendly IEM from Thinksound
 Current Price: *$100 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $119.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 16Ω_ | Sens: _96 dB_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges, Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), shirt clip, cotton carrying pouch, and over-the-ear cable guides
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The MS01 is similar in both construction and appearance to the other Thinksound models. The housings are made out of wood and aluminum and the rubbery cable features long strain reliefs and a beefy 3.5mm plug. The cable lacks a cinch but other than that attention to detail is excellent
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Respectable for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Low in the PVC-free cable
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The MS01 uses a slim, elongated housing to allow for a deeper, more comfortable insertion. The housings are lightweight and the earphones are very comfortable when worn. The included cable guides eliminate cable noise and can provide a more secure fit, though I personally don’t need them to wear the MS01 cable-up

 Sound* (8/10) *– The MS01 is the first earphone from Thinksound’s Monitor Series, said to be designed for pros and discerning listeners. Make no mistake, however—the MS01 still follows Thinksound’s usual signature, offering enhanced bass with clean, engaging mids and highs, only in a slightly more tempered proportion. At the core is ample bass boasting good extension and plentiful impact. The 8mm drivers move plenty of air – the low end of the MS01 is hard-hitting and visceral, outpacing those of the Brainwavz M5 and VSonic GR02 Bass Edition. Despite this, the bass is not too boomy and bass bleed up into the midrange is mild, resulting in a sound that is warm but not bloated.

 The midrange of the MS01 retains good clarity and detail. The mids are not as thick and lush as may be expected considering the powerful bass but the MS01 is not as thin-sounding as an RE-ZERO or Sunrise Xcited, either. The midrange is reasonably smooth and not overly recessed – less so, for example, than that of the HiSound Wooduo 2. In typical Thinksound fashion, the treble carries a bit of emphasis for a mildly v-shaped overall sound. Top-end extension isn’t great but otherwise the MS01 is crisp and pleasant, though not well-suited for those who prefer a laid-back treble presentation.

 The MS01 also presents a coherent sonic image – the mildly v-shaped sound gives it a reasonably open and airy feel, though more emphasis on upper treble and better extension would help. In addition to above-average width, the soundstage has decent depth and layering. Admittedly the soundstage of the MS01 is less 3-dimensional than that of the VSonic GR06 but the overall presentation is impressive and more to my liking than the flatter soundstage of the pricier HiSound Wooduo 2.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– Thinksound’s formula has always been beautiful in its simplicity – combine one part enhanced bass with one part clarity, add stylish, well-crafted housings made from renewable materials, and package it all with great attention to detail. The MS01 doesn’t stray far from its predecessors – it’s not a monitoring earphone as the name seems to imply, but it delivers great sound and retains the upmarket look and feel of the other Thinksound models. As far as I’m concerned the sonic refinement alone is well worth the price hike over the older TS02.

*Pros: “Green” construction; aesthetically pleasing; plentiful bass & good all-round performance
 Cons: No cable cinch*


*(2C54) HiFiMan RE-400 Waterline*


Added Mar 2013

 Details: Newest entry-level earphone from one of the pioneers of accurate dynamic-driver earphones
 Current Price: *$99* from head-direct.com (MSRP: $99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _15-22k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock bi-flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange (2 sizes), short bi-flange, and long bi-flange silicone tips; cable winder* Updated February 2014*: RE-400 now comes with 3 types of silicone bi-flange eartips, 4 types of silicone single-flange eartips, two sizes of Comply foam tips, a shirt clip, and a clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Construction is in line with what we’ve seen from HiFiMan as of late – solid housings, long strain reliefs, and thicker cables. The top part of the cord is similar to the RE262/RE272 while the bottom part is nylon-sheathed. HiFiMan’s standard 45º-plug completes the picture. The RE-400 is single-ended – there is no option of running it balanced and no adapters are necessary to use it with standard 3.5mm jacks
 Isolation *(**4**/5)* – Quite good for a dynamic-driver unit. The small housings and thick stock tips allow for a deep seal with even better isolation.
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; fine otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings of the RE-400 are the smallest of all the HiFiMan earphones I’ve seen to date. The shape seems to favor a deeper seal, which shouldn’t be an issue for all but those with the smallest ear canals. Cable-up wear is easy though the cable slider is a little loose on the cable.

 Sound *(9/10)* – The RE-400 takes the place of the RE-ZERO in HiFiMan’s new, more streamlined lineup. For the most part it stays true to what we’ve come to expect from the RE-series earphones--its tone is mostly neutral and the sound is about as clean and transparent as it gets. The RE-400 seems to be endowed with a slightly more robust low end compared to the old RE-ZERO--there is a slight mid-bass lift audible with the newer model. This gives its bass a little more weight and depth and tilts the overall tone slightly in the “warm” direction compared to the RE-ZERO, RE272, and Etymotic ER-4S. This is not necessarily good or bad—those who want a ruler-flat bass will likely still prefer the 272, but it will allow the RE-400 to cater to a wider audience, which is a definitely plus in my book.

 I would still classify the RE-400 as a neutral earphone with just a hint of warmth. The midrange is clear and well-positioned, neither recessed nor forward in the presentation. Detail resolution is excellent and the overall sound is very transparent. The top end, similarly, is present but not overbearing. As with the other HiFiMan earphones, it is delicate and refined. For an accuracy-oriented earphone the RE-400 is rather smooth and forgiving – it is a little more tolerant of sibilance than, for example, the Etymotic ER-4S. Treble extension is quite good, which tends to be the case with HiFiMan sets – certainly on-par with other high-end dynamics such as the VSonic GR07 and Sony EX1000.

 The presentation of the RE-400 is versatile and uncongested. Separation lags a hair behind the ER-4S and RE272, which seem to benefit from the lack of a mid-bass lift, but really isn’t far behind these (far pricier) flagships. The overall sense of space easily beats out similarly-priced sets such as the MEElec A161P and Ultimate Ears 600, and even offers slightly better depth than the older RE-ZERO. Like the rest of the RE-400’s sound, the presentation is very, very difficult to fault.

 Value *(10/10)* – The latest iteration of the balanced-and-accurate dynamic-driver earphone from HiFiMan, the RE-400 offers an audible tuning change from the old RE0 and RE-ZERO models. It produces slightly weightier bass, a more well-rounded presentation, and smooth, forgiving treble while still offering accuracy on a level very rarely found at or near its price point.

 Additional improvements over the previous-gen RE-ZERO include a more robust construction and better noise isolation, mostly due to the more compact, deep-sealing form factor. The RE-400 also boasts much nicer packaging, though there is still a disappointing dearth of accessories. The no-frills approach is fine by me - the RE-400, like its predecessors, is a listener's IEM. All in all, adding a hint of warmth to an otherwise neutral sound should let RE-400 appeal to the casual listener better than the models it replaces while holding very close to the HiFiMan sound many—myself included—have come to love. 

*Pros: Very smooth & balanced sound; small & comfortable;
 Cons: Cable noise can be bothersome in cable-down configuration*



*(2C55) Astrotec AM-800*


Added Mar 2013

 Details: Beautiful wood-and-metal earphone from Astrotec
 Current Price: *$65* from lendmurears.com (MSRP: est $65)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _8-27k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (3/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam eartips, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The housings of the AM-800 are an extremely handsome combination of brushed metal and lacquered wood, with fit and finish deserving of a much higher price point. The cable is more plasticky and memory-prone than the excellent rubberized cord used on the AM-90 model but still resists tangling well and feels sturdy. The strain reliefs, too, are supple enough to inspire confidence in the construction
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Average due to the shallow fit and vented design
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Decent when worn cable-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort* (4/5)* – The wood-and-metal housings are surprisingly lightweight and designed for a shallow fit. Comfort is very good with both silicone and foam tips

 Sound *(7.8/10) *– While the cheaper DX-60 is a passable-yet-forgettable entry-level headset, the AM-800 leaves the lasting impression of a solid all-around performer. It pursues a mildly v-shaped signature with punchy bass and bright treble. The low end is similar to that of the VSonic GR06 – slightly above neutral in quantity, but far from overbearing. There is less impact and subbass depth compared to the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition but better control compared to the Brainwavz M5 and the lower-end Astrotec DX-60, with the latter sounding downright sloppy in comparison to the AM-800.

 The bass is quick enough that midrange bleed is a non-issue, and the overall balance is better than with many competing sets. The AM-800 is less mid-recessed than the GR02 Bass Edition and MEElec CC51, for example. The mids are clear and open-sounding, making competitors such as the Brainwavz M5 appear a little veiled and congested in comparison. The treble of the AM-800 is smoother and less sibilant compared to the GR02 Bass Edition but can still get a touch harsh next to some higher-end sets. There is more treble energy than with sets such as the Brainwavz M5—a good thing in my book—and top-end extension is good as well.

 The presentation of the AM-800 is on the large side, with an airy, out-of-the head feel. It is a little wider and more spacious than the VSonic GR02BE and similar to the GR06, albeit with a touch less depth. The treble extension helps, as does the lack of congestion typically caused by mid-bass bloat. Overall, while the AM-800 doesn’t quite have the imaging of higher-end sets, it is more than capable enough for its price bracket.

 Value* (9/10) *– The AM-800 is one of the best-looking earphones I’ve come across in a long time, but it’s more than just a pretty face. Average isolation aside, the AM-800 is the total package – well-made, comfortable, and plenty good-sounding. The clear, mildly v-shaped sound puts the performance of the AM-800 in good company with the likes of the ECCI PR401 and VSonic GR06. All in all, there’s really not much to complain about here – the AM-800 is a great mid-range earphone for both first-time IEM users and those seeking to upgrade from an entry-level model.

*Pros: Great aesthetics; well-built; impressive sound quality
 Cons: Mediocre isolation*


*(2C56) Audio-Technica ATH-CKM500*


Added May 2013

 Details: mid-level Audio-Technica model with a form factor similar to the CKM99
 Current Price: *$60 *from accessoryjack.com (MSRP: $79.99); $90 for CKM500i with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _5-25k Hz _| Cable:_ 2' I-plug + 2’ L-plug extension_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _standard single-flanges, short bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories* (3/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), carrying pouch, and 2’ extension cable
 Build Quality* (4/5) *– Plastic housings combine with sturdy cables and flexible strain reliefs to provide very solid construction. The stereo version boats a modular cable while the CKM500i headset has a 1-piece cord
 Isolation* (3/5) *– Average due to shallow-fit design
 Microphonics* (3.5/5) *– Cable noise can be bothersome and is difficult to eliminate as these must be worn cable-down and lack a cable cinch
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The housings are not small, but are lightweight and ergonomically designed. Like the pricier CKM99, the CKM500 uses a half in-ear design with no sharp edges to provide a comfortable and secure fit.

 Sound *(8/10) *– Like the far more expensive CKM99 I reviewed a while back, the CKM500 is a slightly v-shaped earphone with powerful bass and a wide presentation. The most noticeable quality is the strong mid-bass response – there is more mid-bass impact than, for example, with the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition or the rather bass-heavy HiSound Wooduo2. Deep bass is present as well but less prominent in comparison, resulting in sets like the Sony MH1C and Wooduo 2 appearing to have cleaner, more prominent sub-bass. The strong mid-bass response does take away from the overall finesse of the earphone but will undoubtedly find its fans.

 Though the sound of the CKM500 is heavy on the bass, apparent midrange recession is mild and confined to the lower midrange, with the upper mids coming across strong and clear in typical Audio-Technica fashion. The v-shape is noticeable mostly because of the intrusive, somewhat bloated mid-bass. Note thickness is good, which is not the case with the mids of certain other v-shaped earphones, and the clarity is surprisingly great considering the bass quantity of the earphones. The CKM500 is not as clear as the thinner-sounding, more balanced VSonic VC02 but easily beats the more veiled-sounding Brianwavz M5 and most other bass-heavy dynamics in its price range.

 The top end is where Audio-Technica earphones can sometimes be overly energetic but the CKM500 does pretty well. There is a good amount of treble energy and some very mild grain but nothing too harsh at reasonable volumes. The treble is not too sparkly and extension is good. The VSonic GR02 Bass Edition, while a little more crisp and clean at the top, is also more sibilant. Soundstage width is also good, as is the case with the pricier CKM99, but the midbass bloat hurts the overall presentation, causing some congestion. Despite the good width and overall sense of space, there’s not a ton of depth to the sound, though the CKM500 still performs well enough to draw comparisons with pricier sets.

 Value *(9/10)* – The ATH-CKM500 is yet another solid offering from one of Japan’s best-known headphone manufacturers. The earphone impresses with its strong bass, good midrange clarity, and spacious presentation, all wrapped up in a comfortable angled-nozzle housing with a strong cable and good strain reliefs. The CKM500 strikes me as the perfect upgrade to the newly-popular TDK MT-300 and an alternative to other mid-level heavy-hitters such as the VSonic GR06 and Shure SE215.

*Pros: Good overall sound quality with strong bass; comfortable and lightweight
 Cons: Bass bloated at times; modular cable in 2’+2’ configuration may be an issue for some*

 Big thanks to Anaxilus for the CKM500 loan!


*(2C57) Dunu DN-23 Landmine*


Added Jun 2013

 Details: Mid-range dynamic-driver earphone from Dunu
 Current Price: N/A (MSRP: $80)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _120 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz _| Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Hybrid-style single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5) *- Single-flange regular (3 sizes), hybrid-style (3 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, ¼” adapter, airline adapter, soft carrying pouch, clamshell carrying case, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(5/5) *– As with the cheaper DN-22M, the construction is extremely solid. The metal housings have great finish and the cable is smoother and more tangle-resistant than with some of the other Dunu earphones
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Very good for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Pretty good when worn cable-down; excellent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings are one the heavy side and flare out to hold the drivers, which can lead to mild discomfort in the long term. The earphones lend themselves well to over-the-ear wear

 Sound *(7.5/10)* – Like the entry-level DN-22M Detonator, the DN-23 Landmine is a warm and smooth-sounding earphone reminiscent of Dunu’s popular Trident model. The bass of the DN-23 falls in the realm of “enhanced”, with more boost compared to the Trident but not quite as much as with the Detonator. It is very satisfying in both impact and depth but also rather clean and controlled, considering the quantity. Though the DN-23 sounds a little more full-bodied than both, bass tightness is actually about on-par with the Brainwavz M5 and VSonic GR02 Bass Edition.

 Due in part to the more controlled bass, the DN-23 has clearer and more prominent mids compared to the DN-22M. The midrange presentation is spot-on – not overly forward, but not as recessed as with the Brainwavz M5 and VSonic GR02 BE. Detail retrieval is good and the midrange gives way to equally smooth treble. As with the lower-end DN-22M, the treble is inoffensive, without a hint of grain or sibilance. The DN-23 is not as rolled-off, however, which again leads to improved accuracy over the DN-22M.

 The presentation of the DN-23 is spacious and well-rounded. The soundstage is larger and less intimate than with the Trident and DN-22M, and the earphones have a fairly open, airy, and uncongested sound. The DN-23 still isn’t as spacious as Dunu’s flagship Tai Chi model, but it’s not too far behind and competes well with other sets in its price bracket.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– With its stellar build quality and smooth, easy-going sound, the DN-23 Landmine is a difficult earphone to dislike. It may not be as accurate and spacious as the higher-end DN-19 Tai Chi, but it’s an easy recommendation for fans of warm and smooth sound. 

*Pros: Fantastic build quality; well-accessorized; smooth, enhanced-bass sound*
*Cons: Housings a bit on the heavy side*


*(2C58) Ultimate Ears 600 / 600vi / **Logitech UE 600*


Added July 2013

 Details: Long-running staple of the UE lineup previously known as the Super.Fi 5
 Current Price: *$60 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $119.99); $120 for 600vi w/mic & 3-button remote
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _13Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Comply, generic bi-flange_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear *or straight down_

 Accessories* (4/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips (2 sets), and hard plastic carrying case
 Build Quality* (3.5/5)* - All-plastic construction, color-coded nozzles, and chromed housings are all reminiscent of the lower-end UE earphones. The cable is identical to the one used by the UE 700 - soft and flexible, but plasticky and not very well-relieved
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* - Nozzles are long and lend themselves to deep insertion fairly well. Isolation is good but still lags behind many pricier BA-based earphones
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* - Quite low in the soft and flexible cable, and can be eliminated completely with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The curved shells and long nozzles of the SF5 allow them to be worn either cord-up or cord-down quite easily, though the position of the mic suggests over-the-ear wear. The housings are very light and rarely come in contact with the ear, much like those of the Phonak PFE and Future Sonics Atrio earphones

 Sound *(8.6/10)* - Originally known as the Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5, the single-armature UE 600 took its spot in the UE lineup over from the dual-armature Super.Fi 5 Pro model. Sonically, it differs greatly from its predecessor, taking on a more balanced and accurate sound. At the low end, the UE 600 sounds like a typical single-armature earphone, lacking the enhanced bass of UE’s dynamic-driver models. The bass is very level and controlled, with impact that is on-par with the Etymotic Research HF5 and lags slightly behind the MEElec A161P.

 The midrange, on the other hand, is more prominent. The UE 600 places the mids front and center. It is still more neutral than the vast majority of entry-level earphones but for me sounds slightly mid-centric, albeit very clear and refined. This could be due to an impedance interaction with my sources, but it is consistent across all of the ones I’ve tried. Tonally, the UE 600 is a touch warmer than the UE 700 and other TWFK-based sets, as well as the Etymotic HF5, but detail and overall transparency are still very good.

 The top end of the UE 600 is clean and smooth, if not particularly sparkly. The UE can’t quite match the delicacy and detail of the HiFiMan RE-400 but still impresses with the slightly relaxed nature of its treble. There is absolutely no grain and the earphone tends to avoid harshness and sibilance. It is also not overly critical of lower-bitrate files. I would say this was done on purpose due to its low price point, but the flagship UE 900 model has similar tendencies. Admittedly, the UE 900 does have better treble presence, energy, and extension, sounding more natural overall, but there is also a huge price gap in play there.

 The UE 600 possesses an impressively wide soundstage but doesn’t keep up too well with higher-end earphones. I found it lacking overall dynamics and the separation of higher-end sets such as the quad-driver UE 900 model. As a result, the soundstage has comparatively poor depth and layering and the overall sonic image is a bit flat, much like that of the similarly-priced Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3.

 Value *(9.5/10) *- The UE 600 is a little plasticky in build but remains lightweight, comfortable, and fairly well-isolating courtesy of the included Comply eartips. The sound is neutral to somewhat mid-centric, with very good clarity, decent bass presence, and smooth, forgiving treble. It sounds great with music and is especially well-suited for audiobooks and phone calls with its forward, highly intelligible vocal presentation. Simply put, it’s a great fit for anyone in search of a comfortable earphone with excellent mids.

*Pros: Comfortable form factor; very low cable noise; smooth, yet accurate sound*
*Cons: Plasticky build quality and typical UE cable; prone to impedance interactions with high-OI sources*


*(2C59) Nuforce NE-700X / NE-700M (2013 new version)*


Reviewed October 2013

 Details: Dynamic-driver in-ear from California-based Nuforce
 Current Price: *$65* from amazon.com (MSRP: $65); $75 for NE-700X version w/mic and 1-button remote
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω _| Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.5’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (6 pairs in 3 sizes), shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The metal housings are nice and solid and feature strain reliefs that grip the circumference of the shell. A small red ring around the right strain relief takes the place of L/R indicators. The cable is rubbery and equipped with beefy y-split and 3.5mm L-plug
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The somewhat bulky housings prevent deep insertion, resulting in average isolation
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Decent when worn cable-down; very good with over-the-ear fitment
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells are on the large side and may not work for those with small ears due to their barrel-like shape but the light weight keeps them comfortable once fitted

 Sound *(7.6/10)* – The 2013 version of the Nuforce NE-700X stays true to its predecessor, delivering a rich, full-bodied sound underpinned by tactile, powerful bass. The low end extends well and provides enough impact to satisfy all listeners, even serious bass fanatics. The low end is a bit slow but bloat is kept to a minimum, which is impressive considering the quantity of bass present. However, the earphone does have a tendency to add bass to the recording. In comparison, the bass of the Sony MH1C is almost as impactful as that of the NE-700X but sounds less intrusive.

 The enhanced low end gives the NE-700X some warmth and coloration. Clarity is good for a bass-heavy earphone and the midrange doesn’t sound recessed, as one might expect, reminding me of the Sony MH1C. The treble, likewise, is smooth and pleasant, and the sound is free of harshness and sibilance. It is less energetic up top but also smoother than the HiSoundAudio Crystal and dynamic-driver VSonic sets. Overall, the tone of the NE-700X is a bit dark due to the slightly laid-back treble, but the earphone remains non-fatiguing even at higher volumes, which is a definitely plus.

 The soundstage of the NE-700X is average in size, but tends to be well-rounded and makes for an involving listening experience. It doesn’t have the sheer width of the VSonic VSD1 but still sounds natural, boasting good separation and layering despite the heavy bass. Worth noting also is the NE-700’s consistency across sources and good efficiency, which make it a nice set to use with a smartphone or tablet.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The Nuforce NE-700X is a great earphone for those who like their sound smooth and impactful. It delivers bass in spades while sacrificing little in the way of all-around sound quality, with a nice construction and all-around usability to match. The 2013 version isn’t a total overhaul, but it does help the NE-700X stay competitive in an increasingly crowded market and makes it one of the best options out there for the type of sound it pursues.

*Pros: Well-built; deep, plentiful bass with good overall audio quality*
*Cons: May be uncomfortable for those with smaller ears; bass can be intrusive*


*(2C60) Moe Audio MOE-SS01*


Reviewed December 2013

 Details: Dual dynamic driver earphone from China-based Moe Audio, closely related to the JVC HA-FXT90
 MSRP: $65 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$64* from lendmeurears.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dual_ _Dynamic _| Imp: _12Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _8-25k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges; MEElec “balanced” bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: *Straight down*_ or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The SS01 uses plastic shells that clearly show the driver chambers and incorporate an “S” into the design. The earphones utilize a narrow flat cable that actually feels rather sturdy and is more user-friendly than most other flat cables, which tend to be either too thick and heavy, or too rubbery
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Not bad despite the shallow-fitting shells
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low when worn cable-down; nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The drivers of the SS01 are arranged vertically, like those of the JVC FXT90, resulting in similarly-shaped housings. The earphones are lightweight, and despite their larger footprint in the ear are no less comfortable than most conventional straight-barrel IEMs, thanks in part to the angled nozzles. Over-the-ear wear is possible for those with larger ears but may require longer eartips than those provided. For me the SS01 is much more comfortable when worn cord-down

 Sound* (8/10)* – The MOE-SS01 utilizes a driver setup similar to the pricier JVC HA-FXT90s - twin 5.8mm drivers made of different carbon composites. The sound bears some similarities to the JVCs but on the whole the discrepancies do add up to a rather different audio experience. I would summarize the sound of the SS01 as very clear, with a cool tonal character and slightly v-shaped response.

 The bass of the SS01 is very impressive, perhaps second only to the earphone’s clarity in this regard. It is enhanced, but not overbearing, and has good punch and extension with virtually no bloat. The JVC FXT90, which the SS01 is closely related to, has more of a mid-bass hump and sounds warmer and fuller overall. The SS01 is a little on the thin side, especially with the way it presents male vocals, but otherwise the mids are quite good - mostly level and extremely clear.

 The upper midrange and lower treble of the SS01 are quite prominent, lending guitars great presence and “crunch”. The treble is nice and energetic overall. It reminds me of the Audio-Technica ATH-CKM500 - not really peaky, but with an “edgy” character that occasionally bothers me (with a lot of heavy metal recordings, for example). At times, the SS01 can exaggerate sibilance a bit as well, but not nearly to the same extent as the average VSonic set. The FXT90, from memory, had a bit more treble sparkle but less of an edge to it.

 The presentation has good width and decent imaging for something in this price range. It’s not quite as spacious and out-of-the-head as, say, a VSonic GR07, but it fares very well against similarly-priced sets. The SS01 is very efficient, too, reaching listening volume more easily than the GR07 and most other dynamic-driver sets.

*Select Comparisons*

VSonic VSD1S ($49)

 One of my favorite sets in its price range, the VSD1S is a slightly v-shaped earphone that makes a pretty good match for the MOE-SS01 in overall performance. The VSD1S boasts a little more bass impact compared to the MOE and sounds warmer overall. The SS01 is leaner and cooler in tone but still has excellent bass presence. The earphones have similarly excellent clarity. Like most VSonics, however, the VSD1S tends to amplify sibilance. The SS01, on the other hand, is far less prone to exaggerating sibilance but sounds a little harsher in general. The SS01 also appears a touch more congested while the VSD1S is more airy and open-sounding. 

SteelSeries Flux In-Ear ($50)

 The Flux is another of my favorite budget-friendly in-ears and again tends to be a touch v-shaped, making it a good competitor for the SS01. The Flux has similar bass impact but boasts a touch more sub-bass weight in comparison, making the SS01 sound a little more “hollow”, or lacking footing, in the bass region. The mids of the Flux, on the other hand, are more recessed and sound veiled as a result. The SS01 is significantly clearer, but also tends to sound thinner. The added treble of the brighter SS01 also makes it harsher overall whereas the Flux by and large remains smooth, if a little grainy and unexciting. 

Philips Fidelio S1 ($95)

 The Philips Fidelio S1 is one of several reasonably well-balanced earphones in the sub-$100 price bracket. Like the SS01, the Fidelio S1 boasts enhanced bass and prominent, crisp upper mids and treble. As with the SteelSeries Flux, the Philips earphones boast a touch more sub-bass weight compared to the MOE, sounding more solid when it comes to bass punch. Tonally, the Philips earphones are warmer, with mids that appear a bit fuller and smoother. The MOE-SS01 is brighter and harsher and sounds a little less natural overall in terms of tone and timbre but easily keeps up in clarity and detail, which is impressive. The presentations tend to be similar, with pretty good width and average depth.

HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)

 The RE-400 and MOE-SS01 are two very different takes on near-neutral sound. Despite having less bass presence, the RE-400 is warmer, sounding more mid-centric overall. Its treble is smoother and more refined. The SS01, on the other hand, tends to be more v-shaped in signature—it is bassier but also brighter compared to the RE-400. The added treble can make it sound harsh next to the HiFiMan set, but also allows it to appear clearer at times. The smoother RE-400 tends to sound more natural through the treble region but lacks the striking clarity of the MOE. 

 Value *(9/10)* – The MOE-SS01 is a dual dynamic earphone with a slightly cool tonal tilt and great clarity. There is a bit of treble harshness but for the price the performance leaves almost nothing to complain about – the SS01 can compete with the best sets in its price tier and beyond. Sound quality aside, the SS01 also boasts a nice construction with an excellent, low-noise cable and is surprisingly comfortable thanks to its light weight. Call me crazy but I don't mind the look of it, either – at the very least I won't mistake this earphone for anything else in my collection. For fans of clear, punchy earphones, the SS01 is nothing short of an excellent buy.

*Pros: Fantastic clarity, great bass quality; low cable noise*
*Cons: Large footprint may not be comfortable for those with small ears *


*(2C61) HiSoundAudio BA100*


Reviewed February 2014

Details: HiSound’s first Balanced Armature earphone with a driver of their own design
 MSRP: $99 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$75* from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _BA _| Imp: _36Ω_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ 45°-degree plug with mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 single & bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), cable winder, shirt clip, and zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The design of the BA100 seems similar to that of the aging HiSound Crystal, yet is different in a couple of ways. First, it uses two-step nozzles – a solution I haven’t seen for a while which allows two different positions for the eartips. The nozzles are flared at the front and show off the copper construction of the earphone housings. The BA100 also has a different cable compared to the Crystal, which feels a bit less durable but is holding up admirably so far. There is no cable cinch
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Can be very good but varies depending on where the eartips are positioned as well as how deep the earphones are inserted
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Can be bothersome, but greatly reduced with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – As noted above, the BA100 allows eartips to be either pulled all the way on to the nozzle, or positioned further out using the additional lip. I ended up preferring to keep the tips on the outer notch, but the difference it made wasn’t huge. I quite like the BA100 for comfort – the housings are very light and slim, kept entirely away from the outer ear. They are easy to wear over-the-ear and can be very comfortable with the right eartip configuration

Sound* (7.9/10)* – The BA100 is HiSoundAudio’s first balanced armature earphone and its drivers are said to be designed by, or at least built to specification from, HiSound themselves. For those not intimately familiar with balanced armatures, this is a pretty big deal as most balanced armatures, especially those used by Western brands, come pre-tuned from one of two major balanced armature OEMs – Knowles or Sonion. This is why, for example, it can be said that the Ultimate Ears 700, Brainwavz B2, and VSonic VC1000 (among many others) “share” a driver – they all use the Knowles TWFK armature, although potentially different variants of it.

The driver in the BA100 has a rather unique voicing and most likely does not come from either Knowles or Sonion. What surprised me most at the outset, however, was its low efficiency. For a BA it’s really not very efficient despite the rather high stated sensitivity. This is not an issue other than making volume-matched comparisons against other earphones a bit more difficult, and of course requiring a notch or two of extra volume from the source.

On to the sound – what HiSound has created here is a balanced-sounding earphone with a rather neutral tonal character. Bass quantity is low-to-medium – it is not the most impactful, but certainly good for a single balanced armature. The extension is there but the earphone just lacks the rumble and air movement at the lowest lows compared to many dynamic-driver and multi-BA sets. Bass control is quite good – for example the VSonic VSD1S and Astrotec AM-800, two of my favorite sub-$100 dynamic-driver earphones, sound bassier – but also more boomy – compared to the BA100.

The mids of the BA100 are not very prominent but the earphone can’t be accused of having a recessed midrange, either. The VSD1S, for example, sounds noticeably v-shaped in comparison. The BA100 has similar clarity to the VSD1S and lags just behind the brighter AM-800 and VSonic VC02. Compared to the BA100, the Ultimate Ears 600, another solid sub-$100 BA earphone, sounds more forward in the midrange and also a touch cleaner, as if lifting a slight veil or bit of distortion that’s present over the BA100. This is not at all noticeable on EDM tracks, for example, but rather with rock and metal, especially with the presence of distorted guitars.

At the top, the BA100 has strong enough treble presence, albeit with only moderate extension. Its treble is not particularly peaky, but with an “edgy” character that on occasion manifests in a bit of harshness, especially since the neutral bass quantity and lack of brightness make it easy to inadvertently raise the volume. The VSD1S, AM-800, and VC02 all have more sibilance compared to the BA100 while the UE600 is smoother than the HiSound unit.

The presentation of the BA100 is good – more spacious compared to the majority of sub-$100 BA sets, especially those based on the Knowles SR driver. The BA100 doesn’t have great dynamics but definitely doesn’t sound as small as the SR-based earphones. It lacks some air compared to the UE600 and some width compared to Astrotec’s rather spacious-sounding AM-800 but overall puts up a good performance for the price.

*Select Comparisons*

Astrotec AM-90 ($44)

Seeking a good example of Knowles’ entry-level SR armature, better known as the “Siren”, to compare to HiSound’s freshman BA effort, I selected the Astrotec AM-90, one of the best SR implementations I’ve tried alongside the MEElectronics A151 and Rock-It Sounds R-20. SR-based earphones tend to struggle a little at the bottom and up top but generally produce nice mids with a warmer tone compared to many other BA earphones. Indeed, the AM-90 sounds mid-centric next to the HiSoundAudio set, with a more intimate midrange and a touch more mid-bass presence for a warmer overall tone. The BA100 has more capable subbass and less forward mids with no loss in clarity. The AM-90 has smoother, more relaxed treble whereas the BA100 is a little brighter and more balanced overall. It also has a more spacious presentation than the somewhat intimate-sounding Astrotec unit.

Moe Audio MOE-SS01 ($65)

The MOE-SS01 is a very unique earphone in its price bracket, utilizing twin 5.8mm dynamic drivers to deliver a crisp, bright, and somewhat v-shaped sound. Compared to the BA100, the SS01 has greater deep bass emphasis and sounds more effortless when it comes to subbass rumble and slam. Its dynamic drivers produce a more natural bass presentation. Despite its bass presence, however, the SS01 has excellent clarity. Both earphones have strong presence in the upper midrange and lower treble and can sound a bit edgy, even approaching harsh, but the SS01 has a little more energy overall, which gets it in more trouble on occasion. However, the greater treble energy and extension of the SS01 also give it a more open and clear sound overall.

HiFiMan RE400 ($99)

One of my most-used benchmarks in the sub-$100 range, the RE-400 is an accuracy-oriented dynamic-driver earphone with a near-neutral sound signature. To the BA100’s credit, it can keep up with the RE-400 in bass depth but the dynamic-driver HiFiMan unit provides greater bass impact. The midrange is the focus of the presentation with the RE-400, and the HiFiMan sounds stronger and a touch clearer than the BA100 there. At the top, the RE-400 is extremely smooth and slightly relaxed while the BA100 has a more prominent – and harsher – upper midrange and lower treble region. The RE-400 also has excellent treble refinement and extension, and sounds more natural to me on the whole as a result.

MEElectronics A161P ($100)

The A161P utilizes a different balanced armature driver from Knowles than the Astrotec AM-90 – the ED. Compared to the BA100, the A161P offers up punchier bass and mids that are stronger and clearer. The BA100 lacks some of the midrange forwardness and clarity, appearing to have a slight veil, or perhaps even a bit of barely-audible distortion – in the midrange. In the upper midrange the A161P begins to appear a little grainy while the BA100 is a touch harsher, likely in the 3-5k range, and neither has a major advantage over the other in treble quality. Neither earphone has a very large soundstage, either. Worth noting also is the enormous difference in efficiency between these two earphones, the A161P reaching ear-splitting volumes almost too easily, and the BA100 requiring quite a push.

Value *(7.5/10)* – HiSoundAudio’s first BA-based earphone is a solid entrant in the sub-$100 price bracket. I love the small size, light weight, and comfortable fit of the earphones, as well as the solid noise isolation. I like the balanced and neutral sound, too, though there is a bit of room to grow and the overall performance can be somewhat genre-dependent. It is a step above most entry-level BA-based earphones but also requires more power than much of the competition. Still, the BA100 is a compelling buy at current pricing, especially for those outside the US.

*Pros: small and lightweight form factor; good noise isolation; balanced sound signature*
*Cons: less sensitive than most BA earphones; treble quality could be better*



*(2C62) Astrotec AX-35*


 Reviewed May 2014

Details: sub-$100 hybrid in-ear from China-based Astrotec
 MSRP: est $87 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$70* from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _BA+Dynamic hybrid _| Imp: _12Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _12-23k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T-400, Stock foam, Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips (1 pair), over-the-ear cable guides, and metal carrying tin/case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – Very solid, as with the other Astrotec sets I’ve tried. The AX-35 uses machined aluminum housings and nozzle filters, and the brushed metal aesthetic is very appealing. The strain reliefs are flexible and the sturdy cable is covered with a translucent sheath. It’s a very nice cable – quiet, flexible, and highly tangle-resistant
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average noise isolation despite the earphones having housings suitable for a relatively deep seal
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Low when worn cable-down and nonexistent when used cord-up
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The elongated nozzles and rounded edges of the AX-35 make it one of the more comfortable straight-barrel designs I’ve tried. The shells stay farther out of the ear, preventing fatigue, and also allow for a deeper seal. They might be a bit long for those with steeply-angled ear canals but for most they should be very comfortable

Sound* (8.5/10)* – The Astrotec AX-35 is a dynamic + single BA hybrid earphone that utilizes a Knowles ED armature driver and competes with the likes of the T-Peos H-100 and Dunu DN-900, albeit at a significantly more attractive price point. The signature of the AX-35 is somewhat v-shaped thanks the combination of bright, energetic treble and the mild mid-bass emphasis of the dynamic driver.

Though I wouldn’t call it bass-heavy, the AX-35 does have good low-end presence and punch. Its bass is not the deepest but the mid-bass emphasis is greater compared, for example, to the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07. The GR07’s bass is a bit tighter but less emphasized in the mid-bass region, and less impactful as a result. In fact, the overall bass quantity of the AX-35 is closer to that of the GR07 Bass Edition. This does result in the low end being less tight compared, for example, to the MEElectronics A161P, which is also based on the Knowles ED balanced armature, or the VSonic VC1000, but it also means that the bass quantity will suit a wider range of listeners. Indeed, improving on the bass response of single BA systems is one of the usual motivations behind hybrid designs such as this one, and the AX-35 does succeed in delivering bass.

The enhanced bass of the AX-35 combines with the thinner note presentation of its midrange to give the earphones a slightly v-shaped sound. Clarity is limited by the mid-bass but the AX-35 still manages to keep up with the more mid-forward Ultimate Ears 600. It lags behind VSonic’s higher-end GR07 and VC1000 models, both of which are more balanced-sounding and neutral in tone. The VC1000 especially makes for a stark contrast to the AX-35, with its strong mids making the Astrotec unit sound withdrawn and distant in the midrange.

At the top, the AX-35 has good presence and energy, falling a bit on the bright side of neutral. The treble sounded better to me at lower volumes but the mids aren’t quite strong enough at those same volumes for my liking, so I ended up taming the top end with foam eartips instead. The treble character is not unlike that of the MEElectronics A161P, which is based on the same BA driver – a little harsh and unrefined, but overall not far behind popular higher-end sets such as the VSonic GR07. What sibilance does show up can be tamed with the right eartips.

The presentation of the AX-35 is wide, with good air and separation between instruments. Earphones such as the Ultimate Ears 600 and MEElectronics A161P, which have more forward presentations, sound overly intimate next to the AX-35 and lack both soundstage depth and separation in comparison.

*Mini Comparisons* 

VSonic VSD1S ($49)

VSonic’s entry-level VSD1S is a dynamic-driver earphone with a slightly v-shaped sound signature. It has more bass, especially mid-bass, than the AX-35, which gives it a warmer tonal character but takes away from the midrange clarity. As a result, the AX-35 is clearer. It’s also brighter in tone, though the VSD1S is by no means dark-sounding. The VSD1S tends to be a little more sibilant while the AX-35 is a little splashier. The AX-35 has a slightly wider presentation, though the VSD1S is no slouch.

Philips Fidelio S1 ($95)

The Fidelio S1 offers up a more balanced sound while the AX-35 tends to be more v-shaped in response. The Astrotec unit has more bass but the extra enhancement comes in the mid-bass region, so it doesn’t have an advantage in bass depth. The Fidelio S1 is more mid-centric in comparison and has fuller, more fleshed-out mids while the AX-35 is a little thinner-sounding. Neither unit is especially smooth in the treble – the S1 has some emphasis in the lower treble region, which gives guitars a characteristic crunch, while the treble emphasis of the AX-35 comes in higher up, resulting in a slightly more sibilant sound. The AX-35 has a slightly more 3-dimensional presentation with better layering compared to the Philips, and is also noticeably more efficient.

HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)

The sound of the HiFiMan RE-400 is more midrange-focused compared even to the Philips Fidelio S1, so it provides a very striking contrast to the more v-shaped Astrotec AX-35. The AX-35 is bassier, but the RE-400 has a tighter, more controlled low end. The slightly looser bass and more recessed midrange of the AX-35 together cause it to sound more veiled than the HiFiMan set. The RE-400 is also very smooth at the top, whereas the significantly brighter and more energetic AX-35 can sound both harsh and sibilant in comparison. The AX-35 has a wider presentation than the RE-400.

T-Peos H-100 ($120) 

Compared to T-Peos’ pricier H-100 hybrid, the AX-35 has a more conventional sound signature that should be less polarizing among listeners. It sounds fuller and has more bass than the H-100, albeit with a little more bloat as well. The H-100 sounds thinner and more scooped-out in the midrange, appearing a little clearer but also less natural from a tonal standpoint. The AX35 is more neutral and its presentation is less distant with better depth/layering. Its treble is surprisingly a little less forgiving than that of the brighter H-100, but overall I still think the majority of listeners will prefer the more inexpensive Astrotec unit.

Dunu DN-900 ($120)

Dunu’s DN-900 is another dual-driver hybrid, one that boasts fantastic deep bass but has only so-so clarity. The AX-35 can’t match the sub-bass prowess of the DN-900 but has similar overall bass impact. The DN-900 sounds a little thicker throughout but that doesn’t do its midrange any favors – it’s significantly muffled compared to the leaner AX-35. The Astrotec unit sounds more detailed and has brighter, crisper treble. The presentation of the two is about on-par but there’s just no making up for the comparatively poor overall clarity of the Dunu set.

Value *(9/10)* – Not only is the Astrotec AX-35 one of the most reasonably-priced hybrid designs on the market, it manages to skimp on none of the qualities that made me a fan of the lower-end Astrotec earphones – a polished design with great attention to detail, sturdy construction, and excellent user-friendliness. It makes for a very enjoyable listen, too, and the slightly v-shaped signature seems to particularly excel with electronic music.

*Pros: Comfortable, well-built, and good-sounding hybrid earphones*
*Cons: Treble can be peaky in stock configuration; would have preferred a standard case to the included tin*



*(2C63) Rock Jaw Alfa Genus*


 Details: Variable-tuning earphone from England-based Rock Jaw

MSRP (UK): £49.99; MSRP (US): $79.95
 Current Price: *$72* from amazon.com; £46 from amazon.co.uk
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), interchangeable tuning nozzles (3 pairs), and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The Alfa Genus is made of wood and aluminum and uses a variable tuning system with interchangeable metal nozzles. The cable is internally braided, more flexible than others of its type, and has very soft strain reliefs – so soft that care should be taken not to bend them at too sharp an angle. No cable cinch is present and L/R markings can be quite hard to see, but the skinny L-plug is great – it works with fat phone cases and recessed jacks while providing ample strain relief
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Present when worn cable-down but can be eliminated with over-the-ear wear, which is made easy by the soft strain reliefs and compact housings
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings of the Alfa Genus are slim and lightweight, allowing for excellent wearing comfort, and the earphones are easily worn cable-up or cable-down

Sound* (8.1/10)* – The Rock Jaw Alfa Genus utilizes a tuning system in the form of threaded nozzles, which can be swapped to alter the sound. Variable tuning earphones are not a novel concept but in my experience interchangeable nozzles are more effective in changing the sound of an earphone than rear ports or tuning screws. The last earphone I encountered with this kind of setup was the Torque t103z. The three settings of the t103z were extremely varied, but none impressed me very much, which is not the case with the Alfa Genus.

Three pairs of color-coded nozzles are included with the Alfa Genus – the silver and black were original “enhanced bass” and “reference” configurations, respectively, while the gold (aka champagne) nozzles were added later, meant to fit between the other two in sound tuning.

There are sizable differences in sound between the nozzles. The *silver* pair delivers a v-shaped, enhanced-bass sound along the lines of a Brainwavz S1. The bass is powerful and very deep, but also a bit intrusive and boomy. For an earphone with plentiful bass it’s quite good, but also leaves some room for improvement on the fidelity front.

The *black *nozzles follow the original “reference” tuning, which is much flatter-sounding. It lacks the powerful bass of the silver nozzles and has better clarity with no bass bloat at all. Unfortunately, severing the bottom end of a v-shaped signature means that what remains is bright treble. Indeed, with the black nozzles the Alfa Genus sounds somewhat bright and a little harsh, partly because there is no longer that heavy bottom end to counterbalance the prominent treble.

The third and final option are the *gold* (champagne) nozzles, which were not present in older batches of the Alfa Genus. The tuning of these is positioned between the other two, but closer to the black “reference” setting. The gold configuration provides a warmer, smoother, slightly bassier sound and could be nicknamed the “natural” setting – while the black tuning sounds a little clearer, it is also brighter and harsher. Compared to the enhanced-bass silver nozzles, the gold ones sound clearer, tighter, more balanced and neutral, and again more natural. Interestingly, the gold nozzles raise acoustic impedance noticeably compared to the other two, resulting in a slightly quieter sound.

As always, the sound score provided is given with preferred tuning (gold nozzles). The silver enhanced-bass nozzles are also very good and would score maybe 0.2 less. The black nozzles are the one setting I am not a fan of with gold as an alternative.

Because of the wide variation in audio performance between the nozzles, I thought it best to split them up when putting the audio performance in context.

The *silver* configuration of the Alfa Genus boasts more bass than the average in-ear, sounding deeper and more impactful at the expense of being a little boomy. In this configuration the Alfa Genus is bassier – and more v-shaped on the whole – than sets like the Ostry KC06, Philips TX2, and T-Peos Rich200, but also not as clear.

The *gold *nozzles, on the other hand, have very well-measured bass response. They are not as bassy as the TX2, Rich200, Ostry KC06, or even the Havi B3 Pro I. The bass is also quite tight – more so, for example, than that of the mid-bassy KC06. Compared to more analytical earphones such as the BA-based MEElectronics A161P and the VSonic VC02, which have rather flat bass with good extension, the Alfa Genus has a little more mid-bass and sounds less neutral.

Through the midrange and treble, the gold tuning of the Alfa Genus is balanced and smooth – more so, for instance, than the TX2 and Rich200. It is brighter than the Havi B3, but also a touch clearer thanks to having slightly greater upper midrange presence and less warmth. In fact, clarity lags just a hair behind the pricier, BA-based MEElectronics A161P. The *black *nozzles make the Alfa Genus brighter and introduce a bit of harshness, for me sounding a little too sharp in the treble and colored in terms of overall tonality.

The presentation of the Alfa Genus doesn’t change much between the *silver* and *gold* nozzles – both put the Rock Jaw unit ahead of the somewhat congested-sounding Rich200 and behind the TX2 and KC06 in soundstage size. With the *black* nozzles you get a more forward sound that gives up some soundstage width and imaging ability. 

*Select Comparisons *(Note: in each comparison the tuning nozzles with the best sound signature match were selected) 

VSonic VSD1S ($40) (Silver nozzles)

Its enhanced-bass tuning fashions the Alfa Genus into a strange beast, one that maintains a rather lean note presentation through the midrange and treble while delivering gobs of deep, powerful bass. Compared to VSonic’s VSD1S, the Alfa Genus has slightly more potent bass punch but sounds less warm and full-bodied overall. Treble is a little more present with the Rock Jaw set, but still less sibilance-prone than that of the VSonic. The Alfa Genus also sounds a little clearer thanks to the thinner note presentation and extra treble sparkle whereas the VSD1S has a more spacious and out-of-the-head soundstage.

Brainwavz S1 ($60) (Silver nozzles)

Brainwavz’ venerable S1 is the best all-around signature match I could find for the silver nozzles of the Alfa Genus. Both are v-shaped IEMs with heavy bass and prominent treble. The Alfa Genus is a touch boomier at the low end and less full-bodied in the midrange. As a result, its mids sound a touch more recessed, but also clearer. It is also smoother at the top and has marginally better imaging.

MOE-SS01 ($65) (Silver/Gold nozzles)

The dual-driver MOE-SS01 makes for an interesting comparison as its mildly v-shaped signature falls right between the silver and gold tunings of the the Alfa Genus. Next to the silver configuration, the SS01 is lighter on bass (mid-bass, mostly – there’s still plenty of deep bass), a little clearer, and more aggressive through the upper midrange and treble. The Rock Jaw has a deeper v-shape to its sound signature, sounding bassier but more bloated in comparison. Its midrange is more recessed and overall it is slightly warmer and smoother. In this configuration I preferred the more balanced SS01.

Switching the Alfa Genus to the gold tuning nozzles instantly turns the tables on the SS01. With the gold nozzles in place the Rock Jaw sounds more balanced and natural. It has stronger mids, less prominent bass, and smoother treble than the SS01, making the MOE seem overly bassy and a little too edgy up top in comparison. With the gold nozzles in place, I found the sound of the Alfa Genus preferable to that of the SS01.

HiSoundAudio BA100 ($65) (Gold/Black nozzles)

As with the MOE-SS01, the HiSound BA100 made for an especially interesting comparison as its sound fits between the gold and black nozzles of the Rock Jaw Alfa Genus, though in this case I preferred both configurations of the Rock Jaw unit.

With the gold nozzles in place the Alfa Genus sounds a little warmer and more natural than the BA100. Its bass is more full-bodied and realistic. The BA100 is a little closer to neutral tonally, but also harsher and more forward, intimate, even congested in terms of presentation.

Switching the Alfa Genus to black nozzles levels the field a little – in this configuration the Alfa Genus is brighter than the BA100, but also a little clearer. In my experience the brightness is a little excessive and makes certain things sound sharper than I like. The BA100 is again a little more neutral, this time not as bright as the Rock Jaw unit. It still sounds more intimate and congested than the Alfa Genus.

Value *(8.5/10)* – Rock Jaw scores a value win with their first official US release, the Alfa Genus. I quite liked the compact design, flexible cable, and slim plug of the earphones, but found myself wishing for slightly firmer strain reliefs and a cable cinch. The Alfa Genus is especially noteworthy for using a functional tuning system that actually changes the sound in a very obvious way. Both the silver and gold tunings are well worth the money, and two different sound signatures in a single earphone are always more interesting than one.

*Pros: Sound tuning system allows both capable bass-heavy and balanced sound profiles; very comfortable form factor*
*Cons: Cable noise when worn cord-down; some design nitpicks*





*(2C64) UBSOUND Fighter*


 Added Feb 2015

Fighter In-Ear Earphone from Italy-based UBSOUND
MSRP: $69.90 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: UK: *£49 *from Amazon UK; Italy: *EUR 65* from Amazon.it; *$85 *from ebay.com (US distribution coming soon)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _92 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug w/mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(2/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The Fighter is a lightweight, aluminum IEM with a flat cable. There is a mic and 1-button remote on the cable, and the earpieces and I-plug are properly relieved. The raised L/R markings on the strain reliefs are difficult to see in low light
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics *(3/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; good over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are longer than we’ve seen with other earphones that share this sort of flared shape, such as the RHA MA350 and Dunu Trident, but are surprisingly lightweight and comfortable. In smaller ears the outer diameter may be tricky to fit properly, but for most these should be just as comfortable as any other lightweight, straight-barrel IEM. Over-the-ear wear can be tricky because the flat cable lacks a cinch

Sound* (7.6/10)* – The UBSOUND Fighter is a bass-heavy in-ear earphone with a warm and smooth sound signature. The low end is well-extended, with a nice balance of sub-bass and mid-bass – exactly the kind of thing I like to hear from basshead IEMs. Control is also pretty good considering the bass quantity and mid-level price tag.

The midrange sounds somewhat recessed, as expected with this level of bass, and has only average clarity. A contributing factor on top of the dominant bass and midrange recession is an upper midrange dip. A dip like this is not uncommon among higher-end Balanced Armature-based earphones, as those often have detail and clarity to spare and just need to sound a little smoother, but it is not something often seen with bass-heavy dynamic-driver sets.

As a result, the Fighter has lower vocal intelligibility than similarly bass-heavy sets with a more v-shaped response – for instance the Brainwavz S1 - though there are many lower-end earphones that sound still muddier and more veiled through the midrange. The dip in the upper mid region has another effect – the Fighter sounds very smooth, which is most noticeable when comparing it to earphones that aren’t normally considered harsh, such as the Nuforce NE-700X. At higher volumes, its inherent smoothness can make the Fighter sound more natural despite sacrificing some clarity.

In fact, that’s the real asset of the Fighter – it is smooth and non-fatiguing even at high volumes, yet carries decent overall treble energy. The Fighter is far from the crispest, clearest-sounding IEM in its price range, but there are earphones with even warmer sound that - at reasonable listening volumes – tend to sound downright treble-deficient compared to the Fighter. The presentation of the Fighter, likewise, doesn’t have the greatest depth or air but is not small or overly congested.

Narmoo S1 ($45)

Compared to the NarMoo S1, an enhanced-bass earphone currently included in my Earphone Buyer’s Guide, the Fighter is similar only in the general sense of being quite bass-heavy. The S1 follows a more v-shaped sound signature with even punchier bass and brighter – but also harsher – treble. It is clearer and has a wider soundstage while the Fighter is smoother, which at times makes it sound more natural. The Fighter has more recessed mids, especially upper mids, and vocals sound less clear and intelligible as a result. However, it is much more forgiving of sibilance and maintains composure better at louder volumes.

Tekfusion Twinwoofers ($50)

The Twinwoofers from India-based Tekfusion are a better sound signature match for the Fighter than the NarMoo S1 but are not able to keep up with the UBSOUND in performance. The Twinwoofers have more bass, but also more bloat, sounding boomier as a result. The Fighter, while less bassy, is still quite impactful and has a similarly warm tone. Its mids are a little recessed compared to those of the Twinwoofers, but overall the Fighter is clearer, smoother, and more refined, making the Twinwoofers sound a little harsh in comparison. Overall, the Fighter is quite a bit better.

Beats by Dre Tour 2.0 ($150)

The second-generation Beats by Dre Tour is a respectable bass-heavy IEM, but does not have much of a performance advantage over the less expensive Fighter. The Tour is a little warmer overall thanks to a slightly larger mid-bass hump, whereas the Fighter is a little more balanced and neutral. The Fighter has better treble energy, yet is even less harsh and more forgiving than the Beats thanks to its upper midrange dip. The tuning is a two-sided sword, however, as the Fighter is also less clear as a result of that same dip. Overall, I ended up preferring the Beats at low-to-medium volumes but at highest volumes the smoother nature of the Fighter was a strong asset, allowing it to remain more natural-sounding.

Value *(7.5/10)* – The UBSOUND Fighter is a unique-looking, lightweight, surprisingly comfortable earphone with the caveat of a slightly microphonic flat cable. The performance of the earphones hinges on plentiful bass – not unusual in this price range – but sets itself apart with a smooth (perhaps even smoothed-over) sound courtesy of a recessed upper midrange. It is not a hallmark of balance and accuracy, but it was nearly impossible to extract any sort of harshness from the earphones, and just for that it’s likely to be a great match for many bass-loving listeners.

*Pros: Bass-heavy and extremely smooth sound; lightweight and comfortable*
*Cons: Upper midrange dip leads to mediocre clarity; can be microphonic when worn cable-down; packaging and accessories pretty basic for the price*



*(2C65) Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear*


Added March 2015

Details: In-ear model from Sennheiser’s Momentum line

MSRP: $99.95 Available in 3-button iOS remote (MOMENTUM In-Ear i) and 3-button Android remote (MOMENTUM In-Ear G) versions
 Current Price: *$100 *from Amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _118 dB/Vrms_ | Freq: _15-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; trimmed Monster triple-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips with cross-brace (4 sizes) and large carrying case with removable cable winder
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Sennheiser touts that no plastic was used in the acoustic components of the Momentum In-Ear. This is externally seen in the form of stainless steel sound tubes, but the actual housings of the earphones are still mostly plastic. Attention to detail is excellent, however, and the construction quality is good despite the apparent fragility. The Momentum uses a narrow two-tone flat cable with built-in 3-button remote (both iOS and Android versions are available) and slim L-shaped plug
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Good
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Noticeable in the flattened cable but kept at bay by the “floating” cable attachment
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Though it is not a small earphone, the Momentum In-Ear is comfortable thanks to the extremely light weight and smooth curves of its housings and the slim, angled nozzles. In addition, the cable attachment keeps the strain relief and cord farther out of the ear, preventing them from causing discomfort

Sound* (8.6/10)* – The Momentum In-Ear offers a rather unusual sound signature for Sennheiser, closest perhaps to the flagship IE800 model. It is v-shaped, with enhanced bass and energetic treble, and not as sensitive and ear-splittingly loud as one may expect from a consumer-oriented earphone.

The overall tone of the Momentum In-Ear is slightly warm, thanks to a generous amount of bass enhancement. Bass depth is excellent and the overall impact, while short of “basshead”, is plentiful, falling just between the bassier RHA MA750 and the more balanced VSonic GR07 Bass Edition. The bass enhancement is well balanced between sub-bass and mid-bass, and offers a minimal amount of bloat for the quantity.

The midrange of the Momentum is mildly recessed, in keeping with a v-shaped sound signature. However, due in large part to the plentiful bass, it does not sound overly thin. Clarity is limited slightly by the recession and bass boost, but on the whole it is more than respectable. Likewise, detailing is good for an enhanced-bass model but falls short of some flatter-sounding earphones. For instance, the popular Havi B3 Pro 1 has mids that are clearer and significantly more forward. However, it also sounds somewhat anemic and gutless at the low end compared to the Momentum, thanks to the far greater bass depth and power of the latter.

Starting with the upper midrange, the Momentum In-Ear again picks up steam, maintaining a rather high level of energy through the highs. It is still tilted towards the low end on the whole, but the treble presence provides a sound very different from most mainstream enhanced-bass earphones (such as the Beats by Dre Tour 2.0, for instance). The top end of the Momentum has a slightly splashy character that is not especially forgiving of either harshness or sibilance, but is still significantly less sibilance-prone than the similarly-priced VSonic GR07.

Like many earphones with v-shaped sound signatures, the Momentum In-Ear boasts a rather wide soundstage – on-par in size with the formidable VSonic GR07. Depth is, as with the GR07, lacking a bit in comparison to the width, but the combination of clarity and strong presence the highs and lows results in good dynamics and a very competent overall presentation.

*Select Comparisons*

HiFiMan RE-400 ($79)

The RE-400 is far flatter than the v-shaped, moderately bassy Momentum In-Ear. Its sound is more mid-focused, with less bass and treble presence compared to the Sennheiser set. The Momentum delivers more powerful and significantly deeper bass at the expense of a bit of bloat, while the tighter, flatter bass and lack of midrange recession in the RE-400 help it sound clearer and a touch more detailed overall. However, that same forward midrange makes the presentation of the RE-400 appear lacking in depth and dynamics compared to the Momentum.

The top end of the Momentum is more prominent and less smooth than that of the RE-400. There is more treble sparkle, but the Momentum is also prone to a bit of splashiness. On the whole it’s tough to determine the better earphone between these two – the RE-400 offers smoother, more natural treble and better midrange presence, while the Momentum delivers deeper, more impactful bass and a larger soundstage.

Fidue A71 ($90)

Compared to the Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear, the dual-driver A71 is less feature-rich and more finicky when it comes to fit, but offers a similar level of audio performance. Its bass is a little boomier – the tighter, more controlled lows of the Momentum leave a better impression and help the Sennheiser set sound a bit clearer despite its recessed midrange.

The mids of the A71 are not quite as clear, but a lot more forward, which balances out the intelligibility of vocals against the Momentum and makes the A71 sound richer and more full-bodied. The midrange of the more v-shaped Momentum tends to be a little thin and dry in comparison, but can sound more detailed and resolving than as well. The top end of the Fidue unit is smoother and its tone – warmer and arguably more natural. The A71 is also much more sensitive.

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

The GR07 Classic follows a more balanced and neutral sound signature than the warmer, more v-shaped Momentum In-Ear. The bass of the Sennheiser set is significantly deeper and more impactful, but also a little boomier and less refined than the tighter, flatter lows of the GR07.

The midrange of the Momentum is slightly more recessed while the GR07 is clearer and more detailed thanks to its flatter, more accurate response. The top end of the Momentum is less sibilant and not as bright, but otherwise the two earphones are in the same boat when it comes to highs – both tend to be energetic and at times a bit splashy. Both have wide soundstages with only average depth.

RHA MA750i ($130)

RHA’s MA750i model offers functionality similar to the iOS Momentum In-Ear, but in a very different form factor and with a warmer sound. The MA750 is bassier, boasting a bit more mid-bass emphasis but maintaining bass quality similar to the Momentum. Its sound signature can also be called v-shaped, but its mids are not quite as recessed as those of the Momentum.

The Momentum is a little brighter and at times can sound clearer, but also tends to be a little less full-bodied. The MA750 sounds slightly smoother overall, but actually has a bit more lower treble presence than the Momentum. Still, the Momentum is more v-shaped and has a greater tendency to sound splashy up top. The soundstage of the MA750 is also slightly larger.

Beats by Dre Tour 2.0 ($150)

This comparison is made very simple by the fact that the Momentum In-Ear is miles ahead of the Beats Tour 2.0 in fidelity. The Tour is more sensitive/efficient and much bassier, but its bass is significantly more bloated and boomy. The midrange is quite a lot muddier as well, though more forward than that of the Momentum. Despite its v-shaped sound sig and more recessed midrange, the Momentum sounds more balanced, clear, and refined with its tighter bass and superior treble energy. The treble presence and energy of the Momentum do make it less forgiving, but still not harsh even next to the dull-sounding Beats.

Value *(9/10)* – Sennheiser’s on- and over-ear Momentum models have been highly praised for successfully combining form and function, bringing Sennheiser audio performance to the style-focused headphone segment. The Momentum In-Ear follows in the same footsteps, boasting a unique design, comfortable, lightweight construction, and impressive audio performance. Combined with the choice of full-featured iOS or Android remotes – the latter still a relative rarity – this makes the Momentum an excellent value.

*Pros: Lightweight and comfortable design; 3-button Android remote available; plentiful bass and solid overall performance*
*Cons: Midrange is a bit recessed*



*(2C66) NHT SuperBuds*



Brief: First in-ear earphones from loudspeaker manufacturer NHT

MSRP: $129.99
 Current Price: *$70* from Amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _96.5 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ 45-degree plug w/ mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; MEElec M6 single-flanges; Comply T200 (included)_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (5 sizes), Comply T200 memory foam tips (3 sizes), and zippered clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The SuperBuds’ earpieces are decidedly large and hefty, but also feel rock-solid. The cables are fabric-sheathed, and while the combination of heavy earpieces, fabric cords, and lack of external strain relief worries me a little, they’re holding up fine five months in. The cable features a mic with single-button remote on the left side and 45-degree termination. No cable cinch is present
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Impressive, especially with the included Comply eartips
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Bothersome when worn cable-down; good otherwise. Very good considering the cloth cable
 Comfort *(3/5)* – Heavy, wide housings will cause problems in smaller ears but the SuperBuds attempt to make up for it with a strong eartip selection – 5 sizes of good-quality silicone tips (including always-welcome XL and XS sizes) and 3 pairs of Comply memory foam tips. The SuperBuds can also be worn cable-up to mitigate the weight

Sound* (7.7/10)* – The NHT SuperBuds follow a surprisingly bass-heavy signature with a warm tone and smooth highs – perhaps a bit more Beats by Dre than I expected, but a bass fan’s delight to be sure. The bass is deep and powerful, with a slight mid-bass bias and relatively slow attack and decay resulting in a very full-bodied sound.

The SuperBuds’ bass quantity falls north of just about any IEM I’ve tried recently except maybe JVC’s Xtreme Xplosives line, and their slower bass presentation acts to further accentuate the low end. This sort of bass “bloom” also means the majority of less bassy earphones, even those with strong punch like Brainwavz’ similarly-priced S5, sound tighter and quicker at the low end but ultimately lack the sheer power and fullness of the NHTs.

The SuperBuds have a warm tonal character and sound thick and rich through the midrange. The mids of the SuperBuds are slightly veiled, but not recessed. As expected, they don’t reach the clarity or detail levels of less bass-heavy earphones like the Brainwavz S5, but the clarity is not bad at all for this type of sound. Sets with more v-shaped, mid-recessed signatures – again, like the S5 – tend to sound a little thin and “hollow” in comparison.

The top end of the SuperBuds is smooth and non-fatiguing at the expense of sounding a little darker and less crisp than the average $100 in-ear monitor. It does an excellent job of killing whatever harshness and sibilance may be present and maintains smoothness even at higher volumes, which makes it perfect for sensitive ears. The soundstage is also good for a bass-heavy earphone – spacious enough to digest all the bass and not overly prone to congestion.

Interestingly, the SuperBuds have lower than average sensitivity – they’re not quiet or anything, but listeners who equate volume with sound quality may prefer the more efficient Beats by Dre Tours or JVC Xtreme Xplosives. I found this aspect of the performance interesting – on one hand the SuperBuds have a sound signature that’s perfect for the mainstream, and on the other they act more along the lines of enthusiast earphones when it comes to the volume war.

*Select Comparisons*

JVC HA-FR301 ($40)

The intent of JVC’s Xtreme Xplosives headphone line is simple – to deliver as much bass as possible. The FR301 succeeds in matching the SuperBuds there, offering up a hair more mid-bass punch to boot, but lacks refinement. The overall response of the JVCs is much more v-shaped, with a ton more treble presence compared to the NHT set. The FR301 can sound a little clearer and more dynamic thanks to the extra treble energy and crispness, but the midrange is recessed and the top end is brighter and harsher, with occasional bouts of sibilance. The NHT set is muddier and more veiled, warmer in tone, and more dull in the treble, but its smoother sound is more natural and never unpleasant, which is more than can be said for the JVC unit.

UBSOUND Fighter ($75)

The Fighter from Italy-based UBSOUND can be thought of as a bargain Beats by Dre – a flat-cabled headset with flashy colors and enhanced-bass sound. Next to the SuperBuds, however, its bass response seems rather tame. The SuperBuds boast greater mid-bass presence for a more impactful and full-bodied sound, offering true basshead performance and a richer, warmer overall audio experience. The Fighter puts up less mid-bass and sounds more balanced, which should give it a clarity advantage over the SuperBuds, but doesn’t, most likely due to the Fighter’s upper midrange dip.

RHA MA750i ($130)

RHA’s pricier MA750i, like the NHT SuperBuds, is a metal-shelled earphone with a hefty construction and bass-heavy sound. Compared to the basshead-worthy SuperBuds, the low end of the MA750i is less impactful, but tighter and not as intrusive. It still has good punch but with quicker note attack and decay, which makes it sound leaner and short on slam next to the NHT set. The SuperBuds, with their more full-bodied note, are boomier and more veiled, but also more powerful.

The MA750i offers a brighter overall tone compared to the SuperBuds, with significantly more presence in the upper midrange. This also makes it sound a little “tizzy” and far less tolerant of harshness in comparison to the smoother NHTs. The MA750 is more spacious thanks to its brighter sound and better overall resolution.

Beats by Dre Tour 2.0 ($150)

The Tour 2.0 is a sizable improvement over the original Beats Tour, but still doesn’t offer very good value for money in sound alone. It is, however, very user-friendly and ergonomic. The plastic-shelled Beats are much lighter than the SuperBuds, for instance, and tend to be more comfortable and secure in the ear with their angled nozzles and optional ear fins.

Coming back around to sound, it almost seems like NHT set out to out-Beats the Tour 2.0 by tuning the SuperBuds to be slightly bassier, warmer, and richer-sounding. The SuperBuds’ bass is a little slower and its midrange – a little more veiled – but the smoothness can sound more natural and the presentation is a little less compressed. The Tour 2.0 is marginally clearer, a bit less full-bodied, and less forgiving at the top. It is also worth noting that the Beats are significantly more sensitive – potentially an issue for the SuperBuds with listeners who wrongly equate loudness with sound quality.

Value *(7.5/10)* – The NHT SuperBuds are substantial in both sound and design, with hefty metal housings to match the basshead-worthy performance. Indeed, these warm and smooth-sounding earphones are unashamedly bassy, reminding me of the pricier, now-defunct TFTA 1V. The 1V was another large, solidly-built, and very bassy earphone that I’m still itching to recommend when someone asks for the most explosive bass you can get in a decent-sounding in-ear package. Happily, I can now recommend the SuperBuds in its stead, and to anyone else in search of a basshead earphone without the extra spend – and stigma – of a Beats Tour 2.0.

*Pros: Solidly built, good eartip selection, smooth sound with tons of bass*
*Cons: Large, hefty housings not ideal for small ears; tons of bass*



*(2C67) Alpha & Delta AD01*


Reviewed July 2015

Brief: First offering from Lend Me UR ears’ new house brand

MSRP: approx. $98
 Current Price: *$91* from lendmeurears.com; $98 from Amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _9Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _10-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3′ L-plug, detachable w/ 2mm DC plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Sony Hybrid-style silicone tips (3 sizes), short double-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips (1 pair), and spacious zippered case with detachable wrist strap
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Thanks in large part to their size and heft, the metal housings of the AD01 feel very solid. The cables are detachable, with replacements available via Lend Me UR ears’ website. The earpieces are sold separately as well – always a big plus with detachable-cable earphones in case one is lost or damaged. Cable quality is nice enough – the stock cable is internally twisted and then covered with a smooth sheath. A more premium upgrade cable is available as well
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good for an earphone of this type
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Easily tolerable even when worn cable-down
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The AD01 is a large straight-barrel earphone and fits similarly to most others. The smooth housings help prevent sore spots but the housing size, together with the strain relief length and angle, is less than ideal for over-the-ear wear

Sound* (8.7/10) *– The AD01 is the first earphone from Singapore-based headphone shop Lend Me UR ears’ new house brand, Alpha & Delta. It is a dual dynamic driver earphone with an interesting sound tuning – a mild v-shape with a bass bias. As a result, it falls somewhere between V-shaped and warm-and-smooth on my sound-o-meter. This is a pretty versatile signature that makes the AD01 a strong alternative – and potential upgrade – to some of my favorite sub-$100 earphones; the now-defunct SteelSeries Flux, for instance.

The bass of the AD01 is moderately enhanced, with impact and quality similar to the popular Sony MH1C. Both of these earphones can be a touch boomy compared to higher-end, less bass-heavy sets, but the bass also gives them a warmth and richness that, when combined with good clarity, makes for a very likable listening experience. Compared to the rather bass-heavy RHA MA750, on the other hand, the AD01 is decidedly more balanced, with tighter bass and a slightly more neutral tonal character.

Despite its v-shaped sound signature, the AD01’s midrange is not thin-sounding or significantly recessed. In this way it reminds me of the JVC HA-FXT90, another mildly v-shaped dual dynamic that doesn’t sound very mid-recessed. The slightly boosted upper mids and lower treble give the AD01 an advantage in clarity over the Sony MH1C, which has similar bass quantity and warmth. Clarity is on-par or slightly better than with the pricier RHA MA750, though it is impressive that the MA750 can keep up at all considering its greater bass emphasis.

In addition to the midrange being more full-bodied and prominent than could be expected, the AD01 sets itself apart from more conventionally v-shaped earphones with treble that’s neither harsh nor sibilant under normal conditions. Sure, it is brighter and less smooth than the golden standard of the Sony MH1C and HiFiMan RE-400, but compared to other v-shaped sets, especially those in the sub-$100 range, the AD01 strikes a good balance between “lively” and “overbearing”. At the very least, treble quality won’t be a constant caveat with every mention as it is, for instance, with VSonic earphones.

The AD01’s presentation maintains a pretty good sense of depth and width, sounding dynamic and engaging. It’s good for the type of warmer, more bass-biased sound it delivers, but naturally not as out-of-the-head compared to brighter, more airy-sounding sets such as the Ostry KC06, VSonic GR07, and DUNU DN-2000.

*Mini Comparisons*

SteelSeries Flux In-Ear ($50)

With a warm, clear, and relatively smooth sound, the Flux immediately became one of my favorite sub-$100 in-ears when it was released in late 2012. However, its durability left something to be desired and it was discontinued two years later. The Alpha & Delta AD01 is the most suitable Flux replacement I’ve come across so far, though it places a bit more emphasis on its bass and treble for a more v-shaped sound. The extra bass results in a slightly more full-bodied sound, yet the AD01 is still clearer than the Flux on the whole.

The Flux still has an advantage in overall balance/accuracy and maintains slightly tighter bass. However, its upper mids and treble, despite being less prominent, are a bit grainier compared to the smoother AD01. The AD01 is also quite a bit more efficient.

HiFiMan RE-400 ($79)

The RE-400 and AD01 fall on different sides of “neutral” in sound – the RE-400 is focused on the midrange while the AD01 is somewhat v-shaped, with boosted highs and lows. The AD01 has quite a bit more low-end power than the RE-400. Its bass is more boomy and intrusive, and the overall sound is warmer. The stronger highs of the AD01 are a little more metallic but at times can seem a touch clearer compared to the more laid-back, smooth, and dull RE-400.

The RE-400 has tighter bass, less full-bodied mids, and more neutral overall tone. Surprisingly, though, despite its brighter tone and thinner note presentation, it is not significantly clearer than the AD01. On the whole, while the RE-400 may offer a more refined and smooth sound, these two earphones are similar enough in performance and so different in sound tuning that each makes the other sound quite “off” in an A:B comparison.

VSonic VSD3S ($50)

Thanks to VSonic’s accelerating product release cycle as of late, the VSD3S is just one of several latest-gen, sub-GR07 models in the company’s lineup. However, to date it rates among my favorite sub-$50 IEMs. The AD01 offers a warmer, smoother, more full-bodied sound compared to the brighter VSD3S. Clarity is generally similar between the two earphones but on tracks with more bass the slightly more controlled low end of the VSD3S pays dividends. The VSD3S is more sibilant, however, and on the whole appears to be a touch more v-shaped. This is also mirrored in its slightly wider presentation, which puts more distance between listener and performance than does the more intimate AD01.

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

The GR07, in one form or another, has been around for nearly five years now and remains the IEM to match for admittance to the high-end IEM caste. At first listen, the GR07 compares to the AD01 just as the VSD3S does – the AD01 is again the warmer, bassier, and fuller-sounding earphone. It is smoother and less sibilance-prone than the brighter GR07, but also more intimate and not as out-of-the-head in terms of presentation.

Where the difference come in are the little details – the GR07 is just that little bit more balanced, poised, and refined than the VSD3S, which really shows when comparing both of the VSonics to a highly capable set like the AD01. The bass boost of the AD01 – and the slight boominess that comes with it – is much more noticeable when pitting the AD01 against the more balanced GR07 than against the VSD3S. The bass of the GR07 is tighter and more controlled. Clarity is better, too, though the difference is natural considering the AD01’s higher bass quantity – in fact, for such an impactful earphone the AD01 keeps up surprisingly well here.

Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear ($99)

Sennheiser’s latest and greatest factors into any conversation where v-shaped ~$100 earphones are involved. It is a great example of the breed, combining deep and powerful bass with a slightly withdrawn midrange and crisp treble for a textbook example of a v-shaped sound profile. The AD01 is slightly warmer than the Momentum and remains more full-bodied and rich through the midrange. The bass of the AD01 is a little boomier while the Momentum’s is tighter, but otherwise the Alpha & Delta unit tends to be a little clearer. This surprised me as I was expecting the thinner-sounding Momentum to pull ahead here, but the more recessed mids don’t do it any favors. The Momentum does have a slightly wider presentation while the bassier and more upfront AD01 has slightly better depth.

Value *(9/10)* – The first earphone from Lend Me UR ears’ Alpha & Delta brand offers a desirable sound tuning and very strong performance at a mid-tier price point. The mildly v-shaped sound delivers good bass punch and warm tone while avoiding most of the caveats of inexpensive v-shaped earphones. Additional perks include replaceable cables and a nice accessory kit. In many ways it reminds me of a 1st-gen HiFiMan release – not in sound tuning, but in the way that the sound and a few other selling points make an earphone that’s a bit rough around the edges recommendable over many established brands.

*Pros: Very impressive warm, slightly v-shaped sound; solid construction with replaceable cables*
*Cons: Bulky and not particularly sleek; L/R markings can be hard to see in low light*





*(2C68) Philips Fidelio S1*


Reviewed July 2015

Brief: One of the two in-ears Philips deems worthy of the flagship “Fidelio” badge

MSRP: $99.95 
 Current Price: *$90 *from ebay.com;  $110 from Amazon.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _5-25k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug w/mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T/Ts200, Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply S200 memory foam tips, and zippered clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – The build quality of the Fidelio S1 and S2 earphones is extremely similar but the S1 features a cheap-looking plastic baffle at the front, in contrast to the all-metal S2. Issues have been reported with the seal around the front baffle on the S1. While this has not been the case with either of the two units I have, a nozzle filter detached on one of my units and had to be glued back in place. The S1 utilizes good-quality flat cables with an in-line microphone and single-button remote
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average, not as bad as could be expected from a shallow-fit design
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Good
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The Fidelio S1 and S2 are built around 13.5mm dynamic drivers – large for IEMs, but definitely not unheard of. Philips chose a half in-ear form factor for the earphones, placing the driver enclosure in the outer ear with an angled nozzle fitting into the ear canal. This sacrifices some noise isolation for the comfort of a shallow seal, but the wide housings fitting 13.5mm drivers put a lower limit on the size of ears that will tolerate these earphones – smaller ears just won’t fit the housings comfortably

Sound* (8.9/10)* – Philips did a spectacularly good job with the tuning of their new high-end Fidelio line, both the two Fidelio in-ears and the on/over-ear models I tried at CES 2015. The Philips Fidelio in-ears sound clear and accurate with just the right amount of bass kick. The low end extends nicely, with very mild overall boost and medium impact reminiscent of the popular VSonic GR07.

The mids are crystal clear, with resolution to rival accuracy-oriented IEMs from VSonic and HiFiMan. The lack of bloat helps, allowing the bass of the Fidelio earphones to shine and keeping the midrange completely clear of bleed. Treble presence is good too – the earphones aren’t lacking at the top end for my tastes, and I’ve been known to enjoy a more energetic sound. At the same time, the treble is free of grain and harshness, though there is some upper midrange lift affecting the tone of guitars and vocals. In comparison, the VSonic GR07 sounds a little peaky and sibilant at the top end while the HiFiMan RE-400 is smoother and more laid-back.

The presentation boasts good width with average depth, reminding me of a slightly more mid-focused and less broad-sounding VSonic GR07. Curiously, the Fidelio earphones are not super efficient for a portable audio product and take more power to reach listening volume than much of the competition. This isn’t a problem except for those who gauge sound quality by maximum attainable volume – there’s still plenty of headroom with portable players. The earphones aren’t picky with sources, either, and sound decent enough from a sub-par Android phone.

There is one small caveat with the both the S1 and S2: they require a very good acoustic seal to perform their best. This is true for almost all IEMs but because of the shallow fit and near-neutral tuning of the Fidelios, there’s not much room for error. The large size of the housings and limited insertion depth play a factor as well. Without a good seal the bass quantity drops, the treble sounds a touch hot and spitty, and the presentation loses its depth.

*Select Comparisons*

Philips Fidelio S2 ($100)

The Philips Fidelio S1 and S2 really don’t differ much, especially when it comes to sound. In addition to its better build quality and fit kit, the pricier S2 model has a slightly more full-bodied sound with a touch more bass. Both can sound a little hot in the treble, especially without an optimal seal, but the S2 is a touch smoother with stock tips. At the same time, it maintains a marginally more airy sound than the lower-end model.

Moe Audio MOE-SS01 ($65)

Like the dual-driver MOE-SS01, the Fidelio S1 boasts mildly enhanced bass and prominent, crisp upper mids and treble. The Philips earphones boast a touch more sub-bass weight compared to the MOE, sounding more solid when it comes to bass punch. Tonally, the Philips earphones are warmer, with mids that appear a bit fuller and smoother. The MOE-SS01 is brighter and harsher. It sounds a little less natural in terms of tone and timbre but easily keeps up in clarity and detail, which is impressive. The presentations tend to be similar, with pretty good width and average depth.

Astrotec AX-35 ($70)

The Fidelio S1 offers up a more balanced sound while the hybrid BA + dynamic-driver AX-35 tends to be more v-shaped in response. The Astrotec unit has more bass but the extra enhancement comes in the mid-bass region, so it doesn’t have an advantage in bass depth. The Fidelio S1 is more mid-centric in comparison and has fuller, more fleshed-out mids, while the AX-35 is a little thinner-sounding. Neither unit is especially smooth – the S1 has some emphasis in the upper mid/lower treble region, which gives guitars a characteristic crunch, while the treble emphasis of the AX-35 comes in higher up, resulting in a slightly more sibilant sound. The AX-35 has a slightly more 3-dimensional presentation with better layering compared to the Philips, and is also noticeably more efficient.

HiFiMan RE-400 ($79)

Compared to HiFiMan’s similarly-priced RE-400 model, the S1 has better bass depth and more bass overall. However, it still sounds a little less full-bodied and not as warm. Its upper midrange and treble are more energetic whereas the RE-400 is smoother and more laid-back up top with a more forgiving treble character. The S1 also has a wider soundstage while the RE-400 is more intimate, but also more even in terms of depth and width.

VSonic VC1000 ($125)

The S1 is a balanced-sounding dynamic-driver earphone that reminds me in many ways of VSonic’s pricier dynamic-driver sets. Compared to the balanced armature-driven VC1000, it boasts more bass, especially deep bass, and has a warmer overall tone. While less powerful, the low end of the VC1000 is tighter and a bit clearer. Its midrange is more prominent in comparison, and on the whole the VC1000 sounds more mid-centric next to the Fidelio S1. Interestingly, while the VC1000 boasts similar, or even slightly greater, treble energy, it actually does a better job of keeping its treble smooth. The Fidelio S1 appears a little harsher and peakier, and tends to be even less forgiving than the VC1000, which itself is not exactly smoothed-over.

Value *(8.5/10)* – The Philips Fidelio S1 earphones are well-designed, user-friendly, and have good fit and finish. Offering a flat and level signature with a bump across the bass range, the Fidelio models also feature tangle-resistant cabling and a built-in microphone and remote. The semi-open design makes them great in situations where the higher noise isolation of most other high-end earphones is undesirable—and a great choice for those who don’t like the more intrusive fit of most other IEMs. The only thing that would steer me away from recommending them is the price of the higher-end Fidelio S2 dropping ever close in today’s market.

*Pros: Shallow-fit design; balanced and capable sound*
*Cons: Mediocre isolation; housings on the large side*


----------



## ljokerl

*Tier 2B ($100-150)*


*(2B1) Monster Turbine*


Reviewed Nov 2010
  
 Details: First ever IEM from Monster Cable, which they dubbed an “In-Ear Speaker”
 Current Price: *$149.95 *from Amazon.com (MSRP: $179.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _3.8’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), silicone tri-flange tips (2 sizes), and buttoned hard leather case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Weighty metal housings exude an air of quality and solidity. Unfortunately the same can’t be said for the cabling, which is only a little thicker than the Klipsch S4s’. I do really like the discrete L/R color markings that are nevertheless very easy to see
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Very good isolation for a dynamic IEM
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Low when worn over-the-ear; bothersome otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – I have no comfort issues with these. They feel heavy but don’t ever break seal and I can forget about them when worn over-the-ear

 Sound *(7.5/10)* – Right out of the box the sound of the Turbines exceeded my expectations (which, I concede, may have been fairly low). The most striking aspect is the bass – it is deep, smooth, and textured – exactly as advertised by Monster, for once. There’s quite a good amount of it - fast, natural, dynamic bass that doesn’t bleed into the lower mids. While not as tight as some other earphones, the quality of the lows produced by the Turbines is top notch and balances well with the quantity. Moving up, we come to the midrange, which is neither recessed nor forward but quite effortless and very dynamic. The treble is equally natural, with moderate extension and surprising accuracy. On the whole, soundstaging is about average, perhaps a little narrower than the Klipsch S4, but the entire signature is very smooth, extremely dynamic, and surprisingly balanced.

 Value *(7/10)* – I went into this test fearing that the Turbines would end up being Skullcandy’s big brother, offering overblown “subwoofer” bass and little else. I am extremely glad that I was wrong. I feel that these would be great phones at the $99 price point. Don’t get me wrong – they are very competitive IEMs and my first recommendation for something fun and dynamic. What the Turbines excel at is offering a popular signature while at the same time pleasing the audiophile in me with their speed, depth, and texture. However, I still feel that the Turbines would be more comfortable at the $100 price point, especially now that the improved Turbine Pros are pushing the $200 mark.

*Pros: Excellent fit and finish, excellent bass, very smooth, fun, and dynamic sound
 Cons: Cables don’t inspire confidence, can be too bass heavy for some*


*(2B2) Digital Designs DD DXB-01 EarbuDDs*
  

Reviewed Mar 2010
  
 Details: Upmarket tunable earphones from car audio manufacturer Digital Designs
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $119)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _93 dB_ | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Single flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), adhesive foam tape (2 strips), and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Metal housings sheathed in rubber feature long integrated strain reliefs and seem to be shared with the rare Sony Qualia MDR-EXQ1 canalphones. The plastic cabling is thick and sturdy. Oddly, the 3.5mm plug has 4 contact points despite the earphones having no microphone
 Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Rather poor due to the massive vents
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Cable is too energetic and tends to bounce around a lot. Lack of cord cinch and the difficulty of wearing these over-the-ear doesn’t help matters
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Hard to get a good insertion depth wearing these cord-down due to the short housing and massive strain relief. The strain relief and unwieldy cord also make them a bit difficult to wear over-the-ear so cable guides are highly recommended

 Sound *(6.2/10)* – The distinguishing feature of the DD-DXB01 is the tunable bass response. Unlike the usual implementation using a knob or even interchangeable filters or ports, Digital Designs’ solution is rather crude – the two supplied strips of foam tape can be cut into pieces and used to cover some or all of the vents on the front of the earphone.
 With the vents open the earbuDDs drown in massive amounts of medium-quality bass. In this configuration they remind me of the V-Moda Vibe II – smooth, dynamic, warm, and slightly muddy at the low end. Cover up the vents, though, and they improve dramatically, tightening up and exhibiting surprising bass control. With the vents obstructed the DD-DXB01 becomes a much more controlled earphone with very little bass bleed and a slightly warm midrange. There is still plenty of bass to go around but it takes on a rather tame character. The mids are airy and articulate but slightly distant and missing a bit of detail compared to competitors like the RE0 and Phonak PFEs. Because of this the DXB01 works pretty well with low-bitrate mp3 files. The 93dB sensitivity also means that hissy sources won’t be much of an issue Treble extension is average and with the vents obstructed the treble does lose some of its smoothness, but not enough to be fatiguing. All-in-all the DXB01 is a good-sounding phone; I just can’t help feeling that the tuning feature detracts more value than it adds.

 Value *(5/10)* – Though there are many bass-heavy earphones in its price range, the DD-DXB01 stands out with its rock-solid build quality and ‘tuning’ feature. Unfortunately the implementation of the latter is rather crude and feels more like an afterthought and less like true functionality. I only really like the sound these produce with the vents fully closed and so would prefer them to be sold that way (and at half the price). As it stands there are far better options at the price.

*Pros: Tank-like build, surprisingly clean bass with the vents obstructed
 Cons: Foam tape ‘tuning system’ is akin to a bad joke, no cord cinch, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




4-pole plug*


*(2B3) Denon AH-C710*
  

Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Denon’s newest mid-range entry meant to replace the aging C700/C751 models
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $149.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _5-25k Hz_ | Cable: 2.3’_ I-plug + 2.6’ L-plug extension_
 Nozzle Size: 5.5_mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single flanges,_ _Comply T400_
 Wear Style: *Straight down *_or over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips, extension cord, shirt clip, and hard carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The large metal shells with plastic nozzles feel very solid. Cabling is modular but thin and tangle-prone. The extension connector is sightly bulky in comparison to those used by Jays and others
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The housings are fairly large and don’t really allow for deep insertion but isolation is passable nonetheless
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Quite low although wearing these over-the-ear is not as easy as I would have liked
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells of the AH-C710 are large but not too heavy and boast an ergonomic angled-nozzle design. They are very comfortable to wear in the conventional manner but the large housing diameter makes them problematic for cord-up fit – more slender housings such as those of the Klipsch S4 and Auvio Armatures fare far better in this regard
  
 Sound *(7.7/10) *– The Denon AH-C710s are lively but not downright aggressive earphones. The bass is strong and smooth, extending nearly deep enough to compete with the likes of the FA Eterna. Bass power is impressive and the impact tends towards ‘boomy’ rather than ‘punchy’, but not in a bad way. The Denons do have a slight mid-bass emphasis but no Kilimanjaro-sized hump as with the Senn IE8. The low end carries some warmth up into the midrange and can be too heavy at times but remains well-layered, aided by the large soundstage and relatively transparent midrange.
  
 The mids are clear and detailed, neither too thick nor too thin, and quite transparent in comparison to the more upfront and aggressive top end. Despite the AH-C710 being a bass- and treble- heavy earphone, the midrange is not easily overshadowed and blends well in to the rest of the sound signature. The treble, on the other hand, is very prominent and sparkly. It can be a touch harsh and sibilant at first but settles down with time. The C710 does lack that last bit of extension that earphones like the Hippo VB and RE0 revel in, making it sound slightly less effortless and accurate. Still, the treble remains well filled-out and quite lively, if somewhat colored.
  
 The presentation of the AH-C710 is spacious and well-separated, with above-average soundstage width and depth and solid, though not pinpoint-accurate, positioning. The Denons never sound too intimate (a-la JVC FXC80) or too spread-out (a-la IE8). The overall presentation is quite immersive and works well with the dynamic sound signature. They may not be as outrageously large-sounding as the Eterna or IE8 but they are engrossing and enjoyable. Indeed, vivaciousness is a recurring theme with these earphones – they aren’t relaxing to listen to and may be too intense for long listening sessions but they certainly do carry great energy and score high on the fun factor. Remarkably, the fun factor is something the Denons maintain even at low listening volumes, which is rare for dynamic-driver IEMs. The fact that the 16-ohm C710s are very sensitive doesn’t hurt either, though minor hiss may be present with some sources. 
  
 Value *(7.5/10)* – The Denon AH-C710 is a competitive entry from one of Japan’s best-known audio firms, offering a convenient and user-friendly form factor, solid build quality, and low microphonics. However, some of the design choices, especially in the cabling, are baffling. The cord is quite thin and very prone to tangling and its length is several inches too short without the extension and quite excessive with it. A shorter or longer cord would have made more sense to me. And then there is the included carrying case, which is very frustrating to use, especially on the move. It makes the Sennheiser IE8 and Phiaton PS200 cases seem sensible in comparison. Usability complaints aside, there is plenty to like about both the sound signature and presentation of the AH-C710. The earphones are lively and spacious, with powerful bass, smooth mids, and sparkly treble. The current $130 price tag is slightly excessive for those who don’t find added value in the Denon brand, putting the C710 in the same price category as the Panasonic HJE900, Klipsch Custom 3, and even Radius DDM, but those who can find them for less or are stuck paying import duties on competing products could do much, much worse than the Denons.
  
*Pros: Powerful, spacious, and lively sound, comfortable to wear cord-down, well-built, low microphonics*
*Cons: Over-the-ear fit not for everyone, tangle-prone cabling, quirky cord lengths*
  
  
*(2B4) Westone 1*


Reviewed Nov 2010
  
 Details: Entry-level model from Westone’s consumer series
 Current Price: *$129* from earphonesolutions.com (MSRP: $199.00); $129 for T1 model w/mic
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _30Ω_ | Sens: _117 dB_ | Freq: _20-16k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single flange (Shure Gray Flex), Shure Olive_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange conical (3 sizes) and rounded (3 sizes) silicone tips, triple-flange silicone tips, Comply foam tips (3 sizes), ¼” adapter, in-line volume control, filter and tip cleaning tool, and hard clamshell carrying case with carabiner
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The housings are plastic and extremely lightweight, as is the sturdy multi-strand twisted cable. The y-split, housing entry, and 3.5mm L-plug are all very well-relieved. Although the construction of the Westone 1 just doesn’t seem as solid as that of the higher-end UM3X, it’s still far above average in its price tier
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Good due to the ergonomic shells
 Microphonics *(5/5) *– The W1 can only be worn over-the-ear and microphonics are nonexistent
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The shells are extremely lightweight and ergonomic but don’t fill my ears quite as nicely as those of the larger UM3X or even Meelec M6, requiring re-adjustment every once in a while. Cabling is very light and flexible, as with all Westone earphones

 Sound *(7.6/10)* – Although the Westone 1 is undoubtedly one of the top earphones in its class when it comes to overall usability, the sound leaves a different impression. The general signature is a balanced one, with a very slight downward slant resulting from top-end roll-off. As is the case with many single-armature earphones, the transducer of the W1 struggles to cover the entire frequency range, giving up a slight bit of extension at the bottom and a more noticeable amount at the top compared to most of my similarly-priced dynamics. The bass of the Westones is relatively flat and carries decent impact for a single-armature earphone. It won’t keep up with the Q-Jays or DBA-02 in fullness but doesn’t fare quite as poorly as the Ety ER6i or Apple dual-drivers, either. It is fast and tight, but not overly so. Texturing is also good but not on-level with my VISang R03, Fischer Audio Eterna, or even RE-ZERO. Put simply, the dynamic-driver earphones in the W1’s price bracket are just more effortless when it comes to reproducing low notes.

 The slightly forward midrange of the Westone 1, on the other hand, is definitely an asset. It is quite smooth and transparent and works especially well with female vocals. Vocal sibilance is completely absent and the tonal character is quite neutral. Clarity and detail are good but not on the same level as those of the cheaper HiFiMan RE-ZERO. The same goes for the treble – aside from the top-end roll-off, the Westone suffers from a lack of treble sparkle. The high end is very smooth but lacks the crispness of earphones such as the RE-ZERO - as with the low end, the treble of the Westones sounds a bit constrained next to a good dynamic-driver IEM.

 When it comes to presenting audio, the Westones again leave me wanting just a bit more out of them. Though rather neutral and transparent overall, I found the W1 a bit bleak in coloration, not unlike the UM3X and RE-ZERO. This sort of desaturated coloration is an acquired taste and can definitely be a positive trait for those used to it, but can also be somewhat boring with the wrong tracks. The soundstage is reasonably wide and deep and tends to distance the listener from the performance, with the exception of vocals, which again come through quite strong and intimate. The separation is good and the earphones do sound fairly well-layered, but not nearly as much so as the UM3X. The W1 is also more forgiving of less-than-stellar sources, bitrates, and mastering. As indicated by the physical specifications, the Westone 1 also doesn’t mind having a bit of extra juice to play around with, making small gains in balance and resolution when amped.

 Value *(8/10)* – The Westone 1 is an extremely well-rounded mid-range product by virtue of its excellent pack-ins, solid build quality, and impressive isolation and fit. It is the sound that can make or break an earphone, however, and the sonic qualities of the single balanced armature used by the Westone 1 are polarizing. On the one hand, the earphone is refined, smooth, and neutral. On the other, it lacks the crispness and clarity I’ve come to expect from mid-range BA-based models and even certain dynamics. Put simply, as far as single-BA designs go, I don’t feel that the sound of the Westone 1 is worth nearly $100 more than that of the budget-oriented Soundmagic PL50. The HiFiMan earphones pose a problem as well - both the RE0 and RE-ZERO offer a similarly neutral and somewhat bleak sound with fewer drawbacks and at a lower price. For those who value the Westone name, the superb user-friendliness of the W1, or their particular sound signature, these earphones make a very good mid-range buy. For audio performance alone, they are simply outclassed by some of the other options on the market.

*Pros: Impressive fit, isolation, build quality, and accessory pack; pleasant overall sound, great with female vocals
 Cons: A bit rolled off on either end, not as crisp or clear as some of the competition*
  
  
*(2B5) HiFiMan RE262*


Reviewed Nov 2010; 2010 single-ended version shown
  
 Details: Latest dynamic-driver offering from one of Head-Fi’s favourite brands
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $149)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _150Ω_ | Sens: _95 dB_ | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Large stock bi-flange, Meelec ‘balanced’ bi-flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* –  Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, replacement filters (5 pairs), and shirt clip; latest version adds storage case,balanced extension cable, single-ended extension cable, and single-ended channel swap extension cable
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The glossy plastic housings of the RE262 are far more to my liking than the gummy shells of the RE252 not only in ergonomics but in general usability. The RE262 doesn’t collect dust and features proper strain reliefs as well as metal nozzles with replaceable mesh filters. The new cable, too, is thicker, sturdier, and less tangle-prone. The modular system adds an extra layer of protection and the new beefy 45º L-plugs and proper strain reliefs all around inspire confidence
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – The channel swap adapter allows the RE272 to be worn cable-up, which should help provide a deeper fit. With the stock bi-flanges or other deep-sealing tips the isolation is surprisingly good
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – With the new cord cable noise is very low when worn cable-down and nonexistent cable-up
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – There are now a total of four ways to wear the 262 with the additional cord configurations provided by the included adapters. I find three of them to be quite comfortable and would imagine most people won’t have trouble finding at least one that works

 Sound *(9.1/10)* – HIFiMan has long been trying to perfect the high-end ‘neutral and balanced’ dynamic-driver earphone, starting with the RE2 and RE0 and then moving to the RE252 and RE-ZERO. I have owned all four of the above and, with slight reservations about the RE2, loved them all. To be fair, until very recently there was little competition for the HiFiMan sound in the dynamic segment and I had a feeling that the company may venture outside its comfort zone with the new flagship. Venture they did, and what a departure it is – at first listen the RE262 is a vastly different animal from the more analytical Head-Direct earphones with no thinned-out midrange or desaturated tonality anywhere in sight.

 At the heart of the RE262 is still an impressively clean and quick dynamic driver with plenty of headroom – more so due to the 150Ω impedance and low sensitivity. Indeed, the RE262 is a power-hungry beast of an IEM – and one that drains the battery in my much-abused Cowon J3 in less than 8 hours when running unamped. Though still very impressive right out of the J3, I do feel that the RE262 benefits from a dedicated amp, sounding tighter, cleaner, and bigger with added power (more on that later).

 At the base of the RE262’s sound signature is a smooth and articulate low end. The bass is plentiful for my tastes and has better depth and impact than on any of the other HiFiMan earphones I’ve tried (which is all of them except the RE1). Attack and decay are also more naturally extended than with the RE262’s siblings – the earphone easily has the most fleshed-out lows of the HiFiMan range (again, cannot speak for the RE1). The core driver speed is still there, however, and the earphones never miss a beat. They also aren’t as rumbly or textured at the lowest of lows as one would expect from a high-end dynamic-driver set from any other manufacturer. The Sennheiser IE7 has comparable subbass quantity but the IE8, the Monster Turbine range, and even the Denon C710 place significantly more emphasis and weight on the lowest lows. In terms of presentation the bass is soft and notes come out warm and somewhat ‘rounded’ – those who like aggressive, edgy bass will likely be disappointed by the RE262’s tactfulness.

 It is the midrange, however, that is the true meat of the RE262’s sound. The mids – especially the lower mids - are forward, warm, and very smooth, always remaining at the focal point of the sound signature. ‘Fluid’ is the best word I can think of when it comes to comprehensively describing the mids of the 262. There is none of the thinness commonly associated with the RE0 and, to a lesser extent, the RE-ZERO and RE252, but the RE262 is not a thick-sounding earphone. Excessively thick mids can sound a little sloppy and opaque on a dynamic-driver earphone but the RE262 suffers from none of that - it is a fairly transparent earphone with great detail despite being less crisp compared to, say, the Ety ER4S or DBA-02. Interestingly, excessive midrange ‘bloom’ actually works well for certain armature-based earphones such as the Earsonics SM3, but that’s a matter for another discussion. On the whole, the bottom-skewed midrange balance of the RE262 may not be to everyone's liking but it is what it is - for those in search of an earphone that emphasizes no particular frequency range and has relatively 'flat' mids there's always the DBA-02 or RE252.

 The treble of the RE262 is laid-back but not rolled-off - smooth and completely inoffensive but not missing altogether. The RE262 isn’t a particularly dark earphone despite the lack of treble emphasis and even carries a bit of sparkle at times. Treble detail is good but not RE-ZERO-good and the RE262 doesn’t quite have the airy feel of the RE-ZERO at the top. It is still competent and highly resolving but the energy just isn’t there compared to brighter earphones. I’m not one to pass judgment on a particular sound signature and won’t claim that a brighter presentation is more natural on the whole. I do, however, know that cymbal crashes are supposed to be slightly startling and I don’t get that sense from the RE262. In that respect, too, the RE262 is in good company – its treble is no less prominent than that of the Monster Miles Davis or Westone UM3X – just don’t expect them to match any of the other Head-Direct earphones in top-end presence.

 Aside from the seductively fluid midrange the biggest strength of the RE262 for me is the presentation. The earphones boast both and excellent soundstage and headstage – still a relatively rare occurrence in the IEM realm. Compared to my RE-ZERO, the RE262 is decidedly out-of-the-head –sounding. It really gives a great sense of ambient space without losing track of individual instruments or diluting other location cues. Positioning is helped by good -- perhaps even excessive – layering; the RE262 really leaves no doubts as to what is in a track’s foreground and what is in the background. When amped, the RE262 sounds even bigger and the soundstage seems to lose its outer limits – something even the stadium-sized sonic space of the IE8 can’t quite pull off. In addition, an amped RE262 needs less volume to shine, revealing more detail and texture at lower output levels. Naturally the effortless dynamics of the earphone are an asset here as well. Tonally, the RE262 makes no attempts to hide its coloration from the listener, but then that’s part of its charm. The RE262 really is a very basic and honest earphone – it doesn’t pretend to be neutral or analytical, nor does it pretend to be a conventional high-end dynamic with loads of subbass power and heavy midbass emphasis – and I like that.

 Value *(9.5/10)* – Despite being enough of a sonic departure for HiFiMan to cause some die-hard fans to feel left out, the RE262 is an incredibly capable earphone with a fairly unique sound signature. There is no doubt in my mind that the older RE252 is the more neutral and accurate set, but it is also the more boring one. The RE262, on the other hand, is quite captivating with its greater (albeit not too great) bass weight, smooth and forward mids, and laid-back, non-fatiguing treble. The lower-end RE-ZERO, too, is crisper-sounding and brighter but lacks the liquidity of the new flagship and its soundstage is quite claustrophobic in comparison. HiFiMan went back to the drawing board with the design as well, which shows with the RE262 being both more durable and more ear-friendly than the RE252. As always, do make sure that the sound signature of the earphone is the right one for you before dropping $150 but aside from that the folks at HiFiMan have done a great job reducing the list of caveats usually attached to their earphones.

*Pros: Immersive presentation, seductive midrange, smooth and effortless sound; can be worn over-the-ear
 Cons: Still no carrying case included, cable-down fit not for everyone*
  
  
*(2B6) Monster Beats by Dr. Dre Tour*


  
Reviewed Dec 2010
  
 Details: In-ear model from Monster’s Beats by Dr. Dre line
 Current Price: *$150* from amazon.com (MSRP: $179.95); $170 for ControlTalk version w/mic
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Single-flange (3 sizes) and triple-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– The housing construction is a combination of different materials, with the driver chamber made of aluminum and attached to a plastic nozzle and stem. The flat cable seems reasonably sturdy and remains tangle-free but unfortunately has no strain relief to protect it from the edges of the stems, y-split, or 3.5mm plug casing
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The long, angled nozzles allow for deep insertion of the Tours. Isolation is very reasonable with correct fitment
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – The flat cable carries less noise than the majority of conventional cords but the Tours are difficult to wear over-the-ear to eliminate microphonics completely
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The tours are ergonomically-designed but rather large and limited in versatility by the long and wide stems. In addition, they sound very poor with a shallow fit so deep insertion is pretty much required with the earphones.

 Sound *(6.1/10)* – Being familiar with Monster’s Turbine line as well as the Jamz & Lil’ Jamz, I was hoping that the Beats Tour would stick closer to the original Turbines in signature, especially since the two earphones share a price point. Unfortunately, the Tours, with their highly colored, aggressive signature, are far more similar to the Lil’ Jamz than any of the other Monster earphones. Also like the Lil Jamz, the Beats are less forgiving of a poor seal or shallow insertion than the Turbines or regular Jamz and do not sound their best with the narrow-channel silicone tips that Monster includes – aftermarket silicones such as Sony Hybrids are better. With good tips and a proper fit, the beats are still brighter and more colored-sounding than the Turbines but at the very least show improvement over the signature of the Lil’ Jamz.

 The low end of the Beats is extremely strong, putting out more mid-bass than the Turbine but with a touch less impact than the Eterna. The Turbine is slightly more controlled and textured as well but the difference isn’t great. Sub-bass extension is there but the sheer amount of mid-bass often overshadows the low rumble that earphones such as the Hippo VB portray accurately. Detail is closer to other mainstream bass-heavy earphones, such as the Thinksound TS02, but lags behind the Eterna and VB. Ironically, though the Beats are marketed as ‘High Resolution’ earphones, resolution is one of the many things they could use more of.

 There’s a small amount of bass bleed distinguishable in the lower midrange but on the whole the mids are crisp and clear. Clarity is slightly better than that of the Turbine and Thinksound TS02 – two earphones that are also significantly warmer than the Beats. Detail is lacking slightly in comparison to the Turbine but the Beats are fairly aggressive and push the detail they do have on the listener, appearing more revealing than they actually are. There is unevenness in the upper midrange and lower treble, resulting in a lot of treble sparkle but also quite a bit of harshness and occasional bouts of sibilance. The Turbine actually has slightly more emphasis on the upper midrange but maintains its composure better and sounds far smoother than the Beats on the whole. Expectedly, the Beats can be fatiguing at times, especially for those with a low treble tolerance. Upper midrange peaks aside, the Beats have surprisingly competent treble – not particularly detailed or textured but with good presence across the range and surprising clarity.

 Presentation, however, is where the Beats fall quite flat for me. Despite the plentiful treble sparkle, there’s a slight lack of air, making the Beats sound stuffier than the Thinksound TS02 or Phiaton PS 20. Soundstage width is average but the Turbine still sounds a bit less closed-in. Of course next to an earphone with a truly out-of-the-head soundstage, such as the Eterna or PS 20, the Beats sound quite narrow, but that’s expected. Soundstage depth is average for an earphone in the Beats’ price bracket as well but the separation leaves a lot to desired – layering is quite poor and the presentation of the Beats is somewhat similar to the ‘wall of sound’ that I ran into recently with the Skullcandy FMJ, albeit not as forward and far less offensive on the whole. As a result, the Beats are not ideal for busier, denser tracks – classical, big-band jazz, and heavy metal are clearly not genres Monster had in mind when tuning the earphones. In addition, the heavy coloration of the earphones throws off the timbre – the Thinksound TS02, Turbine, and Eterna all make instruments sound more natural. Lastly, it should be noted that the Beats Tour are more sensitive than either the Jamz or the Turbines and exhibit hiss with some of my more poorly-matched sources, which came as a bit of a surprise as even the top-of-the-range Turbine Coppers do a good job of suppressing hiss.

 Value *(5.5/10) *– The Beats Tour by Dr. Dre were one of the first in-ears released under the Monster brand and remain a practical set for day-to-day use two years later. With a proper fit, which can be more difficult to achieve than with the Turbine and Jamz models, the Beats are fairly comfortable, have decent isolation, and carry little cable noise. Sonically, the Beats Tour are ‘shouty’ earphones, lacking the dynamic range and separation needed for the proper portrayal of musical nuances, but have lots of clarity, bass impact, and treble sparkle. There are genres that they perform relatively well with but even then the signature and presentation of the Beats fatigue me fairly quickly. Those looking for a colored, bass-heavy sound may be better off with cheaper models such as the Thinksound TS02 or Fischer Audio Eterna, or the Turbines for the same money. Additionally, if a deal on the Beats Tour seems too good to be true, it probably is – eBay and most Chinese deal sites are completely flooded with fakes, though I cannot be sure that the real thing sounds significantly better than the counterfeits.

*Pros: User-friendly cable, 3-year warranty, impressive clarity, heavy but not offensively bloated bass
 Cons: Heavily colored sound; can be harsh & fatiguing; poor separation & layering*
  

*(2B7) Etymotic Research HF5 / ACS Custom Tips*
  

Reviewed May 2011

 Details: mid-range single-armature consumer earphone from the pioneer of universal IEMs
 Current Price: *$120* from amazon.com (MSRP: $149); $140 for HF2 with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _*ACS Custom Tips*, Stock triple-flanges, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Triple-flange silicone tips (2 sizes), Etymotic foam tips, Etymotic Glider tips, replacement filters (1 set), filter replacement tool, shirt clip, and zippered velour carrying pouch; *ACS Tips*:_ cleaning tool, insertion lubricant, and zippered leather carrying pouch_
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The HF5 is similar in design to Etymotic’s other models and features slim, tubular housings and Kevlar-reinforced cabling. Unlike the aluminum-shelled MC5, the body of the HF5 is all-plastic. The nozzles are quite thin so care should be taken when changing eartips. The cord is slightly thicker than that of the MC5 but also carries a bit more memory character, preserving its shape for some time after being coiled up. Small strain reliefs are used to protect the cable on housing entry and the hockey stick-shaped 3.5mm plug is designed to withstand a good amount of abuse; *ACS Tips:* _The tips are made out of soft medical-grade silicone and molding quality is excellent - no cracks or bubbles are visible in the material. The color of the ACS logo on each tip differentiates which earpiece they go on (red for right, blue for left)_
 Isolation *(4.5/5)* – The combination of a slim, deep-insertion design and sealed housings gives the HF5 mind-bogglingly good isolation – passive attenuation just doesn’t get much better than this with universal-fit earphones; *ACS Tips (5/5)*: _Amazingly, the ACS custom tips are an improvement over standard Ety sleeves when it comes to isolation, which makes them dangerously isolating. Wearing them around traffic or anywhere lack of auditory awareness may be a safety concern is not recommended. The consistent, deep-ear seal of the custom-molded tips means that there is absolutely no way for significant amounts of ambient noise to leak in. Of course low frequencies will still be audible in via bone conduction but when inserted properly the ACS Etys isolate about as much as in-ear earphones can_
 Microphonics* (4/5)* – Quite low when worn cable-down, nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The balanced armature drivers used in the HF5 are smaller than the dynamic transducers used in the MC5, allowing the earphones to be lightweight and extremely slim in diameter. Like all Etymotic in-ears, the HF5 are deep-insertion earphones, which can feel intrusive at first, but with the right tips they can be very comfortable; *ACS Tips (5/5)*:_ As with full-shell customs, there is a slight learning curve to inserting custom-fitted Ety earphones. Once mastered, however, it is much quicker than putting on a full-shell acrylic custom. When inserted correctly, the tips should press very lightly in all directions against the ear canal, providing the same comfort level as a soft foam tip but noticeably greater isolation. For the HF5, the ACS custom silicone sleeves provide the best of both worlds – the consistent, deep-insertion fit of triple-flange silicone tips with the long-term comfort and stability of foamies. As with most customs manufacturers, ACS offers a 30-day fit guarantee - if the tips do not fit comfortably and securely, by all means have them re-fitted until perfect_

 Sound *(8.8/10) *– For Etymotic Research, the sonic ideal has always been neutrality and accuracy. Those familiar with other Ety models will not be surprised to learn that the low end of the HF5 will do little to satisfy a basshead. The bass put out by the single balanced armature is extremely tight and controlled but the tiny drivers don’t move a whole lot of air - those looking for eardrum-quaking gobs of impact will be sorely disappointed. Instead, the bass is quick and highly detailed. The speed and clarity of the earphones allows them to texture notes in ways lower-end sets simply cannot but opinions will undoubtedly be split on whether such a presentation is ‘natural’. For those who think ‘natural’ sound hinges on realistic attack and decay times as well as note weight and presence, a dynamic-driver earphone will provide more satisfactory bass response. On if the other hand if ‘natural’ means hearing all of the nuances on the the track down to the tiniest detail (including mastering and compression flaws), the HF5 leaves little to be desired. No matter how dense the track, the HF5 never misses a beat. Low end extension is quite linear down to around 30Hz - no exaggerated sub-bass or mid-bass bloat to be found here. Interestingly, the dynamic-driver Etymotic MC5 responds to equalization a little better than the HF5 does but in both cases even the best equalizer can only do so much - those looking for rumbling, full-bodied bass will want to stay away from Etys.
  
The midrange of the HF5 is again typical Etymotic – clear, detailed, and quite neutral in tone.  The mids are smooth and free of grain, though a poor seal can result in vocal sibilance. Of course if the sibilance is present on the track, the HF5 will be relentless in pointing it out. Those looking for an earphone that will make 128kbps mp3s sound better should probably look elsewhere or at the very least consider the MC5 as an alternative. The treble is balanced with the rest of the signature, as tends to be the case with analytical earphones, but not so overly prominent that it becomes fatiguing. It is crisp and very highly-detailed, with excellent extension across the audible range and impressive definition. These earphones, like all Etymotics, are not for those who prefer laid-back, smoothed-over treble. 
 
The presentation is perhaps where the HF5 is most similar to the MC5 – both do a good job of separating out individual instruments but neither provides the type of highly immersive three-dimensional listening experience one may get from a top-tier earphone. The soundstage has good width but mediocre depth and height. That said, the highly accurate and impeccably detailed HF5 still sounds plenty convincing and easily relates the differences between foreground and background instruments to the listener – it just doesn’t give the same three-dimensional sonic image as, for example, the ATH-CK10 or Westone 2. Tonally, the HF5 is quite neutral, foregoing the warm accented lower harmonics of cheaper earphones for bright and crisp treble. Its timbre might seem slightly ‘off’ to those used to warmer signatures and dynamic drivers, but instruments are no more difficult to differentiate with the HF5.

*ACS Tips*: The sound quality of the HF5 depends heavily on the integrity of the acoustic seal between the drivers and the listener’s ear canal. Now, this is true for all in-ear earphones but because the HF5, like all Etys, is tuned for maximum accuracy and realism, a good seal is arguably even more important with it than with most other in-ears. Bass response, especially, is at risk with a mediocre seal.

 Expectedly, the custom tips are not capable of radically changing the sound signature of the earphone but they do provide a consistently perfect seal, bringing out the absolute best in the HF5. The sound quality is very similar to what I got when inserting the triple-flange silicone tips as far into my ears as I could tolerate – not a comfortable proposition for long-term listening enjoyment. If there are any sound quality improvements brought about by the custom tips, they are mostly tiny changes in imaging and sub-bass extension and response. Of course if poor seal quality led to shrill treble or recessed mids with universal tips, the ACS custom sleeves will remedy that as well, but they will not affect the core signature of Etymotic earphones in any major way.

 Value *(9/10)* – The Etymotic HF5 is a thoroughly modern take on the classic Etymotic design philosophy. The single balanced armature transducer produces clear and detailed sound that never misses a beat, conveying every nuance of an audio track with impeccable accuracy and no added coloration. As is the case with many high-end armature-based earphones, the HF5 lacks the enhanced bass response, warmth, and thickness of mainstream competitors. The slim, deep-insertion form factor, eerie levels of isolation, and subdued aesthetics all make the HF5 a quintessential Etymotic earphone. For those who are simply looking to dabble in entry-level audiophile sound, the cheaper and sturdier MC5 may be a better match but if absolute fidelity is a priority, the HF5 is hard to beat for the money.

*Pros: Stellar noise isolation; impeccably clear, detailed, balanced, and accurate sound; comes in three flavours of varying smartphone functionality
 Cons: Deep-insertion form factor takes getting used to; sound signature not for everyone; lower-end MC5 is built better*

*ACS Tips (8/10)*: The Etymotic Custom Fit program is a collaboration between Etymotic Research and UK-based customs manufacturer ACS to provide custom-molded eartips for Etymotic’s universal-fit models – for an additional charge, of course. The tips carry an all-inclusive $100 price tag, making them one of the cheapest products of the sort. The total cost of a custom-molded Etymotic earphone runs somewhere between $180 and $330, depending on the starting model - still a fairly low price in the customs realm. Furthermore, while full-shell customs with smartphone controls are still very rare, the custom-fit HF2, HF3, and MC3 models provide all of the functionality of a stock headset with the sound of a custom-fitted audiophile-level listening device. Combine that with the comparative ease of use, superb noise isolation, and faultless comfort of silicone custom sleeves and the investment starts making more sense.

*Pros: Stellar noise isolation and long-term comfort; consistently perfect seal; easier and quicker to insert than full custom earphones
 Cons: Proper insertion takes a bit of practice; will not improve sound quality for those who get a very good fit with stock triple-flanges*
  
  
*(2B8) Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99*


Reviewed Aug 2011

 Details: Audio-Technica’s priciest dynamic-driver earphone
 Current Price: *$150* from buy.com (MSRP: $229.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _5-28k Hz_ | Cable: _2’ I-plug + 2’ L-plug extension_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _*Stock single-flanges*; generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), 2’ extension cable, cleaning cloth, and magnetic clasp carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The housings of the CKM99 are made of equal parts sturdy plastics and sturdier titanium. The design is of the half in-ear type, with flexible strain reliefs all around and a modular cable. Unfortunately, the cord is not as thick as with the higher-end CK10 and CK100 models, lacks a sliding cinch, and has a greater tendency to tangle. Color-coded left/right markings on the inner side of the housings are a nice touch
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Despite being a half in-ear design, the ear-filling CKM99 provides surprisingly good isolation
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low despite cable-down form factor
 Comfort *(4/5) *– Despite their size and heft, the 14mm housings fit snugly and securely. The excellent molding quality and a design that completely avoids sharp edges are partly responsible though those with smaller outer ears may find the CKM99 too bulky

 Sound *(8.6/10) *– The ATH-CKM99 is Audio-Technica’s flagship dynamic and the company’s take on a high-end consumer-class earphone. The signature of the earphone strikes a balance between the typical high-end dynamic-driver IEM and Audio-Technica’s bright-and-shiny house sound. The end result is lively and versatile. The bass is plentiful but never excessive. It is deep and controlled but a little soft in character. A mild mid-bass hump is present, giving the low end greater overall quantity than either the VSonic GR07 or the Sennheiser IE7. The IE7 really isn’t very far behind in slam or power but its forward midrange causes the low end to stand out less. The GR07, on the other hand, is clearly quicker and tighter than the CKM99. Though it lacks most of the mid-bass boost, the GR07 manages to be both more resolving and more immediate in impact. Those who value bass body and fullness of note over speed and accuracy will likely prefer the bass of the Audio-Technicas by a margin. Coming from the GR07, however, the CKM99 sounds a bit too boomy.

 The midrange of the CKM99 is slightly recessed next to the emphasized bass and abundant treble. There is a touch of warmth imparted by the bass hump but the CKM99 is still a neutral-to-bright earphone on the whole. Clarity and detail are good - similar to the Sennheiser IE7 and very respectable for a dynamic-driver earphone. The mids are extremely smooth and very fluid – occasionally too much so, leading to a slight loss of texture. The GR07 sounds slightly dryer, less smoothed-over, and not quite as polite as Audio-Technica’s flagship.

 The treble is where the CKM99 attempts to revert to Audio-Technica’s house sound. There is a fair bit of emphasis starting at the upper midrange that, in contrast to the VSonic GR07, doesn’t seem to flatten out a whole lot with burn-in. As a result, the CKM99 is a bright-sounding earphone and can be a touch hot and spitty with certain tracks. The treble peaks seem to be far broader and lower down than with my ATH-CK10, so a much wider range of source material is affected. Compared to the GR07, the sibilance of the ATH-CKM99 seems a little more widespread and a whole lot more violent. My GR07, post burn-in, simply has far shallower treble peaks. Aside from the sibilance added to some recordings, the treble sounds very clean and refined. Extension is good, a-la GR07, and there is no excess (and certainly no lack) of sparkle. Like the VSonics, the Audio-Technicas aren’t ideal for high volume listening but work well otherwise with their solid detail, clarity, and bass impact.

 Presentation is an area where most higher-end Audio-Technica earphones I’ve heard shine, and the CKM99 is no exception. The emphasized treble gives the sound an airy, lightweight feel. The stage is above average in size and extends well in all directions. Dynamics are quite good and the earphone has no trouble with separation or positioning. The similarly-priced Sennheiser IE7 has a larger soundstage but, like the higher-end IE8, has some trouble portraying intimacy. The CKM99 has significantly better on-center feel and sounds a bit more convincing on the whole. The GR07 has slightly better layering but otherwise doesn’t score any points on the CKM99 either.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – Audio-Technica’s CKM99 is an exquisitely well-built earphone that exemplifies an angled-nozzle design done right. Despite the huge 14mm drivers used, the CKM99 fits comfortably in the ear and isolates better than many other high-end dynamics. It also sounds good, competing well with similarly-priced offerings from Sennheiser and Monster. VSonic’s similarly-priced GR07 monitor will probably be a constant thorn in the CKM99s side but the earphones have different purposes. The GR07 is fast, neutral, and balanced. The CKM99 is lively, colored, and liquid. In typical Audio-Technica fashion, it breaks from the warm sound of most similarly-priced dynamics and captures some of the company’s ambient and euphonic house sound. Not being priced up in the $250+ range with Audio-Technica’s BA-based flagships helps the CKM99 stay competitive and availability outside of Japan is nice to see as well.

*Pros: Excellent build quality; comfortable angled-nozzle design; good overall sound quality
 Cons: Cable not as nice as with CK10/CK100; can be sibilant*
  
 Huge thanks to *Inks *for the CKM99 loan! 
  
  
*(2B9) Fischer Audio Tandem*


Reviewed Oct 2011

 Details: Fischer Audio’s vertical dual dynamic in-ear
 Current Price: *$129* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $129)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual Dynamic_ | Imp: 36_Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1’ 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock wide-channel single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Narrow-tube (4 sizes) and wide-tube (3 sizes) single-flange silicone tips, bi-flange and tri-flange silicone tips, soft drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (3.5/5)* – The housings of the Tandem are made entirely of matte and glossy plastics, with red and blue trim taking the place of L/R markings. Metal nozzle filters and somewhat tangle-prone nylon-sheathed cables are shared with a few of Fischer’s other models. The lack of strain relief on housings entry is worrisome but not a deal breaker
 Isolation *(3/5) *– The Tandem is vented at the rear and can’t be inserted too deeply due to the large housings. Isolation is moderate even with longer eartips
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Reasonable despite the nylon-sheathed cord and lack of shirt clip; good when worn cable-up
 Comfort* (3/5)* – The drivers of the Tandem are oriented parallel to the nozzle, one above the other, resulting in a housing that is elongated vertically. Ergonomics are good considering the size and it can be worn over-the-ear easily but tends to be sensitive to insertion depth and may cause long-term comfort issues for those with smaller ears

 Sound *(8.6/10)* – The sound of the Tandem is extremely smooth and liquid, reminding me in many ways of the Sunrise Xcape IE. The bass has plenty of punch and carries realistic weight. It’s not as deep and powerful as with the Radius dual dynamics but the reach is good and there is a bit more impact compared to the Xcapes. While the overall note presentation is a touch soft and the Tandem doesn’t seem to have the ability to become hard and aggressive the way crisper-sounding IEMs like the HiSound Crystal can, the absence of distracting mid-bass bloat keeps the low end clean and controlled. The Tandem may be a bit slower than the VSonic GR07 and HiSound Crystal but it is quick and resolving enough to make Sennheiser’s IE6 and IE7 - as well as Beyerdynamic’s DTX 101 iE - sound loose and flabby in comparison.

 The midrange is lush and very smooth, sharing the liquid and slightly warm character of the Xcape IE. It is not too clear from the specifications but as far as I can tell no crossover is used by the Tandem, meaning that both drivers cover the entire frequency spectrum, and the overall smoothness of the sound may be a testament to that. Balance is good compared to the Radius DDM2, with the Tandem’s mids being more prominent and never becoming overshadowed by the low end. The DDM2 does have an edge in clarity and tends to sound more airy and open but the clarity of the Tandem is still very reasonable. The detail level, too, while not quite a match for Fischer’s own similarly-priced BA-based SBA-03, is good for a mid-range dynamic. Like the Xcape IE, the Tandem really isn’t for those who prefer an analytical edge.

 The treble of the Tandem, while not noticeably lacking, is not particularly prominent or energetic. As with the midrange, the overall smoothness is excellent, with no hint of grain or harshness. Extension is not bad but the treble becomes increasingly laid-back towards the top of the spectrum. I won’t say that the Tandem sounds dark but the treble quantity lags slightly behind that of the DDM2 and misses out completely on the upper midrange lift present in so many clarity-focused earphones. As a result, the sound of the Tandem is extremely non-fatiguing and very forgiving – so much so that it makes even the Sennheiser IE7 sound edgy and unpleasant.

 The presentation, too, is spacious but not overly enveloping. The soundstage has better width and depth than that of the Sunrise Xcape IE but lags slightly in overall size behind the DDM2. Layering is good and instruments are reasonably well-separated. Despite leaning towards a softer note presentation overall, the Tandem has above-average dynamics and experiences no problems portraying distance or intimacy. Worth noting is one side effect of using dual dynamic drivers – the Tandem is not the most efficient earphone out there and will require a few extra volume notches than many competing earphones to reach listening volume. Sensitivity isn’t an issue, however, and the Tandem will still satisfy at moderate volumes.

 Value* (7.5/10) *– The Fischer Audio Tandem may be the most versatile dual dynamic I’ve used so far but it still lags behind modern single-driver designs slightly in user-friendliness. The large, toy-like housings do not sit well enough in smaller ears and the included assortment of eartips, while certainly good considering the sensitivity of the Tandem to insertion depth, doesn’t quite make up for the lack of other pack-ins. In terms of sound quality, however, there isn't much to complain about with the Tandem – its signature is not one that impresses immediately but it is very likable and easy to appreciate, especially over long listening sessions. It really is a case of the end result being superior to the sum of its parts and an easy earphone to recommend for those who value balance and smoothness over analytical clarity or monstrous bass.

*Pros: Extremely smooth & forgiving sound
 Cons: Large housings, mediocre accessory pack*
  
  
*(2B10) Fischer Audio SBA-03 / MEElectronics A161P*
  

Reviewed Dec 2011
  
 Details: BA-based IEM second to the DBA-02 in Fischer's monitor lineup; the MEElec A161P is identical in sound quality but differs in construction and packaging, as well as price
 Current Price: *$129* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $129); *$100* for MEElectronics A161P w/mic
 Specs: Driver: BA | Imp: _16__Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec triple-flanges_
 Wear Style:_ Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
  
 Accessories* (2.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), cord wrap, and soft carrying pouch (MEElec version *(4.5/5)*: Single-flange (3 sizes), double-flange, and triple-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, over-the-ear cable guides, PC headset adapter, smartphone adapter, shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* - The shiny plastic housings seem nicely-made and feature metal nozzle grilles and long, flexible strain reliefs on housing entry. The cable is rubbery, below average in thickness, and lacks a cinch, which may make over-the-ear wear more difficult for some (MEElec version: cable is plasticky instead of rubbery. Thickness is the same but a cable cinch is present)
 Isolation* (4/5)* - Above average and even better with aftermarket eartips (MEElec version: double- and triple-flange tips provide good isolation out of the box)
 Microphonics* (3.5/5) *- Moderate when worn cable-down; low otherwise (MEElec version: cable is not quite as noisy but over-the-ear wear is made less practical by the microphone)
 Comfort *(4/5) *- Extremely lightweight housings with slightly angled nozzles provide excellent ergonomics. The cable is less excellent, however, and a shirt clip or cable cinch should have been included (MEElec version: both a cable cinch and shirt clip are included but over-the-ear wear is made less practical by the presence of mic/remote)
  
 Sound *(8.7/10)* - Until just a few years ago, the majority of single balanced armature earphones fell victim to shortfalls in frequency range and performance at the limits when compared to their dual- and triple-driver counterparts. Advertising a mid-tier single-BA earphone meant disclaimers such as 'full range' were an absolute necessity. This perception has since been seriously challenged by the reasonably-priced but extremely capable single-BA models released by Etymotic Research, Phonak, and now - Fischer Audio. 
 The SBA-03 is an impressive all-around performer, not just ‘for a single BA’ or ‘at its price point’, but overall. The bass is fast and resolving, as expected from a BA-based earphone, but it is also surprisingly punchy, even aggressive at times. Impact is greater than with the Etymotic ER-4S and ACS T15 but not quite a match for the VSonic GR07 or Fischer's own dual-dynamic Tandem. It has good depth and body but is also tight and controlled, with great clarity and good detail, though the latter lags slightly behind the pricier Ety ER-4S and ACS T15, partly due to the average dynamics and aggressive nature of the SBA-03.
  
 The midrange is slightly forward but still balances out very well with the punchy low end. Detail level is good - not quite as impressive as with the Etymotic HF5, but then the SBA-03 doesn't sound as lean, either. It is still a crisp, very slightly dry earphone with good resolution and a fairly neutral tone. The aggression from the bass carries over - the midrange of the SBA-03 is anything but laid-back. Vocals are very prominent and guitars have good bite. Compared to the Tandem and VSonic GR07, the SBA-03 is a bit less smooth and much less full-bodied but also more raw and transparent, with no sense of distancing or veiling between the listener and the music.
  
 The lower treble of the SBA-03 is reasonably prominent but not too peaky. With the wrong tips it can be a touch splashy but with a deep seal there is just some sparkle. Grain is mild. Gentle roll-off at the top completes the picture. Admittedly, the Etymotic HF5 is cleaner and again slightly more detailed in the treble but the two earphones have opposing profiles for a pair of single BAs, with the SBA-03 emphasizing the bass and midrange more so than (much of) the treble region.
  
 The presentation of the SBA-03 is competent but not flawless  Most noticeable when switching over from a higher-end monitor such as the GR07 or ACS T15 is the in-the-head positioning of all the sonic cues. The SBA-03 does have very nice instrument separation and accurate positioning across its stage but the sheer expanse of earphones such as the GR07, ACS T15, Sony EX600, or JVC FXT90 is just not there. The soundstage of the SBA-03 is average or even slightly above-average in size but the earphone achieves neither the air nor the ambience of the pricier monitors in my collection. 
  
 One last point worth noting - the SBA-03 is a very efficient earphone with high sensitivity and low impedance. Powerful sources such as the Cube C30 can be too loud even on the lowest volume settings and computers and other sources with a less-than-black background or high output impedance will be noisy. For a set of general-purpose computer earphones the similarly-priced Tandem does a much better job - it is less sensitive and more forgiving.
  
 Value *(8.5/10)* - When a mid-level earphone performs as well as this one does, it draws comparisons with top-tier earphones, as in the review above, and those rarely play in its favor. The SBA-03, however, holds its own in many ways against higher-end products from the likes of JVC, ACS, and VSonic. Aside from the smallish headstage and average dynamics, the SBA-03 is easily a top-tier performer. What detracts from its value are the surrounding bits – the cable, which is stringy and microphonic, and the small selection of tips, none of which showcase what the SBA-03 is really capable of. Those willing to overlook these minor flaws will find a direct competitor to the Ety HF5 and Phonak PFE with more emphasis on the bass and midrange and less on the top end – a versatile signature and a great introduction to higher-end BAs. (note: the MEElec version corrects the tip issue by including an extra 3 pairs).
  
*Pros: Wonderfully versatile BA sound*
*Cons: Mediocre cable, sub-optimal stock tips*
  
  
*(2B11) Creative Aurvana 3*


Reviewed Dec 2011

 Details: Third-gen enthusiast-oriented IEM from consumer electronics giant Creative Labs
 Current Price:* $150* from amazon.com (MSRP: $149.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _28Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _10-17k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec triple-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam eartips (2 sets), cleaning tool, airplane adapter, and hard-shell carrying case with removable cable winder
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– The glossy, reflective housings are plastic and feature matte dual-bore nozzles and very, very flexible strain reliefs. The rubbery cable is extremely soft and thin. It never gets in the way but also tends to tangle and doesn’t inspire much confidence in the earphones’ longevity
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5)* – Ergonomic housings and fully-sealed design result in above-average isolation
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent in the soft, featherweight cable
 Comfort* (3.5/5)* – The housings are very well-designed – lightweight, smooth, and rounded at the edges; the nozzle is angled well and the soft strain reliefs never make themselves known. However, the sheer size of the housing is uncharacteristic for a dual-BA – it is larger than that of a Westone 4. Those with smaller outer ears may experience discomfort quickly as a result

 Sound *(8.5/10) *– Creative’s third-gen armature-based earphone takes some pages out of the Shure playbook when it comes to more than just design – the sound may be familiar to the Shure faithful as well. The signature is mid-centric and slightly warm. The bass is accurate and controlled but not prominent or aggressive. It is fairly punchy but made to sound less so by the midrange emphasis. Gentle roll-off at the bottom also means that even certain single-armature earphones - the Fischer Audio SBA-03, for example - offer better bass depth.

 The midrange is the focal point of the Aurvana’s sound signature – forward compared to the bass and treble, warm, and very smooth. Note thickness is good but the presentation is a bit dry, reminiscent of the ill-fated Klipsch Custom 3. The Fischer SBA-03 has similarly forward mids but sounds leaner, with more crispness and slightly better detailing, while the Aurvana is smoother, thicker, and warmer in tone. It’s a pleasant sound but clearly not one for those in search of a balanced, neutral, highly detailed monitor. Even the dual-dynamic JVC HA-FXT90 has better transparency than the Aurvana 3, as well as more natural tone and timbre.

 At the top, the Aurvana 3 is laid-back and very non-fatiguing. Compared to earphones with crisp, prominent top ends – the VSonic GR07, for example – the Creatives sound a bit veiled and even a touch dark. As with the bass, the top end is not so much rolled-off as it is overshadowed by the attention-grabbing midrange. The presentation, too, is defined largely by the balance of the earphones - the Aurvana 3 is not particularly dynamic and rarely sounds aggressive or even energetic. The soundstage is about average in size, albeit quite well-rounded. The space is larger than that of the Fischer Audio SBA-03 and the layering is more convincing. Still, the Aurvana 3 lacks air and openness next to dynamic-driver competitors such as the JVC FXT90 and doesn’t have the same imaging prowess. On the upside, it is very, very efficient – clearly designed for use straight out of a portable player.

 Value* (8/10) *– The Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3 is a solid mid-range monitor that could pass for a consumer-oriented product from Shure or Westone. Aside from the mid-centric sound, which won’t be to everyone’s liking, the Aurvana 3 also filters potential listeners by ear size with its large plastic housings. Sonically, the Creatives have few weaknesses but also offer few memorable traits – a sound that fails to impress at first listen but may just be a cheaper - albeit slightly less balanced - alternative to something like a Klipsch Custom 3 or Ortofon e-Q7.

*Pros: low cable noise; competent mid-centric sound
 Cons: large housings not comfortable in smaller ears; thin cable*

 Big thanks to *kidcharlemagne* for the Creative Aurvana 3 loan
  
  
*(2B12) PureSound ClarityOne*


Reviewed Jan 2012

 Details: First release from Canada-based ClarityOne Audio, said to provide the perfect sound experience
 Current Price: *$129.99* from clarityoneaudio.com (MSRP: $129.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 8Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _15-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _trimmed MEElec tri-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and hard clamshell carrying case with carabiner
 Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– Straight-barrel metal shells feel very solid and the smooth clear-coated cable is similar to those used by MEElectronics and Fischer Audio. The housings lack proper strain relief as well as nozzle filters
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5) *– Above average, especially with aftermarket eartips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Very low with cable-down wear; nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– Straight-barrel metal housings are average in weight and fit. Earphones sound best with deeper insertion or longer aftermarket eartips

 Sound *(7.9/10) *– In contrast to the marketing efforts of most mainstream brands, the ClarityOne website concentrates largely on sound quality. The earphones are promised to deliver, among other things, “the clearest, truest, best sound on the market today” and “the ultimate in 3-dimentional (sic) listening experience”. A company that promises “perfect sound quality” and focuses on audio rather than cosmetics and endorsements certainly gets my attention, but separating expectations from reality can be rather difficult.

 There are some potential pitfalls, including the low impedance of the earphones. Claimed to increase battery life despite the higher current draw, the 8-ohm impedance of the C1 can be problematic when coupled with sources that have high output impedance - the earphones will exhibit varying amounts of bass roll-off, though the effects will likely be mild with most portable players. Hiss is a bigger problem – when using a source with moderate background noise levels, hiss is very evident and background electrical noises can be audible as well.

 Source matching issues aside, the bass is probably the best aspect of the C1’s sound. Bass response is punchy and well-measured, with good depth and power – visceral, but not overblown. There is a mid-bass hump but nothing that affects resolution or causes the low end to sound bloated – the bass may not be as quick as that of the average armature-based earphone but it performs very well among similarly-priced dynamic IEMs. The C1 offers up both more impact and better control than the MEElectronics CC51 and HiSoundAudio Crystal, for example, though its aggressive bass is not quite as tight as with the higher-priced VSonic GR07 and JVC FXT90.

 The midrange of the C1 is clean and detailed. Despite the mid-bass lift, bleed is nearly nonexistent and the mids are only slightly warm. The bass and treble stand out in relative emphasis but the slightly recessed mids are still plenty aggressive. Peaks in the upper midrange and treble regions tend to exaggerate the clarity – an effect akin to using a treble-boosting equalizer. Natural clarity is good for a mid-tier dynamic – on-par with Sennheiser’s IE6 and IE7 - but certainly not revolutionary as the name may imply. It trails armature-based sets such as Fischer’s SBA-03 and Etymotic HF5, as well as pricier dynamics such as the VSonic GR07 and Sony MDR-EX600. The abovementioned earphones are also a touch more detailed than the C1, though none place nearly as much emphasis on the bass.

 The top end unevenness does more than affect the clarity of the C1 – the upper midrange has a tendency to sound a touch shrill. Vocals also seem a tad ‘nasal’ at times and timbre doesn’t particularly impress, especially with stringed instruments. ‘Colored’ is clearly a term applicable to the C1’s sound. Cymbals are very prominent, even dominant at times. The treble is shimmery, aggressive, and energetic, but also fatiguing on occasion. With the wrong tips, the C1 can be sibilant and even with a good aftermarket set, such as Comply T400s or a deep-fitting tri-flange, sibilance-prone recordings can be problematic. It doesn’t help that the note thickness of the C1 is on the low side compared to sets like the JVC HA-FXT90.

 The presentation of the C1 is far less enigmatic than the sound signature. It gives a good sense of space – better than the MEElec CC51 or HiSound Crystal – but stops short of the ambient, 3-dimensional soundstages offered by some higher-end models. Instrument separation is good and the positioning is adequate but compared to sets such as the Sony EX600 and VSonic GR07 it all sounds quite in-the-head. Imaging lags slightly behind the JVC HA-FXT90 but dynamics are well above-average despite the sound of the C1 being rather aggressive. Again, it puts on the best show at lower volumes, though due to the high sensitivity of the earphones certain players are too loud even at minimum output.

 Value* (7/10)* – The ClarityOne is a competent mid-range dynamic-driver earphone in a conventional form factor. Minor omissions such as nozzle filters, molded strain reliefs, and alternate types of eartips are mostly made up for by the noise-free cable, sturdy shells, and mic/remote unit. PureSound’s marketing sets expectations for the earphone’s sound a bit high, however – the C1 is neither revolutionary in audio quality nor aimed at absolute fidelity with its sound signature. Instead, it is a fun-sounding IEM with few claims to accuracy or neutrality, but one that will be instantly impressive to fans of crisp, punchy, aggressive sound as well as anyone coming from stock earbuds or entry-level headphones.

*Pros: Low cable noise; punchy, aggressive sound
 Cons: No nozzle filters; aftermarket tips required for best sound; peaky treble leads to issues with timbre and tone*
  
  
*(2B13) JVC HA-FXT90*
  

Reviewed Jan 2012

 Details: JVC’s high-tech take on the dual dynamic earphone
 Current Price:* $105* from ebay.com (MSRP: est. $149.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual Dynamic_ | Imp: _12Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _8-25k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges, short bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), shirt clip, cable winder, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality* (4.5/5)* – The plastic housings of the FXT90 may be rather ordinary-looking compared to the metal FX300 and wooden FX500/FX700 shells but it feels very well put together, in typical JVC fashion. The strain reliefs are long and the L-plug is beefy. The cord itself is reasonably thick, soft, flexible, and – best of all – not modular as it is with JVC’s FX500/FX700 models
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Quite good with the ergonomic but shallow-fitting shells
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Very low when worn cable-down; nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Despite the vertical arrangement of the dual dynamic drivers, the FXT90 is no less comfortable than most conventional straight-barrel IEMs. The ergonomic nozzle angle helps, as do the smooth surface and rounded edges of the housings. Over-the-ear wear is possible but may require longer eartips than those provided

 Sound *(8.9/10)* – The FXT90 is JVC’s first attempt at a dual-dynamic earphone. Utilizing no crossover, the FXT90 relies on the differences between the materials of the two drivers to create a natural variance in their response. Like Fischer Audio’s similarly-priced Tandem, the FXT90 positions the drivers vertically in the ear. Unlike the Tandem, it offers up impressive presence across the frequency range without straying too far from the sound of JVC’s higher-end wooden in-ears.

 The low end of the FXT90s is strong but not overly dominant, with a mild mid-bass hump and excellent note thickness – similar in quantity to the Sennheiser IE7, but quicker and more controlled. Impact is good and the bass sounds full and fleshed-out. Compared to JVC’s FX500, the bass of the FXT90 is less prone to overshadowing the midrange, partly because the note presentation is thicker in the midrange and partly because the FXT90 exercises better control over its bottom end. The bass may not be as fast and tight as that of the VSonic’s GR07, but it is more forward and has both greater body and more impact. The GR07 boasts shorter decay times and tends to be quick and punchy, but not as powerful in comparison. Fischer’s dual-dynamic Tandem, too, is flatter through the bass and midrange but yields to the FXT90 in both bass impact and depth.

 The midrange of the FXT90 is strong and prominent – not as forward as the mids of the Sennheiser IE7 or Fischer SBA-03, but not in the least laid-back. The good note thickness of the low end is retained, as is a bit of warmth. Despite the presentation being airy and nicely layered, the mids tend towards intimacy. They are smooth and full, with excellent timbre and good transparency. Clarity is good – better than with the Sennheiser IE7 and Fischer Audio Tandem but not quite as impressive as with the more neutral-sounding GR07 or the armature-based ACS T15. Detail levels are nearly on-par with the GR07.

 At the top end, the FXT90 is again prominent, yet very competent. The mild emphasis tends to point out and even exaggerate sibilance present on a track but the edginess of the FX500 is all but absent. The energy is still there, however, as it is with all of the higher-end JVC in-ears I’ve heard. Compared to the similarly-priced FA Tandem, the FXT90 is significantly brighter and more sparkly but - luckily - has quality to make the treble work. Treble detail is excellent and the resolution and transparency give the GR07 a run for its money. In comparison, the similarly-priced PureSound ClartyOne lacks separation and sounds both thinner and peakier while the Sennheiser IE7 sounds plasticky and lacks smoothness. Absolute extension at the top is decent but trails both the ClarityOne and the IE7 slightly.

 Presentation is yet another strength of the FXT90 – the earphones are airy, well-separated, and nicely layered. Soundstage width is about average but the depth is quite good. Compared to the GR07, the FTX90 sounds narrower and less spacious but has slightly better imaging. Its presentation is more intimate compared to the GR07 and Tandem and more well-rounded than those of the similarly-priced ClarityOne and Fischer SBA-03. Dynamics are good and the efficiency is very impressive. That’s not to say there’s no upgrading from the FXT90 – there is a noticeable gap in detail, refinement, and soundstaging when moving to a higher-end set like the HiFiMan RE272, but for the asking price the FXT90 is a very impressive all-around performer.

 Value *(9/10) *– JVC’s FXT90 is not the first dual-dynamic earphone to hit the market, but it may just be the first one you’ll actually want to live with. From a usability standpoint it is clearly the best of the bunch, foregoing not only the awkward fit and questionable design of the dual-dynamic competition but also the modular cable and open-back housings of the other high-end JVC monitors. The sound of the FXT90 is balanced in an aggressive sort of way, with the intimate midrange giving up only a bit of emphasis to the prominent bass and sparkly treble. The sound is strengthened by good timbre and a nicely layered presentation – the same qualities that make the FX700 a cream-of-the-crop top-tier. Simply put, at $135, the FXT90 is one of the best deals in portable audio.

*Pros: Lively, competent sound; solidly built; low microphonics
 Cons: N/A*

 Huge thanks to* Inks* for the HA-FXT90 loan!
  
  
*(2B14) Sony MDR-EX600*


Reviewed Feb 2012

 Details: Sony's mid-range dynamic-driver monitor
 Current Price: *$131 *from provantage.com (MSRP: $199.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB _| Freq:_ 4-28k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids, generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5) *- Sony Hybrid silicone tips (6 sizes), Hybrid silicone+foam tips (3 sizes), and carrying case
 Build Quality* (4.5/5)* - Though not made out of magnesium like those of the EX1000, the housings of the EX600 share the vertical-driver design and still feel just as sturdy. The detachable cable is held in place by a threaded bit and I still found myself unscrewing the connectors a bit each time I took the earphones off. The cord itself is very flexible but not particularly thick. The "memory wire" section doesn't hold its shape well. The termination is a slim 3.5mm L-plug
 Isolation* (2.5/5)* - The nozzles of the EX1000 seem rather long but the earphones are not well-designed for deep insertion. Isolation is mediocre with the standard Hybrid eartips and very slightly better with the supplied foam-stuffed tips. Wind noise can be an additional issue when used outside
 Microphonics *(5/5)* - The native wear style is over-the-ear and cord noise nonexistent in the soft cable
 Comfort* (4/5) *- Though housings designed around vertically-positioned drivers often feature angled nozzles or other ergonomic improvements, the EX600 is actually a straight-barrel earphone. It is quite large and tends to protrude farther than most earphones when worn, looking a bit like the ridiculous PFR-V1. On the upside, the long nozzles position the driver far enough away from the ear not to cause discomfort. The fit is not as secure as with most other high-end monitors but the soft memory wire works well enough in conjunction with the cable cinch

 Sound *(9/10) *– The MDR-EX600 closely resembles Sony’s dynamic-driver flagship, the EX1000, not only in design but also sound. As with the EX1000, the low end of the EX600 is accurate and controlled. It sounds clean and detailed, but not at the expense of note thickness. Rather, the bass is smooth and lacks the aggression of something like the JVC HA-FX500, which easily offers more depth and weight but loses out to the EX600 in control and accuracy. The similarly-priced VSonic GR07 is a little quicker and flatter in response, with better bass depth but similar punch, while the EX600 is more dynamic and at times presents a touch more bass power, though neither leans heavily on lower frequencies. Similarly, the EX600 itself loses just a bit of depth, resolution, and control compared to the pricier EX1000 model.

 The midrange of the EX600 is neutral-to-bright, with a slight gain in emphasis towards the lower treble. Bass-midrange balance is good - the EX600 doesn’t share the warmth of an FX500 or Sennheiser IE7. There is no bass bleed, just clear and detailed mids. Like the EX1000, the EX600 is very smooth and liquid in presentation – more so than the GR07, T15, or FX500. The slight treble tilt also tends to create an illusion of better clarity compared to sets such as the warmer, darker FX500. However, next to more resolving earphones - the HiFiMan RE272, for example - it is noticeable that the EX600 lacks a bit of microdetail and overall refinement.

 The top end of the EX600 is emphasized, but controlled. As with the EX1000, the EX600’s treble tends to be a bit sharper than that of the VSonic GR07 but still manages to remain refined and reasonably forgiving. On some tracks the EX600 does exaggerate sibilance a bit compared to the GR07 (or even JVC FX500), but those are few and far between. There is no grain or harshness and no sacrifices made in crispness or resolution. Best of all, the treble energy that is often lacking with consumer-friendly dynamic-driver sets is conveyed realistically. Top end extension is not quite a match for an RE272’s but keeps up with the GR07 and other similarly-priced sets.

 The presentation, too, mimics the EX1000 closely – the EX600 sounds just as spacious and open as the flagship. Dynamics are excellent and both sets tend to sound rather effortless. Soundstage width is impressive and there is not a hint of the confined, closed-in feel prevalent among stage monitors. The similarly-priced VSonic GR07 also feels wide and spacious but gives up a bit of air, as well as some depth and imaging prowess to the EX600. The EX600 also has a wider soundstage and better layering than the JVC FX500. The VSonics and JVCs do provide a slightly more 3-dimensional presentation compared to the heightened left-right separation of the Sonys, making all three sets are very impressive in their price bracket. Those looking for a wider, more headphone-like presentation compared to the more typical in-the-head feel of an IEM should be especially impressed with the EX600.

 Value* (9/10)* – A much more reasonably priced alternative to Sony’s flagship MDR-EX1000, the EX600 is a perfect look into the law of diminishing returns. At about 1/3 the price, the EX600 delivers all of the flagship’s functionality and most of the sound quality, easily competing with the very best earphones in its category. The sound signatures of the two Sony sets are remarkably similar - clean, quick, airy, and dynamic – and the same isolation and wind noise caveats apply to both. Those willing to embrace the design will discover the EX600 to have one of the best price/performance ratios in its class.

*Pros: No cable noise; clear, detailed, open, and spacious sound
 Cons: Average isolation; fit can be frustrating; wind noise can be an issue*

 Huge thanks to *Inks* for loaning me the EX600 for review
  
  
*(2B15) Paradigm Shift E3m*


Reviewed Apr 2012

 Details: Flagship of speaker manufacturer Paradigm’s new IEM line
 Current Price: *$129.99* from paradigm.com (MSRP: $129.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 18Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _8-19k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Trimmed MEElec triple-flanges; Head-Direct bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (3.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and faux leather clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5) *- The E3m is built around a single piece of machined aluminum housing the driver chamber. A second, plastic piece flares outward at the rear and presents a rather large Paradigm Shift logo. The nozzle is protected by a metal filter and the entire construction feels nice and solid. The cabling is nylon-sheathed but seems to resist kinks and tangles very well. The biggest issue is the lack of strain relief on housing entry and at the y-split, which may result in the nylon cable sheath fraying over time. A mic/remote unit with an unusually small single button is located on the right-side cable.
 Isolation *(3/5) *- Good for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics* (4/5) *- Mild when worn cord-down and pretty much nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* - The housings use an ergonomic, off-axis design (a-la AKG K3003) and the stock tips are of good quality and easy to get a good seal with. The E3m can be worn both cable-up and cable-down but the sharp rear corners of the housing and stem tend to contact the outer ear, potentially causing discomfort for some users. This is easily remedied by using longer aftermarket eartips that position the housings farther out in the ear

 Sound *(6.9/10)* - The general sound signature of the Paradigm Shift E3m is bass-biased, with a laid-back midrange and similarly relaxed treble. The low end is full and deep, easily reaching down into the subbass frequencies and offering great rumble and impact. Paradigm claims that the tuning of the E3m was inspired by their Signature Series loudspeakers, and it is easy to imagine speakers putting out the same sort of powerful, visceral bass the earphones produce. Relative to the midrange and treble, the quantity of the bass borders on ‘basshead’ and despite the lack of mid-bass bloat lacks a little texture, speed, and resolution, sounding boomy at times. For comparison purposes I grabbed another in-ear headset recently released by a different speaker manufacturer – the Velodyne vPulse. While the bass of the Velodynes did not have quite as much impact, it was pleasantly cleaner and more controlled, resulting in a more accurate, less colored overall sound.

 The midrange of the E3m – and pretty much everything following – is recessed compared to the prominent bass. Though there is not much of a mid-bass hump per se, the bass level is so inflated that the low end bleeds into the midrange anyway, resulting in noticeable veiling of vocals and instruments and a lack of clarity compared to many cheaper in-ears. Bumping everything above 200 Hz up on the EQ helps, allowing the mids to shine - with the bass out of the way detail and texture levels are actually quite good and the earphones sound enjoyable. Notes have good weight and thickness, giving the E3m a full-bodied feel that works well with the warm tone.

 The treble transition is smooth and uneventful. The top end is just as laid-back as the midrange, with the resulting ‘dull’ sound reminding me of the new Dunu Crater and Hawkeye. There is no treble sparkle and crispness is mediocre at best. On the upside, top-end extension is decent and the E3m adds no harshness or sibilance into the mix. The sound remains smooth and non-fatiguing, even at higher volumes, but the dullness does make cranking up the volume tempting. A more accurate set - a VSonic GR06, for example - will extract the same amount of musical detail at lower volumes and may even encourage some listeners to turn down their devices.

 The presentation of the E3m is probably its best trait – it is wholesome and well-rounded. The soundstage is above-average in size and has very good on-center feel compared to sets like the Velodyne vPulse. While the bass tends to dominate the sonic space when present, the E3m doesn’t sound particularly congested and has good instrument separation and layering. In comparison, the Dunu Hawkeye and Velodyne vPulse both sound flat and a bit uninvolving. Dynamics are quite decent as well – closer to the mid-fi level of a MEElec CC51 or Shure SE215 than the Velodyne or Dunu sets.

 Value *(6.5/10)* - Paradigm’s flagship in-ear is less of a shift and more of a paradox, promising sound akin to high-end speakers but delivering a bass-heavy signature saddled with veiled vocals and dull treble. The drivers are certainly very capable, producing high detail levels, good dynamics, and a spacious presentation, and the E3m is a solid headset – well-built, comfortable, and low on cable noise. As it stands, however, the balance makes it one to recommend only for lovers of warm, full-bodied sound with forward bass and recessed mids and highs.

*Pros: Nice construction; smooth sound with decent presentation
 Cons: Housing shape may not be comfortable for everyone; bass-biased balance results in midrange and treble deficiencies*
  
 Full review of the E3m, complete with more photos, can be found here
  
  
*(2B16) Yamaha EPH-100SL*


Reviewed June 2012

 Details: Yamaha’s flagship in-ear, built around a dynamic microdriver
 Current Price: *$150* from amazon.com (MSRP: $199.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5)* - Bi-flange silicone tips (5 sizes), ¼” adapter, 6.5’ (2m) extension cable, and soft zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The EPH-100 boasts a nozzle-mounted microdriver and sturdy machined-aluminum housings. The cable is average in thickness but well-relieved on housing entry and at the L-plug. Driver flex is nonexistent
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Some of the best among all dynamic-driver earphones with the stock bi-flange tips
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Reasonable when worn cord-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Those with narrow ear canals may want to give these a pass due to the nozzle diameter but for everyone else the small, lightweight shells should be ergonomic and extremely unobtrusive. Stock eartips are surprisingly comfortable

 Sound *(8.9/10) *– Taking Yamaha’s flagship spot away from the EPH-50, the EPH-100 utilizes a dynamic microdriver in a form factor much like that of Monster’s Miles Davis Trumpets. Like the Trumpets, the EPH-100 is an excellent all-rounder, but it is tuned differently from the mildly v-shaped Monsters. The bass is strong – deep and punchy, with a mild mid-bass lift giving it significantly more impact compared to most BA-based earphones and leaner dynamics such as the VSonic GR07 and Sony EX600. At the same time, the EPH-100 is far from overly bassy in the conventional sense – while not the most detailed or textured, its bass always remains clean and controlled. Like the Miles Davis Trumpet, which is a touch heavier on mid- and sub-bass in comparison, the EPH-100 is noticeably less boomy than Sennheiser’s IE7 and the older Miles Davis Tribute.

 The mids of the EPH-100 are balanced very well with the low end – not recessed, but not quite forward. They are smooth, veil-free, dynamic, and more prominent compared to those of the slightly v-shaped Monster Trumpet. Clarity and detail are good and the note presentation is excellent – the EPH-100 is not overly thick or full-bodied but definitely cannot be called lean, either. The sound is very liquid but lacks a touch of crispness compared to the GR07 and many armature-based sets. The EPH-100 is what many would consider ‘musical’ - it sounds warmer, fuller, and more dynamic compared to sets such as the GR07 but is occasionally less adept at portraying fine details and texturing.

 At the top the EPH-100 sounds somewhat smoothed-over compared to the more energetic Monster Miles Davis Trumpet, VSonic GR07, and JVC HA-FXT90, but also has the least potential for treble fatigue. Indeed, it’s difficult to imagine the treble of the Yamahas being overbearing for any listener. The downside is that it is not the most resolving – the highs are more refined than those of the Sennheiser IE7 but not as crisp and clean as those of the GR07. Top end extension is good, however, and the EPH-100 doesn’t lack air.

 The presentation of the EPH-100 is befittingly well-rounded – soundstage size is above average, though it doesn’t quite keep up with the GR07 or Ultimate Ears TF10 in absolute width and out-of-the-head feel. Depth is good, as are the instrument separation and dynamics, which allow for better layering compared, for example, to the more flat- and distant-sounding GR07. At the same time, the EPH-100 is not as forward and intimate as the FXT90 and yet sounds open and uncongested, avoiding the more closed-in feel of many lower-end monitors.

 Value *(9.5/10)* – Yamaha’s latest flagship makes a clean break from the company’s unremarkable lower-end models, offering up a comfortable, well-built, highly-isolating earphone in a compact, microdriver-based package. The sound quality is far above average as well, with strong bass, lush mids, and smooth – albeit slightly docile – treble. The EPH-100 is easily one of the best-sounding earphones – and one of the best overall packages - in its price class.

*Pros: Great isolation; small and comfortable; smooth and dynamic sound
 Cons: Nozzle-mounted driver not great for those with narrow ear canals*

 Big thanks to *Gilly87* for the EPH-100 loan!
  
  
*(2B17) JVC HA-FXD80*
  

Added Sep 2012

 Details: JVC’s carbon nanotube microdriver earphone
 Current Price: *$105* from ebay.com (MSRP: est $80); $120 for HA-FRD80 with mic & 1-button remote
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _20Ω_ | Sens:_ 102 dB_ | Freq: _8-25k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _generic single-flanges; generic bi-flanges; MEElectronics ‘short’ bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), cable winder, shirt clip, and drawstring carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (4.5/5) *– The housings of the FXD80s are solid-feeing stainless steel, with nozzle-mounted microdrivers and unique-looking but sturdy strain reliefs. Cabling is typical JVC – soft and flexible. Mild driver flex is present.
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5)* – Very good with the right tips and moderate insertion
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Very low when worn cable-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5) *– Quite comfortable except for those with narrow ear canals. The housings are heavier and a bit larger than those of the Yamaha and Monster microdriver sets but not enough so to cause fit issues

 Sound* (8.7/10)* – JVC’s previous microdriver earphone, the FXT90, featured a carbon nanotube driver alongside a second transducer. The new FXD80 uses a single carbon nanotube microdriver. Interestingly, the FXD80 is not as efficient as the dual-driver FXT90, requiring a few extra notches to reach listening volume. The power handling of the FXD80 is rather strange in that it is actually sensitive enough to be used at low volumes, yet happily accepts quite a lot more power before passing comfortable listening thresholds. Due to the slightly recessed mids, being able to bump up the volume without the sound becoming shrill or boomy is very welcome with many tracks.

 The bass of the FXD80 is punchy and has good depth. Mid-bass boost is very mild – not as heavy as with the FXT90 and lower-end FX40 model but more substantial than with the VSonic GR07 and HiFiMan earphones. Like the FX40, the FXD80 leans slightly on the thin side in note presentation and as a result its bass reminds me of the Shure SE535 – great in extension but perhaps not as full and rumbly as the response warrants. The slight bass elevation causes the JVCs to sound a little less controlled compared to the GR07. Certain similarly-priced armature sets such as the Fischer SBA-03/MEElectronics A161P and Rockit R-50 also sound quicker and tighter, as expected. The bass of the FXD80 is also not quite as effortless as the dynamic, highly versatile low end of the Monster and Yamaha microdriver earphones but is certainly respectable considering the lower price of the JVCs.

 The midrange is clear and detailed but, like the low end lacks a bit of thickness. The mids seem to take a step back compared to the bass and treble. Male vocals especially sound somewhat recessed – the GR07, for example, provides a flatter response with fuller, thicker, more natural male vocals. The RE-ZERO and MEElectronics A161P are more similar to the FXD80 in note presentation but both feature much more forward mids.

 The response starts gaining emphasis in the upper midrange and the top end is prominent, yet somehow not fatiguing. The overall tone of the JVCs is a little on the cool side, which is certainly unusual for a mid-level dynamic earphone. Detail and top-end extension are good and the sound is nice and airy on the whole. The treble curve adds some perceived clarity to the sound in a way reminiscent of the lower-end FX40 model and the similarly-priced PureSound ClarityOne. The treble response does tend to exaggerate cymbal ringing a little and can throw timbre off slightly but – happily - doesn’t have the sibilant tendencies of the VSonic GR07. The pricier HiFiMan RE272, on the other hand, does a much better job of controlling sibilance without losing air but will not work for those who crave the extra treble energy.

 The presentation of the FXD80 is less straightforward. The earphones sound spacious in a way reminiscent of the $300 Monster Miles Davis Trumpets and yet seem to have an average-sized headstage and layering. The FXD80 doesn’t throw sonic cues as far out of the head as a VSonic GR07 and Rockit R-50 and the presentation seems a little less well-spaced and linear. The HiFiMan RE272 is also more open-sounding and spacious, but the fact that the FXD80 draws comparisons to these far more expensive sets speaks volumes of the overall level of its performance.

 Value *(9/10) *– JVC’s latest microdriver design is solid performer, combining deep bass, a clean midrange, and prominent treble for a crisp and energetic sound. As with the lower-end FX40 model, the FXD80 can’t be recommended without some reservation – the sound signature seems to work best with electronic music and male vocals disappoint compared to the pricier FXT90 model and other competing sets. Still, with its stainless steel shell, above-average isolation, and versatile, no-frills cabling, the FXD80 is one of the better buys in its price range.

*Pros: Very solid build, flexible and quiet cabling, highly proficient sound
 Cons: Fit may not work for those with narrow ear canals*
  
 Big thanks to *mcnoiserdc *for the FXD80 loan!
  
  
*(2B18) HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2*
  

Added Oct 2012

 Details: Wooden flat-cable earphone from HiSound
 Current Price: *$105 *from ebay.com (MSRP: $129)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB _| Freq: _16-23k Hz_ | Cable: _4.1' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges, Comply T400_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4/5) *- Single-flange (3 sizes), double-flange (3 sizes) and triple-flange silicone tips, hard shell carrying case, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The Wooduo 2 utilizes wood and metal housings with flat cables. Everything is very well put together and the cables seem sturdy and are tangle-resistant, though the strain reliefs are a bit stiff for my liking and no cable cinch is present
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good for a dynamic-driver design
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down; better when worn cable-up
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The housings are fairly small and fit comfortably but the flat cable a little stiff and, combined with the lack of a cable cinch, can make over-the-ear wear difficult

 Sound *(8/10) *– The Wooduo 2 is a bass-heavy earphone that manages to retain solid all-around performance by keeping its low end in check and maintaining good clarity and treble presence. Bass impact is excellent and depth is very good – on-par with pricier sets such as the JVC HA-FX500 and FutureSonics Atrio MG7. Listeners who find heavy bass fatiguing will want to stay away but it’s doubtful that even die-hard bassheads will find the Wooduo 2 lacking in low-end presence. Sets such as HiSound’s own Crystal and the VSonic GR06, which are not exactly bass-light, are absolutely trampled by the Wooduo’s visceral, domineering bass. At the same time, while the Wooduo is among the bassier IEMs I’ve heard, its the low end remains surprisingly controlled and clean. It does lack some tightness and detail when compared to an armature-based set such as the Rock-It Sounds R-30 or the higher-end VSonic GR07 but not when pitted against other bass monsters, especially ones in its price bracket.

 The midrange of the Wooduo is not as recessed as one might expect from such a bassy earphone – only a little more so than that of the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition. Midrange clarity is very good and the detail level is again respectable, though not as good as with HiSound’s more balanced-sounding Crystal model. Some loss of refinement is expected with this much bass and the Wooduo handles complexity well for an earphone with the sound signature equivalent of a steamroller.

 The treble of the Wooduo is more emphasized that the midrange, likely in an attempt to balance out the heavy low end. There is a good amount of sparkle and the Wooduo doesn’t sound as dark as the Atrio earphones or the many other bass-heavy sets with severely recessed treble. The top end of the Wooduo 2 is crisp and well-defined – not in the least bit smeared – and the treble emphasis results in a bit of added clarity compared to sets such as the Rock-It R-30 and HiSound Crystal. The treble does sound a little edgy and can be harsh, especially at higher volumes, but lacks the sibilance-inducing peak of the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition. Extension at the top is good as well, surpassing the GR02 BE slightly.

 The soundstage of the Wooduo 2 is above average in size and boasts good air and impressive instrument separation. There are sets with better 3D imaging, such as the Thinksound MS01 and VSonic GR06, but the Wooduo 2 still has good width and decent depth--better, for example, than HiSound’s Crystal model. Interestingly, the sensitivity of the Wooduo is higher as well – the Crystal requires quite a bit more power to reach the same listening level.

 Value *(8/10) *– The HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2 is a dream earphone for the bass lover, combining a very deep and powerful low end with good midrange clarity and crisp, if slightly hard-edged treble. Its brute, visceral sound makes it a great signature upgrade for something like a MEElec M9 or JVC FX1X. In addition, the form factor is small and lightweight, and though I am not a fan of the flat cable, it does feel sturdy and resist tangling. Overall, the Wooduo 2 a solid alternative to HiSound’s excellent Crystal model for bass fans in search of a good all-rounder.

*Pros: Great bass impact and depth; good clarity
 Cons: Treble is a bit edgy; will be too bassy for some; over-the-ear wear can be a challenge with flat cable*
  
  
*(2B19) Dunu I 3C-S*
  

Added Nov 2012

 Details: Single-armature earphone from Dunu
 Current Price: *$108* from ebay.com (MSRP: $108)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _10Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _16-22k Hz _| Cable: 4' L-plug
 Nozzle Size: _3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec A151 single-flanges; Shure gray flex_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(5/5)* - Single-flange standard (3 sizes), Hybrid-style (4 pairs in 3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, cable guides, ¼” adapter, airline adapter, impedance adapter, cleaning cloth, drawstring carrying pouch, and crushproof metal carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The construction of the I 3C-S doesn’t feel as heavy-duty as that of the other Dunu earphones but is still above average. In contrast to other Dunu models, the housings of the I 3C-S are made out of lightweight plastic and the cables are only average in thickness. In addition, the strain reliefs are too hard for my liking and the nozzle filters come off too easily. The L-plug is well-relieved, however, and the cable features all of the usual Dunu enhancements including sliding cinch and integrated cable wrap
 Isolation *(3/5)* – The housings seem to favor a relatively shallow insertion. Isolation is average for a BA-based earphone.
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Very little cable noise is present
 Comfort *(4/5) *- The housings are lightweight and comfortable but on the large side for a single BA. Also, while I like the wide tip selection in theory, some of the eartips provided with the I 3C-S didn’t stay on the nozzles well enough for my liking

 Sound *(8.1/10) *– Dunu’s first proper armature-based earphone, the I 3C-S is a mid-centric affair with sound characteristics typical of a mid-tier single-armature setup. Dunu includes an impedance adapter with the I 3C-S for a reason – the earphones benefit from the extra impedance, and not only because the output impedance of a source can interact with the low impedance of the earphones. Even with my Fiio E7, which has notably low output impedance, the I 3C-S sounds better when the adapter is used. The bass response is better in quality, appearing tighter and flatter, and the overall balance is improved with slightly brighter, better-defined treble and less dominant mids.

 In general, the sound of the I 3C-S is hardly unique in the world of single-driver monitors. The bass is quick and clean, with mild deep bass roll-off. As expected, it can appear a touch lean next to many dynamic-driver monitors, including Dunu’s own DN-19 Tai Chi, but lacks some crispness and definition next to more analytical armature-based sets such as the MEElec A161P (Fischer SBA-03) and the dual-BA Rock-It Sounds R-50. Tonally, the I 3C-S is very slightly warm – warmer, for example, than the HiFiMan RE-ZERO but not quite as warm as the bassier Rock-It Sounds R-30.

 The midrange of the Dunus is clean-sounding and very prominent. The I 3C-S is a mid-centric earphone but the mids are not pushed forward as much as with the Rock-It R-30, resulting in better overall balance (better still when the impedance adapter is used). Detail levels are good and the background is darker compared to the R-30, with the I 3C-S sounding clearer and more transparent. It’s clearer, more forward, and more intelligible also than Dunu’s DN-19 model, which sounds veiled in comparison. Note thickness is rather good for a single BA.

 At the top, the I 3C-S remains clean and resolving. It sounds smooth, but is still more revealing than the Rock-It single-armature earphones, making both the R-20 and R-30 sound smoothed-over and lacking in refinement. The I 3C-S is still rather light on treble sparkle and less extended at the top than the HiFiMan RE-ZERO and MEElec A161P, but also not as grainy as the latter. The presentation is wide with good instrument separation. The I 3C-S is more spacious compared to the Rock-It R-30, though it can sound rather intimate with some tracks due to the forward midrange.

 Value *(8/10)* – The Dunu I 3C-S is more unique in name than design, with clean if slightly mid-centric sonic performance delivered by a single balanced armature driver. There’s quite a bit of competition among armature-based earphones at and below its price point, however, and while it is one of the better single BA tunings I’ve heard, the I 3C-S has trouble pulling itself above similarly-priced dual-armature designs. All in all, the earphones do make for a well-rounded, non-fatiguing introduction to BA sound and are redeemed as a total package by a well thought-out accessory kit, good build quality, and the lightweight, over-the-ear design.

*Pros: Clear, slightly mid-centric sound; great accessory kit; very low cable noise
 Cons: Sounds best with included impedance adapter*


*(2B20) Dunu DN-19 Tai Chi*


Added Nov 2012

 Details: Dunu’s current dynamic-driver flagship featuring a vent tuning system
 Current Price: *$133* from ebay.com (MSRP: $133)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω _| Sens: _100 dB _| Freq: _16-26k Hz_ | Cable: 4.2' L-plug
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips:_ Stock silicone (gray)_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories* (5/5) *- Single-flange (3 sizes) and Hybrid-style (4 pairs in 3 sizes) silicone tips, shirt clip, cable guides, ¼” adapter, airline adapter, 10 pairs of vent plugs, cleaning cloth, plastic eartip/accessory organizer, drawstring carrying pouch, and crushproof metal carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The housings of Dunu’s new flagship are plastic but still convey the same solidity as the company’s metal-shelled earphones. The quality of the materials is excellent and the Yin-Yang design on the faceplate is very discreet. The housings have protruding tuning ports that can be left open or plugged with the included dampers. The tiny plugs are plastic and feel a bit low-grade compared to the rest of the earphone, especially considering they can become loose with use. Mercifully, 10 pairs are included for when they get lost or damaged. The cables are thicker than those of the I 3C-S model and the L-plug is well-relieved
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5) *– The ergonomic housings allow for a reasonably deep seal to be attained and isolation is good
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Some cable noise is present in the slightly stiff cord but a shirt clip, cable guides, and sliding cinch are all included to help mitigate microphonics
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The DN-19 is designed for an over-the-ear fit, with good overall ergonomics reminiscent of the Sennheiser IE6. The housings contain 10mm drivers but aren’t too large. However, though the tuning vents were designed to exit the ear comfortably, their location may still cause issues for those with smaller ears

 Sound* (8.1/10) *– First, a note on the tuning system. The Tai Chi has only two inherent configurations – closed-vent and open-vent. Dunu recommends tip rolling for even more extreme results and, as advertised, the thicker narrow-channel Hybrid-style tips are good for a bassier sound while the softer wide-channel gray tips provide lesser bass quantity. The tips do make a difference, but for those already familiar with tip rolling that shouldn’t come as a surprise.

 The vent system is interesting, however. It is very obvious that more air is moved when the vent is left open, resulting bass that is deeper and fuller but also looser and softer of note. The difference in bass quantity is quite large – the DN-19 can go from sounding relatively accurate, with bass quantity slightly lower than that of the VSonic GR06, to an earphone that’s very hard-hitting, deep, and rumbly, a competitor for Monster Turbines and the like. I vastly preferred the vents closed in all of my listening but those willing to live with boomier, albeit more powerful, bass may prefer to keep the vents open.

 In general, the bass of the DN-19 is full and impactful but far from overwhelming with the vents closed. Like all of the Dunu dynamics, it’s not a very quick-sounding earphone—definitely no match for Dunu’s I 3C-S model—but sounds natural and pleasant. With the vents closed the bass is quite linear—compared to the VSonic GR06, for example, the Tai Chi has slightly more deep bass and less mid-bass. As a result, the Tai Chi is slightly more neutral in tone and boasts a very easy-going bass presentation.

 The midrange of the Tai Chi is rather level but a bit laid-back in terms of emphasis, in stark contrast to the forward mids of Dunu’s similarly-priced I 3C-S. It doesn’t have the greatest clarity, sounding veiled compared to Dunu’s I 3C-S and sets such as the HiFiMan RE-ZERO but still slightly clearer than that of the VSonic GR06. Overall, the mids of the Tai Chi are smooth and rather natural-sounding, with good note thickness and only a slight lack of clarity.

 The treble, likewise, is smooth and forgiving. There is no harshness or sibilance with either vent configuration. Compared to the more revealing I 3C-S and other sets such as the HiFiMan RE-ZERO and HiSound Crystal, the treble of the Tai Chi is laid-back and very easy-going. Top-end extension is good but again the note presentation just isn’t very crisp or energetic, as is the case with the DN-17 and DN-18 models.

 The presentation of the DN-19 is expectedly a touch laid back, but with good overall space and a coherent presentation. The DN-19 is capable of placing vocals front and center when necessary, especially when the vents are closed and the bass isn’t overwhelmingly powerful. Not being a particularly quick earphone, it can get congested at times but otherwise manages an airier and more spacious sound than, for example, the VSonic GR06 and HiSound Crystal.

 Value* (8.5/10) *– Dunu’s new flagship is an impressive all-rounder, easily the company’s best-sounding and most distinctive earphone. In typical Dunu fashion it provides a very thoughtful accessory kit and great build quality, but also adds an ergonomic fit and variable-bass sound tuning system, all wrapped up in a unique design. The tuning system of the DN-19 doesn’t quite provide two sound signatures in one as some may hope, but it does greatly affect the way bass is presented. Overall sound quality is good, with variable bass quantity underscoring the capable mids and smooth, extended treble. It may not have the clarity of the armature-based I 3C-S model, but the smooth and forgiving signature should work for a variety of genres and listening preferences. 

*Pros: Tuning system makes a difference in bass performance; good build quality; great accessory kit; comfortable fit
 Cons: Tuning dampers feel cheap compared to the rest of the kit; clarity and transparency lag behind some of the competition*
  
  
*(2B21) Rock-It Sounds R-50*


Added Nov 2012

 Details: Dual BA earphone from Rock-It Sounds
 Current Price: *$120 *from rockitsounds.com (MSRP: $119.99); *$125.99* for R-50M with mic and 1-button remote
 Specs: Driver: _dual BA_ | Imp:_ 31Ω_ | Sens:_ 110 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 3mm _| Preferred tips:_ Etymotic triple-flanges, Stock single-flanges; Klipsch bi-flanges, Shure gray flex_
 Wear Style:_ Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), airline adapter, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The R-50 utilizes plastic housings with a soft rubber sheath on the outside. Two inches of memory wire and a twisted cable identical to those found on the Rock-It R-20 and R-30 complete the picture. The memory wire is quite inflexible and makes the housings feel more fragile than they really are. Care should be taken when handling the joint between the memory wire and housing
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5) *– Isolation is good even though only single-flange tips are included. Aftermarket triple-flange tips and a deep insertion help further
 Microphonics *(5/5) *– Cable noise is nonexistent with the excellent twisted cable
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings are small and designed for an over-the-ear fit. The nozzles are long enough to achieve a comfortable seal and the overall design is lightweight and unobtrusive. The memory wire has more memory than most

 Sound *(9.1/10) *– The R-50 is based on the familiar Knowles TWFK dual armature driver, which puts in good company with the likes of the Ultimate Ears 700 and VSonic GR01. While not exactly unique in sound signature, the R-50 is one of the better-tuned TWFKs I’ve come across, and also one of the most reasonably-priced.

 The sound signature of the R-50 is a balanced one. Starting with the low end the R-50 pursues accuracy. The bass is lean, punchy, linear, and extended, with much less mid-bass presence and than the lower-end R-30 model. The single-armature MEElec A161P has a similarly flat bass presentation but offers more punch and power than the R-50 at the expense of some of the refinement. The Audio-Technica CK10 and Etymotic ER4S are more similar to the R-50 with a hair less mid-bass providing them with even flatter bass presentations. On the whole, while those looking for rumbly sub-bass or thick, full-bodied impact won’t find it in the R-50, fans of clean and accurate bass will be pleased.

 The midrange of the R-50 is near the top of the food chain when it comes to clarity and fine detailing, vastly improving on the lower-end R-30. It helps that the low end never intrudes and the note presentation is lean and crisp. The tone is quite neutral as well - the R-50 makes both the MEElec A161P and VSonic GR07 sound warm in comparison. Some may complain that it tends towards a thinner note presentation but it’s really no worse than the original Fischer Audio DBA-02 in that respect.

 Moving on up, the R-50 continues to yield no real surprises. In typical TWFK fashion, the treble boasts plenty of energy. It is crisp and sparkly, but not particularly forgiving. Some treble peaks can be discerned but sound tamer with Etymotic triple-flange tips and a deeper seal, or an inline impedance adapter. With single-flange tips the R-50 can be a touch sibilant compared, for example, to the Etymotic ER4S, but not as offensive as the VSonic GR07 can be. Top-end extension is good and the presentation is quite airy. Soundstage size is impressive – the width and depth are above average and the imaging is not too far behind the venerable Audio-Technica CK10. Soundstage width is reminiscent of the VSonic GR07 but the R-50 boasts better depth. Instrument separation is excellent as well.
  

*Select Comparisons:*

Rock-It Sounds R-30 ($70)

 The R-50 is not the only high bang-per-buck earphone in Rock-It Sounds’ lineup – the single-armature R-30 sounds good enough at $70 to compete with many pricier earphones. It falls far short of the flagship, however, with sound that is not nearly as clear or as refined as that of the R-50. The mid-bass of the single-armature is boosted, which results in a warmer, muddier sound less revealing of fine detail. The note presentation is fuller and softer compared to the R-50 but the overall balance is lacking. Treble energy suffers, as does top-end extension, and the presentation is more intimate and closed-in. Compared to the R-50, the single-armature model sounds congested, lacking both the excellent separation and 3-D imaging of the R-50.

Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII ($178)

 The second generation of Fischer’s bang-per-buck champion improved largely on the construction and aesthetics of the previous model, but also gained an interesting sound signature that contrasts well with the R-50. Keeping in mind that both earphones use Knowles TWFK dual armature drivers, it’s the little differences that differentiate the two. Compared to the Rock-It R-50, the DBA-02 mkII boasts a slightly bassier, warmer, and more colored sound signature that makes it better-suited for the average consumer. The R-50 sounds slightly thinner and flatter, has a larger and more spacious presentation, and beats the mkII in treble energy. It is a bit more transparent and revealing, but also less forgiving compared to the smoother Fischers.

HiFiMan RE272 ($250)

 HiFiMan’s flagship is delivers well-balanced and highly refined sound courtesy of a single dynamic driver. Compared to the dual BA-powered R-50, the RE272 generally sounds slightly softer and fuller of note. Its bass, while not as crisp and punchy, decays more naturally and its treble is smoother and more forgiving. The R-50, on the other hand, is crisper and a hair more grainy. Its tone is brighter, with added treble energy which also makes the sound appear a touch clearer. The treble of the R-50 is less forgiving, however, and the earphones sometimes come across sounding hot and spitty compared to the R272.

Ultimate Ears 900 ($400)

 Ultimate Ears’ new flagship is the latest and greatest in balanced armature technology, with four drivers per side providing exceptionally smooth sound. Compared to the UE900, the R-50 boasts a brighter tone with less bass emphasis and more treble energy. It has a thinner note presentation but provides better midrange clarity and more intelligible vocals. Unfortunately, the treble is also splashier and more prone to exaggerating sibilance. The UE900, on the other hand, is smoother and carries more lower midrange emphasis for fuller, throatier vocals. Its bass is deeper and significantly more powerful, though also a touch boomy in comparison. Both earphones have similarly spacious soundstages with good depth and width.

 Value *(9.5/10) *– Rock-It Sounds’ flagship capitalizes on some of the best traits of a dual balanced armature setup – tiny size, high efficiency, good detail and clarity, and an extended, well-balanced response. It offers great comfort, low microphonics, and a clean, transparent sound that puts many pricier products to shame. Best of all, it’s just as good a value at $120 as Rock-It’s lower-end models are at their respective price points.

*Pros: Tiny & comfortable form factor; excellent cable; great BA sound
 Cons: Seems to perform best with aftermarket tips*
  
  
*(2B22) T-Peos H-100*


Added Jul 2013

 Details: BA-dynamic hybrid from Korea-based T-Peos
 Current Price: est. *$120 *from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $170)
 Specs: Driver: _BA+Dynamic Hybrid_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_ 
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5) *– Single-flange hybrid-style (4 sizes) and foam-stuffed (4 sizes) silicone tips, foam tips, lanyard, airline adapter, cleaning tool, and padded zippered carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The construction is above average, with sturdy metal housings bearing engraved T-Peos logos at the rear. They don’t look particularly elegant but should last. The cables are plasticky near the housings but become much thicker and gain a nylon sheath below the y-split. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Isolation is above average
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Can be bothersome with cable-down wear; nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The metal housings of the H-100 are not particularly light or compact, but they have a smooth and ear-friendly shape that isn’t bothersome in long-term listening. The stock tips are of good quality

 Sound *(8.7/10)* – The T-Peos H-100 is part of the still-rare breed of reasonably-priced hybrid earphones. I’ve reviewed and/or auditioned a few others in this price range – the old UE Super.Fi 5EB, the Scosche IEM856MD, and the Audiofly AF78. None of those were particularly impressive so the T-Peos H-100, with its bright, crisp sound and added sub-bass kick, sort of defaults to being the best of the bunch.

 The sound of the H-100 is rather unique, with the overall tone on the cool and bright side but plenty of deep bass kick afforded by the dynamic driver. Bass depth and presence are quite impressive, but not excessive – the sub-bass extends well and affords the bright sound some footing. There is little mid-bass boost, however, and almost no mid-bass bloat. This makes the deep bass seem more prominent and also prevents veiling of the midrange.

 The midrange and treble seem to be handled by the armature of the H-100, with the signature being v-shaped overall. The mids, especially the lower mids, appear a little thin and withdrawn, reminding me of JVC’s FX40 model. Many BA-based earphones, such as the VSonic VC1000, MEElectronics A161P, and Ultimate Ears 600 - not to mention dynamic-driver competitors - have more filled-in and prominent mids compared to the thinner-sounding H-100.

 The treble of the H-100 is bright but not overbearing at reasonable volume levels. It sounds clean and crisp and boasts plenty of energy and sparkle, yet isn’t as harsh as may be expected. The H-100 is less prone to sibilance than several of my VSonic earphones and lacks the graininess of the MEElec A161P, for example. The bright treble gives the sound an added clarity – the same principle used by the JVC FX40 and PureSound ClarityOne. In fact, despite its bass boost and recessed mids, the H-100 has very intelligible vocals and works well at low volumes.

 The presentation of the H-100 is wide and spacious, as tends to be the case with earphones that share these types of v-shaped signatures. The soundstage is good overall and the sound is very airy, making earphones such as the VSonic VC1000 and MEElec A161P sound quite intimate in comparison. Soundstage depth isn’t great, however, and the earphone doesn’t produce properly centered vocals the way a less mid-recessed set, such as the A161P, can.


*Select Comparisons:*

_HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)_

 HiFiMan’s latest mid-range offering combines a balanced sound with a compact, user-friendly form factor and sub-$100 price tag. Next to the v-shaped sound signature of the H-100, the RE-400 sounds very well-balanced, perhaps even a little mid-centric. The H-100, on the other hand, lacks midrange weight and sounds a little “hollow” in comparison. It has significantly better deep bass presence but also more treble than the HiFiMan. The added treble results in a brighter overall tone compared to the more neutral and natural RE-400, but also causes the H-100 to appear clearer, akin to using a treble boost equalizer setting. Naturally, the brighter H-100 is more revealing of sibilance and overall less forgiving than the smoother RE-400.

 The H-100 does have an advantage in soundstage width, appearing a lot more spacious and less intimate than the HiFiMan set. All in all, these two earphones sound vastly different and make each other sound bad in comparison – after listening to the RE-400, the H-100 sounds overly bright and hollow in the midrange. Switching back to the RE-400 after using the H-100 makes the HiFiMan sound overly intimate and lacking in bass depth.

_VSonic GR07 ($179)_

 VSonic’s dynamic-driver GR07, like the HiFiMan RE-400, follows a rather balanced sound signature but, due to its greater bass depth and treble sparkle, does not sound like a complete antithesis to the T-Peos the way the RE-400 does. Admittedly, the GR07 is still quite a bit flatter than the H-100, offering up a sound that is less bright and more coherent, but it doesn't sound downright mid-centric in comparison.
 The tone of the GR07 is warmer than that of the T-Peos due to its greater emphasis on mid-bass and less subbass quantity. It is also thicker in the midrange and again makes the T-Peos sound a bit hollow with its thinner, more withdrawn mids. The bright treble of the H-100 gives vocals good clarity and intelligibility but ultimately the sound is thin and not entirely natural. Interestingly, though the H-100 is brighter, the GR07 is still more prone to sibilance. Overall, I found the pricier GR07 to be better than the T-Peos for its more accurate and natural sound, though when listening to EDM music the H-100 makes a very strong case for itself and may even be preferable to the VSonics.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– The T-Peos H-100 is a BA+dynamic hybrid earphone with a rather unique sound signature. V-shaped, with an emphasis on subbass and treble, the H-100 sounds bright, but with a sizable deep bass kick. It reminds me of a more refined JVC HA-FX40, and like the FX40 provides a uniquely lively experience with EDM. With very nice packaging and an all-around competent design, the H-100 is a standout in value as well, as long as its signature meshes well with the listener.

*Pros: Good clarity, strong subbass, and a spacious and airy sound; packaged like a higher-end product
 Cons: Lacks a bit of midrange presence and thickness*
  
  
*(2B23) VSonic VC1000*
  

Added Sep 2013

  
 Details: VSonic’s second, more reasonably-priced dual BA earphone
 Current Price: *$137* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $159)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _50Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB (@500 Hz)_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec M6 Bi-flange tips_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Single-flange (10 pairs), foam-stuffed (3 pairs), and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and soft drawstring carrying pouch 
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The VC1000 utilizes a slim, straight-barrel form factor similar to the dynamic-driver VSonic VC02 and the pricier GR01. It lacks the detachable cables of the VC02 and removable filters of the GR01, but both of those features were poorly implemented so their exclusion is no big loss. The cable is smooth but on the thin side and lacks a sliding cinch. A bump on the inside of the right strain relief differentiates the left and right earpieces
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Similar to that of the GR01 - good, but not at the level of an Etymotic monitor
 Microphonics *(4/5) *- Cable noise is bothersome when worn cable-down but becomes low with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The housings are very slim and the variety of included eartips should allow the fit to work for anyone. The cable exits at an angle so those with smaller ears may have trouble wearing the VC1000 cable-up. The inclusion of a cable cinch would have helped in this regard
  
 Sound *(9.2/10)* – The VC1000, like VSonic’s pricier GR01 model, is based on the popular TWFK dual balanced armature transducer from Knowles, and offers a balanced sound signature and overall performance on-par with the GR01. Its bass is tight and level, about even in quantity with the Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII. Both depth and punch are good for a balanced-sounding BA-based earphone. 
  
 The midrange is likewise level and not clouded or veiled by the bass in any way. The VC1000 sounds a little warmer and fuller than the similarly-priced Rock-It Sounds R-50 and is again more akin to the Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII and the VSonic GR01. Next to the R-50 its mids are thicker and more filled-in. It is still less warm and thinner-sounding than the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07, however, presenting its midrange in a decidedly BA-like fashion.
  
 The top end of the VC1000 is a bit more forgiving compared to the DBA-02 and Rock-It R-50, again reminding me of the GR01. The R-50 especially sounds brighter and harsher in comparison unless modified with aftermarket eartips and an inline impedance adapter. The treble of the VC1000 is also a bit smoother and less sibilant than that of my first-generation GR07, and more refined and extended than that of the single-armature MEElec A161P. 
  
 The VC1000 also sounds airier than the more intimate A161P. In general, its presentation is similar to other TWFK-based sets. It lacks a bit of soundstage width next to the Rock-It Sounds R-50 but sounds plenty spacious and well-rounded overall.
  
*Select Comparisons*
  
HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)
  
 The RE-400 is a dynamic-driver monitor with a neutral-to-warm sound signature. Compared to the VC1000, its sound is warmer and fuller and its balance is more mid-centric. The VC1000 carries very similar overall bass punch but sounds a bit thinner in the midrange. It is also brighter, with significantly more treble energy than the RE-400. The HiFiMan set is smoother, but also a bit dull-sounding in comparison. In a way, the VC1000 sounds more balanced and complete due to the added treble intensity, but is also less forgiving and on some tracks less natural overall. The presentations of the two earphones are equally capable, with the VC1000 having a very slightly wider soundstage. The optimal choice between the more forgiving and mid-focused RE-400 and the brighter, more crisp-sounding VC1000 will definitely depend on the listener.
  
Philips Fidelio S1 ($99) 
  
 Another balanced-sounding dynamic-driver earphone, the S1 reminds me in many ways of VSonic’s pricier dynamic-driver sets. Compared to the VC1000, it boasts more bass, especially deep bass, and has a warmer overall tone. While less powerful, the low end of the VC1000 is tighter and a bit clearer and its midrange is more prominent in comparison. As the HiFiMan RE-400 sounds more mid-centric compared to the VC1000, so the VC1000 sounds more mid-centric next to the Fidelio S1. Interestingly, while the VC1000 boasts similar, or even slightly greater, treble energy, it actually does a better job of keeping its treble smooth. The Fidelio S1 appears a little harsher and more peaky in comparison and tends to be even less forgiving than the VC1000, which itself is not exactly smoothed-over. 
  
Etymotic Research ER4S ($299)
  
 Long-renowned for its accuracy, the ER4S remains the fidelity standard for many listeners. The performance of the more reasonably-priced VC1000 falls in the same ballpark, offering up a slightly less neutral – but still well-balanced – sound. The VC1000 has fuller bass, boasting a bit more impact, while the ER4S sounds thinner. The Etys have more forward upper mids and as a result appear to be a little clearer. The upper and midrange and treble sound a little more accurate and refined with the Etys, while the VC1000 is a bit more splashy and sibilance-prone. Overall, the two earphones really aren’t very far apart - those concerned with bass will be happier with the VC1000 but otherwise it’ll come down to preference – and budget. 
  
 Value *(9.5/10) *– Yet another competitive monitor from VSonic, the VC1000 uses the familiar TWFK formula, taking advantage of the drivers’ small size and capacity for accurate sound. Unlike the similarly-priced Rock-It Sounds R-50, which required some minor modification, I was impressed with the sound of the VC1000 right out of the box. It has more going for it than just the sound, too – the slim form factor is very comfortable and the construction is good as well. The earphones utilize a simplified design that gets away from some of the quirks of VSonic’s GR01 and VC02 models. All in all, the VC1000 is a lower-priced – but not less capable – alternative to the GR01 and a very solid earphone for those who tend to prefer a flatter sound signature.
  
*Pros: Small, lightweight, and comfortable; balanced and articulate sound*
*Cons: Lacks cable cinch; subpar carrying pouch*
  
  
*(2B24) SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro*
  

 Added Sep 2013
  
 Details: Single balanced armature headset for gaming and music
 Current Price: *$129.99* from amazon (MSRP: $129.99)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _26Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips, proprietary PC adapter, proprietary smartphone adapter/connector, cable guides, and semi-rigid zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The plastic shells of the Flux In-Ear Pro look like a combination of the Phonak PFE and Brainwavz M3 designs. Above the y-split, the cable is of average thickness and features an inline microphone and single-button remote. Below the y-split, the cable is thick and flat, terminating in a proprietary 8-pin connector. From there, one of two included terminations can be used – a 4-pole L-plug form smartphones and other portable devices, or separate microphone and stereo audio plugs for use with a PC
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average for an armature-based set
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Good with over-the-ear wear, average otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The fit of the Flux In-Ear Pro reminds me of Phonak’s defunct “Perfect Fit” earphones, which remains one of the most comfortable in-ears I’ve tried to date. The Flux Pro is a little larger but otherwise fits similarly. Though advertised as wearable either cable-up or cable-down, the earphone requires the channels to be swapped for comfortable cable-down wear
  
 Sound *(8.5/10) *– The SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro is the company’s higher-end in-ear offering and is priced similarly to a number of other balanced armature earphones on the market. Overall, it is a good performer – well-balanced, with good bass depth and smooth, gentle treble. Bass extension and impact are rather impressive for a single BA – punch is about on-par with the HiFiMan RE-400 and MEElectronics A161P, though not quite as tight, and on bass-heavy tracks the low end definitely hits harder than one might expect from a single armature, exhibiting good depth and rumble.
  
 The midrange of the Flux In-Ear Pro is nice and prominent – a little less clear compared to the Etymotic Research HF5 and HiFiMan RE-400, but still good. It is smooth and not overly prominent, with a slightly warm tone and no discernible grain. At the top, the Flux Pro is again smooth and refined – more so, for example, than the MEElec A161P. It sounds a bit duller than the MEElecs but the more forgiving treble presentation is likely worth the lack of energy for many listeners.  
  
 The presentation of the Flux In-Ear Pro is highly reminiscent of the Ultimate Ears 600. It boasts good width but only average depth and layering, especially when compared to higher-end sets. While wide, the soundstage of the Flux Pro is not as airy as that of the HiFiMan RE-400, for example. The less expensive Flux model, too, occasionally has the upper hand when it comes to soundstage depth and dynamics.
  
*Select Comparisons*
  
SteelSeries Flux In-Ear ($50)
  
 SteelSeries’ two in-ear monitors are both impressive performers but the sound quality difference between them isn’t as great as the price suggests. The armature-based Flux In-Ear Pro is flatter and more accurate, with more prominent mids, less bass, and smoother treble compared to the dynamic-driver Flux. It is also more sensitive, requiring less power to reach listening volumes.
  
 The cheaper Flux model, on the other hand, boasts more bass and appears to have better bass depth. In terms of clarity the two are very close, with the more prominent treble of the Flux sometimes giving it an edge in vocal intelligibility. That same treble can sound a little grainy compared to the Flux In-Ear Pro but overall the two aren’t far apart. The soundstages of both earphones are similarly well-rounded but the Flux can be a little more dynamic at times.
  
Logitech Ultimate Ears 600vi ($70)
  
 UE’s only remaining single-armature model, the UE600vi, is a direct competitor of the Flux In-Ear Pro. It is one of my favorite single-armature earphones, offering a slightly mid-centric sound with smooth, refined treble. The Flux Pro has a more balanced midrange presentation – while more mid-centric than, say, the dynamic-driver Flux, it emphasizes mids less than the UE600 does. It also has a bit more bass impact and better depth – always welcome traits in a single balanced armature earphone. The downside of the Flux Pro favoring bass over the midrange is a slight drop in clarity compared to the UE600. The treble, too, seems to be a bit duller on the Flux while the UE sounds a little more crisp and transparent.
  
 The UE600 has a source matching caveat, however – it prefers sources with very low output impedance. The Flux In-Ear Pro is less sensitive and has higher impedance, sounding more consistent between sources – a definite plus for gamers and others planning to use them with a variety of audio devices.
  
VSonic VC1000 ($137)
  
 VSonic’s dual-driver monitor is a bright and crisp-sounding affair, offering a major sonic contrast to the warmer, smoother Flux In-Ear Pro. Compared to the impossibly tight VC1000, the Flux Pro sounds bassier and boomier, with a warmer tone and poorer clarity, especially in the midrange. The VC1000 also provides quite a lot more treble energy at the expense of being very unforgiving when it comes to sibilance and harshness. The Flux Pro, while more dull-sounding, sounds a lot smoother and doesn’t butcher poorly-mastered tracks.
  
 Value *(8.5/10)* – The SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro is a solid single-armature earphone that accomplishes what it sets out to do, providing a balanced and accurate audio experience with a feature set that also makes it suitable for gaming. The over-the-ear form factor is comfortable and unobtrusive and the included PC headset adapter is a nice touch – I’ve only seen one other higher-end earphone ship with one (the MEElec A161P). Overall, while the Flux In-Ear Pro may not be as shockingly good a value as the regular Flux, it certainly delivers solid audio performance while asking little in the way of concessions.
  
*Pros: Comfortable form factor; good overall sound quality; PC- and smartphone-compatible*
*Cons: Cable-down wear requires swapping left and right channels*

  
  
*(2B25) RBH EP1 / EP2*
  

Reviewed December 2013
  
 Details: First in-ear earphones from speaker manufacturer RBH
 MSRP: $149.00 (manufacturer’s page);  $179.00 for EP2 w/mic & 1-button remote (manufacturer’s page) 
 Current Price: *$124* from amazon.com for EP1; $154 from rbhsound.com for EP2
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _14-18k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock Comply foam_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_
  
 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam eartips (1 pair), shirt clip, and spring-clasp carrying pouch; EP2 model includes 1 extra set of Comply eartips
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The housings are aluminum with plastic nozzles and on the whole feel extremely solid. The design is of the half in-ear type, with long strain reliefs and a cloth-sheathed cable. The cord is not very thick and lacks a sliding cinch but has no tendency to kink and resists tangling rather well. The mic/remote module on the EP2 model is located in the y-split but works quite well regardless
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Despite the half in-ear design, the EP1 isolates well, especially with the included Comply eartips
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– The cloth cable of the EP1 is among the least noisy such cables I’ve come across
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The shells of the EP1 house large 13mm drivers but are smooth in finish, compact, and lightweight. They fit snugly and securely, and don’t feel bulky in the ear
  
 Sound* (8.5/10)* – The EP1 is the first in-ear earphone from Utah-based speaker experts RBH Sound, a company with a four decade-long history in the manufacture of audio components. The tuning of the RBH EP1 earphones follows an enhanced-bass profile. The low end extends very well, with no sub-bass roll-off, and has good impact thanks to sizeable mid-bass presence. The EP1 is tighter at the low end than, for example, the VSonic VSD1S but more mid-bassy than the rather neutral-sounding Philips Fidelio S2. All in all, the EP1 boasts a warm sound with great underlying bass power.
  
 Despite its authoritative bass, the EP1 does not sound mid-recessed as do most earphones with similar bass quantity. Instead, it has strong and very clear mids – noticeably clearer, for example, compared to the VSonic’s VSD1S and SteelSeries Flux, two of my favorite budget IEMs. The EP1 makes the Flux sound downright mid-recessed and is a touch clearer than the similarly-priced RHA MA750 as well, boasting more midrange presence but also a slightly thinner note presentation.
  
 Part of the reason for the EP1’s midrange clarity and presence is the lack of upper midrange recession. The prominent upper mids allow the EP1 to sound crisp and clear, but a cut in that region typically tames harshness. The EP1 can be a little harsh as a result – more so, for example, than the Philips Fidelio S2, especially at higher volumes. It is a stark contrast to the smooth and forgiving, but also somewhat dull-sounding, RHA MA750. Happily, the top end of the EP1 is not peaky and dips down towards the upper treble, making the earphones less sibilant than, for example, competing sets from VSonic.
  
 The soundstage of the EP1 is about average for an in-ear of this type. It is noticeably more spacious than, for example, the lower-priced SteelSeries Flux but a touch more congested than the more neutral Philips Fidelio S2. On the whole, the RBH earphones have a slightly warm/dark coloration and sound especially good at moderate volumes due to their strong midrange presence and solid bass. At high volumes the earphones can get a little harsh, and it’s worth noting that they do reach higher volumes easily thanks to rather good sensitivity.
  
*Select Comparisons*
  
Sony MH1C ($60)
  
 The street price of this Sony headset has been growing steadily ever since it became popular in audiophile circles for its warm, smooth, and overall capable sound. The sound signature of the EP1 is not all that different from that of the MH1C, which made the Sony set a natural starting-off point for comparisons. Through the bass region the earphones don’t differ much but the mids of the EP1 are more forward and clearer. The MH1C appears more recessed in the midrange and offers up a little less clarity as a result. The EP1 sounds more crisp through the upper midrange and treble regions, though as a result it has a greater tendency towards harshness. The MH1C, on the other hand, sounds smoother and more forgiving, especially at higher volumes. Lastly, the presentation of the EP1 is a touch more spacious, though the MH1C is no slouch in this respect.
  
HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)
  
 Though the EP1 is an enhanced-bass earphone and the RE-400 is a balanced one, the HiFiMan set is one of my favorite benchmarks and makes for a good contrast to the EP1. As expected, the RBH earphones boast lots more bass, but focus on the sub-bass region and don’t sound particularly bloated even next to the balanced-sounding RE-400. The HiFiMan set is more mid-focused but the EP1 does not sound mid-recessed in comparison. In fact, its mids actually appear more prominent at times, likely because it has more upper midrange energy than the RE-400. The RE-400, on the other hand, offers up smoother but seemingly more extended treble and has a more neutral overall tone. The RE-400, thanks to its more mid-centric sound, has a slightly more intimate presentation. On the whole, these earphones are different enough to the point that each makes the other sound lacking.
  
Onkyo IE-HF300S ($129)
  
 The Onkyo IE-HF300S and RBH EP1 make for an excellent match-up – they fall in the same price bracket and share a similar form factor, and while the Onkyo set has detachable cables, the aluminum housings of the EP1 feel more sturdy in the hand. In sound, too, the earphones are quite evenly matched, though they each have a strong tendency to accentuate the other’s flaws.
  
 The RBH EP1 is the bassier earphone of the two, offering especially more presence in the subbass region. The IE-HF300, on the other hand, while far from bass-light, has less low end presence overall and focuses more on mid-bass. This endows it with a warmer tone, though bass control is still quite good, not yielding to the RBH unit. The midrange of the EP1 is more forward and often clearer as a result compared to the IE-HF300. The mids of the Onkyo set are nonetheless not overly recessed and the HF300, with its lower bass quantity and greater treble energy, sounds a bit more balanced overall.
  
 Tonally, the EP1 is a little darker. It has a more presence in the upper midrange, which makes it sound more harsh at times, but the Onkyo set has some peaks in the treble that cause it to be more revealing of sibilance. Lastly, the presentation of the HF300 is more to my liking – it is broader and more open. On the whole, these two earphones are certainly very distinct in sound despite being on a similar performance level. More so than with any other matchup I can think of, the set I found preferable here really varied from track to track.
  
VSonic GR07BE ($179)
  
 VSonic’s range of GR07 models is getting a bit long in the tooth but for me they remain an excellent showcase for the type of fidelity a good dynamic-driver earphone can achieve. The RBH EP1 is bassier than even the Bass Edition of the GR07, boasting more impact and slam, while the GR07 sounds a little more detailed. The GR07 has more recessed mids whereas the EP1 is more mid-forward and has a bit more upper midrange presence. As a result, the mids of the EP1 can at times appear clearer and more intelligible but both earphones have excellent midrange clarity. The GR07, as is often the case with VSonic earphones, is more sibilant than the EP1, though it also appears to have slightly more extended treble. Overall, I found the GR07BE to be more neutral and balanced than the EP1 despite its more recessed midrange and preferred it in this matchup except for its tendencies towards sibilance.
  
 Value *(8/10)* – The first in-ear model from speaker manufacturer RBH, the EP1 delivers good sound quality and a solid construction. The half in-ear form factor is comfortable and while I am not usually a fan of cloth cables, this one is sturdy and carries little noise. The earphones also isolate well for this type of design with the included Comply eartips. Sonically, the RBH EP1 earphones offer up enhanced bass and strong presence all the way through the upper midrange and are especially enjoyable at low to moderate volumes.
  
*Pros: Solid build quality and good wearing comfort; bass-heavy sound with good midrange clarity*
*Cons: Can get a touch harsh at higher volumes*
  
  
*(2B26) RHA MA750 / MA750i*
  

Reviewed December 2014
  
 Details: Flagship in-ear from Scotland-based RHA
 MSRP: $119.95 (manufacturer’s page); $129.95 for MA750i w/mic & 3-button remote (manufacturer’s page) 
 Current Price: *$120* from amazon.com for MA750; *$130* from amazon.com for MA750i
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _16-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4.4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange (6 pairs in 3 sizes) and double-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, foam tips (2 pairs), shirt clip, stainless steel eartip caddy, and zippered leather carrying case
 Build Quality *(5/5)* – As with RHA’s lower-end models, the construction is impeccable. The MA750 boasts machined aluminum housings, metal nozzle filters, and thick, rubbery cables. At the earphone end there is a molded “earhook” section about 4” long. It’s not memory wire, but it’s a lot more comfortable than the earhooks I’ve come across in the past. The cable is thick and tangle-resistant, and all of the hardware is metal, including the 3.5mm I-plug with a long “spring” strain relief. The 3-year warranty is very impressive as well
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – The housings are narrow at the front, allowing a good insertion depth and good isolation
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– The cable carries some noise but microphonics are generally not a problem due to mandatory over-the-ear fitment and the fact that the cord is thick and heavy, and doesn’t move around much
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The earphone housings have a familiar flared shape a-la Dunu Trident and RHA’s lower-end models. The earpieces of the MA750 made of stainless steel, though, so they are a little heavier. The small diameter at the front nonetheless affords a surprisingly comfortable fit considering the weight
  
 Sound* (8.9/10)* – The previous RHA earphones I’ve tried left me impressed with their bass power and clarity, but the new MA750 is a strong performer all around. Its signature is predicated on enhanced bass, but less so compared to the lower-end models. It has a strong emphasis on sub-bass, and a little less on mid-bass. The bass quantity is not at what I would consider “basshead” level – deep bass presence is good with the MA750 but there’s not too much mid-bass punch compared to some of its competitors. On the other hand it is a lot bassier than the HiFiMan RE-400, which sounds more controlled but appears deficient in subbass in comparison the RHA unit.
  
 The MA750 is warm in tone, but not overly so. It has decent enough treble presence to balance out the bass, though it is certainly is not a neutral earphone. The midrange is rich and full-bodied, with very decent clarity considering the sound signature. Clarity is better than with many other stereotypically “warm” earphones, such as the Sony MH1C and Dunu Trident. The RE-400, on the other hand, is more mid-centric, but still sounds more neutral and is a little clearer through its midrange. The pricier Dunu DN-1000 hybrid, too, is clearer, making the MA750 sound veiled comparison.
  
 The upper midrange of the MA750 is energetic but emphasis diminishes before getting into the regions that typically cause harshness and sibilance. The MA750 is brighter overall compared to the Sony MH1C and Dunu Trident and has a slight tendency to sound “tizzy”, especially at high volumes, thanks to the lower treble emphasis. It isn’t bothersome, however, and I definitely would not call the treble energy excessive. On the other end of the spectrum, the Dunu DN-1000 has treble that is brighter and more revealing of artifacts, making the MA750 sound quite smooth in comparison.
  
 Presentation-wise, the MA750 performs well for the price. Its soundstage is larger than those of the MH1C and Trident, and separation is better as well. The Trident especially sounds more in-the-head and congested in comparison. Aside from the enhanced bass having the ability to throw a slight veil over minute details and take away from its imaging ability, there is not much to complain about with the MA750 here.
  
*Select Comparisons*
  
RHA MA350 ($40)
  
 RHA’s $40 MA350 is one of my favorite budget-friendly sets for enhanced bass, but while the flagship model does command a healthy price premium, it also offers up a significantly more refined sound. The MA350 has strong, domineering bass, but the MA750 manages to sound rich and full-bodied while maintaining lower overall bass quantity and better bass control. It’s more balanced, as well as smoother and more refined. The treble of the MA350 is a little grainy in comparison, and more prone to harshness. The MA750 sounds more natural and enjoys a larger presentation with better depth and separation, making the MA350 appear congested in comparison.
  
Onkyo IE-HF300 ($129)
  
 The IE-HF300 couldn’t be more different from the RHA MA750 in design, but sonically both earphones tend towards a warm, enhanced-bass sound. The RHA unit boasts bass that is both more extended and more powerful overall. The HF300, meanwhile, has less bass quantity with a focus on mid-bass. This results in mids that are a little more veiled compared to the MA750. The MA750 sounds clearer and more crisp, though it is a little more laid-back at the top end compared to the Onkyos. Both earphones boast above-average soundstages, with the HF300 being a little more open-sounding.
  
RBH EP1 ($149)
  
 Yet another enhanced-bass, consumer-friendly earphone in the sub-$150 range, the EP1 nonetheless offers a sizable contrast to the MA750. Both earphones have a strong emphasis on bass but the MA750 is a little more powerful here, which gives it a warmer and more full-bodied sound. The RBH earphones place more emphasis on the midrange and sound a little clearer as a result. The MA750, on the other hand, has a thicker midrange presentation and a smoother and more forgiving sound. The RHA also boasts a slightly wider presentation and tonal character that, to me, is more natural overall.
  
VSonic GR07 Bass Edition ($179)
  
 This earphone’s “Bass Edition” moniker is only true insofar as it is more bass-heavy than the regular GR07. Next to the MA750, however, the GR07BE sounds rather balanced. The RHA unit has more bass and a warmer tonal character while the GR07 is closer to neutral. The bass of the MA750 is boomier and results in more veiling of the midrange. The GR07BE lacks some of the full-bodied character of the RHA, but remains clearer, especially in the midrange. Up top, the MA750 is a little smoother where it counts while the GR07 is more sibilance-prone.
  
 Value *(9/10)* – The RHA MA750 has a lot going for it – a lush and warm sound, spacious presentation, and good bass presence. No less important is the construction quality, which features stainless steel housings and thick cabling. The earphones are comfortable, too, thanks in large part to the over-the-ear fit and molded earhooks, and isolate surprisingly well. Most impressively, the MA750 is not at all exorbitantly-priced – it’s extremely comfortable just north of $100. Early last year I found myself impressed with the entry-level MA350 and hoped to see more great things from RHA, and this year starts off with another hit from the Scottish manufacturer.
  
*Pros: Extremely solid build quality; 3 year warranty; warm sound with excellent bass presence*
*Cons: Housings a bit on the heavy side*
  
  
  
*(2B27) Brainwavz R3 (ver.2)*
  
  

Reviewed September 2014 
  
Details: Dual dynamic earphone form Brainwavz with a unique design
 MSRP: $129.50 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$130* from amazon.com; *$130* from mp4nation.net
 Specs: Driver: _Dual Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _95 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3′ (1.3m) 45°-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 bi-flanges, Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear (preferred)_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Black single-flange (3 sizes), double-flange, and triple-flange silicone tips, gray single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply T400 foam tips, 6.3mm adapter, and sturdy zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The R3 is very well-made, with metal housings and an almost excessively thick cable very similar to the cord on the RHA MA750. The cord is rather long at ~4.3ft, but well-relieved and resistant to tangling
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good, but limited by the housing shape
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Quite low even when worn cable-down
 Comfort *(3/5)* – The R3 is rather unusual in shape, with a large tubular body positioned perpendicularly to the nozzle. Memory wire was present on the original version but made the fit options somewhat limited. The new version (released in May 2014) ditches the memory wire and works better for me, making it possible to maintain a good seal. It’s still a little heavy and has a learning curve, but most listeners should be able to wear the R3 ver. 2 comfortably

Sound* (8.9/10)* – The design of the R3 is rather unique in that its dual dynamic drivers are positioned facing each other, with the nozzle exiting the sound chamber between the drivers. I have previously auditioned the first revision of the R3 and liked what I heard, though I couldn’t keep it securely in my ears due to the memory wire. Now that I can wear the earphones properly, I can give the sound the attention it deserves.

The Brainwavz R3 follows a balanced, slightly warm sound signature with upfront mids, not unlike the HiFiMan RE-400 or Brainwavz’ entry-level M1 model. The bass is level and well-controlled for a dynamic-driver set, with no discernible mid-bass hump. Bass quantity is similar to the RE-400, but the R3 sounds a touch more full-bodied and not quite as tight. This is even more true next to higher-end BA-based earphones such as the TDK BA200 and Brainwavz’ own B2. Compared, on the other hand, to the Brainwavz M1, the R3 has much better quality bass – tighter, flatter, and more effortless.

The R3 has prominent mids with a slightly warm tonal character. Like the RE-400, it can be classified as slightly mid-focused in the grand scheme of things thanks to its level bass and smooth treble – most earphones have more of either one or both. As far as mid-focused earphones go, it is a very good one – clearer, more balanced, and more natural than the Brainwavz M1 but warmer and fuller – albeit also noticeably less clear – than the BA-based TDK BA200 and Brainwavz B2.

At the top, the R3 is smooth and a little laid-back. It does a good job of avoiding harshness and sibilance, sounding soft and refined. Treble reach is good despite its relaxed nature, which gives the R3 a pleasant, airy presentation. The soundstage is well-rounded, with good width and depth, and while imaging is not nearly as precise as with many higher-end monitors (including the B2 and BA200), the somewhat laid-back presentation complements the smooth sound signature nicely.

*Select Comparisons*

Brainwavz S1 ($60)

The pricier R3 is flatter and more neutral than the S1, with tighter bass and more refinement all around. The S1 has greater bass quantity, but also sounds more bloated and a little dark in tone. The treble of the S1 is peaky in comparison to the smooth and natural R3, making it sound harsh and metallic. Clarity between the two is on par, however, likely due to the stronger treble of the S1. Indeed, the top end of the R3 can sound a little dull and smoothed-over at times. The S1 is also a touch more cohesive while the R3 boasts a wider, more spaced-out presentation.

Fidue A63 ($60)

Fidue’s A63 model is a warm-sounding earphone with forward mids. While excellent for the price, it’s no match for the R3 in balance and overall refinement. The A63 sounds rather mid-bassy next to the R3, which has very well-balanced midbass and subbass. Nonetheless, the Brainwavz unit is not lacking in impact and its bass sounds more effortless and natural than that of the A63. The midrange is clearer on the R3 whereas the A63 is a little veiled in comparison. The R3 is also a little smoother and more forgiving.

HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)

The Brainwavz R3 is not too different in sound from the HiFiMan RE-400, which has been one of my favorite $100 earphones for quite a long time. Both are balanced earphones with level bass and smooth treble. The top end of the R3 sounds a little dull next to the thinner, crisper RE-400. The RE-400 has a bit more midrange emphasis, slightly better clarity, and even more refined highs, though both earphones are extremely smooth on the whole. The R3 has slightly more full-bodied bass and a wider, more spacious soundstage, giving it a bigger, more headphone-like sound.

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

The latest version of the VSonic’s popular GR07 model maintains the clear, punchy sound of its predecessor and offers a good contrast to the R3. The bass of the GR07 is both deeper and more impactful compared to the Brainwavz unit. The R3 has thicker, more present, arguably more natural mids while the GR07 is more v-shaped in comparison. The VSonic unit is clearer and a touch more resolving, but also brighter, harsher, and more sibilant. The R3 is much smoother, especially at higher volumes, though its top end is also little dull next to the GR07. Both earphones have above-average soundstage width and imaging that is good, but short of top-tier.

Sony MDR-7550 ($230)

Sony’s dynamic-driver pro monitor also has an unconventional fit, but its similarities to the Brainwavz R3 run deeper. Like the R3, the MDR-7550 is a balanced, slightly warm-sounding earphone with a smooth top end. Compared to the far less expensive R3, the Sony is brighter, clearer, and overall more accurate, but not quite as forgiving through the treble. The largest gap between the two earphones is in clarity, in favor of the Sony. The bass of the MDR-7550 is more quick and well-defined, though also a touch thinner, and its soundstage is a little wider.

Value *(8/10)* – I’ve noticed that earphones in the $100-$150 range are let down by the sound quality more often than expected – maybe 1 in 3 are worth recommending on sound alone. This is not at all the case with the Brainwavz R3 – the smooth, balanced, slightly warm sound with good dynamics is the best part of the package here. The R3 is a great compliment to Brainwavz’ similarly-priced dual-BA B2 model, which sounds brighter, thinner, and more “analytical”. The heavy-duty construction and surprising lack of cable noise also impress. The fit can be a little tricky, but the latest version forgoes the memory wire, making the earphones easier to wear. All in all, the R3 is for those who don’t mind putting a little effort into their earphone experience, so long as the payoff is great sound.

*Pros: Solidly built earphones with an impressively well-balanced, smooth, and capable sound*
*Cons: Fit can still be tricky even with new version*

 



*(2B28) Philips Fidelio S2*


Reviewed July 2015

Brief: Flagship earphone in Philips’ sound-focused Fidelio line

MSRP: $149.99
 Current Price: *$105* from amazon.com;  $125 from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _22Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _15-24k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug w/mic & 1-button remote_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T/Ts200, Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (5 sizes), Comply S200 (1 pair) and Ts200 (1 pair) memory foam tips, and zippered clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The construction of the Fidelio S2 is similar to the S1 model, but – in contrast to the partly-plastic S2 – is all-metal and boasts a fancy-looking glossy finish reminiscent of ceramic earphones such as Sennheiser’s  IE 800. The earphone utilizes textured flat cables with an in-line microphone and single-button remote
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Average, not as bad as could be expected from a shallow-fit design
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Good
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The Fidelio S1 and S2 are built around 13.5mm dynamic drivers – large for IEMs, but definitely not unheard of. Philips chose a half in-ear form factor for the earphones, placing the driver enclosure in the outer ear with an angled nozzle fitting into the ear canal. This sacrifices some noise isolation for the comfort of a shallow seal, but the wide housings fitting 13.5mm drivers put a lower limit on the size of ears that will tolerate these earphones – smaller ears just won’t fit the housings comfortably

Sound* (9/10)* – Philips did a spectacularly good job with the tuning of their new high-end Fidelio line, both the two in-ears and the on/over-ear models I tried at the 2015 CES. The Philips Fidelio S1 and S2 in-ears sound clear and accurate with just the right amount of bass kick. The low end extends nicely, with mild overall boost and impact reminiscent of the VSonic GR07, an IEM highly renowned in audiophile circles.

The mids are crystal clear, with resolution to rival accuracy-oriented in-ears from VSonic and HiFiMan. The lack of bloat helps, allowing the deep bass of the Fidelio S2 to shine and keeping the midrange completely clear of bass bleed. Treble presence is good too – the earphones aren’t lacking at the top end for my tastes, and I’ve been known to enjoy a more energetic sound. At the same time, the treble is free of grain and harshness, but there’s a bit of a lift in the upper midrange and lower treble area. In comparison, the VSonic GR07 sounds a little peaky and sibilant at the top end, while the HiFiMan RE-400 is smoother and more laid-back.

The presentation boasts good width with average depth, reminding me of a slightly more mid-focused and less broad-sounding VSonic GR07. Curiously, the Fidelio earphones are not super efficient for a portable audio product and take more power to reach listening volume than much of the competition. This isn’t a problem except for those who gauge sound quality by maximum attainable volume – there’s still plenty of headroom with portable players. The earphones aren’t picky with sources, either, and sound decent enough from a sub-par Android phone.

There is one small caveat with the both the S1 and S2: they require a very good acoustic seal to perform their best. This is true for almost all IEMs but because of the shallow fit and near-neutral tuning of the Fidelios, there’s not much room for error. The large size of the housings and limited insertion depth play a factor as well. Without a good seal the bass quantity drops, the treble sounds a touch hot and spitty, and the presentation loses its depth. Here, the pricier S2 model has an advantage of the S1 with its extra eartip sizes and Comply Ts-series foam tips.

*Select Comparisons*

Philips Fidelio S1 ($100)

The Philips Fidelio S1 and S2 really don’t differ much, especially when it comes to sound. In addition to its better build quality and fit kit, the pricier S2 model has a slightly more full-bodied sound with a touch more bass. Both can sound a little hot in the treble, especially without an optimal seal, but the S2 is a touch smoother with stock tips. At the same time, it maintains a marginally more airy sound than the lower-end model.

HiFiMan RE-400 ($79)

One of the pioneers of accurate-sounding dynamic-driver earphones, HiFiMan have been selling earphones in this segment since 2008 or so. Compared to the Fidelio S2, their latest $100 offering, the HiFiMan RE-400, is more efficient, warmer in tone, and boasts more intimate mids and a more in-the-head presentation overall.

The Fidelio S2 has more subbass & bass in general but is also less warm and a touch clearer as a result. The mids on the S2 are less forward but it has a boost in the upper midrange/lower treble and sounds brighter on the whole. The RE-400 is smoother and more laid-back up top, sounding more refined and forgiving. The Fidelio S2 is more spacious and has a wider soundstage but gives up the intimate feel and more well-rounded presentation (in terms of depth and width being more even) of the RE-400.

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

VSonic’s similarly-priced, accurate-sounding dynamic-driver IEM is a direct competitor for the Fidelio S2. The GR07 is more sensitive than the Fidelio S2 but otherwise they don’t sound very different, either. The two have similar bass quantity, but the S2 has a flatter/more linear low end while the GR07 has a bit more of a mid-bass hump. As a result, the VSonic unit boasts a hair more bass impact, slightly warmer tone, and a more full-bodied sound while the Fidelio S2 sounds a touch thinner and has a cooler tonal character.

Despite being less warm than the GR07 and having some upper midrange lift, the S2 tends to sound smoother than the GR07 and is less prone to sibilance. The VSonic unit does have a slightly more spacious and three-dimensional presentation, but, thanks in large part to the sibilance, I don’t feel that it is superior to the Philips overall.

RHA MA750 ($120)

Compared to RHA’s warm and bassy MA750, the Fidelio S2 is much more neutral, clearer, and more transparent, but also a little harsher in the treble region. The MA750 sounds thicker overall and suffers from more bass bloat. It is definitely smoother than the Philips, but the top end can still be a little tizzy, especially at high volumes, and the deeper v-shape of its sound signature is audible.

RBH EP1 ($149)

The EP1 is notable for having a very similar form factor to the Fidelio S2, as well as similar build and accessories. The sound of the EP1 is bassier, with the enhancement most audible in the mid-bass region. Its mids are more forward and can appear a little clearer as a result, though on the whole the Fidelio S2 has similar clarity. The RBH unit is also a little harsher, can appear less natural in tone, and its presentation is a little more congested. The more balanced and neutral S2 – despite its slightly more recessed mids – sounds more realistic.

Dunu DN-1000 ($200)

The Fidelio S2 is a dynamic-driver earphone with accuracy-oriented tuning. The DN-1000, which boasts a v-shaped sound signature, has much more of a “wow” factor to its acoustics. Its powerful bass easily outpaces the Philips set, which itself is no slouch when it comes to depth and impact. More surprisingly, the Dunu seems a bit clearer than the more balanced-sounding Philips, due in part to its brighter tonal character. The Fidelio S2 is not the most exciting earphone in the first place, and next to the DN-1000 it sounds especially dull. On the downside, the treble of the DN-1000 has a more “metallic” timbre than that of the Fidelio S2, especially at higher volumes, which is not uncommon for earphones based on the Knowles TWFK driver. The Fidelio S2 is also significantly less efficient than the DN-1000.

Noble 4S ($999)

Compared to the Fidelio S2, the Noble 4S clearer and more balanced, but also a little thinner. The S2 has more bass emphasis and sounds a more full-bodied as a result. It lacks some of the clarity of the 4S, though, and gets harsh a lot more easily. The 4S, despite having a similarly healthy amount of treble energy, is smoother, especially at higher volumes. Lastly, the 4S sounds more airy and open and has better soundstage depth and layering while the S2 is more closed-in.

Value *(9/10)* – Philips is not the first brand that comes to mind when I think “headphone Hi-Fi,” but the Dutch electronics giant has been designing and manufacturing headphones since the 1960s – longer than many of its current competitors have been in business. The 2012 introduction of the Fidelio line of performance-oriented audio products, with its aggressive pricing and solid audio quality, makes it clear that the company is still serious the about high-end personal audio market.

The Philips Fidelio S2 is a well-designed, user-friendly earphone boasting a neutral sound signature with a bump across the bass range, tangle-resistant cabling, and a built-in microphone and remote. The semi-open design makes them great in situations where the higher noise isolation of most other high-end earphones is undesirable—and a great choice for those who don’t like the more intrusive fit of most other IEMs. For a flagship product, they are also quite reasonably priced, costing less than the flagship IEM from any of the other major manufacturers.

*Pros: Shallow-fit design; balanced and very capable sound*
*Cons: Mediocre isolation; housings on the large side*


----------



## ljokerl

*Tier 2A ($150-250)*


*(2A1) Etymotic Research ER-4S*


Reviewed Nov 2009
  
 Details: Legendary IEM from Etymotic Research, first released more than a decade ago
 Current Price: *$239 *from Amazon.com (MSRP: $299.99)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _100 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _20-16k Hz _| Cable: _5’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 3mm _| Preferred tips: _Shure Olives, Etymotic tri-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear or *straight down*_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Large selection of silicone and foam tips, plastic storage case, carrying pouch, two sets of spare filters, filter removal tool, ¼” adapter, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The tubular are made out of a thick, sturdy plastic. Stock cables are thick, strong, and - if necessary - replaceable
 Isolation *(4.5/5)* – Very deep fit. Etymotic claims a maximum attenuation of 42db, and I believe them
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Can be microphonic when used without the included shirt clip. Hard to wear over-the-ear due to long stem and thick cables
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Have to be inserted quite deeply for ideal seal. The thin housing makes this easier and Foam tips often work great

 Sound *(9.1/10)* – There is just no way not to be blown away with the level of detail these things put out. Unlike the RE0, which let the detail sink in slowly, the Etymotics smack you in the face with it. As a result, they can be very unforgiving of poor source material, as a good studio headphone should be - these are not for collectors of low-bitrate mp3s. The highs are detailed and extended, replete with mind-boggling crispness and resolution. The mids are smooth, detailed, well-placed and very engaging. Tone is neutral to slightly bright. The bass has excellent detail but tends to be a bit thin of note. The ER-4S is not bassy by any means, but definitely satisfying for those in search of quality over quantity. Extension is not perfect, but texture is superb. The presentation is typical Etymotic - excellent instrument separation, good layering and positioning, but not much in the way of 3D space. The soundstage is much wider than it is tall or deep.

 Amping: Not required but will go a ways towards making them shine with portable equipment. Though an mp3 player can drive them to decent volume, it will not unlock their full potential. With a decent amp (such as a mini3), the ER-4S really opens the tap on speed and detail.

 Value *(8/10)* – Make no mistake – Etymotic’s flagship is still a top-tier IEM 15 years later. The fact that it costs $250 to some of the other flagships’ $400+ is a testament to its high value, not low worth. One of the biggest problems of the ER-4S is the HF5, which can compete with the flagship on several key characteristics and costs just under ½ as much. Another much-cheaper competitor is the HiFiMan RE0, previously in the same price bracket but now severely discounted. When both are properly amped and outfitted with the right tips, choosing between the two can really come down to a question of preference and, with prices currently what they are, budget.

*Pros: Some of the most detailed sound to be had, durable, replaceable cables, unbeatable isolation, 2-yr warranty w/great customer service
 Cons: Deep insertion not for everyone, can be difficult to wear over the ear, microphonics can annoy without shirt clip, very analytical sound*


*(2A2) Phonak **Audéo P**FE 122*


Reviewed Jan 2010
  
 Details: the original ‘Perfect Fit Earphone’ from Swiss hearing aid manufacturer Phonak
 Current Price: *$169 *from Audeoworld.com (MSRP: $169) for 111/112; $199 for 121/122 with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _5-17k Hz_ | Cable: _3.6’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm _| Preferred tips: _Jays silicone single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), Comply T130 foam tips, 8 filters (4 grey; 4 black), cleaning tool, silicone ear guides, and zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* –  The plastic housings are extremely lightweight and the cabling is fairly thick and quite soft, with a strong tendency to resist tangling. The PFEs certainly don't feel bulletproof but the newest revisions should survive daily use quite well
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Isolation is quite tip-dependent and best with the included Comply T130s or similar foamies. With silicone tips isolation is average
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Quite low, partly because they must be worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(5/5)* – The part of the housings that fits inside the ear is small and the earphones are very light. As a result the PFEs can really disappear during everyday use. Bonus points for the included silicone cable guides. The only (rare) problem I had was that of losing seal under strenuous exercise with silicone tips

 Sound *(8.8/10)* – Ultimately, the sound is really what makes or breaks an earphone. After my initial listening rounds with the PFE I settled on the grey filters and kept them in for the duration of the test. To my ears the grey filters provide more sparkle in the treble and a slightly smoother and thicker upper midrange. The black filters accentuate the bass but I found the (slight) hardware bass boost provided by my iBasso T4 to be a better solution. Tips matter as well – the included comply T130s will provide a more tactile bass presentation but also slightly veil the high end. The silicone tips have a more transparent sound but for some reason none of the stock tips fit me quite right. I did finally find a good fit with Jays silicone tips off of my J-Jays though.
  
The overall sound of the PFEs amazes with its smoothness and clarity. The bass is tight and accurate. The mids are somewhat liquid and very well-positioned in being neither forward nor recessed. The treble is similarly accurate and quite enjoyable. There is a small amount of unevenness at the high end, but this can be reduced a bit by using the black filters. I wasn’t bothered enough by it to give up the grey filters though. Overall the PFEs have a tonal balance on the cool side of the spectrum and very high resolving capability. Soundstaging is about average – wider than the Ety ER-4S and RE0 but not as expansive as the ATH-CK10 or RE252. Instrumental separation is excellent and positioning is quite good as well. They lack the famed Etymotic forwardness, which makes it a tiny bit harder to pick out details with the PFE but results in a less fatiguing sound.

Amping: The PFE is one the rare IEMs that do benefit from amping. Despite the relatively low rated impedance and high sensitivity, the PFE becomes truly effortless when fed enough power. My iBasso T4 was sufficiently powerful but the transparency of the D10 and mini3 gave a nicer sound. When properly amped the PFE maintains its incredible clarity and resolution and becomes very hard to beat in transient response and all-around speed. A positive side effect of their inefficiency is the ability of the PFE to suppress background hiss from impedance mismatches. At listening volume the PFE exhibited no notable hiss from any of my amps or sources except the Amp3, with which they were still far more tolerable than with most earphones.

 Value *(9/10)* – Despite the crop of excellent mid-range earphones currently available to the average consumer, the year-old Phonak PFEs still amaze with their incredibly coherent presentation and musical sound signature. I can’t recommend them enough for acoustic tracks, but they work well with nearly all music styles. The possible combinations of tips and filters and the responsiveness of the armatures to equalization also make the PFEs very tunable. Die-hard bassheads may want to look elsewhere, but for the rest of us the PFE might just be able to provide the desired sound. If Phonak has indeed made the necessary improvements to the build quality of the PFE for the v1 release, the PFE should be shortlisted by anyone looking for balance and clarity without the need for monstrous isolation.

*Pros: Comfortable, low microphonics, very balanced and musical presentation, great clarity and resolution
 Cons: Reported build issues with original version, mediocre isolation*
  

*(2A3) Head-Direct / HiFiMan RE252*


Reviewed Jan 2010
  
 Details: Head-Direct’s latest creation that strays from the path set by the RE2 and RE0 in favor of an even more balanced and less intense sound
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $199)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq: _16-22k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_5mm _| Preferred tips: _Altec Lansing / UE biflange, Soundmagic Single flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(3/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) tips, shirt clip, and replacement filters (5 sets)
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The silicone housings are fairly soft and seem protective but time will tell if they will stay intact or not. Strain reliefs are integrated into the housings and should work as long as the cable is anchored well. The new cabling (compared to the older cloth cords on my RE0) is flexible and seems sturdy. The L-plug is nice as well. An odd issue with these is that they are absolute dust magnets. Not really a problem per se but those who like their earphones shiny and clean may have some trouble
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Isolation depends hugely on fit (and therefore one’s ears) and tip choice. Smaller biflange tips give me solid isolation at the expense of long-term comfort. Single flange tips do the opposite
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Not too bad but the cord is quite energetic (much more so than my cloth RE0 cord) and can be loud when bouncing around. The included shirt clip helps
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The RE252 are almost custom-like in form factor and take some getting used to after conventional IEMs. The shells do get softer with break-in. I stopped noticing them around the 3rd week of use. Wearing them over-the-ear is possible with longer tips but not for everyone. Persons with very small ears may not be able to get a good fit at all

 Sound *(8.9/10)* – When the RE252 (at that time called the RE3) was first announced I expected that it would be a spiritual successor to Head-Direct’s previous flagship and one of my all-around favorite IEMs, the RE0. From the first listen, however, I realized that they are very different animals. The soundstage has great width but not as much air as the RE0, which gives them a strange lack of intimacy but also a headphone-like immersion and imaging that’s often difficult for an earphone to achieve. Balance, however, is superb. I have seen them summed up as sounding like the RE0 with more bass and less treble. While technically correct, this description really ignores a lot of nuances. Compared to the crisp and endlessly extended treble of the RE0 the treble on the RE252 is much softer and more subdued, resulting in a more laid back sound. With the right tips treble quantity can approach that of the RE0, but it never sounds quite the same. The midrange has much more weight to it with the RE252, making the RE0 sound slightly thin in comparison. It is still impeccably smooth, however, and the detail never gets glossed over. The bass is fast, accurate, and not lacking in quantity for my tastes but also a little too soft in impact. When properly amped, the RE0 can get about 80% of the way there in bass quantity and has a tighter presentation, but unamped the RE252 wins. One of the necessary hallmarks of a great earphone (for me) is the ability to provide an enjoyable sound at very low listening volumes. On this front, the RE252 simply cannot be beaten in my book. Several times during my testing I wanted to see if I could still enjoy them at a slightly lower volume only to find out that dropping one more notch on my mp3 player or muted it.

 Amping: Straying off the path set by the RE0 again, the RE252 benefits no more from amping than the average 16-ohm earphone. An amp can be used to modify the sound signature (e.g. the iBasso T4 for more warmth), and a good source will scale these up a notch, but I can’t say that getting an amp for them is recommended. Also, the higher efficiency compared to the RE0 means they can hiss slightly with certain amps and sources.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The RE252 is an excellent choice for anyone who tried the RE0 and thought “Hey, I would enjoy these more if they were more restrained in the treble, more lush in the mids, had more bass, and were reshelled into mutant gummy bears”. I really think they are near the top of the upgrade path for anyone who craves a wide and balanced sound, a path that stems from enjoyment of earphones such as the Soundmagic PL30 and Cyclone PR1 Pro. But it is also here that the RE252’s main problem lies – this signature is definitely not for everyone. While I do feel that the RE252s sound fuller and more engaging than the RE0 with dense rock and metal tracks that rely on spatial positioning and require at least some bass, I can’t help but feel that I would still choose an (amped) RE0 as an all-around earphone with its crisp, sparkly, and airy treble. This certainly has a lot to do with the innovative housing of the IEM, which makes the fit too restrictive for my tastes and results in other small quirks. I do think that some people will find their perfect sound in the RE252 and certainly applaud Head-Direct for trying something new, but for me an IEM is something that should, aside from sounding good, make my life easier on all fronts and the traditional approach just seems to do that better.

*Pros: Impossibly balanced sound, top-tier detail and clarity
 Cons: Cannot be worn over-the-ear, potential fit issues for some, can be microphonic, mediocre isolation, absolute dust magnets*
  
  
*(2A4) Panasonic RP-HJE900*


Reviewed Mar 2010
  
 Details: Panasonic’s flagship IEM made of Cubic Zirconium
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $249.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _26 Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _6-28k Hz_ | Cable: _3.6’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _UE Single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes) and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The Cubic Zirconium housings feel indestructible. Cables are user-replaceable and fairly thick but a bit plasticky and energetic. Cord cinch doesn’t have enough grip. Reports of nozzle filters falling out
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Good for a dynamic-driver IEM
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn over-the-ear; slightly bothersome otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The Cubic Zirconium shells are quite heavy and the long strain reliefs/cable connectors can make them hard to wear over-the-ear. Cord may be too short for some

 Sound *(8.6/10)* – The HJE900 sounds every bit as interesting as it looks. Bass extension is impressive and impact is fast and tight. Low-end response is slanted slightly towards mid/upper bass. A long-ish decay time gives them a very natural presentation at the low end and their realistic timbre rounds off the sound. The upper bass boost gives them a warm tonality – but not excessively so. In fact, the unique presentation of the HJE900 is defined by the combination of slightly warm vocals and crisp, sparkly treble, all underlined by strong, controlled bass. The midrange is detailed and has a lusher feel compared to the dryer, more accurate ATH-CK10s. The soundstage is fairly close and intimate, but not narrow or closed-sounding. The HJE900 do have more depth than width, separating instruments nicely and imaging each well. The highs are more similar to the ATH-CK10 than other dynamic-driver IEMs, with a good amount of sparkle minus some of the detail and transparency. The Panasonics are quite efficient but don’t hiss too badly with my Amp3. On the downside, they are less forgiving of poor source material than much of the competition, likely due to their accentuated presentation of the upper mids/lower treble. Not recommended for 128kbps mp3s.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The HJE900 provides a great balance of fun and refinement. The bass and treble are quite strong, perhaps excessive for some, but the sound is beautifully dynamic and involving. They manage to sound very ‘musical’ and yet have nothing to be ashamed of when it comes to detail and imaging. Unfortunately, Panasonic has pulled them from the US market, leading to a two-fold increase in price. For those in search of a fun, v-shaped sound the HJE900 may still be worth buying but the competition is very strong at $250.

*Pros: Rock-solid, replaceable cables, interesting and engaging sound signature
 Cons: Treble may be excessive for some, heavy shells, stock tips are underwhelming*

 For a more in-depth review and comparisons to the Monster Turbine Pro Gold and ATH-CK10 see here
  
  
*(2A5) Monster Turbine Pro Gold*


Reviewed Mar 2010
  
 Details: Monster’s latest creation may be obscenely garish, but underneath the gold exterior beats a driver to match the best of the best
 Current Price: *$249 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $299.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Soundmagic biflanges, Monster Supertips_
 Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes), tri-flange (2 sizes), and Comply foam tips, gel-filled Monster supertips, buttoned carrying case, magnetic-clasp carrying pouch, over-the-ear cable guides, 1/4” adapter, and shirt clip
 Build Quality *(**3.5**/5)* – The Monster Turbine Pro addresses the known issues with the build of the original Turbines by offering proper strain reliefs on the sturdy metal shells, a thicker cable, and an L-type 3.5mm plug
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Very good for a dynamic-driver IEM
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn over-the-ear; slightly bothersome otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – Despite the weighty housings they stay in extremely well both cord-up and cord-down. The variety of included tips makes it easy to find a good seal right out of the box

 Sound *(8.7/10)* – First off, the Turbines are very sensitive to insertion depth – shove them in too far and they lose clarity and air; not far enough and bass depth drops off significantly. I found the soft Soundmagic biflanges to work well for me in terms of providing the right insertion depth effortlessly, but Monster’s own fit kit will likely satisfy most. Sound-wise the Turbines are the epitome of a high-end dynamic IEM. When properly inserted the Turbines come reasonably close to the best earphones I’ve heard in clarity while providing a much thicker overall sound without sounding unbalanced. I was impressed with the sound of the original turbines, which provided ample bass with almost no bleed into the midrange. The Pro version follows the same philosophy while correcting the original Turbines’ biggest weakness – mediocre treble response. The Pros are also superior in other areas as well – detail, clarity, control, soundstaging, and separation all undergo improvement to varying degrees.
 
Bass-wise the Turbines go deeper and move more air than nearly everything else I’ve heard. Though the bass isn’t quite as aggressive as with the Panasonic HJE900, sub-bass is more pronounced. The dynamic drivers do a good job of texturing the low end while providing very smooth and full-bodied bass response. They are capable of delivering poised, well-textured, and surprisingly balanced sound but just can’t quite compete with high-end armature phones such as the ATH-CK10 and UE TF10 in speed and control. Same goes for resolution, especially at the high end – the Turbines have a lot of resolving power but the overall sound is slanted towards coherency rather than resolution. The midrange is impossibly smooth and tends towards a thicker note presentation.
 
The Turbines are less forward and intimate than the HJE900 and yield in soundstage depth to the Panasonics but on the whole everything is properly spaced and positioned. The high end is natural and well-extended but lacks the sparkle of some BA earphones, instead providing a sound that is completely free of harshness and sibilance. Partly because of this the MTP is less engaging than earphones such as the CK10 and RE252 at extremely low volumes. Though the specs of the Turbine Pros are not published, they are clearly less efficient than most of my other IEMs. Just like the original Turbines, they do an admirable job of cutting down on hiss with the Amp3 as well as my netbook audio jack.

 Value *(8/10)* – With a relaxed and buttery-smooth sound signature, the Monster Turbine Pro Gold is an excellent all-around earphone, picking up where the original Turbines left off and providing a more balanced and refined sound signature. Bass lovers should take notice – the Turbines can put out impressive bass, both in quantity and quality. They also provide treble that, while not as extended as the limitless RE0 or CK10, is smooth, natural, and extremely pleasing to the ear. The signature of the MTP also changes noticeably with tip choice and insertion depth so some trial and error may be required to extract the best performance.

*Pros: Good build quality, comfortable, massive fit kit, excellent bass, very smooth, balanced, and dynamic sound
 Cons: Posh to the point of vulgarity, some microphonics can be coerced from the cable*

 For a more in-depth review and comparisons to the Panasonic HJE900 and ATH-CK10 see here


*(2A6) Yuin OK1*
  

Reviewed May 2010
  
 Details: Yuin’s top of the line IEM/earbud hybrid
 Current Price: *$229 *from Head-Direct.com (MSRP: $229)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _150 Ω_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq: _20-24k Hz_ | Cable: _4.5’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Large single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – In-ear nozzle inserts (3 lengths), Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) tips, rubber earbud covers, and 6.3mm adapter
 Build Quality *(3/5)* – Like all of Yuin’s earbuds, the OK1 uses plastic housings and a thin, rubberized cable terminated with a straight plug. Unlike the PK line, the grilles of the OK1 are actually metal and the screw-on IEM nozzles glide smoothly into place. Like most earbuds, the plastic stems take the place of proper strain reliefs
 Isolation *(1/5)* – The OK1 are basically conventional earbuds with nozzles tacked on. They are open-back and isolate accordingly
 Microphonics *(5/5)* – Like conventional earbuds, the OK1 do not suffer from microphonics the way IEMs do - the ear coupling is too shallow and loose for solid conductance
 Comfort *(2.5/5)* – Since this is an IEM review, I am only evaluating the OK1s when used as IEMs. When worn as conventional earbuds, they are as comfortable as any stock buds. With the IEM extenders, however, the OK1 become a complete disaster. The shape of the human ear is such that the ear canals are not perpendicular to the ear itself, which is why angled-nozzle designs like the Klipsch S4 work so well. Sticking a forward-facing nozzle in the center of a conventional earbud, however, results in an IEM with a gigantic driver bulge and very long stems. Finding a comfortable fit takes a lot of experimentation and deep insertion is nearly impossible. For me the longest nozzles in combination with the largest single-flange tips provided a relatively comfortable (read: 2-3 hours at most) shallow seal. Others may not be so lucky

 Sound *(8.9/10)* – Again, since this is an IEM review, I will not be evaluating the OK1 as a conventional earbud. I simply don’t have extensive experience with other conventional buds, nor do I like the form factor. As an IEM, though, the OK1 clearly holds its own against the best of the best, though proper insertion is perhaps more crucial with the Yuins than most traditional IEMs.

 From the bottom up, the OK1 is a bit different from my other IEMs both in signature and presentation. The sound it produces manages to be bright and a bit aggressive, but at the same time extremely refined and surprisingly delicate. Even with ample driving power the bass of the OK1 will probably be its weakest point for the average listener. Bass is similar, both in quantity and impact, to the Head-Direct RE0 – tight, accurate, quite fast, but lacking the rumble and grungy texture that many bass-heavy dynamics provide. However, due to the wider and more open presentation of the OK1, instruments that rely on low notes actually sound more natural than with the RE0. Above 40Hz or so the bass is quite linear, transitioning smoothly into the midrange. The mids of the OK1 are its strongest quality – clear as a bell, detailed, and transparent, they put most traditional IEMs to shame. The midrange actually reminds me of the ATH-CK100 in clarity and transparency. However, the forwardness of the CK100 makes them sound slightly colored in comparison to the OK1. In addition, the OK1 isn’t nearly as touchy with regards to source - the midrange is always neutral and natural. An amazing property of the OK1 is the absolute lack of barrier between the listener and the vocalist, especially when it comes to female vocals, though this comes at a price – a slight loss in texture. Still, the absolute nudity of vocals as presented by the OK1 makes something like the Custom 3 sound veiled. Like the CK100, the OK1 picks up emphasis towards the upper midrange and keeps going right up into the lower treble, resulting in a rather bright and crisp sound shimmering with energy. As a result they are less forgiving of harsh and sibilant tracks than the CK100 despite sounding more delicate overall. Top-end extension is good – not quite CK10-good but better than the Custom 3/e-Q7 and company.

 The presentation of the OK1 is again very different from most other IEMs I’ve tried. The OK1 has perhaps the most natural way of separating out instruments and positioning them in the soundstage – the instruments are very evenly spaced in the depth of the sonic stage. Despite not having the absolute widest soundstage around, the Yuins are quite adept at conveying both distance and intimacy, though they don’t fare too well at either extreme. Openness of sound is quite surprising as well – for an IEM the OK1 is downright airy. The resulting sound makes it quite easy to pick out and focus on individual instruments and/or vocalists. Best of all, the OK1 still sounds very coherent and musical, never sounding thin even with the widest and most spacious pieces

 Amping: As if the 150 Ω impedance isn’t a dead giveaway, the OK1s need a lot of driving power. My Sansa Fuze barely reaches listening volume and sounds positively anemic with the Yuins and an iRiver T5 actually starts clipping at high volumes. An amp is therefore absolutely required if using these with an average DAP. Exceedingly powerful players such as my S:Flo2 can drive the Yuins fine without making them sound constrained, but the S:Flo is more of an exception than the rule.

 Value *(6.5/10)* – If I were evaluating the OK1 on sound alone, the $230 price tag would not be difficult to justify – the incredibly airy and delicate sound of the Yuins is sure to find many fans among those who prefer a more realistic listening experience. As a total package, however, the OK1 lacks the advantages so many higher-end IEMs provide. Isolation and long-term comfort are not in the OK1’s playbook and the build quality is slightly disappointing for a high-end product. On the upside, cable noise never rears its ugly head and it is very unlikely that the OK1 will ever be stolen. In fact, their dimestore-earbud appearance may be a thief deterrent over stock apple earbuds. As usual, the true value of the OK1 comes down to personal preferences in the end. One thing is for sure – for some listeners the sound produced by the OK1 will be able to negate their shortfalls.

*Pros: No microphonics, extremely airy sound, great balance, detail, and transparency
 Cons: uncomfortable when used as IEMs, almost no isolation, build quality worthy of a $30 earbud*
  
  
*(2A7) Radius HP-TWF11R Pro “DDM”*
  

Reviewed Jun 2010
  
 Details: World’s first dual-dynamic driver earphone from Japanese audio firm Radius
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $219.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual Dynamic_ | Imp: _24 Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _10-18k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single-flange (large)_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_
  
 Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (6 pairs), cleaning cloth, and hard clamshell carrying case with removable cord winder
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The housings are plastic with the inner surfaces rubberized slightly. A thick rubber strain relief protects the cable entry point but doesn’t feel particularly well-integrated. The nylon-sheathed cord is relatively thick and doesn’t kink nearly as much as the Klipsch Custom series cabling. It is terminated with a metal 3.5mm I-plug with a short rubber strain relief
 Isolation *(2/5)* – Quite average due to vented design
 Microphonics *(3/5)* – Fairly bothersome and exacerbated by the fact that the DDM is difficult to wear cord-up
 Comfort *(3/5)* – The DDM is a very tough earphone to get used to. It seems to be designed to maintain stability by virtue of seal alone. The cable exit point keeps me from tucking the driver-containing bulge inside my ear and the nozzle angle is rather odd compared to my other earphones. Though not uncomfortable per se when a proper seal is achieved, the DDM still never feels particularly secure to me. Expect to spend time experimenting with fit to get the most out of these
  
 Sound *(8.7/10)* – While the ergonomics and aesthetics of the tongue-twisting Radius may leave much to be desired, sound quality is where the funky earphone really shines. By virtue of what I can only imagine is some sort of dark magic, the dual-dynamic-driver HP-TWF11R sounds more coherent than not only most IEMs in its price range, but just about any high-end earphone I’ve heard, period. I’ve said in the past that what a lot of the high-end multiple-BA IEMs do best is dissect a piece of music into the tiniest details to display the most minute intricacies present on the track. The Radius achieves the same result by opposing means – rather than dissecting the music, it presents an exquisitely blended sound that’s refined enough for the tiniest details to make themselves quite obvious. A side effect is that the the DDM takes a bit of getting used to and might not sound entirely natural at first listen. But let’s start from the bottom.
  
 The bass of the HP-TWF11R is the foundation for the robustness of their sound signature. It is very extended, competing with my Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Future Sonics Atrios, and provides a bit of rumble and plenty of impact. Despite being impactful, the HP-TWF11R never loses balance - the bass is rather soft and polite in presentation. Unless a track specifically calls for bass dominance, the low end of the Radius never feels intrusive or aggressive. It keeps up on fast techno and trance tracks and provides the reverb and decay necessary for the proper portrayal of orchestral recordings. Midrange bleed is nonexistent and the midrange itself seems (sounds?) to be the meat of the DDM.
  
 The midrange is fluid and coherent, not at all veiled but not forward as with the ATH-CK100 or thick as with the Ortofon e-Q7. It lacks the absolute transparency of the whimsical Yuin OK1 but still manages to be quite competent in expressing the emotion in vocals. The DDM shines when it comes to reproducing stringed instruments. The rather delicate presentation conveys every nuance of string motion and every intonation of the sound it produces, resulting in a surprisingly detailed sound despite the lack of Etymotic-like forwardness or aggression. The same goes for the treble of the DDM – it is equally polite and very clear but lacks the crispness and energy of the treble produced by certain armature-based earphones (e.g. ATH-CK10, ATH-CK100, TF10). Instead of smacking the listener in the face with detail and clarity the way the CK10 does, the DDM presents detail softly and never leans toward a treble-heavy sound, maintaining a slightly more grounded balance at all times. However, that is not to say that the DDM cannot convey authority – I feel confident in saying that the dynamic range of the earphone is one of widest I have encountered. Despite this, due to the way fine detail is presented, the DDM does not work as well at minimal volume as the Yuin OK1, ATH-CK10, or RE252 – not necessarily a con but simply result of their peculiar dynamics.
  
 In terms of presentation, the DDM is a very airy earphone. The soundstage has very good width and depth and an ‘out of the head’ feel, seemingly compounded by the size of the earphones themselves. Despite the rather large sonic stage, I feel that the DDM works best with conveying the intimacy in recordings rather than spaciousness. Compared to the ATH-CK10, the positioning isn’t quite as precise and imaging isn’t as accurate. The DDM also can’t quite compete with the overall speed of my CK10 or CK90Pro but fares well enough for electronic music. Lastly, the DDM does like being given a bit of extra juice. Depending on the source and/or amp used, giving the DDM some leeway in available power can make it sound more dynamic, more fluid, and even more detailed. Is it a night and day difference? Not exactly, but it is noticeable. I’m not a big proponent of portable amps but if the DDM is your be-all, end-all earphone, a decent amp may be worth the investment.
  
 Value *(7/10)* – Overall I found the Radius HP-TWF11R to be both incredibly infuriating and undeniably endearing. Their build quality, microphonics, and fit leave much to be desired for me. Granted, I have been spoiled by the ergonomics of the Audio-Technica IEMs along with my Q-Jays and, more recently, the Phiaton PS200, but for me the fit of the DDM is simply irksome. The sound, however, leaves an entirely different impression. Though the signature takes a bit of time to get used to, the DDM is easily one of the most balanced dynamic-driver IEMs I have heard and its sonic characteristics, in a way, make me think of a pyramid – robust, detailed, and consistent bass at the bottom, a voluminous and wonderfully integral midrange in the center, all topped up with a healthy serving of extended and unfatiguing treble - the whole thing in perfect balance (in this analogy the CK10 would be a free-standing upside-down pyramid – unsurprisingly polarizing but quite literally mind blowing under the right conditions). Couple all that with a great dynamic range and I feel confident in saying that the DDM is the best-sounding IEM I have heard in the sub-$200 category. Yes, I require more from an IEM than just sound quality. But if I were to buy an IEM specifically for home use, I’d be hard-pressed to find a better value and a more enjoyable overall listening experience than what the HP-TWF11R provides for the asking price.
  
*Pros: Oh-so-beautiful sound, very nice carrying case*
*Cons: Finicky fit, mediocre isolation, microphonic*
  
  
*(2A8) Future Sonics Atrio M8 (v1) MG5*
  

Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Bass-heavy universal IEM from the pioneer of dynamic customs, Future Sonics
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $199.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: Stock biflanges, _Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Bi-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), porous foam tips (4 sets), cleaning tool, and zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The teardrop housings are made of plastic with molded rubber strain reliefs and an inch of memory wire tacked on. The plastic-sheathed cord is light and flexible but has a bit of memory character and can be tough to straighten out. Though the cable is plenty long, the y-split is slightly higher up than usual, which may be inconvenient for some
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Excellent with any of the stock tips and outstanding or Shure Olives
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Extremely low
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The fit of the Atrios reminds me of the Phonak PFEs. When worn properly, the housings don’t touch the wearer’s ear at all. However, with the stock bi-flange tips, insertion depth is quite great and sleeping in them is not as pleasant as it could be due to the sharp front edges of the shells as well as the intrusive fit. Getting a stable seal may also require a bit of fidgeting due to the memory wire
  
 Sound *(8/10) *– As expected, the bass is the dominant aspect of the sound signature of the M8. What is surprising is just how technically competent the low end is. The bass is extremely extended, dropping below 30Hz without significant roll-off and audible well into the low 20Hz range. With the exception of the Hippo VB, the Atrios may have the flattest sub-bass of all the bass-heavy earphones I’ve tried. But it’s not just the excellent extension that gives the Atrios their reputation – the bass is detailed and impeccably textured. The dynamic drivers found in the Atrios can move quite a lot of air and, while the impact isn’t quite as precise as bass produced by BA-based earphones, the Atrios exercise impressive control over their low end. The bass is neither muddy nor bloated and can be an incredibly satisfying underlying element on bass-light tracks. On tracks with dominant basslines, however, the low end of the Atrios can be intense and perhaps even a bit overpowering if your personal preferences lean towards more analytical sound as mine do.
  
 Recessed slightly in comparison to the low end, the midrange is clear and detailed. The clarity lags slightly behind the Sennheiser IE8, Hippo VB, and most armature-based earphones in the price range but still manages to impress for an earphone balanced the way the Atrio is. The mids are smooth, surprisingly uncolored and natural-sounding, and blended well with the bass and treble. Stringed instruments sound especially crisp and pleasant with the Atrios but vocals have good presence as well. The treble is just as smooth and relaxed as the midrange and boasts decent extension with silicone tips and a slight bit more roll-off with foamies. The top end is quite natural and, though fine detail is not as forthcoming as with some of the more analytical earphones, the edginess present in the treble of earphones such as the Hippo VB and Panasonic HJE900 is nonexistent with the Atrios.
  
 The overall tone of the Atrios is quite dark, especially when using foam tips, but the presentation is quite monitor-like in nature. Soundstaging is good for an IEM but they won’t keep up with a Sennheiser IE8 or Phiaton PS200. Compared to the IE8, the Atrios have noticeably poorer separation and are a bit more tiring as a result. Truth be told, the Atrios sound like an IEM version of the popular M-Audio Q40 monitors – both are quite flat and uncolored aside from the hugely boosted bass, matching also in the little details such as the dark tone and fairly spacious and three-dimensional soundstage. As proper monitors should be, the Atrios are fairly revealing and 128kbps mp3s are a no-no with them. Lower listening volumes are also not ideal for extracting all of the detail the dynamic drivers of the M8s can produce.
  
 Value *(7/10)* – The Atrios were widely regarded as the best bass-lover earphones in their price bracket when they were first introduced back in 2007. Aside from a minimal revision to the construction and specsheet, the Atrios have changed little over time in a rapidly evolving market but still remain competitive today. The secure fit, high isolation, and low microphonics make them very convenient everyday earphones and the rich, smooth, bass-heavy sound is sure to find many fans. If not for the similarly-capable but far cheaper Hippo VB, the Future Sonics Atrio would be a best buy for lovers of the deepest sort of bass on a budget. The Atrio still beats the VB easily on the usability front but is undercut heavily in price. However, bass lovers in search of a great earphone for all-around or active use not willing to shell out $400 for a Sennheiser IE8 will still find a great match with the Atrios. Those who care about value over all else and don’t mind the more aggressive nature of the Hippos’ treble may do well to check out the VB.
  
*Pros: Comfortable, well-isolating, low microphonics, extremely powerful but well-controlled bass, clean midrange and treble*
*Cons: Plasticky build, not very pretty, rather dark in tone*
  
  
*(2A9) Phiaton PS200*
  

Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Flagship in-ear earphone from the Phiaton’s Primal Series
 Current Price: *$199* from amazon.com (MSRP: $249.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA _| Imp: 39_Ω_ | Sens: _95 dB_ | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: *Straight down *_or over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single flange (3 sizes) silicone tips, airplane adapter, and hard foldout carrying case with integrated cable winder and tip storage
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Metal housings with filter-less plastic nozzles and purely ornamental plastic ‘turbine blades’ at the rear feel rock solid. Long strain reliefs protect the thicker-than-average cable, which has a slight tendency to maintain bends introduced by the rectangular cable winder
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Surprisingly good with the ‘bulbous’ stock single-flange tips or Shure Olives
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cable-down, nonexistent otherwise. Slightly susceptible to wind noise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The fit of the PS200s mimics that of the Monster Turbine earphones with one exception – unlike the straight-barrel Turbines, the PS200 housings flare outward at the rear. Those with smaller ears will likely find the diameter of the PS200 housings too great for long-term comfort. In addition, the BA-based Phiatons benefit from the deepest possible fit while the Turbines are more or less forgiving of a shallow (and therefore less intrusive) insertion depth
  
 Sound *(8.8/10) – *The dual-armature Phiaton PS200 utilizes a passive crossover network to split the frequency spectrum between the two drivers. Like the majority of multiple-armature IEMs, the sound surprises with its ability to separate instruments and general attentiveness to detail. But let’s start at the bottom. The bass of the PS200 is unsurprisingly armature-like in nature – tight and very accurate but lacking a bit in both body and reverb. The low end isn’t quite as linear as that of the ATH-CK10, nor is it as hard-hitting as the ridiculously fast and punchy bass of the CK90Pro.
 
Bleed is expectedly non-existent and the mids are neither forward nor recessed, featuring astonishing clarity and detail. Coming from the dual-armature Audio-Technica IEMs, the PS200 maintains the astonishing clarity but makes gains in warmth and musicality. Strings sound crisp and natural and every nuance of the motion of piano keys is revealed. Moving on to the treble, it becomes quite obvious that the PS200 is overall a brighter-sounding earphone. It crosses the line between sparkle and sibilance quite often. It’s not a harsh or grating sound – just mildly sibilant with certain tracks. Having poorly recorded material exacerbates the problem greatly – those who still have a sizable number of 128kbps mp3s may want to give the Phiatons a pass. Aside from the occasional sibilance, the treble of the PS200 is incredibly competent – aggressive, clear, detailed, and chock-full of energy, it will not disappoint the most hardcore treble lovers. Cymbals shimmer with the excitement and authority that makes them so jarring in real life – an effect I simply don’t get from most other earphones. As far as portraying the full spectrum of treble energy goes, the PS200 is a hard act to follow.
 
Pretty treble isn’t the end of it, however – the dual-driver Phiatons have another ace up their sleeves – presentation. The soundstage width simply doesn’t get much better than this in an IEM - Sennheiser IE8 aside, the PS200 has what may be the widest and most evenly-spaced soundstage of all of the in-ears I’ve heard. They are also surprisingly adept at portraying intimacy when suitable and generally display admirable prowess when it comes to positioning. Though soundstage depth and height are fairly average, the massive width results in a very well-separated sound. A rather less pleasant surprise, however, is the level of hiss that the Phiatons exhibit when plugged into less-than-ideal sources. Despite their relatively high impedance and low sensitivity, the Phiatons hiss as much as the Fischer Audio Eternas. 
  
 Value *(7.5/10)* – Priced to compete with the likes of the Audio-Technica ATH-CK10/CK90Pro and Jays Q-Jays, the dual-armature Phiaton PS200 boasts low microphonics, solid build quality, very impressive isolation, and aesthetics Monster’s earphone division could envy. The sound is equally impressive – quick and accurate, but at the same time lively and quite bright. Those who can live with the lean bass and occasional mild sibilance are rewarded with an excellent soundstage, warm and lifelike midrange, and incredibly fast and energetic treble, and, while the Phiatons certainly are not cheap, their signature is unique enough to warrant them a spot in the ranks of high-end in-ears.
  
*Pros: Surprisingly well-isolating, great midrange and treble, wide soundstage*
*Cons: Shy low end, can be slightly sibilant*
  
  
*(2A10) Audio-Technica ATH-CK90Pro*
  

Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Dual-driver monitors from Audio-Technica built around an acoustic horn design
 Current Price: *$220* from accessoryjack.com (MSRP: $299.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual Armature_ | Imp: _37 Ω_ | Sens: _111 dB_ | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 4_mm_ | Preferred tips: _Monster tri-flange, Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
  
 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes), heat-activated foam tips (1 set), and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – Unlike the higher-end consumer-oriented CK10 and CK100, the CK90Pro features a no-frills plastic construction. The housings are sturdy though foam is used in the nozzle in place of a filter. The cable is nowhere near as thick as those of the CK10/CK100 and generally doesn’t feel very impressive for a $300 product. It lacks a cord cinch but is properly relieved on housing entry and terminated with the same iPhone-friendly 3.5mm L-plug as the CK100
 Isolation *(4/5)* – The angled-nozzle design and thin housing allows for deep insertion and the sealed housing yields impressive isolation with the right tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – The cable carries a bit of noise when the CK90Pro is worn cord-down but is general not very energetic and carries no noise when looped over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The oddly shaped housings work surprisingly well when it comes to providing a comfortable fit. The earphones can be inserted quite deeply but remain comfortable. Over-the-ear wear takes a bit of getting used to as the housings need to be angled upward but becomes quite comfortable and very secure in the long run
  
 Sound *(8.7/10) *– Being part of the Pro audio line, the CK90Pro is the black sheep of Audio-Technica’s high-end in-ear stable. Lauded on release as a CK10 replacement, it is hard to see how Audio-Technica ever intended to substitute the austere and impassive CK90Pro for the shiny and exciting CK10. But the CK90Pro has a place in Audio-Technica’s lineup even alongside the two consumer models. For one it is much darker-sounding than both – while the CK10 and CK100 are both somewhat bright, the CK90Pro is just shy of neutral, leaning slightly away from brightness. The CK90Pro also has the most impactful bass of the three, perhaps due to the acoustic horn setup of the sound channel. Its extension is very impressive, offering flatter bass than the CK100 and coming quite close to the linearity of the CK10 without as much of a sacrifice in low end quantity. Decay times are extremely short and the CK90Pro can nearly keep up with the speed and accuracy of the CK10 despite the greater slam. Still, the sacrifices typical of decay-less armature bass abound – there is simply no way the CK90Pro can keep up with the bass body/fullness of something like Panasonic HJE900 or Monster Turbine Pros even though they are plentifully impactful.
  
 Expectedly there is no midrange bleed and, as with the CK10, the midrange of the CK90Pro is neither forward nor recessed. Clarity and detail are good but the CK90Pros are smooth to the point of sound ‘glossy’, meaning that there is a loss of microdetail as the earphones strive to avoid sounding sharp. The brightness present in the CK10s is nonexistent and harshness/sibilance are nearly imperceptible with the CK90Pro, with the side effect being a slightly duller sound, especially when it comes to female vocals. It is the treble, however, that draws me to Audio-Technica’s consumer-oriented earphones. Compared to the CK10, the treble of the CK90Pro is slightly de-emphasized and lacks the peaks that make the CK10 so bright and sparkly. It is clear and quite detailed but without that last bit of treble extension that makes the other two so effortless. Those who find the treble of the CK10 overbearing and are willing to sacrifice a bit of detail for a smoother overall sound may do well to check out the CK90Pro.
  
 When it comes to presentation, the CK90Pro again impresses with excellent imaging and decent (though not nearly UM3X-good) instrumental separation in its average-sized stage. The earphones do have a good sense of space and do a surprisingly capable of job of not only left-to-right but also front-to-rear positioning. They aren’t pinpoint-accurate and not nearly as three-dimensional as something like the UM3X but do a good enough job of it to be involving without sounding unnatural.
  
 But there is something else. The CK90Pro, being part of Audio-Technica’s Pro monitor line, is a proper studio monitor and something of a chameleon when it comes to source matching. Aside from the CK100, which requires careful source matching for different reasons, the CK90Pro may be the most source-dependent earphone I’ve tried. Hook it up to a Sansa Clip/Fuze and it showcases the strengths of the player with outstanding stereo separation and imaging. Swap those for a Sony DAP (A828 in my case) and they warm up and become even smoother. Hook them into an S:Flo2 and bass slam and note articulation improve noticeably. Upon hearing the CK90Pro, jant71 stated that in a sense the earphone is a ‘blank slate’ in that it allows the source to imprint it with certain aspects of its sound signature – a statement that I think captures the essence of the earphone quite well. In addition, the old head-fi maxim of ‘garbage in - garbage out’ applies unequivocally in the case of the CK90Pro – feeding them low bitrate tracks out of a laptop’s headphone jack will result in an exceptionally dull listening experience. 
  
 Value *(7.5/10)* – The Audio-Technica CK90Pro may be the odd one out among the company’s high-end IEMs in design and build quality but its sound signature is just as polarizing as those of the CK10 and CK100. Dark and quite hard-hitting for an armature-based earphone, the CK90Pro is technically even more balanced than the others, boasting neither the forward midrange of the CK100 nor sparkly treble of the CK10. However, the sound of the CK90Pro has a strong tendency to reveal the strengths and weaknesses of its source and even the core signature won’t appeal to everyone. The CK90Pro, then, is business as usual for Audio-Technica. It is the proverbial love-it-or-hate-it earphone - those who enjoy a monitor-like approach to music will fall in love with its balance and technical proficiency; those who do not will quite possibly hate it.
  
*Pros: Highly isolating and comfortable with the right tips, great technical proficiency*
*Cons: Build quality is disappointing next to other Audio-Technica earphones, strong source dependence, love-it-or-hate-it sound*
  
  
*(2A11) JAYS q-JAYS*
  

Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Miniscule dual-driver monitors from Swedish audio house JAYS
 Current Price: *$171* from amazon.com (MSRP: $249.00)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual Armature_ | Imp: _39 Ω_ | Sens: _95 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _2’ I-plug + 3’ extension_
 Nozzle Size: 3_mm_ | Preferred tips: _Klipsch gels, stock single flanges, Sony hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
  
 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange silicone (7 sets / 5 sizes) and foam tips, 4 sets of replacement filters, 3.5mm splitter, airplane adapter, L-plug 3’ extension cord, I-plug 3’ extension cord, and small zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The tiny plastic housings feel sturdy but lack proper strain reliefs. The Kevlar-reinforced cabling is of medium thickness and robust but has a tendency to harden over time. The ability to switch between L-plug and I-plug extension cables is a welcome innovation, though
 Isolation *(4/5)* – The tiny housings allow for an extremely dip fit and isolation is excellent with the right tips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Present when worn cord-down, nearly nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(5/5)* – The tiny housings are bent slightly for a comfortable over-the-ear fit but can be worn cable-down as well and are one of the few sets of earphones I can sleep on my side with. Five sizes of silicone tips are included, ensuring a comfortable fit for all ear sizes except maybe the very largest, which would swallow the q-JAYS whole
  
 Sound *(8.8/10)* – The q-JAYS are claimed by the manufacturer to be the smallest IEMs on the market, which doesn’t seem at all unreasonable from looking at them. For something so small, however, these dual-armature earphones pack quite a punch. For me the strength of the q-JAYS lies in their low end. For a pair of dual-BA monitors, the bass of the q-JAYS is excellent. It is controlled, impactful, detailed, and accurate. The low end is smooth and carries just a hint of warmth. Depth and texture are quite good and the overall bass weight is slightly heavier than with the DBA-02/CK10. Impact lags slightly behind the hard-hitting CK90Pro. Low end extension is very reasonable as well. Attack and decay are quite realistic for a BA-based earphone but of course similarly-priced dynamics (HJE900, DDM, MTPG) are capable of a more realistic experience on that front. Still, I rate the bass of the q-JAYS very highly among all of the dual-BA earphones I’ve heard.
  
The midrange, on the other hand, is not particularly noteworthy. The mids of the q-JAYS are clear and quite detailed but yield easily to those the DBA-02 and CK10. Compared to the highly present bass and treble, the midrange of the JAYS is oh-so-slightly recessed and somewhat dry. In contrast, the high end is slightly forward and quite crisp and energetic. There is some unevenness which accentuates sibilance if it is present on the track and generally causes the treble to sound a bit edgy. However, the q-JAYS don’t quite have the hot-tempered nature of the CK10, DBA-02, or PS200 when it comes to treble, though they are far from laid-back. Treble sparkle and extension lags slightly behind these three as well – the q-JAYS are not dark earphones (a la CK90Pro), but they lack the brightness of the aforementioned trio.

The presentation of the q-JAYS is relatively airy and quite three-dimensional in feel. The soundstage is neither very wide nor very deep but keeps up with most of the competition while providing rather accurate positioning. Among the high-end dual-drivers I’ve had in my possession, the presentation of the JAYS falls closest to the Klipsch Custom 3. One last matter of note – the q-JAYS boast relatively high impedance and low sensitivity. They aren’t particularly difficult to drive and fail to justify the expense of a portable amp. However, they do sound slightly flat and dull at minimal listening volumes and a couple of notches above my preferred volume level are required to really bring them to life.

 Value *(8/10)* – Despite being a three-year-old design, the JAYS q-JAYS still impress greatly with their ergonomics, aesthetics, and of course sonic qualities. The miniature construction and comprehensive accessory pack make the q-JAYS one of the most versatile in-ear sets on the market. Aside from small quibbles such as the lack of proper strain reliefs and unwieldy modular cable lengths, the q-JAYS are enormously agreeable in day-to-day. Their sound is rather agreeable as well. The bass of the q-JAYS stands among the best I’ve heard out of dual-driver monitors. The midrange is competent, if a bit dry, and doesn’t draw attention to itself over the bass and treble. The high end is crisp and edgy but lacks the brightness and effortlessness of competing earphones such as the CK10 and DBA-02. For sound quality alone the price tag of the q-JAYS could be considered slightly excessive. As a total package, however, the tiny Swedish earphones make quite a lot of sense.
  
*Pros: Wonderfully small and comfortable, excellent accessory pack, high isolation with the right tips, clear and crisp sound, great bass for a BA-based earphone*
*Cons: Cable lengths can be frustrating, slightly edgy & dry-sounding*
  
  
*(2A12) Fischer Audio DBA-02 / Brainwavz B2*
  
 
Reviewed Jul 2010
  
 Details: Dual-driver monitors from Fischer Audio’s flagship Master Series
 Current Price: *$160* from gd-audiobase.com (MSRP: $159.99); $130 from amazon.com for Brainwavz B2
_Specs: Driver: Dual Armature | Imp: 43 Ω | Sens: 108 dB | Freq: 20-24k Hz | Cable: 4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: 3_mm_ | Preferred tips: _Shure single-flange, Etymotic tri-flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_
  
 Accessories *(3/5)* – Single flange silicone tips (3 sizes), over-the-ear cable guides, and soft carrying pouch (Brainwavz B2 *(4/5)*: Single-flange silicone tips (6 pairs in 3 sizes), Comply T100, 6.3mm adapter, airplane adapter, and hard clamshell carrying case)
 Lacks cable guides. The sliding cinch is better than the DBA-02 one and minijack is now J-shaped (120 degree) bent slim model. Comes with 1 year warranty.
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The shells consist of two layers of plastic – one light blue and one clear - and feel slightly cheap to the touch. Some sharp edges are left by the molding process and the strain relief on cable entry, while functional, is quite short. The black-and-white cable is very similar to the twisted cords found on Westone earphones and feels quite sturdy. The Y-split is well-relieved but the 3.5mm straight plug is a bit wimpy and the cord cinch slides up and down the cable too easily, which can be frustrating
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Quite good with single-flange tips and even better with aftermarket triples
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Present when worn cord-down, almost nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The angled-nozzle housings can be worn both cord-down and over-the-ear in the same way as the Klipsch S4 but are quite a bit longer and may not be as fitting for those with smaller ears as the S4
  
 Sound *(9.2/10)* – Despite being a relative newcomer on the international hi-fi scene, Fischer Audio have already caused quite a stir with their highly competitive midrange earphones. The Eterna, which I reviewed previously, won me over with its uncompromising musicality and fun factor despite being so very far from my preferred sound signature. But I’ve never made a secret of being after a far more analytical sound. There are many out there who claim that analytical earphones are antithetical to music enjoyment – that they cause the listener to hear the earphones and not the music. But for me a proper analytical earphone is quite relaxing – it never forces me to focus my attention on this or that to pick up on every detail and I find this more relaxing than listening to an earphone with the sound signature equivalent of a rocking chair (e.g. MTPG). 
 
On that note, I will say that the DBA-02 is one of the best all-around earphones I have heard for the type of sound I am after. I will compare it mostly to the Audio-Technica CK10 as the two share an uncanny similarity but my listening involved lengthy comparisons to the dual-driver Phiaton PS200, Q-Jays, and ATH-CK90Pro as well as the Westone 1 and UM3X and the dynamic-driver-based Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Copper. As with the ATH-CK10, the bass of the DBA-02 is tight, controlled, and well-extended. I find the DBA-02 to be ruler-flat down to the lowest limits of my hearing, beating out the CK100 and a slew of other high-end earphones. The low end is quick and detailed. I do feel that the CK10 is just a hair more immediate in terms of impact and seems to move more air than the DBA-02 does. It should be noted that while I consider both earphones to be very well-balanced, for those used to something like the MTPG or Senn IE8 both will still fall square into ‘bass-light’ territory. 
 
The midrange of the DBA-02 is balanced perfectly with the bass and treble. It isn’t lacking in transparency, clarity, or detail. If anything, it is a bit too crisp and aggressive when it comes to texturing – a bit Etymotic-like in that respect – but this is hardly a negative in my book. The mids of the CK10 sound slightly smoother and have a more liquid nature to them. Moving into the lower treble, the DBA-02 stays fairly smooth and quite articulated. There’s plenty of sparkle to go around but no harshness or sibilance. The DBA-02s are certainly bright earphones but the lower treble is less hot-tempered than that of the CK10s, which are just a tad more prone towards being sibilant. Treble detail is excellent but microdetail is presented with less authority than the somewhat more aggressive CK10 - a role reversal of sorts from the midrange, where the CK10 exhibits a more laid-back character than the DBA-02. Extension is effortless – a characteristic the DBA-02 shares with the CK10 and CK100. 
 
When it comes to presentation, the DBA-02 once again surprises with the amount of air in its spacious stage as well as with the excellent (though not quite UM3X-excellent) instrumental separation. Soundstage width and depth are quite good, though neither the IE8 nor the Phiaton PS200 will feel threatened by the Fischers any time soon. In comparison, the CK10 sounds more enveloping and three-dimensional with better imaging and a capacity for front-to-rear positioning that never ceases to surprise me. The sound of the CK10 has a sort of ambience to it that I have not heard replicated except in the higher-end CK100. On a final comparative note, I feel that both the CK10 and DBA-02 are equally (in)efficient and will both run fine off of portable players and scale relatively well with added power. 
 
Lastly, I want to emphasize that while direct comparisons always make it seem like the two products being compared are extremely dissimilar, the differences between the ATH-CK10 and DBA-02 are fairly small. For all intents and purposes, the two earphones share a general sound signature and I probably wouldn’t want to own both simultaneously.
  
 Value *(9.5/10)* – The Fischer Audio DBA-02 offers nearly unprecedented bang/buck. For detailed and analytical sound, the biggest competitor is the substantially pricier Audio-Technica ATH-CK10, which boasts better build quality and a more convenient form factor. The build quality and accessory pack of the DBA-02 aren't fitting of top-tier earphones, but then neither is the price, and that really sums up the earphones pretty well – top tier sound quality with middle rung amenities and price tag.
  
*Pros: Astonishingly balanced and capable sound, comfortable, well-isolating*
*Cons: Average build quality and accessory pack*
  
 Special thanks to *rawrster* for generously lending me the DBA-02 for the full duration of my review regimen!
  
  
*(2A13) Westone 2*


Reviewed Nov 2010
  
 Details: Dual-driver earphone from Westone’s consumer series
 Current Price: *$239* from accessoryjack.com (MSRP: $339.00)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _33Ω_ | Sens: _117 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Shure gray soft flex (stock)_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange conical (3 sizes) and rounded (3 sizes) silicone tips, triple-flange silicone tips, Comply foam tips (3 sizes), ¼” adapter, in-line volume control, filter and tip cleaning tool, and hard clamshell carrying case with carabiner
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – Identical to the Westone 1 - lightweight plastic housings, a sturdy multi-strand twisted cable, and well-relieved y-split, housing entry, and 3.5mm L-plug
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Good due to the ergonomic shells
 Microphonics *(5/5)* – The W2 can only be worn over-the-ear and microphonics are nonexistent
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Like the Westone 1, which uses the same shells, the W2 is extremely lightweight and ergonomic and the cabling is very user-friendly. The small shells can sometimes require re-adjusting after a while but not often enough to be bothersome

 Sound *(8.9/10)* – Having read that the W2 can compete with the other high-end dual driver monitors not only in fit and user-friendliness but also in sound quality, I was quite eager to complete my survey of Westone’s consumer-class in-ear monitors with it. In a sentence, though I can see why some would find them preferable to the more analytical ATH-CK10 and Fischer Audio DBA-02, they are entirely different animals from the no-nonsense clarity kings. The sound of the W2 is extremely balanced and yet very musical, splitting the difference between the entry-level consumer-oriented Westone 1 and the reference-quality UM3X stage monitors.

 The low end of the W2 is smooth and punchy but still typical of armature-based earphones on the whole. The bass rolls off gently below 50Hz or so, which is not completely out of character for a dual-BA. The W2 does beat out the ATH-CK10 and Fischer DBA-02 by a hair in bass quantity but, expectedly, lacks the sub-bass presence of many high-end dynamics. It also loses in extension and impact to the W3 by a fair margin - at the low end the W2 is really more akin to a vastly improved Westone 1 than a de-tuned Westone 3. Texture and detail are on-par with the other high-end dual-BAs though the latter is slightly less prominent due to the greater warmth and smoothness of the W2.

 The midrange is where the W2 really shines. The mids are in very good balance with the bass and treble – slightly more forward than those of the UE TF10 but not as much as with the UM3X or SM3. Like the Westone 1, the W2 is slightly warm but there is no loss in detail or added veil as a result. The W3, which is dryer and thinner-sounding in the midrange, admittedly sounds slightly more clear and detailed but the difference is small. Like the other Westone earphones, the smooth and transparent midrange of the W2 works wonders with female vocals - compared to the ATH-CK10, for example, the thicker and wetter W2 has better vocal definition and simply sounds more satisfying.

 At the high end the W2 is competent but seems to avoid risk as much as possible – I guess Westone took enough risks with the W3. It is not quite as airy as the DBA-02, probably due to the greater warmth, and less sparkly than the Westone 3, TF10, and CK10. It is, however, detailed and extended but not at all offensive or tiring. The W2 really sounds very natural but lacks the energy of some of the more treble-heavy earphones out there, sounding darker than much of the competition. All in all it’s a good balance for those who want an earphone with present treble without risking listening fatigue but may not appeal to those who find high levels of treble energy exciting.

 The presentation of the W2 again puts it on-level with most of the so-called ‘top-tier’ earphones. The soundstage has impressive depth and width and never sounds confined or closed. Because it’s a bit thicker and less crisp than the CK10, the W2 sounds a tiny bit vaguer when it comes to positioning (the CK10 really is the sniper rifle of in-ear earphones with its pinpoint-accurate imaging). The warmer W2 is also slightly more forward on the whole (especially in the midrange) but does a very good job of conveying distance – better than the W3, actually. However, the W3 does sound more three-dimensional, in large part due to the extra layer of bass presented by the flagship. On the whole I feel that the W2 works better for busier and faster tracks (where the bass of the W3 can get overwhelming) but at the same time is more forgiving of mediocre source material. Lastly, it is worth noting that the Westone 2 is just as sensitive as the W3 is, meaning that it will hiss with many of the more powerful portable players as well as amps, notebooks, desktop computers, and so on.

 Value *(9/10)* – From the day I laid hands on the Westone 1, I was disappointed by the wasted potential of the earphone as an overall package – with the W1, sound quality was by far the weakest part of an otherwise exemplary IEM. Listening to the Westone 2, I almost feel that Westone purposely de-tuned the lower-end model to leave room for the W2 - an earphone that is more similar in signature to the smooth and inoffensive W1 but technically much closer to the company’s flagships – the W3 and UM3X. Though I do still like the clearer and crisper ATH-CK10 and DBA-02 better overall as far as dual-drivers go, the W2 has arguably more mass appeal than any other dual-driver out there and is a good example of what many consider to be the ‘audiophile’ sound signature – slightly warm but with good balance, detail, and natural clarity and nothing to distract the listener from the midrange. That said, analytical listeners and bass-lovers alike may find themselves slightly bored by the W2 and of course lovers of dynamic drivers won’t find the note presentation they seek in the Westones. For everyone else, the W2 offers a very complete package at a price point that slots in right below the so-called ‘top-tiers’.

*Pros: Impressive fit, isolation, build quality, and accessory pack; pleasant overall sound, great balance, good soundstage
 Cons: ‘Safe’ sound signature may be boring for some*
  
  
*(2A14) Earsonics SM2 DLX (v1)*


Reviewed Apr 2011

 Details: Dual-driver model from French audio firm Earsonics
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP $299.00)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sensorcom bi-flanges, SM3 bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5)* –Comply foam tips (2 sets), filter and tip cleaning tool, and hard zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The lightweight shells are made of two plastic halves and don’t feel as sturdy as those of the Westone earphones. The light multi-strand cables are properly relieved both on housing entry and at the Y-split but again aren’t as thick, soft, or supple as Westone cords
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Quite good, especially when longer tips are used
 Microphonics *(5/5)* – Can only be worn over-the-ear so microphonics are nonexistent
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings of the SM2 are very similar to those of the SM3, including the squared-off rear corners of the shells, which can cause long-term discomfort for those with smaller ears. I ended up using longer tips and leaving the shells outside of my ears when wearing the earphones for more than an hour at a time

 Sound *(9.1/10)* – The SM2 is Earsonics’ most basic earphone – a dual-armature monitor designed for professionals on a budget. That said, the sound quality of the SM2 shows just how serious the French company is about audio – this ‘entry-level’ monitor sounds anything but. Expectedly, the SM2 shares quite a few sonic traits with the higher-end SM3 but, while Earsonics clearly addressed some of the SM2’s weaknesses with the newer model, the two earphones are different enough to both have a place on the market.

 The most surprising aspect of the sound of the SM2 is the bass – one may expect the dual-armature model to have less low-end presence than the triple-armature one – and in general one would be right – but with the SM2 the rules really don’t apply. The low end is very strong – at least on-level with the Westone UM3X – and extended. It is not quite dominant over the midrange but clearly isn’t submissive, either. In fact, it seems more powerful than the bass of the SM3 because the midrange isn’t as forward. There is plenty of punch and yet the bass remains nice and detailed. However while not downright slow, it is not as quick or tight as that of flatter earphones like the CK10/DBA-02 or even the higher-end SM3 or Westone 4 – not surprising considering that the SM2 is the bassiest dual-armature earphone I’ve come across. On the upside, the low end boasts very natural attack and decay times for an armature-based earphone and generally sounds quite natural.

 The midrange of the SM2, like that of the SM3, seems be the meat of the sound signature. The overall balance of the earphones is very good and while the midrange is still slightly forward next to the CK10 or DBA-02, it is not emphasized heavily as the mids of the SM3 and UM3X tend to be. Clearly serving as the jumping off point for the tuning of the SM3, the midrange of the SM2 is slightly warm, rich, and detailed. It is not as crisp as the midrange of the ATH-CK10 and generally sounds much thicker and softer. Those who found the lush midrange of the SM3 to sound ‘veiled’ will find little solace in the SM2 as it is only slightly thinned-out in comparison. As with the SM3, vocals and instruments centered on the midrange have surprisingly natural timbre for an armature-based earphone and approach my entry-level customs when it comes to realism.

 The treble of the SM2 is competent but obviously tuned with low listening fatigue in mind. Clarity and extension are quite good but it gives some emphasis up to the midrange, resulting in the entire earphone sounding very slightly dark. As with the SM3, there is really no frequency range in which the SM2 lacks presence but for my taste the treble could definitely be more energetic. Interestingly, the top end isn’t quite as smooth on the SM2 as it is on the SM3 – a few peaks and valleys are noticeable in the response – but instead of adding energy or air they just cause the treble to sizzle on occasion. The SM2 sometimes does sound a touch more airy than the SM3 but it’s still a far cry from earphones such as the ATH-CK10 and DBA-02, or even the Westone 4.

 As for the presentation, there are clear similarities between the SM2 and SM3 but the former is not quite as immersive and enveloping as the latter. For those who found the presentation of the SM3 just a bit too holographic to be believable, the SM2 should be more tolerable. The difference between the two isn’t huge, however, and those who found the feel of the SM3 downright offensive will not find solace with the SM2. Soundstage size is quite similar between the two – well above-average and close to the perfect size for a BA-based earphone - and the SM2 can portray extreme intimacy just as well as the SM3. Expectedly, imaging and separation are also very good except when the slightly muddier bass of the SM2 gets in the way. The dynamics are good as well though they lag behind similarly-priced dynamic-driver earphones such as the Radius TWF21. Like the SM3, the SM2 will not be all things to all people but it is a highly refined monitor with great presence across the range and a very interesting earphone in its own right.

 Value *(8/10)* – Though not as popular as the higher-end SM3 model, the SM2 DLX is arguably an even more difficult earphone to dislike. While it retains the slight warmth and thickness of the SM3, it is not as forward in the midrange or as enveloping in presentation. As a result, its flavour isn’t as pronounced as that of Earsonics’ flagship – a potential positive for some listeners. All of the functional caveats of the SM3 still apply – the build quality lags slightly behind that of Westone monitors and the angular housings aren’t particularly ergonomic – but on the whole the SM2 is almost as musical as addictive as the SM3.

*Pros: No microphonics; Smooth, refined, and detailed sound; spacious presentation*
*Cons: No silicone tips included, angular housings lead to potential comfort issues, not as well-built as Westone monitors*

  
*(2A15) Kozee Sound Solutions Infinity X1 Executive*


Reviewed Apr 2011
  
 Details: Entry-level single-driver custom from Kozee Sound Solutions
 Current Price: *$190* from kozeesolutions.com (MSRP: $189.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Vented BA_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A| Freq: N/A | Cable: _4.6’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: N/A | Preferred tips: N/A
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Cleaning tool, velvet carrying pouch, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– Molding quality is adequate – the acrylic shells of my X1 Executive show fewer bubbles than with my 1964-T but the molds are also thinner, almost plastic-like in nature. The finish around the cable socket and nozzle bores is better than with the 1964-T but not quite up there with my UM Miracle. The matte finish is also different from the usual shiny, clear-coated acrylic of pricier customs. As for cabling, the X1 Executive utilizes a UE custom cable while the cheaper silicone-shelled X1 has fixed cabling
 Isolation *(4/5) *– The isolation provided by the fitted acrylic shells is excellent, though it may not seem so at first. The passive attenuation is slightly below what the higher-end Etymotic earphones and my UM Miracle are capable of but higher than with the universal stage monitors from the likes of Westone and EarSonics
 Microphonics* (5/5)* – Microphonics are pretty much nonexistent, as is the case with most customs. The cable cinch should still be used if the X1s were to be exercised in but for day-to-day use I don’t see myself bothering with it
 Comfort *(5/5)* –The most obvious contrast to universal earphones is the lack of ‘suction’ created by the soft tips of most universals. Putting the customs in requires a bit of getting used to but the twisting motion eventually becomes second nature. The acrylic shells are hard but not in the least uncomfortable – sometimes I am aware of them and other times I forget they’re in my ears at all. Obviously fit will always depend on the quality of the initial molds and maybe a bit of luck but I can’t imagine a properly-fitting custom being uncomfortable. Kozee also offers an industry-leading 90-day fit guarantee, which should be taken advantage of if the customs remain even a tiny bit uncomfortable after an initial break-in period

 Sound* (8.4/10)* – On the list of additional features that the Executive package brings to the X1 only one caught my eye – upgraded drivers. Presumably, the vents clearly visible on the rear of my X1 drivers are not a cosmetic touch and wouldn’t be possible with the silicone-shelled base model. I can’t see any markings on the transducer but it is a little smaller than the Sonion 2015s used in my 1964-T and positioned right near the nozzle. As usual, I can’t claim any direct knowledge of the effects venting has on a balanced armature transducer but, rear vent or not, the X1 is an impressive performer and does share some aspects of its signature with the $1100 vented-BA FAD FI-BA-SS.

 The dominant aspects of the X1’s sound are the crispness and clarity – the earphone really makes no sacrifices whatsoever on either front. Being a single-armature design, however, it does sacrifice a bit of extension on either end as well as some note thickness to cover the entire spectrum. Sub-bass roll-off is most noticeable, dropping off fairly quickly below 45Hz or so. In contrast to my 1964-Ts, there is also no mid-bass boost adding extra warmth or punch to the sound. Instead, the X1 is more Etymotic-like in nature, with fairly flat and very tight bass. It is punchy and accurate but clearly not for those who desire sizeable bass rumble or body. In addition, the limitations of the X1’s low end are difficult to remedy with and equalizer – the bass can be dialed up a touch but attempts to change the nature of the earphones significantly are met with distortion. Definitely not one for bassheads, then.

 The midrange of the X1 is balanced well with the low end and generally remains accurate and realistic. Though there is some upper midrange emphasis, the overall tone is more neutral than, for example, that of the brighter UE700 or darker Sennheiser IE7. As with the only other vented BA earphone I’ve heard, the FAD FI-BA-SS, the clarity and resolution of the X1 are outstanding – the single armature used by Kozee is a far cry from the drivers found in most sub-$100 universals. The only single-armature earphones besides the FADs that can compete on the clarity front are Etymotic’s HF- and ER-series models. That said, the detail level of the X1 is a half-step below what similarly-priced dual drivers such as the UE700 and Fischer DBA-02 are capable of. Even the Ety HF5 pulls ahead slightly by virtue of better texturing, which is not to say the X1 lacks texture. On the contrary, it seems to introduce texture – a bit of ‘grit’ or ‘grain’ over the midrange and lower treble – giving the illusion of being overly revealing. However, the detail and transparency aren’t quite on-level with the FI-BA-SS so all that results in is a little edginess and a fairly aggressive note presentation. In terms of thickness, the X1 is only a bit leaner than the ATH-CK10 but also slightly more dry.

 The X1 is also somewhat guilty of following the Ety mold with the treble, which is slightly elevated without being notably harsh or sibilant. Like the midrange, it is a bit rough and edgy and tends to be very revealing of artifacts present on the recording – those looking for an earphone that will do some post-processing on sibilant tracks will be better off with a Westone or Earsonics model. Clarity and detail are quite good and there’s plenty of sparkle to go around – not quite as much as with the UE700 but close to Fischer’s DBA-02 and the like. As a result, the X1 stops just short of being unambiguously bright without losing the extra bit of energy associated with prominent treble but those who find Etymotics fatiguing will want to stay away. Extension is quite decent and the X1 remains crisp and resolving all the way up. Still, though the X1 wouldn’t be out of place in the Etymotic lineup (it would fit in between the MC5 and HF5), there is no mistaking its sound for that of the armature-based Ety models. If I had to pick the universal they remind me most of it would be the $1100 FAD FI-BA-SS. Of course they don't have the detail of the BA-SS and the bass response lacks the power, richness, and fullness of the FADs but the disproportionately high level of clarity, the overall tone, and 'naked' feel of the sound are similar.

 In terms of presentation, the X1 Executive again proves itself an impressive piece of kit. Its soundstage is wide – wide enough to compete with the most capable universals – but lacks a bit of depth and height in comparison. While the soundstage of the 1964-T is a lot more compact, it is also quite a bit more spherical in shape. The 1964-T also has better imaging - the X1 may have plenty of air but it doesn’t really have the positioning precision of my other customs or higher-end universal such as the CK10 or W2. The headstage of the X1 is impressive for an earphone and broader than with the 1964-T. Like a few of the higher-end dynamics, the X1 really has an out-of-the-head feel to it but sacrifices the ability to portray intimacy to an extent, partly because of the fairly average dynamic range of the earphones. As a result, stereo separation can seem just a touch exaggerated at times and the ability of earphones such as the Westone UM3X and Earsonics SM3 to “center” vocals within the headstage is lost on the X1. Instrumental separation is expectedly quite good but stops just short of the Ety HF3 and Westone 2. Tonally, the Kozee is just a touch cooler than my Ety HF3 but still remains a bit closer to ‘neutral’ than ‘cold’. A note on usability – although the specs of the X1 are unpublished, the earphones Kozees do hiss very slightly with my netbooks and some portable amps and may not mesh particularly well with sources that have high noise floors.

 Value* (8.5/10)* – Though the base Infinity X1 runs an incredibly affordable $139 including DIY impressions, the $50 Executive upgrade buys additional accessories, acrylic shells, custom artwork, detachable cables, and a vented transducer. Either way, you get the fit and isolation of a custom earphone, not to mention the build quality and customization options that come with venturing into customs territory. The sound put out by the single armature combines excellent clarity with a wide soundstage and presents slightly rolled-off subbass, crisp and aggressive midrange, and elevated, but not downright fatiguing, treble. It has to be noted that as with all customs, the sound signature cannot be modified with alternate tips or a different insertion angle as it can with universal earphones. A set of customs – especially one as cheap as the Kozees - is also not nearly as easy to walk away from as a similarly-priced universal. With those reservations in mind, the $189 full-shell custom from Kozee provides some very impressive value for money.

*Pros: Clear, neutral, and accurate sound; excellent long-term comfort; no cable noise
 Cons: Correct insertion takes some getting used to; less isolating than silicone-shelled customs; not as smooth or level-sounding as some similarly-priced universals*
  
  
  
*(2A16) VSonic GR07*


Reviewed May 2011
  
 Details: VSonic’s flagship dynamic-driver monitor
 Current Price: *$179* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $179)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _50Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _7-30k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 3.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single- and bi-flanges, Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes), Hybrid-style (10 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips, foam tips, over-the-ear cable guides, and soft carrying pouch Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, foam tips, over-the-ear cable guides, and hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality* (4/5)* – Rectangular in shape and designed for over-the-ear wear, the GR07 features adjustable-angle metal nozzles and beefy gray cabling. The cord can be somewhat resistant to staying behind one’s ears without the included ear guides. The strain reliefs on the housings aren’t as flexible as I would like and the cables aren't particularly tangle-resistant but otherwise the build is well thought-out.
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5)* – Like most dynamic-driver in-ears, the GR07 is vented but the fairly long nozzles help keep isolation reasonably high
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Cable noise is very low as the GR07 can only be worn in the over-the-ear configuration. Although the conventional cable clip is missing from the accessory pack, the cable cinch and ear guides can be used to fix the cord in place
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Though the GR07 uses fairly large 11mm drivers, the lightweight, form-fitted, over-the-ear style housings actually work very well for prolonged listening with their slim profile and rounded edges. The angle of the nozzle is also adjustable in every direction

 Sound *(9.1/10) *– Despite the rapid growth of the IEM market in the past couple of years, competition in certain niches is still fairly low among higher-end earphones. One such niche is the dynamic-driver professional monitor – a market segment VSonic clearly had in mind when designing the GR07. The earphone utilizes an 11mm bio-cellulose transducer and delivers more than enough sonic bang to compete with similarly-priced offerings from Western brands. One catch of this particular driver is the importance of break-in - I am generally quite sensitive to sibilance and listening to some of my tracks with the GR07 was downright unpleasant until some hours in. Happily, the earphones do eventually settle into their intended sound, and what glorious sound it is!

 Overall balance is definitely a strong suit of the GR07. Presence is excellent across the range and the earphones remain refined and detailed at the limits – something I’ve always particularly liked about Sennheiser’s IE-series models. The low end of the GR07 is deep and punchy. For a dynamic-driver earphone, the GR07 is rather quick, which does show through in bass control and accuracy. At the same time, the bass is well-weighted and carries realistic attack and decay, striking a fine line between the slightly thicker bass notes produced by the Sennheiser IE6 and IE7 and the leaner bass presentation of armature-based monitors such as the Fischer DBA-02 and Westone 2. The only other higher-end dynamic that could be used for monitoring – the HiFiMan RE252 – doesn’t fare nearly as well either when it comes to bass extension, body, or overall presence.

 The midrange is balanced properly with the low end and maintains the same impressive levels of clarity and detail. Unlike the similarly-priced Sennheiser IE7, the GR07 is not at all forward in the midrange. It is also nowhere near as warm and thick as the Sennheisers, instead taking the RE252 route with a leaner (and arguably more realistic) note presentation. Tonally, the mids of the GR07 are quite neutral, leaning only slightly towards warmth and having no coloration at all compared to the majority of higher-end dynamics. Texture levels are very good but, as is the case with almost all dynamics, the detailing is not very aggressive compared to higher-end BA-based monitors from Fischer, Etymotic, Audio-Technica, and the like. This makes the GR07 seem smoother and gives it certain finesse in getting the complete sonic picture across without inducing listening fatigue. At the same time, it makes the volume easier to turn up inadvertently when listening to the GR07 – something I caught myself doing on several occasions.

 At the outset, the GR07’s lower treble is probably the only real problem with its sound signature. The GR07 has excellent treble presence and remains noticeably brighter than Sennheiser’s IE7 but has a slight tendency towards sibilance. Sibilance can be somewhat striking out of the box but becomes nearly a non-issue at low-to-moderate listening volumes after the initial adjustment period. Like the low end, the highs of the GR07 are fairly well-extended and always remain crisp and detailed. Of course the GR07 can’t quite match the bell-like clarity of an ATH-CK10 or the sparkle of the JVC FX700, but then it isn’t meant to. As a neutral and accurate monitor, it performs exceedingly well.

 The presentation of the GR07 is again very competent on every level. The soundstage is wide and spacious. It is slightly oblong in shape, losing out in depth and height to competitors such as the IE7, and tends to position things a bit farther away compared to more intimate-sounding dynamics such as the Radius TWF21. At the same time, the GR07 can’t quite throw sonic cues as far as the TWF21 or JVC FX700 when push comes to shove, but then it is deep-fit stage monitor and not a consumer-oriented open-back canalphone. Instrumental separation is still excellent and the GR07 is anything but congested-sounding. To my ears it provides a very cohesive sound without becoming overly analytical despite impressive levels of separation and layering – not an easy task by any means. Without a doubt the presentation of the GR07 is helped along by decent imaging and a good dynamic range. On that point, the sound of the VSonics is very effortless – almost as much so as that of the HiFiMan RE262. Lastly, a note on usability – although the GR07 is fairly transparent to source, its high impedance makes it a consistent performer and its signature isn’t particularly susceptible to poor synergy. In addition, the integrity of its sound is not dependent on tip choice to the same degree as, say, a DBA-02, making it a great first step into higher-end in-ear territory for those with limited hands-on IEM experience.

 Value *(9.5/10)* – Designed for use as a stage monitor, VSonic’s new flagship is a very strong performer on several levels. Utilizing bio-cellulose drivers that undergo marked improvement with break-in, the GR07 does have the right sound signature to become one of the few studio-friendly dynamic-driver earphones. Its biggest selling point is the excellent balance across the spectrum, offering controlled but well-weighted bass, clear and articulate mids, and accurate treble. As is the case with some of the pricier in-ears from Ortofon, Westone, HiFiMan, and even 1964EARS, one of the GR07’s greatest strengths is its lack of real weaknesses, both in sound quality and overall usability. Putting aside the eternal debate on the virtues of balanced armature vs. dynamic transducers, especially for monitoring applications, it is quite easy to see that the GR07 is worth the asking price, and maybe more. 

*Pros: Well-built and well-designed; great balance and presence across the spectrum
 Cons: Tends to be slightly sibilant, especially when coming from a smoother earphone*
  
  
  
*(2A17) Munitio Teknine SITi Nine Millimeter*


Reviewed Aug 2011
  
 Details: Bullet-shaped earphone from Munitio
 Current Price: *$159* from munitio.com (MSRP: $159); $179 for [M] SITi with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _N/A_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _12-22k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips:_ Stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(2.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 pairs in 3 sizes), microfiber cleaning cloth, and soft leather carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – Styled after a nine-millimeter round, the Teknines are noticeably smaller than the other bullet-shaped earphones I’ve come across and yet feel much sturdier. The fit and finish run with the best of the big-name manufacturers and the heft inspires confidence. The housings are engraved with the Munitio logo and the nozzles are protected by mesh filters. The Kevlar-reinforced cable is thicker than average and does a good job of staying untangled. It has a mild tendency to kink but should go the distance despite minimal strain relief. The cable cinch tends to let go of one side of the cable when tightened
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Good for a dynamic-driver earphone and helped by the thicker-than-average eartips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Slightly bothersome when worn cable-down; not an issue otherwise
 Comfort *(4/5)* – The Teknines wear similarly to most other straight-barrel earphones. The housings are quite heavy – similar in weight to those of the Monster Jamz and Panasonic HJE900s – but slim and compact. They can be inserted deeper than the Fischer Silver Bullets and the stock tips are nice and thick. The cable-up configuration is preferable due to the heft of the housings

 Sound *(6.2/10)* – As is usually the case with new entrants on the HiFi scene, I was quite unclear on what to expect from the Munitio Teknines. The minefield of marketing copy on Munitio’s website promises superior dynamic range, quick recovery, and sound purity, as well as tight and accurate bass and smooth treble response. All of these are important qualities for any IEM but the approach taken by Munitio in tuning the earphones makes them radically different from most of my other IEMs and very outlandish to my audiophile sensibilities. Whereas almost all of the gear we discuss around Head-Fi pursues balance, detail, and clarity, the Teknines have different priorities.

 From the subbass onwards, the Teknines make no compromises whatsoever in favor of conventional ‘hi-fi’ sound. The inevitable comparison to the similarly-priced Monster Turbines reveals that the Teknines have more sub-bass presence, resulting in large amounts of deep, full-bodied bass rumble, and a touch more mid- and upper bass as well. Despite the massive bass boost, the Teknines present notes softly and smoothly, without the aggressive impact true bass monsters such as the Sony XB40EX and UE Super.Fi 5 EB. However, the real strength of the Monster Turbines – and the reason they are popular around Head-Fi – is that despite their bottom-heavy nature, they manage to keep the bass response where it belongs – under control and confined below the midrange frequencies. The Teknines, on the other hand, don’t do quite as good a job of controlling their low end. Though detail is quite decent, bass texture and resolution take a hit – the cheaper Fischer Audio Eterna does a slightly better job of distinguishing low notes and generally sounds crisper, not only down low but across the entire frequency range. The Teknines also possess somewhat lengthy attack and decay times even when compared to other bass-heavy, consumer-oriented earphones.

 Any IEM with a single driver and a ton of soft-sounding bass is bound to have somewhat veiled mids, and the Teknines are no exception. The mids are slightly thick and a tad warm but not excessively so on either count. Even fully burned-in, however, the Munitios sound fairly veiled, especially at lower volumes. Raising the volume makes the veil much less noticeable and brings the earphones to life. Clarity is generally sub-par and some of the detail is masked. On the upside, the softened way in which the earphones present low notes does prevent the bass from crowding out the midrange completely and makes the Munitio one of the smoothest-sounding in-ears I’ve heard. Put together, the mids and bass provide a complimentary, well-blended sound despite all of its technical shortfalls – a far cry from the SF5EB, which assigns the bass to a separate driver, or the Fischer Audio Eterna, which has noticeably more recessed mids.

 Expectedly, the treble transition and high end of the earphones are very smooth. The midrange veil thins out towards the top, permitting the high end to possess a bit of crispness in comparison to the midrange. The treble is still extremely soft, however - though the Fischer Audio Eterna handily beats the Teknines in clarity and resolution, it sounds very hard-edged and aggressive doing it. The Brainwavz M2, with its gently rolled-off upper treble, is more similar but still far more forward at the upper midrange than the Teknines. Indeed, the entire presentation of the Teknines is slightly distant, as if the veil had a very tangible thickness to it. Aside from the inner limit of the soundstage and slight lack of air, the presentation of the Teknines is pleasing, with above-average width and decent depth. The Eterna, which suffers from similar intimacy issues, sounds wider still and has slightly better imaging but at the same time thins out more to cover its massive soundstage. If anything, the soft and powerful bass of the Munitios allows them to envelop more of the soundstage in music. Dynamics are good and the Teknines can portray subtlety as well as aggression. That said, the low sensitivity of the earphones doesn’t do the low-volume performance any favors so expect to crank up the volume to get the full benefits.

 Value *(5.5/10) *– In the past year we’ve seen several manufacturers go down the ammunition path with their designs but the Munitio Teknines may just be the most faithful take on the form factor yet. Carrying an inherent appeal to the ’18-24’ demographic, the shape also allows for rock-solid construction and general user-friendliness but it is the sound signature that really sets the Teknine apart from the field. Smooth and powerful, the earphones take ‘non-fatiguing’ sound to new extremes. There undoubtedly is a certain charm to their sound – a sense of brutality with a veneer of restrain. Their signature is perfect for those who, upon hearing any other earphone, immediately wish it to be smoother and bassier. On the other hand those who, like me, value clarity and separation above all, usually listen at low volumes, and prefer tight and quick to loud and ponderous will not be sold on the Teknines. Personally, I can think of hundreds of IEMs I’d buy before the Teknines, but then I am clearly not part of the target audience.

*Pros: Excellent build quality, tons of bass, obscenely smooth and non-fatiguing
 Cons: Sub-par clarity, overly soft and wooly sound*
  
  
  
*(2A18) Future Sonics Atrio MG7 Pro*


Reviewed Sep 2011

 Details: Flagship universal IEM from the pioneer of dynamic customs, Future Sonics
 Current Price: *$175 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $189.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp:_ 32Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _18-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock bi-flanges, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Bi-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), porous foam tips (4 sets in 2 sizes), cleaning tool, and zippered carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – As with the old MG5 Atrios, the teardrop housings are made of plastic and feature molded rubber strain reliefs and thin, filterless nozzles. The memory wire has been dropped but the cable remains the same - light and flexible but not very thick
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5)* – Excellent with any of the stock tips or Shure Olives
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cable-down; nonexistent otherwise
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* –The fit of the Atrios reminds me of the Phonak PFEs. When worn properly, the housings don’t touch the wearer’s ear at all although the bi-flange tips can be a bit intrusive. Thankfully, the memory wire has been dropped so they can now easily be worn cable-down

 Sound *(8.8/10) *– The original Future Sonics Atrios were introduced back in 2007 and quickly rose to fame as some of the best basshead earphones money could buy. Four years and several revisions later, the low end is still the most attention-grabbing aspect of the Atrio sound – deep and powerful, yet controlled and accurate. The bottomless bass extension that made the old Atrio a hit is still very much a selling point of the new one. The bass is a bit forward in the overall signature but manages to be powerful without throwing off the balance. It can be reasonably tame when necessary but can also become dominant and explosive when track calls for it. The lack of a mid-bass hump helps, eliminating the bloat endemic to so many bass-heavy earphones, and the sub-bass emphasis gives the low end good rumble and a tactile feel. The drivers are still not the quickest out there but they don’t lose resolution quickly the way many mid-bassy earphones in the lower tiers do. The difference between the Atrio and lesser bass-heavy earphones such as the Fischer Audio Eterna is obvious – next to the Atrio, the Eterna sounds overly soft and bloated, with noticeably poorer clarity and detail resolution. Even the similarly-priced Sennheiser IE7 lacks control and tightness at the low end next to the Atrio.

 The midrange of the Atrio is recessed slightly in comparison to the low end but still impresses with clarity and detail. It’s not quite there up with the HiFiMan RE272 or Sony MDR-EX1000 on either count but competes well with the RE-ZERO and Turbine Pro Coppers. The mids are slightly warm and thick compared to the similarly-priced VSonic GR07 but lack some of the overall refinement and don’t achieve as neutral a tone. They sound smooth but slightly ‘dry’ in character, which contributes to a more crisp and monitor-like sound next to the softer, more lush MTPC and Sennheiser IE7. The treble is boosted in comparison to the old Atrios, which sounded dark and a little murky for my taste. The top end of the new Atrios isn’t laid-back and will not mask issues with the source material. It is a little more edgy than before but no less smooth on the whole than that of the VSonic GR07. Top-end extension is still only moderately good and the overall tone is still just a bit on the dark side but the treble quantity should be sufficient for most listeners without risking violent sibilance and harshness.

 The presentation of the MG7 is not particularly impressive for a top-tier earphone but works well enough with the sound signature. The soundstage is relatively well-rounded but width and depth are only average, superseded easily by the spacious soundstage of the Sennheiser IE7 and even the lower-tier FA Eterna (pretty much the only area in which the Eterna can compete with the new Future Sonics). The bass of the Atrio layers well over the rest of the sound and the healthy note thickness makes the thinner-sounding RE-ZERO somewhat less convincing despite its similar soundstage size. The MG7 also images better than the ZERO does, providing a more accurate sense of placement and distance. The brighter VSonic GR07, expectedly, carries better air and sounds spacious and open in ways the Atrio can’t quite match but separation seems improved over the MG5 version. The timbre is not up there with the Sony MDR-EX1000, JVC FX700, or even Monster MD, but then neither is the price. In its tier the Atrio is very competitive – I don’t feel that Sennheiser’s IE-series earphones perform better, for example. A final point to note – as before, the Atrio is not at its most brilliant at low listening volumes but – due to the newfound treble prominence – may now become tiring at extremely high levels as well.

 Value* (9/10)* – Outfitted with the updated MG7 transducers, the latest-gen Future Sonics Atrios manage to preserve the bass-heavy sound signature of the previous iteration while making serious performance gains on the dynamic-driver heavyweights from the likes of Sennheiser and JVC. With no changes made to the exterior save for the disappearance of the memory wire, the MG7 Atrio remains a somewhat unsightly but highly practical earphone with its secure fit, high isolation, and low microphonics. The bass-heavy sound signature, now made slightly more v-shaped with added treble, still offers a surprising blend of fun, dynamic-driver sound and monitor-like accuracy and control. It’s not perfect, but it’s an impressive step forward and one that should make the competition very wary of the low-profile PA-based manufacturer, especially whenever bass quantity and quality are brought up.

*Pros: Comfortable, well-isolating, low microphonics, powerful but controlled bass, clean midrange and treble
 Cons: Plasticky build; not very pretty; mediocre presentation*
  
 Big thanks to *esanthosh *for the MG7 loan!
  

*(2A19) Bowers & Wilkins C5*


Reviewed Sep 2011

 Details: First in-ear earphone from British hi-fi boutique B&W
 Current Price: *$180* from amazon.com (MSRP: $179.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _118 dB/V_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories* (3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes), right-angle adapter, airline adapter, and zippered velour carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The C5 shells are quite large and made entirely out of metal, which gives them an impressive heft. The angled housings and porous filter have the look and feel of quality but unfortunately the same cannot be said for the cable, which has a bit of memory and doesn’t feel all that upmarket. The caps on the end of the ‘memory wire’ section are not glued in place and came off on my pair after a day. Mild driver flex presents itself as well
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* – Surprisingly good despite the ‘porous filter’ at the rear. Can be made better with aftermarket bi-flanges
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– The earphones have to be worn cord-down but the earloop keeps the microphonics low
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – Though comfort is a major marketing push for the C5, the earloop design simply won’t work for some ears. The wire is pretty stiff at the top and pushes unpleasantly on the inside of the ear after a couple of hours and the earphones being large and heavy doesn’t help matters. Wearing the C5 over-the-ear is made impossible by the earloop and putting the earphones on correctly – annoyingly - often requires the use of both hands

 Sound* (7.6/10)* – The C5 is Bowers & Wilkins’ second iPhone headset, following in the footsteps of last year’s supraaural P5. Like the P5, the C5 attempts to balance a relatively mainstream sound signature with audio quality that won’t offend the discerning listener. Most noticeable is the emphasized mid-bass – the C5 is a decidedly bass-heavy earphone and offers up tons of power and impact. The low end is not the tightest or the most controlled, lagging behind competitors such as the Sennhesier IE6, nor is it as deep and extended as that of the Future Sonics Atrios. It is a touch slower and thicker than I would have liked, too, giving the C5 a full and fleshed-out sound even next to similarly bass-heavy sets such as the Beyerdynamic DTX 101. Interestingly, both the sound signature and sound quality of the C5 bear remarkable similarity to Beyer’s flagship - the manufacturers clearly did their research on the type of sound consumers find appealing.

 The midrange of the C5 is recessed next to the heavy bass – more so than that of the DTX 101, for example – and the low end seems to bleed up more noticeably as a result. The note thickness carries over as well, causing the C5 to sound a bit less clean and open than the DTX 101 and borderline muddy next to the HiFiMan RE-ZERO and VSonic GR07. Clarity and detail retrieval are decent but not on-level with some of the truly hi-fi sets in the price range. The overall tone is slightly warm and the sound remains smooth well into the treble. Harshness and sibilance are nowhere to be found and the overall treble curve is quite inoffensive, dipping off gently at the top. The top end is smooth and relaxed but again lacks the clarity and sparkle of earphones found near the top of the <$100 price bracket. As a result, much like the P5, the C5 falls just a touch on the darker side of neutral for me and lacks some air and transparency.

 Also like the P5, the C5 has an average-sized soundstage with good imaging and decent instrument separation. It’s a well-rounded presentation that nevertheless doesn’t offer anything extraordinary among the more high-performing dynamic-driver earphones. The sound is not as open as I would like and positioning precision is not pinpoint-accurate. The somewhat constrained dynamics – an issue with the P5 headphone as well – is one of the limitations to be faulted. One upside of both the signature and presentation of the C5 is how forgiving it is of the contents of an average listener’s iPod. Audiophile-oriented sets such as the HiFiMan RE-ZERO do not take kindly to 128 kbps mp3s but the C5 chugs along just fine. Still, while the B&Ws do perform better than other fashion-forward high-end in-ears such as the Beats by Dre Tour and Munitio Teknines, next to Head-Fi favorites such as the Sony EX600, HiFiMan RE262, and VSonic GR07 their warm and mid-bassy antics leave me quite cold.

 Value *(6.5/10)* – Despite its hefty price tag, the older P5 headphone is a reasonably good value in my book because – sound aside - very few sets can match its combination of portability, build quality, comfort, and isolation. The in-ear market, however, is flooded with sets that can compete with the C5 in every way for a lot less money. Like the P5, the in-ear model treads no new ground whatsoever with its signature, either, sounding dry, colored, and a touch thick. The sound is clearly more consumer than audiophile and while the C5 does surpass mainstream models such as the Beats by Dre Tour and Klipsch Image S4 in fidelity, it seems content with stopping there. I have other complaints as well – the adjustable earloop, while able to provide a secure fit, can be time-consuming to put on and isn’t necessarily comfortable in the long run; the cylindrical remote unit is difficult to operate blindly; and the velour carrying case is monumentally frustrating to use. On the whole, the earphones are beautifully packaged, nice to look at, and surprisingly well-isolating but simply don’t perform as well as I’d have liked for the asking price.

*Pros: 2 year warranty; secure fit; fairly inoffensive sound signature
 Cons: Would be more comfortable without earloop; frustrating carrying case; sound quality on par with cheaper sets*
  
  
*(2A20) HiFiMan RE272*


Reviewed Oct 2011

 Details: HiFiMan’s latest flagship and the company’s second balanced earphone
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $249)
 Specs: Driver: Dynamic | Imp: _20Ω_ | Sens: _103 dB_ | Freq:_ 15-22k Hz_ | Cable: _1.8’ I-plug + 2’ 45º plug extension_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock bi-flanges; MEElec ‘balanced’ bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, replacement filters (5 pairs), storage case, shirt clip, balanced extension cable, single-ended extension cable, and single-ended channel swap extension cable
 Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– While the housings of the RE272 are very similar to those of the RE262, the cable has been reinforced significantly. The new cable is thicker, sturdier, and less tangle-prone. The modular system adds an extra layer of protection and the new beefy 45º L-plugs and proper strain reliefs all around inspire confidence, as does the 3-year warranty
 Isolation* (**3.5**/5)* – The channel swap adapter allows the RE272 to be worn cable-up, which should help provide a deeper fit. With the stock bi-flanges or other deep-sealing tips the isolation is surprisingly good
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – With the new cord cable noise is very low when worn cable-down and nonexistent cable-up
 Comfort* (4.5/5)* – Though a deeper seal offers the best sound, there are now a total of four ways to wear the 272 with the additional cord configurations provided by the included adapters. I find three of them to be quite comfortable and would imagine most people won’t have trouble finding at least one that works

 Sound* (9.2/10) *– HiFiMan have had a number of hits around Head-Fi but none as potent as the original RE0. Fans of the RE0 have been waiting patiently for an update but – first with the RE252, then the RE-ZERO, and then the RE262 – HiFiMan have instead offered different flavors of poised and competent dynamic-driver sound to complement – but never replace – the RE0. Now, however, RE0 fans have something new to drool over.

 As with the RE0, the low end of the RE272 doesn’t offer great depth but also lacks mid-bass bloat, sounding quick and natural. Control and accuracy are excellent but there’s not a whole lot of impact to be found – noticeably less than with the Sony MDR-EX1000, for example. The bass, while fast, is a bit soft in character. The lack of aggression and edginess is particularly noticeable next to a BA-based IEM such as the ATH-CK10 or j-phonic K2 SP. The crisp, hard-edged punch of the CK10 and K2 SP makes the bass of the RE272 sound slightly recessed, even veiled in comparison. An EQ bump at the low end will help with the bass depth but it won’t make the bass significantly more aggressive. Those who like their bass snappy and delicate will like the RE272 but even the K2 SP offers more impact, punch, and rumble. Personally, I am happy with the bass quantity and It doesn’t hurt that texture and detail are top-notch; even the RE-ZERO is made to sound a touch artificial at the low end in comparison.

 The midrange is where the RE272 gets interesting. The clarity and detail are simply fantastic but unlike armature-based IEMs achieving the same levels or resolution, the RE272 still manages to sound soft and delicate. Compared to the Sony EX600, too, the RE272 is more refined and dynamic, and though the sweetness and warmth of the RE262 are all but gone, the mids are still liquid and very smooth. At times, the smoothness can almost become a detractor – the RE272 isn’t particularly great at portraying grit and seems to lack a tiny bit of texture at times. The upper midrange can sound a bit glassy, reminding me of the MA-based Ortofon e-Q5. Nonetheless, the sound is open and extremely transparent, trailing the K2 SP closely on both counts. In terms of note fullness, the RE272 pulls ahead of most analytical BA-based IEMs and competes well with popular dynamics such as the Sony EX600 and VSonic GR07.

 The upper mids and lower treble are prominent but the emphasis milder than with the higher-end Sony dynamics. The top end is not at all unpleasant – never harsh or sibilant like the treble of the EX600 sometimes is and not overly bright or edgy like that of some armature-based earphones. Despite this, the RE272 is very revealing and resolving – nearly on par with the brighter, more sparkle-heavy, more clinical j-phonic K2 SP. There’s still good amount of sparkle as well as excellent top-end extension and superb detail retrieval. The overall smoothness is also impressive, with no major peaks or dips, and the presentation is clean and very refined. Nothing at all to complain about with the treble.

 The presentation is not unlike that of the RE262, with similarly above-average soundstage size and good layering. If anything, the 272 sounds a bit more cohesive than the 262 and both utterly dominate the RE-ZERO in expansiveness and positioning. The sonic space is wide, open, and airy, though not quite to the same extent as that of the Sony MDR-EX1000. Instrumental separation is great and the imaging – while not quite a match for the ATH-CK10 – is impressive as well. Dynamics are good and the RE272 sounds effortless and works exceedingly well at low volumes, as have all of the HiFiMan IEMs before it.

 I also got the chance to try the earphones in balanced mode with a borrowed HM801 and a balanced card kindly provided by HiFiMan. Theoretically, running in balanced mode reduces channel crosstalk, doubles the voltage swing of the amp, and creates a natural resistance to interference (the latter not a big deal for IEMs). Practically, comparing the RE272 in balanced mode against running single-ended with the HM801 as a source reveals sound quality differences that are small but distinguishable. The most noticeable for me is an increase in dynamics, which are good to begin with but become among the best of all universals in balanced mode, with a darker background and amazing effortlessness. Then we have bass control – in balanced mode the RE272 seems to tighten up slightly and become crisper, with quicker attack times and even better resolution. Bass emphasis remains low but there is no denying the difference in quality. There are also very minor gains in texturing and clarity. Overall there is merit to running the RE272 balanced but whether it is worth the cost is a different discussion. Note that the sound score given is for single-ended mode - the balanced score would be one or two tenths higher.
  
 Value* (9/10)* – With its quick, resolving sound and neutral-to-bright tonality, the RE272 won’t be to everyone’s liking but as an overall package it is clearly the culmination of years of R&D on the part of the folks at HiFiMan. The modular cable system used by the RE272, unlike most, actually adds value to the product at the expense of a slightly heavier cable and the fit, finish, and build quality are finally giving the major Western brands something to think about. In both functionality and sound, the RE272 is an audiophile-class product, and one of the best around at that.

*Pros: Versatile cable system; solid design; 3yr warranty; top-class sound
 Cons: N/A*
  
  
*(2A21) ACS T15*


Reviewed Dec 2011

 Details: First universal IEM from UK-based customs manufacturer ACS
 Current Price: *£149* (est. $230) from acscustom.com (MSRP: £149)
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _41.5Ω_ | Sens: _N/A_ | Freq: _16-20k Hz_ | Cable: _5.5' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips:_ trimmed MEElec triple-flanges; stock triple-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (3.5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and triple-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips; hard clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The minimalistic design combines tiny, nondescript-looking plastic housings with a Kevlar-reinforced cable. The color-coded nozzles are surprisingly wide for an armature-based set and the cable lacks strain relief on housing entry. It also has plenty of long-term memory character despite being relatively tangle-resistant
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Tiny, sealed housings allow for very high passive isolation, especially with the triple-flange eartips
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Present when worn cable-down; low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(5/5)* – The T15 is one of the smallest IEMs on the market and is remarkably unobtrusive. The only odd design choice is the wide nozzle, which makes the fit slightly less universal than – say – an old Etymotic ER6i. For all but those with the smallest ear canals, however, the T15 will be a fit-and-forget earphone with the right tips

 Sound* (9/10)* – Designed in cooperation with Netherlands-based Dynamic Ear Company, who are also involved with ACS's latest music filters, the tiny single-armature monitors produce a very clear and detailed sound over a wide frequency range. They are by no means bass-heavy but the low end has surprisingly good depth and is fuller than that of Etymotic’s flagship ER-4S, though not by a wide margin. The ER-4S, with its shorter attack and decay times, sounds drier and more clinical than the T15 does. The bass of the T15 is still very clean and articulate, however, as expected from a single-armature reference earphone. It is flat in response and possesses enough detail and texture to keep up with the likes of the Audio-Technica CK10 and HiFiMan RE272, as well as to easily beat the cheaper Fischer Audio SBA-03 save for the slightly lower overall bass quantity.

 In the midrange, the T15 is neutral and very accurate. Overall balance is excellent and the midrange aggression of cheaper monitors such as the SBA-03 is nowhere to be found. The T15 is undoubtedly a BA-based earphone, crisp and highly detailed – traits that are very obvious in comparison to the softer, more relaxed HiFiMan RE272. However, it is also refined and smooth, not unlike the Audio-Technica CK10. Transparency yields to the CK10 and Ety ER-4S slightly but again the T15 has a marginally fuller, more fleshed-out sound. Still, its sound will not be confused with that of a dynamic-driver earphone any time soon. Compared to the JVC HA-FXT90, for example, the T15 offers far less bass, less natural timbre, and a dryer, less musical sound but makes sizable gains in clarity and resolution.

 The highly neutral tone of the T15 does help with overall realism – both the ATH-CK10 and Etymotic ER-4S sound a touch colder and brighter on the whole. The CK10 especially offers more treble sparkle at the expense of the flatter, less fatiguing treble response of the T15. Top-end extension is similar between the three despite the CK10 being a dual-armature earphone. Where the Audio-Technicas do pull away is imaging – while the ER-4S and RE272 both offer a slightly wider soundstage with similarly good layering to the T15, the CK10 is significantly more three-dimensional, with a larger soundstage and headstage and more precise positioning. Compared to the rest of my armature-based earphones, the T15 easily holds its own – the stage is wider and more realistic than that of the SBA-03 and more spherical than that of the ER-4S. It is still very much a monitor, however – maybe not as revealing and unforgiving as an Ety, but not far behind. Simply put, the T15 is for fans of balanced, analytical sound who want a slightly more even-footed response curve to the traditional high-end Etymotic earphone.

 Value *(8.5/10)* – The ACS T15 is an extremely capable universal monitor in a remarkably tiny package. The plain plastic earphones may not look or feel particularly high-end but the comfort, isolation, and sound quality make the T15 one of the best choices in its price bracket both for professional use and for consumers who value clarity, accuracy, and balance over emphasized bass and flashy cosmetics. Ety lovers especially should take note of the T15.

*Pros: tiny size, sturdy construction, high isolation, very detailed and well-balanced
 Cons: long, memory-prone cable*
  
  
*(2A22) JVC HA-FX500*


Reviewed Jan 2012

 Details: JVC's original wooden in-ear, known in some markets as the HA-FX1000
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: est $195)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _100 dB_ | Freq: _8-25k Hz_ | Cable: _2.6' I-plug + 2.3' L-plug extension_
 Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories* (4/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips, 2.3' (0.7m) extension cable, and small hard-shell carrying case
 Build Quality* (4.5/5) *- One of the first wooden IEMs on the market, the FX500 uses a combination of wood, metal, and hard plastics to achieve a weighty, high-end feel. The rear port and nozzle are both protected by metal meshes and the cable entry point features a ¾"-long strain relief in addition to metal reinforcement. The cable itself is similar to the cords found on JVC's lower-end products - soft, reasonably thick, and quite flexible. The 2.6'+2.3' cable configuration can be annoying
 Isolation *(2/5) *- The FX500 is an open-back IEM but isolates slightly more than the higher-end FX700 model due to the smaller rear vent and potential for deeper fitment
 Microphonics* (4.5/5)* - Cable noise is extremely low when the FX500 is worn cord-down and nonexistent with over-the-ear fitment
 Comfort *(4/5)* - The HA-FX500 utilizes an angled-nozzle design with a straight-barrel housing. Weight is not an issue and the slimmer housings lend themselves better to cord-up wear than those of the pricier FX700

 Sound *(8.9/10)* - Released back when wooden earphones were few and far between, the HA-FX500, known also as the HA-FX1000 in some markets, became JVC's first truly high end IEM. In deciding how the flagship in-ear should look, JVC clearly drew inspiration from the brand's flagship full-size consumer headphones. In sound, too, the FX500 is far from a studio monitor. Not surprisingly, it shares much of its sonic character with the newer - and pricier - FX700, but is a ways less refined than its successor.

 At the low end, the FX500 is powerful, rich, and full-bodied, with great impact and plenty of weight. Bass depth is good and the response curve may actually be flatter than that of the FX700, though the FX500 tends to sound a bit more intrusive at the bottom. Despite the above-average resolution, the bass tends to be ever-present while the more dynamic FX700 scales its bass response down when necessary. The drivers aren’t slow but compared to sets like the VSonic GR07 and Sony MDR-EX600 the low end of the FX500 is on the boomy side and could stand to be cleaner and more controlled.

 The midrange of the FX500 is a bit more prone to being overshadowed by the bass than that of the FX700, especially at higher volumes, but actual bleed is minimal as a result of the relatively flat response curve. Part of the reason for the relative dominance of the bass may be the slightly thinner note presentation of the FX500 compared to the FX700. Clarity and detail are still excellent in the midrange, though the brighter signatures of sets such as the Sony EX600 and Sennheiser IE7 create an illusion of better clarity in comparison to the warmer JVCs. As with the FX700, the FX500 is not really v-shaped in the sense that it suffers from a highly recessed midrange, but its mids would fare far better if they were not overshadowed by the powerful bass and treble quite so often.

 The top end of the FX500 is lively and sparkly. It is high in energy and gives the sound an airy, lightweight character. At the same time, it is harder and edgier than the top end of the FX700, especially at high volumes. There is no question that the FX700 is more refined here as the FX500 can be a bit sharp and fatiguing with the wrong track. There are no huge peaks and in vocal sibilance tests the FX500 came out as being less offensive than the brighter VSonic GR07 and Sony MDR-EX600 at low-to-moderate volumes, but only by a hair. On the whole the FX500 tends to add a bit more harshness than the others.

 Presentation is probably where the FX500 is most similar to the FX700 – airy, spacious, and very versatile. Separation and positioning are very good although Sony’s similarly-priced EX600 images slightly better despite a more elliptical soundstage. As with the FX700, the FX500 also yields to Sennheiser’s IE8 and IE7 in headstage size and consequent ability to provide a highly enveloping musical experience, but easily makes up for it with significantly better timbre. The Sennheisers are made to sound plasticky in comparison and lose a substantial amount of realism as a result.

 Value *(8/10) *– As with the pricier FX700, the JVC FX500 is a comfortable, well-built, and user-friendly dynamic-driver earphone with below-average isolation and a somewhat ‘v-shaped’ sound. Admittedly, the v-shaped sonic profile is a lot more common at the sub-$200 price point of the FX500, putting the JVCs in good company with sets such as the ATH-CKM99 and Atrio MG7. Still, despite having more bass than most high-end dynamics, the FX500 offers up detail and clarity on par with the best of the rest. The somewhat intrusive bass and edgy treble can become fatiguing, but not before the FX500 plants itself firmly among the better dynamic-driver earphones in its class.

*Pros: Powerful, lively sound with an airy yet involving presentation; great build quality; nearly no microphonics
 Cons: Sub-par isolation; odd cable lengths; can be fatiguing, especially at higher volumes*

 Huge thanks to* Inks* for loaning me his FX500 for review
  
  
*(2A23) Klipsch Image X10 / X10i*


Reviewed Mar 2012

 Details: Tiny single-BA design from Klipsch
 Current Price: *$155* from amazon.com (MSRP: $349.99); $279 for X10i with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _50Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _5-19k Hz_ | Cable: _4.4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _Klipsch oval gels (stock), Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5) *- Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) oval gel tips, cleaning tool, airplane adapter, 6.3mm adapter, and magnetic-clasp carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (3/5) *– Though the tiny housings of the Image One are made out of metal and feel very solid, the molded strain reliefs are designed rather poorly and seem prone to splitting with extended use. The cable is typical Klipsch – thin and plasitcky. The low-profile 3.5mm L-plug is a nice touch
 Isolation *(4/5) *– The slim, long, fully sealed housings allow for great isolation
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Somewhat bothersome when worn cord-down; nearly nonexistent with cable-up wear
 Comfort *(5/5) *– The combination of skinny, lightweight shells and Klipsch’s Oval Gel eartips makes the X10 one of the most comfortable IEMs around. Unlike most Etys, the X10s still sound good with only moderately deep insertion, making them more user-friendly towards IEM newcomers as well

 Sound* (8.6/10) *– Tuned for a mainstream, consumer-friendly sound, the Klipsch Image X10 tends to emphasize the bass and lower midrange – a sharp contrast to its single-armature competitors. The X10 easily beats all other higher-end single-armature earphones I’ve come across when it comes to bass quantity and offers up plenty of quality as well. The low is detailed and extended - the well-textured bass digs deep and offers up the sort of well-measured punch one would normally expect from a multi-armature monitor. The depth and impact of the X10 are actually about on-par with VSonic’s dynamic-driver GR07 monitor, though the mid-bass emphasis is slightly greater. Naturally, the lower-end dynamic-driver Klipsch Image models produce even more bass than the X10 but have none of the poise and precision of a balanced armature, sounding bloated and unrefined next to the flagship.

 While the bass depth and punch of the X10 are fairly similar to the VSonic GR07, the two differ greatly in how the midrange is handled. The X10 is warm and full, with a bit of bass bleed resulting in a lack of transparency next to sets such as the GR07, Etymotic HF5, and ACS T15. The GR07 is not only clearer but also more resolving, with more air and openness to its mids and more neutral overall tone. The X10, on the other hand, sounds more forward and intimate, with the prominent midrange putting vocals front-and-center. It is not as forward and aggressive as Fischer Audio’s SBA-03, however, and sounds less like a BA-based earphone with better timbre and a more full-bodied note presentation. The SBA-03, on the other hand, is significantly less colored and more aggressive with presenting detail, so analytical listeners will likely prefer it over the X10s.

 The treble of the X10 is much smoother than the uneven, harsh top ends of the Image S3/S4 and the somewhat grainy S2. Most times the top end seems slightly recessed but much to my surprise on a few tracks the X10 managed to be as sibilant as the GR07. Seems that it was tuned to be non-fatiguing but isn’t all that soft – certainly not in the way the dynamic-driver Fischer Tandem or Monster Pro Gold are. Treble detail is decent and the extension is not too bad, but hardly impressive next to an Ety ER4S or JVC FXT90. Clearly the X10 is limited by the single BA setup and was tuned to leave nothing out at the bottom end at the expense of some top-end reach. The treble is low on sparkle and lacks some authority and energy – Klipsch’s now-discontinued Custom 3 is similarly non-fatiguing but appears more balanced overall.

 The presentation of the X10 is well-rounded and, like the sound signature, yields no surprises. The soundstage is narrower than those of the CK10, ER4S, and GR07 but has decent width and some height. For a more intimate-sounding earphone, the X10 has a convincing presentation – more so, for example, than the Fischer Audio SBA-03. Instrument separation is decent but no match for the ER4S and 3-D imaging lags noticeably behind the CK10. Dynamics are good, however, and the earphones are efficient enough for portable use without being overly sensitive.

 Value *(9/10) *– The Image X10 is a high-end consumer-oriented IEM that combines the unobtrusive look and feel of the slim, lightweight housings with warm, smooth, punchy sound derived from a single balance armature driver. The X10’s greatest strength is its bass – extended, controlled, and unusually powerful for a single BA. Like all things Klipsch, the X10 is not suited for fans of neutral or analytical sound with its somewhat dull top end and colored midrange, but those in search of a warmer sound in a great form factor will be pleased with the $150 X10.

*Pros: Good isolation, very small and comfortable, consumer-friendly sound from a single BA
 Cons: Perilous construction*
  
 Thanks to* Inks* for the X10 loan
  
  
*(2A24) TFTA-2100-2V1S / 1V*


Reviewed Mar 2012

 Details: Bass-heavy IEM sharing a housing design with the Padacs Aksent
 Current Price: est. *$156* (£100) from tfta.eu (MSRP: £99.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens:_ 100 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 4.5mm _| Preferred tips: _generic bi-flanges; short bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality* (3.5/5)* – The gigantic metal housings are finished in glossy gunmetal and feel very sturdy. Beefy strain reliefs protect the thin, rubbery cable on housing entry but not so much at the I-plug. Driver flex is moderate to severe
 Isolation *(3/5)* – Good for a vented dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics* (3.5/5)* – Tolerable when worn cable-down; good otherwise
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– Though the housings are quite large, they weigh no more than those of the average metal-shelled earphone and can be worn both cord-up and cord-down

 Sound* (7.1/10) *– The 1V shares more than just its housings with the Padacs Aksent – it shares the bass-centric sound signature as well. The low end of the TFTAs is very attention-grabbing and undoubtedly dominates in the overall balance - if bass could be measured in units of weight, the 1V would have a ton. The last set I remember being this bassy was the Sony XB40EX, with most other in-ears simply being put out to pasture in terms of bass quantity. Bass depth is very good – while there is a touch more mid-bass than sub-bass, rumble and subbass power are plentiful. Impact is very good as well – the TFTAs are capable of moving lots and lots of air. The notes produced are a bit rounded and the bass sounds very full-bodied, even ‘fat’. On the downside, it also appears bloated and boomy much of the time, which is not unexpected considering the quantity.

 The mids of the TFTA 1V are recessed in comparison to the low end, though there is quite a bit of bass bleed propping up the lower midrange. The bleed reduces clarity and resolution – on both counts the TFTA is about on-par with the Dunu Trident and lags behind reasonably bassy sets such as the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE and id America Spark. The overall sound is warm, full, and colored, with reasonably good detail and a pleasant thickness. Those who are expecting the mids to serve as a compliment to the bass should be pleased but listeners on the hunt for transparency can do better, even among bass-heavy sets.

 Similarly, while the treble doesn’t have the same veil as the midrange, it lacks crispness and definition. There is no smearing but the overall detail level isn’t particularly great and those looking for higher-than-average treble sparkle will be disappointed. Compared to other bass-heavy sets, however, the treble is not bad – the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE, for example, is just as treble-recessed, and the Velodyne vPulse has similarly average detail levels. Top-end extension is moderate – better than with the id America Spark and about on-par with the vPulse.

 The presentation is perhaps the most interesting aspect of the 1V and also where it differs most from the cheaper Padacs Aksent. The soundstage is wide and spacious, providing a ‘big’ sound so befitting the huge bass presence. The sonic space is deep and reverberant but unfortunately the bass dominance doesn’t help with separation – the low end is consistently intrusive and seems to come from everywhere all at once. It is often more enjoyable than the somewhat flat and boring soundstage of the Velodyne vPulse but a little more positioning accuracy definitely wouldn’t have hurt.

 Value *(7/10)* – The TFTA 1V is a basshead’s dream come true, a set that unabashedly refuses to sacrifice its immense bass for any reason. The housings, while large, are quite attractive and not overly heavy and the isolation and build quality are decent enough to make the TFTA easy to recommend for those who just can’t get enough bass from headphones. For other listeners – especially those who fear bass bloat - alternatives abound.

*Pros: Well-built and attractive; large presentation; big bass
 Cons: Very large housings; driver flex; big bloat*

 Thanks to *-y0-* for the TFTA loan
  
  
*(2A25) Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII*


Reviewed Mar 2012

 Details: Second version of Fischer’s dual-driver flagship
 Current Price: *$198* from musicaacoustics.com (MSRP: $198)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _43 Ω_ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _20-24k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple-flange_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5) *– Standard (3 sizes), foam-stuffed Sony Hybrid-style (3 sizes), and Apple-style (2 sizes) single-flange silicone tips, triple-flange silicone tips, over-the-ear cable guides, shirt clip, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality *(4/5) *– The tiny new housings feel very sturdy compared to the old DBA-02 shells, boasting a nice rubberized finish and all-black color scheme. The thick flat cable is similar to the one on Fischer’s Oldskool ’70 portable headphone and is very well-relieved both on housing entry and at the I-plug. Biggest complaint is the lack of a cable cinch, which would be a bigger help with the thicker & stiffer flat cable compared to the old DBA-02’s softer twisted cord
 Isolation *(4/5) *– Very good now that the housings are designed for a deep fit and the accessory pack includes a larger variety of tips
 Microphonics* (3.5/5) *– Bothersome when worn cord-down, low when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The new housings are small and very lightweight, with more shallowly angled nozzles that work both for cable-up and cable-down wear. They are only a bit larger than the q-JAYS/UE700 but the stiff, thick cable makes it harder for the DBA-02 mkII to disappear when worn

 Sound *(9.2/10) *– Upon its release, the original Fischer Audio DBA-02 was undoubtedly one of the best bang-for-the-buck earphones on the market for fans of balanced and accurate sound. It mustered a loyal following and still commands frequent recommendations more than two years later. While the new mkII revision, which is set to replace the mkI very soon, is in large part cosmetic, the two generations do differ ever so slightly in sound signature.

 Expectedly, the mkII retains the general sound profile of a TWFK-based earphone – tight and precise bass, a clean and detailed midrange, and prominent, sparkly treble. As before, the bass quantity is quite close to neutral and the low end is only missing a tiny bit of extension at the very bottom. The mkII seems to move a touch more air compared to the old DBA-02 and has a marginally thicker note presentation but overall the bass is similarly quick and highly detailed, with better texture compared to the Ultimate Ears 700 and a bit more punch compared to the VSonic GR01.

 The midrange is clean and prominent, balanced very well with the low end and offering high levels of clarity and detail. The DBA-02 has always been an aggressive-sounding earphone, with an extremely crisp presentation and excellent texture. The mkII revision sounds a touch more dry compared to the old version, with a darker background and cleaner notes, but on the whole the two sets are again more similar to each other than they are to other TWFK-based earphones. The CK10, GR01, and UE700 are all smoother and more liquid-sounding but the DBA-02 mkII is more aggressively detailed compared to the UE700 and clearer than the GR01. It is the most analytical-sounding of the bunch, but the clarity and detail are well worth it.

 The top end of the DBA-02 mkII is crisp and extended. The resolution of the TWFK driver is immense – even the VSonic GR07 fails to sound all that clean and effortless next to the DBA-02. Compared to the original DBA-02, the mkII seems to have been tuned for slightly more relaxed treble, but in reality it is only a hair less sibilant on a few tracks. Otherwise it sounds sparkly and energetic, as the original did – less ‘hot’ than the ATH-CK10 but still not quite as smooth as the VSonic GR01. Treble extension is good and yet there’s none of the sheen or shimmer present at the top end of some other BA-based universals, resulting in fairly realistic timbre with no metallic treble edge.

 The presentation of the DBA-02 mkII is open and airy, as TWFK-based earphones tend to be, but perhaps a touch less so than the brighter mkI. The soundstage is well-rounded, with better depth and height but a little less width in comparison to the UE700. Instrument separation is excellent – again more competent than even the VSonic GR07 – and the sound is nicely layered. The ATH-CK10 is still slightly more enveloping, with better 3D imaging and ambience, but the DBA-02 is no slouch, with a better on-center feel compared to the UE700 and especially the more distant-sounding GR07. Some dynamics are sacrificed in order to maintain aggressive detailing – the Earsonics SM3, Westone 4, and most dynamic-driver sets fare better here – but this will be a mere nitpick for most listeners. Overall, the sound quality of DBA-02 mkII is still well worth the price of admission.

 Value *(9.5/10) *– The second revision of Fischer Audio's renowned DBA-02 finally matches the premium sound of the earphone with a premium feel, making a series of gains over the old version as a result of a new housing design, more durable cable construction, and improved accessory pack. The updated earphones are sturdier, more comfortable, and more isolating – a more mature package more deserving of being a market mainstay. The sound, while slightly re-tuned, is still closer to the 1st-gen DBA-02 than the other TWFK-based earphones on the market. The only real complaint has to do with the microphonics – there is more cable noise with the flat, rubbery cable on the DBA-02 mkII unless the earphones are worn cord-up. Despite this, the DBA-02 is still about as good as it gets for the analytical listener; the competition may have gotten stiffer, but the bang/buck ratio of the DBA-02 has remained very strong.

*Pros: Astonishingly balanced and capable sound, comfortable, well-built, and well-isolating
 Cons: Microphonic when worn cord-down; no cable cinch*
  
  
*(2A26) VSonic GR01*


Reviewed Apr 2012

 Details: VSonic’s slim-fit dual-armature model
 Current Price: *$183* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: $206)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _5-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges, *MEElec triple-flanges*_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *- Single-flange (3 sizes), hybrid-style (7 sizes), foam-stuffed hybrid (3 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips; padded spring-clasp carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4/5)* - The GR01’s form factor is of the slim, straight barrel variety, albeit with fatter-than-usual 4mm nozzles. The metal housings are reminiscent of the Klipsch Image X10. A rubber strain relief is present at the rear and the outer part of the nozzle, along with the metal mesh filter, can be (carefully) unscrewed and removed for cleaning. The cable is smooth but lacks a sliding cinch. A bump on the inside of the right strain relief makes the difficult-to-see L/R markings a non-issue
 Isolation *(4/5)* – The GR01 isolates a little better than VSonic’s dynamic-driver models but not quite as well as an Ety HF5 or ER4
 Microphonics *(4/5) *- Cable noise is bothersome when worn cable-down but becomes low with over-the-ear wear. The inclusion of a sliding cable cinch or at least a shirt clip would have helped in this regard
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *- The housings are very slim and easy to insert deeply for a good seal. The sheer variety of included eartips should allow the fit to work for anyone, though earphones with slimmer nozzles might provide more options still. The cable exits at an angle so those with smaller ears may have trouble wearing the GR01 cable-up

 Sound *(9.2/10)* – With the sound of VSonic’s dynamic-driver GR07 model so widely praised for its accuracy and balance, it should come as no surprise that the tuning of the armature-based GR01 had to be kept fairly similar in order for the new earphone to remain a proper monitor. Though the GR01 is based around the popular Knowles TWFK dual-armature driver – the same one used by the Audio-Technica CK10, Ultimate Ears 700, Fischer Audio DBA-02, and a number of other models – the engineers at VSonic have still added their own unique touch to the sound, making the GR01 the smoothest and most musical of the TWFK-based sets I’ve heard.

 Though it doesn’t quite have the bass depth of the ATH-CK10, the GR01 is only missing a bit of extension in the lowest octave. The GR07, which has solid deep bass as a good dynamic-driver monitor should, easily trumps the GR01 here. The GR07 also has better impact and fuller, thicker notes. The GR01, on the other hand, is quicker and less impactful than the GR07 but still has slightly more drawn-out decay times compared to some of its more analytical competitors. In terms of punch, it is just behind the DBA-02 mkII and about on-par with a well-amped Etymotic ER-4S, but the real treat is the accuracy. Compared to the MA-based Final Audio FI-BA-A1, for example, the bass of the GR01 is significantly tighter, cleaner, and more accurate, and the same can be said - though not to the same degree - when it is matched against the GR07.

 The lower midrange of the GR01 is a little more laid-back than is typical for a TWFK-based set, resulting in a safer sound. It is even slightly warmer than a UE700 or DBA-02, though the bassier GR07 is a warmer still. The natural clarity of the armatures is very good, though the smoother GR01 lacks a bit of the absolute transparency of the DBA-02 and Ety ER4S. Detail, similarly, is on-par with the CK10 and DBA-02 without being presented quite so aggressively.

 At the top, the GR01 is surprisingly smooth and non-fatiguing, perhaps the most inoffensive of the TWFK-based dual-drivers. It is significantly less bright than the UE700 and lacks the hot treble of the CK10. It is also less prone to sibilance than the GR07, displaying a seemingly smoother response where the GR07’s treble peaks fall. The tone is kept fairly neutral and timbre is among the best I’ve heard from an analytical armature-based earphone. The downside is that there isn’t quite as much energy to the sound compared to the CK10 or DBA-02, resulting in a signature that may be too ‘safe’ for fans of analytical earphones but still to neutral and accurate to appeal to the masses.

 The presentation of the GR01 is nice and spacious, yet very cohesive. Though it doesn’t quite have the soundstage width of the GR07, the GR01 is more well-rounded, with decent depth and a better on-center feel. There is still slightly more width to the stage compared to the DBA-02 and the GR01 is clearly more spacious and airy than the Final Audio FI-BA-A1. Separation is good as well, though imaging lags behind the CK10 a bit, partly due to the more elongated shape of the soundstage. Overall, the presentation is solid and reminds me of the Etymotic ER-4S, but those looking for an enveloping sound a-la Earsonics won't find it here.

 Value *(9/10)* – Though the VSonic GR01 strays little from the dual-armature monitor formula, it is one of the more competent such earphones I’ve heard, being neither overly bright nor fatiguing and managing almost all of the resolution of the more analytical Fischer Audio DBA-02. The GR01 has more going for it than just the sound, too – its slim form factor is very comfortable and the design shows good attention to detail aside from a few minor quirks. Construction is solid too, and there are enough tips included to accessorize several earphones comfortably. All in all, while the GR01 is not the direct GR07 upgrade many are doubtlessly waiting for, it is a very solid alternative for those who prefer a flatter sound signature.

*Pros: Small, lightweight, and comfortable; very balanced and articulate sound
 Cons: Lacks cable cinch; mediocre accessory pack; removable filters potentially more trouble than they’re worth*

 A full review of the GR01, complete with more photos, can be found here
  
  
*(2A27) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5 Pro*
  

Added Jul 2012

 Details: Discontinued dual-BA model from UE's pre-Logitech lineup
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $249.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _21Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq:_ 20-16k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(5/5)* -Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips (2 sets), cleaning tool, inline volume attenuator, and crushproof metal carrying case
 Build Quality* (4/5)* - The build of the SF5Pro is very similar to those of the lower-end SF3 and flagship TF10. The large housings are made out of thick plastics and the cable is detachable. The newer version comes with a softer plastic cable similar to the one now used by the TF10. Unfortunately the newer cable is terminated with the same wimpy 3.5mm I-plug as all other UE models. The older (clear) SF5Pro cable has more memory but feels much sturdier
 Isolation *(**3.5**/5)* - Quite good with well-fitting tips
 Microphonics* (4.5/5)* - Low due to over-the-ear fit but not absent completely. A bit poorer with the older (clear) cable
 Comfort* (3.5/5)* - The shells are similar in shape to those of the TF10 but slimmer towards the front and a bit more easy-going in terms of fit. Maintaining a seal can be difficult with stock UE tips. Included Comply foams seal well

 Sound *(8.2/10)* - The SuperFi 5 Pro is a two-way dual-BA setup slotted next to the bass-monster SuperFi 5 EB and below the TripleFi 10 in the original Ultimate Ears lineup. Now-discontinued but still available from several online retailers, the SF5Pro still performs very well next to its replacement, the SuperFi5. The subbass, for one, is stronger than that of the new SF5. It is still not as tight as that of the UE700 or TripleFi 10 but accuracy is very good on the whole. The low end is a bit soft in character for an armature-based earphone but impact is ahead of all of the other SuperFi models with the exception of the SF5EB.

 The midrange derives a bit of warmth from the slight bass emphasis but for the most part it is smooth and competent. There is a slight drop in clarity compared to the new SF5, putting the SF5Pro on level with the SF4 and cheaper dual-armature setups such as the Klipsch Custom 2 and Apple In-ears. The midrange of the SF5Pro is more forward on the whole compared to the UE700 and TripleFi 10 but there is a dip towards the top of the midrange, which makes the earphones less than ideal for female vocals but gives them a softer, sibilance-free character.

 The treble of the SF5Pro loses out to the brighter and crisper UE700 and TF10 in clarity and definition. The detail level is lower as well - something made extremely obvious in a head-to-head comparison with the TF10. The smooth treble presentation is quite easy-going on the whole and the SF5Pro has better extension than UE's single armature models but there is a slight lack of air to the presentation and a darker overall tone. Aside from the lack of air, the sense of space is quite good - the width and depth of the soundstage are both just a hair behind those of the TF10 and the positioning and layering are quite decent. Interestingly, the SF5Pro does improve slightly with the Westone ES cable, which gives up a bit of bass for a cleaner midrange and better treble definition - things the SF5Pro needs to run alongside its modern competition. Unfortunately, the ES cable just adds to the SF5Pro's already-steep price tag and requires a bit of modification to even fit the socket and the isolation is quite high.

 Value *(6.5/10) *- The now-defunct SuperFi 5 Pro still puts up a good fight against the newer Ultimate Ears offerings, including its namesake replacement, not only in sound quality but also in fit and finish. Unfortunately, it is let down by its high price point - the new old-stock sets currently available cost about as much as a TripleFi 10, which offers better detail, more transparency, tighter bass, and crisper, livelier treble. Simply put, the SF5Pro would have to be sold at a very large discount to be worth buying today.

*Pros: Nice carrying case, good isolation, smooth and competent sound
 Cons: Potential fitting issues, TF10 can often be found for less*


*(2A28) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5 EB*


Added Jul 2012

 Details: Discontinued dynamic/BA hybrid from UE's pre-Logitech lineup
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $199.99)
 Specs: Driver: _BA+dynamic_ | Imp: _11Ω | _Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _20-16k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Generic single-flange_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

*Accessories (5/5) *-Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips (2 sets), cleaning tool, inline volume attenuator, 1/4" adapter, and crushproof metal carrying case
*Build Quality (4/5) *- Though the shape of SF5EB is more reminiscent of custom in-ears than any universal I've ever tried, overall build quality is still very similar to those of the SF5Pro and TF10. The large housings are made out of thick plastics and the cable is detachable. The cable suffers from some memory character but is flexible and sturdy on the whole
*Isolation (3/5)* - Slightly lower than that of the other UE models from the time period due to the odd housing shape and ambient vent
*Microphonics (4.5/5) *- Low due to over-the-ear fit but not absent completely. A bit poorer with the older (clear) cable
*Comfort (3.5/5)* - The housings of the SF5EB differ in shape from the ones used by the other UE earphones and are the largest shells I've seen on a universal. They aren't meant to be inserted deeply and as a result never look like they are fitted quite right but the fit bothers me less than that of the TF10

*Sound (8/10) *- The unique housings of the SuperFi 5 EB conceal an equally unique transducer setup - the SF5EB was, to my knowledge, the first universal BA/dynamic hybrid to be released, combining a balanced armature, a 13.5mm dynamic driver, and a two-way passive crossover in a single enclosure. The dynamic driver is responsible for the bass of the SF5EB while the armature handles mids and highs. On paper, this is a dream come true for those familiar with the strengths and weaknesses of both transducer types, but there are one or two issues aside from the resulting housing size.

 As indicated by the 'Extended Bass' moniker, the SF5EB was tuned to appeal to those who find the bass response of UE's other higher-end models, which are all armature-based, less than satisfactory. The huge 13.5mm dynamic transducer of the SF5EB is optimized for low end response and throws out gobs of dynamic bass when prodded. Even the Fischer Audio Eterna cannot quite keep up with the sheer impact of the SF5EB. The bass is rarely muddy or bloated but it's not tight or accurate either - about what one would expect from a relatively pricy basshead earphone. Bass detail and texture are swallowed up by the impact on occasion and therefore appear to be diminished compared to the Eterna and FS Atrios but on the whole the quality of the EB's bass is rather good.

 The overall response of the SF5EB is slightly v-shaped, with a dip in the lower midrange and slightly hyped-up lower treble. Expectedly, the SF5EB does a very good job of separating the bass from the mids - sometimes too good, in fact, making the low end seem poorly integrated on certain tracks. It ends up sounding like a mid-range armature-based earphone with a subwoofer tacked on for good measure. The bass can obscure the lower mids and the midrange is not as transparent or detailed as that of the TF10 but for such a bass-heavy set the clarity is impressive.

 There is a bit of emphasis towards on the upper mids but nothing that would cause the SF5EB to be notably harsh or sibilant. The treble is not particularly heavy on sparkle but provides a very energetic sound in conjunction with the big bass. Extension is not stellar but good for a bass-centric earphone. The sense of space is quite good as well - the width and depth of the soundstage are similar to the SF5Pro and the positioning and layering are good. One thing worth noting is that the SF5EB is very efficient and sometimes hiss-prone. The dynamic driver also likes a touch of extra juice to tighten up while the mids and treble don't seem to benefit much from amplification.

*Value (7/10) *- Plain and simple, the Ultimate Ears SuperFi 5 EB is a basshead's dream come true. It offers tons of powerful, full-bodied, dynamic bass overlaying a competent midrange and treble presentation - an effect afforded mostly by the unique internal workings of the earphone. It's difficult to judge the technical merit of something like the SF5EB since accuracy was obviously not a priority in its tuning but the earphone does accomplish what it set out to do, delivering an uncompromisingly powerful low end. The aesthetics and ergonomics of the EB definitely won't be to everyone's liking and the isolation is a step below that offered by the other high-end UE IEMs but as a total package the EB is a good earphone for the bass-obsessed and a reasonable 'guilty pleasure' for the rest of us.

*Pros: Nice carrying case, huge bass, surprisingly clear mid-range and treble
 Cons: Housing size and fit*
  
  
*(2A29) Sennheiser CX980*
  

Added Mar 2013
  
 Details: One of several Sennheiser earphones developed in collaboration with BMW Designworks
 Current Price: N/A (discontinued; price as tested *$245*) (MSRP: $259.95)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _16-24k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' rotating plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Rock-It R-20/MEElec A151 single-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(5/5) *- Single-flange “balanced sound” silicone tips (3 sizes), single-flange “enhanced bass” silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips, cleaning tool, replacement nozzle filters (2 pairs), shirt clip, airplane adapter, soft carrying pouch, and carrying case with integrated cable winder
 Build Quality* (4/5) *– Engineered in collaboration with BMW Designworks, the CX980 is a striking combination of metal and plastic. The housings have a solid, hefty feel due to the metal stems but are otherwise plastic like those of the other, much cheaper CX-series earphones. The nozzle filters are just cylinders of foam and the cables are thinner compared to Sennheiser’s IE-series models. An in-line analog volume control is mounted at the y-split and the metal 3.5mm plug rotates between 90- and 180-degree configurations
 Isolation* (3.5/5)* – Good due to compact, well-sealing housings and angled nozzles
 Microphonics *(3.5/5) *– Cable noise is tolerable but the CX980 housings are difficult to wear over-the-ear due to the long stems
 Comfort* (4.5/5) *– Despite the heft of the metal housings and volume control, the CX980 is quite comfortable to wear with its thin, angled nozzles, smooth housings, and angled cable entry. My only real gripe is that it is difficult to wear over the ear

 Sound* (8.1/10) *– The CX980 follows the usual Sennheiser CX-series formula, delivering warm sound with generous bass but missing out on some of the clarity and refinement of more fidelity-oriented earphones. The bass of the CX980 is rather heavy – slightly greater in quantity than that of Sennheiser’s IE6 model and more in line with the Brainwavz M5. Bass control is rather good considering the sheer weight of it – the CX980 doesn’t sound overly flabby for such a bassy earphone. It is more controlled, for example, than the Audio-Technica CKM500, which has a more pronounced mid-bass hump. Bass depth is also good – the earphones produce a nice rumble down at the lowest frequencies.

 The midrange of the CX980 is not as forward as that of the IE6 and the bass clouds over the mids slightly. The result is mild midrange veiling and a slight clarity deficiency even in comparison to cheaper sets such as the VSonic GR06. Tonally, the CX980 is on the warm side. Treble extension and quality are good but there’s not enough top end presence to counteract the heavy bass. On the upside, the top end is very smooth, with no discernible grain, and sounds quite natural compared to many lower-end sets.

 The presentation of the CX980 is again typical of a Sennheiser CX-series in-ear – not overly congested but far from spacious as a result of the somewhat laid-back treble. The overall sound is rather in-the-head, especially when compared to sets such as the VSonic GR06 and Sennheiser’s own IE-series earphones. Interestingly, the CX980 doesn’t seem to be as sensitive as indicated in the specifications – through all my listening it required more power than the competition.

 When all is said and done, the CX980 is highly reminiscent of the $40 Brainwavz M5, boasting all similar shortcomings, albeit to a less severe degree. The CX980 is not quite as bassy as the M5, but otherwise shares a similar signature. Treble quality and extension are better on the CX980, but treble energy is still not as great as I would like. Clarity and detail, likewise, are slightly better on the CX980, and soundstage is a little more spacious. The difference between the two sets is clearly audible, and yet not as great as it should be considering the price gap.

 Value* (6.5/10) *– The BMW-designed Sennheiser CX980 accomplishes a rare feat for an in-ear monitor – its metal accents look stylish, but not ostentatious. Sadly, the low-grade plastics don’t have quite give it the same refinement up close and the long stems prevent over-the-ear wear. It is still very comfortable when worn cord-down, however, and has the sound of a good consumer-class earphone, with plentiful bass and smooth treble. Unfortunately, though the bass is rather well-controlled, the overall sound is too slanted towards the low end and lacks the clarity of many other similarly-priced monitors, making the CX980 a difficult recommendation.

*Pros: Comfortable form factor; striking design
 Cons: Difficult to wear over-the-ear; bass emphasis takes away from overall sound*

 Big thanks to *Anaxilus* for the CX980 loan
  
  
*(2A30) VSonic GR07 Bass Edition*


Reviewed May 2013

 Details: Enhanced-bass version of VSonic’s GR07 mkII
 Current Price:* $179 *from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $179)
 Specs: Driver:_ Dynamic _| Imp:_ 40Ω_ | Sens:_ 105 dB _| Freq:_ 5-22k Hz _| Cable:_ 4.3’ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 4mm_ | Preferred tips:_ Stock single-flanges; MEElec A151 single-flanges_
 Wear Style:_ Over-the-ear_

 Accessories* (4/5) *– Single-flange (3 sizes), Hybrid-style (10 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips, foam tips, over-the-ear cable guides, and soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (4/5) *– The build of the new GR07s matches the original quite closely, with similar housings and other hardware. The housings are designed for over-the-ear wear and feature adjustable-angle metal nozzles. The cord is a little bit softer but otherwise very similar to the original GR07 cable
 Isolation *(3.5/5) *– Reasonably good for a dynamic-driver earphone
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Cable noise is very low as the GR07 can only be worn in the over-the-ear configuration. Although there is no shirt clip in the accessory pack, the cable cinch and ear guides can be used to fix the cord in place better
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The earphone uses fairly large 11mm drivers but the lightweight, over-the-ear style housings actually work very well for prolonged listening with their slim profile, rounded edges, and adjustable-angle nozzles

 Sound *(9.1/10) *– It’s been more than two years since the release of VSonic’s original dynamic-driver flagship, and yet the aging GR07 is still a standard I hold all new dynamic-driver earphones against. I skipped over the second revision of the GR07 – the GR07 mkII – which is said to remain very true to the sound of the original with some minor tweaks here and there. The GR07 Bass Edition, however, turned out to be different enough to check out.

 The Bass Edition is advertised as having – surprise, surprise – more bass than the vanilla GR07. Comparing the Bass Edition to my two-year-old mkI GR07 unit presents far more similarities than differences, but the BE definitely does put more weight on the low end. Bass depth is good but the most noticeable change comes from the increased presence in the mid-bass region, which gives the BE a somewhat fuller, more impactful bass presentation. It still won’t do for proper bassheads, but those who found the original GR07 lacking slightly in the bass department but pleasant otherwise will be thrilled.

 The midrange of the BE is very similar to that of the original GR07 – what differences there are all stem from the more prominent bass, which upsets the bass-midrange balance slightly in favor of the low end and makes the midrange sound a touch more recessed. Aside from that, it’s still the good old GR07 – clear, detailed, and open-sounding. Compared to the less expensive GR06, the GR07 BE very obviously sounds clearer, more natural, and less congested despite the greater bass presence.

 Moving up into the treble, the GR07 BE again offers the familiar combination of energy and resolution. It’s very similar to my old GR07 here except a touch less sibilant, which is said to be the case for the GR07 mkII as well. The treble is still not as smooth as, for example, that of the Philips Fidelio S1 and S2 earphones but it’s definitely tolerable. The presentation, likewise, is largely unchanged compared to the original GR07, boasting good width and average depth for a spacious sound that is more distant compared to many other dynamic-driver earphones. As expected, instrumental separation is still good and the GR07 BE still provides crisp and detailed sound without sounding “analytical”.

 Value *(9.5/10) *– While it does not deviate from the feature set of the original GR07, the GR07 BE does deliver exactly what it promises – the clear, detailed sound of the popular GR07 with a bump in bass quantity. The bass boost is nothing drastic – bassheads will still find the GR07 BE lacking and fans of more balanced sound still won’t be offended by it. On balance, the more consumer-friendly signature is an asset precisely because the difference is mild enough to retain the strengths of the still-popular GR07. Those seeking a direct upgrade from the GR07 should look elsewhere but for everyone else the GR07 BE is among the most capable sets in its price range.

*Pros: A slightly more consumer-friendly take on the familiar GR07 sound; same fit, design, and functionality
 Cons: Mildly sibilant on some tracks*
  
  
  
*(2A31) Dunu DN-1000*
  
 

Reviewed February 2014
 
Details: Dunu’s dual BA – dynamic hybrid earphone
 MSRP: $215 (manufacturer’s page)
 Current Price: *$209* from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic + Dual BA Hybrid _| Imp: _10Ω_ | Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _16-22k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock wide-nozzle single-flanges, Stock & Comply T-400 foam tips_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange wide-channel (3 sizes), single-flange narrow-channel (3 sizes), and bi-flange silicone tips, 4 pairs of foam tips, eartip spacer set (6 pairs in 3 sizes), shirt clip, ¼” adapter, airline adapter, cleaning cloth, pair of cable guides, soft carrying pouch, crushproof metal carrying case, and integrated cable wrap
 Build Quality *(5/5)* – As with all of the other Dunu products I’ve tried, the construction of the DN-1000 is very solid. The metal housings have a nice finish to them and the latest iteration of Dunu’s cable is soft, smooth, and tangle-resistant. The machined aluminum y-split and cable cinch add to the premium feel. It may be a little more impressive to see this same level of build quality on Dunu’s sub-$100 models but that doesn’t detract from the DN-1000 in the least. There doesn’t seem to be any driver flex on my unit, either. My one complaint is that the silver L/R markings can be tough to see and the small bump on the left strain relief meant to help identify the left earpiece is too close to the earphone housing
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Very good for an earphone with this form factor
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Good when worn cable-down; excellent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings are on the heavy side and large enough to hold the hybrid driver setup. The weight and size can lead to mild discomfort in the long term but the earphones lend themselves nicely to over-the-ear wear, which helps with the weight. Overall, the DN-1000 is similar to the AKG K3003 in size and fit, though its strain reliefs are not offset like those of the AKGs. Dunu’s new eartip spacers help position IEM housing farther out of the ear and can also have an effect on sound, similarly to what we normally accomplish with tip rolling. That said, the DN-1000 is a little pickier with fit than sets like the RHA MA750 and some of the possible tip/spacer combinations make it easy for the tips to slip off the nozzles

Sound* (9.2/10)* – Balanced armature / dynamic hybrid earphones have been gaining popularity in the past year or two, but few have impressed me as much as the DN-1000. Dunu’s new flagship does what every hybrid hopes to – combines the bass performance of a good dynamic driver with the strengths of a BA setup, in this case the popular Knowles TWFK. The bass driver of the DN-1000 performs very well, providing plenty of both mid-bass and sub-bass, and should satisfy all but the most die-hard bassheads. The bass extends deep and is pretty quick considering the quantity. The RHA MA750, for example, is slower and can sound a bit “bassier” in the conventional sense as a result.

The DN-1000 has a thinner note presentation than the RHA MA750, especially in the midrange, but also sounds clearer than the more veiled RHA set. In keeping with other TWFK-based earphones, the mids of the DN-1000 are a touch thinner compared even to some BA setups, such as the InEar StageDiver SD-2 and EarSonics SM64. That said, the DN-1000 has very little bass bleed and superb midrange clarity, helped further still by the excellent treble energy. The DN-1000 has more perceived clarity compared, for example, to the HiFiMan RE-400 and StageDiver SD-2, which both sound duller at the top end.

The top end of the DN-1000 is bright and crisp, and again rather typical of a TWFK-based earphone. It can be a touch splashy, especially at high volumes, and it takes some playing with all of the included tips and eartip spacers to get the optimal (i.e. smoothest) treble performance out of the DN-1000. I personally found foam tips (especially Comply T-400s) with a deeper seal to work best for me, and the wider single-flange silicone tips with the red spacers to be good as well. In truth, I tend to listen at lower volumes and generally quite like TWFKs, but those who expect to crank up the volume with the DN-1000 to maximize bass impact may find the treble a little too prominent. The RHA MA750, for example, has overall smoother treble and makes the DN-1000 seem a bit fatiguing in comparison. The same goes for the pricier EarSonics SM64 – its treble is smoother, especially at high volumes.* *

*Select Comparisons*

T-Peos H-100 ($120)

T-Peos’ dual-driver hybrid is a rather unique-sounding earphone with a bright and cool tonal character. In comparison to the H-100, Dunu’s DN-1000 hybrid is bassier but also clearer – an impressive accomplishment. The midrange of the H-100 appears to be more scooped out, sounding more distant compared to the Dunu. The H-100 is also brighter and has greater upper midrange emphasis, which causes it to sound a bit “nasal” with the vocals on some tracks. The DN-1000 consistently sounds more natural in comparison. Still, despite its brightness, the H-100 is a touch less revealing of sibilance than the DN-1000, though that’s not quite enough to shift the balance in its favor. The T-Peos unit also exhibits more driver flex compared to the Dunu.

VSonic VC1000 ($125)

VSonic’s dual-armature release is based on the same Knowles TWFK driver as the DN-1000, but without the dynamic driver of the Dunu. The performance of the two earphones is very close despite the differences in sound signature. The most glaring difference is, of course, the far greater bass quantity of the Dunu. However, even in comparison to the bass-heavy DN-1000, the VC1000 sounds pretty punchy. Its bass is also tighter, and it has a more prominent midrange next to the somewhat v-shaped DN-1000.

Clarity is on par between the two earphones but the VC1000 has a slightly smoother top end, which is especially noticeable at higher volumes. On the whole, these earphones illustrate two very different tunings but neither really has the upper hand in performance. The DN-1000, for example, consistently seems to have too much bass when heard back-to-back with the VSonic set. The VC1000, likewise, seems to have too little but, admittedly, is closer to my own personal target than the Dunu.

Philips Fidelio S2 ($150)

The Fidelio S2 is a dynamic-driver earphone with an accuracy-oriented tuning. The DN-1000, which boasts a v-shaped sound signature, has much more of a “wow” factor to its acoustics. Its powerful bass easily outpaces the Philips set, which itself is no slouch when it comes to depth and impact. More surprisingly, the Dunu seems a bit clearer than the more balanced-sounding Philips, due in part to its brighter tonal character. The Fidelio S2 is not the most exciting earphone in the first place, and next to the DN-1000 it sounds especially dull. On the downside, the treble of the DN-1000 has a more “metallic” timbre than that of the Fidelio S2, especially at higher volumes, which is not uncommon for earphones based on the Knowles TWFK driver. The Fidelio S2 is significantly less efficient than the DN-1000, and while it is undoubtedly very proficient and more accurate overall, I couldn’t help but reach for the Dunu when given the choice.

VSonic GR07 Bass Edition ($179)

I’ve always maintained that in the case of this GR07 model, “Bass Edition” is a bit of a misnomer – while it is bassier than the regular GR07, it’s far from a basshead earphone as the name may suggest. The DN1000 has significantly more bass, especially deep bass, than the GR07 BE, and on the whole its sound signature is more v-shaped – closer to the GR02 Bass Edition than any of the other VSonic sets I’ve tried.

The GR07 BE is overall more balanced with less bass emphasis/more linear bass response and mids that are more in line with everything else. Due in part to the treble boost, the DN1000 can sound a little clearer and while the Dunu can be a little sibilant, the GR07 fares worse in this respect. The DN-1000 also has a slightly deeper, more layered presentation than the GR07 BE.

1964EARS 1964-V3 ($425)

Moving well outside of the $200 price bracket, the 1964-V3 triple-driver monitors offer a bass-heavy BA sound in a custom-fit form factor. While the dynamic driver of the DN-1000 affords the Dunu set better bass depth compared to the 1964EARS, the 1964-V3 actually has more mid-bass, which gives it a characteristically warmer, more full-bodied sound. At the same time, the BA-based bass of the 1964-V3 is a little quicker while the DN-1000, in a way consistent with its dynamic driver, has slightly softer, less immediate bass impact.

Overall, the DN-1000 sounds more v-shaped than the V3, which has a relatively forward and energetic midrange. The mids of the DN-1000 are thinner and more withdrawn while its treble is a little brighter. The Dunu is also more sibilance-prone, though the V3 itself is not perfectly smooth, especially at higher volumes.

Sennheiser IE 800 ($999)

The Sennheiser IE 800 is a rather unique earphone that does a few things very right but is somewhat let down by its design. The DN-1000 reminds me of the IE 800 in several ways, right down to the fit sensitivity. The IE 800’s treble has an extra spike that appears unless it’s inserted very shallowly, thanks to its proprietary D2CA tuning system, while the DN-1000 seems to work the opposite way with my ears, requiring a good seal for the smoothest sound. In terms of performance, the IE 800 is overall more detailed and refined, and sounds warmer without a drop in clarity. When it is inserted properly it is less bright and more forgiving of sibilance than the DN-1000, but it is five times the price with a very slight gain in refinement, which speaks volumes for the Dunu DN-1000.

AKG K3003 ($1300)

Though the K3003 and DN-1000 are separated by a huge gap in price, they are both triple-driver hybrid designs and don’t differ all that much in sound signature. To me, the DN-1000 makes for an excellent reasonably-priced approximation of the K3003. Compared to the AKGs with my preferred “Reference” filter installed, the DN-1000 has more prominent bass and a more subdued-sounding midrange. The two earphones have similar overall treble energy but because of its extra bass emphasis, the DN-1000 appears less bright overall.

The K3003 has a stronger midrange, dipping down less than the DN-1000 for a less v-shaped overall signature. Its mids appear a little clearer but overall aren’t too different from the Dunu’s, especially on tracks where the DN-1000 doesn’t have occasion to exhibit its explosive bass. The K3003 is somewhat less prone to sibilance despite similar overall treble energy – something about the way its treble peaks are positioned often makes it stop right on the verge of sibilance when the DN-1000 oversteps. Lastly, the K3003 has a slightly more spacious sound and images a touch better, though again it’s hard to justify the price difference based on the performance gap between the two earphones.

Value *(9/10)* – The Dunu DN-1000 is a high-end earphone of a very rare breed – one of a select few that are both quite bass-heavy and superbly clear, and also rather well-isolating. This is an especially unusual combination because bass-heavy earphones tend to have large, often vented, dynamic drivers. The DN-1000 uses its hybrid configuration to obtain rumbling, hard-hitting bass from its medium-sized dynamic driver while maintaining excellent clarity outside of the bass region. Its V-shaped signature makes it especially great for modern music – EDM, pop, and so on – and the excellent construction, though typical for Dunu, still stands out among other $200 IEMs.

*Pros: Voluminous bass with excellent midrange clarity; lots of eartips included with many possible fit configurations; very well-made*
*Cons: Treble can get peaky typical of a TWFK earphone; a bit heavy in the ear*

  

*(2A32) TDK BA200*
  

 Reviewed April 2014

Details: TDK’s recently-discontinued dual-armature flagship
 MSRP: $299.95 (manufacturer’s page) 
 Current Price: *$190* from amazon.com; $203 from ebay.com
 Specs: Driver: _Dual BA _| Imp: _35Ω_ | Sens: _99 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Westone STAR tips,_ _Stock bi-flanges, EarSonics bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: O_ver-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Bi-flange silicone tips (2 sizes), foam tips (2 sizes), replacement filters, shirt clip, and soft carrying pouch (note: exact accessories seem to differ between versions)
 Build Quality *(4/5)* – The BA200 is made mostly of plastic, but the construction is pretty solid. The nozzle screens are replaceable and spares are included – a rarity these days. The flat cable is soft and inoffensive but the massive y-split, which houses an impedance stabilizer, has a tendency to get caught on things
 Isolation *(4/5)* – Good thanks to the ergonomic housings and long nozzles
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Very low in the flat cable
 Comfort *(5/5)* – The ergonomically-shaped housings of the BA200 are very comfortable, thanks in part to the light weight of the earphones, though those with very small outer ears may have trouble fitting them properly. Despite the manufacturer’s claims, however, the BA200 is not well-suited for cable-down wear

Sound* (9.1/10)* – I’ve long wanted to try TDK’s dual-BA flagship earphone but the opportunity has always gotten away from me, until now. Big thanks to fellow Head-Fier *ericr* for finally making it happen, even if the BA200 model is on its way out as far as TDK is concerned.

On the whole, the sound of the BA200 is as comfortable as the fit. It’s a punchy earphone with good clarity and a tonal character on the warm side of neutral. The bass is slightly enhanced – for a balanced armature set it’s quite impactful, though it won’t win any awards from proper bassheads. In terms of bass quantity the BA200 is just a touch short of the VSonic GR07 and StageDiver SD-2, and significantly short of the Westone W40.

Despite its slight bass enhancement, the BA200 has excellent midrange clarity – about on-par with the GR07, though it is also more forward in the midrange than the VSonic unit. All in all, the mids are similar to those of the $450 StageDiver SD-2 and clearer compared to the Westone W40, likely due to the BA200’s flatter response through the upper midrange. The BA200 also has pretty good note thickness – it may miss out on some of the crispness of a TWFK-based set as a result, but for a BA earphone the note weight is very impressive.

The upper midrange and lower treble of the BA200 are very smooth, but despite this the earphones still sound crisp and resolving, likely due to a mid-upper treble lift. The BA200 is on the whole less bright than the VSonic GR07 and a little more tolerant of sibilant vocals, partly by virtue of its treble emphasis being higher up, but there are still some tracks on which it exaggerates sibilance. It is brighter than the Westone W40, for instance, and a little more sibilance-prone. The StageDiver SD-2 is also less revealing of sibilance than the BA200, and, though it also a dual-driver earphone, seems to have better extension and slightly more energy at the top than the TDKs.

The BA200 is a little less spacious than the SD-2, with a less out-of-the-head presentation, but otherwise the less expensive TDK unit more than holds its own. Imaging is good and the soundstage has enough depth to prevent the earphone from sounding intimate despite its warm tone and prominent mids.

*Select Comparisons*

HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)

In many ways the BA200 and RE-400 are similar – both are balanced earphones with a tonal character a touch warmer than neutral. The BA-200 is less mid-centric and a little warmer due to a marginally greater amount of bass boost. The RE-400 boasts more focus on the midrange. Up top, the RE-400 remains extremely smooth while the BA200 has a treble peak that makes it more revealing of sibilance, which the HiFiMan earphone tends to downplay. This makes the BA200 appear more crisp and also contributes to it sounding less mid-centric than the RE-400. The BA200 is also a touch more spacious.

VSonic VC1000 ($125)

The VC1000 and BA200 both utilize dual balanced armature driver configurations, albeit with different drivers. The Sonion AcuPass drivers in the BA200 endow it with a more impactful sound and warmer tonal character. The Knowles TWFK drivers in the VC1000, on the other hand, provide less impactful but tighter bass, making the BA200 sound a bit boomy in comparison. The midrange of the VC1000 is clearer, but also thinner. The VSonic unit has more upper midrange presence overall, though not by much, whereas the BA200 dips down a bit akin to the RE-400. I personally prefer the balance and clarity of the VC1000, but the thicker note presentation of the BA200.

The VSonic set is brighter overall but emphasizes sibilance less than the BA200. However, like all TWFKs, its treble has a slightly metallic/shimmery character which the BA200, despite its treble peak, lacks. The presentation of the VC1000 seems just a touch more airy and uncongested thanks to its tighter bass and brighter sound.

Sony MDR-7550 ($230)

The smooth, clear, and warm-sounding MDR-7550 makes for a logical competitor to the BA200. Indeed the earphones sound very similar despite the Sonys using a large dynamic driver to the TDKs’ dual armature setup. Surprisingly, the BA200 is a little more emphasized at the bottom end while the MDR-7550 is slightly clearer through the midrange. The MDR-7550 is also smoother in the treble region, with no sibilance-inducing peaks, and has a wider, airier presentation. The BA200, with its extra touch of bass emphasis, sounds a bit congested in comparison.

Value *(9/10)* – With sound that is reminiscent of well-regarded high-end earphones from the likes of HiFiMan and Shure, an ergonomic form factor, and good noise isolation, the TDK BA200 is a solid all-rounder with plenty of mass appeal. TDK has done an excellent job with these earphones, and while prices have been going up steadily since the BA200 was discontinued, those who run across one at a good price should grab it before they’re all gone.

*Pros: Excellent all-round sound quality; great ergonomics*
*Cons: N/A*

Huge thanks to *ericr* for sending over the BA200 for review!

 



*(2A33) RHA T20 / T20i*


Reviewed November 2015
  
 Brief: Latest flagship IEM from UK-based IEM experts RHA
 MSRP: $239.95; $249.95 for T20i w/mic & 1-button remote for iOS
 Current Price: *$240 *from Amazon.com for T20; *$250* from Amazon.com for T20i
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _90 dB_ | Freq: _16-40k Hz_ | Cable: _4.4′ I-plug (w/3-button iOS mic/remote for T20i)_
 Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T200, Stock double-flanges_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_
  
 Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange (6 pairs in 3 sizes), double-flange (2 sizes), and foam (2 pairs) eartips with stainless steel caddy, shirt clip, threaded nozzle tuning filters (3 pairs), and zippered leather carrying case
 Build Quality* (5/5)* – The T20 is yet another in a long line of RHA IEMs with impeccable construction. It utilizes injection-molded stainless-steel housings and features three pairs of interchangeable sound-tuning nozzle filters, which are color-coded and stored threaded through a metal plate. Cables are of above-average thickness, tangle-resistant, and feature a rather beefy “memory wire” section in place of the flexible earhook found on RHA’s MA750 model. The cable terminates with RHA’s signature metal I-plug and the earphones are covered by a 3-year warranty
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Isolation is quite good, on-par with the MA750 model
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – The cable carries some noise but microphonics are generally not a problem due to mandatory over-the-ear fitment and the fact that the cord is thick and heavy, and doesn’t move around much
 Comfort *(3.5/5) *– The ergonomic shape of the T20 makes it unique among the metal IEMs I’ve tried and is similar to what we typically see from Shure, Westone, and EarSonics stage monitors. However, the stainless steel shells of the T20 are also quite heavy in comparison, and a little less comfortable as a result. The memory wire helps, but during more active use it needs the cable cinch to stay in place securely
  
 Sound *(9.1/10)* – The T20 is the third new flagship we’ve seen from RHA in about two years. The title originally belonged to the MA750, which impressed me enough to land a spot on my Earphone Buyer’s Guide upon its debut. The MA750’s combination of superb design and build quality with warm and pleasant acoustics remains difficult to beat – in fact, the T10 model that superseded it missed the mark for me thanks to its overly bass-heavy sound.
  
 The T20 is very similar in design and construction to the T10, down to the three pairs of included tuning filters. However, while the T10 was very bass-heavy and ultimately not as natural-sounding as the MA750, the T20 reverts to a more balanced presentation.
  
 The changes in sound brought about by its tuning filters are quite subtle, but a small amount of customization is better than none. The default “Reference” filter puts forward a mildly v-shaped sound not unlike that of the MA750, but with tighter lows providing a less warm and bass-biased sound and making the v-shape more audible.
  
 The tuning of the T20 shares similarities with earphones such as the less expensive Alpha & Delta AD01 and the pricier, triple-driver Fidue A83, though both of these have slightly more pronounced “v-shaped” sound signatures. The AD01 is warmer and more bass-heavy than the T20 while the A83 has less bass with a slightly brighter and splashier top end.
  
 The T20’s “Bass” filter cuts treble energy down slightly, biasing the sound of the T20 even more towards the low end. Though I consider bass impact and depth to already be plentiful with the “Reference” filter, I do like the smoother sound this filter provides. However, the T20 is not too heavy on midrange presence and detail in the first place, and using this filter dulls the sound further. In the interest of not losing even more fine detail, I ended up using the “Reference” filter instead.
  
 The “Treble” filter of the T20 is actually the most mid-recessed of the three. It maintains the plentiful bass impact of the “Reference” filter but seems to re-balance the midrange and treble a little, with more bias towards the high end. Because the difference is again fairly mild, this filter is definitely usable and the resulting sound is still not as bright as, say, a DUNU Titan 1. However, the less mid-recessed “Reference” filter was again more to my liking. 
  
 The presentation of the T20, which is fairly consistent between all three filters, is about mid-pack for a $200+ earphone. It’s not overly wide and out-of-the-head, instead offering a moderately forward sound. Earphones such as the VSonic GR07 and DUNU Titan 1 appear more airy and spacious in comparison, but also lack the dynamics and immediacy of the T20’s presentation. 
  
 One last thing worth noting is that the T20 is quite sensitive to source noise – surprisingly so for a dynamic-driver earphone, especially one with such low rated sensitivity (per the manufacturer specs). In practical terms, this means the T20 will produce audible hiss and/or electrical noise with sources that don’t have an extremely low noise floor, and selecting the T20 as a “safe” choice for use with an imperfect source based on the rated sensitivity and dynamic driver may not have the desired results.
  
*Select Comparisons*
  
_Below are several head-to-head comparisons between the RHA T20 and earphones that either perform on a similar level or have somewhat analogous sound tuning (or both). These comparisons may play a direct role in someone’s purchasing decision, but more importantly they help contextualize the earphone’s performance based on the other options currently on the market. The T20 tuning filter used for the comparison is noted as well._
  
RHA T20 (Reference) vs RHA MA750 ($120)
  
 RHA’s mid-tier MA750 model has been one of my favorite earphones in its class for a long time, and the T20 is arguably the closest thing I’ve heard to an MA750 upgrade. The biggest improvements are in clarity and soundstaging – the newer model sounds less veiled and has a more precise and well-defined soundstage. In addition, although the tuning of the T20 follows a more conventional v-shape, it has less overall bass bias than the MA750 and is arguably more balanced on the whole.
  
 The bass of the MA750 is more intrusive and less controlled despite being no more powerful than that of the T20 in its “Reference” configuration.  As a result, the MA750 sounds a touch less balanced and detailed than the newer earphone. The T20, on the other hand, is more crisp and resolving, and carries a bit more treble sparkle. Both earphones have similar emphasis in the upper midrange, which is not entirely natural and can make them sound a bit “tizzy” at times, but on the whole the T20 is the one that presents a more dynamic and enjoyable listening experience.
  
RHA T20 (Reference) vs VSonic GR07 Classic ($100)
  
 The VSonic GR07 is one of the most popular reference-class dynamic-driver earphones of the past decade. It’s interesting that both the T20 and the GR07 display some treble unevenness, but in different areas. As a result, both can be harsh in different ways – the GR07 tends to be more sibilant and the T20 – more “tizzy”.
  
 The differences don’t stop there, however – the T20 boasts more powerful and impactful bass and follows a more v-shaped sound signature. Clarity is on-par but the VSonics tend to sound flatter and more accurate on the whole while the T20 is more mid-recessed. The presentation of the GR07 is wider and more laid-back while the T20 tends to sound more forward, but also has better depth and dynamics.
  
RHA T20 (Reference) vs Aurisonics Rockets ($250)
  
 While the RHA T20 and Aurisonics Rockets differ tremendously in sound tuning and form factor, they’re priced similarly and both offer tough-as-nails build quality backed by lengthy warranties. The sound of the Rockets is much more midrange-focused, in stark contrast to the somewhat v-shaped T20. The Rockets’ bass quantity and impact are significantly lower but the bass is tighter and more controlled. The top end of the Rockets is much smoother while the T20 has more prominent – but also harsher – treble.
 Clarity is about even between the two, and neither reaches the clarity and resolution of an ultra-flat earphone such as an Etymotic ER4 – the Rockets are slightly limited by their more laid-back treble and mid-focused sound and the T20 – by its heavier, less controlled bass and more recessed midrange.
  
RHA T20 (Treble) vs DUNU DN-2000 ($265 – $280)
  
 Even with the “Treble” tuning filters in place, the T20 has a bit less energy at the top end compared to DUNU’s hybrid DN-2000 model. The greater treble presence of the DN-2000 gives it a brighter tone and a crisper sound while its bass has a more linear character that leaves the sub-bass more audible. The T20 has more mid-bass impact but isn’t as tight and controlled as the DN-2000.
  
 The T20’s more recessed midrange and darker overall tone limit its clarity and detail resolution a bit compared to the DN-2000. Together with the more powerful bass, this results in sound that is a bit more veiled and muddy. The T20 is smoother, however, while the DN-2000 is more revealing and at times harsher, though it also boasts a more spacious and airy soundstage.
  
 Value *(8.5/10)* – While the RHA T10 was something of a departure from the superb MA750 model that preceded it, the new T20 takes a step back and delivers more of what made the MA750 great. It tackles the difficult task of improving on the MA750’s strongest points – its build and sound quality – and succeeds by combining a seemingly tough-as-nails construction with a slightly more exaggerated version of the MA750’s impactful, mildly v-shaped sound signature. It can be a little heavy-handed in the upper midrange and doesn’t have the most delicate, refined, or detailed sound, but rewards listeners with excellent dynamics and good clarity on top of impactful bass.
  
 With its ergonomic shape, ultra heavy-duty stainless steel construction, and dynamic driver, the T20 is one of the more unique high-end earphones on the market right now, and while it may not quite deliver the killer value for money of the more inexpensive MA750, I’m glad to see RHA continuing to both innovate and improve on previous designs.
  
*Pros: Extremely solid build quality; 3 year warranty; very capable sound with three tuning variations
 Cons: Heavy housings; source-sensitive*


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## ljokerl (Feb 25, 2020)

*Tier 1C ($250-400)*


*(1C1) Audio-Technica ATH-CK10*


Reviewed Jan 2010

Details: Audio-Technica’s diminutive Dual-armature earphone may not be its flagship, but it sure competes well with those of other manufacturers
Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $399.99)
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _55 Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
Nozzle Size:_4mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids, De-cored Olives_
Wear Style: Over-the-ear

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), cleaning cloth, and oval clamshell hard case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – Ever since I first laid my hands on the CK10 I have used it as my build quality benchmark for IEMs. The build is outstanding – rubber-covered metal housings with titanium faceplates look and feel indestructible. The cabling is soft and thick, terminated with a beefy 3.5mm I-plug. They’re not perfect (I prefer an L-plug and the strain reliefs could be better), but in most ways the build of the CK10 is what every other earphone needs to stack up to
Isolation *(4/5)* – With the proper tips the tiny CK10 can be inserted very deeply, providing impressive levels of isolation
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Microphonics are nonexistent in the cabling when worn cord-up and unnoticeable when worn cord-down
Comfort *(5/5)* – The tiny round housings rest inside the ear when the CK10s are worn cord-up, but contrary to the way they were designed the CK10 can be worn cord-down as well. Either way they are impossible comfortable and simply disappear when donned, but wearing them cord-up allows for deeper insertion

Sound *(9.2/10)* – I’ve always done my reviews on a comparative scale, with the perfect score in each category going to the best performer I’d encountered to date. The CK10 has been and still is my SQ benchmark for IEM reviews. The CK10 is as close to a perfectly balanced earphone as I have heard. The low end is smooth, tight, and extended. It is detailed and well-textured, conveying plenty of information. Impact-wise the bass is medium-low on the grand scale, not much greater in quantity than an amped Ety ER4S, but more full-bodied. It is also impossibly quick - I sometimes get the feeling that the armatures on the CK10s could reproduce several different songs simultaneously and never miss a beat. Midrange detail and clarity are close to the ER4S but vocals have better air and a dimensional quality to them that the Etys lack. The treble is best described as being “sweet”, but not excessively so. The CK10s definitely sparkle at the high end and roll off very little - Audio-Technica was quite conservative with the specs on the CK10s, which is a welcome change from the optimistic “8-25k Hz” specifications I’ve been seeing get slapped on $20 earphones. Treble smoothness is top notch – harshness and sibilance are nearly imperceptible even on flawed recordings. Resolution and imaging are both excellent. Soundstaging is above average - though they don’t quite have the lateral width of the RE252, they have the RE0 and Phonaks beat in both depth and width. Transparency is also impressive - the CK10s are my earphones of choice for testing amps and sources. They add no color to the sound, allowing the properties of the source to shine through. That said, I find them more forgiving of poor quality source material than most other high-end IEMs.

Now for the qualifiers: the CK10s score very highly _with me_ at the moment of this writing. There are still many high-end IEMs I have not heard and the CK10 is definitely not for everyone – it does not have a thick, creamy midrange so the Shure faithful may be underwhelmed. The quantity of the bass will not satisfy a basshead’s uncouth craving – the TF10 is better suited there. They may also not be engaging enough for those who tend to get bored with balanced, neutral sound – like the RE0 but to a lesser degree they can be described as sounding ‘thin’ and lacking in body, though I find them to be quite energetic. Lastly, the treble sparkle can quite easily cross the line separating it from brightness for some people. A poor fit can exacerbate the problem.

Amping: Although the CK10s aren’t particularly efficient and do a good job of cutting down on hiss from sources such as the Amp3, they are not difficult too drive. There are small increases in speed, resolution, and bass slam when they are amped, but I often eschew an amp for the sake of portability when using the CK10s – they sound great straight from a portable player and take up no room at all being the one IEM I have no qualms about carrying around without a case.

Value *(8/10)* – Upon release, the CK10 was Audio-Technica’s flagship and retailed at or near the $399 MSRP, but sold closer to $200 for most of its lifespan. With my personal affinity for its sound I’m tempted to say that it is still some of the best money one could spend. However, with budget and mid-range earphones constantly improving, it is becoming more and more difficult to make such statements. The RE0 still costs about 1/4 as much as the CK10. Is the RE0 1/4 of the earphone? Not to me. That said and this being head-fi, diminishing returns are an expectation. With that in mind, plus the fact that the CK10 is one of the most user-friendly IEMs around, I find the asking price quite justified.

*Pros: Well-built, extremely comfortable, no microphonics, great clarity, detail, and imagine
Cons: Stock tips are underwhelming, flat bass won't please everyone*

For a more in-depth review and comparisons to the Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Panasonic HJE900 see here


*(1C2) Ortofon e-Q7*


Reviewed Apr 2010

Details: First IEM from Ortofon utilizing a new type of transducer
Current Price: *$320* from ebay.com (MSRP: ~$320)
Specs: Driver: _Moving Armature_ | Imp: _31 Ω_ | Sens: _117 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9’ I-plug_
Nozzle Size:_ 5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Sennheiser dual-flange_
Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and Comply T400 tips, felt-lined storage case, leather carrying case, filter changing kit with two pairs of spare filters, and filter cleaning tool
Build Quality *(4/5)* – Weighty aluminum shells with rubber strain reliefs feel rather solid. Cabling is in two parts (very similar to the original Lenntek Sonix), with a plastic sheath above the y-split and woven nylon below. Unfortunately, the large plastic strain relief on the 3.5mm plug is quite hard and unlikely to protect the cord. Also, there is no cord cinch and a small bump on the left-side strain relief takes the place of L/R markings
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – The extremely short nozzle limits the insertion depth of the Ortofons by design. The IEMs are fully sealed, however, and isolation is still good
Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Though minimal in the nylon-sheathed part of the cable, microphonics are present and bothersome in the plastic part above the y-split, where it counts. Wearing them over-the-ear solves the problem but isn’t as easy as with other IEMs due to the long housings
Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The short nozzle of the Ortofons means that the housings are nearly flush with the ear canal when wearing all but the longest tips. For those with smaller ears this may be uncomfortable. In addition, the length and weight tend to torque the housings when wearing them cord-down and moving about. A set of cable guides would’ve been nice to make the Ortofons more over-the-ear-friendly

Sound *(9.1/10)* – The sound signature of the e-Q7 takes on a peculiar mix of traits commonly ascribed to balanced armature and dynamic driver earphones. If blindfolded and given the e-Q7 for the first time, I would have attributed the sound to a dynamic driver, albeit a very clean and precise one. The overall tone of the IEM is just a tad on the warm side. Bass extension is impressive - not quite as deep as the dynamic-driver MTPG and Atrio M8s, but better than any armature-based earphone I’ve heard. Texturing across the range, but especially at the low end, is excellent, right up there with the best of the best. The bass is punchier than it is powerful but still boasts plenty of impact and great speed. The midrange is rich and full and acts as a unifying element, making the entire signature extremely coherent and musical. Similar to the Soundmagic PL50, the midrange seems to be the focus of the presentation with the e-Q7 despite not having any particular emphasis. The mids can sound a bit dry, almost grainy at times, and there is a tiny spike towards the upper midrange that can accentuate harshness already present in certain recordings, but I’ve really only noticed it a few times in the hundreds of tracks I’ve listened to using the e-Q7.

The treble, on the other hand, is very smooth and inoffensive. It is devoid of sibilance and harshness but also doesn’t feel as endless and effortless as, for example, the ATH-CK10 or RE0. Despite this, I wouldn’t call the e-Q7 laid-back or relaxed-sounding. They are highly resolving and detailed, resulting in an involving, attention-grabbing sound. Overall balance is excellent, with all signs pointing to the midrange but yet no lack of emphasis in the bass and treble. Soundstage width is impressive, falling right behind the RE252 in expansiveness. Depth is decent, but not class-leading. Instrumental separation, positioning, and imaging, however, are all excellent. I’ve also said before that being enjoyable at low volumes is one of the hallmarks of a great earphone for me and the e-Q7 handles the lowest listening volumes quite well. A note on amping – if planning to pair them with an amp (not a necessity in my view), make sure that your amp is at least neutral. The e-Q7 does not play well with warm amps such as my iBasso T4; it actually pairs better with my new Rocoon RC-1, which is rather neutral, and the mini3, but neither is a significant enough improvement to warrant using.

Value *(8/10)* – As one the most expensive earphones reviewed in this thread to date, it is very difficult to put a value on the e-Q7. As a total package, it does not feel like a $320 product to me. The cable is almost identical to the one found on the $40 Lenntek Sonix 3, several throw-ins are missing from the accessory pack, and the microphonics leave much to be desired. The short nozzle and sizeable housings may also cause fit issues for those with small ear canals. But all of these usability issues can be remedied or mitigated by throwing a few more bucks at the earphones for a set of Phonak cable guides, nicer tips, and a shirt clip. It is much harder to remedy shoddy sound quality but, luckily, that is not an affliction the e-Q7 suffers from. With tight bass, full mids, and smooth (albeit slightly rolled-off) treble the e-Q7 possesses one of the most coherent sound signatures in the land of portable audio. As with all high-end IEMs these are bound to have both strong fans and convinced critics in due time. Though the signature of the e-Q7 is far from the analytical and neutral type of sound I prefer, I easily subscribe to the former category.

*Pros: Beautiful design and packaging, very rich, detailed, and balanced sound
Cons: No true L/R markings, no cord cinch, fit issues likely for those with small ears*

Special thanks to *rawrster* for generously offering to lend me the e-Q7 and allowing me to put it through the full testing regimen.


*(1C3) Klipsch Custom 3*


Reviewed May 2010

Details: Dual-armature flagship of Klipsch’s Custom line, recently discontinued and plummeting rapidly in street price
Current Price: N/A (discontinued; price as tested *$265*) (MSRP: $399.99)
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _32 Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _8-19k Hz_ | Cable: _





.2’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size:_3.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Shure Olives_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) tips, cleaning tool, airplane adapter, 6.3mm adapter, and oversize hard carrying case
Build Quality *(2.5/5)* – The housings are rubber-covered plastic and quite well-made. The memory wire acts as a strain relief and the y-split and L-plug are both very impressive. The nylon cabling, however, is atrocious. It kinks and tangles endlessly, ruining an otherwise very competent build
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – The long, steeply angled nozzles allow for deep insertion, resulting in impressive isolation
Microphonics *(2.5/5)* – Unpleasant despite these being worn over-the-ear and having a ‘memory wire’ configuration
Comfort *(4/5)* – Can’t fault the Customs here – they fit in the ear rather snugly and unobtrusively, not unlike the JVC AirCushions. Persons with smaller ears may find them harder to wear

Sound *(8.7/10)* – Unlike the Custom 2, which uses two identical armatures with no crossover, the Custom 3 has a separate woofer and tweeter with a crossover around 1500Hz. The extended frequency response shows, with the Custom 3 having very reasonable reach both down low and up high. Though they don’t have the bottom-end extension of the MTPG or even the e-Q7, the Customs can easily match IEMs like the RE0 and Ety ER4. Bass is impactful and articulate, with impressive texturing for a BA-based earphone and moderate decay times. The Custom 3s are far from bass-heavy but they have a more immediate punch than the CK10/ER4/RE252 crowd. Aside from dropping off steeply past 35Hz or so, the bass is fairly linear and transitions smoothly to the midrange. While slightly warm, the Custom 3s aren’t quite as toasty as the Custom 2s but not as cool as the Custom 1s, either. The happy medium in tonality works with the thick-sounding midrange to create an accurate and balanced sound. Compared to more analytical IEMs, however, the Customs sacrifice some detail in the midrange and treble for fullness. There is a bit of weight placed on the lower mids but overall the midrange is fairly flat all the way up. The treble is clean and smooth, slightly laid back compared to the bass and mids but far from recessed. It doesn’t sparkle and isn’t quite as crisp as that of the high-end Audio-Technicas or as extended as that of the RE0. More than anything, it reminds me of the Ortofon e-Q7 - neither bright nor harsh nor fatiguing – just perfectly complimentary to the thick and lush midrange.

The presentation of the Custom 3 seems well-suited for their balanced nature. Soundstage width and depth are both above average, resulting in a rather spacious sound. Instrumental separation is hindered slightly by the somewhat thick sound, making it more difficult to pick out and place individual instruments but the sense of space is unhindered. Overall the Custom 3 boasts a very balanced and rather accurate overall sound, though they are a bit heavier-sounding than I would consider natural. Still, the signature is very versatile and makes the Custom 3 a great all-rounder and unlikely to disappoint either the casual listener or the seasoned audiophile.

Value *(7/10)* – The Custom 3 is a very capable earphone with one colossal caveat – the cabling. Personally, I could not live with these cables if the Custom 3 was my primary IEM. It’s possible that I’ve simply been so spoiled by the Audio-Technica earphones when it comes to cabling but my gut says otherwise. In fact, my gut gives me murderous urges when I think of the engineer who designed the cords used across Klipsch’s custom line. Is the sound worthy of homicide? At the $300 MSRP, not exactly. At the significantly lower street price, I would say yes. The C3s are punchy and thick but still very balanced and energetic. Best of all, the sound of the Custom 3 is much less of an acquired taste than either of the two lower end Klipsch Custom models. If Klipsch were to bring the C3 back with a different cord and a lower MSRP, they would become a head-fi mainstay. As it stands, they’re a great-sounding set with a skeleton in the closet.

*Pros: Comfortable, well-isolating, wonderfully balanced and very enjoyable sound
Cons: Downright awful cabling, excessive microphonics*

*(1C4) Sennheiser IE8*



Reviewed Jul 2010

Details: The earphone that established the ability of dynamic-driver IEMs to go toe-to-toe with multi-armature setups
Current Price: *$400 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $449.95), $450 for IE8i with mic
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16 Ω_ | Sens: _125 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: 4_’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single flange, stock short bi-flange_
Wear Style: *Over-the-ear*_ or straight down (with cable flip)_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Single flange (3 sizes), bi-flange (3 sizes), and mushroom (2 sizes) silicone tips, foamhybrid (2 sizes) tips, cleaning tool, bass adjustment screwdriver, over-the-ear cable guides, shirt clip, and storage case with integrated cable winder
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The oddly-shaped housings are made of sturdy plastic and surprisingly ergonomic. The cord is light, strong, flexible, and, best of all, detachable – one of the best cables I’ve seen on an IEM. For some reason the L-plug is not gold plated and rotating it can cause a tiny bit of static
Isolation *(2.5/5)* – Not a strong suit of the IE8, which are rather shallow-fitting earphones, but quite passable for everyday use, especially with dual-flange tips
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Nearly imperceptible when worn cord-down (with the cables flipped); completely unnoticeable when worn in the proper (cord-up) orientation
Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are light but rather large; those with smaller ears will have to settle for very shallow insertion but, like many dynamic-driver in-ears, the IE8s are not overly sensitive to insertion depth. With average-sized ears the IE8s are nearly flush and can be slept in quite easily

Sound *(8.9/10) *– As usual, the first step to my listening involves spending time with the tuning system. In the case of the IE8, tuning is done by turning a bass adjustment screw on the front fascia of the earphones with a small screwdriver. Personally, I don’t much care for the tuning feature. In the minimum-bass configuration, the IE8s are plentifully impactful – similar in bass quantity to my Monster Turbine Pro Golds but a bit more forward and aggressive with the way low notes are presented. Turning up the bass seems to extend the mid-bass hump of the IE8 lower down and darkens the tone of the earphones but does surprisingly little for low-end extension. A single notch of bass increase puts the overall bass quantity of the IE8 on level with the Fischer Audio Eternas (rev.1), two notches get it closer to the Future Sonics Atrio M8, and the maximum setting matches the monstrous bass bloat of the TDK EB900. The bass itself is fairly forward, at least in comparison to the rather relaxed midrange and treble of the earphone. Bass depth, power, and texture are all among the best I’ve heard out of in-ears, beating out the MTPG in technical prowess by a hair. The bass of the IE8 is also characterized by its versatility – the IE8 can be quite quick on fast trance and house tracks but also manages wonderfully realistic attack and decay when necessary. On bass-heavy tracks, the low end of the IE8 can be slightly overwhelming for my tastes but for the most part it works quite well with the unique presentation and overall balance of the Sennheisers.

The heavy-handed low end makes the midrange of the IE8 seem slightly veiled and recessed, but this is as much an artifact of the ridiculously spacious presentation as it is of the balance. Taken out of context, the midrange and treble of the IE8 are both excellent in their own right. The mids are smooth slightly thick, warmed up by the mid-bass heft and quite full-bodied. Clarity is excellent but the midrange isn’t as crisp as, for example, that of the Phiaton PS200 or even the Radius DDM, and the detail is not presented as aggressively. Transparency lags quite a ways behind earphones such as the DDM and Yuin OK1 as well, hindered by the thickness and slight coloration of the IE8s.

The treble transition is seamlessly smooth, yielding a clear high end with no harshness or sibilance. The treble is well-extended and seems a bit edgier and more present in the sound of the IE8 than the similarly-bassy MTPG and Future Sonics Atrios, but not quite as edgy as that of the Hippo VB. The top end does lack the effortlessness of the CK10/RE252 and the sparkle of the OK1/TF10. Expectedly, it is not as crisp and resolving as with many of the BA-based IEMs, resulting in less aggressive detailing but also a generally pleasant an non-fatiguing sound. Again, the treble of the IE8 is more impressive when taken out of context and not juxtaposed to the bass and midrange, which do tend to crowd it out somewhat.

Lastly, the presentation of the IE8 is more than noteworthy in itself. The gargantuan soundstage is one of the most apparent and striking aspects of the sound. Headstage width is similarly tremendous, giving the IE8 and out-of-the-head feel on par with many proper headphones. Soundstage depth is above average as well and the IE8 can convey distances adroitly. However, the soundstage is limited in extent – whereas IEMs like the Yuin OK1 can convey what seems like a near-infinite distances, the soundstage of the IE8 has an outer limit when it comes to positioning. It has an inner limit, as well – the IE8s do not portray extreme intimacy very well; instead, the soundstage extends to within what seems like a few feet from the listener. Nitpicking aside, the presentation of the IE8 has a distanced and yet spacious feel that Sennheiser faithful may find familiar – the earphones infallibly put the listener in a third row seat. With that in mind, the presentation is quite realistic – a bit thick but nevertheless relaxed and boasting decent air. In the land of IEMs, high-end or not, the Sennheiser IE8 stands out in that respect.

Value *(7.5/10)* – Launched at a time when “high end IEM” was synonymous with “balanced armature”, the Sennheiser IE8 re-introduced dynamic drivers into the world of ultraportable hi-fi and firmly established Sennheiser, a late entrant in the IEM game, in the realm of top-tier earphones. Though past its popularity peak, the IE8 still competes with the best of the best two years later. The uniquely rich and full sound, from the heavy bass to the warmed-up midrange and smooth but extended treble, works wonderfully with the relaxed and spacious presentation. Aside from the isolation, which isn’t actually as bad as some say, the biggest issue with the IE8 is its price - at $400 retail, it’s a fair stretch pricier than many of the newer high end earphones. As with all other top tiers, the IE8 brings its own unique strengths and weaknesses to the table. And, again as with all other top tiers, the decision as to whether or not it is worth the asking price rests with the individual listener.

*Pros: Detachable and all-around excellent cabling, no microphonics, light and comfortable, excellent bass depth and texture, monstrous soundstage
Cons: Mediocre isolation, not the best at conveying intimacy*

Special thanks to *Poetik* for letting me borrow the IE8s for a (very) extended audition


*(1C5) Westone UM3X*


Reviewed Aug 2010

Details: Westone’s three-way triple driver flagship designed for professional use
Current Price: *$325* from ebay.com (MSRP: $549.00)
Specs: Driver: _Triple Armature_ | Imp: _56 Ω_ | Sens: _124 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Shure single-flange, Shure Olive_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Comply foam tips (4 sets in 2 sizes) and hard clamshell carrying case. *Edit 4/28/11: *Newer versions may also come with Single-flange conical (3 sizes) and rounded (3 sizes) silicone tips, triple-flange silicone tips, ¼” adapter, in-line volume control, filter and tip cleaning tool, and hard clamshell carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The housings are a two-piece design and made out of a hard, durable plastic. They are quite large but rather good-looking. The multi-strand twisted cable is impossibly lightweight and tends to tangle but feels very sturdy. The split, housing entry, and heavy-duty 3.5mm L-plug are all very well-relieved
Isolation *(4/5)* – Isolation is extremely high as the shells fill my ears nicely and the angled-nozzle design coaxes the maximum possible attenuation from the stock Comply foamies or Shure Olives
Microphonics *(5/5)* – The UM3X can only be worn over-the-ear and microphonics are nonexistent
Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The shells of the UM3X are quite ergonomic and fill out the wearer’s ear nicely – the smaller Westone 1 actually fits me less securely. Cabling is very light and flexible which helps with the over-the-ear fit

Sound *(9.1/10)* – The UM3X was released just a few months after Westone’s own W3, the very first three-way triple-driver universal IEM. Aimed squarely at the pro audio market, the UM3X might just be the smoothest BA-based earphone I’ve heard to date. The bass is impactful and well-extended, keeping up with other bass-heavy BA-based earphones. Body, attack, and decay are all quite natural but the bass isn’t as quick and tight as that of the high end Audio-Technica earphones or the DBA-02; next to the decay-shy CK10, the UM3X sounds thick and a tiny bit bloated but in general its low end is quite pleasant.

The midrange is forward and quite warm but also very smooth, clear, and detailed. The mids of the UM3X are quite possibly even more forward than those of the ATH-CK100 but seem relatively less emphasized due to the more confined overall presentation. The forward nature of the midrange, combined with the warmth and thickness, makes the UM3X sound fairly close and intimate at all times and sacrifices transparency slightly.

Unlike the straightforward midrange, the treble of the Westones perplexes me. On the one hand it is astonishingly detailed and extremely forgiving. Harshness and sibilance are absent completely and the resulting sound is not fatiguing in the least. On the other hand the treble lacks the crispness and sparkle that I like so much in many of my other BA-based earphones. From a technical standpoint, the non-fatiguing nature of the UM3X’s treble is second only to the ATH-CK100. However, I always feel like I have to put in extra work to focus on the details. Naturally, personal preferences play a huge part in this and the UM3X is without a doubt a very capable stage monitor, especially when vocals are of the utmost importance, but cymbals just don’t sound realistic to me without a touch more energy than the UM3X tends to provide. For jazz and vocal performances the polite nature of the UM3X may work well but for rock, metal, and even electronica I found myself yearning for slightly more bite – the UM3X can simply sound bland at times.

When it comes to presentation, the UM3X steps even further away from realism and clearly caters to the professional crowd. Overall, the earphones feel quite intimate, especially when it comes to the forward midrange. For the most part everything is placed quite close to the listener. On the upside, the UM3X has astonishingly good instrumental separation. Lastly, it is worth noting that despite the high impedance, the UM3X is a relatively sensitive earphone and will hiss with full-size amps and other mismatched sources.

Value *(8.5/10)* – Though extremely competent from a technical standpoint, the Westone UM3X has a peculiar way of presenting sound that won’t appeal to everyone. The sound signature combines strong bass, a warm and forward midrange, and extremely smooth and relaxed treble. Comfort, fit, isolation, and build quality are all expectedly superb making the UM3X an excellent top-tier earphone that’s more than certain to find and maintain a loyal fan base.

*Pros: Great fit, isolation, and build quality, high technical proficiency
Cons: Only Comply foam tips included, sound signature & presentation will not appeal to everyone


(1C6) Monster Turbine Pro Copper*


Reviewed Aug 2010

Details: The flagship of Monster’s Turbine line, claimed to be designed for audiophiles and music professionals
Current Price: *$279* from amazon.com (MSRP: $399.95)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sennheiser biflanges, Monster Supertips_
Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Silicone single-flange (3 sizes), tri-flange (2 sizes), and Comply foam tips, gel-filled (6 sizes) and foam (5 sizes) Monster supertips, buttoned carrying case, soft carrying pouch, over-the-ear cable guides, 1/4” adapter, and shirt clip
Build Quality *(4/5)* – Almost identical to the Turbine Pro Gold – sturdy metal shells, proper strain reliefs all around, and a thick but flexible cable. One odd observation of mine is that the Turbine Pro Coppers are more susceptible to driver flex than the cheaper Golds are
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Very good for a dynamic-driver IEM and compounded by the excellent tip selection
Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn over-the-ear; slightly bothersome otherwise
Comfort *(4/5)* – Despite the weighty housings they stay in extremely well both cord-up and cord-down. The variety of included tips makes it easy to find a good seal right out of the box

Sound *(8.8/10)* – When I first learned that I’d be getting a go at the Monster Turbine Pro Coppers, I did some reading and figured that they would be a more appealing lighter on the bass – heavier on the treble version of my own Turbine Pro Golds. But, as is usually the case with top-tier IEMs, the truth is more complex than that. The Coppers do indeed have a smaller bass hump than the Golds, resulting in a lesser overall quantity of bass compared to the MTPG and similarly-bassy Sennheiser IE8. Die-hard bassheads may want to pick up one of the others instead but for the rest of us the bass power and impact of the MTPC should be plentiful. As with the MTPG, the bass is not aggressive but rather controlled and non-intrusive. It carries good depth and body with natural-sounding attack and decay. Resolution is impressive as well, with individual notes distinguishable all the way down.

The midrange follows the typical Monster Turbine formula – smooth, full-bodied, and neither forward nor recessed. The reduced bass intensity of the Coppers results in a slightly thinner sound compared to the Golds, which in turn leads to slight gains in clarity and transparency. The Coppers are also not quite as warm as the Golds are, though I still wouldn’t call them neutral. On the whole, the midrange is lush and musical. Vocals come across strong and vocal timbre is quite natural. Sibilance is kept to a minimum, though admittedly the more laid-back Golds do a better job of clamping down on sibilance-prone tracks. The treble is reasonably strong and carries some sparkle without becoming overly edgy or fatiguing. It still doesn’t sound as crisp as the treble of certain BA-based earphones or the more analytical dynamics (RE0, RE252) but performs better than the MTPG without adding much potential for listening fatigue.

The presentation of the Coppers is not the largest among all IEMs but it is quite adequate in both depth and width. The imaging and positioning do not possess the pinpoint accuracy certain other earphones are capable of providing but, like that of the MTPG, the sound of the MTPC is extremely blended, which may actually seem more natural to some compared to the Sennheiser IE8 with its football-field-sized soundstage or the Westone UM3X with its holographic separation. The same goes for individual notes, which sound slightly ‘rounded’ with the Monster Turbine earphones, as opposed to the crips and highly-defined notes produced by some of the BA-based in-ears.

Finally, a few usability notes – as with the MTPG, the Coppers like a relatively shallow seal. Trying to achieve ear-penetrating insertion with them has a tendency to collapse the soundstage. Also shared with the Golds is the hunger for additional power. For the most part, the MTPC does play fine straight out of portable players but it scales with added power. The MTPC is also less engaging at lower volumes than analytical earphones tend to be. On the upside, the Coppers won’t quite crucify lower-bitrate files the way the UM3X or Ety ER4 will – as with the other Turbine earphones, the natural smoothness tends to gloss over some of the finer imperfections of the recordings, which in itself may be a strong selling point for some.

Value *(8/10)* – As with most $200+ earphones, the value of the MTPC is only as high as its alignment with the listener’s preferences. Though far less polarizing than the Audio-Technica IEMs or Westone UM3X, the MTPC will still appeal more to some listeners than others – namely those who find the bassy and highly blended sound of the Coppers to sound natural, or at least refreshing. Personally, though I do feel that the MTPC is a step in the right direction from my own MTPG, I really don’t feel that it’s a significant improvement. It also somehow sounds less special – the MTPG may not be as accurate but it is thick, smooth, and fun. Don’t get me wrong – the Coppers are excellent earphones – clear and refined, with plenty of bass for most listeners and treble quantity to match. With street prices hovering just above those of the MTPG and Monster’s excellent warranty acting as a value-adding proposition, the Coppers are not difficult to recommend, especially for those who aren’t sure that they will enjoy a truly analytical sound and yet don’t want the more mainstream sound provided by the warm and bassy Golds. But I won’t call them the best thing since sliced bread, either.

*Pros: Excellent build quality, comfortable, massive fit kit, not as vulgar to behold as MTPG, smooth, balanced, and dynamic sound
Cons: Some microphonics can be coerced from the cable*

Special thanks to *rawrster* once again for generously lending me the MTPC for the full duration of my review regimen


*(1C7) Monster Miles Davis Tribute*


Reviewed Oct 2010

Details: Ostentatious jazz-focused earphones from Monster Cable (note: the Miles Davis tributes are not part of Monster’s artist series)
Current Price: *$299* from amazon.com (MSRP: $499.95)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sennheiser biflanges, Generic wide-bore single-flanges_
Wear Style:_ *Over-the-ear* or straight down_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and tri-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, Foam tips, Monster supertips (2 sizes), hard velvet-lined storage case, buttoned carrying case, soft carrying pouch, eartip carousel,  and shirt clip
Build Quality *(4/5)* – While the attention to detail is sublime, the build is poorer than that of the MTPG/MTPC due to the slightly thinner and less flexible cable. The rest is similar – sturdy metal shells and proper strain reliefs all around. Driver flex is among the lowest among all dynamic IEMs (in contrast to the MTPC)
Isolation *(3.5/5) *– Quite good for a dynamic-driver IEM and compounded by the excellent tip selection
Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – A bit more bothersome than with the MTPG/MTPC when worn cable-down; nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings are slimmer than those of the Turbine earphones but equally weighty. The fit is similarly secure both when worn cord-up and cord-down. The variety of included tips makes it easy to find a good seal right out of the box and, like the Turbine earphones, the MDs are very forgiving of a shallow seal

Sound *(8.9/10)* – Despite being at the top of the Monster line-up in suggested retail price, the Miles Davis Tribute is not billed as an upgrade to the two Turbine Pro earphones but rather a specialized ‘sidegrade’ for Jazz lovers. The overall sound of the MD does seem related to both of the Turbine Pro earphones in core characteristics such as dynamic range and speed. In terms of signature the MD are a bit closer to the Golds.

The Miles Davis Tribute is a bass-heavy earphone. Like the Turbine Pro Gold, the MD boasts great bass depth and hits very hard. The sub-bass trumps all but the FutureSonics Atrio and possibly even an IE8 with maxed-out bass. The resulting sound is very full and usually quite pleasant. However, the bass of the MD is more prone to sounding ‘excessive’ than that of the Coppers or Golds, which is not to say that it is lacking control, but rather a reflection of the relative weight of the bass. For an in-ear earphone, the drivers of the MD can really move a whole lot of air – if there’s any earphone that Monster can justifiably dub an ‘in-ear speaker’, the MD Tribute is it. Like the Golds and Coppers, the MDs offer up natural-sounding attack and decay and impressive resolution and texturing but give up the speed and tightness of many similarly-priced BA-based earphones. Interestingly, the reverberant, well-textured, and highly impactful bass of the MDs gives their sound an edge in immersion over much of the competition, even in the BA realm. Compared to the venerable Earsonics SM3, for example, the MDs clearly aren’t nearly as wide or spacious but yet still sound ‘bigger’ on the whole.

The midrange of the MD is warm, smooth, and slightly forward in nature. It is more textured than that of the Golds and more present than that of the Coppers, treading gently between smoothness and clarity. There is no better word to describe the midrange of the MDs than ‘lush’. Those who value clarity above all will want to stick to armature-based in-ears but for a noticeably thicker note and more ‘musical’ sound, the Miles Davis Tributes are hard to beat. Interestingly, the smooth and liquid MD Tributes don’t drop any detail in comparison to the thinner-sounding Turbine Pro Coppers. They also maintain the natural timbre of the Coppers while doing almost as good a job as the Golds of clamping down on sibilance – a fine combination of sonic properties.

The treble, too, falls close to the two Turbine Pro models in emphasis. As with the Coppers, it is not lacking in extension or detail except when compared to the truly limitless BA-based earphones out there. Unlike the MTPC, however, the Miles Davis Tributes never make me feel as though the top end has been ‘tweaked’ for greater sparkle and detail – they never sound overly prominent the way the Coppers can. Instead, the treble is very natural – soft but very well-defined – and listening fatigue is nil.

The presentation of the MDs is also nothing I haven’t heard before. Soundstage size is close to that of the Golds – not the largest but quite spacious. The warm and mid-forward MDs do tend slightly towards intimacy but still sound spacious next to the Westone UM3X and Earsonics SM3. Separation is quite good and individual instruments are easy to pick out. Like the two Turbine Pro earphones, the MDs don’t provide pinpoint accuracy but do handle large compositions well. They also have a pretty impressive dynamic range and handle subtlety surprisingly well for a warm-and-bassy earphone. They sound a bit better at lower volumes than the Coppers and Golds do and are also some of most forgiving high-end earphones when it comes to poor mastering or low-quality rips, though of course much potential is wasted when using them with 128 kbps mp3s.

Value *(8/10)* – The Monster Miles Davis Tribute is devastatingly expensive but what you get is a beautifully packaged and unique-looking earphone that lags just behind the two cheaper Turbine Pro earphones in overall usability. Though the MD is slimmer and can be a bit more comfortable, isolation is slightly lower than that of the Turbine earphones and microphonics in the skinnier cable are worse. The sound of the Miles Davis, on the other hand, leaves little to be desired. Treading a fine line between the signatures of the Turbine Pro models, the Miles Davis sounds like a culmination of the Monster sound – a more refined Turbine. No matter the track or genre, the Miles Davis sounds special. Whether that makes it worth the price is up to the individual listener.

*Pros: Beautiful packaging & presentation; solid build quality & comfort; massive fit kit; smooth, powerful, and dynamic sound
Cons: Very flashy design, can be microphonic*

Special thanks to* Inks* for generously lending me the Monster MD for the full duration of my review regimen


*(1C8) Westone 3*


Reviewed Nov 2010

Details: Flagship earphone from Westone’s consumer series
Current Price: *$350 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $569.00)
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _30Ω_ | Sens: 107 dB | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply P-series, Large Ety tri-flange_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5) *– Single-flange conical (3 sizes) and rounded (3 sizes) silicone tips, triple-flange silicone tips, Comply foam tips (3 sizes), ¼” adapter, in-line volume control, filter and tip cleaning tool, and hard clamshell carrying case with carabiner
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – As with the Westone 1 and UM3X, the housings of the Westone 3 are made of plastic and the multi-strand cables are twisted for extra strength. The y-split, housing entry, and 3.5mm L-plug are all very well-relieved though the consumer-oriented nature of the W3 shows next to the UM3X monitors
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Quite good when longer tips are used
Microphonics *(5/5) *– The W3 can only be worn over-the-ear and microphonics are nonexistent
Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells are quite ‘fat’ in comparison to the Westone 1 and quite a bit heavier. The nozzle is also a bit short for my liking - the UM3X actually fits me better than the W3 does - and longer tips are required for me to maintain a seal. Combine that with the fact that the W3 is very sensitive to seal quality and overall comfort suffers somewhat as a result

Sound *(9.1/10)* – What first made me interested in the Westone 3 was just how polarizing the effects of its sound were on people. Few things are more exciting than getting to the bottom of just why a certain sound signature is controversial. Much like my beloved Audio-Technica CK10 and CK100, the Westone 3 had to be worth trying. In my time at head-fi I’ve heard the W3 described in every way imaginable – v-shaped and balanced, bassy and rolled-off, warm and neutral, accurate and muddy – the list goes on. Truth is, the W3 is all of those things - and none of them. Part of the problem is the housing design – the ‘tubby’ W3s really need a deep seal to sound their best but can put up one hell of a fight even with the included P-series Complys. Long tips are a must since the nozzle is short and improperly-angled. I ended up using large Ety trips off of my HF3, which made the W3 less comfortable but more consistent in sealing with my ear.

With the earphones properly sealed, the sound signature becomes fairly consistent. The bass has lots of weight – the W3 is easily the most bass-heavy armature-based earphone I’ve heard. Impact is on-par with the ATH-CK90Pro but the bass of the Westone 3 is more tactile and full-bodied. The UE TF10, another impactful triple-armature, sounds a bit more ‘punchy’ and has better depth than the W3 but lacks the sheer bass slam and volume of the Westones – the W3 is definitely ‘bassier’ in the conventional sense. It can be a little excessive, depending on track and personal preferences. There is a hint of mid/upper-bass bloat, making the W3 sound just a touch muddy compared to tight-and-fast dual armature models (CK10, DBA-02, q-JAYS, etc). Even Westone’s own W2 sounds cleaner in the lows, though it lacks the impact and body of the flagship. Worth noting is that a few decibels of equalization in the 100-150Hz range can really help level the W3 out while preserving the excellent depth and texture of the low end.

The midrange of the Westone 3 is very impressive when taken on its own merit but can often be overshadowed by the huge bass weight and treble energy of the earphones and the slight recession towards the upper mids does little to help matters. On the whole the midrange is not as thick and creamy as the mids of the UM3X and Earsonics SM3, focusing instead on detail and transparency. It can be just a touch warm on certain tracks but for the most part remains unaffected by the bass. It is also a bit dry but can get much closer to the ATH-CK10 in clarity than the UM3X, SM3, or even TF10. Like all of my Westones the W3 is also magical with female vocals – I don’t know what it is about Westone earphones but the W1, W2, and W3 all make the few vocal albums I have sound sublime. The W3 is quite a bit crisper than the W1 and W2, however, and gives guitars a bit more edge and bite than the lower-end models do.

The treble of the W3 often falls under harsh critique but I’m convinced that the difficulty of achieving the ideal seal with the earphones is undoubtedly a large part of the problem. With a mediocre seal the W3 can be painfully sibilant; with a good seal – mildly so. Only when I was able to get a proper, deep seal did the sibilance retreat far enough to become nearly unnoticeable. Even so, the W3 will accentuate whatever sibilance is present on the recording, not unlike the CK10 or even the higher-end Etys. It should be noted that Comply tips do their usual trick of muffling the treble slightly, which may actually be desirable with the W3 (in stark contrast to the UM3X or SM3). Smoothness aside, the high end of the earphones is crisp, detailed, and sparkly. The notes produced by the W3 can be a bit hard-edged, particularly next to a softer and gentler earphone such as the W2 or even UE TF10, but not over-defined to the point of sounding unnatural. Extension is merely good - despite the 3-way crossover design, the W3 doesn’t sound quite as limitless at the top as the CK10/CK100 or even RE0.

The difference in emphasis between bass, midrange, and treble in the Westone 3 really makes me think that the output of the three armatures was purposely mismatched for a bass- and treble-heavy sound – not necessarily a bad thing but it does make the W3 sound slightly less ‘blended’ than, say, the UM3X or CK100. Tonally, however, the W3 is pretty colorless – closer to what I would call ‘neutral’ than the UM3X or SM3, especially in the midrange. The presentation of the earphones is impressive as well. The soundstage is big – wider and deeper than that of the UM3X – and imaging is excellent. Separation is not quite up there with the UM3X or SM3 but the Westone 3 never sounds run-together in any way. Headstage, which is rarely talked about with IEMs, is impressive as well – just a touch poorer than with the CK10 but much less confined than with most in-ears. Interestingly, though the Westone 2 can portray distance better than the W3 can, the flagship still sounds bigger and more 3-dimensional. The same is true of the Earsonics SM3 but in reverse – the SM3 sounds more spacious and its soundstage is both taller and wider than that of the W3 despite the W3 being less intimate in presentation.

Finally, a word on usability: the Westone 3 is an extremely efficient earphone despite the mildly deceiving specifications. The UE TF10, which on paper is more sensitive, actually requires a good 15-20% more volume for me. As a result, there is a bit of hiss present when using the W3 with many portable players, especially the more powerful ‘audiophile’ ones such as the S:Flo2 and Cube C30. On the upside, there’s nearly no chance that the output of the W3 will be too low with any source.

Value *(7.5/10)* – As is often the case with high-end in-ears, the Westone 3 is tailored to a specific listening preference with its powerful bass, clear and dry midrange, and shimmery treble. There is much to like and (potentially) much to despise about it – those looking for the ‘safe’ choice would probably be better off with the TF10 or e-Q7. The W3 is not the nearly-flawless package that is the SM3 or the completely non-fatiguing UM3X but it is far more exciting and lively. Similarly to the TF10, it is the ‘wow’ factor that makes the Westone 3 special – listening to it is an intense, explosive experience. It is also a unique product in combining the sparkle, crispness, and clarity of more analytical earphones with body, note thickness, and weight. Naturally, getting the best out of the earphone requires a very good seal and can take some experimenting but fit & comfort aside the W3 is as good an all-rounder as any other earphone in its price bracket – just one with a very peculiar flavor.

*Pros: Impressive isolation, build quality, and accessory pack; good bass & soundstaging
Cons: Highly fit-dependent, not as balanced as many other multi-armature setups*

Big thanks to *HeadphoneAddict *for an extended loan of the Westone 3 that coincided perfectly with my brief stint owning the both the Westone 1 and 2


*(1C9) EarSonics SM3 (v1)*


Reviewed Dec 2010

Details: 3-way universal flagship from French audio firm Earsonics
Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP $399)
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _34Ω_ | Sens: _122 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size:_ 2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sensorcom bi-flanges, stock bi-flanges_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Bi-flange silicone tips, Comply foam tips (2 sizes), filter and tip cleaning tool, and hard zippered carrying case
Build Quality *(4/5)* – The lightweight shells are made of two plastic halves (one black, one clear) but don’t feel quite as sturdy as those of the Westone UM3X. The light multi-strand cables are twisted for extra strength and properly relieved both on housing entry and at the Y-split. A meaty 3.5mm L-plug completes the picture
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Quite good when longer tips are used
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Can only be worn over-the-ear so microphonics are nonexistent
Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings of the SM3 are about the same size as those of the UM3X but rear corners of the squared-off shells – a stark contrast to the smooth lines of the UM3X - can cause long-term discomfort for those with smaller ears. I ended up using longer tips and leaving the shells outside of my ears in order to wear the earphones for more than an hour at a time

Sound *(9.2/10)* – The Earsonics SM3 is a high-end three-way triple-driver stage monitor designed to compete directly with the Westone UM3X, an earphone that, while technically proficient, never really appealed to me on a personal level with its intimate presentation and viscous sound. Expectedly, the general signature of the SM3 is not too far off from the UM3X but it is the differences that make it a better consumer-class earphone in my view.

The bass of the SM3 isn’t all that different from that of the UM3X. It is generally deep and well-controlled – not as tight as with some of the leaner, more analytical earphones (e.g. CK10 & DBA-2) but definitely not loose. It is quick and well-weighted but always remains a bit soft in character. Across the range, but especially at the low end, the SM3 retains a roundness of note that reminds me of some of the higher-end dynamic-driver earphones I’ve heard as opposed to bass-happy armatures like the W3 and TF10, which generally have more immediate bass impact. The bass of the SM3 is not ruler-flat, rolling off slightly at the lowest of lows, and won’t satisfy a true basshead, but for me it is plentiful in quantity. Compared, for example, to the Westone 2, the low end of the SM3 manages to be crisper and more impactful at the same time – an impressive feat that shows off the optimization of the bass driver.

The midrange is most definitely the meat of the SM3’s sound signature. The earphones are slightly mid-forward but, unlike the UM3X, the SM3 doesn’t really ‘push’ its midrange on the listener. It has an uncanny ability to ‘center’ the vocalist in its headstage, seemingly escaping stereo separation almost completely, but at the same time avoids the somewhat excessive intimacy of the UM3X. The SM3 is generally only slightly warm in tone but can lean towards greater warmth, depending on source and track. The mids are smooth, sweet, lush, and full, with the same roundness of note as the low end. Transparency is good but not the best I’ve heard, and the same goes for the clarity – the SM3 simply isn’t lean enough to compete with the CK10 or DBA-02 on that front. Even the UE TF10 has slightly better clarity in the midrange than the SM3, though it sounds somewhat hollow and nasal next to the full and forward SM3. Detail retrieval is great but the microdetailing is again not as good as with the CK10 or DBA-02 because the SM3 just isn’t aggressive enough with presenting detail, occasionally requiring conscious effort to hear the minute details. Vocal timbre is excellent, however, even next to the Westone 2, which has some of the better vocal representation among the IEMs I own, with both earphones making the ATH-CK10 sound slightly metallic in comparison.

At the high end the SM3 is laid back and very smooth, again not unlike the UM3X. I do hear a bit more extension out of the SM3 but the difference isn’t great. The treble is neither particularly prominent nor notably deficient - there really is no frequency range in which the SM3 lacks presence - but could definitely use a bit more emphasis for my tastes. Don’t get me wrong - the treble of the SM3 is neither rolled off nor recessed – just not particularly aggressive. With a slightly different overall sound signature the treble would be perfectly adequate - there is even some sparkle to be had - but it’s quite easy to lose next to the buttery mids and healthy low end of the Earsonics. It should be noted that the detail of the SM3 is made all the more impressive by the lack of aggression in presenting it but critical listening with the SM3 will require some effort on the part of the listener, at least initially. As an aside, using Comply tips with the SM3 is not recommended as the tips seem to soak up what little sparkle and energy there is. Other than that there was little need to bother with tips, at least for me – the SM3 is not nearly as sensitive to tip selection as, say, the Westone 3 or UE TF10, which may be one of the reasons for the Earsonics being generally well-received.

Aside from a sound signature without any definite flaws, the biggest strength of the SM3 is undoubtedly its presentation. It is a fairly wide-sounding earphone – not the largest I’ve heard but clearly above average. I think that for a BA setup the soundstage of the SM3 is very close to being the perfect size, though it has taken me a while to figure out why. A massive stage works (more or less) for something like the Sennheiser IE8, with its huge bass and immense dynamic presence, but an armature-based earphone would sound thinner trying to fill all of that space. In addition, the soundstage of the IE8 has an ‘inner limit’, meaning that it seems to start some distance away from the listener, while the ability to accurately portray intimacy is one of the necessary hallmarks of good stage monitors like the SM3 and UM3X. The ‘front-and-center’ vocal presentation that the SM3 does so well simply wouldn’t work with a soundstage like that of the Sennheisers. The stage of the SM3 also has good depth and, surprisingly, decent height, though it is conceivable that the SM3 will sound too 3-dimensional to some. Indeed, the SM3 is almost artificially enveloping for an IEM and as a result acclimating to it can take longer than with most IEMs (the same is true for the Radius DDM, though for slightly different reasons). Personally, I feel that the soundstage of the SM3 would be easier to get accustomed to for those with minimal experience with higher-end earphones and more perplexing for those used to the presentation of other high-end IEMs.

Moving on, there are definitely earphones with more air than the SM3 but usually as a result of brighter and/or thinner sound. Separation is very good without seeming exaggerated as it can be with the Westone UM3X. Layering and imaging are both quite good – instruments take on the proper distance and direction cues and there is ample air around each. Within the confines of the SM3’s overly-enveloping soundstage the imaging is quite realistic. The dynamics are good as well – a necessity for proper presentation – but not the best I’ve heard. Compared head-to-head with the Monster MD, for example, the SM3 struggles to sound as soft or as powerful at the limits but comes respectably close.

The smooth and thick presentation, complete with slightly ‘rounded’ notes compared to many other BA-based earphones, is effortless, polished, and refined. The SM3 is non-fatiguing but accurate. It sounds less like a musician’s tool (a-la UM3X) and more like a consumer listening device that nevertheless remains true to source. I can’t call the SM3 exciting but at the same time it’s not an analytical earphone. I don’t consider the UM3X analytical, either, but its ‘dissection kit’ presentation can be too boring for much of my music. The SM3 takes the comfortable middle ground between the UM3X and uncompromisingly ‘fun’ earphones such as the TF10 and Westone 3. Like all of the other top-tier IEMs, the SM3 is still far from being all things to all people. However, it is much more difficult to hate than it is to like, helped in part by its consistency with different tips and sources. Overall, the SM3 is an extremely efficient earphone with just enough sensitivity headroom to avoid hissing like a snake with a poorly matched source. In my experience, experimenting with tips and amps brings about improvements that are marginal at best.

Value *(8/10)* – As an earphone that doesn't do a whole lot wrong, the SM3 is not unique, but it also seduces with its enveloping soundstage and thick, creamy midrange. Even those who do not value the flavour of the SM3 will find it (at worst) to be a decent top-tier universal while those who do like the signature will be in sonic paradise. On a personal note, while I belong to the former category, I have to say this in closing: there are songs in my music collection that I always skip – songs kept mostly for sentimental or nostalgic value – but with the SM3 I was forced to listen to them all the way through. This earphone is not the end of the road for me, but it may just be for many others.

*Pros: No microphonics; Smooth, liquid, and detailed sound; no real signature flaws; enveloping presentation
Cons: Angled housings lead to potential comfort issues*

Special thanks to *violinvirtuoso* for generously offering to lend me the SM3 and allowing me to put it through the full testing regimen.


*(1C10) JVC HA-FX700*


Reviewed Feb 2011

Details: JVC’s wooden in-ear flagship
Current Price: *$340* from seyo-shop.com (MSRP: $360)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _6-26k Hz_ | Cable: _2.6’ I-plug + 2.3’ L-plug extension_
Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _UE Single flanges_
Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), foam tips (2 sizes), 2.3’ (0.7m) extension cable, and protective magnetic-clasp carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The build of the FX700 is a fusion of beautifully-machined wood and various metal alloys. The earphones look and feel like a flagship product – I imagine the air of quality and sophistication surrounding the HA-FX700 is similar to JVC’s HA-DX1000 headphone. They are big, heavy, and flawless in craftsmanship. The rear port and nozzle are both protected by metal meshes and the cable entry point features a ¾”-long strain relief in addition to metal reinforcement. The cable itself is similar to the cords found on JVC’s lower-end products – soft, reasonably thick, and quite flexible. The 2.6’+2.3’ cable configuration is very annoying, however, as the cord is too short to be used without the extension and way too long with the extension added on
Isolation *(2/5)* – The FX700 is an open-back IEM and isolates slightly less than Sennheiser’s IE8 or Phiaton’s half in-ear designs
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Cable noise is extremely low when the FX700 is worn cord-down and nonexistent with over-the-ear fitment
Comfort *(4/5)* – The HA-FX700 boasts a familiar angled-nozzle design with a large driver hump near the front of the housing. Size-wise the JVCs are quite large – noticeably larger than Denon’s AH-C710s, which have a similar form factor. Still, the driver bulge provides a secure fit and the earphones are quite comfortable in the long run despite the heft

Sound *(9.1/10)* – Despite the misleading ‘HA-FX1000’ moniker given to the Japanese version of JVC’s previous wooden in-ear, the (newer) HA-FX700 is the definitely the company’s flagship earphone. The open-back design of the earphone pretty much guarantees poor isolation and since isolation translates almost directly to sound quality out in the real world, the FX700 only shows its true capabilities in quiet environments. Its lively and aggressive sound signature is not one commonly found among top-tier dynamic-driver IEMs but after an initial adjustment period, the FX700 leaves no doubt as to its standing among the best dynamics. As a general rule I am not a fan of the ‘ton of bass + ton of treble' approach to audio, which partially explains why I like the Monster Golds and Miles Davis Tributes better than the Coppers, but these JVCs sound incredibly natural and effortless.  That said, I still think that the FX700 sounds best at low volumes since the bass and treble both tend to become more dominant as the volume is increased.

The bass of the HA-FX700 has what is quite possibly the best balance of quantity and control in the IEM realm. Though it is clearly not as tight and quick as the bass on most of my BA-based earphones, it does sound quicker than that of the Monster MD or Sennheiser IE8. The response of the FX700 is also a bit more linear than that of the MD, though both have great depth and extension. The MD has slightly more rumble and bass power on the whole but the FX700 really doesn’t lack either. Due to the combination of speed and high impact, the bass of the FX700 is a little ‘aggressive’. As a result, it can be excessive for my liking – the FX700 could do with a more subbass-biased balance (a-la Hippo VB), which would make the lower midrange a little more neutral, but then it would be a different earphone.

Despite the aggressive bass, the midrange of the FX700 is cleaner and clearer than those of the Monster MD or Sennheiser IE8. It attempts to strike a balance between clear-and-detailed (a-la RE252) and the smoother, thicker sound of most high-end dynamics. The FX700 is still not a neutral earphone and there is definitely some warmth to the midrange, but it is more on-level with the Ortofon e-Q7 than the IE8/MD. Yes, most of the thinner-sounding high-end armatures still have the upper hand when it comes to clarity and microdetail, but it is amazing how close the (comparatively) gigantic dynamic drivers of the FX700 come to those levels of performance. In terms of balance, the midrange is not as aggressive as the bass or treble and has a tendency to become slightly subdued at higher volumes, which certainly preserves the spirit of the fun, ‘v-shaped’ earphone. However, on several occasions I ended up catching myself thinking that the pushy nature of the bass can be detrimental to the overall musical experience afforded by the JVCs. 

The timbre of the earphones is worthy of particular mention – I can’t make any claims as to whether the materials used in the construction of the housings have any effect on how they sound but the timbre of the FX700 is outstanding. As a result, the JVCs have some of the most realistic reproduction of stringed instruments I’ve heard out of an in-ear, adding to their excellent timbre the right amount of crispness, detail, and texture for the most minute nuances of string motion to be distinguished. Being an armature type of person, the only other higher-end dynamic I have on hand at the moment is the Sennheiser IE7, and next to the FX700 it is especially apparent how plasticky the IE7 actually sounds.

As hinted above, the treble of the FX700 is nearly as prominent as the bass. Though it is not harsh or sibilant except when necessary to remain faithful to the original recording, it is abundant in quantity and boasts plentiful sparkle and good clarity. Top-end extension is excellent and overall the treble reminds me more of the detailed and extended top end of the IE8 than the softer-sounding Monster MD or HiFiMan RE262. The sparkle of the FX700 makes it quite edgy for a dynamic-driver earphone, but given the choice between the overly-exciting top end of the FX700 and the slightly boring treble of the RE262, I see myself going for the JVCs every time.
Similarly interesting is the presentation of the FX700 – though the JVCs don’t have the out-of-the-head feel of the IE8, soundstaging doesn’t leave a whole lot to be desired. Soundstage width is good but the depth and layering are superb, resulting in accurate portrayal of both distance and intimacy. The impressive imaging gives the earphones an immersive overall feel, though I still feel that, as with most IEMs, the soundstage of the FX700 is slightly elliptical in nature, i.e. lacking just a bit of front-to-rear and top-to-bottom positioning. 

Value *(8/10)* – Like the earphone’s aesthetics and construction quality, the sound of the JVC HA-FX700s is unique and substantial. The JVCs easily run side by side with the other top-tier dynamics in technical proficiency and, on several counts, come out ahead of the field. The drivers JVC used in the FX700 are extremely impressive and manage to shrug off tracks of any complexity, never sounding strained or overwhelmed. The HA-FX700 is, at long last, a high-end dynamic-driver earphone for those who prefer lively and aggressive ‘v-shaped’ sound to the softer, warmer signatures of the IE8/Monster MD/RE262/MTPG. When it comes to practicality, the value of the FX700 is more questionable – for an IEM the FX700 isolates very little and can become fatiguing if the volume is raised significantly to compensate. If ever there was a top-tier earphone for home use, this is it, but out in the real world the FX700’s competitors may win the fight without throwing a punch.

*Pros: Impossibly dynamic and articulate sound; natural and involving presentation; great build quality; nearly no microphonics
Cons: Sub-par isolation; odd cable length; can be slightly fatiguing at higher volumes*

Once again huge thanks to *Inks* for loaning me his FX700 for review



*(1C11) Radius HP-TWF21*


Reviewed Mar 2011

Details: Radius’s follow-up to the world’s first dual-dynamic driver earphone
Current Price: N/A (discontinued; price as tested *$250*) (MSRP: $298)
Specs: Driver: _Dual Dynamic_ | Imp: _24 Ω_ | Sens: _107 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ I-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_
Wear Style: _Straight down_

Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Silicone single-flange tips (6 pairs), cleaning cloth, L-plug adapter, and hard clamshell carrying case with removable cord winder
Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Overall build quality is very similar to the old DDM – the housings are completely plastic and the cord is nylon-sheathed for durability. The thin-stem design of the TWF21 does mean that the earphones probably won’t survive being stepped on the way higher-end Audio-Technica or Ortofon models might but for general use they should last if treated well. The nylon-sheathed cable is flexible and tangle-resistant and features a sliding rubber cinch. The metal-jacketed 3.5mm I-plug has a short rubber strain relief, same as the original DDM
Isolation *(2/5)* – Being a half-in-ear design with a rear vent, the TWF21 really doesn’t isolate much more than the original DDM did
Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Less bothersome than with the original DDM but exacerbated by the fact that the TWF21 is very difficult to wear cord-up
Comfort *(4/5)* – With my average-sized ears, the fit of the new Radius is much more pleasant than that of the old earphone. The earbud-like design is reminiscent of the mid-range Phiaton models and Audio-Technica’s CKS series and fits perfectly into my outer ear. I especially like the way the cable exit point is positioned away from the antitragus – makes the earphones very comfortable for prolonged listening sessions. However, as is usually the case with earbud-style IEMs, over-the-ear wear without swapping channels is nearly impossible. I do also wish a larger selection of tips was included but other than that I have absolutely no problems with the fit

Sound *(8.8/10)* – The promotional materials for the new Radius claim that the earphone has been “carefully tuned” to provide more modest lows and clearer highs compared to the TWF11. Both of these claims are true to a degree but there is no mistaking the TWF21 for an analytical earphone. The bass, for one, is still quite heavy-handed. Low end extension is very good, competing with the likes of the Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Future Sonics Atrio. Sub-bass rumble is likewise plentiful and there should be enough impact for all but the most unreasonable bass lovers. It is only the lack of a pronounced mid-bass hump that keeps the TWF21 from become a total bass monster. The reasonably level bass prevents the low end from becoming dominant over the rest of the signature unless called on by the recording. For an earphone with such impressive bass presence, the TWF21 is surprisingly soft-footed and polite with most of my test tracks – a far cry from the aggressive, hard-hitting bass of earphones like the Fischer Audio Eterna. It is not the sprightliest of earphones but it performed better than I expected with the Exaile album I’ve been listening to lately. At the same time, the attack and decay times are natural enough for realistic portrayal of the instruments in my classical and jazz recordings.

Because the bass of the TWF21 is so linear, midrange bleed is fairly low even next to the other top-tier bass-heavy dynamics. The midrange is warm, smooth, and slightly thick. To my ears it is neither forward nor recessed but otherwise reminds me of the HiFiMan RE262. Not a bad job by Radius as the 262 is one of the most technically capable dynamic-driver earphones I’ve ever heard. Detail and clarity are likewise very close to those of the best dynamics. Like that of the original DDM, the midrange of the TWF21 is fluid and oddly delicate. It is not as transparent as that of the Yuin OK1 or certain BA-based earphones but doesn’t lag too far behind, either. The treble, similarly, is smooth and polite. Like the original DDM, the TWF21 is quite laid-back at the top and leans towards the darker side of things when it comes to tone. Comparatively speaking, I feel that the TWF21 has just a bit more treble presence than the TWF11 but still lacks the effortlessness and extension of the Sennheiser IE8 or RE262. Similarly, the treble crispness and energy characteristic of many armature-based earphones is nowhere to be found. The detail, for the most part, is still there but it is presented softly and unassumingly. As a result, I’ve found myself turning the volume up a little higher than usual on a number of occasions.

The presentation of the TWF21 is spacious and engrossing. Personally, I think presentation is where the new and old Radius models most differ. Since I switch earphones very often, I never quite managed to get used to the way the original DDM presented music – the oddly intimate feel despite the out-of-the-head soundstage, combined with the thickness and sweetness of the earphones, never really worked right away when switching to the DDM from any other earphone. No such problems with the TWF21 – the soundstage is still just as wide and deep as that of the old earphone but is no harder to get used to than that of my Sennheiser IE7 or Xears TD-III. Actually, the presentations of the TWF21 and TD-III share several characteristics aside from large size – both earphones are a bit happier presenting intimacy than distance and neither has the pinpoint-accurate positioning of a high-end BA-based earphone such as the ATH-CK10 or Westone 4. Similarly, both earphones fare better than average when it comes to dynamics and accurate portrayal of timbre; in the case of the TWF21 – significantly better than average. Lastly, the TWF21 does like being given a bit of extra juice. Depending on the source and/or amp used, giving the DDM some leeway in available power can make it sound more dynamic, more fluid, and even more detailed. Not a night-and-day difference, but it is noticeable.

Value *(6.5/10)* – Considering the overwhelmingly positive reception of the sound of the original DDM, it is no surprise that the signature of the new Radius HP-TWF21 strays little from that of its predecessor. There are minor tweaks to the bass and treble but the biggest difference for me is in the presentation – the original DDM really took a bit of getting used to but the new one consistently puts a smile on my face within the first few minutes of listening. Similarly, while the day-to-day usability of the original Radius DDM was at best a mixed bag, the new earphone is easier to live with. The isolation and build quality have not undergone significant improvement but the new earbud-style housings fit me much better and the cable noise is less noticeable. Whether the improvements are worth the extra ~$120 over the TWF11 is a personal choice but for those who, like me, were never quite happy with the fit of the original, the revision brings about a welcome leveling of sound quality and functionality - not a bad deal at all considering how well the W-series earphones perform to start with.

*Pros: Oh-so-beautiful sound, very nice carrying case, comfortable half-in-ear form factor
Cons: Mediocre isolation, significantly pricier than TWF11 PRO model*


For a full review of the TWF21 with better photos see here


*(1C12) Ortofon e-Q5*


Reviewed Apr 2011

Details: Second in-ear earphone from well-known cartridge maker Ortofon
Current Price: *$288* from musicaacoustics.com (MSRP: ~$290)
Specs: Driver:_ Moving Armature_ | Imp: _40Ω_ | Sens: _117 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable:_ 4’ I-plug_
Nozzle Size:_ 4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid_
Wear Style: _*Straight down *or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips, filter changing kit with two pairs of spare filters, filter cleaning tool, and ‘tin can’ storage case
Build Quality *(4/5)* – Weighty aluminum shells with rubber strain reliefs feel rather solid. The cabling has been improved over the e-Q7, with the nylon sheath below the y-split replaced by thick and flexible plastic cabling reminiscent of the stellar CK10 cord and a new, flexible strain relief on the 3.5mm plug. There is still no cable cinch and no external strain relief on the shells but as a total package the build of the e-Q5 easily keeps up with that of its predecessor
Isolation* (3.5/5)* – The nozzle is still short and deep insertion is only possible with longer tips but isolation is nevertheless impressive
Microphonics* (4/5)* – The flexible cable of the e-Q5 makes them a bit easier to wear over-the-ear (compared to the e-Q7) despite the odd design but microphonics are still quite good even with cable-down fitment
Comfort *(4/5)* – For those with smaller ears the short nozzles and wide housings of the e-Q5 may be uncomfortable but I found them surprisingly inoffensive even over longer listening sessions. I’d still like a set of cable guides or at least a cable cinch to be included but for everyday use they are quite convenient

Sound *(9.1/10)* – Ortofon’s first attempt at implementing a moving armature transducer – the e-Q7 – laid down the foundation for the other MA earphones released thus far. However, while it is an excellent performer overall, the e-Q7 never really appealed to me personally with its slightly mid-centric sound and laid-back treble presentation. Enter the e-Q5, Ortofon’s second in-ear and the least expensive moving armature earphone on the market. Despite its many sonic resemblances to the e-Q7, the e-Q5 provides a more neutral and balanced sound, acting to bridge the gap between the e-Q7 and earphones such as the brighter, more fluid-sounding dual-BA ATH-CK10.

Cliché as it sounds, one thing can be said with certainty about the bass of the e-Q5 – the apple has not fallen far from the tree. The low end presentation of the e-Q5, like that of its predecessor, is very well-rounded. Like the e-Q7, the e-Q5 can be mistaken for a very clean-sounding dynamic-driver earphone when it comes to bass performance. Unlike the e-Q7, the e-Q5 does not emphasize the lower half of its frequency spectrum more than the upper half, which gives the bass a slightly less prominent role in the overall sound. Still, the low end boasts impressive extension and can hardly be said to lack body. Texture and detail levels are very high and the bass is punchy enough to compete with almost all BAs and many of the more analytical-sounding dynamics in impact. On the whole, the low end of the e-Q5 is quick and resolving, yet natural, again striking a good balance between stereotypical armature and dynamic-driver bass.

The mids of the e-Q5 take a more noticeable detour from those of the e-Q7 than does the low end, trading some of the midrange focus of the older model for slightly better balance and a more neutral overall tone. The characteristic thickness of the e-Q7 drops off a bit as well, though the mids of the e-Q5 are still a touch more weighty than those of the ATH-CK10 or UE700 and retain most of the e-Q7’s organic richness. A slight predisposition towards warmth is also still present with the e-Q5 but on the whole the midrange is smooth, refined, and transparent. The note presentation of the e-Q5 is slightly on the soft and gentle side, which results in less aggressive detailing compared to something like the ATH-CK10. In fact, I think the e-Q5 is a bit too smooth on the microscopic level in the midrange and treble, which is why it yields even to the dynamic-driver GR07 ever so slightly when it comes to texture and microdetail.

Compared to that of the e-Q7, the treble of the e-Q5 is more extended and more energetic, making the whole signature lightweight and airy. It is more forward than with the e-Q7 but still retains the softness and refinement of the midrange. Minimal sibilance is noticeable with a handful of tracks but for the most part it is free of any grain or harshness. Detail and clarity are very impressive and there is a fair amount of sparkle to be found. The presentation is altogether not too different from that of the e-Q7 - the air added by the treble definitely plays a role but even with a more e-Q7-like balance, the excellent separation of the earphones would have been noteworthy. The soundstage is spacious and well-rounded. Positioning is fairly precise and the overall presentation is quite convincing – easily on-par with most similarly-priced BA-based and dynamic sets.

Value *(8.5/10) *– With the e-Q5 the folks at Ortofon have taken a stab at refining an already-competent performer in accordance with customer complaints - out with the fancy packaging and noisy cable of the e-Q7; in with a lower price tag and more balanced sound signature. However, to say that it is an improvement in sound quality over the e-Q7 would be a mistake - for a warmer, more mid-centric sound with excellent texture, the e-Q7 is still the earphone to beat. For me, however, the e-Q5 has both superior practicality and the more appealing sound signature of the two.

*Pros: Very refined, detailed, and balanced sound; better cable than pricier e-Q7 model
Cons: No cord cinch, no carrying case, fit issues possible for those with small ears*



*(1C13) j-phonic K2 SP*


Reviewed Nov 2011

Details: customizable universal in-ear from a branch of customs manufacturer Sensaphonics
Current Price: *$399* from j-phonic.com (MSRP: $399)
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _27Ω _| Sens:_ 109 dB_ | Freq: _20-16k Hz_ | Cable:_ varies_
Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _*Comply foams (stock)*, Shure Olives_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Comply T100 foam tips (6 sets in 3 sizes), shirt clip, cleaning tool, and Pelican 1010 water resistant carrying case with carabiner
Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The housings are made out of plastic but seem to have been built for strength and lightness above all else. Nozzles and cable entry points are reinforced and the cable is smooth and strong, twisted below the beefy y-split and terminated in one of three lengths with either an I-plug or an L-plug. The lightweight ‘memory wire’ section doesn’t have much memory but also doesn’t get in the way
Isolation *(4/5)* – Very high due to the fully-sealed, ergonomic shells and foam tips
Microphonics* (5/5)* – Nonexistent
Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The ergonomic shells are slim and very lightweight, reminding me of the lower-end Westone earphones except that the notched nozzle places the eartips further inside the ear canal. The shell may be a little too long for smaller ears but with proper insertion depth it should fit most very comfortably. The soft memory wire works well, unlike what Sony’s EX-series monitors use

Sound *(9.2/10)* – Billed as a custom monitor in a universal shell, the j-phonic K2 SP is tuned to deliver reference-level sound quality at a more reasonable price and in a more versatile form factor. Its sound differs from conventional stage monitors offered by Westone and Earsonics and slightly less so from flat-response reference sets such as the Etymotic ER4S. The K2 SP is borderline analytical in signature and presentation, and yet its bass offers up power and depth more akin to the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07. The low end effortlessly combines the cleanliness of a TWFK-based earphone with the power of a beefy dedicated bass driver. It is not quite as bassy as the Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X, but the low end performs brilliantly overall.

On a technical level there is not much to fault with the lows of the K2 SP – mild sub-bass roll-off aside, it’s got fantastic resolution and articulation, surprisingly realistic note weight, and very good speed. Not only is the low end extremely detailed as a result, it makes some dynamic-driver sets sound underpowered. The bass of the HiFiMan RE272, for example, despite being quick and detailed, simply sounds weak, veiled, and lacking in rumble next to the K2 SP. Compared to the Etymotic ER4S, too, the low end of the K2 SP is significantly deeper, fuller, and more prominent. Of all my current monitors, the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07 is closest to the K2 SP in punch and bass balance, though the softer note presentation makes the GR07 sound a touch fuller, and bassier on some tracks as a result. The K2 is disadvantaged only by the inability to move a whole lot of air – for example it will never sound as fleshed-out and dynamic as the consumer-oriented Sony EX1000 with its 16mm dynamic driver.

The midrange of the K2 SP offers up top-notch clarity and detail, coming across resolving and controlled but at the same time very crisp and edgy. The notes are not smoothed out in the least, causing the j-phonics to sound a bit raw and dry next to the HiFiMan RE272 and ATH-CK10. The clarity keeps up with the ATH-CK10 and ER4S but the note weight of the K2 makes the other analytical earphones sound lean, and yet there is still enough crispness to make sets like the ACS T15 and VSonic GR07 sound slightly fuzzy in comparison. Balance-wise, the midrange of the K2 SP is a touch forward – more present than that of the CK10, for example – and picks up a little towards the top, in contrast to the CK10’s flatter mids. As a result, the K2 sounds a touch brighter up until the treble peakiness of the CK10 comes into play.

The treble of the j-phonics is sparkly and extended, not lacking in emphasis by any means but flatter than that of the CK10. It is clean and clear, never getting smeared, but also integrates into the soundscape better than the slightly splashy, hot highs of the CK10. The K2 is not a forgiving earphone, however, and will point out any flaws in the equipment chain or original recording. Its aggressive nature also will not stop it sounding too clinical for some listeners, and it’s worth noting that it only performs at its best with foam tips, such as the included Complys.

The presentation is perhaps the most underwhelming part of the K2’s sound. The soundstage is very slightly above average in size – hardly congested, but far from spacious. It is well-rounded and engaging but simply doesn’t sound as open and airy as the Sony EX1000, HiFiMan RE272, or even VSonic GR07. Instrument separation, however, is easily on the studio monitor level and the K2 can almost match the imaging of the CK10. It sounds more layered than the Ety ER4S but just isn’t for those expecting an IE8 or EX1000-like headstage. Then again, I don’t see why reference earphones should be expected to have the presentation of a consumer-class earphone. Another reason why the K2 SP isn’t a great pick-up-and-go consumer earphone – it’s got a tendency to pick up hiss and electronic noise so don’t expect it to mesh well with the average smartphone or laptop. A solid audio chain or at the very least a decent dedicated audio player or external DAC will make the j-phonics shine.

Value *(8/10) *– The K2 SP is a purpose-built reference monitor and works wonderfully in that respect. It is solidly constructed, ergonomic, and very user-friendly – exactly what an audio professional would want from a universal in-ear monitor. The sound it produces is clear, detailed, and well-separated, with excellent presence across the spectrum. It is very well-rounded technically but the signature will be far from ideal for many listeners. Those looking for warm and organic, or airy and open can pretty much forget about the K2. It sounds a bit cold and bright compared to stage monitors from Westone and Earsonics, as well as ‘concentrated’ – though not congested – due to a slightly aggressive presentation and average headstage size. Non-analytical listeners might find it a bit lifeless for music, which presumably is what the alternative MX tuning was designed to cover. The K2’s requiring a clean audio source also bears repeating in this age of staticky smartphones and noisy computer audio. That said, those who have their audio chain figured out and are after a reference earphone will be hard pressed to do better than the K2 in any respect.

*Pros: Comfortable, well-built, highly isolating; easily one of the best reference earphones on the market; several customization options
Cons: Not well-suited for casual listeners*



*(1C14) Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200*


Reviewed Dec 2011

Details: Dual-driver custom from Florida-based Clear Tune Monitors
Current Price: est. *$350* from cleartunemonitors.com (MSRP: est. $350)
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _17.5Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _20-15.5k Hz_ | Cable: _4.6’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: N/A | Preferred tips: N/A
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Velvet storage/carrying case and cleaning tool
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The CTM-200 utilizes a two-way, dual-bore setup with a Knowles CI-22955 and ED-23619 in each earpiece. The build is good – the exterior of the acrylic shells is clean and free of scratches, with a bit of bubbling on the inside but fantastically clear faceplates. The earphones set themselves apart from the similarly-priced 1964EARS 1964-T by the careful finish of the bores and cable sockets and look more polished than the cheaper Kozee X1 as well. Eighteen color options are available; custom artwork and two-tone schemes for the shells and faceplates each command very a reasonable $25 premium. The cable uses a Westone-size socket and a slightly raised connector
Isolation *(4/5) *– The isolation provided by the fitted acrylic shells is excellent -slightly below what the higher-end Etymotic Research earphones are capable of with foam or tri-flange tips but higher than that of the ergonomic monitors from Westone and EarSonics
Microphonics* (5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent, as is the case with all of the custom monitors I’ve come across
Comfort *(5/5)* – Putting the customs in requires a bit of getting used to but the twisting motion eventually becomes second nature. The acrylic shells are hard but not in the least uncomfortable when fitted correctly. The fit of the CTM-200 depends on the quality of the initial impressions and skill of the person making the monitors. If the earphones remain even a tiny bit uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a re-fit is probably a good idea. CTM allows refits for an extremely generous 120 days. There is added cost with shipping the monitors back and, if necessary, getting new impressions but on the whole a perfect fit is well worth the trouble

Sound *(9.3/10) *– The CTM-200 is billed as a low-cost option for professional musicians and discerning listeners alike. I have no issues with that claim - the sound signature is even enough for it to be used as a reference monitor but at the same time the presentation is fluid and natural, lacking the analytical edge and excessive separation that can interfere with musicality. The bass is only mildly rolled off at the very bottom, otherwise coming across controlled and level. Overall bass quantity is medium, very close to what I would consider ‘neutral’. The mid-bass boost of the similarly-priced 1964EARS 1964-T is nowhere to be found, with the bass of the CTM-200 coming out a touch cleaner and better-defined as a result. The CTM is a little less dynamic and not quite as capable as the 1964-T of belting out the low notes but the gain in resolution will be worth it for many listeners. Compared to the j-phonic K2 SP, the bass of the CTM-200 is similar in quantity but with a greater sensation of impact, likely due to the larger contact area of the custom shell, while the speed and depth are a touch lower. The dynamic-driver VSonic GR07 is also around the same level in terms of bass quantity but has a bit more body and thickness at the expense of detail and resolution.

The midrange transition is smooth and seamless, with zero bleed. Most obvious is just how good the crossover is – the CTM-200 causes the 1964-T to sound concentrated and slightly congested in the midrange, as if there are too many drivers doing the same job. Neither sounds disjointed but the CTM is simply more smooth and relaxed. The mids are less forward than those of the 1964-T but they are by no means recessed. Between the other reasonably well-balanced in-ears, the Audio-Technica CK10 has slightly less midrange presence and the j-phonic K2 SP has slightly more, largely due to its aggressive presentation. Good balance aside, the CTM-200 is also liquid and transparent, not at all dry as the 1964-T tends to be but also slightly less textured and not as aggressively-detailed. The clarity is excellent, note thickness is good, and the tone is very neutral – the K2 SP might sound a touch crisper but it is brighter and thinner-sounding. As a result, the j-phonics come across edgier and more analytical while the CTM-200 is smoother and more organic.

Similarly to the midrange, the treble of the CTM-200 is smooth and non-fatiguing, as it should be with a good monitor. It is clean and clear but those looking for an analytical edge will be disappointed. There is a touch more sparkle compared to the 1964-T but the tuning leans on the safe side on the whole – the VSonic GR07, for example, is noticeably less smooth and tends to accentuate sibilance far more than the CTM-200 does. The ATH-CK10, too, sounds hotter with its treble peak and even the 1964-T is not quite as soft and easy-going despite having slightly more laid-back treble on the whole. Top-end extension is about on-par with the CK10 – some earphones do better but many armature-based sets do worse.

The soundstage of the CTM-200 is rather spacious and the overall sound is big and airy. Whereas the 1964-T is intimate in presentation and has good centering ability, the CTM-200 is well-separated and more diffuse. At times it makes the 1964-T sound downright congested. More interestingly, the headstage is wider than just about anything in my collection. The GR07, RE272 and CK10, while well-rounded in terms of sonic space, fall short of the width of the CTM-200 and the decidedly less spacious K2 SP and 1964-T don’t stand a chance. Those looking for a more 3-dimensional space a-la Earsonics SM3 may be disappointing and the imaging would probably be a little less vague if the headstage wasn’t so big and the dynamics were better but the CTM-200 still performs admirably on all counts.

Lastly, since someone is certainly going to ask, I thought I would compare the CTM-200 to the Unique Melody Miracle. The 3-way, 6-driver, $929 flagship from China-based Unique Melody is not tuned as a reference monitor but it is still my sole benchmark for what a top-tier custom is capable of on a technical level. Keep in mind that the fairness of a comparison between two IEMs so different in purpose and price is dubious at best.

The sound signature of the Miracle is very slightly v-shaped, which means that the midrange of the CTM-200 is more prominent in comparison and the bass and treble are more relaxed. The lows of the Miracle are much more powerful – deeper, thicker, weightier. Impact is more tactile and the bass has rumble to go with its punch. In the midrange the Miracle is again thicker, smoother, and more fluid. Clarity levels are similar but the Miracle is still the more resolving and refined earphone. It is also more dynamic, which has an effect not only on fidelity but also on imaging and positioning. The sonic space of the Miracle is easily more well-rounded and more 3-dimensional while the CTM-200 has a slight upper hand in soundstage width and stereo separation.

Value* (9/10) *– The dual-BA setup used by the CTM-200 is hardly revolutionary but the sound produced by the entry-level custom is excellent. At $350 excluding shipping, impressions, and extras, the CTM-200 is no pricier than many high-end universals but offers the isolation, fit, and customization options of a full-shell custom monitor. The finish is very good compared to the other entry-level customs in my possession and the sound is balanced and spacious. It is not for fans of the dry, overly crisp note presentation of analytical earphones, nor does it have the excessive lushness of certain stage monitors. Instead, the CTM-200 sounds soft and natural, with clarity and detail expected of a BA-based earphone in its price range and a presentation to match. I have been quite impressed with it, and anyone else looking for a balanced monitor in the price range should be as well.

*Pros: Very balanced, neutral, and spacious sound; good build quality; excellent long-term comfort
Cons: Correct insertion takes some getting used to; less isolating than silicone-shelled customs*

For my full review of the CTM-200 please see here


*(1C15) Sony XBA-4SL / XBA-4ip*


Reviewed Mar 2012

Details: Quad-driver flagship of Sony’s BA line
Current Price:* $350* from amazon.com (MSRP: $349.99); $370 for XBA-4iP with microphone
Specs: Driver: _Quad BA_ | Imp: _8Ω_ | Sens: 108 dB | Freq: _3-28k Hz_ | Cable: _2' I-plug j-cord + 3’ L-plug extension_
Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid (stock), Monster Supertips_
Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

Accessories* (4/5)* – Sony Hybrid silicone tips (4 sizes), Hybrid silicone+foam tips (3 sizes), 3’ extension cable, cable winder, and magnetic clasp carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The housings are made out of plastic but feel well put-together. The cables are slightly flattened in cross section and have very flexible strain reliefs all around.
Isolation* (3/5) *– Quite decent with the ergonomic but shallow-fitting shells Microphonics (4.5/5) - Very low when worn cable-down; nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
Comfort *(4/5) *– The housings are rather large but nicely designed for a vertical fit a-la JVC FXT90 or Fischer Audio Tandem. The ergonomic nozzle angle helps, as do the smooth surface and rounded edges of the housings. Over-the-ear wear is possible but may require longer eartips than those provided

Sound *(8.9/10)* – While Sony’s EX-series dynamic earphones are marketed partly for professional use, the armature sets are clearly oriented towards consumers. This shows through not only in the simplicity of the design – no detachable cables or over-the-ear fitment with any of the XBA models – but also the colored sound of the quad-driver flagship. It is an unlikely role reversal, made all the more interesting by the design of the XBA-4. With an 8-ohm impedance, it is a picky earphone when it comes to source matching – more so even than the 8-ohm Clarity One from Puresound - and sounds downright poor with some audio players, such as an iPod Touch 4G. It sounds much better from a source with low output impedance – such as a Sansa Clip – and better yet from a dedicated source such as my iBasso D10. Surprisingly, despite the relatively high rated sensitivity, the XBA-4 isn’t overly revealing of hiss and other background noises.

When finally matched to a proper source, the bass of the XBA-4 is powerful and full-bodied – far ahead of most armature-based sets in quantity. It is extended and effortless, with no major mid-bass lift and a note presentation leaning towards ‘soft’, rather than ‘crisp’. The bass doesn’t sound as precise as a TWFK-based earphone, and personally I really would prefer cleaner bass from an armature-based earphone, but again I don’t think Sony had accuracy in mind when tuning these. Even next to the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07, the XBA-4 sounds a little warmer and bassier. The armature-based j-Phonic K2 SP, on the other hand, is quicker, tighter, cleaner, and more detailed, with slightly less mid-bass emphasis and fullness but similar depth and punch.

The midrange of the XBA-4 is slightly recessed compared to the bass but there is no bleed and it doesn’t sound overly distant next to other earphones with laid-back presentations, such as the GR07. Despite the lack of bass bleed, the mids of the XBA-4 sound just a touch dark and appear muffled – even veiled- next to clarity-focused earphones such as the K2 SP, the similarly-priced custom ClearTune CTM-200, and – to a more limited extent - the GR07. Even vocals noticeably lack intelligibility next to the K2 SP, CTM-200, and all TWFK-based earphones. Detail and texture levels are quite good, however - on-par with the GR07 but more impressive coupled with the smoother sound of the Sonys.

At the top end the XBA-4 has some of that characteristic Sony unevenness, exaggerating the lower treble slightly as the EX-series monitors tend to do. The XBA-4 does not sound nearly as bright, however, and avoids the mild tendency to exaggerate sibilance that can be present in both the EX600 and the GR07. Unfortunately the top end of the XBA-4 does have a metallic tinge to it that is not present in the dynamic monitors. It wasn’t too noticeable in general listening but those hoping for EX1000-like timbre will be disappointed. Treble extension is moderate and the XBA-4 doesn’t have great air despite a sizeable soundstage.

The presentation of the XBA-4 is wide and spacious without losing versatility of positioning. Width is similar to the VSonic GR07 but the XBA-4 has better layering for a more 3-D feel. It is adept at conveying both distance and intimacy and ranks above average in headstage size among armature-based IEMs. It’s still not nearly as spacious as the CTM-200 or a Sennheiser IE8 but matches the ATH-CK10 and j-Phonic K2 SP, which is more than I can say for high-end sets from Shure or Westone. It has good separation, too, but there are issues with how it is achieved. With many tracks the XBA-4 very obviously lacks coherence, especially at higher volumes, and sounds downright disjointed compared to single-driver sets such as the GR07. Many are of the opinion that all multi-BA setups sound incoherent but compared to the XBA-4 all of my TWFK-based sets as well as the K2 SP and CTM-200 sound extremely well-integrated. The individualized outputs of the four drivers do enhance the sense of separation, but I can’t help but feel that the single-driver XBA-1 may sound more natural than the quad.

Value *(6.5/10)* – Sony’s entire new series of BA-based monitors is interesting for several reasons, including the in-house development of the drivers and the consumer-oriented tuning of the earphones. The flagship XBA-4 uses a quad-driver setup with dual dedicated woofers and impresses with its spacious presentation as well as the depth and effortlessness of its low end. Unfortunately, Sony seems to have used extra drivers more as an equalizer than a way of creating a true multi-way system. The differences in voicing between the drivers color the sound and seem to decrease the overall coherence. Still, even if the performance does not stand up to close scrutiny as well as that of the dynamic-driver EX1000, the smooth and powerful sound of the XBA-4 will find fans among those who frown on the more analytical tendencies of so many other BAs.

*Pros: User-friendly BA-based set with good bass
Cons: Not a great performer compared to Sony’s dynamic monitors*

Big thanks to *mascareiro* for the XBA-4 loan


*(1C16) Monster Miles Davis Trumpet*


Reviewed June 2012

Details: Trumpet-shaped follow-up to the original Miles Davis Tribute
Current Price: *$270* from amazon.com (MSRP: $349.95)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _6mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges, Yamaha EPH-100 tips_
Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

Accessories* (4.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Foam tips (5 sizes), Monster supertips (4 sizes), buttoned carrying case, soft carrying pouch, and shirt clip
Build Quality *(4/5) *– Styled to look like miniature trumpets, the unique housings are much sturdier than they look. The attention to detail is superb – the 3-button Apple remote modeled after a trumpet’s valves alone is a work of art. The only worry is the lack of flexible strain relief on the soft, tangle-resistant flat cable. Driver flex is nonexistent – a huge improvement over Monster’s other in-ears. Additionally, Monster’s lifetime warranty is still in effect for the Trumpets, although the one-time no-questions-asked replacement provision seems to have disappeared
Isolation *(3.5/5) *- Good with the right eartips
Microphonics* (3.5/5) *– Bothersome when worn cord-down; low otherwise
Comfort *(4.5/5)* – Since the dynamic micro-driver is mounted inside the nozzle, those with narrow ear canals may want to give these a pass but for everyone else the tiny, lightweight shells should be ergonomic and unobtrusive. My own ear canals are deep enough for these to be slept in comfortably and the Miles Davis plaques on the cords don’t cause any issues with over-the-ear wear

Sound *(8.9/10) *– The Trumpet is Monster’s follow-up to the Miles Davis Tribute (review 1C7) and the company’s first earphone utilizing a dynamic microdriver. Previously seen only in mid-level products, microdrivers have recently made their way into the very impressive Yamaha EPH-100 and JVC FXT90, and the Trumpet follows suit with sound that easily vaults it to the top of Monster’s lineup.

Considering that the Trumpet is a Monster product, it comes as no surprise that its bass is enhanced – both depth and impact outpace the Yamaha EPH-100 slightly and the VSonic GR07 and Sony MDR-EX600 significantly. There is good sub-bass extension but also moderate mid-bass lift, which causes the low end to sound much fuller and slightly more bloated than that of the GR07 or the bassy but BA-based Klipsch Image X10. Admittedly, the Trumpet is not as bassy as the older MD Tribute, with a low end that is less intrusive and more capable of scaling down when necessary, greatly reducing boominess and midrange bleed. The Sennheiser IE7, which has similar bass quantity, also falls short of the Trumpets in control, detail, and texture.

The midrange of the Trumpet boasts good clarity and detail but lacks the emphasis of the low end. The Yamaha EPH-100, while similar in technical performance, offers more forward mids, resulting in better bass-midrange balance, and is slightly clearer of bass bleed as a result. The GR07, too, is flatter, cooler in tone, and more accurate than the Trumpet. That said, the Trumpet is arguably the most nuanced and refined earphone in Monster’s entire lineup and again not nearly as thick and lush-sounding as the older MD Tribute.

The emphasized treble of the Trumpet completes the mildly v-shaped sound signature, causing them to sound brighter than the MD Tribute and Monster’s Turbine models. The emphasis is sufficient to make the Trumpets more tiring in the long run compared to a Turbine Pro but not heavy enough to introduce harshness or sibilance. In fact, the Trumpets tend to be less ‘hot’ on touchy recordings than the GR07 while remaining extremely crisp and clean, with no excessive note sustainment and good extension.

The presentation is wide, providing a large sonic space and good separation. Soundstage depth is good, as are the dynamics, and the Trumpet tends to sound less intimate than the older Tributes. The GR07, admittedly, has a wider, more out-of-the-head presentation with a bit more air. The Sennheiser IE7 also has a larger presentation as well as a better center image but doesn’t have the detail or dynamics of the Trumpet, resulting in a less nuanced and layered sound. On the whole the Trumpet avoids extremes with both its sound signature and presentation, and only sounds better for it.

Value *(8/10)* – Monster’s Miles Davis Trumpet is a beautifully packaged and unique-looking earphone with a small, lightweight form factor and good noise isolation. Its design may be even louder than that of the old Tribute but the sound makes the Trumpet Monster’s most audiophile-friendly in-ear yet - the signature is more balanced and refined than that of the outgoing model and combines enhanced bass with a spacious soundstage and good resolution. Microphonics in the flat cable can be bothersome and there are sets that offer similar sound quality for less but as an overall package – complete with Monster’s lifetime warranty – the Trumpet is still a solid set of earphones.

*Pros: Beautiful packaging & presentation; small & comfortable; lively yet detailed sound
Cons: Very flashy design; can be microphonic*

Big thanks to *Selenium* for loaning me the Trumpet for review!


*(1C17) Final Audio Design FI-BA-SB “Heaven S”*


Added June 2012

Details: Distinctive brass-shelled monitor from Final Audio’s BA line
Current Price: *$379* from musicaacoustics.com
Specs: Driver: BA | Imp: 16Ω | Sens: 112 dB | Freq: N/A | Cable: 4.6' L-plug
Nozzle Size: 4.5mm | Preferred tips: MEElec M6 bi-flanges
Wear Style: Straight down or *over-the-ear*

Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and oversize zippered carrying case
Build Quality* (4/5) *– The FI-BA-SB is solidly constructed, with long, rounded metal shells and a flat cable with matching – albeit minimal - strain reliefs. The flat cable is thicker than those found on the other FI-BA earphones but lacks a cinch
Isolation *(3.5/5) *– Good with the stock single-flanges and even better with aftermarket tips
Microphonics* (4/5) *– Noise in the flat cable is a little higher than with the thinner cords of the BA-SS and BA-SA but still low even with cable-down wear
Comfort* (4/5)* – The housings of the BA-SB are on the heavy side but the flat cables don’t hinder over-the-ear wear and the fit is easy-going on the whole

Sound *(9/10) *– The team at Final Audio Design has never been known to follow convention, and the sound of the FI-BA-SB is highly atypical of an armature-based earphone. Bass is plentiful - for a BA, the BA-SB is punchy and aggressive. It’s not subbass-heavy but has good extension with minimal bloat. Compared to most earphones with similar bass quantity, the BA-SB sounds very quick and clean, though some of the better dynamics, such as the VSonic GR07 and Sony MDR-7550, offer a more natural note presentation and more realistic bass. Compared to the typical TWFK-based earphone – the VSonic GR01, for example - the BA-SB has greater bass quantity at the expense of some of the delicacy, control, and fine detailing that TWFK-based sets are known for. The same goes for comparing it to the Etymotic ER4S or HiFiMan RE272.

The midrange of the FI-BA-SB is smooth and a touch warm compared to flatter sets such as the ER4S and GR01. Like the bass, the mids are forward and aggressive. Overall, the BA-SB sounds colored and boasts a very vivid, lively sound. It makes the Monster MD Trumpet, a respectable performer in every way, sound veiled with its more laid-back mids and softer, slower note presentation. The FI-BA-SB, on the other hand, while neither neutral in tone nor particularly refined, is very resolving, raw, and ‘honest’ in its sound.

The treble of the BA-SB is laid-back compared to the midrange. It remains clear and resolving and the drop in emphasis compared to the mids reminds me of the Fischer Audio SBA-03. It is not as bright or airy as the pricier BA-SS model or dual-driver sets such as the VSonic GR01 and Audio-Technica CK10. At the same time, despite the lower overall treble energy, the BA-SB is not as smooth as the GR01 or HiFiMan RE272, even appearing a touch grainy at times.

The soundstage of the FI-BA-SB is below average in width – narrower than those of the GR01, CK10, and RE272. The general forwardness causes the earphones to lean towards intimacy but the presentation has decent depth to it. Dynamics are impressive for a BA-based earphone and imaging is good enough, providing a well-rounded sonic presentation. Sets that sound more airy and spacious – the VSonic GR01 and GR07, for example – won’t appeal nearly as well those who prefer aggressive, forward sound. Conversely, those who prefer an out-of-the-head presentation may find the sound of the FADs overly small and congested.

It is also worth noting that the BA-SB is an incredibly sensitive earphone, achieving louder volumes than almost anything else out there and hissing noticeably with many amps and sources.

Value *(8/10)* – In typical FAD fashion, the striking brass shells of the FI-BA-SB house a conventional single BA setup that sounds anything but. It is punchy, aggressive, and dynamic, delivering a vivid sonic image in place of the neutral tone and flat response often expected of armature-based monitors. The design of the earphones is decidedly hit or miss, however, with good isolation and a very solid feel to the housings counterbalancing the lack of proper strain relief, above-average weight, and sparse fit kit. One thing is certain – in terms of bang/buck, the BA-SB makes mincemeat of the higher-end SS model.

*Pros: Uniquely colored, lively sound from a single BA
Cons: Minimal strain relief, weighty housings*

Huge thanks to* james444* for loaning me the Final Audio Heaven A, C, and S


*(1C18) Final Audio Design FI-BA-SA “Heaven C”*


Added Aug 2012

Details: Latest addition to FAD’s BA line; replaces the outgoing BA-A1
Current Price: *$299* from musicaacoustics.com
Specs: Driver: BA | Imp: 16Ω | Sens: 112 dB | Freq: N/A | Cable: 4.6' L-plug
Nozzle Size: 4.5mm | Preferred tips: MEElec M6 bi-flanges
Wear Style: Straight down or *over-the-ear*

Accessories* (3.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and oversize zippered carrying case
Build Quality *(4/5) *– The Final Audio FI-BA-SA is very similar in construction to the BA-SB model with more lightweight chromed shells and thinner cabling more akin to that of the $1100 FI-BA-SS. The cable is very soft and smooth but thinner than average and more tangle-prone compared to the flat cable of the BA-SB. Strain relief is still minimal but a cable cinch is present
Isolation* (3.5/5)* – Good with the stock single-flanges and even better with aftermarket tips
Microphonics* (4.5/5) *– Though thin, the cable is nearly silent even in the cord-down configuration
Comfort* (4.5/5) *– The housings of the BA-SA are much lighter than those of the BA-SB. The cabling is more flexible and comes complete with a cinch to make over-the-ear wear easier. On the whole, their featherlike weight pushes these FADs into don-and-forget territory

Sound* (9/10)* – The sound of FI-BA-SA is quite similar to that of its brass sibling and virtually identical to the now-defunct FI-BA-A1. Overall, its signature is a touch less colored than that of the BA-SB but mostly falls in the same vein. Compared to the SB model, the BA-SA has slightly more linear bass – there is still more mid-bass than a VSonic GR01 or Ety ER4 might have but the difference is just great enough to give the SA a slight advantage in definition over the SB. The SA also remains flatter through the lower mids for a slightly more neutral tone and less fullness, though it retains the forward presentation and overall clarity of the BA-SB.

The top end of the SA is again not overly prominent, taking a small step back compared to the bass and midrange. It is clear and resolving but gives up a touch of the brightness and energy of the SB model. The result is a marginally smoother and more restrained sound that loses some the crispness and excitement of the SB. It does, however, make gains in smoothness, keeping up with the VSonic GR01 even on poorly mastered recordings.

The soundstage of the BA-SA remains unchanged – it is below average in width and tends towards forwardness and intimacy. Depth is decent enough and dynamics are good but the SA will still sound congested compared to a HiFiMan RE272 or Sony MDR-7550. The SA also retains extremely high sensitivity – clearly there is no question that these were designed to be used with portable players.

Value *(8/10) *– The FI-BA-SA is a slightly more conservative version of the FI-BA-SB, both in sound and appearance. Physical differences include lighter housings and thinner cables, giving the SA a slightly less solid feel but better long-term comfort and lower microphonics. The sound, too, is potentially less polarizing than that of the SB model, but also less lively and interesting. Technically, the SA may be the more accurate earphone but simply I couldn’t help reaching for the warmer, punchier, and more exotic FI-BA-SB most of the time.

*Pros: Extremely lightweight construction, low microphonics, competent sound
Cons: Minimal strain relief, stringy cables, weighty housings*

Huge thanks to *james444* for loaning me the Final Audio Heaven A, C, and S


*(1C19) Ultimate Ears UE 900*


Added Oct 2012

Details: UE’s long-awaited follow-up to the renowned Triple.Fi 10
Current Price: *$399.99* from logitech.com (MSRP: $399.99)
Specs: Driver:_ Quad BA_ | Imp: _30Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
Nozzle Size:_ 4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges; MEElec M6 bi-flanges; T-series Complys_
Wear Style:_ Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (5 sizes), Comply foam tips (3 sizes), replacement cable with inline mic/remote, ¼” adapter, airline attenuator, soft carrying pouch, and plastic carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The UE900 retains the blue-and-black plastic aesthetic and replaceable cables of UE’s previous flagship, the Triple.Fi 10, but compacts everything into a smaller, more ergonomic package. The two-pin cable sockets are gone in favor of rotating coaxial connectors akin to those used by Shure’s current offerings and both a headset and a plain stereo cable are included. The cables are braided, with an unusual quad-braid configuration below the y-split, and provide a massive ergonomic improvement over the latest TF10 cables
Isolation *(3.5/5) *– Very good with the right fit. The tapered housings allow for a relatively deep seal and a variety of tips is included for optimal isolation
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Nonexistent in the braided cord
Comfort *(4/5) *– Ergonomically, the UE900 is a huge improvement on the old TF10, with housings that sit more flush in the ear and can stay in place without additional support, though the rotating cable connectors can make it more difficult to use the memory wire. The earphone seems to favor a deep seal and the housings still contain four armatures per side, so those with small ears should, if possible, try before buying

Sound* (9.2/10) *– The UE900 is the first Ultimate Ears flagship created under Logitech management. Replacing the Triple.Fi 10, a model that has been a staple of portable audiophiledom for the better part of a decade, the UE900 boasts a 3-way quad-BA configuration akin to that of the Westone 4. Despite UE’s new management, the 900 doesn’t stray too far away from the TF10 sound, opting to simply provide a more balanced and refined take on the signature.

The Triple.Fi 10 has always been known for delivering ample bass courtesy of its 2-way, triple-BA driver configuration, and the new UE900 is certainly no slouch in this regard—its bass is deep, punchy, and articulate. The curve is flatter compared to the TF10, with more linear subbass extension and less mid-bass boost. The resulting sound is less warm compared to the TF10, though still warmer than sets such as the HiFiMan RE272 and VSonic GR07. The bass of the UE900 sounds tighter and more natural than that of its predecessor and the sound is not as colored. The only potential downside is that the UE900 is a touch less “bassy” in the conventional sense than fans of the TF10 may be used to.

The UE900 is tonally on the warm side and the midrange has a mild downward slope. Lower mids are more prominent compared to the TF10, resulting in a sound signature with a much less obvious v-shape. Vocals are less recessed and the midrange sounds fuller and richer, making the mids of the TF10 seem thin in comparison. Upper mids are de-emphasized, however, resulting in slight veiling. Female vocals especially seem veiled and less intelligible compared to sets such as the HiFiMan RE272 and Sony MDR-7550.

Treble response, on the other hand, is quite inoffensive. The UE900 doesn’t lack treble emphasis on the grand scale, providing a brighter sound with more treble presence than some popular triple-driver sets, such as the Shure SE530 and Earsonics SM3. That said, the top end is smoother compared to the TF10 and boasts less sparkle, continuing the UE900’s move away from the more v-shaped, more colored sound of its predecessor. The greater treble emphasis does make the TF10 sound a bit more energetic and can give it the illusion of greater clarity on some tracks but the smoother treble of the UE900 does a better job of avoiding harshness and sibilance. The UE900 also sounds more natural, avoiding the slight metallic tinge displayed by certain other BA-based sets.

The presentation of the UE900 retains the best aspect of the TF10 – the width – but the more forward mids give its sound a less distant, more three-dimensional feel. Soundstage depth is good, easily beating out the popular VSonic GR07 and competing with the pricier Phonak PFE232. Instrument separation and imaging are good as well, providing an immersive listening experience. It’s worth noting also that the sensitivity of the UE900 is rather high compared to the PFE232 and similar sets—seemingly a common trait of all balanced armature in-ears from UE.


In addition to the Triple.Fi 10 comparisons above, I took the chance to test the UE900 head-to-head against a few other high-end universal-fit earphones. What follows are brief notes based on lengthy comparative listening.

Rock-It Sounds R-50 ($120)

The R-50 is a high bang-per-buck dual-armature universal based on the Knowles TWFK driver, a setup similar to UE’s lower-end 700 model. Compared to the UE900, the R-50 boasts a brighter tone with less bass emphasis and more treble energy. It has a thinner note presentation but provides better midrange clarity and more intelligible vocals. Unfortunately, the treble is also splashier and more prone to exaggerating sibilance. The UE900, on the other hand, is smoother and carries more lower midrange emphasis for fuller, throatier vocals. Its bass is deeper and significantly more powerful, though also a touch boomy in comparison. Both earphones have similarly spacious soundstages with good depth and width.

VSonic GR07 ($180)

The GR07 is an audiophile heavy-hitter, providing benchmark performance from a single bio-cellulose dynamic driver. Compared to the UE900, the GR07 provides better clarity and a brighter sound with tonality closer to what I would consider “neutral”. The UE900 is warmer and provides more mid-bass impact with similar sub-bass depth. Its sound is more dynamic, however, and it avoids the sibilance-prone treble peaks of the GR07 in favor of a smoother, less fatiguing presentation. The UE900 also pulls away in soundstaging, with better depth and layering that make the GR07’s presentation appear flat and overly distant.

HiFiMan RE272 ($250)

The RE272 is another audiophile favorite and the latest in a series of increasingly accurate in-ears from HiFiMan. Compared to the somewhat bass-light RE272, the UE900 is warmer and punchier, with an overall presentation centered more on the bass and lower midrange, and a slightly “boomier” bottom end. The RE272 is more transparent and boasts better vocal clarity and treble sparkle, as well as better instrument separation. Its soundstage lacks a bit of depth in comparison, however, giving the UE900 an edge in layering and imaging.

Phonak PFE232 ($600)

Phonak’s flagship uses a dual armature setup but still manages to deliver sound that puts it near the top of the universal earphone game. The sound signature of the PFE232 is noticeably v-shaped, with more recessed mids and added treble energy compared to the UE900. The top end of the PFE232 is more crisp, sparkly, and extended. The low end of the Phonaks also presents less mid-bass emphasis for a slightly cleaner sound. The UE900, on the other hand, still manages good bass, both in depth and impact, but also provides more prominent and less grainy mids compared to the 232. Its presentation also has slightly better depth in addition to great width.

AKG K3003i ($1300)

The priciest universal-fit headset on the planet, the K3003i is AKG’s sole entry into the high-end in-ear market. Compared to the UE900, the dynamic bass driver of the K3003i provides more mid-bass impact and slower bass decay while the balanced armatures attain better top-end extension and crisper, more detailed sound. Its presentation is also more airy and layered better than that of the UE900, though the latter is definitely no slouch. The midrange of the K3003i is more recessed, however, with the UE900 providing better balance between the bass and mids. The UE900 also wins the smoothness battle as the AKGs are more prone to exposing harshness and sibilance.

FitEar ToGo 334 ($1350)

The TG334 is a flagship custom-come-universal from Japan-based FitEar. The UE900 puts up a good fight in this unfair comparison but the TG334 earns its otherworldly price tag with a noticeable jump in clarity and transparency over the UE900. The veil of the UE900 was most noticeable next to the FitEar—the more forward midrange of the TG334, despite the powerful bass, carries no veil whatsoever. Microdetail is brought forward and made more discernible compared to the UE900 and instrument separation is improved as well. Finally, the bass of the TG334 is also more dynamic and capable of delivering greater impact when called for.

Value *(85/10) *– With such a widely revered predecessor and an even more easy-going sound signature, the new Ultimate Ears UE 900 is a high-end earphone for the masses. The outgoing Triple.Fi 10 is still an audiophile icon but after more than half a decade it is undoubtedly a bit long in the tooth. The UE 900, despite the steep price tag, is a well thought-out replacement, both sonically and as an overall package. It provides better ergonomics, optional headset functionality, and an improved cable, as well as punchy, smooth, non-fatiguing sound that doesn’t butcher low-bitrate tracks. It’s not perfect, but with the UE 900 as its replacement the TF10 certainly won’t be missed by many.

*Pros: Comfortable fit; spare cable included; nearly no cable noise; punchy bass; more balanced sound than Triple.Fi 10
Cons: Upper midrange can appear a bit veiled*


*(1C20) Sennheiser IE7*


Added Mar 2013

Details: Previously popular model from Sennheiser’s original IE series
Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $299.95)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _120 dB_ | Freq: _10-19k Hz_ | Cable: _4' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock short bi-flanges; MEElec balanced bi-flanges_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* - Single flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (3 sizes) silicone tips, foamhybrid tips (2 sizes), cleaning tool, over-the-ear cable guides, shirt clip, and storage case with integrated cable winder
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* - The housings are made of sturdy plastic and the kevlar-reinforced cable is light, smooth, and strong. It is not detachable like that of the pricier IE8 and the L-plug is not gold plated, so rotating it can cause a bit of static
Isolation *(2.5/5)* – As with the IE8, the IE7 is a shallow-fitting earphone with below-average isolation
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent
Comfort *(4/5)* - The housings are large but lightweight and surprisingly ergonomic. They sit flush in the ear and are not overly sensitive to insertion depth, so the IE7 should be comfortable for all but those with small outer ears

Sound *(8.2/10)* – Part of Sennheiser’s original IE-series lineup, the IE7 provides a somewhat different sound signature than the more bass-heavy IE6 and IE8. The sound of the IE7 is more mid-focused, though bass is still plentiful. The low end is both impactful and full-bodied, and bass power should be ample for all but die-hard bass fans. Control is a bit disappointing, however – the IE7 suffers from a mid-bass lift and its low end is neither as tight not as quick as those of more modern dynamic-driver designs. The Monster Miles Davis Trumpet, for example, makes the IE7 sound boomy and bloated in comparison and offers up better detail and texturing throughout. The Atrio MG7, too, easily beats the IE7 not only in bass depth but also control, and the JVC HA-FX500 has a flatter, more realistic low end that causes it to sound more even-handed and natural compared to the IE7.

The midrange of the IE7 is warm, yet forward - those who find the IE8 veiled and recessed in the midrange would probably enjoy the IE7 more. The earphone sounds lush and smooth but lacks the detail of most BA-based and many dynamic-driver sets in its price range - the mids simply don’t have the best definition, especially down where the bass bleeds over. The JVC HA-FXT90 and Yamaha EPH-100 are two lower-priced dynamic driver earphones that have cleaner-sounding mids compared to the IE7.

The treble of the IE7 has good presence but isn’t very refined, lacking the delicacy, effortlessness, and detail of sets such as the HiFiMan RE-ZERO and Sony EX600. It can be a little edgy but doesn’t have a whole lot of sparkle and liveliness. The presentation, too, impresses with its spaciousness but boasts only average separation. The IE7 maintains the excellent soundstage and headstage size of the higher-end IE8 model. It sounds more expansive than competing sets such as the Monster Miles Davis Trumpets and even the open-backed JVC HA-FX500, but doesn’t have the imaging to compete with even the cheaper Yamaha EPH-100. The Sony EX600, which has a similarly large presentation, sounds cleaner and less congested, with more convincing layering and a coherent, versatile presentation.

Value *(6.5/10)* – Sennheiser’s now-defunct IE7 is a unique earphone – with a mid-forward signature, large headstage, and powerful bass, it would have a place on the market today were it not for the somewhat disappointing clarity and resulting lack of refinement. Like the higher-end IE8, the IE7 does not offer much isolation but boasts good ergonomics and an excellent cable, making it an easy earphone to use out and about. Its sound, too, works well on the go – it just isn’t as “Hi-Fi” as one might expect from an upper-tier Sennheiser product.

*Pros: Excellent cabling, no microphonics, lightweight and comfortable, large soundstage
Cons: Mediocre isolation, lacks transparency and refinement


(1C21) EarSonics SM64 (v2)*



Added Jul 2013

Details: EarSonics 3-way, triple-armature follow-up to the SM3
Current Price: *$399* from amazon.com (MSRP: $399)
Specs: Driver: _3-BA / 3-way crossover_  Imp: _98Ω_ | Sens: _122 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' L-plug_
Nozzle Size:_ 2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges; Westone STAR tips_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5) *– Double-flange silicone tips (2 pairs), foam tips (2 sizes), cleaning tool, and clamshell carrying case
Build Quality* (4.5/5) *– Like the first-gen EarSonics models I’ve reviewed, the SM64 uses plastic shells reminiscent of the Westone stage monitors. The cords are now detachable, however, utilizing a common 2-pin socket, and have a memory wire section for a more secure fit. The twisted cables are similar to those used by Westone universals and most custom-fit earphones
Isolation *(4/5) *– Quite good with both the included silicone and foam tips
Microphonics *(5/5) *– Basically nonexistent, as with all similar designs
Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The new smooth, rounded housings are a major improvement over the angular design of the old SM2/SM3, fitting securely without applying pressure to parts of the outer ear like the SM3 shells did

Sound* (9.3/10)* – The sound of the SM64 bears a resemblance to its predecessor, the SM3, but at the same time offers a more conventional balance and presentation. First the sound signature – the SM64 is a warmish earphone with impressive bass quality and clear, yet forgiving sound. The low end of the earphones is outstanding – the bass has very good depth and control. It is boosted, yet maintains a good balance of mid- and subbass. The result is a low end that’s extended and powerful, yet very clean and controlled. It makes the bottom end of the VSonic GR07 sound a touch loose and intrusive and competes in quality with the decidedly less bassy Ultimate Ears 900.

The midrange of the SM64 maintains good presence but is not overly forward. Tonally, the EarSonics are slightly warm – warmer, for example, than Philips’ flagship Fidelio S2 model and the Ultimate Ears 900. Note thickness is impressive as well, and while the SM64 doesn’t have the emphasized upper midrange and treble that typically accentuate clarity, it is still about as clear as the flatter and more accurate-sounding VSonic VC1000 and Philips Fidelio S2, among others.

On the point of accuracy – the SM64 has an upper midrange dip, not unlike its predecessor, the SM3. However, the dip of the SM3 seems to be broader and has a greater effect on the sound, resulting in greater veiling and a darker overall tone compared to the SM64. The SM64 still cannot be called neutral, however, and lacks some of upper midrange presence and accuracy compared to earphones such as the Fidelio S2, UE 900, and VC1000, just to name a few.

The treble of the new EarSonics has pretty good presence, appearing more energetic than, for example, the EarSonics SM3, Westone UM3X, and Sony MDR-7550, but not harsh or sibilant. It seems to be a case of taking the middle ground- a little smoothed-over compared to accuracy-oriented in-ears such as the VSonic VC1000 and Philips Fidelio S2 but at the same time is not as smooth as the Sony MDR-7550. Still, while not perfect, it’s an improvement on the old SM3 and a fair compromise between risking harshness and losing crispness. The VSonic GR07, for example, is quite sibilance-prone compared to the EarSonics.

The presentation of the SM64 has good depth and width, and appears to be tuned for more universal appeal than the uniquely enveloping sound of the older SM3. Good bass control and a lack of midrange recession help the SM64’s separation and imaging. The VSonic GR07, for example, sounds a bit congested and lacking in soundstage depth in comparison and even the UE900, while spacious overall and more impressive in this regard than the GR07, still doesn’t quite have the depth of the SM64.

One last thing worth noting is that the SM64 is not very sensitive and was less efficient than all of the earphones I compared it against, especially the SM3.

*Select Comparisons*

EarSonics SM3 (discontinued)

Pitting the SM64 against its predecessor is telling of the direction EarSonics has taken with the tuning of the new model. While the SM3 remains a very unique earphone with its thick, lush mids and enveloping presentation, the SM64 boasts a more conventional – but at the same time more capable – sound. The low end of the SM64, for instance, is more focused on subbass and less on mid-bass, resulting in sound that is tighter and cleaner overall. The mids of the SM64 are not as forward as those of the SM3 and the note presentation is not as thick and creamy.

The thinner note presentation affords the SM64 a slightly clearer sound, which is also helped along by greater treble energy compared to the previous-gen model. The brighter treble results in a more neutral tone compared to the warmer SM3 – though the SM64 is not flat in FR, it is more balanced than its predecessor. The more mid-forward SM3 also boasts a more enveloping presentation, which is something that resulted in a lot of polarized opinions and heated debate. The new SM64 has a wider soundstage and a more conventional out-of-the-head presentation. Overall, while the two earphones are more different in sound signature than technical ability, I would rather listen to the new SM64 nine out of ten times.

Phonak PFE 232 ($599)

Phonak’s PFE 232 is a dual-driver design with a mildly v-shaped sound signature – quite a contrast to all EarSonics models, especially the old SM3. Compared to the new SM64, the 232 has brighter, more energetic treble and at times seems clearer and crisper, as tends to be the case with brighter earphones. However, the 232 also sounds a little “hot” and has a greater tendency towards sibilance when pitted against the more relaxed treble of the SM64. Its sound, especially the top end, seems thinner and less natural compared to that of the EarSonics.

The bass of the PFE is greater in quantity compared to the SM64 and tends to intrude on the more recessed mids of the Phonaks. The EarSonics, on the other hand, boast less aggressive bass and a fuller, more prominent midrage. That, combined with the smoother treble of the SM64, makes it more natural and easier to listen to than the PFE, which is why it has won my ear here.

Sennheiser IE 800 ($1000)

Sennheiser’s flagship in-ear boasts plentiful bass and a more v-shaped overall sound compared to the EarSonics. It offers greater mid- and subbass presence, as well as greater impact and note weight. The EarSonics, on the other hand, exercise a bit more bass control. The lower midrange of the IE 800 is more recessed but maintains clarity very well. At the same time the SM64, with its laid-back upper mids, sounds smoother than the somewhat splashy IE 800. Subjectively, the performance of these two is actually rather close, though the IE 800 did win my ear more often than the SM64 for its greater midrange accuracy and huge bass that does not sacrifice clarity.

AKG K3003 ($1300)

AKG’s BA-dynamic hybrid is yet another earphone with a more v-shaped sound compared to the EarSonics SM64. The K3003 is a set I’ve always rather liked, and that doesn’t change in head-to-head comparisons with the EarSonics. The AKG boasts more treble presence, energy, and sparkle, and the upper midrange is more filled-in, resulting in the K3003 appearing more detailed overall.

The bass of the K3003 is a little more powerful than that of the SM64, though the difference is not night and day. The mids of the SM64 are fuller and more forward, on the other hand, and the overall tone is warmer. The brighter, more v-shaped K3003 nonetheless sounds a little more neutral to me than the SM64, but it’s difficult to fault the bass and lower midrange of the EarSonics even next to the hugely pricy AKGs.

Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 ($350)

The CTM-200 is an entry-level dual-driver custom monitor priced right near the SM64. Tuned for an accurate, musician-friendly sound, the CTM-200 is not as warm in tone as the SM64, with bass that rolls off earlier and lacks the impact of the EarSonics. The lack of proper subbass extension hurts the realism and accuracy of the low end – simply put, the EarSonics sound much more effortless and realistic when it comes to bass.

Aside from the bass, the dual-driver CTM-200 actually does offer some advantages over the SM64 – its mids, for example, are flatter overall and provide better accuracy. The upper midrange is more filled-in and the overall tone is cooler. Despite this, clarity is actually on-par between the two earphones and while the presentation of the CTM-200 is a bit more out-of-the-head, the SM64 keeps up very well in soundstage size, imaging, and overall sense of space. Choosing between these two earphones is a matter of choosing between the superior bass of the SM64 or the more accurate sound and marginally larger presentation of the CTM-200.

Value* (8.5/10) *– EarSonics broke onto the worldwide audio scene a few years back with the rather controversial SM3 – an earphone that, with some reservations, I quite liked. The sound of the new SM64 retains resemblance to its predecessor but also seems to be tuned for more universal appeal. It’s not tonally neutral, but it refines the formula in many ways - even the fit has been improved dramatically compared to the first-gen EarSonics products.

These days there are dozens of great-sounding earphones available at almost all price points so all high-end purchases are tough to justify, but there’s one thing I’ll freely admit - the SM64 is much more proficient than most at getting my toes tapping.

*Pros: Great bass and presentation; very comfortable, especially next to old EarSonics models; good isolation and overall user-friendliness
Cons: Could be flatter between the upper midrange and treble*


*(1C22) Custom Art Music One*


Reviewed October 2013

Details: Single BA model from Poland-based Custom Art, owned and operated by a long-time Head-Fi member piotrus-g
Starting Price: €189 (est. $260) from thecustomart.com
Specs: Driver: _BA _| Imp: _41Ω_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Cleaning tool, Otterbox 1000 crushproof storage/carrying case, and compact clamshell carrying case
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The Music One is a full-shell silicone custom monitor with excellent shell quality. A fixed cable is standard, but detachable cabling is available as an option. The fixed cable lacks external strain relief but the silicone of the shells does the same job better. The cord itself is among my all-time favorites - very soft and slightly rubberized, it is resistant to both microphonics and tangling. There are also far more customization options available for the Music One than my other silicone customs, and Custom Art even offers themed visual designs dubbed “State of Art” at an extra cost. My unit has blue shells, clear tips, and color-coded nozzles, and came with a matching blue carrying case
Isolation *(5/5)* – Excellent, falling just behind my Spiral Ear 3-way Reference, which has a musician’s fit with longer canals
Microphonics *(5/5) *– None – the soft, rubbery cable is completely silent
Comfort *(5/5)* – The flexible, low-profile silicone shells of the Music One can be hard to grip and take slightly longer to insert and remove compared to more rigid acrylic customs, but are extremely comfortable and maintain seal better with changes to ear canal shape, such as while chewing or talking. Built around a single balanced armature driver, the Music One has the lowest profile of all my custom monitors and its soft cables are made more unobtrusive by the lack of a strain relief and memory wire. All in all, it is the most comfortable of all my earphones, custom-fit or otherwise

Sound* (9.2/10)* – From the first listen it was clear that the Custom Art Music One, which utilizes a vented balanced armature driver, is one of the best earphones in its class. It pursues a very coherent, natural sound that impresses with its weight and smoothness. The low end extends well and offers up good impact. It is tighter than the boomier, more mid-bassy 1964EARS 1964-V3 but, as with the other silicone customs I’ve reviewed thus far, there is a certain difficult-to-describe characteristic to the bass that makes the earphones seem more impactful while taking away slightly from the detail and texture, which I attribute to the silicone. This allows the Music One to maintain good bass control while providing ample presence – more than with the dynamic-drover HiFiMan RE-400 and the Ultimate Ears 600, for example – but also means it can’t quite keep up with the low-end resolution of, for example, the pricier EarSonics SM64.

The mids of the Music One are smooth and clear, with good note thickness and again a very natural presentation. The midrange is definitely one of the strengths of the earphone but doesn’t present as overly forward, likely due to the impactful bass. The HiFiMan RE-400 and Ultimate Ears 600 both seem a touch more mid-centric than the Music One, for example. Clarity is excellent as well, falling just a hair behind higher-priced sets such as the EarSonics SM64 and 1964EARS V3.

The treble of the Custom Art is a little less prominent but still remains in good balance with the overall sound, reminding me of the way recent HiFiMan releases have been tuned. It is not the most crisp-sounding, but tends to be natural and smooth. The same is true of the presentation – the Music One has a spacious sound, especially compared to the majority of other single-BA earphones. It also impresses with good soundstage depth and the ability to portray intimacy properly when necessary, further making it a great all-rounder.

*Select Comparisons*

MEElectronics A161P ($100) 

The A161P is a single-armature earphone based on a Knowles ED transducer and tuned for a crisp and punchy sound. The A161P and Custom Art Music One are not exceedingly different in terms of balance, and on some tracks sound rather similar overall. With in-depth listening, however, it becomes clear that the Music One is a significantly more refined earphone.

While the A161P has good bass punch for a single-armature set, the Music One is more impactful and has a thicker, weightier note presentation. Its tone is warmer overall and it makes the A161P sound thin in comparison. The A161P tends to be brighter and, next to the rather smooth Music One, sounds somewhat harsh and grainy. The A161P is also more forward while the Music One offers a wider presentation with better depth and imaging.

VSonic GR07 ($179) 

One of the many reasons the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07 has maintained its popularity over the past few years is that it can go toe to toe with many higher-priced sets. Pitted against the Custom Art Music One, it loses out in midrange and treble quality but partly makes up for it with great bass. The main differences lie in the midrange, where the Music One offers better presence and clarity. The GR07, in comparison, sounds slightly mid-recessed. This, in turn, accentuates the bass of the VSonics, which appears a little more impactful but also quicker compared to the Music One. The Custom Art unit offers smoother treble while the more energetic GR07 is susceptible to sibilance. The presentation of the GR07 tends to have good width and little else, while the Music One is more well-rounded and offers depth and imaging to match.

Etymotic Research ER4S ($249) 

Long-time industry leader and innovator Etymotic Research first released the ER4 in 1991, and its ER4S tuning remains one of my all-time favorite universal-fit earphones. The Custom Art Music One and ER4S each have advantages over the other and it’s difficult to pick a clear winner here. The Music One definitely sounds fuller and warmer overall, thanks in part to its weightier low end. Despite the bass, however, it appears a bit more mid-centric overall. Its treble is less prominent and more forgiving, and its midrange – thicker and more attention-grabbing. The leaner ER4S can at times sound a touch clearer and has a small advantage in overall balance, while the Music One oftentimes sounds more natural thanks to its thicker, fuller sound.

ClearTuneMonitors CT-200 ($350) 

The ClearTuneMonitors CT-200 is a dual-driver acrylic custom priced higher than the Custom Art Music One. It is a neutral-sounding earphone that rolls off gently at either end of the frequency spectrum. Compared to the CT-200, the Music One has an advantage in bass depth and impact. Its low end is more extended and powerful, and grants the earphone a warmer overall tone. The CT-200 is brighter overall, presenting more forward upper mids in comparison. It also sounds a touch clearer and its treble is more crisp, appearing a little more detailed as a result. In terms of presentation, the CT-200 is more spacious and open-sounding while the Music One tends to be slightly more intimate. Nonetheless, the Music One again sounds very natural in this comparison – arguably more so than the CT-200 thanks to its warmer, thicker sound.

Alclair Reference ($399) 

The triple-driver, acrylic-shelled Alclair Reference is an accurate-sounding earphone that offers good presence across the entire frequency spectrum. It has similar bass depth and impact to the Custom Art Music One but tends to be a little tighter and more detailed. As with the VSonic GR07, its midrange is more recessed compared to the Music One, which has rather prominent mids. The Reference is still clearer, however, and seems more resolving as well. In general, the Alclair monitor sounds better up to the upper midrange, where it starts to display some stridency. Its treble is more prominent overall and tends to be peakier and more sibilant. The Music One, on the other hand, is smooth and far more forgiving, and sounds more natural overall in the treble region. Finally, the Reference is overall more spacious and images a little better than the Music One.

Value *(10/10)* – The Custom Art Music One is an excellent value, combining the noise isolation of custom-fit silicone shells with a single balanced armature driver delivering an organic, coherent sound. The ultra-light low-profile silicone shells of the Music One put its fit and comfort above not only universal monitors, but other customs as well. Lastly, in addition to great attention to detail spanning everything from the cable to the accessory pack, the Music One offers more customization options compared to other silicone CIEMs, making it an even tougher earphone to fault on any front.

*Pros: Great isolation & comfort; fantastic cable; great audio performance
Cons: Low-profile shells can be tough to remove from ears*



*(1C23) Fidue A83*


Reviewed Dec 2014

Details: Flagship earphone from Fidue utilizing a dynamic + dual balanced armature driver setup

MSRP: $399.95 (manufacturer’s page)
Current Price: *$280* from amazon.com; $299 on ebay.com
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic + Dual BA Hybrid _| Imp: _11Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _9-31k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug, detachable with MMCX connectors_
Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply T400; Sennheiser short bi-flanges_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) silicone tips, foam tips (1 pair), 6.3mm adapter, airline adapter, Otterbox-style crush-resistant carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The look of the A83 might take a bit of getting used to, but construction quality is excellent. The metal faceplates comprise the most prominent design element and give the housings a very solid feel. The detachable cables utilize MMCX connectors modified to stop them from rotating, which is something I found slightly annoying with a few other MMCX earphones such as the Shure SE535. Fidue does this using an extra pin on the outside of the connector. This results in the A83′s cable being incompatible with other MMCX earphones, but other manufacturers’ cables will still work with the A83. The quality of the stock cable is excellent and the connectors at the earpiece end are angled to facilitate over-the-ear wear. The only thing the cable lacks is a cinch, but with the memory wire it’s not really a must-have
Isolation *(3/5)* – Average due to somewhat shallow fit
Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Very low in the twisted cable
Comfort *(4/5)* – The A83 uses an ergonomic housing design and is worn over the ear with the help of memory wire and angled cable connectors. It’s not a small earphone, but it is relatively lightweight and the shape, which reminds me of the Sennheiser IE7, manages the size well

Sound* (9.2/10)* – The Fidue A83 is a dynamic + dual BA hybrid earphone that improves on the design – and the sound – of Fidue’s dynamic-driver A81 model. Like other triple-driver hybrid setups, it doesn’t suffer from a lack of bass impact. However, aside from the warm and smooth Sony XBA-H3, it is the least v-shaped and arguably the most balanced of the hybrid IEMs I’ve tried. The overall balance of the earphones did benefit a good amount from a tip switch – the best results I got were with Comply foam tips and “short” Sennheiser double-flanges.

In this configuration the A83 has mids that are not as thin as those of the DUNU DN-2000 and T-Peos Altone200 and a top end that’s not prone to harshness or sibilance. Bass quantity is above what I consider flat or “neutral”, but lower than with most other hybrids including the XBA-H3, Altone200, and even AKG’s flagship K3003 in its “Reference” configuration.

The A83 is clearly bassier than flat-sounding BA sets such as the Etymotic ER4, VSonic VC1000, and Final Audio Heaven II, but also a little less tight and controlled. The Westone W40, which is not as flat as the sets listed above, still can’t keep up with the A83 in bass impact, but the quality of its bass is closer to that of the Fidue.

The midrange of the A83 is a little warmer than neutral. It is thicker and more full-bodied than a flat-sounding IEM such as an Etymotic ER4, VC1000, or even Heaven II, but also a bit less clear. Clarity lags a bit behind the pricier AKG K3003 as well. The A83 also lacks a bit of crispness compared to these other sets, likely because it just isn’t as level across the board, but this is only noticeable when comparing it to a flatter, more accurate earphone. On the other hand compared to the warmer and darker Westone W40, the more v-shaped A83 is actually a little clearer.

The top end of the Fidue A83 carries good energy and strikes a fine balance between sounding revealing and harsh. Among the hybrid earphones I’ve tried it is the best bet for those who are worried about the warmth and bloat of the XBA-H3 being excessive but don’t want to risk the brighter and occasionally harsher-sounding DUNU and T-Peos sets. The treble here is by no means smoothed-over – it just avoids some of the harshness and sibilance of the hybrid competitors and even flatter-sounding earphones such as the VSonic VC1000 and Final Audio Heaven II, which tend to have more treble energy. However, this also costs the A83 some crispness in comparison to those. The Westone W40, on the other hand, is less bright and even more forgiving. At the end of the day, the A83 is a compromise between the brighter sound of many other hybrids and the purposely smooth sound of something like the Westone W40.

The A83 has a very unique presentation, with impressive width and depth but a somewhat diffuse sound. The soundstage is spacious – surprisingly so, in fact – but the slight lack of crispness leaves the presentation a bit vague. Still, it a little more out-of-the-head than even the AKG K3003, which has a more “conventional” with more coherent soundstaging and better imaging.

*Mini Comparisons*

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

VSonic’s dynamic-driver GR07 is, by and large, a balanced-sounding earphone, and sounds quite neutral next to the more v-shaped A83. The top end of the A83 is highly tip dependent but tends to be a little brighter and more energetic overall. With the stock tips it can be more sibilant than the GR07, but with my preferred eartips it is actually smoother and less sibilance-prone than the VSonic unit.

The bass of the GR07 seems a bit deeper. This is likely due to it having less of a mid-bass hump to draw attention away from the sub-bass, rather than due to actually having more depth. In the midrange, the A83 sounds both clearer and a little more full-bodied than the GR07 – an impressive feat. It also has a slightly more 3-dimensional presentation with better depth and is quite a bit more efficient.

T-Peos Altone200 ($185) 

The T-Peos Altone200 is close to the Fidue A83 in performance but offers up more bass and brighter treble for a more v-shaped sound signature. The bass of the Altone200 digs deeper and delivers more of both impact and rumble, though it is also a touch more boomy. The A83 is more neutral and a little more natural-sounding, though I can definitely see the more colored sound of the T-Peos being preferable with some genres (such as EDM), thanks in large part to the juicy bass. The mids of the A83 are not as recessed while the Altone200 has a thinner and more withdrawn midrange. The clarity of the T-Peos is much more striking, due in part to the Fidue having thicker mids and lower overall treble energy, though the A83 is also smoother and less sibilance-prone.

DUNU DN-1000 ($199)

DUNU’s original triple-driver hybrid makes for a good contrast to the Fidue A83. Though both earphones follow v-shaped sound signatures, they are tuned differently. The DN-1000 has deeper bass with noticeably more slam. The A83 has more neutral bass quantity, but actually sounds a little warmer thanks to a slightly larger mid-bass hump. It is also a bit thicker and more full-bodied in the midrange, though the more v-shaped DN-1000 seems a touch clearer. The highs of the DUNU unit are less forgiving while the A83 has smoother treble (probably its biggest advantage). That said, the A83 sounds a little less crisp and coherent, but more spacious, whereas the DN-1000 offers a slightly more congested sound.

DUNU DN-2000 ($300)

The A83 and DN-2000 are both high-end triple-driver hybrid earphones that, to my ears, differ most in presentation, with the A83 having a more out-of-the-head sound and appearing a little more distant and diffuse, and the DN-2000 sounding more focused, but also a bit more closed-in. The Fidue set carries less emphasis in the sub-bass region and more in the mid-bass region, which actually makes its low end sound a little more integrated into the overall sound. The midrange of the DN-2000 is a little more recessed but the A83 is lacking in the way of crispness in comparison. The A83 also tends to be a little less forgiving up top, though it falls closer to the smoother DN-2000 than the lower-end DN-1000 in this regard.

Sony XBA-H3 ($348)

Compared to the Sony XBA-H3, the Fidue A83 boasts a brighter tonal character and sound that’s more balanced overall. The XBA-H3 has more bass impact at the expense of greater bass boom whereas the A83 is both lighter and more controlled at the low end. The mids of the A83 are slightly clearer, but also thinner. The XBA-H3 has a more full-bodied sound but also appears a bit more veiled/muffled in the midrange. The Sony is smoother, too, while the A83 is brighter and less forgiving. Surprisingly, the A83 has a slightly more spacious presentation than the XBA-H3, which is already very impressive in this regard.

Value *(8.5/10)* – The Fidue A83 is a triple-driver hybrid earphone with sound that combines impactful, yet well-measured bass with mids and treble that are less recessed and more forgiving, respectively, compared to other earphones of this type. The overall sound is slightly v-shaped and not 100% neutral, but punchy and enjoyable. The earphones are also very well made, with the plastic-and-metal housings and good-quality detachable cables covering all the bases. Indeed, there’s a certain thoughtfulness and attention to detail permeates all aspects of the A83, from the packaging onward, enhancing the user experience. Wearing comfort for the ergonomic-fit housings is also quite good. I do wish there was a mic cable included, as with the less expensive A81 model, but for the price that would simply be too much good stuff.

*Pros: Great construction; detachable cable; enjoyable, slightly colored sound
Cons: Treble quality is tip-dependent*



*(1C24) DUNU DN-2000*


Brief: Second-generation hybrid earphone from DUNU

MSRP: approx $315
Current Price: *$280 *from amazon.com; *$280* from ebay.com; $315 from mp4nation.net; $315 from CTC Audio (US/Canada)
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA + dynamic hybrid _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _10-30k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Wide-channel single-flanges_
Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* –  Single-flange wide-channel (3 sizes), single-flange narrow-channel (3 sizes), and bi-flange (3 sizes) silicone tips, foam tips, eartip spacer set (6 pairs in 3 sizes), ear fins (2 pairs), ear stabilizers (2 pairs), shirt clip, ¼” adapter, airline adapter, cleaning cloth, pair of cable guides, crush-resistant metal carrying case, and integrated cable wrap
Build Quality *(5/5)* – Like other DUNU earphones, the DN-2000 is very solidly constructed. The gold- and coffee-colored metal housings have a matte finish and the cable us DUNU’s typical TPE – soft, smooth, and tangle-resistant. “Genghis Khan” is printed on the side of the housings in Cyrillic script – not really sure why. The machined aluminum y-split, plug, and cable cinch add to the premium feel. The earfin retention nubs help identify left and right earpieces more quickly
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Some of the best among hybrid earphones
Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Very good when worn cable-down; nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The DN-2000 is similar to the older DN-1000 in size and shape. It is moderately large and a bit heavy for a straight-barrel design but can be worn cable-up, which makes it feel lighter in the ear. DUNU provides an extensive fit kit with plenty of eartips, three sets of eartip spacers (same ones included with the DN-1000), and new earfins in two different styles. The eartip spacers change where the eartip sits on the nozzle and can be used to position the housings farther out of the ear. They have an effect on sound similar to what is normally accomplished with tip rolling. However, some of the possible tip/spacer combinations make it easy for the tips to slip off the nozzles and it really does take some experimenting to find the optimal combination.

The earfins are installed using a retention arm on the side of the housing and are meant to keep the earphones in the ear more securely, likely a reaction to those who complained about the weight of the DN-1000 model. On the whole, DUNU has done all they can to make the earphone comfortable, allowing dozens of different combinations for the fit (and sound), but the DN-2000 still would not be my first pick for smaller-sized ears

Sound *(9.3/10)* – Having tested the hybrid IEM market with the impressive DN-1000, DUNU attempted to improve on the formula of combining robust dynamic-driver bass with clear mids and treble with a second-generation hybrid, the DN-2000.

The DN-2000 is by no means lacking in bass, but its low end is a little less emphasized than that of the DN-1000. There’s not really a mid-bass hump to deliver a conventional bass-heavy sound, but there is still plenty of low end presence on the whole. Bass extension is especially impressive – there is more depth to the low end of the DUNU than that of the pricier AKG K3003, for instance. Indeed, the AKG unit, in its “reference” configuration, delivers less enhanced but also slightly tighter bass than the DN-2000.

Compared to the VSonic VC1000, a high-end reference-flat BA earphone, the DUNU provides a bassier sound with a thicker, more natural note presentation. It comes out ahead of the TWFK-based VSonic set in overall SQ – something the DN-1000 didn’t quite manage.

The sound sig of the DN-2000 is a little v-shaped (or u-shaped, to be more exact) but its midrange is more prominent than that of the DN-1000, resulting in better overall balance as well as even better clarity and intelligibility. Clarity is just a hair behind the AKG K3003, which has slightly tighter bass and a thinner note presentation.

The treble of the DN-2000 is nicely extended and plenty sparkly. In fact, one of the earphone’s greatest strengths is great end-to-end extension, which is only made more apparent by its emphasis on deep bass and treble that carries much of its energy up high, as opposed to the upper-mid/low treble region.

Worth noting is that the DN-2000 is very sensitive to fit when it comes to treble quality. With the right combination of eartips, spacers, and insertion depth it’s quite refined for the quantity present. There’s definitely enough to properly convey the energy of cymbals, and yet compared to the DN-1000 the new model is slightly more tolerant of harshness and sibilance due to smoother lower highs. It’s still far from what I’d call “forgiving” and can be said to teeter just on the correct side of sibilance, but fares better than most earphones of the type.

The presentation of the DN-2000 is wide and airy – typical for a mildly v-shaped earphone with broad end-to-end extension, but more expansive than most. The soundstage is wider and more open compared to the DN-1000 and even the K3003, putting the DN-2000 well above average in that regard, but its low end can get boomier than that of the AKG unit on bass-heavy tracks, which doesn’t do the soundstage any favors. 

*Select Comparisons*

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

Compared to the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07, the DN-2000 has an advantage in bass depth and treble smoothness, the note presentation is a little thicker, and the soundstage is a little more even in depth and width. The GR07 and even GR07 Bass Edition don’t have the sub-bass of the DN-2000 and sound more sibilant and less smooth up top. The DN-2000 has a slightly thicker and more natural note presentation, but bass control and overall clarity are on-par with the VSonics. The soundstage of the DN-2000 is a little more even in terms of width and depth and just better-imaged overall. 

T-Peos Altone200 ($185)

The Altone200 is an impressive earphone, especially considering the much lower price tag, but lacks some refinement compared to the DN-2000. The DUNU is a little warmer and more balanced, with a more full-bodied midrange. However, the bass of the more v-shaped Altone2000 seems more impactful and digs deeper, standing out more next to its thinner, more recessed midrange. Clarity is very impressive with the T-Peos unit, augmented by its brighter treble. The DN-2000 can usually keep up in clarity, but only barely. Up top, the T-Peos is a little hotter through the upper mids and lower treble, with greater tendency towards sibilance, while the DN-2000 is smoother and more refined. 

DUNU DN-1000 ($200)

The DN-2000 is about $100 more expensive than the model it supersedes. I don’t know if it can be called a direct upgrade over the DN-1000, but it does offer a few improvements. The most noticeable is the presentation – the higher-end model is more spacious. It creates a wider, airier, more spaced-out sonic image, making the DN-1000 sound more intimate and a touch congested in comparison. Part of the reason the DN-2000 is able to do this is a slight decrease in bass emphasis. Its sound is more balanced than that of the lower-end model, but it is by no means light on low end presence and maintains impressive bass impact, detail, and extension.

The midrange of the DN-2000 is more prominent and in better balance with the low end, which contributes to better vocal clarity. The treble has plenty of energy but seems to be a touch more refined on the newer model. The DN-2000 is nicely extended and just as sparkly as the DN-1000, but a little more tolerant of sibilance when it comes down to it. All in all, I consistently preferred the DN-2000, but the differences are subtle enough that I wouldn’t advocate DN-1000 owners to throw away their earphones just yet – hip-hop and EDM listeners, for example, may not see much benefit from the new tuning or even find the bassier, slightly more v-shaped DN-1000 preferable. 

Fidue A83 ($280)

The A83 and DN-2000 are both high-end triple-driver hybrid earphones that, to my ears, differ most in presentation, with the A83 having a more out-of-the-head sound but appearing more distant and diffuse, and the DN-2000 sounding more focused and cohesive, but also a bit more closed-in. The Fidue set carries less emphasis in the sub-bass region and more in the mid-bass region, which actually makes its low end sound a little more integrated into the overall sound but takes away from the slam of the bass. The midrange of the DN-2000 is a little more recessed but has better crispness and definition in comparison. The DN-2000 also tends to be smoother up top with the right combination of tips and spacers.

Audiofly AF180 ($550)

Audiofly’s quad-driver AF180 is very good competition for the DN-2000, offering a slightly warmer and smoother sound at the expense of a bit of clarity and spaciousness. The DN-2000 has more bass quantity with deeper sub-bass reach, providing more “slam” on top of greater overall presence. It has a slightly more v-shaped signature, however, and sounds brighter than the AF180. The Audiofly unit boasts more upfront mids and sounds a little warmer and more natural. Clarity is on-par much of the time, but occasionally the brighter DN-2000 pulls ahead, which also affords it better intelligibility. Up top, the DN-2000 is a little bolder and can harsher as a result, whereas the Audiofly is a bit more tame and smooth. The DN-2000 also has a wider presentation while the AF180 sounds a little more intimate – but still plenty spacious and well-imaged for an IEM.

LEAR LUF-4B ($565)

The DN-2000 holds its own very well against the nearly twice as expensive LEAR LUF-4B, the bass-heavy version of LEAR’s universal-fit quad-BA earphone. The LEAR unit is a little warmer than the DN-2000, with slightly more powerful but nonetheless tighter bass. The DN-2000 actually sounds a little boomy next to the LUF-4B, but is brighter and otherwise clearer. The LEAR has more emphasis in the upper midrange and lower treble region, whereas the DN-2000’s brightness comes from emphasis higher up. This leads to the DN-2000 occasionally sounding smoother and more forgiving, but on most tracks the two are pretty even in that respect. The presentation of the LUF-4B is a touch more closed-in whereas the DN-2000 sounds a little more airy and open.

For the sake of fairness, I also pitted the DN-2000 against the less bassy LUF-4F model. The 4F puts up a better fight in ways that matter – while it still carries more emphasis in the upper midrange and lower treble, sounding harsher and less forgiving as a result, it is clearer than the DN-2000 and has a more neutral sound. Bass quality is even better than with the LUF-4F, though quantity is also reduced to below-DN-2000 levels. The bassier DN-2000 is warmer and a touch less balanced and coherent on the whole. 

Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro (approx. $1100)

The Harmony 8 Pro is a high-end custom-fit earphone with a very clear, resolving sound that I thought would make for a good way to gauge how much room for improvement there is left with the DN-2000. The most noticeable difference between the two is in the bass region, where the H8P is rather flat and the DN-2000 isn’t. The bass of the DN-2000 is deeper, with greater sub-bass quantity as well as impact. However, next to the H8P, the low end of the DN-2000 sounds quite overbearing and fairly muddy. In addition to tighter bass, the Custom Art unit sounds more neutral. It also has an advantage in clarity and sounds more laid-back and spacious versus the more intimate DN-2000, with better imaging and detail resolution.

Value (*9/10)* – DUNU’s latest flagship, the DN-2000, pulls out all the stops in an attempt to improve on the preceding model. The packaging is significantly nicer and the accessory pack is bordering on excessive, adding several new bits and bobs to the DN-1000′s already-extensive kit to help stabilize the earphone in the ear. With all of the various eartips and accessories, it is a tinkerer’s dream, though that also means it requires more time and effort to use effectively.

In terms of sound quality, the DUNU DN-2000 is a successful hybrid design. It manages to leverage the bass of the dynamic driver without having it overwhelm the mids and highs, maintains pretty good coherency, and extracts the expected clarity and detail from the balanced armatures without losing note thickness. In its price range, it is one of the IEMs to beat for sheer performance.

*Pros: Great end-to-end extension, deep bass, wide presentation, good clarity; very well-made; extensive fit kit and accessory pack
Cons: Physically large and a bit heavy in the ear*





*(1C25) FLC Technology FLC 8*


Reviewed May 2015

Brief: Variable-tuning triple-driver hybrid IEM with a massive 36 possible sound settings

MSRP: approx. $350
Current Price: *$318* from lendmeurears.com; *$343* from amazon.com
Specs: Driver: _Hybrid, dual BA + dynamic _| Imp: _11Ω_ | Sens: _93 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges; MEElec M6 single-flanges; Comply T400_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), treble/midrange tuning nozzles (4 pairs), bass tuning ports (3 pairs + spares), sub-bass tuning ports (3 pairs + spares), keychain container for tuning parts, tweezers, over-the-ear cable guides (pair), cleaning tool, airplane adapter, 6.3mm adapter, and nice semi-hard carrying case
Build Quality *(4/5)* – The angular plastic housings of the FLC8 are well-made and surprisingly small considering the 3-way hybrid driver configuration. What really sets it apart from other high-end earphones, however, is the tuning system. The housings boast prominent front and rear ports, each with its own set of interchangeable plugs, as well as interchangeable nozzles. A word of caution – be careful when working on the earphones for fear of losing and/or damaging the small parts. Changing sound settings is not something I’d recommend doing on the go.

The cables are detachable, with 2-pin sockets that are slightly recessed on the cable end. Oddly, the included cable is a little on the short side, especially considering the over-the-ear fit. The 1.3m length listed in the product specifications is optimistic by about 10cm.
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Good, though mild audio leakage through the vents can occur at high volumes
Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Very low
Comfort *(4/5)* – In the standard over-ear configuration, the FLC8 is very lightweight and comfortable. Next to conventional ergonomic in-ears, like those manufactured by Shure and Westone, its nozzles are slightly unusual – wide and not angled relative to the earpieces. While maybe not perfect for those with narrow ear canals, this, together with the memory wire-less cables, allows the FLC8 to be worn cable-down as well as cable-up in some ears. The stock eartips of the FLC8 also have an unusual design and only come in three sizes but work well, perhaps reducing bass a touch compared to more conventional tips.

Sound* (9.4/10)* – The tuning system of the FLC8 is far more complex than any other I’ve come across, utilizing three different types of adjustment. There are four interchangeable nozzles, which control the mids and treble, three sets of plugs for the front tuning ports, which control the sub-bass, and three sets of plugs for the rear ports, which control the bass.

Altogether, this allows for 36 different sound signatures – a massive number compared to the three that you commonly get with other variable-tuning earphones such as the AKG K3003 and RHA T10i. To put it another way, if I were to A:B all of the possible sound configurations of the FLC8 against one another, I would have to perform over 600 comparisons.

I’ve summarized how each of the FLC8’s parts is designed to affect sound in Table 1 in the off-site version of this review. As always, the tuning parts work by restricting flow through the respective aperture of the earphones. They range from open ports, to various filters, to completely plugged vents. I attempted to determine the hardware setup of each part and included that information as well.

Subjectively, the sound tuning filters do perform as promised for the most part. In some cases the differences are immediately audible and in others – quite subtle.

The manufacturer includes five sets of recommended combinations for the tuning parts, by music genre. These are listed in Table 2 here. I’ve also added my own preferred setting, which is identical to the “balance” setting save for the heavier sub-bass port.

All of the manufacturer-recommended tunings can be grouped into two categories – those with flat/light bass (vocal, light music, and strings), which differ in the relative balance of mids and treble, and those with the FLC’s equivalent of flat mids/treble, which differ in the amount of bass (balance and pop/rap). My own preferred tuning falls in this second grouping as well.

In my view, then, the FLC8 is best viewed not as an earphone with 36 discrete sound signatures, but one with two or three base configurations that may then be subtly adjusted to one’s liking.

I spent some time trying to ascertain the exact effects of each set of tuning ports. I thought the _light bass_ tunings – the clear sub-bass and bass ports – lacked a little in the way of depth and punch for my liking. The gray _medium sub-bass_ port and the red _high_ _sub-bass_ port, on the other hand, provided plenty of depth and only differed from each other minutely. I ended up preferring the red front sub-bass port – the_high_ setting.

The effect of the rear bass tuning port was more apparent. With the gray _medium bass_ ports, the bass has very nice punch. FLC Technology utilizes the gray ports in their default “balance” tuning, but realistically the impact is greater than with a reference-flat earphone. The clear_low bass _port is closer in bass quantity to a flat unit such as an Etymotic ER4 or the VSonic VC1000, but I found this setting to also impact the treble curve of the earphones with my preferred midrange/treble ports, moving some of the treble peaks closer to the “sibilance” range. Since the extra bass impact of the gray bass ports doesn’t take away from the overall clarity and resolution, I find that setting to be preferable.

The black_ high bass_ port increases the impact even further, to the level of enhanced-bass dynamic-driver earphones like the Shure SE215 and Sony MH1C, albeit with better bass quality. While this doesn’t do bass control any favors, high-end earphones with enhanced bass are few and far between, so it is a welcome option. However, I thought the black bass ports, like the clear ones, caused the highs to sound less smooth and refined compared to the gray _medium bass_ filters.

The relative levels of the mids and treble are controlled by the nozzle filters, of which there are four sets. The dark gray filters, which FLC Technology uses in their neutral setting, ended up being my favorites as the smoothest and most pleasant all around. These are said to offer _medium midrange_ and_ medium treble_ levels.

The green _high treble_ filters were too bright for my liking and made the earphones more harsh and sibilance-prone. The gold _high midrange/medium treble_ filters perform as expected, raising the midrange and upper midrange. This setting is still brighter than the gray filters I preferred, though fans of a forward midrange may very much enjoy it. The last set of filters, the blue medium-mids/low-treble, were the least impressive to me, lacking a little in the way of clarity compared to the stock gray filters with no discernible gains elsewhere.

Keep in mind that the filters are only independent to an extent – making changes to one outlet can affect airflow through others. Therefore, swapping from one filter to another may have slightly different effects depending on the settings of the other ports.

After testing all of the filters, I used the neutral configuration of the FLC8 in most of my listening and A:B comparisons, except where it was an especially poor signature match.

In this configuration, the FLC8 has powerful bass that hits harder compared to most balanced-armature in-ear monitors, even relatively bass-heavy ones such as the EarSonics SM64. The SM64 has a noticeably less rich and impactful – though also marginally more controlled – low end. Same goes for relatively balanced-sounding dynamic-driver sets, such as the Philips Fidelio S2 and VSonic GR07 Bass Edition. The bass quantity reminds me of another hybrid earphone, the Fidue A83, and falls short of truly bass-heavy sets such as the Sennheiser IE 800 and JVC HA-FX700. Bass extension is very good and bass quality is superb for the quantity.

Equally impressive is the clarity of the FLC8 – the mids, while not at all forward in the stock configuration, can’t be called recessed either and are impressively close in clarity to high-end analytical earphones like the Brainwavz B2 and VSonic VC1000. The FLC8 is noticeably clearer than the very capable TDK BA200, EarSonics SM64, and Philips Fidelio S2. There is no upper midrange dip as there is, for instance, on the SM64 and Fidue A83, which allows the FLC unit better crispness and overall resolution, as well as superior vocal intelligibility.

Moving on up into the treble, the FLC8 strikes a fine balance of presence and smoothness. Even in the stock configuration it’s not a very forgiving earphone and can probably be classified as “slightly bright” on the whole. At higher volumes it gets harsher, as is usually the case with this type of sound sig, but still fares better than the excellent DUNU DN-2000, for instance. As expected, darker-sounding earphones like the TDK BA200 and EarSonics SM64 are smoother and more forgiving, but lack the sparkle and energy of the FLC8.  Its strong treble presence and excellent end-to-end extension also give the FLC8 some advantage in dynamics in soundstaging, beating the TDK BA200, SM64, and Fidelio S2 in width and, with the exception of the SM64, depth and dynamics, by a margin.

Interestingly, I also found the sensitivity higher than implied by the earphone’s specifications – despite the 93dB/mW stated figure, the FLC8 actually exhibited above-average efficiency in my testing.

*Select Comparisons*

Note: unless otherwise noted, the neutral configuration of the FLC8 was used for comparisons

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

VSonic’s mid-range heavyweight generally competes well with pricier earphones, but the FLC8 is out of its reach. The bass of the FLC8, even in its “neutral” configuration, is deeper and more powerful, but the GR07 still impresses with its bass quality, matching if not beating the FLC8 in control and the overall realism of its bass presentation.

The biggest advantage the FLC8 has over the GR07 is its midrange. There, the FLC8 is more natural, with a more crisp, resolving sound and vocals that are more upfront and realistic. The slight midrange recession of the GR07 causes the mids of the VSonic unit to sound less clear, less detailed, and significantly more laid-back, even distant, compared to the FLC8.

The FLC8 is a touch brighter overall. It can be more revealing, but still sounds more natural than the GR07, thanks in part to the more level midrange and to the GR07’s greater sibilance. Also worth noting is the higher efficiency of the FLC unit.

DUNU DN-2000 ($280)

The DN-2000 is perhaps the closest overall match for the FLC8 in my IEM collection. Like the FLC8, it is a triple-driver hybrid earphone with a sound signature slightly on the v-shaped side of neutral. Both earphones have similar strengths, including bass punch, clarity, and soundstaging. The differences between them are subtle, but add up.

The DUNU boasts a little more of both bass impact and depth, for instance. Modifying the configuration of the FLC8 from “neutral” by moving to the high sub-bass port helps in this regard, but the DN-2000 still maintains slightly better depth. On the whole, the FLC8 sounds a little warmer than the DN-2000, thanks largely to its less bright treble presentation. Its bass still provides plenty of impact when called for but on average is a little more subtle and less intrusive compared to the DUNU unit.

The FLC8 has an overall less v-shaped sound signature with a little more midrange presence. Combined with its marginally larger and more dynamic presentation, this makes for a slightly more natural sound. Up top, too, the DN-2000 is slightly brighter and more metallic-sounding, though both earphones tend to be rather revealing. In fact, depending on track I sometimes found the treble curve of the FLC8 to be more bothersome in terms of harshness and/or sibilance, and other times the DN-2000 was the bigger culprit.

InEar StageDiver SD-2 ($450)

The SD-2 is a warmer, more mid-centric sort of earphone than the FLC8, but it is one of the most capable such sets I’ve tried and makes for an interesting comparison with the “neutral” configuration of the FLC8. First, the FLC8 is a bassier earphone all around – depth, impact, rumble, and so on. The bass of the SD-2 is slightly tighter, but that is as expected due to the bass quantity difference. Taking the FLC8 into its low-bass configuration creates more parity between the two in bass quantity and quality, but makes the already-brighter FLC unit even brighter – a poorer signature match on the whole.

The FLC8 is clearer than the SD-2, due in part to its stronger treble, while the more level SD-2 appears mid-centric thanks to its lower bass quantity and duller highs. One advantage the SD-2 does have is smoother and more forgiving treble, which is something the FLC8 can’t match in any configuration. The presentation of the SD-2 is competent, but a mid-centric sound is never an asset when it comes to dynamics. On the whole, I found the FLC8 to sound more convincing more of the time thanks to a combination of better soundstaging and dynamics, clarity, and bass punch.

Westone W40 ($500)

The W40 is a quad-armature monster with a bit of bass enhancement and a warmer, darker sound signature. In its “neutral” configuration, I did indeed find the FLC8 to be more neutral than the W40 thanks to its brighter sound and broader frequency response. The bass of the FLC8 is not too different the W40 in overall power, but appears deeper thanks to a greater sub-bass focus and a less audible mid-bass hump.

The FLC8 is clearer through the midrange, but up top it sounds more harsh and sibilance-prone than the smoother, darker Westone unit. The FLC8 also has a wider and more “broad” presentation, as v-shaped earphones tend to do when compared to warmer or more midrange-focused ones.

I also switched the FLC8 to its bassier “pop/rap” configuration, but it didn’t make much of difference in this comparison. In this setting, the bass of the FLC8 was clearly more powerful than that of the W40 and the bass quality was more equal between the two. Despite this, the remainder of the comparison above still held true with the FLC8 remaining the brighter, clearer, and “wider” of the two earphones. Also, the FLC8 is more efficient than the quad-driver W40 in any configuration.

Audiofly AF180 ($550)

The signature of the AF180 is an interesting one, with some traits from smoother and more mid-focused sets such as the StageDiver SD-2 and TDK BA200, and others from brighter, more analytical earphones. Audiofly’s flagship IEM turned out to be a stronger competitor for the FLC8 than its counterparts from Westone and InEar, the W40 and SD-2/SD-3.

Once again, the FLC8 is the more efficient earphone. Its sound signature is more v-shaped, with deeper, more enhanced bass and brighter, more sparkly highs. This brighter tone is most noticeable with vocals. The FLC8 is a bit clearer as well, though also more prone to sibilance thanks to its extra treble energy. Where the AF180 shines is in providing a very flat and neutral midrange. Though vocals are a little more dull compared to the brighter FLC8, they end up sounding more prominent, full-bodied, and natural on the whole.

Value *(9/10)* – Despite the ever-increasing number of IEM offerings on the market in 2015, it’s rare to come across an earphone as unique as the FLC Technology FLC8. The main draw is the flexible 36-setting sound tuning system, though I found it best viewed as two or three “base” sound signatures that can each be altered slightly to one’s liking.

Not all of the possible tunings are brilliant and swapping out the ports is an exercise in patience and finesse even with the included tweezers and spare parts, but it’s pretty easy to alter the sound once you get the hang of it. Those who get tired of listening to the same sound signature – or aren’t yet sure of exactly what sort of sound they want – are certain to find extra value here.

It’s not just the tuning system that makes the earphone special, however – even if limited to the default tuning, the FLC8 would be a superb-sounding set with one of the lightest and most comfortable form factors among hybrid IEMs, and that already makes it worthy of a strong recommendation.

*Pros: top-tier audio performance; functional sound tuning system allows for more adjustment than other variable-tuning IEMs; very lightweight and comfortable for a 3-driver hybrid
Cons: small, easy-to-lose/damage parts mean this is an earphone solely for enthusiasts*







*(1C26) LIFE Headphones*



Added December 2015

Brief: dual-BA sports/lifestyle earphone being launched via crowdfunding
MSRP: $309
Current Price: *$250* at Lifeacoustics.com
Specs: Driver: _dual BA_ | Imp: _36Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug; detachable with 2-pin connector_
Nozzle Size: _4 mm_ | Preferred tips: _Earsonics double-flanges; MEElec A151 single-flanges/Shure flex sleeves_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), cleaning tool, and zippered carrying case (note: the tips run a bit small – XS/S/M rather than S/M/L)
Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – The LIFE Headphones use a two-piece plastic shell reminiscent of those used by professional in-ear monitor manufacturers such as Westone and EarSonics. The unusual shape of the earpieces seems a little more fragile than those monitors, but the earphones do use detachable, user-replaceable cables (with conventional 2-pin connectors) and are said to be sweat-resistant. The cable is similar to what is normally found on custom monitors – twisted and lightweight, with a medium length of memory wire at the earpieces and a slim L-shaped plug
Isolation *(4/5)* – Good with the right tips; on par with other balanced armature in-ears
Microphonics *(5/5)* – As usual with this type of cable, microphonics are nonexistent
Comfort *(4/5)* – The shape of the monitors is very unusual but surprisingly comfortable. Because only the bottom half of the earpieces ends up in contact with the ear, they actually feel like a compact Shure or Westone model when worn. The extremely light weight of the plastic earpieces and cables, together with the moldable memory wire section on the cords, makes the fit extremely secure as well

Sound *(9/10)* – One of several new crowdfunding-backed earphones I’ve tried in the past year, the LIFE Headphones are dual-armature IEMs tuned for a balanced sound. LIFE actually has a fairly lengthy – though at times oversimplified – explanation of the earphones’ specs on the company website, a pretty unique piece of content that implies a commitment to audio performance.

The two-way, dual-BA setup of the LIFE Headphones provides a broad frequency response and has very high sensitivity. This means a very clean audio source should be used – any hiss or electrical noise present will be heard clearly in the earphones. Even my FIIO E07k DAC, which has a fairly low noise floor, produces a small amount of audible hiss with the LIFE.

The sound of the LIFE Headphones is fairly unique for a dual balanced armature earphone – it is mildly v-shaped, with good bass punch, slightly laid-back mids, and bright treble. In many ways the tuning reminds me of the pricier triple-driver Alclair Reference custom-fit monitors.

To get a better measure of the performance of the LIFE headphones, I compared them to three of the best-performing dual-BA earphones I’ve tried – the recently-discontinued TDK BA200 and VSonic VC1000 and the Japan-import Audio-Technica ATH-IM02.

In terms of bass the LIFE falls about mid-pack. There’s a bit more bass power compared to the TDK BA200, but a bit less impact, depth, and weight compared to the Audio-Technica ATH-IM02. For a balanced armature earphone this is actually a very good amount of punch, and the bass quality is excellent as well. Of course, the LIFE isn’t a good match for listeners who prefer enhanced bass (and are willing to give up some tightness to get it). To put this in perspective, compared to Philips’ dynamic-driver in-ear flagship, the Fidelio S2 – itself a fairly accurate-sounding in-ear with only slight bass boost – the LIFE Headphones provide significantly lower bass quantity and better bass control.

The midrange takes a step back in emphasis – it is not as upfront and balanced as with the BA200 or VC1000 and tends to be a little less revealing of fine detail as a result. The IM02 from Audio-Technica, on the other hand, has clarity and detail levels similar to the LIFE Headphones but tends to sound a little more full-bodied. Keep in mind that this is all in the context of these four being high-end BA montors – the dynamic-driver Philips Fidelio S2 doesn’t manage the detail or clarity of the LIFE Headphones.

The highs of the LIFE Headphones pick up a bit and sound fairly bright – more so than the BA200 and ATH-IM02 and nearly on-par with the more energetic VC1000. The brightness helps the LIFE Headphones sound clearer, but they are also less forgiving and more prone to sibilance than the BA200 and IM02. Just like the popular VSonic GR07 monitors, I wouldn’t recommend the LIFE for listeners who are sensitive to sibilance.

My favorite aspect of the LIFE Headphones besides the bass is the presentation. The earphone’s soundstage is well-rounded and spacious, especially considering the sound tuning. The LIFE Headphones sound more dynamic than the flatter VSonic VC1000 and have a more natural soundstage with better depth compared to the Fidelio S2.

*Select Comparisons*

HiFiMan RE-400 ($79)

The RE-400 is one of the best-performing audiophile earphones in its price range and is tuned for a different type of balanced sound than the LIFE Headphones – one with more focus on the midrange and smoother, more relaxed treble. The LIFE Headphones deliver more linear bass with better depth and slightly greater punch compared to the RE-400. They also have brighter treble, which results in greater overall clarity compared to the RE-400 but also makes the LIFE headphones more prone to harshness and sibilance. Lastly, the more mid-centric RE-400 also tends to be a little less dynamic and doesn’t have quite as wide and versatile a soundstage as the LIFE Headphones.

VSonic GR07 Classic ($99)

Yet another tried-and-true in-ear monitor benchmark popular in the audiophile community, the GR07 is also tuned for a near-neutral sound but has significantly lower sensitivity and a slightly different sound signature with a bit more bass and less treble. The GR07 sounds a bit more scooped-out in the midrange, which makes me prefer the overall bass-midrange balance of the LIFE even though I appreciate the bass impact of the GR07. The LIFE Headphones have a thinner note and brighter treble with a similar amount of sibilance to the GR07 but slightly more harshness. The presentation, on the other hand, is slightly lacking in depth with the VSonics and is more well-rounded and three-dimensional with the LIFE unit.

Aurisonics Rockets ($249)

Like the LIFE Headphones, the Rockets are a Kickstarter-backed earphone that also happens to be similar in price ($250) and its lifestyle-oriented marketing message, including sweat resistance. Its straight-barrel metal form factor and dynamic driver are very different from the LIFE unit, however, and its sound much more closely resembles that of the HiFiMan RE-400.
Compared to the LIFE Headphones, the Rockets have slightly greater bass quantity and depth while maintaining similar bass quantity/tightness. The midrange of the Rockets is more forward, while the treble is more laid-back. The Rockets are smoother and more forgiving of harshness and sibilance, but also sound a little dull in comparison to the LIFE at times. The LIFE, on the other hand, has bright and energetic treble. The Rockets are also much less sensitive than the LIFE Headphones and will take a lot more power to hit the same volume levels.

InEar StageDiver SD-2 ($449)

The StageDiver SD-2 is a dual-balanced armature earphone, like the LIFE Headphones, but is designed and tuned primarily for stage use. Its sound is warmer, with more midrange presence and extremely smooth treble. The LIFE headphones sound thinner and clearer, partly because of the brighter treble. The downside is that they are more sibilant compared to the rather forgiving SD-2. The presentation of the SD-2 is more forward and intimate thanks to the more prominent mids, while the LIFE Headphones have a more laid-back sound and wider soundstage.

Value* (8/10)* – The LIFE Headphones are a comfortable and balanced-sounding in-ear monitor that combines the usual perks of BA drivers – clarity, tight bass, good noise isolation, and high efficiency – with a feature set made for active use. The memory wire cables keep the earphones securely in place and detachable cables make up for the plastic housings, though care should still be taken not to exert too much pressure on the thin part of the housings when changing tips or detaching the cords. With the advertised sweat resistance, the LIFE Headphones may just be the most audiophile-friendly purpose-made workout buds on the market.

*Pros: Surprisingly comfortable in the ear; no cable noise; excellent bass quality and soundstage presentation
Cons: Can be sibilant at times; housings should be handled with care*








*Tier 1B ($400-600)


(1B1) Audio-Technica ATH-CK100*


Reviewed Apr 2010

Details: Triple-driver flagship from Japanese audio firm Audio-Technica
Current Price: (discontinued) (MSRP: $649.99)
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _23 Ω_ | Sens: _113 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size:_ 4mm _| Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrid, stock foamies_
Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear* or straight down_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), heat-activated foam tips, and a soft magnetic-clasp carrying case
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The housings are made partially of Titanium and partially of thick plastic; an integrated strain relief protects the cables at the entry point. The thick and flexible cord (which is also used by the ATH-CK10) is internally braided for extra strength and is quite possibly the best in the industry. The well-relieved 3.5mm L-plug is shared with the lower-end ATH-CK90Pro
Isolation *(4/5)* – Sealed-back and very small, the CK100 gives a perfect seal every time and isolates very well with the foam tips and nearly as well with silicones
Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Nonexistent when worn cord-up and barely noticeable when worn cord down
Comfort *(5/5)* – Small housings are designed to be worn cable-up but the offset stem means that they can be worn cord-down very easily as well. The small size and low weight make it easy to forget about them completely

Sound *(9.2/10)* – As a big fan of the older and wiser ATH-CK10, the CK100 has always had great appeal for me – appeal that was consistently counterbalanced by the $650 sticker price. When an opportunity to experience the CK100 for several weeks presented itself, I put all other reviews aside and began to prepare for the experience. I can say right up front that the CK100 is unlike any earphone or headphone I’ve ever heard. But let’s start at the beginning.

Initially everything is quite ordinary, with a subtle low end that gets bolder as the frequency counter approaches triple digits. Sub-bass is quite low on the CK100 – bass response definitely isn’t as linear as it is on either the CK10 or CK90Pro. Mid- and upper bass, however, is noticeably fuller on the CK100. Compared to the CK10 and CK90Pro, both of which have some of the shortest decay times of any IEMs I’ve tried, the bass of the CK100 actually carries more information. Still, the rumble commonly found in high-end dynamics is nearly nonexistent and the bass is very tight and fast. Naturally, there is no bass bleed. In fact, the CK100 are the only IEM I’ve tried so far in which the opposite is true – the lower midrange can overshadow upper bass.

This is counterintuitive for a reason – most headphones would need a gargantuan midrange boost to start drowning out the low end. The mids of the CK100 are indeed very forward, especially towards the top of the midrange. Listening to them side by side with the Ortofon e-Q7 makes the difference between mid-centric and mid-forward sound very obvious. The Ortofons are mid-centric – no part of their signature does anything to distract the listener from their midrange. The CK100s, on the other hand, do everything in their power to direct the listener to the midrange. Mids that are emphasized this much had better be good; and they are - with a single reservation – the CK100 has to like what it is plugged into (more on this later). The most striking property of the midrange of the CK100 is the extreme smoothness. Nearly as impressive is the transparency, which is partially responsible for the touchy nature of the earphones in terms of source pairing. Depending on the source, the mids of the CK100 can sound slightly cool or faintly warm. Towards the top of the midrange the emphasis reaches its peak without a trace of harshness or sibilance, resulting in a shiny but very controlled sound. Midrange detail is actually easier to discern with the CK100 than the CK10 due to the far greater midrange weight. Another effect of the peculiar balance is the low-volume prowess of the CK100 –only the Head-Direct RE252 can compete with them for minimal-volume listening enjoyment.

Moving on up into the treble, the CK100 maintains its incredible smoothness but due to the forward midrange, the treble seems less emphasized when compared to the ATH-CK10. Still, the CK100 can almost match the CK10 in extension and treble detail without sounding quite as bright or sparkly. Those who find the CK10 slightly sibilant should have no bones to pick with the CK100 – the shimmering and energetic treble is about as smooth as it gets without a sacrifice in quantity.

In terms of presentation the CK100 also holds its own quite easily against the best of the best. Though the soundstage is not the widest or deepest in absolute terms, instrumental separation, spatial positioning, and imaging are superb, especially in the midrange and treble. The forward nature of the mids results in a beautifully layered sound that works great with big band music and solo performances alike. Combined with the absolutely astonishing way in which the CK100 renders strings, woodwinds, and brass instruments this gives them an almost magical quality with string quartets and orchestral pieces. When vocals are present the CK100 always places them front and center. While this may not be to everyone’s liking, it really brings out more detail in vocals than I can hear even with my Heed-driven AKG K601, making them look like a great value compared to the $800 full-size rig.

Lastly, I want to discuss the one big caveat of the CK100 – the effect of source selection on that touchy and transparent midrange. When paired with a warm source, the mids of the CK100 are extremely sweet and actually somewhat relaxing. When paired with a source that is cold or neutral, the CK100 tends towards coolness and the quick-tempered midrange becomes a bit hard-edged, especially when it comes to female vocals. For this reason neither the Sansa players nor my iBasso D10 can elicit the full potential of the CK100. The S:Flo2 fares far better but buzzes very noticeably when paired with the CK100s. The buzzing is a problem with the player rather than the earphones but is annoying nonetheless. In order to kill the buzzing I had to run the S:Flo2 through an amp. The iBasso T4, though warm and very portable, actually detracts from the excellent resolution of the earphones. Ditto on my Music Valley RC-1. In the end, I settled on my aging DIY mini3, which is clearly overkill for the CK100 in terms of driving power but gives the desired tonality. If not for the tendency of the CK100 to reject otherwise decent sources for their tonal balance, I would have no problem declaring the CK100 the best sounding IEM I have heard; it certainly shows the most technical potential. But while it may be expected of high-end full-size cans, I consider this capriciousness of the CK100 a negative for an IEM and cannot put the CK100 a clear step above the other top-tiers.

Value *(7.5/10)* – Audio-Technica’s strict hold on distribution of their earphones makes the ATH-CK100 one of the world’s most expensive universals outside of Japan. Due to the inconsistent pricing, the touchy nature of the signature, and the fact that some people will love the forward mids and others will hate them, the value of the CK100 is extremely subjective. What isn’t subjective is the build quality, which is superior to any and all earphones I have held in my hands. Isolation, microphonics, and comfort are all far above average as well. As a total package the CK100 makes sense to me even with a $450 price tag. Just prepare to do some source tweaking to unleash their full potential.

*Pros: Market-leading build quality, great comfort and isolation, addictively forward sound
Cons: Inconsistent pricing outside of Japan, love-it-or-hate-it midrange, picky with sources*


*(1B2) 1964EARS 1964-T*


Reviewed Feb 2011

Details: Two-way, triple-driver custom from Oregon-based 1964EARS
Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: est. $500)
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _37Ω_ | Sens: _113 dB_ | Freq: _30-17k Hz_ | Cable: _4.6’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _N/A_ | Preferred tips: _N/A_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Shirt clip, ¼” adapter, cleaning tool, ear mold lubricant, carrying pouch, and protective storage case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – At the heart of the 1964-T are twin Sonion 2015 armatures, used for the lows and mids, and a smaller treble driver I can’t identify molded in a dual-bore configuration. Molding quality is adequate – there are bubbles here and there and the finish around the cable socket and nozzle bores isn’t quite up there with what I’ve seen of Unique Melody molds. On the upside, the 1964-T utilizes a Westone Elite Series cable with a standard Westone socket (multiple lengths and colors are available). A recessed socket is available at an additional cost, as is custom artwork, custom colors, and carbon-fiber faceplates
Isolation *(4/5)* – The isolation provided by the fitted acrylic shells is excellent, though it may not seem so at first. The passive attenuation is slightly below what the higher-end Etymotic earphones are capable of but higher than the universal stage monitors from the likes of Westone and EarSonics
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent, as is the case with all monitors fitted with Westone cables. The included shirt clip and cable cinch should still be used if the 1964-T was to be exercised in but for day-to-day use I don’t see myself bothering with either
Comfort *(5/5)* – The most obvious contrast to universal earphones is the lack of ‘suction’ created by the soft tips of most universals. Putting the customs in requires a bit of getting used to but the twisting motion eventually becomes second nature. The acrylic shells are hard but not in the least uncomfortable – sometimes I am aware of them and other times I forget they’re in my ears at all. Obviously fit will always depend on the quality of the initial molds and maybe a bit of luck but I can’t imagine a properly-fitting custom being uncomfortable. Naturally, 1964 offers a 30-day fit guarantee, which should be taken advantage of if the customs remain even a tiny bit uncomfortable after an initial break-in period.

Sound *(9.2/10)* - I ordered the 1964-T blindly, knowing nothing of its signature other than that it had less bass than the 1964-Q; that and the fact that two-way crossovers have always seemed sufficient to me in terms of covering the entire frequency spectrum - earphones such as the Fischer Audio DBA-02 are a testament to that. Those who have been following my IEM review thread or individual reviews have probably figured out that my preference leans towards leaner and brighter sound signatures – within reason, of course. The 1964-T, however, is neither lean nor thick, bright nor dark. It possesses one of the more neutral signatures I’ve heard out of an IEM which, I suppose, is the idea behind a stage monitor.

The bass is tight and controlled. Sub-bass roll-off strongly reminds of the Fischer-Audio DBA-02 and the mid-bass lift is only mild. In terms of impact and bass weight the 1964-T falls below earphones such as the EarSonics SM3 and Westone 3 but slightly above the Westone 2 and DBA-02 – around the level of a TripleFi 10 and more than adequate for my tastes. Next to bassier dynamic-driver earphones, the 1964-T suffers from no lack of texture or detail but the grunt isn’t really there. Those looking for a custom to match the bottom end of dynamic-driver sets such as the Sennheiser IE8 wand Monster MD will want to look elsewhere – perhaps at the 1964-Q. Despite barely keeping up with the UE TF10 in bass quantity, the 1964-T offers a more satisfying overall experience – its bass is simply more fleshed-out, more tactile. Texturing is better, individual notes are more resolved, and attack and decay times are more natural. The bass of the 1964-T is pretty much what one would expect from a very good armature-based earphone, much like that of the EarSonics SM3 but with slightly more clarity and bit less ‘viscosity’ and softness.

From the bass we move on to the midrange – a clean and crisp affair overflowing with texture. The 1964-T is the first earphone I’ve heard that nearly matches the CK10 and DBA-02 on both counts without sounding lean. It’s always been my opinion that high levels of texture are antithetical to what we commonly perceive as ‘smoothness’, and the 1964-T really isn’t a smooth earphone on that count. Thickness and articulation of note are both very impressive, falling closer to the healthy median of the Klipsch Custom 3 and Westone 2 than the thick-and-smooth SM3/UM3X or the leaner W3/CK10/DBA-02 crop. The 1964-T sounds tactile and well-weighted but not overly ‘creamy’. There is just a hint of warmth carried over from the bass but none of the ‘veil’ commonly attributed to such tonal characteristics. Although the mids are not particularly forward, I have no need to strain to pick out fine detail or tonal intricacies – my Triple.Fi 10 sounds both thinner and more smoothed-over in comparison. Indeed, the entire signature of the 1964-T is somewhat laid-back, with a low end that is a half-step more forward than the midrange and treble. Those looking for a forward, overly lush, liquid, or falsely sweet midrange will probably be best off looking somewhere else – what you get here is an earphone that’s slightly dry in sonic character but quite forthcoming with every little bit of information.

Not unlike the midrange, the treble is accurate and slightly laid-back. Crispness, clarity, and detail are all up there with the better universal earphones. Those looking for brightness or sparkle will be sorely disappointed – the 1964-T is offers neither – but when it comes to technical proficiency the single treble driver performs quite well. Neither sibilance nor harshness is an issue, unless of course sibilance is already present in the source material. Like the midrange, the treble is smooth and even on the whole but not ‘smoothed-over’ when examined more closely. In contrast to the 3-way EarSonics SM3, the treble of the 1964 triples never really sounds lacking in emphasis except at the very top and always remains relatively hard-edged when it comes to presenting detail. Those looking for a softened treble presentation would probably be better off with the Ortofon earphones or one of the high-end dynamics (RE262 or Monster MD). My personal tastes lean in the opposite direction and I find the 1964-T just aggressive enough to keep my attention most of the time.

Lastly we come to the presentation – perhaps the one aspect of the 1964-T’s sound least in-line with my expectations. For some reason I expected it to either be either thick, creamy, and mid-forward, like the UM3X, or spacious and airy, like the CK10, but the truth lies somewhere in-between. The soundstage of the 1964-T is above average in size but has neither the intimacy of the UM3X nor the wide-open feel of the CK10. A few months ago I would have been disappointed, but as I recently outlined in my EarSonics SM3 review, a stage of this size makes sense for an armature-based earphone. As I said in the SM3 write-up, a massive stage works (more or less) for something like the Sennheiser IE8, with its huge bass and immense dynamic presence, but an armature-based earphone would sound thinner trying to fill all of that space. In addition, the soundstage of the IE8 has an ‘inner limit’, meaning that it seems to start some distance away from the listener, but the ability to accurately portray intimacy is one of the necessary hallmarks of a good stage monitor. The 1964-T can indeed sound quite intimate, though not in the eerie centered-yet-enveloping way the SM3 can, but tends to spread things out more evenly across its stage. The stage is wider than it is tall or deep and the space is elliptical in nature, as is the case with most in-ears. The good, though not Monster MD-good, dynamics allow the 1964-T to portray distance as well as direction accurately and imaging is almost on par with what the thinner-sounding CK10 is capable of. Instrumental separation and layering are both good but stop short of what the Westone UM3X can achieve. On the whole, I don’t feel that the presentation of the 1964-T is necessarily better than that of most high-end universals but it does provide its - competitive - flavor.

Value *(8/10)* – The 1964-T currently runs $400 plus the cost of shipping, customization, and impressions. For most, the base model will end up running just over $450 – a price lower than that of some top-tier universals. For that you get the fit and isolation of a custom earphone, not to mention the build quality and customization options that come with venturing into customs territory. I won’t say that the 1964-T is better than every universal I’ve ever heard in every aspect of its signature, but as a total package it is very proficient. Is it the earphone for everyone? Not exactly. The 1964-T has a sound signature – as do all universals and, I imagine, all customs – and that signature may not be to everyone’s liking. Moreover, the sound signature of a custom cannot be modified with alternate tips or a different insertion angle as it can with universal earphones. A set of customs is also not as easy to walk away from – to return or re-sell – and not quite as simple to live with day-to-day. Once the 1964-T is in my ears, however, all of these considerations simply melt away. Even when driven by a low-cost portable player, its sound is still on par with my favourite universal IEMs and, in my opinion, well worth the price of admission.

*Pros: Balanced, detailed, and accurate sound on-par with the best universals in most aspects; excellent long-term comfort
Cons: Correct insertion takes some getting used to; less isolating than silicone-shelled customs;*

For my full, in-depth review of the 1964-T please see here


*(1B3) Westone 4*


Reviewed Mar 2011

Details: Westone’s new flagship and the first quad-driver universal earphone
Current Price: *$449* from bhphotovideo.com (MSRP: $639.00)
Specs: Driver: _Quad BA_ | Imp: _31Ω_ | Sens: _118 dB_ | Freq: _10-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Shure Gray Flex, Shure Olives, Earsonics Bi-flanges_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Single-flange conical (3 sizes) and rounded (3 sizes) silicone tips, triple-flange silicone tips, Comply foam tips (3 sizes), ¼” adapter, in-line volume control, filter and tip cleaning tool, and hard clamshell carrying case with carabiner
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The build of the W4 is almost identical to that the Westone 3. The housings are made of plastic and the multi-strand cables are twisted for extra strength. The y-split, housing entry, and 3.5mm L-plug are all very well-relieved
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Quite good, especially with longer tips
Microphonics *(5/5)* – The W4 can only be worn over-the-ear and microphonics are nonexistent
Comfort *(4/5)* – As is the case with the W3, the shells of the W4 are quite ‘fat’ in comparison to those used by the Westone 1 and 2 and quite a bit heavier. The nozzle is also a bit short for my liking but, luckily, the sound of the W4 seems far less dependent on seal quality than that of the W3 so a wider variety of comfort-oriented tips can be used

Sound *(9.3/10)* – As the first quad-driver universal-fit IEM, the W4 brings with it an undeniably high level of expectations when it comes to sound quality, especially considering Westone’s expertise in portable audio. Having heard all of the company’s universal models except for the aging UM1 and UM2, I can honestly say that the W4 rules the coop. The UM3X, W3, and W2 are all top-tier earphones as far as I am concerned but they are not perfect. The W4 isn’t either, but it’s a tad closer, blending the best traits of the W2 and UM3X in a single, easy-going package. Interestingly, though the specifications of the W4 are remarkably close to those of the W2, I don’t find the earphone to be as sensitive to source as the lower-end W2 and W3 models. It does not hiss with my netbook and its sonic flavor remains fairly consistent across a wide range of sources, much like that of the ATH-CK10 and my 1964-T customs.

First, a note on the fit – while the W4 uses the same ergonomically-styled but somewhat tubby housings as the W3, it is far more forgiving of a less-than-perfect insertion angle. As a result, jamming it as far as possible into the ear canal really isn’t necessary and shorter tips such as the included gray single-flange sleeves will work just fine for many listeners. Once fitted, the W4 immediately surprises with the tame nature of its low end - for an earphone with two dedicated bass drivers, the W4 has undoubtedly been tuned for quality over quantity. Don’t get me wrong – there is still more bass than there would be in a strictly ‘flat’ earphone such as the CK10 – but the quantity trails the powerful and aggressive W3 by miles. In fact, the W4 seems to have a bit less bass body than the UM3X and only a touch more than the W2. The quality of the bass is very difficult to fault – it is extremely linear and speed and control impress even next to the ruler-flat ATH-CK10 and my 1964EARS customs. The bass is also very slightly soft in nature, providing a good compromise between the tight and decay-shy bass provided by more analytical earphones such as the CK10 and DBA-02 and the smoother, thicker, and more full-bodied low ends of the UM3X, SM3, and SM2. For me, the bass of the W4 is always plentiful but never excessive.

The W4’s midrange again strikes a good balance between the forward and creamy-sounding mids of the UM3X and SM3 and the thinner, slightly grainier midrange of the W2. In direct contrast to the slightly recessed midrange of the W3, the mids of the W4 are just a bit forward in the soundscape. They are also slightly warm and extremely smooth. Detail and resolution put the W4 on-par with other top-shelf earphones but clarity is still hindered slightly by the thickness in comparison to the CK10, DBA-02, FI-BA-SS, and other clarity-focused earphones. To me, the midrange presentation of the W4 sounds quite natural both in texture and tone but it really wouldn’t be much of a stretch to call the W4 a mid-centric earphone. In this particular case, however, the mids are so polished and refined that having them as the focus of the sound signature is fine by me.

The treble of the W4, too, achieves a compromise between the other Westone models. It is not as hot and exciting as that of the W3, nor is it as dull and lazy as that of the UM3X. Instead, it is smooth and inoffensive, with good extension and solid presence across the range. Detail is excellent as well and while the W4 isn’t nearly as sparkly or energetic as the ATH-CK10 or Fischer DBA-02, I can’t image anyone taking offense with its treble, either. It is definitely a sweet-sounding earphone on the whole, though, so those who are after something crisp and edgy will want to stick to the W3 or go with another brand.

The presentation of the W4 may just be the most impressive aspect of its sound. The soundstage is similar in size to that of the W3 but the outstanding separation and imaging are closer to those of the UM3X. The resulting sound is not nearly as intimate as that of the UM3X but remains full and coherent despite the greater soundstage size without becoming as ‘falsely’ enveloping as that of the Earsonics SM3. As stated in my review of the SM3, there is definitely a sweet spot for soundstage size in armature IEMs – too large and the earphones will start to sound ‘thinned out’; too small and congestion can become an issue. The W4 puts some natural-sounding distance between the listener and the music but does so without placing much of a ‘veil’ over the sound – an impressive feat. Though the UM3X does not sound notably veiled either, its notes are a bit softer than those of the W4 and its subdued treble results in decreased airiness compared to the new flagship. The tone of the W4, too, is slightly more neutral than that of the UM3X and the timbre is on-par with the SM3 and about as good as it gets for BA-based earphones.

Value *(8.5/10)* – With the introduction of the W4, Westone has once again raised the stakes in the driver wars between high-end IEM manufacturers – something they’ve done at least twice in the past. The fit, comfort, build quality, and isolation are all what we’ve come to expect from Westone products but it should come as no surprise that the sound of the W4 is an evolutionary, rather than revolutionary, step up from the company’s previous flagships. The sound signature requires almost no qualifications for those familiar with Westone products – well-rounded, refined, and spacious, the W4 is a very difficult earphone do dislike. Clearly it is not for those seeking FAD-like clarity, exciting treble, or explosive bass but the balance and realism of the new Westones is difficult to fault. Easily one of the best universal all-rounders I’ve come across.

*Pros: Impressive isolation, build quality, and accessory pack; no cable noise; excellent balance & soundstaging
Cons: Tubby shells may not be ergonomic for some*

Huge thanks to *rawrster* for an extended loan of the Westone 4



(*1B4) Shure SE530*


Reviewed June 2011

Details: Shure's previous flagship and one of the first triple-armature universal-fit earphones
Current Price: N/A (discontinued) (MSRP: $449)
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _36Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _18-19k Hz_ | Cable: _18" I-plug + 3' extension (I-plug) or 9" extension (I-plug)_
Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple flanges, Shure Olives_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* - Single-flange (3 sizes) and triple-flange silicone tips, Olive foam tips (3 sizes), cleaning tool, over-the-ear cable guides, ¼" adapter, in-line attenuator, airline adapter, hard clamshell carrying case, 3' extension cable, and 9" extension cable
Build Quality *(4/5)* - The ergonomically-shaped housings of the SE530 are made out of shiny bronze-colored plastic. The nozzle is a separate piece (in contrast to the SE535) and the entire shell feels rather sturdy. Strain reliefs are extremely beefy and the modular cable is thicker than what's found on most portable headphones. Early production SE530s are infamous for cable cracking issues
Isolation *(4/5)* - As with most ergo-fit monitors, the SE530 isolates quite a lot with longer tips such as the included triple-flanges
Microphonics *(4.5/5)* - The SE530 can only be worn cable-up and microphonics are nearly nonexistent
Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The rounded housings and over-the-ear fit of the SE530 make the earphones quite comfortable for prolonged use and the fit kit provides plenty of tip options. Size-wise the SE530 is similar to the W3 but longer, more shallowly angled nozzle should make the fit more universal. One annoyance is the modular cable, which is quite thick and can be unwieldy

Sound* (8.9/10) *– Introduced back in 2005 as the E500 (not to be confused with the E5), the SE530 became one of the very first triple-driver universal IEMs on the market. The monitor utilizes a two-way design with dual low drivers – a configuration still common today. Unlike a few of the other multi-armature flagships, however, the SE530 is a consumer-oriented earphone through and through. Whereas the Shure E4 I owned a long time ago was mid-centric and neutral almost to the point of blandness, the SE530 overflows with sonic flavor. Tuned for a warm and full-bodied sound, it shares individual characteristics with a number of high-end IEMs but mirrors none in full.

Contrary to what I expected based on the hundreds of SE530 references I’ve read over the years, the low end is well-extended and lacks any significant mid-bass emphasis. Test tones are easily audible below 25Hz but the earphone lacks power, detail, and definition at the lowest of lows, making the usable frequency range a little narrower. Outside of sub-bass frequencies, however, the SE530 yields little detail to the new crop of high-end monitors and usually remains competent and polite. The character of the low end is reminiscent of the Earsonics SM2 but with diminished overall quantity. It is thick, full, and slightly round of note, with good punch and definition. The response also picks up weight and becomes more authoritative towards the lower midrange. Like the SM2, the SE530 is a touch on the boomy side for an armature-based earphone with fairly flat response. The Westone 4, which isn’t a whole lot leaner than the SE530, sounds significantly quicker and tighter.

The mids of the SE530 are powerful and upfront but despite the midrange bias the earphones sound fairly balanced. In my book, the presentation qualifies as mid-centric rather than mid-forward. The midrange is lush and full-sounding. It manages to be warm without coming off significantly veiled, partly because there is no bass hump getting in the way. It is detailed, but not aggressively so. Expectedly, some texture and microdetail ends up being sacrificed for the smoothness - the SE530 sounds very liquid next to my CK10, 1964-T, and even TF10. More noticeable are the sacrifices in clarity and transparency – the SE530 can’t quite keep up with the newer triple- and quad-driver models on the market on either front. I’ve seen the term ‘fat’ tossed around and I think it more or less applies to the midrange of the SE530.

The treble transition is extremely smooth and the earphone drops off more gradually than I expected at the top. There is no doubt that the high end is rolled off but my testing shows that it drops 10dB maybe 1kHz earlier than the (decidedly trebly) CK10. From a frequency response perspective, 1kHz isn’t much and the SE530 actually seems to perform better than the newer SE535 when it comes to absolute extension. What’s missing is treble energy – while the earphone is extremely non-fatiguing and polite, it is also quite laid-back and lacking in air. The top end is not at all sparkly or edgy – not even close – which tends to accentuate the roll-off and – as with the poor note weight at the extreme low end – sacrifice some realism. While the Earsonics SM3 and UM3X can be accused of the same, they do have greater resolution, clarity, and detail to make up for it. On the upside, the SE530 is one of the most forgiving earphones I’ve ever heard when it comes to compressed or poorly-ripped audio – probably not much consolation for seasoned audiophiles but it does make the SE530 more suitable for beginners.

In addition to its performance at the limits of the frequency spectrum, I was slightly underwhelmed by the presentation of the SE530. The soundstage is a bit above average in size, with good width and depth, but the lack of crisp, well-defined treble cuts down on airiness and the sense of overall space. As a result, the earphone leans towards intimacy with the way it presents music and tends to underemphasize the size of its stage. Imaging is average – sufficient, but not nearly as impressive as with the UM3X or SM3. Positioning precision, similarly, lags behind the CK10 and Westone 4, but not for lack of dynamics. Rather, the mid-centric balance messes with positioning cues and causes certain things to sound out of place. In addition, the sound simply isn’t very well-separated – the SE530 sounds blended, almost like a dynamic-driver set – in stark contrast to something like the UM3X or CK10. Of course for those who complain about armatures sounding artificial and consider a track to be more than a sum of its parts, the presentation of the SE530 may actually be preferable. In addition, the laid-back top end contributes to the tone leaning towards the dark side of neutral - not terribly so, but more than most of the competition. The earphones are also quite sensitive and will hiss more with poorly-matched sources than the competition.

Value *(7.5/10) *– The Shure SE530 has been a staple of the audiophile market for the better part of the past decade. In that time it has been challenged by a number of newer designs but – thus far – has managed to maintain a loyal following. As an overall package, the SE530 is indeed impressive, especially considering its age. Early-production cable issues aside, the set is well-designed and user-friendly. The sound is mid-centric, warm, and polite – a signature still considered by many to be the audiophile ideal. Shure obviously thought the earphone aged well enough, admitting publically that sonic changes to the newer SE535 revision were kept to a minimum. What follows is a more personal question – why can’t I bring myself to like the sound? To me, the SE530 has a definite midrange bias while the bass and treble are merely decent. Granted, monitors such as the Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X have a different purpose and different signatures, as do the more V-shaped TF10 and W3, but all of these perform better across the spectrum as a whole than the SE530 does. The Shures lose additional points for questionable positioning precision and texturing. For a triple-driver setup, the SE530 simply runs out of steam too early when it comes to the finer points of audio reproduction and, while I appreciate the role of the earphone in shaping the high-end consumer IEM market, the SE530 is a difficult one to recommend in 2011.

*Pros: Ergonomic; well-accessorized; lush and sweet sound
Cons: Modular cable can be unwieldy; not great at frequency range extremes; not very impressive on a technical level*

Huge thanks to *carlsan *for loaning me the Shure SE530 and SE535 for extensive head-to-head testing!


*(1B5) Shure SE535*


Reviewed June 2011

Details: Shure's latest flagship utilizing three armatures in a dual-low, single-high configuration
Current Price: *$410 *from accessoryjack.com (MSRP: $549.99); $40 more for Shure CBL-M+-K mic/remote accessory
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _36Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _18-19k Hz_ | Cable: _5.3' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple flanges, Shure Olives, Earsonics bi-flanges_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* - Single-flange (3 sizes) and triple-flange silicone tips, Olive foam tips (3 sizes), porous yellow foam tips, cleaning tool, ¼" adapter, in-line attenuator, airline adapter, and hard clamshell carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* - With the SE535, Shure has beefed up the construction of the flagship earphone, integrating the nozzle into the housing molds and foregoing the modular cable for a detachable single-piece design. The housings are now less rounded in shape and available in two colors. The cable connectors use a locking and swiveling design akin to that found on some customs but seems to suffer from an unusally high defect/failure rate so far. Strain reliefs are again extremely beefy and the cable is much thicker than average. One interesting issue is with the cable cinch – while it may loosen up over time, it was extremely difficult to move on the test unit
Isolation *(4/5)* - As with most ergo-fit monitors, the SE535 isolates quite a lot with longer tips such as the included triple-flanges
Microphonics *(4.5/5)* - The SE535 can only be worn cable-up and microphonics are nearly nonexistent
Comfort *(4/5)* - With the SE530 as a starting point, it is difficult to imagine the SE535 being an improvement on the comfort front. Indeed, it isn’t - though the cable itself is lighter without the modular split halfway down, the connectors are big, bulky, and angled too far forward for my liking. The addition of a memory wire section doesn't help either – the entire setup makes the earphones more difficult to position and causes the angular housings to press against my ears

*Sound (9/10)* – The Shure SE535 replaces the aging SE530 – an earphone that, despite its unique and audiophile-friendly sound signature, certainly is not without flaws - as the company’s flagship. Admitting as much but downplaying the extent of the revision, Shure has gone on record commenting that while the core hardware of the earphone is unchanged, modifications to the housing have positively affected the treble and presentation of the earphones. Personally, I think the improvements go a little further than that, but then again the original SE530 failed impress me in any major way to begin with.

The low end is where the SE535 differs least from the previous model. The bass is flat and well-extended. Test tones are easily audible below 25Hz but power, detail, and definition are lacking at the lowest of lows. Bass detail is good and the low end lacks generally in neither control nor quantity. The bass is still punchy, full, and slightly round of note, but seemingly less so with the SE535 – the newer model sounds tighter and cleaner with quicker attack and decay compared to its predecessor. Other than a tiny bit of speed and recovery, the E535 is mostly identical to the SE530 at the low end. It still reminds me of the Earsonics earphones and, compared to the Westone 4 and 1964-T, is still just a touch too soft for my liking.

The midrange remains the focus of the presentation with the SE535. It retains the power and authority of the SE530 but sounds slightly less forward, mainly due to the greater treble presence. Despite a slight reduction in note thickness, the mids are still lush, full, and very smooth. Warmth is reduced slightly compared to the SE530 – the newer model is clearly the more neutral-sounding of the two. Detail levels are good but the detailing is not at all aggressive. Texture and microdetail levels lag behind many other BA-based earphones and even the dynamic-driver Sony EX1000 and JVC FX700. Clarity and transparency, similarly, are not strong suits of the SE535 next to the some of the other monitors in the price bracket.

The top end is where the SE535 deviates most from its predecessor – the treble is noticeably more prominent in the overall soundscape of the newer earphone. Strictly-speaking, there is still a similar amount of high frequency roll-off to the SE530 but the response stays stronger and cleaner right up to the roll-off point. Most of the differences between the two models stem from this minor change – the SE535 sounds a bit cooler, slightly less mid-centric, and a touch leaner than the SE530. It also carries more air and, unlike the SE530, can make claims to sonic balance. The overall amount of treble energy is a bit more realistic though the earphones are still quite polite and non-fatiguing. They are also a touch more critical of poor rips and recordings than the SE530.

The second area of “official” improvement is the presentation. I found myself slightly underwhelmed by the sizeable-yet-intimate presentation of the SE530. The extra air of the SE535 helps the earphone make better use of the sonic space and even the instrument separation seems (very slightly) improved. Overall soundstage size is still slightly above average, imaging is good, and the dynamic range is impressive. There still seem to be some minor positioning anomalies resulting from the relative strength of the midrange but nothing that would bother me. The characteristically ‘blended’ sound of the SE530 is mostly unchanged but the overall tonality is definitely closer to neutral. Clearly an improvement over the SE530 in my book but not one significant enough to warrant an upgrade for most current SE530 owners.

*Value (8/10) *- Though the market as a whole has changed drastically, high-end in-ear earphone hardware has seen little innovation in the past few years. Whereas UE has responded with drastic price cuts, Shure, Earsonics, and Etymotic Reseach seem bent on revising their products to maintain a higher price point. In the case of theSE530/SE535, the changes touch mostly on construction and performance. The build quality has undergone the largest improvement, with the modular cable dropped in favor of a fully detachable system. Unfortunately, the bulky cable connectors can make it slightly more difficult to achieve a comfortable fit with the earphone. The sound quality, too, has been improved but the changes are far from drastic. Shure managed to bring the signature closer to ‘balanced’, with improvements to the treble response affecting the rest of the spectrum in minor ways. The SE535 is, on the whole, a better earphone than the SE530, but sets such as the Westone 4 are quick to point out its remaining deficiencies. The new version, therefore, is not a must-have upgrade for SE530 owners but those buying a Shure product now will clearly be better off with the SE535.

*Pros: Top-notch build quality, well-accessorized, performance improved over SE530
Cons: Detachable cable can be unwieldy*

Huge thanks to* carlsan* for loaning me the Shure SE530 and SE535 for extensive head-to-head testing!


*(1B6) Sony MDR-EX1000*


Reviewed Aug 2011

Details: Sony’s dynamic-driver flagship monitor
Current Price: *$480 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $499.99)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _32Ω _ | Sens: _108 dB_ | Freq: _3-30k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids, generic bi-flanges_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Sony Hybrid silicone tips (6 sizes), Hybrid silicone+foam tips (3 sizes), and carrying case (Note: US version includes an EX600 cable; non-US version ships with a nicer 4' cord plus a shorter 2' cable)
Build Quality *(4.5/5) *– The EX1000 housings are constructed of magnesium and plastic and styled in the typical Sony manner, with the driver positioned vertically outside of the ear. The detachable cable is held in place by a threaded bit, which seems pretty fool-proof except that I found myself gripping the threaded bit when removing the earphones, thereby unscrewing the cable a bit each time. The cord itself feels slightly underwhelming for a $500 product. It is very flexible but a little thinner than the Ortofon e-Q5 cord. The “memory wire” section is likewise very flexible, so it is more of a “suggestion wire” in practice. It can take a bit of time to settle into the desired shape and doesn’t retain form very well under its own weight. The cord is terminated with a slim 3.5mm L-plug
Isolation *(2.5/5) *– The nozzles of the EX1000 seem rather long but the earphones are not well-designed for deep insertion. Isolation is mediocre with the standard Hybrid eartips and very slightly better with the supplied foam-stuffed tips. Wind noise can be an additional issue when used outside
Microphonics *(5/5)* – The native wear style is over-the-ear and cord noise nonexistent in the soft cable
Comfort *(4/5)* – Though housings designed around vertically-positioned drivers often feature angled nozzles or other ergonomic improvements, the EX1000 is actually a straight-barrel earphone. It is quite large and tends to protrude farther than most earphones when worn, looking a bit like the ridiculous PFR-V1. On the upside, the long nozzles position the driver far enough away from the ear not to cause discomfort. The fit is not as secure as with most other high-end monitors but the soft memory wire works well enough in conjunction with the cable cinch. Still, I would prefer a little more ‘memory’

Sound *(9.3/10) *– The MDR-EX1000 slots in above the studio-oriented MDR-EX800ST/MDR-7550 in Sony’s lineup, competing directly with Sennheiser’s IE8 and JVC’s FX700 for the title of top consumer-oriented dynamic. Never having heard Sony’s previous flagship, or indeed any model higher up than the lowly EX300, the EX1000 was a complete mystery to me. What I found was a truly top-tier dynamic-driver earphone with a slight – but not unpleasant – treble tilt.

The low end of the EX1000 is accurate and controlled. In typical high-end dynamic-driver fashion, it is detailed and textured without losing body or fullness – clean, but relatively soft in the way notes are presented. There is no bloat and while the depth is not as immense as with the Monster MD or JVC FX700, the EX1000 is not severely rolled-off, either. Compared to the VSonic GR07, the Sonys skimp on speed just a little bit in favor a smoother and slightly softer presentation. The warmer, boomier Sennheiser IE7, on the other hand, is left completely in the dust by the bass control and detail of the EX1000. Not a bad tradeoff at all and one of my very favorite bass presentations among all universals.

The midrange of the EX1000 is neutral-to-bright, with a slight gain in emphasis towards the top. It is balanced very well with the bottom end, which is not quite something I can say for Audio-Technica’s dynamic flagship, the CKM99. The GR07, on the other hand, is a touch less prominent in the midrange, sounding flatter across the spectrum and slightly more neutral in tone than the EX1000 - not a huge surprise considering its pro-oriented tuning. The ATH-CK10 also sounds a bit flatter through the low end and midrange but treads on the brighter side of neutral, just as the EX1000 does, albeit without the benefit of dynamic-driver fullness. As expected, bass bleed is nonexistent with the Sonys and the smoothness is very impressive. The EX1000 is easily smoother and lusher than the GR07 and nudges the warmer, less clear, and noticeably less textured IE7 on both counts. Clarity is top notch, as is resolution, and there is only a very small bit of microdetail missing compared to top-tier BA-based earphones such as the CK10 and 1964-T. Overall, the detailing of the Sonys is very good but not very aggressive, which allows the earphone to remain extremely refined and liquid. The overall refinement is especially obvious next to a lesser dynamic such as the Sennheiser IE7, which lacks clarity and detail compared to the EX1000 and loses out by a fair margin in overall realism. Only in comparison to the 6-driver, custom-molded, hugely expensive UM Miracle does the EX1000 start to sound a little thin and lacking in note articulation.

The EX1000 picks up emphasis towards the upper midrange and treble but manages to keep its top end in control far better than the CKM99 does. Despite the moderate amount of emphasis, the EX1000 is only a hair hotter than the GR07 and manages to remain extremely smooth and refined without giving up crispness or resolution. It is not harsh and almost never sibilant. Over long listening sessions, the EX1000 can be a little more fatiguing than the GR07 but again not due to harshness or sibilance. Rather, it is the overall tilt towards treble that may grow tiresome for some listeners. Coming from the CK10, however, I wasn’t at all offended by it, though I prefer my treble emphasis higher up. On the upside, the EX1000 does an excellent job of conveying treble energy, which laid-back dynamics such as the RE262 and DDM2 simply cannot do. Interestingly, top end extension is not ‘bottomless’ – above average, certainly, but the EX1000 is on par with the GR07 in dropping off a bit earlier than my CK10 and 1964-T. Sony’s monitor is also a touch less revealing than the 1964-T - a blessing for those with a good number of mp3s in their library.

Whereas the signature of the EX1000 is lively and energetic, the presentation follows a more laid-back approach. Its soundstage is not quite the widest among all in-ears in absolute terms, but it is very spacious, airy, and open. There is not a hint of the confined, closed-in feel prevalent among stage monitors – the 1964-T, for example, sounds downright intimate in comparison. Surprisingly, the same can be said for the dynamic-driver Sennheiser IE7, though to a slightly lesser degree – the Sennheisers sound constrained and congested next to the Sonys. At the same time, the soundstage of the EX1000 is well filled-in and layered better than that of the GR07. The EX1000 also has an upper hand in dynamics, timbre, and overall refinement, though the GR07 is admittedly a bit more neutral in tone. Imaging and positioning are generally good but lag slightly behind a couple of the top-tier armature IEMs I’ve heard. Separation, similarly, is only above average. Those looking for extremely high instrument separation are probably better off with a BA-based monitor as the EX1000 takes a more cohesive approach. Likewise, those who want to be enveloped by the presentation will not get that ‘on stage’ feel with the EX1000 – the EX1000 tends to distance itself slightly and offers a higher degree of left-right separation. A BA-based monitor such as the UM3X, SM3, or 1964-T will give the on-stage feel in spades for those who require it. Personally, I do find that more coherent and centralized imaging provides a more realistic and involving listening experience but only my UM Miracle is capable of making that highly obvious in the Sonys without sacrificing airiness or soundstage size.

Value *(8/10)* – Blisteringly expensive when first announced, Sony’s MDR-EX1000 has recently been dropping low enough in price to compete with other top-tier universal dynamics. In terms of sheer performance, Sony’s flagship readily asserts its dominance over the hi-fi mainstays - the newly-developed liquid crystal polymer driver is one of the best dynamic transducers I’ve come across, alongside those used by HiFiMan and JVC, and the tuning showcases its abilities beautifully. The sound is clean, quick, airy, and dynamic – everything a high-end earphone should strive toward. The design is reminiscent of the higher-end Sony monitors of yesteryear but introduces replaceable cables and native over-the-ear fitment. Isolation is only moderate and wind noise can be an issue but those who are willing to suffer through the fit and aesthetics of the thing will be rewarded with what may be the finest dynamic-driver universal on the market.

*Pros: No cable noise; amazing combination of clear, detailed, open, and spacious sound
Cons: Average isolation; fit can be frustrating; wind noise can be an issue*

Huge thanks to *esanthosh *for the EX1000 loan!



*(1B7) Alclair Reference*


Reviewed May 2012

Details: Triple-driver acrylic custom from MN-based Alclair
Current Price *$399* from alclair.com (MSRP $499)
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _27Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB_ | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4.2' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: N/A | Preferred tips: N/A
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories* (4/5) *– Cleaning tool, cleaning cloth, and hard-shelled Pelican carrying case
Build Quality *(5/5) *– The reference is a two-way, triple-driver monitor with dual low drivers – a setup similar to the 1964EARS 1964-T and several universal-fit monitors. The molding quality is very good, with clean shells and very clear faceplates. The excellent finish around the nozzles and cable connectors sets the Reference apart from my 1964EARS and Kozee customs. The cable uses a recessed Westone-style connector.
Isolation *(4/5)* – The isolation provided by the fitted acrylic shells is excellent -slightly below what the higher-end Etymotic Research universal-fit earphones are capable of with foam or tri-flange tips but higher than that of the ergonomic monitors from Westone and EarSonics
Microphonics* (5/5)* - Pretty much nonexistent as with all of the custom monitors I’ve tried
Comfort *(5/5)* – The nozzles of my Reference were cut to a medium length – a bit longer than those of my Kozees and 1964s but nowhere near my Spiral Ear 3-way. As with all customs, putting them in will require a bit of getting used to for first-time users but the twisting motion eventually becomes second nature. The acrylic shells are hard but not in the least uncomfortable when fitted correctly. If the earphones remain uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit is probably a good idea. There is added cost with shipping the monitors back and, if necessary, getting new impressions but on the whole a perfect fit is well worth the trouble

Sound *(9.4/10) *– The Alclair Reference utilizes a two-way, triple-BA setup with dual low drivers, much like that of the 1964EARS 1964-T. Its signature, however, is very different from the mid-focused sound of the 1964s. The Alclair pursues a more balanced response with some treble emphasis and a more laid-back presentation. At the same time the dual woofers give the sound a warm tone and fullness, making the Alclair Reference one earphone that can easily be enjoyed for casual listening as well as professional use.

The bass of the earphones is detailed and controlled, with good note thickness and minimal bleed. The low end is accurate, but impactful. It is crisper and more punchy than that of the Earsonics SM3 and similar in power but better-textured compared to a black-filtered Phonak PFE 232. Bass depth is also good - better than with the CTM-200 and 1964-T but not quite up there with the pricier UM Miracle, Spiral Ear 3-way, and AKG K3003. The Alclair Reference doesn’t produce a lot of sub-bass rumble but it sounds very clean and resolving across the range, as a good monitor should. It beats out the K3003 in clarity and control and produces a fuller, more realistic sound than the leaner CTM-200 – a good balance in my book.

The midrange of the Reference is balanced very well with the bass, making the Phonak PFE 232 sound slightly mid-recessed in comparison. It is warmed up a little by the bass and very well-detailed. Detail levels are higher than with the AKG K3003 and Spiral Ear 3-way and lag just behind the UM Miracle. The note presentation is on the analytical side but not overly so – the Reference is noticeably thicker-sounding than the CTM-200 as well as TWFK-based monitors such as the Fischer Audio DBA-02. The result is clarity worthy of a reference product without a drop in note weight and overall realism.

Things start to get a little complicated moving up from the midrange – the upper mids and lower treble of the Reference seem to be somewhat emphasized, likely tuned that way to give a boost to vocal clarity. There is a bit of treble unevenness, causing the Reference to sound a touch ‘hot’ with some tracks in a manner reminiscent of the VSonic GR07 and the Phonak PFE 232. The treble peaks of the PFE 232 come in a little higher up but are also slightly stronger, making the Reference less fatiguing for long-term listening, but I wouldn’t recommend either to those who generally prefer smooth and laid-back highs. On the upside, there is plenty of energy at the top, which can’t be said for the pricier Spiral Ear 3-way. Treble extension is good as well – not quite on-par with the Miracle or AKG K3003 but superior to the CTM-200 and vastly better than the 1964-T.

Presentation is a strong suit of the Reference – the soundstage is nice and spacious, with width similar to that of the CTM-200 but better depth and layering. It doesn’t have the best on-center feel – the AKG K3003 and Earsonics SM3 both do better when it comes to portraying elements that are up close but neither can match the sheer size of the Alclair’s soundstage. Instrument separation is also excellent and the Reference has good dynamics for a BA-based earphone. Overall coherence is also impressive, making obvious the slightly mismatched BA-dynamic sound of the AKG K3003 and the overly-mid-centric tuning of the 1964-T’s crossover.

Value *(9/10) *– Starting at $399, the Alclair Reference is a mid-level custom monitor that combines a versatile sound signature with the usual isolation, fit, and customization options of a full-shell custom monitor. The finish is nothing short of excellent and the standard recessed cable sockets make me less apprehensive of long-term cable durability, though some aftermarket cables may be more difficult to fit. More importantly, the sound signature of the Reference should make it the best crowd pleaser among all of the mid-level customs I’ve heard - the triple-BA setup produces a slightly warm, spacious, and energetic sound, an excellent compromise between accuracy and musicality and a potential upgrade to some very popular universals such as the VSonic GR07.

*Pros: Great build quality; comfort of a custom monitor; slightly warm sound with good clarity, detail, and space; excellent bass & midrange quality
Cons: Treble may be hot for some*


*(1B8) Phonak Audéo  PFE 232*


Reviewed July 2012

Details: dual-driver follow-up to Phonak’s renowned Perfect Fit Earphone
Current Price: *$599* from amazon.com (MSRP: $599.00); mic cable included
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _47Ω_ | Sens:_ 104-109 dB_ | Freq: _5-17k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock silicone, stock Comply, Shure Gray Flex_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* - Silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips (3 sizes), 8 tuning filters (4 grey; 2 black; 2 green) & filter changing tool, cleaning tool, silicone ear guides, replacement cable with inline mic/remote, and zippered carrying case
Build Quality *(5/5) *– While the housings of the PFE 232 are plastic, they are very well put-together and the finish is top notch. The cable is flexible, tangle-resistant, thick below y-split, and – most importantly – detachable
Isolation* (3/5) *– Average with the included silicone tips but better with the Complys and some aftermarket tips
Microphonics* (4.5/5) *- Very low with the intended over-the-ear wear
Comfort *(5/5) *– Though the in-ear footprint of the 232 is a bit larger than that of the older PFE models, the earphones are still very lightweight and ergonomic and can really disappear during everyday use. The cable can be a little resistant to staying behind the ear but the fit is very secure with the included cable guides

Sound *(9.2/10) *– Released in 2008, Phonak’s original PFE has been widely revered for offering accurate sound in a lightweight, highly ergonomic form factor at a price that all but obliterated the competition. Those days are long gone – the PFE still sounds excellent but has appreciated in price and no longer leaves as large a berth between itself and its rivals. The original PFE made excellent use of a single armature, so it’s not surprising that the PFE 232, the company’s first all-new earphone since 2008, is a “mere” dual BA despite its ambitious price tag.

The sound of the PFE 232 has been re-tuned to offer a fuller, weightier musical experience without sacrificing accuracy. Like the first PFE, it utilizes a tuning system comprised of three sets of color-coded nozzle filters. The gray and black filters are similar to those included with the original PFE and the green filters are adapted from the cheaper Perfect Bass model.

The bass-heavy green filters attenuate the midrange and a bit of the treble in order to bring the low end forward. Like the original PFE, the 232 is not very efficient to begin with, but the green filters still manage to increase acoustic impedance noticeably. They provide a warmer, bassier sound at the expense of a portion of the transparency and resolution of the PFE 232. Compared to the gray filters, the green ones are muddier, with veiled, somewhat muffled-sounding mids, a more v-shaped response, and less air. The PFE 232 with the green filters still boasts less bass than the pricier AKG K3003 with its ‘Bass Boost’ filters does, as well as a more recessed midrange and brighter, harsher treble. As with the previous PFE model and the K3003, I feel that the bass-heavy configuration of the 232 sacrifices too much of what makes the earphone special, and that if I were willing to accept a poorer-sounding earphone in exchange for a little more bass, the $600 Phonaks would not be in consideration.

Happily, the black and gray filters of the 232 provide a more agreeable audio experience. While the black filters still de-emphasize the midrange and upper midrange for a more v-shaped response compared to the gray ones, they are far more tolerable than the enhanced bass configuration. Most of the veil present with the green filters is lifted and the acoustic resistance seems to be closer to the more unimpeded gray filters. The gray filters are still the most transparent and – to my ears at least – the most balanced-sounding of the three. They do have the most treble energy, but only by a small margin. The entirety of the below review is based on the gray filters except where otherwise noted.

The low end of the PFE 232 is quite consistent between all of the different filters – whichever tuning is chosen, the bass remains controlled but very impactful for a BA-based monitor. Bass punch is reminiscent of the VSonic GR07, trailing slightly behind the AKG K3003 but beating out TWFK-based monitors such as the ATH-CK10 and VSonic GR01 without sacrificing any control. The dynamic-driver GR07 has a bit more deep bass in comparison but doesn’t sound quite as full and fleshed-out overall. Indeed, the PFE 232 sounds very dynamic at all times and strikes an excellent balance between body and tightness with its bass. It is quick and clean as a good BA-based monitor should be, but the note presentation is never thin. Compared to the Earsonics SM3, the bass of the PFE is noticeably cleaner and crisper-sounding, appearing a little less boomy despite similar power and weight. Taken as a whole, the bass of the PFE 232 is very solid – easily some of the best BA bass I’ve heard.

The low end of the PFE 232 is emphasized slightly in comparison to the mids. As a result, the earphone doesn’t sound quite as level as the VSonic GR07 and ATH-CK10 do. Indeed, even the original, single-driver Phonaks have better bass-midrange balance than the PFE 232. That said, the quality of the midrange is very good – it is detailed and very transparent - most so with the gray filters in place. It is not as warm and smooth as that of the Earsonics SM3 but sounds cleaner and clearer. Like the bass, the midrange does not overstep any boundaries – note weight is good and yet the PFE 232 sounds very crisp. It is slightly fuller than the TWFK-based ATH-CK10 and a bit more textured and refined than the VSonic GR07 and Final Audio Heaven A.

With the gray filters, the treble transition is reasonably smooth and the top end is highly reminiscent of the original Phonaks. The PFE 232 has a lot of treble energy, boasting plenty of sparkle and good extension. It reminds me of the VSonic GR07 in being a touch hot without sounding overly bright in terms of tone, and can occasionally accentuate the sibilance on a track. In comparison to the PFE 232, the AKG K3003 has just as much treble energy and similarly faultless resolution but tends to be smoother and less offensive with its ‘Reference’ filters in place. The Final Audio Heaven A, on the other hand, has noticeably less treble energy and sounds a touch grainy compared to the PFE 232.

The presentation of the PFE 232 is very well-rounded – the soundstage has good width and depth, great separation, and believable, versatile imaging. It is much more conventional compared to the enveloping presentation of the Earsonics SM3 and yet loses only a bit of headstage size. The PFE 232 is not overly intimate and boasts a good center image, with better layering and a more 3D sense of space than the VSonic GR07, though not quite to the level of the AKG K3003. The K3003 is also airier and more open-sounding, with slightly better reach up top and great dynamics that make it more involving at the lowest volumes.

The above comparisons are based on A:B listening with the PFE 232 and a slew of top-tier universals. Priced as it is, however, the PFE 232 competes directly with quite a few custom monitors as well, even with the cost of ear impressions factored in. Below are short comparisons between the PFE 232 and the Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 ($350) and Alclair Reference ($500).

A dual-driver custom monitor from Florida-based Clear Tune Monitors, the CTM-200 follows a balanced sound signature with a neutral tone. Compared to the slightly v-shaped PFE 232, the CTM-200 is flatter and more level, with mids that are not recessed and smoother treble. Its bass is a touch quicker but significantly lower in impact and not as extended as that of the Phonaks. The tone is a little cooler with the CTMs and the transparency is slightly better on the whole. In addition, the presentation is more spacious and the imaging is a tiny bit more convincing.

The Alclair Reference is a triple-driver earphone with solid bass and a warmer tone. It has very similar bass punch and clarity to the PFE 232 but offers up more pronounced mids and a less v-shaped signature. The top end of the Reference is similarly hot but the treble peaks come in lower, making it slightly more prone to vocal sibilance. The mids are warmer, drier, and a little more textured compared to those of the PFE and the presentation is larger and a bit more convincing in terms of positioning.

Value* (8/10) *– Phonak’s dual-driver follow-up to one of the best single-armature earphones on the market is a top-tier performer in every sense. The PFE 232 sounds excellent, though it differs greatly in signature from most of the top-tier Westone, Shure, and Etymotic monitors. Some listeners may be bothered by the slightly v-shaped signature and the edgy, revealing treble presentation but the PFE 232 provides some of the best bass I’ve heard from a universal and the clarity and resolution continuously impress. Plus, from the interchangeable cables to the lightweight, ergonomic housing design, the PFE 232 is one of the finest overall packages out there, making it worthy of recommendation despite Phonak’s ambitious pricing.

*Pros: Very well-built with detachable cables, including a spare; lightweight & comfortable; clear sound with excellent bass and three tunings
Cons: Enhanced-bass tuning a step below the others; not as well-balanced as cheaper 112 model*

Huge thanks to *5370H55V* for the PFE 232 loan!


*(1B9) 1964EARS 1964-V3*


Reviewed November 2012

Details: 2nd-gen triple-driver custom from 1964EARS utilizing a new 3-way crossover
Current Price: *$425* from 1964ears.com
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _12-17k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _N/A_ | Preferred tips: _N/A_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5) *– Shirt clip, ¼” adapter, cleaning tool, carrying pouch, and crushproof Pelican storage case
Build Quality* (5/5)* – The 1964-V3 utilizes a brand new 3-way setup in a familiar dual-bore configuration. Molding quality is greatly improved compared to my old 1964-T, with no bubbles, very clear faceplates, and better finish around the cable sockets and nozzles. Like the 1964-T before it, the V3 uses a cable with a standard Westone socket, albeit with a shorter memory wire section and a different plug and y-split. Options include recessed cable sockets, custom artwork, custom colors, and various exotic faceplates
Isolation *(4/5)* – The isolation provided by the fitted acrylic shells is excellent -slightly below that of Etymotic Research earphones but higher than with stage monitors from the likes of Westone and EarSonics
Microphonics *(5/5)* - Pretty much nonexistent as with all of my custom monitors
Comfort *(5/5)* –The acrylic shells are hard but not in the least uncomfortable when fitted correctly. As with all customs, putting them in will require a bit of getting used to for first-time users but the twisting motion eventually becomes second nature. If the earphones remain uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit under the 30-day fit guarantee is probably a good idea. There is added cost with shipping the monitors back and, if necessary, getting new impressions but on the whole a perfect fit is well worth the trouble

Sound *(9.4/10)* – The 1964-V3 is the second-generation triple-driver custom from 1964EARS. The original 1964-T will always have a special place in my heart as my very first custom monitor, but there is no denying that it had room for improvement. With an additional crossover point for a true 3-way configuration, the V3 is superior to the old model in both tuning and ability.

The bass of the V3 is delivered by one of the twin Knowles CI armatures and bests the lows of the old 1964-T in both quantity and quality. The V3 takes on an enhanced-bass profile with warm overall tonality. The bass impresses in both extension and impact, with better depth, more punch, and a more natural note presentation compared to the old 1964-T. The V3 also sounds more effortless and dynamic overall, and despite the above-average note thickness remains quick and clean. Bass bleed is minimized by the prominent midrange, though the V3 still appears a touch boomy next to leaner earphones such as the Alclair Reference.

The midrange of the V3 is smooth and forward, with good note thickness and a pleasant warmth. It sounds lush and fluid, in stark contrast to the somewhat dry 1964-T. Clarity is improved as well, with the mids sounding more transparent and making the 1964-T appear a touch muffled in comparison. Detail levels are still not quite as impressive as with some of my higher-end monitors but definitely not lacking. The treble energy of the V3 is not too great, allowing it to remain a warm-sounding earphone. However, it is brighter and has better top-end extension compared to the old 1964-T. Predictably, the V3 is slightly more sibilance-prone than the smoother, more laid-back 1964-T, but also more lively and energetic.

The presentation of the V3 is solid as well – the V3 is better at portraying intimacy than 1964’s previous triple-driver and has better soundstage depth in addition to very decent width. The result is better layering and a slightly more spacious overall sound compared to the previous model – not quite to the level of the AKG K3003 or Alclair Reference, but not too far off. It’s worth also noting that the V3 is a very sensitive earphone and tends to hiss with some of my poorer sources. Even the generally quiet Fiio E7 isn’t quite dead-silent with the V3.


*Select comparisons*

Clear Tune Monitors CT-200 ($350)

The CTM-200 is a dual-driver custom monitor from Florida-based Clear Tune Monitors. Designed for stage performance, the CTM-200 boasts a leaner, flatter sound signature that is more accurate than it is musical. The 1964-V3 offers up more of both sub-bass and mid-bass, providing added power and punch. It is also a bit more forward in the midrange and provides a livelier, more dynamic sound. The CTM-200 is more accurate and sounds a bit cleaner as a result of its lower bass quantity. Its tone is quite neutral compared to the warmer 1964-V3 and its treble is smoother, reducing harshness and listening fatigue. However, detail resolution lags behind the 1964-V3 a little. Soundstage size is similar between the two earphones with the exception of depth, which is won by the V3. In general, the CTM-200 sounds a bit more laid-back and may be boring for the casual listeners, whereas the more colored signature of the V3 may be ‘just right’. The opposite is true for someone chasing a flat, accurate sound.

Alclair Reference ($399)

The Alclair Reference is a 2-way, triple-driver earphone with impressive technical ability. Originally priced at $499, the Reference has recently dropped in price, putting it in direct competition with the 1964-V3. Compared to the new 1964EARS, the Reference sounds more laid-back and spacious. Its bass has similarly good depth but less mid-bass emphasis for a cleaner sound and cooler tone. Both earphones have impressive bass punch and power. Detail resolution is slightly better with the flatter-sounding Reference while the V3 is smoother and would probably be considered more “musical” by most. Its sound is more intimate and its note presentation – thicker and more “fluid”. The treble of the V3 is also a bit more forgiving of sibilance compared to the Reference.

Ultimate Ears 900 ($400)

UE’s quad-driver flagship is a top-tier universal with a sound signature that does a good job of treading the line between accurate and “fun”. Compared to the 1964-V3, the UE 900 offers a flatter bass profile with better balance between mid-bass and sub-bass, less upper midrange emphasis, and a smoother top end more forgiving of harshness and sibilance. The V3 is warmer in tone but also offers brighter, livelier treble. Its sound is more dynamic, albeit a touch more fatiguing compared to the smooth UE 900. Its midrange is clearer and slightly more detailed, with guitars and vocals sounding raw and transparent, in sharp contrast to the somewhat veiled upper mids of the UE 900. The V3 also sounds more intimate but still provides a more 3-dimensional presentation with better depth and a stronger center image.

Phonak PFE 232 ($599)

Phonak’s dual-driver flagship easily competes with some of the very best universals but is somewhat less impressive when compared to the cheaper 1964-V3. In terms of sound signature, the PFE 232 is far more similar to the Alclair Reference, pursuing a slightly v-shaped sound with prominent treble, and deep, punchy bass. The tone of the 1964-V3 is warmer and the earphone places more emphasis on the mid-bass region. Compared to the V3, the PFE 232 sounds more distant and has a thinner note presentation as well as less mid-bass emphasis. The midrange of the PFE 232 is not as clear and intelligible as that of the V3. With the V3, the mids are much more forward but also more transparent. There is also a large difference in efficiency – the V3 is very sensitive for an in-earphone while the sensitivity of the PFE 232 is definitely on the low side.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

Unique Melody’s flagship utilizes a 3-way 6-driver design, beating out the V3 in technical ability, but at a much higher price. The sound signature of a Miracle is a more neutral one, with a flatter frequency profile for a more balanced sound. The Miracle has better detail resolution and a more spacious—but still very enveloping—presentation. The Miracle focuses on deep bass, with less mid-bass boost compared to the V3 resulting in less impactful but tighter, cleaner, and more resolving bass. The V3 sounds less textured and a touch boomy in comparison, though it avoids mid-range bleed by pushing the mids forward. The treble of the Miracle is both more forgiving and more extended, with a sharp gain in refinement over the cheaper 1964s.

Value* (9/10)* – Priced close to its predecessor but boasting a revised driver configuration and improved tuning, the 1964-V3 is an easy recommendation among entry-level custom earphones. Compared to similarly-priced universals, the V3 not only sounds fantastically good, but also offers the usual perks of going custom, including isolation, fit, and personalization options. The V3 also boasts better molding quality than my old 1964-T, competing with CTM and Unique Melody for the nicest shells I’ve seen so far. Sound-wise, the earphone still boasts full, forward mids but no longer sounds as mid-centric, offering deeper, more powerful bass and more energetic treble. The sound signature of the V3 is a warm and musical one – perhaps not ideal for monitoring purposes but very, very enjoyable in day to day listening.

*Pros: Great molding quality; comfort and isolation of a custom monitor; warm sound with prominent mids, powerful bass, and a well-layered presentation
Cons: Colored sound may not be great for actual monitoring*


*(1B10) InEar StageDiver 2 (SD-2)*


Reviewed December 2013

Details: dual-driver custom-inspired earphone from German in-ear monitoring experts InEar
MSRP: 359,00€ (est. $495)
Current Price: *$450* from otojoyiem.com (USA) 345€ from thomann.de (Europe)
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA _| Imp: _40Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.6' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: Stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 bi-flanges
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), hearing aid cleansing wipes (3 sets), ¼” adapter, and crushproof hard shell pelican carrying case with carabiner
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The StageDiver earphones are designed for longevity in professional applications and utilize extremely solid-feeling acrylic housings. Nozzles are protected by color-coded, interchangeable filters. Replacement filters can be purchased separately and come in sets of 15 pairs, complete with storage carousel and filter changing tool. The cable is sturdy and detachable, in the common 2-pin configuration
Isolation *(4/5)* – Very good even with the stock single-flange eartips
Microphonics *(5/5) *– No noise in the flexible twisted cable
Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings of the StageDiver earphones were designed based on an overlay of over 500 ear impression scans. The shape is very unique, even among “universalized” custom in-ears, because the shell extends into upper part of the concha. This provides an extremely secure and stable fit but with smaller ears the concha “fin” can exert some pressure on the ear, so I would recommend trying before buying for those with small ears

Sound* (9.3/10)* – The StageDiver 2 uses a 2-way, dual-armature configuration. Unlike its triple-driver sibling, the SD-2 is tuned for a balanced sound and impresses first and foremost with its impressive end-to-end extension.

The bass of the SD-2 is very level, offering slightly more overall presence than sets such as the Etymotic ER4S and VSonic VC1000. Compared to these, the SD-2 has a warmer tone, a-la HiFiMan’s RE-400, but still sounds pretty neutral overall. Its bass has very natural punch and excellent extension, maintaining presence all the way down.

The midrange of the SD-2 is well-positioned, coming across as neither recessed nor forward. Thanks to the natural and fleshed-out low end, the SD-2 never sounds mid-centric the way the HiFiMan RE-400 sometimes can. The StageDiver set also has more natural bass impact and depth than the Custom Art Music One while maintaining similar clarity and note thickness. The added bass makes the SD-2 appear less mid-focused than the Music One, but the note thickness keeps it from sounding mid-recessed or lacking midrange presence.

The top end of the SD-2 maintains a good balance of presence and smoothness. It’s not as bright as dual-driver earphones based on the Knowles TWFK driver, such as the Fischer Audio DBA-02 and VSonic VC1000, and as a result is not at all prone to harshness or sibilance. At the same time, it isn’t lacking in extension and has decent energy, resulting in a more balanced treble presentation than, for example, with the RE-400. For me personally, a little more treble energy wouldn’t be a negative but the SD-2 follows a treble curve that’s safe and comfortable, staying true to its stage-friendly name by avoiding listening fatigue.

The presentation of the StageDiver 2 is above average in size, reminding me of the EarSonics SM64. Both width and depth are excellent and the earphones sound very cohesive and natural, no doubt a result of the solid end-to-end extension and clarity across the entire frequency spectrum. Stereo imaging doesn’t leave anything to complain about, either.

*Select Compasisons*

InEar StageDiver 3 ($590)

The two StageDiver models share a very strong family resemblance – in fact, it’s tough to pick the better earphone between the two of them. The triple-driver SD-3 offers more bass presence, which is especially noticeable in the subbass region. Its bass is extremely deep and provides some of the best impact I’ve heard from a universal-fit BA earphone without giving up any bass quality to the SD-2. The SD-2, in comparison, has less punch, as well as less rumble and power.

As a result of the added bass presence, the SD-3 sounds a little warmer overall. The SD-2, on the other hand, appears a touch clearer and more neutral. Its presentation is less thick and full-bodied compared to the SD-3 but I found its balance to produce a more natural sound. Tonally, the SD-2 is a little brighter due to its lack of bass bias. The soundstages of the two earphones are very similar with the SD-3 sometimes sounding a little more forward and aggressive thanks to its bass emphasis and slightly more present lower mids.

HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)

The RE-400, a sub-$100 dynamic-driver earphone, is highly reminiscent of the StageDiver 2 in sound signature, though there is a substantial gap in performance in favor of the SD-2. The SD-2 has a touch more bass than the RE-400, with the difference being more apparent in the subbass region. It is also clearer and slightly more resolving, and boasts more treble energy while still remaining extremely smooth and non-fatiguing, beating HiFiMan at their own game. The RE-400, on the other hand, has more forward mids and sounds a little too focused on its midrange. The soundstage of the RE-400 also appears a little too forward and flat next to the spacious and well-layered StageDiver.

VSonic GR07 ($179)

Comparing the SD-2 to the GR07, one of my favorite sets in its price range, leaves no doubt as to the StageDiver’s superiority. Most apparent is that the SD-2 produces a clearer sound with tighter bass. The GR07 sounds bassier, with mids that appear recessed in comparison. The treble of the GR07 sounds splashy and exaggerates sibilance whereas the SD-2 is much smoother. Overall, the SD-2 sounds more neutral and more natural, making the GR07 seem colored in comparison.

Clear Tune Monitors CT-200 ($350)

The CT-200 is a dual-driver custom-fit monitor from Florida-based Clear Tune Monitors. The most noticeable difference between the SD-2 and CT-200 is in bass performance – the bass of the StageDiver is greater in quantity, extends much better into the sub-bass region, and sounds a great deal more effortless. The CT-200 lacks the more natural bass impact of the SD-2. In the midrange, the CT-200 sounds a touch clearer and has more presence in the upper mids. The SD-2 has less upper midrange presence and a darker overall tone. The CT-200 also has a slightly wider headstage, sounding more out-of-the-head overall.

Alclair Reference ($399)

The Alclair Reference is a 3-driver custom monitor with a “reference” sound signature. In many ways its performance is comparable to that of the SD-2 – bass quantity is about on par and while the Reference has slightly more recessed mids, clarity is similar between the two except at high volumes, where the Reference wins out. Tonally, the Reference is brighter and more peaky compared to the very smooth StageDiver. Its treble is hotter and more splashy, and sibilance is exaggerated compared to the SD-2. The treble of the SD-2 has less energy than I like, but still sounds more natural to me overall. The Reference has a wide soundstage similar to the SD-2 but boasts slightly better imaging.

Value *(8.5/10)* – One of the most well-rounded earphones I’ve ever had the pleasure of trying, the InEar StageDiver 2 amazes with its all-round accuracy, exhibiting tight bass control, level mids, and a good balance between treble presence and smoothness. It can go toe-to-toe with any universal monitor in my collection and provides a compelling upgrade for popular mid-priced sets such as the HiFiMan RE-400. Construction quality on-par with custom in-ears only further substantiates the price tag of these German-made wonders.

*Pros: Well-balanced and extremely capable sound; stellar build quality
Cons: While very secure, fit can be tight in smaller ears*


*(1B11) InEar StageDiver 3 (SD-3)*


Reviewed December 2013

Details: triple-driver custom-inspired earphone from German in-ear monitoring experts InEar
MSRP: 489,00€ (est. $670)
Current Price: *$590* from otojoyiem.com (USA) 469€ from thomann.de (Europe)
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA _| Imp: _40Ω_ | Sens: _119 dB_ | Freq: _20-18k Hz_ | Cable: _4.6' L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: Stock single-flanges, MEElec M6 bi-flanges
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), hearing aid cleansing wipes (3 sets), ¼” adapter, and crushproof hard shell pelican carrying case with carabiner
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The StageDiver earphones are designed for longevity in professional applications and utilize extremely solid-feeling acrylic housings. Nozzles are protected by color-coded, interchangeable filters. Replacement filters can be purchased separately and come in sets of 15 pairs, complete with storage carousel and filter changing tool. The cable is sturdy and detachable, in the common 2-pin configuration
Isolation *(4/5)* – Very good even with the stock single-flange eartips
Microphonics *(5/5) *– No noise in the flexible twisted cable
Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The housings of the StageDiver earphones were designed based on an overlay of over 500 ear impression scans. The shape is very unique, even among “universalized” custom in-ears, because the shell extends into upper part of the concha. This provides an extremely secure and stable fit but with smaller ears the concha “fin” can exert some pressure on the ear, so I would recommend trying before buying for those with small ears

Sound* (9.3/10)* – The StageDiver 3 uses a 2-way, triple-armature configuration with dual bass drivers. Perhaps not surprising is that it sounds very much like the less expensive SD-2 model except in the bass region, where the SD-3 has significantly more presence.

The bass of the SD-3 is enhanced, putting it alongside the likes of the EarSonics SM64 as one of the most bass-heavy BA-based earphones on the market. Bass impact is slightly lower than with the significantly more expensive quad-driver FitEar TG334 but bass control is similarly good. All in all, the SD-3 can compete with many dynamic-driver earphones when it comes to low end power. Extension is excellent as well.

The SD-3 is a bass-boosted earphone with a warm tonal character, and while its midrange is not recessed, bass-midrange balance is definitely better on the flatter SD-2. The StageDiver 3 sounds rich and full, though, and offers good note thickness. However, it lacks the midrange forwardness, as well as some of the clarity, of the FitEar TG334 and high-end custom-fit monitors such as the UM Miracle. There is also just a touch of vocal intelligibility lacking compared to sets such as the Etymotic Research ER4S, in part due to the more laid back upper midrange and treble.

The top end of the SD-3, maintains a good balance of presence and smoothness. It’s not prone to harshness or sibilance and, like that of the SD-2, is less bright than average but not lacking in extension. As with the SD-2, I would not mind slightly more energy in the upper midrange and treble, but I also love the forgiving nature of the SD-3.

The presentation of the SD-3 is very similar to that of the SD-2 - above average in size and with excellent soundstage width and depth. It lacks the layering and 3-D imaging of the pricier FitEar TG334, as well as top-tier customs such as the UM Miracle, but still provides satisfying imaging.

*Select Compasisons*

InEar StageDiver 2 ($450)

The two StageDiver models share a very strong family resemblance – in fact, it’s tough to pick the better earphone between the two of them. The triple-driver SD-3 offers more bass presence, which is especially noticeable in the subbass region. Its bass is extremely deep and provides some of the best impact I’ve heard from a universal-fit BA earphone without giving up any bass quality to the SD-2. The SD-2, in comparison, has less punch, as well as less rumble and power.

As a result of the added bass presence, the SD-3 sounds a little warmer overall. The SD-2, on the other hand, appears a touch clearer and more neutral. Its presentation is less thick and full-bodied compared to the SD-3 but I found its balance to produce a more natural sound. Tonally, the SD-2 is a little brighter due to its lack of bass bias. The soundstages of the two earphones are very similar with the SD-3 sometimes sounding a little more forward and aggressive thanks to its bass emphasis and slightly more present lower mids.

Ultimate Ears / Logitech UE900 ($399)

The quad-armature UE is a very capable earphone with excellent top-to-bottom extension and an energetic but non-fatiguing sound. The SD-3, in comparison, has quite a lot more bass impact, though the UE900 can keep up in bass depth/extension. The SD-3 also has mids that are a little more prominent and level overall while the UE900 has less presence in the upper midrange. The top end of the UE900 gains presence again and on the whole the UE earphones sound brighter than the StageDiver 3. The SD-3, on the other hand, is smoother and sounds more natural overall despite its enhanced bass.

EarSonics SM64 ($399)

A triple-armature monitor with enhanced bass, the SM64 is one of very few BA-based earphones that can best the SD-3 in bass quantity. It has a little more subbass presence with more rumble compared to the SD-3, which also makes the EarSonics a little warmer tonally. The midrange of the SM64 is “sweet”, but thinner in comparison. The EarSonics have no advantage in clarity, though – in fact, the SD-3 oftentimes provided a slightly clearer sound. The StageDiver is also smoother in the treble region and lacks the upper midrange dip of the SM64. Overall, the SD-3 sounded more neutral to me but lacked some of the “fun” factor of the EarSonics—it definitely has more of a conventional warmer/darker signature while the SM64 is very unique, and it’s very difficult to pick a winner between the two.

Audeo Phonak PFE 232 ($599)

While it uses a dual-driver setup, the Phonak PFE 232 produces plenty of bass and makes a natural competitor for the similarly-priced SD-3. Bass impact between the two earphones is similar – both feature enhanced bass that is definitely on the heavy side for BA earphones. The PFE 232 has more recessed mids, however, and its treble sounds hotter and sharper. The smoother SD-3 sounded more natural to me, making the tone of the PFE 232 seem rather metallic in comparison. Both earphones boast similarly spacious presentations but overall, the SD-3 sounds more realistic compared to the PFE 232, especially in the midrange and treble.

Value *(8/10)* – Turning up the bass on the less expensive StageDiver 2 model, the InEar StageDiver 3 makes a compelling case for itself as one of the few balanced-armature earphones well-suited for fans of hard-hitting lows. The midrange and treble of the SD-3 strike a good balance between energy and smoothness and the overall value is reinforced with stellar build quality that rivals high-end custom IEMs. The only reservations when it comes to the StageDiver 3 are the tight fit in smaller ears and the less expensive but equally capable SD-2 model, which differs only in sound signature.

*Pros: Enhanced bass with great overall audio quality; stellar build quality
Cons: While very secure, fit can be tight in smaller ears*


*(1B12) Olasonic Flat-4 Nami TH-F4N*


Reviewed March 2014

Details: Dual-dynamic earphone built for Olasonic by Japan-based Ocharaku
MSRP: $499 (manufacturer’s page)
Current Price: *$499* from aloaudio.com
Specs: Driver: _Dual Dynamic _| Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _104 dB_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Comply foam (included)_
Wear Style: _Straight down (preferred) or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Comply foam eartips (2 sizes) and protective tin carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The construction of the Olasonics is solid, utilizing thick plastics with metal reinforcement. It is a dual dynamic driver earphone with a metal sound pipe connecting the two driver chambers. The cable is excellent, similar in quality to that of the Dunu DN-1000. It lacks a sliding cinch, but with the large size and unique shape of the Nami, I’m not sure one would have been of much use
Isolation *(3/5)* – Average, limited in part by the shallow fit of the Nami
Microphonics *(5/5) *– The smooth and supple cable carries no noise
Comfort *(4/5)* – The earphones are fairly large and stick a fair distance out of the ear when worn, but are very lightweight and the nozzles are angled slightly, improving ergonomics. Overall, the Olasonics are comfortable, especially with the included Comply eartips, and sound good with a shallow insertion. They are not particularly great for over-the-ear wear, but with the noiseless cable it doesn’t really matter

Sound* (9.2/10)* – The Flat-4 Nami is a dual-dynamic earphone built for Olasonic by Japanese Hi-Fi house Ocharaku. The twin 10mm drivers of the Flat-4 are oriented back-to-back, with a “sound pipe” connecting the chamber in front of the rear driver to the primary sound tube just before the nozzle. This is claimed to eliminate the 6 kHz ear canal resonance that is common with in-ear earphones (the US patent for this technology can be found here). The Flat-4 Nami nonetheless doesn’t have the smoothest treble response, but it does impress in several other ways. It boasts superb clarity and very tight bass, sounds airy and open, and has a very unique overall sound signature.

The bass of the Nami offers up excellent extension but the earphones are hardly bass-heavy - I expected greater bass quantity after reading the product description. Instead, the low end of the Nami tends to be tight, lean, and delicate. On tracks that call for bass it can beat sets such as the HiFiMan RE-400 in impact but still offers less bass and a cooler tonal character than, for example, the Philips Fidelio S2 and Dunu DN-1000.

Overall, the sound of the Nami is balanced to slightly v-shaped, not so much due to the mids being recessed (they aren’t), but more because of the emphasized upper midrange/treble region. It is a little more v-shaped than the Knowles TWFK-based VSonic VC1000, for instance, but less so than the VSonic GR07. The mids of the Flat-4 are very detailed and clear, albeit at the expense of some note thickness – compared, for example, to the GR07 and Fidelio S2, the Nami is clearer, but also less full-bodied.

The Nami carries a lot of energy through its upper midrange and treble. It tends to be somewhat bright and at higher volumes the treble emphasis can cause it to sound harsh. It is brighter, for example, than the Fidelio S2, with a treble peak that’s higher up, which makes the top end of the Nami a little splashier. Compared to TWFK-based earphones such as the VSonic VC1000 and Dunu DN-1000, the Nami also has a different treble presentation, tending to be a little harsher, but more tolerant of sibilance. To its credit, the Nami seems to avoid sibilance pretty well in general, perhaps as a result of the target 6kHz reduction. It works best with warmer sources and is a treat at lower listening volumes, which is not a tough order as the Nami isn’t a very sensitive earphone.

The presentation of the Olasonic Flat-4 is wide and a little distant. It is among the more open-sounding earphones I’ve tried – more so, for example, than Fidelio S2 and DN-1000, the latter of which is limited by its slightly boomy (in comparison) bass. It lacks the 3-dimensional imaging of certain top-tier balanced armature earphones, such as the Westone W40 and InEar StageDiver SD-2, but is plenty capable overall.

*Select Comparisons*

VSonic GR07 ($179) 

The VSonic GR07 is a popular accuracy-oriented earphone with a fairly neutral sound signature. Compared to the GR07, the Flat-4 Nami sounds brighter and has tighter bass. The low end of the GR07 is a little more impactful and the VSonics are warmer and fuller-sounding, but also appear more mid-recessed and a touch veiled in comparison to the Olasonic unit. The sibilance of the GR07 is quite prominent next to the Flat-4, especially at lower listening volumes.

Westone W40 ($500)

Westone’s W40 is a quad-armature earphone similar in price to the Flat-4 Nami. The W40 boasts a warmer tonal character compared to the Flat-4, with more bass impact and a more full-bodied sound, while the Flat-4 is less bassy but more controlled at the low end. The W40 is a little veiled in the midrange, while the Olasonic sounds clearer. The W40 has smoother, less prominent treble, and darker overall tonality. The Nami is harsher, especially at higher volumes, but also makes the W40 seem lacking in upper midrange presence. The W40 does have a slightly more well-rounded presentation and imaging, and is significantly more sensitive than the dual-dynamic Nami.

Phonak PFE 232 ($599) 

I had to break my PFE 232 unit out of retirement as my initial listening to the Flat-4 Nami made me think of the Phonak unit many times, especially when it comes to treble and soundstaging. The most striking difference between the two earphones is at the low end – the PFE 232, even with the gray filters, offers up significantly more powerful bass. It sounds a little more v-shaped as a result, but also thicker and more full-bodied. However, the Olasonic unit has clearer, less recessed mids that are extremely nuanced and delicate in a way the PFE 232 can’t match. Both tend to have good treble energy and though their treble character differs slightly, it’s hard to put one above the other in treble quality. The earphones have similarly wide soundstages and good overall imaging ability.

AKG K3003 ($1300) 

AKG’s dynamic-armature hybrid was among the first in the current crop of $1000+ hyper-IEMs. I prefer to use the K3003 with the “Reference” tuning, though in this case the Treble Boost tuning makes for a slightly better signature match with the Flat-4 Nami. The K3003 offers up more bass impact, which gives it a slightly more dynamic sound compared to the lighter-at-the-low-end Olasonic unit. Both earphones have some treble hotness, but emphasize different areas of the treble, which is also true when comparing the Flat-4 to any other TWFK-based earphone. The Flat-4 ends up sounding a touch harsher than the AKG, but the difference is small. The K3003, like the Westone W40, also boasts a slightly more well-rounded presentation but isn’t far enough ahead of the Nami to justify the price difference.

Value *(7.5/10)* – In many ways the approach taken by Olasonic with these earphones makes me think of another Japanese headphone manufacturer—Final Audio. The Olasonic Flat-4 Nami has the same combination of no-frills, audio-focused design, genuine innovation, and clever marketing. The Nami is not just an interesting-looking earphone with a hefty price tag, however—the sonic signature of the earphones is very unique on the US market and listeners are sure to be impressed by the open sound with excellent clarity and bass control. To me, the Flat-4 sounds best for relaxed, low-volume listening, losing none of the sonic detail or energy and keeping its bass completely under control. It’s a niche product, but for this sort of application it’s as good as anything else I’ve tried.

*Pros: Excellent clarity, open presentation, lean & tight bass; no cable noise
Cons: Mediocre-at-best noise isolation; scant accessory pack*



*(1B13) LEAR LUF-4 (LUF-4F / LUF-4B / LUF-4C)*


  
Left:_ transparent purple shells/“metallic” faceplates; Center: transparent light blue shells/black “true texture” carbon fiber imitation faceplates; Right: opaque white shells/“illusion/imaginary color” pearlescent faceplates_


Reviewed September 2014

Details: custom-made universal IEMs from Hong Kong-based LEAR
MSRP: HKD 4,388 (approx. $565)
Base Price: Approx. $565 from lear.hk / Approx. $560 from treoo.com
Specs: Driver: _Quad BA _| Imp: _22Ω (4B), 28Ω (4F/4C)_ | Sens: _120 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ I-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony MH1C tips, MEElec M6 single-flanges, stock single-flanges, stock foam_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Hybrid-style single-flange (3 pairs), bi-flange, and triple-flange silicone tips, Comply-style (1 pair) and generic (1 pair) foam tips, cleaning tool, cleaning cloth, Otterbox crush- and water-proof carrying case, and soft carrying pouch
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The LUF-4 earphones are essentially custom monitors cast in a universal mold. Build quality is on-par with high-end CIEMs, as are the customization options. Two types of detachable cable sockets are offered – conventional 2-pin is standard, with MMCX available at extra cost. There are more than a dozen options for shell and faceplate colors, and the faceplates can be upgraded to a different material – anything from wood to metal to denim – or outfitted with custom artwork, at an extra cost
Isolation *(4/5)* – Isolation is impressive thanks to the hefty shells, long nozzles, and ergonomic design
Microphonics *(5/5) *– No cable noise with the twisted cables
Comfort *(4/5)* – The housings of the LUF-4 earphones are large, but the bulk is msotly in their thickness, making for one of the more comfortable custom-come-universal designs out there (alongside Noble Audio’s universal-fit offerings). The longer nozzles allow the shells to sit comfortably without fatigue, and while the earphones do still require larger ears, they have a smaller footprint than, say, a FitEar TG334, StageDiver SD-2, or Shure SE846

Sound* (9.3/10)* – The LUF in LUF-4 stands for *L*EAR *U*niversal *F*it, and is the universal interpretation of LEAR’s pricier LCM-4 series customs. Unlike other custom-come-universal earphones, however, the LUF-4 models remain fully customizable, starting with the sound. There are three tunings available, as follows:



*LUF-4F* “Flat”
*LUF-4B* “Bass” (enhanced bass)
*LUF-4C* “Crystal Clear” (enhanced treble)

The LUF-4 models each have four drivers in a rather unique 3-way configuration – 1 low, 2 mid, 1 high – and utilize a dual-bore design with metal sound tubes.

The three tunings have a lot in common and only differ a little in sound profile. The LUF-4B model, for instance, is quite a bit more impactful than the LUF-4F, but otherwise pretty much identical. As expected, the extra bass makes it sound warmer and towers over the mids a bit more, but bass quality is still very good and not much changes overall compared to the 4F.

The LUF-4C boasts a brighter top end compared to the LUF-4F and 4B. As expected, this makes the sound seem somewhat clearer, but treble quality is maintained – the 4C is no harsher or more sibilant than the 4F. In the real world, the tuning of the 4C results in the perception of slightly lower bass quantity, also making the 4F and 4B seem warmer in comparison.

Since the LUF-4 earphones are more similar to each other than they are different, throughout the following write-up I am referring to the LUF-4F unless otherwise noted.

Despite the fact that the F in “4F” stands for “flat”, the LUF-4F is a slightly v-shaped earphone (all three of the LUF-4 tunings are) and its bass is somewhat enhanced. All of the LUF-4 earphones sound quite a bit punchier compared to sets such as the TDK BA200 and more analytical BA-based earphones such as the Rock-It Sounds R-50 and VSonic VC1000. The bass power of the LUF-4F is below Dunu’s hybrid DN-2000 model, which has a separate dynamic driver for bass. The low end of the LUF-4B, however, is more powerful than that of the DN-2000, but also tighter and more controlled. The DN-1000, Dunu’s lower-end hybrid, is bassier still, providing a warmer, thicker, and more full-bodied sound, but cannot keep up with the LUF-4 earphones in bass quality.

The mids of the LUF-4 earphones fall slightly behind the bass in emphasis, creating a mildly v-shaped sound signature. As a result, “reference” earphones such as the TDK BA200 sound more mid-centric in comparison. Nonetheless, the mids on the LUF-4 sets are not as thin and recessed as they are, for example, on T-Peos’ Altone200 hybrid. The treble emphasis of the LUF-4 earphones also provides superb perceived clarity – better than that of the BA200 and DN-1000 and on-par with brighter, faultlessly clear sets such as the Altone200 and Rock-It Sounds R-50.

All of the LUF-4 earphones have quite a bit of presence in the upper midrange and lower treble. This type of tuning usually sounds best at reasonable volumes, and the LEAR units are no exception – as the volume is turned up, they get somewhat bright. Compared to the Dunu DN-2000, which uses a hybrid driver setup, the LUF-4F and 4B are not brighter overall, but the emphasis falls in the upper midrange and lower treble. With the Dunu unit, the treble energy is higher up, and as a result the earphone sounds smoother and more forgiving on some tracks.

The presentation of the LEAR units is on-par with other top-tier IEMs – well-imaged and spacious enough not to sound congested even with the enhanced-bass LUF-4B tuning. The Dunu DN-1000, for instance, is more intimate and not as open-sounding, whereas the popular VSonic GR07 lacks the depth and more versatile imaging of the LEAR units.



*Select Comparisons *(Note: in each comparison the LUF configuration with the best signature match was selected)

VSonic GR07 ($99) (vs. LEAR LUF-4F)

VSonic’s GR07 is a long-time favorite benchmark of mine, and with the latest version priced at just $99, will likely remain one for years to come. The LUF-4F made for the closest signature match here, with bass that is just a touch less impactful and full-bodied than that of the dynamic-driver VSonics and the most similar treble energy.

The biggest difference is in how veiled and muffled the midrange of the GR07 sounds next to the LEAR unit – there’s just no comparing the clarity between them. The LUF-4F is also significantly more sensitive, and while it has a little more upper midrange presence, it is still a touch less sibilance-prone than the VSonic set.  Overall, the GR07 keeps up with the LUF-4F in several ways – bass quality, for example, is excellent on both units – but the clarity deficit is just too great to overcome.

InEar StageDiver SD-2 ($449) (vs. LEAR LUF-4F)

InEar’s custom-come-universal StageDiver SD-2 is a “mere” dual-driver, but one that offers a remarkably balanced and coherent sound. The bass of the LUF-4F is more powerful than that of the SD-2, but not emphasized enough to match up with the pricier (and more bass-heavy) SD-3 model.

As expected, the less bassy SD-2 sounds just a hair tighter than the LUF-4F. It also has flatter, more forward-sounding mids than the somewhat v-shaped LEAR. The LUF-4F has stronger upper mids, providing more emphasis in the “presence” region for electric guitars and appearing a little clearer overall. At the top, the StageDiver 2 is smoother and significantly more forgiving while the LUF-4F is brighter. The SD-2 has a wide and spacious soundstage but seems to lack some of the depth of the LUF-4F.

Westone W40 ($500) (vs. LEAR LUF-4F)

First off, compared to the fully customizable LUF-4F, the interchangeable red, blue, and black plastic shell inserts of Westone’s quad-driver model are rather unimpressive. Its sound, thankfully, is more competitive.

Overall bass quantity is similar between the two units, but the LUF-4F tends to sound a little tighter, with less bleed into the lower midrange. The mids of the W40 are less clear, even muffled, in comparison. The difference stems not only from the tighter bass of the LUF-4F, but also from the W40 having an upper midrange dip where the LEAR unit has emphasis. Forward vs. recessed upper mids make a very big difference on certain tracks, especially with vocals and especially at lower volumes.

The brighter, clearer LEAR unit is not as forgiving as the Westone, tending towards harshness, but both units have similarly well-rounded presentations. Tonally, both units are slightly short of perfect, with the W40 losing out thanks to its darker sound with more recessed upper mids and the LUF-4F – for moving too much in the opposite direction. Overall, however, I found myself preferring the LUF-4F, especially at lower volumes.

EarSonics SM64 ($499) (vs. LEAR LUF-4B)

The EarSonics SM64 is closest to LEAR’s enhanced-bass tuning, but tonally warmer and darker. The LUF-4B is more v-shaped, making it more prone to harshness and sibilance. Partly due to the brighter tonality, the LEAR unit is slightly clearer, but the clarity of the SM64 is still impressive considering its smoother sound and lower upper midrange energy. Vocals are still clear and highly intelligible with the EarSonics.

It’s worth noting also that the LEAR LUF-4B is much more sensitive. Overall, it is quite hard to pick between these two, but at lower volumes I found the LUF-4B preferable as the clarity boost makes a bigger difference and its extra upper mid/treble energy is kept in check. At high volumes, however, the smoothness of the SM64 made it very compelling.

AKG K3003 ($1300) (vs. LEAR LUF-4B)

AKG’s ultra-pricy hybrid flagship also has three available tunings, albeit in the form of interchangeable nozzle filters, of which I prefer the middle “Reference” configuration. The enhanced-bass LUF-4B is closest to the dynamic-driver bass of the AKGs, though the K3003 still provides a little more bass impact and a more full-bodied sound with the LUF-4B sounding thinner in comparison.

Clarity is similarly excellent between the two earphones, but LUF-4B doesn’t suffer from the slight lack in coherency of the hybrid system. It does have a little more energy at the top end, however. The K3003 has never been one to disappoint for lack of treble presence, but its sparkle comes from some well-controlled peaks whereas the LEAR has a general upper midrange/treble lift, causing it sound brighter and also making it a bit more prone to harshness and sibilance.

Etymotic Research ER4S ($299) (vs. LEAR LUF-4C)

All of the LUF-4 earphones sound a little v-shaped on the whole, but the least bassy LUF-4C made for the best comparison with the ER4S. The 4C unit still offers quite a bit more bass punch and sounds warmer due to the greater low end emphasis, but not as much as the other LUF-4 variants. The bass of the ER4S is a little gutless in comparison, as it tends to be next to bassier earphones.

The ER4S is not as full-bodied as the LUF-4C, but is also flatter and more balanced overall, with more midrange presence compared to the somewhat v-shaped LUF-4C.  The LUF-4C is a touch less forgiving, but overall treble quality is similar. The LEAR unit has a more 3-dimensional presentation, which, admittedly, has never been a strong suit of Etymotic earphones.

Olasonic Flat-4 Nami ($499) (vs. LEAR LUF-4C)

Olasonic’s Flat-4 earphones utilize a dual dynamic driver configuration, but – surprisingly – are tuned for a little less bass impact than the BA-based LUF-4C. The LEAR unit has a stronger low end and more full-bodied sound. Both earphones have excellent clarity but the thicker note presentation of the LUF-4C is a little more natural. The Flat-4 is a bit brighter and can be slightly harsher, but ultimately neither earphone is very forgiving. In terms of presentation, the Flat-4 Nami sounds a little more airy and open, but the LUF-4C is more well-rounded and three-dimensional.

Value *(8/10)* – The LEAR LUF-4 models offer a competitive, yet well-differentiated alternative to more mainstream multi-BA earphones. The three slightly different takes on a v-shaped sound signature are consistent with each other, yet each delivers exactly what it promises without significant downsides compared to the “flat” 4F tuning. The unprecedented level of customization for universal IEMs is noteworthy as well – certainly a draw for those planning to spend over $500 on a set of in-ears.

*Pros: Unprecedented customizability among universal-fit earphones; superb craftsmanship; excellent bass quality and clarity
Cons: Best suited for fans of v-shaped sound signatures; top-end emphasis can be too much at high volumes*













*Tier 1A ($600-1500)



(1A1) Final Audio Design FI-BA-SS*


Reviewed Feb 2011

Details: Single armature setup from FAD most notable for its steep price tag
Current Price: *~$1100* from musicaacoustics.com (MSRP: est $1100)
Specs: Driver: _Vented BA_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _112 dB_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable: _4.6’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _4.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony Hybrids, Fischer Bi-flanges_
Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3.5/5)* – Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes) and oversize zippered carrying case
Build Quality *(4/5)* – The slim, elongated shell of the FI-BA-SS is made entirely of stainless steel and reminds me, in both size and weight, of Audio-Technica’s CK100, The nozzles contain non-replaceable mesh filters and the hard stems, while quite solid-feeling, lack real strain relief. The cable is very soft and smooth but thinner than most of the cords found on higher-end earphones and slightly prone to tangling
Isolation *(3/5)* – The BA-SS is vented at the rear and isolates surprisingly poorly for a BA setup, though still sufficiently for use on most public transport
Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Though thin, the cord is pretty much silent even in the cord-down configuration
Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The slim, long shells of the BA-SS are tapered on either end and quite easy to fit. Insertion depth is limited by the hard stems and the FADs are definitely on the heavy side for a set of IEMs but on the whole the fit is still excellent with the right tips

Sound *(9.2/10)* –  If the price is the most shocking aspect of the FI-BA-SS, the sound signature definitely comes in a close second. As a fitting segue, it’s worth noting that the type of transducer used in the FI-BA-SS has apparently been the source of some contention as the promotional materials claimed a proprietary “balanced air movement” technology but a blown-up sketch of the internals showed what looks like a conventional balanced armature. The transducer of the BA-SS is indeed a single armature but one that, against all convention, is vented. I’ll be the first to admit that the driver of the BA-SS has the best range of any single-armature transducer I’ve come across. In fact, except for slight roll-off at the lowest of lows, the FI-BA-SS can pretty much match my ATH-CK10 for presence across the frequency spectrum. Also worth noting is how sensitive the FI-BA-SS is to tip choice – bore opening and length seem to have a noticeable effect on the sound and especially the presentation of the earphones. I’ve had good results with narrower-channel tips such as the Sony Hybrids, Monster Single-flanges (or gel supertips), and FA Eterna bi-flanges – often with shallower-than-usual insertion. Comply tips can be used to tame the treble a bit but soak up a bit of the airiness of the FADs. As always, whether that’s desirable is a matter of personal preference – for the most part I got on just fine with silicone tips.

As noted above, the FI-BA-SS gives up a bit of bottom-end extension to multi-driver setups such as the CK10 and SM3, as well as many higher-end dynamics. Impact is greater than with the CK10 or DBA-02 but falls slightly short of the dedicated low-range armature of the SM3. It can be said that the BA-SS is a bit less ‘stingy’ with its bass than the CK10 or DBA-02, sacrificing some of the speed and tightness of the dual BAs for a healthy amount of impact. Texture and resolution are still very good so there is not much to complain about from a technical perspective. Indeed, the bass is the only part of the FAD’s signature that could be called a middle ground or, alternatively, ‘unremarkable’.

The midrange of the FI-BA-SS is more interesting, reminding me of both the smooth-yet-detailed CK10 and the warmer, more liquid Ortofon e-Q5. The noticeable gain in bass impact and body over the CK10 makes the BA-SS sound warmer while retaining the crystal clarity of the Audio-Technicas. On a ‘macroscopic’ level, the BA-SS is also quite smooth and level in the midrange but, while the more liquid-sounding e-Q5 tends to gloss over microdetail, the BA-SS, if anything, is guilty of magnifying it. The texture and detail levels of the FADs are indeed very high and the resulting transparency is simply off the scale – even the CK10 sounds slightly veiled next to the BA-SS. No other earphone I’ve heard gives quite the same sense of ‘nakedness’ to the sound – with the BA-SS it’s simply you and the track (note: I didn’t say ‘the music’ because the BA-SS is hugely unforgiving of source material; only with perfectly recorded, mastered, and ripped material will it be ‘you and the music’). Combined with the excellent balance of the earphones, this transparency has a strange result – the BA-SS certainly qualifies to be called a refined earphone but at the same time it’s quite aggressive and has a ‘raw’ edge to it.

Expectedly, the treble is just as revealing as the midrange and boasts equally impressive clarity and detail. Extension, far as I can tell, is on-par with the CK10, which is more than a little impressive for a single-armature design. There is, however, a bit of treble unevenness, leading to slight harshness and even occasional sibilance. This is not helped by the highly transparent nature of the earphones, which makes them all the more sensitive to any and all artifacts already present on the track. This raises a question - is it possible that an earphone can be too detailed, too clear, and too transparent? Even among high-end earphones there are still a few that elicit complaints of poor clarity when compared to the competition, but the BA-SS clearly breaches the opposite extreme. The BA-SS is the earphone equivalent of an unretouched hi-res image – it may be the technical ideal for many, but ultimately some things are better off airbrushed, if only slightly. It can be argued that the FI-BA-SS is simply taking the next logical half-step over the usual crop of top-tier clarity- and detail-heavy earphones – Audio-Technica’s CK10, Fischer Audio’s DBA-02, Etymotic’s ER4, and so forth – or taking the signature a step too far. Either way, it is an invaluable earphone in demonstrating that, as with most things in audio, there is a fine line for transparency that can be crossed and that clarity and detail need to be balanced against smoothness and cohesiveness – otherwise minor imperfections can simply get too distracting.

Next to the sound signature, the presentation of the FI-BA-SS is fairly pedestrian for a high-end earphone. Soundstage width and separation are compliment-worthy – the BA-SS may not sound ‘wide open’ like the JVC HA-FX700 but is quite airy and spacious. The tonality, on the whole, is just a tad on the bright side of neutral and the timbre, though not quite up there with HA-FX700, is quite good for an armature-based earphone – better than with the ATH-CK10, for example. Imaging, on the other hand, though very good, is just a tad less believable than with the Audio-Technicas. Lastly, the sensitivity of the BA-SS is quite high – higher than with any top-tier earphone I’ve heard recently. The earphones benefit very little from a dedicated amp and actually hiss slightly out of all my amps and DACs. A portable player is really more than powerful enough to drive the BA-SS, though fidelity is a different matter. Plugging one of the world’s most revealing (and most expensive) earphones straight into my $20 Sansa Clip does feel a little strange but I’ll take that over carrying the Fuze->D10 brick with a decrease in usability and increase in noise floor.

Value *(7/10)* – It is difficult enough putting a value on earphones costing $400, but the price tag of the FI-BA-SS is nothing short of ridiculous. Even with diminishing returns factored in the FI-BA-SS would have to be the best earphone I’ve ever heard to truly justify its price tag – and in some ways it is. As a total package, however, the BA-SS is still a luxury item designed for those with a chunk of disposable income seeking the ultimate in both fidelity and exclusivity. The strangely ‘photorealistic’ sound of the BA-SS is clear proof that there is substance to FAD’s marketing claims and value in their patented Balanced Air Movement (BAM) technology – the BA-SS is as clear, detailed, and transparent as I can imagine an earphone being. At the same time, it is absolutely merciless when it comes to poor rips and recordings, too sensitive for most amps & DACs, and probably less than ideal in signature for the iPod crowd – not a mass-market seller, to say the least. Still, it is an invaluable proof of concept as any reasonably-priced FAD earphones utilizing BAM technology are now far less likely to pass me by unnoticed. Even as it stands, the FI-BA-SS might be the destination earphone for some but I am hanging on to both of my kidneys for the time being.

*Pros: Class-leading clarity, detail, and transparency, comfortable form factor
Cons: Thin cabling, no strain relief on cable entry, mediocre isolation*

Huge thanks to *takoyaki7* for the FI-BA-SS loan - I highly doubt I'd ever have heard them otherwise



*(1A2) Unique Melody Miracle*


Reviewed Jul 2011

A bit of backstory: This particular Miracle was a gift to me from the Head-Fi community. Frequenters of the portable forum may have seen the original thread started by 12345142. At his suggestion, a fund was created to purchase a high-end custom in-ear for yours truly. Though the JH13Pro won the public poll, those who actually contributed to the fund settled on the UM Miracle. Much credit is due to rawrster, who did most of the footwork, to Stephen Guo of custom-iem.com for the discount he was able to provide, and of course to everyone who contributed. An earphone of this caliber is far, far outside of my budget and I never would have experienced it had it not been for the community.

Details: Three-way, sextuple-driver custom from Unique Melody
Current Price: est. *$949* from custom-iem.com (MSRP: est. $949)
Specs: Driver: _6-BA;_ _3-way crossover _| Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _114 dB_ | Freq: _18-19k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2’ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _N/A _| Preferred tips: _N/A_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(3/5) *– Cleaning tool and fancy oversize storage case
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The molding quality is phenomenal. The shells are perfectly clear – no bubbles, no cracks, no opaque areas – and the finish is superb. The stock Miracle cable is just as good as the Westone Elite Series cord found on so many other high-end earphones. The cable connectors are recessed by default but UM will make them flush on request
Isolation *(4.5/5) *– My Miracle has longer nozzles and fits deeper than most of my other full-shell customs. The isolation is on par with the very best universals and just behind silicone-shelled customs
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent
Comfort *(5/5) *– As with my other acrylic customs, the shells are hard but not uncomfortable – I often forget they’re in my ears at all. Normally, a well-fitting custom can be worn for hours on end with no fatigue, and the Miracle is certainly no exception. Obviously fit will always depend on the quality of the initial impressions, the skill of the technician making the earphones, and maybe a bit of luck. Naturally, UM will do refits if the fit is less than perfect

Sound *(9.8/10) - *It can be argued that I would have been better off going straight for a top-tier custom instead exploring the 200-some universal monitors I’ve had my hands on over the years. However, I feel that moving up the hierarchy as slowly as I’ve done has allowed me to appreciate the Miracle that much more - there is simply no substitute for experience when it comes to putting things in perspective. Admittedly, the Miracle is not my first custom IEM – that honor went to the 1964EARS 1964-T – but again owning the 1964-T makes the performance of the Miracle that much more striking. The 1964-T has been invaluable in showcasing what customs may be able to offer over similarly-priced universals but, as I’ve said before, really didn’t offer an increase in sound quality over the best universals I’ve tried. The Miracle, however – does – and I can say that with confidence having owned – or auditioned – nearly every top-tier universal monitor on the market at the time of this writing.

Though the UM Miracle is a "mere" 3-way system with dual drivers set up to handle each portion of the spectrum, its response is amazingly coherent and its presentation - entirely effortless. The low end extends without flinching to the limits of my hearing, performing beautifully right down to the extremes. In terms of quantity, the bass presents as quite flat, with no discernable mid-bass hump, but offers more presence across the range compared to the usual "level bass" suspects such as the Audio-Technica CK10 and Etymotic ER4. Bass detail and texture are the best I’ve heard from any headphone, portable or full-size. The bass is well-defined and articulate down to the lowest of lows, in stark contrast to the Shure SE535 I reviewed recently. The SE535, being a two-way system, has less-than-stellar performance at the limits and tends to sound a bit vague and dull below 40Hz. The Miracle, on the other hand, retains the ability to distinguish and texture notes all the way down.

The tight, punchy bass of the Miracle makes the Earsonics SM3 sound bloated and muddy. Compared, on the other hand, to TWFK-based earphones such as the CK10, the Miracle offers up significantly more body and more realistic note sustainment. As with the Klipsch Custom 3, Ortofon e-Q7, and a number of other high-end universals, the bass of the Miracle occupies a happy medium, appearing neither thick and bloated nor overly quick and thin. It is still armature-type bass, replete with immense resolution and clarity, but there is a sensation of vast power reserve behind every kick. One side effect of the highly detailed and yet punchy bass is superb low-volume performance. The Miracle is the best earphone I’ve used for listening at minimal levels to date, with around 10-15% of full volume with the Cowon J3 sufficient for relaxed listening and 20-25% plentiful on a busy street.

Like the bass, the midrange of the Miracle stands above all of the other IEMs I’ve heard when it comes to the balancing act of thickness vs. clarity. The mids are smooth and fleshed-out, much like those of the Earsonics SM3, but without the clarity sacrifice that comes with the Earsonics. The Miracle can match the natural clarity of the ATH-CK10 and Sony EX1000 despite being neither bright nor thin-sounding. Balance-wise, the midrange is very nearly on-par with the low end but has a laid back character that causes the bass to sound very slightly more forward overall. The Miracle is extremely detailed but not in the forward, aggressive manner of the CK10 and Ety ER4. Instead, everything sounds natural, dynamic, and effortless, though the detail and texture are certainly still all there. Tonally, the mids are a touch warm but not as much as with the SM3. The SM3 is actually made to sound quite veiled by the clarity and crispness. The 1964-T, similarly, sounds both thicker and more grainy, sacrificing a good amount of the smoothness and clarity of the Miracle, and yields in overall detail retrieval as well.

The treble of the Miracle is excellent in its own right, pairing well with the slightly laid-back midrange and bringing a bit of energy and excitement to the sound. Most obvious next the SM3, the treble emphasis of the Miracle balances the earphone out nicely. On the whole, the Miracle sounds neither bright nor dark and the sparkle is well-measured and controlled. Compared to the 1964-T, there is definitely more treble presence but the difference is not night-and-day. I have experienced no listening fatigue with the Miracle although the earphone is very revealing. Sibilance can be problematic if it is present in the recoding but the Miracle does not accentuate such flaws the way the CK10 or Westone 3 might. Top end extension is excellent and the natural tone puts the slightly hot and tizzy treble of the CK10 to shame. Overall, the Miracle sounds crisp yet coherent, with effortlessness of detailing that is simply staggering.

A signature as balanced as that of the Miracle deserves an equally well-rounded presentation, which it has. From the first listen it is obvious that the Miracle was not tuned to be a stage monitor. It lacks the forwardness of the Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X and makes the 1964EARS 1964-T sound small and confined. The presentation is enveloping but no to the same extent as that of the SM3. Those who like the clear-cut left side – right side soundstage of Etymotic earphones or the Sony EX1000 would probably be better off staying away but those who found the imaging of the SM3 pleasing, if mildly overdone, will be happy with the Miracle. The Miracle sounds wider than the SM3 and provides a more realistic, slightly distanced feel but still shares the centering ability and three-dimensional feel of the Earsonics. The noticeably greater clarity, along with the larger soundstage and headstage, help provide incredible imaging and positioning. Certain sonic cues take on an out-of-the-head character I’ve only previously heard from semi-open dynamic-driver earphones. Instrumental separation is excellent and dynamics are better than with any other BA earphone I’ve heard so far. The Sony EX1000 was often able to keep up with the Miracle but lower end dynamic-driver sets such as the ATH-CKM99, VSonic GR07, and Sennheiser IE7 were left completely in the dust. On the whole, the presentation of the Miracle really is an immense tuning achievement on the part of Unique Melody, and one that I don’t see myself getting tired of.

Value *(9/10)* – The jump in sound quality from top universals and entry-level customs to the Miracle is significant, but so is the price gap. The fit and finish of the earphone certainly are as sublime as the price tag indicates, though, and the performance is fantastic as well – the Miracle offers a different sort of sound compared to the 1964EARS 1964-T and stage-destined universals like the UM3X and SM3 but still surpasses them in technical ability. I’ve drawn comparisons to the presentation of the SM3, but the Miracle offers all of the advantages – coherent imaging and great on-center feel for maximum immersion – with none of the drawbacks of the over-enveloping SM3. The signature, too, is extremely pleasing, with surprisingly strong but very controlled bass, clean and detailed midrange, and strong, extended treble. One of the Miracle’s greatest strengths is its ability to remain crisp and retrieve all of the detail without appearing aggressive, even at minimal volume levels. Instead of turning the volume up to get the detail and texture out, the Miracle encourages you to lower the volume, offering up assurances that not a single nuance will be lost.

I have to insert one of my usual disclaimers here - the fact that the Miracle is the most proficient earphone I’ve heard is not necessarily an indication that more drivers mean better sound, nor does it mean that throwing more money at your portable audio rig will result in significant performance gains. All I can say is that having occasion to use the Miracle still puts a smile on my face and I plan to enjoy it for years to come – thanks, of course, to the Head-Fi community.

*Pros: Excellent long-term comfort; high isolation; superb finish; fantastic overall sound quality
Cons: Correct insertion takes some getting used to; no portable carrying case included*

Huge thanks to 12345142, rawrster, Stephen Guo of custom-iem.com, and everyone who donated to make this present a reality. Thanks also to average_joe for lending me his SM3 for comparisons.



*(1A3) AKG K3003i*


Reviewed May 2012

Details: AKG’s flagship IEM, built around a hybrid BA+dynamic driver setup
Current Price: *$1299* from amazon.com (MSRP: $1499.00)
Specs: Driver: _Dual BA + Dynamic_ | Imp: _8Ω_ | Sens: _125 dB_ | Freq: _10-30k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5mm_ | Preferred tips: _*HiFiMan large bi-flanges*, Sony Hybrids, stock single-flanges_
Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

Accessories *(5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (6 pairs in 3 sizes), 3 pairs of tuning filters, airline adapter, TRS adapter, and genuine leather carrying case
Build Quality* (5/5) *– Hand-made in Austria, the K3003 boasts a very solid construction and great attention to detail. The housings are machined from stainless steel and most of the hardware is trimmed in brushed metal. The interchangeable nozzle filters feature color-coded o-rings and are stored threaded through a steel plate. Strain relief is good and the cable is tangle-resistant. While not detachable, the cord is thick and nylon-sheathed below the y-split, and of average thickness above. The cable cinch can be detached from the right-side cable and moved above the microphone
Isolation *(3/5) *– Decent with the right tips but the large housings limit insertion depth, especially with the stock single-flanges
Microphonics* (5/5)* – Pretty much nonexistent
Comfort *(4/5) *– The K3003 is a straight-barrel earphone with off-center strain reliefs. While it is neither the overly large nor exceedingly heavy, the cable actually wraps around the rear of the earphone before entering the strain relief, which adds to the diameter of the housings and can cause problems for those with smaller ears. The earphones can be worn cable-up, which puts the cable exit point outside of the ear and makes them more comfortable. Longer aftermarket eartips help as well.

Sound* (9.4/10)* – The first time I heard the AKG K3003 was at a show, side by side with my Unique Melody Miracle. While the Miracle was and still is my best-performing custom monitor, following a 20-minute A:B test I had a strong feeling that the K3003 was the best universal-fit IEM I’d heard to date - a feeling that I've now had a chance to confirm with a much lengthier audition.

The K3003 is unique not only because it is AKG’s first properly high-end earphone or because the price tag is sure to send most consumers into shock – it is also unique because of the “hybrid” driver configuration. Combining a dynamic driver with one or more balanced armatures, “hybrid” setups are seen by some as the Holy Grail, capable – at least in theory – to capitalize on the individual strengths of both technologies.

Hybrid designs have been around for years – UE’s Super.Fi 5 EB combined a rather large dynamic driver with a single BA back in 2005. However, the K3003 is the first universal-fit three-way hybrid, combining a single dynamic driver - mounted at the rear of the cylindrical housing – with a dual balanced armature (TWFK) unit mounted in the nozzle.

The K3003 also utilizes a tuning system not unlike that of Phonak’s PFE earphones. The sound is changed by swapping between the three included nozzle filters, dubbed ‘Bass Boost’, ‘Reference’, and ‘Treble Boost’. In contrast to the tiny filters used by the Phonak PFEs, which can only be removed with the included tool, the K3003’s filters are macroscopic and can easily be unscrewed and swapped by hand.

Tuning filters are - by nature – subtractive. They shape the sound by attenuating some frequencies over others. In the case of the K3003, the Treble Boost filter is just a grille, taking nothing away from the unfiltered sound. It provides a bright but refined signature, with plenty of treble that is really quite smooth for a TWFK-based earphone. There is no problem with treble quality when it comes to the Treble Boost filter but the quantity may push the tolerance limits for some, causing long-term listening fatigue.

The Bass Boost filter acts to attenuate the mids and treble with the intent of bringing the bass forward. Though not quite to the same extent as Phonak’s green filter, it raises acoustic impedance, requiring several extra notches of volume for the same listening level. Compared to the middle ‘Reference’ filters, the Bass Boost setting indeed shows increased impact and a warmer, more consumer-friendly sound. Unfortunately the filters also reduce the fantastic transparency of the K3003, sacrifice some of the texture for a smoother sound, and result in a drop in audible treble extension. I can see why the bass filters are included – as a sort of insurance policy against consumers who buy the K3003 on a whim and then attempt to compare the bass to a Klipsch S4 or Beats by Dre – but don’t see them being popular around Head-Fi as – again like the green Phonak filters - they waste too much of the earphones' potential.

The remaining filter is dubbed ‘Reference’ and provides the most reasonable combination of tone and performance without masking detail or causing excessive treble fatigue. The below review is based on the Reference filter except where otherwise noted. It’s worth saying that even with the reference filter the K3003 doesn’t have a flat response – not in the way an Etymotic ER-4S or a well-tuned TWFK might. Instead, the K3003 is an earphone for those convinced that while a balanced armature can produce excellent clarity and detail, it just can’t match the realistic power of a conventional dynamic driver in the bass and sub-bass regions.

With the Reference filter the K3003 boasts a mild mid-bass boost with good depth and punch. Note thickness is also good and the bass sounds full and weighty, likely in the realm of what most would consider ‘natural’. It is not slow by dynamic-driver standards – certainly on-level with high-end bass-heavy earphones such as the JVC FX700 – but simply doesn’t have the speed and tightness of a balanced armature. Impact is good – bass quantity is closest to the green filters of the Phonak PFE 232 and has similar weight and fullness to the Earsonics SM3, albeit with more immediate punch and better dynamics. Texture and detail are both very good for a dynamic driver and the bass gives the K3003 some warmth in comparison to most armature-based sets. At the same time midrange bleed is mostly kept in check by the generally prominent mids and treble.

As expected, there is a slight coherence issue with the hybrid BA-dynamic system, stemming largely from the difference in note presentation between the drivers. The dynamic driver has greater note thickness and generally sounds softer and less crisp. It is helped greatly by the excellent dynamics but the armatures handling the midrange and treble are still more detailed and resolving – an audible disconnect with some tracks. The Bass Boost filters, which tone down the upper midrange and lower treble, make this less obvious to my ears but the coherence isn’t problematic enough to justify using them.

Moving up into the midrange, the K3003 impresses with sound that is extremely clear and detailed, yet very smooth and completely without grain. On both counts it performs a bit better than the grey-filtered Phonak 232s and the j-Phonic K2 SP, two of the clearest and most resolving universals I’ve heard. It sounds even cleaner next to the Earsonics SM3, which seems dull and muffled in comparison as a result of placing significantly more weight on the lower midrange and less emphasis on everything above it. Note thickness is typical of a TWFK-based earphone and the smooth and liquid midrange presentation of the K3003 is quite similar to that of the Audio-Technica CK10.

The treble of the K3003, while prominent in the overall mix, is smooth for a TWFK-based earphone, falling somewhere between the VSonic GR01 and Fischer Audio DBA-02 in emphasis. It and sounds clean and detailed, with plenty of sparkle and good air. While fans of Earsonics earphones and the Shure SE530 will find the top end overly prominent, it is on the whole smoother than that of the Audio-Technica CK10 while granting cymbals similar energy and excitement. It sounds refined and resolving at all times and has an uncanny ability to escape sibilance – a trait that makes it easier to listen to for long stretches than a gray-filtered Phonak 232 or VSonic GR07. Overall brightness is a touch behind the j-Phonic K2 SP and Phonak 232 with gray filters, though this can be reversed by using the Treble Boost port on the K3003.

The presentation of the K3003 is one aspect that continues to impress me – for a universal-fit earphone the AKGs are very spacious, yet still capable of portraying intimacy exceptionally well. Soundstage width is good but the K3003 also boasts excellent depth and layering, making earphones such as the VSonic GR07 sound flat and distant. The K3003 is on the whole more forward than the Phonak PFE 232, too, but also has the layering to make it sound 3-dimensional and immersive. Nevertheless, the presentation of the AKGs is more conventional than that of the overly-enveloping Earsonics SM3. The fleshed-out bass helps fill out the soundstage and give the earphones a big, full sound. It definitely doesn’t hurt that the dynamics of the bass driver are exceptionally good.

Instrument separation is also excellent and imaging is on-par with the Audio-Technica CK10 and among the best I’ve heard out of universal-fit monitors. The only area of concern is the bass, which can be a touch heavy next to the CK10 and can exaggerate the presence and prominence of low notes in the recording. On the upside, instrumental timbre is quite good – the K3003 sounds more natural than my j-Phonic K2 SP and ATH-CK10 and oftentimes beats the Earsonics SM3, which has some of the best timbre among all armature-based in-ears.

It’s worth noting that the K3003 is revealing but not overly punishing of poor recordings, rips, and masters, as stage monitors such as the j-Phonic K2 SP tend to be. It is also very easy to drive and scales up only moderately with amplification and higher-end sources – less so than the K2 SP and PFE 232, for example. Low-volume performance is also quite good, albeit potentially limited by the isolation in noisy places.


While the review above references only other universals in comparison to the AKG K3003, pitting the K3003 against custom-fit earphones played a large role in its evaluation. Below is a short set of A:B comparisons between the K3003 and three of my customs – the ClearTuneMonitors CTM-200, Alclair Reference, and Unique Melody Miracle.

The ClearTuneMonitors CTM-200 is a balanced-sounding dual-driver custom with neutral tone and a wide soundstage. In comparison, the K3003 is somewhat v-shaped in response, with stronger bass impact and bit more treble presence giving it a livelier, more exciting sound. The K3003 is significantly bassier, boasting more impact, body, and depth. Its bass is more dynamic and detailed, making the low end of the CTM-200 sound a bit flat and lifeless in comparison. The presentation of the K3003, though similar in width, is much deeper and more adept at portraying intimacy.

The Alclair Reference is a triple-driver earphone with a smooth sound on the warm side of neutral. It is a little more detailed and refined than the K3003 in the bass and midrange regions with smoother treble and similar soundstage size. The bass of the K3003 extends slightly better but sounds a touch boomy compared to the dry, tight bass produced by the dual bass drivers of the Reference. The K3003 also has slightly better on-center feel and a presentation that extends a little further inward. There is a tone difference as well – the K3003 is a bit brighter but no more fatiguing than the Reference, which has a slightly dry and analytical note presentation. The overall performance of these two earphones is very, very close.

The Unique Melody Miracle is the very first earphone I compared to the K3003, a test that convinced me that the K3003 may just be the best universal-fit earphone I’ve heard. The Miracle is clearer and more detailed in the midrange and treble and significantly tighter and cleaner in the bass region. The response is smoother overall and most of the time the Miracle sounds more natural and realistic. It has a wider presentation than the K3003 and better air, sounding more spacious with a better sense of dimensionality. The K3003 does boast a different sound signature, with quite a bit more mid-bass compared to the Miracle and a better ability to ramp up the punch and rumble on bass-heavy tracks. What’s impressive is how close the K3003 comes to the Miracle for sheer enjoyment, which wasn’t the case with the universal demo of the Miracle I heard a number of months ago.

Value *(8/10)* – While its price tag is shockingly high, the AKG K3003i represents a new class of portable product. The remote control unit - a seemingly blasphemous feature on a high-end headphone – may be evidence of a coming shift in portable Hi-Fi spending. With highly capable media devices becoming more widespread, consumers are likely to become more open-minded to spending good money on a headset, just as many have become receptive to pricy portable cans following the Beats by Dre craze.

Of course the K3003 is expensive even by celebrity headphone standards; those in search of value-for-money can safely give it a pass. Comparing the headset’s performance to similarly-priced full-size headphone and speaker setups makes no sense either – the K3003 is a solution for those who value portability. While its performance may not match that of a similarly-priced custom-fit earphone, it is almost certainly easier and more practical to obtain, avoids all of the extra costs and delays associated with re-fits, and should retain more resale value. Like the Fitear ToGo! MH334 and several FADs, then, these AKGs are a niche product pretty much in a class of their own. They may not provide the most bang for your buck but I can see very few reasons why those who _can_ afford them wouldn’t be delighted with the sound.

*Pros: Excellent overall build quality, exquisite packaging and presentation; very capable and enjoyable sound
Cons: Cables not detachable; moderate noise isolation; may not be comfortable for those with smaller ears; slight differences in note presentation between armatures and dynamic driver*


*(1A4) Spiral Ear SE 3-way Reference*


Reviewed June 2012

Details: Silicone-shelled custom from Poland-based Spiral Ear
Current Price: €595 (est *$790*) fixed cable, €665 (est *$885*) detachable cable from spiralear.com
Specs: Driver: _Triple BA;  3-way crossover_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4.2' L-plug_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Cleaning tool and hard-shelled custom-printed carrying case w/detachable lanyard
Build Quality* (5/5)* – The Spiral Ear IEMs use silicone shells that are completely filled in. Shell transparency isn’t as good as it can be with Acrylic monitors but the structure is solid, with a relatively small amount of give. The fixed-cable version utilizes Westone-style cables with the connectors encased within the silicone shell. Detachable cables (optional) boast internally-anchored, recessed connectors with conventional Westone ES-style plugs.
Isolation *(5/5)* – The isolation of the deep-fit silicone shells puts every other earphone in my collection to shame, outperforming even my custom-tipped Etymotic Research earphones
Microphonics *(5/5)* - Pretty much nonexistent
Comfort *(5/5) *– The silicone shells of the SE 3-way take slightly longer to insert and remove compared to a more rigid and slippery Acrylic shell but once fitted the 3-way is just as comfortable as my UM Miracle and seems to maintain seal a tiny bit better with changes to the ear canal shape, such as while chewing or talking. Being a custom monitor, the comfort of the 3-way is highly dependent on the quality of the initial impressions and final mold so if the earphones remain uncomfortable after an initial break-in period a re-fit is probably a good idea.

Sound *(9.5/10) *– While a number of promises are made on the 3-way Reference product page, extended listening to the earphones causes none to ring as true as that of “rich and organic” sound. The 3-way is a listening experience unlike anything else I’ve heard, providing a neutral, highly polished signature but also causing all of the other BA-based monitors I’ve heard to sound thin and underpowered in comparison.

The sound of the 3-way takes some getting used to – it isn’t designed to immediately wow with detail and clarity, sparkly treble, or a wide, out-of-the head presentation. Instead, it impresses in the long term – around the time 4 hours and 3 full albums have passed. Most impressive is the bass – there is a certain disconnect between the neutral tone of the 3-way Reference and the voluminous bass. The bass has great body and good punch. On bass-heavy tracks the 3-way is capable of effortlessly producing more impact than any other armature-based earphone I’ve heard, beating out the Earsonics SM3 and the bass-heavy filters of the Phonak PFE 232 and competing with the dynamic-driver bass of the AKG K3003. The bass response scales back quite well when it is not called for, too – dynamics are some of the best among armature-based IEMs, slightly better than with the SM3 and far superior to anything built around a full-range TWFK driver, for example. As a result, the earphones can still sound rather balanced on the whole but are also capable of really belting out the low notes on cue.

While most of the power comes in higher, the low end of the 3-way is well-extended – better, for example, than that of the Alclair Reference. Note weight is on the heavy side and some of the fine detail is not as audible as it can be with a thinner-sounding earphone such as a UM Miracle or Alclair Reference, but the 3-way sounds very natural and detailed in its own way. It is not one for analytical listeners but the excellent note thickness and dynamics make for a uniquely tactile and powerful bass presentation – one that is smooth, yet easily felt. The Earsonics SM3 – which is also rather thick-sounding - has a similar overall feel to its bass but can’t quite match the depth, resolution, and control of the 3-way Reference, sounding a little loose and bleeding up into the midrange more.

The midrange of the 3-way Reference is smooth and rich without sounding excessively warm. Indeed, for the amount of bass the Spiral Ear can produce, the mids are surprisingly free of bass bleed and the overall balance is quite good. There’s no sense of the mids being pushed forward artificially but also not as much distance placed between the listener and the performers as, for example, with the ClearTune CTM-200 or the popular VSonic GR07.

On the whole, the 3-way doesn’t adhere to a typical high-end BA sound - it does not push for the greatest possible clarity and detail, instead focusing on a thicker, more natural note presentation and overall coherency across the spectrum. In this way it is highly reminiscent of the Earsonics SM3, though the 3-way is noticeably more transparent. Combined with the lack of bright, emphasized treble, this means that the overall clarity is not immediately impressive as it is with the UM Miracle or CTM-200. The detailing is also not at all aggressive – the 3-way does not push fine nuances forward as many analytical earphones do. The detail is mostly there, but it takes some listening for. Overall, it sounds very natural and pleasant.

The top end of the 3-way Reference is among the smoothest and most non-fatiguing I’ve heard from an IEM. Comparing it to the AKG K3003, Alclair Reference, and Phonak PFE 232 reveals peaks in their treble presentations that just aren’t there with the Spiral Ear. The treble is clean and detailed but – much like that of the Earsonics SM3 – lacks some sparkle and energy next to other high-end earphones. Most likely it was tuned this way to prevent listening fatigue over long listening sessions but as a result the 3-way has a darker tone and can sound a bit boring at low volumes compared to brighter earphones. Treble quality is good but again the top end of the UM Miracle is not only more prominent, but also has better detail and extension, resulting in a more airy sound and a boost in perceived clarity.

The presentation of the 3-way is very well-rounded – similar in size to that of the Phonak PFE 232 but with better layering for a more ambient and 3-dimensional feel. The 3-way gives a good sense of space but provides a less open, more intimate sound compared to the UM Miracle and Alclair Reference. Separation is very good, as are the dynamics, resulting in good imaging and allowing the 3-way to recreate very fine nuances, especially in live recordings. Listening to a Phonak PFE 232 with the green +bass filters (which result in the most similar, albeit still more v-shaped, balance) makes very apparent just how much more detailed the 3-way is.


In addition to the mentions above, I thought I’d add more concise comparisons against my two other higher-end custom monitors – the Unique Melody Miracle and Alclair Reference.

The Alclair Reference ($399) pursues a slightly warm sound signature with a drier presentation and some treble emphasis. Compared to the Spiral Ear 3-way Reference it has a more laid-back soundstage with a thinner, more analytical note. The tone is brighter overall and it can sound slightly ‘hot’ with some tracks due to emphasis in the lower treble region. As a result of the treble emphasis, the perceived clarity is a bit better than with the 3-way but natural clarity is similar between the two. The 3-way, on the other hand, has much smoother treble for a less fatiguing sound and darker tone. It provides a better sense of 3-D space and better on-center feel. It also sounds more effortless at the bottom end, with better bass weight, power, and impact compared to the Alclair.

The UM Miracle ($950) is a spacious, highly detailed monitor with a very slightly u-shaped response. Like the Alclair Reference, the Miracle sounds brighter and clearer compared to the 3-way. Despite being more laid-back in the midrange, the Miracle still provides better detail and texture in addition to being more airy and spacious. However, while the Miracle’s bass depth and subbass power are similar to those of the 3-way, its mid- and upper-bass response is far leaner. The 3-way has much more bass body and sounds thicker, with more bass weight and impact but also a bit of boominess and slight lack of detail next to the Miracle. This gives the 3-way a very dynamic sound but causes the Miracle to appear more resolving overall.

Value *(8.5/10)* - The Spiral Ear 3-way Reference is a versatile and well-rounded custom monitor that eschews the usual analytical tendencies of high-end BA-based earphones for a holistic approach to sound more akin to that of EarSonics monitors. It is not for fans of a thiner note presentation, leaning instead towards the lush end of the spectrum, but its smooth, powerful, and full-bodied response is something that simply needs to be experienced, especially by those who claim dynamic drivers always sound more natural than armatures. The filled silicone shells offer similar comfort to acrylic shells (provided both are well-fitted) but easily best acrylic monitors – and every other earphone I’ve tried – when it comes to isolation. With the option to add detachable cables at additional cost, the only downside is that the Spiral Ear is limited in customization options compared to most of its acrylic counterparts. In addition, with its effortless low end and excellent dynamics, I feel that this is one custom monitor potentially suitable for bassheads as it is incredibly adept at making sure that whatever bass is on a track can be felt as well as heard.

*Pros: Immense isolation; incredibly dynamic, powerful, and full-bodied sound
Cons: Inserting and removing silicone shells takes some getting used to*

A full review of the SE 3-way with additional photos can be found here


*(1A5) FitEar To Go! 334*


Added Dec 2012

Details: Custom-turned-universal IEM from Japan-based FitEar. This TG334 was gifted to me by the Head-Fi community and I would like to sincerely thank the organizers, including shotgunshane, james444, rawrster, Inks, and Anaxilus, as well as everyone else whose efforts made this a reality. It was an incredible display of generosity that makes me proud to be a part of this community. The original thread can be found here

Current Price: *$1345 *from musicaacoustics.com (MSRP: est. $1350)
Specs: Driver: _Quad BA_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4' I-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5.5 mm_ | Preferred tips:_ Audiofly single-flanges; stock single-flanges, MEElec long single-flanges, short double-flanges_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5) *- Single-flange (3 sizes) & bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, cleaning tool, drawstring carrying pouch, and Pelican 1010 carrying case
Build Quality *(5/5) *– The TG334 is probably the best-constructed earphone I’ve come across; the fit and finish are top-notch--the shells have a very solid feel to them and the cables are sturdy and detachable, albeit with non-standard connectors. The cords don’t tangle but are a bit stiff compared to the cables on my custom-fit earphones
Isolation *(4/5)* – Very good for a universal – the TG334 fills up much of the outer ear and can provide excellent isolation with a good seal
Microphonics* (4.5/5) *– Quite low despite the stiff cable
Comfort *(4.5/5)* – The housings of the MH334 are on the large side, but quite ergonomic. The in-ear footprint isn’t too big and the bulk of the shell ends up outside of the ear. The stiff memory wire also keeps the weight in check

Sound *(9.5/10)* – FitEar’s first mass-produced universal-fit earphone, the TG334 is derived from the company’s MH334 custom-fit model. It is noteworthy not only for being one of the few quad-driver universal earphones, but also as part of the exclusive $1000+ club. The sound signature of the MH334 is an interesting one and is best characterized as mildly off-neutral, with some emphasis on the bass and midrange relative to the top end.

My first listen to the TG334 left me slightly stunned – it was the best universal-fit earphone I’d heard, but its sound signature was also quite different from what I had expected. The bass surprised me most of all – so thick and full compared to the vast majority of the other BA-based sets I’ve heard. Unlike many other armature-based sets, the TG334 can move some serious air and bass depth is very good as well. The sub-bass rumble stops just short of bass-heavy dynamic-driver sets such as the JVC FX700. The TG334 still trails the dynamic driver of the AKG K3003 and the custom-fit Spiral Ear 3-way Reference in sheer impact, but only by a small margin.

The slightly thick note also means that the TG334 just doesn’t sound as tight and quick as a crisper BA-based set might. In fact, this bass presentation can at times make it difficult to pin the TG334 down as a BA-powered monitor altogether. Compared, for example, to the more level bass of the ATH-CK10, the TG334 sounds noticeably boomy but gains more natural power and depth at the bottom end. Unlike the CK10, the TG334 can produce some serious rumble when necessary – a rarity even among higher-end armature-based monitors.

The midrange of the TG334 is clean and prominent, quite possibly the best feature of the earphone’s sound for me. Even though the TG334 is not as entirely neutral to my ears, it manages to maintain top notch transparency. Its midrange is among the clearest I’ve heard, exhibiting no veil whatsoever--clearer, for example, than the mids of the Phonak PFE232 and the custom-fit Spiral Ear 3-way, and more forward and transparent than those of the AKG K3003. Vocals are incredibly intelligible and the mids are very smooth and full-sounding overall.

Moving on up, the TG334 remains smooth and refined. The top end is a bit laid-back on the whole, resulting in a slightly darker tone. The AKG K3003, for example, is both brighter in tone and more edgy in treble presentation, even with the ‘reference’ filters in place. Still, despite the soft treble, the TG334 remains pretty neutral – it is not as dark as the Spiral Ear SE 3-way, for instance. There are also no sibilance-accentuating peaks and sets such as the PFE232 and Audio-Technica CK10 sound downright splashy next to the FitEar. Top-end extension is good but doesn’t seem quite as impressive as that of the UE 900 or even the AKG K3003. As a result, the TG334 is not an extremely airy-sounding earphone, but the presentation is great regardless.

The ambient presentation is my second favorite aspect of the TG334 after the euphonic midrange. The earphone provides a very good sense of space for a universal – it may not sound as wide as the Sony EX1000, but the headstage has excellent height and depth in addition to good width. Add in great separation and it’s clear why the TG334 images extremely well. Due to the forward mids, it has a slight tendency to stay intimate and in-the-head but the overall versatility is impressive. The soundstaging is noticeably better than that of the PFE232 and the Alclair Reference customs – two very solid mid-tier earphones – and the imaging is at least as good as with any other universal-fit earphone I’ve heard.


*Select comparisons:*

HiFiMan RE262 ($149)

Perhaps the most reasonably-priced IEM I would dare pit against the TG334, the RE262 is a dynamic-driver design from one of Head-Fi’s favorite manufacturers. Compared to the far more expensive TG334, the RE262 yields in bass extension and power but sounds a bit tighter and quicker. It lacks the dynamics, deep bass presence, and overall impact of the FitEar, and at times can sound downright recessed at the low end in comparison.

The midrange of the 334 is slightly clearer, thicker, and fuller compared to the RE262 but the overall tonality is quite similar between the two earphones, with both sounding a little warmer/darker than what I would consider neutral. The treble of the RE262 is a little more laid-back but the overall balance is still good, seemingly benefitting from the lighter bass. Finally, the TG334 wins the soundstaging battle easily with a bigger, more out-of-the-head presentation along with better layering and separation and a more convincing center image.

VSonic GR07 ($180)

VSonic’s dynamic-driver reference monitor boasts a fantastic price/performance ratio but falls very short of the TG334 in a head to head comparison. While its bass is tighter and more controlled than that of the TG334, the GR07 fails to make up for its lack of midrange and treble performance. The midrange of the GR07 sounds overly lean and distant compared to that of the TG334. Vocals are less intelligible and generally sound less natural and refined. The mids of the TG334, on the hand, sound fuller and simply more “mature” than those of the GR07.

Moving up, the GR07 is brighter and has the treble energy that the TG334 lacks. However, in doing so it tends to be significantly more harsh and sibilant. Compared to the soft, yet detailed treble of the TG334, the GR07 seems unrefined and ultimately much less satisfying. The presentation, too, is no match for the FitEar. The layering and soundstage depth of the TG334 make the GR07 sound flat and distant and highlight its lack of a strong center image and the ability to portray intimacy properly.

Ultimate Ears 900 ($400)

UE’s latest and greatest boasts a similar quad BA configuration to the TG334 but fails to provide the transparency and spaciousness of the pricier FitEar. Compared to the UE900, the TG334 boasts more powerful and dynamic bass and more prominent mids. Its sound is significantly clearer and more transparent, with better detailing and better instrument separation. The UE900 sounds downright veiled in comparison but, on the upside, has slightly better treble presence and extension compared to the TG334.

1964EARS 1964-V3 ($425)

1964EARS’ second-gen triple-BA custom monitor is a mid-level custom earphone, but it does a surprisingly good job of keeping up with the FitEar. The TG334 does have slightly deeper bass and sounds more dynamic and natural than the V3. On tracks with heavy bass presence, overall bass quantity is quite close between the two but the TG334 does a better job of scaling down its bass response when necessary. In comparison, the bass of the V3 can be slightly more boomy and intrusive.

Both earphones have clean, upfront mids, but the TG334 doesn’t sound quite as forward as the V3, due in part to its superior layering and separation. Its sound is fuller, as well as slightly more detailed and refined. The V3 boasts more emphasis in the upper midrange and treble for a brighter sound. It can also sound just a touch harsh in comparison but generally remains well-behaved. The presentation battle is won by the TG334 with a more spacious soundstage and better imaging, but by a much smaller margin compared to the RE262 or GR07.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

The Miracle is a 3-way, 6-driver custom monitor priced slightly below the TG334. To my ears, the Miracle is a hallmark of full-range sound presented in an immersive way. The bass of the Miracle provides the best qualities balanced armatures have to offer, with great extension and a lack of mid-bass emphasis. The result is tight, quick, and very detailed bass that makes the low end of the TG334 sound slightly bloated. It would not be impossible to mistake the TG334, with its greater mid-bass impact and thicker note presentation, for a dynamic-driver earphone when comparing it to the more textured and detailed Miracle.

From the midrange upward, it becomes more difficult to split the two earphones except on preference. The TG334 sounds warmer overall, with more emphasis on the bass, mids that are more upfront (especially next to the more laid-back Miracle), and less prominent treble. Resolution is fantastic with both earphones but the brighter Miracle has a slight edge in perceived clarity. The greater sparkle and treble energy of the Miracle contrast the softer, smoother, more relaxed treble presentation of the darker FitEar very nicely without sounding harsh or grainy.

The presentation of the Miracle is wider and more spacious compared to the TG334. The TG334 has an impressively out-of-the-head soundstage and very good imaging for a universal-fit earphone but it can’t quite match the sheer size of the Miracle’s presentation, nor the psychoacoustic top-to-bottom and front-to-rear space. The tighter bass of the Miracle also gives it a leg up when it comes to providing a clean and well-separated sonic image.

Value *(8/10) *– The FitEar TG334 earns its hefty price by joining off-the-charts construction quality with impressive sonic performance. The clean and strong midrange and excellent sense of space combine with soft treble and rich, full-bodied bass to appeal even to those who normally prefer dynamic drivers. The question many will be asking is whether the TG334 performs as well as similarly-priced custom monitors. Based comparing it to just the UM Miracle, the answer seems to be "not quite", but more than one data point would be needed for certainty. What I do know is that for many the TG334 is likely more practical to obtain than a custom, avoids all of the extra costs and delays associated with impressions and re-fits, and should retain more resale value. There is no question that the 334 is a niche product, but as a universal-fit earphone it is simply sublime.

*Pros: Fantastically clear and strong midrange; great imaging and sense of space; high isolation; amazing build quality
Cons: Bass could be tighter*

Huge thanks to *shotgunshane*,* james444*, *Anaxilus*, *Inks*, *rawrster*, and everyone else who pitched in to make this TG334 a reality!


*(1A6) Ultrasone IQ*


Added Feb 2013

Details: Ultrasone’s flagship earphone built around a hybrid BA/dynamic driver system
Current Price: *$899* from bhphotovideo.com (MSRP: $949)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic/BA Hybrid_ | Imp: _20Ω_ | Sens: _106 dB_ | Freq: _17-21k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
Nozzle Size:_ 2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Etymotic triple-flange, Westone TRUE-FIT Foam_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4.5/5) *– Single-flange silicone tips (3 pairs standard, 2 pairs cone-shaped), Comply foam tips (2 pairs), spare cable with inline mic/remote, TRRS smartphone adapter, airline adapter, and magnetic-clasp carrying case
Build Quality *(5/5) *– The build is rock-solid, boasting sturdy die-cast housings and detachable cables with coaxial connectors. Filter-less nozzles, together with the lack of a wax loop in the accessory pack, may be an issue for those with waxy ears, though the included Comply tips provide wax guards. The clear-coated cables are soft and flexible, similar to the cords on MEElectronics earphones
Isolation* (3.5/5) *– Isolation is above average with the stock silicone tips and better with the included Comply foams as well as my preferred triple-flanges
Microphonics *(5/5) *– Nonexistent in the coated cable
Comfort* (3.5/5) *– The housings are cube-shaped and on the large side, holding both a balanced armature and an 8mm dynamic driver per side. The profile reminds me of the Earsonics SM3 and the overall volume of the housings isn’t much bigger than some of the mutli-armature sets on the market. However, “cube” is not the most ergonomic shape in the world and the housing corners can cause soreness after some time unless longer tips are used to allow the housing to sit farther outside the ear

Sound *(9.3/10) *– Ultrasone’s first in-ear monitor utilizes a hybrid driver system with an 8mm side-mounted dynamic driver and a single balanced armature. Quite a few hybrid setups have been released in the past year but it is still an unusual choice for a company’s first foray into IEMs. Happily, Ultrasone pulls the IQ off rather well, with the exception of one issue - the tuning seems to favor a deep insertion while the included eartips, in conjunction with the large housing, favor a shallower fit for average-sized ears.

With the stock tips the treble response of the IQ peaks heavily right in the sibilance region, making many tracks sibilant and some - downright uncomfortable. The silicone tips are the worst offenders, followed closely by the Complys. After a few hours of tip rolling, I found the Etymotic triple-flange tips to cut the sibilance completely while retaining an acceptable amount of treble energy for me. An inline impedance adapter can tame the treble a bit more, likely due to the non-linear impedance characteristic of the balanced armature driver. Using both the Etymotic tips and impedance adapter together results in a drastic change but proved unnecessary, so this review and the subsequent comparisons were all done with the Etymotic triple-flange tips as the only modification to the IQ.

No matter the eartips, the bass delivered by the 8mm dynamic driver of the IQ is surprisingly poised and precise. The IQ is an enhanced-bass earphone, no doubt, but the bass is textured, quick, and not at all overbearing for a dynamic-driver set. It is somewhat reminiscent of the AKG K3003 in this respect. Bass extension is good, with plenty of sub-bass rumble, and the overall impact is still impressive, in the realm of the armature-based Phonak PFE 232 and FitEar TG334. Bass bleed is minimal and the IQ, again like the K3003, does not sound particularly mid-recessed despite its v-shaped sound profile.

The midrange is clean and clear, with surprisingly little warmth for an earphone with such robust bass. The mids are lagging in emphasis compared to the low end but not enough to warrant being called recessed, and the upper midrange and treble have good presence. Despite the treble spikes that annoy me with the stock tips, the IQ is not a particularly bright earphone – it doesn’t have the treble energy of the AKG K3003 or the Audio-Technica ATH-CK10, for example; it just seems to hit all of the sibilance-prone areas. The treble presentation with the stock tips does hurt tonality, reminding me of Ultrasone’s HFI-780 headphone – a fun but slightly metallic-sounding full-size set. The HFI-780 never appealed to me over Utrasone’s more balanced Proline models, and the IQ likewise is a tad too colored with the stock eartips. With proper eartips it remains only slightly harsh, to an extent that can be dismissed except when pitted side by side against something like the K3003.

In terms of presentation, the IQ is competent all around. It is a spacious-sounding earphone with a very consistent and even-handed presentation. Its soundstage is larger compared to many other top-tier universals, including the Phonak PFE 232, but doesn’t stay as free of congestion due to the nature of the dynamic driver. Imaging, however, is good and the IQ can provide a very enveloping sonic presentation without sounding forward. It’s worth noting the high sensitivity as well – the IQ is well above average in this regard and is both revealing of source matching issues and very, very easy to drive.

*Select Comparisons*

UE900 ($400)

Logitech UE’s latest and greatest is a quad-armature monster boasting excellent presence across the frequency spectrum and a sound signature somewhere between “neutral” and “Triple.Fi 10”. The UE 900 seems to miss out on the full, natural bass impact of the IQ’s dynamic driver but matches its low-end extension. The bigger, more dynamic bass of the IQ emphasizes the fun factor, but also scales up more convincingly on bass-heavy tracks.

The midrange of the UE 900 sounds a little muffled in comparison to the IQ, likely due to the upper midrange dip noted in my original review. The IQ remains flatter through the midrange, though its treble is not quite as smooth as that of the Ultimate Ears. I prefer the greater treble energy of the IQ once it is tamed with my aftermarket tips, but with both earphones using their stock fittings the UE 900 bothers me less. In terms of presentation, both sets are spacious and image very well, with no clear winner for me.

Phonak PFE 232 ($600)

Yet another detachable-cable universal with a massive price tag and headset functionality, the PFE 232 is rather bassy for an armature-based earphone and proves to be good competition for the dynamic-driver bass of the IQ. Indeed, the bass presence of the two earphones is quite similar, with the Ultrasone providing a bit more punch and body. The overall sound of the PFE 232 is more v-shaped, with less prominent mids compared to the IQ. The lower midrange especially is set a little too far back with the Phonaks, which does them no favors when it comes to intelligibility. The IQ, meanwhile, sounds clearer and flatter through the midrange. Treble is a close call – both earphones have good treble presence and the Ultrasone only wins out in refinement when paired with aftermarket eartips, and even then just barely. The gray-filtered Phonak ends up just a touch hotter and thinner-sounding. The soundstage of the IQ is larger, providing a slightly more out-of-the-head listening experience and superior imaging.

AKG K3003i ($1300)

Similarities between the K3003 and the IQ abound – each is a flagship product from a company with a history of headphone Hi-Fi, each uses a hybrid driver setup, and each has a borderline shocking sticker price. The K3003 utilizes a 3-way setup, with dual armatures handling the midrange and treble. Surprisingly, however, its bass driver is not as well-optimized as that of the IQ. The low end of the K3003 ends up sounding slightly more intrusive and less controlled, with the resulting fuller bass note leading to poorer coherence between the drivers compared to the IQ.

The lighter, snappier bass of the IQ affords it even less midrange bleed. Both earphones have minimal midrange recession and energetic, prominent highs. The K3003 (with the Reference tuning filter) has a bit more treble energy but still sounds smoother and more refined than the IQ. Both have large, well-layered presentations, with the K3003 having a slight upper hand when it comes to portraying a more convincing soundscape.

1964EARS 1964-V3 ($425)

1964EARS’ triple-driver model is a high bang/buck earphone for those willing to invest in a custom-fit product. Compared to the IQ, the V3 pursues a more aggressive and intimate sound, with forward mids, an enveloping presentation, and very high sensitivity. The dynamic driver of the IQ can’t quite keep up with the speed of the V3’s bass but provides similar slam. The V3 seems less bassy due to the forward mids but its sound is overall more colored than that of the slightly v-shaped IQ. Neither set has the most refined treble, nor is picking a winner easier when comparing the broader soundstage of the IQ to the smaller but more 3-dimensional presentation of the V3.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

The Miracle is a 3-way, 6-driver custom that, with the cost of impressions and shipping factored in, would be priced just above the IQ. The Ultrasone competes with this flagship custom monitor surprisingly well despite its more colored, v-shaped sound signature. As expected, the Miracle is flatter and more accurate overall, with mids that are less recessed, more extended treble, and a slightly broader presentation not bogged down with the heavier bass of the IQ’s dynamic driver. It is smoother and more refined, especially in the treble region, while the Ultrasone ends up sounding warmer and harsher. Still, the IQ provides a bassier sound with little sacrifice in the way of clarity and overall resolution – a feat in and of itself. It also does a good job of keeping up with the imaging and dynamics of the Miracle, which few other earphones, custom or universal, manage to do.

Value *(7.5/10) *– Ultrasone’s new flagship in-ear takes a page right out of the Edition playbook, providing an on-the-go listening experience for the well-to-do. The IQ is a top performer in many ways but seems to sound better with a difficult-to-achieve deep seal. It is an interesting proposition – an earphone that doesn’t quite impress out of the box but has tons of potential for those willing to work towards a good fit. Is this reasonable for such a high-end product? I’m not so sure, but the fact remains that the IQ can make a good case for itself in the sound department.

Audio quality aside, the IQ scores high marks for its superb construction, including die-cast housings, detachable cords, and soft, tangle-free cabling. Cable noise is nil and noise isolation is good compared to the Sennheiser IE 800 and AKG K3003. High sensitivity and a secure, over-the-ear fit add to its versatility. It’s not going to win over the value-minded, but the IQ is yet another simpler, easier alternative to spending copious amounts of cash on a custom-fit monitor.

*Pros: Sound can be very competent; solid crafstmanship
Cons: Treble response poorly sculpted with stock tips; awkward housing shape; no nozzle filters or wax loop included*


*(1A7) Hidition NT 6*


Added Jun 2013

Details: One of two flagship models from Korea-based Hidition
Current Price: est. *$1200* from hidition.co.kr
Specs: Driver: _6 BA / 4-way crossover_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
Nozzle Size: N/A | Preferred tips: N/A
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5) *– Custom hard-shell carrying case, cleaning tool, and cleaning cloth
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The build quality of the NT 6 is excellent, with thick acrylic shells and a well-made cable featuring angled connectors and a metal Palics plug. The cable is braided and covered in heatshrink tubing for extra protection but is prone to the memory effect, maintaining its shape after being coiled up for storage. On the cosmetic side, Hidition offers a massive number of customization options, including some very unique mother of pearl faceplates (one of which is shown)
Isolation *(4.5/5)* - The isolation provided by the deep-sealing shells is excellent - slightly below that of my silicone-shelled customs but higher than with my other acrylic-shelled units
Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – The heatshrink-wrapped cable produces slightly more microphonics than the cables on my other customs
Comfort *(5/5)* – My NT 6 was built with a musician fit, extending to the second bend of the ear canal. As with all acrylic customs, the shells are hard but comfortable when fitted correctly. If the earphones remain uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit may be required

Sound *(9.9/10)* – Hidition’s lineup is notable for having not one but two six-driver flagships – the NT 6, which features a 4-way passive crossover, and the NT 6-PRO, which adds another crossover point for a 5-way setup. The PRO model promises enhanced bass, while the vanilla NT 6 is said to be more neutral.

The overall signature of the NT 6 is balanced, with a slight treble emphasis. The earphone impresses most with its bell-like clarity, but there’s a whole lot more to like. The bass is linear, with a small boost in the sub-bass region. The low end is a little leaner compared, for example, to the JH13 Pro and Westone ES5, but remains extremely tight and controlled at all times. Overall accuracy is great and the neutral bass quantity is very welcome, though perhaps a little surprising considering the triple bass drivers of the NT 6. One may expect more bass boost, but the low end of the NT 6 is punchy when it needs to be, otherwise staying out of the way.

The midrange is flat and level, boasting striking clarity and detail. There is no bass bleed and the mids are not in the least bit recessed. With nothing to get in the way of the midrange, detail resolution and overall definition are fantastic. Vocal intelligibility is excellent as well – better compared to the UM Miracle and Heir Audio 8.A, for example. Only the JH13 Pro competes in clarity, and even then its mild bass boost puts it at a slight disadvantage to the NT 6.

On the whole, the NT 6 is well-balanced aside from an upper treble bump, which gives it a characteristically brighter, cooler tone. It is not a forgiving earphone but, happily, the top-end emphasis falls above the 4-8 kHz range where sibilance typically originates, so the NT 6 does not introduce sibilance or harshness to recordings. Treble extension is excellent, contributing to an airy and open sound with entirely unconstrained dynamics.

The tight, clean sound of the NT 6 does wonders for the presentation of the earphone. The Hidition boasts a wide and spacious soundstage but does not lack in the way of a central image. Overall imaging is excellent, resulting in a convincing presentation, and while soundstage depth and layering aren’t quite on-par with the JH13Pro or UM Miracle, they are certainly close enough to compete.

*Select Comparisons*

JH Audio JH13 Pro Freqphase ($1099)

Like that of Hidition, JHA’s lineup offers two flagships, the 8-driver JH16 and the 6-driver JH13, and, like the NT 6, the JH13 is the more neutral-sounding of JHA's two flagships. For me, these two monitors are the cream of the crop – both impossibly clear and resolving, with very good imaging and lifelike presentations. The differences between them lie largely in sound signature, with the JH13 being very close to – but a pinch on the warm side of - neutral and the NT 6 being slightly bright.

While the low end of the NT 6 is extended, punchy, and dynamic, the Hidition just doesn’t crank out quite as much bass the JH13. Personally, I don’t find the low end of the JH13 excessive but the bass of the Hidition is flatter in profile and a little tighter as a result. The bassier JH13 carries a slightly warmer tone as well, though the mids on both earphones are completely free of veiling and fantastically clear. The NT 6 is brighter, with more emphasis on higher frequencies, but it also has a more fluid note presentation. On the soundstage front, the JH13 sounds a little more 3-dimensional and enveloping while the NT 6 has slightly less depth to it. The JH13Pro is significantly more sensitive.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

Unique Melody’s 6-driver flagship remains one of my favorite earphones even after more than two years of ownership. On the whole, it keeps up rather well with the NT 6. The NT 6 is overall brighter, crisper, and more resolving than the Miracle, with a flatter midrange presentation and better vocal intelligibility. Despite its cooler tone, the NT 6 has a bit more bass impact while the Miracle is a little softer and more polite.

The Miracle boasts smoother, more relaxed treble while the NT 6 has more energy, coupled with outstanding treble extension and a very wide and airy presentation. The Miracle, in comparison, is a little more constrained, with a narrower soundstage and slightly less dynamic overall sound. Like the JH13, it gives up some of the width of the NT 6 for better depth and a slightly more enveloping presentation, but unfortunately loses some of the effortlessness of the Hidition and JHA sets in the process.

Lime Ears LE3 (est. $690)

The LE3 from Poland-based Lime Ears may be a mere triple-driver, but it is the most balanced such setup I’ve heard. Compared to the Lime Ears, the much-pricier NT 6 has some advantages – its bass is both tighter and more impactful, and the earphone is a little clearer overall – but the difference on all counts is not night and day. Tonally, the LE3 has less treble emphasis for a more neutral overall sound compared to the brighter NT 6. Its treble is smoother, but also doesn’t quite have the extension of the Hidition. The presentation of the NT 6 is also larger and more dynamic, though the LE3 is no slouch itself.

Value *(9/10)* – The market has changed a lot since my first review of a high-end custom IEM, the UM Miracle, more than two years ago. The inception of a new breed of hyper-expensive universals and dozens of new CIEM companies from all around the world have made the market more crowded – and more confusing – than ever before. One thing is clear in trying to make sense of it all – sound signature remains the key to finding the perfect earphone, custom or otherwise, for every individual.

That said, the NT 6 is undoubtedly one of the very best earphones I’ve had the pleasure of trying, combining incredible clarity and resolution with tight, level bass and extended treble with plenty of energy. Top to bottom, the NT 6 does not lack presence at any frequency and is the ideal earphone for those who want accuracy, avoiding any and all bass bloat and providing a leaner sound with a neutral-to-bright tone. Hiditon’s excellent build quality, deep-sealing shells, and plethora of customization options are just icing on the cake.

*Pros: Great finish; high isolation due to deep fit; outstanding audio quality
Cons: Cable more Microphonic than most custom cables*


*(1A8/1A9) Lime Ears LE3 and LE3B*


Added Jul 2013

Details: sister flagship CIEMs from Poland-based Lime Ears
Current Price: 529€ (est. *$700*) from limeears.com
Specs: Driver: _3 BA / 3-way crossover_ | Imp: _46Ω_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories* (4/5)* - Hard-shell crushproof carrying case and tube of ear lubricant
Build Quality *(5/5) *– Construction is on-par with the likes of 1964EARS and Alclair, falling just short of pricier UM and Hidition sets. The acrylic shells have a very smooth finish and while my LE3B unit has some mild internal imperfections, the shells of the newer LE3 are very clear. The earphones boast recessed 2-pin connectors in the common configuration. There are five standard colors and myriad other customization options available. The cables have a smooth feel but suffer from a bit of memory character, maintaining their shape after being coiled up for storage. On the upside, unlike most clear cables found on custom monitors, these don’t seem to oxidize and turn green over time
Isolation *(4/5) *– Similar to my other shallow-fit acrylic customs and slightly below that of the Hidition NT6 and Etymotic Research universals
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Nearly nonexistent in the smooth clear-coated cable
Comfort *(5/5) *– The LE3 and LE3B have medium length nozzles and are very comfortable when fitted correctly. As usual, if the CIEMs seem uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit is probably a good idea. There is added cost with shipping and, if necessary, getting new impressions but on the whole a perfect fit is well worth the trouble

Sound *(9.5/10)* – Lime Ears currently offers two different configurations of their triple-driver flagship. The standard LE3 provides a balanced and neutral sound while the LE3B, built by request only at this time, is an alternate tuning meant to supply a warmer tone with more bass kick. This review will cover both units.

The standard LE3 offers up a balanced sound with a very mild warm tilt, akin to the JHAudio JH13 or, from the realm of universals, a newer HiFiMan set. To my ears, it is more uncolored than the vast majority of my other custom-fit earphones. The Hidition NT6, for example, is brighter than the LE3 and tends to emphasize treble more while the Spiral Ear SE-3 is warmer with its deep, visceral bass. The bottom end of the LE3 lacks a little in the way of extension – while not exactly poor in this regard, it definitely gives up depth to its enhanced-bass sibling.

That’s pretty much the extent of the LE3’s concessions, however – moving up from the subbass region, it boasts punchy and controlled bass and clean, accurate mids with no hint of recession. It remains smooth through the upper midrange and treble, coming across as quite forgiving for an IEM with such a neutral tone. There is a bit of crispness missing compared to higher-end sets but nothing drastic and despite the soft treble character, the LE3 does not sound dark, again reminding me of current-gen HiFiMan earphones. The LE3 also provides a sonic image that’s neither forward nor too far back, thanks to its prominent, veil-free midrange. Compared to higher-end custom-fit sets, the only thing its presentation is a bit of depth – in this regard it is similar to top-tier universals such as the AKG K3003.

Switching over to the LE3B, the enhanced bass immediately makes itself known. The two earphones have many similarities – as they should, using identical drivers and all, but the LE3B delivers on its promise of extra bass, putting out perhaps the best combination of quantity and quality I’ve heard out of a single bass driver. In this regard the LE3B competes with the pricier Westone ES5. Compared to the LE3, the warmer and bassier LE3B boasts not only more punch but also less roll-off while the extra bass impact and depth lend it a richer, fuller, more dynamic sound.

The bass of the LE3 on the other hand, lacks the depth and rumble of the LE3B’s bass and its presentation actually seems more intimate next to the more dynamic LE3B. The less prominent bass of the LE3 results in a cooler overall tone and slightly cleaner mids. The difference in clarity is small between the two, however, and the treble is very similar - smooth but not lacking in presence.


*Select Comparisons – Lime Ears LE3*

Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 ($350)

The most reasonably-priced of my customs, the CTM-200 is a dual driver that strives towards a flat/neutral sound, which made it the perfect starting point for LE3 comparisons. Compared to the CTM-200, the LE3 has better bass presence and sounds a little warmer overall. The bass is both deeper and more impactful, which results in the Lime Ears having a more natural and dynamic sound. The midrange of the CTM-200 seems more forward overall while the LE3 is more relaxed. The treble of the LE3 is smoother, though the CTM-200 is not a harsh-sounding earphone. The differences in the midrange and treble are minor and can easily be chalked up to preference. Presentation, however, is a win for the Lime Ears – they are simply more spacious and well-separated, with better imaging and depth that cause the CTM-200, with its more forward mids, to sound a bit flat and dull in comparison.

Alclair Reference ($399)

While still pricier than the CTM-200, the Alclair Reference recently underwent a $100 price drop to a more comfortable price point, which has worked in favor of its value proposition. The Reference keeps up with the LE3 very well, with the only major differences stemming from its midrange and treble presentation. Signature-wise, the Reference is a very mildly v-shaped earphone that reminds me more of the UM Miracle and VSonic GR07. Its lower midrange sounds a little withdrawn compared to the more balanced Lime Ears but otherwise the two earphones have a lot in common right up to the upper midrange, which is noticeably grainier on the Reference. This theme continues through the treble, which is more harsh and sibilant with the Alclairs. The extra treble energy of the Reference does make it seem clearer at times, but it’s a dubious tradeoff that causes me to choose the LE3 almost every time.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

A top-tier flagship that has been popular for several years running, the Miracle is a mildly v-shaped earphone, though one with fewer caveats than the cheaper Alclair Reference. Compared to the LE3, the Miracle has better deep bass, with extension that easily matches the bass-heavy LE3B tuning of the Lime Ears, but without of the bloat. The UM is a little warmer overall and suffers from a slightly recessed midrange in comparison to the LE3, which actually appears more balanced as a result. The Miracle does catch up in treble presence, with a top end that is more prominent but still a little more refined and just as smooth as that of the Lime Ears. Overall, I was impressed with how well the LE3 kept up with the Miracle - its downsides were not as obvious as those of the LE3B and its midrange was actually preferable much of the time.

JHAudio JH13 Pro Freqphase ($1099)

Currently my CIEM of choice, the JH13 Freqphase is yet another neutrality-oriented custom that made for a natural comparison with the LE3 – indeed, I found the signature of the JH13 to be more similar to the Lime Ears than those of the Alclair and Unique Melody sets. In terms of performance, the LE3 is less extended at either end and not as clean, crisp, and resolving as the JH13. The JH13 also offers up a bit more bass punch, exercises tighter control over its low end, and provides slightly more convincing imaging but the two earphones definitely share a similar sound signature, with the LE3 approximating the sound and performance of the JH13 as well as can be expected for the price.


*Select Comparisons – Lime Ears LE3B*

EarSonics SM64 ($399)

Like the LE3B, EarSonics’ universal-fit flagship utilizes a 3-way, triple-armature setup and pursues a sound on the warm side of neutral. Compared to the SM64, the bass of the LE3B is a little more enhanced – not in depth, but certainly in impact and overall power. Despite this, the clarity of the LE3B is slightly better and overall detailing appears better as well, likely because the upper midrange dip of the SM64 is not present. There also is more treble energy with the LE3B which, combined with the flatter midrange-treble transition, makes it less forgiving and more prone to exposing sibilance. That’s not to say the LE3B is sibilant on its own – it isn’t – but the SM64 is a more tolerant of such artifacts in recordings. Lastly, the presentation of the LE3B is slightly wider whereas the SM64 appears more intimate, though still far from congested.

1964EARS 1964-V3 ($425)

1964EARS’ triple-BA model is tuned for a decidedly consumer-friendly sound with big bass and sparkly, energetic, treble. The enhanced-bass Lime Ears boast a bit less bass than the V3 and offer a slightly clearer and more neutral overall sound. The midrange of the LE3B is flatter, in contrast to the bumped-up, more forward mids of the V3. The treble is smoother, with less sparkle but also less danger of harshness and sibilance. The V3, on the other hand, tends to be fairly revealing of sibilance and more colored-sounding overall. In terms of presentation, the V3 is more aggressive while the Lime Ears are more laid-back.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

Unique Melody’s flagship IEM offers a level sound signature more in line with the regular LE3, but for the sake of posterity I decided to compare it to the LE3B as well. Unsurprisingly, the results are much the same as when the LE3B is pitted against the LE3. Next to the Miracle, the LE3B sounds mid-bassy and bloated, with a warmer overall tone and a slight loss in overall clarity and refinement. The Miracle boasts more treble presence/energy, is more neutral in tone, and enjoys a slightly more spacious presentation. Still, though I found myself leaning towards the Miracle more here than in the LE3/Miracle comparison, the difference between the two can easily be negated by signature preferences.

FitEar To Go! 334 ($1345)

The TG334 is quite similar in performance to the LE3B but whereas the FitEar is unabashedly warm and dark, the Lime Ears at least make an attempt at a reference sound. Overall, the LE3B is more balanced and neutral while still offering good bass punch. The more prominent treble of the LE3B makes it sound a touch clearer and its soundstage is a little more out-of-the-head. Other than that, the two earphones are about even in performance, with both lacking a bit of treble extension and some of the refinement of more neutral sets. I preferred one or the other on most of the tracks used in the comparison, but never strongly.

Value *(8.5/10) *– Operational for only a few months so far, Lime Ears is off to a very good start with their first flagships, the LE3 and LE3B. Functionally and aesthetically, the earphones are identical, with the same customization options, construction, and accessories. In terms of sound, the LE3 is a reference monitor that sacrifices a bit of bass depth to maintain a clearer, more prominent midrange while the LE3B is warmer and bassier without throwing accuracy under the bus. Both units offer advantages over the entry-level customs I’ve previously come across and compete with pricier earphones. As for choosing between the two, there’s no right or wrong answer, but I have found the bass depth and dynamics of the LE3B very persuasive in day to day listening.

*Note: as of August 2013, the LE3SW is available as a 50€ option, incorporating a switch that allows the user to switch between the sound signatures of the LE3 and LE3B models.

Pros: Both tunings offer competitive performance for their sound signatures
Cons: Cables prone to memory effect*


*(1A10) Sensaphonics 3MAX*


Reviewed October 2013

Details: Silicone-shelled custom from Sensaphonics
Current Price:* $1050*from sensaphonics.com
Specs: Driver:_ 3 BA / 2-way crossover_ | Imp: _14.2Ω _| Sens: _114 dB @ 0.1V_ | Freq: _20-16k Hz _| Cable: _4.2' L-plug_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5) *– Shirt clip, cleaning tool, 1/4" adapter, lightweight zippered carrying pouch, and padded Pelican hard-shell storage case
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The 3MAX utilizes silicone shells. As is usually the case with silicone, shell clarity isn’t as good as with acrylic monitors but the overall construction is very good. The 3MAX is the only custom earphone in my collection to use coaxial connectors. This means most aftermarket custom earphone cables will not fit, but also allows cords for Shure and some Ultimate Ears universals to be used as reasonably-priced replacements. Finally, the Sensaphonics cable resists oxidation better than other clear cords – a good thing as my other clear cables usually start turning green after just a few months
Isolation *(5/5)* – The isolation of the silicone shells is excellent, falling just behind my other silicone-shelled custom, the Spiral Ear 3-way Reference
Microphonics *(5/5) *- Pretty much nonexistent
Comfort *(5/5)* – The silicone shells of the 3MAX take slightly longer to insert and remove compared to more rigid and slippery acrylic shells but are extremely comfortable once fitted and seem to maintain seal a bit better with changes to the ear canal shape, such as while chewing or talking. Being a custom monitor, the comfort is highly dependent on the quality of the initial impressions and final mold so if the earphones remain uncomfortable after an initial break-in period a re-fit is probably a good idea

Sound* (9.4/10) *– Tuned in collaboration with professional mastering engineers, the Sensaphonics 3MAX follows a different sound signature than other musicians’ monitors I’ve tried. Despite the dual woofer design, its sound is focused more on the midrange, especially the upper midrange. The bass has good punch but is not as emphasized as one may expect from an earphone with twin bass drivers. Depth is good – nearly on-par with enhanced-bass earphones such as the Westone ES5 and Heir Audio 8.A. Bass quality is about on par with the universal-fit AKG K3003 – the 3MAX is a little tighter and less mid-bassy, but also less impactful.

The sound of the 3MAX is a bit on the thick side, so while the earphone is fairly neutral in tone, it doesn’t sound analytical. Rather, it has a natural note presentation and tends to emphasize the midrange, placing vocals front and center. As a result, its sound appears more full-bodied next to sets with less prominent mids, such as the Alclair Reference. The emphasis on the upper midrange does cause the earphones to sound a bit “shouty” but the prominent vocals that result are in keeping with Sensaphonics’ goal of encouraging lower-volume listening.

The upper midrange emphasis of the 3MAX gives way to largely smooth treble. There is a bit more treble energy than with the darker-sounding Westone ES5 but less than with the JH13 Pro. The treble doesn’t “sparkle” and is very non-fatiguing – a definite plus for those who intend to wear their customs for hours at a time. In this respect the 3MAX is better than, for example, the AKG K3003 and Alclair Reference. The presentation of the 3MAX is a little on the intimate side, which is not unusual among stage monitors. It is more spacious and open-sounding than the AKG K3003, for example, but sounds a little flat and dull compared to the Heir 8.A.

*Select Comparisons*

Spiral Ear SE 3-way Reference (est. $790)

Like the 3MAX, the Spiral Ear 3-way uses a three balanced armatures in a full-shell silicone mold. However, despite its single bass driver and 3-way crossover, the Spiral Ear is significantly bassier than the Sensaphonics, offering a more full-bodied low end with quite a bit more impact. It boasts more subbass rumble and can summon up a lot more bass power when the track calls for it, appearing more dynamic as a result.

The more prominent midrange of the 3MAX gives it a forward vocal presentation and makes its mids appear clearer compared to the thicker and warmer-sounding 3-way Reference. The 3MAX is still a bit on the warm side of neutral, but not as much so as the 3-way. Due to the powerful bass of the 3-way, the 3MAX is more balanced overall, but outside of the bass region the response of the Spiral Ear is actually flatter and smoother. In the upper midrange region, the 3MAX boasts extra emphasis, which lends it a brighter tone, while the SE 3-way is very smooth. Lastly, there is a big difference in efficiency between the two earphones, with the Spiral Ear being much less sensitive and requiring more power.

Unique Melody Miracle ($950)

Unique Melody’s 6-driver flagship is tuned for a balanced, slightly laid-back sound, providing a healthy contrast to the 3MAX. Bass quantity is greater on the 3MAX - the Miracle boasts less mid-bass while extension and subbass presence are similar to the Sensaphonics. The Miracle sounds thinner, too, and its clarity is expectedly a bit better. The upper midrange emphasis of the 3MAX makes it sound somewhat “honky” next to the flatter and more laid-back Miracle. Tonally, both are close to neutral but the Miracle is a brighter with its more sparkly and crisp treble presentation. It sounds a little more spacious as well.

JH Audio JH13 Pro Freqphase ($1099)

The JH13 has recently become my benchmark for what a custom monitor should be – balanced, accurate, endlessly resolving, and yet dynamic and fun to listen to. The pro-oriented 3MAX doesn’t pursue the same sound signature, but it’s still interesting to compare the two. Like the UM Miracle, the JH13 is brighter in tone and clearer than the 3MAX. It’s more detailed, too, revealing fine musical nuances more readily and sounding more refined overall. The JH13 boasts similarly ample bass impact on tracks that call for it but also has greater ability to scale back, providing tighter, quicker, less intrusive bass when necessary. It also has more treble energy, sounds more crisp, and is more spacious as well, with a soundstage that boasts better width and depth in comparison to the 3MAX.

Value *(7.5/10) *– The Sensaphonics 3MAX may seem expensive for a triple-driver in-ear monitor, but it is a good earphone, though perhaps more so for musicians than casual listeners. One of the few custom manufacturers committed to using silicone shells, Sensaphonics maintains that the material offers advantages in fit, comfort, and noise isolation compared to acrylic. They certainly aren’t wrong - the 3MAX is extremely comfortable and its isolation is second only to the other silicone custom I have – the Spiral Ear 3-way Reference. Its sound signature also works with Sensaphonics’ stated goal of encouraging lower-volume listening – always a respectable focus. It may be limited in customization options compared to most of its acrylic counterparts, but if comfort and isolation are a priority alongside a near-neutral sound, the 3MAX is the custom earphone to get.

*Pros: Great isolation & comfort
Cons: Inserting silicone shells takes some getting used to; limited customization options*


*(1A11) JH Audio JH13 Pro Freqphase*


Added Oct 2013

Details: One of the flagship models from Florida-based CIEM experts JH Audio
Current Price: *$1099* from jhaudio.com; smartphone cable with mic and 1-button remote available for $54.95
Specs: Driver: _6 BA / 3-way crossover _| Imp: _28Ω_ | Sens: _116 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug / other lengths available_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Cleaning tool, Comply Soft Wraps, Otterbox 1000 hard-shell carrying case, and drawstring carrying pouch
Build Quality *(5/5)* – The JH13 boasts fantastic fit and finish all around, with crystal-clear shells and faceplates. The cables use the common 2-pin connector. Numerous customization options are available for the earphones via the JH Audio website
Isolation *(4.5/5)* - The isolation provided by the custom shells is excellent - slightly below that of silicone-shelled customs but on-par with my UM and Hidition units
Microphonics *(5/5)* – No cable noise to speak of
Comfort *(5/5)* – The nozzles of my JH13 were cut a bit longer than average, similar to the UM Miracle. As with all acrylic customs, the shells are hard but very comfortable when fitted correctly. If the earphones are uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit is probably a good idea. JH Audio does refits at no cost within the first 30 days and for $50 thereafter

Sound *(10/10)* – A staple of the audiophile scene since its release in 2009, the JH Audio JH13 Pro underwent an update dubbed “Freqphase” last year. Both the JH13 and the bassier JH16 are currently shipping with the Freqphase tweak, which is meant to ensure phase coherency between the drivers by delivering all frequencies to the ear at once. Regardless of the technical details, the JH13 Pro sounds absolutely fantastic to me. It is tight, balanced, and impossibly clear. The bass is quick and extended, with a few decibels of boost and the ability to produce a good amount of punch when necessary. The JH13 can sound lean and quick one moment, and crank out beats with some serious authority the next. Its tone is, on the whole, a bit warmer than that of the Etymotic Research ER4S, but still close to neutral.

Great dynamics and transparency carry over to all aspects of its sound – in addition to good bass control, the JH13 boasts unbelievable clarity and resolution. The mids are in balance with the bass and expose every nuance of the recording with great definition. The sound is, on the whole, a little fuller and more natural compared to the Etymotic ER4S without sacrificing any clarity whatsoever. Comparing the JH13 to the quad-armature Ultimate Ears UE900, for example, makes the UE set sound muffled, thanks in part to its recessed upper midrange and slightly boomier bass.

The treble of the JH13 is nicely prominent but not at all harsh or sibilant. Treble energy is spot-on, appearing about even with the Etymotic ER4S while doing a similarly good job of minimizing harshness and sibilance. Westone’s flagship custom monitor, the ES5, sounds a little dark in comparison to the JH13 and appears a touch more congested. The JH13, on the other hand, sounds airy and has superb instrument separation and stereo imaging. Is presentation has much better depth than that of the Ety ER4S and an airier, more open feel than that of the UE900. The sum sound is crisp and accurate without missing out on the enjoyment factor, especially for those who don’t need tons of bass boost to tap their toes.

*Select comparisons*

VSonic GR07 ($179)

VSonic’s dynamic-driver flagship is an order of magnitude less expensive than the JH13 but, as one of the more capable earphones in its price range, makes for an interesting comparison. The most obvious difference between the two lies in the bass – the GR07 has a softer bass presentation that lacks the speed, tightness, and texture of the JH13’s low end. Overall bass quantity is similar between the two earphones but because it lacks the bass control, as well as the more forward midrange, of the JH13, the GR07 sounds boomier in comparison and its low end appears heavier and more intrusive.

The midrange of the GR07 is not as prominent as that of the JH13 and lacks some clarity in comparison. The treble of the VSonics tends to be hotter and vocals generally appear more sibilant. The JH13 sounds significantly smoother, but not for lack of energy. Rather, it follows a treble profile more like that of the Etymotic ER4S, avoiding the peaks that can make the GR07 offensive while maintaining similar overall treble presence. The JH13 also has a more three-dimensional presentation with better depth compared to the VSonic set.

HiFiMan RE-600 ($399)

One of the few accuracy-oriented dynamic-driver earphones in its price range, the RE-600, much like its lower-priced RE-400 sibling, is an impressive performer when it comes to delivering accurate, yet smooth sound. The biggest difference between the RE-600 and JH13 is the treble – the HiFiMan set sounds dull and lacks treble presence in comparison. Its tone is a little warmer overall and there is a touch more bass bleed and less clarity than with the armature-based JH13. The JH13, due in large part to its tighter bass and superior treble presence, appears a little more detailed and textured, and boasts a more spacious and airy presentation with better imaging.

Unique Melody Miracle ($950)

Unique Melody’s flagship is one of my favorite custom-fit earphones and the standard against which I’ve compared all other monitors for the past several years. Its 3-way, 6-driver configuration and balanced, spacious sound make it a natural competitor for the JH13, but on closer inspection the two earphones are as different as they are similar. The bass of the Miracle is rather level whereas the JH13 has its low end boosted by a few decibels. This is especially noticeable in the mid-bass region and gives the JH13 greater overall bass impact. It also makes the Miracle seem more focused on deep bass in comparison as there’s no mid-bass boost to get in the way. Nonetheless, the punchier JH13 still sounds a touch more resolving than the Miracle.

The JH13 boasts more midrange presence and clarity while the UM set has more recessed mids that end up sounding a bit veiled in comparison. At the top, the Miracle is a little smoother, but otherwise similar in both treble energy and top-end extension. The presentation of the JH13 is, on the whole, more forward but both earphones provide a great sense of space and have excellent imaging.

Sensaphonics 3MAX ($1050)

Sensaphonics’ flagship earphone is a pro-oriented monitor with good bass, a mild midrange focus and smooth, inoffensive treble. The JH13 boasts similarly ample bass impact on tracks that call for it but also has greater ability to scale back, providing tighter, quicker, less intrusive bass when necessary. It is brighter, clearer, and more detailed than the 3MAX, revealing fine musical nuances more readily and sounding more refined overall. The JH13 also has better treble energy and sounds more crisp. It is more spacious as well, with a soundstage that boasts better width and depth in comparison to the 3MAX.

Hidition NT 6 ($1200)

The 4-way, 6-driver NT 6 is less bassy than its pricier NT6-Pro sibling, just as the JH13 Pro is less bottom-heavy than the pricier JH16. The similarities between them run deeper, however. For me, both of these monitors are the cream of the crop – impossibly clear and resolving, with very good imaging and lifelike presentations. The differences between them lie largely in sound signature, with the JH13 being a pinch on the warm side of neutral and the NT 6 being slightly bright.

While the low end of the NT 6 is extended, punchy, and dynamic, it doesn’t crank out bass with quite the same authority and impact as the JH13. Personally, I don’t find the low end of the JH13 excessive, but the bass of the Hidition is flatter in profile and a little tighter as a result. The more mid-bassy JH13 carries a slightly warmer tone, though the mids on both earphones are completely free of veiling and fantastically clear. The NT 6 is brighter, with more emphasis on high frequencies, while the JH13 is a little flatter up top. On the soundstage front, the JH13 sounds a little more 3-dimensional and enveloping while the NT 6 has slightly less depth to it. Interestingly, the JH13 Pro is also significantly more sensitive than the NT 6.

FitEar To Go! 334 ($1345)

One of priciest and most exclusive universal-fit earphones in the world, the Japan-made TG334 utilizes a quad-armature configuration to deliver a warm and powerful sound with smooth, relaxed treble. It sounds quite different from the accuracy-oriented JH13 – significantly bassier and darker in tone. The JH13, with its tighter, less powerful low end, makes the TG334 sound quite muddy in comparison. The mids of the TG334 also appear somewhat muffled next to the JH13, with the JH Audio set offering up better treble presence and superior overall balance as well. On the presentation front the two are more similar, but the TG334 is slightly less coherent-sounding than the JH13.

Value *(9.5/10) *– The IEM market has changed a lot in the past several years, becoming saturated at an increasing rate. Still, of all of the earphones I’ve tried recently, the JH Audio JH13 Pro has been the biggest eye-opener, delivering clarity and resolution unlike anything else I’ve heard. It effortlessly produces extremely nuanced and refined sound across the entire frequency range, complete with fantastic instrument separation and imaging.

I do believe that the best Hi-Fi component is one that does its job so well, you don’t even know it’s there, and after a year spent with the JH13 Pro I still marvel most at its ability to simply fade away, leaving only the music. In fact, finding anything that mildly displeases me about this earphone is a struggle, but one I really don’t mind.

*Pros: Class-leading sound quality; great fit & finish 
Cons: N/A*


*(1A12) 1964EARS V6-Stage*


Reviewed November 2013
   Details: 6-driver flagship custom in-ear from Portland, OR-based 1964EARS
Starting Price: *$699* from 1964ears.com
Specs: Driver: _6-BA / 3-way crossover _| Imp: _22Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ L-plug / other lengths available_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(5/5)* – Shirt clip, ¼” adapter, cleaning tool, and custom crushproof Pelican storage case
Build Quality *(5/5)* – Aside from its triple-bore configuration, the V6-Stage is similar in construction to my 1964-V3. Molding quality is excellent with no bubbles, very clear faceplates, and good finish around the cable sockets and nozzles. It uses a cable with a standard Westone socket and short memory wire section. Options include recessed cable sockets, ambient vents, custom colors, custom artwork, and various exotic faceplates
Isolation *(4/5)* – Very good isolation from the fitted acrylic shells
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Nonexistent as with most of my custom monitors
Comfort *(5/5)* – As with all acrylic customs, the shells are hard but very comfortable. If the earphones are uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit is probably a good idea. 1964EARS does refits at no cost within the first 30 days

Sound* (9.7/10)* – The 1964EARS V6-Stage is the company’s latest flagship, designed for “stage, studio and everyday music listening”. It utilizes a 3-way, 6-armature configuration – a setup similar to those of the Unique Melody Miracle and JH Audio JH13 Pro. The sound signature of the V6-Stage combines near-neutral bass, a rich and clear midrange, and crisp treble.

The bass of the V6-Stage is slightly above neutral in quantity – a touch less impactful than with the JH13 Pro but more so compared to other reference earphones such as the Custom Art Music One, HiFiMan RE-600, and Etymotic Research ER-4S. Bass depth is very good and the low end is tight and controlled. In a way, the V6-Stage is the best of both worlds – it makes bassier earphones such as the FitEar TG334 sound boomy in comparison without giving a bass quality advantage to flatter sets from HiFiMan, Etymotic Research, and the like.

The midrange of the V6-Stage has a neutral tone with a smooth and rich character that prevents it from sounding “analytical”. Note thickness is good and the mids appear very natural overall. The V6-Stage is not as lean as the Etymotic ER-4S and its upper midrange is a little less prominent. Clarity is excellent –aided by its prominent treble, the 1964EARS unit has an advantage here over sets such as the FitEar TG334 and Heir Audio 8.A, and makes the more treble-shy RE-600 sound downright dull in comparison.

However, the treble is prominent enough to where recording quality becomes important. The earphone is significantly brighter than sets such as the Custom Art Music One and Heir 8.A, and its treble character has a tendency accentuate sibilance. This is somewhat source-dependent and more prone to occurring at higher volumes, but the fact remains that the V6-Stage is less forgiving than even the Etymotic ER-4S. Other than that, the treble is excellent – crisp and well-extended, carrying enough energy to balance out the overall sound, bass emphasis and all.

The impressive end-to-end extension of the V6-Stage also reflects in its presentation, which is broad and spacious. The soundstage is larger compared to most universals as well as many customs, such as the Music One. It is a touch more constrained than that of the JH13 Pro but on the whole the presentation of the V6-Stage is as well-rounded as anything I’ve heard in its price bracket.

*Select Comparisons*

EarSonics SM64 ($399)

The SM64 is a triple-armature universal-fit earphone that impresses, among other things, with its bass response. Compared to the V6-Stage, its bass reaches deeper and hits harder but still maintains excellent control. In the midrange, the 1964EARS perform better – while the SM64 is biased towards the lower midrange, the V6-Stage is quite level throughout, offering flatter upper mids and a more balanced and neutral sound. It sounds clearer, less congested, and more refined than the SM64 except for a bit of peakiness in the treble, which makes the V6-Stage sound a little hotter and more “tizzy” next to the darker EarSonics.

Alclair Reference ($399)

Alclair’s Reference monitor pursues a sound signature very similar to that of the V6-Stage, falling a bit short of the V6 in overall performance. Bass quantity is similar between the earphones but the Reference is slightly mid-recessed and sounds more “dry” whereas the V6-Stage has a fuller, smoother sound with a more prominent midrange. Treble performance is also similar between the two – both units have a tendency to exaggerate sibilance and sound a little “hot” on certain tracks, with the V6-Stage performing a bit better in this regard. In terms of presentation, too, the V6-Stage comes across as more versatile and convincing, with a little more imaging prowess and better balance of width and depth.

1964EARS 1964-V3 ($425)

While the similarly-priced Alclair Reference bears a strong resemblance to the V6-Stage, 1964EARS’ own triple-driver sounds quite different. The 1964-V3 is bassier and more “boomy” than the V6-Stage, with the powerful mid-bass response providing much greater impact. This results in a warmer and at times more bloated sound. The V6-Stage, with its tighter, less powerful bass, also has better clarity, especially in the midrange, and sounds more refined and detailed. It is more balanced and neutral whereas the V3 is more colored. In terms of presentation, the boomier bass of the V3 makes it a touch more congested but both units provide a good sense of space.

Westone ES5 ($950)

Westone’s flagship custom is a warm and smooth affair that emphasizes it lows and mids. The ES5 has more bass than the 1964EARS V6-Stage, but the V6 is a little more textured and controlled. Its mids are leaner and clearer while the ES5 sounds fuller and more forward in the midrange. The treble of the Westones is smoother but the overall sound is darker and a bit more muffled. The 1964EARS, on the other hand, have treble that is brighter and peakier, and tend to be more sibilant. I find the V6-Stage to sound more natural overall, though the peaks in the treble region sometimes cause it to sound a little “tizzy” in comparison. In terms of presentation, the ES5 tends to be more intimate, especially in the midrange, whereas the V6-Stage is wider and more laid-back, a-la the UM Miracle.

Unique Melody Miracle ($950)

The UM Miracle has always impressed me most with its ability to sound neutral and balanced, yet remain smooth and not at all analytical. Compared to the Miracle, the V6-Stage produces a little more bass, especially mid-bass, lending it a slightly fuller and warmer sound. The 1964EARS sound a bit more colored as a result of the bass emphasis whereas the Miracle is more neutral and balanced. The Miracle also remains flatter through the upper midrange, boasting more presence there a-la the Etymotic ER-4S. At the top, the V6-Stage is more sibilant despite having similar overall treble energy, while the Miracle is smoother and has a bit more air. The Miracle is slightly more open-sounding with a marginally more spacious soundstage.

Value *(9/10)* – The mid-level 1964EARS customs I’ve tried have offered solid value for money, and the new 1964EARS V6-Stage is doing the same for the flagship segment of the still-developing custom in-ear market. The earphones are very well-made and the sound hits the sweet spot, falling just warm of neutral with a bit of added bass, mids that are clear but not thin, and crisp, if slightly hot, treble. It is an extremely competent earphone that competes with pricier models such as the Westone ES5 and Heir Audio 8.A. Like the less expensive 1964-V3, the V6-Stage is an easy recommendation in its price range and, in contrast to the V3, should work for professional applications as well as consumer audio.

*Pros: Great molding quality; isolation and comfort of a custom in-ear; impressive overall performance
Cons: Can accentuate sibilance




(1A13) Noble 4S*


Reviewed November 2013

Details: 4-driver silicone-shelled CIEM from Noble Audio, a CA-based CIEM company run by _The Wizard_ and team, previously of Heir Audio fame
Starting Price: *$999* from nobleaudio.com
Specs: Driver: _4 BA / 3-way crossover_ | Imp: _>30Ω_ | Cable: _4′ 45-degree plug_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Cleaning tool, Noble Audio stickers and wristbands, and padded hard-shell storage case
Build Quality *(5/5)* – It’s safe to say that Heir Audio’s legendary aesthetic flair has carried over to Noble, because the 4S unit I have on hand here is simply stunning. To escape the artwork limitations of silicone shells, Noble has fitted their silicone customs with acrylic faceplates, which allow full customization. Attention to detail is excellent, down to the neat Noble logos printed on the sides of the housings. The internal setup of the quad-driver 4S is dual low, single mid, and single high with a dual bore configuration. The earphones use a conventional two-pin socket and come with a Westone ES-style cable, but orders placed with Noble’s US office will instead ship with an upgraded cable that has a longer memory wire section, a 45-degree plug, and is braided below the y-split akin to the Heir Magnus-1 cable. This new cable also works with smartphone cases a little better as a result of its plug being narrower
Isolation *(5/5)* – The isolation of the silicone shells is excellent, falling just behind my most-isolating custom, the Spiral Ear 3-way Reference
Microphonics *(5/5) *– Nonexistent
Comfort *(5/5*) – The silicone shells of the Noble earphones take slightly longer to insert and remove compared to more rigid and slippery acrylic shells but are extremely comfortable once fitted and maintain seal a bit better with changes to the ear canal shape, such as while chewing or talking. Being a custom monitor, the comfort is highly dependent on the quality of the initial impressions and final mold, and if the earphones remain uncomfortable after an initial break-in period a re-fit is probably a good idea. Noble performs refits at no charge within 30 days

Sound* (9.9/10)* – I freely admit to being a sucker for a pretty face(plate), one of my few character flaws. As expected, I was immediately enamored with the appearance of my Noble 4S, so it’s safe to say I would have been doubly disappointed had it turned out to sound–well–disappointing. Happily, the 4S sounds rather good, with a neutral and natural sound that is, on the whole, more balanced compared to my other high-end customs.

The bass of the Noble 4S works for me in both quality and quantity – it is not the most plentiful in the subbass region, giving up a bit of depth to sets such as the UM Miracle and Westone ES5, but it has a nice, healthy, balanced punch akin to the Miracle and HiFiMan RE-400. The Noble 4S is definitely not an enhanced-bass earphone but there’s a lot to like about the clean, natural low end. The 4S is less bassy than the VSonic GR07, for example, but its low end is tighter and cleaner.

The midrange of the Noble 4S is very flat and neutral in tone. It makes both the Miracle and GR07 sound a little mid-recessed and appears a touch clearer as a result. Next to the smooth and liquid-sounding Miracle, the midrange of the 4S is more transparent and has a “raw” quality to it. The midrange is also where the Noble differs most from entry-level and mid-tier customs – even neutral-sounding ones like the Alclair Reference and Lime Ears LE3 can’t match the clarity of the 4S. Note thickness and clarity always make for a precarious balancing act and the 4S performs as well as any other earphone I’ve heard on this front, making the Etymotic ER4S sound a touch thin without yielding to it in clarity.

Moving through the upper midrange, the 4S remains very smooth and pleasant. It has a little less upper midrange presence than, for example, the Ety ER4S but overall the sound is very close. In fact, out of all the universal monitors I used in my comparisons, the ER4S was closest to the Noble in tone and balance. The Noble 4S has very smooth treble, too – it definitely isn’t lacking in treble energy but also isn’t as revealing of harshness or as critical of recording quality as, for example, the UE Reference Monitor and JH Audio JH13. The GR07 sounds quite splashy in comparison while the Etymotic ER4S is more similar, but still a touch brighter than the Noble. The presentation of the 4S is open and airy. Soundstage size is good – about on-par with the Heir 8.A and Hidition NT 6 customs and more spacious and open compared to the less expensive Lime Ears LE3 – and overall imaging is just short of the JH Audio JH13.

*Select Comparisons* 

HiFiMan RE-400 ($99) 

The RE-400 is one of my favorite earphones in the sub-$200 range, pursuing a balanced, slightly mid-focused sound signature with very smooth treble. While the RE-400 is a touch on the warm side of neutral, the Noble 4S is balanced out by its brighter, more energetic treble. The bass of the two earphones is similar in impact but the Noble is tighter and resolves detail better in the bass region. The midrange, where the RE-400’s focus lies, sounds veiled with the HiFiMan set compared to the 4S.

The treble of the RE-400, too, is dull and lacks crispness in comparison, causing it to sound muffled next to the crystal-clear Noble. The brighter Noble is nonetheless very smooth-sounding when it comes to treble and has a wider presentation as well, making the RE-400 sound a bit small and in-the-head. There is, of course, a tenfold price difference between these two earphones and much less than a tenfold difference in performance, but, great as the RE-400 is, it can’t keep up here.

VSonic VC1000 ($125) 

Another relatively inexpensive universal monitor, the VC1000 uses dual balanced armature drivers and actually makes for a better matchup against the Noble than the RE-400. For the most part, the VC1000 can compete with the Noble in clarity but has a leaner sound and its bass lacks the tactile impact of the Noble. The Noble sounds more natural when it comes to bass impact and body. The Noble also has a thicker note presentation and fuller sound. While the earphones are similarly balanced overall, the Noble is smoother and more natural. The VC1000 sounds splashy in comparison and has a narrower, more in-the-head presentation. Overall, the signatures of these two earphones are a pretty good match and the Noble can be considered a VC1000 upgrade quite easily.

1964EARS V6-Stage ($699)

The V6-Stage is one of 1964EARS’ flagship earphones and provides a nicely balanced sound. The Noble 4S pursues a different type of reference signature. For one, it has less bass – the bass extension is similar between the two earphones but the V6-Stage has more impact and its sound signature is on the whole warmer and more colored than that of the Noble. The Noble, on the other hand is flatter and more neutral, and is much more forgiving of sibilance than the V6-Stage. The 4S also has a broader soundstage and provides a slightly airier, more spacious presentation than the 1964EARS set.

Ultimate Ears Reference Monitor (UERM) Universal Demo ($999)

The quad-driver, silicone-shelled Noble is different from my other “reference” custom IEMs mostly in that its sound is more mid-centric. Sets like the JH13, UERM, V6-Stage, and even the Miracle tend to have more bass and stronger, more energetic treble than the Noble. The 4S, on the other hand, reminds me of HiFiMan earphones in the way it presents a neutral signature in a more mid-centric way without masking detail. It sounds very flat, with less bass compared to the UERM and a more neutral tone. The Noble is an amazingly smooth earphone that makes the UERM seem a little peaky in the treble region. Tonally, the 4S makes the UERM sound a little colored – no small feat by any means. In comparison to the more level Noble, the UE Reference Monitor has a bassier sound and added treble energy.

JH Audio JH13 Pro ($1099)

JH Audio’s 6-driver model is rather neutral and balanced save for a small bass bump. The 4S differs from it in sound signature more so than performance. On the whole, the 4S sounds more neutral to me. The JH13 is a little warmer and has more bass impact and depth. It is also a bit more full-sounding as a result, which makes its outstanding clarity all the more impressive. The 4S sounds more mid-centric – unlike the JH13 and most of my other custom IEMs, the 4S is not even a little v-shaped in signature. Moving on up, the JH13 has more treble sparkle while the 4S is smoother and more forgiving. Personally, I don’t find either the bass or treble of the JH13 excessive, but the neutrality of the 4S appeals to me a great deal. Lastly, due in part to its deeper and more powerful bass, the JH13 sounds a touch more dynamic overall and provides a more layered presentation but the Noble is quite close here as well.

Hidition NT 6 ($1200)

While the JH13 is a neutral-sounding monitor with a bit of added bass, the Hidition NT 6 leans the opposite way – towards a brighter sound with a cooler tonal character. The triple bass drivers of the NT 6 grant it better bass extension with more emphasis on subbass compared to the Noble 4S but mid-bass impact is similar – neither earphone suffers from elevated mid-bass. The 4S does have a bit more presence in the lower midrange, giving it a fuller, slightly warmer sound, very similar to the “neutral” tone of the HiFiMan RE-400. Overall, the 4S sounds a little mid-focused but also very natural and neutral. The NT 6, in comparison, has less prominent mids and can at times appear a touch clearer thanks to its brighter tone. Lastly, the treble of the 4S is more forgiving but remains just as clean and resolving as that of the NT 6.

Heir Audio 8.A ($1299)

Heir Audio’s 8-driver flagship is a warm and smooth affair, with endlessly extended bass and very non-fatiguing treble. Compared to the Noble 4S, the 8.A is significantly warmer and more bottom-heavy. It has quite a bit more bass, especially deep bass, providing a more visceral and tactile experience. However, even next to the bassy Heir, the 4S doesn’t sound anemic or thin and the bottom end. The 4S is more neutral in the midrange and brighter at the top. The treble of the darker-sounding 8.A is even smoother and more forgiving than that of the Noble, which is great news for those whose greatest audio-related fear is the potential for listening fatigue. Overall, aside from the huge difference in bass quantity, there are quite a lot of commonalities between these two earphones but the more neutral and accurate Noble appeals to me quite a bit more.

Value *(9/10)* – The Noble 4S is a neutral-sounding monitor that is, on the whole, more balanced than the other “reference” customs I have here. Its ultra-smooth, slightly mid-focused sound invokes impressions of a cross between Etymotic Research and HiFiMan universals and makes it a direct upgrade to certain other custom-fit sets, such as the Clear Tune Monitors CT-200 and Lime Ears LE3.

The aesthetics of the Noble 4S are reminiscent of Heir Audio – that is to say, fantastic – with the Wizard continuing to experiment with new looks and materials, and the comfort and isolation of the silicone shells are second to none. All in all, the 4S is one of the very few earphones I can’t find much to complain about with, and that alone makes it worth recommending.

*Pros: Very clear, neutral, and natural sound; excellent fit, finish, and design; superb comfort and noise isolation of silicone
Cons: N/A


(1A14) Clear Tune Monitors WLS-5*


Reviewed November 2013

Details: 5-driver flagship from Florida-based Clear Tune Monitors
Starting Price: *$800* from cleartunemonitors.com
Specs: Driver: _5 BA / 3-way crossover_ | Imp: _20Ω_ | Sens: _124 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Cleaning tool and small hard shell pelican case
Build Quality *(5/5) *– The WLS-5 is part of Clear Tune Monitors’ Wood Legit Series, so called for the use of real wood faceplates. The faceplate on my unit is definitely substantial – a thick wooden slab with an engraved CTM logo. The unit looks great overall, with a metallic brown swirl in the acrylic housings to match the faceplates. The WLS-5 utilizes a triple-bore setup and boasts detachable cables in the standard 2-pin configuration. The cable is twisted and on the whole quite typical except for the longer memory wire section, which I rather like
Isolation *(4.5/5)* – My WLS-5 was made with long nozzles so the isolation is excellent – slightly below that of silicone-shelled customs but on-par with my UM and JH Audio units
Microphonics *(5/5)* – Nonexistent
Comfort *(5/5)* – As with all acrylic customs, the shells are hard but very comfortable when fitted correctly. If the earphones are uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit is probably a good idea.

Sound *(9.5/10)* – Clear Tune Monitors describes the sound tuning of the Wood Legit Series earphones as “extremely warm and punchy”. While the flagship WLS-5 is not overly warm to my ears, it certainly does have good punch. The bass is not the deepest, but emphasis picks up quickly and it can hit quite hard – certainly much harder than Clear Tune Monitors’ dual-driver CT-200 model. Bass impact is greater than with the average custom monitor and about on-par with my benchmark, the JH Audio JH13 Pro, in being a few dB north of neutral.

Emphasis drops off a bit for the midrange, which is less forward than with sets like the JH13 and Ultimate Ears In-Ear Reference Monitor (UERM). Note presentation is a little thinner here as well, which affords the WLS-5 great clarity but also makes the mids sound a touch dry and recessed, not unlike what happens with JVC’s carbon nanotube earphones, such as the FXD80.

The WLS-5 gains presence in the upper midrange, strongly reminding me of the similarly pro-oriented Sensaphonics 3MAX. The lower treble has good presence as well, though top-end extension ultimately doesn’t quite keep up with the JH Audio JH13, resulting in a slightly darker overall tone and a presentation with less “air”. The relative emphasis on the upper mids and treble gives the WLS-5 a slightly “shouty” character, which again reminds me of the 3MAX as well as the Japan-exclusive j-Phonic K2 SP monitors. Despite this, the top end of the WLS-5 is surprisingly forgiving compared, for example, to the Alclair Reference and 1964EARS V6-Stage customs, as well as universals such as the VSonic GR07. The presentation, likewise, is competent – a little narrower than average, but well-positioned and accurate.

Worth noting also is the high sensitivity of the WLS-5 – it is highly recommended to use the earphone with a noise-free source as background hiss can get quite noticeable with a subpar audio player.

*Select Comparisons*

Clear Tune Monitors CT-200 ($350)

One of Clear Tune Monitors’ lower-end models, the dual-driver CT-200 provides a sound radically different from that of the Wood Legit Series earphones – smooth, mid-centric, and light on subbass. The WLS-5 is significantly more extended at the bottom end, providing deeper bass with more punch, and makes the sub-bass roll-off of the CT-200 very obvious.
Moving up, the WLS-5 is clearer and more resolving than the CT-200, especially in the midrange. The lower-end model, in comparison, lacks crispness and sounds a little smeared and lacking in detail. The WLS-5 has more upper midrange emphasis and more treble energy as well. The CT-200 has a more laid-back, out-of-the-head presentation while the WLS-5 is more forward and aggressive, due in part to the upper midrange emphasis. Despite this, the WLS-5 has slightly better overall imaging thanks to its crisp and clean note presentation.

Alclair Reference ($399)

The triple-driver Alclair Reference follows a balanced, slightly v-shaped sound signature. Compared to the WLS-5, the Reference has slightly deeper bass but lacks a bit of bass control and tightness. In the midrange, the WLS-5 is a little clearer and more resolving. Despite its upper midrange boost, it still sounds smoother and more refined overall compared to the Reference, especially in the treble region. The Alclair unit, on the other hand, sounds peaky and is more prone to sibilance. The presentation of the Reference is a bit wider overall, however, and unlike the CT-200 it keeps up with the WLS-5 in imaging, too.

EarSonics SM64 ($399)

The SM64 is a universal-fit earphone with quite a lot of bass for a balanced armature setup. Next to the WLS-5, the bass of the SM64 goes deeper and provides more impact and rumble. Unfortunately this also makes it sound a little muddy in comparison, especially in the midrange. The WLS-5 is clearer and brighter overall, with a lot more emphasis in the upper midrange and lower treble. It does tend to be a little harsher than the SM64, but it’s not bad at all considering how much more the upper mid and treble energy it has.

1964EARS V6-Stage ($699)

1964EARS’ latest flagship is a neutral-sounding earphone in the same price class as the WLS-5. The V6-Stage is a little tighter and more refined in the bass region but has more presence in the lower mids, which gives it a slightly warmer and richer sound. The bass of the WLS-5 is a bit deeper and more impactful but the earphone has dryer, more recessed mids compared to the V6-Stage. However, it gains emphasis towards the upper midrange, which often makes it sound clearer. Realistically, though, neither earphone lacks clarity or has a real advantage over the other here.

The 1964EARS set is more sibilant, especially on tracks already prone to sibilance, but also has a bit more treble “sparkle” and extension. The WLS-5 is less extended, but more forgiving of sibilance and less critical of recording quality. Overall, the V6-Stage does sound a little more natural on some tracks, but each of these earphones has a tendency to make the other sound flawed.

Westone ES5 ($950)

Westone’s flagship custom is a 5-driver, just like the WLS-5, but boasts a warmer, more bass-biased signature. It has deeper, more powerful bass than the Clear Tune Monitors and a richer, fuller, more prominent midrange. The WLS-5, on the other hand, boasts a thinner note presentation and is a touch clearer. Its upper midrange and treble are more prominent, lending it a brighter sound. The ES5 offers up a darker tone but is very, very smooth and has a more spacious soundstage. Neither earphone has great treble reach. Overall, the ES5 is a little more convincing from a tonal standpoint, but the WLS-5 is not far behind and has an advantage in clarity.

Unique Melody Miracle ($950)

The 6-driver Miracle is a top-tier earphone built around a 3-way, 6-driver configuration. Tonally, it is more neutral than the WLS-5 and has a more coherent sound. It lacks the bass presence of the WLS-5, as well as the emphasized mid-treble region, exhibiting great smoothness through the upper midrange and treble. The upper midrange lift of the WLS-5 throws off its tonality in comparison to the Miracle and makes it sound a bit “shouty”. The top end of the Miracle is also more extended and it sounds more spacious overall.

Value *(7.5/10)* – The Clear Tune Monitors WLS-5 is a uniquely-voiced custom monitor oriented towards the pro audio market and doesn’t share many similarities with the lower-end CT-200 model. Instead, it is a less expensive, acrylic-shelled alternative to the Sensaphonics 3MAX. Like the 3MAX, its sound is characterized by a prominent upper midrange, though the WLS-5 also boasts excellent bass presence. It offers deep canals – what I normally see referred to as “musician’s fit” – and isolates rather well as a result. Add the excellent fit and finish with the engraved wood face plates and the WLS-5 is a musician’s truly monitor unlike anything else out there.

*Pros: Great clarity and excellent bass; excellent fit & finish
Cons: Musician-oriented tuning with a distinct sound profile




(1A15) Gorilla Ears GX-4b*



Details: Quad-driver custom in-ear from North Carolina-based Gorilla Ears
Starting price: $799 (manufacturer’s page)
Specs: Driver: _4 BA / 3-way crossover _| Imp: _20Ω_ | Sens: _120 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

Accessories *(4/5)* – Cleaning cloth, cleaning tool, drawstring carrying pouch, and plastic padded storage case
Build Quality *(5/5)* – Gorilla Ears earphones differ from the other acrylic custom in-ear monitors (CIEMs) I’ve encountered in that the faceplates are pre-manufactured and feature molded sockets for the 2-pin cables on the front. Normally, faceplates are made together with the rest of the in-ear monitor and have the cable connectors on the side. This allows custom colors and artwork, but necessitates a thicker faceplate and creates potential for variation in the fit and finish of the connectors. The pre-made faceplates of the Gorilla Ears have a lower profile and more secure fit for the cables, but also reduce all faceplate customization down to just four basic color options and no graphics. The cable connectors on my unit do feel tighter than with most of my other CIEMs and the construction quality is excellent overall. The included cable is twisted above the y-split and braided below. It is gray in color, which seems to be preventing the oxidation typical of clear cables
Isolation *(4.5/5)* – Isolation is excellent on my GX-4b unit, which was made with longer than average nozzles. It is slightly below that of silicone-shelled customs but on-par with other acrylic units
Microphonics *(5/5) *– Nonexistent
Comfort *(5/5)* – As with all acrylic custom-fit in-ear monitors, the shells of the Gorilla Ears are hard but very comfortable. Good impressions/ear molds are very important for the final fit. If the earphones are uncomfortable after an initial break-in/adjustment period, I recommend getting them refitted. Gorilla Ears carry a 30-day refit warranty

Sound* (9.4/10)* – The GX-4b utilizes four BA drivers in a 3-way, triple-bore configuration with dual armatures handling the bass. The first thing I noticed is the extreme efficiency of this earphone – it may just be the most sensitive IEM I’ve ever come across. The efficiency has its benefits – for instance, the GX-4b has no trouble reaching ear-splitting volumes even with limited-output sources – and also some downsides – namely, audible hiss with outputs that have even a moderately high noise floor and difficulty dialing in low volumes with sources not designed for sensitive IEMs.

The sound of the Gorilla Ears is warm, smooth, and intimate, with moderately enhanced bass and slightly relaxed treble. It definitely sounds like a stage IEM, with tuning in the vein of high-end universal stage monitors such as the Westone UM3X and EarSonics SM3. Among higher-end CIEMs, the GX-4b is closest perhaps to the Heir Audio 8.A (albeit with a slightly warmer, less balanced sound signature and more forward/intimate presentation) and Westone ES50 (with the GX-4b  having more bass and a smoother, thicker, more forgiving sound that lags the Westones a bit in resolution).

The low end is the star of the show here, with good extension, rumble, and punch. Bass presence is excellent – the popular HiFiMan RE-400, for instance, sounds decidedly mid-centric and bass-light in comparison to the Gorilla Ears. The GX-4b has better bass depth and impact, providing a more solid footing for its sound, but still maintains similarly good bass quality. On the other hand it is not as bassy and warm as the similarly-priced Sony MDR-Z5 while sounding tighter, less muddy, and less intrusive and overbearing at the low end.

The midrange of the GX-4b is warm and forward. The combination of bass enhancement and lack of midrange recession provides a rich, full-bodied sound – thicker, for instance, than that of the RE-400. Also, in contrast to many (perhaps most) of the other custom in-ears I’ve tried, treble is not accented at all, maintaining a very smooth and forgiving sound – just a hair less so than the slightly laid-back highs of the RE-400 and Shure SE535. There is a tiny bit of grain, but less than with the InEar StageDiver SD-2, which is impressive. At the same time, the treble is not lacking severely in presence – the Gorilla Ears are not dark the way that the basshead Sony MDR-Z5 is. All in all, it’s a well-balanced top end that can range from “slightly dull” to “slightly grainy” from track to track.

The presentation of the GX-4b is forward, but not compressed or congested. It is similar to the RE-400, but less narrow and in-the-head, with more depth to the soundstage and a more open overall sound. This again reminds me of high-end universal-fit stage monitors such as the Westone UM3X (or UM PRO 30) and EarSonics SM3.

*Select Comparisons*

InEar StageDiver 2 ($449)

The StageDiver SD-2 and GX-4b both have their origins in pro audio and share many similarities in their tuning and overall performance. For comfort and noise isolation I definitely preferred the custom fit of the GX-4b, which justifies a large chunk of the price difference between the two. The differences in performance are less clear-cut. however. Both earphones are on the warm side of neutral, with punchy bass and smooth treble. The GX-4b is much more sensitive, more forward, and a little warmer. The common trade-off between bass and clarity is present to a small extent – the Gorilla Ears are slightly bassier while the SD-2 is a bit clearer and tighter at the low end. However, the GX-4b is smoother up top than the SD-2, which tends to be a hair more grainy.

1964EARS 1964-V3 ($499)

The GX-4b and 1964-V3 make for a good match-up in that both are extremely efficient, enhanced-bass acrylic CIEMs. The biggest difference between them is in the extra clarity and brightness of the 1964EARS unit and the buttery smoothness of the Gorilla Ears. In general, the GX-4b is warmer, smoother, and significantly more forgiving than the 1964-V3. Its presentation is more forward and intimate, however, giving it more of a “stage monitor” sound a-la Westone UM PRO 30 or EarSonics SM3.

Bass quantity is very similar between the 1964s and Gorilla Ears but the V3 has noticeably more treble presence and energy for a more v-shaped overall sound. It is brighter, but also harsher and more sibilance-prone than the GX-4b. I like the extra clarity and spaciousness of the 1964EARS unit, but when it came to treble I ended up wishing the V3 (and the higher-end V6-Stage, for that matter) were as smooth as the GX-4b.

EarSonics Velvet ($699)

EarSonics’ luxury universal-fit monitor costs about the same as a GX-4b and performs on a similar level while missing out on the custom-fit form factor of the Gorilla Ears. Surprisingly, even in the “low bass” setting, the Velvet is bassier and even smoother than the GX-4b.

The midrange of the GX-4b is slightly drier and the top end is a bit more revealing. The Velvet, on the other hand, is even smoother and does an unbelievably good job of killing sibilance and harshness. The Velvet at times sounds clearer but on some tracks its heavier bass gets in the way a bit more. The presentation of the Velvet is less forward while the GX-4b is significantly more intimate, and much more sensitive as well.

Lime Ears LE3B ($700)

Lime Ears’ triple-driver enhanced-bass model was the closest match I could find for the Gorilla Ears from a sound signature standpoint among all of my customs. The two are pretty similar except for the GX-4b being warmer and more intimate and the Lime Ears tending to be more neutral and laid-back. The presentation of the Lime Ears, combined with its fluid note presentation, makes it even smoother while the strong, forward midrange of the GX-4b sounds a touch more shouty, but also gives it a slight clarity advantage over the Lime Ears. 

Value *(7.5/10)* – The Gorilla Ears GX-4b is a full-shell acrylic CIEM with a warm and smooth sound signature that makes it a great do-no-wrong in-ear monitor for stage use. There’s plenty of bass, pretty good clarity and resolution, and extremely high efficiency, which is often expected of stage IEMs. Of course you also get all the usual upsides of a custom-fit monitor – comfort, noise isolation, low cable noise, and very good construction. On that note, though the unique pre-made faceplates of Gorilla Ears IEMs limit customization, I quite like the low-profile fit and tight cable sockets that result.

It’s tough to talk about value with a $700 in-ear monitor, but the GX-4b is competitive in sound and more than competitive as an overall package, and with the additional advantage (for US customers, at least) of being based out of North Carolina, it has no trouble earning a recommendation.

*Pros: Smooth, warm, bass-heavy sound; all the typical perks of a full-shell custom monitor plus a lower profile in the ear; cable resists oxidation well
Cons: Not for those seeking a flat freq. response, extreme clarity, or a huge soundstage; faceplate customization very limited compared to other acrylic CIEMs *







*(1A16) EarSonics Velvet*


Added September 2015

Brief: Variable-tuning universal-fit earphone from French IEM experts EarSonics
MSRP: €699 (approx. $800)
Current Price: *$699* from Amazon.com
Specs: Driver: _Triple Balanced Armature w/ 3-way Crossover _| Imp: _31.5 Ω_ _– 41.5 Ω (depending on sound setting) _| Sens: _116 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9′ L-plug_
Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock double-flanges; Westone STAR tips, MEElec M6 double-flanges_
Wear Style: O_ver-the-ear _

Accessories *(4.5/5)* – Small (1 pair) and regular (4 pairs) double-flange silicone tips, large single-flange silicone tips, cleaning tool, antibacterial wipes (2), 6.3mm adapter, flathead screwdriver for adjusting the sound tuning, and zippered protective carrying case
Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The lightweight shells of the Velvet are made of plastic and come in either black or clear. The twisted cables are detachable and feature a memory wire section and standard 2-pin connectors. The construction is solid and the overall design is very understated – all that really stands out are the tuning screws, which are accessible from the faceplates (more on these in the sound section). Two minor complaints – first, the plastic of the tuning screws is rather soft, and can be scratched easily with the included screwdriver. Second, there are no external filters on the nozzles of the earphones, so the included cleaning tool should be used periodically to remove any earwax buildup
Isolation *(4/5)* – Isolation is quite good with the included double-flange tips – about on-par with the SM64 model
Microphonics *(5/5) *– Basically nonexistent, as with all similar designs
Comfort *(4/5)* – The Velvet has a relatively small footprint in the ear, reminding me of the Noble universals. The angular design of the housings harkens back to the EarSonics SM2/SM3 more so than the smoother shape of the SM64 and can introduce some pressure points in small ears but on the whole the earphones are lightweight and very comfortable

Sound* (9.4/10)* – The EarSonics Velvet is a 3-way, triple balanced armature earphone featuring variable sound tunings selectable via a built-in tuning screw on each earpiece. In my experience the tunings mainly affect the bass of the earphones, with the full clockwise position yielding maximum bass and full counterclockwise – the most balanced sound. The three marked settings are “tight” (minimum bass), “balanced” (medium bass), and “warm” (maximum bass).

An explanation on the Velvet webpage indicates that EarSonics considers listening volume a factor when selecting the best sounding tuning to use, with “tight” being best-suited for low-volume listeners and “warm” for high-volume listeners. The nomenclature is relative, of course – per headphone community conventions, all three of the Velvet’s the sound profiles are on the warm and bassy side and just differ in degree.

With that said, the Velvet is an excellent earphone. It actually shares quite a few similarities with the far more expensive FitEar TG334 – both are BA-based earphones with enhanced bass and fairly level mids and highs yielding good overall clarity. Admittedly, the Velvet is a little less neutral – its upper mids are slightly brighter and the bass hump is a little more audible. It is also much less sensitive, but at their core the two are much more similar than they are different.

All three of the Velvet’s sound settings have significantly higher than average bass impact (especially for a BA earphone) and a nice balance of mid-bass and sub-bass. Compared, for instance, to flatter IEMs such as the InEar StageDiver SD-2 and Shure SE535, the Velvet sounds warmer and offers more bass depth and impact. Compared to hybrid earphones such as the DUNU DN-2000 and FLC Technologies FLC8, which tend to have very good bass extension with little mid-bass boost, the Velvet sounds more full-bodied and impactful, and can be considered “bassier” in the conventional sense.

One of the things I like best about the bass of the Velvet – especially in the “tight” and “balanced” configurations – is that, while noticeably enhanced, it never becomes overwhelming to the point of being fatiguing. Unlike, for instance, the Sony XBA Z5 and InEar StageDiver SD-3, which have comparable bass quantity, the low end of the Velvet never feels overwhelmingly bassy. This may stop me from recommending the Velvet to a basshead, but for pretty much all other listeners it is definitely an asset.

The mids of the Velvet are surprisingly clear for a warmer-sounding earphone – much like those of the FitEar TG334. For instance, the Velvet has no less clarity than the flatter, more mid-centric StageDiver SD-2. The treble is also very well-balanced and accomplishes the rare feat of being smooth and non-fatiguing without sounding dull or rolled-off. There is more sparkle and presence than with the SD-2, but not too much so – the treble is not very bright compared to the DN-2000 or FLC8, which means the Velvet loses out on some of the perceived clarity those earphones gain from their extra treble energy but also sounds a little richer and more full-bodied. The other upside, of course, is that the Velvet is less prone to harshness and sibilance.

The deep, impactful bass and good end-to-end presence of the Velvet benefit its presentation. The soundstage doesn’t have the sheer width of earphones with more laid-back mids (like the DN-2000 and FLC8), but it ends up sounding well-layered and versatile. Compared, for instance, to the rather flat StageDiver SD-2, the Velvet does sound more lively and dynamic by a margin. There are earphones that have all that plus a wider soundstage, but they are few and far between – the only one that currently comes to mind is the FitEar TG334.

One last thing to note – while better in this regard than the SM64 model, the Velvet is not very sensitive for a BA earphone, with much lower efficiency than your typical Shure/Westone/Ultimate Ears IEM.

*Select Comparisons*

EarSonics SM64 ($449)

While both the Velvet and the older SM64 can be classified as having a warm and smooth sound, they actually sound fairly different from each other. I kept the Velvet in its minimum-bass (“tight sound”) setting for this comparison, and even then it offered more mid-bass impact than the SM64. I happen to think that the SM64 has fantastic bass – punchy and well-extended, yet linear in response and free of bloat. As a result of its extra mid-bass boost, however, the Velvet is a little more rich and lush-sounding.

The Velvet also lacks the upper midrange dip of the SM64. If not for this dip, the SM64 would sound significantly more neutral than the Velvet; as is, the Velvet is just a little more colored. The greater upper midrange presence helps it sound clearer than the SM64 despite its mid-bass hump. Vocals are fuller and more intelligible on the Velvet, and the overall sound is more cohesive. A side effect is that it is less tolerant of sibilance – while the SM64 does a great job of killing sibilance on tracks prone to it, the Velvet is more revealing, though still smoother than most IEMs in its class. It also has a more forward presentation, versus the more laid-back SM64.

RHA MA750 ($120)

The dynamic-driver, enhanced-bass MA750 has been one of my most consistent recommendations for warmer-sounding mid-level earphones. Its sound falls between the minimum-bass (“tight sound”) and medium-bass (“balanced sound”) settings of the Velvet. While closer to the latter setting in bass presence, the MA750 is actually a little less impactful than the Velvet, which has much more headroom for those who crave even greater impact.

The bass is less controlled and more intrusive on the RHA unit. The mids are more recessed for the most part, before gaining emphasis in the upper midrange. There, the RHA sounds less refined and a bit “tizzy” compared to the Velvet. The Velvet has more midrange presence and is smoother and clearer, but also warmer and more rich-sounding.

DUNU DN-2000 ($270)

The Velvet was kept in its minimum bass (“tight sound”) configuration for this comparison, but these earphones still have very different sound signatures. The V/U-shaped sound tuning of the DN-2000 boasts a bit more sub-bass presence with similar overall bass quantity and a much colder, brighter tonal character. Interestingly, the warmer EarSonics keep up in clarity despite being much smoother. The DN-2000, on the other hand, sounds more metallic through the upper mids and treble. At lower volumes this is not a big deal, but at higher volumes the Velvet sounds quite a bit more natural.

InEar StageDiver 3 (SD-3) ($599)

The SD-3 is a triple-driver, enhanced-bass universal IEM from Germany-based InEar. Being closer to the Velvet in both price and sound tuning than the more balanced-sounding SD-2 on which it is based, the SD-3 seemed like a better point of comparison. To match the SD-3’s sound most closely, the medium bass (“balanced sound”) tuning of the Velvet was used. Clearly, EarSonics’ definition of “balanced” differs not only from mine, but also from that of the folks at InEar.

In its medium-bass configuration, the Velvet has similar impact and depth to the SD-3 but its bass seems a little tighter overall, likely because the bass boost doesn’t reach too high into the upper bass. The Velvet never feels overwhelmingly bassy, yet the solid deep bass presence gives it a dynamic and engaging sound. The midrange of the Velvet is more forward and a little clearer. The upper midrange and lower treble have more sparkle and excitement, while the SD-3 sounds smoother and a bit more dull. The Velvet’s presentation is a little more layered and well-imaged. As usual, the SD-3 is way more sensitive.

Westone W40 ($500)

Westone’s former flagship is a quad-BA monitor with warm and smooth sound signature. For this comparison I put the Velvet in its minimum bass (“tight sound”) configuration. Even then, it generally provided a bit more bass impact while also having its bass emphasis focused more on the subbass region. The W40 has more mid/upper bass, and a result suffers from a bit more bass bleed. This, in turn, results in lower clarity, though on tracks with less sub-bass presence the Westone can appear punchier than the Velvet (of course, the Velvet can be retuned to one of its bassier settings to compensate if needed).

Above its sizable bass hump – from the upper bass region and up through the treble – the Velvet is on the whole more accurate-sounding than the W40. The W40 has less upper midrange presence, which doesn’t help its clarity. Vocals are more intelligible on the Velvet, and the treble is a bit more sparkly on the whole. Otherwise, the two are not far apart in performance though, as is the case with most other BA-based monitors, the W40 is significantly more efficient than the Velvet.

Sony XBA-Z5 ($700)

Sony’s flagship IEM is similar to the Velvet on paper – a warm-sounding high-resolution earphone with plenty of bass and good treble quality. I started out with the Velvet in its minimum bass (“tight sound”) and medium bass (“balanced sound”) configurations. Compared to the XBA-Z5, these had more prominent mids and sounded brighter and clearer. The XBA-Z5 is bassier, warmer, and darker. The bass is a little boomier and the overall sound is a little dull in comparison, with less forward and slightly more muffled mids. The Z5 is also even smoother and more forgiving than the Velvet, which is hardly harsh itself. The presentation of the XBA-Z5 is more spacious, due in part to the more laid-back midrange and excellent treble extension.

Switching the Velvet to its maximum bass (“warm sound”) setting evens the playing field quite a bit. With the Velvet in this configuration, the XBA-Z5 becomes the more balanced of the two earphones, though its bass still has a bit more rumble and the midrange is still not as forward or clear as that of the Velvet. However, in this setting the Velvet has a sizable bass hump and lots of bass impact, which removes its tighter, less powerful bass as an advantage over the Z5 and allows the Sony to keep up in other ways. Not only is the presentation more spacious in the Sony set, but the treble seems to be better quality as well – more level and also more extended.

On the whole, while the two are similar in general tuning philosophy, the Z5 is a very good basshead earphone while the Velvet sounds best when kept it in its warm-but-not-quite-basshead configurations.

Gorilla Ears GX-4b ($799)

The GX-4b is a quad-driver, enhanced-bass custom in-ear monitor that performs on a similar level to the Velvet. The Velvet is no less impactful than the GX-4b even in its minimum bass (tight sound) setting. The midrange of the GX-4b is slightly drier and the top end is a bit more revealing. The Velvet, on the other hand, is even smoother and does a better job of killing sibilance and harshness. The Velvet at times sounds clearer but on some tracks its bass gets in the way a bit more. The presentation of the Velvet is less forward while the GX-4b is significantly more intimate, and much more sensitive as well.

Value *(8.5/10)* – It is always hard to put a value rating on a ultra-high-cost earphone like this, but the Velvet may just be an end-game IEM for those who  like the “warm and smooth” type of sound signature – and that in itself can be worth a lot. With the ability to fine-tune its sound (mostly the bass boost) and a compact form factor with all the usual trappings of a top-tier BA earphone, what’s not to like?

*Pros: potential end-game IEM for warm and smooth sound, detachable cables
Cons: N/A*


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## ljokerl

(000) Short Take: Comparison by numbers

 To summarize, I've taken all of the data and calculated numerical averages of all of the scores for each earphone. 
  
 The accessory score has half the weight of the others. The 'i' column denotes earphones with an available (optional or otherwise) in-line microphone for use with smartphones and other devices. Single-button remotes for Apple, Android, Windows, and other smart devices are denoted with a "1". Three-button remotes with Apple volume controls are denoted with a "3". Three-button remotes with Android volume controls are denoted with an "A".
  
*See here for the new sortable/searchable version of this table with up-to-date pricing & availability.*
  

  
  
 * Denotes custom-fit monitors
 ** Price in USD at time of review
  
 This table is meant to only be used as a quick reference guide in the context of the review. The numbers are meaningless unless you know the reasoning behind them. I am sure most other reviewers will agree - no matter how high of a rating, in sound or value, we give to a particular product, always place your own personal preferences _first_. I cannot stress this enough - sound is a subjective thing and we all have our preferences. I try to be as objective as possible, but complete objectivity is completely impossible, so take the numbers with a grain of salt and read the reviews!
  
*See here for the new sortable/searchable version of this table with updated pricing & availability*
  
  
(001) Upcoming Reviews
  
 A list of planned reviews, in no particular order
  
 1MORE Design Crystal Piston
 ADV.SOUND M4
 Astrotec AX7
 Audio-Technica CKX5iS
 Brainwavz S5
 Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro (brief review)
 Custom Art Pro 330v2 (brief review)
 DUNU Titan 1
 Havi B3 Pro I (brief review can be found here)
 Heir Audio 8.A (InnerFidelity review can be found here)
 HiFiMan RE-600 (InnerFidelity review can be found here)
 LIFE Headphones
 Minerva Mi-Performer Pro & Mi-Artist Pro (brief impressions)
 Onkyo IE-HF300 and IE-FC300 (InnerFidelity review can be found here)
 Ostry KC06 (brief review can be found here)
 Perfect Seal SportBud Silver (brief impressions)
 Philips Fidelio S1 and S2 (InnerFidelity review can be found here)
 Philips SHE3580
 Popclik String
 Sennheiser IE6
 Sennheiser IE 800 (InnerFidelity review can be found here)
 Sony MDR-7550
 Sony XBA-H3 (comparison with Fidue A83, Dunu DN-2000, and T-Peos Altone200)
 T-Peos Altone200 (comparison with Fidue A83, Dunu DN-2000, and Sony XBA-H3)
 Thermaltake Isurus
 UE700
 UE Triple.Fi 10
 VSonic GR07 Classic (brief impressions can be found here)
 VSonic VSD1 (Innerfidelity review can be found here)
 VSonic VSD1S (Innerfidelity review can be found here)
 VSonic VSD3S (brief review can be found here)
 Westone ES5 (InnerFidelity review can be found here)
  
  
 What follows are sets in my possession that probably won't get a full review
  
 Accidentally Extraordinary Bamboo Earbuds (brief impressions)
 AirBuds (brief thoughts)
 AKG K330
 AKG K370
 AKG K376 (brief thoughts)
 Boqari Q1
 Brainwavz R3 (brief impressions can be found here)
 Cardas EM5813 Ear Speakers (brief thoughts)
 Dunu DN-900
 Fidue A81 (brief impressions can be found here)
 Final Audio Design Adagio III (brief thoughts)
 Harman Kardon AE (brief thoughts)
 Harman Kardon NI (brief thoughts)
 HiSoundAudio Golden Crystal
 HiSoundAudio HiPhone HP4 (brief thoughts)
 HiSoundAudio Popo
 JBL J22i  (brief thoughts)
 Meze 11 Deco (brief impressions)
 Miu-Audio MR2 PRO
 Noble 6 (brief impressions)
 Noble FR and PR (brief impressions)
 Noontec Rio (brief thoughts)
 Panasonic RP-HJE120
 Phiaton MS 200 (brief thoughts)
 PNY Midtown 200 (brief thoughts)
 PNY Uptown 200 (brief thoughts)
 RBH EP1 (brief thoughts)
 RHA MA-150 (brief thoughts)
 RHA MA-450i (brief thoughts)
 Sunrise Xcited
 Sunrise Xcape IE
 T-Peos Spider (brief impressions)
 Tekfusion Ecoofers
 Torque t103z (brief thoughts)
 Ultimate Ears Reference Monitor Demo - brief thoughts with comparisons to several CIEMs
 Westone Adventure Series (ADV) Alpha (brief thoughts)
 XTZ EarPhone-12 (brief thoughts)
  
  
(002) Interactive table
  
 For anyone curious to play around with the numbers, a fully sortable version of this table can be found here .
  
  
(003) Buyer's Guides
  
 An abridged buyer's guide containing my some of my favorite earphones, grouped by price and sound signature, can be found here.
  
 A guide to my favorite sub-$50 earphones can be found here.
  
 A few of my favorite custom monitors can be found in the CIEM Buyer's Guide here.
  
  
(004) Acknowledgements
  
 As the number of people who have assisted me in creating this thread grows, I've decided to add this section in an attempt to thank at least some of them. Without the support of these fellow head-fiers I would never have gotten as far as I have with this thread. 
  
*jant71*
*rawrster*
*mvw2*
*Poetik*
*jwhitakr*
*daveyostrow*
*ethan961 *
*kjk1281*
*HeadphoneAddict*
*violinvirtuoso*
*Inks*
*slntdth93*
*takoyaki7*
*Marcus_C*
*Carlsan*
*esanthosh*
*12345142*
*monoglycer*
*mcnoiserdc*
*average_joe*
*kidcharlemagne*
*nmxdaven*
*randomZash*
*idvsego*
*carfentanil*
*mascareiro*
*mark2410*
*-y0-*
*Selenium*
*Anaxilus*
*james444*
*shotgunshane*
*Gilly87*
*5370H55V*
*dweaver*
*scootsit*
*Fernito*
*inline79*
*ericr*
*abhijollyguy*
*listen4joy*
*1clearhead*
*BassInMyFace*
  
 Big thanks to them and anyone else who has chimed in with questions, comments, and suggestions! 
  
  
 (005) FAQs
  
_Q: Why is there no review of [X]?_
 A: There are hundreds of IEMs on the market under dozens of brands. It is unrealistic to try and cover all of them so I am limiting myself to those that are new, interesting, or popular. 
  
_Q: Can you review [X]?_
 A: Theoretically, yes. However, my queue is generally planned out months in advance and my spending is limited. If you want to loan me [X] for review, please contact me via PM. If you are a manufacturer interested in releasing a product sample, please contact me via PM or here.
  
_Q: [X] is on the planned review list. When will it be finished? Can I loan you one for review?_
 A: If an earphone is on the list, that means I have it in my possession. These reviews are written in my spare time and 1-2 per week is the most I can swing for both this thread and the portable headphone shootout. Priority is given to sets loaned to me by other head-fi members and manufacturer samples. Reviews of my own gear will be postponed as long as I have samples and/or loaners to get through.
  
_Q: Your review of [X] is wrong. It is clearly better than [Y]._
 A: There are few constants in the world of audio and a whole lot of variables. My reviews reflect my experiences using my ears, my gear, and my descriptive powers. None of these are perfect but rest assured that a lot of thought is put into the scoring. Nevertheless, the scores are far more important for a ballpark performance estimate than an absolute evaluation. Please read the reviews and form your own conclusions.
  
  
 As always, please feel free to make improvement suggestions, either by commenting or via PM.


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## superpiper

It's efforts like this that make Head-Fi the place it is...

 Top, top, foruming.....


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## mark2410

god, joker i have to say a hate you. you make me feel so spectacularly lazy in comparison, lol.

 looks excellent so far and im sure can only get better


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## rawrster

i guess u wont have the problem of running out of space this time..8 posts all to yourself  looks great so far 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 edit: just wanted to point out that newegg no longer sells the ck10 but since there was shortage of stock when i got them (dont know about now) dont know who actually sells them or who doesnt.


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## kjk1281

Great job ljokerl! I like the way you separated the different tiers into posts of their own. However, I can't help but think about what that seventh post is reserved for (Tier 1?). Though I find your reviews invaluable, please don't go bankrupt just to fill that post!


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## ljokerl

Added Kanen KM-948. A bit under-dramatic for the first addition but I'm afraid that's the earphone I couldn't add to the old thread.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *superpiper* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_It's efforts like this that make Head-Fi the place it is...

 Top, top, foruming....._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark2410* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_god, joker i have to say a hate you. you make me feel so spectacularly lazy in comparison, lol.

 looks excellent so far and im sure can only get better_

 

Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i guess u wont have the problem of running out of space this time..8 posts all to yourself  looks great so far 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 edit: just wanted to point out that newegg no longer sells the ck10 but since there was shortage of stock when i got them (dont know about now) dont know who actually sells them or who doesnt._

 

Thanks, fixed.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kjk1281* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Great job ljokerl! I like the way you separated the different tiers into posts of their own. However, I can't help but think about what that seventh post is reserved for (Tier 1?). Though I find your reviews invaluable, please don't go bankrupt just to fill that post! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Yes, post #7 terrifies my wallet and will do the same to my girlfriend when she sees it and connects the dots. For now I will call it the unmentionable post and keep it empty.


----------



## aabottom

Totally cool!

 I'll let ya know when I get the Head-Direct RE0.


----------



## rawrster

it should terrify much more than just your wallet! if there turns out to be a super incredible ridiculously good iem at $400 then what choice do we have really..

 but if not..then your loss (your wallet that is) is our gain (being more reviews )


----------



## semisight

Hey joker, could you consider adding IEMs like the se530/420 to your review?

 I used to own some shure IEMs and I'm curious to see how they stack up isolation wise to the more recently released ones (especially the MTP gold/copper). I'm going on some very long flights fairly soon so I need to find something that isolates well. (Obviously the ER4 is the best choice, but I want something with heavier bass).


----------



## pi3guy

hey joker, I was wondering about the sound sig differences between the pfe (grey) and ck10s. I'm debating between repurchasing pfes or moving up to ck10s. Are the ck10s more or less forward in the treble and mids than the pfes? Also, which has more bass quantity? Finally, is there a significant difference in the overall sq unamped from a fuze? Thanks in advance, love the thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *semisight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey joker, could you consider adding IEMs like the se530/420 to your review?

 I used to own some shure IEMs and I'm curious to see how they stack up isolation wise to the more recently released ones (especially the MTP gold/copper). I'm going on some very long flights fairly soon so I need to find something that isolates well. (Obviously the ER4 is the best choice, but I want something with heavier bass)._

 

I have owned the Shure E4c in the past and I was so unimpressed (with the sound) that I swore off Shure IEMs except for the SE530/535, which I have yet to try. I remember that my Er6i easily beat them in isolation at the time, but that's not much of a surprise. To answer your question, I have no plans for a Shure IEM at this point except perhaps a lower-end one as a reference point for Shure owners. My next 15 additions are already planned out so I can say for sure that no Shure products will be added until this thread reaches at least 65+ IEMs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *pi3guy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hey joker, I was wondering about the sound sig differences between the pfe (grey) and ck10s. I'm debating between repurchasing pfes or moving up to ck10s. Are the ck10s more or less forward in the treble and mids than the pfes? Also, which has more bass quantity? Finally, is there a significant difference in the overall sq unamped from a fuze? Thanks in advance, love the thread._

 

From memory I would say the PFEs are more forward on both counts due to the fact that the CK10 has a more spaced-out sound overall. The treble is similarly crisp and seemingly endlessly extended on both. The Ck10 has more bass impact than the PFE+grey, but not by much. Plus it's more of an armature-sounding bass (fast, precise, not much in the way of decay) compared to the almost dynamic sound of the PFE bass. Unamped the CK10 are definitely the way to go. I found the PFEs almost not worth using without an amp (not because they sound bad but because I already knew what I was missing). With the CK10s I skip the amp 99% of the time for portability.


----------



## rawrster

this was in your previous thread..but thanks for the comparison b/w the pl50 and pl30.

 was thinking of buying both for like 65 total but i doubt i would just use the pl50 much so got the pl30 for just under 18 shipped. just have to wait 2 weeks now ;p


----------



## ljokerl

$18 is a great price for one of my favorite budget IEMs. Plus the durability is surprising - they are my oldest fully-functioning in-ear set despite hundreds of hours of ungodly gym abuse and other everyday use. Two weeks is a pretty conservative estimate. I take it you didn't order them from mp4nation 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (yes, I am still bitter about the 60 days it took them to ship me the P10s and the 2+ months I've been waiting for my S:Flo).


----------



## rawrster

i bought it off focalprice.com. well my last purchase from hong kong came in a record time so hopefully this will be kind of similar. usually when i buy from asia i forget that i bought it until i get it in the mail. it says 6-14 days so yeah probably 2-3 weeks

 edit: i'm glad i didn't go for the s:flo2 or have an OS that doesnt work from them  waiting that long would drive me absolutely insane.


----------



## stonyboys

Just ordered the ADDIEMs from 7dime. I hope they're good =3


----------



## semisight

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have owned the Shure E4c in the past and I was so unimpressed (with the sound) that I swore off Shure IEMs except for the SE530/535, which I have yet to try. I remember that my Er6i easily beat them in isolation at the time, but that's not much of a surprise. To answer your question, I have no plans for a Shure IEM at this point except perhaps a lower-end one as a reference point for Shure owners. My next 15 additions are already planned out so I can say for sure that no Shure products will be added until this thread reaches at least 65+ IEMs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




._

 

Fair enough. Planning on reviewing any of the Playaz series?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *semisight* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Fair enough. Planning on reviewing any of the Playaz series?_

 

The US ebay seller that used to sell the Playaz doesn't seem to carry them any longer. If anyone knows a good place to get them, I'm all ears, but they are far cheaper in Europe than they are here.


----------



## bcpk

If you want a pair proxied through me, lemme know.


----------



## dweaver

Awesome job Joker! The layout is exceptional and all the links make it very easy to navigate. I bow to your skill and dedication.


----------



## pi3guy

thanks joker, that's just the analysis I was looking for. From your overall reviews, sounds like you really enjoy an expansive soundstage. wondering if you've ever tried audio-technica's ad line. I have the ad700s and it seems very similar to the ck10. i'll bet it has and even larger soundstage though, since it's fullsize and open.


----------



## NimbleRabit

Thanks for this! I'm curious if you've ever listened to, or have plans to review, Q-Jays? I've been doing a bit of research trying to find something good up to my max budget of $175, and a lot of posts point me in the direction of Q-Jays.

 While I'm here, I was thinking about the Phonak PFE's but a friend of mine keeps telling me "spend a little more to get 2 armatures, you'll be dissapointed if you don't". Being a complete noob, what does this mean and does it have any truth to it?

 Also, any specific recommendations for somebody looking to get into IEM's, up to 175, who likes a lot of metal, prog rock, and just about anything with female vocalists (meaning a lot of high pitched music).


----------



## rawrster

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NimbleRabit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_While I'm here, I was thinking about the Phonak PFE's but a friend of mine keeps telling me "spend a little more to get 2 armatures, you'll be dissapointed if you don't". Being a complete noob, what does this mean and does it have any truth to it?_

 

PFE is a single BA (balanced armature) driver. Universal BA iem's have either one, two or three BA drivers. Multiple drivers can sound better than a single one and many of the best universals do have multiple drivers. However more does not always mean better. Take for example I have a CK10 which is 2 drivers and I've owned the TF10 which is 3 and I prefer the CK10 by a large margin. I think more drivers has more potential of being better depending on how they are implemented but it does not always mean it is better. There is a dual driver by apple but there are lots of iem's that are single that people prefer over that. Once again depends on how it is implemented.


----------



## NimbleRabit

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_PFE is a single BA (balanced armature) driver. Universal BA iem's have either one, two or three BA drivers. Multiple drivers can sound better than a single one and many of the best universals do have multiple drivers. However more does not always mean better. Take for example I have a CK10 which is 2 drivers and I've owned the TF10 which is 3 and I prefer the CK10 by a large margin. I think more drivers has more potential of being better depending on how they are implemented but it does not always mean it is better. There is a dual driver by apple but there are lots of iem's that are single that people prefer over that. Once again depends on how it is implemented._

 

Thank you for the very informative post!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bcpk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_If you want a pair proxied through me, lemme know._

 

Thanks, I might take you up on that when I clear my backlog 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *dweaver* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Awesome job Joker! The layout is exceptional and all the links make it very easy to navigate. I bow to your skill and dedication._

 

Thanks, much appreciated

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *pi3guy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_thanks joker, that's just the analysis I was looking for. From your overall reviews, sounds like you really enjoy an expansive soundstage. wondering if you've ever tried audio-technica's ad line. I have the ad700s and it seems very similar to the ck10. i'll bet it has and even larger soundstage though, since it's fullsize and open._

 

I have heard the AD700 briefly and all I could think was "mids, mids, mids". Of course the CK10 can't beat that soundstage, but it does fairly well for an IEM. The AD700 didn't seem nearly as effortless in reproducing treble when I heard it, but that was only a brief impressioin.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NimbleRabit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for this! I'm curious if you've ever listened to, or have plans to review, Q-Jays? I've been doing a bit of research trying to find something good up to my max budget of $175, and a lot of posts point me in the direction of Q-Jays.

 While I'm here, I was thinking about the Phonak PFE's but a friend of mine keeps telling me "spend a little more to get 2 armatures, you'll be dissapointed if you don't". Being a complete noob, what does this mean and does it have any truth to it?

 Also, any specific recommendations for somebody looking to get into IEM's, up to 175, who likes a lot of metal, prog rock, and just about anything with female vocalists (meaning a lot of high pitched music)._

 

The only Jays IEM I've owned are the J-Jays, though the less said about them the better (review coming soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). I have not heard the Q-Jays and would be more interested in one of Jays' new IEMs (namely the quads 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). 

 As for dual vs single armatures, rawrster pretty much nailed it. More potential in multi-driver setups but that does not always equal better sound (just look at the Klipsch custom line). I really don't think you will be disappointed with the PFEs. They don't sound as natural as, say, the CK10, but they are darn good for what they cost and at what they do. You may also look at the Panasonic HJE900 (dynamic-driver), though I wouldn't call them vocal-centric earphones. They still perform very admirably and will take a lot more abuse than the PFEs.


----------



## Bananiq

Hi, I wanted to ask how is the detail reproduction of Phonak PFE compared to the re0 or er4/hf5. FWIK PFE are more laid-back?


----------



## grokit

You might want to move the Soundmagic PL50 up a price tier as Head-Direct has raised them to $79, although they sell them a little cheaper through other retailers, around $65-70.


----------



## stonyboys

$55: Focalprice.com offers Genuine Sound Magic PL-50 Professional 3.5mm In-Ear Headphone (Black) ,discount Genuine Sound Magic PL-50 Professional 3.5mm In-Ear Headphone (Black),Genuine Sound Magic PL-50 Professional 3.5mm In-Ear Headphone (Black) products


----------



## rawrster

^
 you can google focalprice.com coupons or similar search and find a coupon that knocks them down by $10 more bucks. however patience is needed compared to head-direct which ships and arrives much faster. i ordered from there a couple days ago for a PL30 and probably won't get it for 2 weeks minimum.


----------



## rymd

I think this thread + other monster multireview threads should either be stickied or linked to in a stickied review directory thread. Everyday there are recommend me a budget IEM within this price range etc, and this kind of helpful info would help reduce those heavily repeated threads and people would find answers faster


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bananiq* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi, I wanted to ask how is the detail reproduction of Phonak PFE compared to the re0 or er4/hf5. FWIK PFE are more laid-back?_

 

Detail-wise I really don't think the PFE can keep up with either the ER4 or RE0. In terms of aggressiveness, they are definitely not as forward as the ER4 in terms of presenting detail. Compared to the RE0, however, I think they hold their own. The RE0 really isn't an aggressive earphone, especially in the midrange. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grokit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You might want to move the Soundmagic PL50 up a price tier as Head-Direct has raised them to $79, although they sell them a little cheaper through other retailers, around $65-70._

 

It's still quite easy to find them in the $55-60 range - focalprice, mp4nation, ebay, etc. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rymd* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think this thread + other monster multireview threads should either be stickied or linked to in a stickied review directory thread. Everyday there are recommend me a budget IEM within this price range etc, and this kind of helpful info would help reduce those heavily repeated threads and people would find answers faster_

 

Thanks for the vote of confidence. To be honest I'm still surprised ClieOS's multi-threads are not stickied so I suppose this sort of effort is just too narrow of scope, especially compared to the sticky in the full-size forum with its 1.1 million views. And believe me, even having the thread in my sig does not always mean people who ask for recommendations will click on it instead of asking follow-up questions.


----------



## ljokerl

Addition for today: Ankit Stay True

 Also updated Nuforce and Cyclone reviews with new pictures and text revisions.


----------



## rawrster

just a fyi but from your first post...on the list of iem's that you have for reviewing from the addition you added today all the way down to halfway down to your second iem review is pretty much all in bold text..unless of course you meant to do that


----------



## ljokerl

Ah, thanks. That was a bad /B tag. Fixed


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NimbleRabit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for this! I'm curious if you've ever listened to, or have plans to review, Q-Jays? I've been doing a bit of research trying to find something good up to my max budget of $175, and a lot of posts point me in the direction of Q-Jays._

 

Update on this: I will likely be receiving a set of Q-Jays in several weeks so I they will be added to the thread in time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## ljokerl

Another day, another update: Digital Designs DD-DXB01. Fun 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## AwakenedBeing

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Update on this: I will likely be receiving a set of Q-Jays in several weeks so I they will be added to the thread in time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




._

 

Looking forward to this. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 As always, thank you very much for the time, effort, and dedication!


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Just thought I'd mention that according to their twitter feed Meelec is running a 60% off the M11/40% off the M6 promotion. That should be about $20 for the M11 and $30 for the M6. Great deals all around 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

  Quote:


 one day sale (ending Saturday at midnight)! 60% off MSRP on the M11 and M11P headphones (coupon code M11_60_OFF) and 40% off MSRP on the M6 (coupon code M6_40_OFF). Get these great savings at MEElec.com - Ultimate Sound in Style! Earphones, Media Players, Mobile and Gaming Accessories, and Much More! while quantities last!


----------



## rawrster

i refuse to be tempted! of course when i decide to start saving for my next purchases so many good deals lately  i do look forward to your q-jays review however. those were one of my choices when i was deciding on buying my first quality iem.

 @AwakenedBeing: I think you need more AT phones in your signature


----------



## AwakenedBeing

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_
 @AwakenedBeing: I think you need more AT phones in your signature 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Would the ATH-CKF500 look good on me? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 JK. For now, I am done. Maybe one more tiny purchase.


----------



## rawrster

You obviously know too much when I had to google that to find out what it was...never heard of those before

 I was thinking that you should get the AD900 and if you don't like it I can buy it off you at a nice discount 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 and yes that is most likely my next purchase


----------



## ljokerl

ECCI PR100 and PR200 added. Sorry about the frequent 1-IEM updates but I wasn't sure if I'd have time today.


----------



## stonyboys

just to let you know, the bolding on the "comfort" part of the PR100/200 review is messed up.


----------



## ljokerl

fixed, thanks


----------



## Hero Kid

The price of MEElectronics Ai-M6 / M6 (for the AUD at least) has dramatically increased on both Overstock.com (AUD $58.72) and the Meelectronics (AUD $49.99) site. 
 Other than that FANTASTIC topic. I use it as my bible to keep an eye on the lower end IEM market. Keep up the brilliant work...


----------



## ljokerl

Apparently Meelec has finally raised prices to MSRP on their own site. Not the best news for overseas buyers but in the US the M6 and M11 are still easy to find for <$40.


----------



## RallyMaster

I gave in and ordered the Meelec M9 (silver) and M6 (red) from Overstock.com. Excited to see how well those two sound. Anyone know how long Overstock takes to ship and where they ship out from?


----------



## utkusu

Joker,

 Quick question, if you don't mind: What would you rate RE2+e5(bass boost) in terms of your SQ numbers? 6.5?

 thanks,


----------



## spsam

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *RallyMaster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I gave in and ordered the Meelec M9 (silver) and M6 (red) from Overstock.com. Excited to see how well those two sound. Anyone know how long Overstock takes to ship and where they ship out from?_

 

They ship from Cali through USPS, so shipping speed depends on where you live I guess. It took about 5 days for me to receive my M6s through Overstock.


----------



## NinjaCat

hm the Viasng R03 you gave it a 7 for sound, but in the comparison chart it is an 8


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *utkusu* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Joker,

 Quick question, if you don't mind: What would you rate RE2+e5(bass boost) in terms of your SQ numbers? 6.5?

 thanks,_

 

6.5 sounds about right if the source is up to par. When I originally got the RE2 I was still using an old Sansa E280, which has notoriously rolled-off bass. The E5 didn't do much for the Sansa. But the RE2+E5 combo synergized beautifully with my Cowon D2+ and pretty well with the Clip/Fuze. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *spsam* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_They ship from Cali through USPS, so shipping speed depends on where you live I guess. It took about 5 days for me to receive my M6s through Overstock._

 

Funny, that's how long it took them to ship me my Philips Hp910s, and I'm in Cali.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NinjaCat* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hm the Viasng R03 you gave it a 7 for sound, but in the comparison chart it is an 8_

 

Sorry, that should definitely have been an 8.


----------



## stonyboys

So would you say that the r03 is like the bass version of the re0?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *stonyboys* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_So would you say that the r03 is like the bass version of the re0?_

 

Not really. If it were, it would've surpassed the RE0 in sound score. The true strength of the RE0 is its treble whereas on the R03 the treble is merely good. The midrange is more fluid but a little less detailed on the R03 and the bass, while more emphasized, doesn't really outperform RE0 bass in extension or definition.


----------



## jwhitakr

Any plans (or already in the works) to review any of the Sleek Audio offerings? e.g. SA1 or SA6? I had thought you already had one or more of their IEMs in this shootout, but unless I am mistaken I don't see any in there so far.


----------



## ljokerl

I was supposed to get a chance to try the SA1 but it never worked out. The SA1 hasn't become very popular and the SA6 following seems to be dwindling, at least around here.


----------



## rawrster

^
 probably cuz the SA6 had a bunch of build quality issues for such a long time


----------



## mark2410

i think the SA6's is that some of could never use them or even try to. all most of us would do is constantly be changing the bass ports and treble thingys and never listen to anything on them


----------



## david432111

You should update the prices on the meelec iems, they've jacked up all the prices.


----------



## ljokerl

It's not uncommon for manufacturers to charge MSRP for their products at their own outlets. It's still very easy to get the IEMs for the listed prices outside of the Meelec's site. Buy.com, Newegg, and Overstock all have good prices on Meelec products.


----------



## rawrster

hah joker. got my PL30 in days including them being lazy and not sending it to the post office for like 3-4 days. good day for me audio wise since i picked up my AD700 in the afternoon and was able to try out some IE8's and W3 and then my PL30 came waiting for me when I got home.

 now if only my shirt clips from hong kong or china would come..

 edit: just opening it now and this is a surprise! the cable is a right angle instead of a straight one like i was expecting. I guess they updated the cable since you bought it. I hate straight plugs so pleasantly surprised/.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hah joker. got my PL30 in days including them being lazy and not sending it to the post office for like 3-4 days. good day for me audio wise since i picked up my AD700 in the afternoon and was able to try out some IE8's and W3 and then my PL30 came waiting for me when I got home.

 now if only my shirt clips from hong kong or china would come..

 edit: just opening it now and this is a surprise! the cable is a right angle instead of a straight one like i was expecting. I guess they updated the cable since you bought it. I hate straight plugs so pleasantly surprised/._

 

Yes, Soundmagic changed the PL30 cabling and packaging to the type found on the PL21 (PL50 cabling is a bit thicker I think). I should probably update the review with that info but then there will be a discrepancy with the photo 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. It should still come with a shirt clip though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Dakallday

very informative thread, thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

New month, new additions.

 The Ortofon e-Q7 is a good start for a month of reviews 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 To balance things out also added the Coby CVEM79 Jammerz

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Dakallday* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_very informative thread, thank you!_


----------



## bcpk

"make sure that your amp is at least neural"

 Sounds like brain burn-in taken a step too far! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Nice review, mate. But, judging from your comments about fit, I don't think I'll be hankering for them any time soon.


----------



## amnsiac

Maybe this is just the nerd in me, but I would love to see a graph of your collected wisdom, like a simple x/y spread with price vs. average score, should show off the real value performers!

 If I had the table I'd do it myself, but to transcribe all that info from the image would be a pain!

 Just a thought anyways.


 Oh, also, before I forget, awesome thread!


----------



## bcpk

Oh, yeah, I forgot to post this. Me 'n Amnsiac had a "meetup". _Hommage à ljokerl._


----------



## AwakenedBeing

Thanks for the e-Q7 review! Keep up the great work!

 @bcpk: LOL!


----------



## rawrster

@bcpk: what's the iem all the way on the bottom?

 nice review on the e-Q7 joker. not many reviews on those so the more the better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 joker or anyone else who has the PL30, just out of curiosity does your cable retain memory of the way you stored them? I've only had them for a day but wondering if the kinks are just temporary from the way they were in the packaging or not.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *amnsiac* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Maybe this is just the nerd in me, but I would love to see a graph of your collected wisdom, like a simple x/y spread with price vs. average score, should show off the real value performers!

 If I had the table I'd do it myself, but to transcribe all that info from the image would be a pain!

 Just a thought anyways._

 

The problem with this is that the labels really run into each other as one part of the spread is extremely dense (the $15-50 range). In the end it is impossible to see anything below the high-priced earphones. It's a limitation of the excel macro that I'm using to label points on a plot. If you want to give it a shot I'd be happy to lend you the original table. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *amnsiac* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, also, before I forget, awesome thread!_

 

Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bcpk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, yeah, I forgot to post this. Me 'n Amnsiac had a "meetup". Hommage à ljokerl._

 

Lol! Great selection, too. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *AwakenedBeing* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the e-Q7 review! Keep up the great work!_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_nice review on the e-Q7 joker. not many reviews on those so the more the better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Thanks


----------



## KLS

Yeah nice review on the e-Q7! Another 10/10 from joker. But my wallet doesn't appreciate your rating


----------



## rawrster

joker you should take a look at post #7. you got that titled 2A but in the first post that section should be 1C since the iem there definitely didnt cost 150-250 though I wish it did


----------



## ljokerl

Fixed, thanks. Also, the IEM in bcpk's pic is a Cyclone PR1 Pro.


----------



## grokit

What a chart, a great resource. I really enjoyed reading your e-Q7 review, as I have had my pair for a couple of weeks now. I agree with pretty much all of your points, with the exception being that I didn't think the cable microphonics are bad at all, and a slider would have been a good thing to add to the "missing accessory" list. I'm sure the ones you were using were broken in, but for me the upper mids really smoothed out with time. I never thought of the treble as rolled off, but you probably have better sensitivity up there than I do


----------



## rawrster

That would be incorrect about the broken in part. I used them max 30 hours or so before sending it to joker and he was aware of the hours I put on them. However joker did burn them in and he did mention listening to lots of songs during the review so I skipped the burning in part 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I made my own chin slider so may thats why its not in the missing accessory list


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grokit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What a chart, a great resource. I really enjoyed reading your e-Q7 review, as I have had my pair for a couple of weeks now. I agree with pretty much all of your points, with the exception being that I didn't think the cable microphonics are bad at all, and a slider would have been a good thing to add to the "missing accessory" list. I'm sure the ones you were using were broken in, but for me the upper mids really smoothed out with time. I never thought of the treble as rolled off, but you probably have better sensitivity up there than I do 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I put quite a few hours on them, probably around 150, before writing up the review. Whether the treble sounds rolled off or not depends on what you're comparing them to. They sound okay next to the Turbines and the TF10, maybe a bit strained up high. But next to the ATH-CK90Pro or the ATH-CK100 I've been using for the past two days they sound like there's a huge chunk cut off at the top. Oh and I did mention the cable slider. I just call it a "cord cinch" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## james444

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grokit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What a chart, a great resource. I really enjoyed reading your e-Q7 review ... with the exception being that I didn't think the cable microphonics are bad at all ... I never thought of the treble as rolled off, but you probably have better sensitivity up there than I do 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_But next to the ATH-CK90Pro or the ATH-CK100 I've been using for the past two days they sound like there's a huge chunk cut off at the top._

 

x2, thanks for yet another great review! x3 @grokit, no trouble with microphonics here. x4@ joker, I concur, next to the CK100 the Ortofon's treble definitely sounds lacking.


----------



## JxK

Great review joker. And for those who are annoyed by the lack of a cable slider/cinch, might I suggest the DIY alternative of a small rubber band? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 It'll slide up and down, and hold those pesky cables in place, and likely even help with microphonics.


----------



## james444

^ Hey, you've stolen my invention!


----------



## grokit

I just cut a black twist-tie short and wind it around the cable a bit:






 I like it because it's easy to adjust the tension


----------



## grokit

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh and I did mention the cable slider. I just call it a "cord cinch" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




._

 

I knew I should have checked back before I wrote that, lol


----------



## bubsdaddy

In looking at the specs for the nozzle size I see that the ADDIEM and the Meelec M6 are both listed as 4mm. Has anyone tried M6 tips on an ADDIEM? I have an awful time trying to get a seal and I am thinking the M6 tips might help.


----------



## amnsiac

I'll take that table off you joker, although I take your point there is an awful lot of data there for one graph. Still, I might break it up into a few smaller ones and see if I can come up with something useful.


----------



## Donut

Allow me to add my thanks, |joker|. This thread was a big help in my purchase of the Panasonic RP-HJE900.

 I'm feeling another problem coming on, though...now I want to upgrade my home phones - Sennheiser HD 497s...I feel myself sliding down a slippery & expensive slope....


----------



## amnsiac

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Donut* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Allow me to add my thanks, |joker|. This thread was a big help in my purchase of the Panasonic RP-HJE900.

 I'm feeling another problem coming on, though...now I want to upgrade my home phones - Sennheiser HD 497s...I feel myself sliding down a slippery & expensive slope...._

 

By the time you feel yourself slipping, it's already too late!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *JxK* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Great review joker. And for those who are annoyed by the lack of a cable slider/cinch, might I suggest the DIY alternative of a small rubber band? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 It'll slide up and down, and hold those pesky cables in place, and likely even help with microphonics._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grokit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I just cut a black twist-tie short and wind it around the cable a bit:

 I like it because it's easy to adjust the tension 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I think rawrster's method of using a bit of electrical tape wound around so that the sticky side is fully concealed worked very well. The end result is quite similar (in form and function) to the sliders on the Ck10 and Ck100. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bubsdaddy* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_In looking at the specs for the nozzle size I see that the ADDIEM and the Meelec M6 are both listed as 4mm. Has anyone tried M6 tips on an ADDIEM? I have an awful time trying to get a seal and I am thinking the M6 tips might help._

 

Have you tried Sony Hybrids? They work very well with the ADDIEMs and you shouldn't have a problem with getting a seal. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Donut* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Allow me to add my thanks, |joker|. This thread was a big help in my purchase of the Panasonic RP-HJE900.

 I'm feeling another problem coming on, though...now I want to upgrade my home phones - Sennheiser HD 497s...I feel myself sliding down a slippery & expensive slope...._

 

Ah yes, when your IEMs start sounding better than your home rig, it's time to upgrade your home rig 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Or at least that's the slippery slope I went down.


----------



## ZARIM

Hi IJokerI, i want to tell you about JVC FXC80, it's new but looks higher model than FXC50, FXC70.


----------



## Donut

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ah yes, when your IEMs start sounding better than your home rig, it's time to upgrade your home rig 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Or at least that's the slippery slope I went down._

 

Trying not to slide down that slope. Trying very hard. Problem is, I'm already starting to scope out other 'phones [Sennheiser HD 555, AKG K240, Audio Technica ATH-AD700, and actually, quasi-considering the AKG K181DJs you currently have FS, though I'm trying to gravitate towards an open 'phone], though I'm at least trying to keep it around $100.

 Funny thing is, about five years ago, I purchased first the HD 497s, then the HD 280 Pros. I stopped there, and was pretty fine. A year or two later, I wound up purchasing the Koss KSC 75, but I was able to curb my headphone-upgradeitis. Fast forward to the present day. My search for an IEM led me to the Panasonic RP-HJE900, whose sound quality has so impressed me that I'm now finding myself wanting to at least upgrade the 497s, though I'm considering mixing in usage of the 280s and the HJE900s more at home to compensate - the 497 is still fine for activities like movie-watching. Not like that's going to stop me from looking, though.


----------



## rawrster

well that's better than starting with iem's and then beginning the process of the headphone setup and getting something under 100 and then seeing that your iem's can outperform them. then you know you have to spend much more money to match the level of your iem's.


----------



## Napilopez

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ah yes, when your IEMs start sounding better than your home rig, it's time to upgrade your home rig 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Or at least that's the slippery slope I went down._

 

Ugh Joker, don't remind me of these things! My beloved RX700s are starting to feel a bit outclassed... XD


----------



## rawrster

My AD700 didn't take very long to get outclassed by my CK10 in treble detail  

 joker: would you say the e-Q7 is a more refined PFE like dfkt or james mentioned a while ago? I'm not going to buy the PFE obviously but just wondering


----------



## grokit

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ah yes, when your IEMs start sounding better than your home rig, it's time to upgrade your home rig 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Or at least that's the slippery slope I went down._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_well that's better than starting with iem's and then beginning the process of the headphone setup and getting something under 100 and then seeing that your iem's can outperform them. then you know you have to spend much more money to match the level of your iem's._

 

Since I got my Ortos I can feel myself sliding a bit, right on my wallet, which is going to burst into flames soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But since my HE-5s are still holding up well, I may have to torture myself with MDs and/or customs before I get back to the desktop treadmill, if ever


----------



## amnsiac

Joker was right, to make a graph of that whole chart was pretty crazy. So much data! To get around this I've only included the better value of the lower cost 'phones, and I've excluded some I didn't think most people would be able to get their hands on anyway. Here goes!






 By the way, the values on the Y-axis are simply the average score, although maybe some people would rather just see sound quality vs. price. We'll see.


----------



## Bananiq

why the re0 decreased to 9.0?


----------



## amnsiac

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bananiq* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_why the re0 decreased to 9.0?_

 

The graph displays the re0's 8.1 average score, not it's sound score of 9.


----------



## MrGreen

I'm sure you know it, but this thread is an amazing piece of work.

 Out of curiosity, is the scoring system linear or an inverse log function? (i.e. is the gap between headphones that score 0 and 1 bigger than headphones that score 9 and 10?)


----------



## Bananiq

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *amnsiac* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The graph displays the re0's 8.1 average score, not it's sound score of 9._

 

I wasnt reffering to the graph. I meant the SQ score


----------



## amnsiac

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bananiq* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I wasnt reffering to the graph. I meant the SQ score_

 

Oh ok, well joker's the man to answer that then!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ZARIM* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hi IJokerI, i want to tell you about JVC FXC80, it's new but looks higher model than FXC50, FXC70._

 

How does it sound? I'm waiting for a few impressions to surface plus better availability. I like the other JVC carbon-series stuff (namely the HA-M750) but the FXC80s are currently ~$60, which is 4x more than I paid for the FXC50. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Donut* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Trying not to slide down that slope. Trying very hard. Problem is, I'm already starting to scope out other 'phones [Sennheiser HD 555, AKG K240, Audio Technica ATH-AD700, and actually, quasi-considering the AKG K181DJs you currently have FS, though I'm trying to gravitate towards an open 'phone], though I'm at least trying to keep it around $100._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_well that's better than starting with iem's and then beginning the process of the headphone setup and getting something under 100 and then seeing that your iem's can outperform them. then you know you have to spend much more money to match the level of your iem's._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Napilopez* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ugh Joker, don't remind me of these things! My beloved RX700s are starting to feel a bit outclassed... XD_

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My AD700 didn't take very long to get outclassed by my CK10 in treble detail _

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grokit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Since I got my Ortos I can feel myself sliding a bit, right on my wallet, which is going to burst into flames soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But since my HE-5s are still holding up well, I may have to torture myself with MDs and/or customs before I get back to the desktop treadmill, if ever 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

I think I've found a good balance with my AKG K601 + Alessandro MS2i + JVC HA-DX3 trio. The AKGs for mids, the MS2i for energy, and the DX3 for pure power. The top-tier IEMs I've tried do come very close to them. I think the age-old myth of greater bang/buck with headphones vs IEMs needs to be laid to rest because it really depends on what you're after. Yes, there will likely never be an IEM that can even come close to the K601 for soundstaging, but the high end IEMs I've tried really outclass the headphones in speed and detail. Sure the e-Q7 is pricier than the K601, but that's without factoring in the cost of my amp+dac+interconnects, which is like $700. I should have my hands on a DT770/250 tomorrow and will see where it stands, but I'm not expecting miracles. With that said, portable headphones are making less and less sense as IEMs get better and better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_joker: would you say the e-Q7 is a more refined PFE like dfkt or james mentioned a while ago? I'm not going to buy the PFE obviously but just wondering 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Eh, I'm not so sure. The e-Q7 has significantly better bass texture and a more natural low end while the PFE doesn't roll off as early at the top (but isn't as smooth, either). The main difference though is that presentation of the e-Q7 has 'weight'. This is partly a side effect of the texturing, but you 'feel' the sound. The PFE is more armature-like in that it always sounds light and sprightly. Might be just me, though. Also, the PFE is slightly on the cool side in terms of tonality while the e-Q7 is slightly warm. I guess in the grand scheme of things they are close enough to each other, since the pfe sounds like a dynamic-esque armature and the e-Q7 sounds like an armature-esque dynamic-driver.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *amnsiac* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Joker was right, to make a graph of that whole chart was pretty crazy. So much data! To get around this I've only included the better value of the lower cost 'phones, and I've excluded some I didn't think most people would be able to get their hands on anyway. Here goes!






 By the way, the values on the Y-axis are simply the average score, although maybe some people would rather just see sound quality vs. price. We'll see._

 

That's great, it looks a lot more readable than the one I've got. I'm thinking of following your example and taking out a lot of the boring ones and just leaving stuff that's somehow noteworthy. It should be noted that what we are all looking for is something as close to the top left corner of the graph as possible 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. It's funny but I think the Meelec M9, M6, and M11 are collectively closest to that ideal in terms of absolute distance. Shows that Meelec is certainly doing something right. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bananiq* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_why the re0 decreased to 9.0?_

 

That was an artifact of my changing the scaling method to accommodate the e-Q7. I use a second chart to calculate SQ score. All of the scores fell a tiny bit since the e-Q7 textures better than any IEM I've heard but that was enough to pull the RE0 down enough for me to round it down to a 9.0 instead of a 9.5 like before. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *MrGreen* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm sure you know it, but this thread is an amazing piece of work.

 Out of curiosity, is the scoring system linear or an inverse log function? (i.e. is the gap between headphones that score 0 and 1 bigger than headphones that score 9 and 10?)_

 

Thanks. The system is more or less linear although it is intended to be more of a comparative scale, i.e. seeing where things fall in relation to each rather than being based on some unattainable absolute (which I have not heard). And of course I can't stress enough the importance of personal preferences.


----------



## bcpk

|joker|, when are we going to see a Multi-Portable Amp Review thread?


----------



## koven

i havent been hanging around here as much lately, but i have to say, i remember when you first joined head-fi joker, since it was around the same time i did

 head-fi is lucky to have you here, you're a true asset to the community


----------



## Hero Kid

I'm curious to see if you have any plans to review the newest and third generation of the Head-Direct RE0's? 
 It should be a fairly different review as far as accessories, microphonics and build quality goes from what I've read.


----------



## rawrster

The RE0 has already been reviewed though. The only difference in accessories in the box that it comes with, the plug is a right angle and there is no extension cord in the newest version. Sonically it shouldn't be any difference between the versions.

 @koven: I definitely agree. When I first joined and definitely true today there is just way too information about so many earphones especially since the under $100 market pretty much exploded in the last year or so. There was also the multiple iem threads by ClieoS but this one is updated more often so the more the better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 It's nice to see someone be able to use this as a guide although joker's wallet probably doesn't agree too much. It was so much simpler when under $100 was like an ER6i or something like that.


----------



## Leavenfish

Joker- I was wondering if you ever go back and take into account changes/improvements if the IEM's when it comes to your chart? For instance, I know the Phonaks not long ago started sending out their IEM with an improved cable which around the ears, I seem to recall reading, used to be prone to cracking over time due to sweat build-up. I have heard of similar things to other IEM's as well and was just curious.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bcpk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_|joker|, when are we going to see a Multi-Portable Amp Review thread? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Never. I think that with (very) few exceptions the importance of amps is overrated when it comes to IEMs, especially on the low end of things. I would rather dedicate my time to this thread and the portable review than trying to A:B a bunch of amps that most people don't need anyway. This is based solely on my experience with the dozen or so portable amps that i've owned so take it as you will. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *koven* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i havent been hanging around here as much lately, but i have to say, i remember when you first joined head-fi joker, since it was around the same time i did

 head-fi is lucky to have you here, you're a true asset to the community_

 

Thanks, I appreciate that. Also, now you're making me feel self-conscious about my join date 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hero Kid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm curious to see if you have any plans to review the newest and third generation of the Head-Direct RE0's? 
 It should be a fairly different review as far as accessories, microphonics and build quality goes from what I've read._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Leavenfish* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Joker- I was wondering if you ever go back and take into account changes/improvements if the IEM's when it comes to your chart? For instance, I know the Phonaks not long ago started sending out their IEM with an improved cable which around the ears, I seem to recall reading, used to be prone to cracking over time due to sweat build-up. I have heard of similar things to other IEM's as well and was just curious._

 

I try to mention the changes that I'm aware of when new versions are released but then I'm faced with a dilemma - do I evaluate the current version which I don't own or do I leave the (outdated) review in place? I have little interest in picking up the same earphone several times due to non-sq-related changes (although I have owned multiples of several of them like the Meelec range). 

 The RE0 accessories didn't change except for the extension. If you want to know what I think about the new cable, the RE252 uses the same cord. I definitely don't think it's free of microphonics and it seems a bit wimpy on the $200 RE252 but I'd have no issues with it on the $80 RE0. The L-plug is a welcome change. 

 I think I mentioned the PFE cable update in the review. I also intend to mention that the PL30 is now in an L-plug. Forgot to do that when they first got updated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## grokit

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yes, there will likely never be an IEM that can even come close to the K601 for soundstaging_

 

Agreed, but there are already exceptions, at least from the custom-molded IEM realm:
  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Audiofiler* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The soundstage on the JH 13 Pro is almost unbelievable coming from a custom IEM. The soundstage is constructed with vast spaciousness in all directions. There is a remarkably realistic sense of depth within the stereo image, thus allowing the JH 13 Pro’s focused imaging to shine with great accuracy. The width of the soundstage is better than any IEM I have ever heard and is comparable but not better than high-end full sized headphones._


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I try to mention the changes that I'm aware of when new versions are released but then I'm faced with a dilemma - do I evaluate the current version which I don't own or do I leave the (outdated) review in place?_

 

Hmm at first I was like just add the new changes but then I realized that would completely change the review. I see your problem. Perhaps you could compromise and add, for example, "The newest version has ... and would get x/x" or something to that effect? 
 It's tough eh? :/
 Also have you considered adding a "Value" column into the table? If it's meant to be a quick reference point why not include it? 
 Yet again I'll finish with saying fantastic topic. Truly.

 EDIT: Just noticed the picture of the Soundmagic Pl-50 is missing?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hero Kid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmm at first I was like just add the new changes but then I realized that would completely change the review. I see your problem. Perhaps you could compromise and add, for example, "The newest version has ... and would get x/x" or something to that effect? 
 It's tough eh? :/
 Also have you considered adding a "Value" column into the table? If it's meant to be a quick reference point why not include it? 
 Yet again I'll finish with saying fantastic topic. Truly.

 EDIT: Just noticed the picture of the Soundmagic Pl-50 is missing?_

 

The value rating is the most subjective of the bunch. I've considered including it but really it's way too depedent on other factors. My biggest fear is that people will make decisions purely off the table, which is definitely not the intended purpose. I've already seen it reposted out of context outside of head-fi. 

 As for the PL50 picture, imageshack hosting is spotty. Sometimes hosted files will just drop out at random times. Reloading the page in a few minutes usually brings them back.


----------



## Silenced

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hero Kid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmm at first I was like just add the new changes but then I realized that would completely change the review. I see your problem. Perhaps you could compromise and add, for example, "The newest version has ... and would get x/x" or something to that effect? 
 It's tough eh? :/
 Also have you considered adding a "Value" column into the table? If it's meant to be a quick reference point why not include it? 
 Yet again I'll finish with saying fantastic topic. Truly.

 EDIT: Just noticed the picture of the Soundmagic Pl-50 is missing?_

 

for an arbitrary value you can just compare their rank to price. But some things are more important than others for different people.


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Silenced* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_for an arbitrary value you can just compare their rank to price. But some things are more important than others for different people._

 

As far as referencing the rank to price I already do this, and I'm sure others do to. 
 I also realize people value different things, everyone varies. This is exactly why I think Joker should add the value column to the table. Some people prioritize value, why not let them easily reference it? 
 I also respect Jokers thought that people will only reference the graph. I personally use the graph to keep track of new entries and how they compare to existing reviews. If anything grabs my attention I take it further and read the review, then continue to search Head-fi and the web for more information if I think necessary. Surely other people are doing this to? 

 While I'm here I'm wondering if you have considered reviewing any of the "Hippo" range that seems to be so popular over at ABI? 
 ~


----------



## rawrster

there was some kind of value attached to it earlier but it was removed since it was based on his preferences which are different than other peoples.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hero Kid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_As far as referencing the rank to price I already do this, and I'm sure others do to. 
 I also realize people value different things, everyone varies. This is exactly why I think Joker should add the value column to the table. Some people prioritize value, why not let them easily reference it? 
 I also respect Jokers thought that people will only reference the graph. I personally use the graph to keep track of new entries and how they compare to existing reviews. If anything grabs my attention I take it further and read the review, then continue to search Head-fi and the web for more information if I think necessary. Surely other people are doing this to? 

 While I'm here I'm wondering if you have considered reviewing any of the "Hippo" range that seems to be so popular over at ABI? 
 ~_

 

The problem is exactly as rawrster said - value is by far the most subjective of these categories. The value column used to be included, as well as another column that applied a mathematical formula to the average and price to calculate a value. I took them both out. In the old thread there was also someone who requested that I maintain a ranking of IEMs according to my own preferences (quite different from any of the rankings in the table, to be honest). There used to be one in my sig. Either way, I think even that would be better than a value category since it is much more clearly subjective. 

 And reading up further on anything that strikes your eye is the ideal behavior. Unfortunately I have my doubts about its prevalence among those who are not head-fi veterans. 

 As for the Hippos, I have one of them but i've no clue when it will be added. It's at least a dozen IEMs away.


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_As for the Hippos, I have one of them but i've no clue when it will be added. It's at least a dozen IEMs away._

 

Oh wow I didn't realize you had a back-log of IEM's to review. 
 Maybe you could add a list of up-coming IEM's to be reviewed to the thread somewhere? I'd certainly appreciate knowing what you have coming up, no matter how long it may take to get here.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Hero Kid* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh wow I didn't realize you had a back-log of IEM's to review. 
 Maybe you could add a list of up-coming IEM's to be reviewed to the thread somewhere? I'd certainly appreciate knowing what you have coming up, no matter how long it may take to get here._

 

I think that can be done. I'll add an approximate list to the thread with the next update. For now I'll post it here, in order of certainty:

Finished pending editing:
 Jays J-Jays
 Audio-Technica ATH-CK6
 Sennheiser CX300
 Sennheiser CX250
 Grado iGi**

In progress:
 Audio-Technica ATH-CK100
 Audio-Technica ATH-CK90Pro

Planned:
 Yuin OK1
 Klipsch Custom 3
 Radiopaq Classical
 Rockford/Fosgate Punch Plugs
 Klipsch X1/S2
 FutureSonics Atrio M8
 Hippo Shrooms
 ViSang R02

 **Indefinitely delayed


----------



## Bennyboy71

Brilliant oeuvre you got going here Joker - just wanted to add my eighteen thumbs up to you and the stunning effort you've put and are putting in. When they're handing out the medals, you'll need a wheelbarrow.

 For what it's worth, your review set me off on the research trail that led me to purchasing the CK10s this week, and for that I will be eternally grateful. ******** incredible little things, and then some. 

 Cheers. I owe you a pint.


----------



## rawrster

oohh..customs 3 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 That's something I'm interested in since certain people kept talkng about them for a while and they are pretty cheap now that they aren't being sold anymore outside of ebay.

 ^ CK10 is a good choice. They are by far my favorite iem's that I've owned of heard so far.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bennyboy71* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Brilliant oeuvre you got going here Joker - just wanted to add my eighteen thumbs up to you and the stunning effort you've put and are putting in. When they're handing out the medals, you'll need a wheelbarrow.

 For what it's worth, your review set me off on the research trail that led me to purchasing the CK10s this week, and for that I will be eternally grateful. ******** incredible little things, and then some. 

 Cheers. I owe you a pint._

 

Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Where would I need to go to collect said pint?

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oohh..customs 3 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 That's something I'm interested in since certain people kept talkng about them for a while and they are pretty cheap now that they aren't being sold anymore outside of ebay._

 

I can't say that I'm terribly impressed with the Custom 3, but I've spent the last week switching between the Ck100 and Ck90Pro, which clearly outclass it. I would say the ~$130 price point is right where they need to be to be mildly competitive, just like the other two deeply discounted Klipsch Customs.


----------



## AwakenedBeing

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I think that can be done. I'll add an approximate list to the thread with the next update. For now I'll post it here, in order of certainty:
_

 

I was hoping to see the q-jays on that list...looks like it won't be anytime soon.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *AwakenedBeing* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was hoping to see the q-jays on that list...looks like it won't be anytime soon. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

The list only includes earphones currently in my possession. The Q-Jays haven't arrived yet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## mark2410

have you tried olives on the custom 3?

 you know if they have a less abysmally poo cable they would be one of my favourites


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark2410* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_have you tried olives on the custom 3?

 you know if they have a less abysmally poo cable they would be one of my favourites_

 

Yes, using Olives now. And I agree, the cabling is a crime against humanity, same as the Custom 1/Custom 2. I don't know, something about Klipsch Custom line doesn't jive with me. I also don't like the C1/C2 nearly as much as you. Especially the C1.


----------



## rawrster

what kind of cable is it? i've only heard that its ridiculously thin.


----------



## mark2410

well yes i can very much see the 1 as being an aquired taste, i think i wonce described it as sounding like a tiny puppy furiously trying to tear apart a pair of slippers. you know it is doing it but barely however there is just so much enthusiasm you just go, awwww. that what they they do to me.

 the 3 on the other hand is pretty great. great mids, good powerfull clean bass if a little too much. and the treble is good enough and not too abundant which is how i like it to be.

 have you tried amping them, i felt they did quite like it?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_what kind of cable is it? i've only heard that its ridiculously thin._

 

It's a cloth cable that's pretty thin and very microphonic but that's not the biggest problem. The issue is that the cable likes to kink itself at acute angles, which is immeasurably annoying. It's actually worse than the cloth cable on my $3 Kanen MD-52. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark2410* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_well yes i can very much see the 1 as being an aquired taste, i think i wonce described it as sounding like a tiny puppy furiously trying to tear apart a pair of slippers. you know it is doing it but barely however there is just so much enthusiasm you just go, awwww. that what they they do to me.

 the 3 on the other hand is pretty great. great mids, good powerfull clean bass if a little too much. and the treble is good enough and not too abundant which is how i like it to be.

 have you tried amping them, i felt they did quite like it?_

 

Wow, perfect description of the C1. I guess the problem for was that this puppy's MSRP made it look like a big dog. I absolutely hate it when companies (e.g. JLabs) set a higher MSRP for their product to create an illusion of value. Same with the C3. If not for the cable it would be a great buy for the $130. However, the $400 MSRP is ridiculous. Compared to the CK10 it sounds like it's immersed in oil (very preliminary impression). I think it's a great candidate for reshelling though. 

 Oh and I am currently running amped (mini3 or Music Valley RC-1) because without an amp the buzz coming from the S:Flo2 when the screen is on is unbearable.


----------



## rawrster

worse than a $3 iem's cable. That's pretty impressive originally being so expensive and having such a bad cable then.


----------



## ljokerl

Updates for the week: ATH-CK6 and Jays J-Jays. More coming soon.


----------



## TheGame21x

Question, I noticed that in the sound quality section of the two new reviews that they're out of five now. Is that a mistake or are you switching to a 5 point system?


----------



## ljokerl

No, that's my mistake, thanks. They were both so bad I forgot how much better sounds gets.


----------



## TheGame21x

Ah, okay. I thought the ratings (out of five that is) were a bit high considering how negative the actual reviews were. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Keep it up by the way. This is a great reference thread and shows that you're really passionate about what you do.


----------



## mvw2

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Compared to the CK10 it sounds like it's immersed in oil (very preliminary impression). I think it's a great candidate for reshelling though._

 

Yep. It's got thick notes. It's actually pretty nice with deep strings where you get nice, heavy reverberation and presence, but that thickness of note comes at a price, a loss of fine detail. It's noticeable when being able to directly compare to other options like the CK10. It's less noticeable when you don't. Personal preference will play a role in how you like such aspects.

 I think the biggest benefit of the Custom 3 is the sound stage. The sense of size and space is great, and it has good linearity to it. It does sound stage better then a heck of a lot of other earphones.


----------



## kjk1281

Thanks for the update(s)!

 I'm not surprised that the CK6 didn't impress since they're a rather old product. The phones were released in Japan in late 2006 and were discontinued in that country sometime in 2008. One Japanese reviewer stated that he felt the CK6s were worth about $30 but not the $45 or so he paid for them. Its spiritual successors are the CKS line, at least in the sense that they're among the bassier AT canalphones.

 As for the J-Jays: Well, at least now I know that Jays products are available from Amazon. Hooray!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mvw2* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Yep. It's got thick notes. It's actually pretty nice with deep strings where you get nice, heavy reverberation and presence, but that thickness of note comes at a price, a loss of fine detail. It's noticeable when being able to directly compare to other options like the CK10. It's less noticeable when you don't. Personal preference will play a role in how you like such aspects.

 I think the biggest benefit of the Custom 3 is the sound stage. The sense of size and space is great, and it has good linearity to it. It does sound stage better then a heck of a lot of other earphones._

 

They are pretty relaxing to listen to. I guess I've been spoiled in the past few days by the Audio-Technica IEMs. I'll have to equalize myself with some budget sets and then come back to the C3. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kjk1281* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the update(s)!

 I'm not surprised that the CK6 didn't impress since they're a rather old product. The phones were released in Japan in late 2006 and were discontinued in that country sometime in 2008. One Japanese reviewer stated that he felt the CK6s were worth about $30 but not the $45 or so he paid for them. Its spiritual successors are the CKS line, at least in the sense that they're among the bassier AT canalphones.

 As for the J-Jays: Well, at least now I know that Jays products are available from Amazon. Hooray! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Well, to be honest I paid about $15 for the CK6 and I still feel like I got ripped off. Even the CX300 is a better-sounding set. Worst thing is that the US MSRP is listed at $99.99.

 As for the Jays, the one thing they do better than any other brand is packaging. If I had to give an earphone as a gift, the J-Jays would be near the top of the list. High hopes for my incoming Q-Jays!


----------



## Pianist

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_They are pretty relaxing to listen to. I guess I've been spoiled in the past few days by the Audio-Technica IEMs. I'll have to equalize myself with some budget sets and then come back to the C3. 



 Well, to be honest I paid about $15 for the CK6 and I still feel like I got ripped off. Even the CX300 is a better-sounding set. Worst thing is that the US MSRP is listed at $99.99.

 As for the Jays, the one thing they do better than any other brand is packaging. If I had to give an earphone as a gift, the J-Jays would be near the top of the list. *High hopes for my incoming Q-Jays!*_

 

They are one of my favourite IEMs. Very precise and musical sounding. You should like them, but give them at least 20 hours of burn in to relax the treble a little. It's quite hot out of the box. After burn in, they are only slightly sibilant sometimes, but nothing major. I would rate them around RE0 level out of a good source like AMP3. Each has their strengths and weaknesses but unamped q-jays sound much more lively and controlled in the bass.

 Anyway, I am awaiting your impressions. It will be interesting to hear to what you think of them.


----------



## rawrster

Q-Jays 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I remember looking at these sometime around when they came out. They definitely seemed like good iem's but their price turned me off. Now I own one that is much more expensive  I look forward to that review but I guess it won't be for a while since it looks like you got lots of reviews ahead of you.


----------



## grokit

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_As for the Jays, the one thing they do better than any other brand is packaging._

 

You obviously didn't have the "unboxing" experience with the e-Q7's you reviewed, lol


----------



## rawrster

he pretty much did  it came with the box and everything 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 the black box the e-Q7 it comes with is impressive. the stuff that the e-Q7 comes with however is not too impressive. 

 however the jays do pack in a lot of stuff in their iem's. all they need to do now is release xjays and have it relatively low price.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *grokit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You obviously didn't have the "unboxing" experience with the e-Q7's you reviewed, lol 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

Au contraire, I did. But there's a fine line between style and excess, and for me the Ortofons cross it. 

 The Jays packaging is the epitome of swedish design principles - incredibly simple and straightforward and yet so complete (unlike the ortofons). For example the replacement filters are attached right to the instruction manual where the procedure of replacing them is described. Pretty cool. And the number of accessories per unit volume is just off the charts. It's really how Ikea would've packaged a set of earphones, and more.


----------



## grokit

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Au contraire, I did. But there's a fine line between style and excess, and for me the Ortofons cross it. 

 The Jays packaging is the epitome of swedish design principles - incredibly simple and straightforward and yet so complete (unlike the ortofons)._

 

But you were speaking of packaging in the original quote and not accessories, yes? 

 For me there is no contest on the packaging; one is a very good job of retail plastic and the other elevates above that entirely, into the realm of a fine watch.


----------



## Inks

Would be cool if you get to review old heavyweights like the shure s530 or UE Triple fi 10.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Sennheiser CX300 and CX250. CX300s should make a good baseline for those familiar with them while the CX250s are quite good in their own right. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Inks* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Would be cool if you get to review old heavyweights like the shure s530 or UE Triple fi 10._

 

I have the TF10 but they've been reviewed to death so I wasn't planning on adding them, at least not until I'm done with all of the interesting stuff. I will eventually 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## rawrster

looks like the cx250 is better than the cx300. kinda strange how the model numbers dont look that way 

 oh you got a bold tag messed up in the cx250 section in the value area i think.


----------



## iPoodz

Hey |joker|!

 I have nothing valuable to add (except, to tell you that your writeups are excellent, as usual), but I was curious about your ADDIEMs.

 I was lurking, and clicked your profile, and did a double take (or three). Did you re-cable out of necessity, or in the hopes of getting a better sound?


----------



## kjk1281

Ah, the update I've been waiting for! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Actually, I really enjoyed your assessment of the CX300. Even though I'm not too crazy about them myself, I've always felt that most reviews of that particular canalphone have always gravitated toward two extremes: either "This is worst I've ever heard" or "OMG awesome!" It seems that yours and ClieOS' reviews are the only two on the Internet that are objective.


  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_looks like the cx250 is better than the cx300. kinda strange how the model numbers dont look that way _

 

Sennheiser should of called it the CX320 or something similar (since CX350's already taken). Once I achieved the right fit, I was quite pleased at how much better the CX250 sounded when compared to the CX300, at least to my ears.

 To make the numbers even more confusing, there's another Sennheiser, the CX150, that sounds very similar to the CX250, and therefore also better than the CX300.


----------



## rawrster

well their model numbers dont make sense. its like they put numbers in a hat and drew from it to determine what it should be. I don't have too many iem's at that price range but I enjoyed the CX300..until I got something better (so more expensive)but they are one of my 3 or 4 iem's that I had that was in the 20 dollar or so range.


----------



## mvw2

Oh, the big 60. You're getting old.


----------



## slntdth93

little typo in your CX250 review on the comfort rating and forgot the [ for [/B]


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iPoodz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have nothing valuable to add (except, to tell you that your writeups are excellent, as usual), but I was curious about your ADDIEMs.

 I was lurking, and clicked your profile, and did a double take (or three). Did you re-cable out of necessity, or in the hopes of getting a better sound?_

 

Out of necessity - the cable on mine went one side. Now they've got an ex-Meelec M6 cable. No more microphonics, no more microphone, no more straight plug 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kjk1281* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Ah, the update I've been waiting for! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Actually, I really enjoyed your assessment of the CX300. Even though I'm not too crazy about them myself, I've always felt that most reviews of that particular canalphone have always gravitated toward two extremes: either "This is worst I've ever heard" or "OMG awesome!" It seems that yours and ClieOS' reviews are the only two on the Internet that are objective._

 

Thanks. I really found them rather inoffensive. Not giant-killers by any means but an ok listen just the same.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kjk1281* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Sennheiser should of called it the CX320 or something similar (since CX350's already taken). Once I achieved the right fit, I was quite pleased at how much better the CX250 sounded when compared to the CX300, at least to my ears.

 To make the numbers even more confusing, there's another Sennheiser, the CX150, that sounds very similar to the CX250, and therefore also better than the CX300._

 

And to add further to the confusion there is the CX200, which AFAIK is just a CX150 in silver. So no differentiating them by second model digit, either. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mvw2* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Oh, the big 60. You're getting old. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

It seems that I am reaching life expectancy here. Hard drive crash today took the next half-dozen reviews with it. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *slntdth93* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_little typo in your CX250 review on the comfort rating and forgot the [ for [/B]_

 

Thanks, fixed.


----------



## rawrster

that sucks about the hard drive crash  too bad you didn't back it up

 well if you were asian 60 is a pretty big age for them so might not be as bad otherwise


----------



## mvw2

The nice thing about harddrives is the data is still there. Being able to get it depends upon what happened.

 At least you already wrote them once. The next time gets easier.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mvw2* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_The nice thing about harddrives is the data is still there. Being able to get it depends upon what happened.

 At least you already wrote them once. The next time gets easier._

 

Unfortunately no coming back from this one. Power surge toasted the controller on the drive, at least from what I'm hearing. Unless I can find a drive with an identical PCB (down to the firmware version) and succeed in a transplant I'm SOL.

 Latest backup is about 3 weeks old, which is quite outdated with my pacing in terms of work and reviews. But at least the music/movie library is 99.9% intact.

 It's ironic - for the past eight years or so I've been extremely fastidious about keeping nothing I couldn't stand to lose on the boot partition (since windows, especially in the early days of XP, croaked and took the boot partition with it quite often). But the secondary partition I've considered extremely safe, not backing it up as often. Never counted on a mechanical failure. 

 And yes, I am really hoping to be able to rewrite the reviews from memory. Especially for the CK100, which was long and convoluted.


----------



## Bennyboy71

^ Damn, that sucks the big one mate. Hope you manage to retrieve most if not all of the data you lost from your own internal brain drive.

 I'm really keen to hear what you have to say about the CK100s - as a proud owner of the CK10s - which really are the best thing since sliced bread with peanut butter on - I'm curious how their big brother stacks up against them.

 Any wee teasers you can offer? Good, bad, ugly?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Bennyboy71* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I'm really keen to hear what you have to say about the CK100s - as a proud owner of the CK10s - which really are the best thing since sliced bread with peanut butter on - I'm curious how their big brother stacks up against them.

 Any wee teasers you can offer? Good, bad, ugly?_

 

Well I can tell you that 'ugly' is definitely not applicable. I think the Ck100 is the only IEM that I truly hate. I hate them for being so expensive. I hate them for being so picky about source matching. And most of all I hate them for being more enjoyable than my CK10s, but only if they like what they're plugged into. If I had a source portable enough for daily use that mated well with the CK100, I would consider selling one of my kidneys and picking them up.

 I'll spend the next few weeks rummaging by brain for the review.


----------



## rawrster

What a teaser post  The CK100 being more enjoyable than the CK10 is pretty big coming from you ;p

 They definitely are expensive. Even if you were to use a forwarding service it would be $350 which would easily be the more expensive than anything I've bought.


----------



## AwakenedBeing

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_What a teaser post  The CK100 being more enjoyable than the CK10 is pretty big coming from you ;p

 They definitely are expensive. Even if you were to use a forwarding service it would be $350 which would easily be the more expensive than anything I've bought._

 

If you are patient enough and willing to check frequently, a used pair can be had for very cheap. In Japan, I have seen used pairs go for as low as $220 and up to $280. The CK100 is still cheaper brand new than brands like Westone, Ultimate Ears, and Shures outside the U.S.

 All I can say is I got very lucky on pricing. I couldn't be any happier!


----------



## rawrster

Oh that's not too bad of a price since brand new they are cheaper than a W3 brand new if I go through Japan. I don't think I'll be buying anything expensive (which these are) until the x-jays comes out and see if I'm buying those or saving up for customs. Hopefully nothing can tempt me before that


----------



## Mdraluck23

Great reviews, I can't believe how much that must have cost you.... Is the difference in clarity between the s4's and the RE0's really so great? I have some s4's and IMHO, they are pretty great. I'm kind of a newbie, and looking to purchase the RE0's if the are really much better.


----------



## rawrster

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mdraluck23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Is the difference in clarity between the s4's and the RE0's really so great?_

 

Yes the RE0 is much clearer. However keep in mind that the S4 and RE0 have different sound signatures. They are so different you could even argue that they are completely opposite. The RE0 is much more balanced while the S4 is anything but balanced. The S4 is warmer and lots more bass quantity than the RE0. I don't know what kind of phone you are looking for but be sure the RE0 is something you would like since being a superior phone doesn't always mean you can enjoy it.


----------



## Mdraluck23

I am using the s4's with a slight boost to the high end... I must say they are the best IEMs I have ever owned but that's not saying much, I have never even known anyone with Headphones over the 50$ price range... I have been consistently moving up in quality (or lack thereof) since my first ipod earbuds... to some "skullcandy", to some old phillips, etc... up to the koss PortaPros and the S4's.

 I dont really know how high the scale goes... If that makes sense.... Some favorite artists are Pink Floyd, Coldplay, Jack Johnson, Weezer (old stuff), really any kind of music. I don't *think* I have the need or want for a lot of bass. Sometimes I feel that the S4's have too much. I like the sound of the PortaPro's. I know its hard to comare, but is that more like what the RE0's sound like?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mdraluck23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I am using the s4's with a slight boost to the high end... I must say they are the best IEMs I have ever owned but that's not saying much, I have never even known anyone with Headphones over the 50$ price range... I have been consistently moving up in quality (or lack thereof) since my first ipod earbuds... to some "skullcandy", to some old phillips, etc... up to the koss PortaPros and the S4's.

 I dont really know how high the scale goes... If that makes sense.... Some favorite artists are Pink Floyd, Coldplay, Jack Johnson, Weezer (old stuff), really any kind of music. I don't *think* I have the need or want for a lot of bass. Sometimes I feel that the S4's have too much. I like the sound of the PortaPro's. I know its hard to comare, but is that more like what the RE0's sound like?_

 

Rawrster is right - the RE0 is very, very different from the S4. If you're serious about audio I could almost recommend picking it up to try both side-by-side to see exactly what you like. Compared to the RE0 your portapros will sound muddy and unrefined and your S4s will sound colored and unbalanced. However, it may turn out that the S4s are closer to your preferred signature, which would be good to know.

 My collection includes all of the artists you've listed and I happen to think the RE0 works exceptionally well for them, but then I vastly prefer the RE0 to the S4 to begin with. If you find the S4 bass excessive, the RE0 should help.


----------



## Mdraluck23

They seem excellent. Haven't heard any bad reviews. They seem like a nice change. I will be buying them most likely. Would you suggest an amp for them? Or is that not necessary with an iPod. I don't need maximum volume.


----------



## aabottom

I finaly bought my Head-Direct RE0. I'll be using them for plane trips and portable audio. I'm looking forward to hearing how they sound plugged into my new Levono W500 laptop PC. 

 The only decent headphones I can compare them to are my newly acquired Senn. HD650. Stay tuned.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Mdraluck23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_They seem excellent. Haven't heard any bad reviews. They seem like a nice change. I will be buying them most likely. Would you suggest an amp for them? Or is that not necessary with an iPod. I don't need maximum volume._

 

I would suggest running them without an amp first. If you find yourself liking the signature and end up selling the S4, you can invest in an amp. IMO you'd have to spend around $90-100 to get a decent pairing with the RE0. None of the <$20 Fiio toys will do.


----------



## ljokerl

Finally had a chance to take a pic of the post-op ADDIEMs, for anyone curious. 







  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *iPoodz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I have nothing valuable to add (except, to tell you that your writeups are excellent, as usual), but I was curious about your ADDIEMs.

 I was lurking, and clicked your profile, and did a double take (or three). Did you re-cable out of necessity, or in the hopes of getting a better sound?_


----------



## TheGame21x

Interesting operation you did there on the ADDIEMs. Any thoughts on how they sound after the procedure versus before?


----------



## JxK

ADDIEM with meelectronics cable and triple flanges? Nicely done. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 @TheGame21x
 There won't be any direct sound difference, but because the cable is so much less microphonic you will get a defacto improvement when on the move.


----------



## rawrster

that's a nice recable. good thing you didn't choose the M6 cable (version 2 was the one I had at least) as the M9 cable looks much better


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheGame21x* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Interesting operation you did there on the ADDIEMs. Any thoughts on how they sound after the procedure versus before?_

 

I'm not a big believer in cables but I can't say for sure since I also took the chance to perform _goodvibes_ nail polish mod while I had them opened up. Two variables mean I have no clue how each one affected the sound, but the overall effect is positive 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Trip flanges help too, though they tickle my brain. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_that's a nice recable. good thing you didn't choose the M6 cable (version 2 was the one I had at least) as the M9 cable looks much better_

 

Actually that is an M6 v2 cable. The M9/M11 cable is different, terminated with a 45-degree plug rather than the low-profile L-plug that I like. Meelec cords are color-matched to their earphones so the black/red M6/M11/M9 have the dark grey cable while the silver/clear M6/M11/M9 have the silver cable.


----------



## ljokerl

ATH-CK100 added. So much for keeping my blurbs short and sweet


----------



## 12345142

Great thread! I check it infrequently and enjoy reading your reviews. 
 Not to sound intrusive, but could you consider reviewing the Phiaton PS200? I personally enjoy my pair quite a bit, and they're reportedly similar to the CK10s. It's a shame that they were $130 on Amazon a week or so ago, seeing as the price has risen to $180 as of late.


----------



## a_tumiwa

i hope you change your plan from review hippo shroom to hippo VB , many people prefer vb than shroom


----------



## mvw2

You make the CK100 sound kind of like the SE530.


----------



## rawrster

I wish I knew what the SE530 sounded like to respond to that 

 I'll have to read that long writeup on the CK100 soonish..They are pretty ridiculously expensive however. Even with a forwarding service its $360 which makes it too expensive 

 on another note, any interest in the alpha brainwavz? i got them bundled up in a purchase recently and probably got no plans to use them or probably even open the plastic wrapping since I got no use for them and seeing as you got like a trillion budget iem's.


----------



## ovo

I bought the REO's after reading the reviews here after having 3 pairs of cx300's breaking in just over a year and these are what I compare the REO's to, that and my HD280's.

 First off their sensitivity is WAY less than the cx-300's (100dB vs.112dB) This is a huge difference and so their max volume is also less and if you are like myself, using them with your phone, this is a deal breaker in itself because walking down a street at peak hour they just arent loud enough, not to mention I am draining my battery faster. Admittedly my nokia n82's amp is under powered but so are a lot of phones.

 Moving on to the sound, the REO's definitely respond more to dynamics in music and fidelity is better generally than the cx300's which I liked but the mid to upper range is without a doubt far to emphasized making cranking choruses with singers pushing the point just plain painful to listen too.

 The bass?....well there isnt much, I like what my sub does for music bellow a 100hz and the RE0's just dont represent it accurately/enough below around 70hz , especially emphasized against the inflated mids and while the cx300 bass is a little over done and loose at least it has some that u can tame with eq if u wish, increasing bass with eq is not as good a solution for the REO's, I had to push my eq to 80% to get a track of mine I am mixing to a close approximation of what it should sound like with the sub bass melody.

 A big part of the reason IEM has taken off is because of the increased bass they are capable of compared to earbuds, I have earbuds with more bass than the REO's.

 The high's are nice enough but sibilance is a problem as u move into the mids on some tracks.

 Music making and mixing is my life so it is with at least some experience I make these comments, that and I have seen how damaged ears perceive sound in the mid range with the desire for terribly inflated mid/highs that result from it and continue to damage those ears. This is an important point to consider when it comes to IEM's while they inject the sound right into your ear drums.

 I am still 'breaking in' the REO's but I cant see this changing much of the above and while the cx300's are nothing special in regards to creating space/detail/dynamics they are still a better solution (while they work) than the REO's and I will now never buy another pair of IEM's under 110dB sensitivity. The RE3's seem like the next thing to try.

 the search for a decent pair of IEM's at a sane price continues.


----------



## james444

Congrats again joker, your CK100 review is excellently written and spot-on! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mvw2* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You make the CK100 sound kind of like the SE530._

 

Don't make the mistake of interpreting it this way. Apart from both being 3-driver BAs, these don't have much in common.


----------



## james444

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ovo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I bought the REO's after reading the reviews here after having 3 pairs of cx300's breaking in just over a year and these are what I compare the REO's to, that and my HD280's.

 First off their sensitivity is WAY less than the cx-300's (100dB vs.112dB) This is a huge difference and so their max volume is also less and if you are like myself, using them with your phone, this is a deal breaker in itself because walking down a street at peak hour they just arent loud enough, not to mention I am draining my battery faster. Admittedly my nokia n82's amp is under powered but so are a lot of phones.

 Moving on to the sound, the REO's definitely respond more to dynamics in music and fidelity is better generally than the cx300's which I liked but the mid to upper range is without a doubt far to emphasized making cranking choruses with singers pushing the point just plain painful to listen too.

 The bass?....well there isnt much, I like what my sub does for music bellow a 100hz and the RE0's just dont represent it accurately/enough below around 70hz , especially emphasized against the inflated mids and while the cx300 bass is a little over done and loose at least it has some that u can tame with eq if u wish, increasing bass with eq is not as good a solution for the REO's, I had to push my eq to 80% to get a track of mine I am mixing to a close approximation of what it should sound like with the sub bass melody.

 A big part of the reason IEM has taken off is because of the increased bass they are capable of compared to earbuds, I have earbuds with more bass than the REO's.

 The high's are nice enough but sibilance is a problem as u move into the mids on some tracks.

 Music making and mixing is my life so it is with at least some experience I make these comments, that and I have seen how damaged ears perceive sound in the mid range with the desire for terribly inflated mid/highs that result from it and continue to damage those ears. This is an important point to consider when it comes to IEM's while they inject the sound right into your ear drums.

 I am still 'breaking in' the REO's but I cant see this changing much of the above and while the cx300's are nothing special in regards to creating space/detail/dynamics they are still a better solution (while they work) than the REO's and I will now never buy another pair of IEM's under 110dB sensitivity. The RE3's seem like the next thing to try.

 the search for a decent pair of IEM's at a sane price continues._

 

Not meaning to recommend the HJE900 (they are just 100db), nevertheless you might be interested in reading this and my subsequent reply.

 BTW from your description I believe that you would like the $50 Soundmagic PL50, even though their sensitivity is only 109db.


----------



## AwakenedBeing

Thanks for the CK100 review! Also, Seyo-Shop has a lower price by $20-$30 compared to hovanfue.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *12345142* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Great thread! I check it infrequently and enjoy reading your reviews. 
 Not to sound intrusive, but could you consider reviewing the Phiaton PS200? I personally enjoy my pair quite a bit, and they're reportedly similar to the CK10s. It's a shame that they were $130 on Amazon a week or so ago, seeing as the price has risen to $180 as of late._

 

Yes, I am quite curious about both Phiaton IEMs, especially now that I own their MS400 headphones. A lot of good gear around, though, so I'll have to decide what to focus on as soon as I'm done with my planned reviews.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *a_tumiwa* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i hope you change your plan from review hippo shroom to hippo VB , many people prefer vb than shroom 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

Hah, the IEMs on that list are sets that I own already and are just waiting for my ears in my desk. If I could magically turn the Shroom into a VB I would, preferably after reviewing it as a Shroom 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mvw2* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_You make the CK100 sound kind of like the SE530._

 

 Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I wish I knew what the SE530 sounded like to respond to that _

 

I've never heard the SE530 either but from what I've read they really aren't very similar. Then again, the SE530 is a pretty polarizing earphone. I've seen some people call them complete garbage and others who prefer them over mid-range customs. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_on another note, any interest in the alpha brainwavz? i got them bundled up in a purchase recently and probably got no plans to use them or probably even open the plastic wrapping since I got no use for them and seeing as you got like a trillion budget iem's._

 

Sure, I can add them to the review and send them back, though not right now as I'm completely swamped. I guess mp4nation still sells them separately so some people may have interest in them. I know mark likes them. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *james444* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Congrats again joker, your CK100 review is excellently written and spot-on! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Don't make the mistake of interpreting it this way. Apart from both being 3-driver BAs, these don't have much in common._

 

Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I take it the SE530 may not exactly be up my alley, not being a treble-heavy IEM.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *AwakenedBeing* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Thanks for the CK100 review! Also, Seyo-Shop has a lower price by $20-$30 compared to hovanfue._

 

Thanks, I'll lower the pricing a little. Keep forgetting that Seyo prices aren't catalogued by Froogle.


----------



## mark2410

re the alpha brainwavz ^

 yes i do like them, easily the nicest "stock" earphone ive heard.


----------



## rawrster

maybe i should open the packaging then and see for myself for a couple days. I'm not that interested in them but hopefully I'll be surprised.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mark2410* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_re the alpha brainwavz ^

 yes i do like them, easily the nicest "stock" earphone ive heard._

 

Hmm... my S:Flo2 came with some crummy conventional buds. You'd think they'd at least throw a set of the Alphas in with their priciest portable...


----------



## germanturkey

nice ck100 review. "best IEM i've ever heard." quite a claim for someone who has heard as many as you. i don't have a variety of sources, so i'll "settle" with ck10s


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Impressive review here, good job |joker|.


----------



## mvw2

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *germanturkey* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_nice ck100 review. "best IEM i've ever heard." quite a claim for someone who has heard as many as you. i don't have a variety of sources, so i'll "settle" with ck10s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 

That statement is questionable. The more I try out new earphones the more I realize there are a lot of outstanding products out there. I have come to the realization that once you step to a certain point, better becomes a relative term. You start getting to a point where the earphones are largely lack flaws. Better or best begins to be a matter of personal preference more than absolute capability. I've used a slew of "top level" earphones as well as a slew of "high end" earphones, heck, even a number of mid level earphones, and for each one I can say it does X better than any other. However, I have an increasingly hard time saying earphone A is absolutely better than earphone B, or C or D or E for that matter. Once a piece of hardware lacks significant flaws, only personal preference is left.

 I love reviews. It gives another individual a glimpse at products they have yet to own. It's a great way to get an interpretation of a product without actually owning the product. At the same time I can subjectively rank various products on a scale of performance based on desired traits. Yet in the end I always see person impressions to come down to a basic matter of flaw or incapability and personal preference in sound characteristics. The best is a product that is minimally flawed and that fits your personal tastes to a T. That is the best for you. The downside is it is not the best for someone else.

 The hardest part about finding the right hardware is finding the one that creates the sound you find ideal.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *HeadphoneAddict* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Impressive review here, good job |joker|._

 

Thanks. Big fan of your work, too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *mvw2* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_That statement is questionable. The more I try out new earphones the more I realize there are a lot of outstanding products out there. I have come to the realization that once you step to a certain point, better becomes a relative term. You start getting to a point where the earphones are largely lack flaws. Better or best begins to be a matter of personal preference more than absolute capability. 

 [...]

 The hardest part about finding the right hardware is finding the one that creates the sound you find ideal._

 

Totally agree with this. Words like 'better' and 'best' should be taken subjectively when it comes to a lot of the high-end earphones. I've thought about this when positioning things on my scale. As a general rule, differences within +/- 1 point of each other are subject to personal preferences to determine the ultimate order. Beyond that I think absolute technical capabilities take a toll, though there are still lower-end earphones that do particular things amazingly well.


----------



## rawrster

I thought that was pretty obvious when joker said the CK100 was the best he heard. I've listened to a majority of the same high up there universal iem's that joker has and the CK100 definitely doesn't rank as high on my preferences but still up there so it does show it is all up to preferences. CK10 is still number one for me and I await the day it will be brought down to #2


----------



## NapalmK

Wow thanks for this incredible review. It was extremely helpful. I finally ended up with the CK10's. Awesome job. Congrats!


----------



## mark2410

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hmm... my S:Flo2 came with some crummy conventional buds. You'd think they'd at least throw a set of the Alphas in with their priciest portable..._

 

i thought they had stopped making them tbh but id rather things didint come with buds. i alwayse resent thing being bundled i dont want with things i do but thats just me


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I thought that was pretty obvious when joker said the CK100 was the best he heard. I've listened to a majority of the same high up there universal iem's that joker has and the CK100 definitely doesn't rank as high on my preferences but still up there so it does show it is all up to preferences. CK10 is still number one for me and I await the day it will be brought down to #2 _

 

I tried to convey how temperamental the CK100 is but perhaps I should have written a slightly more schizophrenic review. IMO at their best they can very nearly match the CK10s on strengths and really capitalize on the few (relative) weaknesses of the CK10. At their average they don't quite measure up in a few key areas. 

 I am also still waiting on the one to beat the CK10 as an all-rounder. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *NapalmK* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Wow thanks for this incredible review. It was extremely helpful. I finally ended up with the CK10's. Awesome job. Congrats!_

 

Great, hope you like them


----------



## rawrster

The CK10 is definitely a good choice. The CK100 definitely weren't as good to me. The mids were a bit too forward for me which I don't like as much. If only the CK10 had it's brothers cable 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I am hoping my most recent purchase surpasses the CK10 but not I'm not expecting it to so I like to be surprised. I won't get it for 3 weeks or so but I'll find out in around a month.


----------



## germanturkey

^^ recent purchase being? i'm fairly sure you already have the e-q7s right? i pains me to think that if AT had tuned up the bass just slightly, the ck10s would be crazy good. at least when i think about the pain i had to go through to get these, i say now, its sooo worth it.


----------



## rawrster

My signature is always up to date so those are what I have 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I bought the dual BA iem by fischer audio which should come in a couple weeks. I'm quite happy with the CK10 but it is nice to have different sounds. I was hoping my next purchase would be a dynamic driver to have it all in BA, Dynamic and Hybrid (or moving coil or w/e it's called) but it wasn't meant to be and none of the dynamics really interest me (I've tried most of the good ones).


----------



## mvw2

I'm quite fond of the RE252 and Eterna as far as dynamic IEMs go...and my OK1 as a bud. Frankly, I've held onto that bud over a lot of IEMs I've tried, and these newer dynamics like the RE252 and Eterna have really impressed me in terms of capability and range versus a lot of the older options. The tech just keeps getting better on both ends of the spectrum.


----------



## rawrster

Those are probably the dynamic driver iem that interests me the most but still not very high. They sound too much like what I have and I was hoping to have some variety but not sure if I would be able to enjoy a different sound that often to buy one. No rush to make a decision so maybe something new will come out in the future that will spark my interest. Maybe I'll pick up the Eternas one of these days since it is relatively cheap.


----------



## Tsengsta

Can anyone compare the Shure SE530's to the Original Monster turbines for

 Clarity
 Bass
 Soundstage
 ... etc

 I really want to know which one is the best overall thanks!


----------



## midoo1990

Excellent review of ck100 joker.I am not a big fan of AT sound mainly because it is treble oriented and very sharp to my ears,although I miss the unbelievably transparent sound of ck10.I am stil waiting for my um3x to arrive and they are supposed to be very forward in the midrange and all my iems and full headphones are recessed in mids.if I like that kind of forward sound,I may get ck100 because I miss the AT transparent sound although I am still afraid they will have the same metallic treble as ck10.


----------



## a_recording

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *midoo1990* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Excellent review of ck100 joker.I am not a big fan of AT sound mainly because it is treble oriented and very sharp to my ears,although I miss the unbelievably transparent sound of ck10.I am stil waiting for my um3x to arrive and they are supposed to be very forward in the midrange and all my iems and full headphones are recessed in mids.if I like that kind of forward sound,I may get ck100 because I miss the AT transparent sound although I am still afraid they will have the same metallic treble as ck10._

 

Consider the CK90 Pro, which should be similar to the CK10 but a bit more blunted. You can adjust the treble to your taste by removing the foam...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *midoo1990* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Excellent review of ck100 joker.I am not a big fan of AT sound mainly because it is treble oriented and very sharp to my ears,although I miss the unbelievably transparent sound of ck10.I am stil waiting for my um3x to arrive and they are supposed to be very forward in the midrange and all my iems and full headphones are recessed in mids.if I like that kind of forward sound,I may get ck100 because I miss the AT transparent sound although I am still afraid they will have the same metallic treble as ck10._

 

Thanks. Personally, I don't think the CK100 is as strident in the treble as the CK10, especially not with a warm source. The CK100 is more shiny than sparkly, if that makes any sense (it almost doesn't to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). But of course that midrange... it really makes or breaks the earphone depending on source and listener. 

 I agree with a_recording - the CK90Pro has less emphasized treble than the CK10/CK100 and a darker sound overall. But it's an odd one in that it has much harder-hitting bass but even shorter decay times than the CK10. I think the sound of the CK90Pro can potentially be more polarizing than that of the CK10 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## midoo1990

I am nearly set on ck100,I will get them at the end of the month and much later pico slim.


----------



## ljokerl

Update for today: Klipsch Custom 3

 Still getting back on track after my HDD crash but expect more updates in the coming week 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## bcpk

Seagate? Glad you're back up running.


----------



## ljokerl

^ yes. One day I will gather up all of my dead drives and ship them back to their respective manufacturers in black boxes.


----------



## mark2410

nice commentary on the kc3


----------



## EraserXIV

hm has the SQ rating for the RE0 and e-q7 changed? i remember the e-q7 being 10/10 and the RE0 being 9.5/10.

 just throwing a thought out there, but maybe when you change ratings, document it and give a reason as to why it changed. it may be helpful for people who are using the review as a guideline


----------



## Tsengsta

very good work Joker but but you also review the Shure SE530 and the Denon AHC751's thanks!


----------



## rawrster

Looks like some of the sound rankings were changed indeed. The e-Q7 was definitely a 10 previously but I guess it's subject to change as joker hears better iem's?

 The CK100 mids definitely make or break it for a user imo. It didn't break it for me but at the same time didn't make it. If I owned it for say a month I'm not sure I would like the mids compared to a shorter period of time since forward mids isn't something I like most of the time.

 The CK90PRO would be such a winner if it wasn't for that crappy cable. I have no idea how a company that makes the best iem cable imo in the CK100 and CK10 coming very close can make such a bad one in the CK90PRO when that one is supposed to be pretty up there in their iem products.


----------



## germanturkey

i haven't actually used the custom 3s, but if the cable is the same as the s4's, then yeah, it sucks. i thought it was passable when i used them, but the ck10 cable is so far ahead of it, its not even funny how they can make such a crappy cable, let alone put it on an expensive iem.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *EraserXIV* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_hm has the SQ rating for the RE0 and e-q7 changed? i remember the e-q7 being 10/10 and the RE0 being 9.5/10.

 just throwing a thought out there, but maybe when you change ratings, document it and give a reason as to why it changed. it may be helpful for people who are using the review as a guideline 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



_

 

The RE0 rating changed back when I added the e-Q7. Most ratings did. It's a relative scale and is meant to be comparative (in terms of 1 IEM vs another) rather than absolute. Rawrster is right - as I hear more IEMs I slot them in where I think they belong, which moves things around on occasion. I also use a second chart to approximate SQ scores and those get scaled differently as I add more IEMs. 

 The e-Q7 was always between a 9.5 and 10.0 but only today did I decide to add quarter-point gradients. It's a work in progress 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *germanturkey* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_i haven't actually used the custom 3s, but if the cable is the same as the s4's, then yeah, it sucks. i thought it was passable when i used them, but the ck10 cable is so far ahead of it, its not even funny how they can make such a crappy cable, let alone put it on an expensive iem._

 

No, different cable. The S4 cable is very soft and flexible, just extremely thin and plasticky. The Custom 1/2/3 cord is nylon-wrapped and not nearly as flexible or soft. It's strong but the nylon weave kinks a lot when the cable is bent, often permanently. Very frustrating IMO.


----------



## kingpage

Could you tell me what aspects of R03 are lacking compared to Monster Turbine and Cyclone PR1 Pro, ie what makes up the 0.25 difference.

 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *kingpage* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Could you tell me what aspects of R03 are lacking compared to Monster Turbine and Cyclone PR1 Pro, ie what makes up the 0.25 difference.

 Thanks_

 

The Cyclone has a very different signature that's hard to compare to the R03 but I listened to them back to back and felt that the PR1 Pro is technically superior. The Cyclone beats the R03 slightly in detail and clarity, has a more neutral tone, better top-end extension, and flatter bass. The PR1 also has more width to its sound than the R03. It's a far more analytical headphone but the large soundstage keeps it enjoyable and involving. On the other hand the R03 is smoother and warmer, with thicker-sounding vocals and more laid-back treble. It's a more instantly likeable and more forgiving signature. 

 The MTPG is similar to the R03 in balance but had more impressive sub-bass and less mid-range coloration than the R03. Not a huge difference and definitely no justification for the $180 MSRP, but it's there.


----------



## jjeremycai

Thanks for the Custom 3 addition! I have to agree with you that the cables suck.


----------



## Blu.

Hey joker, how would the TF10s and some of the more generic universal iems compare on this list? Thanks


----------



## TheWuss

joker - pardon me if this has already been asked - but, did fischer send you any of their IEMs for review?


----------



## bcpk

oh sh-


----------



## TheWuss

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bcpk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_oh sh-_

 

did i step in something there with my post, bcpk???


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Blu.* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Hey joker, how would the TF10s and some of the more generic universal iems compare on this list? Thanks_

 

I don't know why the TF10 is more generic than the ones on the list but the TF10 would be around a 9.5 in SQ. I have not used mine in a while as I (really) dislike the fit and they are last in line for review since there are so many posts on them out there already. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *TheWuss* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_joker - pardon me if this has already been asked - but, did fischer send you any of their IEMs for review?_

 

No, I have not received anything from Fischer. I don't normally go out of my way to contact manufacturers but I did contact Fischer back when ClieOS first reviewed the Eterna. However, they wouldn't even sell me a set back then. 

 @bcpk: huh?


----------



## bcpk

I was supposed to lend you Eternas for review, remember? I gave them back >_>


----------



## TheWuss

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bcpk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was supposed to lend you Eternas for review, remember? I gave them back >_>_

 

hahahaha. 
 instead of posting a "oh sh-", you should've done a "doh! *slaps forehead."


----------



## rawrster

Heh and here I thought TheWuss was onto something when I saw bcpk's respond :T I'm sure eventually someone will let you borrow some fischer audio iem's unless of course you already bought some.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *bcpk* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I was supposed to lend you Eternas for review, remember? I gave them back >_>_

 

Ah, that's quite alright. Shipping a $60 IEM 1/3 of the way around the world for a loan seems a bit excessive anyway. I'm sure I'll get my hands on them eventually if they stay popular. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Heh and here I thought TheWuss was onto something when I saw bcpk's respond :T I'm sure eventually someone will let you borrow some fischer audio iem's unless of course you already bought some._

 

Nope, I've throttled back my buying as my collection has really grown out of control and I'm having trouble selling off the stuff I did buy.


----------



## ljokerl

Yuin OK1 added


----------



## rawrster

Ah I was wondering when you were going to add that. Sounds like more of a good office earphone than anything.


----------



## 2rooi123

@joker: which earbud do you own or have experience with has the best build/sound/comfort quality? can be driven by any dap but preferably s:flo2


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *2rooi123* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_@joker: which earbud do you own or have experience with has the best build/sound/comfort quality? can be driven by any dap but preferably s:flo2_

 

My long-term experience with earbuds is limited to the Yuin PK3/OK1, Sennheiser MX760/471, and HiSoundAudio PAA-1. All earbuds are equally comfortable for me (i.e. so-so) and I generally don't like the form factor. That said, the OK1 is leagues above the others in overall SQ, as well it should be. The S:Flo2 drives them fine. Other DAPs can't.


----------



## 2rooi123

is the sound different when it is in-ear rather than just sitting outside your ear? it has a small hole at the center right?i want something as comfy as bose ie but with better sound


----------



## steagle

Just wanted to give my thanks for such an exhaustive, intelligent and helpful look into the world of IEM's. Your feedback was a big proponent in me making the switch from traditional headphones and earbuds to IEM's (at least for daily use). Do you publish these reviews anywhere outside of Head-Fi? This could easily be an entire magazine's worth of valuable info.


----------



## mvw2

Interesting approach with the OK1 from an IEM standpoint. I never liked them in that format and most other users have not either. I do find potential, but the end sound is extremely sensitive to the setup as you chose the level of seal and how much "ambient" sound there is and how much you pipe right in. I even toyed with sealing up the outer ring of holes with tape to see how it changed. I think with a lot of trial and error, you can shape the sound to a particular liking, but I find the plain old bud configuration a lot better.

 To answer 2rooi123, yes, it sounds quite a bit different. A lot of aspects change, not just freqency response but also presentation of space. The IEM form is...challenging, but the bud form is great.

 As Joker said, they are bright and bass is a weakness, but they do EQ very well if willing. In IEM form, it varies depending on setup. Heck, you can make it even bass heavy.

 And yes, the OK1 is hard to drive to the fullest. It does play fine off low power but with less fullness and a brighter tonality. An amp isn't a game changer but is a source of capability.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *2rooi123* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_is the sound different when it is in-ear rather than just sitting outside your ear? it has a small hole at the center right?i want something as comfy as bose ie but with better sound_

 

The OK1 can be used as an IEM but I would not recommend doing so if comfort is a priority - it's really not very ergonomic, certainly nowhere near as ergonomic as the Bose IE. At its best the OK1 is as comfortable as a conventional straight-barrel IEM (think RE0) with an earbud hanging off the back.

 Used as a conventional earbud the OK1s are as comfy as any other (iBud, PK3, etc) but isolation is nil. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *steagle* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_Just wanted to give my thanks for such an exhaustive, intelligent and helpful look into the world of IEM's. Your feedback was a big proponent in me making the switch from traditional headphones and earbuds to IEM's (at least for daily use). Do you publish these reviews anywhere outside of Head-Fi? This could easily be an entire magazine's worth of valuable info._

 

Thanks, glad the thread was helpful. 90% of the reviews are unique to this thread. A handful are abridged versions of full reviews I have written for other sites and a half-dozen or so are carryovers from my older full reviews here at head-fi. I publish other stuff around the web on occasion, like the S:Flo2 review I posted yesterday over at mp4nation






.


----------



## 2rooi123

how about blox tm5? looks like competition and the reviews are great. have you tried them?


----------



## 2rooi123

@joker: fantastic review on s:flo2! now i cant wait for the 3rd batch to arrive!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *2rooi123* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_how about blox tm5? looks like competition and the reviews are great. have you tried them?_

 

Nope. My interest in earbuds pretty much stops with the 'convertible' OK1. My need for isolation was confirmed during my stint with the OK1 and some of the other less-isolating IEMs I've been using lately. 

  Quote:


  Originally Posted by *2rooi123* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_@joker: fantastic review on s:flo2! now i cant wait for the 3rd batch to arrive!_

 

Thanks


----------



## Pianist

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_My long-term experience with earbuds is limited to the Yuin PK3/OK1, Sennheiser MX760/471, and HiSoundAudio PAA-1. All earbuds are equally comfortable for me (i.e. so-so) and I generally don't like the form factor. That said, the OK1 is leagues above the others in overall SQ, as well it should be. The S:Flo2 drives them fine. *Other DAPs can't*._

 

I heard AMP3 can drive it well too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *Pianist* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_I heard AMP3 can drive it well too._

 

Oh I've no doubt that it can. But I think you'll agree that the AMP3 is more the exception than the rule.


----------



## nekromantik

For electronic music(mainly house and breakbeat) without a amp which one headphones are better...Nuforce NE6 or Maximo iM-590?

 thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


  Originally Posted by *nekromantik* /img/forum/go_quote.gif 
_For electronic music(mainly house and breakbeat) without a amp which one headphones are better...Nuforce NE6 or Maximo iM-590?_

 

I generally find the Maximos to be the more capable earphone and electronica would be no exception. Neither one needs an amp. The Nuforces are a bit more isolating and slightly friendlier if you plan to wear them cable-down but other than that I prefer the iM-590 all-around.


----------



## ljokerl

Wow, I'm impressed that this thread is still in order. I had a nightmare last night about the switch disabling BBCode and me having to re-do all of the formatting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Also, lost my Supremus title.


----------



## nekromantik

Ok Thanks
  Will need to save up for these then as I cant seem to find them anywhere in the UK so need to import 
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *nekromantik* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> ...


----------



## Marcus_C

Very nice review of the orto e-q7, thanks for that. btw: your "jump to" links are not working at the moment I assume because of the changeover as they used to work fine, just FYI.


----------



## bcpk

I'm feeling very Web 2.0, have a thumbs up.


----------



## rawrster

@joker:Well then you lost access to the Supremus forum  I recently edited my post somewhere else and if that is any indication have fun editing stuff when you add a new review 
   
  now..to figure out how to quote people here lol


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





marcus_c said:


> Very nice review of the orto e-q7, thanks for that. btw: your "jump to" links are not working at the moment I assume because of the changeover as they used to work fine, just FYI.


 


  Ah, thanks, links fixed. New post addressing will have ruined all permalinks across the whole site 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> @joker:Well then you lost access to the Supremus forum  I recently edited my post somewhere else and if that is any indication have fun editing stuff when you add a new review
> 
> now..to figure out how to quote people here lol


 

  You have no idea. Editing those six permalinks took me half an hour. Since BBCode is disabled anything I paste into a message box loses all formatting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Looks like I'll either have to do all my editing in-thread from now on (ugh) or write everything in plain html. I'm probably a bit rusty, too. Never thought I'd have a use for html again...
   
  Oh and the biggest problem: there doesn't seem to be a way to edit thread titles so this thread is stuck at 63 IEMs/Yuin OK1


----------



## Andrew H

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Also, lost my Supremus title.


 
   
  That's ok, we'll still love you. (Can I borrow 20 bucks?)


----------



## Silenced

Please review the fisher Audio Fischer Audio's DBA-02.  You rule! thanks Joker!


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> ... Since BBCode is disabled anything I paste into a message box loses all formatting
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 That's my biggest problem/s with the new forums. A real pain in the but! I got so used to using bbc coding, html is epic fail for me.
  PS: Not being able to change topic titles is also epic fail.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


andrew h said:


> That's ok, we'll still love you. (Can I borrow 20 bucks?)


   
  Only if I get a prototype iM-790. I promise I won't tell 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Quote:


silenced said:


> Please review the fisher Audio Fischer Audio's DBA-02.  You rule! thanks Joker!


 
 Sorry, no plans to review any FA products yet. They are really sloppy with responding to email.

 Quote:


hero kid said:


> Quote:
> 
> That's my biggest problem/s with the new forums. A real pain in the but! I got so used to using bbc coding, html is epic fail for me.
> PS: Not being able to change topic titles is also epic fail.


 
 Theres a feature request in regarding thread titles so hopefully that can get done soon. Multi-quoting is a pain though and the lack of BB code doesn't seem like it can be remedied.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

hi|
  well I'm new to this quality sound.
  I bought an hd600 for gaming/movie/music, so I wouldn't upgrade. Now I have them, I can't stop listening to music, despite using them with creative extigy and bravo audio tube amp.
   
  now I want to have something portable that would give similar quality. I have bought the Koss portapro to begin at the portable headphones. I was just curious, for so long i've heard they are the best bang for buch cheapeness headphones
   
  Now I want something close to my hd600, but in IEM form, what do you advice, I have a sony ericsson hbh-ds980 that seems to be close to sennheiser cx300.
  So i want something that would be better. I like to have some bass. let's say at least like my hd600. 
  I listen mostly to hip hop, pop rock.
  I've been thinking about head-direct re0, but do they have less bass than my hd600???
  Where do you buy the fischer audio eterna? I've searched but not found them nowhere
  Well I am not going to spend over 100 dollars​


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> Now I want something close to my hd600, but in IEM form, what do you advice, I have a sony ericsson hbh-ds980 that seems to be close to sennheiser cx300.
> So i want something that would be better. I like to have some bass. let's say at least like my hd600.
> I listen mostly to hip hop, pop rock.
> I've been thinking about head-direct re0, but do they have less bass than my hd600???
> ...


   

 It's been a long time since I've heard the HD600, about six months. I know there was at least one member here who considered a well-amped RE0 to be an HD600 equivalent, but I can't vouch for that myself. However, you get a 30-day return period with them and if you really find yourself enjoying the highly detailed and resolved sound of the HD600, the RE0s might surprise you. The Soundmagic PL50, Thinksound Rain, and ViSang R02/R03 may also be worth considering. All three have at least slightly more aggressive bass than the RE0.
   
  I haven't heard them myself so I can't comment on the SQ but I think you can buy the Eterna via ethan's store (budgenaudio.com) or import them from russia via ebay. But FWIR they should have significantly more bass than the HD600.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> mcnoiserdc said:
> ...


 

 thanks for answering.
   
  Then I'll go for fisher eterna or head-direct re0, depending on which I find. Eternas seem to be out of stock everywhere and head-direct re0 if I buy from US I'd have to pay customs. 
   
  One question, if head-direct re0 happens to have low bass, the bass boost of a fiio e5 would be a good way to improve it?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> Then I'll go for fisher eterna or head-direct re0, depending on which I find. Eternas seem to be out of stock everywhere and head-direct re0 if I buy from US I'd have to pay customs.
> 
> One question, if head-direct re0 happens to have low bass, the bass boost of a fiio e5 would be a good way to improve it?


 
 Technically, yes - an E5 will boost the RE0 in the lower reaches. Personally I don't think this is worth doing as with a decent source you'll just be introducing a medium-quality link into your audio chain. If you already have an E5 by all means try it out. Otherwise I'd maybe think about saving up for used iBasso T4 or something of that sort. 
   
  Oh and the RE0 ships from China if you order through Head-Direct. Customs fees probably still apply but just something to be aware of nonetheless.


----------



## grokit

The Arrow with its variable bass boost feature is a definite step up from the E5 as well


----------



## Tsengsta

@joker I currently have the Monster turbine and I was thinking seriously about upgrading to the Monster turbine pro coppers for $280 is it really worth it? can you compare soundstage,isolation,sq etc. thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


tsengsta said:


> @joker I currently have the Monster turbine and I was thinking seriously about upgrading to the Monster turbine pro coppers for $280 is it really worth it? can you compare soundstage,isolation,sq etc. thanks


   
  What is it that you'd like to improve about your Turbines? Please note that my Turbine Pros are the Golds, not the Coppers. Still, they aren't as bass-heavy as the original Turbines - just something to be aware of. Cleaner and flatter - yes. Bassier - no.
   
  Soundstaging is definitely better in the Golds - the regular Turbines tend to compress everything closer to the listener while the Golds have fairly even spacing. Isolation is the same except for the fact that you get a lot of nice tips with the Golds. IMO the tri-flanges are still the most isolating and they are exactly the same on both. I certainly like the Golds better overall but $280 is a bit of a stretch IMO. But of course to you they are worth whatever you're willing to pay for them - at the $200+ level value is a personal thing. Not sure if the Coppers are objectively better or just a different flavor of the same sound but that's my 2c.


----------



## rawrster

I haven't heard the Turbines but all indications points to it being a decent phone at their price level and not at the top of the earphone levels.
   
  I have heard the top 3 Monster offerings in the MD,Golds and Coppers. The Coppers are indeed different than the Golds in not only signature but build quality. The cable material on the Coppers are more of a rubbery type material and overall not as good as the Golds. The most noticeable difference between the two are the bass and treble. The Golds have more bass in both quantity and impact. The treble on the Coppers are much better with details being more easily distinguished with the Coppers. The Coppers are the more neutral one but still fall on the fun side of things with the Golds being bass monsters. Isolation on both are the same since the housings are identical except for color.
   
  Are they worth $280? That's something only you and your wallet can decide.


----------



## clarinetman

Sorry if this has already been answered, but what tips do you have on the Ortos in the picture?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


clarinetman said:


> Sorry if this has already been answered, but what tips do you have on the Ortos in the picture?


   
  Sennheiser bi-flanges.


----------



## Tsengsta

@rawrster how is the coppers soundstage compared to the golds?


----------



## Xtrem

Hello guys.. I bumped into this epic thread while I was searching for a brand.. My problem indeed is that I have a pair of in-ear headphones which I can't find the brand of and I wouldn't be so interested if their sound wasn't so nice.. Now since they're so great and I lost one of the triple-flange tips (which are pretty interesting) I seriously want to either get a new pair of them or just pick new tips.. So.. I took some pictures of them and noticed the logo on their back got a little scraped off, I just hope this isn't a big problem.. The jack is gold plated and they're full metal so I wouldn't say they're made by an unknown brand..

 Anyways, here are the pictures:


   

   


 Well.. That's it.. I'm in your hands guys.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Ps: I also remember to have old pictures with the intact logo on a friend's of mine pc so I'll eventually upload them later, in the meanwhile I tried to quickly repair the first picture (by hand drawing it in photoshop)..


----------



## Xtrem

Hello guys.. I bumped into this epic thread while searching for a brand.. My problem indeed is that I have a pair of earphones which I can't find the brand of.. The jack is gold plated, they're full metal, the cord is 100% cloth and the tips are triple-flanged so I wouldn't say they're made from any "poor" brand.. They sound really great and I've been using them for a good while, the problem is that I lost one of the tips (aka ear buds) and when I tried to find either new ones or just the same headphones to buy I couldn't find them.. So if you could please help me with your experience I'd be extremely happy.. I took some pictures so you can at least take a look at the "weird" logo (which I quickly rebuild in photoshop) and I hope they can help you.. Well, here they are:


   

   

   
  Well.. That's all I have for now.. If you need more pictures nor anything else just let me know.. I'm in your hands guys.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Thanks in advance..

 -Xtreme

 Ps: sorry for the huge pictures but I couldn't find any resizement option..


----------



## ljokerl

Not a clue. They certainly are distinctive-looking but I've never seen that logo or design before. Unless there's branding on the y-split or 3.5mm plug I don't know if you'll be able to figure them out


----------



## Xtrem

Eh.. No they're not branded there.. Umm.. Do you think I could find tips for them? They have 3mm holes...
   
  Btw could you ask some audiophile friends? I am ****ing desperate with these little bitches, I think it has been 7 months since I first tried to see what brand they are from...

 Ps: I've read you're a gamer.. What games do you play?


----------



## mark2410

odd looking things those


----------



## Xtrem

Their performance is godlike though..


----------



## jant71

Empire Brands Wicked Little buds. About $15-$17 bucks. Really cool buds with a strong metal housing and well done Litz cabling(not Klipsch like). SQ with stock buds is fairly poor and with better tips almost Coby CVE79(stock tips) level. I gave them to someone.
   
   I like the ergonomics and the size may be the smallest out there still. The pics he posted with the tips on are funny since the tips run quite small and they look big on the earphone.
   
   I have heard some people say they were the worst they ever heard. Godlike performance would seem to be an unusually good pair. Again, my pair ranged from(on the Joker scale)MD51 performance to almost Coby CVE79. So, I rate them in between worst ever and Godlike
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Cheap buds and I suspect variance in production quality accounting for some differences in opinion.


----------



## Xtrem

Well first let me.. THANK YOU MAAAAAAAAN!





 ..I was seriously starting to lose any hope in finding them.. Secondly I believe your theory on the different quality is quite right even though you should never judge a product from the price*.. I also suppose that my thoughts on their performance could be influenced from my musical tastes (I mostly listen to metal) and I don't really like earphones that give you headaches.. Not to mention that they never gave me any distortion.. Anyways, I'll be forever grateful man.. Thank you again.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 *I've got something to tell about prices over products.. One year ago I bought a headset for 20$, its name is Siberia and the brand is Icemat, the materials are very weak (I had to repair the right ear pad by melting its own plastic a couple times) and the microphone performance is barely acceptable; that same headset is now sold by Steelseries for 70$.. Not to mention Skullcandy's overpricing..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


xtrem said:


> Their performance is godlike though..


   
  I think that really depends on what you're coming from. If Jant is right about them being around Coby CVEM79 level, and I'm quite inclined to believe him, that's not bad at all and can definitely impress those who've never ventured into high-end IEMs.

 Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Xtrem* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Ps: I've read you're a gamer.. What games do you play?


 
 I'm a very casual gamer since my primary computer is a netbook and I generally have very little spare time. When I do fire up the gaming rig, I can do a few hours of an FPS or action game. I don't keep up with the latest releases but FO3 is still fun and I've just started playing Just Cause 2. My current netbook runs oldies like GTA:SA and HL2 well so that's what I play more often.
   
  Quote:


jant71 said:


> Empire Brands Wicked Little buds. About $15-$17 bucks. Really cool buds with a strong metal housing and well done Litz cabling(not Klipsch like). SQ with stock buds is fairly poor and with better tips almost Coby CVE79(stock tips) level. I gave them to someone.
> 
> I like the ergonomics and the size may be the smallest out there still. The pics he posted with the tips on are funny since the tips run quite small and they look big on the earphone.


 
 Nice save 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Might be decent value for money if they're built/isolate well and sound close to the CVEM79.


----------



## Xtrem

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think that really depends on what you're coming from. If Jant is right about them being around Coby CVEM79 level, and I'm quite inclined to believe him, that's not bad at all and can definitely impress those who've never ventured into high-end
> 
> Nice save
> 
> ...


 

 Well I did some researches yesterday to see if I could get them for cheap, you can get them for about 10$ on many sites and that's obviously an invitant price.. But.. If you take a close look at them you can find that they've changed.. They no more have triple flanged tips and the driver's tube (IDK how to call it.. xD) is twice as big as mine... I just hope I can find the same ones cause all the bad reviews are recent and I believe that to be the reason why mine perform decently.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





   
  Quote: 





> I'm a very casual gamer since my primary computer is a netbook and I generally have very little spare time. When I do fire up the gaming rig, I can do a few hours of an FPS or action game. I don't keep up with the latest releases but FO3 is still fun and I've just started playing Just Cause 2. My current netbook runs oldies like GTA:SA and HL2 well so that's what I play more often.


 

 Nice! ^^ ..I play CS:S in ESL and I occasionally mod FO3.. A friend of mine also used to have a SAMP (San Andreas Multi Player) stunt server called Stuntlandia, search it up on youtube, he might have it still..


----------



## NimbleRabit

I bought the SoundMagic Pl-50 based on this thread, and they finally arrived a week ago.  Just wanted to say thank you for such an informative review, and that I'm absolutely loving my PL-50s.  These things are insanely comfortable, and I really enjoy the sound signature.  In fact I like them so much that I've been walking my dog more often just because I want to spend more time listening to them


----------



## ljokerl

Cool, glad the thread was useful. I think your dog should be the one thanking me though


----------



## xtasi

Just curious @joker and anyone else who owns a metrofi 220.
   
  I find that the silicon tips fall of way too easily.  In fact I even lost a pair at the gym.  To remedy that, I use comply t-400 foam tips.  I have read that complys take out some sparkle.  I do feel that my the sound sig is a little too warm and I am thinking that the cause is the foam tips.  Do you have any recommendations for me, other than upgrading to a new pair of phones?  For a little more info on fit, i find that the large stock silicon work best when worn "earbud" style, but medium silicon and comply work best over the ear.  It is odd, I know.


----------



## bba1973

Hey joker,
   
  Sorry if you've already been asked about this before, but I wanted to hear what you think about the RE0 vs. the ER4S when both are amped with the mini3. I read what you said in your reviews, but would you mind going more in-depth with it? What would you rate each when amped with the mini3? How much faster is the ER4S?
   
  I'm tempted to get the ER4S, but I'm not sure how much of an upgrade it would be over the RE0. The only real justifications I have for buying them now are for something with better build quality and something faster for heavy metal.


----------



## ljokerl

> Posted by *xtasi* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Just curious @joker and anyone else who owns a metrofi 220.
> 
> I find that the silicon tips fall of way too easily.  In fact I even lost a pair at the gym.  To remedy that, I use comply t-400 foam tips.  I have read that complys take out some sparkle.  I do feel that my the sound sig is a little too warm and I am thinking that the cause is the foam tips.  Do you have any recommendations for me, other than upgrading to a new pair of phones?  For a little more info on fit, i find that the large stock silicon work best when worn "earbud" style, but medium silicon and comply work best over the ear.  It is odd, I know.


   
  I didn't have that problem with the UE220 - that little sharp notch on the nozzle does a good job of hanging on to the stock tips. Complys do have a tendency to cut out sparkle but the severity is earphone-dependent and the UE220 is warm to begin with; I really doubt different tips would make them satisfactory. If you still want to try silicone tips I'd recommend the Sony Hybrids - they should have no problem staying put on the UE nozzle.


 Quote:


bba1973 said:


> Sorry if you've already been asked about this before, but I wanted to hear what you think about the RE0 vs. the ER4S when both are amped with the mini3. I read what you said in your reviews, but would you mind going more in-depth with it? What would you rate each when amped with the mini3? How much faster is the ER4S?
> 
> I'm tempted to get the ER4S, but I'm not sure how much of an upgrade it would be over the RE0. The only real justifications I have for buying them now are for something with better build quality and something faster for heavy metal.


 
 My review of the ER4S is using the mini3; they are a bit better than the RE0 but hardly an 'upgrade'. I like the RE0 treble a little better while the ER4S wins out in the mids (by a bit) and at the low end (by a margin). And yes, the Etys are faster. What else would you want improved? Really if you want an upgrade from the RE0 that's faster and better-built, why not look at the CK10? No need for an amp and the build quality is about as good as it gets.


----------



## bba1973

Quote:  





> My review of the ER4S is using the mini3; they are a bit better than the RE0 but hardly an 'upgrade'. I like the RE0 treble a little better while the ER4S wins out in the mids (by a bit) and at the low end (by a margin). And yes, the Etys are faster. What else would you want improved? Really if you want an upgrade from the RE0 that's faster and better-built, why not look at the CK10? No need for an amp and the build quality is about as good as it gets.


 

 I'd like more speed, more detail (if possible), somewhat better durability, and replaceable cables. All the reviews of the CK-10s sound great, but I'd just feel more comfortable with replaceable cables on something that expensive (expensive for me, anyway). I don't know, I guess I just really want the ER4S for some reason. After buying the mini3, I'd actually rather use an amp, and it seems like the ER4S would help me get more money's worth out of the amp. Portability is much less of a concern now since I'm out of school, and I like being able to "dial in" on the perfect volume.
   
  As far as it being a true "upgrade," I figured I was already knee-deep in the law of diminishing returns. Right now, I'm too poor for customs (and probably will be for a while), but I want something new. Maybe by the time I'll have enough money set aside for customs, JH Audio will have their new 15 driver customs out...
   
  Anyway, thanks for the help joker. The only real way I'll figure out what I like is to try it out, but threads like this help make these decisions easier. I'll probably just go with the etys.


----------



## rawrster

You should keep in mind that replaceable cables does not always mean better quality. Replaceable cables does also mean one more connection to fail (yes I'm looking at UE universals). I typically hear ER4 lasting a long time so their cables does not seem to be fragile like the UE ones.
   
  However I will say this about the CK10. They are the second best quality cable I have experienced and the best cable I own. I think it will take some serious effort to have the cables fail on you. However if you are uncomfortable with that go ahead with the ER4. They do have the replaceable cables for you and hopefully they are what you are looking for.


----------



## bba1973

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> You should keep in mind that replaceable cables does not always mean better quality. Replaceable cables does also mean one more connection to fail (yes I'm looking at UE universals). I typically hear ER4 lasting a long time so their cables does not seem to be fragile like the UE ones.
> 
> However I will say this about the CK10. They are the second best quality cable I have experienced and the best cable I own. I think it will take some serious effort to have the cables fail on you. However if you are uncomfortable with that go ahead with the ER4. They do have the replaceable cables for you and hopefully they are what you are looking for.


 
   
  I see what you're saying, and I'm probably just being paranoid about the cables. I'd just rather have the option, especially if I'm going to spend that much money. With my gear, I'm not rough with it, but stuff does happen.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

hi!
   
  I have now the Re0 and koss portapro for when I'm on the move, but there is this bargain at 25 dollars for metro 220, do you think that metrofi can complement my re0 when I need extra bass? at this price does it justify for who has the re0?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> I have now the Re0 and koss portapro for when I'm on the move, but there is this bargain at 25 dollars for metro 220, do you think that metrofi can complement my re0 when I need extra bass? at this price does it justify for who has the re0?


   

 The 220 will have the bass you are looking for but compared to the RE0 it'll leave you wanting more in nearly every other area. If you just want more bass they'll do fine but don't expect refinement out of them.


----------



## xtasi

@joker
   
  Thanks for the input.  I guess i'll be getting sony hybrids as soon as i get a chance.


----------



## kingpage

Why is ViSang R02 still not included here yet?


----------



## 129207

Yes! How dare you forget another IEM!? With you putting all this work and effort into something that benefits us all. Without getting paid!
   
  Seriously, how dare you? You're fired.
   
   
  sigh


----------



## kingpage

please note that it's been quite a while since the R02 review was out. I am only curious to know about its score, and waited in great anticipation.
   
  Also, I didn't ask the question in THAT tone either.  It was a "i wonder why" kind of tone.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


negakinu said:


> Yes! How dare you forget another IEM!? With you putting all this work and effort into something that benefits us all. Without getting paid!
> 
> Seriously, how dare you? You're fired.
> 
> ...


 
 Hehe 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Quote:


kingpage said:


> please note that it's been quite a while since the R02 review was out. I am only curious to know about its score, and waited in great anticipation.
> 
> Also, I didn't ask the question in THAT tone either.  It was a "i wonder why" kind of tone.


 
 It's no problem. The R02 is not added because I have been waiting for certain forum functionality to be restored, e.g. title editing. There are a number of finiished reviews that need publishing but I would really like to be able to edit the title of the thread to reflect changes. A support ticket has supposedly been submitted but there's no ETA as the feature is probably not a big deal for most HFers. If the feature is not restored I'll publish the R02 review anyway by mid-week.


----------



## kantongkresek

wow. this is really nice. It helped me a lot. Thank you so much


----------



## ljokerl

ViSang R02 added as promised. My apologies to anyone who just received a notification for each front page post I edited. 

 Quote:


kantongkresek said:


> wow. this is really nice. It helped me a lot. Thank you so much


   
  Welcome, glad you found it useful


----------



## JT Vanguard

joker you are amazing!! That is the most amazing list/comparison/chart/review/knowledge ive seen!! Thank you thank you thank you!!
   
   
  Btw you nailed the Nuforce Ne-6 right on the money - My casing separated from the bud 
   
  Im really disappointed by the build quality not sure what they were thinking when they designed it - the glue just does not hold up!! Why didnt that screw it or something isntead of using weak glue :/ 
   
   
  either way im going to use super glue or something?? Think its a good idea or should i do something else??


----------



## chinesekiwi

Quote: 





jt vanguard said:


> joker you are amazing!! That is the most amazing list/comparison/chart/review/knowledge ive seen!! Thank you thank you thank you!!
> 
> 
> Btw you nailed the Nuforce Ne-6 right on the money - My casing separated from the bud
> ...


 

 Warranty it. Nuforce have fantastic customer service. They'll send you a replacement in no time.
   
  Do it here: www.nuforce.com/hp/support/service.html


----------



## kingpage

thanks for finally updating the thread again, I know it's a pain for people want to change the title but can't. I do hope that feature would be brought back like before.


----------



## ASilva

Thanks for the update! These multi-iem comparison threads are awesome.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


chinesekiwi said:


> Warranty it. Nuforce have fantastic customer service. They'll send you a replacement in no time.
> Do it here: www.nuforce.com/hp/support/service.html


   
  This is what I would try first. I had no receipt when my NE-7Ms split and Nuforce still replaced them at no charge. Great customer service. Failing that superglue would work as a last resort but you have to be careful to keep the glue on the overlapping housing lip and not inside the housing.


----------



## Jozurr

Please try to get hold of the silver bullet, eterna and the hippos even if just for reviews. That would really put alot of things into perspective regarding all the other earphones. Thanks alot.


----------



## earfonia

WOW, what a collection of IEMs   I really amazed 
   
  Thanks a lot for the reviews!  Really appreciate your effort for that! 
   
  Have you heard of Superlux HD381 series, especially HD381F?  To my ears they sound very good, although I don't have the extensive experience like you with IEMs   So I think your opinion would be very valuable.
   
  FYI, my mini review about Superlux HD381:
  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/493052/superlux-hd381-series-mini-review-comparisons#post_6653649


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jozurr said:


> Please try to get hold of the silver bullet, eterna and the hippos even if just for reviews. That would really put alot of things into perspective regarding all the other earphones. Thanks alot.


 
 I have the Shrooms and should be able to get their review up in a couple of weeks. No plans for the Eterna, Silver Bullet, or VB at this point, but maybe in the future.
   
  Quote:


earfonia said:


> WOW, what a collection of IEMs   I really amazed
> 
> Thanks a lot for the reviews!  Really appreciate your effort for that!
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks. I've heard of the Superlux IEMs and wanted to try them (as well as their portable headphones, which don't seem to be available anywhere). I'll look into it.


----------



## ljokerl

Woodstravaganza!
   
  Added the Thinksound Rain, Thinksound TS01/Thunder, Woodees IESW101B, and Sentry HO470 Wooden.


----------



## Berserker

This is outstanding work. Takes a real dedication. Thanks for this. I'm a newb, and still learning all the sound jargon. This helps me to understand, because I can listen to  IEM's I have, and compare them with your notes. Makes it come alive in detail a little more.


----------



## Silenced

This is an EPIC thread.  You are amazing Joker.  Keep it up.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Klipsch S2 and Brainwavz M1 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





berserker said:


> This is outstanding work. Takes a real dedication. Thanks for this. I'm a newb, and still learning all the sound jargon. This helps me to understand, because I can listen to  IEM's I have, and compare them with your notes. Makes it come alive in detail a little more.


 
   
  Quote: 





silenced said:


> This is an EPIC thread.  You are amazing Joker.  Keep it up.


 

 Thanks, glad the thread is useful


----------



## rawrster

lots of updates lately  was always interested in the S2 when I had the S4
   
  this is what happens when the OP's goal here is obviously to own every single earphone ever made under $100 or so


----------



## Impulse

First of all, thanks to joker for compiling this awesome comparison thread... Now on to my dilema. I'm torn between the MEElectronics M9P, the Nuforce NE-7M, and the Maximo iMetal iP-HS5 (same drivers/construction as the iM-590, but with a mic, you should add that to the post btw joker). I realize that the M9P are probably a slight step down in SQ from the other two, and the budget isn't a big issue ($20-25 vs $50-55 for the other two), but the build quality and low microphonics make them pretty attractive nonetheless.
   
  I just wanna make sure if I spend 2x the money for either of the latter two that I'm getting my money's worth... I'm coming from a pair of CX300's (which I use to travel, work, study, etc.) and a pair of JVC HA-FX34 Marshmallows. I bought the Senns years ago when they were pretty much the only budget IEMs around (pretty sure i paid over $50 for 'em!) and I bought the JVCs recently from a Best Buy vending machine at an airport when I realized I left my CX300 at home... No joke, not bad at $20 and a quasi-emergency. I'm now using them to exercise (running) since they perform better than the CX300 in an active environment (less microphonics, tips slide out less, etc.).
   
  I also use the JVC HA-RX700 at home, FWIW. I started reading Amazon reviews for the NuForce and Maximo (I know, they're to be taken w/a grain of salt) and there seemed to be a lot of complaints about the Maximo's build quality despite joker's praise of it. A lot of people seem to have had issues with the cable specifically (saying it frayes or opens up and lets the inner cabling show, etc.). I know any of 'em should be an improvement over the JVC (let alone the CX300), but still I'm torn...
   
  Don't people usually say that an I-plug puts more stress on the connector? Joker mentions the Maximos have an I-plug even tho it looks a bit angled on the picture (I guess it starts straight and bends, farther out than the MEElec's 45 deg. plug I suppose). I'll be using 'em primarily with my netbook & phone so I'd guess an L plug or a shorter angled plug is ergonomically preferable. Anyway I've read a few other reviews here and elsewhere and I still can't seem to make up my mind, so if anyone's got any further comments I'd appreciate it, thanks!
   
  Edit: The accessories aren't a big deal to me, the Shack sells Comply tips and I already have a serviceable pouch to carry them. I'd put equal emphasis on everything else.... I guess NuForce's excellent support and Maximo's lifetime warranty are worth a lil' extra $ but if they end up being more fragile than the MEElec's that's kind of a dubious distinction. Never had any issues w/my CX300, or the JVC after having used 'em for 4-5 months of running (3-5 miles about 2-3 days a week), Never used the CX300 to run as they seemed a bit fragile (and expensive, given what I paid) for that.


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks for such a detailed description of your dilemma. 
   
  First off, thanks for the suggestion about adding the HS5. I'll add them with the next update. There's also the iM-595, which I believe is the blackberry (?) version. Also, the plug on the iM-590 is bent at around 15 degrees at the strain relief - not really enough to call it an angled plug but for what it's worth, it's not completely straight. My comments on build quality deal with initial build quality since I can't really test the long-term durability of every IEM I go through. If a lot of people report long-term issues with the iM-590 cable, that's probably true. It's up to you whether the hassle of getting them replaced if that happens is worth it. 
   
  Regarding your question, I do think the SQ upgrade of the iM-590 is worth both the extra dough and the extra bother in terms of microphonics/build quality; however, if you plan to use them actively the microphonics may be an issue. I'd recommend wearing them over the ear but since you're looking at the iphone-compatible versions, you'd probably want the microphone to be in the proper position most of the time. It really looks to me like you've got your decision cut out - just need to pick what matters most to you. The Meelecs are great all-rounders, no doubt, but only you know if you will later catch yourself wondering about what you're missing in terms of sound. IMO Buying the Nuforces would be taking the middle ground. I'm not much of a middle-ground sort of person so I sold my Nuforces shortly after the housings split and I got a replacement set. The Maximos and M9s I still own. By the way, while durability is certainly important, I have to say that in my experience all three of these companies have exhibited outstanding customer service.


----------



## Impulse

Thanks for the quick reply! Even tho I'm looking at the mic versions (for use w/an Android phone btw), I'd probably use them over the ear often if it does reduce the microphonics... I'm not one to yak on my phone for hours on end, but I figured I'd get one w/a mic anyway if I was gonna upgrade my CX300's. What I'm trying to say is that it wouldn't be a constant occurrence for me to switch from music to calls, or a huge hassle to swap them over in the moment (just unplug both ears and swing one around my shoulder). I think you're right tho, I'll just narrow it down to either the MEElecs for good all around performance and low microphonics or the Maximos for better SQ. I like how either of those look better than the NuForce anyway, heh, that counts a lil' bit!
   
  I did read about the iM-595's as well btw, couldn't find 'em online tho, I dunno what's the difference... Is their plug 2.5mm or does the mic/button just interface differently on Blackberries and it requires an entirely different config? I guess that might be something worth looking into w/regards to my phone (an HTC EVO), I'll probably test it with an in-line mic/extender for the iPhone that I got from Philips once I have my phone (next week), if it works then I can be reasonably sure that any of these will work w/it. I'm not terribly worried about the button working right, just the mic. Thanks for clarification on the Maximos' plug! (and the heads up about the iM-595)
   
  Just a couple more questions if it's not too much bother, the Maximos DO have a lifetime warranty no? I think I read it different on Amazon but Maximos page seemed to indicate all their headphones have a lifetime warranty... Also, does the barrel on the Maximos stick out noticeably more than the MEElec M9 or are they about the same? I think your link to the mod to increase isolation on the Maximos is broken btw, it just takes me back to this very thread (or an earlier version of it, I forget). I found the mod while looking around for a more detailed explanation of the fused bi-flange tips tho (pretty clever), here's the mod:
   
  http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k240/ofey_s/Maximo/modtips.jpg
   
  From this review: http://www.inearmatters.net/2009/11/review-meelectronics-in-ears.html
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


impulse said:


> Just a couple more questions if it's not too much bother, the Maximos DO have a lifetime warranty no? I think I read it different on Amazon but Maximos page seemed to indicate all their headphones have a lifetime warranty... Also, does the barrel on the Maximos stick out noticeably more than the MEElec M9 or are they about the same?


 
 Regarding the warranty question I've seen conflicting statements and I don't have my iM-590 packaging to check. You may want to shoot a pm to Andrew of Maximo Products and he should be able to clear that up and also explain the difference between the HS5 and iM-595. I think the iM-*95 line is meant to be phased out but I can't be sure. 
   
  As for the length, the Maximos are actually shorter than the Meelecs and fit completely into my ear (with only the rubber tail sticking out). The Meelecs stick out noticeably. Even if your ears aren't big enough to conceal the iM-590s in their entirety, there's no way they'll stick out more than the Meelecs.


----------



## Impulse

Interesting, judging by the pics I would've thought otherwise but it's hard to judge scale off of those, many thanks... I can now make a well informed decision.


----------



## ljokerl

First update for the new month: Rockford Fosgate Punch Plugs and Arctic Sound E361


----------



## dfrost

Impulse,
   
  I have both the NuForce NE-7M and MEElec M9P, and have also considered the Maximo iP-HS5.
   
  Regarding the last, I think the difference between iP-595 and iP-HS5 is that the 595 has volume control as well as the mic and pushbutton of the HS5. Don't know if the volume control will work with an Android (specified "for iPhone3GS and latest iPod"), but Andrew at Maximo is great about answering questions. Both use 3.5mm plugs, and the HS5 includes a 2.5mm adapter for Blackberries that require such. For Maximo products, I'm waiting for the upcoming 7-series. Last I heard, they are expected in July. Hopefully the cable durability and microphonics issues will be corrected on those.
   
  Between the NE-7M and M9P, if I had to pick one it would be the NE-7M. I find they have a cohesiveness and musicality that I slightly prefer over the MEElec, although the M9P has better treble extension and detail, sometimes also bringing a bit more harshness. I use these with a Blackberry Curve (music stored on a micro-SD card) and an iPod 120 Gb Classic, no amp, and rarely with any EQ. I generally prefer the NE-7M with the BB and M9P with the iPod, but interchange occasionally.
   
  They are quite similar, but I'd summarize their differences as:
  - The NE-7M sounds like I'm sitting in the best seat in the audience in a good, small concert hall, so there's a great sense of reverberation without losing directionality in the soundstage. 
  - The M9P sounds like I'm on stage with the performers, with a little more detail and "space" around each instrument.
  Of the negative SQ attributes with these two (both can sometimes be too bassy and harsh treble), I'd say that the NuForce are more manageable on the occasional tracks when these characteristics are apparent. BTW, I'm using Head-Direct large biflange tips with both of these ATM. Microphonics are good on both, maybe a slight bit better with NuForce. When walking I usually wear them over-ear (the mics still work OK in that position), but they are acceptable worn down. I can lay on my side with both (and those tips). The NE-7M protrudes a little bit more, and the M9P will be more bassy, because that blocks the vent on the down ear.
   
  A friend is looking for less expensive IEMs. I let her listen to both of these and she immediately picked the NE-7M.
   
  The M9P may be the more durable of the two, but I haven't used it as long. I've had two NE-7M fail at the L-plug, but NuForce has been fantastic about getting warranty replacements to me quickly (before sending the defective unit to them!). And to be honest, there may have been some issues with how I use them, although they are never stored while attached to the DAP.
   
  Here's a good description of how the pushbutton control works (same for M9P and NE-7M, and probably also for HS5).


----------



## ljokerl

^ Nice sum-up. I was going to comment yesterday but forgot. I agree on all counts, especially the presentation differences between the two IEMs, except for the Nuforces being harsh, which they weren't to my ears - at least not significantly. Either way a very helpful post for those in need of a cheap mic'd IEM - been seeing a lot of these questions lately. I have to say your ears must be pretty... sizable. I really can't lie down in either one. The M11 and Maximo iM-590 are pushing it for me in terms of protrusion for lying down.


----------



## rawrster

Just a FYI since you used to edit your titles to reflect changes but you can edit your thread titles now.


----------



## ljokerl

Awesome, thanks. Never would have noticed myself.
  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Just a FYI since you used to edit your titles to reflect changes but you can edit your thread titles now.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Radius HP-TWF11R 'DDM' and the new JVC AirCushions.
   
  I am aware that some of the older pics are not showing up, which is due to an imageshack 503 error. Hopefully it will get sorted on their end.


----------



## mvw2

Omnonom at the Radius.  I've had an interest in these since the review by shigzeo.  I'm a big fan of cone area when it comes to putting out a clean sound with ease, and earphones are typically a major compromise device.  It's good to see a company push the boundaries.  It's good to see you found them to sound so good.  How big of an issue was fit for you?  Do you see a lot of people having any issues wearing these?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Omnonom at the Radius.  I've had an interest in these since the review by shigzeo.  I'm a big fan of cone area when it comes to putting out a clean sound with ease, and earphones are typically a major compromise device.  It's good to see a company push the boundaries.  It's good to see you found them to sound so good.  How big of an issue was fit for you?  Do you see a lot of people having any issues wearing these?


   
  I'll be honest - I'm not a fan of the fit. I use my IEMs on the go pretty much all of the time and the Radii just don't lend themselves to being forgotten about while in use. I had the same problem with the RE252 and TF10 - they are hardly unnoticeable when worn. It seems that they were designed to stay in with the tips as the only contact point and that seems counter-intuitive to me because these things aren't small. I can tuck the driver bulge in my ear and they seem more stable that way but then the cord entry point gets in the way. If you've worn the Sony EX700s you'll have some idea of what these are like. 
   
  However, when I tried to warn someone about getting these as a gift (due to finicky fit) in a recommendation thread, one of the other DDM owners said that most head-fiers have no problem with the fit so I may be in the minority. I haven't looked at the appreciation/impressions thread past the first page so I really don't know.
   
  As for sound, they are an odd beast. I do think their presentation warrants some adjustment time as they may not sound entirely natural at first but rather 'grow' on you. They certainly aren't perfect but as far as bass-inclined dynamics go I prefer them to the MTP Golds and Atrios, my only non-analytical >$100 dynamics.


----------



## heathkit

Wow!  First, thank you ljokerl for all your hard work on this. I just went through all 21 pages of this thread and now I've "narrowed" my choices for a new IEM from 2 to about 6 or 7.  Spending up to about $80 on an IEM to use in the gym mainly, current choices are:
   
  Maximo iM-590
  Visang R03
  BrainWavz M1
  Soundmagic PL-50
  RE0's
  Cyclone PR1 Pro
  Fischer Audio Eterna
   
  I use a Sansa Clip+ and Fuze with 320 kb mp3 or FLACs and listen mostly to rock with some occasional jazz thrown in. Still using the stock buds which are surprisingly listenable compared to other stock buds (like ipod Shuffle and Creative Zen to name a few).  Based on what I've read so far in sound quality the RE0's are probably best for me, but what about the usability/durability factor for the gym?
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


heathkit said:


> Wow!  First, thank you ljokerl for all your hard work on this. I just went through all 21 pages of this thread and now I've "narrowed" my choices for a new IEM from 2 to about 6 or 7.  Spending up to about $80 on an IEM to use in the gym mainly, current choices are:


   

 Hah, I thought the whole point of this thread was so that you would only have to do one page of reading (the first page) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Glad it helped you narrow down your choices though...
   
  Personally I would rule out the iM-590 and RE0 if you're buying it specifically for the gym (my new RE-ZERO reminded me of how much I don't like the HiFiMan cable) and the Cyclone PR1 Pro because you just plain won't find one (I should probably mention somewhere in the review that it's been discontinued). 
   
  As for the rest, the PL50 has great ergonomics and comes with ear guides (as do the Brainwavz M1 and M2), which may come in handy for the gym. The R03 does not and since the M2 sounds exactly the same, the ViSang version is not worth getting in your case, even if it is a few bucks cheaper. 
   
  Personally I prefer the R03/M2 to the M1 and, by a wider margin, to the PL50 for rock. Their imaging isn't quite as good as that of the PL50 but they sound more airy and generally have a more likable sound signature - I would say that they are the safer choice. There are people who swear by the PL50 and others who are bored by it - no way to really tell which group you'll belong to without trying it. 
   
  Oh and I've not tried the Eterna yet, though I should have one on hand next week.


----------



## tyrael

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Oh and I've not tried the Eterna yet, though I should have one on hand next week.


 
  Looking forward to your impression


----------



## ljokerl

Sleek Audio SA1 added.
   
  Also updated the prices of the CK10, MTPG, HJE900, etc. Seems like everything has gone up in price...


----------



## beamthegreat

wow! how much money did u spend by making this review? :O Looking forward to the IE8 impression.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


beamthegreat said:


> wow! how much money did u spend by making this review? :O Looking forward to the IE8 impression.


 
 Enough to land me on paypal's reward program 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Not an accurate measurement by any means but summing the 'street price' column on my IEM chart yields just over $5500. Of course fellow head-fiers have been kind enough to let me borrow quite a few sets so that figure is way off but it's the right order of magnitude. 
   
  IE8 review coming soon, hopefully. I think I've got a few of the bass-heavy dynamics people are interested in and reviewing them all at once makes sense.
   
  On a different note, anyone who still hasn't tried a Meelec M9 may be interested in their new review sample giveaway. Great little phones and even better when free.


----------



## Jozurr

I really wish you'd have the silver bullet lined up too! this thread is becoming more and more awesome day by day!


----------



## Inks

Actually, I'll be lending him my Silver Bullets in about a week.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





beamthegreat said:


> wow! how much money did u spend by making this review? :O Looking forward to the IE8 impression.


 

 The real question should be how the heck does joker store everything and have enough space 
   
  On a side note..joker that shirt clip review you did on some jvc earphone. I asked them about buying the shirt clip separately and they have it at like $10 which is pretty expensive for a shirt clip not including shipping which is pretty ridiculous. I might check out the JVC store I see on my commute one day and see if they have it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> The real question should be how the heck does joker store everything and have enough space


   
  Who said I have enough space? Maybe I sleep on the floor because there's headphones everywhere else 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  Quote:


> Originally Posted by *rawrster* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> On a side note..joker that shirt clip review you did on some jvc earphone. I asked them about buying the shirt clip separately and they have it at like $10 which is pretty expensive for a shirt clip not including shipping which is pretty ridiculous. I might check out the JVC store I see on my commute one day and see if they have it.


 
  $10 is exorbitant for a half-ounce of plastic. Also, it is an included accessory with the $18 JVC HA-FX67. Apparently the earphones themselves are only worth $8.  
   
  Note: thread in question is here.


----------



## dspang

Hey joker, I noticed on the Meelectronics M6 review that they made softer memory wire.  Does this make them easier to fit properly now?  I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on these.


----------



## JxK

^Yeah, it should make them easier to fit. And if you still don't like the memory wire, it is extremely easy to remove.


----------



## dspang

Cool thanks.  That's all I needed to know.


----------



## ljokerl

RadioPaq Classicals added. Hoping to add some of the more bass-heavy IEMs in the coming week.


----------



## mark2410

ahh been waiting to read this for some time


----------



## ASilva

What an amazing job you are doing with this thread joker. Really, thanks alot!
   
  Btw, do you plan on reviewing any of the IEMs from Playaz/XEars? I would be very interested in hearing your thoughts on them. IMO they are amazing IEMs for their price and i don't think they get the love they deserve here in head-fi


----------



## Bennyboy71

Earphones that end in a 'Z' should be banished to Siberia.
  
  Quote: 





asilva said:


> What an amazing job you are doing with this thread joker. Really, thanks alot!
> 
> Btw, do you plan on reviewing any of the IEMs from Playaz/XEars? I would be very interested in hearing your thoughts on them. IMO they are amazing IEMs for their price and i don't think they get the love they deserve here in head-fi


----------



## ASilva

Quote: 





bennyboy71 said:


> Earphones that end in a 'Z' should be banished to Siberia.


 

 Try them... I don't think the main concern with IEMs is their name


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mark2410 said:


> ahh been waiting to read this for some time


 
 Well, I hope delivered. I really think the Classicals are pretty unique at the price point. For me they are what the Head-Direct RE2 should have been. But that treble might be too intense for some. The Jazz are more mainstream in sound and probably more likable for the average Joe (not _the_ average_joe).
   
  Quote:


asilva said:


> What an amazing job you are doing with this thread joker. Really, thanks alot!
> 
> Btw, do you plan on reviewing any of the IEMs from Playaz/XEars? I would be very interested in hearing your thoughts on them. IMO they are amazing IEMs for their price and i don't think they get the love they deserve here in head-fi


 
 There's one on the horizon (tentatively) but no promises on timing. As you can see, my backlog is growing faster than the review at this point.


----------



## mark2410

yeah, im forever surprised the Jazz and Classicals have been so largely ignored on head-fi.
   
  did you ever hear the other ones?  (Pop, Rock and Full Range)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mark2410 said:


> did you ever hear the other ones?  (Pop, Rock and Full Range)


 
 Nope - I only got the Jazz and Classicals based on your recommendations. To be honest, getting them over here is a huge pain. The shipping for the Classicals cost me 80% as much as the earphones themselves, plus Fedex International refused to leave the package without a signature, meaning I had to go pick it up after hours. 
   
  Certainly this has something to do with their (lack of) popularity - Head-Fi is a global community but only European head-fiers (and even then, not all) have easy access to the 'Paqs.


----------



## Azathoth

Great new updates, waiting for your thoughts on Eterna. Are you reviewing the original or rev2?


----------



## SolidSnake3

Can't wait to read what you think about the Eterna as well. I ordered a pair back on the 18th of the v1's from the authorized ebay seller and I'm still waiting on them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Really, really hope they show up by Friday since I have 5hrs of bus rides to take and no iem's right now due to my Coppers being shipped out for the dead left ear piece. Come on Eterna's! Show up already!


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> mark2410 said:
> ...


 

 yeah your not loosing out really not hearing the others


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


azathoth said:


> Great new updates, waiting for your thoughts on Eterna. Are you reviewing the original or rev2?


 
 I am reviewing the rev2 specifically but I have both revisions for comparison purposes. So far I think the differences between them have been somewhat exaggerated.
   
  Also, I was just browsing Fischer's site to find that they are releasing a higher-end IEM (the _Genesis_) with a signature that is 'the logical extension of the Eterna's' later in the year.


----------



## jant71

The Genesis looks good. Like the Phonak shape but with some metal and more rounded. They may be my first Fischer phones when it comes along.


----------



## rawrster

I'm going to guess thats a dynamic driver phone? I'm hoping in not buying any more phones after the DBA 02 but if something interesting comes up


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> I'm going to guess thats a dynamic driver phone? I'm hoping in not buying any more phones after the DBA 02 but if something interesting comes up


 
 Yep, from what I can gather it's dynamic. Personally I'm more interested in the new Falcon model. Looks a bit like a Klipsch S2 but it's marketed as having 'heavy-duty construction'.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> rawrster said:
> ...


 

 Looks hot.  Forget about over the ears though.  Didn't Klipsch have issues w/ that kind of stress relief cracking?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Looks hot.  Forget about over the ears though.  Didn't Klipsch have issues w/ that kind of stress relief cracking?


 

 I managed to wear the Klipsch S2 over-the-ear, just not during physical activity. The strain relief on those was pretty hard so I wouldn't have been surprised if it cracked after a while, but I am intrigued by what FA means by 'heavy duty construction'. They specifically refer to a special-weave cable sheath and heavy-duty 3.5mm plug.


----------



## rawrster

I think that was an issue with the X10 or X5 kind of design where the housing is really too small


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I managed to wear the Klipsch S2 over-the-ear, just not during physical activity. The strain relief on those was pretty hard so I wouldn't have been surprised if it cracked after a while, but I am intrigued by what FA means by 'heavy duty construction'. They specifically refer to a special-weave cable sheath and heavy-duty 3.5mm plug.


 

 The sheath appears to be a carbon/kevlar weave.  Any chance you might get some Zagg buds to review?  I found out that they use Invisible shield on their cables which would default them to the most durable cables on the market bar none.  Not considering stress reliefs, etc.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> The sheath appears to be a carbon/kevlar weave.  Any chance you might get some Zagg buds to review?  I found out that they use Invisible shield on their cables which would default them to the most durable cables on the market bar none.  Not considering stress reliefs, etc.


 
 Actually I had a chance to review the original Zagg buds a while ago but a fellow head-fier told me that I would regret listening to them ('cannot be unheard' I believe was the exact phrasing). I was busy anyway so I passed on them. I won't pass on them if I get another shot if the cables are really that good. Might make a good donor cord...


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> anaxilus said:
> ...


 

 I only heard the Zagg buds for about 40sec outside in the parking lot at CES.  All I can recall is the Monster Beats Headphones left a far worse impression from what I recall.  For those unfamiliar w/ Zagg.
   
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQcv3ETEQdM
   
  I have the stuff on my smartphone.  So do all the US helicopter rotor blades in Iraq and Afghanistan.


----------



## rawrster

Invisible shield on their cables..how does that work or rather how do they get that on the cables?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Invisible shield on their cables..how does that work or rather how do they get that on the cables?


 

 No idea.  If its ever in a liquid state then they could just dip it and cure it.  Otherwise your guess is as good as mine.


----------



## ljokerl

Bass-stravaganza!
   
  Added the Sennheiser IE8, Future Sonics Atrio M8, Hippo VB, and Fischer Audio Eterna.


----------



## Hero Kid

Ha this should make a lot of users happy 
  Well done as always.


----------



## rawrster

I was wondering when these would be up. Nice write ups  I was always interested in the Eternas but never got around to buying them


----------



## SolidSnake3

Awesome to read another review of the Eterna's, making the wait to get mine even harder to handle! Glad I scooped up a pair of the V1 of them as well. Can't wait to hear their very distinct and unique sound sig.


----------



## 2rooi123

that was a great read
  by the way are you planning to review phiaton ps 200?


----------



## shigzeo

The Zagg Z-buds are NOT good sounding earphones - not with any tip, not compared to any good, cheaper headset. When I reviewed them, they cost 80$ and I think I wasn't harsh enough on them. Now, at a cheaper price, they are thinkable, but.... only barely. If the iBud headset was sealed, I'd take it over the Zagg z-Bud.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Bass-stravaganza!
> 
> Added the Sennheiser IE8, Future Sonics Atrio M8, Hippo VB, and Fischer Audio Eterna.


 

 Great review as always joker.
  Though  I have to say, for an analytical listener like yourself, going back to your ck10 after all this bass will likely feel like a breath of fresh.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Hope you enjoy them more now after the review.
   
  Edit: About the VB, I think that they might actually sound better at low volumes unlike the majority of dynamics. Most of the edginess in the treble is gone, while the bass still hits hard, but not distractingly so like it can sometimes to when you blast the things.


----------



## rawrster

It's always hard going back to those type of phones after a bass heavy. When I had the Coppers the neutral phones in my collection felt like they had no bass in comparison..


----------



## chinesekiwi

'*excellent bass depth and texture' *
   
   
*in the IE8 review - *
   
*are you sure.....cuz damn the IE8 has a strong mid-bass hump and tbh, I feel even the JVC FX500 beats it in terms of the bass quality. Of course the FX500 can't compare with the mids or treble of the IE8 and yes, the IE8 has a fantastic soundstage, I must admit. But in terms of the bass, I feel the FX500 offers a much better experience and have little doubt the upgraded FX700 model will do too.*


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


hero kid said:


> Ha this should make a lot of users happy
> Well done as always.


   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> I was wondering when these would be up. Nice write ups  I was always interested in the Eternas but never got around to buying them


 
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Quote:


2rooi123 said:


> that was a great read
> by the way are you planning to review phiaton ps 200?


 
 Yep, the PS200 should be up next week or the week after. The complete list of planned reviews can be found in the section entitled 'incomplete list of planned reviews' in post #8.

 Quote:


shigzeo said:


> The Zagg Z-buds are NOT good sounding earphones - not with any tip, not compared to any good, cheaper headset. When I reviewed them, they cost 80$ and I think I wasn't harsh enough on them. Now, at a cheaper price, they are thinkable, but.... only barely. If the iBud headset was sealed, I'd take it over the Zagg z-Bud.


 
 Hmm no, I don't think you were very hard on them at all. With a cursory read, I could've though that you actually felt positively towards them.

 Quote:


jxk said:


> Great review as always joker.
> Though  I have to say, for an analytical listener like yourself, going back to your ck10 after all this bass will likely feel like a breath of fresh.
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Hah, very true but to be honest, I did not feel like I was missing much in the treble with the IE8, which was my breath of fresh air in this test group. I need to take a couple of detours before returning to the CK10s though, mainly over to the portable thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I don't doubt that if I were to switch back now, the lack of bass body would be jarring.
   
  And yeah, I agree - the VBs are one of the better dynamic IEMs to use at low volumes. I think I made a note of it towards the end. And I generally found them far less sibilant then expected, which makes me wonder why it took so many months for people to start saying that the Klipsch S4 is sibilant (and not that they "just need 200 more hours of burn-in") but the VBs were tagged as such from the outset. 

 Quote:


chinesekiwi said:


> '*excellent bass depth and texture' *
> 
> 
> *in the IE8 review - *
> ...


 
  Yep, the IE8 has a mid-bass hump. But it doesn't detract from the depth. I could easily differentiate very low notes with the IE8 - sounds that are reduced to a very feint and unitelligible 'thump thump thump' with something like the ViSang R03 or Klipsch S4. It should be noted that I've never tried the FX500 or FX700 and have no clue how they compare. I've actually stayed pretty far away from bass-heavy IEMs with the exception of the Atrios, which I've owned for a while.


----------



## koonhua90

Yo IjokerI, do you think you will eventually have a listen to FX-500 and the FX-700? FX-700 made me sell my IE8, to my ears, it bests it in a lot of aspects...


----------



## mvw2

Thumbs up on the IE8 and Eterna.  I think you hit many of their key points very well. 
   
  A comment on the IE8.  The knob is something I personally disliked about the IE8 only because it was only partially helpful.  If you ran low, you lost bottom end.  If you ran high, it evened out.  Either way, it only affected frequencies below 100Hz and the midbass hump centered at 100Hz meaning it could only influence the bottom half and do nothing for midbass and lower midrange emphasis.  In my eyes, the only good bass knob setting was full as much as many people new to the amount of bass it offers shies away from that setting.  The earphone really requires a wide EQ cut centered at 100Hz to flatten out the response properly.  All the knob gets to do is make the bass anemic.  This is also mimicked from Headphone's own testing of the IE8 with the bass knob down and up.  When I owned the IE8 I sort of came to the conclusion that you simply turn it up and get used to it.  If you have an EQ with a band at 100Hz, great, but otherwise you just listen and get used to it.  You do get used to it too, and the IE8 is very enjoyable.
   
  I will make a suggestion, if you still have them, to add in the Triple.Fi 10.  Frankly since you're comparing many of these high end earphones, you may want to simply compare and put that into the list as well.  As much as it's been reviewed already, it should at least exist in your review somewhere.  It's an earphone I've always liked.
   
  Now if only you could get someone to loan you their SM3.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





shigzeo said:


> The Zagg Z-buds are NOT good sounding earphones - not with any tip, not compared to any good, cheaper headset. When I reviewed them, they cost 80$ and I think I wasn't harsh enough on them. Now, at a cheaper price, they are thinkable, but.... only barely. If the iBud headset was sealed, I'd take it over the Zagg z-Bud.


 

 Agreed, Z-buds sucked so bad that even though I paid for them myself I still gave them away free because it would have been a crime to charge someone for them (gave to Naamanf as a moving away gift, who hated them too).


----------



## shigzeo

Joker: you are right. I need to go back and edit that review. They are pretty bad. That is one year ago, but they left a bad enough impression that I'd not want to review another pair... even if it was updated.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Agreed, Z-buds sucked so bad that even though I paid for them myself I still gave them away free because it would have been a crime to charge someone for them (gave to Naamanf as a moving away gift, who hated them too).


 
   
  Quote: 





shigzeo said:


> The Zagg Z-buds are NOT good sounding earphones - not with any tip, not compared to any good, cheaper headset. When I reviewed them, they cost 80$ and I think I wasn't harsh enough on them. Now, at a cheaper price, they are thinkable, but.... only barely. If the iBud headset was sealed, I'd take it over the Zagg z-Bud.


 

 The Z-Buds look different from the Zagg buds.  The housing is different and the old ones had cloth not invisible shield cables.  No idea if they still have the same signature but obviously there have been external redesigns.
   
  ZBuds:
   
http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/reviews/entry/zagg-zbuds/
   
  Zagg Smartbuds:
   
http://www.zagg.com/audio/smart-buds.php


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


koonhua90 said:


> Yo IjokerI, do you think you will eventually have a listen to FX-500 and the FX-700? FX-700 made me sell my IE8, to my ears, it bests it in a lot of aspects...


 
 Maybe in the future but no plans at the moment. So many earphones, so few ears.
   
  Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Thumbs up on the IE8 and Eterna.  I think you hit many of their key points very well.


 
 Thanks. I did play around with the bass knob but anything higher than the 2nd setting made me nauseous after a while. Sub-bass is great but coupled with a mid-bass hump it's just overwhelming for me. The VBs are the exact opposite and they still didn't sit too well with me.
   
  I still have the TF10 and will get to them eventually. I don't like the fit very much and reviewing them would mean using them exclusively for a few days. I doubt it'll be a worse overall experience than, for example, the AudioSource IEBAS (even though I only made it one day with those), but other IEMs seem to be inadvertently getting ahead of the TF10 in the queue when I'm not looking 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
   
  As for SM3, who knows. Maybe someday. Head-Fi is full of generous people (thanks again for the Eterna 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)
   
  Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Anaxilus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> The Z-Buds look different from the Zagg buds.  The housing is different and the old ones had cloth not invisible shield cables.  No idea if they still have the same signature but obviously there have been external redesigns.
> 
> ZBuds:
> ...


 
 Yep, definitely different. I was referring to the original ZBuds. I've never spoken to anyone about the Smartbuds, which by the way look like a cross between the Klipsch S4 and Denon C710. Could be really comfortable if the cables are light.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> On a different note, anyone who still hasn't tried a Meelec M9 may be interested in their new review sample giveaway. Great little phones and even better when free.


 

 I guess I got this for free which is definitely a great price  I only tried the M6 and anything that doesn't have that kind of fit for free (2nd gen cable) is definitely a plus for me. I was wondering what the package I got this morning was since I wasn't expecting anything. A nice surprise although they probably should have given some kind of notification. I could always use a 2nd set of budget phones to my PL30
   
  edit: how the heck are you able to listen to very good earphones and then budget ones. I think I'm going to need to spend a few hours to ibuds or something to appreciate these since I used them right after the e-Q7.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

You have some few references to triple fi 10, but it is not included in your list.
  I am having a big fight with the tips for tf10. The rubber ones are hard and not comfortable for me, but the foam tips cuts down bass and treble, and sound muddy to me. quite strange, and bad my experience with foams.
  I now find it sounds much better with my 8 dollars IEM, lol. much better.


----------



## CEE TEE

Joker, thank you for finally including IE8.  I did buy them before your review but with a bit of teeth gnashing and hand wringing over the "mid-bass hump" issue. 
   
  It would have been a lot easier to pull the trigger and buy the IE8's after your review but it is a nice comparison/confirmation for the pair of iems that I am really happy with!


----------



## mark2410

i must say im surprised you rated the IE8 so highly, i did say they they had quite great treble on them too.
   
  did you try them with an icon mobile at all? (the two are somewhat made for each other)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> edit: how the heck are you able to listen to very good earphones and then budget ones. I think I'm going to need to spend a few hours to ibuds or something to appreciate these since I used them right after the e-Q7.


 
 Going from something top-tier to the M9 would be a two step process for me, with the step in the middle being a good midrange earphone (e.g. the Maximo iM-590). Going directly from top-tier to bottom of the barrel, no matter how good the latter, would be a bit of a shock.
  
  Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> i must say im surprised you rated the IE8 so highly, i did say they they had quite great treble on them too.
> 
> did you try them with an icon mobile at all? (the two are somewhat made for each other)


 

 Thanks, they are very enjoyable phones and easily the ones I felt I was missing out on the least with out of my motley group of bassy earphones. I don't have an icon mobile but they were definitely not made for my warmish iBasso T4.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

[size=medium]I continue to enjoy reading your review.  Due to the IE8's bass over-riding their nice but relatively recessed mids and highs, I felt that the Monster Turbine Pro Gold were a little better than the IE8.  Amp synergy was important with the IE8 to me, and only with the ALO Amphora amp did the IE8 sound truly phenomenal (to the point that I could not believe what I was hearing it was so good).  I think they sounded just as you described, but I thought the MTPG's superior bass control and improved balance vs the mids and highs outweighed the IE8's bigger soundstage.  Still, someday I hope to get another IE8 just for listening with the Amphora.  Cheers!​[/size]


----------



## rawrster

^
  You should try the Coppers one day  Although the bass on the Golds are a little better imo the Coppers does everything else better again imo


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, they are very enjoyable phones and easily the ones I felt I was missing out on the least with out of my motley group of bassy earphones. I don't have an icon mobile but they were definitely not made for my warmish iBasso T4.


 

 oh no i cant imagine that would be a pleasant combo, id bet it would turn it into a super high end version of the R1.  just overwhelming warmth all over the place.  the top end senns really need that cooling brease and i know youd appreciate the treble.  personally ive never felt any BA gets treble right in the way a couple of dynamics can.


----------



## Ultrazino

Thanks. I'm already getting the _Hippo VB_, but now after reading your review I think I would have been better off with the _Fischer Audio Eterna... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_


----------



## Azathoth

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> did you try them with an icon mobile at all? (the two are somewhat made for each other)


 

 I agree, I tried the icon mobile + IE8 setup at a local meet, amazing synergy. They have opposite characteristics (IE8 - dark, icon mobile - bright), so I guess it resulted in a great match


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> [size=medium]I continue to enjoy reading your review.  Due to the IE8's bass over-riding their nice but relatively recessed mids and highs, I felt that the Monster Turbine Pro Gold were a little better than the IE8.  Amp synergy was important with the IE8 to me, and only with the ALO Amphora amp did the IE8 sound truly phenomenal (to the point that I could not believe what I was hearing it was so good).  I think they sounded just as you described, but I thought the MTPG's superior bass control and improved balance vs the mids and highs outweighed the IE8's bigger soundstage.  Still, someday I hope to get another IE8 just for listening with the Amphora.  Cheers!​[/size]


 
 Thanks. I really like the balance of the Golds - it is far better than some reading indicated believe before I got them. The mid-bass hump isn't nearly as big as it is on the IE8s but sub-bass is just as present. But I've never really gotten used to the Golds' treble. While technically proficient and very smooth, it just lacks... character. I am a bit of a treble fanatic so something with a bit more bite jives better with me. I have a few other issues with the Golds, especially when a track starts getting busy. Definitely curious to try the Coppers or even the Monster MDs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> headphoneaddict said:
> ...


 

 Yeah, the highs on the Gold can be a little soft, but it makes listening to low bit-rate music a whole lot easier too.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> headphoneaddict said:
> ...


 

 Joker, the Coppers would be a good listen for you since you are more of a treble energy kind of guy.  The Bass is just a smidge short of the Golds and MD's for weight and decay.  The Coppers are also faster than the Golds and MD's so you shouldn't have the same issues when things get 'busy' and they are more accurate.  The MD's for me are like an improved, more sophisticated Gold.  Imagine the Golds but move the smooth and rich Mids forward a bit, present a slightly less warm presentation, a more transparent upper range and maintain the euphonics of the Golds to play anything in pleasing fashion.

  
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Yeah, the highs on the Gold can be a little soft, but it makes listening to low bit-rate music a whole lot easier too.


 

 I don't listen to low bit stuff but sometimes a poorly mastered track is unfixable by user settings.  IMO, IEM's like the Golds and MD's make it so any content is acceptable.


----------



## KLS

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> i must say im surprised you rated the IE8 so highly, i did say they they had quite great treble on them too.
> 
> did you try them with an icon mobile at all? (the two are somewhat made for each other)


 

 I am surprised too, since so many people bashing IE8 for its infamous mid-bass hump.
   
  I believe I am one who doesn't get bothered by the mid-bass hump of IE8. Parting my IE8 for several weeks (I loaned them to my friend and now he won't return them to me...), I listened to them again a few days ago with a brief comparsion with SM3, and surprisingly the midrange clarity of IE8 isn't far behind from SM3, and no mid-bass hump to my ears.
   
  I think my pair of IE8 has undergone some unusual 'process' (like droping or playing too loud at times) that the mid-bass hump has gone. Or is it my dumb ears to be blamed? My crappy iPod?
   
  Thanks joker as always.


----------



## glac1er

Thanks for the review, ljokerl. Very well-written and insightful as always 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Photofan1986

KLS, I think the SM3 also has a bit forward lower mids, and as a result, I think you got accustomed to it so that when you came back to IE8, the midbass hump didn't bother you anymore.
  I got the same feeling. That's why I would say that SM3 are not totally neutral, either.


----------



## cravenz

KLS, the mid bass hump to me tends to be more obvious when you have the bass knob dialed in at the minimum whereas as you increase the variable bass, I find that the mid-bass hump smooths itself out. I currently have mine just a little below three as I am running some tests of SQ with the ACS custom tips on the IE8s.


----------



## KLS

Photofan1986, glad that I am not alone  To my ears there is something weird in the lower midrange of SM3 too. However I don't have my IE8 with me now so I can't compare.
   
  cravenz, I have been using IE8 with bass dial set to maximum for more than half a year I think. Then I changed the bass dial to the minumum and I am happy with it


----------



## cravenz

Quote: 





kls said:


> Photofan1986, glad that I am not alone  To my ears there is something weird in the lower midrange of SM3 too. *However I don't have my IE8 with me now so I can't compare.*
> 
> cravenz, I have been using IE8 with bass dial set to maximum for more than half a year I think. Then I changed the bass dial to the minumum and I am happy with it


 

 you go get those IE8s back ya hear me?! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 lol.
   
  yeah, I'm trying to figure out what I like, I had the bass dialed in at minimum and the middle for most of the time, but had the bass at max the last couple of days, it sounds awesome for some songs, but for the vast majority, I'd prefer the bass at minimum, but I might put it at one cos' after using the bass at max for the last couple of days, minimum is almost anemic! lol. but I'll gradually switch back and get used to the sound again at minimum at some point, it's what I call, ear burn in.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Just got my Eterna v1's this morning after a fun bike ride out to the post office. Been listening to them for about 30min now and the unconscious tap your foot, sing along and nod your head is in full effect. These iem's are not the most clear/precise/micro detailed iem's I have heard but you know what? I don't care! They are just that much fun. I don't need to hear the singers lips open slightly before the words if I'm that enthralled with the feeling of the music and the general rock out vibe they give.
   
  If I get a chance might write up a review although I know some amazing reviews are already out there for them.


----------



## Azathoth

Great thread, I always keep coming back to this one for the comprehensive reviews.
   
  What I'd like to see next:
   
  Westone 2
  Westone UM3X


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


glac1er said:


> Thanks for the review, ljokerl. Very well-written and insightful as always
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   




  Quote:


solidsnake3 said:


> These iem's are not the most clear/precise/micro detailed iem's I have heard but you know what? I don't care! They are just that much fun.


 
 Yep, that pretty much sums them up. Glad you like 'em.

 Quote:


azathoth said:


> Great thread, I always keep coming back to this one for the comprehensive reviews.
> 
> What I'd like to see next:
> 
> ...


 

 Me too! But only one of those is currently on my plate.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Grado iGi and JVC HA-FXC80.


----------



## xtasi

TY joker, just got the JVC ha-fxc80.  Decided to get those because they have the bass, but also the strong treble.  I've always had phones with strong bass but less clarity so I want to see what its like to turn into a treblehead (maybe).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


xtasi said:


> TY joker, just got the JVC ha-fxc80.  Decided to get those because they have the bass, but also the strong treble.  I've always had phones with strong bass but less clarity so I want to see what its like to turn into a treblehead (maybe).


 
 Funny - going to the FXC80 from bass-heavy earphones is equivalent from jumping from red to violet on the color spectrum - probably about as far as you can get. Interested in your impressions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## kjk1281

I've always found the existence of the FXC80s to be both interesting and slightly confusing.  As far as I know, these aren't available in Japan, though that market recently saw the release of the FXC51 and FXC71, the true successors to the FXC50 and 70, respectively.  I'm not exactly sure what JVC is planning to do for this market as the FXC80, despite being marketed as part of the "Black Series," has always been viewed by many (and confirmed by your review) to be an upgrade to the FXC50.  The fact that the FXC50 is readily available here in the US for $20 or less (to clean out inventory perhaps?) makes me wonder if JVC will release the FXC51 and 71 here, or if they'll just let the FX67, which I assume is sold at a higher profit margin, take over their budget line.


----------



## xtasi

Lol joker.  I thought something like the RE0 would be violet.  I chose the HA FXC80 because you mentioned strong and full bass so I thought it would be somewhere in between.  Oh well, we'll see what its like going from Metrofi220 and Denon ahd1001 (CAL!) to these sparkly phones.


----------



## slaters70

Okay, I am waiting for that DBA-02 review, I think (meaning: I am already on board as a DBA fanboy, so even a crushing negative review would not sway me).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kjk1281 said:


> I've always found the existence of the FXC80s to be both interesting and slightly confusing.  As far as I know, these aren't available in Japan, though that market recently saw the release of the FXC51 and FXC71, the true successors to the FXC50 and 70, respectively.  I'm not exactly sure what JVC is planning to do for this market as the FXC80, despite being marketed as part of the "Black Series," has always been viewed by many (and confirmed by your review) to be an upgrade to the FXC50.  The fact that the FXC50 is readily available here in the US for $20 or less (to clean out inventory perhaps?) makes me wonder if JVC will release the FXC51 and 71 here, or if they'll just let the FX67, which I assume is sold at a higher profit margin, take over their budget line.


   
  I don't believe the FXC50 ever became as popular as the FX33/34/66 here despite being the superior earphone in terms of SQ. The very high defect rate may have had something to do with it - out of the four FXC50s that I've owned two were dead out of the box (on one side). The FXC80 seems far more robust. I would certainly not mind trying an FXC71 myself. I never liked the fit of the FXC50s but the FXC71 is angled somewhat and might work better. 

 Quote:


xtasi said:


> Lol joker.  I thought something like the RE0 would be violet.  I chose the HA FXC80 because you mentioned strong and full bass so I thought it would be somewhere in between.  Oh well, we'll see what its like going from Metrofi220 and Denon ahd1001 (CAL!) to these sparkly phones.


 
 The RE0 would also be violet depending on what aspects you are looking at specifically. But the RE0 is not nearly as bright as the FXC80 is. Who knows - maybe you're a treblehead after all. 

 Quote:


slaters70 said:


> Okay, I am waiting for that DBA-02 review, I think (meaning: I am already on board as a DBA fanboy, so even a crushing negative review would not sway me).


 
 No chance of a crushing negative review. These things are too good. The plan is to have it up some time next week along with three other dual-driver earphones.


----------



## rawrster

@slaters70: what if a bunch of people review them and say negative things about them?  Although I doubt that is happening anytime soon unless they came from bass heavy, don't like neutrality or had no idea what they were buying..
   
  I await for your review to come out  Four dual driver iem's sounds like you got your work cut out for you. Good thing you are getting well paid for all this work


----------



## Anaxilus

Joker, have you heard the Klipsch X5?  Finally got to hear them, they were on my short list a long time ago.  They aren't perfect but they are clear, detailed and balanced.  The biggest shock for me was the level of isolation equals my experience w/ ER4s and they are incredibly comfortable at the same time!  For $140 I think I'm gonna have to keep them just for flying.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> I await for your review to come out  Four dual driver iem's sounds like you got your work cut out for you. *Good thing you are getting well paid for all this work*


   
  Yeah, lucky me... 


 Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Joker, have you heard the Klipsch X5?  Finally got to hear them, they were on my short list a long time ago.  They aren't perfect but they are clear, detailed and balanced.  The biggest shock for me was the level of isolation equals my experience w/ ER4s and they are incredibly comfortable at the same time!  For $140 I think I'm gonna have to keep them just for flying.


 
 Nope, the higher-end Klipsch dynamics sort of passed me by, although I did try to get a set of the X10s in that UltimateElectronics rush a while back. I can believe about them being comfortable since they're supposed to be even smaller than the S2/X1. 
   
  I might end up trying one of the X-series IEMs eventually if Klipsch doesn't come out with whatever is meant to replace the Custom line.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Hi!
   
  Well still the same question here.
  Do you guys think I'll learn to listen to IEM if I insist? I ask because the feeling of being closed makes listening to my opened headphones much more pleasing.


----------



## ljokerl

The answer is probably yes but perhaps you should actively seek an open-sounding IEM and not one that is notorious for causing ear pressure build-up. Maybe even something with a 'half in-ear' design like the Phiaton or Audio-Technica dynamics.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

well now they are comfortable for me. I just had my ear to adapt.
  The problem now is only the closed feeling.
  I mean I like them and don't feel like selling them.
  then I will look into the half in ear.
  Does the Radius DDM enter in these half in ear?
  Can you list some them, so I can search a bit about?
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The answer is probably yes but perhaps you should actively seek an open-sounding IEM and not one that is notorious for causing ear pressure build-up. Maybe even something with a 'half in-ear' design like the Phiaton or Audio-Technica dynamics.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Denon AH-C710 and Fischer Audio Toughstuff TS-9002.
  
   
  Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> well now they are comfortable for me. I just had my ear to adapt.
> The problem now is only the closed feeling.
> I mean I like them and don't feel like selling them.
> then I will look into the half in ear.
> ...


 

 I wouldn't say the DDM sounds particularly open and it can be pretty tough too fit unless you're very comfortable with IEMs in general. I was thinking something along the lines of the Phiaton PS210 / ATH-CKS70/90 and Yamaha EPH-50. I'm sure there are others but these come to mind first. I only have the Yamahas and they really don't feel like IEMs at all - more like earbuds with a nozzle.


----------



## kjk1281

That TS-9002 looks quite interesting, and sports an uncanny resemblance to the Marantz HP101.  Thanks for introducing us to what seems like yet another great phone from Fischer.
   
  As for Denon: I've always thought that they charged a bit much for what they were selling, at least when it came to their canalphone line.  At least they're not ripping us off royally like they do to Europeans.
  That said, I'm still interested in a true flagship IEM from Denon (C910/960?) if it ever surfaces.
    
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I don't believe the FXC50 ever became as popular as the FX33/34/66 here despite being the superior earphone in terms of SQ. The very high defect rate may have had something to do with it - out of the four FXC50s that I've owned two were dead out of the box (on one side). The FXC80 seems far more robust. I would certainly not mind trying an FXC71 myself. I never liked the fit of the FXC50s but the FXC71 is angled somewhat and might work better.


 

 Sorry to hear about your troubles with the FXC50.  You're probably right about the sub-par build quality preventing it from becoming more mainstream.  Glad to see that the FXC80 is better in this regard, and hopefully these issues were addressed with the newer FXC51/71.


----------



## rawrster

That Fischer Audio phone definitely has an interesting name  toughstuff but no strain reliefs  They are quickly becoming a company know for good values which is always a nice change.


----------



## chinesekiwi

The Marantz HP101 would certainly be an earphone you should review. Been around for a while tbh, but still rather unknown. I can easily buy it here but go other commitments money wise I've afraid lols.


----------



## mvw2

Small note: The Denon C700 benefited going to a bi-flange tip.  I might suggest you try that out with the C710 as well.  It helps get rid of the midbass and treble bumps and flattens out the response.  A foam tip can help with this too.  The small single flange tip just isn't a good choice for the C700 and it may not be for the C710 either.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kjk1281 said:


> That TS-9002 looks quite interesting, and sports an uncanny resemblance to the Marantz HP101.  Thanks for introducing us to what seems like yet another great phone from Fischer.


   

 Not seeing the Marantz for sale anywhere in the US though I've definitely heard the HP101 name before (just never saw what they looked like). There's also a Kanen model (thanks, jant) with the same housings but I'm not seeing that anywhere either. It'll probably be cheaper than the Fischers if it surfaces but as for the sound - who knows. 
   
  Quote:


chinesekiwi said:


> The Marantz HP101 would certainly be an earphone you should review. Been around for a while tbh, but still rather unknown. I can easily buy it here but go other commitments money wise I've afraid lols.


   
  Just out of curiosity, what's it cost?

 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Small note: The Denon C700 benefited going to a bi-flange tip.  I might suggest you try that out with the C710 as well.  It helps get rid of the midbass and treble bumps and flattens out the response.  A foam tip can help with this too.  The small single flange tip just isn't a good choice for the C700 and it may not be for the C710 either.


 
 The C700 is a straight housing IIRC so that might work with bi-flanges, but the angled C710s really don't, at least not for me. Deep-fitting tips make them intrusive and they're a bit heavy and not exactly flush with my ears in the first place. Comply T(x)400s worked great but of course just add extra cost to the earphones in the long run. UE singles worked fine for me - the Denon stock tips seemed a little less soft/flexible. The treble really isn't offensive - not in the way something like the Grado iGi is.


----------



## rawrster

The Marantz hp101 typically goes for around $100 or so but then you would need some place that ships to US or someone to buy it for you in Japan and ship it to you.


----------



## satur9

Mr. ljokerl, I registered to this forum for the express purpose of thanking you for your time invested & wealth of information you have provided in these reviews.
   
  Admittedly, much of the terms & descriptions of audio were beyond me; nonetheless, I learned more about what I was looking for in an IEM & you have provided much food for thought. 

 As it stands, I believe my choice comes down to the Soundmagic PL50 vs. Brainwavz M1.
   
  Unfortunately I may need to start upgrading my audio files to a higher quality...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> The Marantz hp101 typically goes for around $100 or so but then you would need some place that ships to US or someone to buy it for you in Japan and ship it to you.


   
  Ah thanks. Just as I thought - others are feeling justified to charge more for these housings and I can see why. Hopefully I'll get my hands on more budget-level Fischer phones in the future. Their designs are excellent and so far all three Fischer IEMs I've heard have been pretty darn good value for money.


 Quote:


satur9 said:


> Mr. ljokerl, I registered to this forum for the express purpose of thanking you for your time invested & wealth of information you have provided in these reviews.
> 
> Admittedly, much of the terms & descriptions of audio were beyond me; nonetheless, I learned more about what I was looking for in an IEM & you have provided much food for thought.
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks, I appreciate that. Just an FYI - the head-fi audio glossary might help you out in terms of the lingo and the IEM guide by ClieOS is a must-skim. Both are linked to in the first phone. 
   
  I don't think you can go wrong with either the PL50 or M1. If it matters, I think the PL50 is slightly more forgiving of low bitrates but upgrading your tracks is a good idea either way.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

I am going for the phiaton ps210. I think it gives me too things I want! Not claustrophobic IEM and low isolation earbud.
  I hope I get a way to get them in europe 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Denon AH-C710 and Fischer Audio Toughstuff TS-9002.
> 
> 
> 
> I wouldn't say the DDM sounds particularly open and it can be pretty tough too fit unless you're very comfortable with IEMs in general. I was thinking something along the lines of the Phiaton PS210 / ATH-CKS70/90 and Yamaha EPH-50. I'm sure there are others but these come to mind first. I only have the Yamahas and they really don't feel like IEMs at all - more like earbuds with a nozzle.


----------



## Kubiq

I got Eterna's v1 some days ago and I hate them,they are too harsh and aggressive for me. What neutral/slightly warm IEM would you recommend to me? Budget is ~40£.


----------



## JxK

Do you mean the bass is too much for you? Because I can't imagine it's the highs that are the problem.


----------



## Kubiq

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Do you mean the bass is too much for you? Because I can't imagine it's the highs that are the problem.


 
  Yes,they are too bassy for me.Highs aren't bad but not as smooth as I would like to.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kubiq said:


> I got Eterna's v1 some days ago and I hate them,they are too harsh and aggressive for me. What neutral/slightly warm IEM would you recommend to me? Budget is ~40£.


 
 I would give the Eternas more time. The treble really shouldn't be very harsh. It's not soft but it falls pretty much square in the middle of the spectrum. If you want something more laid-back than that, you'd probably be after relatively rolled-off earphones with softer everything (i.e. ViSang R03). 
   
  If you just want something inoffensive and balanced in that budget take a look at the Soundmagic PL50. They are so gentle that they can be downright boring at times. Wouldn't call them particularly warm but they lean towards the warmer side of neutral.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Hi
   
  I see you comparing the UE triple fi 10 to many IEMs in your list!
  Now I am thinking about selling my triple fi 10. do you have a guess for how it would score in Sound quality?
   
  I have bought a ck9, have you heard it? does it compare to any headphone on your list?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> I see you comparing the UE triple fi 10 to many IEMs in your list!
> Now I am thinking about selling my triple fi 10. do you have a guess for how it would score in Sound quality?


 
 High to very high - I don't mind the TF10 sound - only the fit. The TF10 does a lot of things well. Maybe not $400 well but well enough for the current US price. It's still one of the better bass-heavy multi-armature setups I've heard.
   
   
  Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> I have bought a ck9, have you heard it? does it compare to any headphone on your list?


   
  Sorry, never heard the CK9. It's a pretty old model and just as an FYI there are fakes of them floating around.


----------



## BigDave

well, I took a punt and tried the eterna's version2 and so far was very disappointed by the package - the tips are terrible that come with them (very soft and small ) and what is with the bag?  They should have sprung for a cheap case.  
   
  The sound....well I think I will let them burn in a little longer.  On first listen, with no burn in, the bass is not as "there" as I thought it would be.  With complex music (a lot going on), the eterna's just can't keep up, losing coherency.  I am using UE tips as well as their biflange tips (at the moment) as they work so much better than the ones supplied (toss them away).  
   
  However, they fit perfectly in my ears.  they do not sit deep, but the housing of the phone sits great in the outer part of my ear, and the cables hang great behind my ears without the cable ear guides.  Everything that |joker| said was correct, just waiting on the sound to improve.  They sound very "safe" in comparison to my re0's and UE superfi 5pro's (both of which I prefer far more at the moment).  However, they are much more comfortable to wear.


----------



## ethan961

Give them at least 50 hours of burn-in before making final judgements with any dynamic IEM. 100 hours is ideal and you should have the final sound signature then. They can change rather drastically in ways you would not expect, like the MTPC did for me. Changed from something I hated to something I actually rather liked, which I thought would be impossible at the start.


----------



## BigDave

Thanks Ethan, will do.  Funnily, they already sound better today.  Oh, and thanks for sending them off so quick, got them sooner than I expected 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.  Got to have a talk to Fischer about their accessories, though.  Those tips are really poor.  A small plastic case would also be welcome, and probably cost the same as the little 'baggy' they put in.


----------



## ethan961

No problem, glad you're happy with the service.
   
  As poor as the tips may seem, they've been improved from the originals.
  I agree with you, a hard case would be nice.
  However, I think their philosophy is more of being minimalistic and not adding fancy unnecessary accessories. Reading the writing on the back of the box of the Master series IEMs/headphones explains that.
   
  I have considered looking into supplying cases myself, and if people would like that, I may do so.


----------



## rawrster

That sound magic semi hard case is pretty cheap and would be an improvement over most cases in the market today imo of course. I definitely don't think that a case is unnecessary. I think it's absolutely necessary since most earphones are for portable use and having a case would help if you need to put it in your bag. This one from ebay looks like it's the same thing as the sound magic or shure case.
   
  http://cgi.ebay.com/Carrying-Hard-Case-Storage-Bag-hold-Earphone-Headphone-/150448688663?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item230770ce17


----------



## ethan961

Absolutely, I did not mean to say cases are unnecessary. I use cases for all my valuable items, like phones, iPods, and IEMs. I've had a hard plastic case on my iPod touch 1st gen ever since they came out, and I've abused the *bleep* out of it so much over 3 years (dropping it from 4ft on concrete for demonstration as well as real life abuse) and the case is still intact and there is barely a scratch on the iPod. The case may well outlive my iPod the way things have been going.
   
  That case looks like a good option. I just need to find somewhere that can get me 200 of them without costing me $200, that's the main problem.
   
  Oh, and please do contact FA if you would like to voice your opinions on accessories, it's good for them to see the consumer's reaction too as well as me voicing my opinions (which don't have that much weight unless there is proof, which you guys can help with). Worldwide isn't their primary market at the moment, being a small company that's traditionally been focused on Russia, and sometimes we aren't well enough represented when it comes to these matters as people not in Russia.


----------



## ljokerl

Not sure how I missed this exchange but ethan is right - giving yourself time to adjust as well as running the earphones through for a few more hours is step one for any IEM troubleshooting. 
   
  The case rawrster linked is a nice cheap option if you must have one (2nd cheapest to an altoids tin, probably. If you want a slightly larger case there's the ECCI/Cyclone case which is square in shape and also fits a small DAP (e.g. Sansa Clip) or a 2nd pair of earphones very comfortably. As for pocketable plastic cases, they really aren't very common. UE includes one that is quite close to perfection with their Metro/SuperFi earphones but they want $10+shipping for it if purchased separately, which is quite excessive.


----------



## rawrster

If you want something like that ethan you probably will have to go through some manufacturer or wholesale of those cases if you can find something like that. Although $1 a case is a lot better than most cases out of the market.
   
  $10+shipping is almost as bad as the case that UE makes for the triple fi which is imo the best protecting earphone case. I wish I still had that but I had to include it when I sold them and theres no way I'm paying $15+shipping for that if that's still the price.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> If you want something like that ethan you probably will have to go through some manufacturer or wholesale of those cases if you can find something like that. Although $1 a case is a lot better than most cases out of the market.


   
  True. Also, I'm sure that if a protective hard case was an extra $1.50 option at checkout, many people would grab one for convenience.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Best cheap hard case ever! Bought one about a week back because it looked to be a decent size for coiled IEM's and it turns out to be perfect. The lid seals tight, the case is plenty big and it allows you to easily place a coiled roll of IEM+cable in it safely and comfortably. To top it all off I think it costs $1.99 or $2.99 at your local Trader Joe's store. Oh and you get some Espresso candy things


----------



## David58117

Quote: 





solidsnake3 said:


> Best cheap hard case ever! Bought one about a week back because it looked to be a decent size for coiled IEM's and it turns out to be perfect. The lid seals tight, the case is plenty big and it allows you to easily place a coiled roll of IEM+cable in it safely and comfortably. To top it all off I think it costs $1.99 or $2.99 at your local Trader Joe's store. Oh and you get some Espresso candy things


 

  
  Does that make them smell like chocolate?


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Nice case.
   
  well I have sold my triple fi 10. I liked them but poverty and high end headphones are not so friendly to each other.
  Well I bought a ck9 and so far I LOVE THEM. Very clear, and I am starting to think I don't like much bass, it seems to cover anything else. With triple fi the bass was a bit too much for me. These have weak bass, but with bass booster on iPod it does well.
  These are definetly a keeper. 
  The ck9 I have is great. No microphonics at all, and no feeling of being closed or vacuum. feels great, great comfort also.
   
  I hope I'll have money soon enough to grab a rp-hje900 as I expect to reinvest the money from triple fi 10 in many heapdhones lol.
  Do you guys know whether the rp-hje900 is less claustrophobic than triple fi?


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





david58117 said:


> Does that make them smell like chocolate?


 

 Not if you wash the case out first!....although I got to admit a chocolate smell might be nice


----------



## ethan961

Apparently these are made in Japan.
   
  In any case, that eBay price is cheaper than anything else I've found so far, even wholesale. I might just talk to that eBay seller and see if they'd like to work out a deal.
  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> That sound magic semi hard case is pretty cheap and would be an improvement over most cases in the market today imo of course. I definitely don't think that a case is unnecessary. I think it's absolutely necessary since most earphones are for portable use and having a case would help if you need to put it in your bag. This one from ebay looks like it's the same thing as the sound magic or shure case.
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Carrying-Hard-Case-Storage-Bag-hold-Earphone-Headphone-/150448688663?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item230770ce17


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> Well I bought a ck9 and so far I LOVE THEM. Very clear, and I am starting to think I don't like much bass, it seems to cover anything else. With triple fi the bass was a bit too much for me. These have weak bass, but with bass booster on iPod it does well.
> These are definetly a keeper.
> The ck9 I have is great. No microphonics at all, and no feeling of being closed or vacuum. feels great, great comfort also.
> 
> ...


 
 Audio-Technica replaced the CK9 with the CK10 so I would imagine their signatures wouldn't be polar opposites of each other. 
   
  The HJE900 is pretty easy-going in terms of fit. They are ported so air can escape out the bottom (or front - I can't quite remember where the vent is). But I don't really find the TF10 that bad in terms of intraaural pressure so I can't say anything comparative.


----------



## BigDave

Well, did as Ethan said and sent off a message to Fischer audio on my impressions of their Eterna earphones.  Did it from the message app form on their website.  Not sure what the effect will be, probably nothing.  However, I am a big believer in letting people who provide a good or service know how well they are doing - not enough people do it if you ask me.  How will things change if we don't let them know, good or bad?


----------



## BigDave

Just ordered two of those cases that you guys pointed out on ebay, thanks very much.  Hopefully they turn out to be just what I need for my re0's and eterna's.  
   
  Further update on the sound sig of the eterna's; they have definitely improved but I find myself adding a little bass from my mp3 players - something that I thought I would not have to do.  The tips definitely make a big difference, at the moment using biflange tips (not sure if they are UE or Hifiman ones, got them mixed up in a bag).  They give me the best seal but I feel that they are too deep.  It is definitely a different type of insertion in comparison to the rest of my phones, UE superfi 5pro's included.  I rarely lose seal and they feel comfortable but I want to try different tips to see if I am losing out on something with the sound sig.  Definitely a bigger soundstage in comparison to my other ear canal phones, works well with some music but doesn't work with others.  Sometimes I wonder if it is not a case of burn in but just a case of you acclimatizing to the sound sig.


----------



## ethan961

Oh, something really big that I haven't noted before. If you're shoving the stock bi-flanges in - you may want to try not doing so. It took me a couple weeks to figure it out, but I noticed that insertion depth plays a big part in the sound with those tips. Try putting them in as normal and then slowly pulling them out. You'll hear it when you're at the sweet spot. The biggest flange should be resting just barely totally in the ear, not deeper in the canal. That is, with my ears at least. Most bi-flanges do rest like that, but these ones are easy to just shove in farther than the average bi-flange.
   
  EDIT: Noticed you weren't sure which tips. Since it sounds similar to what I'm describing, maybe try it anyways and see what you can find.
   
  And yeah, that's exactly what I mean! You find yourself hearing things you'd never think were possible before burn-in.
   
  I say burn-in nay-sayers are people that simply haven't experienced it. It's fairly clear that it does exist - plugging something in for 250 hours straight, without a listen since unboxing and hating it then, and loving the IEM post burn-in can't lie.


----------



## JxK

I can't figure out how to break apart a quote, so I'll just add my response in blue.
  Quote: 





ethan961 said:


> Oh, something really big that I haven't noted before. If you're shoving the stock bi-flanges in - you may want to try not doing so. It took me a couple weeks to figure it out, but I noticed that insertion depth plays a big part in the sound with those tips. Try putting them in as normal and then slowly pulling them out. You'll hear it when you're at the sweet spot.
> 
> Interesting. I use the meelelec biflange for my right ear with my VBs, so I'll play around with insertion depth and see how it works. Will report back tomorrow on my results. Thanks for the advice.
> 
> ...


----------



## ethan961

The 250 hours wasn't meant to signify anything other than being sure they were burned in. I just plugged them into a stereo for a few weeks before listening other than right out of the box with the Coppers. Night and day I tell you. I was expecting them to still sound like something I don't like (so no bias in favour there) so that's what nailed it for me.

 So yeah, I'm not one of those people who believe in insane burn-in times, it's just because I left them burning in for a few weeks while I reviewed other new equipment.


----------



## Bennyboy71

Good to see you doing your bit for energy conservation.
  
  Quote: 





ethan961 said:


> The 250 hours wasn't meant to signify anything other than being sure they were burned in. I just plugged them into a stereo for a few weeks before listening other than right out of the box with the Coppers. Night and day I tell you. I was expecting them to still sound like something I don't like (so no bias in favour there) so that's what nailed it for me.
> 
> So yeah, I'm not one of those people who believe in insane burn-in times, it's just because I left them burning in for a few weeks while I reviewed other new equipment.


----------



## ljokerl

A few more budget options - Koss KE29 and Yamaha EPH-20


----------



## rymd

Finally!
  I was pretty curious to see how the koss ke29 compared to the marshmallows in your opinion as retail store low budgeters


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rymd said:


> Finally!
> I was pretty curious to see how the koss ke29 compared to the marshmallows in your opinion as retail store low budgeters


 
 I suppose it's ironic, then, that the KE29 was the one I screwed up. The chart was right but the score in the review was wrong. Fixed now. And yeah, they're definitely better than unmodded marshmallows (not much to brag about there...).


----------



## Jozurr

hey joker! Im thinking of upgrading from my current PL30 (the sound signature i really love.. very unfatiguing) to either of 1) Silver bullet (2) Maximo im590 (3) Brainwavz M1.. im assuming all of them have a somewhat similar sound signature and I can sleep in all of them. How much of an upgrade do you think it will be between the three? Will they be comfortable enough to sleep in? thirdly.. how long does mp4nation take to ship the M1?

   

 Edit: Also.. I can consider something you recommend under the$75-80 mark given the above requirements


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:
   


jozurr said:


> hey joker! Im thinking of upgrading from my current PL30 (the sound signature i really love.. very unfatiguing) to either of 1) Silver bullet (2) Maximo im590 (3) Brainwavz M1.. im assuming all of them have a somewhat similar sound signature and I can sleep in all of them. How much of an upgrade do you think it will be between the three? Will they be comfortable enough to sleep in? thirdly.. how long does mp4nation take to ship the M1?
> 
> Edit: Also.. I can consider something you recommend under the$75-80 mark given the above requirements


 
 Well, keeping in mind I haven't heard the Silver Bullets yet I would say the M1 is a good choice. It does have a somewhat similar signature to the iM-590 but the treble is a little tamer. The M1 is still a relatively bright earphone so if you're _extremely_ sensitive to treble the ViSang R02 might be a better option, since it's smoother at the top (and more rolled off) and has more forward mids. And yeah, it's a sizable upgrade over the PL30. Much crisper and more detailed. As for sleeping - it depends on yours ears. I can sleep in the M1/R02 housings fine but they aren't as flush as earphones like the PL30/PL50/M6. Also you may want to read up on the ThinkSound Rain, though the sleeping requirement rules them out IMO (and I personally prefer the M1 anyway). 
   
  Mp4nation shipping is a bit of a wildcard. On average probably takes around 2.5-3 weeks for delivery but I've had one item take much, much longer.


----------



## rawrster

heh still can't get over that P10 can you  (I think it was this..I know it was a Sound Magic headphone for sure). Although I'd like to avoid Mp4nation completely if possible since I'm not that patient of a person.
   
  All of these recommendations for the M1 have been tempting me even though I know I don't need another one


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> heh still can't get over that P10 can you  (I think it was this..I know it was a Sound Magic headphone for sure). Although I'd like to avoid Mp4nation completely if possible since I'm not that patient of a person.


 
 Yeah that's right - the P10. I'm a reasonable person but when a "guaranteed in stock" item takes a full 60 days to leave the warehouse, it sort of sticks in my memory. Of course Mp4nation did bring us the Brainwavz M1 so I'd call it even.


----------



## SolidSnake3

jeez and I thought the 3 weeks my eterna's took was excessively long!


----------



## Jozurr

Forward mids? More KSC-75 like? I don't need agressive sound and I dont like the KSC-75 sound signature.. its fatiguing.. i need earphones to relax at night.. sleep in them etc.. So The M1 would be better or the Visang R02?
   
  Is there no other website that sells the M1?
   
  Thirdly.. the M6 are $20 at buy.com right now.. do you think that's a good upgrade from the PL30s?
   
  My ears are small and i use the smallest foam tips with the PL30s.. so would sleeping in the housings of M1 and R02 be a problem?
   
  I had decided to go with the PL30s on your recommendation and it couldn't have been better.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Well the Brainwavz brand is owned by mp4nation so no, no other place to buy them (except maybe used on the forums).
   
  And no, the R02s don't really sound like KSC75s. The PL30s have slightly forward mids as well and the R02s are similar in that respect. I find the ViSangs to be pretty relaxing in comparison to the M1s, which are a little more sparkly. The M1s are a little smaller in terms of fit but if you have very small ears (not just small ear canals) you probably won't be able to sleep in either.
   
  The M6 is not very relaxing. Strong bass and strong treble. It's a 'fun' signature. Really, the PL30s are pretty unique (which is why many don't like them) and it's hard to upgrade from them. The RE252 would be the natural choice but of course that's pretty high up there in price. Have you considered the PL50? It's wonderful to sleep in and the only area it's beaten by the PL30 in is airiness/soundstage width.


----------



## Jozurr

I have smaller ear canals.. I had fit issues with the UHP606.. which used to hurt my ears for some reason and i had to sell them off.
  So size wise is the difference enough to make me not consider the ViSangs compared to the M1?
   
  I think I would have to rule out the M6 given that I don't like strong bass which fatigues me.. and i don't think it's going to be as much of an upgrade from the PL30s as the ViSangs or the M1.
   
  I was considering the PL50 but what put me off is the lack of instrument separation and airiness but more importantly the lack of bass on the PL50 which I read is apparent when compared to the PL30s. I really can't do without any less bass than the PL30, which was another reason to sell the UHP606s. Also, I don't know if that's a step up worth the price I'll be paying for the PL50s.
   
  Also, do you think the balanced armature of the PL50s would sound nicer on lower volumes compared to the M1? The PL30s lose out detail on lower volumes.
   
  The deal on the M1 (M1+FiiO E1 for $49.99) is very tempting.
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well the Brainwavz brand is owned by mp4nation so no, no other place to buy them (except maybe used on the forums).
> 
> And no, the R02s don't really sound like KSC75s. The PL30s have slightly forward mids as well and the R02s are similar in that respect. I find the ViSangs to be pretty relaxing in comparison to the M1s, which are a little more sparkly. The M1s are a little smaller in terms of fit but if you have very small ears (not just small ear canals) you probably won't be able to sleep in either.
> 
> The M6 is not very relaxing. Strong bass and strong treble. It's a 'fun' signature. Really, the PL30s are pretty unique (which is why many don't like them) and it's hard to upgrade from them. The RE252 would be the natural choice but of course that's pretty high up there in price. Have you considered the PL50? It's wonderful to sleep in and the only area it's beaten by the PL30 in is airiness/soundstage width.


----------



## ljokerl

The difference in size between the M1 and R02 is very small. They use the same housings but the R02 has an added rubber piece that acts as a strain relief and the M2 doesn't. There's a pic of both in my original R02 review thread.
   
  The instrument separation of the PL50 isn't that bad and the bass is present. I've never thought the PL30s had particularly strong bass. Both the PL50 and M1 are quite decent at low the volumes when the PL30 loses detail.
   
  Also I think there's a coupon code to get a free Fiio E3 with the M1 (freee3), not that it's useful in any way.


----------



## ljokerl

Dual-driver shootout!
   
  Added: Fischer Audio DBA-02, Audio-Technica ATH-CK90Pro, JAYS q-JAYS, and Phiaton PS200


----------



## 2rooi123

very informative joker! i agree on a 10/10 for dba-02 but i sold them because they really lack that bass rumble of dynamics (mtpg,hje900,etc). On the other hand the phiaton ps 200 are too bright for me and even has less bass than dba-02. Radius ddm is the winner imo


----------



## a_recording

I'm so glad that the CK90Pros finally got a shout joker - awesome writeup! I know you've had a fair amount of time with them. I was wondering really how they compared to the spectrum of IEM's at large, because I do feel after getting them that I was in possession of something a little underappreciated. 
   
  Have you tried the foam mod (changing the amount of foam in the stem) by any chance? I'm wondering how much closer they get to the CK10 as a result of changing the amount of foam - would it become a holy grail of a CK10 with more bass? (Well, not a holy grail... bass decay times are still a big issue I feel...)
   
  Your impressions line up with how I feel the DDM and the CK90Pro sound though. I have one question though - do the DBA-02's have a more natural bass decay feel to them than the CK90Pros? I'm pining for an IEM with DDM like bass decay, with BA armature treble speed and articulation...


----------



## Photofan1986

This thread is really becoming comprehensive!
  An outstanding job has been done, and a big THANKS to Joker! 
   
  It is one of the most comprehensive and detailed, yet very enjoyable review here on HF. Kudos!


----------



## Bennyboy71

Joker, thanks heaps for the new reviews.  I'm intrigued by the DBAs, but as I already have the SM3s, I need to figure out if thats just the autistic itch of the geeknerd in me rather than anything else.
   
  By the way, can you please get hold of the SM3s, either through crime or honest means, cos I want to see how you rate them.  Me, I give them 9 tentacles up.


----------



## rawrster

I was wondering when those reviews would be posted. Nice reviews and your DBA-02 thoughts comes pretty close to how I feel about them and my issue with them build wise mostly is that useless chin slider.


----------



## tacomn

you can just cut if off though if you dont like it right?


----------



## rawrster

you could I guess but it won't be that easy. It isn't a plastic tube like some chin slider but more similar to the slider than comes with the coppers, golds, etc. I haven't tried and probably never will. If it bothers me enough I'll make my own but I haven't had them in my possession for a while now.


----------



## tacomn

ljokerl Your review on the dba has not helped in the least to deal with my high level of anticipations


----------



## slaters70

Of course, being a major DBA-02 fan, your review Mike was right on the money for me. Having owned the CK10 in the not-too-distant past, your assessment is perfect. I sold the CK10s mainly because I could not get a comfortable long-wear fit with the tips I preferred, but otherwise we share the same sensibilities when it comes to IEMs. My top two IEMS? The DBAs and the lowly (price-wise) Cyclone PR1 Pros. I have to thank LFF for his introduction to the DBAs, and you for unveiling the PR1s (boy, how I wish I had kept my backup pair of those now).
   
  Anyway, I think the most interesting aspect of your DBA review is that as you say, some might prefer the IE8/DDM sound for bass presentation, and that's cool. But anyone who wants just enough tight, articulate bass (and a tad more than the CK10, which is good) and clean, clear detailed mids and highs owes it to themselves to try a pair of DBAs.
   
  As you may know, they are on sale for $145 now, if that sale is still open, at Budgen,so an even better value.
   
  Excellent work Mike. Of course, you are preaching to the converted.
   
  Someday, I would like to read your review of the SM3, as Benny says. My guess is we'd hear them the same way as well - excellent, albeit very expensive, IEMs, but just a bit too warm (if that's the best term) for those who prefer the DBA/CK10 signature. But who knows?


----------



## slaters70

No reason to cut it off. It's just sort of poorly executed, as it slides back down way too easily.
  
  Quote: 





tacomn said:


> you can just cut if off though if you dont like it right?


----------



## slaters70

Mike, just realized...91 IEMs reviewed! Wow, that is amazing. You can quit when you hit the century mark.


----------



## tacomn

well if it doesnt work I might as well cut it off as to take up less space


----------



## rawrster

Have you seen pics of the chin slider? It barely takes up any space.


----------



## tacomn

ya but I mean if it serves no function then its just kinda a waste. It probably would make rapping my cord around my mp3 alittle harder when on the go.


----------



## ethan961

Quote: 





tacomn said:


> It probably would make rapping my cord around my mp3 alittle harder when on the go.


 

 Please, for the sake of your IEMs, do not do that. Not only am I the one who would be honoring your warranty claim, it's a real easy way to kill IEMs fast. Only do it with cheaper buds. Anything expensive, a case works wonders for longevity.
   
  And about the chin slider, I mostly use it during storage to keep the two sides from getting tangled up in some mess, which is usually all I do with chin sliders.


----------



## rawrster

I hope an actual case comes with the DBA-02 in your next batch Ethan. The cleaning cloth I got was understandable since it's was a last minute thing but not everyone has multiple cases like I do and that thing is still in my desk drawer gathering dust. The leather case did look like it would protect well so I would assume a proper case will come with the next batch.
   
  Also yes wrapping these earphones around your mp3 player probably wouldn't last very long. Too many things can go wrong that way. Get a good case (ebay is cheap) or use an altoids tin can and they would work great. I have many altoids tin cans that are now used as earphone cases.
   
  Soon I get to hear mine again  Ironically shortly after I sent the DBA02 off I got a package of tips to try on the DBA02


----------



## mvw2

Quote: 





a_recording said:


> I'm so glad that the CK90Pros finally got a shout joker - awesome writeup! I know you've had a fair amount of time with them. I was wondering really how they compared to the spectrum of IEM's at large, because I do feel after getting them that I was in possession of something a little underappreciated.
> 
> Have you tried the foam mod (changing the amount of foam in the stem) by any chance? I'm wondering how much closer they get to the CK10 as a result of changing the amount of foam - would it become a holy grail of a CK10 with more bass? (Well, not a holy grail... bass decay times are still a big issue I feel...)
> 
> Your impressions line up with how I feel the DDM and the CK90Pro sound though. I have one question though - do the DBA-02's have a more natural bass decay feel to them than the CK90Pros? I'm pining for an IEM with DDM like bass decay, with BA armature treble speed and articulation...


 

 Bass is an interesting front when it comes to IEMs and options between dynamic and balanced armature earphones.
   
  On one side you have frequency response and the general ability to maintain sensitivity down into the lowest of notes.  There are a number of earphones out there are are entirely capable of getting to 30Hz with ease, both in dynamic and BA formats.  For many that don't naturally, a lot of the rest do actually respond well to EQing to get to the same end result.  Some of these depending on their design may be limited in output capability and cleanliness doing so.  For example, the SE530 can't produce a 30Hz tone, at all, even with a +20dB gain on the EQ.  They just roll off so early and so far that you might be putting in about 30dB of gain on the thing just to hit that note.  Even after that, the driver needs to produce that note cleanly.  For something like the SE530, the drivers used have a TON of throw and can probably do it with enough gain, but the gain is ridiculous.  For something like the RE252 which has outstanding mids and treble and still retails good bass extension, presence, and impact, it suffers a little in clarity of low note.  It is more evident when EQing when the earphone lacks responsiveness to adjustments and the general sound presented isn't quite coherent or as clean as another option.  What one would like to see is a very easily identifiable note and a readiness to adjust linearly with the EQ change.  For example, I should be able to take a 50Hz point and move the EQ up and down and very directly hear the change with the earphone with a very distinct and perceivable presence with the bump or cut put into the response.  Worse earphones will respond less readily and the change won't really stand out.  It effectively isn't producing a 50Hz tone well, sensitivity there or not.
   
  Outside of the response and plain ability to even produce a low frequency sound wave cleanly and coherently, there's a LOT of play in _how_ the note is presented.  Notes can be light and crisp or thick and fluid.  The notes may be very laid back and smooth or could be very energetic and edgy.  The note could have high impact or have a lot of texture and body.  There's a ton of variation.  This actually works the same up through the midrange and treble too, but your interest is bass like a lot of people.  In my eyes, an earphone that has a good bass response needs to first have the sensitivity, either natural or EQed in.  The notes need to be clean and coherent as in a 50Hz note is a 50Hz and not just rumbling or noise.  There should be some thickness and body because it allows for weight and raw presence of the note as well as the ability to articulate information during the attack and decay of that note.  A lot of information can get lost or I should say simply does not get presented if the notes are too short, too clean.  This again works the same way through the midrange and treble.  It's why something like the CK10's treble is so good, it is "thick" and has a lot of micro detail between the notes, i.e. articulation, that a ton of other earphones really don't present at all due to being to sluggish or in some cases too clean.  Bass is no different. 
   
  Typically in a good earphone I look for two things, dynamic range, and articulation of note.  You will ALWAYS get a better end sound if you have both.  The dynamic range should be able to work between subtlety (so few earphones do this well) and explosive energy (again rather uncommon), and so few earphones can do both well.  Out of good 100 products you might have two that do this well to where a whisper or a light brush across a guitar string is presented with that realistic softness and quiet presence.  A lot of earphones either don't present it or presented it too loudly to where there isn't any separation between quiet events and events that are medium in loudness.  Articulation is the other.  This is the texture, the variation in between the note.  With enough, you can no only hear the singer sing, but you can almost see how he/she is moving their lips.  It's the difference between hearing a bass guitar note and recognizing which guitar he/she is using.  I'm a fan of cellos which has a nice, deep, and reverburation.  With good articulation you pick up all the variation in how the string is handled how the bow hits the string, variation in pressure on the bow, and let off.  It's not just a note being held.  There's a lot of little things going on during the action, and that texture and articulation is what gives that.  This is also an area where you pick up outside information like room echos, random noises, and so on that help create the sound stage in size, space, and location of everyone in that space.  Every single earphone I've used that has presented a very good sound stage are earphones that have good articulation of notes.  I know I'm not specifically talking about bass here, but this readily transitions to bass just the same.  This isn't so much a matter of a synthesized 30Hz tone which is simple, clean, and easier to reproduce accurately.  It's more a matter of recreating more complex bass lines from kick drums, from a bass guitar, cello, bass sax, timpani (kettledrum).  While most of this is well above 40Hz, it still requires a device that can very accurately present and articulate low frequency notes down into the double digits.  So few products out there are really capable of doing this so very well.  When you think of bass you don't think of subtlety or micro detail, but these things exist just as much at 60Hz as they do at 600Hz or 6000Hz.
   
  As far as thickness and texture in notes, dynamic drivers have typically won.  BA setups many times are just too clean and short on note.  Dynamic range is typically better with BAs though and BAs tend to be capable of presenting in a more explosive, edgier note.  Dynamics often do subtlety a little better though.  Now these really aren't end all statements.  Frankly, I'd more prefer a BA for cleanliness and dynamic breadth, but to find one that does bass really well requires it to be quite thick in note.  Examples would be the ER4S, Custom 3, Triple.Fi 10, or UM3X.  These are a bit unlike the squeaky clean and short notes of a lot of BA earphones.  The thickness and flow is a little more akin to a dynamic driver but still with a BA kind of cleanliness to it.  If you are a bass head and want to stick to a BA setup, you will generally want to lean in this direction.  You try and find those earphones that are thicker and well bodied.  For dynamic earphones you sort of go in the other direction.  Too thick equals muddy and sloppy.  BAs tend to resist this problem despite being able to thicken up.  The Custom 3 and Triple.Fi 10 can at times be a bit blended and almost muddy in a sense relative to other BAs but from a large standpoint still really clean and detailed.  For dynamics, you can run into problems more readily.  You really try to look for control and look for a driver that can be quick and articulate..  I wish I could comment more on dynamics, but I just haven't listened to as big a variety as Joker.  I haven't used many dynamic bass kings like the Atrilo or Hippo.  I kind of went to BA and high end in general so I'm stuck at the IE8 only for a good high end bass dynamic.  I've used the MTPG which has great extension and control in the lower frequencies.   I've used cheaper earphones like the Eterna, and M9 (good when quiet, very small linear range of travel) that offer different varieties of good low frequency traits.  The Eterna has a car subwoofer kind of feel to it, the M9 is robust and filling as long as you keep the volume low.
   
  Going back to the CK90Pro, they are more of a classic BA sound, clean, separated, lacking some in thickness and texture.  The low frequency quality and extension is great though with a 50Hz remaining clean and accurate and sensitivity running basically ruler flat all the way down.  If this thing had a little more thickness and texture, it would be outstanding.  It's a good example of getting some of the things spot on like frequency response, extension, and quality of sound, but it's also an example of falling short in thickness, texture, articulation that would really fill out the presence.
   
  As to the foam mod, I too am curious about how the CK90Pro would sound without or less foam.  I will say that the CK90Pro is ruler flat in response.  To my ears and a pretty much infinitely adjustable on tap, there really isn't anything I can do with the CK90Pro across the entire spectrum within 1dB.  There are so few earphones out there that I can't touch unless I want to mess something up.  The CK10 has a similar flatness short the treble when it has, again to my ears/testing, a narrow 9dB spike at 12kHz.  The CK90Pro doesn't have that at all being flat through that area, and the CK90Pro doesn't roll off on the bottom end like the CK10 does at around 50-60Hz.  The CK90Pro is arguable better, but the CK10 does things like the CK90Pro doesn't, like have texture and articulation within the notes.  The micro detail is there.  It is "filled out" in the notes, and this transitions all the way up to the highest of trebles.  It is very unnatural relative to the norm for a BA to do this.  The CK90Pro is a more "classic" BA sound but presented really freaking well.  Without an EQ on hand, I would be hard-pressed to pick one over the other.  They are just different trade-offs.  With an EQ, the CK10 is the better option.  Heck, even without an EQ but an open cell foam tip, the CK10 is livable on the top end and still offers more texture and realism.  Due tot he flatness of response with the CK90Pro, I would be hesitant to change out the foam, although I do feel you can get a little more detail doing so.  It would have to be less foam + EQing though.  It was sort of the same case with the RE0.  You could pull the foam on that, but you had to add a bit more EQing into it to get you back to a reasonable place for frequency response.  For how flat the CK90Pro is, I would touch nothing.  Even with the RE0, I put the foam back in because it was a more workable solution.  The foam on the CK90Pro is also glued in, so it's not as easy of a thing as what the RE0 offered.  There would be a bit mroe hassle with the process and I think it's a bad trade off when the frequency response is already so good.  If it rolled off on the top end, I'd say go for it, but with things the way they are, you're just making things worse.


----------



## tacomn

ya dont listen to me, I dont make sense in the wee hours of the night. I plan on using my smallish leather case always to carry them as well as I always use chin straps to make them feel secure.


----------



## jant71

Okay, back on topic, nice work on all the dual drivers Joker!
   
  What I have noticed is the armature phones go through development phases and get better. The single drivers got better first, then the duals got better, and now the triples are starting to getting better. Right now the duals are ahead and a better value in many cases. The triples are improving from the Triple.fi 10 and SE530 days but maybe only the more recent SM3 are starting to reach a higher point of their potential.
   
  I also agree that you can quit when you reach 100 or at least start Multi-IEM Review Part 2 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





!


----------



## tacomn

the iem market right now seems to be changing in front of my eyes and just O so exhilarating


----------



## JxK

Great addition joker. The dba-02 review is especially interesting, since you ranked it higher than the lauded PFE.


----------



## ethan961

Me too. I need to talk to FA and see if they want to go into a bulk buy with me - I found a supplier but 1000 cases minimum is a bit much for just me to spend. I'm sure they would be alright with a few thousand FA stamped cases in similar fashion to the case you listed.
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I hope an actual case comes with the DBA-02 in your next batch Ethan. The cleaning cloth I got was understandable since it's was a last minute thing but not everyone has multiple cases like I do and that thing is still in my desk drawer gathering dust. The leather case did look like it would protect well so I would assume a proper case will come with the next batch.


----------



## a_recording

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> As to the foam mod, I too am curious about how the CK90Pro would sound without or less foam.  I will say that the CK90Pro is ruler flat in response.  To my ears and a pretty much infinitely adjustable on tap, there really isn't anything I can do with the CK90Pro across the entire spectrum within 1dB.  There are so few earphones out there that I can't touch unless I want to mess something up.  The CK10 has a similar flatness short the treble when it has, again to my ears/testing, a narrow 9dB spike at 12kHz.  The CK90Pro doesn't have that at all being flat through that area, and the CK90Pro doesn't roll off on the bottom end like the CK10 does at around 50-60Hz.  The CK90Pro is arguable better, but the CK10 does things like the CK90Pro doesn't, like have texture and articulation within the notes.  The micro detail is there.  It is "filled out" in the notes, and this transitions all the way up to the highest of trebles.  It is very unnatural relative to the norm for a BA to do this.  The CK90Pro is a more "classic" BA sound but presented really freaking well.  Without an EQ on hand, I would be hard-pressed to pick one over the other.  They are just different trade-offs.  With an EQ, the CK10 is the better option.  Heck, even without an EQ but an open cell foam tip, the CK10 is livable on the top end and still offers more texture and realism.  Due tot he flatness of response with the CK90Pro, I would be hesitant to change out the foam, although I do feel you can get a little more detail doing so.  It would have to be less foam + EQing though.  It was sort of the same case with the RE0.  You could pull the foam on that, but you had to add a bit more EQing into it to get you back to a reasonable place for frequency response.  For how flat the CK90Pro is, I would touch nothing.  Even with the RE0, I put the foam back in because it was a more workable solution.  The foam on the CK90Pro is also glued in, so it's not as easy of a thing as what the RE0 offered.  There would be a bit mroe hassle with the process and I think it's a bad trade off when the frequency response is already so good.  If it rolled off on the top end, I'd say go for it, but with things the way they are, you're just making things worse.


 

 Nice explanation. I wish the CK90Pros had more texture too - in frequency sweeps they start at around 25hz, which means the bass is there. 
   
  I think I might have been a bit unclear though - I actually *have* done the foam mod on the CK90Pro. What I did was pull out the existing yellow foam, and stick in about half the volume of gray foam from the earpads of my old Koss KSC75's. I think its a huge improvement for me, because it lifts the 90Pro's veiled, dark sound and makes them sound a bit more airy. I did have to experiment for quite a long time though, to leave just enough foam in before I began being irritated by the sibilance.
   
  What I'm interested in, is whether the CK90Pro with the foam mod is comparable to the CK10, and also if the DBA-02 has better bass texture/decay than the CK90Pro... or in other words, would ljokerl give the CK90Pro a 10 for sound if he did the foam mod?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:
   


2rooi123 said:


> very informative joker! i agree on a 10/10 for dba-02 but i sold them because they really lack that bass rumble of dynamics (mtpg,hje900,etc). On the other hand the phiaton ps 200 are too bright for me and even has less bass than dba-02. Radius ddm is the winner imo


   
  Thanks, and I agree - the PS200 has a lot of amazing qualities but its flaws keep it from ranking with the better $200+ IEMs. The treble energy and soundstage are lovely but the sibilance and lack of bass body bother me. 


 Quote:


a_recording said:


> I'm so glad that the CK90Pros finally got a shout joker - awesome writeup! I know you've had a fair amount of time with them. I was wondering really how they compared to the spectrum of IEM's at large, because I do feel after getting them that I was in possession of something a little underappreciated.
> 
> Have you tried the foam mod (changing the amount of foam in the stem) by any chance? I'm wondering how much closer they get to the CK10 as a result of changing the amount of foam - would it become a holy grail of a CK10 with more bass? (Well, not a holy grail... bass decay times are still a big issue I feel...)
> 
> Your impressions line up with how I feel the DDM and the CK90Pro sound though. I have one question though - do the DBA-02's have a more natural bass decay feel to them than the CK90Pros? I'm pining for an IEM with DDM like bass decay, with BA armature treble speed and articulation...


   
  Yeah, I've had the CK90Pros for six months or so. They're difficult earphones to peg down (for me at least) but very interesting and I'm glad I bought them. I ignored the foam mod as logic dictates that it would result in harsher treble and that's something the CK90Pro definitely does not need (plus it's not 100% reversible). I didn't like de-foamed RE0s, either. And yeah even the CK10 has more natural decay times than the CK90Pro does (and the DBA-02 fares even better than that). Some people would really be bothered by that aspect of the CK90s but I don't mind much. But I doubt the foam mod would fix that. And no, no BA-based in-ear that I've heard will give you the decay of the DDM. The UM3X is probably closest but its presentation bothers me hugely and I would never use it as my day-to-day earphone. 


 Quote:


photofan1986 said:


> This thread is really becoming comprehensive!
> An outstanding job has been done, and a big THANKS to Joker!
> 
> It is one of the most comprehensive and detailed, yet very enjoyable review here on HF. Kudos!


 
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I plan for the thread to become more comprehensive still unless of course the consensus is that I should stop when I hit triple digits.
   
  Quote:


bennyboy71 said:


> Joker, thanks heaps for the new reviews.  I'm intrigued by the DBAs, but as I already have the SM3s, I need to figure out if thats just the autistic itch of the geeknerd in me rather than anything else.
> 
> By the way, can you please get hold of the SM3s, either through crime or honest means, cos I want to see how you rate them.  Me, I give them 9 tentacles up.


   
  Thanks. The SM3 has me intrigued but not quite enough to go out and drop the lump sum that EarSonics is asking for so we'll see what happens.

 Quote:


slaters70 said:


> Of course, being a major DBA-02 fan, your review Mike was right on the money for me. Having owned the CK10 in the not-too-distant past, your assessment is perfect. I sold the CK10s mainly because I could not get a comfortable long-wear fit with the tips I preferred, but otherwise we share the same sensibilities when it comes to IEMs. My top two IEMS? The DBAs and the lowly (price-wise) Cyclone PR1 Pros. I have to thank LFF for his introduction to the DBAs, and you for unveiling the PR1s (boy, how I wish I had kept my backup pair of those now).
> 
> Anyway, I think the most interesting aspect of your DBA review is that as you say, some might prefer the IE8/DDM sound for bass presentation, and that's cool. But anyone who wants just enough tight, articulate bass (and a tad more than the CK10, which is good) and clean, clear detailed mids and highs owes it to themselves to try a pair of DBAs.
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks. And yes, I'm aware of the sale but I'm assuming it's temporary so no point in editing the thread/table. Since that drops it into a lower price bracket the value would be 10/10.
  
 Quote:


slaters70 said:


> Mike, just realized...91 IEMs reviewed! Wow, that is amazing. You can quit when you hit the century mark.


 
 Hah, you're just afraid that I'll cause you to buy more universals 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Bass is an interesting front when it comes to IEMs and options between dynamic and balanced armature earphones
> On one side you have frequency response and the general ability to maintain sensitivity down into the lowest of notes.  There are a number of earphones out there are are entirely capable of getting to 30Hz with ease, both in dynamic and BA formats.  For many that don't naturally, a lot of the rest do actually respond well to EQing to get to the same end result.  Some of these depending on their design may be limited in output capability and cleanliness doing so.  For example, the SE530 can't produce a 30Hz tone, at all, even with a +20dB gain on the EQ.  They just roll off so early and so far that you might be putting in about 30dB of gain on the thing just to hit that note.  Even after that, the driver needs to produce that note cleanly.  For something like the SE530, the drivers used have a TON of throw and can probably do it with enough gain, but the gain is ridiculous.  For something like the RE252 which has outstanding mids and treble and still retails good bass extension, presence, and impact, it suffers a little in clarity of low note.  It is more evident when EQing when the earphone lacks responsiveness to adjustments and the general sound presented isn't quite coherent or as clean as another option.  What one would like to see is a very easily identifiable note and a readiness to adjust linearly with the EQ change.  For example, I should be able to take a 50Hz point and move the EQ up and down and very directly hear the change with the earphone with a very distinct and perceivable presence with the bump or cut put into the response.  Worse earphones will respond less readily and the change won't really stand out.  It effectively isn't producing a 50Hz tone well, sensitivity there or not.
> 
> Outside of the response and plain ability to even produce a low frequency sound wave cleanly and coherently, there's a LOT of play in _how_ the note is presented.  Notes can be light and crisp or thick and fluid.  The notes may be very laid back and smooth or could be very energetic and edgy.  The note could have high impact or have a lot of texture and body.  There's a ton of variation.  This actually works the same up through the midrange and treble too, but your interest is bass like a lot of people.  In my eyes, an earphone that has a good bass response needs to first have the sensitivity, either natural or EQed in.  The notes need to be clean and coherent as in a 50Hz note is a 50Hz and not just rumbling or noise.  There should be some thickness and body because it allows for weight and raw presence of the note as well as the ability to articulate information during the attack and decay of that note.  A lot of information can get lost or I should say simply does not get presented if the notes are too short, too clean.  This again works the same way through the midrange and treble.  It's why something like the CK10's treble is so good, it is "thick" and has a lot of micro detail between the notes, i.e. articulation, that a ton of other earphones really don't present at all due to being to sluggish or in some cases too clean.  Bass is no different.
> ...


 
 Thanks for that. Very informative, as usual. Had to wait until I got off work to read it attentively. And I agree, the foam mod on the RE0 was a no-no for me. I wouldn't call them ruler-flat to begin with and without the foam they became a bit piercing.

 Quote:


jant71 said:


> Okay, back on topic, nice work on all the dual drivers Joker!
> 
> What I have noticed is the armature phones go through development phases and get better. The single drivers got better first, then the duals got better, and now the triples are starting to getting better. Right now the duals are ahead and a better value in many cases. The triples are improving from the Triple.fi 10 and SE530 days but maybe only the more recent SM3 are starting to reach a higher point of their potential.
> 
> ...


 
 Well, the CK10 and Q-Jays have been around for years - since before a couple of the 'modern' triple-drivers were even announced. But in general I agree and this is sort of the problem I have with the SE535 - Shure seems to be convinced that aside from the physical issues their earphones were near perfect as-is - probably not the best position in a crowded and quickly-evolving market.
   
  And... vote two for ending this thread. Has it really run its course? I am hesitant to split it up as I think a one-page resource is more or less convenient. There's really no good way to split it up that I can see - price is useless as some earphones hit way above theirs and people will always want to see newer earphones compared with older ones. 

 Quote:


jxk said:


> Great addition joker. The dba-02 review is especially interesting, since you ranked it higher than the lauded PFE.


 
 Thanks, and yes - the PFE is not quite good enough to compete with the range of multiple armatures and thus has an inherent disadvantage. It's a good earphone still but I really want to see a dual-driver from Phonak


----------



## slaters70

Didn't mean you should quit at 100. The century mark seems so regal is all. Keep on going,no problem from me.


----------



## a_recording

I think a one page resource is incredible. Its nice to just be able to keep everything on the same spectrum.
   
  I'm one who also found the RE0 foam mod to make it piercing (I'm fairly sensitive to sibilance - for some bizarre reason, especially when I lie down.) But I don't know - whether it was the type of foam I replaced the stock foam with in the CK90 Pro (the Koss earbud foam I think is a little denser than the yellow spongey foam in the 90Pros) or whether changing the foam affects different frequencies of treble differently, I found that changing the foam out for me, with some experimentation did not increase sibilance in the region that I'm most sensitive to (8000hz.) while it improved the roll off above 15k which is what most bugged me about the 90Pros. I can hear up to 18.5k in tests, as I'm relatively still young heh...
   
  And I keep looking at my DDM's and wonder if there is some way to mod them. They appear to be completely sealed though...


----------



## rawrster

I agree that you should keep reviewing here. The previous thread had to be updated to this one due to lack of space. I think you should continue until you run out of space and then move on to another thread then. This is definitely a good resource for the confused newcomer to earphones past ibuds.


----------



## mvw2

Quote: 





a_recording said:


> Nice explanation. I wish the CK90Pros had more texture too - in frequency sweeps they start at around 25hz, which means the bass is there.
> 
> I think I might have been a bit unclear though - I actually *have* done the foam mod on the CK90Pro. What I did was pull out the existing yellow foam, and stick in about half the volume of gray foam from the earpads of my old Koss KSC75's. I think its a huge improvement for me, because it lifts the 90Pro's veiled, dark sound and makes them sound a bit more airy. I did have to experiment for quite a long time though, to leave just enough foam in before I began being irritated by the sibilance.
> 
> What I'm interested in, is whether the CK90Pro with the foam mod is comparable to the CK10, and also if the DBA-02 has better bass texture/decay than the CK90Pro... or in other words, would ljokerl give the CK90Pro a 10 for sound if he did the foam mod?


 
   
  The CK90Pro uses different drivers than the CK10.  It is impossible to replicate what the CK10 does.  While you can do a little bit to the top end frequency response and reduce some diffusion of the sound and improve imaging with the removal of the filter, you can't really make the drivers sound different from what they are.  It means you're largely stuck with what's there.  The drivers are just a bit different.  There is some similarity in the goals of both earphones since the engineers are still choosing drivers that share a number of traits they're shooting for.  However, the CK10 carries a lot of micro detail and the CK90Pro does not.  The CK90Pro driver is better in dynamics though.  While the top end is a bit hot on the CK10, when it's balanced out via EQing, the earphone is relatively tame in energy of note.  The CK90Pro carries more raw energy in the note.  The CK90Pro has the benefits of a flatter frequency response and less sensitivity to poor recordings.  The CK90Pro is a very likable earphone.  The CK90Pro is kind of like the RE0 in that it doesn't really do anything wrong.  You may seek something different here or there in how audio is reproduced, but the earphone isn't really flawed.  I could call the CK10 more flawed due to the treble spike and some roll off on the bottom end.  The CK10 reproduces audio more accurately, but if you gave the CK90Pro and CK10 to 100 people and asked them what they liked better, I have a feeling there might be a majority towards the CK90Pro due to CK10's treble spike and the extended bottom end of the CK90Pro.  I still feel the CK10 is the better buy, but the CK90Pro is an earphone you can enjoy without having to put up with or get used to a hot top end (unless you have EQing).
   
  I do question if modifying the CK90Pro is beneficial.  Typically the goal with any mod is to improve the end result.  Many times this may be a series of trade-offs, some you want, some you don't.  Hopefully in the end, the benefits out weigh the detriments.  Sometimes it doesn't.  For example with my OK1 buds which are bright, I've toyed with adding cotton batting to balance out the response.  I can approach a frequency response that is more balanced, but I introduce problems too, mainly a lack of detail and create a much more indirect sound due to diffusion of the sound waves through the material.  The end result is more balanced but lacking as direct and articulate sound.  I would much rather do nothing and EQ the earphone to the desired response.  For the CK90Pro it's the opposite where it starts with foam and you can do some improvements by removing it.  However, with a frequency response as flat as it is stock, I question the willingness to turn a perfectly good setup into one that may almost require an EQ to be livable.  You spent a good bit of time trying to get the correct end result or at least a result you can live with.  For me I see something like the CK90Pro sort of like the RE0.  Yes, you can remove the foam, but you may very well put it back in or a majority of it back in just to get back to a livable solution.


----------



## mvw2

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ljokerl*
> 
> 
> 
> And I agree, the foam mod on the RE0 was a no-no for me. I wouldn't call them ruler-flat to begin with and without the foam they became a bit piercing.


 
   
  Never said the RE0 was ruler flat, just the CK90Pro.  The RE0 requires a bit of EQing with or without foam and the amount required without foam is considerable.  Yes, the RE0 can be a bit piercing.  There is also a small amount of ringing that comes out which is a partial reason for the foam.   They are just better with foam.  I never really thought there was enough to gain with the removal even when EQing both options.


----------



## a_recording

The CK90Pro is definately not ruler flat - but it does come close... even listening to it to what I assume is an amp capable of properly powering their modest requirements, on 20-20,000hz frequency sweeps it does do the usual IEM trick of warbling up and down in response. They thin out significantly towards the top end. This is what I observed before I played with the foam a little, and its still what I observe to a lesser degree after changing the foam.
   
  The RE0 and the RE252 actually are more ruler flat to me in frequency sweeps, but they are ruler flat - on a diagonal... they just climb inexorably louder as you leave the lower frequencies.
   
  I guess as long as this forum exists we will never have something ruler flat and level - and thats not even beginning to talk about variations in everyone's hearing XD


----------



## mvw2

Different ears, different perceptions.  I don't know.  When I test frequency response I run a pink noise track and run a software EQ that is for all intensive purposes infinite in adjustment.  With most earphones I will EQ something.  With the CK90Pro, I have no place to add or subtract to fix anything.  I could say I might add a couple dB at 30Hz, but at that point it gets hard to discern.  The RE252 is very linear, but I do  EQ sloped slightly down, i.e. is slightly bright stock.  The result is pretty much a flat line across the spectrum with only a little extra adjustment at the ends.  There should be some care in sine sweeps.  Higher frequencies are automatically louder because there is more there.  You can EQ with frequency tests, but I find it less consistent.  I prefer pink noise.  For one, you have all frequencies at once so you can immediately hear whatever you want in real time.  A pink noise track is also equal in intensity across the spectrum so a 10kHz tone is the same intensity as a 100Hz tone because it runs a 3dB/octave cut across the board which counters the area gain under the curve as the octaves go up.  Basically 100Hz-200Hz has twice as much there as 50Hz-100Hz, and for a normal sine wave, this holds true because the area under the curve is relative to octave.  I toyed with test tones some time back, but once I stepped to pink noise I never went back or to anything else.  Starting out it takes a while to get accustomed to hearing a mass of sound and discerning a number of frequencies at one time.  Starting out it could take an hour just to be able to EQ something reasonably well once.  After you do it a hundred times you can do it in a couple minutes.  This is something I've used religiously for my car audio setups.  I've run a couple dozen drivers through my car and had to match different tweeters, mids, subs together, evaluate driver performance, pick workable x-overs, balance out everything, EQ each side, and time align everything.  Pink noise made the job easy, and I've stuck with it.  Once accustomed to it and some experience under your belt, it's a very quick and repeatable tool.  The only downside is if you don't use it for a while, you're a bit sluggish wrapping your mind around it again.  Just starting out it's much more so, but I value it much more than test tones or sweeps.
   
  I do agree, different ears, different response.  Even one's own ears change over time, and our minds have little sound balance and tends to auto tune to what we're familiar with.  I kind of see pink noise as a cleansing device to help neutral out our perception because it has no bias.  Even volume level changes reshape the perceived loudness across the spectrum.  I tend to EQ at my normal listening levels to ensure what I tune to is what I would normally be at when listening to music.


----------



## Bennyboy71

someone send Joker a pair of SM3s....PLEASE!!
   
  I would send mine, but for some reason I experience pain whenever I'm away from them


----------



## Hero Kid

I've always thought to myself if I ever bought some SM3s I'd send them on to Mike first. I've never actually mentioned this to him but it's something I've promised myself.


----------



## Prog Rock Man

Thanks to Bennyboy71 I am going to get a listen to the Radius DDM, which I see did quite well in the list. (I will not read the actual review as I want to decide myself how they sound). AKG are my preferred brand, so purely out of curiosity I have been searching for info on their IEMs and have found, well nothing of note. Joker, will you review any AKGs?
   
  (Amazing thread BTW 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


a_recording said:


> And I keep looking at my DDM's and wonder if there is some way to mod them. They appear to be completely sealed though...


   

 I think they could use an extra vent or two 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> I agree that you should keep reviewing here. The previous thread had to be updated to this one due to lack of space. I think you should continue until you run out of space and then move on to another thread then. This is definitely a good resource for the confused newcomer to earphones past ibuds.


 
 To be honest it doesn't seem like there's a post size cap under the huddler system. I've certainly beat all of my previous records with this thread and the portable shootout and the VBulletin limits (10,000 characters or 37 photos per post) no longer seem to apply. The only thing I worry about is page load times and how taxing a 120-IEM shootout would be on a reader's attentiveness. 


 Quote:


hero kid said:


> I've always thought to myself if I ever bought some SM3s I'd send them on to Mike first. I've never actually mentioned this to him but it's something I've promised myself.


 
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Unfortunately international loaning can be unnecessarily nerve-wracking and expensive. There's got to be at least a dozen US-based SM3 owners so I'm sure something will happen eventually. Worst case scenario is that I'll have to grab my car on a weekend and go listen to average_joe's set. 

 Quote:


prog rock man said:


> Thanks to Bennyboy71 I am going to get a listen to the Radius DDM, which I see did quite well in the list. (I will not read the actual review as I want to decide myself how they sound). AKG are my preferred brand, so purely out of curiosity I have been searching for info on their IEMs and have found, well nothing of note. Joker, will you review any AKGs?
> (Amazing thread BTW
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks. No plans for any AKGs at this time as I've still got a massive backlog (see post #8) including some interesting stuff. I still constantly get questions about why an in-ear thread has no Shures, Westones, or mid-range Sennheisers. Truth is that I simply can't afford to buy every earphone out there. The gear I add to this thread falls into three categories - stuff I grab on sale and/or used that I'm actually curious about myself (majority of the earphones), pairs loaned to me by other head-fiers who want to see how they stack up and/or just benefit the community, and manufacturer samples (just a handful so far). I do wonder if the cheap AKGs floating around ebay are genuine or not.. doesn't seem like their IEMs are high-profile enough to be copied but I could be wrong.


----------



## mvw2

I think the important thing to take away is if you want to see something reviewed by Joker, you send it to him.   You want a SE530 or SE535 up to represent the Shure love, you send him one.  You want to see a SM3, W3, or anything else up there, send it to him.  Just expect to be without it for several weeks due to the time involved getting used to the product, understanding it enough to pass judgment and impressions on that product (and relative to other products at hand), and to work through the back log of stuff already on the table.


----------



## Aaron1006

Best thread ever.
   
  Looking forward to what you have to say about the RE-ZERO compared to the RE0/RE252


----------



## Prog Rock Man

Thanks for the response Joker. AKG do not appear much in fakeheadphones.com, not that that will make them immune. I take you point about the waiting list and demand.


----------



## Bennyboy71

I hope Shure, Sennheiser and Earsonics are reading this and respond with bubble wrapped packages directed accordingly.
  
  Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> I think the important thing to take away is if you want to see something reviewed by Joker, you send it to him.   You want a SE530 or SE535 up to represent the Shure love, you send him one.  You want to see a SM3, W3, or anything else up there, send it to him.  Just expect to be without it for several weeks due to the time involved getting used to the product, understanding it enough to pass judgment and impressions on that product (and relative to other products at hand), and to work through the back log of stuff already on the table.


----------



## Prog Rock Man

And AKG. My impressions of the Radius HP-TWF11 are very similar to the review here.


----------



## jwhitakr

Outstanding round-up of dual drivers --- kudos!  My favorite line was from the PS200 conclusion ---> "... and aesthetics Monster’s earphone division could envy."  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  (hmmm.... maybe I should start a new thread about your thread: "Favorite quotes from Joker's humongous IEM thread???)
   
  The FA DB-02 looks really interesting (as does the Radius DDM), but I just wish Radius and Fischer Audio were widely available in the U.S.  I am interested to try them out, but can't justify making it a priority if they are so hard to get a hold of.


----------



## JxK

joker, out of curiosity, since you change earphones so often, which ones do you keep coming back to during "breaks"? Is it just your M6 for the gym, or something else too?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


aaron1006 said:


> Best thread ever.
> 
> Looking forward to what you have to say about the RE-ZERO compared to the RE0/RE252


   

 Thanks and... coming soon. 
  
  Quote:


prog rock man said:


> Thanks for the response Joker. AKG do not appear much in fakeheadphones.com, not that that will make them immune. I take you point about the waiting list and demand.


 
 Oddly I don't think I've ever seen an AKG earphone for sale on the forums here, either. They could be absolutely brilliant but as far as I can make out no one has purchased a set in the two years since they were released. The K340 certainly looks nice though.
   
  Quote:


bennyboy71 said:


> I hope Shure, Sennheiser and Earsonics are reading this and respond with bubble wrapped packages directed accordingly.


 
 You guys will be the first to know if an SM3 shows up at my door (heck I'd even settle for an SM2).
  
  Quote:


jwhitakr said:


> Outstanding round-up of dual drivers --- kudos!  My favorite line was from the PS200 conclusion ---> "... and aesthetics Monster’s earphone division could envy."
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. And yeah, such is the nature of the market. At least Fischer & Radius aren't like JVC/Victor who don't even acknowledge international demand for some of their high-end products. Radius is (officially) distributed by ALO and Fischer by bugdenaudio.


 Quote:


jxk said:


> joker, out of curiosity, since you change earphones so often, which ones do you keep coming back to during "breaks"? Is it just your M6 for the gym, or something else too?


 
 Well I have the luxury to pick and choose but I do use the CK10 quite a bit when it's not out on loan, especially for short naps, and the MTPG for going to sleep at night because it's just so... relaxing. For grab-and-go use I'm currently coming back to the ViSang earphones a lot (R02/R03) as the signature appeals greatly to me and I don't really worry about knocking them about. I was using the Eterna too but one of the strain reliefs has now come unglued. 
   
  For workouts and cycling I usually come back to the M6 but when I have something exercise-worthy to review I usually use that instead. Currently that would be the H2O Audio Surge earphones which are actually surprisingly good.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well I have the luxury to pick and choose but I do use the CK10 quite a bit when it's not out on loan, especially for short naps, and the MTPG for going to sleep at night because it's just so... relaxing. For grab-and-go use I'm currently coming back to the ViSang earphones a lot (R02/R03) as the signature appeals greatly to me and I don't really worry about knocking them about. I was using the Eterna too but one of the strain reliefs has now come unglued.
> 
> For workouts and cycling I usually come back to the M6 but when I have something exercise-worthy to review I usually use that instead. Currently that would be the H2O Audio Surge earphones which are actually surprisingly good.


 

 Two surprises.
  1) No DBA-02 mentioned. Any particular reason?
  2) H20 Audio... really? I've never seen a review of them (never looked for one either), so I know ZERO about their sound, but nonetheless, kinda surprised.
   
  And... lastly, what makes the M6 specific to workouts? (sorry if that's a really stupid question...)
   
  cheers
   
  shane


----------



## rawrster

The M6 is indeed good for workouts and such now that their memory wire isn't so difficult to move. First their cables are very good and not just very good for the price but very good regardless of price. They are cheap and have a memory wire which makes workouts and any physical activity a good choice for the M6. I'd use it for that but I like the sound of the PL30 better.


----------



## kjk1281

I was eagerly awaiting your CK90PRO review.  Very interesting direction that AT has taken with that particular model, from the peculiar placement within the company's lineup to its more monitor-like presentation.  I'm a bit unsure of whether I'll enjoy their sound signature, but their lower price in Japan (around $150) will probably force me to keep an eye on them.
   
  I'd also love to see some AKGs (and some of the other makes you mentioned) in your review.  I've been intrigued by them, particularly the K370, but they're a bit too expensive here in the US for me to try sound unheard.
   
  Also, my two cents regarding the continuation of the review: I'll just say that time spent segmenting or splitting the review is time better spent listening to headphones and/or reviewing them. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





tacomn said:


> the iem market right now seems to be changing in front of my eyes and just O so exhilarating


 

 These are quite exciting times for the headphone forum poster... I mean headphone listener.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> The M6 is indeed good for workouts and such now that their memory wire isn't so difficult to move. First their cables are very good and not just very good for the price but very good regardless of price. They are cheap and have a memory wire which makes workouts and any physical activity a good choice for the M6. I'd use it for that but I like the sound of the PL30 better.


 

 Hmm... good points. Microphonics need to be kept to a minimum when working out or it'll drive you crazy. Sitting still is one thing, but jammin' on a run or bike or treadmill... whatever, the last thing you want is cable sounds in your head.
   
  Decent sound and not bank-breaking. I can see that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  shane


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


shane55 said:


> Two surprises.
> 1) No DBA-02 mentioned. Any particular reason?
> 2) H20 Audio... really? I've never seen a review of them (never looked for one either), so I know ZERO about their sound, but nonetheless, kinda surprised.
> 
> And... lastly, what makes the M6 specific to workouts? (sorry if that's a really stupid question...)


   
  Well, the DBA-02 wasn't mine so it really can't be one of my 'regulars', at least not anymore. If I had the choice I'd still use the CK10 as I prefer the sound by a hair and the build/form factor by a mile.
   
  Perhaps I should have phrased what I said about the H2O buds differently... they are much better than I thought they would be given the 'enhanced bass' marketing buzzwords, mass-market slant, and the fact that they are waterproof. I think they actually keep up pretty well with 90% of the sub-$50 earphones I've heard and the ability to just rinse them off after returning home from my cycling trek is quite nice. 
   
  Which brings me to the M6. Rawrster got most of it - no microphonics and very secure fit (quite Westone-like, actually, but with the added security of the memory wire) are the big factors. There's also the fact that they are 100% flush with my ears and unlike most earphones are not at all susceptible to wind noise, which is vital for cycling down the coastline. Also the isolation is just average, which means that I (probably) won't be hit by a car. Lastly, I feel that the slightly v-shaped sound signature is perfect for low-volume listening (again so that I won't be hit by a car) as it keeps them engaging but not distracting. Also I listen to a lot of trance/electronica during my workouts and the M6 are excellent for that.
   
   
  Quote:


kjk1281 said:


> I was eagerly awaiting your CK90PRO review.  Very interesting direction that AT has taken with that particular model, from the peculiar placement within the company's lineup to its more monitor-like presentation.  I'm a bit unsure of whether I'll enjoy their sound signature, but their lower price in Japan (around $150) will probably force me to keep an eye on them.
> 
> I'd also love to see some AKGs (and some of the other makes you mentioned) in your review.  I've been intrigued by them, particularly the K370, but they're a bit too expensive here in the US for me to try sound unheard.
> 
> Also, my two cents regarding the continuation of the review: I'll just say that time spent segmenting or splitting the review is time better spent listening to headphones and/or reviewing them.


 
 I assume, then, that the CK10 is actually more expensive than the CK90Pro in Japan? That would make a lot more sense to me than the weird import-based pricing we have here that puts the CK90Pro in the same price category.
   
  And thanks, the review will keep going, at least until I run out of earphones


----------



## kjk1281

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I assume, then, that the CK10 is actually more expensive than the CK90Pro in Japan? That would make a lot more sense to me than the weird import-based pricing we have here that puts the CK90Pro in the same price category.


 
   
  That seems to be the case.  The lowest price listed for the CK10 according to Kakaku.com is ¥20270, or about $230.
   
  Quote: 





> And thanks, the review will keep going, at least until I run out of earphones


 
   
  Thankfully for me (and perhaps unfortunately for you), that's probably not happening anytime soon.


----------



## JxK

^Don't forget that the m6 are relatively shallow insertion, which when combined with the over ear design negates any and all microphonics.
  Also, the shallow fit, while providing decent isolation, lets you hear enough that they're almost safe for street use as well.


----------



## shane55

Thanks to all who commented on the M6.
  My E4c's have been my gym cans for years. On certain gym days I will wear the UM2 (just to mix it up a bit). Last few weeks, the SE535 (I've actually had them on almost everywhere) as I break them in and test them out. But that's just temporary. So I'm looking for something for when the E4c's give up the ghost... or just another set to switch out. I figure if I like the DBA-02 well enough I'll have them as my go-to gym cans.
  But having inexpensive fall-back alternatives never hurts. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Thanks again.
   
  shane


----------



## swbf2cheater

i definitely do not agree with the Re0 being higher on the list than the Eterna.


----------



## 129207

maybe you should make your own list then?


----------



## mcnoiserdc

lol
  
  Quote: 





negakinu said:


> maybe you should make your own list then?


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





shane55 said:


> Thanks to all who commented on the M6.
> My E4c's have been my gym cans for years. On certain gym days I will wear the UM2 (just to mix it up a bit). Last few weeks, the SE535 (I've actually had them on almost everywhere) as I break them in and test them out. But that's just temporary. So I'm looking for something for when the E4c's give up the ghost... or just another set to switch out. I figure if I like the DBA-02 well enough I'll have them as my go-to gym cans.
> But having inexpensive fall-back alternatives never hurts.
> 
> ...


 
  I'm not sure about the DBA-02 for the gym but then again you do use the E4 for the gym which is something I wouldn't have done when I owned them. I found their cables pretty heavy from regular use. Although back up choices is always a great thing. I have a couple backups if my main earphone ever gets damaged. I also have my M9 in case my PL30 goes back as well. If only I liked the M6 more than the M9 I would get the M6 to go alongside with thePL30.


----------



## Baycode

I use my Meelec M6 sport version while motorbiking. I know its not safe to wear earphones but these eaphones does not isolate much and I always keep the volume down. So I can hear the outside noise. They don't touch anything else under the helmet and you can forget about them while riding. Near zero microphonics... 
   
  M6 is also my sleeping earphones. They dont touch my pillow and distract me...
   
  For more critical listening and all the other times I preffer my Denon AH-C710. They are better in sq.
   
   IjokerI, do you close your eyes while you test these iems? Also are all the room conditions exactly the same while testing different earphones at different times? I appreciate what you're doing so please don't get me wrong, I just wanted to know your test procedure in more detail.
   
  I am also planning to buy Fioo E5 amp with RE0 and I have a question, will I be gaining something sonically over the C710's (unamped)? Will the soundstage be wide enough to reach a C710 on the amped RE0? Will the bas be good enough to match the C710's? I have never heard RE0, and I have no opportunity listen them before ordering. So your valuable thaugths are wellcomed.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I'm not sure about the DBA-02 for the gym but then again you do use the E4 for the gym which is something I wouldn't have done when I owned them. I found their cables pretty heavy from regular use. Although back up choices is always a great thing. I have a couple backups if my main earphone ever gets damaged. I also have my M9 in case my PL30 goes back as well. If only I liked the M6 more than the M9 I would get the M6 to go alongside with thePL30.


 

 From the looks of things the DBA-02 cable looks similar (but maybe beefier) to the UM2. I like the UM2 for the gym as well, but the E4c cable is great as I use it: Durable, and heavy enough not to get all swinging on me and interfere. That's my main issue with the UM2 at the gym, it's light cable is all over the place... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  The SE535 cable is marginally microphonic (very dependent on eartips), and a bit thick / stiff for the gym in the long haul.
  So far I'm hearing that isolation is not #1 with the M6 (you, Baycode and others). Great for certain things. But at the gym I'm zoning out and really don't want to hear the disco being pumped into the place or the dropped weights or the whirring of the machines. I like it q-u-i-e-t.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  shane


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> i definitely do not agree with the Re0 being higher on the list than the Eterna.


 

 I don't even know how you can compare them. They are two vastly different IEMs made for different purposes and catering to opposing tastes. Very much apples and oranges. Both are fruit, and that's where the similarity ends.


----------



## Pianist

Good assessment of the q-jays. I generally agree with everything you say, but I would add that the lower mids are actually excellent on these IEMs - they are very rich, clear and detailed. Listen to some piano - it sounds fantastic on the q-jays! Too bad the upper mids are recessed and the treble is a bit harsh, otherwise these would've been superb.


----------



## ethan961

Yeah, Eterna vs RE0 is practically comparing an elephant and a giraffe and saying they're both living animals found in a zoo. They have a head, legs, tail, etc, but that's where the similarity ends.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





shane55 said:


> From the looks of things the DBA-02 cable looks similar (but maybe beefier) to the UM2. I like the UM2 for the gym as well, but the E4c cable is great as I use it: Durable, and heavy enough not to get all swinging on me and interfere. That's my main issue with the UM2 at the gym, it's light cable is all over the place...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I guess I see your point here. Something like that doesn't bother me as much but isolation on the DBA-02 is definitely better than the M6 and near one of the best isolation I've had with Shure triple flange tips. I had to adjust a bit to the increased bone conduction when I first got them which was surprising for me. The cable on the DBA-02 is still very light and similar to the Westone ES cable I have except the ES cable is better in certain aspects such as build quality, has a memory wire, right angle plug and the fact that the chin slider actually works as a chin slider.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I guess I see your point here. Something like that doesn't bother me as much but isolation on the DBA-02 is definitely better than the M6 and near one of the best isolation I've had with Shure triple flange tips. I had to adjust a bit to the increased bone conduction when I first got them which was surprising for me. The cable on the DBA-02 is still very light and similar to the Westone ES cable I have except the ES cable is better in certain aspects such as build quality, has a memory wire, right angle plug and the fact that the chin slider actually works as a chin slider.


 

 Another plus for the DBA-02 !! No memory wire. With glasses, these are a real pain in the arse. The wire on my SE535's are better than the ones on my UE's, but it's still an issue, especially at the gym. Ugh. They make me crazy. Talk about conduction and microphonics! The glasses temple piece tapping the wire section (thicker and more rigid) is enough to... well you get the point. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  shane


----------



## swbf2cheater

Quote: 





jxk said:


> I don't even know how you can compare them. They are two vastly different IEMs made for different purposes and catering to opposing tastes. Very much apples and oranges. Both are fruit, and that's where the similarity ends.


 
   
  Pretty easy actually.  The Re0 doesn't seem as well rounded to me, its not as fun or engaging and its a little more expensive, it is 3.5x as hard to drive as the eterna, has a much smaller frequency range, is a tad bit less sensitive at 100db, and i think its output is less than the eterna as well.  
   
  so...ya...does that answer?    Not saying the re0 sucks or anything, i think its pretty awesome but not really as awesome as the eterna srry, its got less of everything compared to the eterna in terms of stats.  One is kinda airy and neutral and one is warm and engaging.  But, a common trend here on head fi is to place the neutral sets above the warm and colored ones.  I heavily disagree with that.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> But, a common trend here on head fi is to place the neutral sets above the warm and colored ones.  I heavily disagree with that.


 

 I disagree with that statement. Both signatures get their love on head-fi but from my experience those that are warm and colored get more. You have the IE8, W3, Coppers, etc that are all pretty warm and many others that get their recognition here. However it's not like the reviews here are the final word here. At the end of the day it is just one person's opinion.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> But, a common trend here on head fi is to place the neutral sets above the warm and colored ones.  I heavily disagree with that.


 

 Last thing I want to do is flame or start an argument, but from what I see around here, I'm not so sure that's true. Yes, there is a push for 'neutrality' by many here, but if it were as common a trend as you say there wouldn't be such devotion and admiration for M50, Dennon (2, 5, & 7k), HD 600 - 650, DT990, etc. Yes, it obviously exists... especially when discussing the top tier cans (T1, HD800, LCD-2, etc), and in some IEM threads (like this one?), but I can't honestly say it's more pervasive than the other.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Then again... maybe I just haven't been paying attention. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  shane


----------



## mvw2

Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> i definitely do not agree with the Re0 being higher on the list than the Eterna.


 

 Realize that Joker's ranking does not only include SQ but also things like comfort, price, etc, so it's more of a total package ranking.  I could see ranking vary depending on what traits people seek too.  We all look for different characteristics when we listen to music.  We deem certain traits necessary, some preferred, and some we don't want to hear.  There are inherent capabilities and limitations with each product.  All reviews are also subjective and will always carry some form of bias along with it driven by the individual's own perceptions.  I know when I review and comment on hardware I carry some bias along with it, expectations, preferences, etc.  The RE0 is an earphone I don't particularly like personally, but I see value in the product that would rank it high on the list.  There are some things it can not do well, but it performs a lot of key traits that are important in audio reproduction.  If I were to include the Eterna, I can say I enjoy listening to the Eterna more and the Eterna does certain things better, like sound stage and locational cues.  At the same time I can call it somewhat limited too once I step past the fun factor of this earphone.  It offers less detail than the RE0.  How a product ranks depends upon what traits one values.  Between my own impressions and how Joker has reviewed a range of products, I do feel his comments are pretty close to what I experience as well.  No two people ever match 100% in experience.  Everyone just hears different, has a different range of experiences, and has different personal preferences and interests in sound reproduction.  In some lights I can see why one would rank the Eterna higher, yet in other lights I can see why the RE0 would be ranged higher.  This will always be a subjective matter.  This is also why it's nice for many members on this forum to share their experiences with the products they own and provide their own reviews, comments, and comparisons.  It's really only through group concensus that we really see how products rank in an unbiased light.  We as individuals can only share one viewpoint.  A group can provide scaled perspective.
   
  I like the talk about neutrality.  I will say a couple things on the subject.  First, when I review I always EQ everything flat, at least "flat" to my ears.  I agree with you that there is some bias for coloration simply because it favors certain preferences and certain music types.  I tend to try and cut this out.  This way there is no response bias when looking at finer details of a product.  I do see value in more people reviewing products on such a basis, _but_ the comments should include raw characteristics of how the sound is produced as well as the natural coloration of the product and what it means to the end sound.  The downside is it may take hardware people don't have.  For what I use, I use my my Meier 2Move which offers a solid, well respected DAC and a good amount of wattage on tap to not limit an earphone's ability.  I use my PC and some $40 software to run a software loop through a robust EQ just to let me get something functional enough to be useful and without limitations.  I run a pink noise track to which I am very accustomed to working with and EQ a product, typically through several attempts before I reach a solid, repeatable setting.  For someone not used to the process, it would take hours, continuous, to do.  It unfortunately is something I consider beyond what most folks would be willing to endure just to decolor a product for review.  Then there's the review itself which of course takes time, typically weeks of listening and many hours just to start to become aware of all the nuances of the product.  It's even a greater challenge to compare a slew of products together and to scale all aspects.  Then one is to expect to rank them, hopefully with minimal bias.  This is quite a challenge. 
   
  Second, more neutral earphones are better in the sense that they work more easily for more people over a broader range of products without the need for EQing.  There is value in that, and this does make the earphone more pleasant to listen to for most people.  One could argue that a non-flat frequency response is a flaw of an earphone, although coloration of sorts are desired traits for people as well as sound engineers developing these products.


----------



## ethan961

Keep in mind that |Joker| is one who loves neutral sound signatures. I think the rating the Eterna got is pretty impressive for having the opposite sound signature to what he usually likes. I'm not meaning bias, but simply that it's harder to like something that you normally wouldn't like.
  An Aussie would hate to be stuck with Marmite, and a Brit would hate to be stuck with Vegemite.
   
  As an aside, Vegemite is way better


----------



## swbf2cheater

dang that got a little hot fast didnt it
   
  one guy above said that there *is* a push for neutrals but that its not as common as i said?  lol, im not sure how to argue with that so i wont lol, that is not winnable, its like saying dude your bike is red and then saying red bikes dont exist
   
  So, what exactly would be the reason to place the re0 above?  Nostalgia?  A preference? If thats so, thats fine.  But as i said by the pure stats of the Eterna, it should be placed above the re0.   It's got better everything, but again, because the Re0 is more neutral, it would more than likely be placed above the eterna even with the eterna 1upping it on everything but the sound type.  In a point system the eterna would dominate the re0.  In terms of sound quality, both are equals but on different paths.  So...i see no reason to put the re0 above it outside of for the sake of saying "its neutral"
   
   
  edit:  for the record, ive only recently started thinking this way.  I am no longer fond of a neutral sound.  I sold off every set i own that is neutral.  After 2 decades of listening mostly to neutral sound, I just cant do it anymore and find myself reverting back to the warm, fuzzy, engaging sounds.  I had the re0 for a long time and when i sit there and use it, I think "wow, thats clear, nice separation!"
   
  but as soon as i got my eterna rev1, I kind of flipped out and said "holy crap...this sound is intensely fun and i could use this all day every day"  So yes, my point was it is a pick your soda type thing, its just that one soda is cheaper and has more stuff in it.


----------



## mvw2

I said the same thing when I got my Eterna.  I made a post about it titled "Holy crap..." haha.  I agree, there is much fun factor to the Eterna.  This is why ClieOS ranked them so high.  I feel Joker is seeking more than just enjoyment alone.  It's not that enjoyment isn't bad and heck it's desired, but there should be more to it.  We are describing SQ here and part of that is attempting perfect sound reproduction.  In some ways the enjoyment shouldn't be the earphone.  It should be the music.  The UM3X has a big problem with this.  It is an earphone that can sound quite boring, but it has incredible SQ.  It's a product that doesn't make music sound better.  It just shows you what's there, and many times what's there is boring.  The music might be simple or there is a lot of compression, or the artists really don't put a lot of heart and energy into their work.  You'll be surprised by how much music is pretty ho-hum when you can hear everything very distinctly.  Some earphones have a way of making a lot of music fun regardless of what level of energy, passion, etc. the music carries.  The Eterna could be said to be one like this.  This isn't bad, but it also sheds light that it isn't reproducing the original source so faithfully.  Things get hidden, not played, or overshadowed.  Should we rank it high simply because it's fun or should we look more at how accurately it reproduces the source material?  Which should we rank higher?
   
  My words are from a guy who does really like the Eterna and think it's a really great product and a person who's owned the RE0 and disliked it moderately.  Despite owning both and having more enjoyment with the Eterna, I can not tell you the Eterna should be ranked above the RE0.  It just depends on what you seek from the music and how you rank what you seek.  I know why the RE0 is popular.  I know why the Eterna is popular.  I know I prefer listening to the Eterna.  Yet, I know both are flawed in various ways.  To rank them requires me to put a scale on a slew of characteristics and weigh each.  Everything will be biased towards what I value as important, what I value as necessary, what I deem a "flawed" or limited in some way.  That's a tough thing to do.  It's an impossible thing to do without bias and in a way that everyone else sees.


----------



## tacomn

yep I think its all been covered on the enterna vs. reo debate, good job guys.... But if this was a game
  Ethan would defiantly would of won it.. Breaking out the vegemight and marmite argument.. True gold


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


negakinu said:


> maybe you should make your own list then?


   
  Lol my first thought too.

  
  Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baycode* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> IjokerI, do you close your eyes while you test these iems? Also are all the room conditions exactly the same while testing different earphones at different times? I appreciate what you're doing so please don't get me wrong, I just wanted to know your test procedure in more detail.


   
  I drain my Sansa Fuze completely and charge it again using a solid gold power cord with eight in-line conditioners. My in-house audiologist then proceeds to flush my ears with the tears of the endangered red wolf as I light butterscotch-scented candles and wait for the rooster to crow thrice. So yeah - basically the same conditions every time.
   

   
  Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Baycode* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> I am also planning to buy Fioo E5 amp with RE0 and I have a question, will I be gaining something sonically over the C710's (unamped)? Will the soundstage be wide enough to reach a C710 on the amped RE0? Will the bas be good enough to match the C710's? I have never heard RE0, and I have no opportunity listen them before ordering. So your valuable thaugths are wellcomed.


   
  The E5 is not really a proper amp - at least not the sort of amp I was talking about when I wrote the review. You will gain very little over an unamped RE0. As for the C710, it will have a wider soundstage no matter what you do.
   

 Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Pianist* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Good assessment of the q-jays. I generally agree with everything you say, but I would add that the lower mids are actually excellent on these IEMs - they are very rich, clear and detailed. Listen to some piano - it sounds fantastic on the q-jays! Too bad the upper mids are recessed and the treble is a bit harsh, otherwise these would've been superb.


   
  Thanks and yeah - certain instruments sound amazing on the q-JAYS. Piano is one of them. So is the bass guitar. Needless to say I really want to try the x-JAYS now. 
   
   
   
  Quote:


ethan961 said:


> Keep in mind that |Joker| is one who loves neutral sound signatures. I think the rating the Eterna got is pretty impressive for having the opposite sound signature to what he usually likes. I'm not meaning bias, but simply that it's harder to like something that you normally wouldn't like.


   
  I do *try* to keep my personal biases out of it as much as I can. On my preference scale there is no way the Eterna would rank above the ViSang R03/R02 or the Cyclone PR1 Pro. And I definitely don't agree that the Eterna is more technically capable than the RE0.


----------



## SolidSnake3

> I do *try* to keep my personal biases out of it as much as I can. On my preference scale there is no way the Eterna would rank above the ViSang R03/R02 or the Cyclone PR1 Pro. And I definitely don't agree that the Eterna is more technically capable than the RE0.


 

 Got to agree with Joker here, having owned the RE0 and currently owning the Eterna's I would have to say the RE0 were more "technically sound and correct". They seemed to do a more accurate job of portraying what was recorded as opposed to the Eterna's which do a great job of making what was recorded more fun. 
   
  On a technical level the RE0's really should be more highly rated HOWEVER on a fun and exciting level I consider the Eterna's to be better. It really depends what you are rating the iem's on in this situation.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quick question for Joker and others here.  I'm looking for the best sounding BA IEM's that have straight, deep insertion a la Klipsch and Ety that can use the Klipsch oval gel tips.  Anything better than the ER4S that can use the tips and go deep?


----------



## Inks

You said BA, but since you tend to prefer dynamics, perhaps you could also give the MC5s a try. They have the same ety isolation but with a dynamic driver that has new patented technology. The bass would be a lot less anemic i'm guessing, but with the same typical ety sound sig.


----------



## mvw2

What's the specific goal with deep insertion?  It's something I've stepped away from, so I'm curious why you specifically look for that.  Also, what's specific about the Klipsch gel tips?  Frankly, I don't touch them.  I'm a bigger fan of foam, especially Shure "Olive" foams.
   
  I might lean you towards the Klipsch Custom 3 as an option that's like the ER4S in terms of a great sound stage, a thicker, textured note that is unusual for a BA, and is well balanced and extended.


----------



## JxK

^Deep insertion may just be comfortable for him, though most likely he wants it for the improved isolation.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Quick question for Joker and others here.  I'm looking for the best sounding BA IEM's that have straight, deep insertion a la Klipsch and Ety that can use the Klipsch oval gel tips.  Anything better than the ER4S that can use the tips and go deep?


 
 In addition to all of the above, the q-JAYS will work with Klipsch gels and can be seated quite deeply. As for being better than ER4S - that's debatable.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> You said BA, but since you tend to prefer dynamics, perhaps you could also give the MC5s a try. They have the same ety isolation but with a dynamic driver that has new patented technology. The bass would be a lot less anemic i'm guessing, but with the same typical ety sound sig.


 

 Has anyone thats tried he MC5 comfirm the insertion depth and isolation level relative to the ER4 or Images?  Do they use the same tips?  I would have thought the dynamic drivers would have a larger nozzle than the BAs meaning I couldn't use the Gel tips?

  
  Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> What's the specific goal with deep insertion?  It's something I've stepped away from, so I'm curious why you specifically look for that.  Also, what's specific about the Klipsch gel tips?  Frankly, I don't touch them.  I'm a bigger fan of foam, especially Shure "Olive" foams.
> 
> I might lean you towards the Klipsch Custom 3 as an option that's like the ER4S in terms of a great sound stage, a thicker, textured note that is unusual for a BA, and is well balanced and extended.


 

 The Klipsch gels give me the best isolation and comfort of any tip i have ever tried.  The foams really don't isolate or offer me much comfort.
  
  Quote: 





jxk said:


> ^Deep insertion may just be comfortable for him, though most likely he wants it for the improved isolation.


 

 Correct sir on both points.

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> anaxilus said:
> ...


 

 Thx joker.
   
  Edit - I don't think I can do recessed mids on the QJays.  Looks like the Ety 4-S then unless the MC5 are that good.


----------



## mark2410

oh the Q-Jays, not sure id give them such a high mark as you did but damn they are not too shabby arent they.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mark2410 said:


> oh the Q-Jays, not sure id give them such a high mark as you did but damn they are not too shabby arent they.


 
 Certainly not for the price you paid... Hoping to have a chance to compare them to the UE700s soon. Looks like my dual-armature quest continues


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> mark2410 said:
> ...


 
   
  ditto
   
  still cash aside id be putting the Q-Jays right along side the custom 3 in terms of goodness.


----------



## slaters70

I would give the MC5s a shot before buying the ER4P, really. Despite being dynamics, the MC5s share the traditional Ety sound tube. If you let them burn in for 100 hours or so, they sound excellent. I found a weird Comply, the T140 (work with PFEs and sold by Audeo), really really work well with the MC5s. Not too deep of an insertion required. I had used them with the ADDIEMs, and tried a pair. And they really are an excellent match with the MC5. I know they are Complys, but you can get 3 pair for $13.95 from Audeo. I know, cause I just bought some for my ADDIEMs.
  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Has anyone thats tried he MC5 comfirm the insertion depth and isolation level relative to the ER4 or Images?  Do they use the same tips?  I would have thought the dynamic drivers would have a larger nozzle than the BAs meaning I couldn't use the Gel tips?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





slaters70 said:


> I would give the MC5s a shot before buying the ER4P, really. Despite being dynamics, the MC5s share the traditional Ety sound tube. If you let them burn in for 100 hours or so, they sound excellent.


 

 Are they really that good that you would try these before the ER4P? I've always wanted to own another Etymotic after selling my ER6i and I'm thinking the ER4P since considering my sound signature I do have to try them eventually even though I probably wouldn't own them for very long probably


----------



## Anaxilus

I'm not really looking at the P but the S, I definitely prefer it over the P.  Curious about the B as well, but it scares me.  Sounds like a recipe for sibilance.


----------



## xtasi

Ended up not getting the FXC80 because the shipper had availability issues.  Luckily, I got them canceled.
   
  Ordered the Klipsch C3's instead.  Thanks for this compilation.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Head-Direct RE-ZERO and H2O Audio Surge.
  
   
  Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Ended up not getting the FXC80 because the shipper had availability issues.  Luckily, I got them canceled.
> 
> Ordered the Klipsch C3's instead.  Thanks for this compilation.


 

 Good choice


----------



## EekTheCat

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Head-Direct RE-ZERO and H2O Audio Surge.


 

 Sweet. I've been curious if H2O is for real or just a marketing gimmick.
  Thanks.


----------



## Anaxilus

You are a beast Joker.  RAWR!


----------



## 129207

If this thread had a buying guide with pricewatch and a spec-sheet with every 'phone you could turn it into a stand-alone website.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

My RE-Zero should arrive tomorrow... or the day after. It's always good to read more impressions, though. Thanks for the review/comparison.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

For me this thread is "the Guide", yes He can make a site like clieos or so...


----------



## tacomn

i dont think there is "the guide" as each person has there own preferences and unique ways they perceive things. Thats why its so great that there is so many in depth comparisons and reviews on head fli as you can truly get a good gauge on different products ..... But this is still the best guide


----------



## mcnoiserdc

That is why I said it is "the guide" for me.
  I understand his reviews and comparison, that is why I said it is the guide *for me*. Each one has its patterns.
  
  Quote: 





tacomn said:


> i dont think there is "the guide" as each person has there own preferences and unique ways they perceive things. Thats why its so great that there is so many in depth comparisons and reviews on head fli as you can truly get a good gauge on different products ..... But this is still the best guide


----------



## tacomn

my bad didnt notice the for me... Your quotation got my attention he he


----------



## HappyFi

Nice review additions as always. Looking forward to the Xears review, since they seem to be an enigma whose passionate following is isolated to a handful of users. Are they the sleeper hit of the year as some seem to suggest? Was that Playaz thread taken over by mental patients? Detective Joker on the case.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eekthecat said:


> Sweet. I've been curious if H2O is for real or just a marketing gimmick.
> Thanks.


 

 Nope, no gimmick. Granted, I didn't swim in them but I certainly subjected them to unreasonable moisture levels for an IEM. Very good option for those in search of gym buds.

  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> You are a beast Joker.  RAWR!


 

 Lol I've actually had the RE-ZERO review done for a while but didn't want to post it before/with the dual-drivers. Still, I concur 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





negakinu said:


> If this thread had a buying guide with pricewatch and a spec-sheet with every 'phone you could turn it into a stand-alone website.


 

 And I was very close to doing it, too, after the huddler switch. But a lot of my major gripes got fixed (or at least toned down) and this way I don't have to worry about paying for hosting or anything. I have been toying with the idea of adding a separate section of 'joker's recommendations' where I'd list the earphones I would pick for a specific sound signature or application. Still want to do that someday...

  
  Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> My RE-Zero should arrive tomorrow... or the day after. It's always good to read more impressions, though. Thanks for the review/comparison.


 
    
  Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> For me this thread is "the Guide", yes He can make a site like clieos or so...


 
   
  Cheers, guys
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





happyfi said:


> Nice review additions as always. Looking forward to the Xears review, since they seem to be an enigma whose passionate following is isolated to a handful of users. Are they the sleeper hit of the year as some seem to suggest? Was that Playaz thread taken over by mental patients? Detective Joker on the case.


 

 Haha, thanks for the laugh. No, they aren't mental. I do recall reading that someone liked the TD100 better than the MTPG and I find that a bit hard to believe but they definitely hold their own in the price range. Plus they fall in that rare crop of decent J-corded IEMs which some people like. It's really amazing what $50-80 can get nowadays, and I say that with full sincerity after (willingly) putting down the $250 MTPC.


----------



## miow

Quote: 





happyfi said:


> Nice review additions as always. Looking forward to the Xears review, since they seem to be an enigma whose passionate following is isolated to a handful of users. Are they the sleeper hit of the year as some seem to suggest? Was that Playaz thread taken over by mental patients? Detective Joker on the case.


 

 HAHAHA!!! Well, they are really that good to my ears. Let's wait for Joker's thoughts about them.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

i recently joined.. so posting some comments.. lol..
  neways..
  i'd like to congratulate ljokerl for his success in making this collective review, and also thank for sharing his opinions on them..
  i found them quite agreeable (used to have eterna, dba02, bijou3, hippo vb)..
  i would also agree on the slight extra points for ck10 vs eq7.. ck10 sounded more like a huge cans rather than iems in imaging, plus the vocals and breath are excellent.
  looking forward to ur next iem victim..


----------



## 2rooi123

Quote: 





miow said:


> HAHAHA!!! Well, they are really that good to my ears. Let's wait for Joker's thoughts about them.


 

 but build quality and j-corded at 2 of the biggest letdowns
  i cant live with that


----------



## xtasi

C3 are coming today!  Wont get them till 5:00ET ish though because im at work, but the UPS man will leave it at my front door.  Will post my thanks & mini impressions when i get them!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


daemontentacle said:


> i recently joined.. so posting some comments.. lol..
> neways..
> i'd like to congratulate ljokerl for his success in making this collective review, and also thank for sharing his opinions on them..
> i found them quite agreeable (used to have eterna, dba02, bijou3, hippo vb)..
> ...


   
  Thanks, and welcome to Head-Fi. I'm glad we agree on certain earphones - it should certainly make accounting for my horrible biases easier when reading my 'sound' blurbs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
  Quote:


2rooi123 said:


> but build quality and j-corded at 2 of the biggest letdowns  i cant live with that


   
  Thing is, some people like the j-cord. I've been asked quite a few times to recommend a good j-corded IEM and there really aren't many that come to mind. Also, what's wrong with the build quality? They're no HJE900s but I find the construction quite reasonable for $50.


----------



## 2rooi123

@joker: they sound good for the price but driver crackling is one big issue


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


2rooi123 said:


> @joker: they sound good for the price but driver crackling is one big issue


   
  Perfectly normal for budget-oriented dynamics. I can probably count on the fingers of one hand all of the dynamic-driver earphones that exhibit zero driver flex. Even the $250 MTPC crackles.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 2rooi123 said:
> ...


 
  X2 on the MTPC crackling, granted it is very, very rare at least on my pair but it does still occur none the less. Not common enough to be an issue or annoying but it's something that if I actually think about it I can remember when it has happened most recently.


----------



## rawrster

Driver flex is apparently in just about every dynamic driver earphone I've tried regardless of price. My Coppers had them so it's just something you get used to, RMA or get a BA earphone.


----------



## ljokerl

It's interesting but there's no flex with my Golds - only the Coppers. Same tips and everything. The IE8, Atrios, HJE900s, and Phiaton PS210s also don't flex. Nearly every other dynamic does, though.


----------



## xtasi

I got my C3's today joker.  Oddly, the ear pieces are not big enough for my left ear.  I've always known my left ear canal was bigger, but I could always use the same size tips on both sides.  I found that UE large and med single flange works best.  The C3 stock largest single flange is too small for my left ear (but it can make a good, not perfect, seal with my right ear) so which size shure olive do you think i should get?  Large?  I've had good experiences with comply foam.


----------



## xtasi

What luck i just found a really good seal with my left ear.  Still, anything on those olives?  or any other tips that work well?


----------



## mvw2

Got the RE-ZERO yesterday, purchased off another member on the forum.  I do see you and others comparing the two as being quite a alike still.  While I haven't owned the RE0 for nearly two years, from my memory the RE-ZERO sounds very unlike the RE0 in many ways.  While I get a sense that both are geared towards the same goals, I think the driver and note presentation is a sizable departure.  It's certainly not RE252 different, but the RE-ZERO driver does seem to be a partial departure from the RE0 driver.  One specific repeat I see from the RE0/ZERO line is a very heavily controlled driver is used.  The benefit of this is that they offer some of the cleaner, lowest distortion sound from a dynamic most of us will hear.  It is super clean and also handles complex information really well.  It pretty much isn't allowed to get messy.  There is a trade-off though, and it's one thing I disliked a good bit with the RE0.  The high control comes at the price of limiting how freely the diaphragm moves.  If anything happens, it's done through motor force.  You end up losing some articulation, some dynamic breadth, some sense of effortless energy.  What impact or texture that does show through seems forced.  As well, high control means the low end frequencies end up a bit light.  Even though this is a low ohm version, it still is happy to use up a bit of wattage from my Meier 2Move, more than I'd expect from a driver that's geared to be easy to run.  I do feel it's within a range that is suitable for portable players and a moderate deviation the RE0, but it still shows that the design still requires power to equate to output and also power and output to equate to dynamics and raw energy.  An inverse of this design would be the Denon C700/C751.  The Denon follows the approach of creating a very loose, effortless driver.  Dynamic breadth comes out more effortlessly without needing to be forcefully driven.  Articulation and fine detail show through more readily and in this improved sound stage.  The downside is that the diaphragm is considerably less controlled, and the sound can get a bit distorted or messy.  The low frequency range of the Denon is a good example of what poor control can mean.  Output gets very muddy and incoherent at volume.   The Denon is really good for critical, quiet listening.  The RE0 or RE-ZERO is happier at moderate volume.  I think both of these products highlight the extremes of design while most dynamically driven earphones fall more in between these two.  The RE252 for example is an in between product that offers a more expected presentation.  The RE0/ZERO provides a unique setup that isn't really found in other dynamically driven products.  I know my favoritism lies outside the range of the RE0/ZERO, but I do think the RE-ZERO is a step towards offering more to everyone while retaining that type of package than the RE0.  The dynamics are improved and shows a better sense of subtlety and range.  Sound stage is more specific with a greater sense of a sound existing in a point in space (RE0 was pretty sucky from my recollection).  The tone is more natural or slightly bright at volume and a departure from the slightly dark sense of the RE0.  I always thought there was some harshness in the highs of the RE0 and a slight inability to accurately articulate high frequency information.  I see the RE-ZERO as improved with a more refined albeit maybe not as edgy top end.  Even though my recollection of the RE0 is a couple years tarnished, I do like the direction the RE-ZERO is heading.  I do see great value in the $80/$100 price points of these products.  I do think the RE-ZERO is a step up in terms of mainstream appeal.
   
  You know what I'd like to see?  I like the RE-ZERO driver design.  However the major limitation is low frequency "looseness."  I would love to see a dual driver setup like the Radius DDM incorporating a version of the RE-ZERO driver as the mid-high and paired with a large bass driver.  Because of the driver setup, there really is no way to get the presence and fullness on the low end, not even with EQing or an excess of wattage.  The fix is dual drivers.  It's something I'd be curious to see.


----------



## 2rooi123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's interesting but there's no flex with my Golds - only the Coppers. Same tips and everything. The IE8, Atrios, HJE900s, and Phiaton PS210s also don't flex. Nearly every other dynamic does, though.


 

 goes to show only a few have good build quality
  yes i noticed the pannies dont crackle
  also the cx980


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





2rooi123 said:


> goes to show only a few have good build quality
> yes i noticed the pannies dont crackle
> also the cx980


 

 I wouldn't say it is build quality but just how dynamics work. It happens less with more expensive dynamics such as the Coppers but it does happen.


----------



## ljokerl

Added two more penny-pinchers - the elago E3 and JVC HA-EBX85. Definitely intend to keep my eye on the elago brand as they've got some higher-end products as well.
   

 Quote:


xtasi said:


> I got my C3's today joker.  Oddly, the ear pieces are not big enough for my left ear.  I've always known my left ear canal was bigger, but I could always use the same size tips on both sides.  I found that UE large and med single flange works best.  The C3 stock largest single flange is too small for my left ear (but it can make a good, not perfect, seal with my right ear) so which size shure olive do you think i should get?  Large?  I've had good experiences with comply foam.


   
  Medium Olives worked fine for me and foam tips are generally more of a one-size-fits-all solution compared to silicones. L-sized Olives are quite gigantic TBH. If you used regular-size comply foamies, medium Olives should be fine.
  
  Quote:


mvw2 said:


> You know what I'd like to see?  I like the RE-ZERO driver design.  However the major limitation is low frequency "looseness."  I would love to see a dual driver setup like the Radius DDM incorporating a version of the RE-ZERO driver as the mid-high and paired with a large bass driver.  Because of the driver setup, there really is no way to get the presence and fullness on the low end, not even with EQing or an excess of wattage.  The fix is dual drivers.  It's something I'd be curious to see.


 
 Thanks, appreciate the impressions. Also agree that a dual-driver from head-direct would be something. They've never shrunk away from innovation before so we can all collectively dream...


----------



## xtasi

I'm pretty sure these are shure olives? http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Shure+-+Medium+Foam+Sleeves+for+Select+Shure+Sound-Isolating+Headphones+-+Black/8348558.p?id=1176506661084&skuId=8348558&st=shure%20olive&cp=1&lp=2
   
  lol why are they called olives anyways?


----------



## mark2410

because they look like black olives


----------



## JoetheArachnid

My RE-Zero finally arrived, the day before I'm due to leave the country for a month too. These are sexy little buggers, and smaller than I expected. I once saw someone say about the RE-0 that you don't listen to them, you listen through them. Arguably my previous IEM experience has only been the lowest-end Sennheiser buds available, but these sound at least on par with HD 595 in detail and more transparent. I'm not feeling any bass detail lacking, just a slight lack of fullness on the low end.
  I'm also surprised by the soundstage they appear to have, but again that may be just because of lack of previous IEM experience. Overall I'm incredibly happy with them right now and they can only get better with burn-in. Also none of the problems I had with having a cold and blocked sinuses when I first got my 595s. That ruined what should have been a magical moment, but no such annoyance with these. I tried the smaller bi-flange but actually got better bass with the single-flange medium tip.
   
  Did anyone try the nozzle foam removal/movement trick on these? Is it necessary? I've seen it for the RE0, but no mention for the Zero.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xtasi said:


> I'm pretty sure these are shure olives? http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Shure+-+Medium+Foam+Sleeves+for+Select+Shure+Sound-Isolating+Headphones+-+Black/8348558.p?id=1176506661084&skuId=8348558&st=shure%20olive&cp=1&lp=2
> 
> lol why are they called olives anyways?


 

 Yep, that's them. Model number is always either PA-910 or EABKF1.

  
  Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> My RE-Zero finally arrived, the day before I'm due to leave the country for a month too. These are sexy little buggers, and smaller than I expected. I once saw someone say about the RE-0 that you don't listen to them, you listen through them. Arguably my previous IEM experience has only been the lowest-end Sennheiser buds available, but these sound at least on par with HD 595 in detail and more transparent. I'm not feeling any bass detail lacking, just a slight lack of fullness on the low end.
> I'm also surprised by the soundstage they appear to have, but again that may be just because of lack of previous IEM experience. Overall I'm incredibly happy with them right now and they can only get better with burn-in. Also none of the problems I had with having a cold and blocked sinuses when I first got my 595s. That ruined what should have been a magical moment, but no such annoyance with these. I tried the smaller bi-flange but actually got better bass with the single-flange medium tip.
> 
> Did anyone try the nozzle foam removal/movement trick on these? Is it necessary? I've seen it for the RE0, but no mention for the Zero.


 

 Congrats on the earphones - glad you like them. I did not do the foam removal since I didn't like it on the RE0. I have a feeling it would get the treble a little closer to what the RE0 treble sounds like but whether that is desirable is arguable.


----------



## xtasi

Thanks so much joker
   
  EDIT:  I noticed that you wrote the preffered tips on the C1&2 are the sony hybrids and i think the pics of the C3 have sony hybrids.  Could they work on the C3?  My bestbuy doesnt carry shure olives but they do carry sony hybrids.


----------



## mvw2

Hey, did you ever try the RE-ZERO without the foam?  I really didn't like the RE0 without the foam, but I am finding that the RE-ZERO without is better option.  The sound is just a little more direct, and the treble difference doesn't seem as dramatic as what the RE0 showed.
   
  Know of any good tips for an earphone that has a lot of movement?  Right now one weakness I'm seeing from the RE-ZERO is that the driver moves the earphone considerably and pulls your attention to the earphone.  I'm curious if there are options that may isolate the earphone more from the ear.  Right now I'm just using some Comply T-500 tips that do a pretty good job, although they do affect the sound some.  If I had a spare Olive tip to decore I wouldn't mind trying that too.  I'm also running them over the ear to help against their tendency to drop and rest against the ear.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Hey, did you ever try the RE-ZERO without the foam?  I really didn't like the RE0 without the foam, but I am finding that the RE-ZERO without is better option.  The sound is just a little more direct, and the treble difference doesn't seem as dramatic as what the RE0 showed.


   
  Nope, haven't tried it yet. Like I said two posts above, the RE0 treble became more strident with the foam removed (which was too much for me). Logically,I would expect the treble of the RE-ZERO to do the same but since it is calmer to begin with that would just move it closer to RE0 treble. I'll try it when I have time to see what I can make of it.


 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Know of any good tips for an earphone that has a lot of movement?  Right now one weakness I'm seeing from the RE-ZERO is that the driver moves the earphone considerably and pulls your attention to the earphone.  I'm curious if there are options that may isolate the earphone more from the ear.  Right now I'm just using some Comply T-500 tips that do a pretty good job, although they do affect the sound some.  If I had a spare Olive tip to decore I wouldn't mind trying that too.  I'm also running them over the ear to help against their tendency to drop and rest against the ear.


 
 Over-the-ear is a must for me since IMO the current cable is more microphonic than the cloth cord on my RE0 was. I'm using Meelec short (Sennheiser-style) bi-flanges from the M11+ fit kit. Sound is rather similar to single flanges but the fit is a bit more secure and the isolation is a tad better. I think I still like de-cored Olives best but they're in short supply here.


----------



## mvw2

Yeah, I used the MEElectronic bi-flange tips too, but I'm back to Comply T-500.  The key here for me was to isolate out the vibration of the earphones.  There's three ways to doing this, lock the earphone well to the ear so all you feel is ear vibration (a visceral sense but no noticeable source), decouple it so you feel nothing, or move the resonance frequency out of the bandpass.  I'm not sure if there's a good #1 option for tips other than something very rigid, maybe a custom, but a foam is pretty good about doing #2.  One could probably add mass to the earphone and lower the resonance point to satisfy #3, but how would one do that what just making the earphone annoying to wear due to the weight.
   
  I find the microphonics similar to the original RE0 before the cord was changed.  It's a pretty normal amount.  I never expeienced the newer cords.


----------



## slaters70

I started using a pair of Monster white hybrids (small, the only size that fits me) with the RE-Zeros, and I like them the best. Seem to give the bass a little more oomph. But I may try the filter removal mod too, since there are replacements should I not like  it.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

I was told that a compromise on the foam mod was to remove the foam then put it back in so as to allow the driver to pump more air >> better bass response. Right now I'm finding plenty of bass kick but not much thump or extended bass. I also think that I'm going to have to invest in a cheap portable amp anyway (I got the Zero rather than the 0 so I wouldn't have to), because the iPod just doesn't quite have the juice for these. They shine at about 97% volume, and below that they tend to be a little tinny or weak.
 Having to go full volume on some songs with IEMs means either they're not getting the power or I'm going deaf. I think FiiO will be getting some of my money by the end of this...
  Oh, and the highs and mids are heavenly. No problems there. Any harshness or sibilance has almost completely ironed out with ~15 hours.


----------



## mvw2

The thin bass notes are inherent with the RE0 and RE-ZERO, less bad with the ZERO.  It's a side effect of the design really.  You can EQ up the low end and add an amp, but there is only so much you can gain.  In the end, the lower frequencies will always be short on body and lack that heft and fullness.  That's why I mentioned earlier about loving to see a 2-way dynamic with the ZERO driver as the mid-high driver.
   
  You don't understand the concept of the foam at all.  Foam is used to trap and destroy high frequencies.  It is used as an EQing tool to shape the overall response.  Air passes freely through the foam, but the shorter high frequency sound waves get trapped and blocked more readily than lower frequencies that would need much, much thicker foam.  Air isn't stuck in the earphone at all.  The foam is just a physical EQing device.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> The thin bass notes are inherent with the RE0 and RE-ZERO, less bad with the ZERO.  It's a side effect of the design really.  You can EQ up the low end and add an amp, but there is only so much you can gain.  In the end, the lower frequencies will always be short on body and lack that heft and fullness.  That's why I mentioned earlier about loving to see a 2-way dynamic with the ZERO driver as the mid-high driver.
> 
> You don't understand the concept of the foam at all.  Foam is used to trap and destroy high frequencies.  It is used as an EQing tool to shape the overall response.  Air passes freely through the foam, but the shorter high frequency sound waves get trapped and blocked more readily than lower frequencies that would need much, much thicker foam.  Air isn't stuck in the earphone at all.  The foam is just a physical EQing device.


 
   
  I didn't claim to understand the foam, I just heard that it was a possibility that someone had tried. The foam is positioned quite close to the driver, so pulling it slightly away provided more air directly next to the driver, which would give it more space in which to build bass whilst still having the foam filtering the highs (or something). I don't know if it works at all, but I was interested. Since I'm very happy with them I probably won't be doing any mods, but I thought it was worth asking to see what results people had found. I knew perfectly well that the RE-0/Zero were not strong in the bass department, but I settled on them anyway after a month or so's research to find the best IEMs in my price range. I know that they don't exactly 'need' amping, but the volume I'm getting from my iPod is pathetic and I was planning to get a LOD+amp at some point anyway.
   
  Here's the foam mod explanation, from the IEM comparison table thread:
   
  Quote: 





			
				Pianist said:
			
		

> RE0 has the best treble and arguably the best tonal balance of any IEM I've heard to date. But that was not my experience with them out of the box, My pair had some very noticeable peaks in the treble region around 12 kHz and 14 kHz. It also had a weak, somewhat sloppy bass, even with the stock dual flanges and UE tips. After some simple modding and lots of burin in however, I was able to eliminate these issues. To improve bass response, I took out the yellow foam inside the nozzle and put it back in such a way so that there is some space left between the foam and the driver. This allows the driver to pump more air and noticeably tightens the bass. I also squeezed the foam into the nozzle a little harder which helped to smooth out the treble (burn in took care of any peaks still present after the mod). Now my RE0 sounds very neutral with accurate, tight bass.


----------



## ethan961

.


----------



## mvw2

I didn't like removing the foam from the RE0 either.
   
  JoeTheArachnid, the RE252 is better in balance than the RE0 if you don't mind spending double the cost.  This is part of the preference I have with the RE252 over the RE0 and ZERO.  There's more of a natural sense to the note.  Even that is slightly light in body on the low end, but the presence is more even throughout.  I'm highly curious about what the RE262 will offer over the current RE252.  I do like the differences that the RE-ZERO offers over the RE0, although the presentation is different.  There may be a slight presence towards one or the other depending on what you're shooting for in terms of sound.  I'm of the feeling that the RE-ZERO offers an even better overall package though.  At the end of the day, I'd still opt for the RE252 and pay the extra cost.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> I didn't like removing the foam from the RE0 either.
> 
> JoeTheArachnid, the RE252 is better in balance than the RE0 if you don't mind spending double the cost.  This is part of the preference I have with the RE252 over the RE0 and ZERO.  There's more of a natural sense to the note.  Even that is slightly light in body on the low end, but the presence is more even throughout.  I'm highly curious about what the RE262 will offer over the current RE252.  I do like the differences that the RE-ZERO offers over the RE0, although the presentation is different.  There may be a slight presence towards one or the other depending on what you're shooting for in terms of sound.  I'm of the feeling that the RE-ZERO offers an even better overall package though.  At the end of the day, I'd still opt for the RE252 and pay the extra cost.


 
   
  Well I've already got the Zero and I'll probably stick with it for a while. I actually couldn't listen to music on the go for a while because the PX100 are too open for my school bus environment and my awful cheap Sennheiser buds (Eco-Canal or something) just didn't cut the mustard. As a quick and cheap fix I'm absolutely fine with these, and I'll only upgrade if I get some more money from somewhere or if the RE-262 turns out to be the best thing ever... whilst still being relatively affordable. Maybe it'll be that dual-driver you wanted. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  All I'm doing is just reassuring myself that there aren't any small fixes I can do to improve the sound, other than that I'll be content for a while... until the inevitable upgraditis kicks in. I see an MS-1, an M-Stage and an HD600/50 on the horizon...


----------



## proxops-pete

Sheer awesomeness!  Thanks for such huge comparison!


----------



## timestable

Thanks for such an informative guide, it helped me narrow down my choices quite a bit. This post is being used to meet the one-post requirement to PM somebody about buying a pair of Monster Turbine Pro's.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a few more high bang/buck midrange earphones - Xears TD100, ECCI PR300, ViSang R01

 Quote:


proxops-pete said:


> Sheer awesomeness!  Thanks for such huge comparison!


 

 Quote:


timestable said:


> Thanks for such an informative guide, it helped me narrow down my choices quite a bit.


 
  Glad the thread was useful


----------



## Hero Kid

Wow, you've almost hit 100. Now that is impressive!
  Also, just so you are aware there are some coding issues at the moment. Half of the text is bold... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Annnd you can't read the last chart. I think you'll have to either split it into two images or not host it on head-fi.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hero kid said:


> Wow, you've almost hit 100. Now that is impressive!
> Also, just so you are aware there are some coding issues at the moment. Half of the text is bold...
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yeah I submitted an error report regarding code parsing. Nothing I can do about that - head-fi seems to be reading the number four as some sort of image or smiley which really screws up formatting.
   
  As for the image, if you click on it and then right click and select 'view image' it will show up full size. But I plan to split it in two once I hit 100.


----------



## mvw2

Yeah, it now takes a couple steps to view the chart in its full size.
   
  So what kind of cookies are you winning when you hit 100?


----------



## Hero Kid

Someone should start a fundraiser and buy Mike some decent customs or something


----------



## rawrster

Well if he sold all of those under $75 earphones he would probably have a good amount


----------



## ljokerl

mvw2 said:


> Yeah, it now takes a couple steps to view the chart in its full size.
> 
> So what kind of cookies are you winning when you hit 100?


   
  Hopefully the freedom of not having any urgent reviews for the first time in a year 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
   

 Quote:


hero kid said:


> Someone should start a fundraiser and buy Mike some decent customs or something


   
  Mass lobbying of JHA to send me a JH5 works too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> Well if he sold all of those under $75 earphones he would probably have a good amount


 
 True but strangely the <$75 ones are usually the hardest to sell off.


----------



## rawrster

Just out of curiosity but how does the DBA-02 compare to the RE252 from memory?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> Just out of curiosity but how does the DBA-02 compare to the RE252 from memory?


 
 From memory the RE252 is softer and more laid-back. The DBA-02 is more aggressive with the detailing and texturing and has better thickness of note. The balance is not dissimilar but the RE252 draws more attention to the midrange and also doesn't go down quite as far. It's a more natural-sounding earphone with better blending and transparency.


----------



## rawrster

Thanks. I might look into it if I can't figure out my issues with the DBA-02 although I can pretty much get the W2 at $10 more but too bad you haven't heard that. If only they came with better cables. I do not like the cables on all of the Hifiman earphones one bit. They would be so much better if like a Westone or CK10 cable.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Agree here about the Hifiman products cabling. I was really not a fan of the RE0 cable that I had especially comparing it to the ck10's and even the Coppers. 
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Thanks. I might look into it if I can't figure out my issues with the DBA-02 although I can pretty much get the W2 at $10 more but too bad you haven't heard that. If only they came with better cables. I do not like the cables on all of the Hifiman earphones one bit. They would be so much better if like a Westone or CK10 cable.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Just out of curiosity but how does the DBA-02 compare to the RE252 from memory?


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> rawrster said:
> ...


 

 Yes, the RE252 has a little upper mids peakiness that the DBA-02 don't have, while the DBA-02 seem flatter and more neutral.  After your ears adjust to the RE252 they become very transparent sounding.


----------



## ljokerl

@rawster: Not a big fan or HiFiMan cables myself. I actually liked the cloth RE0 cord, though, which everyone else seemed to despise at the time.
   
  Oh and for those interested Meelec is running another review giveaway - this time for the R1 woody.


----------



## ljokerl

Fixed all of the formatting and the tables. Thanks to everyone who pm'd me with error reports.


----------



## puckshock

Just want to pop in with another thank you for this compilation of reviews and bringing another person into the audiophile community 
   
  And have you heard of Superlux? This post has me slightly interested, and perhaps you would be too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


puckshock said:


> Just want to pop in with another thank you for this compilation of reviews and bringing another person into the audiophile community
> 
> And have you heard of Superlux? This post has me slightly interested, and perhaps you would be too.


 
 Thanks and yes, I've read that review. The OP of that thread also posted a link to it a dozen or so pages back. I'm interested in them but not quite enough to pick them up yet. There's other superlux phones I'm interested in, too, including their retractable-cord portables, which don't seem to available anywhere.


----------



## ljokerl

Happy centennial to me! 
   
  Added a pair of heavyweights to celebrate - Westone UM3X & MTPC. 
   
  Big thanks to everyone who has commented on and generally participated in the creation of this thread. Definitely couldn't have done this without all of the support.


----------



## 2rooi123

hip hip hooray!


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

congrats on ur 100th...
  very dedicated effort u've put in here..
  thank you.


----------



## Inks

congratsx2
   
  your review of the coppers pretty much reflects my thoughts on them, but while i've been enjoying them and I think they're great they don't offer anything special IME.  On the other hand your thoughts on the UM3X reflect mine regarding the Monster MDs that I just couldn't bring myself to enjoy no matter how much I tried. Going from your thoughts on the UM3X ,the MDs differ in just better treble sparkle that is only slightly below the coppers. But the the bass is probably not as controlled and the imaging wouldn't be up to par because it has a very blended sound with small soundstage. I'm surprised of the high rating in sq for the UM3X thought because it seemed you also had a hard time appreciating it's sound.


----------



## Bennyboy71

Awesomely geektastic stuff mate!  You did it! 
   
  Your ears must need a holiday.


----------



## Hero Kid

x100 + 1 to whatever you say.


----------



## rawrster

You finally hit 100 
   
  Nice writeups on the um3x and coppers


----------



## mark2410

am surprised you ranked the coppers so highly,i found them more than a touch dissapointing


----------



## JoeyRusso

Mark, I'm almost convinced that the Copper's you heard were defective or damaged in some way..
  
  Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> am surprised you ranked the coppers so highly,i found them more than a touch dissapointing


----------



## Grimloki

Congrats on 100 reviews! 
   
  This is my favorite resource on head-fi.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





joeyrusso said:


> Mark, I'm almost convinced that the Copper's you heard were defective or damaged in some way..


 

 unfortunatly i dont think they were, i did speak to others about them at the time and we were hearing similar things.  they just seemed to be for more forgiving than i could be of its behaviour.  for example its inability to remain clear and detailed if too much was going on. 
   
  i think what really was the key is that US reviewers have treated it as a US$200ish product and i treated it like a £200 one.  Here it costs more than the IE8 (quite a lot more) and the 8 just slaughtered it.   it was a shame i really thought i was going to like the coppers far more than i did


----------



## Bennyboy71

Now all you need is the SM3 to test, Mr Joker.


----------



## asphyxiation

Quote: 





bennyboy71 said:


> Now all you need is the SM3 to test, Mr Joker.


 

 I second this!


----------



## rawrster

I doubt the Coppers that Mark had was defective. We all hear things differently which is why there's so many different opinions on the same product. I liked them a lot but I did treat them as a $200 product. If it was £200 or whatever price they go for there I might have had a different opinion on them but I'll never know since that's not a price I'd pay for them anyway.
   
  I think someone should send joker the SM3 then if you want a review


----------



## Grimloki

Price doesn't change the way something sounds. It really shouldn't set expectations. 
   
  I'm not aware of a single BA driver that costs more than $45 to buy one at a time... and thats from a reseller. I am guessing, but I imagine in quantities over 1000, the top Knowles BA driver costs no more than $10... and is probably closer to $1.
   
  I am sure the profit margin on these is so very high, there is incredible flexibility in prices... don't judge based on price. Prices denoting value assumes intelligent, critical buyers.
   
  Skullcandy. Bose. Beats.


----------



## Anaxilus

Nice review on the Coppers.  Pretty much spot on w/ what I heard.  I'm glad you also hear that fuller, rounder note that I find appealing in so many dynamics.  Btw, are those the M9 'balance' biflanges on the Coppers?  If so, I suggest the M11s, they are a bit more resilient and offer a touch more control.  Not going to change much if anything in your review though.  Just a slightly better overall refinement IME.  Obviously I assume you also found the biflanges to offer the best overall performance?


----------



## rawrster

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBkQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mouser.com%2Faccess%2F%3Fpn%3D721-TWFK-30017-000&ei=bBNsTNz0LcP98AaFovXBDA&usg=AFQjCNEjh1wRr5gK7zyfr6Kt_GuleF5lrg
   
  There you go. Over $50 for a single unit purchase for a BA driver.
   
  Also why shouldn't price dictate expectations? A $400 product should have higher expectations than a $20 one. I definitely had higher expectations from my Coppers than I did my M9 or DBA-02.


----------



## KSC35Matt

Fantastic review, a real gem on the internet.
   
  I'm looking at getting great SQ waterproof headphones (so I can run in the rain - I've got a waterproof player case) and really appreciated your H20 Audio Surge review.  The H20 website now has a new waterproof headphone which costs more, called the Surge Pro Mini.  I was wondering what the chances were of you adding it to your list?
   
  http://www.h2oaudio.com/store/waterproof-headphones/surge-pro-balaced-armature-waterproof-headphones.html
   
  http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/reviews/entry/h2o-audio-surge-sportwrap-surge-pro-waterproof-headphones/


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks, everyone. Glad this thread is handy. It really is a bit of a community effort, not just my own 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   

 Quote:


inks said:


> your review of the coppers pretty much reflects my thoughts on them, but while i've been enjoying them and I think they're great they don't offer anything special IME.  On the other hand your thoughts on the UM3X reflect mine regarding the Monster MDs that I just couldn't bring myself to enjoy no matter how much I tried. Going from your thoughts on the UM3X ,the MDs differ in just better treble sparkle that is only slightly below the coppers. But the the bass is probably not as controlled and the imaging wouldn't be up to par because it has a very blended sound with small soundstage. I'm surprised of the high rating in sq for the UM3X thought because it seemed you also had a hard time appreciating it's sound.


 
 I really try not to judge the sound signature of an earphone subjectively. I can see others liking the UM3X but at the same time I clearly stated that I consider it be a boring earphone. Can't really fault it much on technical proficiency, though, and there are others who may find the CK10 or IE8 or one of the other more flavoured earphones bland and boring so who am I to judge. I try to write my reviews to give the reader a sense of how each headphone plays into my personal preferences but I try not to let it affect the numbers.


  Quote:


mark2410 said:


> am surprised you ranked the coppers so highly,i found them more than a touch dissapointing


 
 Not a big fan of the Coppers either, but as stated above it is not in my capacity to judge the appeal of a sound signature. The Coppers do quite a few things right and they are cheaper for us while the high-end dynamic Sennheisers (both the IE7 and IE8) are pricier and there's just not a whole lot of other high-end dynamics out there.

  Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Nice review on the Coppers.  Pretty much spot on w/ what I heard.  I'm glad you also hear that fuller, rounder note that I find appealing in so many dynamics.  Btw, are those the M9 'balance' biflanges on the Coppers?  If so, I suggest the M11s, they are a bit more resilient and offer a touch more control.  Not going to change much if anything in your review though.  Just a slightly better overall refinement IME.  Obviously I assume you also found the biflanges to offer the best overall performance?


   
  Good eye. Yep, those are the new M9 tips. I snapped the pic while playing around with my fit kit as I don't really like those tips on the MTPC (but they look nicer than black ones). Sennheiser short bi-flanges work better IMHO as the Coppers are a bit long and heavy for full-size bi-flanges. And yeah, bi-flanges give the optimal insertion depth with the Coppers for my ears, same as with the Golds.


 Quote:


ksc35matt said:


> Fantastic review, a real gem on the internet.
> 
> I'm looking at getting great SQ waterproof headphones (so I can run in the rain - I've got a waterproof player case) and really appreciated your H20 Audio Surge review.  The H20 website now has a new waterproof headphone which costs more, called the Surge Pro Mini.  I was wondering what the chances were of you adding it to your list?


 
 Thanks, glad you found it useful. I really like the H2O surge and it has become my favorite workout IEM, a position previously occupied by the Meelec M6, Fischer Eterna, and Westone 1. Unfortunately I don't think I'll be hearing the mini anytime soon. According to the rep at H2O, the Armature-based mini was designed to give a more balanced overall sound (read: more treble) but I'm not sure how much. Truth be told, I think the signature of the dynamic-based Surge is just right for exercising as it makes vocals easier to hear and I've noticed that I get fatigued more quickly by treble while exercising.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





> Quote:
> 
> 
> mark2410 said:
> ...


 

 well what made me surprised was the coppers inability to retain clarity when thing got busy.  that isnt a preference issue that for me was just a failing


----------



## mvw2

Yep, the UM3X is a peculiar tool.  I've owned it twice and sold it twice for the same reason.  It has been one of my favorite and poorly fitting earphones I've owned.  I have come to see it more as a tool than a musical device.  I guess that could be a good thing in some lights.  I feel it does some things better than anything else out there.  The lack of realism made me sell it twice.  I came to the conclusion that one of the most important factors for an earphone is to sound real.  There should be a lifelike sense to the music, well enough to be believable.  So few earphones are actually really good about this.  Many present music well.  Few sound real.  I've held onto my OK1 buds for so long for just this reason.  I also valued the CK10 a lot because it offers a very real sound.  The SE530 I had did too although the notes were presented too thinly, well short, so it's more of a ghostly realism that just didn't carry the the raw power and energy.  Again, this is one thing I love about the OK1.  It's aggressive, raw, and the energy is just there.  There's inertia to the sound, a believable amount, the level you'd expect from the real life sound.  I wish more earphones had this sense.


----------



## kjk1281

Congratulations on hitting 100!  I'm in awe at how you've managed to average 20 IEM reviews a month for the five months this thread has been existence.  Truly remarkable!
   
  I'm certainly looking forward to the next 100.  In the near-term, your plan to review what is essentially the rest of the Ultimate Ears universal IEM lineup seems to be the most interesting.  I'm sure many have been pestering begging you to post your thoughts on the TripleFi.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mark2410 said:


> well what made me surprised was the coppers inability to retain clarity when thing got busy.  that isnt a preference issue that for me was just a failing


 
 Unfortunately that's a characteristic shared by all three Turbine earphones. I don't think it's as drastic as you make it sound but they can't track large pieces for beans.


 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Yep, the UM3X is a peculiar tool.  I've owned it twice and sold it twice for the same reason.  It has been one of my favorite and poorly fitting earphones I've owned.  I have come to see it more as a tool than a musical device.  I guess that could be a good thing in some lights.  I feel it does some things better than anything else out there.  The lack of realism made me sell it twice.  I came to the conclusion that one of the most important factors for an earphone is to sound real.  There should be a lifelike sense to the music, well enough to be believable.  So few earphones are actually really good about this.  Many present music well.  Few sound real.  I've held onto my OK1 buds for so long for just this reason.  I also valued the CK10 a lot because it offers a very real sound.  The SE530 I had did too although the notes were presented too thinly, well short, so it's more of a ghostly realism that just didn't carry the the raw power and energy.  Again, this is one thing I love about the OK1.  It's aggressive, raw, and the energy is just there.  There's inertia to the sound, a believable amount, the level you'd expect from the real life sound.  I wish more earphones had this sense.


 
 Agreed, and please forward this to Yuin. They really need to make an OK1 with a usable IEM form factor. Even the Yamaha EPH-20 form factor will do for me.
  
  Quote:


kjk1281 said:


> Congratulations on hitting 100!  I'm in awe at how you've managed to average 20 IEM reviews a month for the five months this thread has been existence.  Truly remarkable!
> 
> I'm certainly looking forward to the next 100.  In the near-term, your plan to review what is essentially the rest of the Ultimate Ears universal IEM lineup seems to be the most interesting.  I'm sure many have been pestering begging you to post your thoughts on the TripleFi.


 
 Well, as much as I'd like to claim the superhuman ability to review 20 IEMs per month for five months running, I have to admit that this thread was created because my old thread ran into the old head-fi's post content limits. The original multi-iem review was started in November so it's more like 10 months in total 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  And you're right - the TF10 is easily my most-postponed earphone. I've had it since I started the original thread so I've essentially been putting off its write-up for 10 months. But to review the rest of UE's lineup and skip the TF10 would be a crime (and probably one not so easily forgiven by all of you guys at that) so I'm bound to get it done now.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> mark2410 said:
> ...


 

 oh yeah its something i definitely grade harshly for, prominent treble and beginning to break up just gets scratchy and abusive to my ears.  if they had lost clarity and begun to just hide the treble that would have been far less offensive to me.  keeping it there and just making it more and more coarse was just like waiting till i have a head ache then poking me with a stick.


----------



## jwhitakr

I'm a bit late to the 100th review celebration party, but congrats anyway on hitting the 100 milestone!  You da man!


----------



## 2rooi123

yea joker
  you da man!


----------



## AzureSky

just wanted to point out that the pl-30's now come with a right angle plug and the cables very similar to the pl-50's(i have both)


----------



## esanthosh

Congrats on the 100th IEM review. Waiting eagerly for your review on TF10, hopefully soon


----------



## SolidSnake3

Hey joker just wanted to say thanks for this amazing thread and all that you have contributed the community. Also, the ck10 loan may have exposed me to my ideal and final iem.


----------



## rawrster

Well averaging 10 or so and having a portable headphone review thread at the same time is indeed impressive  Although your wallet might not have been too impressed..
   
  @SolidSnake3: I thought the same way about the CK10 until I got into customs and now I'm saving up for some more expensive customs. The CK10 is great however and I do wish I still had it but needed to sell it to fund stuff. If I can get a good price on them I may buy them again but they are the one sale I do somewhat regret.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jwhitakr said:


> I'm a bit late to the 100th review celebration party, but congrats anyway on hitting the 100 milestone!  You da man!


   
  Quote:


2rooi123 said:


> yea joker
> you da man!


 
 Quote:


esanthosh said:


> Congrats on the 100th IEM review. Waiting eagerly for your review on TF10, hopefully soon


 
 Quote:


solidsnake3 said:


> Hey joker just wanted to say thanks for this amazing thread and all that you have contributed the community. Also, the ck10 loan may have exposed me to my ideal and final iem.


 
 Thanks, everyone. Much appreciated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote:


azuresky said:


> just wanted to point out that the pl-30's now come with a right angle plug and the cables very similar to the pl-50's(i have both)


   
  Thanks, I've been meaning to update this for a long time. Soundmagic changed the cabling on the PL30 around the same time the PL21 was released, which is close to a year ago now. I'll get it done


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Well averaging 10 or so and having a portable headphone review thread at the same time is indeed impressive  Although your wallet might not have been too impressed..
> 
> @SolidSnake3: I thought the same way about the CK10 until I got into customs and now I'm saving up for some more expensive customs. The CK10 is great however and I do wish I still had it but needed to sell it to fund stuff. If I can get a good price on them I may buy them again but they are the one sale I do somewhat regret.


 
  for me customs regardless of price will, for the most part, never really be a good option because of my other hobby's outside of audio. I enjoy bjj and mma which along with wrestling are a great way to end up with Cauliflower Ear meaning that any sort of customs probably won't last long without a refit. Even as it is I notice occasional changes in my ears on a monthly basis and at that rate the amount of refits needed would be staggering. 
   
  As a result either the ck10's or W3's after I test those will be my final iem for a long, long time. Unless some sort of universal comes out that is somehow leaps and bounds better than any of the current top tier I don't see myself changing once I find that ideal sound signature for me *ck10 or W3*


----------



## rawrster

I guess it doesn't make sense for you but I'm not planning on doing that anytime soon and well I don't have the time for it even if I wanted to. I didn't spend much on mine so it's not as bad although I do wish I had the CK10 still but my Eterna seems to fit the bill although nowhere close to my preferred signature. The Zero aren't slouches either.
   
  Choosing between the CK10 and W3 is pretty interesting? Why those two? If it was CK10 or e-Q7 it would be more understandable since those are closer in signature than that and W3.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I guess it doesn't make sense for you but I'm not planning on doing that anytime soon and well I don't have the time for it even if I wanted to. I didn't spend much on mine so it's not as bad although I do wish I had the CK10 still but my Eterna seems to fit the bill although nowhere close to my preferred signature. The Zero aren't slouches either.
> 
> Choosing between the CK10 and W3 is pretty interesting? Why those two? If it was CK10 or e-Q7 it would be more understandable since those are closer in signature than that and W3.


 
   

 [size=medium]Well I know the 2 choices seem odd as they are quite different iem's however what I have found is that in the Coppers I missed some of the detail of the ck10's. The Coppers just were not as clear and detailed as the ck10's. Also, the Coppers gave me odd fit issues every now and then, I would get a good few days and than bad one's where I just couldn't shake the feeling that there was something foreign in my ears. With the ck10's I got a wonderful fit every time and they totally vanished in my ears, the sound was just there. They were just about perfect but lacked a bit of "fun" to me.
   
  Anyhow, the reason the W3's are in there is that fit wise I'm pretty sure they will be just as comfortable as the ck10's. Also, I have read that they have great detail and are more clear/detailed than the Coppers. Also, I do enjoy some fun and bass every now and then so I figure that sound signature might be nice. 
   
  I should be able to listen to a pair in a few days and from there make my decision 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I get that their sound signature are quite different, ck10 vs. W3 and I won't really know which I prefer until I hear the W3 I guess...​[/size]


----------



## MKang25

We need to get some 535s into the hand of Joker


----------



## rawrster

That is true. You need to try them for yourself before you can know if they are for you or not. I tried them and wanted to like them but not for me. I do like their cables however and I like it a bit better than the ES cable I have since ES cable has that memory section when I don't like. I still think the CK10 beats the build of the W3 however.


----------



## SolidSnake3

I should be getting the W3's in the mail in a few days so I will keep everyone posted with the results of the loan. Although I have yet to actually have the W3's I really don't think bettering the build of the ck10's is possible. To me it is perfect in every sense of the word. There is no flaw to look to regarding their build which is an amazing feat by Audio Tech.


----------



## AzureSky

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> azuresky said:
> ...


 

 just figured you either didnt know or hadnt bothered to update it, the new plugs alot nicer then the original, But with my pl-50's I rarely pull my 30's out of their case anymore....


----------



## idvsego

I have a pair of JVC Aircushions and love the fit but want better sound, preferably under $60, this thread has helped a lot.  So far my candidates are the Visang R02, Brainwave M2, Soundmagic PL21.  I am really looking for fitment recommendations.  I like the air cushions because they are light and stay in pretty well even when I move around.  I am not a huge fan of the over-the-ear fit unless it has a cable guide.  I hate when the cables come out from behind my ears.  With this in mind, are there any recommended sets I could add to the list?


----------



## mvw2

Fun little datasheet
   
  I took all the 7.0 and plus SQ earphones in the list and weighed them against price to see which options show the the price you pay per 1 point of SQ.  It's kind of neat to see how little it costs to get good sound.


----------



## Anaxilus

I'm guessing you did full retail.  If you could incorporate a temporal graph to ascertain a Median low for prices and recalculate.  Something to consider when you get incredibly bored.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  NVM- i see you got all sort of prices going on there.  My bad.  I think the IE8 could be adjusted and the M1 ($29)?  Just trying to stack the deck.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> Fun little datasheet
> 
> I took all the 7.0 and plus SQ earphones in the list and weighed them against price to see which options show the the price you pay per 1 point of SQ.  It's kind of neat to see how little it costs to get good sound.


 
   
  Fun indeed... Thanks.
  If you would, please re-sort by 'Sound'?
   
  Cheers
   
  shane


----------



## mvw2

Oh yeah.  The pricing is just what Joker listed.  I know pricing fluctuates a good bit, so there's most likely a lot of swapping all the time.  For example, I bought my IE8 used for something like $240 if I recall correctly.  The Custom 3 is available on eBay for $99 now.  As you pointed out, the M1 is $29.  Joker can comment more on the pricing if he chooses.  I think a lot of his pricing was retail (no sale, limited time pricing) or a relatively current, stable going rate that the product has been going for.  I could probably zip through the list and dig around for the lowest price as of today and change the list, but tomorrow or next week it might be totally different again.  A lot of the pricing wouldn't even be valid a month or two down the road.  I do agree on the IE8 though.  I don't think anyone's bought them at $400 for forever.  Even the expensive price had been around $350, and there have been numerous deals around the mid $200s for them.  I've seen the CK10 for under $190 and the oem version of the DDM can be had for $99 or similar. 
   
  Price isn't an absolute game.  The graph was just more of an interesting tidbit and kind of shows some of the value associated with some of these products.  I mean why is the PL50 incredibly popular?  Or the RE0/RE-ZERO?  I know Joker's suggested the Cyclone PR1 Pro a number of times to people as a good budget option.  Well, there's why.  No, it's not an exact thing, but it's neat to look at.
   
  Sorted for SQ and sub-sorted by value.  It's a very basic breakdown of them in a one-dimensional sense.  The leaders should be pretty obvious.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


azuresky said:


> just figured you either didnt know or hadnt bothered to update it, the new plugs alot nicer then the original, But with my pl-50's I rarely pull my 30's out of their case anymore....


   
  Now updated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote:


idvsego said:


> I have a pair of JVC Aircushions and love the fit but want better sound, preferably under $60, this thread has helped a lot.  So far my candidates are the Visang R02, Brainwave M2, Soundmagic PL21.  I am really looking for fitment recommendations.  I like the air cushions because they are light and stay in pretty well even when I move around.  I am not a huge fan of the over-the-ear fit unless it has a cable guide.  I hate when the cables come out from behind my ears.  With this in mind, are there any recommended sets I could add to the list?


   
  If you have trouble with conventional earphones I really wouldn't recommend the ViSang R02 or Brainwavz M2 as they have rather stiff cables and fit pretty much like a typical IEM. The PL50 is definitely one to consider for comfort in that price range. It does come with cable guides, although they're a bit large for my liking. The cable is soft and should stay behind your ears by itself, though. There's also the Meelec M6, which has the memory wire section. Very easy to keep in place. Another interesting one is the Yamaha EPH-50, which I haven't added to the thread yet. It's a half in-ear design, sort of like the Phiaton PS210. Much more aggressive sound compared to the AirCushions but pretty good overall. But of course if conventional straight-barrel in-ears are okay the R02/R03 and M1/M2 offer the best bang/buck IMO.


 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Fun little datasheet
> 
> I took all the 7.0 and plus SQ earphones in the list and weighed them against price to see which options show the the price you pay per 1 point of SQ.  It's kind of neat to see how little it costs to get good sound.


 
 Very fun indeed, but with an obvious price bias. Then again, such is the nature of diminishing returns. The cheap Kanens would probably be at the top if you graphed everything.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> No, it's not an exact thing, but it's neat to look at.
> 
> Sorted for SQ and sub-sorted by value.  It's a very basic breakdown of them in a one-dimensional sense.  The leaders should be pretty obvious.


 

 Brilliant! That's perfect. Thanks so much. Great little sheet.
   
  shane


----------



## mvw2

I could go further.  Let's say I put equal weight on both ultimate SQ as well as the bang for the buck value I'm getting.  In this sense I put 50% on that it's king of SQ and I put 50% on that it offers high SQ per dollar spent.  These percentages could be different, but I chose 50% weight per each.  The scale is 1 to 0 for each measure and 1 is the highest number, 0 is lowest.  A SQ of 10 is 1.  A value of 4.57 is 1.  A SQ of 7 is 0.  A value of 40.03 is 0.  I could set the ranges different so SQ 0 to 10 and value 0 to 500 if I wanted, and things would scale differently.  I am merely staying within the range of the test group here and broke the range down linearly and with equal weight.
   

   
  The weighted approach might make a little more sense because we as humans do put value on different aspects.  It's not all about SQ or all about comfort or all about price.  It's 50% SQ, 30% comfort, and 20% price or some other mix of things.  You could rebuilt Joker's entire table and put a weight scale for each category and pick your own preference.  The products would then be listed according to your own measures and how much you value each part.  Realize that charts and tables like these can be manipulated quite easily and biased towards certain "winners" if one so chooses.  It all depends on how I measure and weight various aspects.  It is useful to understand how a table is developed.  For example Joker's own rankings averages all of the categories he deems important.  All are weighed equally, so SQ is just as important as microphonics or accessories.  As an individual, it might be beneficial to add more weight to aspects you care about and less weight for aspects you don't really have a concern for.  Maybe accessories doesn't matter to you.  Maybe money is no object.  Maybe you want the best bang for the buck or the SQ king.  Well, adapt the data table to your needs.


----------



## rawrster

That's an interesting little graph. Of course the CK100 is dead last in value


----------



## RBNHIFI

it would be also nice to see groupings of these IEM's based on similar sound signature.  E.g grouped by bass, neutral, or detail sound perhaps.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> That's an interesting little graph. Of course the CK100 is dead last in value


 

 Looks to me that the IE8 has the highest value rating. 41.03, so the CK100 has been spared that embarrassment.


----------



## rawrster

Oh I must have missed that. I also thought the CK100 goes for much higher than $400 retail. Since it's MSRP I guess the IE8 isn't as good a value but they go for the mid $200's quite often from some dealers so I would go for those before I even think about the CK100 which means I'll never get either.


----------



## mvw2

I wouldn't read the graphs too critically.  The price it says and the price you can get a pair for are two different things.  I bought my IE8 used at $240.  There's a CK100 for sale on the forum for $290.  Bang for the buck depends on what you can get them for.


----------



## dweaver

I have to say I am on my 3rd pair of Monster Turbine Pro Copper's and all three have sounded different due to burnin process differences. My first pair was burned in playing music at regular listening levels and that pair had a slightly recessed midrange that made it very dry to listen to and sucked a bit of life out of the vocals in my opinion. My 2nd pair I deliberatly burned in the IEM with a brown noise centric burnin file consisting of brown, pink, and white noise doubling up the brown noise. I increased the volume throughout the burnin process from 10% to 15% volume on my computer. This pair ended up having a pretty heavy bass with a hump in the mid-bass and lower midrange making the pair warmer sounding than the first pair with a more forward midrange at least in the lower midrange. I liked this version more than the first pair but did find the added midbass a bit to much to handle over time. Fortunately the IEM started to have the same physical flaw as some of the other early MTPC's and was breaking wher the two halfs of the IEM are joined together so I warrantied them and recieved a new pair. This latest pair I changed up my burnin routine by creating a burnin file based off of my P-W-B-P-W burnin file, to this file I added 1 minute heavy drumming intervals every cycle and 3 minutes of cymbals every cycle. I used this for the first 5 or so hours and had a listen and found the midrange was not changing as much as I had hoped so I switched to my brown centric burnin file and let the IEM's burn for about 15 hours and the midrange was just about perfect more forward but no big midbass hump. I then set up my system to rotate between my new burnin file and the brown burnin file, set the volume to 15% and left on holidays for 2 and half days. I have since been listening to these headphones on and off and have to say they are much better than my first two. I have never seen a pair of headphones respond to differences in the burnin process so much.
   
_|Joker|, do you still have the Coppers you used for your review? If so I would love to send you this pair and have you do a comparison. I think the difference is startling but would love to have someone else verify they are hearing a similar difference (or not)._
   
  BTW I also have started to use a home made foam tip made from earplugs that has eliminated the one issue of echoing I had with this IEM.
   
  Between the new tip and my latest burnin process this IEM is the nicest sounding dynamic based IEM I have heard, I much prefer it to my IE8. I think it conveys emotion very well and is good for music like rock with the exception of anything that is extremely fast and complex that is better handled by a BA based IEM.
   
  Will it replace my SM3 as my main IEM? Probably not, but I do have to say it will get used for certain genres more often and if the SM3 broke tomorrow I could certainly live with the MTPC for a good while without feeling like I was missing something.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> I could go further.  Let's say I put equal weight on both ultimate SQ as well as the bang for the buck value I'm getting.  In this sense I put 50% on that it's king of SQ and I put 50% on that it offers high SQ per dollar spent.  These percentages could be different, but I chose 50% weight per each.  The scale is 1 to 0 for each measure and 1 is the highest number, 0 is lowest.  A SQ of 10 is 1.  A value of 4.57 is 1.  A SQ of 7 is 0.  A value of 40.03 is 0.  I could set the ranges different so SQ 0 to 10 and value 0 to 500 if I wanted, and things would scale differently.  I am merely staying within the range of the test group here and broke the range down linearly and with equal weight.
> 
> 
> 
> The weighted approach might make a little more sense because we as humans do put value on different aspects.  It's not all about SQ or all about comfort or all about price.  It's 50% SQ, 30% comfort, and 20% price or some other mix of things.  You could rebuilt Joker's entire table and put a weight scale for each category and pick your own preference.  The products would then be listed according to your own measures and how much you value each part.  Realize that charts and tables like these can be manipulated quite easily and biased towards certain "winners" if one so chooses.  It all depends on how I measure and weight various aspects.  It is useful to understand how a table is developed.  For example Joker's own rankings averages all of the categories he deems important.  All are weighed equally, so SQ is just as important as microphonics or accessories.  As an individual, it might be beneficial to add more weight to aspects you care about and less weight for aspects you don't really have a concern for.  Maybe accessories doesn't matter to you.  Maybe money is no object.  Maybe you want the best bang for the buck or the SQ king.  Well, adapt the data table to your needs.


 

 Very nice. This approach definitely falls much closer to my own value ranking. And yep, nothing like applying your own weighting to the table. Maybe I'll make the bare table available in .xls format at some point for those curious to play around with it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## ethan961

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Very nice. This approach definitely falls much closer to my own value ranking. And yep, nothing like applying your own weighting to the table. Maybe I'll make the bare table available in .xls format at some point for those curious to play around with it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Question, is isolation a factor in your tables? I find that to be the most subjective, because some people might want something that barely isolates so they don't get hit by a car etc. Sorry if this has already been brought up before. It does seem like common sense, so no offense if it is excluded, but it's still something that came to my mind seeing the red to green boxes in the isolation column and thinking about how that's usually attributed to something being good or bad, 'bad' being ideal in some cases for isolation.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


dweaver said:


> _|Joker|, do you still have the Coppers you used for your review? If so I would love to send you this pair and have you do a comparison. I think the difference is startling but would love to have someone else verify they are hearing a similar difference (or not)._


   
  The Coppers I had belong to rawrster. They were BNIB when they got to me and were subjected to my usual burn through - a 64mb SD card loaded with pink noise, white noise, and a couple of music tracks. The card has a 15-min silent track at the end and runs about 50 mins in total. All new earphones I receive are subjected to at least 96 hours of burn-in with this SD card. To make a special case for the Coppers would be somewhat unfair. And no, I don't have them anymore, sadly.


 Quote:


ethan961 said:


> Question, is isolation a factor in your tables? I find that to be the most subjective, because some people might want something that barely isolates so they don't get hit by a car etc. Sorry if this has already been brought up before. It does seem like common sense, so no offense if it is excluded, but it's still something that came to my mind seeing the red to green boxes in the isolation column and thinking about how that's usually attributed to something being good or bad, 'bad' being ideal in some cases for isolation.


 
  Yes, isolation is factored into the average. I definitely see your point and I've thought this through but I believe isolation is more often considered desirable than undesirable when it comes to IEMs. I think the accessories rating is more subjective, tbh. Most of the accessories we get with the $100+ earphones are worth $2-3 by themselves. I see people ask for isolation all the time. Never seen anyone ask for an IEM with a good accessory pack. Anyway, I leave it up to the reader to focus on what they feel is important. Obviously if isolation is not important the IE8 will do relatively better and the ER4 - worse. I think I made a note of that in my portable thread but not here for some reason.


----------



## dweaver

Thats OK |Joker|;
   
  I am more interested in seeing if anyone else notices a difference in the sound as anything. I may see if Rawrster is interested in doing a bit of A/B testing after these finish burning in. I'll give him a PM if and when I'm up for the task. This darn curiousity is gonna get me someday LOL.
   Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ljokerl*
> 
> The Coppers I had belong to rawrster. They were BNIB when they got to me and were subjected to my usual burn through - a 64mb SD card loaded with pink noise, white noise, and a couple of music tracks. The card has a 15-min silent track at the end and runs about 50 mins in total. All new earphones I receive are subjected to at least 96 hours of burn-in with this SD card. To make a special case for the Coppers would be somewhat unfair. And no, I don't have them anymore, sadly.


----------



## mvw2

I always thought the IE8 had good isolation.  It's just that it's so seldom well isolated.  You have a big weight flopping around at the end of the tip.  Unlike some of the more secure IEMs, I always found the IE8 to unseal itself pretty readily.  With the healthy amount of bass, you never really noticed it happening all that often.  Every once in a while you shove them back in and hey, more bass and look the outside world went away again.  They weren't godly in isolation but not terrible either.  I just found them to be on par with other IEMs and this is when I owned the SE530, UM3X, and Triple.Fi 10 too.  I was never disappointed by the amount of isolation...just as long as I had a solid seal.  The seal was the hard part because you had a big, floppy dumbbell at the end.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> That's an interesting little graph. Of course the CK100 is dead last in value


 

 That's because the FI-BA-SS isn't yet on the list. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Oh, and of course congrats to Joker on 100 IEM reviews!


----------



## airwax

Congrats to Joker for hitting the century mark! and still counting, keep the reviews coming.


----------



## panthers2012

New to HF and this thread is amazing. I am looking to replace my iBuds, and I have some good ideas now.


----------



## idvsego

just for further fun, I dropped all of the values from the summary chart into a spreadsheet to be able to sort by whatever I wanted.  I also added the price tier info.
   
  http://www.nuclearfuzz.com/idvsego/ljokerl_chart.xls


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





james444 said:


> That's because the FI-BA-SS isn't yet on the list.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Well I don't think that earphone will make it on the list anytime soon  So my wallet can relax right now without fear of it being emptied.


----------



## mvw2

Quote: 





idvsego said:


> just for further fun, I dropped all of the values from the summary chart into a spreadsheet to be able to sort by whatever I wanted.  I also added the price tier info.
> 
> http://www.nuclearfuzz.com/idvsego/ljokerl_chart.xls


 

 Cool, more work than I wanted to go through. 
   
  I would also suggest to anyone to add weights in front of each column so you can scale the level of importance each factor has for you.  The average can then be redone to include those weights and score the list to your preference.
   
  Haha, just noticed you did it for the _*headphone*_ chart, not the IEM chart.  I added weights to it, but I can't attach files without permission.


----------



## idvsego

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> Cool, more work than I wanted to go through.
> 
> I would also suggest to anyone to add weights in front of each column so you can scale the level of importance each factor has for you.  The average can then be redone to include those weights and score the list to your preference.
> 
> Haha, just noticed you did it for the _*headphone*_ chart, not the IEM chart.  I added weights to it, but I can't attach files without permission.


 

 I have a worksheet for portables and a worksheet for IEM as well as a worksheet to track changes I am making.  All values were pulled from the summary table ljokerl posted. 
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/478568/multi-iem-review-100-iems-compared-westone-um3x-turbine-pro-copper-added-08-18#post_6492059
  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/433318/shootout-46-portable-headphones-compared-audio-technica-ath-em7-added-08-22#post_5830274
   
  a little more info...
  http://www.nuclearfuzz.com/idvsego/ljokerl_chart_rev2.xls


----------



## mvw2

idvsego will upload a weighted version of the IEM Excel spreadsheet I whipped up.  I don't have a file host at the moment and head-fi doesn't yet support attached files.
   
  You guys should be able to fiddle with the weights and then sort the list and get a nice breakdown of which products you should think about wasting more money on.


----------



## idvsego

Here they are...
   
Joker's Headphone Chart Weighted.xls
   
Joker's IEM Worksheet Weighted.xlsx
   
  and the compatibility pack in case anyone needs it for their version of Office
   
  http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=941B3470-3AE9-4AEE-8F43-C6BB74CD1466&displaylang=en


----------



## mvw2

Just copy and paste the whole line and the links will work.  The forum seems to have wanted to stop after the apostrophe.


----------



## idvsego

Links are now clickable for everyones convenience


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mvw2 said:


> I always thought the IE8 had good isolation.  It's just that it's so seldom well isolated.  You have a big weight flopping around at the end of the tip.  Unlike some of the more secure IEMs, I always found the IE8 to unseal itself pretty readily.  With the healthy amount of bass, you never really noticed it happening all that often.  Every once in a while you shove them back in and hey, more bass and look the outside world went away again.  They weren't godly in isolation but not terrible either.  I just found them to be on par with other IEMs and this is when I owned the SE530, UM3X, and Triple.Fi 10 too.  I was never disappointed by the amount of isolation...just as long as I had a solid seal.  The seal was the hard part because you had a big, floppy dumbbell at the end.


   
  For some reason longer tips (e.g. standard-length dual- and triple-flanges) never really worked for me with the IE8 so I was stuck with single flanges and stubby biflanges. I think the fit I had was pretty secure. My IE7 is the same way. Seems to isolate more if I tape up the vents, too.


 Quote:


james444 said:


> That's because the FI-BA-SS isn't yet on the list.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks, and I think rawrster is right on this one. Not seeing any new shiny Japanese earphones in my future (if only wallets were capable of letting out a sigh of relief...)


 Quote:


airwax said:


> Congrats to Joker for hitting the century mark! and still counting, keep the reviews coming.


 
 Quote:


panthers2012 said:


> New to HF and this thread is amazing. I am looking to replace my iBuds, and I have some good ideas now.


 
 Thanks, glad the thread is helpful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
  Quote:


idvsego said:


> Here they are...
> 
> Joker's Headphone Chart Weighted.xls
> 
> ...


 
 Amazing work there, this should be handy for many. I think I'll link to this post in the OP or paste the direct links (with your permission).


----------



## idvsego

I dont have a problem hosting them for now as long as mvw2 doesn't mind sharing his work


----------



## ethan961

Quote: 





idvsego said:


> I dont have a problem hosting them for now as long as mvw2 doesn't mind sharing his work


 

 If it comes to a point where you can no longer host them, just let me know and I can gladly do it for you - I've got 1TB of bandwidth that I barely touch that I'm more than happy to lend out. I bought this server package for the power, it just came with more bandwidth than I could ever use.


----------



## mvw2

Do whatever with it.  My "work" was just copying data.  It's Joker's thread, Joker's data.  I just put it in different packaging.  Plus I had nothing else to do today, haha.  I'd say host a copy of it and give Joker the link so he can do whatever he wants with it.  Also he will be modifying anything on his own as he adds more.
   
   
  One thing I keep saying, if someone wants to see a review done on an earphone, someone just needs to loan you a pair.  Want a review of the FI-BA-SS or SM3?  Well, people have them lying around.  Send a pair to Joker and it will go up.  Simple.
   
  p.s. Joker, count your list again.  Tell me what number you get to.


----------



## rawrster

LOL  How do you notice things like that? Looks like Joker needs to make his next review count


----------



## faisal2003456

Bought the iM-590. Hope I like them! My first true foray (do random ones from Fry's Electronics count?) into the IEM market.


----------



## ethan961

Oh man, that's just too funny - I literally LOLed at that. Got a couple funny looks, but oh well!
   
  You get a second chance to make an even bigger bang!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


idvsego said:


> I dont have a problem hosting them for now as long as mvw2 doesn't mind sharing his work


   
  Thanks, added a link to the file in the OP (well... in post #8). 


 Quote:


ethan961 said:


> If it comes to a point where you can no longer host them, just let me know and I can gladly do it for you - I've got 1TB of bandwidth that I barely touch that I'm more than happy to lend out. I bought this server package for the power, it just came with more bandwidth than I could ever use.


   
  Thanks, ethan.
  
  Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Do whatever with it.  My "work" was just copying data.  It's Joker's thread, Joker's data.  I just put it in different packaging.  Plus I had nothing else to do today, haha.  I'd say host a copy of it and give Joker the link so he can do whatever he wants with it.  Also he will be modifying anything on his own as he adds more.
> 
> One thing I keep saying, if someone wants to see a review done on an earphone, someone just needs to loan you a pair.  Want a review of the FI-BA-SS or SM3?  Well, people have them lying around.  Send a pair to Joker and it will go up.  Simple.
> 
> p.s. Joker, count your list again.  Tell me what number you get to.


 
 Lol. You can add up the numbers in the individual categories much quicker. It should come out to 99 but I counted the ViSang R03 and Brainwavz M2 as different earphones when I added them since they were released and added to the thread at different times.


----------



## idvsego

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> LOL  How do you notice things like that? Looks like Joker needs to make his next review count


 

 pretty easy when you do a spreadsheet and the line counts don't add up.  I thought I had just missed one. 
   
  Oh, and this very useful thread has led to me buying a set of visang R02.  Very excited.  Now I am looking at new sources.  I like my Zune but dont love it.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

|joker| - great reviews as usual.  I agree with most of your impressions as well, but I've maybe heard 15-20 of the IEM you've reviewed.  I just want to interject my thoughts on a couple of things here.
   
  After listening to the UM3X with removable cable for the past week non-stop, I'd have to say that I think the bass quality and transparency is a little better than what I read in your descriptions.  But I understand that you must not think those areas are actually bad when you gave them a sonic score of 9.75/10.  I also think the UM3X with removable cable is a better value than the ones you reviewed since it does come with the full tip fit-kit for only $20-25 more.  I posted a UM3X review in the product section recently this week as well.  
   
  Also, with the Monster Turbine Pro Gold Vs the Copper I might actually prefer the Gold over the Copper.  While treble and detail was improved over the Gold, I didn't like the decrease in bass vs the Gold.  I didn't think the UM3X were any more forward sounding than the Copper, but to me the UM3X were more transparent and realistic sounding.  The Copper also seemed to have a very slight closed headphone sound or some other coloration that my Gold don't have, and this hurt their transparency for me.  
   
  So I think the 9.75/10 you gave the UM3X is deserved, and they were better than the Copper to me.  But I might have scored the the Copper slightly lower than you did, because even though the Copper were more detailed and balanced than the Gold I just didn't enjoy them as much as the Gold.  (I own the gold and the copper were loaned to me by rawrster, same as you).  
   
  In my case I'd go nuts trying to give numerical scores to the reviewed gear, because two or three IEM could have the same score but sound somewhat different and appeal to different people.  It's easier for me to rank things in order of my "personal preference", but I have gotten away from putting things on a scale of 1-10 these days.  I think that your descriptions of the IEM sound is the most helpful part, and I would hate to see someone pass up a 9.25 IEM in favor of a 9.5 without reading the actual review which is the best part.
   
  Keep up the good work!


----------



## mvw2

That explains it.  Well at least the math works out now.
   
  Small note, feel free to remove my edits if you feel they are off.  In the spreadsheet I did up isolation on the IE8 by 1 and lower it's price to $350.  I always felt the isolation is actually quite good on them just as long as you have a good seal.  I will agree that the stock tips aren't necessarily the best.  I ran a small bi-flange, and I didn't have much use for most of the others.  If I were to own a pair in the future for some reason I might plop on a Comply T-500 tip or a decored Olive instead.  When sealed well, they did block out sounds well.  I know I read a lot of comments about this even before I owned a pair and was aware of what people said as I tested them.  I found isolation to be on par, but I so seldom maintained a good seal.  With the heavy bass, you never really notice it loosening up.  Even a leaky fit still has good bass with them.  They were on par with others in my eyes, but feel free to rank as you see fit.  I also felt the $350 price tag was much better.  I saw the IE8 for $350 all the time and deals seem to pop up quite often for them sold sub $300, sometimes as low as $240 new.  For day to day, I think something in the $300 to $350 range is more fitting in terms of available price.
   
  I also upped the build quality on the OK1.  For as cheap as it looks, the material choices and build quality is actually quite good.  It's not something I'd notice on casual use, but they are smartly built.  Mind you I've owned them for almost 2 years now and as a main product I've used on a daily basis.  They still look like new.  I know you picked on the cord some, but two years, no case, and just stuffing them in pockets, bags, or burying them under piles of crap on my deck has done nothing to them.  No nicks, no memory/kinks/twists, nothing.  For as budget level as they look, the materials were picked smartly.  I know I'm nitpicking.
   
  I also noticed my remarks didn't move with the earphones, so where my comments are no longer correlates to which earphone I was commenting about.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Also, with the Monster Turbine Pro Gold Vs the Copper I might actually prefer the Gold over the Copper.  While treble and detail was improved over the Gold, I didn't like the decrease in bass vs the Gold.  I didn't think the UM3X were any more forward sounding than the Copper, but to me the UM3X were more transparent and realistic sounding.  The Copper also seemed to have a very slight closed headphone sound or some other coloration that my Gold don't have, and this hurt their transparency for me.
> 
> So I think the 9.75/10 you gave the UM3X is deserved, and they were better than the Copper to me.  But I might have scored the the Copper slightly lower than you did, because even though the Copper were more detailed and balanced than the Gold I just didn't enjoy them as much as the Gold.  (I own the gold and the copper were loaned to me by rawrster, same as you).


 

 I would actually like to supports joker's scoring of the Coppers and HeadphoneAddict's impressions at the same time.  While I have a preference for the signature and engaging nature of the Golds and MDs the Coppers do some technical aspects more proficiently.  I think from joker's perspective of grading a phone he did so in a very analytical fashion which goes in favor of the Coppers as that's the focus of their design in comparison.  Perhaps you lose bass quantity and related textures a bit but you gain overall speed in the IEM which many prefer.  From my listening the Coppers when positioned just right in the ears beat the Golds in transparency and do not sound closed to me at all.  I still recall the wide soundstage of the Coppers listening to Hotel California from Hell Freezes over quite clearly to this day.  The Golds were more closed in to me.  My 2 cents.  
   
  If you like the Golds more than the Coppers I'm curious what you thought of the MDs.  To me the MD's are like more proficient Golds.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


idvsego said:


> pretty easy when you do a spreadsheet and the line counts don't add up.  I thought I had just missed one.
> 
> Oh, and this very useful thread has led to me buying a set of visang R02.  Very excited.  Now I am looking at new sources.  I like my Zune but dont love it.


 
 Yeah, the spreadsheet would work for keeping track if I didn't have in there earphones that haven't been added to the thread yet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Hope you like the R02! Looks like you did a good job of reading the table as they are the earphone I'd rate highest in value among the budget sets.


 Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> |joker| - great reviews as usual.  I agree with most of your impressions as well, but I've maybe heard 15-20 of the IEM you've reviewed.  I just want to interject my thoughts on a couple of things here.
> 
> After listening to the UM3X with removable cable for the past week non-stop, I'd have to say that I think the bass quality and transparency is a little better than what I read in your descriptions.  But I understand that you must not think those areas are actually bad when you gave them a sonic score of 9.75/10.  I also think the UM3X with removable cable is a better value than the ones you reviewed since it does come with the full tip fit-kit for only $20-25 more.  I posted a UM3X review in the product section recently this week as well.
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks for your thoughts. I really hope it doesn't sound like I didn't like the bass of the UM3X - I did. I have almost no technical issues with the sound of the UM3X - it's the presentation I don't like. And yeah, the removable-cord UM3X would probably have scored higher. Hopefully those who are considering buying the removable-cord ones can make the appropriate mental substitution (or use idvsego's handy chart). 
   
  Also I think I mentioned that I like the Gold more than the Copper if not in the review, then from one of the early posts after it was posted. To me the Coppers sound like they're trying too hard but I really try to keep personal preferences out of it, which is why the Coppers scored higher. 
   
  As for your last thought, I really can't stress that enough. It even says so right under the table but I don't think anyone reads that part.
  
  Quote:


mvw2 said:


> That explains it.  Well at least the math works out now.
> 
> Small note, feel free to remove my edits if you feel they are off.  In the spreadsheet I did up isolation on the IE8 by 1 and lower it's price to $350.  I always felt the isolation is actually quite good on them just as long as you have a good seal.  I will agree that the stock tips aren't necessarily the best.  I ran a small bi-flange, and I didn't have much use for most of the others.  If I were to own a pair in the future for some reason I might plop on a Comply T-500 tip or a decored Olive instead.  When sealed well, they did block out sounds well.  I know I read a lot of comments about this even before I owned a pair and was aware of what people said as I tested them.  I found isolation to be on par, but I so seldom maintained a good seal.  With the heavy bass, you never really notice it loosening up.  Even a leaky fit still has good bass with them.  They were on par with others in my eyes, but feel free to rank as you see fit.  I also felt the $350 price tag was much better.  I saw the IE8 for $350 all the time and deals seem to pop up quite often for them sold sub $300, sometimes as low as $240 new.  For day to day, I think something in the $300 to $350 range is more fitting in terms of available price.
> 
> ...


 
 Ah yes, the shifted edits. I had some fun trying to figure out where each one belongs. I don't have a problem with them but I won't be modifying my review. I still don't see an authorized retailed for the IE8 that consistently sells them at under $399. If you can find one I'll drop the price. I know ecost has them for $240 but it's easier to maintain consistent pricing and consider sales a bonus.
   
  Doesn't your OK1 have electrical tape on the cords? I really don't have a problem with the build personally but you have to agree that for a $230 product it's just not very impressive. Also, I know people who have had a pair of ibuds for 3+ years with nary an issue. I still wouldn't call ibuds well-built, though.


----------



## mvw2

I put the tape on the right side to tell me which was right in the dark.


----------



## idvsego

99 or 100, I dont care.  its fantastic work and a herculean effort...and it is much appreciated.  Not by my wife though, as I have about 3 other sets in my sights now.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> I put the tape on the right side to tell me which was right in the dark.


 

 I was considering doing this with my RE-ZERO. Is there a better way to do it? My previous IEMs had a J-cord, so it wasn't a problem.


----------



## rawrster

Well you can't tell the difference in the dark unless  you show some light on it or do something similar to that where one side is different than the other.


----------



## Katun

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> I have to say I am on my 3rd pair of Monster Turbine Pro Copper's and all three have sounded different due to burnin process differences. My first pair was burned in playing music at regular listening levels and that pair had a slightly recessed midrange that made it very dry to listen to and sucked a bit of life out of the vocals in my opinion. My 2nd pair I deliberatly burned in the IEM with a brown noise centric burnin file consisting of brown, pink, and white noise doubling up the brown noise. I increased the volume throughout the burnin process from 10% to 15% volume on my computer. This pair ended up having a pretty heavy bass with a hump in the mid-bass and lower midrange making the pair warmer sounding than the first pair with a more forward midrange at least in the lower midrange. I liked this version more than the first pair but did find the added midbass a bit to much to handle over time. Fortunately the IEM started to have the same physical flaw as some of the other early MTPC's and was breaking wher the two halfs of the IEM are joined together so I warrantied them and recieved a new pair. This latest pair I changed up my burnin routine by creating a burnin file based off of my P-W-B-P-W burnin file, to this file I added 1 minute heavy drumming intervals every cycle and 3 minutes of cymbals every cycle. I used this for the first 5 or so hours and had a listen and found the midrange was not changing as much as I had hoped so I switched to my brown centric burnin file and let the IEM's burn for about 15 hours and the midrange was just about perfect more forward but no big midbass hump. I then set up my system to rotate between my new burnin file and the brown burnin file, set the volume to 15% and left on holidays for 2 and half days. I have since been listening to these headphones on and off and have to say they are much better than my first two. I have never seen a pair of headphones respond to differences in the burnin process so much.


 

 Wow, I didn't even know that was possible. I thought, burn in was burn in, it would all turn out the same in the end.
   
  So, could this mean one might be more careful on how to burn in their headphones (these specifically) because of the permanent sound that eventually breaks in?
   
  I think I'm a bit frightened. I do want my Turbine Golds to sound their best...


----------



## dweaver

Quote: 





katun said:


> Wow, I didn't even know that was possible. I thought, burn in was burn in, it would all turn out the same in the end.
> 
> So, could this mean one might be more careful on how to burn in their headphones (these specifically) because of the permanent sound that eventually breaks in?
> 
> I think I'm a bit frightened. I do want my Turbine Golds to sound their best...


 


 While there is no way to prove conclusively my findings because I can't afford to buy enough pairs to do a true sampling, I am pretty sure the coppers as least respond very well to different burnin techniques. For the Golds I would probably recommend starting with my P-W-B-P-W Flac file as it should not over emphasize the mid-bass and lower midrange which is already strong in the golds. But if you want even more in that area by all means try the brown based file. Actually download both and try one for a about 5hrs and have a listen to see if the phones are changing the way you would like and then switch if your not happy. But take a read through "A tale of 2 IEM's" first, I would also recommend putting respones in that thread so as to not get this thread to far off topic. BTW I have put a tip mod at the end of that thread you might also find very interesting to try out.


----------



## mvw2

It would be hard to compare.  There are many assumptions associated with the experiments.  For one, you assume all the sets sounded very close to each other in the start.  Driver variation could very well have one set sounding a little different than another.  I really have no clue where Monster gets their drivers and if the company tests their samples for consistency.  Second, there is the assumption that all burn in methods completely burnt in the earphones.  Maybe one method simply doesn't do as much as another.  While one may sound different than another after the burn in it may turn out that all equal out through normal listening later.  Third, we has humans have terrible memory of sounds.  What we thought we heard and what we hear now are two different things.  Both our perception of sound and our memory of sound vary with time.  Human hearing is an adaptive, auto-tuning system, so it gets incredibly hard to perceive the same way twice.  A form of "pallet cleanser" can help though.  I find pink noise to both be a good tool for EQing but also resetting the mental perception of sound.  When you spend an hour or so listening to static through several headphones, it tends to wash away any skew you may have had.  There are a few product I've had for a very long time, and I've used them in the mix as I try out new hardware.  It is interesting to experience changes in perception with time.
   
  I think the only good test is to literally buy a bunch of earphones, run all of them immediately and write down how each sound overall and in relation to each other.  If all of them sound the same or at least close enough to not casually be aware of which earphone you have in your ears at any given time, you can step into the burn in.  It would be helpful to do listening evaluation blindly with random testing of the bunch.  I would also wait a while and randomly test again once or twice more and just write down everything.  If it is in the head, we will describe one earphone different every time we hear it.  If it is from the burn-in, we should be able to describe the same earphone the same way every time no matter what order we listen to them.in a blind test.  Repetition of the test weeds out random chance and actually shows a pattern.  At the end of the burn in process they should sound different if the method is important.  I would also suggest after this point to swap the burn in process for each and run them through again.  They should get more alike if they all share the same process.  There might be a control earphone on the side of all of this testing that measures just normal musical use and time.  If they all equal out over time, it would just be a use issue.  It may just be that one burn in method is just quicker getting to the end result.


----------



## dweaver

Last post on this subject from me in this thread as the A tale of 2 IEM's is the right place for this discussion. My full response to mvw2 will be in that thread.


----------



## proedros

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> I have to say I am on my 3rd pair of Monster Turbine Pro Copper's and all three have sounded different due to burnin process differences. My first pair was burned in playing music at regular listening levels and that pair had a slightly recessed midrange that made it very dry to listen to and sucked a bit of life out of the vocals in my opinion. My 2nd pair I deliberatly burned in the IEM with a brown noise centric burnin file consisting of brown, pink, and white noise doubling up the brown noise. I increased the volume throughout the burnin process from 10% to 15% volume on my computer. This pair ended up having a pretty heavy bass with a hump in the mid-bass and lower midrange making the pair warmer sounding than the first pair with a more forward midrange at least in the lower midrange. I liked this version more than the first pair but did find the added midbass a bit to much to handle over time. Fortunately the IEM started to have the same physical flaw as some of the other early MTPC's and was breaking wher the two halfs of the IEM are joined together so I warrantied them and recieved a new pair. This latest pair I changed up my burnin routine by creating a burnin file based off of my P-W-B-P-W burnin file, to this file I added 1 minute heavy drumming intervals every cycle and 3 minutes of cymbals every cycle. I used this for the first 5 or so hours and had a listen and found the midrange was not changing as much as I had hoped so I switched to my brown centric burnin file and let the IEM's burn for about 15 hours and the midrange was just about perfect more forward but no big midbass hump. I then set up my system to rotate between my new burnin file and the brown burnin file, set the volume to 15% and left on holidays for 2 and half days. I have since been listening to these headphones on and off and have to say they are much better than my first two. I have never seen a pair of headphones respond to differences in the burnin process so much.
> 
> _|_


 
   
   
  just curious , but what kind of music do you listen to ?
   
  seems to me you are a little more 'anal' than required to simply enjoy the music with its tiny flaws and errors

 to be honest , reading your post i imagined you living in an air-sealed room wearing special isolation uniform...
   
  it's music dude , it's not nuclear physics...
   
   
   
  on topic
   
   
  can the mods make this a 'sticky' thread ?
   
  This is really useful , when wanting to compare different IEM's.....


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





proedros said:


> just curious , but what kind of music do you listen to ?
> 
> seems to me you are a little more 'anal' than required to simply enjoy the music with its tiny flaws and errors
> 
> ...


 

 Nope, pretty common place around here.  Head over to the burn-in, impedance, 16 v 24bit, threads in the sound science forum.


----------



## dweaver

Quote: 





proedros said:


> just curious , but what kind of music do you listen to ?
> 
> seems to me you are a little more 'anal' than required to simply enjoy the music with its tiny flaws and errors
> 
> ...


 


 Not often that a nubie almost gets my hackles up. Thought about posting something in the same vein of "humor" but decided not to...
   
  I suspect from your 4 whole sentences of dribble you haven't figured out your on a website dedicated to hi-fi listeners of music. Half the threads on this site focus on the "tiny flaws and errors" so I guess the other members of this site must also be in "an air-sealed room wearing special isolation uniform" as well, but wait... your on this same site too, does that mean your also in an air-sealed room wearing special isolation uniform?
   
  Hey wait a minute, I said I wasn't going to go down the same vein of "humor"... oh well
   
  Have a good night proedros...


----------



## james444

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> One thing I keep saying, if someone wants to see a review done on an earphone, someone just needs to loan you a pair.  Want a review of the FI-BA-SS or SM3?  Well, people have them lying around.  Send a pair to Joker and it will go up.  Simple.
> 
> p.s. Joker, count your list again.  Tell me what number you get to.


 
   
  It wasn't my intent to coax Joker into doing yet another review. I was replying to rawrster, who said the CK100 were dead last in value. The CK100 earned a 10/10 in SQ, so it's easy to predict that the $1000+ FI-BA-SS would set a new low record in value.
   
  Speaking of which, I'll be lending these to dfkt next week and already wonder whether he'll pull them to pieces like the other FADs. After that, I might lend them to one or two other trustworthy Head-Fiers in case they're still interested, hehe.
   
  p.s. @mvw2 copy/paste 'what your mother said last night Trebec' into google and tell me what comes up.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> I was considering doing this with my RE-ZERO. Is there a better way to do it? My previous IEMs had a J-cord, so it wasn't a problem.


 

 I've used a small drop of nail polish in the past. With some practice I could 'feel it out' in the dark to tell which earphone is which. But tape is easier and easily reversible.

  
  Quote: 





proedros said:


> can the mods make this a 'sticky' thread ?
> 
> This is really useful , when wanting to compare different IEM's.....


 
   
  I don't believe the concept of a 'sticky' exists under the new (Huddler) platform. It's been replaced by Wikis
  
    
  Quote:


james444 said:


> It wasn't my intent to coax Joker into doing yet another review. I was replying to rawrster, who said the CK100 were dead last in value. The CK100 earned a 10/10 in SQ, so it's easy to predict that the $1000+ FI-BA-SS would set a new low record in value.
> 
> Speaking of which, I'll be lending these to dfkt next week and already wonder whether he'll pull them to pieces like the other FADs. After that, I might lend them to one or two other trustworthy Head-Fiers in case they're still interested, hehe.


 
  Well, unless the inclusion of the FI-BA-SS forces me to re-scale my system in such a way that the CK100 ends up with a 5/10 in SQ


----------



## ethan961

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't believe the concept of a 'sticky' exists under the new (Huddler) platform. It's been replaced by Wikis/


 

 It's been done in the FS forum now, just noticed it this morning.


----------



## rawrster

You could always get some expensive customs that might make the CK100 such a low value there as well  Although value wise they have to be pretty low considering such a high price tag and the fact that I liked the CK10 better.


----------



## padcat

Hello Joker, I'm amazed by the amount of budget earphones you reviewed. Your reviews are so detailed that anyone could pretty easily choose the best value for their purchase, but still I would love to hear your input on this:
   
  In which two IEMs should I spend $100 on? I'm looking for two different signatures (detailed yet engaging, impactful yet clean). I'm pretty set on the Brainwavz M1 thanks to the delicious free shipping, but since I'll be getting 2 different pairs, maybe a more extremist sound signature would be better? Again, I would love to hear your opinion.
   
  PS: Your comparison threads are my favourite thing on head-fi.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ethan961 said:


> It's been done in the FS forum now, just noticed it this morning.


 

 Oh yes, those. I stopped noticing them the day after they showed up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.

  
  Quote: 





padcat said:


> Hello Joker, I'm amazed by the amount of budget earphones you reviewed. Your reviews are so detailed that anyone could pretty easily choose the best value for their purchase, but still I would love to hear your input on this:
> 
> In which two IEMs should I spend $100 on? I'm looking for two different signatures (detailed yet engaging, impactful yet clean). I'm pretty set on the Brainwavz M1 thanks to the delicious free shipping, but since I'll be getting 2 different pairs, maybe a more extremist sound signature would be better? Again, I would love to hear your opinion.
> 
> PS: Your comparison threads are my favourite thing on head-fi.


 

 Thanks, glad you found the thread useful.
   
  Hmm... a compliment to the M1. Perhaps the soundmagic PL50 or Thinksound Rain. All three are rather balanced but the thick and mid-centric PL50s or more laid-back Rains would make a good addition to the shimmering and airy M1s.


----------



## mvw2

Quote: 





james444 said:


> It wasn't my intent to coax Joker into doing yet another review. I was replying to rawrster, who said the CK100 were dead last in value. The CK100 earned a 10/10 in SQ, so it's easy to predict that the $1000+ FI-BA-SS would set a new low record in value.
> 
> Speaking of which, I'll be lending these to dfkt next week and already wonder whether he'll pull them to pieces like the other FADs. After that, I might lend them to one or two other trustworthy Head-Fiers in case they're still interested, hehe.
> 
> p.s. @mvw2 copy/paste 'what your mother said last night Trebec' into google and tell me what comes up.


 

 I wasn't talking to you specifically.  It was more of a general comment.  If anybody wants to see what Joker thinks about X earphone, someone send him one.  That's it.  It's not like he has to personally buy every product out there just to get a review up.  It's more of having someone willing to be without their beloved X earphone for a few weeks.  Why no SE535 yet?  Heck even SE530?   Someone send him one, and it will be up there with the others.
   
  dfkt is an interesting guy.  I like his reviews and his general character.  I've noticed him and I don't quite hear alike though reading through past reviews/impressions.  I've been more in-sync with ClieOS' and Joker's reviews, so I tend to follow those.  It's nothing against dfkt, but I understand we seek different things.
   
  Will Ferell runs rampant through the internet, and yes it's funny that it comes up with my for sale thread, haha.


----------



## 2rooi123

just snagged a pair of maxell dhp-II for $37 shipped
  thanks for the review joker! you da man!


----------



## Anaxilus

Cool, I guess the Maxells are all that.  Way to get to the bottom of things Joker!


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> <snip> If anybody wants to see what Joker thinks about X earphone, someone send him one.  That's it. <snip>


 

 I know it's Mikes(?) place to answer this but I'll somewhat pose it to you anyway (kinda 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).
   
  I don't think it's as simple as "That's it." because if it was Mike would say so. If he was serious about having people send him IEMs to review he would have to (or at least should) set up a set of rules that go along with someone lending him anything.
  I'd hate to have the responsibility of strangers treasured IEMs on my head, especially dealing with international post, etc. So I can see why it wouldn't be a simple thing to do.
  So Mike. If you are serious about people lending you things to review my recommendation is say so on the first page with a set of rules that have to be agreed with by both parties first. If not I can totally understand why you wouldn't want to. Either way it should be cleared up.


----------



## james444

^ Not sure why we'd need a publicly announced set of rules for that. Anyone willing to send Joker IEMs for a review would surely PM him first. Well at least I would, if only to ask for his address . Then we would agree upon a modus operandi. I don't see the problem here.


----------



## Hero Kid

^ Of course. But things like what happens when the item gets lost or damaged could either be settled individually or as a blanket rule.
  Personally I'd go for the first option out of ease, to save a lot of questions.


----------



## rawrster

I don't see why it would have to be on the first page and public. That should be done in PM.
   
  Of course the times I sent him stuff the only rule I really had was to tell me when he's done? lol


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


2rooi123 said:


> just snagged a pair of maxell dhp-II for $37 shipped
> thanks for the review joker! you da man!


 
 Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Cool, I guess the Maxells are all that.  Way to get to the bottom of things Joker!


 
 It's finally happened! My review threads have converged!
   
  In other news, I didn't even notice the reply count on the IEM thread blitz that of the Portable thread, and in half the time...
   
  I hate the term 'giant killers' and would never apply it the Maxells but they are good phones for the asking price. Probably wouldn't pay the full $90 for them but for what they cost now they're very hard to beat.


 Quote:


james444 said:


> ^ Not sure why we'd need a publicly announced set of rules for that. Anyone willing to send Joker IEMs for a review would surely PM him first. Well at least I would, if only to ask for his address . Then we would agree upon a modus operandi.


 
 Yeah, I'd say this has always been the unwritten rule. I'm not actively asking for earphone loans and never have but yet somehow they've always lined themselves up, thanks largely to rawrster and others. The assumption is of course that once the earphones are in my charge they are my full responsibility. If that needs to be written out for someone than chances are that person wouldn't be loaning me anything in the first place


----------



## Raines

the Xears TD100 for 23 $ is a good deal?
   
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





raines said:


> the Xears TD100 for 23 $ is a good deal?


 

 Yes


----------



## ljokerl

Added Meelec M11+ and Hippo Shroom.


----------



## idvsego

Quote: 





raines said:


> the Xears TD100 for 23 $ is a good deal?
> 
> thanks


 

 yes and please share your source


----------



## Raines

Some time ago we did a group buy in a portuguese forum and we got 19 euros shiping included


----------



## jimmy895

no sony mdr ex's?
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





   I own the mdr ex300s and I just ordered the mdr ex700s


----------



## xtasi

I'm wondering if you're interested in the hippo epic's?  especially their epic sparkles.  They look interesting to me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jimmy895 said:


> no sony mdr ex's?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   
  No Shures either, apparently


 Quote:


xtasi said:


> I'm wondering if you're interested in the hippo epic's?  especially their epic sparkles.  They look interesting to me.


 
 Interested - yes. But not really enough so to go buy one right this minute. Still, I like what Hippo is doing with their model-for-every-price-range-and-signature approach.


----------



## mvw2

Oh god!  They keep coming.  You crazy person.
   
  i think in the next couple weeks I'm going to be trying out a few of the better earphones I have yet to use, namely the HJE900 and Radius.  I'm still hoping I get my DBA-02 tomorrow.  I'm also waiting on the RE262 to pop up as well as the SA7 whenever that comes out.  I think that will round out my test group through the end of the year, although I'd like to demo the SE535 (not quite willing to buy it) but want a SE530 in hand if I did so as a comparison.  Well, I'm curious about the x-Jayz too which might pop up around x-mas time.  I think I'll stay under the $200 mark for now.


----------



## kjk1281

Great update.  I'm sorry if this goes a bit off-topic, but I couldn't help but notice that you have the CX281 in your possession (courtesy of jant71 I presume 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ).  Since I've always been somewhat interested in the differences (if any) between the CX280 and the CX281, I'm wondering if you'd be interested in borrowing my pair of CX280's and comparing the two, assuming that you're planning on reviewing the CX281.
   
  Back on topic: if you do ever plan on reviewing a Sony EX, I'd take a look at their just announced EX310, EX510, EX600, or EX1000.  Honestly, I'd be quite surprised if anybody here at Head-Fi will go for the $730 EX1000.


----------



## Marcus_C

Wow! This thread has grown a lot even since June, I think there were about 65 earphones back then. Thanks for the dedication to the cause. I was very interested reading your impressions of the H20 surge. I bought the Surge mini pro for use on the water over the summer and was very impressed after being very sceptical at first. They have proved to be every bit as water/bulletproof as H20 claim and they sound good too!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kjk1281 said:


> Great update.  I'm sorry if this goes a bit off-topic, but I couldn't help but notice that you have the CX281 in your possession (courtesy of jant71 I presume
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Yep, the CX281 is jant's and I do plan to review it. It's a surprisingly good earphone - an improvement on the already-decent CX250. Just hope the price stay at $25-30. It won't compete well at the $50-70 suggested price point. I'll PM you about the 280.
   
  I have a Sony XB40EX on the way since that's been one of the more-requested in-ears. I saw the new Sonys and can't believe they kept the silly vertical driver design. I can't be the only one that finds it less than comfortable. Still, would be nice to have another top-dog dynamic (or two) around. 


 Quote:


marcus_c said:


> Wow! This thread has grown a lot even since June, I think there were about 65 earphones back then. Thanks for the dedication to the cause. I was very interested reading your impressions of the H20 surge. I bought the Surge mini pro for use on the water over the summer and was very impressed after being very sceptical at first. They have proved to be every bit as water/bulletproof as H20 claim and they sound good too!


 
 Yeah to be honest my Surge hasn't ceased to amaze me. It's one of my most-used in-ears since it's on exercise duty and the sound signature is just excellent for that. I tried replacing them with the CX281 yesterday and will be switching back to the Surge today. An in-line volume control (a-la CX281) is handy to have but the Surge is more secure, less micrphonic, better-isolating, and better-sounding. And of course sweat-proof. Does the mini sound anything like what I've described with the non-mini surge? H2O claim that it's more balanced which is probably true. Most likely it is more detailed as well, as the glossing over of fine details is what keeps me from calling my surge truly hi-fi.


----------



## mark2410

actually the vertical driver placement isnt always bad, it work quite well on the EX500 i have.  the cable of course on them is terrible but they are perfectly comfy to use


----------



## kjk1281

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yep, the CX281 is jant's and I do plan to review it. It's a surprisingly good earphone - an improvement on the already-decent CX250. Just hope the price stay at $25-30. It won't compete well at the $50-70 suggested price point. I'll PM you about the 280.
> 
> I have a Sony XB40EX on the way since that's been one of the more-requested in-ears. I saw the new Sonys and can't believe they kept the silly vertical driver design. I can't be the only one that finds it less than comfortable. Still, would be nice to have another top-dog dynamic (or two) around.


 

 Yeah, $50+ is a bit much (especially with the CX280 and its choice of cable), but I feel it's a very respectable effort by a mainstream company.  I think the new CXs fare better in Japan, as well as the UK and other parts of Europe, where they're priced more competitively against their mainstream counterparts.
   
  The XB40EX is interesting in that it's actually marketed as a bass-heavy earphone (like the previous cheaper Sonys weren't...).  I would like to try the EX500 someday, especially if the prices in Japan continue on their downward track as they get phased out.  (Amazon.co.jp currently sells the EX500 for around ¥6000.)  I do worry about their comfort though.


----------



## Marcus_C

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Does the mini sound anything like what I've described with the non-mini surge? H2O claim that it's more balanced which is probably true. Most likely it is more detailed as well, as the glossing over of fine details is what keeps me from calling my surge truly hi-fi.


 

 It's quite a fitting description for the mini pro actually although I haven't found bass extension to be much of a weakness in them and the detail is pretty good. I'm not at all sure why h2o included foam tips in the box, they really didn't work for me and with water involved I still think they'd sound worse. I also don't really like the blue cable but that's a marketing ploy. Usability of the mini pro's is about the same as the surge's read as being although the reason I bought the pro over the non-pro apart from they were only £8 more was they looked quite a lot smaller in the shop. I don't know whether the size is an issue with the others but I felt it might be, well, that was my excuse anyway....
   
  The mini-pro's aren't as good as my beyer dtx100 or the ety hf5 but I prefer them to everything else I own.


----------



## DervishD

Thanks, ljokerl, for the superb additions  The M11+ description is awesome, and judging by your previous reviews, I think I'm going to enjoy them  I've decided to start saving for buying a pair. I've passed my headphone frontier, having now five pairs in rotation, and probably my wife is going to kill me if I buy a pair of M11+, but I'm more than tempted 
   
  I'm a bit Meelec fan and if M11+ is less V-shaped than M9 and M6 then I'm going to like them, no matter how bass-heavy are they.
   
  Thanks a lot for your amazing reviews, ljokerl


----------



## rawrster

So what do you think would be a better option for a sleeping earphone between the M1 and PR300. Your descriptions make me think I will like them both. I think the PR300 might be better suited for my preferences however. I currently use the PL30 but don't really like the way they fit although they are comfortable.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


marcus_c said:


> It's quite a fitting description for the mini pro actually although I haven't found bass extension to be much of a weakness in them and the detail is pretty good. I'm not at all sure why h2o included foam tips in the box, they really didn't work for me and with water involved I still think they'd sound worse. I also don't really like the blue cable but that's a marketing ploy. Usability of the mini pro's is about the same as the surge's read as being although the reason I bought the pro over the non-pro apart from they were only £8 more was they looked quite a lot smaller in the shop. I don't know whether the size is an issue with the others but I felt it might be, well, that was my excuse anyway....
> 
> The mini-pro's aren't as good as my beyer dtx100 or the ety hf5 but I prefer them to everything else I own.


   
  Very interesting - perhaps my exercise set does need upgrading after all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote:


dervishd said:


> Thanks, ljokerl, for the superb additions  The M11+ description is awesome, and judging by your previous reviews, I think I'm going to enjoy them  I've decided to start saving for buying a pair. I've passed my headphone frontier, having now five pairs in rotation, and probably my wife is going to kill me if I buy a pair of M11+, but I'm more than tempted
> 
> I'm a bit Meelec fan and if M11+ is less V-shaped than M9 and M6 then I'm going to like them, no matter how bass-heavy are they.
> 
> Thanks a lot for your amazing reviews, ljokerl


   
  Well, might not want to wait too long since the M11+ is temporarily on sale for $20 off and there's a shipping coupon going around (SHIPPING_COUPON). For $45 the M11+ is admittedly a very good deal. You can tell your wife it's the old M11 and has been heavily discounted .


 Quote:


rawrster said:


> So what do you think would be a better option for a sleeping earphone between the M1 and PR300. Your descriptions make me think I will like them both. I think the PR300 might be better suited for my preferences however. I currently use the PL30 but don't really like the way they fit although they are comfortable.


 
 PR300 simply because they are so low-profile. The sound is also a bit less aggressive than that of the M1, though I doubt the sparkle of the M1 would interfere with your sleep.


----------



## Hero Kid

Any plans to add the Etymotics HF5 to the list? They certainly are getting some good praise around here recently.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


hero kid said:


> Any plans to add the Etymotics HF5 to the list? They certainly are getting some good praise around here recently.


 
 Do you mean the new MC5? The HF5 has been around for a while I think. Either way I've got an MC5 and an HF3 sitting on my shelf but probably won't get to them for a little while with all the UEs on my plate.


----------



## Anaxilus

Joker.  Whats your thoughts on the HJE900 versus the Q-Jays not considering price in the equation.  Also, which phones rules the Piano?


----------



## ketan7s

The Sony is the inventor of portable audio, and they researched this heavily. They have really great headphones.
  Why do you people omit them? Is it on purpose?


----------



## faisal2003456

Quote: 





ketan7s said:


> The Sony is the inventor of portable audio, and they researched this heavily. They have really great headphones.
> Why do you people omit them? Is it on purpose?


 

 Their DAPs are good, but expensive and their headphones aren't as good as the competition.


----------



## buffalowings

from reading your review on the monster pro turbine coppers and golds, am I right to interpret that the phones need an amp? or are they fine unamped but the volume needs to be turned higher than other IEMs?
   
  thanks in advance
   
  James


----------



## rawrster

They don't necessarily need an amp. It could help depending on your listening volume and what dap you use. They do like more power however although it also depends on if you want to carry around an extra cable and amp.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ketan7s said:


> The Sony is the inventor of portable audio, and they researched this heavily. They have really great headphones.
> Why do you people omit them? Is it on purpose?


 

 Thats what happens when you rest on your laurels.  You realize what you are referring to took place 30-40 years ago.  They have some new flagship phones and IEMs coming out, we shall see then.  I'm sure Sony had to take a respite on audio engineering w/ all the money they were losing making PS3s, unprofitable movies, marketing BluRay and fighting that format war w/ HD-DVD.  They do not have infinite resources to make upgrades to the R10 every year.


----------



## rawrster

Well many years ago Sony overplayed their hand and paid the price. Although it was more with dap's. They had the most on the market and even more than what apple had now but they charged even more ridiculous prices than they do now. Then someone took their market away by providing products at much less price.
   
  A good number of their earphones are still overpriced for what it is although their lower offerings aren't bad but more marketed towards those who like Skullcandy, Bose, etc.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Joker.  Whats your thoughts on the HJE900 versus the Q-Jays not considering price in the equation.  Also, which phones rules the Piano?


 
 Well, that's a tough one. Despite both being heavy on the bass, heavy on the treble earphones they sound quite different. The HJE900 is a quintessential dynamic and compared to the q-JAYS it is a brute. It hits harder, sparkles more, and just generally follows the Texas approach to everything. Now, I don't usually like that sort of thing (see MTPC) but the HJE900 is just so honest about it (plus we can't just take price out of the equation) that I liked it anyway. The off-neutral balance gives the sound a certain lushness that many other phones lack (Other examples of this: ViSang R03, Xears TD100, IE8). Plus it's a very enveloping sort of earphone - not the biggest-sounding but it gives a good sense of space.
   
  The q-JAYS, on the other hand, are more technical. They have plenty of bass as far as armature-based phones go, which is a different measuring stick. Compared to the HJE900 they sound rather modest. They're much drier overall, almost terse. If I was forced to pick a single IEM to live with in the long run, it would be the q-JAYS. As a second to my CK10s or other high-end BAs I would definitely buy the Panasonics.
   
  As for Piano, the HJE900 has a very unique timbral character to it that sounds quite natural but I like my piano very crisp and the q-JAYS win out on that front.


  Quote:


ketan7s said:


> The Sony is the inventor of portable audio, and they researched this heavily. They have really great headphones.
> Why do you people omit them? Is it on purpose?


 
  Lol @ 'you people'. 
   
  But yeah, what rawrster & Anaxilus said. Instead of being at the forefront of the IEM revolution Sony has taken the passive approach and being the follower rarely works here at head-fi unless you're doing something better than the competition.
   

 Quote:


buffalowings said:


> from reading your review on the monster pro turbine coppers and golds, am I right to interpret that the phones need an amp? or are they fine unamped but the volume needs to be turned higher than other IEMs?
> 
> thanks in advance


 
 They are fine unamped in the sense that everything I said about their sound still applies when used straight off of a portable player. They do seem to like added power but don't change radically with it. Whether you want to bother with the extra cost & bulk of a portable amp is up to you.


----------



## cdp7

Just want to show appreciation for this amazing thread.  I'm now deciding between the iM-590's or the visang R02s


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Do you mean the new MC5? The HF5 has been around for a while I think.


 

 Yeah I probably do


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

Where did you get the ATH-CK100 from?  Im on their site and can't seem to find them....=(


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


cdp7 said:


> Just want to show appreciation for this amazing thread.  I'm now deciding between the iM-590's or the visang R02s


 
 Thanks and congrats on your future earphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
  Quote:


hawaiiancerveza said:


> Where did you get the ATH-CK100 from?  Im on their site and can't seem to find them....=(


 

 The CK100 has never been officially sold in the US and therefore you won't be able to find them on Audio-Technica's USA site. You can of course find them at audio-technica.co.jp (google cache) here or at one of the other non-US pages such as the audio-technica.com.sg.


----------



## rawrster

You can also try accessory jack or price japan. If you don't mind using mail forwarding you can buy off amazon japan and use a forwarding service such as tenso.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Lol @ 'you people'.
> 
> But yeah, what rawrster & Anaxilus said. Instead of being at the forefront of the IEM revolution Sony has taken the passive approach and being the follower rarely works here at head-fi unless you're doing something better than the competition.


 

 See here: Head Direct, FiiO, other Chinese companies. They're not exactly breaking any ground that the West hasn't already covered, but the sheer value and pace of their development means that the only thing holding them back is that people don't know about them.


----------



## idvsego

Quote: 





cdp7 said:


> Just want to show appreciation for this amazing thread.  I'm now deciding between the iM-590's or the visang R02s


 

 Just got my R02s today...only took about 6 days.  I havent listend to them much but enough to know i am pleased with the purchase.  I was most concerned with the bass output (I know, I know, but I listen to a decent amount of hip hip, sue me) and I am fine with their output.  I first used them with the biflange tips...didnt liek the bass at all and my heart sank some.  Swapped to the faom tips and got a better response right away.  I am goign to try the other silicone tips as well but I think I just have small ears.  This isnt the first time I have had fitment issues.  So I cant speak for the iM-590, but the R02 is a good investment.
   
  sigh...now I want to try some Audio Eternas.


----------



## ljokerl

Going to be out of town for the rest of the week so decided to add three 'half in-ear' earphones - the Phiaton PS210, Yamaha EPH-50, and Pioneer SE-CLX50 - while I still can.


----------



## sweetguy5

Hi,
   
  I would like to ask you TS, between HJE900 and DBA 002, which is a better at which aspect? Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


			
				sweetguy5 said:
			
		

> I would like to ask you TS, between HJE900 and DBA 002, which is a better at which aspect? Thanks!


 
 The DBA-02 is 'better' at everything except bass quantity, soundstage depth, and timbre reproduction. And of course build quality.


----------



## hh3808

ljokerl thanks for taking the time to review all of these iems. Sorry if this has been asked before, but in your opinion how does the eq7 bass quantity compare to ck10.


----------



## rawrster

e-Q7 has a bit more but not by much


----------



## james444

^ x2 for quantity, but texture and decay are different and closer to dynamic drivers.


----------



## hh3808

Thanks for the replies. Would this be a good representation of bass quantity tf10 >> eq7 > ck10. This is such a hard decision, the eq7's seem to have the type of sound signature I would like except for the bass quantity. The tf10 were just about perfect quantity wise and the ck10 were a little to light on the bass for my tastes.
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> e-Q7 has a bit more but not by much


 




  Quote: 





james444 said:


> ^ x2 for quantity, but texture and decay are different and closer to dynamic drivers.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hh3808 said:


> Thanks for the replies. Would this be a good representation of bass quantity tf10 >> eq7 > ck10. This is such a hard decision, the eq7's seem to have the type of sound signature I would like except for the bass quantity. The tf10 were just about perfect quantity wise and the ck10 were a little to light on the bass for my tastes.


 

 Yes, I'd agree with that breakdown, assuming that each individual '>' is a relatively small increment.


----------



## hh3808

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, I'd agree with that breakdown, assuming that each individual '>' is a relatively small increment.


 

 Thanks


----------



## Maxvla

Got my MEE M9s today. Ordered them based on price (disposable) and the review in this and the other mega-IEM review thread. I hope they improve with burn in because these are terrible. Extreme recessed mids and substantially rolled off highs. The detail somehow manages to be decent at times, but things like audience applause sounds thick and heavy instead of quick and crisp. Listening to a violin it sounds like someone put a crossover to only hear the highs because the sound isn't full at all. The mids are just gone. Voices are clear, but very thin.
   
  The soundstage is larger than I anticipated, and with a good amount of air. The bass is more than I'm used to, but it does seem to be relatively well defined. The biggest positive about the M9s is after the disaster that are the Q-Jays, these at least fit comfortably. Despite their tiny size the Q-Jays were horribly uncomfortable. Using the smallest flange on left and the standard double flange on the right (left canal is smaller) gives me a fit I should be able to wear for hours. The Q-Jays left me in serious pain after a mere 30 minutes, no matter which tips I used.
   
  These comments are based on comparison to Portapros which are virtually the same price ($25 and $30) and sound infinitely better. Only got the M9s because they are ultra-portable and they had glowing reviews. I'm not sure how these can get such great reviews when the sound is so terribly broken.
   
  Listening to V0 mp3 on iPod Touch 4G at 40-60% volume.


----------



## ljokerl

Burn-in should definitely help a little but you may have been expecting a bit too much from $20 in-ears - they will never be as smooth as portapros. Still, the treble should be quite prominent, almost excessive. Make sure that you have a good seal - the M9s are very sensitive to insertion depth and you may want to try other tips on them.


----------



## kantongkresek

Hi Ijokerl,
   
  Right now I have 2 iems: Phonak PFE & Fischer DBA 02. do you have input for upgrade? i love more pfe compare to dba 02 due to forward and smooth vocal. dba02 is laid back except i plug the right into left and the left itu right.  
   
  Thanks


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Quote: 





maxvla said:


> Got my MEE M9s today. Ordered them based on price (disposable) and the review in this and the other mega-IEM review thread. I hope they improve with burn in because these are terrible. Extreme recessed mids and substantially rolled off highs. The detail somehow manages to be decent at times, but things like audience applause sounds thick and heavy instead of quick and crisp. Listening to a violin it sounds like someone put a crossover to only hear the highs because the sound isn't full at all. The mids are just gone. Voices are clear, but very thin.
> 
> The soundstage is larger than I anticipated, and with a good amount of air. The bass is more than I'm used to, but it does seem to be relatively well defined. The biggest positive about the M9s is after the disaster that are the Q-Jays, these at least fit comfortably. Despite their tiny size the Q-Jays were horribly uncomfortable. Using the smallest flange on left and the standard double flange on the right (left canal is smaller) gives me a fit I should be able to wear for hours. The Q-Jays left me in serious pain after a mere 30 minutes, no matter which tips I used.
> 
> ...


 
  The highs are not so rolled off as you are saying in my oppinion


----------



## james444

Quote: 





kantongkresek said:


> Hi Ijokerl,
> 
> Right now I have 2 iems: Phonak PFE & Fischer DBA 02. do you have input for upgrade? i love more pfe compare to dba 02 due to forward and smooth vocal. dba02 is laid back except i plug the right into left and the left itu right.
> 
> Thanks


 

 Looking forward to Joker's opinion, as far as I am concerned the logical upgrade for PFE lovers who like forward and smooth vocals would be without a doubt the e-Q7. Just my 2c.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kantongkresek said:


> Hi Ijokerl,
> 
> Right now I have 2 iems: Phonak PFE & Fischer DBA 02. do you have input for upgrade? i love more pfe compare to dba 02 due to forward and smooth vocal. dba02 is laid back except i plug the right into left and the left itu right.
> 
> Thanks


 
 That's a tough one. My first thought was the Westone UM3X, which is really smooth and forward in the midrange and still extremely detailed, much like the PFE, but if you like the aggressive presentation of the PFE you may find the UM3X slightly boring, much like I do. The Ortofon e-Q7 fits the bill too if you can live with a bit less treble extension than the UM3X/PFE are capable of providing. Everything else I can think of with that signature wouldn't really be a clear step up over the PFE in overall SQ (though I haven't tried the SE535 or SM3.. yet).


----------



## Katun

This guide has been extremely helpful. I read it all the time, depite me already having IEMs. I also suggest it to everyone in the IEM market. Fantastic guide |joker|! Thanks for all the new additions as well!
   
  I remember when I bought the Pro Gold a few weeks ago. I thought to myself, "|joker| gave this a 9.25 in SQ! It's up there with some of the best!". I was really quite excited to hear a "really good" IEM, as my previous IEM was the Philips 9850.
   
  Well, unfortunately for me, I'm not incredibly impressed with the SQ. Now, I'm in sort of a state of dispair, knowing that I am disappointed with a "9.25" in SQ. Yes, I know sound is subjective an all, but I think all of |joker|'s ratings are definitely in the ball park, if not nearly dead accurate. So now, I don't plan on upgrading at all, rather I'm going to actually downgrade. I will be looking for an IEM with more of a certain "ability or function". I guess the statement is slightly true then that people will pay "extra money" for that 10-15% increase in SQ...
   
  For now, I'm stuck with the Golds. I feel bad saying that, because they are such a "nice" headphone to many others, but for me it's almost a waste of money. Even at the $162 I paid for them! (What on earth is wrong with me?) Eventually, I hope to sale them or trade them for something else, probably here on the forums. But, when I do go back to buying a slightly cheaper IEM, I am definitely coming back to this thread! I may just go with something cheap and to the point, such as the PL50 or even the S4. I dunno, a bit confused really.
   
  I may just be a full sized user. IEM's may just not be my thing. Hmm.


----------



## Katun

Okay, okay, I admit it! So I do like them!
   
  I actually was comparing them to all my headphones today, and they sound better than all of them, including the M50. They absolutely stomp my 9850, which is a good thing. They sound very, very thick, and have a nice, rich, full sound with excellent bass. They sound wonderful (not jaw dropping, but wonderful) but that isn't the problem...
   
  My absolute biggest problem is the fitting. I really cannot get a consistent fit with any of the 17 tips! It's really bothering me, because it's really frustrating. I guess I should start buying a bunch of different "fit kits" to see which eartip is best for me. Obviously, Monster's tips don't work for me. Maybe some Sony Hybrids, a MEelec fit kit, or even a Shure fit kit? I'm not sure, but all I know is I like the sound. It's the fit that is really irritating me.
   
  Anyone recommend a tip other than the Monster brand? I am willing to buy all different kinds just to find one that works for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Funny but the Golds really aren't an earphone that you like right away, especially after spending time around head-fi. I know I walked away unimpressed at first listen. However, my reviews take 3-4 weeks for a reason - give the Golds time and their sound signature will blossom to provide no-compromises enjoyment. They really don't do anything in particular better than every other earphone (except maybe smoothness) but it all comes together very nicely - just have to give them time (and be sure that their signature is one you may like).
   
  I'm not a big fan of Hybrids on the MTPG (though they are far worse on the MTPC). Shure tips won't fit (except de-cored Olives). That leaves you with the Meelec fit kit - a bit pricy for the big (M11+) one but worth it if you really want some tips to play with. The short and long bi-flanges both work for me on the MTPG/MTPC though I prefer the gray M9 "balanced" biflanges to the thicker ones that come with the M11+.


----------



## Anaxilus

2 things:
   
  1-DBAs laid back?  Hmm, I suspect other issues not related to ears being different.
   
  2-Golds better than the M50?  Wow, I like the Golds, Coppers and MDs but better than the M50?  Again, I suspect issues.
   
  If you can, pick up some Meelec M11+ tips.  The whole set will be great for the Golds and any or all dynamic driver IEMs you may hear in the future w/ the same size aperture.


----------



## kantongkresek

@ james & IjokerI, Thanks for the input. may be i have to wait other model realese to make the updgrade worted. 
   
  @ anaxilus, Yes DBA02 more laid back in vocal compare to PFE. except you try to put the left side in the right ears and vice versa


----------



## james444

^ Watch this thread. I just got the Final Audio Design FI-BA-SB and from first impressions they are very similar to the e-Q7 with a bit more treble extension and energy. They are also similarly priced, so maybe they'll turn out being the better choice for treble lovers.


----------



## shigzeo

The FA-SB-A1 is a bit more laid back up top than the SB, but both are excellent. You are right about fit: they fit deeper than Ortofon eQ7.


----------



## Katun

Thanks for the input |joker|. I may indeed try one of the MEelec fit kits sometime. But I actually found out the pure foam tips work best for me now, because foam always fits... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> 2-Golds better than the M50?  Wow, I like the Golds, Coppers and MDs but better than the M50?  Again, I suspect issues.


 

 Yes indeed, to my ears at least. I listed to a song with a nice beat with the Golds about 3 times in a row. I then quickly switched to the M50 right before the chorus so I could hear a difference.
   
  What I found was that the Golds had a MUCH thicker sound that the M50. The M50 sounded a bit hollow, the bass wasn't as good, and I think I may have finally heard and distinguished a bit of sibilance for the first time. (I've never heard sibilance before, well not where I could actually distinguish it).


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





katun said:


> Thanks for the input |joker|. I may indeed try one of the MEelec fit kits sometime. But I actually found out the pure foam tips work best for me now, because foam always fits...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 That sounds like a source/amp issue w/ the M50 being underdriven perhaps.  I will say w/ the right tips and the Golds plugged in closer to your brain they can really pound out deep, full bass.


----------



## rawrster

it's not that hard to drive the M50 however although the M50 being hollow with bad bass doesn't exactly describe them.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> it's not that hard to drive the M50 however although the M50 being hollow with bad bass doesn't exactly describe them.


 

 Sure, it is not hard to drive the M50.  The question is how well they sound driven by a Clip+ or the like.  Half of my IEMs don't get driven properly from it IMO, let alone the M50.  I mean lets be real about driving 40-50mm drivers from certain DAPs.  It would certainly be expected that an IEM should sound better from an underpowered source than a full sized headphone.  I only mentioned because its not at all how the M50 sounds to me or many others.


----------



## rawrster

Well that depends on if they have an amp in between 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I probably wouldn't pair a headphone with my clip+ however and if someone is doing that they are a bit too optimistic.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

I've just noticed something odd... the CK10 are £249.99 in the UK, haven't seen anyone selling locally below that. The CK100, only available through import, come to ~ $430, which is ~£275. So if for some reason you didn't want to save £50+ by buying the CK10 from somewhere outside of the UK, there's only a £25 discrepancy between the two.
  This is bad, I'm suddenly considering that I might possibly afford the CK100 one day. Stupid UK prices...


----------



## Katun

I was using the M50 off my iAudio 7.
   
  And no, they didn't have bad bass, I just thought the Golds was better. It's like the perfect mix of depth, presence, and quality.
   
  M50 did sound a bit hollow compared to the Golds, as did ALL my headphones. The Golds just have this super thick sound that I actually really enjoy.
   
  (By the way, I'm sending my M50's back, so I can't compare them anymore)


----------



## mjm0

Thanks, |Joker|.  Just bought the M11+'s off amazon for $53, sounds like a good sound signature for my tastes, great value, and a comfortable pair that'll do well on planes/subway without microphonics that'll drive me nuts.  OK, and I will actually use the remote and mic.


----------



## legodt

What are you referring to when you say the er4s need amping to really shine? Are they not worth the purchase without an amp, or do they not get very loud without an amp?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


			
				Anaxilus said:
			
		

> Sure, it is not hard to drive the M50.  The question is how well they sound driven by a Clip+ or the like.  Half of my IEMs don't get driven properly from it IMO, let alone the M50.  I mean lets be real about driving 40-50mm drivers from certain DAPs.  It would certainly be expected that an IEM should sound better from an underpowered source than a full sized headphone.  I only mentioned because its not at all how the M50 sounds to me or many others.


   
  Agreed, the M50 is not as easily driven as many people make it out to be - it's about mid-spectrum as far as DJ cans go - many are harder to drive but quite a few benefit less from amping or don't benefit at all. Running them through a proper portable amp makes for a noticeable jump in sq.


 Quote:


joethearachnid said:


> I've just noticed something odd... the CK10 are £249.99 in the UK, haven't seen anyone selling locally below that. The CK100, only available through import, come to ~ $430, which is ~£275. So if for some reason you didn't want to save £50+ by buying the CK10 from somewhere outside of the UK, there's only a £25 discrepancy between the two.
> This is bad, I'm suddenly considering that I might possibly afford the CK100 one day. Stupid UK prices...


   
  If that wasn't so much money I'd say having the choice between the CK10 and CK100 is a good thing. Import CK10s should be priced more reasonably though...


 Quote:


mjm0 said:


> Thanks, |Joker|.  Just bought the M11+'s off amazon for $53, sounds like a good sound signature for my tastes, great value, and a comfortable pair that'll do well on planes/subway without microphonics that'll drive me nuts.  OK, and I will actually use the remote and mic.


 
 Glad you found the thread useful... I hope you picked up the M11P+ if you intend to use the mic as the M11+ is just an earphone.


 Quote:


legodt said:


> What are you referring to when you say the er4s need amping to really shine? Are they not worth the purchase without an amp, or do they not get very loud without an amp?


 
 A bit of both, really. Not that the ER4S doesn't sound good without an amp but there is an improvement, and won't you always wonder 'what if'? 
   
  As for loudness, they should get loud enough with most portable players but will require quite a bit more volume than the majority of in-ears. I think with the Sansa Fuze the ER4S required about 65-75% volume, as opposed to 20-30% for most earphones.


----------



## sweetguy5

Base on what others have comment, DBA sound is more laid back while Hje900 is more forward?
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ProjectDenz

Just showing my respect for someone who had the arse to review 105 iems.


----------



## buffalowings

Quote: 





katun said:


> Okay, okay, I admit it! So I do like them!
> 
> I actually was comparing them to all my headphones today, and they sound better than all of them, including the M50. They absolutely stomp my 9850, which is a good thing. They sound very, very thick, and have a nice, rich, full sound with excellent bass. They sound wonderful (not jaw dropping, but wonderful) but that isn't the problem...
> 
> ...


 


 I actually like my coppers more than my M50s (well, I sold them just recently) but from my memory, almost everything about the coppers trumps the M50s , expecially the overall smoothness


----------



## mjm0

Yes, M11P+ 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I'll be sure to come baxk and offer my feedback on them; not sure what thoughts are on burn-in for them (as this is a new concept for me -- and yes ive tried to read up on the pro/con-troversy here!)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


sweetguy5 said:


> Base on what others have comment, DBA sound is more laid back while Hje900 is more forward?


   
  I don't really think the DBA sounds laid-back unless you're comparing it directly to something that's very aggressive. In terms of energy and the way notes are presented, I'd say the HJE900 is softer than the DBA-02 is so it really depends on how you gauge an earphone's aggressiveness. 
   

 Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ProjectDenz* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Just showing my respect for someone who had the arse to review 105 iems.


 
 Thanks, appreciated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote:


mjm0 said:


> Yes, M11P+
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Well, they'll end up burned-in whether you like it or not. Just make sure to reserve impressions until you've gone through at least a few dozen listening hours.


----------



## Maxvla

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Burn-in should definitely help a little but you may have been expecting a bit too much from $20 in-ears - they will never be as smooth as portapros. Still, the treble should be quite prominent, almost excessive. Make sure that you have a good seal - the M9s are very sensitive to insertion depth and you may want to try other tips on them.


 

 I've left these burning for about 4 days straight with a little in ear time each night. Burn in has certainly helped make them listenable, but they still sound like someone put a ceiling on the sound like a crossover at 8KHz or something, and mids are still very recessed. It's really bad. Due to my ears these are the only tips that work (smallest flange left, double flange right). I tried a foam on left and it was too large. I tried small flange left and foam right and it sounded weird so I went back to what I found originally and it sounds balanced and is extremely comfortable, a surprise to say the least.
   
  I don't get your comment about expecting too much. The price difference between the M9 and the PortaPros is only $5.
   
  edit: After perusing some graphs on headroom I've come up with a close match to what I'm hearing from the M9s, the Sleek Audio SA1. Take the SA1 and make the mids dip earlier to about the same valley. The spike before 10k is accurate to what I'm hearing then a severe drop from there. The HD600 is my main normal can and is used for reference. Speaking of, does anyone have a frequency response chart for the M9s? I looked and couldn't find one. Also included is the PortaPros which share similar pathing as the HD600, which is probably why I like them so much. Portapros are definitely on the dark side and the treble could use some sparkle, but the flow from the high bass peak to the upper mids transitioning to the highs is much smoother and not recessed much.
   



   
  Dunno, to me it just sounds like someone put a clothes iron on the frequency between about 600 and 4k the lifted it to 8k then smashed it to oblivion. The upper mids and lower highs just sound 1 dimensional like everything is compressed so much it bleeds together to make one of the worst mid to high transitions I've ever heard.


----------



## JxK

^Try listening to them at lower volumes. If they're anything like the M6, they sound pretty bad at mid to high volumes. Also, they're just a pair of budget IEMs after all, and won't be as good as a portable set of headphones at the same pricepoint. They just can't compete with the larger, better drivers. My M6, for example, though it's priced higher is only at about the same level of SQ as my ksc75 (though clearly they have different sound signatures). At just about any pricepoint, IEMs will typically sound comparatively worse than similarly priced fullsize and portable headphones. That's the price you pay for the small size and added portability.


----------



## Maxvla

The effects are still present at lower volumes. Perhaps not as large a problem, but at this volume I can't even enjoy the music properly. (~20% iPod Touch 4G)
   
  I guess the bright side of my getting the M9s is that I now know that IEMs can actually sound good. There are definitely things about these that I did not expect (in a positive way) including a great soundstage (much wider and deeper than the Portapros.. not a contest at all), superior imaging, and full and fairly well controlled bass. The Q-Jays I owned before sounded awful like I had a boombox strapped to my ear. They didn't have the recessed mids like these do, but the sound was so 1 dimensional and it had zero sound stage that I got rid of them at my earliest convenience, while fighting with returning them after falling apart with extremely light use (1-2 hours a week). I had owned some $50-75 Shures many years ago, but they didn't even begin to fit so I sent them back without even really hearing them.
   
  I might have to try something in the JH line at some point.


----------



## ljokerl

JXK is right - at the very low end IEMs just don't sound as good as portables dollar for dollar. I think you'd have to go to the Soundmagic PL50 / ViSang level to match the SQ of the PortaPros. Funny that you picked the SA1 though - it's definitely clear on the other side of the spectrum from the M9 in some aspects - smooth almost to the point of glossing over detail and very in-your-head sounding.
   
  Quote:


maxvla said:


> The effects are still present at lower volumes. Perhaps not as large a problem, but at this volume I can't even enjoy the music properly. (~20% iPod Touch 4G)
> 
> I guess the bright side of my getting the M9s is that I now know that IEMs can actually sound good. There are definitely things about these that I did not expect (in a positive way) including a great soundstage (much wider and deeper than the Portapros.. not a contest at all), superior imaging, and full and fairly well controlled bass. The Q-Jays I owned before sounded awful like I had a boombox strapped to my ear. They didn't have the recessed mids like these do, but the sound was so 1 dimensional and it had zero sound stage that I got rid of them at my earliest convenience, while fighting with returning them after falling apart with extremely light use (1-2 hours a week). I had owned some $50-75 Shures many years ago, but they didn't even begin to fit so I sent them back without even really hearing them.
> 
> I might have to try something in the JH line at some point.


 
 Well... the JH line is a bit of a jump - I hope the Meelecs didn't turn you off of mid-range in-ears (as they really aren't even mid-fi.) The M9 is a fairly polarizing in-ear. It does a lot of things much better than a $20 earphone should but the balance is definitely love-it-or-hate it. I get the feeling you'd like one of the ViSang earphones (R02 or even R01). I have a frequency graph somewhere and it looks a lot like the PortaPros.


----------



## Maxvla

I'll think about getting more low end IEMs, but I mainly got these to be a smaller, disposable, version of my Portapros. While they don't really match, they are good enough for the purpose. I suppose I was expecting more considering the hype. 

 As for my consideration of JH products, I'm participating in a loaner program for the new Hifiman HE-6 so I'm not really looking towards low or mid-fi at the moment. I'm looking for a top end experience that I previously thought was unavailable and uncomfortable (for me) in IEM form. We'll see how things play out. Thanks for your input.


----------



## ljokerl

Added three Earsquake earphones - the CRO, Fish, and SHA. 
   
  Also updated the planned review list. Terrifying.


----------



## Inks

woah...quite a lot planned reviews


----------



## rawrster

That's an impressive list you have there and I see the TF10 is on that list finally as well as a bunch of other UE products


----------



## legodt

Which do you prefer overall, the CK10s or the DBA-02s?


----------



## buffalowings

Quote: 





legodt said:


> Which do you prefer overall, the CK10s or the DBA-02s?


 

 better question yet..which one is easier to obtain, those DBA-02s have been out of stock for months, and I'm pretty sure audio technica took the ck10s off the shelves


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





buffalowings said:


> better question yet..which one is easier to obtain, those DBA-02s have been out of stock for months, and I'm pretty sure audio technica took the ck10s off the shelves


 
  Very true. For analytical IEMs, your best bet is likely phonak's pfe. It's easy to obtain, and the warranty is backed by a solid multinational company.


----------



## legodt

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Very true. For analytical IEMs, your best bet is likely phonak's pfe. It's easy to obtain, and the warranty is backed by a solid multinational company.


 

 Do you have experience with the PFEs?


----------



## jackson

This is the most informative post I've ever seen.  I'm in awe of the detail, the care that went into it.
   
  Thanks so much for all your efforts (and thank you to all those that contributed to this guide).


----------



## ljokerl

uote:


legodt said:


> Which do you prefer overall, the CK10s or the DBA-02s?


 
 Personally I easily prefer the CK10. I feel that the CK10s align with my SQ preferences a bit better than the DBA-02 does and of course the aesthetics, ergonomics, and construction are much more to my liking. Unfortunately obtaining them is indeed quite a bother nowadays. Using a Japanese importer (e.g. hovanfue.com) is probably the only way.


 Quote:


jackson said:


> This is the most informative post I've ever seen.  I'm in awe of the detail, the care that went into it.
> 
> Thanks so much for all your efforts (and thank you to all those that contributed to this guide).


 
 Thanks, very glad the thread is useful. It does take up quite a bit of my time but helps me organize my own thoughts better and of course is (reportedly) helpful to others


----------



## bcpk

It ain't easy to get hold of DBA-02s either, I can tell ya


----------



## rawrster

I should have just kept them both to myself when I had the two of them at the same time for a short period but sadly they both slipped out of my hands to purchase other things. I'm looking forward to what AT has planned next after their prices are reasonable since we all know AT has some ridiculous MSRP when they introduce their earphones. The CK10 was around 500 iirc when it was introduced.
   
  Although if I had to pick one based on sound it would probably be the DBA-02 but as the total package CK10 would win but at a higher price.


----------



## DervishD

ljokerl, this thread is, reportedly, very useful to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 From time to time I revisit it, just to know more and more phones. Maybe it's because I have (more or less) the same sound likings than you, but your descriptions have been extremely accurate, and led me to pick better phones that I have always liked.
   
  BIG THANKS!


----------



## Hero Kid

My god that planned list isn't getting any smaller!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I'm looking forward to what you think of the SM3s. I'm not sure if they will be to your taste but it will be interesting none the less.


----------



## straden

wow nice reviews, but how come you don't have UE tf 10 or shure se530 in the list? I remember they were most popular high end IEM back then...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


dervishd said:


> ljokerl, this thread is, reportedly, very useful to me From time to time I revisit it, just to know more and more phones. Maybe it's because I have (more or less) the same sound likings than you, but your descriptions have been extremely accurate, and led me to pick better phones that I have always liked.
> 
> BIG THANKS!


   

 Thanks, appreciate it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote:


hero kid said:


> My god that planned list isn't getting any smaller!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Yeah, worryingly it isn't. I was really hoping to have worked my way through all of my earphones by the end of summer but it's not looking good. I can say that so far I'm very impressed with the SM3 from a technical point of view (much like I was with the UM3X) and not particularly disgusted with the presentation (as I was with that of the UM3X...). I think that for those who like BA sound but have an inclination towards the warm and musical, the SM3 is a great proposition. 


 Quote:


straden said:


> wow nice reviews, but how come you don't have UE tf 10 or shure se530 in the list? I remember they were most popular high end IEM back then...


 
 TF10 is in the works (see To-Do list at the bottom of post #8). SE530 has never interested me much as I had some bad experiences with lower-end Shure products and the SE530 doesn't seem to be up my alley signature-wise anyway.


----------



## inarc

Any plan to do Nakamichi IEM? I'm particularly interested with this ceramic housing dynamic IEM http://www.hmv.com.hk/product/headphones.asp?sku=43812


----------



## rawrster

So I got myself a pair of the ViSang R02 and things definitely have changed since I actively was in the under $50 market. The fake hybrids definitely is hard to tell apart if it wasn't for the colored cored. I wonder if those ebay ones are the same and would pick some up if it didn't come with so many and if I needed them just to compare. Usually when I go from higher tier down to lower tier I feel a dramatic decrease in SQ like if I go from my Livewires to a PL30 but I went from HJE900 to the R02 and while I did notice a drop in SQ it wasn't as much as I expected. That's typically my judge for how lower priced earphones go. If I notice a dramatic increase and hate what is coming out of the earphones then the drop is a bit too much to handle but it's not the case here and I believe HJE900 is a pretty decent sounding earphone. I like the case as well and it's better than a lot of those out there. I expected the same size as my PL30 case but it's even smaller so takes up less room. A cheap earphone such as this packs more in than some of the more expensive models when it should be the other way around 
   
  The cable having memory is a bit of a pain but doesn't look as bad as my E4 did when I had those. The connector is a bit different in color than most I've had which is interesting. The lack of a chin slider is a bit annoying but luckily I used some electrical tape and made my own. I also had a spare shirt clip since that works better since I don't trust myself in putting the included shirt clip on and not breaking it. I'm also guessing you distinguish among the left and right by where the vent is if you are not looking or in the dark.


----------



## signmeuptoo

I am totally new here.  I live on a fixed income so I cannot afford stuff, but a good friend in another forum gave me their trusty old Cowon D2 and the other day I fixed a friend's friend's computer and was given the gift of IEMs in gratitude.  I am very thankful for the OP's detailed reviews, I chose the iMetal iM-590s.  When I first used them, the bass seemed a little weak and that there seemed to be sibilance (from an uneducated ear) in the uppermid, low treble, but nevertheless they sounded outstanding.
   
  Well, I was skeptical, but I did a burn in using this website here:  http://jlabaudio.com/burn.php (I don't know if there is anything better, if there is, please let me know) for 12 hours after listening for 4 hours. 
   
  All I can say is Wow.  After finding a better fit (I am still trying to find the right one for my left ear which is smaller than my right ear), the bass is just right, mids are clean, treble is crisp, and it sounds like I am there.  I used to have a pair of Sure E2Cs and they were "blah" to me, but these are terrific and only 44 bucks at Amazon.  I spent a whole day working on a guys computer but it was worth it to have these.
   
  I know you audiophiles out there will chuckle at some noobie with no pocketbook, but I just wanted to thank the OP before I dig in to the forum and this thread.  So much to read.
   
  My roomate gave me a lot of ribbing about headgear thinking it made little difference, until he listened with these.  He just isn't into music like me, I used to be in a band (those were the good old days).
   
  One thing the OP might want to add to the review of these iM-590s is that some complain that after a while the internal wires start to pop out of the woven cable cover and can't be coaxed back in.  Probably people who don't treat their stuff well, but I am going to watch out for it.
   
  BTW, stuff played in Rockbox definitely sounds better on the D2 than the native OS.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


inarc said:


> Any plan to do Nakamichi IEM? I'm particularly interested with this ceramic housing dynamic IEM http://www.hmv.com.hk/product/headphones.asp?sku=43812


 
 I've heard of the company and that's about it. Some of their models look very interesting but no - no plans as of this time. Perhaps I'll look into how to get my hands on one if I ever manage to clear up my review queue.


 Quote:


rawrster said:


> So I got myself a pair of the ViSang R02 and things definitely have changed since I actively was in the under $50 market.
> 
> [...]
> 
> I'm also guessing you distinguish among the left and right by where the vent is if you are not looking or in the dark.


 
 Sounds like a good first impression. I have a feeling you'd like the sound of the M1 a bit better than that of the R02 (more treble, less bass) but the R02 is still one of my top three <$50 IEMs. Oh and the housings are asymmetric so you should be able to differentiate them by touch after a couple of days.


 Quote:


signmeuptoo said:


> I am totally new here.  I live on a fixed income so I cannot afford stuff, but a good friend in another forum gave me their trusty old Cowon D2 and the other day I fixed a friend's friend's computer and was given the gift of IEMs in gratitude.  I am very thankful for the OP's detailed reviews, I chose the iMetal iM-590s.  When I first used them, the bass seemed a little weak and that there seemed to be sibilance (from an uneducated ear) in the uppermid, low treble, but nevertheless they sounded outstanding.
> 
> Well, I was skeptical, but I did a burn in using this website here:  http://jlabaudio.com/burn.php (I don't know if there is anything better, if there is, please let me know) for 12 hours after listening for 4 hours.
> 
> ...


 
 Wow, this is the kind of first post I love to see! Sounds like you found a match - congrats. Regarding fit, you may want to try Sony Hybrid tips. You can get knockoff ones for relatively cheap off ebay or the real thing for $9 at Best Buy. The stock tips work well for me but Hybrids have the potential to give a better seal.
   
  As for the cable issue, I've known about it for a while but haven't experienced it myself. I try not to set a precedent for writing about something I've not witnessed firsthand. Regardless, Maximo have updated the build of the iM590 fairly recently. They upgraded the 3.5mm plug and I changed the cable (I think). Does the plug on the ones you got look like the one in my pic? If so, you've got the 1st-gen iM-590, which are still holding up well for me (about 15 months old now). I think the ones being supplied as warranty replacements at this point are 2nd-gen earphones. Not sure if stores have cleared old stock though.


----------



## signmeuptoo

They look just like your photo, we got them from Amazon for 44 bucks.  I will have to look into those Sony tips at some point.  I'll go check them out now.
   
  Did they change the cable to something other than woven?  I have two year's warranty IIRC, but I don't know if the paper that came in the shipping box is a receipt or not, it sure looks like one.  I will have to ask the buyer to email me whatever he got with that regards.
   
  Is it really true that I should burn them in for as much as 40 hours?
   
  Also, out of curiosity, were I to upgrade from these to something a little more expensive but that sounded the same except with more bass, just a touch more, what would I want to get?
   
  Also, have you considered making a sticky that teaches how to self critique IEMs and what to look for, and what pitfalls there are?


----------



## inarc

Well I saw this on ebay http://cgi.ebay.com/Brand-new-genuine-Nakamichi-NEP-XT1-black-white-/250688999936?pt=UK_AudioVisualElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Headphones&hash=item3a5e3a9200#rpdId dunno how reliable the seller is though. Maybe I'll bite...


----------



## ljokerl

To be honest I'm not sure. I know they changed the 3.5mm plug to something that looks more like the one on the Etymotic MC5 but I don't remember if they got rid of the nylon cord altogether. I'm sure the cord splitting/shearing issue was one of the things they were trying to fix. If you're really curious, you can always shoot a PM to Andrew H, the Maximo rep on these forums.
   
  Some people recommend 100 hours of burn-in. Some say 50 is enough. Usually depends on the earphone. I say as long as they sound good, why not just use them? Burn-in is inevitable so just keep pumping your music through.
   
  The iM-590 is still pretty close to the top of the crop as far as mid-range earphones go. If you want the same amount of treble crispness and clarity with a noticeable bass quantity boost you'd have to look at something like the Fischer Audio Silver Bullet, which I haven't finished (or started) reviewing yet, or the Panasonic HJE900. Not sure if the latter is still on sale but it's been hovering around $80-90 for the past few weeks.
   
  And no, I've never thought of doing a critical listening guide of any sort. I suppose that would entail putting together a list of good test tracks along with what to look for in each one - quite a bit of work to be honest. Pitfalls are a good idea - perhaps I'll start writing some down. There's a few very common ones such as mistakenly declaring every bass-heavy earphone 'warm'. At the same time, it's really difficult to explain to someone how to listen for a characteristic such as warmth. It would be far easier if everyone had the same selection of IEMs but of course everyone's ears are still different. A guide like that would be quite a challenge any way you spin it.


----------



## Katun

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> And no, I've never thought of doing a critical listening guide of any sort. I suppose that would entail putting together a list of good test tracks along with what to look for in each one - quite a bit of work to be honest. Pitfalls are a good idea - perhaps I'll start writing some down. There's a few very common ones such as mistakenly declaring every bass-heavy earphone 'warm'. At the same time, it's really difficult to explain to someone how to listen for a characteristic such as warmth. It would be far easier if everyone had the same selection of IEMs but of course everyone's ears are still different. A guide like that would be quite a challenge any way you spin it.


 

 And I don't think you should do anything like that either. What you have now is already "beyond extraordinary" in all aspects. _Absolutely phenomenal_.
   
  You've already worked hard enough, and somehow have had the patience and time to put all this together. What more could somebody ask of you?


----------



## signmeuptoo

Indeed, what a bunch of hard work.  My roomate and I have been writing things and writing is no small task, especially with the cost of things and adding photos and shopping information!  Once again, THANK YOU!


----------



## rawrster

I think a critical listening guide would be difficult to do. We all do critical listening differently I'm assuming and I'm sure how I do that is different than the way joker does his critical listening. There are some things that would be the same such as a good source, quiet environment but my tracks are probably different as well. I think it's something you learn over time but most people probably wouldn't be spending money on many different earphones to compare to another at least those who are here just to find out an earphone to buy and then leave.


----------



## Andrew H

EQ.
   
  And (for bonus points) test tones.
   
  Seriously. People here tend (how can I put it mildly) to REALLY SUCK at learning their frequencies. I'm not saying you have to develop your ear to the point of being able to correctly ID a specific pitch when you hear it. But at least become friendly with an octave (typically 10-band) EQ enough to develop a reasonable feel for the difference between say, 125 and 250 hz. Hook up your various earphones, play with all the bands, and you'll get a much better idea of what the specific colorations are for each model.
   
  Otherwise, to only be able to think and talk in terms of "bass/mid/treble" (which have no absolute/specific technical meaning, and will be perceived differently by every individual), is like a car enthusiast claiming their car is "fast". Does it mean it runs the quarter in 12's or 15's or 25's or 30's?


----------



## Andrew H

It's still using knit cable, just one that is softer and more supple, and less likely to kink or split. (And supposedly tested to be something like 3x more durable than the previous one. So why did they provide the stinky one to us in the first place, one might ask?)
   
  One thing I suppose we should check is what effect it might have had (if any) on the microphonics...
   
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> To be honest I'm not sure. I know they changed the 3.5mm plug to something that looks more like the one on the Etymotic MC5 but I don't remember if they got rid of the nylon cord altogether. I'm sure the cord splitting/shearing issue was one of the things they were trying to fix.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


katun said:


> And I don't think you should do anything like that either. What you have now is already "beyond extraordinary" in all aspects. _Absolutely phenomenal_.
> You've already worked hard enough, and somehow have had the patience and time to put all this together. What more could somebody ask of you?


 
 Quote:


signmeuptoo said:


> Indeed, what a bunch of hard work.  My roomate and I have been writing things and writing is no small task, especially with the cost of things and adding photos and shopping information!  Once again, THANK YOU!


   
  Thanks, appreciate the support 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I don't think I'd be the right person to write such a guide anyway. My critical listening is very subjective in nature, which is why I can't crank reviews out day after day. I usually spend at least two weeks in daily rotation with each earphone before writing down anything at all.
   
   
  Quote:


andrew h said:


> EQ.
> 
> And (for bonus points) test tones.


   
  Yep, both quite important for consistency though I don't trust my hearing to match earphones to within 1dB the way mvw2 does 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Test tones and a simple sweep are usually the first thing I do with a new earphone. 
   
  Oh and thanks for chiming in on the iM-590 cable. I do hope the microphonics aren't any worse than with the old one. Do you know if stores are now stocking the new revision or will they still be clearing old stock for some time?


----------



## nissansupragtr

Hi I just wanna say thanks for this thread. I had old JVC air cushions and was about to buy new ones when I came across this and am considering some other options. FYI the air cushions are the best headphone I've ever heard. I listened to a good part of my collection again just because everything sounded so great, but I was going from apple standard headphones and dealextreme headphones. Right now the Sound Magic PL30s look very appealing. I was wondering if there was a more modern alternative and if you would purchase them over the M9s.. Thanks for the advice!


----------



## ljokerl

I think the PL30 has aged reasonably well. It's still the airiest and widest-sounding sub-$30 IEM I've heard, has great clarity and good balance, and beats much of the competition in fit & comfort. Its main weaknesses are the fact that it glosses over fine detail (at least compared to higher-end stuff) and that the extension isn't great on either end. The M9 beats it easily on all three of those counts but sounds far more aggressive. It's a different sort of sound from the warm and mushy aircushions. I guess it depends on the path you want to take. The PL30 would be the balanced, neutral, and slightly laid-back choice in this case; the M9 would be the barroom brawler. 
   
  I guess this begs the question: what are your priorities and how much are you willing to pay? The PL30 covers all the bases but may not amaze at first listen. The M9 may be too big of a jump from the AirCushions. If you want to maintain the approximate balance of the AirCushions you may want to look at the ViSang R01 as well.


----------



## nissansupragtr

Woah quick response! Ended up buying some M9Ps for the built-in microphone, still ended up $23 and I should be able to use it with my new ipod 4g as well. I'll be sure to let you know how aggressive they feel in comparison to the air cushions. Thanks again man!


----------



## ljokerl

Wow, has anyone else noticed that the Brainwavz M1 is no longer in mp4nation's catalog? Wonder what gives...

  
  Quote: 





nissansupragtr said:


> Woah quick response! Ended up buying some M9Ps for the built-in microphone, still ended up $23 and I should be able to use it with my new ipod 4g as well. I'll be sure to let you know how aggressive they feel in comparison to the air cushions. Thanks again man!


 

 Great, definitely a good buy. Hope you like them


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Wow, has anyone else noticed that the Brainwavz M1 is no longer in mp4nation's catalog? Wonder what gives...


 

 Sold out?  Hope its not something else.  That would be a great loss.....


----------



## tyrael

ljokerl, what's your opinion on ck90pro compared to re-zero? I love my re-zero's mid and treble, but always wish it has more bass. I'm not a bass head though, just find the re-zero's bass is a little lacking for my taste. Will the ck90pro suits me more?


----------



## kidcharlemagne

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Wow, has anyone else noticed that the Brainwavz M1 is no longer in mp4nation's catalog? Wonder what gives...
> 
> 
> 
> Great, definitely a good buy. Hope you like them


 
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Sold out?  Hope its not something else.  That would be a great loss.....


 

 Yup, theyre just OOS. I sent mine in for RMA recently (left side went out) and they didnt have any M1s in stock to send a replacement 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. They did graciously offer to send an M2 instead but I refused. Theyre expecting more stock next month (and hopefully another preorder discount)


----------



## rawrster

A lot of retailers do that when it is out of stock. They remove the listing until it goes back on stock. Although I probably would have taken the M2 not knowing what the M1 sounds like ;p


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


tyrael said:


> ljokerl, what's your opinion on ck90pro compared to re-zero? I love my re-zero's mid and treble, but always wish it has more bass. I'm not a bass head though, just find the re-zero's bass is a little lacking for my taste. Will the ck90pro suits me more?


 
 The CK90Pro definitely has more bass impact but it's armature-type bass. Very quick attack & decay, 'snappy' if you will. The CK90Pro is darker-sounding than the RE0/REZERO (by quite a margin) but has similar range (i.e. good extension on either end). It is less 'sparkly' though and doesn't sound quite as airy (but still gives a good sense of space). It would be a bit of a departure from the RE0/REZERO, no doubt about that, and not a very typical BA on the whole. I've been meaning to sell mine for months now (who needs two dual-BA earphones by ATH?) but each time I end up trying it again and keeping it 'for a bit longer'. Very interesting earphone, no doubt, but not for everyone just like the other ATH BAs.
   
  Oh and you may want to check out mvw2's latest writeup here.


 Quote:


kidcharlemagne said:


> Yup, theyre just OOS. I sent mine in for RMA recently (left side went out) and they didnt have any M1s in stock to send a replacement
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Ah, thanks for that. Very good to know.


----------



## kendric

Oh ya just a lil heads-up, would recommend to add in Regular Monster JAMz to review (which i seen comments on how different they are from LiL JAMz, Which i would like to find out more since i only had Regular JAMz and probably not going to grab lil JAMz 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




" class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//wink.gif" title="
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




" width="" />
   
  Secondly, I am thinking of going for my first-ever Higher End IEMs for the first time, For now i am thinking of either 1) Klipsch X10 2) Shure SE535 3) MTPG 4) MTPC 5) UE TF-10 so perhaps you might review them also if you haven planned any of the above for a review. Thanks alot and Your review's are great, My head is turning dizzy after all the reading on this post and your 47 headphones review~ (*_*)
   
  *And Yes Would like to hear your opinions on Aurvana In-Ear 2 as the pair are my current emergency back-up pair of IEMs =)


----------



## tyrael

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The CK90Pro definitely has more bass impact but it's armature-type bass. Very quick attack & decay, 'snappy' if you will. The CK90Pro is darker-sounding than the RE0/REZERO (by quite a margin) but has similar range (i.e. good extension on either end). It is less 'sparkly' though and doesn't sound quite as airy (but still gives a good sense of space). It would be a bit of a departure from the RE0/REZERO, no doubt about that, and not a very typical BA on the whole. I've been meaning to sell mine for months now (who needs two dual-BA earphones by ATH?) but each time I end up trying it again and keeping it 'for a bit longer'. Very interesting earphone, no doubt, but not for everyone just like the other ATH BAs.
> Oh and you may want to check out mvw2's latest writeup here.


 

 Thanks for the info
  Guess the ck90pro is not for me then...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kendric said:


> Oh ya just a lil heads-up, would recommend to add in Regular Monster JAMz to review (which i seen comments on how different they are from LiL JAMz, Which i would like to find out more since i only had Regular JAMz and probably not going to grab lil JAMz
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 To be honest I only grabbed the Lil' Jamz because I like the slim form factor and the price was right. Some stiff competition in the $70-90 range nowadays with a lot of imported phones keeping up with Monster's own Turbines... not sure if I expect the Lil' Jamz to compete. Yet to open the box though so time will tell.
   
  I've got the TF10 in review right now, along with a few of the high-end universals you aren't considering (W3, W2, SM3, Monster MD). My head is dizzy just contemplating the amount of writing I have to do once I start putting my notes in paragraph form... yikes.
   
  Aurvana in-ears look great and I've been wanting to pick up a set ever since ClieOS put up his review. A price drop or decent sale would probably push me to it.


----------



## proedros

Great thread , and the one who sold me to get RE-ZERO as my first 'serious' IEM (for less than100$)
   
  will you be adding perhaps SM3 in your list ?
   
  Thanx again


----------



## ljokerl

Added Sennheiser CX280 and CX281 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





proedros said:


> Great thread , and the one who sold me to get RE-ZERO as my first 'serious' IEM (for less than100$)
> 
> will you be adding perhaps SM3 in your list ?


 

 Thanks, and good choice with the RE-ZERO 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  The SM3 is currently in review. You can find a list my upcoming reviews at the bottom of post #8, below the chart.


----------



## proedros

Oh i hadn't seen it , so thanx for pointing me there
   
  Again , thanx for such a thorough and painstaking review...I am sure i ain't the only one who benefited from this thread
   
  Expect some more questions when i decide to upgrade and move to the 200$ area (i will wait to see the feedback on the RE-262...)
   
  Cheers


----------



## kjk1281

Thanks for the update!  I'm glad somebody got the chance to try both the CX280 and CX281 so I don't have to. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Pretty much in agreement with a majority of the review, particularly the CX280's airiness and occasional lack of intimacy, though I do get the feeling you were hearing more bass than I am.  Then again, the lack of sub-bass weight per your description may be what contributes to that perception.
   
  Anyway, if I were to upgrade, I'd probably go for something similar to the CX280.  It's not a perfect canalphone by any stretch of the imagination, but it does many things to my liking.  Not exactly sure what a proper upgrade would be but I'm sure the answer will lie somewhere in this thread (if it doesn't already).


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





kjk1281 said:


> Anyway, if I were to upgrade, I'd probably go for something similar to the CX280.  It's not a perfect canalphone by any stretch of the imagination, but it does many things to my liking.  Not exactly sure what a proper upgrade would be but I'm sure the answer will lie somewhere in this thread (if it doesn't already).


 

 The $99 refurb IE7's might be just what you're after.


----------



## rawrster

Just out of curiosity but do you have any interest in the PFE Perfect Bass? However I'm assuming the only real difference between that and the one you have reviewed (assuming you have reviewed it) is the different filter.


----------



## kjk1281

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> The $99 refurb IE7's might be just what you're after.


 

 That's what I was afraid of. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I'll more likely than not get a pair someday, though I'm still curious as to what Sennheiser (and others) have in store in the next year.


----------



## SolidSnake3

ljokerl you should be happy to know that I finally bought myself a new pair of CK10's after they have been eating at the back of my mind since I listened to your pair over the summer. It's funny, every other iem I heard since the CK10's I have been comparing to them and I have to say, the ATH keep coming out on top. 
   
  My wallet is shedding a few tears...ok a lot of tears and a small brain hemorrhage but in 10 days or so my ears and mind should be back at ease. *crosses fingers* Can't wait to hear nay experience that magic again


----------



## rawrster

Excellent choice there 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 The CK10 remains my favorite universal as the best package. It sounds great and is in the top 2 in terms of build quality and cable quality with the CK100 as the other. I don't know which is 1st and 2nd but they can easily be interchanged and you would get no complaints from me.


----------



## slntdth93

+1 on the ck10 love. Only thing is the strain relief near the earpiece doesn't look like its molded on.


----------



## germanturkey

another ck10 convert.  excellent.  i saw a pair for sale in the forum for $270.  that's kinda pushing it i think.  haha.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Excellent choice there
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 How does the hje900 compare in build quality to the ck10/ck100? It's been described as being built like a tank with replaceable cables...but then the ck10/ck100 are also said to be among the best built IEMs in production.


----------



## rawrster

Well I did say the CK10/CK100 as top 2 and I own the HJE900 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I find the CK10/CK100 the better package in terms of build quality than the HJE900 even though neither have replaceable cables. The CK10/CK100 have housings that are built like thanks, soft and flexible cable that has very low microphonics straight down and no memory when wrapped. The HJE900 has very good housings and is user replaceable. The cable is where it falls way short. It retains memory, has a chin slider that is more for show than anything and the cable is much more microphonic. If the CK10/CK100 had user replaceable cables with the same cable then they would further the distance between the next best built universal.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





germanturkey said:


> another ck10 convert.  excellent.  i saw a pair for sale in the forum for $270.  that's kinda pushing it i think.  haha.


 

 That price is more than pushing it....anyhow, I can't wait to get the CK10's! Have to agree with Rawr on the build quality as well, second to none, it is without question the best I have ever seen and experienced. None of other iem's I have tried or owned have come close to them, I honestly feel that they are the only set of iem's I don't fear any sort of problem with as a result of the build. I think I could abuse them like no tomorrow and they would be no worse for wear, they are that well made.


----------



## germanturkey

^^ see, you say that, but i'm still deathly afraid i'll break them somehow.  like when i listen before bed, i'm always ocd about making sure i put them on my bedside table in a way that they don't scratch anything metal i have or fall on the floor.  haha.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


proedros said:


> Oh i hadn't seen it , so thanx for pointing me there
> 
> Again , thanx for such a thorough and painstaking review...I am sure i ain't the only one who benefited from this thread
> 
> ...


   
  Thanks, and good luck on your upgrade path 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
   
  Quote:


kjk1281 said:


> Thanks for the update!  I'm glad somebody got the chance to try both the CX280 and CX281 so I don't have to.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 And thank you for the CX280! I did personally think that the (mid/upper) bass was plentiful but then we all know my inclinations towards 'bass-light' phones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. The IE7s might indeed be a good choice for you though I've been very impressed with the space and air of the Thinksound TS02 as well. Compared them to IE7s yesterday and couldn't pick a clear winner. If the price of the TS02 drops 20-30% as happened with the other thinksound earphones, they'll be a real strong contender as they can compete with the Eterna/VB/Xears TD100/Brainwavz M2 crop in their own (warm and lush) way. 


 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Just out of curiosity but do you have any interest in the PFE Perfect Bass? However I'm assuming the only real difference between that and the one you have reviewed (assuming you have reviewed it) is the different filter.


 
 Interest, yes. I did review the PFE121 but the cables frayed and I don't have it anymore. I've not been keeping up with the news but I take it Phonak won't sell the bass filters separately? 
  
   
  Quote:


solidsnake3 said:


> ljokerl you should be happy to know that I finally bought myself a new pair of CK10's after they have been eating at the back of my mind since I listened to your pair over the summer. It's funny, every other iem I heard since the CK10's I have been comparing to them and I have to say, the ATH keep coming out on top.
> 
> My wallet is shedding a few tears...ok a lot of tears and a small brain hemorrhage but in 10 days or so my ears and mind should be back at ease. *crosses fingers* Can't wait to hear nay experience that magic again


 
 Wow, I still find it hard to believe that the CK10s infected someone so badly. Then again, I just spent three hours (instead of 15 mins) drinking tea and listening to the CK10 and SM3 side by side. This hobby is worse than some drug habits.


 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Excellent choice there
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Quote:


slntdth93 said:


> +1 on the ck10 love. Only thing is the strain relief near the earpiece doesn't look like its molded on.


 

 Quote:


germanturkey said:


> another ck10 convert.  excellent.  i saw a pair for sale in the forum for $270.  that's kinda pushing it i think.  haha.


   
  Good bit of love for the CK10 here. Glad there's still a few people out there hanging on to them. To illustrate the issue with comparing another IEM to the CK10/CK100 in build quality I will simply post this:
   

   
  CK10 is on the top. Bottom is a UE TF10, the cabling of which is far from thinnest among my IEMs. I don't think the picture illustrates the extent of the difference but the CK10 cable is at least 2x meatier and makes  the TF10 look like it's wired with string.


 Quote:


jxk said:


> How does the hje900 compare in build quality to the ck10/ck100? It's been described as being built like a tank with replaceable cables...but then the ck10/ck100 are also said to be among the best built IEMs in production.


 
 The HJE900 is very solid, no doubt about that, but it has some design choices that boggle the mind. The crappy cable cinch is one. The hard strain relief on the 3.5mm plug is another. The below-average cord length is a third. And, as rawrster said, the cable simply doesn't feel high-end despite being somewhat thick. It's a bit worse than Turbine cords IMO and a pretty big step down from CK10/CK100 cables. 


 Quote:


germanturkey said:


> ^^ see, you say that, but i'm still deathly afraid i'll break them somehow.  like when i listen before bed, i'm always ocd about making sure i put them on my bedside table in a way that they don't scratch anything metal i have or fall on the floor.  haha.


 
 Hah, it helps that I got my CK10s used. They've been in use since 2008 and I've never been careful with them - probably least careful out of all my earphones. I have to say that the titanium faceplate is very difficult to scratch. If the light falls on it a certain way I can see a couple of very thin scratches on the surface but I've been pretty rough on them so the fact that there's no deep gashes is a testament in itself. I take very good care of the rest of my earphones but the CK10s just scream 'abuse me'. The plastic bits, strain relief, and cable on my set are still in excellent condition. You should really worry more about the damage your CK10s will do to whatever they land on


----------



## SolidSnake3

It's a bit odd I know but the CK10's are the first and only iem's I have listened to that made me forget I had iem's in. It was that ah ha! sort of moment that is what keeps sticking in my head. It's not that they infected me with their speed or anything like that, it's just that the sense of real music was so strong. That is what I miss most and what eventually caused me to buy a pair. It's not like I dream about them or anything like that it's just that when I logically review or think about my iem's and those I have heard I can't help but admit they come out on top the stack. I guess that's what I'm trying to say in a sometimes overly poetic and enthusiastic sort of way.
   
  I think this sums it up well:
   
  With the CK10's I wasn't listening to an IEM, I was listening to music
  


> Quote:
> 
> 
> solidsnake3 said:
> ...


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good bit of love for the CK10 here. Glad there's still a few people out there hanging on to them. To illustrate the issue with comparing another IEM to the CK10/CK100 in build quality I will simply post this:
> 
> 
> 
> CK10 is on the top. Bottom is a UE TF10, the cabling of which is far from thinnest among my IEMs. I don't think the picture illustrates the extent of the difference but the CK10 cable is at least 2x meatier and makes  the TF10 look like it's wired with string.


 

 How does the CK10 go with the E7? That's looking like the portable rig I'm aiming for at the moment (iPod>L3>E7>CK10). I'd like to say that it'd be my 'final' portable rig, but y'know... This website is a black hole. I need to find gainful employment and get some cash together.


----------



## rawrster

They do sell the filters separately and I've been toying with getting myself a pair with the grey and black filters as well.
  http://store.audeoworld.com/shared/StoreFront/default.asp?CS=audeoworld&StoreType=BtoC&Count1=949871242&Count2=867011666


----------



## germanturkey

I had the e7 for a while, so i'll give my impressions from what i remember.  (so you can rightfully infer that i returned it.)  let me say that apparently, it goes super well with the re0, which many people seem to think is a lesser ck10.  however, when i plugged it in to my ipod via lod or into my computer via usb, it widened the sound stage in such a way that it made the music sound distant.  something i'm unfamiliar with since i don't use full sized headphones.  i had become accustomed to the intimate, yet completely enveloping sound that the ck10s produced.  so to have a "gap" between where the sound was coming from and where i was hearing the sound actually turned me off from the device.  i figured a slight boost in bass (which was actually pretty nice) wasn't worth the change in sound.  so i ended up returning the device.  of course, its only my opinion, so someone else might have a more favorable view.
   
  joker, i probably won't let go of my ck10s ever.  if you dig up the ck10 thread, there's a record of me searching high and low for a few months looking for them.  haha.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





germanturkey said:


> joker, i probably won't let go of my ck10s ever.  if you dig up the ck10 thread, there's a record of me searching high and low for a few months looking for them.  haha.


 

 I feel the same way about my Eterna V1's. I got them right when the V2 came out because I knew they wouldn't be on sale for much longer. I don't think I will ever sell them, maybe give them to a friend some day so they can experience the awesomeness but other than that they are staying firmly in my drawer or in my ears


----------



## rawrster

Too bad I don't feel the same way about my Eterna v1. They been in an altoids can and have barely seen anything outside of the darkness inside that can in the past month or so.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


joethearachnid said:


> How does the CK10 go with the E7? That's looking like the portable rig I'm aiming for at the moment (iPod>L3>E7>CK10). I'd like to say that it'd be my 'final' portable rig, but y'know... This website is a black hole. I need to find gainful employment and get some cash together.


   
  The E7 doesn't really have a great amp section so unless you want it as a DAC I wouldn't recommend it. It does have really high stereo separation which the CK10 doesn't need. There were measurements done by DFKT somewhere that show the same. Tonally I think it works better with warmer earphones but the bass boost (on +1) will help the CK10. If you want something that meshes with the CK10 and is portable perhaps the T3D will be a better option. My T4 works fine even though I don't really use it, as does my mini3, which I use more.


 Quote:


rawrster said:


> They do sell the filters separately and I've been toying with getting myself a pair with the grey and black filters as well.
> http://store.audeoworld.com/shared/StoreFront/default.asp?CS=audeoworld&StoreType=BtoC&Count1=949871242&Count2=867011666


   
  That's interesting - based on those prices I don't see why anyone would buy a PFE when they could buy the Perfect Bass plus grey and black filters for the same amount.
  
  Quote:


germanturkey said:


> joker, i probably won't let go of my ck10s ever.  if you dig up the ck10 thread, there's a record of me searching high and low for a few months looking for them.  haha.


 
 Yes, I remember. I think that was our first glimpse of things to come in terms of CK10 availability. Glad that everyone who wanted one was able to get it.


----------



## rawrster

@joker: Just out of curiosity how's the SA1 cable in terms of does it have lots of memory and is it a microphonic cable? I'm thinking of getting a SA1 cable since the 1m cable is annoying compared to a 1.2m and the memory of that cable.
   
  One of the things about the CK10 is that they are quite difficult to get a good picture on camera which only adds to their mystique 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




" class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//smily_headphones1.gif" title="
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




" width="" /> Here's an example of a bad picture of them I took a while back when I had them. The housing is actually a blueish greenish color but also shiny so it's hard to get a picture that isn't multi toned or black. CK10 top rip right and it's brother on top left. There's mostly good built earphones in this pic except for one and the CK10/CK100 beats them all in build.


----------



## SolidSnake3

That pic makes it easy to see just how tiny the CK10's in particular are compared to the Coppers/MD's/Orto. 
   
  Annoying update #1, got the confirmation email from the site I ordered the ck10's from with tracking number. Says they were received by the Hong Kong post on the 27th so I'm hoping I get them sometime next week 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 *fingers crossed*


----------



## kjk1281

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> And thank you for the CX280! I did personally think that the (mid/upper) bass was plentiful but then we all know my inclinations towards 'bass-light' phones
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Well, it's not that I don't find the bass plentiful as much as a find the lower frequencies to be somewhat lacking a bit in body.  It was really odd when I first listened to the CX280 (after my brief period of wrestling with the fit as I usually do with any new pair of earphones) as the CX250 and CX300 seems quite a bit more meaty (and bloated, at least in the latter) in the bass response.  I do prefer the CX280's style of bass presentation quite a bit more, though neither is really what I would call ideal.  Of course, it could be just me with my oddly-shaped ear canals that contributes to the abundant-but-lean bass response that I'm hearing.
   
  I might have to check out the TS02 some time, especially if you find them comparable to the IE7.  I'm kind of hoping that Thinksound would make a version that doesn't have the mic, but it's not really an issue.  The only real problem now is a lack of funds...


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





solidsnake3 said:


> That pic makes it easy to see just how tiny the CK10's in particular are compared to the Coppers/MD's/Orto.
> 
> Annoying update #1, got the confirmation email from the site I ordered the ck10's from with tracking number. Says they were received by the Hong Kong post on the 27th so I'm hoping I get them sometime next week
> 
> ...


 

 Actually someone mentioned the CK10 in another thread and tempted me to buy them again. They were going for a bundle for a bit under 300 and made me consider selling my M50 and some other stuff and get them again lol..If there's going to be any universal I buy a second time this is it. However them being discontinued..it really means it's only available in Asia correct like the CK100 not being sold in USA?


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Actually someone mentioned the CK10 in another thread and tempted me to buy them again. They were going for a bundle for a bit under 300 and made me consider selling my M50 and some other stuff and get them again lol..If there's going to be any universal I buy a second time this is it. However them being discontinued..it really means it's only available in Asia correct like the CK100 not being sold in USA?


 

 That's what I found yes, the only places I found them were import sites. AccessoryJack has them as does Jaben however Jaben has the bundle with them in it listed as having some "item without enough inventory". Basically, something isn't in stock for them to add to the bundle if you were to buy it. I emailed Jaben 3 times over the course of a month and they never returned a single one so I chose not to go that route. You can't find out what is missing from the bundle until you order it it seems like as well. 
   
  AccessoryJack seems to have them not listed as in stock but I think you can still add them to your cart.


----------



## Bennyboy71

iheadphones has them here in UK: http://www.iheadphones.co.uk/headphones/23762/Audio+Technica+ATH+CK10.htm 
  
  Quote: 





solidsnake3 said:


> That's what I found yes, the only places I found them were import sites. AccessoryJack has them as does Jaben however Jaben has the bundle with them in it listed as having some "item without enough inventory". Basically, something isn't in stock for them to add to the bundle if you were to buy it. I emailed Jaben 3 times over the course of a month and they never returned a single one so I chose not to go that route. You can't find out what is missing from the bundle until you order it it seems like as well.
> 
> AccessoryJack seems to have them not listed as in stock but I think you can still add them to your cart.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Holy cow those are expensive!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The Accessory Jack one's are way cheaper


----------



## rawrster

I definitely won't be buying the CK10 anytime soon or more like ever. I'd rather spend my money on other things as I do like the universals I have now and they cost me very little money compared to some other earphones. Outside of the RE262 not much interests me really..SA7 and the xjays did interest me but taking too long and HifiMan has a sound I know is for me while I don't know about the others.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the JAYS t-JAYS Three and TDK EB900 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> @joker: Just out of curiosity how's the SA1 cable in terms of does it have lots of memory and is it a microphonic cable? I'm thinking of getting a SA1 cable since the 1m cable is annoying compared to a 1.2m and the memory of that cable.


 
 The SA1 cable wasn't bad (or good) enough to leave an impression on me so I suppose it's pretty average - not as soft as soundmagic cords but not stiff and kink-prone, either. 
  
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> However them being discontinued..it really means it's only available in Asia correct like the CK100 not being sold in USA?


 
 Yep but at least for the time being we can import them without paying a huge premium.


----------



## Jukka

I'd like to thank ljokerl for impressive reviews. As a new iem-person I've found your thread to be extremely informative. Keep up the good work and thanks again!


----------



## SpikedJuice

Hear, hear! I would also like to extend my thanks to ljokerl for his reviews. They have been a tremendous help in clearing the IEM waters for someone new to the game, like myself. I hope that I'm able to contribute my own reviews once I get my first IEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jukka said:


> I'd like to thank ljokerl for impressive reviews. As a new iem-person I've found your thread to be extremely informative. Keep up the good work and thanks again!


 
 Quote:


spikedjuice said:


> Hear, hear! I would also like to extend my thanks to ljokerl for his reviews. They have been a tremendous help in clearing the IEM waters for someone new to the game, like myself. I hope that I'm able to contribute my own reviews once I get my first IEMs.


 

  Thank you, glad you found the thread useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Good luck picking out the perfect set!


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yep but at least for the time being we can import them without paying a huge premium.


 
  I don't thinki there's really a huge premium when buying from Japan. There's seyo shop and accessoryjack and a bunch of others. If they charge too much I can always use a mail forwarding service which pretty much adds $30 or so on top of the price which includes EMS so it's not too bad when buying from Japan. If the CK10 prices decides to chop in half I may be tempted and by tempted I really mean forced to buy


----------



## Halk

Just to make sure I understand you correctly... When you say microphonics do you mean resonance from touching the cable/moving, or do you mean something electrical?
  I'll be buying IEMs to replace my 380 pro headphones, and one thing that annoys me about headphones is if I touch the cable it echoes in the left cup. If that's what you mean by microphonics it means I can forget about the Copper Pros.
  I should also say thanks for this thread, and the work you've done to create it!


----------



## rawrster

Microphonics is in short cable noise. Just about every earphone has it when worn straight down but mostly removed by going over the ear.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


halk said:


> Just to make sure I understand you correctly... When you say microphonics do you mean resonance from touching the cable/moving, or do you mean something electrical?
> I'll be buying IEMs to replace my 380 pro headphones, and one thing that annoys me about headphones is if I touch the cable it echoes in the left cup. If that's what you mean by microphonics it means I can forget about the Copper Pros.
> I should also say thanks for this thread, and the work you've done to create it!


 
 Microphonics is cord contact noise that comes about as a result of solid conductance. Nothing electrical - it's the same idea as if you put your ear to your table and knock on any other part of the table - you'll hear it louder than you would through air. 
   
  FYI a higher score in the microphonics category means lower microphonics. Coppers aren't very offensive in terms of cable noise, especially when worn over-the-ear, but if you want to really avoid cable noise altogether you need a Westone earphone, Earsonics SM3, CK10, etc etc.


----------



## Halk

Thanks for the explanation on microphonics. It's exactly what I want to avoid! I did understand the way your microphonics scale worked, to be frank the way you have reviewed them is pretty clear. The only two questions I had was exactly what microphonics was (Wikipedia suggests it's electrical) and if you meant aftermarket accessories, or the accessories that came with the package (you meant the latter). I found the whole thing very easy to comprehend.
   
  I'm edging towards Audio Technicas at the moment, next step is to decide if custom is worth considering.


----------



## SoSpecial

Hey I'm looking for aggressive IEM's but I don't really want to spend all that much. The lower end needs impact but without sacraficing the top end. I'm looking to spend a max of $45, are there any you guys have used which are aggressive for under $45?


----------



## rawrster

What does "aggressive iem" mean


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> What does "aggressive iem" mean


 

 I think it means different things to different people. But to me it generally means an IEM with a good bit of treble sparkle and detail. This is usually, though _not _always, accompanied with a lack of midbass bloat/warmth and a smaller soundstage. Your hje900 is likely one of the exceptions, where you get the more aggressive sound while simultaneously having a little added warmth. Etymotic is a more typical aggressive IEM, while anything sennheiser (or your eterna) is the opposite - being more laid back and relaxed.


----------



## SoSpecial

Quote: 





jxk said:


> I think it means different things to different people. But to me it generally means an IEM with a good bit of treble sparkle and detail. This is usually, though _not _always, accompanied with a lack of midbass bloat/warmth and a smaller soundstage. Your hje900 is likely one of the exceptions, where you get the more aggressive sound while simultaneously having a little added warmth. Etymotic is a more typical aggressive IEM, while anything sennheiser (or your eterna) is the opposite - being more laid back and relaxed.


 
  Actually Mid bass is  a bit important but not everything to me.
  
   
  I was recommended HJ3900's but I'm not sure about that price, I know they are good headphones but like I said  I don't even have Full sized Headphones for that much right now haha.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


sospecial said:


> Hey I'm looking for aggressive IEM's but I don't really want to spend all that much. The lower end needs impact but without sacraficing the top end. I'm looking to spend a max of $45, are there any you guys have used which are aggressive for under $45?


   
  The VB is another good aggressive earphone in the HJE900's price range. As for under $45, I'd look at the Yamaha EPH-50. I also consider the iM-590 aggressive even though it doesn't have a whole lot of bass. It's sparkly and energetic. Meelec M6 would be the third one I'd look at.


----------



## macrocheesium

This may seem like a strange question, but do the eartips from the Nuforce NE-6/7 fit on the Panasonic HJE900? I will be ordering the Panasonics soon and the included eartips from my Nuforce create a perfect comfortable seal for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


macrocheesium said:


> This may seem like a strange question, but do the eartips from the Nuforce NE-6/7 fit on the Panasonic HJE900? I will be ordering the Panasonics soon and the included eartips from my Nuforce create a perfect comfortable seal for me.


   
  Haven't tried it explicitly but the nozzles are the same size so I don't see why not.


----------



## SoSpecial

I may just suck it up and get the HJE900's. . . I mean this is the second time I've been recommened them for the second thing I've asked for, AND correct me if I'm wrong they aren't wimps on the low end right?


----------



## rawrster

They definitely are not bass light. I would not recommend it for true bass heads that like a nice big mid bass hump but definitely plenty of bass. IMO their weakness is the length of their cable as it is a bit short as it is 1m instead of the usual 1.2m


----------



## SoSpecial

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> They definitely are not bass light. I would not recommend it for true bass heads that like a nice big mid bass hump but definitely plenty of bass. IMO their weakness is the length of their cable as it is a bit short as it is 1m instead of the usual 1.2m


 


  These will go from my ear to my pocket, I'm sure I can deal with the length.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


sospecial said:


> I may just suck it up and get the HJE900's. . . I mean this is the second time I've been recommened them for the second thing I've asked for, AND correct me if I'm wrong they aren't wimps on the low end right?


 
 I agree with rawrster - the low end is plentiful but not overwhelming (for my tastes, that is). If you haven't seen my long HJE900 vs CK10 vs MTPG review, I ended up preferring them to the MTPG (and by extension the MTPC) as far as high-end dynamic-driver earphones go.


----------



## SoSpecial

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> sospecial said:
> ...


 

 Oh okay, and sure I'll give that a look.
   
  Also if I wanted basshead IEM I'd get S4's.


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> macrocheesium said:
> ...


 


  I must have jinxed it; they tore last night. =/


----------



## Jozurr

Cant wait for the reviews on the westones!


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Fischer Audio Silver Bullet and Thinksound TS02+mic. 
   
  Quote: 





jozurr said:


> Cant wait for the reviews on the westones!


 

 I think I've got more requests for the MD so I'll finish the Monster IEMs first, then the Westones


----------



## Inks

Wow finally a good description of the Silver Bullets' sound. I specially like the description of the soundstage which I similarly described to a user (SWBcheaters?), it's got that realistic combination of width and tallness kind of like the TF10.
   
  I would also note that Fischer has a new version of the Silver Bullet with a better cable, but I have no idea if any authorized dealers have any at the moment.


----------



## rawrster

another nice review joker however unless the cable improves by quite a bit I don't think I'll ever get it..although it's not like I _need_ another universal..these bang for your buck products always gets me ;p


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> l..these bang for your buck products always gets me ;p


 


 Truth to that! I always wanto buy the RE0 or RE-Zero... no idea why seeing I already have the SM3, RE262 and M6 for throwing around.


----------



## Angelopsaro

I really look forward for the westones too. Especially for the westones 1 since that is the top price i am willing to spend, and jokers reviews are important for me (and the society)


----------



## lazybum

This thread is getting epic.
   
  The more i read about the bullets, the more enticed i get.
  May i ask how does the soundstage of the silver bullet compare to that of the dbas?
  I may eventually pick one up as a backup iem to the dbas


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote:


lazybum said:


> This thread is getting epic.


 
   
  Fixed


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


inks said:


> Wow finally a good description of the Silver Bullets' sound. I specially like the description of the soundstage which I similarly described to a user (SWBcheaters?), it's got that realistic combination of width and tallness kind of like the TF10.
> 
> I would also note that Fischer has a new version of the Silver Bullet with a better cable, but I have no idea if any authorized dealers have any at the moment.


   
  Thanks, appreciate that. The Silver Bullet is a very good soundstaging benchmark - it does a great job of revealing the flaws in other earphones in direct comparisons - it really makes the Eterna sound very distant, the ViSang R03 - very upfront, etc etc. Amazing really.
  
   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> another nice review joker however unless the cable improves by quite a bit I don't think I'll ever get it..although it's not like I _need_ another universal..these bang for your buck products always gets me ;p


 
 There's definitely a rev.2 Silver Bullet in the works with a new cable but it's not even up in the product section of Fischer's site yet. I suppose it'll be a while before it's available internationally.

  
  Quote:


angelopsaro said:


> I really look forward for the westones too. Especially for the westones 1 since that is the top price i am willing to spend, and jokers reviews are important for me (and the society)


   
  Ha, not sure about the last part but I'm glad my reviews are useful.


 Quote:


lazybum said:


> This thread is getting epic.
> 
> The more i read about the bullets, the more enticed i get.
> May i ask how does the soundstage of the silver bullet compare to that of the dbas?
> I may eventually pick one up as a backup iem to the dbas


 
 I think the Silver Bullet is more ambient-sounding than the DBA-02. The DBA-02 is extremely precise not only with producing each note but also with placing it in the soundstage while the SB sort of lets things fall naturally into their place. In terms of sheer width i'd say the two are comparable with the DBA-02 being a little wider. Same story with depth but with the slight edge going to Silver Bullets. The DBA-02 does have more air, partly as a result of greater all-around clarity and partly because of the greater treble emphasis.


----------



## bisayaboi

This truly needs to be stickied. I've looked at this thread a long time ago and is the reason why I got the DBA-02's. I still look at today just to check out new IEM's.
   
  It will be 100% perfect when the MC5, SM3, Westone 3's, Shure models, and UE Triple.Fi.'s get reviewed.


----------



## Katun

Quote: 





bisayaboi said:


> This truly needs to be stickied. I've looked at this thread a long time ago and is the reason why I got the DBA-02's. I still look at today just to check out new IEM's.


 
   
  Yeah, it really should be. Probably the best thread I've seen on Head-Fi.
   
  Quote: 





bisayaboi said:


> It will be 100% perfect when the MC5, SM3, Westone 3's, Shure models, and UE Triple.Fi.'s get reviewed.


 
   
  I agree. It just keeps getting better and better! I always like to check, like you said, when new IEM's are reviewed.


----------



## airwax

Quote: 





bisayaboi said:


> This truly needs to be stickied. I've looked at this thread a long time ago and is the reason why I got the DBA-02's. I still look at today just to check out new IEM's.
> 
> It will be 100% perfect when the MC5, SM3, Westone 3's, Shure models, and UE Triple.Fi.'s get reviewed.


 


  Indeed. Hope there is a Westone 2 review as well. Can I audition your DBAs bai?


----------



## bisayaboi

Quote: 





airwax said:


> Indeed. Hope there is a Westone 2 review as well. Can I audition your DBAs bai?


 
  Sure. Maybe when I go back to Cebu.


----------



## jarrett

Will you look at adding the Sunrise SW-Xcape one day?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


bisayaboi said:


> This truly needs to be stickied. I've looked at this thread a long time ago and is the reason why I got the DBA-02's. I still look at today just to check out new IEM's.
> 
> It will be 100% perfect when the MC5, SM3, Westone 3's, Shure models, and UE Triple.Fi.'s get reviewed.


   
  If you're specifically looking for it this thread shouldn't be hard to find - it's the first google search result for 'multi IEM review' or 'IEM review thread' or 'x IEMs compared' (where 0 < x < 115) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Of that list Shure IEMs are the only ones I have no plans to review. Everything else is currently in progress. 


 Quote:


airwax said:


> Indeed. Hope there is a Westone 2 review as well. Can I audition your DBAs bai?


 
 Yes, there will be a Westone 2 review 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Any earphone that is on the 'to do' list in post #8 is already in my possession and (most likely) is gathering dust awaiting its turn. 


 Quote:


jarrett said:


> Will you look at adding the Sunrise SW-Xcape one day?


 
 Yes, I have a couple of possibilities for getting a go at the Xcape. Hopefully I'll have my hands on it sooner rather than later but not too soon as I've got loads of other write-ups to post.


----------



## DervishD

Thanks ljokerl, for the additions.
   
  I think, too, that this thread should be sticky, I find it just imprescindible even in the (strange) occasions where I don't think the same as you in some model. I don't think anybody can find a more comprehensive and plain good list of IEMs in the net.
   
  THANKS, dude


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you're specifically looking for it this thread shouldn't be hard to find - it's the first google search result for 'multi IEM review' or 'IEM review thread' or 'x IEMs compared' (where 0 < x < 115)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Amusing, since searching Head-Fi it's actually incredibly difficult to find. I am totally down with all the sticky sentiments - maybe it would lessen the number of 'Help - first time poster needs earphones!' threads.


----------



## bisayaboi

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> bisayaboi said:
> ...


 
  Fantastic but why no Shure reviews?


----------



## rawrster

I don't think he has any Shure earphones in his possession ;p


----------



## element51

Fantastic thread!! Helped me choose my wonderful meelec m6's!


----------



## zachgraz

@ Joker: great Fischer Audio Silver Bullet review.
   
  I have received mine today from Russia. They really sounded amazing from the start. As you wrote in your review the cables are very thin above the y-split.
  I always worry about breaking them. Like this the SBs do not look as if they were built to last...but the sound ... wow


----------



## pinoyman

i AM STILL waiting for bro joker's review on MILES DAVIS tribute...


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





pinoyman said:


> i AM STILL waiting for bro joker's review on MILES DAVIS tribute...


 


  ...


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





pinoyman said:


> i AM STILL waiting for bro joker's review on MILES DAVIS tribute...


 

 I hope I'm interpreting this wrong but it does not look like you are being very appreciative of what joker has been doing. I wish there was some kind of guide such as this when I first got started in this hobby. It would have saved me a good amount of money (..maybe well probably not.) Writing reviews is not easy especially something such as this where there are lots of reviews. It takes a lot more time and effort that you may think if you have never written a review before. Also there are things other than reviewing that joker does so it's not like he can just pump out reviews like a machine.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


dervishd said:


> Thanks ljokerl, for the additions.
> 
> I think, too, that this thread should be sticky, I find it just imprescindible even in the (strange) occasions where I don't think the same as you in some model. I don't think anybody can find a more comprehensive and plain good list of IEMs in the net.
> 
> THANKS, dude


   
  Thanks, D. Glad to see you around 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote:


bisayaboi said:


> Fantastic but why no Shure reviews?


 
 Pretty much what rawrster said - I simply haven't had any pass through my hands since I started this thread and having some previous experience with lower Shure models I've never been tempted to buy any.


 Quote:


element51 said:


> Fantastic thread!! Helped me choose my wonderful meelec m6's!


   
   
  Thanks, glad the thread helped!
   
   

 Quote:


zachgraz said:


> @ Joker: great Fischer Audio Silver Bullet review.
> 
> I have received mine today from Russia. They really sounded amazing from the start. As you wrote in your review the cables are very thin above the y-split.
> I always worry about breaking them. Like this the SBs do not look as if they were built to last...but the sound ... wow


   
  I say if you can get $68 worth of audio enjoyment out of them, it's still worth it in the end, but here's to hoping that the rev.2 is a better all-rounder 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
   
   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> I hope I'm interpreting this wrong but it does not look like you are being very appreciative of what joker has been doing. I wish there was some kind of guide such as this when I first got started in this hobby. It would have saved me a good amount of money (..maybe well probably not.) Writing reviews is not easy especially something such as this where there are lots of reviews. It takes a lot more time and effort that you may think if you have never written a review before. Also there are things other than reviewing that joker does so it's not like he can just pump out reviews like a machine.


 

  Thanks, rawrster, though I think his post came out sounding very different than was intended due to language barrier. Either way the MD review will be done when it's done


----------



## mcnoiserdc

I don't believe pinoyman is being rude!
   
  I think he meant like he can't wait for joker review of MD
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> dervishd said:
> ...


----------



## rawrster

I did leave the possibility of interpreting it wrong 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  If the rev.2 of the Silver Bullets has a much better cable and well a strain relief near the housing I _might_ be tempted as long as sound isn't changed like what they supposedly did with v1 and v2 of the Eterna. It does depend on what earphones I have then but good deals always get me in the end ;p


----------



## jarrett

Will there be a rev 2 of the Silver Bullet...o_O


----------



## Inks

yes but it's only a cable difference supposedly.


----------



## jarrett

Oh do you know when? How did you hear about a rev 2? That'll be nice, I was thinking of getting some at the low cost they are


----------



## pinoyman

Quote: 





> I hope I'm interpreting this wrong but it does not look like you are being very appreciative of what joker has been doing. I wish there was some kind of guide such as this when I first got started in this hobby. It would have saved me a good amount of money (..maybe well probably not.) Writing reviews is not easy especially something such as this where there are lots of reviews. It takes a lot more time and effort that you may think if you have never written a review before. Also there are things other than reviewing that joker does so it's not like he can just pump out reviews like a machine.


 
  oh....
  i am very very sorry brothers...
   
  i didnt want to offend anyone or to be rude to anybody...
  sorry if youve  mistaken me to be a rude guy...
  no im not.
   
  peace man...
  i love you all people and i do love this community cause this helps me a lot in developing my listening journey.
   
  mr. joker is a nice man, one the people i respect in this community.
   
  i typed the  "i* AM STILL waiting for bro joker's review on MILES DAVIS tribute...*" last night and i was in a dark room and i didnt see the shift button and in this message the I AM STILL is written in all capital letters...
  i didnt intend to be not so appreciative, sorry for that.
   
   
  MD's is my dream iem...ever since its released date till now.
  i respect bro JOKER a lot.
  his work means a lot to me.
  we already had our little conversation regarding the MD reviews.
  and i am waiting for his review before i place my purchase online.
   
   
   
  im sorry if my english is not that good...and for sorry also for misunderstanding my message.
  i am a FILIPINO and still learning to be fluent in your own language.
  hope we can still find peace even if we have different languages.
   
  maybe music can make us one.
   
  sorry again bro joker.
  sorry to mr. rawster, by the way, you are also one of the finest and respected member of this community, and to that i salute to you.
  sorry to all.
   
  happy listening to everyone...and i wish you all happiness and good health!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jarrett said:


> Will there be a rev 2 of the Silver Bullet...o_O


   
  I've been seeing rumors of a rev.2 Silver Bullet for some time but not an official announcement (though Fischer kind of sucks with timely official announcements). They've been slowly refreshing their lineup (Omega v2, Paradigm v2, etc) to get rid of the plasticky cabling across the range so it does make sense for the Silver Bullet to get a build upgrade at some point.


 Quote:


pinoyman said:


> im sorry if my english is not that good...and for sorry also for misunderstanding my message.
> i am a FILIPINO and still learning to be fluent in your own language.
> hope we can still find peace even if we have different languages.


 

  Well, I got the message so it's all good 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I'm not one to take things the wrong way but I can see how your message could appear out of line to a native English speaker (I'm not one either 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).


----------



## pinoyman

thanks bro joker!


----------



## esanthosh

I actually hate this thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  Every month I find at least one new, interesting IEM that matches my preference. Bad for my wallet, but I can't stop visiting this thread at least once a week. Now, I'll have to wait for Silver Bullet v2!


----------



## pinoyman

HAHAHA...
  i got to laugh on that...
  its called the "more you hate the more you love" thread!


----------



## bakka

good to know that silver bullet v2 is coming. I still hate the cable unlike beloving performance.


----------



## DervishD

I can't believe you're not a native English speaker, ljokerl, you look native to me! Your English is very very very good to my eyes. Maybe I'm wrong, because I'm not a native English speaker either, but man, your English rules!


----------



## rawrster

v2 Silver Bullet has been in the works but no idea when they will be released. I'm assuming the dealers are just waiting to get the Silver Bullet but who knows when the v2 will be released. FA isn't exactly the best at setting a date and distributing it at that date.


----------



## musedesign

Joker,  Thank you!  Thank you!  As a newbie to the hobby, reviews like this make all of the difference!
  Mark


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


esanthosh said:


> I actually hate this thread
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Sorry 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. However, I bet others curse your reviews on techenclave just as much 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 Quote:


musedesign said:


> Joker,  Thank you!  Thank you!  As a newbie to the hobby, reviews like this make all of the difference!
> Mark


 
 Ah, cheers 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Hope you picked out something nice.


----------



## bakka

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> v2 Silver Bullet has been in the works but no idea when they will be released. I'm assuming the dealers are just waiting to get the Silver Bullet but who knows when the v2 will be released. FA isn't exactly the best at setting a date and distributing it at that date.


 


  Totally agree with worst thing about FA,setting date and distributing. But their products are really nice i have to admit and worth to be patient I guess. Hopefully they release SB v2 soon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Btw ; this thread also made my wallet lighter day by day seriously !


----------



## DJGeorgeT

I would like to suggest that you move the table in post #8 to #1 or #2. I really like to check the table first and if something catches my eyes, I can go down and read your review. This acts like a summary and IMHO, summaries should be first page. Another suggestion is to organize the table alphabetically by manufacturer. Would just be nice. Now, I am overwhelmed trying to find a specific IEM in that long table. Few suggestions.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


bakka said:


> Totally agree with worst thing about FA,setting date and distributing. But their products are really nice i have to admit and worth to be patient I guess. Hopefully they release SB v2 soon
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   
  My apologies ><
  
  Quote:


djgeorget said:


> I would like to suggest that you move the table in post #8 to #1 or #2. I really like to check the table first and if something catches my eyes, I can go down and read your review. This acts like a summary and IMHO, summaries should be first page. Another suggestion is to organize the table alphabetically by manufacturer. Would just be nice. Now, I am overwhelmed trying to find a specific IEM in that long table. Few suggestions.


 

  Hmm.. perhaps moving the table up to post one would be a good idea although there's a link in there to post #8. Sorting the table by name, however, might lead to issues as competing earphones could end up very far apart and not easy to compare. Perhaps the solution is to have one table sorted by name (in post #1) and also keep the one in post #8 sorted by average but then I have to update two tables each time... Thanks for the input.


----------



## jasonb

this thread is amazing! thanks!


----------



## mvw2

You know what?  I'm surprised to still see no SA6 review.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jasonb said:


> this thread is amazing! thanks!


   
  Thanks, and glad you're liking the R03s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
   
  Quote:


mvw2 said:


> You know what?  I'm surprised to still see no SA6 review.


 
 Not that surprising considering Sleek wouldn't even send me an SA1 to demo. Had to get my own to see what they were hiding. I've actually tried trading for the SA6 a couple of times in the past (especially back when I had a score of high-end single-armature IEMs in my possession) but it's never worked out. Perhaps I'll get to try the SA6R/SA7 but perhaps not. Keeping pretty busy as is and more interested in the RE262, Xcape, FA Genesis/new dual-driver, etc.


----------



## kendric

Perhaps you might wanna try reviewing the Final Audios~ That will be a justice for us seeing that how EXPPP they really are, One of the few rare brands that makes even Monster Cable hands down on their expensiveness on their product pricing~ =S


----------



## Jozurr

Hey joker how are the silver bullets compared to the brainwavz m1? Can you post some detailed thoughts.. including the comfort aspects and build quality comparison? Im thinking of the silver bullets to upgrade to from the brainwavz.. thanks alot dude. I can't thank you enough for the M1s and the PL30s


----------



## mvw2

Speaking of the RE262.  I might have one heading your way in the near future.  Hero Kid has been gracious enough to let me demo his pair from his HM-602 purchase he was planning on selling.  We chatted and he likes the idea of giving back to the community by allowing these demos.  He wants you to demo the pair too, so I will be sending them off to you after I try them out for a couple weeks.  He's in no hurry, so time line isn't an issue.  I will have a RE252 in my possession that I will soon be getting from a fellow member that I also want to send along to you so you can have a direct RE252 vs RE262 comparison.
   
  The SA6R and SA7 will be interesting.  I don't really expect a company to send demo hardware.  However, I'd think fellow forum members would be willing to loan a pair.  I would give you a pair to try out if I actually still owned them.  My bro owns a pair, but I'm not sure how willing he is about loaning them out for an extended time since they are his main earphones that he does use on a regular basis.  I'd be curious to see a SA6 vs SA6R to see if there are audible differences due to the new housing and possibly minor tweaks and of course how the SA7 stacks up against, well, everything else out there.


----------



## Inks

Lol comparing the RE252 to the RE262 will be like comparing DBAs to the DDMs.


----------



## rawrster

It's only natural to be comparing them since they are both from HifiMan although it does seem like they have much different sound signature. I'm a bit disappointed about that but I'll hold judgment until I eventually get to hear them for myself.


----------



## mvw2

Yeah, Fang seems mainly interested in filling out his lineup rather than replacing old models.
   
  Aside from the frequency response/gearing difference, I am curious how they fair against each other as they both represent Fang's top level products.


----------



## rawrster

In any case I look forward to your thoughts on them. The RE262 is the last universal I currently have a good about of interest in although I did want something similar to the RE0 sound although the RE262 being harder to drive and providing a different sound signature is also very interesting and curious to how they fare. If it has a bit more bass than the RE0 or RE-Zero it may appeal to many more people although they would need to be able to meet the power requirements of them but lots of head-fi members have their portable and/or home amps.


----------



## mvw2

I don't know about you, but I'm looking forward to the SA7 too.  I don't know if you've ever used the SA6 before, but it's a nice product.  The transparency and air is incredible for an IEM.  The notes are also quite natural for a BA.  Treble is a bit smoothed (not rolled off) and bass does roll off early without EQing, but that's forgivable as a single BA earphone.  The sound stage is so-so, no great sense of location and placement, open, but you don't get a pinpoint sense of things like you do with other earphones.  With the SA7 stepping to a dual driver setup, it will fix a lot of the shortcomings of the SA6, so I'm quite curious what it will sound like.  I definitely liked the driver choice of the SA6, very natural and enjoyable, but a single driver is a single driver.  If they intend to stay with the same sound signature goals, I'm excited.
   
  I'm curious if Fang was just trying to aim for a new crowd, basically everyone who thinks the RE0, RE-ZERO, and RE252 are too lean or weak on the low end, maybe make something that's sort of a HD650 of his IEM lineup.  I'm curious for certain.  I was very surprised by the RE-ZERO, so I'm curious what the RE262 will be as a whole.


----------



## Inks

Let me add the EQ5 and the second dual driver iem from Radius. Those are the last ones I'm looking forward to because they're the next step of new technologies that were just introduced.


----------



## rawrster

The SA6 did have an interesting concept with their removable ports to change the way it sounds but it never really appealed to me. There were also reports that there were some QC issues early on so it steered me away and never looked back. The SA7 also does not appeal to me as they are also quite expensive and I'm pretty happy with my portable setup. I have some neutral phones and then some that gear towards the bassy side. I'm hoping the RE262 is my last universal for a long time. I'm also considering a full sized setup and that's expensive so might save up for that.


----------



## a_recording

Quote: 





inks said:


> Let me add the EQ5 and the second dual driver iem from Radius. Those are the last ones I'm looking forward to because they're the next step of new technologies that were just introduced.


 


  It's kind of curious that there are even new technologies being developed in IEMs when it seems like full tower speaker and headphone technology seems to be relatively resolved. (Using big dynamic drivers... I'm assuming that horns lost their debate, and ribbon tweeters and flat panel technologies don't seem to have taken off.) The craziest thing I've seen in a while are the Sony PFR's, which seemed to have flopped.
   
  Meanwhile IEM's are going from balance armature to dynamic drivers, to hybrid moving armature drivers, quadruple driver universals and dual drive dynamics - all these attempts to overcome shortcomings in a relatively immature market. I think we have portable audio to thank for that.
   
  Personally I'm looking forward to the new DDM's and the X-Jays. I'm particularly surprised that the X-Jays haven't been released yet...


----------



## Anaxilus

Well, remember, IEMs have to fit in your ear canal.  They don't have infinite space to play with.  I also don't think that dynamics have necessarily won anything.  They are more plentiful but so are Accords and Camrys.


----------



## a_recording

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Well, remember, IEMs have to fit in your ear canal.  They don't have infinite space to play with.  I also don't think that dynamics have necessarily won anything.  They are more plentiful but so are Accords and Camrys.


 


  I guess so, but I mean for floor standing speakers, even the most expensive speakers in the world use dynamic drivers, in the same way that the most expensive sports cars in the world still have four wheels heh. IEM's are a different matter.
   
  The PFR's seemed like a particularly misguided way to get around the pesky limitation that IEM's have to fit in your ear canal...


----------



## Kunlun

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Well, remember, IEMs have to fit in your ear canal.  They don't have infinite space to play with.  I also don't think that dynamics have necessarily won anything.  They are more plentiful but so are Accords and Camrys.


 


   Wankel rotors 4 lyfe


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not that surprising considering Sleek wouldn't even send me an SA1 to demo. Had to get my own to see what they were hiding. I've actually tried trading for the SA6 a couple of times in the past (especially back when I had a score of high-end single-armature IEMs in my possession) but it's never worked out. Perhaps I'll get to try the SA6R/SA7 but perhaps not. Keeping pretty busy as is and more interested in the RE262, Xcape, FA Genesis/new dual-driver, etc.


 


  You mentioned THE word and i tracked it.
   
  joker + genesis = killer combo.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kendric said:


> Perhaps you might wanna try reviewing the Final Audios~ That will be a justice for us seeing that how EXPPP they really are, One of the few rare brands that makes even Monster Cable hands down on their expensiveness on their product pricing~ =S


 
 I remember james saying something about possibly lending his FA out when he was done with it so that might actually happen. I'm certainly curious as I've never heard an FAD product before.


 Quote:


jozurr said:


> Hey joker how are the silver bullets compared to the brainwavz m1? Can you post some detailed thoughts.. including the comfort aspects and build quality comparison? Im thinking of the silver bullets to upgrade to from the brainwavz.. thanks alot dude. I can't thank you enough for the M1s and the PL30s


 
 I think that the M1 is both more comfy and better-built than the SB overall, but only slightly. The cable is strong even though it lacks strain relief and the shells are time-tested (read: ancient design) on the M1. They are a bit larger than the SB in diameter but rounded at the front and the nozzle is a little longer. Plus they sound good with bi-flange tips which means the housing never really touches my ear when I wear them. For sound though I'd have to say the SB has a leg up in many aspects. It's the more spacious-sounding of the two, has better extension on either end, and seems to have slightly better dynamics (though the M1 is still very impressive). I have to say that because the note of the SB is a bit 'rounded', the M1 does sound more crisp, especially in the midrange. Strings have the right 'twang' and piano notes actually have impact. I think Inks might be able to do a better sound comparison than I since he's had my M1s for a while and has definitely spent time comparing the two 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> Speaking of the RE262.  I might have one heading your way in the near future.  Hero Kid has been gracious enough to let me demo his pair from his HM-602 purchase he was planning on selling.  We chatted and he likes the idea of giving back to the community by allowing these demos.  He wants you to demo the pair too, so I will be sending them off to you after I try them out for a couple weeks.  He's in no hurry, so time line isn't an issue.  I will have a RE252 in my possession that I will soon be getting from a fellow member that I also want to send along to you so you can have a direct RE252 vs RE262 comparison.
> 
> The SA6R and SA7 will be interesting.  I don't really expect a company to send demo hardware.  However, I'd think fellow forum members would be willing to loan a pair.  I would give you a pair to try out if I actually still owned them.  My bro owns a pair, but I'm not sure how willing he is about loaning them out for an extended time since they are his main earphones that he does use on a regular basis.  I'd be curious to see a SA6 vs SA6R to see if there are audible differences due to the new housing and possibly minor tweaks and of course how the SA7 stacks up against, well, everything else out there


 
 Ah, that would be great. It'd be very nice to cross the RE262 off my list.
   
   

 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> I don't really expect a company to send demo hardware.


 
  Don't be so sure - Sleek is a small company with roots in the audio community and even large corporations like Etymotic sometimes comply with samples (though it took them 6 months to get me an MC5). I certainly don't expect any demo hardware from anyone but it benefits both the community and my aching wallet (did I mention that I bought the Monster Lil' Jamz and Skullcandy FMJ recently? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) and some seem to understand that.


 Quote:


inks said:


> Lol comparing the RE252 to the RE262 will be like comparing DBAs to the DDMs.


   
  Well, I'm guessing people are more interested in aspects of the sound aside from frequency response and balance. There are some underlying properties that could be very similar if the hardware is related - driver speed, throw, thickness of note, etc etc.
  
  Quote:


inks said:


> Let me add the EQ5 and the second dual driver iem from Radius. Those are the last ones I'm looking forward to because they're the next step of new technologies that were just introduced.


 
 Yep, definitely interested in those as well. I've also got some of the lower-end Radius earphones coming in though they seem to be MIA at the moment.


 Quote:


a_recording said:


> It's kind of curious that there are even new technologies being developed in IEMs when it seems like full tower speaker and headphone technology seems to be relatively resolved. (Using big dynamic drivers... I'm assuming that horns lost their debate, and ribbon tweeters and flat panel technologies don't seem to have taken off.) The craziest thing I've seen in a while are the Sony PFR's, which seemed to have flopped.
> Meanwhile IEM's are going from balance armature to dynamic drivers, to hybrid moving armature drivers, quadruple driver universals and dual drive dynamics - all these attempts to overcome shortcomings in a relatively immature market. I think we have portable audio to thank for that.
> 
> Personally I'm looking forward to the new DDM's and the X-Jays. I'm particularly surprised that the X-Jays haven't been released yet...


 
 Hey don't knock the PFRs! They're very interesting... when they work. I really need to get mine fixed. I asked Peter@Jays about the x-JAYS recently and he was not forthcoming with info about release date, pricing, etc so I assume we'll have to wait substantially longer.
  
   
  Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Well, remember, IEMs have to fit in your ear canal.


 
 Yeah, tell that to FAD 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
   
  On a completely unrelated note, imageshack has decided that my picture of the Phonak PFEs was not worth preserving and lost it in a system crash. I also lost my backup of that photo a while ago so if anyone has access to a set of PFEs and is willing to take a replacement picture for me (in the usual manner - close-up with shells and 3.5mm plug) I would be very grateful.


----------



## mvw2

I don't mind a manufacturer waiting.  I like it when a company actually tries and takes their time with a product to get it right instead of just trying to get something into market as quick as possible.


----------



## Djiem

Wow, what an absolutely outstanding review thread.
   
  Could i please request that you review a pair of " SHURE SCL2"  IEM's  please.
   
  i am very interested in how they are as i am debating between those and a few others.
   
  thanks


----------



## pinoyman

oh hi joker...
  any news on the *miles davis* review???
  hehehe...
  im still waiting.. please do take your time. and ill just wait here till you post them and before i pull the trigger on purchasing it.
   





miles...miles...miles!


----------



## Inks

Quote:*Joker*


> I think that the M1 is both more comfy and better-built than the SB overall, but only slightly. The cable is strong even though it lacks strain relief and the shells are time-tested (read: ancient design) on the M1. They are a bit larger than the SB in diameter but rounded at the front and the nozzle is a little longer. Plus they sound good with bi-flange tips which means the housing never really touches my ear when I wear them. For sound though I'd have to say the SB has a leg up in many aspects. It's the more spacious-sounding of the two, has better extension on either end, and seems to have slightly better dynamics (though the M1 is still very impressive). I have to say that because the note of the SB is a bit 'rounded', the M1 does sound more crisp, especially in the midrange. Strings have the right 'twang' and piano notes actually have impact. I think Inks might be able to do a better sound comparison than I since he's had my M1s for a while and has definitely spent time comparing the two
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  x2 spot on. Funny how that comparison regarding the sound sounds like one I would've done, which leaves me with only a bit more to say. First, get ready for a much bigger/more extended bass. It might seem bass heavy at times compared to the M1s but upon notice, it's a very controlled bass that manages to give off just the right amount of warmth. The midrange is less forward than the M1s but it sounds more lush yet very clear and smooth like the M1s. Treble extension is better on the SBs but the sparkle of the M1s is up par so you'll just be getting more micro-detail. The soundstage was actually deeper on the M1s for me but the SBs soundstage still manages to sound bigger because of it's combination of good depth and height. Good transparency comes hand in hand with it's soundstage because you'll notice each instrument has more air to breathe whereas the M1s tend to do a more layered sound.


----------



## Jozurr

What I'm really worried about is the weight of the SBs you mentioned in the review. The Brainwavz M1 is borderline comfortable for me. I don't think any more weight or increase in size would be comfortable for my small ear canals. I also sleep in them so that's another factor. 
   
  Also if you have the DBA-02 and the Brainwavz M1, can you please post a picture of them side by side so I can see what the size of the DBA-02 is compared to the M1?
   
  Edit: One more question. When someone says the mids are "recessed" does that mean the opposite of the mids as compared to the PL30 and the M1? Mids are basically where the electric guitars and vocals are right?
   


> Quote:
> 
> 
> jozurr said:
> ...


----------



## kendric

Quote: 





pinoyman said:


> oh hi joker...
> any news on the *miles davis* review???
> hehehe...
> im still waiting.. please do take your time. and ill just wait here till you post them and before i pull the trigger on purchasing it.
> ...


 

 Hope it will be a good one, My MDs are plugged into my ears at the very moment now =D , Haven totally burned in though, And i still have the e-Q7 (Moving Coil BA maybe need burn in unlike normal BA???) and the 100 hours for FA-003, heard that FA-003 undergoes big transformation after 100hrs of burn-in for the better, cant wait but urgh i only have 1 zen x-fi player so burn in wil have to take turns one by one.


----------



## Inks

Jozurr I sleep with the SBs just fine because they don't stick out much with deep insertion. But they are going to feel noticeably heavier and even thought I too have small ears I'm not sure everyone is going to be able to insert them the way I do. I have also tried the DBAs which in the ear, are barely visible like the M1s, but expect to experiment with tips because they require a much deeper insertion.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Monster Miles Davis Tribute.
  
  Quote: 





djiem said:


> Wow, what an absolutely outstanding review thread.
> 
> Could i please request that you review a pair of " SHURE SCL2"  IEM's  please.
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks. Regarding Shure IEMs, the question was just asked a page or two back (perhaps I should put the answer on the front page). Truth is, I went through a couple of Shure in-ears before this thread was even in its infancy and have never felt the desire to go back to budget-oriented Shures. I was especially underwhelmed with my Shure E4c (aka SCL4) though I've no idea how the SCL2 compares.

  
  Quote: 





pinoyman said:


> oh hi joker...
> any news on the *miles davis* review???
> hehehe...
> im still waiting.. please do take your time. and ill just wait here till you post them and before i pull the trigger on purchasing it.
> ...


 

 Done 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I wanted to wait until my Monster Lil' Jamz review was finished to post the Monster MD one but that'll probably take another week or so. Can't argue with demand 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





jozurr said:


> What I'm really worried about is the weight of the SBs you mentioned in the review. The Brainwavz M1 is borderline comfortable for me. I don't think any more weight or increase in size would be comfortable for my small ear canals. I also sleep in them so that's another factor.
> 
> Also if you have the DBA-02 and the Brainwavz M1, can you please post a picture of them side by side so I can see what the size of the DBA-02 is compared to the M1?
> 
> Edit: One more question. When someone says the mids are "recessed" does that mean the opposite of the mids as compared to the PL30 and the M1? Mids are basically where the electric guitars and vocals are right?


 
   
  While the SB is a bit longer than the M1, the housings aren't as wide so they may be more comfortable for deeper insertion (which is what Inks seems to be doing). I don't think I could sleep in the SB (at least not on my side) since I favor a shallower insertion with those shells. 
   
  Sadly I don't have the DBA-02 anymore but fit issues aren't as likely with it due to the angled-nozzle design. 
   
  As for recessed mids, they are indeed the opposite of what the M1 (and to a lesser extent the PL30) possess but (in the case of the Silver Bullets) not by much. Midrange typically refers to the 300hz-5khz range or thereabouts.


----------



## Inks

Nice review and nice pic, the only thing missing is the fact that you also get the Kind of Blue legacy edition 2 disc set.


----------



## rawrster

I thought the CD's and such were taken out of the package since it stopped being a limited edition


----------



## pinoyman

yehey!!!
  an MD review!!!!
   
  thank you very much bro joker!


----------



## Inks

Nah the second revision still gets the CDs, at least I did. I kind of miss these but I'm looking forward to Audio Technica's new dynamic flagship (ATH-CKM-99). I'll have enough by the time of their release, but if that doesn't work out I'm going back to these.


----------



## esanthosh

@joker,
   
  Since I don't have MTPG / MTPC for reference, how would you compare MDs to DDM?


----------



## pinoyman

bro joker...
  can you recommend an amp that is best for the MDs without being bulky, but a really great performer yet portable one?
   
  thanks!


----------



## Inks

Anaxilus gets good results with the arrow, but if you want to spend less the T3D/T3 also does fairly well because it contrasts it's signature. The arrow is a much better amp thought, i'm sure.


----------



## pinoyman

hey inks, 
  can i connect the arrow straight with the ipod classic?
  can i ask how? i mean what wires to use...or does it already include the wires for the ipod connection.
   
  i wonder...what does this amp do???
  does it change the sound?
   
  i am thinking if maybe the amp may help me boost the sound of my ue700 dual BA driver....and thinking of buying the MDs that belonged to you...which is now currently being sold to me by bro cory gillmore.


----------



## Inks

You need an LOD, fiio sells some budget ones that work well. The amp with the LOD will bypass the Classic's internal amp for the Arrow's, so it will change the sound sig and improve it.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





jozurr said:


>


 
   
  On the M1 size v. DBA.  The DBA is smaller and I wear them deep insertion a la Etymotic.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Nice review and nice pic, the only thing missing is the fact that you also get the Kind of Blue legacy edition 2 disc set.


 

 Hmm.. it's not listed on Monster's site under accessories. I guess it's not an accessory per se but they do list a 'Headphone Test CD' on there.


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> @joker,
> 
> Since I don't have MTPG / MTPC for reference, how would you compare MDs to DDM?


 

 Sure. The DDM has similarly detailed and textured bass but never sounds excessive while the MD _can_ sound overly bassy (for my tastes). The MDs have slightly longer decay but actually seem to resolve a little better. Pretty sure their drivers are closely related to Turbine Pro drivers which are quite quick for moving coil transducers. In the midrange the MD is possibly even more fluid than the DDM. The MD is also more forward, to the point of sounding a bit intimate with vocals, etc. Part of it stems from the fact that the DDM has a pretty wide soundstage while the MD... doesn't. Still conveys a good sense of space though. Good layering, too. Treble-wise both are non-intrusive. The MD extends just a bit further but the DDM has better air. I'd also say that the MD has a greater power dependence - the DDM improved only slightly with my mini3 when using a weak player like the ipod shuffle 2g. 

  
  Quote: 





pinoyman said:


> bro joker...
> can you recommend an amp that is best for the MDs without being bulky, but a really great performer yet portable one?
> 
> thanks!


 

 I don't really have much experience with the amps that are currently popular. I'm not really an amp person and have been happy with my iBasso T4/D10 for more than a year now. Only use them when I have to, anyway. I tried the MD with those plus my mini3 and Rocoon RC-2 and the Fiio E7 I normally use with my notebook. I don't really consider the D10 or E7 portable but among the others I'd say RC-2 > mini3 > T4. With portability factored in the T4 would win every time though. I don't know anything about the Arrow or Pico Slim or whatever the latest word in portable amp technology is.

  
  Quote: 





pinoyman said:


> hey inks,
> can i connect the arrow straight with the ipod classic?
> can i ask how? i mean what wires to use...or does it already include the wires for the ipod connection.
> 
> ...


 

 Inks is right - you need an LOD. You can probably pick one up on ebay for ~$20-30 but the Fiio ones work too. Of course you can connect an amp to the headphone out but then you'll be double-amping the signal which is not recommended. I don't think a single amp will work wonders with both the UE700 and MD. The UE700 is very cold-sounding and would need a warm amp (or none at all - improvements are minimal). The MD benefits from something more neutral or even slightly treble-heavy. Skylab's portable amp thread might be worth reading; not sure if he's updated it lately though.


----------



## Anaxilus

Great review Joker.  That pretty much summarized exactly how I hear the MDs in their own right and versus their brethren and competition.  Apart from SQ and signature you hit the nail on the head as to why I still keep and will continue to keep the MDs in my arsenal.  They do so much right and offer so much versatility beyond just being a 'checkbox' IEM w/ respect to SQ benchmarking.  I seriously could not find one point of contention in your review of the MDs.  Well, except I think the MDs have a better housing construction w/o that linear parting line on the Golds and Coppers.  Small potatos.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Btw, did you ever use the Meelec Bi Flanges?  I noticed the tips in the picture but I know you have used the MeeBif's before.  Yes, I just said MeeBif.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Man, thanks again for what you do here.  You are one of the Head-Fiers that hears the DBA, CK10, DDM, Monsters, etc. like I do.  Having you as a resource saves so much time and money for a lot of us.  Much thanks Joker!!


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sure. The DDM has similarly detailed and textured bass but never sounds excessive while the MD _can_ sound overly bass (for my tastes). The MDs have slightly longer decay but actually seem to resolve a little better. Pretty sure their drivers are closely related to Turbine Pro drivers which are quite quick for moving coil transducers. In the midrange the MD is possibly even more fluid than the DDM. The MD is also more forward, to the point of sounding a bit intimate with vocals, etc. Part of it stems from the fact that the DDM has a pretty wide soundstage while the MD... doesn't. Still conveys a good sense of space though. Good layering, too. Treble-wise both are non-intrusive. The MD extends just a bit further but the DDM has better air. I'd also say that the MD has a greater power dependence - the DDM improved only slightly with my mini3 when using a weak player like the ipod shuffle 2g.


 

 x2 w/ everything said in that post.


----------



## Stalwart

ljokerl
   
  great review of the MD!
   
  Although it is truly a good IEM, I consider its design to be a "bit" too shiny...
  actually it is fair to say that this is not limited to the MD, but also relates
  to the Coppers and especially to the Golds.
   
  I recognize that it is a personal preference, but if you look to the other top tiers,
  they have more "neutral" look, and that's for a reason...
   
  Anyways I wanted to ask you something in relation to the observation you made
  i.e. "Driver flex is among the lowest among all dynamic IEMs (in contrast to the MTPC)"
   
  If I understand correctly you get driver flex with the MD, but not as high as the Coppers.
  Could you elaborate more on that observation? I wonder how you classify what is low
  and high driver flex?
   
  I find truly annoying the driver flex on my right bud of the Coppers, and more specifically
  the vacuum that occurs and the constant fight to get it right, and at the end I'm still not
  sure whether I'm getting equal/even sound response from both buds due to the precise
  fitting.
   
  Honestly, I didn't think that high class IEMs could have such an issue, but the more I go
  into it, the more evidence I encounter - people reporting the same with the Golds, IE8,
  and especially with the Coppers... and now the MD too. Correct me if I'm wrong, but
  if a particular unit experience such an issue, shouldn't be regarded as defective in regard
  to the fact that a great deal of the other units produced don't have it? There are reports
  of people sending back such an IEM and getting a replacement that doesn't have it i.e.
  it all comes to the particular unit and as I see it it is more of a quality control issue.


----------



## Anaxilus

@ Stalwart.  I'd recommend trying something like the Meelec Bi flanges.  Much easier and consistent fit.  Brings the bass and treble in line although not sure if the treble might get a bit too bright w/ the larger aperture on the Coppers.  I think the Coppers were tuned w/ the Supertips in mind and the rest of the lineup inherited the same tips for obvious reasons.  The benefit of the larger bi flanges also is it makes insertion depth and fit cake by spacing them away consistently.  This will help w/ flex and vacuum a bit as its also more progressive upon insertion.  If you have a vacuum problem still, pull up on your upper ear and open your mouth before you pull them out.


----------



## Inks

I think they include the Kind of Blue cds as a surprise gift. Thus, they just label it as a headphone-test cd(s).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Btw, did you ever use the Meelec Bi Flanges?  I noticed the tips in the picture but I know you have used the MeeBif's before.  Yes, I just said MeeBif.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   

 Thanks, appreciate the kind words. I do like the Meelec biflanges (the soft gray 'balanced' ones) on many earphones but the Turbines are a bit too heavy to be used with longer tips for me since I prefer a shallower insertion with them. The housings end up exerting a bit of torque on my ears and can sometimes break seal. Sound-wise they are fine though - very similar to the shorter Sennheiser bi-flanges.


 Quote:


stalwart said:


> ljokerl
> 
> great review of the MD!
> 
> ...


 

  Thanks. The Miles Davis can indeed be a bit ostentatious but I didn't notice any particular glances in my direction when I used them. In the end an IEM is really not that visible out in public so it's not a big deal - I got many more sideways glances the two or three times I wore the wooden Kanen KM880s out in public or my zebra-padded Earpollution Nerve Pipes.
   
  You are correct in understanding that I think the MD has less driver flex than the Coppers. There's really no good way of quantifying driver flex other than in relative intensity and how much it 'bothers' you. I separate it into four tiers. Tier 0 consists of earphones that I cannot coax any flex from no matter how hard I try. From memory this includes the JVC FXC50/80, Head-Direct RE252, Yuin OK1, FS Atrios, Phiaton PS210 and a couple of others. Tier 1 would be earphones that sometimes flex mildly upon insertion but stay quiet at all other times. Of course flex can be coaxed out of them manually. Most dynamic belong to this category, including the IE8s, Golds, MDs, Panasonic HJE900s, Brainwavz M1/M2, etc etc. Tier 2 would be earphones that flex noticeably on insertion and again on removal. This would include the Coppers, Thinksound TS01/TS02, Xears TD100. And finally Tier 3 would be extreme offenders that flex as I walk from changing air pressure. These are usually very cheap models with thin driver membranes (e.g. Kanen MD-51, JLabs J3...).
   
  If I had to rank the driver flex of Monster earphones on a comparative scale from greatest to least, it would look like this:
   
  Coppers >> MDs >= Golds
   
  IMO driver flex is just a side effect of using dynamic drivers in sealed chambers. Of course driver coating and diameter have a huge impact on how much something flexes. I'm tempted to say that uneven flex on either side of a set of earphones should be regarded as a defect but there's varying ear geometry to account for as well.


----------



## Stalwart

Anaxilus,
   
  thank you for the recommendation.
   
  However I don't have any fit issues, I get pretty good seal.
  The annoyance comes from the driver flex of the right bud.
   
   
ljoker, 
   
  appreciate the time you spare for elaborating more on the issue.
   
  I understand that driver flex could be classified as side effect like
  you said. But if some units have it while others don't I tend to think
  that it is a defect (especially noticeable when just one of the buds
  has it). Apparently it is hard to spot it on the production line, and
  I guess more work is needed in that area.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> anaxilus said:
> ...


 

  Ah...I see.  My phonak ear guides take the brunt of the weight.  Anyone sending you a 262?


----------



## Photofan1986

Many thanks for the Herculean job you do here, Joker!
  Really, big thumbs up! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I'm looking forward to your SM3 review! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Cheers


----------



## rawrster

Saves money..I think not  I think this thread makes wallet lighter for the most part than heavier with some exceptions of course. I think for the most part my wallet is safe when reading the first page on this thread.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Saves money..I think not  I think this thread makes wallet lighter for the most part than heavier with some exceptions of course. I think for the most part my wallet is safe when reading the first page on this thread.


 

 Well, the forum is like a torrential flood.  Jokers thread is like shoveling dirt into the Mississippi.  At least it's trying.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Ah...I see.  My phonak ear guides take the brunt of the weight.  Anyone sending you a 262?


   

 Yep, rawrster is probably this thread's greatest benefactor 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Should be getting it soon.


 Quote:


photofan1986 said:


> Many thanks for the Herculean job you do here, Joker!
> Really, big thumbs up!
> 
> 
> ...


   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. SM3 will probably take a little while as I have to re-scale my internal rating system for it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Well, the forum is like a torrential flood.  Jokers thread is like shoveling dirt into the Mississippi.  At least it's trying.


 
 Yes, if I managed to save someone a couple of bucks on not buying a pile of garbage like the Grado iGi, I'll consider that a resounding success. And of course brining good but lesser-known models to view is always satisfying.


----------



## rawrster

That's a good point. This thread does make some lesser known models (esp to those who are not regular head-fi members such as Sound Magic and other small companies) better known. One of my favorite was the PL30 before I gave that away and I would have never known about it if I wasn't a head-fi member. I imagine most just looking for a good budget earphone would know a bit less about the market than I do.


----------



## esanthosh

This thread is actually both a wallet thinner as well as a wallet saver. Because of joker's reviews, I have too many IEMs, but they all vary in signature. And, I would not own something like a Xears TD-100 if it's not been for the relative SQ rating here. I looked past threads discussing Playaz models many times before that. It's a great resource for someone like me who cannot audition / loan IEMs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## macrocheesium

Where can you buy the "UE Single-flange" tips that you mention? I searched around but I couldn't find any UE tips.
   
  Also looking forward to the MC5 review!


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Haha now that does sound interesting! Does this mean you are liking what you are hearing? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  PS: I'll PM you about you reviewing my RE-262s.


----------



## airwax

Joker is one lucky guy. Getting to review and test all those amazing IEMs. Thanks for sharing your thoughts to the community.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


macrocheesium said:


> Where can you buy the "UE Single-flange" tips that you mention? I searched around but I couldn't find any UE tips.
> 
> Also looking forward to the MC5 review!


 
 UE is just shorthand for Ultimate Ears. When I say 'UE Single-Flange' I mean these 'squared-off' silicone tips, not the rounded clear tips that they are using now:
   


 It seems that Logitech is trying to phase out replacement silicone cushions and instead force people to buy Complys, though. Best place to buy these particular tips would probably be on the sale forum here. 
   
   
  Quote:


hero kid said:


> Haha now that does sound interesting! Does this mean you are liking what you are hearing?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   
  Yes, yes it does. Thanks for the PM 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
  Quote:


airwax said:


> Joker is one lucky guy. Getting to review and test all those amazing IEMs. Thanks for sharing your thoughts to the community.


 
 You say lucky, I say stark raving mad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Glad the thread was useful though.


----------



## reginaldnugroho

Hi...
 I'm looking to find an IEM to pair up with my blackberry, right now I'm using the sony ex-300...

 I am almost about to jump the gun with the Head-direct RE-0 but looking at the 64ohm made me think again, so i think posting a question here is the wisest thing to do...

 Joker mention that "the high impedance is deceiving" but I'm still not sure if this applies when pairing them up with blackberry...
 It also made me think should I  just save up and go for the RE-ZERO which only use 16ohm, but with the price tag $110 in ebay... Not too great...

 Anyone has experience pairing re-0/zero with blackberry?
 or does anyone has experience pairing an IEM with blackberry... My budget is around $90...

 Cheers everybody...


----------



## Inks

The Thinksound TS02 will be one to consider especially since it has a mic. It's a nice all-rounder that doesn't have a big glaring weakness imo.


----------



## rawrster

Loaners are not always a good thing. The more expensive ones tempt you into buying them if you like it enough  I almost bought some of the earphones that have been loaned out to me.,
   
  I've tried out my TS02+mic with a blackberry and it works well..it was only for testing purposes however as I like the sound of my J3 much better.


----------



## macrocheesium

Ok, thanks joker. I knew what UE meant, but I couldn't find anywhere to buy them. I'll have a look at the sales forum.


----------



## SpikedJuice

Goddamn. ljokerl - you've just pushed me over the edge in grabbing some Monster Turbine Pro Miles Davis Tributes.
   
  I'm out of cash.


----------



## EraserXIV

I know prices are changing all the time, but there are two updates I particularly think should be taken note of. The Custom 3 can now be bought for $99 off of eBay from Adorama Camera, also, the HJE900 can be found for $80 from JR now. These are two massive price drops on two already great set of IEMs, it just sweetens the deal almost to the point of "you'd be foolish not to try it" territory.


----------



## SolidSnake3

interesting to see that the Miles Davis appear to be a sort of hybrid of the Coppers and Gold's. They seem to be pulling a bit from both IEM's like the bass of the golds for instance.


----------



## Stalwart

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> Ok, thanks joker. I knew what UE meant, but I couldn't find anywhere to buy them. I'll have a look at the sales forum.


 


      macrocheesiu, 
      take a look here - http://buy.logitech.com/store/logib2c/en_US/DisplayCategoryProductListPage/categoryid.27807000?WT.ac=sc|downloads||dd


----------



## kendric

Yup, I feel that MDs seems to be a epitome of balance borned after Monster Cables researches the views and feedbacks from their Golds and Coppers which fundamentalizes the team's direction when they tried to engineer and create the Miles Davis, At Least thats what i think personally. Just my 2 cents of personal opinion =]


----------



## Pianist

It's interesting how you rate q-jays above RE0 in sound quality. Could you provide a brief explanation of why you think q-jays sound better overall? I think RE0 actually has an edge over the q-jays technically when well amped. Q-jays also improve with amping but not as much.


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





stalwart said:


> macrocheesiu,       take a look here - http://buy.logitech.com/store/logib2c/en_US/DisplayCategoryProductListPage/categoryid.27807000?WT.ac=sc|downloads||dd


 


  Even better! Do you know if they have a multi-size set? I'd hate to waste $20 finding the right size.


----------



## MastahRiz

This review thread is quite possibly the best thing on the entire interwebs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


reginaldnugroho said:


> Hi...
> I'm looking to find an IEM to pair up with my blackberry, right now I'm using the sony ex-300...
> 
> I am almost about to jump the gun with the Head-direct RE-0 but looking at the 64ohm made me think again, so i think posting a question here is the wisest thing to do...
> ...


 
  Not sure about the blackberry but my Nokia E63 does okay with the RE0 - not great but not unusable, either. At least the impedance helps cut down on the terrible hiss. If you're tempted to go for something more efficient the Ety MC5 might do the trick - they're efficient enough to work fine but yet not so sensitive that they will reveal a bucketload of hiss. If you want something with controls the Maximo iP-HS5 is worth a look assuming you're after a more balanced sound.
   
   
  Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> I know prices are changing all the time, but there are two updates I particularly think should be taken note of. The Custom 3 can now be bought for $99 off of eBay from Adorama Camera, also, the HJE900 can be found for $80 from JR now. These are two massive price drops on two already great set of IEMs, it just sweetens the deal almost to the point of "you'd be foolish not to try it" territory.


   
  Yeah, fair point. I won't be able to move them to the proper price tiers though but I can definitely update the price (and maybe the value scores)
   

  Quote:


pianist said:


> It's interesting how you rate q-jays above RE0 in sound quality. Could you provide a brief explanation of why you think q-jays sound better overall? I think RE0 actually has an edge over the q-jays technically when well amped. Q-jays also improve with amping but not as much.


   
  Well, I feel that the q-JAYS have an edge in some areas. Even when amped, for example, the RE0 simply doesn't have the bass emphasis to put out as much detail and texture at the low end as the q-JAYS can. Both sound a little dry and terse and the RE0 has a slight edge in smoothness and treble microdetail IMO but sounds a bit leaner than the q-JAYS do. RE0 also sounds more neutral, almost desaturated in tone, while the q-JAYS are just colored enough to be enjoyable. Obviously YMMV as it depends on what you value most. I can see how it's a toss-up in technical proficiency but I feel that the q-JAYS have the edge for the average listener.


 Quote:


mastahriz said:


> This review thread is quite possibly the best thing on the entire interwebs.


 
 Thanks


----------



## reginaldnugroho

Thank you JOKER...
   
  Last question... If i go for the RE-ZERO is that a wise choice..? cause MC5 is about $10 away from RE-ZERO and both are 16ohm... if the RE-ZERO has better sound quality I'd prefer to save up...
   
  cheers...
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> reginaldnugroho said:
> ...


----------



## Stalwart

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> Even better! Do you know if they have a multi-size set? I'd hate to waste $20 finding the right size.


 

  
      Not that I know of... but you can always call and ask them.
    
      However as you can guess they are pretty standard, and I can confirm that
      i.e. medium is the tip size I use for my IEMs, thus I got medium from these and
      they fit perfectly.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


reginaldnugroho said:


> Last question... If i go for the RE-ZERO is that a wise choice..? cause MC5 is about $10 away from RE-ZERO and both are 16ohm... if the RE-ZERO has better sound quality I'd prefer to save up...


 

  If you can live with the adapter and maximum isolation is not a priority, yes. Personally I prefer the RE-ZERO to the MC5, albeit not by a huge margin.


----------



## tyrael

Looking forward to your IE7 review


----------



## kendric

Looking forward to your LiL Jamz Review, though JamZ sounds different from LiL JamZ as i have heard from others but Normal JamZ are pretty bang-for-bucks even though i sold them to tide my thin wallet from buying the MD =)


----------



## TheMaestro335

Looking forward to the MC5 review! These things sound amazing with a T3.


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





reginaldnugroho said:


> Hi...
> I'm looking to find an IEM to pair up with my blackberry, right now I'm using the sony ex-300...
> 
> I am almost about to jump the gun with the Head-direct RE-0 but looking at the 64ohm made me think again, so i think posting a question here is the wisest thing to do...
> ...


 
  I use both a Blackberry 8310 (Curve) and iPod Classic as my sources, and find that the BB is very slightly less warm/bassy than the iPod, so it sounds better with a warmer IEM. Power-wise, the volume adjustment is identical between the two for the same cuts (about 60% with my signature IEMs).
   
  I'd suggest the Thinksound TS02+mic as a good pairing with the BB if you can stretch you budget $10 or so (from the reviews I've read here - no personal experience). You'd have the phone capabilities with that IEM, and the pushbutton remote is much more convenient than the BB play/pause/forward/reverse controls. BTW, my NuForce NE-7M are 12 ohm, and they worked fine with the BB.
   
  I love the Fischer DBA-02 with either source, and the RE-ZERO has been described as similar in signature to the DBA.


----------



## Klaasje

Wow, I love dedication like this. Thanks for the hard work Joker. I've been reading for some time on Head-Fi now but this thread made me post.
  Any idea on when you'll update your OP again? I'll base my next buy on it. Thanks!


----------



## Marcus_C

I shall be watching this thread for updates now, seeing as you have two of my most recent acquisitions in for review at the moment. I've had the W2's for about 3 weeks now and I received Benny's sm3s today. I'm interested to read your thoughts. Also I loved the MD review, even though I'm now firmly convinced they're not for me that was very descriptive and objective. As a person who has never heard them but has owned quite a few earphones it's very easy to appreciate how they'll sound. Thanks for you dedication in this thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kendric said:


> Looking forward to your LiL Jamz Review, though JamZ sounds different from LiL JamZ as i have heard from others but Normal JamZ are pretty bang-for-bucks even though i sold them to tide my thin wallet from buying the MD =)


 
 I have to say that the Lil' Jamz has very little in common with the sound of the Turbine line. I'd never have guessed it a Monster earphone from the sound alone - maybe JVC or Denon but not Monster.


 Quote:


marcus_c said:


> I shall be watching this thread for updates now, seeing as you have two of my most recent acquisitions in for review at the moment. I've had the W2's for about 3 weeks now and I received Benny's sm3s today. I'm interested to read your thoughts. Also I loved the MD review, even though I'm now firmly convinced they're not for me that was very descriptive and objective. As a person who has never heard them but has owned quite a few earphones it's very easy to appreciate how they'll sound. Thanks for you dedication in this thread.


 
  Thanks, good to hear that the thread has the potential to save money as well. Westone 2 is in the works, might be part of the next update (unless I muster up the courage for a go at the Skullcandy FMJ and Sony XB40EX). SM3 will take longer as it's not fitting into my scoring framework very well.


----------



## kendric

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> kendric said:
> ...


 


  Yes! I don't know how's it for lil jamz but for jamz when you compare them to the turbines, These definitely don't have sonic specs on par, but yet the JAMz seems to tell you that he don't tries as hard as the turbines, but still delivers with delight, making it like a crisp breath of fresh air when you compare JAMz's sound signature to the Turbines.
   
  Just my 2 cents of opinion~


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> SM3 will take longer as it's not fitting into my scoring framework very well.


 

 Lol.  The SM3 paradox.  Anax's scoring matrix:
   
  Do I like this iem?  Maybe.
  Should I?  Probably.
  Will I?  Magic 8-Ball says, "The future is uncertain."


----------



## Inks

I don't get it...


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> I don't get it...


 

 Exactly


----------



## Jozurr

Maybe you can increase the SQ rating threshold to 15 instead of 10 =P
   
  Can't wait for the westone 1 and 2. Would be a great help if you post it early.. thank you in advance. This thread is a huge help.


----------



## rawrster

I think if that happens the SM3 review will never appear  I look forward to the SM3 review although I have no interest in buying them it would be nice to hear an opinion from someone who tends to hear similar to myself.


----------



## Confispect

Curious as well, on these and the SM2's


----------



## Anaxilus

I honestly can't believe Joker hears the SM3 being better than all the others.  I doubt the 1-10 scale is the issue, lol.  Perhaps the overall rating would be an issue w/ the cost and build quality pulling down the score too much.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







  I could be wrong.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I honestly can't believe Joker hears the SM3 being better than all the others.  I doubt the 1-10 scale is the issue, lol.  Perhaps the overall rating would be an issue w/ the cost and build quality pulling down the score too much.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Or it could be an issue of presentation (and personal preference) versus objective sound quality. I think he rated the um3x a little like that, where though objective SQ was high, value was low due to the odd delivery and signature.


----------



## ethan961

I'm going to take a stab and add that it may be that there are simply too many 10/10s and the original point of the 10/10 was to show the best that he had heard up to that point. Of course, only |joker| knows.


----------



## Anaxilus

We should start a 'How does Joker think' thread, lol.


----------



## kendric

LOL Then it shall be named "Joker's Neuro + Psychology Anatomy Thread"


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> We should start a 'How does Joker think' thread, lol.


   
  No need - ethan pretty much nailed it. Although if you did want to venture there, I must warn you that it's a dark and dangerous place filled with numbers and diagrams. My mindset is of the mathematical sort.

  
  Quote:


ethan961 said:


> I'm going to take a stab and add that it may be that there are simply too many 10/10s and the original point of the 10/10 was to show the best that he had heard up to that point. Of course, only |joker| knows.


 
 Indeed. The inherent problem with a rating like 10/10 is that it implies perfection. In the absence of perfection I have to make a decision on what is valued most in an earphone and that's extremely subjective. The problem with the CK10, CK100, DBA-02, etc is that it is not difficult to imagine a listener who will absolutely hate each one of them, for different reasons of course. The DBA-02 seems to be slightly less polarizing thus far, perhaps because people are finally doing research before jumping on the bandwagon or perhaps because only those who are convinced that it's the one to buy are patient enough with all of the shortages and delays. Regardless, the CK10 is a perfect example - I think the split is around 60/40 in favor of 'hate' vs. 'love' for the CK10 and I, of all people, can easily see why. For all of the things the CK10 (CK100, DBA-02,, UM3X, IE8, TF10 etc) does better than any other earphone, it takes one or two risks with its sound. With the CK10 that would be the 'hot' treble and lack of fleshiness to its sound but it varies from earphone to earphone. 
   
  With the SM3 it's different - I can see someone finding another earphone preferable to the SM3 but I can't see anyone absolutely hating it. In the case of the SM3, the lack of weaknesses is its greatest strength. In that sense, I can't see any earphone that I've heard aside from the SM3 earning a 10/10 - and especially not the current trio, each flawed in its own way. It really doesn't matter what I think about it in the context of my personal (analytical) listening preferences.


----------



## kendric

Perhaps give it a 10/10 (*) --- Just like Exams has two grades of Ace - A and an A+ Distinction, Which the SM3 Falls into xD


----------



## Anaxilus

I figured as much Joker.  You set up your scoring criteria to compensate for signature preferences which was the right way to go for sure.  I can easily see the SM3 getting 10/10.  Is it an 11/10?  Not IMO.  The SM3 is like the 530 in a way to my ears.  They are both phones that check the boxes.  Call them benchmark phones if you will.  They do nothing terribly wrong, yet for me neither was particularly engaging for various reasons.  It's easy to say these do such and such very well.  The question is whether the absence of evil equates to the presence of good.  Is it enough.  Up to you, it's your test.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Hope that makes sense.  It's late.


----------



## SpecialJ

I partly blame joker for me buying SE535s. If he had reviewed them and said that they weren't that great... My curiosity got the best of me.


----------



## DKaz

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The inherent problem with a rating like 10/10 is that it implies perfection.


 
   
  Yes, but this thread goes to eleven!


----------



## mvw2

I agree with Joker's approach.  You have to realize it gets very hard to quantify these high level earphones.  Low quality products are easy.  They're largely flawed, largely limited, and just plain do things wrong.  It's easy to pick out the problems.  Once you get up to these very good products, they just don't have those flaws or limitations.  A lot of the ranking instead can go down a dangerous road, subjectivity, something we don't want when we're trying to be as unbiased as possible.  In the end, all we have are flaws, and they get pretty minuscule by the time we get to these high end products. 
   
  Perfection, at least as close as we can get to it, comes down to finding the products that do the least wrong.  These typically are not amazing products.  They don't have the wow factor or special gearing.  Why is the RE0 so popular?  Because it does so little wrong.  It's not a great earphone.  It's not an "oh my god this is the most amazing thing I've ever heard" kind of product.  It simply doesn't do anything terribly wrong.  Back when I owned a pair, I hated it.  I so wanted it to be better than it was, but it simply wasn't.  It was far from my preference and fell short in some areas like sound stage and dynamics.  However, it didn't do that much wrong, and it is such a well liked product because of that.  Despite my preference, I see great value in the RE0 because it doesn't do a lot of wrong. 
   
  I've read reviews on the SM3.  I know the sound signature without EQing isn't what I'm looking for.  However its popularity is there because it doesn't do much wrong.  It's not an earphone like the IE8 or SE530 where you have this wow effect.  You don't have this monstrous bass and huge sound stage like the IE8 that just blows you away when you first listen to it.  You don't have the butter smooth mids of the SE530 that have you saying these are the best mids I've ever heard.  You don't see people saying specifics about the SM3 like that.  At the same time you also don't hear people complaining about a bunch of flaws.  I think the worst I've read relates to the frequency response being bassy, dark.  Ok, well that's gearing.  If the earphone can play the frequencies competently, you can't count it as a flaw.  Another comment was level of detail versus the UM3X, an obvious rival.  Ok, is it a flaw or just a gearing?  Is it missing information or is it simply presenting the details more subtlety?  This is the difference between gearing and flaw.  It's a small difference but a big deal.  In the end if the earphone simply doesn't do anything wrong, you just can't score against it.  It may not be your ideal, maybe not even close, but if it's not flawed, it's not flawed.
   
  Like Joker said, a lot of these other earphones have absolute flaws in some way.  The CK10 has from what I got from pink noise testing a 9dB narrow spike at 10kHz that is a pretty significant issue that shows through with many songs.  Foam tips help, but EQing is the only way you really deal with it well.  Plus you can add that little bit on the bottom end to counter the role off below 50Hz (what my ears hear).  It had gotten a 10/10 because frankly it does so much right.  Speed, texture, dynamics, tonality, everything is so "correct" in how it's presented.  Maybe the treble peak was intended.  If so, it's not flawed.  However, it's an odd addition because of how significant it is.
   
  The CK100, I don't know.  I like this earphone a lot.  It's hard for me to really say it's flawed.  It's not as articulate as the CK10, but it's not bad at all for a BA based earphone.  I mean nothing else is like the CK10, and the CK100 is better than most other BA earphones in presenting a well balanced note.  There is again some treble emphasis and again a weak bottom end, but information is presented well.  Could it have a heartier bass line?  Sure, but notes are well bodied and defined even if they are a little quiet.
   
  The DBA-02.  I don't get this one being a 10/10.  I'd barely give it an 8/10 I thought the earphone was relatively flawed in several ways.   Dynamics were significantly compressed.  The notes had a very short decay which created very minimal body and texturing which in turn made for a very lean low end.  I for one thought the drivers weren't of as high a quality as better offerings.  I actually want to say there was a noticeable amount of distortion or what I'll call a slight sense of scratchiness or harshness to the notes.  This is something I associate with lower level products, not junk but not as refined.  The frequency response wasn't bad at all, but the thin notes created a lot of limitations on the low end.  I thought the sound stage was significantly lacking, mainly from the lack of texture/articulation and compressed dynamics.  The speed of this earphone was neat.  It's definitely a "wow" type earphone, sort of doing what the SE530 does for mids but with highs and speed like the CK10 (but without the texture).  At the end of the day I would gladly suggest to anyone the RE-ZERO or Custom 3 as better choices at a cheaper price point.  I really do hate to nitpick this earphone, but like the RE0, I kind of feel people are liking it more than it's worth.  I guess someone has to not like it, and that's me, lol.  I do try and not like it from a personal preference standpoint.  I don't like it because I think it does a number of critical things wrong. 
   
  For me the UM3X is a 10/10 product.  It's one of those earphones I can use and can't really say it does anything wrong.  The frequency response is geared a certain way, but it just presents the notes well.  It's very clean, highly dynamic, highly textured.  It just doesn't do much wrong.  The worst thing it does is roll off some on the top end.  It's not exactly the 16kHz king.  It's like the CK100 but opposite.  It would be nice to see more top end sparkle and edge, but I think most of it comes down to the filter and any x-over implementation used than an actual limitation of the driver.  The Custom 3's driver is limited.  It lacks the speed to cleanly present notes above 10kHz well and is noticeably sluggish.  The IE8 is like this too, just a little sluggish and smoothed in details.  These are raw, noticeable inabilities of the drivers used.  The UM3X, I don't see a raw inability.  It's just gearing.  I really do get the sense that both the CK100 and UM3X use the exact same drivers, but they're just implemented differently.
   
   
  I like when earphones are just plain wrong.  It makes things easy.  When they aren't wrong, then things just become subjective.  You're either picking out extremely minute limitations, or you are throwing in personal preference or at least scaling to a common or social preference(what most people will like or prefer).


----------



## Kunlun

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With the SM3 it's different - I can see someone finding another earphone preferable to the SM3 but I can't see anyone absolutely hating it. In the case of the SM3, the lack of weaknesses is its greatest strength. In that sense, I can't see any earphone that I've heard aside from the SM3 earning a 10/10 - and especially not the current trio, each flawed in its own way. It really doesn't matter what I think about it in the context of my personal (analytical) listening preferences.


 
  I don't know about hating it, but music bird and James444 are examples of people who found serious weaknesses with the SM3's sound.
   
  It's great that you are taking greater account of your personal listening preferences and moderating against them so as to give reviews that will more accurately match the experience of the greatest number of readers/listeners possible. I know there are different ideas about how one should write a review, but I like the one you are moving towards. Cheers.


  
  Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> Like Joker said, a lot of these other earphones have absolute flaws in some way.  The CK10 has from what I got from pink noise testing a 9dB narrow spike at 10kHz that is a pretty significant issue that shows through with many songs.  Foam tips help, but EQing is the only way you really deal with it well.  Plus you can add that little bit on the bottom end to counter the role off below 50Hz (what my ears hear).  It had gotten a 10/10 because frankly it does so much right.  Speed, texture, dynamics, tonality, everything is so "correct" in how it's presented.  Maybe the treble peak was intended.  If so, it's not flawed.  However, it's an odd addition because of how significant it is.


 
  I liked the ck10 from my short listening session with it, but it clearly did have a sonic flaw in the way bass was presented. When an earphone does not reproduce a given frequency as it was intended in the recording, then that is a flaw. A basshead may enjoy an earphone that gives a greater quantity of bass than is present in the recording, but it is still a flaw, just one that matches the particular taste of the listener. For the ck10, the bass quantity is less than the recording and the aforementioned treble peak is more. These are flaws and, while the ck10 does a lot right, a flawed earphone should hardly be considered perfect without serious caveats to warn the reader.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> I agree with Joker's approach.  You have to realize it gets very hard to quantify these high level earphones.  Low quality products are easy.  They're largely flawed, largely limited, and just plain do things wrong.  It's easy to pick out the problems.  Once you get up to these very good products, they just don't have those flaws or limitations.  A lot of the ranking instead can go down a dangerous road, subjectivity, something we don't want when we're trying to be as unbiased as possible.  In the end, all we have are flaws, and they get pretty minuscule by the time we get to these high end products.
> 
> Perfection, at least as close as we can get to it, comes down to finding the products that do the least wrong.  These typically are not amazing products.  They don't have the wow factor or special gearing.  Why is the RE0 so popular?  Because it does so little wrong.  It's not a great earphone.  It's not an "oh my god this is the most amazing thing I've ever heard" kind of product.  It simply doesn't do anything terribly wrong.  Back when I owned a pair, I hated it.  I so wanted it to be better than it was, but it simply wasn't.  It was far from my preference and fell short in some areas like sound stage and dynamics.  However, it didn't do that much wrong, and it is such a well liked product because of that.  Despite my preference, I see great value in the RE0 because it doesn't do a lot of wrong.
> 
> ...


 

 Mostly agree w/ you except in regards to the DBA-02.  Your impressions to me are similar to those of one w/ poor fit or ears that simply don't go well w/ the phone.  You criticisms like low bass, thinness and lack of body are not there for people like myself that like them.  I know Shane wouldn't have kept them either if he heard them like you do.  So to my ears they are 10/10.  Obviously if I heard them as you do I would rate them like I have most BAs I have heard along your lines of description.  As much as you like the CK10 over the DBA I heard the opposite.  Less bass and body than the DBA, shriller highs and migraine inducing treble spikes.  My scores for the CK10 and DBA would be the inverse of yours.  So I think you need to consider how you hear these phones rather than stating your impressions as empirical fact.  For the most part you are right but it is obvious that the DBA is a phone that you either hear in its sweet spot or you just won't ever get it.  I've had my Etys (P and the S), CK10, heard the RE0.  To me the DBA is not a treble centered phone.  Of course, certain tips with a certain fit can make them sound as such.  It has awesome clarity, full natural sound balanced throughout and fantastic detail.  A snare drum has a round, full pop, not a slap, I can get a nice render of the entire drum kit.  Hip-hop bass can go boom.  The bass is about 92-95% of where it needs to be (CK10 is like 85%) and the rest basically spot on.  Of the afore-mentioned the transparency is the best I've heard as well.  It also has more texture than the 530 as I heard it, though everything does practically.  Other than the congestion issue you raise, I see no major flaws to my ears.  In the end, that's the point.  I can only speak to my ears and all impressions should be viewed in that light.  Synergy matters too.


----------



## Klaasje

I've decided to go for the HJE900 after reading reviews including yours, however I noticed you didn't like the stock tips.
   
  Quote: 





> *stock tips are underwhelming*


 
   
  Which ones would you recommend?


----------



## rawrster

Funny how we hear things so differently. I think sound wise I do like the DBA-02 although the bass extension is not quite as good as the CK10. Sound wise I'll take the DBA-02 but as the whole package I'll take the CK10 any day. I definitely found the CK10 bass better but that's not the case for everyone who heard both apparently.
   
  I would say that the DBA-02 is the "safer" earphone to get than the CK10 since the CK10 does have that spike that makes people either hate it or love it.


----------



## audiophileforlife

yep dba02 should not get a 10/10. more like 7.5-8/10
  the sound lacks a bit of body and although treble is good, its as if its trying too hard making it sibilant


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


specialj said:


> I partly blame joker for me buying SE535s. If he had reviewed them and said that they weren't that great... My curiosity got the best of me.


   
  What, so now I have to worry about what I _don't_ review, too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




?


 Quote:


mvw2 said:


> I agree with Joker's approach.  You have to realize it gets very hard to quantify these high level earphones.  Low quality products are easy.  They're largely flawed, largely limited, and just plain do things wrong.  It's easy to pick out the problems.  Once you get up to these very good products, they just don't have those flaws or limitations.  A lot of the ranking instead can go down a dangerous road, subjectivity, something we don't want when we're trying to be as unbiased as possible.  In the end, all we have are flaws, and they get pretty minuscule by the time we get to these high end products.


 
 Thanks, Matt. I have to say that among all the wall-of-text posts I encounter around here yours are the only ones I read more than once.  
   
  Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Mostly agree w/ you except in regards to the DBA-02.  Your impressions to me are similar to those of one w/ poor fit or ears that simply don't go well w/ the phone.  You criticisms like low bass, thinness and lack of body are not there for people like myself that like them.  I know Shane wouldn't have kept them either if he heard them like you do.  So to my ears they are 10/10.  Obviously if I heard them as you do I would rate them like I have most BAs I have heard along your lines of description.  As much as you like the CK10 over the DBA I heard the opposite.  Less bass and body than the DBA, shriller highs and migraine inducing treble spikes.  My scores for the CK10 and DBA would be the inverse of yours.  So I think you need to consider how you hear these phones rather than stating your impressions as empirical fact.  For the most part you are right but it is obvious that the DBA is a phone that you either hear in its sweet spot or you just won't ever get it.  I've had my Etys (P and the S), CK10, heard the RE0.  To me the DBA is not a treble centered phone.  Of course, certain tips with a certain fit can make them sound as such.  It has awesome clarity, full natural sound balanced throughout and fantastic detail.  A snare drum has a round, full pop, not a slap, I can get a nice render of the entire drum kit.  Hip-hop bass can go boom.  The bass is about 92-95% of where it needs to be (CK10 is like 85%) and the rest basically spot on.  Of the afore-mentioned the transparency is the best I've heard as well.  It also has more texture than the 530 as I heard it, though everything does practically.  Other than the congestion issue you raise, I see no major flaws to my ears.  In the end, that's the point.  I can only speak to my ears and all impressions should be viewed in that light.  Synergy matters too.


   
  Conversely, the CK10 can also be a bit fidgety in terms of fit and its little indiscretions really are accentuated with a shallow insertion. I'm lucky to be able to fit the housings themselves partway into my ear canal with smaller tips - otherwise I have to use modded Monster trips. 
  
  Quote:


klaasje said:


> I've decided to go for the HJE900 after reading reviews including yours, however I noticed you didn't like the stock tips.
> 
> 
> Which ones would you recommend?


 
 UE single flanges. There's a link on the last page of this thread. That said, I'd recommend listening to the stock tips first and only shelling out more cash if you're not satisfied but not completely appalled. Tips can only do so much for most earphones.


 Quote:


rawrster said:


> I would say that the DBA-02 is the "safer" earphone to get than the CK10 since the CK10 does have that spike that makes people either hate it or love it.


 
 I don't think it's the spike that makes people love the CK10. The spike is at best tolerable - it's the other quantities that make up for it.


----------



## pinoyman

hi bro joker...
  dont you plan on journeying to custom iems?
  hehhee...
   
  someday...you will, i know!
  and on that day...you will be reviewing more on driver's count and numbers of bores, crossovers...etc.and the mold, the color...etc... hahaha.
   
  i am happy with your work joker.
  you bring joy to my ears!


----------



## kendric

Yeah joker everyone loves ya. Keep its up and i have high expectations of your future endeavours. ^.^


----------



## Bennyboy71

I give the RE252 a score of 86/10 for sound and all the other iems in the universe 10 or less.
   
  Joker - do you have a day job? Or do you lie in a padded room writhing under a straight-jacket of iem cables?


----------



## jjmai

looks like the Miles Davis Tribute is quite a basshead IEM.
   
  Joker, do you feel if your taste in IEMs has changed at all throughout all these reviews?


----------



## kendric

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> looks like the Miles Davis Tribute is quite a basshead IEM.
> 
> Joker, do you feel if your taste in IEMs has changed at all throughout all these reviews?


 


  Yup Miles Davis has quite the satisfying amount of bass. Though when i compare to the e-Q7 the latter is more 'I don't miss a beat' but its bass and beat sounds more unrefined compared to MDs while MD in comparison drops a lil accuracy in the beats to usher in refining.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> We should start a 'How does Joker think' thread, lol.


 


  Lol this young skywalker is a great idea.


----------



## dfrost

|Joker|,
   
  A suggestion for your IEM summary table in Post #8: How about adding a column, asterisk, or some other indication for IEMs that have the iPhone compatibility/mic/remote option? That would provide a quick, relatively up-to-date reference to answer the frequent questions that come up on that subject.


----------



## Bennyboy71

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!  Why make things _easier_ for crApple users?

  
  Quote: 





dfrost said:


> |Joker|,
> 
> A suggestion for your IEM summary table in Post #8: How about adding a column, asterisk, or some other indication for IEMs that have the iPhone compatibility/mic/remote option? That would provide a quick, relatively up-to-date reference to answer the frequent questions that come up on that subject.


----------



## mvw2

Haha


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


pinoyman said:


> hi bro joker...
> dont you plan on journeying to custom iems?
> hehhee...
> 
> ...


 
 Not strictly for review purposes - customs are too costly to go through the way I've been doing with universals. However, it's very tempting and a definite goal to clear up the review backlog, sell 95% of my earphones and headphones, and see what I can do with that. My custom of choice would probably be a Fitear 333 assuming I can find one to re-mold.

  
  Quote:


bennyboy71 said:


> I give the RE252 a score of 86/10 for sound and all the other iems in the universe 10 or less.
> 
> Joker - do you have a day job? Or do you lie in a padded room writhing under a straight-jacket of iem cables?


 
 Day job - yes. Straight-jacket of IEM cables - also yes. I've been forced to stop using my 2nd monitor because it's turned into a full-time headphone rack and 5 of the 6 drawers in my desk are filled with earphones and related junk.


 Quote:


jjmai said:


> Joker, do you feel if your taste in IEMs has changed at all throughout all these reviews?


 
 Taste - probably not. What has changed is my perception of the capabilities of in-ears. I used to think that each 'desirable' property carried its own set of sacrifices but I've heard so many high-end earphones now that it's getting harder and harder to make distinctions like that. I definitely still agree that no one earphone will be all things to all people but with the newest crop of earphones it's getting really difficult to find straight-up weaknesses. I think this was true a couple of years ago for the 3-4 top-tiers that were around but now it is true for many earphones in the $100-200 (and sometimes even $60-100 range). I can foresee the lines between high-end and mid-range (non-mainstream) earphones getting more and more blurry and submit that it all started with the RE0. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm having an easier time imagining my perfect IEM (without a ridiculous price tag) as a reality.
   

  Quote:


dfrost said:


> |Joker|,
> 
> A suggestion for your IEM summary table in Post #8: How about adding a column, asterisk, or some other indication for IEMs that have the iPhone compatibility/mic/remote option? That would provide a quick, relatively up-to-date reference to answer the frequent questions that come up on that subject.


   
  Good idea now that concrete's headset thread is no longer being updated - I'll find some way of marking earphones that have a mic'd version.


----------



## mvw2

Yeah, it is very surprising how many good earphones there are these days.  A couple years ago it really was cut and dry.  You had top tier, and then you had most everything else.  Now, pssssh, half the new stuff popping up is actually very decent at the least.  it was kind of funny when I was running through piles of earphones myself.  I started off cheap like everyone else and then worked up to just a couple mid level products.  Then it was straight to top tier and top tier was absolutely top tier.  There wasn't really any comparison to what mid level was back then.  Now mid level is also pretty much top tier.  You can spend $150 to $200 and get the near the same level of product as the best universal you can buy.  The differences are more so put into build quality and manufacturing refinement than sound.  Something like the IE8 or SE530/535 is not only good sounding but also refined and elegant physically and not just the earphone but the case, wiring, everything.  The extra cost seems to transition into craftsmanship rather than sound simply because everyone can now just buy the same drivers and make a very similar earphone.  Every manufacturer has their own gearing and most of what you're doing by the time you get to $200 is not trying to find a better sounding product but rather finding a different sounding product that fits your personal taste.  It doesn't really get better.  It just gets different.  Outside of manufacturing quality, fit and finish, accessories, etc. you're really not getting better sound, just different sound.  Now the build quality, accessories, etc. do play important roles for certain people.  For some physical quality is as important as sound quality, and you do have to pay that little extra for that.


----------



## proedros

i think the perfect mindframe is a combination of joker/mwv2/benny71
   
   
  modesty
  wisdom
  humor
   
   
  the 3 qualities that lead to the palace of enlightment .


----------



## rawrster

I figured the Fitear would be something you would want to get considering your liking of the CK10 
   
  The lower cost for high quality has been getting better compared to the last couple years which is a good thing for us consumers. When I started the ER6i was pretty much the earphone to get at a budget of under $100 and now look at how crowded that price range is now. However I'm fairly happy at the "mid-fi" level of universal earphones and I don't feel like I'm giving up that much compared to the more expensive models.


----------



## Confispect

The SM3 would nice


----------



## Olimoronio

[size=10pt]So for the last few days I was looking for a certain type of paint and having a hard time finding it so in between hardware stores I stopped by Wal-Mart, Kmart and Big Lots for the heck of it.[/size]
   
  [size=10pt]Big Lots! I got the Coby Jammers which are quite enjoyable for $5. [/size]
   
  [size=10pt]Wal-Mart had these Maxell's called "Crystal Ear Buds" with these horrible, gaudy looking fake crystals on the back of them...[/size]
   

  [size=10pt]Well, the supposedly special crystallized driver intrigued me so I plunked down the $20 for them and off I went. I figured if I really liked them I'd pull off the crystal or paint it or reshape it or something... Now I let these things burn in for quite some time thinking that if they were hard diaphragms they'd take a while. They were pretty bad. All highs and upper mids and hardly any lows at all. So I took them back. [/size]
   
  [size=10pt]Then I went to Kmart and saw some more interesting looking Maxell’s. They were kind of flat like the driver was placed in there sideways. So I paid $10 for these and without any break in what-so-ever they sounded great. Nice, powerful, non-boomy lows, clear mids and extended highs. After break in they just got better. These had the ridiculous moniker of "Maxell Juicy Tunes." [/size]
   
   
  [size=10pt]You should try them. I've heard several of the buds in your $0-$15 category and these beat out most of the ones I've heard.[/size]


----------



## laon

@olimoronio
  You're truly on the level of hardcore maxell fanboy now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 your zeal alone make me consider on importing dhp-ii (they don't sell any here).
   
  Also you may be interested in their high end iem CN-N40, fitted with 13mm driver and cost only $54 for a top-end model, can be found here http://www.seyo-shop.com/product.php?productid=15196&cat=15120&page=1
   
  I'm kinda interested and it got generally great review on amazon.jp too


----------



## Olimoronio

[size=10pt]Haha... I knew someone was going to say something like that. I even considered cracking a joke about it myself but forgot. Actually, I hated the higher-end Maxell's and the Juicy Tunes were the only interesting looking IEM's at Kmart. I will say that the Juicy Tunes sound quite a bit better than the Coby Jammers which I liked. I'm really no fanboy of anything except the DHP ii's themselves.[/size]
   
   
  [size=10pt]I might try the CN-N40  as long as there is a good return policy.[/size]


----------



## laon

Isn't DHP-II actually one of their more expensive model? I don't think there are any return policy since they don't seem to sell it outside of Japan. :/


----------



## Olimoronio

$22 shipping!!! #$%^&*+


----------



## Olimoronio

Quote: 





laon said:


> Isn't DHP-II actually one of their more expensive model? I don't think there are any return policy since they don't seem to sell it outside of Japan. :/


 
  The DHP ii's??? Right around $30 shipped on Amazon. And they sell in the US. And they are the best buy in headphones to date, period.


----------



## laon

I mean that IEM I talked about before, they don't sell it outside Japan. And afaik DHP-II normal price is around $90, you lucky American just get the better deal, like always. I'm envious.


----------



## buffalowings

Quote: 





olimoronio said:


> The DHP ii's??? Right around $30 shipped on Amazon. And they sell in the US. And they are the best buy in headphones to date, period.


 


  for $30, I just might try them out, but I'm concerned with users complaining about disintegrating headbands etc etc....


----------



## JoetheArachnid

So Joker, will we ever see the SR-001/003 on this list? It would be interesting to see how they compare to the rest...


----------



## Hero Kid

You're up there with the big boys now* |joker|*. About bloody well time I say! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Can I have your autograph please?


----------



## ljokerl

Just wanted to say thanks to Jude for the front-page feature and to Hero Kid for the suggestion 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Autographs all around!
  
  Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> So Joker, will we ever see the SR-001/003 on this list? It would be interesting to see how they compare to the rest...


 


  Probably not - I think I'm more likely to turn to customs than 'stats.


----------



## rawrster

I would have never noticed. I bookmark the forum list page since I find the front page useless. Looks like more people may have you to thank for their wallets being a bit lighter


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Congrats on the front page feature! Hopefully this will mean less 'I'm looking for new IEMs' threads where I just link straight to this thread.
   
  Pity about the Staxen, though - they're actually pretty affordable compared to most of those top-tier universals.


----------



## jjmai

Congrats. About time.


----------



## Bennyboy71

Indeed - great news this mammoth epic has front page status.
   
  If I can make a suggestion, I'd like to see the whole enterprise formatted in a way that allows users to post comments against each iem, with their own impressions or feedback.
   
  Is that possible?


----------



## RockItHerbie

Quote:


rawrster said:


> I would have never noticed. I bookmark the forum list page since I find the front page useless. Looks like more people may have you to thank for their wallets being a bit lighter


 


 Joker's threads are always the first pages I navigate on head-fi to see if he has any new reviews. Without a doubt, he ensures to cram as much information into every post he is able, and puts just as much dedication into a $2 dollar IEM than he does a $200 IEM.  Without question, they have been very vital in assisting my future decisions on headphone purchases. I actually bookmark both of Joker's in-ear/portable comparison threads, as I find all of his detailed reviews extremely informative. Quite frankly, I'm VERY surprised that it took 115 IEM reviews (not including the portables thread) before head-fi considered giving him the recognition that he deserves by the home page presentation, and believe that he is still due credit. Joker, thank you for all of the work and effort you put towards your reviews, and I look forward to reading them for many headphones to come.


----------



## Geruvah

Would the IE8, UM3X, or W3 give me a sound like my HD-650s? I think UM3X is more of a monitor, so the bass would probably be lacking for my tastes in rock and electronica.


----------



## Bennyboy71

I'm sure if he reviewed million dollar plastic music players designed by chimps and mental looking ear covering sound machines for which you need warehouses crammed with amplification gear, he'd have been all over the front pages by now.
  
  Quote: 





rockitherbie said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Joker's threads are always the first pages I navigate on head-fi to see if he has any new reviews. Without a doubt, he ensures to cram as much information into every post he is able, and puts just as much dedication into a $2 dollar IEM than he does a $200 IEM.  Without question, they have been very vital in assisting my future decisions on headphone purchases. I actually bookmark both of Joker's in-ear/portable comparison threads, as I find all of his detailed reviews extremely informative. Quite frankly, I'm VERY surprised that it took 115 IEM reviews (not including the portables thread) before head-fi considered giving him the recognition that he deserves by the home page presentation, and believe that he is still due credit. Joker, thank you for all of the work and effort you put towards your reviews, and I look forward to reading them for many headphones to come.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





bennyboy71 said:


> I'm sure if he reviewed million dollar plastic music players designed by chimps and mental looking ear covering sound machines for which you need warehouses crammed with amplification gear, he'd have been all over the front pages by now.


 

 Lol Benny.  I don't think anyone will be able to explain your next ban either.


----------



## Towert7

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A2) Head-Direct RE2*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  ..... But I wear my RE2 over my ear all the time...


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





geruvah said:


> Would the IE8, UM3X, or W3 give me a sound like my HD-650s? I think UM3X is more of a monitor, so the bass would probably be lacking for my tastes in rock and electronica.


 

 IE8 sound closest to the HD-650, if you like that kinda sound.  With the right amp they're great, but otherwise with everything else they weren't my cup of tea.


----------



## cristigheran

I really preffer the M-audio IE30. It offers me the best quality I ever had (for this price, of course)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


bennyboy71 said:


> Indeed - great news this mammoth epic has front page status.
> 
> If I can make a suggestion, I'd like to see the whole enterprise formatted in a way that allows users to post comments against each iem, with their own impressions or feedback.
> 
> Is that possible?


 
 I absolutely don't see how that would be possible under the current system. If this thread was contained off-site, there's quite a lot of streamlining ideas that could be implemented. A separate discussion area for each earphone would definitely be one of them. Forum mechanics are very limited, however, so the best I could do would be to link to an active appreciation or review thread for each set.
   
  Quote:


rockitherbie said:


> Joker's threads are always the first pages I navigate on head-fi to see if he has any new reviews. Without a doubt, he ensures to cram as much information into every post he is able, and puts just as much dedication into a $2 dollar IEM than he does a $200 IEM.  Without question, they have been very vital in assisting my future decisions on headphone purchases. I actually bookmark both of Joker's in-ear/portable comparison threads, as I find all of his detailed reviews extremely informative. Quite frankly, I'm VERY surprised that it took 115 IEM reviews (not including the portables thread) before head-fi considered giving him the recognition that he deserves by the home page presentation, and believe that he is still due credit. Joker, thank you for all of the work and effort you put towards your reviews, and I look forward to reading them for many headphones to come.


   
  Thanks, appreciate that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. To be honest I _do_ put more care into reviewing higher-end gear but only because the sound signature is usually more complex and the flaws take longer to find. There are exceptions of course (e.g. Phiaton PS200).
  
  Quote:


geruvah said:


> Would the IE8, UM3X, or W3 give me a sound like my HD-650s? I think UM3X is more of a monitor, so the bass would probably be lacking for my tastes in rock and electronica.


   
  I don't own the HD650 and have only heard it a couple of times in the past. I think you can definitely cross the W3 off that list - too energetic and aggressive. I didn't really think the HD650 was bassy so the UM3X should have enough bass for you; however, I agree with HPA - the IE8 would be my choice out of the three. That said, perhaps someone who actually owns the HD650 can give more specifics.

  
  Quote:


towert7 said:


> ..... But I wear my RE2 over my ear all the time...


 
 Sorry, as you understand I can only relate my own experience. I had a lot of trouble keeping the RE2 cord seated behind my ears due to the long stems (without cable guides). I had a rev.1 RE2 and I think head-direct has  changed the cable since but I've not tried the newer one.
   

  Quote:


cristigheran said:


> I really preffer the M-audio IE30. It offers me the best quality I ever had (for this price, of course)


   
  That's a re-branded UE Super.Fi 5 Pro. Review coming... eventually.


----------



## Pianist

I think HD650 is way better than IE8. The bass on HD650 is tighter and the treble is of much better quality. HD650 also sounds bigger and has a more realistic imaging.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





geruvah said:


> Would the IE8, UM3X, or W3 give me a sound like my HD-650s? I think UM3X is more of a monitor, so the bass would probably be lacking for my tastes in rock and electronica.


 
   
  Out of all the IEMs I've heard so far, I think Shure SE535 sounds closest to HD650. Actually, I think that they are both on about the same level in sound quality. IE8, UM3X and W3 are all a step below. Just my opinion of course.


----------



## mx19

i think adding (and testing) phonak audeo pfe012 perfect bass for $89.00 to the Tier 2C would be good idea. they are 40$ cheaper than standard pfe112 and you can buy always additional grey or black filters to turn them into pfe112...


----------



## Geruvah

Thanks. It may be an opinion, but it sure is a good direction to start researching. I would've NEVER considered the Shure line (first experience was the e2c and I had to return it in a few hours because I hated that sound quality.
  
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> Out of all the IEMs I've heard so far, I think Shure SE535 sounds closest to HD650. Actually, I think that they are both on about the same level in sound quality. IE8, UM3X and W3 are all a step below. Just my opinion of course.


----------



## Olimoronio

So I guess that's a big fat no on reviewing the Maxell Juicy Tunes, eh?
   
   
  Can't be seen reviewing an IEM with an absurd name like "Juicy Tunes" now that you've hit the big time.


----------



## darknessproz

A review of this size deserves a forum on its own.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


olimoronio said:


> So I guess that's a big fat no on reviewing the Maxell Juicy Tunes, eh?
> 
> Can't be seen reviewing an IEM with an absurd name like "Juicy Tunes" now that you've hit the big time.


 
 It's not really an issue of nomenclature - simply one of time. I'm not sorting through my backlog as fast as I should be so buying more phones now would just stress me more. Don't really care if they were called 'AKG Audiophile's Delight' instead of 'Maxell Juicy Tunes' (well.. maybe a little).
  
  Quote:


darknessproz said:


> A review of this size deserves a forum on its own.


 

  Thanks


----------



## airwax

I agree with HPA that the IE8 is closest to the HD650 in terms of sound. But I also agree with Pianist, that the HD650 is much better. I don't like comparing full-size headphones against iems though.


----------



## ljokerl

Updated some of the more outdated prices and added a new column to the chart to signify the availability of an iPhone version of a particular earphone. Not sure if it's clear enough - definitely open to suggestions for improvement.


----------



## kostalex

If head-f blogs are still available, then:
   
  1) You may use 1st post as table of contents (with summary, conclusions, etc.) pointing to the blog records, individual for for each IEM.
  2) There in the blog comments people may discuss specific model.
   

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I absolutely don't see how that would be possible under the current system.


----------



## DervishD

Hyperclear, ljokerl 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  As always, the best and more comprehensive list of IEMs ever! Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kostalex said:


> If head-f blogs are still available, then:
> 
> 1) You may use 1st post as table of contents (with summary, conclusions, etc.) pointing to the blog records, individual for for each IEM.
> 2) There in the blog comments people may discuss specific model.


   
  I think blogs are implemented under the wiki feature in the new forums. There was a big discussion on it after the Huddler switch though I don't remember exactly how it ended. I'll look into it, though I might as well move the thread off-site if I have to separate out the individual reviews ><.
   
  Quote:


dervishd said:


> Hyperclear, ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Great


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I might as well move the thread off-site if I have to separate out the individual reviews ><.


 
   
  Why do you have to move it off-site? Just because someone suggested something that is different to the way it is doesn't mean you have to change it. I'd like to see it stay on-sight rather than disappearing to some obscure dedicated website, here it's part of everything, anywhere else and it would just be a special kid sitting in the corner alone.


----------



## EraserXIV

I know you've got a lot on your plate, but do you have an plans to review the Sunrise SW-Xcape?


----------



## s0lar

Thanks for the comparison!
  I bought the Brainwavz M1 a few months ago and I am enjoying them ever since.
  Because I also like cans sometimes I bought the AKG81DJ because they came out pretty good in your other thread.
  Unfortunately I do not like them that much, they are out of control with the bass, although with equalizer settings for jazz, they do sound pretty good.
  Now I am looking for an upgrade IEM. I use a Sansa clip+ and like straight-down, not too bass heavy and balanced earphones.
  I mostly listen to Folk and Rock. I like the way the voices sound with the Brainwavs M1, very clear and natural. I do not like in my face drums.
  The AKG81DJ does make guitars sound as they should but the drums seems to take over.
  I read through the entire sum-up, but it is hard to find a sound-signature comparison. Does someone has any suggestions?
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> I know you've got a lot on your plate, but do you have an plans to review the Sunrise SW-Xcape?


 


  He does, don't worry.  It's in the pipeline.


----------



## Xfinity

Thanks ljokerl for an excellent comparison guide between all the IEMs you have reviewed. Excellent stuff!


----------



## Olimoronio

Just wondering but are there a lot of IEM's that fire sideways instead of directly out?
   
  You can sort of see it in this pic...
   

   
  [size=10pt]The driver fires sideways at a slightly forward angle into the sidewall of the cavity with the nozzle on it.[/size]
   
  [size=10pt]I think it's pretty nifty... especially since they sound pretty darned good.[/size]


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





olimoronio said:


> Just wondering but are there a lot of IEM's that fire sideways instead of directly out?
> 
> You can sort of see it in this pic...
> 
> ...


 

 Radius DDM, Sony's, many others.  Similar design to the CK10 but those are dual BAs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


hero kid said:


> Why do you have to move it off-site? Just because someone suggested something that is different to the way it is doesn't mean you have to change it. I'd like to see it stay on-sight rather than disappearing to some obscure dedicated website, here it's part of everything, anywhere else and it would just be a special kid sitting in the corner alone.


   
  It was just a hypothetical. I have neither the time, desire, nor technical know-how to move the entire thread off-site although I admit that it could be made far more user-friendly in its implementation with scripting wizardry. 
  
  Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> I know you've got a lot on your plate, but do you have an plans to review the Sunrise SW-Xcape?


 
 Yes but I am still waiting on my pair so they are currently last on my to-do list by default.


 Quote:


s0lar said:


> Thanks for the comparison!
> I bought the Brainwavz M1 a few months ago and I am enjoying them ever since.
> Because I also like cans sometimes I bought the AKG81DJ because they came out pretty good in your other thread.
> Unfortunately I do not like them that much, they are out of control with the bass, although with equalizer settings for jazz, they do sound pretty good.
> ...


 
 The M1 is a rather unique earphone in that it manages to retain pretty good overall balance and a decent soundstage despite having forward mids. What is it that you don't like about the M1 and would like to see improved? I can see someone who likes the M1 upgrading to the Senn IE7 (not at full retail price though), Radius DDM, KC3, and maybe some of the high-end triple-drivers but it really depends on what you're looking for and how much you're willing to spend.

 Quote:


xfinity said:


> Thanks ljokerl for an excellent comparison guide between all the IEMs you have reviewed. Excellent stuff!


   
  Glad it was useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Also, 6000th post


----------



## Inks

x2 regarding the IE7 as an M1 upgrade. I find them very similar in terms of sound sig, except the M1s midrange may be a tiny bit thicker.


----------



## s0lar

What I don't like about the M1's? Good question. It's been a new world opening up for me, I never knew my music could sound this good with IEM's.
  I really like it that I can hear the singers breathing for example and the way it all sounds laid-back.
  Maybe an IEM that even sounds more detailed without overwhelming me. I feel that the hitting of the acoustic guitar strings sounds just a little bit monotonous, so if that could be improved. I'm willing to spend up to 150 euro. Digging through your reviews points me to RE-0/Zero, perhaps DBA-02.
  How about the Phonak PFE 121?
  Thanks a lot! I will do some reading about the given advace.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


s0lar said:


> What I don't like about the M1's? Good question. It's been a new world opening up for me, I never knew my music could sound this good with IEM's.
> I really like it that I can hear the singers breathing for example and the way it all sounds laid-back.
> Maybe an IEM that even sounds more detailed without overwhelming me. I feel that the hitting of the acoustic guitar strings sounds just a little bit monotonous, so if that could be improved. I'm willing to spend up to 150 euro. Digging through your reviews points me to RE-0/Zero, perhaps DBA-02.
> How about the Phonak PFE 121?
> Thanks a lot! I will do some reading about the given advace.


 
 The problem is that you really don't know what level of detail you'll find overwhelming, if any. I've seen the term 'hyperdetailed' used and I suppose that if there is such a thing, the DBA-02 and PFE could both be qualified as such. The RE-ZERO is a little more delicate in the way it presents detail and I can't imagine anyone finding it fatiguing (this is true for the RE252 and RE262 as well). If you like the somewhat thick mids of the M1 perhaps the RE-ZERO will be a little thin (though so will the DBA-02 and maybe even the PFE with gray filters) but if you're willing to take a chance on that for the sake of extra detail, I'd say go for it because you really don't know with any great certainty which direction you want to move in from the M1 (since the M1 is your sole data point, so to speak). Truth be told, most higher-end earphones, dynamic and BA, will have at least slightly more detail than the M1 (meaning things like the IE7, DDM, MC5, etc) but I think going for something more analytical makes sense, if only for the sake of knowing what one of those sounds like.


----------



## s0lar

Thanks!
  I will probably go for the IE7, no one seems to dislike it, so it might be a safe bet.
  I like the words ClieOS uses: warm, musical, smooth and a little laidback. Because I have no idea what other IEM's might sound like, describing things this way feels logical for me. Whether the forward mids are the reason I like them is not yet known, perhaps I can compare this later on. Also no idea about what level of details I might like/dislike. 
  Reading through his reviews I found those things also when he described the Phonak PFE.
  Looking for a review on the IE7 seems to return nothing but discussions, if someone could please provide me with an easy link, that would be appreciated. About the DDM I also read things like sweet, warm, forward mids and smooth treble.
  I can also say that when listening to Bob Dylan with AKG81DJ I get dizzy, but it sounds just as harsch and shreeking as it should sound with the M1's.


----------



## rawrster

There really aren't that many reviews on the IE7. There was a long appreciation thread somewhere but not much reviews on the IE7. I personally feel that they have been overlooked (although not as much as the IE6) by the IE8. Although I do blame Sennheiser partly for that since they released all three models around the same time iirc.
   
  I do like the way the IE7 sounds but it probably isn't for me. Warm, smooth, laid back and musical is probably what I would describe them as although I haven't had that much time on them but will put some more time into them over the next couple of days. It's hard when you have better alternatives however


----------



## Inks

I don't think the IE7s have been given a  proper review yet, but they are on Joker's upcoming list so you can stay tuned for that. I personally think the IE7 is a nice safe bet as long as you pay <100$.


----------



## rawrster

Well it's a good thing around $100 is their current going price if you buy a refurbished unit. I think I remember seeing them around $200 the last time I was at J&R for another earphone purchase and I don't think I would pay that much for them. They do have a nice cable and sound nice but not $200 nice and well they don't suit me and I already have enough earphones in my possession that don't suit me well.


----------



## Anaxilus

So in the sub $100 market if one could pick would the choice be HJE900 or IE7?  Do they have the Sennheiser 'veil'?  Reports seem to indicate clarity on these.


----------



## s0lar

Reading through even more threads and rawrster's review of the DBA-02, I think that might be my thing too? I see in Anaxilus' sig, he owns both as well, what do you think makes them different or similar?
  The HJE900's are not my cup of tea, I think, knowing only what I am reading from other's opinions.


----------



## rawrster

I think I'd pick up the HJE900 over the IE7. I don't have the HJE900 to compare right now however. The IE7 doesn't really do anything horrible but it doesn't sound as engaging to me as the HJE900. I'd probably pick the HJE900 for the isolation factor as well since the IE7 isn't that great and the HJE900 isn't the best either but it's better at least. I also like a straight connector better.
   
  As for the question about veil I don't think it's horrible but I haven't directly compared it to anything in my possession with decent clarity and the fact that I've only been using them in 15 minute or so sessions. I haven't really noticed much of a veil so it can't be too bad.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> There really aren't that many reviews on the IE7. There was a long appreciation thread somewhere but not much reviews on the IE7. I personally feel that they have been overlooked (although not as much as the IE6) by the IE8. Although I do blame Sennheiser partly for that since they released all three models around the same time iirc.


   
  I think the IE7 is sufficiently different from the IE8 to appeal to those with a different taste. The IE6, however, has been rightly overlooked IMO. I expected it to be a de-tuned version of the IE8 sound but it sounds more like a CX-series Sennheiser than the IE7 or IE8. No way they are worth more than $70-80, even with comfort and looks factored in (I think they are the most comfortable of the IE earphones). The $140 that Sennheiser's been asking for them up until a few months ago is ridiculous. 
  
  Quote:


inks said:


> I don't think the IE7s have been given a  proper review yet, but they are on Joker's upcoming list so you can stay tuned for that. I personally think the IE7 is a nice safe bet as long as you pay <100$.


 
 Agreed, for <$100 they are a good choice as long as that's the sort of sound you're after. Those who like the more balanced but still dynamic-sounding budget sets (PL30, M1, etc) will find a good upgrade with the IE7 but for some people the sound will be neither here nor there.
  
  Quote:


anaxilus said:


> So in the sub $100 market if one could pick would the choice be HJE900 or IE7?  Do they have the Sennheiser 'veil'?  Reports seem to indicate clarity on these.


 
 From a technical standpoint I don't think either has the upper hand but preference-wise I'll take the HJE900 any day. I agree with rawrster that the IE7 really isn't very exciting although it does many things right. I think I'd rather have an earphone that does a couple of things so well that it draws me in than have one that has fewer flaws but doesn't really get my pulse up one way or another. Otherwise I'd have picked up an SM3 of my own by now. 
  
  Oh and there's no veil compared to the IE8 and IE6, partly because there's much less bass. They are still laid-back though so they won't have the vocal clarity if your DBAs.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> > From a technical standpoint I don't think either has the upper hand but preference-wise I'll take the HJE900 any day. I agree with rawrster that the IE7 really isn't very exciting although it does many things right. I think I'd rather have an earphone that does a couple of things so well that it draws me in than have one that has fewer flaws but doesn't really get my pulse up one way or another. Otherwise I'd have picked up an SM3 of my own by now.


 
   
  x2
   
  I can definitely relate to that perspective.


----------



## JxK

joker, do you know of any over the ear IEMs with a sound signature similar to the hje900? Is the westone 3 the only one that comes close? And are there any other over the ear designs with exceptional value you know of, besides the M6 and the eterna? And discounting the custom 3 due to build quality issues.


----------



## rawrster

The closest in signature is probably the IE8 that I've heard at least.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jxk said:


> joker, do you know of any over the ear IEMs with a sound signature similar to the hje900? Is the westone 3 the only one that comes close? And are there any other over the ear designs with exceptional value you know of, besides the M6 and the eterna? And discounting the custom 3 due to build quality issues.


 
  
  I don't think the Westone 3 is very similar to the HJE900 other than in the very general sense of being slightly v-shaped. It also comes with its own share of fit issues. Don't get me wrong - it's a very good earphone. I just wouldn't bill it as a logical HJE900 upgrade. I honestly can't think of anything with the HJE900 signature and an over-the-ear form factor that wouldn't also be a downgrade.


----------



## feardorcha

Thank you, ljokerl!
   
  I'm from Germany - so excuse for my bad english... ^^
  I browsed all the internet and looked for my first in-ear monitors.
  For this I am a real bloody beginner concerning this matter.
  But for that I am a music lovin' freak I already wanted a real good in-ear from beginning.
  At the same time I didn't want to become poor and so I searched and searched for an objective review compassing a big range of in-ears.
   
  Well... what should I say.. I found it! Thank you!
   
  I fell in love with the Head-Direct RE0 and ordered them in... Great Britain! (AmpCity)
  I'll post here when I've got and tested them.
  I'm full of anticipation!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


feardorcha said:


> Well... what should I say.. I found it! Thank you!
> 
> I fell in love with the Head-Direct RE0 and ordered them in... Great Britain! (AmpCity)
> I'll post here when I've got and tested them.
> I'm full of anticipation!


 
 Thanks and congratulations on your purchase. Remember to read the in-ear wiki if these are your first proper in-ears and enjoy!


----------



## jackson

What do you guys recommend? I'm looking for:
   
  1) Clean sound, no sibilance and good bass (note: I have the Etyomotic ER-6i and decided I do not like the sound, after trying my new SoundMAGIC PL50s).  I like a wide soundstage with good separation.
  2) Good fit.  I like to wear my IEMs over the ear
  3) Easily driven.  I'm looking at my laptop and an iPod as primary sources.  I may spring for a NuForce uDAC
  4) Under $150
   
  Any IEMs that fit that criteria? I like my PL50s but I feel the soundstage isn't wide enough and the bass isn't there.  They definitely sound clean, though, and don't need an amp.  The Fischer Audio Silver Bullets look like they might be fit this criteria.  Again, I do NOT like the sound of Etymotic ER-6i (very, very warm).
   
  And I don't know the difference between the RE0 and the PL50; I don't think the difference (from what I've read) is great enough to warrant the purchase of the RE0.  
   
  Let me know!
   
  This site may have started an expensive habit for me...I'm looking at the Audio Technica M50 even though I have Senn HD590 (I may sell these if I like the M50s).


----------



## rmappita

What about a used Triple.fi, Clean Sound, very good sound stage and a good bass!


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





jackson said:


> What do you guys recommend? I'm looking for:
> 
> 1) Clean sound, no sibilance and good bass (note: I have the Etyomotic ER-6i and decided I do not like the sound, after trying my new SoundMAGIC PL50s).  I like a wide soundstage with good separation.
> 2) Good fit.  I like to wear my IEMs over the ear
> ...


 

 I don't know what to tell you. I hope that you're mixing up what warm means - it refers to an elevated level of midbass. Because if in fact the er-6i is _too warm_ for your tastes...you're out of luck buddy. T he er-6i is pretty much the coldest, least warm IEM on the market and there is nothing out there with less bass.


----------



## jackson

I think you're right.  I guess I have my terms mixed up.  I just know that I do not like the sound of the ER-6i.
   
  I like a bit of bass (jazz and hip hop, I also like vocals/acapella stuff).  The PL50 don't have enough bass but I do love how they sound.
   
  My friend has the UE Triple.fi 10 and I love how they sound.  He got them for half price because he knew someone that worked at the company.  person.
   
  Maybe I should just keep the PL50 for portable listening (walking around, working out) and get the Audio Technica M50? I will be sitting down mostly, working on a laptop and listening to music.


----------



## JxK

Also an option. Generally, fullsize headphones are superior to similarly priced IEMs. And by a fair margin. So, as a rule, if you're able to use a fullsize headphone, you may as well do so. IEMs are a compromise, so unless you need to take advantage of their portability (or just find them more comfortable) there's no need to to spend money on IEMs.


----------



## ppmd

^ Is that also true for the top end customs?


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





ppmd said:


> ^ Is that also true for the top end customs?


 

 Don't know as I don't have any top end customs. But it certainly stands to reason, especially when it comes to aspects like soundstage. Here's a review written comparing the JH13 customs to good fullsize cans. The gist was that while they're great IEMs, they can't compete with real fullsize headphones


----------



## feardorcha

Quote: 





jackson said:


> My friend has the UE Triple.fi 10 and I love how they sound.  He got them for half price because he knew someone that worked at the company.  person.


 

 Well, he's your friend!?
  Maybe it works a second time?! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks and congratulations on your purchase. Remember to read the in-ear wiki if these are your first proper in-ears and enjoy!


 

  
  Thanks for the next hint! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I've done so although I already knew about most things by reading in two bulletin boards.
  But it's nice to find these informations in a compact form.


----------



## ppmd

Thanks for the link. While I was expecting such an answer, I can't help but feel a little down as I do have a preference for IEMs for portability. 
  In terms of soundstage however, the intimate soundstage of IEMs have grown on me and I don't fuss over it anymore.
  Quote: 





jxk said:


> The gist was that while they're great IEMs, they can't compete with real fullsize headphones


----------



## jackson

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Also an option. Generally, fullsize headphones are superior to similarly priced IEMs. And by a fair margin. So, as a rule, if you're able to use a fullsize headphone, you may as well do so. IEMs are a compromise, so unless you need to take advantage of their portability (or just find them more comfortable) there's no need to to spend money on IEMs.


 


  Damnit.  Now, I have to decide between the AT-M50 and the Shure SHR840.  I've read a couple comparisons on here and there wasn't a clear consensus as to which is "better."
   
  Thanks for the reply.


----------



## rawrster

I've listened to many earphones and headphones and imo they are hard to compare and they use different setups. An earphone is simple to use. You plug it into your dap (or if you have an amp) and it sounds great. I do the same with a decent headphone and it might be underpowered. Typically headphone setups are a dac and amp to go along with that headphone. It just depends on what kind of use they will be getting.


----------



## albau

Quote: 





jxk said:


> I don't know what to tell you. I hope that you're mixing up what warm means - it refers to an elevated level of midbass. Because if in fact the er-6i is _too warm_ for your tastes...you're out of luck buddy. T he er-6i is pretty much the coldest, least warm IEM on the market and there is nothing out there with less bass.


 

  
  Yeah, I was also damn surprised by even the thought of ER6i (or anything from Etymotic for the matter) to be "warm". I had Etys for few months long ago and while I appreciated phenomenal isolation, clarity and detail in highs resultant overall clinical, cold, congested and thin sound turned me off.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jackson said:


> What do you guys recommend? I'm looking for:
> 
> 1) Clean sound, no sibilance and good bass (note: I have the Etyomotic ER-6i and decided I do not like the sound, after trying my new SoundMAGIC PL50s).  I like a wide soundstage with good separation.
> 2) Good fit.  I like to wear my IEMs over the ear
> ...


 
 I think you need to decide if you're willing to sacrifice the portability of an IEM for a full-size headphone (as that's what the M50 is) before you start looking because comparing IEMs to headphones gets confusing real quick. The PL50 and Er6i are good entry-level sets but they really don't compete with higher-end gear. Based on your requirements I can recommend that you look into the Klipsch Custom 3. It's an earphone that doesn't really do much wrong and has dropped precipitously in price over the past year. The cable is pretty terrible but unless you're jogging with them it probably won't be a problem.
  
  Quote:


jxk said:


> Also an option. Generally, fullsize headphones are superior to similarly priced IEMs. And by a fair margin. So, as a rule, if you're able to use a fullsize headphone, you may as well do so. IEMs are a compromise, so unless you need to take advantage of their portability (or just find them more comfortable) there's no need to to spend money on IEMs.


 
  I don't think that's true at all. Aside from the obvious differences in presentation and impact (an IEM really can't move all that much air) there is nothing to dictate that an IEM has to be worse than a similarly-priced headphone. There are bang/buck winners and bang/buck losers in both categories and headphones get very expensive very quick (people seem to forget about the price of the dac/amp/cables/etc when comparing cans to IEMs). In addition, a headphone doesn't necessarily have a more spacious presentation than an IEM. The HD25 is a good example - next to a high-end in-ear it sounds very claustrophobic and a little congested. As an aside, I've actually not heard a headphone with the instrumental separation of the Westone UM3X - most don't even come close. Of course one can pick and choose many examples where a particular headphone will beat a particular IEM in a particular trait (or vice versa) but as a general rule it's not fair to say that headphones are better by a margin. Different - yes.


----------



## Pianist

Quote:  





> I don't think that's true at all. Aside from the obvious differences in presentation and impact (an IEM really can't move all that much air) there is nothing to dictate that an IEM has to be worse than a similarly-priced headphone. There are bang/buck winners and bang/buck losers in both categories and headphones get very expensive very quick (people seem to forget about the price of the dac/amp/cables/etc when comparing cans to IEMs). In addition, a headphone doesn't necessarily have a more spacious presentation than an IEM. The HD25 is a good example - next to a high-end in-ear it sounds very claustrophobic and a little congested. As an aside, I've actually not heard a headphone with the instrumental separation of the Westone UM3X - most don't even come close. Of course one can pick and choose many examples where a particular headphone will beat a particular IEM in a particular trait (or vice versa) but as a general rule it's not fair to say that headphones are better by a margin. Different - yes.


 
   
  ++ on this. I agree completely. Moreover, I think that not only can IEMs and headphones in the same price range be comparable is sound quality, but there are IEMs out there that beat full sized headphones costing two times or more IMO. One example is RE0 beating out the AKG K271 in overall sound quality, even though the AKGs cost about twice as much and are very good cans in their price range.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

My RE-ZERO certainly has better separation and clarity compared to my HD 595, though the Senn is wider, warmer and more organic. Considering that the RE-ZERO cost ~£75 and the 595 cost ~£120 for similar (though different tonally) levels of quality, I'd say that the 595 is overpriced (true) and that the ZERO is an astoudingly good deal (also true). Possibly these are exceptions rather than the rule, but I think that at least sub $200, or anywhere where HiFiMAN/Head-Direct are on the prowl, the value line is pretty even between cans and IEMs.


----------



## jackson

I was looking at the RE0 but not sure what they can offer over the PL50 (both unamped).  I might recommend the RE0 or Fischer Audio SB to my brother, who is looking for a pair.
   
  I'd love to have a pair of the Westone UM3X or EarSonic SM3.
   
  If I can get the Triple.fi 10, I will.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





jackson said:


> I was looking at the RE0 but not sure what they can offer over the PL50 (both unamped).  I might recommend the RE0 or Fischer Audio SB to my brother, who is looking for a pair.
> 
> I'd love to have a pair of the Westone UM3X or EarSonic SM3.
> 
> *If I can get the Triple.fi 10, I will.*


 

 I think RE0 sounds better than Triple.fi - more balanced and coherent. I also prefer RE0 over UM3X. The SM3 and SE530/535 are probably the only universal IEMs which I would consider a true upgrade from RE0.


----------



## jackson

Quote: 





pianist said:


> I think RE0 sounds better than Triple.fi - more balanced and coherent. I also prefer RE0 over UM3X. The SM3 and SE530/535 are probably the only universal IEMs which I would consider a true upgrade from RE0.


 

 I was going to say that those are some...bold words...but that would be too cheesy (look, I did!).
   
  RE0 are THAT good? I keep hearing that the bass is lacking with the RE0.  Now, I'm curious what the difference is between them and the PL50.


----------



## rawrster

Well Pianist does have some real high praise for the RE0 although I will say that when I had both the TF10 and the RE0 together the RE0 was no slouch. I liked the RE0 better but I think the TF10 is a tiny bit better but not by much and definitely not what the price difference suggests.


----------



## EraserXIV

to be honest, i thought the TF10 was pretty bad compared to the RE0


----------



## jackson

Wow, so the RE0 must sound way better than the PL50, because I thought the TF10 (borrowed them briefly) sounded noticeably better than the PL50.
   
  Can anyone compare the RE0 and PL50? I'll have to look for threads comparing them.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





jackson said:


> Wow, so the RE0 must sound way better than the PL50, because I thought the TF10 (borrowed them briefly) sounded noticeably better than the PL50.
> 
> Can anyone compare the RE0 and PL50? I'll have to look for threads comparing them.


 
  Short answer: RE0 wins in terms of sound quality, especially detail, if that's your thing. PL50 wins in terms of build quality, fit, and comfort. Neither isolate well enough for truly noise environments like planes, but are good enough for general use. Most people here will say RE0 wins hands down, but I truly think that there's more to IEMs than simple sound quality. One should look at them as a total package.


----------



## jackson

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Short answer: RE0 wins in terms of sound quality, especially detail, if that's your thing. PL50 wins in terms of build quality, fit, and comfort. Neither isolate well enough for truly noise environments like planes, but are good enough for general use. Most people here will say RE0 wins hands down, but I truly think that there's more to IEMs than simple sound quality. One should look at them as a total package.


 

 Thanks.  I definitely love the fit/comfort of the PL50.  I can't get over how "transparent" they feel.  I sometimes forget I'm wearing them.
   
  They definitely don't isolate like the ER-6i.  Too bad the Ety flanges don't fit the PL50s.
   
  Actually, the Fischer Audio DBA-02 is what I was considering. Clean sound, good bass, comfortable.  Good price, too.
   
  Maybe the Westone W3 as a graduation gift to myself


----------



## paulypaul

Quote: 





jackson said:


> Wow, so the RE0 must sound way better than the PL50, because I thought the TF10 (borrowed them briefly) sounded noticeably better than the PL50.
> 
> Can anyone compare the RE0 and PL50? I'll have to look for threads comparing them.


 

 I thought the RE0 was quite a bit better than PL50.
  I couldnt get the bass impact from the BA of the PL50 and the highs of the PL50 are nowhere near as extended as the  RE0s.
  The mids of the PL50s are nice, but not as nice as my RE-ZEROs.
   
  RE-ZEROs > RE0 > PL50  thats my opinion.


----------



## germanium

Concerning the JVC HA-FXC50 I would rate them higher than they are rated here. More like a 6.5 as I feel that there only drawbacks is thier somewhat heavy bass & very slightly soft upper midband. Bass extension is excellent as is bass detail. On recordings that are recorded with capturing depth in mind they do excellent in depth but do not create excess depth that isn't in the recording. Bass with the right source material can sound open & airy even if a little over the top. Detail remains excellent throughout.
   
  Bear in mind I'm not claiming these to be accurate but I do find them way more listenable than the highly accurate Etymotic Research ER4P earphones. While I do agree with the placement of the ER4P in this review the JVCs score should be higher but not above the ER4P as they truely are not as accurate but points need to be given for listenability. Concerning the treble balance JVC has done well here as they are very detailed without excess sibilance or irritation. In this they should outscore the ER4P if not for the inaccuracy in the lower spectrum. Cymble sounds are very realistic & with softly struck cymbles you can hear the sound of the stick used to strike it with & this sound is exactly how I would imagine it if seated close to the drum set. Vocals are more fleshed out than the ER4P though this is due to the upper mids being a tad soft on the JVC's but does give the vocals warmth & body the ER4Ps lack to a slight degree. Piano music definately suffers though from the excess warmth of the JVC's & as a result don't sound realistic & here the accuracy of the ER4P shines as piano music always sounds correct. Piano is one of the most difficult instruments to reproduce & admittedly the JVC's fail here in a big way due to the excess bass & warmth but I still feel that they deserve a higher score than they have been given here as most music they still sound very good & seem to always be at least listenable in spite of thier inaccuracies


----------



## jackson

RE-ZEROs are discontinued, no?
   
  Quote: 





paulypaul said:


> I thought the RE0 was quite a bit better than PL50.
> I couldnt get the bass impact from the BA of the PL50 and the highs of the PL50 are nowhere near as extended as the  RE0s.
> The mids of the PL50s are nice, but not as nice as my RE-ZEROs.
> 
> RE-ZEROs > RE0 > PL50  thats my opinion.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





jackson said:


> RE-ZEROs are discontinued, no?


 


  Not as far as I can see: http://www.head-direct.com/product_detail.php?p=89
  They ARE a limited edition of 1000 (supposedly) but they don't seem to have sold out just yet. I'd imagine that there's a good few hundred left.


----------



## jfgwapo

Can you include Senns IE 6 next time you update? I think I can afford one from Amazon. Nice review. Thank you..


----------



## Pianist

Hmm... I am listening the q-jays now and if they indeed have less treble energy than CK10 and PS200, then I think those two are definitely over the top in the treble department. I would probably consider q-jays to have about the maximum treble energy that I am willing to tolerate in a headphone, as they are already north of neutral up there. Also, I feel that the mids on the q-jays are actually very, very nice and are certainly noteworthy. They may not be the focus of the presentation, but for the price I think mids don't really get much better than that if at all. I think q-jays are only a hair behind IEMs like e-Q7 and SE530 in the mids department and up there with RE0 and IE8. IE8 may have slightly better texture, but q-jays have better resolution and speed. There is a slight dip in the upper mids, nothing major, but the lower and mid mids are fantastic on the q-jays IMO - clear, articulate and generally very accurate.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Q-jays has great treble, but for instance DBA-02 has more treble. In fact it is on the limit I can handle...
  
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> Hmm... I am listening the q-jays now and if they indeed have less treble energy than CK10 and PS200, then I think those two are definitely over the top in the treble department. I would probably consider q-jays to have about the maximum treble energy that I am willing to tolerate in a headphone, as they are already north of neutral up there. Also, I feel that the mids on the q-jays are actually very, very nice and are certainly noteworthy. They may not be the focus of the presentation, but for the price I think mids don't really get much better than that if at all. I think q-jays are only a hair behind IEMs like e-Q7 and SE530 in the mids department and up there with RE0 and IE8. IE8 may have slightly better texture, but q-jays have better resolution and speed. There is a slight dip in the upper mids, nothing major, but the lower and mid mids are fantastic on the q-jays IMO - clear, articulate and generally very accurate.


----------



## Angelopsaro

i am about pullthe trigger for an brainwavz M1.  Can nu force compare to the m1's? I read good reviews about them, but they are so low in the joker's board, comparing to the m1's.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


angelopsaro said:


> i am about pullthe trigger for an brainwavz M1.  Can nu force compare to the m1's? I read good reviews about them, but they are so low in the joker's board, comparing to the m1's.


 

  I guess that's just the way the cookie crumbles. The NE-6 is a good earphone but if I were you I'd check the date on the really good reviews - they were extremely popular ~1.5 years ago but the budget IEM market has come a long way since then.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> angelopsaro said:
> ...


 

 Yes, your right.
  I am also really confused with the M1 vs the R02 (now no pre sale by mp4nation). I  think this is the noobie's dilemma.
  I remember back to my first post here, where you suggested me the R02 over the M1.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I understand that R02 have an advantage on the bass factor and a bit more sparkly(?). I dont know why but i am leaning to the M1. Maybe the R02 are a bit better but i feel the M1's idea grow on me. So since you stated that the differences are not so big and are simply different but equal i will go with the M1.  I also like the no strain relief's factor, silly me, but i do.
  Maybe because they are 32ohm and more balanced i think i can play better with the eq of my J3 (you have one too
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). And also will help me start separating the sound so i go depper into the sound hobby.
   
  P.S which are more laid back?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> I am also really confused with the M1 vs the R02 (now no pre sale by mp4nation). I  think this is the noobie's dilemma.  I remember back to my first post here, where you suggested me the R02 over the M1.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  The R02 is actually less sparkly than the M1 as a result of their more bottom-biased balance. I would say that the NE-6 is the most laid-back, followed by the R02 and then M1, but I don't consider any of them even close to fatiguing (compared to other sets like the RadioPaq classical, JVC HA-FXC80, etc). 
   
  The M1 responds extremely well to EQ so I think you may be on to something there. The R02 responds well also as you would expect since they are very closely-related but is a little less flat to start with.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

FA Genesis is available but it is a dynamic driver... it is 60 USD... so not so high end..
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> jasonb said:
> ...


----------



## kiev88

Amazing thread!!!
   
  Quick question: Would you say the Ortofon EQ7 bass is more impactful and richer than that of qJays?
   
  Has anyone heard the Grado G10?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kiev88 said:


> Quick question: Would you say the Ortofon EQ7 bass is more impactful and richer than that of qJays?


 

  More impactful - probably not. At best the EQ-7 has *slightly* more present bass but not in terms of sheer impact. It does possess certain characteristics of a dynamic-driver earphone that may make its bass more appealing than the clean-and-dry q-JAYS but I wouldn't put them on different tiers in terms of bass presentation.


----------



## DVDIT

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  X2. I have the UE TF10 pro (custom re-shelled) and the RE0 sounds better to me in every thing except bass. With an external amp or EQing, I get the type of bass I like. I regret having the TF10 re-shelled because now I can't even play around with different tips to tame those excessively bright and harsh treble.  On some tracks, the treble becomes way over the top for my taste. I am now looking at the IE8 and Monster Turbine copper or I might just spring for the SM3 if I can sell the TF10 at a reasonable price for someone who want to have them re-shelled.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> kiev88 said:
> ...


 

 Well, I agree for the most part, except that I think both e-Q7 and q-jays sound quite dry and in fact, I think e-Q7 is actually dryer than q-jays, which is not a bad thing of course, just different voicing. In other parts of the spectrum I also feel that these two IEMs trade blows - e-Q7 has richer mids with better texture and perhaps more natural, less fatiguing treble, whereas q-jays are a bit faster, clearer and more resolved. I feel that in the treble q-jays have an advantage of better micro detail and more refinement compared to e-Q7, which sound a bit grainy by comparison. Overall, both are great IEMs and I don't think I can say that e-Q7 is overall better than q-jays - they are just too different to compare. The richer, wider sound of the e-Q7 will appeal to some people more, while others may prefer the q-jays' better separation and overall detail resolution and won't mind a somewhat compressed soundstage.
   

  
  Quote: 





			
				DVDIT said:
			
		

> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Hell yeah, when properly amped, the bass on RE0 is fantastic!


----------



## jackson

Damnit, so how would you guys compare the FA DBA-02 vs RE-ZERO ?
   
  You're making this difficult!


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





jackson said:


> Damnit, so how would you guys compare the FA DBA-02 vs RE-ZERO ?
> 
> You're making this difficult!


 

 Rawrster can answer that.


----------



## rawrster

It's not that hard a decision 
   
  First off there is availability. DBA-02 is not readily available like the RE-Zero so it will depend on how patient you are. Secondly is price. RE-Zero is $99 while DBA-02 is $170 or so (I can't remember the price). In terms of sound they are close and I did do some minor comparisons between the two when I decided to sell one of them. I still have the RE-Zero but I will admit that the DBA-02 is the superior phone but I don't feel like I am missing much with the RE-Zero. The thing about the RE-Zero is that unless you get lucky and have an output that makes contact with the balanced plug on the RE-Zero you will need an adapter and luckily for you HifiMan provides two adapters to choose from.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> It's not that hard a decision
> 
> First off there is availability. DBA-02 is not readily available like the RE-Zero so it will depend on how patient you are. Secondly is price. RE-Zero is $99 while DBA-02 is $170 or so (I can't remember the price). In terms of sound they are close and I did do some minor comparisons between the two when I decided to sell one of them. I still have the RE-Zero but I will admit that the *DBA-02 is the superior phone* but I don't feel like I am missing much with the RE-Zero. The thing about the RE-Zero is that unless you get lucky and have an output that makes contact with the balanced plug on the RE-Zero you will need an adapter and luckily for you HifiMan provides two adapters to choose from.


 
   
  Can you expand on that a bit please? Thanks.


----------



## DVDIT

rawrster & Pianist,
   
  Coming from the RE0, and as someone looking RE0 type sound quality but with bass that has more impact and deeper, wider soundstage, and silky smooth mids, would you consider any of these a natural upgrade and superior in overall sound quality to the REO ? I am looking at DBA-02 IE8, MC Turbine Pro Copper, Westone 3 and SM3 ? I want one top tier primary universal that works with all types of genres but I mostly listen to world music and  I am a sucker for vocal, BTW.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The RE-Zero can sound thin in the bass area and some details I am accustomed to hearing from other earphones are not there in the RE-Zero. The bass esp in the sub bass is an area of issue in the RE-Zero so there's stuff missing there and it doesn't sound natural due to the bass response. The DBA-02 while suffer from a similar problem does it better than the RE-Zero and has a bit more weight to make it sound more natural. Also the DBA-02 does have a bit better clarity, speed and resolution. IMO going from the RE-Zero to the DBA-02 is like using an amp when you want to the last couple % of SQ. The difference isn't as much as say from an ER6i to the RE262.
   
  I find the RE-Zero and DBA-02 to have similar sound signatures but I think of the DBA-02 as a slightly refined RE-Zero in some areas at least when I had them both.


----------



## Icy56

quick question, is there any iem under $100 that has the similar sound sig to the m50s? i currently use the m50 for home and the ie6s for portable use but i think the ie6 sound terrible clarity  wise. Im looking at the re0 and hje900 but i don't know which to choose because of the lack of bass on the re0 and the reviews of the hje900 sounding distant and harsh? i was going to go for the hje900 because of their praise and build quality but i just read this: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/521977/hifiman-re0-vs-panasonic-hje900-vs-nuforce-ne-7m-review and now i dont know what to choose. please help. im looking for very clear treble (i like hearing everything so i don't care if its analytical) good mids and good bass (similar to m50, not like the overpowered ie6).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


icy56 said:


> was going to go for the hje900 because of their praise and build quality but i just read this: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/521977/hifiman-re0-vs-panasonic-hje900-vs-nuforce-ne-7m-review and now i dont know what to choose.


 

  Not to imply anything I can't back up but that review is way too complimentary of the NE-7M based on what I heard out of them. They are good phones, no doubt, but quite a few of the details in that review don't work for me. If you want my opinion I'd say ignore that one and go with the HJE900 over the RE0. They won't be too similar to the M50s but should be way closer than the IE6 (which doesn't impress me much).  The Sunrise Xcape is another one you could  take a look at though it's quite bit dryer than the M50 tends to be and doesn't have the bass weight or sparkle of the M50.


----------



## jackson

I don't want the RE252 because of the weird shape.  I'm worried they won't fit my ears.


----------



## Pianist

I just got a pair of RE252s in a temporary trade with a local head-fi'er. Impressions: the driver used in these things is absolutely incredible. In his review of them, kostalex notes that they are only slightly behind the $1000 Beyerdynamic T1 and have a similar overall sound. I would probably agree with him. However, all that great sound is ruined for me by the horrible fit - I just can't for the life of me get these things to stay in my ears and the bass, soundstage and isolation suffer a lot.


----------



## proedros

ask benny71 how he wears them without problems , once he is done putting them on their pedestal 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> I just got a pair of RE252s in a temporary trade with a local head-fi'er. Impressions: the driver used in these things is absolutely incredible. In his review of them, kostalex notes that they are only slightly behind the $1000 Beyerdynamic T1 and have a similar overall sound. I would probably agree with him. However, all that great sound is ruined for me by the horrible fit - I just can't for the life of me get these things to stay in my ears and the bass, soundstage and isolation suffer a lot.


----------



## Pianist

Some more impressions on the RE252s: These sound really... weird. : \ The bass is super well defined and extremely detailed, but rather weak and lacking substance. The mids are probably the most accurate and revealing of any IEM I've heard. The treble is really soft sounding - there is a small peak in the lower treble region, but there is not even a hint of sibilance. For me the jury is still out on how accurate the treble is - on one hand all the detail is there, but on the other, it does not really reveal sibilance even if it is present on the recording. Sibilance is not a good thing of course, but an accurate headphone should still show it. Overall, I somehow get a feeling that the drivers in these IEMs of of insanely high quality, but something is seriously preventing them from sounding their best. It may be the fit, my crappy sources, the acoustic properties of the weird rubber housing... Whatever it is, I feel that it ruins what could've been an amazing sound. I got the same feeling with Shure SE530 BTW - insanely good drivers, but the fit was so horrible for me that I almost never really heard anything close to the sound that these IEMs are actually capable of producing.
   
  So anyway, I am switching back to my q-jays for now - out of all IEMs I've heard so far, they are probably strike the best balance between sound and ergonomics.


----------



## Icy56

Thanks for the suggestions. Once i have the money i will be getting the Sunrise Xcape or the HJE900. One last question, since isolation is also a very big factor for me would getting the HJE900/Xcape and putting on triple flanged tips or foamies isolate almost/the same as the ety mc5?
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> icy56 said:
> ...


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Quote: 





icy56 said:


> Thanks for the suggestions. Once i have the money i will be getting the Sunrise Xcape or the HJE900. One last question, since isolation is also a very big factor for me would getting the HJE900/Xcape and putting on triple flanged tips or foamies isolate almost/the same as the ety mc5?


 
   
  In short, no. The isolation of Etymotic IEMs is to do with the design of the monitors themsleves than the tips used, though obviously the tri-flanges help a bit. Otherwise Joker's isolation stat would have to be entirely based on stock tips and wouldn't have anything to do with the monitor at hand. I actually get less isolation from biflanges than from singles, but maybe I'm just weird.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


pianist said:


> However, all that great sound is ruined for me by the horrible fit - I just can't for the life of me get these things to stay in my ears and the bass, soundstage and isolation suffer a lot.


 
 Welcome to the club. I'm happy for those who can use the RE252 comfortably, I really am, but I can't and have never explicitly recommended them to anyone who wasn't already considering them because the fit is such a toss-up.
   

 Quote:


icy56 said:


> Thanks for the suggestions. Once i have the money i will be getting the Sunrise Xcape or the HJE900. One last question, since isolation is also a very big factor for me would getting the HJE900/Xcape and putting on triple flanged tips or foamies isolate almost/the same as the ety mc5?


 
 No, they still won't match the MC5. And you'll need really long ear canals to use tri-flanges with the HJE900 or Xcape. Honestly an isolation above 3/5 on my scale should be good enough for the daily commute unless maybe you take the subway or need to have total silence.


----------



## Icy56

Oh, ok thanks for the reply. Wow I cant believe I completely forgot about the isolation part of his chart. I am really a noob at this.
  
  Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Icy56

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> No, they still won't match the MC5. And you'll need really long ear canals to use tri-flanges with the HJE900 or Xcape. Honestly an isolation above 3/5 on my scale should be good enough for the daily commute unless maybe you take the subway or need to have total silence.


 


  Ok thanks for the reply, I just need total silence for when I am at home or in the library and it starts to get noisy i.e. people talking or tv blaring and I need to do my homework. I find it very hard to concentrate if I hear things around me and right now my ie6, earplugs, and m50s are not doing the job good enough. The isolation would really help for my daily commute too.
   
  Quote: 





joethearachnid said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for the reply, I cant believe I completely forgot about that portion of the chart. I am a complete noob at this.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Westone 1, 2, and 3.


----------



## izaku

Wow, 3 IEM reviews in the row.
  Now you mentioned more about SM3 and TF10.
  Hopefully you are able to write the comparison in near future 
   
  headfiers must thank for your effort as usual. Many decisions are made from this review.


----------



## Hero Kid

Now that's a trifecta people have been waiting for. Well done!


----------



## airwax

Thanks for the reviews of the Westones Joker. I can safely say that I chose the right earphone for me with the W2. As an overall package, the W2 is pretty damn excellent.


----------



## s0lar

This thread really gets better every day!
  I looked for the Sennheiser IE7, but the price is a bit higher then I hoped and not easy to get my hand on, so I ordered a RE0 from ampcity. Now I also ordered the mini3 diy kit and I am really curious about all of this. I have read about the foam-removal of the RE0, so I am interested about that as well.
  Are there any other European forum members here that find it hard to find most of the good IEM's in the shops.
  Of course you can always buy from the internet, but, there doesn't seem to be a choice. From what I have read the RE0 is a top IEM, I guess I won't need another after that.


----------



## Kpalsm

Thanks very much joker, for this _huge _comparison! Excuse my ignorance (I "searched" the thread, haven't read it) but have you listened to the UM2 yet, and if so, where would that fit? It's what I'm planning to buy. From what I've read, it seems it's hard to go wrong with those


----------



## Inks

Nice reviews, also the IE8 should get updated on the chart with having phone capabilities now.


----------



## dfrost

Joker,
   
  The more I learn about IEMs, the more impressed I am with your ability to describe and compare them.


----------



## JoeyRusso

Great addition of the Westone W family ljokerl.  Your impressions fall right into place.  I agree the W3's aren't for everyone and they are tip and fit dependent (I prefer the Shure Olive's with both W2 & W3). The W2's were less finicky with tips.  They are undoubtedly my two favorite IEM's to date.  I agree that the W3's won't appeal to those who find joy in analyzing music or an IEM's presentation, but for pure enjoyment, they are hard to beat for me.  I use all of my IEM's for "fun" listening.  The W3's get my toes tapping, head banging or make me want to dance every time they're in my ears (sorry about the bad dancing visual - LOL).  The W2's were perfect for casual listening while reading or working, engaging enough but not overwhelming, a great all-arounder.  As always, thanks for your hard work.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


izaku said:


> Wow, 3 IEM reviews in the row.
> Now you mentioned more about SM3 and TF10.
> Hopefully you are able to write the comparison in near future
> 
> headfiers must thank for your effort as usual. Many decisions are made from this review.


 
 Thanks. I've been working on the SM3 but very slowly since it's a complex sound signature and also because I have other reviews that have deadlines on them. The TF10 has already been delayed for a while since it's mine and I don't feel any pressure to finish it (plus I don't like the fit at all). I'll get them done eventually.
   

 Quote:


hero kid said:


> Now that's a trifecta people have been waiting for. Well done!


 
 Quote:


airwax said:


> Thanks for the reviews of the Westones Joker.


   
   
  Quote:


s0lar said:


> This thread really gets better every day!
> I looked for the Sennheiser IE7, but the price is a bit higher then I hoped and not easy to get my hand on, so I ordered a RE0 from ampcity. Now I also ordered the mini3 diy kit and I am really curious about all of this. I have read about the foam-removal of the RE0, so I am interested about that as well.
> Are there any other European forum members here that find it hard to find most of the good IEM's in the shops.
> Of course you can always buy from the internet, but, there doesn't seem to be a choice. From what I have read the RE0 is a top IEM, I guess I won't need another after that.


 
  Thanks, and congratulations on your purchase. I did try the foam mod back when I had the RE0 but it already had enough treble for my tastes with the foam so I ended up putting it back in. YMMV.

   

 Quote:


kpalsm said:


> Thanks very much joker, for this _huge _comparison! Excuse my ignorance (I "searched" the thread, haven't read it) but have you listened to the UM2 yet, and if so, where would that fit? It's what I'm planning to buy. From what I've read, it seems it's hard to go wrong with those


 
  Thanks, and no - no plans for a UM2. I haven't tried either that or the UM1 and from what I've read they wouldn't hold my interest too well (even the W2 struggles with that).

   

 Quote:


inks said:


> Nice reviews, also the IE8 should get updated on the chart with having phone capabilities now.


 
  Thanks, wasn't aware of that. I'll change it with the next update.

   

 Quote:


dfrost said:


> Joker,
> 
> The more I learn about IEMs, the more impressed I am with your ability to describe and compare them.


 
 Hah, thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'm really not as good at digging deep as some of the other members here but having a large basis for comparisons makes it seem like I know what I'm talking about 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   

 Quote:


joeyrusso said:


> Great addition of the Westone W family ljokerl.  Your impressions fall right into place.  I agree the W3's aren't for everyone and they are tip and fit dependent (I prefer the Shure Olive's with both W2 & W3). The W2's were less finicky with tips.  They are undoubtedly my two favorite IEM's to date.  I agree that the W3's won't appeal to those who find joy in analyzing music or an IEM's presentation, but for pure enjoyment, they are hard to beat for me.  I use all of my IEM's for "fun" listening.  The W3's get my toes tapping, head banging or make me want to dance every time they're in my ears (sorry about the bad dancing visual - LOL).  The W2's were perfect for casual listening while reading or working, engaging enough but not overwhelming, a great all-arounder.  As always, thanks for your hard work.


 
 Well, to be honest I _prefer _the W3 to the W2 by a pretty wide margin though of course I factor such things out of my reviews. The W3 is special and very unique - at least nothing I've heard out in IEM-land sounds quite like it. The W2 is like a warmer and more refined and spacious Ety MC5 with a much better fit and no cable noise. It's great for what it is but it doesn't do much for me in terms of pure enjoyment.


----------



## proedros

Hey Joker
   
  any plans on reviewing the *re-262 * ?
   
  The 'great thread' part is skipped cause you know that all of us reading this thread think so


----------



## rawrster

A nice addition to your reviews  All we need now is all the UE earphones and then some others and you should be good for a while  I'll look forward to your RE262 whenever that comes out.
   
  The W2 is one of my more favorite earphones that I've loaned with the next one probably being the CK100. I definitely like it more than the W3 and it indeed is a safe choice and it is somewhere in between an analytical CK10 or a fun earphone like a W3.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


proedros said:


> Hey Joker
> 
> any plans on reviewing the *re-262 * ?
> 
> The 'great thread' part is skipped cause you know that all of us reading this thread think so


 
 Oh wow, yes - I forgot to add the RE262 (and the Brainwavz M3) to the already-daunting 'planned review' list on the front page. 
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> A nice addition to your reviews  All we need now is all the UE earphones and then some others and you should be good for a while  I'll look forward to your RE262 whenever that comes out.
> 
> The W2 is one of my more favorite earphones that I've loaned with the next one probably being the CK100. I definitely like it more than the W3 and it indeed is a safe choice and it is somewhere in between an analytical CK10 or a fun earphone like a W3.


 
  By the time I finish up all of the UE reviews the next word in universals will probably be right around the corner... And yeah, I can see you (and many others) liking the W2 although it falls too far from both 'fun' and 'analytical' for me personally.


----------



## JoeyRusso

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> > Originally Posted by *JoeyRusso* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 And that my friend is why I still have and will keep my W3's.  The W2's have moved on to another set of ears as an intro to the Westone sound..


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote:


rawrster said:


> A nice addition to your reviews  All we need now is all the UE earphones and then some others and you should be good for a while  I'll look forward to your RE262 whenever that comes out.
> 
> The W2 is one of my more favorite earphones that I've loaned with the next one probably being the CK100. I definitely like it more than the W3 and it indeed is a safe choice and it is somewhere in between an analytical CK10 or a fun earphone like a W3.


 


  Rawrster, how would you compare the W2 and the RE262?
   
   
  ljokerl, what would you say about the W2 bass impact vs the e-Q7?


----------



## buffalowings

ljokerl, thanks for the additional reviews on the Westone family. with the right eartips, they should fit next to anyone right? could it be possible for a person to have ears that prevent the housing from...fitting


----------



## rawrster

I guess if they have small ears I could see the W3 not fitting too well.
   
  I was asked between the RE262 and W2 recently and briefly mentioned some differences between the two over here.  In terms of impact of W2 and e-Q7 they are fairly similar with the W2 probably providing a hair more but hard to compare without A/B. I will say that the e-Q7 has much better body, texture, and detail in the bass and is one of the best bass quality I have heard in an earphone.


----------



## ibrahimovic

Nice W


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I guess if they have small ears I could see the W3 not fitting too well.
> 
> I was asked between the RE262 and W2 recently and briefly mentioned some differences between the two over here.  In terms of impact of W2 and e-Q7 they are fairly similar with the W2 probably providing a hair more but hard to compare without A/B. I will say that the e-Q7 has much better body, texture, and detail in the bass and is one of the best bass quality I have heard in an earphone.


 

  
  Hm interesting, thanks! How about RE262 and e-Q7 bass?


----------



## xtasi

Wow so many planned reviews.  I have to say that is impressive.
   
  I was just wondering if you also planned on reviewing the nuforce ne-700X?  It's unreleased, but I thought maybe its something worth looking at in the future.


----------



## rawrster

I can't answer between the RE262 and e-Q7 especially when they are not there for A/B and both being very good earphones. I think ClieOS would be the person to ask since he has both. I have the feeling the e-Q7 still has better texture however but no chance at A/B.


----------



## monoglycer

Great reviews of the westones joker, you captured what I thought about them as well as being a  really enjoyable read.


----------



## JxK

Great review joker.
  Regarding the W1, I'm guessing it's closest competitor in terms of sound, price, and design is the PFE? And I'm assuming, based on your chart, that the PFE pretty much beats it hands down as a total package?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> ljokerl, what would you say about the W2 bass impact vs the e-Q7?


 
 I'd say pretty similar - neither is anemic but then they aren't bass-heavy, either. Like rawrster I put a lot of value in the technical characteristics of the Ortofons' bass, which treads a fine line between 'natural' and 'accurate'. I remember it having pretty solid extension so the W2 may roll off a little earlier but other than that not very different.
  
  Quote:


buffalowings said:


> ljokerl, thanks for the additional reviews on the Westone family. with the right eartips, they should fit next to anyone right? could it be possible for a person to have ears that prevent the housing from...fitting


 
 I can see the W3 being a pain to fit for someone with smaller ears as they are a little fat for my liking. With longer tips they should still fit but you will have to get used to something pressing into your ear.
   

 Quote:


xtasi said:


> Wow so many planned reviews.  I have to say that is impressive.
> 
> I was just wondering if you also planned on reviewing the nuforce ne-700X?  It's unreleased, but I thought maybe its something worth looking at in the future.


 
 Ha, it'll be impressive if I actually get through all of them. I was not aware the NE-700X existed until yesterday, to be honest. I suppose I should contact Nuforce but at the same time that planned review list is pretty daunting and I feel like I should try and stay focused on those... dozen or so earphones.
   

 Quote:


monoglycer said:


> Great reviews of the westones joker, you captured what I thought about them as well as being a  really enjoyable read.


 
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   

 Quote:


jxk said:


> Great review joker.
> Regarding the W1, I'm guessing it's closest competitor in terms of sound, price, and design is the PFE?


 
 In terms of price, yes, but the PFE is a fairly analytical earphone so the W1 is to the PFE what the W2 is to the CK10 - a less energetic and aggressive sound that's noticeably warmer and slightly smoothed-over. To me the PFE has less sonic flaws than the W1 does although for vocal-centric  music I can see someone picking the Westones. I'd say for sound its closest competitors are the Soundmagic PL50 and UE SF5 v2, which are both a lot cheaper. Granted, neither is quite as resolving and transparent as the W1 but the difference is much smaller than the price indicates and the SF5 has a bigger soundstage while the PL50 doesn't lack as badly in extension.


----------



## Ginuwine

amazing thread man! this makes everyones lives much easier! thanks again!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Westone 1, 2, and 3.


 

 Nice reviews, I enjoyed reading them. I'm happy I was able to loan you the W3 for the review.  I agree the fit of the W3 makes or breaks the sound.  I've found the UM56 custom tips give me the proper deep insertion and best sonic balance.  Otherwise, based on the sound signature I would describe the W3 as being almost like a universal fit UE11Pro.


----------



## germanturkey

personally, i like how every review is also sort of a review of the CK10.  haha.  its always a good read; things that i don't/won't have.  though it would seem to me that the W2 is what i would want out of the three.


----------



## JoetheArachnid

Joker, I know it's kind of stalking but I can't help noticing that the RE262 is listed in your sig where the CK10 once was. Could it be that we've found a new king? Sorry if I'm just reading in to it too much


----------



## Golden Monkey

Excellent read!  I can't wait for your full write-up of the EarSonics SM3.  I just got mine yesterday and am blown away.  Coming from detailed yet uncomfortable and sterile Ety ER-4P/S's to these is a night and day difference.  Where the Etys are dry, neutral, analytical, and very flat in response, these are much more magical, warm, impactful, and sweet.  I always loved my Ety's but there was always something missing (or rather, there was NOTHING missing, but they just aren't fun).  If the Ety ER-4 is the AKG K-701, the SM3 is the HD650.  Sure, the IE8 may be closer to that, but these strike an incredibly fine middle path in all things...not too much anything, not too lacking in other areas.  I too need some more time with them to fully appreciate them for what they are.


----------



## rawrster

If only the RE262 didn't make the J3 so inefficient. I might have to pick up one of those players with more power such as a C30 for the RE262 if I considered using it in my portable rig.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





golden monkey said:


> *Excellent read!  I can't wait for your full write-up of the EarSonics SM3.*
> 
> 
> You and me both, I hope he tells the truth and nothing but the truth or forever hold your....I have a strong feeling these will blow....everything out of the water. This is my chart of reference, and it looks very promising.
> ...


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





confispect said:


> > You and me both, I hope he tells the truth and nothing but the truth or forever hold your....I have a strong feeling these will blow....everything out of the water. This is my chart of reference, and it looks very promising.
> >
> >
> > http://anythingbutipod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15243


 


  That chart is funny, on the CK10 he gives treble "medium", Isolation "medium", comfort "medium" ease of insert "bad".
   
  Sure, people have different ears, but for me ease of insert is "high", comfort "pillow-like", Isolation "very good" and treble in the 6kHz-10kHz sector "supreme".
   
  Unless there's something I don't know about q-jays or x-jays, I think the ck10 are surely the best IEM's in the world... _for their size_.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Hmmm, I would have thought comfort to be good, I can understand treble medium though......sibilance. Different ears.


----------



## Golden Monkey

I found this chart a little more useful in the descriptions: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/476315/top-tier-universal-iem-comparison-chart-frequency-response-charts-discussion
   
  Coincidentally, SM3 topped the list, lol.  In a recent convo with average_joe, he stated that his favorite IEM was still the SM3, and I'm inclined to agree, although I don't have nearly the breadth of knowledge that he or dftk or joker has with them.  I just know what I like...and I LOVE these, lol.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


ginuwine said:


> amazing thread man! this makes everyones lives much easier! thanks again!


 
 Thanks, glad the the thread is useful.
   

 Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> Nice reviews, I enjoyed reading them. I'm happy I was able to loan you the W3 for the review.  I agree the fit of the W3 makes or breaks the sound.  I've found the UM56 custom tips give me the proper deep insertion and best sonic balance.  Otherwise, based on the sound signature I would describe the W3 as being almost like a universal fit UE11Pro.


 
 Thanks. To be honest it was your disclaimer on loaning them to me that made me persevere with the fit of the W3 - as much as I like to think that I would've been patient enough to figure it out on my own, I have to admit that the sound of the W3 with stock single-flange tips is quite discouraging 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

 Quote:


germanturkey said:


> personally, i like how every review is also sort of a review of the CK10.  haha.  its always a good read; things that i don't/won't have.  though it would seem to me that the W2 is what i would want out of the three.


 
 I have to have a consistent benchmark and since the CK10 is the one I am probably most familiar with of the IEMs I actually own (and scores high on technical points) I think it makes a good one. Plus it gives those who own/have heard the CK10 a relate-able perspective although I do try to throw in some comparisons to other earphones when reviewing higher-end gear.
   

 Quote:


joethearachnid said:


> Joker, I know it's kind of stalking but I can't help noticing that the RE262 is listed in your sig where the CK10 once was. Could it be that we've found a new king? Sorry if I'm just reading in to it too much


 
  Ha. Actually, my CK10 is out on loan so I've had to settle for the next best thing lately. I agree with rawrster that the RE262 is not a reasonable portable solution with the J3 because it drains mine in under 7 hours but I don't have room in my sig for all of the IEMs I have in rotation..

   

 Quote:


golden monkey said:


> Excellent read!  I can't wait for your full write-up of the EarSonics SM3.  I just got mine yesterday and am blown away.  Coming from detailed yet uncomfortable and sterile Ety ER-4P/S's to these is a night and day difference.  Where the Etys are dry, neutral, analytical, and very flat in response, these are much more magical, warm, impactful, and sweet.  I always loved my Ety's but there was always something missing (or rather, there was NOTHING missing, but they just aren't fun).  If the Ety ER-4 is the AKG K-701, the SM3 is the HD650.  Sure, the IE8 may be closer to that, but these strike an incredibly fine middle path in all things...not too much anything, not too lacking in other areas.  I too need some more time with them to fully appreciate them for what they are.


 
 Thanks and I definitely understand what you mean about the SM3 being magical and not sounding like a compromise despite not being the absolute best at _everything_. It seems that they are an even better match for you than they are for me since it only took you a day to like them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

 Quote:


confispect said:


> You and me both, I hope he tells the truth and nothing but the truth or forever hold your....I have a strong feeling these will blow....everything out of the water. This is my chart of reference, and it looks very promising.


 
 Well I've already admitted a couple of pages back that I have to re-scale the chart for the SM3 which is part of the reason why it's taking so long 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   

 Quote:


kiteki said:


> That chart is funny, on the CK10 he gives treble "medium", Isolation "medium", comfort "medium" ease of insert "bad".
> 
> Sure, people have different ears, but for me ease of insert is "high", comfort "pillow-like", Isolation "very good" and treble in the 6kHz-10kHz sector "supreme".
> 
> Unless there's something I don't know about q-jays or x-jays, I think the ck10 are surely the best IEM's in the world... _for their size_.


 
 Agreed and I also don't understand how DFKT managed to coerce microphonics from the CK10. I've worn them while jogging and even cable-down, which they weren't designed to do, microphonics were still very low. Everything else is relatively subjective but microphonics I don't get 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## rawrster

Just remember that the chart on that site is just one man's opinion. The last time I saw that chart I disagree with a lot on that chart but it is based on his opinions. If I made a chart it would be very different in many ways.
   
  Regarding the CK10 many users have used them with triple flange tips to get them to sound the best and triple flange tips are not as easy to insert as the sony hybrids. I had much better comfort with the hybrids although then it was prone to sibilance compared to triple flanges which did not have sibilance but was not as comfortable.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

anyone here who owned RE0 and q-jays?
  That chart is strange. It says little bass to q-jays and medium to RE0????


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> anyone here who owned RE0 and q-jays?
> That chart is strange. It says little bass to q-jays and medium to RE0????


 


  So what do you feel it should say as Rawster said this is just his opinion dfkt is known thru-out head fi as a good reviewer. So I'd say he's accurate....but different ears.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

I know he is a good reviewer. I bought the hje900 because of his review and I was happy with it.
  The thing is that RE0 lacks bass while q-jays has good quality and quantity bass...


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> I know he is a good reviewer. I bought the hje900 because of his review and I was happy with it.
> The thing is that RE0 lacks bass while q-jays has good quality and quantity bass...


 


  Agreed, but quantity......eh I disagree I ditched the Jays (not because of bass), acquired the Phonaks and haven't looked back. Quality yes quantity no, medium perhaps. Different ears the Phonak sounded more punchy, as well as having more body with both filters. The jays are comfortable though...


----------



## mcnoiserdc

well it is strange you guys find the q-jays to lack bass... little for me means lack.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> well it is strange you guys find the q-jays to lack bass... little for me means lack.


 


  Different ears.


----------



## ljokerl

Eh, it's a silly argument. I am sure much my own ranking doesn't bode well with some people although I do my best to explain my reasoning. It's most pointless to argue about sound as it's always subject to preferences (well.. to an extent. When someone prefers the AudioSource IEBAS to the CK10 I will quit). I just remarked on the microphonics which aren't very subjective as it seems almost as if dfkt had it in for the CK10 on that front.


----------



## Golden Monkey

Hey, as long as the reviewer is objectively reviewing, isn't being a blatant fanboy/shill, can compare and contrast, and is articulate enough to explain what he hears, I'm happy.  Being that all ears are different, and we all hear differently, I take any notes on fit, comfort, and relative value with a grain of salt.  Not that I'd think they were WRONG, I just know better than to assume that I'd have the same response.


----------



## DVDIT

ljokerl,  Thanks for all the hard work you do. I bought the IE8 yesterday. Your review was instrumental is my final decision to go with IE8. What a fantastic thread !!!


----------



## TMMC

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> anyone here who owned RE0 and q-jays?
> That chart is strange. It says little bass to q-jays and medium to RE0????


 
  I have both, and q-Jays has more bass with sony hybrid, TX100 and even more with olives. q-Jays are way more punchy than RE0.
   
  q-Jays is better than RE0 in many aspects (without amp).
  
  Keep the good  work |joker|.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

thanks, guess what I did the same thing you did.
  I registered at abi only to disagree with that q-jays statement. and you made the first post about it too, lol!
  
  Quote: 





tmmc said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## faideelah

Hello. I'm looking for new IEMs in the $70-$100 range. I am currently using Sony MDR-EX56LP and want to upgrade. Would I need an amp since I am mostly going to use my iPhone. Are RE0s one of the more recommended IEMs in the list since it's higher up on the chart?
   
  I listen mostly to R&B, hip hop, and on occasion alternative and electronic.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

well in my conscience the best suited for you at that price and likes is the panasonic hje900. but you have to see if you need high isolation or average isolation. you can find the hje900 at 75 USD. read the hje900 review to see if it pleases you.
  The RE0 is light on bass which is needed for your likings...


----------



## TMMC

It's impossible to have everything right. I disagree about the build quality of both. q-jays is one step ahead RE0 and td100.  
  
  Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> thanks, guess what I did the same thing you did.
> I registered at abi only to disagree with that q-jays statement. and you made the first post about it too, lol!
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ejs811

amazing resource, thanks for all the hard work!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


dvdit said:


> ljokerl,  Thanks for all the hard work you do. I bought the IE8 yesterday. Your review was instrumental is my final decision to go with IE8. What a fantastic thread !!!


   
   
  Quote:


ejs811 said:


> amazing resource, thanks for all the hard work!


 
  Thanks!
  
   
  Quote:


faideelah said:


> Hello. I'm looking for new IEMs in the $70-$100 range. I am currently using Sony MDR-EX56LP and want to upgrade. Would I need an amp since I am mostly going to use my iPhone. Are RE0s one of the more recommended IEMs in the list since it's higher up on the chart?
> 
> I listen mostly to R&B, hip hop, and on occasion alternative and electronic.


 
 Whether you need an amp or not depends much more on the earphone you are planning to buy than on your source. AFAIK the iPhone should drive almost all of the IEMs in the thread just fine unamped (especially those in the <$100 bracket). 
   
  As a general rule 'higher up the chart' does mean equal 'better' but you should definitely read some full reviews of the earphones you're looking into to make sure that they have the type of sound you want. In addition, you have to decide on what factors aside from sound are more important to you as some earphones isolate more than others, some come with more bundled accessories, etc etc.
   
  The RE0 is very good for a certain type of sound - neutral, balanced, and  detailed - but not everyone will like them equally. For R&B and Hip-hop perhaps something else would be a better choice. How about the Thinksound TS02+mic? Very easy-going sound and you'll get iPhone functionality as a bonus.


----------



## Anaxilus

I second the TS02 for Rap and Hip-Hop.  Plus acoustic pieces.  The bass on the 900 isn't of sufficient character for those genres IMHO.


----------



## Caesar56

This Post was born in the Olympus and gets 10/10 in epicness.
  Thanks a lot Joker for your time, dedication and devotion. Keep it up!


----------



## zoritativo

hi guys!
  I have to make a gift to my son and unfortunately I have no experience in this field.
  What headphones do you recommend for (max max max) 30 €(euro) all included?
 (i'm in italy).
  i've seen in mp4fornation the :
   
  MS PL30    16.67€
  Brainwavz M1  29.26€
   
  I read that the first model has a problem of hissing with the Cowon i9.
  the same problem is present with the sansa Fuze and PL30??
  Can you advice me some other models, maybe in another shops?
   
  P.s: the players that i have chosen are good?around 100€, these are the best choices?
   
  thank you very much!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


caesar56 said:


> This Post was born in the Olympus and gets 10/10 in epicness.
> Thanks a lot Joker for your time, dedication and devotion. Keep it up!


 
 Thanks!
   

 Quote:


zoritativo said:


> hi guys!
> I have to make a gift to my son and unfortunately I have no experience in this field.
> What headphones do you recommend for (max max max) 30 €(euro) all included?
> (i'm in italy).
> ...


 
 Unfortunately I don't have any hands-on experience with the Cowon i9. The PL30 is pretty sensitive but it doesn't hiss with my Fuze/clip or Cowon J3. Hisses with some other sources though so who knows. However, with those prices I would definitely make the jump to the Brainwavz M1 or the new ProAlpha (known as the ViSang R02 in this review). The M1 definitely won't hiss with any consumer-level portable player as it's pretty inefficient. 
   
  As for portable players, I really don't have a very good grasp on what's out there but perhaps someone in the portable source forum can make other suggestions. I don't remember why I skipped the Cowon i9 but I don't recall reading anything bad about its sound.


----------



## zoritativo

thanks for the reply!
  i've seen the pro alpha in the site and they have the same prices!
  I'm directed to the fuze sansa with rockbox plugin...which is "better" for this consumer player?
  give me a name because i'm sailing in the dark
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





...
  another last question..in your opinion, what these headphones are inefficient with these players? they are very castrated or only minimally?
   
   
  thanks a lot!
  bye


----------



## kiteki

He's saying the PL30 can hiss, and the M1 should not hiss, hiss is usually very low anyway, you can't really hear it with music playing.
   
  For 100 euros there are many players to choose from, perhaps you should spend less on the player and more on the earphones, like Sansa Clip+ and FA Eterna or something like that.


----------



## leberserkfury

any chance that you could add Grado GR10 to this list? thanks


----------



## nicknyhk

Can't be said enough..Thank you Thank you Thank you for this thread. I know music is subjective and putting a number on them is kinda wrong but these numbers(engineering student, need the numbers to compare...feelings don't play well on choosing a iem)  along with the pros and cons makes life way easier to at least pick out a few to choose from. Would appreciate it if a the Sleek Sa-6 could get in line for a review. Thinking about getting that or Sa-7 (depending on how reviews pan out) for Xmas.. Once again cheers and keep up the good work


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


zoritativo said:


> thanks for the reply!
> i've seen the pro alpha in the site and they have the same prices!
> I'm directed to the fuze sansa with rockbox plugin...which is "better" for this consumer player?
> give me a name because i'm sailing in the dark
> ...


 
 Yes, the M1 and ProAlpha have the same price because they are basically the same earphone with different tuning. The ProAlpha is tuned for a slightly warmer and bassier sound while the M1 is more balanced. Either will work fine from a Fuze or any other modern player - all that the inefficiency of the M1 means is that I have to dial the volume up to around 10/40 on my J3 to get the same output from them as I do with the ProAlpha at 7/40. 
   

 Quote:


leberserkfury said:


> any chance that you could add Grado GR10 to this list? thanks


 
 To be honest I wasn't planning on it. I had a really bad experience with Grado following my review of the iGi and plan to leave no more of my money with them as a company (I've even gone in a different upgrade path with my home cans). If someone lends me a GR10 for review down the line, I won't complain, but I have no intention of buying my own.
   

 Quote:


nicknyhk said:


> Can't be said enough..Thank you Thank you Thank you for this thread. I know music is subjective and putting a number on them is kinda wrong but these numbers(engineering student, need the numbers to compare...feelings don't play well on choosing a iem)  along with the pros and cons makes life way easier to at least pick out a few to choose from. Would appreciate it if a the Sleek Sa-6 could get in line for a review. Thinking about getting that or Sa-7 (depending on how reviews pan out) for Xmas.. Once again cheers and keep up the good work


 

  Thanks - good to hear that from a fellow engineer! I've wanted to review the SA6 for some time now but it never panned out and now I guess there's not much a point as it's an outgoing model (and I have my hands pretty full). Maybe the SA7...


----------



## sdhobbs

Amazing job ljokerl!  Can't wait for your SM3 review!


----------



## rawrster

I always thought the M1 would have more bass than the ProAlpha. I had the R02 although was never really for music purposes but they didn't have that much bass to begin with compared to a lot of other earphones I own or have heard in that price range.


----------



## buffalowings

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> He's saying the PL30 can hiss, and the M1 should not hiss, hiss is usually very low anyway, you can't really hear it with music playing.
> 
> For 100 euros there are many players to choose from, perhaps you should spend less on the player and more on the earphones, like Sansa Clip+ and FA Eterna or something like that.


 


  when going through a amp, many IEMs have some serious hissing


----------



## Veemo

Great post, but I see one problem, TOO MUCH! I want them all! How can one decide?!


----------



## zoritativo

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, the M1 and ProAlpha have the same price because they are basically the same earphone with different tuning. The ProAlpha is tuned for a slightly warmer and bassier sound while the M1 is more balanced. Either will work fine from a Fuze or any other modern player - all that the inefficiency of the M1 means is that I have to dial the volume up to around 10/40 on my J3 to get the same output from them as I do with the ProAlpha at 7/40.


 

 fantastic!thanks for your job and for your time!
  your passion has arrived in italy, in particular in rome.....
   

   
  very compliments!


----------



## Marcus_C

Great recent batch of reviews joker as ever, they are a good read.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


sdhobbs said:


> Amazing job ljokerl!  Can't wait for your SM3 review!


 
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> I always thought the M1 would have more bass than the ProAlpha. I had the R02 although was never really for music purposes but they didn't have that much bass to begin with compared to a lot of other earphones I own or have heard in that price range.


 
 Nope. The R02/ProAlpha is not a bass-monster but it's not exactly lacking at the low end either. At least 5dB of bass boost according to the graph. I'm guessing the M1 is a bit closer to being flat when it comes to mid-bass.
  
  Quote:


veemo said:


> Great post, but I see one problem, TOO MUCH! I want them all! How can one decide?!


 
 Well, tell all these companies not to release any more earphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

 Quote:


zoritativo said:


> fantastic!thanks for your job and for your time!  your passion has arrived in italy, in particular in rome.....


 
 Thanks and good luck. Hope both you and your son like the earphones you pick out!
   
  Oh and it's a small world. Looks like some measly 12,000 km...
   

 Quote:


marcus_c said:


> Great recent batch of reviews joker as ever, they are a good read.


----------



## Confispect

Yes please with the SM3...when you give it a 10 send them over here.


----------



## Golden Monkey

Joker, been meaning to ask you...what's your take on break-in as far as IEMs are concerned?  Do you feel they benefit at all from doing it?  I think unlike a full size phone or something with capacitors in it they don't seem to need it, especially with armature designs.  I suppose a small dynamic speaker would react much like a full size one does though, and some break-in would help.  In your testing and reviewing process do you just take them as they are out of the box, or do you have any sort of guideline for break-in?  Thx. in advance!


----------



## proedros

Hi Joker
   
  Just wanted to add +1 vote on you reviewing these 2 IEM's (if they come your way of course ,no stress)
   
   
*RE-262*
*GR-10*
   
   
  I am finally starting to swim on my own here and not feel like a complete noob, but i will NEVER forget what a HUGE help this thread was in helping me decide on my first serious IEM (a pair of re-zero)
   
  Keep up the good work my friend


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





proedros said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Just wanted to add +1 vote on you reviewing these 2 IEM's (if they come your way of course ,no stress)
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  1+ still waiting on the SM3, I'm thinking a bullying session must take place.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


golden monkey said:


> Joker, been meaning to ask you...what's your take on break-in as far as IEMs are concerned?  Do you feel they benefit at all from doing it?  I think unlike a full size phone or something with capacitors in it they don't seem to need it, especially with armature designs.  I suppose a small dynamic speaker would react much like a full size one does though, and some break-in would help.  In your testing and reviewing process do you just take them as they are out of the box, or do you have any sort of guideline for break-in?  Thx. in advance!


 
  
  I always give my dynamics a flat 100 hours of burn-in to rule out any variables. I do think that some of my dynamics have changed (not necessarily improved) with burn-in but I've never heard a difference from an armature-based earphone though, to be fair, I've only purchased a couple of armature-based earphones with crossovers brand new. I keep BA burn-in at around 40 hours just to be safe but don't really believe in it.
   
  My burn-in rig is consistent - a Fiio S3 (used as a low-voltage USB-powered DAP) and a 5-way 3.5mm splitter. I level the volume to just above listening volume with the lowest-impedance earphone/headphone that's connected. The player has a 256mb SD card loaded with pink noise/white noise/random music and a 30 min 'blank' track. Played sequentially it gets to the 30 min 'break' every loop so about every 3.5-4 hours.
   
   
   
  Quote:


proedros said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Just wanted to add +1 vote on you reviewing these 2 IEM's (if they come your way of course ,no stress)
> 
> ...


 
  I have the RE262 - I just forgot to add it to the 'planned review' list. Hope to get to it soon as I actually do enjoy it quite a bit.


----------



## rawrster

Just curious but have you gotten a pair of Xcape? I have a pair in my ears right now and think they might be something you enjoy. It's not analytical like a CK10 but it's still pretty enjoyable at least from my short listening time with them so far.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Hi!
   
  I saw on in the Fischer Audio DBA-02 Review that you used etymotic triple flanges or the shure tips if I remember well.
  I don't like the tips provided from fischer but I find the foam tips from q-jays to do the job. The thing is it doesn't git well.
  Do you know of any foam tip that is the size of the q-jays tips but that has the nozzle size of DBA-02. I ask so because I use the foam tips that came with my triple fi 10, but they are too lengthy which absorbs the highs I think.


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have the RE262 - I just forgot to add it to the 'planned review' list. Hope to get to it soon as I actually do enjoy it quite a bit.


 


  Is the fact that you have the RE262 in your signature now as your portable any indication of how much you like them? IIRC, that spot has been graced by the CK10 for quite some time


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> Just curious but have you gotten a pair of Xcape? I have a pair in my ears right now and think they might be something you enjoy. It's not analytical like a CK10 but it's still pretty enjoyable at least from my short listening time with them so far.


   
  Yeah, I have an Xcape and I do like it. Very very dry sound (been using the RE262 and M3 lately) but excellent for the price on the whole.
  
   
  Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> Hi!
> 
> I saw on in the Fischer Audio DBA-02 Review that you used etymotic triple flanges or the shure tips if I remember well.
> I don't like the tips provided from fischer but I find the foam tips from q-jays to do the job. The thing is it doesn't git well.
> Do you know of any foam tip that is the size of the q-jays tips but that has the nozzle size of DBA-02. I ask so because I use the foam tips that came with my triple fi 10, but they are too lengthy which absorbs the highs I think.


 
 I did't have any when I tried the DBA-02 but maybe the Shure/Ety foamies (orange/yellow ones) would work. Might have to stretch the inner core a bit but it should be a nice, tight fit. Those tubby q-JAYS tips are pretty unique though so maybe a reverse adapter mod (using the core from a another tip inside the q-JAYS core to make them stay on the nozzle is an option too.
   

 Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> Is the fact that you have the RE262 in your signature now as your portable any indication of how much you like them? IIRC, that spot has been graced by the CK10 for quite some time


 

  No, my CK10s are out on loan so I didn't want to keep them in my sig. In their absence I do resort to the RE262 for casual listening but part of that is because some of my other decent IEMs (W2, TF10, IE7) are out also.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I did't have any when I tried the DBA-02 but maybe the Shure/Ety foamies (orange/yellow ones) would work. Might have to stretch the inner core a bit but it should be a nice, tight fit. Those tubby q-JAYS tips are pretty unique though so maybe a reverse adapter mod (using the core from a another tip inside the q-JAYS core to make them stay on the nozzle is an option too.


 
  What you are recommending me for the q-jays tips, I am doing with the comply foams that came with triple fi 10. but I can't do that with the q-jays tips I have because the q-jays tips are damaged


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah, I have an Xcape and I do like it. Very very dry sound (been using the RE262 and M3 lately) but excellent for the price on the whole.
> 
> No, my CK10s are out on loan so I didn't want to keep them in my sig. In their absence I do resort to the RE262 for casual listening but part of that is because some of my other decent IEMs (W2, TF10, IE7) are out also.


 


  Ah yes, dry is exactly how I would describe the Xcape. There was something peculiar about them and I just couldn't quite put my finger on it. They sound great, but coming from the Custom 3, e-Q7, and RE262 they are dry in comparison, which may be a good or bad thing depending on your preferences.
   
   
  Haha interesting how you call it "resorting" to the RE262, as if they are some sort of torture device that you had to be forced to put on.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> rawrster said:
> ...


 

 Ah I'll wait for when the review on them comes out eventually probably not anytime soon. I listened to them most of the day and they are pretty enjoyable. I did get my TS02 back today in the mail so not sure how much time they will get ;p I was expecting the Xcape to be a more bassy earphone such as my HJE900 but I was surprised in a nice way. It's a good thing I have a policy of only owning earphones that I would use often or I'd be buying a whole bunch of earphones lately.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


> What you are recommending me for the q-jays tips, I am doing with the comply foams that came with triple fi 10. but I can't do that with the q-jays tips I have because the q-jays tips are damaged


 
 Doesn't JAYS sell replacement tips? I know you can buy their silicones pretty easily, especially in Europe.
   
  Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> Ah yes, dry is exactly how I would describe the Xcape. There was something peculiar about them and I just couldn't quite put my finger on it. They sound great, but coming from the Custom 3, e-Q7, and RE262 they are dry in comparison, which may be a good or bad thing depending on your preferences.
> 
> Haha interesting how you call it "resorting" to the RE262, as if they are some sort of torture device that you had to be forced to put on.


 
 Perhaps 'resorting' was the wrong word. I like the RE262 quite a bit but I usually try not to use sets that I still have in review for casual listening since I have a tendency to focus on the earphone and not the music. I don't do that with earphones I'm very familiar with so the CK10 would normally be my casual listening implement of choice. 
   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> Ah I'll wait for when the review on them comes out eventually probably not anytime soon. I listened to them most of the day and they are pretty enjoyable. I did get my TS02 back today in the mail so not sure how much time they will get ;p I was expecting the Xcape to be a more bassy earphone such as my HJE900 but I was surprised in a nice way.


 
 Well Sunrise is responsible for some of the Head-Direct earphones. I didn't read much on the Xcape besides some random posts in recommendation threads and some short comparisons but for some reason it was exactly what I expected. I also like how the shell tapers towards the front - I think more manufacturers need to do that.
   
   
   
  Quote:


> It's a good thing I have a policy of only owning earphones that I would use often or I'd be buying a whole bunch of earphones lately.


   
  Yeah well... now I'm jealous 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Maxvla

Joker,

Using the MEElectronics M9 as the starting point, do you have a suggestion (up to ~$1500) for an IEM (or custom) that has similar bass (or slightly less) quantity, great bass quality, the same 3D headstage, but with great mids and fast ultra clear highs? I've come to appreciate these M9s more than when I first got them (certainly), but the crunchy highs are getting to me. I'm also considering a wholesale rig swap from traditional cans to IEMs (amped at home with desktop amp, no amp portably). The 3D headstage on these M9s is addictive, and going back and forth with my HE-6, the massive difference in bass quantity leaves me wanting IEMs.

Thanks,

Chris


----------



## EraserXIV

I have no personal experience with these, but take a look at the JH16, which is supposedly the JH13, but with more bass.


----------



## Maxvla

I'm aware of those 2, but wanted to know if there were any alternatives with the characteristics I am looking for. Especially if there are universals that will do the trick and be much cheaper. I've been happy with my HD600 in the face of many many higher end setups I didn't prefer, so I have no problem not being the 'I spent the most, I'm the coolest' person.

Also, if someone can answer a couple quick questions regarding customs:

I read in the customs intro thread/wiki thing that impression kits are often wrong and a professional impression is recommended. I've never visited an audiologist. How much will something like this cost? How long does it take to get them crafted once you mail off the impressions? Are they heavy at all?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxvla said:


> Using the MEElectronics M9 as the starting point, do you have a suggestion (up to ~$1500) for an IEM (or custom) that has similar bass (or slightly less) quantity, great bass quality, the same 3D headstage, but with great mids and fast ultra clear highs? I've come to appreciate these M9s more than when I first got them (certainly), but the crunchy highs are getting to me. I'm also considering a wholesale rig swap from traditional cans to IEMs (amped at home with desktop amp, no amp portably). The 3D headstage on these M9s is addictive, and going back and forth with my HE-6, the massive difference in bass quantity leaves me wanting IEMs.


   
  Ha, that budget is way out of my budget 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. If you move up from the M9 to universals in the $150-400 range you will definitely get the all of the improvements you are looking for. The M9 is very bass-heavy so the IE8 could be to your liking but for a realistic and immersive headstage I can't recommend the Earsonics SM3 highly enough. The Monster Miles Davis will probably appeal to you as well - it's definitely got the bass you're after and the soundstaging is at least as good as with the M9. Not the quickest earphone but again at least as fast as the M9. Also extremely smooth in the midrange and treble. The M9 really is pretty low on the foodchain when you start comparing it to top-tiers so there's plenty of options. 
   
  That said, you are indeed looking at customs with the latter $1k of that price range (erm... FAD earphones excepted) and I really don't have much experience. My first custom is currently just entering the production stage over at 1964EARS so I really won't even know how it compares to all the universals for a little while. 
  
   
  Quote:


maxvla said:


> Also, if someone can answer a couple quick questions regarding customs:
> 
> I read in the customs intro thread/wiki thing that impression kits are often wrong and a professional impression is recommended. I've never visited an audiologist. How much will something like this cost? How long does it take to get them crafted once you mail off the impressions? Are they heavy at all?


 

  Yep, definitely get a professional impression done. I used Westone's site to find an audiologist 10 mins from my house. You can also use the audiologist locator on UE's site - their databases don't overlap too much. She came in on a Saturday for me and charged just $20/ear. Very easy process - took maybe 20 mins total. Slight bit of discomfort with the ear pressure build up when the silicone putty is injected but nothing terrible. After that there's the added expense of mailing off the impressions (since I wasn't getting Westones it wasn't included in her price) - a massive $4.95 in my case. 
   
  Crafting time depends on the company. I've heard of people getting a 2-day turnaround with JHA but I was promised 5-10 days plus shipping time by 1964. No idea if the customs are heavy yet but I'm guessing no more than some of the metal-shelled universals.


----------



## rawrster

The ones I have are 3 drivers and they aren't really that heavy. It doesn't seem that much heavier than my other earphones
   
  which model customs did u end up getting joker?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I guess that's right.  I had the same issue w/ finding the right descriptor for that Xcape dryness.  I think shigzeo referred to it as sheen.  Perhaps the reason I couldn't come up w/ 'dry' is because I usually associate dry with lean or thin.  The Xcape is certainly not that to my ears.


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> I guess that's right.  I had the same issue w/ finding the right descriptor for that Xcape dryness.  I think shigzeo referred to it as sheen.  Perhaps the reason I couldn't come up w/ 'dry' is because I usually associate dry with lean or thin.  The Xcape is certainly not that to my ears.


 

  
  Yes I agree, they are definitely not lean or thin. They have a full sound, but are still somewhat "dry" which is a very peculiar mix of traits. Don't really want to get too deep into semantics, but I think sheen is a good way to describe it as well.


----------



## rawrster

I can see people finding the Xcape light in bass if they are used to more heavy stuff. If I only had my TS02 or HJE900 they would be considered to be thin in the bass. I like it so far however. It's closer to my signature than some of the previous earphones I've been listening to it and is enjoyable for the most part. If only they  had a chin slider and shirt clip  I just have to find some good tips for them.


----------



## Maxvla

ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> maxvla said:
> ...




Thanks. Really appreciate it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> The ones I have are 3 drivers and they aren't really that heavy. It doesn't seem that much heavier than my other earphones
> 
> which model customs did u end up getting joker?


 


  1964-T (trips)


----------



## davidcotton

My second pair of westone 2's just failed today.  So requested a refund.  First pair the nozzle came off, second pair, the right side died completely.  I liked the size, and sound (although felt it could do with a bit more bass) and isolation (very important this!).  I did have slight issues with the fit on my right side.  Just wondering now if I ought to either get a third set of w2's or take the plunge with something else.  Looking at either a sideways step level quality or upwards and have done with it.  W3's sound like it could be too much of a good thing.  Would be used mainly at work.  Using an ipod touch second gen.
   
  Cheers.


----------



## rawrster

I was hoping that's the pair you would choose out of them. The triple driver is the one I've looking at and what better way than to have someone who has a similar preference to mine get it first ;p I look forward to impressions whenever they are done and send them to you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


davidcotton said:


> My second pair of westone 2's just failed today.  So requested a refund.  First pair the nozzle came off, second pair, the right side died completely.  I liked the size, and sound (although felt it could do with a bit more bass) and isolation (very important this!).  I did have slight issues with the fit on my right side.  Just wondering now if I ought to either get a third set of w2's or take the plunge with something else.  Looking at either a sideways step level quality or upwards and have done with it.  W3's sound like it could be too much of a good thing.  Would be used mainly at work.  Using an ipod touch second gen.


 
 Well if you're happy with the rest of the W2's sound I can't think of anything else to recommend. There is no 'W2 with more bass' earphone that I'm aware of that would also keep you in the same price tier. Moving up you could try the SM3 but it is bigger and not as easy on the ears (fit-wise) as the W2.
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> I was hoping that's the pair you would choose out of them. The triple driver is the one I've looking at and what better way than to have someone who has a similar preference to mine get it first ;p I look forward to impressions whenever they are done and send them to you.


 
 Yeah, had to get the trips. 2-way x-overs generally bode pretty well with me and the extra bass driver over the duals might be nice to have. Time will tell.


----------



## rawrster

That's partly why I'm planning on buying them and probably over the JH5 as both are the same price for me. Those have a dual bass and single treble while my current customs are single low and dual highs. I'm hoping it's a dual CI22955 and single ED29689 driver. Hopefully it works out for you as you finally enter the world of customs


----------



## germanturkey

hmm, you think you'll end up review those NOX Audio Scouts?  they made a wave on cnet!  haha


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> That's partly why I'm planning on buying them and probably over the JH5 as both are the same price for me. Those have a dual bass and single treble while my current customs are single low and dual highs.* I'm hoping it's a dual CI22955 and single ED29689 driver*. Hopefully it works out for you as you finally enter the world of customs


 

 rawrster, try calling the company and asking them. I called them earlier out of curiosity to get an idea of what the IEMs are supposed to sound like, and they were remarkably forthcoming insofar as driver choice and sound signature are concerned. For instance, the single driver apparently uses the exact same armature as found in the shure e3. Didn't ask for specifics about the others, but it's surprisingly nice that they actually disclose such information. Props to them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> That's partly why I'm planning on buying them and probably over the JH5 as both are the same price for me. Those have a dual bass and single treble while my current customs are single low and dual highs. I'm hoping it's a dual CI22955 and single ED29689 driver. Hopefully it works out for you as you finally enter the world of customs


 
 I'll try to take photos of the insides but I have no idea how the my color selection will turn out at this point. Hopefully the molding quality is good enough for them to remain transparent even with dye. 
   

 Quote:


germanturkey said:


> hmm, you think you'll end up review those NOX Audio Scouts?  they made a wave on cnet!  haha


 
 First I've heard of them... I'll put them on the list of companies to contact but I really need to figure out a way to prioritize.


----------



## legodt

Would you say that any of these IEMs stand up to the sound quality of the HD25-1 II?


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Well I am not such a specialist, but I have had several IEMs from the list which I find better than hd 25-1 II.
  I can list some like, hje900, jays q-jays, dba-02, re0...
  But people opinions are diverse...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





legodt said:


> Would you say that any of these IEMs stand up to the sound quality of the HD25-1 II?


 


  Yes, many. I'd say the portable scale translates to the IEM scale with roughly the same sound ratings, which is one of the reasons I had to stop at 9/10 for the portable scale - I have yet to hear a portable that can touch some of my high-end IEMs in speed or detail.


----------



## legodt

Thanks again for being so thorough with your review methods. Happy listening!


----------



## ljokerl

Added two new sets - Earjax Tonic & Lyrics


----------



## TheGame21x

Nice to hear about the Earjax IEMs. I should be receiving a review sample from Earjax in the near future and seeing as you hear IEMs pretty much the same way as I do, it's nice to have an idea of what to expect when I receive them.


----------



## rawrster

Mike, how are you able to keep up with the market for these earphones? It seems that there's some new company popping up every week (at least new to me) and you seem to always know who they are.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Mike, how are you able to keep up with the market for these earphones? It seems that there's some new company popping up every week (at least new to me) and you seem to always know who they are.


 


  I've been wondering the same thing. If there's a new company or a new pair of IEMs on the market (or soon to be released) |joker| always seems to know about them first. It's pretty amazing actually.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


thegame21x said:


> Nice to hear about the Earjax IEMs. I should be receiving a review sample from Earjax in the near future and seeing as you hear IEMs pretty much the same way as I do, it's nice to have an idea of what to expect when I receive them.


 
 Thanks - hope you like them too. I do think the Lyrics is a nice sounding set but it would be helped if the price was close to the $50-60 level. The Tonic is good for the money though it's really not my type of signature and that amount of bass really doesn't work with all genres.
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Mike, how are you able to keep up with the market for these earphones? It seems that there's some new company popping up every week (at least new to me) and you seem to always know who they are.


 
 Keep up? You give me too much credit. I've got a list of companies I'd like to contact for review purposes and that list is filling up about 4x faster than I'm working through it. And that's not counting well-known brands that are due to release new gear (Nuforce, MEE, etc). Soon I will have to start discriminating (gasp) between the sets I choose to review.
   
  Interestingly, one of the ways is keeping  an eye on the google ads on sites I visit since I pretty much only get headphone-related ads.


----------



## EraserXIV

Haha yeah, those google ads can get pretty creepy. They track your website visits and then pump user-specific related content to you in the ads. Mine are mostly headphone related. My brother's computer is mostly video game related.


----------



## Maxvla

Well I officially cast off full size headphones, just now. You guys might be seeing more of me in the IEM section. It's ironic I used to bad mouth IEMs because of my bad experience with a pair of early Shures, and the Q-Jays, but now I've cast my lot for IEMs. I'm not sure where I'll start, either trying to find my tastes in the universal mid to high range, or go straight for a high end custom and hope and pray my choice is right. I'm glad to have a resource like this thread, and the many regular posters in this and other IEM threads. A little pre-thanks, guys.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





maxvla said:


> Well I officially cast off full size headphones, just now. You guys might be seeing more of me in the IEM section. It's ironic I used to bad mouth IEMs because of my bad experience with a pair of early Shures, and the Q-Jays, but now I've cast my lot for IEMs. I'm not sure where I'll start, either trying to find my tastes in the universal mid to high range, or go straight for a high end custom and hope and pray my choice is right. I'm glad to have a resource like this thread, and the many regular posters in this and other IEM threads. A little pre-thanks, guys.


 

 As someone who is well versed in your acoustic preferences I say go for customs.  You should use your headphone knowledge and look for a signature that lines up w/ your preference as much as possible.  I recommend you head straight to customs if you are looking purely at sound.  If you are looking for non SQ related attributes that universals can bring then don't make the quick jump.  If you like the laid back but balanced Senn sound of your 600's perhaps the JH13 or 3A/16 would be the way to go if money is no object.  My 2 cents.  Then again, ask yourself if it's about the journey or the destination.


----------



## kiteki

I know this is a long-shot, but is there a dynamic-driver, more acoustic sounding equivalent to the CK10's?  I like the ck10's a lot, but if there is such an IEM (or earbud) I think it would be ideal for me, so I thought I'd check in case such an item exists, or if anyone has had a similiar line of thought.  Thanks in advance.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I know this is a long-shot, but is there a dynamic-driver, more acoustic sounding equivalent to the CK10's?  I like the ck10's a lot, but if there is such an IEM (or earbud) I think it would be ideal for me, so I thought I'd check in case such an item exists, or if anyone has had a similiar line of thought.  Thanks in advance.


 

 Just a guess here.  RE252?


----------



## EraserXIV

maxvla said:


> Well I officially cast off full size headphones, just now. You guys might be seeing more of me in the IEM section. It's ironic I used to bad mouth IEMs because of my bad experience with a pair of early Shures, and the Q-Jays, but now I've cast my lot for IEMs. I'm not sure where I'll start, either trying to find my tastes in the universal mid to high range, or go straight for a high end custom and hope and pray my choice is right. I'm glad to have a resource like this thread, and the many regular posters in this and other IEM threads. A little pre-thanks, guys.


 

 If you are in search of a great soundstage and 3D imaging in an IEM, I can't recommend the RE262 enough. It is really an interesting IEM and has given me a sound that I haven't heard in any other headphone or IEM. They are power hungry little buggers though and require a source with a decent voltage swing to sound their best due to the high impedance. They do sound great though without an amp, but will scale really well if you do feed them. There are a couple of great reviews out there that pretty much hit the key points head on so take a look at those to gauge whether these fit your musical preference.
   
  Another IEM that I particularly love is the e-Q7. It gives a blend of musicality, transparency, clarity, and detail that is very hard to come by. I still consider it the best overall headphone/IEM I've ever heard (though an amped RE262 hits pretty damn close and I may change my mind after burn in...). They really put you _into _the music and I sometimes get lost for hours at a time listening to these. Apparently, the new e-Q5 and GR10 give a similar sound so I think it's worth looking into those as well.
   
   
  Customs are another monster all together and I have no experience there. Some claim they are another level up altogether, while other say high-end universals hit pretty close. Although, I find it easy to believe the high end customs will blow high end universals out of the water. The engineering that goes into customs such as the JH3a is pretty ridiculous and I wouldn't be surprised if the sound is equally breathtaking.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Thanks anax, I'll read up on them.  What is your taste in music, btw?
   
  You had the ck10's briefly and sold them right? how come?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxvla said:


> Well I officially cast off full size headphones, just now. You guys might be seeing more of me in the IEM section. It's ironic I used to bad mouth IEMs because of my bad experience with a pair of early Shures, and the Q-Jays, but now I've cast my lot for IEMs. I'm not sure where I'll start, either trying to find my tastes in the universal mid to high range, or go straight for a high end custom and hope and pray my choice is right. I'm glad to have a resource like this thread, and the many regular posters in this and other IEM threads. A little pre-thanks, guys.


 
 Well, i'd like to welcome you to the dark side but I really feel that IEMs are the lesser of two evils compared to full-size cans. Also, us portable forum folk are generally more agreeable 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  If you plan to start with universals I'd consider the SM3 but of course I'm not personally familiar with your signature preferences. It's a good all-rounder without any serious turn-offs (that I can hear) and I do feel that it is an IEM capable of incredibly intimacy without losing too much presence at the outer limits of its soundstage, in contrast to something like the IE8 which has a humongous stage but struggles with both intimacy and limitlessly portraying distance.
   
   
  Quote:


kiteki said:


> I know this is a long-shot, but is there a dynamic-driver, more acoustic sounding equivalent to the CK10's?  I like the ck10's a lot, but if there is such an IEM (or earbud) I think it would be ideal for me, so I thought I'd check in case such an item exists, or if anyone has had a similiar line of thought.  Thanks in advance.


 
 What exactly do you mean by 'acoustic-sounding'? If you're after a more natural timbre than nearly any dynamic will do it but you will most likely lose the speed and microdetail of the CK10. You need to figure out what you're trying to gain and what you're willing to sacrifice. The CK10 is the right set for me (or at least has been thus far) since I am not willing to sacrifice imaging, transparency, speed, or microdetail but of course only a few here share my listening preferences to the dot.


----------



## Maxvla

anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I think I might start with a few universals just to get my feet wet, but quickly move to customs. The part that has me worried about customs, especially jumping right in, is if I choose poorly, the resale will be worse and more difficult. In an ideal situation I would have a good enough grasp on different IEM signatures to make an informed choice on my customs. If I had to choose right now it would really just be a guess. After the revelation I've just had, excuse me if I don't put any faith at all in full size to IEM signature comparisons. At this point they mean nothing to me. I really feel like I'm starting from scratch, which is nice, but also frustrating. It took several years to get to where I knew exactly where I wanted to be with full size cans. I think I can make the move in IEMs faster, but starting the process again is a bit daunting.

Thanks for the suggestions, both you and Eraser. HeadphoneAddict also recommended the Westone ES5 in the realm of customs.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What exactly do you mean by 'acoustic-sounding'? If you're after a more natural timbre than nearly any dynamic will do it but you will most likely lose the speed and microdetail of the CK10. You need to figure out what you're trying to gain and what you're willing to sacrifice. The CK10 is the right set for me (or at least has been thus far) since I am not willing to sacrifice imaging, transparency, speed, or microdetail but of course only a few here share my listening preferences to the dot.


 

 I mean I'm just curious what the closest dynamic-driver IEM to the CK10 is. =p
   
  Yes I'm after a more natural and lifelike timbre.  I can sacrifice a little speed and microdetail, I'd like to keep the excellent imaging, mids, highs and flat FR feeling, oh and comfort and isolation. =p
   
  I can also just compliment the CK10's with another high-end IEM, in which case I'll just go for something that excels at the opposite genres to my ck10's, and I won't mind if they have weaknesses such as mid spikes or are overly raw sounding.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kiteki said:


> I mean I'm just curious what the closest dynamic-driver IEM to the CK10 is. =p
> 
> Yes I'm after a more natural and lifelike timbre.  I can sacrifice a little speed and microdetail, I'd like to keep the excellent imaging, mids, highs and flat FR feeling, oh and comfort and isolation. =p
> 
> I can also just compliment the CK10's with another high-end IEM, in which case I'll just go for something that excels at the opposite genres to my ck10's, and I won't mind if they have weaknesses such as mid spikes or are overly raw sounding.


 
 Closest would probably be the RE252, as Anaxilus said, but there's several that share key characteristics. You also don't have to stray from BAs to have a more natural sound, though it helps. Personally I think that the CK10 is weakest with female vocals as well as tone-dependent instruments such as piano, sax, and woodwinds. If you're looking for a compliment to the CK10 rather than a replacement perhaps something that does those well would be a good place to start - the Monster MD comes to mind, for example.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Closest would probably be the RE252, as Anaxilus said, but there's several that share key characteristics. You also don't have to stray from BAs to have a more natural sound, though it helps. Personally I think that the CK10 is weakest with female vocals as well as tone-dependent instruments such as piano, sax, and woodwinds. If you're looking for a compliment to the CK10 rather than a replacement perhaps something that does those well would be a good place to start - the Monster MD comes to mind, for example.


 

 Ah, I thought perhaps I haven't spent enough time with them yet, but I'm glad you agree their lesser strengths lie in female vocals and piano and such, and not that I'm just being picky or inept at hearing any sombre natural tones or seductive lifelike female vocals in them.   For violin I have not decided yet, it lingers between amazing and too smooth, or too shrill with a bright source like my blu-ray player (cd's).
   
  I am liking them more and more, I was not a fan of the smooth mids and I recognized it's similarity to the k701's which I do not like, but I am getting used to it, I think I like them too much to experiment with a replacement but we'll see, they are afterall, exceptional in what they excel at, excellent with electronica and trance, and have a true studio-monitor -like flat FR which requires zero eq'ing.
   
  For compliments I'll check out the Monster MD, thanks, even though I don't like jazz =p.  I see Anax is using them, I am also close to pulling the trigger on the ATH CM700 which seem very interesting and almost out of stock these days.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





maxvla said:


> I think I might start with a few universals just to get my feet wet, but quickly move to customs. The part that has me worried about customs, especially jumping right in, is if I choose poorly, the resale will be worse and more difficult. In an ideal situation I would have a good enough grasp on different IEM signatures to make an informed choice on my customs. If I had to choose right now it would really just be a guess. After the revelation I've just had, excuse me if I don't put any faith at all in full size to IEM signature comparisons. At this point they mean nothing to me. I really feel like I'm starting from scratch, which is nice, but also frustrating. It took several years to get to where I knew exactly where I wanted to be with full size cans. I think I can make the move in IEMs faster, but starting the process again is a bit daunting.Thanks for the suggestions, both you and Eraser. HeadphoneAddict also recommended the Westone ES5 in the realm of customs.


 

  
  Something to consider is if possible try to demo the customs you are interested in. If you have some local meets there might be a representative from JHA, Westone, etc. who might have some demos of their customs. Also if any of their recommended audiologists is close by you can call them to see if they have any demo sets you can listen to. The good thing about universals is that you can judge if they are for you while suffering very little loss if you buy used. With customs you have to buy in faith that they will be for you. If they are not then you either suffer a big loss (they are not cheap and usually rule of thumb is that resale value is 50% MSRP or less) or are just stuck with them. I feel choosing a couple of universal earphones to find out what you like and then go for customs is a good way to go if you haven't used many earphones in the past.
   
  Also you may want to see if you can acquire some loaner earphones for the pure intention of trying them out for a couple weeks from head-fi members who would loan them to you. Something else is to see if there are any stores where you can visit that have earphones you can audition.
   
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Keep up? You give me too much credit. I've got a list of companies I'd like to contact for review purposes and that list is filling up about 4x faster than I'm working through it. And that's not counting well-known brands that are due to release new gear (Nuforce, MEE, etc). Soon I will have to start discriminating (gasp) between the sets I choose to review.
> 
> Interestingly, one of the ways is keeping  an eye on the google ads on sites I visit since I pretty much only get headphone-related ads.


 
   
  Maybe there are way too many companies popping up but you do a much better job at keeping up than I do. Since you and ClieOS are the two main people responsible for me knowing as much of the market as I do I think you are keeping up just fine ;p Of course I don't get google ads or really pay attention much since my desire for acquiring universals has pretty much ended although there are times when someone has caught my eye but I'd rather audition/loan them than buy them for the pure intention of selling them.


----------



## Maxvla

I've checked with all the major brands of customs. None of them have units to audition in my area, and the only meet we have is on the smallish side. We never have any vendors except the person who organizes the meet because he happens to live there (Alex of APureSound, Dallas). I'll see where CanJam is next year, but I don't know if I can afford the trip just to pick out a custom IEM.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





maxvla said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I could be happy with the ES5 as my one and only headphone on a desert island.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Thanks anax, I'll read up on them.  What is your taste in music, btw?
> 
> You had the ck10's briefly and sold them right? how come?


 

 Jazz, Hip/Hop, RnB, Rap, Blues, Classic rock, Swamp rock, Prog rock, Heavy Metal, Speed Metal, Death Metal, Alternative, Grunge, Ska, Classic Country, non-popish Modern Country, 80's (New Wave, Rock, Pop, Goth, Punk, Hip/hop), Disco, Foreign, Electronic, Trance, Baroque, Classical, Romantic, Opera, Reggae, Dub music (not to be confused w/ Dubstep, jury is out on that one), Big Band era, Classic and Modern folk to name a few.  There is no bad musical taste or genre, just bad musicians IMO.  I'm still waiting to hear a good Dubstep musician though.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
   
   
  I simply got a fuller, more natural sound w/ my DBA's w/o the CK10 treble spike and fatigue at almost half the cost.  That's basically it.  It was pretty close though.  I like a natural type of full bodied sound that both the DBA and MDs give me in two completely different ways for different occasions.  YMMV.


----------



## Maxvla

Well, I'm going to start my journey with the RE262 that was offered me in trade for the ipod touch I was selling. Should be a good indicator of what is possible with IEMs.


----------



## rawrster

That's a good place to start to see what earphones are capable of. Signature aside I consider them to be a pretty good earphone while not being as expensive as other top models although they are not available for sale yet but is rumored to be $249.


----------



## EraserXIV

maxvla said:


> Well, I'm going to start my journey with the RE262 that was offered me in trade for the ipod touch I was selling. Should be a good indicator of what is possible with IEMs.


 


  A great place to start out IMO. Depending on your ears, fit can be a bit tricky so make sure you're getting a good seal; I personally like wearing it over the ear w/ biflanges. Also, don't forget to feed it some power to get the most possible out of them.
   
  I've noticed a decent amount of improvement w/ burn-in. I'm at the 50 hr mark, though I've heard 70 hrs is ideal.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> maxvla said:
> 
> 
> > Well, I'm going to start my journey with the RE262 that was offered me in trade for the ipod touch I was selling. Should be a good indicator of what is possible with IEMs.
> ...


 

 I'm usually a biflange guy but the 262 sounded best w/ nice big aperture single flanges.  Helped bring up the treble and remove much of the Sennheiser veil for my ears.  I guess that is one inherent advantage IEMs have over headphones.  At least universals.  The ability to tailor tips and insertion techniques to alter the signature.  Rather than opening up your headphones for every tweak or mod and hunting down pricey if not limited selections of pads.  
   
  Yes the 262 like their power.


----------



## Inks

x2 on single flanges. Double flanges were hard to insert and get a good seal with. The result usually ended in some frequencies being cut out as they seemed to seal the sound off somewhat. And even when done right, it just didn't work so well with me. These worked well with UE single flanges and generic large bore single flange tips like the stock ones.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxvla said:


> Well, I'm going to start my journey with the RE262 that was offered me in trade for the ipod touch I was selling. Should be a good indicator of what is possible with IEMs.


 
 As good a place to start as any - they are popular right now so figuring out which direction to move in from there shouldn't be too difficult.
   

 Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> A great place to start out IMO. Depending on your ears, fit can be a bit tricky so make sure you're getting a good seal; I personally like wearing it over the ear w/ biflanges. Also, don't forget to feed it some power to get the most possible out of them.
> 
> I've noticed a decent amount of improvement w/ burn-in. I'm at the 50 hr mark, though I've heard 70 hrs is ideal.


 

  +1 for bi-flanges for me. I use gray Meelec M9 "balanced" ones. Wearing them cord-down gets uncomfortable pretty quick and cord-up I don't get a very good seal with singles. They do like a shallower insertion but I have no trouble waring bi-flanges shallowly.


----------



## EraserXIV

I much prefer wearing them up due to insertion depth and microphonics. Single flanges don't sit in my ear too well when I wear them up so I really don't have any other choice but to use biflanges I guess.
   
  How big are the M9 balanced biflanges compared to the stock biflanges that come with the RE262? The large stock biflange is a little on the big side, while the smaller stock is too small, so I'm looking for one that is a little in between the two.


----------



## rawrster

The M9 biflange is in between the 2 biflange tips that are provided. It's closer to the smaller biflange and it is a bit bigger.


----------



## EraserXIV

rawrster said:


> The M9 biflange is in between the 2 biflange tips that are provided. It's closer to the smaller biflange and it is a bit bigger.


 


  Interesting, I may have to look into getting them. How is the stiffness and feel compared to the stock hifiman?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> Interesting, I may have to look into getting them. How is the stiffness and feel compared to the stock hifiman?


 
 Thinner/softer but the gray 'balanced' ones are thicker than the black MEE tips. Size-wise they are identical to the Biflanges that came with your M9.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Just to share my knowledge.I got an email from meelectronic telling me that the melectronic R1 has a somewhat unofficial 2nd version.
  This is what they told me
   
  Quote: 





> [size=11pt] [/size]
> [size=11pt]The current R1s (what's being shipped) have some improvements over the last version - 1) the port has been relocated to the back instead of on the side of the housing; and 2) it has been retuned which is supposed to make the R1s sound even better than previous version.[/size]


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Just to share my knowledge.I got an email from meelectronic telling me that the melectronic R1 has a somewhat unofficial 2nd version.
> This is what they told me.


 
   
  Yes, I have one of the new ones here but I haven't opened it yet. I think with the exception of the M11+ all of Meelec's product updates have been unofficial thus far - otherwise we'd be on Revision 4 of the M6 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## EraserXIV

Revision 4? Oh wow, what changes were made since when they first changed to the new silver cable and debuted the clear version?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


eraserxiv said:


> Revision 4? Oh wow, what changes were made since when they first changed to the new silver cable and debuted the clear version?


 
 Well that was the first change (rev 2) but after that they changed the packaging and accessory pack (rev 3) and then later replaced the copper memory wire with a stainless steel one (rev 4). I still can't shake the feeling that my rev 1 M6 sounded best but sadly I don't have it anymore.


----------



## rawrster

I think that was the pair I had. It was the most maddening earphone I've ever had. That has got to be the worst memory wore in the history of all earphones.


----------



## EraserXIV

The copper memory wire was pretty frustrating. I eventually cut it off and just wore it without the memory wires, it worked much better that way.


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> I eventually cut it off and just wore it without the memory wires,


 

 x2  Thank god they changed them...


----------



## Maxvla

eraserxiv said:


> maxvla said:
> 
> 
> > Well, I'm going to start my journey with the RE262 that was offered me in trade for the ipod touch I was selling. Should be a good indicator of what is possible with IEMs.
> ...




One of the reasons I decided to get this IEM was the higher impedance and lower sensitivity. I might be able to use these on my big tube amp and not run into hum problems. I'm currently looking into the amp situation for a desktop amp that will work for the normal impedance and sensitivity of IEMs. HPA suggested I look no further than a WA6 with Sophia. ASR suggested a GS-1 and I was also thinking about the Asgard, but have also seen posts where the most sensitive IEMs had barely noticeable hum. 

Going to have a good time completely revamping my setup.


----------



## kiteki

New IEM's acquired today, to compliment my CK10's.
   
  Sony MDR-EX700.
   
  Now I fully understand the difference between "sibilance" and "pierce". =p
   
  These are really teriffic though, they have fully complimented what I was missing in the CK10's, I've only listened for half an hour so just brief impressions here but they are very dynamic-driver sounding, very involving, hardcore dynamic bass, excellent with violins, fluid female vocals (can transfer the "melt" feeling across), nice and _colourful_, that's just a new term I invented, but it's the best why I can describe my feelings, it's as though the music is illustrated on black canvas of silence in a full spectrum of green, purple, black, white and grey pouppon.  They are also the closest IEM's I've heard to a "full-size speaker" type sound,_ not _in soundstage which is minimal, just in the sound signature and feeling you get from full-size speaker type sound. Very good++++
   
  Edit:  My ears are ringing more than usual.
   
  Edit:  I love how the box says "Professional Monitor Sound" on the front, when they are the complete opposite Lol.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the RE262 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote:


maxvla said:


> One of the reasons I decided to get this IEM was the higher impedance and lower sensitivity. I might be able to use these on my big tube amp and not run into hum problems. I'm currently looking into the amp situation for a desktop amp that will work for the normal impedance and sensitivity of IEMs. HPA suggested I look no further than a WA6 with Sophia. ASR suggested a GS-1 and I was also thinking about the Asgard, but have also seen posts where the most sensitive IEMs had barely noticeable hum. Going to have a good time completely revamping my setup.


 
 They haven't hissed with anything I've thrown at them but I no longer have any of the terribly hissy 'audiophile' portable players and my Heed is out for repairs. Keep in mind that some people are more sensitive to hum than others. The head-fier who bought one of my HiSound AMP3s loved it with the Turbines while I thought it hissed like a snake and was completely unusable with identical earphones.
   
   
  Quote:


kiteki said:


> Now I fully understand the difference between "sibilance" and "pierce". =p
> 
> [...]
> 
> Edit:  My ears are ringing more than usual.


 
 I can't tell if you like them or not


----------



## proedros

Great review of the 262 Joker.Just great 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I also liked your ''cons'' on the 262 , since i can live with that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
*Cons: Still no carrying case included, cable-down fit not for everyone*
   
   
  My 262 is being shipped to me today and i feel like i made the right choice in buying them
   
   
  Thanx for giving us your review , always a pleasure !!!
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the RE262


----------



## rawrster

The RE262 has become one of my more favorite earphones in my possession. I can wear it straight down without a problem but over the ear is much preferred. The soundstage is definitely impressive for an earphone and the midrange is excellent.
   
  I do wish they came with a proper carrying case as the plastic case they come in is not something you can bring outside. I have various ebay cases and altoids tin cans but it would be nice if they had a small case I can just throw in my bag when I leave the house.


----------



## esanthosh

Interesting review on the 262. RE1's bass is closer to RE0, so 262 has the best bass among the Hifiman IEMs 
   
  I remember clieOS mentioning 262 being closer to DDMs than 252s earlier. How do 262s sound compared to DDM?
   
  PS: A small typo. I typically search by numbers. In the Index, it says 2A13 and in the review, it's 1A13 incorrectly.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


proedros said:


> Great review of the 262 Joker.Just great
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   
   
  Thanks. Cons are not usually a big deal for me since of course the biggest con would be a sound signature one doesn't like and I can't make a guess at that. The lack of a proper carrying case is just something that's always bugged me about Head-Direct's earphones, especially with a $250 price tag. Like rawrster said I can always grab another case but I don't see why I should have to. I've got some $4 generic earbuds from focalprice that came with a nice protective carrying case...
   
   
   

 Quote:


esanthosh said:


> Interesting review on the 262. RE1's bass is closer to RE0, so 262 has the best bass among the Hifiman IEMs
> 
> I remember clieOS mentioning 262 being closer to DDMs than 252s earlier. How do 262s sound compared to DDM?
> 
> PS: A small typo. I typically search by numbers. In the Index, it says 2A13 and in the review, it's 1A13 incorrectly.


 

  I haven't heard the DDM in a while but from memory I'd say the DDM is more textured and blended while the 262 is smoother and better-separated. DDM has more sub-bass, slightly less forward mids, and slightly crisper treble but I think the RE262 extends farther up top. It's also much easier to get used to (sound-wise) as the DDM has a somewhat unnatural sound at first listen for reasons I couldn't explain.
   
  Looking at my own sound scoring the DDM is right on the borderline at 9.675 but I rounded it off to 9.75. The RE262 is firmly in 9.75 territory. I think these might get spread out more once the SM3 is introduced.
   
  Oh and thanks for the correction - fixed that. I shudder to think of Tier 1A, never mind earphone 1A13...


----------



## Hero Kid

Pff RE-262, bring on the SM3


----------



## mythless

Must get my hands on a pair of RE262, lol!


----------



## Maxvla

Sounds like I chose wisely without knowing. Looking forward to giving these a go.


----------



## rawrster

hah mythless  I wonder when they will be available for individual sale. I'm thinking once the new year hits they will be available since I'm sure they are busy with all the orders regarding their recent products such as the HE6, HM601 combo and their other headphones. Of course there may be those who have do not need the RE262 that they got from the 602 combo.


----------



## kmhaynes

Joker, Enjoying the SW-Xcape right now, and interested to hear your take on them, esp how it compares to the RE0 which it seems to share similarities, but not quite as good as.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kmhaynes said:


> Joker, Enjoying the SW-Xcape right now, and interested to hear your take on them, esp how it compares to the RE0 which it seems to share similarities, but not quite as good as.


 

  Well I only have the RE-ZERO now and I think i prefer it to the Xcape slightly but I wouldn't say that one is necessarily better than the other at this point. Great earphones with slightly different sonic inclinations - certainly two of my favorites in their price range.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> hah mythless  I wonder when they will be available for individual sale. I'm thinking once the new year hits they will be available since I'm sure they are busy with all the orders regarding their recent products such as the HE6, HM601 combo and their other headphones. Of course there may be those who have do not need the RE262 that they got from the 602 combo.


 


  Exactly what I am doing, trying to see those with the DAP who don't need the RE262.  I am still deciding if I should also get the RE-Zero just to have the "complete" set per se.  Am I missing anything if I don't get the RE-Zero?


----------



## rawrster

The complete set obviously  I actually really like the RE-Zero but the RE262 deviates from what I call the house sound of the RE lineup if RE0 and RE-Zero is anything to go by. The RE-Zero has slightly sweet midrange and from memory a bit less extension in treble than RE0. Bass is similar but easier to drive. I think if compared to the RE0 I would prefer the RE-Zero but I don't have the RE0 anymore to compare. If you have the money and want to get the set or want something different than RE0 I'd say go for it.


----------



## mythless

Probably not then, like all the RE-Zero reviews, they sound too similar to the RE252.  I prefer the RE252 over the RE0 any day, but that design was its downfall.  Of course, unless someone offered me a price I couldn't refuse, haha.  But, I am quite fixated on the RE262 and my Pico Slim wants to drive them.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

mythless said:


> Probably not then, like all the RE-Zero reviews, they sound too similar to the RE252.  I prefer the RE252 over the RE0 any day, but that design was its downfall.  Of course, unless someone offered me a price I couldn't refuse, haha.  But, I am quite fixated on the RE262 and my Pico Slim wants to drive them.







RE262 are a great match for the Pico Slim, and I prefer them amped vs not.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mythless said:


> Probably not then, like all the RE-Zero reviews, they sound too similar to the RE252.  I prefer the RE252 over the RE0 any day, but that design was its downfall.  Of course, unless someone offered me a price I couldn't refuse, haha.  But, I am quite fixated on the RE262 and my Pico Slim wants to drive them.


 
 I liked the RE252 better than the RE0 as well but the RE-ZERO is the one I felt was worth keeping when factoring in usability in addition to sound signature. I think I may yet end up keeping the RE-ZERO over the RE262.
   

 Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> RE262 are a great match for the Pico Slim, and I prefer them amped vs not.


 
 I really can't imagine the opposite being the case - these aren't some 16-ohm toy that reaches full potential driven by a cell phone.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Looking at my own sound scoring the DDM is right on the borderline at 9.675 but I rounded it off to 9.75. The RE262 is firmly in 9.75 territory.* I think these might get spread out more once the SM3 is introduced.*


 


 I actually feel that RE252 sounds on the same level as SM3 and SE530/535 beats both. lol Preferences, preferences...


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Really?  Is the soundstage as expansive as the SM3?  dynamic-driver flat FR and huge soundstage sounds very interesting to moi.
   
  The only Shure I've heard that sounded good to me was SE210, the rest were probably fakes or something.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Well, the soundstage on the 252 is pretty good, although I find it a bit closed in sounding. RE252 is every bit as detailed, fast and clear as the SM3 though IMO. SE530/535 have great soundstage on the other hand - very full sized headphone like.  And the Shures also have great dynamics. SM3 is not quite as good in these aspects IMO.
   
  lol You definitely need to hear a genuine SE530/SE535. SE210 sounds crap by comparison - no treble, little bass, bad soundstage. SE530 is several leagues ahead and remains the best IEM I've heard to date. I find its sound to be the most natural and closest to "being there" than any other IEM I've tried. However, I found the fit of the Shures to be a huge pain the arse, at least for my ears, I could literally only get them to fit my ears right maybe 5 times out of 100+. And when you don't get a good fit with them, their sound is ranging from unimpressive to downright terrible. But with the right fit, they are absolutely brilliant 'phones.
   
  Oh yeah, so maybe your issue with the other Shures was the fit - like I said it's just horrible. It's not that they don't seal well or are uncomfortable, but it's that they don't fit _right_ in order for the sound to enter the ears properly and thus even if you think that you got a good fit, chances that if you think SE530/535 sounds bad/unimpressive - you didn't.


----------



## Maxvla

The upcoming Gilmore X2 with DAC might just be my solution for an amp for IEMs. It should be out early 2011, but I still can't shake the fear of what I experienced with the Gilmore Lite. I experienced no difference in audio with or without the Lite in the chain many years ago, and swore off solid state amps from there on (which has been reinforced by listening to other SS amps as time has passed). WA6 might be the only answer unless another tube amp maker has something with ultra low noise floor.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Oh yeah, so maybe your issue with the other Shures was the fit - like I said it's just horrible. It's not that they don't seal well or are uncomfortable, but it's that they don't fit _right_ in order for the sound to enter the ears properly and thus even if you think that you got a good fit, chances that if you think SE530/535 sounds bad/unimpressive - you didn't.


 
   
  I have small to average sized ears and the demo models of the SE530 and SE4XX something I tried had large tips so they didn't fit very well at all, but irrespective of fit they sounded very average to me.  I was certainly confused when I demo'ed a crossroads HR1 earbud directly afterwards and it sounded near-identical in sound signature like it was the exact same driver inside or something but I didn't say anything out of politeness to the shopfront.
   
  Chances are you are correct, since I found the 210 better than 535.
   
  SE210 had the most natural armature sound I've heard to date with clean timbre and fresh clarity in mids and highs, but it also had the weakest bass I've ever heard in my life, only someone that doesn't care for bass in the slightest or has music completely devoid of bass could enjoy the 210 as their primary IEM.


----------



## kiteki

Joker, the RE262 review is one of your best reads to date, jolly good descriptions there IMHO
   


> When amped, the RE262 sounds even bigger and the soundstage seems to lose its outer limits – something even the stadium-sized sonic space of the IE8 can’t quite pull off.
> 
> the RE262 is an incredibly capable earphone with a fairly unique sound signature.
> 
> Pros: Immersive presentation, seductive midrange, smooth and effortless sound; can be worn over-the-ear


----------



## kiteki

uote:


> Originally Posted by *Pianist* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
       Oh, I thought you were referring to the soundstage, i.e. it's on the same level as SM3 in respect to it's main assets.
   
  I somehow don't think RE252 can serve as a replacement/upgrade over CK10 for me based on what I've read so far, and it's looks like a gummy bear versus jewellery, hmm oh well then =p
   
  __________
   
  I noticed you have CM700 in your signature, any thoughts on it?  I've found a good price on a new pair, and they're almost out of stock, everyone needs a high-tier armature, dynamic, and earbud.  Personally I think earbuds have a few sonic assets IEM's cannot replicate.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The RE262 is big but it seems more spread-out than the SM3. The SM3 is somehow capable of filling its entire soundstage whereas with the RE262 there's a definite division between 'near' and 'far' (as there is with most earphones). Both are a step above the 252 in terms of soundstage and especially headstage IMO - the RE252 has good width but only moderate depth and doesn't quite sound as 'out-of-the-head'. In terms of signature I probably like the RE252 best out of the three but I have to admit that the RE262 driver is more capable and the SM3 is just tuned so it has no real weaknesses. 


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Joker, the RE262 review is one of your best reads to date, jolly good descriptions there IMHO


 

 Thanks


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 
   
  Lest I forget, the EX700's have been fully burnt-in by prev. user in an attempt to tame them, and I am personally inclined to forgive sibilance out of respect to what those frequency peaks are trying to achieve, or rather delivering on a two-sided coin with irrevocable positive/negative traits.  In the same light as the ~6khz peak on the EX700's, I also love the ~10khz peak on the CK10's, and therefore am not very interested in the DBA-02's.
   
  The 16mm dynamic driver sounds vastly different than a dual-armature imho, and better than most of my gear, but a half-hour listening impression is what it is. (I might hate them after 7 hr's)
   
  The EX1000 with it's FR graph even peakier then the EX700 seems to have most inclined to look away, but with the same multi-layered liquid crystal polymer as in the Z1000 which has received a couple rave reviews compared to other HP flagships, I can only hope the EX1000's enter your list after the price has come down to sanity, or EX600/800 if they use the same driver material. =]  (liquid-crystal + 16mm + over-ear design, an IEM like that deserves a place in the joker list, is all I'm saying =p)


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> The EX1000 with it's FR graph even peakier then the EX700 seems to have most inclined to look away, but with the same multi-layered liquid crystal polymer as in the Z1000 which has received a couple rave reviews compared to other HP flagships, I can only hope the EX1000's enter your list after the price has come down to sanity, or EX600/800 if they use the same driver material. =]  (liquid-crystal + 16mm + over-ear design, an IEM like that deserves a place in the joker list, is all I'm saying =p)


 


 Interestingly enough, I find the EX1000's slightly weak at the higher frequencies, it just isn't as detailed as the ER4S, but still very, very good. As you said, once the price has come down to a sanity level, then I think the EX1000 will be a very interesting competitor in the $250 - $400 range. It is quite good.


----------



## vrln

I just wanted to say this thread is just amazing. Absolutely fantastic work - the amount of dedication required for something like this is not very common to say the least!


----------



## Pianist

Hey Joker, I wonder what you think of SE530/535? Ever heard them? I think they deserve to be reviewed. If you rate Q-jays at 9.25/10, the Shures should be well over 10+. I think that they even beat the SM3, especially in the mids department, providing a lusher, more dynamic sound. Actually, SE530 was the only IEM that made me feel that I am there with the musicians and I mean a vivid feeling of being there. It was really something. The soundstage was super realistic and provided a great sense of distance and space, while the dynamics were completely effortless and timbre was spot on. I remember I plugged them into a computer at a local library one day and listened to an 80s Pop Hits CD and I was just totally blown away. I was literally sitting there with a stunned expression on my face and everyone looked at me like I was crazy or something. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But unfortunately IEMs with such thin nozzles just don't fit my ears well and getting such good sound out of the Shures was nearly impossible for me. But damn, that sound... I had them for over a year trying to get a good fit and to experience that amazing sound again, but alas, that almost never happened.


----------



## mythless

@Pianist: I will assume that's the reason why you go out and try different IEMs? 
   
  All this talk about the SM3 is piquing my interest in it again, but Joker, what do you mean by "capable?"  Oh and between the SM3 and RE262 which one do you prefer?


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





mythless said:


> *@Pianist: I will assume that's the reason why you go out and try different IEMs? *
> 
> All this talk about the SM3 is piquing my interest in it again, but Joker, what do you mean by "capable?"  Oh and between the SM3 and RE262 which one do you prefer?


 

 Yeah, I've since been trying to find an IEM that will my ears better and have the glorious sound of SE530, but haven't found one yet unfortunately. The closest thing I came across so far is probably the Q-jays, but they are still significantly behind SE530 in sound quality. They do fit my ears really well though and sound consistent, which is what I like best about them - they always sound good to me, whereas SE530 sound ranged from brilliant to horrible. Most other IEMs I've tried also sounded different each time I put them in. I also tried customs (the ES3X). It didn't fit me right the first time and god knows how many refits I would need to do to make the fit good.  I guess I am just really unlucky that my ear canals are so oddly shaped.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  What about Etymotics?  They look pretty small.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





mythless said:


> What about Etymotics?  They look pretty small.


 

 Ahh, the Etys... I was always impressed with their sound every time I tried them, but for some reason I never actually bought a pair for myself. I've been thinking of getting an ER4p or ER4s for a long time now, but I always end up with another IEM or headphone for whatever reason. I guess it's because the Etys are old and are kind of unexciting. lol But the sound was... hmmm... very, very nice. When I tried the HF2, they instantly reminded me of SE530 - similar quality mids, similar non-fatiguing, but detailed highs, fantastic precision. I was really impressed. Thanks for reminding me of these IEMs, because I totally forgot. I definitely need to get a pair, just need to find a good deal.


----------



## mythless

Sent you a PM


----------



## albau

Would be interesting to see how Joker stacks SM3 against W2/3. I'm after UE 5Pro warm signature, wide soundstage and overall fun. HJE-900 come close except for distant mids that disappoint especially for rock vocals. So I'm eyeing W2 but not sure.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxwelldemon said:


> Interestingly enough, I find the EX1000's slightly weak at the higher frequencies, it just isn't as detailed as the ER4S, but still very, very good. As you said, once the price has come down to a sanity level, then I think the EX1000 will be a very interesting competitor in the $250 - $400 range. It is quite good.


 
 That's quite a price drop - Sony really aren't known for doing that, are they...
   
   
  Quote:


pianist said:


> Hey Joker, I wonder what you think of SE530/535? Ever heard them? I think they deserve to be reviewed. If you rate Q-jays at 9.25/10, the Shures should be well over 10+. I think that they even beat the SM3, especially in the mids department, providing a lusher, more dynamic sound.


 
 Never heard the SE530. I really didn't like the SE115, SE310, or  the E4c and my ventures into Shure earphones stopped there. 
   

 Quote:


mythless said:


> @Pianist: I will assume that's the reason why you go out and try different IEMs?
> 
> All this talk about the SM3 is piquing my interest in it again, but Joker, what do you mean by "capable?"  Oh and between the SM3 and RE262 which one do you prefer?


 
 I've said 'capable' quite a few times. Which occasion do you mean? If it's about the RE262 driver, I feel that it is extremely capable in the sense that there's a lot of output headroom - it EQs better than the RE252 driver, handles loud volumes better, and sounds more effortless at the extremes of the output range (or, rather, my hearing). 
   
   
  Quote:


albau said:


> Would be interesting to see how Joker stacks SM3 against W2/3. I'm after UE 5Pro warm signature, wide soundstage and overall fun. HJE-900 come close except for distant mids that disappoint especially for rock vocals. So I'm eyeing W2 but not sure.


   
  I think the W3 is a better upgrade from the UE5Pro than the W2 or SM3. It's brighter than the UE5 but has a similar sense of space and bass intensity. Unless your goal is to have more forward mids than the 5Pro gives you, in which case the W3 is not the right choice.


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> maxwelldemon said:
> ...


 

   
  No, unfortunately, they don't. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I guess they could be a competitor to the 400+ category along with CK100, would still be nice to see a bit more of a drop.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Any reason why i didnt see many people be interest about the M what deal from meelectronics? Maybe because you want to know exactly what you pay for?


----------



## DVDIT

I need to unsubscribe from this thread otherwise I am going broke, LOL!! I just bought the RE-262 from a forum member. I have now bought the Senn IE8, FA DBA-02 and now RE-262 all in the past 10 days based on the review here looking for that one IEM that will end my search. The only IEM I will buy going forward will be the Earsonics SM3. Awaiting your review on that one, ljokerl.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





dvdit said:


> I need to unsubscribe from this thread otherwise I am going broke, LOL!! I just bought the RE-262 from a forum member. I have now bought the Senn IE8, FA DBA-02 and now RE-262 all in the past 10 days based on the review here looking for that one IEM that will end my search. The only IEM I will buy going forward will be the Earsonics SM3. Awaiting your review on that one, ljokerl.


 


  You can always resell what you don't like and put those funds to buy the SM3 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I too wouldn't mind seeing another SM3 review.  I just realized I only had 1 BA IEMs and I sold it a while back.  I think I need to branch out to other driver types.


----------



## DVDIT

Quote: 





mythless said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 That is the plan now. I have a S:flo2 on order. I will keep only one or two that has good synergy with S:flo2 and  sell the rest.  I will start with Tf10 Pro and RE0 very soon.


----------



## mythless

Good luck with that, that's a lot of different flavored IEMs you got there.


----------



## rawrster

That's a good thing  I've come to enjoy many different flavors as long as they aren't too different. The Eterna v1 was the only earphone that I had to sell. It was too different than everything else that I had.


----------



## Thecoolguy

@ljokerl how do the re262's compare to the MD tributes? which did you prefer?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thecoolguy said:


> @ljokerl how do the re262's compare to the MD tributes? which did you prefer?


 


  Despite being high-end dynamics they are pretty different earphones. Compared to the RE262 the MD is a real bass monster with more weight and rumble at the low end. The 262 drops off at the lowest of lows and generally sounds softer and more relaxed. I'd say the MDs are a tiny bit more dry and textured overall while the RE262 is cleaner and clearer. The mids are more forward on the RE262, maybe even too forward for some tracks, and more smooth and attention-grabbing at the same time. Treble quantity is similar between the two but the RE262 seems to extend a bit more effortlessly despite again sounding softer. Presentation-wise the RE262 has a larger stage and better separation while the MD sounds more cohesive. I'd say that the soundstage of the MD is more spherical while the 262 extends farther outward at the sides but these things are quite subjective.
   
  Personally I prefer the technical capability of the RE262 but I like the tuning of the MD better - despite being the inferior earphone (to my ears) from an 'objective' point of view the MD is just lots of fun to listen to when taken for what it is. It also offers the better overall package IMO, especially the warranty, but then that's where the price difference comes in. If it were my money I'd still buy the RE262 but it's definitely a close call.


----------



## Thecoolguy

thanks for the reply! I think i'll go for the RE262s.


----------



## rawrster

Compared to just about every other earphone the MD is a bass monster in comparison


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Compared to just about every other earphone the MD is a bass monster in comparison


 

 You going to get every _real _basshead out there scolding you who say the Monsters are bass light.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > That's quite a price drop - Sony really aren't known for doing that, are they...
> ...


 

 I don't think the EX1000 will be able to compete with the CK100's.  EX600 seems the most interesting price-wise ($200-ish) especially if it is using the same driver, and then there is EX800ST.
   
  EX700 was released with RRP $699 right?  So it seems there is a chance for a price drop on the ex1k but not anytime soon I think.
   
  SA5K was also RRP $699 and then street price $500+ (still is today in Japan) and then dropped to $300-ish in the US.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 But that's not what he said.  He said the MD is a bass monster vs others, not the other way around.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I understand.  I was referring to some who have commented that Monsters aren't bass monsters and are bass light in their opinions.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Post #1336 edited for lexical ambiguity.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Do you think its the best to buy 3-4 low budget iems for a starter? (Brainwavz m1, meelectronics, koss KSC75, JVC flats etc) Or spend the 100$ to buy only one iem from the 100+$ category?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Do you think its the best to buy 3-4 low budget iems for a starter? (Brainwavz m1, meelectronics, koss KSC75, JVC flats etc) Or spend the 100$ to buy only one iem from the 100+$ category?


 


  In general I would say that going for the $100 set if you can afford it is better than owning multiple budget earphones. However, there are exceptions that I think are pretty self-explanatory such as if you have a tendency to lose or damage your gear. I would also say that if you really know nothing or next to nothing about audio (but want to) and can't invest more than $100 initially to eventually settle on a set you like it might be worth it to explore several budget offerings just to narrow your signature search.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

Hi IjokerI
   
  again, similar question if u dont mind, plus a bit more.
  so, re262 also has an immersive soundstage.. similar to ck10? how close / different?
   
  also you mentioned that it has bump in the lower mids.. so i take it, if i consider ck10 to be almost dead neutral except on the highest end and the lowest end, re262 would be like flat with a bump in the lower mids? does that means, male vocals better than female?
   
  and.. how forward is forward? i always loved ck10 rendition of the mids, its simple forward-like, but still blends with the rest spectrum to sound balance.
   
  I always felt that ck10 lacks that little bit on the low end to make me satisfied..
  thanks for your hard work on this. It really helps the community.


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Gotta agree that for a 100$ budget owning one good iem will be the better choice (if worried about build you can get the Panas).
   
  Likewise, if the budget is around 200$-300$ I think owning more than 1 is the better choice than owning one for 200-300$ imo. You get more options in regards to sound and more bang-for-the-buck.


----------



## paulypaul

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Do you think its the best to buy 3-4 low budget iems for a starter? (Brainwavz m1, meelectronics, koss KSC75, JVC flats etc) Or spend the 100$ to buy only one iem from the 100+$ category?


 

 I think owning a couple of iems is good is the signature is different enough.
  I have the RE-ZERO and M2 & M1 and the M2 still gets listened to everyday as well and the ZERO.
  They both have something the other one doesnt.
  M2 has warmth and bass emphasis.
  The ZERO have detail and forward mids.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


daemontentacle said:


> again, similar question if u dont mind, plus a bit more.
> so, re262 also has an immersive soundstage.. similar to ck10? how close / different?


 
  I'd say it sounds bigger than the CK10 and portrays distance more effortlessly but the real strength of the CK10s presentation is imaging and on that count neither fares better than the other. One potential issue with the RE262 is that it can put too much distance between the foreground and background of a track which is fine for rock & metal IMO but when there's a single vocalist with some instrumental backing the instruments can get really pushed back (admittedly some may prefer this sort of emphasis). 
   

 Quote:


daemontentacle said:


> also you mentioned that it has bump in the lower mids.. so i take it, if i consider ck10 to be almost dead neutral except on the highest end and the lowest end, re262 would be like flat with a bump in the lower mids? does that means, male vocals better than female?


 
  Yes, the RE262 definitely has accented bass and mids over what I would consider 'flat' but part of the result is that sub-bass sounds relatively weaker than mid-bass (as opposed to the CK10 or something equally linear). I think the midrange hump encompasses female vocal bands as well, or at least wouldn't say that female vocals are weak or anywhere near weak with the RE262.  
   
   
   
  Quote:


daemontentacle said:


> and.. how forward is forward? i always loved ck10 rendition of the mids, its simple forward-like, but still blends with the rest spectrum to sound balance.
> 
> I always felt that ck10 lacks that little bit on the low end to make me satisfied..
> thanks for your hard work on this. It really helps the community.


   
  The CK10 is definitely not forward compared to the RE262. If you've heard the CK100 that's more like it. I don't think either the CK100 or RE262 is particularly unbalanced personally but if you prefer a more v-shaped sound they might not satisfy. You'll definitely get the bass boost you are looking for from the RE262 but be prepared for softer impact (compared to the sharp and fast CK10) and gentler attack & decay. 

   
  Quote:


paulypaul said:


> I think owning a couple of iems is good is the signature is different enough.  I have the RE-ZERO and M2 & M1 and the M2 still gets listened to everyday as well and the ZERO.
> They both have something the other one doesnt.
> M2 has warmth and bass emphasis.
> The ZERO have detail and forward mids.


 
 Well the ZERO and the Brainwavz earphones are hardly entry-level since you'd have a tough time picking up 3-4 of them on a $100 budget. I think these IEMs approach the level of something I could personally live with indefinitely.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

cool..
  sounds like something i can look forward to.
  btw.. i never liked v shape.. and will stay away from them. If i have to rate westones.. they would all perform very very poor.
  for me, its inverted v, it will always be mids first, bass second, and treble last. eq7 fits this criteria kinda well, but it lacks the full body on the bass for me to consider it complete. ck10 does better in the presentation of bass, big drums can sound big rather than loud in ck10, despite it having what i consider less than ideal quantity. ck10 treble is also very smooth, and the peak more or less affects the sparkle rather than the quantity, plus its flat anywhere from below that point, so thats quite okay. Otherwise, i'll stay away from treble focused phone, ex-dba-02 included.
  i dont like bassy phones either, i just need the 'right' amount of bass that will only be present when called for.
  again, thanks for the detail explanation.


----------



## singh

@joker ...my re262 impressions match yours , bur the re262 that i have has a huge issue of microphonics !! i cant ignore it really! is that possible ! i mean should i contact Head direct.
  otherwise they are very good set of earphones!


----------



## rawrster

As much as I like the CK10 no way does it have better bass than the e-Q7 and the treble is anything but smooth. The peak make cymbals sound not as good as they could be.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


singh said:


> @joker ...my re262 impressions match yours , bur the re262 that i have has a huge issue of microphonics !! i cant ignore it really! is that possible ! i mean should i contact Head direct.
> otherwise they are very good set of earphones!


 

  Try wearing them over-the-ear with longer tips. Microphonics aren't an issue for me since I find them more comfortable with a cord-up sort of fit anyway.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> As much as I like the CK10 no way does it have better bass than the e-Q7 and the treble is anything but smooth. The peak make cymbals sound not as good as they could be.


 

 Haven't heard the eq7 but agree w/ the rest.


----------



## Maxvla

Got my RE262 today. The fit is perfectly fine. Initial impressions are good since I'm using my phone and VBR mp3s. The 2 weaknesses of mp3s, bass and treble extension are the only complaints I have currently. Assuming these are fixed with better power and losses sourcing and better DAC, these appear to be an excellent choice. I'll also try more tips but the black double changes seem to be doing a good job.


----------



## singh

with me the stock blac tips do wonder, i tried the sony hybrids and the FX700 tips as well as the double flanges  ...nothing beats the stock black tips !


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote: 





maxvla said:


> Got my RE262 today. The fit is perfectly fine. Initial impressions are good since I'm using my phone and VBR mp3s. The 2 weaknesses of mp3s, bass and treble extension are the only complaints I have currently. Assuming these are fixed with better power and losses sourcing and better DAC, these appear to be an excellent choice. I'll also try more tips but the black double changes seem to be doing a good job.


 

  
  Regarding bass and treble extension, YMMV, but mine seemed to have improved noticeably with burn in as well. It is definitely not a treble focused IEM, but the treble extension is there, despite that fact that it is not in the foreground.
   
  Yours came with black double flanges? I thought the double flanges that came with the RE262 were white.


----------



## Maxvla

I got these from another headfier in trade. He lost one of the double changes included with the RE262 so he included the double changes from his M9s. These only have a could of hours on them so far. I'm looking forward to getting these home to a proper amp, DAC, and source files in an hour or two.


----------



## rawrster

I use similar tips but the other biflange tips from the M9. They are a bit softer than the black ones but still quite nice. I've tried both and they sound slightly different but both good.
   
  @singh: The cable does have microphonics but it can be solved for the most part in a couple of ways. I use a shirt clip but not the one it came with since I tried putting it on and it broke almost instantly. I also made a chin slider so I don't use the one it came with since it is too resistant when trying to adjust it. I also wear it over the ear. That removes most of the microphonics although I don't use them outside.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

.. double posted..


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

consider me as one of the lucky (or unlucky?) people that got almost perfect fit on ck10 with its stock tips, imho it does best compared to sony hybrids or complys.
  it does took me about 3 month fiddling to figure out how to wear them proper, otherwise i always have to be pressing the iem to my ear..

  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> As much as I like the CK10 no way does it have better bass than the e-Q7 and the treble is anything but smooth. The peak make cymbals sound not as good as they could be.


----------



## mootookang

Joker, just wondering if you are fortunate enough to take advantage of the recent TF10 deal?
   
  I got my pair today, and I'm currently A/Bing the TF10 with my SF5 pro with one in each ears right now. I'll give an impression once I burn in the TF10 a bit more.


----------



## Hero Kid

|joker| already owns the TF10 as far as I know. He just can't stand the fit issues long enough to complete his review of them


----------



## Maxvla

More time and different amping with the RE-262 revealed a better signature. I'm quite impressed with them. I think they are similar to my HD600 in that they are very good, but still have room to go. The tonal balance is good, but lacks clarity in the upper end (also similar to HD600). The 3D headstage is quite present and superior again to any full size headphone I've ever worn. I really see this as my new direction. The HE-6 just isn't doing it for me.

Unfortunately even with a fairly high impedance (150ohm) and low sensitivity (95db) I still get substantial hum from my MKVI so the best amp I have for these presently is the built in amp from my Shanling CDP, which doesn't sound amazing, and couple that with the subpar DAC it also has inside and I really can't say for sure where these IEMs will go. Listening through the hum on the MKVI shows much better treble clarity, but the hum is too distracting for detailed analysis.

I'm really hurting for an amp here since I can't use my good DAC with my current situation. Ah... choices choices...

By the way does anyone have the official resolution of this IEM? It certainly feels like it has more headroom than the M9 which according to the website cuts off at 20khz. I don't believe it for a second, however.


----------



## EraserXIV

Another IEM with similar signature, but with more clarity overall would be the e-Q7 (or the e-Q5). The GR10 looks promising too, but I haven't heard it myself.


----------



## Maxvla

Even with the experience of only 2 IEMs I don't think it will get much better than these RE-262 without going custom. I need to get an amp squared away then I will consider a higher end universal or take the plunge into customs. I'm quite curious about Justin's X2 with DAC since it is attractively priced, but I'm also eyeing the AudioLab 8200CD which is a transport and 32bit Sabre DAC I could pair with something like a GS-1 or WA6.

I've been blessed to have this Little Dot MKVI which was perfect for my uses until now. I never had any second guesses with regard to amping, but it simply won't do for efficient IEMs.


----------



## EraserXIV

Have you taken a look at some of Audio-GD's offerings? I have the Audio-GD Sparrow, which is one of their cheaper DAC/Amps but I have little to no hiss and it has great synergy with the RE262. IMO, Audio-GD offers great performance/price ratio. They have a lot of other higher-end stuff as well which I imagine would only scale up that much better. From what I've observed, feedback has been overall great for their stuff on head-fi.


----------



## Maxvla

The only thing I've seen about Audio-GD (and I haven't gone looking) is how people say they use too many parts and it drives the cost up. I'll give them a look, but I can't say I will seriously consider them.

Oh, by the way, I've found I prefer the gray biflanges with the RE-262 as well. The white ones were absolutely terrible, and due to the strange shape of this IEM I can't use the smallest single flange like I would prefer. The IEMs just don't clear and give enough insertion depth to make a good seal. I get almost no bass.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mootookang said:


> Joker, just wondering if you are fortunate enough to take advantage of the recent TF10 deal?
> 
> I got my pair today, and I'm currently A/Bing the TF10 with my SF5 pro with one in each ears right now. I'll give an impression once I burn in the TF10 a bit more.


 
 Quote:


hero kid said:


> |joker| already owns the TF10 as far as I know. He just can't stand the fit issues long enough to complete his review of them


 
  Yep, the TF10 is one of my oldest high-end IEMs - I just haven't gotten around to reviewing it (and post all of my other UE reviews). I definitely liked the fit of the SF5Pro better when I had them but in terms of sound it's no contest IMO. 

   

 Quote:


maxvla said:


> By the way does anyone have the official resolution of this IEM? It certainly feels like it has more headroom than the M9 which according to the website cuts off at 20khz. I don't believe it for a second, however.


 
 There's no official response specs for the RE262 AFAIK. Glad you like them though.


----------



## Rockadile

What's the most comfortable IEM under $30? There wasn't a 5/5 comfort for one in the price range.
  I've only used Skullcandy inkd and didn't find them comfortable after 30mins.


----------



## Maxvla

I found the MEElectronics M9 to be very comfortable. Are you sure you are inserting them correctly? Grab the top of your ear and pull up slightly and drop the IEM then release the top of your ear to create the seal. This helped me get a great fit and better seal at the same time. If this isn't comfortable, try either a smaller deeper single flange, or on the opposite side try a shallower biflange or find a happy medium with foamies.

I've worn the M9s for as long as 6 hours without anything but general contact irritation (6 hours is a loooong time to have something in your ear constantly) after I took them out.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rockadile said:


> What's the most comfortable IEM under $30? There wasn't a 5/5 comfort for one in the price range.
> I've only used Skullcandy inkd and didn't find them comfortable after 30mins.


 

 Comfort is a highly subjective thing that depends not only on ear geometry but other factors such as correct insertion technique and choice of eartip size. If you're sure it's the earphone I'd say try the Soundmagic PL30 or JVC Air Cushions. PL30s need to be worn over-the-ear but on the whole both sets are ergonomically 'correct' for most ears.


----------



## Rockadile

Looking between the M9 and Air Cushions. Personally like straight down cable.
  I use foam ear plugs for lawn work and find them more comfortable than the standard single flange. Are the foam tips on the Air Cushion anything like the ear plugs?
  Oh and how short is the Air Cushion cable exactly?


----------



## Maxvla

Foam earplugs have an advantage as they are solid throughout. They don't have to worry about attaching to a shaft with a tuned channel. When you have a solid squishable material it can spread pressure out far better than a tip of an IEM.

That said, it should be possible to find something that works just right after enough trial and error.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rockadile said:


> Looking between the M9 and Air Cushions. Personally like straight down cable.
> I use foam ear plugs for lawn work and find them more comfortable than the standard single flange. Are the foam tips on the Air Cushion anything like the ear plugs?
> Oh and how short is the Air Cushion cable exactly?


 


  M9 fit is very similar to the Ink'd buds which is why it's strange that Ink'd buds get uncomfortable so quickly for you.
   
  Air Cushion foam tips are made of thicker/harder foam than conventional earplugs. Cable on the new ones (FX67) is okay - just under 4ft I think. Older ones (FX66) had shorter cords.


----------



## Anaxilus

For comfort <$30 I'd go for the Klipsch S2 just because I love the oval gels.


----------



## divinenow

Great thread ljokerl! Unfortunately, I'm left considering way too many earphones and despite the buy-all influence of head-fi, I really only have time and money for one. I was wondering if I could receive some further advice with which IEM to get. I currently own the Nuforce NE-6, which I enjoy although I'm not overly impressed with, and the Shure SRH 750DJ which I really enjoy too but they seem to be missing a bit of something... Although, I mainly listen to music off of my computer or my walkman MP3 player so the source isn't exactly the highest quality.  I've also had the Etymotic ER-4P before but wasn't too huge a fan - while I liked picking out the instrumental parts it seemed like it was lacking in fullness and a bit piercing when it came to the treble. What I'm looking for is a solid, fun IEM that has that wow factor. Bass is definitely important to me as I love listening to heavy electronic music, although clear vocals and high-end detail are also very important (I listen to a fair share of blues, rock, classical, and all kinds of genres). So far I have it down to this:
   
    
$30 - $60 range:
  -RadioPaq Jazz
  -ViSang R02
  -Xears TD100
   
$60-100 range:
  -ViSang R03
  -Thinksound TS02
  -Fischer Audio Eterna
  -Fischer Audio Silver Bullet
  -Hippo VB
   
  I'd consider going a bit above the $100 range if the IEM is good enough (I had previously been looking into Monster Turbines), but it doesn't really seem too necessary especially given that it's mainly for MP3 player use.
   
  Any advice is really appreciated!
   
  Thanks.


----------



## kiteki

First, sorry for ranting a bit about the new Sony IEM's, I have good experiences with sony sound so it's exciting (for me) that they have three new IEM's that haven't been documented yet, but in a thread covering all kinds of IEM's I haven't heard, I'm sure Sony aren't the most technically proficient out there, their sound is coloured, as am I in that respect.
   
  Second, @DaEmOnTEnTAcles, I recall some of your posts and advice to me in regards to speed in IEM's and sa5k and reading your comparisons with DBA-02 and CK10, you led me (along with joker and countless others) to the ck10's which I now use, so thanks for sharing your experiences there.  I have to admit I don't think the ck10's are the fastest 'phones on earth as per my definition of speed, I think they are very good at imaging and have very high detail retrieval, also a flat FR +they show everything in the frequency spectrum, these merits combined give the impression of very fast speed but in reality I think the mids are not so fast, they are smooth and the smoothness covers up the friction of a violin string or the rawness of an electric guitar, I feel the notes in the mids are something like hundreds of fish in a river. I didn't have this feeling with my SA5k, which I found the faster phone in all respects, though the ck10 wins in detail retrieval insofar as it can rather effortlessly display every niche of sound on all frequency bands with none taking precedence over the other.
   
  Like you, a few days ago I was considering a replacement for my ck10's in the RE252 or perhaps RE262 which looked like good candidates, aside from all the above praise I find the ck10's don't sound natural enough and I don't get immersed in the music, long story short I think it's better to compliment them rather than replace them, find something that shines where you think they err, I got lucky and did so right away and now I'm using two IEM's and I'm pretty satisfied, the difference in some tracks is laughable, I don't think I'd be having such quality listening time with the RE252 alone.
   
  @rawrster, while I like the 10kHz emphasis, I have to agree with you, cymbals sound like a kitchen sink on the ck10's.


----------



## mootookang

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yep, the TF10 is one of my oldest high-end IEMs - I just haven't gotten around to reviewing it (and post all of my other UE reviews). I definitely liked the fit of the SF5Pro better when I had them but in terms of sound it's no contest IMO.


 
   
  The fit of TF10 and SF5 pro really isn't that different for me, I guess it's because I have fairly large ear canals.
   
  When compare the two sound signature, I find the SF5 pro to be louder and brighter, but there are a lot of roll off high notes when compared. The mids also feels a bit recessed, even after EQ the mids sound unnatural and grainy. As of right now (with limited burn in), the TF10's sound signature feels fairly dark, and the bass feels a bit light when compared to other headphones that I own. To describe graphically, I think the SF5 pro has a more U signature that focuses heavily on the two ends, and TF10 has a more v shaped sound signature, the mids are more presented and there are less roll offs, but the headphones feel more dull in comparison.
   
  Interesting note, I'm very surprised how forgiving the TF10 is to poor recordings, because of the more laid-back sound signature, it allows me to EQ accordingly to the music style I'm listening to. I think this is a huge plus to a portability factor, since most PMP has a fairly limited memory storage, allowing to user to enjoy audio files with a worser sound quality that's smaller in size is also part of how well a portable headphone performs.
   
  I don't really think the TF10 compares that well to other sub $200 headphones in the current market, but if UE can drop the price to around $150-170, it'll probably be one of the best contender in the sub $150 audiophile market.
   
  Also, I think the M6 is probably the most comfortable IEM that I've come across that's under $30. The sony hybrids will greatly increase the comfort and fit, and the total will still be under $30.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


divinenow said:


> Great thread ljokerl! Unfortunately, I'm left considering way too many earphones and despite the buy-all influence of head-fi, I really only have time and money for one. I was wondering if I could receive some further advice with which IEM to get. I currently own the Nuforce NE-6, which I enjoy although I'm not overly impressed with, and the Shure SRH 750DJ which I really enjoy too but they seem to be missing a bit of something... Although, I mainly listen to music off of my computer or my walkman MP3 player so the source isn't exactly the highest quality.  I've also had the Etymotic ER-4P before but wasn't too huge a fan - while I liked picking out the instrumental parts it seemed like it was lacking in fullness and a bit piercing when it came to the treble. What I'm looking for is a solid, fun IEM that has that wow factor. Bass is definitely important to me as I love listening to heavy electronic music, although clear vocals and high-end detail are also very important (I listen to a fair share of blues, rock, classical, and all kinds of genres).


   
  Fairly  standard question - what would you want to see improved over your NE6s. They aren't lacking in fullness and certainly don't have piercing treble so it's got to be something else. My standard suggestion for an NE6 upgrade would be the Brainwavz M2/R03 or Brainwavz ProAlpha/R02 since they are so reasonably-priced. But if you want more bass, for example, they won't do.


----------



## divinenow

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Fairly  standard question - what would you want to see improved over your NE6s. They aren't lacking in fullness and certainly don't have piercing treble so it's got to be something else. My standard suggestion for an NE6 upgrade would be the Brainwavz M2/R03 or Brainwavz ProAlpha/R02 since they are so reasonably-priced. But if you want more bass, for example, they won't do.


 

 True, the NE-6 definitely have some fullness, although I would say that on the rare occasion the treble can be a bit too sharp and fatiguing for my liking - but that really depends on the music. A few things I'm looking for in an upgrade:
   
  -Even more on the low-end - less of a polished, punchy bass and more of a heavy-hitting, powerful bass
  -More clarity - soundstage and imaging as long as the IEM doesn't sound too distant
  -A little bit more of a high-end sparkle
   
  Right now I'm considering just ordering both the Eterna and the Silver Bullet to test out and selecting between them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





divinenow said:


> Right now I'm considering just ordering both the Eterna and the Silver Bullet to test out and selecting between them.


 


  Ha, I was about to suggest the Eterna before I read the last line. That would be a very good way to do. I don't think the SB is bassier than the NE-6 but it does many things so well that you may be able to live with that.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Sunrise Xcape and Brainwavz M3.
   
  There probably won't be any more updates for at least two weeks as I'm on the final stretch of getting my first real degree. 
   
  Also please let me know if there's any errors in these two reviews as I haven't had the chance to proofread them as many times as I usually do.


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the Sunrise Xcape and Brainwavz M3.
> 
> There probably won't be any more updates for at least two weeks as I'm on the final stretch of getting my first real degree.
> 
> Also please let me know if there's any errors in these two reviews as I haven't had the chance to proofread them as many times as I usually do.


 


  So many IEMs and you are still in university?
   
  I kinda wish I got THAT much money to spend when I was in uni...


----------



## Anaxilus

Great review of the Xcape Joker!  Hopefully they start getting some street cred.  Despite their price point I love their attention to detail on non SQ aspects like the cable, case, tapered housing, etc.  Wonder if they do something w/ the 252 and 262 drivers?


----------



## mythless

Cool, sounds like another nice IEM , won't be picking them up but, they sound very good.


----------



## kmhaynes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the Sunrise Xcape and Brainwavz M3.


   
  Super!  I'm glad to read your take on the Sunrise Xcape, as I have felt for the past week listening to it that it rivals, maybe equals, maybe even excels the RE0.  Either it has, or I can get from it with a bit of EQ, more warmth and bass body than I remember getting from the RE0.  The trebles might have a tad less than the RE0 infinite (seeming) extension, but they are still very revealing, smooth and clear.
   
  Thanks for the work, ljokerl, and good studying!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

divinenow said:


> True, the NE-6 definitely have some fullness, although I would say that on the rare occasion the treble can be a bit too sharp and fatiguing for my liking - but that really depends on the music. A few things I'm looking for in an upgrade:
> 
> -Even more on the low-end - less of a polished, punchy bass and more of a heavy-hitting, powerful bass
> -More clarity - soundstage and imaging as long as the IEM doesn't sound too distant
> ...







You really should try the Shure E2c tips on the NE-6, or Complys T400 foam tips. These will really help the sound.


----------



## sepinho

Thank you for the great review of the Xcape. I've been listening to it extensively in the last few weeks and (almost) fully agree.
   
  It's a great little IEM and one of my current favorites. It does seem to have BA characteristics, but where I disagree with your assertion is the comparison with the Custom 3's low end. Then again, I suspect that's due to the fit issues I have with the Custom 3. The Xcape reminds me a lot of my Sleek Audio SA6 (in neutral configuration), which is still my favorite IEM. Detail retrieval and general sound signature are surprisingly similar to my ears.


----------



## shadowfox42

Glad to see a review of the xcape. My re0's, which I love, have just become defective after 4 months of use. I've considered purchasing the ck10, as they are my ideal IEMs, alas the expense is holding me back. So I've taken an interest in the xcape, I can only hope they'd last considerably longer than the re0.
   
  So I can't decide between them both. It seems that the ck10 are very well built, therefore, durable. I assume there isn't too much of a difference between the xcape and the ck10, in terms of sound quality is there?


----------



## utkusu

It is great to see that your Xcape review validates my earlier purchase as a great one. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Especially for those in Canada, Xcapes are a much better buy than REs due to faster (took mine 3 business days to arrive) and cheaper shipping. So far-last couple of days, the Xcapes amazed me. My only concern is the build quality. The housings seem to be built very well but the cables are very thin and  feels like they can get separated from the housings or simply break easily. So I treat them like my babies!


----------



## sphinxvc

Joker, this thread is the most informative resource on IEMs on the internet.  Love it.
   
  Cheers..
   
  PS wish you would bump the TF10s up the "queue!"


----------



## rawrster

So I got a pair of the Brainwavz M2 and so far I'm pretty impressed. They are quite sensitive so I added a 68 ohm adapter for use with my dac/amp and it sounds a bit more balanced with the adapter on them. Also it does seem like a noticeable difference over the R02 at least to my ears esp in the bass area.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> PS wish you would bump the TF10s up the "queue!"


 

 He can't do that if it's not in his possession.


----------



## sphinxvc

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hmm, he currently owns the TF10s according to his profile.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> anaxilus said:
> ...


 

 Doesn't mean he has it.  It's on loan.  You can read about it a few pages back.


----------



## kmhaynes

BTW, noticed that the price for the Sunrise Xcape on eBay has dropped a bit to $75, free shipping from Singapore.


----------



## Smithy321

how do sm3's fair in this list  ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxwelldemon said:


> So many IEMs and you are still in university?
> 
> I kinda wish I got THAT much money to spend when I was in uni...


   
  It's not money spent... it's a short-term negative-yield investment 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I have a separate paypal account with a $5k limit for hobby stuff and consider it a revolving fund so my buying new gear always depends on selling off stuff I don't use anymore.
   

 Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Great review of the Xcape Joker!  Hopefully they start getting some street cred.  Despite their price point I love their attention to detail on non SQ aspects like the cable, case, tapered housing, etc.  Wonder if they do something w/ the 252 and 262 drivers?


 
 Has it been confirmed that Head-Direct uses the same OEM for the RE0/RE-ZERO and 252/262? If so - here's to hoping. I want a lower-impedance earphone using the RE262 driver with a conventional housing 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   

 Quote:


kmhaynes said:


> Super!  I'm glad to read your take on the Sunrise Xcape, as I have felt for the past week listening to it that it rivals, maybe equals, maybe even excels the RE0.  Either it has, or I can get from it with a bit of EQ, more warmth and bass body than I remember getting from the RE0.  The trebles might have a tad less than the RE0 infinite (seeming) extension, but they are still very revealing, smooth and clear.
> 
> Thanks for the work, ljokerl, and good studying!


 
 Thanks, appreciate that. Glad you like the Xcape also 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

 Quote:


sepinho said:


> Thank you for the great review of the Xcape. I've been listening to it extensively in the last few weeks and (almost) fully agree.
> 
> It's a great little IEM and one of my current favorites. It does seem to have BA characteristics, but where I disagree with your assertion is the comparison with the Custom 3's low end. Then again, I suspect that's due to the fit issues I have with the Custom 3. The Xcape reminds me a lot of my Sleek Audio SA6 (in neutral configuration), which is still my favorite IEM. Detail retrieval and general sound signature are surprisingly similar to my ears.


 
 Never tried the SA6 but the Xcape only reminds me of the KC3 in overall bass level and extension, not really on any fundamental level. 
   

 Quote:


shadowfox42 said:


> Glad to see a review of the xcape. My re0's, which I love, have just become defective after 4 months of use. I've considered purchasing the ck10, as they are my ideal IEMs, alas the expense is holding me back. So I've taken an interest in the xcape, I can only hope they'd last considerably longer than the re0.
> 
> So I can't decide between them both. It seems that the ck10 are very well built, therefore, durable. I assume there isn't too much of a difference between the xcape and the ck10, in terms of sound quality is there?


 
 There's definitely a difference between the CK10 and Xcape in both sound signature and overall SQ but perhaps it is smaller than it should be with a 3-fold difference in price. The CK10 is damn near indestructible but of course should still be used with care, just like the Xcape. The initial build of the Xcape has no obvious problem areas so I think it should be okay but of course we won't know for sure until people have had them for a while.
   

 Quote:


sphinxvc said:


> Joker, this thread is the most informative resource on IEMs on the internet.  Love it.
> 
> Cheers..
> 
> PS wish you would bump the TF10s up the "queue!"


 
 Thanks. Unfortunately, Anaxilus is right - I sent the TF10s off for what was supposed to be a short loan to a fellow head-fier in early September and have had a very difficult time getting them back. Not sure I would have gotten them back if not for the recent TF10 amazon deal, to be honest. They've supposedly been shipped out now so they're making one more stop (with someone I trust) on the way back to me.
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> So I got a pair of the Brainwavz M2 and so far I'm pretty impressed. They are quite sensitive so I added a 68 ohm adapter for use with my dac/amp and it sounds a bit more balanced with the adapter on them. Also it does seem like a noticeable difference over the R02 at least to my ears esp in the bass area.


 
 Yeah, the difference in bass is most noticeable between the two but I hope you tried the R02 with an adapter as well .
   
  Quote:


kmhaynes said:


> BTW, noticed that the price for the Sunrise Xcape on eBay has dropped a bit to $75, free shipping from Singapore.


 
 Good deal. Let's see if it's a permanent price drop.


----------



## rawrster

I didn't try the adapter with the R02..I pretty much only connected it to my netbook onboard sound. I think I might cut the strain relief a little bit to make for an easier over the ear fit. RIght now it kinda feels like the over ear fit of one of those earphones such as the M9 or MC5. I just noticed something strange about the M2. The metal part where the strain relief is by the housing can be twisted off to expose the wire which I find to be pretty odd. Although by doing so it revealed to me where the vent was.


----------



## McChickenz

|joker|, do you / could you do a comparison utilizing the Audio Technica ATH-CK-7 in the $50-100 category?  I'm having trouble deciding what I want in that category, especially since I'm spoiled with my M50 cans from A-T.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## vilasn

My salutations to the one who started this thread and others that are contributing to it, it's an enormous effort to serve the community. Your efforts are highly appreciated and will be for generations to come I am sure.


----------



## tuahogary

Quote: 





vilasn said:


> My salutations to the one who started this thread and others that are contributing to it, it's an enormous effort to serve the community. Your efforts are highly appreciated and will be for generations to come I am sure.


 


  All hail |joker| the magnificent! Server of the people and hero of the IEM kingdom. May the blessings of the IEM goddess sweep fortune to thy throne! Let this epic review that is imbued with thy name be preserved in the history books for all our great great grandchildren to see! The world would not have hoped for a better pair of golden ears that is |joker|'s!
   
   
  -sorry i cant help myself


----------



## mcnoiserdc

75 USD for Xcape is at discount. I read it somewhere.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


smithy321 said:


> how do sm3's fair in this list  ?


   

 Very well sound-wise and near the top (since they are generally similar to Westones) overall.
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> I just noticed something strange about the M2. The metal part where the strain relief is by the housing can be twisted off to expose the wire which I find to be pretty odd. Although by doing so it revealed to me where the vent was.


 
  I think that's just simpler from a manufacturing point of view. There's no real utility to being able to take the stem but attaching it permanently is probably more difficult or less reliable.

   

 Quote:


mcchickenz said:


> |joker|, do you / could you do a comparison utilizing the Audio Technica ATH-CK-7 in the $50-100 category?  I'm having trouble deciding what I want in that category, especially since I'm spoiled with my M50 cans from A-T.
> 
> Thanks.


 
 The CK7 is a very old model and I haven't any plans to go back and review it. With so many great options in the $50-100 range I don't see how adding another would make choosing easier 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
   


  Quote:


tuahogary said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  Lol thanks, guys. Very entertaining


----------



## JosephKim

Hey Joker wondering if youve heard the shure se530 and what you think


----------



## EraserXIV

I believe he has not. I think he stated in the past that he has experimented with some of Shure's other offerings and was not overly impressed so did not put much effort into pursuing them any further.


----------



## McChickenz

|joker|,
   
  Thank you for your reply about the CK7's
   
  What set of double (or triple) flange-tips would work with the Phiaton 210's?  You mention in your review that the poor isolation almost makes a flange purchase necessary.  I shop on Amazon 99% of the time if that helps.


----------



## etragedy

Dear Joker,
  I felt I should let you know that you are the single reason that I no longer have a savings. The world or IEM's was opened up to me by you. Thank you for all the time you have put into this amazing piece of foruming.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


josephkim said:


> Hey Joker wondering if youve heard the shure se530 and what you think


  Quote:


> POriginally Posted by *EraserXIV* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I believe he has not. I think he stated in the past that he has experimented with some of Shure's other offerings and was not overly impressed so did not put much effort into pursuing them any further.


   
  Perhaps this thread needs it own FAQ section 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. The first two would be 'how does the SM3 rank?' and 'why are there no Shures?'. But yeah, Eraser is right. I've not heard the SE530/535 and have little interest in them since I haven't heard anything good out of the lower 2/3 of their product line.
   

 Quote:


mcchickenz said:


> What set of double (or triple) flange-tips would work with the Phiaton 210's?  You mention in your review that the poor isolation almost makes a flange purchase necessary.  I shop on Amazon 99% of the time if that helps.


 
 Monster triple-flanges should work and any of the Meelec fit kits should fit as well. If I were you I'd try them with the stock tips first - maybe my ears are just weird. By the way I have the new Phiaton PS 20 here as well and they offer a similar type of fit with a more mainstream (read:bassy) sound signature. I think they are a little more discrete as well. I was surprised to find them selling for just over $55 as the list price is $79 and they were just released a month or so ago. 
   
   
  Quote:


etragedy said:


> Dear Joker,
> I felt I should let you know that you are the single reason that I no longer have a savings. The world or IEM's was opened up to me by you. Thank you for all the time you have put into this amazing piece of foruming.


   
  Sorry about your savings but just think of how much you'd have spent if you skipped IEMs and went straight for full-size setups


----------



## rawrster

I do consider earphones the lesser evil. A good one can sound good out of a dap while headphones have their dac, amp, power source, etc. I continue to be impressed at my ability to keep my wallet intact whenever I look at this thread..of course unfortunately my wallet is not in tact due to head-fi.
   
  It's a good thing there's a decent amount of space at the bottom of the strain relief so I can cut it. If it was tight I'd probably wouldn't be able to cut the strain relief.


----------



## etragedy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sorry about your savings but just think of how much you'd have spent if you skipped IEMs and went straight for full-size setups


 
   
   
True, I should look at this as an opportunity for savings!. Though I'm not quite sure what you mean by “full-size setups.” Are you referring to a set of high end cans and mobile amp?


----------



## izaku

I spend only $100 before know this thread. After that, spend $500+. But at least this thread has save me thousand $$ 


  Quote: 





etragedy said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


   
*ljokerl*, you break my heart. i thought you will said sm3 will be at the top   
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> smithy321 said:
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


etragedy said:


> True, I should look at this as an opportunity for savings!. Though I'm not quite sure what you mean by “full-size setups.” Are you referring to a set of high end cans and mobile amp?


 
 Or full-size amp. Either way it'll suck way more cash out of you (potentially). I am so lucky that I prefer my cheap age-old K601 to most of the other <$300 full-size cans out there.
   

 Quote:
   


izaku said:


> I spend only $100 before know this thread. After that, spend $500+. But at least this thread has save me thousand $$
> 
> *ljokerl*, you break my heart. i thought you will said sm3 will be at the top


   
  Sound-wise yes but I don't think anyone expected that big hunk of plastic to be a better overall package than the CK10/CK100. Even the W2 isn't quite there and it's the most comfortable and well-packaged Westone-style earphone I've tried.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

IF you need isolation don't go the ps210 way, it isolates a little more than a conventional earbud. I even bought the ps 210 to use in the lab so I can hear my colleagues.
  
  Quote: 





mcchickenz said:


> |joker|,
> 
> Thank you for your reply about the CK7's
> 
> What set of double (or triple) flange-tips would work with the Phiaton 210's?  You mention in your review that the poor isolation almost makes a flange purchase necessary.  I shop on Amazon 99% of the time if that helps.


----------



## divinenow

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ha, I was about to suggest the Eterna before I read the last line. That would be a very good way to do. I don't think the SB is bassier than the NE-6 but it does many things so well that you may be able to live with that.


 

 Thanks for the help! I'll give them both a try and post some impressions. Where would you recommend I order the earphones from? Looking for a seller with a good refund policy because I'll most likely only be keeping one of these (too low on money 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





).

  
  Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> You really should try the Shure E2c tips on the NE-6, or Complys T400 foam tips. These will really help the sound.


 

 Yeah, I'll grab some new tips when I order the new headphones and give them a try with the NE-6 as well. Not sure about the Complys though, as I heard that they limit sound. I'll probably true some Monster or PL30 single flange tips.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


divinenow said:


> Thanks for the help! I'll give them both a try and post some impressions. Where would you recommend I order the earphones from? Looking for a seller with a good refund policy because I'll most likely only be keeping one of these (too low on money
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I don't know if any of the Fischer audio dealers accept non-defective returns - you probably want to check their individual policies. Bugdenaudio.com is the authorized North American dealer so perhaps you can start there. Buying used is another alternative since you won't lose much resale value and there's no ethical ambiguities with re-selling earphones if you don't like them.


----------



## atobe

nice reviews... sucks that you said the m3 isn't worth the extra $ over the m2s :/ should of waited for the review before i bought them oh wells


----------



## McChickenz

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> IF you need isolation don't go the ps210 way, it isolates a little more than a conventional earbud. I even bought the ps 210 to use in the lab so I can hear my colleagues.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, yeah I don't know whether or not I want isolation or not...decisions decisions... sigh.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





atobe said:


> nice reviews... sucks that you said the m3 isn't worth the extra $ over the m2s :/ should of waited for the review before i bought them oh wells


 


  To be fair I only think that's true for the mainstream (read: non-head-fi) audience and is largely a result of me having more faith in the fit and isolation of the M2. Barring that the M3 definitely the superior earphone and clearly one of the best in the sub-$100 range (definitely in the top 5 for me now that the HJE900 is no longer available).


----------



## JxK

^Yeah. It's sad to see the hje900 withdrawn from the US market. One can only hope that panasonic is planning on unveiling its successor soon. Its sound signature was definitely one of a kind.


----------



## Maxvla

Is there such a thing as a RE-262 with a bit more bass quantity? I can already tell I'm going to be heading towards the JH16 side of the high end IEM spectrum...

Been listening to these for a while and really loving them. Listened to The Eagles - Hotel California (Hell Freezes Over) tonight, absolutely the best I've ever heard it. Really felt like I was in the audience. Overall resolution aside, I'm hearing great things, and I'm still not amping or DACing them properly!


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I agree that the M3 is technically more capable and more balanced than the M2 which is still a fun and inexpensive earphone to play with.  Once I got enough burn-in on the M3 to reduce the "out of the box" cupped hands sound in the M3's mids they just pulled ahead of the M2 from there.
   
  I've also been spending time with the Nuforce NE-700 and think you should give those a try when you have the chance.  Think Sunrise Audio Xcape with warmer fuller bass and mids while retaining similar detail, but being less forward and more spacious sounding.  They don't have the slight treble tilt of the Xcape, nor the slight bass tilt of the M3.  They're a little more laid back than the M3, with slightly less bass although having more than the Xcape.  They're only a little less efficient than the M3, but noticeably easier to drive than the Xcape.  I don't even know how it's possible to rank these when they're all capable but cater to different tastes.


----------



## NCT

Thank you for the review!


----------



## rawrster

Well since the HJE900 is no longer available maybe it's time to reflect that on your price for the HJE900 in the first page of this thread or mention that it has been discontinued in the US.
   
  In the sub $100 range the M2 is quickly becoming one of my favorite and I still have my HJE900 which are both pretty good values at $100 and under although the latter is no longer available in the US.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Well since the HJE900 is no longer available maybe it's time to reflect that on your price for the HJE900 in the first page of this thread or mention that it has been discontinued in the US.
> 
> In the sub $100 range the M2 is quickly becoming one of my favorite and I still have my HJE900 which are both pretty good values at $100 and under although the latter is no longer available in the US.


 


  501! Oh was I suspose to say something....uh nice thread Pana are the king of all IEM along with countless of others I haven't tried. Lol jking anyhow, keep up the good work Joker and please throw up a SM3 review so I can stop bugging you. Lol anyways cheers and take your time.
   
   
  Edit: Where is my banner? 100+ head-fi'er is contradicting 501 we have a problem, I'm going to get the guns


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxvla said:


> Is there such a thing as a RE-262 with a bit more bass quantity? I can already tell I'm going to be heading towards the JH16 side of the high end IEM spectrum...
> 
> Been listening to these for a while and really loving them. Listened to The Eagles - Hotel California (Hell Freezes Over) tonight, absolutely the best I've ever heard it. Really felt like I was in the audience. Overall resolution aside, I'm hearing great things, and I'm still not amping or DACing them properly!


 
 No, there isn't. You can move to a bassier earphone but you will be sacrificing the unique balance of the RE262 and most likely the soundstage as well. The Monster MD and IE8 are the main competitors but the IE8 doesn't sound as natural on the whole as the RE262 does and may be too distant-sounding for you. The MD, on the other hand, doesn't really have the separation or sheer soundstage size of the 262. Both are much bassier though. 
   

 Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> I agree that the M3 is technically more capable and more balanced than the M2 which is still a fun and inexpensive earphone to play with.  Once I got enough burn-in on the M3 to reduce the "out of the box" cupped hands sound in the M3's mids they just pulled ahead of the M2 from there.
> I've also been spending time with the Nuforce NE-700 and think you should give those a try when you have the chance.  Think Sunrise Audio Xcape with warmer fuller bass and mids while retaining similar detail, but being less forward and more spacious sounding.  They don't have the slight treble tilt of the Xcape, nor the slight bass tilt of the M3.  They're a little more laid back than the M3, with slightly less bass although having more than the Xcape.  They're only a little less efficient than the M3, but noticeably easier to drive than the Xcape.  I don't even know how it's possible to rank these when they're all capable but cater to different tastes.


 
 Thanks, sent Nuforce an email. Let's see if they'll let me try one. I hope my being somewhat less enamored with the NE-6 than most doesn't bother them. 
   
  I agree that it's very difficult to rank these but in the end I feel like I am sacrificing more detail, clarity, and resolution when I move from a top-tier to the M3 than the Xcape. Of course if bass impact, soundstage size, and thickness of note are more important than detail, clarity, and resolution, one could make the opposite argument, which is why I sincerely hope noone simply looks at the numerical scores I give out...
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Well since the HJE900 is no longer available maybe it's time to reflect that on your price for the HJE900 in the first page of this thread or mention that it has been discontinued in the US.
> 
> In the sub $100 range the M2 is quickly becoming one of my favorite and I still have my HJE900 which are both pretty good values at $100 and under although the latter is no longer available in the US.


 
  Yeah, I'll change the price with the next update. Seems to still be available at $130-140 which is around the price they were when I wrote the review a bit under a year ago. Also, I have a feeling you'd like the M3 quite a bit.


----------



## mootookang

Joker, I see that you're currently listening to 1964Ts. Can't wait to hear your impression on them.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

x2
  
  Quote: 





mootookang said:


> Joker, I see that you're currently listening to 1964Ts. Can't wait to hear your impression on them.


----------



## rawrster

If the M3 is a bigger and better M2 then I probably would like them. I find the M2 more of a fun earphone and can probably substitute my HJE900 in that category. It does have a slight boost in the bass area and I did a short comparison with the HJE900 since I received a PM about the two and it does seem like the M2 has more weight in the bass which is something I was surprised at. However the M3 probably isn't very practical with the M2 already in my possession and the HJE900 gathering dust as the days pass (I need to sell the HJE900 whenever I get around to it) unless of course someone wants to give me a M3 which is very unlikely 
   
  The NE-700 does seem interesting and I've never heard a Nuforce earphone so if  the NE-700 is competitive with the other top models in the sub $100 earphones then Nuforce probably has made something quite good and the competition in that particular price range continues to get more and more difficult. It's never been a better time to get started in this hobby and spending not as much money to get much better quality than just a few years ago.


----------



## Jozurr

Hey Joker.
   
  Here I am again contemplating over my new IEM. Seems like Xcape is going to be it. I already have the M1. How would you compare the Xcape to the M1? Do you think it's an upgrad? Please give me some details..
   
  Thanks alot for the M1 and the PL30 I own.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mootookang said:


> Joker, I see that you're currently listening to 1964Ts. Can't wait to hear your impression on them.


   
  Lol... It'll be a while.
   
   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> If the M3 is a bigger and better M2 then I probably would like them. I find the M2 more of a fun earphone and can probably substitute my HJE900 in that category. It does have a slight boost in the bass area and I did a short comparison with the HJE900 since I received a PM about the two and it does seem like the M2 has more weight in the bass which is something I was surprised at. However the M3 probably isn't very practical with the M2 already in my possession and the HJE900 gathering dust as the days pass (I need to sell the HJE900 whenever I get around to it) unless of course someone wants to give me a M3 which is very unlikely


 
 Mine are going out on loan to JxK but if he doesn't like them I can certainly let them make another stop on the way back.
   
   
  Quote:


jozurr said:


> Here I am again contemplating over my new IEM. Seems like Xcape is going to be it. I already have the M1. How would you compare the Xcape to the M1? Do you think it's an upgrad? Please give me some details..
> 
> Thanks alot for the M1 and the PL30 I own.


 

  The Xcape is an upgrade to the M1 but only if it lines up with your listening preferences. It's not as soft or liquid-sounding as the M1 but it is a bit clearer, slightly more spacious, and more detailed. If you've felt that the M1 is not analytical enough than the Xcape is probably right for you. However, if you're happy with the detail and clarity of the M1, aren't willing to sacrifice the lush midrange, and just want a bigger soundstage and better presence across the range the M3 might be a better option.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Mine are going out on loan to JxK but if he doesn't like them I can certainly let them make another stop on the way back.


 
  Yeah, with joker's permission, after I've tried them I could just send them directly to you rawrster. And considering the M3's odd shape, and my own oddly shaped ears, I may end up sending them to you sooner than expected.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The odd shape is the thing that concerns me. If it had anything similar to the R02 or M2 it would be quite tempting but the shape of the housing leads me to believe I may have some issues with fit. Things sticking out usually means bad fit for me. I'll have to see if time allows me to have a loaner whenever it is you have it and are done with it.


----------



## mootookang

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> mootookang said:
> ...


 


  It'll be well worth the wait though, since 1964 do offer customs at a budget price. The road to customs might become more easily accessed if they perform well.


----------



## Jozurr

> Quote:
> 
> 
> jozurr said:
> ...


 

 I find the M1 sounds a little thin compared to the PL30.. it's not as smooth.. feels rather very dry. The bass HITS hard but I can't feel it.. a little boomy I think. I love how the vocals sound on it though.. Im thinking of an upgrade as a better IEM with a little more bass which I can FEEL.. I think the M1 lacks synergy among the ranges.. they're all good on their own.. they aren't as good TOGETHER... you still think I should go for the Xcape or just buy the M2 instead? I feel I'd get an itch to upgrade very soon again with the M2.. since it's not really a superior phone.. just the things I'd want in the M1.. I don't need hot treble and recessed mids though..


----------



## s0lar

Quote: 





jozurr said:


> > I find the M1 sounds a little thin compared to the PL30.. it's not as smooth.. feels rather very dry. The bass HITS hard but I can't feel it.. a little boomy I think. I love how the vocals sound on it though.. Im thinking of an upgrade as a better IEM with a little more bass which I can FEEL.. I think the M1 lacks synergy among the ranges.. they're all good on their own.. they aren't as good TOGETHER... you still think I should go for the Xcape or just buy the M2 instead? I feel I'd get an itch to upgrade very soon again with the M2.. since it's not really a superior phone.. just the things I'd want in the M1.. I don't need hot treble and recessed mids though..


 


 I have the M1's and they don't sound thin to me, but I do not have a lot of experience.
  Recntly I switched to RE0's and compared to the M1's I would say that they sound thin but there is a lot more detail. Sometimes the detail overwhelms me since I mostly listen to acoustic, slow music (read: Bob Dylan). The RE0, similar to Xcape from what I can read, is a better IEM but it sounds quite different. I liked the warm sound from the M1's. To me, none of them carry a lot of bass. I am getting a iBasso T4 soon, some recommend a warmish amp for the RE0's and some others say the T4 is that kind of amp.
  Time will tell.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:  





>





> I find the M1 sounds a little thin compared to the PL30.. it's not as smooth.. feels rather very dry. The bass HITS hard but I can't feel it.. a little boomy I think. I love how the vocals sound on it though.. Im thinking of an upgrade as a better IEM with a little more bass which I can FEEL.. I think the M1 lacks synergy among the ranges.. they're all good on their own.. they aren't as good TOGETHER... you still think I should go for the Xcape or just buy the M2 instead? I feel I'd get an itch to upgrade very soon again with the M2.. since it's not really a superior phone.. just the things I'd want in the M1.. I don't need hot treble and recessed mids though..


 


  If you feel that way about the M1 the Xcape is definitely not for you. The PL30 sounds smoother by virtue of glossing over a lot of detail and texture - I agree with s0lar that the M1 is not thin or dry at all in the grand scheme of things. Things like the RE0 and and to a lesser extent the Xcape are much more offensive if you find the M1 lacking smoothness and thickness. I don't think the M2 is really an upgrade to the M1 - it has more mid-bass but if you want rumble it won't do - extension is very similar between the two. Maybe the Thinksound TS02 or something though that's more of a fun sound and arguably more grainy than the M1. Silver Bullets might be to your liking.


----------



## rawrster

Just curious but how do the M1 and M2 compare signature wise? I'll assume that the M2 is superior to the M1 on technical ability. I know that the M2 is a rebranded R02 but the M1 doesn't have a ViSang equivalent and unless I'm mistaken isn't a rebrand of any model. So I'm wondering if the M2 and M1 are similar in any way.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Just curious but how do the M1 and M2 compare signature wise? I'll assume that the M2 is superior to the M1 on technical ability. I know that the M2 is a rebranded R02 but the M1 doesn't have a ViSang equivalent and unless I'm mistaken isn't a rebrand of any model. So I'm wondering if the M2 and M1 are similar in any way.


 


  The M2 is actually a rebranded R03 - the ProAlpha is a rebranded R02. The M1 is also OEMd by ViSang and very closely related to the M2. It is obviously tuned differently with higher impedance and a different chamber, though. M1 and M2 are indeed very similar but the M1 is lacks some of the mid-bass hump and subsequent warmth of the M2. A second result of the flatter response is that it doesn't sound quite as relaxed up top. Detail, clarity, timbre, speed, etc are quite similar between the two but the M1 is a little harder to drive and really comes alive with a more powerful player. The M2 does too to an extent but it's still very efficient. Overall the M1 is more to my liking than the M2 but I rate the M2 a tad higher overall because it has a slightly more cohesive signature and more of an 'x-factor'. I quite like the M2 - always have - it has an atmospheric feel to it despite the forward mids and mediocre soundstage depth and never gets boring or fatiguing. I think when I wrote up all of the popular <$80 bass earphones I said that I prefer the M2 over the Eterna and Hippo VB, which are likely superior from a technical perspective, and I stand by that.


----------



## Mdraluck23

Found this quote, from a LONG time ago, I believe this was my third or fourth post... I was so naive... I am going with the E7, unless anybody has anything to add. 
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *Mdraluck23* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> ...


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Yeah I meant the R03. The only thing I wish for the M2 was that it would be less sensitive. I can increase the impedance but not much I can do about sensitivity. They challenge my Livewires as the most sensitive earphones I currently own. I was excepting something more of a R02 but better when I got the M2 so didn't expect it to be as bassy as it is but it replaced my HJE900 as my fun earphone so it works for me. I once owned the Eterna v1 but I was unable to switch earphones to compare since it would either be too bass light or heavy depending on if I was coming from or to the Eterna. I don't have that issue with the M2 as I've been able to use my Livewires without any issues. Although the M1 does sound interesting and I do have a pair coming in the mail..eventually. Maybe I'll actually open that package.


----------



## EraserXIV

Anyone know any good sources for biflange tips? I know meelec has some, but I'm curious if some other places sell them too. Can anyone comment on how the ebay ones compare to the meelec stock ones (not the balanced ones) in terms of size, thickness, and firmness?
   
  Ebay ones: http://cgi.ebay.com/Double-Flange-Earbud-Tip-Panasonic-In-Ear-Headphone-/200541822638?pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item2eb1395eae#ht_3285wt_1115
   
  After getting the meelec stock ones for my RE262, I love them and they sit perfectly comfortable in my ear. But I'm curious now and want to test out some other tips


----------



## ywcs4530

Is it possible to have Ultimate Ears' in the review?
  I am looking forward with it
   
  of coz, your effort are highly appreicated!


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

   
  Well, that's too bad. You are missing out on some seriously impressive sound IMO. In fact, I've yet to hear a headphone, regardless of price and type, that will impress me more than the SE530 did.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mdraluck23 said:


> Found this quote, from a LONG time ago, I believe this was my third or fourth post... I was so naive... I am going with the E7, unless anybody has anything to add.


 
 To be honest I don't find the amp section of the E7 all that impressive but if you need it to double as a DAC it's still a very good deal.
   

 Quote:


ywcs4530 said:


> Is it possible to have Ultimate Ears' in the review?
> I am looking forward with it
> 
> of coz, your effort are highly appreicated!


 
 There's a list of upcoming reviews in post #8 right below the table. There are some UEs in there - I've got the earphones on-hand (well.. most of them) but not the time to write up the reviews. Hopefully they will be done by Christmas though.


----------



## ValSic

How 'bout a comparison between the Final Audio Heavens A1 and the Ortofon EQ-5?


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> Anyone know any good sources for biflange tips? I know meelec has some, but I'm curious if some other places sell them too. Can anyone comment on how the ebay ones compare to the meelec stock ones (not the balanced ones) in terms of size, thickness, and firmness?
> 
> Ebay ones: http://cgi.ebay.com/Double-Flange-Earbud-Tip-Panasonic-In-Ear-Headphone-/200541822638?pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item2eb1395eae#ht_3285wt_1115
> 
> After getting the meelec stock ones for my RE262, I love them and they sit perfectly comfortable in my ear. But I'm curious now and want to test out some other tips


 
  I've liked Head-Direct's biflanges. When I bought this kit, it also contained a pair of smaller biflanges in addition to two pair of the large ones (my preference), and several more items than shown.


----------



## paulypaul

my favs are the meelec bi-flange over the small hifiman biflange.
  Also the large and mid size sony hybrid copies (from lostearbuds on ebay)
  Also i find cutting the 2nd flange of the stem of the hifiman large biflange works for me for a good seal.


----------



## rawrster

I've tried those biflange tips Eraser and if you have ever had the PL30 it is the same biflange tip. I like the tips from MEElectronics better. There's also the HifiMan biflange tips which I really like the smaller biflange tip since the large is too large.
   
  From my order of preference: balanced M9 > small HifiMan biflange > bass heavy M9 > ebay biflange


----------



## EraserXIV

The balanced M9 works great, but is just a hair on the small side for me. the hifiman large is too big and the hifiman small is too small. The bass heavy M9 is the perfect size for me, but just a little too firm that it gets a little painful after long listening sessions. I'm pretty satisfied with the bass heavy M9s, but I guess this is like the case of goldilocks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'm curious now to see if any other biflanges will be my holy grail


----------



## Inks

M11+ biflange tips are also a bit different than the M9 biflange tips, you can also give those a try.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> The balanced M9 works great, but is just a hair on the small side for me. the hifiman large is too big and the hifiman small is too small. The bass heavy M9 is the perfect size for me, but just a little too firm that it gets a little painful after long listening sessions. I'm pretty satisfied with the bass heavy M9s, but I guess this is like the case of goldilocks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 If the balanced M9 is just a hair off have you tried moistening the tip w/ water before insertion?  That might do the trick and get you the seal your looking for.


----------



## anchorman69

Thank you for this top-notch post! Your effort is beyond heroic! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  It would be really interesting to see your review of Senheisser IE6. I have been looking into it but haven't found many good reviews on it... I wonder if its a forgotten little gem


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote: 





inks said:


> M11+ biflange tips are also a bit different than the M9 biflange tips, you can also give those a try.


 


  how would you say they differ? thinner, firmer, bigger, smaller, etc?


----------



## reckca

Hello everyone, I own the re0, i am very satisfied, and i want to give something under $ 100 with the same stamp but a little softer and lower, i tought sw-xcape or re zero. wath do you recommend?


----------



## s0lar

Same for me, but I think both the xcape and the re-zero are too similar. I think there must be better choices to complement the RE0, but again I am not the right person to answer this. I am still awaiting my amp, I think getting an amp for your RE0 might be a better idea. Try to get the most out of it before looking elsewhere.
  
  Quote: 





reckca said:


> Hello everyone, I own the re0, i am very satisfied, and i want to give something under $ 100 with the same stamp but a little softer and lower, i tought sw-xcape or re zero. wath do you recommend?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





s0lar said:


> Same for me, but I think both the xcape and the re-zero are too similar. I think there must be better choices to complement the RE0, but again I am not the right person to answer this. I am still awaiting my amp, I think getting an amp for your RE0 might be a better idea. Try to get the most out of it before looking elsewhere.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 

 If you want a fun compliment to RE0 then perhaps the SB, TS02, HJE900, Custom 3 will do the trick.


----------



## reckca

yes, i have a fiio e7, and with re0 is splendid (for me), but i want to give me a gift without deviate much from that stamp.


----------



## reckca

in europe hje900 are to much expensive, what are sb?


----------



## s0lar

I have the same problem, no way to get good earphones in a "real store". Of course you can order online but I like to avoid that. I think if you want to know what else you could do with RE0 kind of sound, the Xcape and RE-ZERO are indeed good choices. But I rather choose a different sound sig instead of a similar one. I will probably end up getting a HJE900 over the internet as well some day. No idea what SB is.

  
  Quote: 





reckca said:


> in europe hje900 are to much expensive, what are sb?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anchorman69 said:


> Thank you for this top-notch post! Your effort is beyond heroic!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks! I don't think the IE6 has been forgotten - it's just a little too expensive for what it offers at the ~$130 it usually sells for. Sound-wise it competes very well with the Brainwavz earphones and Fischer dynamics but it's nearly twice as expensive as some of them. It is very comfortable and well-built though.
   

 Quote:


reckca said:


> Hello everyone, I own the re0, i am very satisfied, and i want to give something under $ 100 with the same stamp but a little softer and lower, i tought sw-xcape or re zero. wath do you recommend?


 
  If you really want to stay within a half-step of the RE0 I think the RE-ZERO is closer to what you are looking for. Personally I'd be tempted to try something a little different but it's your call.

   

 Quote:


reckca said:


> in europe hje900 are to much expensive, what are sb?


 
 Silver Bullets (as in Fischer Audio Silver Bullets)


----------



## ljokerl

Added two Sony sets - XB40EX and EX082. Very impressed with the EX082 - for a stock earbud it is the best I've heard by a margin.


----------



## paulypaul

i have the ex082 and although they are ok for stock buds, i couldn't put them in front of any of my other iems ive owned (except the M9s and my first iems koss "plugs".
  I feel the mids are far too recessed (the same reason i didnt like the M9s)
  I like my mids


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





paulypaul said:


> i have the ex082 and although they are ok for stock buds, i couldn't put them in front of any of my other iems ive owned (except the M9s and my first iems koss "plugs".
> I feel the mids are far too recessed (the same reason i didnt like the M9s)
> I like my mids


 


  Well consider yourself lucky - you haven't owned as many terrible earphones as I have 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## paulypaul

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well consider yourself lucky - you haven't owned as many terrible earphones as I have
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  I think i have you and your excellent reviews to thank for the choices i have made 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  At least my choices after the koss plugs and and the skull candys (i only have myself to blame for those)


----------



## reckca

and you think that is better sb or eterna (i don't like exagerated bass)


----------



## rawrster

If you don't like exaggerated bass then you are looking at the wrong thing. Eterna is about as far as you can get from accurate bass...at least of everything I've heard


----------



## zubin111

Great effort!! Truly outstanding, atleast from where I stay (India) we have least access to all these amazing stuffs you have. Bought a Brainwavz M2 based entirely on your review and my sound preference and trust me, it was spot on!! I love them completely!! Thanks a lot!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


reckca said:


> and you think that is better sb or eterna (i don't like exagerated bass)


 
 Not sure which earphone you are referring to as 'that' but between the Eterna and Silver Bullets the Bullets definitely have more natural bass levels.


  Quote:


zubin111 said:


> Great effort!! Truly outstanding, atleast from where I stay (India) we have least access to all these amazing stuffs you have. Bought a Brainwavz M2 based entirely on your review and my sound preference and trust me, it was spot on!! I love them completely!! Thanks a lot!!


 

  Thanks, glad to hear that! It's great when someone finds a good match with so little trial-and-error


----------



## akacoke

hi there
   
  could you recommand some earphones with a lot of bass and good clarity?
   
  i have a protapro and monster jamz,  protapro sounds great but too muddy,  jamz have good clarity and detail but i could use some  more bass
   
   
  price under 100-120 cheaper the better
   
  thank


----------



## youngjoon

Hi there,
   
  Just joined and wanted to post for the sole purpose of thanking you.  Spent a lot of time reading your reviews and through a lot of research, I've decided to go with the CK10s (my old Sennheisers died today).  I never would have even heard of them, to be honest, until I read your post today, so thank you.  Got a great deal for them on a site called Accessory Jack as well!
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## zubin111

Thats true!! But i guess this is a disease in itself... At tha back of my mind I am also thinking what next!?? What would it be that would take me to the next level of enjoying great sound!! And would definitely require help from the experienced fellow members out here!!


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Thats true!! But i guess *this is a disease* in itself... At tha back of my mind I am also thinking what next!?? What would it be that would take me to the next level of enjoying great sound!! And would definitely require help from the experienced fellow members out here!!


 

 If you find a cure, let me know 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. There always seems to be a "next level" or "a different experience" available.


----------



## zubin111

True..!! But i guess its worth it... Its a pity we dont have all those goodies available here...
  
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## JosephKim

I bought the Brainwavz m1 based off the review here and other impressions, and was surprised at how poor the sound quality sounds to me. Everything sounds extremely veiled. I think my expectations were too high. For some reason I wanted them to be as good as the RE-ZEROs were  but of course $40 compared to $100. Oh well they seem to be built very well so I might hold on to them.


----------



## s0lar

When you are used to iem's like DBA-02 and RE-ZERO, the Brainwavz M1 is indeed a step down. After weeks using the RE0, I find the M1 perhaps too warm and it lacks details compared to the RE0. But I think you were expecting too much. SQ 7.5 against 9 and higher for RE-ZERO and DBA-02 speaks for itself.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





josephkim said:


> I bought the Brainwavz m1 based off the review here and other impressions, and was surprised at how poor the sound quality sounds to me. Everything sounds extremely veiled. I think my expectations were too high. For some reason I wanted them to be as good as the RE-ZEROs were  but of course $40 compared to $100. Oh well they seem to be built very well so I might hold on to them.


 


  I agree my expectations were to high as well there now sold. A'shame.


----------



## rawrster

I have one on the way from mp4nation in around a month or so from a coupon last weekend. I might end up keeping them as a backup to the M2.
   
  It does depend on what you are coming from however. If I came from customs and then to the RE262 I would think it wouldn't be good but if I came from my M2 it would be a good earphone.


----------



## yliu

The Klipsch Customs 1s are , I think, not even worth 6.5/10. They high and mids sound colored compared to my other iems, and it really lacks somewhere in the high mids.


----------



## JosephKim

Quote: 





s0lar said:


> When you are used to iem's like DBA-02 and RE-ZERO, the Brainwavz M1 is indeed a step down. After weeks using the RE0, I find the M1 perhaps too warm and it lacks details compared to the RE0. But I think you were expecting too much. SQ 7.5 against 9 and higher for RE-ZERO and DBA-02 speaks for itself.


 

 Those were almost exactly my impressions. Too warm, veiled and lacking detail. I also thought the bass was a bit boomy. Im surprised how many people actually like them.


----------



## s0lar

I do like the Brainwavz M1's, I am just saying that after listening to my RE0 a lot, they are quite different. They are good IEM's and I can really enjoy listening to them but only after knowing what they are about. They were my first good headphones together with AKG 81's. And I was using them a lot, I never thought the bass is too much, certainly not compared to the AKG's. At first I really disliked the AKG's but now I can enjoy them with certain music, also because I know what to expect.
  I found the RE0's to be missing a little in the bass region but when I put on The Police I know they do a great job and I love the kind of punch they put out, it feels almost perfect.


----------



## spacemanspliff

Having  serious issues with the MEE M9P. It is shocking! Literally, it retains static electricity and it has fried one driver and occasionally the microphone will not work. I can actually hear the static too. Is this a typical issue or am I just juicy?


----------



## Soyuz

@spacemanspliff 
  I can't recall reading more issues like this. Did you already contact Meelec?


----------



## legodt

What do the DBA-02s do better (and worse) than the HD25-1 IIs?


----------



## spacemanspliff

Quote: 





soyuz said:


> @spacemanspliff
> I can't recall reading more issues like this. Did you already contact Meelec?


 


  No. It is just weird. The cable seems to retain static electricity to a scary degree.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


akacoke said:


> could you recommand some earphones with a lot of bass and good clarity?
> 
> i have a protapro and monster jamz,  protapro sounds great but too muddy,  jamz have good clarity and detail but i could use some  more bass
> 
> price under 100-120 cheaper the better


   
  Should have gotten the Lil' Jamz 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. But if we're being serious I'd recommend the FA Eterna. Nice and cheap at <$70 and has all the bass you could expect from an in-ear that doesn't feel like taking a wrecking ball to the head (if the wrecking ball sounds appealing check out the Sony XB40EX).
   

   
   
  Quote:


youngjoon said:


> Hi there,
> 
> Just joined and wanted to post for the sole purpose of thanking you.  Spent a lot of time reading your reviews and through a lot of research, I've decided to go with the CK10s (my old Sennheisers died today).  I never would have even heard of them, to be honest, until I read your post today, so thank you.  Got a great deal for them on a site called Accessory Jack as well!


 
  Thanks, hope you like them!

 Quote:


spacemanspliff said:


> Having  serious issues with the MEE M9P. It is shocking! Literally, it retains static electricity and it has fried one driver and occasionally the microphone will not work. I can actually hear the static too. Is this a typical issue or am I just juicy?


 
 Sounds like they aren't grounded properly. I had similar issues with one of my Jlabs J3s - just get them exchanged for a new one. 
   

 Quote:


legodt said:


> What do the DBA-02s do better (and worse) than the HD25-1 IIs?


 

  Aside from not being headphones, the DBA-02 does everything better than the HD25 except for sheer impact - the HD25 does have pretty impactful bass while the DBA-02 is tight and clean but not very hard-hitting.


----------



## legodt

Would you recommend the DBA-02s over the HD25s?


----------



## Eric_C

Quote: 





legodt said:


> Would you recommend the DBA-02s over the HD25s?


 


  Wait. I thought you said you loved your HD25s in another thread (a month ago, quote below)
   
  Quote:


legodt said:


> I love my Senns, upgrading is now completely out of the question.


----------



## buffalowings

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


 upgrade-itis...it happens to all of us


----------



## legodt

They are the best thing since sliced bread, no doubt, but some questions just have to be asked. Why? Because I love to see my wallet cringe!


----------



## Eric_C

Quote: 





legodt said:


> They are the best thing since sliced bread, no doubt, but some questions just have to be asked. Why? Because I love to see my wallet cringe!


 


  I...see. Sorry about your wallet then...


----------



## legodt

Quote: 





eric_c said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Poor thing may as well be bulimic, but that is just the Head-Fi curse.


----------



## Magitek

Hey joker, thank you so much for all of your work. I wonder how many people have gotten into hi-fi because of you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Anyway, I have a question.
   
  I was thinking about getting $100 headphones, but I'm not really sure if I want IEMs or full-sized. I was thinking about getting the M50s because I think I would like their sound and you gave them a 9/10 (higher than most of your reviews of the $100 IEMs). Then I wondered, is your rating for IEMs the same as full-sized? Thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


legodt said:


> Would you recommend the DBA-02s over the HD25s?


 
  Depends on the use, I suppose. The HD25 is more fun with its bass impact and sharp treble while the DBA-02 is more accurate and natural-sounding. The HD25 also has the advantages of being nearly indestructible and not being an IEM (sometimes I need to wear cans so that people know I can't hear them).
   
  Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Magitek* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Hey joker, thank you so much for all of your work. I wonder how many people have gotten into hi-fi because of you
> 
> ...


 
 I did not actively think about correlation when developing the scoring rubrics for the two threads; however, there is a strong correlation and I would say that they are comparable to within around 0.5 pts in sq (does not apply to comfort, isolation, etc). I guess this question is another one for the FAQ since it comes up pretty often.


----------



## anchorman69

ljokerl  thanks for your earlier reply!
   
  I am new into this world of IEMs and I am having trouble deciding between the Phonak PFE, Westone 1 and UM1.... 
   
  I need them to have good isolation (during work and commuting) and obviously good SQ as well. I listen to a wide range of music from electronic to classical and jazz, but most of my music collection is in mp3 (~320kbps) and I'm stuck with an IPod Touch for the time being...
   
  What would your opinion be?


----------



## ljokerl

Between the two I've heard (W1 and PFE) and with your preferences and the requirement for isolation in mind the Westone 1 wins by a margin, though I still think it's overpriced for what it offers in terms of sound. If you're willing to forego the wonderful Westone cable the Klipsch Custom 3 may be one to take a look at as well. There is nothing wrong with 320kbps - I rarely put lossless on my portable player to save space. I really can't tell the difference between 320 and FLAC/WMA on a portable player with any earphone (or at least any universal-fit earphone). 
   
  Quote:


			
				anchorman69 said:
			
		

> I am new into this world of IEMs and I am having trouble deciding between the Phonak PFE, Westone 1 and UM1....
> 
> I need them to have good isolation (during work and commuting) and obviously good SQ as well. I listen to a wide range of music from electronic to classical and jazz, but most of my music collection is in mp3 (~320kbps) and I'm stuck with an IPod Touch for the time being...


----------



## buffalowings

LjokerL, how would you compare the monster miles davis tributes to the westone 3's? I understand that I'm trying to compare a multiple BA based IEM with a single dynamic driver so I guess it's kinda like comparing fiji apples to granny smith (I assume that's the best comparison since full sized cans vs IEMs are apples to oranges) anywho, from your review the westone 3's are the bassiest of nearly if not all BA earphones and because of that, there is some slight loss in detail. Compared to the miles davis tributes, which would you say is the bassier (more slam/quantity) and which one has more detail etc etc, purdy much, what are the noticible differences between the two
   
  thanks again!
   
  james


----------



## anchorman69

I went down to the store today to listen to these IEMs in person, and wow(!), those Westone cables are really so nice and practical! Pictures really don't do them justice!
   
  I also think that the PFEs are a lot smoother in terms of SQ, but I agree that the Westone 1 will be more suitable for me. I had a look at the Klipsch Custom 3 as well but they are in a different price range from where I live so I won't consider them for now.
   
  Thanks again!

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Between the two I've heard (W1 and PFE) and with your preferences and the requirement for isolation in mind the Westone 1 wins by a margin, though I still think it's overpriced for what it offers in terms of sound. If you're willing to forego the wonderful Westone cable the Klipsch Custom 3 may be one to take a look at as well. There is nothing wrong with 320kbps - I rarely put lossless on my portable player to save space. I really can't tell the difference between 320 and FLAC/WMA on a portable player with any earphone (or at least any universal-fit earphone).
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


----------



## Inks

which store is this? Curious...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


buffalowings said:


> LjokerL, how would you compare the monster miles davis tributes to the westone 3's? I understand that I'm trying to compare a multiple BA based IEM with a single dynamic driver so I guess it's kinda like comparing fiji apples to granny smith (I assume that's the best comparison since full sized cans vs IEMs are apples to oranges) anywho, from your review the westone 3's are the bassiest of nearly if not all BA earphones and because of that, there is some slight loss in detail. Compared to the miles davis tributes, which would you say is the bassier (more slam/quantity) and which one has more detail etc etc, purdy much, what are the noticible differences between the two


 
 I don't think the W3 suffers any loss in detail compared to the MD. Slam is similar between the two but the MDs still have that drawn-out attack/decay that makes them sound more full-bodied but also smoother. I would say that neither has the upper hand in bass clarity/detail but in the mids the thinner W3 has the thick and smooth MD beat on both counts. They are pretty different earphones on the whole so I guess it comes down to what you are after - lots of armature bass with more analytical mids and aggressive treble or a smoother, dynamic sound that's more coherent but arguably less revealing.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> (sometimes I need to wear cans so that people know I can't hear them).


 
   
  That's just brilliant.  Hadn't thought of that myself.  I think I'm to just the thing.....


----------



## chinesekiwi

tbh joker, you might want to give the MeElectronic M6's a 10/10 value rating considering they're at $20 street price now!
   
http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-M6-BK-Sport-Sound-Isolating-Headphones/dp/B0038W0K2K/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1292101431&sr=1-6
   
http://www.google.com/search?q=meeelectronic+m6&tbs=shop:1&aq=f#q=meelectronic+m6&hl=en&sa=X&biw=1920&bih=985&tbs=shop:1,p_ord:r&fp=57592de832f1400c


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





chinesekiwi said:


> tbh joker, you might want to give the MeElectronic M6's a 10/10 value rating considering they're at $20 street price now!
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-M6-BK-Sport-Sound-Isolating-Headphones/dp/B0038W0K2K/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1292101431&sr=1-6
> 
> http://www.google.com/search?q=meeelectronic+m6&tbs=shop:1&aq=f#q=meelectronic+m6&hl=en&sa=X&biw=1920&bih=985&tbs=shop:1,p_ord:r&fp=57592de832f1400c


 

 Makes me want to pick up a pair out of curiosity and possibly to use for working out. I'm sure they would pair great with my Clip+ and make a nice little cheap workout package that if something happened to I would be out about $50 in total for the iems and source


----------



## shadowfox42

Well I did it.....I finally ordered the ck10. I anxiously await their arrival.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


chinesekiwi said:


> tbh joker, you might want to give the MeElectronic M6's a 10/10 value rating considering they're at $20 street price now!


 
 Yeah, need to update the price/value on that among others - thanks.


----------



## buffalowings

congrats, they're a wee bit hard to find in the states

  
  Quote: 





shadowfox42 said:


> Well I did it.....I finally ordered the ck10. I anxiously await their arrival.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> chinesekiwi said:
> ...


 

 While you're at it, perhaps it's time you got around to reviewing that now disregarded budget favorite - the dealextreme orange IEMs. I mean really, is there any better way to spend $2.85 - and with free shipping to boot. I think this will be a headphone to give the parts-express mini a run for its money.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





buffalowings said:


> congrats, they're a wee bit hard to find in the states
> 
> 
> Quote:
> ...


 

 Import them from Japan and you have a pair of CK10  I was tempted to buy a pair a few weeks ago.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





solidsnake3 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 That's what I did.


----------



## shadowfox42

Quote: 





buffalowings said:


> congrats, they're a wee bit hard to find in the states


 


  Thank you. It's a pity Audio-Technica discontinued the ck10s, they still seem to be rather popular, least on here.


----------



## albau

Review notes that various Monsters aren't very efficient unamped. But in practical terms can iPhone 4 (no EQ) satisfactory drive MTPG in terms of loudness and SQ? In my experience Phonaks are really weak on iPhone 4 while HJE-900 and especially W2 are very efficient.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jxk said:


> While you're at it, perhaps it's time you got around to reviewing that now disregarded budget favorite - the dealextreme orange IEMs. I mean really, is there any better way to spend $2.85 - and with free shipping to boot. I think this will be a headphone to give the parts-express mini a run for its money.


 
 I did review them - they're number 3C7. They're quite awful but still not the worst I've heard.
   

 Quote:


albau said:


> Review notes that various Monsters aren't very efficient unamped. But in practical terms can iPhone 4 (no EQ) satisfactory drive MTPG in terms of loudness and SQ? In my experience Phonaks are really weak on iPhone 4 while HJE-900 and especially W2 are very efficient.


 
 It won't be as bad as the PFE but the HJE900 and W2 are extremely efficient compared to the Turbine line. You should be able to get plenty of volume but I don't know how the SQ will compare to a powerful DAP since I haven't heard an Apple phone aside from the 1st-gen.


----------



## akacoke

thanks for the reply,  quick questions about jamz
   
  why is jamz sound so wired compare to all other headphones ive ownd? the jamz made me so dispointed in monster's product, i dont ever wanna buy any thing from them again
  i wanna kick myself for losing the reciept to the jamz
   
  they have a really wired sound signature that i cant describe it, they have these really really wired Timbre i cant tell if its dark or harsh, but one thing for sure is they dont sound nature at all
  jamz with 10hrs of burn in sounds like crap compare to my koss portapro, , my portapro after 15hrs burn in sounds a lot better than before
   
  since its really hard to get FA Eterna, should i pickup cx300 at best for $50 or cx870 for $80?
   
  lots of people recommand to get meelec m9, is it better than cx300?
   
  im looking for bright nature sound , with a lot of bass like portapro and and good/fair clarity, dont really care about soundstage and hi
   
  i also like headphones with the mids stands out, portapro's bass is kinda too forward , it washes out the mids
   
  thanks in advance, please help a noob

  
  Quote: 





> Quote:
> 
> 
> akacoke said:
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


akacoke said:


> why is jamz sound so wired compare to all other headphones ive ownd? the jamz made me so dispointed in monster's product, i dont ever wanna buy any thing from them again
> i wanna kick myself for losing the reciept to the jamz
> 
> they have a really wired sound signature that i cant describe it, they have these really really wired Timbre i cant tell if its dark or harsh, but one thing for sure is they dont sound nature at all
> ...


   
  Both of the Jamz models are very colored. The Lil' Jamz are actually surprisingly bright and a little warm. The regular Jamz are less bright but still somewhat warm. Timbre is terrible with both earphones but the Lil' Jamz make for a fun listen with their treble peaks and massive bass. My 1st pair of Jamz only lasted a few hours so I don't have any full impressions until the replacement comes back. 
   
  If the Eterna seems difficult to obtain I take it you have issues with ordering online? The CX300 at $50 is a huge rip-off - see the review on the first page. It doesn't hold a candle to the PortaPros. The Meelec M9 is better except for you wanting more forward mids, which the M9 definitely does not have. If you have to get them in-store the Klipsch S2 would be a better way to go than either the CX300 or M9 but don't expect miracles - they are still pretty overpriced at $50. If you can order online the Brainwavz M2 have the type of sound you are looking for with forward mids  and good clarity. They aren't bright but they aren't very dark, either, and so sound pretty natural compared to other similarly-priced phones.


----------



## hdizzle

Quote: 





shadowfox42 said:


> Well I did it.....I finally ordered the ck10. I anxiously await their arrival.


 


  Please let us know how you get on with them.


----------



## akacoke

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Both of the Jamz models are very colored. The Lil' Jamz are actually surprisingly bright and a little warm. The regular Jamz are less bright but still somewhat warm. Timbre is terrible with both earphones but the Lil' Jamz make for a fun listen with their treble peaks and massive bass. My 1st pair of Jamz only lasted a few hours so I don't have any full impressions until the replacement comes back.
> 
> If the Eterna seems difficult to obtain I take it you have issues with ordering online? The CX300 at $50 is a huge rip-off - see the review on the first page. It doesn't hold a candle to the PortaPros. The Meelec M9 is better except for you wanting more forward mids, which the M9 definitely does not have. If you have to get them in-store the Klipsch S2 would be a better way to go than either the CX300 or M9 but don't expect miracles - they are still pretty overpriced at $50. If you can order online the Brainwavz M2 have the type of sound you are looking for with forward mids  and good clarity. They aren't bright but they aren't very dark, either, and so sound pretty natural compared to other similarly-priced phones.


 


  
   i read most your reveiws after i posted last night, i think i mislead you by saying i want something with mid forward, i just dont like it when mid is veiled.
   
  i have no problem ordering online, i just couldnt find fish audio's website.  i dont really like the look of FA eterna and its over the ear style, 
   
  how is Fischer Audio Silver Bullet? website shows its out of stock
   
  i think i dont have many choices, after reading some of the reviews more than twice lol
   
  hippo vb, visang/brainwaz r03 and silver bullet
   
  base on your review most likely i will get the silver bullet for the look and price, i think i will be happy with it


----------



## buffalowings

if I remember correctly, the silver bullets lack proper strain relief (sure does remind me of the guy that said "lack of strain relief shows QUALITY"
  Quote: 





akacoke said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## akacoke

how to read this ?  is the dbr higher the better?
   
  jamz 's bass quantity is 80%  of portapro, but the bass of jamz is more punchy and impactfull

  


> >


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


akacoke said:


> i read most your reveiws after i posted last night, i think i mislead you by saying i want something with mid forward, i just dont like it when mid is veiled.
> 
> i have no problem ordering online, i just couldnt find fish audio's website.  i dont really like the look of FA eterna and its over the ear style,
> 
> ...


   
  Not many mid-range and high-end earphones have veiled mids, to be honest. Fischer audio products can be purchased from bugdenaudio or gd-audiobase. The latter now stocks rev.2 of the Silver Bullets which is supposed to have received a much-needed cable upgrade. I haven't gotten the review up yet but the Phiaton PS 20 is another strong competitor in the ~80 range with no hint of midrange veil, assuming isolation is not a priority and the half in-ear form factor is okay. The PS20, M2/M3, and Silver Bullet all have less mid-bass than the Jamz but are more balanced and less muddy across the range which is a very fair tradeoff in my book. 
  
   
  Quote:


akacoke said:


> how to read this ?  is the dbr higher the better?
> 
> jamz 's bass quantity is 80%  of portapro, but the bass of jamz is more punchy and impactfull


 

  "Better" is a relative term - depends on what you're looking for. The graph simply shows you the relative output level at different frequencies. For example for the two Jamz earphones, if you take 1kHz as the base point you can deduce that at the same output @1kHz, the Jamz will have less sub-bass and more rolled-off treble than the Lil' Jamz. In terms of perceived frequency response there are many other factors (ear resonance, hearing sensitivity, loudness response, etc) so you won't necessarily hear your headphones/earphones the way they graph. Conversely you can't graph something by ear objectively, though you can probably graph two headphones relative to each other using pink noise and frequency sweeps (with some practice).
   
  We can graph the Jamz vs the PortaPro and see that the 25-year-old Koss set is still the more balanced headphone. Things like bass control (i.e. punchy vs boomy) and impact quantity (i.e. soft vs aggressive bass) aren't really something you can read off a graph.


----------



## akacoke

no wonder the more i compare the portapros and jamzs, the more i think portapros are really good for the price  i got my jamz for 42 bucks anyways , seeing how the jamz on sale all the time for like 50 -70 bucks , i knew they wouldnt sound great, i didnt expect to be this bad
   
  thanks for taking your time pointing me to right direction


----------



## Mephistopheles

I must say this is one heck of a guide, the effort you have put to make it shows the magnitude of passion you have for music. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Anyways, why haven't you reviewed Head-Direct RE1? Any particular reason?


----------



## sunspot

Hello, I just wanted to thank you for this absolutely awesome guide.  It has served me well when looking for earphones, and so far hasn't failed me.
   
  I really appreciate the fact that despite your preferences for analytical sound, you still review "fun" earphones and try to judge them from a "fun" earphone lover's perspective.  This takes some work doing, and it's quite impressive.  It got me the TD100-II, which I would have never heard about if it had not been for this site.
   
  Speaking of the Xears headphones, it seems like you're reviewing the Xears bullets (XB120Pro) as well.  Just curious... do you have any initial impressions of them?  I have my own, but I curious whether my ears have decent sentivity 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Anyway, thanks again for this epic review thread!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mephistopheles said:


> I must say this is one heck of a guide, the effort you have put to make it shows the magnitude of passion you have for music.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


   
  No particular reason except that I've never been interested enough to go out and buy one. Back when I first reviewed the RE0, the RE1 was actually more expensive and I guess ever since it's just been the one Head-Direct set that got away.
   

 Quote:


sunspot said:


> Hello, I just wanted to thank you for this absolutely awesome guide.  It has served me well when looking for earphones, and so far hasn't failed me.
> 
> I really appreciate the fact that despite your preferences for analytical sound, you still review "fun" earphones and try to judge them from a "fun" earphone lover's perspective.  This takes some work doing, and it's quite impressive.  It got me the TD100-II, which I would have never heard about if it had not been for this site.
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks. Interestingly, based on others' impressions, it seems that there's more of a difference between the TD100-II and the (old) TD100 that I reviewed than Xears will admit to. I've spent a little bit of time with XB120Pro and I think it's a very good earphone for the money but it's not a TD100 replacement. It has a good sense of space and is generally warm and smooth but the notes are a little too soft as it presents them and the sound is almost too 'syrupy'. I don't know what the MSRP is on the XB120 but street price is <$25 which is a truly excellent deal for those who prefer 'smooth and spacious' to 'crisp and tight'.


----------



## rawrster

When I had the loaner of the XB120Pro I saw on some ebay listing that the MSRP came out to around $10 with shipping about the same  so it was around $20-$25 shipped.
   
  I thought it was a good deal but I hated the J cord and the driver flex.


----------



## sunspot

MSRP is a concept unknown to the Xears people... the prices vary widely.  I mean, the TD100-II is at 20 EUR right now, but it was a 90 EUR for a while before that, and 30 EUR a bit before that.  30 EUR is probably an OK deal, but 90 EUR is too expensive considering better headphones have a 80 USD MSRP  (RE-0, Sunrise X-cape).
   
  It's hard to tell what the XB120Pro MSRP is; I think the highest it went on the xears.com site was 25 EUR.  Probably an OK deal at that price but not earth-shattering.
   
  ljokerl, as far as I know, I'm the only one who had both the TD100-II and the XB120Pro on hand at the same time who posted impressions.  So maybe the TD100-II is similar to the TD100 and my ears are just not sensitive enough 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  I'm just a newbie after all and don't have that much experience with IEMs...  And I never heard the original TD100 because its price never went down enough to make it enticing (it was nearly out of stock when I got the TD100-II anyhow) and as a principle I dislike J-cords.  But I'll make an exception when it means paying just 10 EUR + shipping for decent earphones...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


sunspot said:


> MSRP is a concept unknown to the Xears people... the prices vary widely.  I mean, the TD100-II is at 20 EUR right now, but it was a 90 EUR for a while before that, and 30 EUR a bit before that.  30 EUR is probably an OK deal, but 90 EUR is too expensive considering better headphones have a 80 USD MSRP  (RE-0, Sunrise X-cape).
> 
> It's hard to tell what the XB120Pro MSRP is; I think the highest it went on the xears.com site was 25 EUR.  Probably an OK deal at that price but not earth-shattering.
> 
> ...


 

  I just take their web price (non-ebay) as the MSRP. I think the XB120Pro was 20EUR a few weeks ago on the site but now I can't see a price.
   
  And no, you aren't the only one with the Xears collection 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. A member here has the TD100, TD100-II, and XB120Pro.


----------



## esanthosh

While other IEM prices are stationary, Xears prices are like quotes in the stock market. You buy when the price is low. Then there are always PE investments by E-mailing Thomas 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  TD100-II does sound different compared to TD100-I to my ears.
   
  TD100-II has relatively lesser bass quantity and begins to dip a bit earlier than the TD100-I. The mids are not as warm as the 100-I. The notes are much thinner and it feels a lot faster. In treble too, while the first version sounds thicker, the newer one sounds thinner and has some sparkle.In general, TD100-II feels much clearer especially in vocals (which are a bit more forward) compared to TD100-I.
   
  The common thing between them is of course the sound stage.
   
  And thankfully, it also loses the J-Cord and that annoying driver flex I get with TD100-I. Overall, I prefer the TD100-II over the TD100-I slightly because it sounds more balanced.
   
  Is this change achievable by tuning the same driver? I don't know.


----------



## sunspot

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> While other IEM prices are stationary, Xears prices are like quotes in the stock market. You buy when the price is low. Then there are always PE investments by E-mailing Thomas
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yeah, I thought I was the only one with all those Xears things, given that the Playaz N1 thread is pretty much dead now.  And be careful with MSRP; prices vary on site as well as ebay, quite drastically so.  Prices are quoted were all from the official site...
   
  OK, so possibly my ears aren't very sensitive.  Case closed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Re: driver flex... I get quite a bit with the TD100-II in the right earphone.  Then again, I get none with the XB120Pro and others report mad driver flex.  And my PB120 (Xears PowerBall) has very pronounced flex.  Go figure.


----------



## gjohnst4

I noticed that zero Shure headphones made the review list. While I truly appreciate the effort that has gone into this incredible review, in a few months I figure you will be looking for more to add. So, I just snagged a pair of Shure SE115's off overstock.com for 10.99 (nice huh?) and if you want to borrow them to add to this list, I would be glad to send them out.


----------



## gameboy115

After going through the review of my previous IEM, I cant help thinking why you had so similar opinion as mine?
   
  Like Denon 710, I has certainly no idea why the hype is coming from .............
   
  Good work !!!!
   
  Give me some guidance since I haven't visited here for a pretty long time


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


gjohnst4 said:


> I noticed that zero Shure headphones made the review list. While I truly appreciate the effort that has gone into this incredible review, in a few months I figure you will be looking for more to add. So, I just snagged a pair of Shure SE115's off overstock.com for 10.99 (nice huh?) and if you want to borrow them to add to this list, I would be glad to send them out.


 
 That's a pretty amazing price. I've actually heard the SE115 briefly in the past but it didn't really deliver for a $90 earphone. I have little personal interest in reviewing it but I'll be glad to do so for those trying to relate to this thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   

 Quote:


gameboy115 said:


> After going through the review of my previous IEM, I cant help thinking why you had so similar opinion as mine?
> 
> Like Denon 710, I has certainly no idea why the hype is coming from .............
> 
> ...


 

  If I remember correctly the C710 was actually cheaper upon release than it is now - it could easily be found in the $80-90 range which is a much better deal than the $130-150 it costs now. That could explain some of the hype. Either way I'm glad you can relate to this thread.


----------



## ChipnDalebowl

I want to thank you for your amazing review.  I recently purchased some Thinksound Rains and your review of them is definitely spot-on!  They're awesome for your orchestral music aficionado.


----------



## ljokerl

Added dB Logic EP-100 and Skullcandy FMJ.
  
  wQuote: 





chipndalebowl said:


> I want to thank you for your amazing review.  I recently purchased some Thinksound Rains and your review of them is definitely spot-on!  They're awesome for your orchestral music aficionado.


 

 Thanks and glad you like the Rain


----------



## jjmai

Kudos for simply including FMJ.  I would've thought Titan would've been your last ever experience with Skullcandy.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added dB Logic EP-100 and Skullcandy FMJ.


----------



## battleaxe

Right now I am stuck between the Custom 3 and Turbine as both are on substantial mark downs at the moment, and not sure which one would be the better upgrade from my CX300-II. I have heard the turbine Pro and found that to be very good, and even found the Jamz to be solid, but I haven't sampled the Turbine themselves. Nor have I heard any IEM from Klipsch(and it seem like no where in L.A. has Klipsch IEM to sample). I notice joker gave both very solid ratings, with both having similar cons, a weak cable. I am not sure which is going to really fit my needs better. I can't find any place to try the Klipsch. Nor can I tell from a short listen if either will cause fatigue or the such. I like the current bass level on my CX300-II, but just want wider/powerful sound stage with more balance and if possible maybe even a little more natural sound to the IEM. Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Added EarSonics SM3.
   
  The entire rating system has been rescaled, with most earphones simply moving down 0.25 pts in the 'Sound' rating. Some of the ones that were borderline remain unchanged as I was a bit more picky with rounding off than previously.
  
  Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Right now I am stuck between the Custom 3 and Turbine as both are on substantial mark downs at the moment, and not sure which one would be the better upgrade from my CX300-II. I have heard the turbine Pro and found that to be very good, and even found the Jamz to be solid, but I haven't sampled the Turbine themselves. Nor have I heard any IEM from Klipsch(and it seem like no where in L.A. has Klipsch IEM to sample). I notice joker gave both very solid ratings, with both having similar cons, a weak cable. I am not sure which is going to really fit my needs better. I can't find any place to try the Klipsch. Nor can I tell from a short listen if either will cause fatigue or the such. I like the current bass level on my CX300-II, but just want wider/powerful sound stage with more balance and if possible maybe even a little more natural sound to the IEM. Thanks


 

 I don't think the Custom 3 will satisfy you if you're expecting CX300-like levels of bass but the turbines should. The $60 price is pretty good and I think the Turbines are quite a bit better than the Jamz on the whole. Soundstaging is not their strong suit but they should still fare better than your Sennheisers and shouldn't be fatiguing in the least. If you miss the Turbine sale the new Silver Bullet rev.2 might be worth taking a look at.


----------



## xXFallenAngelXx

Thnx for adding in the sm3..got to add it to my list of things to consider..that makes about a million now lol


----------



## Golden Monkey

Finally!  Been looking forward to your SM3 evaluation.  Thnaks man!


----------



## battleaxe

How is the bass(all around) on the Custom 3? Because, I think part of the fatigue is a bit due to the bass. I keep hearing that the Turbines are boomish, but I don't really want boom. I would take both would offer more detail vs the CX300? Was that the case in your testing?  
   
  We pretty much live around the same area, do you know anywhere I can try out the Custom 3? I tried DXC but they don't carry any Klipsch nor does Guitar Center anymore. I would like to try them out and compare both in store before I make a final decision. Thanks.


----------



## Poetik

YES FINALLY THE SM3!!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> How is the bass(all around) on the Custom 3? Because, I think part of the fatigue is a bit due to the bass. I keep hearing that the Turbines are boomish, but I don't really want boom. I would take both would offer more detail vs the CX300? Was that the case in your testing?
> 
> We pretty much live around the same area, do you know anywhere I can try out the Custom 3? I tried DXC but they don't carry any Klipsch nor does Guitar Center anymore. I would like to try them out and compare both in store before I make a final decision. Thanks.


 

 All around - clean and tight, a bit on the dry side but not bad at all. The KC3 is a very solid all-rounder for the money but don't expect the bass to sound like a dynamic driver would. No idea where you can audition IEMs, especially Klipsch ones.  
   
  I don't think the Turbines are nearly as boomy as the CX300-1 (haven't heard the -II).


----------



## Painful Chafe

Fantastic review of the SM3.


----------



## battleaxe

[size=medium]    Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> All around - clean and tight, a bit on the dry side but not bad at all. The KC3 is a very solid all-rounder for the money but don't expect the bass to sound like a dynamic driver would. No idea where you can audition IEMs, especially Klipsch ones.
> 
> I don't think the Turbines are nearly as boomy as the CX300-1 (haven't heard the -II).






  How would you say the C3 compare to the Turbine Pro(either gold or copper) out of curiosity(I see a gold one not sure if real or fake going for 120 used on amazon)? Would you say the C3 are really worth the extra vs the current price of the Turbines? 
   
  I kind like the idea of the C3 as they were originally $300 but now going for 100, but I don't want to purchase something I haven't heard(or at least haven't heard from that brand yet). I guess I can do the 30 day thing but that a bit more trouble that its worth. ​[/size]


----------



## shadowfox42

Ah, Earsonics Sm3, the review I had been waiting for. Fantastic job ljokerl, that was incredibly detailed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I might consider purchasing these someday, though it won't be for awhile since I recently forked out $260 on my ck10's. I'm still waiting on them -_-


----------



## Photofan1986

Joker, your review of the SM3 is SPOT ON! Great writeup, You definitely have talent for this 
   
  Quote: 





> As an earphone that does very few things wrong, it is not unique – other top-tiers such as the Ortofon e-Q7 and HiFiMan RE252 have no empirical flaws either – but they also do few things outstandingly well while the SM3 seduces with its enveloping soundstage and thick, creamy midrange.


 
  That's exactly how I feel about my RE-252 and SM3. But it took me months to find out why 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Again, fantastic job, and many many thanks for your effort!


----------



## yliu

Do you own all these IEMs???


----------



## s0lar

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added EarSonics SM3.
> 
> The entire rating system has been rescaled, with most earphones simply moving down 0.25 pts in the 'Sound' rating. Some of the ones that were borderline remain unchanged as I was a bit more picky with rounding off than previously.


 
   
  Seems almost all just plunged 0.25? I can't help to feel this is not really accurate.
  A .125 scale might be a better idea now.
  Ok, nothing is really accurate in rating 2 different IEM's. Perhaps a good way to say this would be, rating IEM's is a flawed concept. 
  I assume you previously scaled to the CK10, that review perhaps needs to be updated as well. It still tells us it deserves a 10/10.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


battleaxe said:


> How would you say the C3 compare to the Turbine Pro(either gold or copper) out of curiosity(I see a gold one not sure if real or fake going for 120 used on amazon)? Would you say the C3 are really worth the extra vs the current price of the Turbines?


 
  The KC3 compares very well and I'm sure many will prefer it to either of the Turbine Pros I think that the Turbine Pro will be more up your alley. I would definitely be wary of fakes and also buy from a legit reseller to get the lifetime warranty.
   
  Quote:


painful chafe said:


> Fantastic review of the SM3.


 
 Quote:


shadowfox42 said:


> Ah, Earsonics Sm3, the review I had been waiting for. Fantastic job ljokerl, that was incredibly detailed


 
 Quote:


photofan1986 said:


> Joker, your review of the SM3 is SPOT ON! Great writeup, You definitely have talent for this
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks, everyone 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. This one took me way longer than most partly because it took me close to three weeks to get used to the SM3 and partly because changing all the scores took forever.
   

 Quote:


yliu said:


> Do you own all these IEMs???


 
 Not at the moment. Many of the higher-end ones were loaners and I do try to sell off whatever I'm not using as a benchmark so I can acquire new ones.
   
   

  Quote:


s0lar said:


> Seems almost all just plunged 0.25? I can't help to feel this is not really accurate.  A .125 scale might be a better idea now.
> Ok, nothing is really accurate in rating 2 different IEM's. Perhaps a good way to say this would be, rating IEM's is a flawed concept.
> I assume you previously scaled to the CK10, that review perhaps needs to be updated as well. It still tells us it deserves a 10/10.


  Yes, most plunged .25 pts. That's what happens when a new performance benchmark is introduced into a comparative scaling system. I wouldn't say that the rating system is a flawed concept but it should be taken for what it is - comparative rather than empirical. And yes, the CK10 was the previous 'bar', so to speak. I'll make the necessary correction. I'm sure there are others that should be made.
   
  Unfortunately decreasing the scaling interval only leads to more problems. Do I really trust myself to compare earphones so accurately? I'm not sure.


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





poetik said:


> YES FINALLY THE SM3!!!


----------



## Anaxilus

Great review as usual!  I agree with pretty much everything you said.  I also found the lows to be a bit shy at the lowest limits and was less appreciative of the treble than yourself.  I was one who fell into the unrealistic soundstage camp you mentioned, just couldn't do it.  Otherwise I'm in sonic agreement.  They reminded me of a BA version of the MD focused more on the technicalities while the MD was more about being fun.  Kinda soulless by comparison, sort of like listening to Andreas Bocelli versus Carreras.  I just never got engaged to the same level.  The lack of that 'wow' factor made it a sort of Jack of all trades, master of none sort of sound to me.  I do have to raise some questions on the scoring though.  Build quality seems rather high IMO.  I've honestly never used an IEM I was more worried about breaking in my life.  From the barely attached housings to the unreinforced nozzles that could snap like a twig.  In fact of all the IEMs I've ever had in my sig, they have to be the most poorly designed housings and nozzles I've ever experienced.  I did LUV the cable though!  Least microphonic in my experince.  I also wonder about the value score too considering they cost near $400 w/ respect to some of the competition.  I will say this, I certainly hold the SM3 in higher regard than the 530 and much higher than the TF10 granted I'm not a fan of it at all.


----------



## proedros

10/10 for the SM3 ?
   
   
  i think this may be too much - then again we should wait until you grade the GR-10


----------



## esanthosh

Finally, the SM3 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Earlier, I was confused over how the new rating system would be. Would I see scores of 9.875? But this makes better sense, even though I hate to see my beloved DBA-02 drop to 9.75.
   
  I agree with Anaxilus about the build quality of SM3. Even though I have it in my possession only for a couple of days, every time I handle them, I am worried about breaking them. None of my other IEMs make me feel this way. May be I'll get used to it, may be not.


----------



## rawrster

Looks like the SM3 pushed everything down in the sound ranking  Nice review of them and I enjoyed reading it but it doesn't look like it is for me and I probably won't be able to hear them anyway.
   
  Just curious but do you ever plan on having your customs make an appearance in this thread over time?


----------



## Kunlun

4/5 on build quality for the SM3 was a surprise. Many people have had theirs snap, crack or pop apart.


----------



## goodvibes

Thanks, always like the balance of these.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

It is "in progress".
  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Looks like the SM3 pushed everything down in the sound ranking  Nice review of them and I enjoyed reading it but it doesn't look like it is for me and I probably won't be able to hear them anyway.
> 
> *Just curious but do you ever plan on having your customs make an appearance in this thread over time?*


----------



## rawrster

Ah I did not see that so I guess my question has been answered


----------



## izaku

ljokerl, exactly the same with your experience, now i hardly skip any songs.
  It may just be end of the road for me.
  Hopefully there is no sorry anymore for my wallet. 
  Thanks for the all fantastic words in SM3 review.


----------



## sdhobbs

Perfect description and review of the SM3!  It was worth the wait!  Thanks ljokerl


----------



## mythless

Good review on the SM3, very similar to what I thought about them.  I found them to be a bit too thick for my taste, but overall the SM3 are pretty good.


----------



## battleaxe

Thank you for the reviews and help, I think I know what my next purchase is now.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Great review as usual!  I agree with pretty much everything you said.  I also found the lows to be a bit shy at the lowest limits and was less appreciative of the treble than yourself.  I was one who fell into the unrealistic soundstage camp you mentioned, just couldn't do it.  Otherwise I'm in sonic agreement.  They reminded me of a BA version of the MD focused more on the technicalities while the MD was more about being fun.  Kinda soulless by comparison, sort of like listening to Andreas Bocelli versus Carreras.  I just never got engaged to the same level.  The lack of that 'wow' factor made it a sort of Jack of all trades, master of none sort of sound to me.  I do have to raise some questions on the scoring though.  Build quality seems rather high IMO.  I've honestly never used an IEM I was more worried about breaking in my life.  From the barely attached housings to the unreinforced nozzles that could snap like a twig.  In fact of all the IEMs I've ever had in my sig, they have to be the most poorly designed housings and nozzles I've ever experienced.  I did LUV the cable though!  Least microphonic in my experince.  I also wonder about the value score too considering they cost near $400 w/ respect to some of the competition.  I will say this, I certainly hold the SM3 in higher regard than the 530 and much higher than the TF10 granted I'm not a fan of it at all.


   Quote:


kunlun said:


> 4/5 on build quality for the SM3 was a surprise. Many people have had theirs snap, crack or pop apart.


 
  Quote:


esanthosh said:


> Finally, the SM3
> 
> 
> 
> ...


  Sorry, I haven't read anything about others' experience with the build of the SM3. If I'd gone through the appreciation thread this review would never have seen the light of day. Sadly I don't have the time nor the resources to stress test each one of these earphones so I can only rate them on initial build quality. The inclusion of much of the <$30 junk in the review really skews the scales, too, so pretty much anything with a strong cable and proper strain reliefs will get a 3.5/5 or higher. I'll add a note about durability but I can't back it with experience - I didn't feel they were any less durable than my W1/W2.
   

 Quote:


proedros said:


> 10/10 for the SM3 ?
> 
> 
> i think this may be too much - then again we should wait until you grade the GR-10


 
 It's a relative scale. Not saying that the SM3 is perfect - just that I put it a bit above the CK10/CK100/DBA-02 (which aren't perfect either)
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Looks like the SM3 pushed everything down in the sound ranking  Nice review of them and I enjoyed reading it but it doesn't look like it is for me and I probably won't be able to hear them anyway.
> 
> Just curious but do you ever plan on having your customs make an appearance in this thread over time?


   
  Eh, you probably wouldn't like them too much. And yes, the 1964-T will be added to this thread but I'm probably going to start with a separate review for it.
  
  Quote:


izaku said:


> ljokerl, exactly the same with your experience, now i hardly skip any songs.
> It may just be end of the road for me.
> Hopefully there is no sorry anymore for my wallet.
> Thanks for the all fantastic words in SM3 review.


  Quote:


sdhobbs said:


> Perfect description and review of the SM3!  It was worth the wait!  Thanks ljokerl


  Quote:


mythless said:


> Good review on the SM3, very similar to what I thought about them.  I found them to be a bit too thick for my taste, but overall the SM3 are pretty good.


 

  Ha, agreement seems to be split ~50/50. A little worse  than I expected but not too bad. Thanks, everyone!


----------



## mythless

Haha, what did you expect?


----------



## battleaxe

Can you give a quick comment on how the MC5 compares to the pricier ER-4S(or P)?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mythless said:


> Haha, what did you expect?


 
 A little more consensus, maybe 70/30 in favor of the SM3. I think it might be backlash against the Earsonics' earlier 'messiah' status.
   

 Quote:


battleaxe said:


> Can you give a quick comment on how the MC5 compares to the pricier ER-4S(or P)?


 

  I only have the HF3 to compare the MC5 to but the HF3 sounds much closer to the ER-4S than the MC5 so it should do. I think the MC5 has a tad more bass body and responds better to EQ while the HF3 is quicker and tighter. The MC5 is thicker and a bit mid-centric. I get bored of it pretty quickly. The HF3 isn't and keeps my attention much the way the RE0 or CK10 do. HF3 has more treble sparkle and a slightly brighter sound. MC5 is still bright but closer to neutral. Soundstaging isn't all that different between the two - the usual etymotic three-blob stage with mediocre height.


----------



## mythless

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> mythless said:
> ...


 
   
  Oh?  Haha, guess I was off the forum when that happened.  But, I can see why.  The SM3 are good for those who like their signature and those who haven't heard a variety of IEMs, but it might not be the "messiah" that some are looking for and with more experience.


----------



## TheGame21x

Oh snap. Just as I expected, the SM3 review is causing a bit of controversy. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Great review as always Joker.


----------



## singh

SM3 review!! Great work !!
   
  Though i am now not looking at universals now ...the 10/10 ratting of SM3 sure ...have me interested  ( cause its signature is a lot different than CK10/DBA/CK100 ..which you like )
   
  to add to that you have now lowered the earlier 10/10 to 9.75 
   
  I 've gotta try these now !!
   
  Any chance on reviewing my beloved FX700.
   
  Slightly OT : can the SM3 be remolded !? i mean i am afraid that they will fall apard with all the build quotes i am reading, quite a lot !
  to add to that they dont even have removable cable . so if they can be remolded i will be more confident of my purchase !


----------



## coldmack

What would you say is the best all around bang for the buck and/or steal on that list? Maybe even the IEM people must own.


----------



## shane55

I'm shocked ! Shocked I tells ya !
   
  |Joker|... What? How is it possible that you and I don't hear things exactly the same? Ha! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  But seriously... The SM3's were one of the biggest disappointments I've had. Yes, some of that was the hype. They were one of the most hyped IEM's I've seen (and it's funny how some of those who pushed that hype have now moved on to other IEM's...). But most of my disappointment was not. 
   
  It was a frustrating experience for me. I tried all the different tips that everyone recommended, I tried them for months and burned them in and used different sources, amps, etc. Nope, no good.
  They reminded me a lot of the HD600 in that the highs were rolled off early and hard.
  Clarity: no
  Speed: no
  Brilliance: Ha ! Not even close.
  I found them dull and muted and veiled and thick and everything that the DBA-02 is not.
  Details I've heard for years in my recordings were just lost in the mud. "Hey... what happened to that triangle, those cymbals, the 'air'?
   
  That said, man, did they have great bass !! Whoa, the lower mids on the SM3 really cook! Mids were OK, but they are no SE535's.
   
  Controversy indeed. These seem to be very polarizing IEM's and I'm not sure if it's just taste, hearing, or if there is something else at work. Could the QC be so off that Earsonics is putting out SM3's with varying sound signatures? Just asking... 
   
  Many of us (if you go back into the original SM3 thread-s) heard it as I did. But many did not. When you read reviews and reactions to the HD800, T1, LCD-2... you find more similarities than differences. You don't find many (there will always be some) diametrically opposed views. They all are shades off... subtleties not black and white. With these IEM's you find polar opposite opinions (and after all... these are just opinions).
   
  But really |Joker|... you do a great service here and are responsible for one of the best threads in the forum. Thanks for all you do. Truly. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Even if you are terribly wrong here... 10/10 ? Gimme a break.


----------



## vrln

There´s much more to IEM´s than just sound quality though. The SM3 doesn´t score that higher in other aspects... To me the CK100 is still the real king in this roundup  If only they were sold in the EU :/


----------



## proedros

Imo , the only bad thing in joker rating the sm3 as 10/10 ?
   
  People starting buying them without having listened to them - only to sell them shortly afterwards
   
  It's gonna happen.Bet on it.
   
  (and  to see them costing 2,5 times the money you buy a re-262 new from the fs threads)...then again if i have learned something here , it's this
   
*Trial and error folks. Trial and error*


----------



## average_joe

[size=medium]Wow, now |joker| is getting beat up!  The one universal I still have is the SM3 and I have to say I agree with the 10/10 from a technical standpoint.  And I wanted to shout out to |joker| a huge thanks for all of your time and effort into this great thread!
   
  Shane55, your QC question is an interesting one and something that I have also wondered myself.  My pair seems like it is nothing like your pair!  All I can think is the tips were bent in your ear canal   I am also sure you tried a wide variety of music as in my experience they do change their presentation a lot with the different recordings, and for me it is a lot.  From what I have read and heard, the headphones/IEMs in your signature have a brighter presentation than the SM3, which might be your preference.  There are several people that think the LCD-2 is on the dark side; what are your thoughts on that (if you have heard it)? ​[/size]


----------



## shane55

average_joe.
  I have not heard the LCD-2... yet. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  I hope to at our next meet (Feb.).
   
  But you're absolutely correct, I DO tend to like 'brighter' cans/IEM's. What? Maybe I'm going deaf... What ??
  And yes, I did try them with everything I have from LP's to MP3's to high-bitrate files, etc. Various amps (which also tend on the bright / lean side), etc. Lots of tips... lots of tips... tips... lots.
   
  But yeah, just not to my taste (as I said, it's all opinion anyway). Heck, I thought the SE535 had a rolled-off upper end (past 8khz).


----------



## average_joe

My opinion of the SM3 was based on how I hear it, which was a game changer for me as it sounded more like many of the live events I have heard, but I do understand that personal preference does play a role in everything.  But I have no real answer other than QC or ear tips or just plain old preference for why the SM3 is so polarizing.  I would pick it 10 out of 10 times vs. the DBA-02, but I am sure you are the opposite!
   
  Looking forward to your LCD-2 thoughts when you get the chance to hear them!


----------



## rawrster

The controversy surrounding the SM3 is what makes me want to hear them. I was extremely close to buying a pair a few months ago but thought it was pretty stupid spending $300 on an earphone with the intention of selling them. Although I guess the CK10 is no longer the 10/10 standard for sound in this thread which is a shame but does make sense. Every good earphone can't be 10/10 so it does make it a bit more exclusive.
   
  Someone in NYC should let me hear the SM3


----------



## singh

^+1 , really, that exclusive 10/10 ratting for SM3 sure has me interested !!
  earlier i wan interested in CK10 ( am too now ..but Now ,the interest is being shared with SM3 )


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


singh said:


> SM3 review!! Great work !!
> 
> Though i am now not looking at universals now ...the 10/10 ratting of SM3 sure ...have me interested  ( cause its signature is a lot different than CK10/DBA/CK100 ..which you like )
> 
> ...


  I still like the CK10/CK100/DBA-02 better but that's because they align with my preferred signature. The fact that I could enjoy the SM3 as much as I did despite them being so far off my preference is a testament to how good they are.
   
  No plans for an FX700 at this point - as you can see from the planned review list on the front page there's still plenty that needs doing.
   
  I don't see why the SM3 couldn't be remolded but I'm not sure of the process's effect on the sound..
   

 Quote:


coldmack said:


> What would you say is the best all around bang for the buck and/or steal on that list? Maybe even the IEM people must own.


 
 There's really no such thing as it depends on your preferred signature. Back when the Brainwavz M1 were on preorder for $29.50 I'd say that's a must-own. Other than that everyone has their own starter phones. I've still got my first 'head-fi' IEM - the PL30 - and I still like it. If they align with your signature any of the high-value IEMs can be considered a steal - Meelec M6 @ $20, Brainwavz M2 @ $60, Xcape @ $80, DBA-02 @ $150. Perhaps the Xears XB120 'Bullet' once I get around to posting that review.
   

 Quote:


shane55 said:


> I'm shocked ! Shocked I tells ya !
> 
> |Joker|... What? How is it possible that you and I don't hear things exactly the same? Ha!
> 
> ...


 
 We do hear things similarly - you are just taking issue with the fact that they aren't as fast/clear/crisp/lean/sparkly as the DBA-02 while I'm welcoming it with open arms. I think I mentioned all of those things but I wouldn't take off points for them because objectively-speaking an IEM doesn't _need _to be any of those things to be enjoyable. The CK10 has all of those things too and yet it's not an IEM I recommend very often (if ever) because it just isn't an instantly likable sound. Yes, they were hyped. Yes, many bought them who probably shouldn't have; but that happens with every in-ear that becomes popular around here. I think the issue is more with the early impressions of the SM3, which made it seem like a better earphone than any other in every single way, and it isn't. 
   
   
  Quote:


vrln said:


> There´s much more to IEM´s than just sound quality though. The SM3 doesn´t score that higher in other aspects... To me the CK100 is still the real king in this roundup  If only they were sold in the EU :/


 
 I thought we had it better than you guys but then Audio-Technica decided to stop selling the CK10 in the US market as well. I think many people take issue with having to import these earphones and I wish that weren't the case but what can you do... Japanese companies have a history of confining some of their top-of-the-line products to the Japanese market. 
   
  I think the JVC FX700 has the same problem. 
   
   
  Quote:


average_joe said:


> [size=medium]Wow, now |joker| is getting beat up!  The one universal I still have is the SM3 and I have to say I agree with the 10/10 from a technical standpoint.  And I wanted to shout out to |joker| a huge thanks for all of your time and effort into this great thread!​[/size]


 
 Thanks! Glad to see you around here again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> The controversy surrounding the SM3 is what makes me want to hear them. I was extremely close to buying a pair a few months ago but thought it was pretty stupid spending $300 on an earphone with the intention of selling them. Although I guess the CK10 is no longer the 10/10 standard for sound in this thread which is a shame but does make sense. Every good earphone can't be 10/10 so it does make it a bit more exclusive.


 
 I have a feeling that the SM3's status is temporary. I still haven't figured out what I will be doing when the time comes to add the 1964-T. SM3 might get pushed back to the level of the CK10 since there just aren't enough gradations.


----------



## Inks

The FX700s seems to be the only other universal that can probably get a 10 fwir. As mentioned it's too bad the availability is poor and the price is steep.


----------



## Omally

Although I have not heard them, strictly from reviews, I believe the FX700 would be the only IEM deserving of a 10 out of 10 rating for me.
  I just do not believe single armatures can produce enough bass without distorting. And believe me I have tried them all.
   
  Now we must all wait for Westone 4 to crown the IEM king!
   
  lJokerl is not God everyone. 
   
  I still have to say THANK YOU so much for this amazing contribution to the community.


----------



## singh

FX 700 are worth it though! ...still i dont understand WHY are they keeping it exclusive to Japan?
  Imagine how i feel !!  . i have to import every audio gear 
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I thought we had it better than you guys but then Audio-Technica decided to stop selling the CK10 in the US market as well. I think many people take issue with having to import these earphones and I wish that weren't the case but what can you do... Japanese companies have a history of confining some of their top-of-the-line products to the Japanese market.
> 
> I think the JVC FX700 has the same problem.


 

  
  I could have sent you my FX700 if they were not my primary ones !
   
  The change in signature is what i am afraid of ! . as the SM3 has filters ( and customs DOnt )
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> No plans for an FX700 at this point - as you can see from the planned review list on the front page there's still plenty that needs doing.
> 
> I don't see why the SM3 couldn't be remolded but I'm not sure of the process's effect on the sound..


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





singh said:


> I could have sent you my FX700 if they were not my primary ones !
> 
> The change in signature is what i am afraid of ! . as the SM3 has filters ( and customs DOnt )


 


 I think someone once mentioned about requesting a really specific remold with certain filters. Not sure which custom remolder it was though.


----------



## coldmack

So if I prefer something that works well with most every genre of music with a hints of natural how would you say my question stacks up? 
   
  Where would you say the Panny RP-HJE900, or any IEM that got a 9(in sq) and cost 125 or less?


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Please create don't mix customs with universals in the table. instead of downing the rating of the universals in case they get a better rating than all of them, just give them more than 10, in a relative comparison.


----------



## esanthosh

ljokerl,
   
  I only have issues with the build quality rating. Guess we can continue to disagree on that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  But as far as 10/10 goes, it does not stand for 'absolute perfection', which no IEM is. It's a relative scale and there's only so much that can be done within it. So, I don't find anything wrong in giving SM3 - 10/10. Sure people will disagree, but is there any IEM which the entire head-fi community agrees on? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Strangely, I never had that much difficulty in adapting to DDM or SM3. They both require you to (grudgingly) accept their way of presentation. If you do, you'll see their strengths. I still prefer DBA-02 to SM3, as it is much more aligned with my tastes - lean, fast and exciting. SM3 on the other hand is something that engages and captivates me. To my ears, they don't lack much except for the very lows. The more I listen to it, the more I like it. Since my ownership is still within the 'new toy bias' period, I can't really state that I absolutely love and prefer SM3 over all my IEMs, but I can certainly say that I can't hate them.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> rawrster said:
> ...


 

 That depends how long until your review on them will be but I figured they would be better than any universal you have heard. My current customs has pretty much phased out every single universal I have owned and soon I will be down to three budget oriented earphones with my Brainwavz M2 as the best one. I guess that won't happen to you since you do have a certain affinity with budget earphones.
   
  As for the temporary status of the 10/10 sound on the SM3 it is a bit tricky since if your triples are anything like my Livewires then they are a good bit better than the best universal I've heard (although I have not heard the SM3) esp once your equipment chain gets better so you will have to think of something  The real question is if the custom you have leads your wallet to bigger and more expensive things


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


coldmack said:


> So if I prefer something that works well with most every genre of music with a hints of natural how would you say my question stacks up?


 
 I would say go for the Silver Bullet rev. 2  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

 Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> Please create don't mix customs with universals in the table. instead of downing the rating of the universals in case they get a better rating than all of them, just give them more than 10, in a relative comparison.


   
  I don't see the point of giving something an 11/10 - I think it sends out the wrong message. This isn't Spinal Tap...
  
   
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> As for the temporary status of the 10/10 sound on the SM3 it is a bit tricky since if your triples are anything like my Livewires then they are a good bit better than the best universal I've heard (although I have not heard the SM3) esp once your equipment chain gets better so you will have to think of something  The real question is if the custom you have leads your wallet to bigger and more expensive things


 

  I wouldn't  say that the 1964-T is a huge improvement over any and all universals, especially in specific signature aspects, but is the best I've heard as a total package. It'll be a while either way so I have some time to mull it over.


----------



## mywallethurts

any chance the fx700 getting reviewed?


----------



## battleaxe

Out of curiosity have you tired the SA cables on the HJE900(& vice versa) to see how it compares?


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> We do hear things similarly - you are just taking issue with the fact that they aren't as fast/clear/crisp/lean/sparkly as the DBA-02 while I'm welcoming it with open arms. I think I mentioned all of those things but I wouldn't take off points for them because objectively-speaking an IEM doesn't _need _to be any of those things to be enjoyable. The CK10 has all of those things too and yet it's not an IEM I recommend very often (if ever) because it just isn't an instantly likable sound. Yes, they were hyped. Yes, many bought them who probably shouldn't have; but that happens with every in-ear that becomes popular around here. I think the issue is more with the early impressions of the SM3, which made it seem like a better earphone than any other in every single way, and it isn't.


 
   
  While it's true that they aren't as fast/clear/crisp, etc. as the DBA's, I also had them *long before *the DBA's so I didn't have them to compare. I not only welcomed them with open arms, I did everything in my power to like them. You can revisit the threads and read all about it if you like. I gave them more than a fair shake and wanted them to be as good as many had said.
   
  Yes, my tastes tend that way (clear, crisp, bright), but I also know when even_ those _characteristics are wildly exaggerated (read DT880, DT770...). What I did have to compare is the sound of live instruments and many years of listening to music (recorded and live). I didn't find them 'realistic' or 'natural' by any stretch of the imagination. Things were missing in the recordings, sounds and presence were no longer part of the overall mix. They were just plain dead and muted and muffled... without any other cans to compare them to.
   
  Of course many love the SM3's sound. I just don't think they do the music justice. I don't find them to be true to the recording. Information is lost. And that is not a matter of taste. I did not hear thing I knew to exist in the recordings. This actually may be a positive thing for some as those missing items are within the upper part of the spectrum, and some are very sensitive to that. So I can see how someone may 'like' them or prefer their presentation to other IEM's, but for me what was missing is critical to the instrument being there with me in the room. Critical to it's presence. Notes would float without any defined point in space. Individual instruments had no 'air'.
   
  Of course IEM's don't need to be anything in particular, or need specific characteristics to be_ enjoyable_... heck, the M50 is pretty far from neutral across the spectrum, but holy crap, they are completely enjoyable ! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  And that's where taste really comes into play. 
   
  Anyway, my friend, I really don't have_ that _big of an issue with your 10/10 rating for sound. It's an opinion like almost everything else around here. Being that this is a forum (and especially THIS fantastic compendium of a thread ! ) that folks come to in order to gain an understanding of things... I wanted those reading this thread to know that there is a a group of us who feel very differently. It's an odd IEM indeed that would provoke such diametrically opposed views, observations, opinions.
   
  I'll chalk it up to QC issues and just go with the thought that I had very different SM3's than you.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I recommend hearing them before one buys.
   
  All the best.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mywallethurts said:


> any chance the fx700 getting reviewed?


  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> No plans for an FX700 at this point - as you can see from the planned review list on the front page there's still plenty that needs doing.


 


   
  Quote:


battleaxe said:


> Out of curiosity have you tired the SA cables on the HJE900(& vice versa) to see how it compares?


 
 No - didn't have them at the same time and I'd have needed two pairs of the HJE900 for a proper A:B anyway.


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





shane55 said:


> Anyway, my friend, I really don't have_ that _big of an issue with your 10/10 rating for sound. It's an opinion like almost everything else around here. Being that this is a forum (and especially THIS fantastic compendium of a thread ! ) that folks come to in order to gain an understanding of things... I wanted those reading this thread to know that there is a a group of us who feel very differently. It's an odd IEM indeed that would provoke such diametrically opposed views, observations, opinions.
> 
> I'll chalk it up to QC issues and just go with the thought that I had very different SM3's than you.
> 
> ...


 


 The SM3 is actually on my next earphones to check out list. I am actually really surprised about the conflicting view about these earphones, especially since I am also convinced that joker and I probably have very similar taste/hearing (haven't read a review from him that I found myself disagreeing in any level). While this intrigues me by a mile, I am also worried that these might not be the next thing I should be looking forward to... and the UM3X comparison doesn't help either, since I blanched on those. Hmm... decisions, decisions, decisions.


----------



## Anaxilus

If its QC then Shane and myself had the same batch.  We both compared notes for a long time to make sure we weren't imagining things.  The biggest decision I had to make on the SM3 was putting mine up in the FS thread before Shane.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  For those who like the SM3 sound they are a great candidate for remolds.  Probably inevitable.  But for the money you have other custom options as well.  I did find my MDs and SM3 more similar than different in general signature but it was the differences (bass, soundstage, cost, build) that were too much for me to embrace the SM3.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I'm actually with you on hearing things similarly to Joker.  His SM3 review was mostly inline w/ my listening.  I think the point of controversy is in the weighting and scoring of them.  He qualified some of the drawbacks of the SM3 and did his usual bang up job IMO.


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> If its QC then Shane and myself had the same batch.  We both compared notes for a long time to make sure we weren't imagining things.  The biggest decision I had to make on the SM3 was putting mine up in the FS thread before Shane.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I'm actually with you on hearing things similarly to Joker.  His SM3 review was mostly inline w/ my listening.  I think the point of controversy is in the weighting and scoring of them.  He qualified some of the drawbacks of the SM3 and did his usual bang up job IMO.


 


 Then the SM3 is probably not for me as well. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I think what I am most surprised about is joker's decision to make SM3 the new "bar" in his comparisons. So, you'd be right in saying that the controversy lies within the weighting and the scoring. By giving a 10/10 for the sound department, I felt like if it is said that despite of not being a "fan" of the SM3's sound signature, he still felt it was a stellar pair of earphones (which is exactly what he said in his review) and that from now on forth, every earphones are being compared to the SM3 to have their quality rated. It is this bit that intrigued me and is probably pushing the SM3 for Christmas.
   
  In case what I said came out as a disagreement, I don't disagree with joker's methodology in one of Head-Fi's most awesome work ever. I agree with the idea that in order to measure an earphone, you got to make comparisons with something (real life sound, other earphones, etc.). Reviews are nice, but it is the comparisons that outline how certain earphones measure out.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> ...the SM3 seduces with its enveloping soundstage and thick, creamy midrange.


 
   
  The SM3 annoys with its enveloping soundstage and thick, creamy midrange.
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Anaxilus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> His SM3 review was mostly inline w/ my listening.  I think the point of controversy is in the weighting and scoring of them.


 
   
  x2. Couldn't have said it better.
   
  Nevertheless very nice job as always @joker.


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





shane55 said:


> I'm shocked ! Shocked I tells ya !
> 
> |Joker|... What? How is it possible that you and I don't hear things exactly the same? Ha!
> 
> ...


 


  Shane55,
   
  When I read your post, for a second I thought: _did I write that? _You've brilliantly managed to put into words pretty much all my thoughts on the SM3s.
   
  I, too, was shocked to read Joker's take on the SM3s (and the comparisons to the UM3X). To this day the SM3 remains the biggest disappointment of any IEM I've ever heard. I was also shocked because, although I wouldn't say I hear things exactly as Joker does, I tend to agree with a lot of the things he says.
   
  The hype surrounding this particular IEM was unprecedented - at least from the many threads I've read in my 2 years as a HF'ier. I waited 4 months to try them. Funnily enough that's around the time when some of us started to openly state our not so glowing views on the SM3s. Unfortunately, as is often the case, whenever anyone expressed their not so positive views on these, all manner of 'explanations' were given to us as to why we were not 'getting it'.
   
  Coincidentally, around the same time that these negative views started to appear, other SM3 owners started to admit mostly that treble response was not adequate, to put it VERY mildly. All manner of tips had to be tried, EQ'ing started to become a hot new topic, and later the so-called "filter-mod" suddenly appeared. At the same time more people were getting rid of their SM3s, some of which never cared to post on all SM3 threads.
  
  Quote: 





shane55 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I believe shane55 owned the Westone UM2 at the time, which is not considered a bright IEM, and he preferred the sound of it over the SM3.
   
  I also have to agree with shane55 when he says that one thing is having different tastes - perfectly valid, of course - and quite another when key aspects of the music are missing in a particular IEM's performance and presentation.
   
  I did think for a moment that I may have had a faulty set, but more reports started to come out from people who heard them similarly to the way I did; that and the endless attempts by those who liked the SM3 to change the original SQ convinced me that I didn't have a faulty set, and instead made me think the SM3 had some SQ design flaws.


----------



## Pianist

SM3 is an awesome IEM, no doubt about it. To those who were disappointed with it: you guys just didn't get the right fit, that's all. And that's perfectly OK - getting the right fit with deep insertion IEMs that have such a thin nozzle is very, very hard from my experience. For example, I could only get great sound out of Shure SE530 only maybe 5 times out of hundreds and I only got a good fit once with the Westone 3. Many people will probably be more lucky than me, but still - getting a consistent perfect fit with such an IEM design is next to impossible in my opinion.
   
  But anyway, I was also terribly disappointed with the SM3 most of the time since my fit was off. But when I did get a good fit, SM3 sounded absolutely fantastic - nearly perfectly balanced from top to bottom with flawless dynamics, imaging and superb detail resolution. That being said, I still prefer the sound of Shure SE530, but again only with the right fit. Who knows, maybe I never got the right fit with SM3, but when I listened to SE530 those few times out of hundreds when I did manage to get what I thought was a perfect fit, the sound was not only impressive, but it was totally mind blowing. Eargasm at its finest lol While I found SM3 to sound almost like you are there with the musicians, especially in the mids which often did sound I like I was there, SE530 provided a total immersion into the world of music like no other headphone or speaker I've ever heard. All I had to do was close my eyes and I was right THERE.  Maybe SM3 can do that to if I can ever manage to get the same kind of great fit I got with SE530... And maybe e-Q7 can do that too... and maybe Q-jays... and what the heck - there must be a very good reason why Etymotic still hasn't released a multi driver IEM - their ER4 may be the pinnacle of IEM sound quality already, but most people just can't get that perfect fit to be able to hear it...
   
  And  for those who don't agree with what I wrote above and think that it is all very silly, then how do you explain this: I am a healthy, young person - I don't have any mental conditions and I don't have any problems with my hearing (I go to the doctor regularly). When I owned Shure SE530, I could perceive its sound as mind blowing one time I put it in and then as absolutely awful the next time I put it in my ears with exact same tips, exact same source, and exact same recordings. Moreover, I was in a similar mood. In fact, I remember once wearing my SE530 on my morning commute to university and thinking "Oh - that awful sound again! How can Shure even dare to sell these bloody things for $400+? I can get better sound from my $40 Sennheiser HD202s!" Then, after my lecture at university, I hesitatingly put the Shures back in my ears, expecting to hear that terrible sound again, I was in a bad mood that day. The weather was very cold and I was also hungry. So I plugged the 'phones into the exact same player I used to listen to them on the morning commute, using the exact same tips and exact same music. And so I pressed play and.... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 WOOOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWW!!!!! WHAT THE.... Honestly, words can't describe how startled and blown away I was. The sound of my SE530s completely transformed, It was as though I was listening to a completely different headphone. The sound literally turned from that of a typical $20-$50 budget can to that of a $1k+ reference audio system. I just kept smiling when listening to them, while I walked to the library and people looked at me like I was crazy. I didn't take them off, knowing that if I did, the incredible sound would certainly be lost. But then I kept on listening to them with my mouth open in amazement, I noticed that the sound quality seemed to deteriorate over time... I think that might be due to me moving my jaws and altering the fit. The sound slowly turned from incredible to average again and I was left totally confused and seriously questioning my sanity. After this, I don't think I ever heard that kind of sound from my SE530 again. It kept on sounding bad to average and finally the cable also cracked and that's when I could no longer stand it. I got the Shures RMA'ed and sold them when I got the replacement pair with no regrets. I knew that even though it was the best sounding thing I've ever heard, I would never be able to get a consistently good fit to make it worth keeping. I was then tempted to get the Shures again with some custom tips, but after my bad experience with Westone ES3X customs, I decided not to bother. I found that even with a custom, like ES3X, the fit has to be just perfect in order for it to sound the way it was meant to sound. Most people on here seem to be luckier than me getting customs to fit well and that I think is the main reason why most think that customs sound superior to universals. the right fit with a custom is simply easier to obtain, even though the drivers are exactly the same in quality as in universals and maybe even inferior IMO.


----------



## proedros

the focal point here is being able to 'see' through each person's different opinion/point of view
   
*for every joker who gives sm3 a 10/10 there is a mythless who says re-262 > sm3 and so on.*
   
  personally , *i would never pay 400-500$ for a controversial IEM like the SM3* , when some say it's great and some say it's not
   
  On the other hand , i find it weird how there are still new unsold re-262  FS for *160$* , an IEM that (correct me if i am wrong here) has *more than 95% positive opinions* (i won't say 100% beacause i may sound one-sided)
   
  It all comes down to people reading opinions and reviews here and thinking for themselves instead of just following numbers and opinions.Otherwise we shall see many 10/10 iems being returned shortly after being bought.
   
   
  btw , i wanna see some more people here comparing sm3 with re-262 , as this may save people from giving >400$ for something that it may not be worth that much money ( heck , you can buy decent customs with that kind of money).....


----------



## gameboy115

Quote: 





proedros said:


> the focal point here is being able to 'see' through each person's different opinion/point of view
> 
> *for every joker who gives sm3 a 10/10 there is a mythless who says re-262 > sm3 and so on.*
> 
> ...


 

 No offense. Just my humble opinion, every IEM would go through love and hate cycle no matter how, it sounds like to me Re-262 still do not pass the initial phase - praise yet. Just like SM3, once it had absolute positive comment all over forum
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  After all, people jut perceive thing differently. Guys, just give Joker a break


----------



## shane55

[size=10pt]Music_4321.[/size]
[size=10pt]Correct on all counts. I had the UM2 (and others) and it is not a 'bright' IEM, but vastly superior to the SM3 in being able to produce what has been recorded. It is a coloured IEM for sure, but far more revealing... and enjoyable.[/size]
   
[size=10pt]@ Pianist.[/size]
[size=10pt]User error... Really?[/size]


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> SM3 is an awesome IEM, no doubt about it. To those who were disappointed with it: you guys just didn't get the right fit, that's all. And that's perfectly OK - getting the right fit with deep insertion IEMs that have such a thin nozzle is very, very hard from my experience.


 

 You must be joking.  I have a PhD in Etymotic, Klipsch Image, DBA insertion.  I doubt many people wear their DBA's as deep as mine.  I've never had a problem coaxing bass from the ER4S either.  I'm also an avid bi-flange wearer.  I think you go a bit too far w/ your claim IMO.  When people say the DBA is too bass light then I make the same claim you did.  However noone is complaining about the lack of bass on the SM3.  Extension is another matter though.  Most of us agree w/ jokers impressions just not the scoring so perhaps you misunderstand the nature of the disagreement.
   
  I also never got your amazement w/ the 530 either.  I get its technical merits and smoothness but it is far from a real live experience IME.  Its way too glassy, sterile and textureless to sound anything like life IMO.  Its like having sex w/ a mannequin.  Not that I would know.  Kunlun told me.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





shane55 said:


> [size=10pt]Music_4321.[/size]
> [size=10pt]Correct on all counts. I had the UM2 (and others) and it is not a 'bright' IEM, but vastly superior to the SM3 in being able to produce what has been recorded. It is a coloured IEM for sure, but far more revealing... and enjoyable.[/size]
> 
> [size=10pt]@ Pianist.[/size]
> *[size=10pt]User error... Really?[/size]*


 

 What else could it be if I felt SE530 sounded better than HD800 at one time and worse than my HD202 at another time? I don't experience that with over the ear headphones. They can sound a bit different depending on my mood, but not night and day different with the same source, same recordings and same earpads! Unless I am crazy of course, which is a possibility, but then how do you define crazy? lol
   
  Quote:


			
				Anaxilus said:
			
		

> /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 A basshead will. Yes, everybody will hear the bass on SM3, or more specifically the mid/upper bass because the treble sounds recessed to many people due to bad fit and so bass appears more prominent and not the other way around. Personally, I could hardly hear the sub bass on my SM3 due to bad fit. When I got a better fit, I was able to hear the lower bass. It's definitely there, but the mid/upper bass will overpower it with the wrong fit.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





gameboy115 said:


> After all, people jut perceive thing differently. Guys, just give Joker a break


 

 Yes, we do all hear things differently.
   
  We are not slamming |Joker|. We greatly respect, admire and appreciate him and all he has done. Truly, and no disrespect toward him (or any member) should be tolerated.
  We are simply expressing a different viewpoint and opinion, and last I checked, so long as we are not rude, insulting, abusive, etc., we are free to do so. He posted a particular rating for the sound of an IEM. Some of us disagree with that. It happens.
   
  This is not personal... or certainly shouldn't be. I would hope that this thread, like several of the SM3 Appreciation threads, doesn't get closed because people become rude.
  There is something strangely polarizing about these IEM's and too many get their ego's all in a bind over them. It's not worth it. It's just an IEM.


----------



## mythless

Fitting and tips will always be an complicated issue, since it's dealing with different people's experiences.  In a way, it reminds me about the RE0 when they were first released and when they came down to 99 and even 79 many people bought them because they were so "great" but complained about the "bass" even though many have stated the bass wasn't as full or deep sounding compared to newer released IEMs.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Synergy and environmental conditions.  The SM3 and 530 are very sensitive phones so they are more prone to variances of input.  Not to mention the complexity of dealing w/ the triple BAs and their Xover.  I'm still waiting to be impressed by a triple driver, hasn't happened yet.  Your ears are also susceptible to change, they are very adaptable.  This is largely the biggest cause of the differences.  They can hear different when you wake up in the morning and totally different before bed not to mention changes in weather.  I will agree that for me the Shure olive foam offers the most unreliable fit of any tip I've ever had.  I could never get a settled sound after more than 15-20 minutes as my ear canal settled and the foam warmed up and changed/shifted.  As good as you say the SM3 is these are the facts.  The highs do not extend fully and neither does the bass.  The soundstage is all over, on top and behind your head at times.  If this is your perfect IEM then that's your call and your ears, no biggie.  This is not directed at Joker btw, he has stated clearly that 10/10 does *NOT *mean perfect sound but many readers, especially newer members seem to.


----------



## Pianist

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Synergy and environmental conditions.  The SM3 and 530 are very sensitive phones so they are more prone to variances of input.  Not to mention the complexity of dealing w/ the triple BAs and their Xover.  I'm still waiting to be impressed by a triple driver, hasn't happened yet.  Your ears are also susceptible to change, they are very adaptable.  This is largely the biggest cause of the differences.  They can hear different when you wake up in the morning and totally different before bed not to mention changes in weather.  I will agree that for me the Shure olive foam offers the most unreliable fit of any tip I've ever had.  I could never get a settled sound after more than 15-20 minutes as my ear canal settled and the foam warmed up and changed/shifted.  As good as you say the SM3 is these are the facts.  The highs do not extend fully and neither does the bass.  The soundstage is all over, on top and behind your head at times.  If this is your perfect IEM then that's your call and your ears, no biggie.  This is not directed at Joker btw, he has stated clearly that 10/10 does *NOT *mean perfect sound but many readers, especially newer members seem to.


 

 You can drop synergy from the argument because like I said, I used the exact same source and recordings and SE530 sounded totally different each time I put them in my ears. And I know my ears are adaptable, but hell - not THAT adaptable! I mean I hear SE530 as a terrible, incoherent, plasticy sounding cheapish tin can and then I take them out, put them in again and I hear them as glorious, rich, dynamic, immersive, superbly balanced, incredibly detailed expensive monitors. Just how on earth is this possible with just ears adapting? Ears adapt slowly over time - they can't suddenly adapt in an hour or two and without actually listening to the 'phones. And why would we even need expensive audio equipment if we could buy something cheap that sounds horrible and then just allow our ears to adapt so that we could begin to perceive the sound as amazing?


----------



## Anaxilus

By synergy and sensitivity I meant *fluctuation*.  A sensitive piece of equipment is more prone to fluctuations and changes in the input stream.  Though I agree that ears are the most likely culprit.  And ears do change rather quickly within say 5-10 minutes.  I can listen to a neutral or light sounding IEM then put in say my MDs and get rolled by the bass.  Spend a few minutes getting attuned to it then put back in the other IEM and feel the bass is missing.  Yes ears and brain don't adjust within milliseconds but w/i minutes I say yes.  Plus your ears can adapt to ambient even if you aren't listening to anything.


----------



## tuahogary

The only way I can think of about the drastic changes in how you listen to your 530s are fit issues, just like you said. But surely, an experienced listener like you would have chosen the best tips that consistently stay put in your ears? It only takes 5 seconds to realize that the tips you've been trying are not for you.


----------



## Kunlun

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Its like having sex w/ a mannequin.  Not that I would know.  Kunlun told me.


 
  Excuse you, they are called Real Dolls.
 Don't be a hater, bro. 
   
  You just jealous, I got mine from Japan with real human skin.


----------



## Pianist

No guys, I don't think it's that simple. I think that with this IEM design even the differences of 1/10 of a mm or less can have an audible effect on the sound. Just think about it - the nozzle is tiny and all that sound from three drivers must come out of that tiny nozzle then combine properly in your ear canal before it hits your eardrum. Our ear canals are like the extension of the IEM - the sound is not ready when it leaves then IEM nozzle, but has to pass through our canals which act as acoustic chambers which further shape the sound.


----------



## SolidVictory

I agree that the SM3 requires a very good fit in order to achieve its signature sound. Many times (especially when I first received the SM3), I tried different tips and even cut out some foam (from ear plugs) and tried those tips as well. Sometimes I would hear a gorgeous sound from the entire dynamic range, and other times one thing or the other would be missing (missing deep bass impact, highs and treble dissipating artificially, midrange sounding very awkwardly "heavy" and thick). 
   
  However, after BennyBoy71's suggestion of the double-flanged tips from Sensorcom, I decided to order them. I must also add that I de-cored an old Shure yellow foam tip to only retain its plastic core, and put that over the nozzle of the SM3. Then I took the double-flanged tip and slowly pushed it over the nozzle which was already covered with the yellow foam core.
   
  Now, even after doing all that and having a good open sound nozzle from the tips, it is crucial to get a proper insertion. *Here is where the "ultimate SM3 fit" comes in:* *I don't know if everyone knows the whole "put your opposite hand behind your head, pull the top of your ear up while saying "ahhh", and then twist the IEM into place counterclockwise" --> but I think this is one of the most crucial points of getting a proper fit.* Then comes lubrication of the tips, which I also think is very important for the double-flange tips. Additionally, some people like using saliva to lubricate their tips, I find this kind of weird so I just use a TINY amount (literally 1/3 the size of a pea for both tips) of any facial/body lotion, and then first dab, and then rub it on both tips so they are lubricated (you should not see any of the lotion on the tips, since you are using such a small amount--just enough to get them lubricated). By then your fingers will be slightly lubricated too, and you can just your fingers to rub the entrance of the ear canal, lubricating them too.
   
Once again, I am using the double-flange tips from Sensorcom placed on top of a de-cored Shure yellow foam tip, which is snug on the nozzle of the SM3. This may not be the best combination for everyone but it is well worth a few dollars to try out, since it worked for many SM3 users to achieve a perfect fit.
   
  After allll this (I'm used to the process by now--it's not that cumbersome), I did the method above (the hand over head method I'd like to call it), SLOWLY inserting the SM3 counterclockwise in each ear canal. I was surprised by HOW MUCH isolation increased! Compared to any other tip or method I've used, this had the most SUPERB isolation.
   
  And finally, the music. It was after this that I discovered how gorgeous the SM3 can sound. For the entire dynamic range, the SM3 is very cohesive. Its analytical/slightly forgiving/warm/creamy/liquid signature really makes music sound the way it should for me (and for many others who have achieved this "holy grail" of fits with the SM3). I must say, when I had written my SM3 review, I had not achieved this sound all the time--only randomly--by chance, and I knew that this was the sound signature of the SM3, the sound that I based my review off of.
   
  I just had to get this same sound with the SM3 every time. With the above method, I do get this same sound signature every time--which is why I am still with the SM3 (being one of the very first to buy it when average_joe made his thread--before any review except his own) even after many have either sold, changed, or moved up to a custom this past year.
   
  So my point is--try to get this "ultimate" fit with the SM3. Yes, it detracts from the IEM because it is hard to achieve a 100% proper fit; but even if you think you have this "ultimate" fit, you may not. Keep trying even if it sounds great already--which is what I did, and I was rewarded with a gorgeous sound. I think |joker| achieved this sound as well as many other SM3 owners. But the fit is crucial to the sound.
   
  The rating that |joker| gave for the SM3 may be annoying for some members here who did not enjoy the SM3, but we must understand that nearly everything at head-fi is opinion based off of our own experiences. Not everyone will agree with a rating and I do not think |joker| was expecting everyone to come into this thread and agree with him either. As we all know though, he has contributed tremendously to this forum and his review of the SM3 does not seem biased at all.
   
  Finally, I do not in any way think the SM3 is the "one and only BEST universal IEM". It lacks in its build, which is boxy and can sometimes be uncomfortable, its hard to find "perfect" fit, as well as the fact that it is hard to get your hands on considering it is made in France. However, with all this being said, the sound that the SM3 produces simply outweighs all of those detriments for me. I think it is an excellent IEM, and quite humbly, one of (not THE) the best universal IEMs on the market today.


----------



## Anaxilus

Ok, lets simplify this discussion.  For those of you that have this ideal perfect fit and signature.  Once achieved, do the highs match the timbre of the DBA-02 w/ respect to cymbals and crashes?  Does the bass reach the lowest lows and offer the decay and reverb of my Monster MDs?  My experience is no.  It seems to me this discussion is a simple matter of those that don't prefer the SM3 don't prefer the signature and those SM3 proponents that prefer its signature think those that don't haven't actually heard it.  You seem to think the SM3 is so perfect that everyone must like its signature?  IMO the SM3 is a sidegrade among the top tier, not a game changer.


----------



## shane55

What many of us experienced with the sound of the SM3 was not due to fit, seal or insertion. It was not. We are not noobs (no disrespect... we all were/are at one point). But we know fit, seal and insertion... and know our own ears. Please give us a little more credit for being somewhat IEM savvy.
   
  And besides... if it is really that hard to fit these; if one really has to go through all the extreme tip mods performed by SolidVictory (no disrespect, more power to you), why on earth would anyone even consider these worth $400? Just for that alone they should be dismissed. But that's another thread.
   
  It's really very simple. With well-fit eartips, we did not find the sound of the SM3 to be worthy of a 10/10 rating. We expressed that opinion and stated why. It's not solely a matter of taste, though taste and preference is, of course, involved. It was for me, all that these IEM's don't reproduce. They suppress essential sonic characteristics. And if requiring them is what people call 'preference', then I'm guilty of insisting on hearing what has actually been recorded. All of it.


----------



## average_joe

Thanks SolidVictory for possible fixes.  I don't have those fit issues with the SM3, as it sounds great to me with numerous tips and doesn't change much regardless of the insertion method, as long as the tips are not bent and in the same spot.  Back when I originally posted about the SM3, I stated that _technically_ it was the best I had heard, which included the IE8, W3, UM3X, FX700, e-Q7, etc.  My term technically meant that it combined realism, proper soundstage size while being very large in comparison to the competition, and high resolution allowing me to make out things in the music I had previously heard, but didn't sound like the real thing.  This was taken out of context as people (or a person) stated I claimed it was the best, period.  I did ask the question about how people would react if I put the SM3 above all others in my top-tier chart and wow, what a response!
   
  Anyways, my point is that there are those that love the SM3 and hear it's technical merit, while others, for whatever reason don't hear it.  The SM3 seems to be as polarizing as religion or politics and has resulted in 2 SM3 threads being locked.  I am glad people seem to be civil in this thread.  Take any headphone and you will have supporters and detractors, for example the LDC-2, which is beloved by many, but not all.  If there was one correct, preferred sound signature, the all companies products would try to have their products sound that way, but they don't.  I am in the SM3 camp and it is still my favorite universal, although I don't listen to it much due to my other equipment.
   
  If the SM3 can produce a level of sound that is [slightly] technically superior to the competition, shouldn't it get a 10/10, even if it isn't heard that way by everyone?  Are things to be judged by the worst they can sound, or the best?  And hasn't |joker| earned the right to rate things how he hears them, with his vast experience?  Now, if |joker| used his sound signature preferences in the ratings, that would not be a good thing, but he does not and provides excellent write-ups to help us understand something we have not heard.


----------



## SolidVictory

Quote: 





shane55 said:


> What many of us experienced with the sound of the SM3 was not due to fit, seal or insertion. It was not. We are not noobs (no disrespect... we all were/are at one point). But we know fit, seal and insertion... and know our own ears. Please give us a little more credit for being somewhat IEM savvy.
> 
> And besides... if it is really that hard to fit these; if one really has to go through all the extreme tip mods performed by SolidVictory (no disrespect, more power to you), why on earth would anyone even consider these worth $400? Just for that alone they should be dismissed. But that's another thread.
> 
> It's really very simple. With well-fit eartips, we did not find the sound of the SM3 to be worthy of a 10/10 rating. We expressed that opinion and stated why. It's not solely a matter of taste, though taste and preference is, of course, involved. It was for me, all that these IEM's don't reproduce. They suppress essential sonic characteristics. And if requiring them is what people call 'preference', then I'm guilty of insisting on hearing what has actually been recorded. All of it.


 

 I agree that not everyone had fit issues, and many still did not like the SM3 after achieving a perfect fit. I am not in any way saying that everyone who did not like the SM3 had fit issues. I'm just putting it out there for people who did not like it and have not tried to get an ideal fit yet.
   
  I just don't hear any suppression if essential sonic characteristics. Maybe some do hear an actual technical flaw, but I do not, so I am very satisfied with my SM3's; of course not everyone will be, and I understand that.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

wow what a fight the sm3 has caused.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> wow what a fight the sm3 has caused.


 


  Indeed. Going to try to wade through it all now that I'm home but damn... now I see why the SM3 appreciation thread died a painful death. To everyone's credit this is very civil and I appreciate that.


----------



## battleaxe

Let me sway the topic a bit. I really like the review of the Custom 3 that you gave, but durability issue you faced(also read about it in another thread) makes me worried. So, is there anything else you may recommend for about 100 or less I should look at? Or was it just a fluke with the cable? Thought about the RE-0 and Zero but something about the comfort I didn't like. Thanks.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> wow what a fight the sm3 has caused.


 

 Not at all.
   
  While I have had a hand in _somewhat_ hijacking the thread (deepest apologies to |Joker| ), this _has_ been relatively civil. And there were at least 2 threads that were closed over SM3 'disagreements'. You should have seen much of went on there and the posts that were deleted. THAT was fighting. People were banned. This is a discussion with clearly opposing viewpoints. No big deal.
   
  What is it about these IEM's ?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Cheers and Happy Holidays to all.
   
  shane


----------



## Rip N' Burn

I finally sold my SM3's. I did like them but they really didn't grab my attention like other iems and didn't produce a WOW factor. Fit wasn't an issue for me either. I used custom UM56 tips and sensorcom double flange tips. They always gave me a perfect fit. For me, they were very bassy iems which surprised me being that they have BA drivers. It sounded similar to bassy dynamic drivers. The other BA iem that surprised me with bass is the Klipsh image x10. The large oval tips gave me the best seal and I am taken aback by how low and deep the bass goes. It only has one micro BA driver! I also have the UM3X and when I read other people's descriptions of how the bass of the SM3 and UM3X are similar, I though they must be out of their minds. I compared them again and I still could hear a significant amount of more bass quantity from the SM3. The UM3X didn't have the quantity but has a more noticeable visceral slam which I also never heard from a BA iem. When some people stated in the locked threads that the SM3's midrange was much better than the SE530 it put me in a quandary. I really couldn't believe that the SM3's midrange can be better than the legendary se530 midrange. I was then determined to buy them and hear them for myself. The midrange was good, but not as good as the SE535 which I also currently own. I didn't try the filter mod because of all the reports of how easy parts break off with just regular use. It could have changed my perception but I didn't want to risk breaking them. This what I have experienced and I fully understand that we can hear things differently. From my perspective, I would give them a 8.5/10.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *james444* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> The SM3 annoys with its enveloping soundstage and thick, creamy midrange.


   
  Ha, I expected as much. 
   
  I think it needs stating that the difference between 9.75 and 10.0 is very small. Everyone referring to the SM3 as the new 'bar' is missing a crucial chunk of the view - I think I've stated before that personal preferences can easily negate +/- 1pt of difference on the scale so calling the SM3 the 'bar' for high-end earphones would be the same as calling the Meelec M9 the 'bar' for sets <$20. Yes the M9 is very good for a budget set from a technical standpoint but they are also harsh and boomy and have recessed mids. Some people will hate them. Some may prefer the CX300 or PL30 to the M9, yet noone is complaining that the M9 is scored too high because by its nature a score of 5/10 doesn't carry the same connotations as 10/10.
   
  Anyway, I think that needed saying.
   
  Quote:


average_joe said:


> If the SM3 can produce a level of sound that is [slightly] technically superior to the competition, shouldn't it get a 10/10, even if it isn't heard that way by everyone?  Are things to be judged by the worst they can sound, or the best?  And hasn't |joker| earned the right to rate things how he hears them, with his vast experience?  Now, if |joker| used his sound signature preferences in the ratings, that would not be a good thing, but he does not and provides excellent write-ups to help us understand something we have not heard.


 
 Thanks, we really seem to think alike, you and me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I definitely chalk up my preferring the CK10 and DBA-02 to the SM3 to signature preferences but I don't think I'm overcompensating by rating the SM3 higher 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 .
   

 Quote:


battleaxe said:


> Let me sway the topic a bit. I really like the review of the Custom 3 that you gave, but durability issue you faced(also read about it in another thread) makes me worried. So, is there anything else you may recommend for about 100 or less I should look at? Or was it just a fluke with the cable? Thought about the RE-0 and Zero but something about the comfort I didn't like. Thanks.


 
 I don't think anything can beat the Custom3 from a technical standpoint for $100... RE-ZERO/Xcape would probably be closest. I really like the fit of the Xcape-  can't imagine anyone having issues with it. Anyway, the cable on the KC3 really isn't bad from a durability standpoint as long as you are careful with it. I just didn't like how it kinks and conducts noise...


----------



## proedros

No fight whatsoever , i think this may be one of the very,very few times that people here have a different opinion form joker's excellent reviews and since this is xmas , is a good time to 'fight' it out in a good,positive way
   
  It's like these talks buddies do , when they make well-meant fun of each other's girlfriend
   
  well joker loves sm3 and we are simply trying to pull his leg and tell him ' you know what man , actually your gf etc etc'
   
  no biggie.
   
  Besides , i don't think there is one member here who does not respect/dig joker for this thread he has built - it's just our way to tell him ' we love you even more now cause you're human and you ain't the IEM god ' 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  It would seem very peculiar to me seeing people here diss joker in a non-friendly , humorous way....
   
   
  So where were we with this whole sm3 thing ? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> wow what a fight the sm3 has caused.


----------



## rawrster

This is definitely more civil than when the first 2 SM3 threads got out of hands 
   
  Just out of curiosity but any plans to get the Nuforce NE-700X or the new(ish) ECCi earphone? I'm thinking of getting the Nuforce to be the more balanced universal at a reasonable price to my M2 and the ECCi PR401 (I think it's called that) is a bit too much to be spending.


----------



## Kunlun

Quote: 





proedros said:


> No fight whatsoever , i think this may be one of the very,very few times that people here have a different opinion form joker's excellent reviews and since this is xmas , is a good time to 'fight' it out in a good,positive way


 

 On the contrary, people disagree with joker all the time. How many people would really rate the ck10 a 10/10? Very few. Many would give it high scores, but few would give 10/10. It's a minority opinion. That's completely fine and doesn't say anything bad about joker or anyone. It's great that one person has had a lot of experience and practice writing reviews, but it really doesn't give that person's opinion more validity. A civil discussion of different points of view about how an earphone sounds is what head-fi is more or less about.


----------



## Kunlun

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Take any headphone and you will have supporters and detractors, for example the LDC-2, which is beloved by many, but not all.  If there was one correct, preferred sound signature, the all companies products would try to have their products sound that way, but they don't.


 
   
   
  This is a reasonable statement.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> This is definitely more civil than when the first 2 SM3 threads got out of hands
> 
> Just out of curiosity but any plans to get the Nuforce NE-700X or the new(ish) ECCi earphone? I'm thinking of getting the Nuforce to be the more balanced universal at a reasonable price to my M2 and the ECCi PR401 (I think it's called that) is a bit too much to be spending.


 

  There are two dead SM3 threads? I guess they are more controversial than I first thought.
   
  Anyway, both NE-700X and PR401 on the way for me. Hopefully the PR401 will be the ECCI earphone that finally recaptures that Cyclone PR1 Pro refinement.


----------



## Photofan1986

Filter mod guys, you have to try the filter mod, and I'm pretty sure that the SM3 will make MUCH more people happy!


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





photofan1986 said:


> Filter mod guys, you have to try the filter mod, and I'm pretty sure that the SM3 will make MUCH more people happy!


 

 Now see, thats the thing right there.  You get half the SM3 fan base saying that their stock SM3 is the greatest thing since sliced bread and rumors of treble recession or bass roll-off is imagined or a result of poor fit.  Then comes the other half saying removing the filters finally makes them just right.  Those of you doing the filter mod obviously don't know how to insert the SM3 properly I guess?  It's cool.  If the SM3 fans can't agree on how they sound I feel pretty good about my opinion of how I heard them.  Would the filter mod keep performers from playing behind me or on top of my head?  Just curious.


----------



## SolidVictory

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  This was one of the funnier posts I've seen on head-fi. Kudos for making me physically laugh through a post (no offense at all--I'm serious, it was just funny 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).


----------



## Anaxilus

No worries, I think the whole thing is freaking hilarious!


----------



## mythless

lol funny


----------



## Bennyboy71

RE262 is better than SM3, even disregarding the stoopid price differential. Add that into the mix that Earsonics don't even get a ticket for the bus to the ballpark.
   
  This is the truth according to me.


----------



## Photofan1986

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Not that simple, man. I was one of the first to say that there was something wrong with my SM3, and in the beginning, I really did not like them. A proper fit was really difficult to achieve. But even after finding out how to wear them correctly (with the right tips), I could not completely enjoy them. It took me quite a while before I got what was not completely right: the recessed upper mids. The fact is that when I  removed the filters, I understood that I could tailor the sound to remove the sensation of veil on the upper mids. That's exactly what it did, but I had to add some foam to tame the highs. And now I must say that I simply find them better than any other iem I heard (IE8 and RE-252 included). No fanboyism here, just personal experience and preference.
  Now, I understand some people like the stock sound more, but I (and many others would, I'm sure) prefer the sound they give once modded. Simply because they are as many personal tastes as there are ears. Hum, actually, the half.
  
   
  Quote: 





> Would the filter mod keep performers from playing behind me or on top of my head?  Just curious.


 
  No, the soundstage is still very surrounding, but I actually really like this. I understand some may not.


----------



## tuahogary

@anaxilus & shane55, what iems would you recommend over the sm3 then? preferably something neutral and natural sounding. thanks for the advice


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





tuahogary said:


> @anaxilus & shane55, what iems would you recommend over the sm3 then? preferably something neutral and natural sounding. thanks for the advice


 

 Ironically we are both using the DBA-02.  If you can get a fit to give you bass and body on the DBA you are golden, otherwise not so much.  I also use its evil adopted brother the MD which is pretty close to the SM3 signature but less technically adept though better sounding to my preference.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Maybe also worth considering: Ortofon e-Q5 and Final Audio FI-BA-A1. Both sound more natural and transparent than the SM3 to my ears. At $250 and $270 they are also cheaper than the Earsonics, though more expensive than the DBA-02.


----------



## shane55

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Indeed. DBA-02, as has been stated, is very fit / tip dependent for the best sound, but once achieved... oh yeah baby. (Details re. fit & tips through PM if you wish.) They are incredible... fast, clear, clean, bright... mostly neutral. Similar in overall sonic character to the DT880 / 600 Ohm, but without the hump at 8khz.
   
  UM2... another excellent and underrated IEM. Round, robust, full-bodied while maintaining a very natural character. Slightly rolled-off in the highs.
   
  I've always been interested in getting the UM3x. Music_4321 (who posted above, and hears things similarly to me) went there from the SM3. He liked the UM3x very much but may have moved on from there... I can't remember.
   
  Another member who hears similarly to me has moved on to the JH5, and says they do everything but make him toast in the morning. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




   But they're quite dear.


----------



## Anaxilus

I think I know who your JH5 user is, he hears pretty similarly to me as well.  If the Eq5 or GR10 ever fall below $200 I'll give them a go and see if they give my DBA's the boot.  At this point anything above that is going in my Customs fund.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

lols.
  in a way sm3 really is a legend here. everytime someone put it at the top, there'll be people chopping it down. but then, when placed lower, people will bring it up.
  anyways |joker|'s rating didnt suprise me the least.
  its actually kinda obvious when he rated ck10 as 10/10 last time, he is rating the sound based on technical capability.
  better than ck10? yes, it doesnt have top peaks and bottom dips.
  but what about those criteria that is hard, or can not be described or evaluated as technical?
  such as feel? emotion? how immersive? musicality? logic? coherency?
  sure, dba-02 scores in details, that's technical. but is it musical? for some, yes, it does what they want for their music.
   
  for me? no, i dont need all detail to be crystal clear. There are details that should NOT be clear, just as in real life. those are the things u feel from the music, and should stay subtle.
  if i am to rate sm3 myself, technically yes it scores. it also have better frequency balance than ck10, i have no argument about it being placed higher. but how far higher? the difference, if measured, is can be very small. but these are also the difference that make musical experience counts to those seeking them. I accept sm3 being superior, but i do not like them for the same reason people do not like hd650. just like some prefer ferarri and some prefer lotus. ferarri is technically superior, but lotus is known to be fun.
   
  still, having a comprehensive list such as these and maintaining them is a job well done. thank you |joker|.


----------



## tuahogary

wow thanks guys.. unfortunately the dba-02 is rather hard to find in the UK. i see the eq-7 going of 130 quid in the classifieds section. do you think it is a good buy? also, how big is the improvement in the jh5? i assume it's more worth spending a little more for the jh5 than to get the sm3 or say the w4 that is coming out soon?


----------



## average_joe

The SM3 reminded me of autostereograms, you remember, those pictures with dots that you had to focus on to see the 3D picture.  Some people saw them, and when you see it, it is much more 3D than a regular picture (but devoid of color and the other details, of course), but there were many people that I know that hated those, but couldn't see the image ("all I see are dots, these things are stupid").  Here is the concept: "In order to perceive 3D shapes in these autostereograms, the brain must overcome the normally automatic coordination between focusing and vergence."
   
  Of course, this is not a perfect analogy (or even a great one), I do see some parallels.  And once you could see the image in a particular picture, subsequent viewings resulted in the image appearing much more readily.  So, maybe all the SM3 differences are in the brain.  Not that people will agree, but I thought it was interesting enough to share.
   
  Happy holidays to all the SM3 supporters, SM3 detractors, and SM3 neutral people!


----------



## proedros

no offense , but this is like saying 'only smart people get the SM3'
   
  if benny didn't ''get'' them (and imo , he qualifies as one of the most 'smart' people here) then your theory just went down the drain.
   
  does this also apply for people digging NIN , as well ? Cause i used to like trent , but now i find him boring and outdated - where does this place me ?
   
  Chill bro , these IEM have nothing to do with IQ and perception here.
   

  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> The SM3 reminded me of autostereograms, you remember, those pictures with dots that you had to focus on to see the 3D picture.  Some people saw them, and when you see it, it is much more 3D than a regular picture (but devoid of color and the other details, of course), but there were many people that I know that hated those, but couldn't see the image ("all I see are dots, these things are stupid").  Here is the concept: "In order to perceive 3D shapes in these autostereograms, the brain must overcome the normally automatic coordination between focusing and vergence."
> 
> Of course, this is not a perfect analogy (or even a great one), I do see some parallels.  And once you could see the image in a particular picture, subsequent viewings resulted in the image appearing much more readily.  So, maybe all the SM3 differences are in the brain.  Not that people will agree, but I thought it was interesting enough to share.
> 
> Happy holidays to all the SM3 supporters, SM3 detractors, and SM3 neutral people!


----------



## Inks

x2 on not perfect analogy (though he did point it out),  i'm sure there's the case of people that "saw" or "got it" and still dislike it. 
  Quote: 





proedros said:


> no offense , but this is like saying 'only smart people get the SM3'
> 
> if benny didn't ''get'' them (and imo , he qualifies as one of the most 'smart' people here) then your theory just went down the drain.
> 
> ...


----------



## average_joe

Where did I state it had anything to do with intellect and knew some pretty smart people that had issues with the pictures.  It is a matter of perception with everyones brains being part of the equation in a perceptive way, not an intellect way.  The brain has many functions, not just what is measured via IQ  Sorry you took offense, none intended, I was just sharing a thought..
  
  Quote: 





proedros said:


> no offense , but this is like saying 'only smart people get the SM3'
> 
> if benny didn't ''get'' them (and imo , he qualifies as one of the most 'smart' people here) then your theory just went down the drain.
> 
> ...


----------



## proedros

Your thesis just sounded kinda elitist to me , that's all
   
  I mean these are IEMs , and it's not like you tried them on acid and your sonic perception changed and went to a higher state of consciousness
   
  contrary to brain functions , i think all people listen the same sounds , give or take
   
  anyway - all is well and baby jesus is on par for bringing us all presents , so peace out.
   
  (and do try the 262 and let us know if you like em 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 )


----------



## shane55

I think this is the point that Anaxilus was making earlier:
  It would appear that with the SM3, many people are working very hard (either physically or mentally) to have them sound 'right'. Tip mods, filter mod, psychoacoustics... it's all too much for what is priced as a 'high end' (or even 'mid-high-end') IEM.
   
  An IEM of this cost really should be 'plug-and-praise'. For some, it obviously is. Again, a very polarizing IEM, to be sure.


----------



## Bennyboy71

"A brain the size of two planets and they got me reviewing iems" - Marvin the paranoid android
   
  Reasons why I gave up on the SM3, despite it initally floating my boat rather spectacularly, in no particular order
  1) Fit - could never really get a fit that felt comfortable and kept perfect sound at all times (even with the Sensorcom tips), which is crucial for me as I walk a lot
  2) Build quality - mine broke on me twice.
  3) Cost - I could never quite justify spending so much when I was so cash-poor, so I sold them for something cheaper
  4) The partial veil over the upper mids meant I spent ages tweaking eq settings on my J3, until I was spending so long doing that I forgot I actually bought the bloody things to listen to music through
   
  Reasons why I love the RE262 so far:
  1) Fit - stock double flange tips fit me perfectly and stay in place no matter what I'm doing, with constant sound quality performance
  2) Build quality - bit early to talk about this, but they immediately strike me as less flimsy, Kinder Egg-esque than the SM3s.
  3) Cost - got em for just north of £100 in the FS forum, which is a complete bargain
  4) Sound quality is phenomenal and an upgrade over the 252s (which I happened to lose on the train, hence the 262 purchase),.  To my ears, using 'normal' setting (i,e, no eq needed) on the J3, and paired with the Headstage Arrow, the 262s outperform the SM3 easily.  And the reason?  They sound so damn rich, detailed and full sounding, they're the nearest I've heard to full size cans in an iem.  Completely non-fatiguing, they just let me sit back and wallow in the,luxurious noises they make.  Soundstage is less '3D' than the SM3, that's true, but that 3Dness is a bit of mixed blessing if you ask me.  Sure, its enveloping, but it's also ultimately a bit disorientating and confusing - kinda like the James Dean scene in the Planetarium in Rebel Without A Cause, its both spellbinding and overwhelming.  The 262s present the music in a more linear fashion, but the soundstage is so impressive I don't miss the 360 degrees of the SM3s at all.  Rather, they make me feel as if I'm listening to proper stereo speakers in a high end setup.
   
  I can understand why the SM3 divide opinion far more harshly than most other iems, and I can understand why some think they're the absolute canine's wedding tackle.  It doesnt surprise me that Joker gives them 10/10 at all, given his stated preclivities with other iems such as the CK10 and DBA-02. Likewise, it doesn't surprise me that others score them much less favourably.
   
  Me being the traitor I am, I've defected from the former to the latter camp over the last few months. But they have tastier women here and the food's better endowed, so what you gonna do?


----------



## m27gio

Does a thread like this exist for on-ear headphones?


----------



## average_joe

Not elitist, just a thought that came to mind.  I am not saying either way is right nor wrong, it just is (at least with the pictures).  What other IEM has been so polarizing and given people such a wide spectrum of sound perceptions?  And I listed my thoughts of the RE252 a while ago, which is a very very nice IEM, but I prefer others, so I don't plan on getting the 262.  Merry Christmas!
  
  Quote: 





proedros said:


> Your thesis just sounded kinda elitist to me , that's all
> 
> I mean these are IEMs , and it's not like you tried them on acid and your sonic perception changed and went to a higher state of consciousness
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, similar, but for me there is no work involved in hearing the SM3 the way that I do.  Maybe my brain adjusted and now that is how it is, who knows.

  Quote: 





shane55 said:


> I think this is the point that Anaxilus was making earlier:
> It would appear that with the SM3, many people are working very hard (either physically or mentally) to have them sound 'right'. Tip mods, filter mod, psychoacoustics... it's all too much for what is priced as a 'high end' (or even 'mid-high-end') IEM.
> 
> An IEM of this cost really should be 'plug-and-praise'. For some, it obviously is. Again, a very polarizing IEM, to be sure.


 


  @ Benny - thanks for your wisdom!


----------



## mythless

You either like it or don't.  Isn't that how everything is?  It gets to a certain point where some people begin to justify their reason on liking them and disliking them.  In the same retrospect everyone becomes defensive and attempts to, again, justify why they like them or dislike them so much that it seem that they're trying to convince the other party that they're completely wrong.  And, we lose the out on the discussion.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





m27gio said:


> Does a thread like this exist for on-ear headphones?


 

 Somewhat: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/433318/shootout-61-portable-headphones-reviewed-meelec-ht-21-soundmagic-p20-added-12-15


----------



## voicemaster

Just got Sunrise Xcape and so far it sounds similar to the review. Thanks to this thread, I finally found IEM that sounds like KSC75 with isolation (sound signature is pretty similar IMHO although the Xcape sounds better overall). Just a question, does Xcape benefit from burn-in? I believe in burn-in, my other IEMs definitely sounds different than when I first got it so burn-in is real IMHO.


----------



## esanthosh

SM3 is just like every other IEM. Some like it, some hate it.
   
  I don't have any fit issues (with stock bi-flanges, Shure Olives) and I've not tried to EQ / Mod them. Bass does not have the very lows, treble is slightly recessed, the presentation becomes unnatural especially with live performances where it envelops your head rather than present a stage. Every listening session with SM3 goes something like this - denial, acceptance and appreciation of it's sound signature. Strangely, I don't feel the treble 'recessed' at the end. It's like an invisible voodoo driver acting on me half way through.
   
  I don't have such issues with DBA-02. I plug and forget. At odd times, when coming from something like a FX700, it takes me a couple of minutes to adjust. But, it never needs a brain burn-in / adjustment like SM3. I've had SM3 for less than a week, so I am stretching things here - If you accept SM3's way of presentation, 10/10 does not look out of place; if not, it looks a bit charitable for the 'flaws' it has. Just my 2c.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Anyway, both NE-700X and PR401 on the way for me. Hopefully the PR401 will be the ECCI earphone that finally recaptures that Cyclone PR1 Pro refinement.


 

 Excellent. I ordered the NE-700X so should either get it Monday (if Nuforce was working today and shipped it or on Wednesday next week but I don't think they notify when an item has shipped since when I bought the uDAC they never gave me a notification). I look forward to when you  have time to offer your thoughts on them as well as the ECCI one. I've never heard the Cyclone PR1 Pro but I have heard of it's bang for the buck factor for quite a while when it was still around so hopefully something good comes out of their newest earphone. I've never owned a Nuforce earphone so it's about time I owned one and it seems like a good contrast to my M2 according to one head-fi member I asked at least.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





voicemaster said:


> Just got Sunrise Xcape and so far it sounds similar to the review. Thanks to this thread, I finally found IEM that sounds like KSC75 with isolation (sound signature is pretty similar IMHO although the Xcape sounds better overall). Just a question, does Xcape benefit from burn-in? I believe in burn-in, my other IEMs definitely sounds different than when I first got it so burn-in is real IMHO.


 


  It actually does.  It likes more burn-in than usual from what I normally run, at least on my pair.  Greater than 100 would be good as I only gave mine 20 before listening.  Amping really brings them up another notch too.
   
  @averagejoe.  Your analogy is spot on IMO.  I am definitely in the ("all I see are dots, these things are stupid") camp.  It has nothing to do w/ IQ or elitism.  As with the autostereograms and the SM3 I simply am not willing to play the game.  I take no offense to what AJ said myself and actually agree with it.  Maybe that's the source of polarization.  Those willing to try listening in a different way will be rewarded w/ a unique experience not found elsewhere.  Others, like myself, prefer how they listen and want nothing more than to find that which best fulfills that experience.  As we know, the latter is already hard enough to achieve let alone learning new tricks.  Everytime I see one of those dot collages I want to replace them w/ bullet holes and a gasoline induced flaming demise.  Georges Seurat represents the limits of my Pointillism.


----------



## voicemaster

Anaxilus: What are the changes from the burn-in? Right now, at only around 5 hours, I can hear that the bass is getting more pronounce, it's like it has more body/solid, the punch getting more impact but not boomy at all just very tight bass. I haven't notice any changes to the mid and treble.


----------



## Anaxilus

Treble a bit, mids clean up and open up enough to improve detail and overall coherence tying the frequencies together better IMO.  Out of the box they sounded kind of glossy in the mids to me.  YMMV.


----------



## voicemaster

Yesterday, when I heard Hotel California by Eagles, I can hear the clicking from the bass pedal, usually I can't hear it even with my Denon C700 which is pretty detail IMHO. And in another song I can hear the acoustic guitar playing which I couldn't hear before, it's amazing. I think the reason why I couldn't hear those sound was because the bass kind of veiling it up, not the case with the Xcape.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> @averagejoe.  Your analogy is spot on IMO.  I am definitely in the ("all I see are dots, these things are stupid") camp.  It has nothing to do w/ IQ or elitism.  As with the autostereograms and the SM3 I simply am not willing to play the game.  I take no offense to what AJ said myself and actually agree with it.  Maybe that's the source of polarization.  Those willing to try listening in a different way will be rewarded w/ a unique experience not found elsewhere.  Others, like myself, prefer how they listen and want nothing more than to find that which best fulfills that experience.  As we know, the latter is already hard enough to achieve let alone learning new tricks.  Everytime I see one of those dot collages I want to replace them w/ bullet holes and a gasoline induced flaming demise.  Georges Seurat represents the limits of my Pointillism.


 

 Merry Christmas!  I don't think it is 100% spot on because I don't have to "work" at it, it just happens for me.  When I first got the SM3, I heard some greatness hidden behind the way to thick and warm presentation.  I had someone verify what I was hearing.  Somewhere around 2 weeks later, the too warm and too thick went away and I was left with what I heard as greatness!  The person that listened previously, without hearing them again, heard them as much clearer (although he still preferred the FX700).  I think one of the reasons I like the SM3 is my brain interprets the space as larger than the competition with the right 3D proportions, which were better than the rest I had heard to that date.
   
  So, my analogy was more about brain interpretation of the SM3 presentation, and possibly sound in general (just from IEMs?).  From offline conversations with many people on here, some hear large differences in soundstage size/shape, others don't and sound signature is much more important.  I would take a great soundstage over a slightly preferred sound signature for the most part (Tesla T1 vs. LCD-2 being an exception, as the T1 has a wider presentation, but I find the LCD-2 sounds more natural and preferred overall).  I think the soundstage, resolution, reverb, extension, etc. result in technical differences while sound signature is more a preference.   
   
  Disclaimer: I am not trying to be elitist, nor am I saying anything about anyone's intelligence, nor am I saying anyone is right or wrong, just sharing a though process/flow.


----------



## dweaver

I think the analogy pretty accurate. I am someone who sees those pictures through effort and not all the time. I know others who just see the picture with no effort and others who don't see it all or just can't be bothered. I think the SM3 is just like that and I fall into the work at camp with them but do have days where I do just get "it". I have considered selling them several times but do find they work well for alot of my needs so keep listening.

I also agree with others about there presentation being unique in placing a person in the middle but not always appropriate for all music. For some this would make the SM3 to expensive and inappropriate for their needs if their main music choices fall into those categories.

As for Joker's review I have no problem with it follows his methodology.


----------



## Inks

People just see the picture (think abstract painting) differently as simple as that. Some see certain aspects of it as a flaw and others as a virtue. To some certain parts of the picture look like chaos while to some it's coherently done. Doesn't necessarily have to be some complex image. This applies to iems, in my opinion and every iem throughout head-fi has been very polarizing because of this. The SM3s just have this controversy accentuated because it comes at a time where theres more competition, it "battles" for a top spot and the community is at a growth.


----------



## james444

Autostereogram? Abstract painting? I don't think so. Why should anyone who's able to recreate a 3D soundstage with other IEMs not be able to do the same with the SM3? The one thing that's different with the Earsonics though, they lack forward projection:
   

   
  Here's my humble take on the matter, I agree with those who've said (back in the SM3 threads) that soundstaging depends widely on the mix. But IMO forward projection is a feature of the headphone, not the mix. We don't need it when listening to music from stereo speakers, because speakers are already located in front of us. Yet listening to the same recordings from our headphones, most folks would desire some kind of forward projection (tricking the brain into believing that the source is in front of us) to recreate the same feeling we get from speakers or from a live venue. Just think of Ultrasone making millions off their S-Logic and you'll see what I mean.
   
  Well, there's one group of listeners that presumably don't want forward projection and that would be live musicians on stage, because they need to recreate the feeling of being among their fellow musicians. This is where Earsonics are coming from and I guess they simply didn't consider those different needs between professionals and non-professionals when they designed the SM3. Now that doesn't make the Earsonics bad IEMs at all, but IMO it is something to consider before deciding on these phones.
   
  I couldn't agree more with those who've said, (if possible) try before you buy the SM3.


----------



## Hero Kid

Quote: 





james444 said:


> [...] Well, there's one group of listeners that presumably don't want forward projection and that would be live musicians on stage [...]


 
   
  Plus me. I really love feeling a part of the music, rather than a listener. That said I can imagine how people would hate it.


----------



## Inks

Well my example of abstract painting was meant to explain it's polarization. You see, I can see people liking that intimate signature, I actually don't and was one of the reasons I disliked the RE262s. Therefore it's up to the listener to decide as we don't all see that same....


----------



## james444

I think I understood what you meant. I just don't see why there would be any special complexity to the SM3 or any dots that some can see and others can't. In my book they follow the same acoustic principles as any other IEMs. I've tried to explain their unusual spatial presentation and the way I see it leaves far less room for interpretation than an abstract painting. Of course that's just my 2c, no offense meant.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





james444 said:


> I think I understood what you meant. I just don't see why there would be any special complexity to the SM3 or any dots that some can see and others can't. In my book they follow the same acoustic principles as any other IEMs. I've tried to explain their unusual spatial presentation and the way I see it leaves far less room for interpretation than an abstract painting. Of course that's just my 2c, no offense meant.


 

 I thought the analogy involved the soundstage presentation but wasn't limited to it.  I never connected the dots or cared to so can't speak to what the entire prized picture looks like.  Also, if the point is to be part of the music as a musician wouldn't you want to swap channels as well?  Or is that just more crazy than being under the stage?


----------



## Inks

No offence taken, just misunderstood. Your opinion of them is pretty clear and helpful, making it clear that they won't be for me. .


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> I think the analogy pretty accurate. I am someone who sees those pictures through effort and not all the time. I know others who just see the picture with no effort and others who don't see it all or just can't be bothered. I think the SM3 is just like that and I fall into the work at camp with them but do have days where I do just get "it". I have considered selling them several times but do find they work well for alot of my needs so keep listening.
> 
> I also agree with others about there presentation being unique in placing a person in the middle but not always appropriate for all music. For some this would make the SM3 to expensive and inappropriate for their needs if their main music choices fall into those categories.
> 
> As for Joker's review I have no problem with it follows his methodology.


 

 Thanks for sharing, I guess it is closer than I actually thought (with a large enough sampling of people).  The SM3 will give some people enjoyment and others it won't; for those that enjoy it, great! 
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Autostereogram? Abstract painting? I don't think so. Why should anyone who's able to recreate a 3D soundstage with other IEMs not be able to do the same with the SM3? The one thing that's different with the Earsonics though, they lack forward projection:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Excellent post!  Only thing I would have to add is I do have some recordings that change the SM3 presentation to one of the other drawings, but not very many whereas other IEMs in the price range I have heard don't really change much with those tracks.
    
  Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> james444 said:
> ...


 

 My initial thoughts of the SM3 included seeing something, but it didn't come into full view until around 2 weeks later, with the initial problem being warmth and thickness.


----------



## shane55

"Under the stage..."
  Perfect analogy for all that it implies.


----------



## Bennyboy71

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> My initial thoughts of the SM3 included seeing something, but it didn't come into full view until around 2 weeks later, with the initial problem being warmth and thickness.


 


  I think the burn in concept with SM3 is fallacy, at least as far as the hardware goes.  That thinning of the warmth and thickness, that lifting of the veil over the upper mids, is more than likely just the ear and brain compensating over time to a new sound signature.  I remember thinking out of the box that they sounded pretty thick and muddy, and after a while that view changed to one of increased clarity, but I still had the nagging suspicion there was a thin blanket in front of some of the detailing,  What makes me think physical burn in is dubious is that when I decided to sell them, I sent them to Mark and he ultimately decided they were not for him and sent them back.  Trying them again, that veil seemed much more apparent to me than it was before I shipped them out - which I can only conclude was a result of psycho-acoustic burn-in rebooting itself.


----------



## playingwithfire

A couple questions for joker or anybody that can answer it after reading the review for DBA-02, if you don't mind.
   
  If the over ear comfort of Westone UM3x/Westone 3 is a 9.5, how would you rate the DBA?
   
  If the mid detail level of UM3x is a 9, how would you rate the DBA?
   
  If the soundstage size(just the size, not talking about location accuracy) of Westone 2 is an 8, how would you rate the DBA?
   
  Lastly, if the soundstage positioning of the Um3x is a 9, how would you rate the DBA?
   
  Thanks in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





playingwithfire said:


> A couple questions for joker or anybody that can answer it after reading the review for DBA-02, if you don't mind.
> 
> If the over ear comfort of Westone UM3x/Westone 3 is a 9.5, how would you rate the DBA?
> 
> ...


 


  Specific qualities like that are very difficult to quantify so accurately - I doubt anyone will be able to give you meaningful numbers.
   
  Comfort is very user-specific. I find the UM3X slightly more comfortable than the DBA-02 and the Westone 3 slightly less so. All three are pretty good in the grand scheme of things.
   
  Mid detail is high among all three but it's about how it's presented. The UM3X is softer with its detailing but more forward as well. I would say the DBA-02 makes detail a tad easier to discern on the whole, being clearer and quicker.
   
  Soundstage size is similar between the W2 and DBA-02 but the DBA-02 is a little more aggressive and a touch more forward than the W2 on the whole. 
   
  Positioning - I can't tell from memory. I didn't like the presentation of the UM3X very much but the positioning is good; it's good with the DBA-02, also. Can't say much more without a direct comparison.


----------



## chinesekiwi

so joker, I got some EQ7's atm but however I am rather tempted by the Audio Technica CK10? How would they compare?


----------



## rawrster

I may not be joker but I did once own them both at the same time. IMO they don't compare since they both sound quite different as the fit is also very different. The CK10 is the most comfortable earphone with possibly the best build quality in an earphone (tied with the CK100) and has a much smaller housing while the e-Q7 is much larger and has that nylon cloth cable under the Y split which I am no fan of.
   
  Sound wise while them both having similar bass quantity the e-Q7 has much better textured bass and a slight bass rumble. I can't remember which goes lower but they both had similar extension iirc but it has been a long time since I owned them. Midrange the e-Q7 is more forward and is more exciting with vocals esp with female vocals. The treble on the e-Q7 is slightly rolled off which is completely different than the CK10. The treble on the CK10 has much better extension and can be borderline sibilant and it did have sibilance until I decided to use Shure triflanges and then later on Monster triflanges so I didn't have to stretch the tips. There's also a good spike in the upper mids area in the CK10 which is why it can be borderline sibilant depending on how you handle treble. Also with cymbals such as the crash they do not sound very natural.
   
  The CK10 is flatter and the e-Q7 is a much safer earphone to own since I suspect more would enjoy the e-Q7 than the CK10. Sound stage the CK10 is pretty impressive and has very good imaging. The e-Q7 while being good did not quite have the same stage or imaging as the CK10. In terms of speed both are fast but I felt the CK10 was a hair faster and is definitely the fastest universals I've owned.
   
  I enjoyed them both while I had them but they do sound quite different from each other. The CK10 also is not cheap and last I checked it was a bit under $300 shipped from accessoryjack


----------



## soozieq

I demo'ed cn11's SM3's which were well burned in by the time I got them, and they sounded very warm (way too warm) from the start. And they didn't have enough treble sparkle for my own preferences. But they're like so many other phones, in that some people really like them, while others can't see what the fuss is all about. For me, they weren't bright enough to satsify my lust for sparkly treble, but I can see how people who have an intolerance to bright highs would love the smoothness overall, since they're very mellow and laid back, at least, that's how I heard them.
   
*rawrster,* I hated that nylon cable on the e-Q7. It was horribly rigid and annoyed the hell out of me. The fit was terrible for my ears, too big, and they would never stay put.


----------



## james444

I agree with most of what rawrster said about the CK10 vs. e-Q7. I have no fit issues with the Ortofons and prefer them because of their better timbre with voices and acoustic instruments. The CK10's timbre was a tad off to my ears (though not as badly as the CK100's). If you want to try a slightly less mid centric variant of the e-Q7 with better treble I'd go for the Final Audio FI-BA-A1. Or maybe the e-Q5, but that would only be a very small difference.


----------



## chinesekiwi

Ok thanks, that was good. I prefer bass texture and timbre over treble tbh (if I had to choose; I realise the limitations of any sort of BA tech in terms of timbre reproduction). Yeah the eq-7 cable is :/ tbh but something I can live with.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Monster Lil' Jamz & Dr. Dre Beats Tour
   
  @chinesekiwi: I agree with the other posters; if bass texture (or texture in general) and timbre are ahead of treble presence, speed, detail, etc on your priorities list, stick with the Ortofons.


----------



## average_joe

Geez |jolker|, you have created a masterpiece!  Amazing!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Geez |joker|, you have created a masterpiece!  Amazing!


 

 Or a monster, depending on how you look at it


----------



## Jackquelegs

Oh man I completely agree with the Beats Tour review. I bought a pair out of interest..and returned it a week later due to the harsh treble. Almost made listening without EQ impossible.


----------



## jason2087

Still interested to see where HF5 places compared to ER4P in your standings  since HF5 is cheaper it could place higher on the chart than the ER4P due to value, the sound is similar to ER4P. I didn't wait for the review I purchased them anyway, but I'd still like to see where you place them. I see you have it on your list along with MC5 to be reviewed.


----------



## JudgeDreadLocks

I don't know if you're taking requests, but if you could get your hands on a pair of skullcandy ASYMs, I'd like to see how they stack up against the rest of the skullcandy iems you've reviewed.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Joker, have you ever auditioned any other klipsch models? Like x5 and x10? they look very comfortable for sure.


----------



## rawrster

The X5/X10 may look comfortable but those strain reliefs and over the ear fit looks like an absolute nightmare there. Microphonics can't be good on those models.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jason2087 said:


> Still interested to see where HF5 places compared to ER4P in your standings  since HF5 is cheaper it could place higher on the chart than the ER4P due to value, the sound is similar to ER4P. I didn't wait for the review I purchased them anyway, but I'd still like to see where you place them. I see you have it on your list along with MC5 to be reviewed.


 


  The 'value' rating doesn't factor into the chart in any way so there's really no way the HF5 can place higher than the ER4S (ER4P isn't on the chart). I do quite like the HF5 but I've been waiting to get my custom tips for them before finalizing & posting the review.


  Quote: 





judgedreadlocks said:


> I don't know if you're taking requests, but if you could get your hands on a pair of skullcandy ASYMs, I'd like to see how they stack up against the rest of the skullcandy iems you've reviewed.


 
   
  I've actually heard the Asym briefly and aside from the comfortable form factor it didn't wow me. I'd say it's unlikely that I'll pick one up for review.


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Joker, have you ever auditioned any other klipsch models? Like x5 and x10? they look very comfortable for sure.


 

  Nope - never got the chance. I did pick up the new S3, which I regret.


----------



## paulypaul

Quote: 





			
				Angelopsaro said:
			
		

> /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Joker, have you ever auditioned any other klipsch models? Like x5 and x10? they look very comfortable for sure.


 


 Ive had the X5 for and they are quite comfortable, deep insertion and great isolation (a little dangerous if wearing when driving or walking were there are a lot cars).
  They are a little more microphonic than the RE0s and the strain relief is very thin and prone to  cracking.
  For a BA I feel they are a level above the PL50s, but I prefer dynamic drivers now so would not put them above the RE0 or RE-ZEROs.
  They do have a bit more bass quantity than the REs, but the REs bass has more impact and the RE0s definitely extend further in the highs.


----------



## kendric

Joker, just curious, If you must comment on the differences between Regular Jamz and Lil Jamz, how would it be and which would you prefer of the two? x)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kendric said:


> Joker, just curious, If you must comment on the differences between Regular Jamz and Lil Jamz, how would it be and which would you prefer of the two? x)


 

 To be honest I'm not sure why Monster decided to put the Jamz and Lil' Jamz in the same model line. Aside from cosmetics, they are totally different. The Jamz are more like a Turbine Light - not as extended or detailed but smooth, warm, and generally pleasant. The Lil' Jamz are bright, balanced, and a bit fatiguing. They are more like the Dre Beats Tour than the Jamz or Turbine line. I like the Jamz better than the Lil' Jamz but prefer both to the Dre Beats Tour and still rank the original Turbine highest among the <$150 Monster models.


----------



## kendric

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Phew.. Thought seems i think the same as you, Though i haven heard much of the Original Turbines (despite having an MD), Yup among the three is Jamz > Lil Jamz > Beats Tour for me. Hmm was thinking of buying Original Turbines as a gift to a couple of my friend for their coming birthday, I think its quite the step-up for their stock-buds, how you think about this? Joker?


----------



## tuahogary

Hi Joker, of all the IEMs you've heard or reviewed, what would you recommend to be a good upgrade for my Westone 2s? I'm wanting to retain it's signature while looking for improvements in overall SQ especially bass extension / depth and timbre. Mids are still my focal point tho. Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kendric said:


> Phew.. Thought seems i think the same as you, Though i haven heard much of the Original Turbines (despite having an MD), Yup among the three is Jamz > Lil Jamz > Beats Tour for me. Hmm was thinking of buying Original Turbines as a gift to a couple of my friend for their coming birthday, I think its quite the step-up for their stock-buds, how you think about this? Joker?


 
 Turbines are as good a gift as any; they're certainly packaged well enough for it.
   

 Quote:


tuahogary said:


> Hi Joker, of all the IEMs you've heard or reviewed, what would you recommend to be a good upgrade for my Westone 2s? I'm wanting to retain it's signature while looking for improvements in overall SQ especially bass extension / depth and timbre. Mids are still my focal point tho. Thanks


 
 In the universal world the W2 is pretty close to top-tier. For something with a bit more depth and still some focus on mids you'd probably be looking at either the UM3X/SM3 or one of the low/mid-focused dynamics - Monster MD or Radius DDM - or a custom.


----------



## Carson Dyle

Joke, enjoy your reviews.  Thanks.
   
  Could you be persuaded to include the review date for each?  It would help a lot to put things into perspective, as it seems that IEMs continue to improve at the various price tiers.  Also, it can be tough for the reader knowing that some the earphones have gone through several distinct generations and sometimes all there is to go on is the photo posted.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





carson dyle said:


> Joke, enjoy your reviews.  Thanks.
> 
> Could you be persuaded to include the review date for each?  It would help a lot to put things into perspective, as it seems that IEMs continue to improve at the various price tiers.  Also, it can be tough for the reader knowing that some the earphones have gone through several distinct generations and sometimes all there is to go on is the photo posted.


 

 The reviews are added to each tier in chronological order and are approximately evenly spaced in the lower tiers between the start of the thread (~November 2009 for the original version of it) and now. That would mean that something like #3A3 would have been added about a year ago while #3A30 would only be 3-4 months old and #3A40 would be one of the most recent additions. I've always taken the review dates off to keep the table of contents clutter-free but I can leave them up or add them to the review itself if that would help anyone out. I guess I'd need to do some work with the google cache of this page to figure out all of  the dates. 
   
  As for revisions, there are only a couple of earphones I can think of for which that may be an issue, and I usually mention which revision I am working with somewhere in the review. For cheaper stuff like the Meelec earphones I always leave the latest version's review up since older sets get dropped out of production almost immediately.


----------



## JxK

Joker, as a suggestion to the review, for newer reviews perhaps you could put up a hiss rating? I wouldn't ask you to go and add something like that to all your old reviews (waaay too much work) but for newer reviews it might be a good idea? Usually specs, ie. sensitivity and impedance, are enough to give you a good idea of the hiss; but on occasion they can be misleading. So I'd say that a hiss rating would definitely be helpful, especially for people who don't typically amp their phones.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> To be honest I'm not sure why Monster decided to put the Jamz and Lil' Jamz in the same model line. Aside from cosmetics, they are totally different. The Jamz are more like a Turbine Light - not as extended or detailed but smooth, warm, and generally pleasant. The Lil' Jamz are bright, balanced, and a bit fatiguing. They are more like the Dre Beats Tour than the Jamz or Turbine line. I like the Jamz better than the Lil' Jamz but prefer both to the Dre Beats Tour and still rank the original Turbine highest among the <$150 Monster models.


 


  I would very much agree with this based on what I heard in store via my D2.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

*CK-10 IMPRESSIONS:*
   
  Well, I have been listening to |joker|'s CK-10 for a couple of days, and while they are very enjoyable I hate to say that I don't like them as much as he does.  
   
  I do like the feel of the tangle-free cable, and they feel solidly built.  Because of their shape, I can only get a good seal with them wearing them with the cable over my ears.  And wearing them that way means practically no cable microphonics.  The CK-10 are engaging sounding and they don't need to be amped to enjoy them, but pairing them with my Pico Slim is still an upgrade over listening un-amped.
   
  However, when I turn up the CK-10 playback levels to volume match the bass and mids to my UM3X, the CK-10 treble becomes too forward/boosted for my tastes.  Fortunately it's in the 8K-10K or higher range, so there is little sibilance boosting in most music but it's an issue with some tracks.  It's not so much of a "hot" sounding treble, but rather just a forward sounding treble.  The CK-10 may have a similar frequency response to my RE-252 or my old Phonak PFE, but the CK-10 are a bit smoother and more organic/liquid sounding than the RS-252 (and maybe a little warmer too).  I need to do more comparisons than the brief ones I've done, but both of these IEM are more engaging than the new RS-262, which are less aggressive sounding than the RE-252, but which when unamped can sound a little bland vs the RE-252 or CK-10.  The CK-10 bass is good without boost or weakness, but it's not as strong as my UM3X.   The CK-10 have good detail and speed, but I feel that my UM3X still sound more transparent and disappear better.  So, I do like the CK-10, but I don't see them filling a gap in my collection.  
   
  In my case I would pick the UM3X over the CK-10, which themselves are surpassed by the new W4 that I'm reviewing.


----------



## Bennyboy71

252 is not more engaging than the 262.


----------



## Bakkasan

Terrifyingly awesome reviews!!


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> *CK-10 IMPRESSIONS:*
> 
> Well, I have been listening to |joker|'s CK-10 for a couple of days, and while they are very enjoyable I hate to say that I don't like them as much as he does.
> 
> ...


 

 I'm not surprised.The treble you are experiencing is what makes many people hate the CK10 and I think the CK10 fits a specific group that is not very popular here so more people would hate them than like them. I consider them my favorite set of universals and if I was ever to purchase a universal twice the CK10 would be it.


----------



## Bennyboy71

Indeed - the Trebleheads are a vocal sect that worship the CK10, much to the bafflement of normal humans like myself who have tried them, only for blood to start trickling out their eyes and nostrils. .  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## tuahogary

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> In my case I would pick the UM3X over the CK-10, which themselves are surpassed by the new W4 that I'm reviewing.


 






 You have them in your hands right now?? I hope they genuinely sound better than the UM3x! Can you post some first impressions here and maybe a review in the future?


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





bennyboy71 said:


> Indeed - the Trebleheads are a vocal sect that worship the CK10, much to the bafflement of normal humans like myself who have tried them, only for blood to start trickling out their eyes and nostrils. .


 


  QFT


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

tuahogary said:


> You have them in your hands right now?? I hope they genuinely sound better than the UM3x! Can you post some first impressions here and maybe a review in the future?





 


I clearly said I'm reviewing them. See the W4 thread FlavioT started too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jxk said:


> Joker, as a suggestion to the review, for newer reviews perhaps you could put up a hiss rating? I wouldn't ask you to go and add something like that to all your old reviews (waaay too much work) but for newer reviews it might be a good idea? Usually specs, ie. sensitivity and impedance, are enough to give you a good idea of the hiss; but on occasion they can be misleading. So I'd say that a hiss rating would definitely be helpful, especially for people who don't typically amp their phones.


 
 I think there is a certain inherent variability with a 'hiss' rating since hiss is a) extremely source-dependent  b) not a problem for the vast majority of in-ears with portable sources at listening volume and  c) listener-dependent. A setup that hisses like a snake to my ears may be 'almost silent' for someone else (reaching back into the old Amp3Pro2 threads here). If hiss is a problem I try to mention it at the end of the sound section but I think a separate rating would be overkill.
   

 Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> *CK-10 IMPRESSIONS:*
> 
> Well, I have been listening to |joker|'s CK-10 for a couple of days, and while they are very enjoyable I hate to say that I don't like them as much as he does.
> 
> [...]


 
 Thanks for the impressions. I figured you'd have something like that to say since I know your POV when it comes to the DBA-02 as well as the W1/W2/W3/UM3X. Either way it's always nice to try a new sound signature, even if it is bound to be mildly offensive to someone who loves Westone products 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

 Quote:


bakkasan said:


> Terrifyingly awesome reviews!!


 
 Thanks!


----------



## Caze

Damn you Head-Fi and these wonderful reviews!
  When I first registered the FOTM was the Nuforce NE-7M which suited my price range perfectly and I ended up buying them. I still love them but I've now started to crave after something slightly better. Thanks to these reviews (damn you) I've now ended up ordering both the Fischer Audio Eterna v1 AND Sunrise SW-Xcape. That may not sound much to you but for my student wallet, that's a lot of money and now that new harddrive and wireless router will have to wait.
  I'll hopefully end up selling one of them so I pray to god I don't get attached to both of them, otherwise my wallet won't talk to me until next spring.
   
  So thanks |joker| and everyone else here on Head-Fi for being there to ruin our economy!


----------



## esanthosh

Don't worry! It's a temporary phase. You'll get over it when you burn a hole in your wallet with some top-tiers and crave for customs (head-fi and ljokerl will still be "thanked" though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## mootookang

Quote: 





caze said:


> So thanks |joker| and everyone else here on Head-Fi for being there to ruin our economy!


 
   
  I use Joker's thread as a guide line to learn whether a budget phone is worth trying or not, so it probably save me hundreds of dollars from the frequent deals posted on headfi.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





caze said:


> So thanks |joker| and everyone else here on Head-Fi for being there to ruin our economy!


 

 I beg to differ. Actually by spending more money it stimulates the economy and thus makes out economy better so the moral of the story is to buy buy buy 
   
  @HeadphoneAddict: I figured you would get your hands on the W4 pretty soon. It helps that you live so close to where Westone is located and have almost every Westone earphone


----------



## akacoke

awsome reviews. its a masterpiece.


----------



## battleaxe

I think what caze means to say is it bad for his personal economy, and great for the general economy. Lol. I know if I wasn't that particular with my headphones and the deals were better in store I'd have a few phones right now, and an empty wallet. 
   
  In store I was pretty sold on the Jamz(the lil jamz were not powerful enough), and kind of kicking myself for not moving on the great deal Amazon had with the Turbines, but I got fooled by a used Turbine Pro Gold at a good price on Amazon(could have been a scam, but who knows).


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> headphoneaddict said:
> ...


 

 I agree completely, it's good to try different things as some will just surprise you, and it's still good to be familiar with what's out there even if you don't like it (the generic "you", as in people in general).  
   
  What can't be denied is the CK-10's large treble peak, which is easily seen on the oscilloscope during frequency sweeps (don't ask, I can't tell).  While my hearing is gone by 16Khz I don't need any help with the treble below 12Khz, and in longer listening sessions the CK-10 start to become fatiguing with some amps (D4, Pico Slim, Protector, SR-71b, HDP).  They are actually an excellent match for either of my Nuforce uDACs and my ALO amphora amp, and if I hadn't tried them with the other DAC/amps I'd be singing much higher praise for them.  As for the DBA-02, I did think they were very good, it's just that the W2 had a similar sound with slightly better warmth and soundstage which put them ahead of the DBA-02 for me.  Going from memory, the CK-10 still have a smoother and warmer sound signature than the DBA-02, and I might pick the CK-10 over the DBA-02 as well.
   
  Anyway, thanks VERY much for the CK-10 loan and I should be able to mail them back the day after tomorrow, since I'm under the weather after dental work this afternoon.  Is the shipping address the same as when I sent you the W3 before?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


akacoke said:


> awsome reviews. its a masterpiece.


 
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   

 Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> Anyway, thanks VERY much for the CK-10 loan and I should be able to mail them back the day after tomorrow, since I'm under the weather after dental work this afternoon.  Is the shipping address the same as when I sent you the W3 before?


 

  Yep, same address is fine. No rush - I've been without them for about 4 months, a few more days won't hurt.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Xears Bullet XB120PRO and updated the Meelectronics R1 review with impressions of the current revision. Also added review dates for each entry, as requested.


----------



## tuahogary

Quote: 





> Multi-IEM Review - 131 IEMs compared (Xears XB120PRO & MEElec R1 rev2 added *01/08*)


 
   
  I *knew* it Joker! You are a time traveller!


----------



## esanthosh

Good review (as usual) on the XB120. Even though they are not my most favorite Xears, you can't go wrong with these at the price point. Wish you can review the TD100-II as well, but they are sold out already.
   
  Is it possible to review TF10 once your pending reviews are over? I am eagerly (and patiently) waiting for it.


----------



## rawrster

Nice review on the Xears Bullet. I liked them except for their stupid J cord and driver flex.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


tuahogary said:


> I *knew* it Joker! You are a time traveller!


   
  Month/day 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Except for early January it doesn't make sense for me to put a year since I do these updates every 1-2 weeks
  
   
  Quote:


esanthosh said:


> Good review (as usual) on the XB120. Even though they are not my most favorite Xears, you can't go wrong with these at the price point. Wish you can review the TD100-II as well, but they are sold out already.
> 
> Is it possible to review TF10 once your pending reviews are over? I am eagerly (and patiently) waiting for it.


 
 Thanks and yeah, the price is absurdly low - when jant71 told me that he paid $25 for an earphone that could compete with the brainwavz M2, I didn't believe him.
   
  The TF10 review is waiting for me to finish up with stuff that's on a timer - currently the NE-700X from Nuforce and a few cans for the Portable thread. After that, assuming nothing new comes up, I'll get right on it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I just got the UE500 yesterday but - surprise, surprise - UE still can't do mid-range dynamics as well as Brainwavz/Fischer/ECCI/etc. 
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Nice review on the Xears Bullet. I liked them except for their stupid J cord and driver flex.


 
 Thanks. I guess there will always be those who are looking for the j-cord specifically and then they'll be limited to either Xears or some outdated garbage from the mainstream brands.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The TF10 review is waiting for me to finish up with stuff that's on a timer - currently the NE-700X from Nuforce and a few cans for the Portable thread. After that, assuming nothing new comes up, I'll get right on it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 you sound surprised when you say that, UE dont do mids and none of the new UE stuff tops their older stuff (not that ive heard the 500 though)


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





> The TF10 review is waiting for me to finish up with stuff that's on a timer - currently the NE-700X from Nuforce and a few cans for the Portable thread. After that, assuming nothing new comes up, I'll get right on it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Oh good.  I was just about to point out the complete lack of Shure and UE headphones on this list as those are pretty popular headphones.  Glad to hear at least UE is getting some coverage soon.


----------



## kjk1281

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> tuahogary said:
> ...


 

 I think tuahogary was trying to point out that yesterday was *01/05*, not 01/08. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Anyway, I do look forward to your review of the TF10 as it will ultimately determine my IEM upgrade/side-grade path.  Probably the end of the road for me as I'm actually pretty content with what I have; the Sennheiser IEs are just too expensive and customs never interested me.  I'll continue to waste countless dollars on populating my cheapie collection (CX21 please!) and I may start building a full-size rig.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kjk1281* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I think tuahogary was trying to point out that yesterday was *01/05*, not 01/08.
> 
> ...


 

 Ah, right you are. I still have the December calendar open so Wedneday was the 8th ><. Fixed.
   
  How 'bout venturing into the ~$80 range? $60-100 holds some of my favorite earphones and none of them are by Sennheiser


----------



## idvsego

like the eternas...which I cant seem to find anywhere...sigh.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> How 'bout venturing into the ~$80 range? $60-100 holds some of my favorite earphones and none of them are by Sennheiser


 

 Agreed.  Its a great time for IEMs in this bracket.  Noone should want for good sound these days.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Second your thoughts regarding the CK10's here. They don't appeal to everyone or even many people but for some, this guy included, they are without question my favorite universal. Even after getting my JH5's which I do find all around superior, I just can't bring myself to sell the CK10's. I really could be happy with those forever and as a result just can't let them go. They are just such "perfect" sounding device to these ears and tastes. 
   
  I agree with your take on the bass as well Headphone Addict, when I compared the CK10's and UM3X's I found the same thing.
   
  Can't wait to hear your take on the W4's by the way. I was a bit let down by the W3's but the UM3X's really did redeem Westone in my eyes. Those iem's were just a tiny bit behind the CK10's in my eyes which is a huge accomplishment.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





solidsnake3 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I posted my first impressions of the W4 in FlavioT's W4 thread.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Nice impressions, very interesting universal to say the least. They seem to be a nice blend between the UM3X and the W3 although for the price I think an entry level custom might be a better option. The lack of replaceable cables, like others have noted, is a bit of a bummer though especially for the price.


----------



## NimbleRabit

Since you've clearly listened to so many IEM's, and I found your thread to be very helpful last time I was looking for a pair, I figure I'll go ahead and ask your thoughts.  I've had some PL50's for a while now that I love, and they just broke.  I'm deciding whether or not to get some new PL50's or get something a little bit nicer (my range is about $150); do you think any of the IEM's in that range would be noticeably better than a PL50, and something that a PL50 lover would love?  Any recommendations?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nimblerabit said:


> Since you've clearly listened to so many IEM's, and I found your thread to be very helpful last time I was looking for a pair, I figure I'll go ahead and ask your thoughts.  I've had some PL50's for a while now that I love, and they just broke.  I'm deciding whether or not to get some new PL50's or get something a little bit nicer (my range is about $150); do you think any of the IEM's in that range would be noticeably better than a PL50, and something that a PL50 lover would love?  Any recommendations?


 

 In terms of similarity to the PL50 - the Westone 1, but it's not a huge step up and can be quite pricy. Other than that, the Klipsch Custom 3 or maybe used W2.


----------



## the Red Eft

This is an incredibly useful thread.  Thanks so much to the OP/maintainer.
   
  All I can contribute is to point out that post #7 currently calls Ortofon a Japanese firm, when it is in fact Danish.


----------



## rawrster

Mike, thanks for this wonderful thread and it definitely is a great piece of work you have here. I had a friend ask me about some suggestions for a pair of earphones around $75 since he was tired of his skullcandy products breaking (he had around 5 or so broken ones in his desk drawer). I pointed him to this thread and my work is done  This is a fantastic resource. If this existed when I started my wallet would indeed be a lot lighter.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





the red eft said:


> This is an incredibly useful thread.  Thanks so much to the OP/maintainer.
> 
> All I can contribute is to point out that post #7 currently calls Ortofon a Japanese firm, when it is in fact Danish.


 
   
  I was under the impression that the e-Q7 was developed specifically by Ortofon Japan but I'll definitely change it to avoid confusion. Thanks.
   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Mike, thanks for this wonderful thread and it definitely is a great piece of work you have here. I had a friend ask me about some suggestions for a pair of earphones around $75 since he was tired of his skullcandy products breaking (he had around 5 or so broken ones in his desk drawer). I pointed him to this thread and my work is done  This is a fantastic resource. If this existed when I started my wallet would indeed be a lot lighter.


 

 You know, that was originally the intent - to cut down on the number of suggestion threads out on the forum. I guess it hasn't helped all that much but at least there's less of an excuse for those who post without doing an ounce of research. The original plan was to cover earphones that ClieOS missed or couldn't get hold of, since those were usually the ones people were most confused about, but I guess that sort of spiraled out of control now.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> If this existed when I started my wallet would indeed be a lot lighter.


 

 Not so sure about that!
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I've owned a few of them and been able to sample a bunch more because of Mike and this thread! Thanks!


----------



## NimbleRabit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for the advice.  As always I went and did quite a bit of research afterwards on the models you mentioned (as well as some you didn't), and damn the W2 sounds like something I would love.  I think I might end up pulling the trigger on some, wallet be damned.


----------



## tan1415

Hi joker,
   
  This is one of teh best threads I have read anywhere. Incredbible. Keep it up.
   
  Anyway you gave me good insights on brands/models i have never considered. Like the meelectronic, Nuforce etc. 
   
  What i wanted to ask...if u listen to music from an ipod/smartphone...is buying a Qjays for 130$ worth it? If not.Whats a good budget for this setup?
   
  When using the Smartphone...will use an handfsree adapter to connect phone.


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> What i wanted to ask...if u listen to music from an ipod/smartphone...is buying a Qjays for 130$ worth it? If not.Whats a good budget for this setup?
> 
> When using the Smartphone...will use an handfsree adapter to connect phone.


 
   

 [size=medium]I listen direct from my iPod Classic and Blackberry Curve, and the difference between good and great IEMs is quite impressive. That said, I hear only small differences between the Fischer DBA-02's and Sunrise Xcapes (same would likely be true for the similar Head-Direct RE-Zeros). But I always find myself going back to the DBA's.​[/size]


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


nimblerabit said:


> Thanks for the advice.  As always I went and did quite a bit of research afterwards on the models you mentioned (as well as some you didn't), and damn the W2 sounds like something I would love.  I think I might end up pulling the trigger on some, wallet be damned.


 
  
  Such is the curse of Head-Fi...
   
   
  Quote:


tan1415 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> This is one of teh best threads I have read anywhere. Incredbible. Keep it up.
> 
> ...


 

  I'd say that as long as your phone doesn't have a serious output flaw (for example my Nokia E63 hissed like a snake with anything more efficient than an RE0), it's worth it, especially if you are just moving out of stock buds.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





the red eft said:


> This is an incredibly useful thread.  Thanks so much to the OP/maintainer.
> 
> All I can contribute is to point out that post #7 currently calls Ortofon a Japanese firm, when it is in fact Danish.


 

 Otofon is Danish but the EQ5/7 is a product of Ortofon Japan to my knowledge.


----------



## musedesign

Hi Joker,
    Thank you for your great work! 
   
  I did a search, with no luck, did you put togther a review of the Etymotics HF3 ?  If not where do you think they would fall on your IEM matrix?  Above the Westone 3 ? (average score 8.6).
   
  Thanks!
   
  -Mark


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





musedesign said:


> Hi Joker,
> Thank you for your great work!
> 
> I did a search, with no luck, did you put togther a review of the Etymotics HF3 ?  If not where do you think they would fall on your IEM matrix?  Above the Westone 3 ? (average score 8.6).


 


  I have not posted a review of the Etymotic MC5 or HF3 yet (they are on the to-do list, if you look at the bottom of post #8) as I am still waiting on my ACS custom tips for the earphones. I can tell you that while the HF3 won't quite beat the ER4S or W3 in SQ, it will come very close to an 8.6 average score due to the high isolation and great all-around usability.


----------



## musedesign

Joker,
   
  Thanks! 
   
  -Mark


----------



## the Red Eft

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Ah, even more info for me. 
   
  I bought MEE-M6s on seeing that they're now available for around $20 at Amazon and Overstock, just a few dollars more than the M9.  Have them in for the first time now.  Thanks again.


----------



## EternalEmpire

I bought the ViSang R02 based on this guide, but I was kind of disappointed by them. I don't know if I got a faulty model or something, but they have this really 'cheap' sound to them, I can't quite put my finger on what it is though. Everything sounds fine but there's a sort of 'flatness' to them, it isn't so much a problem with the bass, but the mids and highs sort of sound 'clustered' together (though the highs don't seem all that present at all) and the seperation between instruments seems to be somewhat absent. I'm still fairly inexperienced at this so I probably explained what I was trying to say quite badly there, sorry.
   
  Edit: I forgot to mention, I find the vocal presentation to be very sub-par. When compared to my AKG K240 (while it may not be a fair comparison), they just sound 'empty'.


----------



## vilasn

Has anybody tried Yuin PK1 EARBUDS, or do we have such thread on head-fi for earbuds?
   
  Thanks.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/531063/quick-guide-comparison-and-ranks-top-10-earbuds
   
  Search for yuin pk1 reviews, there are a few reviews.
  Quote: 





vilasn said:


> Has anybody tried Yuin PK1 EARBUDS, or do we have such thread on head-fi for earbuds?
> 
> Thanks.


----------



## lorafenik

hmm, recently when I had similar experience the problem lied in bad connection - the jack "hole" was damaged

  


eternalempire said:


> I bought the ViSang R02 based on this guide, but I was kind of disappointed by them. I don't know if I got a faulty model or something, but they have this really 'cheap' sound to them, I can't quite put my finger on what it is though. Everything sounds fine but there's a sort of 'flatness' to them, it isn't so much a problem with the bass, but the mids and highs sort of sound 'clustered' together (though the highs don't seem all that present at all) and the seperation between instruments seems to be somewhat absent. I'm still fairly inexperienced at this so I probably explained what I was trying to say quite badly there, sorry.
> 
> Edit: I forgot to mention, I find the vocal presentation to be very sub-par. When compared to my AKG K240 (while it may not be a fair comparison), they just sound 'empty'.


----------



## SKJohnson

Joker,
   
  I just wanted to let you know that this thread is an amazing accomplishment and you have my sincere thanks.
   
  On the subject of cutting down on recommendations-type threads, it might help if there was an option to sticky this thread at the top of the Earphohnes forum. As my post count of one would indicate, I _am _new here so maybe I missed something, but is it not possible to do that?
   
  Aside from that, I was hoping you might provide some clarification to help a bit further in my IEM choice. Based on where I live (Toronto) I have the option to purchase the following at a mostly reasonable price:
   
  $150 - JAYS q-Jays
  $195 - SHURE SE315
  $185 - Etymotic hf2/3
  $230 - Klipsch Image X5
   
  Were I to go from what's on your summation chart, it looks as if I might like the q-Jays quite a bit. Comfort is great, sound quality is pretty great, there are plenty of accessories to help me get the right fit and it's damn small. The thing is, I didn't notice any of my other options on your chart, so I'm wondering if you may have used any of the others? I noticed that the hf3 was on your to do list, for instance.
   
  If it matters, I'm going to be pairing these with both a 2nd gen. Zune 4GB and an HTC HD7 phone.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





skjohnson said:


> Joker,
> 
> I just wanted to let you know that this thread is an amazing accomplishment and you have my sincere thanks.
> 
> ...


 

 That price for the X5 is really high for a street price here in the US.  It still loses out at $100 less then what you list IMO.  $200 for Shure 315s seem a lot as well when you should be able to do better for that price.  I'd zero in on the Qjays or Etys if I had to pick from your list.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


eternalempire said:


> I bought the ViSang R02 based on this guide, but I was kind of disappointed by them. I don't know if I got a faulty model or something, but they have this really 'cheap' sound to them, I can't quite put my finger on what it is though. Everything sounds fine but there's a sort of 'flatness' to them, it isn't so much a problem with the bass, but the mids and highs sort of sound 'clustered' together (though the highs don't seem all that present at all) and the seperation between instruments seems to be somewhat absent. I'm still fairly inexperienced at this so I probably explained what I was trying to say quite badly there, sorry.
> 
> Edit: I forgot to mention, I find the vocal presentation to be very sub-par. When compared to my AKG K240 (while it may not be a fair comparison), they just sound 'empty'.


   
  I really don't know what to say - perhaps next to the K240 the R02 does sound cheap (I wouldn't know) but without hearing them I can't tell you if they are defective or not.
  
   
  Quote:


skjohnson said:


> Joker,
> 
> I just wanted to let you know that this thread is an amazing accomplishment and you have my sincere thanks.
> 
> ...


 
 I think the sticky subject would have to be pursued by a site moderator or admin but they don't really pay much attention to the portable forum.
   
  Regarding your list, I have not heard the SE315 (unless it's exactly the same as the 310 and in that case I wasn't impressed) or the X5. That seems like a good price for the q-JAYS - they are a little more 'fun' than the HF2/3 albeit slightly less isolating. If they're coming up cheaper for you  with full warranty I'd say go for it.


----------



## EternalEmpire

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I really don't know what to say - perhaps next to the K240 the R02 does sound cheap (I wouldn't know) but without hearing them I can't tell you if they are defective or not.


 

  
  I know the 'burn in' concept is somewhat controversial around here, but I guess the sound I'm hearing could improve and the problem is that they haven't seen much use yet. I'll try them out further, they might improve. I bought the MEElectronics M6 based on this guide also and was quite pleased with them, their performance was best with electronic genres and didn't sound as good when listening to rock or metal, but they were a good IEM overall. Ultimately my M6 met their demise when I tried to cut out the memory wire and severed the cable in the process, I guess my knife-work was a little heavy handed. They didn't break instantly but they didn't last very long afterwards sadly.


----------



## SKJohnson

*Anaxilus*, I hear you on the high price for the X5, which is why I said mostly. As for the other prices, I thought those were okay for my area. Short of driving across the border to Buffalo, I'm unfortunately at the mercy of sellers up here in Canada. I do feel good about the q-Jays though, as the two things I'm most concerned about (sound and comfort) are highly rated by Joker. I'll do a bit more searching to try and find other local vendors with relatively reasonable prices, but I don't really see it getting much better.
   
*Joker*, thank you for weighing in on my question. I must admit I had been leaning towards the q-Jays based on the high rating and relatively low price. If the sound isolation difference that between the q-Jays and the HF2 is as slight as you mentioned, that I'll definitely be picking up the q-Jays. Thanks again for your time and efforts overall.


----------



## jjmai

I was reading the R1 rev2 review and saw "*Update (01/11)*", and I was saying to myself, "wow, what happen to the R1 to make it deserve such a low score of 1 out of 11?"
  It's late... I must be sleepy....


----------



## the Red Eft

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> I was reading the R1 rev2 review and saw "*Update (01/11)*", and I was saying to myself, "wow, what happen to the R1 to make it deserve such a low score of 1 out of 11?"
> It's late... I must be sleepy....


 


  "These go to 11"


----------



## Pianist

Hey Joker. I am wondering why you rate CK10 and DBA-02 above the e-Q7 and RE262. What makes the dual armatures superior in your opinion?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


pianist said:


> Hey Joker. I am wondering why you rate CK10 and DBA-02 above the e-Q7 and RE262. What makes the dual armatures superior in your opinion?


 

  Inherently - nothing. There are plenty of dual armatures I consider inferior to the 262 or e-Q7. The Ortofons and RE262 both have a do-no-wrong type of sound which, while pleasant, never really clicked for me (I like the RE262 better than the e-Q7 personally).


----------



## yifu

Sound is always a subjective thing so YMMV. Also dual armatures are not always better technically than dynamic or singe BA based IEMs. The Apple in ear earphones have 2 balanced armatures  but loses to single driver heavyweights like the RE0 or the ER4. The number of drivers doesnt decide its performance. But one thing that's consistent (i find) is that a multiple BA based IEM would nearly always be better at potraying complex music like large scale classical works than single ones.
  
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> Hey Joker. I am wondering why you rate CK10 and DBA-02 above the e-Q7 and RE262. What makes the dual armatures superior in your opinion?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





yifu said:


> Sound is always a subjective thing so YMMV. Also dual armatures are not always better technically than dynamic or singe BA based IEMs. The Apple in ear earphones have 2 balanced armatures  but loses to single driver heavyweights like the RE0 or the ER4. The number of drivers doesnt decide its performance. But one thing that's consistent (i find) is that a multiple BA based IEM would nearly always be better at potraying complex music like large scale classical works than single ones.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 

 Well a lot of times duals seem to provide a more coherent sound than triples as well.  Headfonia had a mention about that in their review of dual BAs and it lines up what I've heard as well as others.  In fact, the only phone I have heard that I like better than my DBA is the ES5 and possibly the IERM.  I would need more time side by side to know for sure about the latter.


----------



## Bennyboy71

Have never tried the DBA-02s, but have owned the CK10, e-Q7s and currently own the RE262.
   
  I place the 262s ahead of the CK10 and e-Q7s by some margin.  They just seem to be so bloody musical and 'right;' sounding across all the spectrum, whereas the Ortofons suffered by lack of treble and constrained soundstage and the CK10s were so treble-heavy I couldn't get on with them.  Fit wise too, the 262s trump the other 2, especially the CK10s, which made mincemeat of my ears.

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> pianist said:
> ...


----------



## wendell c

Thanks so much for this thread,  with so many IEM available it makes it really difficult to choose one especially when you can't hear them all.  After reading the reviews offered I was looking to get some DBA-02 except I could not find any.  I went and got the Panasonic HJE900 from the trade section.  I am enjoying these headphones a lot.  They sound great with the music I've thrown at it, jazz, r&b, classic rock, and even some old school hip hop. 
   
  I am loving the fast hitting bass on this thing,  I do notice that the mids are a little recessed but I've eq'd it a bit to my liking, noticing some sibilance on some tracks but not really bothering me.  I am using sony hybrids with it and will try the foam tips as others have recommended.
   
  I am still curious about the DBA-02, am I missing a lot with the Panasonics? 
   
  What would be a worthy upgrade from the Panasonics?


----------



## NimbleRabit

Quote: 





> *(3B2) MEElectronics Ai-M9 / M9*
> 
> 
> Microphonics *(4/5)* – Low when worn cable down; nonexistent otherwise


 
  This seems either very misleading or wrong to me unless I just have a faulty pair of M9's.  Or perhaps the iPhone compatible model has more microphonics?  I don't know, but whatever it is, my M9's have what I consider to be quite a bit of microphonics, at least much closer to a 3 than a 4/5 since I would consider 4/5 to be very good.  Do you know if they've changed the M9 at all (I got mine a while ago) or anything? Because I sorta can't believe you would give these things such a high microphonics rating based on what I hear out of them.


----------



## rawrster

Well if you got them a while ago then you probably have the previous version.
   
  I had the most recent M9 for a couple of months and there wasn't much microphonics at all.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


wendell c said:


> Thanks so much for this thread,  with so many IEM available it makes it really difficult to choose one especially when you can't hear them all.  After reading the reviews offered I was looking to get some DBA-02 except I could not find any.  I went and got the Panasonic HJE900 from the trade section.  I am enjoying these headphones a lot.  They sound great with the music I've thrown at it, jazz, r&b, classic rock, and even some old school hip hop.
> 
> I am loving the fast hitting bass on this thing,  I do notice that the mids are a little recessed but I've eq'd it a bit to my liking, noticing some sibilance on some tracks but not really bothering me.  I am using sony hybrids with it and will try the foam tips as others have recommended.
> 
> ...


 
 The DBA-02 is not so much an upgrade from the Panasonics as a different sound signature altogether. It doesn't seem like the slight imperfections of the HJE900s bother you much but to keep the dynamic and hard-hitting sound of the HJE900 while moving up the food chain you'd be looking at something like the Radius DDM or Monster Miles Davis. The DBA-02 is for when you want to try a different type of sound entirely - more dry, more detailed, and much more balanced out of the box.
   

 Quote:


> Originally Posted by *NimbleRabit* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> This seems either very misleading or wrong to me unless I just have a faulty pair of M9's.  Or perhaps the iPhone compatible model has more microphonics?  I don't know, but whatever it is, my M9's have what I consider to be quite a bit of microphonics, at least much closer to a 3 than a 4/5 since I would consider 4/5 to be very good.  Do you know if they've changed the M9 at all (I got mine a while ago) or anything? Because I sorta can't believe you would give these things such a high microphonics rating based on what I hear out of them.


 

  It's a sliding scale - very few IEMs are actually completely quiet, but my M9 is certainly less microphonic than average. I can actually wear it cable-down which is not something I do with many earphones (and yes, mine is the latest version too).


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The DBA-02 is not so much an upgrade from the Panasonics as a different sound signature altogether. It doesn't seem like the slight imperfections of the HJE900s bother you much but to keep the dynamic and hard-hitting sound of the HJE900 while moving up the food chain you'd be looking at something like the Radius DDM or Monster Miles Davis. The DBA-02 is for when you want to try a different type of sound entirely - more dry, more detailed, and much more balanced out of the box.
> 
> 1+ or SM3...


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





			
				ljokerl said:
			
		

> /img/forum/go_quote.gifI am still curious about the DBA-02, am I missing a lot with the Panasonics?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Or FX700. That's where the food chain ends for me, at least for now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Have not tried MMDT though!


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Or FX700. That's where the food chain ends for me, at least for now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 You know I've considered these as well how's the isolation though, annoying??? Compared to the Pana which is agitating until you get use to it I can imagine these would be quite worse.


----------



## esanthosh

FX700's only issue is isolation. Much like DDM (but without it's fit issues), these are to be used in calm, quiet environments 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. But, sound wise, I consider FX700 an upgrade over both DDM and HJE900. I am not talking about a huge step-up, but a combination of several small factors which make it worth. If you can afford to use one set of IEMs for outside and keep FX700 for indoor use, go for it by all means. I needed a bit of 'attitude adjustment' (more than foam mod) to tune to the sound signature of Panas and to a lesser extent with DDMs. I did not require that with FX700. YMMV, of course!


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> FX700's only issue is isolation. Much like DDM (but without it's fit issues), these are to be used in calm, quiet environments
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Figured as much sound wise as well as isolation, knowing me I would still try to use the FX700 on the train or something and be extremely dissapointed.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





confispect said:


> Figured as much sound wise as well as isolation, knowing me I would still try to use the FX700 on the train or something and be extremely dissapointed.


 

 IME the FX700's isolation is only just ok for train and bus rides, but subway is an absolute no-go zone. Speaking of which, I'm about to try out a pretty crazy idea: I'll get myself a small on-ear noise canceling headphone (ATH-ANC25) and cut out their foam pads to wear them over the FX700 (or DDMs, FAD1601). The headphones themselves won't need a cord and will only be there for additional isolation and noise canceling. Granted, this somehow defeats the purpose of having IEMs in the first place, but the ANC25 look pretty inconspicuous and at best that combo will sound way better than any other on-ear headphones of similar size. 
   
  Don't know if this is gonna work, but it's only a small investment and at the very least it will be fun.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





james444 said:


> IME the FX700's isolation is only just ok for train and bus rides, but subway is an absolute no-go zone. Speaking of which, I'm about to try out a pretty crazy idea: I'll get myself a small on-ear noise canceling headphone (ATH-ANC25) and cut out their foam pads to wear them over the FX700 (or DDMs, FAD1601). The headphones themselves won't need a cord and will only be there for additional isolation and noise canceling. Granted, this somehow defeats the purpose of having IEMs in the first place, but the ANC25 look pretty inconspicuous and at best that combo will sound way better than any other on-ear headphones of similar size.
> 
> Don't know if this is gonna work, but it's only a small investment and at the very least it will be fun.


 

 It'll work it's already been done I remember trying this is my construction class with highly rated class 5 muffs. Pretty cool, you feel as if your listening thru headphones no noise is let out/in. Your IEMS almost dissapear. When I say it sounds like it's thru headphones I mean soundstage and everything, but headphones are big and clunky so this as the usual routine would be a no-go.
   
  Something like this:


----------



## james444

Yep, I know it works with around ear phones, I've already used my JBL 610 bluetooth headphones for the same purpose:
   

   
  But the interesting question is, will it also work with small on-ears, and above all with active noise canceling?


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





james444 said:


> *and above all with active noise canceling?*


 

 This I would love to hear/see but what would be the advantages vs. passive....if their is none passive would most likely be cheaper.


----------



## james444

I guess you won't find a headphone as small and light as the ANC-25 with good passive isolation. That'd be the advantage, provided it works.


----------



## ljokerl

For what you are trying to do the Equation Audio EP3070 would be my first choice. It's a tiny collapsible circumaural with impressive passive isolation and a detachable cable. I actually used them as noise blockers around the house back when I had them, though having IEMs underneath was never particularly comfortable for me.


----------



## akacoke

hi jorker
   
  after spending some time with my brainwavz m2, ive decided to upgrade to something with a lot more bass
   
  im thinking to get something good enough, so i will be done spending more money.
   
  i really want turbine gold for the sound and life time warranty. onecall quote me $180.  from reading reviews here, turbines have a flex driver issue, i experienced the same thing with my Jamz, is it really comment? also so people say the MTPGs are too heavy not comfortable to wear, and keep failing off the ears,  how are they compare to jamz? i think the jamz i had are heavy but i could handle the weight and get a good seal, but sometimes the jamz would fail off. i really dont wanna be dispointed for what they cost
   
  do you have any other suggestions instead of turbine golds?
   
  thanks in advance


----------



## bynekm

Hey joker,
   
  Thanks for the impressive reviews. I have spent lots of time reading them all again and again. I will buy myself a pair of iem and i currently have limited my options into 4. So i would really appreciate some help to make me go for 1 of those 4.
   
  As i said i have read all the reviews about those 4 but my question is which one of those would be the better choice considering the ONLY music genres i will be listening to are going to be (psychedelic) trance and chillout/ambient ?
   
  The 4 headphones are Sunrise sw xcape, Head direct RE - 0, Head direct RE-Zero and Etymotic MC5
   
  I would really appreciate a reccomendation from you and of course any other member. Thanks...


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For what you are trying to do the Equation Audio EP3070 would be my first choice. It's a tiny collapsible circumaural with impressive passive isolation and a detachable cable. I actually used them as noise blockers around the house back when I had them, though having IEMs underneath was never particularly comfortable for me.


 

 Well there you go James 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  According to this website their cheap as can be - http://www.frontendaudio.com/Equation-Audio-EP-3070-Headphones-p/9999-02538.htm
   
  J, says their isolating but I wonder.....that collapsible design does inspire to much confidence I wonder how tight they would be with IEMS stuck in them


----------



## james444

Quote: 





confispect said:


> Well there you go James


 
   
  Yeah and thanks to Joker for the tip - still, I'm gonna try the Audio Technicas first, since they're even smaller and I wanna know whether it's possible with an on-ear phone. But the EP3070 look interesting and aren't expensive either. Maybe even worth swapping their drivers for a foam inlay to make them more comfy with the IEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

Just wanted to post a little warning for anyone subscribed - been seeing a lot of posts praising the Teknines and comparing them to things like the TF10 and Turbine Pros. I've had them for three days and to my ears there is no comparison. In fact, I think at this point (~48 hrs of burn-in) they yield in clarity to the Xears XB120Pro and H2O Audio Flex (which are the cheapest earphones I've got). I can see why people like them but comparing them to the MTPG in anything but smoothness and impact is blasphemous.
   
  Also, not to be paranoid, but there are a lot of new-ish accounts with <50 posts doing nothing but praising the Teknines. Hearing these the way I do, I think that smells a little. I would get them exchanged but I know of at least one head-fi veteran who hears these exactly the way I do so I have a feeling they aren't defective.
   
   
  Quote:


akacoke said:


> after spending some time with my brainwavz m2, ive decided to upgrade to something with a lot more bass
> 
> im thinking to get something good enough, so i will be done spending more money.
> 
> ...


 
 My Golds didn't have a whole of driver flex. Coppers did, but not the Golds or Monster MDs. I find all of the Turbines pretty comfortable to wear. If you want a lot more bass than the M2 you may be satisfied with the Eterna, which is much cheaper than the Golds and has a little more bass.
   

 Quote:


bynekm said:


> As i said i have read all the reviews about those 4 but my question is which one of those would be the better choice considering the ONLY music genres i will be listening to are going to be (psychedelic) trance and chillout/ambient ?
> 
> The 4 headphones are Sunrise sw xcape, Head direct RE - 0, Head direct RE-Zero and Etymotic MC5


 
 From that list I would go for the Xcape for your genres, assuming that analytical sound is fine with you.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Hello |Joker|
   
  Thanks for your fantastic thread. Using your reviews, I decided to go with a pair of Brainwavz ProAlpha's and they are en route as we speak.
   
  Tempted to buy some Comply tips (mainly for the comfort aspect, partially because I struggle getting a proper seal on my right ear with S/M/L single flange silicon/PVC tips). Not sure whether to go for S-Series, T-400's or Tx-400's, though reading Head-Fi's review of the Comply tips alongside the Sound review of the ProAlpha's in this thread, the T-400's 'sound' like the right choice (bad pun intended).


----------



## bynekm

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> bynekm said:
> ...


 

 Analytical sound is perfectly fine for me. Thanks again. Great help...


----------



## akacoke

to be honest, having headphone cables over my ears feels so weird. if i do buy the eternas , i dont think i will like wearing them, i will end up buying something else no matter how much i will love the sound of it.  i know you are trying to help me spend least money to get the sound that mostly i would like.
   
   
  at $200 or less ,  do you think of any bass monsters can compare to turbine gold in terms of sound, warranty, comfort and look?
   


  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> > My Golds didn't have a whole of driver flex. Coppers did, but not the Golds or Monster MDs. I find all of the Turbines pretty comfortable to wear. If you want a lot more bass than the M2 you may be satisfied with the Eterna, which is much cheaper than the Golds and has a little more bass.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> Hello |Joker|
> 
> Thanks for your fantastic thread. Using your reviews, I decided to go with a pair of Brainwavz ProAlpha's and they are en route as we speak.
> 
> Tempted to buy some Comply tips (mainly for the comfort aspect, partially because I struggle getting a proper seal on my right ear with S/M/L single flange silicon/PVC tips). Not sure whether to go for S-Series, T-400's or Tx-400's, though reading Head-Fi's review of the Comply tips alongside the Sound review of the ProAlpha's in this thread, the T-400's 'sound' like the right choice (bad pun intended).


 

  I say get whatever is cheapest. I couldn't tell the difference between T400 and Tx400 sound-wise and I've never seen the S-Series.
  
  Quote: 





akacoke said:


> to be honest, having headphone cables over my ears feels so weird. if i do buy the eternas , i dont think i will like wearing them, i will end up buying something else no matter how much i will love the sound of it.  i know you are trying to help me spend least money to get the sound that mostly i would like.
> 
> at $200 or less ,  do you think of any bass monsters can compare to turbine gold in terms of sound, warranty, comfort and look?


 

 How do you compete with lifetime warranty + 1x no-questions-asked replacement? No, I don't think there are any competitors.


----------



## rawrster

Well I think Monster has that warranty because it is needed. I've seen many reports of their housing falling apart including a pair of Coppers I had that I owned for a week and was treated well. I personally would like to receive a 2 year warranty and better build quality than a lifetime warranty which no doubt drives the price up. The warranty is unmatched however and I doubt too many companies can afford a warranty like that that would cut into their sales and profit.


----------



## akacoke

what if just sound, comfort and look?  is $180 a good price for a pair of IEMs bass heavy, well refined like MTPG?

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> How do you compete with lifetime warranty + 1x no-questions-asked replacement? No, I don't think there are any competitors.


 


   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Well I think Monster has that warranty because it is needed. I've seen many reports of their housing falling apart including a pair of Coppers I had that I owned for a week and was treated well. I personally would like to receive a 2 year warranty and better build quality than a lifetime warranty which no doubt drives the price up. The warranty is unmatched however and I doubt too many companies can afford a warranty like that that would cut into their sales and profit.


 
   
  i couldnt agree more, i rather never use the warranty. but for 30 something, i dont understand why portapros have lifetime warranty.
   

 BTW  did monster cover shipping cost for your coppers?


----------



## Monochromatic

Wow thanks for the review of all the different IEMs joker! I was going to get the cx300s before but im going to get the MEElectronics Ai-M6 now :


----------



## sunspot

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Just wanted to post a little warning for anyone subscribed - been seeing a lot of posts praising the Teknines and comparing them to things like the TF10 and Turbine Pros. I've had them for three days and to my ears there is no comparison. In fact, I think at this point (~48 hrs of burn-in) they yield in clarity to the Xears XB120Pro and H2O Audio Flex (which are the cheapest earphones I've got). I can see why people like them but comparing them to the MTPG in anything but smoothness and impact is blasphemous.


 
   
  <tongue firmly in cheek>
  I knew the XB120Pro were better than _something _highly praised, if not the TD100! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  </tongue firmly in cheek>
   
  Edit: originally thought this was just FOTM effect coupled with good looks and good holiday discount and commented to that effect. But then I read the latest posts on one of those threads and, well... I'm left wondering as well.  I haven't heard the teknines, but, well, I think the Xears bullets are amazingly clear earphones... for 30$, shipping included, when not on special.  For the price the teknines go for, I'd expect something close to the RE-0 with big bass and better build/style.


----------



## rawrster

When I sent my Coppers in I had to pay for shipping to them and the return shipping was covered by Monster.
   
  Also what are the teknines? Are they something like a bass monster earphone designed to sell like what the Monster Beats are?


----------



## ljokerl

Added Meelec A151 and Nuforce NE-700X
  
  Quote: 





monochromatic said:


> Wow thanks for the review of all the different IEMs joker! I was going to get the cx300s before but im going to get the MEElectronics Ai-M6 now :


 

 Good choice - glad you found the reviews handy 


  Quote: 





sunspot said:


> Edit: originally thought this was just FOTM effect coupled with good looks and good holiday discount and commented to that effect. But then I read the latest posts on one of those threads and, well... I'm left wondering as well.  I haven't heard the teknines, but, well, I think the Xears bullets are amazingly clear earphones... for 30$, shipping included, when not on special.  For the price the teknines go for, I'd expect something close to the RE-0 with big bass and better build/style.


 

 Well FOTM is one thing but seemingly impossible comparisons to top-tier earphones is what got to me. The Teknines aren't bad per se but next to the similarly-bassy NE-700X they sound vague and veiled. 


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> When I sent my Coppers in I had to pay for shipping to them and the return shipping was covered by Monster.
> 
> Also what are the teknines? Are they something like a bass monster earphone designed to sell like what the Monster Beats are?


 


  Monster Beats are aggressively bassy - hard-edged, very powerful, and lacking dynamic range. The Teknines are softer and more 'rumbly' in nature but IMO that's no excuse for sounding cloudy and imprecise.


----------



## rawrster

I just saw the review of that meelec iem and it sounds interesting. The housing makes it look like those Shure E/SCL series where the nozzle points towards the direction of which ear it is supposed to go in and is meant for over the ear but straight down is possible. It sounds like meelec has started out well with their BA offering.
   
  At the price range of the meelec iem would you say a dynamic may be better if you want something with good extension from top down? I've been looking at possible budget earphones (as you are aware of) that isn't as bassy as the M2 and can't really seem to find one cheap enough (funny I could spend money on a custom without blinking twice and pinching pennies for budget iem). Although most dynamics at this range are probably more bassy but there are some that are not quite the bass monster.


----------



## mootookang

A151's review makes it seem like Meelec has definitely moved in the right direction. Though the straight plug do bother me a bit, I hope that Meelec would have a revision and produce them with L shaped plugs instead.

Now I'm a bit tempted to get the preorder deal and get $10 off, but I'm debating whether I should wait for the review for cc51 and SP51 first.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I just saw the review of that meelec iem and it sounds interesting. The housing makes it look like those Shure E/SCL series where the nozzle points towards the direction of which ear it is supposed to go in and is meant for over the ear but straight down is possible. It sounds like meelec has started out well with their BA offering.
> 
> At the price range of the meelec iem would you say a dynamic may be better if you want something with good extension from top down? I've been looking at possible budget earphones (as you are aware of) that isn't as bassy as the M2 and can't really seem to find one cheap enough (funny I could spend money on a custom without blinking twice and pinching pennies for budget iem). Although most dynamics at this range are probably more bassy but there are some that are not quite the bass monster.


 

 I think the photos are slightly misleading although I did the best I could. The general shape is a bit more like the RE262 and Brainwavz M3 except that the cable extends from the protrusion and not from the housing itself and the native configuration is over-the-ear.
   
  It's definitely not as bassy as the M2 - bass quantity is only a bit bigger than the RE0 or MC5 and a bit below something like the Silver Bullet (which I think you would like too). And believe me - I totally understand the hunt for the best deal even though I have a good number of budget phones that I very much like. 

  Quote: 





mootookang said:


> A151's review makes it seem like Meelec has definitely moved in the right direction. Though the straight plug do bother me a bit, I hope that Meelec would have a revision and produce them with L shaped plugs instead.
> 
> Now I'm a bit tempted to get the preorder deal and get $10 off, but I'm debating whether I should wait for the review for cc51 and SP51 first.


 

 I think the A151 comes from a different OEM than Meelec's dynamics, hence the different plug. It's actually pretty similar to the plug on the ViSang/Brainwavz phones which is well-enough relieved for my liking. I haven't had any problems with the half-dozen ViSang/Brainwavz models I've owned.
   
  The SP51, from the little listening with it that I've done, is a bass beast - it's another one for the M11+/Eterna crowd. Not bad but not something I find myself reaching for. The CC51 is much more to my liking. It's bottom-biased but warm and smooth and very well-rounded. More in-line with the 'reasonably bassy' balance of something like the M2 or Thinksound TS02. One thing about the CC51 is that it's very fit-sensitive because the driver is right there at the end of the nozzle but aside from that I actually rank it slightly higher than the A151 even though the A151 is more in line with my preferred signature (albeit not bright enough for me).


----------



## mootookang

ljokerl said:


> I think the A151 comes from a different OEM than Meelec's dynamics, hence the different plug. It's actually pretty similar to the plug on the ViSang/Brainwavz phones which is well-enough relieved for my liking. I haven't had any problems with the half-dozen ViSang/Brainwavz models I've owned.
> 
> The SP51, from the little listening with it that I've done, is a bass beast - it's another one for the M11+/Eterna crowd. Not bad but not something I find myself reaching for. The CC51 is much more to my liking. It's bottom-biased but warm and smooth and very well-rounded. More in-line with the 'reasonably bassy' balance of something like the M2 or Thinksound TS02. One thing about the CC51 is that it's very fit-sensitive because the driver is right there at the end of the nozzle but aside from that I actually rank it slightly higher than the A151 even though the A151 is more in line with my preferred signature (albeit not bright enough for me).



The CC51's sound signature does sound right up my ally. 

Few questions about CC51, how are the cables? The pictures of meelec's main site shows that it's a completely new cable unlike the braided A151 cable or the traditional seethrough cable from the last generation.

What is the angle for the plug?

Would the CC51 be very tip dependent? Since the driver is so close to the end of the nozzle, I would imagine changing the tips for the would affect the sonic signature more than the regular IEMs.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I say get whatever is cheapest. I couldn't tell the difference between T400 and Tx400 sound-wise and I've never seen the S-Series.


 
   
  Thanks for the advice. 5 pairs of Tx-400's are going for £21.00 and 5 pairs of T-400's are going for £17.60 so I'll plump for the T-400's.
   
  Can't find the S-series tips in the UK or on eBay worldwide search, kinda sad because I was hoping to get a rather outlandish colour for laughs/talking point and of course, they should be cheaper.


----------



## xtasi

Omg nice updates.
   
  You're planned list is getting quite long i see


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mootookang said:


> Few questions about CC51, how are the cables? The pictures of meelec's main site shows that it's a completely new cable unlike the braided A151 cable or the traditional seethrough cable from the last generation.
> 
> What is the angle for the plug?
> 
> Would the CC51 be very tip dependent? Since the driver is so close to the end of the nozzle, I would imagine changing the tips for the would affect the sonic signature more than the regular IEMs.


 

 The cable is indeed different from the old Mee cable and the A151 cord. It's more of the standard-fare plastic-sheathed cable but it's nice and flexible and doesn't have any memory character (similar to Xcape cord, actually). I like it about as much as the old Meelec clear cords or maybe a little better. The plug is the same hockey-stick shaped 45-degree one as on the M11.
   
  Yes, the CC51 is tip-dependent. It also has a large nozzle (as that's where the 6mm driver resides) so most tips will be a tough fit. Tips from the other micro-driver earphones (JVC FXC50/80, Hippo Shroom) will fit as will some of the larger bi-flanges but the vent is actually pretty near the nozzle so pulling bi-flanges over the front end of the earphones can obstruct airflow. The smallest stock tips actually work pretty well for me (mediums fit too but don't sound as good) so maybe aftermarket ones aren't even necessary.
   
   


  Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Omg nice updates.
> 
> You're planned list is getting quite long i see


 

  Yep, no end in sight


----------



## mootookang

Thanks for the impression Joker. 

CC51 does sound very interesting, I'll probably add them on my to get list now.


----------



## tan1415

There is a presale with the a151. $10 cheaper. Does this change your ranking?
  Also with teh price change in the meelec's lineup...will that change the values? The M6 has pricedropped by 40%. That should blow its budget competition away.
   
  Hmm still deciding what to buy. Around 50$ i have decided on the M2, but if i decide to go a little higher. Still not sure  M3, VBs or maybe the CC51 or 700x.
  Which would u consider better value buy right now? I only use MP3s and listen from ipod and Smartphones.


----------



## auroreon

Just registered to thank you for this wonderful resource joker, its been hugely helpful.
   
  Also noticed a slight error, on the review for the Sunrise SW-Xcape you gave 4/5 for isolation but on the comparison table at the end you have it at 3.5/5.


----------



## xtasi

This list is bad...in a way that it prevents me from buying any new IEMs because I really want to see how the new IEMs fare, as there's been a lot of new releases lately.  I guess its good for my wallet 
   
  I have to say, those upcoming reviews: every one of those interest me.  Looks like 2011 is going to be a good review year


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> There is a presale with the a151. $10 cheaper. Does this change your ranking?
> Also with teh price change in the meelec's lineup...will that change the values? The M6 has pricedropped by 40%. That should blow its budget competition away.
> 
> Hmm still deciding what to buy. Around 50$ i have decided on the M2, but if i decide to go a little higher. Still not sure  M3, VBs or maybe the CC51 or 700x.
> Which would u consider better value buy right now? I only use MP3s and listen from ipod and Smartphones.


 

 $10 isn't much of a difference. I'll need to update the values for the other MEE models though.
   
  There really is no 'best value' - just try to buy one you think you will like. The M2/M3/Silver Bullet are 'safe choices' in my book as they really don't do a whole lot wrong. The A151 is a little more analytical and darker in tone - really not for everyone but excellent for what it is. NE-700X is a bass beast with a deep seal and quite colored. I like it less than the others personally. CC51 I'm not sure how I feel about yet value-wise but it certainly sounds good.
   


  Quote: 





auroreon said:


> Just registered to thank you for this wonderful resource joker, its been hugely helpful.
> 
> Also noticed a slight error, on the review for the Sunrise SW-Xcape you gave 4/5 for isolation but on the comparison table at the end you have it at 3.5/5.


 


  Thanks, and thanks for the correction. I'll have the table fixed at the next update.


  Quote: 





xtasi said:


> This list is bad...in a way that it prevents me from buying any new IEMs because I really want to see how the new IEMs fare, as there's been a lot of new releases lately.  I guess its good for my wallet
> 
> I have to say, those upcoming reviews: every one of those interest me.  Looks like 2011 is going to be a good review year


 

 I'd say that's a good thing . To be completely truthful most of the reviews listed as 'in progress' are actually finished but are either waiting for me to sell off the earphones in question or for something else to happen (e.g. for my ACS Ety tips to arrive)


----------



## Inks

There's so many upcoming Meelec models coming in that I can't keep up with the names anymore. I gotta say that most if not all look well built while staying practical and user-friendly. Those cables on the a151s looked amazingly good, not CK10 cable good, but pretty much up there.


----------



## 2enty3

How do you think the RE0 would compare to a AKG K701?
  IYO, what would be a nice step up from CX300's? is S4i better?


----------



## rawrster

Quote:  





> To be completely truthful most of the reviews listed as 'in progress' are actually finished but are either waiting for me to sell off the earphones in question or for something else to happen (e.g. for my ACS Ety tips to arrive)


 

 So in other words don't expect the reviews to be posted anytime soon?  From what I've read about the ACS Etymotic custom tips it doesn't give me that much confidence.
   
  Also what do you consider the NE-700X bass to be? I know it's not bass light but would you consider it a bass monster (ie: Eterna v1) or just boosted in the bass (like a M2). I'm getting the feeling you have it as the first category but just wondering. I tried to like them but the fit was never right and the sound was completely different than what I was expecting. I don't think I've ever had an expectation of an earphone be so completely wrong before.


----------



## Intervention

amazing thread
  would you say the ne700 has more bass than the M2/M3 and meelec m6?
  looking forward to the SP51


----------



## Natha

Im currently using Klispch custom 3 but having a fit problem with the stock tips.
  So Im looking for new tips for my custom3 . based on your review, prefered tip of custom3 is Shure olive but from the picture it does look like Sony hybrids. So Im not sure which tips I should get.. any suggestons  lJokerl?? : )

 Will Shure olive and westone bi-flange fit the nozzle of custom3?
  Thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> There's so many upcoming Meelec models coming in that I can't keep up with the names anymore. I gotta say that most if not all look well built while staying practical and user-friendly. Those cables on the a151s looked amazingly good, not CK10 cable good, but pretty much up there.


 


  I'm guessing you probably wouldn't care about any of the models except the CC51 and A151 as the rest are definitely budget-level products.


  Quote: 





2enty3 said:


> How do you think the RE0 would compare to a AKG K701?
> IYO, what would be a nice step up from CX300's? is S4i better?


 

 I think someone with a K701 would be able to give you a more qualified answer as I only have a K601. The RE0 obviously doesn't have the space of my K601, is more aggressive with presenting detail, and has decidedly more treble-tilted balance, but comparing full-size cans with IEMs is not something I like to do.
   
  A step up from CX300 would depend on whether you like them or not. To maintain that level of bass impact you could go for the Eterna. For a slightly more balanced but still fun sound I'd get the Brainwavz M2 or Silver Bullets (or ECCI PR401 - review coming... eventually).
   

  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> So in other words don't expect the reviews to be posted anytime soon?  From what I've read about the ACS Etymotic custom tips it doesn't give me that much confidence.
> Also what do you consider the NE-700X bass to be? I know it's not bass light but would you consider it a bass monster (ie: Eterna v1) or just boosted in the bass (like a M2). I'm getting the feeling you have it as the first category but just wondering. I tried to like them but the fit was never right and the sound was completely different than what I was expecting. I don't think I've ever had an expectation of an earphone be so completely wrong before.


 

  Well, not unless my sale threads start moving more quickly than they are, which is what's holding up most of the reviews.
   
  I consider the NE-700X closer to 'bass monster' (like Eterna, Atrio, Beats Tour) than 'reasonably boosted' (like Silver Bullet, M2, PR401, CC51). But the bass quantity really changes with insertion depth on the NE-700. They are not to my liking but they are good for those who like a bass-heavy, colored sound. 



  Quote: 





intervention said:


> amazing thread
> would you say the ne700 has more bass than the M2/M3 and meelec m6?
> looking forward to the SP51


 

 Definitely more than M2/M3 to my ears, especially down low (M2's bass comes in a little high). M6 is weird as it seems to have even more bass than it does due to recessed mids. I would say in terms of perceived bass quantity NE-700X and M6 are similar but the NE-700X would probably have more bass boost if graphed.


  Quote: 





natha said:


> Im currently using Klispch custom 3 but having a fit problem with the stock tips.
> So Im looking for new tips for my custom3 . based on your review, prefered tip of custom3 is Shure olive but from the picture it does look like Sony hybrids. So Im not sure which tips I should get.. any suggestons  lJokerl?? : )
> 
> Will Shure olive and westone bi-flange fit the nozzle of custom3?
> Thank you


 

 Yes, Hybrids fit too. I don't like taking pictures of my Olives as they always end up looking dirtier than they actually are. Westone bi-flange will probably be a little too long (i.e. too ear-penetrating) since it will only go about halfway onto the Custom 3 nozzle. Olives do the same but they are foam tips so it's not a problem.


----------



## JamesMcProgger

Hello Joker / IEM connoisseurs,
   
_no, I did not confuse this with the portables shootout. I know am in the iem shootout._
   
  Only IEM I had Altec UPH326 something got lost (and found) 1 week, and made me though that i need another pair.
   
  I know nothing about iems, but i read your incredibly helpful shootout and narrowed to this:
   

 I wont spend over 40$ in these little things
 M6, PL3, M9. those are the one i can buy and i know where. but if you recommend another i'd be happy to take it into consideration.
 I want a clear sound, i want to differentiate instruments. and i was some sort of v shape in the eq. i cant stand the lack of bass, but i dont want it bloated, i just want to hear that is there. punch would be appreciated.
 I would also like them to be as the hard to destroy (my altects has a very hard braided cable, i like that) and a case to carry would be cool.
 No amp, just clip+.
   
  for the price i could get both m6 and m9, does it worth to have both?
  i could go over 40 to 50$ but only if you say its really worth it.
   
  sorry about the blabbering.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jamesmcprogger said:


> I wont spend over 40$ in these little things
> M6, PL3, M9. those are the one i can buy and i know where. but if you recommend another i'd be happy to take it into consideration.
> I want a clear sound, i want to differentiate instruments. and i was some sort of v shape in the eq. i cant stand the lack of bass, but i dont want it bloated, i just want to hear that is there. punch would be appreciated.
> I would also like them to be as the hard to destroy (my altects has a very hard braided cable, i like that) and a case to carry would be cool.
> ...


 


  Well the M6 is definitely v-shaped and at $20 it's almost too cheap not to try but I would definitely urge you to consider the Brainwavz M1 which is still my favorite <$40 earphone. It's far from v-shaped but the clarity is excellent and overall balance is quite good.
   
  And, while the M9 and M6 are slightly different in sound, I wouldn't buy both. The M6 sounds more refined with a good fit and is the one I'd go for.


----------



## goodvibes

M1s aren't bass heavy like most of these and in fact, a hair light so make sure that's OK for you. That said, I also clearly prefer them to the M6 but I value balance more than most.


----------



## roker

Mr. ljokerl, how would you say the Thinksound TS02 compare to the Nuforce 700x/m?
   
  I'm thinking of returning the 700ms because I find them to be too bassy, but I love the build quality.
   
  I want bass but not overpowering bass.  Also, being build like a tank would help as well.


----------



## JamesMcProgger

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 very well. a new contender then, would you recommend the Maximo imetal 590 for the cause?
  altought im almost gone with the M6, might this be my first quality IEM?!


----------



## Bennyboy71

save more money and get something better
  
  Quote: 





jamesmcprogger said:


> Hello Joker / IEM connoisseurs,
> 
> _no, I did not confuse this with the portables shootout. I know am in the iem shootout._
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





roker said:


> Mr. ljokerl, how would you say the Thinksound TS02 compare to the Nuforce 700x/m?
> 
> I'm thinking of returning the 700ms because I find them to be too bassy, but I love the build quality.
> 
> I want bass but not overpowering bass.  Also, being build like a tank would help as well.


 

 The TS02 is an interesting one in that it doesn't really do a whole lot of things incredibly well but it just works and always sounds enjoyable. I never caught myself thinking that the bass of the TS02 is overwhelming even though there's plenty of it. The Nuforce is a little more detailed especially when it comes to sub-bass and is probably flatter in the treble but not by much. As for being built like a tank, the TS02 is very well thought-out, with adequate strain reliefs and aluminum bits where it matters but I wouldn't hit them with a hammer. I think the M2 is a little closer to the NE-700 in feel just because it's mostly metal.
   


  Quote: 





jamesmcprogger said:


> very well. a new contender then, would you recommend the Maximo imetal 590 for the cause?  altought im almost gone with the M6, might this be my first quality IEM?!


 


  Well, the iM-590 is even more balanced than the M1 and has more prominent lower treble. It's more of a Grado-type sound while the M1 is more lush and liquid in the midrange,


----------



## rawrster

I guess the NE-700X is one earphone where we hear differently then. Usually we hear things similarly at least from those we have both heard. Although I guess it depends on the aspect of bass. I felt that the M2 hits harder but is quicker while the NE-700X doesn't have as much impact but is much slower and decay is quite long so the bass is there for quite a while.
   
  Well either way if given the choice I'd take the M2 over the NE-700X which is basically what I did as I returned the NE-700X. I did try to sell it however there were no interested parties so I decided to return it while I had the chance to. I think the NE-700X technically might be better but from an enjoyment level I like the M2. It also is the better package and actually lots of Chinese budget earphones have great packages from ViSang/Brainwavz and Sound Magic. Although the cost is not much the package I received is pretty impressive.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> I guess the NE-700X is one earphone where we hear differently then. Usually we hear things similarly at least from those we have both heard. Although I guess it depends on the aspect of bass. I felt that the M2 hits harder but is quicker while the NE-700X doesn't have as much impact but is much slower and decay is quite long so the bass is there for quite a while.
> 
> Well either way if given the choice I'd take the M2 over the NE-700X which is basically what I did as I returned the NE-700X. I did try to sell it however there were no interested parties so I decided to return it while I had the chance to. I think the NE-700X technically might be better but from an enjoyment level I like the M2. It also is the better package and actually lots of Chinese budget earphones have great packages from ViSang/Brainwavz and Sound Magic. Although the cost is not much the package I received is pretty impressive.


 

  With a shallower insertion I think I hear them the way you do. And yes, the longish attack/decay times were a property of the NE-6/7 as well. In the end, though, I think we came to the same conclusion - I didn't buy the NE-700X but if I had I'd have gone back to the M2 as well.


----------



## roker

I guess I just want something with a good mic, balanced sound, and durability.
   
  I think I may end up keeping the 700ms after all.
   
  I just don't want to gamble with something else considering how abusive I am to my IEMs


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I think said the same thing about iM-590/iP-HS5 in my review, that it's more of a Grado-esque sound, where I compared it to the NE-7M at the time as being more like a Sennheiser.
   
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I guess the NE-700X is one earphone where we hear differently then. Usually we hear things similarly at least from those we have both heard. Although I guess it depends on the aspect of bass. I felt that the M2 hits harder but is quicker while the NE-700X doesn't have as much impact but is much slower and decay is quite long so the bass is there for quite a while.
> 
> Well either way if given the choice I'd take the M2 over the NE-700X which is basically what I did as I returned the NE-700X. I did try to sell it however there were no interested parties so I decided to return it while I had the chance to. I think the NE-700X technically might be better but from an enjoyment level I like the M2. It also is the better package and actually lots of Chinese budget earphones have great packages from ViSang/Brainwavz and Sound Magic. Although the cost is not much the package I received is pretty impressive.


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With a shallower insertion I think I hear them the way you do. And yes, the longish attack/decay times were a property of the NE-6/7 as well. In the end, though, I think we came to the same conclusion - I didn't buy the NE-700X but if I had I'd have gone back to the M2 as well.


 

 As I like to collect phones, I tend to keep most of them and switch around a bit.  Half the fun for me is in trying different sound signatures, and the other half of the time I listen to my best IEM and escape into the music and forget about what I'm listening to.  Often I find the M3 give up too much air, ambience and sparkle in the quest to sound more refined.  To me the M2 is a bassier and darker phone with more forward mids, vs the NE-700X.  This makes it more difficult for the M2 and M3 to disappear for me, although for a while I was enamoured by them and found them to sound fun.  
   
  I also listen with a shallower insertion, and I don't find the NE-700x bass to be excessive, while the M2 often seems to have more bass than the M3 or NE-700x.  Sometimes the M2 bass is too much, but I don't find that to be the case with the NE-700x (it might fall between the M2 and M3 for me).  I'm listening to the M2 right now with some Al Jarreau, and it's fairly bassy and not open enough.  The M2 frequency response reminds me a bit of the UE11Pro, without the UE11Pro detail, speed, soundstage, extension, ambience and air.  
   
  I switched between the M2 and M3 to the NE-700x while typing this, and when I first plugged in the NE-700x I thought I didn't have them plugged into my uDAC-2 properly and that I was hearing my Audioengine A2 speakers which are connected to the back of the uDAC-2.  I was afraid I'd wake up my wife and quickly turned the volume down in a panic.  It turned out that it was the NE-700X I was listening to with the surround sound version of Al Jarreau and George Benson "Givin it Up" DVD, and I was fooled.  
   
  I'm sorry to disagree, but I think I might like the NE-700x more than the M2 and M3, for their more open and deep soundstage, and the extra detail and crispness over the others.


----------



## joe24

Hello ljokerl,
   
  I found your reviews very helpful... actually, i already have monster turbines .. though i like the bass and sound , but the build quality is very poor .... and even isolation is not very good ( it is more than average but it totally depends on which type of song i am listening)... i am planning to get another one... i don't want to spend more than 70...  i prefer earphone with bass but not bassy ... and as i use them while transit isolation is preferable..
   
  i hear all types of music... 
   
  what would you prefer based on sound quality, bass and isolation ...  meelectronics a151 , sunrise sw-xcape , nuforce n700, shure se115, fischer audio eterno v1 or v2 , or should i just replace monster s as it was for only 59$ ... if you think any other headphone are good based on my priorities , also let me know,,
   
  thanks in advance...


----------



## kendric

Hey Joker, ever considered the Nakamichi's humble IEM line-ups? From the entry level ones all the way to that Ceramic Housing ones, Just started work (17/1/2011 as of my Day 1 there) at Stereo Singapore, so i might loan and review them, My ears are rusty so its best i see how you think about these, Since i always felt your reviews hit-on and noticed + mentioned some things which i din notice, My ears are shoddy compared to your delicate ones


----------



## FlySweep

jamesmcprogger said:


> very well. a new contender then, would you recommend the Maximo imetal 590 for the cause?
> altought im almost gone with the M6, might this be my first quality IEM?!


 

 I would HIGHLY recommend the iM-590.  I've listened to the M6, owned the M9 & currently have the M11P+ (takes the best parts of the M6 & M9, refines them & pulls up the mids a bit).. while I enjoy the M11P+ (and find them to be the best of the Mx series.. but I haven't listened to MEElec's latest offerings), I listen to the iM590 on a far more regular basis cause I absolutely love the detail, natural, balanced sound, and accuracy.
   
  I think the iM590s beat the M6s in EVERY way if you want a more balanced sound.  It perfectly walks the line between fun & analytical.  It's got the wonderful grado-sound without the harshness, better bass impact and extention, soundstage, and instrument separation.  Also, I have never found an IEM that fits so effortlessly in my ears.. I'm a HUGE fan of the unique quasi-doubly flange tips.
   
  I bought the iM590's on the strength that ljokerl mentioned they were his "everyday" IEMs for some time.. that's high praise coming from him & knew I had to have them.  Suffice to say, I cherish them very much and despite having heard a lot of other higher-tiered IEMs since owning the Maximos, the iM590s always draw me back in.  I don't see myself EVER selling them.  Maximo also has terrific customer service too.
   
  So, ljokerl.. I'm curious.. what is your current favorite "everyday" IEMs (is it still the iM590) ?  For those who enjoy the 590 sound, what would you recommend as an upgrade in the 100~150 range (and is it a dramatic enough upgrade to warrant the price jump from the iM590) ?


----------



## faideelah

How do I tell the difference between the M11+ and M11 physically? They both look pretty much the same to me.


----------



## FlySweep

faideelah said:


> How do I tell the difference between the M11+ and M11 physically? They both look pretty much the same to me.


 
  I've never owned or seen the M11 so I can't help you there.
   
  My M11P+ housing design is not what is pictured at MEElec's website either (which has the silver metal ring).  It has the same housing design as the M9 but the M11P+ is all metal (opposed to the M9, which was all plastic).
   
  You know.. I haven't gone back to my M11+'s in quite some time.. perhaps MEElec erroneously sent me the M9P instead of the M11P+ I ordered & I've just been too stupid to figure it out (this is very possible.. lol) ?  I'll have to check it out tonight..


----------



## ljokerl

One thing I just noticed - when I said that the A151's sound is on-par with the Westone 1, I mean literally on-par but then I went and grabbed the W1's pre-SM3 score (which was 0.25 pts higher). So the A151 should be the same as the new W1 score which is 7.75. It'll be changed with the next update which will hopefully also include something new that I like very much.
   
    
  Quote:


headphoneaddict said:


> *I'm sorry to disagree*, but I think I might like the NE-700x more than the M2 and M3, for their more open and deep soundstage, and the extra detail and crispness over the others.


 

 That's ridiculous - open arguments are what makes this forum great. I think we all agree that the NE-700 is a solid set of earphones - we just value different things when it comes to picking one to use when the reviews are all said and done. I think the forward mids of the M2 is what appeals to me for casual listening since I also put the M2 ahead of the M3 preferentially (though not technically). Also has a bit to do with the easy fit..


  Quote: 





joe24 said:


> what would you prefer based on sound quality, bass and isolation ...  meelectronics a151 , sunrise sw-xcape , nuforce n700, shure se115, fischer audio eterno v1 or v2 , or should i just replace monster s as it was for only 59$ ... if you think any other headphone are good based on my priorities , also let me know,,
> 
> thanks in advance...


 


  Of those the A151 will have the most isolation but it's not a bassy earphone - just a bit above baseline when it comes to mid-bass. Same goes for the Xcape. Eternas have a hair more bass than the Turbines and the Nuforces are about on-level with the Monsters (the way I hear them). I generally prefer the Eterna to the Turbine so that would be my choice for bass assuming you can't just exercise the warranty on the Turbines and get a new one.
   

 Quote:


kendric said:


> Hey Joker, ever considered the Nakamichi's humble IEM line-ups? From the entry level ones all the way to that Ceramic Housing ones, Just started work (17/1/2011 as of my Day 1 there) at Stereo Singapore, so i might loan and review them, My ears are rusty so its best i see how you think about these, Since i always felt your reviews hit-on and noticed + mentioned some things which i din notice, My ears are shoddy compared to your delicate ones


    
  Nope, never considered those. I do have the MEElec ceramics which I quite like (and which are much cheaper) so I'll just start with those if I may 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Quote: 





flysweep said:


> I bought the iM590's on the strength that ljokerl mentioned they were his "everyday" IEMs for some time.. that's high praise coming from him & knew I had to have them.  Suffice to say, I cherish them very much and despite having heard a lot of other higher-tiered IEMs since owning the Maximos, the iM590s always draw me back in.  I don't see myself EVER selling them.  Maximo also has terrific customer service too.
> So, ljokerl.. I'm curious.. what is your current favorite "everyday" IEMs (is it still the iM590) ?  I really enjoy the 590 sound signature so what would you recommend if one were to upgrade and wanted to spend no more than $100-150?


 
  I think the Brainwavz M1 is the iM-590's biggest problem in my book since it also offers a very balanced and detailed sound at pretty much the same price point but with a seductively smooth midrange and less treble unevenness. I still like the iM-590 myself but there were a few complaints about the treble and build quality back when it was popular so I find the M1 to be the 'safer' choice as far as recommendations go. The M1 is very difficult not to like for the money.
   
  Lately I find myself picking up the Brainwavz M2, ECCI PR401, or Phiaton PS 20 as budget IEMs for casual listening. Phiatons are just nice around the house for low isolation and the M2 and PR401 are fun IEMs with opposing signatures.
   
  As for a ~$100-150 upgrade from the iM-590, that's a pretty tough one. I think if you don't mind moving a bit closer to the analytical side of the spectrum, the DBA-02 would be a good option since it maintains the balance but improves on the iM-590 overall.
   
   
  Quote: 





faideelah said:


> How do I tell the difference between the M11+ and M11 physically? They both look pretty much the same to me.


 
 They should look the same - the only difference is the drivers which you wouldn't be able to tell just by looking at them.


 Quote:


> Originally Posted by *FlySweep* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I've never owned or seen the M11 so I can't help you there.
> 
> My M11P+ housing design is not what is pictured at MEElec's website either (which has the silver metal ring).  It has the same housing design as the M9 but the M11P+ is all metal (opposed to the M9, which was all plastic).


   
  I'm confused about this - the M9 is not plastic and looks nothing like the M11P+.


----------



## FlySweep

Thanks for your opinions re: the 590, joker.. I've got the DBAs & love them too.. I was thinking you'd probably mention them as the next step up.. I might look into those ECCI's for fun.. seems like a winner around HF.
   
  Re: the MEElecs.. I'm fairly sure I got the wrong version of something from MEElec.  All indications state that I have a _silver_ M9*P*.. but the thing is, I had never seen MEElec selling the M9P in silver (only the M9)..  Collectors' item? LOL.  I ordered these way back in November.. I wonder if MEElec would be so kind to send me the M11P+ I actually ordered (it's been a little past the 72 hrs) ?


----------



## tan1415

Which IEM would you recommend if vocals is important. I dont listen to instrumental music like dance or classical. All music i hear is with people singing in it. What kind of characteristics should i look for in a IEM?
   
  budget max 100$.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


flysweep said:


> Re: the MEElecs.. I'm fairly sure I got the wrong version of something from MEElec.  All indications state that I have a _silver_ M9*P*.. but the thing is, I had never seen MEElec selling the M9P in silver (only the M9)..  Collectors' item? LOL.  I ordered these way back in November.. I wonder if MEElec would be so kind to send me the M11P+ I actually ordered (it's been a little past the 72 hrs) ?


 
 I think you need to email MEE about that. I'm pretty sure that if you actually got the wrong earphone and can prove it, they'll make it right.
   

 Quote:


tan1415 said:


> Which IEM would you recommend if vocals is important. I dont listen to instrumental music like dance or classical. All music i hear is with people singing in it. What kind of characteristics should i look for in a IEM?
> 
> budget max 100$.


 

  Something where the midrange isn't recessed would be a good start. I quite like the smooth and liquid way in which the RE-ZERO does vocals but I'd also look at the Fischer Silver Bullet and Brainwavz M2/M3.


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Re: the MEElecs.. I'm fairly sure I got the wrong version of something from MEElec.  All indications state that I have a _silver_ M9*P*.. but the thing is, I had never seen MEElec selling the M9P in silver (only the M9)..  Collectors' item? LOL.


 
  I briefly had a *silver *MEElec M9*P* about 8-10 months ago ago. Decided the cord looked a little too much like jewelry for my tastes and sold it to a female head-fier.


----------



## ljokerl

Fixed the MEE A151 score and added the ECCI PR401 while I was at it.


----------



## JxK

Nice review of the ECCIPR401. I'm wondering though, from a purely personal perspective, ignoring technical proficiency, how do you like it vs your much loved m2? And based upon the review, can I assume you finally have the fx700 in your possession?


----------



## FlySweep

Thanks for getting a review of the ECCI PR401 up so quickly, ljokerl.. I really appreciate it (and I'm sure LendMeYourEars.com does too.. I just ordered them).. prodding you further.. how does the 401's detail, instrument separation, and balance/neutrality stack up to the 590?  While the 590 is quite even across the freq range (if not being ever so slightly mid-forward) it sounds like the ECCI is ever so slightly v shaped.. are the mids recessed enough to affect detail in vocals and instruments in that range?
   
  The 590s & 401s actually sound like they share a lot of the same characteristics, but could also be somewhat complimentary to each other with the the they render mids..
   
  Thanks again..


----------



## esanthosh

@joker,
   
  This is what I don't like about this thread. I didn't have to know about ECCI PR401. Must resist. You really should not have mentioned FX700 in the comparison. Just saying!
   
  While it may be like comparing apple to an orange, how would you compare Silver Bullets to ECCI PR401? SB is something I wanted to try for sometime now, just trying to decide between the two.


----------



## InnovatedMind

To |joker| and every other head-fi'er
 Thank you for a very detailed thread covering the majority of IEM's out there. I know you probably hear that a lot but give appreciation to wherever it's due. This is my first post here but I have been browsing these forums for the past couple of months. I need some questions answered before making my first serious audiophile purchase. 

 A little about my history; Growing up, my brother was a huge audiophile, he used to build speaker boxes and make his own systems for cars and clubs, he used to DJ and he is probably the person who got me into enjoying every detail that music can bring out. I used to love working on cars, making my systems with him but we sort of stopped that and moved on with life.
   
  A few years ago I got into "Skullcandy" and was introduced to my first IEM, Skullcandy FMJ's ... Not knowing any better with IEM's I thought they were GREAT!!!!! Mainly because of the "Thump Thump" from the bass and at times hearing good sub-bass. After a year, the wiring rubber wire casing split open, exposing the actual wires, I dropped them in water on accident (a urinal actually hah... stupid kid I was) and I still proceeded to wear them until they were literally shocking my ears... Anyways I got a new pair and then thought, since the name is very recognizable I would buy them, "Klipsch S4" ... which was a new sound, not as boomy, but a little bit more balanced with a different sound signature but having a tendency to be pitchy. After a year (last month) the housing (is that what you call it? Where it holds the electronic parts and the flange) split open....
   
  ANYWAYS sorry, long story short I've been in the market, browsing head-fi, just doing my research on my next set... but I want them to be the perfect start to my "head-fi" career. I am looking for something that reminds me of the days testing out systems with my brother, feeling the bass in my chest but without the lows crossing over to the mids. I would like to have a great bass but detailed at the same time to where when I am designing or working out I could be in my own little world.

 My favorite genres are: 
 Techno (BT, Armin Van Buuren, Infected Mushroom, and Deadmau5 ... to name a few)
 Rap (Lil Boosie, Outkast, Kesha)
 Some Classical (Rachmaninoff, Tchaikovsky, Saint-Saens, ect)

 For under $100 (yeah I know, tall order)

 Tell me if I'm wrong in my two top picks for this order:
 Either:
 Fischer Audio Eterna's ver1
  -or-
  Hippo VB

 And additional IEM recommendations are welcomed! As I am, again, a newb!

 Thank you for reading this (and not just to |joker|) to all that may help me!
 - Joey


----------



## rawrster

It looks like the PR401 probably wouldn't be for me. I thought flat cables were supposed to be good with tangling however so I find that being a con to be somewhat odd.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Nice review of the ECCIPR401. I'm wondering though, from a purely personal perspective, ignoring technical proficiency, how do you like it vs your much loved m2? And based upon the review, can I assume you finally have the fx700 in your possession?


 

 I think about equally - that is to say, a lot. The treble emphasis and space of the PR401 are right up my alley. I think that the PR401 is more of a compliment to the M2, one being slightly recessed in the midrange and the other slightly forward. And yes, I have a loaner FX700 (courtesy of Inks so you can all thank him) this week.


  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Thanks for getting a review of the ECCI PR401 up so quickly, ljokerl.. I really appreciate it (and I'm sure LendMeYourEars.com does too.. I just ordered them).. prodding you further.. how does the 401's detail, instrument separation, and balance/neutrality stack up to the 590?  While the 590 is quite even across the freq range (if not being ever so slightly mid-forward) it sounds like the ECCI is ever so slightly v shaped.. are the mids recessed enough to affect detail in vocals and instruments in that range?
> 
> The 590s & 401s actually sound like they share a lot of the same characteristics, but could also be somewhat complimentary to each other with the the they render mids..
> 
> Thanks again..


 

 Both the iM-590 and PR401 have pretty high levels of detail but I think the PR401 has slightly better, or at least more pronounced, layering and a deeper stage. Balance-wise the iM-590 "wins", having more forward mids, but the PR401 is not affected negatively by its mildly v-shaped balance. 
   


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> @joker,
> 
> This is what I don't like about this thread. I didn't have to know about ECCI PR401. Must resist. You really should not have mentioned FX700 in the comparison. Just saying!
> 
> While it may be like comparing apple to an orange, how would you compare Silver Bullets to ECCI PR401? SB is something I wanted to try for sometime now, just trying to decide between the two.


 

 Ha, I wasn't trying to hook you - I swear! 
   
  SB is more balanced and a little more refined than the PR401. PR401 has a bit more bass and a bit more lower treble than the SB but not so much that it sounds 'peaky' - it's still a pretty smooth earphone. I think that if the PR401 is an entry-level FX700, the SB is more like the Turbine Pro Gold or even IE7 (though not nearly as boring as the latter).
   

  Quote: 





innovatedmind said:


> ANYWAYS sorry, long story short I've been in the market, browsing head-fi, just doing my research on my next set... but I want them to be the perfect start to my "head-fi" career. I am looking for something that reminds me of the days testing out systems with my brother, feeling the bass in my chest but without the lows crossing over to the mids. I would like to have a great bass but detailed at the same time to where when I am designing or working out I could be in my own little world.
> 
> My favorite genres are:
> Techno (BT, Armin Van Buuren, Infected Mushroom, and Deadmau5 ... to name a few)
> ...


 


  I think that if bass is what you're after you picked the right two IEMs. What it comes down to is the type of bass you like - the conventional kind of the Eternas or the sub-bass heavy balance of the VBs. The VBs certainly let the bass affect the rest of the sound less but are also missing the mid-bass hump usually associated with bass-heavy audio gear.
   
   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> It looks like the PR401 probably wouldn't be for me. I thought flat cables were supposed to be good with tangling however so I find that being a con to be somewhat odd.


 
   
  I was surprised as well but I haven't spent as much time untangling an earphone since I had the Senn CX300. Most manufacturers are certainly paying more attention to that nowadays either making thick cables that don't tangle (Meelec, ViSang/Brainwavz, Fischer) or slippery ones that untangle easily.


----------



## mywallethurts

so joker is the fx700 gonna get a 10/10? imo its around 9.75/10 because of the short cord...


----------



## takoyaki7

Really? I almost bought the FX700 BECAUSE it has the short cord! I hate long cords when I have my ipod in my breast pocket! The poor isolation is the weakness of the FX700 imho...


----------



## InnovatedMind

So there is no actual "mid hump" in the VB's at all? If there is only sub-bass and no mid-bass hump, why would it be classified as a "Basshead" phone? 

 Sorry I'm just a little confused and new to this.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## EternalEmpire

I don't understand this... my Visang R02 keep alternating between good and 'eh'. One time I'll use them and think "Did they always sound this good?", then the next time I use them I'll end up thinking "What happened to the sound quality I was getting with these yesterday?". Maybe they're very genre specific? I don't know what to think.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mywallethurts said:


> so joker is the fx700 gonna get a 10/10? imo its around 9.75/10 because of the short cord...


   
  Quote:


takoyaki7 said:


> Really? I almost bought the FX700 BECAUSE it has the short cord! I hate long cords when I have my ipod in my breast pocket! The poor isolation is the weakness of the FX700 imho...


 
 Neither the short cord, which is actually pretty annoying because it's only missing ~10cm, nor the low isolation will affect the 'sound' score which, I imagine, is what everyone is concerned with.
   

 Quote:


innovatedmind said:


> So there is no actual "mid hump" in the VB's at all? If there is only sub-bass and no mid-bass hump, why would it be classified as a "Basshead" phone?
> 
> Sorry I'm just a little confused and new to this.


 

  No, there's no real midbass hump in the VBs (at least not with the 2-dot plate) but it's by no means anemic. It's a basshead phone as some people really like the deep sub-bass rumble that it provides.
   
   
  Quote:


eternalempire said:


> I don't understand this... my Visang R02 keep alternating between good and 'eh'. One time I'll use them and think "Did they always sound this good?", then the next time I use them I'll end up thinking "What happened to the sound quality I was getting with these yesterday?". Maybe they're very genre specific? I don't know what to think.


 
  Don't know what to tell you - inconsistent fit perhaps? I didn't notice any genre inconsistency with them or with my R01/R03.


----------



## Bennyboy71

Its your brain. Those things have more of a tendency to be faulty than mechanical equipment..
   
   
  Quote:


eternalempire said:


> I don't understand this... my Visang R02 keep alternating between good and 'eh'. One time I'll use them and think "Did they always sound this good?", then the next time I use them I'll end up thinking "What happened to the sound quality I was getting with these yesterday?". Maybe they're very genre specific? I don't know what to think.


----------



## mywallethurts

Quote: 





bennyboy71 said:


> Its your brain. Those things have more of a tendency to be faulty than mechanical equipment..
> 
> 
> Quote:
> ...


 

 couldnt agree more


----------



## rawrster

That's a shame about the PR401 cable. I wish more earphones esp budget ones had either one of those braided cable (like a Westone) or the cable that Brainwavz/ViSang uses.
   
  I guess if the flat cable is too small it doesn't work out like it should ;p


----------



## Inks

The short cord of the JVCs sure is annoying. A temporary solution was to use it with the extension cord wrapped up, but using the RE-Zero adapter also worked somewhat (cable down). The Shure 9inch adapter may be a good option although probably a bit long.


----------



## m4xc4v413r4

Brainwavz earphones do not come with foam tips and ear gliders any more.
   
  This will definitively lower their Accessories and Value scores...


----------



## SoSpecial

Hey guys whats the cheapest IEM I can get that has double and triple flange tips that also fit Turbines?? OR Where I can buy double and triple flange tips for them?
   
  I bought my turbines and love them but they only came with the stock tips, the Sony Hybrids work well( orange is perfect for me, absolutely sounds amazing and fits so much better then everything else I own.)


----------



## Inks

Meelec sells good double flanges that fit the Turbines.


----------



## jddesigned

I've been following this thread for a year now, read and re-read every review and I'm ultimately confused on what to buy next........
   
  I've been using Meelec M6's because $25 was the perfect price to get into IEM's and these really sound great for what they are, actually I really enjoy them. I want to move into the next level without blowing the bank, say $60-100 range. I know I can't have everything I want but I'm sure I can get somewhat nearer. On my way to work today I listened to some 80's, Led Zeppelin, Kanye and Star Wars soundtracks (Sansa Fuze). M6's are fun for the rock & rap but I want more detail/clarity, biggish soundstage and with a twinkle to the highs when "at" the symphony -  a grand live feel. I'd really like to go analytical without losing a lot of base. I  think the bass gives you that oomph you need to feel like you're listening to the symphony. I notice with the M6's when listening to the SW soundtracks if there's a build up to a big cymbal crash sometimes the sounds kinda mush together and falls flat, this drives me nuts. I dunno maybe - warmth, immersion, detail, separation would be a good description
   
  As for musts - isolation and microphonics are it. I was considering Silver Bullets but wouldn't want anything less than the M6's in this area, I love tuning out people when I exercise or ride the subway.
   
  Few random thoughts....
  - I was hoping the Meelec A151's would fit the bill based on build quality but from what I'm reading the highs take a blow.
  - If I moved up to say a DBA-02 for the sake of overall sound quality sacrificing price is the bass compared to the M6 going to disappear completely on me?
  - BA are all wrong for me?
   
  PS: no amping here. I like how small and compact the Fuze is now


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> Which IEM would you recommend if vocals is important. I dont listen to instrumental music like dance or classical. All music i hear is with people singing in it. What kind of characteristics should i look for in a IEM?
> 
> budget max 100$.


 

 PL-50


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





jddesigned said:


> [...]
> - Also if I moved up to say a DBA-02 for the sake of overall sound quality sacrificing price is the bass compared to the M6 going to disappear completely on me?
> 
> PS: no amping here. I like how small and compact the Fuze is now


 
  The DBA0-2's have excellent quality and sufficient quantity of bass (well-balanced with the rest of the spectrum), *if* you get a good fit and seal. If the music has a strong bass presence as originally mixed, then the DBA wil reproduce that mix accurately and very enjoyably.
   
  Some around here have not been that fortunate and describe them as "bass-lite". I'm among the lucky ones, using Shure grey soft flex (single flange silicone) tips, and find that their bass is very similar to what I hear from the sound systems in my home or car (both tuned 'flat'). I am NOT a "bass-head" and prefer not to use a sub-woofer (partly in the interests of marital accord), and no amp in my portable rig, either.
   
  I haven't yet heard an M6, but did own the similar M9 and still occasionally listen to my NuForce NE-7M. The bass from the DBA (or remarkably similar Sunrise Xcape) is less in quantity, but MUCH cleaner, faster and doesn't bleed over into the mids. I was recently (and only briefly) without both the DBA and Xcape, and the NE-7M was noticeably less satisfying to use.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


inks said:


> The short cord of the JVCs sure is annoying. A temporary solution was to use it with the extension cord wrapped up, but using the RE-Zero adapter also worked somewhat (cable down). The Shure 9inch adapter may be a good option although probably a bit long.


 
 Hmm the RE-ZERO adapter is a good idea as that's pretty much all I'm missing with the JVC cord. 
   
   
  Quote:


m4xc4v413r4 said:


> Brainwavz earphones do not come with foam tips and ear gliders any more.
> 
> This will definitively lower their Accessories and Value scores...


 
 Thanks, I actually changed their accessory scores in the table (from 4.5 to 4) a little while ago but I forgot to update the review itself. 
   

 Quote:


sospecial said:


> Hey guys whats the cheapest IEM I can get that has double and triple flange tips that also fit Turbines?? OR Where I can buy double and triple flange tips for them?
> 
> I bought my turbines and love them but they only came with the stock tips, the Sony Hybrids work well( orange is perfect for me, absolutely sounds amazing and fits so much better then everything else I own.)


 
 You can just buy a Meelec fit kit for the M9 or M11 or the M9 'balanced' bi-flange tips. If they already stock fit kits for the new models those might be an option as well as some of them have small tri-flange tips. Alternatively, you can buy monster-style large tri-flanges on ebay from the seller _lostearbuds _(if I remember correctly)
   
   
  Quote:


jddesigned said:


> I've been following this thread for a year now, read and re-read every review and I'm ultimately confused on what to buy next........
> 
> I've been using Meelec M6's because $25 was the perfect price to get into IEM's and these really sound great for what they are. I want to move into the next level without blowing the bank, say $60-100 range. I know I can't have everything I want but I'm sure I can get somewhat nearer. On my way to work today I listened to some 80's, Led Zeppelin, Kanye and Star Wars soundtracks (Sansa Fuze). M6's are fun for the rock & rap but I want more detail/clarity, bigger soundstage and more of a twinkle to the highs when "at" the symphony - more of a grand live feel. I'd really like to go analytical without losing the base. I  think the bass gives you that oomph you need to feel like you're listening to the symphony. I notice with the M6's when listening to the SW soundtracks if there's a build up to a big cymbal crash sometimes the sounds kinda mush together and falls flat, this drives me nuts.
> 
> As for musts - isolation and microphonics are it. I was considering Silver Bullets but wouldn't want anything less than the M6's in this area, I love tuning out people when I exercise or ride the subway.


 
 Since you're using the M6, I would think you won't have any trouble wearing the silver bullets over-the-ear in which case microphonics won't be a much of an issue. Isolation is about on-par with the M6 so I wouldn't worry about that either. The ECCI PR401 and Brainwavz M3 are two more I'd consider. The M3 doesn't quit have that treble 'sparkle' you seem to be after but it's very well-balanced and doesn't have trouble tracking multiple instruments. In any case you will be sacrificing a bit of the M6's bass for a more even-handed and refined sound.
   
  As for moving to the DBA-02, I wouldn't if you think you've gotten used to the significantly boosted bass of the M6. The DBA-02 is a much better earphone but it portrays exactly what's on the track. There are bassy armatures - Westone 3 for example - and some that just have very impressive quality - such as the q-JAYS - but I guess you could say that they are in the minority.


----------



## palthos

Joker,
   
  I've lurked around this site for some time, and I was pleased to find this thread this afternoon while doing research for a solid IEM choice. I've read through the reviews of everything in my range, and many of the replies you've handed out to other users in the past few months. Here's hoping you can help with my individual situation...
   
*I have a $100 Amazon.com gift card* that made it through Christmas somehow. I want to blow it on a solid IEM that I can put to daily use in a variety of situations. I'm one of those job-hunting recent college grads, so I could go *slightly over the $100 mark*, but not drastically so. I really have no need to go lower, but I'm not hung up on a higher price meaning a better item.
   
  I listen to damn near everything. Primary listening device is an iPhone 4 in a vast array of settings, but I have FLACs of some of my favorite albums (such as "Bold As Love", most Beatles albums, and some symphonic and opera performances) that I listen to from my PC. If I had to prioritize, it would go to iPhone listening easily. I lean more towards the analytical end of the spectrum, but I'm looking for the one IEM to rule them all for a few years with everyday use. Definitely not looking for over-the-top bass. *Where is that sweet spot of definition and fluidity on a sweet sound stage around $100?* (I realize this is asking a lot...) I could care less about an inline mic, although on even grounds, I'd go for one with a mic for the rare occasion it would come in handy.
   
  The RE0, TS02, and M3 all fall around the $90 range right now, and I'm sure there are others in range that I haven't seen. The q-Jays are down to $160 on Amazon, but I'm not sure they offer enough to warrant spending the cash out of pocket. Perhaps you even have something yet to make the list that you'd recommend? Thanks in advance for any advice you may have.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





palthos said:


> I listen to damn near everything. Primary listening device is an iPhone 4 in a vast array of settings, but I have FLACs of some of my favorite albums (such as "Bold As Love", most Beatles albums, and some symphonic and opera performances) that I listen to from my PC. If I had to prioritize, it would go to iPhone listening easily. I lean more towards the analytical end of the spectrum, but I'm looking for the one IEM to rule them all for a few years with everyday use. Definitely not looking for over-the-top bass. *Where is that sweet spot of definition and fluidity on a sweet sound stage around $100?* (I realize this is asking a lot...) I could care less about an inline mic, although on even grounds, I'd go for one with a mic for the rare occasion it would come in handy.
> 
> The RE0, TS02, and M3 all fall around the $90 range right now, and I'm sure there are others in range that I haven't seen. The q-Jays are down to $160 on Amazon, but I'm not sure they offer enough to warrant spending the cash out of pocket. Perhaps you even have something yet to make the list that you'd recommend? Thanks in advance for any advice you may have.


 


  Having to buy from amazon is certainly a limitation as my top choice for what you're after would be a Silver Bullet. I'm not a huge fan of the Klipsch Custom series (or the lower half of the Image series for that matter) but the Custom 3 is a solid choice in that price range. They're a little too dry for me to praise their fluidity (as are the q-JAYS) but they really don't do a whole lot wrong, not just 'for the money' but in general. I don't know if gift cards apply to marketplace purchases but a refurb Senn. IE7 would be another option. I'm not a fan of the IE7, either, but at <$100 it makes sense if you're looking for an all-rounder with good soundstaging. I'm the first to admit that the M3 isn't quite up there on a technical level though I'd rather be listening to it than the KC3 or IE7.
   
  Lastly, if a gift card does indeed work with the amazon marketplace, you may be able to pick something up on the sale forum here and have the buyer list it on amazon. Not sure if it's worth the trouble but I think I've seen it done before.


----------



## rawrster

I think a gift card would work for any kind of purchase. It would be like having "amazon money" and then can buy whatever you want and have the option to choose that or from your cc/bank account. Just a FYI but mp4nation has a couple of their earphones on Amazon now on a more limited stock. I remember seeing the M1, M2 and M3 on there. It's a bit higher than the prices ($10) but it's in the US and fulfilled by Amazon.


----------



## Rodrigoqui

Hi Joker!
 I have read your revews, and in a lot of them the triple.fi is cited, so i'm wondering, why didnt you make a review of it yet?
 I'm very curious to read what you think of the triple's, and how it's compared to the others.
 Thanks


----------



## palthos

I was ready to go for the Custom-3s and treat the cable like a baby, then I found some extra funds hidden with the Amazon card's envelope. The C3s on Amazon are $110 right now with free shipping. I could stretch the budge* *now, but I'm not sure if I'm going to find anything that really outperforms the C3s in that range. The M3s are still poking my thought process from time to time, but only because of the poor cable issues surrounding the C3s. So... $110 C3s or perhaps one of the following in the sub-$200 range:
   
  Ultimate Ears TripleFi 10 @ $180 (saw it's listed in upcoming)
  Phiaton PS 200 @ $150 (intrigued at this price, but concerned about sibilance)
  Etys HF2 @ $150
  qJays @ $150 (low man on the totem pole)
  ================  or the temptations....
  Westone 2 or UM2 @ $250 (what advantage does the crossover on the UM give?) -- These really tempt me after going back through your reviews. There is even a set of UM2s with detachable cables for $280.
  Klipsch Image X10 @ $235
  Turbine Pro Golds @ $280 (concerned about being too bassy)
   
  I could realistically stretch to a literal max of $300, but it would have to be some golden child IEM that would last many years and blow me away over the above choices, as it would come from cash instead of various gift cards. The Westone 2 (or UM2, although still not sure what the actual difference is) @ $250 comes to mind based on your reviews, and is currently what I keep coming back to at this higher range for the extreme overall value they seem to bring. The UM3X sits @ $100 over the 2s currently, but going over $300 just isn't something I had in mind when I started this quest.


----------



## jddesigned

> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I take it all sheepishly back and apologize for wasting your time reading my incoherent thoughts previously....  I just listened to a buddy @ works Shure SRH840 headphones (yes I know I'm comparing headphones to IEM's) and it's not about the bass! It's about clarity, the detail, the accurateness and what I would describe as very neutral in a good way. I'm guessing my Fuze was under powering them a little and I wasn't getting their full oomph, but it did not matter the music just sounded so much better to me  Clean and balanced. Instruments were separated and I could feel the bow rubbing the violin strings. Anyways I'm not sure how actually "good" these cans are but they sound a million times better than the M6's I have now, it was like someone had lifted a blanket off the M6's and all the clarity came out. Sorry, rambling over, I'll go away now.......


----------



## Niyologist

Does the Meelectronics A151 have more bass than the M9 and M6?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rodrigoqui said:


> Hi Joker!
> I have read your revews, and in a lot of them the triple.fi is cited, so i'm wondering, why didnt you make a review of it yet?
> I'm very curious to read what you think of the triple's, and how it's compared to the others.
> Thanks


 

 There's a list of planned reviews in post #8. I haven't gotten to the TF10s yet as they are not review samples and not a loan so I can keep putting them off again and again.
   


  Quote: 





palthos said:


> I was ready to go for the Custom-3s and treat the cable like a baby, then I found some extra funds hidden with the Amazon card's envelope. The C3s on Amazon are $110 right now with free shipping. I could stretch the budge* *now, but I'm not sure if I'm going to find anything that really outperforms the C3s in that range. The M3s are still poking my thought process from time to time, but only because of the poor cable issues surrounding the C3s. So... $110 C3s or perhaps one of the following in the sub-$200 range:
> 
> Ultimate Ears TripleFi 10 @ $180 (saw it's listed in upcoming)
> Phiaton PS 200 @ $150 (intrigued at this price, but concerned about sibilance)
> ...


 

 That's quite a few options and they are all over the place sound-wise. I think you have to figure out the type of sound you want more specifically as most of those are solid choices IMO (don't know anything about UM2 or X10 personally). HF2 is not really one I'd recommend if you want a large soundstage but the rest are above average or better.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Does the Meelectronics A151 have more bass than the M9 and M6?


 

 No, not even close. M9 and M6 are dynamic-driver bass monsters. The A151 has just a bit more punch than a 'flat' earphone.


----------



## bcwang

ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I sure hope you get to the TF10s soon and not keep putting it off.  I wish you had more UE and Shure coverage, maybe someone needs to send you some, but not at the cost of delaying the TF10 review any further of course.


----------



## Inks

Having patience will pay off, besides there's plenty of TF10 coverage outside of this thread anyways, there's more interesting stuff coming up that peaks more interest.


----------



## mootookang

inks said:


> Having patience will pay off, besides there's plenty of TF10 coverage outside of this thread anyways, there's more interesting stuff coming up that peaks more interest.




+1

It really isn't difficult to find TF10 impression because of the two Amazon deals, it's more fun to get coverage on something that is either completely new or overlooked by the community.


----------



## Inks

How does the SF4 compare to the M6s? What's the SF4s sound signature and how does it rate against it in technical aspects? thanks.


----------



## bcwang

Quote: 





mootookang said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 But don't forget, for many people who own nothing else on the list, a TF10 review may help give a relative gauge of where the other headphones sit in relation to it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bcwang said:


> I sure hope you get to the TF10s soon and not keep putting it off.  I wish you had more UE and Shure coverage, maybe someone needs to send you some, but not at the cost of delaying the TF10 review any further of course.


 

 Well I've got reviews of the SuperFi 3, SuperFi 4, SuperFi 5 / UE600, SuperFi 5 Pro, SuperFi 5 EB, UE600, UE700, and TF10 in the works. I think that should just about cover UE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			






  Quote: 





inks said:


> How does the SF4 compare to the M6s? What's the SF4s sound signature and how does it rate against it in technical aspects? thanks.


 


  The SF4 is dry and slightly warm/dark/bassy for an armature-based earphone. I don't know what kind of driver it uses but after listening to them I wouldn't be surprised if it was a Knowles Siren (also found in the SM PL50, MEE A151, Fischer SBA-01, s-JAYS, NOX Scouts, etc etc). It does two things right - bass texture and soundstaging - but I like it less than any of the other UE earphones (including the SF3/Altec UHP336). Its balance is bottom-tilted and there's a bit of extension missing at the top. I think UE tried to compensate for that by boosting it somewhere in the 4-7k range but all they added was a bit of sibilance with a couple of tracks (M6 is guilty of this on occasion as well). Technically I rate it just above the M6 but preferentially I don't like it very much. I think it has the type of sound signature that's done right by the A151 and q-JAYS but with the SF4 it's not quite there.


----------



## mywallethurts

hi joker
   
  if i were to get either the m3 or xcape, which is better in terms of overall sq? how about the new meelec armature?
  id like something neutral with a little bit of warmth and a hint of sparkle


----------



## mootookang

bcwang said:


> But don't forget, for many people who own nothing else on the list, a TF10 review may help give a relative gauge of where the other headphones sit in relation to it.


TF10's placement can never be cemented, since the IEM depends heavily on the fit and seal. 

Since TF10 is so fit dependent, the review would be very subjective. In this case, having someone who's interested in them search for multiple impression on them might give them more information about whether TF10 is right for them or not. They really are the wildcard of the universal realm, and I can't help but think having a set review on them would do more harm to the reputation than good. (Since it is possible that someone might be disappoint in them from the poor seal, or someone who could get a good seal avoiding them due to the fear of achieving poor seal)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mywallethurts said:


> if i were to get either the m3 or xcape, which is better in terms of overall sq? how about the new meelec armature?
> id like something neutral with a little bit of warmth and a hint of sparkle


 

 For me that would be the Xcape but personal preferences could push it either way. The Xcape is a little dry for my taste but it does have that slightly warm sound with a touch of treble sparkle. The A151 is quicker and just a tad less thick-sounding but there's really no sparkle to speak of. The M3 is slightly brighter but it's got a relaxed high end. It's got my favourite mids of the three but I like the Xcape's treble better as it just has more bite and crispness.


----------



## joe24

Hey ljokerl,
   
   thanks for helping... i am still confused little bit ... just give me an ideal choice which has both bass n isolation... monster turbine or eterna or klipsch s4 or shure se115 ?? ... not over bass .. but should not lack in bass at all...


----------



## idvsego

Quote: 





joe24 said:


> Hey ljokerl,
> 
> thanks for helping... i am still confused little bit ... just give me an ideal choice which has both bass n isolation... monster turbine or eterna or klipsch s4 or shure se115 ?? ... not over bass .. but should not lack in bass at all...


 


  you cant rely entirely on what one person is telling you because sound preferences are different.  very different.  at some point you are going to have to take a chance and buy one.  I suggest picking one of the popular models so you can resell it if you arent happy.


----------



## idvsego

actually, looking back on the response, he gave you a clear single preference...the eterna.
  
  Quote: 





> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## kitkat12012

Just wondering if anyone has had the chance to compare maybe the turbines with the teknines.
   
  I currently have the turbines and also have the teknines on order (store has them on pre-sale so order won't come until february)
   
   
  I've read good things about the teknines, but I have just read in some other thread that ljokerl was unimpressed by them.  I know SQ is subjective but since I'm still a newb to this hobby I have a lot of trust on ljokerl and you guys.
   
  Just wondering if you guys have some quick 2 minute comments so I can go ahead and cancel my order if teknines turnes out to be bad 
   
  thanks guys


----------



## batpig

I have A/B'd the Munitios to the Turbines.  That was actually one of the first comparos I did because they are of similar cost and have similar reputations (great bass). 
   
  The Turbines have a "thinner" sound sound signature that some may prefer, the treble is a bit more forward so it has a bit more of a "detailed" and brighter sound.  Personally, I really hate "bright" sound so I found the treble a bit harsh.  Others may not.  The Turbines do have excellent bass output but I found it a bit boomy / flabby. 
   
  The Munitios have smoother, less fatiguing treble and significantly better bass performance.  Overall a "thicker" sound.  It's deep, extended sub bass and with more overall output.  With some types of music (e.g. rock / metal) it can a bit sound "congested" because there is SO MUCH bass that midrange gets overwhelmed.  This is really easy to EQ out though (e.g. the "treble boost" setting on the iPod EQ cleans it right up). 
   
  Overall the Turbines are like mating a pair of decent, bright speakers with an OK subwoofer.  The Munitios sound more like a pair of smooth, "warm" speakers paired with a monster subwoofer.
   
  One small side note -- the build on the standard Turbines is kinda cheesy, a thin plastic cord and I didn't think the fit was as comfortable (they kept falling out).  The Turbine Pros are better in this respect. The Munitio 9's have a much nicer cord and better fit/isolation. 
   
  here is another post comparing them (and you can see myself repeat nearly similar comments two posts later 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) : http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/528553/dba-02-vs-munitio-teknines/60#post_7201012
   
  Hope that helps!  They aren't for everyone but if like huge bass and a "warm" sound signature with non-fatiguing treble, they will be great.


----------



## JxK

Joker , would you mind briefly comparing the ecci pr401 and the hje900? Do their sound signatures bear anything more than a passing resemblance to each other?


----------



## Niyologist

I'll go for the Meelectronics SP51. The Housing, Comfort, Isolation and Sound should be very similar to the Hippo VBs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kitkat12012 said:


> Just wondering if anyone has had the chance to compare maybe the turbines with the teknines.
> 
> I currently have the turbines and also have the teknines on order (store has them on pre-sale so order won't come until february)
> 
> ...


   
  Yes, and also with the Monster Jamz. I really don't like the Jamz very much but even they compete well with the Teknines. I don't currently have either on hand as I passed the Turbines on to their new owner and the Jamz died again (3rd time in four months...) but I have plenty of other bassy phones - Meelec SP51, Thinksound TS02, Fischer Eterna, Senn IE6, SuperFi5EB, etc. In terms of bass quantity the Teknines lag slightly behind the real bass Monsters (SF5EB and Eterna) but beat the reasonably bass-heavy IE6 and TS02, which is also approximately where the Turbines fall for me. The problem is definition - there just isn't much with the Teknines. Listening to them on their own it isn't particularly noticeable but when compared to something with properly-defined bass (such as the IE6 or Turbine) they sound flabby. The bass is of the soft type and notes lack edge and attack. The Eterna, which really isn't the most sprightly earphone out there, does a better job of relating texture and detail, especially down in the sub-bass region and especially when things get busy. There is a lot of bass bleed and the midrange veil is one of the thickest and most distracting I've heard on a higher-end earphone. They've gotten better with the 150+ hours of burn-in I've put on them but I still have a hard time adjusting to them after using any other earphone. One thing I can't complain about is smoothness - the veil really irons out the sound signature to the point where nothing pops out whatsoever - but the strong bass keeps them from becoming dull and lifeless (which is what happens with the Monster Jamz). They also sound better at higher volumes but I value my hearing too much to 'enjoy' them that way.
  
  On this note I should say that when I figure out the 'sound quality' score for an earphone, I do so by pitting it in a series of A:B comparisons against the rest of my collection. Usually it starts off being compared to a benchmark like the RE-ZERO or Eterna and if I feel that it is worse, I will move down a bit (to the Brainwavz M2 or Thinksound TS02, for example) and repeat until I get to an A:B where the earphone in question 'wins'. With the Teknines I got all the way down to the Earsquake SHA before I felt that it was the clear winner mostly because clarity is easily the most (immediately) noticeable aspect of an earphone's technical proficiency and there really is no way for me to compare these to other earphones without feeling that clarity is being thrown out the window, so I won't - they are what they are.
   
   
  Quote:


jxk said:


> Joker , would you mind briefly comparing the ecci pr401 and the hje900? Do their sound signatures bear anything more than a passing resemblance to each other?


 
 Yeah, there's definitely a resemblance. I still think that the HJE900 is the slightly better earphone - it's a little more crisp, generally quicker, and more tonally correct - but the PR401 is a little more spacious and the midrange recession is a bit less noticeable. I actually sent my PR401s off to someone who has (and loves) the HJE900s and was hooked by my ECCI review so maybe that person will chime in with some direct comparisons.


----------



## kidcharlemagne

^-Thanks for that Joker, I also wanted to know how it compared to the 900; great review on the pr401 as well. If they do drums/percussion anywhere near as well as the 900s I think id really enjoy them =)


----------



## morizuno

hey guys,
   
  custom 3, TF10, normal turbines, RE0, or westone 1s for the most clarity in  metal?


----------



## kitkat12012

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> kitkat12012 said:
> ...


 

 sweet
   
  dude you're the best!!
   
   
   
  I went ahead and cancelled my teknines order and I'm gonna get eternas or ie6s as soon as I get my refund.
   
  Thanks


----------



## batpig

Just remember that is one man's opinion... joker would probably admit a preference towards an IEM with up-front clarity and tight, crisp bass, and the Munitios definitely lean towards a big bass / smooth treble (at the expense of "crisp" sound)... Like I said I actually preferred the Munitios to the Monster Turbines when I A/B'd them, for my tastes (which lean towards heavy bass and a warm / rich sound) I found the Turbines to be too crisp / bright.  What joker considered a "negative" about the Munitios I considered a "plus"... they are not "cold" or "analytical" IEM's but rather big, dynamic fun bass monsters that beg to be cranked up.
   
  I would generally agree with his comments in terms of his characterization of the sound, but I actually LIKE the sound.... for me the only flaw is the midrage "thickness" (what joker calls the "veil") that can muddy things up with certain types of music... but for most music I really enjoy the smooth, mellow warmth of the overall sound.  So just remember to account for personal taste 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  What exactly do you dislike about the Turbines that you want to improve upon?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





morizuno said:


> hey guys,
> 
> custom 3, TF10, normal turbines, RE0, or westone 1s for the most clarity in  metal?


 

 It would be between the TF10 and RE0.


----------



## kitkat12012

Quote: 





batpig said:


> What exactly do you dislike about the Turbines that you want to improve upon?


 
   
   
  me? 
   
  well, i don't dislike the turbines.  it's actually the first real IEM that I've ever had so I can't compare them that good yet.  I'm also liking them so far


----------



## b0ck3n

I'm new to the forum and found this incredible database this morning, only just noticed I've been sitting here reading reviews for over 2 hours. I was wondering if there's a reason why Shure IEMs haven't been reviewed? I'm curious about the SE535 specifically.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





b0ck3n said:


> I'm new to the forum and found this incredible database this morning, only just noticed I've been sitting here reading reviews for over 2 hours. I was wondering if there's a reason why Shure IEMs haven't been reviewed? I'm curious about the SE535 specifically.


 

 I have no personal interest in Shure products after trying a bunch of the lower-end ones early in my head-fi journey. There's no specific reason for avoiding the SE530/535 other than that I haven't felt the urge to go out and buy one myself.


----------



## b0ck3n

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Fair enough.


----------



## VanillaSound

What would be the best choice in the Tier 3A or lower?
  I want a pair to use when I go to class or don't want to carry around my Senn HD280's.
  I have a Cowon J3 that I'm mostly going to be using it with and I listen to all sorts of music except country.
   
  Help would be greatly appreciated, thank you ^^.
   
  P.S. I'm looking for comfort and sound quality.


----------



## ljokerl

3C is the bottom tier (<$15). Do you mean 3A?
   
  If so I'd go for the Brainwavz M1 or Brainwavz ProAlpha, depending on what you're after. Both are available from amazon as of this week.


----------



## VanillaSound

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> 3C is the bottom tier (<$15). Do you mean 3A?
> 
> If so I'd go for the Brainwavz M1 or Brainwavz ProAlpha, depending on what you're after. Both are available from amazon as of this week.


 


  Haha yeah, I meant 3A . Me and my stupid typos.
  After reading your reviews and both of them I think I'm going to go for the M1's .
  I think I'd rather have a more balanced sound than hard hitting.
  Thanks for all your help!
   
  Oh, and by the way. Even though I'm pretty new to this site, I have to say that you're the coolest and most helpful head-fi person so far .
  You help a lot people in a lot ways, thanks a lot .


----------



## mootookang

vanillasound said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




If you're going order the M1, order it through MP4Nations new US website. There's currently a 5% discount, and it wouldn't take 3 weeks of waiting for them.


----------



## Niyologist

I wonder how good the SP51 is? That's what I want to go for.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vanillasound said:


> Haha yeah, I meant 3A . Me and my stupid typos.  After reading your reviews and both of them I think I'm going to go for the M1's .
> I think I'd rather have a more balanced sound than hard hitting.
> Thanks for all your help!
> 
> ...


 
   
  Great, glad you've found the thread useful. Hope you like the earphones!
  
   


  Quote: 





mootookang said:


> If you're going order the M1, order it through MP4Nations new US website. There's currently a 5% discount, and it wouldn't take 3 weeks of waiting for them.


 
   
  I don't think ordering them from amazon would result in a three-week wait as they are shipping from one of amazon's own warehouses.
  
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I wonder how good the SP51 is? That's what I want to go for.


 


  I haven't spent too much time with the SP51 but so far I hear an earphone with too much bass for my tastes and really hard-edged lower treble. I like the CC51 a lot more at this point.


----------



## mootookang

ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Added Hippo Boom & Pearl


----------



## VanillaSound

Quote: 





mootookang said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  From what I can see, it's the same price on Amazon and I have free two day shipping .


----------



## mcnoiserdc

I have been all day refreshing this page to see if you would add some ultimate ears, lol!
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Hippo Boom & Pearl


----------



## esanthosh

Finally, Hippo Pearl review is up . Despite it's drawbacks - efficiency & slightly lesser clarity than I like in the mids, it remains one of the few smooth, non-fatiguing ear phones I can listen to.


----------



## Niyologist

Then how's the CC51 in terms of bass and treble?


----------



## mootookang

Thanks for the review on pearl Joker.

My experience with them is very similar with yours, the only downsides that I can think of are the driver flex issue, inefficiency, and not being very dynamic overall.

They are however, one of the most natural sounding IEMs I've ever heard. I'll also admit that I've been listening to them more than my more expensive IEMs.

It's a bit difficult to imagine the M3 being that neutral because of the mid bump in M2. I did sign up for the review program. I'll compare the two if I was chosen for the review.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





mootookang said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  If you look closely, the Brainwavz stuff on amazon is still sold by MP4Nation, just fulfilled by Amazon


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mcnoiserdc said:


> I have been all day refreshing this page to see if you would add some ultimate ears, lol!


 
 Someday... I just got the SF3 last week so I have to spend time with that now.
   

 Quote:


niyologist said:


> Then how's the CC51 in terms of bass and treble?


 
 Bass response is good - big but not overwhelming. Somewhere between Silver Bullet and Brainwavz M2 in quantity. The treble is smoothed-over and laid-back but fine on the whole. Full review will probably be up the week after next.
   

 Quote:


mootookang said:


> Thanks for the review on pearl Joker.
> 
> My experience with them is very similar with yours, the only downsides that I can think of are the driver flex issue, inefficiency, and not being very dynamic overall.
> 
> ...


 
 Yes, unlike the Boom, the Pearl was one I truly enjoyed. Too bad I like my Brainwavz M1 and iM-590 a little better or it could have become the new $40 benchmark. Plus, I think it has been discontinued although I really can't tell with Hippo anymore. 
   

 Quote:


50an6xy06r6n said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Yes, which means it ships from an amazon fulfillment center.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Can anyone tell me what does "driver flex" means? i see it very often in reviews but never understood what it means.


----------



## kendric

Would be curious to hear your review on Creative EP830 someday (they are available at equivalent USD$46 over at Singapore), As those were quite bang-for-buck for me in the Singapore Market 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  However~ I am more looking forward to you dishing out the tasty reviews about the UE Families for now


----------



## Photofan1986

During the insertion of a dynamic driver iem into your ear, the driver can be compressed due to air pressure, and can be heard as an annoying and worrying sound. That's driver flex. Usually, it does not do any harm to the iem though.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





photofan1986 said:


> During the insertion of a dynamic driver iem into your ear, the driver can be compressed due to air pressure, and can be heard as an annoying and worrying sound. That's driver flex. Usually, it does not do any harm to the iem though.


 


  mm thank you. Indeed, i experience what you describe quite often.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

How are the Ultimate Ears SuperFi 4's rated? (NOT the 4 vi)
   
  I spotted them in the UK for £35 and from the general gist of things I hear about UE, they are pretty darn good. I have my Brainwavz ProAlpha's (£26) en route, finally left Hong Kong, and should be with me in days. If I sell up the ProAlpha's and the Fiio E5 Amp (free gift) I'll break even money-wise and be able to afford the UE SuperFi4's.
   
  However, I would like to know the general opinion on SuperFi 4's before I make a judgement. How much better are they than the ProAlpha's? Are they better? If it makes any difference, I already have the appropriate Comply tips for them (SuperFi 4's use the same tips as the ProAlpha's, lucky coincidence perhaps)
   
  They also have the UE Metro.Fi 150v for £38... just another thing to toy with.
   
  Sound profile: I listen to a very wide variety of music including rock, rap, hip hop, dance, metal, pop etc. Beyond that, I'm not really sure what other music types are. I like, I listen.. I'm a simple man at heart 
   
  EDIT: Seems like I can pick up Monster Turbines from eBay UK for £35 too. Good reseller rating, BNIB. Any ideas?


----------



## xtasi

Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> How are the Ultimate Ears SuperFi 4's rated? (NOT the 4 vi)
> 
> I spotted them in the UK for £35 and from the general gist of things I hear about UE, they are pretty darn good. I have my Brainwavz ProAlpha's (£26) en route, finally left Hong Kong, and should be with me in days. If I sell up the ProAlpha's and the Fiio E5 Amp (free gift) I'll break even money-wise and be able to afford the UE SuperFi4's.
> 
> ...


 

  
  Yeah the UE line-up review is really interesting.  Especially the 600 since it is really similar to the audeo pfe


----------



## macrocheesium

The MC5 review has been in progress for a long time! Any idea when that'll be up joker?


----------



## monoglycer

Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Isn't the UE600 just a rebranded superfi 5 (which has been reviewed by joker)?


----------



## tehbread

Hey Joker,
   
  First allow me to express my awe in response to the comprehensive database you have compiled. I am new to the site, but have always heard people speak about head-fi with such positive tones.. now i know why 
   
  I was hoping you could give me some advice;
   
  I am looking to purchase some headphones for under 200$ after my Shure E2C's broke. The problem with these headphones, and my Head-Direct RE-0's before them, was mainly a durability issue.. the connection between the wire and the jack that plugs into my ipod keeps breaking no matter how well i take care of the headphones.
   
  I was right about to buy a pair of *Panasonic RP-HJE900* ,mainly because of their build quality, but the cheapest price i can find is just below 200$ from amazon, and i think for that price i could probably find something better. Do you think this is a wise investment for the price or should i be looking elsewhere?


----------



## lorafenik

^ Wow, AFAIRember there were times when you could buy them new for around $80
  BTW, FWIR all Etymotics should be very durable and with great customer support. But many complain about lack of bass and straight-into-ear kind of presentation rather than well placed on soundstage.
  Did you think about splittling thease $200 and buying something like M9 (seen around $10, WAY too good for that price, also they seem durable) and something better?
  pzdr, I hope someone with more expirience will help you


----------



## Redmetal1897

Looking forward to your review of the JVC FX700!!!


----------



## mootookang

ljokerl said:


> Yes, unlike the Boom, the Pearl was one I truly enjoyed. Too bad I like my Brainwavz M1 and iM-590 a little better or it could have become the new $40 benchmark. Plus, I think it has been discontinued although I really can't tell with Hippo anymore.


I skipped the recent iM-590 deal because your review stated that they are more analytical, I personally find bumps overemphasize certain parts of music, making it sound a bit unnatural and thus harder to enjoy the muisc.

I'll be sure to give the M1 a try when I get the chance though, especially since Amazon is carrying the brainwavz products now.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


elcomesoft said:


> How are the Ultimate Ears SuperFi 4's rated? (NOT the 4 vi)
> 
> I spotted them in the UK for £35 and from the general gist of things I hear about UE, they are pretty darn good. I have my Brainwavz ProAlpha's (£26) en route, finally left Hong Kong, and should be with me in days. If I sell up the ProAlpha's and the Fiio E5 Amp (free gift) I'll break even money-wise and be able to afford the UE SuperFi4's.
> 
> ...


 
 The SF4vi and SF4 should sound the same. I don't find the SF4 to be a step up from the ProAlpha - it emphasizes the lower half of the frequency spectrum much like the ProAlpha does but the ProAlpha is smoother and more liquid-sounding. The SF4, like all UEs, is not a bad earphone but I think the Meelec A151 actually does that signature better and is much more all-around user friendly to boot for a little more money. MetroFi for more money than the SF4 is a huge rip-off. I think those are worth $30 at most considering current competition in the price range. Turbines for a price that seems too good to be true are probably fake.
   

 Quote:


xtasi said:


> Yeah the UE line-up review is really interesting.  Especially the 600 since it is really similar to the audeo pfe


 
 Well that's true in theory since both use top-firing armatures but the SF5/UE600 (same thing) doesn't really sound a whole lot like the PFE. It's more of a Westone 1 / Soundmagic PL50 type of sound with emphasis on the midrange and slightly rolled-off treble.
   

 Quote:


macrocheesium said:


> The MC5 review has been in progress for a long time! Any idea when that'll be up joker?


 
 That's because my ACS custom tips have been in the works for something like two solid months now. I can post the long-finished MC5/HF3 reviews without mentioning the tips but then I'd have to go back and revisit the earphones at a later time which doesn't seem all that time-effective from my perspective.
   
   
  Quote:


monoglycer said:


> Isn't the UE600 just a rebranded superfi 5 (which has been reviewed by joker)?


 
 I don't think I've reviewed the SF5 aside from maybe saying a word or two about its signature here and there.
   

 Quote:


tehbread said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> First allow me to express my awe in response to the comprehensive database you have compiled. I am new to the site, but have always heard people speak about head-fi with such positive tones.. now i know why
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks - I appreciate that.
   
  The HJE900 has unfortunately gone up drastically in price in the past couple of months. If you're thinking of paying that much, I would maybe take the time to call up OneCall and see what their lowest asking price for one of the Monster Turbine Pro earphones is. I think the lifetime warranty makes them more enticing than the HJE900s as far as durability goes.


----------



## monoglycer

My mistake, must have been a personal communication.



> monoglycer said:
> 
> 
> > Isn't the UE600 just a rebranded superfi 5 (which has been reviewed by joker)?
> ...


----------



## ElcomeSoft

I thought so too though I ordered a pair. PayPal and eBay combination should keep me safe backed up with enough pictures.
   
  You never know, I might get lucky.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SF4vi and SF4 should sound the same. I don't find the SF4 to be a step up from the ProAlpha - it emphasizes the lower half of the frequency spectrum much like the ProAlpha does but the ProAlpha is smoother and more liquid-sounding. The SF4, like all UEs, is not a bad earphone but I think the Meelec A151 actually does that signature better and is much more all-around user friendly to boot for a little more money. MetroFi for more money than the SF4 is a huge rip-off. I think those are worth $30 at most considering current competition in the price range. Turbines for a price that seems too good to be true are probably fake.


----------



## vcjha

Hi, Joker.  Just wanted to let you know this thread has been incredibly helpful in me determining my next IEM.  Thing is I kind of have to narrow things down, since 1. I can't spend above $60 including shipping for the IEM.  I've been looking for the headphone that performs as well as it can it that price range, every detail is clear, all the ranges are extremely distinguishable i.e. mid highs are easily told apart from highs, soundstage is impressive, and any other characteristics you can throw at for the perfect headphones BUT with the cleanest, deepest, tightest, most punchy, but not boomy bass.  I've loved bass for a long time but I hate it when it gets muddy or it doesn't sound clean but I absolutely cannot stand it when the bass becomes distorted even at high levels of volume.  But I'm thinking with a good seal, there's no need to increase volume to high amounts.  All in all, I'm pretty much looking for an IEM that plays as accurately and reveals every detail, every aspect of the song, and has accurate bass.  For the bass, the deeper, the more impact, the tighter, the punchier, deeper, cleaner the better, but the bass has to be just as accurate as the rest of the ranges.  Is it possible for you to recommend me some choices?  Thanks.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Monster Turbine Pro Copper edition earphones on eBay for £50. Seller with over 8,000 sales and 99.7% feedback, limited company, no website, seems ebay only.
   
  Seems like it's too good to be true as usual as they seem to go for about £200 over here. Judging from everything I can read or see, telling the fakes from the genuine is near impossible except by listening to them.
   
  Worth the risk if I could return them via eBay/Paypal for a full refund?


----------



## EternalEmpire

The price sounds very suspect, how could they afford to sell a £200 product for a mere quarter of the price? I found the seller you're talking about on eBay and looked at his feedback and someone accused him of selling them a fake item to which he didn't respond. It also seems he's been selling some dodgy unbranded mp3 players and a lot of other third party stuff which also seems to be unbranded (mostly for iPods and iPads it seems) which don't work correctly which suggests to me that it wouldn't be too far fetched to believe he's selling other fake merchandise.
   
  I also found these headphones he's selling which look exactly like Creative EP-630s but with no branding or anything on them:
  http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BLACK-IN-EAR-HEADPHONES-BUD-4-iPhone-iPod-MP3-MP4_W0QQitemZ280527257554QQihZ018QQcategoryZ112529QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 I wouldn't trust this guy, you have to be careful even when dealing with sellers with feedback as good as his.
  
  Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> Monster Turbine Pro Copper edition earphones on eBay for £50. Seller with over 8,000 sales and 99.7% feedback, limited company, no website, seems ebay only.
> 
> Seems like it's too good to be true as usual as they seem to go for about £200 over here. Judging from everything I can read or see, telling the fakes from the genuine is near impossible except by listening to them.
> 
> Worth the risk if I could return them via eBay/Paypal for a full refund?


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Aye, the price is too good to be true but the MP4 players are branded Nextel? I believe it was, which has been taken over by something like Tektronic Components Ltd.
   
  It doesn't sound quite right and from everything I read, the fakers do a pretty darn good job of masking their fraudulent attempts and it takes quite a bit of deciphering to work it out. The audio is supposed to be the biggest telltale sign.
   
  Just done another cursory look around and found the Turbine Golds for £189.99 (Amazon direct).
   
  I have my fingers crossed for the Monster Turbines I bought from eBay last night which should arrive in a day or two but i always have Paypal protection and my ProAlpha's due at any time so I can be happy.
  
  Quote: 





eternalempire said:


> The price sounds very suspect, how could they afford to sell a £200 product for a mere quarter of the price? I found the seller you're talking about on eBay and looked at his feedback and someone accused him of selling them a fake item to which he didn't respond. It also seems he's been selling some dodgy unbranded mp3 players and a lot of other third party stuff which also seems to be unbranded (mostly for iPods and iPads it seems) which don't work correctly which suggests to me that it wouldn't be too far fetched to believe he's selling other fake merchandise.
> 
> I also found these headphones he's selling which look exactly like Creative EP-630s but with no branding or anything on them:
> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BLACK-IN-EAR-HEADPHONES-BUD-4-iPhone-iPod-MP3-MP4_W0QQitemZ280527257554QQihZ018QQcategoryZ112529QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
> ...


----------



## EternalEmpire

I was looking at the sales from his feedback, all it says is "8GB MP4 Media Player MP3 AVI Video Player + CAMERA".
  
  Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> Aye, the price is too good to be true *but the MP4 players are branded Nextel? I believe it was, which has been taken over by something like Tektronic Components Ltd.*
> 
> It doesn't sound quite right and from everything I read, the fakers do a pretty darn good job of masking their fraudulent attempts and it takes quite a bit of deciphering to work it out. The audio is supposed to be the biggest telltale sign.
> 
> ...


----------



## ElcomeSoft

In the auction listing for those players, you can see a picture of a manual which has the brand name on. A quick Google search brings up the same player and leads you to additional information. Not that it's of much importance really.
   
  "

 [size=10pt]*Dear <me>,*

 Hi Mate

 These are AAA replicas

 Thanks[/size]

 [size=10pt] [size=10pt]- uktronics2010[/size][/size]
 







 

    
  What do I do with this seller now? Report him to eBay? Is there anything I could/should do?
   
  Quote:


eternalempire said:


> I was looking at the sales from his feedback, all it says is "8GB MP4 Media Player MP3 AVI Video Player + CAMERA".
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vcjha said:


> Hi, Joker.  Just wanted to let you know this thread has been incredibly helpful in me determining my next IEM.  Thing is I kind of have to narrow things down, since 1. I can't spend above $60 including shipping for the IEM.  I've been looking for the headphone that performs as well as it can it that price range, every detail is clear, all the ranges are extremely distinguishable i.e. mid highs are easily told apart from highs, soundstage is impressive, and any other characteristics you can throw at for the perfect headphones BUT with the cleanest, deepest, tightest, most punchy, but not boomy bass.  I've loved bass for a long time but I hate it when it gets muddy or it doesn't sound clean but I absolutely cannot stand it when the bass becomes distorted even at high levels of volume.  But I'm thinking with a good seal, there's no need to increase volume to high amounts.  All in all, I'm pretty much looking for an IEM that plays as accurately and reveals every detail, every aspect of the song, and has accurate bass.  For the bass, the deeper, the more impact, the tighter, the punchier, deeper, cleaner the better, but the bass has to be just as accurate as the rest of the ranges.  Is it possible for you to recommend me some choices?  Thanks.


 


  I think with that kind of budget you will have to make sacrifices no matter what. The best you can do is grab one of the better all-around earphones in that price range - something like the Brainwavz M2 or Xears TD100/TD100-II if you can find them - rather than search for something with all of the characteristics you are looking for. For accuracy the Maximo iM-590 is worth considering as well though it has a bit less bass than the M2 and TD100.


----------



## EternalEmpire

The title states they are "Monster Turbine Pro Copper Edition", not "Monster Turbine Pro Copper Edition *REPLICAS*", which is very misleading so you might be able to do something about it. The only hint that they might be replicas is in the product description (notice it's right at the very bottom ¬_¬) where it says they are "AAA quality", but that could've easily been interpreted as "A+ quality" for someone unfamiliar with the term (I had to Google what it meant) and it still doesn't specifically mean they're replicas/fakes (from wikipedia: "AAA, or Triple-A, may be a three-letter acronym *or may just mean something that is high-quality, premier, or excellent.*").
   
  Did you already purchase them from him? You should report him to eBay/Monster as selling fake merchandise and not clearly stating that they aren't the official product.
  
  Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> In the auction listing for those players, you can see a picture of a manual which has the brand name on. A quick Google search brings up the same player and leads you to additional information. Not that it's of much importance really.
> 
> "
> 
> ...


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Nah, I did drop on the £35 Turbines though. Will see how they go but I'm not expecting miracles.
   
  I thought I'd inquire on these Turbine Pro Coppers and see what I turned up. Might shoot eBay an email because the advert is very misleading, taking into account what he told me.
  
  Quote: 





eternalempire said:


> The title states they are "Monster Turbine Pro Copper Edition", not "Monster Turbine Pro Copper Edition *REPLICAS*", which is very misleading so you might be able to do something about it. The only hint that they might be replicas is in the product description (notice it's right at the very bottom ¬_¬) where it says they are "AAA quality", but that could've easily been interpreted as "A+ quality" for someone unfamiliar with the term (I had to Google what it meant) and it still doesn't specifically mean they're replicas/fakes (from wikipedia: "AAA, or Triple-A, may be a three-letter acronym *or may just mean something that is high-quality, premier, or excellent.*").
> 
> Did you already purchase them from him? You should report him to eBay/Monster as selling fake merchandise and not clearly stating that they aren't the official product.


----------



## rroseperry

@|joker|
   
  Thanks for this comprehensive review that just keeps going on.  I wondering, do you think the Fischer Audio Silver Bullets are characteristic of their house sound? I just bought some from a fellow head-fier and am really enjoying them. Enough to make me think that getting a DBA-02 wouldn't be such a bad idea.


----------



## rawrster

Do Fischer even have a house sound? It looks like they just have a whole bunch of different earphones to have something for everyone.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Hi, so I currently have a pair of UE 500's, and I'm considering upgrading. I was wondering, based on your impressions of them, at what point would I see a significant improvement? I'm probably looking for an overall more balanced sound btw


----------



## rroseperry

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Do Fischer even have a house sound? It looks like they just have a whole bunch of different earphones to have something for everyone.


 


  I have no idea, but I like how warm these are.  The DBA-02 has been praised, but I'm not in the mood for an analytical 'phone.


----------



## Inks

Fischer don't have a house sound. The DBA02s sound very different to the SBs. The SBs are a well balanced and fun v-shaped iem whereas the DBAs are overall linear and analytical, less dynamic and fun.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Hi, so I currently have a pair of UE 500's, and I'm considering upgrading. I was wondering, based on your impressions of them, at what point would I see a significant improvement? I'm probably looking for an overall more balanced sound btw


 

 I think you'd have to move to something like the RE-ZERO to see a noticeable improvement over the UE500. The UE500 is actually a pretty decent earphone, though slightly overpriced for what it offers. 
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> Fischer don't have a house sound. The DBA02s sound very different to the SBs. The SBs are a well balanced and fun v-shaped iem whereas the DBAs are overall linear and analytical, less dynamic and fun.


 

 +1. I think that Fischer, like all of the smaller hi-fi manufacturers, shops around with many OEMs to find earphones that they like and then ask for them to be tuned this way or that. It's definitely safer to choose an upgrade path based on the sound signature of the SBs and not the brand...


----------



## FlySweep

There's something in the way FA render mids which I really enjoy.  I own the 003, 004, SB, and DBA.. and can hear a similarity in the way the mids seem tuned.  While all these phones have quite different signatures, the mids with all the FA phones Iv'e heard always have a surprising degree of clarity and instrument separation (despite how the bass & treble is tuned).  This has always seemed apparent to my ears no matter how warm/fun or cool/analytical the overall sound of their phones are.
   
  Just my 2c.


----------



## Orange1

*HJE900 vs. ECCI 401*​  ​  ​  Joker asked if I could give my impressions of the two.  I own the CZ's (HJE900).  I describe them as FUN the FUNNEST, see that word as billboard sized.  They are heavily theatrical.  You get a deep bass it is subwoofer in impact.  It is spherical, it is like being at the circus and watching the instruments swing from the trapeze, lots of oohs and ahhhs. When you are listening to music it is an EVENT at times stunning.  So what happened why would I ever want another? 
   
  I've changed, I'm more mellow myself, contemplative.  I felt that I was getting sensory overload and wanted something more relaxed.
   
  Enter the 401's.  There is ample bass for me, but less accentuated as the CZ's These are still fun, but see it as tiny print, they are the last step until analytical territory.  They are everything that Joker has written of them (who am I to try to technically review against the golden ears of Joker).  What I can say is that they are very sweet, very pretty.  They delight so gently, coy in their presentation.  The more time I spend the more I can melt and relax, fall asleep even. 
   
  Are the 401's better?  No way.  But they are better for me right now.  Suiting me perfectly.  Unfortunately the only upgrade says Joker is the JVC  FX700 over 300 bucks.
   
  I'm going to sell my CZ's.


----------



## idvsego

This thread gets tons of looks so I think I am going to jump on the bandwagon of "what upgrade makes sense for me".  currently the IEMs I use (VB and soon to arrive Eterna) are fun, bassy sound sigs.  I am looking for something that steps more into the detail realm...something to add some variety to my inventory.  These would be the set I break out for acoustic music or stuff that has strong vocal presence.  I still need some bass in there though.  I think my J3 and BBE can help me bring this out in most IEMs so I am not too scared about that.  I am intrigued by the Phonaks, Silver Bullet, RE0, RE0Zero, SW-Xscape, Meelectronics a151.  Maybe a Thinksound product.  What do you guys think?


----------



## rawrster

I thought you were done Orange1  It's nice to see a familiar face around after a hiatus. Thanks for the impressions on them compared to the HJE900. The flat cable and tangling probably won't make them for me if it's really bad.


----------



## Orange1

Well rawrster  I suppose if you put your mp3 player down and then do several somersaults,  your gonna have a problem with the linguine you know.
   
  May God help me, I just bought the M2 from mp4nation for 36 bucks.  But then I'm out!


----------



## tan1415

Quote: 





orange1 said:


> Well rawrster  I suppose if you put your mp3 player down and then do several somersaults,  your gonna have a problem with the linguine you know.
> 
> May God help me, I just bought the M2 from mp4nation for 36 bucks.  But then I'm out!


 

 Where did you get the M2s for 36$? cant find it on the Mp4nation website.


----------



## Orange1

Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## tan1415

Wow what a sweetdeal.
   Still trying to figure out which IEM to go for.M2 or M3. Even though this seems like a nobrainer.
   
  Man besides the steaks and gasprices....all these sweet deals makes me jealous. Never understood why one of the wealthiest nations in the world also always ends up with the best deals.
  Just compare the respective deal threads.
   
  Btw i guess i am infected here too. Already thinking which IEM i want to try next,...and havn't even done my first serious purchase yet.


----------



## rawrster

Well I'm happy with the Brainwavz M2 and my one and only universal. If I still wanted one I'd probably have bought the PR401 by now. I'm pretty happy with my portable setup right now so don't really find any need to upgrade esp since an upgrade would be very expensive. My desktop setup is another story however..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





idvsego said:


> This thread gets tons of looks so I think I am going to jump on the bandwagon of "what upgrade makes sense for me".  currently the IEMs I use (VB and soon to arrive Eterna) are fun, bassy sound sigs.  I am looking for something that steps more into the detail realm...something to add some variety to my inventory.  These would be the set I break out for acoustic music or stuff that has strong vocal presence.  I still need some bass in there though.  I think my J3 and BBE can help me bring this out in most IEMs so I am not too scared about that.  I am intrigued by the Phonaks, Silver Bullet, RE0, RE0Zero, SW-Xscape, Meelectronics a151.  Maybe a Thinksound product.  What do you guys think?


 

 If you want to maintain bass impact levels at above-flat and still get lots of detail, I'd go for the Xcape though I haven't heard the Phonak Perfect Bass.


----------



## idvsego

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Thanks, after a day of reading around, those are the 2 that I am most inters ted in.  Silver Bullet seemed nice but your comments about build quality leave me cautious.


----------



## esanthosh

@ljokerl,
   
  Any chance you could get the latest TDIII from Xears for review? http://www.xears.com/de/index.php?p=produkte&details=65
   
  @idvsego,
   
  GD-Audiobase lists Silver Bullet v2 with improved cable (OOS though!) - http://www.gd-audiobase.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=11&category_id=4&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=2. From what I read, there are no changes (not even a marking saying version 2 anywhere) apart from the cable.


----------



## idvsego

I will not order from GD-audibase...I tried to get the eternas fro them and their payment system requires an SMS message be sent to your phone.  2 attempts and I didnt get a message.  so I used my google voice number, same result.  I contacted GD about it and they offered to let me pay with paypal if I payed an additional 7% upcharge.  so that brought my total up to about $80 after shipping and surcharge.  I cancelled and ordered my eternas from bugden for $67.50 shipped and used paypal.  The SB and the Sunrise are OOS there too.  its ok, I am in no rush.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

So how big is the gap between the RE-0/RE-Zeroes and multiple-armature phones like the q-Jays, TF10s, etc? Also, you've made some disparaging comments on the UE 700's so where would they fall in there?


----------



## ljokerl

Added Meelec CX21 and CW31. Also posted a review of the Munitio Teknines here. It will probably take me a while to add them here as I have more pressing additions for this thread.
  
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> @ljokerl,
> 
> Any chance you could get the latest TDIII from Xears for review? http://www.xears.com/de/index.php?p=produkte&details=65


 


  Sent Thomas an email so we'll see what happens. They sure are tempting - aesthetics are excellent and Turbine-style housings always fit me well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			






  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> So how big is the gap between the RE-0/RE-Zeroes and multiple-armature phones like the q-Jays, TF10s, etc? Also, you've made some disparaging comments on the UE 700's so where would they fall in there?


 

 I don't think I can quantify a gap any more than I have with numerical scores. Diminishing returns are obviously a factor and so are personal preferences - I can see someone preferring the RE0 to the TF10 or q-JAYS or vice versa. I think the jump between the RE0 and TF10 in terms of overall proficiency is quite noticeable but, like most of the high bang/buck midrange earphones, the RE0 does certain things very well. As for the UE700, it's not that it's a poor earphone but rather that it really doesn't capitalize on the potential of the driver. I rate it around RE0 level or maybe a little below which is worse than any of the other $100+ dual armatures and a lot worse than the CK10, which uses the same driver.


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> So how big is the gap between the RE-0/RE-Zeroes and multiple-armature phones like the q-Jays, TF10s, etc?


 
   
  I purchased Sunrise Xcapes (joker's SQ=8.75) when I was without my favorite Fischer DBA-02's (SQ=9.75) for a while. I find them remarkably similar, but always prefer the DBA's now that I've repaired them (from my carelessness, not their weakness). There can occasionally be a little more bass quantity with the Xcapes (sometimes even a little too much!), but I've always heard just the right amount and texture of bass, well-balanced with everything else, with the Fishers.
   
  I've been struggling to figure out how to describe the differences between these two, and haven't come up with anything specific except what I just said - I always like the DBA's better. That said, I would have been quite happy with Xcapes if I'd bought those first.


----------



## m4xc4v413r4

Just bought those for €25 + shipping 
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> @ljokerl,
> 
> Any chance you could get the latest TDIII from Xears for review? http://www.xears.com/de/index.php?p=produkte&details=65


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *dfrost* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I purchased Sunrise Xcapes (joker's SQ=8.75) when I was without my favorite Fischer DBA-02's (SQ=9.75) for a while. I find them remarkably similar, but always prefer the DBA's now that I've repaired them (from my carelessness, not their weakness). There can occasionally be a little more bass quantity with the Xcapes (sometimes even a little too much!), but I've always heard just the right amount and texture of bass, well-balanced with everything else, with the Fishers.
> 
> I've been struggling to figure out how to describe the differences between these two, and haven't come up with anything specific except what I just said - I always like the DBA's better. That said, I would have been quite happy with Xcapes if I'd bought those first.


 

 If you think that's hard you should try having the RE-Zero and the Xcape. When I had the Xcape on loan they sound very similar t the RE-Zero. In fact I may go so far as to say that it may be the same driver but tweaked a bit differently. I believe Sunrise does some OEM for HifiMan so it might not be too far fetched.


----------



## mailliw320

How does the bass impact of the CK10 compare to the RE0?


----------



## ElcomeSoft

If I could ask here, are these or these sellers of RE0's genuine? There is another UK source for them but they are more expensive and don't fill me with great joy and elation either. eBay has a similar price but it's eBay.. 
   
  What Comply tips fit the RE0's and if there are any UK'ers here, where did you get your RE0's from?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> If I could ask here, are these or these sellers of RE0's genuine? There is another UK source for them but they are more expensive and don't fill me with great joy and elation either. eBay has a similar price but it's eBay..
> 
> What Comply tips fit the RE0's and if there are any UK'ers here, where did you get your RE0's from?


 
  Head-Direct I think is the official distributor of Hifiman products (or are they actually hifiman themselves? I'm not sure) Anyway, they should be reputable, and their site is backed by Amazon too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mailliw320 said:


> How does the bass impact of the CK10 compare to the RE0?


 

 A little greater on the whole but not a night-and-day difference. The greatest advantage is probably in that the CK10 doesn't really roll off at the low end and is very fast - it really sounds absolutely immediate when it comes to impact. 
   


  Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> If I could ask here, are these or these sellers of RE0's genuine? There is another UK source for them but they are more expensive and don't fill me with great joy and elation either. eBay has a similar price but it's eBay..
> 
> What Comply tips fit the RE0's and if there are any UK'ers here, where did you get your RE0's from?


 

 Well, Head-Direct (1st link) is actually the manufacturer of the RE0 so I would certainly hope they are genuine. Ampcity is very much legit as well. Counterfeit RE0s is something I would not worry about.
   
  400-series complys (T400, Tx400, etc) fit fine.


----------



## mywallethurts

@joker: how would you compare the ck10 to the re262? since im planning to buy the former


----------



## DervishD

Again, thanks, ljokerl 
   
  I was very interested in the review of the new CW31 from Meelec, as I'm not a wooden-earphone guy but I have friends who love them. Now I know how they sound 
   
  As for the CX-21, I had great expectations. Well, I have expectations on all the new Clarity line. When I listen music for fun I prefer the sound signature of the M11+, for example, but when I do critical listening, to spot problems in sounds, etc. I need a more neutral earphone even though I don't like the signature. To date I've been using the PL50 for that, but they are not my piece of cake and I wanted a dynamic alternative. Looks like the CX21 was what I was looking for: reasonably cheap, reasonably neutral, good design for insertion in my weird shaped ears.
   
  THANKS!


----------



## RBNHIFI

Hi All,
   
  i've been looking for the ideal pair of iphone compatible IEMs (for myself) and my shortlist is:
  Meelec cc51
  Thinksound ts02
  AP PFE022 perfect bass
  Denon C560R
   
  i've been in touch with joker regarding the first 2 as he has sampled them.  Thought i'd share jokers comments with the rest of the class regarding *thinksound ts02 vs Meelec CC51*.  Please see below:
   
_"they are mostly different in the way music is presented, though I think the CC51 has the upper hand in overall SQ. Both emphasize bass & midrange over treble. The Thinksounds are more textured and prone to bass 'rumble' and win out in overall bass quantity (though not by much). The CC51s are smoother and more prone to bass 'punch'. They are more fluid and remind me more of the Brainwavz earphones in terms of cohesiveness and the way notes are presented. In terms of presentation the TS02s sound more like open-back earphones, with a lot of air and slightly 'hollow' (a.k.a woody) sound. The CC51 sounds smaller but it's got a nice spherical soudstage that is filled completely with music. _
   
_For comfort I quite like both but they are different in principle. The Thinksounds are fairly shallow-insertion earphones and aren't really dependent on seal quality. The CC51 has those nozzle-mounted microdrivers and behaves more like an armature when it comes to seal sensitivity. The entire 6mm-wide nozzle needs to go into the ear canal and a relatively deep seal sounds best, In terms of size they are very simliar to the apple dual-drivers which I thought were very comfortable. Of course the ceramic Meelecs are heavier but the fit is still similar."_
   
  I've been advised that CC51 will become available in the UK in the next 2 to 3 weeks so i'll think i'll wait to purchase them.
   
  Thanks Joker


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, Head-Direct (1st link) is actually the manufacturer of the RE0 so I would certainly hope they are genuine. Ampcity is very much legit as well. Counterfeit RE0s is something I would not worry about.
> 
> 400-series complys (T400, Tx400, etc) fit fine.


 
   
  Cheers |Joker| once again! Seems like the first site does not allow me to ship to a UK address. Damn Amazon.com and their awkwardness!
   
  Looks like AmpCity might get my £60 for the RE0's or my Dad said he found the MEElectronics A151 for £45 over here too... Decisions Decisions!
   
  Any advice on this?


----------



## Niyologist

Is the SP51 almost as good as the Hippo VB? because that'll be good enough for me!


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  You can try to buy it from them directly (not through the amazon web store
http://www.head-direct.com/product_detail.php?p=38


----------



## roker

Hey Mr. Joker,
   
  Thanks for all your reviews.  You're an asset to the community.  Ok, I'm going to have to return my NE-700Ms.  I'm within the 30 days and this isn't the first time a NuForce product has failed on me.
   
  Now, what do you recommend I get?  I definitely do NOT want bass monsters but I do want an iPhone compatible headphone (otherwise RE0s would've been my choice).   Have you ever gotten a chance to try out the Ety HF2s?  I'm not sure if I want a deep insertation, but I'd like some resemblance of sound stage and detail with my next pair.  I want bass, I just don't want it at the forefront of the sound.
   
  Thanks for your time.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





roker said:


> Hey Mr. Joker,
> 
> Thanks for all your reviews.  You're an asset to the community.  Ok, I'm going to have to return my NE-700Ms.  I'm within the 30 days and this isn't the first time a NuForce product has failed on me.
> 
> ...


 

 I think you're wearing the NE-700X inserted too deeply, which can hurt the highs and increase the bass.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I think you're wearing the NE-700X inserted too deeply, which can hurt the highs and increase the bass.


 

 Hey Larry, thanks for all your help.  I really value your opinions.  But I played this game last time with NuForce where my NE-7Ms kept failing and I kept having to get them replaced.  The 700Ms failed on me and I think I'm going to pay a premium to own a pair of IEMs that don't break on me in a couple of weeks.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Which is just as expensive as Ampcity but would take at least 3 timesas long to reach me, presumably.
  
  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> You can try to buy it from them directly (not through the amazon web store
> http://www.head-direct.com/product_detail.php?p=38


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


mywallethurts said:


> @joker: how would you compare the ck10 to the re262? since im planning to buy the former


 
 Two very different earphones - one is fast, bright, flat, accurate, and hyperdetailed and the other is soft, warm, and relaxed.
   

 Quote:


elcomesoft said:


> Cheers |Joker| once again! Seems like the first site does not allow me to ship to a UK address. Damn Amazon.com and their awkwardness!
> 
> Looks like AmpCity might get my £60 for the RE0's or my Dad said he found the MEElectronics A151 for £45 over here too... Decisions Decisions!
> 
> Any advice on this?


 
 The A151 for 25% less than the RE0 is a good deal if usability matters to you as much as sound quality but the RE0s still win fairly easily if sound is all you're concerned with. And of course the two do differ - the RE0 is neutral with slightly emphasized treble while the A151 is neutral with slightly emphasize midbass (which makes it darker).
   

 Quote:


roker said:


> Hey Mr. Joker,
> 
> Thanks for all your reviews.  You're an asset to the community.  Ok, I'm going to have to return my NE-700Ms.  I'm within the 30 days and this isn't the first time a NuForce product has failed on me.
> 
> ...


 
  Broken so soon? It really seemed like the NE-700 was well thought-out compared to the NE-6. 
   
  I have the Ety HF3 (and like it) However, I'm not sure you realize how great the difference in bass quantity between the Nuforce earphones and the RE0/HF3/etc is. Whether the NE-700M is a bass monster or not depends on your bass tolerance and maybe seal depth but the HF3 is on the lighter side in terms of impact no matter what you do. Detail is off the charts on the HF-series Etymotics but if you're after a well-rounded soundstage they aren't for you. Like all Etys the HF3 is fairly tubular, i.e. decent width but not much in the way of front-to-rear or top-to-bottom soundstaging. 
   
  Have you looked into the mic-enabled Phonak models? The cable issues have supposedly been fixed and the Perfect Bass might have a balance that would work for you. Even the old PFE beats the HF3 in bass quantity, though not by much, and has a more well-rounded presentation. I am tempted to recommend the Maximo iP-HS5 or Meelec CW31P but they are arguably a slight downgrade from the NE-700 from a technical standpoint. I wish I could get the CC51P review up already but the JVC FX700 is taking up all of my time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> Which is just as expensive as Ampcity but would take at least 3 timesas long to reach me, presumably.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 
  I wouldn't know anything about that... If you're sure that Ampcity is a reputable seller, I would say to just go get them there...


----------



## roker

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Broken so soon? It really seemed like the NE-700 was well thought-out compared to the NE-6.


 
   
  Tell me about it.
   
  I really like NuForce and they have great customer service, but I also sent my NE-7Ms back like 4 times before I received a pair that lasted me for a year (the cable got torn because of my carelessness eventually).
   
  But yeah, thanks for the recommendations.  I'll look into them.  I don't know if "bass monsters" was the right term, but I think my issue was more about placement.  I guess I was expecting the bass to hang back a bit like it does with my full size and portable headphones.  I'm going to look into the ones you recommended. Thanks again.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> I wouldn't know anything about that... If you're sure that Ampcity is a reputable seller, I would say to just go get them there...


 

 |Joker| has already confirmed AmpCity's credentials. That doesn't seem to be a problem.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The A151 for 25% less than the RE0 is a good deal if usability matters to you as much as sound quality but the RE0s still win fairly easily if sound is all you're concerned with. And of course the two do differ - the RE0 is neutral with slightly emphasized treble while the A151 is neutral with slightly emphasize midbass (which makes it darker).


 

 Thanks for the cut down version, |Joker|. I was leaning towards the RE0's before but a little bit touchy on whether the price difference was worth it. Will give it some more ponderings but I'm leaning even more towards the RE0 now.
   
*EDIT:* Ordered my Head-Direct RE0's from AmpCity (Direct, not via Amazon, save myself £4 P&P). Cannot wait


----------



## vilasn

Hey,
   
  Which tips do you recommend if I want to get good bass out of Phonak Audeo PFE, I know these are bass light headphones.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vilasn said:


> Hey,
> 
> Which tips do you recommend if I want to get good bass out of Phonak Audeo PFE, I know these are bass light headphones.
> 
> Thanks.


 


  I would recommend trying the included complies but would also consider getting the 'Perfect Bass' (green?) filters.


----------



## akacoke

hey jorker,  after spending sometime with turbine gold, i find they clearly is a big step up in all specs,  how come i find the turbine gold have less/similar bass in quantity than the m2?
   
   they now have about 20 hrs burn in with bass heavy R&B and rap, mixed with few hours with brown, white, pink noise.  they have less impact than m2, quantity is about 5% less, some tracks 10% more than the m2.   is it possible that my m2 is not normal pair or the golds are defective?
   
  they both have about 10-20% less bass in quantity compare to the portapro
   
  do you have any thoughts about this situation? maybe i need an amp to drive the gold for it the reach the full potential?


----------



## ljokerl

It's very likely that the M2 does indeed have more mid/upper-bass than the Gold since it has that hump below ~250 hz. It is also possible that you need to play around with the fit since the Monster earphones can be worn too shallowly. The Golds really aren't bass monsters but they do provide ample, linear, high quality bass with great extension. I'd give them some more time.


----------



## akacoke

i think im getting good fit , right now im using the second smallest gel super tip,  i fit them deep, the mid bass " feels " about same compare to the m2s now, i guess i will do some more 'brain burn' in then,  thanks for the response


----------



## FlySweep

My PR401's arrived today.. all I can say is WOW.  I haven't been this impressed with a set of phones since getting the DBAs.  Real talk.
   
  I've been listening to them for just a few hours.. and joker's review is spot ON, disturbingly spot on, in fact. I'm so impressed with how accurate his explanations and impressions are (at least when the phones he's reviews hit my ears):
   
  --Terrific, balanced bass with excellent texture, presence, extension, and detail. NEVER bloated or leaking into the lower midrange, no annoying mid-bass hump whatsoever.  I love hearing bass this accurate and well mannered.
   
  --The treble is simply incredible.. INCREDIBLE. I'm not sure how you can get such a crisp, defined, and extended treble with a wonderful sparkle without ANY sibilance.. but ECCI did it... in spades.  I really can't get over how rounded the treble is on these phones.. nothing phases them.  It's an absolute joy to listen to alone.
   
  --The midrange is rendered really well for my tastes.  Tilted slightly to the cooler, more analytical side than the warmer side.  It's neither lush or dry.. just very neutral to my ears.. lovely.  The mids are recessed ever EVER so slightly.. but they don't sound recessed.. that obviously doesn't make sense but I think it has more to do my final point:
   
  --If the above didn't impress you, the overall presentation of the entire range of frequencies is where these IEMs set themselves apart from the competition.  The way all the qualities of the bass, treble, and midrange blend seemingly perfectly with each other impresses me to no end.  Someone put some serious effort into tuning this phone to sound very VERY cohesive.. which I can't appreciate enough.
   
  I'm a self-confessed iM-590 fanboy and was a little afraid the ECCI's would be too similar to them.. it's safe to say while these PR401's share some of the same qualities (accuracy, balance).. the ECCI is actually a pretty good complement.  The iM590's have a more lush slightly forward midrange, while the PR401's mids are slightly laid back and the overall presentation is airer with a better soundstage.  I'd say the 401's trump the Maximo's in treble extension and detail as well.
   
  I didn't even get into other areas like the superb instrument separation, impressive soundstage, etc. cause well, I want to stop typing and go back to enjoying these phones!  Suffice to say, it's all there and I'm 110% satisfied.  Joker knocks ANOTHER one out of the park for this HFier!  Think I'll have to go over and pitch into the fund for buying him some customs.. the least I could do for all the work he's put in here and not to mention, all the money he's saved me by not having to sort through a bunch of other IEMs.
   
  I hope more people get a chance to try the PR401s.. I guarantee you they'll impress and punch well above their weight/price range.  They most definitely deserve an appreciation thread.. which I might have to start!


----------



## ElcomeSoft

I am posting this to praise some excellent customer service and to unleash my excitement at my earphones order.
   
  Following severalposts, mind changes and moans and groans from my bank balance, I went ahead and ordered my Head-Direct RE0's from AmpCity (direct, not via Amazon UK) for a grand total of £63.
   
  Everything went through alright and I took an afternoon nap, only to be woken up by a pleasant gentleman at AmpCity. I apologise if I have incorrect spelled his name if he ever reads this but a spoke to Yousef from AmpCity who advised me that although the website showed that the RE0 was in stock, they had none available... but he had a solution!
   
  A brief conversation ensued and as a gesture of goodwill, Yousef upgraded me to the RE-ZERO for free (was £10/$15 more expensive) and my order was shipped very shortly after. I should be the proud owner of a limited edition of earphones on Monday or Tuesday... perhaps today if the Royal Mail Gods are with me.
   
  My thanks and appreciation goes out to AmpCity and Yousef for contacting me quickly when a problem arose and providing me with an acceptable (a darn good) solution which did not inconvenience me.
   
  A display of customer service which is rare and deserving of praise.


----------



## akacoke

i dont really believe the re zero would be limited edition


----------



## ElcomeSoft

It has been said that only 1,000 RE-ZERO's will be/were made.
  
  Quote: 





akacoke said:


> i dont really believe the re zero would be limited edition


----------



## akacoke

i take it as you never lie in your life


----------



## sphinxvc

I propose, (if you've gotten the pair you loaned out back), that the TF10s be bumped to the top of the queue!


----------



## jjmai

How does Yamaha EPH-50's bass compare with that of Turbine, Eterna, and Klipsch s4?
  thanks


----------



## ElcomeSoft

RE-ZERO's arrived and loving them. My phone seems to be able to drive them well and despite the first half hour being rather disappointing (postman dropped them off as I was going out so I stuck them in and went out with them in) they are proving to be excellent earphone after some burn-in. I just left them playing music at around 60% volume for a couple of hours while I did other stuff.
   
  My phone has been playing song after song and I am enjoying listening to each one of them in a new light. It is a true joy to listen to a song that you have cherihsed for years and realise that with my stock earphones that I was actually missing instruments or small sounds which had become blurred into the other sounds or swamped out by improper bass.
   
  Dearly do I miss the bass punch of the other earphones I have used but I am happy with the bass produced by the RE-ZERO's. So far, they could do with a bit more punch/power in the bass department for my personal tastes. Honestly, the RE-ZERO's make it up to me in many more ways.
   
  I do not find the sound to be lacking in life or vibrancy. Some songs have suffered in my ears compared to previous earphones but other tracks have taken on a new life altogether, conveying an intimacy I have not experienced thus far.
   
  Downsides? Besides the bass, the extra connector I have to use. A very minor annoyance for a man using a portable player to have an extra little bit attached.
   
  The seal: I cannot seem to get it just right in both ears yet with the stock bi-flanges. Going to give this a real go and see what I can do. Most probably user error but I have time and tips on my side
   
  I think this classifies under bone conduction. I can feel/hear each footstep I take in my ears however during my 30 minute test this morning it probably wasn't an accurate representation for the earphones and I was in a rush so I was walking faster, planting my foot harder than I would normally.
   
  First impressions: Impressed. Seriously impressed. A few minor niggles which will be ironed out or sorted out through use. Compared to my previous best earphone (V-Moda Vibes ~2007, Head-Fi recommendation which cost me ~£70), these earphones simply blow them out of the water.
   
  (A non-audiophile review)


----------



## Angelopsaro

Personally i wait for joker's review on the the clarity series cc51! the look awesome and very comfortable. I imagine their sound something like sunrise x-scape. If thats the the case then this will me my first above 50$ iem.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> My PR401's arrived today.. all I can say is WOW.  I haven't been this impressed with a set of phones since getting the DBAs.  Real talk.
> 
> I've been listening to them for just a few hours.. and joker's review is spot ON, disturbingly spot on, in fact. I'm so impressed with how accurate his explanations and impressions are (at least when the phones he's reviews hit my ears):
> 
> ...


 

 Wow, sounds like you like them even more than I do 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I agree, they are absolutely fantastic for the money and I'm glad you hear them the way I do. Interesting thing about appreciation threads - haven't seen a whole lot of them for budget-level products lately. The Meelec M6, PL30, Klipsch S4, and ADDIEM all had them but none of the new (and much better) <$100 earphones do. I guess with so many great options on the market the number if owners of each 'thins out' and there's less appreciation to go around 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> I propose, (if you've gotten the pair you loaned out back), that the TF10s be bumped to the top of the queue!


 

 Sorry, for now the JVC HA-FX700 has been moved to the top of the queue, since I have to give it back to its owner, as well as the Meelec SP51 and CC51 since I figured people may want to read about them while they're still on pre-order pricing. After that a few minor ones and then the TF10,
   


  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> How does Yamaha EPH-50's bass compare with that of Turbine, Eterna, and Klipsch s4?
> thanks


 

 It's a little flabbier than all of those but powerful and impactful. It's a 'raw' sort of sound, reminds me of the Rockford/Fosgate Punch Plugs. And yes, the $29.99 newegg price is a pretty good deal on those.


  Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> RE-ZERO's arrived and loving them. My phone seems to be able to drive them well and despite the first half hour being rather disappointing (postman dropped them off as I was going out so I stuck them in and went out with them in) they are proving to be excellent earphone after some burn-in. I just left them playing music at around 60% volume for a couple of hours while I did other stuff.
> 
> [...]
> 
> ...


 

 Glad that whole purchased worked out so well. At the same price I'll take the ZERO over the RE0 any day. Regarding fit, the Head-Direct bi-flanges simply don't work for some people. I feel that all of the included tips and whatever other tips you have (from the V-Modas, etc) are worth trying. Bone conduction is something you'll get used to - I don't even notice it anymore. Just to eliminate cable noise as a factor try wearing them over-the-ear and see if it gets any better.
   


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Personally i wait for joker's review on the the clarity series cc51! the look awesome and very comfortable. I imagine their sound something like sunrise x-scape. If thats the the case then this will me my first above 50$ iem.


 


  Nope, not like the Xcape. More like a budget-minded Turbine Pro Gold - warm, smooth, and with an emphasis on the lower half of the frequency spectrum.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Glad that whole purchased worked out so well. At the same price I'll take the ZERO over the RE0 any day. Regarding fit, the Head-Direct bi-flanges simply don't work for some people. I feel that all of the included tips and whatever other tips you have (from the V-Modas, etc) are worth trying. Bone conduction is something you'll get used to - I don't even notice it anymore. Just to eliminate cable noise as a factor try wearing them over-the-ear and see if it gets any better.


 
   
  It did, all thanks to you |joker|. A comprehensive review list backed with friendly help... A credit to the community.
   
  Thanks has to go to AmpCity for their great support. Most companies would not have bothered to call me if I had ordered an item that was inadvertently out of stock.
   
  The Bi-flanges are an oddity for me. My right ear is notoriously difficult to seal and fit properly but with the bi-flanges, I seem to get one ear right and the other one is wrong. Currently using Comply tips and they seem to be pretty awesome with their fit and comfort is insanely good but I don't think I'll be able to use them outside as the isolation seems to be terrible. Still have some V-Moda tips and old Sony tips to try as well as the others that come with the ZERO.
   
  Ever since hearing about microphonics and bone conduction, I've been wearing IEM's over my ear... even if they were just sitting on my chest whilst laying back in bed. I only mentioned bone conduction as being an issue because I've not used IEM's for a couple of years and you're right, I'll need to build up my tolerance for it again.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Nope, not like the Xcape. More like a budget-minded Turbine Pro Gold - warm, smooth, and with an emphasis on the lower half of the frequency spectrum.


 


  Hmm.. Then it sounds like a miss use of the "clarity series" logo. But i shouldnt judge by the sound signature and wait for more detailed reviews.


----------



## CareyPrice31

@Joker
   
  What would IEM would you recommend for mainly Dance, Pop, Rap/Hip-hop and some techno/house/cub.
   
  My source will be a DIYMOD 5.5G iPod video with a Pico Slim.

 Willing to spend $500.


----------



## seanmo

@joker - have you done a triple fi 10 pro review?
  been spending a ton of time reading this post...thanks for all the work you put in on the reviews


----------



## ZV3

Quote: 





seanmo said:


> @joker - have you done a triple fi 10 pro review?
> been spending a ton of time reading this post...thanks for all the work you put in on the reviews


 
   
  I am wondering when the TF10 review is coming also. Not sure what is taking so long, the TF 10 is one of the older IEM's and tons of people are waiting for the review, but I keep seeing reviews for the newer earphones, which is a little strange. Not sure what the hold-up is, I would love to know what joker thinks about them.


----------



## rawrster

It looks like the TF10 review will have to come out sooner or later 
   
  Although I didn't really care for them as soon as I got the CK10 in my possession which will once again be mine soon but you knew that already


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *Angelopsaro* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Hmm.. Then it sounds like a miss use of the "clarity series" logo. But i shouldnt judge by the sound signature and wait for more detailed reviews.


 
 Don't worry - clarity is not sacrificed though the CC51 won't appear as clear as some of the brighter and thinner-sounding earphones for obvious reasons.
   

 Quote:


careyprice31 said:


> @Joker
> 
> What would IEM would you recommend for mainly Dance, Pop, Rap/Hip-hop and some techno/house/cub.
> 
> ...


 
 Would you consider going custom? I think staying in the universal realm with that sort of budget would require you to have a specific signature in mind. Genre preference don't always align with signature preferences but it seems like you may enjoy one of the more cohesive-sounding high end dynamics like the Monster MD or JVC FX700 (if isolation is not necessary).
   

 Quote:


seanmo said:


> @joker - have you done a triple fi 10 pro review?
> been spending a ton of time reading this post...thanks for all the work you put in on the reviews


 
 Quote:


> Originally Posted by *ZV3*
> 
> 
> I am wondering when the TF10 review is coming also. Not sure what is taking so long, the TF 10 is one of the older IEM's and tons of people are waiting for the review, but I keep seeing reviews for the newer earphones, which is a little strange. Not sure what the hold-up is, I would love to know what joker thinks about them.


 

  It's really quite simple - I've owned the TF10 for a long time - almost as long as my CK10 - and have been planning its review this whole time. However, it takes a backseat to most of the other sets I review since
   
  1. It is not on a clock. When I borrow sets from people or get manufacturer review samples, I automatically put a reasonable deadline on their review. Whenever that happens, everything that is non-essential gets pushed back. Right now five of the earphones in the queue are borrowed pairs and have priority over the TF10.
   
  2. It is old and, thanks to the amazon deals, very common. There's dozens of impressions of the TF10 in the long appreciation thread and posts comparing it to nearly everything else out there. In contrast to that, there is one (AFAIK) review of the ECCI PR401 and none of the Mee A151, so I felt that my time was better spent on those.
   
  3. I do a lot of my listening on the go - public transport, lunchtime at work, walking around town etc. The TF10 has never fit me well enough to sound its best while I'm moving about, which means that in order to review it I have to find time to sit down and focus on it at home, and again sets such as the (borrowed) FX700 take priority there.


----------



## CareyPrice31

@Joker
   
  Isolation is semi-important to me.
   
  How about the IE8's?
   
  I don't want customs as I'm young and my ears will change.


----------



## roker

Hey Joker,
   
  I'm going with Phonak Audeo PFEs w/ mic.  I think it's the 022 model (it cost me 99 bucks on Amazon.)
   
  I'll tell you how it plays out.
   
  edit:  Just realized I went with the wrong model, canceled and bought a white pair (121s)
   
  I hope this plays out well.  I'll post my impressions as soon as I get to spend time with them.
   
  Thanks again.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





careyprice31 said:


> @Joker
> 
> Isolation is semi-important to me.
> 
> ...


 

  IE8 really doesn't have great isolation, either. I think it sounds good but I prefer the MD and FX700 myself.

   


  Quote: 





roker said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I'm going with Phonak Audeo PFEs w/ mic.  I think it's the 022 model (it cost me 99 bucks on Amazon.)
> 
> ...


 


  I think the 0** models are the Phonak Perfect Bass (come with the green "bass" filters) while the 1** models are the Phonak Perfect Fit (come with the grey "treble" filters and the black "balance" filters) so you should be a careful of what you order. I think the second number refers to the presence of a microphone (1=no mic, 2=mic) and the third refers to the color (1=white/silver, 2=black).


----------



## roker

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think the 0** models are the Phonak Perfect Bass (come with the green "bass" filters) while the 1** models are the Phonak Perfect Fit (come with the grey "treble" filters and the black "balance" filters) so you should be a careful of what you order. I think the second number refers to the presence of a microphone (1=no mic, 2=mic) and the third refers to the color (1=white/silver, 2=black).


 

 I definitely got the mic version, but I went with the perfect fit version (121) for the comply tips and grey filter.  I could probably still cancel the order if necessary.  Is the price hike worth it?
   
  edit:  I just took a look at my cell phone bill, I changed my order to the 022 (with the mic).  I don't think it's going to be bass heavy if the impressions are any indication of what to expect from the sound.  I gotta stop with this indecisiveness.  I'm sticking with it this time.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





zv3 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 No offense to Mike but the the TF10 is quite old and has been reviewed to death. I think he really can't bring anything new to the table and it should be on the back burner. Use the search function. There is all you need to know about the Triple.fi 10 and then some. There is plenty about them on the web outside of Head-fi as well.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote:  





> No offense to Mike but the the TF10 is quite old and has been reviewed to death. I think he really can't bring anything new to the table and it should be on the back burner. Use the search function. There is all you need to know about the Triple.fi 10 and then some. There is plenty about them on the web outside of Head-fi as well.


 

 I still would like to see a TF10 review in this thread just to get ljokerl's opinion on how it stacks up against other IEMs. But, I am in no hurry and would rather have FX700 reviewed first.


----------



## tan1415

Joker ,
   
  Any chance of a quick review on the 2 Meelec CC51 and SP 51?


----------



## battleaxe

Is the thinksound rain worth an extra $10 over the Woodies 101B if I want durability, good soundstage, comfort, and balance?  
   
  BTW what is the difference between the Woodees 101B vs 200B vs the 101L(this looks to be a bluesier model with dark lacquer finish)?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> No offense to Mike but the the TF10 is quite old and has been reviewed to death. I think he really can't bring anything new to the table and it should be on the back burner. Use the search function. There is all you need to know about the Triple.fi 10 and then some. There is plenty about them on the web outside of Head-fi as well.


 

 None taken - I think I admitted to as much. I have very little to add regarding the sound of the TF10, which is not to say I'm not interested in putting it up for comparison purposes.


  Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> Joker ,
> 
> Any chance of a quick review on the 2 Meelec CC51 and SP 51?


 

 Quick - no, but I'm aiming for Tuesday or Wednesday for putting up the full reviews. My SP51 seems to be done burning in so I'll start playing with the tuning tonight.


  Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Is the thinksound rain worth an extra $10 over the Woodies 101B if I want durability, good soundstage, comfort, and balance?
> 
> BTW what is the difference between the Woodees 101B vs 200B vs the 101L(this looks to be a bluesier model with dark lacquer finish)?


 

 I would say yes - go for the rain. No idea what the different woodees models are except that the *00 ones have a microphone and the *01 ones do not. Also, the orange metal trim on the ones I had was particularly hideous.


----------



## battleaxe

Thank you. Yeah I saw some with almost this hotrod orange flame type scheme on Amazon that looks pretty gaudy. I also noticed the 00 are the sports model with a little difference in the shape.


----------



## Zephyron

Hey Joker, just curious.
   
  How would you compare the energy levels of the treble regions of the Klipsch Custom 3 and Earsonics SM3.

 Gonna take a wild swing at it, but I'm guessing that the SM3 is the warmer and intimate of the 2?


----------



## mywallethurts

joker have you tried xcape v2? was it an improvement over v1?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Hey Joker, just curious.
> 
> How would you compare the energy levels of the treble regions of the Klipsch Custom 3 and Earsonics SM3.
> 
> Gonna take a wild swing at it, but I'm guessing that the SM3 is the warmer and intimate of the 2?


 

 Yes, the SM3 is warmer and more laid-back in the treble though the KC3 is still on the warm side of neutral for me. For what it's worth, I actually like high levels of treble energy on my IEMs but neither the KC3 nor SM3 left me significantly wanting.

  
  Quote: 





mywallethurts said:


> joker have you tried xcape v2? was it an improvement over v1?


 

 Not yet but I should have one on the way pretty soon.


----------



## Zephyron

Hmm, I'm gonna guess that the SM3 is gonna sound something along the lines of a Brainwavz M1 (to my ears), but very very enhanced version it would seem. Like the M1s a lot though, good earphones for the price =)

 Guess I'll find out in 2 weeks or something =3


----------



## gorman

Recently bought JVC HA-FXC50 as a temporary replacement for my lost UE-10, while waiting for the new ACS T1 I've ordered.
   
  Was wondering about Comply tips, to get a better seal, but I don't know which models are compatible. Also, are they worth it?


----------



## ljokerl

uote: 





gorman said:


> Recently bought JVC HA-FXC50 as a temporary replacement for my lost UE-10, while waiting for the new ACS T1 I've ordered.
> 
> Was wondering about Comply tips, to get a better seal, but I don't know which models are compatible. Also, are they worth it?


 


  *400 series complys are compatible though they need to be forced on. Don't know about *500 series. If the tips are going to cost you more than the earphones I'd say it's not worth it unless you really can't get a seal as-is.


----------



## tuahogary

hi joker i have the pl30 and w3 but my ears are telling me that the pl30 has a more realistic timbre than the w3 in some recordings. am i crazy or is this due to the fact that it is dynamics vs ba? some ppl suggested the hje900, ts02 and fx700 to be really good in timbre. to give me a rough idea, how would you compare the timbre between the hje900, ts02, fx700, re0, xcapes, re252, w3, w2 and pl30? thanks in advance!


----------



## rawrster

Good thing I forgot most of your A151 review from Meelec. I got a pair in the mail today. The cable is super long like the DBA-02 and the rest of the cable is basically the same but color and such is different. I guess whoever makes the cable for the DBA-02 does the same for the A151. The chin slider hasn't fallen all the way down so I guess that's an improvement over the DBA-02 cable. I've using the balanced M9 tips and they sound pretty decent so far. I'm not sure of the MSRP but should be ~70 or so and not too bad so far.
   
  I guess the M2 should probably compare with the A151 in terms of technical ability? I don't have any BA driver phones that would be a fair comparison. Customs and my CK10 would be an unfair fight.


----------



## elliotm

Someone get this guy the Ultimate Ears super.fi 5 Pro!
   
  Alas, I've gone through a few of those as though they sound great, their build barely lasted beyond a year.  Even with RMA'd warranties, at around $200 a pop, they're an expensive habit.
   
  Add to that they're harder to find since UE no longer makes them.
   
  So, I must remain contented with the RE-ZEROs I just got.  Perhaps they'll sound better after burn in, but I can't imagine them besting the dual armature drivers of the super.fi 5 Pro. :/
   
  Oh, well.  Maybe something akin to it will be produced, in the future.


----------



## mike28307

Hey Joker, is it possible that you could do a review on the Shure 535's? thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


tuahogary said:


> hi joker i have the pl30 and w3 but my ears are telling me that the pl30 has a more realistic timbre than the w3 in some recordings. am i crazy or is this due to the fact that it is dynamics vs ba? some ppl suggested the hje900, ts02 and fx700 to be really good in timbre. to give me a rough idea, how would you compare the timbre between the hje900, ts02, fx700, re0, xcapes, re252, w3, w2 and pl30? thanks in advance!


 
 I can believe that. I don't think it's entirely due to the fact that the PL30 is dynamic and the W3 is armature - more likely it's due to the fact that the PL30 has that pleasant, slightly-warm tone and the W3 is just the W3. I think the HJE900 and FX700 would have the best timbre I've heard out of in-ears but really the e-Q7 isn't that far off and neither is the SM3. W2, RE252, and RE0/Xcapes all do a little better than the W3 in my book. The TS02 (and Rain) have their moments also but I wouldn't quite rank it up there with the HJE900 and FX700. 
   

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> Good thing I forgot most of your A151 review from Meelec. I got a pair in the mail today. The cable is super long like the DBA-02 and the rest of the cable is basically the same but color and such is different. I guess whoever makes the cable for the DBA-02 does the same for the A151. The chin slider hasn't fallen all the way down so I guess that's an improvement over the DBA-02 cable. I've using the balanced M9 tips and they sound pretty decent so far. I'm not sure of the MSRP but should be ~70 or so and not too bad so far.
> 
> I guess the M2 should probably compare with the A151 in terms of technical ability? I don't have any BA driver phones that would be a fair comparison. Customs and my CK10 would be an unfair fight.


 
 I quite like hybrids on the A151 - give them a shot if you've got em. I think they're $75 which is fine considering the general user-friendliness of that form factor. And yeah, the M2 will do certain things better right off the bat but if you give the A151 some time they actually do start to sound pretty accurate.
   
  Quote:


elliotm said:


> Someone get this guy the Ultimate Ears super.fi 5 Pro!


 
 I have a SuperFi 5 Pro and it's also on the to-do list on the front page of this thread (below the table). Personally, I don't see how it can be worth buying now that the TF10 can be had for <$180.
   
   
  Quote:


mike28307 said:


> Hey Joker, is it possible that you could do a review on the Shure 535's? thanks


 
  Not at this time - that's more than I want to spend on a universal, I have no personal interest in them whatsoever, and the review queue is way over capacity.


----------



## roker

I have a review suggestion:
   
  The Phonak Audeo 021/022.
   
  It's a great deal considering it's exactly the same as the 122 and 121, but 50 to 60 dollars less, with the only differences being the filter being used and some accessories  The 99 dollar price point also brings them down to the more competitive pricing tier.
   
  I'll know how they sound by Saturday when I get them in the mail and post my impressions of them here.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Definitely having an awkward time getting my RE-ZERO's positioned correctly for the best sound.
   
  Stock Bi-flanges can give me great sound and great isolation but reaching that nirvana is tricky and painful too. The right ear is happy with the smaller bi-flange but the left ear finds the small one to be too small and the large one to be too large.
   
  Comply tips are so comfortable I can barely feel them there but the isolation feels terrible and they take so much away from the highs they don't feel worth it.
   
  Trying the standard tips now. Perhaps I'm not giving myself enough time to adjust to them seeing as I've only had my earphones since Saturday.
   
  One thing that miffs me slightly about these earphones is that there is no unique identifier to make these as 1 of the 1,000 made. A slight touch missed perhaps?


----------



## RBNHIFI

Roker - really keen on your impressions of the PFE021/022.  Looking forward to reading them. 
  
  Quote: 





roker said:


> I have a review suggestion:
> 
> The Phonak Audeo 021/022.
> 
> ...


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I quite like hybrids on the A151 - give them a shot if you've got em. I think they're $75 which is fine considering the general user-friendliness of that form factor. And yeah, the M2 will do certain things better right off the bat but if you give the A151 some time they actually do start to sound pretty accurate.


 

  I'll have to look into the hybrids on them. I still have all my tips still and using the balanced M9 tips on them right now and sound pretty decent. It didn't take that long to sound more accurate than the M2 since I haven't used the M2 in a few weeks and that they are boosted in the bass. The A151 sound like a poor man's W2 from my short listening yesterday.


----------



## kingpintps

This thread had a huge part to play in my buying the CK10 and |joker| I have to say they are well worth all the hype they are made up to be. Thanks for the (indirect) recommendation and hope you keep adding to this thread.

 Just waiting for my Fake Sony hybrids to land, so that they can hopefully get ever so slightly better.


----------



## rawrster

A lot of people have found multi flange tips to work well with the CK10 such as triple flanged tips.


----------



## ljokerl

Didn't realize this thread passed 200k views and 2k posts this week. Who'd have thought...
   
   
  Quote:


roker said:


> I have a review suggestion:
> 
> The Phonak Audeo 021/022.


 
 That might happen, actually. Someone with a PFE 022 did step forward a little while ago and offer for me to test it when I get a break in my planned reviews, though he's in Canada and it might take a little longer than usual in terms of turnaround time.
   

 Quote:


elcomesoft said:


> One thing that miffs me slightly about these earphones is that there is no unique identifier to make these as 1 of the 1,000 made. A slight touch missed perhaps?


   
  I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in the ZEROs actually being limited edition at this point but I guess only time will tell. Either way marking each unit would have raised production costs and we certainly don't want that.
  
   
  Quote:


kingpintps said:


> This thread had a huge part to play in my buying the CK10 and |joker| I have to say they are well worth all the hype they are made up to be. Thanks for the (indirect) recommendation and hope you keep adding to this thread.
> 
> Just waiting for my Fake Sony hybrids to land, so that they can hopefully get ever so slightly better.


 
 Great, glad you like them. Welcome to the (highly exclusive) CK10 lovers club. Watch out for the DBA-02-faithful


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> [...] Watch out for the DBA-02-faithful


 
   
  Yup, we're a rabid bunch! Be wary of the rain of our rejected tips.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





dfrost said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 +1 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. kingpintps, better take cover. I may be far off, but am a little closer to you than the rest 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## kingpintps

haha..bring it on...I can take on any fishy(er) audio products with Audio Technica power-ups!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> +1
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 




  Quote: 





dfrost said:


> Yup, we're a rabid bunch! Be wary of the rain of our rejected tips.


----------



## rawrster

Well if the CK10 is at the post office today I'll rejoin the CK10 group  Although I'm just guessing where it is since the tracking said it left a notice when I didn't get any notice.


----------



## onefatsurfer

Can you do a review of the Superlux HD381?


----------



## kingpintps

Yeah I read that but unfortunately I don't have any multi-flange tips either...I'll try the fake hybrids for a while and see how they turn out..else I'll try some double flanged ones. The stock tips are okay, but they do seem to have a problem and the seal with Medium size comes open quite easily. I tried the large ones but they are too big for my canals.

 The poor thing is that it is taking ages for those fake hybrids to come via USPS Airmail.
  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> A lot of people have found multi flange tips to work well with the CK10 such as triple flanged tips.


----------



## Bobby9

Just got my Meelec A151s, coming from a dual armature pair I can tell the difference with the range and the impact of the bass. 
   
  I'd say they're at about the price they should be.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Meelec SP51 & CC51


----------



## mootookang

Thanks for the review Joker.

CC51 do sound interesting, but the straight down wearing style and mid driver flux makes it a pass for me.

It's nice to see meelec adventuring new grounds with completely different design though, I wonder when they would release their next lineup.


----------



## EraserXIV

If the CC51 dropped down to the $50 range, I can see them giving Brainwavz a huge headache.


----------



## RBNHIFI

Hi, what is mid driver flux?
   
  Quote: 





mootookang said:


> Thanks for the review Joker.
> 
> CC51 do sound interesting, but the straight down wearing style and mid driver flux makes it a pass for me.
> 
> It's nice to see meelec adventuring new grounds with completely different design though, I wonder when they would release their next lineup.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> If the CC51 dropped down to the $50 range, I can see them giving Brainwavz a huge headache.


 

 I think that would be downright unreasonable as the CC51 already sounds about as good as Brainwavz' flagship and also considering that Nakamichi's ceramic-shelled IEM runs closer to $200.
   

  Quote: 





rbnhifi said:


> Hi, what is mid driver flux?


 


  Lol i think he meant  'driver flex'. It's the flexing of the membrane of the dynamic transducer under pressure, namely when you are inserting the earphones. It presents as a 'crinkling' sound and can be annoying for some people. I don't usually mind it unless it's fairly severe and with the CC51 it only happens in one ear for me anyway.


----------



## Niyologist

Thanks for the review on the CC51 and SP51. I thought I was going to regret on purchasing the SP51, but I guess I didn't. The SP51 may have boomy bass, but I can tolerate it. I was gonna go for the CC51, but since I'm a basshead, I wasn't so sure. Many thanks!


----------



## EraserXIV

Hey, you never know with the tons of coupons and promotions that Meelec tends to run. Their great bang/buck products should knock some sense into the overpricing that tends to be done by the larger companies.


----------



## Inks

Those CCs look quite interesting. A typical well liked dynamic driver sound signature with good dynamics and timbre all at a budget price...This makes for a good secondary to a top tier BA IEM.


----------



## RBNHIFI

I hear driver flex with the playaz N3's.  Not much of a concern for myself as the crackling noise only appears when I maneuver of the earphone.  Its good to know it has a name 
  
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Strange, missed a bunch of notifications from this thread
  
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Thanks for the review on the CC51 and SP51. I thought I was going to regret on purchasing the SP51, but I guess I didn't. The SP51 may have boomy bass, but I can tolerate it. I was gonna go for the CC51, but since I'm a basshead, I wasn't so sure. Many thanks!


 


  Right, the CC51 really isn't one for the basshead. The SP51 and the entire M-line (except maybe the M16) offer a whole lot more impact, with the SP51 making the fewest sacrifices elsewhere.


----------



## Inks

I wonder if the SP51's tuning ports fit the VBs and vice-versa just for fun and who knows maybe good results...


----------



## Sengoku79

Hi ljokerl,
   
  Excellent compilation am finding it really helpful to identify my next set, am curious though as to where you would place Klipsch Image X10's as these are my current pair.
   
  Many Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> I wonder if the SP51's tuning ports fit the VBs and vice-versa just for fun and who knows maybe good results...


 


  I don't see why not. Sadly, I don't have a VB to figure out what that would sound like.
   


  Quote: 





sengoku79 said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> Excellent compilation am finding it really helpful to identify my next set, am curious though as to where you would place Klipsch Image X10's as these are my current pair.
> 
> Many Thanks


 
   
  Sorry, never heard the X10 so not a clue.


----------



## bynekm

Hey joker,
   
  Any plans for a Sunrise Xcape v2 review ?


----------



## rawrster

How do you think the A151 and CC51 from Meelec fits in their lineup? I have the A151 and wondering what the CC51 is like since it does sound like it is more balanced than a bassy earphone and the A151 is not a bassy one either. I believe their prices are similar so wondering even though one is dynamic and the other is BA.
   
  The A151 kinda reminds me of the W2 from memory although the cable does look like a Westone even though it is not braided.


----------



## Shufny

Hi here as well.

 @Joker: did you talk with Thomas, about him sending you an XR120 Pro II? The word is they are pretty analytical and forward sounding, with a bit of a treble spike. Should be intresting.

 About the TD: could you tell me more about the ranking? From your reviews it sounds like they should be behind the Brainwavz M1/2 in  everything, except low end clarity and extension.

 Any thoughts on the K330? Or you don't even have them yet?


----------



## xtasi

I was just wondering: I've been looking at the FR graph of the phiaton ps200 on headroom, and it looks to me like the bass isn't shy, but pretty darn flat.  However, it also seems to me that the headroom folks also think the bass is also shy.  Am I just reading the graph wrong?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


bynekm said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> Any plans for a Sunrise Xcape v2 review ?


 
 Yes, though it could take a while as I'm not sure they've even shipped yet.
  

 Quote:


rawrster said:


> How do you think the A151 and CC51 from Meelec fits in their lineup? I have the A151 and wondering what the CC51 is like since it does sound like it is more balanced than a bassy earphone and the A151 is not a bassy one either. I believe their prices are similar so wondering even though one is dynamic and the other is BA.
> 
> The A151 kinda reminds me of the W2 from memory although the cable does look like a Westone even though it is not braided.


 
 The difference is mostly in the fact that one is dynamic and one is armature-based. The CC51 does have more bass (especially low bass) than the A151 but it's not a bass monster by any means (a bit below M2 level in quantity to my ears). It does, however, sound smoother and thicker and warmer, all of which you'd sort of expect from a dynamic of that caliber, and has a more natural timbre.
   
   
  Quote:


shufny said:


> Hi here as well.
> 
> @Joker: did you talk with Thomas, about him sending you an XR120 Pro II? The word is they are pretty analytical and forward sounding, with a bit of a treble spike. Should be intresting.
> 
> ...


 
 There are way too many Xears models for me to keep them all straight. I did get a TD-III a couple of days ago and so far it's sounding much like the TD100 but I like the build better.
   
  The TD100 and M1/M2 all share one similar characteristic - they sound better as a whole than the individual aspects of their signatures indicate. But I do think the TD100 has the upper hand in extension (on either end) and balance, as well as soundstage depth. Perhaps I will re-evaluate my scoring after the TD-III is done burning in but I still hear a reasonably balanced earphone with plenty of bass weight and good space.
   
  I do have the K330 - I don't usually put earphones on the to-do list unless they are in my possession. I think they sound okay - not great but definitely not terrible. Overall signature is balanced and clear. The cable is the worst thing about them as it reminds me of the CX300 cord - thin and plasticky. It's an old design and I really haven't seen cables this bad on more recent releases. $60 (what they currently cost here) is a bit too much with things like the M1 and iM-590 out there but if they ever drop into the $30 range I can see myself recommending them.
   

 Quote:


xtasi said:


> I was just wondering: I've been looking at the FR graph of the phiaton ps200 on headroom, and it looks to me like the bass isn't shy, but pretty darn flat.  However, it also seems to me that the headroom folks also think the bass is also shy.  Am I just reading the graph wrong?


 
 Nope, I'll easily believe that the PS200 is flat in terms output level, there's just more to the perception of bass quantity than that. Otherwise you could EQ any earphone to sound like almost any other earphone with a good 40-band EQ. The PS200 sounds bass-light because it's lean on body and loses all note very quickly below a certain point. I am sure there is still air being moved but it's not something that can be called 'bass' in the head-fi sense. With the PS200 it's difficult to explain but listening to them side-by-side with the CK10 it was pretty obvious that one can be heard all the way down and the other just gives up. 
   
  I think with the recent price drops on the PS200 its falling back down into the realm of 'good deal' though as the DBA-02 is still fairly scarce and the CK90Pro/CK10 cost way over $200 now.


----------



## Shufny

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> There are way too many Xears models for me to keep them all straight. I did get a TD-III a couple of days ago and so far it's sounding much like the TD100 but I like the build better.
> 
> The TD100 and M1/M2 all share one similar characteristic - they sound better as a whole than the individual aspects of their signatures indicate. But I do think the TD100 has the upper hand in extension (on either end) and balance, as well as soundstage depth. Perhaps I will re-evaluate my scoring after the TD-III is done burning in but I still hear a reasonably balanced earphone with plenty of bass weight and good space.
> 
> I do have the K330 - I don't usually put earphones on the to-do list unless they are in my possession. I think they sound okay - not great but definitely not terrible. Overall signature is balanced and clear. The cable is the worst thing about them as it reminds me of the CX300 cord - thin and plasticky. It's an old design and I really haven't seen cables this bad on more recent releases. $60 (what they currently cost here) is a bit too much with things like the M1 and iM-590 out there but if they ever drop into the $30 range I can see myself recommending them.


 
 I just suggested the XR because it's getting really good feedback, and Thomas even promised to one of our members, that he would send you a pair.  The others are not that intresting imho. (many prefer them to the TD, mainly because of the lower bass levels)

 Makes me wonder what was the deal with my K330s. I read people complain about lack of bass or calling them bright. I think mine sounded like the definition of "bass bleed". Other than that it was fine I guess, but defenetly wasn't balanced when sealed properly


----------



## Pianist

Regarding instrument separation on DBA-02: I think it's every bit as good as on UM3X, if not better to my ears.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shufny said:


> I just suggested the XR because it's getting really good feedback, and Thomas even promised to one of our members, that he would send you a pair.  The others are not that intresting imho. (many prefer them to the TD, mainly because of the lower bass levels)
> 
> Makes me wonder what was the deal with my K330s. I read people complain about lack of bass or calling them bright. I think mine sounded like the definition of "bass bleed". Other than that it was fine I guess, but defenetly wasn't balanced when sealed properly


 


  Ha, Thomas didn't offer me anything the last time we exchanged emails. Maybe I'll contact him again. 
   
  And my K330 is somewhere between balanced and bass-light. Reminds me of the iM-590 though perhaps I need to try different tips. I haven't spent much time with it in the 6+ months I've had it since it doesn't really do anything for me. I can see people calling them bright as they have a bit of an accent on the lower treble.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Regarding instrument separation on DBA-02: I think it's every bit as good as on UM3X, if not better to my ears.


 


  actualy i almost agree there, id say not just quite the same as the UM3x but its is very good.  lol oops for me forgetting to stick that in the review i just did of them


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  IMO, the differences could easily come down to which tips you use.


----------



## albau

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There is a hint of mid/upper-bass bloat, making the W3 sound just a touch muddy compared to tight-and-fast dual armature models (CK10, DBA-02, q-JAYS, etc). Worth noting is that a few decibels of equalization in the 100-150Hz range can really help level the W3 out while preserving the excellent depth and texture of the low end.


 
   
  Joker, wonder if when you talk about W3 sounding a “touch muddy” due to the “hint of mid/upper-bass bloat” you refer to my main problem with my W3 which I’ll describe shortly?
   
  Before getting W3 as an upgrade for my HJE900 (that have too hot highs to my tastes) I was wary of infamous sibilance everybody are talking about. Luckily with both ways of circumcising tri-flanges (cutting stem or cutting top flange) I get what seems like a consistent and good seal with no trace of sibilance and very nice detailed but controlled treble.
   
  But I’m a little mystified by my main beef with W3. They possess smooth but detailed mids and highs, good dynamics, excellent in both width and depth soundstage and strong (well, sometimes bordering on boomy) lows. In short almost everything I was looking for. But I can’t fully enjoy them – somehow despite all the detail, image separation, musicality and other virtues W3 sound - how best to say  - not muffled,  not veiled, but maybe too warm or as you say “muddy”.  It’s like detail and clarity are all there and in spades but I have to consciously concentrate to enjoy them. Otherwise warm goo, for lack of better word, irritates and distracts from music. I tried W3 out of my FiiO 7 or straight from iPhone 4 with same results. Unfortunately I’m away from home without laptop and my rockboxed Clip+ so I can’t try to EQ it.
   
  So what is it? A matter of just some EQ within 100-150Hz, seal problem, need to mentally adjust after bright HJE900 or something inherent to W3?


----------



## JxK

^Is it the lows in general that are too strong, or just the warmth? If it's the warmth, EQing down a couple decibels somewhere between 150 and 250Hz can make a big difference. If it's everything try setting up a low shelf filter around 150 or 200Hz. And of course, give yourself a couple of days to adjust (with breaks) before making a final decision.


----------



## Pianist

Westone 3 is no upgrade over HJE900. The Panasonics sound way more coherent and fun to my ears.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





albau said:


> But I’m a little mystified by my main beef with W3. They possess smooth but detailed mids and highs, good dynamics, excellent in both width and depth soundstage and strong (well, sometimes bordering on boomy) lows. In short almost everything I was looking for. But I can’t fully enjoy them – somehow despite all the detail, image separation, musicality and other virtues W3 sound - how best to say  - not muffled,  not veiled, but maybe too warm or as you say “muddy”.  It’s like detail and clarity are all there and in spades but I have to consciously concentrate to enjoy them. Otherwise warm goo, for lack of better word, irritates and distracts from music. I tried W3 out of my FiiO 7 or straight from iPhone 4 with same results. Unfortunately I’m away from home without laptop and my rockboxed Clip+ so I can’t try to EQ it.
> 
> So what is it? A matter of just some EQ within 100-150Hz, seal problem, need to mentally adjust after bright HJE900 or something inherent to W3?


 
   
  The problem is that they are a bad multi driver design with improperly matched drivers. This leads to all kinds of strange problems with phase coherency and stuff. I am no technical guru, but I experienced exactly the same issues with the W3 that you experience and I can tell you that this is no ordinary problem with the frequency response, or sound quality - it is a problem with driver matching, period. If you want to hear a truly well designed multi driver, I recommend Fischer Audio DBA-02. It's not perfect, but way better designed than most multi driver armatures IMO. But the most accurate IEM I've heard so far is the single driver Etymotic ER4.


----------



## albau

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Westone 3 is no upgrade over HJE900. The Panasonics sound way more coherent and fun to my ears.


 

 Not sure that compared to W3 I can call HJE900 more coherent but it for sure more fun to my ears also. It's rather damning that we even have to compare $100 can against $350 one.


----------



## albau

Quote: 





pianist said:


> The problem is that they are a bad multi driver design with improperly matched drivers. This leads to all kinds of strange problems with phase coherency and stuff. I am no technical guru, but I experienced exactly the same issues with the W3 that you experience and I can tell you that this is no ordinary problem with the frequency response, or sound quality - it is a problem with driver matching, period. If you want to hear a truly well designed multi driver, I recommend Fischer Audio DBA-02. It's not perfect, but way better designed than most multi driver armatures IMO. But the most accurate IEM I've heard so far is the single driver Etymotic ER4.


 
   
  Thanks Pianist for the insight. Unfortunately I'm not that sophisticated and not really after accuracy, neutrality and balance if it doesn't sound to me like fun, energetic and doesn't lets me enjoy my classic/hard rock while working out (for classic, fado and jazz I have my beloved K-501 and HD-600 at home). For my uses best multi armature IEMs were UE super.fi 5 Pro but two copies I had both broke after a year or so. In single BA land I used to have Etys ER4p but frankly for my gym music they were too bright, thin and fatiguing. Audoe PFEs were too boring. I read all the raves about DBA-02 but afraid they are in the same mold as Etys.
   
  If I hate one thing then it's sibilance which I gather DBAs are prone to.  Actually that's my only real problem with HJE. Foam mod does cure it but at the expense of muffling mids. I tried to jump to MTPG but at 2.5x price I didn't find them much of an improvement over HJE and they proved too fidly with insertion depth and angle. Then this W3 fiasco. I guess I'll have to stick with HJE or maybe try TF10?


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





albau said:


> If I hate one thing then it's sibilance which I gather DBAs are prone to.  Actually that's my only real problem with HJE. Foam mod does cure it but at the expense of muffling mids. I tried to jump to MTPG but at 2.5x price I didn't find them much of an improvement over HJE and they proved too fidly with insertion depth and angle. Then this W3 fiasco. I guess I'll have to stick with HJE or maybe try TF10?


 


  The UE Superfi 5 Pro is supposed to be really good for rock, have you looked at them yet?


----------



## albau

macrocheesium said:


> The UE Superfi 5 Pro is supposed to be really good for rock, have you looked at them yet?





 


Like I said before 5 Pros were my favs but two pairs died one me after a year so I was trying to stay clear of UE.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





albau said:


> Joker, wonder if when you talk about W3 sounding a “touch muddy” due to the “hint of mid/upper-bass bloat” you refer to my main problem with my W3 which I’ll describe shortly?
> 
> Before getting W3 as an upgrade for my HJE900 (that have too hot highs to my tastes) I was wary of infamous sibilance everybody are talking about. Luckily with both ways of circumcising tri-flanges (cutting stem or cutting top flange) I get what seems like a consistent and good seal with no trace of sibilance and very nice detailed but controlled treble.
> 
> ...


 


  It seems like we are talking about the same thing but the best way to tell would be to try the EQ - if it doesn't help then another solution is obviously in order. If you really are sensitive to sibilance i am not sure why you decided to risk it with the W3 because even at its best it is a treble-heavy earphone. I would think that one of the smoother dynamics (e.g. RE262), an e-Q7, or one of the flatter armatures (W2, etc) would be a prime candidate, especially if you prefer the dark-ish SF5Pro.


----------



## albau

I'm sensitive to sibilance but strangely enough W3 with moded tri-flanges to my ears don't have even a trace of sibilance even on the bright tracks where HJE900 would be simply painfull.


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





albau said:


> Like I said before 5 Pros were my favs but two pairs died one me after a year so I was trying to stay clear of UE.


 


  I have no idea how I missed that... whoops.


----------



## albau

Following your guys advise I finally got a hold of rockboxed clip+ that has parametric EQ and after some tinkering settled on dialing down 2dB around 130Hz on low shelf filter. Amazingly effect is like using Afrin to clear stuffed nose. Warmish goo over W3 sound is much less prominent, bass got more disciplined and better shaped and overall detail and separation got more pronounced because they aren’t overshadowed. Highs stand out now better within overall balance but thankfully still no sign of sibilance.
   
  Normally I don’t EQ phones, never had to do it for HJE or for 5 Pros or Etys. That’s why using iPhone wasn’t a problem and is actually very convenient so I don’t have to carry a separate player, do extra fiddle with syncing, playlists and so on.  In fact built-in amp on iPhone 4 is more powerful than clip+, to my ears sounds better and EQ makes clip+ even more wimpy. It’s still disappointing to have to go through all this trouble to make famed $350 triple driver IEMs sound close to expectations and at least partially beat the $100 phone.


----------



## rawrster

Well the clip+ is one of the weaker daps on the market in terms of power output so that's not surprising that the iphone 4 has more power.


----------



## Pianist

IMO For rock music, Ortofon e-Q7 will be a nice "upgrade" over Westone 3 if you want a more neutral sound. The e-Q7 may well be the best IEM I've heard for rock - it is fairly neutral, but has a very special coloration that is unique to moving armature drivers that somehow worked wonders with rock for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pianist said:


> IMO For rock music, Ortofon e-Q7 will be a nice "upgrade" over Westone 3 if you want a more neutral sound. The e-Q7 may well be the best IEM I've heard for rock - it is fairly neutral, but has a very special coloration that is unique to moving armature drivers that somehow worked wonders with rock for me.


 


  Yes, though I do prefer the ergonomics of the e-Q5 I have to admit that the e-Q7 sounds better with rock & metal for those who don't find that last bit of treble emphasis absolutely necessary. The e-Q5 has this strange liquid quality that seems to gloss over microdetail and fine texture in the midrange while the e-Q7 is a bit more 'gritty'.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  e-Q7 just has better texture IMO. I loved the e-Q7, but totally disliked the e-Q5. The former sounds wonderfully musical - rich, forward, but not aggressive and very exciting with rock music. The latter sounds flat and boring by comparison to my ears and like you said - strange.


----------



## Niyologist

For those of you who are wondering why the SP51 and CC51 didn't ship out on the 4th is because of Chinese New Year (I totally forgot about that). Those two shipped out today. I'm bursting with excitement!


----------



## Confispect

I just got the Eterna V1 this thing is weird I cannot for the life of me wrap my head around their sound signature.
   
   
  Anybody know how long burn-in is?


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





confispect said:


> I just got the Eterna V1 this thing is weird I cannot for the life of me wrap my head around their sound signature.
> 
> 
> Anybody know how long burn-in is?


 
   
  The v1 signature is quite simple. Lots and lots and lots of bass with a huge bass hump, smooth mids and a slightly laid back treble while being very engaging and caring more about fun than accuracy.


----------



## seanmo

just got my eternas v1 today and am liking them a lot.  Not as bassy as described at least not yet.  Nuforce 700m's seem bassier to me.
  Compare fairly favorably to my w3's
  I'll have to burn them in.


----------



## Ultrainferno

I found the eterna rev2 to be much more basier then those nuforces, even right out of the box.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> The v1 signature is quite simple. Lots and lots and lots of bass with a huge bass hump, smooth mids and a slightly laid back treble while being very engaging and caring more about fun than accuracy.


 
  Agreed,
   
  Also has anybody had driver flex with these i'm have massive driver flex in my left ear.


----------



## EraserXIV

I was looking for a backup IEM and a deal on the SF5 popped up on slickdeals and I was able to snag one. Joker, can you give me a slight idea where the SF5 falls in line with other single BA IEMs such as the Westone 1, A151, PL50? Also, how will it compare with my current backup, the Brainwavz M2? Thanks in advance


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





confispect said:


> Agreed,
> Also has anybody had driver flex with these i'm have massive driver flex in my left ear.


 

 No flex at all with mine though I can coax it out with hybrids and some effort.
   


  Quote: 





eraserxiv said:


> I was looking for a backup IEM and a deal on the SF5 popped up on slickdeals and I was able to snag one. Joker, can you give me a slight idea where the SF5 falls in line with other single BA IEMs such as the Westone 1, A151, PL50? Also, how will it compare with my current backup, the Brainwavz M2? Thanks in advance


 


  For me the SF5 is around PL50 level... not quite up there with the A151 or W1. It's a good earphone but it's limited somewhat by the single armature configuration. Not the greatest subbass/upper treble presence and it's not as accurate-sounding as the A151 or as transparent as the Westone. I think the M2 is just a bit better overall as it has a similar mid-forward sound but, as a dynamic design, is fuller-sounding. It's close, though, so depending on what you value the SF5 may come out ahead for you.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Not to sound funny or anything, but is there a 'How to' guide about writing a review of earphones?
   
  I'd like to be able to better explain what I hear and if I can lay something out in a review-style format, I think I'd be able to help the community with an opinion and myself when switching to new earphones without the previous pairs to hand.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





elcomesoft said:


> Not to sound funny or anything, but is there a 'How to' guide about writing a review of earphones?
> 
> I'd like to be able to better explain what I hear and if I can lay something out in a review-style format, I think I'd be able to help the community with an opinion and myself when switching to new earphones without the previous pairs to hand.


 


  There's really not much of a format - just go with what seems logical. For a straight-up review the order has always obvious to me in terms of receiving and familiarizing yourself with an earphone/headphone - first the packaging/accessories, then design/build/aesthetics, then comfort/practicality, and lastly sound quality. The audiophile glossary is a good resource for the sound terminology and that's about it.


----------



## ljokerl

Added The Phiaton PS 20 and Pioneer SE-CLX60


----------



## Confispect

^ Congrats.
   
  On the Eterna there is definitely some flex in the left ear. Non-existent with stock tips but the Sony hybrids is a whole different story. Rather annoying. I've never heard of a driver going out so I think I just won't worry about it but there still that thought in the back of my mind


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Dude, this is freakin' nuts!  I'm exhausted just reading your thread title...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Dude, this is freakin' nuts!  I'm exhausted just reading your thread title...


 


  Thanks - and you can imagine how I feel when i look at the 'planned review' list...


----------



## rawrster

I bet your wallet feels the same


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I bet your wallet feels the same


 


  Well everything on that list is currently or has already been in my possession so I think of it as a 'sunk investment'. My wallet does cower in the corner every time I get a slickdeals alert with 'headphones' in the title though.


----------



## adirere

ljokerl how do you compare the Xears TD100 with Fischer Audio Eterna ver.1 ?


----------



## aLm0sT

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> Dude, this is freakin' nuts!  I'm exhausted just reading your thread title...


 

 x2 this is absolutely crazy.. longest review ever!


----------



## Zephyron

Very much appreciated though.

 Ended up with the SM3 over the KC3 and couldn't be any happier.

 Maybe having an A151 coming in sometime soon too =)


----------



## bisayaboi

joker could you care to tell me which has more bass? My CK90 or the RE262? Your answer might be the deciding factor on whether I want to get the RE262.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


adirere said:


> ljokerl how do you compare the Xears TD100 with Fischer Audio Eterna ver.1 ?


 
 The Eterna is a bass monster, with forward bass and the rest of the spectrum a bit more laid-back in nature (but still very competent). The TD100 is definitely bass-heavy but it has slightly forward mids as well and sounds more balanced on the whole. I think the Eterna has slightly better detail and resolution while the Xears are smoother and more 'pleasant'-sounding. Sort of a do-no-wrong signature but with heavy bass.
   
   
  Quote:


bisayaboi said:


> joker could you care to tell me which has more bass? My CK90 or the RE262? Your answer might be the deciding factor on whether I want to get the RE262.


 
 In terms of impact, I would say they are similar but the nature of the bass is very different. The CK90Pro is impossibly fast, tight, and precise. The RE262 is soft and smooth, with long-ish attack and decay times. If the bass delivered by the CK90Pro is like getting hit with a ping-pong ball, the RE262 would be like getting nailed with a beach ball - no more painful but certainly a very different experience. On that scale, something like monster MD would be equivalent to a Javelin ball 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> In terms of impact, I would say they are similar but the nature of the bass is very different. The CK90Pro is impossibly fast, tight, and precise. The RE262 is soft and smooth, with long-ish attack and decay times. If the bass delivered by the CK90Pro is like getting hit with a ping-pong ball, the RE262 would be like getting nailed with a beach ball - no more painful but certainly a very different experience. *On that scale, something like monster MD would be equivalent to a Javelin ball
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Heh. Makes one wonder what sort of ball the hippo VB and munito teleknines are analogous to.


----------



## Inks

Well the MDs are the (competent) bass monster of the IEM world ime. VBs/Teknines will probably in between  the Javelin ball and the beach ball.


----------



## JxK

^Inks, what's your go to IEM these days? Is it the fx700, or has something else trumped it?


----------



## Inks

My favorites are the FX700 and SM3. The JVCs don't get much use because I've been needing relatively high isolation but the sound is on par imo. They are very very different though but both excel at aspects that are inherited by their technology. MDs, EQ5s and RE262s are runner-ups in this order for my taste, technical proficiency is another matter.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Very much appreciated though.
> 
> Ended up with the SM3 over the KC3 and couldn't be any happier.
> 
> * Maybe having an A151 coming in sometime soon too =)*


 
   
  The A151 is a nice sounding iem  I really like it when I have listened to them but unfortunately not as often as I'd like to since my customs and CK10 are better but the A151 is still a good value imo.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jxk said:


> Heh. Makes one wonder what sort of ball the hippo VB and munito teleknines are analogous to.


 

  That's an interesting question considering the unique nature of the bass on those. The VB is weird because there is much more subbass than midbass - all of the foundation is there but they aren't ear-rippingly bassy per se. I guess it would be a hollow metal ball - similar in size to the javelin ball but noticeably less damaging in the conventional sense.  The Teknines would be like one of those rubber splat/slime balls that get squashed if you throw them at a wall real hard and then slowly regain composure. Except this one would be the size of a basketball 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## bisayaboi

Quote: 





> Quote:
> 
> 
> bisayaboi said:
> ...


 
  RE262 it is then. The bass on the CK90 is too fast for my tastes.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





rbnhifi said:


> Roker - really keen on your impressions of the PFE021/022.  Looking forward to reading them.


 

  
   
  [size=medium]I would just like to say that purchasing the Phonak Perfect Bass Earphones (PBE) 021/022s was life-changing. ​[/size]

  [size=medium]
 I now have new found respect for IEMs all thanks to the PBEs.  The sound is unbelievably fantastic.  I kind of want to try other high end IEMs to see what else is out there, after all, these IEMs were a measly 99 bucks (chump change in the audiophile world).
   
  IMO, you'd be hard pressed to find a better IEM in the price category.  This of course is my opinion and I do not claim to have the prerequisite that Mr. Joker does.  
   
  I don't know where to start, the bass, the highs, the mids, all present and wonderful.  The bass is actually perfect.  Not too much, not too little.  In fact, I'd rename these to the Perfect "Amount of" Bass Earphones.  The sound is the closest I can get to my Sennheiser HD-25s, they're not better, but they compliment each other nicely.  The highs are really smooth, giving it a nice refined sound.  I wouldn't say these headphones are dark, but there seems to be more emphasis on the mids and bass over the treble, on the other hand, the trade off is that it makes the vocals clear and never piercing.
   
  I hooked them up to my LDI+ and they sounded even better.  I was kind of surprised the difference a full size amp made.  My Nuforce Icon mobile only gave it a small boost.  I was thinking of buying a better portable amp for work (ibasso maybe?) so I can enjoy these to their best potential.  But even out of my iPhone or iPods, it still sounds great.
   
  If anyone is on the fence about what to buy in the sub 100 range, I'd go with these hands down. I should also note that the weight and fit make them one of the most comfortable IEMs I've ever worn (disclaimer: I've never owned customs).  The deeper than usual insertion might take some getting used to.  It's a bit more than the average IEM, but nothing like Etys and such.
   
  I'm not even sure I'll open the S4is I ordered the other day.  I love them so much that I cannot fathom another set of IEMs taking time away from them.​[/size]


----------



## Inks

The "best" in any category is dependent on what stuff you've tried and even then.... Best in the price range hands-down, sounds like a fairy tale to me an IMO would've made more sense. Anyways, they're pretty great in the price range for sure, but there's worthy competitors out there that some may prefer. 
  
  Quote: 





roker said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


> [size=medium]I would just like to say that purchasing the Phonak Perfect Bass Earphones (PBE) 021/022s was life-changing.
> 
> I now have new found respect for IEMs all thanks to the PBEs.  They sound unbelievably fantastic.  I kind of want to try other high end IEMs to see what's out there, after all, these IEMs were a measly 99 bucks (chump change in the audiophile world).
> 
> ...


----------



## roker

Quote: 





inks said:


> The "best" in any category is dependent on what stuff you've tried and even then.... Best in the price range hands-down, sounds like a fairy tale to me an IMO would've made more sense. Anyways, they're pretty great in the price range for sure, but there's worthy competitors out there that some may prefer.


 
   
  That's what I meant Mr Inks.

 I'll make the edit accordingly (and fix my typos).


----------



## Inks

On another note, if you liked the PFEs so much an upgrade for should be easy to identify, hide your wallet lol.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





inks said:


> On another note, if you liked the PFEs so much an upgrade for should be easy to identify, hide your wallet lol.


 

 I'm going to probably stick with these for a while.
   
  I don't think the other filters are for me because I like my bass (with a side of clarity, of course)
   
  I'm off to buy an amp ... any recommendations?


----------



## Inks

It's good you have restraint, Arrow should pair fairly well, perhaps use the grey filters but then use the bass boost of the Arrow for a nice balance.


----------



## Ikarios

This is my first foray into the IEM thread, so I have a lot of reading to do. But to save me some time I'll post my main concerns/questions up front:
   
  Is there a big detail difference between the RE0 and the Xcape? Is there an analogy using full-size headphones that I might better understand? I heard the RE0 briefly and liked the detail and presentation very much, although the light bass might not be the best for portable/street usage. The Xcape seems like it has most of the qualities of the RE0 but with a little more bass.
   
  Also can you sleep with either of these earphones (i.e. do they go deep enough)? Sadly this looks like it's going to be a pretty big concern for me since my roommates like to have conversations to 3am, while I have to wake up at 8.
   
  Finally has anyone mentioned the UE700 around here? From some brief reading it sounds like I might like the sound signature. They're also super small, which means they won't be a problem at all when sleeping.


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Also can you sleep with either of these earphones (i.e. do they go deep enough)? Sadly this looks like it's going to be a pretty big concern for me since my roommates like to have conversations to 3am, while I have to wake up at 8.


 
  The Xcapes are fully within my ears with the medium tip, so sleeping with these should not be a problem (unlike your roommates!).
   
  Never had RE0's so can't help with that comparison, but I can comment that the Xcapes seem quite well-balanced (after burn-in) with a very nice quantity and quality of bass when it's present in the music.


----------



## mootookang

dfrost said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




RE0 is small enough for sleeping purpose, but I wouldn't suggest it with RE0's infamous build quality.

I sleep with Hippo pearl, it's small enough so it goes deep enough and the isolation is good enough to be used as standard earplug without music in the background.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Is there a big detail difference between the RE0 and the Xcape? Is there an analogy using full-size headphones that I might better understand? I heard the RE0 briefly and liked the detail and presentation very much, although the light bass might not be the best for portable/street usage. The Xcape seems like it has most of the qualities of the RE0 but with a little more bass.
> 
> Also can you sleep with either of these earphones (i.e. do they go deep enough)? Sadly this looks like it's going to be a pretty big concern for me since my roommates like to have conversations to 3am, while I have to wake up at 8.
> 
> Finally has anyone mentioned the UE700 around here? From some brief reading it sounds like I might like the sound signature. They're also super small, which means they won't be a problem at all when sleeping.


 

 No, the RE0 and Xcape are quite similar in detail level, though the more treble-biased RE0 tries very hard to make itself seem more detailed. The housings of the RE0/ZERO are shallower (by about a third) and I have no problem sleeping in them. I can sleep in the Xcape, too, but that requires slightly deeper insertion.
   
  I think the UE700 has been mentioned a few times. Great if you like your treble hard enough to cut diamonds (erm... sonic diamonds). I said I couldn't think of a single reason to buy them over the q-JAYS or DBA-02 but I guess if size is a priority that might be one.


----------



## maxnight1189

Just wondering (and I certainly did not read through all 140 pages of this thread to be sure it is complete), but is the lack of Shure IEMs in this thread intentional?  I was thinking about the SCL4's (cuz someones selling them in the FS forum)  and I couldnt find much info on them. And I was shocked to find there was none from ljoker, the most trusted (or atleast most comprehensive) of sources


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxnight1189 said:


> Just wondering (and I certainly did not read through all 140 pages of this thread to be sure it is complete), but is the lack of Shure IEMs in this thread intentional?  I was thinking about the SCL4's (cuz someones selling them in the FS forum)  and I couldnt find much info on them. And I was shocked to find there was none from ljoker, the most trusted (or atleast most comprehensive) of sources


 
 I guess in a sense the lack of Shure products is intentional since in the 18 months or so this thread (and its previous iteration) have been up I haven't bothered to pick up a Shure. Yes, I have owned the SCL4 (E4/E4c). It was my primary earphone long before this thread was even in its nascent stages. I ended up buying the RE0 when it originally dropped to $99 and the RE0, being better in every way (except isolation) as far as I could tell, made it very easy to part with the Shures. Today I don't see myself paying more than $50-60 for an E4. And yes, the Shure question has been asked before (I will add an FAQ section one of these days!):

 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I have no personal interest in Shure products after trying a bunch of the lower-end ones early in my head-fi journey. There's no specific reason for avoiding the SE530/535 other than that I haven't felt the urge to go out and buy one myself.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Is there a big detail difference between the RE0 and the Xcape? Is there an analogy using full-size headphones that I might better understand? I heard the RE0 briefly and liked the detail and presentation very much, although the light bass might not be the best for portable/street usage. The Xcape seems like it has most of the qualities of the RE0 but with a little more bass.
> 
> Also can you sleep with either of these earphones (i.e. do they go deep enough)? Sadly this looks like it's going to be a pretty big concern for me since my roommates like to have conversations to 3am, while I have to wake up at 8.


 

 I recently had the RE-ZERO and found then to be very fun. I never found the 'light bass' to be an issue when walking around outside along a main road.
   
  Whilst I never attempted to sleep with the RE-ZERO's in my ears, I did have several long relaxing sessions where I was laying on my sides. Extremely comfortable and could certainly fall asleep with them in my ears with a single flange tip. Comply tips were even more comfortable than the silicone tips I used and if not for the music in my ears, I'd have have forgotten that they were in there. However, The T-400 Comply tips make the sound noticably worse in my opinion.


----------



## maxnight1189

Haha, well thanks for the quick and informative answer ljoker.


----------



## Unreal88

Hi I'm in doubt about which earbuds I should buy.
   
  I've got these right now:
  - Meelec M11 (the 'old' version), sound is too bass-heavy but comfort with Bi-Flanges is lovely.
  - Branwavz Alpha (the cheapest version) Picked them up for $4. Sound is okay but comfort is worse. They just don't fit as well as the M11's.
   
   
  Got these on my shortlist now:
*Brainwavz ProAlpha (could get these for $25)*
  Do want these because of the fantastic sound quality. Don't want these because I've got the cheap Brainwavz alpha and they are not as comfortable as my M11's. Anybody got a clue if there's a difference in comfort between the Alpha's and the ProAlpha's? 
*Meelec M11+ (now $45)*
  Comfort will be perfect but sound won't be as good as at the ProAlphas. Also they are $20 more expensive.
*Nuforce NE-6 ($55 at local store)*
  A friend of mine has got these but they are mainstream and not very special. I'd rather have something with more bang/buck. Also the comfort is less than of the M11's/
   
  I am a fan of some 'warm' sound but I do miss some detail with my old M11's. And they are too bass-heavy.
  I am willing to spend some more (the 60-100 dollar price range), if it will make a great improvement.
  The ProAlphas are a steal though. So I'm doubting.
   
  Anybody got a suggestion?
  Thanks in advance


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





unreal88 said:


> Hi I'm in doubt about which earbuds I should buy.
> 
> I've got these right now:
> - Meelec M11 (the 'old' version), sound is too bass-heavy but comfort with Bi-Flanges is lovely.
> ...


 
  Have you looked at joker's extensive set of reviews (the front end of this thread)? Save some reading time by looking at the table in Post #8.
   
  Hint: "earbuds" is the term for earphones that sit outside the ear canal. Your MEElec M11, Brainwavz and others you've mentioned are called IEMs ("in-ear monitors") around head-fi. The ProAlphas seem pretty nice, and an awesome deal at $25. You can do better than M11+ and NE-6 for the money you're willing to spend.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





unreal88 said:


> Hi I'm in doubt about which earbuds I should buy.
> 
> I've got these right now:
> - Meelec M11 (the 'old' version), sound is too bass-heavy but comfort with Bi-Flanges is lovely.
> ...


 

 If you think the M11 is bassy, don't even think about trying any of the other M-series models, especially the M11+ or M31. And of course if you don't find the Alpha comfortable, I'd recommend another form factor (as the ProAlpha will likely be the same size) - the Meelec CX21, for example, which is both reasonably-priced and easy-fitting. If you're willing to go up to $75-80, there are a lot of options that will be more balanced than the old M11 and potentially quite comfortable - the ECCI PR401, Sunrise Xcape, Meelec's whole 'clarity' series, the A151, etc. And of course there's always the tiny Soundmagic PL50.


----------



## Unreal88

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you think the M11 is bassy, don't even think about trying any of the other M-series models, especially the M11+ or M31. And of course if you don't find the Alpha comfortable, I'd recommend another form factor (as the ProAlpha will likely be the same size) - the Meelec CX21, for example, which is both reasonably-priced and easy-fitting. If you're willing to go up to $75-80, there are a lot of options that will be more balanced than the old M11 and potentially quite comfortable - the ECCI PR401, Sunrise Xcape, Meelec's whole 'clarity' series, the A151, etc. And of course there's always the tiny Soundmagic PL50.


 

 Thanks for your help 
  I find the M11's very bassy with kick drums. This is not a problem with Daft Punk, but when I listen to i.e. Dire Straits, it feels like someone is punching me all the time. It's just too much then. So I would be looking for a more neutral type of headphone? I can always up the bass with a decent EQ/The bass switch on the E5 amp.
  It's just that when I listen to a song with my M11, it's like all I can hear is  bass, the voices and other instruments just don't show.
   
  What's your opinion about an Head-Direct RE0 + Cowon J3 /S9
  I'd have a pretty neutral headphone then and I could always tweak the sound if I don't like it. But I guess the RE0 is too analytic, I do like the sound a tad warm, but just not as much as with the M11's


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





unreal88 said:


> What's your opinion about an Head-Direct RE0 + Cowon J3 /S9
> I'd have a pretty neutral headphone then and I could always tweak the sound if I don't like it. But I guess the RE0 is too analytic, I do like the sound a tad warm, but just not as much as with the M11's


 


  I think the RE0 is pretty great but if you're after a bit of warmth I would recommend the Sunrise Xcape, Meelec CC51, or even ECCI PR401 in its stead. All are very good earphones but the RE0 is the most established choice as it has simply been around way longer.


----------



## maxnight1189

Hey, back again 
   
  So I see from your list of "In Progress" IEMs that you are currently trying out the Super.Fi 5 Pro's (or atleast some variation of the Super.Fi 5's).  Im currently looking at an offer of a used set of these, with a new UE cable, for $80 and am seriously considering pulling the trigger.  Do you think its a good deal or would I be better off with something like the RE0's or Ety's MC5 (as suggested to me by jleewach)?
   
  My two main concerns are: durability and sound quality (consisting of clarity, "sparkle," and bass in that order).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


maxnight1189 said:


> So I see from your list of "In Progress" IEMs that you are currently trying out the Super.Fi 5 Pro's (or atleast some variation of the Super.Fi 5's).  Im currently looking at an offer of a used set of these, with a new UE cable, for $80 and am seriously considering pulling the trigger.  Do you think its a good deal or would I be better off with something like the RE0's or Ety's MC5 (as suggested to me by jleewach)?
> 
> My two main concerns are: durability and sound quality (consisting of clarity, "sparkle," and bass in that order).


 
 If durability is your prime concern, buy the Etys. however, I found nothing noteworthy about their sound. Aside from isolation and durability (and Ety's warranty), I can't think of a single reason I would pick the MC5 over the RE0 or Xcape. In fact, there's at least a half-dozen other <$100 IEMs I'd chose before the MC5 just because it is somewhat bland-sounding (not bad from a technical perspective, mind you, but not something I'd willingly subject myself to). 

 The SF5Pro (not to be confused with the other variations) is actually a pretty decent earphone but it's got a peculiar flavor. Even though the bass is not particularly emphasized and the treble isn't too laid back, the SF5Pro sounds somoewhat dark to me. It lacks a bit of tightness in the bass and some detail in the treble next to the RE0 and Xcape. Not a ground-breaking amount but enough for me to pick either of those two over the SF5Pro every time, given the choice.


----------



## shadowfox42

I received my ck10s a little over a month ago. I can honestly say that ljokerl's review is absolutely spot on in every aspect. They are the most detailed IEMs I've ever used, however, I did find the ck10s a little too sparkly and bright for my taste. This, of course, is not a flaw but rather a conflict of personal preference.
   
  So once again I'm on the search for a pair of IEMs suitable for my preference, therefore I might be selling my ck10s within the next couple weeks. I've been interested in the Earsonics Sm3 and Westone UM3x, as of late.
   
  Although I desire the Sm3 more, I feel the rather "squared-off" shells might be a problem with comfort due to my incredibly tiny ears. Take a look below.
   


 


    ^^^ck10 hanging here^^^     *Tiny, aren't they? Barely 2 inches and I'm a 6ft male, lol.


----------



## DervishD

Quote: 





unreal88 said:


> Hi I'm in doubt about which earbuds I should buy.
> 
> I've got these right now:
> - Meelec M11 (the 'old' version), sound is too bass-heavy but comfort with Bi-Flanges is lovely.
> ...


 
   
  From what you want, you may want to try the Meelec M21. They're not as warm as the M11, of course, but not cold either. They have some decent clarity, space, etc. I think they fit what you want.
   
  On the other hand, if you would like to sacrifice some warmness in exchange for incredible clarity and deep but controlled basses, the Meelec CX21 may be the phones for you.
   
  From what you say, both the M21 and the CX21 may sound bassy to you, I can't be sure, but IMHO they're not bass-heavy. OK, the M21 has the usual fun-sounding signature found in the Meelec M-series, and that means basses, but I think they are controlled. The CX21 is, to my ears, less bassy (beware, I haven't tested them thoroughly) and more clear, but that means less warm.
   
  So, maybe the M21 is a good combination of warmness and basses. Even though they have the classical M-series sound signature, the increased soundstage and space may compensate.
   
  I don't know if you have listened to the Meelec M9. If the answer is "yes", I think you can regard the M21 as a midpoint between the M9 and the M11+, with more space and soundstage than the M9 and a bit less definition than the M11+, a bit warmer.
   
  It's a pity I cannot be of more help, but as I said I haven't tested the M21 thorougly yet. Oh, and if you liked the comfort in your old M11, the M21 are very similar: thin metal body which allows for a deep insertion and is even unnoticeable with biflanges. I love that


----------



## Unreal88

Quote: 





dervishd said:


> From what you want, you may want to try the Meelec M21. They're not as warm as the M11, of course, but not cold either. They have some decent clarity, space, etc. I think they fit what you want.
> 
> On the other hand, if you would like to sacrifice some warmness in exchange for incredible clarity and deep but controlled basses, the Meelec CX21 may be the phones for you.
> 
> ...


 

 This is exactly the comfort I mean. Deep insertion is quite nice. I really miss that at Brainwavz.

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think the RE0 is pretty great but if you're after a bit of warmth I would recommend the Sunrise Xcape, Meelec CC51, or even ECCI PR401 in its stead. All are very good earphones but the RE0 is the most established choice as it has simply been around way longer.


 

 Ok, I've been doing some research about these IEM's.
  There seems to be a new version of the Sunrise Xcape, which would have less definition? Have you heard these and do you have an opinion about these? They do seem to be the best buy, since you gave these 10/10 on value. I'm just a bit sceptic about the build quality. And the fact that there is a new version which would be worse? 
  
  I'm also interested in the CC51 by Meelec. I do trust the build quality and comfort of Meelec, but you didn't give these a 10/10 on value.
   
  ECCI PR401 isn't my thing. I'm guessing that loud Mid-Bass would mean the Kick-bass is loud? This isn't really my thing as I already find these too loud on my M11.
   
  I think I'm going to wait for some discount on the CC51 as it would be the best buy for me. I do like the Sunrise Xcape but the build quality troubles me. And the fact that there are no reviews on V2.


----------



## DervishD

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Unreal88* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I'm also interested in the CC51 by Meelec. I do trust the build quality and comfort of Meelec, but you didn't give these a 10/10 on value.
> 
> I think I'm going to wait for some discount on the CC51 as it would be the best buy for me. I do like the Sunrise Xcape but the build quality troubles me. And the fact that there are no reviews on V2.


 

 Just two notes: the CC51 doesn't allow for a very deep insertion, as the housing has a shape very similar to a smoking pipe. Since the drivers are at the end of the housings, you can insert them deeper than other similar designs, but not as deep as the M21, for example.
   
  As for sound, the CC51 are not warm at all. They're not excessively cold or analytical, but they focus on clarity, so be aware.
   
  A midpoint  between the CC51 and the M21 would be the CX21. Deep insertion, good comfort, more than decent basses and cheaper than the CC51.
   
  This said, I utterly love the CC51's. The only other model I like more is the A151, because it's a balanced armature on steroids, with great basses. Sound quality wise I thing the CC51 and the A151 are at the same level, but with different sound signatures.
   
  But take into account that neither the CC51 nor the A151 or the CX21 have the same fun-sounding signature of the M21. They're focused on clarity and balance, so think what kind of sound do you want before buying. Any of the four models is a great buy, IMHO. I've tested all of them and I think their value is much higher than its cost, but they have different sound signatures.
   
  I'm going to post reviews on the four models, but it will take me some time so probably your best bet is to trust ljokerl, his reviews are amazingly good. In fact, his reviews are my main guide for choosing new phones


----------



## Cloud-S

Is it possible to wear the 'over-the-ear' earphones like UE TF10 normally, that is 'straight down'?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


shadowfox42 said:


> I received my ck10s a little over a month ago. I can honestly say that ljokerl's review is absolutely spot on in every aspect. They are the most detailed IEMs I've ever used, however, I did find the ck10s a little too sparkly and bright for my taste. This, of course, is not a flaw but rather a conflict of personal preference.
> 
> So once again I'm on the search for a pair of IEMs suitable for my preference, therefore I'll be selling my ck10s within the next couple weeks. I've been interested in the Earsonics Sm3 and Westone UM3x, as of late.
> 
> Although I desire the Sm3 more, I feel the rather "squared-off" shells might be a problem with comfort due to my incredibly tiny ears. Take a look below.


   
  It's quite difficult to judge from a photo. Obviously if you wanted to stay on the safe side you'd avoid the SM3 but there's really no way to know for sure unless you try them. I know some people have had success leaving the entire shell outside of their ear.

 Quote:


unreal88 said:


> Ok, I've been doing some research about these IEM's.  There seems to be a new version of the Sunrise Xcape, which would have less definition? Have you heard these and do you have an opinion about these? They do seem to be the best buy, since you gave these 10/10 on value. I'm just a bit sceptic about the build quality. And the fact that there is a new version which would be worse?


 
 I have not tried the v2 xcape but I don't think there's anything wrong with the build of the v1.
   

 Quote:


cloud-s said:


> Is it possible to wear the 'over-the-ear' earphones like UE TF10 normally, that is 'straight down'?


 
 In the case of the TF10 - yes - because you can just detach the cable and swap the sides.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have not tried the v2 xcape but I don't think there's anything wrong with the build of the v1.


 

  Me neither.  Much of the concern is from visual inspection and theoretical postulation.  Still waiting for mine to fail.  I'll just continue to enjoy them till then.  I think Sunrise should consider selling both variants.  The fact that they don't makes me wonder about things not sound related like the business end, hmm.....


----------



## shadowfox42

I've heard there may be revisions of the Sm3s that might use a different material for the shell. Has anyone heard anymore about this?
   
   
   
   
  *Keep in mind, I "might" be selling my ck10s within a couple weeks, not 100% sure though. I find it incredibly hard to part with these earphones, but I also need the money if I wish to purchase other IEMs, such as Sm3 or UM3x.


----------



## EraserXIV

That's true, there is a revision of the SM3 that uses a stronger plastic for the body


----------



## average_joe

SM3 vs. CK10 = Murphy's Irish Stout vs. Heineken light
   
  Be prepared for thick, rich, and filling, not to mention tasty!
   
  The SM3 shell is UV welded (I believe), not glued, and the original material didn't hold all that well.  They switched to a different shell material or composition quite a while ago, but I am not sure if there are any more current revisions to the shell.


----------



## shadowfox42

Lol, interestingly put average_joe.
   
  I figured there was a revision, just didn't know for sure. I assume there were no alterations to the shape of the shell?


----------



## ljokerl

Added Meelec M21 & M31


----------



## nunomeneses

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Meelec M21 & M31


 


  The unstopable ! Thank you so much for these wonderful reviews! Not speaking about the last ones but all!


----------



## Wyatt H

Hello,

I am looking for a new pair of IEMs for about $80. I used to have Thinksound TS01, which I really enjoyed, except for the painful snare hits at high volumes. I am looking for an IEM that is similar, but better overall and without the harshness.

I liked the slightly emphasized and impactful bass, and there was something magical about them. They just sounded so beautiful, and I would get goosebumps and have random euphoric moments while listening. I like my ATH-M50's and the other technically superior headphones I've tried, but nothing has recaptured that fantastic feeling that the TS01s gave me.

I was looking at the TS02, which seemed like the obvious choice since it's described as the best of TS01 + the best of Rain, but I'm interested in the MEElectronics CC51 too. I noticed you gave that one a higher score, and I was extremely impressed with the build quality of the other MEElectronics products I've owned/used. From your description, it seems like that would be great for me too, and they are the same price.

So, the question is, do you think the CC51 would have that same beautiful tone that I've been looking for, or should I go with the safer option of the TS02?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





wyatt h said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am looking for a new pair of IEMs for about $80. I used to have Thinksound TS01, which I really enjoyed, except for the painful snare hits at high volumes. I am looking for an IEM that is similar, but better overall and without the harshness.
> 
> ...


 

 It sounds like you want something with great clarity. I would say that the CC51 or the Hippo VB's are the earphones you would want with better texture of bass, but better treble would be the RE0. That's IMO.


----------



## EndlessMike

Wyatt, go with the TS02.
   
  You were totally in love with the TS01, it's the only logical choice tbh.


----------



## DervishD

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Meelec M21 & M31


 


  Thanks! I wondered how the M31 sounded 
   
  Just one comment. I dissent about the headstage of the M21. I prefer the M21's headstage rather than the M6's one. Compared with the M21, the sounstage/headstage of the M6 sounds more "artificial" to me, reminds me of "fake surround", can't explain it better, sorry. Of course, the sensation vanishes after a few minutes of listening the M6, when brain adjusts, but when switching between the M21 and the M6 that was my sensation.
   
  To be sincere, two comments: how the heck do you manage to sleep with the M21 on? You have deep ear canals, dude!   For sleeping, no phone can beat M11+ in my collection, although M9 and Philips SHE3581 are both very near.
   
  But well, it's a matter of taste  Nice review and nice photos.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





wyatt h said:


> I am looking for a new pair of IEMs for about $80. I used to have Thinksound TS01, which I really enjoyed, except for the painful snare hits at high volumes. I am looking for an IEM that is similar, but better overall and without the harshness.
> 
> I liked the slightly emphasized and impactful bass, and there was something magical about them. They just sounded so beautiful, and I would get goosebumps and have random euphoric moments while listening. I like my ATH-M50's and the other technically superior headphones I've tried, but nothing has recaptured that fantastic feeling that the TS01s gave me.
> 
> ...


 

 I personally like the tone of the CC51 better than that of the Thinksound IEMs. However, the TS01/TS02/Rain do have a slight coloration to them which you won't be able to replicate with the Meelec set. If you were asking for the more accurate earphone, I would recommend the CC51 but it seems that you'll be happy with a more bassy and slightly smoother TS01, which is what the TS02 is.
   
   

  Quote: 





dervishd said:


> To be sincere, two comments: how the heck do you manage to sleep with the M21 on? You have deep ear canals, dude!   For sleeping, no phone can beat M11+ in my collection, although M9 and Philips SHE3581 are both very near.


 

  Ha, I was surprised as well but it turns out I can insert the M21 quite far with smallish tips. It's only about as long as the M9 when it's in my ears.


----------



## johanchandy

which has better SQ....the soundmagic pl30 or the soundmagic p10.........i prefer the p10 style headphones but if the SQ is better on the pl30 i may go for them.......is there a big difference between them?


----------



## scare

I found my way to head-fi only recently while looking for IEM reviews and I seem to have found my way to quite the place.
   
  As a newbie I applaud you, |joker|, for maintaining such a great thread. It serves as a great starting point for my learning. The sheer amount of information and the willingness of members to help others really makes this place inviting. I may be gushing a bit, but I wanted my first post to be a thank you.


----------



## james444

Hi and welcome to Head-Fi. Nice to see someone let their wallet choose the nickname


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johanchandy said:


> which has better SQ....the soundmagic pl30 or the soundmagic p10.........i prefer the p10 style headphones but if the SQ is better on the pl30 i may go for them.......is there a big difference between them?


 


  It's difficult to compare a headphone to an IEM but I would say the PL30. Either way it wouldn't be a big difference except for the superior isolation of the PL30, which very much results in more enjoyable sound out in the real world.
   
   


  Quote: 





scare said:


> I found my way to head-fi only recently while looking for IEM reviews and I seem to have found my way to quite the place.
> 
> As a newbie I applaud you, |joker|, for maintaining such a great thread. It serves as a great starting point for my learning. The sheer amount of information and the willingness of members to help others really makes this place inviting. I may be gushing a bit, but I wanted my first post to be a thank you.


 
   
  Thanks, and welcome to H-F. Acting as a starting point for those looking to jump into portable audio was the original intent of this thread so I'm always happy to read posts like this one.
   

  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Hi and welcome to Head-Fi. Nice to see someone let their wallet choose the nickname


----------



## johanchandy

@ |joker|: thanks again!....


----------



## robjrock

Thanks joker!
   
  Hey anyone and everyone, I've just downsized my collection to a Sansa Clip & a pair of Yuin PK3's - and I'm loving the bass - treble and general sound signature of these little earbuds. 
   
  Can anyone recommend a pair of Meelec earphones that would roughly equal the sound of the PK3's, as far as bass and treble is concerned? I used to own a pair of AI-M9 but I'm having trouble remembering their sound. I remember it was quite bassy and a little aggressive, but quite a spacious sound. I remember liking them though.  
   
  I sold my pair of Brainwavz M2's because the sound was way too dark and mid-centric for me. The bass lacked 'fun' and the treble rolled off too early for my liking.   
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Added Meelec M16 & RX11
  
  Quote: 





robjrock said:


> Hey anyone and everyone, I've just downsized my collection to a Sansa Clip & a pair of Yuin PK3's - and I'm loving the bass - treble and general sound signature of these little earbuds.
> 
> Can anyone recommend a pair of Meelec earphones that would roughly equal the sound of the PK3's, as far as bass and treble is concerned? I used to own a pair of AI-M9 but I'm having trouble remembering their sound. I remember it was quite bassy and a little aggressive, but quite a spacious sound. I remember liking them though.
> 
> ...


 

 It's been a while since I've heard the PK3 so perhaps someone else can comment. However, if you can afford them there's almost no reason to get any of the other Meelec IEMs over the CC51 (the A151 is darker so that's out of the question for you).


----------



## HKgirl

I've been following this forum for quite sometime, but registered today.
  Just wanted to thank ljokerl for his awesome reviews!
   
  Its been a pleasure going through the details and understanding a lot of things about IEMs


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hkgirl said:


> I've been following this forum for quite sometime, but registered today.
> Just wanted to thank ljokerl for his awesome reviews!
> 
> Its been a pleasure going through the details and understanding a lot of things about IEMs


 


  Thanks, glad the reviews have been useful


----------



## Angelopsaro

Hello joker. A quick question about the q-jays. I am looking on this cause i hope they have the signature on M1 that lacks a bit. I am talking about the thickness of M1 that is a bit strange to me and also i would like them a bit more clean and bright. What do you think?


----------



## cali141

Fischer Audio Eterna or NuForce NE700X for electronic music? I can't really tell the difference between the two from reviews, honestly. They both sound like they have loud, rumbling, punchy bass, and good if recessed mids and highs. What's the difference between the two?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Hello joker. A quick question about the q-jays. I am looking on this cause i hope they have the signature on M1 that lacks a bit. I am talking about the thickness of M1 that is a bit strange to me and also i would like them a bit more clean and bright. What do you think?


 

 The q-JAYS are very clear but I wouldn't call them bright. If you really want to move in that direction, the UE700 might be worth looking into since they can be found for <$100 used. Or you could wait for the Brainwavz B2 as those should deliver all the clean-and-bright you can handle.

  Quote: 





cali141 said:


> Fischer Audio Eterna or NuForce NE700X for electronic music? I can't really tell the difference between the two from reviews, honestly. They both sound like they have loud, rumbling, punchy bass, and good if recessed mids and highs. What's the difference between the two?


 
   
  I would say Eterna - I like it a little better on the whole and the fit is less fidgety. It's a bit less balanced than the NE-700X but it seems like that's what you're after.


----------



## Katun

Wow! MEElectronics seems to be doing shockingly good with their new line-up. Hope that gets some attention!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





katun said:


> Wow! MEElectronics seems to be doing shockingly good with their new line-up. Hope that gets some attention!


 


  I think only three Meelec products qualify for 'shockingly good' for me personally - the M9, CX21, and CC51. The A151, M6, M21, and CW31 are just very good all-rounders. The rest will be hit-or-miss depending on the user.


----------



## tyoung8

Great stuff joker.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think only three Meelec products qualify for 'shockingly good' for me personally - the M9, CX21, and CC51. The A151, M6, M21, and CW31 are just very good all-rounders. The rest will be hit-or-miss depending on the user.


 

 I guess I'm at a loss about the M9 being shockingly good but not the M6.  You mean bang/buck wise?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> I guess I'm at a loss about the M9 being shockingly good but not the M6.  You mean bang/buck wise?


 

  Yes - I guess I still think of the M6 as costing over $30. That and the last M6 I heard didn't sound as good as my old one (or my M9). It may have been defective though.


----------



## BoxShot

Joker would you mind doing a comparassion in sizes of the meelec series? This thread is great stuff too.


----------



## esanthosh

It's getting close to #150. So, which one would be the special #150? I hope it's FX700 or the 'always-on-the-back-burner' TF10.......or is it something else?


----------



## rawrster

This thread is growing much faster than I can keep up. That's some good stuff here...wallets may disagree however


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





boxshot said:


> Joker would you mind doing a comparassion in sizes of the meelec series? This thread is great stuff too.


 

 Sure, here we are:
   

   
   
  These are the only ones I have on hand. Order is as follows (left->right):
  Top: M11/M11+, M16, M21, M31, CW31, CX21
  Bottom: M9, RX11, CC51, A151, SP51
   
  Come to think of it, I might own too many Meelec earphones.


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> It's getting close to #150. So, which one would be the special #150? I hope it's FX700 or the 'always-on-the-back-burner' TF10.......or is it something else?


 

 It won't be the TF10 because if I post all the UE reviews at once as I've been planning to it will hit 155 or so 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I actually passed 150 a long time ago (I have at least a dozen not-yet-added reviews). If I had to make an educated guess as to which was really the 150th to be reviewed, it's probably the Meelec A151 or ECCI PR401 (all hail 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).


----------



## Zephyron

I've just been keeping tabs on something about the number of earphones reviewed and the number of pages on this thread.
   
  Joker, ya planning to keep ahead of the 1 IEM reviewed per page record that's been going on for a while now? ;D


----------



## esanthosh

^ Hasn't he already? It's 146 IEMs in the review and we are on the 144th page 
   
  @lJokerl,
   
  (muffled voice) A151 / PR401?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. (normal voice) But, it's the #150 posted that I care about (tries to fake a straight face). 
   
  #200 should be here by 2012, but at this rate, I won't be surprised if it's reached this year


----------



## Zephyron

^ He is
   
  Last times I checked in, he was at these numbers IIRC
   
  140/139,140,141
  142/141,142
  144/142,143
  146/143,144
   
  Its kinda like a fun, but somewhat stressful, game of small leapfrogging *wide grin*


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Come to think of it, I might own too many Meelec earphones.


 

 At least you have different models.  I have 3 M6's and don't know how or why.


----------



## BoxShot

:/ So all the newer ones are longer than the older ones!  At least m series wise.


----------



## Zephyron

@Anaxilus: Different colour variations?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> @Anaxilus: Different colour variations?


 

 I have one clear that was butchered for the sake of science.  Two black 'P's (went black to avoid green cable syndrome, once you go black....).  One for working out, other backup or what not.  I guess once the booze wore off I could remember.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Reminds me, I'm due some Scotch per Shane's orders!


----------



## kingice10

This forum makes my daily visit to Headfi complete...kudos to ljokerl!
   
  Chances to put the JVC-Victor FX7000 here? IMO they are the best in timbre and bass extension. Also I noticed UE TF10s are also not included...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> I've just been keeping tabs on something about the number of earphones reviewed and the number of pages on this thread.
> 
> Joker, ya planning to keep ahead of the 1 IEM reviewed per page record that's been going on for a while now? ;D


 
   
  I've never even noticed that before. For a while I kept track of the number views of this thread, which until the 120th IEM or so hovered at ~1000 per each addition. However, the views really shot up recently and are now growing by 10k+ a month. There's no way I can consistently review that many earphones each month so I've given up on that. I guess the 1 IEM per page thing is more up to you guys than me. This thread does get buried once in a while and can go a few days with no posts.
   


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> #200 should be here by 2012, but at this rate, I won't be surprised if it's reached this year


 


  I just double-checked and I could easily push it above 160 tomorrow if I wanted to. I won't - for various reasons - but definitely on track for 200 by fall. I've got a bit of a change planned for the rating system which will coincide with the 150th review. Now I need to figure out which filler review to use before that.
   
   
   


  Quote: 





kingice10 said:


> This forum makes my daily visit to Headfi complete...kudos to ljokerl!
> 
> Chances to put the JVC-Victor FX7000 here? IMO they are the best in timbre and bass extension. Also I noticed UE TF10s are also not included...


 

  There's a list of upcoming reviews on the front page, below the table.


----------



## macrocheesium

I'm thinking it would be a good idea to get some Beats in here, so we can direct people to this thread. It's a REALLY good amount of reviews, but it's not really going to help a "mainstream" guy realize what's out there. He'd just say something like "Pff, I'm sure my Beats would rate a 10 if they were on there". Know what I mean? Or maybe iBuds, for reference.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> I'm thinking it would be a good idea to get some Beats in here, so we can direct people to this thread. It's a REALLY good amount of reviews, but it's not really going to help a "mainstream" guy realize what's out there. He'd just say something like "Pff, I'm sure my Beats would rate a 10 if they were on there". Know what I mean? Or maybe iBuds, for reference.


 

 This is the IEM thread. Joker has reviewed the Beats Solo in the regular portable thread. In this one he's done the Beats Tours, Lil Jams, and all of the turbines.


----------



## macrocheesium

I meant the Beats Tours, guess I missed that one! I'll go read it... EDIT:: Oh. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Turbines are in the Beats line? Didn't know that either. Learning somethin new every day!


----------



## Inks

No they aren't, the turbine line isn't part of the Beats line. Prove me otherwise.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the H2O Audio Flex. I know these are probably going to be ignored since they fall quite low on the table but for the money I am quite happy with their sound as an exercise earphone. 
   
  Also, a little contest for those who have been keeping up with my reviews. A while ago I wrote a review comparing the Thinksound TS01 to the Woodees IESW101B. Now that both the Thinksound and Woodees lineups have been refreshed, the time has come for a 'Got Wood? Part 2', which will be a 5-way review. Four of the contenders should be fairly obvious but if anyone can guess the fifth, they will win it as a prize. 
   
  Some rules: the winning post must correctly identify all five earphones. Vague answers such as 'the wooden one from Thinksound' will not be accepted. Also, there will be a 12-hour timeout between consecutive guesses for a single head-fier - don't want anyone to be up all night spamming guesses.
   
  Clues revealed so far:
   
  1. As with most of my reviews, this one will be kept relatively fair. That means that I will not be pitting a top-tier earphone against something from the bargain bin.
  2. Overlap with already-posted reviews is possible


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





inks said:


> No they aren't, the turbine line isn't part of the Beats line. Prove me otherwise.


 


  I didn't think so; I'm going with this.
   
  There's one question I've been wanting to ask for a while. Joker, what's the best IEM you've heard for rock for under ~$120, including used prices. From other threads, I got the idea that it was the Superfi. 5 pro, but with their notorious build quality I don't want to mess with those. I like an exciting sound, and accuracy isn't needed in the slightest bit. I just want to have fun listening to them, and I doubt I'll be doing any critical listening on the go anyway.
   
  I really liked my NE-6 when I had them.


----------



## Inks

His preferences of sound signature for rock probably won't equal to yours (they don't to some extent to mine) but if you're looking at strictly technical aspects, the chart always helps.
   
  Nice review of the H20s Mike, they're pretty nice for their price because they offer something different than most other budget IEMs do at this price point but it can take some time to getting used to. Also due to the fact that the noise made by water drowns out lower frequencies makes me wish they had more presence there but then we'll be making some compromises. 
   
  Got Wood IEMs? I think I know them all but it will be fun to see how some approach this.


----------



## Anaxilus

So the reason to get the surge over the flex would be...?


----------



## Redmetal1897

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> I didn't think so; I'm going with this.
> 
> There's one question I've been wanting to ask for a while. Joker, what's the best IEM you've heard for rock for under ~$120, including used prices. From other threads, I got the idea that it was the Superfi. 5 pro, but with their notorious build quality I don't want to mess with those. I like an exciting sound, and accuracy isn't needed in the slightest bit. I just want to have fun listening to them, and I doubt I'll be doing any critical listening on the go anyway.
> 
> I really liked my NE-6 when I had them.


 

 Best I've heard are the HJE900's if you can get them for that price. I've heard the DBA-02, RE262, FA Silver Bullet and ortofon e-q5 for reference


----------



## scare

I'll guess Skullcandy Holua.
   
  What an odd name - maybe that's the selling point?


----------



## takoyaki7

FX-700?


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





daanish said:


> Best I've heard are the HJE900's if you can get them for that price. I've heard the DBA-02, RE262, FA Silver Bullet and ortofon e-q5 for reference


 


  That was actually my first consideration, based on their exciting sound. You like them for rock?


----------



## Redmetal1897

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> That was actually my first consideration, based on their exciting sound. You like them for rock?


 

 Absolutely love em, for rock and metal!


----------



## kreeayetor

I would say JVC FA-HX1000

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the H2O Audio Flex. I know these are probably going to be ignored since they fall quite low on the table but for the money I am quite happy with their sound as an exercise earphone.
> 
> Also, a little contest for those who have been keeping up with my reviews. A while ago I wrote a review comparing the Thinksound TS01 to the Woodees IESW101B. Now that both the Thinksound and Woodees lineups have been refreshed, the time has come for a 'Got Wood? Part 2', which will be a 5-way review. Four of the contenders should be fairly obvious but if anyone can guess the fifth, they will win it as a prize.


----------



## mywallethurts

jcv ha-fx700


----------



## ljokerl

I guess it's more difficult than i first thought to figure out all of the earphones so let's say that all five are required to win.


 Quote:


macrocheesium said:


> I didn't think so; I'm going with this.
> 
> There's one question I've been wanting to ask for a while. Joker, what's the best IEM you've heard for rock for under ~$120, including used prices. From other threads, I got the idea that it was the Superfi. 5 pro, but with their notorious build quality I don't want to mess with those. I like an exciting sound, and accuracy isn't needed in the slightest bit. I just want to have fun listening to them, and I doubt I'll be doing any critical listening on the go anyway.
> 
> I really liked my NE-6 when I had them.


 
 Inks is right - I really don't associate sound signature preferences with genre preferences to the same extent as many other head-fiers. A great earphone makes any genre sound great while a poor earphone may need a certain genre (or rather a lack of certain musical elements) to mask its flaws. Usually the earphones considered to be tuned for rock are those with a v-shaped signature and if that assumption is upheld right now my pick would be the ECCI PR401.
   

 Quote:


inks said:


> His preferences of sound signature for rock probably won't equal to yours (they don't to some extent to mine) but if you're looking at strictly technical aspects, the chart always helps.
> 
> Nice review of the H20s Mike, they're pretty nice for their price because they offer something different than most other budget IEMs do at this price point but it can take some time to getting used to. Also due to the fact that the noise made by water drowns out lower frequencies makes me wish they had more presence there but then we'll be making some compromises.
> 
> Got Wood IEMs? I think I know them all but it will be fun to see how some approach this.


 
 Yes, the bass of the H2Os will leave a bit to be desired for many listeners but I find its sound less fatiguing in the long run than, say, the Meelec M6. In a way, it has advantages as I really like to keep my volumes low during any workouts (since the ear is not only more easily fatigued but also more easily damaged during heightened physical activity). The sound of the Flex means that I never have to struggle to discern vocals even at lower volumes, which is something that annoys me about many other entry-level earphones.
  
  Quote:


anaxilus said:


> So the reason to get the surge over the flex would be...?


 
 Several I can think of but none of them good enough for me personally. First would be bass - the Surge has more of it. Second would be tips - the thick rubber tips that come with Surge seal much better (for underwater and workout use) and the size selection is better as well. It takes a lot of force to pull the Surge from my ear when its sealed properly. The Flex comes with pretty typical (albeit good quality) silicone tips. Third would be the cable - the one on the flex is pretty thin and wouldn't be too difficult to ruin. The thicker plastic-sheathed cable of the Surge will last longer than the thinner rubbery affair on the Flex for those who are less careful.


 Quote:


scare said:


> I'll guess Skullcandy Holua.
> 
> What an odd name - maybe that's the selling point?


 
 Since it's in my signature I think it qualifies for 'obvious'. 
   

 Quote:


takoyaki7 said:


> FX-700?


   
  That would be highly unfair to the aforementioned Holua...


 Quote:


kreeayetor said:


> I would say JVC FA-HX1000


 
 See above.


----------



## HKgirl

@ljokerl, I would say Mingo-WM2 is going to be the new woodies!


----------



## Zephyron

Gonna guess that the 5-way review's mystery entrant maybe the FX700.

 The said, the H20 sound like something fun to experiment with if we can get our hands on a waterproof DAP =)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hkgirl said:


> @ljokerl, I would say Mingo-WM2 is going to be the new woodies!


 

 Interesting guess but sadly not right.
   


  Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Gonna guess that the 5-way review's mystery entrant maybe the FX700.
> 
> The said, the H20 sound like something fun to experiment with if we can get our hands on a waterproof DAP =)


 

 The FX700 would be highly unfair to the other entrants. I try to make my comparisons more or less even-handed. FX700 vs Skullcandy Holua would be a lot like pitting a racehorse against a one-legged donkey in a 500-m sprint (and that's considering the fact that the Holua is the best Skullcandy product I've heard).
   
  Don't know about waterproof DAPs but I have a moisture-proof mp3 player pouch that I got off meritline for about $6. I don't trust it with my J3 for obvious reasons but my 3-year-old 1gb clip has taken a few dips in it with no issues.


----------



## Basilius

Is the fifth wood the Xears TD-III ?


----------



## Inks

> Posted by *Joker*
> Yes, the bass of the H2Os will leave a bit to be desired for many listeners but I find its sound less fatiguing in the long run than, say, the Meelec M6. In a way, it has advantages as I really like to keep my volumes low during any workouts (since the ear is not only more easily fatigued but also more easily damaged during heightened physical activity). The sound of the Flex means that I never have to struggle to discern vocals even at lower volumes, which is something that annoys me about many other entry-level earphones.


 
  Funny but I usually get annoyed at not being able to discern the bass while the brass/strings/woodwinds (mids) are easily there at lower volumes, I guess that's the magic of having different sources. I like how you mention the potential damage of listening at higher volumes when in physical activity, it's a disclaimer everyone should know and it's one of the main reasons I use v shaped iems and listen at lower volumes when in physical activity.  
   
   
   
   
  LOL hilarious. It will be nice to give them a cameo appearance though. 


ljokerl said:


> The FX700 would be highly unfair to the other entrants. I try to make my comparisons more or less even-handed. FX700 vs Skullcandy Holua would be a lot like pitting a racehorse against a one-legged donkey in a 500-m sprint (and that's considering the fact that the Holua is the best Skullcandy product I've heard)..


----------



## Zephyron

Thought did just cross my mind with regard to the FX700, was just excited as its one of the yet to be reviewed woodies and blanked out on its cost @_@
   
  Woodees IESW101B
  Thinksound TS01
  Meelec CW31
   
  Those are what I'd imagine that you'd be comparing against the Holua, relatively similar price brackets, but have no idea what would fit in that price category
   
  The Sentry's too cheap, and the Rain, Thinksound 02 and FX500 are way above the reasonable price range of the Holua (if we take $50 to be the absolute maximum amount of money one would be willing to spend)


----------



## Inks

CW31
  Thinksound TS01
  TD 100 III
  Woodees IESW101B
  Skull Candy Holua


----------



## ljokerl

I feel like some ground rules need to be laid out. Please list all five earphones if you intend to make a guess. Also, there will be a 12-hour timeout between consecutive guesses for a single head-fier. Don't want anyone to be up all night spamming guesses.
  
  Quote: 





jbsteeves said:


> Is the fifth wood the Xears TD-III ?


 

 It is on the to-do list so.. fairly obvious. Also, please list all five if you intend to give it a shot.


  Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Thought did just cross my mind with regard to the FX700, was just excited as its one of the yet to be reviewed woodies and blanked out on its cost @_@
> 
> Woodees IESW101B
> Thinksound TS01
> ...


 
   
  Well just because the Holua can be had for $50 doesn't mean I will consider its competition to be necessarily cheaper but the FX700 is unreasonably expensive.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> CW31
> Thinksound TS01
> TD 100 III
> Woodees IESW101B
> Skull Candy Holua


 
   
  2/5


----------



## Zephyron

Tonight on HeadGear!
   
  - We got some wood
  - Victor beats up a skull
  - And many people wave their arms in the air madly
   
  Stay tuned! =D


----------



## Ikarios

Cool, another contest.
   
  Before I make a guess, are any of these headphones on your list already? I noticed you already have all three Thinksound woodies.


----------



## rawrster

So this is what you came up with 
   
  I'd post my answers but I think I have a slight advantage in knowing what all 5 are before you posted the contest  Also I think this contest will run longer than your previous one in the portable headphone review thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Tonight on HeadGear!
> 
> - We got some wood
> - Victor beats up a skull
> ...


 






   


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Cool, another contest.
> 
> Before I make a guess, are any of these headphones on your list already? I noticed you already have all three Thinksound woodies.


 

 Your logic is difficult to argue with 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. So yes. I'll update the clues list accordingly.


----------



## Ikarios

Well, my first guess:
   
  Xears TD-III
 Skullcandy Holua
  Woodees IESW201B
 Thinksound TS02
  Maxell Timbers


----------



## scare

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Tonight on HeadGear!
> 
> - We got some wood
> - Victor beats up a skull
> ...


 

  
  Fixed


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Well, my first guess:
> 
> Xears TD-III
> Skullcandy Holua
> ...


 

 3/5


----------



## Marcus_C

Can I ask about the flex? (I know this is a contest thread at the moment but I don't need any more iem's) Does the strain relief work? Looking at the design i'd hope it at least tries to reduce microphonics, also I assume it makes wearing over ear that much more difficult, wearing ove rear on my h20's is not exactly natural anyway. btw: if you'd be interested in reviewing the pro-mini's send me a pm and i'm sure I can arrange something.


----------



## audionewbi

Just a question, I already own ER4S and E7 with an LOD, this is my current set up. I was wondering should I buy the *minibox-ES* from head-direct or should I instead by *Ultimate Ears TripleFi *they both cost the same for me.
  What you guys thing? I love ER4S as it is but I was thinking perhaps it would be fun to try a different IEM sound signature than just improve the same signature of ER4. I am not sure maybe the ER4 is yet to reach its full potential!
   
  Thanks in advance


----------



## redsevn

Xears TD-III
 Skullcandy Holua
  Woodees IESW201B
 Thinksound Rain
  Fischer Audio Daleth


----------



## Insilin1i

Xears TD-III

Woodees IESW201B

Fischer Audio Daleth

  Thinksound Rain
  Maxell Timbers


----------



## TekeRugburn

Woodees IES101B
  Woodees IES201B
  Thinksound ts01
  Thinksound ts02
  skullcandy holua


----------



## rawrster

Hopefully some other time there will be a contest that I actually qualify for 
   
  Mike, just curious but out of all the dual drivers with TWFK that you have heard which one do you prefer? I have the B2 and CK10 right now in my possession so just wondering.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

I can guess the answer will be ck10...


----------



## rawrster

That would be my guess as well but just wondering. If I had to choose it would be difficult between the CK10 and DBA-02 right now. I did rebuy the CK10 so I like them better as an overall value with sound and build quality but the DBA-02 does sound very good esp at the cheap price that it is compared to the CK10.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





marcus_c said:


> Can I ask about the flex? (I know this is a contest thread at the moment but I don't need any more iem's) Does the strain relief work? Looking at the design i'd hope it at least tries to reduce microphonics, also I assume it makes wearing over ear that much more difficult, wearing ove rear on my h20's is not exactly natural anyway. btw: if you'd be interested in reviewing the pro-mini's send me a pm and i'm sure I can arrange something.


 

 Don't worry - I think this is still a review thread at heart 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. The strain relief works as a strain relief. It does nothing to reduce microphonics. However, it is very soft and quite flexible and does not get in the way of wearing them over-the-ear, at least for me. The housings are very small (maybe 50% smaller by volume than those of my Surge and a bit smaller than the Sennheiser CX250) and fit quite deeply for me but the strain relief still doesn't bother me any. 
   


  Quote: 





audionewbi said:


> Just a question, I already own ER4S and E7 with an LOD, this is my current set up. I was wondering should I buy the *minibox-ES* from head-direct or should I instead by *Ultimate Ears TripleFi *they both cost the same for me.
> What you guys thing? I love ER4S as it is but I was thinking perhaps it would be fun to try a different IEM sound signature than just improve the same signature of ER4. I am not sure maybe the ER4 is yet to reach its full potential!
> 
> Thanks in advance


 

 I don't think any amp will make the ER4S sound significantly different from the way it does with an E7 (though I'm the first to admit that the E7 doesn't have the greatest amp section). If you want a different sound signature, the TF10 will definitely do that for you. Plus, it will run fine unamped. 
   


  Quote: 





redsevn said:


> Xears TD-III
> Skullcandy Holua
> Woodees IESW201B
> Thinksound Rain
> Fischer Audio Daleth


 

 3/5
   


  Quote: 





insilin1i said:


> Xears TD-III
> Woodees IESW201B
> Fischer Audio Daleth
> Thinksound Rain
> Maxell Timbers


 

 2/5
   


  Quote: 





tekerugburn said:


> Woodees IES101B
> Woodees IES201B
> Thinksound ts01
> Thinksound ts02
> skullcandy holua


 

 2/5
   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Hopefully some other time there will be a contest that I actually qualify for
> 
> Mike, just curious but out of all the dual drivers with TWFK that you have heard which one do you prefer? I have the B2 and CK10 right now in my possession so just wondering.


 

 That would be the CK10, quite easily. The DBA-02 (followed by the B2 and q-JAYS) do come close but fail to recreate the ambient experience or that liquid midrange smoothness of the CK10 for me.


----------



## audionewbi

thank you ljokerl


----------



## bleho

Xears TD-III
 Skullcandy Holua
  Woodees IESW201B
  MEElectronics R1
  iFrogz EarPollution Timbre


----------



## Insilin1i

Xears TD-III
Skullcandy Holua

Woodees IESW201B

MEElectronics R1

  JVC FX-500


----------



## Inks

Alright I'll actually officially give it an effort. 
  Skullcandy Holua
  Xears TD 100 III
  Meelec R1 rev.2
Woodees IESW201B

  Meelec CW31


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bleho said:


> Xears TD-III
> Skullcandy Holua
> Woodees IESW201B
> MEElectronics R1
> iFrogz EarPollution Timbre


 

 2/5


  Quote: 





insilin1i said:


> Xears TD-III
> Skullcandy Holua
> Woodees IESW201B
> MEElectronics R1
> JVC FX-500


 

 2/5


  Quote: 





inks said:


> Alright I'll actually officially give it an effort.
> Skullcandy Holua
> Xears TD 100 III
> Meelec R1 rev.2
> ...


 

 2/5


----------



## Inks

woah I underestimate this game..thought I had at least 3 right at least now I know where I went wrong.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Guess #1:
Skullcandy Holua
Xears TD 100 III
Thinksound Rain
Fischer Audio Daleth
Woodees IES101B


----------



## yanks1234

Skullcandy Holua
 Thinksound Rain
 Xears TD-III
 Thinksound TS02
 Woodees IESW100L


----------



## jjmai

Let's see...
   
Skullcandy Holua
Woodees IESW200B
Xears TD-III (also known as Xears Turbo Devices TD III PRO Blackwood)
Thinksound TS02
  Thinksound Rain
   
  Was going to say Fischer Audio Daleth, but seems to be a lower tier.
   
How many chances can each person guess, and how often?


----------



## yanks1234

i believe he said ur allowed to guess once every 12 hrs


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Guess #1:
> Skullcandy Holua
> Xears TD 100 III
> Thinksound Rain
> ...


 

 3/5
   


  Quote: 





yanks1234 said:


> Skullcandy Holua
> Thinksound Rain
> Xears TD-III
> Thinksound TS02
> Woodees IESW100L


 

 4/5


  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Let's see...
> 
> Skullcandy Holua
> Woodees IESW200B
> ...


 

 3/5
   
  And yes - one guess every 12 hours, no limit on re-tries.


----------



## esanthosh

Let me take a chance:
   
  Skullcandy Holua
  Xears TDIII
  Fischer Audio Daleth
  Thinksound TS02
  Woodees IESW100L


----------



## Kubiq

Skullcandy Holua
 Xears TD III
 Thinksound Rain
Woodees IESW100V
Woodees IESW100L


----------



## Zol0ft

Skullcandy Holua
  Thinksound Rain
  Woodees IESW100L
  Woodees IESW100B
  Xears TD-III


----------



## NuckinFutz

This is fun 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Skullcandy Holua
 Fischer Audio Daleth
 Xears TD-III
 Thinksound TS02
 Woodees IESW100L


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think any amp will make the ER4S sound significantly different from the way it does with an E7 (though I'm the first to admit that the E7 doesn't have the greatest amp section). If you want a different sound signature, the TF10 will definitely do that for you. Plus, it will run fine unamped.


 

 i totally dissagree, in my experience the TF10 absolutely needs an amp to come alive


----------



## tuahogary

Guess #1
   
  Skullcandy Holua
 Thinksound Rain
 Xears TD-III
 Woodees IESW100L
  Crossroads Woody 2


----------



## nunomeneses

Skullcandy Holua
 Thinksound Rain
 Xears TD-III
 Woodees IESW100L
 Thinksound TS01


----------



## hojomojo96

Skullcandy Holua
 Xears TD-III
Fischer Audio Daleth
 Thinksound TS02
 Woodees IESW100L
   
  I think I won. Simple elimination.


----------



## hojomojo96

NOOOO NUCKINFUTZ BEAT ME TO IT! SILLY PASSPORT APPLICATION!
   
  Still, fun brain teaser, thank ljokerl


----------



## Insilin1i

Skullcandy Holua
Altec Lansing MHP136
Xears TD-III
Thinksound TS02
Woodees IESW100L   
  Third times the charm?
   
  This is wrong nooooo, nuckin futz did get it.


----------



## yanks1234

Dang  I was sooo close to getting it. Picked the wrong side of 50/50


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





hojomojo96 said:


> NOOOO NUCKINFUTZ BEAT ME TO IT! SILLY PASSPORT APPLICATION!
> 
> Still, fun brain teaser, thank ljokerl


 


 Where does that leave me? Hmmm... Two posts above NuckinFutz 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Will now wait for Joker's post to confirm if anybody got it right.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Where does that leave me? Hmmm... Two posts above NuckinFutz
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 That leaves you on the outside looking in!
   
  This contest took less time than I suspected however...


----------



## hojomojo96

Actually, esanthosh DID get it right, then NuckinFutz, then me >.>
  It was actually wuite simple, I found it by looking at other posts: its like a puzzle


----------



## Angelopsaro

Anyone knows how we remove the filters from the q-jays? does the accessory pack includes a tool?


----------



## redsevn

Nuts. Do I get a consolation prize for guessing the Fischer Audio Daleth (which I suppose is the "5th" woody)? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Skullcandy Holua
 Fischer Audio Daleth
 Xears TD-III
 Thinksound TS02
 Woodees IESW100L


----------



## ljokerl

Whoa, the contest exploded while I was sleeping. I guess people were secretly putting together all of the clues 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Let me take a chance:
> 
> Skullcandy Holua
> Xears TDIII
> ...


 

 Yes, with the Daleth being the 'fifth' one in my book. Send me your address and I'll drop it in the mail next week. I suppose now it's safe to say that the prize was provided by rawrster (wanted to keep this under wraps since he may have told someone he got the Daleth, which would have been unfair) so all thanks go to him this time around.


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Anyone knows how we remove the filters from the q-jays? does the accessory pack includes a tool?


 

 There's instructions in that overly wordy manual they came with. I think you just hook the filter with a needle and pull it out.


  Quote: 





redsevn said:


> Nuts. Do I get a consolation prize for guessing the Fischer Audio Daleth (which I suppose is the "5th" woody)?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Sadly, no, as the rules specified that all five had to be correct. Good guess, however.


----------



## rawrster

I did not tell anyone outside of you that I had the Daleth..unless I forgot that I mentioned it somewhere but it may be in my profile but don't remember


----------



## hojomojo96

Congrats esanthosh!


----------



## jjmai

wow, a sub-$30 Daleth competing with the rest of the woodys? Didn't see that coming. Looking forward to the reviews.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> wow, a sub-$30 Daleth competing with the rest of the woodys? Didn't see that coming. Looking forward to the reviews.


 

 I think the lineup is more unfair to the Holua than the Daleth since Fischer actually cares about audio quality. The Daleth was thrown in at the last minute courtesy of rawrster, who said there's no such thing as review overkill at Head-Fi 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## treal512

Sub'd for the FX700 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I'm on the fence with these.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





hojomojo96 said:


> Congrats esanthosh!


 

 Thanks. Do I get to give a long acceptance speech? But I'll spare you all the time & trouble and instead wait for the next set of updates. So close to #150 now! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  @Zephyron,  
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Zephyron* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> Last times I checked in, he was at these numbers IIRC
> 
> 140/139,140,141
> ...


 
   
  It's 147 reviewed vs 149 pages now. As if visiting this thread this thread to check reviews is not enough, there are now stats to keep an eye on 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. My head-fi addiction is getting serious and there's no cure.


----------



## nunomeneses

Congratulations esanthosh!


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





nunomeneses said:


> Congratulations esanthosh!


 


 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  A short list of Thank yous from my side
   

 To rawrster for the prize
 To ljokerl for the contest and this thread
 To all those who participated before me, without whose help it would have been really difficult for me to guess
 To head-fi for transforming a person who spent three weeks contemplating buying EP-630 (because he feared how his ear canals would be affected) to an avid IEM collector that I am today.
 To my wallet for not going completely empty


----------



## jjmai

esanthosh said:


> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I think you meant to say sorry to your wallet. Congrats


----------



## NuckinFutz

Yes congrats esanthosh. I noticed your post as soon as I posted mine....gutted


----------



## jant71

Hey, I know that esanthosh guy
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





! Congrats!


----------



## TekeRugburn

Skullcandy Holua
Thinksound Rain
Xears TD100-III
Thinksound TS02
Woodees IESW201B


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hopefully you enjoy them whenever you receive them in the mail. It would not have been used much or at all if I had kept them so I decided to send them to joker for a listen and then a giveaway afterwards


----------



## james444

Quote: 





tekerugburn said:


> Skullcandy Holua
> Thinksound Rain
> Xears TD100-III
> Thinksound TS02
> Woodees IESW201B


 

 Close but not quite there. Take your time...


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> I think you meant to say sorry to your wallet. Congrats


 
  Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Yes congrats esanthosh. I noticed your post as soon as I posted mine....gutted


 
  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Hey, I know that esanthosh guy
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks a lot.
   
  @Jant71,
  To my knowledge, perhaps the only owners of the HDSS earbud around here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
   
   
  Quote:  





> Hopefully you enjoy them whenever you receive them in the mail. It would not have been used much or at all if I had kept them so I decided to send them to joker for a listen and then a giveaway afterwards


 

 Hopefully, yes


----------



## Inks

woah @ the new updates.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the JVC HA-FX700, FAD FI-BA-SS, and 1964EARS 1964-T. 
   
  The sesquicentennial addition brings with it a lot of records - first custom, most expensive earphone, highest-scoring dynamic-driver IEM, highest-scording single armature, and so on - not to mention the record for most ridiculously long review thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  And yes, all of the ratings have been rescaled and re-adjusted to accommodate the customs. This thread is now on a more precise scale for both sound quality and the tabulated average.
   

 Quote:


inks said:


> woah @ the new updates.


 
 Lol... quick on the draw there.


----------



## Inks

Yeah I was checking out your thoughts on the Q-Jays which I have coming and then noticed all those weird new sound ratings. Second time this happens, first with the TS02 update. 
   
  Only read the FX700 review so far and I gotta agree with all that's been said. It's a in-home use iem like full-size cans but I wish it was more subbass focused rather than midbass like you mention in the review. Oh and yes the FX700s bass is faster than the MDs, check it myself with a sine-sweep. Did your experience with these somehow accustomed you to look closer to the timbre of iems? Happened to me..


----------



## rawrster

I was wondering when the BA-SS was going to come out. I'm surprised the value is that high..also with the sound score you consider the SM3 better?


----------



## mywallethurts

hi joker. is it advisable to get the quad driver 1964ears or is the 3 driver setup good enough?


----------



## TheGame21x

Wow, 150 IEMs compared and reviewed. Such an amazing milestone to hit. Congrats and thanks for all of your hard work!


----------



## treal512

Page 150 with 150 IEMs reviewed. Congrats, Joker. What a feat and great resource!


----------



## Redmetal1897

Excellent! This thread should be in the internet hall of fame lol. Have been eagerly looking forward to your review of the JVC FX700 and it did not disappoint!


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote:


inks said:


> Yeah I was checking out your thoughts on the Q-Jays which I have coming and then noticed all those weird new sound ratings. Second time this happens, first with the TS02 update.


 


  I think it also happened when he added the SM3


----------



## monoglycer

Nice reviews again joker!
   
  I am now curious to see how much custom you get with a single BA from kozee.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the JVC HA-FX700, FAD FI-BA-SS, and 1964EARS 1964-T.
> 
> The sesquicentennial addition brings with it a lot of records - first custom, most expensive earphone, highest-scoring dynamic-driver IEM, highest-scording single armature, and so on - not to mention the record for most ridiculously long review thread
> 
> ...


 

 Congrats on reaching 150 and very nice work on both the FX700 and FI-BA-SS, though we obviously don't agree in sound rating vs. the SM3. Btw. the FAD's sensitivity/hiss is one of the reasons why the Samsung R0 managed to become my favorite DAP lately, because it's more silent than both my Cowon i9 and Fuze.
    
  Quote:


rawrster said:


> I was wondering when the BA-SS was going to come out. I'm surprised the value is that high..also with the sound score you consider the SM3 better?


 

 I can somewhat relate to that, since I've stated several times that the FI-BA-SS are a niche phone for those who want utmost clarity and transparency at all cost. Though I wouldn't go so far to hold that fact against the FADs in a rating, I also concluded in my review that "the prize for the most forgiving high-resolution IEMs goes undoubtedly to the SM3".


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Only read the FX700 review so far and I gotta agree with all that's been said. It's a in-home use iem like full-size cans but I wish it was more subbass focused rather than midbass like you mention in the review. Oh and yes the FX700s bass is faster than the MDs, check it myself with a sine-sweep. Did your experience with these somehow accustomed you to look closer to the timbre of iems? Happened to me..


 

 Thanks. And yes, timbre issues are more noticeable next to the FX700 but then I knew which earphones are slightly off beforehand thanks to knowing how most of my tracks sound with the K601.


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I was wondering when the BA-SS was going to come out. I'm surprised the value is that high..also with the sound score you consider the SM3 better?


 

 For obvious reasons assigning a value score to something twice as expensive as anything else in the thread is difficult but the BA-SS does offer something unique. It probably won't even be considered by those without the means or a personal interest in its sound signature so giving it a low value score would be fairly meaningless.
   
  However, here's some trivia. Early in the life of this thread the value score was calculated using a formula that compared the average score and street price in an overcomplicated way. That formula turned out to be highly biased against earphones costing over $300 so I dropped it when the CK100 was added and moved to a more subjective value score. However, just for the heck of it, I plugged the numbers of the FI-BA-SS in and got -0.02/10 as the value.


  Quote: 





mywallethurts said:


> hi joker. is it advisable to get the quad driver 1964ears or is the 3 driver setup good enough?


 

 I don't think that question has a universal answer. I went for the T as I felt that the bass delivered by two low drivers in a dual X-over config would be sufficient for my tastes. Personally, I would not want the 1964-Q in place of my T but I am sure many will gladly take the extra bass it affords.


  Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> Wow, 150 IEMs compared and reviewed. Such an amazing milestone to hit. Congrats and thanks for all of your hard work!


 
  Quote: 





treal512 said:


> Page 150 with 150 IEMs reviewed. Congrats, Joker. What a feat and great resource!


 
  Quote: 





daanish said:


> Excellent! This thread should be in the internet hall of fame lol. Have been eagerly looking forward to your review of the JVC FX700 and it did not disappoint!


 

 Thanks, everyone 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote: 





monoglycer said:


> Nice reviews again joker!
> 
> I am now curious to see how much custom you get with a single BA from kozee.


 

 Lol... so far it has been exactly none. Hopefully they'll pull through though.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Congrats on reaching 150 and very nice work on both the FX700 and FI-BA-SS, though we obviously don't agree in sound rating vs. the SM3. Btw. the FAD's sensitivity/hiss is one of the reasons why the Samsung R0 managed to become my favorite DAP lately, because it's more silent than both my Cowon i9 and Fuze.


 

  Thanks, I know there are a few things that bug you about the SM3 just as there are a few things that bug me about the BA-SS. The important thing is that there's a huge body of information out there for people to draw their own conclusions and make informed decisions. Oh and I don't think the BA-SS hisses notably with my J3 at normal listening volumes - if the R0 has an even lower noise floor, that's pretty impressive.


----------



## jjmai

With 1964-T and the upcoming UM Miracle, I have feeling that joker won't have as much time to enjoy the many universal IEMs pretty soon.  I bet he wishes he had more than 2 ears.
   
  A question regarding mid-range bass monsters:
  Which of these has the most bass quantity and extension?  I am looking for something that sounds like Sony XB700.
  TDK EB900
  Sony MDR-XB40EX
  Meelec M31
  Yamaha EPH-50
  HIppo VB
  Xears TD100 or TD-III
   
  Thanks


----------



## kite7

joker, I notice you have the HD25-1. Would you say its isolation is only about as good as canal phones? From my experience, IEMs that have deeper inserts isolate far better than the HD25-1 but that's probably expected. I would have liked to have kept the HD 25 if it blocked out the low frequencies better because sound wise it's great. Which IEM would you say most resembles the HD25-1 in sound?


----------



## mikop

Didn't notice the review for the 1964-T is up!
   
  Was going to wait for a comparison between the 1964-T and UM Miracle, but I got impatient and bought a 1964-Q (should have it in a week or so..) 
   
  Can't wait for when you review the Miracle. If I ever get another custom, UM is probably where I will be getting them.


----------



## s0lar

Shouldn't it be easier for yourself to use a less detailed scale.
  I think it is virtually impossible to justify the difference of 0.1, I would use something like 8+, 8.5-,8.5,8.5+. This allows you to give an IEM a score that has the same value of let's say 8.6 or 8.7 but makes your job easier.
  Scaling old scores is ok, but there you used a different scale for a long time. Reviewing new IEM's and giving them a correct score is going to be very hard, I can imagine.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> And yes, all of the ratings have been rescaled and re-adjusted to accommodate the customs. This thread is now on a more precise scale for both sound quality and the tabulated average.


----------



## esanthosh

I for one, like the new scale much, much better. Finally, RE-ZERO goes over RE0. What a relief! It's minor differences like this which were tough to make out using the old scale. Thanks for taking time to do it.
   
  Finally, FX700 and.. FI-BA-SS and 1964-T. I knew something special was going to happen close to #150. But, this was better than I expected


----------



## leylandi

will it be the sony ex1000 review?If the great


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, I know there are a few things that bug you about the SM3 just as there are a few things that bug me about the BA-SS. *The important thing is that there's a huge body of information out there for people to draw their own conclusions and make informed decisions.*


 

 X2, and it's all the more important if you're contemplating a purchase like the BA-SS.
   
  (Btw your SM3 sound ratings are different between review and chart.)


----------



## DervishD

Hi ljokerl 
   
  It's a pity that profanity is forbidden in the forum, because your latest additions made me produce a lot of profanities. WOW! I was quite curious about the FX700, because for the price I sincerely expected them to be almost perfect, so your review was very useful. To be precise, I was curious about isolation, as I had heard some comments about the lack of it. Thanks for confirming 
   
  The 1964 review is just fantastic. Just like listening to them  Thanks a lot, really, for such a detailed review.
   
  The FAD FI-BA-SS... well, I didn't even know they existed. They're more expensive than my car 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 And from your review, I think I would prefer the 1964, but that's a matter of taste and money 
   
  As always, THANKS. I know the work you put in these reviews, really. You're great


----------



## Carlsan

Been following this thread for a while, great job ljoker!
   
  Just a thought on a possible addition to the review cue and chart.
  My daughter, a 19 year old college kid but with very discerning taste in music, just replaced her RE0's with a pair of Klipsch image X5. I bought these for her during one of those Amazon quick sales when the price had dropped to about $130 (normal price is $170 or so).
   
  Anyway she reports back that she is very impressed, her comments:
  Sound, there's a lot of layers; Bass and tremble very good. Overall much better to her ears than the RE0's.
  Anyway, she's up in college so I can't compare them myself.
   
  If you can borrow a set it would be interesting to read your thoughts on this pair. Unfortunately I don't think I can get her set to lend them out!
   
  thanks again for the excellent job!


----------



## Prazzyp

How come you dont do any on Bose headphones?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> With 1964-T and the upcoming UM Miracle, I have feeling that joker won't have as much time to enjoy the many universal IEMs pretty soon.  I bet he wishes he had more than 2 ears.
> 
> A question regarding mid-range bass monsters:
> Which of these has the most bass quantity and extension?  I am looking for something that sounds like Sony XB700.
> ...


 

 Extension - the Hippo VB - but it really doesn't have a whole lot of mid-bass. If quality is less important than quantity, I'd say the XB40EX sounds closest to the XB700 in terms of balance.
   


  Quote: 





kite7 said:


> joker, I notice you have the HD25-1. Would you say its isolation is only about as good as canal phones? From my experience, IEMs that have deeper inserts isolate far better than the HD25-1 but that's probably expected. I would have liked to have kept the HD 25 if it blocked out the low frequencies better because sound wise it's great. Which IEM would you say most resembles the HD25-1 in sound?


 

 Yes - the HD25 isolates about as much as certain shallow-insertion canalphones (maybe a 2.5/5 or 3/5 on the IEM scale), which is impressive for a headphone but does make proper IEMs all the more desirable. The problem with low frequency noise is bone conduction - no matter how well you plug up your ears, you will get some low frequency leakage that way. The best isolation I've experienced (by a fair margin) is my Etymotic HF3 with ACS custom silicone tips and even with those I get low frequency leakage when playing test tones through my speakers.
   


  Quote: 





mikop said:


> Didn't notice the review for the 1964-T is up!
> 
> Was going to wait for a comparison between the 1964-T and UM Miracle, but I got impatient and bought a 1964-Q (should have it in a week or so..)
> 
> Can't wait for when you review the Miracle. If I ever get another custom, UM is probably where I will be getting them.


 

 The miracle is being built now and I'm hoping to have it by mid- to late March. 
   


  Quote: 





s0lar said:


> Shouldn't it be easier for yourself to use a less detailed scale.
> I think it is virtually impossible to justify the difference of 0.1, I would use something like 8+, 8.5-,8.5,8.5+. This allows you to give an IEM a score that has the same value of let's say 8.6 or 8.7 but makes your job easier.
> Scaling old scores is ok, but there you used a different scale for a long time. Reviewing new IEM's and giving them a correct score is going to be very hard, I can imagine.


 

 Your thought process follows mine as of about 6 months ago - back then I switched from the (0.5) difference system to the (0.25) difference system in lieu of using pluses and minuses (same general idea, though). The problem with pluses and minuses is that excel doesn't take them into account when sorting my table, which leads to all sort of problems. Back then I considered switching to the (0.1) scale but decided that it would require too much accuracy on my part. However, with 150 earphones, I simply wanted more freedom in terms of showing minute differences as some things had to be purposely exaggerated under the old system to show that there _was_ a difference no matter how small and some had to be left out. 


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> I for one, like the new scale much, much better. Finally, RE-ZERO goes over RE0. What a relief! It's minor differences like this which were tough to make out using the old scale. Thanks for taking time to do it.
> 
> Finally, FX700 and.. FI-BA-SS and 1964-T. I knew something special was going to happen close to #150. But, this was better than I expected


 

 Thanks, you are absolutely right. I think in the long run this system will work better (though I do anticipate re-scaling everything again when the Miracle gets here.
   


  Quote: 





leylandi said:


> will it be the sony ex1000 review?If the great


 

 No plans for one at the moment.
   


  Quote: 





james444 said:


> X2, and it's all the more important if you're contemplating a purchase like the BA-SS.
> 
> (Btw your SM3 sound ratings are different between review and chart.)


 

 Thanks, fixed that. Guess I missed one (or maybe more.. who knows).
   


  Quote: 





dervishd said:


> Hi ljokerl
> 
> It's a pity that profanity is forbidden in the forum, because your latest additions made me produce a lot of profanities. WOW! I was quite curious about the FX700, because for the price I sincerely expected them to be almost perfect, so your review was very useful. To be precise, I was curious about isolation, as I had heard some comments about the lack of it. Thanks for confirming
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, always happy to hear that I've helped someone come closer to understanding what an earphone sounds like without actually listening to it, especially when we're talking about $400+ sets 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   


  Quote: 





carlsan said:


> Been following this thread for a while, great job ljoker!
> 
> Just a thought on a possible addition to the review cue and chart.
> My daughter, a 19 year old college kid but with very discerning taste in music, just replaced her RE0's with a pair of Klipsch image X5. I bought these for her during one of those Amazon quick sales when the price had dropped to about $130 (normal price is $170 or so).
> ...


 

 Thanks. I've definitely considered the higher-end Image earphones but I can't help thinking that Klipsch will update them soon. Actually, I've been thinking that ever since the $99 X10 sale over at ultimateelectronics. Either way, if someone lets me borrow a set I'll be happy to review it but I've got no plans to buy one at the moment,
   

  
   
  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> How come you dont do any on Bose headphones?


 

  I would rather not leave any of my money with Bose and I don't think anyone around here has kept a Bose In-Ear after listening to it to let me borrow one for review. The old ones were just terrible; the new ones - I don't know.


----------



## Prazzyp

> I would rather not leave any of my money with Bose and I don't think anyone around here has kept a Bose In-Ear after listening to it to let me borrow one for review. The old ones were just terrible; the new ones - I don't know.


 
   
  well a friend of mine had just bought the Bose IE2's which he claims are very good, so is it possible you can do a review on them? they aren't too expensive either. i think they only cost him around £90 (which is around $145)
   
  it would really help if you can  i want to compare them with the monster turbines which i may possible be getting.
   
  Thanks


----------



## Zephyron

^
  Recently joined HeadFi I guess.

 Bose aren't usually well recieved here, they're often overmarketed, and their cost don't justify the sound they give.

 You friend says the Bose IE2 are good, perhaps, but without a basis for comparison, it makes it hard to justify.
   
  Also, congrats on 150 reviews Joker, job well done =)

 Loving the new rating system as well, makes sorting through individual phones a lot more easily. Looking for a comfy earphone to sleep with right now and considering the more comfy shallow insertion ones.


----------



## roy_jones

I fear that your new stable of customs is going to cut back on your motivation to continue with evaluating universals!


----------



## Prazzyp

^ yeah i just joined here lol
   
  and they only have 2 in ear models and yes they are pretty expensive but i tried my friends IE2's and they did impress me. surely just because one model was bad doesnt mean that all of them are bad?
   
  and bose are pretty expensive ill agree with you there, but there over ear headphones and speakers are great IMO


----------



## Zephyron

^
 Comfortable they are, yes, that I concede, but there are better, much better in fact, performers for the cost.
   
  'Great' is relative in this sense because for one, we don't know what you're comparing them against. Compared to tinny, low quality included earbuds and/or maybe gaming headphones, they may sound good yes, but against headphones and earphones based on this hobby, there are a lot better for the cost.
   
  Basically, Bose are expensive, but you're not paying them for the sound as much as you are paying for the brand name and comfort/function on say, an airplane (they do really dissapear, are forgettable for the most part), bt for the cost of their earphones, you can pay for say, 2 Soundmagic PL50s, a 'cheap and cheerful' Chinese branded earphone that has greater technical sonic peformance VS the Bose IEs.
   
  Granted, the IEs have a very consumer oriented sound signature (bottome and and midrange oriented, that's not very refined I might add), which is why people who never really heard anything better would easily be impressed.


----------



## germanturkey

so the FI-BA-SS makes the CK10 sound veiled.  jesus, i need to hear them.  haha.  i'm also surprised you made it through the FX700 without mentioning the CK10s.  i prefer BAs, so i doubt i'll ever hear them, but they sound like they sound (heh) amazing.  but their price tag is kind of large.
   
  take away message, only customs sound better than CK10s.  gotcha  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  i'm a fanboy if you can't tell.


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> ^
> Comfortable they are, yes, that I concede, but there are better, much better in fact, performers for the cost.
> 
> 'Great' is relative in this sense because for one, we don't know what you're comparing them against. Compared to tinny, low quality included earbuds and/or maybe gaming headphones, they may sound good yes, but against headphones and earphones based on this hobby, there are a lot better for the cost.
> ...


 

 hmm i guess you have a point there, im not saying they are great myself but i want to see what an expert wil say about it. i want to compare it with other headphones and right now i can't which is exactly my problem.
   
  for example i was thinking of getting monster turbines for around the same price, but i dont know what is better, so it would be nice if there is a review on them here 
   
  you are of course right though, i mean they are very expensive and you can probably get cheaper and better, but i do want to be able to cmpare them to other IEM's


----------



## Zephyron

Hmm, lets say in terms of performance and sound, I much prefer my M1s to the IE2s.

 I have yet to try the IE1 though, but I don't think I'm gonna bother.


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Hmm, lets say in terms of performance and sound, I much prefer my M1s to the IE2s.
> 
> I have yet to try the IE1 though, but I don't think I'm gonna bother.


 


  ive heard that the IE1's are very bad too.
   
  also is it possible that you can review the standard apple headphones? i know it sounds stupid but if you want to buy a pair it costs £30 which i think is absolutely ridiculous but i would love to compare them to some other IEM's


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> Hmm, lets say in terms of performance and sound, I much prefer my M1s to the IE2s.
> 
> I have yet to try the IE1 though, but I don't think I'm gonna bother.


 


  ive heard that the IE1's are very bad too.
   
  also is it possible that you can review the standard apple headphones? i know it sounds stupid but if you want to buy a pair it costs £30 which i think is absolutely ridiculous but i would love to compare them to some other IEM's


----------



## tuahogary

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> hmm i guess you have a point there, im not saying they are great myself but i want to see what an expert wil say about it. i want to compare it with other headphones and right now i can't which is exactly my problem.
> 
> for example i was thinking of getting monster turbines for around the same price, but i dont know what is better, so it would be nice if there is a review on them here
> 
> you are of course right though, i mean they are very expensive and you can probably get cheaper and better, but i do want to be able to cmpare them to other IEM's


 

 He has a point. Rating common earphones like the iBuds and Bose IE together in this thread will give a better idea to newbies who visit this forum in search of better earphones. Right now we don't know if a Bose IE falls into 2/10 or 5/10 SQ scale for example compared to other similarly priced earphones.


----------



## Zephyron

If memory serves me right, the included apple earbuds aren't so bad for included buds (some of the later Cowon earbuds OEMed from Cresyn are better though)

 If you push the Apple earbuds towards your ears, they should produce a relatively coherent sound through the entire spectrum, just that they don't have a good resolution and coherency.

 If they're given to me for free for example, I won't complain, but I definitely can't justify buying them when I got a pair of Meelec M6 for US$19.65


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





tuahogary said:


> He has a point. Rating common earphones like the iBuds and Bose IE together in this thread will give a better idea to newbies who visit this forum in search of better earphones. Right now we don't know if a Bose IE falls into 2/10 or 5/10 SQ scale for example compared to other similarly priced earphones.


 


  exactly, newbies like me  i mean it would really help me out. i currently use the stock apple headphones (or Ibuds as this person has just mentioned) and i would love to see just how much better all the other headphones out there are


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> If memory serves me right, the included apple earbuds aren't so bad for included buds (some of the later Cowon earbuds OEMed from Cresyn are better though)
> 
> If you push the Apple earbuds towards your ears, they should produce a relatively coherent sound through the entire spectrum, just that they don't have a good resolution and coherency.
> 
> If they're given to me for free for example, I won't complain, but I definitely can't justify buying them when I got a pair of Meelec M6 for US$19.65


 

 great, im currently using the iBuds and i would love to know how they match up against other much better P) headphones.


----------



## Ikarios

Joker hasn't reviewed the iBuds here because this thread is for IEMs only, not earbuds - and he includes the Yuin OK1 only because it has some IEM functionality. He does include the Apple IEMs, if you look closely.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zephyron said:


> You friend says the Bose IE2 are good, perhaps, but without a basis for comparison, it makes it hard to justify.
> Also, congrats on 150 reviews Joker, job well done =)
> 
> Loving the new rating system as well, makes sorting through individual phones a lot more easily. Looking for a comfy earphone to sleep with right now and considering the more comfy shallow insertion ones.


 

 This is true - most midrange IEMs will sound great next to stock earbuds and dimestore replacements. It is only by pitting them against each other that we can find the real price/performance winners.


  Quote: 





germanturkey said:


> so the FI-BA-SS makes the CK10 sound veiled.  jesus, i need to hear them.  haha.  i'm also surprised you made it through the FX700 without mentioning the CK10s.  i prefer BAs, so i doubt i'll ever hear them, but they sound like they sound (heh) amazing.  but their price tag is kind of large.
> 
> take away message, only customs sound better than CK10s.  gotcha
> 
> ...


 
   
  No point in comparing the CK10 to the FX700 - they have nothing in common. And yes, the only way to really do better than a top-tier universal is to go custom, but even that probably doesn't hold true all the time. 


  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> hmm i guess you have a point there, im not saying they are great myself but i want to see what an expert wil say about it. i want to compare it with other headphones and right now i can't which is exactly my problem.
> 
> for example i was thinking of getting monster turbines for around the same price, but i dont know what is better, so it would be nice if there is a review on them here
> 
> you are of course right though, i mean they are very expensive and you can probably get cheaper and better, but i do want to be able to cmpare them to other IEM's


 

 The Turbines are a very safe choice, especially at the ridiculously low prices that have been popping up here and there. I think you would be best off getting them and drawing your own conclusions against your friend's IE2s.


  Quote: 





tuahogary said:


> He has a point. Rating common earphones like the iBuds and Bose IE together in this thread will give a better idea to newbies who visit this forum in search of better earphones. Right now we don't know if a Bose IE falls into 2/10 or 5/10 SQ scale for example compared to other similarly priced earphones.


 

 iPod buds don't belong in an IEM thread and the Bose IEs aren't that popular even outside of Head-Fi. I did add all of the Skullcandy models, Sennheiser CX300, JVC Marshmallows, Beats Tours, and others for this specific purpose.


----------



## takoyaki7

Quote: 





james444 said:


> I can somewhat relate to that, since I've stated several times that the FI-BA-SS are a niche phone for those who want utmost clarity and transparency at all cost. Though I wouldn't go so far to hold that fact against the FADs in a rating, I also concluded in my review that "the prize for the most forgiving high-resolution IEMs goes undoubtedly to the SM3".


 
   
   
  I totally agree with this assessment of the FI-BA-SS by ljokerl and james444. They have a very particular strength, which is their amazing clarity and transparency. What's funny is I have been doing A/B with the FI-BA-SS and the W4s for the past week or so and, by comparison, am disappointed with the W4. The W4 is smooth, an excellent and detailed all-rounded. By comparison the FI-BA-SS are quite a bit more "raw" and can be brutal with bad recordings but the risk/reward is just a lot higher IMHO 
   
  The "value" of the FI-BA-SS really relates to what your preferences are. I think ljokerl makes an interesting point about how perfect audio fidelity might not always be the most sonically pleasing, as ironically it is the lack of colorization that makes the FI-BA-SS sound "colored" and somewhat aggressive. I think the one aspect that wasn't fully addressed is that the "BAM" Balancing Air Movement gives them a real feeling of (modest) dynamic-like slam, something I've never heard in any other BA before.
   
  For me it really depends on moods. W4 and SE425 are laid back and chilltastic. I like my IE8s and MDs when I am listening to bass-heavy genres. For me my FI-BA-SS are in their own category, a strange hybrid of dynamic and BA traits, though I generally pick them up when I am in for a "fun" listen.
   
   
   
  And I would really like to hear for myself where the SM3 fit in all of this, since there seems to be a lot of debate!


----------



## Ikarios

Well, thanks to this thread I've wasted even more money on headphones. Just picked up a pair of Sunrise Xcapes V1 and Klipsch Custom 3s. I was waiting for joker to review the Xcape V2 but from the looks of it I didn't think I was going to like the new sound signature. I listened to a pair of Turbines and they sound pretty good, but ultimately didn't have the detail I crave in the treble. The Sunrise, by all accounts, seem to be similar enough to the RE0s that I think I would really like the sound. The Klipsch, on the other hand, was super cheap, and for how highly they were rated on Joker's scale seemed very interesting. I hope I can get past the crappy cable issues, because an MSRP of $400 with two BA drivers and an 8.8 rating sounds too good to be true for the price I paid. Unfortunately it doesn't look like I'll get the two of them for another two or three weeks, so I won't be able to post any impressions until then 

A quick question for joker - are your sound ratings weighted at all based on the price? In other words, does a theoretical $100 headphone that gets a 9.0 rating sound pretty much the same as a theoretical $500 headphone that has the same sound signature? I've done a little more reading and I'm not quite sure what to expect from the Custom 3. A lot of people have said they've gotten them reshelled, too, but that would be an extra ~$100, and reshelling opens up the possibility of getting other earphones that sound good but don't have good form factors (i.e. Triple.fi 10, which does not fit me well at all). Anyway I think I'm rambling...


----------



## kingice10

Thanks @ljokerl for the JVC FX7000 impressions!! This with @CleOs review are my reference reviews so far and you both did an excellent job here!

Now, the hard part is getting JVC FX7000 to my ears...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> A quick question for joker - are your sound ratings weighted at all based on the price? In other words, does a theoretical $100 headphone that gets a 9.0 rating sound pretty much the same as a theoretical $500 headphone that has the same sound signature? I've done a little more reading and I'm not quite sure what to expect from the Custom 3. A lot of people have said they've gotten them reshelled, too, but that would be an extra ~$100, and reshelling opens up the possibility of getting other earphones that sound good but don't have good form factors (i.e. Triple.fi 10, which does not fit me well at all). Anyway I think I'm rambling...


 

 That's a lot of theory 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I do try to keep my ratings consistent regardless of price but I can't really think of two headphones with the same sound quality and similar signatures at vastly different price points.


----------



## akacoke

hey jorker,  i just got my eterna,  ive spent about 3-4 hrs with them.
   
  MAN !! they are fun to listen to, even they are a lil dark, lack a lil bit of clarity,detail and lushness.  they still rock
   
  im able to wear them straight down with sony hibrid tips. im so happy , i shouldve listen to you and bought them in the first place


----------



## rank08822

You like them better than the MTPG?
  
  Quote: 





akacoke said:


> hey jorker,  i just got my eterna,  ive spent about 3-4 hrs with them.
> 
> MAN !! they are fun to listen to, even they are a lil dark, lack a lil bit of clarity,detail and lushness.  they still rock
> 
> im able to wear them straight down with sony hibrid tips. im so happy , i shouldve listen to you and bought them in the first place


----------



## akacoke

i like turbine gold more,  turbine gold is a lot more better than the brainwavz M2 and eterna in every way, the gold is easily 4 5 times better, but the MTPG have very lil mid bass, eventho i like the turbine gold and m2, i still prefer the eterna
 IMO eterna is even worst sounding overall than the brainwavz M2 when it comes to bass quality,clarity and detail, i cant say i only care about bass quantity, its just more important than the other specs for me,  but without a huge mid bass quantity gold is not for me. gold for 180 is good value , same thing for the m2,  but i think the eternas worth something like 40-50, i could be wrong because the eterna is fresh out of box now, it need more time to break in, i doubt the sound would change dramitically
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





rank08822 said:


> You like them better than the MTPG?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





akacoke said:


> hey joker,  i just got my eterna,  ive spent about 3-4 hrs with them.
> 
> MAN !! they are fun to listen to, even they are a lil dark, lack a lil bit of clarity,detail and lushness.  they still rock
> 
> im able to wear them straight down with sony hibrid tips. im so happy , i shouldve listen to you and bought them in the first place


 

 Glad you like them - I still use mine when (once in a blue moon) I just want to listen to my daft punk with a decent soundstage and brain-shaking bass. I don't own any higher-end bass-monster dynamics anymore because the Eterna (and, more recently, the Xears TD-III) perform that role more than well enough for my purposes.


----------



## Confispect

On the Eterna ever since I got them the Pana/SM3/DBA have been collecting dust. Plain and simple.
   
  Out of all the reviews out there on the Eterna I think the only one I see eye to eye on is MMw2's or something like that. I hear the Eterna differently but as far as burn in goes after about 100hrs, they definitely seem more open, not class leading on the clarity front but the mid-bass definitely is pleasurable and stays out of the way. These have actually inspired me to do a review, the doing it part of course is the hardest 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Eterna could be called the poormans - Sm3 *Ducks and runs out the room 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




*
   
   
  MVW2 - http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/483783/fischer-audio-eterna-holy-crap


----------



## jjmai

Quote: 





akacoke said:


> im able to wear them straight down with sony hibrid tips. im so happy , i shouldve listen to you and bought them in the first place


 


  Wearing Eterna straight down?  Didn't know that's possible with Eterna's over-the-ear design.  I gotta try it now.


----------



## akacoke

lol, i have very small ears , if you can get a good seal with the earpiece twisted 45 degrees, you can wear them straight down


  
  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Wearing Eterna straight down?  Didn't know that's possible with Eterna's over-the-ear design.  I gotta try it now.


----------



## Confispect

^ Indeed switch the right with the left it works perfect.


----------



## akacoke

did you guys need to EQ the eterna?  i find the mids way too shallow, i have to EQ it a lil bit to make the mid more forward, EQing brings out a lil more clarity too


----------



## Confispect

Nope perfect for me, what tips are you using???


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Glad you like them - I still use mine when (once in a blue moon) I just want to listen to my daft punk with a decent soundstage and brain-shaking bass. I don't own any higher-end bass-monster dynamics anymore because the Eterna (and, more recently, the Xears TD-III) perform that role more than well enough for my purposes.


 
  It's funny how preferences differ between people. I much preferred listening to Daft Punk with the RE-ZERO's than I did with the Monster Turbines (in response to the bass). The highs were just so much more pleasing with the RE-ZERO's and they coped well with the speed.
   
  What would be the logical, direct upgrade after the RE-ZERO? A similar sound signature with maybe a little more in the bass end, better speed/soundstage.


----------



## akacoke

i am using the small orange hydrid tips for now, ive tried all the tips, the small grey semi clear one gives them more clarity and spark but they are way too small keep falling from my ears

  
  i dont know if you have the brainwavz m2s, im used to the foward mid range on those, so eternas seem very recessed out of the box, now they have about 20 hrs burn in i think they begain to open
   
  what tips do you sugest to use?
   
  Quote: 





confispect said:


> Nope perfect for me, what tips are you using???


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


elcomesoft said:


> It's funny how preferences differ between people. I much preferred listening to Daft Punk with the RE-ZERO's than I did with the Monster Turbines (in response to the bass). The highs were just so much more pleasing with the RE-ZERO's and they coped well with the speed.
> 
> What would be the logical, direct upgrade after the RE-ZERO? A similar sound signature with maybe a little more in the bass end, better speed/soundstage.


 
 I do like daft punk (and all other music) better with my primary earphones, which lean towards the analytical, but there are times when I'm tired or whatnot and I just don't care about anything but the beats. Doesn't happen too often.
   
  I think to upgrade from the RE-ZERO you'd have to stray a bit from that signature. The RE262 uses a highly capable driver that generally sounds cleaner than the RE-ZERO and delivers more bass and a wider stage. However, it also moves away from the analytical tendencies of the ZERO towards a warmer, more fluid signature.


----------



## Inks

Since we are on the topic, which BAs had great timbre in your experience? I would give it to the SM3 and runner-up HF5 in my limited BA experience. 
  Quote: *Joker*


> Thanks. And yes, timbre issues are more noticeable next to the FX700 but then I knew which earphones are slightly off beforehand thanks to knowing how most of my tracks sound with the K601.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> Since we are on the topic, which BAs had great timbre in your experience? I would give it to the SM3 and runner-up HF5 in my limited BA experience.


 
   
  IMO the SM3 doesn't have the treble energy to properly render the timbre of cymbals, electric guitars, horns, brass, etc.  Apart from the 30hz roll-off on the DBA it portrays timbre in the rest of the spectrum more accurately and naturally to my ears.  My ES5 just arrived today as well...


----------



## Inks

yeah, i'll agree with the above, instruments that need that decay past 3k aren't what the SM3 does great . Timbre is really instrument specific and the SM3 doesn't do well on those. I personally think it does well on pianos, cello, bass, bass drums, toms, etc. I wouldn't say the timbre is overall great compared to dynamics, but it's good considering the BAs I've heard. I have two twfk based BAs on the way and will be interested in how those hold-up.


----------



## Niyologist

Have you guys ever thought of using the Meelectronics M6 Triple Flange Eartips for the Sennheiser IE8? They both have the same nozzle tip size (5.5mm).


----------



## jwcdis

Can anyone recommend me anything similar to the Eterna's v1?
 I like the sound signature but the large housing is an annoyance to my ear.


----------



## Pedro H.

I was thinking about spending about $120 on an IEM, but it seems that a cheaper one like the SW-Xcape or the RE0 are better options... Am i right?


----------



## Szadzik

After trying AT CK10s and deciding I did not want IEMs I am still tempted to try them some more. I changed my objectives in this case completely though. I have a pair of Beyerdynamic T5ps and Sennheiser MX980s and now am looking to buy some IEMs that would be completely different from the two I already have.
   
  I had AT ESW9s some time ago and I loved the warmness, lushness they gave. The tubey sound that made you forget about everything and just listen to music for indefinite amounts of time with no fatigue would be what I am looking for. A bit more detail and transparency that ESW9s lacked would be very welcome too.
   
  I will be using them mainly on planes and not on the move. They do not have to be top tier or anything, I just need something relaxing and helping me fall asleep  but since I like premium built quality a higher price tag will not be an issue if it also brings accessories or built quality in.
   
  I live in Europe and thus it would be good if I did not have to import them from the US, but if it is needed I will do it.
   
  I currently use Sony X Series with mp3s of high bitrate and also have a Meier Stepdance portable amp and have an iBasso D6 on order so driving the IEMs will not be a problem.
   
  Does what I am looking for even exist? 
   
  I read a few threads as well as the reviews in this thread and thought about:
  Monster MDs;
  Panasonic RP-HJE900;
  Brainwavz M3,
  Thinksound TS02
   
  Some also suggested Denon C751, but I have not been able to confirm if these would fit the requirements.
   
   
  What woud you recommend? My budget is totally open and if I find the right phones I can pay for them.


----------



## james444

^ For tubey sound, relaxing and non-fatiguing listening, yet at the same time great detail and transparency, look no further than the Ortofon e-Q7. You can get them in Europe from iheadphones.uk.


----------



## Anaxilus

^ Warm, non fatiguing and isolation are not strengths of the HJE900.  I have used MDs on airplanes a lot so far.  Isolate pretty well and provide alot of what you want.  Your needs are some of the reasons I've kept my MDs.  They should mate well w/ the Stepdance too.  I've fallen asleep w/ them a few times as I have my DBAs and ES5s.  Obviously you've read a lot about them in their thread already so you know the up and downsides.  Haven't heard the ESW9 so can't comment on that.  If you want a similar sound sig but w/ a more technically proficient type of BA version the SM3 is that to the MD IMO.  The MDs Achilles heel is speedy and complex passages and timbre accuracy in the upper treble but that's the warmth and smoothness.  The SM3 has its own properties you may or may not like as well.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Joker, any thoughts on the A151 vs. the RE0/Xcape? Just wondering, since they seem to be in the same price range and all score pretty highly...


----------



## Szadzik

Quote: 





james444 said:


> ^ For tubey sound, relaxing and non-fatiguing listening, yet at the same time great detail and transparency, look no further than the Ortofon e-Q7. You can get them in Europe from iheadphones.uk.


 


  I read up on them and they seem to have a bit dry midrange and some other things that are not to my liking. 


  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> ^ Warm, non fatiguing and isolation are not strengths of the HJE900.  I have used MDs on airplanes a lot so far.  Isolate pretty well and provide alot of what you want.  Your needs are some of the reasons I've kept my MDs.  They should mate well w/ the Stepdance too.  I've fallen asleep w/ them a few times as I have my DBAs and ES5s.  Obviously you've read a lot about them in their thread already so you know the up and downsides.  Haven't heard the ESW9 so can't comment on that.  If you want a similar sound sig but w/ a more technically proficient type of BA version the SM3 is that to the MD IMO.  The MDs Achilles heel is speedy and complex passages and timbre accuracy in the upper treble but that's the warmth and smoothness.  The SM3 has its own properties you may or may not like as well.


 


  Deleted HJE900 from my list and moved Monster MD up.
   
  Here is what I have:
   
  Monster MD
  Brainwavz M3 - cheap and no loss if I do not like them.
  Thinksound TS02 - the same as with BM3.
  C751 - I have to read a bit more about them.
  PL50?
   
  I am leaning towards BM3s because on one side they are cheap and give good value for money. They do not have the overpowerig bass quality that MDM have.
   
  Looking at my choices from the perspective of how little use they will be getting, I carry y T5ps everywhere with me and will only use IEMs at times when I do not want to take T5ps out, I think it would be more reasonable to buy something less expensive.
   
  Can anyone tell me their opinions about the Brainwavz M3s?


----------



## 99tollap

Looking forward to a review of the superfi 5 pro...


----------



## Szadzik

I will buy Brainwavz M3s today and see how I like them. I will see how this level of equipment compares to my current rig and if I like them or not. If I do not I will simply give them as a present to someone and buy something else, or keep them and just use them for benchmarking other stuff.
   
  Now I just have to find a source to buy these as they seem to not be readily available everywhere, or buy them used from this forum.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> yeah, i'll agree with the above, instruments that need that decay past 3k aren't what the SM3 does great . Timbre is really instrument specific and the SM3 doesn't do well on those. I personally think it does well on pianos, cello, bass, bass drums, toms, etc. I wouldn't say the timbre is overall great compared to dynamics, but it's good considering the BAs I've heard. I have two twfk based BAs on the way and will be interested in how those hold-up.


 

 I'll agree with that. The SM3 does't have enough treble energy for me but it does have good timbre with instruments that don't require it, at least for a BA. 
   
  Two twfks? q-JAYS and what else?
   
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Have you guys ever thought of using the Meelectronics M6 Triple Flange Eartips for the Sennheiser IE8? They both have the same nozzle tip size (5.5mm).


 

 Using the IE8 with long and highly flexible tips doesn't seem like it would yield great results but you're welcome to try it. You would have to have fairly narrow ear canals to get a consistent seal.


  Quote: 





jwcdis said:


> Can anyone recommend me anything similar to the Eterna's v1?
> I like the sound signature but the large housing is an annoyance to my ear.


 

 If you can find Futuresonics Atrios in your price range, they may suit your ears better - the fitting system is more similar to Phonak's in that the housing is not really meant to touch your ears. Bonus points for sticking Shure Olives on them if you don't like multi-flange silicone tips.
   

  Quote: 





pedro h. said:


> I was thinking about spending about $120 on an IEM, but it seems that a cheaper one like the SW-Xcape or the RE0 are better options... Am i right?


 


  Assuming that the signatures of the RE0 and Xcape are to your liking - yes - but taste can swing the scale both ways. 




  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Joker, any thoughts on the A151 vs. the RE0/Xcape? Just wondering, since they seem to be in the same price range and all score pretty highly...


 

 Not sure what I can add to the reviews - the A151 generally wins out in usability (though less  so over the Xcape)  but doesn't really
   have the crispness or treble energy to compete with either of the dynamics. It's a good earphone for an inoffensive sound but it's not quite 'hi-fi' in my book, much like the PL50 or Westone 1.


  Quote: 





szadzik said:


> Here is what I have:
> 
> Monster MD
> Brainwavz M3 - cheap and no loss if I do not like them.
> ...


 

 Any reason you excluded the RE262? On the higher end of things they are probably the first earphone I think of when 'warm and relaxing' comes up. On the budget end of things, I can make things harder for you by adding the Xears TD-III. Not the greatest build quality but then they are cheaper than everything else you're considering except maybe the PL50s. No review of them in this thread yet but I did write something up here. 
   
  And of course from your list I'd pick the MDs assuming you don't find copious bass antithetical to your relaxation needs.


----------



## Szadzik

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Any reason you excluded the RE262? On the higher end of things they are probably the first earphone I think of when 'warm and relaxing' comes up. On the budget end of things, I can make things harder for you by adding the Xears TD-III. Not the greatest build quality but then they are cheaper than everything else you're considering except maybe the PL50s. No review of them in this thread yet but I did write something up here.
> And of course from your list I'd pick the MDs assuming you don't find copious bass antithetical to your relaxation needs.


 


  I am looking into RE262 and what I think I will do will be getting both RE262 and BM3 and seeing if I like any of them. Later I will try to pick up a pair of used MDs, they are incredibly expensive in the EU and much cheaper in FS forum.


----------



## inteificio

Thanks for all the info.
   
  I bought a set of ecci 100s a few months ago and have never liked portable headphones so much.
   
  Due to a bit of incompetence I now need a new set.
   
  As mostly use these phones for either listening to podcasts or for dance music while running I am going for either the Visang RO2 or the MEElectronics M6.
   
  You mentioned that the M6 was the ultimate cheapy for dance, but I can get the RO2 at the same price which gets a higher sound score.
   
  Any specific advice?
   
  Thanks
   
  P


----------



## joekool

Hi guys, in the table the monster turbine pro copper is listed as having an inline or optional mic for mobile phones.. I check the monster website and didn't see anything, am I missing something??


----------



## xtasi

Hey joker, how does the KC3 compare to the 1964-T?  I'm really a fan of the KC3's sound sig and I was wondering if I should maybe go for a reshell or a new custom.  I'm most specifically looking at the quantity of bass between the two.  From what I've read it looks like they have about the same?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





joekool said:


> Hi guys, in the table the monster turbine pro copper is listed as having an inline or optional mic for mobile phones.. I check the monster website and didn't see anything, am I missing something??


 

 Regular Coppers don't.  You have to buy a 'control-talk' version.  Make sure your device is supported.


----------



## swbf2cheater

Would the Phiaton PS200 be the wisest choice for me if I wanted an IEM with the largest possible soundstage for a $200 Budget?
  I researched a little on iems with large stage size and the phiaton came up a few times.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inteificio said:


> I bought a set of ecci 100s a few months ago and have never liked portable headphones so much.
> 
> Due to a bit of incompetence I now need a new set.
> 
> ...


 

 I think the R02 is better overall in terms of sound quality - I just quite like the build and comfort of the M6. However, assuming you liked the fit of the PR100, the R02 won't be a problem for you. While I think the M6 has a good signature for dance, the R02 will be an easier switch from the more accurate PR100.


  Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Hey joker, how does the KC3 compare to the 1964-T?  I'm really a fan of the KC3's sound sig and I was wondering if I should maybe go for a reshell or a new custom.  I'm most specifically looking at the quantity of bass between the two.  From what I've read it looks like they have about the same?


 

 I think if I had to pick a universal closest in signature to the 1964-T, the KC3 would be it but I do feel that the 1964-T has a bit more mid-bass (more TF10 level than KC3). Not a night-and-day difference.


  Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> Would the Phiaton PS200 be the wisest choice for me if I wanted an IEM with the largest possible soundstage for a $200 Budget?
> I researched a little on iems with large stage size and the phiaton came up a few times.


 

 In my experience yes, especially with the prices I've been seeing lately. Relatively close competitors like the RE262 and W2 would cost you more.


----------



## swbf2cheater

thanks!


----------



## xtasi

Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> thanks!


 


  x2


----------



## GalmArn

First, thank you ljokerl for all your impressive work.

 I started to search for IEM in September, found your topic, and since I bought a IM-590 and recently a Xears TDIII and I never was disappointed. Your descriptions are top notch and well documented (even if for the Xears TDIII you still didn't add the info to the main post).
   
   
  About the TDIII, I read that you were complaining about the difficulty to insert correctly the tips in the ears in order to get a proper sound. I have a big issue to get a perfect sound with my left ear, causing a bad balance. Most of the time I lack of bass.
  I wanted to know if you have a good recommendation for the tips ? I was searching for Sennheiser bi-flange ones, but they are sold only by pack of 5 pars of the same size, at a expensive price. MEElectronics M11 Eartips seem to be a good deal and are easy to find, but are they a good alternative ? (and if anybody can tell me of M11 & M11+ share the same nozzle size).
   
  Thank you.


----------



## FlySweep

[size=medium]joker.. how does the PS200 stack up against the DBA ?  Both are in the same price range and are dual balanced armatures.. I get the feeling the PS200 might be a slightly less refined version of the DBA (PS200 reports of slight sibilance, etc.)?  Is it as musical and engaging as the DBA?  I'm curious as to how the bass quality/quantity also compares.. Considering the PS200 might be a little easier to get for many people than the perpetually out-of-stock DBA (as well as the DBA being quite fit-dependent to get the best sound), is it a viable alternative for around same price?
   
  Thanks for all you do here, it's very much appreciated..​[/size]


----------



## jjmai

Quote: 





galmarn said:


> First, thank you ljokerl for all your impressive work.
> 
> I started to search for IEM in September, found your topic, and since I bought a IM-590 and recently a Xears TDIII and I never was disappointed. Your descriptions are top notch and well documented (even if for the Xears TDIII you still didn't add the info to the main post).
> 
> ...


 

 If Xears TDIII is indeed the same nozzle size as Turbine, then you can try Comply T400 or Sony hybrids (EPEX10A).  These are the most recommended tips for better seal.
  Some also use Shure olive (PA910 S/M/L), but it's for smaller nozzles, so have to be decored to fit on bigger ones, and may run the risk of falling off the nozzle and stuck in your ear.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





galmarn said:


> First, thank you ljokerl for all your impressive work.
> 
> I started to search for IEM in September, found your topic, and since I bought a IM-590 and recently a Xears TDIII and I never was disappointed. Your descriptions are top notch and well documented (even if for the Xears TDIII you still didn't add the info to the main post).
> 
> ...


 


  Thanks, I'm glad the thread has been useful.
   
  Have you tried the bi-flange tips included with the TD-III? If you're having trouble with those, I'm not sure Sennheiser bi-flanges are a solution. But yes, the Meelec tips will fit. M11 and M11+ use the same housings so the do share the same nozzle size. However, the M11+ fit kit is much more extensive (albeit more expensive) than the M11 kit.
   
   

  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> [size=medium]joker.. how does the PS200 stack up against the DBA ?  Both are in the same price range and are dual balanced armatures.. I get the feeling the PS200 might be a slightly less refined version of the DBA (PS200 reports of slight sibilance, etc.)?  Is it as musical and engaging as the DBA?  I'm curious as to how the bass quality/quantity also compares.. Considering the PS200 might be a little easier to get for many people than the perpetually out-of-stock DBA (as well as the DBA being quite fit-dependent to get the best sound), is it a viable alternative for around same price?
> 
> Thanks for all you do here, it's very much appreciated..​[/size]


 
  There's a review of the PS200 on the front page. Not sure what I can add to that and the score it was given. Yes, the PS200 is easier to find. It may even be better-built and more isolating. But there's no way everyone who likes the DBA-02 will like the PS200 - it's a very specific sonic flavor.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It may even be better-built and more isolating.


 

 Ahem.  I have been meaning to say that I think the DBA got short changed on isolation and especially build quality IMO.  The build is actually better than some of those ahead of it despite appearances.  In feel and actual reports of user failure the DBA has been better than a good number of higher ranked IEMs in that regard.  My 2 cents.


----------



## xbr50

FANTASTIC thread, I have learned so much about the IEM's out there. I was just wondering if you have any plans on reviewing Shure products? More specifically the Se215 that were just released, it would be interesting to see how they fair against the competition!


----------



## Szadzik

Paid for Brainwavz M3 today. Hoping to get them in a few weeks.


----------



## swbf2cheater

I'm really not sure if I should try the Phiaton PS210 first, $140 for the ps200 is a bit pricey for me.  If i got that, there would be no reason for my to keep my ESW9, that is if it were just as good or better.
   
  meh, choices


----------



## robjrock

Hey y'all,
   
  So this is the last lame 'can you compare these earphones' post I will ever write.
   
  I'm about to pull the trigger on the Meelec M9s - but I'm just wondering if any of the new Meelec earphones (such as M16, M21) offer a very similar sound? I just think the M16 for instance looks much sexier. Essentially I want the M9 sound in a better looking shell! Or should I just stop being so silly and order the M9? I personally enjoy the enhanced bass and treble. I find the Brainwavz M2 too dark and boring! 
   





   
  Thanks!


----------



## DervishD

Quote: 





robjrock said:


> Hey y'all,
> 
> So this is the last lame 'can you compare these earphones' post I will ever write.
> 
> ...


 

  
  The M21 are IMHO superior to the M9, while still being the "M-series" (V-shaped, plenty of basses). In my opinion the M21 are worth the extra money, but that decision is up to you


----------



## GalmArn

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> If Xears TDIII is indeed the same nozzle size as Turbine, then you can try Comply T400 or Sony hybrids (EPEX10A).  These are the most recommended tips for better seal.
> Some also use Shure olive (PA910 S/M/L), but it's for smaller nozzles, so have to be decored to fit on bigger ones, and may run the risk of falling off the nozzle and stuck in your ear.


 
   
  I am not really attracted by foam tips, but Sony hybrids could be an interesting alternative, I read a lot about them on Head-Fi.
  I was looking more for double flange ones, but if I have the opportunity I will buy them at decent price.

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, I'm glad the thread has been useful.
> 
> Have you tried the bi-flange tips included with the TD-III? If you're having trouble with those, I'm not sure Sennheiser bi-flanges are a solution. But yes, the Meelec tips will fit. M11 and M11+ use the same housings so the do share the same nozzle size. However, the M11+ fit kit is much more extensive (albeit more expensive) than the M11 kit.


 

  
  Yes, I am currently using the stock bi-flanges, I am much more satisfied using these than the stock single-flange.
  I think that larger bi-flange would make easier for me to have a perfect seal in my left ear. Meelec tips have all kind of size for the bi-flange, so if they are decent i will order a kit.
   
   
  And yes your thread is useful... but dangerous for my wallet too, I am already thinking of buying DBA-02 in the incoming months.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
   
  Thanks to both of you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xbr50 said:


> FANTASTIC thread, I have learned so much about the IEM's out there. I was just wondering if you have any plans on reviewing Shure products? More specifically the Se215 that were just released, it would be interesting to see how they fair against the competition!


 

 There are no plans to review any Shure products. None of the previous-gen models (except the SE530, which I've not tried) managed to impress me. Glowing reviews and ridiculous claims made by a Shure retailer do not impress me either; actually, they make me less interested in the product.


  Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> I'm really not sure if I should try the Phiaton PS210 first, $140 for the ps200 is a bit pricey for me.  If i got that, there would be no reason for my to keep my ESW9, that is if it were just as good or better.
> 
> meh, choices


 

 The PS210 and PS200 aren't very much alike. One is a huge dynamic-driver and the other is a dual armature setup, probably a TWFK. Phiaton does tend to have a more spacious sound across their in-ear range but other than that there's not much of a common 'signature'.


  Quote: 





robjrock said:


> I'm about to pull the trigger on the Meelec M9s - but I'm just wondering if any of the new Meelec earphones (such as M16, M21) offer a very similar sound? I just think the M16 for instance looks much sexier. Essentially I want the M9 sound in a better looking shell! Or should I just stop being so silly and order the M9? I personally enjoy the enhanced bass and treble. I find the Brainwavz M2 too dark and boring!


 


  The M6 is still the most similar earphone to the M9 for me. The M16 has more treble and slightly less bass, the M21 has more midrange and slightly less bass, and the M31 - more bass.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There are no plans to review any Shure products.
> 
> 
> The M6 is still the most similar earphone to the M9 for me. The M16 has more treble and slightly less bass, the M21 has more midrange and slightly less bass, and the M31 - more bass.


 
   
   I see an SE215 in your future.
   
   
  Come to think of it, Mee offers something for everyone in the M series alone. For budget phones that is.


----------



## swbf2cheater

You should know me by now, I'm in it for the experience heh, I'd still like to try the cheaper phiaton first   Im sure both are just fantastic


----------



## robjrock

Quote: 





dervishd said:


> The M21 are IMHO superior to the M9, while still being the "M-series" (V-shaped, plenty of basses). In my opinion the M21 are worth the extra money, but that decision is up to you


 

 Thanks (and thanks to Joker too) - I might give the M21s a go as they look super schmick.


----------



## extinguish

Thank you for your effort, Joker. I noticed that you own a TF10 and mentioned it a lot in your reviews. Is there a reason why you don't give it a review? I'm just curious how would you score it compared to all 150 IEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





extinguish said:


> Thank you for your effort, Joker. I noticed that you own a TF10 and mentioned it a lot in your reviews. Is there a reason why you don't give it a review? I'm just curious how would you score it compared to all 150 IEMs.


 

 It's on the to-do list (see post #8, below the table), I've simply been putting it off because there is plenty of info on it already and because I just plain don't like the fit. Can't avoid it forever so I'll definitely get around to it.


----------



## HeatFan12

Amazing thread |joker|.  Thanks for all your hard work and effort.  I gave up on iems a couple of years ago when I purchased the UE Super.fi5 because of the fit and they were very uncomfortable.  I use the v-moda bass freqs for the gym and that's about it for my iems.  After reading your reviews I decided to give them a try again and ordered the Monster Turbines and am loving the sound, fit, seal, everything basically.  I have come to the conclusion that I like the straight down cable vs over the ear.
  I was looking at the NuForce NE-700X to have an extra pair basically close to the same tier and maybe compliment the Turbines and vice versa.  Thoughts? or another selection.  
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Had a bit of spare time yesterday and decided to crunch some numbers. Came up with some fun statistics that illustrate diminishing returns - the average jump in SQ between price tiers drops by about half above $100 while the overall rating makes the biggest gains when moving from the penny-pincher category up and then again when moving into the $150-250 range.

($0-15)
 Average Sound Score: *3.3*   Best: *5.5* (JVC HA-FXC50)            Worst:* 0.5* (_AudioSource IEBAS_)
 Average Overall Score: *4.4*   Best: *5.55 *(EarsQuake SHA)        Worst: *2.2* (_AudioSource IEBAS_)

($15-30)
 Average Sound Score:* 4.9*   Best: *6.4 *(Xears Bullet XB120Pro)  Worst: *4* (_Skullcandy TiTan / Koss KE29_)
 Average Overall Score: *5.9 *  Best:* 6.75* (ECCI PR100)              Worst: *4.7* (_Sennheiser CX300_)

($30-60)
 Average Sound Score: *5.9*   Best: *7.5* (_Xears TD100_)               Worst: *3.5* (_Skullcandy FMJ_)
 Average Overall Score: *6.5*   Best: *7.75* (_Soundmagic PL50_)     Worst: *4.65* (_Skullcandy FMJ_)

($60-100)
 Average Sound Score: *7.0*   Best: *8.8* (_Klipsch Custom 3_)        Worst: *4* (_JAYS j-JAYS_)
 Average Overall Score: *7.1*   Best: *8.4* (_Sunrise Xcape_)            Worst: *5.85 *(_UE MetroFi 220_)
   
($100-150)
  Average Sound Score: *7.5*   Best: *8.7* (_Phonak PFE_)               Worst: *6.3* (_Monster Beats by Dre Tour / Digital Designs DD-DXB01_)
 Average Overall Score: *7.6*   Best: *8.5* (_Westone 1_)                  Worst: *5.25* (_Digital Designs DD-DXB01_)

($150-250)
 Average Sound Score: *9.1*   Best: *9.5* (_Fischer Audio DBA-02_)  Worst: *8.1* (_FutureSonics Atrio M8 (v2)_)
 Average Overall Score: *8.5*   Best: *9.2* (_Westone 2_)                  Worst: *7.55* (_Radius DDM_)

($250+)
 Average Sound Score: *9.5*   Best: *10* (_1964EARS 1964-T_)        Worst: *9.1* (_Monster Turbine Pro Copper_)
 Average Overall Score: *8.9*   Best: *9.8* (_1964EARS 1964-T_)       Worst:* 8.5* (_Ortofon e-Q7_)

  
  Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> Amazing thread |joker|.  Thanks for all your hard work and effort.  I gave up on iems a couple of years ago when I purchased the UE Super.fi5 because of the fit and they were very uncomfortable.  I use the v-moda bass freqs for the gym and that's about it for my iems.  After reading your reviews I decided to give them a try again and ordered the Monster Turbines and am loving the sound, fit, seal, everything basically.  I have come to the conclusion that I like the straight down cable vs over the ear.
> I was looking at the NuForce NE-700X to have an extra pair basically close to the same tier and maybe compliment the Turbines and vice versa.  Thoughts? or another selection.


 

 I don't know if I'd recommend the NE-700X as a compliment to the Turbines. The fit is not as friendly and the sound is not all that different. Have you considered the Xears TD-III? Same price range as the Nuforces but quite similar in shape to the Turbines - you shouldn't have any fit problems with them. The sound is a bit different, too - more spacious and fluid but still with a good bass kick.


----------



## Inks

Nice list, though the C3 should be updated in it's pricing (getting it <100$ is hard nowadays). Xears is doing well in the budget region while Skullcandy is doing the opposite lol.


----------



## Anaxilus

Nice table Joker.  I don't think I'm ever selling my Xcape v.1.  I'll have to hear an Xears product someday.


----------



## ljokerl

You are right, a lot of the pricing needs to be updated, which I am a bit hesitant to do as it will require me to move things between the tiers, messing up the order. I don't think the ATH-CK10 can be had below $260 anymore and the HJE900 supposedly isn't available below $250 (even though froogle still says $130).
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Nice list, though the C3 should be updated in it's pricing (getting it <100$ is hard nowadays). Xears is doing well in the budget region while Skullcandy is doing the opposite lol.


----------



## ljokerl

Double post


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





> I don't know if I'd recommend the NE-700X as a compliment to the Turbines. The fit is not as friendly and the sound is not all that different. Have you considered the Xears TD-III? Same price range as the Nuforces but quite similar in shape to the Turbines - you shouldn't have any fit problems with them. The sound is a bit different, too - more spacious and fluid but still with a good bass kick.


 
   
  Thanks very much joker.  I believe the Xears TD-III is exactly what I'm looking for.  Just caught your "got wood"? woodie reviews and after your suggestion and reading your impressions there was no need to wait.  I ordered the Xears....I purchased them for $66 shipped.  Is that the going rate nowadays?
   
  Thanks again and I'll post a few thoughts upon arrival...


----------



## DervishD

Interesting demonstration of the law of diminishing returns. Fits more or less what I think, that there is no big point in spending very big bucks in phones for having more than reasonable quality.
   
  Of course, we are not very reasonable at all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










 and want the best of the absolute best if we can afford it!
   
  To be sincere, and taking into account my reduced experience with expensive (let's say, more than 150USD) models, I've noticed the biggest jump in sound quality in phones which are between 50 and 90USD, coming from phones of about 40USD max. Above that 90USD I haven't yet found a model which I think is worth the extra money, and no giant killer below 40USD, either.
   
  I still think that the best ratio of sound quality vs. cost belongs to the Meelec M9. I yet have to find a cheaper phone with such audio quality. This said, my current favourite is a model which retails for 80USD, so I have to recognize that quality has its price.
   
  Again, thanks for the number crunching  Do you have spare time to actually listen to and enjoy music? It's incredible the amount of time you put in this forum, and it's impossible to thank properly


----------



## martinqiao7

joker, the sound score for CK-100 was 9.75 on the review, but 9.6/10 in the summary table, u might want to adjust it.....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  and thank you for this incredible review, i have just order my ck-100 and its on the way.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> Thanks very much joker.  I believe the Xears TD-III is exactly what I'm looking for.  Just caught your "got wood"? woodie reviews and after your suggestion and reading your impressions there was no need to wait.  I ordered the Xears....I purchased them for $66 shipped.  Is that the going rate nowadays?


 

 Should be around 40EUR + shipping. $66 sounds about right.


  Quote: 





dervishd said:


> Again, thanks for the number crunching  Do you have spare time to actually listen to and enjoy music? It's incredible the amount of time you put in this forum, and it's impossible to thank properly


 

 Oh yes, luckily I have more than just entry-level sets in review most of the time. The higher-end review sets are what I end up listening to at my leisure (currently that would be the W4). Part of the reason high-end IEMs take me so much longer to review is that I have to force myself to go and do some testing and writing instead of just throwing on an album and listening.

  
  Quote: 





martinqiao7 said:


> joker, the sound score for CK-100 was 9.75 on the review, but 9.6/10 in the summary table, u might want to adjust it.....
> 
> and thank you for this incredible review, i have just order my ck-100 and its on the way.


 

 Thanks, fixed. Hope you like the CK100


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Oh yes, luckily I have more than just entry-level sets in review most of the time. The higher-end review sets are what I end up listening to at my leisure (currently that would be the W4).* Part of the reason high-end IEMs take me so much longer to review is that I have to force myself to go and do some testing and writing instead of just throwing on an album and listening.*


 
   
  That is pretty much why it takes me so long as well although there are some rare reviews where the writing part just comes easily (1964-T review). I'd rather listen than test


----------



## Shufny

Wainting for your thoughts on the Xcape v2. I got mine yesterday and they sound how you described the v1. Maybe the bass is slightly elevated, which pushes the midrange further back, but I love the extension. I don't mind a bit more low-end anyway, because buses tend to suppress them. Loving the fit, and less microphonics compared to the Brainwavz phones too.

 I still think you should find some time to ask Thomas for an XR 120 Pro II for a review. They are really cheap, and the Xcape owners here think it's pretty close to it in terms of clarity (or even better). Overall they should be really energetic, probably due to a treble spike around 7-8kHz, and the pretty balanced lows. Personally I've yet to hear it, but I'll get a loan pair probably next week. Of course I can write some personal updates, if you will.

 On an other note: Are you intrested in the Superlux HD 381 ? I don't know how much it costs to send an IEM to you from here (hungary), but if it's not the price of the phones (~$30) it maybe worth it. We have a spare 651 too, but I think it doesn't worth your time.

 I'm glad that even you guys "suffering" from this. I many times find myself just listening to the music when "testing" phones, and having to rewind, because I have no idea how something I was looking for sounded.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shufny said:


> I still think you should find some time to ask Thomas for an XR 120 Pro II for a review. They are really cheap, and the Xcape owners here think it's pretty close to it in terms of clarity (or even better). Overall they should be really energetic, probably due to a treble spike around 7-8kHz, and the pretty balanced lows. Personally I've yet to hear it, but I'll get a loan pair probably next week. Of course I can write some personal updates, if you will.
> 
> On an other note: Are you intrested in the Superlux HD 381 ? I don't know how much it costs to send an IEM to you from here (hungary), but if it's not the price of the phones (~$30) it maybe worth it. We have a spare 651 too, but I think it doesn't worth your time.


 


  Alright, I'll see what Thomas says after I get the TD-III writeup up in this thread. I've heard of the Superlux but know nothing about it. I doubt shipping will cost more than $10 but if you have contact info for Superlux I can give them a shout myself and see what they say.


----------



## Raguvian

I bought the M31's and found them to be incredibly fun to listen to. Then again, I found the M6 to be lacking in bass. The M31's are also a lot more comfortable and better isolating to me, as well. They also have a nice, weighty feel, whereas the M6 feels cheap. Plus the black finish on my M6's is peeling off already.
   
  Great reviews as always! Looking forward to reading more of them.


----------



## Inks

M6 lacking bass? lol....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> M6 lacking bass? lol....


 


  The M31 can make a bass drum seem lacking in bass... The next step up from that is strapping two woofers to your head.


----------



## Raguvian

Quote: 





inks said:


> M6 lacking bass? lol....


 


  Considering I find the M31's to have an appropriate amount of bass, yes.


----------



## jjmai

Quote: 





inks said:


> M6 lacking bass? lol....


 


  m6 sounds tinny when compared with m31's bass.  m31's sound is much more mainstream, with lots of bass quantity. at slightly higher volume, the bass beats in songs stand out from the rest sound spectrum a lot.


----------



## Anaxilus

The black finish on the M6 comes off?  I thought that was black plastic.....


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





inks said:


> M6 lacking bass? lol....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> The black finish on the M6 comes off?  I thought that was black plastic.....


 
  
  Same here. I've had a black one, red one, and still have my clear. Don't think there was anything coming off on my black/red ones.


----------



## Raguvian

Sorry for the bad quality but that grayish splotch over there seems to be a chip of some sort... It's not a big deal obviously but I also thought it was just black plastic but it's some sort of weird coating.


----------



## Intervention

can i just ask wether the westone 3 has more bass impact than the m6?
  (for reference purposes)
  Also amazing work on the thread Joker, its been a massive help, thanks.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





raguvian said:


> Sorry for the bad quality but that grayish splotch over there seems to be a chip of some sort... It's not a big deal obviously but I also thought it was just black plastic but it's some sort of weird coating.


 

 Oh, you chipped it.  That's different than a finish flaking off.  That's what it should look like.  It's not going to have a glossy enamel look inside of any plastic.


----------



## Inks

lol ain't that the truth....


----------



## ljokerl

Added Xears TD-III and Woodees Blues


----------



## rawrster

This thread continues to get better and better  It looks like I'll have to try out some more Xears in the future.


----------



## NightRyder

hey im not sure if anyone has commented on this yet but the re262 are 150$ now at head-direct, is this a really good buy now?


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





nightryder said:


> hey im not sure if anyone has commented on this yet but the re262 are 150$ now at head-direct, is this a really good buy now?


 


  Yes. yes. A thousand times yes.


----------



## rawrster

but only if you like the signature of it  A great buy if you do


----------



## NightRyder

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> but only if you like the signature of it  A great buy if you do


 


  signature? haha whhhhat?


----------



## EraserXIV

sound signature, take a look at this: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/541204/concise-multi-iem-comparison-phiaton-ps20-added-mar-12-2011


----------



## hgabi00

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Xears TD-III and Woodees Blues


 


  
  Nice Review!
   
  I think you should try out the Xears XR120PRO II. It's actually the best sounding Xears, it"s more balanced, and has more [size=11pt]details[/size] than the TD-III.


----------



## potatoos

Can anyone tell me the differences between the re0 and the audeo 012?
  Ive heard that the audeos are a better buy


----------



## carfentanil

From comments and discussions I've seen around, Sony MDR EX1000 flagship merits addition...


----------



## Ikarios

Joker, I'd like to thank you again for your superhuman efforts in compiling this list. Every time I come across another IEM I default to your description of it to see what the general sound signature is, and if I would like it or not. This time I picked up an RE262 at the NYC Meet after reading your review, and again, it was spot-on. Comping from a Sunrise Xcape V1, the RE262 is almost better across the board in detail (for mids and lows, not highs), soundstage, comfort, "fun" factor and smoothness. I can wear the RE262s in either straight down or over ear configurations when I use the Phonak Audeo silicone ear guides (which are awesome, by the way, and totally worth the $12 I paid for three sets). I've been using them for the past two hours and I don't feel any discomfort at all using the small stock tips, which is incredibly rare - I haven't come across an IEM this comfortable since... ever.
   
  The only real complaint I have with the RE262 is that they are a somewhat mid-forward headphone, which means the treble is a little too smooth and laid back. If I could keep everything about the RE262's bass and mid quality and could just push down the mids a little bit and the highs up a little bit, I would be extremely content. Right now I'm leaning towards balanced armature headphones, since dynamics don't seem to have the stuff I'm looking for. Current candidates are the DBA-02, CK10, and then the 1964 Ears Custom. First and foremost the most important quality in considering an upgrade from the RE262 is comfort - I don't care if something sounds better if I can't wear it for more than an hour or two at a time. Next up would be treble quality - I like the airyness and detail of the Sunrise and the RE0 but don't want to give up bass or mids too much in favor of the treble. I also can't stand harshness or sibilance so there's a very thin margin for my ideal treble preferences. Is there anything else I should be looking at?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

I recently got a pair of A151s, and for the life of me I can't figure out how to get a good fit with the double- and triple-flange tips... is there some kind of trick that I need to get them to fit?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Joker, I'd like to thank you again for your superhuman efforts in compiling this list. Every time I come across another IEM I default to your description of it to see what the general sound signature is, and if I would like it or not. This time I picked up an RE262 at the NYC Meet after reading your review, and again, it was spot-on. Comping from a Sunrise Xcape V1, the RE262 is almost better across the board in detail (for mids and lows, not highs), soundstage, comfort, "fun" factor and smoothness. I can wear the RE262s in either straight down or over ear configurations when I use the Phonak Audeo silicone ear guides (which are awesome, by the way, and totally worth the $12 I paid for three sets). I've been using them for the past two hours and I don't feel any discomfort at all using the small stock tips, which is incredibly rare - I haven't come across an IEM this comfortable since... ever.
> 
> The only real complaint I have with the RE262 is that they are a somewhat mid-forward headphone, which means the treble is a little too smooth and laid back. If I could keep everything about the RE262's bass and mid quality and could just push down the mids a little bit and the highs up a little bit, I would be extremely content. Right now I'm leaning towards balanced armature headphones, since dynamics don't seem to have the stuff I'm looking for. Current candidates are the DBA-02, CK10, and then the 1964 Ears Custom. First and foremost the most important quality in considering an upgrade from the RE262 is comfort - I don't care if something sounds better if I can't wear it for more than an hour or two at a time. Next up would be treble quality - I like the airyness and detail of the Sunrise and the RE0 but don't want to give up bass or mids too much in favor of the treble. I also can't stand harshness or sibilance so there's a very thin margin for my ideal treble preferences. Is there anything else I should be looking at?


 

 Thanks, and glad you like the 262. It really is quite special.
   
  Now, I still think the DBA-02 is the best value for more analytical sound and if you can find one for a reasonable price I'd definitely start there. I would recommend the RE252 if you want to give dynamics another shot but unfortunately the fit can really be hit-or-miss with that. The Westone 4 is another interesting earphone with treble intensity I'd put about halfway between the DBA-02/CK10/etc and the RE262/Radius TWF21/etc. My review of it should be up reasonably soon unless other great earphones that require my immediate attention suddenly show up at my doorstep tomorrow (ahem... UM...).


  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> I recently got a pair of A151s, and for the life of me I can't figure out how to get a good fit with the double- and triple-flange tips... is there some kind of trick that I need to get them to fit?


 

 The same way as the single flanges. I prefer to wear them cable-down and I just barely get a seal with the trips. If you have slightly larger ear canals the triples probably won't seal but the bi-flanges should still work.


----------



## mvw2

Aflac, have you removed the foam in the nozzle yet?  I would advise doing that for a little more treble.  Outside of that, there isn't much else you're going to do with them outside of EQing if you have that.  I particularly like the treble on the RE262.  It has a lot of detail, is reasonably strong, and has this cool sweetness to it that's very likable, a sweetness that I haven't really heard outside of the Triple.Fi 10, although the presentation of sound is quite different between the two, even if we are only comparing the treble region.
   
  All I can really suggest is remove the foam.  Other than that, play with tips.  The stock tips are few, and I would suggest toying with other options.  Deeper insertion will knock down the mids some versus shallow.


----------



## Jongwee

hi ljokerl, I'm just wondering if the review for the EBs are almost done?  not trying to press you BTW


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jongwee said:


> hi ljokerl, I'm just wondering if the review for the EBs are almost done?  not trying to press you BTW


 


  Which EB? If you mean the Hippo 10, I haven't even started yet. If you mean the SuperFi5, all of the UE reviews are done except the TF10 and 700. I just have to finish the remaining two and get them all posted.


----------



## somspaple

[size=medium]hi friends,
   
  i am looking for a good set of IEM and zeroed in on DBA 02 (analytical, comparatively cold) and Triple fi 10 (comparatively warm) . i know both have different sound signature. i have been reading through many of the reviews too. i normally listen to techno and i currently use a Klipsch Image S4. i don't like harsh highs and hate even the hint of sibilance (and S4s does sound sibilant some times   ) . 
  so far i have not been able to audition either of the two (looks like it is not possible from here -'m from India) but reading about the sound signatures i feel Triple fi 10 is the one for me (i like slightly warmer sound and a wide soundstage) . now the reason for this post is just reconfirm my understanding and i don't wanted to start one more 'vs' thread (i hope joker doesn't mind hi-jacking his thread - and anyways he refuses to review the triple fi 10s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 ).
   
  and at last, can anybody confirm how good/authentic are the deals like below are? Triple fi 10 under 200$ sound inviting and one of my friend is returning from US next month. so 'm planning to get these through him. hoping to see some replies 
   
   
  http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-ULTIMATE-EARS-TRIPLE-Fi-10-PRO-EARPHONES-IPHONE-NIB-/360349141209?pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item53e67b88d9
   
   
  my current set-up :
  Cowon S9 (music in flac and mostly high bit rate mp3 -256 kbps+ as most of the techno available on net is)
   
  + Fiio E5 (this does make a difference in the o/p from S4s especially at volumes >20 on S9)
   
  + Klipsch Image S4​[/size]


----------



## mvw2

It is interesting that you are sensitive to strong highs but seek two earphones that have strong highs.  Both the DBA-02 and Triple.Fi 10 are both dominant and aggressive on the top end.  The DBA-02 sounds more balanced, but the Triple.Fi 10 is more hearty/smoother but more pronounced.  If you want something with a more pleasant top end, I might start leaning you towards other things.  You can still get a lot of the extension, air, and good detail but in a lighter, non-fatiguing presentation.  The RE262, e-Q7, SA6, IE8, SE530, and RE-ZERO are options that come quickly to mind in terms of products I've used.  I haven't personally used the e-Q5, but that's a slightly more affordable route versus the e-Q7.  These tend to offer good treble presence and extension but offer a softer, smoother, or laid back presentation in one way or another that makes them more pleasant.  I'm a huge fan of the Triple.Fi 10, but I also know it's a rather colored earphone.  On a budget and indicating to someone who may seek something well balanced, I will very readily lead that person to the RE-ZERO.  The $100 price tag is easy to swallow, and it does a lot of things right.
   
  In terms of Joker's reviews, pay attention to the sound descriptions and look for products that are describe as having a more mild, smoother, laid back top end.  If strong treble offends you, this is the kind of thing you're looking for.  Don't think this means you have to get an earphone with complete lack of treble.  Rather, you just want to seek things that offer a more mild-mannered presentation rather than something hot, aggressive, forward, or peaky.


----------



## rawrster

Mike, I look forward to your thoughts on the W4. I like them so far but haven't put much time on them yet. Also  you could just listen to the UM and finish/edit or whatever else you need to do for the W4 review 
   
  I guess with all these reviews you do that backlog you have will only get longer as the days go by


----------



## Ikarios

I'm considering sending the iM716 to joker if they don't sell anytime soon, but I figure he has a large enough backlog that he doesn't need any extra help


----------



## rawrster

I think it was mentioned in the previous thread about the im716 but it is discontinued so not sure how much he would want to review something no one can get


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Monster Jamz & PADACS Aksent. The latter is quite interesting being a bass-heavy iPhone headset with an analogue volume control.
    
   
  Quote:


somspaple said:


> [size=medium]and at last, can anybody confirm how good/authentic are the deals like below are? Triple fi 10 under 200$ sound inviting and one of my friend is returning from US next month. so 'm planning to get these through him. hoping to see some replies ​[/size]


 

 Very legit- the price of the TF10 in the US has plummeted in the last two years. However, I would heed mvw2's advice - the DBA-02 (and, to a lesser extent, the TF10) are not exactly treble-light. I don't think the top end of the TF10 is very edgy but it's definitely exciting. I am, however, fully aware of the TF10's excellent reputation in India and at the current prices the praise is quite well-deserved.


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Mike, I look forward to your thoughts on the W4. I like them so far but haven't put much time on them yet. Also  you could just listen to the UM and finish/edit or whatever else you need to do for the W4 review
> 
> I guess with all these reviews you do that backlog you have will only get longer as the days go by


 

 I was hoping to catch a break but that's not looking likely in the near future. I can't believe how quickly new gear pops up on the horizon.


----------



## somspaple

Quote: 





mvw2 said:


> It is interesting that you are sensitive to strong highs but seek two earphones that have strong highs.  ...........
> On a budget and indicating to someone who may seek something well balanced, I will very readily lead that person to the RE-ZERO.  The $100 price tag is easy to swallow, and it does a lot of things right.
> 
> In terms of Joker's reviews, pay attention to the sound descriptions and look for products that are describe as having a more mild, smoother, laid back top end.  If strong treble offends you, this is the kind of thing you're looking for.  Don't think this means you have to get an earphone with complete lack of treble.  Rather, you just want to seek things that offer a more mild-mannered presentation rather than something hot, aggressive, forward, or peaky.


 

  
  thanks for the reply mvw2!
  mmm.. i knew this is gonna be difficult -explaining about the music preferences.
  i do not mind good treble but it is the harsh/piercing highs that 'm terrified of. as for Image S4 they have been ok so far and but nothing special or lively in it. and i want a larger soundstage (and better representation of low/mid and high - at the same time not analytical 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) .  also ClieOS thread here segregates TF10 as balanced.
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/541204/concise-multi-iem-comparison-panasonic-rp-hje450-added-mar-20-2011
   
   
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> ...............
> 
> Very legit- the price of the TF10 in the US has plummeted in the last two years. However, I would heed mvw2's advice - the DBA-02 (and, to a lesser extent, the TF10) are not exactly treble-light. I don't think the top end of the TF10 is very edgy but it's definitely exciting. I am, however, fully aware of the TF10's excellent reputation in India and at the current prices the praise is quite well-deserved.
> 
> .............


 
   
  thanks joker. i am definitely considering TF10
   
   
   
  also as i have read through many reviews/mini-reviews about TF10 here, people seem to enjoy their TF10 for Techno/Trance genre of music. 
  just one question that i still need answer for : are TF10s are sibilant at any point or do they have harsh highs?


----------



## goodvibes

I didn't care for the Tf-10 but didn't find them sibilant. They do have extended and pronounced highs but it's rather peak free. My take is that they just lacked too much mids for my tastes and the bass was more mid bass prominent. It's not a bad phone and there's a reason many really like it. The mid bass doesn't bleed up for instance like on many such phones so if you like a v response, it's a good choice, especially for what you can now get them for.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> I didn't care for the Tf-10 but didn't find them sibilant. They do have extended and pronounced highs but it's rather peak free. My take is that they just lacked too much mids for my tastes and the bass was more mid bass prominent. It's not a bad phone and there's a reason many really like it. The mid bass doesn't bleed up for instance like on many such phones so if you like a v response, it's a good choice, especially for what you can now get them for.


 

 That's similar to my take on them. I can see people like it but it's not for me especially the fit.


----------



## somspaple

thanks goodvibes and rawster for the frank opinion 
   
  i think a lot of it depends on the 'fit' too as with most IEMs it is. hopefully i get lucky. 
   
  i am now going through TF10 appreciation thread. i had saved it for last 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 . i think it is only going to make me buy these. 
   
  the 'lack' in mid is the only gripe i have come across so far.. hopefully i should be able to eq it to some extent.  related to this has anybody listened to the song - "i ain't got nobody..." from Santana with TF10. i expect them to represent those instruments in the song clear, crisp with wide soundstage.
   
  if not very good ..  i feel these are definitely an 'upgrade' from what i use now - Klipsch Image S4 in terms of sound quality.


----------



## Peruvian96

i know this may be like comparing apples to oranges but
  What are the differences in sound quality comparing the MTPG and the ATH-M50?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





peruvian96 said:


> i know this may be like comparing apples to oranges but
> What are the differences in sound quality comparing the MTPG and the ATH-M50?


 


  Apples to oranges indeed. Very hard to compare as a whole but in terms of frequency balance I'd say the M50 has more midbass and more prominent treble. The MTPG has good extension and bass body but it's not a very aggressive-sounding earphone. It's also rather laid-back up top. Maybe someone who owns both can be more specific.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

ljokerl, would you happen to know which size of comply fit the A151s, if at all? Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> ljokerl, would you happen to know which size of comply fit the A151s, if at all? Thanks


 

 The T/Tx200 fits but it's tough to get on. Don't think the T100 will fit at all and the T400 is very loose.


----------



## infernojim

Thanks for such an amazing thread.
   
  I've got completely addicted to this site over the past few days. Having previously only ever ventured into "good quality" earphones once, with my Shure Se210s, which sadly died.
   
  I have, based on this thread, and my budget now splashed out on some Xears TDIII Blackwoods and agreed a trade on some RE-0s. Both at 50 euros each.
   
  From reviews it looks like they will offer up quite a different sound, and I am looking forward to being able to compare and contrast them. Fingers crossed I'll have both within about a week... and will then be able to start my journey afresh!


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

ljokerl said:


> The T/Tx200 fits but it's tough to get on. Don't think the T100 will fit at all and the T400 is very loose.




Tough as in too loose or too tight? Cuz I got a set for my UE 500s, which I think have bigger nozzles... But I'll check if I get home. If they fit, it just means I won't have to buy more tips, I guess


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





infernojim said:


> I have, based on this thread, and my budget now splashed out on some Xears TDIII Blackwoods and agreed a trade on some RE-0s. Both at 50 euros each.
> 
> From reviews it looks like they will offer up quite a different sound, and I am looking forward to being able to compare and contrast them. Fingers crossed I'll have both within about a week... and will then be able to start my journey afresh!


 

 I think that's a great way to jump into it! I do hope you like both but in case you don't at least you'll know which direction to go when upgrading.


  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Tough as in too loose or too tight? Cuz I got a set for my UE 500s, which I think have bigger nozzles... But I'll check if I get home. If they fit, it just means I won't have to buy more tips, I guess


 

 Actually I am not even sure what size these complies are but they are too tight because of the notch on the  A151 nozzle. They are the complies that came with the Brainwavz B2/Fischer DBA-02. I'm guessing someone in the Fischer thread might know the size.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

definitely not the T200s... As I suspected, the opening is a bit big... Are you sure T400s are only loose? I thought they numbered based on size, and if the 200s are too big, are the 400s only loose?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> definitely not the T200s... As I suspected, the opening is a bit big... Are you sure T400s are only loose? I thought they numbered based on size, and if the 200s are too big, are the 400s only loose?


 
  Well by loose I mean quite loose. As in, they don't stay on at all.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

ljokerl said:


> Well by loose I mean quite loose. As in, they don't stay on at all.




oh, ok then...


----------



## Luv My BASS 1

hi, just looking for a quick recomendation. i listen to trance, electronica, and dubstep. i need something that has unearthly bass, but dosen't mud the mids or highs. i can choose between skullcandy FMJ, Lil Jamz, Jamz or JVC bi-metal. those are, unfortunately my ONLY choices (otherwise, i would get the punch plugs) any help?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





luv my bass 1 said:


> hi, just looking for a quick recomendation. i listen to trance, electronica, and dubstep. i need something that has unearthly bass, but dosen't mud the mids or highs. i can choose between skullcandy FMJ, Lil Jamz, Jamz or JVC bi-metal. those are, unfortunately my ONLY choices (otherwise, i would get the punch plugs) any help?


 

 I'd probably take the Jamz as the other ones are even worse but really none of them are what you're looking for. The Jamz aren't very clean-sounding and lack treble, the Lil Jamz and JVCs are probably not bassy enough for you, and the FMJs are just terrible in every way.


----------



## Ikarios

I should have known getting into IEMs was a bad idea... my budget started at $50, and has slowly inflated up to $200. Curse you Head-Fi!
  
  So I just got the IE8s in today... my first impression is that they have a very V-shaped response, with a little less emphasis on the treble. Bass is powerful and deep, but has a somewhat pronounced mid-bass hump. For me the bass definitely bleeds into the midrange (especially kick drums), drowning out a lot of what I like to hear in the mids (generally guitars, vocals). The mids are quite relatively de-emphasized compared to the bass (too much) and the treble (which I find just right). The treble has just the right balance between sparkle and shimmer - it's detailed enough not to sound like a shimmery mess but not edgy enough to sound harsh or sibilant.
   
  One thing I did find interesting is that the bass adjustment doesn't really do anything, for me. I noticed a little bit of deeper bass when I maxed out one side vs min on the other, but most of it was a slight boost in the midbass. I turned it back down to min because it was already too much to begin with.
   
  I also noticed that the Senn "bi-flanges", while uncomfortable, did wonders for body microphonics. The isolation is mediocre/average, but normally with IEMs I hear every part of my moving body, especially my mouth and breathing. With the biflanges I didn't really notice any of that, they were awesome in that regard.
   
  So, so far I'm not quite sold on them yet. If I could make a Frankenphone, it would be with the treble somewhere between the IE8 and the RE-Zero, the midrange of the RE262, and the bass... somewhere between the RE262 and the IE8. Should I just throw caution and budget to the wind and splurge for the CK10? I'm a little bit afraid the DBA-02 will be a little too analytical and dry to be really enjoyable. The CK10 seems to have the right amount of balance of everything... what would be a full-size equivalent?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Should I just throw caution and budget to the wind and splurge for the CK10? I'm a little bit afraid the DBA-02 will be a little too analytical and dry to be really enjoyable. The CK10 seems to have the right amount of balance of everything... what would be a full-size equivalent?


 

 IMO, its the CK10 that's drier and more analytical than the DBA.  I think the DBA is more natural and fluid sounding while the CK10 then the ER4S are the analytical ones.  Though they are still musical while other analytical phones aren't.  I think you should look at Fisher 003, Sennheiser HD598 and Beyer 880s for headphones.


----------



## Redmetal1897

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> IMO, its the CK10 that's drier and more analytical than the DBA.  I think the DBA is more natural and fluid sounding while the CK10 then the ER4S are the analytical ones.  Though they are still musical while other analytical phones aren't.  I think you should look at Fisher 003, Sennheiser HD598 and Beyer 880s for headphones.


 
   
  +1 on the FA-003, which basically sounds a like a full sized dynamic version of the DBA


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





daanish said:


> +1 on the FA-003, which basically sounds a like a* full sized dynamic version of the DBA*


 
  Interesting....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


ikarios said:


> I also noticed that the Senn "bi-flanges", while uncomfortable, did wonders for body microphonics. The isolation is mediocre/average, but normally with IEMs I hear every part of my moving body, especially my mouth and breathing. With the biflanges I didn't really notice any of that, they were awesome in that regard.
> 
> So, so far I'm not quite sold on them yet. If I could make a Frankenphone, it would be with the treble somewhere between the IE8 and the RE-Zero, the midrange of the RE262, and the bass... somewhere between the RE262 and the IE8. Should I just throw caution and budget to the wind and splurge for the CK10? I'm a little bit afraid the DBA-02 will be a little too analytical and dry to be really enjoyable. The CK10 seems to have the right amount of balance of everything... what would be a full-size equivalent?


 

 The CK10 definitely does not fall between the IE8 and RE-ZERO on the treble spectrum. Neither does the DBA-02 for matter. It also does not fall between the RE262 ad IE8 in terms of bass quantity since both of those have convex bass curves. The Westone 4 is closer to what you seem to be after although it is painfully pricy.


----------



## ljokerl

Added two more <$10 earphones - Maike MK-EL5031 and Sentry HO642


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> ikarios said:
> ...


 

 I know - these are ideals, and I don't think there's anything that comes close in a universal that can meet all my requirements at a budget I won't kill myself over. The TF10 seems like it would actually be pretty close (barring lush mids) but I'm 90% sure I'm going to hate the fit. Maybe once I settle down on a full-size headphone I can live with, I can move onto IEM heavy hitters like customs.


----------



## cnhardwick

|joker|, in your review you note that the MEElectonics A151 midrange has a slight warmth to it, how does it compare to the CW31? I love the warm mids--and to a lesser degree bass--of the CW31, but want treble a little more like Triple.Fi 10. Would the A151 be a good choice or would the treble still be a little to laid back for my taste? Anything else under $100 worth considering? Thanks.


----------



## WalmartSecurity

joker, so I've had the Xears TDIII for some time now, with an iPod touch as my source. I spent some time this past weekend EQing them in iTunes and with the custom presets on my touch.
   
  I dunno if you use a touch, but I definitely think the "Bass reducer" preset EQ makes the TDIII sound the best. There's an entire layer of bass (sub-bass, mid-bass?) that is eliminated. And although the mids/highs are roughly the same vs no EQ, the overall sound appears to be more crisp and clear because that layer of bass is eliminated.
   
  The same bass is eliminated with a "treble booster" setting, but the mids aren't as forward.
   
  I've been thinking about getting the DBA-02s as my next upgrade, and I'm wondering if my bass-reduced description of the TDIII matches the sig of the DBAs. If not, do you have any suggestions? Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cnhardwick said:


> |joker|, in your review you note that the MEElectonics A151 midrange has a slight warmth to it, how does it compare to the CW31? I love the warm mids--and to a lesser degree bass--of the CW31, but want treble a little more like Triple.Fi 10. Would the A151 be a good choice or would the treble still be a little to laid back for my taste? Anything else under $100 worth considering? Thanks.


 

 I don't think the A151 is what you want. The CC51 is closer as it has more prominent treble than the A151 but still not as much sparkle and energy as the TF10. For that you would be looking at something like the ECCI PR401 or at least Fischer Silver Bullet.


  Quote: 





walmartsecurity said:


> joker, so I've had the Xears TDIII for some time now, with an iPod touch as my source. I spent some time this past weekend EQing them in iTunes and with the custom presets on my touch.
> 
> I dunno if you use a touch, but I definitely think the "Bass reducer" preset EQ makes the TDIII sound the best. There's an entire layer of bass (sub-bass, mid-bass?) that is eliminated. And although the mids/highs are roughly the same vs no EQ, the overall sound appears to be more crisp and clear because that layer of bass is eliminated.
> 
> ...


 

 I don't use iPods so I am not sure of the quantitative effect these presets have. Therefore, i can't say if you're dropping the bass of the TD-III enough to match the DBA-02. I don't think you'll find anything more crisp/clear than the DBA-02 but the bass of the Fischers pretty much portrays exactly what is on the track so if the TD-III still sounds 'enhanced' to you at the low end, the DBA-02 will probably have less bass.


----------



## WaveRider69

Hey man this is very awesome, great job on this.  If at all possible would you be willing to add a column in your chart of "openback" with yeses or nos going down the line?  I'm looking for a great pair of high quality buds that are able to "breathe".  I prefer an open sound as a closed sound drives me crazy especially any hint of breathing noise.  I imagine a lot of others would be interested as well.
   
  Thanks for this in depth review.  If you were to sum up a top a few for electronica & dance club music which would they be?  Something with great bass, speed, good vocals, energy, and are on the bright cheery side.  Maybe something along the likes of a DT990/AD700 sound combined, if possible lol, or you get the idea .  Ones that can breathe out the back and are under $150.  Ohms don't matter as I'll probably amp them.  That would be very awesome if you could, if not that's cool too.
   
  Thanks man!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





waverider69 said:


> Hey man this is very awesome, great job on this.  If at all possible would you be willing to add a column in your chart of "openback" with yeses or nos going down the line?  I'm looking for a great pair of high quality buds that are able to "breathe".  I prefer an open sound as a closed sound drives me crazy especially any hint of breathing noise.  I imagine a lot of others would be interested as well.
> 
> Thanks for this in depth review.  If you were to sum up a top a few for electronica & dance club music which would they be?  Something with great bass, speed, good vocals, energy, and are on the bright cheery side.  Maybe something along the likes of a DT990/AD700 sound combined, if possible lol, or you get the idea .  Ones that can breathe out the back and are under $150.  Ohms don't matter as I'll probably amp them.  That would be very awesome if you could, if not that's cool too.


 
   
  By open back to you mean actually open IEMs (there's very few) or just vented ones? Vents really don't mean much in terms of sound signature or presentation but there will be a correlation (negative) between the presence of vents and isolation. Very few IEMs will actually give you an 'open' sound.
   
  I have not heard the DT990 and generally don't like comparing IEMs to full-size cans. What you are looking for sounds like the JVC HA-FX700 although it is way out of your price range. If you're willing to take a small step back in terms of requirements, I'd take a look at the ECCI P401 or used Panasonic HJE900.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





waverider69 said:


> I'm looking for a great pair of high quality buds that are able to "breathe".  I prefer an open sound as a closed sound drives me crazy especially any hint of breathing noise.


 

 I believe you may be talking about the occlusion effect with closed IEMs and the vented ones are definitely better in that regard. IME vents do make a difference in presentation, at least with dynamic drivers - especially soundstaging is more believable to my ears than the rather boxed-in feeling with most closed ones I've heard. Among armatures the vented Final Audios have better bass texture than all others I've heard, but that might be coincidence and possibly not due to their vents.

 Btw, if you don't need isolation, you might also consider high quality buds like the Audio Technica EC700. Due to some medical issue that prevented me from wearing IEMs, I've been using these during the last weeks and I must say they give the IEMs I know in that price range a run for their money.


----------



## cnhardwick

Thanks |joker|.


----------



## Vloeibaarglas

I don't know what you are listening to, but I got the Sentry HO642 on sale directly from Amazon a few months ago for ~$2.
   
  I listened to them for 30 seconds and threw them directly into the garbage. Maybe my pair is defective, but based on the pair I received, I give them a -1/5 on Sound.


----------



## xtasi

Quote: 





vloeibaarglas said:


> I don't know what you are listening to, but I got the Sentry HO642 on sale directly from Amazon a few months ago for ~$2.
> 
> I listened to them for 30 seconds and threw them directly into the garbage. Maybe my pair is defective, but based on the pair I received, I give them a -1/5 on Sound.


 


  What did you expect for $2?


----------



## Confispect

Lmao.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vloeibaarglas said:


> I don't know what you are listening to, but I got the Sentry HO642 on sale directly from Amazon a few months ago for ~$2.
> 
> I listened to them for 30 seconds and threw them directly into the garbage. Maybe my pair is defective, but based on the pair I received, I give them a -1/5 on Sound.


 


  30 seconds is not enough to form an opinion on anything, least of all a dynamic-driver earphone. Not sure what they sounded like out of the box but I give all my gear a fair chance. They like to be inserted pretty deeply and they don't like the stock single-flanges.


----------



## ljokerl

Added reviews for the Westone 4 and Radius TWF21


----------



## tuahogary

omg


----------



## Redmetal1897

Quote: 





tuahogary said:


> omg


 


  exactly lol this thread is a work of art


----------



## Oddworld

Love this thread... why no Shure?


----------



## RainofSorrow

Ever consider doing a review on the Shure SE535's? I'm kinda set with my Westone 4's, but I'm definitely going to pick up the 535's in the future.


----------



## rawrster

Mike, did you ever get your custom tips from ACS via Etymotic? If you did I was wondering about if you used them with the W4 since I'm thinking about that and if it solves the issues of the short nozzle and how the sound changed compared to the tips you were using with them.


----------



## Redmetal1897

Quote: 





oddworld said:


> Love this thread... why no Shure?


 


  Lol, joker had a bad experience with shures and since then he hasn't really had an interest in reviewing them. The issue has been brought up several times in this thread so if you search for it you should be able to find the exact reason which I can't remember. 


  Quote: 





rainofsorrow said:


> Ever consider doing a review on the Shure SE535's? I'm kinda set with my Westone 4's, but I'm definitely going to pick up the 535's in the future.


----------



## rroseperry

whew! what an epic!


----------



## tyoung8

Quote: 





daanish said:


> Lol, joker had a bad experience with shures and since then he hasn't really had an interest in reviewing them. The issue has been brought up several times in this thread so if you search for it you should be able to find the exact reason which I can't remember.


 
   
  oh so that is why.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  No Shure on any of his reviews.  (*cough* Shure 440 *cough*)


----------



## rawrster

I'm sure if someone sends him the SE535 he will review them  There's enough interest but I don't think he's going to go out and buy them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


tuahogary said:


> omg


  Quote:


daanish said:


> exactly lol this thread is a work of art


  Quote:


rroseperry said:


> whew! what an epic!


 
 Thanks, everyone. And thanks to rawrster for the W4 loan - $450 universals are still too rich for my blood so this review could not have happened without him.
  
  Quote:


daanish said:


> Lol, joker had a bad experience with shures and since then he hasn't really had an interest in reviewing them. The issue has been brought up several times in this thread so if you search for it you should be able to find the exact reason which I can't remember.


  Quote:


rawrster said:


> I'm sure if someone sends him the SE535 he will review them  There's enough interest but I don't think he's going to go out and buy them.


 
  Right on both counts. 
   
   

  Quote:


rawrster said:


> Mike, did you ever get your custom tips from ACS via Etymotic? If you did I was wondering about if you used them with the W4 since I'm thinking about that and if it solves the issues of the short nozzle and how the sound changed compared to the tips you were using with them.


   
  Yep, have the tips. However, they are custom-molded for my Ety HF3 which means they will only fit on the HF3 (or ER4, I suppose). The tips actually go a good 1/3 way onto the body of the Etys so another earphone would have to have a very slim housing or very long nozzles for them to fit. The W4 obviously has neither of those.


----------



## rawrster

Well it's rich for my blood as well but I don't have as many earphones as you do so it doesn't add up quite like it does for you although I did get it 2nd hand so it's not quite $450.
   
  That's a shame about those tips. I would have liked it to be for the nozzle only and not the body of the earphone but oh well. I did get an opinion of the custom tips by another user but wanted more opinions.


----------



## victorbrt

Hey joker,
   
  How do you compare the treble of the M2 and M3?
   
  I like treble and you said in reviews that the M2 have a better treble than M3. Is that true? They share the same sound signature?
   
  Because i have more than $100 to spend and if the M3 is better than M2, then will be my choice.
   
  I'm looking for a upgrade from my CKM55.


----------



## Zephyron

My impressions with the Westone 4's were pretty much spot on with yours when I tried them =)
   
  The most predominant thing that stood out with the to me were their liquid-like midrange (above and beyond what the SE535 had to offer, makes both the SM3 and SE535 sound somewhat dry in comparison) and a very naturally sized soundstage.

 Bass quantities were nothing to scoff at either too, and the treble presentation is polite enough, that when combined with the rest of the frequency spectrum, to allow it to to be worn for long periods of time without suffering from listening fatigue IMO.
   
  Combined with the comfort of the Westone 4s, they're the earpiece I'd turn to for relaxation if I could afford them right now =)


----------



## breakfast

Just wondering if there is an easy way to see cost-to-performance on the original chart. I'm looking to spend under $200 (ideally under $100) and just wondering if I'm going to see a significant jump in performance from $100 to $200 spent.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


rawrster said:


> Well it's rich for my blood as well but I don't have as many earphones as you do so it doesn't add up quite like it does for you although I did get it 2nd hand so it's not quite $450.
> 
> That's a shame about those tips. I would have liked it to be for the nozzle only and not the body of the earphone but oh well. I did get an opinion of the custom tips by another user but wanted more opinions.


 
 True, I have way too many cheap earphones. The 1964-T absolutely has to be the most I've spent on a single in-ear. Second place would probably go to the ATH-CK90Pro. I really don't buy many expensive earphones myself.
   
  I think ACS will do a custom sleeve not fitted for the Ety nozzle. It's pretty pricy though - the ACS/Ety collaboration deal is sweetened only by the fact that you get a voucher for free ACS impressions by registering your Ety earphone.
   

 Quote:


victorbrt said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> How do you compare the treble of the M2 and M3?
> 
> ...


 
 I don't recall saying that the M2 had better treble than the M3. If anything they are very similar with the M2 maybe being a tiny bit livelier. The bigger difference, however, would stem from the overall balance - the midrange of the M2 is very prominent and the treble comes across as a bit of an afterthought sometimes. Not so with the M3, which is very well-balanced across the spectrum. If you want the earphone with the more prominent treble, that would be the M3 for me. I have not heard the CKM55 so I cannot give a comparison to that.
   
   
  Quote:


zephyron said:


> Combined with the comfort of the Westone 4s, they're the earpiece I'd turn to for relaxation if I could afford them right now =)


 
 Great disclaimer - I think that applies to all of the ultra-high-end universals. I remember thinking the same back when I first auditioned the CK100...
   

  Quote:


breakfast said:


> Just wondering if there is an easy way to see cost-to-performance on the original chart. I'm looking to spend under $200 (ideally under $100) and just wondering if I'm going to see a significant jump in performance from $100 to $200 spent


 
  If you have a formula in mind I can provide the source spreadsheet. Something simple like SQ or average pts/dollar is easy to calculate but favors budget stuff very heavily. Personally I do feel there is a jump between the best <$100 and the best <$200 earphones but it will depend heavily on the earphones and/or desired signature in question. If you're interested in more number play I did some simple average calculations by tier a little while ago.


----------



## Ikarios

Joker, out of curiosity - do you remember all the sound signatures of everything you've listened to, or do you refer to notes or something? I ask because I have a hard enough time juggling the sound signatures of everything I've listened to in my head... and you've heard at least 5 or 10 times as many sets. Mind-boggling...


----------



## victorbrt

Quote: 





> victorbrt said:
> 
> 
> > Hey joker,
> ...


 
  Thanks for the info Joker. The CKM55, from what i've read from friends, share the same sound signature of Brainwavz M2, but M2 is a lot better.
   
  So, the M3 have same sound signature of M2 but is better?
   
  I'm considered the HJE900, but now i can only find them for the MSRP price - $250. Do you think that they worth in this price?
  There's also the Triple Fi, but i read too much fit issues.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> rawrster said:
> ...


 
   
  You can thank whoever had the W4 up in the FS for my impulse buy. The W4 is easily the most I've spend on a universal by a good amount and not sure yet what I plan on doing with them but I'll hold onto them for at least a month or two. I also meant custom tips in general and not particularly the ACS. After what I've been hearing I'll pass on the ACS tips and rather go with Westone or 1964 Ears.


----------



## jiddu

Hi, hopefully I can get some help with this:
   
  MEElectronics M6 vs. Nuforce NE700x.. not sure which to pick.  I'm in Canada and not willing to do the used or crossborder thing for this purchase, pricewise $15 difference from this retailer because they sell the M6 at full MSRP sadly but it's convenient for me. 
   
  I mostly listen to electronica (a lot of DnB and House) and want good SQ across the spectrum of course but bass is important (extension, output and hopefully detail), I've never had IEMs before which is making it hard to chose but I've bought full size headphones based on reading I've done here (HFI-780) and am satisfied with my choice.  For reference I've read that the Ultrasone HFI-780 had massive bass and great extension, some people complained that it's like wearing a subwoofer on your head but by instinct I chose them knowing I could EQ it down if needed and have to say that the low end is just right for me, really I've a proper sub in the HT room so I find these headphones to simply suffice on that end.. hence I figure that means I'm a bit of a basshead and look for that quality now when reading about these IEMs. 
   
  I don't expect the same kind of performance from IEMs and in this price range of course, just the most capable set so that I don't dread listening to my portable when I'm away.  I've been recommended the NE-7m before but now there's the ne700 which seems like a step up, the M6 is recommended here for exactly my type of music though so I'm considering it too even if it's in a different category because of US prices.


----------



## Ikarios

Well... I got my DBA-02s in today. People say you should spend some time with a headphone/earphone in order to get to know it better, but I don't particularly like to subscribe by that policy. Your brain can only do so much adjusting to the sound, and when I listen to headphoens I usually do it fresh - that is, not having listened to other headphones for maybe an hour or two before the demo. This usually happens because I get new headphones in the morning, so I don't really have time for headphone listening (which is usually late at night).
   
  First, the good - I *LOVE* the mids. They have the same kind of analytical detail that I like in the iM716s, and presumably other Etymotics. It's not too warm or fleshed out, but it's not recessed - I guess they would best be described as "dry". The DBA-02 is a very very quick headphone, and that applies to the mids as well. Compared to the IE8 and the RE262, the DBA-02 is like a Lotus Elise compared to... say, a Ford F150 (powerful, but a little slow) and a Lexus RX350 (nice and luxurious) (sorry, I don't really know too much about cars). The DBA-02 has so much detail and is so fast you hear everything through a microscope. The bass is tight and textured, and the treble is possibly even more detailed than the mids.
   
  But now, the bad... granted, I am coming from the IE8 and lately, some testing with notable bass-heavy closed full-size sets (DT770/80, M50, SRH750DJ), but the DBA-02s just don't seem to have any bass. It may be tight, but it becomes a problem when I try to listen for bass extension and can't pick it out. I don't really care if the bass isn't bloomy and powerful, I just like to hear the texture behind the rhythm bass and kick drums. That isn't really happening... and a lot of it has to do with the treble. People weren't kidding when they said the DBA-02 was a relatively bright headphone. It has great extension, and cymbals sound  much more realistic than what every other IEM I've listened to (and many full-size sets) can do, but it's the quantity that's the problem. Most notably, there seems to be a peak between around 6kHz-8kHz (or somewhere around there), making crash cymbals sound bright - but not on the shimmer, which a lot of other treble-heavy sets do, but rather on the initial hit. This might be due to the super-fast decay of the DBA-02, but nevertheless it's still a little bothersome. The treble brings all the cymbals out to the front, so that you can hear every hi-hat, ride cymbal, even the snares. I'm trying really hard to block out the cymbal attack noise, even after half an hour of listening (which is usually about when my brain starts to kick in the habituation) and it's just not going away.
   
  Since I've only had about half an hour total, one pair of tips (although the biflanges and hybrids I got don't seal with my ears at all), and one "listening session" I will not go into further detail. I plan on keeping the DBA-02 at least until the CC51 comes in later this week, so I can do a direct comparison, but it's not looking good so far. I really want to like the DBA-02, I really do - it's nice and small, has a great form factor, has an awesome cable, and looks great - and the detail is to die for. Maybe if I can find foam tips that fit...


----------



## DKaz

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Well... I got my DBA-02s in today. People say you should spend some time with a headphone/earphone in order to get to know it better, but I don't particularly like to subscribe by that policy. Your brain can only do so much adjusting to the sound, and when I listen to headphoens I usually do it fresh - that is, not having listened to other headphones for maybe an hour or two before the demo. This usually happens because I get new headphones in the morning, so I don't really have time for headphone listening (which is usually late at night).
> 
> First, the good - I *LOVE* the mids. They have the same kind of analytical detail that I like in the iM716s, and presumably other Etymotics. It's not too warm or fleshed out, but it's not recessed - I guess they would best be described as "dry". The DBA-02 is a very very quick headphone, and that applies to the mids as well. Compared to the IE8 and the RE262, the DBA-02 is like a Lotus Elise compared to... say, a Ford F150 (powerful, but a little slow) and a Lexus RX350 (nice and luxurious) (sorry, I don't really know too much about cars). The DBA-02 has so much detail and is so fast you hear everything through a microscope. The bass is tight and textured, and the treble is possibly even more detailed than the mids.
> 
> ...


 

  
  I felt much the same way until I got the comply TX-100.  A good seal really brings out the bass and the built in filter ever so slightly calms the 8KHz region.


----------



## dlechner

Thanks for the review.  I bought a pair of RE-ZEROs in the FS forum and love them!!!  Thanks for all the time you spend on the reviews!


----------



## Ikarios

I hope no one minds that I'm making this thread my depository for random thoughts, but I just popped in the RE0s after a little time with my Sunrise Xcapes (V1)... wow, these sound nearly identical. Maybe a teensy bit less bass, maybe a more neutral midrange, treble is a tiny bit more extended... but otherwise, they sound like long-lost twins. It might have to do with the fact that I'm still using the Sunrise silicone tips... I'll have to try the default RE0 tips later.


----------



## Fantoon

How is the soundstage of the W4 compared to the DBA-02, sorry if this question has been answered before.


----------



## Anaxilus

Aflac, sounds like you admitted yourself that you aren't getting a proper seal on the DBA.  I think you'll be surprised by what you hear if you can manage it.  Not only will you find bass but you will add body to the whole spectrum.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Aflac, sounds like you admitted yourself that you aren't getting a proper seal on the DBA.  I think you'll be surprised by what you hear if you can manage it.  Not only will you find bass but you will add body to the whole spectrum.


 

 With the stock Fischer single flanges it sounded like I was getting a seal, it was only with the biflanges and hybrid-like tips that I couldn't get to seal (these sounded even worse, less bass and thinner treble). I ordered a set of T100 Comply's, which should be here by the end of the week, which should help seal and attenuate some of the treble. That might do a lot of good.


----------



## AngryBaconGod

ikarios said:


> With the stock Fischer single flanges it sounded like I was getting a seal, it was only with the biflanges and hybrid-like tips that I couldn't get to seal (these sounded even worse, less bass and thinner treble). I ordered a set of T100 Comply's, which should be here by the end of the week, which should help seal and attenuate some of the treble. That might do a lot of good.




To be picky, DKaz specifically mentioned the TX-100 Comply's. The TX versions have the ear guard, which I read as claimed to "ever so slightly calms the 8KHz region."

It's not clear that the T-100 would do that.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





angrybacongod said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I know, but the TX series is $5 more per set of 3 ($20 compared to $15). When you consider that you have to replace Complys every month or so (probably more often for me), I'm wary of spending more money than I already have to to "fix" an IEM. After a year or so I could've just gotten a custom to begin with and not had to deal with getting new tips.


----------



## seanmo

@jiddo...I have both the m6p and the 700m. The m6 is a great iem for the gym and for active listening(least amount of 'walking' noise from any iem for me). The sound is good, but not as good as the 700m which is very solid sound quality wise but not as good for active listening. Both have a lot of bass, but to me the 700m has a fuller more complete sound. I got the m6p for $20 and think its an amazing value, but at full retail its less so. Very happy with it for the gym though.


----------



## jiddu

Quote: 





seanmo said:


> @jiddo...I have both the m6p and the 700m. The m6 is a great iem for the gym and for active listening(least amount of 'walking' noise from any iem for me). The sound is good, but not as good as the 700m which is very solid sound quality wise but not as good for active listening. Both have a lot of bass, but to me the 700m has a fuller more complete sound. I got the m6p for $20 and think its an amazing value, but at full retail its less so. Very happy with it for the gym though.


 

  
  Thanks, answers my question perfectly.  I just found newegg has some valentines leftover m6's for $30Cdn for 2 pairs, only downside is one of them is PINK 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.  I haven't been to the gym in ages because I get (too much) exercise at work right now but if things change I'll know what to get then if the nuforce don't cut it.. I mean you're getting rid of your 700m it looks like so the m6 must be pretty decent.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Cheers!


----------



## seanmo

I almost got that 'valentines' pack for my wife and I   but then I would have to admit I bought new headphones  and yes the m6 is definitely decent...the 700m was an impulse buy and I don't need the iphone controls so its got to go


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Joker, out of curiosity - do you remember all the sound signatures of everything you've listened to, or do you refer to notes or something?


 


  A little of both. I have pretty extensive notes on everything I've listened to - I don't write reviews immediately but rather let my impressions simmer and then write off of a combination of an earphone's "aftertaste" and my notes. If it's something I want to go back and listen to again, it scores a little higher. If I couldn't care less to hear it again, it scores lower. I've found that regardless of signature earphones that are capable and interesting will be difficult to put down while ones that are flawed or boring will likely end up sitting in my desk until I sell them off or give them away. In the long term, I really don't remember entry-level sets very well since I spend maybe 2-3 hours listening to them for a review. High end sets can take 10 times longer and I get a much longer-lasting picture of what they sound like.
   
   

  Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Thanks for the info Joker. The CKM55, from what i've read from friends, share the same sound signature of Brainwavz M2, but M2 is a lot better.
> 
> So, the M3 have same sound signature of M2 but is better?
> 
> ...


 

  The M2 and M3 aren't too different but I wouldn't say they have the same signature. The M3 tries to be more balanced while the M2 is just uncompromisingly mid-forward with pretty strong bass.
   
  I would not buy the HJE900 at $250. If you want that sort of signature get the ECCI PR401 and keep the rest of the $250 for later.



  Quote: 





fantoon said:


> How is the soundstage of the W4 compared to the DBA-02, sorry if this question has been answered before.


 

  I would say the W4's is bigger but with a caveat - the DBA-02 is leaner and can sound more airy/separated-out. The W4 tends to fill its entire stage.


----------



## lorafenik

Hey Joker, your describtion of ER-4 interested me, have you by chance heard the ER-6i? If so, could you tell sth about them?
  I'm now considering them or Audeo (seller includes all filters). I know both will have totally different sig than the HPs I own, but I'm interested in trying sth new 
  Thanks in advance


----------



## victorbrt

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> A little of both. I have pretty extensive notes on everything I've listened to - I don't write reviews immediately but rather let my impressions simmer and then write off of a combination of an earphone's "aftertaste" and my notes. If it's something I want to go back and listen to again, it scores a little higher. If I couldn't care less to hear it again, it scores lower. I've found that regardless of signature earphones that are capable and interesting will be difficult to put down while ones that are flawed or boring will likely end up sitting in my desk until I sell them off or give them away. In the long term, I really don't remember entry-level sets very well since I spend maybe 2-3 hours listening to them for a review. High end sets can take 10 times longer and I get a much longer-lasting picture of what they sound like.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Joker, when you say that M3 is "balanced" you refer to a balanced signature, with more emphasis on bass and treble?


----------



## kingice10

Hi |joker|, please do a review for Sony EX1000. Thank you so much for all of this!


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





kingice10 said:


> Hi |joker|, please do a review for Sony EX1000. Thank you so much for all of this!


 
  Since he gets these a lot...Only way a review will happen is if the manufacturer sends a review pair or someone lends it to him. Doubt the former is going to happen so I will wait for the latter.


----------



## Fantoon

Thank you, love the reviews. Keep up the good work 
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would say the W4's is bigger but with a caveat - the DBA-02 is leaner and can sound more airy/separated-out. The W4 tends to fill its entire stage.


----------



## idioot

hey. i'm looking to buy new earphones for my sony player. I was looking at cx300II and CX280 sennheisers. this review makes cx280 seem  better than cx300 but how does it relate to cx300II? i'm gonna use it for mostly rock/metal/pop music. 280 is slightly cheaper as well...don't know which one to get.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lorafenik said:


> Hey Joker, your describtion of ER-4 interested me, have you by chance heard the ER-6i? If so, could you tell sth about them?
> I'm now considering them or Audeo (seller includes all filters). I know both will have totally different sig than the HPs I own, but I'm interested in trying sth new
> Thanks in advance


 

 The Er6i is quite old. It was one of my first proper mid-range IEMs and is probably the earphone that weaned me onto analytical sound. It's an earphone with great clarity and detail but pretty noticeable bass roll-off and not much soundstaging prowess. It is not as good as the Phonak PFE and the ER4 is definitely a class above it. If you can't afford an ER4 but want an Ety, I'd recommend the HF5 (review coming soon). It's 90% of the ER4's sound in a cheaper and more user-friendly package.
   


  Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Joker, when you say that M3 is "balanced" you refer to a balanced signature, with more emphasis on bass and treble?


 
   
  Or, alternatively, less emphasis on the mids.
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> Since he gets these a lot...Only way a review will happen is if the manufacturer sends a review pair or someone lends it to him. Doubt the former is going to happen so I will wait for the latter.


 


  Thanks. I guess this is another one for that FAQ I've been meaning to write.


  Quote: 





idioot said:


> hey. i'm looking to buy new earphones for my sony player. I was looking at cx300II and CX280 sennheisers. this review makes cx280 seem  better than cx300 but how does it relate to cx300II? i'm gonna use it for mostly rock/metal/pop music. 280 is slightly cheaper as well...don't know which one to get.


 

 The CX300-II is just a rebadged CX400. No idea what it sounds like. In the context of the reviews, you have to understand that the CX300 was released more than five years ago (and, IIRC, based on a Sharp model that's even older than that) while the CX280 is a fairly recent release. Doesn't matter how many confusing naming conventions Sennheiser uses, the CX300 is just plain old. If the CX280 is cheaper than the CX300-II/CX400 and you must have a Sennheiser, I'd consider it a safe bet.


----------



## leylandi

please do a review for Sony EX1000


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





inks said:


> Since he gets these a lot...Only way a review will happen is if the manufacturer sends a review pair or someone lends it to him. Doubt the former is going to happen so I will wait for the latter.


 
  One of them needs to happen but for some odd reason I doubt it.


----------



## idioot

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The CX300-II is just a rebadged CX400. No idea what it sounds like. In the context of the reviews, you have to understand that the CX300 was released more than five years ago (and, IIRC, based on a Sharp model that's even older than that) while the CX280 is a fairly recent release. Doesn't matter how many confusing naming conventions Sennheiser uses, the CX300 is just plain old. If the CX280 is cheaper than the CX300-II/CX400 and you must have a Sennheiser, I'd consider it a safe bet.


 

 well it doesn't have to be Sennheiser, I've just read good things about them online  a lot of the players in this review I can't find in any shop near me...


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Buy online...
  
  Quote: 





idioot said:


> well it doesn't have to be Sennheiser, I've just read good things about them online  a lot of the players in this review I can't find in any shop near me...


----------



## ickayR

I listen to rock & need a good noise isolating IEM. My budget is between $70-120,what do you recommend?


----------



## FlySweep

Very much looking forward to your Vsonic GR07 review, joker.. got mine yesterday and I'm in a deep state of bliss with them.


----------



## nucgaek

A question for i guess anyone who's tried the UE 700's and various others...
  What would the sq and value be on ljokerl's scale? (As a very rough estimate?) They're the only "mid range" iem's i've used, so i was thinking about upgrading to something like the DBA-02, but wanted to know if it was worth it?
  Thanks a lot


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ickayr said:


> I listen to rock & need a good noise isolating IEM. My budget is between $70-120,what do you recommend?


 

 Music genre and sound signature preferences don't go hand in hand but if you don't mind analytical sound and want the maximum possible isolation, it'd have to be the Etymotic HF5. If you're looking for a more fun sound and are willing to step off the isolation requirement a bit, the Meelec CC51, ECCI PR401, and Fischer Silver Bullet are worth looking into. In any case you'd have to do some thinking regarding what type of signature you'd rather have. The PR401 would be the one most like the tradition 'rock' equalizer, though that doesn't necessarily mean it'll be the one you prefer.


  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Very much looking forward to your Vsonic GR07 review, joker.. got mine yesterday and I'm in a deep state of bliss with them.


 
   
  I've had them since last week and they are very enjoyable phones. Aside from a bit of sizzle in the treble they are clear competition for the IE7 and RE252.


  Quote: 





nucgaek said:


> A question for i guess anyone who's tried the UE 700's and various others...
> What would the sq and value be on ljokerl's scale? (As a very rough estimate?) They're the only "mid range" iem's i've used, so i was thinking about upgrading to something like the DBA-02, but wanted to know if it was worth it?
> Thanks a lot


 

 I happen to own the UE700 so I can answer this. The UE700 and DBA-02 actually use the same driver - a Knowles TWFK. However, the DBA-02 happens to be one of my favorite tunings of that armature while the UE700 is probably my least favorite due to its spiky treble and smoothed-over microdetail. I'd say the UE700 is roughly an 8.8/10 (in contrast to the DBA-02's 9.5). Taking into account diminishing returns, that's a sizable difference but of course you're moving from one fairly analytical earphone to another and it will take some critical listening to really appreciate the differences.


----------



## rawrster

If the GR07 is anything like the IE7 then it's definitely not for me although I've never heard the RE252 but reviews does seem to indicate that it is different sounding than the IE7.


----------



## Anaxilus

Sizzle in the treble does remind me of my Sony CD2Ks which I was wondering about.


----------



## Zephyron

Have the PL50s in my ears right now, they feel like the Shure SE215 in the mids quantity department, but I actually find the PL50s to be technically more capable overall.

 Better overall balance, less emphasis on the bass and more airiness. The PL50 seems to be able to carry over details on each of the freq. spectrum better as well. Gonna compare them to the SE215 using the same tips the week after next.

 Headed out to try out the ECCI PR401 and VSONIC GR07 later on too =)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> If the GR07 is anything like the IE7 then it's definitely not for me although I've never heard the RE252 but reviews does seem to indicate that it is different sounding than the IE7.


 
  Well, they are all similar in that they are fairly balanced dynamic-driver earphones in the $150-200 range. I do like the GR07 better than the IE7 personally but right now (still <50 hrs burn-in) it falls just a bit a short of being a top-tier dynamic. It matches my preferences better than the Radius TWF21 but I'm the first to admit that it's not nearly as smooth and lush.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> If the GR07 is anything like the IE7 then it's definitely not for me although I've never heard the RE252 but reviews does seem to indicate that it is different sounding than the IE7.


 

 Well, Mike told me the GR07 is _not_ boring. So, that's different from the IE7
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





!


----------



## ickayR

Does the genre that I listen to really make a difference when I pick IEM's. Which of all these do you think is the overall best?


----------



## UserFriendly

Was this last updated 03/27/10 or 03/27/11 ?
  And what are some good earphones for under $250?


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Well, Mike told me the GR07 is _not_ boring. So, that's different from the IE7
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Well compared to the IE7 most earphones are exciting


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> Was this last updated 03/27/10 or 03/27/11 ?
> And what are some good earphones for under $250?


 


  W4 and Radius TWF21. Of course it was 2010
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




! Gotta do better than that. Really read the thread and you'll know the dates(plenty of update posts and dates under each photo) and answer your own question. No offense but the thread stays cleaner this way.


----------



## UserFriendly

Oh, so it's 03/27/11
   
  Why aren't there any Sennheiser/Bose/Shure reviews on this thread?
  Also, good earphones for under $250?


----------



## yello131

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> Oh, so it's 03/27/11
> 
> Why aren't there any Sennheiser/Bose/Shure reviews on this thread?
> Also, good earphones for under $250?


 

 new Radius W21 are supposed to be promising
  Tip: Dimitri from Musica Acoustics.com offering Special price for headfi members for under 250,
  Contact directly to receive the Special


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, they are all similar in that they are fairly balanced dynamic-driver earphones in the $150-200 range. I do like the GR07 better than the IE7 personally but right now (still <50 hrs burn-in) it falls just a bit a short of being a top-tier dynamic. It matches my preferences better than the Radius TWF21 but I'm the first to admit that it's not nearly as smooth and lush.


 
   
  Yep! None of my top IEMs feel threatened by GR07 either. I think of it more as a good companion to those top-tiers than an able replacement. Mine too is still under 50 hrs, so will give it a proper listen this weekend.


----------



## UserFriendly

Why aren't there any Sennheiser/Bose/Shure earphones on this thread?


----------



## ickayR

ickayr said:


> Does the genre that I listen to really make a difference when I pick IEM's. Which of all these do you think is the overall best?




Edit: are the klipcsh s4's any good?


----------



## UserFriendly

answer my question plox


----------



## mcnoiserdc

Really? Can't you read?
  I remember there is an IE8, a CX300, CX281... at least... lol!
  No bose and shure? the author of the thread reviews whatever he wants, lol, nobody is paying for it.. lol
  Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> answer my question plox


----------



## Jackquelegs

Ctrl-F on page 1
   
  Type in "Sennheiser", and you'll see plenty of Senny reviews.
   
  Bose is not a very popular brand here, you can do a quick search to see why...
   
  and...since Joker isn't loaded with money, I guess no one has offered to lend their shures to him for review


----------



## UserFriendly

...I thought Bose was good.


----------



## Jackquelegs

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> ...I thought Bose was good.


 


  They're quite good if they go for 10% of their asking price


----------



## Inks

Heh, a lot more than 10% actually.


----------



## Ikarios

Bose and Monster products would garner a lot less hate if they just priced them reasonably at about 1/3 of the MSRP.


----------



## Jackquelegs

Quote: 





inks said:


> Heh, a lot more than 10% actually.


 

 Just an expression


----------



## Anaxilus

Does anybody know if there is a cap to the ignore list?


----------



## UserFriendly

Monster earphones are less than $250.
  Unless you're talking about headphones.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> Monster earphones are less than $250.
> Unless you're talking about headphones.


 
   
  Yes, and they're also terrible for MSRP (unless you're talking about Turbines or Turbine derivatives, in which case they're pretty good - but only for street price).
   
  Please, read the reviews in this thread before asking questions. Joker's worked very hard to compile a very large list of IEMs in this thread, all with prices and value scores.


----------



## rawrster

Well I hope someone sends him a SE535. That's the only model I would be interested in a review of and it definitely won't be me sending him a SE535 ever. My wallet took a pretty hard hit this month with customs and the W4.
   
  If Bose went for 10% of MSRP I would probably buy that AE2 or whatever their newest model that's out that I've seen on a bunch of ads on the subway. Monster definitely has MSRP over $250. The Copper and MD's go for $399 and $499 MSRP iirc but I'm too lazy to check.


----------



## Jackquelegs

Yeah, Monster IEMs cost retailers about half the price of MSRP. Aka MTPC costs 399$ MSRP, the cost is about 190-205$


----------



## Ankit1010

I'm considering buying the Klipsch Image X5. Does anyone know about these headphones?Most of what's on this site and the net says they're very good headphones, but there's nothing specific about their frequency response etc.. What kinds of sounds do they excel at , and what kind of music are they suited to etc?
  Personally, I want something that does modern rock, punk rock types really well, and handles vocals and electronic (dub-step) well. The X5's seem like a good option for this, but there's just not enough information on the net.
  Also, they use a balanced armature rather than dynamic, what exactly does this imply in terms of sound quality, and durability?


----------



## jinx20001

what an awesome collection of reviews! would be great to see the se535 in there and triple fi 10. the IE8 value should be updated because its miles cheaper than anything else in its firing line here in the UK. se535 RRP £370, IE8 RRP £170 screams great value. shame its more expensive over the pond. brilliant work keep it up!


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





ankit1010 said:


> I'm considering buying the Klipsch Image X5. Does anyone know about these headphones?Most of what's on this site and the net says they're very good headphones, but there's nothing specific about their frequency response etc.. What kinds of sounds do they excel at , and what kind of music are they suited to etc?
> Personally, I want something that does modern rock, punk rock types really well, and handles vocals and electronic (dub-step) well. The X5's seem like a good option for this, but there's just not enough information on the net.
> Also, they use a balanced armature rather than dynamic, what exactly does this imply in terms of sound quality, and durability?


   
  For answers to your last last question, read this thread by ClieOS (also stickied at the top of this thread). Virtually all custom IEMs use multiple balanced armatures. A single BA generally can only be optimized for part of the audible spectrum, whereas dynamics are more full-range, and typically give better bass impact (not necessarily bass extension), although often at the expense of some detail. Better BA IEM's typically use multiple armatures to cover the spectrum completely. But more armatures doesn't necessarily mean better sound for *all users*.
   
  Don't worry about frequency response as often provided/exaggerated by the manufacturer. Look for user reviews around here, especially those that compare similar IEMs.
   
  ClieOS has also written this excellent collection of comparative reviews, grouped by similar sound signature.
   
  Sorry that I can't help on the X5's.


----------



## Lempelig

Wondering if I might ask you a question joker? (Other are of course very welcome to answer as well)
   
  I'm coming from the UE700, which I liked a lot, but unfortunately they broke and then got stolen.
  What I'm looking for in my next IEM is speed, tight bass, transparant sound, detailed, over the ear fit, topnotch build and easy to drive, source and amp is my iPod Classic 6. gen.
  I'm somewhat certain my next IEM will be the CK10, but before buying I'd like to hear some thoughts on the subject and maybe alternatives?
  Also will my Comply foamies from the UE700 fit the CK10, or should I order some others tips when buying?


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





lempelig said:


> Wondering if I might ask you a question joker? (Other are of course very welcome to answer as well)
> 
> I'm coming from the UE700, which I liked a lot, but unfortunately they broke and then got stolen.
> What I'm looking for in my next IEM is speed, tight bass, transparant sound, detailed, over the ear fit, topnotch build and easy to drive, source and amp is my iPod Classic 6. gen.
> ...


 

 Sounds like either the DBA-02 or the CK10 to me.


----------



## Lempelig

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Sounds like either the DBA-02 or the CK10 to me.


 

 Great to hear I'm on the right track.
  Considered the DBA-02 for some time as well, but the CK10 ended up winning, based mostly on the description of they build. The DBA-02 sounds like it's built so-so, while the CK10 sounds like it's built to withstand a nuclear holocaust.


----------



## ickayR

So I saw all the reviews for IEM's in between $60-100 & it seems like the highest reviewed are the 
Sunrise sw-xcape
Ficsher audio silver bullet
Higi Man
Head direct REO
Meleec CC51
PR401

I don't know if these are the best for under $100,but seems like they had the best reviews. Which of these would you guys recommend,or which are the best? If it matters,I listen to rock & need good isolation. Are there any other details I'm missing for when I'm looking for an IEM?


----------



## Inks

There is not best, get your preferences together and go from there.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Does anybody know if there is a cap to the ignore list?


 

 Only one way to find out...


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Please, read the reviews in this thread before asking questions. Joker's worked very hard to compile a very large list of IEMs in this thread, all with prices and value scores.


 
   
  Thanks, didn't think it needed to be said but I sure am glad I didn't have to say it.
   


  Quote: 





jinx20001 said:


> what an awesome collection of reviews! would be great to see the se535 in there and triple fi 10. the IE8 value should be updated because its miles cheaper than anything else in its firing line here in the UK. se535 RRP £370, IE8 RRP £170 screams great value. shame its more expensive over the pond. brilliant work keep it up!


 

  Thanks. The TF10 is on the to-do list (and has been for longer than I care to admit).
   
  Prices around the world do vary quite a bit for some gear and I can't even keep on top of US prices at times. There's a disclaimer about international prices somewhere on the first page. Value scores are always open to interpretation based on the best price you can find.



  Quote: 





lempelig said:


> Wondering if I might ask you a question joker? (Other are of course very welcome to answer as well)
> 
> I'm coming from the UE700, which I liked a lot, but unfortunately they broke and then got stolen.
> What I'm looking for in my next IEM is speed, tight bass, transparant sound, detailed, over the ear fit, topnotch build and easy to drive, source and amp is my iPod Classic 6. gen.
> ...


 

  I would go the CK10 route as well. I can't find my UE foamies at the moment but comparing the two side by side the CK10 nozzle is a hair thicker but doesn't have the flange of the UE nozzle. I'd say any tips that fit the UE700 should fit the CK10.
   


  Quote: 





ickayr said:


> So I saw all the reviews for IEM's in between $60-100 & it seems like the highest reviewed are the
> Sunrise sw-xcape
> Ficsher audio silver bullet
> Higi Man
> ...


 
   
  There is no best; just different. The Xcape is currently undergoing revision and I don't know what the new one sounds like. The rest are awesome earphones and I think you'd be happy with any one of them. The PR401 is probably the most 'rock'-oriented if you judge by EQ presets. If you value isolation more than sound quality the Ety MC5 might be worth looking at as well.
   
  Edit: Inks beat me to it


----------



## Lempelig

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would go the CK10 route as well. I can't find my UE foamies at the moment but comparing the two side by side the CK10 nozzle is a hair thicker but doesn't have the flange of the UE nozzle. I'd say any tips that fit the UE700 should fit the CK10.


 

  Awesome, thanks!
  Ordering now ^_^


----------



## ickayR

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Only one way to find out...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Is there anyway I can buy the ones you reviewed? Seems like it had the best ratings for that price. Did you review the Ety MC5?


----------



## RADI0HEAD

lempelig said:


> What I'm looking for in my next IEM is speed, tight bass, transparant sound, detailed, over the ear fit, topnotch build and easy to drive, source and amp is my iPod Classic 6. gen.



Sounds like the CK10.


----------



## ickayR

Anyone know where I can buy the Xcapes v1? Online or retailer?


----------



## carfentanil

What do you guys think about adding the SW XCape to my collection as a low-budget improvement over Sony's MDR EX300?


----------



## ickayR

Is there anyway I can buy the Xcapes v1? Or should I look for other IEM's?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> What do you guys think about adding the SW XCape to my collection as a low-budget improvement over Sony's MDR EX300?


 
   
  Most of the good $50-80 in-ears are an improvement over the EX300. It's worth noting that the Xcape has a lot less bass, however, and that the v1 Xcape which was reviewed here is no longer available.
   


  Quote: 





ickayr said:


> Is there anyway I can buy the Xcapes v1? Or should I look for other IEM's?


 

 Can't think of a way other than the FS forum.


----------



## Shufny

Quote: 





ickayr said:


> Is there anyway I can buy the Xcapes v1? Or should I look for other IEM's?


 


  You should contact GD AudioBase, I think it is still the v1. I loaned my v2 to a v1 owner last week, he said it's not that big of a difference. I shall hear it myself next week. (bass is bumped a bit)

 I thought you had one incoming ljokerl. What's up with that?


----------



## carfentanil

Ok, I was satisfied with my EX300 but am appreciating the weaknesses of it. What I want in the long run is an easy-to drive, dynamic (if practical) IEM that has the spaciousness and punchy~detailed fluidity that I get out of the Altec Lansing ATP3 computer speakers, without the signature being overly analytical. Portable durability is a significant consideration. The Sony EX1000 sounds like the ideal, but the geometry might get in the way ...My collection runs the gamut - I don't have a lot of Jazz or Rap, but what I have of them is good at putting the phones through a 'punishing demonstration.' ps. I woud love high vocals to be exceptionally clear...violins too...
   
  What is the distinct difference in the following, besides shape and price?

*Interested in for long-long term...*
  Sony EX1000
  EQ-7
  SM3
  Westone 4
  ER4S
   
*Upgrades on a budget:*
  RE-Zero
  Sunrise XCape, (if obtainable)
  Meelectronics CC51


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shufny said:


> I thought you had one incoming ljokerl. What's up with that?


 

 It was supposed to be forwarded through Ethan @ bugden but never got to me. I'll probably get another one sent out soon enough.

  
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> Ok, I was satisfied with my EX300 but am appreciating the weaknesses of it. What I want in the long run is an easy-to drive, dynamic (if practical) IEM that has the spaciousness and punchy~detailed fluidity that I get out of the Altec Lansing ATP3 computer speakers, without the signature being overly analytical. Portable durability is a significant consideration. The Sony EX1000 sounds like the ideal, but the geometry might get in the way ...My collection runs the gamut - I don't have a lot of Jazz or Rap, but what I have of them is good at putting the phones through a 'punishing demonstration.' ps. I woud love high vocals to be exceptionally clear...violins too...
> 
> What is the distinct difference in the following, besides shape and price?
> 
> ...


 

 For spacious, punchy, and detailed <$100 the ECCI PR401 is probably worth looking into as well. 
   
  For the rest of them, just read the reviews on the front page. There's more to each than price and shape.


----------



## victorbrt

Joker,
   
  I don't know what is my favorite sound signature. The only thing that i can say is that i like a good bass with impact (but i'm not a basshead) and good highs. I listen most to rock and what a like when the music goes on is the energy of guitar (probaly because of good highs?).
   
  And i want a good instrument separation too, because my actual IEM (the CKM55) is bad in this aspect.
   
  How you compare the ECCI PR401 and Brainwavz M3 in sound (bass / mids / highs)? What is the sound signature of both?
   
  My price range is up to $150.


----------



## ickayR

shufny said:


> You should contact GD AudioBase, I think it is still the v1. I loaned my v2 to a v1 owner last week, he said it's not that big of a difference. I shall hear it myself next week. (bass is bumped a bit)
> 
> I thought you had one incoming ljokerl. What's up with that?




"This product has been discounted due to the dented box. "

Any other places I can buy em at?

Joker,when will your Xcapes v2 review be up?


----------



## Selenium

Thought about making a new thread, but figured I'd just post in here instead. I'm in the market for a decent IEM. Today I bought the Kilpsch S4 somewhat on an impulse, and they are just too bassy and warm. I haven't burned them in the necessary 100+ or so hours I've seen people recommending on here(obviously), but I can't imagine the sound changing too terribly much from what is is now. They're so bassy it feels like it's bleeding into the midrange, and they're also a bit sibilant at times. I suppose the sibilance might go away with burn in. I would just prefer something with a little more clarity.
   
  I listen to lots of different kinds of music so I'd like it to be relatively versatile. Listening to trip-hop with the S4s is OK...classical, not so much. I also listen to rap, metal, indie, acoustic, electronic, folk, singer-songwriter, etc. etc. So maybe something more balanced would be best? I do find the S4s to be comfy, and they isolate pretty well.
   
  I already dropped $80 on the S4s, so that's my budget pretty much.


----------



## KimChee

I know I've seen plenty of other reviews on it, but I'd like to see a TF 10 make it on this review thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ickayr said:


> Joker,when will your Xcapes v2 review be up?


 

 See above:
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It [Xcape v2] was supposed to be forwarded through Ethan @ bugden but never got to me. I'll probably get another one sent out soon enough.


 



  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *victorbrt* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> How you compare the ECCI PR401 and Brainwavz M3 in sound (bass / mids / highs)? What is the sound signature of both?
> 
> My price range is up to $150.


 

 There are reviews of both on the front page of the thread. M3 is pretty balanced with maybe a tough of forwardness in the mids. The PR401 is mildly v-shaped with emphasis on mid-bass and treble.


  Quote: 





selenium said:


> Thought about making a new thread, but figured I'd just post in here instead. I'm in the market for a decent IEM. Today I bought the Kilpsch S4 somewhat on an impulse, and they are just too bassy and warm. I haven't burned them in the necessary 100+ or so hours I've seen people recommending on here(obviously), but I can't imagine the sound changing too terribly much from what is is now. They're so bassy it feels like it's bleeding into the midrange, and they're also a bit sibilant at times. I suppose the sibilance might go away with burn in. I would just prefer something with a little more clarity.
> 
> I listen to lots of different kinds of music so I'd like it to be relatively versatile. Listening to trip-hop with the S4s is OK...classical, not so much. I also listen to rap, metal, indie, acoustic, electronic, folk, singer-songwriter, etc. etc. So maybe something more balanced would be best? I do find the S4s to be comfy, and they isolate pretty well.
> 
> I already dropped $80 on the S4s, so that's my budget pretty much.


 

 M3, CC51, PR401, Silver Bullets would pretty much be the usual suspects. None of them have as much bass or are as sibilant as the S4. If you really want balance than the RE0 but it seems like you aren't too sure yet.


  Quote: 





kimchee said:


> I know I've seen plenty of other reviews on it, but I'd like to see a TF 10 make it on this review thread.


 
  ,
 It's on the to-do list (see post #8 on the front page)


----------



## Pianist

Joker, I just read your review of the FX700 and although I agree about your take on their bass and mids, I disagree with your description of the treble and soundstage and with your overall rating of this IEM. Did you burn the FX700 in before reviewing? Personally, I find the treble on them is very soft and smooth and not at all emphasized in relation to the mids. In fact, the balance between mids and treble on the FX700 is probably the best I've ever heard in an IEM. I do agree that the bass is emphasized, but the treble is not to my ears. I also disagree about the soundstage - I think FX700 has a grand soundstage in all directions. It has better depth than any IEM I've heard and width and height is right up there with the very best. FX700 also has something that only one other IEM, the Shure SE530 has to my ears and that is the huge dynamic range. The dynamics are flawless on FX700 and make music sound so relaxed its unbelievable.
   
  I also disagree with your rating of this IEM, in particular how you rate it relative to the other IEMs. I don't think DBA-02 comes that close to FX700 for example. I think FX700 is in a different league SQ wise. I also don't think SM3 is better than FX700. Actually, I think that FX700 is in a different league from SM3 too because FX700 destroys SM3 in dynamics, soundstage and timbre IMO.
   
  Of course we could say "That's OK, it's just a matter of personal preference." But what my ears are telling me right now as I am listening to the FX700 is that it is not a matter of preference - the dynamic driver in the FX700 coupled with the fine tuned wooden housing is simply better technically that what BA drivers are capable of. FX700 doesn't leave any chances for BAs in timbre soundstage and dynamics. Its wooden housing creates reverberations that BAs cannot due to their design and the vent at the back creates a sense of air, dynamic range and bass impact that BAs can only artificially mimic.


----------



## Selenium

Thanks a lot, will check them all out. I'd also like something with really good isolation as I'll be using these when mowing the lawn.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> M3, CC51, PR401, Silver Bullets would pretty much be the usual suspects. None of them have as much bass or are as sibilant as the S4. If you really want balance than the RE0 but it seems like you aren't too sure yet.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Thanks a lot, will check them all out. I'd also like something with really good isolation as I'll be using these when mowing the lawn.


 

 He has an isolation score for all of his reviewed IEMs as well.


----------



## hombredelsaco

Hi Joker,
   
  Thank you for your hard work, i am enjoying your multireview very much.


----------



## Selenium

Yes...I realize that. Just thought I'd throw that out there since people here tend to want as much info as possible when making recommendations.
  
  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> He has an isolation score for all of his reviewed IEMs as well.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Thanks a lot, will check them all out. I'd also like something with really good isolation as I'll be using these when mowing the lawn.


 

 Isnt that a bit dangerous?


----------



## Selenium

Why would that be dangerous? I suppose if an airplane with failed engines is rapidly descending upon my lawn it might be, but otherwise? lol
  
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Isnt that a bit dangerous?


----------



## UserFriendly

For the wear style, is the bold one the preferred one?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> For the wear style, is the bold one the preferred one?


 


  The one I prefer, yes.


----------



## juneblaize

Excellent coverage on the various equipment... love it


----------



## victorbrt

Quote: 





			
				ljoker said:
			
		

> l /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> There are reviews of both on the front page of the thread. M3 is pretty balanced with maybe a tough of forwardness in the mids. The PR401 is mildly v-shaped with emphasis on mid-bass and treble.


 

 Joker,
   
  It seems to me that I finally understand what i want and i finally decided. I will pick the PR401.
   
  Hearing to CKM55 today with very attention i see what i like on their sound - is the sparkle highs and the bass (i don't know if is mid bass, but is from drums of bands like Pink Floyd, Dire Straits, Eagles...). But i hear too the harsh highs and sibilance on them, and now i understand what these words mean, hehehe. It's good to see that my ears have detected these weakness of my IEM, because i while back i can't hear this things or ignored it. I'm very new to sound and don't know very much.
   
  I look to emphasis on treble, bass and great instrumental separation. The ECCI PR401 seems to have this and i have a feeling that i don't will be dissaponted with them because of good reviews around there, include your review. It's is proballly much better than my actual IEM, i have no doubt of that.
   
  Thank for your multi-review, it's the most complete review i see around here.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Joker,
> 
> It seems to me that I finally understand what i want and i finally decided. I will pick the PR401.
> 
> ...


 

 That's not a good thing for you. Now you start down the slippery slope... sorry about your wallet!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





juneblaize said:


> Excellent coverage on the various equipment... love it


 

 Thanks!


  Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> It seems to me that I finally understand what i want and i finally decided. I will pick the PR401.
> 
> Hearing to CKM55 today with very attention i see what i like on their sound - is the sparkle highs and the bass (i don't know if is mid bass, but is from drums of bands like Pink Floyd, Dire Straits, Eagles...). But i hear too the harsh highs and sibilance on them, and now i understand what these words mean, hehehe. It's good to see that my ears have detected these weakness of my IEM, because i while back i can't hear this things or ignored it. I'm very new to sound and don't know very much.
> 
> ...


 

 Great choice! Hopefully you'll be able to listen to the CKM55 and PR401 side by side to see how they differ. There's really no better way to get down into the thick of things than with comparative listening.


----------



## victorbrt

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> Great choice! Hopefully you'll be able to listen to the CKM55 and PR401 side by side to see how they differ. There's really no better way to get down into the thick of things than with comparative listening.


 
  True fact! In sound, there's no way better to compare than hear side-by-side. That's why i think is so hard to decide for a new headphone or IEM.
   
  I will post here telling of what i think about PR401 and how much he is better than CKM55.
   
  And Aflac, my wallet got threatened in the first listen with CKM55, hahaha. Since then, i got addicted to look for the sound nirvana like everyone.


----------



## RBNHIFI

I agree.  no better way than to compare side by side.  However the wallet takes a bit of a beating.  Its also worth keeping in mind Jokers impression of the IEMs as you hear them.  I.e you'll get to understand what joker considers to have too much/little bass, forward/recessed mids etc.  This in turn should make future purchases much easier.


----------



## Selenium

Just wanted to thank Joker for all the work he's put into this. It's been very helpful. I've pretty much decided on the CC51. I'm going to sleep on it, but that's my decision. And yes I'll be careful with the shirt clip.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Denon AH-C360 & H2O Audio Surge Pro Mini (waterproof BA-based earphone).
  
  Quote: 





selenium said:


> Just wanted to thank Joker for all the work he's put into this. It's been very helpful. I've pretty much decided on the CC51. I'm going to sleep on it, but that's my decision. And yes I'll be careful with the shirt clip.


 

 Awesome


----------



## RADI0HEAD

selenium said:


> Just wanted to thank Joker for all the work he's put into this. It's been very helpful.



A big +1. It should be a sticky. I'm constantly referring to it. Very grateful, a huge service to this community. Thanks!


----------



## UserFriendly

The cheapest I can find the *Audio-Technica ATH-CK10 *is $275 on ebay, I can't find it on adorama.com, like you said


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Hey ljokerl, you accidentally labeled both of the new additions with "3A49" in the main review... Just thought you'd like to know


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


radi0head said:


> A big +1. It should be a sticky. I'm constantly referring to it. Very grateful, a huge service to this community. Thanks!


 
 Good to hear, thanks
   
   
  Quote:


userfriendly said:


> The cheapest I can find the *Audio-Technica ATH-CK10 *is $275 on ebay, I can't find it on adorama.com, like you said


 
 I really can't keep up with the ever-changing prices so I've long since stopped trying. Quick google search shows a price of $250 on accessoryjack though.
   

 Quote:


50an6xy06r6n said:


> Hey ljokerl, you accidentally labeled both of the new additions with "3A49" in the main review... Just thought you'd like to know


 
 Thanks, fixed.


----------



## Ikarios

While we're on fixing things, the Phonak Audeo PFE review no longer has a picture.


----------



## Marcus_C

Thanks for posting the surge pro review, it sounds pretty spot on as usual. It's good to have them compared to other BA phones in their range, I did wonder how they compared to something like the pl50, probably not well but they're about the same price across the pond at least.
   
  Do you ever get to actually enjoy your music???


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> While we're on fixing things, the Phonak Audeo PFE review no longer has a picture.


 

 That one's entirely on imageshack - they lost some of my images from the old multi-thread before I started backing them up myself.
   
  Quote: 





marcus_c said:


> Do you ever get to actually enjoy your music???


 
  Sometimes I can't help it, which is why I have no ETA on when the Miracle review will be posted


----------



## UserFriendly

Can you review http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/IE40.htmlasdfasdf
      and the Shure SE535s? and the Shure SE535s?
   
  And for the Westone 3 reviews, it says 9./10 for the sound.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> Can you review http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/IE40.htmlasdfasdf
> and the Shure SE535s? and the Shure SE535s?
> 
> And for the Westone 3 reviews, it says 9./10 for the sound.


 

 The IE40 is the same thing as the Triple.fi 10, which Joker is working on. The Westone 3 is likely supposed to be 9.4 (from the chart). Unless someone sends him an SE535 it doesn't look like he's going to review one anytime soon (although I would also love to see a review of the 535).


----------



## UserFriendly

How are the IE40s the same as the TF10s?


----------



## kidcharlemagne

They're rebrands.


----------



## excelsior

joker, i hate u for making me want to buy another equip
  jk lol 
   
   
  i just ordered beyer dt 235 and still waiting for it
  and now i see your post about xears and tempted to buy one because of price reduction and free ship to germany 
   
  will it be a significance upgrade from beta brainwav pro??
  actually im already planning to buy iem too after buying headphone but not so soon... 
   
  and now this xears deal make me cannot sleep..hahaha
  especially blackwood iii which you recommended
  need opinion should i hurt my wallet or should i force myself to be happy with my current beta brainwav?? (i thought that xears often have this kind of deals, no??)
  i dont hate or love my current iem...just nothing special from it i think
   
  thanx


----------



## lazuline

edit: Just noticed the ie40 is discontinued. I still would like to know where to get UE double flange tips like the ones that came with these. I'm guessing the tf10 at some point had double flange tips in an earlier version.
   
  Honestly, I'm more curious about the new se215 than the se535 (multiple head-fiers have posted impressions and reviews). I think ljokerl posted earlier that he doesn't like Shure because they're overpriced. My only experience with Shure is from their headphones (440/840) olive tips, and mics, so I'd love to see if these are worth $100 or just $30 iems with $70 in build quality and branding.
  
  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> The IE40 is the same thing as the Triple.fi 10, which Joker is working on. The Westone 3 is likely supposed to be 9.4 (from the chart). Unless someone sends him an SE535 it doesn't look like he's going to review one anytime soon (although I would also love to see a review of the 535).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *excelsior* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> i just ordered beyer dt 235 and still waiting for it
> and now i see your post about xears and tempted to buy one because of price reduction and free ship to germany
> ...


 

 The TD-III is on a whole another level compared to the Beta Brainwavz. It's been a very long time since I've heard the Brainwavz (and they've obviously been discontinued) but I remember having a hard time picking the better earphone between them and the Soundmagic PL30. I still have the PL30 and between that and the TD-III there's just no contest. If you want to upgrade to a more bass-heavy earphone, I'd say the Xears deal is as good as any.


----------



## Prazzyp

i wanted to know what the warranty on the monster turbine headphones are? i heard that the pro versions' and the orginals warranty differ


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> i wanted to know what the warranty on the monster turbine headphones are? i heard that the pro versions' and the orginals warranty differ


 
   
  The Turbines itself has a 2 year warranty (limited). Although the Pros/Davis Tribute has a Lifetime Warranty.


----------



## ljokerl

^ I think it's three years for the regular turbines, just like the Jamz/Lil Jamz/Beats Tour. The Pro Gold/Copper and Miles Davis have lifetime limited warranty plus one-time no-questions-asked replacement.


----------



## JxK

Joker, this might be a different sort of question than what you usually get, but I'm wondering which IEMs do you find most comfortable? Is it your customs, or your ck10? Something else? I know everyone always espouses the virtues of a custom IEMs fit and comfort, but personally I can't help but think that they might feel a bit intrusive. Especially the fact that they fill up your ear, unlike the smaller universals which basically just sit in your ear canal. What's your experience been?


----------



## Smallville

When should we be expecting the review of the VSonic GR07? It seems like a great IEM from ClieOS's review and I was just wondering how it matches up to other IEMs in that price range.
   
  These threads must kill your free time and your wallet. 160 IEMs is crazy!


----------



## LostOne.TR

whoa, been gone for awhile and now it seems that there's a few new ones to try out : D
 Heard the eq-7 recently, and the sony MDR-EX1000 recently. Too short a listen to have a concrete impression, but liking what I heard.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> Which IEM would you recommend if vocals is important. I dont listen to instrumental music like dance or classical. All music i hear is with people singing in it. What kind of characteristics should i look for in a IEM?
> 
> budget max 100$.


 


   


  Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> PL-50


 


  thats the same question i wanted to ask. good thing that my pl50 are already on their way
   
  is there something from meelec that would match those needs? how about the a151? budget up to $75 (as the a151) would be ok but i can consider higher prices too. over-the-ear if possible , for less-microphonics
  or maybe there's no match for the pl50 at that price?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Joker, this might be a different sort of question than what you usually get, but I'm wondering which IEMs do you find most comfortable? Is it your customs, or your ck10? Something else? I know everyone always espouses the virtues of a custom IEMs fit and comfort, but personally I can't help but think that they might feel a bit intrusive. Especially the fact that they fill up your ear, unlike the smaller universals which basically just sit in your ear canal. What's your experience been?


 
   
  The answer to this might be surprising but I think it's the dB Logic EP-100 with Shure Olives, and I'll explain why.
   
  I think there's a comfort 'ceiling' at which point an IEM simply disappears when worn. Several models reach that point for me, including my full-shell customs (assuming they are properly fitted, of course), my Ety HF3 w/custom tips, the CK10, the smaller Westones (W1 & W2), q-JAYS, dB Logic EP-100s, and a few others. As long as I am doing my listening while upright & stationary, all of these simply vanish. From there the major difference is how comfortable they remain under abnormal listening conditions, such as while lying on the side. I don't mind sleeping in my customs (unless your impressions were bad customs should only feel intrusive while inserting/removing them) but I do feel them pressing against my ear. Same goes for the Westones. The q-JAYS remain mostly unaffected except for one thing - they have a tendency to shift insertion angle when the cord gets tugged slightly. It's not a huge issue but it does mean they are less secure, staying in mostly by virtue of seal alone. Which brings me to the EP-100 - they are absolutely tiny (about 50% smaller than the CK10), don't require a particularly deep seal like the CK10s do, and sound pretty much the same at any insertion angle. If I had to wear an earphone 24/7 for whatever reason, it would be the EP-100.


  Quote: 





smallville said:


> When should we be expecting the review of the VSonic GR07? It seems like a great IEM from ClieOS's review and I was just wondering how it matches up to other IEMs in that price range.
> 
> These threads must kill your free time and your wallet. 160 IEMs is crazy!


 

 Some time next week. It is a very good IEM (one of the few well-balanced dynamics) and may be the only dynamic-driver earphone suitable for pro monitoring use. 
   

  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> is there something from meelec that would match those needs? how about the a151? budget up to $75 (as the a151) would be ok but i can consider higher prices too. over-the-ear if possible , for less-microphonics
> or maybe there's no match for the pl50 at that price?


 
   
  The A151 and PL50 actually use the same driver but the A151 is tuned differently and I think has a more airy presentation and more bottom-end presence. There was an A151 review posted a few days ago (by DervishD I think) that compared the two. The PL50 is still hard to beat at its price and brand-name products that perform at the PL50/A151 level (i.e. Westone 1) will cost you more.


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The Turbines itself has a 2 year warranty (limited). Although the Pros/Davis Tribute has a Lifetime Warranty.


 

 ok thank you


----------



## Prazzyp

Will you be able to do the sennheiser CX95's?
   
  thanks in advance


----------



## Ikarios

Joker, how much does tip selection affect the sound on the DBA-02 and the CK10? I just received my Ck10 today and compared to my DBA-02, they have a far more balanced sound IMO. The DBA-02 has very "sizzly" treble, and is super forward, whereas the Ck10 is a little bit "slower" in the treble but isn't as sizzly; it's still a little forward but the fact that there's more bass helps to alleviate the treble fatigue. I'm using the same Monster foam Supertips on each one - a medium for my left ear and a small for my right ear (different sized ear canals, although the difference between M and S for foam supertips is not big at all). I'm just wondering if the supertips change the sound, since my findings seem to go against your findings (you said that the CK10 would be bordering sibilant, whereas the DBA-02 is more balanced for you). I do not have any of the recommended tips for either of these - no Sony Hybrids, Shure Olives, Shure single-flanges, nor Ety triple flanges.


----------



## TMMC

Hi |joker|, 
   
  I'm really curious about the SM2's review. It takes a long time to get used to them, but I still prefer them to my other in-ears in my inventory. 
   
  Will it take more time than the others in-ears review? Will it be published shortly?
   
  Keep the good work, congrats.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> Will you be able to do the sennheiser CX95's?
> 
> thanks in advance


 

 No plans for a CX95 review at the moment
   


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Joker, how much does tip selection affect the sound on the DBA-02 and the CK10? I just received my Ck10 today and compared to my DBA-02, they have a far more balanced sound IMO. The DBA-02 has very "sizzly" treble, and is super forward, whereas the Ck10 is a little bit "slower" in the treble but isn't as sizzly; it's still a little forward but the fact that there's more bass helps to alleviate the treble fatigue. I'm using the same Monster foam Supertips on each one - a medium for my left ear and a small for my right ear (different sized ear canals, although the difference between M and S for foam supertips is not big at all). I'm just wondering if the supertips change the sound, since my findings seem to go against your findings (you said that the CK10 would be bordering sibilant, whereas the DBA-02 is more balanced for you). I do not have any of the recommended tips for either of these - no Sony Hybrids, Shure Olives, Shure single-flanges, nor Ety triple flanges.


 

 A lot - tips definitely have the potential to modify a sound signature but there are other variables such as ear canal shape, insertion depth & angle, etc. Tips aside there are still response differences between the CK10 and DBA-02. The treble peaks of the CK10 come in higher up on the frequency response - it is quite possible that you are not as sensitive there as lower down where the DBA's emphasis comes in. The Ck10 also has flatter bass response. I have no idea how supertips mesh with either earphone but the CK10 definitely needs a very good seal to sounds its best. It's easy to get that sort of seal with trips but I manage with Hybrids because my ear canals are nearly large enough to swallow the CK10 whole.


  Quote: 





tmmc said:


> Hi |joker|,
> 
> I'm really curious about the SM2's review. It takes a long time to get used to them, but I still prefer them to my other in-ears in my inventory.
> 
> ...


 


  Aiming for next week with the SM2 review but I'm busier than usual these days and the backlog just keeps growing. Can't say I prefer the SM2 to the SM3 though.


----------



## noobpower2

is there a sonic difference between wood and metal casing? also, do you think the wood design such as those in xears and thinksounds would last  in the long term? even tho they look ok, for me the wood looks kinda flimsy in most of the pictures.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> I'm just wondering if the supertips change the sound, since my findings seem to go against your findings (you said that the CK10 would be bordering sibilant, whereas the DBA-02 is more balanced for you).


 

 Tips are huge on the CK10, DBA, Etys.  I'm with Joker on the CK10/DBA impressions.  CK10 treble was too much for me but had more bass extension.  Despit the roll off, DBA bass is more impactful and punchier with a bit more body to the overall sound signature for my ears.  Gives it a more rounded natural sound whereas the CK10 is a bit leaner but has better texture.  CK10 has more body than the ER4 though.  YMMV.


----------



## jiddu

Well I finally got my nuforce 700, plugged them into my i9 and.. I gots bass! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  But seriously, between the HT setup and the HFI780 at the computer, this portable setup will fit in much better than I had ever hoped for.  Thanks for this thread!
   
  However I have to say, as a first time IEM user, sticking stuff deep into my ears like that feels really wrong, I only do it cause the sound that comes out is pretty great.


----------



## victorbrt

Joker, just for curiosity: the HJE900 is much better than ECCI PR401?
   
  Because same have the same signature (i guess), i'm wondering how they compare!


----------



## Selenium

So I just got my CC51 and the clip was already attached to the cable. Was that the case for those of you who've had this IEM?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The A151 and PL50 actually use the same driver but the A151 is tuned differently and I think has a more airy presentation and more bottom-end presence. There was an A151 review posted a few days ago (by DervishD I think) that compared the two. The PL50 is still hard to beat at its price and brand-name products that perform at the PL50/A151 level (i.e. Westone 1) will cost you more.


 

 ok thanks.
  the thing is that the pl50 are free-shipping , and the a151 are $20 + for shipping (to here),
  so it would be around $100 for the a151. so should i consider something else for $100 with lower shipping? or just try to get a lower shipping for the meelec? (i;ve read they have low low microphonics so maybe they are worth)
   
  forgot to ask! does anyone has some pictures for comparig the size of pl50 and a151? i've seen that the pl50 are really small (which is a good point for me)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





noobpower2 said:


> is there a sonic difference between wood and metal casing? also, do you think the wood design such as those in xears and thinksounds would last  in the long term? even tho they look ok, for me the wood looks kinda flimsy in most of the pictures.


 


  To know for sure I would need to compare two sets of earphones/headphones that are 100% identical except for housing material. That means same cable, same drivers, same hardware, same venting, and same chamber size, but one in wood and one in metal. Since such a pair, to the best of my knowledge, does not exist, I really can't say for sure. However, most manufacturers certainly try to tune their wooden models a certain way, and it shows.
  As for durability, as long as the wood is well-finished and sealed correctly, I don't expect any issues. The Xears TD-III actually feels more solid to me than its metal TD100 cousin. 


  Quote: 





jiddu said:


> Well I finally got my nuforce 700, plugged them into my i9 and.. I gots bass!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Glad you like the NE700s. Assuming you've picked the right tip size, you'll get used to the fit after a while. I used to hate Ety triple-flanges because they felt intrusive but now I can wear my HF3s deep enough to tickle my brain like nobody's business.


  Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Joker, just for curiosity: the HJE900 is much better than ECCI PR401?
> 
> Because same have the same signature (i guess), i'm wondering how they compare!


 

 Yes, they share a sound signature. I do think the HJE900 is a little better but it costs a lot more now. The most noticeable difference would be in aggressiveness - the HJE900 is quite forward and explosive. Listening to it can be like trying to hang on to a bucking bull. The PR401 is a but more relaxed and gentle. I also think the HJE900 has slightly better timbre and speed, not that the PR401 is slow. Orange1 described the differences in her own (whimsical) way a while back:
   
   

  Quote: 





orange1 said:


> *HJE900 vs. ECCI 401*​  ​  ​  Joker asked if I could give my impressions of the two.  I own the CZ's (HJE900).  I describe them as FUN the FUNNEST, see that word as billboard sized.  They are heavily theatrical.  You get a deep bass it is subwoofer in impact.  It is spherical, it is like being at the circus and watching the instruments swing from the trapeze, lots of oohs and ahhhs. When you are listening to music it is an EVENT at times stunning.  So what happened why would I ever want another?
> 
> I've changed, I'm more mellow myself, contemplative.  I felt that I was getting sensory overload and wanted something more relaxed.
> 
> ...


 

    
   
  Quote:


selenium said:


> So I just got my CC51 and the clip was already attached to the cable. Was that the case for those of you who've had this IEM?


 

 I think all MEElec IEMs ship with the clip attached. If you're going to take it off, be very careful and maybe bend the little tab that holds the cable in place beforehand.


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> ok thanks.
> the thing is that the pl50 are free-shipping , and the a151 are $20 + for shipping (to here),
> so it would be around $100 for the a151. so should i consider something else for $100 with lower shipping? or just try to get a lower shipping for the meelec? (i;ve read they have low low microphonics so maybe they are worth)
> 
> forgot to ask! does anyone has some pictures for comparig the size of pl50 and a151? i've seen that the pl50 are really small (which is a good point for me)


 

 Sorry, don't have a PL50 with me to take photos. But yes, the soundmagics are quite a bit smaller. There are other good IEMs with free shipping in that price range - ECCI PR401, Brainwavz M3, etc etc.


----------



## kanuka

checked!
  what about over-ear design at that range? "in angle tube" (like the pl50 and a151, hope u get what i mean) , not straight if possible


----------



## Selenium

Thanks. I think I'll keep it attached for a while and see how I like it. This thing has far less microphonics than the Kilpsch S4. With the S4, if no music was playing and I moved around(wearing them cable-down, of course), all I could hear was "WAAAAAHHHH WOOOOOOSH", but not so much with the CC51. They're a bit bassier than I expected, but nothing I can't live with.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think all MEElec IEMs ship with the clip attached. If you're going to take it off, be very careful and maybe bend the little tab that holds the cable in place beforehand.


----------



## RADI0HEAD

anaxilus said:


> Tips are huge on the CK10, DBA, Etys.  I'm with Joker on the CK10/DBA impressions.  CK10 treble was too much for me but had more bass extension.  Despit the roll off, DBA bass is more impactful and punchier with a bit more body to the overall sound signature for my ears.  Gives it a more rounded natural sound whereas the CK10 is a bit leaner but has better texture.  CK10 has more body than the ER4 though.  YMMV.



I agree with both of you, tips make a huge difference with the CK10.(haven't heard the DBAs yet but from what I've read is they are quite similar)

Even different triples make a big difference. For example, using the knock-off Monster triples with their larger diameter holes pass through too much treble for my liking. When using triples from Shure, Ety and earplugstore their smaller diameter opening cut back on treble response. Its a very noticeable difference.


----------



## evanatch

Hey, great thread. It's been very helpful and informative. I have a quick question, if you have the time:
  How would you compare the regular Turbine and the Turbine Pro Copper in:
  -Balance
  -Bass quantity
  -Speed
  -Detail
  -Clarity
  Also, are the Pro Coppers good IEMs for Rock and Metal music? I've been looking at IEMs in the sub-$250 price range, but I saw the $99 dollar deal for these refurbished and I'm very tempted. I have the regular Turbines and for the $40 I got them for, they're pretty good, but I think they can be too bassy.


----------



## Ikarios

I also saw the $99 deal and jumped on the Coppers as soon as I could; I did some more reading and I became more interested in the Gold signature, but I had already made the order for the Coppers and couldn't make another one for the Gold. From the descriptions it sounds like the Copper is a more V-shaped IEM whereas the Gold is more like a refined Turbine. Does this sound about right?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> I also saw the $99 deal and jumped on the Coppers as soon as I could; I did some more reading and I became more interested in the Gold signature, but I had already made the order for the Coppers and couldn't make another one for the Gold. From the descriptions it sounds like the Copper is a more V-shaped IEM whereas the Gold is more like a refined Turbine. Does this sound about right?


 

 Sounds about right.  The Coppers are kinda V-shaped but think of the mids as being neutral rather than recessed like the HJE900 or TF10.  Of the Pro line they do the best with speed and detail but I think the mids are a bit dry whereas the treble and bass are more fluid in comparison.  One or two other phones have this same sort of signature.  Some might prefer their vocals less wet like this.


----------



## Prazzyp

will you be able to do the Klipsch X1, i heard they have geat value for money and have great bass too


----------



## ljokerl

Double post.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> checked!
> what about over-ear design at that range? "in angle tube" (like the pl50 and a151, hope u get what i mean) , not straight if possible


 

 Can't think of anything else I've reviewed in the <$100 category with over-the-ear fit, angled nozzles, and sound quality on par with or better than the PL50/A151. Seems like the price of Westone 1s has fallen to <$120 though.


  Quote: 





evanatch said:


> Hey, great thread. It's been very helpful and informative. I have a quick question, if you have the time:
> How would you compare the regular Turbine and the Turbine Pro Copper in:
> -Balance
> -Bass quantity
> ...


 

 Technically, the Coppers are superior to the regular Turbines pretty much right down the list. Don't expect the same ridiculous bass quantity but the MTPC is by no means bass-light. I prefer a more analytical sound for rock and metal but there are many who love the Coppers for rock. Signature preferences trump genre-specific sound signature any day.
   


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> I also saw the $99 deal and jumped on the Coppers as soon as I could; I did some more reading and I became more interested in the Gold signature, but I had already made the order for the Coppers and couldn't make another one for the Gold. From the descriptions it sounds like the Copper is a more V-shaped IEM whereas the Gold is more like a refined Turbine. Does this sound about right?


 
   
  That's about the way I hear them. I agree that the Coppers aren't recessed in the midrange but they do have slightly hyped up bass and treble nonetheless.
   


  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> will you be able to do the Klipsch X1, i heard they have geat value for money and have great bass too


 
   
  X1 is just the UK name for the Klipsch S2. There's a review of them on the front page of this thread. Not bad if you need isolation on the cheap but definitely not anything special.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Can't think of anything else I've reviewed in the <$100 category with over-the-ear fit, angled nozzles, and sound quality on par with or better than the PL50/A151. Seems like the price of Westone 1s has fallen to <$120 though.


 
  really thanks
  double checked those ones. how is their bass as for a armature?
  and they look even bigger  than the a151 , i'm i right?


----------



## lukaleo

when will you finish the IE7 and TF10 reviews  i need em


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Can't think of anything else I've reviewed in the <$100 category with over-the-ear fit, angled nozzles, and sound quality on par with or better than the PL50/A151. Seems like the price of Westone 1s has fallen to <$120 though.


 

 Though I haven't heard it myself, the phonak pfe perfect bass may be another option. Ask clieos about it, as he has tried the pl50, a151, and the pfe perfect bass.
   


  Quote: 





lukaleo said:


> when will you finish the IE7 and TF10 reviews  i need em


 
  I think joker will get them out eventually, but there's no rush. There has been _alot_ written about both the TF10 and IE7 on headfi. Several years worth of posts, impressions and reviews. I think joker will get to them after he gets done with his backlog - though oddly enough it seems to be growing rather than getting smaller
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. But personally, I'd much rather get info of lesser known or available earphones than ones that have been so exhaustively covered.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Though I haven't heard it myself, the phonak pfe perfect bass may be another option. Ask clieos about it, as he has tried the pl50, a151, and the pfe perfect bass.


 
  thanks for the advice
  i checked their price and ... $160 or did i check the wrong one?


----------



## kanuka

im sorry. i searched for the worng one. the ones you mentioned are $89 w/o mic
  same range of the a151.
  i may read/ask clieos thread about them
  thanks


----------



## lukaleo

many reviews, but no comparisons done, no way to know which one i should choose >.<
  
  Quote: 





jxk said:


> Though I haven't heard it myself, the phonak pfe perfect bass may be another option. Ask clieos about it, as he has tried the pl50, a151, and the pfe perfect bass.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> really thanks
> double checked those ones. how is their bass as for a armature?
> and they look even bigger  than the a151 , i'm i right?


 

 The W1 is actually pretty compact. Probably about the same as A151 in terms of volume but a little skinnier and definitely easier to sleep/lie down in. The bass is good - maybe a tad less impactful than A151 but still punchier than PL50. IMO they shine with female vocals.


  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *JxK* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I think joker will get to them after he gets done with his backlog - though oddly enough it seems to be growing rather than getting smaller
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, the backlog does seem to be growing faster than I'm getting through it. I've already cut down on the number of sets purchased myself and haven't requested a manufacturer sample in a month or so. Perhaps it will start shrinking soon though I don't have as much spare time as before.
   
  UE and Senn IEMs are among the most requested but unfortunately they are my own and have to take a back seat to manufacturer review samples and loaner sets. If I can get through the VSonic GR07, e-Q5, Kozee X1, and the entire Beyer line without getting more urgent gear in, I'll step on the UEs and then the Senns.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The W1 is actually pretty compact. Probably about the same as A151 in terms of volume but a little skinnier and definitely easier to sleep/lie down in. The bass is good - maybe a tad less impactful than A151 but still punchier than PL50. IMO *they shine with female vocals.*


 
  
  which ones? the W1 or a151? a listen to j-pop so good female vocals are needed


----------



## ljokerl

I meant the W1.


----------



## kanuka

now it gets interesting. i hope my pl50 will produce good vocals
   
  btw, how are the w1 in microphonics? i saw they also have the cable like the a151, so i guess it has low microph.


----------



## lorafenik

^This question is answered in their review on the 1st page


----------



## kanuka

oops sorry , missed that


----------



## Ethan211

Thank you for putting this thread together, I can barely guess at how many hours of your life you've donated to the community in doing so.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ethan211 said:


> Thank you for putting this thread together


 

 Glad it's been useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
   
  Quote: 





ethan211 said:


> I can barely guess at how many hours of your life you've donated to the community in doing so.


 
  That makes two of us.


----------



## RBNHIFI

Hi Joker,
   
  I have another review request from xears.  They are the xears nature N3.  I have the playaz nature n3 and rank them highly and am wondering if they are based on the same.  Any chance you can get Thomas to send you a sample pair to review?
   
  http://xears.com/en/Nature_N3i_Highend_Iphone_Headset_Mp3_use_69.html


----------



## parshand

[size=medium]Hi. I've been reading your post and its been very helpful but i needed a little more help.
   
  I've read your 1st post;rather I've read the part of it that i can gain access to (strictly sub $50) and its helped me narrow it down to this bunch
   

  -Brainwavz M1
  -ViSang RO2(Brainwavz proAlpha)
  -Sennheiser CX 300II....read elsewhere that these are good
   
  I haven' tested any of these and i won't be able to either in my city so I was hoping you'd bear with me and give me a decisive opinion on which ones i should buy.
  I like *all sorts of music* but i* value detail and clarity for rock more* than heavy thumping bass (that's why I put the M1 on top) but I also need the pair i buy to do reasonably well with trance, pop etc. Also I noticed that you rated the* ViSang higher for build quality (and now even accessories; brainwavz don't come with all those ear-tips anymore)*.
   
  Thats whats playing in my head. Could you straighten it out?​[/size]


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rbnhifi said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I have another review request from xears.  They are the xears nature N3.  I have the playaz nature n3 and rank them highly and am wondering if they are based on the same.  Any chance you can get Thomas to send you a sample pair to review?


 

 Yeah, I wouldn't rule it out.

  
  Quote: 





parshand said:


> [size=medium]Hi. I've been reading your post and its been very helpful but i needed a little more help.
> 
> I've read your 1st post;rather I've read the part of it that i can gain access to (strictly sub $50) and its helped me narrow it down to this bunch
> 
> ...


 

 That seems like a good list except for the Sennheisers, which I've not heard. However, unless the CX300-II is radically better than the CX300, I wouldn't expect much from them. As for the other two, I think you've pretty much got the gist of it. The R02 is a little bassier with slightly more muffled treble while the M1 is more even across the spectrum without losing that midrange emphasis all of the Brainwavz/ViSang earphones have. I like the M1 better myself. The R02 has a better build quality score because it has articulated strain reliefs. Depending on how rough you are with your cable, that may or may not make a difference in the long run. As for accessories, double check with the listing should you choose to purchase them - I really wouldn't know if ViSang decided to switch up the accessories since I don't keep in contact with them.


----------



## victorbrt

Joker, reading the reviews of Tier 2B, your review of Denon CK10 attract my attention. They share a similiar signature to ECCI PR401, right?
   
  Like i said, i have $150 to spend but... your rating of ECCI PR401 (7.9) is better than of Denon C710 (7.6). Do you think that ECCI PR401 is better? Because Denon C710 is $150 and ECCI PR401 is $75.
   
  I found the HJE900 on Seyo Shop for $188, but i guess that they don't worth in this price.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Joker, reading the reviews of Tier 2B, your review of Denon CK10 attract my attention. They share a similiar signature to ECCI PR401, right?
> 
> Like i said, i have $150 to spend but... your rating of ECCI PR401 (7.9) is better than of Denon C710 (7.6). Do you think that ECCI PR401 is better? Because Denon C710 is $150 and ECCI PR401 is $75.


 
   
  While there generally is a correlation between price and performance, the PR401 is just one of many examples of in-ears that perform on-par with pricier sets. Yes, the HJE900, C710, and PR401 are all somewhat v-shaped in response, but at the current prices the ECCIs are just better value.


----------



## Ikarios

Joker, how does the Audio-Technica CK90 stack up against things like the Hifiman RE0/RE-ZERO and Sunrise Xcape V1 in terms of neutrality and overall balance? Your review makes it sound really great and perfect for what I want (very fast, but slightly dark). I really like the CK10's aggressiveness, edge, and detail, but they are just a tiny bit too treble-forward for me, especially with the super-comfortable gel Supertips I use (which seem to boost the treble a little bit). I prefer the balance of the RE-0/RE-ZERO (which IMO sound pretty much the same, except the ZERO has slightly more forward mids, like the Sunrise), but the RE0/ZERO/Xcape don't have enough treble detail or crisp for me (which I attribute to their being dynamics instead of BAs).
   
  Also, do you plan on doing more moving armature sets at some point in the future? Specifically, the Ortofon e-Q5 and the Grado GR8/10. I like your description of the e-Q7 but's above my price range. Thanks!


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Joker, how does the Audio-Technica CK90 stack up against things like the Hifiman RE0/RE-ZERO and Sunrise Xcape V1 in terms of neutrality and overall balance? Your review makes it sound really great and perfect for what I want (very fast, but slightly dark). I really like the CK10's aggressiveness, edge, and detail, but they are just a tiny bit too treble-forward for me, especially with the super-comfortable gel Supertips I use (which seem to boost the treble a little bit). I prefer the balance of the RE-0/RE-ZERO (which IMO sound pretty much the same, except the ZERO has slightly more forward mids, like the Sunrise), but the RE0/ZERO/Xcape don't have enough treble detail or crisp for me (which I attribute to their being dynamics instead of BAs).
> 
> Also, do you plan on doing more moving armature sets at some point in the future? Specifically, the Ortofon e-Q5 and the Grado GR8/10. I like your description of the e-Q7 but's above my price range. Thanks!


 

 You sound like a candidate for the vsonic GR07.  Haven't heard it but the impressions seem to match your needs.  I believe Joker is listening to them atm so he could offer up something.


----------



## Inks

Don't expect more crispness with the EQ5s and presumably the EQ7s/GR10s. The treble is more prominent and a tad more detailed on the RE-Zeros ime. You could try the DBA02s or the GR07s.


----------



## Ikarios

DBA02s were far too bright, although I liked the character of the sound. The frequency balance was just not for me. The CK10 is a big step in the right direction and almost there, but I want that kind of detail and edge in a darker package. The GR07 looks interesting and sounds like it fits my requirements well. If I see one pop up in the FS forums I'll jump on it, but I don't particularly like buying new items when I haven't heard them :\


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> DBA02s were far too bright, although I liked the character of the sound. The frequency balance was just not for me. The CK10 is a big step in the right direction and almost there, but I want that kind of detail and edge in a darker package. The GR07 looks interesting and sounds like it fits my requirements well. If I see one pop up in the FS forums I'll jump on it, but I don't particularly like buying new items when I haven't heard them :\


 

 It is interesting that the DBA was brighter than the CK10 for you.  I know we all hear w/ our curves but which tips were you using on the DBA and the CK10?


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> It is interesting that the DBA was brighter than the CK10 for you.  I know we all hear w/ our curves but which tips were you using on the DBA and the CK10?


 

 With the DBA-02s I tried Comply T100s, Monster foam Supertips, and the stock tips (which were not great). Not even the Comply did much to the treble, it was overbearingly bright. I know I got a good seal with the Complys because my ear canals generally accept small tips, but the Complys were medium and started to put pressure on my ears after a little while. The CK10s are about 2/3 of the way to the RE-ZERO's frequency balance from the DBA-02 (so, significantly more bass and mids). I've been listening to the CK10s with Monster Supertips (foam and gel), the stock tips, and Hifiman small tips. I like the Hifiman tips the best because they smooth out a few of the treble peaks that bother me a little bit, but the Supertips are most comfortable and seem to provide the most detail.
   
  The more I read about the GR07, the more I like it. I really liked the RE262 but it didn't have quite enough treble aggressiveness for me, and the mids were just a tad too forward. The GR07 seems to fix these issues. I'm considering just biting the bullet and buying from Lendmeurears, and taking a small loss if I decide I don't like it and want to sell.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> With the DBA-02s I tried Comply T100s, Monster foam Supertips, and the stock tips (which were not great). Not even the Comply did much to the treble, it was overbearingly bright. I know I got a good seal with the Complys because my ear canals generally accept small tips, but the Complys were medium and started to put pressure on my ears after a little while. The CK10s are about 2/3 of the way to the RE-ZERO's frequency balance from the DBA-02 (so, significantly more bass and mids). I've been listening to the CK10s with Monster Supertips (foam and gel), the stock tips, and Hifiman small tips. I like the Hifiman tips the best because they smooth out a few of the treble peaks that bother me a little bit, but the Supertips are most comfortable and seem to provide the most detail.
> 
> The more I read about the GR07, the more I like it. I really liked the RE262 but it didn't have quite enough treble aggressiveness for me, and the mids were just a tad too forward. The GR07 seems to fix these issues. I'm considering just biting the bullet and buying from Lendmeurears, and taking a small loss if I decide I don't like it and want to sell.


 

 Just curious.  Despite seal, did you get a deep Ety like insertion?  I do think the GR07 looks interesting.  The question is whether having the ES5 and IERM it makes sense for me to go w/ the GR07 over the Xcape v.1 as a backup.  Or perhaps even the FX700 I've always longed for.
   
  One reason I have never sold my Sony CD2K was it's bio-cellulose drivers.  If the GR07 stacks up maybe I can part ways with it finally.  Decision, decisions.


----------



## victorbrt

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> While there generally is a correlation between price and performance, the PR401 is just one of many examples of in-ears that perform on-par with pricier sets. Yes, the HJE900, C710, and PR401 are all somewhat v-shaped in response, but at the current prices the ECCIs are just better value.


 
  Well, the more i read, more i came to conclusion that the PR401 is a sooo nice choice at a good value.
   
  I see some complains with the Denon C710 like harsh highs e too much bass, and with the PR401 i see none.
   
  But, in your opinion, what's the next upgrade of PR401 then? The JVC FX500 / FX700?


----------



## Inks

Going from his review, pretty sure the FX700. The FX500s sound like they will be more like a sidegrade, going fwir.


----------



## FlySweep

@Aflac.. balance, neutrality, great end-to-end, detailed, treble w/o harshness and good crispness, and a (very) slight left-of-center/warmer presentation?  The GR07 is calling your name.  You can read my very affectionate rants for the GR07 on ClieOS' thread.
   
  Being a big DBA fan, owner.. I enjoy the 07 JUST as much as the DBA.. in fact, it's all I've been listening to for the past three weeks.  It's faster than the 262, sounds great unamped, and while it's a non-fatiguing, smoother phone.. there's plenty of detail and crispness with good quality source files.
   
  The crispness isn't on the BA level.. but I honestly don't think it aims to be or is tuned to try to be.  What's the most impressive part (aside from the non-fatiguing sig) is the GR07's layering.  It's really quite impressive and that particular aspect makes it easier to pick out details.
   
  The overall presentation is what seems paramount with these phones, so the sound is VERY cohesive.  I've got over 150 hours and they're very very very balanced to my ears.. perhaps the most balanced phones I've heard (even more than the 003).  Bass texturing is excellent.. and the way the mids are presented are very much to my liking (not forward or recessed.. just perfectly in line with the bass & treble).


----------



## Inks

Any sibilant issues? Heard some people were getting some sibilance with the R07s..


----------



## sunspot

Quote: 





inks said:


> Any sibilant issues? Heard some people were getting some sibilance with the R07s..


 

 I didn't notice anything myself.  And I HATE sibilance.  In fact, I hate fatiguing treble.
   
  esantosh was the one with sibilance issues IIRC, I'll let him answer this, but I think it was dependent on sibilance being present in the recording.  Some IEMs correct this, but the gr07 will reveal it.
   
  The lower treble does have a small peak which I do notice.  It doesn't bother me (I actually like it), but YYMV.
   
  Also, this is my only "high-end" phone; best I've heard beside those were the Xears TD100-II (for fun; I still respect them a LOT after A-B ing considering their price) and the RE-0 (for treble and mid accuracy, but man, I just can't like them that much, they sound very tinny to me)...


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> @Aflac.. balance, neutrality, great end-to-end, detailed, treble w/o harshness and good crispness, and a (very) slight left-of-center/warmer presentation?  The GR07 is calling your name.  You can read my very affectionate rants for the GR07 on ClieOS' thread.
> 
> Being a big DBA fan, owner.. I enjoy the 07 JUST as much as the DBA.. in fact, it's all I've been listening to for the past three weeks.  It's faster than the 262, sounds great unamped, and while it's a non-fatiguing, smoother phone.. there's plenty of detail and crispness with good quality source files.
> 
> ...


 
  How do you like them compared to your pr401?


----------



## Ikarios

Man, you guys suck. I just cleared out some of my full-size headphones and now I plop more down for IEMs. Maybe getting into a portable rig was a terrible idea after all...
   
  Anyway, GR07s purchased. I'll probably keep the CK10s around until I get them, unless the Q-jays or the MTPC sound better than I expect them to. Hopefully everything arrives quickly.


----------



## FlySweep

jxk said:


> How do you like them compared to your pr401?


 
   
  That's tough.. different sound sigs really.. The PR401, I love.  As with the DBA & GR07.. the PR401's overall presentation is where it excels.. I think you can see a particular theme forming with the phones I own, here.. lol.
   
  The PR401 has an ever so slight U shaped, balanced sound.. the mid bass hump on them settled perfectly after about 70 hours or so, mids came forward to be more in line with the wonderful, sparkling treble.  I consider the PR401 a true titan in it's price range, so you're not gonna here many, if any complaints about it from me.  Relative to the GR07, the PR401 is more "fun" but it certainly cozies up to the neutral side of things when pitted against it's direct competitors.
   
  PR401 has more sparkle than the GR07, but that can be attributed to the slight U-shaped curve.. The GR07 has sparkle, but it doesn't draw attention to itself like the PR401's sparkle does.. which is clearly one of the unique aspects of the ECCI phone.  PR401 has more bass quantity, but I think the quality is better on the vsonic.. not by miles, but it sounds more refined and it's quicker.  The ECCI's bass has more impact, but that is to be expected with its frequency curve.  The vson'c bass is really excellent when it comes to texture, extension and neutrality.  Not to be worried though, there is no RE0 type of non-existence in the GR07's bass.  I listen to a lot of hip hop and it sounds more than adequate for my ears with the GR07.  In fact, I almost prefer it over some of my other cans cause its so well textured and fleshed out from the lower midrange all the way to the sub-bass.
   
  PR401 has a wider & deeper soundstage, but the GR07's soundstage is freakishly accurate and surprisingly spacious.  I'd argue I like the GR07's soundstage more, in fact.  Both have great timbre, but the edge goes to the GR07.  Instrument separation goes to the GR07.  Listening to some electronica.. synths, horns, drums, and other instruments sound like they're floating in air.  Layering, which is what I would consider the GR07's ace in the hole is simply incredible.  PR401 is nice too, there.. but not anything I own can touch what the GR07 does when presenting layers in music (DBA comes close).
   
  It might sound like I'm heaping all the praise on the GR07 here, which it deserves.. but the PR401 is a phone I certainly listen to often when I want a slight bit more fun but not wanting to go all Eterna on my ears.  It's addictive treble presentation cannot be denied too.
   
  I think both the PR401 & GR07 are tremendous values at their pricepoints.. Both a VERY well rounded phones in my opinion and when you evaluate what each phone aim to do soundwise, they both achieve it better than most of their peers (PR401 = balanced U shape, musical GR07 = neutral, musical, accurate, non-fatiguing, detailed).  They both sound excellent unamped and handle a variety of genres with high competence (I'd say the GR07 has the edge here because of it's timbre accuracy, speed, and neutrality).
   
  It all depends on what you listen to & what kind of sound you want.. I personally don't think you could go wrong with either.  How much you want to spend should make the decision easier though.
   
  It's probably not what you want to hear.. but get both.  I don't see myself really selling either.


----------



## FlySweep

ikarios said:


> Man, you guys suck. I just cleared out some of my full-size headphones and now I plop more down for IEMs. Maybe getting into a portable rig was a terrible idea after all...
> 
> Anyway, GR07s purchased. I'll probably keep the CK10s around until I get them, unless the Q-jays or the MTPC sound better than I expect them to. Hopefully everything arrives quickly.


 

 LOL.. I think you'll be quite happy, Aflac.  Out of the box, they definitely lean to the warmer side of things, midrange can feel a bit muffled, and the treble can sound a bit harsh.. fear not.. after 10 hours or so, you'll start to hear their true character.. after 100 hours, the treble fleshes out, gains sparkle, the bass tightens, gets impact, and has that wonderful texture, mids round to reveal some excellent timbre, and the entire FR gains a noticeable level of clarity.. at least to my ears.  One thing I'm continually impressed by is for a smooth sounding phone, the GR07 possess a surprising level of crispness.. it's a dichotomy of sorts.  Regardless, it makes for great listening.
   
  I was kind of in the same boat as you in terms of being hesitant to throw down for another IEM I wasn't really sure I needed.  Between the 003, 004, DBA, PR401, & Silver Bullet (FA fanboy, right?), I felt I had all my musical bases covered pretty well.  But the more I read about them and ClieOS' glowing review made me take notice.
   
  I'm in the middle of moving so all my possessions (phones included) are being shipped and won't arrive at my new residence for three weeks.  I decided to take one phone to listen to during the arduous wait and decided on the GR07.  Not only cause of its versatility, but because it's got tinges of the signature elements of my other phones all rolled into one: 003's neutrality, SB's airy soundstage & non-fatiguing smoothness (which the 004 also possess), DBA's speed/accuracy/layering/detail/musicality, and the iM-590/PR401's balance.
   
  So if these are the things you're looking for, I think you'll be quite satisfied with the 07.. happy listening and do post your impressions.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Also, do you plan on doing more moving armature sets at some point in the future? Specifically, the Ortofon e-Q5 and the Grado GR8/10. I like your description of the e-Q7 but's above my price range. Thanks!


 

 e-Q5 - yes. I think I forgot to put it on the list but I've had one for weeks.


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Man, you guys suck. I just cleared out some of my full-size headphones and now I plop more down for IEMs. Maybe getting into a portable rig was a terrible idea after all...
> 
> Anyway, GR07s purchased. I'll probably keep the CK10s around until I get them, unless the Q-jays or the MTPC sound better than I expect them to. Hopefully everything arrives quickly.


 


  The GR07 is a good earphone but the drivers really need some hours on them. My only other high-end dynamics are the IE6/IE7 and Radius W2, and the GR07 went from being tied with the IE6 for last place to beating out the W2 for first as far as my own listening is concerned. The only other higher-end dynamic that can compete in balance is the 252 and even that struggles to maintain an even presence across the range, which makes the GR07 very special. Aside from that. the real strength of the GR07 is its l.ck of glaring weaknesses (once the sibilance goes away, that is). I haven't read ClieOS's review but I really don't have anything to add to esantosh's write-up on techenclave,


----------



## Majin

I am really looking forward to your review of Kozee Infinity X1. If they provide good sound and value i will most likely buy them


----------



## SOLIDOPS

I would like to double confirm the reviews on the Zune premium headphones. I have two pairs of these headphones. (I still use them...I'm a newbie) and while they do have surprisingly adequate isolation, the build quality isn't really that good. On one of them, the headphone jack cover came off, and the cloth just right on top of the audio jack is starting to fray. Also, for some reason, the inner plastic cord, burst out of the cloth and are now permanently stuck there, and they have formed loops. It's very odd.
   
  On the case of isolation: I had a Mexican marachi brand playing right in front of me on an NYC subway, and a good amount of the sound was filtered out, and when I came into my friend's room, who was blasting music, I didn't notice until I took them off.


----------



## Ikarios

how does the gr07 compare to the ck90? the descriptions sound somewhat similar, neutral with punchy bass.


----------



## parshand

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah, I wouldn't rule it out.
> 
> 
> 
> That seems like a good list except for the Sennheisers, which I've not heard. However, unless the CX300-II is radically better than the CX300, I wouldn't expect much from them. As for the other two, I think you've pretty much got the gist of it. The R02 is a little bassier with slightly more muffled treble while the M1 is more even across the spectrum without losing that midrange emphasis all of the Brainwavz/ViSang earphones have. I like the M1 better myself. The R02 has a better build quality score because it has articulated strain reliefs. Depending on how rough you are with your cable, that may or may not make a difference in the long run. As for accessories, double check with the listing should you choose to purchase them - I really wouldn't know if ViSang decided to switch up the accessories since I don't keep in contact with them.


 

  

 Thanks. Will the m1 be ok to use with a sansa clip+ on the move (no amp).


----------



## sunspot

Quote: 





parshand said:


> Thanks. Will the m1 be ok to use with a sansa clip+ on the move (no amp).


 

 I have that combo, and it works well.  You'll have to crank up the volume a little bit, but unless you listen to high volumes in general, it won't be a problem.  Those earphones don't need an amp, but they do require a bit more volume than most.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





parshand said:


> Thanks. Will the m1 be ok to use with a sansa clip+ on the move (no amp).


 

  
  Quote: 





sunspot said:


> I have that combo, and it works well.  You'll have to crank up the volume a little bit, but unless you listen to high volumes in general, it won't be a problem.  Those earphones don't need an amp, but they do require a bit more volume than most.


 

 The Pro Alpha might be a good choice spec wise as well for the CLip+.  If you plan to EQ and Rockbox have a look at the specs of the Pro Alpha next to the M1.


----------



## shinybeast

Aloha Joker-san, from the land of the rising radiation count...

Been a while since I last looked-in on your prodigious, never-ending, ever-expanding magnum opus. Continue to be amazed. What caught my eye this time was your recent review of both JVC FX700 and Westone 4.

Late last year, looking to truly go to a new level, damn the body blows to the wallet, and after much cogitating, sweaty fretting, and incredibly gracious advice received from yourself, I pulled the proverbial trigger on a pair of JVC FX700's. 

At the time I had been leaning heavily toward the ATHC100 (after reading your wonderful review and having been very happy - blissfully unaware perhaps - with my previous ATH700's). In fact my intention had been to go all out and purchase one more (just one more), high-end IEM to compliment the JVCs (in for a penny, in for a pound, etc.). However, I was worried that the CK100 would be too similar to the JVC, so was temporarily stumped (although you assured me that this would be unlikely since the CK100 are B/A and the JVC dynamic - information which I have since come to understand to some degree through reading and listening). 

Then I started reading lots of posts on the soon-to-be-released Westone 4, and getting the idea that this first-ever quad-driver rig would surely be something quite different from (or complimentary to) the JVC. And now suddenly I find that you have reviewed both. 

I have fallen in love with the JVC. From Mahler to Mingus, K-OS to Krall, DJ Shadow to Donovan; as you noted the magic with strings; piano, acoustic guitar almost crushingly gorgeous...I was a little surprised to read that you found the bass a bit "excessive for your liking" but this just points to the woefully insufficient breadth of my listening. For me, how well the phones convey and handle dynamically/tonally high-contrast symphonic music is the single most important thing. Even IEMs that do well with strings, for instance, can have real trouble with the big brass passages of say a Mahler or a Bruckner symphony in full stride.

So, to bring this already over-long ramble to a close (or at least a pause), if you only owned the JVC FX00, and had, say, up to to spend on one more IEM, which would it be (and I do mean for you personally, given your stated preferences)? I guess I'm assuming it would be an armature type, but perhaps not. Or would you simply kiss your JVCs, gently tuck them into their little box, and go out and spend the money on something really worthwhile like sex, drugs and women (in whatever order)?

All the best....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





majin said:


> I am really looking forward to your review of Kozee Infinity X1. If they provide good sound and value i will most likely buy them


 

 X1 review should be posted this weekend. Was aiming for earlier in the week but the GR07 held me up. The X1 has a very specific sound signature, something between a mid-range Etymotic and the FAD FI-BA-SS. For those who can handle that sort of sound, a full-shell custom at $189 all-in is great value for money. Stay tuned!

  Quote: 





solidops said:


> I would like to double confirm the reviews on the Zune premium headphones. I have two pairs of these headphones. (I still use them...I'm a newbie) and while they do have surprisingly adequate isolation, the build quality isn't really that good. On one of them, the headphone jack cover came off, and the cloth just right on top of the audio jack is starting to fray. Also, for some reason, the inner plastic cord, burst out of the cloth and are now permanently stuck there, and they have formed loops. It's very odd.
> 
> On the case of isolation: I had a Mexican marachi brand playing right in front of me on an NYC subway, and a good amount of the sound was filtered out, and when I came into my friend's room, who was blasting music, I didn't notice until I took them off.


 
  Good to know
   


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> how does the gr07 compare to the ck90? the descriptions sound somewhat similar, neutral with punchy bass.


 

 No, not very similar, except perhaps in that the CK90Pro has an atypical singature for a dual BA and the GR07 is not your typical dynamic. The CK90Pro is fairly dark and, despite being as impactful as the GR07, doesn't have nearly the same amount of bass body/fullness. The GR07 is more balanced than the CK90Pro to my ears and definitely more full-bodied. It also has better midrange texture than the CK90Pro and a tiny bit of treble roughness where the CK90Pro instead starts dipping down. As a result, the GR07 sounds energetic and exciting with female vocals while the CK90 sounds slightly dull/blunt. And of course the VSonics are more effortless when it comes to treble extension. Amazing how easily some dynamic drivers can cover the whole spectrum (thinking of IE7/IE8 and FX700 here as well). One thing the CK90Pro does exceedingly well is imaging - the GR07 really can't compete there.
   


  Quote: 





parshand said:


> Thanks. Will the m1 be ok to use with a sansa clip+ on the move (no amp).


 

 As has been said, it will take a few notches of extra volume compared to most earphones but assuming you aren't already using the clip with maxed-out volume you should be okay. The other Brainwavz earphones are all more efficient than the M1.
   


  Quote: 





shinybeast said:


> Aloha Joker-san, from the land of the rising radiation count...
> 
> Been a while since I last looked-in on your prodigious, never-ending, ever-expanding magnum opus. Continue to be amazed. What caught my eye this time was your recent review of both JVC FX700 and Westone 4.
> 
> ...


 


  I remember your original question, which actually doesn't happen often as I get at least a dozen PMs every day. I think it's your writing style 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Having now heard/reviewed the FX700, I can say that nothing you buy will replace it if you've gotten used to the signature. If it were me, I'd get something on the analytical side to compliment them because middle-of-the-road BA-based monitors such as the SM3 and W4 still won't give you the dynamic range, timbre, or air of the JVCs. Basically, the things they do really, really well for BAs will be wasted on you due to the nature of the FX700. Half-jokingly, I can recommend the FI-BA-SS - nothing I've heard -and certainly not the JVCs - sounds quite like it. Then again, if you wanted to move into that price range you would probably give up the JVCs and go full custom. More seriously, the Ortofon e-Q5, which I hope to review next week, is worth a look. It's an interesting sound and different enough from the FX700 to at least warrant some reading. It should also be slightly less shocking of a change from the JVCs compared to, say, a CK10 or DBA-02. 
   
  Oh and I think we all know at this point that I'd way rather spend my money on IEMs than drugs or women (this thread is too long for the gf to read through, right? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Oh and I think we all know at this point that I'd way rather spend my money on IEMs than drugs or women (this thread is too long for the gf to read through, right?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Compared to women, IEMs are generally less sibilant, harsh and tend to have a more balanced response.  They also could be considered to have a better bang/buck ratio and are much easier to move on the FS forum when you grow tired of them.  When you factor customer service into the equation it really becomes a no brainer.


----------



## Inks

Very sound advice, I am looking into a compliment to the FX700s myself as they have rendered all the BAs I've had unpleasant for my taste. EQ5s are a good suggestion because you won't be pushed too much into that blunt BA sound but the GR07s and RE262s are also very good contrasting in-ears that don't give up much timbre and dynamic range and are easy on the wallet
   
  LOL @ Anax. What about fit? wait don't answer that....


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> Very sound advice, I am looking into a compliment to the FX700s myself as they have rendered all the BAs I've had unpleasant for my taste. EQ5s are a good suggestion because you won't be pushed too much into that blunt BA sound but the GR07s and RE262s are also very good contrasting in-ears that don't give up much timbre and dynamic range and are easy on the wallet


 

 Well, here's the thing about BA's for me.  They have a unmatched ability to image clearly and realistically compared to dynamic IEM I've heard so far.  If you can provide superb timbre, low-end presence and coherence in a multi BA they can be quite superb.  My ES5 is the closest for me yet.  Most of you know I was a steadfast DD guy and probably considered more of a basshead by some.  Only the DBA and ES5 were able to make me switch hit.  I don't doubt that the FX700 is an inevitable purchase for me though.  This time the lack of isolation being an asset rather than a hinderance.


----------



## Inks

Well I haven't heard customs which could do the trick,  but the BAs i've had just didn't do it for me. It's just different... the sound is more straightfoward and cold with BAs ime. The DBA02 vs the RE-Zero for example have a very comparable soundsignature but the way the music moves and how more natural the dd sounds  is something I prioritize.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> Well I haven't heard customs which could do the trick,  but the BAs i've had just didn't do it for me. It's just different... the sound is more straightfoward and cold with BAs ime. The DBA02 vs the RE-Zero for example have a very comparable soundsignature but the way the music moves and how more natural the dd sounds  is something I prioritize.


 

 Well, I've got about 5-6 DD's still floating around and only 2 BA's left and those ones aren't cheap.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Compared to women, IEMs are generally less sibilant, harsh and tend to have a more balanced response.  They also could be considered to have a better bang/buck ratio and are much easier to move on the FS forum when you grow tired of them.  When you factor customer service into the equation it really becomes a no brainer.


 

 Awesome 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   


  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Well, here's the thing about BA's for me.  They have a unmatched ability to image clearly and realistically compared to dynamic IEM I've heard so far.  If you can provide superb timbre, low-end presence and coherence in a multi BA they can be quite superb.  My ES5 is the closest for me yet.  Most of you know I was a steadfast DD guy and probably considered more of a basshead by some.  Only the DBA and ES5 were able to make me switch hit.  I don't doubt that the FX700 is an inevitable purchase for me though.  This time the lack of isolation being an asset rather than a hinderance.


 

 True for my Miracle as well. I saw a post on TechEnclave comparing the Miracle to FX700 saying that the timbre of the Miracle is 50% better. I don't find that to necessarily be true (or quantifiable for that matter) but the Miracle can definitely compete in timbre with the best dynamic driver earphones have to offer. It's much like the SM3 with but proper treble energy and less thickness down low.


----------



## LooptroopRocker

@Joker: will you be reviewing the Sunrise SW-XCape Impressive Edition you think? My sincerest apologies if this has already been asked to you, it's just that I hear they retain most of the sound quality of the V.1 but with some bass quantity and I must say that that sounds almost too perfect for me, so I hope you understand the curiosity!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> @Joker: will you be reviewing the Sunrise SW-XCape Impressive Edition you think? My sincerest apologies if this has already been asked to you, it's just that I hear they retain most of the sound quality of the V.1 but with some bass quantity and I must say that that sounds almost too perfect for me, so I hope you understand the curiosity!


 


  I don't know, to be honest. Sunrise sent me a package (or at least said they did) a week or so ago but I have no idea what's in it. Also I haven't been paying attention to all of the nomenclature so the "Impressive Edition" is news to me.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





shinybeast said:


> I have fallen in love with the JVC. From Mahler to Mingus, K-OS to Krall, DJ Shadow to Donovan; as you noted the magic with strings; piano, acoustic guitar almost crushingly gorgeous...I was a little surprised to read that you found the bass a bit "excessive for your liking" but this just points to the woefully insufficient breadth of my listening. *For me, how well the phones convey and handle dynamically/tonally high-contrast symphonic music is the single most important thing. Even IEMs that do well with strings, for instance, can have real trouble with the big brass passages of say a Mahler or a Bruckner symphony in full stride.*


 

 You should give the Sony EX1000 a try. Honestly.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If it were me, I'd get something on the analytical side to compliment them because middle-of-the-road BA-based monitors such as the SM3 and W4 still won't give you the dynamic range, timbre, or air of the JVCs. Basically, the things they do really, really well for BAs will be wasted on you due to the nature of the FX700. *Half-jokingly, I can recommend the FI-BA-SS - nothing I've heard -and certainly not the JVCs - sounds quite like it*. Then again, if you wanted to move into that price range you would probably give up the JVCs and go full custom. *More seriously, the Ortofon e-Q5*, which I hope to review next week, is worth a look. It's an interesting sound and different enough from the FX700 to at least warrant some reading. It should also be slightly less shocking of a change from the JVCs compared to, say, a CK10 or DBA-02.


 

 As a counterpoint to the FX700 the FI-BA-SS are an excellent recommendation for classical. Or the FI-BA-A1, if you want to get 80-90% of the SS for 80% less. The Ortofon e-Q5 are also great with classical, but (like all moving armatures) struggle a bit with those aforementioned high dynamic passages in a full stride Mahler symphony.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> True for my Miracle as well. I saw a post on TechEnclave comparing the Miracle to FX700 saying that the timbre of the Miracle is 50% better. I don't find that to necessarily be true (or quantifiable for that matter) but the Miracle can definitely compete in timbre with the best dynamic driver earphones have to offer. It's much like the SM3 with but proper treble energy and less thickness down low.


 

 While the SM3 and W4 have very good timbre for BA based IEMs, they still fall a bit short (to my ears) in rendering sounds that require a high amount of bass texture, like the low vibrato of cello or double bass. I wonder if a custom BA like the Miracle is closer to the FX700 in that regard?


----------



## race2c

I would just like to give this reviews a very, well deserved thanks. They helped to decide on my M6s.
   
  Cam


----------



## ljokerl

Added Kozee Infinity X1 & Earsonics SM2
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> While the SM3 and W4 have very good timbre for BA based IEMs, they still fall a bit short (to my ears) in rendering sounds that require a high amount of bass texture, like the low vibrato of cello or double bass. I wonder if a custom BA like the Miracle is closer to the FX700 in that regard?


 

 I would say yes but the Miracle is still on the 'new toy' stage for me. So far it has remained flawlessly textured and detailed no matter what I've thrown at it.


  Quote: 





race2c said:


> I would just like to give this reviews a very, well deserved thanks. They helped to decide on my M6s.
> 
> Cam


 

 Glad to hear it.


----------



## chinesekiwi

Hey Joker, how would you compare the likes of the eQ7 to the SM2?
Sidegrade?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





chinesekiwi said:


> Hey Joker, how would you compare the likes of the eQ7 to the SM2?
> Sidegrade?


 


  Yes, definitely sidegrade. The SM2 is more impactful than the e-Q7 and less aggressive with detailing. I don't actually like its signature too much personally but it is a very good earphone. Amazing what a $250 pair of dual-drivers can do nowadays - the Shure SE530 in my ears right now is not as impressive to me.


----------



## roy_jones

I'm sort of surprised that the 1964 EARS triple driver is better sonically than the W4.  It says a lot about the quality of their IEMs. 
   
  I'm pretty sure I read in the W4 thread some poster(s) who have the JH13pro suggest that the W4 is playing in the same ballpark, so by transitive logic, it would seem to suggest to me that I've been underestimating the value and quality of the 1964 EARS customs.  Of course, it's always dangerous when one starts getting into making transitive assumptions in this fashion...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





roy_jones said:


> I'm sort of surprised that the 1964 EARS triple driver is better sonically than the W4.  It says a lot about the quality of their IEMs.
> 
> I'm pretty sure I read in the W4 thread some poster(s) who have the JH13pro suggest that the W4 is playing in the same ballpark, so by transitive logic, it would seem to suggest to me that I've been underestimating the value and quality of the 1964 EARS customs.  Of course, it's always dangerous when one starts getting into making transitive assumptions in this fashion...


 


  I think that says more about the JH13 than the 1964T. I really don't think the spread between the W4 and 1964-T is very large but the 1964 is more textured and more detailed. Having a perfect seal each time helps as well. Difficult to compare the otherwise due to different signatures. My Miracle, which is in the same price range as the JH13, is better still. I think the spread between the Miracle and 1964-T is a lot bigger than the spread between the 1964-T and similarly-priced universals.


----------



## SCL5

Why not trying the Shure SCL5. I prefer it to the SE535


----------



## IpodHappy

ljokerl, your reviews are always impressive.  Thanks so much for the time, outright work, and dedication you share with the community.  I'm really looking forward to your SE530 review, but was wondering if you are planning a comparison between the SE530 and the newer SE535?


----------



## EndlessMike

What do you guys reckon is better: a Monter Turbine @ 100 or a Hippo VB @ 80


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ipodhappy said:


> ljokerl, your reviews are always impressive.  Thanks so much for the time, outright work, and dedication you share with the community.  I'm really looking forward to your SE530 review, but was wondering if you are planning a comparison between the SE530 and the newer SE535?


 

 Well, I don't have a 535 and the 530 is a loan so I don't think that's going to happen.


----------



## GalmArn

Wow, you have a whole new bunch of Xears IEM added to your planned list.
  I am curious about the Resonance model.
   
  But personally, it's the fact that the GR07 directly jumped at the bottom of your _In progress_ list that interested me the most. I was looking to the DBA-02 for its very good ratio sound quality / price, but the GR07 seems to be a great contender, with a sound signature that could be closer to my tastes.
   
  Again, thank you for your work.


----------



## carfentanil

Hey, maybe you could review the Sony EX300. I need a frame of reference since this is my only genuine IEM. I'd be upgrading by now to the $200 range, but I'm on a very low fixed income. This would give me a rudimentary benchmark for comparison purposes. This is a great thread for [mostly] unbiased diverse discussion. I'm a numbers guy so the statistical approach really gets my attention. I'm making a spreadsheet of all the IEMs reviewed in this thread... another week I might have a crude finished version...

 It should be rather important to clearly distinguish between universals and customs. This is probably the most distinctive divergence in the products listed, not to mention that customs are a bit more complex to obtain, etc...

 Isn't the sense of community and support on Head-Fi awesome?!!


----------



## ickayR

What is splitting?


----------



## monoglycer

Nice review of the X1s!
   
  Its a shame that they couldn't tune the driver in the silicone version like they did for the executive.


----------



## Majin

How would you compare the bass from the X1 to similiar priced universals (for example: shure 215, radius DDM, vsonic GR07 etc.) and the brainwavz M2. And would it be a major upgrade going from the M2 to X1?


----------



## average_joe

james444 said:


> While the SM3 and W4 have very good timbre for BA based IEMs, they still fall a bit short (to my ears) in rendering sounds that require a high amount of bass texture, like the low vibrato of cello or double bass. I wonder if a custom BA like the Miracle is closer to the FX700 in that regard?


 

      Quote:


ljokerl said:


> True for my Miracle as well. I saw a post on TechEnclave comparing the Miracle to FX700 saying that the timbre of the Miracle is 50% better. I don't find that to necessarily be true (or quantifiable for that matter) but the Miracle can definitely compete in timbre with the best dynamic driver earphones have to offer. It's much like the SM3 with but proper treble energy and less thickness down low.


 

 Hi James & Joker (and thanks for the best review compilation anywhere on earth!), my 0.02.  While the FX700 and SM3 (SM3 is very tip dependent, and the fit will also affect the FX700) are in the same ball park, my experience with high end customs (although still limited for now) is that they take a step up from the universals.  My lone universal, the SM3, which used to be my favorite, is no match to me now for my customs.  I can't quantify how much better, but I will just say I have heard BA bass that is holding it's own against the LCD-2.  Of course the price point is very high, so it should be great to justify the price.
   
  Thanks to both of you for your contributions and even though I rarely post in many thread, I do still read some universal threads, especially this one.


----------



## Prazzyp

hey, i was wondering how the regular monster turbines match up to the on-ear monster beats solo's?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





galmarn said:


> Wow, you have a whole new bunch of Xears IEM added to your planned list.
> I am curious about the Resonance model.
> 
> But personally, it's the fact that the GR07 directly jumped at the bottom of your _In progress_ list that interested me the most. I was looking to the DBA-02 for its very good ratio sound quality / price, but the GR07 seems to be a great contender, with a sound signature that could be closer to my tastes.
> ...


 
   
  Those to-do lists are in alphabetical order so the GR07 having been at the bottom is not really indicative of anything. Since the GR07 review is finished, it probably won't take as long as it usually does to add to this thread (though this hasn't been true for some other earphones recently). 
   
   
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> Hey, maybe you could review the Sony EX300. I need a frame of reference since this is my only genuine IEM. I'd be upgrading by now to the $200 range, but I'm on a very low fixed income. This would give me a rudimentary benchmark for comparison purposes. This is a great thread for [mostly] unbiased diverse discussion. I'm a numbers guy so the statistical approach really gets my attention. I'm making a spreadsheet of all the IEMs reviewed in this thread... another week I might have a crude finished version...
> 
> It should be rather important to clearly distinguish between universals and customs. This is probably the most distinctive divergence in the products listed, not to mention that customs are a bit more complex to obtain, etc...
> 
> Isn't the sense of community and support on Head-Fi awesome?!!


 

 The EX300 is on the to-do list (see post #8 in this thread). There is also a spreadsheet already (again, post #8). Customs are marked with an asterisk on the spreadsheet. Perhaps I will do so on the index as well.


  Quote: 





ickayr said:


> What is splitting?


 






   


  Quote: 





monoglycer said:


> Nice review of the X1s!
> 
> Its a shame that they couldn't tune the driver in the silicone version like they did for the executive.


 

 Thanks! I really can't confirm the exact effect of the venting on a BA (assuming the X1 and X1 Executive use the same driver in the first place) but I'm assuming you mean that the Executive seems to sound better than your X1.


  Quote: 





majin said:


> How would you compare the bass from the X1 to similiar priced universals (for example: shure 215, radius DDM, vsonic GR07 etc.) and the brainwavz M2. And would it be a major upgrade going from the M2 to X1?


 

 Those are all dynamic-driver IEMs.... not really fair to compare. The bass of the X1 would be closer to something like an Ety ER6 or HF5 or even the Westone 1. Very tight and not at all exaggerated. The M2 is a warm-sounding IEM with several dB of bass lift... it is a lot more impactful than the X1 and also much thicker/smoother. The X1 is very analytical in comparison - much clearer, much more detailed, more hyped in the treble, and much 'wider'-sounding. On a technical level, it is an upgrade, but if you're looking for something closer to the M2 in signature you'd be better off with a Senn IE7 or Radius W21.


  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> hey, i was wondering how the regular monster turbines match up to the on-ear monster beats solo's?


 

 The Solos sound worse in pretty much every single way.


----------



## GalmArn

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those to-do lists are in alphabetical order so the GR07 having been at the bottom is not really indicative of anything. Since the GR07 review is finished, it probably won't take as long as it usually does to add to this thread (though this hasn't been true for some other earphones recently).


 

  
  Damn, never noticed it before. It's just that recently it was only on the planned list, so I assumed that.
   
  Good news, I'm going right now to read the dedicated topic. =)


----------



## FripZ

I've fallen in love with the q-jays but $150+ is too much. What IEMs come close to the q-jays in terms of size/comfort/looks?
On the other hand... if they were on sale for less than $100 it'd be a no-brainer ;D


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





fripz said:


> I've fallen in love with the q-jays but $150+ is too much. What IEMs come close to the q-jays in terms of size/comfort/looks?
> On the other hand... if they were on sale for less than $100 it'd be a no-brainer ;D


 

 My guess would be the UE700 but they are pretty expensive at MSRP but don't know if they still go for that high.
   
   
  Mike, just out of curiosity but where does the W4 fit for you? I have my UM custom coming to me tomorrow (surprisingly..although tbh I have no idea how long it has been) so wondering with all the customs you have as well as other earphones where the W4 would be if you owned them. Although if a custom sounded like the W4 I might be tempted to get that. I want to keep them but not sure what I plan on doing with them yet since they are very close to the 1964-T in technical ability but a more "fun" sound signature.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fripz said:


> I've fallen in love with the q-jays but $150+ is too much. What IEMs come close to the q-jays in terms of size/comfort/looks?
> On the other hand... if they were on sale for less than $100 it'd be a no-brainer ;D


 

 If sound quality is a low priority, the MEElec M11+ would probably be closest in size/comfort/looks. 
   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> My guess would be the UE700 but they are pretty expensive at MSRP but don't know if they still go for that high.
> 
> Mike, just out of curiosity but where does the W4 fit for you? I have my UM custom coming to me tomorrow (surprisingly..although tbh I have no idea how long it has been) so wondering with all the customs you have as well as other earphones where the W4 would be if you owned them. Although if a custom sounded like the W4 I might be tempted to get that. I want to keep them but not sure what I plan on doing with them yet since they are very close to the 1964-T in technical ability but a more "fun" sound signature.


 

 The W4 is a damn good universal and if I didn't have the 1964-T or Miracle I'd be tempted to pick one up as my all-around benchmark (something I've never said about the SM3). I agree that the differences in performance are very small between the 1964-T and W4 and many will find the signature of the W4 preferable. With the Miracle here, however, I don't see a place for the W4. In fact, there's no place for the 1964-T or Ck10, either, so my collection will have to undergo some drastic changes in the long run.


----------



## FripZ

Alright UE 700s are a great, if not better alternative. While I was searching around I found an old 65% off deal.. How often do those sales happen? I guess I'll just wait for the first one to go on sale ._. (Assuming $150 is the lowest price at the moment for UE 700s)


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





cliffroyroycole said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I'm a definite UM-56 fanboy.


----------



## ljokerl

fripz said:


> Alright UE 700s are a great, if not better alternative. While I was searching around I found an old 65% off deal.. How often do those sales happen? I guess I'll just wait for the first one to go on sale ._. (Assuming $150 is the lowest price at the moment for UE 700s)




I don't think they go on sale too often but you may be able to get a good deal on a used one. Even though the q-JAYS use a similar armature to the UE700, I wouldn't think twice about putting up the extra $50 they cost. The NOCS NS800 is another twfk-based earphone with the same form factor but it's quite rare in the states. NOCS also have some lower-end models which look more or less similar but I am not familiar with them.


----------



## Majin

If you compare the X1 to the Ety ER6, then from what i recall the Ety ER6 has nearly no bass at all.


----------



## Anaxilus

Sounds like the 530 has done little if anything to change your mind about that Shure signature.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  I still can't believe I was a Shure user exclusively for about 4 years.  Thank goodness for Head-fi.


----------



## rawrster

Your wallet may disagree with you 
   
  I liked the Shure E4 the year or so I had them but the signature didnt suit me as well as what I have now. I'm happy with the W4 as my universal and the Brainwavz M2 as a backup universal with 2 customs. I need a higher disposable income so I can buy the rest of the customs


----------



## lazuline

Can anyone compare the a151 to an er6i/hf5/er4? I jumped on the $50 price now that it's sold directly through amazon (easy return if it's not to my liking). I wasn't buying into the se215 hype, so this seemed like a good option for a pair to kick-around.
   
  And then there's Meelectronics excellent CS. I've had them replace defective m series pairs multiple times, and each time it was pain-free.


----------



## swbf2cheater

Any other Iems you can think of or remember that sound as airy and open as the Yuin Ok1?  I've been trying to rebuy them for weeks.


----------



## ljokerl

majin said:


> If you compare the X1 to the Ety ER6, then from what i recall the Ety ER6 has nearly no bass at all.




I've never actually heard the Er6. I had an Er6i a long time ago, which supposedly had improved bass over the Er6. It wasn't lacking mid-bass for my tastes but it did lean out severely at the very bottom. The X1 doesn't do that - it retains decent (for a high-end single BA) detail, texture, and impact pretty far down but the 'enhanced bass' label definitely does not apply here.




anaxilus said:


> Sounds like the 530 has done little if anything to change your mind about that Shure signature.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It's not that the SE530 is poor - it does some things very well - but it just isn't keeping my attention the way most $200+ earphones do. if I wanted a slightly dark armature-based earphone with heavy bass and smooth, forward mids, I would take the cheaper Earsonics SM2 any day. And I don't even like the SM2.




rawrster said:


> Your wallet may disagree with you
> 
> I liked the Shure E4 the year or so I had them but the signature didnt suit me as well as what I have now. I'm happy with the W4 as my universal and the Brainwavz M2 as a backup universal with 2 customs. I need a higher disposable income so I can buy the rest of the customs




The E4 was in my stable as well but I never considered it a great performer for the asking price. I guess it was already outdated by the time I got my hands on it because there was simply no contest between the $299 Shure and the RE0, which was still $169 at the time...




lazuline said:


> Can anyone compare the a151 to an er6i/hf5/er4? I jumped on the $50 price now that it's sold directly through amazon (easy return if it's not to my liking). I wasn't buying into the se215 hype, so this seemed like a good option for a pair to kick-around.
> 
> And then there's Meelectronics excellent CS. I've had them replace defective m series pairs multiple times, and each time it was pain-free.




Er6i and HF5 are on the bright side of things, ER4S is pretty neutral, A151 is dark. Expect a bit more bass impact out of the Meelecs than any of the Etys but don't expect the same levels of microdetail and texture - the A151 favors smoothness and coherency. The A151 really should be compared to consumer-class single armatures such as the PL50, Westone 1, UE SF4/SF5, Fischer SBA-01, s-JAYS, etc., and not Etys.




swbf2cheater said:


> Any other Iems you can think of or remember that sound as airy and open as the Yuin Ok1?  I've been trying to rebuy them for weeks.




HA-FX700


----------



## shinybeast

Man,

You gave me a moment of pure non-sibilant self-chuckle, on a night when I needed it most. Ultra thanks....


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  In fact the early vented Playaz (aka Xears) models N1 and Sonia II sounded very airy and open with a huge soundstage and I loved them for that, even though you had to EQ down the bass because it was just too much. There are still a few open models in the current Xears lineup and the CP100 looks a lot like the old Sonia II. Haven't heard them though.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm looking for earphones that have deep bass that actually goes below 30 Hz, nice mid-range, very good treble and for the price of $60-80.
   
  I'm also a basshead that wants some clarity and I find that the Meelectronics SP51 isn't pleasing me enough, but it's doing pretty good for its' price range. I just want to find those things I just mentioned above.....and.....GO!


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'm looking for earphones that have deep bass that actually goes below 30 Hz, nice mid-range, very good treble and for the price of $60-80.
> 
> I'm also a basshead that wants some clarity and I find that the Meelectronics SP51 isn't pleasing me enough, but it's doing pretty good for its' price range. I just want to find those things I just mentioned above.....and.....GO!


 

 You've basically described the hippo VB. They have some of the biggest sub-bass I've seen. Additionally, the quality of the bass is superb as well. And unlike so many other basshead phones the VB are not a giant fart canon. The bass stays where it's supposed to, it doesn't bleed into the midrange and isn't present unless called for - when it then appears in spades and rattles your head. Moreover clarity is also quite impressive considering the price and the massive amount of sub-bass they're capable of putting out. Highly recommended.


----------



## ljokerl

Sounds like the VB to me as well, though it seems to be getting more difficult to find. Failing that there's Eternas and refurb'd Turbines once in a while.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sounds like the VB to me as well, though it seems to be getting more difficult to find. Failing that there's Eternas and refurb'd Turbines once in a while.


 

 What about the pr401? From what I've read it doesn't strike me as a default basshead phone, but perhaps with a little EQ?
   
  And now that you mention it, the VB does seem to be sold out everywhere? Was the model unpopular, or did hippo end up releasing so many models that they cannibalized their own market share?


----------



## ljokerl

PR401 isn't really that bass-heavy, certainly not as bassy as SP51 with the bass port installed. I don't know how it responds to EQ since I like its balance as-is. 

Also don't know what's going on with Hippo. IMO they did release too many models and ended up devaluing their best new earphone (the Hippo 10EB) with those ES8 cable sales. They also discontinued their only good sub-$50 earphone (the Pearl) and kept the mediocre Boom and Epic for reasons I don't understand.


----------



## Subatomic

Hey guys, was wondering if you could give me a bit of advice. I'm really stumped as to what I should do. See my post here: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/548861/upgrades-from-ue-sf5pros-250-300-recommendations#post_7417444
   
  Basically, my UE SF5pros just failed, and so i'm looking at upgrading. Something in the area of ~$200-400. Like I said in my post, I don't know if I should get a UM reshell of the UEs (~$450), go for the UM Aero (~$500) or just get a universal kit, somewhere in the area of ~$200-400 and try and sell my semi broken UEs to someone or maybe eventually down the road getting them reshelled. I think i'm leaning towards the universal route just because its quicker and easier and cheaper.... but I will look at going customs at some point (maybe a good reason to keep my UEs).
   
  So, in the case of going universals, what should I look at? I'm really confused.... reading through this thread, kinda makes me want to go for the Westone 4, but I know people have issues with comfort/fit so I dunno.. What else should I be looking at? Or are there any cheaper ones that will give me similar sorts of results?
  
  Really what i'm looking for is: excellend sound quality, good build quality, good isolation, good bass, low microphonics, good fit and a good level of comfort.
   
  Mainly for listening to music, mostly trance/house but also a little bit of pop/rock, and maybe even for a bit of movies/tv shows/gaming. For use at home/travelling/out and about at uni and what not.
   
  If anyone could help me wade it all out, that would be amazing. I'm so confused, especially reading this thread, reading the other threads in this forum, looking at earphonesolutions recommendations etc etc. Thanks guys


----------



## xtasi

Amazon has the a151 for $49.99

   
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B004OBZ2XQ/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Also don't know what's going on with Hippo. IMO they did release too many models and ended up devaluing their best new earphone (the Hippo 10EB) with those ES8 cable sales. They also discontinued their only good sub-$50 earphone (the Pearl) and kept the mediocre Boom and Epic for reasons I don't understand.


 

 After hearing input from Sunrise it could be that Hippo was in a similar position and wanted to cater to a more profitable market that had greater demand in that niche.


----------



## Niyologist

I was suspecting that the Hippo VB's was the set I was looking for. I'll have this along with my SP51 and I need to return my SP51 because it's a defective pair. I'll have the new SP51 by Saturday or Monday or Tuesday. I'll tell you guys how the SP51 ports will affect the Hippo VB's sound signature.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





subatomic said:


> Hey guys, was wondering if you could give me a bit of advice. I'm really stumped as to what I should do. See my post here: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/548861/upgrades-from-ue-sf5pros-250-300-recommendations#post_7417444
> 
> Basically, my UE SF5pros just failed, and so i'm looking at upgrading. Something in the area of ~$200-400. Like I said in my post, I don't know if I should get a UM reshell of the UEs (~$450), go for the UM Aero (~$500) or just get a universal kit, somewhere in the area of ~$200-400 and try and sell my semi broken UEs to someone or maybe eventually down the road getting them reshelled. I think i'm leaning towards the universal route just because its quicker and easier and cheaper.... but I will look at going customs at some point (maybe a good reason to keep my UEs).
> 
> ...


 

 The cheapest option would probably be a non-UM re-shell. Don't expect throwing extra drivers at the SF5Pro to make it better - while I'm sure the techs at UM know what they're doing, the SF5 has a couple of weaknesses that prevent it from being a true top-tier earphone in my book and I don't know if that'll be fixed by the re-shell. I have no idea what the UM Aero sounds like but the W4 should be a good fit for you. It has maybe a touch less bass than the SuperFi5 but it is much cleaner and more detailed. Westone pays a lot of attention to ergonomics and I expect most people will be happy with the W4's fit. If you find the bass of the SF5Pro lacking quantity, the W3 might be a good fit as well.


  Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Amazon has the a151 for $49.99
> 
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B004OBZ2XQ/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new


 

 Good deal. Surprised they're so cheap so soon.


----------



## Subatomic

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The cheapest option would probably be a non-UM re-shell. Don't expect throwing extra drivers at the SF5Pro to make it better - while I'm sure the techs at UM know what they're doing, the SF5 has a couple of weaknesses that prevent it from being a true top-tier earphone in my book and I don't know if that'll be fixed by the re-shell. I have no idea what the UM Aero sounds like but the W4 should be a good fit for you. It has maybe a touch less bass than the SuperFi5 but it is much cleaner and more detailed. Westone pays a lot of attention to ergonomics and I expect most people will be happy with the W4's fit. If you find the bass of the SF5Pro lacking quantity, the W3 might be a good fit as well.


 

 Thanks for the advice. I've actually decided the W4 is out of my price range... including shipping it brings it up to ~$460usd and yea, its just getting all too much. So now I'm thinking around the ~$300-350 mark... maybe the W3? How does it compare? Or should I be looking at something else?
   
  Still undecided as to what to do with the superfis... maybe i'll get a new pair of universals and see how it goes and then think about reshelling them.... as for the extra driver, yea I dunno, they said its 'highly recommended'... makes it a 2-way dual low and single mid/high setup. Hrm.
   
  Thanks


----------



## T78Power

@ Joker 
  The UM3X now comes with all the accessories that the W3 and W4 come with.  (about 10-12 pairs of tips / case / wax loop and brush combo)
  Thought it might help to update the review section.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





t78power said:


> @ Joker
> The UM3X now comes with all the accessories that the W3 and W4 come with.  (about 10-12 pairs of tips / case / wax loop and brush combo)
> Thought it might help to update the review section.


 
   
  Is that true for all UM3Xs or just the RC version?


----------



## victorbrt

Hey joker, i already buy the ECCI PR401, just waiting for it. I will say what i think of them when they arrive.
   
  But, from what i've read, they're very great IEMs and the value is very good. I hope that they have a great instrument separation because my CKM55 lacks in this.
   
  Thanks for your help!


----------



## T78Power

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Is that true for all UM3Xs or just the RC version?


 
  I recently got the RC version but people have been saying the fixed cable UM3X comes with all the accessories too.
  also Earphone Solutions updated their "this item comes with" section on the fixed cable UM3X to include all the tips and wax loop etc.


----------



## badger109

I can't thank Joker enough for this awesome comprehensive review.  Helped me decide to cancel my order for klipsch s4 in favor of the MEElectronics a151 ($50 at amazon 
   
  Now I need another suggestion.  I have an fleabay "groupon" that I'd like to use to get a pair of budget IEMs since the senn 300's i was using died.  I'm a headphone noob and those sounded good enough for me while they lasted.
   
  Here's what I'm looking for:
   
  A better build quality.  The stress reliefs ripped off of my old senns and soon enough one side went out.  Also the microphonics were awful (never wore over the ear tho).
  Comfort.  I wanna sleep with them in and I tend to sleep with my ear down on the pillow.  The 300 was fine for that puropse, but I'm not sure if bulky or over the ear headphones would be very comfortable. But I also wanna use them for running and working out so they gotta stay put in my.
   
  Looking through the lineup I'd consider MEE m6, NuForce ne-6, soundmagic PL30, brainwavz m1, h2o audio flex, senn cx250, maximo im390, vsonic r02, ECCI PR100, etc.
  If anybody would weigh in on the best option to get on ebay or if there are any suggestions, I'd really appreciate it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





t78power said:


> I recently got the RC version but people have been saying the fixed cable UM3X comes with all the accessories too.
> also Earphone Solutions updated their "this item comes with" section on the fixed cable UM3X to include all the tips and wax loop etc.


 


  Ok, thanks - I'll make a note of it.


  Quote: 





badger109 said:


> I can't thank Joker enough for this awesome comprehensive review.  Helped me decide to cancel my order for klipsch s4 in favor of the MEElectronics a151 ($50 at amazon
> 
> Now I need another suggestion.  I have an fleabay "groupon" that I'd like to use to get a pair of budget IEMs since the senn 300's i was using died.  I'm a headphone noob and those sounded good enough for me while they lasted.
> 
> ...


 


  You want a number of very different things there. For a balance of durability and SQ the ViSang R02 would be near the top of that heap but I don't know if you'll be able to sleep in it. For sleeping it'll have to be the M6, PL30, CX250, or Flex. I happen to like the PL30 and Flex but coming from the CX300 they will seem extremely bass-light to you. The CX250 is a good option but you have to be careful of fake Sennheiser products on ebay - there are many. The M6 is a good deal at current prices but not everyone finds it as comfortable as I do.


----------



## Prazzyp

> The Solos sound worse in pretty much every single way.


 
   
  haha awesome!


----------



## badger109

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You want a number of very different things there. For a balance of durability and SQ the ViSang R02 would be near the top of that heap but I don't know if you'll be able to sleep in it. For sleeping it'll have to be the M6, PL30, CX250, or Flex. I happen to like the PL30 and Flex but coming from the CX300 they will seem extremely bass-light to you. The CX250 is a good option but you have to be careful of fake Sennheiser products on ebay - there are many. The M6 is a good deal at current prices but not everyone finds it as comfortable as I do.


 

  
  Dude, you are the best! and thanks for the advice.  Once I get my MEE a151s, if I like em, I may decide that I want something with more bass just for fun. thanks for bringing up that point


----------



## High_Q

Joker,
   
  I think it would be great if there was a list of top picks for each tier.  Excellent work by the way.  Although I have different ears and tastes than you do, its a great guide for the noobs.  It should be stickied, but the forum setup doesn't seem to allow that.  Oh well...


----------



## ljokerl

badger109 said:


> Dude, you are the best! and thanks for the advice.  Once I get my MEE a151s, if I like em, I may decide that I want something with more bass just for fun. thanks for bringing up that point




Good plan 




high_q said:


> Joker,
> 
> I think it would be great if there was a list of top picks for each tier.  Excellent work by the way.  Although I have different ears and tastes than you do, its a great guide for the noobs.  It should be stickied, but the forum setup doesn't seem to allow that.  Oh well...




I have a 'my picks' section and it's been a work in progress for a while but for the time being I've decided to focus on new reviews and let others handle recommendations and such. I think it'd be too easy to leave an earphone that's absolutely perfect for a particular listener's tastes/uses out of such a guide so it has to be fairly all-encompassing. Originally, it was going to be sorted by sound signature but I think ClieOS has covered that pretty well and certainly in much more detail than I was going to.


----------



## usb7

I'm coming from the CX300 also and I'm considering between the MEElectronics A151 and M6.
  Does anyone having any input that would help me swing towards one or the other?
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You want a number of very different things there. For a balance of durability and SQ the ViSang R02 would be near the top of that heap but I don't know if you'll be able to sleep in it. For sleeping it'll have to be the M6, PL30, CX250, or Flex. I happen to like the PL30 and Flex but coming from the CX300 they will seem extremely bass-light to you. The CX250 is a good option but you have to be careful of fake Sennheiser products on ebay - there are many. The M6 is a good deal at current prices but not everyone finds it as comfortable as I do.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





usb7 said:


> I'm coming from the CX300 also and I'm considering between the MEElectronics A151 and M6.
> Does anyone having any input that would help me swing towards one or the other?


 

 Do you like the warmth and bass impact of your cx300? If so, go with the cc51 (if the a151 is in your price range, so are these). If you want less impact and want a more detail oriented sound choose the a151.


----------



## usb7

Could you elaborate more on the difference between the two?
  (warmth and bass impact vs detail oriented sound)
  
  Quote: 





jxk said:


> Do you like the warmth and bass impact of your cx300? If so, go with the cc51 (if the a151 is in your price range, so are these). If you want less impact and want a more detail oriented sound choose the a151.


----------



## JxK

I can go into more detail, but until you've heard examples of both types of sound signatures, it will be just words. Your cx300 is a very bass heavy IEM. It doesn't have a great deal of sub-bass (the "kick" in bass) but has a great overabundance of mid-bass - which makes for a "thicker", "warmer" sort of sound. The a151 is a balanced armature. It is tuned to also produce some extra midbass "warmth"  but not nearly to the same extent as the cx300. Also, as a balanced armature it will be "faster" - meaning it can respond quicker to small changes in the music...though depending upon what you listen to it's not always a good thing.
   
  But as I said earlier, you really have to hear some different headphones/earphones in order to get an understanding of their sound, and in order to develop a preference about the sort of sound you prefer. So at first just decide upon generalities. If you want your next purchase to sound similar, though better, than your cx300 pick the cc51. If you want to gamble and try something different, or if perhaps you've always felt the cx300 was too bassy or thick, try the a151.
   
  Or maybe something else? Is there some aspect of the cx300 that particularly stands out, positively or negatively?


----------



## Niyologist

I got my new non-defective SP51 in the mail and Meelec also gave me the M31 as well! Awesome Customer Service!


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





jxk said:


> Do you like the warmth and bass impact of your cx300? If so, go with the cc51 (if the a151 is in your price range, so are these). If you want less impact and want a more detail oriented sound choose the a151.


 

 You find the cc51 has more warmth, bass impact and less detail than the a151?  Unless they changed the demo I heard at CES I would switch those around.


----------



## kanuka

say people
  even after reading this multi-review i cant make my mind (im posting this on other thread too...)
  any suggestions about which of these ones would be a better buy
   
  surise xcape (ver2 seems to be the only one available)
 meelec a151
  meelec cx21
 ecci pr401
 fischer audio eterna (though neither version seems to be available)
   
  yes i know the prices are different but dont take that on count
  i want the best comfort
  and also best isolation possible as i need them for bus travel, rush hours and/or very noisy engines
  good for vocals, specially jap-female vocals, not laid back please
   
   
  another thing. im also considering of getting a ~$150 iem
  anyone tried or know about the new Brainwavz B2 (the preorder price seems a good buy)
  maybe the FA DBA-02. look similar but i dont know the difference
  or the UE triple10
   
  same requirments as before comfort/isolation. and but for these they should "shine with female-vocals". the Westone 1, dont seem to be comfort for me
  thnks


----------



## Pianist

Hey Joker. I think DBA-02 is probably rated too highly. I don't think it deserves to be rated above RE252, e-Q7 and ER4S and RE262. I know you may prefer them more, but I think you should be a bit more objective. You reviews are excellent though, just don't necessarily reflect the rating well. I would place all of the aforementioned IEMs on par because I think that choosing between them is just a matter of personal preference. If you have strong reasons why you think that DBA-02 actually objectively beats all of them, then you should state it in your review. Personally, I can easily say that ER4S is more neutral and accurate than DBA-02, which is a bit too bright by comparison. I can also say that ER4S extends deeper in the low end and its low end is tighter and more defined than that of DBA-02. I think e-Q7 has smoother, better textured mids than DBA-02 and tighter, better textured bass as well. I think RE252 is more neutral than DBA-02 and the RE262 has smoother mids and much better dynamics than DBA-02. So overall, I don't see how DBA-02 can be rated higher overall. Is it the best all arounder? I don't think so because its treble can be slightly too bright, the bass is not always as defined as I would've liked and the compressed dynamic range works better with some music than other music.
   
  Actually, I would drop ratings altogether. I think that sound is too subjective to be rated on a scale like this. You should just describe the sound of a 'phone and what you feel it does well and doesn't do well and then let the reader decide for himself whether it may be better than some other 'phone you described before based on your description.


----------



## GalmArn

Quote:  





> Actually, I would drop ratings altogether. I think that sound is too subjective to be rated on a scale like this. You should just describe the sound of a 'phone and what you feel it does well and doesn't do well and then let the reader decide for himself whether it may be better than some other 'phone you described before based on your description.


 

 You should just not pay too much attention to the rating without using ljokerl descriptions as context. They definitely cannot be a result of a perfect analysis based on precise and standard characteristics with proper weighted coefficients.
  Ratings are indicative, there is always to argue between a 9.3 and a 9.5.
   
  What would be very interesting is a ranking by sound signature, like did ClieOS. Because after all, what people seeks most of the times is a recommendation, based on a budget and sound signature. After if people are seeking for a more peculiar trait, they should pay a deeper attention to descriptions.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





galmarn said:


> You should just not pay too much attention to the rating without using ljokerl descriptions as context. They definitely cannot be a result of a perfect analysis based on precise and standard characteristics with proper weighted coefficients.
> Ratings are indicative, there is always to argue between a 9.3 and a 9.5.
> 
> *What would be very interesting is a ranking by sound signature, like did ClieOS. Because after all, what people seeks most of the times is a recommendation, based on a budget and sound signature. After if people are seeking for a more peculiar trait, they should pay a deeper attention to descriptions.*


 

 Agreed 100%. But the ratings are still there and a 9.3 is still less than a 9.5 and it sure has a psychological effect on people, especially those new to headphones and head-fi. Especially if you then also look at the price. DBA-02 is rated _higher _than e-Q7 and costs _half the price_! Which IEM do you think a newbie reading the reviews is more likely to pick. DBA-02 by a landslide.
   
  But there are things that e-Q7 does much better than DBA-02 and vice versa. Each of these IEMs has strengths and weaknesses and there is really no better between them. But by rating DBA-02 higher than e-Q7, it is as though Joker assumes that DBA-02 is indeed better than e-Q7 overall, which is not true IMO. e-Q7 has a wider dynamic range, better structured bass and better texture than DBA-02 and that alone can make it worth the extra money over the DBA-02 if those are the qualities that are most important to the buyer. And of course, if one is looking for the sharpest treble with plenty of excitement and aggression up there, then of course DBA-02 is a much better choice and killer value compared to e-Q7 for that individual. But to say that DBA-02 has a higher value and sounds better overall is just wrong. There are plenty of other IEMs in that review, like RE262, e-Q7, ER4S and even RE0 that do some things better than DBA-02 and are thus in at least some ways are worth the money or are a better value than DBA-02.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Hey Joker. I think DBA-02 is probably rated too highly. I don't think it deserves to be rated above RE252, e-Q7 and ER4S and RE262. I know you may prefer them more, but I think you should be a bit more objective. You reviews are excellent though, just don't necessarily reflect the rating well. I would place all of the aforementioned IEMs on par because I think that choosing between them is just a matter of personal preference. If you have strong reasons why you think that DBA-02 actually objectively beats all of them, then you should state it in your review. Personally, I can easily say that ER4S is more neutral and accurate than DBA-02, which is a bit too bright by comparison. I can also say that ER4S extends deeper in the low end and its low end is tighter and more defined than that of DBA-02. I think e-Q7 has smoother, better textured mids than DBA-02 and tighter, better textured bass as well. I think RE252 is more neutral than DBA-02 and the RE262 has smoother mids and much better dynamics than DBA-02. So overall, I don't see how DBA-02 can be rated higher overall. Is it the best all arounder? I don't think so because its treble can be slightly too bright, the bass is not always as defined as I would've liked and the compressed dynamic range works better with some music than other music.


 
  I'd be happy to offer my view versus the ER4S.  The DBA-02 has better clarity and more pronounced detail from mid to treble because of it.  Listen to the sound of glass breaking on Rush's YYZ and you'll hear one aspect of the DBA's superior timbre in that region.  It actually sounds like someone threw a vase at your head.  Despite being more 'accurate' or 'neutral' the DBA sounds more natural and closer to real life versus the ER4 which sounds like a 2 dimensional recording.  Despite inferior bass extension the DBA is fuller and has more body and impact from the mid bass up which contributes to that natural sound by balancing out the spectrum nicely.  As good as the ER4S is it always sounds like a balanced armature due to it's thinness and inferior transparency (definition 1 or 2 depending).  As always YMMV on tips, fit, seal, musical preferences.  Apart from more linear balance, extension and texture the ER4S does nothing better except maybe 1-2 dB of isolation. 
   
  I actually would rate the DBA higher overall because the build quality and isolation potential is superior to say the SM3 IMO.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Agreed 100%. But the ratings are still there and a 9.3 is still less than a 9.5 and it sure has a psychological effect on people, especially those new to headphones and head-fi. Especially if you then also look at the price. DBA-02 is rated _higher _than e-Q7 and costs _half the price_! Which IEM do you think a newbie reading the reviews is more likely to pick. DBA-02 by a landslide.


 

 I'd pick the DBA over the EQ5 though it would be very, very close.  I'm still not coping well w/ Moving Armature bass presentation.  If the GR10 doesn't improve on the EQ5 low-end I'm not interested.  If I was more focused on classical and acoustic I probably would prefer the EQ5.  For rock, pop, metal, electronic, etc.  DBA-02.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I'd pick the DBA over the EQ5 though it would be very, very close.  I'm still not coping well w/ Moving Armature bass presentation.  If the GR10 doesn't improve on the EQ5 low-end I'm not interested.  If I was more focused on classical and acoustic I probably would prefer the EQ5.  For rock, pop, metal, electronic, etc.  DBA-02.


 
   
  While we're doing opposing viewpoints I couldn't stand the DBA-02 for modern rock and metal (my main genres) due to the shrilly treble when crashy cymbals came about. I've never heard a moving armature but I'd love to get my hands on one. If the ER4P sounds at all similar to the iM716 (which it SHOULD, although I've never actually heard one) I think I would take the DBA-02 for detail and very singular music (i.e. not busy, with few instruments going on at the same time, and no cymbals), but the ER4P for a more natural balance and very clinical detail. In comparison the DBA-02 has a more... airy detail, if you know what I mean. It doesn't focus on the detail but by virtue of its speed and treble quantity it is there in spades.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I'd be happy to offer my view versus the ER4S.  *The DBA-02 has better clarity and more pronounced detail from mid to treble because of it*.  Listen to the sound of glass breaking on Rush's YYZ and you'll hear one aspect of the DBA's superior timbre in that region.  It actually sounds like someone threw a vase at your head.  Despite being more 'accurate' or 'neutral' the DBA sounds more natural and closer to real life versus the ER4 which sounds like a 2 dimensional recording.  Despite inferior bass extension the DBA is fuller and has more body and impact from the mid bass up which contributes to that natural sound by balancing out the spectrum nicely.  As good as the ER4S is it always sounds like a balanced armature due to it's thinness and inferior transparency (definition 1 or 2 depending).  As always YMMV on tips, fit, seal, musical preferences.  Apart from more linear balance, extension and texture the ER4S does nothing better except maybe 1-2 dB of isolation.
> 
> I actually would rate the DBA higher overall because the build quality and isolation potential is superior to say the SM3 IMO.


 
  Interesting. I find ER4S sharper and more detailed overall than DBA-02. Clarity is great on both, but DBA is definitely not clearer to my ears. DBA-02 creates an illusion of extra clarity because of brighter treble and an overall brighter, more forward sound. ER4S is more subtle, textured and neutral. More laid back if you will. ER4S is more dynamic too - quieter passages in recordings have more power with ER4S to my ears. DBA-02 is more 3D, yes, but also less coherent. I sometimes still feel chunks of sounds floating around in the soundstage without being attached to any clear musical content, whereas with ER4, every sound is always a part of the whole.
   
  That being said, I do like DBA-02. Its a very nice IEM indeed and a good all arounder for the price. But it just isnt really better overall than an ER4, RE262 or e-Q7 as it does not do everything as well as these IEMs.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> While we're doing opposing viewpoints I couldn't stand the DBA-02 for modern rock and metal (my main genres) due to the shrilly treble when crashy cymbals came about. I've never heard a moving armature but I'd love to get my hands on one. If the ER4P sounds at all similar to the iM716 (which it SHOULD, although I've never actually heard one) I think I would take the DBA-02 for detail and very singular music (i.e. not busy, with few instruments going on at the same time, and no cymbals), but the ER4P for a more natural balance and very clinical detail. In comparison the DBA-02 has a more... airy detail, if you know what I mean. It doesn't focus on the detail but by virtue of its speed and treble quantity it is there in spades.


 

 That's funny, the ER4P would shred my ears after more than 15 minutes.  I couldn't stand them, much shrillier than my DBA.  ER4S is great though.  Just goes to show, ears, tips, fit, gear.  All relative.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Interesting. I find ER4S sharper and more detailed overall than DBA-02. Clarity is great on both, but DBA is definitely not clearer to my ears. DBA-02 creates an illusion of extra clarity because of brighter treble and an overall brighter, more forward sound. ER4S is more subtle, textured and neutral. More laid back if you will. ER4S is more dynamic too - quieter passages in recordings have more power with ER4S to my ears. DBA-02 is more 3D, yes, but also less coherent. I sometimes still feel chunks of sounds floating around in the soundstage without being attached to any clear musical content, whereas with ER4, every sound is always a part of the whole.
> 
> That being said, I do like DBA-02. Its a very nice IEM indeed and a good all arounder for the price. But it just isnt really better overall than an ER4, RE262 or e-Q7 as it does not do everything as well as these IEMs.


 

 I stand by my comments and weight the natural sound of the DBA over the more clinical and technical performance of the ER4.  If you can provide a philosophic basis for how you weight one metric over another feel free.  Many phones excel at putting checks in boxes.  My highest weighted criteria is how a phone sounds compared to how my ears hear without phones.
   
  Hell, I've seen people go on and on about the fruity notes of X wine over Y and blah, blah, blah.  By the time they're done w/ their pretentiousness I need a good freaking Scotch.  I'll take a Lagavulin over some hyped, watered down, grape juice anyday.  But that's just me.  Slightly OT.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

@ Pianist, you seem a bit too agressive... I mean the guy rates the earphones according to his hears and knowledge, and when you add that to the fact that the sound is "subjective", your objection makes little to no sense...


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I stand by my comments and weight the natural sound of the DBA over the more clinical and technical performance of the ER4.  If you can provide a philosophic basis for how you weight one metric over another feel free.  Many phones excel at putting checks in boxes.  My highest weighted criteria is how a phone sounds compared to how my ears hear without phones.


 
  I think ER4 is just really revealing. Pair it with a high quality warm, musical source and it will sound warm and musical.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> I think ER4 is just really revealing. Pair it with a high quality warm, musical source and it will sound warm and musical.


 

 It is, but I think the DBA is more so taken into context of what I said.  It's easier for me to differentiate sources than w/ the ER4S IMO.  Pair the ER4S w/ the DACPort and it will sound warmer than the DBA-02.  Fyi, the DACPort is not warm at all.  Not that my IERM cares either way.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> @ Pianist, you seem a bit too agressive... I mean the guy rates the earphones according to his hears and knowledge, and when you add that to the fact that the sound is "subjective", your objection makes little to no sense...


 
  Well, if this was just some 1000 word review, I wouldnt be complaining. But Jokers comparison seems to become more and more of a reference on head-fi for comparing IEMs and one of the first reviews a newb looking for IEMs is likely to read. So I think it is very important for this grand effort to be as objective as possible. I am just providing some ideas on how to improve it and make it more helpful to readers, that is all. I think the rating system should be abolished because it is too subjective and can often give a wrong impression that one IEM is better than another on a subconscious level, even if the person is consciously aware that sound is all subjective.


----------



## Anaxilus

Damn you Huddler!


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Hey Joker. I think DBA-02 is probably rated too highly. I don't think it deserves to be rated above RE252, e-Q7 and ER4S and RE262. I know you may prefer them more, but I think you should be a bit more objective. You reviews are excellent though, just don't necessarily reflect the rating well. I would place all of the aforementioned IEMs on par because I think that choosing between them is just a matter of personal preference. If you have strong reasons why you think that DBA-02 actually objectively beats all of them, then you should state it in your review. Personally, I can easily say that ER4S is more neutral and accurate than DBA-02, which is a bit too bright by comparison. I can also say that ER4S extends deeper in the low end and its low end is tighter and more defined than that of DBA-02. I think e-Q7 has smoother, better textured mids than DBA-02 and tighter, better textured bass as well. I think RE252 is more neutral than DBA-02 and the RE262 has smoother mids and much better dynamics than DBA-02. So overall, I don't see how DBA-02 can be rated higher overall. Is it the best all arounder? I don't think so because its treble can be slightly too bright, the bass is not always as defined as I would've liked and the compressed dynamic range works better with some music than other music.
> 
> Actually, I would drop ratings altogether. I think that sound is too subjective to be rated on a scale like this. You should just describe the sound of a 'phone and what you feel it does well and doesn't do well and then let the reader decide for himself whether it may be better than some other 'phone you described before based on your description.


 

 Sounds like sour grapes to me. Telling other people what they should hear and then when Joker doesn't match your opinion, he needs to let people decide for themselves. A bit hypocritical maybe. From what I have read, one person does present his opinion and lets people decide for themselves and the other doesn't quite practice what they preach in that regard.
   
  Each persons opinion only counts for so much. Ears and gears, YMMV, etc. Joker, ClieOS, and others clearly state and acknowledge that these are their opinions based on their set-up and methods. Respect their opinions and big deal if they don't agree with yours. I like the DBA better than the CK10. Some, including Joker, don't. More people like the DBA over the RE252. So what!
   
  IMO, Pianist, you've been around long enough to have gotten over the "my opinion is right and yours is wrong" thing by now. It is not an attack on you if someone hears something different esp. under a different set-up.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I stand by my comments and weight the *natural sound of the DBA over the more clinical and technical performance of the ER4.*  If you can provide a philosophic basis for how you weight one metric over another feel free.  Many phones excel at putting checks in boxes.  My highest weighted criteria is how a phone sounds compared to how my ears hear without phones.
> 
> Hell, I've seen people go on and on about the fruity notes of X wine over Y and blah, blah, blah.  By the time they're done w/ their pretentiousness I need a good freaking Scotch.  I'll take a Lagavulin over some hyped, watered down, grape juice anyday.  But that's just me.  Slightly OT.


 

 Funny how we disagree about the relative frequency balance of the DBA-02 but agree on this part. Oh well. I wish I could hear the DBA-02 you guys are all hearing


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Sounds like sour grapes to me. Telling other people what they should hear and then when Joker doesn't match your opinion, he needs to let people decide for themselves. A bit hypocritical maybe. From what I have read, one person does present his opinion and lets people decide for themselves and the other doesn't quite practice what they preach in that regard.
> 
> Each persons opinion only counts for so much. Ears and gears, YMMV, etc. Joker, ClieOS, and others clearly state and acknowledge that these are their opinions based on their set-up and methods. Respect their opinions and big deal if they don't agree with yours. I like the DBA better than the CK10. Some, including Joker, don't. More people like the DBA over the RE252. So what!
> 
> IMO, Pianist, you've been around long enough to have gotten over the "my opinion is right and yours is wrong" thing by now. It is not an attack on you if someone hears something different esp. under a different set-up.


   
  Ok, when one says that he prefers this IEM over that IEM, that's one thing, but when one says that this IEM is a 9.4/10 and that one is a 9.5/10, that's completely different. It's just way too precise to judge the subjective perception of sound in this way. I mean in the above case, you could say that they are too close to make any objective claims about which one is better. But what about 9.3/10 vs. 9.6/10? Is the one rated at 9.3 really better than the one rated at 9.6, or they are just too close to tell? And what about 9.2 vs. 9.7? Just when can one draw the line and say that this IEM is indeed in better than that one overall, based on such a rating? Therefore, I think that rating IEMs in this way is very unconvincing and only confuses things. I think Joker's older rating of 0.5 point increments was more reasonable, because sound cannot be judged so precisely. But even that is too much I think.
   
  I don't understand your claim that I am telling others what they should be hearing. I always put "IMO," "to my ears," etc in all my posts to indicate that it is just my opinion and that I am not forcing people to take it as facts. I am not stupid and I understand that sound is very subjective and that I am not God with golden ears and that my opinion is not the only right one. Also, it's not my opinion that DBA-02 is not better than e-Q7 or RE262 - it's a fact because there are people who prefer e-Q7 and RE262 to DBA-02 and to them DBA-02 is not better.
   
  Also, if I don't always practice what I preach that sure doesn't mean that what I preach is wrong. We are all humans and we can all be overtaken by emotions and do irrational things.


----------



## rymd

I think he's remained pretty objective with his reviews. The ratings are comparative, not empirical, so phones with 9.4 and 9.5 may be essentially on the same level, but the 9.5 just barely edges out the 9.4 in areas he thinks are important. I think he said when he switched to the .1 system that it was because there were too many earphones at the top all around the same level, 9.3 and 9.5 don't necessarily mean that the 9.5 is better, and that he just wanted to give the ratings a bit more detail. 
The first statement in the review works pretty well:


> This thread contains concise observations on IEMs in my possession. It is meant to be a quick reference for those in need of earphone recommendations or a start-off point for research into IEMs. The observations reflect my personal experience with each earphone and should be taken as such - audio, after all, is extremely subjective.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





rymd said:


> I think he's remained pretty objective with his reviews. The ratings are comparative, not empirical, so phones with 9.4 and 9.5 may be essentially on the same level, but the 9.5 just barely edges out the 9.4 in areas he thinks are important. I think he said when he switched to the .1 system that it was because there were too many earphones at the top all around the same level, 9.3 and 9.5 don't necessarily mean that the 9.5 is better, and that he just wanted to give the ratings a bit more detail.
> The first statement in the review works pretty well:


 
  Ok, so all the 9s are pretty much top tier, the 8s are near top tier, the 7s are midrange, etc, while the differences between the levels are more personal preference. Well, that makes sense I guess. Maybe I was a bit too harsh indeed. Still, I find this whole 9.4, 9.5 rating a bit too detailed. I think it will be better if the rating is dropped and the 'phones are just classified by tier and price range.


----------



## esanthosh

I think you are taking this ratings thing too seriously, Pianist.
   
  I have a very similar preference to Joker and hence I tend to agree with his SQ ratings more than you do. There are also IEMs like SM3 & UM3X, which Joker does not like as much personally, but still awarded a higher rating. I think he is doing a fine job objectively. There is no need to drop the rating just because you or I have a disagreement with it.


----------



## UpTownsNV

Hi I am new to HeadFi and custom IEM in general Im looking for a entry level custom IEM and the X1 from kozee looks like a strong contender can anyone recommend any other single driver solution from  any other custom IEM manufacture 1964-S, Alien Ears(C1000) , DRM, Challenger series from ear plug store etc...


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> I think you are taking this ratings thing too seriously, Pianist.
> 
> I have a very similar preference to Joker and hence I tend to agree with his SQ ratings more than you do. There are also IEMs like SM3 & UM3X, which Joker does not like as much personally, but still awarded a higher rating. I think he is doing a fine job objectively. There is no need to drop the rating just because you or I have a disagreement with it.


 

 Yes, for proof of his objectivity just look at the ratings for the Turbines. Totally not his sound signature at all but he's quite aware of that, and awarded a score accordingly. If I were scoring on objectivity alone I'd give the Turbines a 7 and the Coppers an 8, I just don't like the sound signature very much.


----------



## ljokerl

The thing with using a rating scale is that no matter how objective you think you are, there will always, _always_ be someone who disagrees. If it were my intention for this thread to represent the opinion head-fi as a whole, I'd have to take that into account. However, there is already the Head Gear section and, for obvious reasons, I cannot modify my own ratings based on what someone else is hearing out of a particular earphone. I have no problem with open discussion of the ratings but I don't understand the end goal of these arguments. 

The decimal system is here to stay - I do not pretend to be accurate in my ratings but a lot of deliberation goes not only into each rating but also into each time I change the scale around. Nowhere have I guaranteed that someone - or even the majority of listeners - will like a higher-rated earphone better than a lower-rated one. I used to say that personal preferences could shift the scale by a point or even more but there really is no range for the potency personal preference. This thread is fallible and should always be considered a work in progress. It is not a one-step, beginning-to-end guide for every IEM search but rather a one-page, 100,000-word resource containing reviews all written by one person with the same set of ears, same set of tracks, same gear, and same set of reference points. In that context, the scores act to drastically reduce the number of "so which is better" questions that occur when 162 individual earphone reviews are involved. 




kanuka said:


> same requirments as before comfort/isolation. and but for these they should "shine with female-vocals". the Westone 1, dont seem to be comfort for me
> thnks




Have to ask: what do you find uncomfortable about the W1? 




anaxilus said:


> Hell, I've seen people go on and on about the fruity notes of X wine over Y and blah, blah, blah.  By the time they're done w/ their pretentiousness I need a good freaking Scotch.  I'll take a Lagavulin over some hyped, watered down, grape juice anyday.  But that's just me.  Slightly OT.




Lovely. I wonder if wine aficionados would be similarly open-minded to the finer points of audiophilia .




uptownsnv said:


> Hi I am new to HeadFi and custom IEM in general Im looking for a entry level custom IEM and the X1 from kozee looks like a strong contender can anyone recommend any other single driver solution from  any other custom IEM manufacture 1964-S, Alien Ears(C1000) , DRM, Challenger series from ear plug store etc...




I think you are extremely unlikely to find someone who owns more than one single-driver custom - it just doesn't make sense - even less so than having multiple top-tier universals. For what it's worth I think the Infinity is the cheapest single you're going to find but you can see a list of all of them with pricing in average_joe's custom info thread.


----------



## kanuka

the shape they have, sitting "stuck" in the ear , i feel that will be bothersome for me . same goes for the meelec m6


----------



## RADI0HEAD

pianist said:


> Ok, so all the 9s are pretty much top tier, the 8s are near top tier, the 7s are midrange, etc, while the differences between the levels are more personal preference. Well, that makes sense I guess. Maybe I was a bit too harsh indeed. Still, I find this whole 9.4, 9.5 rating a bit too detailed. I think it will be better if the rating is dropped and the 'phones are just classified by tier and price range.



Try convincing cigar or wine reviewers that their number systems are too detailed.

More important are the notes (comfort, build quality, isolation, sound, microphonics, how it compares to model A, B, X etc.).


----------



## ljokerl

kanuka said:


> the shape they have, sitting "stuck" in the ear , i feel that will be bothersome for me . same goes for the meelec m6




I would still recommend the W1. You'd be surprised at how comfortable 'form-fitted' IEMs can be. Failing that, I'd go with the A151 or PL50. A151 has less of a midrange emphasis than the PL50/W1 but very good isolation with the right tips. PR401 is not really something to get specifically for vocals - the Silver Bullets would be more like it.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  thanks joker
   
  my pl50 are already on their way (been ordered i few weeks before) , but it seems they'll take a while more than expected.
  but from you say, the pl50 should match my needs similarly like the w1/a151.
  about the silver bullet, to be honest i dont like the design. yes, i know it's a silly reason but still....
  i guess the sunrise xcape  wont meet my needs too?
  and about "form-fitted" i dont want to take a risk for that price , but i may consider trying first the m6 only for comfort matter and then reconsider the W1
   
  anyway. what about the DBA-02 , Brainwavz B2 and triple10 i mentioned before?. the B2 preorder seems really a good deal and i dont want to miss it.  but im not sure which to get (if any)
  i think the B2 and DBA-02 wont be so different , like the t10 will. but i want to know which ones will match my tastes


----------



## a1rflow

Any progress on the MC5's? I'd like to see how they stand up to RE0s.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Then again, if the "form" doesn't fit your ear it's just a big pain. I discovered that my old M6 had a shell that was too big for my ears, which caused discomfort. No wonder I never liked IEMs, what with my first two experiences being the ear-raping iM716 and the too-large M6.


----------



## ljokerl

kanuka said:


> thanks joker
> 
> my pl50 are already on their way (been ordered i few weeks before) , but it seems they'll take a while more than expected.
> but from you say, the pl50 should match my needs similarly like the w1/a151.
> ...




Production versions of the B2 and DBA-02 should sound quite similar. TF10 is very different and there was a thread somewhere with TF10/Fischer comparisons.




a1rflow said:


> Any progress on the MC5's? I'd like to see how they stand up to RE0s.




MC5 review is finished and should be posted later this week.




ikarios said:


> Then again, if the "form" doesn't fit your ear it's just a big pain. I discovered that my old M6 had a shell that was too big for my ears, which caused discomfort. No wonder I never liked IEMs, what with my first two experiences being the ear-raping iM716 and the too-large M6.




W1 is significantly smaller and slimmer than the M6 which is why i was wondering.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 yes. i checked that thread just now. and from what i've read the triple f10 dont seem to be for me. i'll double check your own review of the b2.
   
  any picture comparing the m6 and W1 ?
  algthough from your multi-review, the sound points of the W1 are lower than the Dba-02. should i take that on count for *my *signature tastes.
  since you mentioned the W1 "shine" with vocals, i really wanted 'em.... but as i mentioned i'm afraid of having comfort issues
  looks like i'll get the B2, just hope not to make a mistake


----------



## tennisfan20

I just got a pair of A151s from the Amazon deal for $50. However, I'm having trouble getting right fit and isolation. I use Sony hybrids with my M6s and they fit really well. Any advice on a pair of tips for the A151s?
   
  Basically, I want better isolation. The meelec tips are always flimsy.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kanuka said:


> yes. i checked that thread just now. and from what i've read the triple f10 dont seem to be for me. i'll double check your own review of the b2.
> any picture comparing the m6 and W1 ?


   
  Sorry, no such photo that I'm aware of.
   

 Quote:


tennisfan20 said:


> I just got a pair of A151s from the Amazon deal for $50. However, I'm having trouble getting right fit and isolation. I use Sony hybrids with my M6s and they fit really well. Any advice on a pair of tips for the A151s?
> 
> Basically, I want better isolation. The meelec tips are always flimsy.


   
  Hybrids should work with the A151 as well - the notch on the nozzle keeps them very secure - unless yours are stretched out by larger earphones already. Other tips that fit are Phonak silicone tips for the PFE and Monster Supertips. Probably some Complys, too, though I don't know which size.


----------



## Majin

Is the Vsonic GR07 going to be added to the list anytime soon?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





majin said:


> Is the Vsonic GR07 going to be added to the list anytime soon?


 

 No, Joker listened to Pianist and has decided to stop posting reviews.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

joker,
  if u dont mind, can u help list me out 5 dynamic iems, within the $200 price bracket, that have a balance sound like sm3, of slightly more bassier.
   
  1. smoothest sound, zero harshness.
  2. widest extension, lower freq is more prioritized than high freq.
   
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> No, Joker listened to Pianist and has decided to stop posting reviews.


   
  Definitely thought about it.
   
   
  Quote:


daemontentacle said:


> joker,
> if u dont mind, can u help list me out 5 dynamic iems, within the $200 price bracket, that have a balance sound like sm3, of slightly more bassier.
> 
> 1. smoothest sound, zero harshness.
> ...


 
 Wait, you want all of those in one earphone? RE262 or MTPG would probably be closest but the latter cannot compete with the SM3 in resolution and the former has arguably less bass (or at least less impact) than the SM3. The VSonic GR07 probably has the best top-to-bottom presence but it is definitely not emphasized down low and also not the most inoffensive set in terms of harshness/sibilance. The DDM is another one with emphasized bass but it has other issues...


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

^
  lol.. sorry was a bit confusing.. ahahaha..
  then i said sound balance like sm3, i was more referring to the quantity of lows, mids, and highs, not detail or resolution. specifically i wanted to know what single dynamic driver, with open acoustic, that doesnt lack in terms of quantity, and have a good extension especially at the lower end. Iem that does 'complete' bass is something like vb or ddm, but vb is harsh and dry sounding, ddm is 2 soundstage position issue.
  so anyway lets list out 5 of whats u think is smoothest sounding single dynamics that is not offensive, and vented.


----------



## nizarp

Joker,

 Can you please give a quick comparison between the GR07 and the Brainwavz B2.


----------



## RADI0HEAD

anaxilus said:


> No, Joker listened to Pianist and has decided to stop posting reviews.



Almost spit up my beverage. lol


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daemontentacle said:


> ^
> lol.. sorry was a bit confusing.. ahahaha..
> then i said sound balance like sm3, i was more referring to the quantity of lows, mids, and highs, not detail or resolution. specifically i wanted to know what single dynamic driver, with open acoustic, that doesnt lack in terms of quantity, and have a good extension especially at the lower end. Iem that does 'complete' bass is something like vb or ddm, but vb is harsh and dry sounding, ddm is 2 soundstage position issue.
> so anyway lets list out 5 of whats u think is smoothest sounding single dynamics that is not offensive, and vented.


 

 I still don't think you're going to come up with a list of five. Let's see - there are only about 10 top-tier dynamics in total (that I've heard):
   
  MTPC
  MTPG
  Monster MD
  IE8
  IE7
  FX700
  RE262
  RE252
  Radius DDM (which you've tried)
  Radius W21
  Yuin OK1
  GR07
   
  Discounting anything that's over your $200 limit or not vented, we get:
   
   
  IE7
  RE262
  RE252
  Yuin OK1
  GR07
   
  Dropping anything with significantly less bass impact than the SM3:
   
   
  IE7
  RE262
  GR07
   
  But I really wouldn't call the GR07 especially smooth. It is detailed, textured, and a little dry. Does have great extension, though, but really not an SM3-type signature.
   


  Quote: 





nizarp said:


> Joker,
> 
> Can you please give a quick comparison between the GR07 and the Brainwavz B2.


 

 I have not heard the final production version of the B2 so I cannot give a proper comparison. I would expect it to sound very close, if not identical, to the DBA-02, but of course noone knows for sure at this point. There was a good DBA-02 vs GR07 comparison in one of the GR07 threads if you're willing to live with that approximation.


----------



## Niyologist

I installed the Comply Foam Tips T-400 (Medium) on my SP51. The results....Better Bass response! It's even better than the Meelec Silicon Ear tips. The bass isn't muddy either, instead it's more textured and it's slightly deeper and bigger. It's also tighter and punchier and especially with the Extreme Bass Port on it. I suggest someone else who is experienced to try this out because I just want to know what I heard is true.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Ortofon e-Q5 and Etymotic MC5


----------



## UserFriendly

Can't wait for the Shure SE535 reviews


----------



## battleaxe

Your review really makes me want to go out and find a place to listen to the MC5. Would you say HF5 worth the extra $25(based on what I saw on amazon) over the MC5?


----------



## Ikarios

Damn you Joker, I just received the GR07 and I've decided I like it more than the Phonaks.... and now you go pop the e-Q5 on me, making it sound like it's all rainbows and butterflies to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Just to be sure, the e-Q5 is still a relatively mid-oriented headphone (like the RE262) compared to more neutral IEMs like the GR07 and the grey filter Phonak PFE 122, right? It sounds lik the e-Q5 is a slightly more extended, slightly more neutral version of the RE262. Also, how large are those nozzles compared to something like the CC51? I almost had trouble with the size of the CC51 nozzle and the e-Q5 seems like it's significantly larger than that, which means it probably won't fit in my tiny ear canals.


----------



## Anaxilus

Solid Joker, pretty spot on to how I heard the MC5 and EQ5.  Kudos to your subjectivity not letting the underwhelming factor of the MC5 creep into your score.


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Excellent review, joker! I am glad to see the IEM that introduced me to audiophilia making its debut into your review list. Most of all, I agree with your review.
    
   
  Quote:


battleaxe said:


> Your review really makes me want to go out and find a place to listen to the MC5. Would you recommend the MC5 over other Etymotics for a person looking for total package?


 
  From a person that owned the MC5 (until a friend lost it) and the ER4, I like to think of the MC5 as the introduction to the Etymotic sound signature. I'd hardly call the MC5 as a total package since there are loads of room for improvement over all aspects... but then that depends on what you do mean by a 'total package'.
   
  In comparison to the rest of the Etymotic earphones in technical performance, there is no comparison between either the HF5 or the ER4 to the MC5. The MC5 just doesn't compete in the end.
   
  Of course, in comparison to its competitors in its price range is a completely different story though...


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> I almost had trouble with the size of the CC51 nozzle and the e-Q5 seems like it's significantly larger than that, which means it probably won't fit in my tiny ear canals.


 

 It's 50% thicker by direct comparison.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> It's 50% thicker by direct comparison.


 

 Phew, that saves me another couple hundred...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Your review really makes me want to go out and find a place to listen to the MC5. Would you say HF5 worth the extra $25(based on what I saw on amazon) over the MC5?


 
   
   
  Absolutely. I liked my HF3 enough to have custom tips made by ACS. It's not as good as my old ER4S but it sounds fine straight out of my phone and is much more practical. Better than the MC5 in every aspect except maybe bass body and thickness, if you're into that sort of thing. 


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Damn you Joker, I just received the GR07 and I've decided I like it more than the Phonaks.... and now you go pop the e-Q5 on me, making it sound like it's all rainbows and butterflies to me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The e-Q5 is mid-oriented, yes. Not unbalanced, though. The nozzle is smaller than with the CC51 but the housing is bigger, obviously. I can stretch sony hybrids over the e-Q5 nozzle pretty easily but they definitely won't fit on my CC51.


  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Solid Joker, pretty spot on to how I heard the MC5 and EQ5.  Kudos to your subjectivity not letting the underwhelming factor of the MC5 creep into your score.


 

 Thanks. And yeah, the MC5 is a little bleh, but if I put the RE-ZERO, Xcape V1, and HF3 far out of reach I can enjoy it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 

  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> It's 50% thicker by direct comparison.


 
   
   
  The nozzle or the housing itself?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> The nozzle or the housing itself?


 

 Housing.  If he just inserts up to the tip on the nozzle it seems it might fall out?  My real-time simulation failed to pass.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  The nozzle alone is perhaps 1mm thinner than the CC51, I can't imagine what tip you would use to even get it in w/o deformation.  He could use small tri-flanges perhaps over the ear.
   
  I think I just realized why Aflac wasn't able to get the low end from the DBA.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The e-Q5 is mid-oriented, yes. Not unbalanced, though. The nozzle is smaller than with the CC51 but the housing is bigger, obviously. I can stretch sony hybrids over the e-Q5 nozzle pretty easily but they definitely won't fit on my CC51.


 

 Whoops - didn't notice there was even a nozzle. Dumb. Still, given how large they are I don't think they would work in my ears, since they'd stick out like Frankenstein bolts. >$170-220 disaster averted, wallet is happy
  At least, it's nothing like the Qjays where the whole thing can potentially disappear in my ear canal. That's nice.
   
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I think I just realized why Aflac wasn't able to get the low end from the DBA.


 

 Honestly, that may have been it - I always had a little bit of trouble with fit on the DBA-02; the super-soft Hybrid-like tips didn't seal, and neither did the biflanges; only the stock single-flanges and Monster Supertips fit. I thought I was getting a good seal, though, and insertion depth didn't matter even if I shoved em in. I've listened to enough IEMs that I know what a bad seal sounds like and the DBA-02 just didn't sound like a bad seal to me. The Gel Supertips in particular were a great fit; I used them nicely with the CK10s. I also tried Comply T100s (which are basically guaranteed to seal, right?) and that didn't help much.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> Excellent review, joker! I am glad to see the IEM that introduced me to audiophilia making its debut into your review list. Most of all, I agree with your review.
> From a person that owned the MC5 (until a friend lost it) and the ER4, I like to think of the MC5 as the introduction to the Etymotic sound signature. I'd hardly call the MC5 as a total package since there are loads of room for improvement over all aspects... but then that depends on what you do mean by a 'total package'.
> 
> In comparison to the rest of the Etymotic earphones in technical performance, there is no comparison between either the HF5 or the ER4 to the MC5. The MC5 just doesn't compete in the end.
> ...


 

 Let me ask you this then. I tried the ER6i and the SQ wasn't to my liking, it was kind of fatiguing the first minute of trying it. I don't think it was a problem with the one I tired, as I did try on another one with the same results. Would the HF5 or MC5 have similar signature vs the ER6i?


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Let me ask you this then. I tried the ER6i and the SQ wasn't to my liking, it was kind of fatiguing the first minute of trying it. I don't think it was a problem with the one I tired, as I did try on another one with the same results. Would the HF5 or MC5 have similar signature vs the ER6i?


 

 I unfortunately haven't heard of the ER6i to make that comparison. If you got fatigued due to the treble, then it is highly likely that Etymotic in general just isn't suitable for you.
   
  Again though, I have no idea at all to how the ER6i should or would sound.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

dunno why my reply button wont work, but thanks joker. thats very helpful way of putting it actually.
  didnt expect ie7 to be in the list. will try them out again later, cant really recall how they sound like anymore, except for being very wet in the bass.. >_<
   
  btw, can u help me out with listing the ones with most extension as well? any dynamic goes. Iater i'll also gonna read ur thoughts on the eq5 and mc5, always liked to read reviews, especially comparison reviews. cheers


----------



## edmundtyw1

Would it be better to reshell a DBA-02 or get a custom?


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





edmundtyw1 said:


> Would it be better to reshell a DBA-02 or get a custom?


 


  A reshelled DBA-02 would be, by definition, a custom.  If you really like your DBA-02, it'd probably be best to just reshell that, since a custom at around that price would never be as good.
   
  ...of course, if you don't already have the DBA-02, that's a different matter.


----------



## nyjets28

i love this thread. hope the reviews never end haha. i pretty much use this thread whenever i consider buying something. just ordered a pair of mc5's after yesterday's review


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> I unfortunately haven't heard of the ER6i to make that comparison. If you got fatigued due to the treble, then it is highly likely that Etymotic in general just isn't suitable for you.
> 
> Again though, I have no idea at all to how the ER6i should or would sound.


 


  Thank you for the reply. I do like treble, but maybe the ER6i had too much of it. I guess I need to find the MC5 and HF5 in store to see how those compare.


----------



## mark2410

very, very generous mark to the mc5 if you ask me


----------



## jant71

I think the score for the MC5 is fine. Not really very Ety-like though as it is quite dark. Needs the right tips or it can be a real disappointment. Like the SM3, the MC5 was rescued(for me) by the Kanen KM-948 tips. We were all over that in the MC5 thread; they are one of the more YMMV phones out there and their level of satisfaction really varies. I sold my MC5 and kept the CLX60. A/B'd them both over a few days and decided I preferred the Pioneer.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





edmundtyw1 said:


> Would it be better to reshell a DBA-02 or get a custom?


 

 IMO get something that is meant to be a custom. The DBA-02 while is good at a damn good price it can't keep up with actual customs (not reshells). That changes if you add drivers and such but I would either keep the DBA-02 and get a custom or sell the DBA-02 to help fund the custom.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Let me ask you this then. I tried the ER6i and the SQ wasn't to my liking, it was kind of fatiguing the first minute of trying it. I don't think it was a problem with the one I tired, as I did try on another one with the same results. Would the HF5 or MC5 have similar signature vs the ER6i?


 

 The signature of the Er6i is closer to that of the HF-series than the MC5 but with less presence in the lowest octave. I would not recommend the HF5 if you hated the Er6i, and it's probably not worth risking the MC5 either. Depending on your end goal, there are earphones that are just as competent (or even more so) without chancing listening fatigue, such as the RE-ZERO.
   


  Quote: 





daemontentacle said:


> dunno why my reply button wont work, but thanks joker. thats very helpful way of putting it actually.
> didnt expect ie7 to be in the list. will try them out again later, cant really recall how they sound like anymore, except for being very wet in the bass.. >_<
> 
> btw, can u help me out with listing the ones with most extension as well? any dynamic goes. Iater i'll also gonna read ur thoughts on the eq5 and mc5, always liked to read reviews, especially comparison reviews. cheers


 

 The IE7 is on the list only because there was no real reason to eliminate it - it is not sealed, doesn't roll off noticeably, and is generally pretty competent. That said, I think the GR07 is a better earphone.
   
  As you saw there are very few high-end dynamics out there. I'd add the IE8 and FX700 if price is no object - certainly no extension issues on either of those.


----------



## edmundtyw1

because even a custom cost more than a reshelled triple fi from ebay


----------



## battleaxe

Well I guess I have to try the HF5 and MC5 in person before I can fully pass on them or not. But, thank you joker.


----------



## b0ck3n

Just wanted to point out that the RE-ZERO is rather fit and seal dependant and can be a fatiguing listen if you don't get the right seal. Once that's out of the way the only thing stopping me from wearing them always is that I don't know sign language.

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The signature of the Er6i is closer to that of the HF-series than the MC5 but with less presence in the lowest octave. I would not recommend the HF5 if you hated the Er6i, and it's probably not worth risking the MC5 either. Depending on your end goal, there are earphones that are just as competent (or even more so) without chancing* listening fatigue*, such as the *RE-ZERO*.


----------



## edmundtyw1

How would you compare the Triple Fi 10 to the DBA-02 since i can get them both at around the same price


----------



## supersleuth

I found the MC5 quite fit-dependent as well, and I think that may help account for the wide range of opinions about them. (I use the large triflanges.) I also found them dark at first until I got the hang of inserting them properly- at least for the shape of my ear canals a really deep insertion, achieved by moistening the tips and pulling up fairly hard on my ear as I insert  the tip, seems to be vital for treble as well as bass extension. Since I got the hang of that, they seem roughly as bright as my SR80s (which I wear low and forward, so they aren't nearly as bright as when worn circumaurally), and a little less bassy, but overall similar enough that there's surprisingly little adjustment involved in going back and forth. Maybe that fit-dependence makes them too fussy to be generally recommendable, but they work nicely for me.


----------



## Niyologist

I think I might've found a breakthrough for the Meelec SP51. The Comply Foam Tips T-400+Extreme Bass Port provides the punchiest and biggest bass. It's punchy for the Enhanced Bass Port, but the presence is less. There is also the fact that the treble is much more open and it's much more airy on both ports. My SP51 is still burning in, so I'm in for a goooooooood ride.


----------



## Pianist

Hi Joker,
   
  I think e-Q5 should be rated just a bit higher than the e-Q7. e-Q5 is better technically - it has better treble quality and extension and similar quality mids and bass, but more even and neutral. But this is of course debatable. I just felt that the treble on e-Q7 was clearly grainier and less refined than that of e-Q5. Also, just curious: what makes you give the FX700 a higher score? What do you feel they do better than the e-Q5?
   
  BTW, I just got RE0 again - borrowed from a fellow head-fi'er and I am so impressed with them! I compared directly with e-Q5 and I am honestly not sure which one is better at all. RE0 is just so incredibly composed, clear, detailed and transparent. e-Q5 is also great, but is it better than RE0? Honestly, I think it will take a high end source and amp to tell for sure. I only tried RE0 unamped, but we all know how well it scales. In your opinion - what makes the e-Q5 superior to RE0?
   
  I just looked over your RE0 review and read this: "They are very neutral with maybe just a hint of warmth, but *lack lushness or liquidity*." Do you still feel the same way about them? I always thought RE0 had very smooth mids. They may not have the ultra lushness of SE530 or RE262, but they are on par with e-Q5/e-Q7 in this regard and maybe even smoother to my ears. I used to own e-Q7 and RE0 at the same time and I ABed them a lot. I came to the conclusion that RE0 is actually smoother than e-Q7. Again, this is all subjective, but I would never say RE0 _lacks_ smoothness, no matter how I look at it.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

It looks like time for a Pianist multi IEM thread. and you know what? I would read it.


----------



## High_Q

Joker please review the ultimate high end universal IEM:  Sony EX-1000
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  You will not regret it.


----------



## RADI0HEAD

high_q said:


> Joker please review the ultimate high end universal IEM:  Sony EX-1000
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Maybe you can persuade him by sending him yours for evaluation.


----------



## RADI0HEAD

mcnoiserdc said:


> It looks like time for a Pianist multi IEM thread. and you know what? I would read it.



Not as easy as it looks.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm gonna go for the following earphones in the next year or so:
   
  Meelectronics CC51
  Monster Turbine Pro Copper
  Hippo VB's
  Sony MDR-EX 1000
  Westone UMX3
   
  I'm gonna need $2,000 to get these. Although I'm serious, I will achieve this because I'm very curious how these sound.


----------



## xtasi

Joker, could you compare the bass of the Sm2, Custom 3, and the eq-5?  I'm specifically looking at the quantity (they all already have good quality, right?)


----------



## jashanjeet

I'm really grateful to you for this wonderful comparison thread and all the effort and money you've put into comparing IEMs.
   
  Is the Stax SR-001 in any of your future plans?


----------



## goodvibes

Great review on the E-q5. I've described it as being detailed but with a bit of fill. Your explanation of micro detail is more to the point. Not noticeable unless you've heard something with more air and space between the notes. Never heard the EQ-7 but I think the bass balance VG on the E-q5. Depending on tip there's a very slight lower treble bump and general overall forwardness but these are very minor compared the more prominent character of some other highly regarded IEMs. I also think most sources aren't going to stress these and that they're forgiving while still fun and informative. A great big note IEM though that's over stating it for something with this type of info. A nice balance of attributes other than fit which is so so.


----------



## limpidglitch

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> very, very generous mark to the mc5 if you ask me


 


  A bit too generous mark if you ask me.
  I really appreciate jokers work, but with all due respect I think he's got it wrong when he claims the MC5 to be less sterile than the hf5. The hf5, as the er4, is very good at letting the music through perceptably un-altered. Rich and vivid music will sound rich and vivid, boring music will sound boring.
  The MC5, on the other hand, seems to make all music sound boring and lifeless. Now I might have fallen for semantic ambiguities here, as I read "less sterile" to to mean 'more lively'. If jokers intended meaning of the term were to be 'more dirty', I'd heartily agree.
  For the record I've tested all three IEMs with a wide selection and tips, with the single flange and Alpine eartips from sensorcom being my favourites.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





b0ck3n said:


> Just wanted to point out that the RE-ZERO is rather fit and seal dependant and can be a fatiguing listen if you don't get the right seal. Once that's out of the way the only thing stopping me from wearing them always is that I don't know sign language.


 

 I think that's true for most IEMs - poor seal means shrill treble (and no bass). The ZERO is perhaps less sensitive than most while the MC5 is more sensitive than average.


  Quote: 





edmundtyw1 said:


> How would you compare the Triple Fi 10 to the DBA-02 since i can get them both at around the same price


 

 There was an entire thread somewhere comparing the two. 


  Quote: 





pianist said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I think e-Q5 should be rated just a bit higher than the e-Q7. e-Q5 is better technically - it has better treble quality and extension and similar quality mids and bass, but more even and neutral. But this is of course debatable. I just felt that the treble on e-Q7 was clearly grainier and less refined than that of e-Q5. Also, just curious: what makes you give the FX700 a higher score? What do you feel they do better than the e-Q5?
> 
> ...


 

 Didn't you say that the FX700 should be rated higher than it is a couple of pages back? 
   
  While I do like the e-Q5 better than the e-Q7, I feel that it gave up some of the midrange detail and weight of the latter in striving to be smoother and more balanced, which is not necessarily a good thing for everyone. The RE0 (or  is a very good earphone but it doesn't quite have the speed or clarity of an e-Q5, nor the ability to throw distance cues as far. It is also less revealing when it comes to low-end detail, especially in the bottom octave. I like the RE0, always have, but it doesn't fare all that well in direct comparisons to top-tier earphones with a similar signature. If I had time I would re-write my old reviews with more detail but as it stands I have quite a backlog and it doesn't seem to be getting any shorter.
   
  I don't think the RE0 lacks smoothness, not at all, but lushness is going above and beyond. Lush-sounding earphones usually have an upper-bass or lower-midrange lift, which the RE0 does not.


  Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Joker, could you compare the bass of the Sm2, Custom 3, and the eq-5?  I'm specifically looking at the quantity (they all already have good quality, right?)


 

 Quantity: SM2 >> e-Q5 ~ KC3
   
  The KC3 and e-Q5 are both pretty flat. SM2 is very bassy in comparison (probably the bassiest armature aside from the W3) but as a result it also sounds the most bloated of the three. The bloat is not overbearing in the least but is rather unavoidable with that much bass. 


  Quote: 





jashanjeet said:


> I'm really grateful to you for this wonderful comparison thread and all the effort and money you've put into comparing IEMs.
> 
> Is the Stax SR-001 in any of your future plans?


 

 No, not at the time. I don't really see myself walking around with that thing (says the man who wore earpollution nerve pipes with zebra pads out and about).

  
  Quote: 





limpidglitch said:


> A bit too generous mark if you ask me.  I really appreciate jokers work, but with all due respect I think he's got it wrong when he claims the MC5 to be less sterile than the hf5. The hf5, as the er4, is very good at letting the music through perceptably un-altered. Rich and vivid music will sound rich and vivid, boring music will sound boring.
> The MC5, on the other hand, seems to make all music sound boring and lifeless. Now I might have fallen for semantic ambiguities here, as I read "less sterile" to to mean 'more lively'. If jokers intended meaning of the term were to be 'more dirty', I'd heartily agree.
> For the record I've tested all three IEMs with a wide selection and tips, with the single flange and Alpine eartips from sensorcom being my favourites.


 

 I don't think 'sterile' has a bad connotation... most would fine the CK10 and HF5 sterile, and those are still my favorite earphones at their respective price points. The MC5 is not as analytical, not as clean, and not as cold. That makes it less sterile but not really lively. I have custom tips for use with the HF5 and (with some twisting and pushing) the MC5. As for the score, I cannot dock points for 'boring' sound - that's far too subjective. The value score is also not as dependent on sound quality as most seem to assume - there's simply nothing that is better-built or more isolating at the MC5's price point.


----------



## xtasi

Thanks joker!

  EDIT: One last thing joker.  Do you think it would be better to EQ up the bass on the e-q5 or get the SM2?  I'm looking to upgrade my KC3, and I feel that the bass is just a tad too light, but my main beef is that its too thick and has not enough sparkle.  This makes me feel that the e-q5 would be a good fit.  Any thoughts or comments are appreciated as always.


----------



## limpidglitch

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think 'sterile' has a bad connotation... most would fine the CK10 and HF5 sterile, and those are still my favorite earphones at their respective price points. The MC5 is not as analytical, not as clean, and not as cold. That makes it less sterile but not really lively. I have custom tips for use with the HF5 and (with some twisting and pushing) the MC5. As for the score, I cannot dock points for 'boring' sound - that's far too subjective. The value score is also not as dependent on sound quality as most seem to assume - there's simply nothing that is better-built or more isolating at the MC5's price point.


 


  It appears that we do agree then


----------



## jackmccabe

Hi, I was just wondering of the iem's that you have tested which have been the best for rock and metal, and have great build quality and low microphonics.
  Thanks


----------



## oslpag

This is a stunning post, so much effort going into, great stuff.
   
  Could I make a suggestion, it would be nice if you could include the Y-Split in the photo of the earphone, it is always interesting to see how manufacturers implement them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Thanks joker!
> 
> EDIT: One last thing joker.  Do you think it would be better to EQ up the bass on the e-q5 or get the SM2?  I'm looking to upgrade my KC3, and I feel that the bass is just a tad too light, but my main beef is that its too thick and has not enough sparkle.  This makes me feel that the e-q5 would be a good fit.  Any thoughts or comments are appreciated as always.


 
   
  Not sure about EQing up the bass on the e-Q5 (haven't had the need) but I don't think the SM2 has more sparkle than the KC3, either. e-Q5 defiitely seems like a better fit on that front.

  
   
  Quote: 





jackmccabe said:


> Hi, I was just wondering of the iem's that you have tested which have been the best for rock and metal, and have great build quality and low microphonics.
> Thanks


 

 Unique Melody Miracle.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Unique Melody Miracle.


 






   
  That said, someone should really compile a list of "FAQs" for this thread... it seems like the same four pages repeat over and over ad nauseum.


----------



## xtremetechuk

I have just returned my RE0, they seem to distort at high volumes regardless of source.

 I'm now considering the Phonak PFE 122 and Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition. Can anyone help me choose? I listen to trance and metal.

 Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> I have just returned my RE0, they seem to distort at high volumes regardless of source.
> 
> I'm now considering the Phonak PFE 122 and Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition. Can anyone help me choose? I listen to trance and metal.
> 
> Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


 

 If the Xcape IE is anything like the V1 Xcape or the RE0, it'll be good. If you liked the RE0 the Sunrise should sound very similar. I haven't caught up on the nuances behind the IE though, so I'm not sure what exactly is different.
   
  The PFE122 is another great IEM that tend to prefer over the RE0. It sounds "faster" partly due to its balanced armature.  I listen to a lot of metal and the PFE122, while it can be a little bit harsh in the treble sometimes, has performed admirably well.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *I don't think 'sterile' has a bad connotation... *most would fine the CK10 and HF5 sterile, and those are still my favorite earphones at their respective price points. The MC5 is not as analytical, not as clean, and not as cold. That makes it less sterile but not really lively. I have custom tips for use with the HF5 and (with some twisting and pushing) the MC5. *As for the score, I cannot dock points for 'boring' sound - that's far too subjective*.


 

 Interesting post. It somehow explains why I find myself agreeing more often with your descriptions than your ratings. Nothing bad about that btw, since this is _your _thread and at that an extraordinary piece of work.
   
  As for me, sterile has definitely a bad connotation, unless the music was meant to sound that way in the first place. However, I don't believe many recordings were made with that intention and certainly no live concert I've ever seen. Don't get me wrong, I've been to several really bad ones, but sterile? Not that I can remember. So in my book a sterile presentation is undoubtedly a weakness in music reproduction. Just my 2c.


----------



## limpidglitch

That was more or less what I was tring to get at. It all boils down to what you mean by 'sterile'
  To me it means that no matter what kind of music is played, they won't come 'alive'
  To joker it seems to mean more or less 'clean', as in no coloration?


----------



## xtasi

As always, thanks joker for your advice!
   
  That seems to be about it as far as questions go


----------



## jackmccabe

Hi, sorry I forgot to mention my budget is about $250.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> That said, someone should really compile a list of "FAQs" for this thread... it seems like the same four pages repeat over and over ad nauseum.


 

 You haven't seen my PM box...


  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Interesting post. It somehow explains why I find myself agreeing more often with your descriptions than your ratings. Nothing bad about that btw, since this is _your _thread and at that an extraordinary piece of work.
> 
> As for me, sterile has definitely a bad connotation, unless the music was meant to sound that way in the first place. However, I don't believe many recordings were made with that intention and certainly no live concert I've ever seen. Don't get me wrong, I've been to several really bad ones, but sterile? Not that I can remember. So in my book a sterile presentation is undoubtedly a weakness in music reproduction. Just my 2c.


 

 For me sterile is very closely related to 'analytical', with perhaps a bit of a warning overtone for those who like other signatures. Ideally, a good analytical listening device will portray exactly what is on the track without adding to or holding anything back from the recording. "No coloration", as limpidglitch put it. It's not about recreating live sound (unless it was a live recording to start with) or adding some specific flavor to the sound, "audiophile" or not (isn't that what Bose tries to do?). It is also why I've kept the AKG K601 around as my one real full-size can despite 'technically superior' sets coming and going. Don't get me wrong, there's room for all sorts of signatures, but it can be argued that 'fun' can possess a negative connotation just as 'sterile' can.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





jackmccabe said:


> Hi, sorry I forgot to mention my budget is about $250.


 

 Well there you go - Joker has ratings for value, MSRPs (although not always accurate, should give you a good idea of what to look for), build quality, and microphonics. Read the reviews yourself.


----------



## jackmccabe

I have, but I was just asking for a suggestion specifically for metal and rock.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jackmccabe said:


> I have, but I was just asking for a suggestion specifically for metal and rock.


 


  The problem is that genre preferences and sound signature preferences don't necessarily go hand in hand. There are hip-hop lovers who don't mind the beats being in the background as long as they can hear every detail of the lyrics... and then there is the majority of hip-hop listeners. Rock & metal is 80-85% of what I listen to on my own time and the CK10, DBA-02, and e-Q5 are all very much to my liking. GR07 is not far behind, either.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The RE0 (or  is a very good earphone but it doesn't quite have the speed or clarity of an e-Q5, nor the ability to throw distance cues as far. It is also less revealing when it comes to low-end detail, especially in the bottom octave. I like the RE0, always have, but it doesn't fare all that well in direct comparisons to top-tier earphones with a similar signature.


 
   
  So you can hear more bass detail with e-Q5? Have you done direct AB between the two? Have you amped the RE0 and do you have the latest version of this IEM? I find that the latest version which has a more "squashed" housing compared to the older one (similar to RE-ZERO now) sounds more dynamic and has better imaging. I personally can't hear any more bass detail with e-Q5 than RE0. In fact, its the other way around - I hear details easier wit RE0 due to better separation. I think RE0 reaches just as low and is at least as tight too. I think RE0 has great speed and clarity and I am not sure e-Q5 surpasses is in speed although clarity is a bit better on the e-Q5. I think during complex music passages RE0 sounds more effortless due to better separation. I think RE0 will also scale better with better sources and amps. So far, I have not found anything that e-Q5 really does better than RE0. So far, it just sounds like different presentations/signatures to me.


----------



## jackmccabe

Ok, thanks. I have the dba-02 and quite like it sound but find it to be a bit too aggressive so I think I will go with the e-q5.
  Thanks


----------



## james444

Quote: 





limpidglitch said:


> That was more or less what I was tring to get at. It all boils down to what you mean by 'sterile'
> *To me it means that no matter what kind of music is played, they won't come 'alive'*
> To joker it seems to mean more or less 'clean', as in no coloration?


 

 That's exactly what I was trying to say and it's obviously something different from being clean/uncolored/analytical. The MC5 aren't less colored than several other analytical phones out there, but to my ears they're noticably less lifelike. To put it bluntly, even 'live' recordings won't come 'alive' with them and that's definitely a weakness in my book. The term 'coloration' usually refers to (peaks or dips in) frequency response, but there are more variables in the equation, as mvw2 illustrates in this brilliant post. To my ears the MC5 are pretty good at reproducing a sine sweep, but pretty bad at reproducing lifelike music.

 Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For me sterile is very closely related to 'analytical', with perhaps a bit of a warning overtone for those who like other signatures. Ideally, a good analytical listening device will portray exactly what is on the track without adding to or holding anything back from the recording. "No coloration", as limpidglitch put it. It's not about recreating live sound (unless it was a live recording to start with) or adding some specific flavor to the sound, "audiophile" or not (isn't that what Bose tries to do?). It is also why I've kept the AKG K601 around as my one real full-size can despite 'technically superior' sets coming and going. Don't get me wrong, there's room for all sorts of signatures, but it can be argued that 'fun' can possess a negative connotation just as 'sterile' can.


 

 I'm afraid you've misinterpreted my post, I wasn't trying to make a case for fun sound (see above). But nevermind, I don't want to detour your thread, so I'll leave it at that.


----------



## xtremetechuk

@ljokerl

 Have you tested the Audio Technica ATH-CKM90?


----------



## mark2410

or we could all just agree the mc5 are about as fun or enjoyable as a bowl of your favourite ice cream, thats at room temperature
   
   
  its all there but you just dont want it anymore


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> Have you tested the Audio Technica ATH-CKM90?


 

 No; my experience with Audio-Technica in-ears stops with the multi-BA models.


  Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> or we could all just agree the mc5 are about as fun or enjoyable as a bowl of your favourite ice cream, thats at room temperature
> 
> 
> its all there but you just dont want it anymore


 

 I think that's fair though I'm sure some don't mind their icecream lukewarm.


----------



## FlySweep

ljokerl said:


> I think that's fair though I'm sure some don't mind their icecream lukewarm.


 

 I like my ice cream deep fried.. that makes me an Eterna fan, no?  Lol.


----------



## rawrster

fried ice cream sounds good right about now 
   
  Although the MC5 was one of the more disappointing earphones I've heard in a while. I was expecting more from Etymotic


----------



## Ikarios

I've been listening to my VSonic GR07s lately and while I think the balance is perfect, it has a very "dynamic" character in its presentation. Compared with my Phonaks I find that the VSonics are slightly slow and aren't particularly "snappy", which is a quality I really like in most BAs. What are some other $100-250 (used) balanced armatures that are nicely balanced? I thought the PFE122s with grey filters had great bass (coming from RE-0s, Xcapes, and CK10s - about even with the CK10s), until I tried the GR07s, which are relatively slightly bass heavy. I like the amount of sparkle the GR07s have, but detail in the mids and treble isn't quite up to the level I'd really like. I've been trying to find a pair of used Klipsch Custom 3s or A-T CK90Pros but both are quite rare on the used market. The Ortofon e-Q5s have also popped up on my radar but I'm afraid they'll be too dark and forgiving/smooth in the treble, nor do they look very ergonomic. I haven't identified anything else that might hit my targets (great detail all around, relatively neutral, not bass-light, treble-heavy nor recessed in mids, comfortable, low microphonics, and easily over-ear wearable - in that general order). I haven't really looked at the popular Shure or Westone offerings since they all seem to be moderately mid-oriented and I'm not sure if I'd like that or not.


----------



## Inks

I actually think the EQ5s fit your bill. They have more clarity than the GR07s and the bass is in between the Phonaks/GR07. They are also very ergonomic, easily one of the best cables I've used and the isolation is pretty outstanding. The fit is a tad fatiguing though considering these love a deep insertion. It sounds weird, but actually sticking AAA batteries in your ears is a good test in terms of insertion (they're obviously not going to be that heavy though). If you're really worried about fit though, I'll suggest the FAD A1s or GR10s.


----------



## james444

^ GR10 is out of his price range, but I agree the e-Q5 would fit. However I'd recommend the FAD A1s (aka FI-BA-A1 or heaven a), even though their cable isn't as nice as the e-Q5's. But they are easier to fit and hit all your targets (great detail all around, relatively neutral, not bass-light, treble-heavy nor recessed in mids, comfortable, low microphonics, and easily over-ear wearable). Plus they're pretty snappy and even more so when amped. Isolation is slightly lower than with the e-Q5 though, if that's of concern.


----------



## Inks

Nice to hear that the isolation is only slightly worse. That housing looks to be about the same size to the EQ5s based on pictures though. 
   
  Nevertheless, those A1s sound very interesting to me nowadays.....


----------



## james444

^ Max diameter is about the same, but they're more rounded and taper towards the nozzle. My fit with the e-Q5 can be borderline uncomfortable at times, but never with the A1s. They're actually much easier for me to get a deeper fit with, which also improves isolation. Of course no two ears are the same and YMMV.


----------



## xtremetechuk

@ljokerl

 Thanks for your time,

 I'm about to order from accessory jack, I'm choosing between the ATH-CK10, Westone 2 or Ortofon e-Q5. Which would be best suited for trance and metal? I have read your descriptions, however still can't come to a conclusion. I loved my RE0, however they distorted at high volumes which ruined the experience.


----------



## Inks

Kind of saw this kind of respond coming, thanks a lot for the confirmation. I can definitely see how a flusher/deeper seal can be possible with the A1s, it looks more natural to insert that way with the FADs due to their overall shape. Thanks once again.


----------



## Ikarios

Interesting - I've never really read anything about the Final Audio IEMs. They look interesting in that they share a lot of characteristics with the Ortofons, but they DO sound like they'd be a good match... problem is, they're quite expensive, and no one sells them in the FS forums. Oh well... maybe sometime down the road.
   
  But it does sound like a moving armature is what I want, in that it combines the texturing and bass/warmth of a dynamic with the speed and detail of a balanced armature. Anyone know if MA technology is catching on? So far I only know of three manufacturers - Ortofon, Grado (probably OEMed by one of the same companies, I imagine), and Final Audio. Anything on the horizon?


----------



## Inks

I believe you can get the FAD A1s from MA for about 250$. Email dimitri for a precise quote, he gives discounts to headfiers at times. I think goodvibes will easily forward you his email.


----------



## xtremetechuk

Can anyone help me choose between the ATH-CK10 and Ortofon e-Q5? I'm dying to order the ATH-CK10, but want to be 100% sure especially considering the cost. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  EDIT -
  Nevermind, I have ordered the ATH-CK10, Hope I made the right choice.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





inks said:


> I believe you can get the FAD A1s from MA for about 250$. Email dimitri for a precise quote, he gives discounts to headfiers at times. I think goodvibes will easily forward you his email.


 

 x2 on Dimitri, one of the best customer experiences I've had. You can contact him for a price quote at info@musicaacoustics.com.


----------



## ljokerl

I find the CK10 to be fantastic for trance, but then I am more seduced by space, liquidity, and shimmer than pounding lows and weighty notes when it comes to trance.
  
  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> Can anyone help me choose between the ATH-CK10 and Ortofon e-Q5? I'm dying to order the ATH-CK10, but want to be 100% sure especially considering the cost.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## DaBomb77766

Hey, joker, random off-topic recommendation - what artists/albums would you recommend for a newcomer to the Trance genre? 
   
  (also, another slightly more on-topic addition, how would you like to review a pair of fake IE8s?   I think it would be a interesting and perhaps humorous addition to your thread.  If you wanted, I could send you a pair on me, no need to worry about sending back)


----------



## xtremetechuk

I would also be interested in your suggestions,

 Lately I have been listening to alot of euphoria and trance nation. I struggle to find decent trance albums, and modern trance has been ruined by commercialism.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Hey, joker, random off-topic recommendation - what artists/albums would you recommend for a newcomer to the Trance genre?
> 
> (also, another slightly more on-topic addition, how would you like to review a pair of fake IE8s?   I think it would be a interesting and perhaps humorous addition to your thread.  If you wanted, I could send you a pair on me, no need to worry about sending back)


 

 I am no more than a casual trance listener and really haven't gotten as familiar with the genre as I'm sure many others have. Therefore, I am not comfortable making recommendations. Not very familiar with the subgenres but I think I've somehow gotten into 'psytrance'. Bizarre Contact is one of my favorite artists and I quite like Electro Sun as well. I also like some Super8 & Tab, Above & Beyond, Yuri Kane, Filo & Peri from the more mainstream (I guess) stuff.
   
  I have had numerous opportunities to review fakes in the past but I will not include any of them in the thread as that would only act to legitimize the establishment. I'd be happy to listen to it and give my thoughts but only genuine products are making it onto the front page of this thread.


----------



## Niyologist

As a Super Giant Trance Fanatic (That is me), I'd go for Above and Beyond, Brett Wood, Klonez (Hard Trance Artist), and Dr. Willis. They create excellent Trance music.


----------



## Niyologist

Propane by Filo and Peri are one of their best songs.


----------



## xtasi

Quote: 





james444 said:


> x2 on Dimitri, one of the best customer experiences I've had. You can contact him for a price quote at info@musicaacoustics.com.


 


  Just curious, how much is the discount?


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am no more than a casual trance listener and really haven't gotten as familiar with the genre as I'm sure many others have. Therefore, I am not comfortable making recommendations. Not very familiar with the subgenres but I think I've somehow gotten into 'psytrance'. Bizarre Contact is one of my favorite artists and I quite like Electro Sun as well. I also like some Super8 & Tab, Above & Beyond, Yuri Kane, Filo & Peri from the more mainstream (I guess) stuff.
> 
> I have had numerous opportunities to review fakes in the past but I will not include any of them in the thread as that would only act to legitimize the establishment. I'd be happy to listen to it and give my thoughts but only genuine products are making it onto the front page of this thread.


 

 +1 to Above and Beyond, very good stuff. Also, dynamite thread ljokerl. Can't wait to hear your opinion on the newest sunrise iem's.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Just curious, how much is the discount?


 

 He has made introductory offers for some IEMs in the past and his communication, support and shipping speed are top-notch, but I don't know about any general discount for Head-Fiers. I'd say, best to ask him directly.


----------



## AlexRoma

*ljokerl*, great thread you made.. Still waiting your _VSonic GR07_ add-in here... I've put an eye on them but still find little info and direct comparisons. Hope it come soon..


----------



## SowonAoD

Joker, can you compare ep5 to gr07? I'm looking for something similar to my ck10 with less sibilance, more forward mid and may be a little more warm in mid, too. I've think about ck100 but it's more expensive.


----------



## Niyologist

I used this video to further the Meelec SP51's ability. Although when listening and watching this, I recommend turning down the volume. The Sensitivity of the earphones that you have may be exceeded, so it's best to keep the volume to a minimum. 
   
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLHVQNV2Cas
   
  That is all.


----------



## noise-phobe

joker, would you be able to recommend a sound-isolating IEM that doesn't require significantly deep penetration, i.e. something that balances comfort with isolation for less than $150US? i've looked through your guide but it's hard to judge from your ratings exactly what noise isolation encompasses to you. i was looking for something that good block out more dynamic, high-range stuff like dogs barking, kids yelling, etc.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> joker, would you be able to recommend a sound-isolating IEM that doesn't require significantly deep penetration, i.e. something that balances comfort with isolation for less than $150US? i've looked through your guide but it's hard to judge from your ratings exactly what noise isolation encompasses to you. i was looking for something that good block out more dynamic, high-range stuff like dogs barking, kids yelling, etc.


 

 He notes in his post that a 5/5 is about the level of isolation of an ER4P and a 1.5/5 is the level of the Yuins (an earbud). For typical street usage I find that anything above around 3/5 is enough attenuation. The trouble is, oftentimes sound isolation is linked with insertion depth, but the difference between a 3 and a 5 in isolation is really not that much, IMO. Any kind of IEM is going to be enough for typical usage when you have music playing.


----------



## yello131

Quote: 





sowonaod said:


> Joker, can you compare ep5 to gr07? I'm looking for something similar to my ck10 with less sibilance, more forward mid and may be a little more warm in mid, too. I've think about ck100 but it's more expensive.


 

 ep5?


----------



## ljokerl

I guess I've got some more trance tracks to buy!
  
  Quote: 





alexroma said:


> *ljokerl*, great thread you made.. Still waiting your _VSonic GR07_ add-in here... I've put an eye on them but still find little info and direct comparisons. Hope it come soon..


 

 Coming soon.. hopefully this weekend. Working on a separate review and the portable thread this week.


  Quote: 





sowonaod said:


> Joker, can you compare ep5 to gr07? I'm looking for something similar to my ck10 with less sibilance, more forward mid and may be a little more warm in mid, too. I've think about ck100 but it's more expensive.


 

 If you mean the e-Q5, I think that's more likely to appease you than the GR07. Not that the GR07 is similar to the CK10 but no sibilance + slightly forward and slightly warm mids describes the e-Q5 well.
   
   

  Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> joker, would you be able to recommend a sound-isolating IEM that doesn't require significantly deep penetration, i.e. something that balances comfort with isolation for less than $150US? i've looked through your guide but it's hard to judge from your ratings exactly what noise isolation encompasses to you. i was looking for something that good block out more dynamic, high-range stuff like dogs barking, kids yelling, etc.


 
  If you're really concerned about noise just find whatever has the highest isolation scores without a deep-insertion form factor. I think the Phiaton PS200 is still $145 from amazon and that has very impressive isolation. Or you could go for the base model Kozee X1, which will isolate better than any universal except some Ety models.


----------



## SowonAoD

then you mean the gr07 is better choice than e-q5 (I typed wrong, my bad)


----------



## esanthosh

No! He means e-q5 is a better choice based on what you are looking for.


----------



## noise-phobe

Quote:


> If you're really concerned about noise just find whatever has the highest isolation scores without a deep-insertion form factor. I think the Phiaton PS200 is still $145 from amazon and that has very impressive isolation. Or you could go for the base model Kozee X1, which will isolate better than any universal except some Ety models.


 


  Thanks, I'll look into those. I'm not really looking for street-usage isolation; I work from home, but the insulation is pretty bad and I'll often hear the neighbour's dog barking or my brothers fighting, etc. 
   
  I know this is probably going to sound really weird, but I have to be honest: my ex-girlfriend worked at a hospital and told me a story once about someone who'd punctured their ear-drum with a cotton bud. Ever since then I've been paranoid about inserting stuff too deeply into my ear... is it even physically possible for the deep in-ear buds to reach that far? Or does the body of the bud prevent it?


----------



## Ikarios

From Wikipedia, the length of a typical human ear canal is 35mm. That's 1.37 inches, and quite a long way. You have to be pretty dumb and insert something quite deep to puncture your ear drum. Furthermore most ear canals have a kink along the way which helps prevent straight objects from reaching the tympanic membrane in the first place.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Thanks, I'll look into those. I'm not really looking for street-usage isolation; I work from home, but the insulation is pretty bad and I'll often hear the neighbour's dog barking or my brothers fighting, etc.
> ...


 

 Yeah, they won't ever reach your ear drum man.. I wouldn't worry about it and pick up an ety, they are well known for their isolation. I don't know what your sound preferences are though..


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> Thanks, I'll look into those. I'm not really looking for street-usage isolation; I work from home, but the insulation is pretty bad and I'll often hear the neighbour's dog barking or my brothers fighting, etc.
> ...


 

 that's a bad thing itself. every doctor i'd asked, told me NOT to use them for deep cleaning, only for external ear use. i dont think the iem tips can get that far...


----------



## noise-phobe

Quote: 





chrislangley4253 said:


> Yeah, they won't ever reach your ear drum man.. I wouldn't worry about it and pick up an ety, they are well known for their isolation. I don't know what your sound preferences are though..


 

 I'm really not picky about sound preferences. I'm only using them to work study/with. I listen to a lot of ambient music, or soundscapes, electronica etc. 
   
  which would be ideal out of the ER6, MC5, or hf5?


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> I'm really not picky about sound preferences. I'm only using them to work study/with. I listen to a lot of ambient music, or soundscapes, electronica etc.
> 
> which would be ideal out of the ER6, MC5, or hf5?


 

  
  I just got the MC5.. it seems like people have a lot of mixed feelings about them. But you can probably pick up a used pair for 50-60 bucks.. Personally, I think they sound pretty neutral, with good extension. They don't really color the music at all except for the highs, those can get rather bright.. For me, its something my ears adjust to in a matter of minutes. The best thing about the MC5 is its build quality and isolation.. The sound quality can be beat for the price, but it isn't bad. I'm happy with my purchase and will probably be using these for quite some time. I can't comment on the rest of the Ety's.. I can say those triple flanges are going to take a bit to get used to, but the isolation is the best I've heard and the build quality is great.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> I'm really not picky about sound preferences. I'm only using them to work study/with. I listen to a lot of ambient music, or soundscapes, electronica etc.
> 
> which would be ideal out of the ER6, MC5, or hf5?


 

 HF5 + Shure Olive Tips. Sounds great and still comes out to <$150, though if you don't want deep insertion the Phiatons may still be a better choice. All Etys isolate a lot but the HF5 can isolate a bit more than the MC5 with a deep seal and there's no reason to pick the ER6i (or MC5 for that matter) over the HF5 for sound quality.


----------



## noise-phobe

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> HF5 + Shure Olive Tips. Sounds great and still comes out to <$150, though if you don't want deep insertion the Phiatons may still be a better choice. All Etys isolate a lot but the HF5 can isolate a bit more than the MC5 with a deep seal and there's no reason to pick the ER6i (or MC5 for that matter) over the HF5 for sound quality.


 
   
  Is wearing the HF5 for a couple of hours at a time, multiple times throughout the day, going to be an issue, comfort-wise, given the deep insertion?


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> Is wearing the HF5 for a couple of hours at a time, multiple times throughout the day, going to be an issue, comfort-wise, given the deep insertion?


 


 Don't recall having a problem in discomfort with either MC5 or the ER4 with triple flanges (and I used to listen to them for 7+ hours per day), so I think it should be fine.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> HF5 + Shure Olive Tips. Sounds great and still comes out to <$150, though if you don't want deep insertion the Phiatons may still be a better choice. All Etys isolate a lot but the HF5 can isolate a bit more than the MC5 with a deep seal and there's no reason to pick the ER6i (or MC5 for that matter) over the HF5 for sound quality.


 
  I knew I should have grabbed that HF5 over the MC5... Oh well, I was worried about breaking them. At least I won't be able to do that with the MC5's... Maybe I'll upgrade when my birthday comes around or if i can find a good deal.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *noise-phobe* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Is wearing the HF5 for a couple of hours at a time, multiple times throughout the day, going to be an issue, comfort-wise, given the deep insertion?


 

 For me it is not, but everyone's ears are different. Foam tips are less likely to be uncomfortable IMO.


  Quote: 





chrislangley4253 said:


> I knew I should have grabbed that HF5 over the MC5... Oh well, I was worried about breaking them. At least I won't be able to do that with the MC5's... Maybe I'll upgrade when my birthday comes around or if i can find a good deal.


 


  For build quality the MC5 wins, no question - not that I feel the need to baby my HF3, but the MC5 is a tank.


----------



## noise-phobe

Okay, I promise this is my last question - and I'm sorry for being so anal ..
   
  This is really more than I wanted to admit, and I hope no one thinks I'm crazy henceforth, but I actually suffer from OCD (or obsessive-compulsive disorder). It's insidious and effects every part of my life .. even simple decisions like buying a pair of ear phones.  
   
  So basically, when I have an unreasonable phobia, I'll enact a compulsion to try and reassure myself that it won't come true. For example, I find myself pressing my earbuds against my ear to make sure that they couldn't touch my ear drum. Normally that isn't a problem because the body of the earbud on the cheap pair i'm using is too big to actually enter the ear.
   
  But the body on the HF3 and MC5 actually looks pretty skinny, so I thought that it might be possible for it to enter the ear and for me to (accidentally) hurt myself if I pushed hard enough.
   
  a) is that possible? and b) if the decision is causing me enough anxiety, is the sound-isolation on the ER6s (which appear to have bigger bodies) or even one of the other more shallow-fitting pairs you mentioned still significant enough that I'd be okay settling for one of those? 
   
  ugh, I hate having to reveal what a nutjob I really am, but I thought it would be better to just be honest than make an expensive decision I regret


----------



## chrislangley4253

Just wanted to comment on your review of the Maximo iM-590's.. They have changed the cable to one that is much, much less likely to get kinked, it is still cloth but much better. Also, they changed the headphone jack to one that is very similar to the jack on the MC5's.. both big improvements on the build quality..
   
  Also, I found them kinda bass heavy, but I really like a more analytical sound sig, I guess.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> Okay, I promise this is my last question - and I'm sorry for being so anal ..
> 
> This is really more than I wanted to admit, and I hope no one thinks I'm crazy henceforth, but I actually suffer from OCD (or obsessive-compulsive disorder). It's insidious and effects every part of my life .. even simple decisions like buying a pair of ear phones.
> 
> ...


 

  I do not think your concern is justified - as someone mentioned on the previous page, your ear canal has a kink in it in before your ear drum. I would be more concerned about irritating your ears if you constantly jostle/adjust deep-sealing IEMs. Oh and the ER6i is not fatter than the MC5 - just a different shape.
   
  And again, if that's really a big deal, I will reiterate my recommendation for the Phiaton PS200. You will not be able to push those very deep into your ear and the isolation should be more than sufficient for your uses.


  Quote: 





chrislangley4253 said:


> Just wanted to comment on your review of the Maximo iM-590's.. They have changed the cable to one that is much, much less likely to get kinked, it is still cloth but much better. Also, they changed the headphone jack to one that is very similar to the jack on the MC5's.. both big improvements on the build quality..
> 
> Also, I found them kinda bass heavy, but I really like a more analytical sound sig, I guess.


 

  I am aware  of the build quality changes. However, they did not send me an updated unit to evaluate so I cannot make any relevant claims about the build. Also, first time I've heard the iM-590 called bass-heavy.


----------



## noise-phobe

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I do not think your concern is justified - as someone mentioned on the previous page, your ear canal has a kink in it in before your ear drum. I would be more concerned about irritating your ears if you constantly jostle/adjust deep-sealing IEMs. Oh and the ER6i is not fatter than the MC5 - just a different shape.
> 
> And again, if that's really a big deal, I will reiterate my recommendation for the Phiaton PS200. You will not be able to push those very deep into your ear and the isolation should be more than sufficient for your uses.


 

 Thanks so much for your reply. I'll research the Phiaton's.


----------



## FlySweep

chrislangley4253 said:


> Just wanted to comment on your review of the Maximo iM-590's.. They have changed the cable to one that is much, much less likely to get kinked, it is still cloth but much better. Also, they changed the headphone jack to one that is very similar to the jack on the MC5's.. both big improvements on the build quality..


 
   
  Interesting.. thank you for noting this.. the pair I've had for nearly a year are getting replaced due to heavy driver flex in the right ear channel.  How recent is this change in build quality?
   
  I wouldn't consider the 590s bass heavy.. more balanced with a hefty punch, IMO.. the mids are grado-like (but thicker with better balance and air), the treble has nice detail & sparkle.. despite having IEMs that are more technically proficient, the 590s still get a ton of play cause I find their sound kind of unique and addicting.  I'm not sure you'll find a better balanced phone at $50 and it's tackles every genre I listen to quite admirably.  It's really nice to have a phone like the 590 that can still hold it's own despite it's age..
   
  I've been waiting for the 790's forever.. wonder when they'll drop, they sound quite promising.. heck, I should just visit their office the next time I trip down from Olympia to Portland..


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I do not think your concern is justified - as someone mentioned on the previous page, your ear canal has a kink in it in before your ear drum. I would be more concerned about irritating your ears if you constantly jostle/adjust deep-sealing IEMs. Oh and the ER6i is not fatter than the MC5 - just a different shape.
> 
> And again, if that's really a big deal, I will reiterate my recommendation for the Phiaton PS200. You will not be able to push those very deep into your ear and the isolation should be more than sufficient for your uses.
> 
> ...


 

 ah, I can post some pictures if you'd like..  Also, I guess it is just me. *plugs in his iM-590's and questions his sanity*
   


  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Interesting.. thank you for noting this.. the pair I've had for nearly a year are getting replaced due to heavy driver flex in the right ear channel.  How recent is this change in build quality?
> 
> I wouldn't consider the 590s bass heavy.. more balanced with a hefty punch, IMO.. the mids are grado-like (but thicker with better balance and air), the treble has nice detail & sparkle.. despite having IEMs that are more technically proficient, the 590s still get a ton of play cause I find their sound kind of unique and addicting.  I'm not sure you'll find a better balanced phone at $50 and it's tackles every genre I listen to quite admirably.  It's really nice to have a phone like the 590 that can still hold it's own despite it's age..
> 
> I've been waiting for the 790's forever.. wonder when they'll drop, they sound quite promising.. heck, I should just visit their office the next time I trip down from Olympia to Portland..


 


  the change is...
  not that recent. I got a replacement pair that was improved quite some time ago. Last year for sure.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Okay. I take it back.. They aren't bass heavy. They are quite balanced, and I am crazy.. I think I'm just not used to it.. In fact, I was comparing them to my portapros.. which have a good punchy mid bass, but they lack on the lowest end compared to the maximo's.. which led me to think that the maximo's were bassy.. which led me to buy ety's which I'm not enjoying all that much. Actually, I think my perfect IEM would be somewhere between the Ety and the Maximo. If that even makes sense. It is 3:45am.
   
  Such is the life of someone who tries to listen to hard and not just enjoy the music.
   
  - Actually, I think I'd like something that stuck to the type of sound sig that the Maximo has, but a step up.. What would something like that be? Something fun, but balanced and analytical.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> Okay, I promise this is my last question - and I'm sorry for being so anal ..
> 
> This is really more than I wanted to admit, and I hope no one thinks I'm crazy henceforth, but I actually suffer from OCD (or obsessive-compulsive disorder). It's insidious and effects every part of my life .. even simple decisions like buying a pair of ear phones.
> 
> ...


 


  Honestly, I think everyone here has some form of OCD, you'd have to be to be so obsessive over buying such expensive audio equipment. 
   
  But yeah, I'd agree with Joker, I've never once heard of anyone damaging their eardrums by pushing their IEMs in too far.  However, I have accidentally wedged some in too far once and got some earwax stuck somewhere in the back of my ear canal - it deadened the sound coming in for awhile.  I was a little worried about it, but I just had to go to the doctor about it.  Nothing permanent.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> I've been waiting for the 790's forever.. wonder when they'll drop, they sound quite promising.. heck, I should just visit their office the next time I trip down from Olympia to Portland..


 

 To be honest I wouldn't be surprised if the 790 never made it at the rate things are going. I have not heard much of/from Maximo in the past year and I don't think they were at CES 2011, which could indicate financial issues. Their facebook page is ghost city and I haven't seen any review samples distributed in a while.


  Quote: 





chrislangley4253 said:


> Okay. I take it back.. They aren't bass heavy. They are quite balanced, and I am crazy.. I think I'm just not used to it.. In fact, I was comparing them to my portapros.. which have a good punchy mid bass, but they lack on the lowest end compared to the maximo's.. which led me to think that the maximo's were bassy.. which led me to buy ety's which I'm not enjoying all that much. Actually, I think my perfect IEM would be somewhere between the Ety and the Maximo. If that even makes sense. It is 3:45am.
> 
> Such is the life of someone who tries to listen to hard and not just enjoy the music.
> 
> - Actually, I think I'd like something that stuck to the type of sound sig that the Maximo has, but a step up.. What would something like that be? Something fun, but balanced and analytical.


 

 The VSonic GR07 might be what you want.


----------



## Prazzyp

skullcandy aviators vs skullcandy sk pro vs skullcandy GI?


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> skullcandy aviators vs skullcandy sk pro vs skullcandy GI?


 

 Think you have your threads mixed up


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For build quality the MC5 wins, no question - not that I feel the need to baby my HF3, but the MC5 is a tank.


 


  also its so crap your ears would thank you if you broke them


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> Okay, I promise this is my last question - and I'm sorry for being so anal ..
> 
> This is really more than I wanted to admit, and I hope no one thinks I'm crazy henceforth, but I actually suffer from OCD (or obsessive-compulsive disorder). It's insidious and effects every part of my life .. even simple decisions like buying a pair of ear phones.
> 
> ...


 


  btw you realise this place is full of obsessive crazys?  curious why you ask about the mc5 and hf3 not both 3 or both 5? 
   
   
  anyway id say go with the hf if you can, they are very significantly better in everyway than the mc series


----------



## kmhaynes

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> also its so crap your ears would thank you if you broke them


 


 Well, I wouldn't say the MC5 is that bad -- but do agree that the HF5 (and a number of other > $75 phones) is a significant step up in SQ and clarity.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





kmhaynes said:


> Well, I wouldn't say the MC5 is that bad -- but do agree that the HF5 (and a number of other > $75 phones) is a significant step up in SQ and clarity.


 


  music should be passion and emotive, on the mc5 is utterly dead.  why bother?


----------



## AwakenedBeing

It seems like forever since I last visited Head-Fi. I just spent all day today reading up on what I have missed. Keep up the awesome work joker and thanks for the reviews as always!


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





awakenedbeing said:


> It seems like forever since I last visited Head-Fi. I just spent all day today reading up on what I have missed. Keep up the awesome work joker and thanks for the reviews as always!


 
  That's probably a good thing for your wallet. I presume you are still happy with the CK10 and CK100


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> music should be passion and emotive, on the mc5 is utterly dead.  why bother?


 

 You mean you don't like 'neutral' sound?


----------



## AwakenedBeing

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> That's probably a good thing for your wallet. I presume you are still happy with the CK10 and CK100


 
   I sold my CK10 a little after I got the CK100. Been listening to the CK100 since then.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> To be honest I wouldn't be surprised if the 790 never made it at the rate things are going. I have not heard much of/from Maximo in the past year and I don't think they were at CES 2011, which could indicate financial issues. Their facebook page is ghost city and I haven't seen any review samples distributed in a while.
> 
> 
> 
> The VSonic GR07 might be what you want.


 


   

 I'll look into them. Many thanks
  Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> also its so crap your ears would thank you if you broke them


 

 stop it! I already bought the damn things. I've got enough buyers remorse.. At least they work well for mowing the grass! okay?


----------



## Niyologist

My Meelec SP51 sounds like it's nearly finished with burning in. It's a whole new experience with that frequency test I did. The Comply Foam Tips just add in the detail, thumping bass, and sense of space. It's better than the original pair I had! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Although, the detail is still behind the A151, but close with the Comply T-400.


----------



## noise-phobe

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> btw you realise this place is full of obsessive crazys?  curious why you ask about the mc5 and hf3 not both 3 or both 5?
> 
> 
> anyway id say go with the hf if you can, they are very significantly better in everyway than the mc series


 


  yeah, but my version of crazy is a little less benign, i suppose. sorry i didn't notice that there was an MC3 and hf5, i was just going based on what an amazon search for etymotic pulled up.
   
  ugh, the neighbour's dog is driving me insane. my room is on the second story of our house and situated right by their backyard, so the sound travels directly upwards.
   
  would most isolating IEMs be enough to drown out a dog barking? im still not crazy about the ety's. i've been looking at the Phiaton like joker suggested, but thought I might wanna spend a little less than $150 so i can get some nice tips.
   
  would westone 1's + foam tips do the job?


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> My Meelec SP51 sounds like it's nearly finished with burning in. It's a whole new experience with that frequency test I did. The Comply Foam Tips just add in the detail, thumping bass, and sense of space. It's better than the original pair I had!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  S151P's have thumping bass? Hmm, I found the CC51P's to have very little bass. Different sound for different models I guess then.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





awakenedbeing said:


> It seems like forever since I last visited Head-Fi. I just spent all day today reading up on what I have missed. Keep up the awesome work joker and thanks for the reviews as always!


 

 Good to see you around! And thanks - I appreciate that.


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> My Meelec SP51 sounds like it's nearly finished with burning in. It's a whole new experience with that frequency test I did. The Comply Foam Tips just add in the detail, thumping bass, and sense of space. It's better than the original pair I had!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The A151 isn't all that detailed for an armature-based phone (compared to higher-end stuff, at least) but I still wouldn't expect the SP51 to match it on the detail front. Maybe I have to dig up my SP51 and find some Complys.
   


  Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> yeah, but my version of crazy is a little less benign, i suppose. sorry i didn't notice that there was an MC3 and hf5, i was just going based on what an amazon search for etymotic pulled up.
> 
> ugh, the neighbour's dog is driving me insane. my room is on the second story of our house and situated right by their backyard, so the sound travels directly upwards.
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, isolating IEMs should drown out a dog unless it's right next to you. Honestly, if you're that concerned about it and have the time to do all this research, I would consider the base model Kozee X1. $139 for a custom-fit in earphone in silicone. Definitely highly isolating and won't reach your eardrum. Westone 1 plus foam tips works too but won't isolate as quite much as an Ety+foam tips.


----------



## scare

Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> S151P's have thumping bass? Hmm, I found the CC51P's to have very little bass. Different sound for different models I guess then.


 

 Wow, how people's tastes vary. I find that I like the CC51 more when I attenuate the bass a little with the EQ. And this comes from someone who does listen electronica and rock.


----------



## noise-phobe

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, isolating IEMs should drown out a dog unless it's right next to you. Honestly, if you're that concerned about it and have the time to do all this research, I would consider the base model Kozee X1. $139 for a custom-fit in earphone in silicone. Definitely highly isolating and won't reach your eardrum. Westone 1 plus foam tips works too but won't isolate as quite much as an Ety+foam tips.


 

 the Kozee looks good. i know personal preferences vary as far as tips go - i've only really tried plastic before - but is it rare for people to have an issue with custom silicons as far as comfort goes?


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> S151P's have thumping bass? Hmm, I found the CC51P's to have very little bass. Different sound for different models I guess then.


 

 If your CC51s had very little bass then either you had a fit problem or something wrong with your model. The CC51 is one of the bassier (especially midbass) earphones I've heard, IMO more bass than the Turbine line. They had a somewhat large hump in the midbass which makes basss seem more apparent.


----------



## 177261

So when's the update with the Shure models? The comparison is a year old by now.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





christianh said:


> So when's the update with the Shure models? The comparison is a year old by now.


 

 Buy a few sets and send them to Joker then.


----------



## LooptroopRocker

At first I thought I was addicted to Head-fi.
   
  Now I realize it's just Joker.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> S151P's have thumping bass? Hmm, I found the CC51P's to have very little bass. Different sound for different models I guess then.


 

 Yes, the SP51 is VERY Bass-Heavy. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I did several test, so my SP51 can go down to 20 Hz and it worked. It goes that low when needed. The bass impact is now like a bowling ball hitting the floor with the Enhanced and Extreme Bass Ports, especially with the Comply T-400. Although the texture may need some work. Otherwise, bassheads can't ignore these IEMs.


----------



## xtremetechuk

@Joker
   
  Have you noticed any sibilance/distortion regarding the ATH-CK10?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> the Kozee looks good. i know personal preferences vary as far as tips go - i've only really tried plastic before - but is it rare for people to have an issue with custom silicons as far as comfort goes?


 

 If the impressions for the molds are good, customs really can't be uncomfortable. The only experience I have with silicone is the ACS custom tips on my Etymotics and those pretty much disappear. Kozee phones come with a 90-day fit guarantee.


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> If your CC51s had very little bass then either you had a fit problem or something wrong with your model. The CC51 is one of the bassier (especially midbass) earphones I've heard, IMO more bass than the Turbine line. They had a somewhat large hump in the midbass which makes basss seem more apparent.


 

 Don't know about bassier than the Turbine line but the CC51 definitely has more than enough bass for me as well.


  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *goodvibes* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Buy a few sets and send them to Joker then.


 







  Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> At first I thought I was addicted to Head-fi.
> 
> Now I realize it's just Joker.


 

 Not sure if I should be scared of flattered... or both


  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> @Joker
> 
> Have you noticed any sibilance/distortion regarding the ATH-CK10?


 

 Not unless it's in the recording. I don't think I've ever heard significant distortion out of a TWFK-based earphone.


----------



## Prazzyp

out of the skullcandy aviator, SK pro and GI which are the best regardless of price.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





noise-phobe said:


> yeah, but my version of crazy is a little less benign, i suppose. sorry i didn't notice that there was an MC3 and hf5, i was just going based on what an amazon search for etymotic pulled up.
> 
> ugh, the neighbour's dog is driving me insane. my room is on the second story of our house and situated right by their backyard, so the sound travels directly upwards.
> 
> ...


 

 btw the number for the ety denotes if it has a mic or phone controls, have look on etys website.  if you want huge isolation id take the hf3 or hf5 (depends if you need the controls)  nothing isolates quite like the hf and ER series


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> out of the skullcandy aviator, SK pro and GI which are the best regardless of price.


 


  Aviators, without a doubt.  The other two are honestly pretty awful.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Aviators, without a doubt.  The other two are honestly pretty awful.


 


  Yep, agreed.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> If your CC51s had very little bass then either you had a fit problem or something wrong with your model. The CC51 is one of the bassier (especially midbass) earphones I've heard, IMO more bass than the Turbine line. They had a somewhat large hump in the midbass which makes basss seem more apparent.


 

 Lol, I think you had a fit problem w/ your Turbines.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Lol, I think you had a fit problem w/ your Turbines.


 

 Could be... the Turbines are huge and my ears are not. But the Turbines have more subbass than midbass, whereas the CC51 had a somewhat-bloated midbass section.


----------



## Austin Morrow

I had perfect fitment with the CC51P's. Very little bass response, although pretty detailed. Maybe you had a fitment issue?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> btw the number for the ety denotes if it has a mic or phone controls, have look on etys website.  if you want huge isolation id take the hf3 or hf5 (depends if you need the controls)  nothing isolates quite like the hf and ER series


 

 There's also an HF2 for those of us with non-apple smartdevices.
   
   
  Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> I had perfect fitment with the CC51P's. Very little bass response, although pretty detailed. Maybe you had a fitment issue?


 
   
  You need to check your balance benchmark. There's a huge difference between "very little bass response" and "not enough bass for me".


----------



## vinay2070

Hi Guys,
   
  I am completely new to this and REALLY REALLY need some help deciding which IEM  to buy. Source would be clip+, pc audigy card. Unamped.
   
  Preference: 
   
  1)Above average bass (Iam not a hardcode bass head, but I prefer a little more bass than usual  )
  2)Wide sound stage and details in music and mids to be on the warmer side. Not very particular about highs, but they should not be straining and should be there.
  3)comfort. Note that I have a very small ear canal.
  4)Build quality/isolation/microphonics.
   
  One important thing. I want to buy either from the sub 100$ series or invest on a really good 250$ ones. What I saw was that from the first page is that the xcape scores a 8.x score on the SQ and the Westone2 scores 9.x. Does it mean that for a 180$ penalty there is only a 10% increase in performance?
   
  If yes then should I stick with the sub 100$ series. Are the 250$ ones really worth it? If not, i would like to save that 180 bux for something more useful.
   
  After 3 weeks of painstaking reading I have short listed the following(based on the reviews here and amazon) but really confused which one to buy. 
   
  Sub 100$ Series:
   
  1)Sunrise xcape Impressive edition
  2)silver bullet
  3)eterna 
  4)Ne700x 
  5)Hippo VB 
   
   
  OR
   
  250$ series.
  1)UM2 - bass compared to NE-700x eterna?
  2)Monster turbine copper.
   
  I have exluded the following out as I read that they have low bass/ not enough for my taste.
  1)DBA-02
  2)Ck10
   
  I dont stay in US and I dont have the luxary of trying them out at a shop or Sending back if I don't like them. It will be a one shot purchase and use.
  Please feel free to refer some other that i may have missed. I cant go beyond 250$ though.
   
  GUYS, I really really need some assistance. All i have is this forum to blindly make a choice and live with what I buy in one shot.
   
  Thanks a Lot


----------



## lazuline

Quote:
   
*"HF5 + Shure Olive Tips. Sounds great and still comes out to <$150, though if you don't want deep insertion the Phiatons may still be a better choice. All Etys isolate a lot but the HF5 can isolate a bit more than the MC5 with a deep seal and there's no reason to pick the ER6i (or MC5 for that matter) over the HF5 for sound quality."*
   
  The man ( speaks the truth. As an Ety fanboy, I approve of this message. And this combo should cost you $120. HF2/HF/HF5 are currently all ~$105 from Amazon(not all colors), and Shure Olives are $15 from Sweetwater, both with free shipping. In my everyday use, I use olives, and when I need the absolute maximum isolation, i switch to the triple flanges.
   

  
  Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I am completely new to this and REALLY REALLY need some help deciding which IEM  to buy. Source would be clip+, pc audigy card. Unamped.
> 
> ...


 
  I'm going to give a +1 for the MTPC @ $220 from Amazon. It pretty much hits all your requirements. I got these, and decided to stop looking for my version of "fun" IEMS after living with them for a few weeks. I bought mine refurbished for $100, but if they break out of warranty, I think I'll be getting a new pair. I'm sure I could find something more optimal if I spent more time looking and expand my budget, but I'm starting to get tired of playing the head-fi game. Head-fi is Pokemon. Gotta Catch Em All.
   
  1) I'm a bass hater (especially too much midbass)but I occasionally listen to rap/hiphop (i.e. dead prez)... so these are about the maximum amount of bass I can tolerate. I really like subass > midbass on these.
   
  2) I wouldn't call it wide, but nothing is particularly forward to my ears (possibly the bass? I mean you can't ignore it), so it's not fatiguing. Then again I'm not particularly treble sensitive so YMMV. They're warmer then my Etys in the mids (which is exactly what I wanted) but give 90% the detail retreival and maybe 93% If I strain to hear it. The detail is there, it's just the smooth nature of the sound kind of hides it a bit.
   
  3) I find these remarkably comfortable cable down with small sized Sony Hybrid tips. 4) Build quality should be excellent if you're buying new, they've made a few design improvements. Cable down with the shirt clip I don't get microphonics, but I only use these at home, seated. Isolation is on par with most dynamic IEM. Not enough for public transit (that's Ety territory) but good enough for a Starbucks.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There's also an HF2 for those of us with non-apple smartdevices.
> 
> 
> 
> You need to check your balance benchmark. There's a huge difference between "very little bass response" and "not enough bass for me".


 
  Well, I haven't listened to them in a few months. Let me go back to them again.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Now I feel like a complete idiot. Just went back and listened to my CC51P's. There's a lot more bass than I originally thought. I think I am going to rewrite my review (then again, I didn't know a lot about Hi-Fi and how to judge music properly at the time). And my balance benchmark is overall balance. I like a good amount of bass that does not overpower everything else. Even though the CC51P's still have a pretty big bass response, there highs (midrange a little recessed) are pretty crisp and don't roll off to easily.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Actually, no, not recessed, that's a little much, maybe a little laid back as I am listening to them right now. Hmm, treble seems a tab bit laid back as well, but still a lot of clarity.


----------



## Inks

Yeah not recessed, just a tad laid back. The highs are another story, it's certainly very laid back.


----------



## Austin Morrow

I only burned them for a few hours, maybe that's why?


----------



## Angelopsaro

Why it seems so hard to me tο distinguish the highs from the mids? I feel like the mids are actually the juice of the music. All the musical instruments and the liveness of the music lies in the mids. The problem is that most of the times its hard to pick the mids from the highs (treble). A guitar has many notes and strings. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I see all of you can talk so comfortable about the mids but to me its hard to judge.


----------



## Inks

The treble is usually were all the overtones lie, but the mids have the actual notes for strings/guitar.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Why it seems so hard to me tο distinguish the highs from the mids? I feel like the *mids are actually the juice of the music*. All the musical instruments and the liveness of the music lies in the mids. The problem is that most of the times its hard to pick the mids from the highs (treble). A guitar has many notes and strings.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  You said it right there. Sometimes I find it hard to distinguish different tones because I prefer a midrange sound signature with good overall balance. If you enjoy listening to mid level frequencies, you won't notice highs and lows much unless it's obvious.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Preference:
> 
> 1)Above average bass (Iam not a hardcode bass head, but I prefer a little more bass than usual  )
> 2)Wide sound stage and details in music and mids to be on the warmer side. Not very particular about highs, but they should not be straining and should be there.
> ...


 

 Diminishing returns is a well-established concept when it comes to higher-end audio gear and to many people the difference between a decent $250 in-ear and a very good $100 one will be quite small. Is the difference worth $100+? That's up to you. There are also a few high performers in the $150 range you skipped - namely the VSonic GR07 and Radius DDM. With the ones you've selected you seem to be leaning towards the 'bass monster' side of things. The VB has huge subbass and is also fairly hard to find at the moment. The Eterna and NE-700X are two of the most bass-heavy in-ears in that price range. On paper, that doesn't quite seem like what you want. The Silver Bullet and Xcape IE fall more in the realm of 'enhanced bass'. Both are solid earphones for the money. The Copper (and Gold) has maybe a touch more bass but still not as much as an Eterna. The UM2 - I have no idea. It's quite old but a dual BA can sometimes crank out a lot of bass (see Earsonics SM2).


----------



## Angelopsaro

Joker i ask you cause you tested both but anyone else is free to comment. How would you compare the cc51 with the q-jays. One is rated 8 and the other 9 but i have a feeling i will like the cc51 more.
  I dont know why but i cant settle with q-jays. The difference with the stock foams to the silicone tips is very big. The problem is that the dry of the mids make the sound a bit less fun and live?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Also mids make the sound more distant than my brainwavz M1? For a 150$ iem this is frustrating.
  They are very comfortable and looks great but it seems i want to try something different with better mids maybe (?). Is this placebo or the mids could be better? 
   
  P.S when foam tips need to be changed, tend to make the sound more warm and less edgy?


----------



## Kunlun

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I am completely new to this and REALLY REALLY need some help deciding which IEM  to buy. Source would be clip+, pc audigy card. Unamped.
> 
> ...


 

 Hi, looking at your preference for sound, the new Future Sonics Atrio is perfect (|joker| only had the first version in his review, we are on the third version now with a new driver too so it would have a much higher score). You can get one for $179 and, for you, I would recommend it over the monster turbine pro copper (which also excellently fits your sound preferrence) because the copper has had a few issues with reliability. The copper and atrio both have excellent warranty policies (the copper is the best in the industry), but you don't want to have to ship something back to the U.S., so go with the Atrio. It has the bass and sub-bass, the warm mids and the treble you want. Soundstage with any iem is partly due to recording, fit, etc., and people on head-fi tend not to recognize that. I would say they have about the same soundstage. Comfort and fit should be good either way.
   
  Enoy.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Joker i ask you cause you tested both but anyone else is free to comment. How would you compare the cc51 with the q-jays. One is rated 8 and the other 9 but i have a feeling i will like the cc51 more.
> I dont know why but i cant settle with q-jays. The difference with the stock foams to the silicone tips is very big. The problem is that the dry of the mids make the sound a bit less fun and live?
> 
> 
> ...


 


  The q-JAYS isn't really a fun-sounding earphone and its balance is a pretty stark contrast to the somewhat mid-forward M1. The CC51 follows neither of these signatures - it emphasizes bass/mids without giving up much in the treble. I think it's a fairly unique sound because other nozzle-mounted dynamic microdrivers, namely those produced by Hippo and JVC, usually have more of a treble-oriented balance. Regardless, I put the CC51 between the q-JAYS and M1 in technical ability but I do think the midrange is one of its strengths.


----------



## AstralStorm

I've spotted some neglect of Philips line of IEMs in the reviews. There are some cheap and good models in there supposedly...


----------



## ljokerl

Added the VSonic GR07.
  
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> I've spotted some neglect of Philips line of IEMs in the reviews. There are some cheap and good models in there supposedly...


 
   
  Can't cover everything. I did risk Philips a number of times in my portable headphone thread and their stuff is really hit or miss. No consistent signature and really no way to know what's good and what isn't ahead of time.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Hey joker, 
   
  I'm sure you are probably already planning to do this, but when you review the HF3 can you make sure to compare it to the MC5 that you reviewed? I'm curious to see how Etymotic scales.
   
  Many thanks,
   
  Chris Langley.


----------



## Poetik

Um Miracle wheeeeeeeeeere aaaaaaaaaaaare youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu =)


----------



## glac1er

Thanks for the review joker. From your review, the GR-07 seems too good to be true. I wonder if you could really nitpick one thing about its sound, what would it be? This is compared to the competitions in the 9.4-9.5 SQ rating category.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Can't cover everything. I did risk Philips a number of times in my portable headphone thread and their stuff is really hit or miss. No consistent signature and really no way to know what's good and what isn't ahead of time.


 


 That's why it's more vital to have someone miss the bad ones, so that I don't have to hit them. Or worse, gift them to a friend as a cheap gift. Come on, seems like you enjoy reviewing the junk too.


----------



## kanuka

great review.
  is it really imposibble to wear the gr07 straight down??


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> great review.
> is it really imposibble to wear the gr07 straight down??


 


  -puts mine on straight down to check-
   
  No, it's not impossible, but it is rather awkward.  Works quite a bit better if you flip channels but you'd need a channel-switching adapter.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> -puts mine on straight down to check-
> 
> No, it's not impossible, but it is rather awkward.  Works quite a bit better if you flip channels but you'd need a channel-switching adapter.


 


  ...in fact, they're rather comfortable this way.   They should have added a channel-swapper in for good measure.  Oh well, microphonics are rather awful this way though.


----------



## crazedfai

I'm currently using the Denon C551, which I am currently very happy with, and may fit in with your criteria.
  The Denon C560 is this year's generation version of that.
   
  Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I am completely new to this and REALLY REALLY need some help deciding which IEM  to buy. Source would be clip+, pc audigy card. Unamped.
> 
> ...


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> ...in fact, they're rather comfortable this way.   They should have added a *channel-swapper *in for good measure.  Oh well, microphonics are rather awful this way though.


 

 what for? doesnt it just sounds the same by using the left on right and right on left??


----------



## Inks

Yes, but then your channels are swapped without an adapter which makes the music your listening to different than what they're meant to sound like.


----------



## kanuka

then you mean *up-down *, and not left-right?


----------



## Inks

I meant that when you use the left IEM for the right ear and vise-versa, simple as that. DaBomb likes it that way (wearing them straight down) and thus a channel switching adapter will help because it will place the channels to the corresponding ears.


----------



## Ikarios

What?
   
  Wearing them down means you have to use the right bud (designed for over-ear wear) on the left side, which means what normally comes out in the right channel now comes out in the left channel. If you're bothered by this (I'm not, really, but a lot of people are) you can use a channel swapper to correct this.


----------



## kanuka

i guess i get it now. but  what's the big deal hearing the left sound in the right ear and vice-versa? or is it really designed so to give a better sound on each ear??


----------



## GalmArn

No big deal generally, that's just inverted.
   
  It's only if you want to listen the music the way it was meant to be.
  It may be more annoying if you are classical music amateur.


----------



## rawrster

Imaging is affected when the channels are switched. If you have an option to swap the channels that also helps if it bothers you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


chrislangley4253 said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> I'm sure you are probably already planning to do this, but when you review the HF3 can you make sure to compare it to the MC5 that you reviewed? I'm curious to see how Etymotic scales.
> 
> ...


 
 To be honest the MC5 and HF3 reviews were both written at the same time back in December. I'm sure some amount of parallels between the two is inevitable but I don't remember how comparative the review is.
   

 Quote:


poetik said:


> Um Miracle wheeeeeeeeeere aaaaaaaaaaaare youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu =)


   
  Can't listen to the miracle and then go back to other gear and review it accurately. Tried it with the Shure SE535 at first and it may as well have been a Meelec M9. That means that I either have to dedicate a couple of weeks to using only the miracle or finish everything else before I switch to it permanently.


 Quote:


glac1er said:


> Thanks for the review joker. From your review, the GR-07 seems too good to be true. I wonder if you could really nitpick one thing about its sound, what would it be? This is compared to the competitions in the 9.4-9.5 SQ rating category.


 
 The lower treble peakiness. It improves a lot but never really goes away completely, at least not in the ~250 hrs I put on my GR07. Most of the other issues with it will be preference-related. I've already lent my pair out and, interestingly, don't feel a very strong urge to go back to it. While very capable technically, it's just not a sound that grabs you. For monitoring applications, that's a good thing. As a consumer listening device, could go either way.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Imaging is affected when the channels are switched. If you have an option to swap the channels that also helps if it bothers you.


 

 does this happen with every earphone?
  will rockbox help on that?
  not that i really mean to switch but it's good to know...
   
  btw. what is "imaging"?


----------



## Ikarios

Joker, I've been wondering about this for some time - is there any reason you wait some time before you post new reviews? I keep seeing you reference the Etymotic HF3/5 but when I went back to look at the list of reviews, the HF5 wasn't on the list. I guess it turns out you've listened to them and just haven't posted the review yet. You always have some interesting equipment on your to-do list (currently, IE7, HF3, SE535, SF5Pro, and TF10) so it irks me when you have a review written but not added to the lineup 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 thanks!


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> does this happen with every earphone?
> will rockbox help on that?
> not that i really mean to switch but it's good to know...
> 
> btw. what is "imaging"?


 
  Well, the way stereo sound works is when you get slightly different sounds in each ear, which allows you to distinguish where sounds are coming from, kind of like how having 2 eyes lets you see in 3D... If you switch the channels by swapping sides, you hear the opposite arrangement of what was originally recorded, which can be annoying... This will happen on pretty much any equipment you use, unless it plays in mono...


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Well, the way stereo sound works is when you get slightly different sounds in each ear, which allows you to distinguish where sounds are coming from, kind of like how having 2 eyes lets you see in 3D... If you switch the channels by swapping sides, you hear the opposite arrangement of what was originally recorded, which can be annoying... This will happen on pretty much any equipment you use, unless it plays in mono...


 


  Yeah, that's pretty much it.  Just annoying when suddenly music sounds different from what you're used to.  It's no huge deal, really, but it's still annoying - it's especially a problem if you're gaming.
   
  And not sure if rockbox would fix it, depends on whether or not the firmware lets you swap the channels.


----------



## jarrett

Ahh scratch that, not important...


----------



## kanuka

thanks , now its more clear!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Joker, I've been wondering about this for some time - is there any reason you wait some time before you post new reviews? I keep seeing you reference the Etymotic HF3/5 but when I went back to look at the list of reviews, the HF5 wasn't on the list. I guess it turns out you've listened to them and just haven't posted the review yet. You always have some interesting equipment on your to-do list (currently, IE7, HF3, SE535, SF5Pro, and TF10) so it irks me when you have a review written but not added to the lineup
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Actually there are several standard reasons but the HF3 happens to be a special case. I was waiting for my ACS custom tips which took around 10 weeks to get to me (after I wrote the initial review).


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Actually there are several standard reasons but the HF3 happens to be a special case. I was waiting for my ACS custom tips which took around 10 weeks to get to me (after I wrote the initial review).


 

 Care to provide those standard reasons? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  And I can understand waiting for the ACS tips to finish a complete review of the HF3, but the general population most likely won't be following in your footsteps. If you already have the review written up, why not post it?
   
  EDIT: Please don't read these as accusatory in any way - I couldn't find a way to frame these sentences without sounding aggressive, sorry! I'm not pushing you to release reviews before you think they're fully complete or thorough - I'd just like to understand your thought process regarding the release "schedule" of new reviews. Again, I tend to rely very much on your reviews (on many occasions they've single-handedly pushed me to purchase a new IEM) so I really appreciate what you're doing. I'm not sure if you'll ever get sick of hearing this but I'll probably reiterate it once or twice a month.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


ikarios said:


> Care to provide those standard reasons?


 
 Sure - the most common is that I start a review and get sidetracked before I finish it. I have a good dozen reviews in various states of completion, anywhere from 30-90%. As you probably know, I always give priority to loaner sets and product samples, which usually interrupts ongoing reviews of my own gear. A second reason is selling the headphones - I try not to post reviews of anything I intend to sell prior to selling it. If a sale thread moves slowly, it is likely to delay my ongoing review or even the next one. I also try to do my reviews in waves so that I don't have to adjust too much between consecutive headphones - wave of budget gear, wave of mid-range gear, wave of high-end gear, and so on. If something doesn't fit in with the rest of what I'm reviewing, it will probably be put off. There are probably other reasons I've put something of that I can't think of at the moment but those should be the main ones.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> ikarios said:
> ...


 

 I dunno, how about your customs stealing eartime from the other phones?  That's been a big one for me.


----------



## jarrett

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> thanks , now its more clear!


 


  Haha I was actually wondering why the HF5 weren't listed as they are a few years old. I remember how the MC5 were quite deep insertion so they probably don't interest me now.


----------



## lazuline

There are plenty of other places where you can find reviews of Ety's HF2/HF3/HF5. A good comparison to the ER4P/S was done by Chris Martens a while back in Playback's Earphone Buyers Guide, that is still linked on the front page.
   
  quote:
   
*hf2 vs. ER-4P*
 • Etymotic’s hf2 and ER-4P designs are
 similarly voiced, though side-by-side
 comparisons reveal an upper midrange
 region where the ER-4P sounds a little
 more prominent than the hf2 does. This
 difference underscores the fact that the
 ER-4P can resolve low-level sonic details
 more effectively than the hf2, but also tends
 to make the ER-4P sound a bit bright and/
 or bass-shy in comparison to its less costly
 sibling. Bass is well controlled in both
 earphones, but is a bit more prominent in the
 hf2—a difference that I think many listeners
 will welcome.

• The ER-4P comes with an even more
 extensive range of accessories (especially
 eartips) than the hf2 does, but the hf2 offers
 the compelling benefit of having headset
 functionality, while the ER-4P does not.

• The hf2 does a good job with low-level
 details and is one of the clearest sounding
 offerings in its price class, but the ER-4P
 gives an even more focused and explicit
 rendering of subtle musical details (the ER-
 4P is quite exceptional in this respect).
   
BOTTOM LINE

The hf2 is a welcome addition to the
 Etymotic product range, offering—exactly as
 advertized—many of the sonic benefits of the
 flagship ER-4P model, but at a lower price
 and with the added convenience of headset
 functionality. What I think many listeners will
 appreciate are the subtle shifts in tonal balance
 in the hf2 relative to the ER-4P; namely, the
 hf2’s slightly less prominent upper midrange
 frequencies and slightly more prominent
 bass. These shifts are subtle, not huge, but
 together they add up to a sound that conveys
 the natural warmth of music in a rich and
 welcoming way.
   
   
   
  ljokerl's scorecard will probably look something like this:
   
  Accessories *(4.5/5)* - same as er4
 Build Quality *(4/5) - * slightly lower than er4
 Isolation *(5/5)*  - same as er4
 Microphonics *(4/5)*  - slightly better than er4
 Comfort *(4.5/5)*  - slightly better than er 4 because can be worn up, cable is less bothersome
 Sound *(9.1/10)*  - slightly less detailed then er4, bit warmer overall.
 Value *(9/10)*  - at the amazon ~$100 price, preferable to analytical competitors in the price range for those who want maximum isolation, better build quality, headset functionality, 2 year warranty.
    
  Yeesh, reading this thread, some of you need to stop stalking the guy... seriously.
   
  Quote:


ikarios said:


> Care to provide those standard reasons?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## vinay2070

Quote:


crazedfai said:


> I'm currently using the Denon C551, which I am currently very happy with, and may fit in with your criteria.
> The Denon C560 is this year's generation version of that.


 

 Thanks for the suggestion  Checked the reviews and they say its pretty stressful at the high end.

  Quote: 





kunlun said:


> Hi, looking at your preference for sound, the new Future Sonics Atrio is perfect (|joker| only had the first version in his review, we are on the third version now with a new driver too so it would have a much higher score). You can get one for $179 and, for you, I would recommend it over the monster turbine pro copper (which also excellently fits your sound preferrence) because the copper has had a few issues with reliability. The copper and atrio both have excellent warranty policies (the copper is the best in the industry), but you don't want to have to ship something back to the U.S., so go with the Atrio. It has the bass and sub-bass, the warm mids and the treble you want. Soundstage with any iem is partly due to recording, fit, etc., and people on head-fi tend not to recognize that. I would say they have about the same soundstage. Comfort and fit should be good either way.
> 
> Enoy.


 

 I saw the review. These seemed like more analytical than musical. I am looking at more musical earphones, sorry i did not mention that in my first post. I will add these as well in the consideration list.
   
  Quote: 





lazuline said:


> Quote:
> 
> I'm going to give a +1 for the MTPC @ $220 from Amazon. It pretty much hits all your requirements. I got these, and decided to stop looking for my version of "fun" IEMS after living with them for a few weeks. I bought mine refurbished for $100, but if they break out of warranty, I think I'll be getting a new pair. I'm sure I could find something more optimal if I spent more time looking and expand my budget, but I'm starting to get tired of playing the head-fi game. Head-fi is Pokemon. Gotta Catch Em All.
> 
> ...


 

 As kunlun says and by the amazon reviews, I see a high failure rate on the turbine series in general(number of reviews to failure ratio). Thats why I put it at the second place in my first post. Waiting for some suggestions on the UM2 as well.  Iam tired of searching tooo. I never read this much for my engineering exams or interviews 

  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Diminishing returns is a well-established concept when it comes to higher-end audio gear and to many people the difference between a decent $250 in-ear and a very good $100 one will be quite small. Is the difference worth $100+? That's up to you. There are also a few high performers in the $150 range you skipped - namely the VSonic GR07 and Radius DDM. With the ones you've selected you seem to be leaning towards the 'bass monster' side of things. The VB has huge subbass and is also fairly hard to find at the moment. The Eterna and NE-700X are two of the most bass-heavy in-ears in that price range. On paper, that doesn't quite seem like what you want. The Silver Bullet and Xcape IE fall more in the realm of 'enhanced bass'. Both are solid earphones for the money. The Copper (and Gold) has maybe a touch more bass but still not as much as an Eterna. The UM2 - I have no idea. It's quite old but a dual BA can sometimes crank out a lot of bass (see Earsonics SM2).


 
   
  Joker, thanks for adding the Gr07 to the review list. Only making it more confusing for me to buy  The reason I had removed the DDM from my reason is that they scored less on the other divisions like comfort/microphonics etc.
  
  ========================================================================================
   
  After 2 more days of Reading :
   
*Ok, here let me refine it so that you guys can suggest me better and accurately. Here is what I am looking at:*
   
  1) Bass of the CX 55 (Review here - http://realdeepsnow.com/?p=430 Please read this review, just 1st 2 paras.) I own this and I expect this much bass. Please assume the bass LEVEL based on that review. They are not very punchy, but bass is loud and undistorted, rumbles fine at low Hz w/o distortion. Its thicker than finer and does not decay very very fast and I like it that way. Am I a basshead?
   
  2) Add wide sound stage and details to this CX55 mids which it slightly lacks. Mids should be slightly warm and details sud be there. Sounds should not merge at higher volume.
  3) Make the highs clear and extended on the CX55 but not straining.
  4) Remove the bad microphonics and thin cables from CX55.
  5) I have a small ear canal and still the small sized earbuds of the cx55 were a lil tight fit. So big IEMs are a no no. I think I need to get used to this 
  6) They should be more musical(60%) than analytical(40%) and fun to hear and not boring. (For the sake of getting bored I have ordered the HD595  )
   
  So here is the tuned list, based on suggestions from you guys and reviews from joker and amazon. 
   
  1)Sub 100
   
  a) XCape IE - Has good enough bass as cx55?
  b) Silver Bullet - Has good enough bass as cx55?
  c) Eterna
  d) Ne 700X
   
   
  2)100 to 200
  a) GR07 - The Review is wonderful! Are these a little fun to listen. Is the bass strong enough?
  b) Future sonic atrios -More analytical?
   
   
  3) 200+
  a) SM2 - IS this still available? I see the V2 is out.
  b) Turbine copper - Afraid of high failure rate of turbines 
  c) UM2 - Any suggestions here?
   
   
  I have described my preference to the BEST! Now which one do I buy  Please help me out here. Going to a shop and testing out/sending back is not an option for me.
   
  Thanks a ton.


----------



## vinay2070

Joker, you need to review the CX55 from deal extreme - http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-sennheiser-cx55-in-ear-stereo-earphone-with-carrying-bag-3-5mm-jack-120cm-cable-34760
   
  I got the so called genuine version and they ROCK. Still at 30 hours of break in and the mids getting better, they sounded better than my friends old HD 201. For the 11.xx $ shipped price, they simply ROCK. They may actually land at a good "value" position on your list. My only complain is that the left ear piece is slightly(15%) louder than the right ones. I had ordered one more considering the price  Hope that ones fine and genuine too.


----------



## NimbleRabit

Thanks for this thread joker, I've been using my Westone 2's for something like half a year now and I'm still happy every time I put them in my ears.  This thread has helped me a ton in finding what I wanted, and I've also pointed countless friends here when they asked me for recommendations.  I might get something new at some point (the westone's are amazing but there is a little something missing in the treble), but right now I just want to reiterate how awesome this thread is and thank you for everything you do here.


----------



## estreeter

I am currently trying to decide between the RE262 and the q-Jays : its the word 'Preorder' on the Head-Direct site that has me leaning toward the latter. I notice that the asking price for the RE262 seems to have come down drastically since Joker published his review - thats a good thing, but who knows what kind of backlog they have ? q-Jays are increasingly crying out 'Buy me, buy me !'  
   
  http://www.wickeddigital.com.au/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=joomlaplates.tpl&product_id=791&category_id=58&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=53


----------



## EraserXIV

From all I've seen and heard, the RE262 is not in pre-order, they just didn't update their website. Head-fiers have reported ordering and having them shipped soon after.


----------



## estreeter

Thanks Eraser - you have just put me back into 'indecisive' mode 
   
  Seriously, both sound like very good VFM from Joker's descriptions, so it may come down to a coin toss.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I dunno, how about your customs stealing eartime from the other phones?  That's been a big one for me.


 

 My not-so-ideal solution was to put the Miracle in the back of my desk drawer for the time being. The 1964-T makes for a good benchmark and isn't leaps and bounds above top-tier universals.

  Quote: 





lazuline said:


> ljokerl's scorecard will probably look something like this:
> 
> Accessories *(4.5/5)* - same as er4
> Build Quality *(4/5) - * slightly lower than er4
> ...


 

 Close, actually. Still a damn good deal in my book.
   
  Accessories (4/5)
  Build Quality (4/5) 
 Isolation (5/5)
 Microphonics (4/5) 
 Comfort (4/5) 
   
  Sound (9/10) 
  Value (9/10) 


  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *vinay2070* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> a) GR07 - The Review is wonderful! Are these a little fun to listen. Is the bass strong enough?


 

 I have no idea what the CX55 sounds like but the GR07 is not a 'fun' earphone. It's a studio monitor. Bass is plentiful for my taste  but not at all enhanced. Also, I hope you realize that Turbine Golds/Coppers come with a lifetime warranty plus a 1-time no questions asked replacement - one of their strongest selling points.
   


  Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Joker, you need to review the CX55 from deal extreme - http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-sennheiser-cx55-in-ear-stereo-earphone-with-carrying-bag-3-5mm-jack-120cm-cable-34760
> 
> I got the so called genuine version and they ROCK. Still at 30 hours of break in and the mids getting better, they sounded better than my friends old HD 201. For the 11.xx $ shipped price, they simply ROCK. They may actually land at a good "value" position on your list. My only complain is that the left ear piece is slightly(15%) louder than the right ones. I had ordered one more considering the price  Hope that ones fine and genuine too.


 

 There are no genuine Sennheiser product on dealextreme. This has been discussed out on the forum a dozen times (which is not to say that the fake ones don't sound good). Also, fake IE8s and my reasons for not reviewing any counterfeit items were discussed a couple of pages back in this thread. 
   
  A 15% channel imbalance would bother the crap out of me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


  Quote: 





nimblerabit said:


> Thanks for this thread joker, I've been using my Westone 2's for something like half a year now and I'm still happy every time I put them in my ears.  This thread has helped me a ton in finding what I wanted, and I've also pointed countless friends here when they asked me for recommendations.  I might get something new at some point (the westone's are amazing but there is a little something missing in the treble), but right now I just want to reiterate how awesome this thread is and thank you for everything you do here.


 

 Thanks, good to hear!

   
  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Thanks Eraser - you have just put me back into 'indecisive' mode
> 
> Seriously, both sound like very good VFM from Joker's descriptions, so it may come down to a coin toss.


 

 Ah, the ol' coin toss. Perfect for those difficult decisions.


----------



## inarc

Just got the MeElectronic M2s Seriously hoping it improves with burn in, absolutely correct in your review where you say that the bass is boomy however I would like to add that the sound is just unbalanced and the bass really just overpowers everything. I would like to add that this is a newer version that comes with a mic and bi flange tips the "45 degree" plug and a clip to reduce microphonics.


----------



## fatthumb

Hi ljokerl, how do you compare sound signature between DBA02 and GR07 (one being BA and another dynamic)? I assume (from your previous post in the last few pages) you consider DBA02 to be more exciting? Why is it so?
   
  Have you reviewed TF10 in the past? I'm curious about your feedback on TF10 
   
  Thanks for your great review as always. Cheers.


----------



## vinay2070

Joker, can you please tell me which of these are fun sounding and less of analytical?
   
  and if you can give a bass rating(loudness/quantity) for each out of 10 (considering eterna / ne700x as 10), that would end my 4 week long search. Expecting your help very much here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Iam not expecting you to be very accurate here, but just what you can recall from your memory 
   
  1)Sub 100

   

  a) XCape IE -

  b) Silver Bullet - 

  c) Eterna

  d) Ne 700X

   

  2)100 to 200

  a) GR07 - 

  b) Future sonic atrios -

   

  3) 200+

  a) SM2 - 

  b) Turbine copper - 

  c) UM2 -


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inarc said:


> Just got the MeElectronic M2s Seriously hoping it improves with burn in, absolutely correct in your review where you say that the bass is boomy however I would like to add that the sound is just unbalanced and the bass really just overpowers everything. I would like to add that this is a newer version that comes with a mic and bi flange tips the "45 degree" plug and a clip to reduce microphonics.


 

 It's a $10 IEM, I really don't know what you expect. MEElec has revised the build and sound of most of their models at some point and I haven't kept up with the M2 revisions. It's not a model for head-fi anyway. The presence of a mic just means it's an M2P and not an M2.
   


  Quote: 





fatthumb said:


> Hi ljokerl, how do you compare sound signature between DBA02 and GR07 (one being BA and another dynamic)? I assume (from your previous post in the last few pages) you consider DBA02 to be more exciting? Why is it so?
> 
> Have you reviewed TF10 in the past? I'm curious about your feedback on TF10
> 
> Thanks for your great review as always. Cheers.


 

 The signatures aren't too different - it's the presentation of BA vs dynamic where they differ most. The GR07 has slightly better bass extension but the detailing isn't as aggressive and the treble sparkle is diminished somewhat. I generally find analytical BAs to sound more energetic than dynamics and the DBA-02 is no exception. 
   
  TF10 is on the to-do list (post #8 of this thread, below the table).

  
  Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Joker, can you please tell me which of these are fun sounding and less of analytical?
> 
> and if you can give a bass rating(loudness/quantity) for each out of 10 (considering eterna / ne700x as 10), that would end my 4 week long search. Expecting your help very much here
> 
> ...


 

 I don't know about a numeric rating but perhaps I can try to arrange them in order of quantity.
   
  Atrio ~ Eterna > NE-700X > Turbine Copper > SM2 > Xcape IE ~ Silver Bullet ~ GR07


----------



## jipan

Now if only you could review Superlux IEM's.... btw, thanks for your great effort its really helpful. I'm still can't deciding going for Hippo Pearl or MEElectronics M9, I can get both for about $24. Which one have better mids, soundstage, separation and neutrality?


----------



## vinay2070

> I don't know about a numeric rating but perhaps I can try to arrange them in order of quantity.
> 
> Atrio ~ Eterna > NE-700X > Turbine Copper > SM2 > Xcape IE ~ Silver Bullet ~ GR07


 
   
  Thanks Guru, will read more and get back if I have some doubts.
   
  Leaning towards MTPC or above basswise. Mind and heart says MPTC. But let me read/decide between those 4 again.
   
  EDIT: After some more reading and googling, I will settle between Eterna/NE 700x/ Copper.
   
  Since Eterna is almost unavailable everywhere, its going to be *either copper or ne 700x*. Hope both of these run well unamped on my clip+
   
  Also where can I find the over the ear support for the coppers?


----------



## chelle

Hey everyone,
   
  You probably have heard this, but I'm amazed by this review and by 200 pages long discussion 
  I've red a lot of it, and founded out how little i know about IEMs. 
   
  I'm looking for budget (<30euros) IEMs.
  I like clear sound, well with a bit stronger well defined bass. Hate the lack of treble, and i guess mids aren't so problematic .
   
  Owned Koss spark plug which turned out too have pumped up muddy bass that gave me headaches, at least they had no treble . I used them like twice, and I threw them away. After that, I used some budget sonys which were ok.
   
  Wanted to buy CX300s, now that i saw this, i think there are better options.
  Liked PL21s. PL30s seem a bit big, cant find M9s on ebay.uk
   
  Any suggestions? Did something better show up since these reviews were done?
   
  Thnx!


----------



## kanuka

why dont you order the m9 from meelec site?


----------



## chelle

well maybe I will if they turn out to be the best solution. M6 looks like a good choice also. 
   
*Any opinions? *
   
   
  I guess, there were a lot of similar questions somewhere in this 200 pages


----------



## kanuka

check this thread
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523950/best-earbuds-under-20-maybe-30
  post #6 is joker's listing some good options too
   
  also check mp4nation.net
  they have a preorder of the Brainwavz M1 for $30 instead of $40~$45
   
  and maybe you should also check clieos multi-review like joker's
  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/450407/multiple-iem-shootout-v-3


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jipan said:


> Now if only you could review Superlux IEM's.... btw, thanks for your great effort its really helpful. I'm still can't deciding going for Hippo Pearl or MEElectronics M9, I can get both for about $24. Which one have better mids, soundstage, separation and neutrality?


 

 M9 has better soundstaging and separation; the Pearl has better mids and better overall balance.
   


  Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Also where can I find the over the ear support for the coppers?


 

 I've never seen that before.

  
  Quote: 





chelle said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> You probably have heard this, but I'm amazed by this review and by 200 pages long discussion
> I've red a lot of it, and founded out how little i know about IEMs.
> ...


 

 M9 should be available on amazon.co.uk or advancedmp3players. Be warned that it has very powerful bass, though it's not nearly as muddy as a CX300. No lack of treble, ether. 30 Euros can land you a few other decent earphones these days. The MEElec M21 may actually come out around that price with shipping from the US. The Xears XR120Pro retails for 29EUR and is a very impressive performer. The Xears Bullet is a surprisingly good earphone as well despite the low price. The Brainwavz ProAlpha is also worth mentioning.


----------



## Inks

I'll go for the Coppers as you won't get as much upgraditis. But I'll also consider the Golds though which you may find at a lower price and yet have comparable sound (not one is completely better than the other). 
   
  While we are on the topic of Monsters. I think the Coppers have more flex than the Golds because there is less dampering on the nozzle (foam?). I think they're both the same drivers and housing but the dampering is what causes the changes.  I assume this because the HJE900s get more flex without filters and foam. This will also explain the sound differences and performance (efficiency) between the Golds and Coppers (similar sound differences happen to the HJE900s/RE0/Zero) as these are said to use the same drivers. I personally think this is spot on...
   
  Oh and for those interested in the Monster Turbine Pearls. They seem to apparently be the regular Monster Turbines in Monster Tubrine Pro-like packaging with a nice white color to boot.....lol (note: they are not in the Pro series). I wouldn't expect any sound differences.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





inks said:


> I'll go for the Coppers as you won't get as much upgraditis. But I'll also consider the Golds though which you may find at a lower price and yet have comparable sound (not one is completely better than the other).
> 
> While we are on the topic of Monsters. I think the Coppers have more flex than the Golds because there is less dampering on the nozzle (foam?). I think they're both the same drivers and housing but the dampering is what causes the changes.  I assume this because the HJE900s get more flex without filters and foam. This will also explain the sound differences and performance (efficiency) between the Golds and Coppers (similar sound differences happen to the HJE900s/RE0/Zero) as these are said to use the same drivers. I personally think this is spot on...
> 
> Oh and for those interested in the Monster Turbine Pearls. They seem to apparently be the regular Monster Turbines in Monster Tubrine Pro-like packaging with a nice white color to boot.....lol (note: they are not in the Pro series). I wouldn't expect any sound differences.


 


  It's probably more damping in the actual driver, more than just a filter.  I doubt the sonic differences could simply be due to a filter...


----------



## bowlofsoup

This is kind of a broad question, but which iem's going up to $70 on this list would be the best choice for listening to metal? I really have a hard time with all of the descriptions of the sound, and I really don't know what sound fits this type of music the best.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> This is kind of a broad question, but which iem's going up to $70 on this list would be the best choice for listening to metal? I really have a hard time with all of the descriptions of the sound, and I really don't know what sound fits this type of music the best.


 

 Hmmm - are you into any specific genre ? My friend is a massive Opeth fan and he was very happy with the resolution offered by the RE0, but they didnt have enough slam for my Melodeath cravings. I would suggest that you revisit Joker's epic thread, get a shortlist together of the IEMs in your price range and come back to us.


----------



## Inks

Of course there is no filter difference as they are the same. There is a difference in the dampening in the nozzle or driver.


----------



## bowlofsoup

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Hmmm - are you into any specific genre ? My friend is a massive Opeth fan and he was very happy with the resolution offered by the RE0, but they didnt have enough slam for my Melodeath cravings. I would suggest that you revisit Joker's epic thread, get a shortlist together of the IEMs in your price range and come back to us.


 


  Here's a list of what I was considering:
   
  Soundmagic PL50
  Brainwavz ProAlpha
  JVC HA-FXC80
  Meelectronics CX21
  Meelectronics CW31
  Meelectronics SP51
  Nuforce NE-700X
   
  I didn't list certain iems since I am trying to find something on Amazon, though I may still consider the Brainwavz M2. In terms of style of music, I also listen to Opeth. I also listen to melodeath, OSDM, trash, NWOBHM, metalcore, deathcore, etc. I listen to any variation of metal, essentially. I also listen to the occasional pop, rock, and trip hop. If this helps at all, I own a pain of JVC HA-M750's that I really enjoy. Joker has them on his portable headphones thread. Here is their sound description:
   
      "The sound of the JVCs manages to be very full and rich but at the same time surprisingly balanced. The bass is quite deep – extension is better than the K81DJ and about on-par with the CAL!s – and well-textured. If the mids weren’t so forward these could easily be classified as bass-centric cans, but the whole signature is pretty aggressive, which corrects the balance (albeit at the expense of a mediocre soundstage). The midrange is very thick and creamy, causing them to lag behind the K81Dj in separation and clarity. The timbre isn’t quite as natural, either, but they do sound more coherent as a result. While on the dark and warm side of neutral, the M750 did a great job of keeping me entertained without being absolutely true to the source."
   
  Sorry for going on a bit there.


----------



## jipan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> M9 has better soundstaging and separation; the Pearl has better mids and better overall balance.


 


 thank you very much! I think I'm going for Pearl... My last IEM is rather bass-heavy (its a locally re-branded SoundMagic PL20, I think), so I'm kinda wanting something different.


----------



## xtremetechuk

Received my CK10 today, and the difference between the RE0 is night and day. I weren't expecting such a difference, my only gripe is sibilance. Even with Comply tips the sibilance is still unbearable, I hope the burn-in will reduce sibilance otherwise I will be looking elsewhere.


----------



## TekeRugburn

finally got my refurbished coppers from monster.... took forever.... after listening to them i remember why it was so hard to sell my original pair.  great headphones for casual listening at night in bed


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





tekerugburn said:


> finally got my refurbished coppers from monster.... took forever.... after listening to them i remember why it was so hard to sell my original pair.  great headphones for casual listening at night in bed


 


  As opposed to intense listening in the morning on your sofa?


----------



## aleki

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> As opposed to intense listening in the morning on your sofa?


 

 or lounging on your chair at noon..


----------



## vinay2070

Guys, Finally decided on the turbine coppers. Will be placing the order today from amzon. Are there any eartips i need to be considering along with this? I have a narrow ear canal.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Guys, Finally decided on the turbine coppers. Will be placing the order today from amzon. Are there any eartips i need to be considering along with this? I have a narrow ear canal.


 


  Pretty sure they come with a pretty massive array of tips.  You probably don't have to worry about fit, unless none of the many, many included tips fit you (it comes with a whole bunch of different kinds too, last time I checked).


----------



## aleki

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Guys, Finally decided on the turbine coppers. Will be placing the order today from amzon. Are there any eartips i need to be considering along with this? I have a narrow ear canal.


 


 you'll get 15 different pairs of tips; includes five pairs foam/hybrid, 5 pairs silicone gel, 3 regular silicones and two tri-flanges. If you get anything less, they're likely a phony pair..


----------



## vinay2070

OK then, I am ordering


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> Received my CK10 today, and the difference between the RE0 is night and day. I weren't expecting such a difference, my only gripe is sibilance. Even with Comply tips the sibilance is still unbearable, I hope the burn-in will reduce sibilance otherwise I will be looking elsewhere.


 

  
  I too received some CK10's Today & I too @ times hear that there is a fair amount of sibilance either being produced by the CK10's or High frequency content in the original track.Are you listening too mp3's by any chance? .Also If you don't achieve a very tight seal then there is a lack of bass extension which will sound like sibilance(edit: will over emphasize the high frequencies), .For these I.E.M's to work effectively you need that slight suction  feel type of seal .
   
  Once you get the fitting right the bass comes up and balance's the highs thus the "Sibilance" fades mostly away even with mp3's  .CK10's are well balanced as tracks that I produced using my Big monitor headphones are accurately reproduced  .In fact apart from the inner head sound that I.E.M inherently have, the track is musically identical (edit: sorry I meant has a identical  musical transparency ) to how it sounds on the Audio technica ATH - M50's & HD25's .
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> I hope the burn-in will reduce sibilance otherwise I will be looking elsewhere.


 
   
   
   "burn-in" it will not reduce the high frequencies .In fact I believe "burn-in" is largely marketing spin as manufacturers are well aware the longer people listen to a particular type of sound the more likely they are to feel comfortable with it .What may happen is you adapt to the highs you hear with these and maybe begin to enjoy them .I think quite a few people especially so called "bass heads" want that boom from the bass.But quite often that rumble is not in the original recording, it is the re-verb effect of loud  music,with low frequency content being played in large rooms like Night clubs. And is in fact a distortion .
   
   
   
  As for me I'm still testing the CK10's out.I've got Fairly used to the westone 3 I.E.M with it's over amplified bass region .At times I feel CK10's are @ the other end of the spectrum with over amplified highs,even if they are energetic Sprite highs   .


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Also where can I find the over the ear support for the coppers?


 

 That's part of the new accessories for the Coppers.  I use Phonak guides for my MD's from audeoworld.
   
  Meelec tip kits M11+ are great for Monsters.
   
  Did someone say the CK10 sounds like the M50?  WTH are people smoking?


----------



## xtremetechuk

@Joker 

Will the Shure Triple Flange tips with CK10 reduce sibilance?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/6-SHURE-Ear-tips-In-Ear-bud-Earphones-Headphone-sleeves-/200484117562?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eadc8dc3a


----------



## GalmArn

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> @Joker
> 
> Will the Shure Triple Flange tips with CK10 reduce sibilance?
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/6-SHURE-Ear-tips-In-Ear-bud-Earphones-Headphone-sleeves-/200484117562?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eadc8dc3a


 

  
  Apparently Joker barely perceived any sibilance, so you should probably ask in the CK10 topic.
   
  At the end of this post, _"Sony, Shure tri-flanges, and/or foam tips"_ seem to be recommended for sibilance issues.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> Here's a list of what I was considering:
> Soundmagic PL50
> Brainwavz ProAlpha
> JVC HA-FXC80
> ...


 
   
  Joker or ClieOS can obviously give you more specific reccomendations from these, but I do have the PL50 and I find them to be a litte too 'polite' : the upside of that is that they are the least fatiguing phones I own. One of the things to be careful of with the cheaper IEMs is durability - my RE0s literally fell apart within the first 6 months - but the PL50s seem quite tough by comparison. That said, you will almost certainly take more care of your IEMs than I do, but at least you know the PL50 has been 'battle tested' for months on end (I did try to baby the RE0, to no avail).


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Did someone say the CK10 sounds like the M50?  WTH are people smoking?


 

 Where has someone said a I.E.M sounds like a Big headphone ? They must be drinking something which contains a brain altering drug & makes their sense's lag  .
   
  Or maybe they should be a little more precise .The Analytical characteristic of the CK10 is closely matched with the Analytical characteristic of the m50 & HD25...... no that's still not quite what I mean.The CK10 ,M50 & HD25 are all *Transparent*! .-" Easy to hear into the music, detailed, clear, not muddy. Wide flat frequency response, sharp time response, very low distortion and noise. A hear through quality that is akin to clarity and reveals all aspects of detail."
   
   
  And it doesn't matter what people are smoking ,it's destroying there lungs!, weather that be direct inhalation of personal narcotics or passive breathing of Vehicle exhaust fumes .
   
  But that's just common sense! ?  .Lungs don't like smoke of any kind .. IMFO.
   
  Anyway keeping focused on the Rhythm . So Anaxilus ! comparing the CK10's Transparency with that of the M50's what are the main difference's you hear? .
   
  The ck10's high's sometimes seem to be too dominant for me.Nothing that a little tweak of the EQ can't Fix .


----------



## bowlofsoup

Thanks for the help estreeter.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





ib1dance said:


> Where has someone said a I.E.M sounds like a Big headphone ? They must be drinking something which contains a brain altering drug & makes their sense's lag  .


 
   
  Hmm - I'm not going to name names, but there is a reference to a certain IEM sounding very much like the *HD600*, and its not the first time I have seen that particular comparison. I agree that such comparisons serve no worthwhile purpose, other than to start flame wars between fans of the RE0, er K701, er .......


----------



## chrislangley4253

soooo.. Shure Olives. Amazing with my Ety MC5's. I think they made me decide to definitely upgrade to a pair of HF5's for my birthday. I love these headphones with these tips. I saw an increase in isolation and a huuuge bump in sound quality. Awesome.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Oh and for those interested in the Monster Turbine Pearls. They seem to apparently be the regular Monster Turbines in Monster Tubrine Pro-like packaging with a nice white color to boot.....lol (note: they are not in the Pro series). I wouldn't expect any sound differences.


 

 Very interesting, thanks. I guess I'll be waiting for the Trumpet Tributes, then.

  
  Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> Here's a list of what I was considering:
> 
> Soundmagic PL50
> Brainwavz ProAlpha
> ...


 

 The M2 is available on amazon as well. $70 will also get you an A151 and the CX21/CW31 really aren't worth buying over it. However, that M750 that you like lies far closer in balance to the NE-700X or rather, a split of the NE-700X and the Brainwavz M2. If you want the mids more forward than they are in the M750, the M2 is a solid choice. If you like the balance as is (and maybe wouldn't mind more bass depending on the seal you get with the Nuforces), the NE-700X. The SP51 is also quite fun to play with but its bass is a bit loose on the 'extreme bass' port.

  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> @Joker
> 
> Will the Shure Triple Flange tips with CK10 reduce sibilance?
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/6-SHURE-Ear-tips-In-Ear-bud-Earphones-Headphone-sleeves-/200484117562?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eadc8dc3a


 

 Not sure. I use fake monster tri-flanges or MEElec M6 trips (can't remember which is which anymore) and of course Sony Hybrids. The CK10 fits into my ear canal pretty much in its entirety. I don't get significant amounts of sibilance unless it's present on the track.


  Quote: 





chrislangley4253 said:


> soooo.. Shure Olives. Amazing with my Ety MC5's. I think they made me decide to definitely upgrade to a pair of HF5's for my birthday. I love these headphones with these tips. I saw an increase in isolation and a huuuge bump in sound quality. Awesome.


 

 Ah, first Olive experience. They were my favourite tips back when the Er6i was my primary earphone.


----------



## vinay2070

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> That's part of the new accessories for the Coppers.  I use Phonak guides for my MD's from audeoworld.


 
   
  I doubt if the kit I ordered from amazon yesterday has those new ear guides as its not mentioned anywhere.
   
  The audioworld US site is not working properly. I get 404 error when i click buy.
   
  BTW can someone please help me find some over the ear guides for Coppers? A quick search on amazon for "ear guides" is not fetching anything useful. and google fetches only Phonak guides sold in UK. Any US sites sell them? 
  
  Thanks.


----------



## aleki

to be honest, my ears do a better job at keeping the headphones in place. those ear guides move a bit too much to make them useful..


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Hmm - I'm not going to name names, but there is a reference to a certain IEM sounding very much like the *HD600*, and its not the first time I have seen that particular comparison. I agree that such comparisons serve no worthwhile purpose, other than to start flame wars between fans of the RE0, er K701, er .......


 

 Apart from the purpose of having a relatively similar Transparency thus a nice Audio continuity of your headphones,I.E.M's etc .So  music produced on one type of headphone will sound reasonably similar on another headphone or I.E.M .That's an issue I have with westone 3's .I'd produce a track using M50's and or HD25's and parts in the lower frequency would sound substantially different on the W3's with some tracks .
   
  Anyway I have no Desire to Argue this particular point. I only mentioned it as to be helpful.
   
  I have found Jokers Interpretation of headphones such as M50's , HD25 and yuin G2a to be Accurate .Not only Accurately describing the Detail of these headphones independently,but also there transparency being relatively well match . HD25 being close to M50's and the clip on yuin G2a having a Transparency that doesn't leave you feeling Disappointed after you've been listening with the  Bigger headphones,though the G2a it does need EQ or a tight fit .
   
  CK10 seems to be another Audio device with that Transparency signature .Though with slightly risen Highs which can at first listen veil the sub bass region .
   
  So merely as a helpful suggestion for people whom feel CK10's are too sibilant ,Try turning down  the High end Frequencies spectrum /Treble .Then you can turn the volume up more to hear the bass without the highs sounding Sibilant .
   
  I'm trying this method out just to see if I can recalibrate my ears.Maybe using westone 3's I've become too used to the bass being in my face .
   
  But if after a few days I still feel that the CK10's are too Sibilant .....?
   
  Moving on


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





ib1dance said:


> Apart from the purpose of having a relatively similar Transparency thus a nice Audio continuity of your headphones,I.E.M's etc .So  music produced on one type of headphone will sound reasonably similar on another headphone or I.E.M .That's an issue I have with westone 3's .I'd produce a track using M50's and or HD25's and parts in the lower frequency would sound substantially different on the W3's with some tracks .
> 
> Anyway I have no Desire to Argue this particular point. I only mentioned it as to be helpful.
> 
> ...


 


  Quick, rather off-topic question: why do some people capitalize adjectives and other random words like this sometimes?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





aleki said:


> to be honest, my ears do a better job at keeping the headphones in place. those ear guides move a bit too much to make them useful..


 

 ???


----------



## rroseperry

I might be thinking about getting a new universal and was wondering how the GR07 compares to the more expensive Ortofon e-Q5 for example. Thanks.


----------



## bowlofsoup

Thanks for the help Joker. The M2's were available on Amazon until a few weeks ago, and I'm not sure when they'll be back. I'm pretty sure I'm between the M2's and the NE-700X at this point, especially since both resemble my JVC's in sound.


----------



## aleki

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> ???


 


 what I meant by that is that the cables tuck behind my ear and dont move out of place. with the ear guides, I cant keep them in place when moving around since they are too big for my ears to pinch tight. I end up having to readjust the phonak guides more often than without them..


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





aleki said:


> what I meant by that is that the cables tuck behind my ear and dont move out of place. with the ear guides, I cant keep them in place when moving around since they are too big for my ears to pinch tight. I end up having to readjust the phonak guides more often than without them..


 

 Ahhh.  It hadn't occurred to me that the ear guides might not fit different ear sizes.


----------



## xtremetechuk

@Joker

Thanks for you time and advice, I most definitely appreciate it.

Were your CK10's purchased second-hand? That may be why you can't hear sibilance, after 20H burn-in I'm finding the sibilance to become less apparent.


----------



## sinquito

Hello, I got a question, currently I am using the panasonic hje 900 as my daily drivers, but I used to listen to the FA eterna, I do like them both but I like more the eterna, mostly because their engaging sound and their isolation, Any recomendations to upgrade, my budget is 150 to 170 and I listen to specially trash and metalcore and post harcore and post grundge. I was thinking about the RE 256 but I am afraid that my zune hd and my xperia 10 wont be able to drive them with out an amp.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> I might be thinking about getting a new universal and was wondering how the GR07 compares to the more expensive Ortofon e-Q5 for example. Thanks.


 

 Quite well overall although they are different sound signatures
   
   
   

  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> @Joker
> 
> Thanks for you time and advice, I most definitely appreciate it.
> 
> Were your CK10's purchased second-hand? That may be why you can't hear sibilance, after 20H burn-in I'm finding the sibilance to become less apparent.


 

  More like fourth-hand.


----------



## rroseperry

Hi |joker|, do you mind a follow up question? I had gotten the impression that both had a certain clarity, but now that I go back and look at mark2410's review, it sounds as though the GR07 has a slight V shape, though adequate highs, where the e-Q5 is going to be flatter overall with a good mid-range. Would that be accurate?


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> Hi |joker|, do you mind a follow up question? I had gotten the impression that both had a certain clarity, but now that I go back and look at mark2410's review, it sounds as though the GR07 has a slight V shape, though adequate highs, where the e-Q5 is going to be flatter overall with a good mid-range. Would that be accurate?


 


  Personally, I wouldn't say the GR07 has a v-shape.  If anything it's just a bit warm with the mids.  But then, I don't have many headphones to compare to.


----------



## rrjack12345

hey so im looking for new headphones since my skullcnadies inkd broke and now im stuck with the apple ones =-(, btw those are the only 2 headphones ive ever owned so i dont know much about this, i loved the skullcandies though,i mostly listen to Children of bodom, metallica, messhugah, iron maiden, august burns red, as blood runs black, pantera, across the sun, after the burial etc... you get it jajaj all types of metal and well ive read alot of comments in here and found the Klipsch - Image S4,Brainwavz M2 among other like im-590, etymotic mc5 etc... were great for this type of music but i dont know, so what do you think and for sound well i dont know i guess i like a little bit of everything i cant really tell much specifics about audio, just that i want good sounding headphones XD i can spend 50 bucks a little more wouldnt kill me if its worth the extra money, just a little though jajaj.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





rrjack12345 said:


> hey so im looking for new headphones since my skullcnadies inkd broke and now im stuck with the apple ones =-(, btw those are the only 2 headphones ive ever owned so i dont know much about this, i loved the skullcandies though,i mostly listen to Children of bodom, metallica, messhugah, iron maiden, august burns red, as blood runs black, pantera, across the sun, after the burial etc... you get it jajaj all types of metal and well ive read alot of comments in here and found the Klipsch - Image S4,Brainwavz M2 among other like im-590, etymotic mc5 etc... were great for this type of music but i dont know, so what do you think and for sound well i dont know i guess i like a little bit of everything i cant really tell much specifics about audio, just that i want good sounding headphones XD i can spend 50 bucks a little more wouldnt kill me if its worth the extra money, just a little though jajaj.


 


  I'd recommend the maximo im590's in a heartbeat.. Great little set of IEM's that will always get listening time from me no matter how expensive my rig gets. Just some really fun IEM's..


----------



## ljokerl

Added two new Xears releases - the Resonance and the PS120PRO
  
  Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> Hi |joker|, do you mind a follow up question? I had gotten the impression that both had a certain clarity, but now that I go back and look at mark2410's review, it sounds as though the GR07 has a slight V shape, though adequate highs, where the e-Q5 is going to be flatter overall with a good mid-range. Would that be accurate?


 
   
  Calling the GR07 v-shaped is a bit strong IMO. It does not have forward mids but 'v-shaped' implies a certain amount of bass and treble dominance, which is not the case with the GR07. That said, the e-Q5 probably is flatter overall and also a bit mid-centric, like e-Q7. It's warmer in the midrange than the GR07 and provides a more musical presentation compared to the dryer, more monitor-like VSonics.
   

  Quote: 





rrjack12345 said:


> hey so im looking for new headphones since my skullcnadies inkd broke and now im stuck with the apple ones =-(, btw those are the only 2 headphones ive ever owned so i dont know much about this, i loved the skullcandies though,i mostly listen to Children of bodom, metallica, messhugah, iron maiden, august burns red, as blood runs black, pantera, across the sun, after the burial etc... you get it jajaj all types of metal and well ive read alot of comments in here and found the Klipsch - Image S4,Brainwavz M2 among other like im-590, etymotic mc5 etc... were great for this type of music but i dont know, so what do you think and for sound well i dont know i guess i like a little bit of everything i cant really tell much specifics about audio, just that i want good sounding headphones XD i can spend 50 bucks a little more wouldnt kill me if its worth the extra money, just a little though jajaj.


 

 Nearly anything is an upgrade to the Ink'd buds. I  would not recommend the S4 as it's just not good enough for the usual asking price or the MC5, due to its signature. The iM-590 and M2 are both good all-rounders, or the Fischer Silver Bullet/ ECCI PR401 if you want to step up in price. You can also get the MEElec CC51 for $50 from overstock which is a pretty damn good price if you can get used to the fit. The SP51 may be another option.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Quote:
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion  Checked the reviews and they say its pretty stressful at the high end.
> 
> ...


 


  I am not a Monster fan but when you have something that well distributed and purchased by non enthusiasts, you will get more negative reviews as folks tend to write more often about dissatisfaction. More sold means more failed and I bet you read reviews about lack of bass from inexperienced users coming from buds and not getting a seal.  All I'm saying is that


----------



## rroseperry

ljokerl said:


> Added two new Xears releases - the Resonance and the PS120PRO
> 
> 
> Calling the GR07 v-shaped is a bit strong IMO. It does not have forward mids but 'v-shaped' implies a certain amount of bass and treble dominance, which is not the case with the GR07. That said, the e-Q5 probably is flatter overall and also a bit mid-centric, like e-Q7. It's warmer in the midrange than the GR07 and provides a more musical presentation compared to the dryer, more monitor-like VSonics.




Thanks. I think I'll keep an eye on the for sale forum for the e-Q7 or e-Q5. Musical is more my preference.


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> @Joker
> 
> Thanks for you time and advice, I most definitely appreciate it.
> 
> Were your CK10's purchased second-hand? That may be why you can't hear sibilance, after 20H burn-in I'm finding the sibilance to become less apparent.


 

 Was that "20H burn-in" done mostly whilst you were listening to them or did you leave them  burning in without listening to them and then after-wards notice the change in Sibilance? . Listening to High frequencies for long periods will certainly dampen your ears sensitivity to those high frequencies .
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> More like fourth-hand.


 


  OK I will take the CK10's out of the parcel, as I was going to post them back tomorrow, and leave them "burning" in over night . I'd really like to calm down the high end and beef up the low end on the CK10's.
   
  I definitely have acquired a love hate relationship with them . Love there quick response and mid - high mid range .Hate that on some  electronic/dance tracks they mask the low end bass to sub bass by a over pronounced  top end .
   
  Do they have a mid to high frequency spike? !
   
  EDIT: Dam though these things  fly.Either way there is no going back to westone 3 's  .Gonna white noise the CK10's for 24 hours and hear if they do actually burn in .


----------



## Poetik

UM MIRAAAAAAAAAAACLEEEEEEEEEEE you are getting closer ^_^*.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


ib1dance said:


> Do they have a mid to high frequency spike? !


 
 No, they have a treble spike above the usual 'sibilant' frequency range. It's what gives them some of that air and cleanliness. I think different tips will help the CK10 much more than burn-in. 

  
  Quote: 





poetik said:


> UM MIRAAAAAAAAAAACLEEEEEEEEEEE you are getting closer ^_^*.


 

 Farther, actually - it is being buried in my desk under the growing pile of review samples. The upside is that some of those samples are now finished and will never be listened to again.


----------



## xtremetechuk

@ib1dance

I fed them white noise over-night. 

All of my recordings are lossless, and I 'm using the sony hybrid tips. The stock tips are more prone to sibilance.


----------



## Poetik

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Farther, actually - it is being buried in my desk under the growing pile of review samples. The upside is that some of those samples are now finished and will never be listened to again.


 


 NooOoooOoo, let it take precedence!!! It is the benchmark amongst all benchmarks that these iem's should be benchmarked against.
   
  Lol I'm sure you'll get to it eventually, you got a ton on your plate man.


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> ib1dance said:
> ...


 


  Ok thanks . What I.E.M that you have heard,would you say is similar to CK10, though with a more prominent bass ?.The stock ear tips were all too small for my ear canals .I've been using the Largest grey silicon tips that come with the westone 3's . They do give me a tight seal .I've never really had that same kind of seal with those foam like tips .


  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> @ib1dance
> 
> I fed them white noise over-night.
> 
> All of my recordings are lossless, and I 'm using the sony hybrid tips. The stock tips are more prone to sibilance.


 

 Have not found any sony hybrid tips available in the uk yet .


----------



## bowlofsoup

So, I just found a pair of Sony earbuds with the model name MDR-EX310LP. I was wondering if anyone had heard them yet as they seem to be a new model? Chances are that they are just re-shelled EX300's buds though


----------



## vinay2070

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> I am not a Monster fan but when you have something that well distributed and purchased by non enthusiasts, you will get more negative reviews as folks tend to write more often about dissatisfaction. More sold means more failed and I bet you read reviews about lack of bass from inexperienced users coming from buds and not getting a seal.  All I'm saying is that


 
   
  True, I still ordered the coppers


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ib1dance said:


> Ok thanks . What I.E.M that you have heard,would you say is similar to CK10, though with a more prominent bass ?.The stock ear tips were all too small for my ear canals .I've been using the Largest grey silicon tips that come with the westone 3's . They do give me a tight seal .I've never really had that same kind of seal with those foam like tips .


 

 FAD FI-BA-SS maybe but that's about it unless you're willing to give up some of that clarity, transparency, and imaging. If you are, the e-Q5 is a pretty good compromise.
   


  Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> So, I just found a pair of Sony earbuds with the model name MDR-EX310LP. I was wondering if anyone had heard them yet as they seem to be a new model? Chances are that they are just re-shelled EX300's buds though


 

 EX310 is indeed a newer model. I think it was released this past winter. Not sure how it is related to the EX300, which I do own. I'm not a fan of the build of the EX300 but the sound is pretty decent.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you are, the e-Q5 is a pretty good compromise.


 
   
  x2.  I was just going to say that as the EQ5 reminds me very much of the CK10/DBA-02 with the balance shifted just a tad from uber clarity and detail to fuller, more balanced bass.  I think all 3 are relatives somehow.  The question is will the EQ5 bass be enough for what he wants.  Only one way to find out.


----------



## xtremetechuk

I would consider changing the tips first, 

FYI I'm experiencing more sibilance with comply tips than the sony hybrid tips. 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120527078291&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT


----------



## chelle

m9 vs VS-R02 (visang)? 
   
  whats the difference between those two?
   
  Kinda don't like the looks of R02s, but they cost 25e (5e more than m9)....


----------



## xtremetechuk

I have just been listening to "Adagio For Strings" by DJ Tiesto, and I was simply blown away. I now understand why the CK10's are recommended for trance. Unfortunately they don't give the same wow factor for metal, what would you recommend purely for metal and rock? 

My hobbies are far too expensive.


----------



## vinay2070

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> My hobbies are far too expensive.


 


  Get into aero modelling, you shall know


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





chelle said:


> m9 vs VS-R02 (visang)?
> 
> whats the difference between those two?
> 
> Kinda don't like the looks of R02s, but they cost 25e (5e more than m9)....


 

 R02 is smoother, much more forward in the midrange, and much more refined overall. M9 has deeper and much more powerful bass, slightly recessed mids, and quite a bit more harshness in the treble. The Xears XB120 bullet is a bit of a compromise between the two in the same price tier.


  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> I have just been listening to "Adagio For Strings" by DJ Tiesto, and I was simply blown away. I now understand why the CK10's are recommended for trance. Unfortunately they don't give the same wow factor for metal, what would you recommend purely for metal and rock?
> 
> My hobbies are far too expensive.


 

 Something more dynamic, HA-FX700 or maybe the GR07 or Ortofon e-Q7. I think personal preferences matter more than genre selection anyway.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Get into aero modelling, you shall know


 

 Naah- drag racing/jet boats. Its not unusual to see a racer junk a 20-100K worth of bits in a single pass. Almost as silly as paying 14K for a phono cartridge


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> FAD FI-BA-SS maybe but that's about it unless you're willing to give up some of that clarity, transparency, and imaging. If you are, the e-Q5 is a pretty good compromise.


 

  
  Thanks for the help.The e-Q5 Looks good and at a OK price, though  I will also be using the I.E.M for running/dancing thus ideally would like a over the ears I.E.M .I wonder if the cables could be hooked over the ears and would the I.E.M then stay in place if your body was in Dynamic motion.
   
  I didn't  hear the CK10's as having a 100% clarity,transparency,and imaging throughout the spectrum . In the mid-highs they shone, though left the bass in the dark for some tracks of Dance Music .Anyway the ck10 have been a Good lesson in my search for a more detailed and less bass heavy I.E.M than the stunning westone 3 . Stunning as it's a High end I.E.M among many others including the CK10's .
   
   


  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> x2.  I was just going to say that as the EQ5 reminds me very much of the CK10/DBA-02 with the balance shifted just a tad from uber clarity and detail to fuller, more balanced bass.  I think all 3 are relatives somehow.  The question is will the EQ5 bass be enough for what he wants.  Only one way to find out.


 

 I'd certainly prefer to compromise a little mid-high clarity if that meant the I.E.M would have  more sub bass presence .
  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> I would consider changing the tips first,
> 
> FYI I'm experiencing more sibilance with comply tips than the sony hybrid tips.
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120527078291&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT


 

 I've decided the CK10's are not for me.Or to be more precise I can only really afford to buy one High end I.E.M so the CK10's will have to go .With the tips It depends on how much sibilance your hearing .There yours ears,only you know what you can hear .Is it a subtle amount that can be remedied by tips ?.


----------



## battleaxe

By any chance do you know how the CX380 compares to the CX300?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> By any chance do you know how the CX380 compares to the CX300?


 

 Not a clue.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Joker did you remember how the phonak audeo compares with q-jays?
  Also i read in many reviews of the cc51 including yours (i think) that you dont suggest them for people with small ear canals. I read in your review than it has a 5mm nozzle and brainwavz series 5.5mm which is very common for many especially dynamic drivers. If the cc51 has slightly smaller nozzle than a very comon nozzle size like the brainwavz M1's why you say it might be big for some?


----------



## james444

@ib1dance, the e-Q5 are less than ideal for running, I'd look into the GR10 or FI-BA-A1 instead. Very similar sound signature and much more secure over-ear fit.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Joker did you remember how the phonak audeo compares with q-jays?
> Also i read in many reviews of the cc51 including yours (i think) that you dont suggest them for people with small ear canals. I read in your review than it has a 5mm nozzle and brainwavz series 5.5mm which is very common for many especially dynamic drivers. If the cc51 has slightly smaller nozzle than a very comon nozzle size like the brainwavz M1's why you say it might be big for some?


 

 Q-Jays are much more dry and emphasize texture over liquidness/smoothness. I guess relative balance would depend on the filters used but with black filters the PFEs still lost out to the q-JAYS in bass presence. From memory I think the q-jays are also a bit more resolving and slightly warmer than PFE w/black filters.
   
  As for the CC51, unless MEElec has somehow managed to fit a 6mm driver in a 5mm chamber, that's a mistake on my part. Fixed it now - thanks.


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





james444 said:


> @ib1dance, the e-Q5 are less than ideal for running, I'd look into the GR10 or FI-BA-A1 instead. Very similar sound signature and much more secure over-ear fit.


 


  mmm...? Moving Armature & Balanced Armature . I've read that Moving Armature drivers can "move more air" thus the Grado GR10's may give me that sense of bass impact I require .
   
  I know it's not practical comparing a I.E.M to a full size headphone, but, essentially I'm  searching for  a I.E.M with  frequency characteristics and soundstage similar to the sennheiser HD25's .
   
  Maybe someone should lend joker some Grado GR10's 
   
  I've been reading a mixed bag of opinions on them .Some saying there audio perfection in a I.E.M some saying there  nothing special for the price.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Q-Jays are much more dry and emphasize texture over liquidness/smoothness. I guess relative balance would depend on the filters used but with black filters the PFEs still lost out to the q-JAYS in bass presence. From memory I think the q-jays are also a bit more resolving and slightly warmer than PFE w/black filters.
> 
> As for the CC51, unless MEElec has somehow managed to fit a 6mm driver in a 5mm chamber, that's a mistake on my part. Fixed it now - thanks.


 
   
  I see you are talking about the black filters so i guess that greens have even less bass. Thats not actually a problem. Well there is no problem. Just trying to figure out other sound signatures. Maybe the more smoothness of the Pfe will be something i will like.
   
  Anyway 6mm is not that big afterall. It must be close to the brainwavz i guess


----------



## rawrster

None of the MA based eaprhones I've heard are bass monsters by anyone's standards. They would be polite to many but what they do have is great texture, detail, decay and resolution in the bass and well in the midrange and treble as well.


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> None of the MA based eaprhones I've heard are bass monsters by anyone's standards. They would be polite to many but what they do have is great texture, detail, decay and resolution in the bass and well in the mid range and treble as well.


 


  Yes, BUT,.especially in Dance music, bass is what you feel .In your description of bass you missed out the main element that makes bass the energy it is.... conductive impact
   
  "Bass monsters" ? I simply want to feel the bass impact as nature intended and not merely monitor bass @ a energy level equal to the Tantalizing Treble.Bass is not equal to treble it yields far more energy . If you don't feel a drum  on a I.E.M how can it be said to be accurately reproducing a drums characteristics .westone 3's do produce that 'feel effect' ,though with a bloated 'boom' on the tail of the bass and with a less thrilling treble than that of the CK10's .
   
  When I say I want a good solid bass response, I certainly do not mean I want it at the cost of the mid-high regions.
   
  I want the frequencies to dance as they should.The bass has the Body and most mass ,the treble has the Highs which should never undermine the lows as the CK10 can do, and the mids..? well they just Glue it all together as it's all relative to the whole .
   
  If I  listen to music with some Standard Dynamic Driver full size headphones the bass ,drums etc have  impact as bass and drums naturally do . This impact was missing from the ck10's, and it was this lack of energy or movement in the lows that left some Dance tracks sounding like a symphony of snares and hi-hats   .
   
  Maybe moving Armature drivers can not deliver the needed energy in order to correctly produce the bass? .If not  I wonder if a Hybrid could be tuned in order for Different models of drivers to be able to provide that gap between a Dynamics bass energy and a Moving Armatures Precision .
   
  Quote:http://splurgebook.wordpress.com/2011/02/21/everything-you-need-to-know-about-iems/


> "Dynamic drivers are relatively uncommon in IEM’s (although are the staple driver type in ear-buds). Because they are able to move more air, bass reproduction is better than balanced armature drivers, however they cannot move as fast, meaning intricate details (including those within the bass range) may be lost."


 

 Could a 3 driver Hybrid I.E.M using a  Dynamic Driver for the Lows,Balanced driver for the Mids,Moving Armature for the Highs be physically feasible ?
   
   
  Quote: 





> None of the MA based eaprhones I've heard are bass monsters by anyone's standards. They would be polite to many


 
   
  So there isn't a Moving Armature I.E.M for Dance music then!  since the Bass in many Dance tracks is anything but "polite" .
   
  That would be a shame because I did love the speed of the CK10's .


----------



## lorafenik

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> I see you are talking about the black filters so i guess that greens have even less bass. Thats not actually a problem. Well there is no problem. Just trying to figure out other sound signatures. Maybe the more smoothness of the Pfe will be something i will like.
> 
> Anyway 6mm is not that big afterall. It must be close to the brainwavz i guess


 
   
  Green ones have more bass (sold with HP as "Audeo Perfect Bass", I'd say that they're quite on the bassy side). Gray filters have the most clinical sound.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not a clue.


 

 Thank you. I need a new pair of workout IEM so a new search starts. Out of all the models you have tested do you have a recommendations(I think you may have the record for most headphones reviewed)? The CX30-II worked alright in this respect but on some songs  dare I say I found it to be a bit bright and fatiguing, which isn't a good thing when working out. I would prefer the same SQ as the CX300 but with bit more balance, & instrument separation/sound stage.


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Thank you. I need a new pair of workout IEM so a new search starts. Out of all the models you have tested do you have a recommendations(I think you may have the record for most headphones reviewed)? The CX30-II worked alright in this respect but on some songs  dare I say I found it to be a bit bright and fatiguing, which isn't a good thing when working out. I would prefer the same SQ as the CX300 but with bit more balance, & instrument separation/sound stage.


 
   
  I use Shure's SE425 as my gym-phone. The fit is great (if you got the ears for it) and you won't have to worry about it fall off during a run (unlike the CX300). Considering the price though, maybe you should consider the SE215 instead? Those seems to be the FOTM at the moment.


----------



## estreeter

I tried dance music once, but realised that I really do prefer women.


----------



## Inks

Ib1dance, you should try the fx500s...


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> I tried dance music once, but realised that I really do prefer women.


 


 I used to listen to Rock music a lot , but realized I prefer a Diverse spectrum of people playing and dancing to Drums & percussion ( and sometimes Guitars too)  rather than usually just men playing with there Guitars 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Whats a Rock song without a Guitar ...?
   
  Whats a Dance song without Percussion...?  I'm just shopping for that I.E.M that can if called upon  Bang those Drums Hard whilst also  providing that sparkle in the treble with a balanced response of the Mids .
   
  Obviously if we could just have a listen to these I.E.M 's B4 we spent money on them we'd be making our choice's based on what sounds Good and moves us forward.
   
  Joker can I ask you just one more question?
   
  You have not mentioned the westone 4's . Though you place it quite high in your ranking with a sound score of  9.7 & the CK10's sound score is 9.6 .Since I already like the flavor of the westone 3's, though would like more detail and a tighter less bloated bass, don't you think westone 4's achieve this? . Or because they are Balanced Armatures do they lag behind in terms of a speedy response quite considerably to the ck10's? .


----------



## ib1dance

an they
  
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> @ib1dance, the e-Q5 are less than ideal for running, I'd look into the GR10 or FI-BA-A1 instead. Very similar sound signature and much more secure over-ear fit.


 

 The GR10;s and FI-BA-A1's are getting my interest, especially if they are sonically close to the CK10's, though with a more forward bass .But, only producing that Boom or sub bass if it's in the original recording .
   
  Seeking anybody's opinion,anybody whom owns the GR10's or and the FI-BA-A1's  and listens regularly to  Progressive House,prog trance,tribal etc.Can they provide the attack ,the kick of the drum? and the presence and depth of the bass?.
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Ib1dance, you should try the fx500s...


 
  I've read a few reviews stating that they are to coin someone Else's phrase "bass monsters" . I don't want any added colour to the bass . I don't want the I.E.M 's to give me a 'in a club' type sub bass .


----------



## Inks

They're not bass monster per say. They're not so big in the bass that it bleeds into the midrange, the mids actually stay quite clear and clean reminding me of BAs in this aspect. They make the HJE900s/MTPC seem a bit thick in comparison, in which themselves are somewhat controlled in the bass. The mids are laid back though, so that's something to consider.


----------



## ib1dance

Quote: 





inks said:


> They're not bass monster per say. They're not so big in the bass that it bleeds into the midrange, the mids actually stay quite clear and clean reminding me of BAs in this aspect. They make the HJE900s/MTPC seem a bit thick in comparison, in which themselves are somewhat controlled in the bass. The mids are laid back though, so that's something to consider.


 


  sound like a nice I.E.M . what about the High Freq .is it fast enough ?


----------



## Inks

It's fast for a dynamic, I don't think these could be called slow at all.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> I see you are talking about the black filters so i guess that greens have even less bass. Thats not actually a problem. Well there is no problem. Just trying to figure out other sound signatures. Maybe the more smoothness of the Pfe will be something i will like.
> Anyway 6mm is not that big afterall. It must be close to the brainwavz i guess


 

 I would guess the green filters have more bass since the PFEs are called 'Perfect Bass' when sold with the green filters.


  Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Thank you. I need a new pair of workout IEM so a new search starts. Out of all the models you have tested do you have a recommendations(I think you may have the record for most headphones reviewed)? The CX30-II worked alright in this respect but on some songs  dare I say I found it to be a bit bright and fatiguing, which isn't a good thing when working out. I would prefer the same SQ as the CX300 but with bit more balance, & instrument separation/sound stage.


 

 Not sure how much you're looking to spend but the Brainwavz earphones are generally pretty non-fatiguing. The Phiaton PS20 also, though it can't be worn over-the-ear without swapping channels.


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> I use Shure's SE425 as my gym-phone. The fit is great (if you got the ears for it) and you won't have to worry about it fall off during a run (unlike the CX300). Considering the price though, maybe you should consider the SE215 instead? Those seems to be the FOTM at the moment.


 
  Thank you I will check that out. 
  
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not sure how much you're looking to spend but the Brainwavz earphones are generally pretty non-fatiguing. The Phiaton PS20 also, though it can't be worn over-the-ear without swapping channels.


 

 I want to spend around $40 maybe $50. I will check those out also(if they are within budget maybe see if the local shop has them to try on). Thanks


----------



## Angelopsaro

Anyone knows if iems with mic have any effects on sound? I think some have issues, but meelectronics' series are trouble free?
  I am asking to know so i chose the "m what" offer with mic or not which is back by popular demand! wow!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Anyone knows if iems with mic have any effects on sound? I think some have issues, but meelectronics' series are trouble free?
> I am asking to know so i chose the "m what" offer with mic or not which is back by popular demand! wow!


 

 I don't really use headset mics since none of them are very good but the below post (from an M6 thread a few days ago) is something I wholeheartedly agree with:

  
  Quote: 





dbdynsty25 said:


> Anytime you're adding another piece of hardware (the mic/remote), you're going to be more prone to something failing on the headphones.  The sound is exactly the same, but you're just getting more functionality with the added downside of another part to break.  So it's all about choosing what is most important to you.


 
   
   
  Good deal by the way. From the photo looks like you're getting a CX21, CW31, M31, SP51, or CC51 for $20.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't really use headset mics since none of them are very good but the below post (from an M6 thread a few days ago) is something I wholeheartedly agree with:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Yeah his right! but if its something to break that would be the mic and not the iems. Well The truth is than i dont need them BUT.
  1. i wanted to buy  an iem with good mids according to your reviews so i can see if my q-jays are bothersome and decide if i will sell them before i start using them more.
   
  2. I love how cc51 looks and sound signature might what i am after. Maybe close to panasonic hje900?
   
  3. i wanted to try the meelectronics brand.
   
  You can easily see that i really cant miss here. B)


----------



## JxK

Joker, I've been thinking about what IEM to upgrade to for a bit after deciding the pr401 wasn't dynamic enough for me, at least at low volume. Anyway, I thought about getting the new atrios with the mg7 driver, but came to the conclusion that if I want a warmer and bassier sound, I always have my m50s at home.
   
  So I decided that for the sake of variety I'd get something with a different sound signature for use on the go (or at home when I'm not in the mood for the m50). As such, I've been leaning toward the phonak PFE's. I can get them from earphone solutions for $118. In your opinion, after two years, are the PFE still a good buy at said price point? Or is there something better out there now? I'll be using them out of my phone or my sansa clip unamped (though the new digizoid ZO is quite intriguing...).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Yeah his right! but if its something to break that would be the mic and not the iems. Well The truth is than i dont need them BUT.  1. i wanted to buy  an iem with good mids according to your reviews so i can see if my q-jays are bothersome and decide if i will sell them before i start using them more.
> 
> 2. I love how cc51 looks and sound signature might what i am after. Maybe close to panasonic hje900?


 

 Well if the mic unit causes issues in the cable there's a good chance it'll take an audio channel with it. Plus if the remote shorts that could lead to all sorts of issues. Every time you stick an extra solder point on something, you're adding a potential problem area.
   
  Oh and CC51 doesn't really sound a whole lot like the HJE900 except maybe in the midrange, which is slightly warm and quite detailed with good timbre on both.


  Quote: 





jxk said:


> Joker, I've been thinking about what IEM to upgrade to for a bit after deciding the pr401 wasn't dynamic enough for me, at least at low volume. Anyway, I thought about getting the new atrios with the mg7 driver, but came to the conclusion that if I want a warmer and bassier sound, I always have my m50s at home.
> 
> So I decided that for the sake of variety I'd get something with a different sound signature for use on the go (or at home when I'm not in the mood for the m50). As such, I've been leaning toward the phonak PFE's. I can get them from earphone solutions for $118. In your opinion, after two years, are the PFE still a good buy at said price point? Or is there something better out there now? I'll be using them out of my phone or my sansa clip unamped (though the new digizoid ZO is quite intriguing...).


 

 I have no idea what an MG7 Atrio sounds like. The PFE is still a solid earphone today I think, at least if you don't feel like splurging on a DBA-02 or GR07. The Ety HF5 would be the other solid single-BA earphone in that price category.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Beyerdynamic's DTX 71 iE & DTX 101 iE.


----------



## DannyBai

Joker, first of all, thank you for your reviews.  I've purchase several iem's based on yours and Cleos reviews.  Any chance you can tell me about the mmx 101's.  Can you tell me in your opinion what the sound difference might be and is it worth the higher price.  I know there aren't any reviews out there but just wanted your opinion.  Thanks.


----------



## scare

I've been curious about these Beyerdynamics, thanks for the reviews.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> Joker, first of all, thank you for your reviews.  I've purchase several iem's based on yours and Cleos reviews.  Any chance you can tell me about the mmx 101's.  Can you tell me in your opinion what the sound difference might be and is it worth the higher price.  I know there aren't any reviews out there but just wanted your opinion.  Thanks.


 

 The MMX 101 is just a DTX 101 with a mic & remote. If you look closely at the pic I used for the DTX 101, it is actually my MMX 101 with a 4-pole plug. I'll try to edit the reviews to make that a bit clearer.
   
   
  Quote: 





scare said:


> I've been curious about these Beyerdynamics, thanks for the reviews.


----------



## singha

Joker ,
  I noticed you have had the TF10 as a planned review for the past 5 months. I think many people would appreciate a review since they are so often referenced on the forums. Also, I am just very curious to see how it compares to the hundreds of IEM’s you have listened to. If it’s a matter of getting one, I would be happy to donate one cause I live in West LA also. I can steal one from my roommate who is a TF10 whore and has three of them.
   
  I also wanted to thank you for your effort and devotion to such a worthy cause. I am a medical student and have been studying 12 hours a day for the past few months and I have actually enjoyed the last few months because of this headphone hobby that I am now so deep into because of you. I just thought you well deserved and proper shoutout.


----------



## FlySweep

I'm curious.. just how much does the PR401 & HJE900 have in common?  Being a PR401 owner and reading some of these HJE reviews, it seems like they share quite a bit from a sound signature standpoint, no?


----------



## gtrsl

cant accept the result that DTX 101 just got 7.4 in your review. I've owned my DTX 100 for over a month, and I find out that DTX 100 is better than the X-cape v1 in every aspect except the price. I've been long waiting for the DTX101 score and expected a much higher score it would get.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





singha said:


> Joker ,
> I noticed you have had the TF10 as a planned review for the past 5 months. I think many people would appreciate a review since they are so often referenced on the forums. Also, I am just very curious to see how it compares to the hundreds of IEM’s you have listened to. If it’s a matter of getting one, I would be happy to donate one cause I live in West LA also. I can steal one from my roommate who is a TF10 whore and has three of them.
> 
> I also wanted to thank you for your effort and devotion to such a worthy cause. I am a medical student and have been studying 12 hours a day for the past few months and I have actually enjoyed the last few months because of this headphone hobby that I am now so deep into because of you. I just thought you well deserved and proper shoutout.


 

 Actually it's been on the list for a year or so. It's not a matter of getting one - I don't put anything on that list unless I own it or otherwise have access to it. 

  
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> I'm curious.. just how much does the PR401 & HJE900 have in common?  Being a PR401 owner and reading some of these HJE reviews, it seems like they share quite a bit from a sound signature standpoint, no?


 

 Yes. There was a post comparing the two a while back (not mine - I didn't own both at the same time). I will admit that the HJE900 has superior drivers but the tuning is not that different between the two.
  
  Quote: 





gtrsl said:


> cant accept the result that DTX 101 just got 7.4 in your review. I've owned my DTX 100 for over a month, and I find out that DTX 100 is better than the X-cape v1 in every aspect except the price. I've been long waiting for the DTX101 score and expected a much higher score it would get.


 
   
  In what way exactly is the DTX 101 better than the Xcape? My Xcape has better clarity, texture, microdetail, balance, dynamics, top-end extension, and separation than my DTX 101. The DTX 101 has way more bass and that's about it.


----------



## DannyBai

Thanks you!


----------



## kkl10

Great work ljokerl!
   
  Could you please help me on the following subject?
   
  I've had the RE0 IEMs for almost a year now and I like their sound very much, unfortunatelly it's right channel just died.
  So I'm starting to look for an IEM that serves as an upgrade on sonic resolution and with *a sound signature that strives for tonal balance and transparency/accuracy above everything*.
  Ultimately, I want the IEM that gives me the most real and natural sound possible.
   
  Budget: 200 - 250USD max (actually, I'm trying to not go above 150 - 170 USD, only if the sound quality is really worth it)
  It will be used amped and unamped for home and portable purposes.
  I'm a proponent of parametric equalization.
  I listen to every kind of music.
  (Let's try to forget my Bias with the RE0 sound shall we?)
   
  What I'm looking to right now:
   
  Fischer Audio DBA-02
  Hifiman RE-252
  Yuin OK1 (can find this one cheap near me)
  Etymotic HF5 (not sure if this one is worth of being included here)
  Etymotic ER4
  Vsonic GR07
   
  Which one of these choices do you find to be the most balanced and transparent one, if it is possible to be both thing at the same time?
  Or is there another option that you find to fit my goal for sound signature better than these ones?
  How would you compare this choices on sonic resolution/level of detail? Are there big differences or are all of them similar?
  Which one do you find to have the most natural presentaton or the best spacial resolution?
   
  I'm particularly interested on the GR07, so:
   
  On your GR07 review you say about the midrange:
  "_Texture levels are very good but, as is the case with almost all dynamics, the detailing is not very aggressive compared to higher-end BA-based monitors from Fischer, Etymotic, Audio-Technica, and the like._"
  With this sentence do you mean that the GR07 has less sonic or detail resolution than those BA monitors, or are you saying instead that those details are just presented in a less upfront (and maybe more realistic) manner?
   
  Is there any other sub-300USD IEM with a more realistic or accurate bass reproduction than the GR07?
  Do you find the GR07 to match the OK1 midrange transparency/resolution, or is it apples and oranges?
  Do you find the GR07 treble reminescent of the UM3X? D you find the GR07 to reproduce cymbals and drums well?
  Does the GR07 respond well to equalizaton?
   
  Sorry if I'm being to demanding... take your time.
  Thank you!


----------



## gtrsl

have your dtx been burned in to the best state? i experienced the period when my dtx got a excessive bass without good quality, a recessed mid and a slightly rolled-off treble. but now, after several times of comparison with the x-cape, my result is:
  bass: dtx100>>xcape (no doubt, absolutely. the dtx100s' bass is among the best in iems.)
  mid: dtx100>=xcape  (due to the lack of the bass of xcape, its mid is thin especially for male vocal, though not resessed.)
  treble: dtx100<xcape (dtx's highs are not shining caompared to xcape, but still above average.)
  most importantly, the whole sound of dtx is FULL, and is more funny, more versatile for various types of songs than xcape.
  i will give the dtx100 a score about 8.5 or above that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kkl10 said:


> Great work ljokerl!
> 
> Could you please help me on the following subject?
> 
> ...


   
  That's a very strong list. I really don't think anything in the price range could be added to it. The OK1 and RE252 pop out as two very natural-sounding in-ears that I couldn't live with for reasons independent of SQ. Really, they are all very neutral and balanced but you do miss out on things here and here. The OK1, for example, lacks some sub-bass and the HF5 isn't very 3-dimensional in presentation, at least not compared to something like the DBA-02.
   
  As for the GR07, its is mostly all there, though some of the BA-based IEMs such as the DBA-02 do perform a touch better. It is indeed not very upfront, which is what I was referencing with the line you quoted. The GR07 does not match the transparency or resolution of the OK1 but it's pretty close. The OK1 is really an excellent-sounding in-ear with a terrible form factor (when used as an in-ear). The treble on the GR07 is not as laid-back as that of the UM3X. Really very different treble presentations. I do think the GR07 can be equalized but I didn't think it necessary. mvw2 has my GR07 and he's a huge fan of the parametric EQ. Maybe he can lend some specific insight into that.
   

 Quote:


gtrsl said:


> have your dtx been burned in to the best state? i experienced the period when my dtx got a excessive bass without good quality, a recessed mid and a slightly rolled-off treble. but now, after several times of comparison with the x-cape, my result is:
> bass: dtx100>>xcape (no doubt, absolutely. the dtx100s' bass is among the best in iems.)
> mid: dtx100>=xcape  (due to the lack of the bass of xcape, its mid is thin especially for male vocal, though not resessed.)
> treble: dtx100<xcape (dtx's highs are not shining caompared to xcape, but still above average.)
> ...


 
 No... I decided to forgo my usual testing protocol and review the DTX 101 without burning it in. Also I had clogged sinuses and only used tracks encoded in 64kbps. 
   
  I think you are confusing quantity for quality. The 101 has more bass and more prominent mids than the Xcape. However, it sacrifices a lot of texture and resolution for that fullness of sound you are referring to. The bass is a bit boomy and really way stronger than I would want in the overall balance. It's not a problem with the DTX specifically - it's the 'consumer' sound that many earphones strive for. 'Fun' is not something I give points for.


----------



## Anaxilus

I agree w/ Joker as I had the DTX101 for a few weeks as well.  It was solid but it was no Xcape v.1.  I would have thought a score around 8.0 but Joker did readjust his scale upward by about .5 over the past half year or so.  It's even given my HD558 a run for it's money every now and again.  The v.1 never strikes me as bass light or thin and is always very balanced and refined and never boring.  Easily the best $70-$80 IEM I've had or heard so far.  If only the RE0 had the same balance then that superb treble detail would push it over.
   
  Might want to consider how signature preferences and gear synergy play out.


----------



## PWBone

Joker,
   
  Two questions, first i will thank you for your diligance, You have never lead me wrong,.
   
  1: Same as the quote, the triplefi10 is somewhat a benchmark for iems. It would help many, if you plublished your results. Don't worry about the backlash................
  2; With the added case and adapters of the RE-262, will you change the overall ratnking?
   
   
   


  
  Quote: 





singha said:


> Joker ,
> I noticed you have had the TF10 as a planned review for the past 5 months. I think many people would appreciate a review since they are so often referenced on the forums. Also, I am just very curious to see how it compares to the hundreds of IEM’s you have listened to. If it’s a matter of getting one, I would be happy to donate one cause I live in West LA also. I can steal one from my roommate who is a TF10 whore and has three of them.
> 
> I also wanted to thank you for your effort and devotion to such a worthy cause. I am a medical student and have been studying 12 hours a day for the past few months and I have actually enjoyed the last few months because of this headphone hobby that I am now so deep into because of you. I just thought you well deserved and proper shoutout.


----------



## gtrsl

> No... I decided to forgo my usual testing protocol and review the DTX 101 without burning it in. Also I had clogged sinuses and only used tracks encoded in 64kbps.
> 
> I think you are confusing quantity for quality. The 101 has more bass and more prominent mids than the Xcape. However, it sacrifices a lot of texture and resolution for that fullness of sound you are referring to. The bass is a bit boomy and really way stronger than I would want in the overall balance. It's not a problem with the DTX specifically - it's the 'consumer' sound that many earphones strive for. 'Fun' is not something I give points for.


 

 I don't think the dtx sacrifices a lot of texture. Overall balance, ye, that's what we hifiers are looking for, but you can't give it such a low score just because it's a bassheads' iem. BTW, the dtx is not that bass heavy or dark. I think you've got a prejudice: you don't like bass, so an iem with a heavy bass will never get a high score in this list even though the rest parts of it are greatI'm not here to devaluate your effort. But I'll appreciate it if you could consider the bassheads' taste.


----------



## james444

flysweep said:


> I'm curious.. just how much does the PR401 & HJE900 have in common?  Being a PR401 owner and reading some of these HJE reviews, it seems like they share quite a bit from a sound signature standpoint, no?




Heard both at a recent meet with dfkt and the HJE900 struck me as slightly more v-shaped, even with the foam-mod that brings the mids a bit forward. Apart from that the Pannys clearly outclassed the PR401s to my ears. As a former owner of the Cyclones PR1 and PR2 I had actually higher expectations regarding the PR401, but they're of course still good value for the price.


----------



## glac1er

Quote:


gtrsl said:


> I don't think the dtx sacrifices a lot of texture. Overall balance, ye, that's what we hifiers are looking for, but you can't give it such a low score just because it's a bassheads' iem. BTW, the dtx is not that bass heavy or dark. I think you've got a prejudice: you don't like bass, so an iem with a heavy bass will never get a high score in this list even though the rest parts of it are greatI'm not here to devaluate your effort. But I'll appreciate it if you could consider the bassheads' taste.


 

 HJE900 and IE8 got great score, and also Eterna and VB. Those are not the most balanced sounding IEMs but rather bassy. I hated HJE900 because it has too much upper bass.


----------



## kkl10

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's a very strong list. I really don't think anything in the price range could be added to it. The OK1 and RE252 pop out as two very natural-sounding in-ears that I couldn't live with for reasons independent of SQ. Really, they are all very neutral and balanced but you do miss out on things here and here. The OK1, for example, lacks some sub-bass and the HF5 isn't very 3-dimensional in presentation, at least not compared to something like the DBA-02.
> 
> As for the GR07, its is mostly all there, though some of the BA-based IEMs such as the DBA-02 do perform a touch better. It is indeed not very upfront, which is what I was referencing with the line you quoted. The GR07 does not match the transparency or resolution of the OK1 but it's pretty close. The OK1 is really an excellent-sounding in-ear with a terrible form factor (when used as an in-ear). The treble on the GR07 is not as laid-back as that of the UM3X. Really very different treble presentations. I do think the GR07 can be equalized but I didn't think it necessary. mvw2 has my GR07 and he's a huge fan of the parametric EQ. Maybe he can lend some specific insight into that.


 

 Apprecciate your answer!
   
  Just some more questions:
   
  Is the step up in sound quality from the RE0 to any of these higher IEMs bigger or smaller than the step up from a Etymotic MC5 to a RE0?
  What are the biggest sonic improvements that these IEMs provide over the RE0 or SW-Xcape?
   
  I'm not sure if you remember the OK1 sound well enough to answer the following questions, but anyway...
   
  When you say that the GR07 doesn't match the OK1 transparency and resolution, are you refering only to the midrange or to all the frequency spectrum?
  Do you think that the DBA-02 is able to match or surpass the transparency, resolution and spatial presentation of the OK1?
  How would you compare these two sound signatures? Which one of these two sounds the most real and natural to you?
  Is any of these higher IEMs able to match the RE-262 dynamic range effortlessness, besides the GR07?
   
  Final questions, hopefully:
  Which of these IEMs sound more similar to the AKG K601 and K701 and Beyerdynamic DT 880, respectivelly?
  Do you feel that these IEMs fall short  of the sound quality provided by these fullsized headphones on some way other than spatial resolution?
   
  Thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pwbone said:


> Joker,
> 
> Two questions, first i will thank you for your diligance, You have never lead me wrong,.
> 
> ...


 

 Backlash... haven't really considered that until now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.

 Also, got a link to info on the RE262 case/adapter? I've heard about an adapter but nothing about a case.


  Quote: 





gtrsl said:


> I don't think the dtx sacrifices a lot of texture. Overall balance, ye, that's what we hifiers are looking for, but you can't give it such a low score just because it's a bassheads' iem. BTW, the dtx is not that bass heavy or dark. I think you've got a prejudice: you don't like bass, so an iem with a heavy bass will never get a high score in this list even though the rest parts of it are greatI'm not here to devaluate your effort. But I'll appreciate it if you could consider the bassheads' taste.


 

 Yep, clearly I hate bass and the DTX's good-but-not-great score has absolutely nothing to do with how it compares to my similarly-priced Eterna/M2/CC51/Hippo 10/Xears TD-III. That's also why the Monster Gold/Copper/MD, Earsonics SM2, IE8, HJE900, Radius TWF11/W21, and JVC FX700 all rank merely as top-tier or near top-tier and not way above everything else as they clearly should be.


  Quote: 





glac1er said:


> HJE900 and IE8 got great score, and also Eterna and VB. Those are not the most balanced sounding IEMs but rather bassy. I hated HJE900 because it has too much upper bass.


 







  Quote: 





kkl10 said:


> Is the step up in sound quality from the RE0 to any of these higher IEMs bigger or smaller than the step up from a Etymotic MC5 to a RE0?
> What are the biggest sonic improvements that these IEMs provide over the RE0 or SW-Xcape?
> 
> I'm not sure if you remember the OK1 sound well enough to answer the following questions, but anyway...
> ...


 


 The MC5 is a hard one to talk about. It really doesn't do a whole lot wrong on a technical level but, as others have said, somehow manages to suck some of the life out of tracks. The RE0 doesn't do that which puts it a good step above in my book as an overall experience. I don't think I remember the OK1 well enough to answer all those specific questions but I do remember being amazed by its transparency ever time I'd use it. I don't really like to compare IEMs to full-size cans. K601, K701, and DT880 all happen to be well-balanced which can also be said for all of the earphones on your list. In general, I don't feel that IEMs sacrifice as much of the sound quality of full-size cans as most people say when you're looking at the same price point. My AKG rig (dac->heed canamp->akgs) really doesn't keep up with my 1964-T, which costs about the same, in speed, detail, or separation. The headphones do have an advantage in presentation and maybe realism of the way bass impact is conveyed (since the drivers can actually move air), as well as small individual things here and there (e.g. DT880 has better bottom-end extension than my 1964s and the K601 has a smoother, more fluid overall presentation) but generally I don't feel like I'm getting less sound quality for my money while out and about.


----------



## kkl10

Thank you!


----------



## Niyologist

Have these come out yet?
  Fischer Audio: TS-9005

   
  These look almost the same as the Meelectronics M11+.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Have these come out yet?
> Fischer Audio: TS-9005
> 
> 
> These look almost the same as the Meelectronics M11+.


 

 They probably use the same OEM MEElectronics does.


----------



## estreeter

262s just arrived - pretty obvious from my 3G Touch that they will need an amp, but thats OK - I have several for just such an occasion


----------



## PWBone

I just see so many appreciation threads, everyone wants to be part of a "team". I own the TF10, and have my own opinion, I bought them because I couldn't wait any longer for your review.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  The RE-262 packaging is a little assuming by me. In the review below there are pictures of what I believe is included, which I also received when I purchased in April at $149. I'm not on team RE-262, and I realize they are a  kind of boutique company, but this seamed to be the standard now.

http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/545548/living-with-the-hifiman-re-262
   
  per the website
   
  Accessories: four size flanges, balanced 4-pin mini (female) to regular mini (male) adapter, reversed phase (L/R) balanced 4-pin mini (female) to regular mini (male) adapter
  
   
  But again thanks, your reviews have help me tremendously
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Backlash... haven't really considered that until now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## estreeter

Its more a 'gang' than a 'team', and the first rule of our club is that you never talk about our club. Er. sorry - wrong forum - damn IE9 !


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> They probably use the same OEM MEElectronics does.


 

 The interesting question is, do they use the M11+ drivers, the old M11 drivers, or something else entirely?
   


  Quote: 





pwbone said:


> I just see so many appreciation threads, everyone wants to be part of a "team". I own the TF10, and have my own opinion, I bought them because I couldn't wait any longer for your review.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Good info, thanks. I'll try to remember to add it to the thread with the next update.


----------



## G4Oblivion

Few questions about MEElectronics M6 and Sony Hybrids:
   
  1) Do the hybrids solve or improve the sealing issues?
   
  2) Is the fit tight, loose or just right on the M6?
   
  3) Is there a comfort improvement over the stock tips?
   
  Going to order the M6 in a few days and plan on sticking with them for awhile, so I wanted to upgrade the tips.
   
  [EDIT]: Just to comfirm, these are the Hybrids, correct? http://www.amazon.com/Sony-EPEX10A-BLK-Replacement-Earbuds/dp/B001RB24UA/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1306146403&sr=1-1
   
  Thanks,
   Hunter


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





g4oblivion said:


> Few questions about MEElectronics M6 and Sony Hybrids:
> 
> 1) Do the hybrids solve or improve the sealing issues?
> 
> ...


 


  If you have sealing issues, Hybrids are worth trying. If there's not much improvement to be had, they won't do a whole lot for you. The fit on the M6 is tight - I've never had a problem with hybrids coming off. They a bit softer than stock tips (and come in 4 sizes instead of 3) so if you find stock single-flanges uncomfortable hybrids may help. EPEX10A is the right model number. I'd say try the stock tips first and if they're not doing it for you - get the hybrids.


----------



## cnhardwick

g4oblivion said:


> Few questions about MEElectronics M6 and Sony Hybrids:
> 
> 1) Do the hybrids solve or improve the sealing issues?
> 
> ...




1) In the end I suppose it is all subjective since we all different ears. I would say improvement in all likelihood though.

2) Just right, although tight enough they will not slip off.

3) Again, subjective to your ears, but the Hybrids have a reputation of being one of the most comfortable silicone tips on the market, so I guess yes.

Yes, that is them.


----------



## G4Oblivion

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you have sealing issues, Hybrids are worth trying. If there's not much improvement to be had, they won't do a whole lot for you. The fit on the M6 is tight - I've never had a problem with hybrids coming off. They a bit softer than stock tips (and come in 4 sizes instead of 3) so if you find stock single-flanges uncomfortable hybrids may help. EPEX10A is the right model number. I'd say try the stock tips first and if they're not doing it for you - get the hybrids.


 


   


  Quote: 





cnhardwick said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 



 Thank you both for the responses. I think I'll get both since amazon does free shipping on purchases $25 and over.
  More sizes to choose from and possible comfort improvement makes it worth trying, imo.


----------



## vinay2070

Guys, does turbine pro copper need an amp to shine? I read that it has a low impedance of 20 ohms.
  If it needs an amp, would a fiio e11 be good enough? source would be clip+


----------



## FlySweep

Got the J&R open box HJE-900 today.. popped 'em out of the case and everything (pouch, tips, instructions, etc.) looked to to be in "as new" condition except the box which was (obviously) repackaged.
   
  Right away, these are simply gorgeous headphones.. easily the most visually pleasing phones I own.. by far.  I was mesmerized by the shells which appear to change color in different light, the cable was fantastic too.. sturdy, no microphonics, and the brushed metal plugs looks classy and feel sturdy.  The fact the cable is detachable is pretty sweet too but I don't anticipate having to use this feature.. cool amenity nonetheless .  I don't mind the shorter length cord, I wear them over the ear and they look a bit awkward cause of the detachable cables that protrude out.. Frankly, I could care less how they appear to others though.  The tips that were on the phones fit perfectly in my ears which was really nice.. quite comfortable and decent isolation.
   
  A few brief notes about the sound.. I'm not sure if these were burned in extensively or what but they simply sounded fantastic to me in stock form.  I had absolutely no issues with the well-argued treble presentation.. not fatiguing to me in the least.. terrific sparkle and timbre.  I consider someone quite sensitive to sibilance and personally found none of it here.  I played it with a variety of genres and poor recordings and didn't find any issues at all aside from uncovering the artifacts in those bad recordings.  Bass goes deep and is well textured.  The claim that they're subwoofer like in volume and presentation is exaggerated.  The bass is certainly impressive but I don't consider their presentation to be akin to basshead phones in any way.  The midrange has very nice separation and timbre.  The midbass hump is well articulated and doesn't intrude on the (slightly recessed) midrange.. It warms up vocals a fair bit but keeps detail retrieval and balance quite well in the region.  I had to give rock a spin with these phones and the praise for their timbre with this genre is absolutely justified.
   
  The HJE-900 admittedly share quite a bit in terms of signature with the ECCI PR401.. another fantastic phone.  While the Panny's have a more aggressive overall presentation, the PR401 is softer.  I feel the HJE-900 is a clear step ahead of the ECCI phone from my brief listening and comparison of the two.  The HJE is simply more involving and I like how the midbass is tuned much better in the HJE than the PR401.  While the ECCI phone has a bigger soundstage, the HJE is no slouch and certainly fits my taste.  The HJE simply sounds like a maturation on the PR401 sound.. I'll write the rest of my thoughts on the HJE thread.. but the PR401 has clearly been dethroned.  It's still an awesome phone and a definite high VFM under $150.  But the Pannys trump them in virtually every area.
   
  For those who found the HJE a little too aggressive in presentation but didn't want an overly smooth version.. the PR401 awaits you.
   
  I can certainly understand the praise the HJE900 got when it was in the sub $150 market.. they're a bonafide STEAL at their original pricepoint  and I fell very lucky to have gotten them at ~$70.. these phones might be the highest VFM IEM in my collection (price to performance ratio).  Next time they drop to even 150, I would certainly recommend prospective buyers to step on their cat, push their wife out of the way, and run through a screen door to order them.  I would have no problem being stuck in the doghouse with these lovely buds.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Guys, does turbine pro copper need an amp to shine? I read that it has a low impedance of 20 ohms.
> If it needs an amp, would a fiio e11 be good enough? source would be clip+


 

 Need is a strong word.  They do like volume and gain for sure to sound best.  I do prefer a good amp to get the most out of them.  I just like having my detail and articulation well represented.  E11 should be fine. I am NOT a fan of Monster Pros or MDs from the Clip+.  Though some might prefer the more thin and lean signature w/ the Clip+ and their Monsters, who knows.


----------



## Inks

I think it sounds too dark and a bit sluggish on the clip+.


----------



## estreeter

Really enjoying the sound on my new RE262s, but what the hell is with the short cables ? Wear them over-the-ear and you feel like you have a chinstrap with the Y-cable sitting so high - I get annoyed with the ludicrously long cables on phones like the AD900, but they suddenly make sense next to the RE262's crazy short cabling. HiFiMan need to spend less on the 'display case' and more on the cabling 
   
  From a sonic POV, I can relate to impressions from Joker and others - its not hard to see why this earphone wouldnt make the purists happy. Whatever - the 262s like to party and so do I !


----------



## Inks

Hmm the cable length was fine in my experience, but you seem to be using the newer batch (mine was the pre-production batch). Perhaps there's a difference there, so it's short even with the extension plugs they provide?


----------



## vinay2070

Quote: 





inks said:


> I think it sounds too dark and a bit sluggish on the clip+.


 

 Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Need is a strong word.  They do like volume and gain for sure to sound best.  I do prefer a good amp to get the most out of them.  I just like having my detail and articulation well represented.  E11 should be fine. I am NOT a fan of Monster Pros or MDs from the Clip+.  Though some might prefer the more thin and lean signature w/ the Clip+ and their Monsters, who knows.


 

 Are there any chances of Coppers hissing when connected to an amp in general? as they are very low impedance.
   
  Thanks again for the replies.


----------



## JxK

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Quote:
> 
> Are there any chances of Coppers hissing when connected to an amp in general? as they are very low impedance.
> 
> Thanks again for the replies.


 
  No, if you're using a good and proper amp, they should not hiss. In fact, even before amplification, the primary purpose of an amp is to clean up the signal. That means it should clean up background hiss or bass rolloff with low impedance IEMs, fix the lack of volume or dynamics with overly high impedance IEMs, et cetera. Only after that comes the amplification. Now, whether your phones actually benefit to any degree from amplification is a different matter, not all do. But by all accounts the MTPC are among the IEMs that do benefit.


----------



## Inks

x2, JxK is spot on.


----------



## vinay2070

all i have is a 100 $ budget for the portable amp guys 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i dunno if these low budget ones can do all that.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> all i have is a 100 $ budget for the portable amp guys
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 You need to raise your question, as specifically as possible, in one of the Fiio E11 threads. I may not be buying into all the hype around this $60 amp, but its hard to ignore that price and I have been very happy with my E9. Just be very clear on what your expectations are - you might be better served by saving a few more dollars - either way, I havent heard the E11 (or the E7)


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





inks said:


> Hmm the cable length was fine in my experience, but you seem to be using the newer batch (mine was the pre-production batch). Perhaps there's a difference there, so it's short even with the extension plugs they provide?


 

 Yep - embarrassment at my end - I didnt realise that I needed to chain two of the adapters together to get a decent cable length. Still dont entirely get the 'balanced' thing, as all my sources/amps are single-ended, but I know that one of the adapters gives me sound in a single channel only, so I assume that was meant for a balanced source/amp ?


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Yep - embarrassment at my end - I didnt realise that I needed to chain two of the adapters together to get a decent cable length. Still dont entirely get the 'balanced' thing, as all my sources/amps are single-ended, but I know that one of the adapters gives me sound in a single channel only, so I assume that was meant for a balanced source/amp ?


 


  One of the adapters swaps channels and keeps it as a balanced plug layout, one of them swaps the channels and makes it a normal TRS plug and one of them simply turns it into a normal TRS plug.  Swapping the channels is for if you want to wear them over-the-ear.


----------



## FlySweep

BTW, the FA Silver Bullet tip set fit the HJE900 PERFECTLY.  Much better quality than the stock tips that come with the Pannys and better isolation to boot.


----------



## Audiophile1811

ljokerl, what tips were used on the Turbine Pro Coppers? The ones in the image.
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





audiophile1811 said:


> ljokerl, what tips were used on the Turbine Pro Coppers? The ones in the image.
> Thanks


 


  MEElec "balanced" bi-flanges.


----------



## Audiophile1811

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> MEElec "balanced" bi-flanges.


 
   
  These?
 http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_M11_Earphones_p/tipset10-m11+bk-mee.htm  -  or which of these
  http://www.meelec.com/category_s/299.htm?searching=Y&sort=5&cat=299&show=400&page=1
  Thanks


----------



## cnhardwick

audiophile1811 said:


> Quote:
> 
> These?
> http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_M11_Earphones_p/tipset10-m11+bk-mee.htm  -  or which of these
> ...




These I think.


----------



## Inks

cnhardwick is right but all the Meelec double flanges work fairly well. I personally like the RE/Hifiman double flanges because they seem to balance the sound even more for me.


----------



## kanuka

hey people i've found this site which sells the yuiin ok1 at 90 euro + shipping
   
  http://www.zococity.es/product.aspx?p=116&t=14&c=65&af=0000000006&utm_source=kelkooes&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=kelkooclick&utm_term=YUIN+Yuin+OK1&from=kelkooes
   
  though they dont ship everywhere and im not sure its updated but it's worth they try


----------



## ljokerl

Added Etymotic HF5 review w/ notes on the ACS Custom Eartips.


----------



## Ikarios

And the $100-150 market heats up yet again... the HF5 looks fantastic. I'm a little surprised you don't mention the ER-4P/S in the review at all - I suppose you don't have a set handy to compare to?
   
  How does the HF5 bass compare in quantity to similar analytical earphones like the DBA02, CK10, and ER4P? I really like the Etymotic mid/treble presentation but the soundstage and lack of bass quantity and deep insertion kind of put me off from Etys. Looks like that hasn't changed, but the smartphone controls and the price are tempting...


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

hi joker,
  mind detailing me how the ts-02 compares with rain?
  thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> And the $100-150 market heats up yet again... the HF5 looks fantastic. I'm a little surprised you don't mention the ER-4P/S in the review at all - I suppose you don't have a set handy to compare to?
> 
> How does the HF5 bass compare in quantity to similar analytical earphones like the DBA02, CK10, and ER4P? I really like the Etymotic mid/treble presentation but the soundstage and lack of bass quantity and deep insertion kind of put me off from Etys. Looks like that hasn't changed, but the smartphone controls and the price are tempting...


 

 I've never heard the ER4P and I don't have my ER4S any more. The bass of the HF5 is not as extended as the CK10 and lacks some of the fullness and depth. CK10 is no bass monster of course but the HF5 is leaner still. In terms of balance, with a very good seal I find the HF5 bass slightly de-emphasized in the spectrum but pretty close to flat. 
   
   
  Quote: 





daemontentacle said:


> hi joker,
> mind detailing me how the ts-02 compares with rain?
> thanks in advance.


 


  TS-02 is quite bassy in comparison to the rain. Think Senn IE7 vs Senn IE8 level of difference. All of the other differences stem from that - the TS02 is warmer, thicker, and fuller while the Rain is crisper, more sparkly, more airy.


----------



## jjmai

How come the latter half of the HF5 +ACS review becomes HF3?
  And is it possible to fit the HF5's ACS onto other brands of IEMs?  I wonder if Altec im616/717 fits...


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> How come the latter half of the HF5 +ACS review becomes HF3?


 

 Same earphone, just the HF5 doesn't have controls and the HF2/HF3 do. I'm assuming Joker labeled the section as the HF5, since it's more popular and universal, but he himself owns an HF3 as his review unit. I guess he just slipped up, you'll notice he makes references to the HF2, HF3, and HF5 in his other reviews.
   
  While we're talking about "mistakes"... the Phonak PFE122 is still missing a picture


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> How come the latter half of the HF5 +ACS review becomes HF3?
> And is it possible to fit the HF5's ACS onto other brands of IEMs?  I wonder if Altec im616/717 fits...


 

 I wrote it as an HF3 review originally. Was in a hurry when posting so I guess I missed a bunch when changing it to HF5.
   
  HF-series ACS tips are said to fit on the ER4 earphones but nothing else is listed. Didn't fit on my MC5 very well.
   


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Same earphone, just the HF5 doesn't have controls and the HF2/HF3 do. I'm assuming Joker labeled the section as the HF5, since it's more popular and universal, but he himself owns an HF3 as his review unit. I guess he just slipped up, you'll notice he makes references to the HF2, HF3, and HF5 in his other reviews.
> 
> While we're talking about "mistakes"... the Phonak PFE122 is still missing a picture


 

 Kept forgetting to add the PFE pic and now there's a chance I'll get to test the Phonak PB and take a new one.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

hmm..
  what about frequency extension at the bass level?
  quantity aside, do both of them have similar reach down below?


----------



## KoldKore

I just want to say thank you for this amazing guide. It is, hands down, the best I've come across.
   
  I'm also very psyched to see what you have to say about the upcoming Logitech/Ultimate Ears reviews.
   
  Lastly, I've tried upgrading my M6s to the S4 and they sounded like **** in my opinion. Then I tried the 700X and they're far too uncomfortable and fatiguing to my smaller ears. I keep going back to my M6s, but i hate the over the hear design. I'm thinking the UE 700s will do the trick.. hoping.
   
  I also want to point out your accuracy in these reviews. After using all three I have listed, I can confirm your opinions on all of them.


----------



## carfentanil

Thanks for the informative thread - to |joker| and all the contributors - among the most inviting on the forum for me. I'll be upgrading to the Sunrise Xcape, (but reviews have me leaning toward the "Impressive Edition" when(?) it becomes available.) I can drop $85 right away, but if cost is closer to $100+, I'll have to wait until July...

 This oughtta knock the socks off of my much-abused Sony EX300... More balance, more precision, and more physicality...


----------



## carfentanil

I have also read they need a burn-in to "snap" into the eventual sound signature... Will recreational listening be sufficient for the process (and if so, how long will this take?)


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Etymotic HF5 review w/ notes on the ACS Custom Eartips.


 


 And another fine interpretation. I think the highs fine if slightly elevated as they're not peaky. I actually prefer them to the 4p but I understand why the 4p has a higher sound rating. It is slightly more informative and deliniated but it's top is too much for me. Others will feel different.


----------



## Niyologist

My friends are starting to take a liking of this thread ljokerl. They find it Extremely Useful.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> Thanks for the informative thread - to |joker| and all the contributors - among the most inviting on the forum for me. I'll be upgrading to the Sunrise Xcape, (but reviews have me leaning toward the "Impressive Edition" when(?) it becomes available.) I can drop $85 right away, but if cost is closer to $100+, I'll have to wait until July...
> 
> This oughtta knock the socks off of my much-abused Sony EX300... More balance, more precision, and more physicality...


 

  
  There are two versions of the Xcape.. the old one and the newer V2 one.. its the older one that got so many rave reviews, the second one has a pretty different sound signature. The impressive edition is out (mostly) and so far a lot of people are reporting issues with them failing. 
   
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> I have also read they need a burn-in to "snap" into the eventual sound signature... Will recreational listening be sufficient for the process (and if so, how long will this take?)


 


   
  Yes, recreational listening would be sufficient.. They recommend like 100 hours I believe, but someone might correct me there.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daemontentacle said:


> hmm..
> what about frequency extension at the bass level?
> quantity aside, do both of them have similar reach down below?


 

 The TS02 might have a bit more just because of the greater bass quantity.

  
  Quote: 





koldkore said:


> I just want to say thank you for this amazing guide. It is, hands down, the best I've come across.
> 
> I'm also very psyched to see what you have to say about the upcoming Logitech/Ultimate Ears reviews.
> 
> ...


 

 'Upcoming' is a very flexible word but I'm glad you've found the thread useful. The UE700 sounds nothing like the M6, S4, or NE-700X but it's a good earphone now that logitech has lowered the MSRP to <$150.
   


  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> Thanks for the informative thread - to |joker| and all the contributors - among the most inviting on the forum for me. I'll be upgrading to the Sunrise Xcape, (but reviews have me leaning toward the "Impressive Edition" when(?) it becomes available.) I can drop $85 right away, but if cost is closer to $100+, I'll have to wait until July...
> 
> This oughtta knock the socks off of my much-abused Sony EX300... More balance, more precision, and more physicality...


 

 You've probably been reading about the old Xcape, which you can no longer buy anyway. In the near future your options will be the Impressive Edition and the Xcited, which are different from each other and from the original Xcape.


  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> I have also read they need a burn-in to "snap" into the eventual sound signature... Will recreational listening be sufficient for the process (and if so, how long will this take?)


 

 Sunrise recommends 200 hrs for the Xcape IE and 100 for the Xcited.
   


  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> And another fine interpretation. I think the highs fine if slightly elevated as they're not peaky. I actually prefer them to the 4p but I understand why the 4p has a higher sound rating. It is slightly more informative and deliniated but it's top is too much for me. Others will feel different.


 

 I've never actually heard the ER-4P.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> My friends are starting to take a liking of this thread ljokerl. They find it Extremely Useful.


 

 Good to know.


----------



## goodvibes

Oops. I see its the 4s you rated. I never heard that one but understand that they're smoother than the P so my comment was NA.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> And another fine interpretation. I think the highs fine if slightly elevated as they're not peaky. I actually prefer them to the 4p but I understand why the 4p has a higher sound rating. It is slightly more informative and deliniated but it's top is too much for me. Others will feel different.


 

 I don't, you're spot on.


----------



## scare

Joker, how would would you characterize the response of your HF5 to amping by something like your iBasso T4? Is there any marked improvement when the source is your Fuze?


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





scare said:


> Joker, how would would you characterize the response of your HF5 to amping by something like your iBasso T4? Is there any marked improvement when the source is your Fuze?


 


  I've heard good things. Not literally myself  but I've heard that they respond to a bass boost well.


----------



## Majin

Why is the Kozee X1 ranked higher then the Vsonic GR07? Care to give a little comparison?


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





majin said:


> Why is the Kozee X1 ranked higher then the Vsonic GR07? Care to give a little comparison?


 

 It's ranked higher because it's average score is higher than the Vsonics.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scare said:


> Joker, how would would you characterize the response of your HF5 to amping by something like your iBasso T4? Is there any marked improvement when the source is your Fuze?


 

 I don't use the fuze a whole lot for testing or even listening - the J3 gets most of my portable listening time and of course the iBasso D10 is what I use for the majority of critical listening. The HF5 doesn't benefit a whole lot from amping with the J3 and the HF5 is actually less eq-friendly than the MC5. It's not a very sensitive earphone but I think it works well for portable use. Also, the T4 is not exactly neutral-sounding so it's hard to say whether it's the extra driving power that's responsible for the changes or the warm signature of the T4 itself.

  
  Quote: 





majin said:


> Why is the Kozee X1 ranked higher then the Vsonic GR07? Care to give a little comparison?


 

 The table is sorted by average score first, then by price, then by SQ score. The X1 is much thinner-sounding and more transparent than the GR07. It has less bass impact and less reach. In general the X1 is pretty dry and a little clinical-sounding. There's not many customs in its price range so I guess it's hard to compare it to anything but I think my HF5, for example, is the better-performing single armature in several respects.


----------



## Niyologist

Sigh......I can't wait until the Sennheiser IE9 comes out.
   
  Frequency response: 10 to 24000 Hz
 Impedance: 16 Ohms
 Sensitivity: 127 db
 Attenuation: 26 db (95%)
 Connector: 3.5 mm
 System: dynamic dual driver
   
  Sigh....Good stats here.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Sigh......I can't wait until the Sennheiser IE9 comes out.
> 
> Frequency response: 10 to 24000 Hz
> Impedance: 16 Ohms
> ...


 


  Stats don't mean anything next to actually listening to them!  Or at least some good, solid graphs.  It's interesting they'll be making a dual dynamic though.  Not many of those out there yet.


----------



## Anaxilus

Oh great, another dual driver dynamic.  Can't wait to see Senns 'special' pricing for that.  I'm assuming another poor fitting 'discus' design.  I'd love to see them manage -26dB w/ a discus design and I would be shocked if the large bass driver isn't vented.  Call me skeptical.


----------



## Poetik

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Oh great, another dual driver dynamic.  Can't wait to see Senns 'special' pricing for that.  I'm assuming another poor fitting 'discus' design.  I'd love to see them manage -26dB w/ a discus design and I would be shocked if the large bass driver isn't vented.  Call me skeptical.


 


  Do the senns not fit in your ear properly? They've been one of the most comfortable IEM's I've used so far.  The CK10 is definitely up there too.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





poetik said:


> Do the senns not fit in your ear properly? They've been one of the most comfortable IEM's I've used so far.  The CK10 is definitely up there too.


 

 Nobody mentioned IE8s or CK10s so I'm not sure what you are getting at actually.  CK10 is a dual driver balanced armature, not dynamic.  IE9 is not out yet....


----------



## UserFriendly

You spelt Research wrong.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





poetik said:


> Do the senns not fit in your ear properly? They've been one of the most comfortable IEM's I've used so far.  The CK10 is definitely up there too.


 

 I think Anaxilus was referring to the Radius dual-drivers.
   


  Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> You spelt Research wrong.


 

 Typo - fixed - thanks.


----------



## FlySweep

userfriendly said:


> You *spelt* Research wrong.


 

 This was tongue in cheek, right?


----------



## UserFriendly

No actually, I'm Australian, so we follow British English, so it's spelt, not spelled.
  
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> This was tongue in cheek, right?


----------



## FlySweep

userfriendly said:


> No actually, I'm Australian, so we follow British English, so it's spelt, not spelled.


 

 Noted! See.. I learn something here everyday..


----------



## Phantompain

I just purchased the Westone 2 earphones upon reading this extremely helpful thread and researching around here I was just wondering after 3-4 days of use that they sound brilliant on certain songs but they sound muffled on other tracks. ( Possibly due to wrong eartips? )
   
  Im using the large Shure soft grey flex tips and was wondering if it would be recommended to purchase a relatively cheap amp for my earphones to improve the sound quality ( My source is a 2G ipod touch ) Take it easy on me as Im new here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  I was thinking of the Fiio e11, just wanted to here some opinions on this thanks again in advance


----------



## b0ck3n

I wouldn't exclude the possibility that some tracks sound muffled because they were recorded that way, and you're only just realizing it because you haven't heard them through very revealing headphones before.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





b0ck3n said:


> I wouldn't exclude the possibility that some tracks sound muffled because they were recorded that way, and you're only just realizing it because you haven't heard them through very revealing headphones before.


 


  may very well be just this.


----------



## LooptroopRocker

Thanks for the Beyerdynamic review Joker! I am however torn between the two models. I like that the DTX 71 has forward midrange but I do prefer the isolation the DTX 101 seems to offer. Which sacrifice is smaller? (midrange forwardness from 71 to 101 or isolation from 101 to 71?) Thanks!!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Oh great, another dual driver dynamic.  Can't wait to see Senns 'special' pricing for that.  I'm assuming another poor fitting 'discus' design.  I'd love to see them manage -26dB w/ a discus design and I would be shocked if the large bass driver isn't vented.  Call me skeptical.


 


        This is Sennheiser we're talking about. They'll find some way. Maybe I'll come up with a few designs myself and post the designs here.


----------



## Phantompain

Quote: 





b0ck3n said:


> I wouldn't exclude the possibility that some tracks sound muffled because they were recorded that way, and you're only just realizing it because you haven't heard them through very revealing headphones before.


 
   
  Hmm that could well be the case, however Its just that the vocals seem very far off? I don't know how to put it exactly. And It just seems to me despite being of the same file format and bitrate some songs sound crystal clear while others sound far-off and rather muffled. You maybe right though it could be my ears and brain adjusting to the sound of such earphones or the problem with the recording


----------



## vcjha

I tried posting this in a separate thread but nobody replied so I'm going to post it here and hopefully I will get a reply in time so I can finalize a decision on my next pair of earphones.
   
  "There are many out there who claim that analytical earphones are antithetical to music enjoyment – that they cause the listener to hear the earphones and not the music." That was one of your statements in a IEM review.  As you can tell, I've definitely graduated from wanting good thumping punchy bass to finally being a little bit disappointed if the bass overpowers the other frequencies even slightly.  But that statement revealed  what I wanted and it is exactly what I'm going for.  Here's an elaboration made by markl, a fellow head-fi poster: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/203957/rudistor-rpx-33-dualmono-mark-ii-impressions-and-review-with-pics.  If you don't want to bother reading it, the key characteristics I'm looking for are in these little passages:
  "Hefty SLAM and grinding, pounding, full bass. TIGHT, TIGHT, TIGHT bass. This amp has a rock-hard GRIP on the sound." 
  "ORGANIC and NATURAL sound. It sounds just like life. This amp is anything but "THIN", reedy, spindly, or anemic. It's FULL, ROBUST and COMPLETE." 
  "Deep, wet, and liquid sound. This is the antithesis of dry, digital, arid, analytical sound."  The second statement may make you and some people who cherish analytical headphones a little uneasy but it's the sound I'm after.  I wouldn't mind a reply from you, joker, or anyone else who loves this kind of sound, for that matter.  Frankly, I think you probably wouldn't give a recommendation on something you're not familiar with, but I'm sure some of your subscribers can help me out. 
   
  With that said, can someone give me the absolute IEM's money can buy that offer that kind of sound, a pair of IEM's that produce that kind of sound at $200 or less, and finally a pair of headphones with the same sound but at $100 or less?  And I do also have to state that I would like to use these IEM's without an amp as I'm probably using a good amount of my savings for the IEM's.  Thanks to anyone who helps and I look forward to finalizing my decision and eventually finally listening through a pair of IEM's that are head-fi worthy.


----------



## kanuka

hey joker
  maybe people already asked this , if so then sorry for asking again
  anyway. i remember you said the W1 "shine"  with female vocals. in the review you mention the re0 and re-zero can compete well with the W1. but how are they compared in this , do they also shine? and what about the re262?
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> Thanks for the Beyerdynamic review Joker! I am however torn between the two models. I like that the DTX 71 has forward midrange but I do prefer the isolation the DTX 101 seems to offer. Which sacrifice is smaller? (midrange forwardness from 71 to 101 or isolation from 101 to 71?) Thanks!!


 

  The difference between the two stems more from the bass quantity of the DTX101 than the absolute position of the midrange. Really, both sacrifices are quite small but if you can handle the bass I'd go for the 101.

  
  Quote: 





phantompain said:


> Hmm that could well be the case, however Its just that the vocals seem very far off? I don't know how to put it exactly. And It just seems to me despite being of the same file format and bitrate some songs sound crystal clear while others sound far-off and rather muffled. You maybe right though it could be my ears and brain adjusting to the sound of such earphones or the problem with the recording


 

 Is the problem consistent between different recordings on a single album/master?
   


  Quote: 





vcjha said:


> I tried posting this in a separate thread but nobody replied so I'm going to post it here and hopefully I will get a reply in time so I can finalize a decision on my next pair of earphones.
> 
> "There are many out there who claim that analytical earphones are antithetical to music enjoyment – that they cause the listener to hear the earphones and not the music." That was one of your statements in a IEM review.  As you can tell, I've definitely graduated from wanting good thumping punchy bass to finally being a little bit disappointed if the bass overpowers the other frequencies even slightly.  But that statement revealed  what I wanted and it is exactly what I'm going for.  Here's an elaboration made by markl, a fellow head-fi poster: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/203957/rudistor-rpx-33-dualmono-mark-ii-impressions-and-review-with-pics.  If you don't want to bother reading it, the key characteristics I'm looking for are in these little passages:
> "Hefty SLAM and grinding, pounding, full bass. TIGHT, TIGHT, TIGHT bass. This amp has a rock-hard GRIP on the sound."
> ...


 

 Sounds like one of the Monster earphones (Gold or MD) or one of the Radius sets (DDM or W21). For headphones, maybe the sony XB700, Creative Aurvana Live!, or AKG K181 will deliver what you're after - definitely read some reviews, though, because only you know what you really want. I do think 'tight' bass and 'full' bass are slightly antithetical to each other. 
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker
> maybe people already asked this , if so then sorry for asking again
> anyway. i remember you said the W1 "shine"  with female vocals. in the review you mention the re0 and re-zero can compete well with the W1. but how are they compared in this , do they also shine? and what about the re262?
> thanks


 

 I think the RE-ZERO is a better earphone than the W1 all around. I really like the HiFiMan sets with all vocals, the RE-ZERO and RE262 especially. With the W1 it was more a matter of rendering vocals above its overall competency level.


----------



## kanuka

then the re262 is even better in that matter? but the 3 of them are dynamic, can they compete in detail with BAs ?


----------



## Phantompain

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The difference between the two stems more from the bass quantity of the DTX101 than the absolute position of the midrange. Really, both sacrifices are quite small but if you can handle the bass I'd go for the 101.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Their from different albums though I have a feeling it may be due to the recording as mentioned before. Hmmm i guess im not too used to the earphones yet I suppose. This thread has been a major help for me and I am sure many other people to making excellent purchase and enjoying music. Thanks for everything


----------



## vcjha

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The difference between the two stems more from the bass quantity of the DTX101 than the absolute position of the midrange. Really, both sacrifices are quite small but if you can handle the bass I'd go for the 101.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 



 Wow, never thought you would recommend a monster.  But you are right to say that full and tight are antithetical.  Would you say monster is tight or full?  I will definitely have to say tight is much more favorable to me now.  If not, please do recommend one that is tight with as close to that sound as it can get.  Thanks, and may your headphone collection be more plentiful.  I'm surprised you haven't reviewed some of the best yet.  I'm sure big sponsors such as jhaudio probably should know about your gigantic thread by now.  Oh, how awesome it would be to to see a review of the jh16pro from the great joker...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vcjha said:


> Wow, never thought you would recommend a monster.  But you are right to say that full and tight are antithetical.  Would you say monster is tight or full?  I will definitely have to say tight is much more favorable to me now.  If not, please do recommend one that is tight with as close to that sound as it can get.  Thanks, and may your headphone collection be more plentiful.  I'm surprised you haven't reviewed some of the best yet.  I'm sure big sponsors such as jhaudio probably should know about your gigantic thread by now.  Oh, how awesome it would be to to see a review of the jh16pro from the great joker...


 


  Monster is full, not to be confused with 'loose'. 'Tight' is often associated with more analytical sound but a bass-heavy earphone can still sound controlled (JVC FX700 and Hippo VB are great examples). I do like the Monster Turbine earphones - unlike the Beats series they have quite a lot going for them.
   
  JHAudio was not even interested in selling me a JH5 at a discount, which is why I ended up getting the 1964-T. And of course the community was nice enough to pitch in for a UM Miracle, which is coming up on the review queue.


----------



## kmhaynes

Quote:


scare said:


> Joker, how would would you characterize the response of your HF5 to amping by something like your iBasso T4? Is there any marked improvement when the source is your Fuze?


 

 OK, so I'm not Joker, but my portable rig for the 6 months has been Fuze + Rockbox -> T4 -> HF5.  The nice thing about the HF5 is that it can handle everything your amp can do for the source.  The T4 creates a bigger, fuller and cleaner sound from the Fuze that the HF5 can fully represent.  (My Alessandro MS-1i with the T4 just sounds louder than without the T4).  So I can't really say if the HF5 IMPROVES with amping, or if it can better handle what the source + amp give it.  Does that make sense?  I know I would much rather listen to my Fuze -> HF5 WITH the T4 than without!
   
  Just to try something different, I've just let go of my T4 and have ordered a SoundMagic A10 amp.  The T4 is certainly a clean amp, and I'm trying the A10 to see if it has a warmer sound to give the HF5 a bit more body and warmth (even tho Joker says the T4 is warm -- maybe he means with the bass boost on...).


----------



## vcjha

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Monster is full, not to be confused with 'loose'. 'Tight' is often associated with more analytical sound but a bass-heavy earphone can still sound controlled (JVC FX700 and Hippo VB are great examples). I do like the Monster Turbine earphones - unlike the Beats series they have quite a lot going for them.
> 
> JHAudio was not even interested in selling me a JH5 at a discount, which is why I ended up getting the 1964-T. And of course the community was nice enough to pitch in for a UM Miracle, which is coming up on the review queue.


 

  
  I guess we should already be happy that jhaudio is sponsoring this site.  UM?  I looked it up.  Hmm, seems to be on par with jhaudio, only a little bit more bold to display what they are about.  I look forward to hearing it and seeing if it tops 1964ears.  I'm a bit happy that you told me to go with monster as their availability is pretty widespread, making it convenient to pick up in the store.


----------



## Premonition

Hi joker, can u recommend me any mid-centric earphones? i enjoy forward mids that display intimacy in vocals and strings(violin) as forte. budget is flexible.  i have 1964-Q s which is a little too bassy for me (yes i regret), and someone else's reshelled UM3x which im considering to reshell . I've had the SM3 MTPC IE7 TF10 KC3.. Do you think the Radius TWF21 is a good option or should i go ahead and reshell UM3x? I'm on the verge of purchasing the TWF21 but theres nowhere i can audition it here in singapore


----------



## ljokerl

Added Xears XR120PRO II and Kozee E100.
   
   
  It seems that there is now a V2 Xears TD-III with cloth cables. Pricy at 80 EUR on the website but the old coupon code from the deal thread ("KLANGFUZZIS") brings the price down to 30. May also work on other Xears models.
   
    
  Quote:


premonition said:


> Hi joker, can u recommend me any mid-centric earphones? i enjoy forward mids that display intimacy in vocals and strings(violin) as forte. budget is flexible.  i have 1964-Q s which is a little too bassy for me (yes i regret), and someone else's reshelled UM3x which im considering to reshell . I've had the SM3 MTPC IE7 TF10 KC3.. Do you think the Radius TWF21 is a good option or should i go ahead and reshell UM3x? I'm on the verge of purchasing the TWF21 but theres nowhere i can audition it here in singapore


 


  I don't consider the TWF21 mid-centric. Low+mid-centric, maybe, but it definitely draws plenty of attention to the bottom end. Not sure how bassy the 1964-Q is but the TWF21 probably beats the MTPC in impact and reach. That said, if you didn't like the SM3 you may not like the UM3X either as they do share a few similarities. If I had to make a mid-centric earphone list the ATH-CK100 and both of the Ortofon models would be on it.


----------



## Poetik

Damn, the Kozee E100 is so good it almost rivals the top tier customs in both comfort and sound.  Definitely next on my "must have" list


----------



## Inks

poor Joker, don't worry the CKM99s would prove better with a similar design (not fair I know).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





poetik said:


> Damn, the Kozee E100 is so good it almost rivals the top tier customs in both comfort and sound.  Definitely next on my "must have" list


 

  It would have become the new thread benchmark but I seem to have accidentally dropped it in an outgoing package headed for a foreign country.
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> poor Joker, don't worry the CKM99s would prove better with a similar design (not fair I know).


 
   
  I would trust Audio-Technica not to put functional grilles on the wrong end of their IEMs


----------



## macrocheesium

I've been out of the IEM loop for quite a while, and although I prefer full sized cans I'm leaning towards getting IEMs again just for convenience. What would you recommend for a basshead (must be good controlled bass, not just quantity) that has clear mids and isn't too bright, but still has good extension in the highs? For reference, I have the Ultrasone HFI-580 and I think it's perfect besides being a little bit too bright.
   
  EDIT: I forgot, price range is $150 or less, and that's for the used price.


----------



## Premonition

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't consider the TWF21 mid-centric. Low+mid-centric, maybe, but it definitely draws plenty of attention to the bottom end. Not sure how bassy the 1964-Q is but the TWF21 probably beats the MTPC in impact and reach. That said, if you didn't like the SM3 you may not like the UM3X either as they do share a few similarities. If I had to make a mid-centric earphone list the ATH-CK100 and both of the Ortofon models would be on it.


 
  Oh, i thought the TWF11 was mid-centric when i briefly auditioned it and was really enchanted when i heard a violin song on it, i thought the TWF21 would be the same. Btw i loved the SM3, when i got it i never wore my UM2 ever again, and it was long before i wore the MTPCs again, must've been the magic of the soundstage. But anyway, how would you compare the highs of the SM3 vs TWF21? I found the SM3's to have extremely distant highs, which i wouldnt even notice of unless i tried. Thank you for the help!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> I've been out of the IEM loop for quite a while, and although I prefer full sized cans I'm leaning towards getting IEMs again just for convenience. What would you recommend for a basshead (must be good controlled bass, not just quantity) that has clear mids and isn't too bright, but still has good extension in the highs? For reference, I have the Ultrasone HFI-580 and I think it's perfect besides being a little bit too bright.
> 
> EDIT: I forgot, price range is $150 or less, and that's for the used price.


 

 I'm not sure what the HFI-580 sounds like. Good bass IEMs in that price range - Radius DDM, used MTPG, Senn IE6. Going down into the <$100 range there's the Beyer DTX101, Eterna, Xears TD-III, refurb Turbine, and NE-700X. All of these are neutral/leaning towards dark and have good clarity and decent treble presence in addition to heavy bass. 


  Quote: 





premonition said:


> Oh, i thought the TWF11 was mid-centric when i briefly auditioned it and was really enchanted when i heard a violin song on it, i thought the TWF21 would be the same. Btw i loved the SM3, when i got it i never wore my UM2 ever again, and it was long before i wore the MTPCs again, must've been the magic of the soundstage. But anyway, how would you compare the highs of the SM3 vs TWF21? I found the SM3's to have extremely distant highs, which i wouldnt even notice of unless i tried. Thank you for the help!


 

 The distant highs of the SM3 are relative and IMO seem that way mostly because of the forward and somewhat stuffy midrange. The TWF21 doesn't have that much midrange forwardness and the treble sounds more balanced. Doesn't quite have the extension of an SM3, though, and certainly not the detail.


----------



## Ikarios

Hey Joker, I hate to ask a question like this, but is there any ETA on the Shure reviews? I just got a pair of SE530s and while I like them, they're quite uncomfortable. I'd love to know how you describe the sound so I can reference your other reviews in order to see where to move next. I've been staying away from Westone and Earsonics multi-driver IEMs mostly due to their description of mid-centricness but I (mostly) like what I hear on the SE530, so if this is what midcentricity sounds like I can probably deal. Also, how large are the Westone and Earsonics multi-driver IEMs (UM3x, Westone 3, SM2/SM3) compared to the SE530? The Shures are very large and don't quite sit nicely in my ear. I'm also not sure if I'm using the smallest tips since I got mine secondhand and the smallest soft flex tips are irritating my canals (they look like they're small but they're probably mediums). Thanks!


----------



## Niyologist

That was HILARIOUS when you said "The horror!" for the Kozee E100!


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'm not sure what the HFI-580 sounds like. Good bass IEMs in that price range - Radius DDM, used MTPG, Senn IE6. Going down into the <$100 range there's the Beyer DTX101, Eterna, Xears TD-III, refurb Turbine, and NE-700X. All of these are neutral/leaning towards dark and have good clarity and decent treble presence in addition to heavy bass.


 


  The IE6 looks really nice. How good is the isolation on the 1-5 scale?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> The IE6 looks really nice. How good is the isolation on the 1-5 scale?


 

     Look at the Radius DDM and you got your answer.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> The IE6 looks really nice. How good is the isolation on the 1-5 scale?


 


 Better than expected for a vented dynamic. There's also Sen CT6 which is the same driver, but closed design - sacrificing a bit of soundstage for a bit better isolation.
  (but this model has a faux-chrome that wears off from what I hear)
   
  Short version: muffles all sound > 2kHz, 1.5/3 of my "sticking fingers in ears benchmark" (which is 3/3, there can be higher notes) isolation score.
  At the topmost end it's about -20 dB.


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote:


niyologist said:


> Look at the Radius DDM and you got your answer.


   

 Ouch. Looks like these won't be the ones.
   
   

  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> There's also Sen CT6 which is the same driver, but closed design - sacrificing a bit of soundstage for a bit better isolation.


 

   
  Oh yeah? Thanks, I'll check them out. I can do without soundstage in an IEM.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Hey Joker, I hate to ask a question like this, but is there any ETA on the Shure reviews? I just got a pair of SE530s and while I like them, they're quite uncomfortable. I'd love to know how you describe the sound so I can reference your other reviews in order to see where to move next. I've been staying away from Westone and Earsonics multi-driver IEMs mostly due to their description of mid-centricness but I (mostly) like what I hear on the SE530, so if this is what midcentricity sounds like I can probably deal. Also, how large are the Westone and Earsonics multi-driver IEMs (UM3x, Westone 3, SM2/SM3) compared to the SE530? The Shures are very large and don't quite sit nicely in my ear. I'm also not sure if I'm using the smallest tips since I got mine secondhand and the smallest soft flex tips are irritating my canals (they look like they're small but they're probably mediums). Thanks!


 

 I'll try to get them up next week. I actually found the SE530 very comfortable - more so than the W3/W4. If you have trouble with the shell size of the SE530, I would definitely stay away from those as well as from the v.1 SM3/SM2 and even UM3X. The W1/W2 are smaller than the SE530. 


  Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> The IE6 looks really nice. How good is the isolation on the 1-5 scale?


 

 Not great but a little better than the IE7/IE8. Probably 3/5.


----------



## Ikarios

I think I just have small ears - the mold of the SE530 doesn't quite conform to the shape of my pinna. The angle of my ear canal has a lot to do with it, since when the IEM is inserted the shell kind of "sticks out" a bit outwards. This is one reason why i like the GR07 so much. So you're saying the SM2/SM3/UM3X/Westone 3 are all about the same shell size? The Westone 3 looks a little thinner and sleeker so that may work out for me. The "bulb" of the SE530 starts to irritate my ears after a couple hours, and they're kind of heavy so that probably contributes. I'm also not sure about the tip size - how do the Shure small tips compare to tips of other companies, like the GR07, Phonak Audeo, etc? My ear canals are getting irritated which is a sign that the tips are too big.
   
  I wish I could find a picture comparing multi-driver IEMs side by side, but Google is coming up short re: SE530 vs W3. Oh well. It's too bad because I've been listening to the SE530 all day and they sound pretty damn good for the price I paid. I don't think they're worth the MSRP price or new price but used prices are low enough that the value proposition is pretty good nowadays.


----------



## desilver

look forward to reviewing the Audio-Technica CKM99 and Audio-Technica CKS90


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> I think I just have small ears - the mold of the SE530 doesn't quite conform to the shape of my pinna. The angle of my ear canal has a lot to do with it, since when the IEM is inserted the shell kind of "sticks out" a bit outwards. This is one reason why i like the GR07 so much. So you're saying the SM2/SM3/UM3X/Westone 3 are all about the same shell size? The Westone 3 looks a little thinner and sleeker so that may work out for me. The "bulb" of the SE530 starts to irritate my ears after a couple hours, and they're kind of heavy so that probably contributes. I'm also not sure about the tip size - how do the Shure small tips compare to tips of other companies, like the GR07, Phonak Audeo, etc? My ear canals are getting irritated which is a sign that the tips are too big.
> 
> I wish I could find a picture comparing multi-driver IEMs side by side, but Google is coming up short re: SE530 vs W3. Oh well. It's too bad because I've been listening to the SE530 all day and they sound pretty damn good for the price I paid. I don't think they're worth the MSRP price or new price but used prices are low enough that the value proposition is pretty good nowadays.


 

 The SE530 has the best combination of length vs thickness out of  the Westone/Earsonics v1 earphones for me. The W3 is definitely neither thinner nor sleeker than the SE530. Its housing is a little shorter, though. The SE535 is a little sleeker but it has other issues. There's a pic of the SE530 next to a UM3X in this thread, though it's not a very good one. Really, there's no way ahead of time to know whether one of the other ergo-monitors will fit you better but counting on them being much different in overall size is not a good idea.
   
  Shure small tips are actually pretty small but in your case it might be worth it to splurge for small olives. Sound-wise I really wasn't impressed with the SE530. I'd characterize it as great in the midrange, okay elsewhere, which is not really good enough by today's standards.


----------



## jzzb

Hey guys, do you know where we can purchase the Sunrise Audio SW-Xcape v1? I checked both lendmeurears and budgenaudio but had no luck as both sites are out of stock! I wouldn't mind settling in for the v2 aswell but where can we find authorised and legit resellers of this product? Can someone also tell me the difference b/n the newer and older one? Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


jzzb said:


> Hey guys, do you know where we can purchase the Sunrise Audio SW-Xcape v1? I checked both lendmeurears and budgenaudio but had no luck as both sites are out of stock! I wouldn't mind settling in for the v2 aswell but where can we find authorised and legit resellers of this product? Can someone also tell me the difference b/n the newer and older one? Thanks!


 

  You can't... the v1 has been discontinued. I haven't personally heard the v2 but it's supposed to be quite different. I think ClieOS reviewed it so just look for his Xcape v2 review thread. There are two new Sunrise products out as well - the Xcited and Xcape Impressive Edition. You can find my early thoughts on them in this thread (to be updated soon).


----------



## jzzb

Thanks joker, so where could I purchase them from? and would you say they are better overall in comparison to the v2's and 1's?
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> jzzb said:
> ...


----------



## kanuka

check clieos review of the new 2 verisions. i think he mentioned one of them is quite similar to the original v1


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jzzb said:


> Thanks joker, so where could I purchase them from? and would you say they are better overall in comparison to the v2's and 1's?


 

  I think they should be available from lendmeurears pretty soon. I don't think they are better than the V1s, just different. I posted my finalized review earlier today.


----------



## Niyologist

I've been doing frequency test and bass, midrange, and treble test on my SP51. It really works. The treble sounds slightly more extensive than before. The midrange sounds a bit more open. Finally, the bass is thumping and even slightly deeper than before. This was all done on the Enhanced Bass Port.


----------



## vcjha

Anybody on here who knows what "natural" sound is like, which is better suited for me: meelectronics m16, meelectronics m9, or maximo imetal?  Those are my three choices and they're pretty cheap on this website I checked I tried crossreferencing all the reviews but they just got me confused.


----------



## ljokerl

For those who are curious to play with the scores and ratings in the chart, carfentanil was nice enough to create an updated table with variable weighting. It can be downloaded here.

  
  Quote: 





vcjha said:


> Anybody on here who knows what "natural" sound is like, which is better suited for me: meelectronics m16, meelectronics m9, or maximo imetal?  Those are my three choices and they're pretty cheap on this website I checked I tried crossreferencing all the reviews but they just got me confused.


 

  Which iMetal? The iM-590 is way above the other two you've listed. If it's the 490 or 390, I'd go for the M9.


----------



## vcjha

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For those who are curious to play with the scores and ratings in the chart, carfentanil was nice enough to create an updated table with variable weighting. It can be downloaded here.
> 
> 
> 
> Which iMetal? The iM-590 is way above the other two you've listed. If it's the 490 or 390, I'd go for the M9.


 
  Yow that was fast.  Many thanks.  Yep, it's the 390.  m9 it is then.  FINALLY PURCHASING TIME!!


----------



## riffola

As someone who listens to rock (Collective Soul, Def Leppard, Bon Jovi, The Beatles, McCartney), pop (Tear for Fears, INXS, etc), some jazz, some classical, some Indian classical and some Indie, and loves finding minor details in the songs without it being muddied by faux bass & treble... and wants to use it with his iPhone 4, thus with a mic.
   
  Should I buy the Etymotic HR3 with it's 3 button remote with ACS custom tips, the Shure SE315 and get the 3 button remote cable, the UE Triple Fi 10 and get the 10vi cable from somewhere (no triple buttons here) or get something else?
   
  I use the mic a *lot*, at least 20 minutes a day, so I need a pair with a good mic. The Triple Fi's mic is apparently pretty lame. It's one of the reasons I original went with the ADDIEM.
   
  My current headphone/earphone selection is rather pathetic. ADDIEM for iPhone usage, Grado SR80 for in-home. I have a MEElectronics headphone with mic, which I dislike for their artificialness and I used to like my Nu NE7M before I lost them.


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For those who are curious to play with the scores and ratings in the chart, carfentanil was nice enough to create an updated table with variable weighting. It can be downloaded here.
> 
> 
> 
> Which iMetal? The iM-590 is way above the other two you've listed. If it's the 490 or 390, I'd go for the M9.


 
   +1 I'm a big fan on the 590's


----------



## noingwhat

Where can you get the Xears TD-III for *42€* (est. $60) from xears.com (MSRP: 42€)? I looked on their website and its 79.9 eur (~$115!)
   
  what happened?


----------



## esanthosh

It's the new TDIII v2 version with textile cable. But, the code KLANGFUZZIS still works and you can get it for €30 + shipping (€8). Interestingly, it says "Textile J-Cable" on the front page and "symmetric Y-cable" on the product page.
   
  The web site and eBay prices keep fluctuating between €20 and €90 all the time (depending on stock / demand-supply / Thomas' mood? - I have no idea).


----------



## jant71

There's a new XE200 as well. Having had the TD100 and CP100ip(same shape housing as XE200), I would go with the XE200 over the TDIII V2 myself.
  http://cgi.ebay.com/Xears-Experience-XE200PRO-Holz-Highend-Ear-Kopfhorer-/300562591910?pt=MP3_Player_Zubeh%C3%B6r&hash=item45faed30a6


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





riffola said:


> As someone who listens to rock (Collective Soul, Def Leppard, Bon Jovi, The Beatles, McCartney), pop (Tear for Fears, INXS, etc), some jazz, some classical, some Indian classical and some Indie, and loves finding minor details in the songs without it being muddied by faux bass & treble... and wants to use it with his iPhone 4, thus with a mic.
> 
> Should I buy the Etymotic HR3 with it's 3 button remote with ACS custom tips, the Shure SE315 and get the 3 button remote cable, the UE Triple Fi 10 and get the 10vi cable from somewhere (no triple buttons here) or get something else?
> 
> ...


 


  I've never heard the SE315 and the HF5 and TripleFis don't sound anything alike. If you like the ADDIEM I'd go with the Etys. The Ety mic is certainly very nice but I've not tried the UE mic. The only other higher-end headsets I can think of right now are the Senn IE8i (3-button), Nocs NS800 (3-button), Phonak Pfe (1-button) and Turbine Pro w/ controltalk (1-button), as well as all of the other Shures.


----------



## riffola

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've never heard the SE315 and the HF5 and TripleFis don't sound anything alike. If you like the ADDIEM I'd go with the Etys. The Ety mic is certainly very nice but I've not tried the UE mic. The only other higher-end headsets I can think of right now are the Senn IE8i (3-button), Nocs NS800 (3-button), Phonak Pfe (1-button) and Turbine Pro w/ controltalk (1-button), as well as all of the other Shures.


 
  Thanks for the suggestions and input, ljokerl! I think I'll go with the Etys. Probably spring for the ACS/Microsonic custom tips.


----------



## Shufny

Or the AKG K3003






 (it's still misplaced to the full-size forums)


----------



## usb7

I'm curious why |joker| hasn't reviewed any of the Shure IEMs.
  How high up would you guys think the Shure SE215 (and the SE315) would be on Comparisons by Numbers list?
   
  Higher than the MEElectronics A151?


----------



## GalmArn

Quote: 





usb7 said:


> I'm curious why |joker| hasn't reviewed any of the Shure IEMs.


 

 He is currently reviewing the SE530 and the SE535.
  But for the story, he didn't have a great experience when he first tested some Shure IEM and that's why he never bothered reviewing them without having the opportunity for it (probably someone lent him the 530 & 535).


----------



## 182751

Hey Joker,
  Would be VERY interested to see your review of the Miracles as I have just purchased a set of these myself, am just waiting on delivery.
  Also I'm sure someone else has already offered, but if you would like a set of UE Triple.Fi 10's to review, I can send you my ones once my UM's arrive if you like .


----------



## esanthosh

I think it's time for a FAQ in post #8
   
  Why no Shure reviews?
  When are you going to review TF10?
  When is UM Miracle review coming?
   
  .... and so on. A large part of the problem is not many can read all the 200+ pages to know that these have been answered already. If someone new starts following this thread much later, these questions bound to come up.
   
  @Acesi7,
   
  ljokerl owns TF10, but priority is given to manufacturer review samples and loaner pairs as a result of which, the IEMs he owns gets pushed down the order.


----------



## 182751

Ahh, Cheers esanthosh. I wasn't sure if he owned any or not, just noticed it was in the 'planned' section and figured he might not have them. Thanks for clarifying.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shufny said:


> Or the AKG K3003
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for the link. A top-tier IEM from AKG? A bit wary of that since they don't seem to have perfected the mid-range IEM yet.

  
  Quote: 





galmarn said:


> He is currently reviewing the SE530 and the SE535.
> But for the story, he didn't have a great experience when he first tested some Shure IEM and that's why he never bothered reviewing them without having the opportunity for it (probably someone lent him the 530 & 535).


 

 Thanks


  Quote: 





acesi7 said:


> Hey Joker,
> Would be VERY interested to see your review of the Miracles as I have just purchased a set of these myself, am just waiting on delivery.
> Also I'm sure someone else has already offered, but if you would like a set of UE Triple.Fi 10's to review, I can send you my ones once my UM's arrive if you like .


 

 Same story with the miracles as with the TF10 - they keep getting delayed until I finish all the reviews of loans and manufacturer samples. 
   
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> I think it's time for a FAQ in post #8
> 
> Why no Shure reviews?
> When are you going to review TF10?
> ...


 

 I could put the FAQ on the to-do list but then it will just keep getting put off 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'm sure the answers to all of the questions have been written out by myself and others; just a matter of finding them.


----------



## lazysleepyboi

hey ljokerl, I'm not sure if someone asked this, but how would you compare the Westone 4 to the 1964 triples? I am still thoroughly debating between the two. I have custom tips for my sennheiser ie8s, so I'm a bit used to the whole customs process, but how would you compare the two in terms of sound, isolation, cost to value ratio, etc. Also, which one would you recommend more. Again, i'm sorry if someone has asked this before.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lazysleepyboi said:


> hey ljokerl, I'm not sure if someone asked this, but how would you compare the Westone 4 to the 1964 triples? I am still thoroughly debating between the two. I have custom tips for my sennheiser ie8s, so I'm a bit used to the whole customs process, but how would you compare the two in terms of sound, isolation, cost to value ratio, etc. Also, which one would you recommend more. Again, i'm sorry if someone has asked this before.


 


  Noone has asked because that's what the sound, isolation, and value scores are for. They do have different signatures and I can't clearly recommend one of the other. The W4 is smoother, a bit thicker, more liquid-sounding. It covers the frequency spectrum a little better on the whole and has a more spacious soundstage. The 1964-T is faster, tighter, cleaner, and more accurate. Its midrange and treble are crisper and clearer and have more aggressive detailing without sounding overly analytical. Both earphones place a very realistic amount of weight on the notes, which is one of their big strengths compared to much of the competition.


----------



## kanuka

hey people.
  i'd never get this ones, but im just curious. has someone tried the skullcandy Asym? from what i heard they have bad isolation and SQ doesnt match the overp-price
   
  (yeah, sorry for mentioning Skullcandy in head-fi.org 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 )


----------



## lazysleepyboi

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Noone has asked because that's what the sound, isolation, and value scores are for. They do have different signatures and I can't clearly recommend one of the other. The W4 is smoother, a bit thicker, more liquid-sounding. It covers the frequency spectrum a little better on the whole and has a more spacious soundstage. The 1964-T is faster, tighter, cleaner, and more accurate. Its midrange and treble are crisper and clearer and have more aggressive detailing without sounding overly analytical. Both earphones place a very realistic amount of weight on the notes, which is one of their big strengths compared to much of the competition.


 

 I've been keeping up with this thread for a while, and it's always amazes me how long this thread has gotten along with how many IEMs you have reviewed. I believe that in your first post you said that the scores are not in relation to each other and that you were ranking them on how you felt during the time with them. Your answer to my dilemma is still kind of foggy because I have no idea which one i would prefer. If I were to get a 1964 custom IEM it would most likely be the quads, but the westone 4 seem very appealing also. Also given the fact that they're 200 dollars apart in terms of the 1964 needing impressions and mailing, I'm still not sure which one i would prefer. Only time will tell, but thanks joker for the insight. I'm sure my decision will be an impulsive buy


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





lazysleepyboi said:


> I've been keeping up with this thread for a while, and it's always amazes me how long this thread has gotten along with how many IEMs you have reviewed. I believe that in your first post you said that the scores are not in relation to each other and that you were ranking them on how you felt during the time with them. Your answer to my dilemma is still kind of foggy because I have no idea which one i would prefer. If I were to get a 1964 custom IEM it would most likely be the quads, but the westone 4 seem very appealing also. Also given the fact that they're 200 dollars apart in terms of the 1964 needing impressions and mailing, I'm still not sure which one i would prefer. Only time will tell, but thanks joker for the insight. I'm sure my decision will be an impulsive buy


 

 I don't see how he could give you any more info to go off of. It's all based on personal preference and what we hear ourselves at the end of the day. 
   
  Impulsive shopping is the best shopping.


----------



## tibble89

What is the general recommendation for gaming with the astro mixamp? I'm in UK so not everything is available but preferable under £50. Maybe get the MC5's as I'm not that bothered about mic.. Thanks for any info/help


----------



## chrislangley4253

Quote: 





tibble89 said:


> What is the general recommendation for gaming with the astro mixamp? I'm in UK so not everything is available but preferable under £50. Maybe get the MC5's as I'm not that bothered about mic.. Thanks for any info/help


 


  I don't think the MC5's would be very good for gaming. I own them and I certainly wouldn't use them for that. I stick to using them for mowing. Great isolation.. Kind of meh sound quality. Very sterile, with the mids very forward and the bass very light. Not much detail on the upper end either.


----------



## vinay2070

Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Joker, you need to review the CX55 from deal extreme - http://www.dealextreme.com/p/genuine-sennheiser-cx55-in-ear-stereo-earphone-with-carrying-bag-3-5mm-jack-120cm-cable-34760
> 
> 
> 
> I got the so called genuine version and they ROCK. Still at 30 hours of break in and the mids getting better, they sounded better than my friends old HD 201. For the 11.xx $ shipped price, they simply ROCK. They may actually land at a good "value" position on your list. My only complain is that the left ear piece is slightly(15%) louder than the right ones. I had ordered one more considering the price  Hope that ones fine and genuine too.






 Quote:



> There are no genuine Sennheiser product on dealextreme. This has been discussed out on the forum a dozen times (which is not to say that the fake ones don't sound good). Also, fake IE8s and my reasons for not reviewing any counterfeit items were discussed a couple of pages back in this thread.
> 
> A 15% channel imbalance would bother the crap out of me
> 
> ...


 


  Hi Guys, 
   
  Received my HD 595, fiio e11, turbine coppers, clip+ 8 gb today. The best IEM that I previously owned was the Senn CX55 from Dealextreme as mentioned above.
   
  There is no 15% channel imbalance in the cx55. I was using my old signal broken Sonyericsson k550i as media player, which was the culprit. Works well with clip+ 
   
  The HD595 are 8+hrs broken in, coppers 1 hour, and my old CX55 for 70 Hour.
   
  Makes no difference if I use the E11 with CX55 or coppers.
   
  Here is what I feel. Sound quality wise:
   
  HD595+ e11 > CX55 > Coppers. The Hd595 still lacks bass for my taste. should have gone for m50 I guess.
   
  The cx55 sound very full and warmer compared to the coppers.
   
  1) How  many hours burn in minimum required for coppers to sound better? Will there be any difference? I was infact shocked to hear them sound worser than my DE CX55, considering that I paid 20X more.
   
  2)Any good/best link for burn in process?
   
  3)My clip+ skips part of the tracks when I hold it in hand, It just squeks and skips whole tracks some time. But If I keep on table, it plays well. I have a silicone cover on it. Any static issues? I cant send it back though as I bot it in US, but dont stay in US.
   
   
  Thanks,
  Vinay


----------



## thatladude

Just wanted to thank the original poster (ljokerl) for this round up -- amazingly detailed and useful research and writing! 
   
I found the lowend IEM reviews very helpful -- the local discount retailer near me sells many of these and I do not want to throw down major cash for something that will break or get lost eventually.  
   
THANK YOU!


----------



## Niyologist

Sigh....another day with just my M9 and SP51. I need to build my collection. I guess the MTPG and Sennheiser IE8 is next on my list.


----------



## ljokerl

Shure SE530 and SE535 added. Planned review list updated.
   
  Quote: 





vinay2070 said:


> Received my HD 595, fiio e11, turbine coppers, clip+ 8 gb today. The best IEM that I previously owned was the Senn CX55 from Dealextreme as mentioned above.
> 
> There is no 15% channel imbalance in the cx55. I was using my old signal broken Sonyericsson k550i as media player, which was the culprit. Works well with clip+
> 
> ...


 

 See the head-fi burn-in FAQ for burn-in info. I suppose I should add a link to that in the OP at some point... on the to-do list it goes.
  SQ changes are best noted retrospectively. Put the CX55 aside for a week or two and just use the Coppers. You'll hear a larger difference when you switch back.


  Quote: 





thatladude said:


> Just wanted to thank the original poster (ljokerl) for this round up -- amazingly detailed and useful research and writing!
> 
> I found the lowend IEM reviews very helpful -- the local discount retailer near me sells many of these and I do not want to throw down major cash for something that will break or get lost eventually.
> 
> THANK YOU!


 

 Awesome - glad the thread was useful!
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Sigh....another day with just my M9 and SP51. I need to build my collection. I guess the MTPG and Sennheiser IE8 is next on my list.


 

 The SP51 is like 1.5 earphones in one


----------



## Inks

Nice reviews, sounds like a very good take on those Shures. Funny how bloated the FOTM was when the SE535s came out, but that luckily has calmed. 
   
  I take it you've already heard the EX1000s? What do you think of those so far (and CKM99s)? Currently using the EX600s and they are proving to have extremely good value in terms of SQ and build, though isolation and fit is only decent.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> Nice reviews, sounds like a very good take on those Shures. Funny how bloated the FOTM was when the SE535s came out, but that luckily has calmed.


 

  Well, remember the 535 has a very long lineage going back to the 500.  It's a very entrenched model much like the ER4.  If you like it you love it, otherwise.....


----------



## goodvibes

It was great that he had them side by side. I've heard both but not like that. Makes for a good contrasting perspective. They were actually quite good reviews so it's still a flavor thing. I've said it before, Joker seems able to set aside a sonic bias better than most. Even though I've moved from Shure, I'd personally rate them higher than some other more v shaped sigs due to my need of natural mids more than bandwidth but that's my bias. It's still horses for courses even at this level. I also didn't care as much for the new ergonomics of the 535 vs the 530 though it's fine overall. Great job and thanks, again.


----------



## Ikarios

Great review of the SE530, I pretty much agree with all the points. Your recent reviews of the GR07 and the SE530 have helped me get a better idea of where I need to look, even after trying out so many IEMs and reading the first post (yes, the entire thing - every single review...) who knows how many times over. Looks like I need a balanced and mid-centric sound, but with extended bass and highly detailed and crisp treble, and less "thickness", like how the CK10 presents its highs and mids, but not with its tonal balance. I'm not sure if at this point I can afford the IEMs that can actually match all of these qualities, if one even exists. The 1964T/Q look very interesting and will probably hit every one of my points but cost too much for me. This darn hobby!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Nice reviews, sounds like a very good take on those Shures. Funny how bloated the FOTM was when the SE535s came out, but that luckily has calmed.
> 
> I take it you've already heard the EX1000s? What do you think of those so far (and CKM99s)? Currently using the EX600s and they are proving to have extremely good value in terms of SQ and build, though isolation and fit is only decent.


 

 I think the EX1000 is much more neutral than the CKM99. The Audio-Technicas are a little bright, even for me. Maybe I need to find some foam tips. I agree on the build - EX1000 is quite good though the cable connectors are a bit unwieldy and the cables themselves are pretty thin. Isolation is fine - more than most of the other high-end dynamics. Fit is only so-so. Basically a straight-barrel with a vertical bulge. 

  
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> It was great that he had them side by side. I've heard both but not like that. Makes for a good contrasting perspective. They were actually quite good reviews so it's still a flavor thing. I've said it before, Joker seems able to set aside a sonic bias better than most. Even though I've moved from Shure, I'd personally rate them higher than some other more v shaped sigs due to my need of natural mids more than bandwidth but that's my bias. It's still horses for courses even at this level. I also didn't care as much for the new ergonomics of the 535 vs the 530 though it's fine overall. Great job and thanks, again.


 

 Thanks, the Shures were actually pretty challenging to review. They are not my signature but closer to it than the Earsonics sets. I just didn't feel that the performance was there, especially with the SE530.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Great review of the SE530, I pretty much agree with all the points. Your recent reviews of the GR07 and the SE530 have helped me get a better idea of where I need to look, even after trying out so many IEMs and reading the first post (yes, the entire thing - every single review...) who knows how many times over. Looks like I need a balanced and mid-centric sound, but with extended bass and highly detailed and crisp treble, and less "thickness", like how the CK10 presents its highs and mids, but not with its tonal balance. I'm not sure if at this point I can afford the IEMs that can actually match all of these qualities, if one even exists. The 1964T/Q look very interesting and will probably hit every one of my points but cost too much for me. This darn hobby!


 

  The whole thing? That's over 100,000 words. Your dedication is admirable. Oh and you'd probably like the e-Q5


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> The whole thing? That's over 100,000 words. Your dedication is admirable. Oh and you'd probably like the e-Q5


 

 Yeah, I spend far more time on Head-Fi than I'd like...
   
  I thought I would like the e-Q5 too, but I picked up the Grado GR8 and it's kind of peaky. I'm not sure if this is due to Grado's tuning (it probably is) but I've been reading the Grado models are like long-lost brothers to the Ortofon models. If I see a good price on the e-Q5 in the FS section I'll probably jump on it, but there haven't been too many. As it stands the GR07 and the SE530 both come very close to complete satisfaction, with a few flaws in both - the GR07 doesn't flaunt it's detail like Etymotic or the CK10 does, and the sibilance at higher volumes bothers me, while the SE530 is large, bulky, and uncomfortable, and also suffers from the same "too smooth/missing detail" syndrome (but is smoother overall and more balanced).
   
  The CK90Pro also seems interesting, and i've had my eye on it for a while, but the only ones I can find are imported from Japan and quite costly. If it turns out I don't like them I will probably end up losing quite a bit of money on them, and I don't like that at all.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Yeah, I spend far more time on Head-Fi than I'd like...
> 
> I thought I would like the e-Q5 too, but I picked up the Grado GR8 and it's kind of peaky. I'm not sure if this is due to Grado's tuning (it probably is) but I've been reading the Grado models are like long-lost brothers to the Ortofon models. If I see a good price on the e-Q5 in the FS section I'll probably jump on it, but there haven't been too many. As it stands the GR07 and the SE530 both come very close to complete satisfaction, with a few flaws in both - the GR07 doesn't flaunt it's detail like Etymotic or the CK10 does, and the sibilance at higher volumes bothers me, while the SE530 is large, bulky, and uncomfortable, and also suffers from the same "too smooth/missing detail" syndrome (but is smoother overall and more balanced).
> 
> The CK90Pro also seems interesting, and i've had my eye on it for a while, but the only ones I can find are imported from Japan and quite costly. If it turns out I don't like them I will probably end up losing quite a bit of money on them, and I don't like that at all.


 

 When people say that they mean the GR10 not the GR8.  GR8 is nothing like the other MA's tonally except maybe bass presentation.  I find the EQ5 resembles the DBA02 more than the GR8 but less aggressive and more refined w/ better bass extension and texture.  I still prefer the DBA though for what it does well.


----------



## Ikarios

Oh, figures. Guess that means I should start looking harder for the e-Q5.
   
  Joker, I know you don't like comparing full size sets to IEMs, but is there something that has the same general presentation as your K601, but with a little more linear response and more subbass? I spent some time with the K501 again and I forgot how much I love the sound signature (basically a smoother version of the K601, with more subbass and less fatiguing treble, although missing a little bit of detail). I switched to the GR07 and it took a little time to adjust to the signature, it was just a little thick and slow. I think the K501/601/701 are my favorite series of full-size headphones and don't really do anything really wrong, so that's kind of what I'm looking for, I guess.


----------



## james444

Thanks @joker for the Shure reviews, no objections here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You actually made me dig up an old post from the locked SM3 thread, where I had been speculating on how the new SE535 would fare against the SM3:
  
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> ... A/Bing the SM3 and SE530, the most striking difference to my ears is better detail resolution and refinement on the Earsonics _across the whole frequency range_. Both phones have a quite similar smooth and warmish sound signature with laid-back treble, but (metaphorically speaking) the SM3 sound more like SE550 than SE535 in comparison. Therefore I suspect that the SE535's improvements over the SE530 may be not be significant enough to match the SM3 ...


 
   
  Seems like it would really require an _SE550 _for Shure to catch up with Earsonics and Westone...

 Quote:


ikarios said:


> Oh, figures. Guess that means I should start looking harder for the e-Q5.


 

 e-Q5, GR10 or FI-BA-A1. All of these have very similar sound signatures, but if you like to listen at higher volume and/or are into amping, I'd recommend the latter. Final Audio's vented BAs sound a tad more dynamic and less strained at high volume and slightly snappier with amping than Ortofon/Grado's MAs.


----------



## SolidSnakeUS

Because of all of this, I chose to go with the Brainwavz M2 IEMs. Hope I don't regret it .


----------



## AstralStorm

ljokerl: Any plans to review the old granddaddy Klipsch Image X10 now that you're through top Shures?


----------



## davidcotton

I'd be interested in that review, bit late though seeing as I how I've just ordered a set anyway


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> The CK90Pro also seems interesting, and i've had my eye on it for a while, but the only ones I can find are imported from Japan and quite costly. If it turns out I don't like them I will probably end up losing quite a bit of money on them, and I don't like that at all.


 

 The CK90Pro is different enough from everything else that I've never recommended it to anyone and probably never will. Quite dark for an armature and very, very fast. I don't know if the acoustic horn setup has anything to do with how it sounds. Would really like to try the CK70Pro but they are prohibitively expensive stateside. Still, Phonak got the top-firing armature down so maybe ATH did as well.


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Joker, I know you don't like comparing full size sets to IEMs, but is there something that has the same general presentation as your K601, but with a little more linear response and more subbass? I spent some time with the K501 again and I forgot how much I love the sound signature (basically a smoother version of the K601, with more subbass and less fatiguing treble, although missing a little bit of detail). I switched to the GR07 and it took a little time to adjust to the signature, it was just a little thick and slow. I think the K501/601/701 are my favorite series of full-size headphones and don't really do anything really wrong, so that's kind of what I'm looking for, I guess.


 

 You description of the K501 vs K601 sounds how I feel about the K601 vs K701 - the K601 has less detail but also sounds more laid-back and less fatiguing for long sessions. And you are right, I don't think it's right to compare headphones to IEMs. The K601 I find a little inverse-U-shaped, not that it has forward mids but it does roll off gently on either end. The ortofons I feel would be a good match (I haven't heard any of the MA FADs), maybe a higher-end HiFiMan with a proper source match. I would think you'd like the RE-ZERO if you've tried it. Won't be as resolving as the AKGs but similarly non-fatiguing.


  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Thanks @joker for the Shure reviews, no objections here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 That's about how I felt comparing the two (and the W4 as well). Really a shame as I do like the SE535 signature a little better than the Earsonics'. I have to say the response to the SE530/5 reviews so far has been more positive than I expected. I suppose I can stop sleeping with my eyes open now.

  
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> ljokerl: Any plans to review the old granddaddy Klipsch Image X10 now that you're through top Shures?


 
   
  Not at the time - there's already far more stuff in the review queue than I can handle.


----------



## Carlsan

Joker, Nice review of the Shure's.


----------



## lazysleepyboi

thinking about doing more custom IEMs soon joker?


----------



## Pianist

It's a shame SE530/535 are so sensitive to fit. When fitted correctly, they are stunning 'phones. Certainly up there with the best of the best. I haven't heard anything with better mids than the Shures yet.


----------



## Carlsan

Quote: 





pianist said:


> It's a shame SE530/535 are so sensitive to fit. When fitted correctly, they are stunning 'phones. Certainly up there with the best of the best. I haven't heard anything with better mids than the Shures yet.


 


  Yes, have to agree. To my ears the sound is very lush. I especially like the Shures for both Orchestral pieces and ambient music.


----------



## Sweden

It would be interesting to see if someone could estimate the total number of IEM's available on the market.
  Also let separate world and US market.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The CK90Pro is different enough from everything else that I've never recommended it to anyone and probably never will. Quite dark for an armature and very, very fast. I don't know if the acoustic horn setup has anything to do with how it sounds. Would really like to try the CK70Pro but they are prohibitively expensive stateside. Still, Phonak got the top-firing armature down so maybe ATH did as well.
> 
> You description of the K501 vs K601 sounds how I feel about the K601 vs K701 - the K601 has less detail but also sounds more laid-back and less fatiguing for long sessions. And you are right, I don't think it's right to compare headphones to IEMs. The K601 I find a little inverse-U-shaped, not that it has forward mids but it does roll off gently on either end. The ortofons I feel would be a good match (I haven't heard any of the MA FADs), maybe a higher-end HiFiMan with a proper source match. I would think you'd like the RE-ZERO if you've tried it. Won't be as resolving as the AKGs but similarly non-fatiguing.


 

 That's the thing - a dark fast armature sounds like it could be what I want. I like detail and I like speed but I don't particularly like a treble-oriented sound. You describe the CK90 as having a mostly neutral sound, with treble detail but no treble peaks. I'm a little surprised you say that you've never recommended it, your review sounds quite enticing. You say it's "quite dark for an armature", but I've noticed many of the BAs I've listened to have a treble-oriented sound (haven't heard a Westone or Earsonic). How does the CK90 balance compare to something like, say, a Turbine or the GR07?. If I ever get a chance to listen to them I would probably jump on the opportunity.
   
  I do like the RE-ZERO when I owned it, but there were a couple caveats - first, I very very *very* slightly preferred the Sunrise Xcape V1 (mostly on account of the shape of the barrel and the less-microphonic cable, but also the very slightly warmer and very slightly heavier sound). However I also owned the CK10 at the time, which did everything the Sunrise/RE-ZERO/0 did but better. I've always considered the RE-0 to be a thin headphone, with a smooth but not overtly detailed treble, and the CK10 did the treble much faster and much more detailed. In the end it turns out the treble of the CK10 was actually too much, and even the PFE122s with grey filters beat them out in bass without losing too much of the treble detail. Ever since, I've been searching for something that can come close to the detail of the CK10 but not the treble quantity. If I had to summarize my cornerstones, it would probably be:
  GR07 - smooth, balanced, nice extended bass without a midbass hump, but somewhat sibilant treble and a can smear tiny details in cymbal hits and other high treble
  SE530 - great tonal balance and extension on both ends, presentation is great, no peaks, but large/uncomfortable and can smear details in the high treble like the GR07
  CK10 - very very fast and exquisitely detailed, bass and treble extension is superb, but bass quantity/slam is too little and treble is too much, especially in cymbals
   
  These three IEMs have come closest to what I'm looking for, but each of them is missing something. I know I've stated this a hundred times and you guys are probabyl tired of recommending stuff to me (I know the moving armature models in particular have been recommended a thousand times but no one wants to sell them for a low price 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). I should probably start a new thread about this.
   
  And yes, the K501 is to the K601 what the K601 is to the K701. It's an interesting progression and it turns out that I prefer the overall strengths of the K501s (mostly smooth frequency response and nice bass response - not really that punchy but the quantity is nice) enough over the K601/701 to have kept them over the two higher-end models.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> I know the moving armature models in particular have been recommended a thousand times but no one wants to sell them for a low price


 

 Maybe that's because they're worth it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Btw dunno if you've seen my last reply, just in case you're interested there's a FI-BA-A1 (not mine) up on the FS.


----------



## mgtb

Whoa 174 IEMs this must take you a long time to listen to them all.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lazysleepyboi said:


> thinking about doing more custom IEMs soon joker?


 

 Maybe
   


  Quote: 





sweden said:


> It would be interesting to see if someone could estimate the total number of IEM's available on the market.
> Also let separate world and US market.


 

 I can't even estimate the number of brands that IEMs are sold under but it's definitely in the triple digits.
   


  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> That's the thing - a dark fast armature sounds like it could be what I want. I like detail and I like speed but I don't particularly like a treble-oriented sound. You describe the CK90 as having a mostly neutral sound, with treble detail but no treble peaks. I'm a little surprised you say that you've never recommended it, your review sounds quite enticing. You say it's "quite dark for an armature", but I've noticed many of the BAs I've listened to have a treble-oriented sound (haven't heard a Westone or Earsonic). How does the CK90 balance compare to something like, say, a Turbine or the GR07?. If I ever get a chance to listen to them I would probably jump on the opportunity.


 

 There are many BAs that are not treble oriented - Westone, Shures, Earsonics, etc. CK90 is hard to compare to a Turbine or GR07. The sound is much more 'armature' than that - fast and punchy. It's only got a bit more bass than the CK10, and significantly less treble.


----------



## chengbin

Hi
   
  Thank you again for 2 detailed review of the Shure SE530 and SE535. When I saw these reviewed, I went like "finally!" and couldn't wait to read it. 
   
  I personally have heard of the SE530, and I agree with most of what you say. But I am perplexed by the rating system after this review. Despite the SE530 "failed to impress" and the entire review being quite critical of the SE530, it still scored a 9.2/10 for sound, which in my opinion is far too high based on your review and my own impressions. Even though the midrange was wonderful, the, and IMHO, dreadful treble performance should drag down its mark in sound out of a 9 and more like into a low 8. I'm sorry if me, a beginner, seems to be criticizing you, someone with much more experience, but this is my honest opinion
   
  I have a question. How does the GR07, a 9.4, compare to the 9.2 SE530? I originally wanted to buy a DBA-02 because it has even better clarity than the RE0 with more bass, but I ultimately cancelled due to customer service and build quality issues and bought a GR07 based on the great reviews and good build quality. I know the GR07 is a smoother phone, not as trebly and analytical, but if the GR07 sounds anywhere near like a SE530 in treble, I have to cancel my order. 
   
  I think I am an analytical listener, because I like a trebly sound, but I also like bass. I can't hear difference between the level of detail between two phones. I had a Shure E2c before the RE0, and I thought the RE0 was just a much more trebly phone than the E2c. As much as I love the RE0, the lack of bass and the thin sound makes me want to upgrade. The IE8 is probably my favorite IEM due to the V shaped sound. If I had $300, I'd just buy a CK10 and be done with it, but unfortunately $180 is already pushing it.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





chengbin said:


> But I am perplexed by the rating system after this review. Despite the SE530 "failed to impress" and the entire review being quite critical of the SE530, it still scored a 9.2/10 for sound, which in my opinion is far too high based on your review and my own impressions. Even though the midrange was wonderful, the, and IMHO, dreadful treble performance should drag down its mark in sound out of a 9 and more like into a low 8. I'm sorry if me, a beginner, seems to be criticizing you, someone with much more experience, but this is my honest opinion


 
   
  From a couple of pages ago -
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> I've said it before, Joker seems able to set aside a sonic bias better than most.


 

 This is not the first time Joker has rated an IEM he does not personally like higher (UM3X, SM3 are examples). I'd think treble would be just one of the parameters based on which he evaluates and assigns the final SQ score, but the weight is definitely not loaded in favor of treble to drag down SE530.


----------



## chengbin

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> From a couple of pages ago -
> 
> This is not the first time Joker has rated an IEM he does not personally like higher (UM3X, SM3 are examples). I'd think treble would be just one of the parameters based on which he evaluates and assigns the final SQ score, but the weight is definitely not loaded in favor of treble to drag down SE530.


 

  
  I realize treble is just one component of sound, but I believe an earphone that can score >9 should do nothing bad. The treble on the SE530 are, well, bad. Also, I've never read such a critical review for an earphone getting >9
   
  "the earphone lacks power, detail, and definition at the lowest of lows"
   
  "SE530 is a touch on the boomy side"
   
  "the SE530 yields little detail to the new crop of high-end monitors"
   
  "More noticeable are the sacrifices in clarity and transparency"
   
  "What’s missing is treble energy "
   
  "I was slightly underwhelmed by the presentation of the SE530"
   
  "the sound simply isn’t very well-separated"
   
  "the original SE530 failed impress me in any major way" (that says a lot considering how good the midrange is on the SE530, yet ljokerl was not impressed in a major way)
   
  This is why I questioned the 9.2/10 score because ljokerl's review is contradicting the score.


----------



## Ikarios

Keep in mind Joker considers the SE530 to have a street price of $400 new, and that's what he bases his review around. At least, that's how I view the framing of the sound score. If you go about reading some of the reviews, you'll notice that he doesn't sound very critical of some of the lower-end IEMs, and yet they can have much lower sound scores. In other words the context of the sound score is based around how much the IEM is worth.
   
  I own both the GR07 and the SE530 and honestly, I prefer the more balanced sound of the SE530, taken price-blind. Both IEMs are slightly mid-centric, and are both very balanced with good extension, especially in the bass. I don't know what you dislike about the SE530 treble but to me, it's a little bit lacking in detail and does roll off a little bit early, but it's nothing too bad. The SE530 in general is a smooth and well-balanced IEM with no huge faults and a great midrange. The GR07 is relatively similar in that it has a pretty even frequency balance throughout the spectrum, with one fault, in that it has a somewhat sibilant treble, which gets worse at higher volumes. It's interesting, because this is the first IEM I've heard with sibilance, but not an emphasized treble. It's hard to say whether or not you will like the GR07 since you don't have a lot of reference points.


----------



## chengbin

@Aflac
   
  My main problem with the SE530 was the REALLY rolled off treble. Perhaps I was A/B'ing with a RE0 and IE8, but call me an average listener, but the SE530 sounds unimpressive, and even low end, due to the severely rolled off treble. 
   
  Despite my dislike of the treble, I found the midrange to be amazing and the bass to be a bit bass heavy (which I like)
   
  I'm not bashing the SE530, it does many things well, such as midrange, fit, isolation, build quality, and bass, but the rolled off treble just wasn't my cup of tea.


----------



## lazysleepyboi

Quote: 





chengbin said:


> @Aflac
> 
> My main problem with the SE530 was the REALLY rolled off treble. Perhaps I was A/B'ing with a RE0 and IE8, but call me an average listener, but the SE530 sounds unimpressive, and even low end, due to the severely rolled off treble.
> 
> ...


 


  remember, this is what joker thinks, not what the rest of us thinks. This is what he perceives, not what you perceive. Sometimes people will have the same impression for IEMs and other times not. Like most people say on this forum, "to each his own". Joker has done enough IEM reviews to know why he ranks things the way he does, and he knows how to tell good IEMs from bad IEMs. A score of 9 or 10 does not mean perfection, it means that it does a lot of things well and that joker liked the experience. I'm pretty sure he explains this in his opening statements, but for the most part, this is his opinion of these IEMs. Don't take it too seriously because what this provides for other people is a reference. Some people will agree and some other people like you will disagree, this forum is mostly opinion based


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





chengbin said:


> @Aflac
> 
> My main problem with the SE530 was the REALLY rolled off treble. Perhaps I was A/B'ing with a RE0 and IE8, but call me an average listener, but the SE530 sounds unimpressive, and even low end, due to the severely rolled off treble.
> 
> ...


 

 IEM experience can vary greatly from person to person (I know this firsthand, re: my experience with the DBA-02). The RE0 is an extended IEM for its price range but IMO it's about the equivalent of the SE530. The IE8 I thought was terrible, and I never got so far as to look at treble extension because the midbass bloat was so bad. Different strokes for different people. You might have had a bad fit with the SE530, or maybe your ear canals just didn't like them. Reading reviews helps to narrow down targets for IEMs you think you would like but ultimately it's down to experience and first-hand listening.


----------



## kiteki

This thread is an excellent read to catch up on as always, a shame joker gave the 1964-T a 10/10 on sound quality though, Lol.
  Is it safe to say it doesn't have the unique strengths of some other IEM's? I mean for example, he says the Yuin OK1 has a nudity in the vocal presentation, ck10 forgiving of low quality source material, excellent high-end sparkle, etc.?  I mean with 9.X/10 scores on every universal, and a sudden 10/10 score on the custom, I get this dissapointing feeling "custom > universal", Lol, is that the case?
  Also, a quick check on 1964's website, and the frequency graph on the 1964-D seems to have better high end extension than the 1964-T, however they both lack the 10kHz clarity spike present in many other headphones and IEM's like the CK10 and W4... just my initial thoughts. =)


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





chengbin said:


> I realize treble is just one component of sound, but I believe an earphone that can score >9 should do nothing bad. The treble on the SE530 are, well, bad. Also, I've never read such a critical review for an earphone getting >9


 
   
  IMHO, no IEM is perfect. Not all of us perceive IEMs similarly. There are many IEMs that scored above 9, but still have "flaws" according to individual tastes and preferences.
   
  As you pointed out, the review does point out it's defects. But, there's always the question of benchmarks. An IEM can be "bad" compared to those which are higher up the SQ score, but can still be better than those which have lesser SQ score. IMO, Joker had to put an older SE530 in it's place among the current crop of top-tiers and that's not possible without describing the flaws. At the same time, knowing that he's trying to be as objective as he can be, SE530 should have bettered the other IEMs on few other parameters to earn that 9.2 score. If he had to bring personal preferences into the SQ score, I am sure SE53X would have scored lesser.
   
  I am just trying to interpret based on how I _think_ the scoring system works.
   
  @Aflac,
   
  I'd think that $400 price would be reflected more in the Value for Money score. I am not sure if price range has an influence on the SQ score.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





chengbin said:


> I personally have heard of the SE530, and I agree with most of what you say. But I am perplexed by the rating system after this review. Despite the SE530 "failed to impress" and the entire review being quite critical of the SE530, it still scored a 9.2/10 for sound, which in my opinion is far too high based on your review and my own impressions. Even though the midrange was wonderful, the, and IMHO, dreadful treble performance should drag down its mark in sound out of a 9 and more like into a low 8. I'm sorry if me, a beginner, seems to be criticizing you, someone with much more experience, but this is my honest opinion
> 
> I have a question. How does the GR07, a 9.4, compare to the 9.2 SE530? I originally wanted to buy a DBA-02 because it has even better clarity than the RE0 with more bass, but I ultimately cancelled due to customer service and build quality issues and bought a GR07 based on the great reviews and good build quality. I know the GR07 is a smoother phone, not as trebly and analytical, but if the GR07 sounds anywhere near like a SE530 in treble, I have to cancel my order.
> 
> I think I am an analytical listener, because I like a trebly sound, but I also like bass. I can't hear difference between the level of detail between two phones. I had a Shure E2c before the RE0, and I thought the RE0 was just a much more trebly phone than the E2c. As much as I love the RE0, the lack of bass and the thin sound makes me want to upgrade. The IE8 is probably my favorite IEM due to the V shaped sound. If I had $300, I'd just buy a CK10 and be done with it, but unfortunately $180 is already pushing it.


 

 Aflac is right - the negative tone of the review has more to do with the expectations set by the Shure earphones. Saying 'good clarity' about a $20 product is very different than saying the same about triple-armature flagship. Same goes for all of the other things I said about the Shures - they don't perform as well as an SM3, for example, but they are good enough in most ways. For the record, I don't think the SE530 is particularly rolled off. I think its extension is pretty average (and I think the IE8 is way above average on that count). It just has trouble making what's there sound realistic and energetic.
   
  I do think you will like the GR07. It's not lacking any treble or bass. I would not get the DBA-02 or CK10 if I were you.
   


  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *chengbin* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I'm not bashing the SE530, it does many things well, such as midrange, fit, isolation, build quality, and bass, but the rolled off treble just wasn't my cup of tea.


 


  Exactly. There are many who would say the SE530 sounds natural and the CK10 or RE0 has way too much treble. I don't necessarily agree with that but I won't call the SE530 a low-end product just because it presents treble a certain way. If you look at its score, it does fare worse than pretty much every other big-name flagship, and its performance at the limits plays a big role in that, but I can't say that those who like its presentation are simply wasting their money. If this was "joker's multi-iem opinion thread", it would look very different. More often than not my personal opinion bleeds into the writing style but not into the scores and evaluations. I haven't heard an earphone that I didn't find flawed in some way in quite a while (UM Miracle excepted). Some annoy me more than others, but who's to say that what gets on my nerves is 'wrong' and what does not is 'right'.
   
   

  
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> This thread is an excellent read to catch up on as always, a shame joker gave the 1964-T a 10/10 on sound quality though, Lol.
> Is it safe to say it doesn't have the unique strengths of some other IEM's? I mean for example, he says the Yuin OK1 has a nudity in the vocal presentation, ck10 forgiving of low quality source material, excellent high-end sparkle, etc.?  I mean with 9.X/10 scores on every universal, and a sudden 10/10 score on the custom, I get this dissapointing feeling "custom > universal", Lol, is that the case?
> Also, a quick check on 1964's website, and the frequency graph on the 1964-D seems to have better high end extension than the 1964-T, however they both lack the 10kHz clarity spike present in many other headphones and IEM's like the CK10 and W4... just my initial thoughts. =)


 

  The 1964-T is not perfect but it does combine quite a few good traits in one package. It's the Klipsch Custom 3 sound on steroids. I do not think it does any one thing better than all universals, no. For that it seems you need to go to the $500+ range customs. It's safe to say I'll be rescaling the review again when the UM Miracle is added.
   


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> As you pointed out, the review does point out it's defects. But, there's always the question of benchmarks. An IEM can be "bad" compared to those which are higher up the SQ score, but can still be better than those which have lesser SQ score. IMO, Joker had to put an older SE530 in it's place among the current crop of top-tiers and that's not possible without describing the flaws. At the same time, knowing that he's trying to be as objective as he can be, SE530 should have bettered the other IEMs on few other parameters to earn that 9.2 score. If he had to bring personal preferences into the SQ score, I am sure SE53X would have scored lesser.


 

  Actually I like the _signature_ of the SE535, just not its performance. Putting something at 9.2 means that I think, on balance, that it performs better than something given a 9.1 and worse than something given a 9.3. Every single IEM has its own issues and balancing them against each other is proving very difficult.


----------



## Kurdt-bada

Um3x 9.4 and shure 535 9.3? I have both and with custom tips shure 535 are not only better in my opinion are much better in sq in construction they are in another league.


----------



## kiteki

I demo'ed the Shure SE535 at Jaben in Singapore for like... 2 minutes, and my impression was it sounded very average and I could hardly detect any differences from the lower priced Shure models I listened to there.
   
  I'm interested in trying it again, but those 2 minutes were the most boring of my IEM life.


----------



## kiteki

I'm curious about customs now and want to start with the lowest end model possible just to see what it's like, single or dual driver, what to get.


----------



## lazysleepyboi

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I'm curious about customs now and want to start with the lowest end model possible just to see what it's like, single or dual driver, what to get.


 


  at the prices that customs offer, there is no point in going lower than three drivers IMO. Given that the difference is 125 dollars between a single and a triple, you can really just get the triple and be happy with it. I don't understand charts very much, so I'm saying this off of what I hear a lot of people saying. Generally, charts aren't entirely the tell all for IEMs or high end headphones. They answer some questions when you don't like a certain part of the headphone, but generally, it's always a rule of thumb to try things out yourself before. That being said, customs are pretty expensive compared to Universals. You pay more for the added isolation and comfort, and in some ways it pays off. Depends on where you get your impressions, but they can vary between 50-150 dollars, and then since you're in Australia, if you get 1964ears, you'll have to worry about customs. I'm not trying to deter you from getting customs, I'm just saying that there's a lot of things to consider. Most head-fiers that have customs consider them greater than universals, but there's a lot of added cost. Impressions, shipping, cost of IEMs, labor, shipping to you. And if your IEMs aren't good the first time, you'll have to send it back. Sorry if I'm being negative about customs, but I think it's noteworthy to remember that the impressions aren't always perfect the first time around


----------



## kiteki

yeah..... ok, I'll wait till I'm richer. - until then, keep buying old broken discmans on ebay = hifi. )
   
  I know an FR chart isn't "tell-all", but if there is a -10dB drop at 12kHz I'm pretty sure I could hear that to a degree, whereas the 1964-D survives until 16kHz, it's just an observation on paper. 
   
  Regarding customs, optimistically though, I was thinking if I knew what the driver was, like if it was a single BA from the Shure SE210, or dual BA from the CK10/DBA-02, then I'd know I'd be very happy with it, and get to experience a custom at the same time.


----------



## Kurdt-bada

try a good source and a good fit then you'll see what 535 are capable of


----------



## Pianist

I don't think SE530 lacks clarity - it just doesn't have an artificially added sense of clarity. And boomy? I didn't read Joker's full review, but if he said that, that's just wrong. SE530 is definitely not boomy at all in the low end, unless of course the fit is off. The bass is punchy, very tight and defined. Really high quality with excellent texture and a sense of power and impact at least in the mid/upper bass region, although I think SE530 is strong down to at least 60 Hz, which is plenty enough for most music IMO. I found SE530 excels at instrumental, especially pianos, which sounded just so sweet and lush it melted my heart. And of course the mids are simply superb overall. Anything with vocals shines on the Shures. Voices sound eerily realistic through these phones, but again, only with a good recording and fit. I don't think SE530 is very sensitive to source though - it can sound amazing even out of something like the Clip. I also found SE530 great at imaging - with some well recorded music, I could clearly imagine the performance happening in front of me with great realism. Also, I still haven't hear an IEM with such powerful, explosive dynamics as the SE530. I think FX700 comes close, but isn't quite there maybe because it isn't as balanced as SE530.
   
  Here are some reasons why I think SE530 should be rated higher than it is:
   
  - It is superior to e-Q7/e-Q5 overall IMO. In fact, in some ways, it simply blows away these two IEMs, namely in imaging and separation. In other ways, it is at least on par IMO. Dynamics are at least as good on the Shures, although I think SE530 is more dynamic, soundstage has better depth, the sound is more refined, there is more micro detail/texture, especially compared to e-Q5, the treble is smoother and more delicate vs. e-Q7 and at least on part with e-Q5 maybe missing only a little bit of extension on the very top - no big deal. the bass on SE530 is similar to e-Q7 in quality and character IMO - it has a similar impact and texture, but also a better sense of tactility/flow. The Ortofons sound a bit rough, I dare say even schematic compared to SE530 which is just more refined, smoother and more effortless overall to these ears.
   
  - DBA-02 is rated higher and yet SE530 is clearly the better IEM to these ears by a large margin. The Shures destroy DBA-02 in dynamics and micro detail. SE530 is also more balanced tonally and more natural sounding, whereas DBA-02 is bright and overly sharp by comparison. SE530 is smoother, more refined and subtle, while DBA-02 is much grainier and too dry, almost clinical by comparison. DBA-02 sounded to me like it tried very hard to provide a realistic representation of real performance and somewhat succeeded with a pretty impressive holographic presentation with good recordings. But SE530 sounded like it didn't even have to try - music just flowed through it so naturally and effortlessly and it provided a much more believable, lively and dynamic representation of the original recording than DBA-02 IMO, which just sounded limited in its abilities by comparison.
   
  - RE262 is rated higher than SE530 and yet what does it do better? Nothing IMO. But not only does it do nothing better, it also sounds much worse when not amped properly. I have not tried it amped unfortunately, but I highly doubt that amping it will completely transform its sound so that it will suddenly surpass SE530. Unamped RE262 is no match at all for SE530 - bass, mids, highs, soundstage, dynamics all sound very limited on the RE262 unamped vs. SE530 unamped. Even when amped properly, I don't expect RE262 to match SE530 in detail, separation and timbre. I think RE262 is quite colored compared to SE530 and further from the truth.
   
  - FX700 is rated quite a bit higher, but to these ears, it's not really better than SE530, just different. In some aspects, like imaging and dynamics, I think SE530 surpasses FX700. In other things, like bass depth, impact and treble, FX700 takes the cake. In most aspects, the are pretty close however. Mids are stellar on both, although different in character/presentation. bass quality is similar. Timbre may be better on FX700, but SE530 is more tonally balanced. Strings and acoustic guitars are better with FX700, but I think vocals and most other instruments are equally impressive on both. Overall, I think that SE530 can sound more realistic than FX700, because it has superior imaging abilities and a deeper, more immersive soundstage


----------



## esanthosh

I have never heard the SE530, so won't comment on it. But, just out of curiosity, did you compare all the IEMs side by side against SE530?
   
  Of particular interest to me is your take on FX700 vs SE530 in terms of "superior imaging abilities and a deeper, more immersive soundstage". I re-read Joker's review after reading your post and from what he described about FX700 and SE530, I simply don't get that feeling.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





pianist said:


> I don't think SE530 lacks clarity - it just doesn't have an artificially added sense of clarity. And boomy? I didn't read Joker's full review, but if he said that, that's just wrong. SE530 is definitely not boomy at all in the low end, unless of course the fit is off. The bass is punchy, very tight and defined. Really high quality with excellent texture and a sense of power and impact at least in the mid/upper bass region, although I think SE530 is strong down to at least 60 Hz, which is plenty enough for most music IMO. I found SE530 excels at instrumental, especially pianos, which sounded just so sweet and lush it melted my heart. And of course the mids are simply superb overall. Anything with vocals shines on the Shures. Voices sound eerily realistic through these phones, but again, only with a good recording and fit. I don't think SE530 is very sensitive to source though - it can sound amazing even out of something like the Clip. I also found SE530 great at imaging - with some well recorded music, I could clearly imagine the performance happening in front of me with great realism. Also, I still haven't hear an IEM with such powerful, explosive dynamics as the SE530. I think FX700 comes close, but isn't quite there maybe because it isn't as balanced as SE530.


 

 Fair enough, but I remember you stating in an earlier post, that during the whole time with your SE530 there were only _two occasions_ when you managed to get the perfect fit that made them sound that way.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I suppose I can stop sleeping with my eyes open now.


 
   
  Seems like you might have cheered too soon.


----------



## Pianist

With FX700, there is great depth to the sounds, but imaging is not as realistic as with SE530 IMO. FX700 still gives that "3 blobs in the head" feeling with clear separation between the channels and a "hole" in the middle, whereas SE530 is more layered and fills in the middle better. I think e-Q5 also fills the middle really well, but it does not image as well as SE530 and does not have the separation. there are other IEMs, such as UM3X and SM3 that also have minimal 3 blobs effect, but none I've heard provide the sense of space, dynamics and overall realism that SE530 did. SM3 came close at times, but the dull, recessed treble ruins everything IMO. FX700 comes even closer and with the right tips, it is almost there, but not quite as stunningly real sounding as SE530 was to my ears.
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Fair enough, but I remember you stating in an earlier post, that during the whole time with your SE530 there were only _two occasions_ when you managed to get the perfect fit that made them sound that way.


 
   
  That's right. And judging from other people's impressions on the Shures, most are even less lucky.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I'm interested in trying it again, but those 2 minutes were the most boring of my IEM life.


 

 Wait till you try the SE215 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote: 





pianist said:


> I don't think SE530 lacks clarity - it just doesn't have an artificially added sense of clarity. And boomy? *I didn't read Joker's full review, but if he said that, that's just wrong. *


 

 Sorry but in that case I'm not reading your post beyond that first line. Since when do we have to defer to Pianist to know what's right and what's wrong?


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sorry but in that case I'm not reading your post beyond that first line. Since when do we have to defer to Pianist to know what's right and what's wrong?


 
   
  Well, I know when bass sounds boomy and when it doesn't. SE530 is no ER4 when it comes to bass definition, but it certainly not boomy. Not when compared to a UM3X, e-Q7, RE262 or FX700. In fact, I think SE530 is better composed than UM3X, SM3 and DBA-02 down there.
   
  You probably just didn't get a good fit with the SE530, that's all. With some tips, I found them boomy too.


----------



## gloco

If you guys tried the SE530's with a Rio Karma you would hold the 530's in higher regard.  With the Karma's eq they sound pretty lively, musical and fun (and yes, the treble is right where it belongs).  Even with my iriver H180 the shures can sound pretty darn good, although warmer than when mated with the Karma.   I'd be willing to loan my Karma to the OP if he can get the Shures back into his hands and give them another shot. 
   
  I think the OP hit the mark on the 535's.
   
  edit:  A big thank you to the OP for taking the time to write this extensive comparison, I love it!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Well, I know when bass sounds boomy and when it doesn't. SE530 is no ER4 when it comes to bass definition, but it certainly not boomy. Not when compared to a UM3X, e-Q7, RE262 or FX700. In fact, I think SE530 is better composed than UM3X, SM3 and DBA-02 down there.


 


  Not the way I hear it, and if I did not get a 'good fit' with the SE530 once in six weeks despite being able to hear low extension down to 20Hz and the top end to ~15.5, there is a problem with the earphone.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not the way I hear it, and if I did not get a 'good fit' with the SE530 once in six weeks despite being able to hear low extension down to 20Hz and the top end to ~15.5, there is a problem with the earphone.


 
   
  Well, there is definitely a problem with the fit of the SE530 - a_ huge_ problem. That's why I will probably never buy them again. The sound is out of this world, but who needs it when they can hear it once in a blue moon, if at all. I guess we should just forget about it. Happy listening.


----------



## gloco

Gotta disagree with any fit issues on the SE530, I always got a solid fit with them.  The 535's?    Nope.  (with the olives)


----------



## esanthosh

Thankfully, this discussion is over. I was worried for a moment whether Joker knows how to get a good fit at all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I mean after nearly trying 200 IEMs, I thought he'd know by now.


----------



## ljokerl

I may have to get a pair of custom tips for each of the 200. Who knows what I've missed.


----------



## Pianist

Even with custom tips, you will need to make sure that they are the right length, made from the right material, have the right diameter of the nozzle, etc. I think fit with multi driver IEMs is a much more complex issue that most think.


----------



## Anaxilus

I actually find the 'natural' sound of the 530 artificially enhanced, thus rather unnatural to my ears.  An overly liquid, clean and sterile signature for me.  Meh.  Any moments of enjoyment I had w/ the 530 seemed more attributable to psychoacoustic adjustment IME.  It's a phone w/ a distinct signature that you either like or not, just like any other phone.  It's no holy grail.
   
  Let's also not bring EQ into the conversation otherwise we might as well throw the whole thread out and start over.


----------



## lazysleepyboi

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I may have to get a pair of custom tips for each of the 200. Who knows what I've missed.


 


  that would be a pain to do all 200 reviews again.....good luck doing that joker. But first, can you do the UM miracle review before the redo of the 200 IEMs you have already done? I'd much rather hear about the UM miracle than have to hear people complaining about you getting the sound signature wrong. Go figure, it's bound to happen when you compare so many IEMs that people love


----------



## gloco

Re: SE530's:  Clean and sterile?  Seriously?  They sound quite warm out of the box and even after any kind of break-in even without any EQ'ing.   I can certainly agree they sound unnatural whether they sound sterile to you or warm to me.  And don't kid yourself about using EQ on a DAP, I bet most HF members use one so it shouldn't be ignored.   Depending on the DAP, an EQ can certainly make a headphone/IEM sound radically different and not always for the worse.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I may have to get a pair of custom tips for each of the 200. Who knows what I've missed.


 
   
  I thought that would be sufficient until....
   
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> Even with custom tips, you will need to make sure that they are the right length, made from the right material, have the right diameter of the nozzle, etc. I think fit with multi driver IEMs is a much more complex issue that most think.


 
   





   
  Hope you can post the next two reviews sooner. Otherwise, the way this thread is going, I may start doubting all the reviews


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





gloco said:


> Re: SE530's:  Clean and sterile?  Seriously?  They sound quite warm out of the box and even after any kind of break-in even without any EQ'ing.   I can certainly agree they sound unnatural whether they sound sterile to you or warm to me.  And don't kid yourself about using EQ on a DAP, I bet most HF members use one so it shouldn't be ignored.   Depending on the DAP, an EQ can certainly make a headphone/IEM sound radically different and not always for the worse.


 

 Seems a lot confusion about using the term 'warmth' lately but whatever.  Warmth has nothing to do with being overtly liquid to me.  You can be warm and have proper texture.
   
  I don't care if people use EQ or not.  It simply has no place in reviews or comparisons for obvious reasons.  EQ all you want.  If you need EQ to make a phone then it has issues IMO.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Seems a lot confusion about using the term 'warmth' lately but whatever.  Warmth has nothing to do with being overtly liquid to me.  You can be warm and have proper texture.
> 
> I don't care if people use EQ or not.  It simply has no place in reviews or comparisons for obvious reasons.  EQ all you want.  If you need EQ to make a phone then it has issues IMO.


 
   
  But sources sound different too, even on their "flat" settings. My Clip is clearly warmer and fuller than Samsung T9. Samsung U2 is darker than Shuffle 1st gen and Sony NWZ-A816 is bassier than the Samsung players. Depending on the type of amp used in the source, different headphones can also change their sound signature, depending on their impedance. Low impedance IEMs have more sub bass on my Sony player than higher impedance ones, even if they are using the same drivers. And what about music? Music is EQed differently too...


----------



## gloco

I took note with your use of clean and sterile specifically because I wouldn't describe them as either.  The "house sound" of the shures is warm and musical, not clean and sterile.  I agree that the 530's can have proper texture...when EQ'd  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Seems a lot confusion about using the term 'warmth' lately but whatever.  Warmth has nothing to do with being overtly liquid to me.  You can be warm and have proper texture.
> 
> I don't care if people use EQ or not.  It simply has no place in reviews or comparisons for obvious reasons.  EQ all you want.  If you need EQ to make a phone then it has issues IMO.


----------



## gloco

I still think Joker's massive review is extremely beneficial, but it wouldn't surprise me if I purchased one of the IEM's in his review and found different results than what he described.  It's not his reviews are flawed or he's a fanboy.  It's that gear, even with the EQ off, has a particular signature that may be advantageous or detrimental to any IEM.  It's all about matching gear.  That's the reason why I mentioned the Rio Karma DAP (thanks to its wonderful EQ).  Any Shure+Rio Karma owners can attest to their happy marriage. 
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> But sources sound different too, even on their "flat" settings. My Clip is clearly warmer and fuller than Samsung T9. Samsung U2 is darker than Shuffle 1st gen and Sony NWZ-A816 is bassier than the Samsung players. Depending on the type of amp used in the source, different headphones can also change their sound signature, depending on their impedance. Low impedance IEMs have more sub bass on my Sony player than higher impedance ones, even if they are using the same drivers. And what about music? Music is EQed differently too...


----------



## flyingbangus

Hey joker,
   
  First off - big thanks for all the time and effort you've put in on this and the headphone review. Amazing contributions to this community.
   
  With that said, I want to get your thoughts on my next IEM....
   
*Short Version: *I'm looking for a durable IEM that is better than my S5i and M50 with presenting details on very busy tracks. Bass needs to be there, but less overpowering than my M50 and S5i - maybe a touch less than the M50? Inline mic and iPhone controls are a plus. Looking for something below $200, but willing to go up high if recommended highly. At the moment, the GR07 seems to be what I'm looking for.
   
   
   
*Long Version*
  Background
  - I am a newb. I may have actually read through both your reviews and spent countless hours reading head-fi, but I'm still a newb.
  - My on-the-go setup is iPhone 4 --> Klipsch S5i.
  - My music files are 50% (lossy?) mp3 and wma rips, 49% apple lossless, and a tiny handful of 256kbps aac and full-blown wav files.
  - I have no set music/genre preference. What I listen to changes every few weeks/months. As a result, my music library is all over the place - from Black Eyed Peas to The Verve.....and almost everything in between.
  - Lately I've been listening to a lot of dubstep and two recent CD's I picked up -- Linkin Park's A Thousand Suns and OneRepublic's Waking Up.
  - My at-home setup is iTunes -> X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty sound card -> TOSLINK -> Astro MixAmp 5.8 -> Audio Technica ATH-M50.
   
  What I'm looking for
  1) Durability. I am very rough on my IEM's. The Klipsch S5i has withstood the daily abuse for almost 5 months now, with only a tiny/slight kink on the wire to show for. While I will definitely be more careful on my next purchase, it still needs to be able to withstand getting plugged in and out of my iPhone around 20 times a day, 5 days a week.
   
  2) Detail and separation. Here is the part where you will have to forgive my newbie-ness and lack of use (and understanding) of common audiophile terminology. Basically, after spending a lot of time with M50's, I find that the same music played on the S5i seems to be more congested and tiny details are harder to recognize as a result. It also doesn't help that the S5i's bass is very very strong.
   
  Both the M50 and S5i also seem to be off when playing busy (complicated?) Metallica and Linkin Park tracks. I used to have cassette tapes of their albums a long time ago that I play(or blast, LOL!) on my dad's expensive sony system back in the late 90's. The cymbals, and diff guitars are easy to tell from my pop's speaker system, unlike on my S5i and M50 (though the M50 fares a bit better than the S5i). Perhaps it's too much to expect the same detail (or is it imaging?) from IEM's and headphones?
   
  3) Inline mic and iPhone controls. Not very important, but convenience is convenient 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  4) Budget is less than $200. I am willing to go up above that for something highly recommended. _(Translation: I'll delay my purchase of Grado SR325is LOL)_
   
  I think I've narrowed it down to....
  VSonic GR07 -
  Fischer Audio DBA 02 -
  Ortofon e-Q5 -
  Shure SE535 - expensive, and worried about durability.
  ER HF3 - anemic on bass?
  Phonak PFE - durability concern?
   
  Thoughts?
   
  A couple of weeks ago I was set on ordering CK10's.....then I hesitated......then it's out of stock. Pffft.
   
   
   
   
  (Please let me know if it's more appropriate to open up my own thread.)


----------



## victorbrt

Joker, my ECCI PR401 finally arrived.
   
  And i have one question if you don't mind. How to put the Sony Hybrid tips on the ECCI?
   
  I can't put the tip on the IEM, they don't fit. With the original tips they fit easily.


----------



## High_Q

ER4 SQ 8.9!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Shame on you.  I know this review thing can't be totally objective, but the most detailed and accurate IEM deserves better.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  What is done is done, none the less.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


flyingbangus said:


> Background
> - I am a newb. I may have actually read through both your reviews and spent countless hours reading head-fi, but I'm still a newb.
> - My on-the-go setup is iPhone 4 --> Klipsch S5i.
> - My music files are 50% (lossy?) mp3 and wma rips, 49% apple lossless, and a tiny handful of 320kbps aac and full-blown wav files.
> ...


 
  If you plan to be rough, I'd forget the DBA-02, HF3, and Phonaks. Nothing wrong with their build quality but they aren't exactly high-grade survivalist items. The rest are balanced each in their own way. If the S5i sounds like the S4, the GR07, e-Q5, and SE535 should all be a major step up in resolution. The GR07 is better if you like dynamic-driver bass - the e-Q5 and SE535 both sound more soft and gentle. Same goes for the treble, actually - the GR07 is not necessarily aggressive but it's not at all laid-back. A bit like the M50 in that respect. e-Q5 is not laid back either but it's more polite and refined.
   
   
  Quote:
   


victorbrt said:


> Joker, my ECCI PR401 finally arrived.
> 
> And i have one question if you don't mind. How to put the Sony Hybrid tips on the ECCI?
> 
> I can't put the tip on the IEM, they don't fit. With the original tips they fit easily.


 
  There's a method to it. Hybrids will fit on pretty much anything but it takes a bit of work. Have to start by putting the corner of the nozzle into the inner core of the eartip and then stretching the rest of the core over the nozzle. You have to be a bit careful but hybrids can take a ton of abuse.
   

  Quote: 





high_q said:


> *ER4 SQ 8.9*!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  Uhh... what?


----------



## High_Q

My bad, ER4 SQ is listed as 9.3, not 8.9.  I say it should be higher though.  Damn microphonics. It would be perfect if microphonics were dampened.


----------



## victorbrt

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> flyingbangus said:
> ...


 
   
  Joker, i have tried that, but not for so long. I will try again: it's the only way i can think. The green Sony Hybrid is the medium one?
   
  I pretend to do A/B comparasion with the AT CKM55 with my Fiio E7 (that have two headphones jack) but, from what I hear, I can see that the ECCI PR401 is much better to CKM55.
   
  The only thing that bothers me is the fit. With the original ones, i try the medium size and, althrought the IEM seems to fit my ear, they don't go very deep: if i put my finger in the IEM and push it to my ear i can feel that he goes deeper and then came back a little when i put my finger off. It's normal?
   
  My fear is of bad fit, because sometimes I hear the voice of the vocalist become harsh.
   
  Ah, Joker, do you notice an improvement of ECCI PR401 with burn-in?


----------



## mcnoiserdc

After reading these last posts, I am here thinking, what joker has to go through... from contradictions to dealing with score misreading, lol!
  Thanks for being so patient, lol!
   
  Pianist I really think it is time for you to start your own thread, with strong convictions like you have, I think there are a lot of people who would be helped with your point of view.


----------



## esanthosh

I agree on both points. A few months back, I was very much into the SQ score thing as many do. But, of late, I just take it as an indicator of which tier the IEM would fall into and attach much more importance to what is written. It's not about whether Joker has rated the IEM higher or lower, but whether the signature matches my own preferences (likewise with clieOS' ratings as well).
   
  I won't mind a Pianist Multi-IEM review thread either. Rather than focus energy on Joker's scores, I guess he can give his own SQ scores


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There's a method to it. Hybrids will fit on pretty much anything but it takes a bit of work. Have to start by putting the corner of the nozzle into the inner core of the eartip and then stretching the rest of the core over the nozzle. You have to be a bit careful but hybrids can take a ton of abuse.


 
   
  Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Joker, i have tried that, but not for so long. I will try again: it's the only way i can think. The green Sony Hybrid is the medium one?


 

 There's another method that might help. Use a ball-point pen or something similar and slide the Hybrids top first onto it (you can moisten the pen to make it easier). Then align the pen's tip with the nozzle (be careful not to damage the IEM's filters, if there are any) and slide the Hybrids off the pen and onto the nozzle. This has helped me on several occasions when I found it hard to stretch the tips directly over the nozzle.


----------



## flyingbangus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you plan to be rough, I'd forget the DBA-02, HF3, and Phonaks. Nothing wrong with their build quality but they aren't exactly high-grade survivalist items. The rest are balanced each in their own way. If the S5i sounds like the S4, the GR07, e-Q5, and SE535 should all be a major step up in resolution. The GR07 is better if you like dynamic-driver bass - the e-Q5 and SE535 both sound more soft and gentle. Same goes for the treble, actually - the GR07 is not necessarily aggressive but it's not at all laid-back. A bit like the M50 in that respect. e-Q5 is not laid back either but it's more polite and refined.


 

 Thank you! I'm almost sold onto GR07, but they are out of stock at the moment on lendmeurears. In the meantime, I'll read about the e-Q5 and the SE535. I like the availability of inline mic and iphone controls on the SE535, but the price is something I have to factor in.


----------



## kanuka

hey all
  i got my pl50 finally
   
  didnt have good luck with the foams tips , and only the M and L silicone fit
   
  i've already ordered the hybrids (the clone ones) from ebay. hope they arrive soon
  so any suggestions about better tips? silicone or foams? bi/tri-flanges?
   
  if they can  match the DBA-02 too, would be better
  btw my inpressions  fo the pl50? ... just look at my avatar!


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> I agree on both points. A few months back, I was very much into the SQ score thing as many do. But, of late, I just take it as an indicator of which tier the IEM would fall into and attach much more importance to what is written. It's not about whether Joker has rated the IEM higher or lower, but whether the signature matches my own preferences (likewise with clieOS' ratings as well).
> 
> *I won't mind a Pianist Multi-IEM review thread either. Rather than focus energy on Joker's scores, I guess he can give his own SQ scores*


 

 I would not read it.


----------



## muad

They are supposed to be in stock this Friday....
   
  Quote: 





flyingbangus said:


> Thank you! I'm almost sold onto GR07, but they are out of stock at the moment on lendmeurears. In the meantime, I'll read about the e-Q5 and the SE535. I like the availability of inline mic and iphone controls on the SE535, but the price is something I have to factor in.


----------



## flyingbangus

Sweet! Thanks!
  
  Quote: 





muad said:


> They are supposed to be in stock this Friday....


----------



## fusedpro

(I posted this in another thread but I figured asking here couldn't hurt either)

   

  Hi all,

   

  I'm another new buyer and pretty inexperienced in the whole IEM field, so any help would be appreciated. I've browsed these forums a good amount, learned quite a bit, but still can't decide on a pair of IEMs. My only experience in this field are with a pair of Ink'd by Skullcandy so I don't really know good sound from bad but I imagine anything will be an upgrade (don't get me wrong, these things have last well over 4 years, so kudos for <$10).

   

  First things first, my price range is ~$40. With that, I know not to expect the best but I would like the best that that amount can buy. I much prefer straight-down to over-the-ear as well. Meelectronics' M6 came with high reviews but was ruled out because of that factor. I did order an M9 since it was only $17 but those will probably serve as a back-up pair to the decision that will hopefully be made in this thread (if not, I still have something decent at least).

   

  Listening environment -- isolation isn't high up on my list but it never hurts as I do plan on taking them to the gym occasionally (my gym is pretty quiet though). At work, I only have one monitor in my ear the majority of the time so I'm not sure if that changes anything, but I do use both as I'm walking around campus.

   

  My player is just a 16GB Zune HD, no amp or equalizer. I do listen to a wide range of music (very little rap/hip-hop though) but I would guess my main genres, NOT in order of preference, are rock, punk, alternative, and classical. Classical aside, some of my favourite artists are Jimmy Eat World, Say Anything, Relient K, House of Heroes, Andrew WK, SR-71, and The Classic Crime. Other artists that show up in my playlist -- Blink 182 and variations (Angels and Airwaves, Boxcar Racer, +44), Coheed and Cambria, The Fall of Troy, Dance Gavin Dance, Sugarland, The Dangerous Summer, The Dear Hunter, A Day to Remember, Enter the Haggis, Passion Pit, Straylight Run, and Four Year Strong. Probably not the best spread but that should help determine a good fit.

   

  As per this thread, the pair that caught my attention were Brainwav's M1 but there were a lot in there so I couldn't really decide. Many seem to think that the M2 is worth the extra coin, but following that, might as well spend just a bit more and get a pair of RE0. Amplifiers are a completely different beast that I know nothing about. Would something cheap like the FiiO E5 be of any benefit with my price range or would that extra $20 be better spent on a higher end IEM?

   

  After reading this, does anyone have any input that would help me make a decision. Thanks!


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> After reading these last posts, I am here thinking, what joker has to go through... from contradictions to dealing with score misreading, lol!
> Thanks for being so patient, lol!
> 
> *Pianist I really think it is time for you to start your own thread, with strong convictions like you have, I think there are a lot of people who would be helped with your point of view.*


 
   
  I don't see how one's subjective impressions on sound can help anyone, except maybe really close friends or relatives who know the person well. We all have different ears, gear, music.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Joker, i have tried that, but not for so long. I will try again: it's the only way i can think. The green Sony Hybrid is the medium one?
> 
> I pretend to do A/B comparasion with the AT CKM55 with my Fiio E7 (that have two headphones jack) but, from what I hear, I can see that the ECCI PR401 is much better to CKM55.
> 
> ...


 

 Green is the medium (2nd largest) for hybrids. It's normal to be able to push the IEM further in than it normally sits but maybe a smaller size is worth trying just in case. I don't remember if the PR401 benefits from burn-in but if I didn't mention it specifically in the review, chances are the changes were subtle at best. 


  Quote: 





james444 said:


> There's another method that might help. Use a ball-point pen or something similar and slide the Hybrids top first onto it (you can moisten the pen to make it easier). Then align the pen's tip with the nozzle (be careful not to damage the IEM's filters, if there are any) and slide the Hybrids off the pen and onto the nozzle. This has helped me on several occasions when I found it hard to stretch the tips directly over the nozzle.


 

 Sounds reasonable.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey all
> i got my pl50 finally
> 
> didnt have good luck with the foams tips , and only the M and L silicone fit
> ...


 

 Meelec A151 single/bi/tri-flange tips should fit but of course the A151 came out long after the PL50 so I'm not sure anyone has tried the tip combination. I think T200s from Comply will fit also but you may want to search through the long PL50 threads for confirmation.

  
  Quote: 





fusedpro said:


> First things first, my price range is ~$40. With that, I know not to expect the best but I would like the best that that amount can buy. I much prefer straight-down to over-the-ear as well. Meelectronics' M6 came with high reviews but was ruled out because of that factor. I did order an M9 since it was only $17 but those will probably serve as a back-up pair to the decision that will hopefully be made in this thread (if not, I still have something decent at least).
> 
> 
> Listening environment -- isolation isn't high up on my list but it never hurts as I do plan on taking them to the gym occasionally (my gym is pretty quiet though). At work, I only have one monitor in my ear the majority of the time so I'm not sure if that changes anything, but I do use both as I'm walking around campus.
> ...


 


  My suggestion would be to wait for the M9 to arrive and go from there. M9, M1, M2, and RE0 all sound very different but having an additional data point to your Ink'd might help figure out a direction. I wouldn't bother with an E5 and of course moving up to the M2-RE0 price range opens up a bunch of other high-performing earphones with different sound signatures - Sunrise, Fischer, Refurb Turbines, higher-end MEE stuff. I think you can also still get any Xears model for 30EUR+shipping with a coupon code mentioned a few pages back. The XR120, TD-III, and Nature N3i are easily worth that much, and more.


----------



## UserFriendly

Here's a suggestion:
  Add an update log, showing the dates each IEM was added.


----------



## 7swell

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Wait till you try the SE215


 

 Does that imply that the SE215 is not a good choice? I was considering getting it as a backup IEM because the $100 price tag isn't bad at all, but it seems you weren't impressed. Ah well, looking forward to the review.


----------



## Inks

Little late, but I think  Pianist's critical approach is fun, regardless of that...
  Pianist....your "it's hard to get a perfect fit" just sounds like an excuse. I get a perfect fit with 95% of my IEMs, which results in the deepest bass possible for the driver which I test with sine waves. You get a sense of that "perfect fit" with enough experience, my ears usually get the best fit with triple flanges which I used on my brief listen of the Shures. Joker has more experience than us both and I'm sure he tested them with that "perfect seal". The 530s have a likable signature, but it's just lacking in technical strengths. It does have one of the best dynamic ranges I've heard from a BA but that's the best complement I could give it. Joker has had enough experience know when his fit is best and how to manage it with all the IEMs. His descriptions of the Shures are quite respectable, I will be surprised if you disagree on that. I do wish he had more time to just sit back and take his time on each review though, the man is kind of being overworked. 
   
  For Fun...........


> *Posted by Pianist*
> 
> Here are some reasons why I think SE530 should be rated higher than it is:
> 
> ...


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





7swell said:


> Does that imply that the SE215 is not a good choice? I was considering getting it as a backup IEM because the $100 price tag isn't bad at all, but it seems you weren't impressed. Ah well, looking forward to the review.


 

 Well, different strokes for different folks. Seems like |Joker| just doesn't like Shure sound signature. There are many other people who don't like it and that's fine. That doesn't mean Shure is no good of course. I personally love the Shure signature lush midrange, rich, textured, laid back sound. I thought all Shure IEMs I tried - and I tried almost all of them - sound great. They are not for those who like a sharp aggressive sound, but rather for those who prefer a rich, somewhat dark, laid back listening experience.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> Here's a suggestion:
> Add an update log, showing the dates each IEM was added.


 

 There is a date (month/year) in each review as well as dates for the most recent additions in the table of contents.

  
  Quote: 





7swell said:


> Does that imply that the SE215 is not a good choice? I was considering getting it as a backup IEM because the $100 price tag isn't bad at all, but it seems you weren't impressed. Ah well, looking forward to the review.


 

 No.. I think someone commented that the SE535 sounded dull but I thought it sounded very lively and dynamic next to the SE215.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Meelec A151 single/bi/tri-flange tips should fit but of course the A151 came out long after the PL50 so I'm not sure anyone has tried the tip combination. I think T200s from Comply will fit also but you may want to search through the long PL50 threads for confirmation.


 

 i checked the meelec site, but looks they dont sell tips for a151?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> No.. I think someone commented that the SE535 sounded dull but I thought it sounded very lively and dynamic next to the SE215.


 
   
  I'm pretty sure I listened to the SE215 at the same time, or SE4XX, it had the same body shape as the SE535.
   
  I A/B'd them and they sounded 100% identical, and both sounded rather dull, so after due consideration I think I _must_ have been auditioning fakes in that store, and have never heard a real SE535, so I take back my comments.
   
  I also auditioned an SE210 in that store and it sounded _nothing_ like the previous time I had heard an SE210, much to my confusion...
 The people working there were very nice and customer-service oriented, and I thought it must have just been a bad fit or I had a cold, but nah... terrible store... seems like I've never heard a genuine shure, except the SE210.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Well, different strokes for different folks. Seems like |Joker| just doesn't like Shure sound signature. There are many other people who don't like it and that's fine. That doesn't mean Shure is no good of course. I personally love the Shure signature lush midrange, rich, textured, laid back sound. I thought all Shure IEMs I tried - and I tried almost all of them - sound great. They are not for those who like a sharp aggressive sound,* but rather for those who prefer a rich, somewhat dark, laid back listening experience.*


 
  Intersting.


----------



## lazysleepyboi

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Well, different strokes for different folks. Seems like |Joker| just doesn't like Shure sound signature. There are many other people who don't like it and that's fine. That doesn't mean Shure is no good of course. I personally love the Shure signature lush midrange, rich, textured, laid back sound. I thought all Shure IEMs I tried - and I tried almost all of them - sound great. They are not for those who like a sharp aggressive sound, but rather for those who prefer a rich, somewhat dark, laid back listening experience.


 

  you have to remember, joker is not the person that's telling us what we are supposed to feel. Reviews on head-fi are taken with a grain of salt. So when joker says something about a IEM, it's his perception of it, not anyone elses. If shure's do not fit joker's criteria for good headphones, it may for others. Everyone has a different taste and everyone has a different preference. Joker has done a great job in compiling a list of IEMs and reviewing each one so he has experience in this. Everyone in head-fi knows that you're not supposed to take only one person's opinion on IEMs so i really do not understand why you're trying to say that the shure's are actually good IEMs. If you want to say your own opinion about shures make your own thread and review them. Other than that, this isn't the place to say that joker is wrong. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, so make your own thread and have people flock over to your thread to disagree with you. It's the way this forum runs


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





lazysleepyboi said:


> you have to remember, joker is not the person that's telling us what we are supposed to feel. Reviews on head-fi are taken with a grain of salt. So when joker says something about a IEM, it's his perception of it, not anyone elses. If shure's do not fit joker's criteria for good headphones, it may for others. Everyone has a different taste and everyone has a different preference. Joker has done a great job in compiling a list of IEMs and reviewing each one so he has experience in this. Everyone in head-fi knows that you're not supposed to take only one person's opinion on IEMs so i really do not understand why you're trying to say that the shure's are actually good IEMs. If you want to say your own opinion about shures make your own thread and review them. Other than that, this isn't the place to say that joker is wrong. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, so make your own thread and have people flock over to your thread to disagree with you. It's the way this forum runs


 

 I agree w/ most of what you are saying but how is rating a phone over 9.0 make it NOT a good sounding phone?  Most of people's criticism of the ratings here have little or no perspective whatsoever and should be considered arbitrary noise.  Fanboys are just upset that someone can be critical of their favorite phone.  I like how the same folks spouting off the amazing virtues of their darlings never seem to offer a critique of what they do wrong.  Then again, I guess when a phone is as perfect as the 530 that's hard to do.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  
   
  I also forgot to add two dimensional, typical flat note BA sound to my previous sterile, unnatural, over liquid, poorly textured comments.  The 530 paints an interesting picture if you like wall art.  I prefer audio sculptures.  YMMV.


----------



## Confispect




----------



## Chaza741

Great comparison, makes buying earphone sooo much easier


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





confispect said:


>


----------



## Niyologist

Yeah, it looks like my collection will have a major upgrade in the next several months. I'll have the following:
   
  Meelec CC51 (Meelec rumored that they'll have a Version 2, although it is coming soon)
  MTPG
  Sennheiser IE8
   
  That should be beneficial so I won't have to rely on my other two IEMs.
   
  Besides, I was curious I how these sound, so I'll have to find out myself.


----------



## mark2410

seeing as its on going, i shall comment.  now im not going to tell joker hes wrong but all our ears are differently shaped, have different frequency responses and different preferences.  joker is more inclined towards a bright, sparkly sound and i can see that often his ranking and scoring reflects that.  brighter sizzling high IEM's he scores higher than i would and smoother gentle treble things he ranks lower. (although i still think hes mad for scoring the MTPC as he did, crazy generously scored that one.)  likewise im quite sure that should he read one of my reviews and i complain a little about too much treble he will know how it relates to what hes likely to hear and what his tastes are.
   
  now i know he says he marks biased on technical ability's not just personal preference as i do too but im well aware we all are still swayed in part by what we like and what we find comfortable.  for me too much crispy treble tires me out and for me thats a fault.  for him i think hes more likely to find gentle, easy on the ear, rolled off treble to make for a lifeless and dull sound.  neither of us are really right as what we hear may not be what you hear or what you want to hear.  its why im not big on giving numerical marks to things, id rather say what level they are on and from there on its the sound sig that determines whats "best." 
   
   
  for me however i hear more what pianist hears and im a great big fan of the 530, its a spectacularly dynamic and emotive IEM.  its mid range is stunning and its bass is near perfection for me.  its highs well, arent perfect but i could hear them all day, i doubt i could do that with say the TF10.  so for me the 530 is my favourite Top Tier but id be more reluctant to grade them numerically as aspect weighting will always be the deciding factor there.


----------



## kiteki

Yes I'm sure as a human species we have taken different paths in evolution, some hunted fish and some hunted bats, this was millions of years ago, and now as a result we prefer different IEM's because we are more attracted to the bat and fish frequencies, which once upon a time where adamant for our survival on this planet, so they trigger happy chemicals in our brain, is that what you're saying?


----------



## kiteki

There are also the rare "dolphin hunter" humans that come from antlantis and had to have acute hearing to the ultra high frequency echolocation of the rare hyperborean dolphin, these people should opt for the Final Audio $1000+ range as it is more tailored to their unique happy triggers.


----------



## ljokerl

I have never declared my scores absolute or representative of anything but my own impressions of the earphones so I don't understand why everyone's getting their panties all up in a knot. In fact, there is an FAQ section and a disclaimer in post #8 asking people to read the damn text and only refer to the chart in that context. If an earphone that adequately covers about as much of the spectrum with three armatures as most do with one or two sounds natural and appealing to someone, great, but I can't rank an earphone like that up with any of the other triple-driver flagships. Not even the TF10, which itself is by no means a paragon of accuracy. All of my issues with the SE530 are laid out in the body of the review. Those who don't hear the earphones the way I do or are willing to overlook this or that for the solid midrange performance - fine - but I don't really see where this discussion is going. For obvious reasons I've never changed any scoring due to someone else's impressions or opinions. I have no intention of carrying my distaste of a particular earphone into any appreciation or recommendation threads as some here do and have never purposely contradicted another poster for the sake of interjecting my own opinion. Those who feel that this thread or the individual reviews it contains are biased, erroneous, or otherwise useless have my blessing to ignore it altogether. 
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kanuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> i checked the meelec site, but looks they dont sell tips for a151?


 

 It seems they do not. Not sure why that is.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> joker is more inclined towards a bright, sparkly sound and i can see that often his ranking and scoring reflects that.  brighter sizzling high IEM's he scores higher than i would and smoother gentle treble things he ranks lower.


 

  I don't actually think that's quite accurate.  He scores the Monster Gold, MD's, Radius DDMs, SM3, 530 highly.  Those are all warm and not paragons of brightness.  Don't forget, it was the SM3 that caused him to readjust his scale.  I for one think he does a great job not over emphasizing FR in his scoring.  Oh well.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Dunu Ares and Crius
  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> He scores the Monster Gold, MD's, Radius DDMs, SM3, 530 highly.  Those are all warm and not paragons of brightness.  Don't forget, it was the SM3 that caused him to readjust his scale.  I for one think he does a great job not over emphasizing FR in his scoring.  Oh well.


 

 You forgot e-Q7, UM3X, IE8, and SM2 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I really, really don't like the signature of the SM2.


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

From how i understand joker's scoring, i would sum it up as a scale of clarity.
  clarity would mean a lot of things.. i can probably list it down below..
  1. details, how much can you hear, opposite of er.. well.. less detail (lol). i think he mentioned resolution.
  2. focus, how solid is the note, opposite of fuzzy, smeared, related to muddiness.
  3. fluidity, how effortless the sound is, or opposite of how constrained the sound is. also related to muddiness, dynamic range, strength of sound, etc.
  4. imaging, also related to focus, but more on soundstage, positioning, separation, spatial room for each note, and so on.
   
  taking into account of all the above.. the result is still clarity, how clean the music comes to be heard, or not.. a clean and smooth sounding iem will actually get higher score, a smooth sounding but muddy iem will get lesser score, a clean but harsh sounding iem will get points depending on how the harshness affects the flow of the sound, if it hampers the flow, it gets less, if its simply grainy or piercing or painful but still conveys the sound well, it will get marks depends on how the listener interprets the harshness, or how annoyed the person is.
   
  there's still a lot more things to consider that will affect the sound of the iem, namely balance, presentation, impulse, body, decay, projection, and probably a whole lot more criteria (the glossary have lots anyways) but were not used when putting scores. Its possible that we will get a more accurate idea on where to rank the iems if we consider all 20+ criteria? 30+? dunno, never bothered, just like the lots here.. , score them, and average the whole lot, but we simply dont have enough resource, measuring tools, scale, or what not to do that, hence the huge bias in the simplified scale used by joker (its HIS reference scale anyways), and differs to other people's scale.
   
  all in all, i found his comments and opinion valuable as a reference vs our own personal opinion, and that can actually give an idea on what to expect when trying out new iems.


----------



## kiteki

I'd say clarity is seperate from imaging and detail, since you can have a very clear sound with zero imaging, and likewise a clear sound with all the details smoothed over, pretty sure...
   
  what's all this about clarity in the first place? I came here looking for muddy and dissonant sound, harsh and coloured too, is there an "anti-joker" on head-fi?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I came here looking for muddy and dissonant sound, harsh and coloured too, *is there an "anti-joker" on head-fi?*


 
   
  Hah!  No comment......


----------



## DaEMoNteNTAcLe

anti joker thread lol..
   
  well imaging can be different, but can be related, depending on how u would want to relate it.
  I put smoothed over as focus. how pinpoint of fuzzy the sound is. of course, if all sounds are pinpoint focus, but placed in same location on the imaging, it will blurr out all distinction of the sound, hence diminished clarity. if the imaging are positional, but the sound is not focused, it will sound blurr as well, so its either wide blurring or single point blurring.. both are not clear. both can also be either fuzzy, smoothed over, congested, stacking, etc.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> what's all this about clarity in the first place? I came here looking for muddy and dissonant sound, harsh and coloured too, is there an "anti-joker" on head-fi?


 

 Lol


----------



## kiteki




----------



## Niyologist

(I wonder when the Sleek Audio SA7 will come out. I would sure love to test those out......) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Sorry! Just thinking of those powerful, well crafted earphones that can withstand 14,000 G.


----------



## eric8205

is there any thread like this for cans? would be interesting because this is a very nice one and helped me out alot, looks like the next iems ill be getting are the m9's looking at the review and ecspecially value rating here


----------



## kanuka

there's and it's also joker's
  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/433318/shootout-84-portable-headphones-reviewed-fischer-audio-fa-004-koss-ur55-added-06-06


----------



## SowonAoD

will you get one pair of j-phonic k2, joker?


----------



## Confispect

^ Good question.
   
  Also Sony EX1000, Ex6000, Atrio MG7, also well as the other J-phonic.


----------



## esanthosh

EX-1000 is already on the list in post #8. Now, if someone could loan ljokerl Atrio MG7...


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> EX-1000 is already on the list in post #8. *Now, if someone could loan ljokerl Atrio MG7*...


 

 Runs and hides...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  My cat friend might I'll have to wake him up with my stun gun.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> (I wonder when the Sleek Audio SA7 will come out. I would sure love to test those out......)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Hard-shell earphones are well and good as long as the rest of the construction is up to par. I know the Monster Jamz can withstand a direct hit with a hammer but then the cable goes three times in as many months, that doesn't really matter. As always, hoping for the best but the cable on my SA1 was sub-par.

  
  Quote: 





sowonaod said:


> will you get one pair of j-phonic k2, joker?


 

 I doubt it. Big-name manufacturers almost never reach out to me and I don't think there are a whole lot of K2s floating around Head-Fi.


----------



## Kunlun

Quote: 





confispect said:


> Runs and hides...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  w-whut happen'd?


----------



## Inks

Well I do have hopes for Sleek now, seeing as how they moved the manufacturing back to the States. What I'm not so sure about is the pricing....


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I don't actually think that's quite accurate.  He scores the Monster Gold, MD's, Radius DDMs, SM3, 530 highly.  Those are all warm and not paragons of brightness.  Don't forget, it was the SM3 that caused him to readjust his scale.  I for one think he does a great job not over emphasizing FR in his scoring.  Oh well.


 


  oh he does, as do many but for me having read lots and lots of reviews i know that we all value certain aspects more than others.  this is why there has never and will never, be 1 IEM to rule them all.  there is the Top Tier which in theory everyone agrees belong at that top table but  i wouldnt ever say the 530 is better than the TF10 or the TF10 is better than the IE8.  at the level they all operate its all about what it is you are looking for and where your tastes lie.  there is no "the best" and i wouldnt say any were better, just different.
   
  ie what i mean is once you get to the good stuff no one should be looking at numbers, its silly.  like arguing car X is better than car Y because it goes 196mph and X can only do 195.


----------



## Inks

Right on, this is isn't a perfect science (specially the sq-ratings). This should be looked at as a guide rather than thinking this is Joker's attempt at trying to condense the IEM world into an absolute hierarchy. Joker does the best he could do, but he is going to value certain aspects more than others. This applies to any other reviewer, so it's just a fact one has to accept. Nevertheless, Joker is easily one of the best at trying to be impartial regardless of the inevitable. 


mark2410 said:


> oh he does, as do many but for me having read lots and lots of reviews i know that we all value certain aspects more than others.  this is why there has never and will never, be 1 IEM to rule them all.  there is the Top Tier which in theory everyone agrees belong at that top table but  i wouldnt ever say the 530 is better than the TF10 or the TF10 is better than the IE8.  at the level they all operate its all about what it is you are looking for and where your tastes lie.  there is no "the best" and i wouldnt say any were better, just different.
> 
> ie what i mean is once you get to the good stuff no one should be looking at numbers, its silly.  like arguing car X is better than car Y because it goes 196mph and X can only do 195.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





kunlun said:


> w-whut happen'd?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


>


 
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


>


 

  
  Agreed.  It's all about finding 'your sound' as Nikongod put it.  No measurement or review can replace what you hear individually.  They are support tools for your ears and brain.


----------



## ljokerl

If anyone is interested in a loan of the DDM2/TWF21 for review, shoot me a PM. Active members with positive feedback only please.


----------



## kostalex

Update:  *Dunu DN-13 Crius* added.  
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C38) Dunu DN-13 Crius*
> 
> 
> Reviewed June 2011
> ...


 

*Joker*, may I suggest you to post updates like I shown above? This way we may read them in the end of the thread. Original post is too big for mobiles and even my laptop struggles with it.


----------



## KainTFM

Hey everyone.  Extremely new to these forums, and by new I mean "First discovered less than a week ago while researching IEMs"
   
  Anyway, thanks to the massive wealth of information here, I was able to make an informed decision within my price range.  I purchased a set of MEElectronics CC51s from Amazon based on what I read here, coupled with the much lower price I found at Amazon.
   
  My reason for posting is I thought that Joker may want to revisit the "value" rating for the MEElectronics CC51, since his original assessment was based on a price range of $79.99 to $89.99, while they can currently be found on Amazon with a price range of $49.99 to $54.99.  I likely would have looked elsewhere, possibly the Brainwavez M1 or M2, were it not for the drastic (and happy) price reduction I found on Amazon for the CC51s.  If they were a 9.0 out of 10 value at $80, I can only imagine what they would be at $50!
   
  Thanks again for compiling this informative list.


----------



## Niyologist

It's at the MSRP. So therefore, the lowered price will not count, but although the score probably would've been a 10/10 at $49.99.


----------



## Shufny

Quote:


  Street price changes a lot, especially on amazon. Ha can't track all of them. Probably gonna go back up soon anyway. Plus, that's US only. And as discussed on the last pages: Score doesn't really metter.

 Ety HFs are keep changing between 100-130 too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kostalex said:


> *Joker*, may I suggest you to post updates like I shown above? This way we may read them in the end of the thread. Original post is too big for mobiles and even my laptop struggles with it.


 

 Good idea. It's an extra step but I'll definitely try to remember to do it next time.
   


  Quote: 





kaintfm said:


> Hey everyone.  Extremely new to these forums, and by new I mean "First discovered less than a week ago while researching IEMs"
> 
> Anyway, thanks to the massive wealth of information here, I was able to make an informed decision within my price range.  I purchased a set of MEElectronics CC51s from Amazon based on what I read here, coupled with the much lower price I found at Amazon.
> 
> ...


 

 Glad the thread has been useful. As for the value score and the actual pricing mentioned in the review/table, Shufny is right - I've ran into issues before when the review was posted during what everyone thought was a permanent price drop, then the price went up and I had to move things around and even re-write some bits. I try to keep it closer to the MSRP now. I also think 9/10 might be the value cap for the CC51 with that cable and its other quirks since the 9.5-10.0 range is reserved for 'outstanding/best-in-class' as per the chart in post #1. The A151 could definitely move up to a 10/10 if the price on that dropped to $40-50 since that has no real flaws.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good idea. It's an extra step but I'll definitely try to remember to do it next time.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  talking about that. what score would you give to re262 with the $150 price they have now?


----------



## carfentanil

I agree. While "objective comparison" may point a listener in the right direction, it's the subjective "experience" that should be the deciding factor. What about durability, etc. ? Experience is a good measure of things other than sound signature, too. It should always be about enjoying your own music as much as possible...
  
  Quote: 





lazysleepyboi said:


> remember, this is what joker thinks, not what the rest of us thinks. This is what he perceives, not what you perceive. Sometimes people will have the same impression for IEMs and other times not. Like most people say on this forum, "to each his own". Joker has done enough IEM reviews to know why he ranks things the way he does, and he knows how to tell good IEMs from bad IEMs. A score of 9 or 10 does not mean perfection, it means that it does a lot of things well and that joker liked the experience. I'm pretty sure he explains this in his opening statements, but for the most part, this is his opinion of these IEMs. Don't take it too seriously because what this provides for other people is a reference. Some people will agree and some other people like you will disagree, this forum is mostly opinion based


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> talking about that. what score would you give to re262 with the $150 price they have now?


 
   
  A higher one than now but below the GR07 still since the GR07 gets the build and fit more right than the RE262.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> GR07 gets the build and fit more right than the RE262.


 

 More right?  That's an understatement.  Holy hell if the GR07 isn't one of the best designed IEMs ever.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  If only it sounded more like the new Sonys.  Ironic they are using the old Sony bio-cellulose technology.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> ie what i mean is once you get to the good stuff no one should be looking at numbers, its silly.  like arguing car X is better than car Y because it goes 196mph and X can only do 195.


 

 Think about it. If you drop the numbers, we would have to actually read the reviews to get worked up.


----------



## fanmo

Hello. Someone in the iem help thread suggested I try my luck in this thread.

 My Fischer Audio Eternas (v1) are about to die on me. I love these so much that I was initially thinking of buying a new pair for roughly £45. Then I thought maybe I could try something similar but better by stretching my budget to £60-70. What I had in mind was the Sennheiser IE6, Sony EX510 or the Meelec CC51. However I love the eternas' signature (great bass, soundstage, forward vocals, musicality) so much that I'm not sure something else could live up to them.

 Any help or suggestions would be more than welcome. Cheers!


----------



## DannyBai

Try the Dunu Trident.  IMO they compare well but the Trident is not as thick sounding and slight more sparkle.  They only cost little over $50 and very fun earphone.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> More right?  That's an understatement.  Holy hell if the GR07 isn't one of the best designed IEMs ever.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Wait.... you mean the RE262 has the same driver material as the E888?


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Wait.... you mean the RE262 has the same driver material as the E888?


 


  No, the GR07 does.  Pretty sure the RE262 uses some sort of titanium in the driver.


----------



## kiteki

Sigh, I just read the review, the description sounds very similiar to the E888, except less coloured and more balanced, in a sturdy IEM housing, that sounds pretty damn interesting, yet another IEM I have to buy (sigh) haha.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fanmo said:


> Hello. Someone in the iem help thread suggested I try my luck in this thread.
> 
> My Fischer Audio Eternas (v1) are about to die on me. I love these so much that I was initially thinking of buying a new pair for roughly £45. Then I thought maybe I could try something similar but better by stretching my budget to £60-70. What I had in mind was the Sennheiser IE6, Sony EX510 or the Meelec CC51. However I love the eternas' signature (great bass, soundstage, forward vocals, musicality) so much that I'm not sure something else could live up to them.
> 
> Any help or suggestions would be more than welcome. Cheers!


 


  The CC51 is a lot more balanced than the Eterna (less bass, more mids & treble) and I've never heard the EX510. The IE6 should be up your alley, as well as some of the new Xears models (TD-III and Nature N3i especially).


----------



## lazysleepyboi

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Sigh, I just read the review, the description sounds very similiar to the E888, except less coloured and more balanced, in a sturdy IEM housing, that sounds pretty damn interesting, yet another IEM I have to buy (sigh) haha.


 


  seriously.....every time joker says something has value and says that something is balanced and natural, i feel like jumping to go buy it. But jokes on you joker! i have no money in the bank for it! muhahaha wait, who gets the final laugh.......


----------



## kiteki

^Actually if I buy the GR07 then I'll just want to hear the liquid crystal in the EX600 after that, it just never ends, Lol, oh well, ER-4P on the way, time to stop reading. Ciao. =)


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





fanmo said:


> Hello. Someone in the iem help thread suggested I try my luck in this thread.
> 
> My Fischer Audio Eternas (v1) are about to die on me. I love these so much that I was initially thinking of buying a new pair for roughly £45. Then I thought maybe I could try something similar but better by stretching my budget to £60-70. What I had in mind was the Sennheiser IE6, Sony EX510 or the Meelec CC51. However I love the eternas' signature (great bass, soundstage, forward vocals, musicality) so much that I'm not sure something else could live up to them.
> 
> Any help or suggestions would be more than welcome. Cheers!


 


  Buy it over again nothing can replace the Eterna. 
   
  It serves as a outstanding back up phone due to build quality ,isolation and comfront.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





confispect said:


> Buy it over again nothing can replace the Eterna.
> It serves as a outstanding back up phone due to build quality ,isolation and comfront.


 


  Oh I think the IE6 has it beat in build quality and comfort. I find its fit more versatile than that of the IE7 and IE8. It's just overpriced here in the states which is why it's rarely mentioned.


----------



## Confispect

Hmmm,
   
  They do look quite comfortable.
   
  I really couldn't' imagine getting more comfortable then the Eterna unless I go custom.
   
  They just slide ride in.


----------



## battleaxe

I didn't see the* Beyerdynamic DTX 71 iE on Amazon *but the DTX 100, 80, and 60 did come up instead and all of them are going for under $60 right now. I take it* these are the older models, *but not sure/clear if these are any good, because your review of the DTX71 did catch my eye, and I may be what I am looking for.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> I didn't see the* Beyerdynamic DTX 71 iE on Amazon *but the DTX 100, 80, and 60 did come up instead and all of them are going for under $60 right now. I take it* these are the older models, *but not sure/clear if these are any good, because your review of the DTX71 did catch my eye, and I may be what I am looking for.


 


  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/537625/more-color-superb-sound-three-new-in-ear-headphones-from-beyerdynamic-dtx-71-ie-dtx-101-ie-and-mmx-101-ie/30#post_7268536


----------



## fanmo

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The CC51 is a lot more balanced than the Eterna (less bass, more mids & treble) and I've never heard the EX510. The IE6 should be up your alley, as well as some of the new Xears models (TD-III and Nature N3i especially).


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Oh I think the IE6 has it beat in build quality and comfort. I find its fit more versatile than that of the IE7 and IE8. It's just overpriced here in the states which is why it's rarely mentioned.


 

  Thank you so much |joker|! I believe I am pretty much sold on the IE6 now. If I may ask, how would the sound compare between the Eternas and the IE6? Would it qualify as an upgrade?


----------



## Angelopsaro

joker have thought of reviewing the first attempt of cowon to enter the iem market?
Exportprive seems to have them in 70% offer for a long time now. I heart they add them as a gift in some orders so they might be positive to send you a pair for review.


----------



## ljokerl

Didn't realize the link to the downloadable table on the front page wasn't working. Fixed it now.
   
  Quote: 





fanmo said:


> Thank you so much |joker|! I believe I am pretty much sold on the IE6 now. If I may ask, how would the sound compare between the Eternas and the IE6? Would it qualify as an upgrade?


 

 The IE6 is a little warmer with the bass affecting the midrange more than that of the Eterna. It also isn't quite as impactful, though it's not lacking bass by any means. Mids and treble should be pretty comparable otherwise with the IE6 maybe having a slight clarity edge and a bit more top-end extension. I wouldn't call it a full-fledged upgrade from the Eterna and can't really justify the $60 price difference between the two here in the US. 
   


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> joker have thought of reviewing the first attempt of cowon to enter the iem market?
> Exportprive seems to have them in 70% offer for a long time now. I heart they add them as a gift in some orders so they might be positive to send you a pair for review.


 
   
  $10? Asking for a free sample at $10 is almost humorous. I don't have the time, anyway, unless someone comes out saying they beat the RE0 (or the realvoice or FX67 or whatever the top dog IEM under $150 is nowadays).


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> $10? Asking for a free sample at $10 is almost humorous. I don't have the time, anyway, unless someone comes out saying they beat the RE0 (or the realvoice or FX67 or whatever the top dog IEM under $150 is nowadays).


 

 Heh just popped an idea 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 in case you look for new iems to add in your threat.
   
  Btw i was always wondering how can you, clieos and other guys who have tested so many iems remember how they sound.? You tested eterna before 1 year? after that you tested at least 50 more iems and you can still comment in a detail way about its signature.


----------



## kanuka

i doubt they can even match the M9


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i doubt they can even match the M9


 

 You never know.
  I saw their specs and for a 30$ pair of earphones they have two some like innovations that might make them stand out of their price contenders. It has the common air hole for improving bass and somthing claimed like air ducts.
  It also has double filter.
   
  All these might be useless but you never know if you dont try


----------



## lazysleepyboi

hey joker, are you almost done with the UM miracle review? I'm interested in knowing what you think about them, I've read your first impressions, and that only drew me in more......


----------



## kanuka

wasnt it $10?? if it's $30 that's another story...


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> wasnt it $10?? if it's $30 that's another story...


 


  amazon has them for 24$ retail price is 30$ and i mention a deal of 10$


----------



## fanmo

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The IE6 is a little warmer with the bass affecting the midrange more than that of the Eterna. It also isn't quite as impactful, though it's not lacking bass by any means. Mids and treble should be pretty comparable otherwise with the IE6 maybe having a slight clarity edge and a bit more top-end extension. I wouldn't call it a full-fledged upgrade from the Eterna and can't really justify the $60 price difference between the two here in the US.


 
  Thanks again. That's a shame. I was hoping the extra cash would get me a nice upgrade. I am slightly hesitant in going ahead with the IE6 now. But I believe they come closest to what I am looking for to replace the Eternas, being similar yet better built. I hope I can find a good deal.
   
  The Xears TD-III look tempting but at 80euros on xears.com, that seems a bit steep compared to the 42euros MSRP at the time of your review. 
   
  On a final side note, I love my PL30s, especiall because of the soundstage. I just wish they had more bass. Would something like the A151 perhaps be a nice upgrade?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> amazon has them for 24$ retail price is 30$ and i mention a deal of 10$


 

 ups! my bad!  then , looking fwd for a review


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Btw i was always wondering how can you, clieos and other guys who have tested so many iems remember how they sound.? You tested eterna before 1 year? after that you tested at least 50 more iems and you can still comment in a detail way about its signature.


 

 I still own the Eterna and it happens to be one of my heavy bass benchmarks so I use it fairly often. Normally I'd have to go back and look at my notes or at least the finished review to answer a question like that.


  Quote: 





lazysleepyboi said:


> hey joker, are you almost done with the UM miracle review? I'm interested in knowing what you think about them, I've read your first impressions, and that only drew me in more......


 

 Working on it but of course finishing the review is only half the story as the thread will need to be re-scaled to accommodate the Miracle. 
   


  Quote: 





fanmo said:


> The Xears TD-III look tempting but at 80euros on xears.com, that seems a bit steep compared to the 42euros MSRP at the time of your review.
> On a final side note, I love my PL30s, especiall because of the soundstage. I just wish they had more bass. Would something like the A151 perhaps be a nice upgrade?


 


  A151 does not have a lot more bass than the PL30, nor does it sound as open. IE6, TD-III, Nature N3i, ECCI PR401, Phiaton PS20 would probably match what you're looking for better than the A151. Also, I think the coupon code for the Xears site "KLANGFUZZIS" (or something like that) still works.


----------



## lazysleepyboi

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I still own the Eterna and it happens to be one of my heavy bass benchmarks so I use it fairly often. Normally I'd have to go back and look at my notes or at least the finished review to answer a question like that.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  wow, guess the miracle blew the scale out........that's pretty cool


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/537625/more-color-superb-sound-three-new-in-ear-headphones-from-beyerdynamic-dtx-71-ie-dtx-101-ie-and-mmx-101-ie/30#post_7268536


 

 Thanks. Do you, or anyone know if there is a difference in build quality, and accessories?


----------



## iXpertMan

Hey!
  Just want to know if anyone can explain me the difference between Westone in-ear monitors, in particular Westone 2 and UM2?
  I searched this and other forums and websites but still can't find a definite answer. I read the review for UM3X and Westone 3 (probably similar differences) but still can't understand it. The UM series is older as far as I know, so why would you buy it if there is a newer version which seems to be the same if not better.
  I assume the Westone series (1, 2...) are smaller... but what's the difference in sound? Are the UM series for Audiophiles and Professionals so they have a more flat performance, but then why would you buy something different if a flat reproduction is the key (if it is not it is worse).
  Please Help.


----------



## Niyologist

Let's just say that the main difference between the Westone 2 (Older) Vs. UM2 (Newer) is that it's slightly more improved in performance of treble and especially midrange . The Westone 3 (Older) and UMX 3 (Newer) is basically an improvement in bass and slightly more improved in the rest of the frequency. I guess that means the UMX 4 might be the Ultimate IEM if the Build Quality and Sound Quality are crafted correctly.


----------



## Niyologist

I was at B & H today and I saw the Monster Turbine Pro Copper and Westone 4 up close. So coooool! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I post some pics by this weekend when I'm done exploring B & H.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> Thanks. Do you, or anyone know if there is a difference in build quality, and accessories?


 

 You can probably pull the accessory lists of Beyer's site. I doubt the build quality differs but there were a few reviews of the DTX80/100 you could use to double-check.

  
  Quote: 





ixpertman said:


> Hey!
> Just want to know if anyone can explain me the difference between Westone in-ear monitors, in particular Westone 2 and UM2?
> I searched this and other forums and websites but still can't find a definite answer. I read the review for UM3X and Westone 3 (probably similar differences) but still can't understand it. The UM series is older as far as I know, so why would you buy it if there is a newer version which seems to be the same if not better.
> I assume the Westone series (1, 2...) are smaller... but what's the difference in sound? Are the UM series for Audiophiles and Professionals so they have a more flat performance, but then why would you buy something different if a flat reproduction is the key (if it is not it is worse).
> Please Help.


 

 The W3 and UM3X sound nothing alike. Generally, there are different sound ideals for stage monitors and consumer-class models. The W3 would make a terrible stage monitor, as would many of the other high-end in-ear sets on the market. A lot of consumer-class sets are pretty colored-sounding, even in the top price bracket. Is flat better? For monitoring - probably. For the average music fan listening to top 40 on an iPad - who's to say? For how the W2 and UM2 differ specifically, you'll have to get hold of someone who has heard both.


----------



## kanuka

hey joker
  what are the "aftermarket" tips you mention in the DBA-02 isolation score? and where can i buy them?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker
> what are the "aftermarket" tips you mention in the DBA-02 isolation score? and where can i buy them?


 


  Etymotic triples. They're mentioned in the 'tips' section under the 'specifications' bit.


----------



## victorbrt

Joker, i'm feeling a harshiness on the sound of cymbals with ECCI PR401. It's normal because of the mild V shaped sound signature or is probally that I don't have a good fit? This harshness is really annoying in some songs, especially in metal.
   
  I'm thinking in give a try on the Sony Hybrids smallers ones because I fell that the ECCI don't go deep on my ear.
   
*EDIT: *I tried to remove the Sony Hybrid on ECCI, no sucess. It seems that is more hard than putting. Do you have any method or tip? I just trying to remove the tip with my finger on the nozzle area (the tip is inverted by me).
   
*EDIT2:* I get it. Removed the medium one (green) and put the smaller one (orange). I don't see any difference between the two.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Spider realvoice and Fischer Audio Daleth
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B26) Fischer Audio Daleth*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jun 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C39) Spider Realvoice*
> 
> 
> Reviewed June 2011
> ...


 




  Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Joker, i'm feeling a harshiness on the sound of cymbals with ECCI PR401. It's normal because of the mild V shaped sound signature or is probally that I don't have a good fit? This harshness is really annoying in some songs, especially in metal.
> 
> I'm thinking in give a try on the Sony Hybrids smallers ones because I fell that the ECCI don't go deep on my ear.


 


  Probably a little of both. How many hours are on your PR401s?


----------



## rolz

very cool thread joker 
   
  can you do a review on the sunrise xcape impressive edition and the sony ex600?
   
  thanks!


----------



## Inks

No requests, he can only review what is loaned or given to him. Look at the upcoming IEM list, the IE is there.


----------



## rolz

on second thought, i think he already did a full review on the IE but it's not added to this thread and the average list yet


----------



## Anaxilus

Thanks for the new review postings.  Much more consumer friendly this way.


----------



## murano

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Spider realvoice and Fischer Audio Daleth


 

  Kind of curious, did you keep the Spiders or send them back?
   
  I'm surprised you wore them cable up.  I'm concerned that I'll break them since cable up seems to put a lot of strain were the cable attaches to the end of the spine, even though my ears are on the large size.


----------



## ronrad

Joker, thanks for the great work! 
   
  At any rate, I just received my UM Miracles, which I purchased more on instinct than anything else.  I have to say that for me I'm blown away by them.   I like their sound better than anything I've heard before, including my T1 and AD2k.  At any rate, I made a big leap from the HF3 to the Miracles, and while I'm super happy with the Miracles, the thread about whether high end customs are worth it has me wondering whether it would be fun to review a higher end universal in comparison.
   
  Earlier on you mentioned the TWF21 as being up for loan, and given that I don't real feel like shelling out a bunch of cash when I already have something fantastic, I thought that might be a cool opportunity to do a comparison with little cash outlay.  Question for you is that loaner option still available, and do you think that is high enough the spectrum or should I try something like the Westone 4?


----------



## FlySweep

I'm enjoying the spider's quite a bit too.. they're some of the most comfortable IEMs I've worn, but as joker said, they're not idea for active use.  My only gripe with them is that they tend to be a little _too_ smooth sounding for my taste.. the details get lost in that liquid presentation.


----------



## kanuka

hey joker
   
  what iem/s would you suggest for:
   
  detail and fun in general
  detailed vocals (more on female)
  sparkling higs
  decent quality bass impact
   
  high isolation for daily travel/noise places 
  and comfort for long use
  wearing style doesnt really matter
   
  budgets:
  sub $100 (sub $80 better)
  and sub $200 ( sub $150 if possible)
   
  thanks
   
  btw. do you plan to review the new SoundMagic products?


----------



## alphaman

Not orig.suggestions here by any means but may I further push reviews for Grado GR10 and Sony EX1000?


----------



## esanthosh

Many have tried pushing, but all they get in the end is a re-direction to FAQ in post #8 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I guess no one has loaned ljokerl a GR10. EX-1000 is on the _Planned_ list though.


----------



## swbf2cheater

I really enjoyed the spider realvoice, despite it being very large and a bit cumbersome it retained very good marks across the board.  The balanced 3.5mm jack causes some problems with amps that are not supposed to be used with balanced plugs, like my Fiio E9.  
   
  When I plug the realvoice into the E9, its warped and almost mono sounding.  Sometimes when I plug it into my E11, its also warped and mono-ish but the fix seems to eject it from the amp and plug it directly into my sansa fuze's 3.5mm jack, then plug it back into the amp and they work perfectly.  Thats weird and I don't know if its a good thing or a bad thing.  The E11 doesn't always do this, most of the time it plays the realvoice perfectly.  But there have been more than a few times that I have left the realvoice in the e11 and came back later and turned everything on where it did not work and gave that same mono type warped sound, which was quickly fixed again by just unplugging it from the amp, connecting it to my fuze, then plugging it back into the e11
   
  It never works for the E9.  I really can't explain this in the slightest, as I don't really know much about it but i am assuming its the balanced 3.5mm adapter on the realvoice.  But...its very odd this happens with some amps, i did test other amps and found some to work with the balanced jack, but also a few that do not


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cliffroyroycole said:


> Excellent take on the Spiders. I don't have any of the competitors you mention, but I believe you captured what I like best about the Spiders (prefer calling them Spiders to realvoices, not a fan of the latter name).


 

 That'll be a problem when they release more models 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Thanks for the new review postings.  Much more consumer friendly this way.


 

 All credit for that idea goes to kostalex

  
  Quote: 





murano said:


> Kind of curious, did you keep the Spiders or send them back?
> 
> I'm surprised you wore them cable up.  I'm concerned that I'll break them since cable up seems to put a lot of strain were the cable attaches to the end of the spine, even though my ears are on the large size.


 

 Not sure. I'd have to dump one of my other $60-100 benchmarks to keep the realvoice around because A:Bing more than half a dozen sets every time something new comes along is time-consuming. Current comparison sets in that price range include the Brainwavz M2, Eterna, CC51, Xcape v1, Xcape IE, RE-ZERO, and Xears TD-III.
   
  As for the wear style, the boldfaced one is what I prefer, which is cable down. I was simply acknowledging that it is possible to wear them cord-up.


  Quote: 





ronrad said:


> Joker, thanks for the great work!
> 
> At any rate, I just received my UM Miracles, which I purchased more on instinct than anything else.  I have to say that for me I'm blown away by them.   I like their sound better than anything I've heard before, including my T1 and AD2k.  At any rate, I made a big leap from the HF3 to the Miracles, and while I'm super happy with the Miracles, the thread about whether high end customs are worth it has me wondering whether it would be fun to review a higher end universal in comparison.
> 
> Earlier on you mentioned the TWF21 as being up for loan, and given that I don't real feel like shelling out a bunch of cash when I already have something fantastic, I thought that might be a cool opportunity to do a comparison with little cash outlay.  Question for you is that loaner option still available, and do you think that is high enough the spectrum or should I try something like the Westone 4?


 

 The TWF21 is on its way to India but it'll be back.. eventually. Even a high-end dynamic will be a very different experience from the miracle. IMO the Miracle slaughters it in almost every way. Signature differences only act to emphasize SQ differences in this case so moving to the W4 would be far less shocking. Of course moving from the Miracle back down to a universal, maybe shocking is what you want. Oh and those who think high-end IEMs are overrated have either never tried a good one or have a poor grasp of diminishing returns.
   


  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> I'm enjoying the spider's quite a bit too.. they're some of the most comfortable IEMs I've worn, but as joker said, they're not idea for active use.  My only gripe with them is that they tend to be a little _too_ smooth sounding for my taste.. the details get lost in that liquid presentation.


 

  Yeah, there's probably a dozen IEMs in the <$100 range that have the realvoice beat on detail. In fact, it really doesn't push any technical boundaries but still somehow works well as a whole.
   


  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kanuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> detail and fun in general
> ...


 
   
  That's a pretty long list of list of requirements and long-term comfort is a personal thing, really. Anyway, I'd look at Fischer Silver Bullet, MEE CC51, GR07, used e-Q5 maybe. 

 Did I forget to add the Sondmagic stuff to the to-do list?

  
  Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> I really enjoyed the spider realvoice, despite it being very large and a bit cumbersome it retained very good marks across the board.  The balanced 3.5mm jack causes some problems with amps that are not supposed to be used with balanced plugs, like my Fiio E9.


 


  The realvoice is not actually balanced. The TRRS plug is only used to accommodate the mic/remote pin and yes, that does cause issues with some devices. I've only kept gear that accepts TRRS jacks because the alternative is quite frustrating considering how many apple-ready IEMs I go through.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's a pretty long list of list of requirements and long-term comfort is a personal thing, really. Anyway, I'd look at Fischer Silver Bullet, MEE CC51, GR07, used e-Q5 maybe.
> 
> Did I forget to add the Sondmagic stuff to the to-do list?


 

 sorry. forgot about that list. as it appears in the end i never check it.


----------



## ronrad

Ok, I totally get your comments in the thread about messing up the testing of other phones by listening to the Miracle.  I just put on my ESW10jpns for the first time since getting the Miracles, and they just seemed dull and lifeless!  And this is a phone that I have usually loved)   As I said in the first post, given that these things (Miracles) are awesome and I'm completely happy with them, I don't feel the need to spend money on a universal to test out whether I made the right choice, it was more of a curiosity to see how close they are, so I'll probably look to try some loaners or to check out some higher end universals at a meet.  That said, oddly enough, I didn't find the transition to the HF3s as shocking as the transition to my ESW10s, even though in general I prefer the ESW10s to the HF3s in overall sound
   


> The TWF21 is on its way to India but it'll be back.. eventually. Even a high-end dynamic will be a very different experience from the miracle. IMO the Miracle slaughters it in almost every way. Signature differences only act to emphasize SQ differences in this case so moving to the W4 would be far less shocking. Of course moving from the Miracle back down to a universal, maybe shocking is what you want. Oh and those who think high-end IEMs are overrated have either never tried a good one or have a poor grasp of diminishing returns.


----------



## Niyologist

I took a picture of the Shure SE535. It's the box of it (of course). As I said, I'll post the pics this weekend.


----------



## fanmo

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> A151 does not have a lot more bass than the PL30, nor does it sound as open. IE6, TD-III, Nature N3i, ECCI PR401, Phiaton PS20 would probably match what you're looking for better than the A151. Also, I think the coupon code for the Xears site "KLANGFUZZIS" (or something like that) still works.


 

 Hey Joker. Thought I'd let you know that I finally pulled the trigger on the TD-III V2 using the coupon. Thank you! At that price it was a steal. I see that you own a pair yourself and am a bit scared because of driver fllex and build quality, so could you maybe reassure me on that?
   
  Also, since I managed to get the TD-III for so cheap, I had some spare cash left that I decided to splurge on the A151 because I really wanted to try a BA (and get something different for my collection) and ClieOS said they'd make a good entry-level BA


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fanmo said:


> Quote:
> 
> Hey Joker. Thought I'd let you know that I finally pulled the trigger on the TD-III V2 using the coupon. Thank you! At that price it was a steal. I see that you own a pair yourself and am a bit scared because of driver fllex and build quality, so could you maybe reassure me on that?
> 
> Also, since I managed to get the TD-III for so cheap, I had some spare cash left that I decided to splurge on the A151 because I really wanted to try a BA (and get something different for my collection) and ClieOS said they'd make a good entry-level BA


 
   
  Not really-  you just have to be a bit careful with the TD-III like all Xears stuff. The proper insertion procedure is to pull at the top of your ear to equalize the pressure when you put them in. Takes a bit of practice but I had no trouble using them on the go. Of course the A151 is much more user-friendly so you'll have that going for you as well. Plus those two probably couldn't sound more different, which is always nice,


----------



## kanuka

hey joker
   
  your planned list means that you havent even listen to those ? or is it like the in progress , but just in the beginning?


----------



## ljokerl

I can't keep away from new earphones once I receive them so it's safe to say I've listened to everything on that list at least once. After that most go on the shelf until I have time to burn them in and do the actual review.
  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> your planned list means that you havent even listen to those ? or is it like the in progress , but just in the beginning?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I can't keep away from new earphones once I receive them so it's safe to say I've listened to everything on that list at least once. After that most go on the shelf until I have time to burn them in and do the actual review.


 

 so, is it ok to ask you non-SQ-wise questions about those ones, like comfort and isolation and build-quality?


----------



## ljokerl

If it's something I can figure out from using the earphones once or twice - sure.
  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> so, is it ok to ask you non-SQ-wise questions about those ones, like comfort and isolation and build-quality?


----------



## rawrster

Mike, I'm a bit curious but do you have any plans for the Phonak Perfect Bass? I've been thinking of getting a budget universal iem not counting my Brainwavz M2 which I don't use for music and these do sound interesting.


----------



## goodvibes

Nice review on the Realvoice. I think you really got the essence of them. Better than their component sonic parts and something you know will just sound good every time you pick it up. That it can be very slightly back in the very upper mid/lower treble and not sound like it's missing much is an accomplishment. Makes them a bit smooth but not in a bad way depending on perspective. Thanks again for the contributions.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Mike, I'm a bit curious but do you have any plans for the Phonak Perfect Bass? I've been thinking of getting a budget universal iem not counting my Brainwavz M2 which I don't use for music and these do sound interesting.


 

  I'll probably be reviewing the PB at some point but I don't even have them in my possession yet so it's still a ways off.

  
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> Nice review on the Realvoice. I think you really got the essence of them. Better than their component sonic parts and something you know will just sound good every time you pick it up. That it can be very slightly back in the very upper mid/lower treble and not sound like it's missing much is an accomplishment. Makes them a bit smooth but not in a bad way depending on perspective. Thanks again for the contributions.


 

 Thanks


----------



## onetonnoodle

joker can you throw me some advice? i'm deciding between gr07 and the hippo vb, but i'm leaning towards the gr07.
   
  My main concern is if the bass of the gr07 wouldn't suffice my needs, hence my other preferred option, the hippo vb. Any insight would be helpful. 
   
  I'm coming from an mee m6 and a cx500. I like that my m6 is more clear and refined than my cx500, but I feel it lacks in the bass department. I'm hoping that the gr07 would be near or hopefully not far from the bass quantity that my cx500 has.
   
  Btw, thanks for your extensive multi-iem review, it's really a big big help to budding audiophiles like me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





onetonnoodle said:


> joker can you throw me some advice? i'm deciding between gr07 and the hippo vb, but i'm leaning towards the gr07.
> 
> My main concern is if the bass of the gr07 wouldn't suffice my needs, hence my other preferred option, the hippo vb. Any insight would be helpful.
> 
> ...


 


  Doesn't the lack of current availability for the VB pretty much rule in the GR07's favor? GR07 bass is a little less than the M6 assuming your M6 is well-fitted (it really is bassy when fitted properly but many seem to have trouble with that). Not sure what the CX500 sounds like but the CX300 has a huge mid-bass lift. The VB has a different bass curve (more sub-bass than mid-bass). For a more sennheiser-like bass curve with better availability than the VB there are a bunch of other options - Fischer Eterna, Beyer DTX 101 iE, Xears TD-III / N3i, Nuforce NE-700X, and even the Radius DDM at the GR07 price point.


----------



## esanthosh

Actually, Hippo VB is back in stock - http://jaben.net/forums/index.php?topic=20031.msg301184  (http://jaben.net/shopping2/Hippo_VB.html)


----------



## onetonnoodle

thanks for your advice joker! it definitely cleared up my concerns.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  looks like gr07 is not going to satisfy me on the low end. The radius ddm looks interesting, i'll try looking for a seller that ships free. If there's none, i guess i'll just go for the vb in the mean time.
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## germanturkey

Joker, is there anything considered the poor man's RE0?  i'm shopping around for a friend based on his preferences.  Thanks for the help.
   
  also, how are those Miracles treating you?  I don't want to rush you, but how's the review coming on those?


----------



## AstralStorm

RE0 is cheap, can't go cheaper and keep its qualities unfortunately. It's one of a kind in its price range in my humble opinion.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Actually, Hippo VB is back in stock - http://jaben.net/forums/index.php?topic=20031.msg301184  (http://jaben.net/shopping2/Hippo_VB.html)


 

 That's good to know - thanks!
   


  Quote: 





germanturkey said:


> Joker, is there anything considered the poor man's RE0?  i'm shopping around for a friend based on his preferences.  Thanks for the help.
> 
> also, how are those Miracles treating you?  I don't want to rush you, but how's the review coming on those?


 

 The RE0 is already a very high performer at its price point. It is possible to get something clear and balanced for less but it won't be nearly as refined or technically proficient overall. For a slightly warm/thick but still well-balanced sound there's the Brainwavz M1. For more clarity and a brighter voicing, the JVC FXC80, Hippo Shroom, and RE2. For a more neutral coloration, maybe the MEElec CX21, Maximo iM-590, or even Xears XR120ProII.


----------



## Shufny

I think the RE0's key attributes are it's technical capability, and lack of subbass. The first one isn't really transferable, because if something would be as capable as the RE0, it would be as good as the RE0. And why would anyone want the second one?


----------



## garysohn

It has been said the REO has what I _guess we could call quality control problems or perhaps poor design, but whatever.   I didn't have mine thirty days before one channel went dead.  _But I had them long enough to hear what I will simply call that "special sound". I really like them.  So if I buy the other models, Zero,  252, 262; how do they compare for durability and having that "special sound"?  I have to have that. Mine have been returned for warranty, but I am going to need a backup.  I have to have "that sound".  Do you understand?  See, I am starting to get surly without my REOs. I apologize. Humbly.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





garysohn said:


> It has been said the REO has what I _guess we could call quality control problems or perhaps poor design, but whatever.   I didn't have mine thirty days before one channel went dead.  _But I had them long enough to hear what I will simply call that "special sound". I really like them.  So if I buy the other models, Zero,  252, 262; how do they compare for durability and having that "special sound"?  I have to have that. Mine have been returned for warranty, but I am going to need a backup.  I have to have "that sound".  Do you understand?  See, I am starting to get surly without my REOs. I apologize. Humbly.


 


  There seems to be fewer issues with the newer models but that could just be due to the lower total number sold. Once you sell hundreds of something there are bound to be some issues. I've owned every HiFiMan IEM except for the RE1 and haven't run into any problems. As for the 'special sound', that really means different things to different people. I think both the RE252 and RE262 are fantastic earphones in their own right but both stray a bit from the RE0 signature, the RE252 towards even better balance and the RE262 towards a warmer, sweeter sound. If you like clear-and-detailed you could also look at the Ety HF- and ER-, Fischer DBA-02. VSonic GR07, ATH-CKM99, etc., etc.


----------



## garysohn

Thank you lJokerl. Yes, special has many meanings, but despite a forty year love affair with high fidelity I don't feel I can adequarely describe what I like using audiophile terms. I'll take a shot and describe it as a liquid (warmth?) midrange with seperation, micro detail, and just generally what I would refer to as a generic "tube" or valve sound.  As a user of SET (currently 1944 RCA 2A3) I recognized what I considered to be a similarity. REO is the SET of IEMs? Well, perhaps to me.  Years ago I had cans known as Koss Pro 4AA. They caused my ears to perspire and were not good for very long listens. I never went back to cans. Only went to IEMs when I bought the EVO4G and then promply went into Walm and bought the best Koss they had. Stumbled across head-fi.org on The Internets, took a flyer on an IEM with a good rep at a fair price and now I am hooked. When the REO were sent to Flushing I took another flyer on Emo MC5. Not to my liking. The triple flange went into my ears too far and now my left ear seems to be earitated for some reason. Probably be fine in a few days. If I have  to choose I will take tone and PRaT over soundstage and extended high end. I don't think I hear over 14kHz anymore.  I do recognize the value of having a deep and tight bass as foundation for music reproduction, mostly classical. To me, the REOs honored the music in the brief time I had them. I am currently investigating desi, Bollywood, Bhangra, or however it is referred to, and the REOs allowed me to acess and have appreciation for this genre. I think from what you say I will purchase 262s.
  I thank you and all posters for sharing your knowledge.  I am sure I will enjoy the 262s.


----------



## kanuka

hey joker. just for reference
   
  what is your isolation score that is suitable for noise-street-travel places?


----------



## Niyologist

Next earphones on my "To Observe" List are:
   
  DUNU Ares
  DUNU Hephaes
  DUNU DN-20 (Coming Soon)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *garysohn* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I thank you and all posters for sharing your knowledge.  I am sure I will enjoy the 262s.


 

 I agree, the RE262 is difficult not to like. Just very agreeable in every way.

  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker. just for reference
> 
> what is your isolation score that is suitable for noise-street-travel places?


 
   
  I would say 3+ is reasonable, 4.5+ is borderline dangerous.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would say 3+ is reasonable, 4.5+ is *borderline dangerous*.


 





 can you explain that? is it good or bad?


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> can you explain that? is it good or bad?


 

 It depends on your environment and how much isolation you want. The earphones I use on my commute would probably be a 4.5-5 on Mike's point system since they are customs. That means isolation is very good and you would not be able to hear your surrounding very well. I am used to that so it's no big deal for me but if you were not it could potentially be dangerous if you are not aware of what is going on around you.


----------



## kanuka

mmm interesting. i dont like customs (at least not yet ready for them) but as i most use iem for bus travel or busy noisy street i want to get a better isolation. i've been using the pl50 they're really ok, but not enough as i can still hear some people conversation and they dont isolate from louder noises.
  from joker's rating they're 3/5
  i hope the B2 (being like the dba02 rated 4/5) will be better
  and besides that i wanted to know for future purchases
  thanks rawrster


----------



## rawrster

The Brainwavz B2 has some of the best isolation in any earphone I've used. You can't get too much better isolation than those with the right tips. Lack of isolation is definitely not a problem with them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> can you explain that? is it good or bad?


 

 It has its uses but when I'm wearing something that isolating outside I always feel that I won't hear a car until it hits me. I stopped wearing my ER4S outside after failing to hear an approaching fire engine.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> The Brainwavz B2 has some of the best isolation in any earphone I've used. You can't get too much better isolation than those with the right tips. Lack of isolation is definitely not a problem with them.


 

 that's great news! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  which tips to you use? the stock ones?
   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It has its uses but when I'm wearing something that isolating outside I always feel that I won't hear a car until it hits me. I stopped wearing my ER4S outside after failing to hear an approaching fire engine.


 

 wow! now i get what you mean by *dangerous*, just be careful! but seems to eliminate completely buses and motorbikes engines. is it just because of the ety's triplets? or does the deep insertion helps (a lot) ?
  thanks for the info


----------



## Shufny

Now that's hardcore man. I got the best isolation with the Xcape v2/IE (with single flanges) but it's nowhere near that level. I was thinking about getting an HF5 for my girlfriend, because her ears are really small, and it has smaller nozzle than the Xcape. So I thought it would be more comfortable for her with the Olives. But I'm not sure if the isolation is really that much better.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> that's great news!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I don't own the B2 but I was part of the loaner program. I used Monster triple flanges with a core of the Shure earphone as a spacer.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> wow! now i get what you mean by *dangerous*, just be careful! but seems to eliminate completely buses and motorbikes engines. is it just because of the ety's triplets? or does the deep insertion helps (a lot) ?  thanks for the info


 

 Deep insertion, well-sealing tips, and a fully sealed driver are all factors.
   


  Quote: 





shufny said:


> Now that's hardcore man. I got the best isolation with the Xcape v2/IE (with single flanges) but it's nowhere near that level. I was thinking about getting an HF5 for my girlfriend, because her ears are really small, and it has smaller nozzle than the Xcape. So I thought it would be more comfortable for her with the Olives. But I'm not sure if the isolation is really that much better.


 

 HF5 isolates significantly more than an Xcape. There are a lot of earphones that have thinner Nozzles than the Xcape - don't necessarily have to go to a deep-seal Ety for that.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I don't own the B2 but I was part of the loaner program. I used Monster triple flanges *with a core of the Shure earphone as a spacer*.


 






'
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




'
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




' what is that???
   
  and isnt the monster's a little big for the B2?
  and where is your B2 review?


----------



## carfentanil

If anyone has checked out my spreadsheet of joker's stats, I'd like to know what your impression or feedback is.... It has become quite exciting considering it's a fun-spare-time-thing...


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> If anyone has checked out my spreadsheet of joker's stats, I'd like to know what your impression or feedback is.... It has become quite exciting considering it's a fun-spare-time-thing...


 


  It really is fun to "play with."  The same 10 or so are pretty much stuck at the top unless you drastically change the sound quality weight haha.
  You did good and I applaud the time you took to type that all out since his table is an image. Glad you froze the top rows haha.
   
  As far as feedback goes:

 I think I noticed when I looked at it a while back that a score or two didn't coincide with joker's table which unless people notice won't be changed and might affect the results, e.g. the VSONIC GR07 value score is 8.0 when it should be 9.5 (I know, transposing numbers is a bitch). Value scores aren't taken into account by default but if someone chooses to, it could result in problem for them if its an IEM they are considering.
 You could maybe format it a bit towards drawing the users eye to the relevant cells, especially for people not used to spreadsheets.
 You can write some VBA code to automatically re-sort the results after any cell changes (i.e. weights). Then again though, people are suspicious when excel warns them against possibly enabling harmful macro's when opening up a file they just downloaded over the internet. Maybe the same can be done through a pivot table but I'm pretty out of touch with them.


----------



## carfentanil

My numbers were drawn from the text reviews after re-re-re-checking the table got to me... I'm not sure how joker updates the visual readout, but sure he's quite busy as is. 

 As for sort, the vba macro issue is a bummer, but if you select the range A6:Mxx where "xx" is the last data row (currently row 182) the sort function sorts by 1.Highest Final Score; 2.Highest Sound Score; 3.Highest Price (assuming quite asininely that higher $ is indication of quality/prestige)
   
  I could zero-weight the VAL column in the master formula to dummy-proof the adjustable weights since VAL is subjective - although I'm more confident of joker's guesses than some people's "facts."

 Making the sheet neat, clean, and linear was my main goal. But then the target users are most likely dataheads.

 tx


----------



## carfentanil

Nice eye for the VSonic number. Whenever I put up an update, prolly next weekend it'll be reflected. No time atm, but I have 177 in the .xlsx and joker says 178 models in thread. I'll fix it next time.
  
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> It really is fun to "play with."  The same 10 or so are pretty much stuck at the top unless you drastically change the sound quality weight haha.
> You did good and I applaud the time you took to type that all out since his table is an image. Glad you froze the top rows haha.
> 
> As far as feedback goes:
> ...


----------



## vwinter

Joker might change a good portion of the data after the UM Miracle review. Should be fun lol.
   
  Good point on the dataheads. I agree with not zero weighting the VAL in the master formula.
   
  I had a bit of free time just now and, having the same mentality as your "fun-spare-time-thing," already wrote the VBA code that autosorts for myself. If anyone wants it, I can upload it.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Listening to the cx21 i really like them and find your impressions really accurate! Actually i like the sound more than brainwavz M1. Its more transparent and clear. I am happy because through decent budget iems i am starting to find my signature.
   
  The cable is also great and finally i saw the so much praised meelec cable.It stays over my ear perfectly. The brainwavz cable seems that doesnt stay over my ear.
   
   
  P.S omg cx21 are bass monsters if you want. They are the only iems that dont distort with cowon j3's x-bass eq. Even if idont like huge bass i like to test my brain from time to time B)


----------



## ljokerl

Added the ECCI PG100 and Skullcandy Holua
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B27) ECCI PG100*
> 
> 
> Reviewed June 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A54) Skullcandy Holua*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jun 2011
> ...


 

  
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> My numbers were drawn from the text reviews after re-re-re-checking the table got to me... *I'm not sure how joker updates the visual readout*, but sure he's quite busy as is.


 

 If you knew, you would laugh at me.
   

  
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> Nice eye for the VSonic number. Whenever I put up an update, prolly next weekend it'll be reflected. No time atm, but I have 177 in the .xlsx and joker says 178 models in thread. I'll fix it next time.


 

  This discrepancy was due to the separate releases of the ViSang R03 and Brainwavz M2. They were released at different times and originally posted as two reviews. Later I combined them together just noting the differences. 
   
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Joker might change a good portion of the data after the UM Miracle review. Should be fun lol.


 
   
  I'll be sure to make the raw data available at that point - there's no sense in anyone else suffering through manually entering 180+ data points.

  
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Listening to the cx21 i really like them and find your impressions really accurate! Actually i like the sound more than brainwavz M1. Its more transparent and clear. I am happy because through decent budget iems i am starting to find my signature.
> 
> The cable is also great and finally i saw the so much praised meelec cable.It stays over my ear perfectly. The brainwavz cable seems that doesnt stay over my ear.
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks. The driver used in the CX21 is indeed very good. The tuning is unusual for a <$40 earphone and will not be to everyone's liking which I guess is why it hasn't gotten too much love around here.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks. The driver used in the CX21 is indeed very good. The tuning is unusual for a <$40 earphone and will not be to everyone's liking which I guess is why it hasn't gotten too much love around here.


 

  
  It extents better in all direction compared to the M1. I found soundstage also more realistic. It might be brain burn, but i should had been the opposite if that was the case.
  Why some wouldnt like this kind of sg?
   
  How would you compare the cable, the comfort and the signature with the vsonic07 in 2 lines.?
  Sorry for you time.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Angelopsaro* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> How would you compare the cable, the comfort and the signature with the vsonic07 in 2 lines.?
> Sorry for you time.


 
   
  GR07 cable is a little stiffer than the MEElec cord but really not bad at all. It's well-relieved and very sturdy. Sound-wise the GR07 will be much more detailed and refined, with a more convincing presentation and better dynamics. The CX21 is a good entry-level in-ear but nuanced it is not. Comfort is a personal thing but I find the GR07 no less comfortable than the CX21, not that I've had problems with either.


----------



## user02

I got my CK10 today. I was skeptical of the score you gave it, and now I now why you like it so much.  It's simply amazing, it's not like any IEMs I've heard of.  I also agree with the score you gave for 1964-Ts which I have also.  Great customs.


----------



## Niyologist

Any IEMs that have bass impact that is similar but better to the SP51 and has a large soundstage with very good midrange and treble with a price between $100-$130?


----------



## Niyologist

Gonna purchase the CC51 and VB's. Can someone confirm that the Hephaes Sound Sig is similar to the Sennheiser IE7 Sound Sig?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





user02 said:


> I got my CK10 today. I was skeptical of the score you gave it, and now I now why you like it so much.  It's simply amazing, it's not like any IEMs I've heard of.  I also agree with the score you gave for 1964-Ts which I have also.  Great customs.


 

  Good to hear! The CK10 seems to be a difficult one to approach objectively for some. It's not the best universal out there but what it does right, it does very right. With the right combination of fit, ears, and preferences, it can be fantastic. Otherwise, it's just another in a long list of available top-tiers.

  
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Any IEMs that have bass impact that is similar but better to the SP51 and has a large soundstage with very good midrange and treble with a price between $100-$130?


 

 Eterna, IE6, used DDM, maybe Xears N3i.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Can someone confirm that the Hephaes Sound Sig is similar to the Sennheiser IE7 Sound Sig?


 
   
  Signature? Maybe, though it's not quite as punchy or mid-happy as the IE7. Also sounds a touch congested next to the spacious Sennheisers, at least with the ~20 hours of burn-in I have on it. I think the IE6 is a more fair comparison, being dryer and a bit smaller in staging than the IE7.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Eterna, IE6, used DDM, maybe Xears N3i.
> 
> Signature? Maybe, though it's not quite as punchy or mid-happy as the IE7. Also sounds a touch congested next to the spacious Sennheisers, at least with the ~20 hours of burn-in I have on it. I think the IE6 is a more fair comparison, being dryer and a bit smaller in staging than the IE7.


 
      
       Thanks for the info!


----------



## Niyologist

Does the Hephaes have a good warranty?


----------



## Niyologist

Scratch the VB. Now going with only the CC51. I can only afford that with the Audeo Phonak PFE Ear Guide.


----------



## mukumi

I would also like to thank you here since i've picked the brainwavz M2 based on what i've read here.

 They are my first IEM so i didn't want to put lot of bucks in them and they are indeed comfortable with a good sound. You said the isolation wasn't that good but I do not have any problem with it, I do not hear what happens outside my world <3


----------



## Niyologist

I'm wondering. The bass of the VB Vs. The bass of the CC51?
   
  Also, will the Custom EQ from my Sansa Fuze be enough to near the bass of the SP51 without covering the midrange too much?
   
  Sorry for asking so many questions. I'm just a person who is growing from the mid-bass hump to the sub-bass area with added clarity. A maturing audiophile is more of the technical term.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Does the Hephaes have a good warranty?


 

  I have no idea... that's probably something you want to ask a dealer. It does have excellent build quality like the rest of DUNU sets, though.


  Quote: 





mukumi said:


> I would also like to thank you here since i've picked the brainwavz M2 based on what i've read here.
> 
> They are my first IEM so i didn't want to put lot of bucks in them and they are indeed comfortable with a good sound. You said the isolation wasn't that good but I do not have any problem with it, I do not hear what happens outside my world <3


 

 Glad the thread was useful! The M2 is a great performer and I think you'll find that with music playing the vast majority of in-ears isolate enough for a typical commute.
   
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'm wondering. The bass of the VB Vs. The bass of the CC51?
> 
> Also, will the Custom EQ from my Sansa Fuze be enough to near the bass of the SP51 without covering the midrange too much?
> 
> Sorry for asking so many questions. I'm just a person who is growing from the mid-bass hump to the sub-bass area with added clarity. A maturing audiophile is more of the technical term.


 
  VB puts emphasis on the sub-bass. The CC51 puts emphasis on mid/upper bass though not nearly to the same extent as SP51+black port. Both the CC51 and VB are extremely clear in the midrange and treble but I'm not sure you'll be able to EQ either to the extremes of the SP51.... maybe to the impact of the matte port.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have no idea... that's probably something you want to ask a dealer. It does have excellent build quality like the rest of DUNU sets, though.
> 
> VB puts emphasis on the sub-bass. The CC51 puts emphasis on mid/upper bass though not nearly to the same extent as SP51+black port. Both the CC51 and VB are extremely clear in the midrange and treble but I'm not sure you'll be able to EQ either to the extremes of the SP51.... maybe to the impact of the matte port.


 
      
       Thank you ljokerl. I won't regret my purchase of the CC51 because the VB's have terrible build quality, so I don't want to constantly replace them.


----------



## PinkysBrain

@Niyologist
  You should ask ljokerl how well the Phonak ear guides work together with the CC51 before you buy them. The CC51 are simply not made to be worn over the ear. Maybe the ear guides can stabilize them in your ear, because without any ear guide when worn over the ear -they simply don't attach to the outer ear, giving them a kinda loose fit.
   
  I've tried to boost the lowest band of Fuze's custom EQ and the maximum that seemed viable (for me) is +4. Going beyond that made the sound a bit mushy. But the +4 still don't make them a "bass monster". I haven't tried it in rockbox yet, but you don't seem to be using RB...


----------



## ljokerl

Welp, the AKG K3003 (caution: audio in link) is apparently nearing release. Better start saving up now.
   
   
  Quote: 





> 1000 euros = 1431.80 US dollars with VAT, €836.12 = 1197 USD without


----------



## Inks

The FAD SS isn't going to feel so lonely anymore.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> The FAD SS isn't going to feel so lonely anymore.


 

 Unless the AKG sucks.  Is it April 1st again?  I do believe that housing appears to Unicorn horn.  Yes....yes it does.


----------



## Niyologist

I just purchased the CC51 last night. Now all I need is a good Portable Amp....


----------



## kanuka

say joker
  though i already own the yuin pk1 (perfect fit and comfort)
  i can get the yuin ok1 for about 90 euro + 12 euro shipping. is it a good deal? i'd only use them as an earbud, the iem mode sure wont be, with no isolation and comfort


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Welp, the AKG K3003 (caution: audio in link) is apparently nearing release. Better start saving up now.





Those Austrians must be a crazy bunch


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> say joker
> though i already own the yuin pk1 (perfect fit and comfort)
> i can get the yuin ok1 for about 90 euro + 12 euro shipping. is it a good deal? i'd only use them as an earbud, the iem mode sure wont be, with no isolation and comfort


 

 I'm not sure how they differ from the PK1 as I've never heard the latter but I did think the OK1 sounded pretty damn good when I had it, if you're into balanced and refined.
   


  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Those Austrians must be a crazy bunch


 

 Yes... must be


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'm not sure how they differ from the PK1 as I've never heard the latter but I did think the OK1 sounded pretty damn good when I had it, if you're into balanced and refined.


 

 then, is there any iem that can match them with the price i mentioned 90-100 euro (i think thats about $125-145)
  btw, do the ok1 sound like a full-size can as the pk1 are known as?


----------



## Austin Morrow

Joker, are you going to get the new AKG's? If you do, you should do a comparison between them and the FAD SS.


----------



## Inks

lol if you mean buy, I hope that's a joke.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





james444 said:


> Those Austrians must be a crazy bunch


 

 Too much Schnitzel and Spaetzle.  Makes me hungary.  Haha!


----------



## Austin Morrow

inks said:


> lol if you mean buy, I hope that's a joke.




Haha, I wasn't joking.


----------



## victorbrt

Hey Joker, do you remember what tips sounded best to you with ECCI PR401? The stock single-flanges or the Sony Hybrids?
   
  I already tested both but I'm can't say yet which one is better.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Niyologist

Still awaiting for my CC51. I'll compare my review with Joker's review next week. The pre-burn-in and 50 hour burn-in will be posted, along with the specs and analysis of build, comfort and isolation.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Hey Joker, do you remember what tips sounded best to you with ECCI PR401? The stock single-flanges or the Sony Hybrids?
> 
> I already tested both but I'm can't say yet which one is better.
> 
> Thanks.


 
      
       Are you enjoying your ECCI PR401 to the fullest?


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Still awaiting for my CC51. I'll compare my review with Joker's review next week. The pre-burn-in and 50 hour burn-in will be posted, along with the specs and analysis of build, comfort and isolation.


 


  Your getting the CC51? Congrats, one of my favorite budget IEM's. Rumbly bass and great high end extension.


----------



## FlySweep

niyologist said:


> Are you enjoying your ECCI PR401 to the fullest?


 

 I'm not joker but I've had the PR401 for a while.. and like them very much.  They're akin to a smoother, more balanced version of the HJE900.  The midbass hump isn't as pronounced as it is on the HJE and the midrange sounds a bit thicker.  Treble on the PR401 has excellent sparkle and crispness with no sibilance.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> Your getting the CC51? Congrats, one of my favorite budget IEM's. Rumbly bass and great high end extension.


 
   
       Yeah, thanks for the heads up.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


kanuka said:


> then, is there any iem that can match them with the price i mentioned 90-100 euro (i think thats about $125-145)  btw, do the ok1 sound like a full-size can as the pk1 are known as?


   
  There are other good iems in the price range - DBA-02, GR07, etc - but they sound different from the OK1. Not sure what it's supposed to sound like to rival a full-size can as I've never heard the PK1. It's pretty airy and spacious but then many earbuds tend to be.


 Quote:


victorbrt said:


> Hey Joker, do you remember what tips sounded best to you with ECCI PR401? The stock single-flanges or the Sony Hybrids?
> 
> I already tested both but I'm can't say yet which one is better.
> 
> Thanks.


 
 I'm sure I ended up using the Hybrids since they generally seal very effortlessly for me but for sound I really don't remember.
   

 Quote:


flysweep said:


> *I'm not joker *but I've had the PR401 for a while.. and like them very much.


 
 That question wasn't directed at me anyway


----------



## kanuka

"the pk1 are eforthless and have a great soundstage" thats supposed to be., not that i really know what it means.
  anyway. from what you mention the B2/dba-02 should be enough. but i wanted to know as i find earbuds very comfortable for home and silent places use.
  btw. in case i decide to get 'em, what amp can drive the ok1? will the ibasso t3d be enough?


----------



## G4Oblivion

Finally got my M6 today 
   
  I spent an hour trying out the stock tips and could not get any of them to seal on my left ear (average/small canal), but I was able to get a few to fit my right ear (large canal)
  Luckily though, I bought Hybrids with the M6  Large hybrids fit perfect for my left ear and medium fit my right ear, though not perfect.
   
  First impressions: (I do not know the correct terms, but will try to describe it to the best of my ability)
   
  Accessories – Carrying case, shirt clip, silicone single-flange tips (3 sizes), silicone double-flange tips (1 size), silicone tri-flange tips (2 sizes)
  The stock silicone tips are hard and do not form to ears making it hard to get a good seal.
 Build Quality - "Solid-feeling plastic housings are coupled with Meelec's excellent new cabling terminated with a low-profile L-plug. Two inches of memory wire provide additional strain relief" - ljokerl
 Isolation – Haven't had enough time to test isolation.
 Microphonics - What microphonics? 
 Comfort - I don't even notice them. The only comfort related problem is ear pressure and that's probably just me and will work itself out.
   
  Sound - No burn-in (bear with me, I do not know the correct terms and will describe as best I can)
  Sparkly highs, recessed mids and slightly uncontrolled lows. <- That fun V-shape.
  Sound stage is awesome for the price. These things are definitely bass heavy, more so than my TiTANs. The bass is a bit uncontrolled, so it has the "boomy" feeling/sound.
   
  Would I recommend these to someone else? No. Why? the sealing issue. I'm sorry, but the sealing issue is a deal breaker unless you have small canals or the right tips (not stock).
  Would I recommend other MEE products?  Yes. Why? Build quaility, Price, Sound sig and friendliness.
  Am I happy with them? Hellz yeah, I am. Thanks ljokerl for your great review on them 
   
  End of impressions from an average guy looking for some fun IEMs.
   
edit
  Large hybrid fits my left ear (average/small canal) and small hybrid fit my right ear (large canal). I've never had fit issues with other IEMs. Stock medium size tips fit both my ears on my other IEMs.
  The pressure in my ears is gone and some of it seemed to be caused by too deep an insertion. The M6 doesn't seem to like large ear canals. Insertion is too deep on large canals and requires you to readjust each time you put on the IEMs (only takes a few seconds)
   
edit #2
I tried small hybrids on my left ear and they seem to work just fine, so I'm now using the pair of small hybrids for both ears.
These things are great for hardstyle  I also tried out LMAO's "sorry for party rocking" (album) with these and they made me like tracks that I hated before.
Truly great little things for electronic music.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> "the pk1 are eforthless and have a great soundstage" thats supposed to be., not that i really know what it means.
> anyway. from what you mention the B2/dba-02 should be enough. but i wanted to know as i find earbuds very comfortable for home and silent places use.
> btw. in case i decide to get 'em, what amp can drive the ok1? will the ibasso t3d be enough?


 


  Not sure. The T4 can't but the T3d is supposed to be an improvement.


  Quote: 





g4oblivion said:


> Finally got my M6 today
> 
> I spent an hour trying out the stock tips and could not get any of them to seal on my left ear (average/small canal), but I was able to get a few to fit my right ear (large canal)
> Luckily though, I bought Hybrids with the M6  Large hybrids fit perfect for my left ear and medium fit my right ear, though not perfect.
> ...


 

 Yep, figuring out to fit them correctly can be a pain but other than that they're pretty fun little things for the price paid. I think they get a little less boomy with time, too. My M6 is a bit tighter than my M9 and it's only had eighteen months of burn-in


----------



## Niyologist

Okay! Review Time.
   
  Meelectronics CC51
   
  Price/Store Location: ($54.99 from Amazon)
   
  I listened to the CC51 BK for about 2 Hours and this is the Pre Burn-in thoughts.
   
  Let us start with the bottom of the frequency. Bass.
   
  Bass: It's punchier and more hard hitting than my M9 by a mile and my SP51 by a tenth of a mile on both the Enhanced Bass Port and especially the Extreme Bass Port. It's clean and barely intrudes with the midrange. The quantity of bass is just like the Enhanced Bass Port of the SP51 and it mainly stays around Mid-Bass and some songs it actually goes down to lower Mid-Bass when called upon on.
   
  Moving up to midrange
   
  Midrange: Wow! I gotta say it's certainly much clearer than both the M9 and SP51 (Enhanced Bass and Extreme Bass Ports). Although it's slightly clearer than the SP51 (Balanced Sound Port). It's warmed up by the bass and it's very clean and smooth.
   
  Last part of the frequency. Treble.
   
  Treble: Very nice extension. The piano strokes are decently realistic and the treble isn't sibilant at all. It works really well on Trance music. It makes me enjoy my Trance music to the fullest. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Soundstage: About Average. I hear some depth to it and a slight bit of height. It'll probably be more 3D after the 50 Hour Burn-In.
   
  Now with the CC51 Analysis:
   
  Accessories: 4/5 The standard bi-flange, small bulb, medium bulb, and large bulb
   
  Build: 4.5/5 The housing feels extremely durable, the fact that it's Ceramic. I do not have any intention of removing the shirt clip after I saw how dangerously sharp it is. I see and feel that the cable is slightly thicker than the SP51, but not as much as the M Series. 
   
  Isolation: 4/5 It's much better than my vented M9 and SP51.
   
  Comfort: 4/5 It sits in my ears and I'm not moving it around like the M9 or SP51
   
  Fit/Seal: 3.5/5 The fact that it's not so good for the narrow ear canal. Although I found a good fit with the medium bulb flange for my left ear and the and the small bulb flange for my right ear.
   
  Value (Expect it to change): 9.2/10 It's clearer and cleaner than my M9 and SP51 and the fit/seal is slightly better than those two, along with the isolation and comfort and build. It may not be for a basshead (use to be one until a week ago), but it's still bass-heavy anyway. Its' accurate sound and clarity just brought out the best of the music I listen to daily. I sure hope Meelec has some more goods soon, because I'm gonna consume them (not literally).


----------



## PinkysBrain

You should really consider removing the shirt clip! I'd even go so far and break it apart (for safety reasons), as 1) it doesn't stick to the cable (=> cable is too thin) and 2) it has sharp edges that can damage the cable even if you do not remove it.
   
  Meelec knows of the problem and they have a benevolent CS, so I don't think you'd get warranty problems. But you should ask them first.


----------



## G4Oblivion

Please see this thread on ABI - http://www.anythingbutipod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=62343
   
  I'm not sure if they've changed clips or the cable, but I strongly recommend against removing it.
  The risks outweigh the benefits.


----------



## Niyologist

SP51 has the same dangerous Shirt Clip and it didn't damage my cable.
   
  EDIT: The cable is thin? I don't see that considering that it's between the thickness of the SP51 and the M Series cable.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> SP51 has the same dangerous Shirt Clip and it didn't damage my cable.


 

  SP51 has that same clear-coat covering as the rest of MEElec's cables, which is why you can't damage it by taking off the clip. The best way to take off the CC51 clip is to widen the opening of the part that goes on the cable with a small screwdriver first.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Joker are you planning to release your SM e30 review before July ends? No need to rush you just asking.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Joker are you planning to release your SM e30 review before July ends? No need to rush you just asking.


 


  It should be the next update though there's been a bit of a delay as I've been working on the portable thread


----------



## Mormonsloot (Sep 25, 2017)

.


----------



## PinkysBrain

Quote:Originally Posted by *G4Oblivion* /img/forum/go_quote.gif


  Please see this thread on ABI - http://www.anythingbutipod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=62343
   
  I'm not sure if they've changed clips or the cable, but I strongly recommend against removing it.
  The risks outweigh the benefits.


   If you don't mind breaking the clip I would definitely remove the clip. The CW31 has a clip that is easily removable and I still hope that they will produce a similar one for the CC51 - unfortunately the clip of the CW31 is not compatible with the CC51. While most reviewers say, that removing the clip can damage the cable, they still do it, so I guesstimate that they share my concerns about leaving it. 
*@ljokerl*: What is your opinion regarding this?
   
   
  Quote:


niyologist said:


> SP51 has the same dangerous Shirt Clip and it didn't damage my cable.
> 
> EDIT: The cable is thin? I don't see that considering that it's between the thickness of the SP51 and the M Series cable.


 


  Doesn't the cable of the SP51 have a hard coating? The coating of the CC51 is rather soft IMHO.


----------



## PinkysBrain

Quote: 





> Quote:Originally Posted by *G4Oblivion* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> Please see this thread on ABI - http://www.anythingbutipod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=62343
> ...


 
   
  If you don't mind breaking the clip I would definitely remove the clip. The CW31 has a clip that is easily removable and I still hope that they will produce a similar one for the CC51 - unfortunately the clip of the CW31 is not compatible with the CC51. While most reviewers say, that removing the clip can damage the cable, they still do it, so I guesstimate that they share my concerns about leaving it. 
*@ljokerl*: What is your opinion regarding this?
   
   
  Quote:


niyologist said:


> SP51 has the same dangerous Shirt Clip and it didn't damage my cable.
> 
> EDIT: The cable is thin? I don't see that considering that it's between the thickness of the SP51 and the M Series cable.


 


  Doesn't the cable of the SP51 have a hard coating? The coating of the CC51 is rather soft IMHO.


----------



## ZMan2k2

Just wanted to thank |joker| for all his hard work on these reviews.  I've had quite a few recommendations made to me as a new guy, but the best recommendation was to come to this thread.  It really helped me pick out a new set of IEM's that I'm sure I'll be very happy with.  Thanks again.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mormonsloot said:


> wow, thank you for your incredible work on these reviews.
> 
> i am looking to replace my full-size cans - beyer dt-770 pro (80 ohm), I have $250 to spend on iems,  out of all of these iems does anyone have an idea of which of these has a similar sound / bass response?
> 
> I have read through all of these reviews and narrowed down the selection, but it is still difficult to differentiate between them w/o actually hearing them.


 

 I've only heard the DT770/250 and that had pretty flat and controlled bass. I did not like the hard-edged treble of the /250 a whole lot and I really can't be sure how the 80 ohm model compares but I would recommend something dynamic, on the neutral side of things in terms of tone, and maybe with a touch of bass boost. The bad news is that I can't think of anything that sounds exactly like that but I think the VSonic GR07 and Sony EX600 are both worth reading up on.


  Quote: 





pinkysbrain said:


> If you don't mind breaking the clip I would definitely remove the clip. The CW31 has a clip that is easily removable and I still hope that they will produce a similar one for the CC51 - unfortunately the clip of the CW31 is not compatible with the CC51. While most reviewers say, that removing the clip can damage the cable, they still do it, so I guesstimate that they share my concerns about leaving it.
> 
> Doesn't the cable of the SP51 have a hard coating? The coating of the CC51 is rather soft IMHO.


 

 As I said above, the SP51 does have a coated cable that cannot be damaged by the clip. Taking off the clip without damaging the cable on the CC51 is also possible - just pry the clip open a bit with a small flathead screwdriver. I took mine off because the cable noise wasn't particularly annoying. Definitely wasn't worried that leaving it on would damage the cable. I sent MEElec an email when I screwed up my original cable and they said they were working on it and offered to replace the earphone. I've tried the CW31 clip and it doesn't work - too loose on the CC51 cord.


  Quote: 





zman2k2 said:


> Just wanted to thank |joker| for all his hard work on these reviews.  I've had quite a few recommendations made to me as a new guy, but the best recommendation was to come to this thread.  It really helped me pick out a new set of IEM's that I'm sure I'll be very happy with.  Thanks again.


 
   
  Thanks, much appreciated. Glad the thread was useful. Good choice with the MD - reasonable prices on those lately and they are an easy one to live with.


----------



## kanuka

hey joker.
  being the re0 a perfect rival to the er4s , then does it win over  the hf5 by far?


----------



## xtremetechuk

*@Joker*
   
  Which customs would you recommend?
   
  I'm currently using the CK10, which are great, apart from being slightly too bright for my taste. I'm looking for a similar sound signature to the CK10.
   
  The 1964EARS appeal to me, I have read your review on them, however I'm still not sure.
   
  My budget limit would be around £400 or $640.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker.
> being the re0 a perfect rival to the er4s , then does it win over  the hf5 by far?


 

 No... none of them are that far off from one another. Currently I prefer my ACS HF3 to my RE-ZERO.
   


  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> *@Joker*
> 
> Which customs would you recommend?
> 
> ...


 


  You mean between the one custom I've heard in that price range 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





? 
   
   
  Starkey makes a TWFK-based custom in that price range that I imagine wouldn't be all that different from the CK10 in signature. I think average_joe would be the person to ask as he's heard the CK10 (multiple times) and a good number of customs. I do not think the 1964-T is a very logical CK10 upgrade, being a touch more mid-centric and lacking emphasis at the low lows and high highs. That's not to say you won't like it, though.


----------



## Gadabout

Just wanted to say a quick and big Thank-You .... Joker...
   
  This thread helped a lot as I researched my first jump into IEMs. I know it took a lot of work and I'm sure there are a lot of folks reading it that haven't decided to join up or comment. You efforts are appreciated.
   
  Oh and I decided on the Audeo PFE112's & AT-M50s for my starting point.
   
  Thanx again.


----------



## nikon131

*Another thank you for this epic thread Joker. *The thing that helped me the most when choosing my first "high end" iem's were not only the detailed reviews, but the comparison of your reviews in relation to your other really helped me narrow it down. I ended up with the Miles Davis Turbines and am very satisfied with my choice. Cheers!


----------



## xtremetechuk

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> You mean between the one custom I've heard in that price range
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  I'm having sibilance issues with the CK10, mostly with rock and metal. Trance however sounds outstanding, and have not experienced any sibilance.
   
  I have also been interested in the Kozee Infinity X2 and X3, however can't find any reviews for the X2.
   
  I much prefer trance over any other genre, though the highs can often be harsh with the CK10. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  EDIT - I noticed that rawrster preferred the 1964-T over the CK10 as an whole package.
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/539610/review-1964-ears-1964-t


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gadabout said:


> Just wanted to say a quick and big Thank-You .... Joker...
> 
> This thread helped a lot as I researched my first jump into IEMs. I know it took a lot of work and I'm sure there are a lot of folks reading it that haven't decided to join up or comment. You efforts are appreciated.
> 
> Oh and I decided on the Audeo PFE112's & AT-M50s for my starting point.


 

  Quote: 





nikon131 said:


> *Another thank you for this epic thread Joker. *The thing that helped me the most when choosing my first "high end" iem's were not only the detailed reviews, but the comparison of your reviews in relation to your other really helped me narrow it down. I ended up with the Miles Davis Turbines and am very satisfied with my choice. Cheers!


 

 Awesome, glad the thread was useful. Enjoy the IEMs!

  
  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> I'm having sibilance issues with the CK10, mostly with rock and metal. Trance however sounds outstanding, and have not experienced any sibilance.
> I have also been interested in the Kozee Infinity X2 and X3, however can't find any reviews for the X2.


 

 The CK10 is not very sibilant for me unless it's present on the track. If you have a capable player you can try a narrow EQ cut around 8k to counteract the CK10's treble contour, though that's a little higher than sibilance usually presents. 
   
  X3 does not seem CK10-like at all based on average_joe's impressions.  Don't think anyone has gone for the X2 yet.

  
   
  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> EDIT - I noticed that rawrster preferred the 1964-T over the CK10 as an whole package.


 
  As do I, but I still don't think they are very similar in signature.


----------



## xtremetechuk

*@Joker *
   
  Thanks for your time and advice, I most definitely appreciate it.
   
  I might take the gamble and purchase the kozee infinity X2, or reshell the CK10.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

I had the dba-02 and ck10 which I also liked but my 1964 T are a bid diferent. 1964 T sounds darker than those headphones. More bass on the T and more treble on those universals.
  
  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> *@Joker *
> 
> Thanks for your time and advice, I most definitely appreciate it.
> 
> I might take the gamble and purchase the kozee infinity X2, or reshell the CK10.


----------



## xtremetechuk

I find the CK10 to be slightly too bright at times, so maybe the 1964-T would be ideal.
   
  Apparently the reshell will tame the highs.
   
  I noticed that kozee only charge $90 for reshell, while 1964EARS charge $190.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mcnoiserdc said:


> I had the dba-02 and ck10 which I also liked but my 1964 T are a bid diferent. 1964 T sounds darker than those headphones. More bass on the T and more treble on those universals.


 

  Yeah my 1964-T has more mid-bass than a CK10/DBA-02 and smoother treble.
   


  Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> I find the CK10 to be slightly too bright at times, so maybe the 1964-T would be ideal.
> 
> Apparently the reshell will tame the highs.
> 
> I noticed that kozee only charge $90 for reshell, while 1964EARS charge $190.


 


  Fisher Hearing charges $90 as well I think. There was someone who reshelled a CK10 with an extra bass driver a while ago, though I think you'd have to go to Unique Melody for that.


----------



## rawrster

Mike, I have a question. Have you tried any of the earphones in this thread that sound decent that would fit into phone if you wanted to use that? The mic isn't really needed as I don't need that. I'm looking mostly at one of the Phonak earphones. Today as I was leaving my J3 battery died leaving my Samsung Galaxy S only to find out that the plug on my 1964-T cable does not fit or at least a Neutrik straight plug does not fit since I had the stock cable reterminated. Usually my phone is my backup source in situations like these but I did not realize that it did not fit properly until it was too late.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Mike, I have a question. Have you tried any of the earphones in this thread that sound decent that would fit into phone if you wanted to use that? The mic isn't really needed as I don't need that. I'm looking mostly at one of the Phonak earphones. Today as I was leaving my J3 battery died leaving my Samsung Galaxy S only to find out that the plug on my 1964-T cable does not fit or at least a Neutrik straight plug does not fit since I had the stock cable reterminated. Usually my phone is my backup source in situations like these but I did not realize that it did not fit properly until it was too late.


 

 I think the vast majority of them do - a Neutrik I-plug is larger than pretty much anything you will find stock on an IEM (Shure's new cabling excepted). I have to admit that I'm not sure what the SGS headphone jack looks like. The one on my ZTE Blade is not recessed so anything fits as long as I take the case off. Phonak plugs should certainly fit. Of the stuff I've been using recently, the Sony EX600/EX1000 have unusually slim L-plugs and work with my phone even if I leave the case on.


----------



## kanuka

sorry to keep aksing about the ok1 , im still considering getting them, but cant make my mind
  are you sure thay come with 2 size bi-flanges? from pictures i only saw 1 size of bi-flange


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> sorry to keep aksing about the ok1 , im still considering getting them, but cant make my mind
> are you sure thay come with 2 size bi-flanges? from pictures i only saw 1 size of bi-flange


 

 Nope, not sure. The pair I reviewed was not mine so if an extra pair of tips made it into the package, I'd have no way of knowing. Nowadays I double check with manufacturer accessory lists (not that those are very accurate when the pack-ins keep changing) but I don't think I did that back then.


----------



## soundbear

Joker, thanks for the awesome review! Can you or anyone give a comparison between the GR07 and the Westone 2.   From your review it appears that the GR07 has more bass punch and quality, treble slighty more forward on the Westone 2?   Also, my DBA's have that "live" sound, how many rows back are the GR07 or W2's?   Thanks for the feedback.


----------



## shsh

Hi, i have been lurking around for months, few months ago i bought ath ck100 on impulse being relatively new to the audio stuff. I'm starting to get irritated by the forward mids on some songs. I tried the UM3X it sounded really good but the bass doesnt extend well enough, and also the sm3 which i don't quite like the sound. Lastly shure 535 which sounded near to ck 100. I'm considering on UM3X so i would like to ask if there is any other IEMs you can recommend which has a wide soundstage, clarity and bass?
  Thanks


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think the vast majority of them do - a Neutrik I-plug is larger than pretty much anything you will find stock on an IEM (Shure's new cabling excepted). I have to admit that I'm not sure what the SGS headphone jack looks like. The one on my ZTE Blade is not recessed so anything fits as long as I take the case off. Phonak plugs should certainly fit. Of the stuff I've been using recently, the Sony EX600/EX1000 have unusually slim L-plugs and work with my phone even if I leave the case on.


 
   
  That's a good point there. I did think of that after I wrote my message however. The neutrik is larger so I guess that's the downside of reterminating them into a straight plug. I don't think the jack is recessed or anything like that but rather the side where the plug is the phone is curved which makes the end of the plug on my cable impossible to reach all the way so I either get no sound or one side if I play with it a bit.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





soundbear said:


> Joker, thanks for the awesome review! Can you or anyone give a comparison between the GR07 and the Westone 2.   From your review it appears that the GR07 has more bass punch and quality, treble slighty more forward on the Westone 2?   Also, my DBA's have that "live" sound, how many rows back are the GR07 or W2's?   Thanks for the feedback.


 

 Being a dynamic the GR07 does do bass body and impact better than the W2. However, I would not say that the W2 has more forward treble. Rather, the W2 is slightly more intimate-sounding overall (despite having a good-sized stage) but the GR07 is more airy and sparkly. Don''t know if I can define space  in terms of rows very accurately but the GR07 is a little more distant than the W2, which itself is a little more distant than the DBA-02.

  
  Quote: 





shsh said:


> Hi, i have been lurking around for months, few months ago i bought ath ck100 on impulse being relatively new to the audio stuff. I'm starting to get irritated by the forward mids on some songs. I tried the UM3X it sounded really good but the bass doesnt extend well enough, and also the sm3 which i don't quite like the sound. Lastly shure 535 which sounded near to ck 100. I'm considering on UM3X so i would like to ask if there is any other IEMs you can recommend which has a wide soundstage, clarity and bass?
> Thanks


 

 The Westone 3, pretty much the polar opposite to the CK100.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Its a threat which many people come and go so I thought i should post here too. I a, looking for an electronic shop. Its based in HK, ships worldwide and its a big store. I think its a subsidiary company of  Samsung or something like that.
  I also think they stock the Pleo dinosaur Toy.
   
  Thanks for your lights!


----------



## Mdraluck23

Just purchased some HF5's. Really looking forward to them. I had it down to the B2's and DBA-02's, but the $95 price tag and amazing isolation sold me on the Etymotic's. I should get them in two days thanks to my Amazon Prime Trial. What do you think of them as an upgrade from my beloved RE0's? More or less light on the bass?


----------



## ashinyforehead

I currently have the Dr Dre Tours.  I'm considering returning it & getting the Ety HF5s.  Do you think I would enjoy that a lot better?  I like bass, but I don't think I like as much as the Beats Tour.
 I mainly listen to modern music like hip hop/rap, r & b, & pop.
  Thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Soundmagic E30 & Blue Ever Blue 866B
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A55) Soundmagic E30*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jul 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





mdraluck23 said:


> Just purchased some HF5's. Really looking forward to them. I had it down to the B2's and DBA-02's, but the $95 price tag and amazing isolation sold me on the Etymotic's. I should get them in two days thanks to my Amazon Prime Trial. What do you think of them as an upgrade from my beloved RE0's? More or less light on the bass?


 

 With a good seal the HF5 should have impact similar to the RE0 but with slightly quicker note presentation and leaner body.
   


  Quote: 





ashinyforehead said:


> I currently have the Dr Dre Tours.  I'm considering returning it & getting the Ety HF5s.  Do you think I would enjoy that a lot better?  I like bass, but I don't think I like as much as the Beats Tour.
> I mainly listen to modern music like hip hop/rap, r & b, & pop.
> Thank you


 


  Those are at pretty opposite extremes in terms of sound signature. I think the changeover to the HF5 from the Tours would be mildly shocking and would recommend grabbing something in the middle instead if you want a try a more 'hi-fi' sound - maybe a Brainwavz M3, MEElec CC51, or ECCI PR401 - or even a better bass-heavy phone than the Tours, such as the Monster Turbine, Fischer Eterna, or Beyer DTX 101.


----------



## kanuka

great update! i was waiting for the SM review. too bad there's no enough isolation and that the accessories are less than the pl30 (both versions)


----------



## ashinyforehead

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those are at pretty opposite extremes in terms of sound signature. I think the changeover to the HF5 from the Tours would be mildly shocking and would recommend grabbing something in the middle instead if you want a try a more 'hi-fi' sound - maybe a Brainwavz M3, MEElec CC51, or ECCI PR401 - or even a better bass-heavy phone than the Tours, such as the Monster Turbine, Fischer Eterna, or Beyer DTX 101.


 

 Why do you say the Ety HF5s would be mildly shocking?  I enjoy the sound & bass level of the Klipsch S4 my father has, but I do not wish to purchase those.  I want a better earphone.  Do you enjoy the sound of the HF5s?  & How do you test earphones since most of these aren't in stores on display?


----------



## redwarrior191

ljokerl.. which one of beyer dtx 101ie, ne-700m, or brainwavz m3 have the best bass extension?? (ie. good subbass presence?)
  and which one do you think is the best for low listening levels??
   
  thanks


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ashinyforehead said:


> Why do you say the Ety HF5s would be mildly shocking?  I enjoy the sound & bass level of the Klipsch S4 my father has, but I do not wish to purchase those.  I want a better earphone.  Do you enjoy the sound of the HF5s?  & How do you test earphones since most of these aren't in stores on display?


 
       
        If you like more bass than the other range of the frequency, then the HF5 is definitely not for you. I recommend you looking at CC51 or the Eterna. The Tours and the HF5 are in different leagues. The Tours is probably warmer and stuffy, while the HF5 is Cold, Bright and open. So Cold and Bright means that you shouldn't expect much "bass" from it, because it'll focus more on the midrange and treble.


----------



## rovex

Would be interested in seeing a review on the new Jamo wEAR in30/40, they appear to be rebranded Klipsch S4i's however it's still up in the air with nothing definitive.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ashinyforehead said:


> Why do you say the Ety HF5s would be mildly shocking?  I enjoy the sound & bass level of the Klipsch S4 my father has, but I do not wish to purchase those.  I want a better earphone.  Do you enjoy the sound of the HF5s?  & How do you test earphones since most of these aren't in stores on display?


 


  The bass level of the S4 is way closer to the beats tour than it is to the HF5, which is why I think the HF5 will not suit you well. You'll probably be happier with something like the DTX 101. 
   
  I do not test earphones in stores. An evaluation typically runs 2-3 weeks so that would be quite impractical. I would say around 40% of these I buy and test, another 30% (mostly higher-end ones) are loaned out by fellow head-fi members, and the final 30% are review samples from manufacturers/distributors. 


  Quote: 





redwarrior191 said:


> ljokerl.. which one of beyer dtx 101ie, ne-700m, or brainwavz m3 have the best bass extension?? (ie. good subbass presence?)
> and which one do you think is the best for low listening levels??
> 
> thanks


 

  They all have good extension... the DTX 101 ie and NE-700M just happen too have a lot more overall bass quantity than the M3. I think the DTX 101 edges out the NE-700M slightly in sub-bass presence. I prefer a balanced signature for lower listening levels but if you want prominent sub-bass I'd give a slight edge to the Beyers.

  
  Quote: 





rovex said:


> Would be interested in seeing a review on the new Jamo wEAR in30/40, they appear to be rebranded Klipsch S4i's however it's still up in the air with nothing definitive.


 

 I think the Jamo brand is owned by Klipsch so that would be a very reasonable guess. Plus for the in20/in20m they didn't even bother modifying the housings to look different than the Klipsch S2/S2m. I doubt they'll send me a review sample after seeing the rest of my Klipsch reviews - probably  better off sticking with mainstream review sites. Also, I will find it absolutely awesome if the in40 gets lower scores than the S4 from sites like cnet just because it doesn't have the Klipsch name on it.


----------



## redwarrior191

thanks ljokerl, so what would you reccomend for low volume listening?? under $100 if possible..


----------



## kanuka

eartips question:
  how do you compare the sony hybrids (clone, fakes) with the meelec bi-flange for m6/a151, in isolation and comfort ?
  thanks


----------



## Mormonsloot (Sep 25, 2017)

.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Cool! thx for the review on the e30. You dont seem  as enthusiastic as clieos but the reviews agree in almost every aspect. I dont know why but i have a crash on the e30. Maybe because i was very happy with the pl30 and the e30 looks like a stronger brother!


----------



## Stuie299

I'm thinking of getting the RE-Zero, RE0, or the Xcape. I mostly listen to Indie Rock, Indie Folk, and stuff from 60's and 70's (Folk Rock, Psychedelic, and Baroque Pop mainly). I also listen to Hip-Hop/Rap, and Shoegaze/Dream Pop occasionally. I was set on getting the RE-Zero since they are made for being listened to without an amp. However, after hearing about the adapter I'm not so sure. Which one of these would be the best if I'm not using an amp (I will use iPod Classic and my computer)? Also if you have any other suggestions for IEMs under $100 with good all around SQ I would be open to them to. As always thanks for helping.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





redwarrior191 said:


> thanks ljokerl, so what would you reccomend for low volume listening?? under $100 if possible..


 

 HF5 can be found for $95 apparently... great low volume IEMs if you like analytical sound. For bassier ones, maybe the Hippo VB. Not that the DTX101 is bad at low volumes - it is actually not as overwhelmingly bassy as when the volume is cranked up.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> eartips question:
> how do you compare the sony hybrids (clone, fakes) with the meelec bi-flange for m6/a151, in isolation and comfort ?
> thanks


 
   
  I am not a huge fan of the fit of the MEElec bi-flange. It's thicker and less flexible than the hybrid. Small isolation sacrifice with the Sonys for more comfort.

  
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Cool! thx for the review on the e30. You dont seem  as enthusiastic as clieos but the reviews agree in almost every aspect. I dont know why but i have a crash on the e30. Maybe because i was very happy with the pl30 and the e30 looks like a stronger brother!


 

 I really do like the E30. In terms of performance, it's everything I wanted from a PL30 replacement and it's priced right at $40. It may not be head and shoulders above everything in its price bracket but it's pretty close to the top. The sound signature and PL30 heritage should make it pretty popular in the long run. 
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





stuie299 said:


> I'm thinking of getting the RE-Zero, RE0, or the Xcape. I mostly listen to Indie Rock, Indie Folk, and stuff from 60's and 70's (Folk Rock, Psychedelic, and Baroque Pop mainly). I also listen to Hip-Hop/Rap, and Shoegaze/Dream Pop occasionally. I was set on getting the RE-Zero since they are made for being listened to without an amp. However, after hearing about the adapter I'm not so sure. Which one of these would be the best if I'm not using an amp (I will use iPod Classic and my computer)? Also if you have any other suggestions for IEMs under $100 with good all around SQ I would be open to them to. As always thanks for helping.


 
   
  I would double-check with head-direct regarding the adapter. They seem to be changing things around lately. The Xcape v1 is no longer available as far as I know, but the new Xcape IE model is quite good, if different in signature. I reviewed it here. It requires more power than the old Xcape and the RE-ZERO but should be driven sufficiently by most portable players. Other good, reasonably well-balanced all-rounders in the price range include the Brainwavz M3, MEElec CC51, and Fischer Silver Bullet.


----------



## rovex

ljokerl said:


> I think the Jamo brand is owned by Klipsch so that would be a very reasonable guess. Plus for the in20/in20m they didn't even bother modifying the housings to look different than the Klipsch S2/S2m. I doubt they'll send me a review sample after seeing the rest of my Klipsch reviews - probably  better off sticking with mainstream review sites. Also, I will find it absolutely awesome if the in40 gets lower scores than the S4 from sites like cnet just because it doesn't have the Klipsch name on it.




Speaking of the S2 and in20m, have a look at this:

http://www.whathifi.com/review/klipsch-image-s2

http://www.whathifi.com/review/jamo-wear-in20m

Conflicting to say the least, perhaps the Jamo brand name had something to do with this. Personally I assume they're exacty the same just a different paint job.


----------



## 182751

Hey Joker,
  Sorry to ask as I'm sure you get heaps of questions about them, but I'm just wanting to know what the low end is like on the Miracles. Trying to decide if I want to order a set of JH16's as well to compare to the Miracles(haven't arrived yet). Do you find that the Miracles are a very bright and sparkly custom or more well rounded? I'm not a bass head, but I do like a good low end. Like my TF10's but with a more analytical signature in respect to the mids and highs.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





user02 said:


> I got my CK10 today. I was skeptical of the score you gave it, and now I now why you like it so much.  It's simply amazing, it's not like any IEMs I've heard of.  I also agree with the score you gave for 1964-Ts which I have also.  Great customs.


 
   
  Nice to hear you like it and it went to a good home.
   
  __________________________________
   
  I demo'ed the Shure SE425 while in transit at Singapore airport, and now I'm sure the SE535 I demo'ed at Jaben was fake, along with a couple other IEM's they had on demo.
   
  I didn't even achieve a good seal, and I think it has the best imaging I've heard in an IEM so far, exceeding the ck10, very good soundstage, sturdy, cool design and a beckoning, desireful sound, in the end too dark to attract my interest though, and a bit lacking in tonality and cleanness.  Note: used Teclast T51 as a source and only listened for 5-10 minutes, A/B'd with MDR-EX700, listened mostly to electronic music, take my thoughts with some salt, seemed like a very good IEM though.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rovex said:


> Speaking of the S2 and in20m, have a look at this:
> 
> http://www.whathifi.com/review/klipsch-image-s2
> 
> ...


 

 I would guess the reviews were done by different reviewers - one who has tried a lot of higher-end products and one who has not. Perspective is key.
   


  Quote: 





acesi7 said:


> Hey Joker,
> Sorry to ask as I'm sure you get heaps of questions about them, but I'm just wanting to know what the low end is like on the Miracles. Trying to decide if I want to order a set of JH16's as well to compare to the Miracles(haven't arrived yet). Do you find that the Miracles are a very bright and sparkly custom or more well rounded? I'm not a bass head, but I do like a good low end. Like my TF10's but with a more analytical signature in respect to the mids and highs.


 

 The miracles are sparkly but I wouldn't call them bright. I think they are very well-balanced. The bass extends all the way down without flinching but doesn't have any mid-bass boost. I think impact is plentiful and the notes are very well-fleshed out. They are actually more akin to what a quick dynamic driver (such as the GR07 or EX1000) is capable of, but again without the added boost that comes from a mid-bass hump. Either way I doubt you will miss your TF10 with the Miracles.


----------



## 182751

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The miracles are sparkly but I wouldn't call them bright. I think they are very well-balanced. The bass extends all the way down without flinching but doesn't have any mid-bass boost. I think impact is plentiful and the notes are very well-fleshed out. They are actually more akin to what a quick dynamic driver (such as the GR07 or EX1000) is capable of, but again without the added boost that comes from a mid-bass hump. Either way I doubt you will miss your TF10 with the Miracles.


 

 Thanks a million for getting back to me so quickly Joker, really appreciate it.


----------



## mugen3

Hey joker, what do you think of the Audio Technica CKM99 compared to other IEMs in the $150-200 range? I'm looking to buy new IEMS and I'm wondering how well they hold up.


----------



## Stuie299

Quote: 





			
				ljokerl said:
			
		

> *ljokerl*





> I would double-check with head-direct regarding the adapter. They seem to be changing things around lately. The Xcape v1 is no longer available as far as I know, but the new Xcape IE model is quite good, if different in signature. I reviewed it here. It requires more power than the old Xcape and the RE-ZERO but should be driven sufficiently by most portable players. Other good, reasonably well-balanced all-rounders in the price range include the Brainwavz M3, MEElec CC51, and Fischer Silver Bullet.


 

 The more I read about the RE-ZERO the more I think they're the perfect IEM for me. Where are you getting this information that they have been changing things around lately? Everything I've read gives me the impression that nothing is changing. If things do not change then I would be interested to know which IEM has the most similar sound signature. I was thinking of going with the RE0, Xcape-IE, or MEElec CC51. Again thanks for the help.


----------



## Inks

I think Joker is referring to the fact that some RE-Zeros don't need an adapter at all. HeadDirect doesn't seem to acknowledge it though, so it's the luck of the draw. The adapter really isn't bothersome at all, don't see it as a deal-breaker.


----------



## Stuie299

Quote: 





inks said:


> I think Joker is referring to the fact that some RE-Zeros don't need an adapter at all. HeadDirect doesn't seem to acknowledge it though, so it's the luck of the draw. The adapter really isn't bothersome at all, don't see it as a deal-breaker.


 


  Oh, thanks for the info. I was just concerned because I know some people have had some complaints with the adapter. If you don't mind me asking what causes some to work without the adapter?


----------



## Inks

Because they have standard plugs, the regular Zeros come with a TRRS plug which is longer and has an extra pin and thus needs an adapter. Unless you have a Cowon S9 you need the adapter, but like I said it generally shouldn't be bothersome.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am not a huge fan of the fit of the MEElec bi-flange. It's thicker and less flexible than the hybrid. Small isolation sacrifice with the Sonys for more comfort.


 
   
  i agree the hybrids are really comfortable, but it's hard to get a decent isolation with them on the  pl50 for noisy streets. and the tri-flanges i got just dont get in my ears. so i thought  i'd try something else, and the only ones that fit the pl50 are the meelec


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mugen3 said:


> Hey joker, what do you think of the Audio Technica CKM99 compared to other IEMs in the $150-200 range? I'm looking to buy new IEMS and I'm wondering how well they hold up.


 

 The CKM99 is a decent performer but if I were looking for a neutral-to-bright dynamic in that price range it would be the GR07 or EX600. The CKM99 is slightly v-shaped in signature and doesn't control its bass or treble as well as the GR07 does. Can't fault the CKM99 on build quality or comfort, though.

  
  Quote: 





stuie299 said:


> The more I read about the RE-ZERO the more I think they're the perfect IEM for me. Where are you getting this information that they have been changing things around lately? Everything I've read gives me the impression that nothing is changing. If things do not change then I would be interested to know which IEM has the most similar sound signature. I was thinking of going with the RE0, Xcape-IE, or MEElec CC51. Again thanks for the help.


 

 RE0 would be most similar but I agree with Inks - the soft ZERO adapter really isn't much of a problem.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i agree the hybrids are really comfortable, but it's hard to get a decent isolation with them on the  pl50 for noisy streets. and the tri-flanges i got just dont get in my ears. so i thought  i'd try something else, and the only ones that fit the pl50 are the meelec


 
   

 In that case it might be worth a try. I think the M6 fit kit might come with two sizes of tri-flanges nowadays so maybe that's worth getting over the A151 kit if you don't need the singles.


----------



## kanuka

nop, no need for singles, as i have 9 pairs of hybrids (s/m/l)
  but i thought  of just gettiing the 3 pairs of bi-flanges for the a151/m6. because none of the 2 sizes of tri-flanges i got from a ebay store work.
  i dont know why but they just dont get into my ears, i guess i dont have deep ears 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 . and even i trimmed them they just dont isolate as well as the hybrids


----------



## Mdraluck23

HF5's are spectacular.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote:


stuie299 said:


> The more I read about the RE-ZERO the more I think they're the perfect IEM for me. Where are you getting this information that they have been changing things around lately? Everything I've read gives me the impression that nothing is changing. If things do not change then I would be interested to know which IEM has the most similar sound signature. I was thinking of going with the RE0, Xcape-IE, or MEElec CC51. Again thanks for the help.


 

       If I were you, I'd go for the Xcape-IE or the CC51 for promising build quality and sound quality. The RE0 excels on both for treble, but the build. I wish it were better. I heard too many complaints. I hope they got that problem solve since the last time I heard those problems.


----------



## Ikarios

The Xcape V1 is very similar ot the RE0, but the CC51 is quite different. I prefer both to the CC51 by a good margin, although if you love bass the CC51 might be higher in your personal hierarchy.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> The Xcape V1 is very similar ot the RE0, but the CC51 is quite different. I prefer both to the CC51 by a good margin, although if you love bass the CC51 might be higher in your personal hierarchy.


 

      The problem is that the V1 of Xcape isn't being sold anymore. Discontinued or near it. How's V2?


----------



## Niyologist

How's the CC51+Fiio E5+Sansa Fuze Combo?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> How's the CC51+Fiio E5+Sansa Fuze Combo?


 


  The FIIO is probably unnecessary but otherwise fine. CC51 doesn't respond to amping nearly as much as an Xcape IE or RE0.


----------



## carfentanil

mmm ... now that my XCape-IE is on its way, i'm nervous to see where my old ex300 stands just as a reference to compare ~ and much more nervous to find out just how good the ex1000 is as well as where Sony still has room to improve.  I got my 300's on sale at $60 and still feel like a relative with the MeElec M9 got a much better deal, hehe...

 [Wish List - Spiral Ear 5-Way Custom, lol]


----------



## GoodBoy

@ljokerl
  How's the Xears TD-III V2 compared to XE200PRO? Which one is better?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The FIIO is probably unnecessary but otherwise fine. CC51 doesn't respond to amping nearly as much as an Xcape IE or RE0.


 
       
        Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> mmm ... now that my XCape-IE is on its way, i'm nervous to see where my old ex300 stands just as a reference to compare ~ and much more nervous to find out just how good the ex1000 is as well as where Sony still has room to improve.  I got my 300's on sale at $60 and still feel like a relative with the MeElec M9 got a much better deal, hehe...


 

  The EX1000 is not perfect but it's very good. The EX300 isn't bad either - it's a bit old and the MSRP is too high but it's still a noticeable step above modern entry-level IEMs.

  
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> [Wish List - Spiral Ear 5-Way Custom, lol]


 

 Welcome to the club 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





goodboy said:


> @ljokerl
> How's the Xears TD-III V2 compared to XE200PRO? Which one is better?


 

 Not sure either is better. The XE200PRO is a bit more balanced, lacking the heavy midrange emphasis of the TDIII, and seems to have a slightly wider soundstage as a result. I actually prefer the TD-III as it has a very uniquely musical signature with high intelligibility but might rate the XE200 higher in technical proficiency. I quite like the Nature N3i as well - that one's got very surprising clarity and falls between the XE200 and TD-III in balance.


----------



## GoodBoy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not sure either is better. The XE200PRO is a bit more balanced, lacking the heavy midrange emphasis of the TDIII, and seems to have a slightly wider soundstage as a result. I actually prefer the TD-III as it has a very uniquely musical signature with high intelligibility but might rate the XE200 higher in technical proficiency. I quite like the Nature N3i as well - that one's got very surprising clarity and falls between the XE200 and TD-III in balance.


 
   
  Thanks a lot, I will opt for TD-III v2 then  One last question - do they suffer driver flex as much as previous generation?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





goodboy said:


> Thanks a lot, I will opt for TD-III v2 then  One last question - do they suffer driver flex as much as previous generation?


 

 Yes. I think in that respect the XE200 might have a (very small) advantage. The XE200 and CP100iP suffer the least flex of all the Xears earphones although it's still there.


----------



## kanuka

joker
  1) is there any reason to get the audio-tech ck10 if i already own the B2/dba-02?
  the main difference i see is build quality and maybe a bit more isolation
  would you consider the re0 being a good rival to those as it's for the er4s?
   
  2) im planning to get the yuin ok1 , if they are quite different from the B2.
  as for isolation i dont really care about the ok1, mainly using them as a earbud. but i'm a bit concerned about their bass and soundstage
  and also it's not completly clear to me what you mentioned about the vocals (female). is it like the westone 1 or even much better?


----------



## KevinWolf

Would be interesting to see the ex1000 on the list. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Joker, how the EX1000 compares to other top-tiers? Like CK10, CK100, SM3, W4?


----------



## kiteki

I think he's going to listen to them for a while first, but Anaxilus says the EX1000 is better than the CK10, CK100, SM3 and W4.


----------



## KevinWolf

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I think he's going to listen to them for a while first, but Anaxilus says the EX1000 is better than the CK10, CK100, SM3 and W4.


 


  Yes, probably the ex1000 is better, but i would be happy to see ex1000 in the list, to have an idea of how much better they are.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I think he's going to listen to them for a while first, but Anaxilus says the EX1000 is better than the CK10, CK100, SM3 and W4.


 

 For my ears and gears.  Haven't heard the CK100 just to be clear.


----------



## kiteki

Oh okay, btw here's what mike from headfonia had to say "The Sony is similar to the Audio Technica CK100 sound, but with a better tonal balance, soundstage, and without the signature BA transients".
   
  He also says the Sony reminds him of the R10 headphone, and is better than the JH16 in high-quality jazz and classical recordings... pretty collossal accolades there to say the least.
   
  I still think the EX600 is the gem though, perhaps Sony was already familiar with mass-producing magnesium-alloy housings (see their camera called A900), but shifting production from Japan to Thailand cuts huge costs, and both models use the same driver.  Also noted is the EX1000 uses a 7N OFC cable versus a regular OFC in the EX600, but not everyone thinks 7N sounds better, right Anaxilus?


----------



## rolz

i've been looking forever for joker's impressions on the ex600. is it here on this thread? direct link? anyone? hehehe


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I still think the EX600 is the gem though, perhaps Sony was already familiar with mass-producing magnesium-alloy housings (see their camera called A900), but shifting production from Japan to Thailand cuts huge costs, and both models use the same driver.  Also noted is the EX1000 uses a 7N OFC cable versus a regular OFC in the EX600, but not everyone thinks 7N sounds better, right Anaxilus?


 

 Yes and no.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






   
  They aren't exactly the same drivers btw.  Despite the size similarity I believe the EX600 are not LCP.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> joker
> 1) is there any reason to get the audio-tech ck10 if i already own the B2/dba-02?
> the main difference i see is build quality and maybe a bit more isolation
> would you consider the re0 being a good rival to those as it's for the er4s?
> ...


 

 I probably wouldn't bother with the CK10 if you own one of the DBA rebrands. The RE0 is a good rival to pretty much anything, it just misses out here and there compared to something like the CK10. I can still go back and forth without saying 'well this sounds like crap' (which is what happens when the CK10 goes up against something like the Klipsch S4 or Maximo iM-590). 
   
  The OK1 is pretty different from anything else I've heard. The bass is not great and does roll off. You'll get more punch out of a good in-ear. The soundstage is fine. The OK1 is brighter than the Westone 1 so there are definitely differences in how instruments and vocals are presented.
   


  Quote: 





rolz said:


> i've been looking forever for joker's impressions on the ex600. is it here on this thread? direct link? anyone? hehehe


 

 I don't own the EX600 so don't expect a full review any time soon. I did get a short (<1 hr) listening session with them against the GR07 and EX1000. The EX1000 is clearly a step up in performance though they aren't very different in signature. Diminishing returns apply. I spent about half an hour trying to split the EX600 and GR07 on technical performance and couldn't. They are very close, which should give you an idea of how the EX600 would rank on my scale.


----------



## Shufny

That sounds amazing... for you guys in the US. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But it's nice to see a huge brand pricing their higher end phone this good.


----------



## Prazzyp

oh my gosh, im in need of deserate help here.
   
  my monster turbine headphones which i purchased a couple of months ago have now broken... the sound in one ear has completely gone, but the other side seems to be working fine, is there anything that i can do?
   
  and these are just the regular turbines, not the pro editions.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





shufny said:


> That sounds amazing... for you guys in the US.


 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sony-MDR-EX600-Studio-Quality-Earbud-DJ-Headphones-2011-/220803187933?pt=DJ_Gear_Lighting&hash=item3368e544dd
   
  "Ships To: Worldwide"


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> http://cgi.ebay.com/Sony-MDR-EX600-Studio-Quality-Earbud-DJ-Headphones-2011-/220803187933?pt=DJ_Gear_Lighting&hash=item3368e544dd
> 
> "Ships To: Worldwide"


 

 This is legit? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 what is the msrp?


----------



## Shufny

Quote:


kiteki said:


> http://cgi.ebay.com/Sony-MDR-EX600-Studio-Quality-Earbud-DJ-Headphones-2011-/220803187933?pt=DJ_Gear_Lighting&hash=item3368e544dd
> 
> "Ships To: Worldwide"


 
 "Shipping and handling: US $54.95"
  
  And I assume you know that shipping from the US usually isn't the same as shipping from the east. Especially if it's a Sony.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I probably wouldn't bother with the CK10 if you own one of the DBA rebrands. *The RE0 is a good rival to pretty much anything*, it just misses out here and there compared to something like the CK10. I can still go back and forth without saying 'well this sounds like crap' (which is what happens when the CK10 goes up against something like the Klipsch S4 or Maximo iM-590).
> 
> The OK1 is pretty different from anything else I've heard. The bass is not great and does roll off. You'll get more punch out of a good in-ear. The soundstage is fine. The OK1 is brighter than the Westone 1 so there are definitely differences in how instruments and vocals are presented.


 
   
  thanks clearing things up
  can you say the same about the re-zero and/or the new sunrise's xcape ie and xcited?
   
  as for the ok1 bass. i havent heard any other iem than the pl50, and they're totally not bassy. all the others i have are just earbuds , which have a much better bass than the pl50, specially the pk1 (even unamped) have a way great impact than can make dizzy/sleepy. with the pl50 i feel the mid/vocals very fwdd, treble in second place and last the flat bass. dont get me wrong they're great but missing the fun.
  the B2 should arrive very very soon, then i can compare them.
  it's just i dont want to miss a sale offer on the ok1, and i like what you mention about them being very airy with great instrument separation and vocals. i'm just worried not to miss the bass impact of the pk1
  i thing i'll ask again after getting some impression of the B2, if you dont mind , of course
  thanks again


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> They aren't exactly the same drivers btw.  Despite the size similarity I believe the EX600 are not LCP.


 

 I thought I saw mention of LCP in the EX600 somewhere at the end of last year, but I can't find it now.  You own both, what do you think, do they actually sound different enough to be using different driver material? or is the difference in sound more in line with the inner-housing material, like in the FI-BA-XX series?
  If the EX600 is using a 16mm multi-layer polyethene driver like in the EX700, I'm confused how Sony has supposedly made the EX600 sound so much better and caused all this hype, so I'm inclined to believe it's using a different driver material, such as LCP, or even bio-cellulose, and Sony is simply leaving out the LCP from the specs sheets for marketing purposes "Look, the EX1000 is special". 
   
  E484 - bio-cellulose
  E888 - bio-cellulose
  CD3000 - bio-cellulose
  R10 - bio-cellulose
  EX500 - polyethene?
  EX700 - polyethene
  EX600 - ?
  EX800 - ?
  EX1000 - LCP
  Z1000 - LCP
   
  pics
EX700
E888
EX500


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> oh my gosh, im in need of deserate help here.
> 
> my monster turbine headphones which i purchased a couple of months ago have now broken... the sound in one ear has completely gone, but the other side seems to be working fine, is there anything that i can do?
> 
> and these are just the regular turbines, not the pro editions.


 


 Warranty service? Monster's warranty support is pretty painless although one time they "forgot" to contact me and let me know that replacement units for my particular model were OOS.



  Quote: 





shufny said:


> "Shipping and handling: US $54.95"
> 
> And I assume you know that shipping from the US usually isn't the same as shipping from the east. Especially if it's a Sony.


 


  Ouch. $200+ and (presumably) no warranty? I'd rather have the GR07.



  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> thanks clearing things up  can you say the same about the re-zero and/or the new sunrise's xcape ie and xcited?


 

 The IE and Xcited are different. The RE0/ZERO (and Xcape v1) signatures are easier to go back to from a true top-tier since they are less 'flavoured'. The Xcited is bright, overly spacious, and quite aggressive. It works on its own but in an A:B comparison with B2, CK10, etc it probably won't sound very natural. The IE is different but its thicker, warmer sound will result in a much more noticeable clarity drop when switching from something like the CK10 compared to the RE0/ZERO.


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Warranty service? Monster's warranty support is pretty painless although one time they "forgot" to contact me and let me know that replacement units for my particular model were OOS.


 


  ok thanks, do you have a link to their warranty service or anything, i can seem to find anything


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> ok thanks, do you have a link to their warranty service or anything, i can seem to find anything


 


  You have to call them up. Annoyingly, they never respond to email or contact forms.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I thought I saw mention of LCP in the EX600 somewhere at the end of last year, but I can't find it now.  You own both, what do you think, do they actually sound different enough to be using different driver material? or is the difference in sound more in line with the inner-housing material, like in the FI-BA-XX series?
> If the EX600 is using a 16mm multi-layer polyethene driver like in the EX700, I'm confused how Sony has supposedly made the EX600 sound so much better and caused all this hype, so I'm inclined to believe it's using a different driver material, such as LCP, or even bio-cellulose, and *Sony is simply leaving out the LCP from the specs sheets for marketing purposes "Look, the EX1000 is special".*


 

 I thought the same thing.  I'm pretty sure the MDR7550/EX800 said 'multi-layer polymer'.  So you could read that either way.  The 600 and 1000 do have a similar signature but whether that means they have the same driver or are just tuned for that house sound is another question.  There is certainly a proficiency difference between the three models but tis hard to say whether it's driver or acoustic treatment.  The nuances and added detail of the 1000 certainly make it seem like a better driver.  Otherwise Sony is gimping the 7550 and 600 drivers since they do sound less technically capable.  Then there's the cable question but I digress.  I believe I recall someone linking that the 600 wasn't LCP, not sure though.  
   
  They certainly aren't bio-cellulose as I'm quite familiar with what those sound like.  I've had the CDR2K for almost a decade and a half and remember the GR07's sound.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> They certainly aren't bio-cellulose as I'm quite familiar with what those sound like.  I've had the CDR2K for almost a decade and a half and remember the GR07's sound.


 

 wow, a decade and a half! now that is something, my first impression of you was some 21 year old audio enthusiast kid that likes metal Lol 
   
  Ok, thanks for confirming it's not bio-cel, I admit I am theorizing a bit too much and need to find a sonystyle store, I am optimistic about the EX600 but can't spend $200 on them when I already own the EX700 :/


----------



## Inks

EX600 and 7550s are multi-layer film diaphragm drivers, whereas the EX1000 uses a liquid crystal polymer driver. I think all 3 are using very similar tuning but the driver difference will most likely occur between the EX600/7550 (which most likely use the same one) vs the EX1000. In addition, the 7550s do seem to have an output limitation ala GR07 that compresses it's dynamic range and it's a tuning choice due to it's purpose.


----------



## kiteki

Ok I found one, this article says the EX600 uses LCP.


----------



## Inks

That article is wrong, the official Sony box says it's a multi layer diaphragm. It is also the same on the offical Sony Japan website, I wouldn't trust articles such as those, they certainly got that wrong. EX510 (though in a smaller configuration), EX600 and EX7550/800ST use what Sony label as ML (Multi-layer film) in their diaphragms which involves very thin cuts of polymer. The EX1000 uses a distinctively different driver. 
   
  edit: lol it even says the EX600 uses magnesium housing....


----------



## kiteki

Edit: ok ok fine that article is just posting the ex1000 specs and I was misled/being optimistic hoping Sony put their best driver in the cheap ex600 :/ :/
   
  I'm still confused how the EX600 can apparently sound so much better than the EX700 if they are both using the same ML polyethene type driver, and the EX700 even has magnesium inner-housing which should lean it more in favour of the EX1000, but the EX700 is harsh and has weak imaging, is it the shape of the housing? different filters? I cannot rest! Sorry.
   
  I don't mean to hype the EX600 I realise there are other offerings out there like the cheaper and more snug GR07, and james444 has pointed out that it's a "romantic" IEM and CK10/ER-4P lovers might not rate it very highly.


----------



## Anaxilus

Read the whole article.  It is describing the EX1000.  The 7NOFC cable.  Extra short cable accessory.  The EX600 uses aluminum not magnesium according to Sony.  Way off.


----------



## Inks

kiteki said:


> OK but I still have a hunch Sony mass-produced the LCP driver and are omitting it from the specs online and on the box to favour marketing for the EX1000, since reviews are saying they sound very similiar, and if the EX600 is using an ML polyethene driver like in the EX700 then it should not sound close to the EX1000 at all especially since the FR graphs are quite similiar and the EX700 already uses a magnesium inner-housing and sounds like crap according to most users!  p.s. here is the LCP in the Z1000 driver http://assets.head-fi.org/7/74/1000x500px-LL-748eb9ac_2.jpg
> 
> Sorry joker for hyping the ex600 a bit in your thread, I realise there are dozens of great IEM's out there like the GR07 which costs less at $156 including shipping, and james444 has pointed out that it's more for "romantic" listening and er-4P/ck10 lovers might not rate the ex600 very highly..


 
  You could go ahead and make some theories on it, but I trust Sonys' specs. If anything the Japanese companies are the most trustworthy when it comes to specs, JVC being another. Yes, EX600 sounds similar but like I said, they have similar tuning but the EX1000 is still a step ahead and it uses a different driver. I think it's all pretty straightforward and I trust the specs.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





inks said:


> You could go ahead and make some theories on it, but I trust Sonys' specs. If anything the Japanese companies are the most trustworthy when it comes to specs, JVC being another. Yes, EX600 sounds similar but like I said, they have similar tuning but the EX1000 is still a step ahead and it uses a different driver. The EX700 uses a unique bio-cellulose not a ML like the EX600. I think it's all pretty straightforward, no need to overcomplicate it.


 

 I didn't realise that but you are right Japanese companies tend to be quite honest... apart from the mW input and frequency extension on the CK10??
   
  Why do you think EX700 uses bio-cellulose? do you have a source on that? http://www.gadgetlite.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/sony-mdr-ex700lp-headphone-in-ear.jpg


----------



## Inks

Sometimes the frequency extension may seem overblown because they're using a more advanced way of testing that range than just going by ear and perhaps going air movement or something of the sort. 
   
  You are right the EX700 uses a ML diaphragm, couldn't double check that as I had to do something. I was probably thinking of another Sony. Anyways, similar frequency response doesn't equal same driver though the EX600/EX700/7550 most likely do. The EX1000 may be using the same driver but dissolved in a polymer solvent or heating it pass it's melting point to create that LCP. Either way it's technically not the same driver at the end. 
   
  EX600/700/800=Multi Layer Polymer
  EX1000=Multi Layer Liquid Crystal Polymer


----------



## Kagelou

Looking forward to the SE215 review^^
  Thinking about buying it, but kind of worried about the build quality...


----------



## Niyologist

I'd love to hear how the EX1000 sounds. It's on my "to get" list. =)


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You have to call them up. Annoyingly, they never respond to email or contact forms.


 

 hmm i live here in the UK, and i can only find international numbers?


----------



## Angelopsaro

I have once again another question! Joker. How would you compare the highs between the q-jays, visonic Gr07 and the FA dba02 (very similar to the Brainwavz B2?)?
  It seems i wasnt very comfortable to the crispy highs of the q-jays. I likes the clarity and transparency but not very aggressive.


----------



## n-phect

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Edit: ok ok fine that article is just posting the ex1000 specs and I was misled/being optimistic hoping Sony put their best driver in the cheap ex600 :/ :/
> 
> I'm still confused how the EX600 can apparently sound so much better than the EX700 if they are both using the same ML polyethene type driver, and the EX700 even has magnesium inner-housing which should lean it more in favour of the EX1000, but the EX700 is harsh and has weak imaging, is it the shape of the housing? different filters? I cannot rest! Sorry.
> 
> I don't mean to hype the EX600 I realise there are other offerings out there like the cheaper and more snug GR07, and james444 has pointed out that it's a "romantic" IEM and CK10/ER-4P lovers might not rate it very highly.


 

 you have discovered a glitch in the matrix...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> hmm i live here in the UK, and i can only find international numbers?


 

 Monster probably handles warranty through their local retailers/distributors but I'd give them a call anyway.
   


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> I have once again another question! Joker. How would you compare the highs between the q-jays, visonic Gr07 and the FA dba02 (very similar to the Brainwavz B2?)?
> It seems i wasnt very comfortable to the crispy highs of the q-jays. I likes the clarity and transparency but not very aggressive.


 

 I think I would stay away from all of those if you found the q-JAYS aggressive. Maybe a smoother dynamic like the RE252 or the slightly darker Westone 2 would be a better match.


----------



## possante87

hi. how is sound quality of vsonic GR07 compared with headphone audio M50? i like very much the sound of M50....GR07 have a sound like M50? or exist better options like FA dba02?
  vsonic GR07 still is one of best preice/performance on market?
  thanks


----------



## n-phect

Joker what's your initial impressions of the Sony ex600/ ex1000? If ex1000 is on par with westone 4 I will buy me thinks.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Monster probably handles warranty through their local retailers/distributors but I'd give them a call anyway.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


 The Q jays are hotter as their responce is a bit more U shaped but the advice is sound. The B2 and is smoother overall but it was still a bit too top prevalent for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


possante87 said:


> hi. how is sound quality of vsonic GR07 compared with headphone audio M50? i like very much the sound of M50....GR07 have a sound like M50? or exist better options like FA dba02?
> vsonic GR07 still is one of best preice/performance on market?
> thanks


   
  The GR07 is not as bass-heavy as the M50 is but I think it's a better match than the DBA-02. After trying the Sony EX600 I have to say that with fit/comfort/isolation factored in the GR07 is still my top $150 pick though the EX600 sounds equally good.


 Quote:


n-phect said:


> Joker what's your initial impressions of the Sony ex600/ ex1000? If ex1000 is on par with westone 4 I will buy me thinks.


 
 EX1000 is about on par with W4. They have different strengths and weaknesses. 
   
  There are no plans for an EX600 review at this time - I only heard it briefly and was able to confirm that 
   
  a. There is a noticeable gap in sound quality between the EX600 and EX1000 (though keep diminishing returns in mind)
   
  b. The EX600 performs about as well as the similarly-priced GR07 overall, which is very impressive for a big-brand unit
   
  c. I like the EX600 better than similarly-priced dynamics from Sennheiser and Audio-Technica.
   
   
   
  Quote:


goodvibes said:


> The B2 and is smoother overall but it was still a bit too top prevalent for me.


 
   
   
  That's exactly my worry.


----------



## n-phect

I really am caring less about sound, I just need an iem that I don't have to fuss with. Something I can stick in and go. No pulling my ear, jamming it in my head,ect. I'm sick of this seal CRAP


----------



## Inks

Joker will eventually get a chance to listen to my EX600, FXT90 and FX500. His backlog is pretty big at the time though so I'll give it some time since I'm keeping these.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





n-phect said:


> I really am caring less about sound, I just need an iem that I don't have to fuss with. Something I can stick in and go. No pulling my ear, jamming it in my head,ect. I'm sick of this seal CRAP


 

 what are you using now? have you tried the ety's?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





inks said:


> Joker will eventually get a chance to listen to my EX600, FXT90 and FX500. His backlog is pretty big at the time though so I'll give it some time since I'm keeping these.


 

 HA-FXT90 too? Nice.


----------



## vwinter

inks said:


> Joker will eventually get a chance to listen to my EX600, FXT90 and FX500. His backlog is pretty big at the time though so I'll give it some time since I'm keeping these.



Have you had an opportunity to compare the FXT90's to the DDM's, seeing a they are comparable in price internationally?


----------



## Niyologist

I wonder how the Sansa Fuze+CC51+Fiio E11 combo is?
   
  Yes, I'm planning to purchase the E11.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> what are you using now? have you tried the ety's?


 

 Well, if you don't get a deep seal w/ the ER4 you bass will go missing for the most part.  Plus those Ety tri-flanges tickle and itch after more than 10-15 minutes for me.  Ety foams are also tedious to deal with.
   
  Anything w/ Klipsch gels are easiest and 'bestest' for my ears.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Followed by Meelec silicones.


----------



## musedesign

lJokerl,
    Thank you for putting together this fantastic resource, I come back to it over and over.  I normally use headphones, but would like to get a pair of IEMs for air travel.  
   
    I use the DT770 250ohms (non-pro) most of the time, great headphone, but bulky.  Can you recommend an IEM to pair with the iBasso D4 with the topkit?  I am looking in the $100-$200 range, I enjoy an accurate midrange, large sound stage and and transparency.
   
  Thank you!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Well, if you don't get a deep seal w/ the ER4 you bass will go missing for the most part.  Plus those Ety tri-flanges tickle and itch after more than 10-15 minutes for me.  Ety foams are also tedious to deal with.
> 
> Anything w/ Klipsch gels are easiest and 'bestest' for my ears.
> 
> ...


 
  do you know if all the klipsch gels are oval shape and if are sold alone?


----------



## Inks

vwinter said:


> Have you had an opportunity to compare the FXT90's to the DDM's, seeing a they are comparable in price internationally?


 
    I'll probably get more into this soon but here's what I can give so far. The FXT90s are actually more balanced, the treble is more prominent than the two DDMs and actually manages to keep a smooth character. While it doesn't have the depth of bass of the two DDMs, the FXT90s are faster and the midbass/lower mid warmth isn't as prominent as with the DDMs. Mids are probably about the same in presentation but the FXT90s are clearer and have a unique kind of thickness. DDMs have more stage depth and width but the FXT90s layers each instrument more precisely and offer outstanding imaging for a dynamic. The FXT90s sound a lot more coherent to me, there is no grain which I can't say for the DDM and the timbre is quite realistic while carrying a good tonal balance that leans toward the warm side of things without sounding subdued. These are actually very balanced despite leaning to a warmer sound, the EQ7 in comparison actually sound warmer and yet harsher while also lacking the treble sparkle of the JVCs.


----------



## Tefloon

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Well, if you don't get a deep seal w/ the ER4 you bass will go missing for the most part.  Plus those Ety tri-flanges tickle and itch after more than 10-15 minutes for me.  Ety foams are also tedious to deal with.
> 
> Anything w/ Klipsch gels are easiest and 'bestest' for my ears.
> 
> ...


 

 I found the triflanges became more comfortable after 2 or 3 weeks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





musedesign said:


> I use the DT770 250ohms (non-pro) most of the time, great headphone, but bulky.  Can you recommend an IEM to pair with the iBasso D4 with the topkit?  I am looking in the $100-$200 range, I enjoy an accurate midrange, large sound stage and and transparency.


 


  I'm not a huge fan of the DT770/250 to be honest and I've never heard the D4 but depending on your balance preferences I'd look at the Fischer DBA-02, HiFiMan RE252, VSonic GR07, and Sony EX600. If you don't need isolation the Yuin OK1 may be worth a look as well.


----------



## kiteki

So the Yuin OK1 is still a contender for the highest transparency and nakedness in an IEM?
   
  P.S. music_4321 seems to think the Sony MDR-7550 has the most accurate midrange of the new Sony trio, I realise it's above the budget of user musedesign, just putting it out there.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> P.S. music_4321 seems to think the Sony MDR-7550 has the most accurate midrange of the new Sony trio, I realise it's above the budget of user musedesign, just putting it out there.


 

 Did he say accurate?  I thought it was best and preferred qualifying that he liked it a bit forward?


----------



## kiteki

He wrote:
   
  "The 7550s are possibly the most truly neutral IEMs I've heard, more so than the W4s & EX1000s, or at least they have a more convincing, realistic neutrality."
  "*--* Mids -- FANTASTIC! - I frankly did not expect them to be just this good. Just the right balance and proper real presence, not (overly) forward and/or thick, nor slightly recessed - just bloody PERFECT!!"
   
  Sonove:
http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=ja&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fsonove.angry.jp%2Fsony_MDR_EX800ST.html


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> "*--* Mids -- FANTASTIC! - I frankly did not expect them to be just this good. Just the right balance and proper real presence, not (*overly*) forward and/or thick, nor slightly recessed - just bloody PERFECT!!"


 

  See bolded.  =)


----------



## swbf2cheater

I love my 866B, not only is it comfortable to boot in my dainty ears   but it had a nice sound to it despite the somewhat bloated bass.  On a budget, I think its a real winner of a set and my bud of choice currently for the on the go needs.


----------



## vwinter

*@Inks*
Thanks, I had to think for a bit as to why I asked, beside it being a logical question: I'm trying to find my gf an upgrade to the nuforce ne-6m that she loves and i think the DDM would have fit issues for her. She likes my GR07's but would prefer a slightly more rumble in the bass. After you described them, I kind of want them now haha. You have any hunches about them dropping in price internationally any time soon?


----------



## musedesign

Quote:  





> I'm not a huge fan of the DT770/250 to be honest and I've never heard the D4 but depending on your balance preferences I'd look at the Fischer DBA-02, HiFiMan RE252, VSonic GR07, and Sony EX600. If you don't need isolation the Yuin OK1 may be worth a look as well.


 

 Hi Joker,
    Thank you for the recommendations!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> So the Yuin OK1 is still a contender for the highest transparency and nakedness in an IEM?


 


  I think so


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think so


 

 what exactrly you mean by transparency and nakedness ?


----------



## kiteki

I had the chance to listen to the Shure SE535 today, and was not impressed.  I prefer the Shure SE425.


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> P.S. music_4321 seems to think the Sony MDR-7550 has the most accurate midrange of the new Sony trio, I realise it's above the budget of user musedesign, just putting it out there.


 
   
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> He wrote:
> 
> "The 7550s are possibly the most truly neutral IEMs I've heard, more so than the W4s & EX1000s, or at least they have a more convincing, realistic neutrality."
> "*--* Mids -- FANTASTIC! - I frankly did not expect them to be just this good. Just the right balance and proper real presence, not (overly) forward and/or thick, nor slightly recessed - just bloody PERFECT!!"
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Anaxilus* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 
   
  There was another post where I said: "Either the mids may be ever so slightly recessed on the EX1000s or the 7550s mid-range (except upper mids) is ever so slightly forward". All my comments quoted above came from my impressions *without *doing a direct comparison between the EX1000 & 7550 (a couple of times I did say "from memory" as my EX1000s were away for nearly 3 weeks).
   
  What I meant then was that I found the mids to be even more neutral than the EX1000's mids. When I said "not (overly) forward and/or thick, nor slightly recessed" I meant they're the most neutral/flat/accurate mids I've heard - I do NOT think they're forward. "Overly" is in brackets because since the 7550s are meant for stage use, I thought they might turn out to have more forward mids a la ES3X, but they actually didn't.
   
  Today I got my EX1000s back and confirmed my comments re the 7550's mids, but found the EX1000's mids (which I already liked A LOT) to be even closer to the 7550's than I first thought, but the latter still had the edge by a VERY small margin in the mid-range.
   
  Having said that, the EX1000 is the best IEM I've heard to date - the 7550 is a close second.


----------



## Inks

The EX800s mids would be more forward as it has less treble and bass response. Too bad the 7550s lack the dynamic range of the EX1000s fwir.


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





inks said:


> The EX800s mids would be more forward as it has less treble and bass response.


 

 Not so sure I agree with that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> what exactrly you mean by transparency and nakedness ?


 

 The ability of the earphone itself to 'disappear', so to speak, and provide as realistic a listening experience as possible. It hinges on clarity, detail, resolution, texture, etc. 'Veiled' sound would be the exact opposite.


----------



## kanuka

thanks
  and wow, that seems a great thing.
  so than means they're "lively" as well?


----------



## Caze

Been thinking about upgrading my Eterna v1 and have pretty much decided on RE262 or VSonic GR07. From sound signature perspective I can't really say which one I'd like more so it comes down to comfort. One of the biggest gripes with the Eternas for me is that they are too bulky to sleep with. Is either of those small enough/have the shape so that they don't become uncomfortable when having the ear against the pillow? Other suggestions are welcome too.


----------



## Angelopsaro

The thing about the 262 is that are power hunger. joker states that 262 drains j3 battery in 8 hours!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> thanks
> and wow, that seems a great thing.
> so than means they're "lively" as well?


 

 "lively" is often used to refer to a v-shaped response curve these days and the OK1 really doesn't have that.


  Quote: 





caze said:


> Been thinking about upgrading my Eterna v1 and have pretty much decided on RE262 or VSonic GR07. From sound signature perspective I can't really say which one I'd like more so it comes down to comfort. One of the biggest gripes with the Eternas for me is that they are too bulky to sleep with. Is either of those small enough/have the shape so that they don't become uncomfortable when having the ear against the pillow? Other suggestions are welcome too.


 

 I can lie down in the GR07 just fine - it's definitely slimmer than the Eterna and the swivel nozzle helps. The RE262 - not so much.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> "lively" is often used to refer to a v-shaped response curve these days and the OK1 really doesn't have that.


 
  sorry. but as being "transparent" i thought the music sounds as in "live". it's a bit confusing


----------



## Inks

The RE262 actually sits in deeper and is less obtrusive than  the GR07 if you have the channels reversed and wear them over the ear, so a newer batch will be good for this.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kanuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> sorry. but as being "transparent" i thought the music sounds as in "live". it's a bit confusing


 

 Definitely don't mean to give an english lesson here but:
   
   
  Quote: 





> *live·ly / ˈlīvlē / Adjective*
> 
> 1. Full of life and energy; active and outgoing


 
   
   
   
  Live sound and the term 'lively' don't have a whole lot to do with each other. 'Lifelike' is probably closer.


----------



## kanuka

thanks for the lesson and sorry. there are many terms i still dont get. even "balanced" sounds like "neutral" which is not. someone should list the equal and opposite terms, specially for non-native english speakers or even for newbies
   
  anyway , so the ok1 ARE "live/lifelike" and NOT "lively"(balanced). gotcha!


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *kanuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> someone should list the equal and opposite terms, specially for non-native english speakers or even for newbies


 

http://www.stereophile.com/content/sounds-audio-glossary-reverse-glossary-part-2


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Quote:
> 
> http://www.stereophile.com/content/sounds-audio-glossary-reverse-glossary-part-2


 
  thnk you very much


----------



## kiteki

You're welcome, it's a good glossary =)
   
  For americans following the FOTM, Sony EX600, it's now down to $125 on amazon.com.


----------



## Heret1c

Hi Joker, just wanted to say this is a great thread / resource and thanks for all the effort / time taken to share all your reviews / impressions. You opinions are highly valued and appreciated by me, along with those of a few others.
   
  Will / do you have the EX1000s in your collection and will you be putting up impressions of them on this thread? Would love to hear your take on them. If you already done so and I missed it, I apologise. Its easy to miss things in a massive thread like this one.
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Hi Joker, just wanted to say this is a great thread / resource and thanks for all the effort / time taken to share all your reviews / impressions. You opinions are highly valued and appreciated by me, along with those of a few others.
> 
> Will / do you have the EX1000s in your collection and will you be putting up impressions of them on this thread? Would love to hear your take on them. If you already done so and I missed it, I apologise. Its easy to miss things in a massive thread like this one.
> 
> Thanks again!


 


  Thanks, I appreciate that!
   
  The EX1000 will be added in the near future. If you're interested in what's coming up, there's a list of planned reviews on the front page, below the summary table.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, I appreciate that!
> 
> The EX1000 will be added in the near future. If you're interested in what's coming up, there's a list of planned reviews on the front page, below the summary table.


 

 Yeah, just realised i missed that. D'oh! Sorry. Oh goodie, i really cannot wait to hear your take on the Ex1000s.


----------



## kanuka

hi joker and everyone !
  may i have your suggestion/advice again?
  the thing is, its like a 1.5 month i'm using the pl50. but im having really "serious" isolation/fit and comfort issues. and i tried different type and sizes of tips and no help.
  so i think i'll give up over the pl50 , at least for a while.
  so may need something different.
  i asked clieos and this his reply:
   
  Quote: 





clieos said:


> PL50 is a fairly shallowly fitted IEM with a semi-small nozzle. For your case, I think an IEM with wide nozzle or deeper fitting might be the direction you want to go.


 
   
  what can you suggest me?
  for now i dont want to risk too much money, so i'd rather get a sub $100, but i can see the re-zero as an exception
  the signature , design and/or wearing style is not a real matter right now, as long as it's not a total bassy iem
  the truth is i'm interested in the re0/re-zero and the sunrise's for a while , but dont want to make the same mistake i made with the pl50
  any ideas are welcome
  thanks


----------



## applevalleyjoe

What a fabulous thread...thanks for your hard work putting it together...now, to order!


----------



## possante87

anyone here have already listen to shure se425? how are they in SQ and wich IEM have a sound similar? i can buy them for 160€ with almost 3 year warranty...is a good buy or exist better in this price range?


----------



## kiteki

I listened to them briefly.
   
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I didn't even achieve a good seal, and I think it has the best imaging I've heard in an IEM so far, exceeding the ck10, very good soundstage, sturdy, cool design and a beckoning, desireful sound, in the end too dark to attract my interest though, and a bit lacking in tonality and cleanness.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kanuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> what exactrly you mean by transparency and nakedness ?


 

 He means this  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvfKAc2QJjA


----------



## ljokerl

Added Soundmagic E10
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A57) Soundmagic E10*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jul 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kanuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> for now i dont want to risk too much money, so i'd rather get a sub $100, but i can see the re-zero as an exception
> the signature , design and/or wearing style is not a real matter right now, as long as it's not a total bassy iem
> ...


 

 The RE-ZERO is a good all-rounder to buy. The design is very generic and very different from the PL50. It's not exactly deeply-fitting but the head-direct bi-flanges compensate for that. Sadly the Sunrise Xcape is no longer available and the IE/Xcited have more flavoured signatures.


  Quote: 





applevalleyjoe said:


> What a fabulous thread...thanks for your hard work putting it together...now, to order!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The RE-ZERO is a good all-rounder to buy. The design is very generic and very different from the PL50. It's not exactly deeply-fitting but the head-direct bi-flanges compensate for that. Sadly the Sunrise Xcape is no longer available and the IE/Xcited have more flavoured signatures.


 

 thanks a lot.
  i dont really care about signature right now as long the fit/isolation really improves from the pl50
  something else i should consider before deciding?
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> He means this  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvfKAc2QJjA


 

 that's 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 (and my avatar). if it'll be like that with japanese vocals will be AWSOME


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> thanks a lot.
> i dont really care about signature right now as long the fit/isolation really improves from the pl50
> something else i should consider before deciding?


 

  Those cheap Ety HF-series on Amazon with a pair of Shure Olives


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those cheap Ety HF-series on Amazon with a pair of Shure Olives


 


  thanks. they ARE cheap but no international shipping. and amazon shipping rates to here are just insane!
  i did considered the HF5 before as i dont need a microphone. but i'd rather get them at a local store , even they're more expensive, about $130, and only 1-year warranty. but it's still more than my actual budget. unless they get really cheaper
  thanks a lot as always
  and nice review of the E10


----------



## UserFriendly

Can you give an estimate time as to when the TF10 and Miracles will be reviewed?


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those cheap Ety HF-series on Amazon with a pair of Shure Olives


 


 He could always try some olives on his pl50 first. They don't need to be fully pushed on to stay put so better isolation plus deeper fit. It's what I used to use.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> He could always try some olives on his pl50 first. They don't need to be fully pushed on to stay put so better isolation plus deeper fit. It's what I used to use.


 
  indeed i tried most of my tips "fully pushed on" but it still didnt work and just gave a less comfort.
  as for the olives, i dont know how much different they're from the pl50 foams. i just now they're the same length, and with the large size foams THAT was not  comfort


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





userfriendly said:


> Can you give an estimate time as to when the TF10 and Miracles will be reviewed?


 


  Not with any certainty


----------



## psyco1

Just want to say thanks for all the work you put into this thread, although it's hurt my wallet a bit.
  First the RE0, then the Turbines, then the Mi-9 and now the Klipsch S2. I saw they were $21 at amazon and thought the design looked right to wear under a full face helmet with hopefully more bass than my er-6. Holy smokes, they sure sound a lot better than a 20 buck phone should.


----------



## s0lar

I would like some advice. I own several IEM's but they all lack something.
  I owned a RE0 and now own a RE-ZERO, but I don't like the adapter with the ZERO, it makes noise when you touch it and is too bulky in my amp or dap.
  The RE0 was almost as good only looking at sound and I could easily lay down on my ear listening to music. Same deal with the Xcapes I used to own. Perhaps one of the new reincarnations is a good option.
  I also own TD-III, M1 and DDM's, all of them sound good but are not that comfortable to lay down with.
  So what I am looking for is a IEM that is very comfortable, small enough to not be disturbing in your ears when laying down on one ear and sound good.
  The ability to have an very good and easy fit and seal and no or little microphonics.
  Good mids and very good extension both ways. Not too bass-heavy, musical with a hint of warmth, does not have to be very easy to drive and I do not mind some sibilance and brightness.
  Any recommendations?


----------



## lina

hello
  first post as a new  user
  i have the SM pl50 and i want something better
  after reading some reviews
  i'm trying to decide between the RE0 RE-ZERO Sunrise Xcited and Xcape IE
  for someone new in iem world, which one of the 4 above is better for japanese pop and rock ?
  thanks


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





s0lar said:


> I would like some advice. I own several IEM's but they all lack something.
> I owned a RE0 and now own a RE-ZERO, but I don't like the adapter with the ZERO, it makes noise when you touch it and is too bulky in my amp or dap.
> The RE0 was almost as good only looking at sound and I could easily lay down on my ear listening to music. Same deal with the Xcapes I used to own. Perhaps one of the new reincarnations is a good option.
> I also own TD-III, M1 and DDM's, all of them sound good but are not that comfortable to lay down with.
> ...


 

 CK10


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


lina said:


> hello
> first post as a new  user
> i have the SM pl50 and i want something better
> after reading some reviews
> ...


 

 Yeah, I found the PL50 pretty boring.  I'll let you know what I think of the RE0 with j-rock, otherwise, my favorite so far for j-rock is the Sony MDR-E888.


----------



## lina

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Quote:
> 
> Yeah, I found the PL50 pretty boring.  I'll let you know what I think of the RE0 with j-rock, otherwise, my favorite so far for j-rock is the Sony MDR-E888.


 
  thank you. i'm waiting for your opinion of the RE0.
  as for the mdre888. arent those regular non-isolation earbuds? i already have a variety of earbuds, being the Yuin PK1 my last purchase.
  but thanks for the idea


----------



## kiteki

Yeah they're non-isolation earbuds, just sayin'.
   
  Apparently the RE0 and CK10 sound very similiar, and I already gave my thoughts on the ck10 and j-rock in my ck10 review if you search for it, so that should give you a rough idea of what I'll think of the RE0.  On the other hand the RE0 is a dynamic driver and is supposed to have more natural sounding mids or something like that.  I think J-rock and similiar genres will favour a slightly more visceral, natural, coloured sound, as opposed to reference quality, but that's just my hunch.


----------



## lina

thnks. i'll read your ck10 review


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





psyco1 said:


> Just want to say thanks for all the work you put into this thread, although it's hurt my wallet a bit.
> First the RE0, then the Turbines, then the Mi-9 and now the Klipsch S2. I saw they were $21 at amazon and thought the design looked right to wear under a full face helmet with hopefully more bass than my er-6. Holy smokes, they sure sound a lot better than a 20 buck phone should.


 

 Four IEMs? Seems reasonable to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Glad the thread was useful.
   


  Quote: 





s0lar said:


> I would like some advice. I own several IEM's but they all lack something.
> I owned a RE0 and now own a RE-ZERO, but I don't like the adapter with the ZERO, it makes noise when you touch it and is too bulky in my amp or dap.
> The RE0 was almost as good only looking at sound and I could easily lay down on my ear listening to music. Same deal with the Xcapes I used to own. Perhaps one of the new reincarnations is a good option.
> I also own TD-III, M1 and DDM's, all of them sound good but are not that comfortable to lay down with.
> ...


 

 I wouldn't necessarily call it musical but the GR07 may work for you otherwise. The RE262 flipped upside down can work as well but I don't know if you want to use the channel reversal adapter after your experience with the RE-ZERO. Other sets I'd look at - Westone 2, q-JAYS, and Senn IE7, though I think these all yield to the RE262/GR07 in sound quality and usually cost more.
   


  Quote: 





lina said:


> hello
> first post as a new  user
> i have the SM pl50 and i want something better
> after reading some reviews
> ...


 

 Not sure about jrock but for 'regular' rock I prefer the RE-ZERO, followed very closely by the RE0.


----------



## lina

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not sure about jrock but for 'regular' rock I prefer the RE-ZERO, followed very closely by the RE0.


 

 thanks. i need the vocals to sound clear.
  so you think i could tell the difference between the 0 and the Zero?
  also, will a good amp improve the 0 over the zero, or at least make them even?


----------



## Niyologist

Interesting....
   
  http://www.ifans.com/blog/26665/


----------



## ljokerl

Added the UM Miracle. The chart has been rescaled and sound now has slightly (30%) more weight in the average than before.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1A2) Unique Melody Miracle*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jul 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





lina said:


> thanks. i need the vocals to sound clear.
> so you think i could tell the difference between the 0 and the Zero?
> also, will a good amp improve the 0 over the zero, or at least make them even?


 

 In a direct comparison it's not difficult to differentiate the two. Owning only one, I doubt you'll be able to say which one it is if you didn't know. I don't think either has a clarity edge over the other. Amping the RE0 does help and with the right amp it may even have an edge over the ZERO but then adding a decent amp would push it to a different price bracket.


----------



## rawrster

It sounds like the Miracle may be close to what I have in my UM customs but can't know for sure unless I buy it but there's not a very high chance on that.
   
  I'm glad you like your Miracles and I may one day end up with one of the UM customs that they make rather than a reshell but will see


----------



## xtasi

It was interesting to see just about every SQ score go down lol.
   
  Cheers.


----------



## 182751

Having my Miracle for a few weeks now, I cannot agree more with the review |joker| has done, A haven't had the same previous experience with IEM's as |joker| and pretty much dived straight in, but these are absolutely amazing.
   
  Also worth noting, that with my Miracles that I received from UM Australia, I did get a portable carry case for them. So it appears they have heard the requests and responded. Not sure if that's only through UM Aus though.


----------



## chinesekiwi

"left blob – right blob soundstage" - also called lateralisation


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





xtasi said:


> It was interesting to see just about every SQ score go down lol.
> 
> Cheers.


 

 Not by much. The difference between Miracle and 1964-T is more striking than the difference between the T and top of the line universals


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> It sounds like the Miracle may be close to what I have in my UM customs but can't know for sure unless I buy it but there's not a very high chance on that.
> 
> I'm glad you like your Miracles and I may one day end up with one of the UM customs that they make rather than a reshell but will see


 
   

  Perhaps UM could tell you with certainty how the Miracle improves (or otherwise) on your setup.
   
  And thanks again, I'm not sure I would've gotten the Miracle if you hadn't stepped in and spearheaded the entire thing 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






  Quote: 





acesi7 said:


> Having my Miracle for a few weeks now, I cannot agree more with the review |joker| has done, A haven't had the same previous experience with IEM's as |joker| and pretty much dived straight in, but these are absolutely amazing.
> 
> Also worth noting, that with my Miracles that I received from UM Australia, I did get a portable carry case for them. So it appears they have heard the requests and responded. Not sure if that's only through UM Aus though.


 

  I'll have to ask if all Miracles come with a case now. That was most certainly the only bit that left me disappointed. Personally, I have no use for the fancy display box and ended up using the Earjax hard clamshell case (best one I've found for customs) to lug them around. 
   


  Quote: 





chinesekiwi said:


> "left blob – right blob soundstage" - also called lateralisation


 

  I thought that was a neurological term
   


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Not by much. The difference between Miracle and 1964-T is more striking than the difference between the T and top of the line universals


 

 Great, that was the point I intended to convey 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## average_joe

Nice review.I hope to hear the Miracle some day...


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Nice review.I hope to hear the Miracle some day...


 
   
  Actually you will hear the demo.  I'm giving the Merlin and Miracle some run in as they just arrived.


----------



## kiteki

It must be difficult to affix "value" to IEM's in this price-bracket.
   
  If the EX1000 can keep up with the UM Miracle most of the time, it should have a high[er] value than the UM Miracle, and consequently the EX600 higher still.
   
  I think the vast majority of people that are going to invest circa ~$1000 in an IEM will never have the chance, finanaces or audio fetischism to sanction them to hear the sound of any other custom IEM brands out there, joker's amorosity for the UM aside, I think they should really do their homework with which custom IEM is the best for them, as they all seem to be on a similiar pedestal and as far as I can tell the UM has not achieved some kind of plateau or pinnacle by itself, but rather subjectively in light of joker's collection, other custom IEM's out there on similiar level seem to be the SA-43, JH13, UE18, LS8, CX8, SE 5-way, 3MAX, ES5, XE4....
   
  If ljokerl could hypothetically review all of these, then the UM Miracle would be perceived in a different light, it's a shame this will never be the case since anyone owning all of them would equal the cost of a very nice car, so for us already rather rash individuals interesting in spending $1k on an audio investment I think we should study the different alternatives available, decide which particular model will suit us the most, or looks the best, and then commit to that long-term sonic investment and trip the deep.
   
  I'm just writing this to be fair, because I think to some head-fiers that enjoy reading a lot like myself it may appear as common-sense, but to other individuals that are busy or less interested in research they might consider the UM as some kind of new pinnacle, afterall who doesn't want to buy something and think they have the best of the best? I sure would like to but in truth I think all of the high-end custom IEM's are next to eachother, it's like comparing Yamaha, Suzuki, Honda and Kawasaki.


----------



## Eric_C

Ag, now I need to know how the Miracle compares with the JH13.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Nice review.I hope to hear the Miracle some day...


 

 Thanks. I, too, hope you get to hear the Miracle and see how it fares in your sizable collection.
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> If the EX1000 can keep up with the UM Miracle most of the time, it should have a high[er] value than the UM Miracle, and consequently the EX600 higher still.


 
   
  That statement about the EX1000 was specifically in relation to timbre. It cannot keep up with the Miracle in most ways.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


eric_c said:


> Ag, now I need to know how the Miracle compares with the JH13.


 

 I heard Jaben in Singapore has the JH13, you could call them and check if they have the Miracle.


----------



## Eric_C

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Quote:
> 
> I heard Jaben in Singapore has the JH13, you could call them and check if they have the Miracle.


 

 They do indeed have the 13 on demo, but I never asked them about the Miracle. Would be nice to hear from someone who has the actual customs, and not the universal demos though.


----------



## lina

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the UM Miracle. The chart has been rescaled and sound now has slightly (30%) more weight in the average than before.
> 
> 
> 
> In a direct comparison it's not difficult to differentiate the two. Owning only one, I doubt you'll be able to say which one it is if you didn't know. I don't think either has a clarity edge over the other. Amping the RE0 does help and with the right amp it may even have an edge over the ZERO but then adding a decent amp would push it to a different price bracket.


 

 the amp wont be a problem as i already have one that can drive the ones like etymotic er4s , re262 and yuin pk1/ok1
  so i'm more worried by the $20 difference than the amping. also there is $10 more for the shipping of any of them
   
  btw. nice review of those new customs. but im sure im not ready for that


----------



## RockaRolla

Quote: 





eric_c said:


> They do indeed have the 13 on demo, but I never asked them about the Miracle. Would be nice to hear from someone who has the actual customs, and not the universal demos though.


 
   
  i think even comparing the demos would be a problem since JH13 is in Jaben while the Miracle is in Stereo


----------



## Maxvla

Thanks Joker, you made my decision harder bringing the Miracles back to my attention. I had somewhat eliminated them thinking they would be too treble/mids focused.


----------



## Smallville

Man. It sucks how the UM Miracles are WAYYY out of my price range. I've been thinking about getting into customs for a while, but I can never justify the prices for them since I rarely use my IEMs


----------



## Eric_C

Quote: 





rockarolla said:


> i think even comparing the demos would be a problem since JH13 is in Jaben while the Miracle is in Stereo


 

 =\


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Excellent write up, joker! Glad you are enjoying your Miracles. Now you have bring back the want of customs again.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lina said:


> the amp wont be a problem as i already have one that can drive the ones like etymotic er4s , re262 and yuin pk1/ok1  so i'm more worried by the $20 difference than the amping. also there is $10 more for the shipping of any of them
> 
> btw. nice review of those new customs. but im sure im not ready for that


 

 If you don't mind carrying the amp might as well get the RE0. No adapter needed for that, either. 


  Quote: 





maxvla said:


> Thanks Joker, you made my decision harder bringing the Miracles back to my attention. I had somewhat eliminated them thinking they would be too treble/mids focused.


 

 If anything they are very mildly v-shaped but the balance really is very, very good. Bass impact is similar to my 1964-T (and other punchy armature-based sets, such as the TF10) but the Miracle has significantly better bass depth.

  
  Quote: 





smallville said:


> Man. It sucks how the UM Miracles are WAYYY out of my price range. I've been thinking about getting into customs for a while, but I can never justify the prices for them since I rarely use my IEMs


 

 I know what you mean, I've been considering upgrading my full-size setup but I use IEMs 90% of the time so it is hard to justify. My first car cost less than some of the headphones I've been looking at, which is a thought I come back to once in a while.  

   
   
  Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> Excellent write up, joker! Glad you are enjoying your Miracles. Now you have bring back the want of customs again.


 

 Thanks


----------



## DervishD

As always, an excellent review.
   
  I agree with you: throwing more money not always gets you an equivalent increase in quality, but nonetheless I think that a pair of customs is worth the economical pain. Of course I'm not referring to 1000$ customs, and of course I don't have a pair of customs, but sometimes one spends a quite amazing amount of money looking for the "perfect" phones, so it may make sense to spend it all at once and get customs.
   
  When I say "perfect" I don't mean the ultimate sound-miraculous phone, but a phone you really like, with the amount of isolation you want, the comfort you want, the sound signature you want, the looks you want (why not?), etc. Sometimes you're lucky and you find a cheap pair of phones which fulfil your needs, but other times you have to sacrifice one aspect to get other.
   
  I can't remember how many times I've lived that. I get a new pair of phones which sound exactly how I want, only to discover they fit like crap and isolation is subpar, or the cable is in auto-tangle mode all the time, or they cause me pain after half an hour, or they slide out of my ears, etc. Customs looks like the way of solving all the issues at once.
   
  Still, price is prohibitive for me. But hoping is free 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Thanks a lot for the review, really, a great work like usual.


----------



## Poetik

YES!! Way to go joker for the miracle review!!!


----------



## Eric_C

Do UM IEMs use Westone cables?


----------



## Shufny

Nice review as always. It's easier to resist for me, because here it's not just about shelling out $930 or not. I'm really glad that you like it this much, and would happily donate again, but it wouldn't be a nice gift anymore, but rather giving you more work to be done. (a nice high-end home setup on the other hand... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I know what you mean, I've been considering upgrading my full-size setup but I use IEMs 90% of the time so it is hard to justify. My first car cost less than some of the headphones I've been looking at, which is a thought I come back to once in a while.


 
  It's a bit sad to hear that. I'm real curious how something like the Miracle fares against a Qualia. I was really blown away by those. I hope I can audition some other high-end sets this year, because somehow I doubt I'll like anything more than that.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kiteki* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> ........as far as I can tell the UM has not achieved some kind of plateau or pinnacle by itself, but rather subjectively in light of joker's collection, other custom IEM's out there on similiar level seem to be the SA-43, JH13, UE18, LS8, CX8, SE 5-way, 3MAX, ES5, XE4....
> 
> If ljokerl could hypothetically review all of these, then the UM Miracle would be perceived in a different light, it's a shame this will never be the case since anyone owning all of them would equal the cost of a very nice car


 

 We can always have a Multi Custom IEM comparison thread from joker if we buy him one custom each year 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. But then, average_joe already has a comprehensive thread on customs including general information and comparisons.


----------



## xtasi

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Not by much. The difference between Miracle and 1964-T is more striking than the difference between the T and top of the line universals


 


  Yes I know that, but I remember back when this review compilation first came out, and it has been fun to see that standards rise.  I remember back when the ck-10 and dba-02 were both 10s in the SQ on the list, and now they have been reduced to a 9.2/9.3.  It just makes me wonder how far IEMs (and headphones in general) can just keep going.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eric_c said:


> Do UM IEMs use Westone cables?


 

 Not by default but you can have a Westone socket fitted on request.


  Quote: 





shufny said:


> It's a bit sad to hear that. I'm real curious how something like the Miracle fares against a Qualia. I was really blown away by those. I hope I can audition some other high-end sets this year, because somehow I doubt I'll like anything more than that.


 

 I haven't heard the Qualia but I've auditioned the LCD-2, which is quite fantastic, and I don't think it has a clear SQ advantage over the Miracle except in sheer bass power.


----------



## Shufny

"...and dynamics are better than with any other BA earphone I’ve heard so far. The Sony EX1000 was often able to keep up..."

  And again with the scoring. First it would be unusable if every large step would be like a 2 points jump, and we would have maybe 60 phones between 7.00 and 7.05. Second: .5 is more than twice as big as .2. And finally the last 5% is way more difference than it is in the middle. It's substantial because the Miracle is better (and as the score suggests, maybe not by much) in every way than all of the universals. There is no "but".


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





dervishd said:


> As always, an excellent review.
> 
> I agree with you: throwing more money not always gets you an equivalent increase in quality, but nonetheless I think that a pair of customs is worth the economical pain. Of course I'm not referring to 1000$ customs, and of course I don't have a pair of customs, but sometimes one spends a quite amazing amount of money looking for the "perfect" phones, so it may make sense to spend it all at once and get customs.
> 
> ...


 

 Seriously, i could not agree more. And another great review / impression, joker. Many thanks!


----------



## Stephen Guo

I am here to pay my gratitude to |joker| for taking the time to write the Miracle review. 
   
  ~Stephen


----------



## Armaegis

My experiences with finding iems that fit me so far have been unsuccessful. I'm wondering if I should just abandon them altogether...
   
  The bullet/plug style ones do not fit me at all and just feel awkward. Wearing them cord up is worse than cord down. The angled over-ear type are better, but still a little odd. I've got a Miu Audio MR2 that sort of fits, but it's hard to get a seal and my right side sticks out at a funny angle no matter what I do which makes me think I've got a significant difference in ear shape from one side to the other. I feel like I want a sharper angle to the nozzle for them to fit better as well. Anyone have any ideas for me?
   
  On a related note, is there a proper naming convention for iem shapes? I usually call them bullet/plug for the straight ones, and the angled over ear ones I tend to call universal, but I don't know if that's right.


----------



## FlySweep

edvardd said:


> 1. Joker havn't listened to other customs and now many people will buy Miracle without listening to other high-end customs. Also his rating system might have to be changed if customs are to be included this roundup.


 

 Let's not forget these are joker's observations based on _his_ experiences.. Of course he hasn't listened to all the other customs, how is that even possible from an economical standpoint?  As he listens to other customs, I would _expect_ him to adjust scores.  What if he does eventually hear something better than the UM Miracle? The Miracle is the best IEM he's heard to date, so obviously it's going to score a 10 to _his_ ears.  When SA releases the CT20 (
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) and Joker reviews it, _it_ could become the best IEM he's heard and the Miracle might get knocked down a few points.
   
  I don't see anything wrong with continually adjusting scores.. in fact, it's necessary.  I'm completely ok with the reviews having fluid scores that change based on the industry, technology, pricing, and what's available.. I hope those reading can also take that into account.  For the breadth and concise nature of all his reviews, this isn't a static, finished project.. these reviews aren't the end all be all.. and at the end of the day, it's still one man's _personal observations_ and should be treated as such.


----------



## edvardd

That would then mean that if some other custom is better, then the Miracle might get a 9 then, and he would have to lower all the scores of the others. Is that what you mean?
   
  Quote:


flysweep said:


> I don't see anything wrong with continually adjusting scores.. in fact, it's necessary.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote:  
   
  Have you tried the GR07?  I love the adjustable nozzles and fit.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





edvardd said:


> That would then mean that if some other custom is better, then the Miracle might get a 9 then, and he would have to lower all the scores of the others. Is that what you mean?


 

 That's what he's been doing for awhile now.  What's the problem w/ that?
   
  If people want to buy a Miracle ranked at 10 over other customs he hasn't heard or ranked that's not his problem.  I don't see ranking them 9.8 changing anyone's processes who would behave in such a way.


----------



## MusicalChillies

By IjokerI
  Quote: 





> the treble of the IE8 is more impressive when taken out of context


 
   
Been listening again to these in the last few days. Been hidden in a dark zipped case for over a year. Read your review of these again.
What a cracking comment above. Funny how your brain gets trained in clarity. My MTPC`s made these sound almost muddy in clarity, muddy is a bit harsh but I always thought of them as having a veil hence I bought something else (MTPC).
   
Now that my brain has overcome the initial shock of hearing something different again, the IE8`s do have treble and they do in an effortlessly and fun way, just bang the sound out.
I think it is time for a new pair of IEMs to hit the dark zipped world for a period and let these back out to be enjoyed once again now that the owner understands what he purchased was actually musical value.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





musicalchillies said:


> Been listening again to these in the last few days. Been hidden in a dark zipped case for over a year. Read your review of these again.
> What a cracking comment above. Funny how your brain gets trained in clarity. My MTPC`s made these sound almost muddy in clarity, muddy is a bit harsh but I always thought of them as having a veil hence I bought something else (MTPC).
> 
> Now that my brain has overcome the initial shock of hearing something different again, the IE8`s do have treble and they do in an effortlessly and fun way, just bang the sound out.
> I think it is time for a new pair of IEMs to hit the dark zipped world for a period and let these back out to be enjoyed once again now that the owner understands what he purchased was actually musical value.


 

 This is why you need to A/B phones.  The human ear and brain is very resilient and adaptable.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





cliffroyroycole said:


> Or maybe increase the scale from 1-50, or 50-100, so there is more room for scaling the scores. Though of course I don't expect Mike to go back and rescore all 184 IEMs. Now that would be a PITA.


 
   
  Considering that he just did that after including the Miracle, I don't think he would want to rescale it again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Even grades like A+, A would bring back the same debate at one point of time or the other. Numerical scores are better in that they allow a _relative_ comparison between IEMs that fall within the same tier in terms of SQ. No matter whether the score is out of 50 or 100, it would once again lead to the same questions. Personal differences with scores will continue to exist no matter what.
   
  The point is read the score to see which tier the IEM falls into, it's peer group, how it's ranked relative to them, BUT read the sound description, see the features (Comfort, Isolation, Build Quality) and decide if it suits you. Without a SQ score, I certainly would be lost as I cannot be expected to read all 130,000+ words to find the right IEM. At least, that's how I use this vast resource.


----------



## MusicalChillies

Hi Anaxilus again.
   
  Very true, weird, but true. IE8`s amped almost seem what I am looking for but I already had them?


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Have you tried the GR07?  I love the adjustable nozzles and fit.


 


  I have not. Are there Canadian/US dealers? Or I guess I'll keep an eye out on the sale forums. Are there any other iems with adjustable nozzles?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I have not. Availability for stuff in Canada is rather limited, but I'll keep an eye out on the sale forums. Are there any other iems with adjustable nozzles?


 

 Not that I can think of off hand.  They are built very well too.  One of my favorite universal IEM designs by far.  ClieOS has some nice pics in his review.  That may help you figure out if they will fit you or not.


----------



## FlySweep

edvardd said:


> That would then mean that if some other custom is better, then the Miracle might get a 9 then, and he would have to lower all the scores of the others. Is that what you mean?


 
   
  Yes.. which is what he's been doing and I think it's appropriate.. this is a fluid, subjective, adaptable list.. not something that is set in stone.
   


cliffroyroycole said:


> Can't his review just be a case of it is what it is, and leave it at that?


 
   
  COSIGNED.
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Considering that he just did that after including the Miracle, I don't think he would want to rescale it again
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  COSIGNED.  I too use the scores in relative terms more than as absolutes.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not by default but you can have a Westone socket fitted on request.


 

 Don't the UM customs fit the Westone stocket regardless of request or not?


----------



## Nemezice

Sorry for my English. I write with a translator.
 ljokerl you made ​​a mistake with the change of sound evaluation Radius HP-TWF21.
 We had to change from 9.4 to 9.1, but you have changed from 9.4 to 9.0, while other headphones with an estimate of 9.4 did you change the sound to 9.1.
 I hope you understand what I mean


----------



## average_joe

My thinking on the whole custom IEM topic, as for universals is people should buy for a sound signature they like, not based on scores/rating.  I am working on ratings for all my custom IEMs and the select universals I have recently heard, however the ratings don't tell the whole story, and scoring higher won't make a choice the best for you.
   
  In addition, while the universals I have recently heard such as the SM3, EX-1000, CK10, ER4P, W4, GR07 etc. all sound very good in their own right, for me they don't put everything together like many of the custom IEMs I own.  When all of these pieces are put together, regardless of the score (although it will be higher), the realism of the recreation for me will increase dramatically.  And sources are important as well and can take something that is exceptional to an even higher level of exceptional!
   
  Ultimately, if you are going to buy one expensive custom IEM I would go for something with the sound signature you like and strengths that are important to you (if you can find that within your price range) which should result in long term enjoyment when listening casually and deep appreciation of the accurate, realistic reproduction that is achieved through technical ability.


----------



## rymd

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> On a related note, is there a proper naming convention for iem shapes? I usually call them bullet/plug for the straight ones, and the angled over ear ones I tend to call universal, but I don't know if that's right.


 
   
  ljokerl only used the term for a while, but I like "straight barrel IEM" for the generic housings. No idea what to call the over the ear ones


----------



## Naim.F.C

Joker, can I firstly just say I love your work, and would like to further my appreciation for all your efforts. You have done a massive service to not only Head.Fi'ers but general consumers as well. Your reviews are insightful and valuable.
   
  If I have just one complaint, it's that you have perhaps done what many reviewers (and even I myself) do, which is to tend to stick more to the upper echelons of the rating scale. It would have been better if you rated lower on the 10 scale to begin with, to allow more room for the higher end IEM's and headphones. As is, the problem you may face now is all the top end IEM's and customs getting rated 10's. I feel some adjustments may be necessary to balance things out and allow clearer comparisons among users.
   
  Other that that, phenomenal work! All credit to you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dervishd said:


> As always, an excellent review.
> 
> I agree with you: throwing more money not always gets you an equivalent increase in quality, but nonetheless I think that a pair of customs is worth the economical pain. Of course I'm not referring to 1000$ customs, and of course I don't have a pair of customs, but sometimes one spends a quite amazing amount of money looking for the "perfect" phones, so it may make sense to spend it all at once and get customs.
> 
> ...


 

  Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Seriously, i could not agree more. And another great review / impression, joker. Many thanks!


 

  Quote: 





stephen guo said:


> I am here to pay my gratitude to |joker| for taking the time to write the Miracle review.
> 
> ~Stephen


 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





armaegis said:


> My experiences with finding iems that fit me so far have been unsuccessful. I'm wondering if I should just abandon them altogether...
> 
> The bullet/plug style ones do not fit me at all and just feel awkward. Wearing them cord up is worse than cord down. The angled over-ear type are better, but still a little odd. I've got a Miu Audio MR2 that sort of fits, but it's hard to get a seal and my right side sticks out at a funny angle no matter what I do which makes me think I've got a significant difference in ear shape from one side to the other. I feel like I want a sharper angle to the nozzle for them to fit better as well. Anyone have any ideas for me?
> 
> On a related note, is there a proper naming convention for iem shapes? I usually call them bullet/plug for the straight ones, and the angled over ear ones I tend to call universal, but I don't know if that's right.


 

 I would say a small angled-nozzle set may be worth trying - something like the Klipsch S4 - as well as foam tips for the sealing issue. The GR07 may be a good option as well. 
   
  I usually just call IEMs either "straight barrel" or "ergonomic". 
   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Don't the UM customs fit the Westone stocket regardless of request or not?


 

 I think the order form had 'westone socket' as a separate option. I'll have to check if my Westone cord fits in the recessed socket of the Miracle but the Miracle cable is definitely different from the Westone ES.


  Quote: 





nemezice said:


> Sorry for my English. I write with a translator.
> ljokerl you made ​​a mistake with the change of sound evaluation Radius HP-TWF21.
> We had to change from 9.4 to 9.1, but you have changed from 9.4 to 9.0, while other headphones with an estimate of 9.4 did you change the sound to 9.1.
> I hope you understand what I mean


 

 Actually not all scores changed by 0.3 points exactly as it is a sliding scale. The sound scores have a math component to them and a couple of IEMs dropped more because of the Miracle upsetting certain sound characteristics. The DDMs had very high presentation scores before and were hurt more than most by the new presentation scaling caused by the Miracle. I actually lowered the weighting of presentation in the overall score to compensate but the DDMs were right on the edge before. 
   
   


  Quote: 





naim.f.c said:


> Joker, can I firstly just say I love your work, and would like to further my appreciation for all your efforts. You have done a massive service to not only Head.Fi'ers but general consumers as well. Your reviews are insightful and valuable.
> 
> If I have just one complaint, it's that you have perhaps done what many reviewers (and even I myself) do, which is to tend to stick more to the upper echelons of the rating scale. It would have been better if you rated lower on the 10 scale to begin with, to allow more room for the higher end IEM's and headphones. As is, the problem you may face now is all the top end IEM's and customs getting rated 10's. I feel some adjustments may be necessary to balance things out and allow clearer comparisons among users.
> 
> Other that that, phenomenal work! All credit to you.


 

  I think the clumping of IEMs around the 7-9 area illustrates diminishing returns and how far you can go with just $50-100 very well. It's actually quite difficult to put things in the lower bit of scale (What exactly is a 0/10? Is that no sound?) Originally the scale was designed to start at around 3/10 but unfortunately I got my hands on earphones that had to be ranked lower. Ultimately, a lot of the more hi-fi mid-level earphones aren't too far off what most consider to be 'top tier' performance and artificially widening the gap there may send the wrong message. 
  Regarding the problem of headroom, I said from the start that I would not be making any guesses at the potential performance of gear I have not heard. Therefore, the most proficient earphone I've heard to date will always have the maximum category score.
   


  Quote: 





cliffroyroycole said:


> Yeah, guess so. You are right. The whole scoring thing makes my head hurt. When I buy IEMs, and I buy a lot, my personal scoring scale is strictly non-numerical.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The value of the scoring is in providing a consistent, relative ranking. It is certainly qualitative more than quantitative but it puts the write-ups themselves in a bit of context (obviously 'good clarity' for something rated 5/10 overall is different from 'good clarity' for something rated 9.4/10). It also prevents the 'new toy syndrome' since all ratings are given in A:B comparisons with a number of similarly-priced benchmark sets.


----------



## 7swell

Great review as usual and glad to see that you are enjoying your Miracles. They also bring a smile to my face every day. Female vocals just sound heavenly with them.


----------



## Anaxilus

Technically, yes, Westone/JH connectors will plug into a UM socket.  The only ones that aren't interchangeable at all are the new UE cables.


----------



## edvardd

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> That's what he's been doing for awhile now.  What's the problem w/ that?
> 
> If people want to buy a Miracle ranked at 10 over other customs he hasn't heard or ranked that's not his problem.  I don't see ranking them 9.8 changing anyone's processes who would behave in such a way.


 
  No problem with that


----------



## 182751

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'll have to ask if all Miracles come with a case now. That was most certainly the only bit that left me disappointed. Personally, I have no use for the fancy display box and ended up using the Earjax hard clamshell case (best one I've found for customs) to lug them around.


 

 I was impressed they included it, but I still carry mine around in the UE Metallic case, I like the (almost) crushproof metallic case as it just gives me a little more reassurance that I'm not going to damage my CIEM's through accidentally dropping them in the case or sitting on them or something silly like that.


----------



## rawrster

The Miracles come with the blue rectangular case right? I got that with my reshells and I actually like just as much as the UE case. The UE case offers more protection but both are functional imo.
   
  Also I can confirm that UM recessed socket fits Westone cable. I might get the UE cable with them but have to see if it fits first. I can't remember if I asked anyone but ljokerl can you check if it fits if you have the new UE cable with a recessed socket? I've changed my portable dap to my sgs so a right angle is now preferred over what I've been using which is a straight neutrik plug. The UM cable I have is pretty handy for that.


----------



## 182751

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> The Miracles come with the blue rectangular case right? I got that with my reshells and I actually like just as much as the UE case. The UE case offers more protection but both are functional imo.
> 
> Also I can confirm that UM recessed socket fits Westone cable. I might get the UE cable with them but have to see if it fits first. I can't remember if I asked anyone but ljokerl can you check if it fits if you have the new UE cable with a recessed socket? I've changed my portable dap to my sgs so a right angle is now preferred over what I've been using which is a straight neutrik plug. The UM cable I have is pretty handy for that.


 

 Yup that's the one, and I agree it's definitely functional, I carry my TF-10's around in it now  I just like the UE case slightly better, but if I didn't have the UE case I would use the UM one without a problem and wouldn't really think about changing either.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





7swell said:


> Great review as usual and glad to see that you are enjoying your Miracles. They also bring a smile to my face every day. Female vocals just sound heavenly with them.


 

 Thanks!

  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> The Miracles come with the blue rectangular case right? I got that with my reshells and I actually like just as much as the UE case. The UE case offers more protection but both are functional imo.
> 
> Also I can confirm that UM recessed socket fits Westone cable. I might get the UE cable with them but have to see if it fits first. I can't remember if I asked anyone but ljokerl can you check if it fits if you have the new UE cable with a recessed socket? I've changed my portable dap to my sgs so a right angle is now preferred over what I've been using which is a straight neutrik plug. The UM cable I have is pretty handy for that.


 

 Mine did not come with a portable case. I double-checked with project86's review and he got the same package:
   

   
  That case is definitely not portable.
   
  Don't have a UE custom cable on hand to check if it fits.


----------



## Maxvla

Joker have you posted your Frequency Response chart? If not can you get a good picture of it?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> The Miracles come with the blue rectangular case right? I got that with my reshells and I actually like just as much as the UE case. The UE case offers more protection but both are functional imo.
> 
> Also I can confirm that UM recessed socket fits Westone cable. I might get the UE cable with them but have to see if it fits first. I can't remember if I asked anyone but ljokerl can you check if it fits if you have the new UE cable with a recessed socket? I've changed my portable dap to my sgs so a right angle is now preferred over what I've been using which is a straight neutrik plug. The UM cable I have is pretty handy for that.


 

 Which UE cable are you asking about?  I'm confused.  You know the current UE cable is actually a socket/female.  You would be going female to female.  Not necessarily a bad thing but still...


----------



## 182751

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I'll take a picture of the portable case tonight and throw it up if you like, I don't have it on me now to photograph.
   
  Edit: Oh and I can now confirm that it's just UM Aus that does the portable case, just got an email from Matt and he confirmed that they purchase them and pass them onto the customer at no extra cost.
  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Which UE cable are you asking about?  I'm confused.  You know the current UE cable is actually a socket/female.  You would be going female to female.  Not necessarily a bad thing but still...


----------



## Eric_C

Armaegis: have you considered entry-level customs? That should, in theory, eliminate fit issues entirely.
   
  On whether Joker reviewing the Miracle in absence of comparison against other top-tier customs:
  Eh, as stated before it's only 1 data point among many others. In fact, on threads like the JH13 and ES5 ones, there are numerous comparisons (albeit not full-blown reviews) of top-tier offerings. Joker's review is uniquely valuable among these in that he compares a pair of high end customs against the vast majority of known high end universals--this hurdle is a significant one for many to cross, and I myself am at that stage.


----------



## Selenium

Nice review, and well-deserved gift.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Which UE cable are you asking about?  I'm confused.  You know the current UE cable is actually a socket/female.  You would be going female to female.  Not necessarily a bad thing but still...


 
   
  On the UE website there are two types of cables for customs. One that is suitable for only UE customs (probably the one on your UE custom) and then one that is suitable for their older customs as well as ones that would fit other companies. It looks similar to the cable that I got with UM actually but recessed does require it to be the size connector to be the same size as it has on the Westone.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote:  

 Gotcha.  No idea about the old cable.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





maxvla said:


> Joker have you posted your Frequency Response chart? If not can you get a good picture of it?


 

 Sure, though I don't put all that much stock in manufacturer measurements.
   

   


  Quote: 





acesi7 said:


> Edit: Oh and I can now confirm that it's just UM Aus that does the portable case, just got an email from Matt and he confirmed that they purchase them and pass them onto the customer at no extra cost.


 

 Great, thanks for clarifying! Certainly a good move on UM Australia's part. 


  Quote: 





selenium said:


> Nice review, and well-deserved gift.


 

 Thanks


----------



## Maxvla

Oddly shaped indeed. I was just curious. Thanks.


----------



## kanuka

can i ask for a short comparison between the UE 500 vs 600
  and also both of them vs the RE0 (amped with T4 and better)
  thanks


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> My thinking on the whole custom IEM topic, as for universals is *people should buy for a sound signature they like, not based on scores/rating*.  I am working on ratings for all my custom IEMs and the select universals I have recently heard, however the *ratings don't tell the whole story*, and scoring higher won't make a choice the best for you.
> 
> _Yup, this statement pretty much hits the nail on the head as far as I'm concerned. Reviews / impressions / ratings, etc can  / should only do so much in deciding which IEM (or any product for that metter) to get. IMO, the ideal chain of events should be: Read review / impression ->audition the IEM for yourself ->Make final decision whether it suits YOUR preferences or not._
> 
> ...


----------



## -y0-

This thread is so informative, you deserve the customs for all the time and effort. I can't imagine listening to 184 different earphones and reviewing them.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sure, though I don't put all that much stock in manufacturer measurements.


 

       I think these are my type of IEMs. The bass looks to be the seconds strongest point with the treble and upper midrange as the strongest, along with excellent balance.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> can i ask for a short comparison between the UE 500 vs 600
> and also both of them vs the RE0 (amped with T4 and better)
> thanks


 

 The UE600 is mid-forward with gentle roll-off on both sides. It's smooth, a bit warm, and maybe slightly dull-sounding. The UE500 is pretty much the opposite - crisp, clean, with punchy bass and decent treble sparkle. I actually like the UE500 - it's a big improvement over the UE350 and older UE dynamics. Unfair to compare them to the RE0 as they are probably a full tier below it in SQ but I guess the UE500 would be a sort of less refined, less delicate, less nuanced RE0 with more bass punch. The UE600 again stands apart as it is a mid-forward earphone.

  
  Quote: 





-y0- said:


> This thread is so informative, you deserve the customs for all the time and effort. I can't imagine listening to 184 different earphones and reviewing them.


 
   
  Thanks! To be fair, though, the number of IEMs is a bit less staggering when you consider that it's been complied over two years. Or maybe not...


----------



## kiteki

The UM Miracle frequency graph looks like a camel, and dips rather bluntly after 7kHz, unlike the ck10 which dips after 10kHz.
   
  The EX800ST FR looks like a perfect audio pulse sine wave.
   
  Final Audio FR's are pretty schizo.
   
  What does all this mean? I have no idea.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





rockarolla said:


> i think even comparing the demos would be a problem since JH13 is in Jaben while the Miracle is in Stereo


 

 Hello, what's Stereo please? Do you recommend it? I'll be in Singapore next week for 1 day.
   
   
  Quote: 





edvardd said:


> That would then mean that if some other custom is better, then the Miracle might get a 9 then, and he would have to lower all the scores of the others. Is that what you mean?


 

 No, not if some custom is better, if ljokerl _hears_ a custom which is better, if joker received (after the vote) a different high-end CIEM (like the JH16), then that CIEM would have the new 10/10 score here.

  
  Quote: 





			
				music_4321 said:
			
		

>


 

 Thanks, and I'm sorry your posts got deleted!
   
  Like ljokerl, I believe you have only heard 1(?) high-end custom IEM (I have heard zero), and if you bought an $850 CIEM and think it's overrated compared to your UIEM's, then I think it's useful to listen to your critique, from the other side of the coin, so to speak.


----------



## Eric_C

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Hello, what's Stereo please? Do you recommend it? I'll be in Singapore next week for 1 day.


 


  Welcome to Singapore in advance! Stereo is a headphone business, like Jaben. They have 2 outlets in shopping centres, although the Plaza Singapura one is likely more convenient for you since it is in the Orchard Road area. http://stereo.com.sg/


----------



## kiler

This list has been much of a help to me when it comes deciding which IEM to take! Although the list may has been a little bit harsh on my wallet  But keep up the good work !


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiler said:


> This list has been much of a help to me when it comes deciding which IEM to take! Although the list may has been a little bit harsh on my wallet  But keep up the good work !


 


  Thanks, glad the thread was useful! Sorry about the wallet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## Shufny

I see you got a K370. Can you tell us some very brief impressions? I mean, I only heard really bad stuff about them (e.g. it's bested by phones rated below 6 on your scale), but nothing exact from someone I can use as reference. (like you)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shufny said:


> I see you got a K370. Can you tell us some very brief impressions? I mean, I only heard really bad stuff about them (e.g. it's bested by phones rated below 6 on your scale), but nothing exact from someone I can use as reference. (like you)


 


  6 might be a bit low but they aren't particularly great. Haven't listened to them since the day I got them but I'd say they are slightly worse than the Soundmagic E10 at first listen.


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks! To be fair, though, the number of IEMs is a bit less staggering when you consider that it's been complied over two years. Or maybe not...


 
   
  It's only been 2 years? Much more staggering in my eyes, That's pretty much an IEM reviewed every 4 days. Just wow. Congrats man, that is one hell of a dedicated achievement. And to think I thought you deserved the UM Miracle when I was under the impression that it wasn't such a breakneck pace. And I just realized the portable headphones thread too. Someone buy this man a beer, he needs a break. Oh, and thanks.


----------



## germanturkey

and there's the miracle review!!  i'm glad i was a part of getting the gift to you!  makes me want one so hard...  haha


----------



## Blinxat

Any chance we get the j-phonics k2's tested?


----------



## esanthosh

^ If somebody sends it to ljokerl, then by all means 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (refer FAQ in post #8)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> It's only been 2 years? Much more staggering in my eyes, That's pretty much an IEM reviewed every 4 days. Just wow. Congrats man, that is one hell of a dedicated achievement. And to think I thought you deserved the UM Miracle when I was under the impression that it wasn't such a breakneck pace. And I just realized the portable headphones thread too. Someone buy this man a beer, he needs a break. Oh, and thanks.


 

 I take breaks pretty frequently or I'd have no backlog 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





germanturkey said:


> and there's the miracle review!!  i'm glad i was a part of getting the gift to you!  makes me want one so hard...  haha


 
   
  Cheers, thanks for the Miracle! Sorry about you wallet (maybe 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





blinxat said:


> Any chance we get the j-phonics k2's tested?


 

 Which version of the k2, tho? SP or MX? I've been contemplating getting the K2 SP for a long time now but just haven't bit the bullet as I only have 2 reviews to go on (ClieOS' and shigzeo's). To me, that simply isn't enough to go on, especially since you cant return them (says so on the website) and there is no way I can audition them first.


----------



## Blinxat

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Which version of the k2, tho? SP or MX?


 

 The SP's. It would be great to get them on here. Aswell as the SE215's I have, so I can compare the performance. ( I know it's always subjective ) but it appears the reviewer has had hundreds of the things in his ears, so there must be a good degree of validity to his opinion.
   
  I would go as far to say that it's in J-Phonics interest to have them in this comparison table, this kind of marketing is not to be underrated


----------



## -y0-

I'm more curious about the K2 MX since there are a few reviews on the SP.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





blinxat said:


> The SP's. It would be great to get them on here. Aswell as the SE215's I have, so I can compare the performance. ( I know it's always subjective ) but it appears the reviewer has had hundreds of the things in his ears, so there must be a good degree of validity to his opinion.
> 
> I would go as far to say that it's in J-Phonics interest to have them in this comparison table, this kind of marketing is not to be underrated


 
  That's true. Joker's impressions on the k2's will certainly help me decide if i wanna get it or not. But i feel the MX should be reviewed as well so ppl would know which one suits them better.  The only issue here is we cant always expect joker to buy the IEMs we want him to review so someone needs to buy it first and then lend it to him to review. Hmmm.....


----------



## kiteki

It costs $480 in Japan and $400 to non-Japan, sounds better than the famous $850 2-xs (which was the _only_ high-end custom IEM a few years ago, along with the UE something) and it's the most customizable IEM (tuning, 8 colours, cable length, termination, hard-case size, hard-case colour) etc.
   
  Oh yeah and it's made in Japan so it's only natural it's in the "made in Japan" pricing category (Stax, for instance).
   
  They could start making the J-phonic in Thailand but then they'd have to call it the Thai-phonic.


----------



## xtremetechuk

The UM Miracle seems to be a worthy and logical upgrade over the CK10.
   
  Personally, spending $260 for the CK10 was quite extravagant. Spending nearly $1000 for customs would be beyond absurd.
   
  Unfortunately for my wallet, I can't resist the temptation!
   
  I need to ban myself from head-fi!


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> It costs $480 in Japan and $400 to non-Japan, sounds better than the famous $850 2-xs (which was the _only_ high-end custom IEM a few years ago, along with the UE something) and it's the most customizable IEM (tuning, 8 colours, cable length, termination, hard-case size, hard-case colour) etc.
> 
> Oh yeah and it's made in Japan so it's only natural it's in the "made in Japan" pricing category (Stax, for instance).
> 
> They could start making the J-phonic in Thailand but then they'd have to call it the Thai-phonic.


 
  Somehow I dont think i'd be all that excited about it if that were the name. Thats just me being superficial, of course. But still...it just DOES NOT sound nice.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> The UM Miracle seems to be a worthy and logical upgrade over the CK10.
> 
> Personally, spending $260 for the CK10 was quite extravagant.


 

 There is also the LS8, LS6, CX8 and CX6 to consider... http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/556914/rooth-ls8-custom-iem-review-crystal-clear-power-dynamics
   
  average_joe says the LS8 "is like a ck10 on steroids" and "it's like comparing a kitten (ck10) with a lion (LS8)"


----------



## xtremetechuk

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> There is also the LS8, LS6, CX8 and CX6 to consider... http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/556914/rooth-ls8-custom-iem-review-crystal-clear-power-dynamics
> 
> average_joe says the LS8 "is like a ck10 on steroids" and "it's like comparing a kitten (ck10) with a lion (LS8)"


 
   
  Thanks, but at nearly $1400. I'm not sure I can even comprehend paying such an amount on customs.
   
  I think $1000 would be the absolute maximum.
   
  Apparently the LS8 can be brought for $830, however I'm sure that deal has ended.
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/523182/rooth-custom-iem-8driver-iem-ls8-830-dollar-sale


----------



## shsh

nice review on the miracle, really looking forward for the review on mdr ex1000


----------



## GalmArn

Quote:


kiteki said:


> There is also the LS8, LS6, CX8 and CX6 to consider... http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/556914/rooth-ls8-custom-iem-review-crystal-clear-power-dynamics
> 
> average_joe says the LS8 "is like a ck10 on steroids" and "it's like comparing a kitten (ck10) with a lion (LS8)"


 

  
  :drools:
   
  If only I could afford such IEM... but at the same time I am wondering if I could really appreciate such difference.


----------



## TwoSongs

I currently own a set of Brainwavz PhoAlpha IEMs, which supplanted a set of Sennheiser CX400s. To my very untrained and limited hearing, the difference was extremely noticeable, particularly regarding clarity, bass, range of tones (that's soundstage, I guess?) and much less need to drive up the volume setting on my players. Now, feeling wanderlust, I want to move up to Tier 3C. After sifting through it a couple of times, I settled on either the Head-Direct RE0s or the Fischer Audio Eternas. They clearly have very different approaches, but I was not able to discern which one would be the natural third step in my IEM evolution. Therefore, any comments to help clarify this (or even suggest more suitable alternatives) are most definitely welcome.


----------



## kaixax555

Have been lurking for quite a while and I have to say your reviews are really great bro
   
  Now looking forward to your reviews on the UHP336


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





xtremetechuk said:


> Thanks, but at nearly $1400. I'm not sure I can even comprehend paying such an amount on customs.
> 
> I think $1000 would be the absolute maximum.
> 
> ...


 

 Not sure where you got the $1400 from.
   
  I think the CX8 is around $830 IIRC... or even less... which is like the LS8 (same designer I believe) except it has a two sub-bass drivers instead of two super-tweeter drivers, so it's basically like a JH16... however I read once that you can opt for the super-tweeter drivers instead, in which case it becomes an LS8? It's kinda confusing, but hey... the kitten and lion analogy, it's really appealing right?  I know what you mean, when I started with my first "real" purchase buying a headphone for $300 I thought that was a bit absurd, then after a while you get used to the prices around here and just want to take the next step all the time, $1000 including impressions is the absolute maximum for me too, after that and it's simply not portable, at all.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Shufny* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> It's a bit sad to hear that. I'm real curious how something like the Miracle fares against a Qualia. I was really blown away by those.


 
  Blown away by their price? or looks?


----------



## ljokerl

Updated some of the pricing & added download link for the chart in post #8 (thanks again to carfentanil for putting it together).
  
  Quote: 





twosongs said:


> I currently own a set of Brainwavz PhoAlpha IEMs, which supplanted a set of Sennheiser CX400s. To my very untrained and limited hearing, the difference was extremely noticeable, particularly regarding clarity, bass, range of tones (that's soundstage, I guess?) and much less need to drive up the volume setting on my players. Now, feeling wanderlust, I want to move up to Tier 3C. After sifting through it a couple of times, I settled on either the Head-Direct RE0s or the Fischer Audio Eternas. They clearly have very different approaches, but I was not able to discern which one would be the natural third step in my IEM evolution. Therefore, any comments to help clarify this (or even suggest more suitable alternatives) are most definitely welcome.


 

 High sensitivity (lower volume requirement) is not always a good thing. If you are willing to step towards a more balanced sound from your ProAlpha, go for the RE0. If you find the bass of the ProAlpha barely sufficient, or lacking, go for the Eterna. You could also try something in between, like a Brainwavz M3 or Spider realvoice. 
   


  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> Have been lurking for quite a while and I have to say your reviews are really great bro
> 
> Now looking forward to your reviews on the UHP336


 

 Thanks, glad the thread been helpful.


----------



## Inks

Nice pricing update, prices have been changing a lot in the IEM world so this makes sense. Perhaps something that can denote if the IEM has been discontinued will also be useful instead of the NA in the pricing, to see where they stood. I don't think the C3 or HJE900s are being produced anymore and thus the high pricing, but there are still new ones available. 
   
  OT, but Headdirect's RE252 pricing makes no sense as it's priced higher than the RE262 and almost hitting the RE272 level. Something like 125$ makes a lot more sense


----------



## kanuka

hi
  i want to get the RE0, but first i want to be sure which version to ask for. i saw already 3 versions!
  i prefer the straight plug, but lower microphonics and lower memory cable is better.
  any info? thanks


----------



## TwoSongs

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> ...
> High sensitivity (lower volume requirement) is not always a good thing. If you are willing to step towards a more balanced sound from your ProAlpha, go for the RE0. If you find the bass of the ProAlpha barely sufficient, or lacking, go for the Eterna. You could also try something in between, like a Brainwavz M3 or Spider realvoice.
> ...


 
   
  In what cases would high sensitivity not be a good thing? Does having that imply that some of the other qualities must suffer for it?
   
  As for your recommendation: heh, it figures I would choose alternatives that don't quite fit with my criteria. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  The bass on the ProAlphas seem to be just right, actually. The first choice were the RE0s, but since you described them as maybe too analytical or dry I wanted to check a "fun" alternative to it....how do you think the RE0s would perform for movies and gaming, compared to the ProAlphas?


----------



## weechuen

thanks alot for your review, i got my etymotic after reading it and was very satisfied.
   
  now i'm planning to get miiracle over merlin after reading your review =)


----------



## Majin

could you quick summary between the sound signatures of Xears Nature N3i, Xears TD-III, Xears XE200PRO? and would they be better then Brainwavz M2 if only looking at the sound quality


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


inks said:


> Nice pricing update, prices have been changing a lot in the IEM world so this makes sense. Perhaps something that can denote if the IEM has been discontinued will also be useful instead of the NA in the pricing, to see where they stood. I don't think the C3 or HJE900s are being produced anymore and thus the high pricing, but there are still new ones available.
> 
> OT, but Headdirect's RE252 pricing makes no sense as it's priced higher than the RE262 and almost hitting the RE272 level. Something like 125$ makes a lot more sense


 

 I think the HJE900 is just not being imported to the US. Not sure about the custom 3. I will leave the MSRP of the discontinued units because the late-stage sale prices don't necessarily make sense.


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hi
> i want to get the RE0, but first i want to be sure which version to ask for. i saw already 3 versions!
> i prefer the straight plug, but lower microphonics and lower memory cable is better.
> any info? thanks


 

 I don't know if you can ask for a specific version. The $169 v1 and the $99 2009 v2 version that I had (with the nylon cord) are no longer being produced. I think my RE-ZERO has the latest cable and it's fine - not spectacular but nothing to complain about, either.
   


  Quote: 





twosongs said:


> In what cases would high sensitivity not be a good thing? Does having that imply that some of the other qualities must suffer for it?
> As for your recommendation: heh, it figures I would choose alternatives that don't quite fit with my criteria.
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  There are no inherent disadvantages to having high sensitivity but it can make the earphones more revealing of source matching issues. I have plenty of overhead at regular listening volumes so low sensitivity has never really bothered me. Also, I think sensitivity is sometimes confused with efficiency. They are interchangeable in some contexts but high sensitivity does not necessarily imply low power draw unless the impedance is also low.
   
  If the bass on the ProAlphas is just right, the Eterna will probably have too much and the RE0 may have too little. I like the RE0 for movies just because of the high intelligibility. There are other earphones I like just as much, though. The Brainwavz M3 comes to mind again as it really is an excellent all-rounder with no real flaws aside from the form factor.
   


  Quote: 





weechuen said:


> thanks alot for your review, i got my etymotic after reading it and was very satisfied.
> 
> now i'm planning to get miiracle over merlin after reading your review =)


 
   
  Good to hear, hope you like the Miracle! Curious about how the Merlin compares myself. 
   
  I picked up another ER-4S Ety recently and hope to re-visit that review when I have time now that I've heard most other top tiers.
   
   
   


  Quote: 





majin said:


> could you quick summary between the sound signatures of Xears Nature N3i, Xears TD-III, Xears XE200PRO? and would they be better then Brainwavz M2 if only looking at the sound quality


 
  Those reviews should be posted this coming week. I do think all three are a step above the M2 for overall sound quality but the new prices make me think twice about recommending them. Of the three I like the N3i best, personally.


----------



## Inks

HJE900s are also being discontinued in Japan I believe, thus my comment. Good idea leaving the MSRPs.


----------



## TwoSongs

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> ...
> There are no inherent disadvantages to having high sensitivity but it can make the earphones more revealing of source matching issues. I have plenty of overhead at regular listening volumes so low sensitivity has never really bothered me. Also, I think sensitivity is sometimes confused with efficiency. They are interchangeable in some contexts but high sensitivity does not necessarily imply low power draw unless the impedance is also low.
> 
> If the bass on the ProAlphas is just right, the Eterna will probably have too much and the RE0 may have too little. I like the RE0 for movies just because of the high intelligibility. There are other earphones I like just as much, though. The Brainwavz M3 comes to mind again as it really is an excellent all-rounder with no real flaws aside from the form factor.
> ...


 

 Got it, thanks.


----------



## Szadzik

Some time ago I asked you guys for advice regarding IEMs for travelling and I got Brainwavz M3. I never used them too much but a few days ago was travelling and took them with me, I was very pleased with them. The only problem is that when I am on a plane and sitting away from the aisle, the guys next to me had to punch me when stewardesses were around as I wdid not hear them, isolation hahaha (I am side-blind so I do not see much on the sides, ahead mostly unless I move my head around).
   
  I was so pleased with them, that now having these and a pair of Sennheiser MX980 earbuds  I am questioning whether I really need my Beyer DT1350s.


----------



## n3utra1

Any chances of reviewing the UM Merlin Joker?


----------



## Majin

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those reviews should be posted this coming week. I do think all three are a step above the M2 for overall sound quality but the new prices make me think twice about recommending them. Of the three I like the N3i best, personally.


 

 well the discount coupon still works and with shipping they cost €38 each


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





inks said:


> OT, but Headdirect's RE252 pricing makes no sense as it's priced higher than the RE262 and almost hitting the RE272 level. Something like 125$ makes a lot more sense


 

 Who says the RE262 is better? The RE252 has a very unique shape, and joker says "Pros: Impossibly balanced sound, top-tier detail and clarity", for RE262 he says "a sonic departure from Hifimans sound" and "a vastly different animal".  I'm sure Fang has his reasons for the keeping the RE252 at $199.


----------



## kanuka

joker
  have you already tried the other 2 Dunu's ? if you did, how is the isolation?
  thanks


----------



## Maxvla

n3utra1 said:


> Any chances of reviewing the UM Merlin Joker?




He'll have the demo of both Merlin and Miracle soon.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





szadzik said:


> Some time ago I asked you guys for advice regarding IEMs for travelling and I got Brainwavz M3. I never used them too much but a few days ago was travelling and took them with me, I was very pleased with them. The only problem is that when I am on a plane and sitting away from the aisle, the guys next to me had to punch me when stewardesses were around as I wdid not hear them, isolation hahaha (I am side-blind so I do not see much on the sides, ahead mostly unless I move my head around).
> 
> I was so pleased with them, that now having these and a pair of Sennheiser MX980 earbuds  I am questioning whether I really need my Beyer DT1350s.


 
   
  Awesome, glad you like them. The IEM market really is getting more and more competitive as we look on. 

  
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kanuka* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> have you already tried the other 2 Dunu's ? if you did, how is the isolation?
> thanks


 

 Good, 4-ish on my scale.


----------



## kiteki

H0ly Sh1t I just heard the *EX600*'s I could not believe what I was hearing!!
   
  They sound better than Shure SE535 and they sound NOTHING like the EX700's wth!..........
   
  When I only have time for a quick demo I usually listen to several songs quickly but I was just stuck on the same song I did not want to press Next.........


----------



## Inks

kiteki said:


> Who says the RE262 is better? The RE252 has a very unique shape, and joker says "Pros: Impossibly balanced sound, top-tier detail and clarity", for RE262 he says "a sonic departure from Hifimans sound" and "a vastly different animal".  I'm sure Fang has his reasons for the keeping the RE252 at $199.


 

 The RE262 driver is the same as the RE272 driver which is their flagship driver (made of titanium). It's simply better than the RE252 in performance, the driver is effortless, but HeadDirect's pricing is just weird at times. The RE252 sure is different in sound, but that doesn't change the fact that the pricing is off. Not to mention the build & comfort of the 252 is the worst I've seen from the REs I've tried (RE0/Zero/262)


----------



## kiteki

q-jays, t-jays, Shure SE535, shure srh-840, shure srh-940, ex600, ex1000, Sony Piiq q1, v-jays, Sony zx500........ AHHHHH too many sounds have entered my sonic memory in the past few hours, trying to keep it all intact!
  being in Transit at Singapore airpot with a powerful DAP is a fun experience =D


----------



## KainTFM

I remember Joker mentioning that if the MEElectronics a151s ever came down to around $50, they'd be a 10/10 value since they have no real flaws, unlike the CC51s, who are "capped" at 9.0/10.  Well, for anyone interested...
   
  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826735027
   
  Stumbled upon this while researching other products.  MEElectronics a151s for $45 and free shipping (good till the 8/5).  I'm normally not one to "pimp" purchases, but I've been having such a love affair with the ones I bought a month or two ago I couldn't help but say something 
   
  Oh, and I paid $68 for mine


----------



## ljokerl

The CC51 is currently $39.99 at Sears and to be honest I'd rather have that despite all of its quirks and caveats. Still a very solid price on the A151, though. 

  
  Quote: 





kaintfm said:


> I remember Joker mentioning that if the MEElectronics a151s ever came down to around $50, they'd be a 10/10 value since they have no real flaws, unlike the CC51s, who are "capped" at 9.0/10.  Well, for anyone interested...
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826735027
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Xears N3i and XE200PRO
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A58) Xears Nature N3i*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


----------



## sulkoudai

joker, i saved up my 100th post on Head Fi to thank you.


----------



## leylandi

Why Sony EX600 IjokerI deleted?


----------



## Shufny

Or, you know... their sound. 
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Blown away by their price? or looks?


----------



## Niyologist

The N3i and the XE200PRO sonic flavor sound very interesting.


----------



## jant71

Good you and ClieOS are helping out all the Xears. They are hard to tell apart with different housings of different materials and they all say "High-end" and have the same specs but there are some differences in sound/performance.


----------



## kiteki

Sound?
   






?
   
  Why did I have to start with the ck10? Listening to ER-4PT now and had higher expectations, the imaging is very basic =(.
   
  They came with a signed unique FR graph of the IEM you receive though, with two serial codes on the paper which match serial codes printed on the L and R earpiece of the IEM itself.
   
  I hope this inclusion takes off and more companies use it.


----------



## LegendaryLvl1

Quote: 





sulkoudai said:


> joker, i saved up my 100th post on Head Fi to thank you.


 


  I think you can liken this to losing your virginity in head-fi terms : )


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sulkoudai said:


> joker, i saved up my 100th post on Head Fi to thank you.


 

 Awesome, thank you! Speaking of which, this thread beat the IE8 appreciation thread as the second in the portable forum to hit 1/2 million views. Pretty cool.
   


  Quote: 





leylandi said:


> Why Sony EX600 IjokerI deleted?


 

 ?
   


  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Good you and ClieOS are helping out all the Xears. They are hard to tell apart with different housings of different materials and they all say "High-end" and have the same specs but there are some differences in sound/performance.


 

 Yep, best to ignore the name and go by the sound. With all of them at the same price it's hard to look at any aside from the three wooden flagships (TD-III v2, N3i, XE200PRO) and the more analytical XR120. That narrows it down a little bit.
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Why did I have to start with the ck10? Listening to ER-4PT now and had higher expectations, the imaging is very basic =(.
> 
> They came with a signed unique FR graph of the IEM you receive though, with two serial codes on the paper which match serial codes printed on the L and R earpiece of the IEM itself.
> 
> I hope this inclusion takes off and more companies use it.


 


  Welcome to the Ety presentation. You get the separation but no real sense of immersion. 
   
  I don't think my ER4S came with an FR chart 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Inks

ER4PT are the only ones that come with a signed graph as they are matched by hand.


----------



## glac1er

Thanks for the Xears reviews ljokerl.
   
  Got a used XR120 based on your review, and aside from the driver crinkle and big housings, I'm really liking  the XR120-II sound, perfect for me on the go as it's not too analytical like the re0/zer0/xcapev1, better balanced than VB/Eterna, and a nice step above the M2.THe new models look even better, but too bad they haven't fixed the crinkling issue.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Sound?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Ditto, that certainly would be a welcome inclusion to a standard retail package. Although, i wonder just how much stock we can put in it.
  
  Oh and I love my ck10s. They are my go to pair for classical and soundtracks. Never heard the Etys tho so must say I am suprised you feel they dont match up. Perhaps if it was the ER-4s you impression would be different?


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





legendarylvl1 said:


> I think you can liken this to losing your virginity in head-fi terms : )


 
  Well if so, I can hardly think of a better person to lose it to. LOL


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





glac1er said:


> Thanks for the Xears reviews ljokerl.
> 
> Got a used XR120 based on your review, and aside from the driver crinkle and big housings, I'm really liking the XR120-II sound, perfect for me on the go as it's not too analytical like the re0/zer0/xcapev1, better balanced than VB/Eterna, and a nice step above the M2.THe new models look even better, but too bad they haven't fixed the crinkling issue.


 


  To be fair the XE200PRO does have less flex than the older Xears models I've tried but yes, the little usability quirks are the price you pay for getting this level of sound quality at the asking price.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Ditto, that certainly would be a welcome inclusion to a standard retail package. Although, i wonder just how much stock we can put in it.
> 
> Oh and I love my ck10s. They are my go to pair for classical and soundtracks. Never heard the Etys tho so must say I am suprised you feel they dont match up. Perhaps if it was the ER-4s you impression would be different?


 

 I'll receive the adapter which converts the ER-4P to the ER-4S soon, so we'll see, I don't really want to comment on *Ety* until I get a good seal and everything =(, I need to try the different tips, but initially I'm surprised at how sibilant they are, and the lack of imaging.
   
  I just opened up my *RE0* box, I've listened to 10 or 11 songs so far, but my initial impressions are much higher than with the ER-4PT.
  Everything is better than expected so far with the RE0, the cable, the housing (solid, metal), the included tips (I'm using the stiffish shure olive looking ones), and the sound, they sound like soft pillows, like running headlong into a wall of soft, delicate, high quality pillows.  These are not a weaker ck10 to me, I can immediately hear qualities of a dynamic driver I sought after in the ck10 at times.  The softness and delicate highs (like you want to tap them) are so nice, they just sound like exploding red flowers, or a girl with perfect satin-soft skin, with perfume drinking gin.  Yeah, these sonic sine waves are touching the violin strings to my heart quickly.
  
  p.s. I just went to the post-office and got all my new stuff and the X1051 wasn't there, user *High_Q* ripped me off, he has my ck10, what an idiot, hey *Paul Park* I bet you're reading this thread, I have your address and all your details you know... Currawong can you unban him please?
   
   
  back to RE0.... just realised I have my Teclast T51 on max volume.... hmm these need some juice to sound good.... but the sound is really melting in my ears and dripping onto my soul strings.  Kinda worried what the J-phonic will sound like now Lol.....
   
  Edit: wow if the line between sibilance and clarity is a thin one the RE0 is walking on it, what a perfect treble, jeez I didn't expect this... just goes to show 1000 travel books are not worth the journey.


----------



## kiteki

Ok I just unpacked some more boxes and saw the J-phonic and A2000X headphone..... I am not going to touch them until I've thoroughly tested everything else and cleaned my room and made a pretty hi-fi setup........... must.. resist.... _temptation._


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I just opened up my *RE0* box, I've listened to 10 or 11 songs so far, but my initial impressions are much higher than with the ER-4PT.
> Everything is better than expected so far with the RE0, the cable, the housing (solid, metal), the included tips (I'm using the stiffish shure olive looking ones), and the sound, they sound like soft pillows, like running headlong into a wall of soft, delicate, high quality pillows.  These are not a weaker ck10 to me, I can immediately hear qualities of a dynamic driver I sought after in the ck10 at times.  The softness and delicate highs (like you want to tap them) are so nice, *they just sound like exploding red flowers, or a girl with perfect satin-soft skin, with perfume drinking gin.  Yeah, these sonic sine waves are touching the violin strings to my heart quickly.*


 
  I've never ever heard them being described like that! Tho the highs are indeed really nice on the RE0s. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Still am suprised to the the CK10 and RE0 sound better thatn the Etys, to you. It must be a fit issue. I wold think at least they'd all be on par? Need to wait till you've gotten a better fit with them and see what you say then.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Ok I just unpacked some more boxes and saw the J-phonic and A2000X headphone..... I am not going to touch them until I've thoroughly tested everything else and cleaned my room and made a pretty hi-fi setup........... must.. resist.... _temptation._


 
  Good grief man, Etys, Re0s, J-phonics, A2000x (meh...still am not into full size cans)!! You went on a shopping spree didnt you? You bought most of what you listened to in Jaben / Singapore? What about the EX600? Are you gonna suprise us with that later? LOL
   
  Oh how i wish i had THAT much disposable income. BTW, what 'pretty hi-fi setup' are you talking about?
   
_PS: sucks about the x1051 tho...shame_


----------



## kiteki

No I can't afford the A2000X, especially not at the Singapore price of ~$1k SGD, traded my Stax setup with head-fi user "Ra97oR", they look brand new have to thank him for a great trade and luring me into these amazing HP's when I was skeptical.
   
  The nice thing about trading is you can make one large investment and then just keep cycling through different gear until you find what you want, I only have 1 high-end headphone at a time, I think the A2000X is the one for me unless I demo something better which feels unlikely, at Jaben I had little desire to demo any other HP's after hearing the A2000X, so I went straight for the $1000+ custom IEM and Final Audio FI-BA-SB, both were a severe fade in comparison, then I asked for the AD2000 or AD1000 and they checked and were out of stock =(.  I don't think they stock the J-phonic but she asked me what I use and I said J-phonic, they have to gauge customers that way so they know what to recommend, no point showing me a Hippo VB, or showing someone with a Hippo VB the Westone 4.
   
  I haven't ordered the EX600 yet that will come later.
   
  My pretty hi-fi setup is a chaotic desk, I'll clean it up soon and post a picture in a different thread. =P


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> No I can't afford the A2000X, especially not at the Singapore price of ~$1k SGD, traded my Stax setup with head-fi user "Ra97oR", they look brand new have to thank him for a great trade and luring me into these amazing HP's when I was skeptical.
> 
> The nice thing about trading is you can make one large investment and then just keep cycling through different gear until you find what you want, I only have 1 high-end headphone at a time, I think the A2000X is the one for me unless I demo something better which feels unlikely, at Jaben I had little desire to demo any other HP's after hearing the A2000X, so I went straight for the $1000+ custom IEM and Final Audio FI-BA-SB, both were a severe fade in comparison, then I asked for the AD2000 or AD1000 and they checked and were out of stock =(.  I don't think they stock the J-phonic but she asked me what I use and I said J-phonic, they have to gauge customers that way so they know what to recommend, no point showing me a Hippo VB, or showing someone with a Hippo VB the Westone 4.
> 
> ...


 
  SO you did get the j-phonics? SP or MX? What was the lead time like? i nopticed on their website that they were Out of Stock on alot of the options and that means you cant order online the usual way.  Have to send them an email stating your preferences and then they'll let you know how long it will take.


----------



## kiteki

I bought my J-phonic from head-fi user "syed786", he had the *K2 SP* version in the clear (skeleton) shell which is what I wanted, he chose the short cable length and L-plug but oh well.
   
  They look better in real life than in pictures and the pelican case is very impressive.  Haven't turned them on yet but I put them in my ear and the fit is very very easy.  Sensaphonics said they took the 3D data of thousands of custom IEM impressions over several years to create the "ultimate fit" regular IEM that fits everyone from tiny Japanese girls like me to tall Sudanese men.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Still am suprised to the the CK10 and RE0 sound better thatn the *Etys*, to you. It must be a fit issue. I wold think at least they'd all be on par? Need to wait till you've gotten a better fit with them and see what you say then.


 

 Ya... I got a better fit... they sounded pretty good for a while until the Etyrāpic EarRape-4PeneTration blocked my right ear so I can't listen to anything right now.
   
  They sound analytical, maybe if I was a cyborg with dual-mono input processor jacks on my head I'd appreciate them, the analysis is overrated though, I've heard higher detail retrieval elsewhere, unless you have to place the "syringe" of sound exactly 4mm away from each eardrum and I'm missing something, will try Shure Olive tips later, sigh.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Ya... I got a better fit... they sounded pretty good for a while until the Etyrāpic EarRape-4PeneTration blocked my right ear so I can't listen to anything right now.
> 
> They sound analytical, maybe if I was a cyborg with dual-mono input processor jacks on my head I'd appreciate them, the analysis is overrated though, I've heard higher detail retrieval elsewhere, unless you have to place the "syringe" of sound exactly 4mm away from each eardrum and I'm missing something, will try Shure Olive tips later, sigh.


 

 LOL, well tbh i still havent heard the Etys, as the sig doesnt sound like something i would like. But now i really got to hear it cuz praise upon praise has been heaped on it and you're saying quite the opposite. Sure, preference reign supreme...but still...I'm gonna have to go down to Jaben and see if they have any for demo-ing.


----------



## leylandi

Sony EX600 would add to the table


----------



## kiteki

Yes, it has an excellent price to performance ratio. (imho)
   
  It sounds better than the ACS T1, which is a 3-driver $1050 custom (imho)


----------



## ljokerl

Changed the price on the RE262 from $249 to $149 and moved it up a tier per Fang's confirmation of permanent $149 pricing. Value score updated accordingly.
   
   
  @leylandi: EX600 won't be added for a while. I have yet to put up the EX1000 review and that's been finished for weeks.


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Changed the price on the RE262 from $249 to $149 and moved it up a tier per Fang's confirmation of permanent $149 pricing. Value score updated accordingly.


 

 It still shows as $250 in the actual review section.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Changed the price on the RE262 from $249 to $149 and moved it up a tier per Fang's confirmation of permanent $149 pricing. Value score updated accordingly.
> 
> 
> @leylandi: EX600 won't be added for a while. *I have yet to put up the EX1000 review and that's been finished for weeks.*


 
  It is? I cant wait to see your impressions on that one!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> It still shows as $250 in the actual review section.


 


  Forgot about that. Fixed now, thanks.


----------



## Cortlendt

Would wish for Sunrise X-Cape IE review, I will get them from gd-audiobase (authorized Sunrise dealer) in some time to compliment my CK10.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





cortlendt said:


> Would wish for Sunrise X-Cape IE review, I will get them from gd-audiobase (authorized Sunrise dealer) in some time to compliment my CK10.


 


  you can get them cheaper at shop.frogbeats.com they have some discounts


----------



## Niyologist

*CALLING ALL MEELEC IEM USERS:*
   
  Meelectronics finally have their own *Cable Guides*:
   
  http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Over_the_Ear_Cable_Guides_p/ep-cableguide-bk.htm
   
  Enjoy!


----------



## ljokerl

Those should fit more than just MEElec IEMs. Good alternative to the thinner Phonak ones that come 6 per pack.


----------



## Armaegis

The guides I use are from the dollar store. They had cheap buds attached, but yank 'em out and voila brand ear ear guides.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> It is? I cant wait to see your impressions on that one!


 

 I'm looking forward to his impressions on EX600 vs EX1000, too...


----------



## PinkysBrain

Quote:


niyologist said:


> *CALLING ALL MEELEC IEM USERS:*
> 
> Meelectronics finally have their own *Cable Guides*:
> 
> ...


 
 But not for my CC51 (which was to be expected...)


----------



## Jocelyn84

Thank you so much for this thread joker! It helped me decide on my first pair of armature iems (Melec A151), and I'm in love with the sound. Everything I've used before had too much bass emphasis and I couldn't be happier with these. That being said, my girlfriend has also fallen in love with them and I'm looking to get myself a second pair of armatures in the $100-$200 price range. I've been reading up on DBA-02 and Brainwavz B2 as potential candidates and was wondering if these would be a step in the right direction. Needless to say, I'd probably go with the B2 due to their current sale price ($129.50), but was wondering if you might have any other suggestions prior to making a purchase. Thank you


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





pinkysbrain said:


> But not for my CC51 (which was to be expected...)


 

      The weird thing is that I can wear my CC51 Over-the -Ear. So I don't know why they excluded that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jocelyn84 said:


> Thank you so much for this thread joker! It helped me decide on my first pair of armature iems (Melec A151), and I'm in love with the sound. Everything I've used before had too much bass emphasis and I couldn't be happier with these. That being said, my girlfriend has also fallen in love with them and I'm looking to get myself a second pair of armatures in the $100-$200 price range. I've been reading up on DBA-02 and Brainwavz B2 as potential candidates and was wondering if these would be a step in the right direction. Needless to say, I'd probably go with the B2 due to their current sale price ($129.50), but was wondering if you might have any other suggestions prior to making a purchase. Thank you


 

 The DBA-02 is what I'd have if I wanted to try a well-balanced high-end BA-based earphone without spending a fortune. Runner up would probably be a simple HF-series Ety considering the prices we've been seeing lately. Still one of my favorite sets around $100.


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The weird thing is that I can wear my CC51 Over-the -Ear. So I don't know why they excluded that.


 

 I think the end of the cable guide will overlap with the strain relief of the CC51 because the stem is so long, resulting in a less-than-perfect "fit". Probably depends on the size of the wearer's ear, too.


----------



## Reutan

This was a great help to me. Perhaps you'd like to make a minor update to the value of the MEE M6, though, as they're now approximately $22 on Amazon.


----------



## Cortlendt

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> you can get them cheaper at shop.frogbeats.com they have some discounts


 


  Thanks, they really have some nice discounts, but still I don't pay import taxes from Russia so it is gd-audiobase for me. They are quite slow in shipping by the way.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





reutan said:


> This was a great help to me. Perhaps you'd like to make a minor update to the value of the MEE M6, though, as they're now approximately $22 on Amazon.


 


  I'll move them up a tier one of these days.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





cortlendt said:


> Thanks, they really have some nice discounts, but still I don't pay import taxes from Russia so it is gd-audiobase for me. *They *are quite slow in shipping by the way.


 
  who?


----------



## 3602

I'm just going to TR;DL on the 252 pages and ask, would you review Sony's higher EX-tier IEMs?
  As in EX600, EX800ST (MDR-7550) and the EX1000?
   
  Thank you very much.


----------



## Majin

In progress:

  Altec Lansing UHP336 / Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 3

  Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99

   

  Dunu Hephaes

  Dunu Trident

  Munitio Teknine SITi

  Shure SE215

*Sony MDR-EX1000 <<---*

  Sunrise Xcited
  Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition
  Ultimate Ears SuperFi 4

  Ultimate Ears 600 / SuperFi 5

  Ultimate Ears 700

  Ultimate Ears SuperFi 5 Pro

  Ultimate Ears SuperFi 5 EB

   

  Xears Communicate CP100iP

  Xears TD-III V2


Planned:

  AKG K330

  AKG K370
 Hippo 10 EB

  Klipsch Image S3

  Miu-Audio MR2 PRO

  Sennheiser IE6

  Sennheiser IE7

  Sony MDR-EX300

  Ultimate Ears 350

  Ultimate Ears 500

  Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10


----------



## 3602

Ah, didn't see that one. Thank you for that.
   
  Hey uh abs(joker), I can lend you some EX600 for review if you'd like.


----------



## Inks

I was going to volunteer my EX600, FXT90 and FX500. It will be in about a month though. His backlog is pretty huge at the moment anyway so the wait is good for him.


----------



## Cortlendt

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> who?


 


  gd-audiobase takes almost a week to ship an order)


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





3602 said:


> Ah, didn't see that one. Thank you for that.
> 
> Hey uh abs(*joker), I can lend you some EX600 for review if you'd like.*


----------



## 3602

Also Save those Whales. Both the killers and the non-killers.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





3602 said:


> Hey uh abs(joker), I can lend you some EX600 for review if you'd like.


 

  Quote: 





inks said:


> I was going to volunteer my EX600, FXT90 and FX500. It will be in about a month though. His backlog is pretty huge at the moment anyway so the wait is good for him.


 

  Thanks, guys. Month works for me - not really suffering for lack of IEMs here.


----------



## 3602

Ah good. In the mean time, I'm going to stew some chicken with mushrooms.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





3602 said:


> Ah good. In the mean time, I'm going to stew some chicken with mushrooms.


 
   
        That sounds good right about now.


----------



## kiteki

Traded my ER-4PT for 3602's EX600, awesome.
   
  Making some osso bucco soaked in red wine in the oven here.


----------



## kanuka

hello i need help!
  i got the RE0 yesterday. i cant put the tips on the nozzle its just impossible
  thanks


----------



## kiteki

Just use the thick squishy black tips, they're awesome.
   
  For the clear white ones just put them on at an angle, use force.


----------



## kanuka

im trying that. the black ones are even more difficult!


----------



## kiteki

No no I mean the black ones that are like foam, really thick and foamy, they are really easy to get on... unless you didn't get those.
   
  The silicon black and white ones are pretty hard to get on, yeah.... you just need twist and push and pull, you'll get there!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> No no I mean the black ones that are like foam, really thick and foamy, they are really easy to get on... *unless you didn't get those*.
> 
> The silicon black and white ones are pretty hard to get on, yeah.... you just need twist and push and pull, you'll get there!


 

 you did? there are only 5 pairs of silicones. s/m/l single flange and 2 pairs of bi-flanges


----------



## kiteki

I got two pairs of single-flange (black) and two pairs of bi-flange (clear), and 1 foamy squishy thing which is all I use.... I got mine from a guy in the UK so I have no idea.


----------



## kanuka

i see. that's not the orignal package! i got mine directly from head-direct. seems that guy put some extras on yours. lucky you!
  anyway, can you post a picture of that thing?


----------



## Shufny

Quote:


kanuka said:


> hello i need help!
> i got the RE0 yesterday. i cant put the tips on the nozzle its just impossible
> thanks


 
 I use the end of a mech. pencil, to temporary widen the bottom of the tip. Then I put the nozzle behind it, and just slide it on.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





shufny said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> kanuka said:
> ...


 

 thanks for the tip!


----------



## Armaegis

Are there any iems out there which have the same shape/form factor as the RE252? They are so far the only iem I've worn that actually fit comfortably, but the seal just wasn't quite right and I lost all my bass response. The microphonics were also driving me crazy.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> Are there any iems out there which have the same shape/form factor as the RE252? They are so far the only iem I've worn that actually fit comfortably, but the seal just wasn't quite right and I lost all my bass response. The microphonics were also driving me crazy.


 


  i havent seen any. but im surprised you find the re252 comfortable with that weird shape


----------



## kiteki

I have to agree that I achieved a very tight fit and high isolation with the RE252 and great bass response, it feels like a custom IEM.
   
   
  @kanuka, sure, I'll take a picture later.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I have to agree that I achieved a very tight fit and high isolation with the RE252 and great bass response, it feels like a custom IEM.
> 
> 
> @kanuka, sure, I'll take a picture later.


 


  thanks!!
   
  btw, how do you wear the re252 to get that fit?


----------



## kiteki

RE252 ------> EAR


----------



## kanuka

funny -_- ...
  over the ear or straight down


----------



## kiteki

ohhhhhhh ^^
   
  RE252... straight up, not over the ear, that's impossible, there are two pieces of err.... a very soft material, it's very pliable (fangoso), one will go up into the err... let me look it up.... _Cymba Conchae _(which is great! if I get a custom I'll get it made like that) and the other goes down into the _Intertragic Notch _which (for me at least) creates a really good fit, the first time I used them I had trouble getting them _out _of my ears Lol.
   
  I also just a got secret extra cable that really improves the RE252 soundstage, I tried the cable on the RE0 and it didn't work =(  So I'm sad to say the RE252 has surpassed the RE0.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> ohhhhhhh ^^
> 
> RE252... straight up, not over the ear, that's impossible, there are two pieces of err.... a very soft material, it's very pliable (fangoso), one will go up into the err... let me look it up.... *Cymba Conchae *(which is great! if I get a custom I'll get it made like that) and the other goes down into the *Intertragic Notch *which (for me at least) creates a really good fit, the first time I used them I had trouble getting them _out _of my ears Lol.


 
  LOL
  thats very explainful. (?) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			








. 
  but i get the idea. pretty sure wont buy them before trying them ,at least not at that price


----------



## kiteki

Or you can just get a pair of scissors and cut all that stuff off........ Hahaha.


----------



## 3602

These guys must have a _hard time_ fitting IEMs.
  Hey how do you exactly insert and remove a custom piece? Apparently _you can pull a muscle_ doing that?


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> RE252 ------> EAR


 


  So I've been doing this wrong the whole time... ?


----------



## 3602

Great. Now I _have_ to try this.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Dunu Trident and Hephaes
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A60) Dunu DN-12 Trident*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C40) Dunu DN-16 Hephaes*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


----------



## LegendaryLvl1

I'm still waiting for someone to troll by quoting the first page : )


----------



## 3602

Quote: 





legendarylvl1 said:


> I'm still waiting for someone to troll by quoting the first page : )


 


   
  Please don't.


----------



## kanuka

great update joker!! i was waiting for those 2


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i havent seen any. but im surprised you find the re252 comfortable with that weird shape


 



   
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I have to agree that I achieved a very tight fit and high isolation with the RE252 and great bass response, it feels like a custom IEM.
> 
> 
> @kanuka, sure, I'll take a picture later.


 


  I get a really nice fit, but the isolation is average and I'm just not feeling the bass response... sigh, so close and yet so far to finding an iem that works for me.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I get a really nice fit, but the isolation is average and I'm just not feeling the bass response... sigh, so close and *yet so far to finding an iem that works for me.*


 

 welcome to my club buddy


----------



## s0lar

I noticed a small error.
   
  (2C37) Dunu DN-11 Ares - Added 06/15
  (2C38) Dunu DN-13 Crius - Added 06/15
  (2C39) Spider Realvoice - Added 06/20
*(3C40) Dunu DN-16 Hephaes* - Added 08/10
   
  Should be 2C40. Thanks for all the good work, what a bunch of reveiws, impressive!


----------



## ljokerl

Phew, thread is back up. Was returning an error message earlier today. 
   
   
  Quote: 





s0lar said:


> I noticed a small error.
> 
> (2C37) Dunu DN-11 Ares - Added 06/15
> (2C38) Dunu DN-13 Crius - Added 06/15
> ...


 


  Fixed, thanks.


----------



## LegendaryLvl1

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Phew, thread is back up. Was returning an error message earlier today.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I was getting that too - perhaps you should keep a backup?


----------



## aleex

Ordered N3i a couple of hours ago, but just read XE200 review. How big is the difference, from the rookie's perspective? Since I haven't paid yet, it shouldn't be too inconvenient for Thomas to cancel the order?


----------



## Foress

saw the Trident review. personally felt that it sounded quite similar to the CX300II, and it's more worth its price. what are your thoughts?


----------



## 3602

If DUNU can exploit the horn-shaped housing... In-ear Klipschorns?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





legendarylvl1 said:


> I was getting that too - perhaps you should keep a backup?


 

 I do, but only of the text. Just thinking of re-doing all of the formatting for the entire thread makes my skin crawl.


  Quote: 





aleex said:


> Ordered N3i a couple of hours ago, but just read XE200 review. How big is the difference, from the rookie's perspective? Since I haven't paid yet, it shouldn't be too inconvenient for Thomas to cancel the order?


 

  Not big. The N3i is the more impressive earphone at first listen, actually. If you think you'd prefer a slightly more balanced sound, I'd consider switching to the XE200PRO. Otherwise, I wouldn't bother.
   


  Quote: 





foress said:


> saw the Trident review. personally felt that it sounded quite similar to the CX300II, and it's more worth its price. what are your thoughts?


 
   
  I've never heard the mkII CX300. In a way the Trident does sound like a much more refined CX300 without the mid-bass lift, bloat, and top-end roll-off.
   
  Honestly, the Trident is one of the five best <$40 IEMs I've heard, alongside the Brainwavz M1, MEElec CX21, Soundmagic E10, and Soundmagic E30. It just happens to be my least favourite of the five.


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I do, but only of the text. Just thinking of re-doing all of the formatting for the entire thread makes my skin crawl.


 

 Click the edit button, hit the "source" button at the upper left, now copy the code rather than just the text. Voila, instant backup. You'll have to do this for each individual post in the megathread(s) though.


----------



## kanuka

@joker
  seems we have similar fits
  what size of comply T 400 do you use?


----------



## ljokerl

Thread working again. Thanks to Joe and the huddler staff for fixing it.

  
  Quote: 





armaegis said:


> Click the edit button, hit the "source" button at the upper left, now copy the code rather than just the text. Voila, instant backup. You'll have to do this for each individual post in the megathread(s) though.


 
   
  Yep, I've done that in the past but haven't updated those since the Miracle review, which makes them all outdated. Hopefully will have time to renew the backups this weekend.


  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> @joker
> seems we have similar fits
> what size of comply T 400 do you use?


 

 The regular one (medium?)


----------



## szczuru

Hey guys I see you have listened to lots of IEM's, so I'd like to get an advise from you. I had now a Soundmagic's PL-21 with an Ipod Nano 2G and I really liked this combination, but SM's broke down and I don't know which IEM's should I pick now. I'm thinking of any Xears, Brainwavz M1, Nuforce NE-6. What would I like next phones to be? I think a little bit more highs and a little bit more details, overall sound signature like PL-21, I really like my Philips SHP-5401 too, this is what I like. Oh and good isolation is quite imporant, I'm gonna use phones out-door. Oh and one more thing: I have Meelectronics CX-21 and these are to bright for me-not enough bass and isolation is to low for me.
   
  I'll appreciate any help
  Thanks!


----------



## Niyologist

I now own the Meelec M6 w/Sony Hybrid Tips, Meelec M9, Meelec SP51 and the Meelec CC51. The next pairs I'll own are in my Sig.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





szczuru said:


> Hey guys I see you have listened to lots of IEM's, so I'd like to get an advise from you. I had now a Soundmagic's PL-21 with an Ipod Nano 2G and I really liked this combination, but SM's broke down and I don't know which IEM's should I pick now. I'm thinking of any Xears, Brainwavz M1, Nuforce NE-6. What would I like next phones to be? I think a little bit more highs and a little bit more details, overall sound signature like PL-21, I really like my Philips SHP-5401 too, this is what I like. Oh and good isolation is quite imporant, I'm gonna use phones out-door. Oh and one more thing: I have Meelectronics CX-21 and these are to bright for me-not enough bass and isolation is to low for me.
> 
> I'll appreciate any help
> Thanks!


 
   
  You can always read through joker's reviews on the first page (control+F helps) and you can also ask questions here http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/557996/iems-portables-advice-don-t-start-a-new-thread-ask-for-help-here/


----------



## szczuru

Of course I've read almost whole review, but I would like to see what an experts would say, I just can't decide which one would be best to my expectations...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





szczuru said:


> Hey guys I see you have listened to lots of IEM's, so I'd like to get an advise from you. I had now a Soundmagic's PL-21 with an Ipod Nano 2G and I really liked this combination, but SM's broke down and I don't know which IEM's should I pick now. I'm thinking of any Xears, Brainwavz M1, Nuforce NE-6. What would I like next phones to be? I think a little bit more highs and a little bit more details, overall sound signature like PL-21, I really like my Philips SHP-5401 too, this is what I like. Oh and good isolation is quite imporant, I'm gonna use phones out-door. Oh and one more thing: I have Meelectronics CX-21 and these are to bright for me-not enough bass and isolation is to low for me.
> 
> I'll appreciate any help
> Thanks!


 


  I don't know if you can get the NE-6 these days. I should probably mark it discontinued. For treble between the PL-21 and CX-21 and a bit more detail than both I'd try the Xears Resonance or XE200 or maybe the Soundmagic E30. Problem with all of these is that they don't exactly have great isolation. The MEElec CC51 may also be an option if you can find one in your price range, or the Xears TD-III - that's a little darker than the XE200 and Resonance so its treble will be more PL21 than CX21 but at least it has decent isolation.


----------



## szczuru

Thanks a lot ljokerl. I thought so to take the Xears TD-III, MEElec are too expensive for me, I will keep on reading about earphones, but Xears are good for me I belive thanks a lot for help!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





szczuru said:


> Thanks a lot ljokerl. I thought so to take the Xears TD-III, MEElec are too expensive for me, I will keep on reading about earphones, but Xears are good for me I belive thanks a lot for help!


 

      I bought the CC51 for $54.99 from Amazon. Although Xears sounds like a very good option. I think I'll get a pair soon.


----------



## Shufny

^ "Location: Poland"


----------



## szczuru

Exactly-Poland. For 55$ I'd buy them now without any thinking... In Poland i can get them for about 80$ a little to exppensive for me :/


----------



## StargateRecords

Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> So, I just found a pair of Sony earbuds with the model nameMDR-EX310LP. I was wondering if anyone had heard them yet as they seem to be a new model? Chances are that they are just re-shelled EX300's buds though


 


  I have the MDR-EX310LP in white, I use them with my iPod Touch via EQu and with my BlackBerry, they sound great !


----------



## kanuka

hey joker
  do you think the M11+ eartips kit are a good option to the RE0?


----------



## kiteki

Kanuka, these are my RE0 tips you asked me to take a picture of.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker
> do you think the M11+ eartips kit are a good option to the RE0?


 

 They'll fit if that's what you mean. The M11+ kit offers a lot of options if you can't get a good fit with the RE0 tips. I quite like the short bi-flanges.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Kanuka, these are my RE0 tips you asked me to take a picture of.


 


  thank you!! looks like the shure olives

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They'll fit if that's what you mean. The M11+ kit offers a lot of options if you *can't get a good fit with the RE0 tips*. I quite like the short bi-flanges.


 

 yeah, that's exactly my problem. and even with my other extra tips
  thanks.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> thank you!! looks like the shure olives


 
   
  Yes, however, they're much stiffer than my shure olives, and they're already 'decored', I don't know what they are but they work well with the RE0!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Yes, however, they're much stiffer than my shure olives, and they're already 'decored', I don't know what they are but they work well with the RE0!


 


  I have a few pairs of these as well. I can't remember if they came with my old RE0 or not (mine is a summer '09 model, rev. 2 with the cloth cable). I know for sure I got a pair with my Soundmagic PL30 but I don't think they're included any more.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Yes, however, they're much stiffer than my shure olives, and they're already 'decored', I don't know what they are but they work well with the RE0!


 

 did you also got the new big 45angle plug? that's what i have
   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have a few pairs of these as well. I can't remember if they came with my old RE0 or not (mine is a summer '09 model, rev. 2 with the cloth cable). I know for sure I got a pair with my Soundmagic PL30 but I don't think they're included any more.


 

 i havent seen any of the previous versions with that tips
  and cloth cable? isnt it more microphonics than the 'new' PPE cable?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i havent seen any of the previous versions with that tips  and cloth cable? isnt it more microphonics than the 'new' PPE cable?


 


  No, not really a large difference in cable noise. Some cloth cords are noisy and some are not. Xears' and Woodees' new cloth cords are pretty low in microphonics, for example - lower than their 'standard' counterparts.


----------



## lina

hello
  meelec are selling the M11+ for $30 + $5 shipping.
  seems a good deal. but is there something else to consider for that price  that rivals the m11??


----------



## Ikarios

Joker - has Fang anyone contacted you about reviewing the RE272? I briefly listened to my loaner pair over the weekend and I like them a lot, but I don't remember the RE262 well enough to make a good comparison. In fact my memory of the 262 seems to be very similar to how I would describe the 272. It would be interesting to see how it stands with your descriptions.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lina said:


> hello
> meelec are selling the M11+ for $30 + $5 shipping.
> seems a good deal. but is there something else to consider for that price  that rivals the m11??


 

 To be honest I'd rather have the M21 than the M11+, unless you just want heavy bass. M21 is cheaper and sounds more natural with the same build quality. Not quite as small/attractive as the M11+ and doesn't come with as many tips but still better value.

  
  Quote: 





ikarios said:


> Joker - has Fang anyone contacted you about reviewing the RE272? I briefly listened to my loaner pair over the weekend and I like them a lot, but I don't remember the RE262 well enough to make a good comparison. In fact my memory of the 262 seems to be very similar to how I would describe the 272. It would be interesting to see how it stands with your descriptions.


 

 I've talked to Fang about it but I'm not sure whether an RE272 has been sent out to me, especially considering my stance on the whole universals vs customs debate.


----------



## lina

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> To be honest I'd rather have the M21 than the M11+, unless you just want heavy bass. M21 is cheaper and sounds more natural with the same build quality. Not quite as small/attractive as the M11+ and doesn't come with as many tips but still better value.


 
  and what about isolation and comfort? i know you only rated the M11+  a 0.5 point more , but how much better/worse they're?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lina said:


> and what about isolation and comfort? i know you only rated the M11+  a 0.5 point more , but how much better/worse they're?


 


  Comfort difference is due to the tips - the M11+ simply gives more fitment options. They are also shorter but the M21 is equally light so that shouldn't be an issue. The difference in isolation, similarly, is because the M11+ can be inserted quite deep with some of the included tips. With a more shallow seal they isolate more or less similarly.


----------



## Niyologist

I got my Meelectronics M6-CL. They are great, but the only thing that bothers me is the VERY Bright upper midrange/lower treble. Also, I have noticed that there isn't a mesh filter. Is there anyway to fix that?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I got my Meelectronics M6-CL. They are great, but the only thing that bothers me is the VERY Bright upper midrange/lower treble. Also, I have noticed that there isn't a mesh filter. Is there anyway to fix that?


 


  Burn-in, deeper insertion, better tips, equalizer. You can try sticking a piece of foam a short way into the nozzle as well but I haven't had an issue with mine despite the lack of filter. The M6 is always going to be pretty strident, like the M9.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Burn-in, deeper insertion, better tips, equalizer. You can try sticking a piece of foam a short way into the nozzle as well but I haven't had an issue with mine despite the lack of filter. The M6 is always going to be pretty strident, like the M9.


 

      Thanks for the info.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Sony MDR-EX1000 and Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99. Also updated much of the pricing and availability in the lower tiers. 
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2B9) Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1B6) Sony MDR-EX1000*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


----------



## Inks

Nice, was looking forward to this update.


----------



## lina

nice update!
  just a bit disapointing about the sony 1000 isolation and fit. not that i'd ever get them anyway


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Once again, great job, joker! Very nice to see my thoughts are similar to your assessments in this extremely huge comparison database (I refuse to call this a review, it doesn't do this justice).

You are closing into your 200th IEM... Any idea which IEM will gain that particular honor? 
I joke, the number really doesn't matter!


----------



## kiteki

Thanks for sending that to ljokerl esantosh, and thanks joker for using the word "amazing" at least once in your EX1000 synopsis. 
   
  I'd add to the review that bargain hunters can find it around the $315 mark, and that the EX600 is a fantastic alternative with a slightly edgier sound and less refinement however shares a very similiar SS, but that is just my take


----------



## Cortlendt

I'm looking for a dynamic, straight-down wear IEM to compliment my CK10. I would be very grateful if someone would provide picture of CKM99 in ears. I think fit can be an issue here. Also, would isolation of theirs be decent for a subway? With double flange tips.
   
  Many thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Nice, was looking forward to this update.


 
   
  Quote: 





lina said:


> nice update!


 
   
  Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> Once again, great job, joker! Very nice to see my thoughts are similar to your assessments in this extremely huge comparison database (I refuse to call this a review, it doesn't do this justice).


 

 Thanks!
   
   
  Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> You are closing into your 200th IEM... Any idea which IEM will gain that particular honor?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Not a clue. If unfinished/unposted reviews can be counted I'm sure I've passed the 200 mark already. I've got a hunch that it was the Shure SE215. If only posted ones count, it's anybody's guess. I'd have wanted it to be the long-lost TF10 but I don't think I can make it.


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Thanks for sending that to ljokerl esantosh, and thanks joker for using the word "amazing" at least once in your EX1000 synopsis.
> 
> I'd add to the review that bargain hunters can find it around the $315 mark, and that the EX600 is a fantastic alternative with a slightly edgier sound and less refinement however shares a very similiar SS, but that is just my take


 


  I wasn't sure that dealer was reputable and quoting the amazon price is safer anyway as I would hate to keep moving the earphone between tiers. But yes, those who seek shall find the EX1000 for less... probably. 
   
  Agree on EX600 - I rank its SQ at GR07 level but it's a good $50 cheaper nowadays, which is quite impressive. Still has the same isolation/fit caveats as the EX1000, of course.


----------



## music_4321

Joker -- I think it should be mentioned in your review that the non-US version of EX1000 comes not only with the genuine (RK-EX1000*L*P) thicker, more supple and even less microphonic cable, but also includes a shorter (RK-EX1000*S*P) 0.6m / 24" cable meant to be used with remote units (and has a straight plug unlike the L-shaped plug used with the longer cable). The US version of the EX1000 uses, in fact, the EX*6*00 cable (RK-EX*6*00LP).
   
  Left RK-EX1000*L*P (*L*ong cable) -- Right RK-EX*6*00LP (*L*ong cable)

   
   
  RK-EX1000*S*P (*S*hort cable)

   
   
  Top RK-EX1000*L*P -- Bottom RK-EX*6*00LP


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cortlendt said:


> I'm looking for a dynamic, straight-down wear IEM to compliment my CK10. I would be very grateful if someone would provide picture of CKM99 in ears. I think fit can be an issue here. Also, would isolation of theirs be decent for a subway? With double flange tips.
> 
> Many thanks in advance.


 


  I would want more isolation for subway use, personally. Not sure if anyone has a pic of a CKM99 but it's the same size/general shape as the Phiaton PS 210 / PS 20. Should look something like this:


----------



## esanthosh

Been waiting sometime for this update. I personally don't find the treble in EX-1000 to be fatiguing (but then I too am at home with CK10). But that not-so-aggressive nature does not always sit well with me for all genres. It does exceedingly well with Jazz and Classical for me, but due to that slightly distant presentation and lack of aggression, I don't always like it with Metal.
   
  Would you say that timbre on UM Miracle matches EX-1000? If yes, color me intrigued.
   
  On an unrelated note, I wish Hifiman would hurry the RE-272 review sample to you . In a few ways, it has the yang for yin of EX-1000's characteristics - some to my liking, others not so much. But, a very interesting IEM none the less.


----------



## Cortlendt

Quote: 





> I would want more isolation for subway use, personally. Not sure if anyone has a pic of a CKM99 but it's the same size/general shape as the Phiaton PS 210 / PS 20. Should look something like this:


 
   
  Thanks for the picture)


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





cortlendt said:


> I'm looking for a dynamic, straight-down wear IEM to compliment my CK10. *I would be very grateful if someone would provide picture of CKM99 in ears*. I think fit can be an issue here. Also, would isolation of theirs be decent for a subway? With double flange tips.
> 
> Many thanks in advance.


 

 Here you go:


----------



## i2ehan

EXmen rejoice! The EX1K is here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








 Just finished the read. Thank you |joker|, I've been meaning to see where the EX1000 stands for you my friend.


----------



## idvsego

hmmm...I like the description of the ckm99 and its in my price range...thanks again for the reviews


----------



## shureThing

"Extremely refined and liquid" – that is also how I would describe the MDR-EX1000's.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> Joker -- I think it should be mentioned in your review that the non-US version of EX1000 comes not only with the genuine (RK-EX1000*L*P) thicker, more supple and even less microphonic cable, but also includes a shorter (RK-EX1000*S*P) 0.6m / 24" cable meant to be used with remote units (and has a straight plug unlike the L-shaped plug used with the longer cable). The US version of the EX1000 uses, in fact, the EX*6*00 cable (RK-EX*6*00LP).


 
   
  Not sure I need to go into that much detail but I've added a mention of the cabling difference.

  
   Quote:


esanthosh said:


> Would you say that timbre on UM Miracle matches EX-1000? If yes, color me intrigued.


 
   
   
  Yes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 

  
  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> EXmen rejoice! The EX1K is here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





idvsego said:


> hmmm...I like the description of the ckm99 and its in my price range...thanks again for the reviews


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  I-I-I think... I just heard my wallet scream in pain...


----------



## i2ehan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   





 I'm surprised as well!


----------



## tuahogary

Any plans for the sennheiser cx880 "audiophile" iems? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Legendary thread btw. Was waiting for the EX1k for a long time!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tuahogary said:


> Any plans for the sennheiser cx880 "audiophile" iems?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I should probably try to finally get to the IE6 and IE7 first.


----------



## kanuka

hi my new RE0 (only a week) already broke. housing spltting. i asked for replacement or a refund. if a refund, i'm considering the Xcape IE or Xcited. but do they have a better build quality?


----------



## sulkoudai

wow, 190 headphones, 200 isn't far away now.....


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hi my new RE0 (only a week) already broke. housing spltting. i asked for replacement or a refund. if a refund, i'm considering the Xcape IE or Xcited. but do they have a better build quality?


 

 Strange, mine is second hand and solid, I can't pull it apart, can't you just glue the two shells back together?
   
  If Hifiman give you a refund I think you should sell your PK1 and get something really good instead 
   
  Anyway since around ~100 seems like your limit, may I recommend to you the Ultimate Ears UE 700 currently on sale in Australia, you can find it on ebay.


----------



## kanuka

i have the pk1 more than a month so i cant get a refund for them. anyway , i'm not willing to send back the pk1 !
  but i'll check those UE
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hi my new RE0 (only a week) already broke. housing spltting. i asked for replacement or a refund. if a refund, i'm considering the Xcape IE or Xcited. but do they have a better build quality?


 


  They do not


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They do not


 

 ok. maybe it's time for a meelec?


----------



## mugen3

Great review of the CKM99. They need more love around here.


----------



## music_4321

^ I agree and, in fact, think the CKM99s should have been ranked a bit higher.
   
  Also, I think build-quality is markedly better than the CK10's and closer to the excellent CK100's. The cable, though indeed thinner than the CK10's & CK100's, is not actually thin per se and is, in fact, quite strong and less intrusive that the thicker CK10 & CK100 cables, but when it comes to microphonics, I would give not rate the CKM99s 4/5 but more like 2/5 or 3/5. I also wish it was a single cable, ie not modular and that it had a chin slider.
   
  Also, I don't think the CKM99's midrange is "slightly recessed" at all but, overall, on SQ alone I think Joker pretty much nailed it.


----------



## Inks

The ranking is fine IMO, maybe an 8.9 but then that sounds quite generous. It's not as finely tuned as the GR07 and putting at about the level of the Coppers and Golds sounds about right. I really like the housing's build, the cable is nothing to write about. AT did a great job squeezing in such a big driver without sacrificing too much usability, Sony should take note. The only thing I will change on the housing is the nozzle, it's a tad short. I'll make it tapered and slightly longer. If I had to design a dynamic IEM sporting a big driver, the housing will be similar to this one.


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





inks said:


> *The ranking is fine IMO, maybe an 8.9 but then that sounds quite generous.* It's not as finely tuned as the GR07 and putting at about the level of the Coppers and Golds sounds about right.


 

 At the end of the day, it all becomes rather subjective. I said "a bit" higher, not higher or much higher, more like 9.0, IMO, rather than 8.8. Of course, I haven't heard the GR07, Coppers or Golds, but compared to other ratings (of IEMs I have indeed heard), I do think the CKM99 deserves to be a bit higher up - nothing major, really. Agreed about the great design, simply brilliant for such a big driver and definitely a very comfortable IEM. Oh, and at low to medium volumes I just love how the CKM99s perform - use mine almost every night just before going to bed.


----------



## DannyBai

To a person who has GR07, IE8 and FX700, is it worth it to purchase the EX1000?
  Sources are iphone, ipod, E11 and A10 with ALAC files.  Music choices are everything but country.  Also, I'd rather not use the amps and I do love the sounds of each earphone for their differences.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> To a person who has GR07, IE8 and FX700, is it worth it to purchase the EX1000?


 

 Yes.


----------



## Benjerry

dannybai said:


> To a person who has GR07, IE8 and FX700, is it worth it to purchase the EX1000?
> Sources are iphone, ipod, E11 and A10 with ALAC files.  Music choices are everything but country.  Also, I'd rather not use the amps and I do love the sounds of each earphone for their differences.




I would say no.
You would be better of saving money for customs; 
Why waste more cash on another universal when you have a pair of customs if you save a little more?
The Sony iems are not cheap; they cost around Singapore $680 approximately (offer price from Sony shop) elsewhere, I heard they cost close to $700 to nearly $1000 (Singapore dollars)
And they offer little, if any, marked sound improvement over the other top tier universals you own, hence it would be more of a side grade in terms of sound.
However, this is just my view;
If you really want to buy, go and demo out a pair before making a decision.
And buy them online, preferably 2nd hand to save $$$


----------



## i2ehan

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> *To a person who has GR07, IE8 and FX700, is it worth it to purchase the EX1000?*
> Sources are iphone, ipod, E11 and A10 with ALAC files.  Music choices are everything but country.  Also, I'd rather not use the amps and I do love the sounds of each earphone for their differences.


 
   
  That depends my friend. In the end, do you intend to keep each, or keep whichever one of the bunch sounds best to your ears? If it's the latter case, I'd say most definitely yes, it''s worth it. Else, I really don't see why you'd need another universal, in which case case I'd personally hold off.


----------



## rolz

i'd like to read joker's opinion on the sound quality between the ex600 and 1000. from the massive threads for both models, i reckon the general consensus is about 10-20 percent in sound quality. with the 1000's soundstage only slightly larger than that of the 600's. and now the ex600s are getting cheaper, it's like one-third the price of the flagship now.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Yes.


 


  Good answer.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





benjerry said:


> I would say no.
> You would be better of saving money for customs;
> Why waste more cash on another universal when you have a pair of customs if you save a little more?
> The Sony iems are not cheap; they cost around Singapore $680 approximately (offer price from Sony shop) elsewhere, I heard they cost close to $700 to nearly $1000 (Singapore dollars)
> ...


 

 This is great advise.  I think customs are the logical choice when it's time to upgrade.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> That depends my friend. In the end, do you intend to keep each, or keep whichever one of the bunch sounds best to your ears? If it's the latter case, I'd say most definitely yes, it''s worth it. Else, I really don't see why you'd need another universal, in which case case I'd personally hold off.


 

 I don't intend to keep each but I have a hard time getting rid of them.  I like each one so much.  I think holding off on the Sony's is the most logical choice and going custom when my wallet permits.  Just extremely curious about the Sony's.  Thanks for the input guys.


----------



## vwinter

I'm not sure if you know about it or just prefer your way, but you can use the multi quote buttons. I don't mean this in any snarky way, just trying to be informative.


----------



## i2ehan

I was going to kindly suggest the same.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> I'm not sure if you know about it or just prefer your way, but you can use the multi quote buttons. I don't mean this in any snarky way, just trying to be informative.


 


  Didn't know.  I just figured out the quote recently.  Thanks for the information.


----------



## vwinter

Click "Multi" on all the posts you want to quote and on the last one hit "Quote"
  Enjoy


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Click "Multi" on all the posts you want to quote and on the last one hit "Quote"
> Enjoy


 


  Got it.  Thanks for letting me know.  I appreciate it.


----------



## Selenium

I don't see why some of you are so concerned over rating scores. It's just one guy's interpretations. One guy who made his preferences clear and his ratings reflect as much.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> To a person who has GR07, IE8 and FX700, is it worth it to purchase the EX1000?
> Sources are iphone, ipod, E11 and A10 with ALAC files.  Music choices are everything but country.  Also, I'd rather not use the amps and I do love the sounds of each earphone for their differences.


 

 All good answers above. The EX1000 does sound different from all of these but whether you need yet another $300-400 dynamic-driver universal is a question only you can answer. Much as I like the GR07, I think the FX700 and EX1000 together would cover the spectrum for me. Except isolation, of course, as neither is very good at that.


  Quote: 





rolz said:


> i'd like to read joker's opinion on the sound quality between the ex600 and 1000. from the massive threads for both models, i reckon the general consensus is about 10-20 percent in sound quality. with the 1000's soundstage only slightly larger than that of the 600's. and now the ex600s are getting cheaper, it's like one-third the price of the flagship now.


 


  I would lean towards the higher end of that range but these things are sort of difficult to try and quantify. I think the EX600 is at GR07 level in sound, though of course with the same usability quirks as the EX1000. Whether the jump from there to the EX1000 is worth it is up to you - diminishing returns are just a part of this hobby. The jump in quality you get by spending more once you get to that level can (subjectively) be sizable or insignificant. Unfortunately there is also the reverse effect of price on quality perception, as evidenced by the TF10.


----------



## kingice10

Also it's better to have the EX1000 than having custom iems because of the value. You can sell them off with a couple of dollars off if you don't want the signature..But for EX1000, this iem is easily be liked by many.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Much as I like the GR07, I think the FX700 and EX1000 together would cover the spectrum for me. Except isolation, of course, as neither is very good at that.
> 
> Unfortunately there is also the reverse effect of price on quality perception, as evidenced by the TF10.


 

 Two things I totally agree with


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





benjerry said:


> I would say no.
> *1.* You would be better of saving money for customs;
> Why waste more cash on another universal when you have a pair of customs if you save a little more?
> The Sony iems are not cheap; *2.* they cost around Singapore $680 approximately (offer price from Sony shop) elsewhere, I heard they cost close to $700 to nearly $1000 (Singapore dollars)
> ...


 


 1. True, but customs that rival the EX1000 probably cost around $1000... USD.
   
  2. The prices you're quoting are too high, and Sonystyle in Singapore had 20% off recently so that would be $544 SGD.
   
  3. I think they offer a very significant improvement in SQ over the IE8.
   
  4. Yep, demoing is good, that's what I did, and then I decided the EX600 is pretty much the one for me, not everyone will prefer the EX1000, it depends on your taste in music, the EX1000 will surpass the EX600 at jazz, but it's reversed if your favorite music is complex/fast electronica. The EX600 is also excellent value, it SQ level is far higher than a $150 IEM, whereas the SQ level in the EX1000 is somewhere close to it's RRP I think. The EX1000 will also have a high resale value, which a JH13 will not.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Sony MDR-EX1000 and Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99. Also updated much of the pricing and availability in the lower tiers.


 
  Thanks joker!! Was looking forward to this for so long! Great impressions.


----------



## OnlinePredator

Thanks for the great reviews!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> 1. True, but customs that rival the EX1000 probably cost around $1000... USD.
> 
> 2. The prices you're quoting are too high, and Sonystyle in Singapore had 20% off recently so that would be $544 SGD.
> 
> 3. I think they offer a very significant improvement in SQ over the IE8.


 

  I think at $1000 you'd be well past EX1000 SQ when going custom. Trouble is finding a custom that has the strengths of the EX1000 - tone and timbre, openness, resolution, etc. My 1964-T rivals the EX1000 in overall SQ but they are meant for different purposes and therefore nearly impossible to compare. Frankly, each makes the other sound terrible. Same goes for comparing EX1000 to SM3.
   
   
  Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Thanks joker!! Was looking forward to this for so long! Great impressions.


 

  Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> Thanks for the great reviews!


----------



## s0lar

You've helped me a lot by helping me picking IEM's.
  I went from M1, RE0, Xcape v1, DDM, RE-ZERO, to RE262 and IE8.
  The RE262 I use mostly now, it's comfortable enough to sleep with.
  My next buy needs to isolate very well. I take a bus once in a while and then isolation is not good enough from either IEM I currently own.
  Some remarks. The RE0 leans the most towards what I like to hear.
  For me, the RE262 is amazing for duets and has very good soundstage.
  Bass is excellent with the IE8. But I am missing some treble sparkle. The RE-ZERO and RE262 come close.
  I am also considering customs (tips or monitors).My budget is around 500 EURO. I don't mind using a portable amp.
  The Etymotics (HF5, ER4)  are perhaps a good next try but since I heard IE8's bass and RE262's voices I want a lot.
  Another problem is my location, for customs the only dealer around is Variphone (Westone Belgium) and those are quite expensive.
  There is still the option of sending impressions to any manufacturer but I prefer to pick one in Europe.
  Thanks!


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> All good answers above. The EX1000 does sound different from all of these but whether you need yet another $300-400 dynamic-driver universal is a question only you can answer. Much as I like the GR07, I think the FX700 and EX1000 together would cover the spectrum for me. Except isolation, of course, as neither is very good at that.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for your take.  I was also thinking that EX1000 and FX700 would be the two keepers.  
   


  Quote: 





kingice10 said:


> Also it's better to have the EX1000 than having custom iems because of the value. You can sell them off with a couple of dollars off if you don't want the signature..But for EX1000, this iem is easily be liked by many.


 


  Valued point you make.


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> 1. True, but customs that rival the EX1000 probably cost around $1000... USD.
> 
> 2. The prices you're quoting are too high, and Sonystyle in Singapore had 20% off recently so that would be $544 SGD.
> 
> ...


 


  I actually didn't consider the EX600 but being a huge fan of electronica, I might have to have a listen of these.  When the EX1000 comes down in price to $350 or less, I might take the bite.  If the EX1000 really has a better SQ over the IE8, then I think it's worth it for me.


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *I think at $1000 you'd be well past EX1000 SQ when going custom.* Trouble is finding a custom that has the strengths of the EX1000 - tone and timbre, openness, resolution, etc. My 1964-T rivals the EX1000 in overall SQ but they are meant for different purposes and therefore nearly impossible to compare. Frankly, each makes the other sound terrible. Same goes for comparing EX1000 to SM3.


 
   
   
  I'll have to strongly disagree with you there (bolded text). I know you and _average_joe_ share the same view regarding the whole customs vs universals 'debate'. In the thread I started over 2 years ago (linked in my sig), which was sadly locked recently, there were several reports by people who owned very expensive customs who found the gap between expensive customs and expensive universals not as big as you suggest.
   
  I personally own the truly excellent $850 custom Westone ES3X, and not only is my EX1000 the first universal to match my ES3X sonically, but in some instances surpass it; after nearly 3 months with my EX1000s I might as well choose the EX1000s over the ES3Xs if I could only keep one. There's also an excellent Headphonia review where the JH16 - one of the most expensive customs out there and quite possibly HF's favourite and most highly regarded - is compared to the EX1000 and the Sonys compare very favourably.
   
  Also, it seems more drivers doesn't always translate into better SQ as evidenced by some people who prefer the triple-BA-driver UERM or the 5-BA-driver ES5 over the 6-BA-driver JH13 or 8-BA-driver JH16, or (in two cases that I know of) the triple-BA-driver ES3X over the ES5. There's one or two people who prefer the dual-BA-driver JH5 over the JH13.
   
  Like I said in an earlier post, things often become rather subjective, and in my particular case I found, for instance, both CK10 & SM3, two IEMs you yourself regard quite highly, quite poor sounding. As for the SM3 vs EX1000, most of those who have heard both, they seem to favour the Sonys. Even the much cheaper GR07 & EX600 are favoured by a few of those who have also heard the SM3 and not by a small margin.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





s0lar said:


> You've helped me a lot by helping me picking IEM's.
> I went from M1, RE0, Xcape v1, DDM, RE-ZERO, to RE262 and IE8.
> The RE262 I use mostly now, it's comfortable enough to sleep with.
> My next buy needs to isolate very well. I take a bus once in a while and then isolation is not good enough from either IEM I currently own.
> ...


 

 I think you may like the RE272 if you find the isolation of the RE262 sufficient for your commute. It is brighter/sparklier and has pretty good bass extension while preserving the soundstage and (for the most part) the midrange sweetness. Not a night and day difference but maybe a better signature match for you. Personally I'd take the EX1000 over it but that's not suitable for sleeping or commuting. I am not familiar with customs in that price range that sound like what you're after and have heard none at all from European manufacturers.
   


  Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> I personally own the truly excellent $850 custom Westone ES3X, and not only is my EX1000 the first universal to match my ES3X sonically, but in some instances surpass it; after nearly 3 months with my EX1000s I might as well choose the EX1000s over the ES3Xs if I could only keep one. There's also an excellent Headphonia review where the JH16 - one of the most expensive customs out there and quite possibly HF's favourite and most highly regarded - is compared to the EX1000 and the Sonys compare very favourably.
> 
> Also, it seems more drivers doesn't always translate into better SQ as evidenced by some people who prefer the triple-BA-driver UERM or the 5-BA-driver ES5 over the 6-BA-driver JH13 or 8-BA-driver JH16, or (in two cases that I know of) the triple-BA-driver ES3X over the ES5. There's one or two people who prefer the dual-BA-driver JH5 over the JH13.


 

 As always, I can only relate my own experience - the disclaimer is right there in the first post. One ~$900 custom is not enough data points to make a generalization and I honestly don't see why the ES3X would sound significantly better than the UM3X in the first place - as TF10 owners are finding out, sticking the internals of a well-tuned universal (which the UM3X certainly is) into a custom shell probably is fairly limiting on the performance increase you can get, unless Westone seriously handicapped the UM3X. I also don't see how the driver argument is relevant - I've said countless times that more drivers does not equate to better sound in and of itself, and we see plenty of examples of that in the universal realm. It's what's done with those drivers that matters. What I do know is that Miracle makes the EX1000 - and any other universal I've heard so far - sound underwhelming - and that's not  a statement I make lightly considering how much I like the EX1000.
   
  Either way, unless you can point me to someone who has heard the UM Miracle and EX1000 and preferred the latter, I really don't see how other users preferring other customs to various universals is relevant. Even then I trust my own ears above anyone else's at this point, which is one of the reasons I do not read reviews or participate in discussion/appreciation threads. This would be especially true of someone whose views continually diverge from my own, as mine apparently do from yours.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think at $1000 you'd be well past EX1000 SQ when going custom.


 

 Actually I only said $1000 due to the EX*1000*.
   
  Since I'm not that heavily into customs *YET *I'll simply refrain from commenting, but that is all going to change very soon. =)
   
  I know you only compare what you've heard, but if you received the *UE Capitol*, the *JH16*, the Westone *ES5*, or various other flagship customs, don't you think they'd be in the *Nr#1* spot of your IEM reviewing now?


----------



## kiteki

P.S. Dr. Fang says the RE272 rival $1000 customs in the mids and highs.


----------



## Niyologist

What has the bass of the IE8, but with better clarity and detail that is a Universal?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> P.S. Dr. Fang says the RE272 rival $1000 customs in the mids and highs.


 
   
       Do you think that the treble could sound a bit "metallic" due to the metal housing?


----------



## Inks

niyologist said:


> What has the bass of the IE8, but with better clarity and detail that is a Universal?


 
  FX700
   
  Also, RE272's have plastic housing I believe...


----------



## i2ehan

Quote: 





inks said:


> FX700


 
   
  Ditto, It's the first one that came to my mind as well. However, I'd say the IE8 is more midbass oriented than subbass, whereas the FX700 has a good bit more sub-bass, no?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Niyologist* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Do you think that the treble could sound a bit "metallic" due to the metal housing?


 

 Titanium sounds much less metallic than you'd expect!!
   
  Not sure about the RE272 housing though.


----------



## Inks

i2ehan said:


> Ditto, It's the first one that came to my mind as well. However, I'd say the IE8 is more midbass oriented than subbass, whereas the FX700 has a good bit more sub-bass, no?


 
  FX700's bass is midbass oriented like the IE8, FX500s will be the subbass alternative. It's just that the FX700 midbass isn't as pronounced as the IE8 so you get a better sense of the subbass.


----------



## i2ehan

Hmm, I haven't heard the FX500's, and while it may very well be more sub-bass oriented, the FX700 certainly doesn't fall short in that regard, at least not to my ears. Albeit, they share little resemblance in sound, correct?


----------



## Inks

FX700s are bottomless, so it's not lacking anything deep down. It's more pronounced in the midbass though so more attention is drawn there. 
   
  FX500s are pretty close to the 700s, but not close like the EX600 to EX1000 in sound signature (but closer in performance imo). FX500s are the 700s with more subbass than midbass, thinner lower midrange, more upper mid energy and very similar treble performance and presentation.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I know you only compare what you've heard, but if you received the *UE Capitol*, the *JH16*, the Westone *ES5*, or various other flagship customs, don't you think they'd be in the *Nr#1* spot of your IEM reviewing now?


 

 Assuming they were better than the 1964-T and I'd never heard the Miracle, I don't see why that wouldn't be the case.
  
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> P.S. Dr. Fang says the RE272 rival $1000 customs in the mids and highs.


 

 That statement is so vague that it's nearly useless and may well be true as a result. I'm quite sure that as with universals, there are marked differences in both sound signature and sound quality between customs (even at the same price point). Without a specific model in mind and specific aspects of the sound to consider, such a statement is impossible to refute. Are we talking mid/treble balance? Detail? Clarity? Resolution? Tone and timbre? Other factors? There may be customs out there that the RE272 can rival in one or more ways. Mine needs burn-in before I can say for sure how it comparesd to the Miracle but so far it's only really keeping up in clarity.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Do you think that the treble could sound a bit "metallic" due to the metal housing?


 

 Metallic is just a term - it hasn't necessarily got to do with housing material. It describes a certain type of midrange/treble unevenness and the resulting tone/timbre issues. Sometimes these issues can be caused by resonance in the housing but that's not always true. Something can sound metallic in a plastic housing (see: Pioneer MJ71, Senn HD25, etc) and there are certainly plenty of examples of metal-shelled gear that sounds smooth and has good tone & timbre (see Monster Pro line). Plastic housings can echo too, by the way.


----------



## Inks

Correct, plastic housings are the ones that echo more and cause poor resonants. I wouldn't attribute a metallic sound to a metal housing, it's a very flawed way to look at it. If there's a bad peak in the high regions it's usually because of poor tuning leading to resonants. Besides, the diaphragm's material is most important.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> [...] There may be customs out there that the RE272 can rival in one or more ways. Mine needs burn-in before I can say for sure how it comparesd to the Miracle but so far it's only really keeping up in clarity.


 
   
  Cool, as clarity is one of my favorite aspects of sound replication I think I'm going to love the RE272.
   
  p.s. please don't tell me you're in the "they need 800 hours burn-in" camp. =p


----------



## Niyologist

Thanks everyone!


----------



## Shufny

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> p.s. please don't tell me you're in the "they need 800 hours burn-in" camp. =p


 


  I'm fairly sure he is in the "if I don't burn them in for x hours before review, I'm gonna get crucified" camp.


----------



## a_recording

Quote: 





shufny said:


> I'm fairly sure he is in the "if I don't burn them in for x hours before review, I'm gonna get crucified" camp.


 


  I always find it worrying when IEM manufacturers themselves recommend huge amounts of burn in time. Considering they actually have the measuring tools to test this, why do we never see any graphs or any data supporting the idea that things like transient response, frequency response, etc improve with time? I sometimes think I hear small differences in sound over time, but I know enough about the human brain to have serious doubts about the whole thing...


----------



## tuahogary

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> P.S. Dr. Fang says the RE272 rival $1000 customs in the mids and highs.


 

 Are you serious? I hated the RE272 and so did my audiophile friends - although they were the full size can types, not us IEM-ers.


----------



## kiteki

*hate* is a strong word.
   
  just kidding 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, why did you hate them? I'd like to know, it just makes it all the more exciting to receive an IEM/HP that receives *love / hate* reactions, not that I can think of many... EX700 comes to mind...
   
  but you are saying you hated them and so did all your friends, and bennyboy says it was like being on an island with fountains of whiskey and naked lucsious girls! Kinda makes me wonder how they sound


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





inks said:


> FX700
> 
> Also, R*E272's have plastic housing I believe...*


 

 Yeah, thats what I thought too...or was it the 262 I was thinking about.....? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> FX700's bass is midbass oriented like the IE8, FX500s will be the subbass alternative. It's just that the FX700 midbass isn't as pronounced as the IE8 so you get a better sense of the subbass.


 
   
  Interesting. Sub-bass isn't a bad thing to have, just not by itself. Say, can someone tell me, between the FX500 and FX700, which would be sounds better with hard and/or progressive rock / metal? Also, is the EX1000 good for those genres? I know its not ideally suited to those genres but does it fare much worse than the FXs or just a little bit?
  

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That statement is so vague that it's nearly useless and may well be true as a result. I'm quite sure that as with universals, there are marked differences in both sound signature and sound quality between customs (even at the same price point). Without a specific model in mind and specific aspects of the sound to consider, such a statement is impossible to refute. Are we talking mid/treble balance? Detail? Clarity? Resolution? Tone and timbre? Other factors? There may be customs out there that the RE272 can rival in one or more ways. Mine needs burn-in before I can say for sure how it comparesd to the Miracle but so far it's only really keeping up in clarity.


 
   
  Yup, that really is vague. Where would you even begin to support or refute it? Not that it can't be true but it needs to be a little more specific. Generalizations like that are annoying, IMO.


----------



## Inks

Thats true @recording. Burn-in is mostly mental, when tests have actually been done, it's shown that changes are very minuscule. Our auditory memories are poor and our mind can be tricky at perceiving sound. Manufacturers recommend long sessions because they want you to adapt to the sound. 

Both re262 and 272 have plastic housings.


----------



## Poetik

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> As always, I can only relate my own experience - the disclaimer is right there in the first post. One ~$900 custom is not enough data points to make a generalization and I honestly don't see why the ES3X would sound significantly better than the UM3X in the first place - as TF10 owners are finding out, sticking the internals of a well-tuned universal (which the UM3X certainly is) into a custom shell probably is fairly limiting on the performance increase you can get, unless Westone seriously handicapped the UM3X. I also don't see how the driver argument is relevant - I've said countless times that more drivers does not equate to better sound in and of itself, and we see plenty of examples of that in the universal realm. It's what's done with those drivers that matters. What I do know is that Miracle makes the EX1000 - and any other universal I've heard so far - sound underwhelming - and that's not  a statement I make lightly considering how much I like the EX1000.
> 
> Either way, unless you can point me to someone who has heard the UM Miracle and EX1000 and preferred the latter, I really don't see how other users preferring other customs to various universals is relevant. Even then I trust my own ears above anyone else's at this point, which is one of the reasons I do not read reviews or participate in discussion/appreciation threads. This would be especially true of someone whose views continually diverge from my own, as mine apparently do from yours.


 

 You tell him man!! I completely agree with this.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





inks said:


> Burn-in is mostly mental, when tests have actually been done, it's shown that changes are very minuscule. Our auditory memories are poor and our mind can be tricky at perceiving sound. *Manufacturers recommend long sessions because they want you to adapt to the sound.*


 

 Right! That's where my cynicism comes from too, and that's why I couldn't let it rest when Pianist suggested the RE0 requires burn-in for _over a month _continuously until it sounds like it should.
   
  It's like saying a blu-ray player will get better picture quality after 300~1000 hours of constant burn-in, what kind of videophile would even do that?
   
  As for our auditory memory, I know it's probably a long a deep subject but most people can recognize a song just by hearing a tenth of a second from a song, randomly!


----------



## tuahogary

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> *hate* is a strong word.
> 
> just kidding
> 
> ...


 

 lol actually hate_ is_ a strong word! My bad! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Let's just say most of us agreed that we wouldn't pay more than $170 for them. It sounds dull to me and the detail, soundstage or dynamic range really isn't that impressive. A lot of hyped reviews out there IMO. Reminds me of the UM3x ahem! Don't get me wrong - it is a good IEM, but great? I don't think so.
   
  Granted it wasn't burnt in for more than 50 hours, but then comes your recent discussion about burn in, Personally, I think driver burn in exist because I've experienced it under extreme conditions - the HJE900 literally went from more unlistenable than $5 earbuds to something more amazing than the W3. And I didn't listen to the HJE at all during its burn in. Very rare this, but it erases all my skepticism.


----------



## nikp

Awesome review!!


----------



## Niyologist

Anyone knows where the FX-500 is sold for a low price?


----------



## shotgunshane

http://www.seyo-shop.com/product.php?productid=15195&cat=15090&page=2
   
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Anyone knows where the FX-500 is sold for a low price?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> http://www.seyo-shop.com/product.php?productid=15195&cat=15090&page=2


 

      Thank you.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


tuahogary said:


> Granted it wasn't burnt in for more than 50 hours, but then comes your recent discussion about burn in, Personally, I think driver burn in exist because I've experienced it under extreme conditions - the HJE900 literally went from more unlistenable than *$5 earbuds to something more amazing than the W3*. And I didn't listen to the HJE at all during its burn in. Very rare this, but it erases all my skepticism.


 

 I see I see, I suppose that's why the price increased from $79 to like $279 now, people discovered cubic zirconia needs 600 hours of 5 - 50,000 Hertz sweeps at 111 dB to anneal, decrystallize, and evaporate into zirconium dioxide that layers our inner ear canals, dissipates into our bloodstream and then hyperstimulates the auditory nerve.


----------



## Anaxilus

You guys need to stop crapping all over this thread w/ burn-in talk.  Grow a pair and take it to the science forum.  Better yet, everything said so far is more appropriate for the members lounge.


----------



## kiteki

Ok.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shufny said:


> I'm fairly sure he is in the "if I don't burn them in for x hours before review, I'm gonna get crucified" camp.


 

 That was definitely a thought at the very beginning but since then I've been doing it for the sake of fairness/consistency. I usually do 100 hours or whatever the manufacturer recommends, whichever is greater. 

  
  Quote: 





a_recording said:


> I always find it worrying when IEM manufacturers themselves recommend huge amounts of burn in time. Considering they actually have the measuring tools to test this, why do we never see any graphs or any data supporting the idea that things like transient response, frequency response, etc improve with time? I sometimes think I hear small differences in sound over time, but I know enough about the human brain to have serious doubts about the whole thing...


 

 Manufacturers are just as aware of 'brain burn-in' as we are and it is to their advantage to recommend a certain amount of run-in on the off-chance that your opinion will change in favor of their product, even if they have no quantifiable data to support that claim.
   


  Quote: 





nikp said:


> Awesome review!!


 

 Thanks


----------



## Inks

ljokerl said:


> Manufacturers are just as aware of 'brain burn-in' as we are and it is to their advantage to recommend a certain amount of run-in on the off-chance that your opinion will change in favor of their product, even if they have no quantifiable data to support that claim.


 
 This is most likely correct imo. Joker's approach to burn-in for the sake of consistency and fairness is pretty respectable I must add.

Jzool is the cheapest place to get the FX500s and their customer service is great ime. ​


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





inks said:


> Jzool is the cheapest place to get the FX500s and their customer service is great ime. ​


 
   
      An even better price! Thanks!


----------



## Stephen Guo

New and unique product!~

http://www.custom-iem.com/wan-xuan-i9-pro-single-14mm-dynamic-driver-p-661.html
   
   
 Wan Xuan i9 pro - Single 14mm Dynamic Driver


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





stephen guo said:


> New and unique product!~
> 
> http://www.custom-iem.com/wan-xuan-i9-pro-single-14mm-dynamic-driver-p-661.html
> 
> ...


 

      I think my wallet will be suffering after this. Although it's for a good cause.


----------



## cn11

Quote: 





stephen guo said:


> New and unique product!~
> 
> http://www.custom-iem.com/wan-xuan-i9-pro-single-14mm-dynamic-driver-p-661.html
> 
> ...


 

 So how do they sound? Have you heard the Future Sonics MG6Pro custom for comparison as these were developed?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





stephen guo said:


> New and unique product!~
> 
> http://www.custom-iem.com/wan-xuan-i9-pro-single-14mm-dynamic-driver-p-661.html
> 
> ...


 


 Does this also mean that Wan Xuan may intend on reshelling 14mm dynamic driver universals? I'd anticipate quite an interest for that.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Does this also mean that Wan Xuan may intend on reshelling 14mm dynamic driver universals? I'd anticipate quite an interest for that.


 

 Not from me.  I'd prefer a 16mm driver.  Cough...cough....


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Not from me.  I'd prefer a 16mm driver.  Cough...cough....


----------



## i2ehan

He meant 16 drivers.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm very interested of the Sound Signature of the Wan Xuan i9 Pro.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> He meant 16 drivers.


 

 Per sound tube.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Per sound tube.


 

 Good grief! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 LOL


----------



## Stephen Guo

Average_Joe will be reviewing the Wan Xuan i9 pro, so stay tuned!~


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





stephen guo said:


> Average_Joe will be reviewing the Wan Xuan i9 pro, so stay tuned!~


 

 Yahoooo....cant wait!


----------



## i2ehan

Let's carry this discussion over at our friend average_joe's thread, in respect to |joker|.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> [size=small]An incomplete list of planned reviews. Subject to change without notice.[/size]
> 
> In progress:
> 
> ...


 

 Just started listening to these, an overlooked gem is all I can say!
   
  I can no longer recommend AATH-CK10.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Just started listening to these, an overlooked gem is all I can say!
> 
> I can no longer recommend AATH-CK10.


 

 Really?  Most reviews put it behind the CK10, DBA, Qjays.  Interesting.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Just started listening to these, an overlooked gem is all I can say!
> 
> I can no longer recommend AATH-CK10.


 
  Is the UE700 a TWFK-based IEM as well?


----------



## kiteki

Ya, it is, that's a TWFK right there.

 I only bought it for reshelling it into a custom IEM, expecting it to sound like nothing special.  I hope the RE272 highs and high-highs sound like this.


----------



## Inks

Pretty sure Joker thinks the UE700 is the worst implementation of the TWFK.


----------



## kiteki

These sound like an exciting ER-4.
   
  The CK10 has better sub-bass for sure, and liquid smooth mids, these have more dynamic mids and are also more open and even more extended(?_)in the highs.

 The CK10 had more accurate imaging, but the imaging of these sounds more effortless, almost like you're listening to open-air earbuds.

 They both share a very flat FR and addictive pacing and speed, but the UE700 doesn't have the slight piercingness of the ck10 in the highs, and shares the air of the ER-4S, just my 2 cents.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Pretty sure Joker thinks the UE700 is the worst implementation of the TWFK.


 

 Yes
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Impossible.
> 
> These sound like an exciting ER-4.


 
   


  A:B them with the CK10 and you'll see what I mean. They sound alike signature-wise but the UE700 is just that little bit worse in every way.


----------



## Heret1c

Does Knowles sell the TWFK as is to all manufacturers or do they also custom tune them before delivery as the the manufacturer's request? I ask because UE is always talking about how they use custom-tuned drivers.
   
  "
 Pro-quality sound reproduction. *Dual-armature design with passive crossover:* Two *custom-tuned* armature speakers in each ear give you clean, detailed sound. One speaker produces rich and punchy bass, while the second speaker delivers clear mid and high notes."
   
  -Excerpt from UE website


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> A:B them with the CK10 and you'll see what I mean. They sound alike signature-wise but the UE700 is just that little bit worse in every way.


 

 I'll do so, when I get the chance, but your throughts above are what I thought of the q-Jays. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I prefer the mids on the UE700, it could just come down to taste, the bass in these is lacking though, it's like they took the ck10 and shifted the whole FR a couple steps to the right, I edited my post above with how I think they compare to ck10.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Does Knowles sell the TWFK as is to all manufacturers or do they also custom tune them before delivery as the the manufacturer's request? I ask because UE is always talking about how they use custom-tuned drivers.


 


  If you're placing a large enough order they'll tune it for you or help you tune it.


----------



## kiteki

The UM Aero is also TWFK.
   
  From memory (I used the ck10 everyday for a long time..) the UE700 has even better clarity, really!... you just need to find the sweet spot in volume before the bass starts distorting.
   
  By the way I'm interested in your thoughts on RE272 versus CK10 and UE700 joker!


----------



## tyrael

Do you have any plan to review the re272 joker?


----------



## i2ehan

^^ I'm interested to know as well.


----------



## kiteki

Ok, I just read Mike at headfonia's review, he says the UE700 is *very airy *compared to the other dual-driver IEM's, including the JH5! I don't agree with him on his whole review at all, but like I said, this has the air and clarity of the ER-4S but it's more exciting! surpassing ck10 in the highs, moving my rant here -> kiteki UE700 ranting


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you're placing a large enough order they'll tune it for you or help you tune it.


 

 Ah ok. So UE wasn't just embellishing when they said that then, possibly. Always thought it was just marketing speak, really.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tyrael said:


> Do you have any plan to review the re272 joker?


 

 Yes
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Ok, I just read Mike at headfonia's review, he says the UE700 is *very airy *compared to the other dual-driver IEM's, including the JH5!


 


  I've never read his reviews and never will after someone mentioned that his review of the Marshall Major said they sound like the HD25-1. I can't think of two headphones that are more different to my ears so I don't imagine we'd agree on anything. I did spend hours A:Bing the CK10, UE700, DBA-02, q-JAYS and the Phiaton PS200 (back when I still had it) and maintain that the UE700 is the one I'd get rid of first. It's also often the cheapest, however, since UE dropped the MSRP from $199 to $149 this year, so it's not necessarily the one I'd be least likely to buy.


----------



## kiteki

I'm happy for you to maintain that, and I'd agree that the UE700 sub-bass is almost non-existent, it just sounds quite a bit better than I expected in the mids and highs, especially for only $99! now all I need to do is perhaps buy another one and reshell it with one or two more drivers.
   
  Edit: Also Lol at Mike, and by the way you and esantosh said the RE252 sounds roughly like a reshelled RE0! I can't agree on that, just ftr...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *kiteki* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> by the way you and esantosh said the RE252 sounds roughly like a reshelled RE0! I can't agree on that, just ftr...


 


  I don't recall saying that. They are both well-balanced dynamic-driver IEMs and there were very few of those back then so obviously they shared a degree of similarity but I don't think I ever hinted that they used the same internals as the RE0. If you mean my comment about gummy bears, that refers strictly to the form factor. My RE252 review does start with:
   
   
  Quote: 





> When the RE252 (at that time called the RE3) was first announced I expected that it would be a spiritual successor to Head-Direct’s previous flagship and one of my all-around favorite IEMs, the RE0. From the first listen, however, I realized that they are very different animals.


----------



## ljokerl

Whoa, just noticed my new custom title 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. How long has that been there?


----------



## MaxwellDemon

ljokerl said:


> Whoa, just noticed my new custom title
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Probably a few days old, I don't recall it being there when I made a comment about your EX1000 review. Neat title!


----------



## i2ehan

Ahaha, well deserving, might I add! However, my title for you is slightly different my friend: |joker|, "190+ reasons why your wallet hates you"


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Ahaha, well deserving, might I add! However, my title for you is slightly different my friend: |joker|, "190+ reasons why your wallet hates you"


 

 OUch. LOL. I'm sure he means it in a good way


----------



## kiteki

Yeah I meant the reshelled into gummy bears thing.
   
  If you think they're "very different animals" (not bears) then that's good.
   
  If I find an IEM sounds exciting, or makes my music sound captivating, I can't help but _adore_ it, which may colorize my thoughts a bit, such is perhaps the case for the EX600 and UE700, if I was a robot I'd perhaps call the CK10 the better technical performer overall than the UE, as a robot I'd also closely match the UE and the ER-4S (they sound closer than CK10, you must admit), as a robot I might also like the K2 SP, but as a music lover it was very difficult to get anything out of it, and in pure music terms I'd rank it lower than every IEM I just mentioned.
   
  Edit: I'm not calling you a robot btw, ljokerl, I admire the fact you're devoid of brand favoritism and colorizing.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Ahaha, well deserving, might I add! However, my title for you is slightly different my friend: |joker|, "190+ reasons why your wallet hates you"


 


  Thanks, but I think I like the one I've got just a little bit better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   

  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Edit: I'm not calling you a robot btw, ljokerl, I admire the fact you're devoid of brand favoritism and colorizing.


 


  011101000110100001100001011011100110101100100000011110010110111101110101


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Edit: Also Lol at Mike, and by the way you and esantosh said the RE252 sounds roughly like a reshelled RE0! I can't agree on that, just ftr...


 

 Err... When did I say that? I don't remember saying RE0 and RE252 sound alike either. I prefer RE-252 and even RE-ZERO to RE0.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Whoa, just noticed my new custom title
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Since yesterday in my time zone.


----------



## Foress

Sony MDR-EX100 or IE8? hmm..


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Err... When did I say that? I don't remember saying RE0 and RE252 sound alike either. I prefer RE-252 and even RE-ZERO to RE0.


 

 Again, the gummy bear reshelling thing, you had it at the end of your RE252 review, on a different website, remember..?
   
  I'm glad you and ljokerl don't think the RE252 is roughly an RE0 inside a mutant gummy bear, it was a misconception on my part, and by the way the RE252 looks like a seal or a dolphin to me.


----------



## esanthosh

I thought so! Actually, if you read closely, I quoted Joker's conclusion in that review 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
_Edit_: Too many one liners (including this post 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) and topics that are better discussed elsewhere in this thread of late. Let's not hijack the Multi-IEM review thread into a random discussion thread. And to conclude, I don't think ljokerl is a robot.


----------



## kiteki

TBH... who cares, it's time to reshell the RE272 into a custom, it already sounds like a high-end custom, what will it sound like... inside a custom? I think we are on to something here.


----------



## GalmArn

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> TBH... who cares, it's time to reshell the RE272 into a custom, it already sounds like a high-end custom, what will it sound like... inside a custom? I think we are on to something here.


 

 It shouldn't sound much different no ?
  I mean, beside if you have a bad seal with the original, all you will upgrade is the comfort and maybe a bit the SQ if you manage to get a even better seal. I would be surprised if you get a significant upgrade SQ wise.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Per sound tube.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





foress said:


> Sony MDR-EX100 or IE8? hmm..


 

 If you have to have the mid-bass lift, flat treble, flush form factor, or low wind noise - IE8. Otherwise I can't really see why you wouldn't get the Sonys.
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> TBH... who cares, it's time to reshell the RE272 into a custom,* it already sounds like a high-end custom*, what will it sound like... inside a custom? I think we are on to something here.


 






 how rumours get started...


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> *(2B3) Digital Designs DD DXB-01 EarbuDDs*
> ...


 
   
  I just noticed these are using almost the exact same housing as my old Qualia EXQ1.
   
  See here: http://ctec3.blog.so-net.ne.jp/2010-10-20


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I just noticed these are using almost the exact same housing as my old Qualia EXQ1.
> 
> See here: http://ctec3.blog.so-net.ne.jp/2010-10-20


 

 It's a fairly common housing nowadays - there's a Radius model using it as well, and a number of others. I mentioned it in the review of those:
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> Build Quality (4/5) – Metal housings sheathed in rubber feature long integrated strain reliefs and seem to be shared with the rare *Sony Qualia MDR-EXQ1 canalphones*. The plastic cabling is thick and sturdy. Oddly, the 3.5mm plug has 4 contact points despite the earphones having no microphone


----------



## i2ehan

I know it's been mentioned a few times already, but I thought I'd ask anyways; any chance the GR10 can make the list my friend?


----------



## kanuka

i saw a while ago a reference to the meelec series explaining what each number and/or letter stands for
  does anyone know a link to that?  cant find it myself now


----------



## kanuka

hey joker congrats for your "Portables Reviewerus Prolificus" title. that's nice (whatever it means). sounds like a lost specie in an evolution chain


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I know it's been mentioned a few times already, but I thought I'd ask anyways; any chance the GR10 can make the list my friend?


 

 Not planing on it - think I've got enough to get through as is.

  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i saw a while ago a reference to the meelec series explaining what each number and/or letter stands for
> does anyone know a link to that?  cant find it myself now


 

 I don't know where it is but it was something like First letter - series; Second letter - housing material; 1st number (if present) - number of drivers; 2nd number - model line; 3rd number - model number. The rules did not apply to the older models so it was pretty confusing. 


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker congrats for your "Portables Reviewerus Prolificus" title. that's nice (whatever it means). sounds like a lost specie in an evolution chain


 

 I am the missing link


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am the missing link


 

 Indeed you are, my friend. Indeed you are. LOL. (I meant that in a good way of course! )


----------



## ljokerl

Added Xears CP100iP. Updated TD-III review to v2. Updated queue.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A61) Xears Communicate CP100iP*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


----------



## rubyiris

rubyiris said:


> I'm trying to decide between the Apple Dual-Driver IEMs, and  Klipsh Custom 2, or if I should just stick to dynamic or single armature drivers considering my price-range. Both of the Dual-Armature drivers within my price range have quirks about them that turn me off, whilst dynamic driver IEMs within the same price range seem to be moer impressive in terms of  build, SQ, and value.
> My choices thus far:
> 
> Dual Armature IEMs:
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rubyiris said:


> I listen MOSTLY to various works by Yuki Kajiura. Specifically, the stuff she's produced as Kalafina and Fictionjuction. Red Moon, Everlasting Songs, and Fictionjuction 2008-2010: The Best of Yuki Kajiura Live. Her works are extremely varied. Anywhere from minimalist classical to jazz to pop with classical and opera influences. Many tracks are extremely bass-heavy with relatively technical melodies. for her instrumental tracks. Vocal tracks are a relatively simplistic melody, often electric guitar or violin, heavy bass, and mostly choir-style vocals. anywhere between 3 to 5 vocalists at any one time. Single vocalist is fairly rare.
> 
> Next on the list is Prog/Power. Rhapsody of Fire, Seventh Wonder, Lost Horizon, Machinae Supremacy, Powerglove, Galneryus, and some avant-garde stuff like Arcturus and In The Woods. With the exception of Machinae Supremacy who is closer to generic mainstream style music, such as hard rock and punk, whilst staying primerily power metal, the bands I klst are all extremely technical with loads of things going on. Intricate guitar, symphonic, and basslines. I'm looking for something relatively analytical.
> 
> Finally, not counting things I listen to on a less frequent basis are various electronic genres, and rap. Mostly, I listen to Tonedeff, Deepsky, Hyper, SuperGreenX, The Flashbulb, Lumin, Onoken, and Zircon. All of these artists are relatively bass-heavy whilst still having intricate melodies.


 

 Your picks are all over the place but I would go dynamic.in that price range without hesitating. You can still get relatively analytical sound from dynamic-driver models such as the JVC HA-FXC80, Meelec CX21, or Hippo Shroom. Personally, I would get the Soundmagic E30 instead as it offers a good blend of resolution/detail, space, and bass impact, or a Xears XE200PRO (if you can swing the price), for the same reasons.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't know where it is but it was something like First letter - series; Second letter - housing material; 1st number (if present) - number of drivers; 2nd number - model line; 3rd number - model number. The rules did not apply to the older models so it was pretty confusing.


 
  it's back
  http://www.meelec.com/Articles.asp?ID=136#NAME


----------



## Foress

heard that the MDR EX-1000 was comparable to JH11s. i guess I am mistaken.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> P.S. Dr. Fang says the RE272 rival $1000 customs in the mids and highs.


 
   
  Well, I prefer RE272 to any multi driver IEM I've heard to date including the $850 Westone ES3X customs. It's all a matter of preference, remember. The $1000 custom will only sound great if you like the signature. If you don't, then you may prefer a headphone that costs far less.


----------



## Pianist

Quote:


tuahogary said:


> lol actually hate_ is_ a strong word! My bad!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Umm, ok. First of all, RE272 has very little in common with UM3X in sound. RE272 is way brighter, has less midrange and low end emphasis than the UM3X. Second of all, the detail of RE272 is at least in the ballpark with IEMs like FX700 and Westone 4. I compared the RE272 to the latter two and I really couldn't feel like RE272 lacks detail by comparison. Third of all, the soundstage on the RE272 is more open than that of even the FX700 and W4 to my ears and imaging is nice and solid. The soundstage is not as good as with my DT880, but for an IEM, it's about the best I've heard. Fourth of all, the dynamics on RE272 are not lacking in any way to my ears compared directly to FX700 and Westone 4 and only lack a tiny little bit perhaps vs. the DT880, but DT880 is a dynamic range monster. Lastly, RE272 doesn't sound dull - it sounds extremely clean and very well defined from top to bottom and with excellent presence in the upper highs. It's not ER4 defined, but better defined than my FX700 for example.
   
  Just my 2 cents of course, but I had to write this because I just totally disagree with everything you wrote there about the RE272. Perhaps you just didn't get a good fit with them? Or maybe they were broken or something.


----------



## Dreaming Of A Better ... (Jun 19, 2020)

....


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





dreaming of a better ... said:


> hello
> 
> quick question, is there a IEM with great mids and good bass ? i'd like to upgrade from the re-262's . budget £400.
> 
> thanks for reading


 
   
  Well, RE262 is a great IEM. What exactly don't you like about them? If you don't like the mids on RE262 then perhaps you want something with less color? Then Westone 4 or the RE272 will be good choices - they have more neutral mids than the RE262 with less thickness and warmth in exchange for better accuracy. If you want better bass quality though, you will be hard pressed to find it in any IEM within your budget because RE262 provides great bass quality in my opinion. If you just want a bigger, more powerful bass without losing on quality, then I recommend JVC FX700. Sony EX1000 or Westone 4 should also provide somewhat more hefty lows than the RE262, but not to the extent of the FX700. FX700 is a true basshead IEM with tons of bass, but what I love about them is that you can easily adjust the amount of low end with them using different tips. Put on large tips and they will rock your world. Put on smaller tips and you will get a significantly more neutral, but still beautifully punchy sound.


----------



## i2ehan

If he's looking to upgrade from the RE262's, and all the while wants great mids, I can almost guarantee he'd find the FX700's mids recessed. Alas, I haven't even a fraction of his experience; I'll let |joker| take this one, over anything I'd recommend...


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> If he's looking to upgrade from the RE262's, and all the while wants great mids, I can almost guarantee he'd find the FX700's mids recessed. Alas, I haven't even a fraction of his experience; I'll let |joker| take this one, over anything I'd recommend...


 
   
  I personally don't find the mids on FX700 recessed with a good fit. Sometimes they may seem a little bit behind all that bass and the sparkling treble, but they are all there when required IMO. And the mids quality on FX700 is out of this world. Outstanding timbre accuracy, detail, dynamics and clarity coupled with a wonderful subtle warmth from the wooden housing and driver. Musicality at its best IMO. I couldn't ask for more from an IEM really.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Quote:
> 
> Umm, ok. First of all, RE272 has very little in common with UM3X in sound. RE272 is way brighter, has less midrange and low end emphasis than the UM3X. Second of all, the detail of RE272 is at least in the ballpark with IEMs like FX700 and Westone 4. I compared the RE272 to the latter two and I really couldn't feel like RE272 lacks detail by comparison. Third of all, the soundstage on the RE272 is more open than that of even the FX700 and W4 to my ears and imaging is nice and solid. The soundstage is not as good as with my DT880, but for an IEM, it's about the best I've heard. Fourth of all, the dynamics on RE272 are not lacking in any way to my ears compared directly to FX700 and Westone 4 and only lack a tiny little bit perhaps vs. the DT880, but DT880 is a dynamic range monster. Lastly, RE272 doesn't sound dull - it sounds extremely clean and very well defined from top to bottom and with excellent presence in the upper highs. It's not ER4 defined, but better defined than my FX700 for example.
> 
> Just my 2 cents of course, but I had to write this because I just totally disagree with everything you wrote there about the RE272. Perhaps you just didn't get a good fit with them? Or maybe they were broken or something.


 

 I think he wasnt referring to the sound of the UM3x and RE262 but rather he was likening the 'hype' around the RE262 to that of the UM3x.


----------



## TopspinTEC

You labeled the latest Xears "3A60" in the contents and "3A61" in the actual review


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> I think he wasnt referring to the sound of the UM3x and RE262 but rather he was likening the 'hype' around the RE262 to that of the UM3x.


 
   
  Well, in that case my bad.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote: 





pianist said:


> I personally don't find the mids on FX700 recessed with a good fit. Sometimes they may seem a little bit behind all that bass and the sparkling treble, but they are all there when required IMO. And the mids quality on FX700 is out of this world. Outstanding timbre accuracy, detail, dynamics and clarity coupled with a wonderful subtle warmth from the wooden housing and driver. Musicality at its best IMO. *I couldn't ask for more from an IEM really.*


 
   
  I'd have felt the same, if it hadn't been for the EX1000/GR07. Even after a plethora of tips, the FX700's mids were still borderline recessed to neutral at best (if I'm to be overly generous) for my ears. When it came to any vocal track, my preference fell on the former two each and every time. Nonetheless, as it stands, the FX700 is most certainly amongst my top 5 universals.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> And the mids quality on FX700 is out of this world.


 
   
  Allow me to disagree once again for the sake of balance here.  I would never recommend the FX700 to anyone who considers themselves a mids lover.  Especially a vocals lover.  I'll leave it at that.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I'd have felt the same, if it hadn't been for the EX1000/GR07. Even after a plethora of tips, the FX700's mids were still borderline recessed to neutral at best (if I'm to be overly generous) for my ears. When it came to any vocal track, my preference fell on the former two each and every time. Nonetheless, as it stands, the FX700 is most certainly amongst my top 5 universals.


 
   
  Well, don't fix it if it ain't broke. I am happy with what I currently have and I really don't feel like trying anything else anymore. FX700 is fantastic. If I want more clarity and presence in the mids, I grab the RE272. And if I just want a great all around listening experience, I put on DT880. Seems like the journey's over for me. At least for now...


----------



## shotgunshane

Famous last words.  At least you put a qualifier on it!
  
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> Seems like the journey's over for me. At least for now...


----------



## i2ehan

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Allow me to disagree once again for the sake of balance here.  I would never recommend the FX700 to anyone who considers themselves a mids lover.  Especially a vocals lover.  I'll leave it at that.


 
   
  Ditto.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Allow me to disagree once again for the sake of balance here.  I would never recommend the FX700 to anyone who considers themselves a mids lover.  Especially a vocals lover.  I'll leave it at that.


 
   
  I am still puzzled why you find the FX700 mids unnatural. To my ears, they sound very real. Oh well...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





topspintec said:


> You labeled the latest Xears "3A60" in the contents and "3A61" in the actual review


 


  fixed, thanks


----------



## Pianist

How does the bass of the Miracle compare to that of the RE272?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pianist said:


> How does the bass of the Miracle compare to that of the RE272?


 


  The Miracle has more subbass and more overall impact and presence. There is more rumble and definition down low with the Miracle and the low end is crisper and punchier while the RE272 is softer and more delicate.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Miracle has more subbass and more overall impact and presence. There is more rumble and definition down low with the Miracle and the low end is crisper and punchier while the RE272 is softer and more delicate.


 
   
  So it seems to me that the Miracle and RE272 each offer different strengths in the bass and neither is really better than the other. I mean if someone listens primarily to instrumental music with little sub bass and likes delicate lows, then the person may prefer RE272 sound, right?
   
  I understand that the Miracle is supposed to offer an unparalleled level of technical ability having six BA drivers per side, but does it really sound natural? Does it really sound totally coherent? I find it hard to believe that considering that even dual drivers sometimes struggle to deliver a coherent sound and triple drivers are sometimes a real nightmare in this regard, a 6 driver IEM somehow manages to sound perfectly composed without a single trace this problem. Does it have the timbre of RE272 or FX700? Can it do strings as well or better than RE272 and FX700? Does saxophone sound more realistic than with RE272? I find RE272 extremely realistic in how it renders the instrument with maximum clarity, a very full bodies sound to my ears and really, really good detail. Does the Miracle beat that to your ears?
   
  I am sorry if this may sound like an attack on the Miracle. I haven't heard it, so I cannot criticize the sound. I am just speculating based on my current experience with many multi drivers, which has been quite negative overall to say the least.
   
  I also find it highly suspicious that right after the JH13 released their triumphant JH13 6 driver BA customs which were supposed to be the pinnacle of current BA technology and must take quite an effort to build all these other companies many of which are hardly known like the Unique Melody or the Rooth or whatever it's called suddenly started rolling out 6 driver and 8 driver monsters like hotcakes and claiming that all of them offer that same unparalleled sound quality with no compromise and all that. Are all of these 6-8 driver BAs really that great? Well, I think it is a real miracle if they are.


----------



## average_joe

In my experience, multi-driver BA customs, when done right can sound perfectly coherent and technically superior to dynamic driver IEMs.
   
  If you find it hard to believe try them yourself, you may be surprised!


----------



## Pianist

Well, I guess Westone couldn't do it right with their ES3X then because they didn't sound perfectly coherent to me. I know it's just one custom though and I need to try more to really get a good idea of customs sound. But do customs really sound all that different from universals?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Well, I guess Westone couldn't do it right with their ES3X then because they didn't sound perfectly coherent to me. I know it's just one custom though and I need to try more to really get a good idea of customs sound. But do customs really sound all that different from universals?


 

 The only triple driver I've liked in my life was the UERM.  Oddly the ES5 beats it in coherence for me, go figure.  Against both of those, the W4, 530, SM3, DDM pale by comparison for coherence and naturalness IMO.
   
  Now it might be very personal since recently I've heard people say they use their mental powers to change the SS and imaging of their phones so caveat everything I said.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> The only triple driver I've liked in my life was the UERM.  Oddly the ES5 beats it in coherence for me, go figure.  Against both of those, the W4, 530, SM3, DDM pale by comparison for coherence and naturalness IMO.
> 
> Now it might be very personal since recently I've heard* people say they use their mental powers to change the SS and imaging of their phones* so caveat everything I said.


 
   
  Say what??


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Now it might be very personal since recently I've heard people say they use their _*mental powers*_ to change the SS and imaging of their phones so caveat everything I said.


 





   
  I need to learn from those masters about how quickly I can adapt to SM3 coming from a clutch of other IEMs. Oh well!


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> The only triple driver I've liked in my life was the UERM.  Oddly the ES5 beats it in coherence for me, go figure.  Against both of those, the W4, 530, SM3, DDM pale by comparison for coherence and naturalness IMO.
> 
> Now it might be very personal since recently I've heard people say they use their mental powers to change the SS and imaging of their phones so caveat everything I said.


 

 I feel the same way about the 1964-T but don't have the UERM....yet..well maybe one day when I save up some more. The UM custom I have beats it however so haven't used the 1964-T in a while except to compare things.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





pianist said:


> Well, I guess Westone couldn't do it right with their ES3X then because they didn't sound perfectly coherent to me. I know it's just one custom though and I need to try more to really get a good idea of customs sound. But do customs really sound all that different from universals?


 

  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> The only triple driver I've liked in my life was the UERM.  Oddly the ES5 beats it in coherence for me, go figure.  Against both of those, the W4, 530, SM3, DDM pale by comparison for coherence and naturalness IMO.
> 
> Now it might be very personal since recently I've heard people say they use their mental powers to change the SS and imaging of their phones so caveat everything I said.


 

 Are these two posts somehow related?
   
  I haven't heard the ES3X and not all my customs can do what the top few can, but yes, some have amazing coherence along with everything else.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

My ES3X are perfectly coherent.


----------



## kiteki

http://www.stereophile.com/content/sounds-audio-glossary-glossary-b-c
   
_coherent_ 1) Pertaining to a multi-way loudspeaker's sound: seamless from top to bottom; showing no audible evidence of a crossover or of different driver colorations in different frequency ranges. 2) Pertaining to the soundstage: Phantom imaging that reproduces within the stereo stage the original lateral positions of the performers. See "bunching," "hole-in-the-middle."
   
  just ftr this is pretty low on my list, like.. I read one user say the JH13's were "a waste of money and, clearly the sound was coming from 3 seperate directions" I mean what does that even mean...


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> http://www.stereophile.com/content/sounds-audio-glossary-glossary-b-c
> 
> _coherent_ 1) Pertaining to a multi-way loudspeaker's sound: seamless from top to bottom; showing no audible evidence of a crossover or of different driver colorations in different frequency ranges. 2) Pertaining to the soundstage: Phantom imaging that reproduces within the stereo stage the original lateral positions of the performers. See "bunching," "hole-in-the-middle."
> 
> just ftr this is pretty low on my list, like.. I read one user say the JH13's were "a waste of money and, clearly the sound was coming from 3 seperate directions" I mean what does that even mean...


 

 Thanks for the definition, kiteki. TBH i thought i somewhat understood what coherent meant but now i'm totally confused. What exactly is coherence? isnt being able to tell that the sound is coming from separate, different directions a good thing?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> [...] isnt being able to tell that the sound is coming from separate, different directions a good thing?


 

 Precisely.


----------



## kiteki

Two comments.
   
  1. I was "joking" about the RE272 keeping up with $1000 high-end custom IEM's, someone said so on a Chinese forum, so I joked it was true, but like joker said, it's a vague statement and may as well be true.
   
  2. I've listened to the RE272 now, if I say anything this thread will get spin off into more terminology discussion so my impressions are over here and you can spin off that thread instead but please no more talk about burn-in or seagulls.
   
  Edit: Sorry about my UE700 raving btw, I still rank it higher than the CK10 in the mids though, but it's much weaker in the bass and in imaging, in the highs I'm unsure.


----------



## kkl10

So it seems that the RE272 isn't quite an improved RE252 isn't it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I was hoping for the RE272 to retain the same flat and balanced FR as the 252... oh well...
   
  Guys, give me some input here please:
   
  How's the tonal balance of the RE272 compared to the RE0/ZERO?
  Is it's FR as flat as the RE0?
  Does the RE272 have a peaked FR from the upper mids to the treble?
  Does the RE272 treble extend as high as that of the RE0?
  Is the bass quantity comparable to the RE0/ZERO or does the RE272 have less?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





kkl10 said:


> *1.* So it seems that the RE272 isn't quite an improved RE252 isn't it?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 1. Take the RE252, improve soundspace, imaging, overtones, add some air, mess around with the FR, improve note definition ~

 2. -
  3. -
  4. No, it's not that simple.
  5. RE272 is the "open sky" version of RE0. // I haven't done tone testing at 17kHz if that's what you mean, Hifiman say 15Hz - 22kHz if you'd like to go by that.
  6. RE272 has more bass than RE0.
   
  7. It doesn't retain the balance of RE252, if that's really what you're after ... it seems like you want a flat FR and balanced IEM, well... the RE272 isn't quite a studio monitor, I think it's some kind of monitor... but not a studio one  I think you should research the Etymotic ER-4B, Ultimate Ears UE700 and Vsonic GR07.


----------



## tuahogary

Quote:


pianist said:


> Quote:
> 
> Umm, ok. First of all, RE272 has very little in common with UM3X in sound. RE272 is way brighter, has less midrange and low end emphasis than the UM3X. Second of all, the detail of RE272 is at least in the ballpark with IEMs like FX700 and Westone 4. I compared the RE272 to the latter two and I really couldn't feel like RE272 lacks detail by comparison. Third of all, the soundstage on the RE272 is more open than that of even the FX700 and W4 to my ears and imaging is nice and solid. The soundstage is not as good as with my DT880, but for an IEM, it's about the best I've heard. Fourth of all, the dynamics on RE272 are not lacking in any way to my ears compared directly to FX700 and Westone 4 and only lack a tiny little bit perhaps vs. the DT880, but DT880 is a dynamic range monster. Lastly, RE272 doesn't sound dull - it sounds extremely clean and very well defined from top to bottom and with excellent presence in the upper highs. It's not ER4 defined, but better defined than my FX700 for example.
> 
> Just my 2 cents of course, but I had to write this because I just totally disagree with everything you wrote there about the RE272. Perhaps you just didn't get a good fit with them? Or maybe they were broken or something.


 

 Erm. Ok. First of all I think you misunderstood when I said it reminded me of the UM3x in the sense that I meant the UM3x is also overrated in my opinion. Nothing to do with sound signature. I guess I could've have phrased my statement more clearly but my mistake. Second of all, I felt the RE272 lacked detail in bass and top treble region simply because it couldn't produce enough energy in those areas but again just my opinion. I think if I have to listen hard and concentrate to hear the details, then the IEM is not doing a good enough job (personal opinion). Third of all, the soundstage is respectable for an IEM but nowhere as close to an eye opener like the EX1000 or 1601SB, so I tend to disagree when a reviewer gets all too enthusiastic about it. It's not airy in a natural way. I can hear some distance but the only word I can think to describe is that it's unnatural. Fourth of all, to my ears their dynamics are lacking which in turn sounds dull but just my opinion.
   
  Yes I have come to terms that I might have received a faulty unit. The only reasonable explanation I think. But I'd rather not discuss more about the RE272. I never feel good about criticising any IEM openly in a public forum, not especially when Head Direct had been so kind to send me a pair. I knew a comment like mine will draw some stick which is why I tend to keep quiet in this enthusiastic forum. Ta.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> 7. It doesn't retain the balance of RE252, if that's really what you're after ... it seems like you want a flat FR and balanced IEM, well... the RE272 isn't quite a studio monitor, I think it's some kind of monitor... but not a studio one  I think you should research the Etymotic ER-4B, Ultimate Ears UE700 and Vsonic GR07.


 
   
  I think RE0 is also very neutral. I think it's more neutral than RE272 and RE252, but the latter two may sound more natural to many listeners due to better technicalities and more natural frequency responses. RE0 has a pretty flat FR, but flat does not necessarily equal natural as we all know.
   
  I think RE0 is also more neutral than UE700 and ER4.


----------



## kiteki

Firstly, he already has the RE0.
   
  Secondly, I just answered his questions and I'm just trying to help out.
   
  Neutral wasn't even a requirement but w/e...
   
_"neutral_ Free from coloration."
_"balance_ 1) The subjective relationship between the relative loudness of the upper and lower halves of the audio spectrum; "tonal balance." 2) The relative loudness of the instruments in a performing group."
   
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> I think RE0 is also very neutral. I think it's more neutral than RE272 and RE252, [...]


 
  Quote: 





pianist said:


> (older post)
> I personally prefer RE0 over RE252 because RE0 has a warmer, more pleasant tone, while RE252 sounds too clinical too me.


 
   
  The RE0 is not neutral, because it has warmth, the RE0 is not balanced, because it doesn't have enough bass.
   
  If it really was a perfect IEM, and better than everything you've ever owned or heard, I don't think Hifiman wouldn't have received hundreds of returned RE0's and then made the RE-Zero to allieviate that.


----------



## Eagle Hawk

hey guys ... i currently own a sound magic pl30 and they sound really great ( atleast for me ).. the only problem i have with the pl30s are that their bass is very low  .... pl11 is known for good bass... so can anyone tell me how are the pl11 ( am planning 2 get one in a day or two )
 high,mids,trebel,bass ? and build quality 
 thank you


----------



## masimot

hello everyone
  thanks god i found this forum its kick ass! btw
   
  so, can anyone plshelp me decide which is best between these two iem
   
  im liking the MEE m6 for all the reviews in the net so but i want to know how it will compare with the new beta brainwavz version2
   
  that's all.,.thanks guys!


----------



## shotgunshane

eagle hawk said:


> hey guys ... i currently own a sound magic pl30 and they sound really great ( atleast for me ).. the only problem i have with the pl30s are that their bass is very low  .... pl11 is known for good bass... so can anyone tell me how are the pl11 ( am planning 2 get one in a day or two )
> high,mids,trebel,bass ? and build quality
> thank you




The PL line has been updated in the new E line. Sounds like the E10 is what you should consider. Joker gives them a very favorable rating in this thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eagle hawk said:


> hey guys ... i currently own a sound magic pl30 and they sound really great ( atleast for me ).. the only problem i have with the pl30s are that their bass is very low  .... pl11 is known for good bass... so can anyone tell me how are the pl11 ( am planning 2 get one in a day or two )
> high,mids,trebel,bass ? and build quality
> thank you


 

 I haven't heard the PL11 but I agree that if you can afford it, I'd go for the newer E10 or E30. The E30 really is a fantastic upgrade to the PL30 with the soundstage, airy feel, and good ergonomics that the PL30 was popular for plus noticeably more bass and an overall more refined sound. The E10 is pretty similar but uses a more conventional form factor and has a more bass-heavy sound signature. 

  
  Quote: 





masimot said:


> hello everyone
> thanks god i found this forum its kick ass! btw
> 
> so, can anyone plshelp me decide which is best between these two iem
> ...


 

  Not sure anyone has heard the new Brainwavz yet. The form factors are totally different - brainwavz seems to be a half-in-ear design with a large driver which is a contrast to the sports-oriented M6. If you want it to stay put I'd go for the M6. Otherwise I'd check out the M21 or other options or wait for the Brainwavz reviews to roll in (assuming they sent some samples out).
   


  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> The PL line has been updated in the new E line. Sounds like the E10 is what you should consider. Joker gives them a very favorable rating in this thread.


 

 I honestly can't recommend the E10 enough. It's so much more fun and enjoyable than the technical performance (and subsequent score) indicates - solid bass + large and airy soundstage is just a superb combination in a budget in-ear.


----------



## musedesign

Joker, Thank you for being such a great resource!  
   
  I just bought a pair of UM3X, and I am thinking about returning them.  For me the bass seems to be over boosted, they are great with Jazz and Classical, but with rock, they become unlistenable. For me there is too much bass and it seems to get in the way of the music.  I have tried all of the ear tips, some are better than others, but still too much bass for me.
   
  Interested in suggestions, return them?  What other IEM should I try in the $300 range?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





musedesign said:


> Joker, Thank you for being such a great resource!
> 
> I just bought a pair of UM3X, and I am thinking about returning them.  For me the bass seems to be over boosted, they are great with Jazz and Classical, but with rock, they become unlistenable. For me there is too much bass and it seems to get in the way of the music.  I have tried all of the ear tips, some are better than others, but still too much bass for me.
> 
> ...


 

 How about giving them a week first to make sure you really know what the phone is capable of.  I see you are using a D4.  That probably has >10ohms output z like most iBassos which could be making your bass boomy and do other wierd things.  Or it could just be too boomy for you.  Just listen more to make sure.  People give up on IEMs too fast quite often before they get a chance.


----------



## musedesign

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> How about giving them a week first to make sure you really know what the phone is capable of.  I see you are using a D4.  That probably has >10ohms output z like most iBassos which could be making your bass boomy and do other wierd things.  Or it could just be too boomy for you.  Just listen more to make sure.  People give up on IEMs too fast quite often before they get a chance.


 

 Thanks Anaxilus,
    I had a pair of RE262, which I loved, liked their sound signature more than the UM3X (but one earbud went dead).  The UM3X has a larger sound stage and larger dynamic range than the RE262, it's just the boom, boom.  Tried direct out of my Powerbook and it seems worse for me.  Will give it a little more time.  
   
  Any other suggestions for an IEM, large soundstage, great midrange, less than $300?  I tend to like the Sennieser sound signature.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





musedesign said:


> Any other suggestions for an IEM, large soundstage, great midrange, less than $300?  I tend to like the Sennieser sound signature.


 

 Personally, I'd look at the RE272, Sony EX600 (if you can deal with form factor), and maybe one of the moving armature ones - Ortofon e-Q5 or one of the FAD sets (which I haven't tried/reviewed). The GR07 may belong on that list as well but it really doesn't shine in the mids. These are all on the neutral-to-bright side but have accurate bass, detailed mids, and good soundstage size. For a warmer earphone with those qualities that's more laid-back at the top the RE262 is still the top choice out of what I've heard. Side note: unfortunately the Sennheiser IE7 really won't do it for you if you're used to the tone and overall refinement of the RE262 and the IE8 will have too much bass.


----------



## Anaxilus

You could get an EX1000 for just a smidge over $300 too.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Personally, I'd look at the *RE272*, *Sony EX600 *(if you can deal with form factor), and maybe one of the moving armature ones - Ortofon e-Q5 or one of the FAD sets (which I haven't tried/reviewed). The *GR07 *may belong on that list as well but it really doesn't shine in the mids. These are all on the neutral-to-bright side but have accurate bass, detailed mids, and good soundstage size. For a warmer earphone with those qualities that's more laid-back at the top the *RE262 *is still the top choice out of what I've heard. Side note: unfortunately the Sennheiser IE7 really won't do it for you if you're used to the tone and overall refinement of the RE262 and the IE8 will have too much bass.


 
   
  As fortunate as I am to owned all the above shown in bold, they too would be my exact recommendations, and as out friend Anaxilus mentioned, I too second the EX1000, especially if the EX600 is to be considered. I'd also personally recommend the RE252, which while on the neutral side, isn't devoid of a great midrange IMHO.


----------



## Cortlendt

I've recently bought Sunrise SW-Xcape IE from gd-audiobase.com but received only empty packaging and accessories of the headphones. Since postal cardboard box was undamaged and it took me effort to open it, I've contacted gd-audiobase for the clarification. They indeed responded to me and sent me the headphones again (it took a second email from and one business week for them to respond).
   
  I must give them the credit for sending me the headphones but if you intend to buy from gd-audiobase it may be a good idea to check package contents before accepting.
   
  BTW in spring I got FA DBA-02 from them no problem.


----------



## kanuka

got the m11+
  is it just me or they need much higher volume than the pl50. just like the RE0 ?
   
  btw. in the cable (chin) slider, says m11-bk . no m11+ ?


----------



## musedesign

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Personally, I'd look at the RE272, Sony EX600 (if you can deal with form factor), and maybe one of the moving armature ones - Ortofon e-Q5 or one of the FAD sets (which I haven't tried/reviewed). The GR07 may belong on that list as well but it really doesn't shine in the mids. These are all on the neutral-to-bright side but have accurate bass, detailed mids, and good soundstage size. For a warmer earphone with those qualities that's more laid-back at the top the RE262 is still the top choice out of what I've heard. Side note: unfortunately the Sennheiser IE7 really won't do it for you if you're used to the tone and overall refinement of the RE262 and the IE8 will have too much bass.


 

 Joker, Thank you!
   
  Can you tell me about the difference in SQ between the RE272 and RE262 ?  I enjoyed the RE262, but the multiple cables were a bit janky for me.  Does the RE272, have the same "laid back" spacious qualities as the RE262?  or is the RE262 the top dog?  Thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cortlendt said:


> I must give them the credit for sending me the headphones but if you intend to buy from gd-audiobase it may be a good idea to check package contents before accepting.


 
   
  Not always possible unless you get all international packages hand-delivered. Good tip otherwise.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> got the m11+
> is it just me or they need much higher volume than the pl50. just like the RE0 ?
> 
> btw. in the cable (chin) slider, says m11-bk . no m11+ ?


 

 MEElec earphones generally don't have very high sensitivity. Shouldn't be a problem unless you plan on damaging your hearing. I don't think they changed the M11 one bit cosmetically when the M11+ rolled out so it makes sense that the slider still reads 'M11'.
   


  Quote: 





musedesign said:


> Quote:
> 
> Joker, Thank you!
> 
> Can you tell me about the difference in SQ between the RE272 and RE262 ?  I enjoyed the RE262, but the multiple cables were a bit janky for me.  Does the RE272, have the same "laid back" spacious qualities as the RE262?  or is the RE262 the top dog?  Thank you!


 

 I haven't had the 272 very long but it definitely preserves the space of the RE262. It is brighter, however, which prevents it from sounding as laid-back as the 262 from a signature standpoint. It still has that refined, softened note presentation of the RE272 that avoids the analytical edge. Cable is modular but not really an issue for me. The RE262 I had was fixed-cord with a TRS plug but the channel swap cable on the 272 makes the entire system worth it for me.


----------



## musedesign

Quote:


> I haven't had the 272 very long but it definitely preserves the space of the RE262. It is brighter, however, which prevents it from sounding as laid-back as the 262 from a signature standpoint. It still has that refined, softened note presentation of the RE272 that avoids the analytical edge. Cable is modular but not really an issue for me. The RE262 I had was fixed-cord with a TRS plug but the channel swap cable on the 272 makes the entire system worth it for me.


 

 Joker,
    Thank you!  I think I will stick with the RE262, I love how laid-back they sound.  I couldn't decide between getting the RE262 and the EX600, so I ordered both!


----------



## i2ehan

Quote: 





musedesign said:


> Joker,
> Thank you!  I think I will stick with the RE262, I love how laid-back they sound.  *I couldn't decide between getting the RE262 and the EX600, so I ordered both!  *


 






 when in doubt...


----------



## i2ehan

Hey |joker|, I got my CK100's today my dear friend, and re-read your full review, to which I couldn't personally find any room for disagreement. They certainly make a clear-cut distinction between mid-centric and mid-forward. As you mentioned, any and all personal gripes I had with the CK10's treble is nonexistent with the Ck100's. I must admit however, my sole intention in purchasing the CK100 was with one thing in mind; the added Zo effect. I'm no longer hearing the CK100's however; thanks to the Zo, I'd dub them the CK101, and the added 1 is no small feat. They're beginning to sound much more on the warm and sweet side, with the impeccable midrange taking priority above all else. Initially, I was worried that coupled with my FiiO E7 + Zo combination, I wouldn't do them justice. Even still, I can't say that I have, to be quite honest, but owing to the fact that I'm not hearing much different from what you've described, I'm content. Now, once I've allowed myself a few days time to become accustomed to their sound, I'll see where the CK100 stands in comparison to the K2 SP and EX1000. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  P.S. As was the case with my SM3's, low volume listening has never been easier.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> The RE0 is not neutral, because it has warmth, the RE0 is not balanced, because it doesn't have enough bass.
> 
> If it really was a perfect IEM, and better than everything you've ever owned or heard, I don't think Hifiman wouldn't have received hundreds of returned RE0's and then made the RE-Zero to allieviate that.


 
   
  RE0 is generally neutral with a hint of warmth. The bass quantity on RE0 is similar to that on RE252/262/272 to my ears. I think the mids on RE0 are better placed between the highs and bass than on the RE252 and RE262. I find RE0 better balanced between bass and mids than the RE272, with the latter being a little too forward in the mids compared to the rather low amount of bass that it has.
   
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> If it really was a perfect IEM, and better than everything *you've ever owned or heard*, I don't think Hifiman wouldn't have received hundreds of returned RE0's and then made the RE-Zero to allieviate that.


 
   
  But I didn't return hundreds of RE0s and the RE-ZERO wasn't made for me.


----------



## Dissonant

Hi Joker, thanks for the fabulous reviews. You may remember my query from your full-sized thread.
   
  I was looking at full-sized cans, but couldn't find one that impressed me in the price range I was aiming for (150SGD - 275 SGD), from 120 USD to ~230 USD). However, I found the signature I was looking for - that of a HD800 with a very slightly warm amp - neutral, smooth mids, but detailed, and a slightly elevated treble (not too much, I found the treble of the SRH440s to be dry and the M50s to be metallic, but that is like comparing apples to oranges), with tight, textured bass that extends low, but not too much in quantity. The 2010 M50s were sufficient to give me a headache as it was.
   
  My shortlist was:
  Ultimate Ears UE700 (as I gather, it is an early Knowles TWFK that was a direct competitor of the Q-Jays - price has dropped over here for it)
  Ety HF5 (seems like an ER4P/S for portable use, less microphonics, and the same driver matched less stringently)
  MDR-EX600 (slightly out of my price range, as I was planning to leave a balance to buy a decent source like the Clip+)
  ATH-CKM99 (not sure if I can find it here)
   
  Brainwavz B2/DBA-02
  VSONIC GR07 (both the B2 and GR07 can be found relatively easily over here, as LendMeUrEars.com is based here in Singapore) - cheaper than all the above IEMs, save for the UE700 too)
   
  Would you care to enlighten me, which has the the best separation and overall soundstage width and depth of those? I am kind of a soundstage junkie here. They all seem to share a similar signature due to the inherent properties of BAs, so I am less worried about that, save for the EX600s, GR07 and CKM99.
   
  EDIT: Silly me. I forgot to list the genres I listen to. Currently, mostly Jazz and Classical, with the occasional guilty pleasure of J-Pop.


----------



## musedesign

Quote:


musedesign said:


> Joker, Thank you for being such a great resource!
> 
> I just bought a pair of UM3X, and I am thinking about returning them.  For me the bass seems to be over boosted, they are great with Jazz and Classical, but with rock, they become unlistenable. For me there is too much bass and it seems to get in the way of the music.  I have tried all of the ear tips, some are better than others, but still too much bass for me.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Well... After already ordering the RE262 and the EX600, I wasn't ready to give up on the UM3X, so tried Audio Hijack, a Mac recording / equailizer http://www.rogueamoeba.com/audiohijack/, playing Macbook Pro >Pandora>Audiohighjack>iBasso D4>UM3X = Happy listener !
   
  Anyone else have experience with Audiohighjack?  Seems very cool


----------



## i2ehan

Alright, so I just got done A/B-ing the RE252 and CK100, and I'm quite shaken by the results. The two share an _extremely _uncanny resemblance. It *almost* feels as though I'm listening to one and the same earphones, I kid you not. I know it may be hard to appreciate, but if and when A/B'ed side by side, the two sound so similar, it's hard to tell one apart form the other. I did have to boost the volume on my FiiO E7 from 12 to 15, when going from the CK100 to the RE252, respectively. From the highs down to the lows, they are very similar sounding; as though one was tuned with the other in mind. Now I realize why the CK100's grew on me rather quickly, because as of late, I've wanted nothing more than to listen to the 252's on end! The ONLY appreciable difference between the two was the midrange, which was just a tad more intimate/fuller sounding on the CK100's, as compared to the 252's, and even then it's was a _very subtle _difference. Comparisons between the two were made using my FLAC vocal trance tracks, at which they both sounded exceptional. Nevertheless, this has confirmed my appreciation for the RE252, and to anyone given the opportunity, I urge you to A/B the two, and hear the resemblance. Off of memory, one may not believe it to be true; but if I'm to stay true to my ears, the CK100 and RE252 share a very, very similar sound.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> MEElec earphones generally don't have very high sensitivity. *Shouldn't be a problem unless you plan on damaging your hearing*. I don't think they changed the M11 one bit cosmetically when the M11+ rolled out so it makes sense that the slider still reads 'M11'.


 

 what u mean?


----------



## ljokerl

i2ehan said:


> Hey |joker|, I got my CK100's today my dear friend, and re-read your full review, to which I couldn't personally find any room for disagreement. They certainly make a clear-cut distinction between mid-centric and mid-forward. As you mentioned, any and all personal gripes I had with the CK10's treble is nonexistent with the Ck100's. I must admit however, my sole intention in purchasing the CK100 was with one thing in mind; the added Zo effect. I'm no longer hearing the CK100's however; thanks to the Zo, I'd dub them the CK101, and the added 1 is no small feat. They're beginning to sound much more on the warm and sweet side, with the impeccable midrange taking priority above all else. Initially, I was worried that coupled with my FiiO E7 + Zo combination, I wouldn't do them justice. Even still, I can't say that I have, to be quite honest, but owing to the fact that I'm not hearing much different from what you've described, I'm content. Now, once I've allowed myself a few days time to become accustomed to their sound, I'll see where the CK100 stands in comparison to the K2 SP and EX1000.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The CK100 is really the one triple-driver IEM I would love to own. We got along well and it makes a great CK10 compliment. It could certainly use some sub-bass boost as it rolls off noticeably compared to the CK10 so your magic bass box should be putting it a step ahead of how I heard it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   


  Quote: 





dissonant said:


> Hi Joker, thanks for the fabulous reviews. You may remember my query from your full-sized thread.
> 
> I was looking at full-sized cans, but couldn't find one that impressed me in the price range I was aiming for (150SGD - 275 SGD), from 120 USD to ~230 USD). However, I found the signature I was looking for - that of a HD800 with a very slightly warm amp - neutral, smooth mids, but detailed, and a slightly elevated treble (not too much, I found the treble of the SRH440s to be dry and the M50s to be metallic, but that is like comparing apples to oranges), with tight, textured bass that extends low, but not too much in quantity. The 2010 M50s were sufficient to give me a headache as it was.
> 
> ...


 

 Personally I would skip the HF5 and the CKM99. The CKM99 is likely too v-shaped for you and the HF5 doesn't quite perform as well as the others on the soundstage front if we look at width, depth, and imaging altogether. If you want open and airy, the EX600 will do it but at the cost of isolation. The GR07 would be my second choice for what you want and the DBA-02 - third. Bit of a tradeoff there between soundstage size and separation there as the DBA-02 will perform a bit better on that front than both dynamics, but not by much. If the GR07 is reasonably-priced and soundstage takes priority, I'd go for that. 
   


  Quote: 





musedesign said:


> Quote:
> 
> Macbook Pro >Pandora>Audiohighjack>iBasso D4>UM3X = Happy listener !


 

 I guess that makes it a pending 3-way comparison 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   



  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> what u mean?


 

 Meaning I don't see why the sensitivity of the M11+ should be a problem unless you're not getting enough volume with your source maxed out.


----------



## kanuka

as expected and as you reviewed, the m11+ are really heavy-bass. (and i thought the pk1 had a big impact...)
  no complain on that. fit is great and isolation is a bit of upgrade from the pl50
  but what i dont like it's the sooo far/laid-back vocals, even in higher volumes. really, there're some tracks without the singers
  any suggestions?
  i can consider an exchange for another model. or even a refund as a last resort
  i use it on a clip+
  thanks


----------



## lina

hello
  has anyone tried the AKG K312/314 earbuds? i've been using them for a long time and liked them a LOT and now i want an IEM similar to those. budget $50 or lower ($40 or even $30, is better)
  thanks in advance


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> as expected and as you reviewed, the m11+ are really heavy-bass. (and i thought the pk1 had a big impact...)
> no complain on that. fit is great and isolation is a bit of upgrade from the pl50
> but what i dont like it's the sooo far/laid-back vocals, even in higher volumes. really, *there're some tracks without the singers*
> any suggestions?


 
   
  The midrange should not be sucked out enough to lose musical elements entirely. The M11+ isn't even that recessed (though next to the PL50 it might seem that way). It's just very bass-heavy but again that shouldn't be enough to lose vocals.


----------



## SpaceCake

Anyone knows what the (if there is any)difference is between the Ultimate Ears 400 and Ultimate Ears 500? The UE 500 is not on the European site while the UE 400 is not on the North America site, are the IEM just the same headset only with a different name? Because they also look exactly the same.
Also thanks for this incredible thread, the last couple years I have been spoiled by the 595 so I'm searching now for a higher end iem. I'm now doubting between the DTX 71(€66), UE 400vi(€64) and DTX 101(€82) any advice? Another question is it so the higher end IEM use better cables, because I bicycle with the IEM I keep breaking them within a year at the plug(eg no sound in of the ears) even though I am careful with it I already broke several Sennheiser CX's


----------



## ljokerl

Thought I would repost my impressions of the demo UM Miracle and Merlin from the audition thread here.
   
   
  One of the limitations of custom monitors in consumer applications has always been the fact that there really is no good way to ‘try before you buy’ – a fact especially concerning considering the relative difficulty and expense of going the custom route. In an attempt to convince potential customers that higher-end customs really are worth the asking price, manufacturers started building ‘demo’ versions of custom monitors – customs molded to fit most ears complete with nozzles that work with conventional eartips. I’ve recently had a go at two such demos – one of the Unique Melody Miracle and the other of the newly-released Merlin. Both units were supplied by UM Australia as part of the Head-Fi loaner program. Big thanks to them for the opportunity to sample these units and to Anaxilus for handling everything stateside.
   
 General Notes 
  The Miracle uses 6 balances armatures and two passive crossovers. The Merlin is a hybrid IEM, using 4 BA transducers and a single dynamic driver. Both use a dual-bore design and the Merlin is also vented. It’s difficult to say how the vent impacts the isolation, however - the noise blocking abilities of the two demo units are very similar and both yield to the full custom Miracle. The long-term comfort of the demo units is also not very good for me despite the shells having been molded as compactly as possible.

 For the purposes of this testing, I used my standard listening setup – Cowon J3 with and without a 5x mini3 and an iBasso D10. Tracks used for critical listening were selected from my lossless library, mostly in wma format.
   
 Sound Quality 
 Demo Miracle vs Custom Miracle   

UM Miracle demo
   

UM Miracle demo

  As some may know, I own a fully custom UM Miracle – a (spectacular) gift from the Head-Fi community that has been my sound quality benchmark for the past six months. My full review of the custom Miracle can be found towards the bottom of the first page of this thread. Looking at the custom Miracle and demo Miracle side by side, it is pretty clear that there should be sonic differences between them – the size and shape of the shells varies significantly between the two. All of the Miracle’s armatures are of the self-contained, non-vented variety but there is still a disparity in driver placement and sound tube lengths between two units, not to mention the inevitable differences in fit. This may explain why, try as I might, I simply couldn’t get the demo Miracle to sound like the real thing - originally designed as a full-shell custom monitor, the Miracle sounds significantly poorer to me as a universal.

 With the best fit I was able to achieve with the demo Miracle, the biggest balance difference was at the low end. My custom Miracle has deep, plentiful bass that is both powerful and very controlled. The demo lacks some of the sub-bass presence of the real Miracle, offering instead slightly greater mid-bass presence and gentle roll-off at the very bottom. It sounds warmer than the real thing as a result and offers less crispness and articulation. Clarity is a bit poorer across the range and the overall performance isn’t quite as impressive as that of the custom Miracle. The mids of the demo are less detailed, clean, and engaging – not hugely so but enough to make me pick the real thing over the demo every time. The demo even requires a bit more volume to be enjoyable. The top end is more prominent on the custom Miracle, with better definition and cleaner presentation of cymbal crashes. The demo Miracle ends up being slightly darker in tone as well, though it is still brighter than the Merlin unit.

 It is the differences in presentation, however, that kill the demo Miracle for me - here the test unit is not even in the same league as the custom-shelled IEM. Whereas the ‘real’ Miracle is easily the most engrossing and dimensional earphone I’ve heard, the presentation of the demo is very reminiscent of a number of high-end universals. The soundstage is not as large as that of the full-shell custom and lacks the fantastic on-center feel. I find the presentation of my Miracle to be incredibly enveloping without overstepping any bounds but the demo doesn’t offer anything above high-end universals such as the Westone 4 in imaging, separation, or positioning. It doesn’t necessarily seem small or confined but ends up sounding much ‘flatter’ and less convincing. Truth be told, the slightly laid-back - especially in the midrange - sound of the Miracle simply doesn’t work without the coherent imaging of the full custom, and the whole experience suffers greatly as a result.

  
 Demo Merlin   

UM Merlin demo
   

UM Merlin demo
   
  My disappointment in the Miracle demo makes evaluating impressions of the demo Merlin quite difficult. To rule out the double variables of custom fit and different driver configuration, I mostly compared the Merlin to the demo Miracle and not the full custom. It is entirely possible that the demo Merlin is closer to the real thing than is the Miracle; the opposite can be true as well.

 For one, the Merlin seems to require more power than the Miracle. The difference is not huge but it is noticeable – even the demo Miracle is easier to listen to at low volumes with a player such as my Sansa Clip. The bass roll-off is accentuated with the clip and less noticeable with the Cowon J3 or when a mini3 is added into the mix. Flat sub-bass or not, it’s difficult to call the Merlin anything but bassy – it would really make a great earphone for those whose musical enjoyment hinges on feeling the bass. The Miracle is by no means bass-light for my taste but the Merlin is on a different level. The significantly greater mid-bass quantity carries with it greater sub-bass presence as well. The Merlin is not quite as linear as the full-custom Miracle – quite possibly a limitation of the demo – but there is still more than enough deep, thumping low-end grunt to go around. In addition to greater bass quantity, the Merlin boasts all of the usual dynamic-driver characteristics – it is softer of note, fuller, and more liquid-sounding than the Miracle. There is a reverberant character to the bass, likely the fault of longer attack/decay times, and even a bit of boominess on occasion – not at all surprising considering the overall weight of the low end. The detail requires a few extra notches of volume to bring out and even then the Miracle remains a touch more crisp in typical armature fashion. All in all the Merlin really showcases bass designed to please those who find balanced armatures to sound unnatural at the low end, not beat the Miracle in texture and detail.

 The midrange of the Merlin is perhaps even more laid-back than that of the Miracle. Due to the heavier bass presence it sounds a touch recessed and a bit thinner than that of the demo Miracle. The Miracle is also a bit brighter, or, rather, more neutral due to differences in overall balance and tends to beat the Merlin in overall crispness by a small margin. Not a large difference overall and one that becomes even smaller into the treble. Aside from the balance of the Merlin being skewed in favor of the low end, I really can’t tell the top ends of two demos apart – a plus, assuming it will translate into full custom form. Presentation-wise, the demo Merlin may even get ahead of the demo Miracle at times - the soundstage is a bit more wide and airy and differentiates itself better from reasonably spacious universals such as the Sennheiser IE7. It’s still not as enveloping and immersive as the full custom Miracle but is more tolerable than the demo Miracle. Then again, if a more separated and spread-out left-right soundstage is desirable in place of the singular, coherent sonic image of a full custom, I just don’t see the Merlin beating an open universal such as the MDR-EX1000.
  
 Conclusion   

Left->Right: UM Miracle, UM Miracle demo, UM Merlin Demo
   
  My experiences with the UM’s Miracle and Merlin demo units are a mixed bag. There are many variables but the one thing I am certain of is that with the fit I was able to get, the Miracle demo is not doing the real thing justice. It provides a reasonable approximation of the custom’s sound signature, which is not all that surprising since response is easiest to test for, but the absolute quality and refinement of the full-shell Miracle just isn’t there. By far the largest difference is in the presentation, which is much more ‘universal’ on the demo. It is akin to comparing an Etymotic HF5, which tends to sound wide and well-separated but a tad flat and not very involving, to a universal with good 3-D imaging, such as the CK10 or W4.
  
 Other things learned in the process: 
  -Quite a few of the top universals I’ve heard are competitive with these demo units in many ways, which may be the reason why most customs manufacturers do not sell universal versions of their earphones – those would simply have to be priced much lower to be compete in sound quality with existing universals.
 -Cramming five or six drivers into a shell is absolutely not indicative of overall sound quality and that there is more to a high-end custom than number and type of drivers.

 Despite my tangential takeaway, the whole purpose of this audition was to audition the new UM Merlin – a hybrid custom with a single dynamic bass driver and 2+2 armatures used for the mids and highs. Assuming the relationship between the sound of the demo Merlin and the custom one is similar to that between the two Miracle units, I would expect the full-shell Merlin to deliver exactly what it promises – tons of deep and powerful dynamic-driver bass laid over the sound signature of an armature-based custom. Though there is still an emphasis difference between the midrange and low end of the Merlin, the crossover is clearly less flawed than that of UE’s old hybrid - the hideous SF5EB - and the powerful low end integrates reasonably well into the overall sound.

 A final disclaimer - demo units could potentially fit some people better than others and may or may not be a better approximation of how the custom IEM will sound than they were for me. It is therefore doubly important for reviewers to state that they’ve only tried a demo or someone else’s mold when commenting on customs as the gap in performance is there and can be a relatively wide one. In addition, while the well-known adage of ‘try it for yourself’ still holds, the value of reviews might be higher for custom monitors than I expected since demo units can leave key elements out of the equation. I can honestly say that if I had heard only the demo, I’d probably have walked away from the Miracle content with my stable of universals.
   
   
   
   
*Bonus photo* for those who remember how this thread got started:
   

   
   
   


  Quote: 





spacecake said:


> Anyone knows what the (if there is any)difference is between the Ultimate Ears 400 and Ultimate Ears 500? The UE 500 is not on the European site while the UE 400 is not on the North America site, are the IEM just the same headset only with a different name? Because they also look exactly the same.
> Also thanks for this incredible thread, the last couple years I have been spoiled by the 595 so I'm searching now for a higher end iem. I'm now doubting between the DTX 71(€66), UE 400vi(€64) and DTX 101(€82) any advice? Another question is it so the higher end IEM use better cables, because I bicycle with the IEM I keep breaking them within a year at the plug(eg no sound in of the ears) even though I am careful with it I already broke several Sennheiser CX's


 


  I would guess the UE400 and UE500 are the same. Those are some very high quoted prices. The UE500/UE400 (presumably the same thing) sounds very different from the Beyer sets - not as warm or bassy but brighter, thinner, and more distant. They are good earphones but the signature is not for everyone. As for cables, some do and some don't. How the cable are attached matters just as much as the strength of the actual cables. I would put more stock in Beyer's build quality than UE's, personally. The DTX101 may not look it but it is a very solid product.


----------



## esanthosh

Just a curious question - how much would the Demo Miracle and Demo Merlin score in the SQ department? Would give a rough idea of the difference between demo and custom versions.


----------



## Inks

So looks like the demos are a relatively long shot compared to the full fledged customs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Just a curious question - how much would the Demo Miracle and Demo Merlin score in the SQ department? Would give a rough idea of the difference between demo and custom versions.


 

 I didn't think they clearly beat the SM3 to be honest, so in the 9.3-9.4 range. 9.5 tops.
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> So looks like the demos are a relatively long shot compared to the full fledged customs.


 

 Indeed. For signature approximation purposes they work (sort of) but you have to wonder if customs companies are doing themselves more harm than good with people like myself, who don't get significantly better sound out of them than some universals.


----------



## rawrster

hmm that photo is of a J3 and not a sansa fuze


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The midrange should not be sucked out enough to lose musical elements entirely. The M11+ isn't even that recessed (though next to the PL50 it might seem that way). It's just very bass-heavy but again that shouldn't be enough to lose vocals.


 

 well, it does happens to me. 320kbps files on a clip+ , no EQ setting
  (of course compared to the pl50 it'd sound like that, but i mean this's too much)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> hmm that photo is of a J3 and not a sansa fuze


 


  The king is dead, etc. etc.


----------



## SpaceCake

ljokerl said:


> I would guess the UE400 and UE500 are the same. Those are some very high quoted prices. The UE500/UE400 (presumably the same thing) sounds very different from the Beyer sets - not as warm or bassy but brighter, thinner, and more distant. They are good earphones but the signature is not for everyone. As for cables, some do and some don't. How the cable are attached matters just as much as the strength of the actual cables. I would put more stock in Beyer's build quality than UE's, personally. The DTX101 may not look it but it is a very solid product.




Thanks for the response, always if I want new IEM I keep reading, reading and reading. Just today I came across the Sennheiser CX6 for €62(travel editon of the IE6) they look great for the price, only not a lot of reviews on Head-Fi. I'm now leaning more towards the CX6 because of the price and I'm used to the sound of sennheisers. Are the CX6 a good choice for the price, also can you wear than normal(so not over the ear)? Thanks!


----------



## rroseperry

|joker| There's a possible UM sale, with 20 people ordering, there's a 20% deal. I've got the 1964-Ears triples and have just fallen in love with the e-Q5. Which of the UM line would you recommend?

Thanks


----------



## i2ehan

Just wanted to thank you |joker|, for all your help in promptly answering my PM's from time to time. Seems my universal journey is coming to a closure, until the next best thing comes around. As of late, I've been hooked on the analytical side of things, and my most belated discovery, the RE252, is now my second most preferred universal; second only to the EX1000 of course. I'd rank the two side by side, at the very top of my list, in terms of strictly preference that is. What I love most about the RE252 is just how _pure/natural _and _raw _it sounds, as though the music is reproduced just as was intended. All the while, the HiFiMan house signature is most certainly apparent (especially the magnificent mids), and the RE252's do retain a musical side for my ears. In turn, I'm able to appreciate all the nuances, while enjoying the music on end! There's no coloration, and when it comes to details, they hardly ever miss a beat. If I'm to be honest, ever since the RE252, I'm finding it more and more difficult to enjoy any signature with noticeable coloration. Not to mention, coupled with the LL sony hybrids, the fit/comfort excels that of any universal I've owned to date. Must be fate, because once they're in, they feel as though they're practically made for my ears. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
All that's left now is to pay the Ortofon's and Etymotic's a visit. Who knows? They may very well be my next RE252's. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


​


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Just wanted to thank you |joker|, for all your help in promptly answering my PM's from time to time. Seems my *universal* journey is coming to a closure, until the next best thing comes around. ​


 

 I guess that means your _*custom*_ journey is beginning very soon?


----------



## i2ehan

Hopefully *much* later than sooner my friend.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Shure SE215 and Munitio SITi Nine Millimeter
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C41) Shure SE215*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2A16) Munitio Teknine SITi Nine Millimeter*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Aug 2011
> ...


 




  Quote: 





spacecake said:


> Thanks for the response, always if I want new IEM I keep reading, reading and reading. Just today I came across the Sennheiser CX6 for €62(travel editon of the IE6) they look great for the price, only not a lot of reviews on Head-Fi. I'm now leaning more towards the CX6 because of the price and I'm used to the sound of sennheisers. Are the CX6 a good choice for the price, also can you wear than normal(so not over the ear)? Thanks!


 

 An IE6 for DTX71 money is a pretty good deal. They aren't meant to be worn cable-down but for me it's comfortable to do so anyway.

  
  Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> |joker| There's a possible UM sale, with 20 people ordering, there's a 20% deal. I've got the 1964-Ears triples and have just fallen in love with the e-Q5. Which of the UM line would you recommend?
> 
> Thanks


 

 I've only heard one custom from the UM line so I really don't know. The Miracle makes the 1964-T sound pretty poor in comparison but it's a pretty different signature.


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Just wanted to thank you |joker|, for all your help in promptly answering my PM's from time to time. Seems my universal journey is coming to a closure, until the next best thing comes around. As of late, I've been hooked on the analytical side of things, and my most belated discovery, the RE252, is now my second most preferred universal; second only to the EX1000 of course. I'd rank the two side by side, at the very top of my list, in terms of strictly preference that is. What I love most about the RE252 is just how _pure/natural _and _raw _it sounds, as though the music is reproduced just as was intended. All the while, the HiFiMan house signature is most certainly apparent (especially the magnificent mids), and the RE252's do retain a musical side for my ears. In turn, I'm able to appreciate all the nuances, while enjoying the music on end! There's no coloration, and when it comes to details, they hardly ever miss a beat. If I'm to be honest, ever since the RE252, I'm finding it more and more difficult to enjoy any signature with noticeable coloration. Not to mention, coupled with the LL sony hybrids, the fit/comfort excels that of any universal I've owned to date. Must be fate, because once they're in, they feel as though they're practically made for my ears.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Cheers, you've certainly worked hard at finding the one. I've never seen someone throw themselves at high-end universals with such dedication 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## rroseperry

*|joker| wrote:*


> I've only heard one custom from the UM line so I really don't know. The Miracle makes the 1964-T sound pretty poor in comparison but it's a pretty different signature.




More detailed, less warm?


----------



## Inks

Bah, my universal journey is coming to an end as well. It will between the FAD A1, FXT90, GR07(giving it a second chance) for an isolating IEM and then will probably pull the trigger on either the EX1000s or MDR7550s for lower isolation. FX500s I may keep as well. Don't think I'll go custom anytime soon, if I end up making more money in the future, then perhaps. Couple of things here and there are interesting, but there's very few and I'm probably not going to spend like before. 
   
  edit: nice shure215 review. The rating mirrors what I think of them.


----------



## esanthosh

Hmmm....Interesting. I've considered ending my universal IEM journey as well. For sometime now, I've lost my enthusiasm when trying new IEMs. I think I've heard a good sample of what's on offer and not many have offered something fresh and exciting in the past several months. For me, EX-1000 + FX700, CK10 and SM3 offer enough variety and perhaps I'd retain a few others as well, but a nice reduction in numbers (I think I own close to 40, lost count somewhere 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) is currently on. I don't think I will stay off customs forever since I always let my curiosity get ahead of any logic. But, it would take a while.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


esanthosh said:


> Hmmm....Interesting. I've considered ending my universal IEM journey as well. For sometime now, I've lost my enthusiasm when trying new IEMs. I think I've heard a good sample of what's on offer and not many have offered something fresh and exciting in the past several months. For me, EX-1000 + FX700, CK10 and SM3 offer enough variety and perhaps I'd retain a few others as well, but a nice reduction in numbers (I think I own close to 40, lost count somewhere
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Precisely! Though I must admit, the ES5 does look rather tasty... mmm, like candy for my ears...


----------



## DannyBai

After purchasing nearly 40 iems, I think going custom might be the answer.  The Unique Melody group buy seems very interesting.  Hint…hint.


----------



## Raguvian

Yay! Thanks for reviewing the SE215's. I'm always interested in knowing how you rate the headphones I already own.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  I'm (patiently, but not really) waiting for your TF10 review. I also have a silver cable for mine and would love to know what you think of that vs stock as well if you're interested.


----------



## -y0-

After about 20 universals, I'm thinking about going customs myself. Deciding between the UM group buy and 1964ears, hmmmm.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> After purchasing nearly 40 iems, I think going custom might be the answer.  The Unique Melody group buy seems very interesting.  Hint…hint.


 

 But, it's restricted to Americas. Otherwise, I was ready for it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Precisely! Though I must admit, the ES5 does look rather tasty... mmm, like candy for my ears...


 

 Stop tempting me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I have a few under consideration, but unlike universals, I want to take sometime to decide on one. Can't afford to end up with too many customs.


----------



## Anaxilus

Wow, I thought you had given up on the Teknines joker!  I know I did.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Glad to see you were able to plow through them eventually.  
  
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Bah, my universal journey is coming to an end as well. It will between the FAD A1, FXT90, GR07(giving it a second chance) for an isolating IEM and then will probably pull the trigger on either the EX1000s or MDR7550s for lower isolation. FX500s I may keep as well. Don't think I'll go custom anytime soon, if I end up making more money in the future, then perhaps. Couple of things here and there are interesting, but there's very few and I'm probably not going to spend like before.
> 
> edit: nice shure215 review. The rating mirrors what I think of them.


 

 I'd vote FAD A1 and EX1000 for you knowing your preferences.  I'd choose the same.  Maybe FXT90 since you don't do vocals but then you've got the FX500 too so you're going to have to figure out your JVC's.  
   
  Good luck w/ the GR07.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  I'm guessing you're going to throw every tip you have at them.


----------



## ljokerl

Well, with everyone quitting the IEM game I fear for the future of this thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I certainly won't be auditioning everyone's customs.
   
  Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> More detailed, less warm?


 

 There's a fundamental balance difference - emphasis on sub-bass instead of mid-bass, more laid-back midrange, more treble sparkle and better top-end extension. Yes, the Miracle is a bit less warm though it is still warm to my ears. The detail level is excellent.
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> edit: nice shure215 review. The rating mirrors what I think of them.


 

 Thanks
   


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Hmmm....Interesting. I've considered ending my universal IEM journey as well. For sometime now, *I've lost my enthusiasm when trying new IEMs*.


 

 This does happen, and I think it is often reflected in the order I review stuff, though not so much lately as it's mostly been dictated by deadlines 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Something I'm enthusiastic about will get a lot of listening time. To listen to something like the Teknine, on the other hand, I'll need a lot of prior motivation.


  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Wow, I thought you had given up on the Teknines joker!  I know I did.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I posted a separate review for them a long time ago, at the peak of their popularity. I still can't believe there were impressions comparing them positively to the TF10 and DBA-02 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Amazing insight into the head-fi hype machine at work.


----------



## WakiDabeast

thanks for adding the shure se215 , but the se215 and the se535 are the EXACT same build except for housing color and what not you can e-mail them too, the cable issue is only so common because more people buy the se215 and they don't review it when it's good nearly as much as they review it when it breaks.


----------



## Raguvian

Quote: 





wakidabeast said:


> thanks for adding the shure se215 , but the se215 and the se535 are the EXACT same build except for housing color and what not you can e-mail them too, the cable issue is only so common because more people buy the se215 and they don't review it when it's good nearly as much as they review it when it breaks.


 


  The housings on the SE215 are different than the SE535's. Even the SE315 is slightly different than the 215.


----------



## Ikarios

May as well chime in, I haven't tried a new IEM in a couple months since I haven't been able to find the "perfect" one, and the GR07 is good enough for the price. Towards the end of my IEM buying binge I started to realize I found a flaw in almost every IEM I listened to - treble was a little sibilant, mids slightly recessed, wasn't lively enough, midbass hump, etc etc etc. It was at that point I thought about trying higher-end customs. Well, fast forward to today, I'm getting impressions done on Tuesday and am working with my builder regarding details... this should be fun


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





wakidabeast said:


> thanks for adding the shure se215 , but the se215 and the se535 are the EXACT same build except for housing color and what not you can e-mail them too, the cable issue is only so common because more people buy the se215 and they don't review it when it's good nearly as much as they review it when it breaks.


 


  The SE535 and SE215 housings differ is size and shape. Back when I reviewed the SE535 fewer people owned the new Shure models and I wasn't aware of the reliability issues. I've received a number of PMs from SE215 owners since I started listening to them, all asking for replacement recommendations, which led me to investigate their durability. If the SE535 has the same issues I'll drop its score down to match the 215's.


----------



## Izeekio

In the price range of $30-100 which IEMs would you put money on last you more than a year? Maybe even the $100-150 bracket as well. Did any IEMs really stick out to you in that aspect of long term durability with daily use?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





izeekio said:


> In the price range of $30-100 which IEMs would you put money on last you more than a year? Maybe even the $100-150 bracket as well. Did any IEMs really stick out to you in that aspect of long term durability with daily use?


 

 If it were my money - Beyer DTX 101 iE, Ety MC5, ATH-CKM99, or Senn IE6.


----------



## MusicalChillies

On day 2 of owning the W4`s. Your review is pretty much spot on and mainly how I hear them. The slightly warm mids and excellent bass make these an easy choice over the 535`s imho.
   
  Love them to bits.
  Dare I say fun?


----------



## SpaceCake

Jokerk thanks for all the help I actually bought the IE7 now! I will try to wear this bad boys cable down with Left and Right turned around, or just over the ear if it doesn't looks too weird. The IE6 on play.com somehow couldn't get shipped to Holland(I knew it actually after I bought a prepaid CC...)


----------



## musedesign

Hi Joker,
    I received the Hifiman RE262 today and now I can listen to the two sets of earphone "side by side".  I would be interested if your reactions to the two IEMs are similar to mine:
   
*Westone UM3X* - Larger soundstage, less intimate than RE262, more of an "accurate sound".  Great for Jazz and Classical, but with Rock or Rap I use Audio Hijack and reduce the bass.  With Rock and Rap the sound is too muddy with bass for me.  Amazing how the sound can project forward with an IEM. Impressive how "big" the sound can be from an IEM.
   
*Hifiman RE262* - Large sound stage (not as big as UM3X), less "out of head" soundstage.  More of a "focused" soundstage, less enveloping than UM3X.  Warmer sounding than UM3X, I find it more engaging than UM3X.  Instruments more intimate, I become more involved with the music.  I find myself listening to individual instruments more than the overall music.
   
  Because of the impedance difference between the two IEMs I adjusted the volume between the two listenings.
   
  It seems to come down to; a big, "sitting on the stage experience" (UM3X) or a "sitting next to the saxophone in a smokey bar experience" (RE262).  In the end, if I was only going to keep one of the two, I would keep the UM3X, but I am still on the fence.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





musicalchillies said:


> On day 2 of owning the W4`s. Your review is pretty much spot on and mainly how I hear them. The slightly warm mids and excellent bass make these an easy choice over the 535`s imho.
> 
> Love them to bits.
> Dare I say fun?


 
   
  Thanks, good to hear. Calling the W4 fun would leave the W3 in a weird place in the lineup.
  
  Quote: 





spacecake said:


> Joker thanks for all the help I actually bought the IE7 now! I will try to wear this bad boys cable down with Left and Right turned around, or just over the ear if it doesn't looks too weird. The IE6 on play.com somehow couldn't get shipped to Holland(I knew it actually after I bought a prepaid CC...)


 


  It's harder to wear the IE7 cable-down than the IE6 but maybe it'll work for you.


----------



## SowonAoD

Anybody knows whether there is there fake ath ckm9 yet?


----------



## lina inverse

hi
  looking for a half-in-ear design
  i prefer neutral or mid/warm/sweet signature.
   if it's bright , analytical or even balanced it's also ok. just no bassy
  the only options i found till now are the new pg100 and brainwavz beta (v2) but there're no much reviews (if any).
  any advice is appreciated , thnx
   
  (the audio techina ckm99 look great but cant afford them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





)


----------



## carfentanil

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Not from me.  I'd prefer a 16mm driver.  Cough...cough....


 


  Outstanding, lol.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sowonaod said:


> Anybody knows whether there is there fake ath ckm9 yet?


 

 Is there a real CKM9?
   


  Quote: 





lina inverse said:


> hi
> looking for a half-in-ear design
> i prefer neutral or mid/warm/sweet signature.
> if it's bright , analytical or even balanced it's also ok. just no bassy
> ...


 

 Depending on your budget, you could consider the Phiaton PS 210 or MEElec CW31. I think both are a sizable step up from the PG100.


----------



## lina inverse

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Depending on your budget, you could consider the Phiaton PS 210 or MEElec CW31. I think both are a sizable step up from the PG100.


 
   the ps210 are definetly out of my budget.
  the cw31 , better. does that pointy back part of the housing touches the back of the ear?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lina inverse said:


> the cw31 , better. does that pointy back part of the housing touches the back of the ear?


 


  No, not really - the housings are very short and taper quickly.


----------



## SowonAoD

ops, i missed another "9" 
 So i'm wondering whether there is any fake ath ckm99 or not since i found i seller in japan sells them at the price of  ~90$ while the other sell them for around 135$.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sowonaod said:


> ops, i missed another "9"
> So i'm wondering whether there is any fake ath ckm99 or not since i found i seller in japan sells them at the price of  ~90$ while the other sell them for around 135$.


 


  Haven't seen any reports of counterfeit CKM99s. It's still a relatively new model and I don't believe any of Audio-Technica's titanium flagships have been counterfeited.


----------



## Inks

I haven't heard about them myself either, but they are made in China unlike the CK10/100. This kind of raises the probability of possible counterfeit issues, it's kind of unlikely, but still be wary.


----------



## gtrsl

I wonder when will the Triple.Fi 10's review be finished? BTW, are there any perfect IEMs for METAL/ROCK to recommand?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





gtrsl said:


> I wonder when will the Triple.Fi 10's review be finished? BTW, are there any perfect IEMs for METAL/ROCK to recommand?


 

 I might nominate the HJE900 and GR07 for rock and metal.  As long as it's not super fast to the point you need a BA.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I might nominate the HJE900 and GR07 for rock and metal.  As long as it's not super fast to the point you need a BA.


 

 What about the FX700, Anax? Do you think those would be good for this genre? Also, I would have thought the GR07 wouldnt be lively enough for rock / metal. I have yet to hear it tho, just going by what ppl are saying.
   
   
  On a personal aside, out of all the universal I own and have heard, the SM3s sound perfect for rock / metal. Again, thats just me.


----------



## gtrsl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I might nominate the HJE900 and GR07 for rock and metal.  As long as it's not super fast to the point you need a BA.


 


  I've learned that GR07 has a so flat sound that makes it versatile for all genres. I doubt its bass could  be enough to rock up.


----------



## shotgunshane

GR07 has really good deep bass for rock/metal, as well as a great distortion guitar crunch.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


gtrsl said:


> I've learned that GR07 has a so flat sound that makes it versatile for all genres. *I doubt its bass could  be enough to rock up.*


 

 The GR07 has ample bass for all genres IMO. I wouldn't assume otherwise, unless one hears it that way.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> GR07 has really good deep bass for rock/metal, as well as a great distortion guitar crunch.


 


  I hear it this way as well.
   
  I quite like the e-Q7, too. I don't need huge, booming bass to enjoy rock/metal and the highly textured and slightly warm sound of the Ortofons works well IMO. However, I still maintain that signature preferences take precedence over genre choice. What some might love with metal, others may hate.


----------



## Niyologist

I asked Meelec the other day:
   
  Are you guys planning to make Dual and Multi-Armature Earphones?
   
  Response: It's a secret. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  That's a pretty BIG hint. I hope it's released very soon.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> What about the FX700, Anax? Do you think those would be good for this genre? Also, I would have thought the GR07 wouldnt be lively enough for rock / metal. I have yet to hear it tho, just going by what ppl are saying.
> 
> On a personal aside, out of all the universal I own and have heard, the SM3s sound perfect for rock / metal. Again, thats just me.


 

 Oh yeah, FX700.  If you like lack of isolation they work.  SM3s are a no go for my taste in guitar bite, shredding and cymbal crashing.
   
  The GR07 isn't aggressive I guess but it has a timbre that would work well with rock and metal I think.
   
  Oh the FADs and DBAs too if you can get a fit to extract the low-end.  My DBA's used to tear up Rush like no other.  I probably listened to Rush more on the DBAs than any other IEM I've had.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Oh yeah, FX700.  If you like lack of isolation they work.  SM3s are a no go for my taste in guitar bite, shredding and cymbal crashing.
> 
> The GR07 isn't aggressive I guess but it has a timbre that would work well with rock and metal I think.
> 
> Oh the FADs and DBAs too if you can get a fit to extract the low-end.  My DBA's used to tear up Rush like no other.  I probably listened to Rush more on the DBAs than any other IEM I've had.


 

 OK, agree on the cymbals crashing bit with the SM3, but I think distortion guitars have a nice crunch / bite to them on the SM3 albeit with maybe a thickness to them. Of course, that's just MY tastes.
   
  Speaking of Rush, I think i was on a CK10 binge last i listened to them. They did sound really good tho. Do you think the CK10 has got what it takes for rock / metal? I'm only asking because I think they're somewhat similar to the DBAs, right?


----------



## Love Music

Hi,
   
  great review. i am thinking of buying the Audio Technica CK100. You said that it needs to be paired up with a right source to sound as its best. I have a Cowon J3 will it work?
   
  Also which is better with Japanese female vocalists the Audio Technica CK100, Ortofon e-q7, Etymotic HF5 or the JVC HA-FX700 . 
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Love Music

Hi,
   
  Great review. I was wondering if the Audio Technica CK100 will be paired well with the Cowon J3?
   
  Also which is better for Japanese female vocalists the Audio Technica CK100 , Ortofon e-q7, JVC HA-FX700  or the Etymotic HF5.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Speaking of Rush, I think i was on a CK10 binge last i listened to them. They did sound really good tho. Do you think the CK10 has got what it takes for rock / metal? I'm only asking because I think they're somewhat similar to the DBAs, right?


 

 Yup.  The only issue is how much bass do you need from the drum kit for your tastes and can you get that from either of them.  I was able to on the DBA.  Others had better results on the CK10 than myself so YMMV.  Plus I was using them w/ the Arrow which could pump out 60hz and below at the flick of a switch.  Sometimes I used the BB and sometimes I didn't.  Really depended on my mood and how my ears were hearing that day.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





love music said:


> Hi,
> 
> Great review. I was wondering if the Audio Technica CK100 will be paired well with the Cowon J3?
> 
> ...


 


  The J3 is a pretty flexible source and should be fine, especially if you're willing to play around with BBE.
   
  I am not familiar with Japanese vocalists specifically but I think the CK100 and e-Q5 (probably preferable to the e-Q7 for your purposes) are spectacular for female vocals in general. The CK100 has some of the best intelligibility of anything I've heard and works very well, especially if you like to focus on the midrange. The e-Q5 is more balanced but still has the great transparency and fluidity you would want.


----------



## i2ehan

@|joker|: quick question for you my dear friend. Of the customs you've heard, would you say the detail retrieval of the ER4S rivals that of customs? Or are customs yet again a 'step up', if you will. I just received my first every Ety's (ER4S), and I'm simply blown away at the level of detail. Quite a few tracks now have literally sent goosebumps down my skin. With the Zo thrown into the mix, well... where words fail...


----------



## kiteki




----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> @|joker|: quick question for you my dear friend. Of the customs you've heard, would you say the detail retrieval of the ER4S rivals that of customs? Or are customs yet again a 'step up', if you will. I just received my first every Ety's (ER4S), and I'm simply blown away at the level of detail. Quite a few tracks now have literally sent goosebumps down my skin. With the Zo thrown into the mix, well... where words fail...


 

 Which customs are you asking about?  Not on par w/ the ones I use.  Are you asking about the Kozee X1?


----------



## i2ehan

Any, from entry-level on up.


----------



## kiteki

Personally I found the ER-4S had high detail and seperation of note but it was lacking in imaging and all the details came from a similiar whirlpool, I think the CK10 and UE700 have similiar or equal high levels of detail but better imaging so the details are more dissected, I imagine a custom IEM using the same driver as the ER-4 or CK10/UE700 must have a similiar effect except better due to the multitude of drivers and thus more concentration/less effort for the respective drivers and increased imaging/more dissection, is my theory.
   
  If the ER-4 driver becomes worse in a custom Etymotic must have some magic nozzles and filters.


----------



## KevinWolf

Quote: 





love music said:


> Hi,
> 
> Great review. I was wondering if the Audio Technica CK100 will be paired well with the Cowon J3?
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  I didn't had too many IEMs, but when I had both the CK10 and CK100, I thought that the CK100 were better than CK10. And both CK10 and CK100 were WAY better than SE530. Unfortunately I haven't heard neither of the other models cited.
  
  What I can say is that I find the CK100 to be excellent with vocals, perfect with trance and other electronic music and outstanding with most genres, maybe not so great with some pop.
  I found to be also very revealing, needing 256 kbps MP3 or better files to get most of its potential. Using a Samsung Galaxy S with Voodoo Control.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Any, from entry-level on up.


 

 If you find yourself becoming a detail freak, just stay away from the FAD SS and UERM.  The ER4 is not even in the same league as those two.


----------



## i2ehan

I'm confused. Wouldn't I be drawn more towards the FAD SS and UERM, if I find myself becoming a detail freak, if they're levels above the ER4S?


----------



## KevinWolf

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> If you find yourself becoming a detail freak, just stay away from the FAD SS and UERM.  The ER4 is not even in the same league as those two.


 

 Anaxilus,
   
  Only now that I noticed that you have the IERM! Could you do a comparison with the CK10? I interested on these but nothing on the forum was helpful to me. There are differences that make them worth upgrading?


----------



## kiteki

I don't think Anax liked the CK10 very much or had a short encounter with it... but the Westone ES5 seems like one of the logical CK10 upgrades since it's using the same drivers X2 + 1.
   
  Unique Melody Mage is another, CK10 driver + bass, I'll get to hear it tomorrow and see how far the apple falls from the tree...


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I'm confused. Wouldn't I be drawn more towards the FAD SS and UERM, if I find myself becoming a detail freak, if they're levels above the ER4S?


 

 Your wallet might not be.... =P


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kevinwolf said:


> Anaxilus,
> 
> Only now that I noticed that you have the IERM! Could you do a comparison with the CK10? I interested on these but nothing on the forum was helpful to me. There are differences that make them worth upgrading?


 

 Arrigoshred and djnellie have some nice reviews.
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/568229/multi-custom-flagship-iem-review-23-8-11-uerm-added
   
  Average_joe will have his up as well soon enough.  
   
  I liked the DBA-02 more than the CK10 but they are very similar.  Key differences?  Better imaging, better resolution, cleaner treble, better bass, more natural note thickness to name a few.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I don't think Anax liked the CK10 very much or had a short encounter with it... but the Westone ES5 seems like one of the logical CK10 upgrades since it's using the same drivers X2 + 1.
> 
> Unique Melody Mage is another, CK10 driver + bass, I'll get to hear it tomorrow and see how far the apple falls from the tree...


 

 Umm, CK10 and ES5 are not very similar at all.  I know you've been on this driver X sounds like X thing lately but there is really more to it than that.  I owned the CK10 for more than a month.  I'm just more adverse to its treble spikes and there wasn't enough mid bass presence to make it not sound like a BA for me despite it having better extension and texture than the DBA.  Plus the price diff was 2:1 and I got better isolation w/ the DBA for my ears since I wear them like Etys.


----------



## kiteki

Whoops..... I forgot you own the ES5 too... umm but it is the TWFK x 2 right?
   
  Oh well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 If I can't hear a TWFK inside the Mage and so on I'll give up my driver x thing.


----------



## Raguvian

Somehow I talked myself into maybe getting a Westone 4 in a couple of months (November-ish).
   
  Do they need an amp or would they be happy out of a Clip+? I'm interested in knowing how they'd perform vs the TF10. Since the TF10's are more "fun", would that make the W4 "boring" by comparison? I don't need pounding bass like the TF10 and I'm pretty sensitive to overly sparkly highs but I would like something that keeps me engaged with the music. That was my problem with the UM3x: lots of bass but otherwise they sounded pretty boring especially in the higher frequencies. I've read the review quite a few times and it seems like the W4's have a "safer" signature by not being crazy explosive and engaging but not analytical either.
   
  Is the W4 more of a "jack of all trades, master of none" kind of phone?


----------



## KevinWolf

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Arrigoshred and djnellie have some nice reviews.
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/568229/multi-custom-flagship-iem-review-23-8-11-uerm-added
> 
> ...


 

  
  Great thread, really haven't found when searching.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Yup.  The only issue is how much bass do you need from the drum kit for your tastes and can you get that from either of them.  I was able to on the DBA.  Others had better results on the CK10 than myself so YMMV.  Plus I was using them w/ the Arrow which could pump out 60hz and below at the flick of a switch.  Sometimes I used the BB and sometimes I didn't.  Really depended on my mood and how my ears were hearing that day.


 

 Yup, I use them with an Arrow as well and flip on the BB to 1 every now and again when I feel like more bass. The CK10 + Arrow BB1 is a pretty potent combo in my humble stable of IEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> @|joker|: quick question for you my dear friend. Of the customs you've heard, would you say the detail retrieval of the ER4S rivals that of customs? Or are customs yet again a 'step up', if you will. I just received my first every Ety's (ER4S), and I'm simply blown away at the level of detail. Quite a few tracks now have literally sent goosebumps down my skin. With the Zo thrown into the mix, well... where words fail...


 

 The ER-4S is ridiculously detailed as far as universals go and can easily compete with the 1964-T. Compared to the Miracle it doesn't quite have the same detail resolution and the way notes are fleshed out on the Miracle is much more realistic, if you consider that to be part of 'detail retrieval'. 
   
  I have a sneaking suspicion that the Miracle gives up a bit of microdetail compared to some other high-end customs because of its note thickness, though. 
   


  Quote: 





raguvian said:


> Somehow I talked myself into maybe getting a Westone 4 in a couple of months (November-ish).
> 
> Do they need an amp or would they be happy out of a Clip+? I'm interested in knowing how they'd perform vs the TF10. Since the TF10's are more "fun", would that make the W4 "boring" by comparison? I don't need pounding bass like the TF10 and I'm pretty sensitive to overly sparkly highs but I would like something that keeps me engaged with the music. That was my problem with the UM3x: lots of bass but otherwise they sounded pretty boring especially in the higher frequencies. I've read the review quite a few times and it seems like the W4's have a "safer" signature by not being crazy explosive and engaging but not analytical either.
> 
> Is the W4 more of a "jack of all trades, master of none" kind of phone?


 


  Don't know about a clip+ but the W4 is reasonably happy driven by a Cowon J3 or Cube C30 (rebadged Nationite something or another). I wouldn't say the W4 sounds purposely dull the way some other earphones do (Shure E4, Ety MC5, etc.) but it's a very level earphone and quite neutral in tone. I think your take on it from reading reviews is about as good as it will get without actually listening to it. Yes there is less bass than with the UM3X and it doesn't have the same dissecting sort of presentation but it's hardly a consumer sound. The W4 really doesn't have a 'wow' factor except for the fact that it has no glaring faults that I could hear (which is pretty noteworthy to me but maybe not so impressive in general).


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> *The ER-4S is ridiculously detailed as far as universals go and can easily compete with the 1964-T.* Compared to the Miracle it doesn't quite have the same detail resolution and the way notes are fleshed out on the Miracle is much more realistic, if you consider that to be part of 'detail retrieval'.
> 
> I have a sneaking suspicion that the Miracle gives up a bit of microdetail compared to some other high-end customs because of its note thickness, though.


 
   
  No better time to use the Ety smile:


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> No better time to use the Ety smile:


 


  I am glad you finally got a hand on the ER4!
   
  In my opinion, the ER4 is one of the most underrated IEM due to its age, but despite of having quite a few top-tier contenders, the ER4 never fails to impress me on its accuracy and details.


----------



## i2ehan

And these hands don't intent to let go of the ER4's either! They've got me wanting to revisit my entire EDM collection (among other genres), and I can't stress the improvements the Zo brings forth. However, I still can't decide between the RE252 and ER4s; then again, I'm no longer pressed to. The two sound distinct enough to coexist, as far as I'm concerned.


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





kevinwolf said:


> I didn't had too many IEMs, but when I had both the CK10 and CK100, I thought that the CK100 were better than CK10. And both CK10 and CK100 were WAY better than SE530. Unfortunately I haven't heard neither of the other models cited.
> 
> What I can say is that I find the CK100 to be excellent with vocals, perfect with trance and other electronic music and outstanding with most genres, maybe not so great with some pop.
> I found to be also very revealing, needing 256 kbps MP3 or better files to get most of its potential. Using a Samsung Galaxy S with Voodoo Control.


 


 Thanks. What is the difference between the two and what are there sound signature?


----------



## i2ehan

Refer back to the original post my friend. They've both (CK10 & CK100) been reviewed.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I have a sneaking suspicion that the Miracle gives up a bit of microdetail compared to some other high-end customs because of its note thickness, though.


 


 Much fleshier than RE272, I'm assuming?
   
  What are all the custom IEM's you've heard now btw?


----------



## KevinWolf

Quote: 





love music said:


> Thanks. What is the difference between the two and what are there sound signature?


 

  
  CK10 has flat response on the bass and mids, but have a very emphased high. CK100 has a upper-mid-forward signature, less emphasis on highs and slightly rolled off on bass (below 80 Hz is most noticeable IMO).
  Both are very good at detail retrieval, but the CK100 has the advantage on mids and highs are very refined, allowing fatigue-free listening for hours. But CK10 presents it more in-your-face.
  The CK10 sounds like it's dissecting the music, separating every instrument, making easy to focus in one instrument. The CK100 makes music sound more like a whole piece (not in a congested way, but more like a better idea of how the music should sound, if that makes sense).
  When I had both with me I compared them many times, I found that the CK100 a little more rich and full, because of their mids.
   
  Build quality on both are top notch, being the CK100 the better. CK10 is easy to drive, unlike the CK100, which needs a good source and files, I found to have synergy problems with the computer soundcard but they are perfect with the Galaxy S. They were horrible with the N95, sounding a little cold compared to the GS and pretty noisy.


----------



## kiteki

Thanks for your comparison.
   
  I used to think the CK100 was an exotic super-expensive signature dish IEM and now the price seems "normal", it's weird what head-fi does to you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Much fleshier than RE272, I'm assuming?
> 
> What are all the custom IEM's you've heard now btw?


 


  Custom molded - only the ones reviewed in the OP. I'm going off average_joe's impressions of the Miracle demo and how I hear it in comparison to the real Miracle & universals.
   
  The RE272 does sound thinner than the Miracle but the problem with it is a little deeper than that - it sounds a tiny bit glassy and is missing some texture in comparison.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


kevinwolf said:


> CK10 has flat response on the bass and mids, but have a very emphased high. CK100 has a upper-mid-forward signature, less emphasis on highs and slightly rolled off on bass (below 80 Hz is most noticeable IMO).
> Both are very good at detail retrieval, but the CK100 has the advantage on mids and highs are very refined, allowing fatigue-free listening for hours. But CK10 presents it more in-your-face.
> The CK10 sounds like it's dissecting the music, separating every instrument, making easy to focus in one instrument. The CK100 makes music sound more like a whole piece (not in a congested way, but more like a better idea of how the music should sound, if that makes sense).
> When I had both with me I compared them many times, I found that the CK100 a little more rich and full, because of their mids.
> ...


 

 Excellent description of the CK10 and CK100. Nailed it IMO, as that's exactly how I heard them both.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





kevinwolf said:


> CK10 has flat response on the bass and mids, but have a very emphased high. CK100 has a upper-mid-forward signature, less emphasis on highs and slightly rolled off on bass (below 80 Hz is most noticeable IMO).
> Both are very good at detail retrieval, but the CK100 has the advantage on mids and highs are very refined, allowing fatigue-free listening for hours. But CK10 presents it more in-your-face.
> The CK10 sounds like it's dissecting the music, separating every instrument, making easy to focus in one instrument. The CK100 makes music sound more like a whole piece (not in a congested way, but more like a better idea of how the music should sound, if that makes sense).
> When I had both with me I compared them many times, I found that the CK100 a little more rich and full, because of their mids.
> ...


 
  Really great description of the CK10's. I found your comment about the CK10's dissecting the music to be spot on, that is precisely how I heard them. They allowed you to analyze your music to a degree I have never experienced before or since. Now granted this wasn't the most musical or outright fun thing to do however it was quite an astonishing feeling/sensation.
   
  This was particularly noticeable and stunning on acoustic tracks where there was this almost sublime realism to it. I have not experience acoustic Eric Clapton like I did with the CK10's thanks to their separation and ability to display sound in a spacious environment.


----------



## KevinWolf

Thanks for the comments.
   
  I was going to buy one ER4 but later I thought that would be similar to the CK10, then I gave up. Now that I sold the CK10, I missed its highs a bit, but I'm quite satisfied with the CK100.
  Now I want to go to customs only to get more detail and better isolation.
  [Maybe will take a long time, but I'm pretty sure that I will have 3 CIEMs: IERM, MG6Pro and C435 (FitEar). These IEMs should be amazing!]


----------



## KevinWolf

Just posting a photo of the IEM (since I don't know if I'm allowed to post a photo here, I put only the link). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




CK100


----------



## i2ehan

I swear, both the CK10 and CK100 look edible. They should put a disclaimer on the box to keep listeners like myself from chewing on them from time to time. Mmm... Audio Technica's...


----------



## kiteki

i2ehan is the king of smiley faces.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


kiteki said:


> i2ehan is the king of smiley faces.


----------



## KevinWolf

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I swear, both the CK10 and CK100 look edible. They should put a disclaimer on the box to keep listeners like myself from chewing on them from time to time. Mmm... Audio Technica's...


 


  For me they have a tasty signature, lol.


----------



## Freefallr4545




----------



## kiteki

Kay so I've heard every Unique Melody custom IEM now.
   
  and now i2ehan is like a dog in a window waiting for someone to come home and feed him dinner.


----------



## i2ehan

Careful Kiteki, this dog's got a mean bite my friend... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  PM me... NOW!


----------



## MaxwellDemon

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Careful Kiteki, this dog's got a mean bite my friend...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Oh boy.
   
  Can't wait to hear your impressions as well, kiteki.


----------



## SpaceCake

Just received my IE7! Even without burn-in I can hear the potential already, they are so clear I love it. However it's hard to get a fit with the IE7, it always feels like they need to pushed in some more and the isolation ain't great. I still have to take the ultimate test and that is taking the subway. Right now I'm going to buy some eBay Sony Hybrids and Ebay Bi-flanges I hope that will fix the (lack) of isolation. 

Edit: I was using the normal used because I was used to those on the CX400 and other IEM, but somehow on the IE7 the bi-flange and single Large sleeves fit perfect for me! They suddenly sound so much better instead of that hallow sound with a bad fit :rolleyes: Can't even imagine how much better these IE7 are going to be


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


maxwelldemon said:


> Oh boy.
> 
> Can't wait to hear your impressions as well, kiteki.


 

here


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


spacecake said:


> Just received my IE7! Even without burn-in I can hear the potential already, they are so clear I love it. However it's hard to get a fit with the IE7, it always feels like they need to pushed in some more and the isolation ain't great. I still have to take the ultimate test and that is taking the subway. Right now I'm going to buy some eBay Sony Hybrids and Ebay Bi-flanges I hope that will fix the (lack) of isolation.
> 
> Edit: I was using the normal used because I was used to those on the CX400 and other IEM, but somehow on the IE7 the bi-flange and single Large sleeves fit perfect for me! They suddenly sound so much better instead of that hallow sound with a bad fit
> 
> ...


 

  IMO the isolation will always be a bit lacking with the IE7/IE8. I use MEElec 'balanced' bi-flange tips with mine as they are longer than stock and seal better for me.


----------



## carfentanil

The "first" universal flagship IEM and STILL top of the range for Ety... Newer products nearly always inflate prices to a degree... Then there's the whole issue of it being premium electronics, too... I like thick and loud sound so far but the ER4 is high on my want-to-sample list - if I ever wrote it down, lol
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





maxwelldemon said:


> I am glad you finally got a hand on the ER4!
> 
> In my opinion, the ER4 is one of the most underrated IEM due to its age, but despite of having quite a few top-tier contenders, the ER4 never fails to impress me on its accuracy and details.


----------



## crystaltears

What IEMs would you recommend that would last me the longest? My budget is up to $150. I was thinking of the Shure SE215 but I am still not sure.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





crystaltears said:


> What IEMs would you recommend that would last me the longest? My budget is up to $150. I was thinking of the Shure SE215 but I am still not sure.


 


  In that price range I'd say Beyer DTX 101 iE, Ety MC5, or maybe ATH-CKM99. If you were looking at the Shures I'd go with the Beyers as they are at least somewhat similar in sound signature and sound quality.


----------



## cwill51

Thanks very much joker!!  I'm a poor grad student but have made satisfied purchases, with your help, of Meelectronics CC51 and M6 earphones and most recently CAL! headphones.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cwill51 said:


> Thanks very much joker!!  I'm a poor grad student but have made satisfied purchases, with your help, of Meelectronics CC51 and M6 earphones and most recently CAL! headphones.


 


  Glad the thread was helpful. Nice collection you've got there - I could be happy with those.


----------



## kiteki

Hey joker have you heard the Vsonic R04 yet? (not to be confused with the Visang R04 / M3).


----------



## haesor

Many thanks for your review Shure 215th But I think that somehow sound should be a little higher rated


----------



## kiteki

There was someone on head-fi that sold all their headphones after buying the SE210 and they disappeared.
   
  I can kinda understand them, except the bass was the weakest thing ever, so it must sound the opposite of the SE215...


----------



## Armaegis

I think I've temporarily settled on the SE215 as my iem. It sounds good, but more importantly it actually fits my blasted ears and doesn't stick out at funny angles and cause discomfort. This has been the greater deciding factor for me above sound quality.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Hey joker have you heard the Vsonic R04 yet? (not to be confused with the Visang R04 / M3).


 


  No, I haven't


  Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I think I've temporarily settled on the SE215 as my iem. It sounds good, but more importantly it actually fits my blasted ears and doesn't stick out at funny angles and cause discomfort. This has been the greater deciding factor for me above sound quality.


 

 Yep, good sound with poor fit is one of more unfortunate combinations out there. Glad you like the SE215.


----------



## Raguvian

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I think I've temporarily settled on the SE215 as my iem. It sounds good, but more importantly it actually fits my blasted ears and doesn't stick out at funny angles and cause discomfort. This has been the greater deciding factor for me above sound quality.


 


  Too bad they are not durable at all. I've been using my SE215's at the gym everyday for the past few months and they're pretty much dead now. Sound cuts out on both sides unless I keep my head at a certain angle and don't move all. It's pretty terrible especially because they are comfortable and sound decent.
   
  My Meelec M31 have also been abused at the gym on a daily basis and they're still fine. I haven't used them in a while because they aren't as comfortable but they've never cut out on me.


----------



## rroseperry

Do the new Shure SE215 have replaceable cables? That was always my issue with Shures, love the sound, hate the cable, which shorted out in about 6 months on each model I've had.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> Do the new Shure SE215 have replaceable cables? That was always my issue with Shures, love the sound, hate the cable, which shorted out in about 6 months on each model I've had.


 


  Yes they do


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> Do the new Shure SE215 have replaceable cables? That was always my issue with Shures, love the sound, hate the cable, which shorted out in about 6 months on each model I've had.


 


  They do but so far the reliability of the connectors isn't looking too good.


----------



## Varley

@*Joker - *You should take a listen of the new Brainwavz Beta's ~(the one with the comply tips standard) - I reckon they're a good contender for under $50 range 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 - I would send you mine but it would probably cost about the same in shipping there and back than an actual new pair 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 http://mp4nation.net/catalog/brainwavz-beta-iem-earphones-p-553.html


----------



## Datsmah

What is the difference between Etymotic research HF2, 3 and 5 ? It is very hard to get non-mainstream stuff here, so if i want the HF5's i have to buy them on amazon, and due to tax regulations need to pay an additional 25%, making them (or anything i order on amazon) expensive. However, apple carries HF3's in their webshop, meaning i can get them without having to pay import tax
   
  The review in this thread is done on the HF5, but in the comparison table it seems HF2 and HF3 is put together with HF5 ? Can i assume the HF3 has the same specs as HF5, and is just a newer model ? The HF5's seem ideal for my planned use for IEM's, but if for example the HF3's has a different score in isolation (my main concern) then they wouldn't be my favourite purchase.


----------



## Ikarios

Quote: 





datsmah said:


> What is the difference between Etymotic research HF2, 3 and 5 ? It is very hard to get non-mainstream stuff here, so if i want the HF5's i have to buy them on amazon, and due to tax regulations need to pay an additional 25%, making them (or anything i order on amazon) expensive. However, apple carries HF3's in their webshop, meaning i can get them without having to pay import tax
> 
> The review in this thread is done on the HF5, but in the comparison table it seems HF2 and HF3 is put together with HF5 ? Can i assume the HF3 has the same specs as HF5, and is just a newer model ? The HF5's seem ideal for my planned use for IEM's, but if for example the HF3's has a different score in isolation (my main concern) then they wouldn't be my favourite purchase.


 

 I believe the only differences are in phone/mic addition. The HF3 has apple controls, HF2 has a mic and a mute, HF5 is just the earphones.


----------



## kiteki

Sony just released a complete series of new balanced armature IEM's.
   
   
  They look vented and unique to Sony.


----------



## Datsmah

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> I believe the only differences are in phone/mic addition. The HF3 has apple controls, HF2 has a mic and a mute, HF5 is just the earphones.


 
   
  Thanks !
   
  Sounds like ill be ordering my first IEMs
   
  My AKG518s combined with the thick plastic rods on my glasses are killing my ears !


----------



## epidoc

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Sony just released a complete series of new balanced armature IEM's.
> 
> 
> They look vented and unique to Sony.


 
  Lets see how the prices pan out for these guys. The XBA-S65 sounds interesting.


----------



## promolic1

OMG!
   
  I was expecting the SE215 review!!! Thanks joker!!!
   
  So, I am not sure now  What do you recommend guys, for a lounge, chillout, light electronic music listener and a little bit basshead? xD
   
  SE215, CC51, or maybe Etymotic MC5? Or another model?
   
  These three seems to compare in score, but what about my kind of music?
   
  Can be risky to get the 215s form Amazon? Because I don't understand what is the defect that is discussed here.


----------



## Raguvian

Quote: 





promolic1 said:


> OMG!
> 
> I was expecting the SE215 review!!! Thanks joker!!!
> 
> ...


 

 If you do get it from Amazon, make sure that it's from Amazon themselves or an authorized dealer. And the defects are from the removable cables. The points where they attach go bad easily and cause the sound to cut out. It's much worse if sweat gets on that joint as that will cut them out for sure if you have a defective pair.


----------



## Heret1c

epidoc said:


> Lets see how the prices pan out for these guys. The XBA-S65 sounds interesting.




Yup, am very interested to see the pricing for these. In true SONY fashion they're likely gonna be pricier than comparable IEMs but I hope it won't be ludicrously expensively.


----------



## promolic1

Quote: 





raguvian said:


> If you do get it from Amazon, make sure that it's from Amazon themselves or an authorized dealer. And the defects are from the removable cables. The points where they attach go bad easily and cause the sound to cut out. It's much worse if sweat gets on that joint as that will cut them out for sure if you have a defective pair.


 


  Thanks Raguvian, yes, the idea is getting them from Amazon, but I am not sure what to get  SE215... or another one!!! :S


----------



## Niyologist

Just in-case if anyone was wondering, here's the News Press for the Single, Dual and Multi-Armature IEMs from Sony:
   
  http://www.sony-asia.com/pressrelease/asset/469743/section/regionalpressreleases
   
  Sony is seriously making me curious.


----------



## kiteki

Lol Sony is smart.
   
  They're using magnesium in the XBA-2, XBA-3, XBA-4 and liquid crystal in the XBA-1.
   
  That means the people that instantly buy the XBA-4, will eventually buy the XBA-1 anyway out of curiosity, Sony has already given it a label of "Profound vocal sound".
   
  The people that buy the XBA-1 thinking it's expensive enough already, will slowly become insatiably curious about the XBA-2, 3 and 4.
   
  In the end Sony is making sure everyone buys at least two models to increase sales two-fold, and they sure released these all at a good time, the balanced armature IEM market is more lively than ever right now in 2011.
   
  The XBA-3 is the one for me.
   

   
   
   
  p.s. Why was my thread showing the movie about this deleted?


----------



## i2ehan

I'm personally eyeing the XBA-1 and XBA-4 myself; the former for neutrality, and the latter for the _super woofer_.


----------



## FlySweep

Looks like the XBA-3 is going to be about midbass.. and the XBA-4 is going to be a sub-bass monster.


----------



## buffalowings

hey, at least sony is finally getting back into the game


----------



## kiteki

Black, silver and orange is probably my favorite colour combination EVER... I am really happy about the look of these, they will match my black, silver and orange Nike shoes!!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Lol Sony is smart.
> 
> They're using magnesium in the XBA-2, XBA-3, XBA-4 and liquid crystal in the XBA-1.
> 
> ...


 

       This is why I can't resist this.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Looks like the XBA-3 is going to be about midbass.. and the XBA-4 is going to be a sub-bass monster.


 

      The XBA-4 is for me then!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





varley said:


> @*Joker - *You should take a listen of the new Brainwavz Beta's ~(the one with the comply tips standard) - I reckon they're a good contender for under $50 range
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I'll see if I can get my hands on one when I have time.
   


  Quote: 





promolic1 said:


> OMG!
> 
> I was expecting the SE215 review!!! Thanks joker!!!
> 
> ...


 

 I think its actually safest to get the SE215 on amazon (directly from amazon, that is) as you'd be covered by the warranty but personally I still wouldn't risk them at this point. If you're worried about longevity I'd go Beyer DTX 101 iE, otherwise maybe one of the Xears models or the Brainwavz M2. The MC5 definitely won't have enough bass for you and the CC51 might not have enough if you don't get a perfect seal.


----------



## Niyologist

Here's the movie for the Sony XBA Series:


----------



## i2ehan

^^ Might I suggest we keep this discussion in the *original thread* please, out of respect to the OP.


----------



## promolic1

Thanks joker!
   
  Just to inform, I come from a M6, CX300, CX280, bassy models AFAIK, but I am interested in getting a new pair about $100.
   
  And about the Xears and Beyers, I haven't looked at them :S They doesn't look cool like other models (LOL)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





promolic1 said:


> Thanks joker!
> 
> Just to inform, I come from a M6, CX300, CX280, bassy models AFAIK, but I am interested in getting a new pair about $100.
> 
> And about the Xears and Beyers, I haven't looked at them :S They doesn't look cool like other models (LOL)


 


  The CX280 isn't really that bassy. If you think you'd be okay with just a bit less low end, the CC51 should work for you. Or the ECCI PR401 if you think it looks good.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Lol Sony is smart.
> 
> They're using magnesium in the XBA-2, XBA-3, XBA-4 and liquid crystal in the XBA-1.
> 
> ...


 

 Curse you, Sony! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Hehe...my wallet grows ever thinner with such news!
   

  
  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I'm personally eyeing the XBA-1 and XBA-4 myself; the former for neutrality, and the latter for the _super woofer_.


 

 I was thinking the same thing too, although budget may have the final say on how I go about that pruchase. Lets hope they dont price them in the EX1000 range.
   
  Ps: Nice avatar!
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Here's the movie for the Sony XBA Series:


 

 Niccceeeeeee


----------



## DarkAndroid

wow!!! I'm looking to buy an IEM to complement my HD 598 and SRH 940 cans and was looking around the forums for opinions on the best IEM but after stumbling on this thread I think I dont have to look further! good work to the OP!


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> wow!!! I'm looking to buy an IEM to complement my HD 598 and* SRH 940 cans* and was looking around the forums for opinions on the best IEM but after stumbling on this thread I think I dont have to look further! good work to the OP!


 
   
  best of luck, you'll need it


----------



## kiteki

So it seems like the new Sony BA's don't have nozzles, which means they won't be able to be reshelled into custom IEM's, thank heavens et dominus patri et spiritus sancti.


----------



## Benjamin6264

Quote:


kiteki said:


> So it seems like the new Sony BA's don't have nozzles, which means they won't be able to be reshelled into custom IEM's, thank heavens et dominus patri et spiritus sancti.


 
   
  Excuse my ignorance, but why do you need a nozzled IEM to make a remold?


----------



## infernojim

Hey there, both of my IEM's busted, both right feeds gone, maybe I have an evil right ear or something. 
   
  As such, I've been listening to my ESW9 cans on the road at present, which I love - but would still like to have a good IEM alternative. Have got about £15 of vouchers for amazon, and would like to put these towards some IEMS from the Amazon UK site.
   
  My maximum outlay (after voucher) is £70, which leaves me quite a few options, and was hoping for your thoughts on which to go for from the following:
   
  Shure SE215s - have owned SE210's in past, and really like them.
  Klipsch S4s
  Phonak Audeo PFE 012
  Ultimate Ears 700 Noise Isolating Phones
  Beyer Dynamic DTX101
  Ultimate Ears Superfi 5
   
  Ideally I'm looking for a shallow V shape to the sound (I've tried RE0's and these were too thin for my taste); very warm and engaging and fun without being bass monsters. I love the ESW9 sound signature, so something similar to that would be cool. I really liked my Shure SE210's when I had them, so am inclined towards them, but was looking for some advice as to which of the others in my price bracket above, may be worthy contenders.
   
  Particular interested in the Klipsch, Phonak and Ultimate Ears as have read good things about all.
   
  Thanks in advance for your thoughts...


----------



## DarkAndroid

Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> wow!!! I'm looking to buy an IEM to complement my HD 598 and SRH 940 cans and was looking around the forums for opinions on the best IEM but after stumbling on this thread I think I dont have to look further! good work to the OP!


 


   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> best of luck, you'll need it


 

 emmm kiteki why do you say so?


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


benjamin6264 said:


> Excuse my ignorance, but why do you need a nozzled IEM to make a remold?


 
   
  OK technically you might not have to but every custom IEM I've seen has sound-tubes attached to the nozzles of the BA drivers, the Sony BA shoots the sound out at a 90 degree angle in a chamber coated with LCP or magnesium.
   
  Sony said they've been working on their new BA's for over three years and they are publicly flaming the other companies for not using their own technology i.e. "it's all the same".
   


  
  Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> emmm kiteki why do you say so?


 

 Because the SRH-940 is really good.


----------



## Inks

Klipsch makes their own BA drivers as well...though yes, it's most likely designed like your typical BA.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





inks said:


> Klipsch makes their own BA drivers as well...though yes, it's most likely designed like your typical BA.


 

 Yep and Final Audio too apparently in a factory in a jungle in Indonesia?
   
  Here is a better picture:


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> wow!!! I'm looking to buy an IEM to complement my HD 598 and SRH 940 cans and was looking around the forums for opinions on the best IEM but after stumbling on this thread I think I dont have to look further! good work to the OP!


 

 Thanks, glad the thread has been useful.

   


  Quote: 





infernojim said:


> Hey there, both of my IEM's busted, both right feeds gone, maybe I have an evil right ear or something.
> 
> As such, I've been listening to my ESW9 cans on the road at present, which I love - but would still like to have a good IEM alternative. Have got about £15 of vouchers for amazon, and would like to put these towards some IEMS from the Amazon UK site.
> 
> ...


 

 To be honest I don't think any of the ones you're looking at have a v-shape curve except for the S4 (and that's definitely not shallow). The S4 is really a step below the others you've listed in overall refinement. The SF5 (non-Pro, I'm assuming) is pretty mid-forward. The UE700 has slightly rolled-off bass and a bit of a treble tilt. I don't think it's what you're looking for. The SE215, PFE012, and DTX101iE are all a bit bass/mid-centric. The Phonaks are a touch on the dark side and pretty hard to drive. The SE215 doesn't sound much like the old SE210 but it's warm and not too thin. There are build issues with the cable so far so I'd rather have a DTX101 personally. If you want something a bit more v-shaped I think the MEElec CC51 is available on amazon.co.uk. It's not very thick-sounding but it's warm and lively and not a bass monster. The ECCI PR401 is another one with a slight v-shape but I'm not sure about availability with that.
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> Klipsch makes their own BA drivers as well...though yes, it's most likely designed like your typical BA.


 

 The Klipsch ones do have sound tubes but there are some pretty common ones that don't such as the Knowles Siren.


----------



## lukeskymac

Being a full-sized headphone, is there a very large difference in SQ between the Sennheiser HD600 and DBA-02? (yeah, apples and oranges, but I'd like to know)
   
  Which handles complex passages with the best detail?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Being a full-sized headphone, is there a very large difference in SQ between the Sennheiser HD600 and DBA-02? (yeah, apples and oranges, but I'd like to know)
> 
> Which handles complex passages with the best detail?


 

 With a proper amp I'd definitely give the overall SQ edge to the HD600 but the detail resolution of the DBA-02 is very good. If that's what you're after they should more than do it for you. They really don't break down on busy passages.


----------



## Arfan

OP is awesome, can't thank enough.


----------



## IndieScent

Hi ljokerl,
   
  you think RE-262 isolation good enough for train and/or bus commuting?
   
  thanks for any reply.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





arfan said:


> OP is awesome, can't thank enough.


 


  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote: 





indiescent said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> you think RE-262 isolation good enough for train and/or bus commuting?
> 
> thanks for any reply.


 


  If you are comfortable with the thick HiFiMan biflanges they actually isolate well. Not sure if the current-rev 262s come with the channel swap adapter or not but the 272 worn over-the-ear (channels swapped) with the bi-flange tips is a 4/5 on my scale. Not Ety-like isolation but more than reasonable.


----------



## i2ehan

*@|joker|*: did you hear? The RE252 has officially been discontinued, now that they've revamped the entire head-direct site. I'm definitely hanging onto mine.


----------



## lukeskymac

Thanks! I'll get the DBA, since it's more practical and costs half the Senns.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Fischer Audio FA-788 and Skullcandy Smokin'
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3C19) Skullcandy Smokin’ Buds*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Sep 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B29) Fischer Audio FA-788*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Sep 2011
> ...


 


   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> *@|joker|*: did you hear? The RE252 has officially been discontinued, now that they've revamped the entire head-direct site. I'm definitely hanging onto mine.


 

 Yep, someone mentioned it a few pages back. I'll wait a bit and then gray it out in the table. A shame, really, as it was different enough from the 262 and 272 in sound. Perhaps they'll bring the signature back in the future.


----------



## Inks

Hope they bring back the RE252 in a different shell. That will surely be nice.


----------



## i2ehan

The current RE252's I bought were a brand new replacement sent to the original seller. Even then, less than a month in, and the HiFiMan logo on the body has practically completely faded. They've been handled with extreme care, and never used outside of home. It'd be really nice to see a revamped shell. Else, there's always the UM reshell route.


----------



## Anaxilus

Such a shame about those skullcandies.  I was looking for a nice $13 purple alternative to my IERM.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


anaxilus said:


> Such a shame about those skullcandies.  I was looking for a nice $13 purple alternative to my IERM.


 
  I'm sorry, but I found that hysterical!


----------



## DaBomb77766

Hm, so I have a rather odd question.  I have a friend who has tiny asian girl ears - so she has a hard time fitting IEMs into them.  For example, she has a pair of cheap dynamic driver ones that have a standard 5mm or so nozzle, and she says the nozzle itself won't even really fit.
   
  What would be your best recommendation for a small, preferably very cheap ($60> or somewhere around there) IEM that has a small physical footprint and a small nozzle?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> The current *RE252's *I bought were a brand new replacement sent to the original seller. Even then, less than a month in, and the HiFiMan logo on the body has practically completely faded. They've been handled with extreme care, and never used outside of home. It'd be really nice to see a revamped shell. Else, there's always the *UM reshell *route.


 

 ?


----------



## i2ehan

Whoopsie! That shouldn't have read UM reshell, just reshell. Goes to show you what's on my mind!


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Hm, so I have a rather odd question.  I have a friend who has tiny asian girl ears - so she has a hard time fitting IEMs into them.  For example, she has a pair of cheap dynamic driver ones that have a standard 5mm or so nozzle, and she says the nozzle itself won't even really fit.
> 
> What would be your best recommendation for a small, preferably very cheap ($60> or somewhere around there) IEM that has a small physical footprint and a small nozzle?


 

 UE700, q-Jays.
  
   
  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Whoopsie! That shouldn't have read UM reshell, just reshell. Goes to show you what's on my mind!


 

 AFAIK only Thousand Sound offer dynamic driver reshelling, and only in orders of 5+, which starts to make sense when you realise the excess bank transfer fee's and shipping costs involved when dealing with China.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> UE700, q-Jays.


 


  Yeah, those were the first that came to mind, but...well, they cost about 3-4x too much.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Such a shame about those skullcandies.  I was looking for a nice $13 purple alternative to my IERM.


 






   
  They are actually more hot pink than purple - not enough light in my photo. Really loved testing these outside...
   


  Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Hm, so I have a rather odd question.  I have a friend who has tiny asian girl ears - so she has a hard time fitting IEMs into them.  For example, she has a pair of cheap dynamic driver ones that have a standard 5mm or so nozzle, and she says the nozzle itself won't even really fit.
> 
> What would be your best recommendation for a small, preferably very cheap ($60> or somewhere around there) IEM that has a small physical footprint and a small nozzle?


 


  First choice - dB Logic EP-100 plus a set of (small?) Shure Olives. By far the smallest dynamic-driver IEM I've come across and a great combination for those with small/sensitive ears. Only potential downsides are the over-the-ear form factor and the bulky y-split. I'd also consider the Soundmagic PL50 and maybe something from Klipsch - Custom 1 or S3 in that price range, though neither is particularly small.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> First choice - dB Logic EP-100 plus a set of (small?) Shure Olives. By far the smallest dynamic-driver IEM I've come across and a great combination for those with small/sensitive ears. Only potential downsides are the over-the-ear form factor and the bulky y-split. I'd also consider the Soundmagic PL50 and maybe something from Klipsch - Custom 1 or S3 in that price range, though neither is particularly small.


 


  Hm...I don't see if there's a way to get those in Canada though.  Their store seems to be amazon-based and only ships to the United States. Being in Canada is a pain...
   
  I noticed that something by Etymotic would probably be the perfect form factor, but they are rather pricey.


----------



## kiteki

Yes, except the PL50 sounds like a dead fish.
   
  What _are_ the balanced armature's in existence under $75, anyway? ^^


----------



## kanuka

meelec a151


----------



## lukeskymac

I've read another review that was also extremely positive of the DBA-02, yet it remarks that it can "sound congested" in busy parts. AFAIK he was testing it unamped This has me worried. How true do you find this claim? Can this be rectified with an amp? Would the PFE be any better than the DBA-02 in this respect?


----------



## Inks

Not true at all, the DBA02 is very fast and can keep up with busy parts better than most. It doesn't have a big sound though, so it won't sound as powerful as other IEMs. Not really a problem of not being able to keep up with information, more having to do with a compressed dynamic range that takes the authority out of powerful passages. The PFE is better at this but it still has a thin note like the DBA02.


----------



## lukeskymac

I'm not sure I follow. I understand it won't sound as "powerful" as IEMs that possess some coloration (at lows and highs, I presume?), but the PFE also being "thin" (apparently a bit more bass-light than the DBA-02), how can it be superior in this aspect? Does the PFE extend farther than the DBA-02? Because that would be unexpected considering how higher the DBA-02 scored on the multi-review.
   
  Alas, I am nothing but a head-fi n00b, so I may be messing up with some terms.


----------



## Inks

Because the PFE has a bigger dynamic range, it will portray loud passages more loud than the DBA and soft ones, softer. The DBA02 actually extends farther at both ends, but the dynamic range of the PFE is big and thus swings more energy.


----------



## lukeskymac

Actually I may have misinterpreted the reviewer's words:
   
   
  Quote: 





> But, to me, it’s never the individual traits that make or break an IEM, rather the overall presentation. DBA-02 does not force me to focus on any one aspect particularly. It just resolves things quickly and stands out of the way. At first, it felt like before you can think “This is…” …. “great!”, it has already moved up two notes ahead. It’s a bit confusing and complex passages seemed a bit congested. Instrument Separation does not strike you at all. With time, I realized it’s more natural and dare I say a bit musical.
> 
> Going back to RE0, I still like how it pauses on a few milliseconds, allowing me to enjoy a note. PFE, being a BA has similar speed, but due to it’s smoother presentation, it never struck me as much as DBA-02. With more listening across genres, there were smaller nuances that keep hitting me now and then. A few things that I’ve not observed in other IEMs came out clearly to the fore front as a result of DBA-02’s presentation.






   
  BTW, this is the link: http://www.techenclave.com/audio-zone/dba-02-definitely-better-audio-175683.html
   
  He may have referenced to the *extra* detail being somewhat confusing *to the listener*, in a way an IEM that "melds" such complex passages wouldn't be. OMG, he's actually praising it for micro detail! If that's the case, this may well be the *perfect* IEM for my needs/budget. I think I now understand your comparison, Inks. Thanks
   
  Now, could someone clarify the bass performance of the Soundmagic PL30? ljokerl commented on it being "tight and accurate, but not particularly impactful. Switching to the bass-heavy setting bumps up the bass very little."
   
  I am asking because I thought about convincing my sis to buy a pair, being dirty cheap and easier for us to get (Brazil) than other options thanks to Focal Price. She used to have  a pair of Skullcandy Ink'ds which she claimed to enjoy because of the bass and used to say that my ADDIEMs "sound too much like a cheap radio" (you may mentally kill her in various ways, if you please), but lost, I mean, "misplaced" one of her tips.
   
  Now she doesn't want the PL30's because I told her the sound was more balanced. The strange thing is, though, that she claims to like punchy bass yet the Ink'd had, to my memory, smooth, boring bass. Are the PL30's punchier in any way? Even if she doesn't end up liking them I can still steal the accessories *grin*.


----------



## Varley

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> I've read another review that was also extremely positive of the DBA-02, yet it remarks that it can "sound congested" in busy parts. AFAIK he was testing it unamped This has me worried. How true do you find this claim? Can this be rectified with an amp? Would the PFE be any better than the DBA-02 in this respect?


 

 DBA is one of the fastest IEM's I've heard


----------



## lukeskymac

As long as the DBA-02 doesn't sound unnaturally "tame", I think I can live with that.


----------



## Varley

I think the DBA's may sound 'thin' at first, depending on what IEM's you're used to - I came straight from the Klipsch S4 - Once you get used to them they are fantastic though, I kinda wish I still had mine - But I think the RE262's do a better job for me


----------



## Slow Show

I posted this in the IEMs/portables advice thread, but this thread seems much more active so hopefully it's okay to repost here.
   
  I'm looking for some IEMs to replace my Sleek Audio SA6s. Budget is $200-250 shipped (but I can go up to ~$300 for the right deal), use will be split between at home and commuting to work so I need decent isolation, and I'll be listening to a mix of rock, electronic and rap. In terms of sound signature I'm looking for something similar to the SA6s (ie mid-centric to warm+sweet), but I'm open to anything that isn't cold and analytical or overly bass-y. Good unamped performance is key as well, as I'll be running them straight from my old first-gen Zune or Nexus S when commuting.
   
  Finally, Build quality/warranty is a priority. I take good care of my equipment but accidents happen, and between my SA6s' less-than-durable construction and a family member's TF10s recently biting the dust I'm looking for something I can use day-in day-out for years without worrying about them being turned into $200+ earplugs. In that same vein, a replaceable cable is a big plus.
   
  I'm currently leaning towards either the Ortofon e-Q5s or MTPCs (big thanks to ClieOS and ljokerl for their threads). I'd prefer the Ortofons as I find the MTPCs to be more than a little gaudy (and after years of telling people "monster cables=monster rip-off, it's hard to wrap my head around dropping $200+ on their earphones), but the MTPCs have a hell of a warranty and I like the pile of accessories it comes with (I've never really been able to find the right tips for my SA6s and hate the idea of $200+ earphones being hampered by the lack of proper-fitting tips that probably cost the manufacturer less than $0.10, so the big selection is welcome).
   
  Other models I'm considering are TF10s (unfortunately I never got the chance to really experience my family member's pair, but he loved them and the replaceable cable is a plus), GR07s (I keep reading the build quality is great but they always look cheap in pictures, and the price seems to be creeping up from the old $150-170), SE215s (the price is right and I like the replaceable cable and olives, but the sound quality might be a bit below what I'm looking for) and Westone 2s/UM2s (can't get a good read on these either way -- seem to be very love-it/hate-it). I've also just found that the Audio Technica ATH-CK10s are still available and mostly like what I've read, but they're a little on the pricey side and sound like they might be a little on the cold-sounding side.
   
  Any help/suggestions/recommendations would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Actually I may have misinterpreted the reviewer's words:
> 
> BTW, this is the link: http://www.techenclave.com/audio-zone/dba-02-definitely-better-audio-175683.html
> 
> He may have referenced to the *extra* detail being somewhat confusing *to the listener*, in a way an IEM that "melds" such complex passages wouldn't be. OMG, he's actually praising it for micro detail! If that's the case, this may well be the *perfect* IEM for my needs/budget. I think I now understand your comparison, Inks. Thanks


 

 The "reviewer" in question did not have a good vocabulary or better grasp of terms as now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. You should read his later opinion in another review to know what he now thinks of DBA-02.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> The "reviewer" in question did not have a good vocabulary or better grasp of terms as now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  Oh hi there! Thanks for the review(s), but this only seems to make my doubts between the PFE and DBA-02 return =P. It seems that the PFE is a little lighter bass-wise, but it also seems that it can be corrected through an amp (and I intend to buy a Fiio E7). Considering an amped PFE and the DBA, we now have sheer extension and speed vs dynamic range. Since both share the same price and the PFE is prettier and comes with better accessories, unless the DBA captures considerably more detail, I seem to be leaning towards the PFE now.
   
  EDIT: Or not...
   
  Quote: 





> *Headfonia*
> The music flows a little bit more as opposed to the surgical precision of the ER4. Soundstage-wise, the Phonak is slightly wider compared to the RE-0 and ER4; however, imaging-wise, the sound is a bit diffused in the soundscape. You trade off some of imaging precision for soundstage width. I was listening to this choir track, and I had some trouble imagining the localization of the sound, the size of the room; it just doesn’t add up to a clear image.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Yes, except the PL50 sounds like a dead fish.
> 
> What _are_ the balanced armature's in existence under $75, anyway? ^^


 


  Well, there's the A151...it's supposed to be quite good, better than the PL50 at least.  And yeah, I already have a pair of PL50s, but my brother's using them.  Not sure about the form factor though...my GR07 just barely seemed to fit into the concha of her ear...something closer to, say, the HF5 in form factor would most likely be ideal.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





varley said:


> I think the DBA's may sound 'thin' at first, depending on what IEM's you're used to - I came straight from the Klipsch S4 - Once you get used to them they are fantastic though, I kinda wish I still had mine - But I think the RE262's do a better job for me


 


  My current 'phones are ADDIEMs. It can't get much thinner than it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Hm...I don't see if there's a way to get those in Canada though.  Their store seems to be amazon-based and only ships to the United States. Being in Canada is a pain...
> I noticed that something by Etymotic would probably be the perfect form factor, but they are rather pricey.


 


  I guess if you really wanted to you could email db logic and ask. The Klipsch S2 has somewhat of an Ety form factor (more like MC5 in size than the ER6/HF5), with a thin nozzle.


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Yes, except the PL50 sounds like a dead fish.
> 
> What _are_ the balanced armature's in existence under $75, anyway? ^^


 

 A151, Custom 1, Addiem, Auvio Armature, H2O Surge Pro Mini, UHP336/SuperFi3, SuperFi 4, SuperFi 5, Dunu Crius

 And many I haven't heard - Elago E7, Brookstone Armature, Handstands Armature, Altec UHP606/MZX606, Creative Zen Aurvana,  Shure SE110, etc.
   


  Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Now, could someone clarify the bass performance of the Soundmagic PL30? ljokerl commented on it being "tight and accurate, but not particularly impactful. Switching to the bass-heavy setting bumps up the bass very little."
> 
> I am asking because I thought about convincing my sis to buy a pair, being dirty cheap and easier for us to get (Brazil) than other options thanks to Focal Price. She used to have  a pair of Skullcandy Ink'ds which she claimed to enjoy because of the bass and used to say that my ADDIEMs "sound too much like a cheap radio" (you may mentally kill her in various ways, if you please), but lost, I mean, "misplaced" one of her tips.
> 
> Now she doesn't want the PL30's because I told her the sound was more balanced. The strange thing is, though, that she claims to like punchy bass yet the Ink'd had, to my memory, smooth, boring bass. Are the PL30's punchier in any way? Even if she doesn't end up liking them I can still steal the accessories *grin*.


 

 PL30 has a bit less bass than an Ink'd. The E30 has significantly more and the E10 has even more than that. The E10 is a fantastic "fun" IEM in its price category.
   


  Quote: 





slow show said:


> I'm looking for some IEMs to replace my Sleek Audio SA6s. Budget is $200-250 shipped (but I can go up to ~$300 for the right deal), use will be split between at home and commuting to work so I need decent isolation, and I'll be listening to a mix of rock, electronic and rap. In terms of sound signature I'm looking for something similar to the SA6s (ie mid-centric to warm+sweet), but I'm open to anything that isn't cold and analytical or overly bass-y. Good unamped performance is key as well, as I'll be running them straight from my old first-gen Zune or Nexus S when commuting.
> 
> Finally, Build quality/warranty is a priority. I take good care of my equipment but accidents happen, and between my SA6s' less-than-durable construction and a family member's TF10s recently biting the dust I'm looking for something I can use day-in day-out for years without worrying about them being turned into $200+ earplugs. In that same vein, a replaceable cable is a big plus.
> 
> ...


 


  I've never heard the SA6 but from your description I don't think the CK10 or TF10 are what you're after. The Westone 2 might be a touch too analytical as well. Not sure what the UM2 is like. The SE215 is a step down from the rest.
   
  If you want to go dynamic I would definitely recommend the RE262 instead of the MTPC for what you want but of course it doesn't have that kind of warranty. The e-Q5 is very nice but it's only slightly warm. The e-Q7 is a bit warmer but its construction impressed me less.


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> The "reviewer" in question did not have a good vocabulary or better grasp of terms as now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Slow Show

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've never heard the SA6 but from your description I don't think the CK10 or TF10 are what you're after. The Westone 2 might be a touch too analytical as well. Not sure what the UM2 is like. The SE215 is a step down from the rest.
> 
> If you want to go dynamic I would definitely recommend the RE262 instead of the MTPC for what you want but of course it doesn't have that kind of warranty. The e-Q5 is very nice but it's only slightly warm. The e-Q7 is a bit warmer but its construction impressed me less.


 

 I'm probably overstating the warm+sweetness of the SA6s, as on second thought they're more of a mid/balanced; the main thing is I'm trying to avoid the cold, analytical side of things. Something musical and slightly warm without overdoing it, if that makes sense.
   
  And yeah, that's sort of where I'm stuck in terms of e-Q5 vs e-Q7 -- the e-Q7 seems like it's a bit better suited signature-wise and it comes with that nice carrying case, but the e-Q5 is better built and about $50 cheaper.


----------



## Inks

> Originally Posted by *lukeskymac* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> Oh hi there! Thanks for the review(s), but this only seems to make my doubts between the PFE and DBA-02 return =P. It seems that the PFE is a little lighter bass-wise, but it also seems that it can be corrected through an amp (and I intend to buy a Fiio E7). Considering an amped PFE and the DBA, we now have sheer extension and speed vs dynamic range. Since both share the same price and the PFE is prettier and comes with better accessories, unless the DBA captures considerably more detail, I seem to be leaning towards the PFE now.
> 
> EDIT: Or not...


 
    Why not get a ZO instead of an E7 to improve the bass? The accessories shouldn't be a deal-breaker as they aren't going to give you anything that stands out. The DBA02 does have better isolation and it is more detailed. Why not get a B2 instead? They're a bit cheaper and look "prettier" than the DBA02 while being pretty much the same product.


----------



## infernojim

Bought the dtx 101s in the end joker. will let you know how i find them.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





inks said:


> Why not get a ZO instead of an E7 to improve the bass? The accessories shouldn't be a deal-breaker as they aren't going to give you anything that stands out. The DBA02 does have better isolation and it is more detailed. Why not get a B2 instead? They're a bit cheaper and look "prettier" than the DBA02 while being pretty much the same product.


 

 I hadn't heard of the ZO before =p . I've read the ABi review and am both excited and skeptical at the same time (I guess I'm one of those "purists" that'll only use it up to half processing...). Won't I miss a "dedicated" amp when paired with the 2010 iPod nano?
   
  As for the B2, well, it's more sleek, sure, but I favor blue to red and like the "nerdy" look of the DBAs, so it's pretty much a draw in that area...
   
  BUT it comes with a hard case and Comply tips, and free international shipping. Only thing stopping me from forgetting about the DBAs is that they reportedly sound a *tad* better (less harsh highs, better bass extension), but I read a review from a pre-production unit, so I'll keep looking.


----------



## lukeskymac

Final production models are reportedly almost identical to DBA-02.
   
  However, they are actually listed as $170 at mp4nation. So there goes the price advantage. The question now is whether the looks and extra accessories are worth the extra $10


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Final production models are reportedly almost identical to DBA-02.
> 
> However, they are actually listed as $170 at mp4nation. So there goes the price advantage. The question now is whether the looks and extra accessories are worth the extra $10


 


 There's also the availability and customer service advantage


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> There's also the availability and customer service advantage


 

 Customer service, lol 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Oh screw it, I'll get the DBAs. I prefer blue, they are cheaper, come with tri-flanges and I like their "MASTER ƒ SERIES" logo. Yes, I took THAT in account '-'
   
  Edit: I also think I'll avoid the ZO for now. After the brief hype period I passed through, I am now again *extremely* skeptical, and afraid it might ruin the balance.
   
  Edit 2: Actually, I'll get the B2's. And they may as well be the cheaper ones, due to free shipping. Oh well, I have like a week or two before I have enough money, so my opinion will probably swing back and forth during that time =P
   
... Unless...
   
I've never used foam tips, though I'm aware of their properties. I'm also aware that they lose their sponginess over time. How much time can a pair last?
   

 Can I use Sony Hybrids with these? Are they even recommendable over the stock tips? (DBA and B2)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





infernojim said:


> Bought the dtx 101s in the end joker. will let you know how i find them.


 

 Good choice 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Can I use Sony Hybrids with these? Are they even recommendable over the stock tips? (DBA and B2)


 


  You would have to mount them on something as the B2/DBA nozzle is too thin to be natively compatible with Hybrids. I don't know how well they work because I didn't bother.


----------



## Inks

> Originally Posted by *infernojim* /img/forum/go_quote.gif


 


> Bought the dtx 101s in the end joker. will let you know how i find them.


 
    The Beyers are nice. They have good isolation and are very thoughtfully built. They can also be very fun if you like a bass driven sound, enjoy.


----------



## infernojim

Received them today. can't wait to give them a whirl at lunch!


----------



## th3answer

hello there,
  i've been reading this informative thread for quite some time and im thinking of a noticeable upgrade for HF5. Any advice for me? i like clear details.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> The Beyers are nice. They have good isolation and are very thoughtfully built. They can also be very fun if you like a bass driven sound, enjoy.


 

 Interestingly enough they are also at least 90% similar to what the Bowers/Wilkins C5 sounds like. B&W went for the same sound signature but unfortunately didn't improve actual sound quality. Combine that with the DTX 101 being smaller, lighter, and more comfortable, less microphonic (since it can be worn cord-up), and arguably better-built and it's pretty clear which one I'd recommend with that $100 price difference. 
   

  Quote: 





th3answer said:


> hello there,
> i've been reading this informative thread for quite some time and im thinking of a noticeable upgrade for HF5. Any advice for me? i like clear details.


 

  Depending on what you'd like improved specifically and how much you're looking to spend - GR07, EX600, EX1000, RE272, DBA-02/B2, e-Q5 (or one of the FAD ones), and maybe the W2.


----------



## sphinxvc

Joker, any plans to review the SR-003?


----------



## infernojim

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Interestingly enough they are also at least 90% similar to what the Bowers/Wilkins C5 sounds like. B&W went for the same sound signature but unfortunately didn't improve actual sound quality. Combine that with the DTX 101 being smaller, lighter, and more comfortable, less microphonic (since it can be worn cord-up), and arguably better-built and it's pretty clear which one I'd recommend with that $100 price difference.


 

 Had a quick blast at lunch time listening to a few old favourites, Massive Attack, Radiohead and so on. Also cracked out Lamb - Gorecki, as there is so much going on in that song to challenge any earphone / hi-fi tech. Sounded incredible; great but not overpowering bass, really wide soundstage, and the isolation was brilliant as well.
   
  Also feel very well built, and as you say are tiny and really comfortable to wear. L-shape jack is always a big plus for me too, which I know Shure's don't have!
   
  So far, am very happy with them. Looking forward to some more listening on my homeward commute!
   
  Thanks for the tip, as I would most likely have gone for the Shure's or Phonak's without guidance, and the more I read (and listen) the more I think these were the better bet for me.


----------



## Chloe

Thank you so much for these reviews, ljokerl. I have a question about the Soundmagic PL21; I hope it's okay to ask here. Do you find they fit comfortably when worn with the cable straight down? I was a bit concerned after reading DervishD's post about them that they aren't comfortable when worn this way. I have long hair and want to avoid having to wear the cable over ear if possible, so perhaps another pair would be more suited?


----------



## th3answer

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Depending on what you'd like improved specifically and how much you're looking to spend - GR07, EX600, EX1000, RE272, DBA-02/B2, e-Q5 (or one of the FAD ones), and maybe the W2.


 


  thanks for your reccommendations! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 personally, i am more inclined towards the dba-02.Which of the above would be the best performing let's say out of a portable fiio E7?  Would like to have same amount of clarity ( if not better amount of clarity) with decent amount of base ( with hf5 being too base shy without any EQ).  budget is not a problem as long as it is worth it every extra buck. Having said that, i would not like to jump into any expensive IEMs without thorough research on it though. Does the DBA-02 have alot of issues with build quality?  Sorry for asking so many questions


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Joker, any plans to review the SR-003?


 

 Not at this time
   


  Quote: 





infernojim said:


> Had a quick blast at lunch time listening to a few old favourites, Massive Attack, Radiohead and so on. Also cracked out Lamb - Gorecki, as there is so much going on in that song to challenge any earphone / hi-fi tech. Sounded incredible; great but not overpowering bass, really wide soundstage, and the isolation was brilliant as well.
> Also feel very well built, and as you say are tiny and really comfortable to wear. L-shape jack is always a big plus for me too, which I know Shure's don't have!
> 
> So far, am very happy with them. Looking forward to some more listening on my homeward commute!
> ...


 

 Sounds good, glad you like them. I think all of the new Shures have L-plugs although they are very different from the ones Beyer uses.
   


  Quote: 





chloe said:


> Thank you so much for these reviews, ljokerl. I have a question about the Soundmagic PL21; I hope it's okay to ask here. Do you find they fit comfortably when worn with the cable straight down? I was a bit concerned after reading DervishD's post about them that they aren't comfortable when worn this way. I have long hair and want to avoid having to wear the cable over ear if possible, so perhaps another pair would be more suited?


 

 As long as you don't have small ears they should be okay. The nozzle is angled slightly and that driver bulge isn't that big. If you can afford the new E10, however, I'd go for that as it is a sizable improvement over the PL21 in sound quality and has a more conventional form factor. 


  Quote: 





th3answer said:


> thanks for your reccommendations!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 They are all top tiers so no real winner there. They should all be able to match the HF5 in clarity, too. If you want a bit more bass I would maybe go dynamic with the GR07 or EX600 (though the DBA-02 will already have more bass than your Etys). The EX600 doesn't isolate too well and looks a bit funky (like all of the EX monitors) but otherwise it can compete with the GR07 pretty well.
   
  Regarding build quality issues, you'd have to ask in the long DBA-02 thread as I have hands-on experience with an insignificant sample size of 1 unit. I've seen some reports of DBA-02 problems but then it has been one of the more popular IEMs here in the past year so that's about what I'd expect.


----------



## lukeskymac

I've been eyeing the GR07's and I realized I don't quite know what my favorite sound signature actually IS like.
   
  I originally embraced the ADDIEM's analytical nature due to the extra clarity, but also because I despise big, boomy and texture-less (?) bass, which is so common on lower-end audio and most people seem to love and relate with "good sound" (cough, skullcandy, cough). However, I am nonetheless underwhelmed with its bass. It's like parts of it sound alright, amplitude-wise, at least, and others are very low, and not necessarily just the sub-bass. It's like a bass hump, but that part of the bass that is present doesn't sound natural, maybe that's the "BA bass" people talk about, at least the bad part of it, since DBA-lovers are quick to protect its bass.
   
  I started looking for detail, clarity, detail, imaging, and more detail, but that's just because I want something better than the ADDIEMs. After I read how the DBAs trade dynamic range for detail, I realized that maybe much of that _should have been _micro-detail, and is instead thrown at you. After reading about the GR07's, I found them to be an impressive all-rounder, with punchy and textured bass that doesn't creep up, along with excellent mids and highs, with effortless sound, a jack of all trades, master of none. Except that, compared to the ADDIEMs, they'll truly sound masterful, and more true to the source. Not to mention they seem to be better built and more comfortable.
   
  Is that truly the case? Forgive me if I make them sound like TEH PERFECT IEMs, but I want to know if they're what I think they are, and I think the difference between them and the ADDIEMs will be as night and day as the one between the ADDIEMs and my sis' Ink'd buds.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Sounds like you'd probably like something like the DBA02, B2 or something by Etymotic...but yeah, your description of the GR07 seems about right.  They are pretty great sounding.  Only real flaw to me is a bit of a treble peak that adds a bit of sibilance...but that's not much of a problem if you listen with a lower volume.
   
  I've never heard the ADDIEMs before though, so I can't really compare the two.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> I've been eyeing the GR07's and I realized I don't quite know what my favorite sound signature actually IS like.
> 
> I originally embraced the ADDIEM's analytical nature due to the extra clarity, but also because I despise big, boomy and texture-less (?) bass, which is so common on lower-end audio and most people seem to love and relate with "good sound" (cough, skullcandy, cough). However, I am nonetheless underwhelmed with its bass. It's like parts of it sound alright, amplitude-wise, at least, and others are very low, and not necessarily just the sub-bass. It's like a bass hump, but that part of the bass that is present doesn't sound natural, maybe that's the "BA bass" people talk about, at least the bad part of it, since DBA-lovers are quick to protect its bass.
> 
> ...


 

 I don't think you'll find anything lacking in the GR07 coming from the ADDIEM. Maybe it's not quite as smooth in the treble but the bass depth and punch should surprise you and you won't be left wanting for clarity or detail. To be honest coming from the ADDIEM even the DBA-02 should have noticeably more bass but since, as you said, you aren't sure of the type of sound you like I'd consider the GR07 (or its rival, the EX600) a good (safer) choice. To be fair there probably is a larger difference stepping up to the ADDIEM from the ink'd but then the ADDIEM is (normally) 6-7x the price of the SK.


----------



## lukeskymac

The EX600 is not in your multi-review, so I can't quite position it in relation to the other IEMs, but I'm looking at some other posts, such as 3602's review. It's strange really, he seemed to criticize it a lot (the "worst isolation for an IEM ever" and "wind noise" parts made me quite nervous). Can you do a straight comparison between them? Let's not forget that they cost some $30 more. Not that I would object to paying that if it's worth it.
   
  Just as I thought I would settle for the GR07, here comes another candidate. Please avoid feeding my curiosity for other IEMs or I think I'll never make a decision. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Edit: Seem like Inks prefer the EX600


----------



## Inks

I actually like the GR07 more now mainly because of the bigger lower treble peak of the EX600. They're very close technically though but the GR07 is more ergonomic. My biggest gripe against the GR07 is it's dynamic range.


----------



## lukeskymac

Dynamic range again? Is there any IEM that satisfies you on that front?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> The EX600 is not in your multi-review, so I can't quite position it in relation to the other IEMs, but I'm looking at some other posts, such as 3602's review. It's strange really, he seemed to criticize it a lot (the "worst isolation for an IEM ever" and "wind noise" parts made me quite nervous). Can you do a straight comparison between them? Let's not forget that they cost some $30 more. Not that I would object to paying that if it's worth it.
> 
> Just as I thought I would settle for the GR07, here comes another candidate. Please avoid feeding my curiosity for other IEMs or I think I'll never make a decision.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Outside of sound quality the EX600 is nearly identical to the EX1000 so you can get a good approximation of how it will do. Sound-wise it is very close to the GR07 but unfortunately I can't do extensive A:B at the moment as Inks has my GR07 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I did listen to them side by side in the past and had trouble splitting them on technical performance (though I think I like the signature of the GR07 better myself). I felt the EX600 had a touch more mid-bass punch and rolled off earlier, had more elevated treble on the whole, and slightly warmer mids.
   


  Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Dynamic range again? Is there any IEM that satisfies you on that front?


 

 Can't answer for Inks but there are a couple of sets I felt had a noticeable leg up on the GR07 in dynamics - EX1000, FX700, SM3, Miracle


----------



## Mr Artistic

Now that I've tested the waters and found that my hearing is capable enough to enjoy IEMs, I think I'm ready to take the plunge onto a higher-class IEM(mid-fi I'm assuming). I've bought the MEElecs M9 and later M6 which thoroughly satisfied my ears, but I'm looking for something a bit more better on mids, just as good bass (or at least sufficient and full), and good treble and clarity. Also a better soundstage and better depth. My candidates are the *Xears XE200PRO*, *Shure 215*, *Silver Bullets*, *Sunrise IE*, *NE-700X*, the *ECCI PR401*. I listen to alot of hip hop, R&B, and jazzy,blues, pop(or whatever you consider the Adele/Norah Jones/Sara Bareilles category) alongside with alternative mixed in and Daft Punk somewhere in there. Well enough with the details, which of these do recommend for me IjokerI based what I listen to and prefer in sound?


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Can't answer for Inks but there are a couple of sets I felt had a noticeable leg up on the GR07 in dynamics - EX1000, FX700, SM3, Miracle


 

 They cost $500, $370, $370 and $900 respectively 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Are there really any IEMs better _at this price range?_


----------



## Inks

lukeskymac said:


> Dynamic range again? Is there any IEM that satisfies you on that front?


 
  The RE262 is in this price range and have a limitless dynamic range. They will drain the battery of your player though unless an amp is used. The GR07 should be fine though, dynamic range is also very relative to the recordings and even the player being used. So I wouldn't worry about it so much, the GR07 is one of the best all-rounders that's ergonomic in this range. Every IEM has it's flaws, don't let one flaw fool you into thinking it's not for you unless it's an aspect you really value based on vast experience.


----------



## i2ehan

Inks description is spot on, as usual. 
   
  By the way, I got my first ever Ortofon's today, the e-Q5 (late comer, I know 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). They sounded a little treble happy at first, but the Comply T-400's took care of that altogether. Their sound is overall extremely well balanced (at least to my ears), and I honestly can't find any one area of their spectrum I dislike. I hate to sound redundant, but once again, the Zo never ceases to amaze me. The synergy between the two is just awesome, no ifs and buts! On another note, I don't think I've ever worn something quite as comfortable as the e-Q5's, though the CK10 isn't too far behind. Quite impressed with the sound coming out of them, especially considering how tiny they are. They weren't kidding when they said good things come in small packages. The e-Q7 is also headed my way, and I've high expectations for it now that I've heard the e-Q5; though I have a hard time deciding where my preference falls, balanced vs. mid-centric. It's like the CK10 vs. CK100 all over again, both of which I'm quite fond of.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mr artistic said:


> Now that I've tested the waters and found that my hearing is capable enough to enjoy IEMs, I think I'm ready to take the plunge onto a higher-class IEM(mid-fi I'm assuming). I've bought the MEElecs M9 and later M6 which thoroughly satisfied my ears, but I'm looking for something a bit more better on mids, just as good bass (or at least sufficient and full), and good treble and clarity. Also a better soundstage and better depth. My candidates are the *Xears XE200PRO*, *Shure 215*, *Silver Bullets*, *Sunrise IE*, *NE-700X*, the *ECCI PR401*. I listen to alot of hip hop, R&B, and jazzy,blues, pop(or whatever you consider the Adele/Norah Jones/Sara Bareilles category) alongside with alternative mixed in and Daft Punk somewhere in there. Well enough with the details, which of these do recommend for me IjokerI based what I listen to and prefer in sound?


 


  All of those are good products and should be an upgrade over the M9/M6. If you want bass quantity close to the M9 I would go with the NE-700X or Shure SE215 (or the Beyer DTX101, which I prefer over the nuforces). If you're willing to give up some of that bass quantity - the Sunrise IE.


  Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> They cost $500, $370, $370 and $900 respectively
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Not saying either is a better buy on that basis alone but if we're talking about objective sound quality it's worth mentioning a product's weaknesses in comparison to a higher-tier standard. Not crap like SK Smokin' because that would be a long list but for mid-fi products and up it makes sense.

 Forgot about the RE262 as well though I never got the chance to A:B it with the GR07


----------



## th3answer

really hope to hear someone post a comparison soon. i'm on the verge of getting a gr07 due to its relatively low cost as compared to ex600/dba02 and even my HF5s in my country. if it is really the ultimate winner i will go for it


----------



## Mr Artistic

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> All of those are good products and should be an upgrade over the M9/M6. If you want bass quantity close to the M9 I would go with the NE-700X or Shure SE215 (or the Beyer DTX101, which I prefer over the nuforces). If you're willing to give up some of that bass quantity - the Sunrise IE.


 
   
  Thanks for the input man. I'm going to do some research on the Shure SE215s, ECCI PR401, and the XE200PROs (since it's on sale right now) before I decide on taking the plunge.


----------



## lukeskymac

Well, if I weren't moving soon and if Brazil's postal service employees weren't in a strike, I would have already ordered the GR07, so I'm sending you all a big "Thank You!" for helping me in this decision.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Bowers & Wilkins C5 and Future Sonics Atrio MG7
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2A17) Future Sonics Atrio MG7 Pro*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Apr 2011
> ...


----------



## OnlinePredator

The MG7 says it's reviewed in April 2011.


----------



## kanuka

hey joker 
  why is that you find turbine-like housing have a good isolation ? what's the difference with straight-barrel? both being dynamics


----------



## Bart1981

If you guys would replace the Q-jays with other IEMs with a little bit more bass, and which can go a bit louder, which ones would that be? (in the same price category as the Q-Jays)
  According to the comparison list, I would say the Westones 2. But after reading some reviews I would say the Westone UM2.


----------



## OrEoH

Very nice review ...


----------



## Confispect

*(2A17) Future Sonics Atrio MG7 Pro*
   

*Goes off to cry somewhere. *


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> The MG7 says it's reviewed in April 2011.


 


  That may have been when I started it but I'll change it for consistency. Thanks.


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker
> why is that you find turbine-like housing have a good isolation ? what's the difference with straight-barrel? both being dynamics


 

 The housings are straight-barrel on the Turbines but they are rounded at the front so they act as a sort of 'plug' for the ear canal when inserted deep enough. Plus Turbines aren't vented as far as I can tell which is somewhat rare with other dynamics.

  
  Quote: 





bart1981 said:


> If you guys would replace the Q-jays with other IEMs with a little bit more bass, and which can go a bit louder, which ones would that be? (in the same price category as the Q-Jays)
> According to the comparison list, I would say the Westones 2. But after reading some reviews I would say the Westone UM2.


 

 I don't think the W2 is bassier than the q-JAYS. I haven't heard the UM2 but the UM3X is definitely bassier, as are the earsonics stage monitors (SM2, SM3). They are all pretty different overall from the dry and somewhat trebly q-JAYS, though. If I were you I'd look at some dynamic-driver monitors, maybe the GR07 or EX600. The UM3X and the Earsonics go louder but I don't think the GR07 or EX600 lack sensitivity.
  
  Quote: 





oreoh said:


> Very nice review ...


 

 Thanks!
   


  Quote: 





confispect said:


> *Goes off to cry somewhere. *


 


  Seem to have that effect on people lately. Luckily there's no B&W C5 fan club yet.


----------



## Confispect

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Seem to have that effect on people lately. Luckily there's no B&W C5 fan club yet.


 

 Muhahahhahaahah it was a joke preferences differ that's reality I'm glad it's up though will you be getting any more customs?


----------



## yjt93

I just bought the W3 I like the exciting sound sometimes. But i find that sometimes it's too overwhelming, like the instrument and bass cover up the vocal sometimes. does this happen with UMX3 or the W4?


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> The MG7 says it's reviewed in April 2011.


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That may have been *when I started* it but I'll change it for consistency. Thanks.


 

 Though it feels that long, you started reviewing MG7 in August 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Was looking forward to it for sometime.
   
_PS_: It amazes me how you still manage to go through Skullcandy's - that's sacrifice of the highest order


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


yjt93 said:


> I just bought the W3 I like the exciting sound sometimes. But i find that sometimes it's too overwhelming, like the instrument and bass cover up the vocal sometimes. does this happen with UMX3 or the W4?


 

 In short, no, not to my ears. The W3 is known to have a v-shaped signature, in which case the highs and lows are slightly elevated, while the mids are slightly pushed back in comparison. Neither the UM3X or W4 share this, and vocals have a good bit of warmth and presence with the UM3X, while with the W4, they aren't at all recessed, nor pushed forward, bur rather in balance with the rest of the spectrum. Just my 2 cents.


----------



## ZV3

Finally some love for the Future Sonic MG7. I actually got rid of my beloved Monster Turbine Golds because the Atrio's beat the Turbines at their own game, Bass! The sub-bass on the Atrios is stupendous, but they surprisingly
  don't forget about the mids or highs at all, it's all there. The Atrios are great and I am going to have a hard time finding something else with so much thumping, pumping Bass!


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Great reviews for the MG7/C5!
   
  Hope the review for the TF10s is in the works


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





confispect said:


> Muhahahhahaahah it was a joke preferences differ that's reality I'm glad it's up though will you be getting any more customs?


 


  Hopefully, although there have been some issues with customs duties and such for the one I really wanted 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote: 





yjt93 said:


> I just bought the W3 I like the exciting sound sometimes. But i find that sometimes it's too overwhelming, like the instrument and bass cover up the vocal sometimes. does this happen with UMX3 or the W4?


 

 That's what happens with a v-shaped sound signature. As i2ehan said, the UM3X is great with vocals as it was built as a professional monitor and the W4 is just a lot more balanced in the sense that nothing overwhelms anything. So no, that wouldn't happen with either of those.


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Though it feels that long, you started reviewing MG7 in August
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 And I have more garbage in store for you all over the coming months 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Bet everyone is excited about the Section 8 buds.
   
  I have to admit that I can still very easily enjoy my music with the Smokin' buds. In fact, the earphone that gets the most eartime from me outside of reviewing is probably the H2O Audio Flex (though admittedly the sound of that is not at all offensive). Use it at the gym and also around the house while doing menial tasks. I just toss it in the sink at the end of the day and then leave it to dry overnight.


  Quote: 





zv3 said:


> Finally some love for the Future Sonic MG7. I actually got rid of my beloved Monster Turbine Golds because the Atrio's beat the Turbines at their own game, Bass! The sub-bass on the Atrios is stupendous, but they surprisingly
> don't forget about the mids or highs at all, it's all there. The Atrios are great and I am going to have a hard time finding something else with so much thumping, pumping Bass!


 

 I don't see the Atrios being beat at _their_ own game in the near future, not by anything I've heard or read about. The JVC FX500/FX700 and Monster MD also have deep-reaching bass as well as good mids and highs but they all have more mid-bass than the Atrios and thereby a different sound profile overall. 


  Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> Great reviews for the MG7/C5!
> 
> Hope the review for the TF10s is in the works


 


  Hoping to start posting UE reviews very soon and make my way towards the TF10, thus forcing myself to finally write it up.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The housings are straight-barrel on the Turbines but they are rounded at the front so they act as a sort of 'plug' for the ear canal when inserted deep enough. Plus Turbines *aren't vented* as far as I can tell which is somewhat rare with other dynamics.


 
  does that mean NO wind noise?!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> does that mean NO wind noise?!


 


  Wind noise is still an issue with fully sealed IEMs because you can hear the wind passing over the outside of the housings. Even the flush and fully sealed MEElec M6 has some wind noise for me when biking downhill.


----------



## Selenium

Wind noise with the Turbine line is very minimal. Same with the Miles Davis. I don't think they're vented either. I walk my dogs with them all the time and have almost never noticed any wind noise.


----------



## mcnoiserdc

I never felt or heard any winde noise with monster turbine line earphones.
  
  Quote: 





selenium said:


> Wind noise with the Turbine line is very minimal. Same with the Miles Davis. I don't think they're vented either. I walk my dogs with them all the time and have almost never noticed any wind noise.


----------



## ljokerl

Yep, wind noise will be minimal with sealed earphones but the only way to ensure zero wind noise is to use something that fits completely inside the canal.


----------



## Ikarios

Wind noise when walking and wind noise when going 30mph on a bike are two different things 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  speaking of wind noise, how do customs fare on that front? They are typically more flush to your ears, so I would expect less wind noise...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ikarios said:


> speaking of wind noise, how do customs fare on that front? They are typically more flush to your ears, so I would expect less wind noise...


 


  Which type of wind noise? I have not gotten any while walking with any of my customs and I have not risked taking one on a bike ride. I would guess on a bike the only wind noise you would get from the air passing over the outside of it, as with an M6. Silicone or solid-fill customs might have an edge in that regard, too.


----------



## Bazirker

|joker|, excellent review of the MG7 Atrios.  I'd say you pretty well nailed it, especially in your discussion of the high end and how it has changed over time.  Did you notice a substantial difference in sound between the stock biflanges and Shure Olives? I find the Olives overly dark, Comply tips less so but still lacking compared to the biflanges.  Are there any universal IEM's which you would say provide better isolation?  For my ears, Atrios to have superb isolation compared to the limited selection of other IEM's I've heard.  I'm attending CanJam and am trying to pick a few IEM's to track down and listen to  
   
  Also, this is THE most epic forum thread.  On the entire Internet.  Period.


----------



## kanuka

then why i dont get any wind noise with the pl50? i'm sure i dont get the best seal with them but no wind noise. is it because it's a BA??


----------



## Armaegis

I suppose one could always wear a headband to reduce wind noise...


----------



## jTizMLG

Looking For Around $20 Earbuds. Please Help!
   
   
  I'm looking for a neutral sound, some-what noise canceling, decent bass, and I'm going to be using the Sansa Clip+ with it.
   
  I found this on Amazon....good buy?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bazirker said:


> |joker|, excellent review of the MG7 Atrios.  I'd say you pretty well nailed it, especially in your discussion of the high end and how it has changed over time.  Did you notice a substantial difference in sound between the stock biflanges and Shure Olives? I find the Olives overly dark, Comply tips less so but still lacking compared to the biflanges.  Are there any universal IEM's which you would say provide better isolation?  For my ears, Atrios to have superb isolation compared to the limited selection of other IEM's I've heard.  I'm attending CanJam and am trying to pick a few IEM's to track down and listen to
> 
> Also, this is THE most epic forum thread.  On the entire Internet.  Period.


 

 I do think that like the old MG5 Atrio, the MG7 is a bit darker with Olives but I don't think they affect extension. Rather, overall treble intensity, which to be fair the MG7 has plenty of in the lower regions. I don't have Complys in this small a size and I don't like the stock foams.
  There are IEMs that isolate more - not just Etys and customs but also some ergonomic monitors from Shure, Westone, etc. There are also two other dynamics I've heard recently that isolate at least as well as the Atrios - the SE215 and the HiSound Crystal.



  Quote: 





jtizmlg said:


> Looking For Around $20 Earbuds. Please Help!
> 
> 
> I'm looking for a neutral sound, some-what noise canceling, decent bass, and I'm going to be using the Sansa Clip+ with it.
> ...


 

 The J3 is alright but it's hardly bassy and errs on the bright side. Someone posted in the deal thread yesterday that you could get a MEElec SP51 for $19. I'd definitely look into that instead.


----------



## Mini0510

The 2 pm limit is really annoying!!

Anyways, back on topic, I currently own the monster turbine pro copper. I'm thinking of getting the JH13 or Unique Melody Miracle. Don't know which one to get though.

I listen to a lot of rock and hip pop music. Personally, I think Monster products just have a lot of bass, including the copper. I alway use treble booster as my EQ. The treble for copper is alot better than the original and gold, but it is still no where near the Sony MDR-EX1000. I love the treble on high end Sonys. But the bass is a bit weak. Bose quiet
And comfort 15 sound very nice and detailed. The placement of the instruments is excellent. I guess these descriptions gives you can idea what I'm expecting.

Wondering if upgrading from turbine copper to UM miracle or JH13 would be a big difference?

Thanks.


----------



## Ultrazino

This list urgently needs the UE-4. I have a demo set in my ears right now. In front of me are lying the W4, JH5, TF10 and some more.
  I can't - for the sake of god - tell if I prefer the W4 or UE4! Somebody has to do this decision for me! 
   
  W4: 356,90 €
  UE-4: 460 €
   
  The only problems I have with the W4 are veiled (not recessed) mids and mediocre timbre. The UE4 does both much better and adds an incredible soundstage. But it might be fatiguing after a while and I doubt the customs will be more comfortable.
   
  Please help!


----------



## Mini0510

customs are much more comfortable because they are made just for you...


----------



## Ultrazino

I don't think so. Customs don't have tips, so they trap the air in your ear canal. This is very uncomfortable when moving your jaw or on a plane. The W4 are extremely comfortable with Complys.


----------



## Mini0510

ya I guess. Overall, your ears are not very comfortable on a plane


----------



## Mini0510

if you dont mind the fatigue, then go for UE-4.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> The 2 pm limit is really annoying!!


 

 Replied to your PM.
   


  Quote: 





ultrazino said:


> I don't think so. Customs don't have tips, so they trap the air in your ear canal. This is very uncomfortable when moving your jaw or on a plane. The W4 are extremely comfortable with Complys.


 

 Is this statement based on experience with real customs or guesswork?


----------



## Ultrazino

Quote:  





> Is this statement based on experience with real customs or guesswork?


 

 It's based on experience with the demo pair and almost all universal IEMs with silicone tips that do not have vents.


----------



## Bazirker

Quote: 





ultrazino said:


> It's based on experience with the demo pair and almost all universal IEMs with silicone tips that do not have vents.


 


  Demo pair = NOT customs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bazirker said:


> Demo pair = NOT customs.


 

 This is true. I was actually surprised by the lack of a 'suction' feeling with full-shell customs, which can be glimpsed from the 'comfort' section of my 1964-T review on the front page. There isn't really a sensation of seal as there is with silicone-tipped universals.


----------



## Ultrazino

Ok, so the guy who gave me the JH-5 and UE-4 demos (and TripleFi 10, and W4, and SE535, ...) told me to go with universals if they are comfortable. The acryl shell is very hard and he also agreed that the trapped air can be uncomfortable. I have very sensible ears and I ripped my eardrum before, so this is a huge matter for me.
  He also hinted to the option of modding vents in the housing but he warned me of the effect that bass will loosen up and have fewer quantity.
   
  I would take the W4 if it wouldn't sound cramped and veiled. God dammit Westone, what have you done?!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ultrazino said:


> Ok, so the guy who gave me the JH-5 and UE-4 demos (and TripleFi 10, and W4, and SE535, ...) told me to go with universals if they are comfortable. The acryl shell is very hard and he also agreed that the trapped air can be uncomfortable. I have very sensible ears and I ripped my eardrum before, so this is a huge matter for me.
> He also hinted to the option of modding vents in the housing but he warned me of the effect that bass will loosen up and have fewer quantity.


 


  A large part of it depends on the skill of the person making the customs. If you wanted to go custom you could ask for the tips to be cut short or rounded at the front. The hard shell is not a problem as they are tailored to your ears, unless you are doing something that would cause them to be pushed further in than they're supposed to go. It's not like the W4 shell is gummy soft, either.


----------



## james444

I think it's somewhat strange if you don't get suction with a well-fitted pair of customs. I get extremely strong suction with my UERMs, if I put them in as far as they go, i.e. with open mouth and a moderate amount of pressure. They literally feel like glued to my ears that way, with great isolation and no discomfort.

But there's a downside and it's occlusion effects. Footfall noise during walking makes it undesirable to listen to anything subtle, like classcal pieces. Even with stationary listening the increased sensation of hearing your own pulse, etc. may be too distracting for quiet and subtle music.

So, even though I've little to complain about my customs' sound quality, there are plenty of situations when I end up picking a universal instead.

(Btw @Ultrazino and others who PMed, due to my smartphone-only access to HF I'm currently unable to reply to PMs, sorry for the inconvenience) think it's somewhat strange if you don't get suction with a well-fitted pair of customs. I get extremely strong suction with my UERMs, if I put them in as far as they go, i.e. with open mouth and a moderate amount of pressure. They literally feel like glued to my ears that way, with great isolation and no discomfort.

But there's a downside and it's occlusion effects. Footfall noise during walking makes it undesirable to listen to anything subtle, like classcal pieces. Even with stationary listening the increased sensation of hearing your own pulse, etc. may be too distracting for quiet and subtle music.

So, even though I've little to complain about my customs' sound quality, there are plenty of situations when I end up picking a universal instead.

(Btw @Ultrazino and others who PMed, due to my smartphone-only access to HF I'm currently unable to reply to PMs, sorry for the inconvenience)


----------



## james444

^ Sorry, the forum editor and my phone's browser don't like each other


----------



## RealSlimSeto

ultrazino said:


> Ok, so the guy who gave me the JH-5 and UE-4 demos (and TripleFi 10, and W4, and SE535, ...) told me to go with universals if they are comfortable. The acryl shell is very hard and he also agreed that the trapped air can be uncomfortable. I have very sensible ears and I ripped my eardrum before, so this is a huge matter for me.
> He also hinted to the option of modding vents in the housing but he warned me of the effect that bass will loosen up and have fewer quantity.
> 
> I would take the W4 if it wouldn't sound cramped and veiled. God dammit Westone, what have you done?!




They are a little veiled in the mids but IMO they don't sound cramped.


----------



## Ultrazino

Thank you to all of you. I already decided in favor of the Westone 4.
  The UE-4 has incredible voices but I prefer a well rounded overall package. To my ears, the W4 are cramped, but after 15 minutes I don't notice it anymore.
  The JH-5 sounds too rough and it just feels too much aimed at Rock music for my taste. Not bad at all, though.
   
  I will stick to the FX700 for when I need some power. I also liked the TF10 (which are sadly unusable due to the faulty design) but the timbre of the JVC is the one feature that the W4 lacks.
   
  This combination should be all the portable sound glory I can ask for before I jump to high end customs.
  Next purchase: I might have to take a closer look at the Edition 8... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  God, I love this hobby!
   
  @James: Thank you for lending me both your IEMs. I will send them out early on Tuesday if that's alright (Monday is holiday).


----------



## pjaires

Dear Friends I need an advice!!! Please.
   
  I want to upgrade from old etymotic 6i, and my new (which a do not like much...Atrio M5)...

 I will use my new in ears with my ipod classic, my 2stepdance meier-audio amp, with an, qable Coppercab ipod lod....

 So now I have 3 options:

 - Vsonic GR 07 - 109£

 - Fischer Audio Tandem - 75£

 - Hisound goldem crystal - 120£

 I love the confort of my little 6i etymotic...and I think I prefer down use that over the ear....I have also an Ultimate fi 3 studio, and I don't use it because I feel it disconfort....

 What do you recomend?
   
  thanks for your answers,....
  Paulo


----------



## rawrster

^
  Have you thought of getting a pair of the Brainwavz B2?


----------



## pjaires

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> ^
> Have you thought of getting a pair of the Brainwavz B2?


 


  Hi To be honest, since I live in Portugal, I have to choose something I could get...within some prices and offer, from an european seller....
  I've read several high rating reviews about the vsonic gr07, the Fischer Audio products are also high appreciated in reviews and foruns, and the hisound are great products, I have an amp3 pro2 player and an pair of is entry level IEM, that I found great, teh cost me more or less 25 euros!!!!
  So I was thinking in one of this 3....
  One problem to me is the confort!!! If I have the best IEM in world and I feel disconfot with them....
  So I can use my etymotic 6i, with triple flanges for hours..., also the hisound IEM, but I bought a pair of Atrios M5 and I just can't use then for more then 20 or 30 minutes!!!(I'm selling them...) and I think they sound very well....
  My only problem is that there ins't any detailed review of both the FA tandem, and the HS golden crystal!
  Anway many thanks for your answer.
  Paulo


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





pjaires said:


> Hi To be honest, since I live in Portugal, I have to choose something I could get...within some prices and offer, from an european seller....
> I've read several high rating reviews about the vsonic gr07, the Fischer Audio products are also high appreciated in reviews and foruns, and the hisound are great products, I have an amp3 pro2 player and an pair of is entry level IEM, that I found great, teh cost me more or less 25 euros!!!!
> So I was thinking in one of this 3....
> One problem to me is the confort!!! If I have the best IEM in world and I feel disconfot with them....
> ...


 


  If you order the B2 from MP4nation, they'll ship for free, but it may take an upwards of a month to get to you!  Just pointing that out.


----------



## Inks

GR07 is fairly comfortable, but the Golden Crystal will be a notch more comfortable. I have used the regular Crystal and it actually surpassed the GR07 in comfort and isolation for me. Since the Golden Crystal uses the same housing, it should be the same. Not sure about it's sound though, the regular Crystal did have a very solid performance for it's price though.


----------



## pjaires

Quote: 





inks said:


> GR07 is fairly comfortable, but the Golden Crystal will be a notch more comfortable. I have used the regular Crystal and it actually surpassed the GR07 in comfort and isolation for me. Since the Golden Crystal uses the same housing, it should be the same. Not sure about it's sound though, the regular Crystal did have a very solid performance for it's price though.


 

 Many thanks for your answer....
  From the 3 options I must confess that my favourite were the GR07 and the golden crystal....My real problem is the lack of reviews of the gold hisound....but I read some of the "normal" and all rate very high the crystal IEMs.
  Now the gold model is told that it is the smallest *dynamic drivers in the world!!!!*
   
*Can you please help from just see the specifications of both hisound IEMs?*
   
*GOLD Crystal: *

 Impedance 16 Ohm Cable Length 124cm Sensitivity 110dB Acccessories 2 Sets of Bi Flanges, 3 Sets of Triple Flanges, 3 Silicone Ear Tips (S/M/L), 5 Sets of Hybrids, Leather Box Frequency Range 15 - 23,000 Hz Driver 5mm dynamic driver
   
*"Normal" crystal: *

 Impedance 16 Ohm Cable Length 124cm Sensitivity 108dB Acccessories 3 Silicone Ear Tips (S/M/L), Storage Case, Shirt Clip Frequency Range 17 - 23KHz Driver 7mm dynamic driver
   
  As far as I can see the specifications are very simillar. So the sound should be very equal?!
   
  You can the the offers:
   
  - http://shop.frogbeats.com/hisoundaudio-golden-crystal
   
  - http://shop.frogbeats.com/hisoundaudio-crystal
   
  Thanks for your help....kind regards
  Paulo


----------



## pjaires

<<I have used the regular Crystal and it actually surpassed the GR07 in comfort and isolation for me.>>
   
  And in terms of sound quality?!
  Are any extreme diferences?


----------



## Inks

Yes there are differences in signature and performance. The GR07 was noticeably better, but nothing "extreme". The Crystals were more V shaped, but still fairly well-rounded. 
   
  No matter what the GC will be more of a gamble as reviews are scarce, whereas the GR07 have proven themselves. Still, I would be surprised if the GC end up being some sort of big disappointment based on my experience with the regular Crystal. 
   
   
  Had no idea the Golden Crystal was using a 5mm driver, that sure is small. I'm going to assume the Miles Davis Trumpet also uses a 5mm driver as it's also claimed to be the smallest driver in the world. Would be funny if it's the same driver.........


----------



## pjaires

Quote: 





inks said:


> Yes there are differences in signature and performance. The GR07 was noticeably better, but nothing "extreme". The Crystals were more V shaped, but still fairly well-rounded.
> 
> Hi again
> Please escuse my ignorance...what do you mea "crystals were more* V shaped"?*
> ...


----------



## Inks

This is when there's more bass and treble and the midrange is put back (and the extent of this depends on how "v-shaped" it is.


----------



## pjaires

<<The GR07 was noticeably better, but nothing "extreme">>
  Hi again and I promisse this will be my last question 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Can you please reveal a little more of the yours opinion: the GR07 *was noticeably better,* but nothing "extreme"....
  Thanks in advance
  Paulo


----------



## Inks

I wish I could, but I didn't have both in hand for that long to go more in-depth in comparisons. Technically I'll probably rate the Crystals at around the same level as the Xcape IE, if that helps. The Crystals are like a blend of the Silver Bullet with the Meelec CC51. The signature is kind of like the SB, while the presentation resembled the CC51 but with more enhanced space. 
   
  When I said noticeably better, I meant it in technical terms. In terms of preferece, it may be a lot closer for you. There's a lot of variables that are subjective, unless you know what you really want, can't go wrong either way.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





james444 said:


> I think it's somewhat strange if you don't get suction with a well-fitted pair of customs. I get extremely strong suction with my UERMs, if I put them in as far as they go, i.e. with open mouth and a moderate amount of pressure. They literally feel like glued to my ears that way, with great isolation and no discomfort.
> But there's a downside and it's occlusion effects. Footfall noise during walking makes it undesirable to listen to anything subtle, like classcal pieces. Even with stationary listening the increased sensation of hearing your own pulse, etc. may be too distracting for quiet and subtle music.


 


  I'm up to four acrylic-shelled customs now and I don't think I've ever felt suction with any of them. My ears aren't very waxy and there's just no sensation of 'seal' at all. I only know they are sealed by the sound. There is no variability in terms of insertion depth with mine, either - they always go in equally far. I do not get significant occlusion effects - no pulse and no more footstep noise than with the average (sealed) universal. My ear canals do flare out a bit towards the bend so maybe that has something to do with it.


  Quote: 





pjaires said:


> Dear Friends I need an advice!!! Please.
> 
> I want to upgrade from old etymotic 6i, and my new (which a do not like much...Atrio M5)...
> I will use my new in ears with my ipod classic, my 2stepdance meier-audio amp, with an, qable Coppercab ipod lod....So now I have 3 options:- Vsonic GR 07 - 109£
> ...


 

 My two cents - the Tandem is not in the same league as the GR07 technically and not at all similar in sound signature. I do not have a Golden Crystal. My regular Crystal is very nice but I wouldn't even say it's tops for the $130 price. Certainly not top-tier as the GR07 is. I agree with Inks that it's Xcape IE / RE-ZERO level (ish) technically but I still like the Xcape IE a bit better. There is no doubt that the Crystal is much better-built, more isolating, and more comfortable than the Xcape, though. If you have access to Fischer stuff I would consider the DBA-02 or SBA-03 as well.


----------



## pjaires

Dear Friends
  Thanks for all your advices...But I just order the Vsonic GR07!!!
  Since Frogbeats has an 7 days return policy, if I have any fiting and confort issues, i just can send the GR07 back and order the Hisound Crystal Gold
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  But if know any review of the HS crystal gold, please send me the link....
   
  PS- Today I received my meier audio 2stepdance amp....and let me say...what a fantastic amp!!!! It is just the one!!!


----------



## Niyologist

Must....get.....Brainwavz....M4!


----------



## Inks

130$ is a bit too much for the Crystal if that's their retail price. It's very nice ergonomically  and very solid in sound, but I still like the RE-Zero, Xcape IE a bit more. 
   
  The Golden Crystal sounds very interesting though (specially how it compares to the Trumpet), hope you get a review pair @ joker. If it happens, I could probably get a Monster Trumpet out to you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Must....get.....Brainwavz....M4!


 


  I was told these are not made by ViSang like the rest of the Brainwavz M-models and are supposed to be even more balanced than the M3. Quite curious as to how they sound.


  Quote: 





inks said:


> 130$ is a bit too much for the Crystal if that's their retail price. It's very nice ergonomically  and very solid in sound, but I still like the RE-Zero, Xcape IE a bit more.
> 
> The Golden Crystal sounds very interesting though (specially how it compares to the Trumpet), hope you get a review pair @ joker. If it happens, I could probably get a Monster Trumpet out to you


 

 I don't think there's an official price for the Crystal but figures I've seen indicate $120-130. The Golden Crystal would need to be significantly better to compete with other top-tiers. Love the form factor, though, and I think the GC has an L-plug which is my (very minor) quibble about the Crystal.


----------



## SoulSyde

@joker, I just want to say "Thank You!" for this thread.  I refer to it several times a week.  It's an absolutely amazing resource.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

ljokerl, have you heard the Brainwavz B2's? If you have, how do they compare to the GR07s? They both seem to be in the same, high-middle range, so it seems natural to compare them. If not, has anyone else heard both that would like to comment?


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think there's an official price for the Crystal but figures I've seen indicate $120-130. The Golden Crystal would need to be significantly better to compete with other top-tiers. Love the form factor, though, and I think the GC has an L-plug which is my (very minor) quibble about the Crystal.


 


  Is there a USA dealer for the Golden Crystals?


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> ljokerl, have you heard the Brainwavz B2's? If you have, how do they compare to the GR07s? They both seem to be in the same, high-middle range, so it seems natural to compare them. If not, has anyone else heard both that would like to comment?


 


http://www.head-fi.org/t/574125/review-brainwavz-b2
   
  Try asking here.


----------



## FlySweep

Worst. Screen Name. Ever.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> http://www.head-fi.org/t/574125/review-brainwavz-b2
> 
> Try asking here.


 

 Thanks, didn't see that. He seems to like the B2 a lot, so that seems to be a point in favor of the B2
   


  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Worst. Screen Name. Ever.


 
  Sorry... It's not meant to be pronounced, it's just a username... Also, it's very distinctive, so wouldn't that make it a good screen name?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





soulsyde said:


> @joker, I just want to say "Thank You!" for this thread.  I refer to it several times a week.  It's an absolutely amazing resource.


 

 Awesome, glad the thread comes in handy so often

  
  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> ljokerl, have you heard the Brainwavz B2's? If you have, how do they compare to the GR07s? They both seem to be in the same, high-middle range, so it seems natural to compare them. If not, has anyone else heard both that would like to comment?


 

 I've only heard the pre-production B2. For all intents and purposes the final version should score very similarly to the DBA-02 evaluated in this thread. Yes, they are natural competitors with the GR07 - I would recommend the B2/DBA-02 if you're looking to maximize resolution and speed and the GR07 if you'd rather have a slightly less analytical signature with more bass.
   


  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Is there a USA dealer for the Golden Crystals?


 

 None that I know of. Not sure about the price, either. I seem to remember ~$250 but I could be off the mark on that.


----------



## Inks

Well Frogbeats has the Golden Crystal for about 200$ with shipping. Interesting how they're found in the "studio-monitor" section of their site, you could also hope a coupon in the future.


----------



## shotgunshane

I'll keep an eye on frogbeats for sales and hopefully any possible reviews/impressions to pop up around here.  I really like the idea of an IEM that small and if the sound can compete with the Monster Trumpets without the ridiculous looks, I'm in.


----------



## kanuka

@joker
   
  having the pl50 , do you consider the a151 a decent/major upgrade in SQ, keeping a good fit/comfort and maybe more isolation?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





inks said:


> Well Frogbeats has the Golden Crystal for about 200$ with shipping. Interesting how they're found in the "studio-monitor" section of their site, you could also hope a coupon in the future.


 

 they do have a 10% off coupon


----------



## Inks

Oh yeah and 15% for students I believe.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think there's an official price for the Crystal but figures I've seen indicate $120-130. The Golden Crystal would need to be significantly better to compete with other top-tiers. Love the form factor, though, and I think *the GC has an L-plug* which is my (very minor) quibble about the Crystal.


 
  they do
  
  (yay my #500 post)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> @joker
> 
> having the pl50 , do you consider the a151 a decent/major upgrade in SQ, keeping a good fit/comfort and maybe more isolation?


 


  No, not a major upgrade. I think the A151 is tuned a little bit better in many ways and it doesn't have that overly creamy, stuffy midrange of the PL50 but otherwise it's just not a big step up. The isolation is better but it's not as small as a PL50 so it may be less comfortable.


----------



## Bola 7

ljokerl, 

Congratulation by great work!

Your reviews help me very.

Thank you!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  how about treble, any more sparkle?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> ljokerl,
> Congratulation by great work!
> Your reviews help me very.
> Thank you!


 







  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> how about treble, any more sparkle?


 

 No. From the A151 review:
   
  Quote: 





> The treble itself is clean, clear, *low on sparkle*, and slightly laid-back


----------



## impruv

Hey joker, great thread and I have spent a great deal of reading time and time again. I currently have the Meelec m9s and thought they were great [the start of my audiophile journey?] I'm not sure if you are familiar with Shure 750DJ closed headphones but I recently got those a few months ago and I'm looking for something with a similar sound in an IEM. It has a very fun, punchy, bass and it has been great for dubstep/house/hip hop. Going back to the m9s they just sounded so flat and empty so I wanted some IEMs that would fit the bill. Any suggestions?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impruv said:


> Hey joker, great thread and I have spent a great deal of reading time and time again. I currently have the Meelec m9s and thought they were great [the start of my audiophile journey?] I'm not sure if you are familiar with Shure 750DJ closed headphones but I recently got those a few months ago and I'm looking for something with a similar sound in an IEM. It has a very fun, punchy, bass and it has been great for dubstep/house/hip hop. Going back to the m9s they just sounded so flat and empty so I wanted some IEMs that would fit the bill. Any suggestions?


 

 Wouldn't expect the M9s to compete with a $150+ DJ can but I'm afraid I'm not familiar with any of Shure's full-size headphones. If you're looking for fun and bassy and more 3-D sounding than an M9 you may want to look at some of the Xears models, Beyer DTX101iE, or original Turbines, but hopefully someone with a 750DJ can chime in with more specifics.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Hey, when are you planning on putting up the UE reviews?  I've been waiting for those since I first read this thread!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Hey, when are you planning on putting up the UE reviews?  I've been waiting for those since I first read this thread!


 


  Aiming for this year


----------



## Niyologist

DUNU's makin' Customs!?


----------



## kanuka

can you suggest something close to the re262, but on the sub $100 (or even lower)?
  just not the spider realvoice or the Xcape IE
  A151, CC51, Xears TD? or something else?


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Aiming for this year


 

  
  suure


----------



## some1

Is it possible you could add the 2 TFTA varieties to your test?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> can you suggest something close to the re262, but on the sub $100 (or even lower)?
> just not the spider realvoice or the Xcape IE
> A151, CC51, Xears TD? or something else?


 

 No, not really. The RE262 is stupid good at $149. I'm not aware of anything that's close <$100 aside from the IE. Maybe the Fischer SB but if you weren't comfortable with the Xcapes, you won't like the Fischers.
   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> suure


 

 You know me too well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   

  Quote: 





some1 said:


> Is it possible you could add the 2 TFTA varieties to your test?


 
   
  Unlikely due to the massive backlog. See the FAQ on the front page of this thread.


----------



## nickknutson

Dang, son! This is quite an impressive thread! I've been away from the HP game for a few years, came back looking for some earphones for my laptop and found this amazing write-up!
   
  Thank you!


----------



## Dirian

I need IEM's for iPod Nano 2G for ~ 100$. Any suggestion? Can MEE A151 or CC51 be good?


----------



## Austin Morrow

You should try and review the new Soul IEM's by Ludacris. I've heard they suck, but want to hear your opinion.


----------



## Bazirker

Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> You should try and review the new Soul IEM's by Ludacris. I've heard they suck, but want to hear your opinion.


 

 lol
   
  How bout you try them and give us your opinion?


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





bazirker said:


> lol
> 
> How bout you try them and give us your opinion?


 

 Haha, bad sarcasm on my part, but Joker usually reviews EVERYTHING.


----------



## estreeter

People, I knew that if I waited long enough the ESW9 would drop to meet my meagre budget. 269 AUD delivered, at a time when the Pacific Peso is spiralling down to 90 US cents, makes me very, very happy. These cans might not be at the very top of Joker's list, but his impressions were enough to tip me over the edge on the purchase.


----------



## Armaegis

I really enjoyed the ESW9a for the brief time that I had it. Probably one I would have liked to keep, but alas I was in a crazy trading mood and out it went. I don't even remember what I got for it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nickknutson said:


> Dang, son! This is quite an impressive thread! I've been away from the HP game for a few years, came back looking for some earphones for my laptop and found this amazing write-up!
> 
> Thank you!


 

 Thanks, glad it was useful.


  
  Quote: 





dirian said:


> I need IEM's for iPod Nano 2G for ~ 100$. Any suggestion? Can MEE A151 or CC51 be good?


 

 Sure, both are good depending on what you're after. I like the CC51 better personally.
   


  Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> You should try and review the new Soul IEM's by Ludacris. I've heard they suck, but want to hear your opinion.


 

 I know someone has to do the dirty work but I'd rather review something good instead 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			







  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> People, I knew that if I waited long enough the ESW9 would drop to meet my meagre budget. 269 AUD delivered, at a time when the Pacific Peso is spiralling down to 90 US cents, makes me very, very happy. These cans might not be at the very top of Joker's list, but his impressions were enough to tip me over the edge on the purchase.


 

 I have nothing against the ESW9 - I think it's a pleasant enough listen that looks excellent and has the best leather earpads I've seen on a portable. Enjoy!


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





armaegis said:


> I really enjoyed the ESW9a for the brief time that I had it. Probably one I would have liked to keep, but alas I was in a crazy trading mood and out it went. I don't even remember what I got for it.


 

 3 goats, a Yurt and the hand of a teenage Mongolian girl ? Seriously, what does the 'a' specify in 'ESW9a' ? I didnt know there were variants, but I live a very sheltered life and its tough keeping these goats amused in the Yurt.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Fischer Audio Tandem and HiSoundAudio Crystal

  
  Quote:


> *(2C42) HiSoundAudio Crystal*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Oct 2011
> ...


   
  Quote:


> *(2B10) Fischer Audio Tandem*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Oct 2011
> ...


   
   
   
   
  Quote:


estreeter said:


> 3 goats, a Yurt and the hand of a teenage Mongolian girl ? Seriously, what does the 'a' specify in 'ESW9a' ? I didnt know there were variants, but I live a very sheltered life and its tough keeping these goats amused in the Yurt.


   
  I think the 'A' just designates the American version. Not sure why the distinction was necessary, maybe each one gets spat in or something.


----------



## Armaegis

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> 3 goats, a Yurt and the hand of a teenage Mongolian girl ? Seriously, what does the 'a' specify in 'ESW9a' ? I didnt know there were variants, but I live a very sheltered life and its tough keeping these goats amused in the Yurt.


 

 Aw man, you mean I got gypped out of a mong.... uh, I mean nevermind, I probably got a Sennheiser or something out of it.
   
  From what I understand, the "a" is for the non-Japanese market (or maybe specifically American). A lot of companies will issue different model numbers for the same product going to different countries as a means of price control, or something like that. For example, a lot of stuff sold in Canada might have a -C or -CA appended to their product name. You can't price match those items with others that don't have it. Surprise surprise, a bunch of sale prices you see in some less reputable places won't have the designation at the end, which means they probably acquired their goods on the grey market.
   
  ...or something like that. Don't ask me, I'm no economagist


----------



## Inks

Nice reviews. Spot-on, regarding the Crystal. You really have a lot of patience and efficiency for this stuff as it's elaborate and concise. You appreciate this stuff more when you have used the IEM reviewed and the ones used in comparisons. 
   
  I wasn't expecting such a high-SQ rating for the Tandem, then again, I didn't know that was their dynamic flagship. Matter of fact, pretty impressed there are 2 9mm drivers inside that housing, that's like having the RE-Zero driver with a Monster Turbine one. Seeing as how the FXT90 is going to come your way pretty soon, they will make for a good comparison as they are also quite versatile, have a similar approach in signature (though I suspect the FXT90 is more balanced) and have a similar design (dual dynamic with no crossover).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Nice reviews. Spot-on, regarding the Crystal. You really have a lot of patience and efficiency for this stuff as it's elaborate and concise. You appreciate this stuff more when you have used the IEM reviewed and the ones used in comparisons.
> 
> I wasn't expecting such a high-SQ rating for the Tandem, then again, I didn't know that was their dynamic flagship. Matter of fact, pretty impressed there are 2 9mm drivers inside that housing, that's like having the RE-Zero driver with a Monster Turbine one. Seeing as how the FXT90 is going to come your way pretty soon, they will make for a good comparison as they are also quite versatile, have a similar approach in signature (though I suspect the FXT90 is more balanced) and have a similar design (dual dynamic with no crossover).


 

 Thanks. I agree that without a reference point a good portion of these reviews will be utterly meaningless. Leaving A:B comparisons out, however, means I'd have to generalize more and I don't like doing that at all.
   
  The Tandem took me a while to appreciate. It's not quite my sort of signature and technically it's not quite there with the GR07s and EX600s and RE262s but it is an interesting exercise and a very 'nice' listen with a non-controversial signature. It is versatile to an extent but really I don't know if you'd want to listen to grimy garage punk or 80s metal with an earphone this smooth. I also don't know how the two drivers of the Tandem differ but I know one is further from the nozzle than the other. With the FXT90 it seems that the diaphragms are made of different material but they are equidistant from the nozzle. Certainly would be interesting to compare the two.


----------



## Armaegis

I wonder what's in store for 200!


----------



## DarkAndroid

Hello peeps,
  This is probably one of the best threads around hi-fi for anyone looking to get new IEMs, and I say kudos again to Joker. After looking at the chart and some of the reviews, considering the 4 most important things for me including price, sound quality, comfort and isolation, I think the etymotic research hf5/2/3 is my best bet. But there are some other IEMs on that list that are intriguing, particularly the Audeo Phonak PFE. The VSonic GR07 and Monster Turbine are also looking good too. I plan to use the IEM I get mainly with the upcoming iPhone 4S and maybe occasionally with my desktop computer in conjunction with my Fiio E7/E9 amp if I dont feel like using my HD 598 or SRH 940 cans. All im looking for in an IEM around the $100 to $200 price point is exceptional audio quality, with mids and highs well represented with clarity. Also lively, warm and thumping bass, which I've heard the etymotic research hf lacks somewhat and can make them 'cold' sounding. If anyone here has heard or own any of these IEMs and can give me some insight I would appreciate it. Just want to make sure I'm getting the right IEM for me before committing to  a purchase. Thanx.


----------



## SpaceCake

I have bought the IE7 with help of you(r thread) and I see you quote the sound of the IE7 lots of times in your reviews of other IEM, why don't you write a review about the IE6/7 it seems you have listen to them quite well.
   
  btw, loving the sound of the IE7 now more and more, it's coming closer to the sound of HD595(clarity and highs) thanks again


----------



## kanuka

can someone explain in short what's "driver flex"? is it something temporary?


----------



## SkinnyPuppy

In your opinion is the TF10 the best iem in the 150 price range or is there better? I'm just wondering, i'm pretty content with my Perfect Bass's right now.


----------



## BHTX

Very interested in the *HiSoundAudio Crystal*, but can't find anyone who sells them, at least in the US.


----------



## estreeter

Guys, thanks for the clarification on the ESW9A - it fits in with the way our local distributors are able to gouge Aussies for headphones. I'm happy that I am buying mine from a legit source - the ESW9 is reportedly very popular with the fake crowd - all that bling gets them in.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> Hello peeps,
> This is probably one of the best threads around hi-fi for anyone looking to get new IEMs, and I say kudos again to Joker. After looking at the chart and some of the reviews, considering the 4 most important things for me including price, sound quality, comfort and isolation, I think the etymotic research hf5/2/3 is my best bet. But there are some other IEMs on that list that are intriguing, particularly the Audeo Phonak PFE. The VSonic GR07 and Monster Turbine are also looking good too. I plan to use the IEM I get mainly with the upcoming iPhone 4S and maybe occasionally with my desktop computer in conjunction with my Fiio E7/E9 amp if I dont feel like using my HD 598 or SRH 940 cans. All im looking for in an IEM around the $100 to $200 price point is exceptional audio quality, with mids and highs well represented with clarity. Also lively, warm and thumping bass, which I've heard the etymotic research hf lacks somewhat and can make them 'cold' sounding. If anyone here has heard or own any of these IEMs and can give me some insight I would appreciate it. Just want to make sure I'm getting the right IEM for me before committing to  a purchase. Thanx.


 

 I wouldn't go with Ety if you want warm or thumping, or even the PFE or GR07. The Turbines (you should be able to get a Gold or Copper in that price range) are good all-rounders with stronger bass. Not sure how much isolation you need but the ATH-CKM99 is very much worth looking at as well. The new Atrio MG7 is also a good all-rounder despite the huge bass. 
  
  Quote: 





spacecake said:


> I have bought the IE7 with help of you(r thread) and I see you quote the sound of the IE7 lots of times in your reviews of other IEM, why don't you write a review about the IE6/7 it seems you have listen to them quite well.
> 
> btw, loving the sound of the IE7 now more and more, it's coming closer to the sound of HD595(clarity and highs) thanks again


 

 The IE7 has been a benchmark for me for a while since it does a lot of things right and a couple of things not so right. The IE6 and IE7 are both in my review queue but since they are mine they keep getting postponed.


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> can someone explain in short what's "driver flex"? is it something temporary?


 

 There's a long thread on it somewhere called "would driver flex finally kill IEMs" or something to that extent. It's usually not a problem except when inserting/removing earphones. It is not temporary - I haven't had a flex-prone IEM 'fix' itself on me.

  
  Quote: 





skinnypuppy said:


> In your opinion is the TF10 the best iem in the 150 price range or is there better? I'm just wondering, i'm pretty content with my Perfect Bass's right now.


 

 I really don't think there is a 'best' in any price range - just good sets that should be split based on preferred sound signature and functionality. I wouldn't rank the TF10 above the RE262 or EX600 or B2 technically, for example, though I am not denying that many would prefer it to those. 
   

  Quote: 





bhtx said:


> Very interested in the *HiSoundAudio Crystal*, but can't find anyone who sells them, at least in the US.


 

 Not sure if they have a US retailer at this time but I think you can have them shipped over by lendmeurears or frogbeats.


----------



## estreeter

Apropos of nothing, I'm perplexed by the fact that the FA 'Omega V2' I bought in Malaysia, and was *convinced* must be fakes due to the woeful documentation, are proving to be more durable than certain 'genuine' IEMs I have owned in the past. Sure, the bass is boomy, but I dont think this model was ever high enough on the FA ladder for anyone to be bothered faking. For the money I paid, they are currently the single best headphone purchase (in VFM terms) I have made after the KSC-75 : truly frightening when I think of the 500 AUD I paid for the SR325is. Even if they fell apart tomorrow, they will have outlasted my RE0s.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Something special for review #200?


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> You should try and review the new Soul IEM's by Ludacris. I've heard they suck, but want to hear your opinion.


 


  I've heard they are actually rather decent though, yet to try it however lol


----------



## DarkAndroid

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't go with Ety if you want warm or thumping, or even the PFE or GR07. The Turbines (you should be able to get a Gold or Copper in that price range) are good all-rounders with stronger bass. Not sure how much isolation you need but the ATH-CKM99 is very much worth looking at as well. The new Atrio MG7 is also a good all-rounder despite the huge bass.


 


  Checking out the Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Copper on Amazon, its about $279 for the Gold and $318 for the Copper. At that price range I might as well get the IE8, no? Or do the Monster Turbine Pro compare favorably to the IE8?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> Something special for review #200?


 


  Probably not. In terms of reviews written, I'm way past 200 so I just have to pick one to post. 
   
   

  Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> Checking out the Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Copper on Amazon, its about $279 for the Gold and $318 for the Copper. At that price range I might as well get the IE8, no? Or do the Monster Turbine Pro compare favorably to the IE8?


 

 If you don't mind the mic unit, you can get a Gold for <$200. The pricier Turbines compare reasonably well to IE8s. At the same price and if isolation doesn't matter I'd rather have an IE8 but that's not the case.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> Checking out the Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Copper on Amazon, its about $279 for the Gold and $318 for the Copper. At that price range I might as well get the IE8, no? Or do the Monster Turbine Pro compare favorably to the IE8?


 

 I'd take the MTPG over the IE8, but the Westone 2 are a little better than those for a little less money.


----------



## DarkAndroid

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I'd take the MTPG over the IE8, but the Westone 2 are a little better than those for a little less money.


 

  
  ahh, then I guess for me its between the Monster Turbine Pro Gold, the Sennheiser IE8 and the Westone 2...at below $200 the Westone 2 is significantly cheaper than the others though.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> Checking out the Monster Turbine Pro Gold and Copper on Amazon, its about $279 for the Gold and $318 for the Copper. At that price range I might as well get the IE8, no? Or do the Monster Turbine Pro compare favorably to the IE8?


 

 I somehow managed to get the Coppers for $189(brand new) awhile back, but they seem to be perennially out of stock ever since.


----------



## AykDaddy

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> I'd take the MTPG over the IE8, but the Westone 2 are a little better than those for a little less money.


 


  I absolutely second this post. The Westone 2 have significantly less bass than the rest of the bunch though.


----------



## ZimmerX

Joker, what packaging did you receive with the Crystal? It's been changed pretty drastically for actual commercial sales. They also include a decent amount of tips. Here is an image of the Golden Crystals with their tip selection (it is identical to the Crystals)
   

   
  3 pairs of "hybrids", 3 sets of triple flange eartips and 3 sets of different shaped single flanges (circular and stubby?). They come with all the Crystals, and the casing is different as well. However I don't have a photo of that. 
   
  The second triple flanges to the right are absolutely gigantic. The second flange on them doesn't even fit in my ear they are so big. I guess someone will use, though!
   
  Amazing reviews. Haven't given enough time to listen to the Tandem's, but now I really want to as I thoroughly enjoy long listening sessions and some IEMs can get fatiguing.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> ahh, then I guess for me its between the Monster Turbine Pro Gold, the Sennheiser IE8 and the Westone 2...at below $200 the Westone 2 is significantly cheaper than the others though.


 

 You wanted warm and thumping... the Westone 2 isn't much of either of those things.
   


  Quote: 





zimmerx said:


> Joker, what packaging did you receive with the Crystal? It's been changed pretty drastically for actual commercial sales. They also include a decent amount of tips. Here is an image of the Golden Crystals with their tip selection (it is identical to the Crystals)


 


  I got three sets of single-flange tips. For obvious reasons I can only comment on/review what I have on-hand or is listed on the manufacturer's page (which the Crystal doesn't have). I sent a link to my review to HiSound and asked them to verify the facts since info is scarce and they did not say anything about the eartips.


----------



## Donut

On my way to repairing my HJE-900s, which I like...just ordered the VSonic GR07 a couple days ago...now I see the Brainwavz B2 price drop to $130. From what I hear, the B2 is, functionally, just about identical to the Fischer Audio DBA-02, which I was also extremely curious about [yet was unable to find in stock...anywhere]. Wondering if the B2s are worth it at USD 130. Opinions?
   
  Man, I really need to take a hiatus from this website again. Every time I come back, I wind up spending money.


----------



## Bola 7

ljokerl,
   
  I am a novice here in the Head-fi, and reading your multi-iem review, i perceived that TF10 is it cited some times. Is there any special reason to you haven't published a review about the TF10 in your multi-iem review?

 Thank you very much!

 P.S.: Forgive me by the my bad english: still i am novice in beautiful and expressive shakespeare's language.


----------



## saykong

New packaging from Hisoundaudio Crystal and Gold Crystal is come with 3 pairs of "hybrids", 3 sets of triple flange eartips and 3 sets of different shaped single flanges.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





donut said:


> On my way to repairing my HJE-900s, which I like...just ordered the VSonic GR07 a couple days ago...now I see the Brainwavz B2 price drop to $130. From what I hear, the B2 is, functionally, just about identical to the Fischer Audio DBA-02, which I was also extremely curious about [yet was unable to find in stock...anywhere]. Wondering if the B2s are worth it at USD 130. Opinions?


 

 Worth it? Sure. Necessary if you have the GR07 already? Maybe not. I'd try the GR07 and see if you're left wanting something even more analytical.
   


  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> I am a novice here in the Head-fi, and reading your multi-iem review, i perceived that TF10 is it cited some times. Is there any special reason to you haven't published a review about the TF10 in your multi-iem review?Thank you very much!P.S.: Forgive me by the my bad english: still i am novice in beautiful and expressive shakespeare's language.


 


  The TF10 is on my to-do list - see the bottom of post #8 in this thread.


----------



## Donut

Thanks |joker|.
   
  By the way, this thread is one of the most useful threads ever. The time & effort you've taken [and continue to take] for this thread does not go unappreciated. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks, I appreciate that.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Nice, I agree with everything you said about the Crystal.


----------



## rawrster

This is such an epic thread..although I have no idea about the current market of universals as I'm done with them but may get a custom in the future...Reference Monitors are calling out to me after I finalize my headphone rig 
   
  Also this saves me quite a bit of work. I point people to this thread when I have friends asking me for recommendations..I just direct to this thread and go about my way


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> Nice, I agree with everything you said about the Crystal.


 

 Good to know 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   


  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> This is such an epic thread..although I have no idea about the current market of universals as I'm done with them but may get a custom in the future...Reference Monitors are calling out to me after I finalize my headphone rig
> 
> Also this saves me quite a bit of work. I point people to this thread when I have friends asking me for recommendations..I just direct to this thread and go about my way


 

 Thanks, and good to know the thread is working as intended at least some of the time. 
   
  Personally, I haven't switched to customs full-time yet - universals are often simply more practical for me. I do have another budget custom on-hand but I don't expect it to compete with the UERM.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, and good to know the thread is working as intended at least some of the time.


 


 I think we could comfortably say most of the time.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I vote for a sticky or at least a linky! I think your reviews are open enough to preference and sig that they are both useful to all and not to be confused with Headfi sponsorship.
   
  Very nice service that you're providing. I personally generally find a twfk too hot (gray Phonak is about my limit) and I know that you like it but I can read that into your reviews. I may not like the same things as you yet still make a reasonable decision based on your reviews. Thanks again.


----------



## rawrster

I think this thread works just fine for its purpose outside of the times when people disagree with the numbers you give for some earphones. I'm sure there are lurkers and people who are not registered that use this thread as a frame of reference when looking to buy something.
   
  I find customs are just better and works just fine for me. I technically don't need a second pair but I've always wanted a JHA custom and a UE so something like the JH5 and UE Reference Monitors may be in my future but my headphone rig is a bigger priority as 85-90% of my listening is done at home which was not the case when I was perfecting my portable rig which is now just down to 1 custom and my phone. Although you are free to donate customs if you ever find the need 
   
   
  edit: actually I do have my Brainwavz M2 but they just sit there as I haven't been watching tv shows with my netbook lately but don't think that will change anytime soon.


----------



## Benjamin6264

Hi ljokerl,
   
  I will soon be the owner of a pair of UM Miracles, and I was wondering if you could please share a few thoughts on how they respond to amplification (in my case the Pico Slim).
   
  Thank you!


----------



## TigerA

Hi ljokerl,
   
  First of all thanks for this very useful review thread!!
  Which one would you recommend, Brainwavz Proalpha, M1 or Soundmagic E10? You call the M1 class leading sound quality and the Proalpha's solid sound quality, but you gave the M1 just a tad higher score, 6.7 vs 7.0. It's hard for me to choose by just reading the reviews, because the Proalpha's sounds better in your review when I read it, but in the end scores lower. I'm concerned abou the M1's bass, which is lacking(?).
  The Soundmagic E10 also sounds pretty good from your review, good bass, treble and good soundstage, but also scored lower than M1, again its 6.7 vs. 7.0. It seems the M1's bass and treble is not as good as either Proalpha or E10, with the bass being underemphasized and treble less sparkly?
   
  I know that in the end it's all about preference. I have the Xears Resonance, it scored higher than all those I mentioned above, but feels it lacks bass, though has good treble but distorts a lot/can't handle busy tracks, which you mentioned in your review. I really like clear vocals, treble and bass.


----------



## Bola 7

ljokerl,
   
  What of two IEMs have less bass: Fischer Audio Eterna Rev.1 or Xears TD-III?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





benjamin6264 said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> I will soon be the owner of a pair of UM Miracles, and I was wondering if you could please share a few thoughts on how they respond to amplification (in my case the Pico Slim).
> 
> Thank you!


 

 I don't have much experience with the Pico Slim and I don't find the Miracle to benefit hugely from amping. I guess it would depend on the source as well. The best I've heard them is out of the Anedio D1 which is a bit tough to pocket. In either case I guess you will find out soon enough how they mesh with your exact setup 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   


  Quote: 





tigera said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> First of all thanks for this very useful review thread!!
> Which one would you recommend, Brainwavz Proalpha, M1 or Soundmagic E10? You call the M1 class leading sound quality and the Proalpha's solid sound quality, but you gave the M1 just a tad higher score, 6.7 vs 7.0. It's hard for me to choose by just reading the reviews, because the Proalpha's sounds better in your review when I read it, but in the end scores lower. I'm concerned abou the M1's bass, which is lacking(?).
> ...


 

 If the sound signature of the ProAlpha sounds more enticing to you, by all means go for that over the M1. I think the bass of the M1 is very well-balanced, the treble is very smooth, and the presentation is very coherent. Technically it is still the best I've heard for $40 and the easiest to go back to from a high-end IEM such as the Miracle. However, if you want bass to be slightly elevated, buy the ProAlpha. If you want bass to be significantly elevated and also to have a sizable amount of treble sparkle go for the E10. The reason there are so many IEMs considered 'great' in every price range is that there is no one correct sound signature, or at least not one everyone will like best. I really think only the E10 will do it for you if you find the Resonance bass-light.
   


  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> What of two IEMs have less bass: Fischer Audio Eterna Rev.1 or Xears TD-III?
> 
> Thanks!


 

 From memory (I only have the v2 on hand) the Eterna v1 has more sub-bass and the TD-III has more mid-bass.


----------



## TigerA

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If the sound signature of the ProAlpha sounds more enticing to you, by all means go for that over the M1. I think the bass of the M1 is very well-balanced, the treble is very smooth, and the presentation is very coherent. Technically it is still the best I've heard for $40 and the easiest to go back to from a high-end IEM such as the Miracle. However, if you want bass to be slightly elevated, buy the ProAlpha. If you want bass to be significantly elevated and also to have a sizable amount of treble sparkle go for the E10. The reason there are so many IEMs considered 'great' in every price range is that there is no one correct sound signature, or at least not one everyone will like best. I really think only the E10 will do it for you if you find the Resonance bass-light.


 


  Thanks. I was leaning towards ProAlpha, now more towards E10. You mentioned that the E10 has lots of bass, but does the music retain it's clarity? The CX300/400 has a lot of bass too, but tends to muddy up the music pretty quick. I do like bass, but i'm not neccesarily a bass head, because I still like the vocals and music to be clear. Which of the three, M1/ProAlpha/E10, in your opinion offers the best bass/treble/vocals/soundstage? Which one will have a nice balance in those four points?
   
  Do you think the Resonance is actually better than all of them? (Maybe I shouldn't read too much into the scores?) Thanks!


----------



## Benjamin6264

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't have much experience with the Pico Slim and I don't find the Miracle to benefit hugely from amping. I guess it would depend on the source as well. The best I've heard them is out of the Anedio D1 which is a bit tough to pocket. In either case I guess you will find out soon enough how they mesh with your exact setup
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I will be running them from a Cypher Labs Algorhythm Solo, so that should be good too. 
   
  Thanks for the reply!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tigera said:


> Thanks. I was leaning towards ProAlpha, now more towards E10. You mentioned that the E10 has lots of bass, but does the music retain it's clarity? The CX300/400 has a lot of bass too, but tends to muddy up the music pretty quick. I do like bass, but i'm not neccesarily a bass head, because I still like the vocals and music to be clear. Which of the three, M1/ProAlpha/E10, in your opinion offers the best bass/treble/vocals/soundstage? Which one will have a nice balance in those four points?
> 
> Do you think the Resonance is actually better than all of them? (Maybe I shouldn't read too much into the scores?) Thanks!


 


   

 For the amount of bass that it has, I think the E10 has excellent clarity but in the budget segment you can't quite have it both ways. For what it's worth the E10 is reasonably quick and has decent enough dynamics so it doesn't sound bloated. If you're a vocal lover you might find it a bit too v-shaped but then again if your Resonance isn't delivering enough bass, the ProAlpha won't do it either. Have you considered jumping to the Brainwavz M2 or Xears TD-III? They are both mid-forward and bassy while retaining decent enough treble and presentation.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  and how are they compared to the pl50 in vocal/mid-fwdness ?


----------



## TigerA

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For the amount of bass that it has, I think the E10 has excellent clarity but in the budget segment you can't quite have it both ways. For what it's worth the E10 is reasonably quick and has decent enough dynamics so it doesn't sound bloated. If you're a vocal lover you might find it a bit too v-shaped but then again if your Resonance isn't delivering enough bass, the ProAlpha won't do it either. Have you considered jumping to the Brainwavz M2 or Xears TD-III? They are both mid-forward and bassy while retaining decent enough treble and presentation.


 
  I'm in Europe and E10/M1/ProAlpha/TD-III (All Xears models) are in the same pricerange. M2 (€45) is even more expensive than any Xears model (€38). Since I already have 2 Xears models, the Resonance and XSR330PRO I wanted to try out a IEM from a different brand. But by reading your reviews i'm not sure I should go for other brands. Unfortunately I don't think you have tried the XSR because it's not a sound signature I like. I feel the bass it produces dominates a bit too much and the vocals are too much in the front, that even sometimes some words are just too hard to hear. I like them a bit further away. Maybe it's because of the XSR that I find the Resonance bass light. When I first got them I don't think they were THAT bass light, now whenever I use them again they are devoid of any bass :/
   
  The M2 scored lower than the TD-III and in it's turn it scored lower than the XE200PRO. This one and N3i are your highest scoring Xears models. Shouldn't I go for one of these instead? Though the XE200PRO is sold out atm and will be available in a walnut version later on.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





tigera said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 actually the M2 are $50 at mp4nation
   
  btw, how would you describe the XSR330PRO  signature? and also is it comfortable?


----------



## TigerA

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> actually the M2 are $50 at mp4nation
> 
> btw, how would you describe the XSR330PRO  signature? and also is it comfortable?


 

 Doesn't it take ages before those mp4nation earbuds arrive?
   
  XSR is bass heavy, a bit dominating imo. Vocals are too forward, sounds so close, like it's pushing into your brain, it loses detail, but with other songs the vocals sounds okay. With the resonance/all the other IEM I own I never had any problems with the vocal placement, but with the XSR it seems to be hit or miss, depending on the song. And soundstage could be bigger for my taste. But there are impressions from other people who really likes them, so ymmv.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





tigera said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  is not a must, but it can take a lot. for example my B2 took about 10 to arrive the country but another 10 to arrive from the post office
   
  as for the XRS. thanks for the info. i asked at xears.com about those and they said they were good with vocals and not bass-heavy. but after what you said, i wont get them for sure.
  i hope the TD will be better


----------



## TigerA

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> is not a must, but it can take a lot. for example my B2 took about 10 to arrive the country but another 10 to arrive from the post office
> 
> as for the XRS. thanks for the info. i asked at xears.com about those and they said they were good with vocals and not bass-heavy. but after what you said, i wont get them for sure.
> i hope the TD will be better


 
  Did he really say that? He told me they had SUPER BASS lol. It's even advertised on his site as having clubsound. There are other members here who also said the vocals are quite forward, but still likes the overal sound quite a bit. I think the XE200PRO has a good balance between vocals/ vocals distance/bass and treble. Too bad I went with Thomas' recommendation of XSR. I don't think you should decide to buy them or not by only reading my impressions. I am not even within 1% of Joker's professionalism in reviewing IEMs. But I did try to be as honest as possible.
   
  Here's a early impression from another member, Nuckinfutz:
   
  Quote: 





> Build quality is not as good as the XT2 Pro or Brainwavz. The earphones themselves, being made from plastic, do feel cheap I must admit but the cable is very nice I definately prefer this to the braided version that tends to tangle, and maybe even preferable to the twisted version on the Brainwavz.
> 
> Fit is good.  Being made of plastic is a slight advantage here I think, they are very light so they stay put nicely.  I'm not having much joy wearing them over-the-ear though, can't seem to get a consistant seal.  There is driver flex, like most Xears as I understand.
> 
> ...


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





tigera said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 yes, he did said that, and even twice i think. i do like fwdd vocals but not that much. let's say the pl50 fwdness is a bit too much. the main singers sound too loud while the backgroung voices are almost null
   
  yea and thanks for that impression quote


----------



## NuckinFutz

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> yes, he did said that, and even twice i think. i do like fwdd vocals but not that much. let's say the pl50 fwdness is a bit too much. the main singers sound too loud while the backgroung voices are almost null
> 
> yea and thanks for that impression quote


 

 Hi peeps.  I have updated the Xears thread with my thoughts.  I'm not certain my description of forward mids is neccessarily accurate, I think it's more a result of the very narrow soundstage that places vocals in your head that gave me this impression....it really needs someone like Joker to clarify. 
   
  On that note, Joker you are a legend!  You have been thanked a thousand times but once more won't hurt 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I appreciate your efforts so much and enjoy reading your reviews very much...thanks!  It was based on this thread and your portables thread that I purchased the ProAlpha and the CAL!  They are both bang on the sound I like.
   
  You may get a pair of XSR's in the post


----------



## jarrett

I just wanted to add that the ECCI PR401 is now $70 at lendmeurears (has been for a couple weeks) and that I think it's a wonderful sounding and overlooked IEM


----------



## NuckinFutz

Whilst I'm here, Joker can you give me some advice.  I mentioned on the Xears thread I would like to try:
   
  Dunu Trident
  Fischer Audio Eterna
  Fischer Audio Genesis
  Xears TD-III
  Xears Resonance
  HiSoundAudio Popo
  Brainwavz M2
   
  Based on myexperience with the XT2 Pro and XSR I think Xears may not be my thing.  I guess I'm after something similar to the ProAlpha but with more extention either end. I don't want anything with a narrow soundstage as I'm finding the Xears. I know you will say M2, and I will get them somewhen, but I would like to try other manufacturers.  I've left off Meelectronics from that list.....was looking at the SP51.
   
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Whilst I'm here, Joker can you give me some advice.  I mentioned on the Xears thread I would like to try:
> 
> Dunu Trident
> Fischer Audio Eterna
> ...


 
   
  i got the PoPo, and imo they're pretty heavy bass. just like the m11+, and maybe a bit more. but mids are definetly not recesed as with the m11+


----------



## jarrett

You may like the PR401, very surprising extension on both ends, soft+rich+deep bass yet pretty quick, and a much larger soundstage than your average IEM. $70 US on lendmeurears now


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Hey, ljokerl, (or anyone else who can answer this) do you think the GR07s would be a suitable upper-midrange upgrade from the A151's? I listen to mostly Indie/Alternative Rock, with some classical and miscellaneous stuff thrown in... Thanks for your work on this extremely helpful thread, btw...


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> when are you going to review the superfi4? how about the ultimate ears 350?


 


  They're all shown as "in progress" at the bottom of the thread - just be patient, I don't think he has any definitive timelines when things will be posted up.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## wilzc

The man has his life to live too you know


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> and how are they compared to the pl50 in vocal/mid-fwdness ?


 

 More so... PL50 is mid-centric but still reasonably balanced overall.

  
  Quote: 





tigera said:


> I'm in Europe and E10/M1/ProAlpha/TD-III (All Xears models) are in the same pricerange. M2 (€45) is even more expensive than any Xears model (€38). Since I already have 2 Xears models, the Resonance and XSR330PRO I wanted to try out a IEM from a different brand. But by reading your reviews i'm not sure I should go for other brands. Unfortunately I don't think you have tried the XSR because it's not a sound signature I like. I feel the bass it produces dominates a bit too much and the vocals are too much in the front, that even sometimes some words are just too hard to hear. I like them a bit further away. Maybe it's because of the XSR that I find the Resonance bass light. When I first got them I don't think they were THAT bass light, now whenever I use them again they are devoid of any bass :/
> 
> The M2 scored lower than the TD-III and in it's turn it scored lower than the XE200PRO. This one and N3i are your highest scoring Xears models. Shouldn't I go for one of these instead? Though the XE200PRO is sold out atm and will be available in a walnut version later on.


 

 The XE200PRO may not have enough bass if you find the Resonance lacking - they're pretty similar in impact. N3i might have too recessed mids if you're after vocals.. TD-III is more forward.
   


  Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> On that note, Joker you are a legend!  You have been thanked a thousand times but once more won't hurt
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, glad someone out there is still enjoying the ProAlpha (and CAL! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). 
   
  I think Thomas@Xears was going to send me one of the new models, not sure which.
   


  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> I just wanted to add that the ECCI PR401 is now $70 at lendmeurears (has been for a couple weeks) and that I think it's a wonderful sounding and overlooked IEM


 

 I agree 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Whilst I'm here, Joker can you give me some advice.  I mentioned on the Xears thread I would like to try:
> 
> Dunu Trident
> Fischer Audio Eterna
> ...


 


  I've not heard the Genesis. Looking at that list I'd recommend the Eterna over the others. It'll have more bass than the ProAlpha but also sounds more spacious and has pretty good presence across the frequency spectrum. The XE200 (when it's back in stock) might be worth considering as well.


  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Hey, ljokerl, (or anyone else who can answer this) do you think the GR07s would be a suitable upper-midrange upgrade from the A151's? I listen to mostly Indie/Alternative Rock, with some classical and miscellaneous stuff thrown in... Thanks for your work on this extremely helpful thread, btw...


 

 Depends on how much you hate the A151 because the GR07 sounds very different - brighter, a lot more impactful, and way more spacious. I do think it works well with your genres but it's not something I would peg as an A151 upgrade in terms of signature.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Thanks ljokerl! Even though I like my A151s, I haven't really been able to explore the different sound signatures out there, so I think I'll give the GR07's a try, given your recommendation for my genres of music


----------



## cocolinho

can't wait for your conclusion about
  Sunrise Xcited
  Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition
   
  thanks!!


----------



## SoulSyde

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> More so... PL50 is mid-centric but still reasonably balanced overall.


 


  Would the PL50 be the closest to the mid-range signature of the UM3X (on the cheap), or would you recommend another cheaper alternative to the UM3X?
   
  BTW, what's in store for #200?


----------



## TigerA

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The XE200PRO may not have enough bass if you find the Resonance lacking - they're pretty similar in impact. N3i might have too recessed mids if you're after vocals.. TD-III is more forward.


 


  Do you maybe know a IEM with a similar signature to the Superlux HD-668B? That is what i'm looking for in a IEM.


----------



## Ulti

Dear Joker,
   
  I've used the Xears TDIII, XE200PRO, Xi200PRO, XSR330PRO and the XGF500PRO.
   
  What would I notice if I got the SoundMagic E10s compared to to the Xears that I've tried? (I assume you've only used the TDIIIs and XE200PRO so it's great if you can give me a quick comparison!)
   
  I prefer just enough, quick tight bass, more in front vocals and clarity is quite nice. Not sure how to explain my music taste better than that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


cocolinho said:


> can't wait for your conclusion about
> Sunrise Xcited
> Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition
> 
> thanks!!


 

 I'm waiting for Sunrise to get back to me regarding what has been done about the build quality of these products

  
  Quote: 





soulsyde said:


> Would the PL50 be the closest to the mid-range signature of the UM3X (on the cheap), or would you recommend another cheaper alternative to the UM3X?
> 
> BTW, what's in store for #200?


 

 Maybe the UE600/SuperFi 5 or even Brainwavz M2 but the PL50/A151 are good as well. #200 will be something from the planned queue. No surprises, unfortunately
   


  Quote: 





tigera said:


> Do you maybe know a IEM with a similar signature to the Superlux HD-668B? That is what i'm looking for in a IEM.


 
   
  GR07, maybe, (or Soungmagic E30 on a budget) but you seem to be after more bass than that.


  Quote: 





ulti said:


> Dear Joker,
> 
> I've used the Xears TDIII, XE200PRO, Xi200PRO, XSR330PRO and the XGF500PRO.
> 
> ...


 


  Yes, I've only used two of those and they both have more upfront vocals than the E10. You might even like the E30 better than the E10, or the Brainwavz M2. Even the MEE CC51 is less mid-recessed than the E10 and has better clarity and detail overall. If you could say what you like and what you'd like improved about the XE200 and TD-III that might help narrow it down.


----------



## vrillusions

Giving you another thanks   Found a pair I liked after only the second one.  First I bought was the R02.  Sound was fine but that memory cable annoyed me so much.  Thought I could get used to getting it to stick around the ears till it "learned". Whenever I take it out of the case I have this coiled cord plugging into the laptop which is the part that really annoyed me.
   
  So 2nd one was the A151.  The cable is awesome.  The angled plug threw me off though, but once I figured that out the fit was great.  Although the medium tip that is usually fine for me was actually kinda painful with these.  Double flange fixed that.  Even with these being my first BA earphones, I can still agree with pretty much the entire review.  The sound is really accurate but also not fatiguing.  Granted my main headphone is the sennheiser HD558 so I'm used to accurate sound signatures.  I'd have like a little more bass but I'm still happy with it.  I actually like the more recessed highs since that makes these easy to listen without fatigue.  For example I played Ellie Goulding's Lights album (came out this year I think so has practically no dynamic range) with the R02.  With maybe 2 or 3 tracks left I started to get kinda fidgety and just wanted the album to end.  Did the same with the A151 and had no problems.
   
  At any rate, thanks for the review and saving me a lot of trial and error.


----------



## Armaegis

So after a couple months the upgrade bug is biting... I've currently got the Shure SE215 and am generally happy with their sound, but after having listened to them for a while I find myself wishing their clarity/detailing were better. What are some options for a step up keeping to the same form factor?
   
  Important to note: I have a *lot* of fit issues with iems. I settled with the SE215 because it actually fits me, if maybe just a tiny smidge too big, but it does hold quite securely. Straight barrel plugs do not fit me at all.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


vrillusions said:


> Giving you another thanks   Found a pair I liked after only the second one.  First I bought was the R02.  Sound was fine but that memory cable annoyed me so much.  Thought I could get used to getting it to stick around the ears till it "learned". Whenever I take it out of the case I have this coiled cord plugging into the laptop which is the part that really annoyed me.
> 
> So 2nd one was the A151.  The cable is awesome.  The angled plug threw me off though, but once I figured that out the fit was great.  Although the medium tip that is usually fine for me was actually kinda painful with these.  Double flange fixed that.  Even with these being my first BA earphones, I can still agree with pretty much the entire review.  The sound is really accurate but also not fatiguing.  Granted my main headphone is the sennheiser HD558 so I'm used to accurate sound signatures.  I'd have like a little more bass but I'm still happy with it.  I actually like the more recessed highs since that makes these easy to listen without fatigue.  For example I played Ellie Goulding's Lights album (came out this year I think so has practically no dynamic range) with the R02.  With maybe 2 or 3 tracks left I started to get kinda fidgety and just wanted the album to end.  Did the same with the A151 and had no problems.
> 
> At any rate, thanks for the review and saving me a lot of trial and error.


 

  Awesome, congrats on the happy ending 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Glad you were able to find the right signature.
   
   
  Quote:


armaegis said:


> So after a couple months the upgrade bug is biting... I've currently got the Shure SE215 and am generally happy with their sound, but after having listened to them for a while I find myself wishing their clarity/detailing were better. What are some options for a step up keeping to the same form factor?
> 
> Important to note: I have a *lot* of fit issues with iems. I settled with the SE215 because it actually fits me, if maybe just a tiny smidge too big, but it does hold quite securely. Straight barrel plugs do not fit me at all.


 

  GR07, maybe? Definitely clearer and more detailed than the SE215 and I like the form factor better, personally. The sound is more neutral and the bass is a touch less pronounced but on the whole it's an impressive performer. You could go Westone 2 and retain the ergonomic form factor but that's even farther away from the SE215 in signature.


----------



## proedros

eagerly waiting your re-272 review


----------



## TigerA

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> GR07, maybe, (or Soungmagic E30 on a budget) but you seem to be after more bass than that.


 

  I'm actually really happy with the sound signature of the Superlux HD-668B. They definitely have more bass than the Resonance. I think there's a nice balance between bass, treble and vocal clarity.
   
  I think i'll stay around the $50-70 pricerange for now. So, the E30 are similar to the Superlux? I'm not sure i'm gonna get a good fit with those. The nozzle (is that how you call it?) is angled, just like the Resonance(?) The Resonance always fall out of my ear. But with the E30 you have to wear it over the ear (?). Never tried one of those. I actually only want a step up from the Resonance as far as bass/treble and vocal clarity goes. Cuz I have to say that my opinion about the Resonance's bass output has been clouded by the XSR330PRO, that one is just a bass monster. Even the CX300-400 sounds tame compared to them.
   
  Any other suggestions? Thanks for your constant input. I really appreciate it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tigera said:


> I'm actually really happy with the sound signature of the Superlux HD-668B. They definitely have more bass than the Resonance. I think there's a nice balance between bass, treble and vocal clarity.
> 
> I think i'll stay around the $50-70 pricerange for now. So, the E30 are similar to the Superlux? I'm not sure i'm gonna get a good fit with those. The nozzle (is that how you call it?) is angled, just like the Resonance(?) The Resonance always fall out of my ear. But with the E30 you have to wear it over the ear (?). Never tried one of those. I actually only want a step up from the Resonance as far as bass/treble and vocal clarity goes. Cuz I have to say that my opinion about the Resonance's bass output has been clouded by the XSR330PRO, that one is just a bass monster. Even the CX300-400 sounds tame compared to them.
> 
> Any other suggestions? Thanks for your constant input. I really appreciate it.


 


  Yes, E30 nozzle is angled, though not very much. I don't think you'll find a full step up from the Resonance that also has more bass outside of the higher-end Xears models, and even then none of them improve on clarity. An improvement in clarity with decent bass would be something like the MEE CC51 but I don't think it's bassier than a Resonance. If you can find a Hippo VB that might be an option but it has a different sound profile.


----------



## icarus004

Hi Joker, i find the Ultimate Ears 500 for 55 $, is a good price or it's better go for Brainwavz M2, I am looking for something under 60$  and something fun with good vocals and highs.
 regards!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





icarus004 said:


> Hi Joker, i find the Ultimate Ears 500 for 55 $, is a good price or it's better go for Brainwavz M2, I am looking for something under 60$  and something fun with good vocals and highs.regards!!


 


  Very different signatures... the UE500 is a bit V-shaped in response, more of an ECCI PR401 or MEElec CC51 sound. Not quite as good as those two but close and a good deal at $55, though you can find the CC51 around that price if you're in the US. I'm not thrilled with the build quality of the UE500 but it's passable. Very lightweight and comfy, too. 
   
  The M2 will be warmer, have more pronounced bass and a significantly more forward midrange, and smoother, more laid-back treble.


----------



## ljokerl

Added HiFiMan RE272
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2A19) HiFiMan RE272*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Oct 2011
> ...


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You wanted warm and thumping... the Westone 2 isn't much of either of those things.


 

 Well, it's not thumping but the bass is just fine - not too much or too little (for me).  And W2 sounds like a warmer and slightly more spacious version of the DBA-02, which to me makes it more accurate than some others.  If warm and thumping is the desired flavor, I'd still take the MTPG over the IE8, but maybe the W3 would be a better choice.


----------



## Anaxilus

Great work joker.  I only had a brief listen at a meet that your take is pretty spot on to my audition.  Did not get to hear them balanced though.  Kind of sad about it. =(


----------



## i2ehan

I was definitely looking forward to the RE272. Thank you SO much |joker|!


----------



## Inks

Nice RE272 review, it sounds like a very interesting product specially since I've been leaning towards that kind of sound.
   
  The RE262's ratings on comfort and isolation should be updated though since they're pretty much the same in these regards because the 262s use the same modular configuration. Even the build of the cable may be the same...
   
  Hifiman seems pretty conservative on showing off it's specs. They rarely market the fact that the 9mm driver uses a titanium coated diaphragm or that their cable is OFC (though i'm not certain on the latter).
   
  Anyways, congrats on reaching 200 and I hope you don't reach 300 anytime soon for your sake.....


----------



## Armaegis

Congrats on reaching #200.


----------



## DervishD

200! Wow! 
   
  It's just incredible how much this forum owes to you. Thanks a lot for this incredible effort and for your invaluable reviews.
   
  Keep on with 'em!


----------



## Heret1c

Excellent review on the 272s, joker! Been waiting to see this for a while and am now more interested than ever with them. Alas, I have some 252s on their way to me so i'll have to give them their dues first


----------



## TigerA

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, E30 nozzle is angled, though not very much. I don't think you'll find a full step up from the Resonance that also has more bass outside of the higher-end Xears models, and even then none of them improve on clarity. An improvement in clarity with decent bass would be something like the MEE CC51 but I don't think it's bassier than a Resonance. If you can find a Hippo VB that might be an option but it has a different sound profile.


 


 Thanks *ljokerl, *I will take all your suggestions under consideration for my next IEM pruchase. I really appreciate your input.


----------



## Hourglass

Hey joker, I owned a pair of Brainwavz M2s and enjoyed them thoroughly. I am currently looking to buy a new pair of IEMs. I wouldn't mind venturing from its sound but would like something similar to it. What is your opinion in regards to PR401s, CC51, and Xcape IE with this in mind? Genres I listen to are Hip Hop, R&B, Jazz, Alternative & Indie Rock.


----------



## proedros

Τhanx for the re-272 review


----------



## esanthosh

Congrats on the 200th posted review, though I am guessing you are half way there to 250 already. Hope you review TF10 before #300 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Would you put RE272 in balanced mode ahead of EX-1000?


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


esanthosh said:


> Congrats on the 200th posted review, though I am guessing you are half way there to 250 already. Hope you review TF10 before #300
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 If I may, he mentioned at the very end that "*the balanced score would be one or two tenths higher*," making it just about even with the EX1000's own rating of 9.4.


----------



## average_joe

Congrats on review #200 in this thread...and let's not forget the 94 portable headphone reviews.  Impressive!


----------



## yipcanjo

Yee Haw!!!!!!!!!!!  The magical #200 for the Multi-IEM Review thread!  Congrats, Joker.... and nice work


----------



## kckc

WOW 200 IEM reviews!! Congrats Joker, and thank you for all your contributions to this community!


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks, everyone!  It's been quite a journey and couldn't have been done without all the support. Much appreciated!
   
  Quote:  





inks said:


> Nice RE272 review, it sounds like a very interesting product specially since I've been leaning towards that kind of sound.
> 
> The RE262's ratings on comfort and isolation should be updated though since they're pretty much the same in these regards because the 262s use the same modular configuration. Even the build of the cable may be the same...
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, and good point on the RE262. Accessory score will be updated as well.
   
  Quite a ways to go to 300. Hopefully it will be neither too soon or too long.
   


  Quote: 





hourglass said:


> Hey joker, I owned a pair of Brainwavz M2s and enjoyed them thoroughly. I am currently looking to buy a new pair of IEMs. I wouldn't mind venturing from its sound but would like something similar to it. What is your opinion in regards to PR401s, CC51, and Xcape IE with this in mind? Genres I listen to are Hip Hop, R&B, Jazz, Alternative & Indie Rock.


 


  They are all pretty different from the M2, all with less emphasized mids and a bit less bass. If that's what you're after I think you'd be happier with the PR401 or CC51.


----------



## icarus004

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Very different signatures... the UE500 is a bit V-shaped in response, more of an ECCI PR401 or MEElec CC51 sound. Not quite as good as those two but close and a good deal at $55, though you can find the CC51 around that price if you're in the US. I'm not thrilled with the build quality of the UE500 but it's passable. Very lightweight and comfy, too.
> 
> The M2 will be warmer, have more pronounced bass and a significantly more forward midrange, and smoother, more laid-back treble.


 


 Thanks for your answer, is there something similar to the brainwavz m2 signature for a similar price?, I see the Xears resonance, they have the same note in sound(7.2) but perhaps they are a different signature of sound. I think that I want for something a bit more clear than the M2.


 Regards.


----------



## Ulti

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, I've only used two of those and they both have more upfront vocals than the E10. You might even like the E30 better than the E10, or the Brainwavz M2. Even the MEE CC51 is less mid-recessed than the E10 and has better clarity and detail overall. If you could say what you like and what you'd like improved about the XE200 and TD-III that might help narrow it down.


 


 Well I've not actually had my TD-IIIs or XE200PRO for a little while now but I feel the isolation of the XE200PRO is quite poor and the fit isn't the best. I have to get the London Underground to uni and it pretty much rips the sound from the headphones apart. My TD-IIIs have broken but after trying a number of different earphones I've decided to chase Thomas up on getting a replacement for them as I feel there's something I don't like about every earphone whereas I was generally happy with the TD-III and I didn't really need anything about them to be improved. (Although flat cables similar to the XSR330PRO would be good (I'll explain further down). I remember I did like the more upfront vocals and I like to have the bass there so that I do notice it, but I like the vocals and clarity much more. I like a warmer sound too.
   
  I love the sound and isolation of the Xi200PRO but the aluminium design and flat cable makes the headphone really heavy, making uncomfortable when I'm doing anything else other than sitting down. The sound from it is quite close to perfect on the London Underground (the bass is almost overpowering but I don't notice this on the underground) but I have to stand up usually (rush hour). I'm not a fan of wearing them over ear either.
   
  The XSR330PRO are also not bad, but as TigerA says, it's a bit of a "raging monster" in your ears type of earphone and doesn't suit my music taste too much. The plastic housing and fit gives probably the best isolation I've seen in budget IEMs and the flat cable design is super light as it only has a small piece of plastic for the L+R joints as opposed to the big aluminium/plastic/metal slab in the Xi200PRO and XGF500PRO. I feel the flat cable design is very good as I can easily untangle my headphones if they get tangled.
   
  I was thinking of trying something other than Xears but it seems that I'd probably be wasting money, I feel they're pretty hard to beat for value.
   
  Either way, I hope Thomas/Xears can replace my TDIII and I'll see where I go from there.


----------



## SoulSyde

joker, random question: I'm sure you borrow many of the headphones you test, but how many IEMs do you think you own at this point?


----------



## i2ehan

On |joker|'s profile page, there's a list of the ones that he currently owns, has previously owned, or has previously auditioned.


----------



## SoulSyde

He's obviously auditioned over 200 of them, I'm just curious about ownership.  Again, it's a random (and not-that-important) question.
   
  For some stupid reason, I didn't think to look there.  That list is insane.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> If I may, he mentioned at the very end that "*the balanced score would be one or two tenths higher*," making it just about even with the EX1000's own rating of 9.4.


 

 My question still remains the same 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I was not asking about SQ scores alone. There are a few IEMs with the same score, but Joker would probably take W4 over SM3.So,
   
  Quote: 





> Would you put RE272 in balanced mode ahead of EX-1000?


----------



## rawrster

You finally reached 200 iems for this review thread and that is quite the feat  It seems like they finally came out with a upgrade over the RE0 with the RE272 which is great although I've never been a fan of their cable so hopefully this one is better.


----------



## jarrett

With the PR401 in mind, is there another IEM out there that is not so pushed back in the mids? I'm not sure if I'm describing it correctly, but it feels as if there's a hollowness to the sound which could be from the V-shaped frequency, thus higher energy frequencies stick out to the ear more.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@Joker
   
  Hi and many many congratulations to u on the review of 200th IEM  I'm luking for an IEM with a sound signature like this: Need an IEM which has bass quantity like M2 but with much better quality, timing and speed, a tad more treble with smoothness than M2 with an excellent imaging, layering and instrumental separation and twice or thrice better soundstage than M2. Mids should not be recessed also not the center image of the sound signature like M2. Please suggest me the iem based on the sound signature I'm luking for. Thank you. Budget is around $100. Thank You.


----------



## kingice10

Congratz on the 200th iem review @ljokerl!!! Hopefully we still have new top-tier iems coming for review.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





icarus004 said:


> Thanks for your answer, is there something similar to the brainwavz m2 signature for a similar price?, I see the Xears resonance, they have the same note in sound(7.2) but perhaps they are a different signature of sound. I think that I want for something a bit more clear than the M2.Regards.


 

 Yes, the Resonance is a bit flatter than the M2 and has a thinner note and slightly better clarity. If you wanted a bigger clarity upgrade you could try a MEE CC51 or Sunrise Xcited.

   


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> My question still remains the same
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Ah, if we're talking subjective and personal I'll take the EX1000. It's a little more 'special' and differs more from the other universal IEMs in my stable (e-Q5, CK10, ER4S, GR07...). If I had to get rid of my other analytical IEMs for whatever reason, I'd take a balanced RE272. The HM-801 with balanced card has to be one of the most awkwardly-shaped sources out there, though.

  
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> You finally reached 200 iems for this review thread and that is quite the feat  It seems like they finally came out with a upgrade over the RE0 with the RE272 which is great although I've never been a fan of their cable so hopefully this one is better.


 

 Thanks! To be fair I can still see someone finding the slightly darker RE0 to be more neutral than the RE272 so I won't call it a universal RE0 replacement but it is as close as it gets among the top-tiers. 
   
  I have no problems with the new HiFiMan cable - it's strong and smooth and doesn't tangle.
   


  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> With the PR401 in mind, is there another IEM out there that is not so pushed back in the mids? I'm not sure if I'm describing it correctly, but it feels as if there's a hollowness to the sound which could be from the V-shaped frequency, thus higher energy frequencies stick out to the ear more.


 

 Brainwavz M2? Pretty different response, certainly not thin or distant in the midrange and cheaper. Otherwise maybe the Xears TD-III but in either case there will be trade-offs. If you wanted to preserve the resolution and crispness of the PR401 you'd need to go up a level to the something like the HiSound Crystal or Xcape IE.
   


  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @Joker
> 
> Hi and many many congratulations to u on the review of 200th IEM  I'm luking for an IEM with a sound signature like this: Need an IEM which has bass quantity like M2 but with much better quality, timing and speed, a tad more treble with smoothness than M2 with an excellent imaging, layering and instrumental separation and twice or thrice better soundstage than M2. Mids should not be recessed also not the center image of the sound signature like M2. Please suggest me the iem based on the sound signature I'm luking for. Thank you. Budget is around $100. Thank You.


 

 Thanks!
   
  That's a tough find for under $100. Best I can think of is the Fischer Silver Bullet but it's not quite as big an upgrade over an M2 as you're describing. For that you'd have to spend more.

  
  Quote: 





kingice10 said:


> Congratz on the 200th iem review @ljokerl!!! Hopefully we still have new top-tier iems coming for review.


 

 Thanks, and there will be. List on the front page.


----------



## OhneHerren

Congratulations on the 200th Joker, five stars! I am thinking about some Sunrise headphones, but I'm unsure about the build quality. Do you know if new batches solve the overheating/cutting out issue?


----------



## icarus004

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, the Resonance is a bit flatter than the M2 and has a thinner note and slightly better clarity. If you wanted a bigger clarity upgrade you could try a MEE CC51 or Sunrise Xcited.


 

 Thanks again for your time and your answer,
   
  Regards!!!


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> That's a tough find for under $100. Best I can think of is the Fischer Silver Bullet but it's not quite as big an upgrade over an M2 as you're describing. For that you'd have to spend more.


 


 Thanks.
   
  If I spend more so what would be the best earphone according to the Sound Signature I'm luking for? Also what about MEE CC51, ECCI PR401? I think that PR401 has less bass than M2


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

I'm gonna Pre-Order the Fischer Audio Eterna rev.1 in a few days.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





soulsyde said:


> He's obviously auditioned over 200 of them, I'm just curious about ownership.  Again, it's a random (and not-that-important) question.
> 
> For some stupid reason, I didn't think to look there.  That list is insane.


 

 'Insane' as opposed to having reviewed over 200 IEMs, roughly a hundred portable on-ears and God-only-knows-what-else ?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Like Skylab, Joker has more kit than Jesus.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ohneherren said:


> Congratulations on the 200th Joker, five stars! I am thinking about some Sunrise headphones, but I'm unsure about the build quality. Do you know if new batches solve the overheating/cutting out issue?


 

 From what I've seen so far, they have not. I am waiting for them to get back to me regarding changes that have been made before I add those reviews (and build quality scores) to this thread.

  
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thanks.
> 
> If I spend more so what would be the best earphone according to the Sound Signature I'm luking for? Also what about MEE CC51, ECCI PR401? I think that PR401 has less bass than M2


 

 Both have less bass than the M2, though not by a huge amount. You can try them and see if that helps you hone in on your ideal signature better. PR401 will also have a wider stage than the M2, though it's also more mid-recessed than the CC51.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> how are the klipsch s3 compared to the metrofi series? how about compared to the ultimate ears 350?


 

 About the same quality-wise but with a very v-shaped sound signature against the more bass/mids-heavy UE350.


----------



## cocolinho

Hi again ,
  There are so many possibilities that I feel a bit lost now... so maybe you can help me out to make the best choice 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Looking for wide soundstage, airy sound, (very) good separation but still well detailed. Mids should not be too recessed (for vocal) & not anemic bass.
  Actually I'm looking for the:
   
  FA Eterna V1
  FA Silver Bullet
  Phiaton PS200
  Vsonic GR07
  Sunrise Xcape IE (?)
   
  Budget limit is 100/120€
  My 1st choice would be Silver Bullet or PS200 but PS200 is almost 2x more expensive than SB...
   
  Thanks for your recommandantion


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Both have less bass than the M2, though not by a huge amount. You can try them and see if that helps you hone in on your ideal signature better. PR401 will also have a wider stage than the M2, though it's also more mid-recessed than the CC51.


 

 Thank you for your reply. Now one last question. Between MEElectronics CC51 and ECCI PR401 which has more treble quantitatively and which has smoothest treble between the both?


----------



## rawrster

So I took out the m2 from like a very long storage in its case as I figured i'll take them to work instead of my customs since they work better. They don't offer as much isolation and it is easier if I just want to have only one ear listening to music.
   
  They sounded pretty damn good for $50 or whatever the MSRP for them is.


----------



## Niyologist

Changed my mind. I'm now going to purchase the Atrio X (MG5 Transducer). How does the Atrio X compare to the Atrio M5?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cocolinho said:


> Hi again ,
> There are so many possibilities that I feel a bit lost now... so maybe you can help me out to make the best choice
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Bass of the PS200 might be a bit too weak. I would go GR07 in its price range or Silver Bullet in the lower price category. Xcape IE seems to have some reliability issues.
   


  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thank you for your reply. Now one last question. Between MEElectronics CC51 and ECCI PR401 which has more treble quantitatively and which has smoothest treble between the both?


 

 The CC51 is brighter. I don't think either is significantly smoother than the other.



  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Changed my mind. I'm now going to purchase the Atrio X (MG5 Transducer). How does the Atrio X compare to the Atrio M5?


 

 With the same driver and the same housing? Probably pretty close..
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> are the newer but cheaper ue350 better than the older but more expenisve metrofi? or am i better off getting the older metrofi?
> 
> and how about for the same price the superfi4? better than all the klipsch s3 metrofi and ue350?


 

 Not better but different. I have not yet reviewed any of them.


----------



## imackler

ljokerl...any advice for me?
   
  I'm looking for a jack of all trades, focusing on classical (lots of strings, lots of choral pieces and some symphonies), then 1950-60s jazz and ending with alternative/folk. Do I go with the RE272 ($250), GR07 ($170ish) or the W2 ($200 now from EarphoneSolutions w/ coupon code).  In general, I like balanced armatures, but one of my favorite iems was the IE7, so I'm leaning toward dynamic for something new. The IE7 wasn't perfect; I think it could have tighter bass and more treble extension, but the mids were amazing. I hate shelling out $250+ for the IE7 (especially after so many purchased it for $100 or so this spring when it was discontinued) and am hoping one of these is better. I've owned the W2 in the past. Again I find the bass a little bloaty, but the W2 is impressive besides that and probably my top pick for a mid-budget all-genre phone of those I've owned. So they present a good alternative. The dark horses for me are the RE272 and the GR07. I'd appreciate any advice. (Maybe, a single phone isn't best... I could do something like a GR07 and a HF5 maybe, etc.. I'd prefer one though.)
   
  I really like the W4. I'm trying to get something a little cheaper though, but still trying to find a quality, long lasting phone. I find its weaknesses to me are probably a little warm and lacking energy, but it really is an amazing phone. I guess I'm looking for something a little bit more dynamic/less reserved, though in general I tend to neutral phones...


----------



## Niyologist

Thanks ljokerl! I'm really happy to see that my purchase will be very well worth it.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## cocolinho

Ok thank you Joker, I've just ordered Silver Bullet V2 with improved cable
  I'm not an expert but would it mean better score in your review??


----------



## s0lar

Do the Hisound Crystals benefit from amping? I just ordered a pair for commuting, since they isolate very well and should sound good.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





imackler said:


> ljokerl...any advice for me?
> 
> I'm looking for a jack of all trades, focusing on classical (lots of strings, lots of choral pieces and some symphonies), then 1950-60s jazz and ending with alternative/folk. Do I go with the RE272 ($250), GR07 ($170ish) or the W2 ($200 now from EarphoneSolutions w/ coupon code).  In general, I like balanced armatures, but one of my favorite iems was the IE7, so I'm leaning toward dynamic for something new. The IE7 wasn't perfect; I think it could have tighter bass and more treble extension, but the mids were amazing. I hate shelling out $250+ for the IE7 (especially after so many purchased it for $100 or so this spring when it was discontinued) and am hoping one of these is better. I've owned the W2 in the past. Again I find the bass a little bloaty, but the W2 is impressive besides that and probably my top pick for a mid-budget all-genre phone of those I've owned. So they present a good alternative. The dark horses for me are the RE272 and the GR07. I'd appreciate any advice. (Maybe, a single phone isn't best... I could do something like a GR07 and a HF5 maybe, etc.. I'd prefer one though.)
> 
> I really like the W4. I'm trying to get something a little cheaper though, but still trying to find a quality, long lasting phone. I find its weaknesses to me are probably a little warm and lacking energy, but it really is an amazing phone. I guess I'm looking for something a little bit more dynamic/less reserved, though in general I tend to neutral phones...


 

 I find the IE7 to sound extremely bloated next to the GR07. If you can live with less warmth and less forward mids than the IE7, I think the GR07 is a good choice. It's much quicker and the treble is cleaner and more prominent. If you want dynamic and energetic I would pick it over the W2 and IE7 both nine times out of ten. The RE272 has more liquid mids and better treble extension than the GR07 but it's a little on the relaxed side in comparison and doesn't have nearly the bass quantity of the IE7 (GR07 is closer, though still a lot less boomy). You may also like the Fischer DBA-02, though it's very much on the lean side compared to the IE7. Much more neutral, clean, and energetic, though.

  
  Quote: 





cocolinho said:


> Ok thank you Joker, I've just ordered Silver Bullet V2 with improved cable
> I'm not an expert but would it mean better score in your review??


 

 The cable was somewhat of a disappointment on the V1 so if they did improve it, I don't see why it wouldn't score higher.

  
  Quote: 





s0lar said:


> Do the Hisound Crystals benefit from amping? I just ordered a pair for commuting, since they isolate very well and should sound good.


 
   
  No, not significantly. As with most mid-level dynamics the cost/bother of an amp just wouldn't be worth it vs. going up to a higher-end IEM.


----------



## estreeter

Joker, I know this is nit-picking, but the second revision of the RE262 are balanced, and that means that HiFiMan now have 3 balanced IEMs on offer - RE-ZERO, RE262 and RE272.
   
  Technically, I believe this to be incorrect:
   
_Details: HiFiMan’s latest flagship and the company’s *second* balanced earphone_
   
  I didnt realise it when I bought my 262s, but the earlier version was single-ended.
   
  http://www.inearmatters.net/2011/03/finally-re262.html
   
  I know - a massive review, thousands of hours, and some clown (!) has to zero in on one technicality - thanks again for the massive garagantuan effort you have put into this review.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Joker, I know this is nit-picking, but the second revision of the RE262 are balanced, and that means that HiFiMan now have 3 balanced IEMs on offer - RE-ZERO, RE262 and RE272.
> 
> Technically, I believe this to be incorrect:
> 
> ...


 

 Unfortunately you are not even the first such clown - Inks mentioned the RE262 update a few pages back 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I have to raise RE262 scores to account for the modular system and (presumably) new cable it's now using. There's a few other adjustments that need to be made, which I've put off until the next revision. I appreciate the correction, though. 
   
  And yes, my RE262 was single-ended.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> ok so i finally know what im looking for. i want a balanced iem. of the klipsch s3 metrofi200 and ultimate ears 350 which would be the best? i want it to sound as close as possible to the superfi4, but just with a tad more bottem end


 

 The S3 and UE350 are not balanced and I've not heard the MF200.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately you are not even the first such clown - Inks mentioned the RE262 update a few pages back
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sensational - thanks for that. We are faced with the prospect of the 262 overtaking the 272 in your rankings


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

Gonna order the Future Sonics AtrioX today or tomorrow. I'll place a 2 year protection plan on it just in-case. I'll have my initial thoughts after arrival.


----------



## imackler

Thanks a ton for the advice! I don't want to lose the mids of the IE7 but not at all a fan of the boomy bass. The GR07 may be a great choice!
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I find the IE7 to sound extremely bloated next to the GR07. If you can live with less warmth and less forward mids than the IE7, I think the GR07 is a good choice. It's much quicker and the treble is cleaner and more prominent. If you want dynamic and energetic I would pick it over the W2 and IE7 both nine times out of ten. The RE272 has more liquid mids and better treble extension than the GR07 but it's a little on the relaxed side in comparison and doesn't have nearly the bass quantity of the IE7 (GR07 is closer, though still a lot less boomy). You may also like the Fischer DBA-02, though it's very much on the lean side compared to the IE7. Much more neutral, clean, and energetic, though.


----------



## DaBomb77766

So, it is said that the common ebay price for the ADDIEM is ~$35 or so.  However, most of the listings I see are probably selling fakes - most of them around ~$15.
   
  Anyone know of a good ebay seller that actually sells legit ones for around that price?


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Hello...I'm a complete noob with respect to IEM's.  I picked up a cheap set of Skullcandy INK'd to replace my workout Sennheiser PMX-100's.  I just got the Skully's today and I'm wondering at this price point ($11) if there's anything with more bass and clearer mids/highs.  I was thinking about MEElectronics M9...budget is $20. 
   
  After burn-in which of the 2 has the deepest bass (I like boomy I guess bc I like the Ink'd), and also give you that bass impact...I want to "feel" the bass if you catch my drift?
   
  I listen to mostly drum and bass along with hip hop.  After about 30 minutes of listening I think the Skullies are really good for drum and bass, and I'd imagine dubstep, but sometimes I think the highs are a little sharp if I listen to something with vocals.  In general though the vocals aren't super clear as the bass drowns it out.  That's ok at this price...just wondering if I can get vocals clearer and boomier bass.  In any case, I'll try them tomorrow during a workout and get a better idea.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Hello...I'm a complete noob with respect to IEM's.  I picked up a cheap set of Skullcandy INK'd to replace my workout Sennheiser PMX-100's.  I just got the Skully's today and I'm wondering at this price point ($11) if there's anything with more bass and clearer mids/highs.  I was thinking about MEElectronics M9...budget is $20.
> 
> After burn-in which of the 2 has the deepest bass, and also give you that bass impact...I want to "feel" the bass if you catch my drift?
> 
> I listen to mostly drum and bass along with hip hop.  After about 30 minutes of listening I think the Skullies are really good for drum and bass, and I'd imagine dubstep, but sometimes I think the highs are a little sharp if I listen to something with vocals.  I'll try them tomorrow during a workout and get a better idea.


 
   
        The M9 or M6 will do. I suggest ordering it from Amazon with a Square Trade 3-Year Warranty under $50.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> which of the ue350 or the klipsch s3 has detail reproduction and speed anywhere near that of the superfi4, becuase i know they both will have more low end? becuase the metrofi200 do come close, but i dont like the cloth cord or the straight plug. im wondering if either could do better
> 
> how about the klispsch s4 or ultimate ears 500? which has better clairty details speed etc?
> 
> any chance at all that your in the process of making either a ue350 ue500 or a superfi4 review? it would be awesome to see what you think about them


 


  I like the UE500 better than the S4. The latter is much more v-shaped. 
   
  The UE350, UE500, and SF4 reviews will not be finished until I clear up most of my sample backlog.


  Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> So, it is said that the common ebay price for the ADDIEM is ~$35 or so.  However, most of the listings I see are probably selling fakes - most of them around ~$15.
> 
> Anyone know of a good ebay seller that actually sells legit ones for around that price?


 


  I got mine from a seller named 7dime. I would just rely on my ears and ebay buyer protection. Genuine earphones will have the threaded filters and a working 3-button remote. There have been reports of fakes that have had neither of those things.


  Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Hello...I'm a complete noob with respect to IEM's.  I picked up a cheap set of Skullcandy INK'd to replace my workout Sennheiser PMX-100's.  I just got the Skully's today and I'm wondering at this price point ($11) if there's anything with more bass and clearer mids/highs.  I was thinking about MEElectronics M9...budget is $20.
> 
> After burn-in which of the 2 has the deepest bass (I like boomy I guess bc I like the Ink'd), and also give you that bass impact...I want to "feel" the bass if you catch my drift?
> 
> I listen to mostly drum and bass along with hip hop.  After about 30 minutes of listening I think the Skullies are really good for drum and bass, and I'd imagine dubstep, but sometimes I think the highs are a little sharp if I listen to something with vocals.  In general though the vocals aren't super clear as the bass drowns it out.  That's ok at this price...just wondering if I can get vocals clearer and boomier bass.  In any case, I'll try them tomorrow during a workout and get a better idea.


 

 The M9 has noticeably more bass than the Ink'd as well as better depth and quality but the treble isn't any smoother and the midrange, including vocals, is less prominent. I would still take an M9 over the Ink'd any day for more tolerable soundstage and better detail but signature-wise it may not be a perfect fit. The M31 is closer to what you are after but of course is more expensive.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I got mine from a seller named 7dime. I would just rely on my ears and ebay buyer protection. Genuine earphones will have the threaded filters and a working 3-button remote. There have been reports of fakes that have had neither of those things.


 


  Yup, I've seen some of these fakes with my own eyes.  Hm...well, it's rather easy to tell if it's fake or not, it'd just be a huge hassle to file a dispute and get them refunded.

 Anyway, thanks, I'll see if I can find this seller!


----------



## Astrozombie

Just got my M1s, sweeeeetness, they have plenty of Bass even if people call them bass light. Exactly what i was looking for as my M9s had a little too much bass 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Cable is a huge bonus, clip and comply tips.


----------



## Niyologist

I ordered the Future Sonics AtrioX just a while ago. I'll have it by Saturday at the latest and I put a Square Trade 3-Year Warranty on it too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> i bought a ue500, but im not going to lie im really starting to enjoy my friends backbeat pros(superfi4), when equalized they sound very good
> 
> are the ue500 really as hard to drive as people are saying? as i have ipod nano. they have normal specs so i dont see why they would be
> 
> ...


 

 Since you've bought the UE500, why not just try it for yourself instead of asking countless questions?
   


  Quote: 





astrozombie said:


> Just got my M1s, sweeeeetness, they have plenty of Bass even if people call them bass light. Exactly what i was looking for as my M9s had a little too much bass
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  The M1 ships with Comply tips now? News to me, but definitely makes it a better value if the rest of the accessory pack is intact.


----------



## s0lar

Seems the Xears XE200PRO are sold out, I was looking for a reasonably priced IEM for a friend who was looking for a good bang for the buck IEM.

  
  Quote: 





astrozombie said:


> Just got my M1s, sweeeeetness, they have plenty of Bass even if people call them bass light. Exactly what i was looking for as my M9s had a little too much bass
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The M1 were my first IEM I bought after reading this thread some time and IEMs ago. I still like them. Mine did not ship with comply and I never tested them with Comply. I like the MEElec balanced bi-flanges best with M1. I shall test them with Comply.
  Bass got better with the balanced bi-flanges compared to the standard bi-flanges.


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Thanks for the excellent input Niyologist and Joker...gave me a couple things to think about.
   
  Joker - thanks for pointing me in the direction of the M31.  I have a list of bassy IEM's (Soundmagic E10, CX 300 II) I'm hoping will go on sale for Black Friday which might bring it to around the $20 I'm looking to spend.
   
  Nyiologist - you mentioned getting an extending warranty which would bring the price up a bit.  Actually I wouldn't mind paying more than $20 but only if I could get a lifetime warranty type deal.  This led me to looking at the Koss KDX300.  Ever tried them?  On Amazon they go for about $50.
   
  And if anyone is in the market for the M6, Newegg.com has them on sale today for $14.99 (free shipping) with Coupon Code:  *EMCJKJF49.*
   
  EDIT:  With Meelectronics, has anyone ever had their IEM's replaced under warranty....good/bad experience?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Thanks for the excellent input Niyologist and Joker...gave me a couple things to think about.
> 
> Joker - thanks for pointing me in the direction of the M31.  I have a list of bassy IEM's (Soundmagic E10, CX 300 II) I'm hoping will go on sale for Black Friday which might bring it to around the $20 I'm looking to spend.
> 
> ...


 
   
        I had one warranty replacement with my pre-order SP51 (when it first came out). Although while the earphones were defective, the customer service was outstanding and I got a new SP51 w/a new M31.


----------



## TigerA

Joker,
   
  In the end I decided to go for the Brainwavz ProAlpha, but I have just one last question. You where spot on in your
  review of the Xears Resonance when you said that it doesn't maintain it's composure when things gets busy.
  Can the ProAlpha's handle busy tracks, without "distorting" (not sure if this is the right word what happens with
  the Resonance) the song? Since I already have the Resonance I wouldn't want a new IEM with the same problem.
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## NuckinFutz

Quote: 





tigera said:


> Joker,
> 
> In the end I decided to go for the Brainwavz ProAlpha, but I have just one last question. You where spot on in your
> review of the Xears Resonance when you said that it doesn't maintain it's composure when things gets busy.
> ...


 


   Good choice buddy.  Please let me know what you think when you have had time to review.  The Alpha's are fast, they have no problem with busy tracks in my experience anyway.  Would be interesting to hear your thoughts again the XSR, we may be the only people with both on here.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Ended up going the M9 route after working out with the Ink'd today.  The bass seemed 1 dimensional with the Ink'd and it became somewhat boring to listen to for more than 45 minutes or so.  The M9 with the 3 Year Warranty worked out to $26.99 so that's cool.  Unfortunately Newegg didn't have extended warranty on the M6's or I would've done that.  But I think I'll be happy with the M9's until some sales come around.
   
  Thanks again Joker and Niyologist....I'm sure I'll be back around closer to Black Friday and once I've gone through more of the reviews posted


----------



## shotgunshane

Well I finally picked up a pair of SoundMagic E10's and my jaw is on the floor.  How in the hell are these only $35?  They are better than any phone at that price has a right to be; and this is first thing out of the box, insert into ears, jaw smacks floor.  Leagues better than my old PL30's.  Very fun and clear sounding with just the right bass punch for my tastes.  Well done SoundMagic.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tigera said:


> Joker,
> 
> In the end I decided to go for the Brainwavz ProAlpha, but I have just one last question. You where spot on in your
> review of the Xears Resonance when you said that it doesn't maintain it's composure when things gets busy.
> ...


 

 Well the Alpha doesn't quite have as much clarity as the Resonance to start with but I don't remember it breaking down on busy tracks. The ViSang/Brainwavz generally maintains resolution very well.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> youre right im going to stop, and i appreicate your help but i just have one last question.
> would you consider the superfi4 balanced and did you like them?


 

 SF4 is reasonably balanced but emphasizes mids/bass over treble and isn't all that smooth at the top. It also rolls off on either end. From listening to it I'm convinced that it uses a Knowles SR transducer which is a very popular driver among budget BAs but the Soundmagic PL50 and MEElec A151, which use the same driver, are on the whole tuned better to my ears. I also prefer all of the other BA-based UEs, including the SuperFi3, to the SuperFi4.
   


  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Well I finally picked up a pair of SoundMagic E10's and my jaw is on the floor.  How in the hell are these only $35?  They are better than any phone at that price has a right to be; and this is first thing out of the box, insert into ears, jaw smacks floor.  Leagues better than my old PL30's.  Very fun and clear sounding with just the right bass punch for my tastes.  Well done SoundMagic.


 
   
  Yes, welcome to the club. The E10 is not the most proficient thing out there but it is just so fantastically fun for the $35 with way better clarity and space than I'd expect from something that bassy at that price.


----------



## dmyster

Insane dedication, amazing job.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

Hehehe....I'm going for the Sony XBA-04 and either the Unique Melody Merlin or the Blue Future Sonics MG6Pro Customs VERY SOON.


----------



## DarkAndroid

I was about to go and drop about 300 bucks for an IE8 but hit the brakes when I learned about the upcoming IE80....looking forward to your review on that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dmyster said:


> Insane dedication, amazing job.


 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   


  Quote: 





darkandroid said:


> I was about to go and drop about 300 bucks for an IE8 but hit the brakes when I learned about the upcoming IE80....looking forward to your review on that.


 


  I doubt the IE80 will be available that far below MSRP any time soon. The IE8 might be viable for a bit longer until Sennheiser starts phasing them out for the new model.


----------



## Niyologist

My Future Sonics Atrio X shipped out around 2:13 AM last night. It shipped out from Indianapolis, so I should get it by the end of the day or by mid day tomorrow.


----------



## Astrozombie

So i got the CC51s, certainly good but for some reason....i think i prefer the M1s right now. Maybe it's true what they say "the soul of music is in the Mids"? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Have to try them both with different tips.


----------



## Sweden

Which one of the sub 200 USD IEM's do you feel offer the most separation and texture?
  Separation is key.


----------



## Niyologist

I got my Future Sonics Atrio X and I must say......AMAZING! The soundstage is huge in comparison to the CC51 and it a mixed, yet enhanced version of the CC51 and the SP51, but with deeper and clearer bass and the treble isn't edgy or harsh. The Sound Signature is dark most of the time, but at other times it's kinda bright, yet there is no sibilance or harshness. The sound is very smooth and it's forward with the bass and treble, but the midrange is a bit recessed, although it's on par or slightly more forward than the CC51. The Clarity is excellent and I can hear and distinguish the Male and Female Vocals quite well. It makes me wonder if the X and the M8 use the same drivers. I'll have more by tomorrow.


----------



## HeatFan12

Serious dedication that keeps on giving and giving, |joker|.  THE go-to reference indeed.  Everytime I see an iem mentioned, I just go to this thread for all the info.  Not only sound, but accessories, wearing style, cord type, ratings etc. etc. etc....Then you answer questions as well....Simply amazing....Great job...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

  
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I got my Future Sonics Atrio X and I must say......AMAZING! The soundstage is huge in comparison to the CC51 and it a mixed, yet enhanced version of the CC51 and the SP51, but with deeper and clearer bass and the treble isn't edgy or harsh. The Sound Signature is dark most of the time, but at other times it's kinda bright, yet there is no sibilance or harshness. The sound is very smooth and it's forward with the bass and treble, but the midrange is a bit recessed, although it's on par or slightly more forward than the CC51. The Clarity is excellent and I can hear and distinguish the Male and Female Vocals quite well. It makes me wonder if the X and the M8 use the same drivers. I'll have more by tomorrow.


 


 Congratz on your purchase Niyologist...
   
  I like da bass and I hear these have great bass. Are these the MG5?  I see some as 500-030, 500-051, however they all say MG5.  Is there a difference?
   
  Thanks in advance...


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> Congratz on your purchase Niyologist...
> 
> I like da bass and I hear these have great bass. Are these the MG5?  I see some as 500-030, 500-051, however they all say MG5.  Is there a difference?
> 
> Thanks in advance...


 

       Thanks HeatFan12. Also, the Atrio X uses Version 1 of the MG5 Drivers, but my ears tell me Version 2.


----------



## Niyologist

The Sub-Bass on the Atrio X is quite an amazing feature from these earphones. The bass doesn't even overshadow the midrange at all, even the bassiest songs I have and it still  doesn't touch it. I'm a huge Hard Dance and Trance fan, so bass and clarity is a must and these IEM's are perfect for the job.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The Sub-Bass on the Atrio X is quite an amazing feature from these earphones. It doesn't even touch the midrange at all, even the bassiest songs I have and it still  doesn't touch it. I'm a huge *Hard Dance and Trance fan*, so bass and clarity is a must and these IEM's are perfect for the job.


 

 Thanks...Nice!!!  Well, not for my wallet...I need to get out of this sub-forum...lol  I'm a house & trance fan myself and now I'm really interested...
   
  Here is what I mean on Amazon they all look the same, but have different numbers...Could you point to the ones you purchased?  ANd while I'm at it, might as well ask- j-cord or y-cord?
   
  Thanks a bunch!!
   
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_6_19?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=future+sonics+atrio+x&sprefix=future+sonics+atrio


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> Thanks...Nice!!!  Well, not for my wallet...I need to get out of this sub-forum...lol  I'm a house & trance fan myself and now I'm really interested...
> 
> Here is what I mean on Amazon they all look the same, but have different numbers...Could you point to the ones you purchased?  ANd while I'm at it, might as well ask- j-cord or y-cord?
> 
> ...


 
        I would go for 500-030:
   
        http://www.amazon.com/Atrio-Future-Sonic-500-030-FutureSonics/dp/B004X97FXO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1319254893&sr=8-1
   
        I purchased that, but it seems that the price went up, but this is an excellent deal. It's definitely a steal. Also, it's a Y-Cord.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I would go for 500-030:
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Atrio-Future-Sonic-500-030-FutureSonics/dp/B004X97FXO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1319254893&sr=8-1
> 
> I purchased that, but it seems that the price went up, but this is an excellent deal. It's definitely a steal. Also, it's a Y-Cord.


 


 Outstanding N....Thanks very much for your help...I will sleep on it and keep you posted....I need to stop spending $$$....lol
   
  Thanks again


----------



## james444

Better late than never: just wanted to drop by and say thanks for your dedication and congrats on hitting 200.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> Serious dedication that keeps on giving and giving, |joker|.  THE go-to reference indeed.  Everytime I see an iem mentioned, I just go to this thread for all the info.  Not only sound, but accessories, wearing style, cord type, ratings etc. etc. etc....Then you answer questions as well....Simply amazing....Great job...


 
   
  Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Better late than never: just wanted to drop by and say thanks for your dedication and congrats on hitting 200.


 


  Thanks, certainly couldn't have been as complete without early adopters like yourself weeding out the great from the mediocre. Also, I'm almost hesitant to add more as that 200 just looks so nice up there.


----------



## -y0-

Holy shiz, reaching 200 is ridonkulous! Congrats man, looking forward to reading more of your reviews.


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Also, I'm almost hesitant to add more as that 200 just looks so nice up there.


 

 Stopping at 200...how anti-climactic!  And without reviewing the TF10 no less


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





average_joe said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 but the #200 was a surprise! the RE272 !


----------



## average_joe

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> but the #200 was a surprise! the RE272 !


 

 I guess that would be a fine IEM to end on.  But something tells me we will be looking at high numbers such as 300, 400, etc in the future


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





-y0- said:


> Holy shiz, reaching 200 is ridonkulous! Congrats man, looking forward to reading more of your reviews.


 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





average_joe said:


> I guess that would be a fine IEM to end on.  But something tells me we will be looking at high numbers such as 300, 400, etc in the future


 


  "400 IEMs Compared" is the sort of thing one might get committed for, or at least forced to undergo counseling.


----------



## Selenium

I'm sure there are people out there who'd say the same for 200, so I say screw it and aim for 500!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Congrats on 200 by the way you nutjob.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Who are you kidding my friend, you're halfway there! The way I see it, the glass is only half full.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selenium said:


> I'm sure there are people out there who'd say the same for 200, so I say screw it and aim for 500!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I make no secret of it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> Who are you kidding my friend, you're halfway there! The way I see it, the glass is only half full.


 

 Thanks..


----------



## Armaegis

No kidding. I got up to about 7 (10 if you count the second thread) and don't see myself doing any more soon. Of course, I said that after the first one too... oh hey look the K550 is coming out soon...


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Good thing you got that out of the way already.


----------



## battleaxe

What are some of the actual hardware difference between the S3 and S4? What about initial SQ differences? Thanks.
   
  Edit: If both the S4 and the X5 were the same price, which would be the better buy, if one is looking for all around SQ and durability?


----------



## coldmack

Do you think you can do a review of some of the Polk Audio IEMs, like the Ultrafit 1000?


----------



## iXpertMan

Joker,
  I've been waiting for you to review the Ultimate Ears (especially UE 700) for around 5-6 months now, and they are on your 'In Progress' - list but you're not publishing anything on them. Can you please give an update on that situation? I really can't wait to see what's better the UE 700 or Westone 2, and Christmas is just around the corner so need to make my mind up.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> What are some of the actual hardware difference between the S3 and S4? What about initial SQ differences? Thanks.
> 
> Edit: If both the S4 and the X5 were the same price, which would be the better buy, if one is looking for all around SQ and durability?


 

 Like the S4, the S3 sounds decent at first listen but it has some very serious flaws. To me it has pretty much all the flaws of the S4 with fewer strengths. I find it very fatiguing, almost unusable. The old S2 was much smoother, albeit less clear and resolving. I've never heard the X5 but would choose it blindly over the S4 as long as you're not after heavy bass.

  
  Quote: 





coldmack said:


> Do you think you can do a review of some of the Polk Audio IEMs, like the Ultrafit 1000?


 

 FAQ is on page 1. I do not have any Polk IEMs on hand at this time.
   


  Quote: 





ixpertman said:


> Joker,
> I've been waiting for you to review the Ultimate Ears (especially UE 700) for around 5-6 months now, and they are on your 'In Progress' - list but you're not publishing anything on them. Can you please give an update on that situation? I really can't wait to see what's better the UE 700 or Westone 2, and Christmas is just around the corner so need to make my mind up.


 


  FAQ is on page 1. Basically, since all of the UE stuff was purchased by me, I won't get around to reviewing it until I'm done with all loans & samples.
   
  Neither is really better between the UE700 and Westone 2 - different signatures. The UEs are crystal clear, bright, and energetic while the W2 on the warm side and more mid-centric.


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Neither is really better between the UE700 and Westone 2 - different signatures. The UEs are crystal clear, bright, and energetic while the W2 on the warm side and more mid-centric.


 


  really?
   
  given how much we have both badmouthed the UE700 im surprised to see you say that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> really?
> 
> given how much we have both badmouthed the UE700 im surprised to see you say that.


 
   
  Comparing it to the W2 which I don't like either...


----------



## imackler

What don't you like about the W2? I know its ranking on your chart is maybe higher because of good build, isolation, accessories, etc. and that it sound is definitely below other top tier phones. Is it that it basically doesn't do anything great? It really doesn't shine at anything while being a little warm and loose, too.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Comparing it to the W2 which I don't like either...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





imackler said:


> What don't you like about the W2? I know its ranking on your chart is maybe higher because of good build, isolation, accessories, etc. and that it sound is definitely below other top tier phones. Is it that it basically doesn't do anything great? It really doesn't shine at anything while being a little warm and loose, too.


 

 The sound score doesn't have much to do with why I don't personally like it but other than that you're right - it's an analytical earphone with a warm tilt that doesn't really work for me. It lacks energy and doesn't have the sharpest, flattest, or cleanest response compared to TWFK-based sets. It's also a touch grainy next to something like the CK10 or even UE700. Between the W2 and UE700 both have plenty of flaws and technically the W2 is - in my opinion - the better earphone but it's easy to see someone preferring one or the other. More difficult to imagine someone really liking both.


----------



## estreeter

Still looking forward to the TF10 review - when I first began to take an interest in better sound via headphones, they were widely recommended but seem to have taken a bit of a slide in the popularity stakes of late, even against other universals.


----------



## imackler

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The sound score doesn't have much to do with why I don't personally like it but other than that you're right - it's an analytical earphone with a warm tilt that doesn't really work for me.


 

 Thanks for the response! That analytical w/ a warm tilt kind of describes the W4, too. So well done, but kind of strangely warm...


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


estreeter said:


> Still looking forward to the TF10 review - when I first began to take an interest in better sound via headphones, they were widely recommended but *seem to have taken a bit of a slide in the popularity stakes of late, even against other universals.*


 

 And it may very well continue on that same path since it's rumored to be discontinued in the near future...


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> hopes this helps and remember i have only heard ths s2 so many joker could help more
> 
> edit: i just looked online and the x5 is close to $200. id say pass on that. if you want a balanced aramature go for the superfi4 which i found for $35 on one website, $50 is the average
> 
> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/533491-REG/Ultimate_Ears_IP_P4SSA0001_02_Super_Fi_4_Personal_In_Ear.html


 

 Thank you. I got lucky and found out Fry's is selling the X5 online for under $99, and was able to drive to a local Frys and get the last one(the packaging was in terrible shape, but at that price who cares). They let me try the S4 and it was acceptable for my taste,specially since Frys also has as sale on the Pro Media(S4 with a mic for gaming) for under $45 online, but that particular store didn't have an in stock. A good heads up for anyone looking at either model.


----------



## Tycn

Great thread! I just wish there was some equivalent for full size headphones...


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## kanuka

joker
  do you the new re272 cable+plug (which i suppose is the same for the last batches for all the other models too) is totally better than the RE0 2009 cloth one. or is there any advantage on the cloth one?


----------



## battleaxe

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> oo did you buy the x5? how do they sound?


 


  I haven't really taken a listen to them yet, as I am burning them in(been reading mix things about this, but it doesn't hurt to try). But, I did watch a commercial with them and I felt there was a lot of clarity and potential to them.


----------



## jamess71

Just stopping by to say Thanks to Joker and congrats on 200.  After much reading I went for the Vsonic GR07 I'm anxiously waiting arrival


----------



## ljokerl

As of today this thread is the most viewed in the portable sub-forum. Thanks, everyone!

  
  Quote: 





tycn said:


> Great thread! I just wish there was some equivalent for full size headphones...


 

 Thanks! There's the portable thread which has a couple of full-size DJ cans. None of the real full-size heavy hitters, though.
   


  Quote: 





jamess71 said:


> Just stopping by to say Thanks to Joker and congrats on 200.  After much reading I went for the Vsonic GR07 I'm anxiously waiting arrival


 

 Thanks, and congratulations on your purchase!
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> joker
> do you the new re272 cable+plug (which i suppose is the same for the last batches for all the other models too) is totally better than the RE0 2009 cloth one. or is there any advantage on the cloth one?


 
   
  I only know of the RE262 having the same cable as the RE272. I think the RE0/ZERO are still using the (rev. 3?) rubbery PPE cable. The cloth cable was rev.2 and hasn't been in production in a while. I like it just fine but the current one is good too, though not as good as the latest RE272/RE262 cable.


----------



## mark2410

what did it just overtake?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  i'm almost sure the RE0 has the new cable. the plug is that beefy angled one that comes with the new re272/re262
  the RE0 v3 was the thin L plug
  how do you find the new one to be worn over the ear? is it easier than the cloth one?
  i'm asking because the new plug is toooo thick for my clip+. while the straight one is excellent
 it isnt a buy killer , though


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> what did it just overtake?


 

 The JH13 appreciation thread
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i'm almost sure the RE0 has the new cable. the plug is that beefy angled one that comes with the new re272/re262
> the RE0 v3 was the thin L plug
> how do you find the new one to be worn over the ear? is it easier than the cloth one?
> i'm asking because the new plug is toooo thick for my clip+. while the straight one is excellentit isnt a buy killer , though


 

 Both cables are fine over the ear. They are soft and flexible, no issues at all.


----------



## estreeter

I can confirm that the RE262 cable is very good - probably a little stiffer/thicker than some may be accustomed too, but so very much better than my recollections of  the RE0 cable. The housings also feel considerably more 'industrial strength' than those of the RE0 - I have read some complaints re quality control on both phones, but nowhere near as many for RE262 compared to the ongoing litany of woe that seems to plague the RE0.


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Hey Joker and Niyologist...thanks for the input on the M9.  I'm really enjoying it and I have another question about the M9 versus the M11+. 
   
  I like the M9 bass extension and it's leagues better than the Ink'd.  I also had a Sennheiser CX475 and I like the M9 much better than that too, but some may prefer the CX475 as it's mid-range is better.  For my tastes though, the bass doesn't have enough impact for me and I'd rather sacrifice some mid range for better bass seeing as I listen to DnB, dubstep, hip hop, house etc.  Plus I think the M9 fits better and is built better with the housing strain relief whereas the CX475 doesn't have that.
   
  Anyways I wanted to know if trying to exchange it for a M11+ makes sense.  I wouldn't want less bass than the M9, if anything I'd like more and to hit more lower frequencies cleanly and increased mid range.  I've read the M11+ definitely has better mid-range, but will I be disappointed if I lose some of the bass of the M9?  Cost would be about $28 for the M11+...make sense or just stick with the M9 ($18) which has about 10 hours listening time without burn-in?
   
  EDIT:  You know what, I'm not going to bother trying changing it.  Rather spend the money on a much better upgrade like the SP51, Hippo VB, or Brainwavz M2.  I'll keep checking around to see what else would suit me.


----------



## EraserXIV

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> I can confirm that the RE262 cable is very good - probably a little stiffer/thicker than some may be accustomed too, but so very much better than my recollections of  the RE0 cable. The housings also feel considerably more 'industrial strength' than those of the RE0 - I have read some complaints re quality control on both phones, but nowhere near as many for RE262 compared to the ongoing litany of woe that seems to plague the RE0.


 


  Agreed, just got my new RE262 in. The new cable on it is much better than the older run of the RE262. It's much more flexible and softer. It may be a tad thicker than the average cable, but I have no complaints at all and am very satisfied. Sounds just as great as I remembered it the first time I owned them, these liquid smooth mids are addicting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Anyways I wanted to know if trying to exchange it for a M11+ makes sense.  I wouldn't want less bass than the M9, if anything I'd like more and to hit more lower frequencies cleanly and increased mid range.  I've read the M11+ definitely has better mid-range, but will I be disappointed if I lose some of the bass of the M9?  Cost would be about $28 for the M11+...make sense or just stick with the M9 ($18) which has about 10 hours listening time without burn-in?


 

 The M11+ has plenty of bass - very close in quantity to the M9 with less recessed mids to boot. If you wanted more bass, however, you should probably hold off for the SP51 w/extreme port or M31.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker you should put a paypal on your account somewhere im sure many of us would donate a buck or two
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  The Head-Fi community bought me a UM Miracle (that thread is linked somewhere in the Miracle review). They are fantastic IEMs and I really couldn't ask for more.


----------



## battleaxe

I am sure this has been asked and mentioned here somewhere, but how long do you do a burn-in(if you do any) before you start to use the IEM? What is the difference between the Ultimate Ears SuperFi 5 Pro and EB versions in your testing so far?


----------



## OnlinePredator

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> And it may very well continue on that same path since it's rumored to be discontinued in the near future...


 


   
   
  Really?Says who?


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The M11+ has plenty of bass - very close in quantity to the M9 with less recessed mids to boot. If you wanted more bass, however, you should probably hold off for the SP51 w/extreme port or M31.


 


  I'm also thinking about the VB, which I'd do if they'll honor 3 year Squaretrade warranty against any channel imbalances or a driver dying beyond the standard 1 yr.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





battleaxe said:


> I am sure this has been asked and mentioned here somewhere, but how long do you do a burn-in(if you do any) before you start to use the IEM? What is the difference between the Ultimate Ears SuperFi 5 Pro and EB versions in your testing so far?


 

 100 hours with the same combination of music, white noise, and pink noise on a loop.
   
  The SF5Pro and SF5EB don't have much of anything in common except part of the model name, the manufacturer, and the cable. EB is a bass monster; 5 Pro is pretty well balanced, maybe a little dark but not too bad. I like both better than the new SuperFi 5 / UE600.
   


  Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> I'm also thinking about the VB, which I'd do if they'll honor 3 year Squaretrade warranty against any channel imbalances or a driver dying beyond the standard 1 yr.


 


  The VB and it also drops off in bass emphasis more quickly than the M9/SP51, both of which have enhanced mid-bass as well as sub-bass. VB does sound cleaner, though.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


onlinepredator said:


> Really?Says who?


 

 See *this post* and onward.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The VB and it also drops off in bass emphasis more quickly than the M9/SP51, both of which have enhanced mid-bass as well as sub-bass. VB does sound cleaner, though.


 


  Yeah I'm most likely going for the SP51 especially if I can get a better price on it later.  What would be your top 5 <$50 phones with sub bass extension/warm signature but also clear midrange along with highs that aren't piercing/sharp...in general have an open feeling to them with maximum deep bass impact?   I was thinking about spending a little more for the Hippo VB's bc they seem highly regarded for bassheads, but now I'm not so sure seeing as the bass emphasis drops off quicker than the SP51's.
   
  BTW Newegg.com has the M9's until 10/31 for $11.99 plus free shipping (coupon code *EMCJKHE65).*  Same price as the Ink'd, yet sooooo much better hahaha.


----------



## Prazzyp

what do you have to say about these comparisons?
   
  Monster Turbine vs Beats Solo HD
  Monster Turbine Gold vs Beats Studio
  Monster Turbine Gold vs Beats Pro
   
  it would help if you could rank these accordingly in terms of which has the best sound quality to the one with worst


----------



## coldmack

What is your favorite headphone in the under $100 class(either at the time of review or now price has been lowered to under $100).


----------



## ChavaC

Such an awesome thread. I've been looking for an upgrade over my RE0s, now I'm stuck deciding between the 272 and ck10. It seems like the hifiman is the obvious choice?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Yeah I'm most likely going for the SP51 especially if I can get a better price on it later.  What would be your top 5 <$50 phones with sub bass extension/warm signature but also clear midrange along with highs that aren't piercing/sharp...in general have an open feeling to them with maximum deep bass impact?   I was thinking about spending a little more for the Hippo VB's bc they seem highly regarded for bassheads, but now I'm not so sure seeing as the bass emphasis drops off quicker than the SP51's.


 

 SP51 would be a contender if you can find it at that price; same goes for the Xears sets, though they will probably come out a bit above $50 with shipping . At regular prices the Soundmagic E10 and Dunu Trident, though the E10 isn't that smooth and the Trident isn't that open-sounding. If you want monster bass there's also the Padacs Aksent around that price. That's more of an M31 competitor in being a touch less refined overall than these others.
   


  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> what do you have to say about these comparisons?
> 
> Monster Turbine vs Beats Solo HD
> Monster Turbine Gold vs Beats Studio
> ...


 

 MTPG > MTB > Beats Studio > Beats Solo HD. I don't know what the pro sounds like.
   


  Quote: 





coldmack said:


> What is your favorite headphone in the under $100 class(either at the time of review or now price has been lowered to under $100).


 

 Purely in terms of sound and now that the Klipsch Custom 3, Panasonic HJE900, and Sunrise Xcape v1 are not available at <$100, probably the Xcape IE or RE0.
   


  Quote: 





chavac said:


> Such an awesome thread. I've been looking for an upgrade over my RE0s, now I'm stuck deciding between the 272 and ck10. It seems like the hifiman is the obvious choice?


 

 Obvious if you want to avoid the aggression/edginess of a BA-based earphone. There's no bad option there.


----------



## dfrost

Joker,
   
  Your willingness to give thoughtful responses and suggestions is endlessly amazing. So now I'll ask for one:
   
  I'm looking for a gym (mostly) IEM. Budget is $50-ish, and I have PayPal money to spend. They'll be used with a new 16Gb iPod Nano.
   
  Sound signature preference: I love both pairs of Fischer DBA-02 (enough bass in my ears) and Sunrise Xcape (v.1). I might have used the Xcape here, but they've become intermittent in the left channel, and being an endangered species with "sketchy' build quality, probably not the best choice for this application. NE-7M, Hippo VB, MEElec M-9 were all to bass-prominent for my tastes.
   
  Candidates:
  MEElec A151 (great price from Newegg)
  MEElec CC51 (pretty good price from Buy.com)
  Brainwavz M1
  Soundmagic E30 - not sure about the fit with my ears
  Soundmagic E10
  One of the H20 Audio Surge models - for the waterproof-ness


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Now I just gotta wait for the right price to pull the trigger on any of them on my list.  Thanks a lot for the input Joker!


----------



## HeatFan12

Joker, received a couple SoundMAGICs today (E10 & PL30)...Of course you were dead on especially with the cable...the rubbery is driving me nuts...I like the sig though...Thanks...The PL30s need to get with it and give me some bass...The slam is there but the depth needs to get lower...
   
  Wait til' I get my JVC Explosives tomorrow, I'll show those PL30s how to reach down and grab some....lol
   
  The E10s shine with some guitar rock...I have pressed repeat about 5 times for Alter Bridge- Down To My Last.....The vocals on that track with some phones sound sibilant and the guitars get muddied...The E10s handle it very well.....No sibilance and the guitars are very smooth with edginess....For 35 beans, I have made a great investment....
   
  Again, thanks so much for the work you do bro.......


----------



## ljokerl

Added two for the bass lovers - Fischer Audio Consonance and Ultimate Ears 350
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(3A61) Ultimate Ears 350 / 350vi*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Oct 2011
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C43) Fischer Audio Consonance*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Oct 2011
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





dfrost said:


> Joker,
> 
> Your willingness to give thoughtful responses and suggestions is endlessly amazing. So now I'll ask for one:
> 
> ...


 

 I wouldn't use the CC51 at the gym and the E10 will be way to bassy if you couldn't handle the NE-7M. The H2O sets are nice but don't really compete with these others on sound. Truth be told, the only H2O that gives great value for money these days is the $19 Flex. I think you will like all three of the rest and they are about evenly matched in performance. It would depend on how you would like to complete your collection at that point - with the more detailed but slightly dark A151, the smoother, thicker, more mid-centric M1, or the more bassy but surprisingly spacious and clear E30.
   


  Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Now I just gotta wait for the right price to pull the trigger on any of them on my list.  Thanks a lot for the input Joker!


 

 Good luck!
   


  Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> Joker, received a couple SoundMAGICs today (E10 & PL30)...Of course you were dead on especially with the cable...the rubbery is driving me nuts...I like the sig though...Thanks...The PL30s need to get with it and give me some bass...The slam is there but the depth needs to get lower...
> 
> Wait til' I get my JVC Explosives tomorrow, I'll show those PL30s how to reach down and grab some....lol
> 
> ...


 

 In a way Soundmagic already responded to all criticisms of the PL30's bass with the E30. Both are great value, the E10 is (IMO) nearly unbeatable for straight-up fun at its price point.


----------



## jnd3344

what would you recommend as a better earphone for bass lovers the consonance or the eterna?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## nikp

Glad to see UE IEMs surfacing in your comparisons, Joker!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jnd3344 said:


> what would you recommend as a better earphone for bass lovers the consonance or the eterna?


 
   
   
  For a significant overall improvement you'd have to spend a lot more, along the lines of a Radius DDM or JVC HA-FX500 or Future Sonics Atrio.

  
  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> and becuase of the lack of a port they create an intesnse seal sometimes if i push them in too deeply, and it kills the driver volume of one or both sides. anyway to avoid this? appreciate it greatly


 


  It's called driver flex and there's a thread about it somewhere. 
   
   

  
  Quote: 





nikp said:


> Glad to see UE IEMs surfacing in your comparisons, Joker!


 


 It'll take some time to sort through them but at least the first step has been made.


----------



## jnd3344

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For a significant overall improvement you'd have to spend a lot more, along the lines of a Radius DDM or JVC HA-FX500 or Future Sonics Atrio.


 
  but if you could only pick between the two?


----------



## kalthus

Hey joker, your reviews are awesome! i had been using the meelec M9 for quite sometime and i love the treble and bass it gives me.. im not so much of an audiophile so i don't really need high-end IEMs.. Currently i am looking for an upgrade from my M9 and i don't wish to spend more than $50 on it.. my question is, is the Brainwavz M1 a worthy upgrade over the M9 if treble and bass were my priority?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Bola 7

*ljokerl,*
   
  http://headfonics.com/2011/10/akg-k3003-is-this-the-best-universal-iem-in-the-world/


----------



## kingice10

I tried the AKG K3003 and it's not as breathtaking as similar prized iems, er custom iems... the sound is balanced with the regular filter, bass is controlled, mids are slightly forward and they are a bit sibilant. Though I expect them to have airy highs or a grand soundstage like the custom iems but to my disappointment, they don't have. So not a good buy for an iem, maybe it's much better to buy a custom for that money.
   
  I tried them on Stereo Store here and shocked as they are around 1.6KSGD, more than the UM Miracles' 1.3KSGD displayed, which I really liked. Why did AKG priced an iem like that? So I'm still in question with those iems.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jnd3344 said:


> but if you could only pick between the two?


 

 Oh... either I suppose. It's actually easier to get big bass out of the Consonance with its conventional fit but i think a bass lover will be thrilled with both.
   


  Quote: 





kalthus said:


> Hey joker, your reviews are awesome! i had been using the meelec M9 for quite sometime and i love the treble and bass it gives me.. im not so much of an audiophile so i don't really need high-end IEMs.. Currently i am looking for an upgrade from my M9 and i don't wish to spend more than $50 on it.. my question is, is the Brainwavz M1 a worthy upgrade over the M9 if treble and bass were my priority?
> 
> Thanks!


 

 No, not at all. The M1 has little bass compared to the M9. I would try a MEElec SP51 or Soundmagic E10 instead. Don't expect significantly more bass out of either compared to the M9 but they are bassy and the overall sound quality is noticeably better.


----------



## nizarp

Hey joker,
   
  Could you please compare SQ of RE-ZERO and GR07?


----------



## carfentanil

Wow. Just as soon as I thought the bar had been raised high enough to stick for awhile by FAD and UM, AKG comes in with a HYBRID UNIVERSAL (shock and curiosity here) at a thousand euro. I've got a dozen emotions in reaction and don't know which is the most remarkable... Who will be next to deliver Dual BA + Dynamic ??

 For that money, I'd rather have a 5-Way from SpiralEar... I don't see how any Uni can compete. Not to mention the Merlin is a player in that game, too...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nizarp said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> Could you please compare SQ of RE-ZERO and GR07?


 


  Compare in what way? The most striking differences will be in bass depth/impact and soundstage size/accuracy, with the GR07 winning by a fairly large margin.


  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> Wow. Just as soon as I thought the bar had been raised high enough to stick for awhile by FAD and UM, AKG comes in with a HYBRID UNIVERSAL (shock and curiosity here) at a thousand euro. I've got a dozen emotions in reaction and don't know which is the most remarkable... Who will be next to deliver Dual BA + Dynamic ??
> 
> For that money, I'd rather have a 5-Way from SpiralEar... I don't see how any Uni can compete. Not to mention the Merlin is a player in that game, too...


 

 Not the first hybrid universal - UE did it years ago with the now-defunct SuperFi 5 EB (1x dynamic, 1x armature) and Scosche did it more recently with the IEM856 (1x dynamic, 1x armature).


----------



## Inks

While the GR07 has a much wider stage, the RE-Zero actually has some depth in it's stage whereas the GR07 is more 2D. The RE-Zero is more intimate in comparison, specially because of it's slightly forward midrange. RE-Zero has a notch less bass, but more clarity in it's mids along with more air on top. The RE-Zero has better imaging and speed. GR07 has a thicker note and more bass extension. The RE-Zero is on par imo, but with a deep insertion. 
   
  I personally like how the K3003 isn't a bass monster, all the other hybrids have been more bass lenient (even the customs) from what I've read and seeing graphs. Haven't seen much on the Scosche though.


----------



## jjmai

Consonance sounds interesting, if it's so much like my all-time favorite Eterna v1.  Personally, I prefer the over-the-ear form factor, so I think I'll hold off buying Consonance


----------



## estreeter

This thread is like a freight train - just wanted to interject and say that I think FA are a godsend for all of us, but particularly IEM fans. Should have bought the Eterna the last time I was in Malaysia.


----------



## nizarp

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Compare in what way? The most striking differences will be in bass depth/impact and soundstage size/accuracy, with the GR07 winning by a fairly large margin.


 
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> While the GR07 has a much wider stage, the RE-Zero actually has some depth in it's stage whereas the GR07 is more 2D. The RE-Zero is more intimate in comparison, specially because of it's slightly forward midrange. RE-Zero has a notch less bass, but more clarity in it's mids along with more air on top. The RE-Zero has better imaging and speed. GR07 has a thicker note and more bass extension. The RE-Zero is on par imo, but with a deep insertion.


 
   
  Thanks a lot joker and Inks. How do they compare in dynamic range?


----------



## Inks

RE-Zero has more dynamic range by a bit.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> This thread is like a freight train - just wanted to interject and say that I think FA are a godsend for all of us, but particularly IEM fans. Should have bought the Eterna the last time I was in Malaysia.


 
   
  Better retail presence worldwide would help them out but I am very impressed with the sound of the two mid-range products I've got - the Tandem and another that's in the queue. 

  
  Quote: 





nizarp said:


> Thanks a lot joker and Inks. How do they compare in dynamic range?


 
   
  IMO dynamics are neither a strength nor a weakness of either but the ZERO is more impressive at its price point.


----------



## VyRuZ

Hello, guys! Sorry in advance for the wall of text.
   
  Long time lurker, first time poster, here. Thank you for this immense effort of reviewing all of these IEMs, so we can make more educated purchases.
   
  On the same topic of purchase, I want to get my hands on a more expensive set of IEMs. Right now, *my source* is a *Nokia 5310 XpressMusic*, playing at least V0 MP3s and mostly 320 MP3s of various *bassy electronic music, including Drum'n'Bass, Dubstep, Tech House, Minimal, Breakbeat* and mostly anything room-shaking. *My experience with headphones is my Sennheiser HD201 pair, which I love. Great and warm bass for my tastes, good clarity and detail all around.*
   
  On IEMs, I have a 30$ Sony pair, don't remember the model, overpriced from where I bought them, so actual retail price would be 20$ or less. 
   
  I want to experience my music better, so I thought of buying a new pair of IEMs. Read through all the reviews until the 100$ category, and settled on the following two sets:* the ViSang R03 / Brainwavz M2 *or the *Fischer Audio Eterna (*with HiSoundAudio Crystal as another option)
   
  I can't afford losing the IEMs in under a year, I want them to be quality-made. I've excluded any HiFiMan products because a LOT of Amazon reviewers had failed IEMs in a month. I also don't care much about a totally precise sound. I like how my HD201 sound, if that is any indication of what I would like.
   
  So, guys, what should I pick? Both headphones have free shipping also, but the Eterna is out of stock and I'm bad at waiting. Should I wait? Would my source be OK for such headphones? Should I consider a portable amp? (I've been thinking about the new digiZoid ZO2, but it's kind of expensive and I would much prefer better headphones first) Any other things you guys might want to share?
   
  Thanks in advance!


----------



## Sweden

Does it help having some form of manic disorder or Aspergers doing this?
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




*When you hit 400 or 500 I think it would be a very nice and proper thing for any frequent reader of this thread to donate say 10 bucks or whatever they feel comfortable donating in gratitude so you can get what you feel is the ultimate in custom IEM's.* Or maybe it's time then to get some proper headphones then?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Just an idea.


----------



## Sweden

I had the Eterna for a couple of months and they had a pretty fun sound.
  Great bass, but the recessed mids and slightly hard treble with not the best clarity made me sell then.
  Great for electronic music though.
  I didn't feel they had a partcularly good build quality. The cable was the worst I've ever encountered! Tangle heaven.
 Just my 2 cents. Or ören..
  
  Quote: 





vyruz said:


> * the ViSang R03 / Brainwavz M2 *or the *Fischer Audio Eterna *


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vyruz said:


> Hello, guys! Sorry in advance for the wall of text.
> 
> Long time lurker, first time poster, here. Thank you for this immense effort of reviewing all of these IEMs, so we can make more educated purchases.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I would think the Consonance might be preferable to the Eterna and so far it seems pretty well put together. It's a lot of fun, too. The M2 has a lot more midrange emphasis in comparison but that won't necessarily be better for your genres. You could also go for a Beyer DTX 101 iE - it's pretty bassy and has excellent build quality. I wouldn't bother with a portable amp at this level. 
  
   


  Quote: 





sweden said:


> Does it help having some form of manic disorder or Aspergers doing this?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I already got the UM Miracle in this fashion 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. There's a thread about it.


----------



## estreeter

Sigh - you've done it again, Joker - will have to make room for the Consonance, but I absolutely agree re FA's retail presence. Old biases die hard, but dealing with a company in Russia still concerns me (as opposed to handing my credit card details to every Chinese e-merchant advertising on Head-Fi ...)


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Sigh - you've done it again, Joker - will have to make room for the Consonance, but I absolutely agree re FA's retail presence. Old biases die hard, but dealing with a company in Russia still concerns me (as opposed to handing my credit card details to every Chinese e-merchant advertising on Head-Fi ...)


 

 I suppose you could ask FrogBeats if they intend to stock the Consonance if you trust them more. Their prices for the other Fischer stuff are reasonable.


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker i knows this sounds really redundant but i need your help one last time. do you like the superfi4 or ue500 better? i mostly listen to rock metal and rap. i want the drums and cymbals, instruments everything to stand outaccurately and clear on the metal and rock and on the rap to have fun bass thanks in advance


 

 I like the UE500 better. It is more v-shaped but it has better clarity and good detail across more of the spectrum, as well as a bigger/more open soundstage. The SF4 struggles with high/low extension and sounds a little dry overall. It's most likely based around a Knowles Siren but out of the Siren-based earphones I definitely prefer the A151 to it and probably the PL50 as well.


----------



## Sweden

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I already got the UM Miracle in this fashion
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Talk about being late on the ball
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  However when you hit 500 I'm sure those miracle will be called mediocre instead of miracle...


----------



## putente

*ljokerl*, first of all, as a regular reader/follower of your reviews, let me congratulate you for your excelent work! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Now, about those Vsonic GR07, I've been reading a lot about them, as I might buy them. According to your table in the first page, in that price range, they are the best buy model, right? I'm just concerned about everyone saying they're quite sibilant at first, and then they settle down after some hundred hours of burn-in. Well, as I hate sibilance, and I easilly get annoyd with it, are these IEM for me? Does that sibilance everyone says they have really goes away after burn-in, or is it just reduced but still quite present?
   
  I'm looking for a good pair of IEM, with good mids, soft (easy, but detailed) highs and, the most important for me, good bass and strong impact (as a drummer, I really enjoy "feeling" the beats)!


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> MTPG > MTB > Beats Studio > Beats Solo HD. I don't know what the pro sounds like.


 

 wow so the regular turbines are better sounding that the beats studio?
   
  how do each of the headphones rank in terms of bass only?


----------



## DnB Sublimity

This weekend...MEElectronics SP51 for $27 http://www.meelec.com/Sound_Preference_In_Ear_Headphones_s/330.htm.  Coupon codes:  "SPooky51" "SHIPPING_COUPON"
   
  I just got one!!!   SOOOO EXCITED!!!!!!  Best $27 I've spent in a while!!!!  Woo-hoo!!!


----------



## imackler

So just got a used GR07...really impressive. Quite shocked at this price point. Just fantastic. Not perfect, but, wow, these things are good. To think this kind of quality can now be found at this price point... It's a good day to love music.
   
  Now, I'm enjoying all kinds of music on the GR07. But it wouldn't be my first pick for the classical side. Right now, I got a W2 (which I ordered before reading you didn't like it). The more I listen to the more I likeit  (especially w/ the Shure Olives; olives are almost a must w/ W2). It does lots of things decently and the olives open them up quite a bit and shrink the veil back. What do you think we would compliment the GR07 for classical, especially strings/baroque, fast stuff w/ lots of detail. Should I stick w/ the W2, which is definitely not bad, or go for the RE272? From reading, it seems like the RE272 could be a great compliment to the GR07...
   
  Thanks as always!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





putente said:


> *ljokerl*, first of all, as a regular reader/follower of your reviews, let me congratulate you for your excelent work!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  Some of those who found them moderately sibilant at first still find them very mildly sibilant after burn-in. Some don't even find them sibilant to start with. It varies a lot based on ear geometry, personal sensitivity to sibilance, and maybe even individual unit. They are a safe buy for most people but in the end there is no way to know for sure without trying them. 


  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> wow so the regular turbines are better sounding that the beats studio?
> 
> how do each of the headphones rank in terms of bass only?


 
   
  Bass is perceived differently between in-ears and full-size headphones. I would say both of the headphones are more tactile and impactful in the conventional sense than the in-ears but it's nasty one-note bass rather than the rich, textured bass of Turbine Golds (and to a lesser extent regular Turbines).
   


  Quote: 





imackler said:


> So just got a used GR07...really impressive. Quite shocked at this price point. Just fantastic. Not perfect, but, wow, these things are good. To think this kind of quality can now be found at this price point... It's a good day to love music.
> 
> Now, I'm enjoying all kinds of music on the GR07. But it wouldn't be my first pick for the classical side. Right now, I got a W2 (which I ordered before reading you didn't like it). The more I listen to the more I likeit  (especially w/ the Shure Olives; olives are almost a must w/ W2). It does lots of things decently and the olives open them up quite a bit and shrink the veil back. What do you think we would compliment the GR07 for classical, especially strings/baroque, fast stuff w/ lots of detail. Should I stick w/ the W2, which is definitely not bad, or go for the RE272? From reading, it seems like the RE272 could be a great compliment to the GR07...
> 
> Thanks as always!


 
  I definitely like the RE272 better than the W2 but that's just me. I have nothing against the W2 from a technical standpoint but the RE272 does not require different tips to lift the veil (seeing as how there isn't one). It certainly is a less aggressive, more liquid complement to the GR07 if you can be happy with its somewhat recessed deep bass.


----------



## imackler

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I definitely like the RE272 better than the W2 but that's just me. I have nothing against the W2 from a technical standpoint but the RE272 does not require different tips to lift the veil (seeing as how there isn't one). It certainly is a less aggressive, more liquid complement to the GR07 if you can be happy with its somewhat recessed deep bass.


 

 Thanks! I _like _liquid but the lack of bass scares me a little, though I'm fine w/ less than the GR07. I've read that it has less than the etymotic brand...would you say that?
   
  I'm not sure what kind of music you like. Apart from the top tier customs, which iem do you think does the best job with a violin or cello solo, or a string quartet? Timber is really important and extended treble w/o grain.  I find that these instruements are just so demanding to reproduce really, really well. So far, I've like what the Westone 4 and ER4P have done (both I've sold off, but I may be crazy...), but I'm interested what you would think, especially in the dynamic driver options?
   
  And, just because its interesting, what music have you been listening to a lot of recently?


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  how's the bass quantity, quality, texture, impact, treble, treble extension of X-IE when compare to Brainwavz M2? Will it be a wise decision to sell my M2 and get the X-IE?
   
  How does Thinksound TS02+mic and Phiaton PS20 stand against Brainwavz M2 and also plz compare Thinksound TS02+mic and Phiaton PS20 to the M2 in bass, mids, treble, soundstage, treble brightness and all.


----------



## coldmack

Do you have any plans to review the Monster Tron IEM?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





imackler said:


> Thanks! I _like _liquid but the lack of bass scares me a little, though I'm fine w/ less than the GR07. I've read that it has less than the etymotic brand...would you say that?
> 
> I'm not sure what kind of music you like. Apart from the top tier customs, which iem do you think does the best job with a violin or cello solo, or a string quartet? Timber is really important and extended treble w/o grain.  I find that these instruements are just so demanding to reproduce really, really well. So far, I've like what the Westone 4 and ER4P have done (both I've sold off, but I may be crazy...), but I'm interested what you would think, especially in the dynamic driver options?
> 
> And, just because its interesting, what music have you been listening to a lot of recently?


 

 The bass of the RE272 is a bit odd. On the one hand it is very controlled and detailed. I really don't find it lacking listening to just the RE272 for a while. However, even compared to balanced or analytical IEMs such as the CK10, j-phonic K2 SP, or even ER4S, impact just seems to be less sharp, less tactile. It really seems like lower notes are pushed further into the background and a little softer and more 'rounded' than they should be. In that sense my ER4S can pull ahead of the RE272 but I think it tends to decay a bit too quickly on average.
   
  I quite like the JVC FX700 with strings except when the bass gets in the way, as well as the EX1000, though it's not exactly flat. Ditto on the W4, though obviously that's not dynamic. I've been using the FX500 and EX600 lately, courtesy of Inks, and while I think they are reasonable approximations of the EX1000 and FX700, they are a little less refined (a-la GR07) which tends to get on my nerves at times.
   
  On my own time I listen mostly to prog rock as well as some metal and electronica. More recently - post-rock, space rock, atmospheric, etc.
   
  Track off the album that's playing right this moment:
   




   
  and the next one:
   




    
   
  Quote:


abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> how's the bass quantity, quality, texture, impact, treble, treble extension of X-IE when compare to Brainwavz M2? Will it be a wise decision to sell my M2 and get the X-IE?
> 
> How does Thinksound TS02+mic and Phiaton PS20 stand against Brainwavz M2 and also plz compare Thinksound TS02+mic and Phiaton PS20 to the M2 in bass, mids, treble, soundstage, treble brightness and all.


 

 I can't recommend buying the X-IE at the moment due to build quality issues. I like the M2 better than the PS20 and TS02. The PS20 is more of a smooth, relaxed sound with less forward mids and lower bass impact. The TS02 is more v-shaped, again with less forward mids, a bit more treble sparkle, and similar bass impact with a little more depth. The PS20 has the widest soundstage. For more specifics you'll have to read the reviews - I haven't listened to the TS02 in a while.
   


  Quote: 





coldmack said:


> Do you have any plans to review the Monster Tron IEM?


 

 Everything I have plans to review is listed on the front page of the thread, below the table.


----------



## Niyologist

How does the JVC HA FX-500 sound like?


----------



## Austin Morrow

I'm waiting for the day I see the AKG K3003 review up on this thread.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I can't recommend buying the X-IE at the moment due to build quality issues. I like the M2 better than the PS20 and TS02. The PS20 is more of a smooth, relaxed sound with less forward mids and lower bass impact. The TS02 is more v-shaped, again with less forward mids, a bit more treble sparkle, and similar bass impact with a little more depth. The PS20 has the widest soundstage. For more specifics you'll have to read the reviews - I haven't listened to the TS02 in a while.


 
   
  Then I think I will need to stick with the M2's only


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> How does the JVC HA FX-500 sound like?


 

 In many ways like an FX700 but with harder treble. Review coming soon.
   


  Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> I'm waiting for the day I see the AKG K3003 review up on this thread.


 

 Me too. Someone should tell AKG to send me one


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> In many ways like an FX700 but with harder treble. Review coming soon.


 

       Thanks for the preview.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> In many ways like an FX700 but with harder treble. Review coming soon.
> 
> 
> Me too. Someone should tell AKG to send me one


 


  I'll get an email out. I've tried to get a review sample for my website, but alas, to no avail. I'll tell them that the biggest IEM junkie in the headphone world would like to review your flagship.


----------



## carfentanil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Compare in what way? The most striking differences will be in bass depth/impact and soundstage size/accuracy, with the GR07 winning by a fairly large margin.
> 
> Not the first hybrid universal - UE did it years ago with the now-defunct SuperFi 5 EB (1x dynamic, 1x armature) and Scosche did it more recently with the IEM856 (1x dynamic, 1x armature).


 

  
  that was ignorance on my part, not meant to claim it the first ever hybrid-u, just one that may have tremendous potential and wondering which company will be the next to continue what may become a promising trend...


----------



## Dirian

@ *ljokerl* - are you heard Brainwavz ProAlpha? Are they better than Brainwavz M1?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## RealSlimSeto

I wonder, would going from MTPCs to the GR07 be an upgrade?


----------



## Selenium

Well, it's 0.2 points higher on Joker's SQ scale.
  
  Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> I wonder, would going from MTPCs to the GR07 be an upgrade?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> that was ignorance on my part, not meant to claim it the first ever hybrid-u, just one that may have tremendous potential and wondering which company will be the next to continue what may become a promising trend...


 

 I haven't heard the Scosche but I thought the SF5EB had quite a lot of potential so I'm with you there. The drivers were out of whack with each other but otherwise there was surprisingly good midrange-treble performance for the amount of bass it had. And the form factor was terrible.
  
  Quote: 





dirian said:


> @ *ljokerl* - are you heard Brainwavz ProAlpha? Are they better than Brainwavz M1?


 

 The ProAlpha is also called the ViSang R02. It's mentioned a number of times in the M1 review and also has its own review in this thread.
   
   
  Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> I wonder, would going from MTPCs to the GR07 be an upgrade?


 

 Depends on what you're after. If it's accuracy and neutrality - yes.


----------



## jayvier

Am currently using Sennheiser CX 300-II Precision, would like to change to Ultimate Ears 400vi.
  What would you recommend?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jayvier said:


> Am currently using Sennheiser CX 300-II Precision, would like to change to Ultimate Ears 400vi.
> What would you recommend?


 


  I have no experience with the CX300-II. If the UE400 is the same as the UE500, it's a pretty good earphone for the price.


----------



## SoulSyde

Since returning my UM3X I've been trying to find a cheaper alternative that comes even somewhat close to their amazing presentation.
   
  My SoundMAGIC E30s arrived today.  My first impression was... meh.  It turns out they needed the right tips.  For me, the large clear UE tips work perfectly - allowing for a tight seal and better bass response.  OK, these things are in no way close to the awesomeness of the UM3X, but they're in the right area.  Warm, slightly mid-centric.  Not as forward and intimate as the UM3X.  Vocals and guitar do well with them.  During busy sections of music the separation is not nearly as good as the UM3X.  The bottom line, for rock and funk these things are great for <$40.  I'm listening to Rush right now and having more fun than my SE535s.  Something is seriously wrong here!
   
  Still... I'm looking for the next "cheap-o-UM3X."  My Brainwavz M2s should be arriving soon.  I'm holding hope.


----------



## staxxx

Looking forward to the EX600 review and I wouldn't mind a review on the JVC HA-FXC51.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





soulsyde said:


> Since returning my UM3X I've been trying to find a cheaper alternative that comes even somewhat close to their amazing presentation.
> 
> My SoundMAGIC E30s arrived today.  My first impression was... meh.  It turns out they needed the right tips.  For me, the large clear UE tips work perfectly - allowing for a tight seal and better bass response.  OK, these things are in no way close to the awesomeness of the UM3X, but they're in the right area.  Warm, slightly mid-centric.  Not as forward and intimate as the UM3X.  Vocals and guitar do well with them.  During busy sections of music the separation is not nearly as good as the UM3X.  The bottom line, for rock and funk these things are great for <$40.  I'm listening to Rush right now and having more fun than my SE535s.  Something is seriously wrong here!
> 
> Still... I'm looking for the next "cheap-o-UM3X."  My Brainwavz M2s should be arriving soon.  I'm holding hope.


 

 I got a bit of a UM3X-ish feel from the UE 600 / SuperFi 5. It's too bad UE isn't having more of those $55-65 sales because $100 is way too much. M2 is a good choice as well.. curious as to whether you will like them better than the E30.


----------



## SoulSyde

I may snag a pair of UE 600s if they do another amazing sale on them.  I'll let you know my thoughts on the M2 shortly.


----------



## unicorn1

hello, I am planning to buy a new iem, my budget isnt munch, so I want to buy hippo 10 or sennheiser cx300-II
 I like tight bass, detail, and good sound stage (well at least from the choices that I made)
  
 so, anybody here knows which iem suits me well? and if you know please tell me the sound signature as well. 
 Thank you


----------



## Anigma

Thanks for this awesome thread! Been reading it alot when looking for new IEMs. Looking forward for more IEM reviews


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





unicorn1 said:


> hello, I am planning to buy a new iem, my budget isnt munch, so I want to buy hippo 10 or sennheiser cx300-II
> I like tight bass, detail, and good sound stage (well at least from the choices that I made)
> 
> so, anybody here knows which iem suits me well? and if you know please tell me the sound signature as well.
> Thank you


 

 I don't know what the CX300-II sounds like but the Hippo 10 EB is fantastic. Not sure what it costs nowadays but for a while it was <$40 which is an amazing deal for balanced sound. Cable noise is its biggest flaw but otherwise very competent. 
   


  Quote: 





anigma said:


> Thanks for this awesome thread! Been reading it alot when looking for new IEMs. Looking forward for more IEM reviews


 





  
  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> where do they have sales like that for the ue600? direct from logitech.com? can they be worn down normally and do they sound any different wearing them this way?


 


  Used to be on amazon goldbox every couple of weeks. Guessing they were just clearing out the pre-logitech packaging. They can be worn cord-down without issue - the nozzles are pretty long so the stems don't get in the way.


----------



## steviiee

Hello,
   
  Can anyone tell me if the MEElectronics are great/okay for hip hop songs, does it have great bass? Because I just got the Klipsch Pro media one's and they barely had any bass.
   
  Thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Hello,
> 
> Can anyone tell me if the MEElectronics are great/okay for hip hop songs, does it have great bass? Because I just got the Klipsch Pro media one's and they barely had any bass.
> 
> Thank you


 


  They have quite a few models that are all different. If you just want bass try an M9. It's cheap enough and the bass goes low and hits hard.


----------



## Niyologist

Those that want to get the Westone 4, check this out:
   
  http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/827589-REG/Westone_WESTONE_4_R_SERIES_WESTONE_4_R_UNIVSL_FIT.html


----------



## kanuka

can anyone comment about the sony ex 310 and 510 fit and isolation? 
  and SQ wise are they worth getting them?


----------



## Alobi

Thanks very much for all the reviews - your review of the GR07 persuaded me to purchase the and I'm loving them. I appreciate all your hard work.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





alobi said:


> Thanks very much for all the reviews - your review of the GR07 persuaded me to purchase the and I'm loving them. I appreciate all your hard work.


 

 Enjoy them. I love my pair!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alobi said:


> Thanks very much for all the reviews - your review of the GR07 persuaded me to purchase the and I'm loving them. I appreciate all your hard work.


 


  Thanks, glad you like your GR07


----------



## Louis8ball

.....   ,,,,   ....   ////   \\\\   ....   ,,,,   .....


----------



## zzffnn

.


----------



## lukeskymac

I've ordered the Vsonic GR07 after asking around here one month ago, through Lend Me UR Ears. It still hasn't arrived. I phoned my country's mail service, and they said the package never arrived, and that the sender would have to file a complaint with their mail service: Singapore's SingPost.
   
  I've replied to Lend's order confirmation mail, and sent a feedback message to SingPost with the order's code. Funnily enough, they had a "compliments" section on their site, but no "complaints" or straight-up "support", just feedback.
   
  I should've asked for a FedEx delivery... Damn, I only want my IEMs... If anyone could give me some tips, or tell me if Lend Me UR Ears has an account here (they have twitter but never tweeted at all), please help. I'm desperate.


----------



## shotgunshane

|joker|, how would you compare the Hifiman 262 to the Fischer Audio Tandem?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> I've ordered the Vsonic GR07 after asking around here one month ago, through Lend Me UR Ears. It still hasn't arrived. I phoned my country's mail service, and they said the package never arrived, and that the sender would have to file a complaint with their mail service: Singapore's SingPost.
> 
> I've replied to Lend's order confirmation mail, and sent a feedback message to SingPost with the order's code. Funnily enough, they had a "compliments" section on their site, but no "complaints" or straight-up "support", just feedback.
> 
> I should've asked for a FedEx delivery... Damn, I only want my IEMs... If anyone could give me some tips, or tell me if Lend Me UR Ears has an account here (they have twitter but never tweeted at all), please help. I'm desperate.


 

 I think they have a facebook page where people ask questions... I'd try that.

  
  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> |joker|, how would you compare the Hifiman 262 to the Fischer Audio Tandem?


 

 RE262 is a little cleaner and more liquid overall but without the bass reach (or sheer power, for that matter) of the Tandem. Tandem will have a bit more thickness to its sound and a bit less resolution and transparency. Both have very smooth, relaxed treble


----------



## StereoNoodles

Radius Atomic Bass vs. MeElectronics M9?
   
  I really think the earbuds around that price range that stands a chance against the M9's are perhaps the Atomic Bass?
  Opinions?


----------



## SolidSnake3

Hey Joker,
   
  Just wanted to let you know that I got a pair of the HiFiMan RE262's as a replacement for my defective Sunrise Xcape IE's and so far I have been loving them. The sound is just enjoyable and relaxing. I don't think about the fact that I'm wearing IEM's or listening to music. I just listen, sing along and enjoy myself to the nth degree. They are a VERY suitable replacement in that I am quite happy with them and their sound signature. In addition, the form factor/shape actually works for me pretty well.
   
  One quick question, considering an amp for them since they are eating my Ipod Classic 6th battery. 
  Any suggestions besides the Fiio E11? I'm looking for something $100 TOPS that will mainly just help prolong my battery and give the RE262's a bit more oomph.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Joker...there's another thread where OP is loaning out the TFTA 2100-2V1S...I'd love to hear your thoughts on 'em as I was contemplating the bassier version TFTA 2100-3V2B?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Radius Atomic Bass vs. MeElectronics M9?
> 
> I really think the earbuds around that price range that stands a chance against the M9's are perhaps the Atomic Bass?
> Opinions?


 


  I doubt many here have heard the Atomic Bass.


  Quote: 





solidsnake3 said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Just wanted to let you know that I got a pair of the HiFiMan RE262's as a replacement for my defective Sunrise Xcape IE's and so far I have been loving them. The sound is just enjoyable and relaxing. I don't think about the fact that I'm wearing IEM's or listening to music. I just listen, sing along and enjoy myself to the nth degree. They are a VERY suitable replacement in that I am quite happy with them and their sound signature. In addition, the form factor/shape actually works for me pretty well.
> 
> ...


 

 Glad you like the RE262! 
   
  As for amps, I haven't tried the E11 so I really shouldn't comment. My sub-$100 amp of choice is still the mini3. Not exactly known for long battery life, though.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> do the superfi5 have significantly more low end than the superfi4? how about the a151/pl50? i really would rather not buy the a151/pl50 though becuase of they way they must be worn


 


  The SuperFi5 and PL50 have less bass than the SF4. The A151 is similar to the SF4 in bass qty.


  Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Joker...there's another thread where OP is loaning out the TFTA 2100-2V1S...I'd love to hear your thoughts on 'em as I was contemplating the bassier version TFTA 2100-3V2B?


 

 Those look remarkably like the Padacs Aksent.


----------



## i2ehan

ljokerl said:


> Those look remarkably like the Padacs Aksent.




Wow, that is an uncanny resemblance! Never even knew of Padacs until now.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Quote: 





> Those look remarkably like the Padacs Aksent.


 


  Indeed they do.  The only minor difference I can tell in the housings is the TFTA's look like they have some sort of design on the outside.  I wonder if it's the same drivers too?  Now I'm really curious if the Aksent is the same as the TFTA-2100-3V2B at about a third of the price hahaha.


----------



## SolidSnake3

Thanks for the recommendation, I'll look into the mini3 although my big thing is battery life so other amps might be a better choice...


----------



## mac3

Hi joker, what do you think of the Fischer Audio SBA-03. I am thinking of getting either that or the Tandem, but I can't decide which. Bass is important to me, but one thing I do like is to have the mids stand out just as well and clear but recessed highs. This is coming from a set of low end Shures. What do you think?


----------



## Louis8ball

Are there any plans of doing a review of the  _*Grado GR8*_  anytime soon?


----------



## Inks

If you want to know what's coming, he has a list on the first page. FYI the gr8 seems to be a slightly less refined version of the EQ7.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> im trying to find a "fun" ba without breaking the bank, in my range are the sf4 mee a151 soundmagic pl50  i think the superfi5 at around $90-100 would be a stretch for me, and thats all i know of. you just said the pl50 have the least low end, so i guess that means its only between the sf4 and a151? which sounds closest to a air dispersing moving coil?


 

 Pretty sure they use the same driver so it would be a toss up. They are tuned similarly - the MEElecs just have better bass depth and generally sound a bit leaner and more controlled.
   


  Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Indeed they do.  The only minor difference I can tell in the housings is the TFTA's look like they have some sort of design on the outside.  I wonder if it's the same drivers too?  Now I'm really curious if the Aksent is the same as the TFTA-2100-3V2B at about a third of the price hahaha.


 

 Well, someone's going to have to buy both and find out. I was impressed with the Aksent considering the amount of bass it had to deal with.
   


  Quote: 





mac3 said:


> Hi joker, what do you think of the Fischer Audio SBA-03. I am thinking of getting either that or the Tandem, but I can't decide which. Bass is important to me, but one thing I do like is to have the mids stand out just as well and clear but recessed highs. This is coming from a set of low end Shures. What do you think?


 

 You want the Tandem. I would not say the SBA-03 has recessed highs even though it is most aggressive in the midrange. 


  Quote: 





louis8ball said:


> Are there any plans of doing a review of the  _*Grado GR8*_  anytime soon?


 

 All planned reviews are listed on the front page, below the table. No plans for the GR8.


----------



## Bart1981

Hmmm there is one IEM that should be in this comparison, but isn't there yet....
  The ACS T15 Universal. It's getting some serious good reviews.
   
  Personally I'm doubting to get the ACS T15 Universal or the HiFiMan RE262.
  Judging from the few review I read, I think I'll go for the ACS.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## rawrster

Mike,
   
  Since you know my preferences what would you suggest for me. I'm looking for something similar to my preferences but with some warmth similar to say an HD600 but musical. I'm thinking something like the GR07 or that Phonak deal with the PFE111 and get a PFE012 free. I have a M2 but want something better quality with less bass but not too bass light.
   
  I'm finding that my custom is great but not sure that money spent on it is well worth it considering how often I spend using them per day as I don't use earphones as much as I used to..although I may just sell my current customs and get something like a JH5..
   
  edit: Also that JVC FXT90 looks promising


----------



## mojoe24

So I'm having some difficulty figuring out what to buy.  I'm looking to buy some new IEMs and seem to have widdled it down to Brainwavz Beta, Monster Turbine, Creative Aurvana 2, or some Xears (not sure which model yet).  Prices are similar (though the Betas are $20 cheaper) but having inferior quality for less isn't really ideal, however, the reviews all are amazing for the Betas so I think they are worthy of being in the bunch.  But then I don't know much.  I really don't want to spend mroe than $60.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

still waiting for TF10 review.


----------



## h1a8

Digizoid zo. Although I do a fiio e11/zo combo which works very well.


----------



## Barett

I would love a Atrio m5 review. There are only 2 on this site. I understand you are probably super busy doing a bunch of other reviews though haha. AWESOME THREAD. I use it all the time, and finally going to make my first big purchase! @_@ Well my family is for X-Mas hahaha.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Since you know my preferences what would you suggest for me. I'm looking for something similar to my preferences but with some warmth similar to say an HD600 but musical. I'm thinking something like the GR07 or that Phonak deal with the PFE111 and get a PFE012 free. I have a M2 but want something better quality with less bass but not too bass light.
> 
> I'm finding that my custom is great but not sure that money spent on it is well worth it considering how often I spend using them per day as I don't use earphones as much as I used to..although I may just sell my current customs and get something like a JH5..
> 
> edit: Also that JVC FXT90 looks promising


 

 Don't think the GR07 is very HD600-like. Haven't heard the FXT90 yet but I'd consider Fischer's dual dynamic, the Tandem. 
   


  Quote: 





mojoe24 said:


> So I'm having some difficulty figuring out what to buy.  I'm looking to buy some new IEMs and seem to have widdled it down to Brainwavz Beta, Monster Turbine, Creative Aurvana 2, or some Xears (not sure which model yet).  Prices are similar (though the Betas are $20 cheaper) but having inferior quality for less isn't really ideal, however, the reviews all are amazing for the Betas so I think they are worthy of being in the bunch.  But then I don't know much.  I really don't want to spend mroe than $60.


 

 Strange list but out of those I'd go for the Turbine. Haven't heard any Creative IEMs, though, and I'm not sure why you would look at the Beta and not the M2 as a Turbine competitor. 
   


  Quote: 





barett said:


> I would love a Atrio m5 review. There are only 2 on this site. I understand you are probably super busy doing a bunch of other reviews though haha. AWESOME THREAD. I use it all the time, and finally going to make my first big purchase! @_@ Well my family is for X-Mas hahaha.


 

 M5 is just a color designation (black, I think). There are two Atrio reviews in this thread - one of the v2 with the MG5 driver and one of the new MG7 driver.


----------



## DnB Sublimity

I have a random newb question - what's the best way to burn-in earphones without causing damage to the drivers?  I usually play some music from my computer for about 3-4 hours (medium volume), then I leave it overnight plugged into my computer with this burn-in audio file (medium vol), plus any additional listening I may do that day with my mp3 player.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Inks

More drivers doesn't always equal better. I think the single driver PFE is better than most of the multi-ba IEMs I've heard.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Quote: 





inks said:


> More drivers doesn't always equal better. I think the single driver PFE is better than most of the multi-ba IEMs I've heard.


 


  Agreed strongly.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Inks

And that's just one example, the ER4S, EQ5, EQ7 and A1 are among my highest rated BAs. It seems the addition of more drivers has more to do with tuning, to personalize a sound signature since a lot of the drivers are shared among manufacturers. Frequency range is adequate with one BA, stuff from 40 to 15k is the most significant anyway.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Inks

Having a dedicated woofer also doesn't  always mean more bass than usual. I wouldn't worry about the drivers or how many are used and just read reviews or ask joker.


----------



## Anaxilus

The point of multiple drivers should be in rendering more complex and fast music more cleanly, clearly and precisely.  Good theory if you tune the phone and crossover to perform properly, bad theory if you don't which is often the case w/ most multi BAs and especially more common triples.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## nikp

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> anyone heard the apple in ear and know if it sounds better than a superfi4 a151 or pl50? i would like it to have a good soundstage better depth and sound and as close to a moving coil as possible, just more low end basically the synthesizer drops just dont sound the same :'( but i love how they show the instruments so much more like under a razor very easy to hear instrument sepeartion and where they are coming from thats what i want a ba


 

 Nope, ADDIEM doesn't have a good soundstage / depth.


----------



## Austin Morrow

Joker, have I ever told you how awesome you are? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Edit: Same with you Inks, your pretty awesome as well.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Brainwavz Beta & Section 8 Earbuds. Also updated the downloadable rating chart, thanks to carfentanil.
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(3B30) Brainwavz Beta*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Nov 2011
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(3C20) Section 8 Earbuds*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Nov 2011
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> I have a random newb question - what's the best way to burn-in earphones without causing damage to the drivers?  I usually play some music from my computer for about 3-4 hours (medium volume), then I leave it overnight plugged into my computer with this burn-in audio file (medium vol), plus any additional listening I may do that day with my mp3 player.


 

 That should be fine, not too different from my process and I haven't had any major issues.
   


  Quote: 





austin morrow said:


> Joker, have I ever told you how awesome you are?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, and thanks to everyone who fields some of the questions in this thread.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Thanks J!  Much appreciated.


----------



## kanuka

is it me or the re272 big bi-flanges are different from the ones on the re262 ?


----------



## monoglycer

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> the apple in ear really only deserve a 6.2 while the a151 and likes get a 7+? did they really do that bad with designing
> 
> let me rephase it my question. i dont need it to have lots of bass, i actually like a balanced (or a little more bass than flat) responce, but i want to be able to feel the bass there is, which i havent been able to do with the superfi4. will the apple in ear allow me to since it has a dedicated woofer?


 

 Wait...so a low end UE dynamic, and you couldn't feel the bass? Then BA IEMs are not for you at all, they don't move a lot of air so you won't feel the bass, you can hear it but its usually nothing like a dynamic driver.


----------



## LarsHP

@ Joker: Thanks for your huge effort in this thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I am considering the UM Miracle and would like to know your impression of the sound vs. the 10dB peak in the frequency graph around 6kHz.
  Is there an audible peak in that area (if you make a sine sweep) or is it just the mic. set-up that causes this?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## monoglycer

Ah sorry, thought they were dynamics. The bass impact you are looking for will most likely not be found with the addition of a second BA (higher end dual-BA are the exception). The ADDIEM are pretty low cost these days so it wouldn't hurt to try them to find out for yourself.


----------



## TChia

Thanks for the review on the Betas Joker. Can you give some suggestions for an upgrade with a similar sound signature and level of bass, but more refined in areas where the Betas are deficient? Thanks!


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Don't think the GR07 is very HD600-like. Haven't heard the FXT90 yet but I'd consider Fischer's dual dynamic, the Tandem.


 

 I got an offer I couldn't refuse on the GR07 but I'll try them first. I'm a bit hesitant about Fischer Audio due to the sellers as well as the wait. Hopefully the GR07 is what but I'll get them on Friday to find out and hopefully it is what I'm looking for but I'm expecting it to be a slight deviation from them but I may very well just like them.


----------



## mojoe24

Well, I ended up picking up the Brainwavz Beta and am kinda disappointed in them.  Mostly just the isolation.  My crappy Ink'd have better isolation.  Which would you guys recommend in the $50-60 price range with good sound (classical, but also acoustic and hardcore)  but also good isolation as I plan to use them at coffeeshops.


----------



## StereoNoodles

I've been using the MeElectronics M9's for a while now. I think  its time for me to upgrade. I would like it to be under $90 dollars please.
 I prefer Pop ( ex: bruno mars, maroon 5, ect. ), Rap (eminem, Pitbull, ect. ), and Techno (deadmau5, Avicci, ect. )
 Most of the songs have alot going on, so I'm not exactly looking for clarity and perfect detail for now.
 I'm looking for an IEM with sort of the "Night Club" feeling. ( most songs I play would blend well in a night club. )
 A bit bass heavy, but not so much that it ruins everything else.
  
 I would also like it to be very durable, able to handle loads of abuse. ( able to stuff in pocket, can handle harsh pulls, ect.. )
  
 I'm not quite the audiophile, but I do believe I should upgrade from my measly $20 dollars I spent on an IEM..
  
 I think i've narrowed it down to the Brainwavz M2,  Dunu Hephaes, or the Xears IEMs ( TDIII


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> is it me or the re272 big bi-flanges are different from the ones on the re262 ?


 

  There are two sizes. I don't think they are different between the RE262 and RE272 of the current revision.

  
  Quote: 





larshp said:


> @ Joker: Thanks for your huge effort in this thread
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  The emphasis in that region does not come across as 10dB on sweeps and certainly doesn't sound like it to the ear. I'm pretty sure a large part of it is due to the setup they are using as the Miracle simply isn't a bright earphone.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





tchia said:


> Thanks for the review on the Betas Joker. Can you give some suggestions for an upgrade with a similar sound signature and level of bass, but more refined in areas where the Betas are deficient? Thanks!


 
   
  Something on the GR07 end of the scale would have that sort of balance and be a lot more refined, as it should be for 6x the price.
   
   

  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I got an offer I couldn't refuse on the GR07 but I'll try them first. I'm a bit hesitant about Fischer Audio due to the sellers as well as the wait. Hopefully the GR07 is what but I'll get them on Friday to find out and hopefully it is what I'm looking for but I'm expecting it to be a slight deviation from them but I may very well just like them.


 


  I have no doubt you'll like the GR07 - the old rawrster would have found them damn impressive 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I just don't think they are HD600s incarnate.




  
  Quote: 





mojoe24 said:


> Well, I ended up picking up the Brainwavz Beta and am kinda disappointed in them.  Mostly just the isolation.  My crappy Ink'd have better isolation.  Which would you guys recommend in the $50-60 price range with good sound (classical, but also acoustic and hardcore)  but also good isolation as I plan to use them at coffeeshops.


 

 Not entirely sure why you would buy a half-in-ear and expect high noise isolation.
  $50 can get you a CC51 or A151 from MEElec or for a warmer sound a Brainwavz M2 or a refurb Turbine. If you want more balanced sound there's the XR120 Pro II from Xears (if it's still in production).
   


  Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> I've been using the MeElectronics M9's for a while now. I think  its time for me to upgrade. I would like it to be under $90 dollars please.
> I prefer Pop ( ex: bruno mars, maroon 5, ect. ), Rap (eminem, Pitbull, ect. ), and Techno (deadmau5, Avicci, ect. )
> Most of the songs have alot going on, so I'm not exactly looking for clarity and perfect detail for now.
> I'm looking for an IEM with sort of the "Night Club" feeling. ( most songs I play would blend well in a night club. )
> ...


 

 I wouldn't expect high durability from anything Xears and I don't consider the Hephaes to be very good value for money sonically (might as well just get the Trident for half the price). I would go for the Beyer DTX 101 iE. The bass is quite substantial (but not as excessive as with the M9) and there's no weak spots in the construction.


----------



## VyRuZ

As per your recommendation, *ljokerl*, I just ordered the FA Consonance yesterday. What bothers me right now is that the website (gd-audiobase) sent no confirmation so I checked up on Head-Fi to see if other people complained about it... What I found kind of shocked me, with people waiting for 2 months on a pair...
   
  Did I just lose 70$? Did you order from them?


----------



## TechHead

Thanks for the reviews, Joker. I've ordered a pair of Hisound Audio Crystal-2s from eBay. I listen to a lot of My Chemical Romance, Police, Led Zeppelin etc, these should be good for that, correct?


----------



## dogears

Checking in and will wait for the FXT90 and K2 SP review


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Since you know my preferences what would you suggest for me. I'm looking for something similar to my preferences but with some warmth similar to say an HD600 but musical. I'm thinking something like the GR07 or that Phonak deal with the PFE111 and get a PFE012 free. I have a M2 but want something better quality with less bass but not too bass light.


 
   
  Having just got the HD600, I doubt you'll get 'musical HD600' in GR07. I don't think you will be dissatisfied on the bass front though.
   
  Quote: 





dogears said:


> Checking in and will wait for the FXT90 and K2 SP review


 

 Checks in every week, continues waiting for TF10 review


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





stargaterecords said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 how is the sound signature?


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have no doubt you'll like the GR07 - the old rawrster would have found them damn impressive
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I did do some research and it seems I'll like them. The old rawrster also didn't have a headphone rig and had a slightly larger wallet


----------



## muratdeveli

@Joker
   
  I would like to thank you for this great effort of putting things together.
  I am a newbie and your post helped me a lot to order my very first IEM.
   
   
  1- My source will be an iPhone 3G, and sometimes my macbook maybe. So i don't think i may buy very very sensitive IEMS while i don't have enough juice at the moment.
  2- I mostly listen soft rock(U2, Bon Jovi etc.), soft jazz (Kenny G., Norah Jones, Frank Sinatra etc.), some classicals from Mozart, Beethoven etc. and some pop music of all kind from Edith Piaf to Michael Jackson.. And i am not sure about what to look at while checking the reviews about sond quality of the IEMS. I know i don't need extreme bass as i am not a bass head. I like clear sound with lots of details. Bass should be there but more importantly Vocals should be clear and all instruments must sound fine.
   
  My budget was just 40 usd for the first IEM however i loved the Amazon price of Meelec a151 at $47.99 and go for it.
  I will try to post my own review about them when i receive the package and burned them in.
   
  Just a basic question.. Are there any special techniques to burn in the new IEMS? I am considering pluging it to my pc and let it run for a full day. Should i run it max. volume? Are there any specific audio files to play while burning in? 
   
  thanks again..


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker, do the apple in ear really not stack up with the other balanced armatures at around the same price, or is it just a bit of apple hate that earned them their 6.2 sq rating, when the other bas have a 7.0plus? (a151 pl50) im wondering if their two drivers help them move more air, as that only seems logical and therefore have more natural soundstage/timbre/bottem end? thanks


 


  Well, and you can take my opinion with a grain of salt, I have the Apple Dual Driver IEMs and the MEElec A151s and the A151s are definitely superior to my ears, being more detailed and better balanced than the Apple IEMs. The Apple IEMs aren't bad at all but they're a textbook example of "more does not always equal better".


----------



## kanuka

audio technica VS DBA-02 
  i get an idea they're pretty close in sound
  how is their treble, upper mids (and mids at all) compared to the RE0's? 
  and specially how vocals (female) sound on these dual BA compared to the RE0? i tried the RE0 and i really liked how vocals sound, a bit far but very detailed and with  a sense of warmth/sweet. and the highs were just WOW!!
   
  i hope  joker and rawster can answer this question
  thnx


----------



## Bola 7

*ljokerl,*
   
  http://www.audio-technica.co.jp/products/hp/ath-ckm1000.html


----------



## mojoe24

Between the A151 and CC51 which is better for classical?  Did they ever change the shirt clip on the CC51?  I think I prefer their styling, but wouldn't want to be stuck with a shirt clip on the cable.


----------



## StereoNoodles

> I wouldn't expect high durability from anything Xears and I don't consider the Hephaes to be very good value for money sonically (might as well just get the Trident for half the price). I would go for the Beyer DTX 101 iE. The bass is quite substantial (but not as excessive as with the M9) and there's no weak spots in the construction.


 


  How about the Brainwavz M2?
  Hephaes and Xears is definently out..
   
  So Brainwavz M2 vs. Beyer DTX 101 iE?


----------



## muratdeveli

Quote: 





mojoe24 said:


> Between the A151 and CC51 which is better for classical?  Did they ever change the shirt clip on the CC51?  I think I prefer their styling, but wouldn't want to be stuck with a shirt clip on the cable.


 

 A forum member "dziendobry" had reviewed both of them before and it seems that he had already focused on classical music like me and you 
   
  You may consider checking the below 2 links of his reviews.
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/551499/review-mee-a151
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/546828/review-mee-cc51


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vyruz said:


> As per your recommendation, *ljokerl*, I just ordered the FA Consonance yesterday. What bothers me right now is that the website (gd-audiobase) sent no confirmation so I checked up on Head-Fi to see if other people complained about it... What I found kind of shocked me, with people waiting for 2 months on a pair...
> 
> Did I just lose 70$? Did you order from them?


 


  I haven't bought anything from gd-audiobase in the past year. I imagine delivery times vary based on destination country and other factors. If you paid via paypal you should be fine.


  Quote: 





techhead said:


> Thanks for the reviews, Joker. I've ordered a pair of Hisound Audio Crystal-2s from eBay. I listen to a lot of My Chemical Romance, Police, Led Zeppelin etc, these should be good for that, correct?


 

 Personal sound signature preferences trump genre choice any day if you ask me. If you like punchy, clear, slightly warm sound with a medium-sized soundstage you should be good.
   


  Quote: 





dogears said:


> Checking in and will wait for the FXT90 and K2 SP review


 

 Haven't heard the FXT90 yet but the K2 SP should be coming up soon. Spoiler - I like it a lot.
   


  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Checks in every week, continues waiting for TF10 review


 

 Dream on 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





muratdeveli said:


> @Joker
> 
> I would like to thank you for this great effort of putting things together.
> I am a newbie and your post helped me a lot to order my very first IEM.
> ...


 

 Don't think the A151 benefits from burn-in but yes, your method should be fine except for the max volume bit and the full day bit. I do 3-4 hour runs at slightly-above-listening volume with half-hour breaks. Music works just fine; I think jlab also has a burn-in application on their site and there's a good noise file in dweaver's signature.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> audio technica VS DBA-02
> i get an idea they're pretty close in sound
> how is their treble, upper mids (and mids at all) compared to the RE0's?
> and specially how vocals (female) sound on these dual BA compared to the RE0? i tried the RE0 and i really liked how vocals sound, a bit far but very detailed and with  a sense of warmth/sweet. and the highs were just WOW!!
> ...


 

 The RE0 is softer and more dry, the CK10 is edgier, brighter. If you want softer, sweeter sound and great treble I wouldn't bother with the TWFK earphones when the RE272 costs <$250. I would even recommend the e-Q5 over the CK10 for that.
   


  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> *ljokerl,*
> 
> http://www.audio-technica.co.jp/products/hp/ath-ckm1000.html


 

 Seen it, now I just wish I had a marketing contact at Audio-Technica 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





mojoe24 said:


> Between the A151 and CC51 which is better for classical?  Did they ever change the shirt clip on the CC51?  I think I prefer their styling, but wouldn't want to be stuck with a shirt clip on the cable.


 

 CC51, I would think, but personal preferences can swing it either way. Not sure about the shirt clip but it's easy enough to remove if you are mindful of the cable - just use a flathead screwdriver to pry it wider or break it before taking it off.
   


  Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> How about the Brainwavz M2?
> Hephaes and Xears is definently out..
> 
> So Brainwavz M2 vs. Beyer DTX 101 iE?


 


  M2 more mid-forward, DTX 101 more bassy. I think the Beyers are a little better as an overall package (though they cost more) but prefer the more unique sound of the M2.


----------



## estreeter

Joker,
   
  I've decided that I just want 'fun' from any future IEM purchases, and to me it seems to come down to :
   
*Hippo VB vs GR07*
   
  I know - no comparison, right - but I've read and re-read your review of the Hippo and a similar one at anythingbutipod and I just cant ignore them. I'd be lying if I said price was not a factor, but $69 is still a substantial chunk off the GR07 price on ebay. Thoughts ?


----------



## dogears

Woof! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> Haven't heard the FXT90 yet but the K2 SP should be coming up soon. Spoiler - I like it a lot.


----------



## steviiee

Hello, I just got my SoundMAGIC E10's and I was extremely excited to finally have them and use them. But, then when I first hook them up to my iPhone 4 I was extremely disappointed, they sound very muddy and I hear no bass at all. Are they supposed to be like this? Or do I need some burn-in/break-in.. My old SC ink'd sounded better.  

I'm not here for a rant, I just want to know what I should to first. 

Thank you


Sent from my iPhone  using Tapatalk


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Hello, I just got my SoundMAGIC E10's and I was extremely excited to finally have them and use them. But, then when I first hook them up to my iPhone 4 I was extremely disappointed, they sound very muddy and I hear no bass at all. Are they supposed to be like this? Or do I need some burn-in/break-in.. My old SC ink'd sounded better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Have you tried all the sizes of the stock tips?  Straight out of the box with my iPhone 4, I heard good sub bass and a clear sound sig.  Seems like you aren't getting a good seal?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker, are the superfi4 or addiem better? id like to have the low end close to feeling like a moving coil, and i think with the addiem having two speakers, it should move more air and therefore produce more depth to the soundstage?


 

 bmeat, you still have not decided?  Joker (as well as others) has answered all your queries dating back to 1987 it seems.  Sir, they are your ears.  Pull the trigger and decide for yourself.  By the time you make a decision, VSONIC will be on the GR027.
   
  Sorry, but I think I have received like 12 iems from the first time I read your posts.  It's all good bro, but you have to make the decision sometime.


----------



## dogears

^


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> bmeat, you still have not decided?  Joker (as well as others) has answered all your queries dating back to 1987 it seems.  Sir, they are your ears.  Pull the trigger and decide for yourself.  By the time you make a decision, VSONIC will be on the GR027.


 
   
  1987 was the year I joined the Army - I don't even think IEMs *existed* in 1987 !   
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  We have a few special cases like bmeat in Portable Amps - one in particular has talked himself out of every new amp since the Corda Headsix : you have to admire that kind of resilience.   I'm not sure exactly when the padlock is going to come off that wallet, but when it does ......


----------



## mojoe24

Thanks a lot Joker.  Now I just need to decide whether to wait for BF and see if there is any deals.  I'm kinda concerned with teh build quality of the CC51s though.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> 1987 was the year I joined the Army - I don't even think IEMs *existed* in 1987 !
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


 LOL...You da man Oz.  1988 was the year I got out of the Marine Corps but I feel like I have known him since back then...
   
  I know we really want to get him a pair of new iems before the US elects our next president.
   
  Having Joker (or anyone else, for that matter) compare two iems at any given time is impossible.  There are like 2.5 million iems at this time for purchase in different price brackets, compared to when I first joined head-fi that there were 7 iems to choose from.  Back then it was easy, now impossible.


----------



## mojoe24

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> LOL...You da man Oz.  1988 was the year I got out of the Marine Corps but I feel like I have known him since back then...
> 
> I know we really want to get him a pair of new iems before the US elects our next president.
> 
> Having Joker (or anyone else, for that matter) compare two iems at any given time is impossible.  There are like 2.5 million iems at this time for purchase in different price brackets, compared to when I first joined head-fi that there were 7 iems to choose from.  Back then it was easy, now impossible.


 

  
  1988 was the year I was born, lol.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Joker,
> 
> I've decided that I just want 'fun' from any future IEM purchases, and to me it seems to come down to :
> 
> ...


 

 I guess it depends on what you're really looking to spend. The VB is an enjoyable listen and a great value at $69 assuming the recent ones still sound the same as the first production run. It's not without competition in that price range but it still holds its own easily. It can't compete in accuracy with the GR07 but if that's not what you're after there's no point in comparing them. 
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Hello, I just got my SoundMAGIC E10's and I was extremely excited to finally have them and use them. But, then when I first hook them up to my iPhone 4 I was extremely disappointed, they sound very muddy and I hear no bass at all. Are they supposed to be like this? Or do I need some burn-in/break-in.. My old SC ink'd sounded better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Sounds like they are defective - lack of bass can be a result of a bad acoustic seal but they shouldn't sound muddier. With a good seal they should easily beat the Ink'd in both clarity and bass quantity out of the box.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker, are the superfi4 or addiem better? id like to have the low end close to feeling like a moving coil, and i think with the addiem having two speakers, it should move more air and therefore produce more depth to the soundstage?


 

 I can't give a better answer than what's been given by Inks, Anaxilus, and others over the past few pages of the thread. No, the ADDIEM does not move more air than the SuperFi4 but since you don't believe anyone just buy it and try it for yourself instead of asking over and over and especially instead of implying something about unfair scoring. There is no real reason to assume that two drivers sound better, produce more bass, give better depth, etc., than one, especially in that price range. There is often the _potential_ for better tuning with multiple drivers but that's it. There are some immensely competent single-driver designs out there. The $1100 FAD FI-BA-SS uses a single armature, for example, and it gets along just fine. This is why hands-on experience is much more valuable than theorizing and also why making recommendations based on assumptions, hearsay, or even others' reviews is discouraged here.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## dogears

^Why not make that the sf5v2?


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





heatfan12 said:


> LOL...You da man Oz.  1988 was the year I got out of the Marine Corps but I feel like I have known him since back then...
> 
> I know we really want to get him a pair of new iems before the US elects our next president.
> 
> Having Joker (or anyone else, for that matter) compare two iems at any given time is impossible.  There are like 2.5 million iems at this time for purchase in different price brackets, compared to when I first joined head-fi that there were 7 iems to choose from.  Back then it was easy, now impossible.


 
   
  Great stuff - I learned everything I know about the Marine Corp from *JAG*, but I still haven't seen a single Marine who looks as good in uniform as Major Colonel McKenzie. I suspect that Donald Belasario got a nice little kickback from the Pentagon for his recruiting efforts with that show. Reality must be a total bitch when they get to recruit training.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Agree re the IEM comparisons, but I'm repeatedly stunned by some of the questions Head-Fiers come out with - as soon as I tell myself that absolutely no-one is going to be using Melody Miracles from a full dCS stack, someone comes along and proves me wrong.


----------



## Audie

This is such an amazing thread!


----------



## RealSlimSeto

I just sold my MTPCs and are very close to getting the GR07s now!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The RE0 is softer and more dry, the CK10 is edgier, brighter. If you want softer, sweeter sound and great treble I wouldn't bother with the TWFK earphones when the RE272 costs <$250. I would even recommend the e-Q5 over the CK10 for that.


 
  thanks for  the advise. hifiman build quality worries me for that price range. and as for the e-q , the weird fit/design
  on the other hand , the ck10 tank-build is what i expect for that price
   
  an TWFK ? so which ones on this thread use those TWFK ? dba-02 and q-jays i guess, and what else?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





audie said:


> This is such an amazing thread!


 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> I just sold my MTPCs and are very close to getting the GR07s now!


 

 Interesting move. Feel free to report back how you like them!
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> an TWFK ? so which ones on this thread use those TWFK ? dba-02 and q-jays i guess, and what else?


 

 CK10, UE700, Phiaton PS200, NOCS NS800


----------



## SoulSyde

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I got a bit of a UM3X-ish feel from the UE 600 / SuperFi 5. It's too bad UE isn't having more of those $55-65 sales because $100 is way too much. M2 is a good choice as well.. curious as to whether you will like them better than the E30.


 

 I've been listening to my M2s for a few days now and I am surprised by their sound quality for as cheap as they are.  
   

   
  They are somewhat close to the UM3X in the mid-range presentation.  They're not as warm as the UM3X, but close.  Spatially, they are not as intimate so if you're looking for more personal feel with your vocals the UM3X is still king.  Also, the instrument separation is night and day.  I don't think anything can match the UM3X, although my SE535s do come somewhat close.
   
  Bottom line - I'm really happy with them.  They're much better than the E30 IMHO.  The E30s will be used for running and sleeping now.
   
  I'm still waiting for that blockbuster deal on a pair of UE 600s.


----------



## Shadow Dog

I just bought the Xears XE200Pro which are very good, especially with the discount price. Anyway, I'm considering on buying the Head-Direct Re0 (ReZero) or whatever. Anyway, I'm located in Canada so I think my only option is to buy from ebay. Which buyer do you guys suggest I buy from?


----------



## Niyologist

Look at this guys!
   
  From MEELEC:
   

   
  What could this be? An Amp or New Headphones with an Amp? You figure it out because I have a raging headache right now.


----------



## HeatFan12

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> i just recently purchased a ue500. im looking for a not too pricey ba now. and thanks i appreciate all your help, *looks like my ba phone will be a superfi4*


 


 Yes....I will drink to you sir!!!


----------



## ljokerl

The MEE thing is probably a standalone amp of some sort. Unless they developed it for a new model, I don't see what they would bundle it with.
   
  Quote: 





soulsyde said:


> I've been listening to my M2s for a few days now and I am surprised by their sound quality for as cheap as they are.


 

 Great, welcome to the club! Agree on the criticisms, but then it wouldn't expected to get anywhere near the UM3X in resolution or separation.
   


  Quote: 





shadow dog said:


> I just bought the Xears XE200Pro which are very good, especially with the discount price. Anyway, I'm considering on buying the Head-Direct Re0 (ReZero) or whatever. Anyway, I'm located in Canada so I think my only option is to buy from ebay. Which buyer do you guys suggest I buy from?


 

 Pretty sure Head-Direct ships worldwide from their site - no need to buy from ebay. RE0 and RE-ZERO are different earphones, by the way.


----------



## Niyologist

Meelectronics had also mentioned about that Amp not being the only thing to release at 2012. That most likely means that there's IEMs/OEMs to be released by Next Year.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## nikp

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> haha and what types of music are balanced armatures typically best for anyway?


 

 Every genre that don't need overwhelming bass.


----------



## blairhh

Been listening to my new MEElectronics CC51's for a few days now. I need more time with them to get a solid impression. They are beautiful to look at and for now I'm very happy with their sound. Ear tips aren't so great and one pair was close to impossible to put on and off. I want to remove the shirt clip without damaging the wire. 
   
  I'm coming from Klipsch S4's. I think the S4's have better bass but I'm not 100% sure. I got my replacement S4's in the mail today and they surprisingly have a straight jack versus my original damaged S4's which had an angled jack. Strange but fine. Klipsch still takes the crown with respect to comfortable ear tips IMO. 
   
  I'll report back after a few weeks with the CC51's. This thread is epic and so valuable to us. Thank you again.


----------



## vikman21

I saw a deal for the Meelec CW31P's for $20 a few weeks ago and I picked it up after looking at the review in this thread.  After switching the stock ear tips out for larger ones, I feel that the CW31s are a very good option for a natural sounding IEM for the price I paid.  The mids and highs sound excellent, and the IEMs provide enough bass for the music I listen to.  Once again, thanks for this amazing thread!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blairhh said:


> Been listening to my new MEElectronics CC51's for a few days now. I need more time with them to get a solid impression. They are beautiful to look at and for now I'm very happy with their sound. Ear tips aren't so great and one pair was close to impossible to put on and off. I want to remove the shirt clip without damaging the wire.


 

 Glad you like them. The shirt clip is pretty easy to take off, especially if you don't intend to put it back on - just pry the tabs further apart with a small flat blade screwdriver before pulling it off the cable.
   


  Quote: 





vikman21 said:


> I saw a deal for the Meelec CW31P's for $20 a few weeks ago and I picked it up after looking at the review in this thread.  After switching the stock ear tips out for larger ones, I feel that the CW31s are a very good option for a natural sounding IEM for the price I paid.  The mids and highs sound excellent, and the IEMs provide enough bass for the music I listen to.  Once again, thanks for this amazing thread!


 

 Good price, and glad the thread has been helpful


----------



## Ymer

I can get the RE262 or VSonic GR07 for $169. Which would you choose to use unamped?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ymer said:


> I can get the RE262 or VSonic GR07 for $169. Which would you choose to use unamped?
> 
> Thanks!


 

      I'd definitely use the VSonic GR07 unamped. The VSonic GR07 has 50 Ohms at -/+ 10%. The RE262 has 150 Ohms, so they'll gobble up your MP3's Battery Life like if it were a snack.


----------



## Ymer

Actually, I'm more concerned about the sound. It's a Sansa Clip and I only need the battery to last through a workout or a run


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ymer said:


> Actually, I'm more concerned about the sound. It's a Sansa Clip and I only need the battery to last through a workout or a run


 

      Then you'll have to consult the Guide that ljokerl has.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ymer said:


> I can get the RE262 or VSonic GR07 for $169. Which would you choose to use unamped?
> 
> Thanks!


 


  Different sound signatures. I really wouldn't worry about amped vs unamped (unless you like to listen at ear-bleeding volumes or care about battery life) but rather pick the one that suits your preferences better. One is warm and musical while the other is more balanced and quite neutral.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> how far off is the ue500 from a balanced frequency responce that they claim?
> 
> "Crisp highs. Warm mids. Powerful bass. When nothing but the music matters, our 500s deliver a balanced frequency response and a highly detailed soundstage. The high-quality diaphragm drivers were designed and tuned for music lovers who want to hear the music just as it was recorded."


 

 Don't you have a pair already? I found them to have a bit of a v-curve, and I guess the mids aren't all that warm... This is all advertising anyway, you shouldn't put that much stock in it... Look at the Beats and skullcandy for god's sake


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Ulti

Dear Joker,
   
  I now own the RE0 and feel they're very good - but not to the point of loving them.
   
  Is there anything with better/same SQ but with a significant increase in isolation? I won't want to spend more than £100 (from the UK) and the choices that I can see with 4.5 Isolation is the ER MC5 (£50), Shure SE215 (£80) and the HiSoundAudio Crystals (£70). At the end of the day I want value so if it's going to be hard to get better value than this then I'll be more than happy to keep the RE0.
   
  Here's a longer post of what I'm looking for: http://www.head-fi.org/t/579877/upgrading-from-the-re0s-for-something-with-more-isolation#post_7886381


----------



## Prazzyp

how would you compare the klipsch S2/X1 with the sennheiser cx300
   
  i know the review says klipsch is better, but it would be nice to get greater detail, mostly interested in which has better bass 
   
  thanks


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ulti said:


> Dear Joker,
> 
> I now own the RE0 and feel they're very good - but not to the point of loving them.
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  All of those easily isolate more than the RE0 but none of them sound as good. unless you are looking for a different sound signature. Listening preferences differ, obviously, but if you're asking my opinion you'll be spending a lot to find sound better than the RE0 with good isolation - think Etymotic HF5 or FIscher Audio SBA-03. Both should be around £100. I'm afraid you won't get away with spending less than that.
  
   


  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> how would you compare the klipsch S2/X1 with the sennheiser cx300
> 
> i know the review says klipsch is better, but it would be nice to get greater detail, mostly interested in which has better bass
> 
> thanks


 

 The CX300 has more bass, the S2 has cleaner bass but honestly buying the CX300 in 2011 is ridiculous. It's so completely outdated and the prices haven't dropped enough to keep up with the competition. If you just want bass, why not get a MEElec M9? Or, if you want decent overall sound quality, the Dunu Tridents and Soundmagic E10s don't cost a whole lot more.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Selenium

It's at least twice as good in my opinion. Way more textures and a tighter bass
  
  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker, i can get both the superfi4 and addiem for around the same price. which one sounds better and more musical? im making a purchase and will then be done with this tonight. thanks


----------



## i2ehan

selenium said:


> It's at least twice as good in my opinion. Way more textures and a tighter bass




Lol, which one?


----------



## -y0-

Dear Mr. ljokerl,
   
What would you say has the same or similar sound to the e-Q7 except cost <$175?


----------



## StereoNoodles

Joker,
   
  Thanks so much for taking your time and helping me.
   
   
  I was thinking about the Beyer 101 as a great option...
  But...
  (Please be prepared for one of the worlds stupidest reasons in your life about a decision on a pair of earphones...(
  The 101 just looks.....
  Dull and boring... It doesn't look very good at all...
   
  The main reason I am doing this was because all my friends thought my M9's were super cheap and crappy because of it's looks. I thought the M9's looked pretty nice, but all of my friends didn't... They had to put it on to believe they were great headphones.
   
  I really don't want to do this again..
  The 101's LOOK even cheaper than the m9's.. ( though it probably sounds GREAT )
   
  I can't believe i'm doing this but....
  I have to take the beyer out over LOOKS. ( God, this is embaressing.. )
   
  I decided to add the  Dunu Trident in instead..
  It's cheap, and sounds decent, but It almost looks as good as the Monster Turbines...
  Just LOOKING at it makes it look super expensive.. It doesn't sound very bad either.
   
  The brainwavz M2 probably sound better... But it doesn't look like anything special at all..
   
  How shameful it is to ask...:
   
  Brainwavz M2 vs. Dunu Trident
   
  With looks added to your decision?


----------



## Ulti

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> All of those easily isolate more than the RE0 but none of them sound as good. unless you are looking for a different sound signature. Listening preferences differ, obviously, but if you're asking my opinion you'll be spending a lot to find sound better than the RE0 with good isolation - think Etymotic HF5 or FIscher Audio SBA-03. Both should be around £100. I'm afraid you won't get away with spending less than that.


 
   
  I'll try grab the HF5, unfortunately it is £100 so I may try grabbing a second hand pair. I'm just worried about the long term usage because if I grab it off eBay and it breaks within one month then obviously I will be very disheartened, especially as I am a student. The FA SBA-03 isn't in the UK yet unfortunately. But Frogbeats may have it soon but I've not really questioned them. I've ordered some Phonak PFEs from ClieOS's recommendation and if they don't go well then I'll put them on sale here or on eBay. I am looking forward to the Phonak PFEs though.
   
  It's a shame I have to pay so much! If only the RE0 was a bit more isolating! I'll be more than happy to get customs as soon as I earn a salary haha! This upgrade path and curiosity in different sound signatures kills my wallet!
   
  EDIT: I'm also very interested in the Kozee X1 Executives, if I can get them in the UK without paying too much extra for shipping then I'll be willing to go for it. How would you compare these with the Phonak PFEs and the RE0 exclusively? Just a simple explanation with the sound signature and clarity/detail and sound stage will be enough for me!
   
  Thanks a lot!


----------



## W3ird_N3rd

ljokerl, just wanted to say you've done a downright amazing job here! Keep up the good work! Earbuds are always hard as no store will ever let you try them for obvious reasons, a review/comparison like this is a godsend. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 As I personally don't want to spend more than $30 because I don't want to worry about losing/breaking my gear, I could fairly quickly filter the MEElectronics M6 from the table to read it's review. Low price, good sound and (although it's personal) they look really good. I always feel I look just a little silly when using standard little-stick-sticking-out-of-your-ears-thingies, M6 looks really good in comparison. It's not the primary reason for my choice, but it is definitely a factor.

 I've just ordered them online (will now have to wait for a bit), but I would have probably never even found them without you. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Once again, thanks. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  [edit]
  I also wanted to note I noticed the MEElectronics A151 can be found for ~$50 on eBay and Amazon, quite a bit cheaper than meelec.com ($75). They were still slightly too expensive for me, but perhaps this information is useful for someone else.


----------



## Hayang

Mr. ljokerl, I need your advice!
   
  First of all thank you very much for the prize gift you gave a long time ago for guessing what earphones you'd be reviewing--my brother, who needed headphones at the time, loved using the M11+s and liked their bass and smooth presentation.  He broke them unfortunately, I think at one of the strains connecting to the earpiece. So I am looking to replace them and thanks to your reviews it looks like I will be buying him DUNU tridents for their build and SS.
   
  But on a more important note, I am looking to replace my full-size cans (Fischer Audio FA-003s) with some nice IEMs around $170.  However I am not quite sure which model will fit my preferences.
   
*I like a warm tonal balance with very full and impactful, well-controlled bass supporting a lush but well-textured midrange and a just slightly sparkly treble (not rolled off).*  The epitome of this sound signature would be the LCD-2 paired with a tube amp, not surprisingly.  But I find that the main attraction of that full-size setup is its effortless warmth and bass extension that feels like the weighty bottom of a pyramid instead of a hulk dominating the midrange and treble.  That, along with good crispness in the midrange and treble.
   
  Are there any IEMs in the sub-200 range that achieve this kind of bass-driven but refined balance?
*For reference:*
  - I am selling the FA-003s because I walk around with my iPod and they are not really portable, but also because they are a little short of being full-bodied in their bass and midbass.  Their midrange texture is nice and so is their treble.  I heard they sound similar to the DBA-02s.
  - I found the Sunrise X-Capes to be very anemic in bass, and they had an okay soundstage but the lack of body made it just sound distant.  I don't remember much about it since I owned it a long time ago.
  - The Fischer Audio Eternas were perhaps a tad too much in the bass department.  But I liked that it erred on the side of too much instead of too little.  The bass is looser than I would like.  Also the treble is very rolled off and I miss some sparkle.  The midrange is a little overpowered by the bass too.  The soundstage was pretty nice.
  - The JVC-FX67s get the frequency balance somewhat close to what I would like, but they lack detail, control, punch and some sparkle.
   
  Any help would be so appreciated, please reply at your convenience!


----------



## Prazzyp

ahhh okay joker, iill take a look at them thank you very much


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





-y0- said:


> Dear Mr. ljokerl,
> 
> What would you say has the same or similar sound to the e-Q7 except cost <$175?


 

 Nothing is as poised with that same sound signature. The HiSound Crystals can be reminiscent at times though they are bassier and not nearly as refined. The Fischer Tandem, too, though it doesn't quite have that same sprightly crispness.
   


  Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Brainwavz M2 vs. Dunu Trident
> 
> With looks added to your decision?


 

 I think the red DTX 101s look pretty snazzy but that's just me. M2 is better than the Trident IMO but if looks matter more than just get whatever looks best. The Trident is great value, no doubt about that.
   


  Quote: 





ulti said:


> EDIT: I'm also very interested in the Kozee X1 Executives, if I can get them in the UK without paying too much extra for shipping then I'll be willing to go for it. How would you compare these with the Phonak PFEs and the RE0 exclusively? Just a simple explanation with the sound signature and clarity/detail and sound stage will be enough for me!
> 
> Thanks a lot!


 

 I think someone else tried and the shipping cost was something like $50 extra. Sound-wise the X1 is not much of an upgrade over the RE0 or PFE but it won't be a step down, either. Similar clarity, maybe a bit less treble detail than the RE0 and gray-filtered PFE, but definitely a wider soundstage. Soundstage width was very impressive with them even though they don't have the best 3-d space.
   


  Quote: 





w3ird_n3rd said:


> ljokerl, just wanted to say you've done a downright amazing job here! Keep up the good work! Earbuds are always hard as no store will ever let you try them for obvious reasons, a review/comparison like this is a godsend.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Glad the thread has been helpful! The M6 is a good choice if you're looking something disposable. Both of the colors are quite discrete.
   


  Quote: 





hayang said:


> *I like a warm tonal balance with very full and impactful, well-controlled bass supporting a lush but well-textured midrange and a just slightly sparkly treble (not rolled off).*  The epitome of this sound signature would be the LCD-2 paired with a tube amp, not surprisingly.  But I find that the main attraction of that full-size setup is its effortless warmth and bass extension that feels like the weighty bottom of a pyramid instead of a hulk dominating the midrange and treble.  That, along with good crispness in the midrange and treble.
> 
> Are there any IEMs in the sub-200 range that achieve this kind of bass-driven but refined balance?
> *For reference:*
> ...


 


  The JVC HA-FX500 comes to mind - definitely bassy, slightly warm, heavy on treble sparkle. Might be a little too sparkly depending on your tolerance but there's not much else I can think of at that level of performance with a more fitting signature. The Audio-Technica CKM99 is up there but it's got many of the same issues and less bass depth than the FX500; the Panasonic HJE900 may be fitting as well but it is difficult to find. 
   
  Alternatively, if you'd prefer less sparkle rather than more, there's the Fischer Tandem. Good but not overpowering bass and mids but not much sparkle at all. 
   
  Interesting exercise - would be nice if everyone had so many reference points when asking for recommendations.


----------



## Ulti

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I think someone else tried and the shipping cost was something like $50 extra. Sound-wise the X1 is not much of an upgrade over the RE0 or PFE but it won't be a step down, either. Similar clarity, maybe a bit less treble detail than the RE0 and gray-filtered PFE, but definitely a wider soundstage. Soundstage width was very impressive with them even though they don't have the best 3-d space.


 

 At $240 then the value drops dramatically, however customs is something I want to try, whether it's entry stuff or high quality stuff. I never thought that I'd be able to try them so quickly, being a student.
   
  There are also the Minerva Mi-1 which I can get in the UK with a 2 week turnaround for £150 ($240) but it lacks removable cables (with something this expensive, I really worry for long term usage and as we all know, the cable is usually the weakest point and most prone to dying) and customisation options cost quite a bit extra. If only I could get student discount!
   
  Thanks for the help Joker, you've been brilliant!


----------



## myisk

I was wondering if you've ever tried UE200 or if you know, roughly, how they compare to the earphones you've reviewed. I've only ever used cheap earphones so far, but now I want to get a good pair with decent sound. I love your guide, but I've never tried any of the earphones on the list so I'm still not really sure where to start. I don't really like the sound of the UE200 but they're the only widely available earphones I have so I figured they'd make an okay baseline. Any help at all would be wonderful. Thank you.


----------



## controlmajortom

Hey Joker, general thoughts on the UE500? I received mine today and was pleasantly surprised by how good it was. Mids are slightly recessed and treble is rolled off quite a bit, but the bass and presentation are fantastic for a <70 headphone. Resolution isn't bad either. Wanted to see if your impressions mirrored mine, thanks!


----------



## Prazzyp

how are the klipsch s4 in terms of bass? are they better than the sennheiser cx300? because they are what i have now and i want to be able to compare them  
   
  how are the klipsch s4 also compared to the s3 and monster turbine?
  and also the soundmagic e10?
  thanks


----------



## Hayang

Originally Posted by *Hayang* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
   
*For reference:*
  - I am selling the FA-003s because I walk around with my iPod and they are not really portable, but also because they are a little short of being full-bodied in their bass and midbass.  Their midrange texture is nice and so is their treble.  I heard they sound similar to the DBA-02s.
  - I found the Sunrise X-Capes to be very anemic in bass, and they had an okay soundstage but the lack of body made it just sound distant.  I don't remember much about it since I owned it a long time ago.
  - The Fischer Audio Eternas were perhaps a tad too much in the bass department.  But I liked that it erred on the side of too much instead of too little.  The bass is looser than I would like.  Also the treble is very rolled off and I miss some sparkle.  The midrange is a little overpowered by the bass too.  The soundstage was pretty nice.
  - The JVC-FX67s get the frequency balance somewhat close to what I would like, but they lack detail, control, punch and some sparkle.
   

   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The JVC HA-FX500 comes to mind - definitely bassy, slightly warm, heavy on treble sparkle. Might be a little too sparkly depending on your tolerance but there's not much else I can think of at that level of performance with a more fitting signature. The Audio-Technica CKM99 is up there but it's got many of the same issues and less bass depth than the FX500; the Panasonic HJE900 may be fitting as well but it is difficult to find.
> 
> Alternatively, if you'd prefer less sparkle rather than more, there's the Fischer Tandem. Good but not overpowering bass and mids but not much sparkle at all.
> 
> Interesting exercise - would be nice if everyone had so many reference points when asking for recommendations.


 
   
  The JVCs look like a pretty good deal at $50 on ebay (apparently they were $130 before?) so I am leaning toward them, but I am wary since they apparently have an aggressive treble.  I like a good sparkle but I really hate female vocals hissing; that makes me want to immediately put them down.  Are they not quite that much?  
   
  I think a better description of what I like is, a flat frequency response until the lower midrange, where there is a lot of warmth, fullness, and extension well into the sub-bass.
   
*Also what do you think of the GR07 for my tastes*, if something like the XCape, which is said to be "neutral", was very bass-anemic for me?  It's been getting such good reviews so I am very tempted since in the end a just slightly warm, balanced and detailed reproduction is better than a super-severe V-curve or flabby warmth with a lot of treble rolloff for me.  For example the FA-003 (much like the DBA-02?) was great but I just wished it had a few more decibels in the midbass.
   
*And would you add any other recommendations if I could afford <$250?*


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





myisk said:


> I was wondering if you've ever tried UE200 or if you know, roughly, how they compare to the earphones you've reviewed. I've only ever used cheap earphones so far, but now I want to get a good pair with decent sound. I love your guide, but I've never tried any of the earphones on the list so I'm still not really sure where to start. I don't really like the sound of the UE200 but they're the only widely available earphones I have so I figured they'd make an okay baseline. Any help at all would be wonderful. Thank you.


 


  I have not, sorry. I imagine UE wouldn't make them better than UE350s, though.


  Quote: 





controlmajortom said:


> Hey Joker, general thoughts on the UE500? I received mine today and was pleasantly surprised by how good it was. Mids are slightly recessed and treble is rolled off quite a bit, but the bass and presentation are fantastic for a <70 headphone. Resolution isn't bad either. Wanted to see if your impressions mirrored mine, thanks!


 

 I've already admitted that I like the UE500 better than the old single-armature SuperFi earphones (minus maybe the UE600). It's a very solid set, surprisingly good clarity, space, and bass control. Slight v-shape response. Good enough for the full retail price, very good when it goes on sale. 

  
  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> how are the klipsch s4 in terms of bass? are they better than the sennheiser cx300? because they are what i have now and i want to be able to compare them
> 
> how are the klipsch s4 also compared to the s3 and monster turbine?
> and also the soundmagic e10?
> thanks


 

 Better bass control than CX300, not sure why you would consider moving down to the Sennheisers from the S4. The S3 packages all of the flaws of the S4 with fewer of the strengths. Aside from having good detail and clarity in its price range, I really wouldn't recommend the S3. The E10 is softer-sounding and a lot more spacious, with less peaky treble. Much easier to recommend. The Turbine is less trebly, period. Also warmer and much smoother. I've always like the Turbine better than the S4.
   


  Quote: 





hayang said:


> The JVCs look like a pretty good deal at $50 on ebay (apparently they were $130 before?) so I am leaning toward them, but I am wary since they apparently have an aggressive treble.  I like a good sparkle but I really hate female vocals hissing; that makes me want to immediately put them down.  Are they not quite that much?
> 
> I think a better description of what I like is, a flat frequency response until the lower midrange, where there is a lot of warmth, fullness, and extension well into the sub-bass.
> 
> ...


 


  $50 FX500s probably not genuine. Should be $150, if not more. Whether the treble is too much for you depends on personal tolerance; I think JVC made great strides in making the FX700 softer and less offensive for most listeners but that's out of your price range. 
   
  The GR07 is punchy but it likely won't have the mid-bass you are looking for. Certainly more bass than the Xcape but no mid-bass lift per se. I haven't heard the FA-003 in a long time but I would say they aren't too different in bass quantity. 
   
  $250 might make it easier to find an HJE900 but otherwise there's not much to add for that 200-250 range. There's just not much in there.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> $50 FX500s probably not genuine. Should be $150, if not more. Whether the treble is too much for you depends on personal tolerance; I think JVC made great strides in making the FX700 softer and less offensive for most listeners but that's out of your price range.


 
   
       I'll find out if it's legit on ebay. I have my crafty ways.


----------



## Inks

It's most likely fake on the above. FX500 have a strict pricing policy in Japan and there aren't any official stores outside of Japan since it's not really meant to be sold overseas. IME, most FX500s are fake on ebay specially from a dealer of any kind. If you find a good deal, it will be for a used pair.


----------



## StereoNoodles

Sorry for annoying you: but one last and final question:
   
  How does the Brainwavz M2 compare to the Nuforce Ne-700x?


----------



## Hayang

I think I will buy the JVC-FXT90s, which are being reviewed very well right now by people who own other good IEMs like the GR07.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/563722/jvc-ha-fxt90-appreciation-thread-user-info-buying-guide-reviews-on-page-1
  
  It sounds like it fits my preferences perfectly!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





inks said:


> It's most likely fake on the above. FX500 have a strict pricing policy in Japan and there aren't any official stores outside of Japan since it's not really meant to be sold overseas. IME, most FX500s are fake on ebay specially from a dealer of any kind. If you find a good deal, it will be for a used pair.


 

      Seyo Shop can sell it. Besides, I already emailed the seller and he said that it's legit. He must've bought A LOT of them. Although I wouldn't chance it, but at the same time, his sellers said that it's real. This guy should have more buyers since they are real. The main risk is getting this in 2 weeks or less. If it doesn't happen in 2 weeks or less, then the seller will have very angry customers.


----------



## ljokerl

Added j-phonic K2 SP
   
  Quote: 





> *(1C13) j-phonic K2 SP*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Nov 2011
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Sorry for annoying you: but one last and final question:
> 
> How does the Brainwavz M2 compare to the Nuforce Ne-700x?


 

 The NE-700X is bassier, the M2 is more mid-forward and more liquid. There should be a number of references to the M2 in the NE-700X review in this thread.


----------



## Inks

niyologist said:


> Seyo Shop can sell it. Besides, I already emailed the seller and he said that it's legit. He must've bought A LOT of them. Although I wouldn't chance it, but at the same time, his sellers said that it's real. This guy should have more buyers since they are real. The main risk is getting this in 2 weeks or less. If it doesn't happen in 2 weeks or less, then the seller will have very angry customers.


 
  Who's the seller? A lot of them say they're legit but send fakes anyways based on user experiences, remain skeptical. Yes Seyo sells it but they pretty much forward from Japan, no official sellers outside of Japan. Could be right, but do more research to make sure. 
  
  Interesting product in the K2. Monitors are quite the products. The Westone UM series are certainly stage monitors as the sounds is colored in a way to reduce fatigue and create a surround kind of feeling with a lack of forward projection (well illustrated by James444). Then you have the studio monitors but what is sometimes overlooked is the compensations IEMs/headphones need, IEM makers need to compensate for bypassing the pinna. It's not an exact science but ideally a small hump in the lower regions is ideal, though the amount would be subjective (IMO the SE530/EQ-7 and Q-Jays sound very realistic in amount here). Then the higher mids/lower treble are problematic as there is an increased gain there that pretty much requires a dip for the IEMs due to the increase gain. In the higher treble lots of resonant issues reside going up and too much emphasis can overlook the fact that filtering is needed since the IEMs are so close to the ear. Getting the most realistic lower/higher treble is perhaps the hardest feat. My worry about so called "flat" IEMs is their lack of compensation which makes them sound artificially forward in details and somewhat treble lenient. Like reference speakers, imo reference flat (not textbook flat) IEMs would be pretty much midrange focused with the a pinch of body coming from the lower regions and without bringing in harmonics and high frequency details in the high regions too forward with a natural smoothness.
   
  Wonder what approach J-Phonic took with these in the high regions, lots of things about it look promising. Monitors like the 7550 and GR07 seem to be taking some compensation in mind. I would say that sometimes IEMs that don't have the monitor marketing get the sound quite right like the PFE, SE530/5 and EQ5. SM3 sounds like a stage monitor but I don't think I've seen it marketed as such. I will disagree on the 535's approach in being solely a consumer product, I think it was tuned based with compensation in mind for professinals.


----------



## dogears

Wow! Thanks for that K2 SP review chief!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





inks said:


> Who's the seller? A lot of them say they're legit but send fakes anyways based on user experiences, remain skeptical. Yes Seyo sells it but they pretty much forward from Japan, no official sellers outside of Japan.


 

      Here's the seller:
   
      http://www.ebay.com/itm/JVC-Victor-HP-FX500-HA-FX500-Wood-In-Ear-Headphones-/270850912396?pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item3f0ff8f08c


----------



## Inks

Usually fakes don't come with a case, that's a deal-breaker. What's even worse is the fact that the picture used is an obvious fake, the finish is nothing like that.  I will transfer any more questions to the FX500 thread though, not really suiting here.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Seyo Shop can sell it. Besides,* I already emailed the seller and he said that it's legit*. He must've bought A LOT of them. Although I wouldn't chance it, but at the same time, his sellers said that it's real. This guy should have more buyers since they are real. The main risk is getting this in 2 weeks or less. If it doesn't happen in 2 weeks or less, then the seller will have very angry customers.


 

 There's a surprise. I would put the chance of them being real at <1%.


----------



## i2ehan

As always, thank you ever so kindly for the anticipated, excellent read/review. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 As you know, I happened to hear the K2 in the very same regards, and I think you absolutely nailed it with the following statements:


> The K2 SP is a purpose-built reference monitor and works wonderfully in that respect.


 


> It is very well-rounded technically but the signature will be far from ideal for many listeners.


----------



## kanuka

nice one joker
  now we're waiting for the MX version of j-phonic review


----------



## Inks

Isn't that just a filter difference? I wonder if they would send the filter.


----------



## dogears

Mine was an MX and it sounded muffled and veiled. After I removed the filter, it sounded much better already.


----------



## Inks

lol sounds like it acts like a PFE perfect bass filter.


----------



## dogears

Could be. It sounded like a was listening to a band playing in a cave -- hence the 'cavernous sound' I mentioned after first listen --- won't even worth USD300 for me!


----------



## SowonAoD

Great review as usual, Joker!
This is what I've been waiting for. And to make things more detailed for me, can you compare directly the k2 to ck10? The k2 is more analytical and unforgived, isn't it?


----------



## Selenium

Sounds like the K2 SQ score comes with a lot of qualifiers. I doubt most people would be using it in the ideal conditions.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> As always, thank you ever so kindly for the anticipated, excellent read/review.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, I normally try not to put qualifiers in my reviews and let the readers judge for themselves but there is just such a disconnect I see with the K2 between how good it is technically and how unsuited it may be for some listeners.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> nice one joker
> now we're waiting for the MX version of j-phonic review


 
   
  I wouldn't hold my breath for that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




   


  Quote: 





sowonaod said:


> Great review as usual, Joker!
> This is what I've been waiting for. And to make things more detailed for me, can you compare directly the k2 to ck10? The k2 is more analytical and unforgived, isn't it?


 

 There's CK10 comparisons scattered throughout but here's the gist of it while they are still fresh in my memory:

 The K2 has Flatter treble than CK10 but also more upper midrange lift/brighter mids. It is not as splashy/tizzy and integrates the top end better. The midrange itself is more forward but not as liquid as that of the CK10. Clarity is similar but the K2 is a bit more crisp and fuller-sounding. Presentation overall is a bit more forward and aggressive with the K2. Bass-wise they have similar emphasis on impact over body, though the K2 again sounds fuller and more powerful.
   
  And yes, I would say the K2 is more revealing of issues. 
   


  Quote: 





selenium said:


> Sounds like the K2 SQ score comes with a lot of qualifiers. I doubt most people would be using it in the ideal conditions.


 

 True - right tips, very clean source, and a preference for analytical sound. Actually, two of those things I would recommend to anyone who is even thinking of buying $400 monitors.


----------



## sachiel

Hi joker. The MEE A151 and CC51 are both being sold at $50 at bestbuy.  Based on your review, the CC51 has a higher sound score but the A151 has a higher overall score of 9.5.  As of right now I chose A151, but I'm wondering if this is the right choice since they are the same price.
   
  This is my first time to buy a good pair of IEM so the only basis I can compare is the ipod earphones.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  I'm not a basshead coz when I tried the S4 at Apple store, I get fatigue after testing it.  I'm looking more of the balanced sound for all types of music.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Thanks, I normally try not to put qualifiers in my reviews and let the readers judge for themselves but there is just such a disconnect I see with the K2 between how good it is technically and how unsuited it may be for some listeners.


 

 And I'm sure that's perfectly understood by (hopefully) all, but having owned the K2 myself, I too feel that the qualifiers here are well within reason.


----------



## kanuka

joker
  a question about the isolation score
  the high isolation you get with the Crystal and the 3 audio-technica is it because the deep insertion? is it possbile to achieve the same level with a less deep insertion? 
  4.5/5 is pretty high. ety's level (mc5)


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





sachiel said:


> Hi joker. The MEE A151 and CC51 are both being sold at $50 at bestbuy.  Based on your review, the CC51 has a higher sound score but the A151 has a higher overall score of 9.5.  As of right now I chose A151, but I'm wondering if this is the right choice since they are the same price.
> 
> This is my first time to buy a good pair of IEM so the only basis I can compare is the ipod earphones.
> 
> ...


 
   
       Definitely go for the A151. I'm now kinda straying away from the CC51 because of the very punchy and near monster bass (probably due to the Mid-Bass Lift). Gives me a headache in comparison to my darker and slightly more airy Future Sonics Atrio X (FS1 Xtrememac).


----------



## sachiel

Thanks joker. The store don't allow testing so I don't know the difference between the two. Good thing you're here or else people might end up buying IEMs with too much bass. I guess I'm one of the few people who don't like too much of it.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  It's getting more common nowadays that more bass =  good IEM so research is important.  Tried the Grado i9i and it was too bassy as well.  The store owner says that I can try looking at other brands but it won't be better than Grado. Love your own as they say.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Definitely go for the A151. I'm now kinda straying away from the CC51 because of the very punchy and near monster bass (probably due to the Mid-Bass Lift). Gives me a headache in comparison to my darker and slightly more airy Future Sonics Atrio X (FS1 Xtrememac).


 


  The CC51 has "monster bass" to you? I thought it was fairly even handed in comparison to real bass monsters like the DUNU Hephaes and SP51 but that's just me.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> The CC51 has "monster bass" to you? I thought it was fairly even handed in comparison to real bass monsters like the DUNU Hephaes and SP51 but that's just me.


 

      It's near "Monster Bass" Levels, but not quite there like the SP51 and the Hephaes and definitely not like the Atrio X. It has more mid bass than sub bass, but it's sort of like a bass hammer and the bass doesn't interfere with the Mid-Range. It strange that my Atrio X sounds better than the CC51. The Clarity is there and it sounds more natural with the bass, vocals and instruments, than with the CC51. It's like if it's trying to imitate the Atrio M5.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Definitely go for the A151. I'm now kinda straying away from the CC51 because of the very punchy and near monster bass (probably due to the Mid-Bass Lift). Gives me a headache in comparison to my darker and slightly more airy Future Sonics Atrio X (FS1 Xtrememac).


 


  That's your tips and fit.  The bass should be approaching sub bass actually not mid bass.  I recall the A151 being more mid bassy.  You can get a much more neutral response from the CC51.  Try different insertion depths.  Micro drivers are pretty impressive for sub bass potential IME.


----------



## Prazzyp

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Better bass control than CX300, not sure why you would consider moving down to the Sennheisers from the S4. The S3 packages all of the flaws of the S4 with fewer of the strengths. Aside from having good detail and clarity in its price range, I really wouldn't recommend the S3. The E10 is softer-sounding and a lot more spacious, with less peaky treble. Much easier to recommend. The Turbine is less trebly, period. Also warmer and much smoother. I've always like the Turbine better than the S4.


 


  the headphones i have right now are the cx300 and i was thinking of upgrading upto either the klipsch s4 or the soundmagic E10
   
  which is better in terms of bass and overall?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> joker
> a question about the isolation score
> the high isolation you get with the Crystal and the 3 audio-technica is it because the deep insertion? is it possbile to achieve the same level with a less deep insertion?
> 4.5/5 is pretty high. ety's level (mc5)


 

 Yeah, the Crystal isolates a lot with a good eartip (e.g. Meelec tri-flange), probably more than any other dynamic except the MC5. 
   


  Quote: 





sachiel said:


> Thanks joker. The store don't allow testing so I don't know the difference between the two. Good thing you're here or else people might end up buying IEMs with too much bass. I guess I'm one of the few people who don't like too much of it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 If you thought the iGi was too bassy just go with the A151. Pretty balanced except for the relaxed treble. By the way, that wasn't me replying above 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> The CC51 has "monster bass" to you? I thought it was fairly even handed in comparison to real bass monsters like the DUNU Hephaes and SP51 but that's just me.


 

 Same, CC51 bass is definitely enhanced but not at all overbearing.
   


  Quote: 





prazzyp said:


> the headphones i have right now are the cx300 and i was thinking of upgrading upto either the klipsch s4 or the soundmagic E10
> 
> which is better in terms of bass and overall?


 

 S4 has aggressive, punchy bass. E10 is a little softer but not far off in quantity. Unless you anticipate fit issues with the larger housing of the E10 I would not recommend paying any more for the S4. Going into the $60-70 range you could have a Fischer Consonance or something.


----------



## Selenium

When I had the CC51s I thought they had more bass quantity than the ATH-M50s. But then you have that whole M50 white box/blue box confusion, so who knows.
   
  Hey Joker, what would you say your favorite "bassmonster" IEM is? Just out of curiosity.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  and the ATH- ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Hey Joker, what would you say your favorite "bassmonster" IEM is? Just out of curiosity.


 

 The FX700

  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> and the ATH- ?


 

 ?


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





inks said:


> Interesting product in the K2. Monitors are quite the products. The Westone UM series are certainly stage monitors as the sounds is colored in a way to reduce fatigue and create a surround kind of feeling with a lack of forward projection (well illustrated by James444). Then you have the studio monitors but what is sometimes overlooked is the compensations IEMs/headphones need, IEM makers need to compensate for bypassing the pinna. It's not an exact science but ideally a small hump in the lower regions is ideal, though the amount would be subjective (IMO the SE530/EQ-7 and Q-Jays sound very realistic in amount here). Then the higher mids/lower treble are problematic as there is an increased gain there that pretty much requires a dip for the IEMs due to the increase gain. In the higher treble lots of resonant issues reside going up and too much emphasis can overlook the fact that filtering is needed since the IEMs are so close to the ear. Getting the most realistic lower/higher treble is perhaps the hardest feat. My worry about so called "flat" IEMs is their lack of compensation which makes them sound artificially forward in details and somewhat treble lenient. Like reference speakers, imo reference flat (not textbook flat) IEMs would be pretty much midrange focused with the a pinch of body coming from the lower regions and without bringing in harmonics and high frequency details in the high regions too forward with a natural smoothness.
> 
> Wonder what approach J-Phonic took with these in the high regions, lots of things about it look promising. Monitors like the 7550 and GR07 seem to be taking some compensation in mind. I would say that sometimes IEMs that don't have the monitor marketing get the sound quite right like the PFE, SE530/5 and EQ5. SM3 sounds like a stage monitor but I don't think I've seen it marketed as such. I will disagree on the 535's approach in being solely a consumer product, I think it was tuned based with compensation in mind for professionals.


 
  With this in mind, do you think the J-Phonic has some compensation in the treble? You mention less peaky than CK10, but I didn't find that too peaky just too forward which consequently made those small bumps stand out. Then you say it's aggressive which worries me that it may have a forward treble.


----------



## Selenium

I've actually been looking at the FX700s on ebay lately. I don't need another bassmonster so my wallet thanks you!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I don't need any other headphones period...damn it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> With this in mind, do you think the J-Phonic has some compensation in the treble? You mention less peaky than CK10, but I didn't find that too peaky just too forward which consequently made those small bumps stand out. Then you say it's aggressive which worries me that it may have a forward treble.


 

 I didn't see your post.
   
  To be fair, the whole thing is aggressive, and I think the treble is more or less in line with the midrange. I mentioned that it flows better than with the CK10 in the review and then in a subsequent comparison when someone asked, but I don't think it dips down as you want. Oh and the CK10 has some peaks higher up, which with some tracks can make it sound spitty, hot, tizzy, splashy, whatever you want to call it. It's not often a problem but on the rare track where the CK10 does put a foot wrong, the K2 sounds a lot better. 
   


  Quote: 





selenium said:


> I've actually been looking at the FX700s on ebay lately. I don't need another bassmonster so my wallet thanks you!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I have reservations about calling the FX700 a bass monster personally since there is a lot of cheap bass-heavy crap I would like to reserve that label for but if you found the CC51 bassy then I've no doubt that that's what it will be to you.


----------



## kanuka

i was asking about the 3 audio technica which you rated 4.5/5 on isolation, is it possbile to get the same level without too deep insertion, with other tips?


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, was set the rating of Fischer Eterna based on rev.2, or on both?


----------



## sachiel

Oops, didn't see the reply source hehe. Thanks Niyologist!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i was asking about the 3 audio technica which you rated 4.5/5 on isolation, is it possbile to get the same level without too deep insertion, with other tips?


 


  Not unless you have a short-nozzle custom that fits very tightly.


  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, was set the rating of Fischer Eterna based on rev.2, or on both?


 

 Rev.2. It was the only one in production at the time.


----------



## StereoNoodles

Which one of the two would you reccomend more?
  In case you don't remember I like to listen to:
  alternative, pop, rap, and techno, and is looking for a fun, bassy, sound.
   
  ( out of the M2, and the NE-700x )
   
  The build quality, looks, and isolation ( as long as it isn't completely mediocre ) is also of a major part of my decision.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Which one of the two would you reccomend more?
> In case you don't remember I like to listen to:
> alternative, pop, rap, and techno, and is looking for a fun, bassy, sound.
> 
> ...


 


  I don't know what I could tell you that isn't already in the reviews. Just get whichever appeals to you more - both are fun and bassy, both are well-built, both isolate about the same. I prefer the fit, the looks, and the sound signature of the M2 but it's your money and your decision.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## buffalowings

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> questions..you guys say the brainwavz and mee all have driver flex, i hate that, do etymotics products do that? a senn and klipsch did, but never my metrofi or ue500. also how does etys glider tip fit? is it made of silicone id rather not wear the flange or foams?
> http://www.google.com/imgres?q=glider+tip+headphone&hl=en&gbv=2&biw=1366&bih=644&tbm=isch&tbnid=6Vz8ykLHrBX6RM:&imgrefurl=http://latidodeamor.com/product/31/185/Etymotic-Er6i-Glider-Eartips.html&docid=36CYjz2Bwdm6dM&itg=1&imgurl=http://latidodeamor.com/img/31/185/1.jpg&w=300&h=300&ei=LkPDTrDuBOfV0QHN85TrDg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=296&sig=110043108139353515251&page=1&tbnh=138&tbnw=155&start=0&ndsp=18&ved=1t:429,r:2,s:0&tx=73&ty=63
> 
> also joker, do you like the addiem or superfi4 better? did you get your addiem off ebay or an authorized retailer? i ask becuaseyour plug is short it dosent look like the true addiem jack?
> ...


 

 the m2's? not in my memory, they had a tiny vent, any dynamic driver IEM with a vent on the side generally doesn't have any driver flex, the worst offenders imo are the monster turbine range


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> did you get your addiem off ebay or an authorized retailer? i ask becuaseyour plug is short it dosent look like the true addiem jack?


 

 My ADDIEM is very old, from the first production batch. They changed the jack at some later point. I prefer the ADDIEM to the SF4 but that's not to say it's a better earphone.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## dogears

sf5v2 is a very good IEM


----------



## Bola 7

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Rev.2. It was the only one in production at the time.


 

 Joker, would be the rating of Fischer Eterna rev.1 higher that 7,7?


----------



## sphinxvc

You weren't kidding!  They really do feel like gummy bears in your ears.  (Picked up a pair of RE-252s today)


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


sphinxvc said:


> You weren't kidding!  They really do feel like gummy bears in your ears.  (Picked up a pair of RE-252s today)


 

 They taste like gummy bears too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, would be the rating of Fischer Eterna rev.1 higher that 7,7?


 


  Yes, but only by a tenth or two. I really didn't think the difference between them was major.

  
  Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> You weren't kidding!  They really do feel like gummy bears in your ears.  (Picked up a pair of RE-252s today)


 

 I don't joke! Hope they are comfortable - fit can really be hit or miss with those 
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> They taste like gummy bears too.


 

 Like scented rubber, then


----------



## sphinxvc

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I don't joke! Hope they are comfortable - fit can really be hit or miss with those


 

 Comfort is okay, can't wear them for longer than 30-45 minutes at a time.  Microphonics on the cable are so bad that listening on the go is not an option. And last but not least, they are a significant downgrade from the B2/DBA-02s I had recently.


----------



## olear

Joker, would you rate FXT90 SQ equilavant to GR07?
   
  Is FXT90 your first recommdation for an IEM within the < $200 range that is more musical, better dynamic range and warmer vs GR07?
   
  Thank you!


----------



## Niyologist

I'm gonna review the Sony XBA-4 Very Soon.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## buffalowings

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker, is the ue600 or the etymotic mc5 a better headphone overall(sound quality wise)? i can get both at the same price right now
> 
> oh and what are the glider tips made of? are they like a regular silicone tip that im used to, becuase i dont like the foam or flange tips?
> 
> i also wonder why they didnt make the ue600 and ue700 out of metal like the superfi4


 


  they are made of foam..does anyone else think they look like a panzerfaust rocket?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> Joker, would you rate FXT90 SQ equilavant to GR07?
> 
> Is FXT90 your first recommdation for an IEM within the < $200 range that is more musical, better dynamic range and warmer vs GR07?
> 
> Thank you!


 

 I have yet to hear an FXT90. 
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> joker, is the ue600 or the etymotic mc5 a better headphone overall(sound quality wise)? i can get both at the same price right now


 

 The MC5 is better technically but personally I would take the UE600 any day. Much less boring with its mid-forward sound and wide soundstage.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> awesome thanks. im really aiming for that balanced sound though, so maybe the mc5 would suite me. as for this superfi4 vs addiem you are right, the superfi4 is a overall better sounding headphone (and it doesnt slip out of your ear, which kills the presence of treble on the addiem). the superfi4 have a fuller sound in both the bass and mids, treble sounds about equal to the addiems, but the superfi4 have a much better soundstage and much better at placing things in the correct spots
> 
> the only thing the addiem have going for them is that they sound smoother, but i think thats just because the mids are so foward on the superfi4 that it cause minor sibilance, which constantly causes me to make sure the superfi4 are not ever too loud, they only sound good at a certain volume. thought im not sure what causes the mild harshness with the superfi4, and the addiem dont hiss horribly like the superfi4, which really doesnt bother me but just thought id add


 


  That's one of the odd things about the SuperFi4 - it's the only sibilant earphone based around an SR driver that I've heard. The PL50 and A151 are not sibilant at all. Hissing is common to all of them, though - the driver is quite sensitive. The A151 just sounds dreadful out of my phone as a result, not that I would dream of using an armature-based IEM with a phone on a daily basis. Also, ADDIEM stock tips are quite poor. They shouldn't give any fit trouble with decent tips.
   
  As for the MC5, I could definitely listen to it and appreciate what it can do but I can't say I enjoyed it all that much. It is possible to do balanced sound and still keep it involving - the RE-ZERO manages just fine, for example, as do sets from Xears, Maximo, ECCI, Soundmagic, etc. Even Etymotic's own HF5 is difficult to put down for me. The MC5 is not.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's one of the odd things about the SuperFi4 - it's the only sibilant earphone based around an SR driver that I've heard. The PL50 and A151 are not sibilant at all. Hissing is common to all of them, though - the driver is quite sensitive. The A151 just sounds dreadful out of my phone as a result, *not that I would dream of using an armature-based IEM with a phone on a daily basis*. Also, ADDIEM stock tips are quite poor. They shouldn't give any fit trouble with decent tips.


 
  why not?


----------



## bubsdaddy

Quote: 





> Also, ADDIEM stock tips are quite poor. They shouldn't give any fit trouble with decent tips.


 
  There is a whole thread somewhere dedicated to finding the right tips for ADDIEMS. Sony Hybrids worked quite well for me. I walked around all day yesterday listening to the ADDIEMS and never was fatigued by the sound or the fit.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> why not?


 


  Armatures are generally more sensitive and phones are generally noisy (with a number of exceptions like the iPhone).


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

I ordered the Fiio E6 about 30 minutes ago. It'll be in my hands by Next Tuesday.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> does the ue600 have a mild harshness that the superfi4 does, or is the sound more refined? also why doesnt the addiem place things as well, what does that have to do with in a headphone, the tuning of what?


 


  The UE600 is more refined than the SF4. As for presentation, there are many things that go into getting it right. Mvw2 had a lot of very lengthy posts explaining it in his many review threads - I'd look those up.


----------



## Inks

Ordered one as well just for curiosity's sake.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Hi joker, I'm back with my GR07s!
   
  Right out of the box, I'm already enjoying them! So much more detailed than the Pro Coppers, and with better soundstage/imaging to boot.
   
  The only thing is that sibilance is pretty bothersome right now, and the lower treble is spikey. Hopefully they change with burn in.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## kckc

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> so i got my ue600. is it normal that when i push on them in my ear the sound cuts out and in, none of my other headphones do this, but both ear pieces do this. also it says it should have an angled plug, and the picture on the ue website shows an angled plug. mine is a straight plug like the superfi5. think they are just boxing the superfi5 and selling them as ue600 till they run out of stock?


 

 yes some earphones can have driver flex, although I also had the UE600 before and they didn't have them. The UE600 is just another name for the SuperFi 5, it was renamed.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Krypt

Would you say that out of the M6 and the M9, which one has a better value? Even though the prices are almost the same, I wonder which ends up being better. Especially in terms of comfort, i've heard many mixed reviews.


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Hey Joker,
   
  Since I got my SP-51's, I'm loving them!  I've been using the black plate and the bass is nice, deep, full and impactful.  The treble could be a tad more forward, but I'm mostly listening to drum and bass so it's ok.  My only complaint is it's time consuming getting a perfect seal with them.  Too far in or not far in enough I lose bass, and sometimes when I get a good seal, they need to be readjusted again if I'm moving around or exercising with them.
   
  I just got a new Atrio X which hasn't burned in yet, but they are easier to get a seal with and stay in place even if I'm exercising with them.  But the bass isn't as deep and impactful as the SP-51's, although the sub-bass frequencies seem to be more cleanly separated.  I don't know if the bass will become deeper after burn-in as I've only listened to them for about 15 hours now.
   
  I was wondering if you could recommend an upgrade to the SP-51's in terms of bass quantity and quality.  Is there anything deeper and more impactful and also stays put if I'm exercising?  I'd like an earphone that would be quite offensive to a non-basshead.  Smooth sound signature and non-fatiguing like the SP-51's.
   
  In terms of pricing, I'd like it to be <$70.  Black Friday is coming up so I'm thinking earphones that normally go for $110 might work.  Is there anything that would be a MAJOR upgrade from the SP-51's or is everything just a minor upgrade at this point?  I was looking at the Munitio 9 MM billets, I think they're the cheaper versions of the SITi ones you reviewed before, but audio response graphs for both sets look identical.  They also come with earhooks which I hope keep them in place when I'm active.
   
  EDIT:  Or should I look into an amp...maybe a ZO2?  My source right now is a Sony NWZ E354 mp3 player.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


realslimseto said:


> Hi joker, I'm back with my GR07s!
> 
> Right out of the box, I'm already enjoying them! So much more detailed than the Pro Coppers, and with better soundstage/imaging to boot.
> 
> The only thing is that sibilance is pretty bothersome right now, and the lower treble is spikey. Hopefully they change with burn in.


 
  
  The sibilance will improve, though maybe not enough depending on how sensitive to it you are



 Quote:


bmeat said:


> i know what driver flex sounds like, on other headphones it used to make one side less loud until i broke the suction, and youd hear the driver kind of crackle. the sound on these actually cuts off and back on when i give them a push. maybe theyre designed to do this, becuase i dont think ba can have driver flex? this is what im most concerned about


 
 No, there shouldn't be any driver flex and the sound shouldn't cut out unless you are using a long tip and sealing off your ear canal when you do that, nor should it sound worse than the SF4. The mids especially should be very strong and smooth and the soundstage should be pretty wide.

  
  Quote: 





krypt said:


> Would you say that out of the M6 and the M9, which one has a better value? Even though the prices are almost the same, I wonder which ends up being better. Especially in terms of comfort, i've heard many mixed reviews.


 

 If they are the same price I'd say the M6. A little less bass and the treble isn't as harsh. It is harder to get a good seal, though. The M9 is very straightforward in fit - pretty much all 'straight' earphones will fit like that. M6 is ergonomic and very comfortable as long as it fits in your outer ear.
   


  Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Since I got my SP-51's, I'm loving them!  I've been using the black plate and the bass is nice, deep, full and impactful.  The treble could be a tad more forward, but I'm mostly listening to drum and bass so it's ok.  My only complaint is it's time consuming getting a perfect seal with them.  Too far in or not far in enough I lose bass, and sometimes when I get a good seal, they need to be readjusted again if I'm moving around or exercising with them.
> 
> ...


 


  I really don't think there is a major upgrade from the SP51 for <$70, unless they really didn't match your listening preference. I would almost say try some foam tips and a pair of earhooks instead of different earphones. There are few things that can match the bass quantity of the SP51 - maybe the Fischer Consonance/Eterna if you can stand to lose a bit of extension for better sound overall. The Consonance especially will have quite a bit more treble sparkle but I'm not sure it will stay in any better (though it is very lightweight). The Munitio is just different but you will miss the clarity of the SP51 if you go in that direction. I don't know anything about the ZO.


----------



## Foress

Hi ljokerl,
   
  Any intention of testing out ClarityOne IEMs anytime soon?
  Or have you tested them out already?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





foress said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> Any intention of testing out ClarityOne IEMs anytime soon?
> Or have you tested them out already?


 


  Yeah, I received my pair this week. They are alright earphones but nothing as revolutionary as the marketing claims. Treble is too prominent out of the box.


----------



## Leo888

Hi ljokerl,
  I'm having issue with driver flex and would like to know if it will have any adverse effect on the phone.
  Thanks


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I really don't think there is a major upgrade from the SP51 for <$70, unless they really didn't match your listening preference. I would almost say try some foam tips and a pair of earhooks instead of different earphones. There are few things that can match the bass quantity of the SP51 - maybe the Fischer Consonance/Eterna if you can stand to lose a bit of extension for better sound overall. The Consonance especially will have quite a bit more treble sparkle but I'm not sure it will stay in any better (though it is very lightweight). The Munitio is just different but you will miss the clarity of the SP51 if you go in that direction. I don't know anything about the ZO.


 


  Yeah I'm going to try some Comply T-400's soon as I love the sound from the SP's.  I think they're going to have a black friday deal on them so I'll give it a shot.  Any idea's on where to get earhooks alone.  I saw some Woodees.., are there any other ones?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## erudite

Hi ljokerl,
   
  Any plans to review the vsonic gr06's any time soon?


----------



## staxxx

ljokerl, in your opinion how does the EX600 compares against it's bigger brother (I'm assuming you've listened to them already).
And would you consider these flat sounding?

Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Yeah I'm going to try some Comply T-400's soon as I love the sound from the SP's.  I think they're going to have a black friday deal on them so I'll give it a shot.  Any idea's on where to get earhooks alone.  I saw some Woodees.., are there any other ones?


 

 Those are not the kind of earhooks I had in mind. They just hold the earphones in place while worn cord-down. Not sure how well they work. I was thinking along the lines of conventional earhooks, for over-the-ear wear. MEElec and Phonak both sell them.
   


  Quote: 





erudite said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> Any plans to review the vsonic gr06's any time soon?


 

 Unfortunately, no


  Quote: 





staxxx said:


> ljokerl, in your opinion how does the EX600 compares against it's bigger brother (I'm assuming you've listened to them already).
> And would you consider these flat sounding?
> Thanks


 
   
  Flat in terms of response? No, not really. The EX1000 isn't flat either - both are colored, albeit pleasantly. They do share a sound signature but the EX1000 is that little bit better all around. The EX600 is about on-par with the GR07 technically but if you're looking for flat the VSonics are a better choice.


----------



## whitefroded

Any word  on the new Brainwavz M4?


----------



## Inks

I personally think they're flat, but only from the bass to the midrange to about (1.5-2k). The upper midrange and treble is where things start getting colored. Not sure I'll say the GR07 are more flat, their bass has an added hump, but it does make them sound more natural and probably more flat if related with compensation in mind. I do think the treble is more even though, but not by a big margin.


----------



## olear

The GR07 has more quantity mid and sub bass vs EX600?
   
  Relative to GR07, is EX600 brighter, even to the point of being unpleasant?
   
  Which would most say is more musical, GR07, EX600 or FXT90?


----------



## DnB Sublimity

I see what you're talking about now...thanks!  I'll try and get the MEE ones when they're available.


----------



## Inks

olear said:


> The GR07 has more quantity mid and sub bass vs EX600?
> 
> Relative to GR07, is EX600 brighter, even to the point of being unpleasant?
> 
> Which would most say is more musical, GR07, EX600 or FXT90?


 
  Here's my take:
  In terms of quantity yes, it has more midbass and subbass. I think the EX600's bass may be a tad tighter though. 
   
  The EX600 is brighter, but it isn't too bright. The problem is a lower treble spike, the GR07 has the same issue but the EX600's seems more uneven. 
   
  "Musical" is broad and is variable, I actually think a close to neutral presentation is musical so it's hard to say. I did predict a great appeal for the FXT90s due to their very aggressive, exiting signature and the appeal has surely turned out to be there. I think the EX600 is the more clinical one of the 3. The GR07 has a nice amount of bass that gives it a good amount of excitement, same for the treble to a lesser extent.


----------



## Dijital

Hey guys. My pair of Sony In ears died on me yesterday, so I've been looking to replace them. I like in the UK, and my budget is around £25.  What would be my best choice? 
   
  Thank you


----------



## whitefroded

Quote: 





dijital said:


> Hey guys. My pair of Sony In ears died on me yesterday, so I've been looking to replace them. I like in the UK, and my budget is around £25.  What would be my best choice?
> 
> Thank you


 


  You are asking this in a thread where, by reading the first page, you would have an answer.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a review of the Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 customs in a separate thread for now:
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/581273/review-clear-tune-monitors-ctm-200-dual-driver-custom#post_7906445

  
  Quote: 





whitefroded said:


> Any word  on the new Brainwavz M4?


 


  Don't know anything about them


----------



## Kejd

Hi ljokerl
Can you give me some sound comparison between westone 3 and UM Miracle? Especially, does vocal sound more laid back for Miracle?


----------



## olear

Quote: 





inks said:


> Here's my take:
> In terms of quantity yes, it has more midbass and subbass. I think the EX600's bass may be a tad tighter though.
> 
> The EX600 is brighter, but it isn't too bright. The problem is a lower treble spike, the GR07 has the same issue but the EX600's seems more uneven.
> ...


 


 Can you compare/contrast the signature of FXT90 and GR07 in terms of bass, mids and treble?
  And, which has a  better three dimensional perception.
  If you were listening to music with eyes closed, which phone would you feel you're at a live concert or being in the same space while the actual music is being produced ?


----------



## Inks

FXT90 has a more accentuated bass, warmer midrange with a bit less clarity and a more forward treble with good extension and sparkle (one of it's strenghts imo). 
   
  GR07 is softer, more detailed and it's treble is a bit laid back apart from some upper midrange peaks. 
   
  FXT90 is more 3D due to greater stage depth, the GR07 isn't completely lacking in depth though and it is wider. 
   
  Too broad and subjective and honestly a pointless way to illustrate it imo. I can tell you that the GR07 is more true to the recording, while the FXT90 is surely more colored to sound more exiting and fun.


----------



## estreeter

This thread is like an out-of-control train hurtling toward a level crossing where it will soon intersect with an out-of-control school bus carrying sick children to a Xmas Party. I swear there have been over a hundred posts since Friday, and I dont know of any other thread that can make a similar claim .....
   
  Having spent the weekend with the ZO2 and various cans, my gut feel is that the Hippo VB might be just a little too much of a 'good thing' with this gadget, so its back to the drawing board for my Dec purchase.


----------



## Foress

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah, I received my pair this week. They are alright earphones but nothing as revolutionary as the marketing claims. Treble is too prominent out of the box.


 


  all right! looking forward to your impressions and reviews after burn in.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





inks said:


> FXT90 has a more accentuated bass, warmer midrange with a bit less clarity and a more forward treble with good extension and sparkle (one of it's strenghts imo).
> 
> GR07 is softer, more detailed and it's treble is a bit laid back apart from some upper midrange peaks.
> 
> ...


 

 Looking further into a favorite armature: ATH-CK10 and FI-BA-A1. Balanced armatures offer more speed vs dynamic's bass?
   
  You also thought FXT90 was one of your favorite dynamics.
   
  After reviewing some posts on the RE272 and e-q5, many were very impressed with e-q5, especially at $250 and at a premium of $70 vs GR07, perhaps it's worth the money?


----------



## Inks

BAs do generally have better speed and imaging as well. Dynamics are slower but tend to have a more natural decay due to greater bass depth, there are many good BAs with good depth though. 
   
  General worth is a hard thing to measure. There are many comparisons out there if interested on the a certain IEM, the GR07 review by ClieOS has some EQ-5 comparisons


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kejd said:


> Hi ljokerl
> Can you give me some sound comparison between westone 3 and UM Miracle? Especially, does vocal sound more laid back for Miracle?


 

 Everything sounds more laid-back on the Miracle - it's not an aggressive earphone whereas the Westone 3 is. The difference in relative emphasis between bass, mids, treble is smaller, though. More bass depth on the Miracle, less of a mid-bass lift, flatter response overall. The Miracle is also smoother, thicker, warmer, more lush, much less strident at the top, and the soundstage is a lot more enveloping. Aside from balance and soundstage size, it's probably closer to the UM3X than the W3.

  
  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> This thread is like an out-of-control train hurtling toward a level crossing where it will soon intersect with an out-of-control school bus carrying sick children to a Xmas Party. I swear there have been over a hundred posts since Friday, and I dont know of any other thread that can make a similar claim .....


 


 Well, let's just hope it doesn't all come to a screamin' halt one day


----------



## d4free

Joker
   
  When will your review about the sba-03 be ready? I have 2 pairs of Sunrise Xcape IE of the moment but i will be sending them back. Do u have a first impression and how would u rate them?
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, let's just hope it doesn't all come to a screamin' halt one day


 

 Well, that obviously depends on your stamina, so let's hope you can keep a healthy mind and body. Tbo, sometimes I can't help but picture you doing some serious zen meditation in the morning, just to prepare for all those 'Joker, when will you review xyz' requests 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Anyway, best of luck to a (super)man with a mission, but don't forget there's nothing wrong about a train slowing down or even taking a break every now and then.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


james444 said:


> Well, that obviously depends on your stamina, so let's hope you can keep a healthy mind and body. Tbo, sometimes I can't help but picture you doing some serious zen meditation in the morning, just to prepare for all those 'Joker, when will you review xyz' requests
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Well said. Even our ears need a well deserved break from time to time. That said, let's not forget, |joker| *IS* the Chuck Norris of Head-Fi. For instance, did you know that (much like Chuck Norris) |joker| can unscramble scrambled eggs? Crazy, right?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## staxxx

that occurred with my JVC HA-FXC51, but only for the left side.

They would be dead, then when you push them in they come alive inside your ears and I doubt it's a cable problem


----------



## Niyologist

I got my Fiio E6 and it works pretty well with my Atrio X. It makes my Atrio X incredibly bassy at Level 3.


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I got my Fiio E6 and it works pretty well with my Atrio X. It makes my Atrio X *incredibly bassy* at Level 3.


 


  Oh hell yes!!!  I love the fit of the Atrio X, but I just wish I could get more bass out of it...mind you I probably only have about 20 hours burn-in.  I was considering a ZO2 but this is a much cheaper option.
   
  How would you compare the amped bass of the Atrio X with the SP51 black plate?  Also have you tried the SP51's with it?


----------



## dogears

I'm not sure how would |joker| take this 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			










  
  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> Well said. Even our ears need a well deserved break from time to time. That said, let's not forget, |joker| *IS* the Chuck Norris of Head-Fi. For instance, did you know that (much like Chuck Norris) |joker| can unscramble scrambled eggs? Crazy, right?


----------



## Kejd

ljokerl said:


> Everything sounds more laid-back on the Miracle - it's not an aggressive earphone whereas the Westone 3 is. The difference in relative emphasis between bass, mids, treble is smaller, though. More bass depth on the Miracle, less of a mid-bass lift, flatter response overall. The Miracle is also smoother, thicker, warmer, more lush, much less strident at the top, and the soundstage is a lot more enveloping. Aside from balance and soundstage size, it's probably closer to the UM3X than the W3.




Thanks for the reply! I am really looking for an IEM that can satisfy me on acoustic music with a lot of female vocal. W3 just seems to produce really good sound for this preference but I want an upgrade. Do you think Miracle is good choice for these genre?

Edit: is vocal on Miracle laid back as much as triplefi? I cannot stand that muffled vocal =\


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Oh hell yes!!!  I love the fit of the Atrio X, but I just wish I could get more bass out of it...mind you I probably only have about 20 hours burn-in.  I was considering a ZO2 but this is a much cheaper option.
> 
> How would you compare the amped bass of the Atrio X with the SP51 black plate?  Also have you tried the SP51's with it?


 

      The bass amp of the Atrio X is much greater than the Extreme Bass port of the SP51 and it's slightly cleaner and definitely deeper. Sounds like being in a club.


----------



## DnB Sublimity

And your source is a Sansa Fuze?  I have a Sony NWZ E-354, and I'm wondering if I'll achieve the same results.  The price is definitely right though.  Before amping, your SP-51 enhanced bass is deeper than the Atrios right?  Reason I ask - I only have limited burn-in hours on the Atrios so I don't know if with more hours it'll get as deep...right now SP-51 is deeper than the Atrios for me.


----------



## StereoNoodles

Hi Joker, I realized that the M9's and the CC51 are in a higher price tier than they should be...
   
  The  Sp51's are only $35 bucks at Amazon, and the CC51 are only $40.
   
  I am sure the value for these would be MUCH MUCH higher at such a low price...
  Of course, if you are just going by MSRP prices I understand....


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> And your source is a Sansa Fuze?  I have a Sony NWZ E-354, and I'm wondering if I'll achieve the same results.  The price is definitely right though.  Before amping, your SP-51 enhanced bass is deeper than the Atrios right?  Reason I ask - I only have limited burn-in hours on the Atrios so I don't know if with more hours it'll get as deep...right now SP-51 is deeper than the Atrios for me.


 

      The SP51 with the Enhanced Bass Port is slightly behind in comparison to my fully burned Atrio X before amping for bass depth and quantity. The Sub Bass is amazing on the Atrio X. It's cleaner, deeper, quicker and definitely more natural sounding than the SP51.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





d4free said:


> Joker
> 
> When will your review about the sba-03 be ready? I have 2 pairs of Sunrise Xcape IE of the moment but i will be sending them back. Do u have a first impression and how would u rate them?
> Thanks in advance.


 

 The SBA-03 is a very good earphone, review should be up in 2-3 weeks. It rates about on-level with the Fischer Tandem and Ety HF5 for me. It is definitely a full-range armature with good bass punch, very strong mids, and reasonably bright treble but not something I would bill as an Xcape IE alternative - the sound signature is quite different.

  
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Well, that obviously depends on your stamina, so let's hope you can keep a healthy mind and body. Tbo, sometimes I can't help but picture you doing some serious zen meditation in the morning, just to prepare for all those 'Joker, when will you review xyz' requests
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks but not to worry, I take plenty of breaks. Got a vast pool of finished reviews to pick and choose from to keep on posting at the same pace even when I'm not listening or writing.


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> Well said. Even our ears need a well deserved break from time to time. That said, let's not forget, |joker| *IS* the Chuck Norris of Head-Fi. For instance, did you know that (much like Chuck Norris) |joker| can unscramble scrambled eggs? Crazy, right?


 

 There is also no chin under my beard, only more ears.


  Quote: 





kejd said:


> Thanks for the reply! I am really looking for an IEM that can satisfy me on acoustic music with a lot of female vocal. W3 just seems to produce really good sound for this preference but I want an upgrade. Do you think Miracle is good choice for these genre?


 


  If you want something fuller, warmer, and smoother - sure. If you are used to the crisp, thin note presentation of the W3 you may want to find a more analytical custom.
   
   


  Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Hi Joker, I realized that the M9's and the CC51 are in a higher price tier than they should be...
> 
> The  Sp51's are only $35 bucks at Amazon, and the CC51 are only $40.
> 
> ...


 

 I go by street price at the time of writing. If I go back and change the CC51 and SP51 scores, I will have to be fair and update the prices for everything and really, I'd rather not. Head-fi is a worldwide community and I leave it up to the reader to find the best deal available to him/her.


----------



## Kejd

Last question, is vocal on Miracle laid back as much as triplefi is? Because TF vocal sounds too muffled to me. By the way, it really helped! Thx for taking time to answer my questions.


----------



## Julk

Right now I'm looking at getting some ~50$ IEMs. Specifically I'm looking at the Etymotic S4 and the Meelectronic A151 (Both can be had for ~50$ on amazon atm)
   
  A major concern for me is that a lot of people complain that the bass is lacking in both of them
  If I'm looking for a balanced sound (other headphones I have used include grado sr60 and Shure srh440, and I found both to be great), will I find the bass in these two IEMs to be lacking?
   
   
  Any other highly recommended IEMs around this price range?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





julk said:


> Right now I'm looking at getting some ~50$ IEMs. Specifically I'm looking at the Etymotic S4 and the Meelectronic A151 (Both can be had for ~50$ on amazon atm)
> 
> A major concern for me is that a lot of people complain that the bass is lacking in both of them
> If I'm looking for a balanced sound (other headphones I have used include grado sr60 and Shure srh440, and I found both to be great), will I find the bass in these two IEMs to be lacking?
> ...


 

 You mean the Klipsch S4? or the Etymotic MC5? totally different IEMs.
  Anyway, regarding the A151's. I really don't find them to be all that lacking in the bass department, though they do have a slight midrange emphasis.
  If you want another IEM in that price range, the MEE CC51 can also be had for around the same price. I heard them once, and I thought they had a slightly bassier sound than the A151s, and a little more natural decay in general? I'm not really sure how to describe it, and keep in mind I only heard it once. But that's another option.


----------



## Julk

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> You mean the Klipsch S4? or the Etymotic MC5? totally different IEMs.
> Anyway, regarding the A151's. I really don't find them to be all that lacking in the bass department, though they do have a slight midrange emphasis.
> If you want another IEM in that price range, the MEE CC51 can also be had for around the same price. I heard them once, and I thought they had a slightly bassier sound than the A151s, and a little more natural decay in general? I'm not really sure how to describe it, and keep in mind I only heard it once. But that's another option.


 
   
   
  Haha YEAH i DO mean the MC5
   
  Stupid brain...


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





kejd said:


> Thanks for the reply! I am really looking for an IEM that can satisfy me on acoustic music with a lot of female vocal. W3 just seems to produce really good sound for this preference but I want an upgrade. Do you think Miracle is good choice for these genre?
> Edit: is vocal on Miracle laid back as much as triplefi? I cannot stand that muffled vocal =\


 

 If you like acoustic music with female vocals then the Ortofon e-q7 is really good with that. Hope this helps


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, In your review *"Clash of the Titans: HJE900 vs. CK10 vs. Turbine Pro Gold*" there is this affirmation:

 "The CK10s have a slight disadvantage in being BA phones, which have always sounded slightly ‘artificial’ to me in terms of timbre, but still manage to hold their own."

 Still think You in this manner?


----------



## DnB Sublimity

Thanks Niyologist.  I'm going to give it a shot because the next step up for me is probably a completely new class of earphones that'll cost a lot more than the E6.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





dnb sublimity said:


> Thanks Niyologist.  I'm going to give it a shot because the next step up for me is probably a completely new class of earphones that'll cost a lot more than the E6.


 

      No problem. I'm loving the Atrio X+E6 Combo right now. It made my Atrio X a tad bit more detailed and widened the Soundstage/Headstage slightly, making it somewhat more dynamic.


----------



## dilkrac

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks for the reply! I am really looking for an IEM that can satisfy me on acoustic music with a lot of female vocal. W3 just seems to produce really good sound for this preference but I want an upgrade. Do you think Miracle is good choice for these genre?
> 
> 
> If you want something fuller, warmer, and smoother - sure. If you are used to the crisp, thin note presentation of the W3 you may want to find a more analytical custom.


 
   
  I thought Westones 3 has more warm and smooth sound signature while Miracle sounds very analytical, cold, dry, and sounds similar to TF with V shape frequency.

  
  Quote: 





kejd said:


> Last question, is vocal on Miracle laid back as much as triplefi is? Because TF vocal sounds too muffled to me. By the way, it really helped! Thx for taking time to answer my questions.


 
   
  This, i am really curious to know as well.


----------



## Mini0510

Hi, for the UM Miracles, how well does it work with EQ Treble Booster?
  The bass might be too much for some tracks.
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kejd said:


> Last question, is vocal on Miracle laid back as much as triplefi is? Because TF vocal sounds too muffled to me. By the way, it really helped! Thx for taking time to answer my questions.


 

 The Miracle is more balanced overall than the TF10 and the midrange is not crowded out.
   


  Quote: 





julk said:


> Right now I'm looking at getting some ~50$ IEMs. Specifically I'm looking at the Etymotic S4 and the Meelectronic A151 (Both can be had for ~50$ on amazon atm)
> 
> A major concern for me is that a lot of people complain that the bass is lacking in both of them
> If I'm looking for a balanced sound (other headphones I have used include grado sr60 and Shure srh440, and I found both to be great), will I find the bass in these two IEMs to be lacking?
> ...


 

 I haven't heard the SRH440  but Grados have always had a bit of added punch to my ears. I think you would have to go a little bassier than A151/MC5 if you want that kind of impact, maybe for something with the balance of a Soundmagic E10 or a MEElec CW31 or Brainwavz Beta on the <$30 side.

  
  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, In your review *"Clash of the Titans: HJE900 vs. CK10 vs. Turbine Pro Gold*" there is this affirmation:
> 
> "The CK10s have a slight disadvantage in being BA phones, which have always sounded slightly ‘artificial’ to me in terms of timbre, but still manage to hold their own."
> 
> Still think You in this manner?


 

 In a way, but I think the bar has been raised in both categories and the gap has decreased significantly since I wrote that review. The Miracle does not sound any less natural than the FX700 or EX1000 to me, though there is that difference in price.
   


  Quote: 





dilkrac said:


> I thought Westones 3 has more warm and smooth sound signature while* Miracle sounds very analytical, cold, dry, and sounds similar to TF* with V shape frequency.


 

 The Miracle is none of those things.
   


  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Hi, for the UM Miracles, how well does it work with EQ Treble Booster?
> The bass might be too much for some tracks.
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  I am not familiar with the effect of iPod EQ settings on the Miracle and do not recommend using them with a high-end earphone. If you think you will need to use a permanent equalizer preset to get the sound you want, buy a different set of earphones. There's certainly more than enough variety out there.


----------



## estreeter

Is it just me, or are we getting a new 'top of the heap' universal every month now ? I guess it just seems that way.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Is it just me, or are we getting a new 'top of the heap' universal every month now ? I guess it just seems that way.


 

 What was it last month?
   
  Btw, the J-phonics were reviewed by shigzeo many, many months ago quite favorably.  Wonder what he's been up to....


----------



## estreeter

How long ago was the RE272 released ? Like I said, its probably just me.


----------



## Mini0510

1. is equalizer not recommended on customs or any high end IEM?
   
  2. how does Miracles perform in Punk/Pop Rock and Hip Pop music?
   
  3. How much gap is between Sennheiser IE8, Sony EX1000, and Monster Turbine or any top universal IEM and UM Miracle?
   
  Thanks


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, about the Shure SE215, you affirmed:

 "the upper midrange of the Shures reveals a bit of grain but nothing distracting or even unpleasant."
  
 Do you believe the process of break-in can improve this?


----------



## zmd

Any MEE CC51 owners around? How are these isolation-wise? I've finally pulled the trigger and ordered a pair, with fairly high hopes. I'm not expecting them to beat my currend portables (HD25s) but I guess I find it's nice to own a good set of ''invisible'' headphones - that is, compared to the Sennheisers  Does anyone besides joker have any idea how they measure up?


----------



## StereoNoodles

How does the M9's bass compare to the Brainwavz M2's?
  Is it as punchy as the M9?
   
  I saw a review on amazon that states there wasn't enough bass..
  Which really worries me..
   
  Wondering if I should really upgrade or not..
   
  Also, have you heard about the Soul by Ludacris' SL series?
  I was sort of expecting it to be just like Beats, but with the very few reviews there are, it's supposed to be somewhat decent...


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





zmd said:


> Any MEE CC51 owners around? How are these isolation-wise? I've finally pulled the trigger and ordered a pair, with fairly high hopes. I'm not expecting them to beat my currend portables (HD25s) but I guess I find it's nice to own a good set of ''invisible'' headphones - that is, compared to the Sennheisers  Does anyone besides joker have any idea how they measure up?


 

      I'm a CC51 owner and it isolates nicely, but not as much as the Atrio X. The CC51 slashes the external noise by around 20 db. The Atrio X slashes it around 26 db.


----------



## Ulti

Hi Joker, as you may recall, I'm looking for an upgrade from the RE0s with more isolation then it's good. I prefer a more analytical sound signature but as long as clarity exists then I won't have much to complain about if there is isolation along with it.
   
  Now I've bought some Shure SE215s just to try what the over ear types are like as well as some Phonak PFE 112s. Whilst the Shure SE215 easily wins in isolation, I do not like the sound signature of it and much prefer the RE0. I do also have the FX1X and quite like the bass too when I want some fun. The Phonak PFE 112s seem pretty good from initial listening but the isolation is horrible, even compared with my RE0 (note I am using shallow triple flanges which seem to isolate the best for straight barelled IEMs for me) and hence I'm stuck with my RE0 for now. I was going to try some Etymotic IEMs but I've decided that they're probably not for me and that the RE0 will probably be "good enough" and not warrant an upgrade to the Etymotic IEMs. 
   
  Now after reading about the VSonic GR07s, I'm quite tempted to go for them as they seem to have enough *clarity *but with *more bass* (which is never a bad thing as long as it's not overpowering or muddy). In addition to this, I may be able to get them for £85 (brand new) in the UK which, to me, would give it a VFM rating of 5/5 (I bought my RE0s for £40 second hand so it's also 5/5 VFM).
   
  However, I'm also interested in customs and I feel that on the other hand, the fit and isolation of customs will be perfect, and we all know that SQ depends on a good seal. The ones that I'm planning to buy is the Minerva Mi-1 (I considered the Kozee Infinity X1 Executives but as I'm from the UK I wanted to deal with a UK firm instead) but I'm worried that I'll lost a lot of detail. From initial listening from the Phonak PFE112s though, it seems that a single BA is quite adequate for me though, but I'm not sure what is used in the Minerva Mi-1 and whether or not it'll provide enough clarity.
   
*Tl;dr:*
  1) How would you compare the VSonic GR07s to the RE0 (I'm aware the RE0 is brighter and more analytical and the GR07 is more balanced, what else would you add/correct to my knowledge?).
  2) Will customs generally provide enough clarity with a single BA driver and will the custom fit seal provide a bit more bass? (I love the RE0 but need a better fit/isolation and a tiny bit more bass).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> 1. is equalizer not recommended on customs or any high end IEM?
> 
> 2. how does Miracles perform in Punk/Pop Rock and Hip Pop music?
> 
> ...


 


  1. I don't like the ipod equalizer presets with anything
  2. My stance has always been that signature preferences trump genre preferences. If you like the signature, you'll probably enjoy it with any genre
  3. You've asked me this via PM. I can't give any more exact of an answer than the scores in this thread give.


  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, about the Shure SE215, you affirmed:
> 
> "the upper midrange of the Shures reveals a bit of grain but nothing distracting or even unpleasant."
> 
> Do you believe the process of break-in can improve this?


 

 No, that grain is pretty typical of some earphones. In my experience it never really goes away. As for the claims that earphone X only starts sounding really good after 800 hours, I have neither the time nor the patience to test those claims but I've never noticed anything changing notably past my usual burn-in time. 


  Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> How does the M9's bass compare to the Brainwavz M2's?
> Is it as punchy as the M9?
> 
> I saw a review on amazon that states there wasn't enough bass..
> ...


 

 M9 has more sub-bass emphasis, the M2 is mostly mid/upper-bass. Anyone saying that the M2 lacks bass is either a basshead or is getting a poor seal - it's bass is way above flat. If you want an M9 upgrade in terms of subbass quantity as well as overall quality you'd be looking at something like the SP51+black ports or Padacs Aksent in the <$50 category.
   
  I don't know anything about the Soul.
   


  Quote: 





ulti said:


> Hi Joker, as you may recall, I'm looking for an upgrade from the RE0s with more isolation then it's good. I prefer a more analytical sound signature but as long as clarity exists then I won't have much to complain about if there is isolation along with it.
> 
> Now I've bought some Shure SE215s just to try what the over ear types are like as well as some Phonak PFE 112s. Whilst the Shure SE215 easily wins in isolation, I do not like the sound signature of it and much prefer the RE0. I do also have the FX1X and quite like the bass too when I want some fun. The Phonak PFE 112s seem pretty good from initial listening but the isolation is horrible, even compared with my RE0 (note I am using shallow triple flanges which seem to isolate the best for straight barelled IEMs for me) and hence I'm stuck with my RE0 for now. I was going to try some Etymotic IEMs but I've decided that they're probably not for me and that the RE0 will probably be "good enough" and not warrant an upgrade to the Etymotic IEMs.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I think the GR07 is what you want, not the X1. The X1 won't have that much more bass than an RE0. Its detail is also not quite there in the upper midrange and treble whereas the GR07 can match the RE0. The clarity of the X1 is something I can't fault, though. Like most of the higher-end single armatures it's very good. I can't generalize to other single-driver customs since the X1 is my only one.


----------



## Dante4246

Hey joker,
  I'm looking to buy a good pair of headphones for under 60$, and i'm currently looking at either the Brainwavz M1 or the Xears TDIII V2.
  I listen to a bit of all genres. Which on of these would you recommend more? Or maybe something else?


----------



## olear

Hi joker, taking your advise and attempting to better identify my preferred sound signature. I think it's "warm and sweet".
   
  Although GR07 is listed under this signature, which IEM(s) would you suggest that are 
  similar to GR07 but have a _*little *_more sub/mid bass quantity and impact?
   
  Does EX600 better fit this bill?
   
  Thank you


----------



## olear

forgot to ask about Brainwavz M4.


----------



## Ulti

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I think the GR07 is what you want, not the X1. The X1 won't have that much more bass than an RE0. *Its detail is also not quite there *in the upper midrange and treble whereas the GR07 can match the RE0. *The clarity of the X1 is something I can't fault*, though. Like most of the higher-end single armatures it's very good. I can't generalize to other single-driver customs since the X1 is my only one.


 


 Unfortunately I won't be able to grab the GR07 for £85 as it's already discounted to £99. 
   
  I noticed that you say the detail of the X1 isn't quite as good as the RE0 but it's clarity is something you can't fault. What do you mean by these two terms, I thought they were the same? (I'm an audionoob!)
   
  I'm tempted to try both the GR07 and the Minerva Mi-1s but at a price like that I'd rather save a little more and go for dual drivers. Dual driver customs generally mean one full range and one bass right?


----------



## putente

Get the GR07, let them burn-in properly and you won't regret it... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





ulti said:


> Unfortunately I won't be able to grab the GR07 for £85 as it's already discounted to £99.
> 
> I noticed that you say the detail of the X1 isn't quite as good as the RE0 but it's clarity is something you can't fault. What do you mean by these two terms, I thought they were the same? (I'm an audionoob!)
> 
> I'm tempted to try both the GR07 and the Minerva Mi-1s but at a price like that I'd rather save a little more and go for dual drivers. Dual driver customs generally mean one full range and one bass right?


----------



## Ulti

Quote: 





putente said:


> Get the GR07, let them burn-in properly and you won't regret it...


 
   
  I need more isolation though, how would you compare the isolation to the IEMs you own? Specifically the TDIIIs


----------



## putente

To be honest, I think it all depends on the tips you use, and your personal case... For me, with the TDIII, the best tips for sound quality and isolation (from the ones bundled) are the bi-flanges. With the GR07, I'm still experimenting, but so far I like the included foams (I got the GR07 with the new package), and I'm about to start trying Sony Hybrids. But I got the GR07 recently, so my choice of the best tips for them might easilly change... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Oh, and right now, I think they isolate about the same. I only use them at home, so this might no be true for other types of use... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





ulti said:


> I need more isolation though, how would you compare the isolation to the IEMs you own? Specifically the TDIIIs


----------



## Ulti

Quote: 





putente said:


> To be honest, I think it all depends on the tips you use, and your personal case... For me, with the TDIII, the best tips for sound quality and isolation (from the ones bundled) are the bi-flanges. With the GR07, I'm still experimenting, but so far I like the included foams (I got the GR07 with the new package), and I'm about to start trying Sony Hybrids. But I got the GR07 recently, so my choice of the best tips for them might easilly change...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Ah, I also have the TD-IIIs and no matter what tips I try on them, I feel they isolate less than the RE0 with shallow triple flanges (in my profile pic).
   
  I'm mostly concerned with isolation on the London Underground as I'm currently a student and I will be using the London Underground for a few years I imagine before I can buy a car and drive to work (if I can find work in this climate, but that should be for another board, work-fi? )
   
  I'm really persuaded over the GR-07's SQ but knowing that the isolation won't be so good puts me off it.


----------



## putente

Well, I understand your problem, but I just listen to my GR07 at home, and I really like them. But for that kind of use, I really can't give you much help... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





ulti said:


> Ah, I also have the TD-IIIs and no matter what tips I try on them, I feel they isolate less than the RE0 with shallow triple flanges (in my profile pic).
> 
> I'm mostly concerned with isolation on the London Underground as I'm currently a student and I will be using the London Underground for a few years I imagine before I can buy a car and drive to work (if I can find work in this climate, but that should be for another board, work-fi? )
> 
> I'm really persuaded over the GR-07's SQ but knowing that the isolation won't be so good puts me off it.


----------



## Mini0510

but does Equalizer damage the iems?


----------



## monoglycer

no
  
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> but does Equalizer damage the iems?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





ulti said:


> Ah, I also have the TD-IIIs and no matter what tips I try on them, I feel they isolate less than the RE0 with shallow triple flanges (in my profile pic).
> 
> I'm mostly concerned with isolation on the London Underground as I'm currently a student and I will be using the London Underground for a few years I imagine before I can buy a car and drive to work (if I can find work in this climate, but that should be for another board, work-fi? )
> 
> I'm really persuaded over the GR-07's SQ but knowing that the isolation won't be so good puts me off it.


 

 In my experience using the GR07s in a school setting, I found that the isolation isn't all that bad, and they're pretty usable in a crowd. That being said, the isolation's not as good as my A151s, and I have to turn the volume up a notch to hear the same detail, but it's not bad overall.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dante4246 said:


> Hey joker,
> I'm looking to buy a good pair of headphones for under 60$, and i'm currently looking at either the Brainwavz M1 or the Xears TDIII V2.
> I listen to a bit of all genres. Which on of these would you recommend more? Or maybe something else?


 

 I would the M2 is more of a TD-III competitor than the M1. The M1 is quite balanced, maybe even mid-centric. I think if you are not sure what you want the M2 would be a safer choice. There are a couple of other good all-rounders in the price range - MEElec CC51s, Soundmagic E30, etc.
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Hi joker, taking your advise and attempting to better identify my preferred sound signature. I think it's "warm and sweet".
> 
> Although GR07 is listed under this signature, which IEM(s) would you suggest that are
> similar to GR07 but have a _*little *_more sub/mid bass quantity and impact?
> ...


 

 I don't consider the GR07 particularly warm or sweet and I don't think the EX600 has more bass, especially not more sub-bass.
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> forgot to ask about Brainwavz M4.


 

 I don't know anything about it.
   


  Quote: 





ulti said:


> Unfortunately I won't be able to grab the GR07 for £85 as it's already discounted to £99.
> 
> I noticed that you say the detail of the X1 isn't quite as good as the RE0 but it's clarity is something you can't fault. What do you mean by these two terms, I thought they were the same? (I'm an audionoob!)
> 
> I'm tempted to try both the GR07 and the Minerva Mi-1s but at a price like that I'd rather save a little more and go for dual drivers. Dual driver customs generally mean one full range and one bass right?


 

 Detail is the ability of an earphone to pick up minute elements (details) on the recording . It depends on resolution, speed, dynamics, and other factors. Of course it is related closely to clarity (as many things are) - it is difficult to retrieve detail well with smearing, veiling, or otherwise poor clarity.
   
  I would imagine all dual-driver customs have a crossover so the drivers would cover different parts of the spectrum. It doesn't make a lot of sense to have a full-range + a separate bass driver.


----------



## Inks

olear said:


> Hi joker, taking your advise and attempting to better identify my preferred sound signature. I think it's "warm and sweet".
> 
> Although GR07 is listed under this signature, which IEM(s) would you suggest that are
> similar to GR07 but have a _*little *_more sub/mid bass quantity and impact?
> ...


 
  A forward midrange with smoothed treble? GR07s are a bit warm and their sound is kind of midrange focused due to it's good balance, not midrange forward and their treble isn't lacking though it is smoothed after the lower treble spike. I guess it does go into that category but it isn't representative of it. The Fischer Tandems will have a tad more bass impact and will have a warmer and sweeter signature. I don't understand how the K2 got into that category, to me it's treble is forward and very fatiguing (even with comply tips). 
   
  EX600s have less bass and a tad more treble presence, it doesn't seem to fit your bill.


----------



## estreeter

I can handle many things in a headphone, but fatiguing treble is the absolute pits, IMO. I got rid of my SR325is, What Hi-Fi's 'Headphone of the Year 2011' in its class, for precisely that reason, and it would be even worse in an IEM. I'm also less than enthused at the prospect of having to endure sibilance on the GR07 for the first thousand or so hours.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





inks said:


> A forward midrange with smoothed treble? GR07s are a bit warm and their sound is kind of midrange focused due to it's good balance, not midrange forward and their treble isn't lacking though it is smoothed after the lower treble spike. I guess it does go into that category but it isn't representative of it. The Fischer Tandems will have a tad more bass impact and will have a warmer and sweeter signature. I don't understand how the K2 got into that category, to me it's treble is forward and very fatiguing (even with comply tips).
> 
> EX600s have less bass and a tad more treble presence, it doesn't seem to fit your bill.


 
  Maybe I would like the FXT90. Is it in the "Mid" category?
  I think the MTP C or MD would be enjoyable. For a product that's more consumer oriented, they get very good audiophile reviews.


----------



## Inks

estreeter said:


> I can handle many things in a headphone, but fatiguing treble is the absolute pits, IMO. I got rid of my SR325is, What Hi-Fi's 'Headphone of the Year 2011' in its class, for precisely that reason, and it would be even worse in an IEM. I'm also less than enthused at the prospect of having to endure sibilance on the GR07 for the first thousand or so hours.


 
  I agree. The K2 doesn't make any really offensive spikes, but IMO it's just too forward in the treble to sound natural. Certain details are bought forward but it sounds a bit artificial, despite the amazing bass-midrange balance. The GR07 was personally never offensive in my case and I have tried two different pairs. It has actually been pretty warm and pleasant, nothing too grating. 
  
   


olear said:


> Maybe I would like the FXT90. Is it in the "Mid" category?
> I think the MTP C or MD would be enjoyable. For a product that's more consumer oriented, they get very good audiophile reviews.


 
  FXT90 is actually kind of "balanced (v-shaped)". The Tandem is a true warm and sweet, midrange focused IEM. Monsters, they get both good and bad reviews. I personally enjoyed them myself, but as I garnered more experience, the more flawed they've been seen in my eyes. I personally wouldn't pay more than 100$ for the Monster MDs and those are my favorite. They're very colored and can be very "fun" to some because of that but they're not really that high in fidelity.


----------



## olear

Do the Tandem and C1 share the same warm and sweet category?
   
  How do they differ?


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





olear said:


> Do the Tandem and C1 share the same warm and sweet category?
> 
> How do they differ?


 

 One is warmer than the other is sweet, apparently.


----------



## estreeter

> Double trouble


----------



## Inks

Haven't heard the C1, but there may be some harshness/sibilance issues there. Comply tips seem to help though, but it may or may not work for you. It seems to also have more bass response. Joker already has a pair, so he's the best one to ask.
   
   I say pull the trigger on the Tandem and get ready to enjoy, it's a good product. There are man intriguing options out there, but the Tandem is just so right, it's hard to fault it for what it does and it seems to suit what you're looking for.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> One is warmer than the other is sweet, apparently.


----------



## Selenium

Fidelity and neutrality are mutually exclusive?


----------



## Inks

selenium said:


> Fidelity and neutrality are mutually exclusive?


 
  They're related, coloration (humps/dips) come with compromises. Adding midbass for example glosses out micro detailing on the lower mids, some do it right, some go over board. Of course then you have IEMs like the FX700s that pretty much get things like soundstage, timbre and speed so right, it's highly technical despite not having that great of a frequency response.


----------



## zmd

Yay! My Meelec CC51 are here and the first impression is decidedly positive. They look very sleek, better than most IEMs out there and the sound is actually as advertised: clear, quick, with a bit of a bump in the bass and a tad of distance in the mids, all in all, very enjoyable. I'm coming from the HD25s and these puppies manage to impress me, so that's something - or maybe I'm easily impressed 
   
  Anyway, a big thanks to joker for his suggestion and all the good work he does here on head-fi.


----------



## Bola 7

Joker,

 If you had to choose observing only sound quality, would you choose Shure SE215 or Fischer Eterna rev.1?


----------



## blupblup

Hi there guys,
   
  I just joined this forum as I'm having real trouble deciding on a new set of headphones.
  I found the OP by googling and searching and think it is absolutely amazing, so helpful... BUT also gives me much more choice and many more options than I originally had.
   
  What do you think would be the best choice out of these headphones.
   
   
  I listen to a lot of  ambient & chillout stuff, hip-hop, blues. funk soul... acoustic stuff..
   
  So really a good mix and I'm looking, I guess, for a good all-rounder.
   
   
  VSonic GR07
   
  Sunrise Audio Sw-xscape IEM
   
  Westone UM2
   
  Beyerdynamic MMX 101 ie
   
  Phiaton PS2000
   
  Hifiman re 262
   
   
  Or if not any of these, what would any of you recommend?
   
  I'm having real issues deciding and would just like some ideas and help so any advice and help would be greatly appreciated.
   
  Many thanks


----------



## The Neverhood

Joker,
   
  How would an Amped RE262 compare to the IE8?
   
  Texture?
   
  Soundstage?
   
  Vocals?


----------



## Mini0510

joker, or anyone else here, know any customs or top tier universals have similar sound signature to Klipsch S4 or Sony + little more bass?
  People said Klipsch S4 is V shaped. isn't miracle V shaped as well??
   
  I hate to say this but I'm not going to deny it. I actually really like the Klipsch sound signature. Sony is good but a little more bass is better. Monster Turbine are just for bass heads. The treble is barely present.


----------



## Extra

Just want to say thank you for the review of the Brainwavz Beta. I received my pair today and they sound fantastic for their $28.50 price tag. I've never really enjoyed IEM's, but I love the design of the Beta.
   
  Again, thanks!


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





zmd said:


> Any MEE CC51 owners around? How are these isolation-wise? I've finally pulled the trigger and ordered a pair, with fairly high hopes. I'm not expecting them to beat my currend portables (HD25s) but I guess I find it's nice to own a good set of ''invisible'' headphones - that is, compared to the Sennheisers  Does anyone besides joker have any idea how they measure up?


 


  I thought it isolated pretty well.  As for the sound, I really enjoyed how the CC51 was tuned.  Not sure how it will compare to the HD25's but for the price the CC51's are going for these days, it's well worth the purchase.  Also, it has a wide nozzle so I'm not sure what other tips will fit.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, or anyone else here, know any customs or top tier universals have similar sound signature to Klipsch S4 or Sony + little more bass?
> People said Klipsch S4 is V shaped. isn't miracle V shaped as well??
> 
> I hate to say this but I'm not going to deny it. I actually really like the Klipsch sound signature. Sony is good but a little more bass is better. Monster Turbine are just for bass heads. The treble is barely present.


 


  I believe the S4 are considered in the Bass category.


----------



## i2ehan

Just thought I'd drop a thank you notice |joker|, for your review (yet again) sparked my curiosity, and I just received my first ever Jays, the Q-Jays. They sound absolutely fantastic, and I was definitely not expecting for the low end to sound this good, offering the perfect blend of quality and quantity. Who knew something so tiny could offer such impact? (TWSS!) Again, thank you for introducing me to yet another clear winner in my book.


----------



## Selenium

Thanks for the explanation. Now I want to try the FX700s even more though. *shakes fist in anger* 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





inks said:


> They're related, coloration (humps/dips) come with compromises. Adding midbass for example glosses out micro detailing on the lower mids, some do it right, some go over board. Of course then you have IEMs like the FX700s that pretty much get things like soundstage, timbre and speed so right, it's highly technical despite not having that great of a frequency response.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zmd said:


> Yay! My Meelec CC51 are here and the first impression is decidedly positive. They look very sleek, better than most IEMs out there and the sound is actually as advertised: clear, quick, with a bit of a bump in the bass and a tad of distance in the mids, all in all, very enjoyable. I'm coming from the HD25s and these puppies manage to impress me, so that's something - or maybe I'm easily impressed
> 
> Anyway, a big thanks to joker for his suggestion and all the good work he does here on head-fi.


 

 Good to hear! 
   


  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker,
> 
> If you had to choose observing only sound quality, would you choose Shure SE215 or Fischer Eterna rev.1?


 

 Probably the SE215 but it's a very close call. 
   


  Quote: 





blupblup said:


> Hi there guys,
> 
> I just joined this forum as I'm having real trouble deciding on a new set of headphones.
> I found the OP by googling and searching and think it is absolutely amazing, so helpful... BUT also gives me much more choice and many more options than I originally had.
> ...


 

 The GR07 is probably the best all-rounder out of those. Doubt you'll be disappointed with it unless you have a particular, different sound signature in mind.
   


  Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> Joker,
> 
> How would an Amped RE262 compare to the IE8?
> 
> ...


 


  More forward vocals on the RE262, not veiled, no mid-bass hump to cloud them over. Soundstage is very good on the RE262 but the IE8 still has among the largest sound/headstages of anything I've heard, if you don't mind that 10th-row-in-the-audience feel. For texture you'd have to do an A:B comparison and I don't have either IEM anymore. 


  Quote: 





extra said:


> Just want to say thank you for the review of the Brainwavz Beta. I received my pair today and they sound fantastic for their $28.50 price tag. I've never really enjoyed IEM's, but I love the design of the Beta.
> 
> Again, thanks!


 

 Good to hear, enjoy! They are a tremendous value for sound.
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Just thought I'd drop a thank you notice |joker|, for your review (yet again) sparked my curiosity, and I just received my first ever Jays, the Q-Jays. They sound absolutely fantastic, and I was definitely not expecting for the low end to sound this good, offering the perfect blend of quality and quantity. Who knew something so tiny could offer such impact? (TWSS!) Again, thank you for introducing me to yet another clear winner in my book.


 

 Yes, they are special. The q-JAYS are the only TWFK earphone i would want as a compliment to the CK10 just because of the glorious bass quality. I would just need to be careful to never A:B them with the CK10.


----------



## Mini0510

joker, whats the closest custom that has a similar sound signature as Klipsch S4?


----------



## ljokerl

None of mine sound like an S4.


----------



## kiteki

Hmm I haven't visited this thread in a while, I suppose the K2 SP will become more popular now and we'll receive more impressions.
   
   
  That looks like the same unit i2ehan and myself once owned. 
   
  I traded with his RE272 and was laughing all the way home, it's interesting to note the drivers in the K2 SP were once upon a time the cream of the crop in custom IEM's and people shelled out $700+, we have a come a very long way in 5 years, imho.


----------



## kiteki

Congratulations on 1,000,000 views.


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR07 is probably the best all-rounder out of those. Doubt you'll be disappointed with it unless you have a particular, different sound signature in mind.


 


  Well I'm quite a noob when it comes to most of this stuff and like many, started out a few years back with the CX 300 II's and was blown away.
  I  had never had ear canal headphones before and the sound was amazing.... Then I got some Klipsch S4i's and then last year got some Shure SE102's.
  I have felt that with each purchase I have got a little more out of the headphones and have heard detail I never did before and realised that upgrading and paying a little more really makes a difference.
   
  I think (Although I've since sold them) that I preferred the S4i's sound overall, although both were an improvement over the CX's
   
   
  I'm happy to invest a fair chunk in a good set because I do listen to a lot of music and if I can get a better aural experience... then  I'm happy to spend.
   
  If you're saying GR07, I'll check them out.
   
  Many thanks for your reply and help.


----------



## ViralRazor

Joker, I read somewhere previously you had an issue with the Eterna's. What was it? Was it just the strain reliefs breaking off or something worse?


----------



## Old_Snake

@ljokerl
   
  What kind of source do you use with your UM Miracles? 
  Do you try to use gear that has similar sound or do you like to mix it up. 
  Do you use EQ or effects with it?
   
  How often do you use your SM3 and why do you still use it?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Congratulations on 1,000,000 views.


 

 Thanks, that's almost difficult to wrap my head around

  
  Quote: 





viralrazor said:


> Joker, I read somewhere previously you had an issue with the Eterna's. What was it? Was it just the strain reliefs breaking off or something worse?


 

 Just the strain relief. A drop of superglue and they're still going strong more than a year later.


  Quote: 





old_snake said:


> What kind of source do you use with your UM Miracles?
> Do you try to use gear that has similar sound or do you like to mix it up.
> Do you use EQ or effects with it?
> 
> How often do you use your SM3 and why do you still use it?


 


   

 Same sources as everything else - Cowon J3 on the go, one of my three DACs at home. I have all sorts of different-sounding gear and I use it every day during the course of my testing. I tend to lean towards more balanced sound but that too comes in many flavors these days. I have very little personal listening time, which keeps the Miracle fresh (though I've been using the CTM-200 a lot lately as well). I do not normally EQ anything and I do not own an SM3.


----------



## blupblup

Hi joker, I just wanted to ask one more thing if you don't mind. I can get the UE triplefi 10's for the same money as the GR07's. What would say would be best? 

I know that's probably a silly question but which do you think would be the better purchase?


Many thanks.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





blupblup said:


> Hi joker, I just wanted to ask one more thing if you don't mind. I can get the UE triplefi 10's for the same money as the GR07's. What would say would be best?
> I know that's probably a silly question but which do you think would be the better purchase?
> Many thanks.


 


  The mids are a tad recessed on the TF10s compared to the GR07s, but their high end extends higher and is more detailed, they have a bit more of a bass punch too so they're a little more "fun"(not to say the GR07s are lacking bass by all means).
   
  I enjoyed them both, so if you can get them at the same price then its just personal preference. I personally preferred the fit on the GR07s.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> None of mine sound like an S4.


 

 do you or anyone else here know anything top universals that sound like Klipsch S4?


----------



## WhiteMage

Can anyone recommend me some good starter IEM's in the $50-150 price range? I've never owned a pair of IEM's. My current source is a iPhone 4 and I normally listen to rock, alternative, pop, a little hip-hop and electronic, and on the occasion, classical. Mid-range is my Main concern, although I do like some bass to go along with what I listen to.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





whitemage said:


> Can anyone recommend me some good starter IEM's in the $50-150 price range? I've never owned a pair of IEM's. My current source is a iPhone 4 and I normally listen to rock, alternative, pop, a little hip-hop and electronic, and on the occasion, classical. Mid-range is my Main concern, although I do like some bass to go along with what I listen to.


 

 Consider Etymotic HF5, TDK BA100, Sony XBA-1 and Ultimate Ears UE700 for balanced armature.
   
  2 cents.


----------



## nikp

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Consider Etymotic HF5, TDK BA100, *Sony XBA-1* and Ultimate Ears UE700 for balanced armature.
> 
> 2 cents.


 

 How can you recommend something that hasn't been out yet?


----------



## blupblup

realslimseto said:


> The mids are a tad recessed on the TF10s compared to the GR07s, but their high end extends higher and is more detailed, they have a bit more of a bass punch too so they're a little more "fun"(not to say the GR07s are lacking bass by all means).
> 
> I enjoyed them both, so if you can get them at the same price then its just personal preference. I personally preferred the fit on the GR07s.








OK great, thanks very much. I do listen to a lot of bassy music but wouldn't describe myself as a bass head at all.... Just that most ambient electronica and hip hop has a lot of bass... But I love acoustic and guitar music too so want the highs to be great.
I think from what you've described about detail and punchier bass, that the TF10s may well be the way forward, fit may be a worry but as long as there's no actual issues with fit? Then i'll go for them I think. 

Thanks for the help.


----------



## kanuka

joker,
  about the Crystal, how'd compare the bass , mid-range bleed and mids fwdness/recesion  with the m11+ and TDIII ?


----------



## WhiteMage

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Consider Etymotic HF5, TDK BA100, Sony XBA-1 and Ultimate Ears UE700 for balanced armature.
> 
> 2 cents.


 


   
  How do the monster turbines stack up against those three? I also heard the sennheiser IE7's are a good pick in the price range.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





blupblup said:


> OK great, thanks very much. I do listen to a lot of bassy music but wouldn't describe myself as a bass head at all.... Just that most ambient electronica and hip hop has a lot of bass... But I love acoustic and guitar music too so want the highs to be great.
> I think from what you've described about detail and punchier bass, that the TF10s may well be the way forward, fit may be a worry but as long as there's no actual issues with fit? Then i'll go for them I think.
> Thanks for the help.


 

 You might want to consider Atrio MG7.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blupblup said:


> Hi joker, I just wanted to ask one more thing if you don't mind. I can get the UE triplefi 10's for the same money as the GR07's. What would say would be best?
> I know that's probably a silly question but which do you think would be the better purchase?
> Many thanks.


 

 Fit would be the deal-breaker for me as well. In terms of performance they are on the same level, with the TF10 a bit more v-shaped and colored and the GR07 more balanced and netural.

  Quote: 





whitemage said:


> Can anyone recommend me some good starter IEM's in the $50-150 price range? I've never owned a pair of IEM's. My current source is a iPhone 4 and I normally listen to rock, alternative, pop, a little hip-hop and electronic, and on the occasion, classical. Mid-range is my Main concern, although I do like some bass to go along with what I listen to.


 

 Unless you think you'll be able to decide on which type of sound you want from reading reviews, I would start small, maybe with something like Brainwavz M2 - nice mids, good bass, on the low end of your budget. If you want to jump further into the deep end I'd go with one of the safer sound signatures - the Fischer Audio Tandem, for example, or maybe a Spider Realvoice or HiSound Crystal. If you're paying $75 or less for a Turbine they are a good choice as well. The IE7 is normally out of your budget and even then I like the Tandem better for that type of sound. 
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> joker,
> about the Crystal, how'd compare the bass , mid-range bleed and mids fwdness/recesion  with the m11+ and TDIII ?


 

 Crystal has very little bleed - about as much as the M11+ but the mids are not that recessed so it isn't very noticeable. The TD-III bleeds more despite the more forward mids.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *WhiteMage* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> How do the monster turbines stack up against those three? I also heard the sennheiser IE7's are a good pick in the price range.


 

 I heard the Monster Turbines briefly, and I thought they sounded okay but nothing special, the UE700 has a lot more pizazz.
   
  I've only heard the ER-4PT + 75 ohm, some people say the HF5 is identical to the ER-4 except made in China, I'm not sure. :/
   
  The TDK BA100 and XBA-1 are newcomers to the single driver BA scene - they have limited, yet quite positive reviews so far, it seems this audio community loves equipment that is new, or soon to be released, so I recommended them.
   
  It makes sense, we are all on a mystery hunt for new sound, and like to talk about X just released or imported from the far east novelty with our peers. 
   
  For dynamic driver IEM's in that price range, another new one to consider with positive reviews is the JVC FXT90, and then there is the Sony EX600 for $131.
   
  If you really value the midrange, then Hifiman RE262 seems to be the popular pick there from what I can tell.


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





olear said:


> You might want to consider Atrio MG7.


 

  
   
  OK I'll have a little read up about them.
  Thanks very much... It's just that when you're spending a fair whack, you want something you'll be happy with.
   
  Many thanks.


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Fit would be the deal-breaker for me as well. In terms of performance they are on the same level, with the TF10 a bit more v-shaped and colored and the GR07 more balanced and netural.


 

  
   
  You think the TF10's are that odd/bad a fit that they're worth reconsidering?
  I mean comfort is paramount really, well second to sound but not by much.... do you think the GR07's would be better?
   
  Man... I have a shorter shortlist now than I did but the decision seems to be getting harder 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  What about the Etymotic HF5's?
   
  Any better for fit, similar quality sound?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blupblup said:


> You think the TF10's are that odd/bad a fit that they're worth reconsidering?
> I mean comfort is paramount really, well second to sound but not by much.... do you think the GR07's would be better?
> 
> Man... I have a shorter shortlist now than I did but the decision seems to be getting harder
> ...


 


  I don't think the HF5 is what you're looking for. As for TF10 fit, it can be hit or miss depending on your ears. At the current less-than-GR07 prices it's probably worth to at least try it.


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think the HF5 is what you're looking for. As for TF10 fit, it can be hit or miss depending on your ears. At the current less-than-GR07 prices it's probably worth to at least try it.


 


   
   
  Well GR07's are £100... so about $154?
   
  TF10's are £125 ... so about $193?
   
  Is that good for what they are?


----------



## kiteki

Nah, the TF10's just sold for $95 on amazon.com, so you will not be able to resell them at a reasonable price if you buy them for $193 and get a bad fit or don't like the mids etc.
   
  GR07's are a bit boring like the Hifiman RE252's.
   
  2 cents.


----------



## blupblup

Well I'm buying from UK... ebay, and cheapest TF10's are £125 (193$) ???
   
  Any other ideas?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





blupblup said:


> Well I'm buying from UK... ebay, and cheapest TF10's are £125 (193$) ???
> 
> Any other ideas?


 
   
  You said ambient, chill and hip-hop... maybe the Shure SE215?
   
  25% off today over at earphonesolutions.com with code "black" or "black7".
   
  If you can stretch it, perhaps UM3X from them with 25% off? Pretty good deal I think...


----------



## WhiteMage

ljokerl said:


> UnlessL you think you'll be able to decide on which type of sound you want from reading reviews, I would start small, maybe with something like Brainwavz M2 - nice mids, good bass, on the low end of your budget. If you want to jump further into the deep end I'd go with one of the safer sound signatures - the Fischer Audio Tandem, for example, or maybe a Spider Realvoice or HiSound Crystal. If you're paying $75 or less for a Turbine they are a good choice as well. The IE7 is normally out of your budget and even then I like the Tandem better for that type of sound.


 


   
  Hmm, I might consider that route. Any idea if any of those headphones would benefit from having a small amp, like a fiio ,to drive it?


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> You said ambient, chill and hip-hop... maybe the Shure SE215?
> 
> 25% off today over at earphonesolutions.com with code "black" or "black7".
> 
> If you can stretch it, perhaps UM3X from them with 25% off? Pretty good deal I think...


 

  
   
  Well Mainly  Electronica, Hip-Hop, Dub Reggae, Acoustic, Rock, Blues, Jazz, Funk...  Seriously everything.
  I do like Bass and I think if I had weak bass I would be disappointed, but really not a bass head... doesn't have to be overbearing.
  I guess a richer, more colourful sound would be better.. but then... I'm not sure until I hear it?
   
  I swear to god, this has been a nightmare.. LOL
   
  I have my mind set on 2-3 sets to choose from and then start researching more and find more I like.
   
  I'm after a balanced, good reproduction and a nice, warm-ish sound... and if I had to choose I would lean more towards bass, but doesn't have to be too much.
   
  *sigh*


----------



## kiteki

Get the UM3X with 25% off, if the rare possibility arises you don't like it you'll be able to sell it later with little loss.


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Get the UM3X with 25% off, if the rare possibility arises you don't like it you'll be able to sell it later with little loss.


 


   
   
  That's quite a purchase, £250 ($370)...!!
   
  I'm happy to spend £100-ish ($150-200) but dunno man, that's a big leap.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *blupblup* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> That's quite a purchase, £250 ($370)...!!
> ...


 

 $370? They are $284 after the "black" code.
   
  I'd vote for Shure SE425 too, reduced to $224 with free international shipping with airmail.
   
   
  If you want a warm and sweet sound you could also get the Audio Technica ANC23 and save a lot of money.
   
  Those are my three rec's for you.


----------



## blupblup

Ahh ok yes, the code, good shout, forgot to factor that in.
  Well I'll do some more thinking and researching tomorrow, It's getting late.
   
  Much appreciated.
   
  Thanks very much for taking the time to help (and curses for giving me more choices 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 )
   
   
  Cheers


----------



## kiteki

Yeah but the code is gone tomorrow.
   
  Get the UM3X and your audio journey was complete within 20 posts!
   
  You're welcome, cya.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Nah, the TF10's just sold for $95 on amazon.com, so you will not be able to resell them at a reasonable price if you buy them for $193 and get a bad fit or don't like the mids etc.
> 
> GR07's are a bit boring like the Hifiman RE252's.
> 
> 2 cents.


 


   Atrios MG7 or FXT90 more exciting vs. GR07?


----------



## kiteki

Probably FXT90, haven't heard either sorry.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


olear said:


> Atrios MG7 or FXT90 more exciting vs. GR07?


 

 For me personally, FXT90 and ClarityOne are both more exciting/enjoyable than the comparatively flatter, more accurate GR07.


----------



## FlySweep

blupblup said:


> Well mainly *Electronica, Hip-Hop, Dub Reggae, Acoustic, Rock, Blues, Jazz, Funk*...  Seriously everything.
> *I do like Bass* and I think if I had weak bass I would be disappointed, *but really not a bass head*... *doesn't have to be overbearing*.
> I guess a *richer, more colourful sound would be better*.. but then... I'm not sure until I hear it?
> *I'm after a balanced, good reproduction and a nice, warm-ish sound*... and if I had to choose* I would lean more towards bass, but doesn't have to be too much*.


 

 The FXT-90 is a practically perfect based on what you're looking for.


----------



## james444

Early morning glance at my head-fi subscriptions summary and wth, joker's thread has 35 new posts, I'm almost thinking the man has had a heart attack or something, but then skimming through the posts thankfully all-clear, it's only kiteki who's found the thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





whitemage said:


> Hmm, I might consider that route. Any idea if any of those headphones would benefit from having a small amp, like a fiio ,to drive it?


 


  Don't bother - at that level you're much better off investing in better earphones than splitting your budget to get an entry-level amp. Save your $20.


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> The FXT-90 is a practically perfect based on what you're looking for.


 
   
   
   
  OK excellent, thanks very much for your help.


----------



## blupblup

OK ordered the HA-FXT90's and I'll let you know my impressions when I get them.
   
   
  Thanks very much for the help guys.


----------



## Foress

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah, I received my pair this week. They are alright earphones but nothing as revolutionary as the marketing claims. Treble is too prominent out of the box.


 


  any updates on this?


----------



## bcpk

http://www.facebook.com/MEElec/posts/296693853696707
   
  A151s for $40 today.


----------



## kiteki




----------



## blairhh

Had the CC51's for a few weeks now and wanted to say I really love them. Also wanted to share that I just saw them for $25 on Overstock right now. Twice what I paid for them via Amazon. 
   
  I'm coming from S4's. It's hard for me to compare but I can say I love both models.


----------



## davidcotton

Hi
   
  I'm curious.  Need a decent iem for use for a few weeks whilst my customs are away.  Had toyed with the idea of getting a westone 3 or umx3 but can't really justify that amount.  Did try the shure 215 but was one of those unlucky with the connection issue, sent it back got a replacement and the left side had died!  Didn't realise that till too late.
   
  I need decent isolation and had pretty much narrowed it down to the hisound audio crystal which I can currently get for £50 or the brainwavz beta 2 which I can get for £99.00   Not a huge fan of over blown bass (didn't like the monster turbines at all due to that, too tiring to listen to for long periods)so was wondering which was best.  Oh and there's also the q-jays floating around at around a £100 or so atm.  I use a 3rd gen ipod touch and listen to progressive rock/metal and synth.  I also listen to audiobooks a lot.
   
  I've also  had the senns ie 7 which I liked a lot but fit issues and poor isolation make that one a no no for work use.
   
  I'm also toying with the idea of getting another shure se215 but not sure on that one.
   
  Anything else that comes under a £100 with good isolation will also be considered.
   
  Cheers.


----------



## kiteki

^q-jays for £100


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





blairhh said:


> Had the CC51's for a few weeks now and wanted to say I really love them. Also wanted to share that I just saw them for $25 on Overstock right now. Twice what I paid for them via Amazon.
> 
> I'm coming from S4's. It's hard for me to compare but I can say I love both models.


 

 *Half


----------



## Niyologist

Now my Atrio X took natural sounding to a whole new level. With the Fiio E6 amp, it helped the Atrio X burn-in even better. When I was listening to Vince Guaraldi's "Linus and Lucy" (At 320 kbps), the instruments sounded very real, but detail level was slightly above average, just barely. The soundstage is above average and the instrument separation is certainly above average. The bass guitar at the right. The piano at the middle. The cymbals and hi-hats at the left. everything is crystal clear and the timbre is somewhat above average.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


niyologist said:


> Now my Atrio X took natural sounding to a whole new level. With the Fiio E6 amp, it helped the Atrio X burn-in even better. When I was listening to Vince Guaraldi's "Linus and Lucy" (At 320 kbps), the instruments sounded very real, but detail level was slightly above average, just barely. The soundstage is above average and the instrument separation is certainly above average. The bass guitar at the right. The piano at the middle. The cymbals and hi-hats at the left. everything is crystal clear and the timbre is somewhat above average.


 

 Agree with everything that's said, especially since I'm listening to mine now with my FiiO E7, as I type this. Been listening to them all day, and even gave them a go with my Zo (V1), which turned out to be enormously fun, though simply overkill for extended listening, as expected of course.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





james444 said:


> Early morning glance at my head-fi subscriptions summary and wth, joker's thread has 35 new posts, I'm almost thinking the man has had a heart attack or something, but then skimming through the posts thankfully all-clear, it's only kiteki who's found the thread.


 

 I expect more than 35 posts when I croak.
   
  
  Quote: 





foress said:


> any updates on this?


 

 Not for a while - it's at least 5th on the queue which means it won't get some ear time for a while.

  
  Quote: 





blairhh said:


> Had the CC51's for a few weeks now and wanted to say I really love them. Also wanted to share that I just saw them for $25 on Overstock right now. Twice what I paid for them via Amazon.
> 
> I'm coming from S4's. It's hard for me to compare but I can say I love both models.


 

 Good to hear! They are flawed in many ways but $25 is an unbelievable price for the sound. I paid more $10 for a Skullcandy Titan...
   


  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi
> 
> I'm curious.  Need a decent iem for use for a few weeks whilst my customs are away.  Had toyed with the idea of getting a westone 3 or umx3 but can't really justify that amount.  Did try the shure 215 but was one of those unlucky with the connection issue, sent it back got a replacement and the left side had died!  Didn't realise that till too late.
> 
> ...


 

 If you didn't have any huge issues with the sound of the SE215, the Crystal should very much be to your liking. I don't think its bass is overblown at all. However, if you're willing to spend twice as much, the B2 and q-JAYS will offer better fidelity. I would go with the q-JAYS since you seem to lean towards warmer-sounding things.


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> Agree with everything that's said, especially since I'm listening to mine now with my FiiO E7, as I type this. Been listening to them all day, and even gave them a go with my Zo (V1), which turned out to be enormously fun, though simply overkill for extended listening, as expected of course.


 


  Absolutely jealous, I got my Zo2 last week and the LOD is completely stuffed (can't be used) so I have to send it back to be repaired/replaced, and yeah, pain in the bum if you live in Australia


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


djvkool said:


> Absolutely jealous, I got my Zo2 last week and the LOD is completely stuffed (can't be used) so I have to send it back to be repaired/replaced, and yeah, pain in the bum if you live in Australia


 

 I'm really sorry to hear that, my friend. I hope it's worth the wait, once your replacement arrives.


----------



## kiteki

ClieOS said the bass-boost on the Teclast X19HD reminds him of the Zo2, for those looking for a cheaper alternative.


----------



## Foress

alright! what are your upcoming reviews? really looking forward! also, have you heard of EXS Korea's EX10 and EX20 IEMs?


----------



## zmd

It might just be my head-cold, but I think the CC51 is a much brighter set than I was expecting them to be. Bass is tight and present, mids smooth and all that, but the treble seems a bit overdone, even when coming from HD25s. Is this something that will clear up with burn-in or are my ears just shot right now? FWIW, I do have a good seal using the small single tips.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





zmd said:


> It might just be my head-cold, but I think the CC51 is a much brighter set than I was expecting them to be. Bass is tight and present, mids smooth and all that, but the treble seems a bit overdone, even when coming from HD25s. Is this something that will clear up with burn-in or are my ears just shot right now? FWIW, I do have a good seal using the small single tips.


 


  I don't remember the CC-51 being bright.


----------



## DannyBai

A friend of mine just gave me a TDK EB900.  I would have guessed it wouldn't be very good based on joker's review but so far it isn't so bad.  It has quite an impressive bass response.  I wouldn't have ever considered purchasing it but for the right price, it's not a bad iem.


----------



## TheMarkRemains

UM2 gets my vote, you'd probably like a warmer signature for those genres


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Quote: 





blupblup said:


> Well Mainly  Electronica, Hip-Hop, Dub Reggae, Acoustic, Rock, Blues, Jazz, Funk...  Seriously everything.
> I do like Bass and I think if I had weak bass I would be disappointed, but really not a bass head... doesn't have to be overbearing.
> I guess a richer, more colourful sound would be better.. but then... I'm not sure until I hear it?
> 
> ...


 


  Sorry, didn't link right. UM3/UM2 would be a good all-rounder with good bass for your genres. some of the others you're listing are analytical which is great but not "musical"


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





foress said:


> alright! what are your upcoming reviews? really looking forward! also, have you heard of EXS Korea's EX10 and EX20 IEMs?


 

 There's a list on the front page of this thread, below the table. I haven't updated it since the K2 review was posted so the Clarity One isn't on there yet. I have heard of EXS but have no experience with their products.
   


  Quote: 





zmd said:


> It might just be my head-cold, but I think the CC51 is a much brighter set than I was expecting them to be. Bass is tight and present, mids smooth and all that, but the treble seems a bit overdone, even when coming from HD25s. Is this something that will clear up with burn-in or are my ears just shot right now? FWIW, I do have a good seal using the small single tips.


 
   
  I don't think it's brighter than an HD25, just that the bass is less powerful and draws less attention to itself. I'd play around with the fit depth a little more. Took me a while to get it right.
   


  Quote: 





dannybai said:


> A friend of mine just gave me a TDK EB900.  I would have guessed it wouldn't be very good based on joker's review but so far it isn't so bad.  It has quite an impressive bass response.  I wouldn't have ever considered purchasing it but for the right price, it's not a bad iem.


 

 I wouldn't mind them as basshead IEMs if they weren't $50. If I was going to spend that much for head-pounding bass it would be the Padacs Aksent, probably.


----------



## StereoNoodles

Hi, just wondering, not sure if you know this or not. You said only the ViSang R03 carry the foamies and the fake hybrids.
  So what do Brainwavz M2 carry instead? Just curious, Amazon seems to be the cheapest way to get these IEM's, i'm just wondering about the tips..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Hi, just wondering, not sure if you know this or not. You said only the ViSang R03 carry the foamies and the fake hybrids.
> So what do Brainwavz M2 carry instead? Just curious, Amazon seems to be the cheapest way to get these IEM's, i'm just wondering about the tips..


 

 Last I heard, it's only the foamies that are missing from the M2 - the other tips are the same between the M2 and R03. It's the R01 that's missing fake hybrids (it has generic silicone single-flanges instead).


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> A friend of mine just gave me a TDK EB900.  I would have guessed it wouldn't be very good based on joker's review but so far it isn't so bad.  It has quite an impressive bass response.  I wouldn't have ever considered purchasing it but for the right price, it's not a bad iem.


 


  I remember seeing that on overstock for about $40 some few days ago...


----------



## psygeist

How would you compare DBA-2 to RE 272. Both share the similar sound signature ?


----------



## blupblup

Quote: 





themarkremains said:


> Sorry, didn't link right. UM3/UM2 would be a good all-rounder with good bass for your genres. some of the others you're listing are analytical which is great but not "musical"


 


   
   
  Hey, thanks for the reply.
  I ended up ordering the _JVC HA_-_FXT90 _'s after reading through the appreciation thread for those and the GR07's
  I did take a look at the Westone's and when I save up some money again, I may take a closer look at them.
   
  I'm hoping that the FXT90's will be to my liking and they're en-route right now... so We'll see.
   
  Thanks again for your response.


----------



## kanuka

joker, 
   
  i'm still considering the Crystal and the ck10. so i need a bit more info
   
  being the Crystal a dynamic, is it vented? prone to wind noise?
   
  as for the ck10. what's the problem you mentioned about the stock tips? 
  have you tried the ck100 foam on the ck10? or are the shure olives better in sound, comfort , isolation, etc?
   
   
  thanks


----------



## StereoTypo

Thank you for your extensive reviews, it made the search for a new pair of IEMs a far more enjoyable task. (Ety HF5s were my final choice, loving the crisp treble).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> How would you compare DBA-2 to RE 272. Both share the similar sound signature ?


 


  Similar only in the sense that they are both well-balanced. One being BA-based and the other dynamic, they differ a fair amount in how notes are actually conveyed. I would never call the RE272 analytical, for example. I made some comparisons to the bass of to the CK10 in the RE272 review and for the most part they will hold for the DBA-02. They also apply to the rest of the spectrum - the DBA-02 is always crisp and immediate whereas the RE272 is always gentle and liquid.


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> joker,
> 
> i'm still considering the Crystal and the ck10. so i need a bit more info
> 
> ...


 

 No wind noise with the Crystal as far as I could tell. 
   
  The stock tips of the CK10 just don't work well for it. It likes foam or a deeper seal (e.g. triple-flanges). I never got to try the CK100 foam. 
   


  Quote: 





stereotypo said:


> Thank you for your extensive reviews, it made the search for a new pair of IEMs a far more enjoyable task. (Ety HF5s were my final choice, loving the crisp treble).


 
   
  Great, glad you like them!


----------



## Foress

Hey ljokerl, YGPM!


----------



## Vloeibaarglas

Joker, do you have plans on getting a pair of God's Gift to IEM aka Monoprice 8320?
   
  And this probably has been asked 100 times before, but why isn't there a TF10 review?
   
  edit: I just got the CC51 today, and DAMN you are good at writing the sound characteristics up. Spot on with CC51, although I prefer the A151 over CC51 (their SQ only differ by 0.2 on your scale and sound is largely subjective so I can't fault you)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vloeibaarglas said:


> Joker, do you have plans on getting a pair of God's Gift to IEM aka Monoprice 8320?
> 
> And this probably has been asked 100 times before, but why isn't there a TF10 review?


 

 Someone is sending me a monoprice to try but I probably won't get around to it for quite a while. There's an FAQ on the front page that explains the order reviews are written in. Basically, as long as I have loaned IEMs and review samples to get through, there won't be a TF10 review.


----------



## kanuka

ljokerl said:


> psygeist said:
> 
> 
> > How would you compare DBA-2 to RE 272. Both share the similar sound signature ?
> ...


 

   
  really? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 that IS a surprise. i was 100% you rated them as a direct upgrade over the RE0.unless you dont call the RE0 analytical neither...
  


ljokerl said:


> kanuka said:
> 
> 
> > joker,
> ...


 

  so, you did tried triple-flanges! which ones? is like Ety's isolation?
  (sorry i keep asking but i'm getting them for a lower price, so i want to know as much as possible)


----------



## onebandonesound

ljokerl, first, i want to thank you yet again for devoting countless hours to this review. My question is, which is a better combination of bass and clarity, the original DDM or the standard monster turbine?


----------



## rlmoss

I cannot get the search engine to return the numerical matrix, where Joker assigned a point value for various attributes and then calculated an average. As I remember first attributes got rankings 1 to 5, but overall ranking was as high as 9.+.
   
  Tried "sticky" "matrix" "array" & c. I'm subscribed to this thread but oddly no link forwarded since 11.23. e-mail to: rlmoss@penguinmail.com. I think private message here should work, but not tested in long while.
   
  Many thanks,
   
  Richard Moss


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





rlmoss said:


> I cannot get the search engine to return the numerical matrix, where Joker assigned a point value for various attributes and then calculated an average. As I remember first attributes got rankings 1 to 5, but overall ranking was as high as 9.+.
> 
> Tried "sticky" "matrix" "array" & c. I'm subscribed to this thread but oddly no link forwarded since 11.23. e-mail to: rlmoss@penguinmail.com. I think private message here should work, but not tested in long while.
> 
> ...


 
  Not quite sure what you are talking about, but the chart with all the scores is on the first page of the thread, waaaayyy at the bottom.


----------



## StereoNoodles

Will the M2's appeal to the average, non-audiophile listener? ( like the ones who still thinks their cheap apple earbuds are good. )
  People LOVED my mee m9's because there was so much bass... It felt literally like a club to alot of people, which hopefully the m2 will be even more like a night club..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> really?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I don't remember calling the RE0 analytical but the RE0 is on the dry and slightly thin side in terms of note presentation whereas the RE272 is more like the RE262 in that regard.
   
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> so, you did tried triple-flanges! which ones? is like Ety's isolation?
> (sorry i keep asking but i'm getting them for a lower price, so i want to know as much as possible)


 

 I use MEElec triples with a trimmed stem (so that the largest flange fits over the body of the CK10s). Isolation is not a match for my ER4 but still very good.


  Quote: 





onebandonesound said:


> ljokerl, first, i want to thank you yet again for devoting countless hours to this review. My question is, which is a better combination of bass and clarity, the original DDM or the standard monster turbine?


 

 I would go DDM unless you want the more user-friendly form factor of the Turbines.
   


  Quote: 





rlmoss said:


> I cannot get the search engine to return the numerical matrix, where Joker assigned a point value for various attributes and then calculated an average. As I remember first attributes got rankings 1 to 5, but overall ranking was as high as 9.+.
> 
> Tried "sticky" "matrix" "array" & c. I'm subscribed to this thread but oddly no link forwarded since 11.23. e-mail to: rlmoss@penguinmail.com. I think private message here should work, but not tested in long while.
> 
> ...


 
   
  This?


   

  Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Will the M2's appeal to the average, non-audiophile listener? ( like the ones who still thinks their cheap apple earbuds are good. )
> People LOVED my mee m9's because there was so much bass... It felt literally like a club to alot of people, which hopefully the m2 will be even more like a night club..


 
   
  The M2 doesn't have as much bass as the M9 but I think the average listener will still find them appealing. Some will even be surprised by the 'clarity' (which in reality would be the forward mids but no matter).


----------



## Twink

Just wanted to throw out a big thanks to you |joker|, I really appreciate all the work you've put into this thread. I've used your reviews extensively in my recent purchases, and look forward to your future reviews.
   
  Keep up the great work!


----------



## StereoNoodles

Which should  impress more?
  M9's cause of the bass?
  Or the m2's because of everything else?


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





stereonoodles said:


> Which should  impress more?
> M9's cause of the bass?
> Or the m2's because of everything else?


 


  M2


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





twink said:


> Just wanted to throw out a big thanks to you |joker|, I really appreciate all the work you've put into this thread. I've used your reviews extensively in my recent purchases, and look forward to your future reviews.
> 
> Keep up the great work!


 

 Thanks, glad the thread has been helpful!


----------



## Selenium

Someone loan Joker a TF10.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Someone loan Joker a TF10.


 


  Seriously. The wait for the TF10 review is killing me!


----------



## kckc

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Someone loan Joker a TF10.


 

 I agree! There are so many reviews that I forgot the TF10 isn't one of them.


----------



## i2ehan

I'm pretty sure I speak for the majority here when I say it's also the most anticipated one. As far as I'm concerned, the remainder can wait...


----------



## olear

And the FXT90 afterwards


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Someone loan Joker a TF10.


 

 I'm pretty sure he owns one, but just hasn't gotten around to reviewing them...


----------



## monoglycer

I think the better idea is for everyone to stop loaning joker IEMs...


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Someone loan Joker a TF10.


 
  Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> Seriously. The wait for the TF10 review is killing me!


 
  Quote: 





kckc said:


> I agree! There are so many reviews that I forgot the TF10 isn't one of them.


 

 Joker owns one and has mentioned many times that TF10 will need to wait as long as there are loaners or review samples. I think it's going to be the grand #250 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (or #300 or #400 or I hope sometime within #500 at least. One can always hope)


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Similar only in the sense that they are both well-balanced. One being BA-based and the other dynamic, they differ a fair amount in how notes are actually conveyed. I would never call the RE272 analytical, for example. I made some comparisons to the bass of to the CK10 in the RE272 review and for the most part they will hold for the DBA-02. They also apply to the rest of the spectrum - the DBA-02 is always crisp and immediate whereas the RE272 is always gentle and liquid.


 
   
  In a way, both will be complementary to some extent ? It wouldn't hurt adding Brainwavz B2 (similar to DBA-02) to my IEM collection as both are different sounding ? Which genre is the forte of Re 272 and DBA-02 ?
   
  Thanks for the detailed reply. I thought RE 272 was more on analytical side, but then I have not listened to many IEMs. Etys are for sure analytical ?


----------



## kiteki

When I first listened to the RE272 I disagreed with the raving about how the RE272 can surpass the ER-4 (or UE700 / CK10 etc.) in detail retrieval.
   
  I was told the CK10 is "too much detail" which is "noise", lol.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> In a way, both will be complementary to some extent ? It wouldn't hurt adding Brainwavz B2 (similar to DBA-02) to my IEM collection as both are different sounding ? Which genre is the forte of Re 272 and DBA-02 ?


 

  I think the DBA's rock with Rock!  Rush is amazing on DBA's unless you have a basslight fit.
   
  Had only a short listen to the RE272 but more laid back/relaxed Classical music would seem best for them I'd say.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Someone loan Joker a TF10.


 

  Quote: 





monoglycer said:


> I think the better idea is for everyone to stop loaning joker IEMs...


 

 Both reasonable solutions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> In a way, both will be complementary to some extent ? It wouldn't hurt adding Brainwavz B2 (similar to DBA-02) to my IEM collection as both are different sounding ? Which genre is the forte of Re 272 and DBA-02 ?
> 
> Thanks for the detailed reply. I thought RE 272 was more on analytical side, but then I have not listened to many IEMs. Etys are for sure analytical ?


 


  I think for a more aggressive sound an Ety or a B2/DBA-02 would compliment the RE272, as long as you're not looking for a radically different balance.


----------



## sphinxvc

Shipped out my RE252s today and came home to a new package: Earsonics SM3s!
   
  The sound: a cohesive, musical sound that ties in the midrange very nicely, ever so slightly warm in balance (getting used it coming from DBA-02s), timbre and bass detail of a level I haven't really experienced from any of my past IEMs.  (RE0s, RE252s, RE262s, DBA-02s/B2s, TF10s, ER4P, S4) 
   
  And I'm happy to report I think I've finally found something I can live with.  I'm not anointing it but I'm not going b-itch either, and I think that constitutes 'happiness' as an audiophile.  Reveling in the music.


----------



## lazuline

Judging from ljokerl's sonic preferences, I'm guessing the tf10 will probably score between 8.8 - 9.0 in sound quality.  If you look at his other reviews, he mentions the tf10 a number of times so you can more or less get an idea of what he thinks of it. For the computer newbies, in your browser type Ctrl+F and then type tf10


----------



## Selenium

I was just joking...Joker.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Both reasonable solutions


----------



## yifu

He does have/had a TF10 in fact and when i asked him about it in a pm he said the sound was a "9 or 9.1" out of 10. Not too bad especially if you got them for 99 dollars 
  
  Quote: 





selenium said:


> Someone loan Joker a TF10.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> And I'm happy to report I think I've finally found something I can live with.  I'm not anointing it but I'm not going b-itch either, and I think that constitutes 'happiness' as an audiophile.  Reveling in the music.


 

 Sounds good to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   


  Quote: 





selenium said:


> I was just joking...Joker.


 

 So was monoglycer, I presume


----------



## Bola 7

Joker,
   
  What do have more dynamic range: CK10 or SM3?


----------



## onebandonesound

ljokerl, because I cant make up my mind on anything, same question as before but with different phones, which of the three have the best combination of bass and clarity? original DDMs, basic Monster Turbines, or TF10?


----------



## Painful Chafe

joker, have you thought about reviewing JVC HA-FXT90?
   
  I keep hearing great things about sound, but need to know about isolation, comfort and durability. I'm torn between these and the GR07's


----------



## nipit

Yes, review FXT90


----------



## olear

joker, a brief impression on FXT90 would be appreciated.
  What time should we expect one?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker,
> 
> What do have more dynamic range: CK10 or SM3?


 

 SM3, but not by a huge margin
   


  Quote: 





onebandonesound said:


> ljokerl, because I cant make up my mind on anything, same question as before but with different phones, which of the three have the best combination of bass and clarity? original DDMs, basic Monster Turbines, or TF10?


 

 The TF10 has better clarity than either of the others but at the expense of bass.
   


  Quote: 





painful chafe said:


> joker, have you thought about reviewing JVC HA-FXT90?
> 
> I keep hearing great things about sound, but need to know about isolation, comfort and durability. I'm torn between these and the GR07's


 
   
  I've had them for about a day. I like the comfort so far - I was expecting worse. Definitely more comfortable than Fischer's Tandems. Isolation is about average, GR07 isolates a bit better especially with the foamies. Build quality is good - JVC always gets it right with the higher-end stuff.
   
  Sound impressions will be reserved for full review - I haven't done any comparative listening and probably won't get to it for a while.


----------



## controlmajortom

Hey Joker, where would you place the TF10s soundstage/imaging compared to the rest of the headphones you've tried?


----------



## DannyBai

This thread might as well turn into a TF-10 thread.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I think the DBA's rock with Rock!  Rush is amazing on DBA's unless you have a basslight fit.
> 
> Had only a short listen to the RE272 but more laid back/relaxed Classical music would seem best for them I'd say.


 

 Thanks. Piques my interest more now.
   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think for a more aggressive sound an Ety or a B2/DBA-02 would compliment the RE272, as long as you're not looking for a radically different balance.


 

 Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Fischer Audio Ceramique and SBA-03
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(3A62) Fischer Audio Ceramique*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Dec 2011
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2B11) Fischer Audio SBA-03*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Dec 2011
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





controlmajortom said:


> Hey Joker, where would you place the TF10s soundstage/imaging compared to the rest of the headphones you've tried?


 

 Among high-end ones, soundstaging (size) would be well above average and imaging slightly above average. The TF10 is not the most 3-D sounding thing but it has decent layering and good separation.


----------



## controlmajortom

Thanks! The TF10s SS is what really impressed me the most. It's stopped me from considering budget-fi IEMs because I know they won't get any headtime next to the TF10s.
   
  The SBA-01 looks interesting, but I'm hesitant to try any FA IEM because I haven't seen one IEM from them that doesn't seem to have shoddy build quality.


----------



## Inks

Nice SBA03 review. It's surely one of the better single BAs out there, just needs a better cable.


----------



## AznInvasion138

Hey Joker great job with the extensive reviews you have on all these different kinds of headphones. I'm looking to buy a new pair of IEMs and having a hard time choosing one. My price range is $200-$300 and I listen to mostly Rap/Hip Hop/Techno/Trance/Rock. Isolation is pretty important to me and I would rather have the hang down style than the around the ear look. Are there any that you can recommend me? Any help would be great thanks!


----------



## jarrett

Did you hear back? re: IE and Xcited
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'm waiting for Sunrise to get back to me regarding what has been done about the build quality of these products


----------



## rocknblogger

Hey Joker I'm looking at a couple IEMs and I would love your input.
   
  I'm looking at the Sennhieser IE6 on Amazon for $119
  Beats Turbines referbs from Monster for $49.95
   
  I listen to rock, alternative, classic (Miles Davis, George Benson, Lee Ritenour), Sinatra. Some Maroon 5, a very little bit of hip hop.
  I like good bass if it's meant to be there. I have a pair of 6 or 7 year old Bose and they are okay but too much bass. A bit too muddy I guess. I like a good crisp sound so high end is important also and a measured mid.
   
  Basically I'm looking to spend less than $130 but I want to get a good value and it seems to me that the iE6's are a good value.
  Do you know if the referbs from Monster come will everything a new pair does? I know the packaging may be no frills but I can't tell from the site about all the other stuff.
   
  So, what do you think?
  Looking forward to your opinion on this.


----------



## musedesign

Joker,
    Thank you for the fantastic resource, great work!  I keep coming back to your thread over and over.
   
    I have a pair of Westone UM3X, great IEM, but a little bass heavy.  Was in San Jose Airport and stopped by the InMotion store and listened to a pair of the Westone 4, I was impressed, larger sound stage than 3, with less boosted bass.
   
    I would like to try out a pair of custom IEM, my current short list:
  Ultimate Ears 4 Pro $399
  JH5 Pro $399
  1964 T $400
   
  What do you think, get the Westone 4 or jump into customs?
   
  Thank you!


----------



## WakiDabeast

o.m.g the consonance sounds like my dream headphone, stlylishly sexy, under 100$, about same sound quality as se215, sexy, really sexy, and damn those look sexy


----------



## Vloeibaarglas

Hey Joker,
   
  When you receive MP8320, can you put them on the TOP of your review list?


----------



## estreeter

I assume that many here are familiar with the term '*slashdotted*' - SlashDot would publish a tech story in the morning and sites mentioned in said story would have their servers groaning under the load by midday.
   
  Well, I think we need a new term - 'jokered'. Go to the j-phonics site and try to order either version of the K2 .....


----------



## i2ehan

On the contrary, it's most probably due to *their most recent announcement*.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





controlmajortom said:


> The SBA-01 looks interesting, but I'm hesitant to try any FA IEM because I haven't seen one IEM from them that doesn't seem to have shoddy build quality.


 


  The Consonance is pretty sturdy. The SBA-03 probably won't break but the cable could definitely stand to be thicker.


  Quote: 





inks said:


> Nice SBA03 review. It's surely one of the better single BAs out there, just needs a better cable.


 


  Thanks.


  Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Hey Joker great job with the extensive reviews you have on all these different kinds of headphones. I'm looking to buy a new pair of IEMs and having a hard time choosing one. My price range is $200-$300 and I listen to mostly Rap/Hip Hop/Techno/Trance/Rock. Isolation is pretty important to me and I would rather have the hang down style than the around the ear look. Are there any that you can recommend me? Any help would be great thanks!


 

 Not sure what type of sound you prefer but I'd look at the Atrio MG7, Monster Turbine Pro line (if you can get them at <half MSRP), and maybe the ATH-CKM99.

  
  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> Did you hear back? re: IE and Xcited


 


  I did, and the problems have supposedly been fixed, but I want to get my hands on the updated units before I start recommending them again.


  Quote: 





rocknblogger said:


> Hey Joker I'm looking at a couple IEMs and I would love your input.
> 
> I'm looking at the Sennhieser IE6 on Amazon for $119
> Beats Turbines referbs from Monster for $49.95
> ...


 


  I wouldn't pay $130 for an IE6, probably not even $100 with alternatives like the HiSound Crystal and FA Tandem around. Tandem is around $130 and I think it sounds better than the IE7, not just the IE6. Crystal is a very good all-rounder as well at around $100. Turbines at $50 are a good deal but not the most crisp thing out there. I think mine came with some tips but not all. Either way I don't like the stock Turbine tips much and you can get tips online for <$10 - check out the MEElec M11+ tip set for example.


  Quote: 





musedesign said:


> Joker,
> Thank you for the fantastic resource, great work!  I keep coming back to your thread over and over.
> 
> I have a pair of Westone UM3X, great IEM, but a little bass heavy.  Was in San Jose Airport and stopped by the InMotion store and listened to a pair of the Westone 4, I was impressed, larger sound stage than 3, with less boosted bass.
> ...


 

 If you want a stage as large or larger than that of the W4, I would skip the 1964-T. I could recommend the CTM-200 instead but that's still a different signature to the W4. If you really like the balance of the W4 I would just stick to that unless you can find someone to comment on how both the JH5 and UE4 compare.

  
  Quote: 





wakidabeast said:


> o.m.g the consonance sounds like my dream headphone, stlylishly sexy, under 100$, about same sound quality as se215, sexy, really sexy, and damn those look sexy


 

 IIRC it comes in 3 different color schemes too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   


  Quote: 





vloeibaarglas said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> When you receive MP8320, can you put them on the TOP of your review list?


 

 Sorry, there are a number of IEMs I've had on loan for a long time that have priority.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> On the contrary, it's most probably due to *their most recent announcement*.


 


  I'm sorry, but that reeks. If they don't have the ability to market outside Japan, *why would they setup a website specifically for non-Japanese customers ? *I can see the need for them to have separate operations - fine - but why restrict yourself to one market when they can clearly sell to the world ? A savvy exporter in Japan could really make a killing selling these 'Japanese market only' products to the rest of the world - they do it with cars, and thats a much larger piece of kit to ship .....


----------



## Foress

hey ljokerl, YGPM!


----------



## rocknblogger

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't pay $130 for an IE6, probably not even $100 with alternatives like the HiSound Crystal and FA Tandem around. Tandem is around $130 and I think it sounds better than the IE7, not just the IE6. Crystal is a very good all-rounder as well at around $100. Turbines at $50 are a good deal but not the most crisp thing out there. I think mine came with some tips but not all. Either way I don't like the stock Turbine tips much and you can get tips online for <$10 - check out the MEElec M11+ tip set for example.


 

 Thanks Joker I decided to give the Turbines a try. I figure $49 is a pretty good deal. I appreciate your input but can you post links to the earbud tips and to Hisound Crystal? I couldn't find them anywhere to see how much they are except one place overseas.
   
  Thanks!!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





rocknblogger said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  here http://www.meelec.com/category_s/377.htm
   
  and here http://shop.frogbeats.com/hisoundaudio-crystal (they seem to sell the Crystal with more tips) and http://lendmeurears.com


----------



## 8bits

Those Soundmagic PL-30's have been a good investment. Very accurate and portable for the low low price of $22.50 - $30


----------



## Moby1

Hey Joker, Discovered your thread while on my break at work earlier today and have been reading since, great help for a lost beginner like myself, thought id join up and ask the guru himself.
  I am looking to upgrade from my 2 year old Sony XB40EX, reading your review on them mirrored my exact thoughts and was enough to convince me that it was time to upgrade, I listen to a wide variety of music genres  and will be using my iphone and laptop/pc (no soundcard).
  Comfort is important coming from the horrible XB40, while I do like bass the sonys make me sick after a short while, I guess good quality over quantity. Isolation is not important but good sound stage would be a nice feel  from the closed feeling I have now.
  Going through your list, I have narrowed it down to the EX1000, FX700, Westone 4 and GR07 but am a little worried that I would not be getting the best out of them considering my sources.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## musedesign

musedesign said:


> Joker,
> Thank you for the fantastic resource, great work!  I keep coming back to your thread over and over.
> 
> I have a pair of Westone UM3X, great IEM, but a little bass heavy.  Was in San Jose Airport and stopped by the InMotion store and listened to a pair of the Westone 4, I was impressed, larger sound stage than 3, with less boosted bass.
> ...




 
 If you want a stage as large or larger than that of the W4, I would skip the 1964-T. I could recommend the CTM-200 instead but that's still a different signature to the W4. If you really like the balance of the W4 I would just stick to that unless you can find someone to comment on how both the JH5 and UE4 compare.
   
   
  Joker you are the best!  I will look into the CTM-200 and will find out about comparisons of the JH5 and the UE4.  
   
   
  Thank you!


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Hey Joker, Discovered your thread while on my break at work earlier today and have been reading since, great help for a lost beginner like myself, thought id join up and ask the guru himself.
> I am looking to upgrade from my 2 year old Sony XB40EX, reading your review on them mirrored my exact thoughts and was enough to convince me that it was time to upgrade, I listen to a wide variety of music genres  and will be using my iphone and laptop/pc (no soundcard).
> Comfort is important coming from the horrible XB40, while I do like bass the sonys make me sick after a short while, I guess good quality over quantity. Isolation is not important but good sound stage would be a nice feel  from the closed feeling I have now.
> Going through your list, I have narrowed it down to the EX1000, FX700, Westone 4 and GR07 but am a little worried that I would not be getting the best out of them considering my sources.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


 

 I can't speak for the others, but my GR07s sound great out of my iPod and my PC


----------



## kkl10

Hey there, ljoker.
   
  Could you please answer this question for me?
   
  What would you rate the sound of the Vsonic GR07 out of the box?
   
  It's just that I received my GR07 yesterday and found that my experience with them has been pretty similar to yours:
   
  "_the earphones fail to impress when it comes to resolution or smoothness (...) I am generally quite sensitive to sibilance and listening to some of my tracks with the GR07 was downright unpleasant_"
   
  There's a lack of transparency that annoys me, and the treble seems very unrefined and not very resolving.
  To be honest it hardly sounds any better than my Etymotic MC5, which I happen to not like very much - lifeless and boring.
  I find it a bit hard to believe that the GR07 sonic performance can improve so much as to deserve more than one point above MC5 sonic performance... but I have hopes, despite not having very faith in burn-in...
   
  So yeah, how would you score the GR07 sound out of the box?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Hey Joker, Discovered your thread while on my break at work earlier today and have been reading since, great help for a lost beginner like myself, thought id join up and ask the guru himself.
> I am looking to upgrade from my 2 year old Sony XB40EX, reading your review on them mirrored my exact thoughts and was enough to convince me that it was time to upgrade, I listen to a wide variety of music genres  and will be using my iphone and laptop/pc (no soundcard).
> Comfort is important coming from the horrible XB40, while I do like bass the sonys make me sick after a short while, I guess good quality over quantity. Isolation is not important but good sound stage would be a nice feel  from the closed feeling I have now.
> Going through your list, I have narrowed it down to the EX1000, FX700, Westone 4 and GR07 but am a little worried that I would not be getting the best out of them considering my sources.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


 
  I own all but the Westones and are easily driven by my ipod and iphone.  The EX and FX have the best soundstage.  The GR07 is the best value but 50ohm compared to 32 for EX and 16 for FX but still sounds fine out of portable players.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> [/]
> Well, I think we need a new term - 'jokered'. Go to the j-phonics site and try to order either version of the K2 .....


 

 I think users are apprehensive in paying $399 for a dual-driver IEM, we are inclined to think more drivers = better, I was suscpicious of that thinking until the 6-driver custom IEM's proved otherwise, when I heard the UM Miracle demo unit.
   
  I didn't like the K2 SP at all, Shigzeo said he didn't think head-fi would 'get it' and I guess I'm the first one here that didn't. The K2 SP and the SE535 are the only two IEM's I've heard I consider of weak sound quality for their price.
  
  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> [/] but why restrict yourself to one market when they can clearly sell to the world ? A savvy exporter in Japan could really make a killing selling these 'Japanese market only' products to the rest of the world - they do it with cars, and thats a much larger piece of kit to ship .....


 

 Japan doesn't care about marketing to the rest of the world much, we'll probably still be able to order them with tenso.com however at a higher price, I think it's around $480, I can only see Sensaphonics 2-XS users doing that.
   
  The 2-XS use the exact same drivers as the K2 SP, Shigzeo thinks the K2 SP sounds even better, he bought the K2 MX version as well, I think he was excited about his first custom IEM being released as a universal, the 2-XS was very popular a few years ago.
   
  I saw one Japanese review that said the K2 SP sound quality doesn't match the price (Japanese price), and after mine went to i2ehan he put them up for sale within a few days so I'm not completely alone with my thoughts.
   
  They are however, highly technically proficient, and would sound 'okay' as a stage monitor, but in that scenario I'd rather use the Shure SE425, IMHO.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


kiteki said:


> I saw one Japanese review that said the K2 SP sound quality doesn't match the price (Japanese price), and after mine went to i2ehan he put them up for sale within a few days so I'm not completely alone with my thoughts.


 

 Can't say I didn't try and find every possible way to like them, but they just weren't up to par with the rest of my top-tiers, in terms of enjoyment that is. From a technical standpoint, I have no trouble agreeing with |joker|'s evaluation, and in all honesty, I expected for them to score no less than the EX1000's. They're very technically proficient, but I personally don't feel it's a matter of few will get it, most won't. On the contrary, I believe most will get it, but only few will find it suitable to their liking/enjoyment. Kiteki and I just so happen to be in the most category, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with the few that do find the K2 to their liking.


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





kkl10 said:


> Hey there, ljoker.
> 
> Could you please answer this question for me?
> 
> ...


 

 I hated the IEM out of the box, but after about 150hr mechanical burn in (and mental burn in too), it was like love at first sight...


----------



## estreeter

Interesting last page or so of posts - two very different IEMs, *GR07 and K2*, but it appears that the former were 'good enough' out of the box to convince new owners to stick with them, whilst the latter generally weren't. Anyway, thanks for the feedback - I'm still considering the GR07 but the K2 sounds like more (expensive) trouble than its worth for my modest requirements.


----------



## kiteki

In my book, ~$400+ is in custom IEM waters.
   
  Reshell a B2, DBA-02, q-Jays, UE700, CK10 or PS200 into the Unique Melody Mage with custom-iem.com, for example.
   
  At reasonably equal prices, I think the UM Mage (demo unit) is several steps above the K2 SP in sound quality and technical performance.
   
  Just sharing my personal thoughts.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





8bits said:


> Those Soundmagic PL-30's have been a good investment. Very accurate and portable for the low low price of $22.50 - $30


 

 My first proper IEM. Never let them go either - the paint has peeled but otherwise they are still going strong after 3 years.
   


  Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Hey Joker, Discovered your thread while on my break at work earlier today and have been reading since, great help for a lost beginner like myself, thought id join up and ask the guru himself.
> I am looking to upgrade from my 2 year old Sony XB40EX, reading your review on them mirrored my exact thoughts and was enough to convince me that it was time to upgrade, I listen to a wide variety of music genres  and will be using my iphone and laptop/pc (no soundcard).
> Comfort is important coming from the horrible XB40, while I do like bass the sonys make me sick after a short while, I guess good quality over quantity. Isolation is not important but good sound stage would be a nice feel  from the closed feeling I have now.
> Going through your list, I have narrowed it down to the EX1000, FX700, Westone 4 and GR07 but am a little worried that I would not be getting the best out of them considering my sources.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


 

 For the most open feel I would go with the EX1000 (or EX600 if you just want to put one foot forward) or FX700. I think an iPhone should work reasonably well with both. Don't remember them being too revealing of electrical noise with my laptop, either. 
   


  Quote: 





kkl10 said:


> Hey there, ljoker.
> 
> Could you please answer this question for me?
> 
> ...


 

 It's been a while but I remember A:Bing it with the RE-ZERO and thinking they weren't too far apart. Score-wise in the 8.5 range, probably.
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> Can't say I didn't try and find every possible way to like them, but they just weren't up to par with the rest of my top-tiers, in terms of enjoyment that is. From a technical standpoint, I have no trouble agreeing with |joker|'s evaluation, and in all honesty, I expected for them to score no less than the EX1000's. They're very technically proficient, but I personally don't feel it's a matter of few will get it, most won't. On the contrary, I believe most will get it, but only few will find it suitable to their liking/enjoyment. Kiteki and I just so happen to be in the most category, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with the few that do find the K2 to their liking.


 

 For what it's worth I wouldn't buy a K2 over an EX1000 either unless I was shopping for a monitor. Also wouldn't buy it over a CTM-200 unless I wanted an aggressive signature, but that's a different story.


----------



## kiteki

How's your UM Miracle sounding these days ljokerl?


----------



## olear

Hi joker, I have a TF10 and like the detail, clarity and of course the treble. I believe it has good quality bass and sub bass but would like more bass impact. If the mids were somewhat more forward that would be a plus.  Which dynamic would you recommend for < $200?  Oh and if it was just a hair more comfortable, that too would be a plus.
   
  I had S4, it was too boomie and X10 which I thought was more balanced but had little detail and clarity, especially compared with TF10. 
   
  Thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> How's your UM Miracle sounding these days ljokerl?


 

 Quite good, in the (very) limited time I have to actually enjoy it. I have been lucky with the review queue lately as it's got gear I actually like (EX600, ACS T15, SBA-03)
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Hi joker, I have a TF10 and like the detail, clarity and of course the treble. I believe it has good quality bass and sub bass but would like more bass impact. If the mids were somewhat more forward that would be a plus.  Which dynamic would you recommend for < $200?  Oh and if it was just a hair more comfortable, that too would be a plus.
> 
> I had S4, it was too boomie and X10 which I thought was more balanced but had little detail and clarity, especially compared with TF10.
> 
> Thank you


 

 The GR07 would seem closest as it 'fills in' the midrange with bass and treble quantities not far off from the TF10. The EX600 would be another option. However, neither of these is significantly more impactful than a well-fitted TF10 despite being dynamics. It is entirely possible that they won't be bassy enough; in that case I am not familiar with an IEM that fits all of your criteria. There is another option - the ATH-CKM99 - but that has mild midrange recession a-la TF10. I think the recession is smaller with the CKM99 but it is still made noticeable by the powerful bass.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  they just should re-make the original xcape


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quite good, in the (very) limited time I have to actually enjoy it. I have been lucky with the review queue lately as it's got gear I actually like (EX600, ACS T15, SBA-03)
> 
> 
> The GR07 would seem closest as it 'fills in' the midrange with bass and treble quantities not far off from the TF10. The EX600 would be another option. However, neither of these is significantly more impactful than a well-fitted TF10 despite being dynamics. It is entirely possible that they won't be bassy enough; in that case I am not familiar with an IEM that fits all of your criteria. There is another option - the ATH-CKM99 - but that has mild midrange recession a-la TF10. I think the recession is smaller with the CKM99 but it is still made noticeable by the powerful bass.


 
  I would be willing to  have some midrange recession as a trade off for significantly more bass impact vs TF10. In this case, which IEMs do you recommend?  Thanks joker


----------



## Moby1

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> I can't speak for the others, but my GR07s sound great out of my iPod and my PC


 

 I suppose I should be fine then, the GR07 seem like a safe bet for all types of genres and the price point is attractive, How have you found the sound stage and fit?
   


  Quote: 





dannybai said:


> I own all but the Westones and are easily driven by my ipod and iphone.  The EX and FX have the best soundstage.  The GR07 is the best value but 50ohm compared to 32 for EX and 16 for FX but still sounds fine out of portable players.


 
  Out of the 3 you own, what would you rate best in terms of comfort?
  
   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For the most open feel I would go with the EX1000 (or EX600 if you just want to put one foot forward) or FX700. I think an iPhone should work reasonably well with both. Don't remember them being too revealing of electrical noise with my laptop, either.


 
  Ahh this will be a tough choice, Do you feel the EX1000 and FX700 are worth the extra cost over the GR07? Looking for that major jump from my horrible muddy mess
   
  Thanks guys for the input its very much appreciated


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Out of the 3 you own, what would you rate best in terms of comfort?


 

 I actually like the GR07 best in comfort, the moving nozzle is worth its weight in gold.  Though others have no problems, I do not like the EX1000's form factor.  The FX700 is fine, but the barrel is somewhat large, so it could be an issue with some people.  None are bad, but I have never had any problems with the GR07.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





moby1 said:


> I suppose I should be fine then, the GR07 seem like a safe bet for all types of genres and the price point is attractive, How have you found the sound stage and fit?


 

  Compared to my other IEMs, the GR07s have a noticeably larger soundstage, but it's not huge compared to full-sized headphones, obviously. The fit is nice because of the rotating nozzles, but at least my set from the original batch had a limited choice of tips, and some have reported issues not getting a good seal with the provided tips. However, the newer batch, which is what you should get if you order them, comes with a huge selection of fake Sony hybrid tips, so you should be fine on that count. Also, if you have an unusually small outer-ear, you might have fit issues with the shell, but unless you have very small ears, this shouldn't be an issue. If it fits your ear, it's very comfortable though. (I've exaggerated fit issues so you're aware of them; it's really not that hard to get a good fit).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> I would be willing to  have some midrange recession as a trade off for significantly more bass impact vs TF10. In this case, which IEMs do you recommend?  Thanks joker


 
   
  CKM99 or even MG7 Atrio if you can stand to give up some detail and soundstage space for even more impact.
  
   


  Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Ahh this will be a tough choice, Do you feel the EX1000 and FX700 are worth the extra cost over the GR07? Looking for that major jump from my horrible muddy mess
> 
> Thanks guys for the input its very much appreciated


 

 All high-end audio is a game of diminishing returns. The EX1000 clearly does not sound twice as good as the GR07 but if given the choice I would take the sound of the Sonys 10 out of 10 times. The GR07 is more usable everyday and a lot cheaper so take that as you will. Either one should be a huge step up for you.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> they just should re-make the original xcape


 

 x2


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> I actually like the GR07 best in comfort, the moving nozzle is worth its weight in gold.


 

  x2.  I've always been sad that I didn't like the signature enough to buy a GR07.  I want to put those in my ears more than just about any other universal.


----------



## NotSoSerious

Wow, how do you manage to do this?
  It's like this is your full-time job!
  Must be spankin' rich to afford all of those in-ears..
   
  Just wanted to let you know how AMAZED I am at this....
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
  Edit:
  Sorry, but I'm just wondering, how is the NuForce cable? I know it's durable, but is it tangle-resistant like Brainwavz cables?
  Would the Brainwavz M2 or the Ne-700x be more appealing to un-audiophilic friends?
   
  Thanks for your help...


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Wow, how do you manage to do this?
> It's like this is your full-time job!
> Must be spankin' rich to afford all of those in-ears..
> 
> Just wanted to let you know how AMAZED I am at this....


 
   
  We are ALL amazed, and he doesnt limit it to IEMs, but Joker now receives review samples from other folks that he doesnt have to pay for - not all of them, granted, but I assume that the financial burden is less than it was when he started this mammoth thread. What blows me away is the number of flagship universals in this thread, yet there are also plenty of sub-$50 recommendations : the kid in the candy store could easily go ballistic.


----------



## rlmoss

Thanks..tht's it in spirit. Different phones at top of array. I didn't realize it was a PNG image; small wonder a text search didn't find it.At least, I've decoded the caption IEMchartjoker.png (that is noting it is an IEM Chart prepared by Joker in format PNG.
   
  I got an another reference that's a table of contents from 50an6xy06r6n, which was useful once I figured out that the coding was an index rather than a ranking. Someone might think of ear canal size. After Ety bonked, I replaced with budget Yuin. Have no idea who possibly could have entry to ear canal as big as these.
   
  Absolute Sound gave Audeo Phonak gold stars; trying to get more information than the stars.  Thanks,
   
  Richard.


----------



## rlmoss

Joker, thanks that is the chart I had in mind. Years back I had printed content and kept 1st 2 pages--probably scores on average above 8. Dynamic movement in the rankings. 
 50an6xy06r6n sent me a pointer to a table of contents. It is helpful although other than Etymotic of old, no mfg keeps models or the nomenclature for models around for very long. I was thinking about Audeo Phonak which Absolute Sound liked, but my recollection is there was a $189 iteration and a $99--012. Maybe $189 got 112.    
I've no idea whether the Absolute Sound gold star ranking speaks to an older or newer variant. So much product.
   
Thanks,
   
Richard


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Wow, how do you manage to do this?
> It's like this is your full-time job!
> Must be spankin' rich to afford all of those in-ears..
> 
> ...


 


  Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither was the thread. There is a v.1 of this thread archived... somewhere. I used to keep track of how much of my resources was tied up in audio gear but I've stopped. I don't really have time to get rid of stuff anymore.
   
  The Nuforce cable is pretty average in my opinion. I like the Brainwavz cable better, both for sturdiness and for user-friendliness. Sound-wise I think both would appeal to non-audiophiles but the M2 may be a bigger change (signature-wise) from entry-level products they've likely heard.


  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> We are ALL amazed, and he doesnt limit it to IEMs, but Joker now receives review samples from other folks that he doesnt have to pay for - not all of them, granted, but I assume that the financial burden is less than it was when he started this mammoth thread. What blows me away is the number of flagship universals in this thread, yet there are also plenty of sub-$50 recommendations : the kid in the candy store could easily go ballistic.


 
   
  I've been postponing adding a 'buyer's guide' to this thread for a long time. I'd love to go through and put up my personal recommendations in each price range but I just don't have the time to put it together or maintain it properly.
   


  Quote: 





rlmoss said:


> Joker, thanks that is the chart I had in mind. Years back I had printed content and kept 1st 2 pages--probably scores on average above 8. Dynamic movement in the rankings.
> 50an6xy06r6n sent me a pointer to a table of contents. It is helpful although other than Etymotic of old, no mfg keeps models or the nomenclature for models around for very long. I was thinking about Audeo Phonak which Absolute Sound liked, but my recollection is there was a $189 iteration and a $99--012. Maybe $189 got 112.


 

 Phonak raised the price of the 112 this year. It used to be in the $139 range with the Perfect Bass (012) at $99. The differ only in the included acoustic filters and accessories. I do not like the green 012 filters but I'm not sure I'd pay $189 for a 112 when a 012 + gray or black filters would come out cheaper.


----------



## cocolinho

Hi all,
  I've been adviced by a member to put my request here, so let's go:
  I would like to start this thread by telling my own story, I think it will help to recommand me some nice IEMs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  So, it did not take that long to find the perfect headphones for me, I started with :
   

 AKG K518DJ, I liked the sound but some problem with comfort and maybe a bit too bassier
 then MEelec HT-21s, did not like it, clear but sound too dry for me. (somewhat the opposite of 518DJ)
 Alessandro MS1: was definitely my taste but way too uncomfortable & of course it leaks too much even for home-use
 Denon D1001, I liked it so much that I decided to pull the trigger and buy D2000, I'm in looooove !!!
   
  So I did not spend a lot of time to test many different things, lucky me! But when it comes to IEMs (for travel, gym etc...), that's another story!
   

 I started with Meelec M6 & M9, pleased especially with M6 but did not like the fit over-the-ear and wanted something more refined
 Brainwavz M1 thanks to ljokerl review , I still have them, I would like an upgrade but it becomes difficult to found the right one...
 Fischer Silver Bullet : very pleased with the sound: soundstage, detailed, clear, good amount of bass, but the housing was too big/too heavy for my ears so I sold them unfortunately
 Hifiman RE-0 because I wanted to give them a try and I knew I could compensate the bass with the bass-boost option of my Cmoy but still I find them a bit too dry, I'm clearly not "WOWed"
   
  So I'm looking for detail, soundstage with good bass amount, good isolation, which can be worn straight down. I made some research here and it seems that the following IEMs are recommanded for a Silver Bullet lover:
  PR401, JVC FX500, HiSoundAudio Crystal, JVC FXT90, Sunrise Xcape IE
   
  I used Cmoy BB & Cowon S9.
   
  Thank you all for confirmation or any other recommandation!


----------



## kiho

I guess u should add Future Sonics Atrio MG7 in ur list,the bass is 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## joe it

Hi joker,
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   this is my *first* post but it is already some time since I read this thread and I learned to trust your expertise with feedback that I got through comparative evidence made by me.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I started with 
   
  -Philips SHE 9700 was the first and I do not mind despite entry level and outdated 
   
  -Philips SHE 9800 bought for an upgrade, IMHO a downgrade 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  -Shure SE215* I like it*, great, but I'd had a greater extent on acute 
   
  -Sunrise Excape IE-*I like very much* but I want deeper bass, for this I tried to take the 
   
  -Xears Nature 3i deep bass and technically valid *but dark* then I tried to take the 
   
  -Brainwavz M2 and average good very transparent and I like that they are slightly forward and accentuated bass but not at the level of the Sunrise, then I tried to take the 
   
  -Beyerdynamic DTX101iE even if I had read your review where you said that he had *too much bass*, now I used with a biflange of Xcape which I removed the smaller part. I insert it very superficially to minimize too much bass preserving in this way a part of  the deep bass and minimizing the effect brought by the preponderance of dark. I lose in isolation but in this way the *sound is not bad* but it is an unsafe attachment for use on the road and at the moment at home used only. 
   
  At this point I need your *help. Please*



* *
   
   
  I prefer conventional housings with headphones Beyerdynamic type or Brainwavz M2, because I noticed that even though I like the sound, use rarely Shure you can wear just because only over the ear. 
   
   
   I did not think to  the IE8 or GR07 precisely for this reason. 
   
  I like deep bass  but must not compromise balanced and nor make dark sound. Good medium-treble not sibilance but extended. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




..............
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Edit: What do you think of Fischer Audio SBA-03?  Has sufficient ' bass ' for me?


----------



## NotSoSerious

Thank you.
  That is very interesting. Just wanted to give a thumbs up.
   
   
   
   
  Just trying to make this sure.
  The Brainwavz M2 isn't _neutral _right? I've heard that it has a very neutral sound, with a nice tilt of the bass.. Sort of like the Sunrise or maybe the Klipsch S4. It might impress friends, but a neutral sound is not what I'm looking for..
   
  Just trying to clear things up for me..
   
   
  Thanks very much.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## joe it

Brainwavz has good bass. Trasparent not neutral. Powerfull bass. Rich and prominent middle but not the same detail and soundstage of the similar sounding Sunrise Xcape IE


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cocolinho said:


> Hi all,
> I've been adviced by a member to put my request here, so let's go:
> I would like to start this thread by telling my own story, I think it will help to recommand me some nice IEMs
> 
> ...


 

 I don't really consider the PR401 and Crystal to be upgrades from the Silver Bullets. The PR401 has less bass and not as much detail and the Crystal is more dry and not as spacious. The FX500 has below-average isolation. The Xcape IE fits your requirements but the jury is still out on whether the build has been improved. I would recommend the Fischer Tandem instead except that the housing is quite large. The FXT90 is more comfortable. I am still unsure on where I would rank the sound - somewhere between the Tandem and GR07 but I haven't listened to it very much. It does fit your requirements, though.

  
  Quote: 





joe it said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 No, SBA-03 won't have enough bass. FA Tandem should - it's a little deeper than the Xcape IE - but it probably won't have enough treble emphasis. I would look a the JVC FX500 and maybe the FXT90. FX500 has very deep bass, I think you would like it, and decent treble presence but tends to be a little harsh, especially at higher volumes. The FXT90 is neither as bassy nor as harsh - it lacks the bass power of the N3i and DTX 101 but should have more than an Xcape IE. Depth seems decent but not FX500-good from my early listening. 
   


  Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Thank you.
> That is very interesting. Just wanted to give a thumbs up.
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The M2 is not at all neutral, if by neutral you mean lacking the coloration that results from emphasis or de-emphasis of particular frequencies. The M2 emphasizes both the bass and parts of the midrange.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> hey joker (or anyone with this knowledge)
> 
> would a full size headphone like a sony mdrv6 outperform a ue600/superfi5? if not i dont see the need to waste my money. i want to get a pair to sit at my desk with, so i dont need the small portablilty of the iem if i can get an even better sound out of a pair of cans. thanks


 
   
  It depends on the headphone - they all perform differently. I would say the V6 is better than the SF5 but it's a different signature so not really a necessary comparison. If the Creative Aurvana Live is still $60 at Amazon I would recommend that as a good all-rounder.


----------



## NotSoSerious

Alright, I think I know enough now.
   
  Thank you joker, and joe too.,


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> No, SBA-03 won't have enough bass. FA Tandem should - it's a little deeper than the Xcape IE - but it probably won't have enough treble emphasis. I would look a the JVC FX500 and maybe the FXT90. FX500 has very deep bass, I think you would like it, and decent treble presence but tends to be a little harsh, especially at higher volumes. The FXT90 is neither as bassy nor as harsh - *it lacks the bass power of the N3i and DTX 101 *but should have more than an Xcape IE. Depth seems decent but not FX500-good from my early listening.


 
   
   
   
  Reading my post I don't know if I explained it well. Sorry. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I like bass with sub bass. The IEM must have them, I don't think being a bass-head  and the n3i and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 have too much bass for me. 
   
  The purchase of these IEM was an involuntary  mistake. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I like the bass depth of  n3i and Beyerdynamic but the amount is too much. When using these IEM, I equalize lowering the level of at least 3-4 db or do I have to insert the tip letting go air, although this is a difficult exercise in balancing acts. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  The bass amount of Xcape ie, for me, is sufficient, except that in some passages you feel lacking in depth and this is what I try. 
   
  Also the Shure SE215 as quantity satisfies me. 
   
  Recapping:
   
  I love deep bass, for me are required, but must not compromise balanced and nor make dark sound. Good medium-treble not sibilance but extended.
   
   I prefer conventional housings with headphones Beyerdynamic type or Brainwavz M2, because I noticed that even though I like the sound, use rarely Shure you can wear just because only over the ear. I did not think to  the IE8 or GR07 precisely for this reason. 

   
  Excuse me if I dwell much but I am not, as you will understand, an IEM expert. 
   
  With these clarifications, what do you think? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Thank you


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

Cowon J3 on Crystal Clear EQ+Atrios X=Sub Bass Heaven.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200
   
  Quote: 





> *(1C14) Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Dec 2011
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





joe it said:


> I like bass with sub bass. The IEM must have them, I don't think being a bass-head  and the n3i and Beyerdynamic DTX 101 have too much bass for me.
> 
> The purchase of these IEM was an involuntary  mistake.
> 
> ...


 

 The FX500 might have a little too much, then. Tandem should be perfect in bass quantity but again the treble emphasis may not satisfy. The FXT90 should but I need more time with it to be comfortable recommending it.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> so what does a superfi5 sound like? probably a grado correct, that in your face mid/high? i have $100 to spend on a can, no more no less. i looked at many, including the creative aurvana, but i know i want an open can so they wouldnt match.
> 
> so ive narrowed it down (i think) between the grado sr80 and akg 240. next on the list were the audio technica ad700 or a senn hd518
> 
> ...


 

 The K240 is probably flat in response, not presentation, but I've never heard them. I've never heard anything else on that list either but Grados are not known for soundstaging. I sold my SR325i because of the poor imaging and lack of 3-D space.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


   
   How long?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 You know if exists the possibility to buy JVC from Europe to Italy? By States for Italy may take well over a month.
 I did a search but could not find anything that was not from the U.S. or ebay Store In Japan, if I could ask you a secure link, possibly via PM? 

 The K240 is flat, and I use them for check my records. Equalized can also be fun, they are very comfortable but do not have good insulation.


----------



## kiteki

Thanks for the CTM-200 review.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> KRK KNS6400


 

 needs more impressions...


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





joe it said:


> You know if exists the possibility to buy JVC from Europe to Italy?


 

 I don't think the FXT-90 is available in Europe, you can try from Japan with http://global.rakuten.com/en/ or Seyo-shop.
   
  Be careful with ebay there are many fakes of the FX500.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I don't think the FXT-90 is available in Europe, *you can try from Japan with http://global.rakuten.com/en/ *or Seyo-shop.
> 
> Be careful with ebay there are many fakes of the FX500.


 


   
  I gave a look to the site for the FTX-90 and the price seems convenient. 
   
  As regards the price written there 
   
  'Approximate price provided for convenience only ' 
   
  How do I know if they are in stock or preorder? 
   
  I hope to order soon or FTX-90 or (less likely) to the FX500. What do you think of the two? 
   
  Thank you, very kind kiteki


----------



## kiteki

I can't find the "convinience only", there are different stores on rakuten, try this one http://global.rakuten.com/en/store/e-earphone/item/10005491/
   
  I haven't heard the FX500 or FXT90 yet, for that price, I think I'll buy a pair as well.
   
   
  Edit: Oh you mean the shipping, I think the shipping and fees will cost you around $25.
   
  It should indicate when it's in stock or a pre-order.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> so you think the superfi5 has a better soundstage better than a grado? probably going to end up buying a k240 if this is the case.
> 
> but wait how can a grado sound like a superfi5 when the superfi5 soundstage sounds very good to me, are they tuned similiary at all? lots of people in the cans section did say the grados sound stage is weak though, but great strength in boosted mids/highs and detail up there as well. this sounds like how a superfi5 sounds, no? im confused
> 
> thanks so much, cheers


 


  I never said the SF5 sounds like a Grado or vice versa. You'll just have to try them and see for yourself.


----------



## olear

Hi Joker, decided to part from the V shaped sound sig of the TF10 and go for something between warm/sweet and midcentric with dynamic driver.
  Which do you recommend:
   
  Atrios G7
  Tandem (seems deficient in the hights)
  MTP MD or Trumpet
   
  Thank you,
  olear


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## cocolinho

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I don't think the FXT-90 is available in Europe, you can try from Japan with http://global.rakuten.com/en/ or Seyo-shop.
> 
> Be careful with ebay there are many fakes of the FX500.


 
   
  I'll pick up FXT90 from ebay from a trustable sealer like buyfromjapan I think


----------



## williammm91

great overview of IEMs on the market!! really leaning towards 1964-Ts!!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> Hi Joker, decided to part from the V shaped sound sig of the TF10 and go for something between warm/sweet and midcentric with dynamic driver.
> Which do you recommend:
> 
> Atrios G7
> ...


 
   
  Won't get less v-shaped than the Tandem but it's not a good companion to the TF10 since it will just sound dull and lacking in resolution. RE262 would be a better choice - more on-level with TF10 technically while having a totally different sound signature. The MD and especially the MG7 are not mid-centric.
   
   
  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> and i cant get the grados becuase i bought an akg240  what would you say the grados sound like, just to help me get my head wrapped around this stuff? unfortunately im only 20 with a minimum wage job, and as much as id like to buy all these headphones, i cant
> 
> thank you so much


 


  There's reviews of the SR60 and the MS1i in my portable review thread. I never bothered to review the SR80 or SR125 but they are fairly similar to the two other Grados.


----------



## 177261

Didn't knew my Shure SE535 was that bad


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





christianh said:


> Didn't knew my Shure SE535 was that bad


 

 I can only go on various reviews that I've read, including those of 'average Joes' on the Amazon page, but most who have both the 535s and the Westone 4 seem to prefer the latter. As I said, that is purely based on what I have read.
   
  Getting back to Joker's latest review, the CTM is the first custom that has ever made me consider spending the money on ear impressions - sadly, like many here, the cost of travelling to a big city and having the impressions done would be more than the custom IEMs cost.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





christianh said:


> Didn't knew my Shure SE535 was that bad


 
   
  Not meant as an offense to Joker, but you should trust your own ears above all. So if the SE535 sound great to you, it shouldn't be that important what Joker (or anyone else) thinks of them.
   
  Besides, let's not forget that personal preferences may differ quite widely. For example, I prefer my FI-BA-SS to my UERM, even though they scored "only" 9.3 on Joker's list and the latter would most likely end up much closer to 10.
  
  I'm a bit into wine collecting and in some way Joker's IEM ratings remind me of Robert Parker's wine points. On the one hand these are invaluable to find one's way among the overwhelming variety of fine wines. On the other hand I've witnessed more than once, that friends would rate wines differently if they knew the Parker points prior to tasting, or even tend to revise their ratings if I told them afterwards.
   
  Don't get me wrong, I hold Joker's work in highest esteem, but you shouldn't outsource your own ears to him or anyone else.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> the CTM is the first custom that has ever made me consider spending the money on ear impressions - sadly, like many here, the cost of travelling to a big city and having the impressions done would be more than the custom IEMs cost.


 

 I got mine done for around $40, central Melbourne.


----------



## Niyologist

When will there be a review of the FX500? I would finally like to end the tough decision of purchasing either the FX500, FX700 or the GR07 before the New Year arrives.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> When will there be a review of the FX500? I would finally like to end the tough decision of purchasing either the FX500, FX700 or the GR07 before the New Year arrives.


 

 How about GR06 (more bass and better vocals or smt) and pick up a different Vsonic model next year? Just an idea.


----------



## rammlied69

the shure se535 is not bad !!!its just not a warm signature i have  them also and am impressed with its  ruler flat freq and detail. to me it provides  a 3d experience very accurate presentation indeed!!!would i pay retail for them??probably not i got mine $349 a deal i couldnt pass up lol  i just my tf10 $95 free shipping amazon black fri deal also grabbed  the klipsch x10 as well  same price deal i must be some kinda iem addict lol out of all 3 i now prefer the uetf10 they r as good as everyone says on here but i did invest in new cables es8 jabben 2 for 1 deal!!!now the fit and comfort is way better and i use the overear flip mod can listen to them 8 hrs at work no problems


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> How about GR06 (more bass and better vocals or smt) and pick up a different Vsonic model next year? Just an idea.


 

      I'm looking for great detail, clarity, imaging and no recessed mids with near basshead quality low-end.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I can't find the "convinience only", there are different stores on rakuten, try this one http://global.rakuten.com/en/store/e-earphone/item/10005491/
> 
> I haven't heard the FX500 or FXT90 yet, for that price, I think I'll buy a pair as well.
> 
> ...


 

  
  There is not a direct shipment for Italy. You must subscribe to Tenso. It is this that refer?


----------



## iXpertMan

Anyone able to help me out?
  I am faced with a decision between Klipsch Image X10 (without mic), Brainwavz B2, Etymotic Research HF2/3/5 or Audeo Phonak 122?
  My main factor is obviously music quality but also high isolation rating (I have no problem with buying and using other tips for better isolation).
  I listen to mainly mainstream music now, but want to get into the Classics as-well.
  The Klipsch seems to cost the most (but on sale now) which to me seems like it's the best deal, after all has good reviews.
  Anyone able to suggest me on my purchase. (I'm open to other suggestions, but the budget is limited to <150$ and I read a lot of reviews and these seems to be the main and best contenders).


----------



## olear

joker, having the tf10 with V shaped sound signature, I'm looking for a midcentric (with a bit of bass and warm/sweet) iem.
   
  Does the ex600 have enough bass? ex1000?
   
  The fx700 seems like it would fit the bill? except it's so expensive!
   
  Any suggestions are appreciated.


----------



## olear

Also interested in a three dimensional sound. And that's intimate.
  MTP MD or Copper?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## olear

bmeat said:


> did you end up getting the gr07? i dont think you will dissapointed with them..purchase them




Decided against gr07; too neutral. If I needed a studio monitor, gr07 would be it.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I got mine done for around $40, central Melbourne.


 


  Of course you did. Melbourne, a city of 4 million people, and I live in a town of 7,000, some 600 km from Sydney and almost as far from Brisbane. That said, anyone driving to work in Melbourne this morning is probably still sitting in their car (10:15am local time ..) after a truck plowed into a pylon on their main freeway - win some, lose some


----------



## NotSoSerious

Nevermind.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, having the tf10 with V shaped sound signature, I'm looking for a midcentric (with a bit of bass and warm/sweet) iem.
> 
> Does the ex600 have enough bass? ex1000?
> 
> ...


 


  The MDR EX 600 is not a warm sounding IEM it's north of neutral and has a lean aggressive sound with very pronounced highs. Unless you're a treble head consider my post fair warning and look elsewhere. As for bass the EX 600 in my opinion has good bass but it's nowhere near what a bass head would like. It does hip hop and electronica not to badly but if those genres are what you're going to be mostly listening to there's far better out there.


----------



## steven-026

*My IEM Preference*​ 
Good sounding bass, and good quantity would be a plus, but not needed.​
Good vocals.​
Works well with underground/older hip-hop.​
  I listen to hip-hop, so being able to hear the words is a must.  The reason I need bass, well, is cuz' I just like bass haha.  Out of these headphones, which would suit my preference best?  Thanks for the help.
  Meelec's M6, M9, M16, M21, M31, CX21's, or anything else around $28ish on Amazon.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





steven-026 said:


> *My IEM Preference*​
> Good sounding bass, and good quantity would be a plus, but not needed.​
> Good vocals.​
> Works well with underground/older hip-hop.​
> ...


 
  Klipsh S4 if you're patient you might luck out and get a deal. The S3 is cheaper and bassy but it sounds pretty crappy IMO


----------



## NotSoSerious

Quote: 





steven-026 said:


> *My IEM Preference*​
> Good sounding bass, and good quantity would be a plus, but not needed.​
> Good vocals.​
> Works well with underground/older hip-hop.​
> ...


 


  Out of those Mee options, I would recommend either the M16's, M9's, or the M6's if you don't hate over-ears like I do. 
   
  Ljokerl should have a much better opinion then I do.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





joe it said:


> There is not a direct shipment for Italy. You must subscribe to Tenso. It is this that refer?


 

 Yes you need to sign up with Tenso, for an IEM the intl. shipping + fee should be around $20 - $25.
   
  There is also ebay.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Getting back to Joker's latest review, the CTM is the first custom that has ever made me consider spending the money on ear impressions - sadly, like many here, the cost of travelling to a big city and having the impressions done would be more than the custom IEMs cost.


 

 Order a kit and do them yourself. It might take an hour or two and maybe require some assistance but it's hardly rocket science.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> When will there be a review of the FX500? I would finally like to end the tough decision of purchasing either the FX500, FX700 or the GR07 before the New Year arrives.


 

 FX500 review is almost finished but I haven't had time to go back and complete it. Hopefully after I put up the ACS T15 write-up...
   


  Quote: 





ixpertman said:


> Anyone able to help me out?
> I am faced with a decision between Klipsch Image X10 (without mic), Brainwavz B2, Etymotic Research HF2/3/5 or Audeo Phonak 122?
> My main factor is obviously music quality but also high isolation rating (I have no problem with buying and using other tips for better isolation).
> I listen to mainly mainstream music now, but want to get into the Classics as-well.
> ...


 

 Not having tried the Klipsch, I would definitely go Ety or Brainwavz for isolation. If you want something with a bit more bass punch on the same overall level as the HF2/3/5 and Phonaks there's also the new Fischer SBA-03. With aftermarket tri-flanges the isolation is good.


  Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, having the tf10 with V shaped sound signature, I'm looking for a midcentric (with a bit of bass and warm/sweet) iem.
> 
> Does the ex600 have enough bass? ex1000?
> 
> ...


 

 I wouldn't expect significantly more punch from an EX600/EX1000 compared to the TF10. The FX700 is not mid-centric; it would probably be considered slightly v-shaped by some.
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Also interested in a three dimensional sound. And that's intimate.
> MTP MD or Copper?


 

 MD is pretty much bass-centric. Copper is more balanced, but lacks the warm, smooth mids of the MD or MTPG. Of the three the MTPG is probably the closest to what you want but still not great value - not worth the price premium over a Tandem, for example.
   
   


  Quote: 





steven-026 said:


> *My IEM Preference*​
> Good sounding bass, and good quantity would be a plus, but not needed.​
> Good vocals.​
> Works well with underground/older hip-hop.​
> ...


 
   
  Out of the MEE stuff the M21, probably - it has the least recessed midrange aside from the CX21 (which probably won't have enough bass for you).


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Order a kit and do them yourself. It might take an hour or two and maybe require some assistance but it's hardly rocket science.


 
   
  I considered that, but the at-home kits seem to get a really bad rap here. It also occurred to me that an audiologist is, presumably, someone who has spent a long time learning how to fit people for hearing aids etc and really knows his/her stuff, but if Kiteki got her impressions for 40 AUD, that puts them somewhere in line with the people who use lasers to whiten teeth in shopping centres !


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Order a kit and do them yourself. It might take an hour or two and maybe require some assistance but it's hardly rocket science.
> 
> 
> FX500 review is almost finished but I haven't had time to go back and complete it. Hopefully after I put up the ACS T15 write-up...
> ...


 


 Joker, thanks for the understanding of the EX600/1000 and the FX700.
  It seems the Tandem is a recommended midcentric iem. I assume the MTPG is also midcentric. What would be a step up from the Tandem?
  Also, would you agree that the Tandem would compliment the sound signature of the TF10? If yes, what would compliment the TF10 on the analytical signature side?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> now buy one olear! will i need an amp if im using a laptop with a
> 
> *Rated impedance* 55 ohms
> 
> ...


 

 There's more than impedance and sensitivity behind whether something  needs an amp but looking at that I'd say it's borderline, if not in 'amp me' territory.
   


  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> I considered that, but the at-home kits seem to get a really bad rap here. It also occurred to me that an audiologist is, presumably, someone who has spent a long time learning how to fit people for hearing aids etc and really knows his/her stuff, but if Kiteki got her impressions for 40 AUD, that puts them somewhere in line with the people who use lasers to whiten teeth in shopping centres !


 


  I've had impressions done for $30. For a professional it's 10-15 mins of work, tops. I've also been quoted as much as $110 by a 'licensed JH Audio audiologist', whatever that is. Any audiologist who has done hearing aids will be able to do impressions just fine. It's just not really something I want to pay for again now that I've started doing my own.


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Joker, thanks for the understanding of the EX600/1000 and the FX700.  It seems the Tandem is a recommended midcentric iem. I assume the MTPG is also midcentric. What would be a step up from the Tandem?
> Also, would you agree that the Tandem would compliment the sound signature of the TF10? If yes, what would compliment the TF10 on the analytical signature side?


 


  Not aware of a major step up from the tandem while keeping that general signature. On the analytical side, Ety ER4, perhaps. Doesn't get more analytical than that.


----------



## HK-47

Joker, would you recommend the RE-262 for someone who loves the HD650 sound sig? Do you think its isolation is good enough, and its build tough enough for daily commutes on the bus? Also, I'll probably be running this unamped straight off a Clip+.


----------



## davidcotton

Just thought I'd throw this out to a wider audience than the westone 4 thread (thanks to those that replied there though!).
   
  Right I've narrowed it down to either the um3x the w3 OR the w4.  Thing is they all do things but none of them in one package.  Sounds like the um3x would fit me better, the w4 easier to live with day to day whilst the 3 has the more "fun" sound.  As a comparison the bass on the monster turbines I had I found gave me a headache, and found the westone 2 a little bass light for my taste.  So would that mean taking off the w3 from the list.  It would be for everyday use from out of an ipod touch 3rd gen listening mainly to rock and metal.
   
  Now I can see why I ended up at the westone 2's in the first place, I may just end up with another of those.
   
  I'm very good at narrowing down choices to the bare minimum but it's making that final choice thats difficult.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## kanuka

any  suggestions for something similar  to the e-q5 but cheaper? of course not the same quality but a close sound , and more treble if possible


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


kanuka said:


> any  suggestions for something similar  to the e-q5 but cheaper? of course not the same quality but a close sound , and more treble if possible


 

 You're best bet is to consider a different moving armature, the Final Audio Design Heaven A (FI-BA-A1). There are two currently listed in the for sale forums, *here*, and *here*, assuming you don't mind second hand.


----------



## steviiee

Hey joker,
  I'm looking for a bass heavy IEM around $80, something that's of a little upgrade to my SoundMagic E10's. Right now, I'm in between the Klipsch S4i which can be had for $65 right now, and the DUNU DN-16 Hephaes for $78. Which one would you prefer? Or do you have any more suggestions? I like the V or U shape type of sound.
   
  Thank yoU!


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Hey joker,
> I'm looking for a bass heavy IEM around $80, something that's of a little upgrade to my SoundMagic E10's. Right now, I'm in between the Klipsch S4i which can be had for $65 right now, and the DUNU DN-16 Hephaes for $78. Which one would you prefer? Or do you have any more suggestions? I like the V or U shape type of sound.
> 
> Thank yoU!


 

 Klipsch S4 is bassy and harsh treble in my opinion. if you want a bassy sound signature, then I dont think Klipsch is your best choice.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Hey joker,
> I'm looking for a bass heavy IEM around $80, something that's of a little upgrade to my SoundMagic E10's. Right now, I'm in between the Klipsch S4i which can be had for $65 right now, and the DUNU DN-16 Hephaes for $78. Which one would you prefer? Or do you have any more suggestions? I like the V or U shape type of sound.
> 
> Thank yoU!


 

 Hephaes would be perfect.


----------



## estreeter

On a lighter note, I'm going to (gently) stick plasticine into my ears to get an idea of what my impressions would look like, then try to imagine having to insert a hard acrylic shell into each ear everytime I want to listen to music. On the plus side, I imagine that the isolation on a plane would be sensational - there is an entire section of Youtube dedicated to howling babies on planes.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hk-47 said:


> Joker, would you recommend the RE-262 for someone who loves the HD650 sound sig? Do you think its isolation is good enough, and its build tough enough for daily commutes on the bus? Also, I'll probably be running this unamped straight off a Clip+.


 
   
  IMO The HD650 is a little bassier than the RE262 but on the whole, in that price range, there's nothing I'd recommend over it. Isolation and build quality are fine on the latest revision.
   


  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Just thought I'd throw this out to a wider audience than the westone 4 thread (thanks to those that replied there though!).
> 
> Right I've narrowed it down to either the um3x the w3 OR the w4.  Thing is they all do things but none of them in one package.  Sounds like the um3x would fit me better, the w4 easier to live with day to day whilst the 3 has the more "fun" sound.  As a comparison the bass on the monster turbines I had I found gave me a headache, and found the westone 2 a little bass light for my taste.  So would that mean taking off the w3 from the list.  It would be for everyday use from out of an ipod touch 3rd gen listening mainly to rock and metal.
> 
> ...


 

 The W3 has a different sort of bass from the Turbines - similarly impacful but it's definitely armature bass - not fat, muddy, or bloated. I still think the W4 is the safest choice in the westone range, with the UM3X close behind but with more bass (I would rank them W1 < W2 < W4 < UM3X< W3 in bass qty). The W4 is better than the W2 in pretty much every way unless you are after a more analytical note presentation. The UM3X is very good as well but I actually prefer the more airy presentation of the W2 over the more intimate UM3X.
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> damn, and will a laptop fully power those cans? if not fully, will a laptop power them better than a small mp3 player with a lithium battery? thanks


 

 Too many variables - you'd be better off asking someone who owns the product in question.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> any  suggestions for something similar  to the e-q5 but cheaper? of course not the same quality but a close sound , and more treble if possible


 

 An Ety HF5 or Brainwavz B2, maybe? They're more analytical in presentation but balance-wise wouldn't be far off from what you want.
   


  Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Hey joker,
> I'm looking for a bass heavy IEM around $80, something that's of a little upgrade to my SoundMagic E10's. Right now, I'm in between the Klipsch S4i which can be had for $65 right now, and the DUNU DN-16 Hephaes for $78. Which one would you prefer? Or do you have any more suggestions? I like the V or U shape type of sound.
> 
> Thank yoU!


 

 My suggestion would be the Fischer Audio Consonance. S4 is at most a sidegrade from E10 IMO and the Hephaes is not really V-shaped. Consonance is a clear step up from both to my ears.
   


  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> On a lighter note, I'm going to (gently) stick plasticine into my ears to get an idea of what my impressions would look like, then try to imagine having to insert a hard acrylic shell into each ear everytime I want to listen to music. On the plus side, I imagine that the isolation on a plane would be sensational - there is an entire section of Youtube dedicated to howling babies on planes.


 

 How easy a custom is to insert/remove depends in large part on how it was made - my Miracles have very long sound channels but the mold is very rounded and locks in place extremely easily. My Kozees are easy as well because the sound tubes are cut short. My 1964s and CTMs are not so easy - they actually take some effort to lock in place. On the whole I think it's beneficial to have the outer ear part of the custom shaved down a little from a 'perfect fit' for insertion purposes and to have the sound tubes as long as possible for seal/isolation. Isolation varies with material as well - acrylic doesn't isolate as well as silicone in my experience.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## kiteki

bmeat if you want more power (volume) than a laptop sound-card for cheap, and clarity, pick up a HM-101.


----------



## Hiya Buddy

@ |joker| I was referred here from a fellow member. I'm totally a noob to these forums but I'm looking for a thunderous/punching bass pair of in ear headphones. I'm willing to splurge if they're worth it. Specifically I'm talking about JH16's. Currently, I use monster turbine pro golds because the sound was a nice step up from the beats tour. I'm looking for a custom pair because I have quite small ear canals, not incredibly tiny like the tips on the klispch x10i's, but small for the smallest tip size that monster offers. They fit me perfectly, but I'm looking to step it up from my turbine pro golds. I have tried UE TF10 to no avail because of size, Klispch x10i where I wasn't impressed, was considering Shure se535 but lack of bass (or so I've heard) is a turn off, and looking at Westone UM3/X but have heard they might be too big for me. I'm not totally into bass and hip hop/R&B I listen to other genres and songs that aren't so laden with bass and wondered if the JH16s would deliver on both of these parts. So I figured what the heck go all the way and get me a top of the line pair of custom in ear headphones. Would you anything about these???


----------



## james444

Why not consider dynamic driver based customs like the Future Sonics or Hybrids like the UM Merlin, if you want visceral punchy bass? The basic characteristics of balanced armatures don't change in a custom shell. jm2c.


----------



## kiteki

I couldn't hear any dynamic driver bass in the UM Merlin demo unit, but that's just me, not very good at listening for bass I think.
   
  2 cents.


----------



## lukeskymac

MY GR07's JUST ARRIVED! YES!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> MY GR07's JUST ARRIVED! YES!


 

       Very excited, no?


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Very excited, no?


 


  Yes I am =D. Not only they are probably (burning them in, not tested them yet) a giant step ahead of my recently perished ADDIEMs and my PortaPros, but I've waited some two months for them. Thanks for that, my postal service.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *bmeat* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> and kiteki is that the hi fi man one? would a fiio e5 provide the same benefit?


 

 I have the Fiio E6 and Hifiman HM-101.
   
  The HM-101 is louder than any sound-card I know of, and it sounds pretty good. The E6 is a really basic amplifier, nothing to see here.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> the addiem is a excellent headphone for its price. let me know how much better (or not) you think the gr07 is compared after youve had some time with it


 

  
  Will do.
   
  Now a general question *looks at ljokerl*. I've had them for some 6 hours so far, and it while at first I promised myself to leave them burning for 48 hours or so (since I was aware of its nature), I couldn't resist and put them in =P. The first thing that I noticed was the ~5KHz peak you mentioned. The second thing I noticed was more concerning, and it was a certain lack of bass presence. Now of course I know they're not bassy in-ears, but I definitely was expecting a wee bit more bass than my ADDIEMs, which despite having a bit of a mid-bass hump (if I'm not mistaken) are still a tad bass-light. From the bass that *was* there, though, I could identify that it was more realistic in the sense that is thumps more than booms, possibly a consequence of being a fast dynamic, while the ADDIEM's bass is, well, balanced armature bass (not much impact).
   
  So at first I thought it could be a fit issue, especially because the GR07's were WAY too comfortable, it simply didn't feel much like a seal was formed at all. But maybe that's because the ADDIEMs were less comfortable. Anyway, I switched the medium tips for the double-flanged, and then for the large ones (damn those small Chinese ears!), and then for the ADDIEMs large ones (that looked weird). I went back to the GR07's large tips, but couldn't find much difference.
   
  I then played a song that starts with lots of deep bass. The thumping and presence were instantaneous, not too much (considering the song itself) and not a hair less than I wanted. First I was baffled, but I then noticed that there were absolutely no mid-high or high frequencies at the start of the song. My current theory is that not only the diaphragm will get a little looser and *slightly* increase presence by itself, but that the 5KHz peak is "thinning" the song as a whole. Does this look like the case?
   
  Other than that, I did notice a certain lack of resolution/smoothness and somewhat congested sound in complex passages, considering it's supposed to be the exact opposite of that after 100 hours of use. Yet compared to the ADDIEMs, even at this stage they sound quite nice. Sometimes a little little little muddier, and sometimes, when the passage is less complex, more detailed.


----------



## lukeskymac

Update: There are already *some* things definitely better in the GR07 than the ADDIEM, even at just 10 hours of burn-in. Mostly detail retrieval (I'm getting some small cues in Yes' cover of America that I simply could not have imagined that existed), in a way that I cannot explain. Overall the sound does seem a tad less peaky, but it still is somewhat congested at the busy parts.
   
  Edit: Going back to one of the first songs I heard, I noticed an increase of bass quantity. Sweet!


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Update: There are already *some* things definitely better in the GR07 than the ADDIEM, even at just 10 hours of burn-in. Mostly detail retrieval (I'm getting some small cues in Yes' cover of America that I simply could not have imagined that existed), in a way that I cannot explain. Overall the sound does seem a tad less peaky, but it still is somewhat congested at the busy parts.
> 
> Edit: Going back to one of the first songs I heard, I noticed an increase of bass quantity. Sweet!


 

 I hated my GR07 out of the box, 150+ hours burn in (mechanical and mental) and now I LOVE it...


----------



## estreeter

Isnt the GR07 one of those earphones that some claim takes a thousand hours to properly bed in ? No, I'm not making that up - 1,000 hours.


----------



## kiteki

^No.


----------



## FlySweep

joker.. how does the Tandem compare with the RealVoice?  I get the sense they have more than a few similarities.  I've listened to a lot of IEMs since buying the RealVoice (quite some time ago) & it remains one of my favorite universal IEMs (regardless of pricepoint).  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hiya buddy said:


> @ |joker| I was referred here from a fellow member. I'm totally a noob to these forums but I'm looking for a thunderous/punching bass pair of in ear headphones. I'm willing to splurge if they're worth it. Specifically I'm talking about JH16's. Currently, I use monster turbine pro golds because the sound was a nice step up from the beats tour. I'm looking for a custom pair because I have quite small ear canals, not incredibly tiny like the tips on the klispch x10i's, but small for the smallest tip size that monster offers. They fit me perfectly, but I'm looking to step it up from my turbine pro golds. I have tried UE TF10 to no avail because of size, Klispch x10i where I wasn't impressed, was considering Shure se535 but lack of bass (or so I've heard) is a turn off, and looking at Westone UM3/X but have heard they might be too big for me. I'm not totally into bass and hip hop/R&B I listen to other genres and songs that aren't so laden with bass and wondered if the JH16s would deliver on both of these parts. So I figured what the heck go all the way and get me a top of the line pair of custom in ear headphones. Would you anything about these???


 

 I am not familiar with the JH16 - you probably want to ask average_joe. You probably won't like the SE535 or UM3X if you're looking for as much as or more bass than the MTPG provides but I doubt you'll have trouble fitting them - high-end armature IEMs from Shure and Westone have very thin nozzles. I would stick with something dynamic, though, like a JVC FX700. 
   


  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> joker.. how does the Tandem compare with the RealVoice?  I get the sense they have more than a few similarities.  I've listened to a lot of IEMs since buying the RealVoice (quite some time ago) & it remains one of my favorite universal IEMs (regardless of pricepoint).  Thanks!


 


  They do but there are some differences. IMO the Tandem is a little darker, has flat mid-bass as opposed to the elevated (and boomier) bass of the Realvoice, less coloration in the midrange, less treble sparkle (and a smoother overall response), and a larger presentation, though it's also more laid-back compared to the Realvoice. Most noticeable difference is definitely the bass - it's just not attention-grabbing (at all) in the Tandem compared to the Realvoice. The Realvoice is more 'fun' but the Tandem is definitely flatter and more refined.


----------



## joe it

Confused and frustrated. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I wanted to purchase a JVC HA-FXT90 by Rakuten (Tenso), but I failed to finish the transaction successfully. Whenever I asked for the address, I couldn't complete the fields properly not knowing Japanese.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I go on ebay and found two interesting offers, send an email with a request for information regarding shipping and after 2 days no answer. If you do not respond either to the email let alone how will the sale. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Ok, let's try with Seyo. Do a look at the prices and their evaluations. 
   
  JVC-Victor HA-FXT90-Rating in Japan: 4.25 out of 5-USD 179.00 
   
  JVC-Victor HP-FX500-Rating in Japan: 4.39 out of 5-$ 159.80 
   
  JVC-Victor-FX700-Rating in Japan:--out of 5-USD 369.80 
   
  AKG K370-Rating in Japan: 5.00 out of 5-USD 207.60. 
   
  Note: estimated delivery time for a month, possibility of ' Customs ' and more expenses. The AKG has a maximum raiting. Buying the AKG K370 price in Europe is about USD 60.00 and I get the 3 days. 
   
  is too difficult to move smoothly, recommended to me a great IEM so at least it's worth it


----------



## kiteki

Sorry to hear your complications Joe.
   
  How about Sony EX510 - http://www.amazon.it/Sony-MDREX510LPN-AE-MDR-EX510LPN-auricolare/dp/B004MPQ7VU/
   
  Audio Technica ANC23 - http://www.amazon.it/Audio-Technica-ATH-ANC23-Active-Cancelling-Headphones/dp/B004K09H32/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1323956510&sr=1-3
   
  Klipsch S4 - http://www.amazon.it/Klipsch-IMAGE-S4-Image-Auricolare/dp/B001V9LPT4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1323957501&sr=8-1
   
  I've heard the ANC23 myself (with NC off), it's performs well for the price, it sounds dolce.


----------



## lukeskymac

How much would the GR07 benefit from an amp? I've heard lots of good things from that funny-looking one that comes in an Altoids can (Cmoy, I think), especially from headfonia.com . I've heard about the ZO, and wonder if it would be a nice pair.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> How much would the GR07 benefit from an amp? I've heard lots of good things from that funny-looking one that comes in an Altoids can (Cmoy, I think), especially from headfonia.com . I've heard about the ZO, and wonder if it would be a nice pair.


 


  They would certainly help boost the bass response.
   
  I personally feel they benefit more from a good DAC as apposed to an amp.(Then again, most decent IEMs/cans do.)


----------



## kiteki

The Teclast T51 is a really good portable amplifier for $130 imho.
   
  It even has a screen.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joe it said:


> Confused and frustrated.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  The K370 sucks for that sort of money. I paid $80 for mine and I still don't feel it was worth it. The Soundmagic E30 ($40) has a somewhat similar signature with better clarity and a larger soundstage. Comparing the K370 to the FXT90 would be a travesty.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Sorry to hear your complications Joe.
> 
> How about Sony EX510 - http://www.amazon.it/Sony-MDREX510LPN-AE-MDR-EX510LPN-auricolare/dp/B004MPQ7VU/
> 
> ...


 

 Thank you kitaki,
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 but really you think are "great" IEM, at least at the level of mentioned JVC? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The K370 sucks for that sort of money. I paid $80 for mine and I still don't feel it was worth it. The Soundmagic E30 ($40) has a somewhat similar signature with better clarity and a larger soundstage. Comparing the K370 to the FXT90 would be a travesty.


 
   
   
  In fact, I have not bought it, even in a mall where he was exposed to less, some time ago.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 My  were only considerations, about how  published on the site of Seyo.

 Joker I love you (your mind and your thread) and now also for your forthrightness.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Which you feel best between JVC FX500 and HA-FXT90?

 I want to shoot for a great  IEM  (at least for me), and you have understood well what I want (in terms of taste); I'm also willing to grow up, learning from your experience.

 Finally, what would you recommend to me IEM (absolute), to grow, than I currently have?

 You tell me what should I do and I do
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I wanted to ask, if possible, also a link ' safe '; If it is not possible on the forum also in PM.
  
 Thanks again. Really polite.


----------



## lukeskymac

Maybe because it's a PMP ?


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> They would certainly help boost the bass response.
> 
> I personally feel they benefit more from a good DAC as apposed to an amp.(Then again, most decent IEMs/cans do.)


 


  Would an E11 be a nice choice then? Notice I've just burned about 32 hours into them, so I don't know if by the time the sound settles I'll still want to bump up the bass (I normally abhor unnatural bass)


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> The Teclast T51 is a really good portable amplifier for $130 imho.
> 
> It even has a screen.


 


  kiteki, I'm not sure where you are going with this, but the T51 doesnt function as a standalone amp - it has no line-in - as alluded to by lukeskymac above.
   
  FWIW, the ZO does function as an 'amp', but I haven't heard the amp-only competition at that price point. I wouldnt recommend the ZO/ZO2 to anyone who doesnt want the SmartVektor sound massaging technology, but I dont know that any of the amps around that sort of money are even remotely 'neutral' - happy to hear otherwise.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Maybe because it's a PMP ?


 


   
   Maybe because I don't know if you can put only one link in the clear on the forum and maybe because I don't have large language property  with the English language. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Because maybe it is better that I re-read the rules?


----------



## lukeskymac

Would any GR07 care to say at which hour mark should I listen to them critically? 100 hours is enough? I am currently alternating between using them whenever possible (I couldn't resist) and leaving them playing looping pink noise when I am not using them (that'd be when I'm sleeping, eating and at the bathroom 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).
   
  I think I finally understand the "absolutely flat bass" part. Even my bass-light ADDIEMs would add a (slight) midbass hump, so even thin songs would have *some* bass, but the GR07, even as of now as the high-peak "thins" the songs, is completely honest with me: if there's no bass, there's no bass. You want unnatural bass? Why don't you go on and buy a pair of Skullcandies? Maybe that ridiculously over the top model so everyone will comment on how cool you are? /random


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Would any GR07 care to say at which hour mark should I listen to them critically? 100 hours is enough? I am currently alternating between using them whenever possible (I couldn't resist) and leaving them playing looping pink noise when I am not using them (that'd be when I'm sleeping, eating and at the bathroom
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I burned mine in for 100 hours then I have been listening to them since.  I've never not heard the bass on the GR07's.  It has the perfect punch.  To me, the ADDIEM, hardly had any bass.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





joe it said:


> Maybe because I don't know if you can put only one link in the clear on the forum and maybe because I don't have large language property  with the English language.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Hm? I think a miscommunication is going on here =P That post was directed at kiteki, but I forgot to quote her =/


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> I burned mine in for 100 hours then I have been listening to them since.  I've never not heard the bass on the GR07's.  It has the perfect punch.  To me, the ADDIEM, hardly had any bass.


 


  I probably 1) need to them burn for some 70 more hours, 2) forgot how bass light the ADDIEM truly was, 3) am still confused on whatever I have a good seal. Still think it's all fault of freaking peak.
   
  Actually, I just went to iTunes and compared The Eraser with and without a curve that "peaks" downwards at 4KHz. It did sound a bit unnatural because of EQing, but it also sounded somewhat bassier. I think that's enough proof that the highs indeed thin the song out-of-the-box, as I've theorized and posted here enough times to make people sick of me


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> I probably 1) need to them burn for some 70 more hours, 2) forgot how bass light the ADDIEM truly was, 3) am still confused on whatever I have a good seal. Still think it's all fault of freaking peak.
> 
> Actually, I just went to iTunes and compared The Eraser with and without a curve that "peaks" downwards at 4KHz. It did sound a bit unnatural because of EQing, but it also sounded somewhat bassier. I think that's enough proof that the highs indeed thin the song out-of-the-box, as I've theorized and posted here enough times to make people sick of me


 


  The seal has a lot to do with GR07.  Just when I thought I had a good seal, I moved the nozzle all the way forward (from being all the way back) and everything sounded that much better.  Also, I use medium hybrids on most of my IEM's but with the GR07 and couple of others, I can either use the small or the large to get the best seal and sound.  Just keep playing and you'll find it to be one of the better sounding IEM's around.  I personally find the GR07 to rank with the top tier universals that cost twice as much.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> The seal has a lot to do with GR07.  Just when I thought I had a good seal, I moved the nozzle all the way forward (from being all the way back) and everything sounded that much better.  Also, I use medium hybrids on most of my IEM's but with the GR07 and couple of others, I can either use the small or the large to get the best seal and sound.  Just keep playing and you'll find it to be one of the better sounding IEM's around.  I personally find the GR07 to rank with the top tier universals that cost twice as much.


 

 Nah, If there's any way to increase my seal here it has go to be either foamies (which I'm not trying out until I start my critical listening) or bigger tips/triple-flanges. I've already played with the nozzle, made me afraid of breaking it: my IEMs usually last for such a short time that I am traumatized. Not that I used to buy $180 IEMs, or even IEMs that *looked* durable.


----------



## atomikn00b

any possibility of adding the brainwavz m4 to this list?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joe it said:


> Which you feel best between JVC FX500 and HA-FXT90?
> 
> I want to shoot for a great  IEM  (at least for me), and you have understood well what I want (in terms of taste); I'm also willing to grow up, learning from your experience.
> 
> Finally, what would you recommend to me IEM (absolute), to grow, than I currently have?


 
   
  I think you would like the FTX90 better than the FX500 - the FX500 will likely have too much bass, or at least not enough bass control compared to something like the Xcape IE. You may have better luck picking one up on the sale forum here and having it shipped to you via EMS than finding a store that will sell you a new one.
   
   
  Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> any possibility of adding the brainwavz m4 to this list?


 


  No plans at this time. You can see a list of all of the planned reviews on the front page of this thread.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





joe it said:


> Thank you kitaki,
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The ANC23 isn't great, but it's very dolce, and it's on amazon.it.
   
  If you're importing a high-end IEM from Japan, consider also researching perhaps the Final Audio A1, TDK BA200, Sony XBA-4.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> really? i thought he addiem has more than enough bass, as well as the superfi5. of course not as much as the klipsch senn or metrofi that ive had, but it sounds like it has the right amount. do the gr07 have "exaggarted" bass or would one call the gr07 or something like the addiems bass to be considred netrual or flat?


 

 Well, so far it does have a bit more *quantity*, the ADDIEM is bass neutral, but on the light side of neutral. What the GR07 really shines in is bass *quality*. While the ADDIEM had mostly controlled bass when the song called for it, when it had to "thump" it usually "boomed", which actually seemed to give the impression that they weren't so bass light. Being a fast dynamic, the GR07 not only captures more detail and texture than the ADDIEM, it *feels* like real bass.
   
  45 hours in, the only things that could still use some fixing are the treble peak and the way it handles loud and complex passages. It's not bad, really, but it's not much better than the ADDIEM used to handle them, and complexity handling was one of the things listed on the review as a quality of the GR07.
   
  It is extremely likely that my source is a big part of the problem. I only listen to them with my MacBook Pro or my 6th generation iPod nano (the freaking small one with a touchscreen), and between the MBP's onboard DAC/Amp and the nano's underpowered (for a headphone such as this) internals, I am thinking of buying a Fiio E7 in the next two weeks, as it is both a DAC (higher quality than the nano's I guess) and an Amp.


----------



## lamboman

Hi all,
   
  I made a new thread but I didn't realise that these types of questions were being posted in this thread!
   
  I have a budget of £150, and am wondering what are the most natural sounding headphones I can get. I have an all Linn system at home, with lively but detailed presentation. I'm ideally looking for something similar. I was looking at Ety hf3s but I'm worried that these will be too light bass wise. It is important that the overall sound signature is balanced, not bloated! If the Etys are balanced, rather than bass light, they could be perfect for me!
   
  The music will vary, a bit of jazz, acoustic, also some hip-hop (though here I do not want massive bass, I just want tight, clean, balanced presentation!
   
  Many thanks all


----------



## kiteki

This thread is discussing IEM's, not full-size headphones, but then you wrote Ety so I'm confused lol.
   
  Will you be using your IEM at home, connected to your high-end Linn system?


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> This thread is discussing IEM's, not full-size headphones, but then you wrote Ety so I'm confused lol.
> 
> Will you be using your IEM at home, connected to your high-end Linn system?


 


  Well, I'm not sure about him, but in my country everything that's in, on or around your head is "headphones". If you say "In-ear monitors" you're kind of a freak.
   
  Then again, I guess all of us head-fiers are


----------



## kiteki

For the average joe I thought there is headphones (full-size) clip-ons (they clip-on) and earphones (IEM's and earbuds).
   
  If you say IEM they think of what musicians use on stage.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> For the average joe I thought there is headphones (full-size) clip-ons (they clip-on) and earphones (IEM's and earbuds).
> 
> If you say IEM they think of what musicians use on stage.


 


  Well, everything here is "fones de ouvido" (earphones). There is no translation for "headphones". Basically no one says "clip-on" (if they did it would be in english), and although there seems to be the term "intra-auricular", the few people who know what it is about just say "in-ears". Most just call them "those earphones with rubber that you stick in your ears".


----------



## lamboman

Sorry for not being specific! The source will be my 4S, and I'm looking for IEMs. 
   
  The Linn system is mentioned as the presentation of my home setup is what I'm looking for. Anybody that is into their high end hifi will know that the Linn house sound is clean, uncoloured, most will even say clinical. I'm looking for a clean, detailed, balanced IEM. Natural sound is important, with bass having good impact without being massively overblown, but enough quantity to not seem light, just natural. The Ety's theoretically are ideal, but of course reality is very different. 
   
  I do have a slightly odd question, but how much bass, in quantity, do the Etys have in comparison to the stock iPhone headset? Really strange question, but everybody will have heard them at some point, so it surely is worth asking! 
   
  I'm certainly not new to IEMs, but I'm fed up with unbalanced, bassy IEMs - I just want something that sounds right!


----------



## kiteki

I have a feeling you're an Ortofon E-Q5 man.


----------



## Niyologist

Just ordered the VSonic GR06. My VSonic GR06 will arrive by Christmas Eve.


----------



## Niyologist

Now introducing "Air-fi" from MEELEC:
   
  http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_AF32_Air_Fi_Bluetooth_Headphone_p/hp-af32.htm


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think you would like the FTX90 better than the FX500 - the FX500 will likely have too much bass, or at least not enough bass control compared to something like the Xcape IE. You may have better luck picking one up on the sale forum here and having it shipped to you via EMS than finding a store that will sell you a new one.


 
   
  I found a seller on ebay who ships via EMS and I ordered. When it arrives I will post my impressions. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> The ANC23 isn't great, but it's very dolce, and it's on amazon.it.
> 
> If you're importing a high-end IEM from Japan, consider also researching perhaps the Final Audio A1, TDK BA200, Sony XBA-4.


 
   
  Very attracted by the Final Audio A1, I read a lot about it, I will continue, it might be the first BA who interest me.


----------



## lukeskymac

I now definitely know that I need an amp. Lowering down the volume so that detail is *just* barely hearable in an absolutely quiet background makes everything sound about as natural as I'd like. Increasing the volume by a little bit fogs the music. If that's not a sign that I need an amp, I don't know what is, because the IEMs themselves can clearly do more than that.


----------



## AstralStorm

Hello Joker,
  Do you happen to know of any dynamic+BA custom IEM? Or perhaps just dynamic, to see where they stack against multi-BA designs?


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Hello Joker,
> Do you happen to know of any dynamic+BA custom IEM? Or perhaps just dynamic, to see where they stack against multi-BA designs?


 


  UM Merlins.
   
  The Future Sonics customs also use solely a dynamic driver IIRC.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lamboman said:


> I have a budget of £150, and am wondering what are the most natural sounding headphones I can get. I have an all Linn system at home, with lively but detailed presentation. I'm ideally looking for something similar. I was looking at Ety hf3s but I'm worried that these will be too light bass wise. It is important that the overall sound signature is balanced, not bloated! If the Etys are balanced, rather than bass light, they could be perfect for me!
> 
> The music will vary, a bit of jazz, acoustic, also some hip-hop (though here I do not want massive bass, I just want tight, clean, balanced presentation!


 

 VSonic GR07, ACS T15, Brainwavz B2/Fischer DBA-02, maybe Fischer SBA-03 if you want to save a bundle. The T15 and B2/DBA-02 don't have significantly more bass than Etys but enough to be considered 'natural' when it comes to bass presence for analytical listeners. The SBA-03 and GR07 have a bit more than that, with the GR07 (with its dynamic driver) offering the most bass body and impact without any of the bloat you will find in cheap dynamic IEMs.
   


  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Hello Joker,
> Do you happen to know of any dynamic+BA custom IEM? Or perhaps just dynamic, to see where they stack against multi-BA designs?


 


  UM Merlin and the Thousand Sound TS842 are the only hybrid customs I've seen reviewed here. I think there's a Rooth hybrid model as well. Future Sonics, Earpower, Wan Xuan all have single dynamic customs. The only one I've heard is a demo of the Merlin.

 There are also a couple of hybrid universals out - at least five that I can think of.


----------



## Mini0510

joker, I heard Earsonics SM3 is very 3D. How do the Sony EX1000, Westone 4 and FX700 compare?
   
   
  Can you compare:
   
  the treble presence and which one has a more extended treble
   
  mids details (I actually dont mind since Im even ok with V-shape)
   
  bass quantity and quality
   
  presentation: which one is more 3D? people say that EX1000 doesn't have a "intimate presentation" and is not like FX700? is that a bad thing?


----------



## lamboman

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> VSonic GR07, ACS T15, Brainwavz B2/Fischer DBA-02, maybe Fischer SBA-03 if you want to save a bundle. The T15 and B2/DBA-02 don't have significantly more bass than Etys but enough to be considered 'natural' when it comes to bass presence for analytical listeners. The SBA-03 and GR07 have a bit more than that, with the GR07 (with its dynamic driver) offering the most bass body and impact without any of the bloat you will find in cheap dynamic IEMs.


 


  Thanks for your reply joker! I have actually bought some hf3s just to see what they are like, seeing as I can of course take them back. I'm looking for something that has more impactful bass and slightly more recessed mids in comparison to them. Do your recommendations still stand? Many thanks!


----------



## i2ehan

Just received my first ever official customs, the UM Miracle! I wish to thank you again for an excellent write-up, |joker|. I must admit, however, their presentation is unlike any other universal I've owned, and is extremely new and strange to my ears; strange in a good sense, however. I'm just not used to anything like this. I have nothing but absolute praise for the fellas at UM, they nailed the fit right town to a tee.


----------



## lukeskymac

ljokerl and owners of the GR07, how big would be the difference in sound between a GR07 in an iPod nano and with the Fiio E7 (using the line out from the nano)? For those unfamiliar, the E7 has both an amp and a Wolfson Audio DAC.
   
  Also, I have about 70 hours of GR07 use. Sibilance is almost a non-issue at this point, but are imaging/soundstage still going improve for the next 70? I feel that all I really need is imaging in complex passages, and extra soundstage would probably help create "islands of air" for the instruments to sit on.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, I heard Earsonics SM3 is very 3D. How do the Sony EX1000, Westone 4 and FX700 compare?
> 
> 
> Can you compare:
> ...


 

 Aside from customs the SM3 has the most coherent central imaging I've heard. The EX1000 probably has the least (of the top-shelf in-ears). It sounds more like a headphone in that respect. Note that this is not necessarily a bad thing - I'm sure some would prefer, or even be wowed by this sort of presentation from an in-ear. The W4 and FX700 are somewhere in between. i would give the W4 the nod in imaging and FX700 in soundstage size. Both are very good compromises, though.

 The EX1000 and FX700 have prominent treble, esp. lower treble. Of the two I would give the nod to the EX1000 in both quantity and smoothness. The W4 is more balanced and the SM3 is more relaxed. You'd have to compare them side by side in treble extension to know for sure - all do pretty good but the SM3 has relaxed treble in the first place so the roll-off it has compounds very quickly.

 Detail is high on all of them. Armatures tend to have a dryer note presentation and can resolve a tiny bit better but these two dynamics are very good - I doubt you'll be missing any detail with any of the four.

 The FX700 would have the most bass by a margin. EX1000 and SM3 would come second and the W4 would be the most balanced. The EX1000 has, IMO, the best quality bass of all the dynamics I've heard. The SM3 and W4 have very good armature bass, with the SM3 being fuller and warmer. The bass of the FX700 is difficult to compare to the others since there's much more of it. It is very good quality in its own right, though.

  
   


  Quote: 





lamboman said:


> Thanks for your reply joker! I have actually bought some hf3s just to see what they are like, seeing as I can of course take them back. I'm looking for something that has more impactful bass and slightly more recessed mids in comparison to them. Do your recommendations still stand? Many thanks!


 


  The GR07, then. SBA-03 has very aggressive mids (more so than Etys) and the T15 and B2/DBA-02 are just a present as Etys in the midrange, albeit with slightly more bass.



  
  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Just received my first ever official customs, the UM Miracle! I wish to thank you again for an excellent write-up, |joker|. I must admit, however, their presentation is unlike any other universal I've owned, and is extremely new and strange to my ears; strange in a good sense, however. I'm just not used to anything like this. I have nothing but absolute praise for the fellas at UM, they nailed the fit right town to a tee.


 

 I'm always reminded most of the SM3's presentation but of course the Miracle has a larger stage and differs quite a ways in other respects. I found A:Bing the Miracle with the EX1000 bothered me because the presentations are so different. Glad the fit is good - re-shells are a pain.


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> ljokerl and owners of the GR07, how big would be the difference in sound between a GR07 in an iPod nano and with the Fiio E7 (using the line out from the nano)? For those unfamiliar, the E7 has both an amp and a Wolfson Audio DAC.
> 
> Also, I have about 70 hours of GR07 use. Sibilance is almost a non-issue at this point, but are imaging/soundstage still going improve for the next 70? I feel that all I really need is imaging in complex passages, and extra soundstage would probably help create "islands of air" for the instruments to sit on.


 


  For the latter, Imaging will improve more towards the 170 hour mark or before. I haven't noticed any changes in soundstage


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Aside from customs the SM3 has the most coherent central imaging I've heard. The EX1000 probably has the least (of the top-shelf in-ears). It sounds more like a headphone in that respect. Note that this is not necessarily a bad thing - I'm sure some would prefer, or even be wowed by this sort of presentation from an in-ear. The W4 and FX700 are somewhere in between. i would give the W4 the nod in imaging and FX700 in soundstage size. Both are very good compromises, though.
> 
> The EX1000 and FX700 have prominent treble, esp. lower treble. Of the two I would give the nod to the EX1000 in both quantity and smoothness. The W4 is more balanced and the SM3 is more relaxed. You'd have to compare them side by side in treble extension to know for sure - all do pretty good but the SM3 has relaxed treble in the first place so the roll-off it has compounds very quickly.
> 
> ...


 

 1. So EX1000 is not 3D?
  in terms of 3D presentation, s FX700 > EX1000? only by a very slight margin right?
   
  2. and which one has the best musical instrument separation?
   
  3. comparison with the Klipsch S4, totally quantity wise, because they are not in the same class.
  I would like slightly less or equal treble presence compared to the S4. which of the two(EX1000 and FX700) does that?
   
   
  4. I think I should go with FX700 since I mainly listen to punk rock. But its poor isolation. I going to be travelling on the bus everyday.
  Im definitely pleased with Monster Turbine Copper's isolation. Im ok with Sony EX300's isolation.
  Is there any ear tips I can use to help isolation? Or maybe an universal iem that is equally as good that can replace FX700?
   
  5. is there is less marginal difference between FX700 sound quality (sound signature aside) and UM Miracle than between Klipsch S4 and Monster Turbine copper?
  I can hear that the S4 texture on every instrument is much less than Copper - bass, treble, everything.
   
  thanks


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> For the latter, Imaging will improve more towards the 170 hour mark or before. I haven't noticed any changes in soundstage


 


  Oooh, glad to hear it. I don't really care _that_ much for soundstage, but usually it helps with imaging.


----------



## The Neverhood

Joker,
   
  I really love the RE262, and until of late was entirely satisfied to the extent of not buying another IEM. Unfortunately the cable has now broken and have only been used for around month. I'm doubting how long the next pair will last, so considering other alternatives.
   
  What would be the closest alternative to the RE262? The CK100, SM3 and UM3X seem the most appropriate?


----------



## BbOO

After carefully reading this thread, i think i am going to get a set of Braniwavz M2 (allthough i am also considering M4 as it seems to be almost similarly priced). I just would like some more opinions based on the following issues:
   
  - I listen to electronic music 80% time, so will this set be good for such music?
  - I also prefer natural sound, natural bass, clarity and detail.
  - Most of my music is played through iPhone 3GS and my dell D630.
  - All my music is in quality MP3 format (V0 and 320), and in FLAC.
  - Lastly, i am thinking of buying a Fiio E6 + Fiio L9 LOD to combined it with M2s.
   
  Do you think this combination will be good considering all the above mentioned things? If not, what else would you suggest that does not go over 80-90 euros in total?


----------



## kiteki

If you have an iPhone 3GS and you're looking for an IEM, you don't _need_ a portable amplifier on top of that.
   
  If you can spend 90 euros, pick up a UE700 they are on sale $99 USD now amazon.com, they are good with electro music.


----------



## BbOO

^ Thanks for your reply! I thought i saw many people using ipod touches/iphones with amplifiers in this thread (this link shows just one of them):
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/552014/pictures-of-your-portable-rig-part-xv/2685#post_7956189


----------



## olear

Hi joker, do you know when the FXT90 review will be posted? I couldn't wait so I'm expecting one this week.
  Also, is the Tandem a good substitute for one of the MTP?
   
  Which phone is more midcentric and similar SQ as TF10?
  Thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> 1. So EX1000 is not 3D?
> in terms of 3D presentation, s FX700 > EX1000? only by a very slight margin right?
> 
> 2. and which one has the best musical instrument separation?
> ...


 

 I think there's a fair margin between the EX1000 and FX700 in presentation. Both have good separation and slightly less treble presence than an S4. FX700 response is probably closer to that of the S4. The isolation will be bad no matter the tips - they are open-back earphones. Marginal returns are smaller between the FX700 and a Miracle than the S4 and any top-tier IEM.
   


  Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> Joker,
> 
> I really love the RE262, and until of late was entirely satisfied to the extent of not buying another IEM. Unfortunately the cable has now broken and have only been used for around month. I'm doubting how long the next pair will last, so considering other alternatives.
> 
> What would be the closest alternative to the RE262? The CK100, SM3 and UM3X seem the most appropriate?


 

 That depends on what you would want different from the RE262 in your next pair. If the answer is nothing, you're better off spending just the $150 and getting another one.
   


  Quote: 





bboo said:


> After carefully reading this thread, i think i am going to get a set of Braniwavz M2 (allthough i am also considering M4 as it seems to be almost similarly priced). I just would like some more opinions based on the following issues:
> 
> - I listen to electronic music 80% time, so will this set be good for such music?
> - I also prefer natural sound, natural bass, clarity and detail.
> ...


 


  There no need to amp the M2. In this price range you are much better off putting all of the money towards an earphone than buying a toy from Fiio. For 80-90 Eur you could get a HiSound Crystal instead of the M2, or an ECCI PR401 which IMO has a more suitable signature for electronica than the M2 despite not being much better technically.

   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Hi joker, do you know when the FXT90 review will be posted? I couldn't wait so I'm expecting one this week.
> Also, is the Tandem a good substitute for one of the MTP?
> 
> Which phone is more midcentric and similar SQ as TF10?
> Thank you


 


  No
   
  Yes
   
  You've asked that like four times already. My opinion has not changed this week.


----------



## Niyologist

How's the VSonic GR06 Sound Signature? I would like a tad bit of a preview before I receive it next Saturday (Christmas Eve).


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think there's a fair margin between the EX1000 and FX700 in presentation. Both have good separation and slightly less treble presence than an S4. FX700 response is probably closer to that of the S4. The isolation will be bad no matter the tips - they are open-back earphones. Marginal returns are smaller between the FX700 and a Miracle than the S4 and any top-tier IEM.


 
   

  can you compare Miracle with FX700?
   
  bass quality.
  treble quality
  mids quality
  Presentation - 3D
   
  which areas does the Miracle do better than FX700 sound quality wise, quantity aside and everything else aside?
   
   
  because when I heard S4, I feel the Copper's quality of the sound is better in all areas. And thats without comparing them side by side because my copper's right ear is not working anymore.
  For the difference in sound quality between FX700 and Miracle, from your experiences, do you have to compare them side by side to hear the difference? or you will remember in your memories that the Miracle is better in almost every way.


----------



## kkl10

ljokerl, how can you keep your cool temper with all this annoying people always screwing up your head with "I want to know this", "can you tell me that", etc, etc,.....
   
  SHEEEEEEEEEEZZZZ!! SCREW THEM!! 
   
  Help me here buddy: 
   
  Meelectronics CC51
  Brainwanz M3
  Sunrise IE
  Sunrise Xcited
  RE-ZERO
  Fischer Audio Silver Bullet
Phiaton PS210
  Phiaton PS20
  Soundmagic E30
  Spider Realvoice
  Xears X200Pro
  Xears XR120Pro
   
  Which one of these do you consider to produce the most *natural*, *realistic* and *all arounder* performance, sound wise?
   
  Or, alternatively, which one of these has greater similarities to the GR07's all around sonic performance and balance/presentation/signature?
  If there is some other sub 100$ IEM you think I should consider do tell... I prefer dynamics though...
   
*I do value flat FR with the least peaks as possible*...
*I do value neutrality and transparency from an uncolored sound*... can be colored but just slightly...
*I absolutelly hate prominent peaks in the upper mids/lower treble* like I found on the GR07 out of the box...
   
  Take your time!
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





kkl10 said:


> ljokerl, how can you keep your cool temper with all this annoying people always screwing up your head with "I want to know this", "can you tell me that", etc, etc,.....
> 
> SHEEEEEEEEEEZZZZ!! SCREW THEM!!
> 
> ...


 

       The RE-ZERO is definitely out of the question. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
        The Brainwavz M3 has good Neutral reputation for a Sub $100 IEM and the Brainwavz M4 does as well.


----------



## BbOO

Quote: 





> There no need to amp the M2. In this price range you are much better off putting all of the money towards an earphone than buying a toy from Fiio. For 80-90 Eur you could get a HiSound Crystal instead of the M2, or an ECCI PR401 which IMO has a more suitable signature for electronica than the M2 despite not being much better technically.


 
  So i don't get it; do i not need an amp because i play music through 3gs or because i will be using brainwavez M2, or...? Does it have to do with headphone type? Music quality? Music player?
  When do i need an amp and when will i not need it?


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *BbOO* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> .
> So i don't get it; do i not need an amp because i play music through 3gs or because i will be using brainwavez M2, or...? Does it have to do with headphone type? Music quality? Music player?
> When do i need an amp and when will i not need it?


 

 Portable amplifiers are a bit of a myth.
   
  Look, here is a cheap DAP driving an LCD-3 at high volume, another user said it drives his HE-500 with full detail, soundstage and resolution.
   


Spoiler: LCD-3










   

 At lot of people come to head-fi looking for the cheapest IEM's possible, and then they buy a $100 portable amplifier, that doesn't make sense.
   
  If you spend an extra $100 on an IEM, you get a _significant _return in sound quality. Your iPhone 3GS will drive 95%+ of IEM's fine, spend all of your money on the IEM.  If you want to improve the sound-quality further, then you have to improve the source, like the actual sound-card, the DAC section, not only amplify your current source.
   
  Imho.


----------



## RapidPulse

I recently picked up the Monster Miles Davis Tributes during a recent Amazon lightning deal (got caught up in the moment 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).
  I really had no intention of keeping them as I also just got the GR07...but I am really liking the way these sound, especially with acoustic music (and jazz, of course).  Really warm, full, and sweet but still has some sparkle and detail up top.  The only issue I have is that the bass can be a bit too strong for my liking at times. 
   
  Can anyone provide me some ideas for an IEM with a similar sound signature to the MDTs...just with more neutral bass?
  The RE262 maybe?  the Coppers?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





rapidpulse said:


> I recently picked up the Monster Miles Davis Tributes during a recent Amazon lightning deal (got caught up in the moment
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Non of the Monster line up have neutral bass. They are for bass heavy in my opinion. probably RE262 or RE272, well its actually neutral all around, not just the bass.


----------



## kkl10

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The RE-ZERO is definitely out of the question.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thank you for the enlightment Your Highness!
  I shall take your word as golden truth!


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Portable amplifiers are a bit of a myth.
> 
> Look, here is a cheap DAP driving an LCD-3 at high volume, another user said it drives his HE-500 with full detail, soundstage and resolution.


 
   
  If that is the case, why do Ray Samuels, Justin Wilson and others even bother making *desktop* amps ? 'full detail, soundstage and resolution' *compared to what ??*  kiteki, I think you need a Bex and a good lie down - you know as well as I do that its not simply about volume, but if you honestly think said 'user' wouldn't peel back layers he didn't know even _existed _with a better amp, then it might be time to take a break. One of the reasons professional reviewers trot out their big-dollar reference gear when giving subjective impressions is that they need to have a baseline for comparison, and that baseline is usually about power - neither the LCD-3 nor the HE-500 are notoriously difficult to drive compared to other planar magnetic phones, and the fact that they can be played loud from a DAP doesnt surprise me. There is a review floating around from the early release days of the HD800 where some bozo from a gadget website auditioned them with an iPhone and complained that he couldn't use them portably - he probably thought he had heard everything those phones were capable of.
   
  We ascribe a lot of magical powers to headphone amplifiers, and I'm all for using a single device instead of a 'brick', but when Joker tells me that a given pair of IEMs benefits from additional amping, I believe him. I do agree that it makes more sense to spend that extra $100 on a better pair of IEMs (or put it toward a better DAP..), but dismissing portable amps entirely is short-sighted.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *RealSlimSeto* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> UM Merlins.
> 
> The Future Sonics customs also use solely a dynamic driver IIRC.


 
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> UM Merlin and the Thousand Sound TS842 are the only hybrid customs I've seen reviewed here. I think there's a Rooth hybrid model as well. Future Sonics, Earpower, Wan Xuan all have single dynamic customs. The only one I've heard is a demo of the Merlin.
> 
> There are also a couple of hybrid universals out - at least five that I can think of.


 

 Hmm. I suspect the Merlin has some bass boost - but from the charts it looks a bit high frequency kneed. I'm also afraid of the ~7k peak after what VSonic GR07 OOTB experience was. It looks substantial. Pity it will be nigh impossible to get a listen of these in Poland...
  Could you compare their sibilance if any to VSonics? Detailing vs RE272?
   
  Am I right to assume that FutureSonics customs would have a similar sound signature to new Atrios? That'd be good, but could use high end extension and BA high end detail...
   
  Does Thousand Sound have higher end models with better highest end extension and less 3.5k cut?
  I can't read the Chinese well enough, but the graphs do seem quite interesting: http://bbs.erji.com/read.php?tid=520827
  It looks like it's slightly recessed in ~3.5k, but no sibilance and great extension.
   
  What would those hybrid universals be?


----------



## Kejd

Hi Joker
  Does W4 have more forward vocal than W3? or is it more laid back?


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





olear said:


> Hi joker, do you know when the FXT90 review will be posted? I couldn't wait so I'm expecting one this week.
> Also, is the Tandem a good substitute for one of the MTP?
> 
> Which phone is more midcentric and similar SQ as TF10?
> Thank you


 

  
  Lol I noticed you have been asking similar questions(including PMs) since like a month ago. Why not just get the FXT90 and be done with it?


----------



## Infinity03

First off, thank you very much for writing such a detailed review of so many IEM's.  I am a total newbie to IEMs and as such am not really sure what would be a good choice for my first pair.  I wouldn't consider myself an audiophile, but I do like getting the best sounding equipment that is within my budget.  There is much talk about warm, neutral, smooth, bright sounding, etc when it comes to reviews and I honestly don't know exactly what the difference is.  About 15 years ago I auditioned several speakers from various brands and finally decided on a pair of Energy Connoisseur C-2's that I still have (and love) to this day.  I seem to remember reading or being told that these are neutral speakers, but I don't know for certain.  Also for the past 10 years or so I have used a pair of Koss PortaPro headphones for traveling, but their open design doesn't make these very useful for places with a lot of noise (airplanes, trains, etc).  Prior to the Koss Porta Pros I briefly had a pair of Sennheiser PX-200 which I exchanged for the Koss Porta Pros (and was much happier with).  I mention all this in hopes it will give some of the more experience headphone gurus here a better idea of what type of "sound" I like, as I don't know.  I am not sure if it matters, but as to what type of music I listen to it pretty much encompasses everything except rap and r&b.  Mostly I listen to classic rock, prog rock and on occasion country and classical.
   
  All that being said, what would be a good first IEM for myself?  I'd like to keep the price under $50.  My main concern is comfort (especially being new to IEM's), followed by sound quality, and then microphonics.  I was thinking about either the Meelec CW31 or the M21, both of which are on Amazon for under $30 and had good reviews here.  Again I am grateful for all these reviews and all the other reviews/opinions from others on here.  However, I must admit I was a bit overwhelmed with the amount of choices out there.


----------



## logwed

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> If that is the case, why do Ray Samuels, Justin Wilson and others even bother making *desktop* amps ? 'full detail, soundstage and resolution' *compared to what ??*  kiteki, I think you need a Bex and a good lie down - you know as well as I do that its not simply about volume, but if you honestly think said 'user' wouldn't peel back layers he didn't know even _existed _with a better amp, then it might be time to take a break.


 

 Because they can make money with them, assuming that we're still talking about the worth of portable amplifiers. Why did you jump to desktop amplifiers?


----------



## kiteki

There was a thread once where someone made a new account and asked "I have some serious cash to drop, what's the best portable rig for $1000?"
   
  One of the answers was Clip+ with JH13, they all laughed at him, and I was skeptical too, but today I see he was pretty much correct!


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





logwed said:


> Because they can make money with them, assuming that we're still talking about the worth of portable amplifiers. Why did you jump to desktop amplifiers?


 

 Reread Kiteki's post, particularly the part about soundstage etc on the HE-500. Would you even bother with a desktop amp if you thought you were getting everything out of your cans straight from your source.
   
  I have absolutely no argument with the 'Clip+ straight into IEMs' argument, but that isnt what we are discussing here. Some headphones, even IEMs, do benefit from additional amplification : whether that benefit justifies the dollars involved is another issue. Dismissing portable amps purely on the basis that most IEMs don't require an amp to sound good is akin to dismissing V8 engines because the Japanese make some very fast and nimble 4-cylinder cars.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## logwed

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *estreeter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Reread Kiteki's post, particularly the part about soundstage etc on the HE-500. Would you even bother with a desktop amp if you thought you were getting everything out of your cans straight from your source.


 


  Kiteki made no accusations that full size headphone amplifiers do nothing, simply that the benefit/dollar ratio of portable amps is extremely high, and the money is better spent on headphone or source upgrades.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> whether that benefit justifies the dollars involved is another issue.


 

 No. That is the issue at hand.
  
  I see dozens of people with $750 iPhones asking about $75 IEM's and $100 amplifiers.
   
    
  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> 'full detail, soundstage and resolution' *compared to what ??*


 
   
  How about compared to a HM-801?  Actually, I don't think adding a $300 portable amp to the X19HD will peel layers and explode rainbows like you're saying here...


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





logwed said:


> Kiteki made no accusations that full size headphone amplifiers do nothing, simply that the benefit/dollar ratio of portable amps is extremely high, and the money is better spent on headphone or source upgrades.


 


  Er, no - she referred to portable amps as a 'myth', although I do agree that in most cases the second part of your assertion is correct.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Does Thousand Sound have higher end models with better highest end extension and less 3.5k cut?
> I can't read the Chinese well enough, but the graphs do seem quite interesting: http://bbs.erji.com/read.php?tid=520827
> It looks like it's slightly recessed in ~3.5k, but no sibilance and great extension.


 

 Ask here - http://www.head-fi.org/t/553516/thousand-sound-ts842-review-appreciation-500-hybrid-custom-iem


----------



## olear

kiteki, I'm interested in RE262 which is one of those iem that really need an amp.
   
  What other iem offers same clarity and detail as TF10, basicaly very similar to SQ, but is midcentric instead of a V shape and doesn't require an amp?
  FX700, one of the Westones, EX1000 or ?


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


olear said:


> kiteki, I'm interested in RE262 which is one of those iem that really need an amp.
> 
> What other iem offers same clarity and detail as TF10, basicaly very similar to SQ, but is midcentric instead of a V shape and doesn't require an amp?
> FX700, one of the Westones, EX1000 or ?


 

 If I may, the FX700 isn't midcentric, not now, not ever; nor are the Westones (W3 & W4), though the W4 does have excellent midrange presence, and may even be considered borderline midcentric by some. The EX1000 is balanced, all around, whereas the BA100, RE262, SM3, and much of the Shures are midcentric. Refer to ClieOS' excellent comparison thread, and you'll find a list of specifically midcentric IEM's highlighted, found listed in *green*.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


olear said:


> kiteki, I'm interested in RE262 which is one of those iem that* really need an amp.*
> 
> What other iem offers *same clarity and detail *as TF10, basicaly *very similar to SQ*, but is *midcentric* instead of a V shape and doesn't require an amp?
> FX700, one of the Westones, EX1000 or ?
> ...


 

 You want the same high-end as the TF10 with more bass impact and a mid-forward signature.
   
  You can afford three mid-tiers (approx $425?), Lol what am I supposed to say? I think you should reshell your TF10 with Unique Melody with extra drivers (starting at ~$330 - http://www.uniquemelody.com.au/lineup/reshell/), or buy the Thousand Sound TS842.
   
  The reason I say TS842 is because it has the ER-4 driver, which is the only IEM I thought has the same high-end as the TF10 from my brief listening...
   
  As for the "really need an amp" comment, I just linked to a video where a $37 Chinese pos can drive a full-size HP to ear-piercing volumes, the RE262 doesn't need an amp, unless - let me guess - you are using an iPhone!


----------



## dogears

Reality check: you really have to buy to try and discover/find the best sounding IEMs for yourself. Asking and getting replies based on impression and comparison (you need to know at least one IEM in the comparison to gauge what is being described) --- then purchasing based on recommendation --- is just THE START to this expensive hobby


----------



## logwed

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Er, no - *she* referred to portable amps as a 'myth', although I do agree that in most cases the second part of your assertion is correct.


 

 LOL.


----------



## TTker

very helpful in finding good IEM. Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kkl10 said:


> Meelectronics CC51
> Brainwanz M3
> Sunrise IE
> Sunrise Xcited
> ...


 

 I would go with the RE-ZERO. It's not exactly laid back in the upper mids/lower treble but it's not peaky. Not recommending Sunrise at the moment due to build quality issues.
   


  Quote: 





rapidpulse said:


> Can anyone provide me some ideas for an IEM with a similar sound signature to the MDTs...just with more neutral bass?
> The RE262 maybe?  the Coppers?
> 
> Thanks!


 

 The bass of the MTP Golds is more relaxed than that of the MDT but still emphasized over flat. You may also like the Radius DDM2.
   


  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Hmm. I suspect the Merlin has some bass boost - but from the charts it looks a bit high frequency kneed. I'm also afraid of the ~7k peak after what VSonic GR07 OOTB experience was. It looks substantial. Pity it will be nigh impossible to get a listen of these in Poland...
> Could you compare their sibilance if any to VSonics? Detailing vs RE272?
> 
> What would those hybrid universals be?


 

 Merlin treble curve should be similar to my Miracle. The Miracle treble looks daunting on graphs but it is not sibilant at all in reality. Graphs are only comparable when done on the same equipment with the same compensation (if any). I believe average_joe's Rooth LS8 has even peakier-looking treble on the graph (likely done on similar equipment to merlin/miracle graphs) but from his review the in-ear response is rather smooth and well-measured. Detail-wise the RE272 keeps up with my customs reasonably well in the treble and to a lesser extent the midrange. Where it falls most flat is bass response and presentation.
   
  Hybrid universals that I can think of - UE SuperFi 5 EB, AKG K3003, Scosche IEM856, Atomic Floyd SuperDartts, and Audiofly AF78


  Quote: 





kejd said:


> Hi Joker
> Does W4 have more forward vocal than W3? or is it more laid back?


 

 The vocals are more balanced with the bass and treble in the W4 while the earphone overall is a bit more laid-back. On balance I would say more forward, but not by much.
   


  Quote: 





infinity03 said:


> First off, thank you very much for writing such a detailed review of so many IEM's.  I am a total newbie to IEMs and as such am not really sure what would be a good choice for my first pair.  I wouldn't consider myself an audiophile, but I do like getting the best sounding equipment that is within my budget.  There is much talk about warm, neutral, smooth, bright sounding, etc when it comes to reviews and I honestly don't know exactly what the difference is.  About 15 years ago I auditioned several speakers from various brands and finally decided on a pair of Energy Connoisseur C-2's that I still have (and love) to this day.  I seem to remember reading or being told that these are neutral speakers, but I don't know for certain.  Also for the past 10 years or so I have used a pair of Koss PortaPro headphones for traveling, but their open design doesn't make these very useful for places with a lot of noise (airplanes, trains, etc).  Prior to the Koss Porta Pros I briefly had a pair of Sennheiser PX-200 which I exchanged for the Koss Porta Pros (and was much happier with).  I mention all this in hopes it will give some of the more experience headphone gurus here a better idea of what type of "sound" I like, as I don't know.  I am not sure if it matters, but as to what type of music I listen to it pretty much encompasses everything except rap and r&b.  Mostly I listen to classic rock, prog rock and on occasion country and classical.
> 
> All that being said, what would be a good first IEM for myself?  I'd like to keep the price under $50.  My main concern is comfort (especially being new to IEM's), followed by sound quality, and then microphonics.  I was thinking about either the Meelec CW31 or the M21, both of which are on Amazon for under $30 and had good reviews here.  Again I am grateful for all these reviews and all the other reviews/opinions from others on here.  However, I must admit I was a bit overwhelmed with the amount of choices out there.


 

 The CW31 is a good option but I think you can also grab the Brainwavz M1 on amazon for a more refined - albeit slightly less bassy - sound. The Soundmagic E30 and Dunu Trident would round out my recommendations in that price bracket. Trident would be most similar to the PortaPros in balance. The M1 is more midrange-focused while the E30 and CW31 are balanced with slight bass emphasis and a more 'open' feel. I think all should be beginner-friendly in comfort but the CW31 and M1 are easiest to fit.

  
  Quote: 





ttker said:


> very helpful in finding good IEM. Thanks


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Reread Kiteki's post, particularly the part about soundstage etc on the HE-500. Would you even bother with a desktop amp if you thought you were getting everything out of your cans straight from your source.
> 
> I have absolutely no argument with the 'Clip+ straight into IEMs' argument, but that isnt what we are discussing here. Some headphones, even IEMs, do benefit from additional amplification : whether that benefit justifies the dollars involved is another issue. Dismissing portable amps purely on the basis that most IEMs don't require an amp to sound good is akin to dismissing V8 engines because the Japanese make some very fast and nimble 4-cylinder cars.


 

 X2
   


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> why would you even need an amp for a iem? i looked the ones iv had were are like 13, 16 29 etc..low ohms.. and alsosuper sensitive
> 
> i just bought my first pair of cans an akg240s..not getting them till christmas though. hoping they will sound even better than the ue600..but they are 55ohms and like 91 db sensitive..im worried
> 
> ...


 


  I was skeptical too until I tried it. A few weeks ago I purchased the Klipsh X10 on sale from Amazon and when I first heard them on my iPod I thought they sounded OK but thought they were lacking in sound for a IEM whose MSRP on some sites is 350 bones and above. The highs were lacking (they sounded dark) and I found the mid range for a lack of a better word rather disjointed. It felt almost like the mids were an after thought when being tuned and just wasn't tying the low and high end together properly. Add to the fact that the sound stage felt small which surprised me because enough people were running around saying the sound stage was only slightly smaller to the TF10 which is known for having a good sized sound stage. The sound felt boxed in and 2D. Anyways last night I was bored and decided for the heck of it to hook up my X10's to Marilyn and see what happened. Usually I use Marilyn for my DT1350's and my Grado SR60's I find she really cleans the general sound signature up nicely and gives some nice added definition here and there. When I started listening to my X10's through Marilyn my jaw just about dropped. The highs were no longer smooth and polite they were now well defined and very much were as prominent as the bass. The next thing i noticed was the mids had smoothed out and was now far more cohesive sounding. The biggest difference though was the sound stage, it was now huge compared to how it was on my iPod and not only that but the feeling was very 3D like. In short it was a completely different IEM. 
   
  Feeling rather excited I then mated Marilyn to my Coppers and again I was surprised. The Coppers are little bass cannons and from my iPod the bass can be quite boomy but when amped they now reached down further and the bass now hit hard without leeching into the mids. The detail was also very slightly improved and I found I could pick out instruments better and songs now had an added level of layering. In a nutshell I guess what I'm describing is the Coppers now had more depth. They didn't scale up as much as the X10's but they did scale up. From there I then hooked up my Sony MDR EX600's and then my UE700's. Both the 600 and 700's treble now was more detailed and felt far more airy. This was quite noticeable on the UE700 the 600 although not as much still showed improvement. The sound stage on the 600 also expanded slightly and again being able to pick out instrument positioning became easier plus that layered almost 3D like effect was also improved. The UE 700 the improvement was more in it's treble and I didn't notice any improvement in sound stage although bass may have been slightly deeper. Not to sure though I'll have to give it some more listening time to make up my mind. The last IEM's I tried were my cheapo Klipsh S4's and they were the only ones I could honestly say didn't improve substantially from amping. They sounded pretty much the same on Marilyn as they did on my iPod.
   
  If you doubt me and think I'm crazy and living in my own placebo induced dream land well whether I am or not is easy to prove. Get yourself some of the IEM's I mentioned and a mobile amp of your choice and see for yourself if they scale up or not. Just because some IEM's don't scale up doesn't mean none of them will. Do some experimenting you may all be nicely surprised at the end results.


----------



## olear

kiteki said:


> You want the same high-end as the TF10 with more bass impact and a mid-forward signature.
> 
> You can afford three mid-tiers (approx $425?), Lol what am I supposed to say? I think you should reshell your TF10 with Unique Melody with extra drivers (starting at ~$330 - http://www.uniquemelody.com.au/lineup/reshell/), or buy the Thousand Sound TS842.
> 
> ...




iPhone


----------



## olear

kiteki said:


> You want the same high-end as the TF10 with more bass impact and a mid-forward signature.
> 
> You can afford three mid-tiers (approx $425?), Lol what am I supposed to say? I think you should reshell your TF10 with Unique Melody with extra drivers (starting at ~$330 - http://www.uniquemelody.com.au/lineup/reshell/), or buy the Thousand Sound TS842.
> 
> ...




iPhone


----------



## kiteki

I'm just trying to help the new fish and be informative, in my limited experience I find expensive portable amplifiers and cables very sugar-coated.
   
  In my example of the LCD-3, the DAP used is 9 times cheaper than an iPod Touch, and has 9 times higher output, so your Apple cMoy story is pretty iffy.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


olear said:


> iPhone


 
   
  Let me narrow this down for you, buy a Clip Zip and the Sony EX800ST (MDR-7550).  That is my advice for you.  As Nike say... "Just Do It".


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## lukeskymac

Garh, I'm extremely frustated with my GR07's right now. "Natural" and "Dynamic" simply don't come to mind when I'm listening to them in any track that has more than one vocal and two backing instruments. I don't know whether it's a fit issue, break-in issue (they have been burning for some 120 hours now), but it sounds awful when playing The Suburbs (the entire frickin album). Sure, I am getting a bit more detail here and there, but it's mostly messy considering how highly these are rated and how much more they cost compared to the ADDIEMs (which actually sounded more DYNAMIC than the GR07 in certain parts of some songs). If this all is just a fit issue I'll have to buy huge tri-flange tips, because the included bi-flanges are the same thing as the big flanges (that is, small).
   
  Fit issue or not, unless *something* changes, I'll swear off IEMs and stick to super-aural, open-backed headphones. Maybe I should've have gone with Senns HD595s...
   
  Can someone please tell me WTH is going on here? I listen everything in 256 kbps AAC in my MBP and nano.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





logwed said:


> LOL.


 

 kiteki has assumed the persona of an Asian female for Head-Fi : I thought it proper to refer to said persona as 'she'. Given that ships don't even *have* a sex, I don't have a problem conferring personal pronouns on board members of indeterminate sex - I normally opt for 'he' but in this case 'she' seemed more appropriate. Those who have visited Thailand will know that there is a third sex, but I'm not even going to go there. Whatever the specifics of the board member punching the keyboard when 'kiteki' logs in, this is a female character just as it would be in a RPG or any virtual world I can think of.


----------



## logwed

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *estreeter* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> kiteki has assumed the persona of an Asian female for Head-Fi : I thought it proper to refer to said persona as 'she'. *Given that ships don't even have a sex,* I don't have a problem conferring personal pronouns on board members of* indeterminate sex *- I normally opt for 'he' but in this case 'she' seemed more appropriate. Those who have visited Thailand will know that there is a third sex, but I'm not even going to go there. Whatever the specifics of the board member punching the keyboard when 'kiteki' logs in, this is a female character just *as it would be in a RPG or any virtual world I can think of.*


 
   
*Straw man.*
   
*LOL*


----------



## maverickronin

I didn't know head-fi was a roleplaying community...


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Garh, I'm extremely frustated with my GR07's right now. "Natural" and "Dynamic" simply don't come to mind when I'm listening to them in any track that has more than one vocal and two backing instruments. I don't know whether it's a fit issue, break-in issue (they have been burning for some 120 hours now), but it sounds awful when playing The Suburbs (the entire frickin album). Sure, I am getting a bit more detail here and there, but it's mostly messy considering how highly these are rated and how much more they cost compared to the ADDIEMs (which actually sounded more DYNAMIC than the GR07 in certain parts of some songs). If this all is just a fit issue I'll have to buy huge tri-flange tips, because the included bi-flanges are the same thing as the big flanges (that is, small).
> 
> Fit issue or not, unless *something* changes, I'll swear off IEMs and stick to super-aural, open-backed headphones. Maybe I should've have gone with Senns HD595s...
> 
> Can someone please tell me WTH is going on here? I listen everything in 256 kbps AAC in my MBP and nano.


 

 I'm actually really surprised to hear that. The Suburbs is one of my favorite albums as well, and I think it sounds fantastic on my GR07s. Where does it sound messy? One issue could be, as you mentioned the fit. I found that if your fit is too shallow you miss some treble detail, which could make it sound muddy. If your ADDIEMs have a treble boost that might be why it sounds better on those, because The Suburbs is a very warm album on the whole.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Garh, I'm extremely frustated with my GR07's right now. "Natural" and "Dynamic" simply don't come to mind when I'm listening to them in any track that has more than one vocal and two backing instruments. I don't know whether it's a fit issue, break-in issue (they have been burning for some 120 hours now), but it sounds awful when playing The Suburbs (the entire frickin album). Sure, I am getting a bit more detail here and there, but it's mostly messy considering how highly these are rated and how much more they cost compared to the ADDIEMs (which actually sounded more DYNAMIC than the GR07 in certain parts of some songs). If this all is just a fit issue I'll have to buy huge tri-flange tips, because the included bi-flanges are the same thing as the big flanges (that is, small).
> 
> Fit issue or not, unless *something* changes, I'll swear off IEMs and stick to super-aural, open-backed headphones. Maybe I should've have gone with Senns HD595s...
> 
> Can someone please tell me WTH is going on here? I listen everything in 256 kbps AAC in my MBP and nano.


 

       It's definitely fit issues. Had a similar problem with my GR06, but I fixed it with Sony Medium Hybrid tips.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> I didn't know head-fi was a roleplaying community...


 

 You mean it isn't ? Damn, clearly I've bought my robe and wizard hat to the wrong place.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> I'm actually really surprised to hear that. The Suburbs is one of my favorite albums as well, and I think it sounds fantastic on my GR07s. Where does it sound messy? One issue could be, as you mentioned the fit. I found that if your fit is too shallow you miss some treble detail, which could make it sound muddy. If your ADDIEMs have a treble boost that might be why it sounds better on those, because The Suburbs is a very warm album on the whole.


 

 I find them too messy in two ways. I am analyzing Rococo. It's all fine and dandy during the first 47 seconds. When the "aah aah aaaah"s start the bass-like instrument is a tad lighter in presence than I remember, as if the song was overall thinned, but in a very slight way. Up to 1:45 everything's fine, other than that. As things start to scale up, they also get less intelligible, but not in a musical way: in a radio-like way. I am aware that they purposefully put some guitar noise along the guitar line, but still, the GR07 is supposed have better imaging and soundstage than the ADDIEM, and I haven't noticed that. Overall this part of the song simply lacks the dynamics and instrument separation it should have. Bass has good texture though, but still a tad iffy on quantity. Mids and Highs, when not "messy" during the build-up, sound excellent as well, just as I expected. I get more detail, I get more extension, I just don't get dynamics or imaging. Again, I have 120 hrs on them, and while that's enough for Vsonic, someone has already said that they get better on that area around 170. Still, I am a bit pissed. I am afraid they don't change much more.
   
  Anyway, the bass on these are driving me nuts. Sometimes (by that I mean some _songs_ it's just perfect, and sometimes it is a bit lacking. And the messiness is actually what I'd describe as the driver "making an effort", instead of "being effortless"
   
  EDIT: Scratch what I said about bass-like presence at the beginning. The problem is that it sounds a bit thin and not separate enough from the acoustic rest of the music.


----------



## lukeskymac

A better example. Listen to In The Backseat, the closer for Funeral (man that was an awesome album). Everything is just perfect until 1:12. When both the cellos (i guess) and the guitar come in, it's obvious that the guitar takes the lead. However, I feel that the cellos should be perfectly comprehensible, just quieter and out of the way. Instead, they stay in place and the guitar jumps in front, in a way that obscures it more than it should.
   
  And at last, at 2:35 when the full band comes in, it loses some of its effortlessness. Kinda like in Rococo.
   
  The last minute, however, plays just as I'd like them to do with every other song.
   
  I think it is a muddiness condition from only-so-slightly poor fit that makes any passages with beats sound confusing, along with levels of the treble-peak that's still there (albeit in a diminished form, I'll give you that) that make *some* highs sound piercing, even slightly distorted.
   
  The background is also a bit less black than what I'd like. But that's my rig's fault... and another excuse to buy an E7!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Garh, I'm extremely frustated with my GR07's right now. "Natural" and "Dynamic" simply don't come to mind when I'm listening to them in any track that has more than one vocal and two backing instruments. I don't know whether it's a fit issue, break-in issue (they have been burning for some 120 hours now), but it sounds awful when playing The Suburbs (the entire frickin album).


 

 To be fair The Suburbs suffers from terrible DRC. It's one of the last albums I'd use for benchmarking a piece of gear.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> thanks for the in depth reply. some great food for though. its no doubt although the aforementioned iem sound better when ampd, but they probably already sound very good without an amp as well, being that they are all easily driveable. i see you say some phones benefit a lot from amping, and some dont so it really just comes down to experimenting. seems like none of your ultimate ears really benfited for an amp, dont think ill buy one for my ue600 then
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Basically boomy bass means when that large bass hit occurs in a song the bass becomes uncontrolled and booms out and leeches into the other frequencies (mids/highs) Some people, usually the more extreme bass heads, don't mind a boomy bass just as long as it isn't to uncontrolled because it sounds and feels more visceral. Think of it along the lines of being in a club and having that doof doof doof like bass sound coming out of the speakers and hitting you, that's boomy bass. Whether someone considers boomy bass a good thing or bad thing depends on the individual, different strokes for different folks. Personally I like a controlled bass with good punch behind it of coarse that's just me. What I would consider bassy other people on here would consider bass light.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> A better example. Listen to In The Backseat, the closer for Funeral (man that was an awesome album). Everything is just perfect until 1:12. When both the cellos (i guess) and the guitar come in, it's obvious that the guitar takes the lead. However, I feel that the cellos should be perfectly comprehensible, just quieter and out of the way. Instead, they stay in place and the guitar jumps in front, in a way that obscures it more than it should.
> 
> And at last, at 2:35 when the full band comes in, it loses some of its effortlessness. Kinda like in Rococo.
> 
> ...


 

 I'm with Joker on this one... I feel like you're listening for stuff that's not really there in the music, and you're just hearing the not so fantastic mastering of the album (Though fit might have something to do with it). Listen to Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon and then come back and tell me it's not dynamic.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> To be fair The Suburbs suffers from terrible DRC. It's one of the last albums I'd use for benchmarking a piece of gear.


 


  I'm quite surprised. I know that Arcade Fire are indie, but this is their third album, and considering their musical style I wasn't expecting Dynamic Range Compression from them... It's not like they are Lady Gaga or something...
   
  But I am afraid you're right. Even No Cars Go from the third album doesn't sound as expansive as an orchestrated piece (which is what the song reminds me a little)
   
  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> I'm with Joker on this one... I feel like you're listening for stuff that's not really there in the music, and you're just hearing the not so fantastic mastering of the album (Though fit might have something to do with it). Listen to Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon and then come back and tell me it's not dynamic.


 

 As a matter of fact I do have Dark Side of the Moon too... I remember having only heard Money, and back at 3 hours or so. Will do a complete listening.
   
  Now that we're talking about mastering quality... Does any of Radiohead's albums (except Pablo Honey, I couldn't care less about it) suffer from any kind of poor mastering too? I would like the blow to be dealt *now* that I'm not so irritated. They are my favorite band, after all.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## lukeskymac

I miss the more forward presentation of the ADDIEM... But if the DBA has less bass I wouldn't like it either. I guess I'll only be satisfied with an uber-high-end pair of over-the-ears


----------



## RapidPulse

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The bass of the MTP Golds is more relaxed than that of the MDT but still emphasized over flat. You may also like the Radius DDM2.


 

 Unfortunately, I had already placed an order for the RE262 before seeing your response...and I see why you did not recommend them based on the sound I said I was looking for.  They sound great, but have a much thinner sound than what I was looking for with this pair of IEMs.  I will be returning them.
   
  The DDM2 looks very interesting, but I am starting to think that I should just stick with the MDT since I am enjoying it and got it on sale (and especially after I re-read your review of the MDT, assuming that it still holds up).  It seems like I could try a number of IEMs, but not necessarily find anything I would like better with this type of sound signature.  Emphasized bass looks to be part of the trade-off I need to accept. Thanks!


----------



## AstralStorm

In my opinion, GR07 can have boomy bass with certain tips without equalization, such as with the stock silicone and less with Hybrids.
  Unsuprisingly, it's most smooth and linear with Comply foams and olive tips - these typically don't resonate.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> In my opinion, GR07 can have boomy bass with certain tips without equalization, such as with the stock silicone and less with Hybrids.
> Unsuprisingly, it's most smooth and linear with Comply foams and olive tips - these typically don't resonate.


 


  Olive tips murdered the perfect balance of the GR07 for me. the only way I can use foamies on them is to use reversed complys. As far as the bass is concerned, I find it to be just fine, if not even slightly lacking in mid-bass. Boomy is not a word I'd use to describe the GR07's bass


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





rapidpulse said:


> Unfortunately, I had already placed an order for the RE262 before seeing your response...and I see why you did not recommend them based on the sound I said I was looking for.  They sound great, but have a much thinner sound than what I was looking for with this pair of IEMs.  I will be returning them.


 


  What source/amp did you use with the RE262 ? The only time I would consider mine 'thin' is when they are under-amped : my iPod Touch wont drive them properly, nor will the headphone out on my laptop, but add a decent portable amp or the ZO2 and its a different earphone, IMO. I also found that the fit had to be bang-on : I initially found the triple-flange silicon tips to be uncomfortable but persevered - now I wouldnt use anything else. Without that 'perfect' seal, you just arent going to hear what the 262s are capable of.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## estreeter

Fair enough - they arent bass monsters, but I've never seen Joker or anyone else here make that claim. There are so many other IEMs that might have better suited him - c'est la vie. I guess HiFiMan cant please all of the people all of the time.


----------



## RapidPulse

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> What source/amp did you use with the RE262 ? The only time I would consider mine 'thin' is when they are under-amped : my iPod Touch wont drive them properly, nor will the headphone out on my laptop, but add a decent portable amp or the ZO2 and its a different earphone, IMO. I also found that the fit had to be bang-on : I initially found the triple-flange silicon tips to be uncomfortable but persevered - now I wouldnt use anything else. Without that 'perfect' seal, you just arent going to hear what the 262s are capable of.


 

 I am using the iBasso D6...but would be curious to hear what the ZO2 does for them.  And I don't really mean 'thin' in absolute terms...just relative to the MDT.
   
  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> he seems to like his bass alot. i dont think no matter how hard he tried to tune into the re262, he still wouldnt like them


 
   
  Actually, I did like the re262s quite a bit. But I wasn't just looking for a great earphone, I had a particular sound signature in mind. 
   
  As I mentioned, I recently picked up the Mile Davis Tributes on a whim during an Amazon lightning deal and like them a lot more than I expected. BUT...I am finding the bass of the MDTs excessive. I was trying to find a replacement that has the qualities I like about the MDT (very warm, natural, full midrange, but still with some detail) without ALL that bass. For me, the RE262s are not it.  Although they are very good, they just don't have the same lushness in the lower midrange that I am enjoying in the MDT.  (That said, I would consider keeping the RE262 if I hadn't also just picked up the GR07.  But I just can't justify 3 new pairs of earphones...even though it is Christmas!)


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





rapidpulse said:


> As I mentioned, I recently picked up the Mile Davis Tributes on a whim during an Amazon lightning deal and like them a lot more than I expected. BUT...I am finding the bass of the MDTs excessive. I was trying to find a replacement that has the qualities I like about the MDT (very warm, natural, full midrange, but still with some detail) without ALL that bass. For me, the RE262s are not it.  Although they are very good, they just don't have the same lushness in the lower midrange that I am enjoying in the MDT.  (That said, I would consider keeping the RE262 if I hadn't also just picked up the GR07.  But I just can't justify 3 new pairs of earphones...even though it is Christmas!)


 

 Sorry, dunno if anyone has suggested this yet, or what your budget is like, but might I suggest the SM3? I think it may fit the bill for what you're looking for tho. IMO, of course.


----------



## Spanish

Quote: 





> I would go with the RE-ZERO. It's not exactly laid back in the upper mids/lower treble but it's not peaky. Not recommending Sunrise at the moment due to build quality issues.


 
  As distributor of HiFiMan and Sunrise i may say - problem with dfective product in HiFiman not less than in Sunrise


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





spanish said:


> As distributor of HiFiMan and Sunrise i may say - problem with dfective product in HiFiman not less than in Sunrise


 


  As noted at the beginning of the thread, I can only recount my own experiences with the products in question. I have had a total of six (!) issues with the three Sunrise products I've owned over the course of six months. I've had a total of zero issues with the five HiFiMan products I've owned over the course of three years. As far as I know HiFiMan has never released a product that is unusable past 1-2 hours because the voice coil overheats.


----------



## RapidPulse

Quote: 





heret1c said:


> Sorry, dunno if anyone has suggested this yet, or what your budget is like, but might I suggest the SM3? I think it may fit the bill for what you're looking for tho. IMO, of course.


 

 Thanks....I appreciate the feedback.  From what I have just read about the SM3, it does sound like a possibility.
   
  But I think I have decided that I will get off the buy/return train for awhile and just appreciate the things I like about the MDT on the music where it sounds best...and just skip the tracks where I find the bass overpowering or switch to other phones.  I have enough variety with the other phones I bought this year that it is probably not worth the effort/expense to force this search.
   
  That said, after re-reading some of ljokerl's reviews and comparing to what I am hearing, I realize that I am leaving out part of what I find so appealing: I think I am really enjoying the timbre and dynamics in addition to the warm, full mids.  More than any other IEM I currently have, the MDTs make me feel like I am hearing real, live instruments (the only problem is, I am sitting right next to the bass player 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





)
  I probably would really like the DDM2 (as ljokerl suggested earlier), but I am concerned that I won't be able to return them if they are not what I am looking for.


----------



## steviiee

Are the Monster Turbine Pro Coppers worth $99 CAD? And would they make a basshead/Treble head happy? I'm more of a U/v-Shaped type of guy but, seeing these are going to be on sale for $99 would they be great? And would they make me happy?


----------



## NotSoSerious

MeElectronics is offering me a free -M model since their M9's fell apart on me so much.
  Whats your opinion on what I should receive?
  (m2,m9,m6,m31,m21,m16, or the most expensive M11+)?
  I was thinking the M11+, it's the most expensive for a reason right?
  Or do the other newer M models top the M11+, at an even lower price?
  The M31's seem to be the same price as the M11+, atleast on their website.
  The insane bass and fun sound tempts me, but the size..
   
  Just so you know, I prefer Hip Hop and Rap, which bass always sounds good with.


----------



## Niyologist

MEELEC has an unofficial announcement of the MEELEC A161. Don't tell them that I told you guys. It's a secret.


----------



## Niyologist

http://www.dnscook.net/hostip.php/meelec.com


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> MeElectronics is offering me a free -M model since their M9's fell apart on me so much.
> Whats your opinion on what I should receive?
> (m2,m9,m6,m31,m21,m16, or the most expensive M11+)?
> I was thinking the M11+, it's the most expensive for a reason right?
> ...


 
   
     Either the M11+ or the M21. Similar sound sigs with the M11+ being more bass heavy.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





spanish said:


> As distributor of HiFiMan and Sunrise i may say - problem with dfective product in HiFiman not less than in Sunrise


 

 Now there's a ringing endorsement....
   
  Our local headphone guy here in Oz dropped UE because he was getting too many returns due to poor quality control - it will come back to bite them eventually.


----------



## steven-026

Not really too sure where to ask this, but do the tips on Meelec m21s fall out easily?  I finally got them and I'm loving them(Keep in mind this is my first pair of good sounding iems, or at least to me they are haha).


----------



## 5370H55V

Hey Joker, do you have plans to review the phonak pfe 232 iems anytime in the future?


----------



## ljokerl

Added Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3 and ACS T15
   
  Quote: 





> *(2B11) Creative Aurvana 3*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Dec 2011
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2A21) ACS T15*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Dec 2011
> ...


 
   


  
   


  Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Are the Monster Turbine Pro Coppers worth $99 CAD? And would they make a basshead/Treble head happy? I'm more of a U/v-Shaped type of guy but, seeing these are going to be on sale for $99 would they be great? And would they make me happy?


 

 More so than any other Monster IEM I've heard but wouldn't normally recommend them for v-shaped curve. At that price, though, they'll be significantly cheaper than any of my other recommendations so I'd say they are worth it. Should be easy enough to trade if you don't like them.

  
  Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> MeElectronics is offering me a free -M model since their M9's fell apart on me so much.
> Whats your opinion on what I should receive?
> (m2,m9,m6,m31,m21,m16, or the most expensive M11+)?
> I was thinking the M11+, it's the most expensive for a reason right?
> ...


 

 The M11+ still has one of my favorite form factors among all IEMs but I never really 'got' the sound. It sounds quite good with electronica but for Rap I'd go M31 if you want monster bass, M21 if you do not. M31 housing is also quite large, if that's a concern.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> MEELEC has an unofficial announcement of the MEELEC A161. Don't tell them that I told you guys. It's a secret.


 
   
  That would be single BA, priced above A151? If it's the same one as before, I believe they had it with them at CES 2011 last January. There were even some posts about it in the CES threads.
   


  Quote: 





steven-026 said:


> Not really too sure where to ask this, but do the tips on Meelec m21s fall out easily?  I finally got them and I'm loving them(Keep in mind this is my first pair of good sounding iems, or at least to me they are haha).


 

 Fall off the earphones? Not more than any other - there's a notch on the nozzle to keep them in place.
   


  Quote: 





5370h55v said:


> Hey Joker, do you have plans to review the phonak pfe 232 iems anytime in the future?


 

 No plans so far, too rich for my blood as far as universals go.


----------



## steviiee

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3 and ACS T15
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  As long, as it makes a basshead happy like me, should I jump on this deal? Sorry for too much questions, I'm currently going to upgrade from my SoundMAGIC e10's. Massive upgrade for me.
   
  Thanks again for all the help!


----------



## i2ehan

Wow, the Aurvana 3 and T15 certainly appear to be very competent set of in-ears. The latter piqued my interest ever since I encountered the perfect rating over at *trustedreviews*. I'll definitely pay the T15 a visit at some point.


----------



## TheGame21x

Nice review of the Aurvana 3s. That's exactly the score I thought you'd give them after listening to them for a while myself.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Wow, the Aurvana 3 and T15 certainly appear to be very competent set of in-ears. The latter piqued my interest ever since I encountered the perfect rating over at *trustedreviews*. I'll definitely pay the T15 a visit at some point.


 


  So much for the miracles curing your obsession with universals


----------



## i2ehan

Performance wise, the Miracle is easily the best I've heard from an in-ear. However, Head-Fi is a very dangerous drug, my friend, and in the words of the great Mitch Hedberg (RIP), *"I used to do drugs... and I still do." 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


*


----------



## dogears

and Music is the Drug my friend


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





spanish said:


> As distributor of HiFiMan and Sunrise i may say - problem with dfective product in HiFiman not less than in Sunrise


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *As noted at the beginning of the thread, I can only recount my own experiences *with the products in question. I have had a total of six (!) issues with the three Sunrise products I've owned over the course of six months. I've had a total of zero issues with the five HiFiMan products I've owned over the course of three years. As far as I know HiFiMan has never released a product that is unusable past 1-2 hours because the voice coil overheats.


 
   

  Even I can only report my experience. 
   
  During the burn-in (after about 80 hours) I had the problem of overheating of the coil solved after few minutes. 
   
  I continued with the burn in fact on a continuing basis. After the problem occurred again, still resulting in a few minutes. 
   
  The fact that they are not sent back does not mean that they have had not problems. 
   
  I have not sent back the IEM because problems have been small and in any case, I didn't know if I would have them solved with the change or if I could get in return an IEM worse


----------



## NotSoSerious

So you are reccomending the M21/31 over the M11+?
  Interesting....
   
  I'm just curious if the M31 isn't too muddy.
  Are they still decent for vocals?
   
  Like for this song? This is one of my favorite songs of all time... If the M31 at least sounds good with this....
  Perhaps better then the M11+?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





steviiee said:


> As long, as it makes a basshead happy like me, should I jump on this deal? Sorry for too much questions, I'm currently going to upgrade from my SoundMAGIC e10's. Massive upgrade for me.
> 
> Thanks again for all the help!


 

 The Coppers are definitely an upgrade but the E10 is a lot more v-shaped in sound, which means it may suit you better signature-wise. Also, keep in mind diminishing returns and if the Coppers don't impress out of the box, put the E10 aside for a couple of days and then go back to them to hear the difference.
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Wow, the Aurvana 3 and T15 certainly appear to be very competent set of in-ears. The latter piqued my interest ever since I encountered the perfect rating over at *trustedreviews*. I'll definitely pay the T15 a visit at some point.


 

 I can't remember if you liked the ER4 when you had it. If you did - the T15 will be right up your alley. If you didn't, you may still like the T15 better due to the slightly greater bass tilt.
   


  Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> Nice review of the Aurvana 3s. That's exactly the score I thought you'd give them after listening to them for a while myself.


 

 Thanks!


----------



## steviiee

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Coppers are definitely an upgrade but the E10 is a lot more v-shaped in sound, which means it may suit you better signature-wise. Also, keep in mind diminishing returns and if the Coppers don't impress out of the box, put the E10 aside for a couple of days and then go back to them to hear the difference.


 

 Thank you very much!


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I can't remember if you liked the ER4 when you had it. If you did - the T15 will be right up your alley. If you didn't, you may still like the T15 better due to the slightly greater bass tilt.


 

 Nah, I never liked the ER4. I _*loved *_it! Hence why I use the HF2 as my exclusive means on the go.


----------



## Angelopsaro

I was wondering.. since so many of our beloved companies have offers what iem would be a good partner for my gr07. meelec offers the cc51 for $36 and hisound the crystals for 50$. I am buying them with the possibility to use them for commuting and maybe running and sports. I guess the crystals build quality and comfort suits the situation better?
   
  P.S has anyone tried the hisound small mp3players? the rocoo C and the amp3 m?


----------



## NotSoSerious

Also, if there is a very small light tear (not a hole ) in the part where the soft black part connects to the firm part in the Sony Hybrids, could if effect SQ?


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Performance wise, the Miracle is easily the best I've heard from an in-ear. However, Head-Fi is a very dangerous drug, my friend, and in the words of the great Mitch Hedberg (RIP), *"I used to do drugs... and I still do."
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I get this - started a thread a couple of months back asking if Head-Fiers buy IEMs 'like candy', and wasnt surprised that a significant number admitted to exactly that.
   
  - bang-for-buck is usually better than fullsize cans, and the point-of-diminishing-returns seems to be more attractive (in my case, I think its about the $300 mark), although I still have concerns over durability and longevity with some brands.
   
  - they are so much easier to carry/store
   
  - there is a fashion component, regardless of my personal aversion to hot rod flames on an IEM  
   
  I admit to being sorely tempted by many of the IEMs in Joker's reviews, but each time I find myself thinking 'Thats IT !', something new and shiny comes along. For all the action at the top end of the fullsize pile ($1000+), they dont release new phones at anything resembling the pace with which IEM manufacturers seem to, nor do we have new players (new to me, at any rate) constantly entering the market.


----------



## controlmajortom

Hey Joker did you change the picture of the ER4? I think you changed the score for sound too up to a 9.1.


----------



## Inks

controlmajortom said:


> Hey Joker did you change the picture of the ER4? I think you changed the score for sound too up to a 9.1.


 
  Well deserved bump. Now if only the PFE will get a 9.0...


----------



## Cykull

Just jumping into IEMs and the HF5 have caught my eye. But, will I have problems getting these into my ears? Also, I mostly listen to EDM.


----------



## ljokerl

double post


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> Nah, I never liked the ER4. I _*loved *_it! Hence why I use the HF2 as my exclusive means on the go.


 

 Ah, same here. I went (Er6i) -> ER-4S -> HF3 -> HF2 (for android compatibility) -> ER-4S. Was tempted to keep the HF2 as a headset when I got my 2nd ER-4S but I only have 1 set of custom molds so there would have been a constant conflict. 

  
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> I was wondering.. since so many of our beloved companies have offers what iem would be a good partner for my gr07. meelec offers the cc51 for $36 and hisound the crystals for 50$. I am buying them with the possibility to use them for commuting and maybe running and sports. I guess the crystals build quality and comfort suits the situation better?
> 
> P.S has anyone tried the hisound small mp3players? the rocoo C and the amp3 m?


 

 I would say the CC51 is a better GR07 companion, being a more colored set, but for gym use the Crystal is clearly more durable and more secure as well (since it can easily be worn over-the-ear). 
   


  Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Also, if there is a very small light tear (not a hole ) in the part where the soft black part connects to the firm part in the Sony Hybrids, could if effect SQ?


 
   
  If it affects your ability to get an airtight seal - yes.
   


  Quote: 





controlmajortom said:


> Hey Joker did you change the picture of the ER4? I think you changed the score for sound too up to a 9.1.


 

 Earlier this week. The old pic was terrible. I also re-wrote the review a bit, something I've been meaning to do for a while since that was one of my first high-end reviews and not very informative. The sound score was teetering around ~9.05 anyway so I just rounded it up after doing some more listening with my new ER4S, properly amped and with custom tips, against the other 9-9.1 range stuff I have.
   


  Quote: 





cykull said:


> Just jumping into IEMs and the HF5 have caught my eye. But, will I have problems getting these into my ears? Also, I mostly listen to EDM.


 


  No, no issue getting them in. Whether you are comfortable with the deep insertion in the long run is a different matter, though. If you give yourself time to adjust it should be fine. Not sure why you picked the Etys specifically but for sheer accuracy they are one of the best ways to spend the money.


----------



## NotSoSerious

Thank you very much, but I have one more question, just so I can make this clear.
   
  Your reccomending the M21/M31 over the M11+ for rap/hip-hop correct?
  How about some R&B with T-pain?
  Songs like this one?




   
  I would like to be able to hear all the crisp vocals to some extent, but having great bass and an overall fun sound if possible. 
  Should the M31 be able to pull of sounding good on a song like above?


----------



## oneoseven

My IEM purchasing path was Brainwavz M1 -> M3 -> M2 -> Vsonic GR07.. The GR07 is by far my most favorite and completely blows the M3 and M1 out of the water from what I remember of them.. What I'm looking for is a pair with the clarity and response of the GR07s in the mids and highs with bass more in tune with the M2s but better overall quality.. The GR07 becomes uncomfortable fit wise after a while because my ears are a tad bit too small for the housing and it begins to dig into the bottom of my ear which is another reason I'd like an upgrade/sidegrade..  I can return the GR07 for 180 and can add 20-70 on top of it so if there's a pair at 250 or under that would give me what I'm looking for I'd like that.. The other option is an amp like the E6 with its bass boost on the GR07s.. The isolation on the GR07s is good enough as is the sound stage and separation but if any of that can be improved that would also be welcomed.. Thank you for any suggestions and if what I'm looking for is well above what I have to spend thanks for letting me know that as well and I'll try the amp route.. My portable source is my HTC G2 and my home setup is a Fiio E10.. I listen to the basics genre wise: hip hop, rock, pop


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Thank you very much, but I have one more question, just so I can make this clear.
> 
> Your reccomending the M21/M31 over the M11+ for rap/hip-hop correct?
> How about some R&B with T-pain?
> ...


 

 They all perform about the same, just with different sound signatures. The M11+ is a little clearer than the M31 but not as bassy or warm.
  
   


  Quote: 





oneoseven said:


> My IEM purchasing path was Brainwavz M1 -> M3 -> M2 -> Vsonic GR07.. The GR07 is by far my most favorite and completely blows the M3 and M1 out of the water from what I remember of them.. What I'm looking for is a pair with the clarity and response of the GR07s in the mids and highs with bass more in tune with the M2s but better overall quality.. The GR07 becomes uncomfortable fit wise after a while because my ears are a tad bit too small for the housing and it begins to dig into the bottom of my ear which is another reason I'd like an upgrade/sidegrade..  I can return the GR07 for 180 and can add 20-70 on top of it so if there's a pair at 250 or under that would give me what I'm looking for I'd like that.. The other option is an amp like the E6 with its bass boost on the GR07s.. The isolation on the GR07s is good enough as is the sound stage and separation but if any of that can be improved that would also be welcomed.. Thank you for any suggestions and if what I'm looking for is well above what I have to spend thanks for letting me know that as well and I'll try the amp route.. My portable source is my HTC G2 and my home setup is a Fiio E10.. I listen to the basics genre wise: hip hop, rock, pop


 

 I don't think you'll find an upgrade from the GR07 with more bass in that price range. For sidegrades with more bass, read up on the JVC FX500, JVC FXT90, and ATH-CKM99. Not sure about housing size - the CKM99 and FXT90 are different in shape but not necessarily 'smaller' than the GR07. The FXT90 doesn't have that much more bass but it's fuller and a little more forward at the low end, with more of a mid-bass lift, giving it a greater impression of bass power.


----------



## oneoseven

What about a slight downgrade in mids/highs but a good upgrade in bass? How do the Atrio MG7 or the MTPG compare? Those are the two that seem to be at least a little similar but with more bass.. But I haven't seen any comparisons to the GR07 since they are a different type of IEM.. Thank you so much for your answer


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





oneoseven said:


> What about a slight downgrade in mids/highs but a good upgrade in bass? How do the Atrio MG7 or the MTPG compare? Those are the two that seem to be at least a little similar but with more bass.. But I haven't seen any comparisons to the GR07 since they are a different type of IEM.. Thank you so much for your answer


 
   
  The ones I listed are probably more similar. The MG7 moves very far away from the GR07 with its smallish soundstage, heavy deep bass emphasis, and darker tone. The MTPG is very different as well with its warm, laid-back nature and extreme smoothness. Both are fine as long as you are not expecting a GR07-like signature.
   
  Aside from poor isolation, the FX500 is probably what you want - heavy bass, good midrange clarity, large soundstage, more conventional fit for smaller outer ears. The treble is pretty edgy but probably not an issue at moderate volumes. The CKM99 is somewhat similar but isolates a lot more and is tamer in the bass and treble.


----------



## oneoseven

Really what I'm looking for is a more fun IEM to listen to while at work since I recently purchased a nice pair of studio monitor headphones for the neutral response I wanted for house use.. The GR07 are amazing and filled both home/work needs but now that I don't use them at home while I'm out I want something that gets me moving and into the music.. I think what I really want is an improved M2 with enough clarity in the mids and highs that I didn't get with the M2s plus better bass response which is why I was looking at the golds and M7s.. Do those fit that? Also I need at least good isolation as my job has a lot of noise around me.. I also wanted to try and find something I could purchase off of amazon so just in case I don't like it I know I can trust in their return policy.. But if the FX500 are what I'm describing I'll look into those over the others.. Sorry for all the questions and I really appreciate the time it takes to answer them


----------



## Coq de Combat

Joker, if you had the* IE8(0)* and the *ACS T15* side by side for the same price (we get to buy the new IE80 for ~ € 200, which would be just as much as importing the ACS T15 from UK, shipping included), which would you choose?
   
  Considering I like the presence of bass (but it shouldn't have to be bass monster) and appreciate details. But the most important part of the sound to me, is the "impact" - I don't only want to hear it, I want to feel it, I want to feel the energy, the drive. My music styles is almost 100% electronic (think Kraftwerk, Jarre, New Wave, and other kinds of synth pop..). Bass presence is as said important, but I wouldn't want the bloated one note doof that I get from my S4. Clarity is almost as important, and soundstage is probably the lest important part. I know this probably sounds like up the ACS alley - however, 2000 kr ($270, €200) for the new IE 80 sounds like an offer too good to let go?
   
  As reference I found the RE-262 a little too "laid back" or something for my tastes. A little too mid centric perhaps? I wanted better bass response and a lot more treble, as I thought they sounded somewhat muffled to me..


----------



## Niyologist

The A161 is to have more extended, yet beeper bass than the A151 and is to be much more well balanced sound signature with a peak around 8-13 Khz and the frequency range is around 5 hz to 30 Khz. Geez!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





coq de combat said:


> Joker, if you had the* IE8(0)* and the *ACS T15* side by side for the same price (we get to buy the new IE80 for ~ € 200, which would be just as much as importing the ACS T15 from UK, shipping included), which would you choose?
> 
> Considering I like the presence of bass (but it shouldn't have to be bass monster) and appreciate details. But the most important part of the sound to me, is the "impact" - I don't only want to hear it, I want to feel it, I want to feel the energy, the drive. My music styles is almost 100% electronic (think Kraftwerk, Jarre, New Wave, and other kinds of synth pop..). Bass presence is as said important, but I wouldn't want the bloated one note doof that I get from my S4. Clarity is almost as important, and soundstage is probably the lest important part. I know this probably sounds like up the ACS alley - however, 2000 kr ($270, €200) for the new IE 80 sounds like an offer too good to let go?
> 
> As reference I found the RE-262 a little too "laid back" or something for my tastes. A little too mid centric perhaps? I wanted better bass response and a lot more treble, as I thought they sounded somewhat muffled to me..


 
   
        Either the MG7 or the FX500. The MTPG is too excessive on bass. The MTPC could be a good candidate.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





oneoseven said:


> Really what I'm looking for is a more fun IEM to listen to while at work since I recently purchased a nice pair of studio monitor headphones for the neutral response I wanted for house use.. The GR07 are amazing and filled both home/work needs but now that I don't use them at home while I'm out I want something that gets me moving and into the music.. I think what I really want is an improved M2 with enough clarity in the mids and highs that I didn't get with the M2s plus better bass response which is why I was looking at the golds and M7s.. Do those fit that? Also I need at least good isolation as my job has a lot of noise around me.. I also wanted to try and find something I could purchase off of amazon so just in case I don't like it I know I can trust in their return policy.. But if the FX500 are what I'm describing I'll look into those over the others.. Sorry for all the questions and I really appreciate the time it takes to answer them


 

 Buying on amazon severely limits your choices. MTPG is closer to the M2 than the MG7 in my opinion. It's actually not too bassy at all - less so than the FX500 or the regular Turbines and Miles Davis Tributes. Don't expect GR07-like clarity out of it but if it's returnable, it's what I would try.
   


  Quote: 





coq de combat said:


> Joker, if you had the* IE8(0)* and the *ACS T15* side by side for the same price (we get to buy the new IE80 for ~ € 200, which would be just as much as importing the ACS T15 from UK, shipping included), which would you choose?
> 
> Considering I like the presence of bass (but it shouldn't have to be bass monster) and appreciate details. But the most important part of the sound to me, is the "impact" - I don't only want to hear it, I want to feel it, I want to feel the energy, the drive. My music styles is almost 100% electronic (think Kraftwerk, Jarre, New Wave, and other kinds of synth pop..). Bass presence is as said important, but I wouldn't want the bloated one note doof that I get from my S4. Clarity is almost as important, and soundstage is probably the lest important part. I know this probably sounds like up the ACS alley - however, 2000 kr ($270, €200) for the new IE 80 sounds like an offer too good to let go?
> 
> As reference I found the RE-262 a little too "laid back" or something for my tastes. A little too mid centric perhaps? I wanted better bass response and a lot more treble, as I thought they sounded somewhat muffled to me..


 

 They sound nothing alike. The T15 is mostly flat, with maybe 1-2dB of lift in the sub-bass region. The IE8 has a large mid-bass lift. I don't think you will like the T15 if you expect enhanced bass in the conventional sense. There are tons of options that fall between the heavy bass emphasis of the IE8 and the flat response of the T15 - VSonic GR07 and JVC FXT90, for example. Reading your post I really don't think any bass below that of the FTX90 will satisfy you.


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Either the MG7 or the FX500. The MTPG is too excessive on bass. The MTPC could be a good candidate.


 
   
  MTPC does sound intriguing I think. But they look a little too "bling-bling" to me. I'll have to think about the Atrio and the JVC.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They sound nothing alike. The T15 is mostly flat, with maybe 1-2dB of lift in the sub-bass region. The IE8 has a large mid-bass lift. I don't think you will like the T15 if you expect enhanced bass in the conventional sense. There are tons of options that fall between the heavy bass emphasis of the IE8 and the flat response of the T15 - VSonic GR07 and JVC FXT90, for example. Reading your post I really don't think any bass below that of the FTX90 will satisfy you.


 

 I read upon the differences, and I know about them. Why I chose to compare them was that I was first kind of interested in the ACS T15, thinking I want clarity, details and a flat sound with a good speed. Then I came to think of the cheaper price of IE80 in Sweden ($270), and thought that it might give me the most bang for the buck, despite it being bass heavy (which has been my tastes, there's no hiding that).
   
  Thus, the comparison of them was due to the price being pretty equal (and the Senns being actually at a good pricepoint - maybe too good to *not* bite).
   
  Thing is, that I would like something to complement my other gear which for the moment pretty much are Denon D2000 and Pro 900 (both bass heavy cans). That's where I think the ACS T15 could fit in.
   
*However*, there's always that risk that it might be too bass shy for my needs. The IE80 on the other hand would probably be somewhere along my bigger cans in terms of bass - however, then it would feel like listening to the same stuff with different, yet portable, gear.
   
  Choices:
  A) Trying something new in having an analytical IEM.. riskiest path
  B) Follow the same recipe that I've always done.. safest path
   
  Oh well, no one is forcing me to choose right now. Thanks for the tips and suggestions. I'll have to think this through and make an educated decision.
   
  Just a question: If I did choose the IE80 path (assuming they're almost the same as IE8), would there be enough clarity, good treble, details and "energy" from it to make it a substantial upgrade from my Klipsch S4?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





coq de combat said:


> Just a question: If I did choose the IE80 path (assuming they're almost the same as IE8), would there be enough clarity, good treble, details and "energy" from it to make it a substantial upgrade from my Klipsch S4?


 


  The IE8 is clearer, smoother, and more detailed than the S4 but the S4 is quite v-shaped in sound signature so don't expect the IE8 to be more energetic in the conventional sense. If you want pumped-up treble you're better off with a JVC FX700/FX500.


----------



## wafflesrawr

Does anyone have any recommendation between the GR07s and the Ety hf3s? I'm replacing a pair of SE210s that died on one side and I can't decide 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  The isolation and volume/mic on the hf3 are making me hesitate from just getting the GR07s (plus the hf3s are cheaper). I'll be using them a decent amount on planes/cars/trains and I'm not sure how good a job the GR07s will do in that regard. My Shures provided more than enough isolation, but I've only ever owned E2Cs and SE210s, so I don't have much to compare to.


----------



## olear

Joker, I've found FXT90's highs too harsh with some sibilance, how do FX500 or FX700 compare? And do they have more bass quantity and extension?


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The IE8 is clearer, smoother, and more detailed than the S4 but the S4 is quite v-shaped in sound signature so don't expect the IE8 to be more energetic in the conventional sense. If you want pumped-up treble you're better off with a JVC FX700/FX500.


 


  After looking up on the FX500, and seeing that they are rather affordable, I feel that I am kind of interested in them. After owning the RE-262, I know for a fact that I am not an especially big fan of "smooth treble". I know we all perceive sound differently, but they did sound a little veiled/muffled to me - making me feel a little claustrophobic.
   
  Thing is, I live in Sweden - sometimes a rather cold and harsh environment, sometimes a rather warm and "moist" environment - and I wouldn't want any IEM to die on my because the cables couldn't handle the weather. So, obviously I would want them to have a rather good build quality. Normally this isn't a big problem for most IEMs, but the JVC house is made of wood... Is it very fragile or does it withstand a little beating weather wise?
   
  Edit: ...and obviously: Would they be a substantial upgrade from the Klipsch S4, or would I have to go up to FX700 for that?
   
  I'm so close to ordering them now. Good looking, seems like my kind of IEM.. I just wish they have that extra "drive" and "weight" (in lack of better words .. I felt the S4 had rather good sound singature and all that, BUT they didn't have that extra something.. "body", "weight".. hard to describe a feeling and English is my fourth language) to their sound that I feel the S4 lacks. The RE-262 gave me that, but the RE-262 were too much mid-based for me; not enough bass and not enough treble.


----------



## shotgunshane

Here is something I'm looking forward to in the immediate future!  First batch is already created.


----------



## tomscy2000

As always, great reviews, Joker. The Aurvana InEar3 seems like a bit of a disappointment. I was half-expecting a hidden gem, but they don't seem to get as much out of a dual-driver setup as others can.
   
  The ACS T15 looks mighty interesting though. They look absolutely miniscule! I can envision musicians using it for on-stage use when they want a low profile look, instead of the 'hearing aid' look.


----------



## james444

wafflesrawr said:


> Does anyone have any recommendation between the GR07s and the Ety hf3s? I'm replacing a pair of SE210s that died on one side and I can't decide  .
> 
> The isolation and volume/mic on the hf3 are making me hesitate from just getting the GR07s (plus the hf3s are cheaper). I'll be using them a decent amount on planes/cars/trains and I'm not sure how good a job the GR07s will do in that regard. My Shures provided more than enough isolation, but I've only ever owned E2Cs and SE210s, so I don't have much to compare to.




You might want to consider the Yamaha EPH-100.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





wafflesrawr said:


> Does anyone have any recommendation between the GR07s and the Ety hf3s? I'm replacing a pair of SE210s that died on one side and I can't decide
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  E2c isolation should fall pretty much between the HF3 and GR07. Solely for plane use I would go up to the HF3 but realistically the difference between the three won't be very big.


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Joker, I've found FXT90's highs too harsh with some sibilance, how do FX500 or FX700 compare? And do they have more bass quantity and extension?


 

 They are all pretty similar in treble quantity. FX500 is a bit more edgy than FXT90, FX700 less so. FXT90 treble peak is rather small quantitatively and can probably be tamed with foam tips. They don't have a tendency to add sibilance where none is present on the track. Yes, the bass on the FX500/700 is bigger - deeper and more powerful.
   


  Quote: 





coq de combat said:


> After looking up on the FX500, and seeing that they are rather affordable, I feel that I am kind of interested in them. After owning the RE-262, I know for a fact that I am not an especially big fan of "smooth treble". I know we all perceive sound differently, but they did sound a little veiled/muffled to me - making me feel a little claustrophobic.
> Thing is, I live in Sweden - sometimes a rather cold and harsh environment, sometimes a rather warm and "moist" environment - and I wouldn't want any IEM to die on my because the cables couldn't handle the weather. So, obviously I would want them to have a rather good build quality. Normally this isn't a big problem for most IEMs, but the JVC house is made of wood... Is it very fragile or does it withstand a little beating weather wise?
> 
> Edit: ...and obviously: Would they be a substantial upgrade from the Klipsch S4, or would I have to go up to FX700 for that?
> ...


 
   
  I live in California so I'm afraid you'll have consult someone else for the FX500's cold weather performance. Overall the build quality is more than fine - all of the higher-end JVC gear is built to last. The FX500 is already a substantial upgrade from the S4. Two potential issues with it are excessive bass and excessive treble so I don't think you'll have to worry about it being mid-centric. There's a lot of texture to their sound, too. 
   


  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Here is something I looking forward to in the immediate future!  First batch is already created.


 

 I guess even apple fans get a high value-for-money set thrown their way once in a while. Hopefully it'll be $45 or so.
   


  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> As always, great reviews, Joker. The Aurvana InEar3 seems like a bit of a disappointment. I was half-expecting a hidden gem, but they don't seem to get as much out of a dual-driver setup as others can.
> 
> The ACS T15 looks mighty interesting though. They look absolutely miniscule! I can envision musicians using it for on-stage use when they want a low profile look, instead of the 'hearing aid' look.


 

 If the InEar 3 wasn't so bland I probably would have liked it more but the fact that Fischer's SBA-03 managed better bass depth and punch along with better clarity and detail, all with a single armature, was indeed disappointing. 
   
  The T15 is tiny - I wouldn't say it's smaller than the q-JAYS / UE700 because the nozzle is rather wide but in the ear it's just as unobtrusive. I had the pleasure of staying with family over the holiday weekend and got to use a number of my in-ears as nighttime noise blockers. The T15 was very comfortable to sleep in - more so than the GR07, Sennheiser IE7, and FA Tandem. The only thing that came close was the RE272.


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I live in California so I'm afraid you'll have consult someone else for the FX500's cold weather performance. Overall the build quality is more than fine - all of the higher-end JVC gear is built to last. The FX500 is already a substantial upgrade from the S4. Two potential issues with it are excessive bass and excessive treble so I don't think you'll have to worry about it being mid-centric. There's a lot of texture to their sound, too.


 


  Great. As said, most headphones can stand the Swedish weather, and for the really harsh days I could always use the S4 instead. Have you heard them yourself or are you going by what others are saying?
   
  I couldn't find any reviews on them in your list..


----------



## Seraphael

Fantastic guide. With it, I finally feel confident enough to get out from under Sennheiser CX300's thumP!


----------



## olear

Thanks joker.


----------



## wafflesrawr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> E2c isolation should fall pretty much between the HF3 and GR07. Solely for plane use I would go up to the HF3 but realistically the difference between the three won't be very big.


 

 They'll be used in places other than a plane as well, and if the difference won't be huge I think I'll give the GR07s a shot. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





coq de combat said:


> Great. As said, most headphones can stand the Swedish weather, and for the really harsh days I could always use the S4 instead. Have you heard them yourself or are you going by what others are saying?
> 
> I couldn't find any reviews on them in your list..


 

  I don't comment on gear I haven't heard. There's a list of upcoming reviews on the front page of this thread, below the table.
   


  Quote: 





seraphael said:


> Fantastic guide. With it, I finally feel confident enough to get out from under Sennheiser CX300's thumP!


 

  Thanks, glad to hear it!


----------



## olear

joker, have you heard the differences between IE8 and IE80?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, have you heard the differences between IE8 and IE80?


 


  I have not


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The A161 is to have more extended, yet beeper bass than the A151 and is to be much more well balanced sound signature with a peak around 8-13 Khz and the frequency range is around 5 hz to 30 Khz. Geez!


 

 Has the A161 been announced yet?  I've been holding back commenting on it since hearing it last year at CES.  Absolutely the cleanest, most balanced listen I've heard from Meelec.  My favorite sounding Meelec IEM yet and definitely a contender for bang per buck performance if the price is right.  One reason I never commented on the A151 since I'd already heard the A161 which technically kicks it's ass IMO.


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't comment on gear I haven't heard. There's a list of upcoming reviews on the front page of this thread, below the table.


 


  You know, I was so certain that you had neither reviewed it or planned it. I ctrl+F:ed too! I had to re-check now, and just like you said, there it is waiting to be reviewed. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Sorry, my bad, I just missed it. However, I have decided on buying them. I mostly use fullsized on the go as well, but I want something good for the times when fullsized just can't be worn. I think this might right up my alley! I also talked to James444 about these, and we both came to the conclusion that these should suit me well. Thanks for the recommendation my friend, I'll let you know if I like them or love them when they arrive! I have to add: those wooden houses really are something special, aren't they?


----------



## kiteki

Coq de Combat make sure you buy them from a reliable seller, such as in Japan.  There's a few fakes of the FX500.
   
  I listen to the exact same music as you at least 50% of the time as you know, I haven't heard any high-end JVC's yet though.


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Coq de Combat make sure you buy them from a reliable seller, such as in Japan.  There's a few fakes of the FX500.
> 
> I listen to the exact same music as you at least 50% of the time as you know, I haven't heard any high-end JVC's yet though.


 


  I was thinking about seyo-shop.com .. They seem to deliver to Sweden as well. You wouldn't recommend the FX500?


----------



## kiteki

Yeah seyo-shop.com seems good, minsann.
   
  I keep going back to the Sony EX700 for that music, it's harshness fits like a glove. 
   
  I've only heard the JVC FXC51, picked it up cheap from amazon.com, it's very good for the price.  I think you'll be safe with the JVC FX500 or FXT-90, unless you want to try a multi BA instead? I like them, something like the Shure SE425 would suit you, or if you really like the doof-doof perhaps the new Sony XBA-4.


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Yeah seyo-shop.com seems good, minsann.
> 
> I keep going back to the Sony EX700 for that music, it's harshness fits like a glove.
> 
> I've only heard the JVC FXC51, picked it up cheap from amazon.com, it's very good for the price.  I think you'll be safe with the JVC FX500 or FXT-90, unless you want to try a multi BA instead? I like them, something like the Shure SE425 would suit you, or if you really like the doof-doof perhaps the new Sony XBA-4.


 


  Yeah, I've checked out the sonys as well, but they look kind of awkward, not as in looks (looks very good) but as in the feel. I remember trying a friends sony (can't remember the model) with the same kind of housing and it felt a bit awkward. It might actually have been the ex700.. As for the FXT90 I'm a little scared of the housing as well - it looks a little big and my ears are pretty small. Not overly small, I've had no problems with the majority of IEMs I've tried, but the FXT90 looks a bit bigger vertically than most. Besides, I'm a sucker for the wooden house of the FX500/700. 
   
  I think I want to stick with the dynamic drivers on this one, my guilty pleasure is the air-moving, almost seismic, feeling that dynamics are said to be better at. 
   
  Though I have planned on getting a good set of BAs as well in the future.


----------



## kiteki

Yeah, the wood, birch, brass and carbon components of JVC IEM's are all very unique and attractive, they have a wooden speaker cone as well, not sure if it sounds any good, but they are pioneers in sound technology at least.
   
  If you buy the FX500, I'm interested in knowing if it has the energy you're looking for, I know what you're trying to express there but I don't know where to find it lol, just effortless alive sonic energy like the wind right?


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Yeah, the wood, birch, brass and carbon components of JVC IEM's are all very unique and attractive, they have a wooden speaker cone as well, not sure if it sounds any good, but they are pioneers in sound technology at least.
> 
> If you buy the FX500, I'm interested in knowing if it has the energy you're looking for, I know what you're trying to express there but I don't know where to find it lol, just effortless alive sonic energy like the wind right?


 


  Yeah, I think you know what I mean..  I'll definitely let you know if the FX500 is what I'm seeking for


----------



## steviiee

Does the Monster Turbine PC have more or same bass as the SoundMAGIC E10?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





steviiee said:


> Does the Monster Turbine PC have more or same bass as the SoundMAGIC E10?


 


  About the same but the Turbine doesn't seem too bassy because the midrange is more prominent than that of the Soundmagics


----------



## Angelopsaro

Hey Joker, i know that you use your cowon J3 a lot for your iem auditions but do you use any other portable setup?


----------



## soullinker20

hey Joker when  will you  be  reviewing the IE80s? and also please do a comparison with the fx700s. thank you!


----------



## i2ehan

I'm still quite eager to know where the TF10 stands... the remainder can wait.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Hey Joker, i know that you use your cowon J3 a lot for your iem auditions but do you use any other portable setup?


 

 I'll use other portable sources as necessary - Sansa Clip, Cube C30, iPod Touch 4, my noisy phone. I have three amps that I swap in and out, too.
   


  Quote: 





soullinker20 said:


> hey Joker when  will you  be  reviewing the IE80s? and also please do a comparison with the fx700s. thank you!


 

  There are no plans to review the IE80 at this time.
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I'm still quite eager to know where the TF10 stands... the remainder can wait.


 

 I lied about getting it done by the end of the year 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I thought I'd be done with all of the other sets but some reviews (e.g. Clarity One, ACS T15) have taken a tremendously long time to reach a satisfactory level of thoroughness.


----------



## Xinn3r

The Xears Coupon code isn't valid anymore... I was just going to buy the Xears XE 200 PRO... sigh...
  It was a really great bargain...


----------



## JamesMcProgger

well I never come to this thread...
   
  Anyone knows if this foam tip would fit the ety MC5? mines are pretty much disintegrated
   
   
 

​​ *ER38-14F​*​ Black Foam Eartips​​ BUY NOW​ - $14.00 5 Pairs​   
   
  I remember reading once something about the MC5 having a different bore size then the rest of the etys(?)
   
  edit: also these ones on amazon: http://www.amazon.com/Etymotic-Research-ER4-14F-Replacement-Earphones/dp/B0015WNZD6
  they are for the ER4, but they say it fits the HF5, are the HF5 and MC5 about the same size? those doesnt seem to be at ety website.


----------



## TTker

Any threads rather than this one to help me comparing MTPC with Shure se535 and IE8?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> The Xears Coupon code isn't valid anymore... I was just going to buy the Xears XE 200 PRO... sigh...
> It was a really great bargain...


 

 I would email Xears and ask if any other promotions are available. Coupon was supposed to be good until the end of the year.
   


  Quote: 





jamesmcprogger said:


> well I never come to this thread...
> 
> Anyone knows if this foam tip would fit the ety MC5? mines are pretty much disintegrated
> 
> ...


 


  Yes, almost strange to see you in this thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. All Ety nozzles are pretty much the same size. I used the same set of Shure Olives on my HF3 and MC5.


----------



## JamesMcProgger

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, almost strange to see you in this thread
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yeah, I feel out of place 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. in that case, the ones from amazon are cheaper, because of the free shipping. thank you.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Guys can anyone comment on my small comparison bwtween brainwavz Pro alpha and visonic Gr07? (i plan to sell the Brainwavz)
   
  Generally i can see that GR07 is a lot more superior. Although the Pro alpha has more bass quantity the gr07 has faster bass speed and more tight and kicking where it should. The mids have more clarity and can reproduce a lot more sounds both mids and highs. Also the highs extend lot further. In the long run the gr07's sound is less tiring in the ear i think.
  Now what troubles me? for some reason the presentation of the pro alpha is a bit more live. I dont know if its more natural or not but the vocals are a bit more in front of the presentation making it more real or something. Although it is a bit more engadging in the start it gets tiring i think. Last Some noise due to bad recording is heared a lot more in the brainwavz pro alpha. (Standing on the Shore- Empire of the Sun).
  I dont know if this is bad or good. This happens because pro alpha has more V-shape sound than the vsonic?
   
  Any thoughts?


----------



## jiff

I'd really like to see your review on the JVC HA FXT90's.  I just purchased some and I always find your reviews very informative.  Also on the ClarityOne to see if you think the sound stage and separation is as thin as I do.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I would email Xears and ask if any other promotions are available. Coupon was supposed to be good until the end of the year.


 


  Thank you very much


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Now what troubles me? for some reason the presentation of the pro alpha is a bit more live. I dont know if its more natural or not but the vocals are a bit more in front of the presentation making it more real or something. Although it is a bit more engadging in the start it gets tiring i think.


 

 The GR07 doesn't do intimacy very well - it's got good soundstage width but only moderate depth. 
   


  Quote: 





jiff said:


> I'd really like to see your review on the JVC HA FXT90's.  I just purchased some and I always find your reviews very informative.  Also on the ClarityOne to see if you think the sound stage and separation is as thin as I do.


 


  The ClarityOne is taking a long time because of how wild some of the manufacturer's claims are. I have a lot of issues with the way these are marketed and it's making the objective review more difficult to write (I especially like how the distorted square wave magically turns into a perfect sine wave in the 'tech' section of their site). The sound of the earphone itself is interesting - somewhat v-shaped but really very aggressive all around. I find them to be off-base when it comes to timbre (esp. with instruments that rely on upper midrange and treble response) and note thickness is indeed lacking slightly. There are a number of things I like, too, but I'm just not as impressed as I was earlier in the month with the similarly-priced Fischer SBA-03 or the FXT90.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The ClarityOne is taking a long time because of how wild some of the manufacturer's claims are. I have a lot of issues with the way these are marketed and it's making the objective review more difficult to write (I especially like how the distorted square wave magically turns into a perfect sine wave in the 'tech' section of their site). The sound of the earphone itself is interesting - somewhat v-shaped but really very aggressive all around. I find them to be off-base when it comes to timbre (esp. with instruments that rely on upper midrange and treble response) and note thickness is indeed lacking slightly. There are a number of things I like, too, but I'm just not as impressed as I was earlier in the month with the similarly-priced Fischer SBA-03 or the FXT90.


 
   
  I concur with all of this and will be really interested in your final conclusion. These are some strange sounding IEMs imo, and even though the manufacturer's claims regarding their "PureSound Processor" are most likely bogus, they do indeed sound "EQed" in some odd way.


----------



## i2ehan

Indeed, for $112 bones, they aren't bad. But they're FAR from revolutionary, especially with the likes of the EX600, FXT90, and GR07 (among others) around. They're still quite fun, nonetheless, if that's what one is after. I know quite a number of friends and family members that couldn't be happier. I also know a few that could.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR07 doesn't do intimacy very well - it's got good soundstage width but only moderate depth.


 
   
  Do you find the JVC FXT90 to have better intimacy?


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR07 doesn't do intimacy very well - it's got good soundstage width but only moderate depth.
> 
> 
> 
> The ClarityOne is taking a long time because of how wild some of the manufacturer's claims are. I have a lot of issues with the way these are marketed and it's making the objective review more difficult to write (I especially like how the distorted square wave magically turns into a perfect sine wave in the 'tech' section of their site). The sound of the earphone itself is interesting - somewhat v-shaped but really very aggressive all around. I find them to be off-base when it comes to timbre (esp. with instruments that rely on upper midrange and treble response) and note thickness is indeed lacking slightly. There are a number of things I like, too, *but I'm just not as impressed as I was earlier in the month with the similarly-priced Fischer SBA-03 or the FXT90.*


 


*Impressed* is the same adjective that I used on Italian forum HERE to describe the sound effect of the FXT90
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Yes, I received yesterday.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 At the moment I thank you for the advice.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 In a few days I'll be more clear...I hope..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





james444 said:


> I concur with all of this and *will be really interested in your final conclusion*. These are some strange sounding IEMs imo, and even though the manufacturer's claims regarding their "PureSound Processor" are most likely bogus, they do indeed sound "EQed" in some odd way.


 

 Same here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Haven't fully made up my mind about them yet.
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Indeed, for $112 bones, they aren't bad. But they're FAR from revolutionary, especially with the likes of the EX600, FXT90, and GR07 (among others) around. *They're still quite fun, nonetheless, if that's what one is after*.


 

 Agreed, I think they do especially well with electronic music where natural instruments are not present.
   


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Do you find the JVC FXT90 to have better intimacy?


 

 Yes, absolutely. The FXT90 can be pretty forward.
   


  Quote: 





joe it said:


> *Impressed* is the same adjective that I used on Italian forum HERE to describe the sound effect of the FXT90
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Glad you like them! They do a lot of things very right.


----------



## jiff

Hey joker are you going to have the FXT90 and the EX600 in the next set of reviews you post, I'd like to see what you think about those 2.  I'm sure I'll love the FXT90 when they get here but just in case I don't or if its has a defect, I'd like to hear what you think of the EX600 because I was close to getting those (as well as the Yamaha EPH-100SL which I don't think you have to review).


----------



## Spec C

Quote: 





jiff said:


> Hey joker are you going to have the FXT90 and the EX600 in the next set of reviews you post, I'd like to see what you think about those 2.  I'm sure I'll love the FXT90 when they get here but just in case I don't or if its has a defect, I'd like to hear what you think of the EX600 because I was close to getting those (as well as the Yamaha EPH-100SL which I don't think you have to review).


 


  X2.
   
  Joker, I am in a situation where I am very undecided on which way to go. I can grab a pair of the ex600, or fxt90 for the low 100's, or just go with something cheaper like the MEE A151 or Brainwavz M2.  I am just looking for a set of IEM's to replace some broken Ety Er6i's for the gym.  Something secure, decently durable, and that will sound atleast as good as the ER6i's or better. I am just typically the kind of person where if $50 gets me "mediocre" quality I rater just spend the extra money and get something that is leaps and bounds better.  If for $50 the A151's will hold up well, fit securely, and produce a decent sound, I am all for saving $75.
   
  I mostly listen to hip hop/rap, with some newer alternative/rock type music.
   
  Thanks for any insight!


----------



## MainTrane

Thanks for the cumulative & insightful reviews ljokerl.
  Hope you add the following to your round-up:
   
  Klipsch X10
  Logitech Ultimate Ears 600
  Denon AH-C560
  Sony MDR-EX510
  Audio-Technica ATH-CKS77
  Brainwavz M4
   
  Comparisons between all of these would be greatly appreciated; as well as with Etymotic's HF5.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jiff said:


> Hey joker are you going to have the FXT90 and the EX600 in the next set of reviews you post, I'd like to see what you think about those 2.  I'm sure I'll love the FXT90 when they get here but just in case I don't or if its has a defect, I'd like to hear what you think of the EX600 because I was close to getting those (as well as the Yamaha EPH-100SL which I don't think you have to review).


 

 Maybe not in the next post, but soon. Both reviews are completed to a large degree. JVCs should go up first.
   
   
  Quote: 





spec c said:


> Joker, I am in a situation where I am very undecided on which way to go. I can grab a pair of the ex600, or fxt90 for the low 100's, or just go with something cheaper like the MEE A151 or Brainwavz M2.  I am just looking for a set of IEM's to replace some broken Ety Er6i's for the gym.  Something secure, decently durable, and that will sound atleast as good as the ER6i's or better. I am just typically the kind of person where if $50 gets me "mediocre" quality I rater just spend the extra money and get something that is leaps and bounds better.  If for $50 the A151's will hold up well, fit securely, and produce a decent sound, I am all for saving $75.
> 
> I mostly listen to hip hop/rap, with some newer alternative/rock type music.
> 
> Thanks for any insight!


 

 The A151 is very different in tuning from the Er6i - better bass punch and depth, but underemphasized treble with less energy. For the gym the A151 works great because of noise-free cable and over-the-ear fit and you certainly won't do much better for $50 if you like BA sound. However, if you wanted something similar to the sound of your ER6i, you may be better off splurging on an Ety HF5. Also, EX600 fit may not be secure enough for gym use.

  
  Quote: 





maintrane said:


> Thanks for the cumulative & insightful reviews ljokerl.
> Hope you add the following to your round-up:
> 
> Klipsch X10
> ...


 


  I only have the UE600 review planned at this time


----------



## Inks

I will loan the X10 soon so expect a review of those as well.


----------



## blupblup

I'm also looking forward to the FXT90 review, I really like these earphones and would be interested to see how they rank alongside some of the other IEMs that Joker has reviewed.
   
  Cheers


----------



## LooptroopRocker

Me too!!!!
  Quote: 





blupblup said:


> I'm also looking forward to the FXT90 review, I really like these earphones and would be interested to see how they rank alongside some of the other IEMs that Joker has reviewed.
> 
> Cheers


----------



## intercrew

I was wondering if there are any double flange earbud replacements out there for the brainwavz M4? The tips that comes with it don't have any so that's one downfall that's holding me back from buying it and instead go for the meelec m11+ for about 40 bucks. 

Has anyone tried a earbud replacement maybe from different brands that would work with the M4? Like the housing for these IEM I'm sure are all different or somewhat similar so I'm kinda afraid that a different ear bud tip won't sound the same as the stock ones in a bad way (lose quality of certain ranges in sound, soundstage, etc)


----------



## zzffnn

Thanks ljokerl for all the wondeful reviews.
  Creative Aurvana 3 sounds interesting.


----------



## olear

I am guessing joker will give the FXT90 8.8 for SQ and 8.0 for value.
   
  joker, thank you for all that you do and I wish you and your loved ones a happy and healthy new year.


----------



## nipit

Quote: 





olear said:


> I am guessing joker will give the FXT90 8.8 for SQ and 8.0 for value.
> 
> joker, thank you for all that you do and I wish you and your loved ones a happy and healthy new year.


 


  From were did you get this info?


----------



## Spec C

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The A151 is very different in tuning from the Er6i - better bass punch and depth, but underemphasized treble with less energy. For the gym the A151 works great because of noise-free cable and over-the-ear fit and you certainly won't do much better for $50 if you like BA sound. However, if you wanted something similar to the sound of your ER6i, you may be better off splurging on an Ety HF5. Also, EX600 fit may not be secure enough for gym use.


 

 Thanks for the reply Joker. 
   
  I could certainly get some HF5's, they are pretty affordable, however I do feel my Er6i lacked bass.  Are these a bit better in this dept?
   
   Would the JVC fxt90's be a better choice then the SONY in regards to staying in place? And would they be on par with the HF5's in SQ, with additional bass?
   
  My head is spinning trying to pull the trigger on something..lol


----------



## olear

Quote: 





nipit said:


> From were did you get this info?


 


 As I said, I am guessing.


----------



## jiff

I'l say he gives the FXT90 a score of 9 for SQ and value.  I know its all very subjective but there are many people who like them over the DDM1 and GR07 which joker gave 8.9 and 9.1 in SQ.  I can't wait tell mine get here sometime between the 6th and the 9th.


----------



## nipit

Quote: 





olear said:


> As I said, I am guessing.


 

 Guessing how much someone will give for earphones... Not my hobby  We should see a review soon.


----------



## Selenium

Hmmm, I actually have used the EX600s at the gym. I don't have any problem with them staying in place. I can face my ear towards the ground and shake my head as if I'm trying to get water out of my ear and they stay in place. YMMV


----------



## estreeter

Contemplating the* GR10*, but I need to be convinced that they are on a similar level to the RS1i in terms of sound - common sense tells me they wont be identical. I dont know what they sell for in the US, but these are expensive (universal)  IEMs here in Oz:
   
http://www.audiophile.com.au/products_grado.html
   
  And 400AUD is the 'special' price - I dont know what they are normally. So much for fiscal restraint in 2012 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Any feedback welcome.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> I will loan the X10 soon so expect a review of those as well.


 

 Good to know 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





intercrew said:


> I was wondering if there are any double flange earbud replacements out there for the brainwavz M4? The tips that comes with it don't have any so that's one downfall that's holding me back from buying it and instead go for the meelec m11+ for about 40 bucks.
> Has anyone tried a earbud replacement maybe from different brands that would work with the M4? Like the housing for these IEM I'm sure are all different or somewhat similar so I'm kinda afraid that a different ear bud tip won't sound the same as the stock ones in a bad way (lose quality of certain ranges in sound, soundstage, etc)


 

 If I had to guess, I'd say the M11+ tip set ($10) will fit. I'm guessing the nozzle of the M4 is notched and you can just ask someone who owns one to measure the diameter with a ruler. Something between 4.5 and 6mm should fit MEElec tips. Tips do usually affect sound quality but the differences are often minor and stock tips may not necessarily be the best for your ears anyway.
   


  Quote: 





zzffnn said:


> Thanks ljokerl for all the wondeful reviews.
> Creative Aurvana 3 sounds interesting.


 
   
  No problem, glad they were useful!
   

  Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, thank you for all that you do and I wish you and your loved ones a happy and healthy new year.


 

 Thank you, I appreciate that. 
   


  Quote: 





spec c said:


> Thanks for the reply Joker.
> 
> I could certainly get some HF5's, they are pretty affordable, however I do feel my Er6i lacked bass.  Are these a bit better in this dept?
> 
> ...


 

 The HF5 has better bass extension than the ER6i but overall bass quantity isn't much greater. I would feel more secure at the gym with the FXT90s than any of Sony's EX -series earphones. FXT90 easily sounds as good as the HF5 and has a lot more bass.


----------



## intercrew

Thank you joker  do you happen to know anyone that owns an Brainwavz by any chance? Probably not cause you've been over hundreds of IEM's but if you do please let me know.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





intercrew said:


> Thank you joker
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I don't but I'm sure someone in one of the M4 review threads will be happy to answer your questions.


----------



## intercrew

ljokerl said:


> I don't but I'm sure someone in one of the M4 review threads will be happy to answer your questions.



I've went to the mp3nation forum where they sell the brainwavz and was able to find out that the diameter of the nozzle is 5mm, I'm guessing this is perfect for the m11+ earbuds?

Thanks again


----------



## ljokerl

Happy 2012, everyone! Thank you all for the support - this thread wouldn't be possible without all of the positive feedback, discussion, and suggestions. All the best to you and yours!
   
  Quote: 





intercrew said:


> I've went to the mp3nation forum where they sell the brainwavz and was able to find out that the diameter of the nozzle is 5mm, I'm guessing this is perfect for the m11+ earbuds?
> Thanks again


 

 Yes, that should work fine


----------



## LooptroopRocker

Thank you Joker!!! I honestly think that your thread is one of the most impressive and noteworthy individual/collective effort on the internet, hands down a testimony of the awesomeness of forums across the world wide web. For this, I salute you!
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Happy 2012, everyone! Thank you all for the support - this thread wouldn't be possible without all of the positive feedback, discussion, and suggestions. All the best to you and yours!
> 
> 
> Yes, that should work fine


----------



## DervishD

Hi fellow ljokerl 
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Happy 2012, everyone! Thank you all for the support - this thread wouldn't be possible without all of the positive feedback, discussion, and suggestions. All the best to you and yours!
> 
> 
> Yes, that should work fine


 

 With all due respect to commenters, suggesters and all people who encouraged you to keep adding models (and I think I'm amongst them), this thread wouldn't be possible without *your* altruist effort. Of course, encouragement is important, but it's you who do the testing, you write the reviews, etc. I know first hand how hard is to write a review, it takes time, critical listening where you are not enjoying music but trying to pick thinks and taking notes, and (given the size of your review list) a good bunch of money.
   
  So, thank YOU a WHOLE LOT for what you've given us here. I don't know how many times I've recommended an IEM to a friend using your reviews as reference.
   
  I also want to thank all fellow members who contributed to this thread making comments, suggestions, etc. It's threads like this the ones that make me feel the sense of community in these forums and that feels great.
   
  You're a great guy, ljokerl! Happy new year and I'm eager to read your new reviews in this new 2012!
   
  And thanks


----------



## i2ehan

If |joker| had a nickel for every time someone has recommended his thread, he'd own as many customs IEM's as the average joe around here. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 See what I did there? That's right, because even at 7:35AM in the morning, I'm just that good.


----------



## lukeskymac

Hello there everyone, it's been some time since I've chimed in to talk about the GR07
   
  The sound has slightly improved mostly all-round since then, but I've concluded that, at least with the nano, it simply sounds too bass-light. I've compared it with what's left of my ADDIEM (the left drivers burned out or something) in a rather amusing way and didn't notice differences in bass quantity. Again, quality is something else entirely, the GR07 wins here.
   
   
  So, craving for more bass (for some artitsts/recordings) and an overall more "authoritative" driving, with more breathing room etecetera, I've just ordered a ZO2, and will order a LOD cable as soon as i finish this post.
   
   
  Will inform you of my impressions when I get it.


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> Hello there everyone, it's been some time since I've chimed in to talk about the GR07
> 
> The sound has slightly improved mostly all-round since then, but I've concluded that, at least with the nano, it simply sounds too bass-light. I've compared it with what's left of my ADDIEM (the left drivers burned out or something) in a rather amusing way and didn't notice differences in bass quantity. Again, quality is something else entirely, the GR07 wins here.
> 
> ...


 

 Looking Forward to your Comments with the ZO2/R07/Nano.  I had a Nano 4th with the GR07's and I will agree with you on this. Playing the Nano Flat Vs MY Sony Flat, was like night and day. However, I did sell my Nano's before the R07 was fully Burned in


----------



## garcsa

_Hi joker,_​ [size=xx-large]_HAPPY NEW YEAR!_[/size]​ _Thanks for reviews!_​   
 I hope it's clear for everybody that all ado is about MUSIC!!!​ $15 or $1500 phones ,  it's all the same - just feel all right and be happy!!​ Dear joker,  do you have any summary about your influence on the IEM market?​ [size=medium]THANKS GOD YOU HAVE AN INFLUENCE![/size]​   
Please do not missunderstand  me  - now I'm listening  Bossa Nova on some ViSangs thanks to you...​ ... and , I'm sure there are hundreds of  other EARS using headphones recomanded by you to ​ listen their favorite MUSIC....​ [size=medium]Long live R'n'R ![/size]​ [size=medium]Regards Csaba ![/size]​


----------



## garcsa

So pathetic, but truth ! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> _Hi joker,_​ [size=xx-large]_HAPPY NEW YEAR!_[/size]​ _Thanks for reviews!_​
> I hope it's clear for everybody that all ado is about MUSIC!!!​ $15 or $1500 phones ,  it's all the same - just feel all right and be happy!!​ Dear joker,  do you have any summary about your influence on the IEM market?​ [size=medium]THANKS GOD YOU HAVE AN INFLUENCE![/size]​
> Please do not missunderstand  me  - now I'm listening  Bossa Nova on some ViSangs thanks to you...​ ... and , I'm sure there are hundreds of  other EARS using headphones recomanded by you to ​ listen their favorite MUSIC....​ [size=medium]Long live R'n'R ![/size]​ [size=medium]Regards Csaba ![/size]​


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> Thank you Joker!!! I honestly think that your thread is one of the most impressive and noteworthy individual/collective effort on the internet, hands down a testimony of the awesomeness of forums across the world wide web. For this, I salute you!


 
   
  Quote: 





dervishd said:


> With all due respect to commenters, suggesters and all people who encouraged you to keep adding models (and I think I'm amongst them), this thread wouldn't be possible without *your* altruist effort. Of course, encouragement is important, but it's you who do the testing, you write the reviews, etc. I know first hand how hard is to write a review, it takes time, critical listening where you are not enjoying music but trying to pick thinks and taking notes, and (given the size of your review list) a good bunch of money.
> 
> So, thank YOU a WHOLE LOT for what you've given us here. I don't know how many times I've recommended an IEM to a friend using your reviews as reference.
> 
> I also want to thank all fellow members who contributed to this thread making comments, suggestions, etc. It's threads like this the ones that make me feel the sense of community in these forums and that feels great.


 

 Cheers, much appreciated
   


  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> If |joker| had a nickel for every time someone has recommended his thread, he'd own as many customs IEM's as the average joe around here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yep, still got it when most people are just entering their first rem cycle on new year's day 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   


  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> ​  I hope it's clear for everybody that all ado is about MUSIC!!!​ $15 or $1500 phones ,  it's all the same - just feel all right and be happy!!​ Dear joker,  do you have any summary about your influence on the IEM market?​ [size=medium]THANKS GOD YOU HAVE AN INFLUENCE![/size]​


 


  Thanks, and I agree. I've taken a little break this weekend (more reviews coming soon) with my Miracle but honestly, when listening for pleasure, I get very nearly as much enjoyment with the HiSound Crystal that I keep in my laptop bag. I don't get hung up on influence - as long as the thread is opening up new options for IEM buyers and maybe helping them make final decisions, I'm thrilled.


----------



## aleex

Just a general question...how impractical is it to wear IEMs over-the-ear? Especially thinking about Fischer Eterna and SoundMagic PL50. I will be using mine on-the-go, and I really need something that's easy to insert/remove etcetera. Some of my "fav picks" have been compulsory over-the-ear, so I'm not sure. 
  Also, regarding sound signature, has anyone had experience going from very bassy IEMs to more neutral ones? I'm considering something like the RE0, but at the same time, a much safer bet would be something like Eterna.


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> Looking Forward to your Comments with the ZO2/R07/Nano.  I had a Nano 4th with the GR07's and I will agree with you on this. Playing the Nano Flat Vs MY Sony Flat, was like night and day. However, I did sell my Nano's before the R07 was fully Burned in


 

  
  Glad to see I'm not the only one. I was really started to question my supposed preference for balanced sound 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
   
  As to Joker, there simply isn't enough that can be said. Your guide has proven to be invaluable, and I'd have probably bought Monster Turbines (or god forbid, Beats!) instead of GR07 if it were not for head-fiers like you.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, I'm just read this thread
http://www.head-fi.org/t/586909/the-thermaltake-isurus-rebranded-audio-technica-and-the-philips-she3580-substantial-finds
  and was interested in your opinion on the Philips SHE3580, from what Donutz said, it's really THAT good


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Well dsnuts planned on plugging the Isurus then added the SHE3580 after trying them on my recommendation (I didn't talk to him beforehand, he just read one of my old posts about them and decided to try them out) but popular opinion seems to be swaying towards the SHE3580 so it's not just donutz


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Double post


----------



## estreeter

Sigh, if only $15 phones WERE the same as $1500 phones. I'd own at least a *hundred* of those $15 phones by now.


----------



## ljokerl

Added PureSound ClarityOne and Phonak 012
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2B12) PureSound ClarityOne*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jan 2012
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C44) Audéo Phonak Perfect Bass 012*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Dec 2011
> ...


 
   
   

  
  .Quote: 





aleex said:


> Just a general question...how impractical is it to wear IEMs over-the-ear? Especially thinking about Fischer Eterna and SoundMagic PL50. I will be using mine on-the-go, and I really need something that's easy to insert/remove etcetera. Some of my "fav picks" have been compulsory over-the-ear, so I'm not sure.
> Also, regarding sound signature, has anyone had experience going from very bassy IEMs to more neutral ones? I'm considering something like the RE0, but at the same time, a much safer bet would be something like Eterna.


 


  With a bit of practice, over-the-ear wear (without cable guides or memory wire) shouldn't be time-consuming at all. Just give yourself time to get used to it. Same goes for sound signature - audio memory is fleeting so after a couple of days/weeks you should be able to judge a different signature on its own merits rather than as a contrast to your previous earphones. Whether you will like what you end up hearing is a different story  


  Quote: 





lukeskymac said:


> As to Joker, there simply isn't enough that can be said. Your guide has proven to be invaluable, and I'd have probably bought Monster Turbines (or god forbid, Beats!) instead of GR07 if it were not for head-fiers like you.


 

 Glad it's helped. Hopefully you are still having more fun obsessing over the GR07 than you would from just listening to Beats or Turbines 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, I'm just read this thread
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/586909/the-thermaltake-isurus-rebranded-audio-technica-and-the-philips-she3580-substantial-finds
> and was interested in your opinion on the Philips SHE3580, from what Donutz said, it's really THAT good


 

 I've never heard them.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, I'm just read this thread
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/586909/the-thermaltake-isurus-rebranded-audio-technica-and-the-philips-she3580-substantial-finds
> and was interested in your opinion on the Philips SHE3580, from what Donutz said, it's really THAT good


 

 If I may throw in my 2c, strictly speaking of sound quality, these are really surprisingly good value imo. But build quality isn't anything special, plus you need to factor in the price of third party tips for them to sound best, since the stock tips are of poor quality. Overall they're certainly a bargain buy, but maybe not the giant killers that some would like them to be:
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> That said, I've been doing a bit of A/B listening with the SHE3580, and the Yamaha EPH-100 are where they reach their ceiling. The latter have a similar sound signature, but are simply more refined in every aspect. Not bad for a $10 phone, since the Yamahas cost $150.


 
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added PureSound ClarityOne...


 
   
  Spot-on review, thanks.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


james444 said:


> Spot-on review, thanks.


 

 Ditto.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





james444 said:


> If I may throw in my 2c, strictly speaking of sound quality, these are really surprisingly good value imo. But build quality isn't anything special, plus you need to factor in the price of third party tips for them to sound best, since the stock tips are of poor quality. Overall they're certainly a bargain buy, but maybe not the giant killers that some would like them to be
> 
> That said, I've been doing a bit of A/B listening with the SHE3580, and the Yamaha EPH-100 are where they reach their ceiling. The latter have a similar sound signature, but are simply more refined in every aspect. Not bad for a $10 phone, since the Yamahas cost $150.


 


  Thanks, this is what I needed to hear!!!
  Many either bash them as cheap Flavor of the Month earphones, and some worship them, this is perfect, balancing the Goods and the Bads
  What brands third party tips are best? I never buy third party tips before, but I want to get the best out of my earphones, so what do you recommend?


----------



## james444

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> What brands third party tips are best? I never buy third party tips before, but I want to get the best out of my earphones, so what do you recommend?


 

 Well, the stock tips are too flimsy and lack support for a secure seal, but any better quality tips will do. I use Ultimate Ears (TF10) silicon tips.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





james444 said:


> Well, the stock tips are too flimsy and lack support for a secure seal, but any better quality tips will do. I use Ultimate Ears (TF10) silicon tips.


 


  Well, what if I don't have the UE's? Can I get buy ONLY the tips and not the IEM's?


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


xinn3r said:


> Well, what if I don't have the UE's? Can I get buy ONLY the tips and not the IEM's?


 

*Indeed.*


----------



## Joe Bloggs

To be honest, as the guy who first introduced these SHE3580 to the community, I'm surprised they got such a universally positive reception based on their stock sound alone after Dsnuts publicized them.  I'd heard high head-fi before (etys, Senn HD580--owned, Sony R10--auditioned) but all my high head-fi broke down 2 years ago.  I got the SHE3580 looking for something cheap and cheerful to tide me over.  They sounded pretty good out of the box but with no preconception of their quality at the time, I reached for the EQ pretty quickly.  I got them to sound pretty good with a 10 band EQ, but I was really floored only after going through PiccoloNamek's tutorial on equalizing with a parametric EQ.  I now had total control over the frequency spectrum, and with increasing experience I knew exactly what to change.  When I was done, these SHE3580 sounded phenomenal--they left the Etys, one of the most highly regarded IEMs at ~$200, in the dust.  They were more detailed AND less sibilant, and everything sounded more "real", for lack of a better description.
   
  Eventually I also EQed the etys to sound pretty damn good.  The amount of equalization required was less and the result at least started sounding better than on the SHE3580 on some tracks, but not others.  It was a might close race.  Then the etys broke again. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Taking a car analogy, I think good cheap-fi is like riceburners like the WRX and Evolution, whereas good high head-fi is like supercars like Ferrari and Lamborghini--they'll smoke the riceburners no problem.  But PiccoloNamek's EQ tutorial (done correctly--which isn't easy, there were some things in his methodology I had to modify for it to really work) is like fully ricing out the WRX for race day with a 1000hp engine, race tires and full suspension overhaul.  The WRX will now smoke pretty much any supercar in stock form and only lose in turn to supercars in race trim, and even then it will be a much closer race than before.
   
  Putting the analogy aside, what I mean is that the main difference we hear between cheap headphones and expensive headphones, and even among different expensive headphones, is the "sound signature", ie the frequency response.  Especially offensive is, literally, "peaky treble"--treble FR characterised by sharp peaks, caused by standing waves caused by closing the ear with the IEMs / headphones themselves, much like standing waves in room acoustics but in a much smaller room (hence shorter wavelengths, hence higher frequencies, ie treble).  Now I don't know what voodoo expensive headphones do, but e.g. I only hear one peak on the Etys, versus 4 in the SHE3580.  Perhaps some of the peaks on the SHE3580 are inherent to the drivers themselves, perhaps Etymotic did extensive research with hundreds of subjects and tuned the drivers to tune out those peaks for the majority of users.  But whatever this voodoo is on high-end headphones, it can be done just as well in software by EQ.
   
  Anyway, to put a long story short, once FR differences are nullified in software, it'll be much harder to tell cheap-fi from high-fi: you'd have to put your finger on things like enclosure resonance, harmonic distortion, etc. and these things are surprisingly well-controlled even on budget stuff these days.  Especially IEMs, since there just isn't much of an enclosure to rattle. (or maybe just because tiny-driver technology has just advanced THAT far).
   
  Speaking of which, it'd be great if headphone reviews could separate the FR ("sound signature") aspect from the actual performance aspect of the headphones.  What someone like Joker could do, with his massive collection, is create a reference standard frequency response based on the pair of IEMs with his favourite sound signature (after tuning out any standing wave resonances), then EQ any other headphones to have the same FR before starting the review.  (I have a methodology based on playing test tones in real time through two passes of parametric equalization that can allow this matching to be done easily by ear)  Then he can comment on two things separately: how far the stock FR deviates from the "ideal" signature (and how hard it is to adjust), and more importantly,
   
_*how the headphones actually sound like, when any sound signature preference influence has been accounted for.*_
   
  As a bonus, the stock sound signature can also be characterized in an easy-to-read, detailed graph, like this:
   


joe bloggs said:


> I've analyzed them on my parametric equalizer.  Here, take a look at how they sound to me:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


  ------
  Imagine if we had one of these graphs for each headphone Joker reviewed.  It'd almost be as good as the HeadRoom set of frequency response graphs.  Better, in some respects, because they'd reflect the preferences of an actual person and show resonant peaks (those spikes on the right) that are actually heard at the eardrum, rather than what's picked up by a microphone (that we'd have to guess whether all those spikes in the graph would actually be heard in real life or actually cancels out).
   
  (whew!)


----------



## garcsa

Just read carefully. "  $15 or $1500 phones ,  it's all the same - just feel all right and be happy!!" Concentrate on the second part of the sentence, ..
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Start-up wiht your nick and avatar, I saw The Boss before some 30 years, The River Tour here in Europe..., and I have ticket for his Prague concert this summer!
  Long live R'n'R!
  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Sigh, if only $15 phones WERE the same as $1500 phones. I'd own at least a *hundred* of those $15 phones by now.


----------



## nipit

I demand a FXT90 review! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Seriously, joker, when are you going to post it?


----------



## olear

joker, how does Sony *7550* compare to ex600/1000 in terms of how they bright they are, bass quantity/extension, and mids.


----------



## maverickronin

Tyll has some graphs of all three if you want a quick and dirty comparison.
   
7550, EX600, EX1000


----------



## olear

Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> Tyll has some graphs of all three if you want a quick and dirty comparison.
> 
> 7550, EX600, EX1000


 

 Thanks


----------



## olear

Can you interpret those graphs?


----------



## maverickronin

From the FR numbers the EX1000 is the brightest and has very slightly better bass extension than the other 2.  The EX600 should be noticeably less bright than the EX1000 and the 7550 looks just a little bit darker than the EX600.
   
  The rest of the numbers are fairly similar but the distortion plot shows the EX1000 should be cleaner at higher volumes than the other 2.


----------



## olear

I knew that.


----------



## kanuka

hey joker, did you lowered the build quality rating of the ck10 ??? why?


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> Just read carefully. "  $15 or $1500 phones ,  it's all the same - just feel all right and be happy!!" Concentrate on the second part of the sentence, ..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  Relax - I was just yanking your chain and engaging in a little idle 'wish it were so'.  The Boss doesnt come to Oz very often, and it doesnt arouse the same mania as it did when he toured on the back of 'Born in the USA' back in the 80s - I stood in a line for 8 hours to buy 4 tickets while scalpers in front of me bought up all the good seats. It was a work day - fortunately, my boss was a rabid Springsteen fan. The last time I saw him with the E-Street band was in early 2003 and the audience was an interesting mix of parents with their kids and a few Boomers : no sign of the hysteria which accompanied his 80s tour.
   
  In IEM-related news, I am still resisting the lure of the 272s, W4, GR07 and GR10. As you said, it should be about the music, not the gear


----------



## kiteki

The FR of the EX800ST has a cleaner shape than the EX600 and EX1000 on both the Tyll graphs and Sonove graphs, if you imagine the shape as a sine wave that is.
   
  The reviews seem to praise the mids of the EX800ST, which would make sense if Sony designed them as studio monitors for musicians performing, like vocalists.
   
  FR will only tell you the volume level, not the quality of the mids.


----------



## kiteki

I have a question, not counting the JVC's or Sony's, what is the best dynamic driver IEM for classical music?  Any price level, thanks in advance to anyone sharing their experiences.


----------



## a_recording

My best experience with classical and dynamic drivers has probably been the Radius DDM, only because the level of detail on the bass really helped give orchestral pieces authority in big dynamic volume swings. It also grounded instruments like piano or cello really well. It isn't the most engaging IEM for things like strings in chamber music though, for that I'd go for the RE-0 or GR07.
   
  On a related note when I heard the EX800ST I thought it was very, very neutral. I only had my 07's to compare with, and it was slightly warm. It struck me as competent but not immediately engaging even compared to the 07.


----------



## kiteki

Okay, let me rephrase, string instruments specifically, I don't want any majestic bass or anything.
   
  I broke my Sony EX700 two days ago, somehow fried it while opamp rolling... that was the best one I've heard, now I'm using EX600 and need a new dynamic for string instruments specifically, mids and highs, not interested in the EX1000 or JVC FX700.
   
  You can basically turn off all bass under 400Hz with solo violin and it still sounds great.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





james444 said:


> Spot-on review, thanks.


 

  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Ditto.


 

 Thanks
   


  Quote: 





nipit said:


> I demand a FXT90 review!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Soon, unless I postpone  it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> hey joker, did you lowered the build quality rating of the ck10 ??? why?


 

 Strain relief on my unit lost anchoring. It is over 3 years old now but it doesn't look like it was anchored that well to start with. Doesn't affect functionality but still disappointing.
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> I have a question, not counting the JVC's or Sony's, what is the best dynamic driver IEM for classical music?  Any price level, thanks in advance to anyone sharing their experiences.


 


  RE272 for me. If its bass weren't so polite it would be nearly perfect.


----------



## kiteki

How about between the RE272, E-Q7 and JVC FXx00?  Anything I'm missing?
   
  Wasn't very fond of the Final Audio Heaven S audition.


----------



## Y2HBK

I had been enjoying my budget ne-7m's for the past couple of years. I used to have a nice pair of shure's years ago that was stolen at my old job. The 7m's tided me over for awhile with some t-400 comply tips.
   
  I have recently been looking into upgrading to a higher quality IEM. I do enjoy IEMs with heavier bass, but still value clear/crisp mids and highs. My choices in music are generally rock and alternative but I do enjoy a lot of acoustical tracks as well. 
   
  I was originally looking at the RE0 but decided I wanted to step up to a more "serious" IEM. With a budget of around $250-ish I was looking at the RE-272 and the ATH-CK10. They seem to be closest to my budget and receive some nice praise. Does anyone have any recommendations for me? I currently have no amp and listen to music off my Nano and MacBook Pro - but will me in the market for an amp down the road depending on the IEM I purchase. So any ideas for an amp to accompany your IEM recommendation would be appreciated as well.


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Relax - I was just yanking your chain and engaging in a little idle 'wish it were so'.  The Boss doesnt come to Oz very often, and it doesnt arouse the same mania as it did when he toured on the back of 'Born in the USA' back in the 80s - I stood in a line for 8 hours to buy 4 tickets while scalpers in front of me bought up all the good seats. It was a work day - fortunately, my boss was a rabid Springsteen fan. The last time I saw him with the E-Street band was in early 2003 and the audience was an interesting mix of parents with their kids and a few Boomers : no sign of the hysteria which accompanied his 80s tour.
> 
> In IEM-related news, I am still resisting the lure of the 272s, W4, GR07 and GR10. As you said, it should be about the music, not the gear


----------



## Niyologist

I'm really tempted to get the Xeport 5010-8. It is said to have a better sound signature than the SP51 and even the Hippo VB. Probably one of the best budget earphones so far.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  i'm not sure i get what you mean 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. but  did you fix it or is it fixable?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> I had been enjoying my budget ne-7m's for the past couple of years. I used to have a nice pair of shure's years ago that was stolen at my old job. The 7m's tided me over for awhile with some t-400 comply tips.
> 
> I have recently been looking into upgrading to a higher quality IEM. I do enjoy IEMs with heavier bass, but still value clear/crisp mids and highs. My choices in music are generally rock and alternative but I do enjoy a lot of acoustical tracks as well.
> 
> I was originally looking at the RE0 but decided I wanted to step up to a more "serious" IEM. With a budget of around $250-ish I was looking at the RE-272 and the ATH-CK10. They seem to be closest to my budget and receive some nice praise. Does anyone have any recommendations for me? I currently have no amp and listen to music off my Nano and MacBook Pro - but will me in the market for an amp down the road depending on the IEM I purchase. So any ideas for an amp to accompany your IEM recommendation would be appreciated as well.


 
  Also look into the GR07 and FXT90. They're at a slightly lower price point, but also have similar reputations for sound, and have different sound signatures to consider.


----------



## Y2HBK

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Also look into the GR07 and FXT90. They're at a slightly lower price point, but also have similar reputations for sound, and have different sound signatures to consider.


 


  Thanks for the advice. The GR07 sounds like it has a lot of what I am looking for. It appears to be a great candidate for an IEM that eases me into the "higher end" models. The lower price point (I found for $179 on Amazon from VSonic themselves) will give me some more room for an amp if I so choose. 
   
  Given my use for these as previously stated - do the GR07's benefit from an amp? A lot of my listening is done at work as I have a desk job - so I would prefer something portable that will not take up a lot of space - but its not a requirement.


----------



## kiteki

I think a DAC raises the bar more than an amp, in my experience.  Look into something like the iBasso D-Zero.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> Thanks for the advice. The GR07 sounds like it has a lot of what I am looking for. It appears to be a great candidate for an IEM that eases me into the "higher end" models.


 

 Yeah, that's the exact reason I chose them as well.
   
   
   


y2hbk said:


> $179 on Amazon from VSonic themselves


 
  Just FYI, the one sold on Amazon is sold by a third party. I got mine from them though, so they are reliable.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> How about between the RE272, E-Q7 and JVC FXx00?  Anything I'm missing?
> 
> Wasn't very fond of the Final Audio Heaven S audition.


 

 The e-Q7 is not dynamic and the FX700 is a JVC. They don't fit your criteria.
   


  Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> I had been enjoying my budget ne-7m's for the past couple of years. I used to have a nice pair of shure's years ago that was stolen at my old job. The 7m's tided me over for awhile with some t-400 comply tips.
> 
> I have recently been looking into upgrading to a higher quality IEM. I do enjoy IEMs with heavier bass, but still value clear/crisp mids and highs. My choices in music are generally rock and alternative but I do enjoy a lot of acoustical tracks as well.
> 
> I was originally looking at the RE0 but decided I wanted to step up to a more "serious" IEM. With a budget of around $250-ish I was looking at the RE-272 and the ATH-CK10. They seem to be closest to my budget and receive some nice praise. Does anyone have any recommendations for me? I currently have no amp and listen to music off my Nano and MacBook Pro - but will me in the market for an amp down the road depending on the IEM I purchase. So any ideas for an amp to accompany your IEM recommendation would be appreciated as well.


 

 I am not sure why you are looking at the RE0, CK10, and RE272 if you like heavier bass. Even the GR07 and Sony EX600 may be too bass-light coming from an NE-7M. If you are looking for that level of bass presence, you are better off with a JVC - an FX500 or FXT90 - or maybe an ATH-CKM99 or FutureSonics Atrios. 
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> i'm not sure i get what you mean
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Fixed already.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  that's a relief... (a strain one 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) . would have like to see a picture of that problem


----------



## Y2HBK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The e-Q7 is not dynamic and the FX700 is a JVC. They don't fit your criteria.
> 
> 
> I am not sure why you are looking at the RE0, CK10, and RE272 if you like heavier bass. Even the GR07 and Sony EX600 may be too bass-light coming from an NE-7M. If you are looking for that level of bass presence, you are better off with a JVC - an FX500 or FXT90 - or maybe an ATH-CKM99 or FutureSonics Atrios.
> ...


 
   
  Hey - bear with me - everyone starts somewhere. I am still easing into this and trying to learn. It wasn't until the past few days that I had ever read anything about the differences between dynamic and BA transducers, ever looked at the sound glossary to understand how people describe their phones, etc. The amount of information around here is somewhat overbearing. 
   
  I may prefer the type of bass on the NE-7M because I really don't know any better. I think I would rather have a punchy, yet "well-weighted" bass rather than one that overpowers the mids and highs. The more I look at it, making a leap into an IEM like the CK10 may be so drastic that what really sounds beautiful may sound terrible to me because, again, I don't know any better and haven't "realized what I have been missing."
   
  The more I researched through the forums about the HiFiMan's and saw more complaints about the build quality - the more I steered away from them. Based on your review of the GR07, it seems like a quality IEM that would be a step in the right direction. Although, it sounds like the FXT90's can go lower and still offer great separation and imaging. This is why I came here looking for some help. In a lot of ways its like looking for a needle in a haystack!!


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## rlmoss

Joker, thanks for clarifying distinction between Phonak Perfect Bass (the $189 one and 012 @ $99). What strange pricing: did Audeo try a focus group? I'm with you: near double the cost because filter set differs. Makes no sense to me.
   
  I can't figure out the e-mail alert internals: just got the url link to your early December post today. I should take a look at how I set preferences.
   
  Richard


----------



## olear

joker, what are the basic differences between FX500,700 and FXT90? Do they all have good bass quantity, bright and mid forward?
   
  Have you heard Yamaha Eph 100? If yes, where would you put their SQ rating? Are they in the same league as GR07 or FXT90?


----------



## kiteki

olear... nothing is bass heavy, bright, and mid-forward all at the same time, you should play with an equalizer...
   
  Also, list your current, past and future IEM's in your profile.


----------



## Freefallr4545

Hope Springs eternal


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> The more I researched through the forums about the HiFiMan's and saw more complaints about the build quality - the more I steered away from them. Based on your review of the GR07, it seems like a quality IEM that would be a step in the right direction. Although, it sounds like the FXT90's can go lower and still offer great separation and imaging. This is why I came here looking for some help. In a lot of ways its like looking for a needle in a haystack!!


 

 The GR07 is plenty deep, it just doesn't have very thick note presentation so it sounds lightweight and 'punchy' at the low end rather than full and weighty. The FXT90 bass quantity is about the lowest I would recommend for someone used to 'consumer' sound (e.g. NE-7M) and not actively looking to take a step towards accuracy. While I do think the GR07 is slightly better from a technical standpoint - tighter, clearer, more neutral, more spacious, and a touch more detailed - there's not much of a purpose in paying extra for an earphone you may like less. That said, you used to own a Shure and unless it was an SE115 it probably wasn't as bassy as the NE-7M so you sort of know what to expect from a more accurate in-ear. The beauty of the FXT90 is ease of use, though - it's a very user-friendly earphone that's shallow-insertion and fairly forgiving of different types of tips. It's got good separation and imaging - it's no FX700, but quite close considering what it costs. 

  
  Quote: 





rlmoss said:


> Joker, thanks for clarifying distinction between Phonak Perfect Bass (the $189 one and 012 @ $99). What strange pricing: did Audeo try a focus group? I'm with you: near double the cost because filter set differs. Makes no sense to me.
> 
> I can't figure out the e-mail alert internals: just got the url link to your early December post today. I should take a look at how I set preferences.
> 
> Richard


 

 The pricing used to make sense before they raised the PFE prices to $160+, when the difference between them was just the cost of the filters. Now you're not only paying extra for the filters that don't come with the 012, but for the other accessories as well.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Y2HBK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR07 is plenty deep, it just doesn't have very thick note presentation so it sounds lightweight and 'punchy' at the low end rather than full and weighty. The FXT90 bass quantity is about the lowest I would recommend for someone used to 'consumer' sound (e.g. NE-7M) and not actively looking to take a step towards accuracy. While I do think the GR07 is slightly better from a technical standpoint - tighter, clearer, more neutral, more spacious, and a touch more detailed - there's not much of a purpose in paying extra for an earphone you may like less. That said, you used to own a Shure and unless it was an SE115 it probably wasn't as bassy as the NE-7M so you sort of know what to expect from a more accurate in-ear. The beauty of the FXT90 is ease of use, though - it's a very user-friendly earphone that's shallow-insertion and fairly forgiving of different types of tips. It's got good separation and imaging - it's no FX700, but quite close considering what it costs.


 
   
  Great info - exactly the type of information I was looking for. I believe the SE315 is the model I had. I was able to get it dirt cheap through a manufacturer accommodation deal when I worked retail. It was nowhere near as bassy as the NE-7M and I enjoyed it. I also have a Bose IME2i set that was given to me as a gift - which I am not very fond of. The isolation is terrible and I find the highs too harsh for my taste. 
   
  I am certainly looking more into taking steps toward a more accurate IEM vs consumer. I also don't want buyers remorse, which I tend to get a lot. I am very easy to "upsell" myself when looking at products. My taste in music varies a lot. I will listen to classic rock, alternative, metal... but also several acoustic tracks, some techno, etc. I believe I am ready to delve into a more accurate phone so I can reap the full benefits of lossless audio tracks. 
   
  I think my concern with the FX700, which I *was* looking at at one point in time before I cut my budget back a tad, was the isolation. Comfort is very important to me as I listen to music a lot while relaxing and not necessarily "on the go," but I want a phone with a great seal as well. Also while at work, I am often removing my phones and reinserting them as I do move around a bit and need to get on/off the phone a lot. I read your reviews for the FX700 and the GR07 and have to ask myself if the difference is really enough to justify double the price tag. Budget was really cut because after reading several reviews, it seemed like there were more "bang for the buck" options at a lower price point. The more I read and learn about different types of sound, transducers, etc... the more I learn the benefit of the higher end models. I begin to ask myself If I am willing to spend $340 on the FX700, is it more worthwhile to look into other 1C or even some 1B models.
   
  The novel Ive written aside - I am willing to sacrifice a more "boomy consumer bass" for accuracy. As my collection of lossless audio files grows, it defeats to purpose to me it seems to not focus more on accuracy. I believe I just put a bit too much emphasis on bass in my original post. 
   
  I think I am going to start off with the GR07. It sounds like a great phone to ease me more into the higher end IEMs. Why do I feel like I could see this becoming an obsession?


----------



## Niyologist

Is there a way to connect my Fiio E6 to a Bluetooth Speaker. Will a Bluetooth Transmitter do?


----------



## murano

ljokerl -
   
  Since you have tried a lot of wooden IEMs, I thought I'd ask how you would rate wooden IEMs in terms of isolation compared to non-wooden IEMs.  I had a chance to demo the Brookstone wooden IEMs at the store for a short time and I thought they sounded pretty good.  However, I couldn't tell how well they isolated during the short demo and I need IEM's with at least above average isolation for my daily commute on public transportation.
   
  btw - This and the deal thread are the two threads that keep me coming back regularly to read the entire forum. Thanks!


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> I think I am going to start off with the GR07. It sounds like a great phone to ease me more into the higher end IEMs. Why do I feel like I could see this becoming an obsession?


 


  Once you get past the GR07, FXT90, and other top-tier IEMS, the law of diminishing returns starts to feel all too real. Yo'll end up spending >$300-350 to get a 5% improvement in 'technical ability.' For the most part, a lot of other top-tiers I've listened to just sound a lot like sound signature sidegrades to me. One IEM will ALWAYS do something better than another, so in the end if you find a signature you like, stick with it. A member on here, Pianist, said the RE0 is a top-tier iem. You can read the first part and conclusion of my GR07 review to get a better idea of what I'm saying here. Good luck with your search!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> Great info - exactly the type of information I was looking for. I believe the SE315 is the model I had. I was able to get it dirt cheap through a manufacturer accommodation deal when I worked retail. It was nowhere near as bassy as the NE-7M and I enjoyed it. I also have a Bose IME2i set that was given to me as a gift - which I am not very fond of. The isolation is terrible and I find the highs too harsh for my taste.
> 
> I am certainly looking more into taking steps toward a more accurate IEM vs consumer. I also don't want buyers remorse, which I tend to get a lot. I am very easy to "upsell" myself when looking at products. My taste in music varies a lot. I will listen to classic rock, alternative, metal... but also several acoustic tracks, some techno, etc. I believe I am ready to delve into a more accurate phone so I can reap the full benefits of lossless audio tracks.
> 
> ...


 

 In that case the only concern is sibilance - I am not familiar with the MIE2 but I doubt a Bose set has exaggerated treble presence. The GR07 has slightly peaky treble so depending on fit, track, and personal tolerance it can be a little sibilant, especially early on.
   
  As for Head-Fi being an obsession, I was supposed to be done after I bought the RE0...
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Is there a way to connect my Fiio E6 to a Bluetooth Speaker. Will a Bluetooth Transmitter do?


 

 It will but... why?
   


  Quote: 





murano said:


> ljokerl -
> 
> Since you have tried a lot of wooden IEMs, I thought I'd ask how you would rate wooden IEMs in terms of isolation compared to non-wooden IEMs.  I had a chance to demo the Brookstone wooden IEMs at the store for a short time and I thought they sounded pretty good.  However, I couldn't tell how well they isolated during the short demo and I need IEM's with at least above average isolation for my daily commute on public transportation.
> 
> btw - This and the deal thread are the two threads that keep me coming back regularly to read the entire forum. Thanks!


 

 I doubt housing material affects isolation in a meaningful way - it will all come down to housing design. If there was a woodie that fits like an Ety MC5, I'm sure it would have similar isolation. The Xears TD-III and Fischer Audio Jazz both isolate about as much as a metal or plastic IEM with a similar housing shape would.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Is there a way to connect my Fiio E6 to a Bluetooth Speaker. Will a Bluetooth Transmitter do?


 
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It will but... why?


 

 Doesn't make much sense to amp a Bluetooth transmitter, since your Bluetooth speaker has it's own amp. Just attach the transmitter directly to the source.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





james444 said:


> Doesn't make much sense to amp a Bluetooth transmitter, since your Bluetooth speaker has it's own amp. Just attach the transmitter directly to the source.


 

      The speakers aren't amped enough. The sound is kinda lacking a little for a 3 W Speaker. I don't think I mentioned that the speakers are portable.


----------



## Niyologist

I just ordered the XEPORT 5010-8 Earphones. I will confirm if they have slightly exceeding clarity in comparison to the SP51 and VB with the very deep soundstage and surprisingly good imaging.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The speakers aren't amped enough. The sound is kinda lacking a little for a 3 W Speaker. I don't think I mentioned that the speakers are portable.


 


  Right but the power for a wireless speaker is provided by its internal amp. The bluetooth signal itself is digital. The only reason I can see for doing this is if you wanted to use the E6 to modify the signal (i.e. to add bass boost).


----------



## Niyologist

This may sound weird, but the Fiio E6 has a bit of a treble booster when used with my Cowon J3. It just makes all of my Headphones sound more "open" and "airy".


----------



## joe it




----------



## Niyologist

>_>


----------



## LooptroopRocker

FXT90!!!


----------



## LooptroopRocker

Please!!!


----------



## lukeskymac

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Glad it's helped. Hopefully you are still having more fun obsessing over the GR07 than you would from just listening to Beats or Turbines


 

  
  Of course I am =P. I am very hard to please, I tend to place high expectations on things I research and buy, especially if they cost so much more than the average person thinks it's sane to.
   
  In the end I'd be complaining about the Turbines too. And would go absolutely mad about the Beats. After the ADDIEMs, any step backwards in clarity would be unforgivable.

  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *The GR07 is plenty deep, it just doesn't have very thick note presentation so it sounds lightweight and 'punchy' at the low end rather than full and weighty.* The FXT90 bass quantity is about the lowest I would recommend for someone used to 'consumer' sound (e.g. NE-7M) and not actively looking to take a step towards accuracy. While I do think the GR07 is slightly better from a technical standpoint - tighter, clearer, more neutral, more spacious, and a touch more detailed - there's not much of a purpose in paying extra for an earphone you may like less. That said, you used to own a Shure and unless it was an SE115 it probably wasn't as bassy as the NE-7M so you sort of know what to expect from a more accurate in-ear. The beauty of the FXT90 is ease of use, though - it's a very user-friendly earphone that's shallow-insertion and fairly forgiving of different types of tips. It's got good separation and imaging - it's no FX700, but quite close considering what it costs.


 

 I was just going to say that I had pinned what created my contradicting feelings for the GR07's bass. As it was described as a more "balanced" IEM than most analytic types, I figured it would be more warm and sweet than the ADDIEMs, and that's what I was looking for in a new IEM. The only other disappointment was how the overall sound signature (the light bass and sometimes sibilant highs) make the presentation feel more congested than it really is: I was hoping for bass that would be sufficiently apart from the other frequencies in a way that gives them room.
   
  But, since it was confirmed that the difference between PMPs is very noticeable with the GR07, and how the nano's not the strongest guy in the family in this respect (still wouldn't trade it for anything other than a better sounding nano with higher capacity), maybe I'm hearing things worse than they are. Also, the ZO2 will fatten every frequency up to 1KHz and give them breathing room: exactly what I wanted.
   
  Edit: I forgot to say how the impact of bass is especially important to me since I listen to mostly rock. I bought the ADDIEM because my subgenres tend to be more dense. Example: Radiohead.


----------



## joe it

Yes.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Today is a good day to add JVC HA-FXT90
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  After a hundred hours of burn-in the FXT90 began to melt and the sound is already beyond my expectations
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   










   
   
   
  My impressions
   
   
  I use the standard tip medium. Also after a few days start to adapt to my ears.
   
  I have ordered  the  monster super tip, but I think I've already found the tip that go well.
   
  The basses are no longer muddy as new, beautiful, fast and go far deeper without overlap at other frequencies 
   
  The midde, never dominated by other frequencies, extending seamlessly up to bind to very acute, extended, but without excessive harshness sibilant or roughness fuzzies.
   
  The FTX are almost transparent, I can hear acoustic instruments and even classical music with good reproduction of harmonics that characterise them.
   
  Horns, drums, strings... very good.
   
  Voice, i can feel the breath and i think i feel the breath of the singer. Great dynamics. Full immersion


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> haha you guys are crazy. for home use i gave up on iems and bought a hd598 and its outstanding, even for rock and metal, unlike what most people say. its very true to the recording.
> 
> i had an akg k240 before that, and had to return them due to comfort issues
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  I use for years the AKG K240 mainly to check my records.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I find it quite flat but equalizzabile and in any case depending from source
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Even more flat of K240 to me seems sterile 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Do not tell you what I think of addiem, my friend


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## kiteki

Great review joe it.
   
   
  I will try FXT-90.
   
   
  bmeat I not think headphone can compete with IEM unless SRH-940 or better. :]


----------



## deadguy99

Ok here's my dilemma atm. Im honestly a bass head but i secretely love super accurate and detailed sound but i didnt know until very recently  i originally had Atrio V2's for almost 2 years which i liked but then upgraded to IE8 and realized what i was missing but i didnt care for the fit very much. Then i bought the TF10 during last years black friday sale and fell in love with the super detailed highs but also .. HATED the comfort of them and there ugly to boot  SO i moved onto this last month the Miles davis Tributes and Immedietely i was saying WOW for about 2 weeks straight because i thought they were everything i wanted. but alas after the wow factor wore off i realized the lower treble/ upper mids are SO bright that certain rock albums snares are just unbearable impactful and just too loud and i don't EQ my music other than my Arrow 3d bass boost. So back they went. Now i'm looking at the gr07 and it seems it might take me to where i want to be but i'm afraid to waste money and time just to find out the bass whatever its accuracy may be i'll end up wanting to just go back to IE8 since its just less fatiguing and more poewrful in the sub 50hz range than MD's/TF10 and i'll just settle for less clarity. I listen to alot of new age electronic like dubstep/DnB etc but also alot of piano/violin, ambient, metal, hip hop....lol so for my wide selection of music interests i just feel like i'll never be happy and was hoping on some input directly regarding something like ie8/mdt vs gr07 since most reviews seem to pair gr07 opinions up more against similarly priced phones. And thanks for reading my wall of text and probably bad grammar 
   
  atm i'm actually using HiSoundAudio crystals due to pure comfort since i sold my ie8's i used to have and my tf10's hurt after a couple days and i wear headphones 10 hours a day at work and 2+ at home while reading before bed


----------



## Y2HBK

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Once you get past the GR07, FXT90, and other top-tier IEMS, the law of diminishing returns starts to feel all too real. Yo'll end up spending >$300-350 to get a 5% improvement in 'technical ability.' For the most part, a lot of other top-tiers I've listened to just sound a lot like sound signature sidegrades to me. One IEM will ALWAYS do something better than another, so in the end if you find a signature you like, stick with it. A member on here, Pianist, said the RE0 is a top-tier iem. You can read the first part and conclusion of my GR07 review to get a better idea of what I'm saying here. Good luck with your search!


 


  Thanks for this. Your thread solidified my feelings on the purchase. My GR07's should be here tomorrow! 
   
  I have to say, something else that really clenched it for me... while this thread is an absolute treasure trove of information, and joker I greatly appreciate your dedication to helping us all - the more and more I continued to look at other threads... the more and more I kept seeing the GR07 pop up. I would look for FXT90 threads... and people would suggest the GR07. I would check out some basic "which IEM is for me in XYZ price point" or "with XYZ sound signature" - and again it seemed like the GR07 pop's up all over the place. Its kind of coincidental - because it was a similar situation a few years ago when I came on here looking for a budget replacement of my Shure's and everyone and their mother recommended the NE-7M. For the price point it was at - the NE-7M I have to say has served me well.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> FXT90!!!


 

  Soon
   


  Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> Please!!!


 

  Maybe...
   



  Quote: 





joe it said:


> I use the standard tip medium. Also after a few days start to adapt to my ears.
> 
> I have ordered  the  monster super tip, but I think I've already found the tip that go well.
> 
> ...


 

 Glad you like them! Now I can postpone my review some more 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





deadguy99 said:


> Ok here's my dilemma atm. Im honestly a bass head but i secretely love super accurate and detailed sound but i didnt know until very recently  i originally had Atrio V2's for almost 2 years which i liked but then upgraded to IE8 and realized what i was missing but i didnt care for the fit very much. Then i bought the TF10 during last years black friday sale and fell in love with the super detailed highs but also .. HATED the comfort of them and there ugly to boot  SO i moved onto this last month the Miles davis Tributes and Immedietely i was saying WOW for about 2 weeks straight because i thought they were everything i wanted. but alas after the wow factor wore off i realized the lower treble/ upper mids are SO bright that certain rock albums snares are just unbearable impactful and just too loud and i don't EQ my music other than my Arrow 3d bass boost. So back they went. Now i'm looking at the gr07 and it seems it might take me to where i want to be but i'm afraid to waste money and time just to find out the bass whatever its accuracy may be i'll end up wanting to just go back to IE8 since its just less fatiguing and more poewrful in the sub 50hz range than MD's/TF10 and i'll just settle for less clarity. I listen to alot of new age electronic like dubstep/DnB etc but also alot of piano/violin, ambient, metal, hip hop....lol so for my wide selection of music interests i just feel like i'll never be happy and was hoping on some input directly regarding something like ie8/mdt vs gr07 since most reviews seem to pair gr07 opinions up more against similarly priced phones. And thanks for reading my wall of text and probably bad grammar
> 
> atm i'm actually using HiSoundAudio crystals due to pure comfort since i sold my ie8's i used to have and my tf10's hurt after a couple days and i wear headphones 10 hours a day at work and 2+ at home while reading before bed


 

 I don't think the GR07 is darker than the MDs so it might be too treble-prominent for you. Plus, it's got less bass power than just about everything you've listed short of the TF10s. If you're looking for smooth, bassy IE8 alternatives to consider you can look at the two Radius dual-dynamics.


----------



## deadguy99

Its not that i'm looking for something dark i like the more detailed presentation of the md's and the tf10's as far as treble goes, its just that tf10 sub bass roll off is so extreme even with the 2 stage bass boost on the arrow 3g it still never felt as good as ie8/md for sub bass oriented music. i was just hoping maybe the gr07 would be able to give that same bass power but with a clear and detailed mid/treble. I found the ie8 to be almost too laid back which is why i sold them. The raddius phones all look so bulky and strange. I honestly thought that the new sony xba-4sl would be perfect but now that there finally out i see that the standard model 4sl has a J cord which i refuse to wear and the 4ip model with controls costs a bit more for something i cant use with an amplifier lol and i'm not sure if there size would make it hard to get a fit. I'd think about getting the 4sl remolded into customs but i'm not sure if my slightly small ears would fit them since ive never had any customs yet. i might try getting my tf10's remolded just to see if i like that style of fit but i always imagined a rock hard huge piece of acryllic in my ear would be akward


----------



## Angelopsaro

Is it me or the Hisound Crystal have no nozzle filter?


----------



## deadguy99

I can't see one but there might be a black one deep in there


----------



## Angelopsaro

I am very pleased with the Crystals in everything besides one thing.. The MIDS! now i realized their importance.. Its what gives to the music the liveness and makes an iem sound fun and forward..
  Things improve great when i adjust my cowon J3 3 levels up the mids but is this noble?


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Great review joe it.
> 
> 
> I will try FXT-90.
> ...


 


  I can't regardless of musicality, I hope you like the FXT-90
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> really now..sterile. perfect word. thats actually how ive been feeling about the hd598. if the bass is booming, like on a rap songs or with 808's and drums machines, these cans rumble, but when the bass is not recorded heavy, like on a regular rock/metal recording, the drums do not sound aggresive enough, and ive been trying to tell myself that the hd598 are better, but i think i may like the mild v shape of k240 more.
> 
> looks like i cant decide either. what am i saying? you guys are crazy? im the crazy one!


 


   
  Why crazy? It is not a wife, you can take more than one.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  As regards the AKG, if you do not need much isolation, I think the AKG optimal. Besides being musical also monitor 
   
  I also think that is very underrated.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





joe it said:


> Why crazy? *It is not a wife,* you can take more than one.


 

 In Soviet Russia...lol


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Glad you like them! Now I can postpone my review some more


 

   
  Also Glad.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  But I do not think that i can take all this responsibility


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> In Soviet Russia...lol


 


  One at a time, can be?


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





deadguy99 said:


> I honestly thought that the new sony xba-4sl would be perfect but now that there finally out i see that the standard model 4sl has a J cord which i refuse to wear and the 4ip model with controls costs a bit more for something i cant use with an amplifier lol and i'm not sure if there size would make it hard to get a fit. I'd think about getting the 4sl remolded into customs


 

 I don't think anyone will reshell any of the XBA's into customs.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> i agree!unfortunately i just spent a lot on a senn hd598, and i cant justify purchasing a k240 right now haha. even though i want one VERY badly. only gripe is why dont they make the cans like a vertical oval instead of round. if they were oval, like the senn's design, there would be more room for the tops of the ears and theyd be even more comfy


 
   

  The Austrians are very conservative.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  To find a Sennheiser which sounds good (HD 800) , IMHO,  I'm afraid it's too expensive, would you solve the problem also does but plus large (56mm) but it has the same design of AKG.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
Meanwhile you can look at  on a good IEM


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Is it me or the Hisound Crystal have no nozzle filter?


 

 Mine does. Filter is black and finely meshed.


----------



## Spec C

Looks like your Fxt90 review is much anticipated...lol


----------



## kiteki

tomcy2000 and I discussed that the FXT-90 could be a dual-core version of the FXC51 / FXC71.


----------



## jiff

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> tomcy2000 and I discussed that the FXT-90 could be a dual-core version of the FXC51 / FXC71.


 


  I was wondering if they used the same micro driver in the FXT90 as they do in the C51.  If they are they tuned the FXT to sound a lot better than the 51 and I don't think the 51/71 have the carbon nanotube on theirs.


----------



## kiteki

The transducer is at the very end of the IEM, so there is no tube, there is an aluminium looking cap.  The driver itself is carbon nanofibre or something like that I think.
   
  If you increase the sub-bass 10Hz-50Hz, turn off 60Hz-400Hz and increase 1kHz-2.5kHz you realise just how much potential the driver has, if it's the same driver I'm sure JVC put a lot of effort into the filters, cable impedance and crossover and that's why the FXT-90 sounds good, ultimately the FXC51 driver lacks some clarity and refinement though and tomscy2000 called the FXT-90 grainy so I started wondering.
   
  Just theory of course.


----------



## kiteki

With this EQ applied it's the closest thing I've heard to a sub-woofer in an IEM, there is no distortion and yes that is +12dB - http://i.imgur.com/vFxk4.jpg


----------



## Joe Bloggs

kiteki you have this strange habit of making all your EQ settings stair-shaped rather than a smooth curve don't you?  Does it sound better to you this way?


----------



## Y2HBK

I received my GR07 in the mail today. I purchased them on Amazon. Aside from the fact that the packaging was filthy (obviously stored away somewhere for awhile) the transaction was great. The phones themselves were fine. 
   
  So far I have about 10 hours of burn in on them. I have to say I was worried about buyer's remorse - but I don't think I could be happier. The bass is punchy, just deep enough for my tastes and I find it fast and accurate. The mids are crisp and clear and I don't find the highs fatiguing at all.
   
  I was worried about going with an over the ear phone as I had poor luck with them in the past but I know now that if the phone is designed correctly it certainly won't be an issue. I think I actually prefer the over the ear style now. I haven't tested all of the tips it came with yet as the ones that came installed already were a great fit. The phones easily fit into my ear for a great seal. I am amazed by the comfort as well. The NE-7M has nothing on these for comfort (or any other category, really). A wonderful upgrade. 
   
  I have tossed a lot at them so far... AC/DC, Bon Jovi, Cradle of Filth, Don Henley, Eminem, Ferry Corsten, Kenny Loggins, Lady Gaga, Shania Twain, Trans-Siberian Orchestra, etc etc... I tried to have a wide range of genres. Some of these were acoustic tracks as well. I have also recently re-ripped a large part of my library in FLAC format instead of MP3. I did a few comparisons between songs in MP3 format and FLAC with the phones... using the NE-7M's and then the GR07's... and the amount of detail I missed listening to MP3 was not only astonishing... but the amount of detail I was missing out on with the NE-7M's was as well. Overall, I think I will be satisfied (at least for awhile). Time to lay low for a bit since I had to try and convince my wife today that the price I paid wasn't that expensive.


----------



## shotgunshane

Reported to be only $5 more than the normally aspired E10.  Should be out by the end of this month.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I guess even apple fans get a high value-for-money set thrown their way once in a while. Hopefully it'll be $45 or so.


 


  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Here is something I'm looking forward to in the immediate future!  First batch is already created.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> I was worried about going with an over the ear phone as I had poor luck with them in the past but I know now that if the phone is designed correctly it certainly won't be an issue. I think I actually prefer the over the ear style now. I haven't tested all of the tips it came with yet as the ones that came installed already were a great fit. The phones easily fit into my ear for a great seal. I am amazed by the comfort as well. The NE-7M has nothing on these for comfort (or any other category, really). A wonderful upgrade.


 

 Glad you like them! 
   


  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Reported to be only $5 more than the normally aspired E10.  Should be out by the end of this month.


 


  Wow, only $5 more for a 3-button remote. That's setting the bar for value .


----------



## Inks

Sure is. Other companies charge 50$+ for a 3 button mic.


----------



## Inks

kiteki said:


> The transducer is at the very end of the IEM, so there is no tube, there is an aluminium looking cap.  The driver itself is carbon nanofibre or something like that I think.
> 
> If you increase the sub-bass 10Hz-50Hz, turn off 60Hz-400Hz and increase 1kHz-2.5kHz you realise just how much potential the driver has, if it's the same driver I'm sure JVC put a lot of effort into the filters, cable impedance and crossover and that's why the FXT-90 sounds good, ultimately the FXC51 driver lacks some clarity and refinement though and tomscy2000 called the FXT-90 grainy so I started wondering.
> 
> Just theory of course.


 
  Theres no crossover and the carbon nanotube driver is a new innovation from JVC, different than cAarbon used in the FXCs. I hope JVC goes dual carbon nanotube and ditches the FXC drivers for the next one 

  
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> tomcy2000 and I discussed that the FXT-90 could be a dual-core version of the FXC51 / FXC71.


 
  Carbon and carbon nanotube are two very different materials. Yes one of the drivers used in the FXT90 is most likely from an FXC, but the carbon nanotube driver is brand new.


----------



## ljokerl

Added JVC HA-FXT90 and JVC HA-FX500
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2B13) JVC HA-FXT90*
> 
> Reviewed Jan 2012
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2A22) JVC HA-FX500*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jan 2012
> ...


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added JVC HA-FXT90 and JVC HA-FX500


 


  Awesomeness!


----------



## Angelopsaro

Haha! i feel that joker did as a favor this time! he knew we all expected this update and tried to finish it fast!! thx!!
   
  btw did you noticed any difference by burn in the hisound crystals?


----------



## kiteki

e-earphone sell the JVC HP-FX500 for ¥10,500 - http://www.e-earphone.jp/shop/shopdetail.html?brandcode=001007000012&search=fx500&sort=


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> e-earphone sell the JVC HP-FX500 for ¥10,500 - http://www.e-earphone.jp/shop/shopdetail.html?brandcode=001007000012&search=fx500&sort=


 


  Thats only for people in Japan..


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> e-earphone sell the JVC HP-FX500 for ¥10,500 - http://www.e-earphone.jp/shop/shopdetail.html?brandcode=001007000012&search=fx500&sort=


 

 Are you i japan nu?


----------



## kiteki

You can use a service like www.tenso.com.
   
  You buy from www.e-earphone.jp, send it to your fake tenso address, and then tenso send it to you overseas.
   
  No I'm not in Japan.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> You can use a service like www.tenso.com.
> 
> You buy from www.e-earphone.jp, send it to your fake tenso address, and then tenso send it to you overseas.
> 
> No I'm not in Japan.


 


  These companies are very handy but the fees and shipping cost will make the price even more expensive than seyo shop for example, not to mentioned that by doing this, if you decide to return them things get messy since you used a intermediary who has be willing to ensure you the return process plus shipping back and forth again.


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> These companies are very handy but the fees and shipping cost will make the price even more expensive than seyo shop for example, not to mentioned that by doing this, if you decide to return them things get messy since you used a intermediary who to be willing to try to ensure you the return process plus shipping back and forth again.


 


  I was kind of thinking the saem thing..
   
  I haven't ordered the FX500 yet, waiting on my student loan to come first. Reading the review just makes me want it even more..


----------



## dogears

both on 8.9/10... glad I didn't get one...


----------



## kiteki

Hmm OK, I don't think the e-earphone.jp price will be more expensive after shipping and fees, but it's only a minor saving if any, and SEYO will be faster I imagine, you're right.
   
  Let's start a FOTM... 4 years(?) after it's release. ^^
   
  Don't buy from any non-Japanese sellers though, there are fakes.


----------



## tomscy2000

Long live the FX1000~!
  
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Let's start a FOTM... 4 years(?) after it's release. ^^


----------



## jiff

> *(2B13) JVC HA-FXT90*
> 
> Reviewed Jan 2012
> 
> ...


 

 That was spot on, great review.


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Hmm OK, I don't think the e-earphone.jp price will be more expensive after shipping and fees, but it's only a minor saving if any, and SEYO will be faster I imagine, you're right.
> 
> Let's start a FOTM... 4 years(?) after it's release. ^^
> 
> Don't buy from any non-Japanese sellers though, there are fakes.


 


  FOTM it is! Have you ordered yours yet?


----------



## blupblup

Fantastic review of the absolutely amazing FXT90's.
  Thanks very much joker!!


----------



## jjmai

FXT90, cons: n/a.
Wow, that really speaks for those IEMs.

Inks probably also got lucky with his set. Many fxt90 users have reported driver flex.


----------



## LooptroopRocker

Yup its the driver flex in the FXT90 that worries me as well. It could be the case that only those who had experienced driver flex actually spoke out and it therefore seems that its a common problem. Will be hoping to hear more about non-driver flex cases!


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


looptrooprocker said:


> Yup its the driver flex in the FXT90 that worries me as well. It could be the case that only those who had experienced driver flex actually spoke out and it therefore seems that its a common problem. Will be hoping to hear more about non-driver flex cases!


 

 My first pair had driver flex issues on one side, but the same side also experienced diminished sound, right out of the box. My replacement unit, however, experienced no driver flex at all, on either side. I purchased mine through *buyfromjapan* via eBay, as a few others had in the official FXT90 appreciation thread.


----------



## Niyologist

You guys should keep a good eye on the CES 2012 for Monster and Meelectronics for today (Monster) and tomorrow (Monster and Meelectronics). They have some very exciting OEMs and IEMs coming up this year.


----------



## Bina

Anybody know if ACS is original manufacturer of T15? Dynamic Ear Company is offering exactly same in-ears, they are partners of ACS and I have info from local shop that they are original manufacturer.


----------



## Niyologist

Here's the link to keep an eye on the event:
   
  http://www.cesweb.org/
   
  I can't wait!


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added *JVC HA-FXT90* and JVC HA-FX500


 
   

*Great review* and gread IEM.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  At the moment, the best universal IEM in my taste; I could not think to use an with less bass.
   
  Even if i have not yet heard, i do not think that i can use with satisfaction a great IEM as 272, for example, just for the lack of bass.
   
  Of course, if the FTXT90 had the same appearance of Beyerdynamic 101 (i.e.), it would be even better, but i am not sure complain of disfigurement, when i think of the appearance and ergonomics of 262-272 or GR7 or Tandem. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Who knows what will be still in time, and  who knows that with the time perhaps cannot nearing the esoteric world of 'Custom', but this is another speech. 
   
*Thank you  again. *


----------



## blupblup

I have no driver flex either on my FXT90's and got them from the same seller on ebay, buyfromjapan.


----------



## Inks

jjmai said:


> FXT90, cons: n/a.
> Wow, that really speaks for those IEMs.
> 
> Inks probably also got lucky with his set. Many fxt90 users have reported driver flex.


 
  I do get driver flex with my pair, but it is slight. People shouldn't worry about driver flex as nothing proves it will kill the drivers and will most likely not from what I know. I believe the FXT90 has flex because of the thin filters and positioning of the drivers. Again nothing to complain about in my book, all it means is a little bit of noise when you insert them. Stuff like the Xears will be ones to worry about as the noise is louder and bothersome. 
   
  Nice reviews joker. I think the FXT90s main strengths are its imaging and treble resolution/transparency.   Even the likes of the GR07 and EX600 fall behind in this. Add to that a fun bass hump and you have an aggressive yet Hifi sound.


----------



## Niyologist

I got my Xeport 5010-8. They look very similar to the Meelectronics SP51. The Sound Signature.......very interesting. The first aspect I noticed was the breathing space aka Soundstage/Headstage. It's very open and even moreso than my GR06. It's also darker than my GR06, but not too much. In comparison to the SP51, well let's say it has nothing on the Xeport 5010-8. Everything out of the box is just far better with the Gunmetal Plate. I'll compare with the Extreme Bass plate and Balanced Plate shortly.


----------



## jiff

Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> Yup its the driver flex in the FXT90 that worries me as well. It could be the case that only those who had experienced driver flex actually spoke out and it therefore seems that its a common problem. Will be hoping to hear more about non-driver flex cases!


 


  I've had mine for a few days now with no driver flex at all.  I wouldn't base getting them on driver flex because what joker said was spot on about the FXT90, I love them and now I'm listening to them more than my TF10's which is my favorite IEM.


----------



## Niyologist

I used my Cowon J3 and used the JetEffect 3.0. for the Xeport 5010-8
   
  80 Hz-Wide: 0db
   
  220 Hz-Wide: 0db
   
  1.4 KHz-Wide: +4db
   
  4.1 KHz-Wide: +4db
   
  6.9 KHz-Wide: +4db
   
  BBE: 9
   
  Mach3Bass: Off
   
  3D Surround: Off
   
  MP Enhance: On
   
  Stereo Enhance: 6
   
  Reverb: Off
   
  Volume Level: 18
   
  Port: Any will apply. Similar outcomes with minor differences. The obvious minor differences.


----------



## Niyologist

When using the Xeport 5010-8, I advise you use the Sony Hybrid tips. It's a bit uncomfortable using the stock. Even the Monster Gel Tips will do.


----------



## ljokerl

Updated the downloadable chart on the front page, for anyone who wants to play with the numbers.
  
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Haha! i feel that joker did as a favor this time! he knew we all expected this update and tried to finish it fast!! thx!!
> 
> btw did you noticed any difference by burn in the hisound crystals?


 

 I don't think I listened to them pre-burn-in. Rarely do these days.
   


  Quote: 





jiff said:


> That was spot on, great review.


 
  Quote: 





blupblup said:


> Fantastic review of the absolutely amazing FXT90's.
> Thanks very much joker!!


 





   


  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> FXT90, cons: n/a.
> Wow, that really speaks for those IEMs.
> Inks probably also got lucky with his set. Many fxt90 users have reported driver flex.


 

 There's a couple of sets I couldn't find much fault with (e.g. MEElec A151) - doesn't make them bulletproof but the FXT90 is definitely better than most.
   
  I actually got to try two different pairs of the FXT90 and neither had levels of flex I'd consider significant. I do get to listen to a lot of cheaper in-ears that have terrible flex (like the Xears sets Inks mentioned and the Maximo iM-590) so I'm hardly shocked or offended by it these days.
   


  Quote: 





bina said:


> Anybody know if ACS is original manufacturer of T15? Dynamic Ear Company is offering exactly same in-ears, they are partners of ACS and I have info from local shop that they are original manufacturer.


 

 It's the same product.
   


  Quote: 





joe it said:


> *Great review* and gread IEM.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Glad you like them! I can definitely see them being 'the one' for many listeners with that sound signature.
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> I do get driver flex with my pair, but it is slight. People shouldn't worry about driver flex as nothing proves it will kill the drivers and will most likely not from what I know. I believe the FXT90 has flex because of the thin filters and positioning of the drivers. Again nothing to complain about in my book, all it means is a little bit of noise when you insert them. Stuff like the Xears will be ones to worry about as the noise is louder and bothersome.
> 
> Nice reviews joker. I think the FXT90s main strengths are its imaging and treble resolution/transparency.   Even the likes of the GR07 and EX600 fall behind in this. Add to that a fun bass hump and you have an aggressive yet Hifi sound.


 

 Thanks, and I agree. The EX600 is a strange beast, like the EX1000, because it lacks the centered stage of the FXT90 and many other in-ears and sounds more like a headphone when it comes to imaging, etc.


----------



## staxxx

Upgraditis and my pay check isn't helping either.

 I have an EX600 and an hf5 and I would like something that is a significant upgrade but I'm ruling out the EX1000 and ER-4.

 I'm kinda leaning to something neutral or close to neutral, and I think I prefer the fast, hi-res sound of the hf5 to the EX600. Works great for power/speed metal.

 Any suggestions?


----------



## jiff

I take back what I said about no driver flex with my FXT90's as I do have a it happen only on the left ear piece and only when I insert them but it doesn't always do it.  They still sound great, I haven't heard any popping or crackling so it hasn't hurt the performance at all.
   
  Man I love the way these sound even more than my beloved TF10's and thats hard to do if you knew how much I like my 10's. They just sound more open and I'm really surprised how good the depth and separation are on them.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





staxxx said:


> *Upgraditis and my pay check isn't helping either.*
> 
> I have an EX600 and an hf5 and I would like something that is a significant upgrade but I'm ruling out the EX1000 and ER-4.
> 
> ...


 


  Run away as fast as you can from Head-Fi????


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





coq de combat said:


> > Let's start a FOTM... 4 years(?) after it's release. ^^
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Not yet still thinking.
   
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> [/]
> 
> Thanks, and I agree. The EX600 is a strange beast, like the EX1000, because it lacks the centered stage of the FXT90 and many other in-ears and sounds more like a headphone when it comes to imaging, etc.


 

 Yup, the EX600 is decidedly detached which results in lacking intimacy and immersion at times, also due to it's very neutral tone.  
  
   
    
  Quote:


staxxx said:


> I'm kinda leaning to something neutral or close to neutral, and I think I prefer the fast, hi-res sound of the hf5 to the EX600. Works great for power/speed metal.
> 
> Any suggestions?


 

 Turn them into a custom IEM, EX600 lo-driver HF5 hi-driver and you will create a MONSTER


----------



## shotgunshane

Nice reviews on the two JVC's.  I find your thoughts on the FXT90 pretty much mirror mine.  They battle the RE262 for ear time and both are easily my favorite universals.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Run away as fast as you can from Head-Fi????


 


  Best advice I've seen in this thread for many months !


----------



## dogears

Only the brave ones stay glued to head-fi 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Best advice I've seen in this thread for many months !


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





staxxx said:


> Upgraditis and my pay check isn't helping either.
> 
> I have an EX600 and an hf5 and I would like something that is a significant upgrade but I'm ruling out the EX1000 and ER-4.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Get an armature-based custom with a flat signature, e.g. CTM-200. Doubt you'll get a significant upgrade otherwise unless you find a signature that suits you better.
  
   


  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Nice reviews on the two JVC's.  I find your thoughts on the FXT90 pretty much mirror mine.  They battle the RE262 for ear time and both are easily my favorite universals.


 

 Thanks! I do personally like the FXT90 and would pick it any day over almost all similarly-priced and many pricier earphones.
   


  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Best advice I've seen in this thread for many months !


 

 Ouch


----------



## staxxx

Custom seems like the only option left for me. Thanks.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





staxxx said:


> Custom seems like the only option left for me. Thanks.


 

 So you have EX600 and HF5 and you've declared you're finished with universals?  Lol bravo.


----------



## staxxx

I know there's better universals, I've heard the EX1000 at my local Sony dealer. And it's only slightly better than the EX600. As someone said on another thread, the differences are so minor, you can only tell them with A/B testing, same with the HF5 + ER-4 variants. I'm trying to get the impedance adapter borrowed from a friend who owns an ER-4P. I actually heard that long time ago before i was an audiophile, but my friend freaked out when he saw me wearing them because he doesn't share his IEMs due to his fear of earwax infections.

 The hf5 and ex600 are pretty flat and detailed, yet both sound so different. I think if I'm purchasing another universal, it may have to be a different sound signature. I don't mind v shaped like the FXC51 but I absolutely hated the TF10.


----------



## kiteki

I thought the EX600 and EX1000 had a very clear difference without direct A/B, I'd only call it a difference though, not necessarily a three-fold improvement or anything to that effect.
   
  If you want to depart from EX600 and HF5 you should get a 3 or 4 driver universal/custom, or a significantly different sounding dynamic driver.  Ljokerl said the FX500 has much better timbre and realism than IE7 and IE8 so I'd skip Sennheiser.


----------



## staxxx

I was planning on jumping straight to the 700, but the 500 seems a wiser choice for me. I've read that the timbre of the 700 is untouched.

 I've heard the IE8 (from that same friend), even on the lowest setting, it's too bassy, don't really care for it much. Very well, I shall purchase the FX500, I still have that Thermaltake IEM to test, too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. How is your FXC51, btw? I think the more I climb up the ladder, I'm beginning to appreciate them more, they're quite fast too.


----------



## Selenium

I can hear a difference without A/Bing as well. I was drunk one night, thought I had grabbed the EX1000s, and only noticed they were the 600s when I picked up on some slight lack of resolution.


----------



## staxxx

Yeah, that's the major difference IMO, the resolution. The EX1000 is better, but the sound signature is the same.

 The hf5 has superior resolution to the EX600, but I wonder if it's close or better to the EX1000. I haven't heard it for many months.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





staxxx said:


> Upgraditis and my pay check isn't helping either.
> 
> I have an EX600 and an hf5 and I would like something that is a significant upgrade but I'm ruling out the EX1000 and ER-4.
> 
> ...


 

 Maybe the PFE232, but the term "significant" is open to interpretation.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Get an armature-based custom with a flat signature, e.g. CTM-200. Doubt you'll get a significant upgrade otherwise unless you find a signature that suits you better.


 

 See above regarding "significant". I've only heard the JH13 demos, UE11 and UERM, but I don't consider any of them a significant upgrade to my favorite universals.


----------



## staxxx

Wow, that's expensive. I think I've settled on the FX500, while not it's perfectly what I want, it's probably a sidegrade with a different sound signature.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





staxxx said:


> Wow, that's expensive. I think I've settled on the FX500, while not it's perfectly what I want, it's probably a sidegrade with a different sound signature.


 


  Have you considered giving Westone 4 a shot? Haven't heard them myself but enough people seem to rave about them on here. It might be up your alley considering your coming from the Sony EX and Etymotic lines.


----------



## staxxx

Yes, but if I was going to spend around that, I might as well go full out and get a Westone custom, or another custom.


----------



## kiteki

The real question is how the XBA-4 compares to the W4, or to 4-driver CIEM demo units.


----------



## staxxx

I don't mind buying Sony as there's a dealer in my country. Perhaps an XBA-1 and 3.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> The real question is how the XBA-4 compares to the W4, or to 4-driver CIEM demo units.


 


  True, the last impression given on it in the XBA thread was rather mixed. I do question the reviews findings though. Looks like you may have been right kitki the low impedance on the XBA-4 might mess up a lot of people who bought it for straight DAP use.


----------



## Bina

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> bina said:
> 
> 
> > Anybody know if ACS is original manufacturer of T15? Dynamic Ear Company is offering exactly same in-ears, they are partners of ACS and I have info from local shop that they are original manufacturer.
> ...


 

   
  I know it is same product, but is it originaly from DEC or ACS? I tried to reach them, but they just ignore my emails.


----------



## kiteki

I already summarised that review, he said the XBA-4 isn't worth the upgrade from ER-4S (which is more expensive), he sold the Shure SE535 (which he thought sounded better), thinks the W4 is better still (which he hasn't heard), and then says he'll keep the XBA-4 forever (as long as it's connected to a Walkman).
   
  Mkubota1 said the XBA-4 "stole the show" at the Tokyo event for him, the SE535LE and ER-4S were present (+50 other earphones) so his impressions seem more realistic.
   
  Sony had a "100% satisfaction or full refund" offer for South-East Asia/Oceania until the end of January, and it's "not arriving until February or March" according to my local Sony store.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bina said:


> I know it is same product, but is it originaly from DEC or ACS? I tried to reach them, but they just ignore my emails.


 


  DEC. Their logo is on the back of my T15 box.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Joker, although i can see that Hisound Crystal is a capable pair of iems it seems that i like the more airy sound of  Vsonic GR07.
  Is this usually a thing with fully closed iems? I see that fxt90 dont have a venting hole.. I cant explain the sound terms greatly but comparing the three, how airy is fxt90?
  I only dont like the Crystals because of this thing which probably come due to the higher isolation(?). Are customs which are praised for isolation the same situation?
   
  Thank for your time and if you dont understand what i mean thats ok


----------



## shotgunshane

The FXT90 are vented. They have slot vents near the black band of the strain relief around the housing if I remember correctly. I don't have them in front of me at the moment.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> The FXT90 are vented. They have slot vents near the black band of the strain relief around the housing if I remember correctly. I don't have them in front of me at the moment.


 

  
  Oups.. i havent read many stuff on them.. i thought when joker compared them with the open-back brothers ment that this is not.. For sure it doesnt have an open-back but as you say it probably has ventings


----------



## kiteki

quick question... the FX500 distorts at high volumes and the FX700 doesn't... is this correct?  How high volume, and what kind of distortion, like, only in the bass?


----------



## shotgunshane

They are pretty small vents. I believe 2 in each housing. The Fx500 is completely open on the back. Venting does seem to help make for larger, airier soundstages.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Joker, although i can see that Hisound Crystal is a capable pair of iems it seems that i like the more airy sound of  Vsonic GR07.
> Is this usually a thing with fully closed iems? I see that fxt90 dont have a venting hole.. I cant explain the sound terms greatly but comparing the three, how airy is fxt90?
> I only dont like the Crystals because of this thing which probably come due to the higher isolation(?). Are customs which are praised for isolation the same situation?
> 
> Thank for your time and if you dont understand what i mean thats ok


 

 Presentation is the strength of the Crystal; I wouldn't compare it to the VSonics. The FXT90 is a lot more intimate than the GR07 (think 1st row feel vs 5th row) but still airy. Only way they'll be a downgrade in presentation is if you like that wide soundstage the GR07s have.
   


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Oups.. i havent read many stuff on them.. i thought when joker compared them with the open-back brothers ment that this is not.. For sure it doesnt have an open-back but as you say it probably has ventings


 

  Most dynamics are vented in some way. FX500 and especially FX700 are open, which is rather rare.
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> quick question... the FX500 distorts at high volumes and the FX700 doesn't... is this correct?  How high volume, and what kind of distortion, like, only in the bass?


 


  Way higher than you would want to listen to them. Both of the JVC work best (are most balanced, etc) at low to moderate volumes.


----------



## Niyologist

The Sennheiser HD 700 has been revealed:
   

   

 Frequency Diffuse field equalized Frequency response (headphones) 15 – 40,000 Hz (–3 dB) Frequency response (headphones) 8 – 44,000 Hz (–10 dB) Transducer principle Dynamic, open Nominal impedance 150 Ω Sound pressure level (SPL) 105dB SPL (1kHz, 1 Vrms) THD, total harmonic distortion ≤ 0.03 % (1kHz, 1Vrms) Ear coupling Circumaural Weight w/o cable 270 g Jack plug ¼” (6.3 mm) stereo jack Cable length 3 m Symmetrical, silver-plated oxygen-free (OFC) copper cable Operating temperature –10 °C to +55 °C


----------



## Niyologist

The Sennheiser HD 25 Amperior Headphones has also been revealed:


----------



## Niyologist

My Xeport 5010-8 sounds Very 3 Dimensional and it also has a Large Semi-Circular Soundstage. Really rare for a pair of IEMs at cost $14.99 or even the original price of $69.99.


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





staxxx said:


> Upgraditis and my pay check isn't helping either.
> 
> I have an EX600 and an hf5 and I would like something that is a significant upgrade but I'm ruling out the EX1000 and ER-4.
> 
> ...


 


  Ortofon EQ-5


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Presentation is the strength of the Crystal; I wouldn't compare it to the VSonics.


 

  What do you mean by this? you wouldnt compare it, as if they are different or the crystals better than vsonic?  I can hear that Crystals have really good instrument separation.. is this what you mean? and also big dynamic range?
  Still i think that the fully closed design makes things kind of congest and air pressurized.. more like something that has to do with my ears. When i travel i always feel my ears clogged and i have to blow my air in my ears by holding my nose. Maybe i get extra sensitive to pressure.. I had my right ear drum blown as well 3 years ago by a 15meter diving.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> My Xeport 5010-8 sounds Very 3 Dimensional and it also has a Large Semi-Circular Soundstage. Really rare for a pair of IEMs at cost $14.99 or even the original price of $69.99.


 


  WOW! i just checked the company you say. Xeport.. what is wrong with this people? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Are they making profit? O_o. I have to stop buying headphones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Niyologist

The accuracy of the Xeport 5010-8 matches the Atrio X. It's like it has the characteristics of most of my earphones. The excellent clarity of the GR06, the accuracy of the Atrio X, the deep bass of the SP51, the clear midrange of the CC51, the extended, yet non sibilant treble of the M6. The huge Soundstage surpasses my GR06 and CC51. This sound signature only took a few tweaks from my Cowon J3. Pretty simple tweaks. I guess I don't see the point of keeping my M6, SP51 and CC51.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The accuracy of the Xeport 5010-8 matches the Atrio X. It's like it has the characteristics of most of my earphones. The excellent clarity of the GR06, the accuracy of the Atrio X, the deep bass of the SP51, the clear midrange of the CC51, the extended, yet non sibilant treble of the M6. The huge Soundstage surpasses my GR06 and CC51. This sound signature only took a few tweaks from my Cowon J3. Pretty simple tweaks. I guess I don't see the point of keeping my M6, SP51 and CC51.


 


  Did anyone asked you to tempt us ?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Did anyone asked you to tempt us ?


 
   
       No, just bought it out of curiosity and the review about it on Amazon.


----------



## Boxytheboxed

I am looking into my 1st higher-end pair of IEMs, but I'm not sure what would be best for funk, New Orleans, and jazz. I also listen to a lot of classic rock (Led Zepplin, KISS)
 Some examples of the music:
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-atDxmfnIrI&list=PL8F815C0A29FC25BE&index=1&feature=plpp_video
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcbIBnPrOTA
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uq_Gdnq2SS8&feature=related
 I am looking something with a warmer, more musical sound. However detail and sound-stage are still important, especially with the brass. Bass emphasis isn't too important. I'd like to stay around $300 plus shipping and possibly impressions, 350 is my max. I'd prefer customs due to concerns over comfort and fit, but I can always get universals reshelled at a later date (when I have the money). So far I'm looking at the CTM200s (at the top end of the budget), HiFiMan 272(maybe a bit too analytic), 262 (cheap enough that I could get them reshelled into customs), Kozee X2 (again, a bit pricy), and Westone 2( too much bass?).
  
 Any advice as to which would be best?


----------



## blupblup

JVC HAFXT90


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The Sennheiser HD 25 Amperior Headphones has also been revealed:


 


  Metal bits and a modular cable with an apple mic? Might make them a little more consumer-friendly but hopefully not just adding more weight for poorer sound quality.


  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> What do you mean by this? you wouldnt compare it, as if they are different or the crystals better than vsonic?  I can hear that Crystals have really good instrument separation.. is this what you mean? and also big dynamic range?
> Still i think that the fully closed design makes things kind of congest and air pressurized.. more like something that has to do with my ears. When i travel i always feel my ears clogged and i have to blow my air in my ears by holding my nose. Maybe i get extra sensitive to pressure.. I had my right ear drum blown as well 3 years ago by a 15meter diving.


 


  No, in presentation the Crystal doesn't have much on the GR07. 


  Quote: 





boxytheboxed said:


> I am looking into my 1st higher-end pair of IEMs, but I'm not sure what would be best for funk, New Orleans, and jazz. I also listen to a lot of classic rock (Led Zepplin, KISS)
> Some examples of the music:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-atDxmfnIrI&list=PL8F815C0A29FC25BE&index=1&feature=plpp_video
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcbIBnPrOTA
> ...


 

  I would start with the RE262, personally. I don't know who does dynamic re-shells but IMO in the current configuration the RE262 should be comfortable for most and the sound seems to suit your tastes.


----------



## Niyologist

The Meelectronics RX12 has been revealed:
   

   
  More MEELEC Products to be revealed tomorrow and Thursday.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

There is also the Blue and Black MEELEC RX12:
   

   
  This is my favorite.


----------



## olear

I am looking for an IEM that has similar clarity, texture, thickness of notes as TF10 but with a different sound signature.
  Which IEM?


----------



## JK1

Joker, how about reviewing the JVC HA-FXC51? It seems like a great improvement over the FXC50.


----------



## estreeter

One Aussie e-tailer has an 'End-of-Life' tag on the ATH-CK10, but refers shoppers to the ATH-CK100, at a whopping *212 AUD* premium. Despite the fact that they dont actually have any stock of the CK10, their listing still comes up on shopbot and other 'price comparison' sites - nothing like a little bait-and-switch.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





olear said:


> I am looking for an IEM that has similar clarity, texture, thickness of notes as TF10 but with a different sound signature.
> Which IEM?


 


  Sounds like the GR07. Your music will finally have mids lol.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Sounds like the GR07. Your music will finally have mids lol.


 








 not funny. I like my TF10.
  GR07 might be too flat, neutral and balanced.
  I might go back to the FXT90.
  More than a few who own both GR07 and FXT90, prefer and spend more time with FXT90.
   
  Does W4 have similar characteristics as TF10 but with less quantity bass with forward mids?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





olear said:


> not funny. I like my TF10.
> GR07 might be too flat, neutral and balanced.
> I might go back to the FXT90.
> More than a few who own both GR07 and FXT90, prefer and spend more time with FXT90.
> ...


 

 I owned both, and I prefer the GR07 to the TF10 by a fair margin but that may be be my music tastes. I see a lot of people saying the GR07 is too flat or boring, but I know that it has as much bass as the TF10, with more quantity and quality sub-bass. Also, the timbre of the GR07 is a country mile ahead of the TF10. Instrument separation and speed are also about the same, with the GR07 having better imaging and soundstaging.
   
  500!


----------



## olear

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> I owned both, and I prefer the GR07 to the TF10 by a fair margin but that may be be my music tastes. I see a lot of people saying the GR07 is too flat or boring, but I know that it has as much bass as the TF10, with more quantity and quality sub-bass. Also, the timbre of the GR07 is a country mile ahead of the TF10. Instrument separation and speed are also about the same, with the GR07 having better imaging and soundstaging.
> 
> 500!


 
  And dynamic range on the GR07 vs TF10?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





olear said:


> And dynamic range on the GR07 vs TF10?


 

 The TF10 has the GR07 slightly beat there at lower volumes. At my listening levels there is no difference. Read joker's review of them.


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





olear said:


> I am looking for an IEM that has similar clarity, texture, thickness of notes as TF10 but with a different sound signature.
> Which IEM?


 


  MTPC -- it has better bass too, and much better mid, though I think TF10 has better treble


----------



## kiteki

Hmmm... EX600 outer-soundspace, FXC51 inner-soundspace, TF10 bass, RE262 mids, Ety ER-4 treble, CK10 imaging, K2 SP note decay, RE272 note quality.
   
   
  Why look...... it's a flying salmon... with the head of a cat!


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





olear said:


> not funny. I like my TF10.
> GR07 might be too flat, neutral and balanced.
> I might go back to the FXT90.
> More than a few who own both GR07 and FXT90, prefer and spend more time with FXT90.
> ...


 

 Hey olear, Been Pming you here and there, honestly, the W4 is more balanced than the GR07 W4 is Ruler flat. The GR07's push the mids forward, and are not as bright as the JVC. If I can suggest, try a pair of GR07. I personally would take the GR07's over the W4, and I Love Westones


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> Hey olear, Been Pming you here and there, honestly, the W4 is more balanced than the GR07 W4 is Ruler flat. *The GR07's push the mids forward*, and are not as bright as the JVC. If I can suggest, try a pair of GR07. I personally would take the GR07's over the W4, and I Love Westones


 


  Hey guys, you have made me want to GR7.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 If they were not so damn only 'over the ear'
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




...but, are there only over the ear, or might be good fit also straight down?
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Edit: However, i am very happy about the JVC HA-FXT90


----------



## Niyologist

And heeeeeere's the MEELEC A161:
   

   
  This is MEELEC's Flagship Headphones/IEM. It is said to have accuracy and fidelity of a studio monitor and it has great extension in bass and good punch in bass as well.
   
  Also, it has a BA Driver.


----------



## FlySweep

A161 housing looks just like the SBA-03.. very interested to hear how it sounds..


----------



## jiff

I take it the A161 just has a single BA.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





jiff said:


> I take it the A161 is just has a single BA.


 

      Yes, I would've said *Dual BA* if there were two.


----------



## monoglycer

Wouldn't underestimate the quality of a single BA, will be interesting to see how it sounds.


----------



## jiff

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Yes, I would've said *Dual BA* if there were two.


 


  Calm down there bold print guy I was just wondering.
   
  Quote: 





monoglycer said:


> Wouldn't underestimate the quality of a single BA, will be interesting to see how it sounds.


 

  
  I don't underestimate singles I have the Ety HF5's which I still listen to even though I have TF10's.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





jiff said:


> Calm down there bold print guy I was just wondering.


 

       Just pointing it out. Someone on the forum tested it and said it has the cleanest and balanced sound in comparison to the A151. The frequency chart shows extended bass and treble. The A161 utilizes the TWFK armature, so you guys should have a bit of an idea of the sound signature.


----------



## eke2k6

Hey the fi-ba-ss is a single BA. Meelec has a special place in my heart, so I'm excited to hear them


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> i thought you just said it was a single ba?


 

      It is, but the TWFK armature can be single or dual.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> i had no clue only thought it applied to the knowles dual setup
> 
> http://www.knowles.com/search/family.do?family_id=TWFK&x_sub_cat_id=10


 
   
       Sorry, I guess it is Dual BA. MEELEC made it seem it was single. Makes sense as of why it is a flagship IEM and the bass is extended.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## jiff

It is a dual, I thought it might be since they already have the A151.  I haven't ever heard the Apple BA so I don't know what the sound signature of the TWFK but if they tune it like the A151 it will probably have some bass boost.


----------



## jiff

Are there any other IEM's besides these 2 that you know of that use the TWFK?  I might of heard one before and just not know it.


----------



## Niyologist

jiff said:


> Are there any other IEM's besides these 2 that you know of that use the TWFK?  I might of heard one before and just not know it.


 

      The UE 700 and I think the Westone 2 or the CK90. I definitely know about the UE 700, but the Westone 2 or the CK90 is what I'm unsure about.


----------



## jiff

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The UE 700 and I think the Westone 2 or the CK90. I definitely know about the UE 700, but the Westone 2 or the CK90 is what I'm unsure about.


 


  Thanks, 
   
  I haven't heard any of thoughs but I still might get the A161's because they make good products at very reasonable prices.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Just pointing it out. Someone on the forum tested it and said it has the cleanest and balanced sound in comparison to the A151. The frequency chart shows extended bass and treble. *The A161 utilizes the **TWFK armature*, so you guys should have a bit of an idea of the sound signature.


 


  I don't think that's true. It was a single armature at last year's CES when they first showcased it and I'm pretty sure it's a single armature now. 


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> It is, but the TWFK armature can be single or dual.


 


  That's not true either


  Quote: 





bmeat said:


> nice, so essentially its an apple in ear with mee tuning. i wonder what theyll charge


 
   
  The ADDIEM does not use a TWFK. It uses what is essentially half of one with another armature.

  
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The UE 700 and I think the Westone 2 or the CK90. I definitely know about the UE 700, but the Westone 2 or the CK90 is what I'm unsure about.


 

 The Westone 2 and CK90Pro are not TWFK-based as far as I know. The CK90Pro has that acoustic horn system but unless it changes the sound past recognizability, it's a different driver.  The Fischer DBA-02/Brainwavz B2, Phiaton PS200, Nocs NS800, and ATH-CK10 are TWFK-based, however.


----------



## jiff

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think that's true. It was a single armature at last year's CES when they first showcased it and I'm pretty sure it's a single armature now.


 
   
   
  I'll trust the almighty joker when it comes to IEM's 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 and believe its a single BA.  
   
  Joker did you get a chance to listen to it a CES and if so how did it sound?


----------



## JK1

When will the A161 be available, and at what price?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





jiff said:


> Are there any other IEM's besides these 2 that you know of that use the TWFK?  I might of heard one before and just not know it.


 


  q-jays


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jiff said:


> Joker did you get a chance to listen to it a CES and if so how did it sound?


 

 Like the SBA-03. It was a while ago so I'm not sure they are exactly identical but close IMO.

  
  Quote: 





jk1 said:


> When will the A161 be available, and at what price?


 

 You should probably ask MEElec - I thought they were bringing it out last year.

  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> q-jays


 

 Good catch, forgot about those.


----------



## kiteki

Okay so UE700, CK10, DBA-02, B2, PS200, Nocs NS800, q-Jays... 7 in total.
   
  Never heard of Nocs


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *eke2k6* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Hey the fi-ba-ss is a single BA.


 

 It's pretty amazing!


----------



## Coq de Combat

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Okay so UE700, CK10, DBA-02, B2, PS200, Nocs NS800, q-Jays... 7 in total.
> 
> Never heard of Nocs


 

 I always thought of Nocs being pretty bad. I think teknikmagasinet sold them for a while too..


----------



## sphinxvc

Ok, I'm on a plane right now and this is the _second time_ his has happened so I thought I'd post.  My left ear starts to hurt wearing my SM3s _while on flights_.  Perhaps the ear is expanding while at altitude.  The SM3 isn't very friendy to my left ear.  I wonder if folks using customs have it even worse since they're even further in the ear canal.
   
  I should note that I have the V1s.  And that I'm very happy with them otherwise.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> And heeeeeere's the MEELEC A161:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Where are you finding this stuff? I can't find these releases anywhere else but here...


----------



## dogears

Indeed. The price is scary though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> It's pretty amazing!


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





dogears said:


> Indeed. The price is scary though


 

 So is jumping out of a plane.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


kiteki said:


> So is jumping out of a plane.


 

 Whilst wearing nothing. Else it's perfectly fine. Trust me. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Where are you finding this stuff? I can't find these releases anywhere else but here...


 

 I'm wondering the exact same...


----------



## Niyologist

i2ehan said:


> I'm wondering the exact same...


 
   
       I'm getting all of this info from FB.


----------



## Niyologist

Yeah, sooooo sorry guys, I'm reading the info the wrong way on FB about the A161. I wonder if MEELEC has anything new besides the A161, RX12 and AF32?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





bmeat said:


> "Aiming at the end of first quarter of this year"
> 
> "We think the treble is smoother than it would have been with a Knowles TWFK armature and hope the bass roll-off is lower as well "
> 
> "Better bass & treble extension, better overall balance, clearer and more resolving. A151 fans will still like it but it should appeal to a broader range of listeners. It is not v-shaped or bright/treble-heavy"


 
   
       Yeah, maybe that's what I should've done. Thanks for providing this info. Also, keep an eye on FB because there'll be more tomorrow. There *could* be new M-Series models revealed tomorrow.


----------



## dogears

Indeed! But getting the FI-BA-SS will give me endless musical bliss - unlike jumping out of a plane which is relatively short lived 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> So is jumping out of a plane.


----------



## estreeter

At the price FA want for them, those phones would want to swing around a pole and perform some very impressive calisthenics. You must have more money than the Sultan of Brunei.


----------



## dogears

"Cheapest" so far: http://www.accessoryjack.com/final-audio-design-fi-ba-ss-stainless-steel-earphone-stainless-steel.html


----------



## i2ehan

*There are bigger temptations than the FAD's!*


----------



## dogears

^Let us know when you get both. Would very much like to hear your impressions


----------



## Niyologist

I'm thinking about making my own earphones. It'll cost about 20K to 30K, but it'll be worth it considering that I live in a major city.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Ok, I'm on a plane right now and this is the _second time_ his has happened so I thought I'd post.  My left ear starts to hurt wearing my SM3s _while on flights_.  Perhaps the ear is expanding while at altitude.  The SM3 isn't very friendy to my left ear.  I wonder if folks using customs have it even worse since they're even further in the ear canal.
> 
> I should note that I have the V1s.  And that I'm very happy with them otherwise.


 


  I have to equalize the pressure in my ears while climbing or descending by breaking the seal every few minutes but I've never experienced the actual tips becoming uncomfortable. That said, I've never used an SM3 on a flight. In fact, I'm not sure I've even used silicone tips...



  
  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Where are you finding this stuff? I can't find these releases anywhere else but here...


 



http://www.facebook.com/MEElec


----------



## estreeter

Given the way the Euro is sliding atm, I wouldnt be too concerned about a '1,000 Euro' pricetag on the K3003. Unless, of course, you happen to *get paid *in Euros ....   
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   

 1,000.00 EUR = 1,235.32 AUD Euro   Australian Dollar 1 EUR = 1.23532 AUD   1 AUD = 0.809506 EUR   

   
  Throw in the DX100, and someone in Oz is bound to be leaving a very expensive portable rig on a bus somewhere in 2012. Time to renew my bus pass !


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Okay so UE700, CK10, DBA-02, B2, PS200, Nocs NS800, q-Jays... 7 in total.
> 
> Never heard of Nocs


 


  and there's the coming Vsonic GR01.... but not sure what drivers it has


----------



## james444

Quote: 





dogears said:


> ^Let us know when you get both. Would very much like to hear your impressions


 

 Well, if you're interested, I've posted a comparison between the K3003, FI-BA-SS and UERM here.


----------



## Niyologist

My Xeport 5010-8 continues to impress me. I'm starting to hear grain in the midrange now. Also, there's even more space than before, providing an "out of the head" type of headstage. The positioning of instruments reminds me of my VSonic GR06+Atrio X combo. The treble is not edgy, but has minimal sparkle and good extension (depending on your source). Also, there's the front and back positioning of the 5010-8 and yes, that's how I knew it was 3D, because it goes left, right, front, back and sometimes diagonally. Yeah, I wonder why Xeport would sell this great IEM for a low price? Hmmmmm......


----------



## tomscy2000

Hey, did you get a chance to listen to the AF78 (or any of Audiofly's other products) at CES, Joker? If so, how do you think it measures up? For an unknown startup to come out of nowhere, they seem well prepared and very polished, on the corporate and marketing side, at least.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hybrid universals that I can think of - UE SuperFi 5 EB, AKG K3003, Scosche IEM856, Atomic Floyd SuperDarts, and *Audiofly AF78*


----------



## jiff

After your excellent review of the FXT90's and you were spot on with the way the C1's sound I can't wait to here what you think of the TF10 and EX600.  I have the TF10's but not the EX600 though I'm still thinking of getting either them or some GR07's and the Yamaha EPH-100SL are still in the running.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> *There are bigger temptations than the FAD's!*


 


   


  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Well, if you're interested, I've posted a comparison between the K3003, FI-BA-SS and UERM here.


 

  
   
  It is exactly this type of evolution to which i was thinking and that i hope will be continued .
   
  The solution  of FI-BA-SS (according in some way) and the K3003 with a the dynamic driver for the low frequencies. But above all advance in research with the solution 'consumer' with IEM to wear easily. 
   
  The classic solution i see better to monitor in live situations, when sound is not only more convenient, but necessary. In daily use for listening to music IMO the solution adopted by FI-BA-SS or K3003 is preferable.


----------



## Niyologist

The new Sports-Fi Series from MEELEC:
   

   
  Looks like an enhanced MEELEC M6 up close. Those are the S6 Earphones. I'll get a close up within the next hour.


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The new Sports-Fi Series from MEELEC:
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like an enhanced MEELEC M6 up close. I'll get a close up within the next hour.


 


  Wish they would get rid of that annoying memory cord. That was one of the reasons why I hated my M6.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> Wish they would get rid of that annoying memory cord. That was one of the reasons why I hated my M6.


 

       They were thinking about fixing the Memory Cord problem for several months and it's probably resolved in this series.


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> They were thinking about fixing the Memory Cord problem for several months and it's probably resolved in this series.


 


  "...Featuring memory wire for a locked-in fit..." I think not.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> "...Featuring memory wire for a locked-in fit..." I think not.


 
   
        I'm pretty sure that's what anyone would want. A locked in fit to prevent the S6 from falling out. Right?


----------



## Niyologist

If anything, just use the cable guides that they're soon going to release later this year. It'll be useful for memory cable problems.


----------



## mbamg

It also prevents a lot of people from getting a proper fit and in many cases prevents the M6 from staying on.
  
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> If anything, just use the cable guides that they're soon going to release later this year. It'll be useful for memory cable problems.


 


  It's useless if the memory wire's still there. That thing could probably bend the guides out of shape.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> It also prevents a lot of people from getting a proper fit and in many cases prevents the M6 from staying on.


 

       If it has better flexibility like the cable itself, then it should be somewhat better than the M6.


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> If it has better flexibility like the cable itself, then it should be somewhat better than the M6.


 


  If they stop using wires altogether and actually gave the cord memory characteristics then it would better than the M6. I cannot help but compare these wires to paper clips.


----------



## Niyologist

MEELEC has also mentioned:
   
   
  Quote: 





> Externally the housing is similar to the M6 (aside from the color scheme) but it has been sealed for better moisture proofing and has new hydrophobic nozzle filters.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> If they stop using wires altogether and actually gave the cord memory characteristics then it would better than the M6. I cannot help but compare these wires to paper clips.


 

       lol, kinda feels like it.


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





> Externally the housing is similar to the M6 (aside from the color scheme) but it has been sealed for better moisture proofing and has new hydrophobic nozzle filters.


 
   
  Funny thing was my M6 did end up falling apart. I didn't bother notifying MEElec customer support about it though. Hydrophobic nozzle filters? Metal is prone to rust, paper is prone to decay... so... plastic?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> Funny thing was my M6 did end up falling apart. I didn't bother notifying MEElec customer support about it though. Hydrophobic nozzle filters? Metal is prone to rust, paper is prone to decay... so... plastic?


 

      My M6 is still intact. Also, I guess it wasn't reinforced enough. It's possible for that to happen.


----------



## Niyologist

More from MEELEC for the S6:
   
   
  Quote: 





> No change to the drivers - any acoustic differences will come from the filters.


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> More from MEELEC for the S6:
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 

 I'm guessing metal filters or something. If they do use paper then I would consider that a step backwards.


----------



## i2ehan

With respect to the OP, let's keep the speculations of any new Meelec offerings in the respective Meelec thread(s) please.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Hey, did you get a chance to listen to the AF78 (or any of Audiofly's other products) at CES, Joker? If so, how do you think it measures up? For an unknown startup to come out of nowhere, they seem well prepared and very polished, on the corporate and marketing side, at least.


 

 Not yet, I don't even know where their booth is.

  
  Quote: 





jiff said:


> After your excellent review of the FXT90's and you were spot on with the way the C1's sound I can't wait to here what you think of the TF10 and EX600.  I have the TF10's but not the EX600 though I'm still thinking of getting either them or some GR07's and the Yamaha EPH-100SL are still in the running.


 

 The EX600 will probably come sooner than the TF10 as the write-up is nearly finished. Have to put up a couple of lower-end sets next week though.
   


  Quote: 





mbamg said:


> Wish they would get rid of that annoying memory cord. That was one of the reasons why I hated my M6.


 


  That's the only thing that makes the M6 special in its price range. Otherwise they might as well ditch it altogether.


  Quote: 





mbamg said:


> If they stop using wires altogether and actually gave the cord memory characteristics then it would better than the M6. I cannot help but compare these wires to paper clips.


 

 The memory wire is stainless steel which would make for a pretty poor conductor. The memory wire on the previous revisions was copper but it was too stiff to be convenient.


----------



## staxxx

Nice, I'm looking forward to both reviews.


----------



## tomscy2000

Well, they could turn out to be mediocre like so many other companies, but they seem good, for now. This probably won't help much, but the booth looks like this, according to their Tumblr:
   

  ​  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not yet, I don't even know where their booth is.


----------



## Niyologist

I made a thread for the new MEELEC headphones:
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/590183/new-meelec-headphones-ces-2012#post_8049805


----------



## dogears

james444 said:


> Well, if you're interested, I've posted a comparison between the K3003, FI-BA-SS and UERM here.



Yup, saw that already. Thanks much for the impressions. Hoping to audition the K3003 locally. Hoping...


----------



## estreeter

I'd be interested to know if anyone here has ever lost/broken a set of seriously expensive ($600+) IEMs. Sure, it can happen with 'regular' cans, but mine never leave the house : by contrast, I've found my IEMs in all sorts of interesting nooks and crannies. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  (I know - put them back in the case yada yada yada. Yes, mum, I am wearing clean underwear as I type this...)


----------



## roker

joker ...
   
  I lost my Phonak Audeo 022s (with the mic button)
   
  While I'm thinking of buying another pair, is there an alternative that suits this:
   
  -Same comfort (better if possible ... is that possible?)
  -mic .... has to have a mic, makes business phone calls easier for me as I can focus on work and talk.
  -durability, the 022s are pretty durable and took a good beating from me.
  -fuller sound.  I like a warm sound, but I'm not expecting headphone like quality.  I kind of felt the sound was a bit too neutral for my taste (green tips help, but where are the mids?)
   
  thanks.
   
  You helped me buy this pair in the first place and I can't believe it's gone.


----------



## Inks

UE600vi perhaps. Not much is known about them but they seem to suit what you're looking for. Haven't heard it but they graph better than the UE700 and have a warmer sound. (based on InnerFidelitys graphs).


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





joe it said:


> It is exactly this type of evolution to which i was thinking and that i hope will be continued .
> 
> The solution  of FI-BA-SS (according in some way) and the K3003 with a the dynamic driver for the low frequencies. But above all advance in research with the solution 'consumer' with IEM to wear easily.
> 
> *The classic solution i see better to monitor in live situations, when sound is not only more convenient, but necessary.* In daily use for listening to music IMO the solution adopted by FI-BA-SS or K3003 is preferable.


 

 Joe it, that's why some people use custom IEM's at home, and open-air earbuds in public.
  
  I am thinking of doing the same, it seems like an ideal setup.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Well, they could turn out to be mediocre like so many other companies, but they seem good, for now. This probably won't help much, but the booth looks like this, according to their Tumblr:
> 
> 
> ​


 

 Its helps because it tells me I haven't been near it. That's pretty noticeable as far as CES booths go. It's unfortunate the CES android app is inferior to the apple one but it still helps navigate.. somewhat.
   


  Quote: 





roker said:


> joker ...
> 
> I lost my Phonak Audeo 022s (with the mic button)
> 
> ...


 


  If you are comfortable with Shure form factors, the SE215 w/mic cable might work. The Spider Realvoice is another warm-sounding one with mic (apple 3-button style). Long-term durability is unknown and comfort is hit or miss. The bass might also sound a little bloated coming from Phonaks. Beyer's MMX101iE is another option though it is much bassier and again the bass is somewhat bloated compared to an armature-based set. It is comfortable, well-built, and definitely warm-sounding, though.


----------



## dogears

The K2 [SP'd MX] is scaling up very nicely with the Epiphany EHP-O2 amp


----------



## roker

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Its helps because it tells me I haven't been near it. That's pretty noticeable as far as CES booths go. It's unfortunate the CES android app is inferior to the apple one but it still helps navigate.. somewhat.
> 
> 
> 
> If you are comfortable with Shure form factors, the SE215 w/mic cable might work. The Spider Realvoice is another warm-sounding one with mic (apple 3-button style). Long-term durability is unknown and comfort is hit or miss. The bass might also sound a little bloated coming from Phonaks. Beyer's MMX101iE is another option though it is much bassier and again the bass is somewhat bloated compared to an armature-based set. It is comfortable, well-built, and definitely warm-sounding, though.


 


 I'm not a huge fan of Shure.  If I did go with a more balanced but not etymotic flat neutral sound, would there be a better option?  In fact, I'm willing to sacrifice my tlt toward warmth in the name of comfort and durability.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Get an armature-based custom with a flat signature, e.g. CTM-200. Doubt you'll get a significant upgrade otherwise unless you find a signature that suits you better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Sold one pair and getting another FXT90. I miss their sound.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





dogears said:


> The K2 [SP'd MX] is scaling up very nicely with the Epiphany EHP-O2 amp


 

 Nice.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Joe it, that's why some people use custom IEM's at home, and open-air earbuds in public.
> 
> I am thinking of doing the same, it seems like an ideal setup.


 

 Excuse me, perhaps i expressed myself badly. My bad english does not help.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I wanted to say that in situations in which need a good isolation, when playing an instrument, and there are other musicians that they do the same thing, it produces music, using headphones as monitor,i think we need to approach the 'custom'.
   
  For listening, I do not think that we need the 'custom', and i am glad that there is a new approach as FI-BA-SS and K3003.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


joe it said:


> For listening, I do not think that we need the 'custom', and i am glad that there is a new approach as FI-BA-SS and K3003.


 
   
  Ditto. I'd personally love to see more and more universals go toe to toe against high end customs, granted the performance delivers of course. For one, it's a pain in the booty to have to sell customs, given the cost of impressions + reshell, and not to mention the likelihood of a different signature after reshelling, as compared to the originally intended sound signature as was tuned by the original custom manufacturer. Nevertheless, I'm not saying it'd be easy to sell a $1000+ universal, but it'd require a hell of a lot less effort than purchasing a second hand custom. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  If ever the K3003 is offered at a discounted price, I'd bite.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





roker said:


> I'm not a huge fan of Shure.  If I did go with a more balanced but not etymotic flat neutral sound, would there be a better option?  In fact, I'm willing to sacrifice my tlt toward warmth in the name of comfort and durability.


 


  Forgot to mention the HiSound Crystals-  they might suit your needs as well and do have a slight tilt towards warmth. Otherwise, you might be better off with another 022 or with moving up a notch to an FXT90 or something.


----------



## ljokerl

Alright, my personal listening impressions from CES. I've broken them up into three categories. These are based on quick impressions but I do think I got a feel for what each set had to offer. Used for comparisons were the UM Miracle and VSonic GR07.
   

 _Brand_
 _Model (Price)_
 _Type_
 _Notes_
 *Sets I was impressed by and would have loved to write a full review of*
  AKG / Harman
  K3003 ($1300)
  Universal IEM
  (Dual armature, single dynamic)
  Very musical yet quite neutral (on the ‘reference’ setting), great clarity and resolution. Surprisingly small and comfortable
  K550 ($300)
  Closed, circumaural
  Flat and pretty neutral, but punchy; good resolution, comfortable, excellent build quality, relatively easy to drive
  K495 NC ($350)
  Closed, supraaural, noise-cancelling
  Very comfortable, excellent noise-canceling circuit, fun, reasonably clear sound with ANC off
  Altec Lansing
  A1 ($499), A2 ($799), A3 ($999)
  Custom IEM demo
 (single, dual, triple armature)
  Silicone customs from ACS. Demo pairs were all impressive in their own right. A3 sounded flatter than Miracle and very smooth, with good reach and note thickness
  Audiofly
  AF78 ($200)
  Universal IEM
  (single armature, single dynamic)
  Similar bass to AF56 but better treble extension, clarity, and quality. Bit of bleed in the midrange. Good fit & nice design
  Etymotic Reseach
  EtyKids ($50)
  Universal IEM
  (dynamic)
  Surprisingly resolving and very enjoyable overall, esp. for the price. 300ohm impedance limits volume.
  House of Marley
  Exodus ($150)
  Closed, supraaural
  Clear, well-balanced, good detail, comfortable
  Skullcandy
  Mix Master Mike ($300)
  Closed, circumaural
  Easily the best thing I’ve heard from Skullcandy. Rich feature set, nice design and isolation, balanced sound with a bump in the bass, very clean and enjoyable. Would be happier at $200 price point
  Sony
  XBA-1 ($80)
  Universal IEM (single armature)
  Great clarity, well-balanced, and seems to be priced very well
 *Sets I was not unimpressed by but would need more time to evaluate properly*
  Audiofly
  AF56 ($100)
  Universal IEM (dynamic)
  Bass-heavy but not terribly muddy. Good fit & comfort
  Bell’o Digital
  BDH-something ($25)
  Universal IEM
  Quite clear and reasonably balanced for an entry-level set. Bass was flabby but for $25 I’d give it another try
  House of Marley
  Zion ($100)
  Universal IEM
  (dynamic)
  Bassy and a bit boomy but not unpleasant
  Name unknown ($200)
  Universal IEM
  (dynamic)
  Bit more balanced than Zion and very nice slim form factor
  Stir it up ($200)
  Closed, supraaural
  Less controlled & clear than cheaper Exodus
  Redemption Song ($200)
  Closed, supraaural
  Less controlled & clear than cheaper Exodus
  Name unknown (price unknown)
  Closed, circumaural
  Unreleased circumaural headphone. Nice construction and very comfortable. Tuning not finalized; did not sound as good as Exodus
  Moshi
  Clarus ($200)
  Universal IEM
  (dual dynamic)
  Dual dynamic (7+15mm) sport-style canalphone. One of very few consumer-class earphones at CES that was not bass-heavy. Pretty good balance and clarity but some of it comes from uneven treble. Feels quite big when worn.
  Scosche
  RH1056m ($230)
  Closed, circumaural
  Surprisingly balanced for a Beats clone. Clean, punchy bass and smooth all around
  Sony
  XBA-4 ($350)
  Universal IEM
  (quad armature)
  Quite bass-heavy for a high-end armature, seemed to have more treble unevenness compared to XBA-1
  Westone
  ES5 ($950)
  Custom IEM demo
  (5x armature)
  Surprisingly bassy even next to UM Miracle. Great resolution but the tone seemed a little off as a result of the bass boost. Would really need more than 10 minutes to evaluate properly.
 *Sets I was not impressed by*
  House of Marley
  TTR Destiny ($300)
  Closed, circumaural, noise-cancelling
  Muddy and congested. Only works with ANC on
  Logic3 / Ferrari
  R300 ($300)
  Closed, circumaural, noise-cancelling
  Muddy and boomy, top-end roll-off, poor clarity. Only works with ANC on
  Scosche
  IEM856m ($250)
  Universal IEM
  (single armature, single dynamic)
  Hybrid (BA+dynamic) IEM. Sibilant, harsh, and boomy. Was told it only sounds good with an iPhone and the Scosche EQ app
  RH656md ($130)
  Closed, supraaural
  New on-ear headphones. Sounded boomy and flat
  Skullcandy
  Aviator ($150)
  Closed, circumaural
  Crap all around

   
   
   
  Just for fun and because I took notes on it, I’ve compiled a list of the quality of the staff at each booth. This in no way says anything about a particular company – just trivial observations on my part. I did try to find the right person to talk to at each booth.
   
*Staff both very knowledgeable and very helpful:*
   
  AKG / Harman
  Altec Lansing
  Etymotic Research
  Sony
   
*Staff helpful but not well-versed in Audio:*
   
  Audiofly
  Bell’o
  House of Marley
  Moshi
  Scosche
  Skullcandy
  Westone
   
*Staff not knowledgeable and not particularly friendly/helpful*
   
  Logic3/Ferrari
  Sennheiser
  TDK/Imation


----------



## mbamg

Might I ask what were you doing at CES?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> Might I ask what were you doing at CES?


 


  Clearly I was doing janitorial work


----------



## jant71

Nice CES impressions! They are coming few and far between this year it seems.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Clearly I was doing janitorial work


 


  He did it for the lolz


----------



## i2ehan

As brief as it may have been, did you find the K3003's clarity and resolution on par with that of the Miracle's?


----------



## jiff

I'd love to checkout the Audiofly AF78 with the BA/dynamic combo, I've really wanted to get a pair like that for awhile now.


----------



## jjmai

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *Staff both very knowledgeable and very helpful:*
> 
> AKG / Harman
> Altec Lansing
> ...


 

 Did you get to check out the Audio-Technica booth?  Too bad they aren't bringing much IEMs in the $100~300 range to US.  I think the only one they got is CKS77 for msrp $120.  They don't even have CKS90, which got a lot of shelf spaces in Japan.
   
  Some tidbits I learned during the show:

 Westone 4R is 1~2dB tighter quality-controlled than the plain Westone 4.
 TDK/Imation staff says BA200 is available at Amazon.  The last time I checked, that ain't true.
 Scosche does not mean the japanese word "sukoshi". It's actually a combination of Nova Scotia (where the owner is from) and Porsche.
 Etymotic HF series's naming goes like this: 2 originally meant "squared", 3 refers the 3 buttons on the control, 5 refers to the 5th generation IEM.
 Sennheiser HD700 doesn't have a firm release date yet.
 Meelec S6 follows M6's design, and is sweat-proof.  The PAE1 bass/treble control module (amp?) unfortunately wasn't on display.
 Monster had a invitation-only section (I am not invited, duh) that required signing non-disclosure agreement.  I wonder if they have even more interesting headphone products coming up soon, especially now that Beats and Monster are separating their ways.
 Comply's booth had Sony's XB500 & XB700 - I think those headphones are using Comply's foam.  Forgot to ask for confirmation.
 Parrot's Zik bluetooth touch-activated headphone is interesting.  Has active noise canceling, and works as wired headphone too.
 Nokia Purity headphone (by Monster) didn't sound bassy at all, but it might've been the Lumia 800 as DAP or the loud noise at the show floor.
 Klipsch Mode's noise canceling didn't sound too effective, but it could've been just because the type of noise at the show.
 I had some connection issue with Hifiman's demo unit (DAP and HE400? not sure), I wonder if that's a common issue.
   
   
  Surprised by your "Crap all around" comment on Skullcandy Aviator, considering the praises it has gotten here at head-fi.


----------



## tomscy2000

Interesting little details; boo on the second bullet point --- the BA200 is a great sounding little thing.
  
  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Some tidbits I learned during the show:
> 
> Westone 4R is 1~2dB tighter quality-controlled than the plain Westone 4.
> TDK/Imation staff says BA200 is available at Amazon.  The last time I checked, that ain't true.
> ...


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *Staff both very knowledgeable and very helpful:*
> 
> AKG / Harman
> Altec Lansing
> ...


 
  Not surprised by those on the top, but I expected Westone to be up there. Very surprised Sennheiser is at the bottom.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> As brief as it may have been, did you find the K3003's clarity and resolution on par with that of the Miracle's?


 

 The K3003 wasn't on display but they would take you to an audition room if you asked for it so I got a nice sit-down listen. I would say clarity and resolution are its strengths, very close to the Miracle if not just as good. It wasn't quite as smooth as the Miracle and a bit less 3-d and enveloping in presentation but I would say it's probably the best universal I've heard.
   


  Quote: 





jiff said:


> I'd love to checkout the Audiofly AF78 with the BA/dynamic combo, I've really wanted to get a pair like that for awhile now.


 

 It's a good sound signature, seemed noticeably better to my ears that Scosche's similar setup mostly due to smoother, more natural treble and less mid-bass bloat. The form factor seems pretty well-thought-out as well. 
   


  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Did you get to check out the Audio-Technica booth?  Too bad they aren't bringing much IEMs in the $100~300 range to US.  I think the only one they got is CKS77 for msrp $120.  They don't even have CKS90, which got a lot of shelf spaces in Japan.
> 
> Some tidbits I learned during the show:
> 
> ...


 


  Thanks, that's very interesting. Ety nomenclature still makes no sense 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
  Audio-Technica didn't have a demo set of the CKW1000 but they sure look pretty. All they had on demo were the Solid Bass IEMs and a bunch of headphones but nothing new that I could find.
   
  The first TDK person I talked to didn't know what the BA200 was. The second was surprised at my asking to audition an earphone. The third told me there was a demo set but it turned out there wasn't - the only two pairs they had were attached firmly to a display stand. 
   
  Monster's booth was very crowded and they didn't have any listening stations for the in-ears. The SMS audio booth was guarded by a wall of sound. Even wearing customs I was too worried about my hearing to come close. Also, listening impressions would have been impossible with the 100dB+ of background noise they were pumping out. On that note, Skullcandy's listening stands had ridiculous volume - couldn't listen to any of the headphones from the stand because all of the volume settings were too loud. The source was an ipad so it must've been the amplifier used in the stand that was turned all the way up. They did bring out demo sets I could try with my own source when asked, though. 
   
  The demo HD800 I thought was probably underamped. It didn't sound as good as I expected. The HD700 was more comfortable for me and sounded very decent but would probably be much better still with nicer source and less background noise. They had no untethered Amperiors that I could try with my own source.
   
  Can't find anything positive to say about the Aviator, especially back to back with the surprisingly competent Mix Master Mikes. With my J3 it still sounded badly post-processed and very bland despite the bass emphasis not being too great. I don't think it's any better than Beats Studios.


  
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Not surprised by those on the top, but I expected Westone to be up there. Very surprised Sennheiser is at the bottom.


 

 Just my quick impressions. Westone guys I talked to weren't sure an ES5 demo was available, one was surprised I asked to 'demo' a set of customs and tried to tell me they had to be customized to my ears (which I would have easily agreed to 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). They found the demo kit eventually.
   
  Sennheiser staff couldn't answer any questions about the new HD25 properly. One said he would get more info and never came back. Another backed away from me to a distance where I couldn't ask any more questions (I promise I was just as courteous at their booth as every other). The only person who openly admitted to not knowing instead of feeding me BS was a guy from Senn UK. I'm not a reporter so my approach was maybe too direct and their booth was pretty busy - I'm sure my impression would have been more positive otherwise. That said, the AKG booth was pretty busy as well but they nearly forced me to listen to some of the new headphones (I was only interested in the K3003) and seemed genuinely proud of their products (IMO with good reason).


----------



## Inks

Have to say, I'm interested in the XBA-1. Never really got interested in the 4 since it seemed more of a V-shaped sound. 
   
  No XBA-3 demo?


----------



## tomscy2000

Wow, perhaps I was wrong about TDK getting serious about the headphone business (this will be reflected in my review of the BA200)... they seem completely clueless! Their stuff just doesn't seem very well publicized, and their lack of information dissemination reflects that. I'm wondering, however, if it might have to do with their corporate structure. It seems like all headphone operations fall under the moniker of 'TDK Performance', and a label of 'TDK/Imation' seems like it's concentrating on recording media. They most likely weren't the people in charge.
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The first TDK person I talked to didn't know what the BA200 was. The second was surprised at my asking to audition an earphone. The third told me there was a demo set but it turned out there wasn't - the only two pairs they had were attached firmly to a display stand.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> The K3003 wasn't on display but they would take you to an audition room if you asked for it so I got a nice sit-down listen. I would say clarity and resolution are its strengths, very close to the Miracle if not just as good. It wasn't quite as smooth as the Miracle and a bit less 3-d and enveloping in presentation* but I would say it's probably the best universal I've heard.*


 
   
  At that price, it had damn well better be! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  That said, it's nice to know the K3003 isn't just remarkably appealing (at least in my eyes), but performs just as well. Now, where'd that wallet run off to...


----------



## jjmai

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Wow, perhaps I was wrong about TDK getting serious about the headphone business (this will be reflected in my review of the BA200)... they seem completely clueless! Their stuff just doesn't seem very well publicized, and their lack of information dissemination reflects that. I'm wondering, however, if it might have to do with their corporate structure. It seems like all headphone operations fall under the moniker of 'TDK Performance', and a label of 'TDK/Imation' seems like it's concentrating on recording media. They most likely weren't the people in charge.


 

 Well, on TDK's defence, it was more of Imation booth, rather than a dedicated TDK booth.
  Most of their headphones are secured to the display boards with very short cords so you couldn't demo.  I did try out ST800 though, but I was surprised that volume control (by spinning the wheel on one of the cans) is digital instead of analog, and has very noticeable delay.
  But it's definitely nostalgic seeing them do this:


----------



## shotgunshane

Wow, it's amazing to me that companies send out employees to host the booths that don't have a clue about their products.  On second thought maybe I shouldn't be amazed, as I know how well the company I work for has customer service reps that know very little of our own products and processes.


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Wow, it's amazing to me that companies send out employees to host the booths that don't have a clue about their products.  On second thought maybe I shouldn't be amazed, as I know how well the company I work for has customer service reps that know very little of our own products and processes.


 
   
  Business policy has gone downhill since the 80's. I recall my dad talking about marketing reps and system engineers partnered up to convince clients to buy their services when he was at IBM.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> And heeeeeere's the MEELEC A161:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Finally it's out!  Assuming they didn't change the sig from a year ago that thing is very nice, best Meelec I've heard yet.


----------



## Inks

Assuming it will sound close to the SBA03, I agree. Knowing Meelec, the pricing should be great as well. It should 100$ retail imo, with the possibility of going quite lower due to Meelec's occasional sales. It is going to have tough competition from other balanced single BAs with a mic (PFE1s/UE600vi/HF3-2/XBA-1ip).


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





inks said:


> Not surprised by those on the top, but I expected Westone to be up there.


 

 Lol, I had to wait 20-25 minutes for them to hunt down the demo for me last year as well.  The bass w/ the silicone flanges I usually use almost knocked me out of the chair i was sitting in.  I guess people didn't believe me.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  The bass on my ES5 custom is a bit more tame but still quite visceral when need be.  If I kick up the gain on my amp the bass driver really lights up similarly to the demo set.
   
  @joker
   
  Wish I knew you were going I would have told you who to seek out.  This is the man!  Great guy all around.
   




   
   Questions about audiology and ear molds definitely look up Michael West.  He did mine and nailed the molds.  The difference between his and the UE ones done at CES were night and day.  Publishes on the matter too.


----------



## kiteki

Thanks for your CES impressions ljokerl.
   
  Someone said the XBA-3 has more bass than the XBA-4, and the XBA-4 had more prominent mids, another person said it sounds crap from Apple devices, the impressions are all over the place. ^^
   
  Can the XBA-1 compete with, say... the Klipsch X10 do you think?
   
  The Aviator sounds pretty balanced for a Skullcandy and looks nice but didn't seem to excel at anything and had recessed vocals iirc...


----------



## tomscy2000

Yeah, that was what I was leaning toward; I'm guessing the reps there were from Imation and not TDK's personal audio division. I wonder if they still sell tapes? I always thought those metal-film tape cartridges were so cool, but were too prohibitively expensive for me to buy.
  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Well, on TDK's defence, it was more of Imation booth, rather than a dedicated TDK booth. Most of their headphones are secured to the display boards with very short cords so you couldn't demo.  I did try out ST800 though, but I was surprised that volume control (by spinning the wheel on one of the cans) is digital instead of analog, and has very noticeable delay. But it's definitely nostalgic seeing them do this:


 
   
  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Wow, it's amazing to me that companies send out employees to host the booths that don't have a clue about their products.  On second thought maybe I shouldn't be amazed, as I know how well the company I work for has customer service reps that know very little of our own products and processes.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> I always thought those metal-film tape cartridges were so cool, but were too prohibitively expensive for me to buy.


 

 Not at all, you just don't eat.  That's what I did, lol.  Now I've got a wall full of them and I can see I haven't learned a damned thing about the money to audio relationship since I was a kid.


----------



## tomscy2000

haha, I wish I had your courage! Seeing these things also reminded me of the more recent ATRAC miniDisc, which died an equally unceremonious death. Well, perhaps it never got off the ground in the first place...
  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Not at all, you just don't eat.  That's what I did, lol.  Now I've got a wall full of them and I can see I haven't learned a damned thing about the money to audio relationship since I was a kid.


----------



## dogears

And?... the suspense is killing me... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> Just my quick impressions. Westone guys I talked to weren't sure an ES5 demo was available, one was surprised I asked to 'demo' a set of customs and tried to tell me they had to be customized to my ears (which I would have easily agreed to
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Have to say, I'm interested in the XBA-1. Never really got interested in the 4 since it seemed more of a V-shaped sound.
> 
> No XBA-3 demo?


 

 Didn't bother since I was short on time and really wanted to get to the AKG booth. IMO the XBA-1 is pretty well-balanced. Anything that adds a bass driver will be on the bassy side.

  
  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Well, on TDK's defence, it was more of Imation booth, rather than a dedicated TDK booth.
> Most of their headphones are secured to the display boards with very short cords so you couldn't demo.  I did try out ST800 though, but I was surprised that volume control (by spinning the wheel on one of the cans) is digital instead of analog, and has very noticeable delay.
> But it's definitely nostalgic seeing them do this:


 

 I tried out the cans while waiting as well. Didn't think any of them were great but of course they were plugged into the demo stand so I wouldn't trust my own impressions. Everything listed on the previous page I got to try out of my own J3 with familiar tracks.
   


  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Lol, I had to wait 20-25 minutes for them to hunt down the demo for me last year as well.  The bass w/ the silicone flanges I usually use almost knocked me out of the chair i was sitting in.  I guess people didn't believe me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 This matches my impressions. The guy who brought out the demo kit did say he thought the Demo sounded 99% identical to his customized ES5 but I'm not sure I believe that. The bass was very strong, more so than the XBA-4 IMO. Really stark difference in bass qty between the ES5 demo and the Miracle, and I thought the Miracle already had slightly more bass than 'flat'. Bass detail was good, though, and I couldn't tell any problems with the midrange or treble in my short audition. I did think the overall tone was slightly darker than the Miracle and of course the presentation wasn't as impressive as the (custom) Miracle. 
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Thanks for your CES impressions ljokerl.
> 
> Someone said the XBA-3 has more bass than the XBA-4, and the XBA-4 had more prominent mids, another person said it sounds crap from Apple devices, the impressions are all over the place. ^^
> 
> ...


 
   
  XBA-1 signature is quite different from the X10, plus its priced much lower. I think it'll have enough competition in the Fischer SBA-03 and Ety HF5 which are more similar in signature, plus the RE-ZERO, etc. The Sonys are definitely less analytical than the armature-based Etys and seem to be slightly thicker and smoother but I would need an A:B comparison to be sure. The impressive part is that it's cheaper than all of the above. I can envision one complaint being that the signature is too safe and 'boring', much like the Ety MC5.


----------



## kiteki

Ah yeah XBA-1 versus HF5 and RE0/-Zero would be interesting.
   
   
  "The guy who brought out the demo kit did say he thought the Demo sounded 99% identical to his customized ES5"
   
  If that's true, you may as well just ask Westone to make you a universal ES5 with comply tip.


----------



## dogears

Thanks for that short impression 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> This matches my impressions. The guy who brought out the demo kit did say he thought the Demo sounded 99% identical to his customized ES5 but I'm not sure I believe that. The bass was very strong, more so than the XBA-4 IMO. Really stark difference in bass qty between the ES5 demo and the Miracle, and I thought the Miracle already had slightly more bass than 'flat'. Bass detail was good, though, and I couldn't tell any problems with the midrange or treble in my short audition. I did think the overall tone was slightly darker than the Miracle and of course the presentation wasn't as impressive as the (custom) Miracle.


----------



## kiteki

Ftr... the miracle demo units I've seen use comply tips, the JH demo units are shaped more like a custom and had what looked like a streched Sony hybrid tip, I assume you were supposed to take that on or off depending on your canal size... either way the JH demo units offered a very good fit, if you twirled them around a bit.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Ftr... the miracle demo units I've seen use comply tips, the JH demo units are shaped more like a custom and had what looked like a streched Sony hybrid tip, I assume you were supposed to take that on or off depending on your canal size... either way the JH demo units offered a very good fit, if you twirled them around a bit.


 

 The Westone demo had foam tips, but I don't think they were Complys. - the foam was rougher and more porous, a-la Etymotic or Futuresonics. Still got a good seal with them, though.
   
  The Altec Lansing customs had ACS triple-flanges (the same sort that come with the ACS T15). According to the guy at the booth, the units are manufactured by ACS but use Lansing-specified Knowles drivers. They were very comfortable - I'm sure the full-shell ACS/Lansing customs are fantastic to use. The Kevlar-reinforced cables are fixed but supposedly ACS has only had one reported issue with that cable in several years.


----------



## Niyologist

I kinda kept emphasizing the Monster Turbines Pro Platinum an hour before the CES 2012 event started on FB. Monster said it was pretty interesting. I don't know if they're currently working on it. Or they have an idea on how to start it.......


----------



## roker

For pure functionality and comfort, phonak once again took my money.
   
  Never throw your IEMs into your work bag then meet people for happy hour.
   
   
  big big big mistake
   
  lesson learned the hard way.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Didn't bother since I was short on time and really wanted to get to the AKG booth. IMO the XBA-1 is pretty well-balanced.* Anything that adds a bass driver will be on the bassy side.*


 
   
  The W4 being an obvious exception, no? I certainly wouldn't call it on the bassy side, though I suppose it's all relative to what it's being compared against.


----------



## lukeskymac

I thought that ADDIEMs had nice vocals but with the GR07 I can clearly understand WTH Thom Yorke is saying most of the time. Quite a feat...
   
  The ZO2 order has just been confirmed.


----------



## olear

joker, is the GR07 "flat" in the same way as IE*8* is flat after the mid bass bump?


----------



## jjmai

ljokerl said:


> The Westone demo had foam tips, but I don't think they were Complys. - the foam was rougher and more porous, a-la Etymotic or Futuresonics. Still got a good seal with them, though.




I am pretty sure that's the comply S series. http://www.complyfoam.com/products/S-400/
I think the comply booth also said something about this series being available directly to earphone manufacturers.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> Quote:
> 
> The W4 being an obvious exception, no? I certainly wouldn't call it on the bassy side, though I suppose it's all relative to what it's being compared against.


 

 I meant in the Sony XBA series specifically. From what I understand, all of them use the same full-range driver as the XBA-1 and just add extra drivers to boost certain parts of the response. However, I really don't think one could add a bass driver to the XBA-1 and still have something that's reasonably flat unless it only boosts sub-bass, and then only a little.
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, is the GR07 "flat" in the same way as IE*8* is flat after the mid bass bump?


 

 The GR07 has a bit of treble unevenness
   


  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> I am pretty sure that's the comply S series. http://www.complyfoam.com/products/S-400/
> I think the comply booth also said something about this series being available directly to earphone manufacturers.


 


  Yes, that might be it.


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, is the GR07 "flat" in the same way as IE*8* is flat after the mid bass bump?


 


   


  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR07 has a bit of treble unevenness


 
  I consider the I8's Mids Slightly recessed GR-07 Mids are "visible" by a good margin


----------



## maverickronin

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Lol, I had to wait 20-25 minutes for them to hunt down the demo for me last year as well.  The bass w/ the silicone flanges I usually use almost knocked me out of the chair i was sitting in.  I guess people didn't believe me.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> This matches my impressions. The guy who brought out the demo kit did say he thought the Demo sounded 99% identical to his customized ES5 but I'm not sure I believe that. The bass was very strong, more so than the XBA-4 IMO. Really stark difference in bass qty between the ES5 demo and the Miracle, and I thought the Miracle already had slightly more bass than 'flat'. Bass detail was good, though, and I couldn't tell any problems with the midrange or treble in my short audition. I did think the overall tone was slightly darker than the Miracle and of course the presentation wasn't as impressive as the (custom) Miracle.


 
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Westone demo had foam tips, but I don't think they were Complys. - the foam was rougher and more porous, a-la Etymotic or Futuresonics. Still got a good seal with them, though.


 
   
  Are there different sounding ES5 demo units going around?  Here's what I wrote a year and a half ago in the ES5 thread.
   
  Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> On a serious note, The ES5s were light and airy without being overly bright.  There is bass response down to at least 20hz but it's a tad rolled off and lacked impact.  If that's the kind of sound you like then these are probably the IEMs for you.


 
   
  IIRC I used Comply tips on them.  Is it the tips instead?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> Is it the tips instead?


 

 Tips.  I used my own Meelec silicone bi-flanges which I'm familiar with on most of the universals I've used.  Great seal for low end response but lets the phone breathe in the upper registers too.  
   
  The ES5 demo is single bore btw compared to the custom which is dual bore.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> I consider the I8's Mids Slightly recessed GR-07 Mids are "visible" by a good margin


 


 You're always pushing that GR07 
   
  Flat meaning neutral? ,  If yes, FX700 is not flat due to its spiked bass and treble? And Atrio M5 is not flat due to its bass spike?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





olear said:


> You're always pushing that GR07
> 
> Flat meaning neutral? ,  If yes, FX700 is not flat due to its spiked bass and treble? And Atrio M5 is not flat due to its bass spike?


 

  
  Neither the M5 nor the FX700 is neutral. For me the definition of neutral is that you don't hear a booming bass line in the middle of a Celine Dion song, nor do you hear overly sparkly treble in a 50 cent rap. Everything is in its place, and nothing is overly emphasized, unless the song wants it to be so


----------



## maverickronin

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Tips.  I used my own Meelec silicone bi-flanges which I'm familiar with on most of the universals I've used.  Great seal for low end response but lets the phone breathe in the upper registers too.


 

 Hmm...
   
  I haven't had had tips make differences that big unless they just didn't seal at all but I haven't owned that many different IEMs either.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Neither the M5 nor the FX700 is neutral. For me the definition of neutral is that you don't hear a booming bass line in the middle of a Celine Dion song, nor do you hear overly sparkly treble in a 50 cent rap. Everything is in its place, and nothing is overly emphasized, unless the song wants it to be so


 


 If absolute neutrality is the goal, why not choose an Ety which I believe to be totally flat?
  And, don't most of us choose the degree of added coloration we prefer?  What sounds good isn't
  always the most technical, true?


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





olear said:


> If absolute neutrality is the goal, why not choose an Ety which I believe to be totally flat?
> And, don't most of us choose the degree of added coloration we prefer?  What sounds good isn't
> always the most technical, true?


 


  Etys really aren't completely neutral.... On the ety website the ER4S/B are listed as 92% neutral.  I think the treble and mids are very slightly emphasised.  The UERM, on the other hand, are 100% neutral.


----------



## Inks

There is no such thing as 100% neutral, even the Orpheus isn't 100% neutral.


----------



## kiteki

Quote:


> Originally Posted by *olear* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> If absolute neutrality is the goal, why not choose an Ety which I believe to be totally flat?


 
   
  The ER-4 is serrated, analytical, digital, the bass sounds like grenade shrapnels and the imaging is two-dimensional.

  
  Quote: 





olear said:


> And, don't most of us choose the degree of added coloration we prefer?


 
   
  I think it's common not to know what that colouration is until it's been experienced.

  
  Quote: 





olear said:


> What sounds good isn't always the most technical, true?


 

 If you could insert an IEM into your ears and it sounded just like a real-life concert that would sound pretty good.


----------



## Inks

The Etys are pretty neutral, easily one of the most neutral IEMs. The problem is that it's slight coloration isn't in favor for a lot of listeners. I don't think it's that flawed of an IEM though, if a recording sounds thin, digital and harsh with them that's because of the recording. It's toward the bright side with slightly under-emphasized bass and closed stage, so it's of little engagement for a lot.


----------



## olear

From what I've heard thus far, IE80 sound like a live concert, especially one that is outside.


----------



## kiteki

olear I meant hypothetically hearing a pounding kick drum 3 metres away and a vocalist 10 metres away, not silly IE80 20cm head-stage. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Inks yeah I can see it was easily one of the best and most neutral IEM's ever, esp. for a single driver, until Vsonic, Hifiman, Final Audio etc. came around to rain on the parade.


----------



## Inks

I still think it is.
   
  I think the ER4P/S, are better than the GR07 and all the Hifimans I've tried (though it's a closer call with the RE262). On par with the A1/SA/SB, though I do give the GR10 the upper hand for my taste and technicality rating.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


inks said:


> I still think it is.


 

 Ditto. The ER4 undoubtedly remains one of the most accurate in-ears, to date.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> Hmm...
> 
> I haven't had had tips make differences that big unless they just didn't seal at all but I haven't owned that many different IEMs either.


 

 Oh my, for some of us IEMers tips can make or break an IEM.  This isn't snake oil or psychoacoustics either.  There's a whole lot going on in that ear canal based on fit and all the stuff that makes that happen.  If anyone else would care to chime in, please.  See if you can discern a regular comply tip versus a cut down, foam trimmed tip.


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





olear said:


> You're always pushing that GR07
> 
> Flat meaning neutral? ,  If yes, FX700 is not flat due to its spiked bass and treble? And Atrio M5 is not flat due to its bass spike?


 

 I actually push the Ortofon EQ-5, but buy the GR-07's and get it over with


----------



## maverickronin

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Oh my, for some of us IEMers tips can make or break an IEM.  This isn't snake oil or psychoacoustics either.  There's a whole lot going on in that ear canal based on fit and all the stuff that makes that happen.  If anyone else would care to chime in, please.  See if you can discern a regular comply tip versus a cut down, foam trimmed tip.


 

 I know the tips can change the sound but I'm just questioning if the magnitude of the change is just due to the tips.  There's a pretty big difference between "light and airy but with good bass extension" and "the bass almost knocked me out of my chair" and its not like I could have heard the 20Hz tone on the Chesky "Heartbeats" track if I didn't have a proper seal.
   
  Maybe the the IEMs I've owned are just relatively insensitive to tips but I've never heard a difference that big.  Maybe we have ideas about how strong is "strong".  I thought it was weaker than my SE530s but I don't remember how much weaker.  Since it was so long ago I'm going by what I posted about it then.


----------



## estreeter

Interesting to see the favourable report on at least one Skullcandy model from Joker- I vaguely recall reading something from Tyll or one of the other heavyweights claiming that the boss at Skullcandy has expressed an interest in making headphones that might evoke something other than derision among audiophiles. I'm not saying they have 'turned a corner', but its difficult to ignore a company that pushes that much product simply because 99% of it is utter crapola


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





inks said:


> There is no such thing as 100% neutral, even the Orpheus isn't 100% neutral.


 


  Well, as neutral as a neutral IEM can get ;P


----------



## tomscy2000

What!?! This man speaks _blasphemy_! Off to the gulag you go! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





inks said:


> There is no such thing as 100% neutral, even the Orpheus isn't 100% neutral.


 

 A remarkably accurate description; it's definitely not made for modern day, highly processed recordings. At the end of the day, however, if there were one Etymotic I'd have it'd be the ER4; I like that it punches the music in the face, spits on it, and gives it a scalping for good measure.
   
  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> The ER-4 is serrated, analytical, digital, the bass sounds like grenade shrapnels and the imaging is two-dimensional.


 
   
  When did you get the GR10? Strangely, however, I actually prefer the ER4 to the GR10.
  
  Quote: 





inks said:


> I still think it is. I think the ER4P/S, are better than the GR07 and all the Hifimans I've tried (though it's a closer call with the RE262). On par with the A1/SA/SB, though I do give the GR10 the upper hand for my taste and technicality rating.


----------



## Comply

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> I am pretty sure that's the comply S series. http://www.complyfoam.com/products/S-400/
> I think the comply booth also said something about this series being available directly to earphone manufacturers.


 


  You're right, they do demo their earphones with our S-Series tips. We make them in 100-size just for Westone demos. 
  We hope everyone had a great CES!


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





comply said:


> You're right, they do demo their earphones with our S-Series tips. We make them in 100-size just for Westone demos.
> We hope everyone had a great CES!


 

     How come you guys won't let MEELEC have a share in Comply Foam tips in their Ear tip set? Their earphones are really good.


----------



## roker

I shot an email to Westone about offering iPhone controls with their premium IEMs and it seems they're working on it.  They're plan to offer replacement cables that will have it.  I think it's safe to say I'll be throwing some money their way when this happens.  I've always been curious about their IEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





roker said:


> I shot an email to Westone about offering iPhone controls with their premium IEMs and it seems they're working on it.  They're plan to offer replacement cables that will have it.  I think it's safe to say I'll be throwing some money their way when this happens.  I've always been curious about their IEMs.


 


  Interesting. How about Westone custom cables? My CTM-200 could be handy with a nice remote/mic unit.


----------



## Inks

guhmo said:


> Well, as neutral as a neutral IEM can get ;P


 
  There's no way to make that definitive with what we can prove though. Unless the UERM does that accuracy test or something of the sort. 
  


tomscy2000 said:


> A remarkably accurate description; it's definitely not made for modern day, highly processed recordings. At the end of the day, however, if there were one Etymotic I'd have it'd be the ER4; I like that it punches the music in the face, spits on it, and gives it a scalping for good measure.
> 
> 
> When did you get the GR10? Strangely, however, I actually prefer the ER4 to the GR10.


 
  I agree a lot of the people who describe the ER4 as thin, harsh, gritty, etc. may just be listening to modern, compressed, harsh recordings. Definitely a factor to consider. 
   
  I'm borrowing it from James. You're right, now that I've had more time with them I think even calling the GR10 an ER4S upgrade is a stretch.  I like the Ety's treble more but I do prefer the GR10's bass though the Ety's are just lacking punch and not depth.


----------



## kiteki

You could send an email to the UE labs and ask what a perfectly neutral IEM is.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


roker said:


> I shot an email to Westone about offering iPhone controls with their premium IEMs and it seems they're working on it.  They're plan to offer replacement cables that will have it.  I think it's safe to say I'll be throwing some money their way when this happens.  I've always been curious about their IEMs.


 

 I presume the cable will be the very same one that's featured already on their new talk series, the *Westone T1*.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





kiteki said:


> You could send an email to the UE labs and ask what a perfectly neutral IEM is.


 


  For your ears, probably not any IEM you can buy from the market.  The IEM interacts with each person's ear canals differently to produce unique resonance peaks
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/413900/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-a-tutorial
   
  The etys would have been pretty close to neutral for me if not for a 10+dB peak around 8kHz.  Sure didn't appear on Etymotic's measured response for the ER-4P.  Once the peak was EQ'ed out they sounded pretty damn good.


----------



## Comply

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> How come you guys won't let MEELEC have a share in Comply Foam tips in their Ear tip set? Their earphones are really good.


 


  If only business were as simple as that...


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





comply said:


> If only business were as simple as that...


 

      Is it that MEELEC isn't supplying enough of the needs you guys are looking for?


----------



## Inks

kiteki said:


> You could send an email to the UE labs and ask what a perfectly neutral IEM is.


 
  Theylll say that there is no perfect neutral IEM unless they make a fool of themselves claiming the UERM is the THE one as that will be blatant marketing. People should avoid the concept of perfection on audio, just not going to happen that's the fun of it.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Interesting. How about Westone custom cables? My CTM-200 could be handy with a nice remote/mic unit.


 


  Here's the email:
   
   
  Quote: 





> Thank you for your email and interest in Westone Music Products. Currently the only product we have available for use with smartphones our Talk Series, TS1. It is a single driver, universal fit earphone that has a microphone and button control on the cable that allows the user to answer/end calls and assists with music playback. In the near future we will be releasing the EPIC MICS replacement cable that can be purchased for any of our products that have a removable cable: Elite Series, AC Series, UM2 RC, UM3X RC, and the Westone 4R. If you have any additional questions please let us know. Thank you and have a great day!


 
   
  I've been wanting try Westone's for a while now, so this is great news.  I'll probably go for the UM2 when this happens.


----------



## dogears

From the K2 thread, my posts on K2 with the Epiphany EHP-O2 amp:
  Quote: 





dogears said:


> I hear impressive layering and better bass texture and attack. Mids is pushed forward just enough for my taste and rendered more natural together with the highs. It really sounds like a full sized headphone with the O2.


 
  Quote: 





dogears said:


> Actually, I was very surprised that the EHP-O2 did not 'aggravate' so to speak the already bright nature of the K2. Note: I did put some foams on the nozzle of my filter-removed-MX as it was too bright for me. WIth the O2, I can listen with the K2 with foam removed. There's no harshness or sibilance, instead there's more air and detail on the highs - could be on par with DBA02's highs but I'm just guessing from memory. I can actually listen to Garbage' When I Grow Up (Ver2.0) in my normal listening level. Carmina Burana O Fortuna sounds very revealing with more detail like the vocals.
> 
> Not sure if its my amp's version but the Epiphany EHP-O2 sounds very smooth on the high end (actually not a very good match with my Fostex T40RPv2) and I think this complemented (my) K2's highs.
> 
> ...


----------



## Mini0510

joker, I am happy to say that the FX700 is exactly what you described. It definitely has more treble presence than the Turbine Copper. It also has more clarity, 3D, and separation.
   
  It's very good but not perfect. If I'm looking for tighter bass, more 3D presentation, and more instrument separation, do I have to go into the custom market?
   
  Thanks


----------



## kiteki

Thanks dogears, the EHP-O2 is a really neat project for IEM's.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, I am happy to say that the FX700 is exactly what you described. It definitely has more treble presence than the Turbine Copper. It also has more clarity, 3D, and separation.
> 
> It's very good but not perfect. If I'm looking for tighter bass, more 3D presentation, and more instrument separation, do I have to go into the custom market?
> 
> Thanks


 

 Not sure, you'd have to ask someone more familiar with the custom market. The customs I've heard are all armature-based and don't deliver the bass of the FX700.
   


  Quote: 





kiteki said:


> Thanks dogears, the EHP-O2 is a really neat project for IEM's.


 


  +1, thanks for sharing your impressions


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, in spite of few time to test him, your rating to XBA-1 is possible?


----------



## Mini0510

ok


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, in spite of few time to test him, your rating to XBA-1 is possible?


 

 It was quite noisy on the show floor and I only had a couple of minutes so I'd rather not put a number on it. I did think that I would like to compare it to the Fischer SBA-03 and Ety HF5, which are two of the best <$150 single armatures I've come across.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> I actually push the Ortofon EQ-5, but buy the GR-07's and get it over with


 

 Not for me, Bass is the only thing the GR07 does better for me by comparison.  I also find the GR07 bass a hair over neutral where the EX1000 is a hair under.  Of course, that's splitting hairs.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> I know the tips can change the sound but I'm just questioning if the magnitude of the change is just due to the tips.  There's a pretty big difference between "light and airy but with good bass extension" and "the bass almost knocked me out of my chair" and its not like I could have heard the 20Hz tone on the Chesky "Heartbeats" track if I didn't have a proper seal.
> 
> Maybe the the IEMs I've owned are just relatively insensitive to tips but I've never heard a difference that big.  Maybe we have ideas about how strong is "strong".  I thought it was weaker than my SE530s but I don't remember how much weaker.  Since it was so long ago I'm going by what I posted about it then.


 

 ES5 definitely hits harder and larger than the 530.  Probably the cleanest, hardest hitting BA I've heard in the low end of any IEM I've heard yet.  The thing with tips is that's it's not just seal, but how the tips place the IEMs in your canal.  Depending you could get a deeper insertion or a shallower one which will affect volume and proximity.  Not to mention various bore diameters shaping the signature as well as the respective IEM design in question.  I did use the 602>Arrow amp high gain to demo them on a noisy CES floor that was probably over 80+dB at the least.
   
  How loud were you listening and from what source?
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> You're right, now that I've had more time with them I think even calling the GR10 an ER4S upgrade is a stretch.  I like the Ety's treble more but I do prefer the GR10's bass though the Ety's are just lacking punch and not depth.


 

 I also find they lack dimensionality.  It's that typical 2D BA signature that annoys me.  ER4S is a great, obvious choice in a world with less choices.


----------



## tomscy2000

Seems like a pretty spot-on characterization to me --- not splitting hairs at all... IMO
  
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Not for me, Bass is the only thing the GR07 does better for me by comparison.  I also find the GR07 bass a hair over neutral where the EX1000 is a hair under.  Of course, that's splitting hairs.


 
   
  I find also that it's actually not until you hear something that does have pronounced dimensionality that it really hits home. I thought my DBA were okay with regard to depth, and then I bought the BA200, which obliterated my idea of 3D sound possible in a BA package not named SM3 or UM3x
  


> I also find they lack dimensionality.  It's that typical 2D BA signature that annoys me.  ER4S is a great, obvious choice in a world with less choices.


----------



## maverickronin

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> ES5 definitely hits harder and larger than the 530.  Probably the cleanest, hardest hitting BA I've heard in the low end of any IEM I've heard yet.  The thing with tips is that's it's not just seal, but how the tips place the IEMs in your canal.  Depending you could get a deeper insertion or a shallower one which will affect volume and proximity.  Not to mention various bore diameters shaping the signature as well as the respective IEM design in question.  I did use the 602>Arrow amp high gain to demo them on a noisy CES floor that was probably over 80+dB at the least.


 

 I suppose the depth could be it.  I'm not sure how you're supposed to fit those sorts of large demo shells very deep into your ears though.  Maybe I'm just underestimating it because the IEMs I've owned haven't been too sensitive to that sort of thing.
   
  Source was Cowon D2+ to Total Bithead.
   
  Its good to know that they do have more bass though.  I loved everything else about it.


----------



## Mini0510

ljokerl said:


> Not sure, you'd have to ask someone more familiar with the custom market. The customs I've heard are all armature-based and don't deliver the bass of the FX700.


 
  ok. is Sony EX1000 have a tighter bass compare to FX700? also, how about the clarity and separation compared to FX700?


----------



## ericfarrell85

Yes, bass on the EX1000 is substantially tighter than on the FX700's. The FX700 bass is greater in quantity and impact. As for clarity they're both a notch below the most transparent universals and two or three notches beneath my customs. They both have large sound stages as befitting dynamics but if memory serves correctly the FX700 has slightly better instrument separation (I could be wrong about this, but the Sonys give more of a cohesive presentation).


----------



## Niyologist

MEELEC now has the Sports-Fi Series: S6 for Pre Order on their site.
   
  http://www.meelec.com/product_p/ep-s6-rdbk-mee.htm
   
  $49.99


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> MEELEC now has the Sports-Fi Series: S6 for Pre Order on their site.
> 
> http://www.meelec.com/product_p/ep-s6-rdbk-mee.htm
> 
> $49.99


 

 meelec has spoiled me.. Dont want to pay for the full price..


----------



## psygeist

Impressive indeed
   

 [size=9pt]Memory wire that conforms to the ear for a locked-in fit[/size]
 [size=9pt]A modular cable system for ease of use[/size]
 [size=9pt]Enhanced sweat resistance for added workout durability[/size]
 [size=9pt]Tangle resistant, color matched, noise-free cable[/size]
 [size=9pt]Superior enhanced bass that is tight and powerful[/size]
 [size=9pt]Noise-isolating in-ear design reduces background noise[/size]
 [size=9pt]Sport-inspired two-tone color scheme[/size]
 [size=9pt]Flush-in-the-ear design reduces wind noise and fits under most helmets[/size]
 [size=9pt]Includes neoprene sports armband, zipper carrying case, and 6 pairs of ear tips[/size]


 [size=9pt]1 year manufacturer warranty*[/size]


----------



## nightgost

I had the so loved GR07,i sell them just for an fitting issue. But i'm looking for some customs now, can you tell me something with more soundstage and sparkling treble than gr07??
  not passing the 600$.
   
  removable cable, silicone, fairly neutral not v-shaped eq, good instrument texture. (and i think having one driver for bass and other one for treble will leave the mids slightly recessed and without proper mid texture, just my thought!)
   
  I Live in portugal, europe.
   
  Thank You joker for all that hard work, i'll apreciate your answer if you have the time for it


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nightgost said:


> I had the so loved GR07,i sell them just for an fitting issue. But i'm looking for some customs now, can you tell me something with more soundstage and sparkling treble than gr07??
> not passing the 600$.
> 
> removable cable, silicone, fairly neutral not v-shaped eq, good instrument texture. (and i think having one driver for bass and other one for treble will leave the mids slightly recessed and without proper mid texture, just my thought!)
> ...


 


  The problem is that there are only a handful of companies that do custom molds in silicone. Off the top of my head - ACS (Altec Lansing), Minerva, Spiral Ear, and Sensaphonics. Some others may have a silicone option. Still fewer offer removable cables - I believe only Sensaphonics has a track record with a silicone mold + detachable cable setup. I have not heard any custom earphones from these companies so I can't be of help with those.
   
  Among the three $300+ (non-silicone) customs that I do own, the Miracle is the only one with as much as (or maybe a touch more) sparkle as the GR07. Other than that the CTM-200 fits your requirements. It is not mid-recessed and I am not even sure where the crossover point is between the two drivers.


----------



## roker

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Impressive indeed
> 
> 
> [size=9pt]Memory wire that conforms to the ear for a locked-in fit[/size]
> ...


 


  I would actually use mine when I bike so the noise isolation kind of scares me.  Though for the gym this would be useful.  I'll just wait until they give it away for like 20 bucks or something.


----------



## kiteki

Quote: 





nightgost said:


> I had the so loved GR07,i sell them just for an *fitting issue.* But i'm looking for some customs now, can you tell me something with *more soundstage *and *sparkling treble *than gr07??
> not passing the 600$.
> 
> *removable cable*, silicone, *fairly neutral *not v-shaped eq, *good instrument texture*.


 

 The Sony EX series (310/510/600/700/800/1000)
  
  Custom IEM... why silicone?  For silicone you can try contacting Alien Ears - http://www.alienears.com/products/221-sq5-five-driver-detachable-crd-mitr.aspx


----------



## dogears

FI-BA-SS at 9.3 and K2 SP at 9.4.
   
  Hoping for a review of K3003 and PFE232 soon


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dogears said:


> Hoping for a review of K3003 and PFE232 soon


 


  Yes, me too. Would really like a few weeks with the K3003.


----------



## rawrster

I miss this thread kinda  I've since stopped with portable since I moved onto full sized so don't get to check out this area as much as I used to.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I miss this thread kinda  I've since stopped with portable since I moved onto full sized so don't get to check out this area as much as I used to.


 


  Good to see you around! Lucky I'm still fixated on portable audio or this would get even more expensive.


----------



## nightgost

keteki, it was originaly posted by me, not dayhuman xD (maybe a mistake, its ok
   
  I THINK silicone because it won't break as easily as hard materials, it will be more confortable, better to be in bed with my ear on pillow. and the most important one, it will seal better, therefore better sound.
   
  joker,
  Thank you, it cleared and narrowed my options=) I was already pointing to the ctm 300 pro but i cant find no one talking about them here in head fi, and by the info on the website i cant tell if there is a driver for bass, other for mid ands other for treble  as im looking for, OR 2 bass, 1mids/treble.
   
  miracle is a little expensive, if i had the money i'd go for them


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *joe it* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> *Great review* and gread IEM.
> 
> ...


 

 It is lighter than GR07, that's for sure, but responds extremely well to equalization. However the "punch" requires perfect fit and that's not for everyone.
  Especially beware if you have tiny and/or highly curved (esp. downwards) ear canals.
  Also, calling GR07 bass light is doing it a huge disservice. It has only 3dB less bass than Brainwavz M2, which is a bass monster (though more of mid-bass kind). However the presentation of it is... slightly hollow, light and not as textured as some, not kicky/punchy, which masks the amount.
  In comparison, a well fitted RE272 is far more punchy and controlled, but lacks in magnitude - easily fixed by an equalizer, esp. bass boost of the Digizoid Zo (which I don't have).


----------



## jjmai

psygeist said:


> Impressive indeed
> 
> 
> [SIZE=9pt]Memory wire that conforms to the ear for a locked-in fit[/SIZE]
> ...




I really hope the S6's modular cable system refers to detachable cables at the IEM's end, but I believe that simply refers to the cable extension...


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> It is lighter than GR07, that's for sure, but responds extremely well to equalization. However the "punch" requires perfect fit and that's not for everyone.
> Especially beware if you have tiny and/or highly curved (esp. downwards) ear canals.
> Also, calling GR07 bass light is doing it a huge disservice. It has only 3dB less bass than Brainwavz M2, which is a bass monster (though more of mid-bass kind). However the presentation of it is... slightly hollow, light and not as textured as some, not kicky/punchy, which masks the amount.
> In comparison, a well fitted RE272 is far more punchy and controlled, but lacks in magnitude - easily fixed by an equalizer, esp. bass boost of the Digizoid Zo (which I don't have).


 


   
  I was spoken of JVC HA-FXT90. With the JVC i found a good fit after 2-3 days. I agree that it is very important. 
   
   I have not spoken of the GR7 because I have not heard it. I am sure that the GR7 sounds very good but I don't like aesthetically and  can only wear ' over-the-ear '.
   
   I was talking solely for my direct experience.
   
   Regarding the 272, do not take into account (at moment) as universal an IEM, that  to be complete, require  an amp-equalizer.


----------



## orta

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It was quite noisy on the show floor and I only had a couple of minutes so I'd rather not put a number on it. I did think that I would like to compare it to the Fischer SBA-03 and Ety HF5, which are two of the best <$150 single armatures I've come across.


 


   
  Do you have any preliminary thoughts, opinions, or comments on the UE600 joker?  Been thinking about picking those up for a while now.


----------



## soullinker20

hi ljokerl !
   
   
  what do you think will be the best BA for me suppose that i already have a ex1000 as my DDs and love it.. i am looking at the W4s, but don't you think it's just another neutral iem with the ex1000s at hand?
   
  what about the shure 535 special edition? they said it has improvements over its predecessor and I don't know if it still lags behind in details as what you've said on your 535 review..
   
  i really like instrument separation and that 3d thing around the head like on my ex1000s..
   
   
  thank you


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> I really hope the S6's modular cable system refers to detachable cables at the IEM's end, but I believe that simply refers to the cable extension...


 

 It's only the cable extension like this:


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nightgost said:


> joker,
> Thank you, it cleared and narrowed my options=) I was already pointing to the ctm 300 pro but i cant find no one talking about them here in head fi, and by the info on the website i cant tell if there is a driver for bass, other for mid ands other for treble  as im looking for, OR 2 bass, 1mids/treble.


 

 IIRC the 300 pro is a 3-way system but you may want to send them an email to double-check.
   


  uote: 





jjmai said:


> I really hope the S6's modular cable system refers to detachable cables at the IEM's end, but I believe that simply refers to the cable extension...


 
   
  There are photos up on the meelec site. Looks like it's just a 2-piece cable a-la JAYS or old Shures.
   


  Quote: 





orta said:


> Do you have any preliminary thoughts, opinions, or comments on the UE600 joker?  Been thinking about picking those up for a while now.


 


  Mine is an SF5V2 - presumably the same. I like it much better than the SF3 and SF4 - things that stand out are the rather well-layered stage and the mid-centric balance. The mids are very good, actually. Everything else is just decent.


  Quote: 





soullinker20 said:


> hi ljokerl !
> 
> 
> what do you think will be the best BA for me suppose that i already have a ex1000 as my DDs and love it.. i am looking at the W4s, but don't you think it's just another neutral iem with the ex1000s at hand?
> ...


 


  I am not aware of a BA-based universal with a headstage as big as that of the EX1000. The W4 is more tame (or dull, if you will) than the EX1000. It's a less fatiguing, more even-footed sort of sound - definitely not as bright and also not quite as punchy as the EX1000. I've never heard the special edition of the SE535 but would think the W4 is still a safer choice coming from an EX1000.


----------



## kanuka

@joker
   
   when you mention you use the trimmed-meelec with crystal, which ones do you use (for which meeled model)?
   
  tnkx


----------



## soullinker20

@ ljokerl
   
   
  i am skeptical about the W4s that it may bore me.. my ex1000s will be my main go-to iem.. i am just looking for a different sound on the BA realm.. i thought about the ck100, SM3, 535 but then i always end up thinking about the um3x because of its superb instrument separation and that all around the place headstage..
   
  would you agree that the um3x will be fine for me as my back up for my ex1000s? i thought the W4 would do the same thing as my ex1000s does but just lesser highs and lows so i thought i just killed it for me haha..
   
  i only listen to my music very simple
  ipod classic 2009>ex1000
  i'm not fond of amping and other stuffs ..
   
   
  thank you


----------



## tao1

Hi All,
   
  very new to all this. I posted on the portable amp forum and they directed me over here. I was looking to improve the sound out of my Shure se215's but was told I would be better off, getting better IEM's than going to an amp, at least with what I've got.
   
  for the most part I listen to jazz, funk, blues, rock, but also some electronica, punk, ska. To give you an idea , when previewing stereo gear my go-to cd's / albums are Stanley Turrentine - "Cherry" (Japanese version) Stanely Turrentine " Don't Mess with Mr. T" and Papa Mali' "Do Your Thing".
   
  Listening to various genre's I tend to like accuracy - if it's bassy I want to hear that, but if it's a more mellow track I want to hear that too.
  but not too much of it - I had Klipsch S4's and found them too bright, too much high end not enough of everything else. Then I had some Thinksound TS02 which I liked better , but not the fit; I could never get them to seat right and they tended to pop out of my ears when the cable got the slightest tug. While the bass was better it was a little muddled and separation wasn't great. The Shure's I find to be pretty good, but still the bass doesn't have the clarity that I like. What I did like about the Shures, is the way they fit, a pain to get in right but once there every comfortable.
   
  I was recommend the GR07 and the TF10 over at the portable amp forum as the seeming most go-to IEM's on these forums.  My budget is in the $200 range, but I would go as high as $300 if it really made a difference. Can you recommend any other IEM's I should be looking at? any and all help is appreciated. thanks


----------



## imackler

ljokerl,
   
  Really intrigued by the CTM-200. I got a good deal on the W4R (let's assume sonically the same as the W4) but am thinking about entry level customs. You gave the CTM-200 a 9.6 and the W4 a 9.4, both very high scores. What does each possess sonically that is stronger than the other? What led you to give a slight sonic edge to the CTM-200?
   
  Thanks for your time, as always!


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





tao1 said:


> Hi All,
> 
> very new to all this. I posted on the portable amp forum and they directed me over here. I was looking to improve the sound out of my Shure se215's but was told I would be better off, getting better IEM's than going to an amp, at least with what I've got.
> 
> ...


 
  Hey Tao, 
   I agree, I don;t think that a portable amp will do it for you. I listen to alot of the same as you, and find the GR-07 do these fine. One question however is, how do you find the highs on your Shure 215


----------



## Niyologist

Has anyone ever heard or listened to this IEM?
   
 TEAC inCore ZE-1000 Hi-Definition In-Ear Stereophones   
  http://www.amazon.com/TEAC-inCore-ZE-1000-Hi-Definition-Stereophones/dp/B00162XSZK/ref=pd_sim_e_100


----------



## jiff

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Has anyone ever heard or listened to this IEM?
> 
> TEAC inCore ZE-1000 Hi-Definition In-Ear Stereophones
> http://www.amazon.com/TEAC-inCore-ZE-1000-Hi-Definition-Stereophones/dp/B00162XSZK/ref=pd_sim_e_100


 

 I've been wanting to know about them myself because I can't find any reviews on them anywhere.  Its a dual BA so I wouldn't think it would be all that bad but with no reviews it makes me wonder.


----------



## jhoff80

Not sure if it's mentioned earlier in the thread, but for what it's worth, I just bought the Meelec M6P as a backup and the standard accessories are slightly different on mine. You mention only "single-flange (3 sizes) and small silicone tri-flange tips"... so I'm sure that they just changed what they include since 2009 when you reviewed them.

Mine came with a pair of large tri-flange, a pair of small tri-flange, a pretty wide pair of biflanges, and then three sizes of single flanges. (And to my mind they all suck, glad I ordered a set of Comply foam ones to go with it).

Thanks for the detailed reviews though. I decided on getting this pair as a backup based on your review, and while it's a little bass-heavy for my liking, I couldn't be more happy with it as a cheap backup set.


----------



## choC.

Just thought I'd add to the Atrio M5 (MG7) review - it seems Joker may have used the wrong tips in his original review.

 He lists the "Shure Olives" as the recommended tips but I have to argue strongly against this - they utterly ruin the sound stage by bloating the bass and destroying the speed and clarity of the highs.
   
  Would be very interested to see his opinion revised using the stock foam sleeves provided with the Atrios as they sound much better to my ears.


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good to see you around! Lucky I'm still fixated on portable audio or this would get even more expensive.


 

 Your saying of portable being the lesser of two evils is correct. However the components stay there for much longer. I've had my dac and amp on my desk for a long time and they are not going anywhere soon. Headphones for the most part have been more stable than when I was big in portable where I would buy and sell every other week. 
   
  However it definitely is very expensive if you want to get a good full sized. I used to think twice about something costing 300+ and just the other day I bought something costing that and didn't blink twice.
   
   
  I'm glad this thread is still kicking and alive. I'm sure it continues to help a lot of people. However one advantage of full sized esp the more popular ones is that they are more likely to show up in meets where you can get an idea for yourself.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> @joker
> 
> when you mention you use the trimmed-meelec with crystal, which ones do you use (for which meeled model)?
> 
> tnkx


 

 M6 large triple-flange, top flange (the smallest one) cut off. Turns them into very soft bi-flanges with a medium-size bore. I like them on quite a few earphones.
   


  Quote: 





soullinker20 said:


> @ ljokerl
> 
> 
> i am skeptical about the W4s that it may bore me.. my ex1000s will be my main go-to iem.. i am just looking for a different sound on the BA realm.. i thought about the ck100, SM3, 535 but then i always end up thinking about the um3x because of its superb instrument separation and that all around the place headstage..
> ...


 

 The UM3X does have excellent separation but it is not at all out-of-the-head as the EX1000/IE8/FX700 and many other dynamic-earphones can be. Even the W4 and SE535 provide a larger headstage. It's a bit difficult to explain but if you get the chance to audition it next to the EX1000 it'll make sense. 
   


  Quote: 





tao1 said:


> Hi All,
> 
> very new to all this. I posted on the portable amp forum and they directed me over here. I was looking to improve the sound out of my Shure se215's but was told I would be better off, getting better IEM's than going to an amp, at least with what I've got.
> 
> ...


 

 I don't think the GR07 or TF10 will give you the bass you want - not compared to TS02s or S4s or even SE215s in some ways. You might like the Atrio MG7. It's got pretty clean bass and most if it is deep bass, with no mid-bass bloat. Also the Radius DDM or maybe JVC HA-FX500.
   


  Quote: 





imackler said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> Really intrigued by the CTM-200. I got a good deal on the W4R (let's assume sonically the same as the W4) but am thinking about entry level customs. You gave the CTM-200 a 9.6 and the W4 a 9.4, both very high scores. What does each possess sonically that is stronger than the other? What led you to give a slight sonic edge to the CTM-200?
> 
> Thanks for your time, as always!


 

 Mostly space - the CTM200 has a large, out-of-the-head headstage while the W4 is only above average, though still very good. I also think the W4 isn't quite as flat as the CTM-200 - it seems a touch more mid-centric in comparison while the CTM-200 is maybe just a hair v-shaped. The W4 does have slightly better note thickness. Neither has fantastic dynamics IMO.
   


  Quote: 





jhoff80 said:


> Not sure if it's mentioned earlier in the thread, but for what it's worth, I just bought the Meelec M6P as a backup and the standard accessories are slightly different on mine. You mention only "single-flange (3 sizes) and small silicone tri-flange tips"... so I'm sure that they just changed what they include since 2009 when you reviewed them.
> Mine came with a pair of large tri-flange, a pair of small tri-flange, a pretty wide pair of biflanges, and then three sizes of single flanges. (And to my mind they all suck, glad I ordered a set of Comply foam ones to go with it).
> Thanks for the detailed reviews though. I decided on getting this pair as a backup based on your review, and while it's a little bass-heavy for my liking, I couldn't be more happy with it as a cheap backup set.


 

 I've changed the accessory listings for the MEElec stuff a few times since 2009 but they keep changing. I'll update the M6 accessories again - thanks. The only tips I really like are the triples with the top flange trimmed off. The single-flanges are okay but don't work well on any other earphones and even on the M6 Sony Hybrids are better. The bi-flanges are weird in shape and rigidity.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Koss KEB70 and Sunrise Aodia i100
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(3B31) Koss KEB70*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jan 2012
> ...


----------



## garcsa

Hello everybody,
   
  Just take a look please:
   
 Fake Brainwavz Betas from MP4nation (?!) Thanks!


----------



## tao1

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> Hey Tao,
> I agree, I don;t think that a portable amp will do it for you. I listen to alot of the same as you, and find the GR-07 do these fine. One question however is, how do you find the highs on your Shure 215


 
  In general the Shure se215's are pretty good, but they do have issues; I've find the bass to be to muddled, the mid's lost and the high end distorts. It's fairly decent for rock, but whenever I pay jazz or any piece with a lot of treble in it I get distortion, might be my source, but I don't hear it on either my home stereo speakers (snell J-III's) or on my computer (swan M200MKII's).
   
  It's why I have been looking for more accurate IEM's. Don't want to go too accurate though then it's as if the music has lost all feeling, looking for that perfect compromise. hah. I guess I am looking for the best of all worlds. When I talk about bass though I want the clarity of a stand-up bass not the thump, thump of a synth


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> M6 large triple-flange, top flange (the smallest one) cut off. Turns them into very soft bi-flanges with a medium-size bore. I like them on quite a few earphones.


 


  ljokerl, do you think the trimmed Meelec triple flange would be good on the FTX90?  I'm currently using the small triple flange (not trimmed) and it seems to work well, isolates a good amount and sound doesn't seem different than the stock tips.  Also, you mentioned biflanges as a preferred tip for the FXT90 - could you be more specific?  I see you didn't mean the Meelec biflanges, which is good because they're much too big for my ears.  Thanks!


----------



## Kaffeemann

Hey joker, this is truly a great piece of work. Thanks a lot.
   
   However, I wonder why you dont´t do reviews of high end IEM first , like sony EX600, Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10..., because most members here probably don´t care about 30$ IEMs.


----------



## i2ehan

Quote:


kaffeemann said:


> Hey joker, this truly a great piece of work. Thanks a lot.
> 
> However, I wonder why you dont´t do reviews of high end IEM first , like sony EX600, Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10..., because most members here probably *I* don´t care about 30$ IEMs.


 

 Fixed that for you.
   
  There are plenty here on Head-Fi who are interested in good budget IEM's. |joker| is only doing right by everyone, and not just _most members_.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> Hello everybody,
> 
> Just take a look please:
> 
> Fake Brainwavz Betas from MP4nation (?!) Thanks!


 


  Doubt they are fake. It is probably a build revision (one that looks pretty good, actually) that has not been officially announced. As for the sound, I doubt the CS staff you got through to knows anything about it. You'd have to find someone to do an A:B between the new and old ones.


  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> ljokerl, do you think the trimmed Meelec triple flange would be good on the FTX90?  I'm currently using the small triple flange (not trimmed) and it seems to work well, isolates a good amount and sound doesn't seem different than the stock tips.  Also, you mentioned biflanges as a preferred tip for the FXT90 - could you be more specific?  I see you didn't mean the Meelec biflanges, which is good because they're much too big for my ears.  Thanks!


 

 I didn't really like the way deep-seal tips sounded with the FXT90. The bi-flange I was using are the 'short' type. I think mine are Sennheiser-branded but you can also get them from MEElec in the M11+ tip set.
   


  Quote: 





kaffeemann said:


> Hey joker, this truly a great piece of work. Thanks a lot.
> 
> However, I wonder why you dont´t do reviews of high end IEM first , like sony EX600, Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10..., because most members here probably don´t care about 30$ IEMs.


 


  This thread was started with the goal of finding the best earphones in each price range - budget IEMs have always been a big part of it. Most of the high-end stuff gets reviewed to death anyway (the TF10 has a 400-page appreciation thread, for example) but some of the other gear has a total review count of none. 
   
  Anyway, the KEB70 was a loan so I had to get it done and the i100 was interesting so I wanted to get it done. The EX600 review is finished as well and should be posted soon.


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I didn't really like the way deep-seal tips sounded with the FXT90. The bi-flange I was using are the 'short' type. I think mine are Sennheiser-branded but you can also get them from MEElec in the M11+ tip set.


 
   
  You mean this set, correct? http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_M11_Earphones_p/tipset10-m11-bk-mee.htm
   
  Would a trimmed large triple-flange be similar to the short bi-flange, or would it sit a lot deeper?  How much isolation would I be giving up moving from the small triple-flange to a short bi-flange?  I'm using these on the subway every day so every bit of isolation helps.
   
  Are there any IEMs that sound similar to the FXT90 that would give me noticeably better isolation?  As a reference, I wasn't thrilled with the sound of the HF5 - I much prefer the more exciting sounding FXT90s.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## garcsa

Thanks. New pics here.
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Doubt they are fake. It is probably a build revision (one that looks pretty good, actually) that has not been officially announced. As for the sound, I doubt the CS staff you got through to knows anything about it. You'd have to find someone to do an A:B between the new and old ones.
> 
> I didn't really like the way deep-seal tips sounded with the FXT90. The bi-flange I was using are the 'short' type. I think mine are Sennheiser-branded but you can also get them from MEElec in the M11+ tip set.
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nyonya said:


> You mean this set, correct? http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_M11_Earphones_p/tipset10-m11-bk-mee.htm
> 
> Would a trimmed large triple-flange be similar to the short bi-flange, or would it sit a lot deeper?  How much isolation would I be giving up moving from the small triple-flange to a short bi-flange?  I'm using these on the subway every day so every bit of isolation helps.
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, that's the one. Triple-flanges sit deeper, even when trimmed. Isolation depends on seal, the answer is typically 'some'. If you're happy with the triple-flange tips I would just keep using them.
   
  There are 'fun' IEMs with good isolation - just not necessarily ones that sound similar to the FXT90s. MG7 Atrios come to mind, as do the Monster Turbine Pros and Westone 3s.


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, that's the one. Triple-flanges sit deeper, even when trimmed. Isolation depends on seal, the answer is typically 'some'. If you're happy with the triple-flange tips I would just keep using them.
> 
> There are 'fun' IEMs with good isolation - just not necessarily ones that sound similar to the FXT90s. MG7 Atrios come to mind, as do the Monster Turbine Pros and Westone 3s.


 

  
  Reading over your descriptions of the earphones you mentioned, I think I'd prefer the FXT90 sound so I think I'll stick with them.  They actually seemed to have a bit too much bass for me at first (coming from the HF5) but I always loved the mids and especially the highs, and now I've gotten used to them and they sound very balanced to my ears.  I might try trimming the large triple-flanges especially since they're too big to use in my ears as is.
   
  Thanks for the advice, and the amazing thread!
   
  If anyone has any other suggestions for earphones that isolate better than the FXT90s and have a forward sound, non-recessed mids and sparkly highs, I'd love to hear them.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Reading over your descriptions of the earphones you mentioned, I think I'd prefer the FXT90 sound so I think I'll stick with them.  They actually seemed to have a bit too much bass for me at first (coming from the HF5) but I always loved the mids and especially the highs, and now I've gotten used to them and they sound very balanced to my ears.  I might try trimming the large triple-flanges especially since they're too big to use in my ears as is.
> 
> Thanks for the advice, and the amazing thread!
> 
> If anyone has any other suggestions for earphones that isolate better than the FXT90s and have a forward sound, non-recessed mids and sparkly highs, I'd love to hear them.


 

 MTPG/Coppers and the Miles Davis Tributes perhaps?


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





joe it said:


> Regarding the 272, do not take into account (at moment) as universal an IEM, that  to be complete, require  an amp-equalizer.


 
  It doesn't per se require it. It will just be pretty "light" and somewhat mid-forward then. Think Etymoics ER-4S but with some bass and quite a bit more kick. (and yes, detailing is on par)


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kaffeemann said:


> Hey joker, this truly a great piece of work. Thanks a lot.
> 
> However, I wonder why you dont´t do reviews of high end IEM first , like sony EX600, Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10..., because most members here probably don´t care about 30$ IEMs.


 

 Those are high end?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  You'll learn soon enough.  Welcome to Head-fi.


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> MTPG/Coppers and the Miles Davis Tributes perhaps?


 


  Thanks for the suggestions, but I don't think I want something with more bass quantity than the FXT90.


----------



## LCMusicLover

Just received SoundMagic E30s. I selected them based on lots of research, but primarily after perusing joker's reviews. Thanks so much for this tremendous resource.
   
  I'm happy to say that I got exactly what I expected based on your review, including the need to get some foam tips 
   
  Again, thank you very much.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lcmusiclover said:


> Just received SoundMagic E30s. I selected them based on lots of research, but primarily after perusing joker's reviews. Thanks so much for this tremendous resource.
> 
> I'm happy to say that I got exactly what I expected based on your review, including the need to get some foam tips
> 
> Again, thank you very much.


 


  Good choice, enjoy!


----------



## hairygrape

brilliant post joker, thanks for pointing me in the right direction!


----------



## Mini0510

joker, I don't remember if you already answered this.
  does the EX1000 has more treble presence than FX700? and does the bass extend deeper than FX700?
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hairygrape said:


> brilliant post joker, thanks for pointing me in the right direction!


 


  Thanks!


  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, I don't remember if you already answered this.
> does the EX1000 has more treble presence than FX700? and does the bass extend deeper than FX700?
> 
> Thanks


 


  It was answered one of the several other times you asked.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Hey joker, can we report small bugs you have on your review? not important but kozee 100 are listed twice in the colorful listing.. Not that anyone would bother buying them after the great appreciation you showed for them.. xD


----------



## ljokerl

Sure, should be okay now. The way I do the table is archaic and inefficient...
  
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Hey joker, can we report small bugs you have on your review? not important but kozee 100 are listed twice in the colorful listing.. Not that anyone would bother buying them after the great appreciation you showed for them.. xD


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks!
> 
> 
> It was answered one of the several other times you asked.


 


  LOL Maybe if we keep asking, we will get the opino
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





n we want to hear


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> LOL Maybe if we keep asking, we will get the opino
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Ya... I accept facts and face the reality. Don't know what you are thinking. I actually searched this thread and I don't think my question 
"does the bass of EX1000 extend deeper than FX700?"ever answered.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Ya... I accept facts and face the reality. Don't know what you are thinking. I actually searched this thread and I don't think my question
> "does the bass of EX1000 extend deeper than FX700?"ever answered.


 


  Well, that one was answered in the second paragraph of the EX1000 review so I didn't think it needed restating
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> while the depth is not as immense as with the Monster MD or JVC FX700, the EX1000 is not severely rolled-off, either


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, that one was answered in the second paragraph of the EX1000 review so I didn't think it needed restating


 

 ok thanks


----------



## DannyBai

My 500th post goes to Joker to let you know that you are awesome.  I started out on Head-Fi buying earphones from this thread and now have moved on to gear from other threads.  I have learned a lot from your reviews and can't thank you enough.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> My 500th post goes to Joker to let you know that you are awesome.  I started out on Head-Fi buying earphones from this thread and now have moved on to gear from other threads.  I have learned a lot from your reviews and can't thank you enough.


 

 me too. It was joker's review that got me into head-fi. Many thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> My 500th post goes to Joker to let you know that you are awesome.  I started out on Head-Fi buying earphones from this thread and now have moved on to gear from other threads.  I have learned a lot from your reviews and can't thank you enough.


 

 That's awesome, glad the thread has been useful!
   


  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> me too. It was joker's review that got me into head-fi. Many thanks!


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


>


 

 joker, when listening to your miracles on ipod 5G nano, how much difference is there with amp and without?
  and what is the difference? thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, when listening to your miracles on ipod 5G nano, how much difference is there with amp and without?
> and what is the difference? thanks


 


  I don't have an iPod Nano and have never heard one.


----------



## Niyologist

Can anyone verify if these are real?
   
  http://www.d201.com/sennheiser-ie8-style-high-fidelity-noise-isolating-ear-canal-headphones.html
   
  http://www.sskmonster.com/product/sennheiser-ie8-iphone-ip8828
   
  I would really like to purchase the Sennheiser IE8 or at least the FX500/FXT90.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I don't have an iPod Nano and have never heard one.


 

 These are on your profile source section: iPod 5G/5.5G/4G Nano.
  do you still have any of them to test with Miracle?


----------



## Angelopsaro

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Can anyone verify if these are real?
> 
> http://www.d201.com/sennheiser-ie8-style-high-fidelity-noise-isolating-ear-canal-headphones.html
> 
> ...


 


   
  Quote: 





> Buy cheap Monster HD Headphones with our store, enjoy ghd 30%-70% Off. Monster Headphones have been leading the top Headphones and very hot around the world. onster Headphones is most popular of hair straighteners for them. Monster is the well-known brand which represents the outstanding transformation of Headphones in 21st century. We usually ship out order within 24 - 72 hours if the product you order is in stock, if they are placed from our website.


 
   
   
  By this statement you can figure out they are fake.


----------



## olear

IjokerI, do you think the Sanso Clip + is a worthy component for IEMs such as TF10, IE80, FXT90? Or would you recommend stepping to another device?
   
  Also, do you think there is a discernable SQ difference between FLAC and MP3 (320 kbps)?
   
  And thank you for sharing all the information that you do.


----------



## Will2

Withdraw post ..... sorry ..... I think I've found where I can answer my question without having to bother you all.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, do you think the Sanso Clip + is a worthy component for IEMs such as TF10, IE80, FXT90? Or would you recommend stepping to another device?
> 
> Also, do you think there is a discernable SQ difference between FLAC and MP3 (320 kbps)?
> 
> And thank you for sharing all the information that you do.


 

 I can't really hear the difference between mp3 kbps and flac with universal IEMs. Im not sure about customs.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> These are on your profile source section: iPod 5G/5.5G/4G Nano.
> do you still have any of them to test with Miracle?


 


  Well, they are listed under 'Gone' so no...
   
  I had the 4G Nano for like a week because someone said it was better than a Clip+. I didn't think it was so I returned it. The 5G/5.5G were regular iPods.


  Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, do you think the Sanso Clip + is a worthy component for IEMs such as TF10, IE80, FXT90? Or would you recommend stepping to another device?
> 
> Also, do you think there is a discernable SQ difference between FLAC and MP3 (320 kbps)?
> 
> And thank you for sharing all the information that you do.


 

 I cannot tell FLAC from 320k on the go with my portable player, never could. I don't think I ever tried to A:B specifically with the Miracle, but 320 really sounds very very good to me, even with my most familiar tracks. With my home setup I'm quite sure I can but I've never subjected myself to a blind test. Figure there's no point - I  keep two copies of my library when possible anyway - flac for home listening/testing/reviewing and a 320k duplicate for portable use. It's very easy to rip everything new twice instead of once and storage is cheap these days.
   
  The clip+ is a very good player. I think the J3 is a small step up from the Sansa players and there's a lot of utility in the BBE EQ if you need it. The only other player I've tried that I thought was an upgrade from the clip was my S:Flo2. I didn't like the signature of the HM801 even though it's a great player.


----------



## dogears

Me either, always failed with ABX. So stuck with 320kbps for portable/mobile.


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, have the JVC FXT90 as strong treble as the JVC FX700? I am wanting to buy it, but i have fear of it be as fatiguing as the FX700.


----------



## olear

Thank you IjokerI


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, have the JVC FXT90 as strong treble as the JVC FX700? I am wanting to buy it, but i have fear of it be as fatiguing as the FX700.


 

 Well, the FXT90 is not exactly treble-recessed but it probably won't quite be as fatiguing as the FX700 (and definitely not as fatiguing as the FX500). I only found the FX700 be become mildly fatiguing at higher volumes so maybe the higher isolation of the FXT90 will eliminate the need for that.


----------



## estreeter

Joker, I 100% understand that you cant spend time with every ~$400 universal to come down the pike, but for all the fanfare around earphones like the W4 and SM3, I see very little on Head-Fi about *Grado's GR10*. I suspect that its a combination of the price and the fact that a single-driver, lime green (!) earphone just isn't what the kids are looking for at that price point. The reviews that I have read are positive, but the local distributor here in Oz is something of a rogue - he had previously told me he had a certain model in stock and I've waited months for delivery.


----------



## manfrog

Thanks for this post...referred to it many time when deciding


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Joker, I 100% understand that you cant spend time with every ~$400 universal to come down the pike, but for all the fanfare around earphones like the W4 and SM3, I see very little on Head-Fi about *Grado's GR10*. I suspect that its a combination of the price and the fact that a single-driver, lime green (!) earphone just isn't what the kids are looking for at that price point. The reviews that I have read are positive, but the local distributor here in Oz is something of a rogue - he had previously told me he had a certain model in stock and I've waited months for delivery.


 

  
  I very much enjoyed the GR10 when I had them as a loaner from another head-fi member. The problem may be price in that Grado usually are very strict on their price so it doesn't deviate from MSRP very often and that the e-Q5 offered very similar sound at a much lower cost. However if I was given the choice I'd pick the GR10 as they were just so comfortable and sounded pretty damn good. It is a shame that it isn't talked about more but it is a good earphone.


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I very much enjoyed the GR10 when I had them as a loaner from another head-fi member. The problem may be price in that Grado usually are very strict on their price so it doesn't deviate from MSRP very often and that the e-Q5 offered very similar sound at a much lower cost. However if I was given the choice I'd pick the GR10 as they were just so comfortable and sounded pretty damn good. It is a shame that it isn't talked about more but it is a good earphone.


 

 Thanks rawstr - appreciate the feedback. Grado cops a lot of flak on HF for making headphones that look 'cheap', and it may be that people who buy a $400 IEM simply expect more bling : perhaps purple shells with 'G-R-A-D-O' pulsating in flashing orange neon in time with your doof-doof tunes .... 
   
  (Attention Skullcandy - you saw it here first - please forward my royalties)


----------



## ljokerl

Added Fischer Audio FA-977 Jazz and Paradigm v.3. Also updated the planned review list.
   
  Quote: 





> *(3A63) Fischer Audio FA-977 Jazz*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Jan 2012
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Joker, I 100% understand that you cant spend time with every ~$400 universal to come down the pike, but for all the fanfare around earphones like the W4 and SM3, I see very little on Head-Fi about *Grado's GR10*. I suspect that its a combination of the price and the fact that a single-driver, lime green (!) earphone just isn't what the kids are looking for at that price point. The reviews that I have read are positive, but the local distributor here in Oz is something of a rogue - he had previously told me he had a certain model in stock and I've waited months for delivery.


 

 It's a bit of a cycle - more popular IEMs usually make their way to me but rarer ones are less likely to land on my desk as a loan. Single moving armatures can definitely produce great sound - the Ortofon sets certainly do - and I have nothing against the Grados' design. Just haven't come across one yet.
   


  Quote: 





manfrog said:


> Thanks for this post...referred to it many time when deciding


 

 Welcome, glad it was helpful


----------



## sid12345678910

IEM god


----------



## FlySweep

I feel the e-Q5 is a phone that doesn't get nearly the attention (or recommendations) it deserves..
   
  Despite selling it recently, I've long been (and still am) a fan of the GR07.  Since getting the e-Q5, I really haven't looked back as far as mid-fi goes.  Like the GR07, the e-Q5 presents a sound in a neutral, slightly smooth fashion.. but the Ortofon has better dynamics, speed, and a wider soundstage.  I'd put clarity, instrument separation, and transparency on par, if not better than the GR07 too.  The e-Q5 also has better control through the midrange & up through the treble, IMO.  Where the GR07 pulls ahead (by a hair, mind you) is natural tonality & microdetail.
   
  Listening to the e-Q5, one would think they're listening to a dynamic driver when considering the impressive decay and texturing the e-Q5 boasts (for a MA driver).  It truly represents the best of both the BA & DD worlds making it quite versatile for me.  Bass has an very nice punch and extends deep enough for my tastes (lots of hip hop, electronica, downtempo, etc.).
   
  Availability be damned, they're very capable phones that boast a sound to match it's top notch build quality & smooth, refined look.  I recently snagged them from Amazon.jp (using the Tenso.com shipping service) for ~$200 shipped.. an _excellent_ value & one that rivals the GR07's wallet friendliness too.


----------



## tao1

IjokerI thanks for the thread - I ended up with UM3X's of all things like their accuracy a lot. wish they had a bit more bass ,but not much


----------



## Gryphus0204

What do you recommend for a sports earpiece? Anything under $50 would be great


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> What do you recommend for a sports earpiece? Anything under $50 would be great


 

 MEE M6


----------



## re-animator

i just want to say i love reading this thread.  its a great resource.


----------



## alterndog

Hey,
   
  I figured I'd put my thanks in considering this thread and the portable headphone thread has guided me through some amazing buys. I was wondering Joker, if you were thinking about reviewing the brainwavz m4. I got them on sale on a whim because they were half off on amazon a few weeks ago, but realized that they were one of the few if any brainwavz you hadn't reviewed and was curious if there was a reason? If you have a chance I'd definitely suggest taking a listen to them, I personally think they are very good for their price range.


----------



## alterndog

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> What do you recommend for a sports earpiece? Anything under $50 would be great


 


   


  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> MEE M6


 



 The M6 are a great if not the best bang for buck headphones that are good for the gym. I will say though I hated the memory wire, which put me off them in the end. I would suggest looking at the new version of the m6 the sports-fi S6 could have a little better memory wire (don't quote me on it) also here is a website that might be useful to use:
   
  http://www.workoutheadphones.org/category/earbuds-2/


----------



## dogears

Just to share that I recently discovered that the K2 is a pair highly resolving IEMs. They have shown me how good an MP3 player is the Tascam DR2d. It has plenty of drive and sounds way better than my Nokia N82 and SansaFuzeRB3.10.
  Tascam DR2d>>>N82>Fuze.
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> A solid audio chain or at the very least a decent dedicated audio player or external DAC will make the j-phonics shine.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Availability be damned, they're very capable phones that boast a sound to match it's top notch build quality & smooth, refined look.  I recently snagged them from Amazon.jp (using the Tenso.com shipping service) for ~$200 shipped.. an _excellent_ value & one that rivals the GR07's wallet friendliness too.


 

 I'm a fan of the e-Q5 but it does come down to availability. If they were consistently available worldwide for ~$200 shipped (with after-sale support) they would be much more popular.. 
   


  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> What do you recommend for a sports earpiece? Anything under $50 would be great


 

 I would go for the M6 as well, especially at current <$20 prices. Easy to replace if something happens to it. Failing that, maybe the Soundmagic E30 though I am less confident in it surviving sweat. It does sound better than the M6 but in a gym setting I am not sure the difference will be as appreciable as with home listening. 
   


  Quote: 





re-animator said:


> i just want to say i love reading this thread.  its a great resource.


 

 Thanks, glad to hear it!
   


  Quote: 





alterndog said:


> Hey,
> 
> I figured I'd put my thanks in considering this thread and the portable headphone thread has guided me through some amazing buys. I was wondering Joker, if you were thinking about reviewing the brainwavz m4. I got them on sale on a whim because they were half off on amazon a few weeks ago, but realized that they were one of the few if any brainwavz you hadn't reviewed and was curious if there was a reason? If you have a chance I'd definitely suggest taking a listen to them, I personally think they are very good for their price range.


 

 Thanks.
   
  The M4 is the most recent release of the Brainwavz IEMs. Brainwavz stuff is generally great value for money and I did want an M4 at one point but there's too much on my plate to go chasing more IEMs at this time.
   


  Quote: 





alterndog said:


> The M6 are a great if not the best bang for buck headphones that are good for the gym. I will say though I hated the memory wire, which put me off them in the end. I would suggest looking at the new version of the m6 the sports-fi S6 could have a little better memory wire (don't quote me on it) also here is a website that might be useful to use:
> http://www.workoutheadphones.org/category/earbuds-2/


 

 I removed the memory wire on my 1st-gen M6 (they used to have stiff copper wire) fairly easily. The current steel memory wire is pretty similar to custom IEMs and not a bother at all for me.
   


  Quote: 





dogears said:


> Just to share that I recently discovered that the K2 is a pair highly resolving IEMs. They have shown me how good an MP3 player is the Tascam DR2d. It has plenty of drive and sounds way better than my Nokia N82 and SansaFuzeRB3.10.
> Tascam DR2d>>>N82>Fuze.


 
   
  Agreed, they scale very well. Only trying them with a low-end portable would probably result in a mildly disappointing experience. They would seem to be "on the edge" of being very good but not quite there.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> I feel the e-Q5 is a phone that doesn't get nearly the attention (or recommendations) it deserves..
> 
> Despite selling it recently, I've long been (and still am) a fan of the GR07.  Since getting the e-Q5, I really haven't looked back as far as mid-fi goes.  Like the GR07, the e-Q5 presents a sound in a neutral, slightly smooth fashion.. but the Ortofon has better dynamics, speed, and a wider soundstage.  I'd put clarity, instrument separation, and transparency on par, if not better than the GR07 too.  The e-Q5 also has better control through the midrange & up through the treble, IMO.  Where the GR07 pulls ahead (by a hair, mind you) is natural tonality & microdetail.
> 
> ...


 
  I've been looking into the Ortofon IEM's. The e-Q5 sounds interesting but I've been more drawn to the e-Q7. Have you listened to the e-Q7 and if so in your opinion is the e-Q7 worth the upgrade? Considering the price difference is small between the two models I'm stuck on which model would be the smarter investment for me.


----------



## Niyologist

Why is the Sennheiser IE8 still $399.99? I really want to purchase it, but it's too expensive. Are the copies from ioffer.com at least 90% identical?


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'm a fan of the e-Q5 but it does come down to availability. If they were consistently available worldwide for ~$200 shipped (with after-sale support) they would be much more popular..


 
   
  I haven't listen to these much. Does it boast of a wider soundstage compared to VSonic GR07 ?


----------



## FlySweep

digitalfreak said:


> I've been looking into the Ortofon IEM's. The e-Q5 sounds interesting but I've been more drawn to the e-Q7. Have you listened to the e-Q7 and if so in your opinion is the e-Q7 worth the upgrade? Considering the price difference is small between the two models I'm stuck on which model would be the smarter investment for me.


 

 I haven't heard the e-Q7 but based on what I've read, both phones share a large degree of the sound as a foundation.. but where the e-Q5 is a little brighter.. the e-Q7 is warmer.  I'm pretty sure joker reviewed both.. there's another great shootout thread that compares the Ortofons, the Final Audio phones, etc. in extensive detail.
   


psygeist said:


> I haven't listen to these much. Does it boast of a wider soundstage compared to VSonic GR07 ?


 

 In my opinion, the e-Q5 has a slightly (but noticeably) wider & and much deeper soundstage than the GR07.  That being said, the e-Q5 isn't on some IE8-type soundstage level.  I'd say the GR07 is slightly above average in width, and the e-Q5 is a little wider than it.
   
  Imaging is on par with the GR07.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Among Sunrise SW xscape Vsonic-GR07 Hifiman-Re-zero, which one is best for rock and which has the bass


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Among Sunrise SW xscape Vsonic-GR07 Hifiman-Re-zero, which one is best for rock and which has the bass


 


  You would probably have a tough time finding an original Xcape these days. The GR07 has more bass and sounds great with rock.


----------



## ASilva

I've been using a pair of Meelec M6 on the gym for 1year and a half and although they are very durable (still functioning perfectly) i absolutely HATE the wiring. It's very uncomfortable and the only way i can seem to use them is to clip them to my shirt or shorts and even then i have to adjust them frequently. The whole wire is very stiff and doesnt seem to "flow" naturally retaining the curved shape from the carrying case.
  The M6 have been through some revisions since then so they might be better now, I can't really tell.
   
  I've taken a picture to show this problem. In the picture you can see the CX400-II and RE0 with the wire perfectly straight. The M6 has been stretched and I tried to make it straight but it just curls up how it shows in the picture. As you can imagine this is a pain to wear
   

   

   
  I just ordered a pair of PL-30s to try and replace the M6 (didnt go for the E30 because sound quality is not really needed, i mostly listen to podcasts), i'll see how it goes.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@Joker
   
  I am using Brainwavz M2 at the moment and now need balanced sounding iem which should has bass quantity like the M2 or more with same/more bass quality. Mids not as much as the Brainwavz M2 has. Little bit more extended smooth treble than the M2. I need better soundstage, Imaging and instrument separation than the M2. I have chosen 3 earphones from your reviews are as follows in no particular order:
   
  Fischer Audio Consonance
  ThinkSound TS02
  ECCI PR401
   
  AFAIK that EECI PR401 is less in bass, but I am waiting for your reply now as you know the best.
   
  Budget is around $60-$100.
   
  Thank You.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





asilva said:


> I've been using a pair of Meelec M6 on the gym for 1year and a half and although they are very durable (still functioning perfectly) i absolutely HATE the wiring. It's very uncomfortable and the only way i can seem to use them is to clip them to my shirt or shorts and even then i have to adjust them frequently. The whole wire is very stiff and doesnt seem to "flow" naturally retaining the curved shape from the carrying case.
> The M6 have been through some revisions since then so they might be better now, I can't really tell.
> 
> I've taken a picture to show this problem. In the picture you can see the CX400-II and RE0 with the wire perfectly straight. The M6 has been stretched and I tried to make it straight but it just curls up how it shows in the picture. As you can imagine this is a pain to wear
> ...


 


   
  Did you look at Sport Fi S6 ?


----------



## ASilva

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Did you look at Sport Fi S6 ?


 


  yea, but the 23$ PL-30 shipped seemed more enticing than the 57$ S6 shipped


----------



## olear

IjokerI, does MG7 have recessed mids? Thank you


----------



## alterndog

Quote: 





asilva said:


> yea, but the 23$ PL-30 shipped seemed more enticing than the 57$ S6 shipped


 


  They have different sound signatures. The bass on the m6 is much more pronounced then on the pl-30s. Don't get me wrong, I like my PL-30s but if your a person who likes bass, they might not be what you want. They have a more balanced clear sound with a fairly nice soundstage.


----------



## ASilva

Quote: 





alterndog said:


> They have different sound signatures. The bass on the m6 is much more pronounced then on the pl-30s. Don't get me wrong, I like my PL-30s but if your a person who likes bass, they might not be what you want. They have a more balanced clear sound with a fairly nice soundstage.


 

  
  Quote: 





asilva said:


> I just ordered a pair of PL-30s to try and replace the M6 *(didnt go for the E30 because sound quality is not really needed, i mostly listen to podcasts)*, i'll see how it goes.


 
   
  For listening to talking bass is not really a priority


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> I've been looking into the Ortofon IEM's. The e-Q5 sounds interesting but I've been more drawn to the e-Q7. Have you listened to the e-Q7 and if so in your opinion is the e-Q7 worth the upgrade? Considering the price difference is small between the two models I'm stuck on which model would be the smarter investment for me.


 

 Tyr not to let the numbers fool you. I'm a YUUUGE (NY Style But Go Pats) fan of the EQ-5 I haven;t heard as much as the great Joker, but they are by far the best IEM I have ever heard. Many consider them better than the mid heavy EQ-7. The Highs are more "sparkly" on the EQ-5, a little more mid bass on the EQ-7. EQ-5's are very very similar to the Grado 10, but personal preference wise, I still prefer the Ortofon EQ-5, the 5's have a littler more bass than the Grado's while the Grado's have just a little more highs. But the "Air" to me was identical


----------



## Gryphus0204

Thanks joker your review and recommendation has made me found the right choice of IEM and headphones for me will continue reading your reviews


----------



## Gilly87

edit, wrong thread...


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





freefallr4545 said:


> Tyr not to let the numbers fool you. I'm a YUUUGE (NY Style But Go Pats) fan of the EQ-5 I haven;t heard as much as the great Joker, but they are by far the best IEM I have ever heard. Many consider them better than the mid heavy EQ-7. The Highs are more "sparkly" on the EQ-5, a little more mid bass on the EQ-7. EQ-5's are very very similar to the Grado 10, but personal preference wise, I still prefer the Ortofon EQ-5, the 5's have a littler more bass than the Grado's while the Grado's have just a little more highs. But the "Air" to me was identical


 

 Great - at a time when a cost-effective alternative to the GR10 seems to be popping up on several people's radar (ok, yourself and rawrstr - that's two !), I have to concentrate on real-world stuff. Stop the planet - I need to get off


----------



## phantompersona

Umm i needed some advice buying some iem. I bought the Meelec a151 thinking they were gonna be the headphones im gonna use everytime i want to listen to music but i find myself yearning for more bass in my music. I am no way a bass head, i just want some thump when needed. I was looking at the Meelec m6 ,cw31, or m21. My budget is kinda low so i was wondering if someone can choose the best one that would suit my needs. I listen to K-pop, J-pop,J-Rock, and instrumentals. Thanks any help or advice is appreciated.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Umm i needed some advice buying some iem. I bought the Meelec a151 thinking they were gonna be the headphones im gonna use everytime i want to listen to music but i find myself yearning for more bass in my music. I am no way a bass head, i just want some thump when needed. I was looking at the Meelec m6 ,cw31, or m21. My budget is kinda low so i was wondering if someone can choose the best one that would suit my needs. I listen to K-pop, J-pop,J-Rock, and instrumentals. Thanks any help or advice is appreciated.


 


  CW31 is the best sounding of the bunch you listed.  Small form factor and all around one of the better Meelecs. I've heard.  It has good bass and clear sounding.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @Joker
> 
> I am using Brainwavz M2 at the moment and now need balanced sounding iem which should has bass quantity like the M2 or more with same/more bass quality. Mids not as much as the Brainwavz M2 has. Little bit more extended smooth treble than the M2. I need better soundstage, Imaging and instrument separation than the M2. I have chosen 3 earphones from your reviews are as follows in no particular order:
> 
> ...


 
   


 The Consonance is definitely bassier than the M2 but might be too v-shaped if you're after balance and smooth treble. From Fischer I'd go for the Eterna instead. I wouldn't say the treble of the TS02 is as smooth as M2, either, and the PR401 does have less bass. The ECCIs are definitely more balanced than the Consonance but still slightly mid-recessed. I can't think of anything in the price range that fits all of your requirements to a T but if you're willing to give up a bit of bass quantity (down the same level as PR401) the HiSound Crystal might work for you. If you're not willing to give up the bass, maybe one of the Xears (TD-III v.2 or N3i) would be a better choice. They have slightly have less treble emphasis than the Consonance/TS02/PR401 but still extend better than the M2.
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, does MG7 have recessed mids? Thank you


 


  It's got lifted subbass and some lower treble emphasis so yes, it's a bit v-shaped IMO.

  
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Thanks joker your review and recommendation has made me found the right choice of IEM and headphones for me will continue reading your reviews


 

 Great, glad the reviews have helped!
   


  Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Umm i needed some advice buying some iem. I bought the Meelec a151 thinking they were gonna be the headphones im gonna use everytime i want to listen to music but i find myself yearning for more bass in my music. I am no way a bass head, i just want some thump when needed. I was looking at the Meelec m6 ,cw31, or m21. My budget is kinda low so i was wondering if someone can choose the best one that would suit my needs. I listen to K-pop, J-pop,J-Rock, and instrumentals. Thanks any help or advice is appreciated.


 

 I think all of the other MEElec IEMs have more bass than the A151. Why not the CC51? It's got plenty of bass punch but the clarity and detail are also very good. The CW31 would be my second choice but there are plenty of other dynamic-driver IEMs in the price range if you are not limiting yourself to MEElec.


----------



## phantompersona

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Consonance is definitely bassier than the M2 but might be too v-shaped if you're after balance and smooth treble. From Fischer I'd go for the Eterna instead. I wouldn't say the treble of the TS02 is as smooth as M2, either, and the PR401 does have less bass. The ECCIs are definitely more balanced than the Consonance but still slightly mid-recessed. I can't think of anything in the price range that fits all of your requirements to a T but if you're willing to give up a bit of bass quantity (down the same level as PR401) the HiSound Crystal might work for you. If you're not willing to give up the bass, maybe one of the Xears (TD-III v.2 or N3i) would be a better choice. They have slightly have less treble emphasis than the Consonance/TS02/PR401 but still extend better than the M2.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The cc51 seems like the perfect fit but alas im a poor college kid. my budget is only around $30. Thanks for the response joker, ill be sure to read the rest of your thread to further educate my decision in finding the perfect iem for my price range.  Your thread is so wonderful and well done!


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> The cc51 seems like the perfect fit but alas im a poor college kid. my budget is only around $30. Thanks for the response joker, ill be sure to read the rest of your thread to further educate my decision in finding the perfect iem for my price range.  Your thread is so wonderful and well done!


 

 You can get the CC51s for like $40 on Amazon if you have an extra ten bucks...


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> In my opinion, the e-Q5 has a slightly (but noticeably) wider & and much deeper soundstage than the GR07.  That being said, the e-Q5 isn't on some IE8-type soundstage level.  I'd say the GR07 is slightly above average in width, and the e-Q5 is a little wider than it.
> 
> Imaging is on par with the GR07.


 

 I found E-Q5 to be much smoother in presentation. Bass response is very nice and it wields the texture gracefully, revealing the subtle nuances.
   
  I guess I don't have to try GR07 now.
   
  I really like the housings, looks top class. But there is no chin slider or clip.

  
  Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> The cc51 seems like the perfect fit but alas im a poor college kid. my budget is only around $30. Thanks for the response joker, ill be sure to read the rest of your thread to further educate my decision in finding the perfect iem for my price range.  Your thread is so wonderful and well done!


 
  One thing to notice is that CC51's vocals are recessed. But so far it's one of my favorite IEM under $100. Detail is amazing for the price. Ordered 2 more sets but seems like got lost or stolen in transit.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Btw joker, does the GR07 need a amplifier? Would the sound be much different with a amp? And if so what would be a good and affordable potable amp


----------



## tseliottt

I've had my ER4Ps for almost a decade now. They've served me well. But I've always wanted a little more bass. Back then, there were only a few options for us head-fiers. Now, it seems like there are more IEMs than headphones, and I don't know where to start.
  
 So what I'm looking for is a IEM with mids and highs like the ER4P, but with detailed, high quality, rumbling bass like in the Denon D2000s. I also want them to be well detailed, and have the amazing instrument separation of the Etys. Soundstage isn't as important, but I wouldn't mind one with a deep stage. Budget is less than $600. Of course, less is always better. Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> The cc51 seems like the perfect fit but alas im a poor college kid. my budget is only around $30. Thanks for the response joker, ill be sure to read the rest of your thread to further educate my decision in finding the perfect iem for my price range.  Your thread is so wonderful and well done!


 

  I assume you'd be trading in your A151. In that case, a CW31 or Brainwavz Beta would probably be your best bet if you just want a small bass bump while retaining good overall fidelity and don't mind mediocre isolation. The Beta is a little clearer and more detailed but doesn't sound as smooth as the CW31 up top.
  
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Btw joker, does the GR07 need a amplifier? Would the sound be much different with a amp? And if so what would be a good and affordable potable amp


 

 Despite the impedance, efficiency is one of the impressive traits of the GR07. I think you will be okay without one.
   
  I haven't tried any of the portable amps popular around here lately. I still use an age-old mini3.
   


  Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> I've had my ER4Ps for almost a decade now. They've served me well. But I've always wanted a little more bass. Back then, there were only a few options for us head-fiers. Now, it seems like there are more IEMs than headphones, and I don't know where to start.
> 
> So what I'm looking for is a IEM with mids and highs like the ER4P, but with detailed, high quality, rumbling bass like in the Denon D2000s. I also want them to be well detailed, and have the amazing instrument separation of the Etys. Soundstage isn't as important, but I wouldn't mind one with a deep stage. Budget is less than $600. Of course, less is always better. Thanks.


 


  If you're willing to give up isolation, doesn't get much more Denon-like than a JVC FX700. Very deep and rumbly, but without sacrificing control. Huge increase in bass quantity over Etys without a drop in separation.


----------



## Nintendam

beat me to it, even coming from a Denon D7000, the FX700 holds it's own
   
  hands down
  
  'high quality rumbling bass'
   
  'well detailed, instrument sepation'
   
  incredible timbre
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you're willing to give up isolation, doesn't get much more Denon-like than a JVC FX700. Very deep and rumbly, but without sacrificing control. Huge increase in bass quantity over Etys without a drop in separation.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Consonance is definitely bassier than the M2 but might be too v-shaped if you're after balance and smooth treble. From Fischer I'd go for the Eterna instead. I wouldn't say the treble of the TS02 is as smooth as M2, either, and the PR401 does have less bass. The ECCIs are definitely more balanced than the Consonance but still slightly mid-recessed. I can't think of anything in the price range that fits all of your requirements to a T but if you're willing to give up a bit of bass quantity (down the same level as PR401) the HiSound Crystal might work for you. If you're not willing to give up the bass, maybe one of the Xears (TD-III v.2 or N3i) would be a better choice. They have slightly have less treble emphasis than the Consonance/TS02/PR401 but still extend better than the M2.


 
   
  Thank you for the reply, I need better soundstage than the Brainwavz M2. I don't need mids like as brainwavz M2 has. I need less mids but also not too much recessed mids; let say if we give 5 score to the M2's mids so I need 2.5 to 3 score in the newly earphone, more or same bass as M2 has which doesn't bleed into midrange and more extended treble than the Brainwavz M2 but in a smooth fashion. Instrument separation and imaging would be plus if I can get in my mentioned budget which is $60-$100.
   
  Thank You.


----------



## estreeter

Joker, I see a lot of warnings about 'potential problems' with balanced armature IEMs in discussions on output impedance : you are probably aware of the revelation that Fiio's E9 had 10 ohms on the 1/4" socket and significantly higher on the smaller socket. I have used my E9 with a variety of IEMs without any appreciable damage, and I don't perceive any degradation in the sound (the higher output impedance reportedly messes with the frequency curve on some phones), but I'm interested in whether you know of any BA phones actually being *damaged* by an amp ?
   
  I'm not looking to start a flame war, and I dont discount the principle behind the claims, but I have yet to see a single post from someone who broke their $400 BA earphones simply by plugging them into an amp. Always happy to hear otherwise.


----------



## maverickronin

I don't remember reading about an amp doing that on its own but most amps will easily blow them up if turn the volume up too much.
   
  If an amp has a pops or clicks when it turns on or off that could blow them too.  Schiit had some issues with that and had to put relays on the Asgard and Lyr.  The Lyr blew two people's ED8s.  If your amp does that and even if you're careful to not switch the power with a 'phone plugged into the amp it only takes a brief power cut to ruin the headphones.


----------



## estreeter

I may be confusing output impedance 'damage' with 'turn on thump' - the 'pops and clicks' you refer to - apologies if that is the case.


----------



## estreeter

Doh !


----------



## maverickronin

Quote: 





estreeter said:


> I may be confusing output impedance 'damage' with 'turn on thump' - the 'pops and clicks' you refer to - apologies if that is the case.


 

 Damaged by the output impedance?  That can't really happen so I though you were talking about damage from amps in general from any factor that wasn't a "match" with IEMs.
   
  The output impedance can't hurt anything by itself.  It affects FR by creating a frequency dependent voltage divider that transfers less power to the drivers at the frequencies with lower impedances.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm ready to upgrade to some seriously detailed IEMs. This is what I have in mind:
   
  -Etymotic HF5
  -Sony XBA-1
  -MEELEC A161
  -JVC HA-FXT90
  -Able Planet SI1000
  -JVC HA-FX 500
  -Radius DDM v1
  -Shure SE215
  -RE-ZERO (Build Quality makes me a bit nervous)
  -Westone UM1
  -Brainwavz M4
  -Ultimate Ears TripleFi 10
  -Fischer Audio SBA-03
   
  What I'm looking for is the equivalent bass quantity of the CC51, but better texture (detailed). The speed of the bass has to be faster. The midrange has to be open and very detailed (moreso than the CC51). The treble has to be extended and sparkly (plus detailed and more than the CC51), but not overdoing it. The Soundstage has to have much better precision than the CC51 (Instrument Separation and Great Level of Submersion). The Clarity must be better than the CC51 (Sorry for the many CC51 Benchmark References). The Build Quality also has to be similar than the CC51 (maybe a tad bit stronger, but definitely stronger cable quality) Which one of those meet the requirements?


----------



## tseliottt

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you're willing to give up isolation, doesn't get much more Denon-like than a JVC FX700. Very deep and rumbly, but without sacrificing control. Huge increase in bass quantity over Etys without a drop in separation.


 


   


  Quote: 





nintendam said:


> beat me to it, even coming from a Denon D7000, the FX700 holds it's own
> 
> hands down
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks guys. Definitely going to check them out. Is Seyo Shop the only place that sells them? Any word on how much they are in Japan? Because I'm going to be there for a couple of weeks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thank you for the reply, I need better soundstage than the Brainwavz M2. I don't need mids like as brainwavz M2 has. I need less mids but also not too much recessed mids; let say if we give 5 score to the M2's mids so I need 2.5 to 3 score in the newly earphone, more or same bass as M2 has which doesn't bleed into midrange and more extended treble than the Brainwavz M2 but in a smooth fashion. Instrument separation and imaging would be plus if I can get in my mentioned budget which is $60-$100.
> 
> Thank You.


 

 Then I would go for the Eterna.
   
   


  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> I may be confusing output impedance 'damage' with 'turn on thump' - the 'pops and clicks' you refer to - apologies if that is the case.


 

 Yes, I think you are. There is no way high output impedance of a source by itself can damage anything physically. If the pops you are thinking of are voltage spikes, they can probably be dangerous as they will result in a lot of current going to the driver, abnormally high driver displacement, etc.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'm ready to upgrade to some seriously detailed IEMs. This is what I have in mind:
> 
> -JVC HA-FXT90
> -JVC HA-FX 500
> ...


 


  I haven't heard the Able Planet, UM1, or M4. I think wanting bass qty on-par with the CC51 would rule out the Sonys, Etys, RE-ZEROs, and maybe even the SBA-03/A161. The need for sparkly treble rules out the SE215 and DDM v.1. The remaining three (FXT90, FX500, TF10)  all fit your requirements and are about on-par from an SQ standpoint, with the FX500 being the brute that can sometimes get out of hand (especially at higher volumes) but rewards with an excellent presentation, timbre, and very good clarity. The TF10 and FXT90 are more straightforward - I'm sure you've read the reviews. I don't find the form factor of the TF10 to be as good as those of the JVCs but that's probably just me.
   
   
   


  Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> Thanks guys. Definitely going to check them out. Is Seyo Shop the only place that sells them? Any word on how much they are in Japan? Because I'm going to be there for a couple of weeks.


 
   
  They are about $280 on amazon.co.jp


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Then I would go for the Eterna.


 
   
  Which Eterna? Rev. 1 and Rev. 2 both are available here. Could you please tell me the differences between Rev. 1 and Rev. 2 in bass, soundstage, imaging, layering, treble response, mids as compared to the Brainwavz M2. which Rev. Eterna's doesn't bleed into mid-range? which Rev. eterna has extended smooth highs than the M2's? which Rev. will be the best for me as you already know what I'm looking for in the new IEM. Will eterna's an upgrade over M2's for what I'm looking for??????? My source is Nationite Nanite N2.
   
  I have noted some points In your eterna's review and comparison:
   
  rev. 1 is bassier than the rev. 2
 rev. 1 has slightly superior low-end clarity and resolution than the rev. 2.
 rev. 1 is also not quite as thick sounding, leading to slightly better air and separation and making the soundstaging seem even more immersive than the rev. 2

 rev. 2's evened-out response helps bring the treble into focus, making detail easier to pick out than the rev. 1
 rev. 2 has slightly better mid-range presence than the rev. 1
   
  Will I be able to notice these differences? which Rev. has more treble? Also both the Rev. has more treble extension than the M2?
   
  Help me as I am a bit confused now.
   
   
  Thank You.
   
  Regards.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the Able Planet, UM1, or M4. I think wanting bass qty on-par with the CC51 would rule out the Sonys, Etys, RE-ZEROs, and maybe even the SBA-03/A161. The need for sparkly treble rules out the SE215 and DDM v.1. The remaining three (FXT90, FX500, TF10)  all fit your requirements and are about on-par from an SQ standpoint, with the FX500 being the brute that can sometimes get out of hand (especially at higher volumes) but rewards with an excellent presentation, timbre, and very good clarity. The TF10 and FXT90 are more straightforward - I'm sure you've read the reviews. I don't find the form factor of the TF10 to be as good as those of the JVCs but that's probably just me.


 

      Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Which Eterna? Rev. 1 and Rev. 2 both are available here. Could you please tell me the differences between Rev. 1 and Rev. 2 in bass, soundstage, imaging, layering, treble response, mids as compared to the Brainwavz M2. which Rev. Eterna's doesn't bleed into mid-range? which Rev. eterna has extended smooth highs than the M2's? which Rev. will be the best for me as you already know what I'm looking for in the new IEM. Will eterna's an upgrade over M2's for what I'm looking for??????? My source is Nationite Nanite N2.
> 
> I have noted some points In your eterna's review and comparison:
> 
> ...


 

 I don't think you will notice the differences unless comparing the two directly. If both are available I would just get the rev.1


----------



## Mykolas

Is there enough difference to consider an upgrade from Klipsch s4 to Brainwavz M4 earphones? If so, could anyone provide me some tips about these differences ? Does anyone own both of them ? Thanks


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, I think you are. There is no way high output impedance of a source by itself can damage anything physically. If the pops you are thinking of are voltage spikes, they can probably be dangerous as they will result in a lot of current going to the driver, abnormally high driver displacement, etc.


 
   
   
  Thanks, Joker - I suspect that many of these fears are based around the size of the drivers in a BA earphone, and their perceived fragility, but its not logical that a company would sell an IEM for $300+ that wasnt able to stand abuse of some description. Most of us have accidentally cranked too much volume into various IEMs, and I havent had one die on me yet - of course, I'd hate to find out that I'm totally off beam. Junking a pair of $300 *anything* isnt on my Bucket List !


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mykolas said:


> Is there enough difference to consider an upgrade from Klipsch s4 to Brainwavz M4 earphones? If so, could anyone provide me some tips about these differences ? Does anyone own both of them ? Thanks


 

 The M4 is fairly new so I think you will find more M4 owners in the dedicated M4 threads, maybe even someone there owns/has owned an S4.
   


  Quote: 





estreeter said:


> Thanks, Joker - I suspect that many of these fears are based around the size of the drivers in a BA earphone, and their perceived fragility, but its not logical that a company would sell an IEM for $300+ that wasnt able to stand abuse of some description. Most of us have accidentally cranked too much volume into various IEMs, and I havent had one die on me yet - of course, I'd hate to find out that I'm totally off beam. Junking a pair of $300 *anything* isnt on my Bucket List !


 


  I think it would be partly on the manufacturer of the amp or source or whatever is giving off the voltage spike. On the upside, there are (with a few exceptions) only two companies making BA drivers and it's probably safe to say these drivers undergo extensive testing.


----------



## Jseeker

Hope you do a review of Brainwavz M4... since its release there hasn't been many professionally written reviews and it's sad for good IEMs to not get what they deserve


----------



## sphinxvc

Man, it's been 3-4 months and I'm having a love/...well hate is too strong a word...frustration relationship with the SM3s.  I love, love the sound, but sometimes the top-end isn't sparkly and extended enough, and couple that with it's overall "thick" sound, and you just don't get enough "breathing space" in it's presentation.  
   
  However, I know at this point that I'm asking for far too much from universals.  The only thing that will remedy all my issues is probably a $1K custom.  
   
  Just can't justify it...I use the SM3s for an hour's commute every day and to block out people in neighboring cubicles at work.  Maybe I should have posted this in the complain about anything thread.


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Man, it's been 3-4 months and I'm having a love/...well hate is too strong a word...frustration relationship with the SM3s.  I love, love the sound, but sometimes the top-end isn't sparkly and extended enough, and couple that with it's overall "thick" sound, and you just don't get enough "breathing space" in it's presentation.
> 
> However, I know at this point that I'm asking for far too much from universals.  The only thing that will remedy all my issues is probably a $1K custom.
> 
> Just can't justify it...I use the SM3s for an hour's commute every day and to block out people in neighboring cubicles at work.  Maybe I should have posted this in the complain about anything thread.


 

 Had the same expereince as you when i first got the Sm3s as well but it took me slightly less than 2 months to finally get used to and subsequently enamored with the Sm3's sound. Still, there are times when i want more top end sparkle (although honestly to my ears its top end is rather good). What do i do? Slap on a HS filter @ approx 2kHz by 2-3db. Lifts the slight veil and opens up the sound. I only use this on some albumsI listen to tho. Most of my albums have enough top end information for the SM3 to work with.
   
  BTW, i'm using rockbox but I suppose any player with a good parametric equalizer should be able to achieve the same effect.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jseeker said:


> Hope you do a review of Brainwavz M4... since its release there hasn't been many professionally written reviews and it's sad for good IEMs to not get what they deserve


 


  I hope to have time for them at some point in the future.


  Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Man, it's been 3-4 months and I'm having a love/...well hate is too strong a word...frustration relationship with the SM3s.  I love, love the sound, but sometimes the top-end isn't sparkly and extended enough, and couple that with it's overall "thick" sound, and you just don't get enough "breathing space" in it's presentation.
> 
> However, I know at this point that I'm asking for far too much from universals.  The only thing that will remedy all my issues is probably a $1K custom.
> 
> Just can't justify it...I use the SM3s for an hour's commute every day and to block out people in neighboring cubicles at work.  Maybe I should have posted this in the complain about anything thread.


 


  All valid concerns IMO. The thickness and lack of treble energy is why the Earsonics IEMs are not for me (SM2 even more so than SM3). It boggles the mind how atrocious the SM3 sounds in comparison with the EX1000 and vice versa.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think you will notice the differences unless comparing the two directly. If both are available I would just get the rev.1


 

 Thank You, I have ordered Fischer Audio Eterna Rev. 1
   
  Can you tell me a bit more like which one sounds more clean and clearer between M2 and Eterna Rev. 1?
   
  Which one has more treble?
   
  Which one has better bass quality, texture?
   
  Which one has less mids b/w M2 and Eterna Rev. 1?
   
  I want to feel better instruments separation and an airy feel so Will I get that in Eterna Rev. 1?
   
  Which one has livelier and upfront presentation between M2 and Eterna Rev. 1?
   
  Please answer all of my questions
   
  Thank You.
   
  Regards....


----------



## LooptroopRocker

Hey Joker, 
   
  If I had to chose between the FXT90 or C710 for mainly electronic music (looking for quick bass with good impact) and female vocalists (forward midrange) which would you recommend? I can get them for the same price and cant decide between the two, any help would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## Dacrazydude

How is this thread not stickied on this forum!? I hate when this thread gets buried like 3 pages in : (


----------



## Niyologist

The RX-12 is now available for Pre-Order:
   
  http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_RX12_In_Ear_Headphones_p/ep-rx12-rd-mee.htm
   
  Pre-Order Price: $10.99
   
  Original Price: $14.99


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thank You, I have ordered Fischer Audio Eterna Rev. 1
> 
> Can you tell me a bit more like which one sounds more clean and clearer between M2 and Eterna Rev. 1?
> 
> ...


 


  Since you've already ordered it, you can be the judge of all that. Much more reliable than my 1+ year old impressions.


  Quote: 





looptrooprocker said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> If I had to chose between the FXT90 or C710 for mainly electronic music (looking for quick bass with good impact) and female vocalists (forward midrange) which would you recommend? I can get them for the same price and cant decide between the two, any help would be greatly appreciated!


 

 I would go for the FXT90. The mids of the C710 weren't forward at all - I thought its sig was a shallow v-shape. I was also never all that impressed by the tone of the Denons - I think the JVCs are easily the more natural-sounding pair.
   


  Quote: 





dacrazydude said:


> How is this thread not stickied on this forum!? I hate when this thread gets buried like 3 pages in : (


 

 I don't get thread notifications anymore so I usually have to go looking for it too.


----------



## Mykolas

Hey, Joker
   
What is your opinion about Yamaha EPH-100 earphones for listening mostly electronic music such as drum and bass? Have you tried them? Thanks


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Since you've already ordered it, you can be the judge of all that. Much more reliable than my 1+ year old impressions.


 

  
  Once My eterna's arrive, I will try my level best to tell you that how it is sounding as compared to M2's and Will it be able to fulfill what I was looking for.
   
  Thank You Joker for your help 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Best Regards.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mykolas said:


> Hey, Joker
> 
> What is your opinion about Yamaha EPH-100 earphones for listening mostly electronic music such as drum and bass? Have you tried them? Thanks


 


  Sorry, never heard them


----------



## Ivabign

Joker,
   
  Were you going to add your impressions of the UETF10? You mention it as a comparison of a few of the included IEM's - Just wondered if it was going to have its day in the sun.


----------



## Niyologist

The way the JVC HA-FX500 should be described is: Partly Cloudy Skies, full sunshine, blue skies with very harsh winds w/Earthquakes. I'm just going by several reviews and made my own weather/Sound Signature reference.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ivabign said:


> Joker,
> 
> Were you going to add your impressions of the UETF10? You mention it as a comparison of a few of the included IEM's - Just wondered if it was going to have its day in the sun.


 

 Someday, but the order of my reviews is rarely decided by me (see FAQ at the front of the thread).
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The way the JVC HA-FX500 should be described is: Partly Cloudy Skies, full sunshine, blue skies with very harsh winds w/Earthquakes. I'm just going by several reviews and made my own weather/Sound Signature reference.


 


  That sounds about right.


----------



## FlySweep

LOL at the _incessant_ clamoring for a TF.10 review.  With all due respect to |joker|'s reviews (which are among the most accurate & consistent I've *ever* read).. is there a phone that's been _more_ reviewed at HF than the TF.10?  What else is there really left to say?  Read a dozen reviews from some of the most trusted HF'iers and you'll get a damn good idea of what to expect & how it stacks up against the comp.. I doubt joker would disagree, either.  In all honesty, I really enjoy & value joker's reviews of the more esoteric phones out there (even if I end up having no interest in them) than the stuff that occupies the majority of posts at HF.  That's truly what makes this thread unique.. the breadth, accompanying accuracy, & diversity of this review thread.  Heck, I'd love to never see a TF.10 review here.. LOL.
   
  Even if I owned the TF.10 (which I don't), I couldn't care less if joker reviewed it ASAP.. I'd much rather have him spend time reviewing the next 'diamond in the rough.'  But I can guarantee once joker does unleash his TF.10 review.. we'll see 15,000 subsequent posts arguing about its (inferior/superior) performance & who's wrong/right (cause we don't have enough of that already, right?)..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Even if I owned the TF.10 (which I don't), I couldn't care less if joker reviewed it ASAP.. I'd much rather have him spend time reviewing the next 'diamond in the rough.'  But I can guarantee once joker does unleash his TF.10 review.. we'll see 15,000 subsequent posts arguing about its (inferior/superior) performance & who's wrong/right (cause we don't have enough of that already, right?)..


 

 I fully agree with you and definitely feel that my time is better spent on new or less widely-covered gear. That said, I also understand that with the annual Black Friday sale the TF10 has become the gateway to high-end audio for many and can see the desire to see it not so much reviewed but at least ranked with other stuff, whether to find an upgrade or to verify that it was a good deal. I actually quite like (the sound of) the TF10 so I doubt my rating of it would surprise anyone.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm gonna go for the Alien Ears: SQ5 Five Driver Detachable Cord Monitors. I really want my upgraditis to be crushed.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Inks

The new batch of apple earbuds are good, for earbuds that is, see this review.


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## vwinter

I agree with this exact statement. I listened to mine a few days ago for fun and was pleasantly surprised.
  Quote: 





inks said:


> The new batch of apple earbuds are good, for earbuds that is, see this review.


----------



## Inks

Try the EX600, those may do it for you, bmeat. Isolation isn't the best, but that's how part of the soundstage air is derived.


----------



## Inks

Newer Apple stuff is actually very hi-fi, their new DAPs/Tables/Phones all sound great and both the earbuds and in-ears are good performers for what they are. Tyll mentions that they know their stuff pretty well after speaking to an engineer of theirs. They extensively tuned each product carefully, improving each time. I also heard the earbud driver is derived from Fostex.
   
  It will be hard to tell which are the newer batch of buds though, but the ones with a mic are surely it.


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, 
   
   
  About the SM2 and the SM3, which of two do have higher dynamic range?
   
  Other doubt: is the Unique Melody Miracle so dynamic as the Monster Miles Davis Tribute or the Radius TWF21?


----------



## bmeat

void


----------



## Inks

It's fairly flat from the bass to midrange, but the mid highs are emphasized a bit.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> About the SM2 and the SM3, which of two do have higher dynamic range?


 

 About the same. The two Earsonics IEMs I've tried are very similar in many ways.
   
   
  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Other doubt: is the Unique Melody Miracle so dynamic as the Monster Miles Davis Tribute or the Radius TWF21?


 

 In my opinion, yes. It can really belt it out when necessary but can also be remarkably docile.


----------



## olear

IjokerI, does RE262 have better mids than E-Q5? Which phone do you like most for vocals?


----------



## Niyologist

I changed my mind. I'm going for the 1964-Q.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, does RE262 have better mids than E-Q5? Which phone do you like most for vocals?


 
   
  I prefer the e-Q5 in general but if you're into warm and relaxed the RE262 is the better choice. Wouldn't say one is better than the other - the e-Q5 is brighter and more transparent while the RE262 is a bit thicker and more mid-focused.


----------



## tseliottt

How would you compare the Atrio Mg7, Yamaha EPH-100, and Vsonic GR07s in terms of overall bass performance, and their instrument separation/imaging/detail ability?


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I prefer the e-Q5 in general but if you're into warm and relaxed the RE262 is the better choice. Wouldn't say one is better than the other - the e-Q5 is brighter and more transparent while the RE262 is a bit thicker and more mid-focused.


 

 Thank you IjokerI


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> How would you compare the Atrio Mg7, Yamaha EPH-100, and Vsonic GR07s in terms of overall bass performance, and their instrument separation/imaging/detail ability?


 


  I've never heard the EPH-100. The MG7 has more bass (much more sub-bass) than the GR07 but the GR07 is quicker and tighter. I would say the GR07 wins out in detail and separation, though not by much. Neither has great imaging.


----------



## olear

joker, which would you prefer to listen to for rock, 60's music and general pop: EX1000 or FXT90?


----------



## tseliottt

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've never heard the EPH-100. The MG7 has more bass (much more sub-bass) than the GR07 but the GR07 is quicker and tighter. I would say the GR07 wins out in detail and separation, though not by much. Neither has great imaging.


 


  Thanks a lot! I'm probably going to get the Atrio's then. I was under the assumption that the GR07 were absolutely superior in separation and imaging.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, which would you prefer to listen to for rock, 60's music and general pop: EX1000 or FXT90?


 


  I generally prefer the EX1000 (or even EX600) so I'm the wrong person to ask.


----------



## olear

One reason due to the Sony's being brighter?


----------



## JK1

Joker, please review the Panasonic RP-HJE120. I think this may be the best IEM under $10. Any chance we could get a Sony XBA-1 review soon?


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Sony MDR-EX300LP and MDR-EX600
   
  Quote: 





> *(3A65) Sony MDR-EX300LP*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(1B14) Sony MDR-EX600*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2012
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





olear said:


> One reason due to the Sony's being brighter?


 

 If you're looking for my personal opinion, I really like the bass-midrange balance, the clarity, and the out-of-the head presentation (which is quite refreshing) of the EX600/EX1000. The treble emphasis I could take or leave.
  
  Quote: 





jk1 said:


> Joker, please review the Panasonic RP-HJE120. I think this may be the best IEM under $10. Any chance we could get a Sony XBA-1 review soon?


 

 Sorry, pretty busy with all of the sets already in the queue.


----------



## Majin

Excellent EX600 review pretty much spot on, excellent value since the GR07 became a bit pricier. When will we ever see the TF10 review?


----------



## psygeist

Joker, how do you compare e-Q5 to EX600 ?


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the Sony ... MDR-EX600
> ...
> 
> There is no grain or harshness and no sacrifices made in crispness or resolution. Best of all, the treble energy that is often lacking with consumer-friendly dynamic-driver sets is conveyed realistically.
> ...


 

 Thanks for yet another excellent review. Though I must confess, I'm a bit disappointed that you did not notice the EX600's grainy highs, that have been repeatedly mentioned across several threads lately


----------



## Majin

and it doesnt forgive poor recordings, had some serious sibiliance with a few tracks


----------



## imboden

Up next..... TF10 VS X10!!!


----------



## music_4321

.


----------



## TheDead

Posting to mention that the EX600 are listed as 1B14 and 2B14 so pointers are miss aligned.
  Also, I want to thank you Joker as your are my main source for IEm shopping  
  *bowing to your greatness*


----------



## Heret1c

Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> Oh, but it's not just grainy highs but the utterly horrendous & unbearable sibilance!
> 
> Joker - Excellent review. The EX600, to these ears, remains one of the best IEMs I've heard to date.


 

 Huh? Is the first statement meant to be sarcastic? Cuz it doesn't seem to tally with the second statement.


----------



## The_pGo

Joker, if you happen to review AKG K370 in the future, be sure to mention about poor cable durablity. In about a year, cable broke twice near the jack and once near the mic. I love their sound, but akg messed up with the cable(and too long plug)


----------



## olear

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Joker, how do you compare e-Q5 to EX600 ?


 


  +1


----------



## moracajay

I want to thank LjokerL for the very informative thread. By the way, since your about to review  SUNRISE XCITED, do you find it having the same kind of sound quality with REO or RE-ZERO? Sunrise XCITED are available here in my place for an introductory price of $46. I prefer the sound quality of RE0. I love my RE0 but died within two months, the left earpiece just stop working.


----------



## JK1

How does the Sony EX310 compare with the EX300?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Where did you get them for $131? I don't see them on beachaudio's website, and everyone else has them for $199.


----------



## Selenium

http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=sony+ex600&hl=en&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=2676l4544l0l4926l10l9l0l2l2l0l196l1039l1.6l7l0&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=8297601929966996596&sa=X&ei=SuYyT7iiJNChtwfrsq2OBw&ved=0CG8QxBUwAA#start=0
  
  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Where did you get them for $131? I don't see them on beachaudio's website, and everyone else has them for $199.


----------



## dweaver

At some point I  have to send you the MDR7550 To review. They are definitely not treble happy with a more forward midrange but all other aspects seem very much like the EX600/1000. They sit right in between the other models price wise as well. I have to say they have pretty much become my go to IEM due comfort and the almost headphone like sound.


----------



## Niyologist

Will my Fiio E6 do any good for increasing the bass quantity for the EX-600? If it does, then I'll buy these and forget about buying customs.


----------



## Selenium

^^^Well the E6 has a bass boost...so yes.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





majin said:


> Excellent EX600 review pretty much spot on, excellent value since the GR07 became a bit pricier. When will we ever see the TF10 review?


 

 Someday 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   


  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Joker, how do you compare e-Q5 to EX600 ?


 

 They aren't too different - both sound like leaner dynamic-driver earphones. I would have to A:B them for an in-depth comparison but I think the EX600 is a bit more impactful/dynamic and the e-Q5 a bit more analytical, especially in the way detail is presented. Biggest difference is probably in the presentation - the EX-series IEMs are more headphone-like in presentation than any of the MA/BA-based sets I've heard.
   


  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Thanks for yet another excellent review. Though I must confess, I'm a bit disappointed that you did not notice the EX600's grainy highs, that have been repeatedly mentioned across several threads lately


 

 Afraid I don't have the time to read other threads so I haven't seen any reports. Really didn't think either of the EX-series IEMs were grainy at all - maybe a little brighter than I would like but it's all high quality treble.

  
  Quote: 





majin said:


> and it doesnt forgive poor recordings, had some serious sibiliance with a few tracks


 

 It does. So do the GR07 and FX500 but the Sonys are a bit more prone to it with some tracks.


  Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> Oh, but it's not just grainy highs but the utterly horrendous & unbearable sibilance!
> 
> Joker - Excellent review. The EX600, to these ears, remains one of the best IEMs I've heard to date.


 

 Thanks, I like my armatures but I have to admit these Sonys do most everything at least as well as anything armature-based in the price bracket.
   


  Quote: 





thedead said:


> Posting to mention that the EX600 are listed as 1B14 and 2B14 so pointers are miss aligned.
> Also, I want to thank you Joker as your are my main source for IEm shopping
> *bowing to your greatness*


 

 Fixed, thanks!
   


  Quote: 





the_pgo said:


> Joker, if you happen to review AKG K370 in the future, be sure to mention about poor cable durablity. In about a year, cable broke twice near the jack and once near the mic. I love their sound, but akg messed up with the cable(and too long plug)


 

 I've had the K370 for about the same amount of time, though I don't use it all that much. The cable doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in me but it's an improvement on the dreadful K330 cord IMO. The mediocre sound is a bigger problem with the K370.

  
  Quote: 





moracajay said:


> I want to thank LjokerL for the very informative thread. By the way, since your about to review  SUNRISE XCITED, do you find it having the same kind of sound quality with REO or RE-ZERO? Sunrise XCITED are available here in my place for an introductory price of $46. I prefer the sound quality of RE0. I love my RE0 but died within two months, the left earpiece just stop working.


 

 I don't think the Xcited is as good as the RE0, RE-ZERO, or the v.1 Xcape and I wouldn't put any more stock in its build quality.


  
  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Where did you get them for $131? I don't see them on beachaudio's website, and everyone else has them for $199.


 

 They were that price last week. I'll change the vendor to provantage with the next update. Seems you can still easily get them for $130-150 for now.
   


  Quote: 





dweaver said:


> At some point I  have to send you the MDR7550 To review. They are definitely not treble happy with a more forward midrange but all other aspects seem very much like the EX600/1000. They sit right in between the other models price wise as well. I have to say they have pretty much become my go to IEM due comfort and the almost headphone like sound.


 


  That sounds good - I am easily seduced by certain mid-forward IEMs.


----------



## zhengwy

this is such a great thread! I am glad it's still updating


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> At some point I  have to send you the MDR7550 To review. They are definitely not treble happy with a more forward midrange but all other aspects seem very much like the EX600/1000. They sit right in between the other models price wise as well. I have to say they have pretty much become my go to IEM due comfort and the almost headphone like sound.


 


  Hi dweaver quick question, where did you get the MDR7550? I went by The Sony Store a few months ago and according to them they're not available in Canada. Seen a few sets on American sites but they seem kind of pricey.
   
  @ Everyone else
  Long time MDR EX600 owner here. In the beginning I also had trouble with overly aggressive treble and sibilance from my set of 600's until I swapped out the tips. Besides giving me a better more comfortable fit, I can't stand the Sony tips, I pretty much killed most of the sibilance and smoothed the treble out when I went to a triple flange Monster tip. I also noticed bass filled in a little more too. Give it a try guys it worked wonders for me.


----------



## music_4321

.


----------



## dweaver

Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Hi dweaver quick question, where did you get the MDR7550? I went by The Sony Store a few months ago and according to them they're not available in Canada. Seen a few sets on American sites but they seem kind of pricey.
> 
> @ Everyone else
> Long time MDR EX600 owner here. In the beginning I also had trouble with overly aggressive treble and sibilance from my set of 600's until I swapped out the tips. Besides giving me a better more comfortable fit, I can't stand the Sony tips, I pretty much killed most of the sibilance and smoothed the treble out when I went to a triple flange Monster tip. I also noticed bass filled in a little more too. Give it a try guys it worked wonders for me.


 

 I picked them up at Axe Music in Calgary. But they have them online as well for the same price I paid  at Axe Music


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zhengwy said:


> this is such a great thread! I am glad it's still updating


 

 As am I, at least most of the time


----------



## Inks

james444 said:


> Thanks for yet another excellent review. Though I must confess, I'm a bit disappointed that you did not notice the EX600's grainy highs, that have been repeatedly mentioned across several threads lately


 
  x2, though I think the grain is slight. In general pretty much every dynamic I've heard has a bit of grain though ime. I think it will take an extremely rigid coil to have a cleaner response. 
  
   
  The EX600 is actually part of the 'monitor' series which includes the 7550 and 1000s. This line-up strives for a flat response for professionals that may in turn welcome certain audiophiles. Definitely not a consumer based product that strives for just mainstream pleasure, that seems to be the job of the BA line-up. 
   
  To me, the GR07 clearly had a bigger midbass hump, with a slightly slower response. I think the EX600 is flatter overall but it is mentioned that the newer GR07s may have a bit more bass emphasis.


----------



## jiff

Joker if you ever have a chance you should checkout the Yamaha EPH-100's, they are really, really good and have some BA qualities like in how detailed they are.  The bass is so very nice with good depth, punch and an over all smooth texture.  I'm truly shocked at how good they sound and the fact that there only $115 to $150 depending on where you get them is a fantastic deal and so far the best bang for buck IEM I've heard.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> I picked them up at Axe Music in Calgary. But they have them online as well for the same price I paid  at Axe Music


 


  Hmmmm interesting the guy at the Sony Store said they weren't available in Canada. Wonder if I just had the bad luck of getting some kid who was to lazy to hit a few buttons and check the stock. Thanks for the info my man.
   
  EDIT:
  I just checked the Sony Style online store and nothing listed there for MDr 7550 so maybe the kid wasn't lying. On the plus side the NEW SONY Z SERIES DAP is coming out in Canada in 4 days ROCK ONNNNNNN!!!!!


----------



## dweaver

I suspect Sony Stores may not carry them but other stores can get them through distribution channel, as Axe is not likely importing these. In any case at $240 this is a great in between option. One thing to note though is the 7550 does not have the same massive fit kit the EX models come with.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jiff said:


> Joker if you ever have a chance you should checkout the Yamaha EPH-100's, they are really, really good and have some BA qualities like in how detailed they are.  The bass is so very nice with good depth, punch and an over all smooth texture.  I'm truly shocked at how good they sound and the fact that there only $115 to $150 depending on where you get them is a fantastic deal and so far the best bang for buck IEM I've heard.


 
   
  The Yamahas seem interesting - their lower-end models are not terrible but clearly tuned for a mainstream sound. The EPH-100 certainly seems different. I take it you would put them above the FXT90s.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They aren't too different - both sound like leaner dynamic-driver earphones. I would have to A:B them for an in-depth comparison but I think the EX600 is a bit more impactful/dynamic and the e-Q5 a bit more analytical, especially in the way detail is presented. Biggest difference is probably in the presentation - the EX-series IEMs are more headphone-like in presentation than any of the MA/BA-based sets I've heard.


 
  Thanks.
   
  How is the treble extension ? Which one is more bright ?


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Thanks.
> 
> How is the treble extension ? Which one is more bright ?


 

 I think EX600 is brighter. Sonys all have more treble presence.
  joker, please confirm this in case I'm wrong.


----------



## olear

IjokerI, I believe you prefer Q7 over Q5? And out of those, would you prefer that vs  EX600?  I believe you prefer the more analytic phone.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Thanks.
> 
> How is the treble extension ? Which one is more bright ?


 

 The EX600 have more treble presence, but on the other hand also more low impact and dynamics to balance out their highs. Like joker said, the Sonys are more headphone-like, but imo not only in presentation, but also in their effortless dynamics and authority.


----------



## Inks

x2 with the above. The\ EX600s are a bit more uneven in response because of that though, despite also having a fairly flat response. This goes back to the treble grain and also to a slower bass response due to the added weight.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Thanks.
> 
> How is the treble extension ? Which one is more bright ?


 


  The EX600 has more emphasis on the lower treble and sounds brighter as a result. Can't fault either on extension - would have to run sweeps on them side by side to know which is better.


  Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, I believe you prefer Q7 over Q5? And out of those, would you prefer that vs  EX600?  I believe you prefer the more analytic phone.


 


  I prefer the e-Q5 over the e-Q7. Not sure if I prefer it over the EX600 - they are rather different in presentation, as james mentioned.


----------



## lostid

Thanks for your latest review on the EX600.
   
  The EX600 was the first pair of IEM's I bought. Although my IE80 is now dominating my classical music, I still enjoy the EX600 very much. It's very fun and entertaining when I listen to all genres of music with the EX600.
   
  Excellent and thorough review as usual. Look forward to your review on IE80 in the near future.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lostid said:


> Thanks for your latest review on the EX600.
> 
> The EX600 was the first pair of IEM's I bought. Although my IE80 is now dominating my classical music, I still enjoy the EX600 very much. It's very fun and entertaining when I listen to all genres of music with the EX600.
> 
> Excellent and thorough review as usual. Look forward to your review on IE80 in the near future.


 


   


 Thanks! No plans for an IE80 at this time but plenty of other interesting sets


----------



## pack21

Joker, first of all thank you for fantastic work on behalf of community.
  
  For vocal acoustic music (voice, chorus, classical guitar, sax, piano) .... what would be the best bet..... EX1000, SM2, SM3 or W4.
   
  to make magic in tracks like this:





   




   
   
   
  Plans to analyze  XBA-4 soon?
   

 Thanks


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





pack21 said:


> Joker, first of all thank you for fantastic work on behalf of community.
> 
> For vocal acoustic music (voice, chorus, classical guitar, sax, piano) .... what would be the best bet..... EX1000, SM2, SM3 or W4.
> 
> ...


 

 Considering first impressions of the XBA-4 has been all over the place I second the request that the XBA-4 get some joker review time


----------



## Photofan1986

Excellent review of the EX600, and your observations match mine.
  A great IEM all in all.


----------



## jiff

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Yamahas seem interesting - their lower-end models are not terrible but clearly tuned for a mainstream sound. The EPH-100 certainly seems different. I take it you would put them above the FXT90s.


 

 Yea I think they sound a bit better than the FXT90's.  They have more detail and better bass in quality and quantity, also the mids are one of the best I've heard in a under $200 IEM.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> The EX600 has more emphasis on the lower treble and sounds brighter as a result. Can't fault either on extension - would have to run sweeps on them side by side to know which is better.


 

  
  All the more I want to try EX600 now.


----------



## olear

Anyone have a chance to hear Sony 7550?


----------



## Flahbah

Hi there, my SE215s have broken and I'm looking for an upgrade, I enjoyed their warm sound as I listen to a lot of metal/jazz but I want a more punchy bass. If anyone has any suggestions as to what to upgrade to that would be great! I like the look of either the Ultimate ears triple fi-10s or the EX600s but I am not the most well informed person at IEMs. Thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pack21 said:


> Joker, first of all thank you for fantastic work on behalf of community.
> 
> For vocal acoustic music (voice, chorus, classical guitar, sax, piano) .... what would be the best bet..... EX1000, SM2, SM3 or W4.
> 
> Plans to analyze  XBA-4 soon?


 



  I still think signature preferences matter more than genre preferences. With the same exact track someone might prefer an SM3 while someone else might like the EX1000 much better (the two couldn't be any more diffent).
   
  If you like a fuller, warmer sound with thicker, more intimate mids - get one of the Earsonics. If you like your sound brighter, more breathy/airy, and presented outside of your head - the EX1000. The W4 is the balancing act - not thin but not too thick, not as open as EX1000 but not as forward as SM3. No bass or treble emphasis, maybe slightly mid-centric. Undoubtedly boring for some so again it depends on what you prefer.

  Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Considering first impressions of the XBA-4 has been all over the place I second the request that the XBA-4 get some joker review time


 

 I've had one for a day now courtesy of mcnoiserdc. I didn't really find it to be very impressive at CES and still I don't find it all that great now but clearly  more listening time is in order.
   


  Quote: 





photofan1986 said:


> Excellent review of the EX600, and your observations match mine.
> A great IEM all in all.


 


  Thanks!


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Anyone have a chance to hear Sony 7550?


 
   
  Dweaver posted some thoughts on the previous page (or the one before), plus there's a 7550 thread out there somewhere.
  
   


  Quote: 





flahbah said:


> Hi there, my SE215s have broken and I'm looking for an upgrade, I enjoyed their warm sound as I listen to a lot of metal/jazz but I want a more punchy bass. If anyone has any suggestions as to what to upgrade to that would be great! I like the look of either the Ultimate ears triple fi-10s or the EX600s but I am not the most well informed person at IEMs. Thank you


 


  The EX600 won't have more punch than an SE215. Maybe consider the FXT90, FX500, or ATH-CKM99?


----------



## music_4321

.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Are the vsonics any good for drum and bass?


----------



## olear

Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> The *MDR*-7550 and *MDR-EX*800ST are exactly the same IEM (the only difference being the latter is sold in Japan/Asia). There is indeed a 7550 thread *and* a few EX800ST reviews/impressions scattered all over the place, *here*'s one of them.
> 
> FWIW, I personally prefer the EX1000, followed very closely by the 7550/EX800 and then the EX600. SQ-wise, all 3 IEMs are definitely members of the same family. To me if, say, I gave the EX1000 a rating of 10.0, the 7550 would get a 9.5, and the EX600 a 9.0. This would, in turn, make the EX600 the best bang-for-the-buck of all three.


 
  Thanks for the link.
  I actually started reading when you first got the 7550 and left off when you received your ex1000 back.  
  Seem different presentation.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Are the vsonics any good for drum and bass?


 


  Sure, if you like your D&B portrayed accurately.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Hey joker I keep forgetting to mention I threw up a review of my Westone 4's recently. Not exactly as well written as your reviews but I thought you might get a kick from it. Let me know what you think all constructive criticism is welcome.


----------



## boost3d

Hey joker new member here searching for a sub $40 IEM for trance and reggae. After doing some research through your thread and ClieOS's thread, Ive limited my search to:
   
  Brainwavz Beta ($28.50)
  Soundmagic E10 ($30)
  Dunu Trident ($35)
  Soundmagic E30 ($36)
  Brainwavz M1 (with preorder its only $34.50)
  Brainwavz ProAlpha ($40)
   
  Out of those which would you recommend or should I be looking at something else? The source will mainly be a laptop and smartphone.


----------



## WakiDabeast

hehe I landed those ex300's for 30 at cowboom but I don't think they have the offer anymore


----------



## miow

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'm looking for great detail, clarity, imaging and no recessed mids with near basshead quality low-end.


 

 That almost describes the Yamaha EPH-100.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Hey joker I keep forgetting to mention I threw up a review of my Westone 4's recently. Not exactly as well written as your reviews but I thought you might get a kick from it. Let me know what you think all constructive criticism is welcome.


 


  I'm not good at critiquing - looks like a very comprehensive and well thought-out review to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. You may want to ask that guy who found like 80 things wrong with the HD668 review in my portable thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


  Quote: 





boost3d said:


> Hey joker new member here searching for a sub $40 IEM for trance and reggae. After doing some research through your thread and ClieOS's thread, Ive limited my search to:
> 
> Brainwavz Beta ($28.50)
> Soundmagic E10 ($30)
> ...


 


  All great choices, really don't think you can make a bad decision there. Unless you want a ton of bass I'd go for the E30, personally. It's a good all-rounder with slightly enhanced bass, good space, and excellent clarity.


  Quote: 





wakidabeast said:


> hehe I landed those ex300's for 30 at cowboom but I don't think they have the offer anymore


 

 I paid less than $10 for my second (refurb'd) pair. A stellar deal as far as sound quality goes but unfortunately that didn't make the j-cord any less annoying so it had to go.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





miow said:


> That almost describes the Yamaha EPH-100.


 

      Thanks. I definitely found my overall Hi-End In Ear. Now moving on to my overall Hi-End Headphones.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





jiff said:


> Yea I think they sound a bit better than the FXT90's.  They have more detail and better bass in quality and quantity, also the mids are one of the best I've heard in a under $200 IEM.


 


   
  Wow!
   
   I took a look at thread relative and it seems from the comments that are used primarily for genre ' Hypnos '; he expressly says that are not suitable for listening to classical music and lack of tremble.
   
   I was attracted, but all these limitations I have dismissed.


----------



## DWbirdseye

Ijokerl,
   
  I'm late to the party having joined a month ago, but this thread is incredibly informative and your careful analysis is greatly appreciated.  I will use this as a decision making tool for my next IEM purchase. I've listened to a few of the higher end universal IEMs and I agree with your evaluations. This is critical because I now have a dependable source that is both trust worthy and credible. Thank you. - Bob


----------



## estreeter

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *DWbirdseye* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I now have a dependable source that is both trust worthy and credible. Thank you. - Bob


 

 We'll be the judge of that, Bob......   
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Seriously, its great to see people spending serious money on a good source in the current financial climate. What's the delivery time on the Puccini stack these days ?
   
  http://www.dcsltd.co.uk/


----------



## olear

I wonder if the longer most people remain in this hobby, the greater chance they will gravitate to a more neutral phone.
  Any truth?


----------



## Flahbah

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The EX600 won't have more punch than an SE215. Maybe consider the FXT90, FX500, or ATH-CKM99?


 


  Thank you for the suggestions, sadly they aren't available here in the UK though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I know they are a completely different breed, but I noticed your glowing review of the Sennheiser 25-IIs on the other thread, do you think they would perform better in bass heavy genres like heavy metal compared to the Shure SE215s which I did really like but found the bass lacking (I've found a used 25-II pair for around half the RRP). Thanks again, appreciate all the hard work you've put into these threads


----------



## Gilly87

Make sure those are real hd25-1 iis, a lot of people get ripped off for the hd25 sp-ii. The ones you want have a split headband.
  
  Quote: 





flahbah said:


> Thank you for the suggestions, sadly they aren't available here in the UK though
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dwbirdseye said:


> Ijokerl,
> 
> I'm late to the party having joined a month ago, but this thread is incredibly informative and your careful analysis is greatly appreciated.  I will use this as a decision making tool for my next IEM purchase. I've listened to a few of the higher end universal IEMs and I agree with your evaluations. This is critical because I now have a dependable source that is both trust worthy and credible. Thank you. - Bob


 
   
  There's no being late to this party 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Glad you've been able to relate to the reviews and make use of the thread!


  Quote: 





flahbah said:


> Thank you for the suggestions, sadly they aren't available here in the UK though
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Bass as presented by a headphone is slightly different from bass as presented by an IEM. The HD25 is more impactful than the SE215 in terms of air moved by the diaphragm but if you're using them in noisy environments some of that punch might be lost because the Shures do isolate better. As Gilly said, make sure the Senns you're looking at are HD25-1s. 
   
  As for IEM availability, I'm afraid you'd have to order the from Japan. The FXT90s and CKM99s are avilable from accessoryjack and the FX500 from seyo-shop.


----------



## Niyologist

???
   
  http://yklee118.blogspot.com/2011/11/jvc-victor-hp-al1000-clip-on-review.html


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Monoprice 8320 / MEP-933
   
  Quote: 





> *(3C21) Monoprice 8320 (MEP-933)*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2012
> ...


----------



## imboden

Nice! Pretty spot-on from my experience.


----------



## Niyologist




----------



## NuckinFutz

Great review Joker!  They really are super smooth, the only negative thought I have is the timbre is off IMO but can't complain......for me they are a 10 for value all day!


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Great review as always.


----------



## Mironov

Does MEElectronics A151 sound good with metal and dubstep?


----------



## Sweden

Any ideas for something with mic and ipod controlls that is good with well produces electronic music, pop, rock and jazz and have great build quality under 150?


----------



## Gryphus0204

On amazon there are a few review saying the cable is stiff and breaks easily, also turning green After a while.... Should these be a concern? As I'm planning to buy it for myself maybe a few months later


----------



## boost3d

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> All great choices, really don't think you can make a bad decision there. Unless you want a ton of bass I'd go for the E30, personally. It's a good all-rounder with slightly enhanced bass, good space, and excellent clarity.


 


  Thanks that is exactly what I was thinking, going with the E30.
   
  But quick question I noticed you put the Monoprice 8320 sound rating at 7.5 and the E30 has a 6.9 rating, is the Monoprice iem sound really better than the E30?


----------



## ravefire

Are the numbers you give weighted? Or in other words, are you saying that (despite the very different sound signature) the Monoprice's are, in your opinion, roughly on par with Monster Turbines? I don't really use the numbers too much but I was just curious about that.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





niyologist said:


>


 


  My reaction exactly. Much higher score than I expected (I was thinking maybe a 6.7 - 7.0) but I totally agree with the review. The Monoprice IEMs have no business sounding as good as they do and if someone is able to get over the pretty poor ergonomics, they'll have an IEM that could very well be the only one anyone ever needs.
   
  Well, anyone who doesn't come to Head-Fi anyway.


----------



## Flahbah

ljokerl said:


> Bass as presented by a headphone is slightly different from bass as presented by an IEM. The HD25 is more impactful than the SE215 in terms of air moved by the diaphragm but if you're using them in noisy environments some of that punch might be lost because the Shures do isolate better. As Gilly said, make sure the Senns you're looking at are HD25-1s.
> 
> As for IEM availability, I'm afraid you'd have to order the from Japan. The FXT90s and CKM99s are avilable from accessoryjack and the FX500 from seyo-shop.


 

 Thank you for all your help for a audio newbie like me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 After reading your review of the FXT90 and various others it sounds perfect for what I'm after, went ahead and ordered them from accessoryjack as someone already snapped up those used Sennheisers!


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





mironov said:


> Does MEElectronics A151 sound good with metal and dubstep?


 

 They won't sound good with dubstep because they lack the bass extension. They should be fine for metal.


----------



## kmhaynes

I'm very sure the Monoproce earphone is the ONLY IEM in |joker|'s list that has a SQ value (7.5/10) that is higher than it's cost in US dollars ($7)!!!  If only the cable weren't so attrocious. 
   
  I didn't care for the extremely open build, so I stuffed some small bits of hose/stocking into the ports on the inside body below the nozzle -- bass punch and clarity has gone up, and the overall focus is much better -- even for $7.  I'm also using the small size 3-flange eartips from MEElec; otherwise I have a hard time getting a good seal, as they rotate/swivel too much; the 3-flange tip goes deeper and stabalizes the movement, and gives me a good seal and clear sound everytime.


----------



## jant71

Seems about right on the score. Never tried the Monoprice but some of the other recent budget phones, the Xeport 5010, Thermaltake Isurus, and the Philips 3580. The CC51 and Xeport 5010 are about equal so a 7.7 score there. I said the Isurus could get an 8 or even more on the Joker scale though I don't subscribe to the AT driver thing(Isurus are a little older than the AT). Dsnuts saying the Philips are better then the Mono's and the Isurus are better still puts the scores right at those levels.  ~$15 gets you near an 8 on the current scale. A year or so ago ~$15 got you an M9 or M6 on sale and you got 5.3 and 5.7.
   
  Maybe there is a 9.5 phone out there for $20-$30. That is why some of still play on all the levels. It is fun and there is that holy grail out there somewhere


----------



## NuckinFutz

jant71 said:


> Seems about right on the score. Never tried the Monoprice but some of the other recent budget phones, the Xeport 5010, Thermaltake Isurus, and the Philips 3580. The CC51 and Xeport 5010 are about equal so a 7.7 score there. I said the Isurus could get an 8 or even more on the Joker scale though I don't subscribe to the AT driver thing(Isurus are a little older than the AT). Dsnuts saying the Philips are better then the Mono's and the Isurus are better still puts the scores right at those levels.  ~$15 gets you near an 8 on the current scale. A year or so ago ~$15 got you an M9 or M6 on sale and you got 5.3 and 5.7.
> 
> Maybe there is a 9.5 phone out there for $20-$30. That is why some of still play on all the levels. It is fun and there is that holy grail out there somewhere




It's all subjective, I would put the monos above the philips myself but i wouldn't put them above the proalpha that only scored 6.7. Mind you I don't have many hours on the monos, not that I subscribe to burn in much anyway. The main point is the monos are a great find and dsnuts should take a bow....nothing comes near them for the price.


----------



## jant71

Yep, it is certainly subjective esp. when the phones are quite close in performance. I like my Panny HJE180 better than the Philips as well which Dsnuts doesn't though that is preference. I think the Philips would score higher but I sold them in favor of the HJE180. Just shows that the scores/SQ levels of these phones are really a bit better than people are thinking preference aside. In another thread, Inks just posted the statement that the Brookstone Clears are "by a fair margin" the best bang for buck. That and the surprise at Joker's score of the Monoprice show some people still aren't taking these budget phones seriously. Something like the Xeport 5010 is clearly a better bargain than the Brookstone and I started the Brookstone thread!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Great review Joker!  They really are super smooth, the only negative thought I have is the timbre is off IMO but can't complain......for me they are a 10 for value all day!


 

 I agree, the timbre is off to my ears as well. Not a big deal for $7 and there's plenty of pricier sets that have worse. 
   


  Quote: 





mironov said:


> Does MEElectronics A151 sound good with metal and dubstep?


 

 I don't think so. Probably not enough bass for dubstep and not enough treble energy to portray metal properly.
   


  Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> Great review as always.


 
   
  Thanks!
   



  Quote: 





sweden said:


> Any ideas for something with mic and ipod controlls that is good with well produces electronic music, pop, rock and jazz and have great build quality under 150?


 

 Westone T1, Shure SE215 + mic accessory, Beyer MMX 101 iE depending on the sound signature you want. All three are pretty good all-rounders, with the Beyers being the bassiest and the Westones - the most balanced/mid-centric. I think all of these have single-button remotes except the Shures.


  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> On amazon there are a few review saying the cable is stiff and breaks easily, also turning green After a while.... Should these be a concern? As I'm planning to buy it for myself maybe a few months later


 

 For which product?
   


  Quote: 





boost3d said:


> Thanks that is exactly what I was thinking, going with the E30.
> 
> But quick question I noticed you put the Monoprice 8320 sound rating at 7.5 and the E30 has a 6.9 rating, is the Monoprice iem sound really better than the E30?


 

 To me it does (with the best possible fit) - better bass control, bit more clarity, less grain, and wider soundstage albeit with poorer depth. I would still recommend the Soundmagics though if you can afford them.
   


  Quote: 





ravefire said:


> Are the numbers you give weighted? Or in other words, are you saying that (despite the very different sound signature) the Monoprice's are, in your opinion, roughly on par with Monster Turbines? I don't really use the numbers too much but I was just curious about that.


 

 The numbers are not weighted so yes, I think the Monoprice are roughly on-par with Turbines. Each will do some things better than the other.
   


  Quote: 





flahbah said:


> Thank you for all your help for a audio newbie like me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Sure thing, hope you like them!
   


  Quote: 





kmhaynes said:


> I'm very sure the Monoproce earphone is the ONLY IEM in |joker|'s list that has a SQ value (7.5/10) that is higher than it's cost in US dollars ($7)!!!  If only the cable weren't so attrocious.
> 
> I didn't care for the extremely open build, so I stuffed some small bits of hose/stocking into the ports on the inside body below the nozzle -- bass punch and clarity has gone up, and the overall focus is much better -- even for $7.  I'm also using the small size 3-flange eartips from MEElec; otherwise I have a hard time getting a good seal, as they rotate/swivel too much; the 3-flange tip goes deeper and stabalizes the movement, and gives me a good seal and clear sound everytime.


 


  That's a fun factoid. 
   
  I can get a stable fit with them using foam tips and putting the housings with the cable exit bulges pointing upward/slightly forward, then looping the cable over-the-ear and tightening it at chin level with a homemade cable cinch. The ridges still hurt my ears after 1-2 hours though.


  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Seems about right on the score. Never tried the Monoprice but some of the other recent budget phones, the Xeport 5010, Thermaltake Isurus, and the Philips 3580. The CC51 and Xeport 5010 are about equal so a 7.7 score there. I said the Isurus could get an 8 or even more on the Joker scale though I don't subscribe to the AT driver thing(Isurus are a little older than the AT). Dsnuts saying the Philips are better then the Mono's and the Isurus are better still puts the scores right at those levels.  ~$15 gets you near an 8 on the current scale. A year or so ago ~$15 got you an M9 or M6 on sale and you got 5.3 and 5.7.
> 
> Maybe there is a 9.5 phone out there for $20-$30. That is why some of still play on all the levels. It is fun and there is that holy grail out there somewhere


 

 I got the SHE3580 as well and I am far, far less impressed with it than the Monoprice. In comparison to the MEP-933 it sounds just like a cheap IEM should - boomy, grainy, harsh, poor treble extension, small soundstage, etc.


----------



## boost3d

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> To me it does (with the best possible fit) - better bass control, bit more clarity, less grain, and wider soundstage albeit with poorer depth. I would still recommend the Soundmagics though if you can afford them.


 


  Thanks still plan on getting the E30 (actually ordered early today) but was curious about those Monoprices, they get alot of praise on here.
   
  Hopefully you get to test out the Audio-Technica ATH-CKM50 too (another $30 IEM getting alot of praise), curious how they would fair in your ranking system.


----------



## Fimbulvetr

I must say I'm surprised @ the Monoprice scoring so high. I figured that Monoprice thread was just a hype machine. Guess I'll have to give this a try then.


----------



## NuckinFutz

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I got the SHE3580 as well and I am far, far less impressed with it than the Monoprice. In comparison to the MEP-933 it sounds just like a cheap IEM should - boomy, grainy, harsh, poor treble extension, small soundstage, etc.


 

 Yep same as.  They sound quite good with EDM but are very V-shaped and the soundstage is ultra narrow.


----------



## NuckinFutz

Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> I must say I'm surprised @ the Monoprice scoring so high. I figured that Monoprice thread was just a hype machine. Guess I'll have to give this a try then.


 

 It's not going to break the bank


----------



## jjmai

How does the monoprice MEP-933's sound signature compare with Etymotic's?
  I couldn't get a good fit with the monoprice, and sounded very airy and lacking in bass - which is how I always imagined Ety would sound (but never actually experienced).


----------



## kmhaynes

^ The Monoprice 933 is fairly balanced as a dynamic earphone, with a warmer, fuller, more musical and slightly wider sound than the Ety house sound.  And while it sounds pretty clear, it falls a good bit behind the Ety, esp ER4, in terms of details and calrity, as you would expect.  But comparing $7 vs $299, the Monoprice is a wonder of an earphone!
   
  The very open build of the housing is what led me to clog up the ports with some very slightly porous material, which closed it in some and tightened and deepened the bass.
   
  The Etymotic HF5 and ER4 both have good bass response, especially clarity and extension, but just not the fullness, body and some impact that is typical with most dynamic drivers.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





> Originariamente inviata da *ljokerl*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 



> jiff said:
> 
> 
> > Yea I think they sound a bit better than the FXT90's.  They have more detail and better bass in quality and quantity, also the mids are one of the best I've heard in a under $200 IEM.
> ...


 
   
 As soon as ordered. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 This is what has prompted me to do so. I hope 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.....


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





joe it said:


> As soon as ordered.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Hope they work out for you.  I myself much prefer the FXT90 over them.


----------



## dogears

There is really something that is going for the dynamic drivers. I still like how my Sony Fontopias sound today. I bought more than 10yrs ago, and nowadays DDIEMs are selling 10x cheaper but the performance as we can see from joker's list is very competitive.
  Hooray for DDs!


----------



## ronnel0918

Great review!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> How does the monoprice MEP-933's sound signature compare with Etymotic's?
> I couldn't get a good fit with the monoprice, and sounded very airy and lacking in bass - which is how I always imagined Ety would sound (but never actually experienced).


 

 If you compare them side by side they're actually pretty different. Etys generally have better soundstage width than depth, like the Monoprice, but they don't sound this open, have some semblance of imaging, and generally tend towards a much more analytical/clinical presentation - very fast attack/decay times, high levels of detail, cooler tonality, etc.

  
  Quote: 





kmhaynes said:


> ^ The Monoprice 933 is fairly balanced as a dynamic earphone, with a warmer, fuller, more musical and slightly wider sound than the Ety house sound.  And while it sounds pretty clear, it falls a good bit behind the Ety, esp ER4, in terms of details and calrity, as you would expect.  But comparing $7 vs $299, the Monoprice is a wonder of an earphone!
> 
> [..]
> 
> The Etymotic HF5 and ER4 both have good bass response, especially clarity and extension, but just not the fullness, body and some impact that is typical with most dynamic drivers.


 
   
  +1
  
   


  Quote: 





ronnel0918 said:


> Great review!


 


  Thanks!


----------



## Selenium

Great review! I actually bought two MP8320s, gave one away as a gift as part of a "secret Santa" thing, to someone in a band who listens to music 7 hours a day. And to this day she's still using bundled earbuds.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  What would be the most appropriate way to choke her?


----------



## TheGame21x

Hehe, I just spent the evening listening to the 8320s while working on a paper and man, I'm still flabbergasted as to how these can possibly be sold for only $7.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Out of the vsonics GR07 and the Sony MDR-EX600... Which would be better for pop,Rock, punk rock and drum and bass? Longevity of the IEM also matters a lot


----------



## Niyologist

Is the Sony MDR-EX600 good for EDM?
   
  P.S: Alright! 400 Pages!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Great review! I actually bought two MP8320s, gave one away as a gift as part of a "secret Santa" thing, to someone in a band who listens to music 7 hours a day. And to this day she's still using bundled earbuds.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 If you wanted, you could get an aftermarket pair of earbuds. The familiar form factor would make the switch easier and the superior sound quality might become apparent over time. That's how I got started - bought a set of KSC75s on a whim and noticed over time that I gravitated towards them over all of my other headphones (for reasons I didn't understand at first)
   
   
  Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> Hehe, I just spent the evening listening to the 8320s while working on a paper and man, I'm still flabbergasted as to how these can possibly be sold for only $7.


 

 It's not the manufacturing costs that make dynamic-driver earphones expensive so I guess an 8320 of some sort was bound to happen sooner or later.
   


  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Out of the vsonics GR07 and the Sony MDR-EX600... Which would be better for pop,Rock, punk rock and drum and bass? Longevity of the IEM also matters a lot


 

 Probably the GR07, definitely prefer it for rock over the EX600. Don't think either is significantly more durable but I only own the GR07;
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Is the Sony MDR-EX600 good for EDM?
> 
> P.S: Alright! 400 Pages!


 

 As good as a reasonably balanced-sounding in-ear can be IMO but you might be better off asking someone who listens primarily to EDM.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Because there has been some review on amazon complaining about the stiff cable and it breaking easily , also turning green should I be worried about this?


----------



## franklyshankly

ljokerl, any plans to review the yamaha eph-100? maybe compare it against the GR07 which it seems to be dethroning in terms of best sound for under $200.


----------



## Mironov

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think so. Probably not enough bass for dubstep and not enough treble energy to portray metal properly.


 

 Could you suggest any IEM's that sounds good in both genre that only costs $50-70?


----------



## Gilly87

Having multiple friends who make a living as musicians, a girlfriend who graduated from one of the most prestigious music schools in the world, and every day exposure to aspiring professional musicians, I have noticed that many of them prefer "crappy" headphones, and when prodded, a number of them have responded that it is because they want to know what their music will sound like to their audience.
   
  My girlfriend, a classically trained vocalist, is actually a really big fan of my MS400. Vocals on MS400 = love 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





selenium said:


> Great review! I actually bought two MP8320s, gave one away as a gift as part of a "secret Santa" thing, to someone in a band who listens to music 7 hours a day. And to this day she's still using bundled earbuds.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Hope they work out for you.  I myself much prefer the FXT90 over them.


 


   
  At the moment the fxt90 is  my  preferred iem.
   
  If he had a greater sub bass and a slightly greater articulation, i could not ask for more.
   
  What do you prefer for the JVC compared to Yammy?


----------



## Dsnuts

Thanks for your favorable review on the MP8320..I knew one day these would be on the map. Thanks to all the guys on the Mp8320 thread that help get these noticed. Love them Mp8320s.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Because there has been some review on amazon complaining about the stiff cable and it breaking easily , also turning green should I be worried about this?


 

 I wouldn't put too much stock in the 1-star Amazon reviews, as they seem to be mostly flame posts. I've only heard of one case of someone's GR07s breaking, and that was the old model, which has since been replaced with an updated model with a better cable. My cables have turned green, but no one has reported any change in sound because of it, and I actually think it looks kind of classy, though that could just be me rationalizing.


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





joe it said:


> At the moment the fxt90 is  my  preferred iem.
> 
> If he had a greater sub bass and a slightly greater articulation, i could not ask for more.
> 
> What do you prefer for the JVC compared to Yammy?


 

 The fxt90 has a wider soundstage and more importantly, to me, it has much better instrument realism. The fxt90 timbre and musicality are what make it special.


----------



## nyonya

I have been enjoying my FXT90s for a couple months now - the best earphones I've heard, but then again I haven't heard an awful lot.  I keep getting the itch to try the GR07s - anyone want to push me to either of them?  Is the isolation any better on the Vsonics?  I listen mostly to classic rock (Dire Straits, Pink Floyd), metal (Led Zeppelin, Iron Maiden) and heavy metal (Iced Earth, Metallica).  Thanks!


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> The fxt90 has a wider soundstage and more importantly, to me, it has much better instrument realism. The fxt90 timbre and musicality are what make it special.


 
   

  Agree completely.
   
   I think with the JVC is a total immersion. To raise the volume  Somehow this can be fatiguing.
   
   No intention to have lost it. 
   
   I thought the Yamaha EPH-100 for use on the road, in the hope that these new micro-drivers will also keep something positive.
   
   

  
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> I have been enjoying my FXT90s for a couple months now - the best earphones I've heard, but then again I haven't heard an awful lot.  I keep getting the itch to try the GR07s - anyone want to push me to either of them?  Is the isolation any better on the Vsonics?  I listen mostly to classic rock (Dire Straits, Pink Floyd), metal (Led Zeppelin, Iron Maiden) and heavy metal (Iced Earth, Metallica).  Thanks!


 

  
  Yamaha EPH-100 should have better isolation, but wasn't this demand, and in any case I haven't heard.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





franklyshankly said:


> ljokerl, any plans to review the yamaha eph-100? maybe compare it against the GR07 which it seems to be dethroning in terms of best sound for under $200.


 

 No plans at this time
   


  Quote: 





mironov said:


> Could you suggest any IEM's that sounds good in both genre that only costs $50-70?


 

 Reasonably balanced: Soundmagic E30, Beyer DTX 71 iE
   
   
  Bass-heavy/v-shaped: Fischer Audio Consonance, id America Spark, Soundmagic E10
   
  Would take any of these over the A151 for rock or dubstep
   
   


  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> I have been enjoying my FXT90s for a couple months now - the best earphones I've heard, but then again I haven't heard an awful lot.  I keep getting the itch to try the GR07s - anyone want to push me to either of them?  Is the isolation any better on the Vsonics?  I listen mostly to classic rock (Dire Straits, Pink Floyd), metal (Led Zeppelin, Iron Maiden) and heavy metal (Iced Earth, Metallica).  Thanks!


 


 Not a huge upgrade in terms of isolation and pretty different in signature so if you like the FXT90s they may be a pretty drastic changeover.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> I wouldn't put too much stock in the 1-star Amazon reviews, as they seem to be mostly flame posts. I've only heard of one case of someone's GR07s breaking, and that was the old model, which has since been replaced with an updated model with a better cable. My cables have turned green, but no one has reported any change in sound because of it, and I actually think it looks kind of classy, though that could just be me rationalizing.


 


   
  Oh really? Than the vsonics are the ones I'm gonna get


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not a huge upgrade in terms of isolation and pretty different in signature so if you like the FXT90s they may be a pretty drastic changeover.


 


  Yes, but I used to like the HF5s...and the SuperFreqs (3-way BA custom from a now-defunct company), and before that the Creative EP-630, so I'm ok with a change in sound. In your opinion ljokerl, which of these (FXT90 or GR07) work better for my preferred genres? Any other 'phones I should look at? My price range is pretty flexible, but I'm keenly aware of diminishing returns.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Yes, but I used to like the HF5s...and the SuperFreqs (3-way BA custom from a now-defunct company), and before that the Creative EP-630, so I'm ok with a change in sound. In your opinion ljokerl, which of these (FXT90 or GR07) work better for my preferred genres? Any other 'phones I should look at? My price range is pretty flexible, but I'm keenly aware of diminishing returns.


 


  I think they are a little too different to compare. The GR07 wide/more distant in presentation, thinner, cooler in tone, etc. I listen in large part to the same stuff you do. The GR07 hits closer to my preferred signature in the lows and mids but I prefer the treble of the FXT90.


----------



## Mironov

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Reasonably balanced: Soundmagic E30, Beyer DTX 71 iE
> 
> 
> Bass-heavy/v-shaped: Fischer Audio Consonance, id America Spark, Soundmagic E10
> ...


 

  Thank you so much!!! i will get the E30 maybe tomorrow.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, I read in your review that VSonic split, what company those become?
  I'm new in head-fi world, sorry if this question is outdated


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, I read in your review that VSonic split, what company those become?
> I'm new in head-fi world, sorry if this question is outdated


 


  VSonic and ViSang (who are also the OEM for the Brainwavz ProAlpha/M1/M2/M3)


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> VSonic and ViSang (who are also the OEM for the Brainwavz ProAlpha/M1/M2/M3)


 

 Thx for the reply =)
   
  In China the Brainwavz Beta and Visang R02 is the same price, which is 30$, which one do you recommend for the same price?


----------



## Xinn3r

Ah, by the way, I will be using it for mainly listening from my iTouch, and I don't use an amp....
  So which one do you recommend for day to day use?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Thx for the reply =)
> 
> In China the Brainwavz Beta and Visang R02 is the same price, which is 30$, which one do you recommend for the same price?


 


  Different sound signatures despite the similar performance level. The R02 is warm and smooth, the Beta is crisp and sparkly, but with good bass impact. Worth noting is that the R02 is built better and has higher isolation.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm curious. How does the FX500 Vs. EX600 go in terms of Soundstage/Instrument Separation?


----------



## olear

IjokerI, among all the universals you've heard, which two would you choose to
  listen to rock and which two for pop (E.John, Beatles, B.Joel, Eagles) ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'm curious. How does the FX500 Vs. EX600 go in terms of Soundstage/Instrument Separation?


 

 The EX600 has a broader/wider/more out-of-the-head soundstage while the FX500 has a more spherical presentation with its depth closer to its width. I thought the separation on the EX600 was better but not a large margin. 
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, among all the universals you've heard, which two would you choose to
> listen to rock and which two for pop (E.John, Beatles, B.Joel, Eagles) ?


 

 Are you asking for a recommendation or my personal opinion? Because as I've said before I don't think genre preferences and signature preferences necessarily coincide. I know there are people out there who listen to rap and hip-hop with Etys and have no complaints. Personally, I would probably pick the EX1000 and W4 for rock as they are rather good compliments without making each other sound absolutely terrible (as the SM3 and EX1000 would). I don't listen to pop on my own time.


----------



## Xinn3r

Hi Joker,
  I've found yet another IEM I'm interested in, before buying I just wanna check, how does the soundmagic E10 stack against Visang R02?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> it should terrify much more than just your wallet! if there turns out to be a super incredible ridiculously good iem at *$400* then what choice do we have really..
> 
> but if not..then your loss (your wallet that is) is our gain (being more reviews )


 

 Looking back to the beginning of the thread, I find this post in particular rather amusing...


----------



## jarrett

What might you recommend, along the lines of the GR07 being my favourite, as a sidegrade or something comparable to the GR07? I'm thinking something a little more edgy with a touch more presence in the treble. The GR07 really are perfect for me, just wondering what you might have to say. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  The headphones I own are listed in my signature


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> What might you recommend, along the lines of the GR07 being my favourite, as a sidegrade or something comparable to the GR07? I'm thinking something a little more edgy with a touch more presence in the treble. The GR07 really are perfect for me, just wondering what you might have to say.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  The FXT90s should work well for that - what price range were you looking at?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Hi Joker,
> I've found yet another IEM I'm interested in, before buying I just wanna check, how does the soundmagic E10 stack against Visang R02?


 

 More bass punch, more treble, better space. Between those two I would go for the E10 unless you are worried that the signature will be too colored for you.
   

  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Looking back to the beginning of the thread, I find this post in particular rather amusing...


 

 Agreed, I always chuckle at it when I scroll too far. I believe when I moved here from v. 1 of this thread the CK10 was the most expensive earphone tested (and it was cheaper back then than it is now, too).
   


  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> What might you recommend, along the lines of the GR07 being my favourite, as a sidegrade or something comparable to the GR07? I'm thinking something a little more edgy with a touch more presence in the treble. The GR07 really are perfect for me, just wondering what you might have to say.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Sony EX600, JVC FX500, maybe even ATH-CKM99.


----------



## gjohnst4

I have such an itch to upgrade my IEM's. I recently jumped up to the LCD-2 for my home rig, and now I want to upgrade my (portable) Triple.fi's....Before I do, I want to hear your impressions! I will continue to wait patiently, and once again, thanks for all the hard work. If it takes long enough for me to save enough to buy Unique Melody's Merlins, so be it!
   
  To hold me over, considering a trade for FXT90's, to give dual dynamics a try.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gjohnst4 said:


> I have such an itch to upgrade my IEM's. I recently jumped up to the LCD-2 for my home rig, and now I want to upgrade my (portable) Triple.fi's....Before I do, I want to hear your impressions! I will continue to wait patiently, and once again, thanks for all the hard work. If it takes long enough for me to save enough to buy Unique Melody's Merlins, so be it!
> 
> To hold me over, considering a trade for FXT90's, to give dual dynamics a try.


 

  The FXT90 is probably a good idea and a solid gauge of what a modern dynamic can do for a moderately low price. I was lucky enough to hear the LCD-2 out of an Anedio D1 side by side with my Miracle and it was a close call. Any universal IEM would probably be a step down but if you can get used to IEM presentation you may be surprised at how close something like a $350 FX700 can get to a properly amped LCD-2 in a number of areas.


----------



## maverickronin

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> if you can get used to IEM presentation you may be surprised at how close something like a $350 FX700 can get to a properly amped LCD-2 in a number of areas.


 

 I agree with that.  I think the mid to high-ish end IEMs I've heard are better than almost all full size 'phones I've heard in the same price range.  In that range I think the only thing full size 'phones do better at is a larger soundstage.
   
  Also, FWIW I haven't heard tons of IEMs but I have heard most all of the popular "mid-fi" 'phones and owned many of them at one time.  I went though many different pairs trying to find something that I liked as much as my SE530s and I found it surprisingly difficult.
   
  I wouldn't know if the superiority of IEMs would continue up to the high end because while I've heard a few different flagship level 'phones I've only ever heard one demo CIEM and have never owned any either.  With that experience I can say that I don't think even mid level universals are embarrassed by high end full size 'phones like the LCD-2.  For example, I'd describe the LCD-2 as an SE530 with better soundstage, better treble extension, and tactile bass impact.  I think the SE530s manage to hold their own in other areas and though its getting a little hazy since I haven't heard the LCD-2 in a while I think I remember the SE530s being slightly superior in the preciseness of imaging.


----------



## Painful Chafe

Another great review with the Monoprice MEP-933's. I picked them up to just see if an $8 IEM can actually sound good. They sound for the price is pretty amazing. I am a sucker for midrange. You accurately described its midrange as "crisp and clean". I'm also prefer a more laid back treble, but not lacking treble which describes the MEP's.
   
  The housings are pretty ridiculously big and it takes a little effort to get them in and sealed. But once in, I am able to use them as my "sleeping" IEM. They are actually really good for this because I think they sound even better at low volume. The top end does get a bit "smeary" when things get fast(cymbals) as you described, but not notably at low volumes.


----------



## vwinter

Quote:


> Originally Posted by ClieOS
> 
> 
> Not Though an interesting point I think most people missed - the Monoprice 8320 [MEP-933] is the flagship of OVC China released about 2 years ago. Monoprice is probably selling it as an OEM product from OVC (which is what OVC main business is)



   
  Thought it would be good to have this here for background.


----------



## Gryphus0204

I just received my meeelectronics M-6 and I must say this are good. But how would the mono price 8320 fair against it and also the vsonics GR07


----------



## Ryolith

what would be the purpose of having two dynamic drivers in the fxt90?


----------



## miow

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Out of the vsonics GR07 and the Sony MDR-EX600... Which would be better for pop,Rock, punk rock and drum and bass? Longevity of the IEM also matters a lot


 

 EX-500


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





maverickronin said:


> I think the SE530s manage to hold their own in other areas and though its getting a little hazy since I haven't heard the LCD-2 in a while I think I remember the SE530s being slightly superior in the preciseness of imaging.


 

 Imaging in IEMs vs headphones is an interesting subject. To me quite a few high-end IEMs provide a more singular sonic image with a good on-center feel. However, they also maintain the ability to position things accurately, which would be lost if, for example, stereo separation was gone. Some still do have a high degree of left-right separation in the way they present music (Sony EX600/EX1000, for example) and that gives them more of a headphone-like feel.
   


  Quote: 





painful chafe said:


> Another great review with the Monoprice MEP-933's. I picked them up to just see if an $8 IEM can actually sound good. They sound for the price is pretty amazing. I am a sucker for midrange. You accurately described its midrange as "crisp and clean". I'm also prefer a more laid back treble, but not lacking treble which describes the MEP's.
> 
> The housings are pretty ridiculously big and it takes a little effort to get them in and sealed. But once in, I am able to use them as my "sleeping" IEM. They are actually really good for this because I think they sound even better at low volume. The top end does get a bit "smeary" when things get fast(cymbals) as you described, but not notably at low volumes.


 

 Thanks!
   
  I agree that most of the 'problems' with the Monoprice wouldn't even be worth mentioning if it performed like a standard $7 IEM in key areas but it doesn't, so it gets matched up against higher-end gear until the flaws begin to show.

  
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Thought it would be good to have this here for background.


 

 Nothing surprising about that aside from the MEP-933 being OVC's flagship. Every product has an OEMs and OVC's a pretty big one from what I've read. They had a few of their own headphones come up as a blip on the Head-Fi radar a few years ago but those are long forgotten.

  
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> I just received my meeelectronics M-6 and I must say this are good. But how would the mono price 8320 fair against it and also the vsonics GR07


 

 In terms of accuracy and fidelity the M6 wouldn't do so well. It's a v-shaped sound to the flatter profile of the GR07 / Monoprice and will sound bass- and treble-happy in comparison. Put it another way, if you like the signature of the M6 I would not recommend the GR07 or 8320 as a direct upgrade since they have a different signature. Naturally, they also have better clarity, detail, bass control, smoothness, etc. compared to the M6.
   


  Quote: 





ryolith said:


> what would be the purpose of having two dynamic drivers in the fxt90?


 

 Same as that of any other dual dynamic, I imagine - to be able to tune each driver to its strengths while having the other cover for the weaknesses (in the ideal scenario, at least). The FXT90's diaphragms are made of different materials, which should have different sonic properties. It's the same reason Radius, Moshi, and others use two different-sized dynamic drivers in their sets - the bigger one for bass/mids and the smaller one for treble. AFAIK the Fischer Tandem is the only dual with two identical drivers but they are physically offset from one another inside the shell.


----------



## Painful Chafe

Quote: 





ryolith said:


> what would be the purpose of having two dynamic drivers in the fxt90?


 


  According to JVC they use two different drivers without crossovers to help cover the spectrum better. One driver handles mids and up and the other is mids and down.


----------



## Katun

Aware of any IEMs that share the PX100-II's sound signature?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





katun said:


> Aware of any IEMs that share the PX100-II's sound signature?


 


  Sure - give the Brookstone Clear Dual-Drive a try.


----------



## Mironov

any plans on doing a review of Superlux HD381F?


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, I just realized that you have put the "SHE 3580" on your planned list, I am really looking forward to this particular IEM review, even after buying more expensive IEM's, the SHE 3580 is still one of my favorite IEM, especially with the price so low


----------



## Gryphus0204

So what IEM would you recommend for a direct upgrade? I would like something under $200..... The reason I like my M6 are because maybe I like the sounds signature as you said... But one problem I have with the m6 is because when singers sing the S-synonym(I don't know the right word sorry noob) it's kinda ear piercing....... Is this a dynamic range problem? My main genres are drum and bass, pop, rock and punk rock so maybe if any of the IEM are better for this genres a change of sound signature is always ok


----------



## blub

wow!, that was some reading! (and I still haven't (and probably couldn't ever) read everything in this immense thread  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 )
  Thanks for the huge amount of info!
   
  Reading through this review-list (and some others), I've narrowed my search for *my first IEM*'s to the following 3 models:

 Shure se215
 Westone 1
 HifiMan RE262
   
  ... as you might suspect, I'm looking for IEM's within the price-range of *$/€  85-150*, with some preference for *good isolation and comfort*.
  It will be my first IEM's, for listening a few hours in a row and I would prefer not to have to insert them tó deep...which I suspect to be a difficult criterium as I also would like good isolation   Therefore I'm looking at 'ergo-fit' IEM's.
  I'm mainly looking for IEM's to use while *travelling/commuting* (train/metro/airplane), which for me means comfort, isolation and build quality...next to sound quality. As I won't use them in 'quiet' environments such as at work, at home, I suspect high-end, very expensive IEM's would be over-kill.
  I listen to quite some *differente genres of music*, but mainly (classic) rock, pop, jazz (all live & studio-recordings) and classical music. (not so much to R&B, rap or hip-hop). Therefore, I'm looking for versatile IEM's with good presentation, rather than e.g. bass-head-IEM's.
   
  My current headphones are the Yuin G2 (e.g. at work), Sennheiser MX880 (e.g. walking/on the move, lightweight) (both thanks to reading head-fi !) and Sony MDR-7056 (e.g. at home). I really like them all, considering their respective price-performance ratio for their use, but non of them fit the bill for light-weight commuting, thus my research for IEM's. I understand I wont get the same *presentation (3D, soundstage, separation,...)* from IEM's, but hope to find the right balance as that is a very important factor for me to have a good time listening to music.
   
I really like the RE262 from what I'm reading about its sound quality and presentation, but their build quality and comfort worry me!! I might misinterprate the reviews, but is it correct that the bi-flanges from the RE262 are less comfortable and need deeper insertion than the Westone 1 or Shure se215, while offering the same or less isolation?
   
  I think I might be asking to much for my budget, but will take satisfaction from the best balance I can get between those criteria. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Could anyone give his thoughts on the choice between these 3 headphones, if possible from direct experience!?
   
  Thanks in advance!!


----------



## jarrett

Thanks above by the way, I added the Sony EX600 and JVC FXT90 to my wishlist


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mironov said:


> any plans on doing a review of Superlux HD381F?


 

 Not at this time.
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, I just realized that you have put the "SHE 3580" on your planned list, I am really looking forward to this particular IEM review, even after buying more expensive IEM's, the SHE 3580 is still one of my favorite IEM, especially with the price so low


 


  My SHE3580 is not a loan so the review won't be finished for some time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I do vastly prefer the Monoprice to it and from initial listening would expect the Philips to rate somewhere around the higher-up MEElec M-series sets, which is still great for $12.


  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> So what IEM would you recommend for a direct upgrade? I would like something under $200..... The reason I like my M6 are because maybe I like the sounds signature as you said... But one problem I have with the m6 is because when singers sing the S-synonym(I don't know the right word sorry noob) it's kinda ear piercing....... Is this a dynamic range problem? My main genres are drum and bass, pop, rock and punk rock so maybe if any of the IEM are better for this genres a change of sound signature is always ok


 

 You're thinking of sibilance. If you have an EQ you can probably get rid of it with a treble cut. Otherwise different tips or some foam in the nozzle should fix it. If you like the M6 I would go for something more fun and colored-sounding than a GR07 - maybe an FXT90.
   
   
  Quote: 





blub said:


> wow!, that was some reading! (and I still haven't (and probably couldn't ever) read everything in this immense thread
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Isolation and insertion depth are pretty much always a tradeoff. With single-flange tips the RE262 doesn't really insert any deeper than the W1 or SE215 and with the over-the-ear wear style I don't think the three are that far apart in comfort. Personally I actually prefer the RE262/RE272 fit to Shures. With bi-flanges your do get deeper insertion but you gain more isolation, same as you would by using triples with the W1 or SE215. With the same type of tips the isolation difference won't be too big, so unless that's priority #1 I wouldn't worry about it with these three. The RE262 is a tier higher in SQ, though, at least in my experience, so unless isolation is vastly more important than sound quality I'd go for the HiFiMan.


----------



## dogears

No posts found for "aurisonics".   
  I hope you get a pair soon chief


----------



## olear

IjokerI, is the SM3 darker than IE8? Thanks


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> My SHE3580 is not a loan so the review won't be finished for some time
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Not a problem, will gladly sit around and wait for you to finish the review 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Ah... I see... Too bad I live in China, the shipping price for the Monoprice is 3x the IEM price... I'll try to find the OEM though...
  Yeah... here in China it's only around 7-10$, for that price, it's hard to beat the value! Guess I'll be buying a few more


----------



## vaed

Hey |joker|! What would you reccomend for an fast, edgy/aggressive IEM with a decent-awesome soundstage/isolation? Maybe an IEM equivalent to an HD-25 1-ii or a Grado, with forward upper-mids and sparkly treble? I've been reccomended the TF10's, but I've heard they have recessed mids; I've been reccomended the GR07, but I think they might be too balanced/neutral sounding; the FX500's were sounding great until you mentioend the isolation. Any tips?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dogears said:


> No posts found for "aurisonics".
> I hope you get a pair soon chief


 

 Only heard of them last week. Sent the company an email but never got a response. Perhaps someone will loan me a set down the line.

  
  Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, is the SM3 darker than IE8? Thanks


 


  Yes. The IE8 actually has pretty clean and extended treble.


----------



## Ryolith

maybe look into the fxt90


----------



## blub

thanks ljokerl for the very straight and clear advice!!
   
  Isolation is not my n°1consideration, but as I will use them (almost) only on public transport, it is an important factor I should balance out with comfort (I'm not used to IEM's...), SQ and build quality (as it is for travelling:light-weight & compact, taking it everywhere).
   
  I was wondering, as I often read about the 'Shure olive'-tips to be the most comfortable with good isolation, also on other headphones, if these can be used on the RE262 and if this would make a difference (better) comfort-wise and on sound-isolation?
   
  I've also read in your review that the RE262 does take considerable advantage from an dedicated amp. As I will use it mainly with my Sansa Fuze (and sometimes with my laptop), I was wondering how far to go amp-wise, reaching from the Fiio E6 through the iBasso D-zero or T5 onto the Fiio E17. Of course, I have to decide between amp and DAC+amp, but was wondering if any of those would fit the bill and make a considerable difference with my Sansa Fuze. Do you have any advice on that?
   
  ...so far, RE262 takes the leap for me (especially because of what I read about its presentation/soundstage/space), followed by the Westone 1 and then Shure se215. If I can get over my comfort and build quality worries about the RE262 (I might be wrong on this...), it's gonna be the re262.
  I'm getting closer!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks!!


----------



## Gryphus0204

So for under 200 and for rock,pop,punk rock and drum and bass you would recommend the FXT90? The review looks good too. and what tips would you recommend for the M6? Cause I am currently using the given tips.... Are the give tips suppose to be good?


----------



## snailmale

Any intention to review the Xears TD4? I have them and really like them. According to others who have owned the TD-III and TD4, the sound is different due to the thicker cable (which reduces the amount of air that is vented through the strain reliefs.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker,
  I was wondering, what's the most analytical (true to the source) IEM for under 50$?
   
  How bout the Etymotic MC5? It seems you're not very fond of them in your review, albeit giving them a (9/10) value...
  I'm asking because I can get an Etymotic MC5 for around 60$ now...
  I was thinking of getting the ECCI PR401, but I just bought a Visang R03, so I was thinking of getting a more analytical IEM, what do you think about this?


----------



## olear

Since they are both V shaped, how does the W3 compare with FX700?  Which one is the better sounding phone?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blub said:


> thanks ljokerl for the very straight and clear advice!!
> 
> Isolation is not my n°1consideration, but as I will use them (almost) only on public transport, it is an important factor I should balance out with comfort (I'm not used to IEM's...), SQ and build quality (as it is for travelling:light-weight & compact, taking it everywhere).
> 
> ...


 

 You would have to de-core the Olive and mount it on a different tip stem. I would recommend trying the stock tips first before deciding if you need to bother with aftermarket ones. I am not familiar with the modern crop of amps - don't have the time to look into them. You would probably want to go beyond the E6 but you may want to ask current RE262 owners about their experience.
   


  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> So for under 200 and for rock,pop,punk rock and drum and bass you would recommend the FXT90? The review looks good too.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The FXT90 is as good a choice as any IMO, as long the signature appeals to you.
   
  The M6 I liked with Sony Hybrids, Comply T500s, de-cored Olives, and also stock triple-flanges with the smallest flange cut off. The stock tips are mostly fine but the singles didn't seal as well as Hybrids for me. My M6 is from before they included the A151 bi-flanges.
   


  Quote: 





snailmale said:


> Any intention to review the Xears TD4? I have them and really like them. According to others who have owned the TD-III and TD4, the sound is different due to the thicker cable (which reduces the amount of air that is vented through the strain reliefs.


 

 No plans at this time. Everything I plan to review is listed on the front page of this thread, below the table.
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker,
> I was wondering, what's the most analytical (true to the source) IEM for under 50$?
> 
> How bout the Etymotic MC5? It seems you're not very fond of them in your review, albeit giving them a (9/10) value...
> ...


 

 I actually thought the new EtyKids sounded quite good, not overly analytical but still very balanced. Another one that comes to mind immediately is the Xears XR120 Pro.
   


  Quote: 





olear said:


> Since they are both V shaped, how does the W3 compare with FX700?  Which one is the better sounding phone?


 

 Despite some similarities in signature, one is a armature and one is dynamic so they sound pretty different on the whole - note thickness, tone, timbre, etc. IMO the FX700 is the better-sounding phone.


----------



## Gilly87

Joker have you heard about the Aurisonics ASG-1? It already has quite a few votes as one of the best universals out there, drawing comparisons to top tier phones like FX700 and SM3, even garnering comparison to the 1964-Q customs.
   
  I've compiled a list of reviews here if you're interested:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/589520/aurisonics-impressions-and-reviews/795#post_8166473
   
  The hype train is soon to be in full swing, I'm sure, but from the looks of it, the train may actually be headed somewhere...


----------



## dogears

^@Gilly: his reply to my post #6038 
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Only heard of them last week. Sent the company an email but never got a response. Perhaps someone will loan me a set down the line.


----------



## Gilly87

Whoops! My bad. I wonder if he e-mailed Aurisonics directly or Matt at Springtree?
   
  Quote: 





dogears said:


> ^@Gilly: his reply to my post #6038


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You would have to de-core the Olive and mount it on a different tip stem. I would recommend trying the stock tips first before deciding if you need to bother with aftermarket ones. I am not familiar with the modern crop of amps - don't have the time to look into them. You would probably want to go beyond the E6 but you may want to ask current RE262 owners about their experience.
> 
> 
> The FXT90 is as good a choice as any IMO, as long the signature appeals to you.
> ...


 


 Thanks IjolerI


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I actually thought the new EtyKids sounded quite good, not overly analytical but still very balanced. Another one that comes to mind immediately is the Xears XR120 Pro.


 


  Did my eyes just fail me? The EtyKids has 300 Ohm Impendance? How hard will it be to drive?


----------



## tseliottt

How would you compare the sound of the Atrios to the FX700s? I just bought the MG7s, and I really love the bass on them. Compared to my ER4s though, they lack a certain realism in vocals and some instruments. I already know that the FX700s are renowned in their timbre, so I'm wondering how the bass stacks up to the Atrios. Do they have the same impact and depth?


----------



## Gryphus0204

Or is there a one that is slightly above 200 and is better than the FXT-90


----------



## dosley01

ljokerl is there a IEM that would be very similar to the ATH-ESW9?  I can do up to tier 1B.  Thanks!


----------



## Shufny

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  That's the point, so it won't go above ~92 dB SPL with a Clip+, which Etymotic thinks is loud enough with proper isolation, and I agree.
 The intresting thing is Golden Ears measured 187 ohms instead. (that's 2dB more, so doesn't really matter)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Whoops! My bad. I wonder if he e-mailed Aurisonics directly or Matt at Springtree?


 

 Aurisonics
   

   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Did my eyes just fail me? The EtyKids has 300 Ohm Impendance? How hard will it be to drive?


 

 Well, it's one of the two simple ways to limit the output volume with portable devices. UE took a different route with their 'loud enough' line, keeping standard impedance but dropping the sensitivity down to 80dB or so. I like Ety's approach better. They actually went plenty loud with my J3 but not so much that kids could blow their ears. There are also more complicated spl reduction methods such as the circuit used by dB Logic on the EP-100 and HP-100. 
   


  Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> How would you compare the sound of the Atrios to the FX700s? I just bought the MG7s, and I really love the bass on them. Compared to my ER4s though, they lack a certain realism in vocals and some instruments. I already know that the FX700s are renowned in their timbre, so I'm wondering how the bass stacks up to the Atrios. Do they have the same impact and depth?


 

 The Atrios are have mostly deep bass while the FX700 strikes a nice balance between deep bass and mid-bass. Mid-bass impact is actually greater in the FX700. Both have great depth but the Atrio will appear to have more sub-bass because only the sub-bass is really emphasized.

  
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Or is there a one that is slightly above 200 and is better than the FXT-90


 

 I feel like you're sort of shooting blindly here. Trying to pick a higher-end IEM straight from the budget stuff is always tricky. The FXT90 is a pretty safe choice, for a significant upgrade you'd be shelling out $350 on an FX700 or something to that effect.
   


  Quote: 





dosley01 said:


> ljokerl is there a IEM that would be very similar to the ATH-ESW9?  I can do up to tier 1B.  Thanks!


 

 None that I know of. What are the things you like about the ESW9?


----------



## dosley01

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> None that I know of. What are the things you like about the ESW9?


 

 I really enjoy their warm, tube like lush mids, bass is good and I like their slightly rolled off top end, it makes sibilance a non-issue.  Predominantly I use them for female vocals, Diana Krall, Eva Cassidy, Norah Jones, etc... IMHO, it's what they do best as colored as they are.  I have the ES7 and my IEMS for "fun" genres.  Just looking for a "soothing" IEM.  My IE8s with silicone custom ear molds come close but the silicone has shrank over time and no longer fits as well as it should.  IE8s with silicone tips are not cutting it otherwise.  I have a pair of MDR-EX600s running through a burn in playlist and with Complys on, they might be close but they are also a similar sound signature to the IE8 so I'm not sure if I will keep them.
   
  Maybe the RE262 or MD Tributes?


----------



## pack21

It's a pleasure read this thread, seeing @Ijokerl replying day after day constructively to everyone without discrimination.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Oh.... So the fxt-90 it is for me then


----------



## vaed

Hey |joker|, I know it's incredibly difficult to compare a portable headphone to an IEM, but I was wondering how you would compare the FXT90 sound signature to that of the HD 25-1 ii? They both appear to be fairly forward in a grado-like way, which is what interests me about them both. I'm assuming that isolation is similar (since you drew the comparison of the hd25's isolation to that of shallow ergonomic buds), anything else you can elucidate? Or am is this comparison too appley-orangey?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dosley01 said:


> I really enjoy their warm, tube like lush mids, bass is good and I like their slightly rolled off top end, it makes sibilance a non-issue.  Predominantly I use them for female vocals, Diana Krall, Eva Cassidy, Norah Jones, etc... IMHO, it's what they do best as colored as they are.  I have the ES7 and my IEMS for "fun" genres.  Just looking for a "soothing" IEM.  My IE8s with silicone custom ear molds come close but the silicone has shrank over time and no longer fits as well as it should.  IE8s with silicone tips are not cutting it otherwise.  I have a pair of MDR-EX600s running through a burn in playlist and with Complys on, they might be close but they are also a similar sound signature to the IE8 so I'm not sure if I will keep them.
> 
> Maybe the RE262 or MD Tributes?


 

 Those two would be my choice as well. Keep in mind that the MD has more bass than an ESW9, to the point where it can get slightly overbearing, and the RE262 has less to the point where you may have to EQ it. If you're used to getting IE8-level bass from your in-ears, the MD is probably the better choice though it lacks the large headstage of the IE8.
   


  Quote: 





pack21 said:


> It's a pleasure read this thread, seeing @Ijokerl replying day after day constructively to everyone without discrimination.


 

 Oh but we really don't want your kind here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   

  
  Quote: 





vaed said:


> Hey |joker|, I know it's incredibly difficult to compare a portable headphone to an IEM, but I was wondering how you would compare the FXT90 sound signature to that of the HD 25-1 ii? They both appear to be fairly forward in a grado-like way, which is what interests me about them both. I'm assuming that isolation is similar (since you drew the comparison of the hd25's isolation to that of shallow ergonomic buds), anything else you can elucidate? Or am is this comparison too appley-orangey?


 
   
   
  Well the FXT90 has pretty forward mids, for one, while the HD25 does not. It also has very natural timbre, which the HD25 does not. Isolation is similar, with maybe a slight edge going to the FXTs (though if you are in very noisy environments the HD25s' bass will be less prone to getting drowned out).


----------



## vaed

Much thanks, as always, |joker|.


----------



## olear

IjokerI, is the isolation on the ex1000 or fx700 about the same as with the stock earbuds that come with an iphone?


----------



## Selenium

^^^It's more with both.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





selenium said:


> ^^^It's more with both.


 


  Thank you for not curbing my enthusiasum about my isolation concern.
   
  I think Larry would choose EX1000 for his IEM, there is no question in my mind.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Dunu DN-17 Crater and DN-18 Hawkeye
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C45) Dunu DN-17 Crater*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2012
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





selenium said:


> ^^^It's more with both.


 

 +1. Apple buds rate around 1-1.5 on this scale for me.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Dunu DN-17 Crater and DN-18 Hawkeye
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


 Thank you.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Btw Joker you said about the smallest tri-flange tips being the one of the best tips
After cutting of the top part? How do I perfectly cut it and what should I use.... It's the M6 Btw


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Btw Joker you said about the smallest tri-flange tips being the one of the best tips
> After cutting of the top part? How do I perfectly cut it and what should I use.... It's the M6 Btw


 


  Actually I don't think the smaller tri-flange that they include now came with my M6 back in 2009. In either case I think they're similar to the triples included with the CW31, which don't seal for me. I use the larger triples that come stock on the earphones, but make them into bi-flanges because the third (smallest) flanges tend to constrict sound flow in my ear. I use manicure scissors to carefully cut the stalk past the 2nd (medium) flange. If the large triples fit you comfortably without modification, you probably don't need to do this.


----------



## kanuka

nice 2 dunu reviews
  but i cant find them on  ebay??


----------



## ItsMeHere

Quote:


kanuka said:


> nice 2 dunu reviews
> but i cant find them on  ebay??


 


   They're yet to be released - I read somwhere that they'll be released in March.


----------



## jarrett

Dunu look nice, but they haven't broke hi-fi ground as far as reviews go. I'd probably be disappointed with a headphone if it didn't hit near a 7.5 to an 8


----------



## olear

IjokerI,  is UM3X a better sounding phone vs IE8?


----------



## Techno Kid

He joker I just wanted to say you do a great job with IEM reviews and even though I just started posting here I have used your reviews over the past couple of years in helping me make some decisions on IEM purchases.  The review you did on the Aurvana 3 is the latest one I used in helping me decide to get a pair (even though I really didn't need them) and I must say I like them a bit more it seems than you do but your review is still almost the same as how I hear them, keep up the good work.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI,  is UM3X a better sounding phone vs IE8?


 

 Is the UM3X a better phone vs TF10?
   
  Thank you


----------



## Tronz

Quote: 





olear said:


> Is the UM3X a better phone vs TF10?
> 
> Thank you


 


  It depends really. If you want a more balanced and monitor like sound free of any significant frequency boost or dips, the UM3X is a better choice. If you want a more lively and energetic sound with a slight boost to the bass and treble, the UE TF.10 Pro is a better choice.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





tronz said:


> It depends really. If you want a more balanced and monitor like sound free of any significant frequency boost or dips, the UM3X is a better choice. If you want a more lively and energetic sound with a slight boost to the bass and treble, the UE TF.10 Pro is a better choice.


 


 I have the TF10 and yes, they are energetic and enjoyable phones.
  How do the UM3X compare with IE80 or IE8?


----------



## Gercam3

Hi joker amazing review, would you recommend Brainwavz B2?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





itsmehere said:


> They're yet to be released - I read somwhere that they'll be released in March.


 

 That's right, I wasn't sure of the release date and just put 'ebay' as the place they are likely to show up first.
   


  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> Dunu look nice, but they haven't broke hi-fi ground as far as reviews go. I'd probably be disappointed with a headphone if it didn't hit near a 7.5 to an 8


 

 Yes, the draw here is the top-tier design/construction without paying hundreds of dollars. There are two higher-end Dunu models that I haven't heard, though. 
   


  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> He joker I just wanted to say you do a great job with IEM reviews and even though I just started posting here I have used your reviews over the past couple of years in helping me make some decisions on IEM purchases.  The review you did on the Aurvana 3 is the latest one I used in helping me decide to get a pair (even though I really didn't need them) and I must say I like them a bit more it seems than you do but your review is still almost the same as how I hear them, keep up the good work.


 

 Thanks, glad you're happy with the Aurvanas!
   


  Quote: 





tronz said:


> It depends really. If you want a more balanced and monitor like sound free of any significant frequency boost or dips, the UM3X is a better choice. If you want a more lively and energetic sound with a slight boost to the bass and treble, the UE TF.10 Pro is a better choice.


 

 +1 - very different sound signatures so it's an apples/oranges comparison. This applies to the IE8 as well - there are some who would prefer it over the TF10 and UM3X regardless of technical merit. It has the widest headstage and most bass impact of the three while maintaining excellent clarity when the bass isn't getting in the way.
   


  Quote: 





gercam3 said:


> Hi joker amazing review, would you recommend Brainwavz B2?


 


  Sure, as far as I know it's a Fischer DBA-02 mk I at 2/3 the price. Don't see what's not to like there 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker,
  in your MEElec M6 review, you said the memory wire is annoying, but could be dealt with with a little knifework, you mean cutting off the memory wire correct?
   
  Also, how does Soundmagic PL50 bass sound compared to Visang R03, more or less?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker,
> in your MEElec M6 review, you said the memory wire is annoying, but could be dealt with with a little knifework, you mean cutting off the memory wire correct?
> 
> Also, how does Soundmagic PL50 bass sound compared to Visang R03, more or less?


 

 Yes, I removed it on my pair. Just cut back the rubber sleeving and pulled out the wire itself. However, my M6 still had the copper memory wire, which was very stiff. I don't think the newer one (stainless steel) is as problematic.
   
  The PL50 has significantly less bass than an R03.


----------



## jant71

Nice review on the DUNU, Joker. Right on the mark.
  
  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> Dunu look nice, but they haven't broke hi-fi ground as far as reviews go. I'd probably be disappointed with a headphone if it didn't hit near a 7.5 to an 8


 

  
  X2. To talk about silver cabling and such but they still lack clarity and transparency is a disappointment. A bit different sounding than the similar scoring Trident and Hephaes but not as enjoyable. Hope they know what their doing and not that they think the phones sound better than they do. Shame that I open up a four year old consumer in-ears model(the Maxell CN40 released in 2008) and out of the package it sounds better than burned in Crater/Hawkeye. Six models in already and they need to shows us they can make a really good sounding phone. The market is even tougher than when the first four came out so they are going to have to step up the performance side to match up more with the presentation/build/accessories side.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Nice review on the DUNU, Joker. Right on the mark.
> 
> 
> 
> X2. To talk about silver cabling and such but they still lack clarity and transparency is a disappointment. A bit different sounding than the similar scoring Trident and Hephaes but not as enjoyable. Hope they know what their doing and not that they think the phones sound better than they do. Shame that I open up a four year old consumer in-ears model(the Maxell CN40 released in 2008) and out of the package it sounds better than burned in Crater/Hawkeye. Six models in already and they need to shows us they can make a really good sounding phone. The market is even tougher than when the first four came out so they are going to have to step up the performance side to match up more with the presentation/build/accessories side.


 
   
  Thanks, and agreed. The Trident is still the best value of the bunch for me - fun signature + very good technical proficiency for the money, solid build, isolates well. Very easy to recommend.


----------



## Niyologist

I just ordered the JVC HA-FXT90 LIMITED EDITION from eBay. The seller is buyfromjapan.


----------



## Goombi

First off, just want to thank Joker for keeping such an up to date, and thorough guide for all of us.
   
  I've been lurking around for a long time, and settled on the TS02's for my first "serious" pair of earbuds. They've broken, and I'm looking to replace them so I don't have to use the stock apple earbuds anymore 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  I listen to everything, save rock/bass-heavy tracks. In short, tight, but present bass, with clear lush mids and trebles that aren't harsh. I'm not driving the phones with anything, and the source is either my laptop or my iPhone4.
   
  I'm narrowed it down to:
MDR-EX600 not a fan of OTE
  FXT90
  FX500 - hints of muddled bass
  CKM99 - prone to sibilant highs
  CK90PRO - source dependant, so might not be great to pair with an iPhone
  RE262
   
  So far, I'm leaning towards the CKM99 or FX500.
   
  Any thoughts or further suggestions? Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





goombi said:


> First off, just want to thank Joker for keeping such an up to date, and thorough guide for all of us.
> 
> I've been lurking around for a long time, and settled on the TS02's for my first "serious" pair of earbuds. They've broken, and I'm looking to replace them so I don't have to use the stock apple earbuds anymore
> 
> ...


 


  While the CKM99 and FX500 are the closest to your TS02 in terms of balance, I wouldn't call either smooth in the highs and the FX500 doesn't have particularly tight bass or very lush mids. Of course depending on your personal tolerances they might be perfectly acceptable (and if you were happy with the TS02, they probably will be) but the FXT90 strikes me as a safer choice on all three counts.


----------



## Goombi

Thanks! Just read 20 pages of the FXT90 thread and they seem to be the right ones for me.
   
  Just two more quick questions:
   
  - How would you compare the soundstage of the FXT90 to my previous TS02
   
  - How does the bass compare as well? I found that I actually preferred to EQ down the bass as the bass became a bit overpowering at times


----------



## olear

Quote: 





goombi said:


> Thanks! Just read 20 pages of the FXT90 thread and they seem to be the right ones for me.
> 
> Just two more quick questions:
> 
> ...


 


 I have FXT90 and found the bass balanced and not overpowering. Using silicone tips decreases the bass and brings out more treble. Using Comply's does the opposite.


----------



## jgray91

I hate skipping research on something I'm going to plunk down some money on, but as it stands, there are too many choices and too little time to read all. And impatient. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 So I'm here to ask around some suggestions to narrow down my research for my quite possibly first high quality IEM.
   
  A little info on what I have, and song preferences.
   
  I have, and like the CAL (which I find that the CAL matches what ljokerl said in his other thread),  They are for the most part fine when I need to use it outside, but as mentioned the isolation are not quite good for portable use, and with no form of folding mechanism, makes eat space in my bag. 
   
  I also have a Koss PortaPro, and very much like using it on the go, rather than at home, because the boomy bass is less apparent when there are outside noise. Personally I find it almost match my CAL and often change between them. It is all the more similar, IMO, after I did the quarter-mod (cut a quarter-sized hole in the earpads, for those who aren't familiar), now they have a fairly balanced V-shape, with the bass just overpowering a little bit. Being open though, and the fact that I take the metro (subway) going to uni, all I hear is the train.
   
  My music preference are somewhat nebulous, as in I listen to whatever I found pleasing/fun/toe-tapping/overall very musical; most genres. I don't listen to, or like, bass-heavy songs much, and very rarely listen to EDM or such genres. If I have to choose, the music the likes of Muse, 30 Seconds to Mars, the Killers, Keane, Arctic Monkeys, Bloc Party, Coldplay, anime/game songs and soundtracks. What I like in my songs though are a combination of vocals (especially female), synergy of the instruments in busy tracks and/or punchy bass that doesn't overpower the other spectrum. with a dash of highs to complement them all. 
   
  As such, I am looking for some suggestions to read up that have almost, if not similar sounds to them, but with a little bit more forward vocals and a little more sparkle on the highs. I guess an all-rounder. My budget would be in the range of not more than $100, at most $130. Needs the isolation, or at least not making me crank up the volume when I take the train.
   
  Oh and maybe geographic info is important too? Currently I'm in Moscow, so maybe some suggestions are harder for me to get. Oh and probably not more than 5 suggestions would be good. 
   
  EDIT: I almost forgot, the source. Mostly I from 320 kbps mp3 from my phone, although I am looking up to snatch me some Clip zip or something, so in the future it will be .flac.


----------



## Niyologist

I have to wait for at least a couple of weeks for my FXT90L2. Waiting..........


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I have to wait for at least a couple of weeks for my FXT90L2. Waiting..........


 

 Getting another FXT90 ?


----------



## Goombi

Quote: 





olear said:


> I have FXT90 and found the bass balanced and not overpowering. Using silicone tips decreases the bass and brings out more treble. Using Comply's does the opposite.


 

 Thanks! Going to spring for those and maybe some Jays silicone tips as well.


----------



## olear

What's the difference between Comply T-400 and TS-400? Thanks


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Getting another FXT90 ?


 

      No, I knew I was getting it in the first place, so I put it on my list. I already know it show be the best of the bunch I own.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  where???


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





goombi said:


> Thanks! Just read 20 pages of the FXT90 thread and they seem to be the right ones for me.
> 
> Just two more quick questions:
> 
> ...


 
   
  Deeper, more layered soundstage despite the somewhat forward presentation. The bass is tighter than that of the TS02 and not as aggressive, I am guessing you won't need to EQ it.
  
   


  Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> I hate skipping research on something I'm going to plunk down some money on, but as it stands, there are too many choices and too little time to read all. And impatient.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Sure, I think the FXT90 would suit, should be right around that budget. Failing that, you could look at the Fischer Audio Tandem. Maybe the Tandem is cheaper locally - that would certainly be in its favor. Neither of these have great isolation but they are some of the better earphones in that price range. I would recommend the Sunrise Xcape IE as well but I am not sure if the construction issues with it have been solved. If you want higher isolation, then Shure SE215 or HiSound Crystal might work - you'd be giving up some sound quality but shouldn't need to turn up the volume with them. The Fischer SBA-03 would be my final recommendation, though that has a different signature. If you are able to try it locally, maybe that's an option as it isolates well and I feel many could like its sound if they gave it a chance.




  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> where???


 

 Well, a B2 is what, $120-130? DBA-02 retails (or at least did when I wrote my review) for $160-180. Therefore B2 is a chunk cheaper than an earphone I already highly recommend at full price.


----------



## kanuka

well, the full price of  B2 is $170. true that mp4nation makes some offers and discounts (if thats what u mean)
  anyway, both arent available for now. and there's the new DBA version 2


----------



## jgray91

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sure, I think the FXT90 would suit, should be right around that budget. Failing that, you could look at the Fischer Audio Tandem. Maybe the Tandem is cheaper locally - that would certainly be in its favor. Neither of these have great isolation but they are some of the better earphones in that price range. I would recommend the Sunrise Xcape IE as well but I am not sure if the construction issues with it have been solved. If you want higher isolation, then Shure SE215 or HiSound Crystal might work - you'd be giving up some sound quality but shouldn't need to turn up the volume with them. The Fischer SBA-03 would be my final recommendation, though that has a different signature. If you are able to try it locally, maybe that's an option as it isolates well and I feel many could like its sound if they gave it a chance.


 


  Hmm interesing. Well in any case that should be enough candidates for me to read around some more. Thanks for the response. Really love both of your very very massive threads.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> No, I knew I was getting it in the first place, so I put it on my list. I already know it show be the best of the bunch I own.


 


  Too much of a conviction you have there


----------



## Xinn3r

I was suddenly wondering, why isn't this thread stickied?
  Alot of useful information, especially for newbie's like me
  Rather than them making a new thread everytime someone wants to buy something....
  "budget and best recommendation" new thread pops out almost everyday


----------



## ljokerl

Added Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 4 and id America Spark
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C47) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 4vi*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(3A66) id America Spark*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2012
> ...


----------



## DigitalFreak

Interesting review on the Spark joker. In your opinion does the id America Spark go head to head with the Klipish S4 and best it in any way?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Interesting review on the Spark joker. In your opinion does the id America Spark go head to head with the Klipish S4 and best it in any way?


 


  I'd put the Spark closer to the better <$100 sets such as the Fischer Eterna/Consonance and Hippo VB. The S4 comparison is very fair - they are actually similarly v-shaped in response and share many of the same flaws - but there is no reason I can see to pick the S4 over the Spark for SQ. The Spark has better bass depth, less recessed mids (milder v-shape), and isn't as harsh up top. Treble extension is not great with either, both have some bass bleed, and the soundstages are similarly average-sized. However, the Spark has pretty decent layering. 
   
  Not sure where id America got this driver but the performance is quite close to Fischer's Consonance, which I was impressed by and still recommend highly as a bass-heavy set.


----------



## Niyologist

My JVC HA-FXT90L2 (Gold) shipped out last night. It'll take 7-10 days for me to receive it.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Ill just post my questions here, to also help others who are wondering the same thing.

 Anyway you suggest the vPulse to me right? When are you doing a review of it? Cuz my iBuds died, and if not anytime soon, Ill just go ahead and buy one. I just hope its better than the S4i(in which you said that its not offensive to the audiophile but will also make the bass junkie happy) and that soundstaging is good.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Ill just post my questions here, to also help others who are wondering the same thing.
> 
> Anyway you suggest the vPulse to me right? When are you doing a review of it? Cuz my iBuds died, and if not anytime soon, Ill just go ahead and buy one. I just hope its better than the S4i(in which you said that its not offensive to the audiophile but will also make the bass junkie happy) and that soundstaging is good.


 


  The vPulse review is a couple of weeks off. I do recommend it over the S4i when a 3-button headset is a requirement. The vPulse is very bassy but there's just as much sub-bass as mid-bass and the top end isn't harsh like it is with the S4. The vPulse has a decent-sized stage and the presentation isn't overly forward/aggressive.


----------



## ShantyD

*Hi I just found this page && I really like it 
 I want to buy the id America spark earphones, but I feel that I need to ask you about other earphones.
 Have you hear or try the House of Marley In-Ear Headphones?
http://www.thehouseofmarley.com/in-ear-headphones.html

I have been looking for good but not expensive earphones.
 I already have the Sony PIIQ Clip-on Earbuds && they are really good for the price which is usually $24.99 but they are now on sale for $12.49. But I am looking for better earphones. *


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The vPulse review is a couple of weeks off. I do recommend it over the S4i when a 3-button headset is a requirement. The vPulse is very bassy but there's just as much sub-bass as mid-bass and the top end isn't harsh like it is with the S4. The vPulse has a decent-sized stage and the presentation isn't overly forward/aggressive.


 


   Thanks man. One last thing, based on your initial handling, hows the durability looks? It doesnt feel to cheap or that the cord will rip off from the monitors themselves eh?

 And do you agree with a review that says it sounds like a $10 SQ earphones but with a million dollar bass?


----------



## carfentanil

Thanks guys, and joker, for the vibrant interaction this thread has prompted - I certainly wish other shopping decisions had such thorough pre-purchase advice available!
   
  My Headphone Search - my source is currently an iPod Classic 160GB (7G I think.)
  ==============================================
  Timeline - my only other audio gear are formerly Philips FW-C70 Shelf System, and my current Sony MHC-EC909ip
   
  Numerous OEM earbuds, cheap headsets
   
  on-ear: Sony MDR-V150, Similar sets from Koss, Aiwa
   *Prone to breaking
   
  ear bud: Apple Stock Buds
   
  IEM: Sony MDR-EX300
   *I liked this one very much, but for the muddled low end/tangle-prone cabling.
   
  IEM: Sunrise SW-XCape Impressive Edition
   *Proficient, but poorly built. Lacked in physical presence. Treble mildly harsh.
   *Very, very good sound quality, but the signature/presentation was not to my liking.
   
  around-ear: Sony MDR-XD200
   *Excellent for videos (or anything else) on PC and Laptop. Not much isolation. In terms of bang-for-buck, I'd put this into my bag 90 times out of 100 instead of the M9, despite the bulk.
   
  IEM: Meelectronics M9
   *Major comfort issues, even when able to seal, sounds unnatural without EQ
  ==============================================
   I am sketchy on whether BA can deliver the "push/pull" loudspeaker-like presence with which the EX300 grabbed my attention. Is this what is called "articulation" or "thickness," or is it simply a byproduct of dynamic drivers? My experience is too limited for me to be sure, as I have not used a BA for any meaningful duration. I also favor sets that have a substantial case (XCape, M9) for protection/transport.
   
  Wanted in sub $100 IEM - my preferences for now
  1.Build quality, endurance: I want to be able to use it [thoroughly] for at least a year
  2.Spacious, detailed sound emulating headphones/loudspeakers
  3.Plentiful, powerful low end, well extended, but not muddy
  4."Wow!" level of presence/detail - mids should be recessed as little as possible
  5.Forgiving treble but not too rolled-off
   
  My shopping, and advice from Head-Fi, has brought me to select these 5 models:
  Fischer Eterna
  Xears TD-III
  Spider Realvoice
  Dunu Ares
  Soundmagic PL50
   
  on the other hand, I could spring for (full-size) either the Creative Aurvana Live or the Sony ZX700, which are also available under $100 - The ZX700 probably isolates more.
   
  Please consult and advise.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shantyd said:


> *Hi I just found this page && I really like it
> I want to buy the id America spark earphones, but I feel that I need to ask you about other earphones.
> Have you hear or try the House of Marley In-Ear Headphones?
> http://www.thehouseofmarley.com/in-ear-headphones.html
> ...


 

 I've only heard the Marley Zion and two as yet unreleased higher-end models briefly and didn't think they were anything special. The bass was consistently heavy and a bit boomy but there are dozens of earphones that sound like that. Generally speaking, there are tons of great earphones out there, some of which would probably suit you better than others - just depends on what type of sound you're looking for and what you're willing to pay. 


  Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Thanks man. One last thing, based on your initial handling, hows the durability looks? It doesnt feel to cheap or that the cord will rip off from the monitors themselves eh?
> 
> And do you agree with a review that says it sounds like a $10 SQ earphones but with a million dollar bass?


 


  They seem to be well put-together although the fact that they were built down to a price shows in some of the finish. Only time will tell how good the real-world durability is; they've only been out for a month or so.
   
  As for the latter statement, both parts seem like hyperbole. They are not giant killers by any means and there may indeed be a $10 earphone that will sound better to some listeners (e.g. the monoprice 8320) but they aren't offensive. Probably somewhere in the 7.x range on my scale though they still need more burn-in time just in case.


  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> I am sketchy on whether BA can deliver the "push/pull" loudspeaker-like presence with which the EX300 grabbed my attention. Is this what is called "articulation" or "thickness," or is it simply a byproduct of dynamic drivers? My experience is too limited for me to be sure, as I have not used a BA for any meaningful duration. I also favor sets that have a substantial case (XCape, M9) for protection/transport.
> 
> Wanted in sub $100 IEM - my preferences for now
> 1.Build quality, endurance: I want to be able to use it [thoroughly] for at least a year
> ...


 

 Some BAs are capable of moving air but I wouldn't recommend any that are in your price range for the type of presentation you want. The Realvoice, Eterna, and TD-III all deliver what you're after minus really heavy-duty durability, with Eterna being maybe a bit more mid-recessed than you seem to want. I would also add the Brookstone Clear Dual Drive to that list though again durability is suspect. Realvoice and Brookstone are probably safer in that regard as they are located in the US for warranty service.


----------



## jarrett

Why not XE200Pro? I thought those were generally regarded as Xears' best pair


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> Why not XE200Pro? I thought those were generally regarded as Xears' best pair


 


  They are (of the ons I've heard) but the more recessed mids and less laid-back treble compared to TD-III seemed to not be what carfentanil was looking for. Really a wash between the XE200 Pro, TD-III v2, XR120 Pro II, and N3i IMO depending on requirements.


----------



## Swimsonny

At the moment I use a Fischer audio dba-02, would it be worth me buying a cheap super fi 3 for more tough use?


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Thanks again Joker. 7+ estimated score? Not bad. Also in your opinion, doesnt make a difference between flat and regular shaped cords eh? - quality wise?

 That said, you still advice the Spark over vPulse if I dont mind the lack of volume controls right? Im torn between the two.


----------



## XacTactX

*Sorry, let me clarify this post, I want ear tips that will bring the RE0 toward a neutral sound signature.*
   
  I have the HiFiMan RE0 coming in the mail, and I'm wondering what eartips to get. I don't have the PL30 so I can use the foam tips, and I don't want to go to the trouble of de-coring the Shure olives. What's the next best alternative? (preferably something that doesn't mess up the treble and doesn't have to be replaced often). I heard the Sony hybrids mess up the treble, but what's the overall consensus on those?
   
  Also, I ordered some eartips off of eBay. The double flange ones look just like the ones that come with the RE0, and the triple flange ones look like Etymotic triple flange (but I'm sure it's more complicated than that). These are the ones I got.
   
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/200715970526?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649
   
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/200708810680?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649


----------



## dosley01

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those two would be my choice as well. Keep in mind that the MD has more bass than an ESW9, to the point where it can get slightly overbearing, and the RE262 has less to the point where you may have to EQ it. If you're used to getting IE8-level bass from your in-ears, the MD is probably the better choice though it lacks the large headstage of the IE8.


 
   
  Grabbed a pair of MDs at the $149 price, too cheap to pass up.  I've had Turbines and MTPC and was actually a little sorry I sold the MTPC as they were "fun" so it will be interesting to see how I like the MD.  I've really come to like the MDR-EX600 also even though it's not my normal sound signature but I think I have finally burned my brain in to them.  I need to weed down the stable of IEMS and Headphones to 1 On-Ear and 2 IEMS.  Definitely keeping the ESW9 and I really enjoy the TF10 for my commute so it looks like the battle will be between the IE8s, EX600s and MMDT but I already feel like it might be time to find the IE8s a new home, and I never thought I would say that.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker,
  just checking to see if there are any Chinese brands I miss,
  ECCI
  HiFiMan (just knew this 5 minutes ago)
  Visang
  VSonic
  SoundMAGIC
  Yuin
   
  any other nice ones I need to know about? I'm looking for my next purchase


----------



## psygeist

^^HiSoundAudio
  DUNU


----------



## eat2na

Hello Joker. Than you for everything that you do. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 When can we see a review on the Yamaha's EPH-100?
http://www.head-fi.org/t/577712/yamaha-eph-100


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Oh my a UE review? TF10 review might not be all that far off then eh?


----------



## nyonya

ljokerl, could you compare the sound of the Miles Davis Tribute to the FXT90?  As well as the isolation?  Thanks!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker,
> just checking to see if there are any Chinese brands I miss,
> ECCI
> HiFiMan (just knew this 5 minutes ago)
> ...


 

 brainwavz


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> At the moment I use a Fischer audio dba-02, would it be worth me buying a cheap super fi 3 for more tough use?


 

 I never recommend using higher-end units in environments where they can be damaged so from that perspective - yes. The SF3 is not the best-sounding thing in its price bracket so unless you are getting a hefty discount on the original price I would consider alternatives as well. The Brainwavz M1 I thought sounded a lot like the SF3 but is significantly cheaper at MSRP.
  
  Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Thanks again Joker. 7+ estimated score? Not bad. Also in your opinion, doesnt make a difference between flat and regular shaped cords eh? - quality wise?
> 
> That said, you still advice the Spark over vPulse if I dont mind the lack of volume controls right? Im torn between the two.


 

 Depends on the cable - like regular cables, some flat cords are better than others. The vPulse one is very flat and very smooth.
   
  If you don't mind enhanced treble in addition to enhanced bass, I would take the Spark. The vPulse has a smoother top end and a slightly wider soundstage but also a bit less clarity and poorer layering compared to the Spark. It's a very close call, though, so if you want the full remote just get the vPulse.
   


  Quote: 





xactactx said:


> *Sorry, let me clarify this post, I want ear tips that will bring the RE0 toward a neutral sound signature.*
> 
> I have the HiFiMan RE0 coming in the mail, and I'm wondering what eartips to get. I don't have the PL30 so I can use the foam tips, and I don't want to go to the trouble of de-coring the Shure olives. What's the next best alternative? (preferably something that doesn't mess up the treble and doesn't have to be replaced often). I heard the Sony hybrids mess up the treble, but what's the overall consensus on those?
> 
> ...


 


  Those aren't RE0 bi-flanges. I think they should be similar to the ones that come with MEElec sets. Ditto on the triples. I liked those bi-flanges on the RE0 but I would just wait and try all the tips you've got before looking for more options. 


  Quote: 





dosley01 said:


> Grabbed a pair of MDs at the $149 price, too cheap to pass up.  I've had Turbines and MTPC and was actually a little sorry I sold the MTPC as they were "fun" so it will be interesting to see how I like the MD.  I've really come to like the MDR-EX600 also even though it's not my normal sound signature but I think I have finally burned my brain in to them.  I need to weed down the stable of IEMS and Headphones to 1 On-Ear and 2 IEMS.  Definitely keeping the ESW9 and I really enjoy the TF10 for my commute so it looks like the battle will be between the IE8s, EX600s and MMDT but I already feel like it might be time to find the IE8s a new home, and I never thought I would say that.


 

 Good price for MDs, especially if the warranty is intact.


  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker,
> just checking to see if there are any Chinese brands I miss,
> ECCI
> HiFiMan (just knew this 5 minutes ago)
> ...


 

 Out of the ones popular on head-fi none come to mind in addition to what psygeist said. Should be plenty of options there.
   

   


  Quote: 





eat2na said:


> Hello Joker. Than you for everything that you do.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 No plans for an EPH-100 review at this time. Current review queue is on the front page of the thread, below the table.
   


  Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> Oh my a UE review? TF10 review might not be all that far off then eh?


 

 Another way to look at it is 3 UE reviews in 2 years with 7 more to go 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   


  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> ljokerl, could you compare the sound of the Miles Davis Tribute to the FXT90?  As well as the isolation?  Thanks!


 

 Isolation should be fairly similar, with a slight edge to the MD. The MD is bassier and warmer, with more bleed and fatter, thicker bass (or, conversely, the FXT90 is tighter and quicker). Note thickness is generally greater on the MDs while the presentation is more laid-back compared to the FXT90. FXT90 should have more treble sparkle, too.


----------



## olear

IjokerI, have you heard the Monster Trumpets? Supposely more balanced compared to the other Monster Pro products.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Thanks again! Im trying to find which sound style is for me, these terms like Dynamic, BA, etc... If Ill buy 2 earphones for opposite spectrums(maybe start at the $70 each more or less) so I can know where I belong, which? Spark and Ety MC3?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Thanks again! Im trying to find which sound style is for me, these terms like Dynamic, BA, etc... If Ill buy 2 earphones for opposite spectrums(maybe start at the $70 each more or less) so I can know where I belong, which? Spark and Ety MC3?


 

      If you are willing to spend $10 more, you can go for the Etymotic HF3/HF5 instead of the MC3 in Best Buy.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Ill check it out. But Spark(similar to S4) is the opposite of HF3 reference wise eh?

  
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> If you are willing to spend $10 more, you can go for the Etymotic HF3/HF5 instead of the MC3 in Best Buy.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

HF3 is $178 at Bestbuy.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> HF3 is $178 at Bestbuy.


 
   
       How about the HF2?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Ill check it out. But Spark(similar to S4) is the opposite of HF3 reference wise eh?


 

      Definitely. Most BA's can't move air like dynamics, so I'm assuming there's a ton of mid bass and very little sub-bass. The HF3 has extreme clarity in comparison to the S4. The S4 is really colored in tone and pretty dirty in comparison to the HF3. The HF3 has more extended treble than the S4 without being sibilant. The detail is extreme on the HF3 while the S4 has the typical dark tone detail of a dynamic that cost less than $100. So yeah, they are polar opposites.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Yeah, Ill probably get 2 so I know where to go from there. Would suck if I know one sound signature, without knowing the other(which may or may not be my type). But for budget sake, MC3 right? I read Joker's review that the difference is not much, and in fact MC3 got better build(since Ill be using it for jogging or travelling)...


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

No HF2. Ill check on Amazon. The only difference is the volume controls right?

  
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> How about the HF2?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> No HF2. Ill check on Amazon. The only difference is the volume controls right?


 

       You'll have to go to the store personally. I've seen like 10-15 HF2/HF3's in my Local Best Buy Store for $78 (HF2) to $94 (HF3).


----------



## XacTactX

Wow, thanks for the response joker! I'll wait and see like you suggested.
   
  Also, I forgot to tell you this, but thanks for all that you've done (and are doing). Before I found this massive review database I was always thinking to myself, "but how will I ever know how good *insert earphones* are in the big picture?". And you've surpassed my (and probably everyone else's) wildest dreams. To know that one person has gone to so much trouble to make such a great resource is just insane (in the best possible way).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> IjokerI, have you heard the Monster Trumpets? Supposely more balanced compared to the other Monster Pro products.


 


  I have not.


  Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Thanks again! Im trying to find which sound style is for me, these terms like Dynamic, BA, etc... If Ill buy 2 earphones for opposite spectrums(maybe start at the $70 each more or less) so I can know where I belong, which? Spark and Ety MC3?


 

 The MC3 isn't BA, just trying to sound like one. But yes, it'll be vastly different from something like the Spark.
   


  Quote: 





xactactx said:


> Wow, thanks for the response joker! I'll wait and see like you suggested.
> 
> Also, I forgot to tell you this, but thanks for all that you've done (and are doing). Before I found this massive review database I was always thinking to myself, "but how will I ever know how good *insert earphones* are in the big picture?". And you've surpassed my (and probably everyone else's) wildest dreams. To know that one person has gone to so much trouble to make such a great resource is just insane (in the best possible way).


 


  Thanks. Keep in mind that the ultimate way to know how earphones fit in is to try them yourself. Hopefully all of the reviews here on Head-Fi can offer the next best thing, though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Swimsonny

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I never recommend using higher-end units in environments where they can be damaged so from that perspective - yes. The SF3 is not the best-sounding thing in its price bracket so unless you are getting a hefty discount on the original price I would consider alternatives as well. The Brainwavz M1 I thought sounded a lot like the SF3 but is significantly cheaper at MSRP.


 
   
  Thanks for the advice and yes, the only reason i suggested the super fi 3s was that i ended up getting them for £17 and i am going to find the accessories (i.e cleaning tool and case) quite handy for my dba-02! Thanks again, Sonny


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Just wondering, how does the UM miracle compare to the TF10 in quantity/quality of bass and highs?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> Thanks for the advice and yes, the only reason i suggested the super fi 3s was that i ended up getting them for £17 and i am going to find the accessories (i.e cleaning tool and case) quite handy for my dba-02! Thanks again, Sonny


 

 That's a great deal - I actually quite like the sound of the SF3 (more so than that of the SF4), just not at the $129 MSRP.
   


  Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> Just wondering, how does the UM miracle compare to the TF10 in quantity/quality of bass and highs?


 

 The Miracle is generally more fleshed out (greater note thickness) and has better bass depth, texture, resolution, and detail. The TF10 has more of a mid-bass lift and may occasionally provide a bit more punch. At the top the Miracle is a little smoother although I've never really found the TF10 harsh or overly bright as some have in the context of its slightly v-shaped signature.


----------



## Gilly87

Hey |joker| 
   
  Is there any top-tier universal that you would say is similar to the SE215 that offers improvements overall while retaining a similar signature? My two biggest concerns would be bass body and extension, and the rich, forward mids, while being slightly dark/without emphasized treble.


----------



## pigsterz

hey joker , i wanna ask what Iem below 500 usd do u recommend  that have punchier bass. thx


----------



## jgray91

joker, I'm just curious, but which IEM you have listened to have the widest IEM? Like from any price point. And how do they compare to headphones. Not that I am looking for one, just curious.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Joker, I found the Spark at MacMall for $30, you said I should just pick vPulse for full remote function at $90. But with $30, its just too hard to pass eh?


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> joker, I'm just curious, but which IEM you have listened to have the widest *soundstage* ? Like from any price point. And how do they compare to headphones. Not that I am looking for one, just curious.


 

 fixed.


----------



## jgray91

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  LOL missed that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Hey |joker|
> 
> Is there any top-tier universal that you would say is similar to the SE215 that offers improvements overall while retaining a similar signature? My two biggest concerns would be bass body and extension, and the rich, forward mids, while being slightly dark/without emphasized treble.


 

 I'd look at the MTPG/MDT, Radius DDM/DDM2, and maybe the FA Tandem and Earsonics SM2/SM3
   
   
  Quote: 





pigsterz said:


> hey joker , i wanna ask what Iem below 500 usd do u recommend  that have punchier bass. thx


 

 Punchier compared to what?
   


  Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> joker, I'm just curious, but which IEM you have listened to have the widest IEM? Like from any price point. And how do they compare to headphones. Not that I am looking for one, just curious.


 

 Probably the IE8 or Sony EX1000. There are definitely headphones that sound more closed-in than these two.
   


  Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Joker, I found the Spark at MacMall for $30, you said I should just pick vPulse for full remote function at $90. But with $30, its just too hard to pass eh?


 

 That's a very good price.


----------



## pigsterz

i have tried FAD Heaven C , and i think the bass is punch , if there's any earphone that sound like that and cheaper i'd be happy


----------



## Gilly87

Thanks Joker


----------



## jgray91

Thanks for the input joker.


----------



## halfwaythere

First of all great job. Secondly I'm wondering if you took the vsonic GR06 for a quick spin and what are your initial thoughts. I'm wondering if they are worth the trouble or should I find something extra for the RE0.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pigsterz said:


> i have tried FAD Heaven C , and i think the bass is punch , if there's any earphone that sound like that and cheaper i'd be happy


 

 GR07 or EX600 could be good options. The 'C' does indeed have very good punch for an armature.
   


  Quote: 





halfwaythere said:


> First of all great job. Secondly I'm wondering if you took the vsonic GR06 for a quick spin and what are your initial thoughts. I'm wondering if they are worth the trouble or should I find something extra for the RE0.


 
   
  Thanks! I did try my GR06 pre burn-in and was impressed. I think at $50 the value is excellent - it seems to be a very solid all around performer with good balance. Good bass punch, slightly warmer tone than GR07, clean mids. Treble seems to have a bit of that same peakiness the GR07 treble had early on but it shouldn't be a big deal in the long run.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  Which one is better between Radius HP-TWF11R Pro “DDM” and Sony MDR-ZX700 Sound Quality wise?
  I know both are different things altogether, One is In-ear headphone and the other one is Circumaural Headphone
   
  Please tell me in detail that how do they compare to each-other and which is better in bass, articulation, depth, Fast, focus, Grip, Imaging, low level detail, naturalness, Pace, Snap, Soundstage, Speed, Texture, Tightness of bass, Timbre, Timing and transient.
   
  Sorry for asking this much but I will be so much glad if you can compare these terms in both the Radius and sony.
   
  Thank You.
   
  Warm Regards.


----------



## james444

pigsterz said:


> i have tried FAD Heaven C , and i think the bass is punch , if there's any earphone that sound like that and cheaper i'd be happy




The discontinued FAD Heaven A sound extremely similar to the C and are cheaper (provided you can still find a pair somewhere).


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks! I did try my GR06 pre burn-in and was impressed. I think at $50 the value is excellent - it seems to be a very solid all around performer with good balance. Good bass punch, slightly warmer tone than GR07, clean mids. Treble seems to have a bit of that same peakiness the GR07 treble had early on but it shouldn't be a big deal in the long run.


 

 would you recommend it for rock , like the 07 ?
   
  btw. what's your opinion of the gr01?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Which one is better between Radius HP-TWF11R Pro “DDM” and Sony MDR-ZX700 Sound Quality wise?
> I know both are different things altogether, One is In-ear headphone and the other one is Circumaural Headphone
> 
> Please tell me in detail that how do they compare to each-other and which is better in bass, articulation, depth, Fast, focus, Grip, Imaging, low level detail, naturalness, Pace, Snap, Soundstage, Speed, Texture, Tightness of bass, Timbre, Timing and transient.


 

 You're asking for an apples-to-oranges comparison in great detail between two sets I haven't heard in a year or more. Sorry, no can do. From a very general SQ perspective the DDM is more bass-heavy (considering it's an in-ear) and has better depth but for more detail you'd have to find someone who can compare both directly.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> would you recommend it for rock , like the 07 ?
> 
> btw. what's your opinion of the gr01?


 


  Sure - the GR06 should be good for rock considering the price. The bass isn't as tight as that of the GR07 and the depth is poorer but again quite reasonable for the price. I haven't spent much time with the GR01 but so far it seems to be one of the better TWFK-based earphones I've heard. Love the build, fit, and isolation, too.


----------



## NotSoSerious

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sure - the GR06 should be good for rock considering the price. The bass isn't as tight as that of the GR07 and the depth is poorer but again quite reasonable for the price. I haven't spent much time with the GR01 but so far it seems to be one of the better TWFK-based earphones I've heard. Love the build, fit, and isolation, too.


 


  Speaking of the GR06, how would it sound with hip-hop/rap? I was thinking the Gr06's limited bass depth might not be suited for something that involves a lot of bass. Is it something that can be fixed with a little bit of equilalizing? 
  The build looks incredibly solid in the price range, and the amount of accessories look tempting either.
  If the Gr06's bass seems insufficient I feel I will just have to do with the Eterna. The excellent build of the Gr06 compared to the Eterna is sure tempting however...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Speaking of the GR06, how would it sound with hip-hop/rap? I was thinking the Gr06's limited bass depth might not be suited for something that involves a lot of bass. Is it something that can be fixed with a little bit of equilalizing?
> The build looks incredibly solid in the price range, and the amount of accessories look tempting either.
> If the Gr06's bass seems insufficient I feel I will just have to do with the Eterna. The excellent build of the Gr06 compared to the Eterna is sure tempting however...


 

 It's got emphasized bass but not on level with something like the Eterna, Consonance, id Spark, vPulse, etc. Not sure how it responds to EQ - haven't tried - but you would need to add a lot of bass to get up to Eterna levels and I wouldn't recommend that over just getting an Eterna.


----------



## NotSoSerious

Thank you Joker,
   
  I will definently go with the Eterna. Though I wish it was built as well as the Gr06.... Gotta learn that I can't get everything..
   
  Thanks again.~
  Your work and quality of these review threads never ceases to amaze me.. You have my abundant respect.~


----------



## kanuka

> Sure - the GR06 should be good for rock considering the price. The bass isn't as tight as that of the GR07 and the depth is poorer but again quite reasonable for the price. I haven't spent much time with the *GR01 *but so far it seems to be one of the *better TWFK-based* earphones I've heard. Love the build, fit, and isolation, too.


 

  
  is it more like the dba-02/ck10 or more to the q-jays side?


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You're asking for an apples-to-oranges comparison in great detail between two sets I haven't heard in a year or more. Sorry, no can do. From a very general SQ perspective the DDM is more bass-heavy (considering it's an in-ear) and has better depth but for more detail you'd have to find someone who can compare both directly.


 
   
  Thank You Joker. I think I should create a new topic.


----------



## syrgon

Hello,
   
  Are you planning to test MEElectronics MEE RX12 ? I'm thinking about buying its but I wonder it's at least as good as RX11. Maybe it's obvious but I'm not expert so I would appraciate if somebody could confirm its quality. Thank you in advance 
   
  Greeting from Poland


----------



## TVisz

Yoo im lookin for good IEMs for around $100 (AUD). I listen to mainly hip-hop, RnB, lotsa ballads and pop. could someone give me some suggestions?? Ive had a look at HiFiMan RE-ZERO buut i found a lot of quality issues from reviews. I found the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE too buut heard that the sound isnt as good and there are better for that amount of money worth. I know i kinda am askin for a lot buut i just wanna get a good quality soundin and lastin IEMs. Hope someone can help Thx.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Thank you Joker,
> 
> I will definently go with the Eterna. Though I wish it was built as well as the Gr06.... Gotta learn that I can't get everything..
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks, hope you like the Fischers.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> is it more like the dba-02/ck10 or more to the q-jays side?


 

 Not sure yet, seems to be somewhere between. It's not quite as cold as my DBA-02 mkII but doesn't seem to have as much bass as a q-JAYS.
   


  Quote: 





syrgon said:


> Hello,
> 
> Are you planning to test MEElectronics MEE RX12 ? I'm thinking about buying its but I wonder it's at least as good as RX11. Maybe it's obvious but I'm not expert so I would appraciate if somebody could confirm its quality. Thank you in advance
> 
> Greeting from Poland


 

 No plans at this time
   


  Quote: 





tvisz said:


> Yoo im lookin for good IEMs for around $100 (AUD). I listen to mainly hip-hop, RnB, lotsa ballads and pop. could someone give me some suggestions?? Ive had a look at HiFiMan RE-ZERO buut i found a lot of quality issues from reviews. I found the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE too buut heard that the sound isnt as good and there are better for that amount of money worth. I know i kinda am askin for a lot buut i just wanna get a good quality soundin and lastin IEMs. Hope someone can help Thx.


 

 There are reviews and a chart on the front page of this thread that might be useful. I don't think you can do much better than a DTX101 if you're looking for more than just sound quality but maybe you should ask the person who told you that you could.


----------



## AndyQ

Hi Joker,
  Congratulations for the thread it is great, and is helping me a lot in deciding which are the best IEM for me. I like very boomy and bassy IEMs, is the IE8 the best in the market with those specs? As well with the ie80 Ive seen in europe its price is going down to 300 USD, do you think that price is reasonable for its quality?


----------



## twinherohk

Great reviews, I can't believe how much that must have cost you....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





andyq said:


> Hi Joker,
> Congratulations for the thread it is great, and is helping me a lot in deciding which are the best IEM for me. I like very boomy and bassy IEMs, is the IE8 the best in the market with those specs? As well with the ie80 Ive seen in europe its price is going down to 300 USD, do you think that price is reasonable for its quality?


 

 $300 is pretty good for an IE8/IE80 all things considered. Monster MD is the other one I'd maybe take a look at if you're after a higher-end IEM with those requirements.


  
  Quote: 





twinherohk said:


> Great reviews, I can't believe how much that must have cost you....


 

 Thanks!


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





andyq said:


> Hi Joker,
> Congratulations for the thread it is great, and is helping me a lot in deciding which are the best IEM for me. I like very boomy and bassy IEMs, is the IE8 the best in the market with those specs? As well with the ie80 Ive seen in europe its price is going down to 300 USD, do you think that price is reasonable for its quality?


 
  Where and do these European sites ship to Canada


----------



## ljokerl

Added Klipsch X10 and Sony XBA-4SL
   
  Quote:   
   
*(2A23) Klipsch Image X10 / X10i*


Reviewed Mar 2012

 Details: Tiny single-BA design from Klipsch
 Current Price: *$155* from amazon.com (MSRP: $349.99); $279 for X10i with microphone
 Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _50Ω_ | Sens: _110 dB_ | Freq: _5-19k Hz_ | Cable: _4.4' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _Klipsch oval gels (stock), Sony Hybrids_
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(4.5/5) *- Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange (2 sizes) oval gel tips, cleaning tool, airplane adapter, 6.3mm adapter, and magnetic-clasp carrying pouch
 Build Quality* (3/5) *– Though the tiny housings of the Image One are made out of metal and feel very solid, the molded strain reliefs are designed rather poorly and seem prone to splitting with extended use. The cable is typical Klipsch – thin and plasitcky. The low-profile 3.5mm L-plug is a nice touch
 Isolation *(4.5/5) *– The slim, long, fully sealed housings allow for great isolation
 Microphonics *(4.5/5) *– Somewhat bothersome when worn cord-down; nearly nonexistent with cable-up wear
 Comfort *(5/5) *– The combination of skinny, lightweight shells and Klipsch’s Oval Gel eartips makes the X10 one of the most comfortable IEMs around. Unlike most Etys, the X10s still sound good with only moderately deep insertion, making them more user-friendly towards IEM newcomers as well

 Sound* (8.8/10) *– Tuned for a mainstream, consumer-friendly sound, the Klipsch Image X10 tends to emphasize the bass and lower midrange – a sharp contrast to its single-armature competitors. The X10 easily beats all other higher-end single-armature earphones I’ve come across when it comes to bass quantity and offers up plenty of quality as well. The low is detailed and extended - the well-textured bass digs deep and offers up the sort of well-measured punch one would normally expect from a multi-armature monitor. The depth and impact of the X10 are actually about on-par with VSonic’s dynamic-driver GR07 monitor, though the mid-bass emphasis is slightly greater. Naturally, the lower-end dynamic-driver Klipsch Image models produce even more bass than the X10 but have none of the poise and precision of a balanced armature, sounding bloated and unrefined next to the flagship.

 While the bass depth and punch of the X10 are fairly similar to the VSonic GR07, the two differ greatly in how the midrange is handled. The X10 is warm and full, with a bit of bass bleed resulting in a lack of transparency next to sets such as the GR07, Etymotic HF5, and ACS T15. The GR07 is not only clearer but also more resolving, with more air and openness to its mids and more neutral overall tone. The X10, on the other hand, sounds more forward and intimate, with the prominent midrange putting vocals front-and-center. It is not as forward and aggressive as Fischer Audio’s SBA-03, however, and sounds less like a BA-based earphone with better timbre and a more full-bodied note presentation. The SBA-03, on the other hand, is significantly less colored and more aggressive with presenting detail, so analytical listeners will likely prefer it over the X10s.

 The treble of the X10 is much smoother than the uneven, harsh top ends of the Image S3/S4 and the somewhat grainy S2. Most times the top end seems slightly recessed but much to my surprise on a few tracks the X10 managed to be as sibilant as the GR07. Seems that it was tuned to be non-fatiguing but isn’t all that soft – certainly not in the way the dynamic-driver Fischer Tandem or Monster Pro Gold are. Treble detail is decent and the extension is not too bad, but hardly impressive next to an Ety ER4S or JVC FXT90. Clearly the X10 is limited by the single BA setup and was tuned to leave nothing out at the bottom end at the expense of some top-end reach. The treble is low on sparkle and lacks some authority and energy – Klipsch’s now-discontinued Custom 3 is similarly non-fatiguing but appears more balanced overall.

 The presentation of the X10 is well-rounded and, like the sound signature, yields no surprises. The soundstage is narrower than those of the CK10, ER4S, and GR07 but has decent width and some height. For a more intimate-sounding earphone, the X10 has a convincing presentation – more so, for example, than the Fischer Audio SBA-03. Instrument separation is decent but no match for the ER4S and 3-D imaging lags noticeably behind the CK10. Dynamics are good, however, and the earphones are efficient enough for portable use without being overly sensitive.

 Value *(9/10) *– The Image X10 is a high-end consumer-oriented IEM that combines the unobtrusive look and feel of the slim, lightweight housings with warm, smooth, punchy sound derived from a single balance armature driver. The X10’s greatest strength is its bass – extended, controlled, and unusually powerful for a single BA. Like all things Klipsch, the X10 is not suited for fans of neutral or analytical sound with its somewhat dull top end and colored midrange, but those in search of a warmer sound in a great form factor will be pleased with the $150 X10.

*Pros: Good isolation, very small and comfortable, consumer-friendly sound from a single BA
 Cons: Perilous construction*
   
  Thanks to* Inks* for the X10 loan
   

   
   
  Quote: 





> *(1C15) Sony XBA-4SL / XBA-4ip*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Mar 2012
> ...


----------



## Swimsonny

i am looking for a iem to companion my dba-02 which has a warmer sound signature with a wider sound stage but hopefully keeping as much of the clarity. i have been looking at dynamics such as the jvc fxt90, sony ex600 and re262. what do you think? thanks


----------



## Omnirai

At last the much awaited XBA-4 review, many thanks! I was looking for an upgrade to my ortofon e-Q5s, but it would seem like these are not it...
   
  If I might ask, will there be plans to review the Aurisonics ASG-1/AS-1 at some point in time? These have attained something of an FOTM status and I'm sure many will be interested in a review from yourself.


----------



## Inks

Those XBA4s sound disappointing, XBA1 looks impressive though.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote:joker 





> It has good separation, too, but there are issues with how it is achieved. With many tracks the XBA-4 very obviously lacks coherency, especially at higher volumes, and sounds downright disjointed compared to single-driver sets such as the GR07. Many are of the opinion that all multi-BA setups sound incoherent but compared to the XBA-4 all of my TWFK-based sets as well as the K2 SP and CTM-200 sound extremely well-integrated. The individualized outputs of the four drivers do enhance the sense of separation, but I can’t help but feel that the single-driver XBA-1 may sound more natural than the quad.


 
  Considering the review I'm surprised sound wise they got such a high score of 9. Sounds like they're an overall mixed bag of pluses and minuses.
   
  Many thanks for the review joker. Right now I'm rather disillusioned with my X10. I personally hate the thin cord and think the overall formfactor although attractive won't stand the test of time. Right now I'm trying to decide whether to reshell them move them along to another home or wait until they bite the dust and then reshell them. i nearly traded them away a few days ago but the other party found another buyer before I could get a final answer to him about the trade.


----------



## glac1er

Thanks for the great reviews as always joker. Been waiting a while for the XBA-4SL and that dampens my curiosity a little .
   
  Though I'm a little surprised that the IMO overly close presentation of the X10 didn't prevent you from giving it a relatively high score. Keep up the good work.


----------



## chidori

thanks for your review of the xba-4, which was right on time.
   
  I'm in the midst of looking for an iem which excels in the sub bass department in addition to my e-q5.
  1. xba-4
  2. westone 3
  3. miles davis
  4. atrios mg7
   
  I was just about to go for the xba-4sl after all the hype about the quad driver but after reading your review, i might be better off with the miles davis after heavy discount : )


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





chidori said:


> thanks for your review of the xba-4, which was right on time.
> 
> I'm in the midst of looking for an iem which excels in the sub bass department in addition to my e-q5.
> 1. xba-4
> ...


 
   
  The best with sub bass would be the MG7s. If the offer on atrio.me still stands its an excellent deal.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Great reviews again for the X10 and XBA-4! My impressions were pretty similar to yours while trying out the Sonys.


----------



## TVisz

AAAH does anyone have any suggestions on where i should get Audeo Phonak PFE 012? liike any other sites that have a price tag of less than $100?? liike the one on Amazon cuz the one on Amazon doesnt shiip to Australia T^T


----------



## Azathoth

Klipsch should really launch "V2" revisions of the X10 and Custom 3 with better cables, they would have sure winners on their hands. The Custom 3 was my first relatively high-end IEM and if not for the cable failure (the store did replace them with a brand new unit), I would never have sold them.


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Quote: 





azathoth said:


> Klipsch should really launch "V2" revisions of the X10 and Custom 3 with better cables, they would have sure winners on their hands. The Custom 3 was my first relatively high-end IEM and if not for the cable failure (the store did replace them with a brand new unit), I would never have sold them.


 

  
  QFT. and I gotta say I'm surprised the X10 scored so high. My impression was that it had inferior detail in both mids & bass compared to the TF10 and the bass overwhelmed the rest of the sound spectrum .


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  I received my Eterna today and so far I'm liking it, soundstage is really very immersive. treble seems to me lil bit more to me than with the brainwavz M2.
   
  Thank You Joker


----------



## AndyQ

In Amazon.es (Spanish) they shell the ie8i for 205 euros (265 USD), I dont know if they shell to Canada. I've seen the Monster page shells the MD for 150 USD but they dont send it to outside US a pity .
  Anyhow anybody know for a basshead whats better ie8 or ie80?
  
   

  
  Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Where and do these European sites ship to Canada


----------



## Inks

fimbulvetr said:


> QFT. and I gotta say I'm surprised the X10 scored so high. My impression was that it had inferior detail in both mids & bass compared to the TF10 and the bass overwhelmed the rest of the sound spectrum .


 
  I agree, this is how they compare if you simplify it. "Overwhelmed" i assume is relative to the TF10. Bass levels should be pretty close to something like the EPH-100 which people have no problem with (X10 has a bit more midbass, 100s have more subbass). I do think it's borderline too bassy, but it's also amazing how people accept much bassier or close to same bass level phones. MDs.FX700s, etc... for example are just muddy now to me, too much a good thing. I really like the X10s rumble, you really do feel that subbass presence, just wish it had a more flatter midbass. It's bass is of fast transients and linearity despite humps (more linear bumps instead of curvy  ones) which results in a more coherent bump whereas most dynamics don't control their air as well. For those X10 users, I highly recommend the newer more tapered Monster Supertips, better isolation and the larger bore opens up the treble.
   
  The X10's score seems highly proper, if anything I think other IEMs that are below it should be higher (HF3/PFE) and certain ones are just too high (MDs/IE8/Coppers). We do have a different definition of what's technically better, but it is fairly close. I sometimes agree and disagree with his ratings as a whole. His sound descriptions should be what gets more attention though and those are spot-on generally.


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Quote: 





inks said:


> I agree, this is how they compare if you simplify it. "Overwhelmed" i assume is relative to the TF10. Bass levels should be pretty close to something like the EPH-100 which people have no problem with (X10 has a bit more midbass, 100s have more subbass). I do think it's borderline too bassy, but it's also amazing how people accept much bassier or close to same bass level phones. MDs.FX700s, etc... for example are just muddy now to me, too much a good thing. I really like the X10s rumble, you really do feel that subbass presence, just wish it had a more flatter midbass. It's bass is of fast transients and linearity despite humps (more linear bumps instead of curvy  ones) which results in a more coherent bump whereas most dynamics don't control their air as well. For those X10 users, I highly recommend the newer more tapered Monster Supertips, better isolation and the larger bore opens up the treble.
> 
> The X10's score seems highly proper, if anything I think other IEMs that are below it should be higher (HF3/PFE) and certain ones are just too high (MDs/IE8/Coppers). We do have a different definition of what's technically better, but it is fairly close. I sometimes agree and disagree with his ratings as a whole. His sound descriptions should be what gets more attention though and those are spot-on generally.


 
  I'm definitely not an audiophile so I'm probably not giving a good description. Maybe it is the midbass that bothers me a lot and the fact that I don't like overly bassy headphones.  I do like the X10 a lot more when I EQ the mids/highs up a bit, but the highs still bother me  because the decay? (dont know if this is the right term) seems too short. Also, I'm using sony hybrids with the X10.
   
  I haven't owned most of the IEMs you listed, but from memory I feel that the HF3 was a superior IEM compared to the X10 as well. You're probably right about the sound descriptions though, I just dislike the sound signature of the X10.


----------



## Inks

You lack the terms, but I can see where you are getting at and you are right. It does seem that the midbass is bothering you. Hybrids do help the midhighs but it still lacks in there and the treble decay/extension isn't great because it's single BA doesn't have the wide bandwidth of the TF10. 
   
  I agree, HF3s are technically superior and can easily understand why you dislike the X10. 
   
  You being new to the hobby, it's hard to find someone that knows what sounds balanced and correct, congrats on being ahead of the curve.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> i am looking for a iem to companion my dba-02 which has a warmer sound signature with a wider sound stage but hopefully keeping as much of the clarity. i have been looking at dynamics such as the jvc fxt90, sony ex600 and re262. what do you think? thanks


 
   
  All three should be good options. The FXT90 has a fairly forward presentation and the EX600 isn't really warm but I don't think you can be disappointed with any of them if your requirements aren't completely rigid.
  
   


  Quote: 





omnirai said:


> At last the much awaited XBA-4 review, many thanks! I was looking for an upgrade to my ortofon e-Q5s, but it would seem like these are not it...
> 
> If I might ask, will there be plans to review the Aurisonics ASG-1/AS-1 at some point in time? These have attained something of an FOTM status and I'm sure many will be interested in a review from yourself.


 

 I should be able to get a loan of the ASG-1 in the future.
   


  Quote: 





inks said:


> Those XBA4s sound disappointing, XBA1 looks impressive though.


 

 Indeed, wouldn't be surprised if it's technically very close to the XBA-4. Being 1/4 the price should help as well.
   


  Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Considering the review I'm surprised sound wise they got such a high score of 9. Sounds like they're an overall mixed bag of pluses and minuses.
> 
> Many thanks for the review joker. Right now I'm rather disillusioned with my X10. I personally hate the thin cord and think the overall formfactor although attractive won't stand the test of time. Right now I'm trying to decide whether to reshell them move them along to another home or wait until they bite the dust and then reshell them. i nearly traded them away a few days ago but the other party found another buyer before I could get a final answer to him about the trade.


 
   
  That's the beauty of including numerical scores - reviews are partly semantics and the same review can be written in a positive or negative tone. I was disappointed with the Sonys from the day I first heard them at CES and I'm sure that shows through in the language. Numbers are honest, however - after some A:B listening I can say that I think the XBA-4 performs better than (for example) the X10 but worse than the GR07, which doesn't leave me any leeway in the scoring. 

 Oh and I wouldn't trust the X10 any further than the warranty period. 
   


  Quote: 





glac1er said:


> Thanks for the great reviews as always joker. Been waiting a while for the XBA-4SL and that dampens my curiosity a little .
> 
> Though I'm a little surprised that the IMO overly close presentation of the X10 didn't prevent you from giving it a relatively high score. Keep up the good work.


 

 Wouldn't recommend them to someone looking for a spacious presentation, that's for sure!

  
  Quote: 





chidori said:


> thanks for your review of the xba-4, which was right on time.
> 
> I'm in the midst of looking for an iem which excels in the sub bass department in addition to my e-q5.
> 1. xba-4
> ...


 
   
  Just goes to show that it's not the number of drivers but what you do with them. If you can get the MD at some of these recent ridiculous discount prices, that's definitely the way to go. Otherwise the FX700 is still the king when comes to subbass+overall performance as far as I'm concerned. If isolation matters and you're more concerned with sub-bass than overall performance, the MG7 is also a good buy. The W3 has good bass but it simply doesn't dig as deep as the rest of these.
   


  Quote: 





realslimseto said:


> Great reviews again for the X10 and XBA-4! My impressions were pretty similar to yours while trying out the Sonys.


 

 Thanks!


  Quote: 





tvisz said:


> AAAH does anyone have any suggestions on where i should get Audeo Phonak PFE 012? liike any other sites that have a price tag of less than $100?? liike the one on Amazon cuz the one on Amazon doesnt shiip to Australia T^T


 

 Soundearphones carries them but I would contact Phonak and ask about Australian distribution.



  Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> QFT. and I gotta say I'm surprised the X10 scored so high. My impression was that it had inferior detail in both mids & bass compared to the TF10 and the bass overwhelmed the rest of the sound spectrum .


 


  Noone is saying it's a better earphone than the TF10 but it does have a number of positive traits like a well-rounded (albeit intimate) presentation - great next to something like an HF5 or Fischer SBA-03 - as well as good bass depth, speed, etc.


  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> I received my Eterna today and so far I'm liking it, soundstage is really very immersive. treble seems to me lil bit more to me than with the brainwavz M2.
> 
> Thank You Joker


 

 Great, glad you like them!


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Oh I'm just saying I'm surprised; nothing against the review at all. I'm sure I don't look at things anywhere as objectively as you do and I'm probably pretty biased due to my sound signature preferences. I mention the TF10 is because its one of the few IEMs I have personally used.


----------



## Selenium

I thought the X10 was garbage(for the price) at first. I know people say BAs don't burn-in, but after being put-off by the sound I just left them plugged into the other headphone jack on my E7 while I listened to something else, then I loaned them to someone who was going on vacation and was packing earbuds for their flight. Then when I got them back two weeks later they sounded like a different earphone and I actually like them now. I'm sure it's just my mind playing tricks on me, though.
   
  Joker, I see you mention the XBA-1 -- have you heard it yet? It's pretty darn good and I'm guessing you'll like it over the X10 for being leaner and brighter. Similar balance to the EX600/1000.
   
  Edit - In reading a little more carefully, I'm guessing you've probably heard it.


----------



## aleki

Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> I'm definitely not an audiophile so I'm probably not giving a good description. Maybe it is the midbass that bothers me a lot and the fact that I don't like overly bassy headphones.  I do like the X10 a lot more when I EQ the mids/highs up a bit, but the highs still bother me  because the decay? (dont know if this is the right term) seems too short. Also, I'm using sony hybrids with the X10.
> 
> I haven't owned most of the IEMs you listed, but from memory I feel that the HF3 was a superior IEM compared to the X10 as well. You're probably right about the sound descriptions though, I just dislike the sound signature of the X10.


 

 I concur with your statement. My impression of the x10's wasnt all that great and also thought the HF3 was a league ahead. I'm genuinely surprised the x10s received the score they did.


----------



## TwoSongs

It seems the FA Silver Bullets got a v2 with improved cabling: 

http://www.gd-audiobase.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=11&category_id=4&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=2

Has anyone tried them?


----------



## FlySweep

twosongs said:


> It seems the FA Silver Bullets got a v2 with improved cabling:
> http://www.gd-audiobase.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=11&category_id=4&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=2
> Has anyone tried them?


 

Yes.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selenium said:


> I thought the X10 was garbage(for the price) at first. I know people say BAs don't burn-in, but after being put-off by the sound I just left them plugged into the other headphone jack on my E7 while I listened to something else, then I loaned them to someone who was going on vacation and was packing earbuds for their flight. Then when I got them back two weeks later they sounded like a different earphone and I actually like them now. I'm sure it's just my mind playing tricks on me, though.
> 
> Joker, I see you mention the XBA-1 -- have you heard it yet? It's pretty darn good and I'm guessing you'll like it over the X10 for being leaner and brighter. Similar balance to the EX600/1000.
> 
> Edit - In reading a little more carefully, I'm guessing you've probably heard it.


 


  I originally heard both the XBA-1 and XBA-4 at a show and the XBA-1 was the one that caught my interest. I thought a longer trial with the XBA-4 would change that but I'm still way more interested in the 1.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

I haven't heard the XBA-1s, but I have heard the 4 and the 3s. I would say the 3s are overall more balanced sounding and smoother as a whole, though their lows don't extend as deep.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker,
  I'm deciding on which to buy, the SoundMagic E30 and PL50, how do they compare to each other?


----------



## Kibble Fat

Jumping in with another recommendation request...

Hi Joker, 
I'm looking for a full-size or portable equivalent to the HiFiMAN RE-262. There was a lack of recommendations in all 4 places I asked this and I'm fairly certain the advice I did get was 2nd hand or inferred from reading others' reviews. Could you recommend something? Keep in mind I'll (likely) be able to try before I buy!

*Budget: *$100-$500 (maybe used?)
*Use: *office cubicle -- closed preferred but could be open if small (ala Koss PortaPro). I'm mostly concerned with sound leak, not isolation.
*From mvw2's 262 review, key attributes for me:*
- detailed
- great clarity / transparency
- mid-centric
- non-fatiguing, sweet treble
- highly dynamic

I would like to make this an upgrade more than a side-grade, although I get the impression that the 262 is very unique IEM and in some areas, it is the best at what it does. Being a portable / full-size newbie, I really need your help in narrowing down my search. Even a brand recommendation would help a lot! From the RE-262's sound, I could stand to have a touch more bass quantity, and a tiny bit brighter presentation overall (trade a tiny amount of mids for highs?).

I was recommended the HE-300 (open) and the ESW9 in other threads. I was also going to revisit the HD598 which I liked for the 10 minutes I listened to it... it certainly didn't have a huge impact on me... Sennheisers generally don't.

Help please?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker,
> I'm deciding on which to buy, the SoundMagic E30 and PL50, how do they compare to each other?


 

 The PL50 is better if you want a warmer, more mid-centric sound with a thicker/more viscous presentation and great overall refinement. The E30 has better range, more bass quantity, a more neutral tone, and an airier, more open sound
   


  Quote: 





kibble fat said:


> Jumping in with another recommendation request...
> Hi Joker,
> I'm looking for a full-size or portable equivalent to the HiFiMAN RE-262. There was a lack of recommendations in all 4 places I asked this and I'm fairly certain the advice I did get was 2nd hand or inferred from reading others' reviews. Could you recommend something? Keep in mind I'll (likely) be able to try before I buy!
> *Budget: *$100-$500 (maybe used?)
> ...


 

 You're probably asking the wrong person - I've owned maybe 10 higher-end full-size headphones in all of my time here. Having tried several hundred portables and IEMs makes it acutely obvious how woefully inadequate that is to make a proper recommendation (I don't recommend anything based on reading, partly because I don't have the time to do any these days). Out of what I've heard the HD580/HD600 reminds me most of the RE262, followed maybe by the K601. I easily prefer the HD600 to the HD598 when driven properly but if you found the HD598 boring, maybe the HD600 isn't the best option out there.


----------



## TheElf

Hi all,
   
  I'm looking for advice regarding a new set of IEMs to replace my ageing Sony EX76s, which have recently developed a faulty connection to the right earbud.
   
  With a budget of ~£25, I narrowed my choices down to the Soundmagic PL11+ or the MEElectronics MP21 and posted in the "IEM buying advice" thread. Here, it was recommended to me to consider the DUNU-12 Tridents and Soundmagic E10s for higher sound quality, as per joker's reviews.
   
  I then found the Brainwavz M2s (seemingly highly recommended by Head-Fiers) at a very reasonable price and was about to pull the trigger when I read a post over in the HardwareZone forums which suggests that the M2s are "terribly bassy".
   
  Given that the majority of the time I'm listening to drum and bass, I suspect this might not be _such_ a bad thing… what would your opinion be? Of the headphones I've mentioned, which do you think would be the best choice for me?
   
  These IEMs will be used either with my iPod touch (4G) or my 2007 iMac. I also like to listen to the occasional spoken word podcast.
   
  Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance for any advice


----------



## Kibble Fat

Joker -- Thanks for the input! Yeah, Sennheisers are usually too dark for my taste, HD600 included. I haven't heard the 601 so that's going on my "to try" list. 

I suppose I'll just have to bump my own thread periodically or give up on my search and just try a different sound. Also, thanks for the great IEM reveiws! They lead to my purchase of the RE-Zero two years ago and the RE-262 last August

Cheers!


----------



## JustSound

Hi Joker, this is my first post on head-fi... Though, I have been looking around for quite a while..
  I see you do not like the Crossfade LP... But, nowadays it is easily found for $100 dollars. 
  How is the value at $100? Does it at least top something like the XB500 or the 700, despite the price range?
   
  Thanks, it really surprises me how much work you put into this excellent thread...


----------



## bboytymee

Hey Joker or anyone who's ever tried the ATH-CKS77. Do you know how it compares to the Atrios MG7? Im a bass monster so I want something with earthquake like bass.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





theelf said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm looking for advice regarding a new set of IEMs to replace my ageing Sony EX76s, which have recently developed a faulty connection to the right earbud.
> 
> ...


 


  The M2 is definitely bassy but far from 'terribly bassy'. That would be something like a MEElec M31 or Sony XB40EX. I think the M2s are a safe choice and a great value at that price.


  Quote: 





kibble fat said:


> Joker -- Thanks for the input! Yeah, Sennheisers are usually too dark for my taste, HD600 included. I haven't heard the 601 so that's going on my "to try" list.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I normally like a brighter sound as well but the HD580/HD600, when properly amped, simply work. I will probably end up letting go of my K701 and keeping just my HD580 and K601 in the long run in addition to all of my closed cans.
   
  Glad the IEM reviews have helped!


  Quote: 





justsound said:


> Hi Joker, this is my first post on head-fi... Though, I have been looking around for quite a while..
> I see you do not like the Crossfade LP... But, nowadays it is easily found for $100 dollars.
> How is the value at $100? Does it at least top something like the XB500 or the 700, despite the price range?
> 
> Thanks, it really surprises me how much work you put into this excellent thread...


 

 The XB500 should be closer to $50, otherwise sure - the Crossfade can compete with it. The XB700 is an interesting one as technically I think it is better than both the Crossfade and the XB500 but it's a bit less warm and not as mid-bassy so it may not appeal to bass lovers as much as the Crossfade/XB500. There was a $100 deal on the D1100 posted in the deal thread recently if you're looking for a great circumaural basshead set in that price range.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





bboytymee said:


> Hey Joker or anyone who's ever tried the ATH-CKS77. Do you know how it compares to the Atrios MG7? Im a bass monster so I want something with earthquake like bass.


 

      What's your budget?
       Also, J&R sells the Monster Turbine Gold for $179.99
       Or the JVC FX-500 is something you want instead of the CKS77.
       If you care about better detail retrieval than the MG7, the the FX500 or JVC HA-FXT90 are the best choices.


----------



## TheElf

Thank you so much joker,
   
  Just placed my order  All I really needed was someone to nudge me in the right direction!


----------



## jarrett

I got the E30 for fun. It definitely has a low-fi sound signature to me. Mids and bass oriented, neutral, not superbly clean or clear, detail is not bad. For me I wish I could EQ the bass down further. There are some prominent bass/mid bass frequencies which tend to always be prominent and exaggerate that frequency range a bit much for my liking (bleed?) [Nick Drake tracks for example and acoustic World Music...should sound articulate and clear throughout a spectrum]. Treble is laid back in the presentation as mentioned before. I'm making these comments with basically no burn-in. I burned them in overnight now and should have up to 20 hours of time on them. Do the E30 change? Maybe it's just the headphones I am coming from, but the reviews have been a little too positive.


----------



## Turfie

Thank you so much for this extended review, amazing!
   
  I got the Sennheiser IE80's
  i was looking into the westone line primarily but by lack of distribution in my country i decided on the senns.
  I sure hope the isolation isn't that mediocre as you stated, we'll see


----------



## Niyologist

First Impressions: In the first 2 hours, the FXT90 sounds very thick, but it seriously started to thin out a bit, making the details more transparent. The bass is rumbling, yet detail and doesn't mess with the midrange at all. No Bass Bleed to speak of and the sound is going through a serious change. I'm just totally impressed of the dynamics and the instrument separation. The timbre is just starting to get good and it'll only get better from here on out. The treble is impressive with the detail, sparkle and extension. Treble heads should not be disappointed of at least 12 hours of burn-in. What's really awesome about this IEM is how very engaging it is. Despite the slightly above average width and well above average depth, it's still engaging and even very revealing. I heard so many things with the FXT90 I never heard before. I'm keeping these. I'll have more info after 12 hours of burn-in.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> I got the E30 for fun. It definitely has a low-fi sound signature to me. Mids and bass oriented, neutral, not superbly clean or clear, detail is not bad. For me I wish I could EQ the bass down further. There are some prominent bass/mid bass frequencies which tend to always be prominent and exaggerate that frequency range a bit too much for my liking (bleed?) [Nick Drake tracks for example and acoustic World Music...should sound articulate and clear throughout a spectrum]. Treble is laid back in the presentation as mentioned before. I'm making these comments with basically no burn-in. I burned them in overnight now and should have up to 15 hours of time on them. Do the E30 change? Maybe it's just the headphones I am coming from, but the reviews have been a little too positive.


 

 Not sure, I don't have time to listen to anything pre burn-in these days.
   


  Quote: 





turfie said:


> Thank you so much for this extended review, amazing!
> 
> I got the Sennheiser IE80's
> i was looking into the westone line primarily but by lack of distribution in my country i decided on the senns.
> I sure hope the isolation isn't that mediocre as you stated, we'll see


 

 It's not bad with longer tips but I thought they sounded best with a shallow fit so it's a bit of an either-or type deal.


----------



## tseliottt

Recommendation for IEMs that are basically ER4Ps with more bass?
   
  I have ER4Ps and I love their presentation.
  I love how you can pick apart instruments and easily separate the snare from the kick from the high hat.
  I love how "holographic" everything is, and how you can hear that the strings are in the far right corner of the room and the vocalist is right in front of you.
  I love how you can hear every detail like the coarseness of a singers voice.
  I love how a track that's sibilant on my D2000s aren't sibilant on the Etys, yet they certainly have sparkle.
  I love how real everything sounds.
  I just don't like that they're bass light.
   
  I also have Atrio's which I thought would replace my Ety's. They have the bass I love, but the presentation is more smashed together. It's harder to separate sounds, and everything seems sort of smeared together. So I've been reverting to my Ety's lately.
   
  Can you suggest a couple of IEMs that have the same presentation and sound signature as the ER4s, but with more bass?


----------



## WaLaoEh

Hey joker, how does the Creative Aurvana 3 compare to the GR07? I have my GR07s, and am hoping to upgrade. Does it have better clarity,separation, and lesser / no sibilance?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> Recommendation for IEMs that are basically ER4Ps with more bass?
> 
> I have ER4Ps and I love their presentation.
> I love how you can pick apart instruments and easily separate the snare from the kick from the high hat.
> ...


 


   
  K2 SP is probably closest except in presentation where it is more forward/aggressive than the ER4S (I've never heard the ER4P). It's got plenty of bass compared to Etys and top shelf clarity/detail/separation. It also images better in 3D but again coming from Etys might sound too forward, at least at first. 
   
  The ACS T15 is another option. It is quite close in performance to my ER4S but has a signature tilted a bit more towards the bottom and away from the top. The difference might not be as great as you would want coming from a D2000, though.
   
  Aside from that there are a number of sets that differ in key ways from Etys but are still worth checking out IMO - the Westone 2, Ortofon e-Q5, MDR-EX1000, or - if you want even more bass (which it seems like you might) - the Westone UM3X. The UM3X is quite a lot warmer than the Etys and like the K2 SP has a more intimate presentation but the separation is stellar and it images rather well. No sibilance and excellent center image ability for that 'vocalist front and center' feel.


  Quote: 





walaoeh said:


> Hey joker, how does the Creative Aurvana 3 compare to the GR07? I have my GR07s, and am hoping to upgrade. Does it have better clarity,separation, and lesser / no sibilance?


 
   
  Worse clarity, worse separation, but definitely lesser/no sibilance. I don't think the Aurvana 3 is a top-tier IEM or an upgrade to the GR07 but if sibilance is an issue with the VSonics, it might work better for you.


----------



## tseliottt

Thanks a lot! You really are a great asset to this community. Coincidentally, the K2 and T15s were the models that jumped out at me after reading most of your OP. I'll probably try out the EX1000s, UM3X, and maybe the Ortofons though because stores that sell them have return policies. If none of them work out, I'll probably jump for the T15s or K2s.
   
  I'm also going to try out the FXT90's just to see what the JVC signature sounds like. How do you think they compare?


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, would you mind sharing a few of your personal favorite budget IEM's, something under 50$ and 100$ respectively?
   
  Also, how about ECCI PR200 compared to the Soundmagic PL50, the bass quantity I mean


----------



## WaLaoEh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Worse clarity, worse separation, but definitely lesser/no sibilance. I don't think the Aurvana 3 is a top-tier IEM or an upgrade to the GR07 but if sibilance is an issue with the VSonics, it might work better for you.


 

 Thank you! How about the UE600 or SE215? Which has better detail,clarity, and less sibilance?
  If I were to put a cable like this http://www.stereo.com.sg/store/product.php?cPath=568_569&products_id=1730 on the SE215,could it possibly improve detail,clarity, soundstage and bass?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





walaoeh said:


> Thank you! How about the UE600 or SE215? Which has better detail,clarity, and less sibilance?
> If I were to put a cable like this http://www.stereo.com.sg/store/product.php?cPath=568_569&products_id=1730 on the SE215,could it possibly improve detail,clarity, soundstage and bass?


 


  The GR07 is a complete upgrade to the SE215 in every aspect. 
  If the sibilance on the GR07 bothers you so much, sell it and get the FXT90. It's just as good a deal as the GR07, without sibilance.


----------



## WaLaoEh

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> The GR07 is a complete upgrade to the SE215 in every aspect.
> If the sibilance on the GR07 bothers you so much, sell it and get the FXT90. It's just as good a deal as the GR07, without sibilance.


 


  I would,but the wearing style is straight down,which I don't fancy.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





walaoeh said:


> I would,but the wearing style is straight down,which I don't fancy.


 


  The Yamaha EPH-100 may be what you want then. It has a "unisex" body that allows one to wear it up and down.


----------



## shotgunshane

The fxt90 can be worn either up or down.


----------



## eke2k6

As far as the spike on the GR07 goes, I've come to realize that it's a defining characteristic of it's overall sound. That spike is what gives so much life to the drums, cymbals, and male voices. It's either something you can live with or not. Also, the GR07 doesn't *create* sibilance. It exaggerates the heck out of it sometimes, but it's not completely to blame.


----------



## bboytymee

Hey Joker, I'm looking for a IEM around 100-150 with earthshaking/hard hitting bass. So far the suggestions were hippo vb, atrios mg7, and ath-cks77. Which one should I get?


----------



## davidcotton

Just a note for those considering a possible reshell of the x10i.  Fisher will do it but you will still be stuck with the original cables as there is a crossover in them that can't be removed.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> Thanks a lot! You really are a great asset to this community. Coincidentally, the K2 and T15s were the models that jumped out at me after reading most of your OP. I'll probably try out the EX1000s, UM3X, and maybe the Ortofons though because stores that sell them have return policies. If none of them work out, I'll probably jump for the T15s or K2s.
> 
> I'm also going to try out the FXT90's just to see what the JVC signature sounds like. How do you think they compare?


 

 Quite well, but they are also pretty far off the Ety signature so it's hard to say whether they'll be to your liking.
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, would you mind sharing a few of your personal favorite budget IEM's, something under 50$ and 100$ respectively?
> 
> Also, how about ECCI PR200 compared to the Soundmagic PL50, the bass quantity I mean


 

 If we are talking current models at full retail (non-sale) pricing, probably the Brainwavz M1 <$50 and Sunrise Xcape IE <$100 (for sound, at least - mine died after a while). PR200 is bassier than the PL50 but not as good overall. PR300 is much closer and still has decent bass.
   


  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> The GR07 is a complete upgrade to the SE215 in every aspect.   If the sibilance on the GR07 bothers you so much, sell it and get the FXT90. It's just as good a deal as the GR07, without sibilance.


 

 +1. I think you'd be disappointed in many ways going from the GR07 to the SE215 even though the Shures will kill sibilance.
   


  Quote: 





bboytymee said:


> Hey Joker, I'm looking for a IEM around 100-150 with earthshaking/hard hitting bass. So far the suggestions were hippo vb, atrios mg7, and ath-cks77. Which one should I get?


 

 I have not heard the CKS77. Between the other two I'd take the MG7. Based on experience with the TFTA 1V, the TFTA 1XB might be worth looking at as well.
   


  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Just a note for those considering a possible reshell of the x10i.  Fisher will do it but you will still be stuck with the original cables as there is a crossover in them that can't be removed.


 
   
  What is the crossover doing in a single-driver earphone?


----------



## aleki

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Just a note for those considering a possible reshell of the x10i.  Fisher will do it but you will still be stuck with the original cables as there is a crossover in them that can't be removed.


 

 did they confuse the x10 for the custom3? from what I remember, the x10 uses a single BA


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Have you had a chance to listen to the GR01s yet? If so, what are your initial impressions, especially compared to the GR07s. Also, I forget, are they dynamic-armature hybrids, or a dual armature?


----------



## Anaxilus

I too am a bit surprised at the X10 score though mine would probably only be 3-4 tenths lower.  Maybe it's a good/better unit or they do better with non Klipsch tips.  Not pairing well w/ the Klipsch tips would defeat the purpose of Klipsch phones for me personally.  Mine only lasted a few weeks before I got rid of them.  I couldn't find one they did as well or better than anything else in my inventory except maybe the Meelec M6s I keep around for cannon fodder.  The TF10 at the deal price blows it away on many levels and I wasn't their biggest fan either though for the deal price they are hard to argue against.  Comparing X10s to MD's is not the most appropriate apart from bass presence I'd say.  One is involving, emotional and romantic, the other pretty ho hum boring IME.  Really two different animals and the MD's should definitely be considered niche phones for specific genres.
  Anywho, good work joker, keep it up.  Just came by to drop my pennies.


----------



## dustdevil

Are the compression flaws really noticeable on the ety hf5? Half of my files are 192kbps or lower.
   
  But then I've heard from someone saying that the compression flaws mostly appear above 16khz, so its not quite noticeable on the hf5...


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, after trying out a few budget IEM's, I think the ECCI pr200 suits me best, and I'm trying to find an upgrade from them under 100$, any suggestuion?
  will the pr401 fit the bill?
   
  Also, I read in your review that the PR200 has very little bass, you said that you "hear it more than you feel it", and the PL50 still has even fewer bass? I'm really shocked, I thought the PR200 was already a little neutral.... no dips and peaks.... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I found a seller that just won a HiSound Crystal, but isn't interested in it, so he wants to see it, for about 40-50$, will it be a worthy upgrade from a Visang R03? How well does it fare against the PR401?
   
  Sorry for the flood of questions, I'm really new, so I'm still learning alot


----------



## kanuka

some early impressions of the hisound GC and the new DBA-02 mk2 ?


----------



## TwoSongs

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Yes.


 


   
  I see, thanks for the quick reply. One more question, regarding sound signature: I really liked my BrainWavz ProAlphas, and previously in this thread I asked about both the HiFiMan RE0s and Fischer Audio Eternas, particularly regarding bass as the other sonic qualities were understandable enough for me. I was told the former had noticeably less bass while the latter had noticeably more. How would you say the Silver Bullets compare to the ProAlphas in that regard?


----------



## WaLaoEh

damn,i just bought sony hybrids to use on my gr07 ,thinking it would be better, somehow the stock tips seem better, as the hybrids kill soundstage, and maybe do some other things to mess up the sound.


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What is the crossover doing in a single-driver earphone?


 

 We're talking about the x10i with the remote.  That was the explanation I got when I wasn't charged the removeable cables.


----------



## Kibble Fat

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-4EvxkOMQXSk/learn/learningcenter/car/crossovers_faq.html


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Have you had a chance to listen to the GR01s yet? If so, what are your initial impressions, especially compared to the GR07s. Also, I forget, are they dynamic-armature hybrids, or a dual armature?


 

 Dual armature, Knowles TWFK in fact. Listening to them right now - they are good, very good. Closer to DBA-02/CK10 in performance than UE700/Phiaton PS200/q-JAYS but with a less bright signature compared to most TWFK-based phones. I've only A:B'd them vs the UE700 and they were the clear winner for me, though admittedly they cost significantly more.
   


  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I too am a bit surprised at the X10 score though mine would probably only be 3-4 tenths lower.  Maybe it's a good/better unit or they do better with non Klipsch tips.  Not pairing well w/ the Klipsch tips would defeat the purpose of Klipsch phones for me personally.  Mine only lasted a few weeks before I got rid of them.  I couldn't find one they did as well or better than anything else in my inventory except maybe the Meelec M6s I keep around for cannon fodder.  The TF10 at the deal price blows it away on many levels and I wasn't their biggest fan either though for the deal price they are hard to argue against.  Comparing X10s to MD's is not the most appropriate apart from bass presence I'd say.  One is involving, emotional and romantic, the other pretty ho hum boring IME.  Really two different animals and the MD's should definitely be considered niche phones for specific genres.
> Anywho, good work joker, keep it up.  Just came by to drop my pennies.


 

 Thanks, the X10 actually fell at 8.7 before I added my 'subjective' listening factor and that was based partly on comparing them to the SBA-03. I'll need to do some more listening with the SBA-03 compared to other similar sets and see if maybe both of them deserve to drop by 0.1. 

  
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Are the compression flaws really noticeable on the ety hf5? Half of my files are 192kbps or lower.
> 
> But then I've heard from someone saying that the compression flaws mostly appear above 16khz, so its not quite noticeable on the hf5...


 
   
  My answer to this question has not changed since I answered it for you via PM - I don't know of many things more revealing than an Ety at that price point and if you know what to look for, you'll definitely hear compression flaws with a lot of stuff. 


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, after trying out a few budget IEM's, I think the ECCI pr200 suits me best, and I'm trying to find an upgrade from them under 100$, any suggestuion?
> will the pr401 fit the bill?
> 
> Also, I read in your review that the PR200 has very little bass, you said that you "hear it more than you feel it", and the PL50 still has even fewer bass? I'm really shocked, I thought the PR200 was already a little neutral.... no dips and peaks....
> ...


 

 The PR401 is definitely an upgrade to the PR200 but the signature is more v-shaped. If you want something with balance closer to the PR200 near the PR401 price, a Brainwavz M3/ViSang R04 would be my pick. 
   
  The Crystal for $50 is a good deal. It fares very well against the PR401 and M2 but it's a different sort of signature - compared to the PR401 there's not as much treble sparkle, less spacious presentation, and dryer note but it is also quicker, more detailed, and more accurate.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> some early impressions of the hisound GC and the new DBA-02 mk2 ?


 

 None for the GC - haven't listened to it. The DBA-02 MK2 sounds a lot like the old one but is better-built, smaller, and more comfortable.
   


  Quote: 





twosongs said:


> I see, thanks for the quick reply. One more question, regarding sound signature: I really liked my BrainWavz ProAlphas, and previously in this thread I asked about both the HiFiMan RE0s and Fischer Audio Eternas, particularly regarding bass as the other sonic qualities were understandable enough for me. I was told the former had noticeably less bass while the latter had noticeably more. How would you say the Silver Bullets compare to the ProAlphas in that regard?


 
   
  SB will have more bass than a ProAlpha but less than an Eterna.

  
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> We're talking about the x10i with the remote.  That was the explanation I got when I wasn't charged the removeable cables.


 

 Still don't see how a crossover factors into a single-driver system. If you asked to keep the mic/remote unit then I can see why you'd have to keep the stock cable but crossovers shouldn't have anything to do with that.


----------



## Techno Kid

Its funny how subjective an IEM's sound is from person to person.  Take the Creative Aurvana IE3 and GR07, I have both and read your review and some of the comments you've answered that people have asked about them and I hear them different than you.  For me the Aurvana 3 has better clarity than the GR07 and the same amount of separation.  I just got finished listening to the GR07 for about an hour to get my head use to the sound then immediately put the Creatives on and they were cleaner and more revealing to me than the Vsonics.  Now the GR07 has better bass an soundstage but I think the Aurvana has better 3D imaging.  To each their own but on most of the reviews you've done on IEM's I have I tend to hear them like you do just not the Creative's for some reason.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





walaoeh said:


> damn,i just bought sony hybrids to use on my gr07 ,thinking it would be better, somehow the stock tips seem better, as the hybrids kill soundstage, and maybe do some other things to mess up the sound.


 


  That is strange. Perhaps the tips are of the wrong size?


----------



## Kibble Fat

Someone said to trim down the stretchy part of the tip nozzle to prevent it from "hour glass-ing" over the IEM filter opening (at least for larger diameter IEMs). Would this work?


----------



## KimChee

Im surprised to see the Sony XBA-4 got a 9.  Without knowing anything else about it I thought it would have scored higher..


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The DBA-02 MK2 sounds a lot like the old one but is better-built, smaller, and more comfortable.


 

  Hah, I had my suspicions.  Want me to send you my B2 for confirmation or do you have DBA's around still?


----------



## vwinter

realslimseto said:


> That is strange. Perhaps the tips are of the wrong size?





walaoeh said:


> damn,i just bought sony hybrids to use on my gr07 ,thinking it would be better, somehow the stock tips seem better, as the hybrids kill soundstage, and maybe do some other things to mess up the sound.




I hear them the same way. They constrained the soundstage, tempered the highs, and created a muddier sound overall, tad bit more bass too. Pretty much lost the magic for me. Really comfortable though.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Hah, I had my suspicions.  Want me to send you my B2 for confirmation or do you have DBA's around still?


 


  Wouldn't say no to that. I never owned a pair of the original DBAs - I think the ones I reviewed were rawrster's. Only heard a pre-production B2, too.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Wouldn't say no to that. I never owned a pair of the original DBAs - I think the ones I reviewed were rawrster's. Only heard a pre-production B2, too.


 

 I'll send them over.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





walaoeh said:


> damn,i just bought sony hybrids to use on my gr07 ,thinking it would be better, somehow the stock tips seem better, as the hybrids kill soundstage, and maybe do some other things to mess up the sound.


 
   
  Quote: 





kibble fat said:


> Someone said to trim down the stretchy part of the tip nozzle to prevent it from "hour glass-ing" over the IEM filter opening (at least for larger diameter IEMs). Would this work?


 
   
  Sure it would work, but I recommend doing the trimming gradually, as described in this post:
  
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> The nozzle opening on the hybrids is smaller than the phone's nozzle, so they will attenuate treble and sound too bassy and congested without modification. But the more you shorten their stem, the more their opening will stretch over the phone's nozzle and open up (that's why you need the flexible genuine tips for doing that). The more they open up, the clearer and less bassy they'll become.
> 
> My sweet spot for the e-Q5 is at half length, but you can find your own by following this simple procedure:
> 
> ...


----------



## TVisz

Heey I was wonderin, is there any other IEMs that are able to match up and beat in sound quality (perspective of a person that listens to mainly HipHop, Pop, Hardstyle, RnB) Audeo Phonak PFE 012 ($138 AUD) while having in-store prices that are about the same (<$150 preferably)?? i fully respect Joker, he's the coolest , but he doesnt listen to the same genre as me...soo i think that maay affect the review scores (well he did mention this)...basically i was just hopin that someone that listens to the same genres as me to give some recommendations thx


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If we are talking current models at full retail (non-sale) pricing, probably the Brainwavz M1 <$50 and Sunrise Xcape IE <$100 (for sound, at least - mine died after a while). PR200 is bassier than the PL50 but not as good overall. PR300 is much closer and still has decent bass.


 

 Ah... sorry bout that, why didn't you asked for a replacement for the Xcape IE? I assume it's still on a warranty?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Ah... sorry bout that, why didn't you asked for a replacement for the Xcape IE? I assume it's still on a warranty?


 


  I did, it was (supposedly) shipped out and never got to me. Oh well - not like I have a dearth of decent IEMs. They still work if I play around with the plug and don't listen to them for more than an hour at a time. I'll just replace the plug some day..


----------



## Gilly87

Hey joker,
   
  First, I think it would be great if you opened up a PayPal account for donations, like Android developers do; I think you would be surprised at the contributions you would get ^_^ I know other members make periodic funds for new and interesting IEMs for you, but personally I would feel less guilty asking your advice in such an overwhelming thread if I knew I could pop a dollar in your hat every time 
   
  Secondly, and to the point, I have read your reviews on each many, many times, but I would like to ask you personally: what advantages do you feel the SM2 offers over the SM3? Are there any distinct advantages to the SM2? Which is more likely to satisfy a moderate basshead who has been seduced by the lushness of Shure mids?
   
  Also if you could draw any comparison between either one and the bass of the Klipsch X10 I would be very grateful


----------



## Gasdoc

Hi Joker,

Awesome thread. Took awhile to work through.

I've got a number of iems including Westone 4, FXT 90, Vsonic GR07,Shure 530 & Earsonics SM2. Yes, Ive got the bug...The FXT90 strangely has too high treble energy, the SM2/530 are too thick and lacking sparkle. The GR07 is spectacular and to me edges out the W4 which is also awesome. Any suggestions for iems that would be similar to GR07/W4?

Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> First, I think it would be great if you opened up a PayPal account for donations, like Android developers do; I think you would be surprised at the contributions you would get ^_^ I know other members make periodic funds for new and interesting IEMs for you, but personally I would feel less guilty asking your advice in such an overwhelming thread if I knew I could pop a dollar in your hat every time
> 
> ...


 

 I've had a UM Miracle donated to me and should have a FitEar 334 coming eventually - I'm more than happy with that.
   
  It's been a while since I've heard an SM2 but at the time I felt that the biggest differences vs SM3 was that the midrange was less close/intimate and the presentation was less enveloping. Bass is similar between the two and both are lush/thick-sounding so it would be a matter of preference. The X10 is pretty different - its bass is tighter and faster and - if I remember the SM2 correctly - flatter. 

  
  Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Hi Joker,
> Awesome thread. Took awhile to work through.
> I've got a number of iems including Westone 4, FXT 90, Vsonic GR07,Shure 530 & Earsonics SM2. Yes, Ive got the bug...The FXT90 strangely has too high treble energy, the SM2/530 are too thick and lacking sparkle. The GR07 is spectacular and to me edges out the W4 which is also awesome. Any suggestions for iems that would be similar to GR07/W4?
> Thanks!


 

 I don't find the FXT90 to be more energetic than the GR07 (though the two units I tried did have slightly different treble intensity) but maybe the EX1000? Would be wary of the treble but it's what I would have as a W4 compliment and GR07 replacement.


----------



## Gofre

I've just written a brief review of the ClarityOne IEMs I won earlier this week. I'm pretty new to high end audio so it's nothing incredible, but if you're looking into them then you might appreciate the insight 
   
  http://www.facebook.com/hifiheadphones/posts/10150734012645312


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





walaoeh said:


> damn,i just bought sony hybrids to use on my gr07 ,thinking it would be better, somehow the stock tips seem better, as the hybrids kill soundstage, and maybe do some other things to mess up the sound.


 

 For soundstage, I thought the stock double-flanges were really nice, though the sibilance comes back. They're probably related, though...


----------



## Gilly87

Thanks! Based partly on your analysis (disclaimer: you are not held responsible for any suicidal/homicidal tendencies/overdraft charges my wallet may incur ) I jumped on the SM3 v2; the forward mids and enveloping presentation are just what I am looking for. I enjoyed the bass out of the X10 but something tells me the SM3 will not disappoint where it really matters 
   
  Thanks again and again, |joker|; you have influenced almost every single one of my purchases either directly or indirectly, and have never led me astray, despite not having anything like my preferred sound signature. You are truly an icon, not to mention an asset, to this community 
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've had a UM Miracle donated to me and should have a FitEar 334 coming eventually - I'm more than happy with that.
> 
> It's been a while since I've heard an SM2 but at the time I felt that the biggest differences vs SM3 was that the midrange was less close/intimate and the presentation was less enveloping. Bass is similar between the two and both are lush/thick-sounding so it would be a matter of preference. The X10 is pretty different - its bass is tighter and faster and - if I remember the SM2 correctly - flatter.
> 
> ...


----------



## TwoSongs

ljokerl said:


> ...
> SB will have more bass than a ProAlpha but less than an Eterna.
> ...




Sounds like the perfect thing to try then. 

Now, GD Audiobase requires a company specification in the "Bill To" address, and I have none to give. eBay doesn't have these either. Where else might I be able to buy a pair?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Thanks! Based partly on your analysis (disclaimer: you are not held responsible for any suicidal/homicidal tendencies/overdraft charges my wallet may incur ) I jumped on the SM3 v2; the forward mids and enveloping presentation are just what I am looking for. I enjoyed the bass out of the X10 but something tells me the SM3 will not disappoint where it really matters
> 
> Thanks again and again, |joker|; you have influenced almost every single one of my purchases either directly or indirectly, and have never led me astray, despite not having anything like my preferred sound signature. You are truly an icon, not to mention an asset, to this community


 

 Yes, it seems like the SM3 will match your signature preferences better than it does mine. I am a fan of the X10's bass but that's definitely at or even slightly above the upper limit of what I want from an IEM.
   

  Quote: 





twosongs said:


> Sounds like the perfect thing to try then.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  Treoo, maybe? I'm not very familiar with FIscher's distribution network.


----------



## TVisz

quick question, are the Audeo Phonak PFE 012 worth $138 AUD??


----------



## TVisz

is it ok to use IEMs that have a higher impedance than the device im usin? say bout 2 ohms...thx in advanced


----------



## queerquirks

Looking for a budget iem for purely gym use.
   
  Owned a brainwavz m2 and the bass is pretty alright.
   
  Which has a bigger bass thump and soundstage, brainwavz alpha or ep630?
   
  Its not for jogging or any excessive usage, just machines and weights. 
   
  Other iems welcomed too! Preferably below ~30usd ~
   
  thanks!


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





queerquirks said:


> Looking for a budget iem for purely gym use.
> 
> Owned a brainwavz m2 and the bass is pretty alright.
> 
> ...


 

 I suggest taking a look at MEElec M6


----------



## bboytymee

Hey joker, how does the Velodyne vPulse compare to the Atrios MG7's in terms of overall quality and in terms of bass? Thanks!


----------



## Audiophile1811

Quote:


gasdoc said:


> The GR07 is spectacular and to me edges out the W4 which is also awesome.


 
  Interesting. How do you think they compare?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tvisz said:


> quick question, are the Audeo Phonak PFE 012 worth $138 AUD??


 
   
   
  Depends on what else you can get for that sort of money. I would rather have an FA Tandem or JVC FXT90 or something.
   


  Quote: 





tvisz said:


> is it ok to use IEMs that have a higher impedance than the device im usin? say bout 2 ohms...thx in advanced


 

 An IEM should have a (much) higher impedance than the output impedance of your device (recommended ratio is usually at least 4:1 if not 8:1).
   


  Quote: 





queerquirks said:


> Looking for a budget iem for purely gym use.
> 
> Owned a brainwavz m2 and the bass is pretty alright.
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Soundmagic E10 maybe?
   
   


  Quote: 





bboytymee said:


> Hey joker, how does the Velodyne vPulse compare to the Atrios MG7's in terms of overall quality and in terms of bass? Thanks!


 

 IMO not well. The vPulse is a tier down in clarity and resolution and the bass, while very good, is a little softer, less textured, and less defined than that of the Atrio. It's still pretty great for $90, though, especially with the headset functionality.


----------



## GigaFi

The EP630s are pretty bad. Maybe the ATH-CKM50.
  
  Quote: 





queerquirks said:


> Looking for a budget iem for purely gym use.
> 
> Owned a brainwavz m2 and the bass is pretty alright.
> 
> ...


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





gigafi said:


> The EP630s are pretty bad. Maybe the ATH-CKM50.


 


  They've got a decent amount of sub-bass though I've found mids to be quite recessed, and trebles have a bit of sparkle which can be fatiguing.


----------



## TVisz

Thx heaps Joker


----------



## ljokerl

Added two reviews of old(ish) discontinued sets - Altec Lansing UHP336 (aka UE SuperFi 3) and Hippo 10EB. 
   
  Quote: 





> *(3A67) Altec Lansing UHP336 / Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 3*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Mar 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C48) Hippo 10EB*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Mar 2012
> ...


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

I see you're well on your way to that 300-review milestone! Keep up the good work!


----------



## Vloeibaarglas

Oh my lord, I actually have a pair of UHP336.
   
  It was my first decent pair of IEM after the EP-630. Also it is interesting to note that they use the same cable as TF10. I just pulled out some TF10 custom cables and are listening to them now.
   
  When they were still being sold, they were priced in the mid $30's. Based on ljokerl's score, their performance/price should still be decently competitive if they had not been discontinued.


----------



## PowerSlide

joker,
   
  sorry cant go thru 400++pages of this thread
   
  for same price should i buy dunu trident or soundmagic e10?
   
  found some love for bassy music..so looking the one with the best thumpy bass
   
  thanks


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





powerslide said:


> joker,
> 
> sorry cant go thru 400++pages of this thread
> 
> ...


 
   
  Use the search function.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> Use the search function.


 

 Or just read the review, and compare scores, though I'm sure ljokerl doesn't mind all that much. Could be wrong though...


----------



## mbamg

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Or just read the review, and compare scores, though I'm sure ljokerl doesn't mind all that much. Could be wrong though...


 
   
  His scores are rather subjective, so it's better to read through the entire review if you have the time.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





mbamg said:


> His scores are rather subjective, so it's better to read through the entire review if you have the time.


 

 Well, do both. Read the review to compare sound signatures and such, but also take into account the scores, as well as the scores for other things like build quality, isolation, etc.


----------



## dosley01

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those two would be my choice as well. Keep in mind that the MD has more bass than an ESW9, to the point where it can get slightly overbearing, and the RE262 has less to the point where you may have to EQ it. If you're used to getting IE8-level bass from your in-ears, the MD is probably the better choice though it lacks the large headstage of the IE8.


 

 ljokerl, just wanted to shout out a big thanks, loving my new MDs and they were exactly what I was looking for.  (The recent sale didn't hurt either)  Thank You!


----------



## jjmai

Congrats on shortening your backlog by getting SF3/UHP336 out of the way.  Looking forward to the imminent TF10 review.
  I had UHP336 a few years ago when I just started getting the IEM bug, and it was right after moving from EP-630.  Needless to say, I was so disappointed with 336's bass response.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Are you planning to do a review on the Phillips SHE 3580?


----------



## PowerSlide

well at 1st i have multiple choice but going thru search, read joker thread read clieos thread read many other thread before end up with 2 final choice
   
  if i dont do that i would type a 1000 word post asking all sorts of question
   
  just need a nudge or a kick to point me the direction


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> I see you're well on your way to that 300-review milestone! Keep up the good work!


 

  Thanks!
   


  Quote: 





vloeibaarglas said:


> Oh my lord, I actually have a pair of UHP336.
> 
> It was my first decent pair of IEM after the EP-630. Also it is interesting to note that they use the same cable as TF10. I just pulled out some TF10 custom cables and are listening to them now.
> 
> When they were still being sold, they were priced in the mid $30's. Based on ljokerl's score, their performance/price should still be decently competitive if they had not been discontinued.


 

  Yes, the actual text for this review was written well over a year ago - I just never got around to posting it. Back then they were still commonly available for $35-60 which is what the value score is based on. 
   


  Quote: 





powerslide said:


> joker,
> 
> sorry cant go thru 400++pages of this thread
> 
> ...


 
   
  Depends on whether you want a warmer, more intimate sound with more forward mids (Trident) or a more spacious sound with more treble emphasis (E10). Both have thumping bass and both are a good buy at $30-40.
  
   


  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> Congrats on shortening your backlog by getting SF3/UHP336 out of the way.  Looking forward to the imminent TF10 review.
> I had UHP336 a few years ago when I just started getting the IEM bug, and it was right after moving from EP-630.  Needless to say, I was so disappointed with 336's bass response.


 

 No surprise there, I wasn't a big fan of the 336 early on either but to their credit they were bassy enough next to my Ety ER6i and Nuforce NE-8 (which had no response below 80hz or so 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).
   


  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Are you planning to do a review on the Phillips SHE 3580?


 


  At some point. A list of all of the IEMs I have in my possession and plan to review can be found on the front page of this thread.


----------



## Ztick

Thanks joker, this thread is great, and interesting since its one guy testing out all these IEMS....and thanks to your review i ended up with some HF5s and really enjoying them! Keep up the great work!!


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Big thanks and congratulations on such a great database of reviews joker!
   
  Question for you:  what's a good pair of mid-forward IEMs that can be had for cheap (<$100 but can swing a bit more if necessary)?  For reference here's a graph of how I find the Philips SHE3580 and Etymotic ER-4P relative to my ideal sound signature:
   




  Red is SHE3580, black is ER-4P using the same tips as stock SHE3580, I gather you've heard both phones.  As you can see I find the SHE3580 V-shaped whereas the ER-4P is closer to my ideal except for a big spike in the treble.  I'm wondering if comply foams would remedy the latter but can't really test it now as my 4P are broken.


----------



## garcsa

+1 :
  Meelec M6. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> I suggest taking a look at MEElec M6


----------



## PowerSlide

thanks joker, now i know which i want
   
  keep up with more review


----------



## NotSoSerious

Just a quick question... Out of mee's products ( limited to mee thanks to warranty ) which bass-oriented ( doesnt HAVE to be necessarily bass monsters, but with a decent amount... Higher then the neutrality of something like the m21 or a151.. ) did you prefer the most? The cc51 is off-limits unfortunately.. I am currently using the sp51, but i am able to get anything under it.. Is the sp51 the best im going to get.... ? Sorry, typing this off an ipod


----------



## Niyologist

How does the Ortofon eQ-7 compare to the HIFIMAN RE272?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ztick said:


> Thanks joker, this thread is great, and interesting since its one guy testing out all these IEMS....and thanks to your review i ended up with some HF5s and really enjoying them! Keep up the great work!!


 


  Glad the thread was helpful!


  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Big thanks and congratulations on such a great database of reviews joker!
> 
> Question for you:  what's a good pair of mid-forward IEMs that can be had for cheap (<$100 but can swing a bit more if necessary)?  For reference here's a graph of how I find the Philips SHE3580 and Etymotic ER-4P relative to my ideal sound signature:
> 
> Red is SHE3580, black is ER-4P using the same tips as stock SHE3580, I gather you've heard both phones.  As you can see I find the SHE3580 V-shaped whereas the ER-4P is closer to my ideal except for a big spike in the treble.  I'm wondering if comply foams would remedy the latter but can't really test it now as my 4P are broken.


 
  Hmm... maybe the UE SF5? Not sure how it compares to the newer UE600 but it sounded rather smooth and mid-forward when I had it. The top end was a little dull but it was decent enough for the price and the clarity/resolution was slightly better compared to the Brainwavz M2 (which also has a good bass-midrange balance). The FA Tandem is a dynamic take on a similar signature, albeit with more/deeper bass vs the UE. Ditto on the Brookstone Clear Dual-Drive. 
  Also, if you can go up to $150 the RE262 might be worth checking out. Bass depth might be a little disappointing after the Philips but otherwise it's a nice, smooth-sounding set.


   


  Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Just a quick question... Out of mee's products ( limited to mee thanks to warranty ) which bass-oriented ( doesnt HAVE to be necessarily bass monsters, but with a decent amount... Higher then the neutrality of something like the m21 or a151.. ) did you prefer the most? The cc51 is off-limits unfortunately.. I am currently using the sp51, but i am able to get anything under it.. Is the sp51 the best im going to get.... ? Sorry, typing this off an ipod


 

 Outside of the CC51 the only set that's decent overall and has good bass is the SP51. I quite like the CW31 as well but it's at best a sidegrade from the SP51 and somewhere between the neutral/enhanced tunings of the SP51 in bass qty.
   


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> How does the Ortofon eQ-7 compare to the HIFIMAN RE272?


 

 One (e-Q7) is well-balanced with a slightly laid-back top end and a slightly dryer sound and the other is well-balanced with a slightly laid-back bottom end and a very liquid sound.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Thanks joker! Will definitely check out your recs.


----------



## Sneakily

I am looking for a new IEM and am between a few options from your thread. My budget is around $40 and I need something to fit hip hop pretty good since its my genre of choice at most times. But the main issue I need to face is I want the least microphonics possible and them to be very comfortable. I think I am currently between the E30, M6, and a few Xears products (Xears Nature N3i ,Xears XE200PRO). I would love your opinion.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sneakily said:


> I am looking for a new IEM and am between a few options from your thread. My budget is around $40 and I need something to fit hip hop pretty good since its my genre of choice at most times. But the main issue I need to face is I want the least microphonics possible and them to be very comfortable. I think I am currently between the E30, M6, and a few Xears products (Xears Nature N3i ,Xears XE200PRO). I would love your opinion.


 


  The M6 and E30 definitely have less cable noise than any of the Xears models I've tried. You might also prefer the bassier sound of the cheaper M6 even though the E30 sounds better overall. Both are very comfortable IMO but the E30 is a little quicker to put on and take off since it lacks the memory wire.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker,
  after recieving the HiSound Crystal, I am amazed at how small an IEM can be, and am interested in knowing more about these kind of small but competent IEM's....
  Any suggestion? All I know about is my HS Crystal, the Q-Jays, and Philips SHE3580, any other interestingly small IEM with good SQ?


----------



## prosay

Is the review for the Ultimate Ears 600 going to be out anytime soon because i am considering to buy it.
   
  and among these: UE 600, A-jays Three and the klipsch S4. Which is the best?


----------



## vwinter

xinn3r said:


> Joker,
> after recieving the HiSound Crystal, I am amazed at how small an IEM can be, and am interested in knowing more about these kind of small but competent IEM's....
> Any suggestion? All I know about is my HS Crystal, the Q-Jays, and Philips SHE3580, any other interestingly small IEM with good SQ?



The Sony XBA-1 comes out soon (in the US), has gotten solid initial feedback, and looks absolutely tiny.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker,
> after recieving the HiSound Crystal, I am amazed at how small an IEM can be, and am interested in knowing more about these kind of small but competent IEM's....
> Any suggestion? All I know about is my HS Crystal, the Q-Jays, and Philips SHE3580, any other interestingly small IEM with good SQ?


 

 Golden Crystals, most of the other TWFK-based sets (UE700, VSonic GR01, Nocs NS800, ATH-CK10, DBA-02 mkII), Monster MD Trumpets, Klipsch X10, Ety HF5, ACS T15

  
  Quote: 





prosay said:


> Is the review for the Ultimate Ears 600 going to be out anytime soon because i am considering to buy it.
> 
> and among these: UE 600, A-jays Three and the klipsch S4. Which is the best?


 

 After finding out that there are two versions of the UE700, I am not certain that the SF5 I had is identical in sound to the newer UE600 but either way they would easily be my pick over the S4 unless you were after the S4's v-shaped sound. I have not heard the a-JAYS but I'd pick the UEs over the t-JAYS.
   


  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> The Sony XBA-1 comes out soon (in the US), has gotten solid initial feedback, and looks absolutely tiny.


 

 It looks tiny next to the other XBA sets, especially the gargantuan XBA-4, but it's pretty much par for the course as far as single-BA sets go (BA drivers are typically pretty small).


----------



## Gilly87

Joker I've been reading your SM3 review, over and over, drooling, for about the last 6 months (and had read it the first time about a year prior) while trying to find something else that could sound similar but cost less, and I've worked my way up the price bracket from the Shure SE215, to the Klipsch X10, EPH100, W3, and most recently ASG-1, until caving/finding a good deal on the SM3, and they are indeed the end of the IEM road for me. I have never heard an IEM and so quickly felt sure that I liked it, not even the Shure SE215. The SM3 is just so full and grand sounding, pianos and full and immediate and gorgeous, the soundstage is big without being obnoxious, the bass is PERFECT for me in quantity...I can't imagine a presentation that is more ideal for my taste. It's because of your description that I've finally arrived at the SM3, and every word you say about it is true to a T. It happens to be the final solution for me.
   
  I am mostly leaving head-fi now, except to chat with a few people I've gotten to know and help people outside the US get their hands on gear at something that resembles a reasonable price  but I have to say, in my hours and days on end of browsing head-fi, bored at work or at home relaxing, I have read this thread probably more than anything and everything else combined, and not for no reason. I think many people, myself included, probably take the scope of this thread for granted, given that it IS the internet and we've learned to expect that SOMEONE will do just about ANYTHING at some point, but this thread is a really incredible accomplishment and compilation of knowledge. It may sound cheesy, but this thread, in a way, exemplifies the best of what the internet has offer us: accessible, condensed knowledge.
   
  And so for that, I say thank you, |joker|. I may not know you, and I'm sure very few, if any, people here on head-fi truly do, but you've taken the time to do an enormous service for every single one of us, and even if that's not your sole motivation, it is beautiful in its own way. At least to me.
   
  So, thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  and happy listening.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Amen to that! Reviewing close to 300 IEMs on one‘s own time is truly an incredible feat.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Golden Crystals, most of the other TWFK-based sets (UE700, VSonic GR01, Nocs NS800, ATH-CK10, DBA-02 mkII), Monster MD Trumpets, Klipsch X10, Ety HF5, ACS T15


 


  What's TWFK short of? I know it's a Knowles based armature design, but I can't seem to find what it stands for....
  Also, are the HS Crystals and Golden Crystals TWFK-based too???


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Dual armature, Knowles TWFK in fact. Listening to them right now - they are good, very good. Closer to DBA-02/CK10 in performance than UE700/Phiaton PS200/q-JAYS but with a less bright signature compared to most TWFK-based phones. I've only A:B'd them vs the UE700 and they were the clear winner for me, though admittedly they cost significantly more.


 

 Better than the GR07s, or a sidegrade?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Joker I've been reading your SM3 review, over and over, drooling, for about the last 6 months (and had read it the first time about a year prior) while trying to find something else that could sound similar but cost less, and I've worked my way up the price bracket from the Shure SE215, to the Klipsch X10, EPH100, W3, and most recently ASG-1, until caving/finding a good deal on the SM3, and they are indeed the end of the IEM road for me. I have never heard an IEM and so quickly felt sure that I liked it, not even the Shure SE215. The SM3 is just so full and grand sounding, pianos and full and immediate and gorgeous, the soundstage is big without being obnoxious, the bass is PERFECT for me in quantity...I can't imagine a presentation that is more ideal for my taste. It's because of your description that I've finally arrived at the SM3, and every word you say about it is true to a T. It happens to be the final solution for me.
> 
> I am mostly leaving head-fi now, except to chat with a few people I've gotten to know and help people outside the US get their hands on gear at something that resembles a reasonable price  but I have to say, in my hours and days on end of browsing head-fi, bored at work or at home relaxing, I have read this thread probably more than anything and everything else combined, and not for no reason. I think many people, myself included, probably take the scope of this thread for granted, given that it IS the internet and we've learned to expect that SOMEONE will do just about ANYTHING at some point, but this thread is a really incredible accomplishment and compilation of knowledge. It may sound cheesy, but this thread, in a way, exemplifies the best of what the internet has offer us: accessible, condensed knowledge.
> 
> ...


 



  Great, very glad that you like the SM3! I know no review can really tell you how something sounds but knowing approximately what you're getting into (hopefully) helps. I took quite some time to warm up to the SM3, personally. 


  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> What's TWFK short of? I know it's a Knowles based armature design, but I can't seem to find what it stands for....
> Also, are the HS Crystals and Golden Crystals TWFK-based too???


 

 Well, the FK is a single armature model designation (not sure where that driver is used - it's quite small) and I'm guessing the 'TW' stands for 'twin'.
   
  Crystals and Golden Crystals are dynamic. There are other IEMs that use dynamic microdrivers (<6mm) - the Monster MD Tributes, JVC FXT/FXC-series, MEElec CC51s, etc.


  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Better than the GR07s, or a sidegrade?


 
   
  Not sure yet but realistically most if not all universals may be but a sidegrade from the GR07 depending on preferences, tolerance to the treble spikes, etc.


----------



## sarahbear

Hi ! New here, but this looks like a great thread for recommendations! I'm starting my IEM journey, and was hoping you could give me a top 5 list or something to start off with. What IEMs in the $300 and under category have the most 3-D like presentation, and most accurate detail? I don't exactly know all the Head-Fi terms yet :/. But I think I like instrument separation and layering, and being able to see and visualize the different, individual sounds. I also like hearing every detail, and like voices to sound realistic. Thanks!!!


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





sarahbear said:


> Hi ! New here, but this looks like a great thread for recommendations! I'm starting my IEM journey, and was hoping you could give me a top 5 list or something to start off with. What IEMs in the $300 and under category have the most 3-D like presentation, and most accurate detail? I don't exactly know all the Head-Fi terms yet :/. But I think I like instrument separation and layering, and being able to see and visualize the different, individual sounds. I also like hearing every detail, and like voices to sound realistic. Thanks!!!


 

 A good first place to look would be ljokerl's IEM review thread, which has a pretty exhaustive list of the IEMs out there, and ranks them really nicely, though you'll need to read the reviews for more details. 
  Off the top of my head though, some good contenders are the GR07, e-Q5, RE272, SM2, ER4, EX600, and CK10. Note that this is mostly based on SQ and the detail-oriented side, as I don't know too much about their soundstaging abilities, except that the GR07 lacks a bit in depth. Go check out that thread and come back when you have more specific questions, perhaps.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

This IS ljokerl‘s IEM review thread


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, have you ever had the chance to hear the Yamaha EPH-100?
  If so, how well can you describe the SQ? What is it on par with?


----------



## sarahbear

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> A good first place to look would be ljokerl's IEM review thread, which has a pretty exhaustive list of the IEMs out there, and ranks them really nicely, though you'll need to read the reviews for more details.
> Off the top of my head though, some good contenders are the GR07, e-Q5, RE272, SM2, ER4, EX600, and CK10. Note that this is mostly based on SQ and the detail-oriented side, as I don't know too much about their soundstaging abilities, except that the GR07 lacks a bit in depth. Go check out that thread and come back when you have more specific questions, perhaps.


 


  I actually did read most of his post thread, but it's a bit overwhelming lol. I picked out a few, and was actually looking at the um3x, sm3, ex1000, fx700, AGS-1, and e-Q5. I was also looking at the ER4 and CK10, and they seemed perfect, except the fact they're bass light :/. I don't really want them to be bass light. And not too bloated either! I like deep detailed bass as I listen to bass heavy music, but would prefer the 3-D imaging thing if it came down to the 2 criteria. 
   
  As you can see, there's a lot of choices, and I don't even know if they're fully suited for what I want (as I don't really understand the difference between soundstage, imaging, separation, layering, 3-D presentation, etc.) So I just wanted to explain the sound I wanted to Joker, and see if he could rank the top suggestions for me. 
   
  Thanks anyways for the response and suggestions! I'll have to check some of the other ones out.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> This IS ljokerl‘s IEM review thread


 

 Oh boy, do I feel silly... I seem to be getting all my threads mixed up... For some reason I thought the question was directed at me...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, have you ever had the chance to hear the Yamaha EPH-100?
> If so, how well can you describe the SQ? What is it on par with?


 

 No, I haven't
   


  Quote: 





sarahbear said:


> I actually did read most of his post thread, but it's a bit overwhelming lol. I picked out a few, and was actually looking at the um3x, sm3, ex1000, fx700, AGS-1, and e-Q5. I was also looking at the ER4 and CK10, and they seemed perfect, except the fact they're bass light :/. I don't really want them to be bass light. And not too bloated either! I like deep detailed bass as I listen to bass heavy music, but would prefer the 3-D imaging thing if it came down to the 2 criteria.
> 
> As you can see, there's a lot of choices, and I don't even know if they're fully suited for what I want (as I don't really understand the difference between soundstage, imaging, separation, layering, 3-D presentation, etc.) So I just wanted to explain the sound I wanted to Joker, and see if he could rank the top suggestions for me.
> 
> Thanks anyways for the response and suggestions! I'll have to check some of the other ones out.


 

 I haven't heard the ASG-1 but the rest are all good choices. The SM3 has what is probably the most 3-D presentation, the UM3X has the best separation, the EX1000 has the widest headstage, and the e-Q5 and FX700 are just excellent all-rounders. The CK10 has some of the best imaging I've heard but if you're worried about bass I'd give it a pass. Maybe pass on the e-Q5 too even though it has a bit more bass than a CK10/ER4S. If you need isolation both the UM3X and SM3 are very good choices but I'm not sure you'll find either for <$300 new.


----------



## joe it

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, have you ever had the chance to hear the Yamaha EPH-100?
> If so, how well can you describe the SQ? What is it on par with?


 


  I'm curious too, since I took (unpretentious), I can no longer away from my ears.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




....


----------



## Fordy314

Hey joker, when you do your review of the Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10's, do you plan to/ could you compare them to Klipsch X10's and or Etymotic HF5's?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fordy314 said:


> Hey joker, when you do your review of the Ultimate Ears Triple.Fi 10's, do you plan to/ could you compare them to Klipsch X10's and or Etymotic HF5's?


 


  I don't have the X10 anymore (it was a loan) but I'll be comparing them with Etys when (if?) I have time to finally do the review.


----------



## ezunyan

hi joker, I think you're experienced in helping newcomer, so could you recommend a few choices of IEM for my friend? (like 2-3)
 he's a first timer with budget around 80 USD. he likes bass and listens to wide range of music genre (mostly pop though).

 we can get these brands here : MEElectronics, SoundMAGIC, Sony, Sennheiser, Fischer Audio, HifiMan, Sunrise, Brainwavz, Jays, Hippo, Crossroads, Klipsch, Ultimate Ears, Denon, Audio Technica, AKG
  I think only these brands which have IEM around that price (or cheaper) here

 thx before.


----------



## pack21

Quote: 





joe it said:


> I'm curious too, since I took (unpretentious), I can no longer away from my ears.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  
  Indeed, having now only the SM3's that i love,  but I have to take off time to time during the day, when i had EPH-100, i could spent hours with them in ears without getting tired.

 Great iem for the price.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Velodyne vPulse and TFTA 1V
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C49) Velodyne vPulse*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Mar 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2A24) TFTA-2100-2V1S / 1V*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Mar 2012
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





ezunyan said:


> hi joker, I think you're experienced in helping newcomer, so could you recommend a few choices of IEM for my friend? (like 2-3)
> he's a first timer with budget around 80 USD. he likes bass and listens to wide range of music genre (mostly pop though).
> 
> we can get these brands here : MEElectronics, SoundMAGIC, Sony, Sennheiser, Fischer Audio, HifiMan, Sunrise, Brainwavz, Jays, Hippo, Crossroads, Klipsch, Ultimate Ears, Denon, Audio Technica, AKG
> ...


 

 Sure, I think the following would all be good options depending on what you'll be paying for them and the exact sound profile desired:
   
  MEElectronics: CC51 or SP51
  Soundmagic: E10
  Fischer Audio: Eterna or Consonance
  Brainwavz: M2
  Hippo: VB
   
  The E10 is a good start as it is priced reasonably and has a likable sound to it. Not exactly hi-fi but way better than it should be for $35.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Oh, so do you have a pair of GR06s?  Could you possibly make a comparison to the GR07 if you haven't done so already...?

 (sorry, I haven't been following the thread lately)
   
  Thanks!!


----------



## halfwaythere

I'm also wondering how high will the GR-06 score on the joker SQ scale. If they are over 8 there's no doubt its a great buy.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Thank you for the vPulse review. Been waiting for it! Thanks for recommending it to me last month and its awesome that you think highly of it(cuz we think highly of your opinions). Props again!


----------



## NotSoSerious

Hi Joker, great Vpulse review..
   
  How do you feel it stacks up against something like the Fischer Audio Eterna?


----------



## tegR

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The TFTA 1V is a basshead’s dream come true, a set that unabashedly refuses to sacrifice its immense bass for any reason.


 

 Wow, and to think the 1XB (2100-3V2B) have even more bass. Would be very interesting to see what you think of the bass on those in comparison to all the other bassy iems you have heard.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Oh, so do you have a pair of GR06s?  Could you possibly make a comparison to the GR07 if you haven't done so already...?
> 
> (sorry, I haven't been following the thread lately)
> 
> Thanks!!


 


  I do but I haven't listened to them for more than a few minutes. First impressions were that it lacks bass depth and a bit of control compared to the GR07, being more mid-bass oriented. Mids seem a little less crisp and clean also. It's still got a bit of the same treble stridency and the same laid-back presentation as the GR07, at least out of the box. No doubt that it'll be great value for money at $50-60, though.


  Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Thank you for the vPulse review. Been waiting for it! Thanks for recommending it to me last month and its awesome that you think highly of it(cuz we think highly of your opinions). Props again!


 

 Thanks, did you end up buying the vPulse? Curious if it's just my pair that has somewhat careless plastic molding or all of them. Does not affect functionality in any way so I can't complain much but it is supposed to be a $90 product.
   


  Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Hi Joker, great Vpulse review..
> 
> How do you feel it stacks up against something like the Fischer Audio Eterna?


 
   
  On the whole - very well. The Eterna is a touch more refined overall and also has a slightly more well-rounded presentation which nudges it up in SQ but of course the vPulse can be worn cable-down and has a remote and a US warranty.
   


  Quote: 





tegr said:


> Wow, and to think the 1XB (2100-3V2B) have even more bass. Would be very interesting to see what you think of the bass on those in comparison to all the other bassy iems you have heard.


 
   
  I think my brain would turn to mush and I wouldn't be able to come back and tell the tale..


----------



## DaBomb77766

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I do but I haven't listened to them for more than a few minutes. First impressions were that it lacks bass depth and a bit of control compared to the GR07, being more mid-bass oriented. Mids seem a little less crisp and clean also. It's still got a bit of the same treble stridency and the same laid-back presentation as the GR07, at least out of the box. No doubt that it'll be great value for money at $50-60, though.


 

  Alright, thanks, I'm looking forward to your review!  I'm looking for a replacement to my GR07 after they broke...I kind of wanted to try something a little different for a change though.


----------



## jjmai

How do the vPulse and TFTA 1V compare with Atrio?
  vPulse was on sale for 2 for 1 during valentine's day, but now promotion has ended (http://velodyne.com/promotion-details).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> How do the vPulse and TFTA 1V compare with Atrio?
> vPulse was on sale for 2 for 1 during valentine's day, but now promotion has ended (http://velodyne.com/promotion-details).


 

 Current MG7 Atrios? Not well. The vPulse is more similar with its sub-bass emphasis but has neither the resolution nor the transparency to compete with a high-end monitor like the Atrio, not to mention its flat stage and mediocre dynamics. The TFTA is different as it is more mid-bass oriented and much more bloated. It's more of a Monster MD sound rather than an Atrio, though again it is not at the performance level of an MD overall.


----------



## Selenium

And it's even bassier than the MDT. The TFTA is so damn bassy that after listening to it for a while the Turbine Coppers sounded downright balanced. lol. It's the only IEM I've tried where I felt like it was too bassy _all the time_. It's just relentlessly bassy.
   
  Nice reviews.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Yeah I bought the vPulse, but still on the way(Im from the Philippines afterall). Ill let you know.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Hey joker,
   
  Just read your TFTA 1V analysis.
  I have to say for the most part I agree - but for the ratings I wasn't sure about.
  3.5 across the board.
   
  Do have to say they aren't really a bass lovers dream.
  The bass lovers would either go:
 -MG7's for sub-bass
  -TFTA 1XB for mid-bass
   
  The TFTA 1V's lie in the middle.
   
  How would u have compared the MG7's and the TFTA 1V's, purely on bass?
   
  Thanks for the comparison nonetheless bro!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selenium said:


> And it's even bassier than the MDT. The TFTA is so damn bassy that after listening to it for a while the Turbine Coppers sounded downright balanced. lol. It's the only IEM I've tried where I felt like it was too bassy _all the time_. It's just relentlessly bassy.
> 
> Nice reviews.


 

 This is true, bassier than MDT. I've heard other things that never lay off the bass - the Sony XB40 for example - but those are usually on a lower SQ (and price) level overall.
   


  Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> How would u have compared the MG7's and the TFTA 1V's, purely on bass?


 

 The same way you seem to compare the MG7 to the 1XB, which I haven't heard - the 1V has a lot more mid-bass, which gives it that impact/ability to move air (boom, slam, whatever you want to call it) while the Atrio is mostly sub-bass. The Atrio has no bloat and really very good bass quality - it is tighter than the Senn IE7 and ATH-CKM99, for example, and has very good resolution and dynamics.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> This is true, bassier than MDT. I've heard other things that never lay off the bass - the Sony XB40 for example - but those are usually on a lower SQ (and price) level overall.
> 
> 
> The same way you seem to compare the MG7 to the 1XB, which I haven't heard - the 1V has a lot more mid-bass, which gives it that impact/ability to move air (boom, slam, whatever you want to call it) while the Atrio is mostly sub-bass. The Atrio has no bloat and really very good bass quality - it is tighter than the Senn IE7 and ATH-CKM99, for example, and has very good resolution and dynamics.


 
  I actually fund the 1V's to be lower in bass than the MG7's:
   
  Mid-Bass wise:
 1XB > MG7 > 1V
  
  Sub-bass:
  MG7 > 1XB > 1V


----------



## phantompersona

Hey Joker What kind of amp would you recommend for the Hifiman RE262? I wish to purchase them but your review states that it needs an amp to bring out its full potential. Would the Cheap Fiio E5 or E6 do? Or do i need something better to bring outs its full potential? Also i will be playing music on my Samsung Galaxy Wifi S player if that helps.


----------



## Mad Max

I'd get an E11 + bigger battery for it if he says that it drains his J3 in less than 8 hours without an external amp.


----------



## phantompersona

mad max said:


> I'd get an E11 + bigger battery for it if he says that it drains his J3 in less than 8 hours without an external amp.




what about cmoybb?it seems to have better reviews compared to e11. will it be able to power my re262 to its fulll potential


----------



## Mad Max

No idea about the cmoyBB, I cannot find output power figures for it, but one guy thinks it is fine: http://www.head-fi.org/t/525217/amp-for-re-262#post_7086314
  Just leave the bass boost off.  No one says anything about battery life however.
   
  Full potential?  Try the Arrow.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Hey Joker What kind of amp would you recommend for the Hifiman RE262? I wish to purchase them but your review states that it needs an amp to bring out its full potential. Would the Cheap Fiio E5 or E6 do? Or do i need something better to bring outs its full potential? Also i will be playing music on my Samsung Galaxy Wifi S player if that helps.


 


  I am not up to date at all on the state of the portable amp market - you'd probably be better off asking in the RE262 thread to see if anyone has had any particularly good pairing within your budget. I got a chance to try the Portaphile amp and ADL Cruze recently and I liked both (the Portaphile especially) but those are a bit spendy. I also don't know how good the HPO of the Galaxy is. My phone is an HTC model and while it isn't terrible, I certainly wouldn't bother amping it instead of just getting a proper source.


----------



## Mysterious

Eagerly anticipating the review of the VSonic Gr06 !

 I heard it is a very good entry in the IEM market !


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Eagerly anticipating the review of the VSonic Gr06 !
> 
> I heard it is a very good entry in the IEM market !


 

 x2. 
  i wonder if it can comapre to the SE215


----------



## putente

Quote: 





reomero said:


> Ooh.. looks like the GR01 has moved into the "In Progress" section...
> 
> I'm anxious to read your review on them.


 
   
  x2


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, would you say the HiSound Crystal has more bass presence than the ECCI PR200? With the HS Crystal, you can "feel" the bass more than the PR200?


----------



## ezunyan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sure, I think the following would all be good options depending on what you'll be paying for them and the exact sound profile desired:
> 
> MEElectronics: CC51 or SP51
> Soundmagic: E10
> ...


 

  
  uhmm.... about eterna, what's so good about v1 being wilder/having less control?
  I see that most ppl favor v1 over v2. and v1 is sold at higher price than v2 here.
   
  *sorry, i couldn't imagine your explanation well based on the review. so could you re-explain in easier words or just make a summary in 1 sentence. thx XD


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Eagerly anticipating the review of the VSonic Gr06 !
> 
> I heard it is a very good entry in the IEM market !


 

 It is, no doubt about that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
   


  Quote: 





reomero said:


> Ooh.. looks like the GR01 has moved into the "In Progress" section...
> 
> I'm anxious to read your review on them.


 

 It's all about TWFKs this week and next with the DBA-02 mkII and GR01. 
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, would you say the HiSound Crystal has more bass presence than the ECCI PR200? With the HS Crystal, you can "feel" the bass more than the PR200?


 

 Yes. The Crystal is not a basshead phone but it's north of flat/neutral and has got plenty of grunt and impact for my liking.

  
  Quote: 





ezunyan said:


> uhmm.... about eterna, what's so good about v1 being wilder/having less control?
> I see that most ppl favor v1 over v2. and v1 is sold at higher price than v2 here.
> 
> *sorry, i couldn't imagine your explanation well based on the review. so could you re-explain in easier words or just make a summary in 1 sentence. thx XD


 

 I think it's the X-factor - the v1 sounds more unique and different from everything else out there than does the v2. Plus it's a little more airy and retains the bass detail despite the greater bass power, which is impressive. However, as I said in my review they are still much more similar to each other than some of the what I'd read led me to believe.


----------



## johanneskatalanc

hi guys,
   
  i am in thailand, travelling around. Anyone know about good in-ears available here? or good deals/locations for price/performance kings mentioned in jokers reviews?


----------



## ljokerl

Hmm... I guess a bunch of posts got moved out of the thread. I know some questions in there were addressed to me so if you asked something last night, please re-post.
   
  For anyone curious about it I put up a review of the Paradigm Shift E3m last night here. Might be a week or two before I get the chance to add it to this thread.


----------



## Ser182

Now this review thread. Thanks ljokerl.


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm... I guess a bunch of posts got moved out of the thread. I know some questions in there were addressed to me so if you asked something last night, please re-post.
> 
> For anyone curious about it I put up a review of the Paradigm Shift E3m last night here. Might be a week or two before I get the chance to add it to this thread.


 
   
  Haha yea, I hoped they had been moved but it was just a purging, all totally gone as far as I can tell. I understand why, but still.

 Anyway, I posted:
  Have you had any more time with the XBA-1? My mothers birthday is coming up and she actually wants me to buy her IEM's. How could I say no to that? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 She doesn't want me to spend too much though and they seem like a good compromise.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Haha yea, I hoped they had been moved but it was just a purging, all totally gone as far as I can tell. I understand why, but still.
> 
> Anyway, I posted:
> Have you had any more time with the XBA-1? My mothers birthday is coming up and she actually wants me to buy her IEM's. How could I say no to that?
> ...


 

 What music does she listen to?

 Possible suggestions might be:
 -Sennheiser
  -PFE
  -Yamas
  -GR07's


----------



## Gasdoc

Good review on the Paradigms.  I bought a pair early on being a sucker for Paradigm speakers.  I was certainly not impressed with the earphones.  I felt they had some mid-bass bloat and were a little veiled.  Passed them on to my brother after a single listen.


----------



## T/A.3xl

This is mindblowing how complete this is . I spent 5 days back and forth here and ENJOYED EVERY MINUTE OF IT !


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ser182 said:


> Now this review thread. Thanks ljokerl.


 

  Quote: 





t/a.3xl said:


> This is mindblowing how complete this is . I spent 5 days back and forth here and ENJOYED EVERY MINUTE OF IT !


 

 Thanks, glad the thread was useful!
   


  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Have you had any more time with the XBA-1? My mothers birthday is coming up and she actually wants me to buy her IEM's. How could I say no to that?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  I don't actually own an XBA-1, I've only heard it once, at a show, and I only compared it to the GR07, which I thought was better, but then that's true for the XBA-4 as well.


  Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Good review on the Paradigms.  I bought a pair early on being a sucker for Paradigm speakers.  I was certainly not impressed with the earphones.  I felt they had some mid-bass bloat and were a little veiled.  Passed them on to my brother after a single listen.


 

 Thanks. They can be enjoyable in certain contexts but yes, pretty difficult to recommend overall being in the price range of things like the JVC FXT90 and Sony EX600.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm... I guess a bunch of posts got moved out of the thread. I know some questions in there were addressed to me so if you asked something last night, please re-post.
> 
> For anyone curious about it I put up a review of the Paradigm Shift E3m last night here. Might be a week or two before I get the chance to add it to this thread.


 

 Just curious, what causes the delay between the review being written and it being added to the thread? Is it just assigning numerical values?


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't actually own an XBA-1, I've only heard it once, at a show, and I only compared it to the GR07, which I thought was better, but then that's true for the XBA-4 as well.


 

 I don't disagree with you; the GR07 is indeed better, but the XBA-1 is half the price, which is pretty nice.
   
  I've had mine for a few days already, having had auditioned it several times prior to purchasing it, and while it's no world beater, I believe it's one of the better deals in the Sony portfolio. The extension can be better, and in general everything is just a little thin-sounding, but it's pleasant and mostly a do-no-wrong type of sound. Though I hated the J-cord, I'm getting more used to it. I'd love to hear your thoughts of it against a top-level single BA like the SBA-03, and I'd totally lend mine to you, but it's too bad I don't live in LA anymore.
   
  Something comparable in technology and pricing like the PFE121 probably bests it, but I haven't done a direct comparison.


----------



## jgray91

Just as an update from _waaaaay _back in late February, when I asked for a IEM recommendation, I received my FXT90 yesterday and I agree with most of ljokerl's impression on it, albeit with a few things I still haven't noticed yet, such as the airiness. But still, it's quite the perfect match for me and have to thank ljokerl for his suggestion back then. Heck I even got it at lesser than street price at $108! Super bargain IMO.


----------



## Techno Kid

Hey joker I was wondering how the Atrio MG7 stacks up against the FXT90.  I just bought the Atrio's a few days ago and I have the FXT90 but I'm not all that impressed with them because I just find them to have a sound signature I just don't like to much.  I'm hoping the MG7 is more to my liking and from your review of them I think they will be I just want to know if they are as airy and bright as the FXT90.  I'm looking for a warmer sound but still have some good detail and I know the bass will be great with the lake of a mid-bass hump.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> I don't disagree with you; the GR07 is indeed better, but the XBA-1 is half the price, which is pretty nice.
> 
> I've had mine for a few days already, having had auditioned it several times prior to purchasing it, and while it's no world beater, I believe it's one of the better deals in the Sony portfolio. The extension can be better, and in general everything is just a little thin-sounding, but it's pleasant and mostly a do-no-wrong type of sound. Though I hated the J-cord, I'm getting more used to it. I'd love to hear your thoughts of it against a top-level single BA like the SBA-03, and I'd totally lend mine to you, but it's too bad I don't live in LA anymore.
> 
> Something comparable in technology and pricing like the PFE121 probably bests it, but I haven't done a direct comparison.


 

 +1. I'm really interested in Joker's opinion on the XBA-1, especially against the UE700


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Just curious, what causes the delay between the review being written and it being added to the thread? Is it just assigning numerical values?


 
   
  No, the scoring is usually finished by the time a review is written but I only post two new ones per week and I like to pair up sets that are at least somewhat similar (e.g. same  manufacturer, similar signature, similar price category, etc) so it might take a few weeks for me to pair something up or have a week where I don't have more urgent reviews to post.


  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> I don't disagree with you; the GR07 is indeed better, but the XBA-1 is half the price, which is pretty nice.
> 
> I've had mine for a few days already, having had auditioned it several times prior to purchasing it, and while it's no world beater, I believe it's one of the better deals in the Sony portfolio. The extension can be better, and in general everything is just a little thin-sounding, but it's pleasant and mostly a do-no-wrong type of sound. Though I hated the J-cord, I'm getting more used to it. I'd love to hear your thoughts of it against a top-level single BA like the SBA-03, and I'd totally lend mine to you, but it's too bad I don't live in LA anymore.
> 
> Something comparable in technology and pricing like the PFE121 probably bests it, but I haven't done a direct comparison.


 

 Don't get me wrong, I am not bashing the XBA-1 for not beating the GR07 - if you read my original CES impressions I was impressed with it as is. Just saying that I didn't get a very good picture of its performance because I only had the GR07 to compare it to.
   


  Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> Just as an update from _waaaaay _back in late February, when I asked for a IEM recommendation, I received my FXT90 yesterday and I agree with most of ljokerl's impression on it, albeit with a few things I still haven't noticed yet, such as the airiness. But still, it's quite the perfect match for me and have to thank ljokerl for his suggestion back then. Heck I even got it at lesser than street price at $108! Super bargain IMO.


 
   
  Great price, glad you like 'em!
  
   


  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Hey joker I was wondering how the Atrio MG7 stacks up against the FXT90.  I just bought the Atrio's a few days ago and I have the FXT90 but I'm not all that impressed with them because I just find them to have a sound signature I just don't like to much.  I'm hoping the MG7 is more to my liking and from your review of them I think they will be I just want to know if they are as airy and bright as the FXT90.  I'm looking for a warmer sound but still have some good detail and I know the bass will be great with the lake of a mid-bass hump.


 


  Since I don't know what your signature preferences are and why the FXT90 doesn't suit them, you're probably best off just trying the MG7 yourself. They are neither as airy nor as bright as the FXT90 if that was the problem.


----------



## Techno Kid

Thanks joker thats what I wanted to know.  I think the MG7 will suit me just right.


----------



## luc shrine

hi joker. this is my first post 
  why dont u put the review about TF10 & sunrise xcited whereas u have heard it? (i mean on this thread)
   
  i love k-pop like SNSD, G.Na, IU. either their beat songs or mellow songs.
  IU and taeyoen SNSD (wish u know them lol) have a very good high voice, i love their voice, but dont like when the voices sound harsh/sibilance. ah, why dba-02 and gr07 have a great score whereas many people in my country said that they're too sibilance?
   
  may i have ur advice which one (or maybe two) is/are best for me? max. budget <= $200
  - TF10 (about $200 in my country)
  - Brainwavz B2 / FA DBA-02
  - HifiMan RE 262
  - VSonic GR07
  - phonak pfe 112 (not worth if it not amp?)
  - Shure 215
  - or maybe another option?
   
  for <= $100
  - sunrise 'B' xcited
  - sunrise sw xcape
  - RE-ZERO
  - FA Eterna
   
  source: only ipod touch 4 / sansa clip and without amp. my IEM is only monoprice 8320. i like monoprice, but still really want to upgrade my IEM.
   
  sorry for my bad english 
   
  thanks in advance


----------



## Gilly87

Just so you know, those are all VERY different headphones...it sounds like you should do more research on your own before posing questions to joker.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> hi joker. this is my first post
> why dont u put the review about TF10 & sunrise xcited whereas u have heard it? (i mean on this thread)
> 
> i love k-pop like SNSD, G.Na, IU. either their beat songs or mellow songs.
> ...


 

 Yes, those are all over the place. You should really narrow it down based on what you like/would like to see improved over the monoprice 8320 as it has a nice, clean signature that's easy to use as a benchmark. If sibilance is a big concern give the DBA-02 and GR07 a pass - there's enough other options not to risk it (GR01, for example, which is a bit smoother at the top than the DBA-02 and GR07).


----------



## Gilly87

Yeah the MP is a great starting place, what do you like or dislike about it overall?


----------



## padcat

Hey Joker, off the top of your head, which headphones excel at classical, around $100 or so
  Probably going to get a pair exclusively for that, hoping not to spend much


----------



## CBus Audio

Hello Joker. You really started a monster with your reviews. Everyone wants to pick your brain, including me. I was narrowing my purchase choice to two IEMs that are currently priced similarly: The Audio-Technica ATH-CK10 and Sony MDR-EX1000.  You have Sony just a .1 higher in your review but it is a dynamic and do you really think that it sounds better than ATs with what you are looking for- ie a more balanced sound across all frequencies? I really do not have the opportunity to try both as they are imports with limited distribution. I have a wide range of music tastes so I am looking for an IEM that can take whatever is thrown at it. I am not a basshead but sometimes I appreciate a bit of oomph with techno. I do have a Electric Avenue PAV2. Do either two benefit from amping? Which has the better soundstage in terms of isolation of instruments and depth? Sounds like the Sony.
   
  BTW the, your review implies the AT CK100 is not a significant upgrade from the CK10 to justify its cost. Would that be accurate?
   
  Also, why haven't you posted a review of the UE TF10? I am extremely curious to see what you think of it.


----------



## boyofrito

I would like to see the SM3 review replaced by a SM3 v2 review if possible.


----------



## luc shrine

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, those are all over the place. You should really narrow it down based on what you like/would like to see improved over the monoprice 8320 as it has a nice, clean signature that's easy to use as a benchmark. If sibilance is a big concern give the DBA-02 and GR07 a pass - there's enough other options not to risk it (GR01, for example, which is a bit smoother at the top than the DBA-02 and GR07).


 


  thank you 
  no one sell GR01 in my country.
  one more question, GR01 or TF10?


----------



## Reomero

Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> GR01 or TF10?


 
   
  Well that would depend on what sound signature you're looking for (which you haven't specified yet).


----------



## luc shrine

Quote: 





reomero said:


> Well that would depend on what sound signature you're looking for (which you haven't specified yet).


 


  ah.. sorry.. the soundsig.
 it quiet difficult for me to tell it clearly in english. i hope u can understand what i mean.
 - mid not too forward neither recessed in order i can hear the instrument behind the vocal clearly.
 - good soundstage.
 - quiet sibilance is ok, but not too sibilance (prefer clear high).
 - bass is enough. not too small nor big.
 - good sound even without amp.


----------



## Reomero

I see.. In that case, I'd suggest the GR01s. But also check out the GR07 as they are both quite similar to my ears.


----------



## Swimsonny

Quote: 





reomero said:


> I see.. In that case, I'd suggest the GR01s. But also check out the GR07 as they are both quite similar to my ears.


 


  Your are sort of suggesting the only iems that you are currently in possession of with the exception of the gr06 so this is quit a biased decision  but then they do, do from what I've heard, be what he is looking for you might be right aha


----------



## ljokerl

Added Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2A25) Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Mar 2012
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





padcat said:


> Hey Joker, off the top of your head, which headphones excel at classical, around $100 or so
> Probably going to get a pair exclusively for that, hoping not to spend much


 

 Depends on what type of sound you prefer for your classical listening. I know some love the detail and accuracy of Etys and yet others can't live without the full-bodied bass of something like an FX700 for orchestral works. If you're in the former group, an RE0 or RE-ZERO should do it.
   


  Quote: 





cbus audio said:


> Hello Joker. You really started a monster with your reviews. Everyone wants to pick your brain, including me. I was narrowing my purchase choice to two IEMs that are currently priced similarly: The Audio-Technica ATH-CK10 and Sony MDR-EX1000.  You have Sony just a .1 higher in your review but it is a dynamic and do you really think that it sounds better than ATs with what you are looking for- ie a more balanced sound across all frequencies? I really do not have the opportunity to try both as they are imports with limited distribution. I have a wide range of music tastes so I am looking for an IEM that can take whatever is thrown at it. I am not a basshead but sometimes I appreciate a bit of oomph with techno. I do have a Electric Avenue PAV2. Do either two benefit from amping? Which has the better soundstage in terms of isolation of instruments and depth? Sounds like the Sony.
> 
> BTW the, your review implies the AT CK100 is not a significant upgrade from the CK10 to justify its cost. Would that be accurate?
> 
> Also, why haven't you posted a review of the UE TF10? I am extremely curious to see what you think of it.


 

 I don't think the EX1000 is as ruler-flat as the CK10 but if priced similarly I would take the Sonys no question. They definitely move more air for your bass needs without sounding unbalanced. Both are efficient and have good separation although the Sony definitely has way more width than depth whereas the CK10 is more spherical/well-rounded in terms of soundstage shape.
   
  The CK100 is different in signature so it's not too fair to compare the two. It isn't any more accurate than the CK10 but they each do certain things well. 
   
  I don't like the fit of the TF10 and haven't had the time to review it.
   


  Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> ah.. sorry.. the soundsig.
> it quiet difficult for me to tell it clearly in english. i hope u can understand what i mean.
> - mid not too forward neither recessed in order i can hear the instrument behind the vocal clearly.
> - good soundstage.
> ...


 


  The quantification of 'enough bass' definitely differs from listener to listener. The GR01 has better extension compared to the Monoprice but not more impact so if you think the Monoprice needs more bass power, look elsewhere.


----------



## kanuka

great joker!! thanks for the mkii review
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 (actually, they're cheaper on gd-audiobase...)
   
  (and nice B2 pic addition)


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2A25) Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII*
> Reviewed Mar 2012
> 
> *Biggest complaint is the lack of a cable cinch, which would be a bigger help with the thicker & stiffer flat cable compared to the old DBA-02’s softer twisted cord*
> ...


 

 Do you think that the slightly toned-down treble has in part compromised the 'spirit' of the DBA-02? I guess I'm biased as a Mk. I owner, but when I heard the Mk. II, it seemed like a purposeful compromise of the TWFK's abilities in order to satisfy a broader audience. The problem is, most people just couldn't handle the DBA-02 --- it handled _them_. I don't know how much the DBA-02 MK II improves things in that regard. I do like the new ergonomic changes a lot, with the exception of the missing neck cinch... but to me it's a shame to have compromised that incredibly aggressive sound especially when the new version might not win over many more fans.


----------



## sonnybayo

hi! i'm really new to the scene and i was wondering how you would rate the ultimate ears 700? i have an meelec a151 and brainwavz m4 on the way. would the ue 700 round up my phones? or should i just go straight for ue 700?
  currently just on jvc fxc80. looking to upgrade.


----------



## dogears

\m/
  
  Quote:  





> The problem is, most people just couldn't handle the DBA-02 --- it handled _them_.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

wow that's a high rating for the DBa's!


----------



## PhoenixClaw

Thanks for the DBA-02 mkii review joker. I liked the mkii much better than the first version, but I didnt get enough time auditioning to see how much better it was.


----------



## FlySweep

Excellent review of the MKII, joker.. Being an MKI owner, you answered most all my questions about the MKII.  I think tomscy2000 most definitely has a good point about toning the treble down a bit as 'sacrificing' some of the charm that made the original DBA such a hit.  I personally never had a problem with treble sharpness/sibilance (unless the recording called for it) as long as a good, deep seal was achieved.
   
  I've had my DBA reshelled & would very much like to audition the MKII to see how it stacks up cause the reshelled DBA's sound a little more refined to my ears than their universal incarnate (refinement that goes beyond just improved isolation).


----------



## Swimsonny

totally dubbed said:


> wow that's a high rating for the DBa's!




Well I have the mk1s and they are amazing and defiently deserve the SQ score! However I don't think youd like them just because if their bass quantity as by looking at your list you like a lot of bass!


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> Well I have the mk1s and they are amazing and defiently deserve the SQ score! However I don't think youd like them just because if their bass quantity as by looking at your list you like a lot of bass!


 
  haha well - how do they compare to some in my list?

 Bass quantity and generally speaking?


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> haha well - how do they compare to some in my list? Bass quantity and generally speaking?


 

 haha, you're going to think they have ZERO bass... I'm almost sure of it!
   
  On a more accurate note, they probably have bass in around the same quantity as the Phonak PFEs... but more textured and better extended. The treble is just as prominent, and in some cases even more aggressive.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> haha, you're going to think they have ZERO bass... I'm almost sure of it!
> 
> On a more accurate note, they probably have bass in around the same quantity as the Phonak PFEs... but more textured and better extended. The treble is just as prominent, and in some cases even more aggressive.


 

 haha ok - I'll ask no further than that
  All i needed to know 
   
  EDIT:
 haha oh dear - I shouldn't have even asked.
  If only I had read the first 2 lines, instead of jumping in the review....
  "Dual BA"

 GOODNIGHT to that one lol!


----------



## vwinter

tomscy2000 said:


> haha, you're going to think they have ZERO bass... I'm almost sure of it!
> 
> On a more accurate note, they probably have bass in around the same quantity as the Phonak PFEs... but more textured and better extended. The treble is just as prominent, and in some cases even more aggressive.




When I had the B2 I was very pleasantly surprised at the bass extension, good impact and texture too, and really was pretty balanced in the presenetation. The way people talk about single and dual BA's I half expected that whole part of the frequency response to just not be there, like the floor dropping out from under that portion of the graph.

They just gave me a pretty painful vacuum seal and didn't quite have the soundstage presentation I was looking for. Otherwise, I can see why they are regarded as highly as they are (I'm extrapolating my B2 experience to the DBA-02's).

Great review Joker.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


  but you the digizoid right? that'd work nice with those Dual BA


----------



## Swimsonny

totally dubbed said:


> haha well - how do they compare to some in my list?
> 
> Bass quantity and generally speaking?



I didnt reply as this seemed to be answered and I have no earphones that you've got on your list!



kanuka said:


> but you the digizoid right? that'd work nice with those Dual BA




But yh dubbed this could pair nicely with the dbas adding a bit of quantity to the already greatly detailed and well extended bass they have. How Did the Phonaks sound with the ZO as they are also BA?


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> but you the digizoid right? that'd work nice with those Dual BA


 

 Very true indeed.
  Now I can literally take the most basslight IEM's ive heard then bump them up to sound like some TFTA's !
   


  Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> I didnt reply as this seemed to be answered and I have no earphones that you've got on your list!
> But yh dubbed this could pair nicely with the dbas adding a bit of quantity to the already greatly detailed and well extended bass they have. How Did the Phonaks sound with the ZO as they are also BA?


 

 No problem man!
  I sold the PFE's before I even bought the ZO2 

 Would have been nice to try though.


----------



## Gilly87

The sound is the same, by all accounts I've heard. Add extra points for comfort and a replaceable cable; seems like easy enough math.
  
  Quote: 





boyofrito said:


> I would like to see the SM3 review replaced by a SM3 v2 review if possible.


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> The sound is the same, by all accounts I've heard. Add extra points for comfort and a replaceable cable; seems like easy enough math.


 

 Yep, the guys at Earsonics said so themselves. Until a couple weeks ago, I thought there might be differences (I've only heard the V2) because the stated specs were different, but it turned out that they were just typos.


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The top end of the DBA-02 mkII is crisp and extended. The resolution of the TWFK driver is immense – even the VSonic GR07 fails to sound all that clean and effortless next to the DBA-02. Compared to the original DBA-02, the mkII seems to have been tuned for slightly more relaxed treble, but in reality it is only a hair less sibilant on a few tracks. Otherwise it sounds sparkly and energetic, as the original did – less ‘hot’ than the ATH-CK10 but still not quite as smooth as the VSonic GR01. Treble extension is good and yet there’s none of the sheen or shimmer present at the top end of some other BA-based universals, resulting in fairly realistic timbre with no metallic treble edge.


 


  Hi Joker; can you please explain the difference between sparkle and "sheen and shimmer?"


----------



## Niyologist

I'm wondering if there's any Multi BA's that matches the bass of the FXT90 in both quantity/quality and has at least a slightly more enveloping soundstage, with greater detail and between the price range of $200-350?


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> Hi Joker; can you please explain the difference between sparkle and "sheen and shimmer?"


 

 I tend to think of it as an extended decay in the treble region, like a reflection off a shiny object.  Curious how others interpret that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> great joker!! thanks for the mkii review
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 



  Interesting, I was told the MSRP would go up compared to the mkI.  You can thank Anaxilus for loaning me his B2 for DBA-02 comparisons and photos 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Couldn't find B2 on mp4nation's site anymore, though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


  
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Do you think that the slightly toned-down treble has in part compromised the 'spirit' of the DBA-02? I guess I'm biased as a Mk. I owner, but when I heard the Mk. II, it seemed like a purposeful compromise of the TWFK's abilities in order to satisfy a broader audience. The problem is, most people just couldn't handle the DBA-02 --- it handled _them_. I don't know how much the DBA-02 MK II improves things in that regard. I do like the new ergonomic changes a lot, with the exception of the missing neck cinch... but to me it's a shame to have compromised that incredibly aggressive sound especially when the new version might not win over many more fans.


 

 I guess that will depend on who you ask (see below). Out of all the TWFKs I've heard the DBA-02 and DBA-02 mkII are still the closest to each other in performance & signature (I would say the mkII takes a half-step towards the q-JAYS sound while the mkI is a half-step closer to the CK10). I think 90% of those who didn't like the original DBA still won't like the new one and more than a few will prefer the old one. However, without the ability to A:B them or extended ownership of the original DBA-02, I really don't think most potential purchasers would be able to tell them apart having only read others' impressions.
   


  Quote: 





phoenixclaw said:


> Thanks for the DBA-02 mkii review joker. I liked the mkii much better than the first version, but I didnt get enough time auditioning to see how much better it was.


 





   


  Quote: 





sonnybayo said:


> hi! i'm really new to the scene and i was wondering how you would rate the ultimate ears 700? i have an meelec a151 and brainwavz m4 on the way. would the ue 700 round up my phones? or should i just go straight for ue 700?
> currently just on jvc fxc80. looking to upgrade.


 

 I put the original UE700 almost on-par with the q-JAYS and Phiaton PS200 but the new (logitech-branded) ones sound better, a little less shrill at the top and not as texture-less. Probably a little above the q-JAYS/PS200. It's a very different sound from the A151 (more like an armature version of an FXC80 with less bass). If you end up liking the A151 but wishing for a much brighter sound with a larger soundstage, the UE700 is probably worth looking at. I have not heard the M4.
   


  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Excellent review of the MKII, joker.. Being an MKI owner, you answered most all my questions about the MKII.  I think tomscy2000 most definitely has a good point about toning the treble down a bit as 'sacrificing' some of the charm that made the original DBA such a hit.  I personally never had a problem with treble sharpness/sibilance (unless the recording called for it) as long as a good, deep seal was achieved.
> 
> I've had my DBA reshelled & would very much like to audition the MKII to see how it stacks up cause the reshelled DBA's sound a little more refined to my ears than their universal incarnate (refinement that goes beyond just improved isolation).


 

 That can probably be arranged - sent you a PM.
   


  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> When I had the B2 I was very pleasantly surprised at the bass extension, good impact and texture too, and really was pretty balanced in the presenetation. The way people talk about single and dual BA's I half expected that whole part of the frequency response to just not be there, like the floor dropping out from under that portion of the graph.
> They just gave me a pretty painful vacuum seal and didn't quite have the soundstage presentation I was looking for. Otherwise, I can see why they are regarded as highly as they are (I'm extrapolating my B2 experience to the DBA-02's).
> Great review Joker.


 
   
  Thanks! Certainly no huge problems with bottom-end extension for any of the TWFK-based phones but some (ahem.. PS200) lose body quicker than others. 
  
   


  Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> Hi Joker; can you please explain the difference between sparkle and "sheen and shimmer?"


 


  At least the way they are used in this context, they refer to a lack of texture/smoothed-over sound in the treble region. For examples see something like a CK100 or UE700 compared to a dryer/more textured set like the DBA-02 or Westone 3.


  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'm wondering if there's any Multi BA's that matches the bass of the FXT90 in both quantity/quality and has at least a slightly more enveloping soundstage, with greater detail and between the price range of $200-350?


 

 Different presentations but the Earsonics SM2, SM3 and Westone UM3X, W3 all have good bass and very good detail overall.


----------



## aviator003

Hi Joker, You have created a monster  One of the most informative posts ever! Still gulping it down...
   
  Bit new here, wanted your *recommendation* on buys - m looking for a *couple of pair of earphones* with distinct sound signature - one with more* accurate reproduction (preferably not too boring)* and another with the *fun of listening*. Not sure how much i could convey, hope u got the picture!
   
_Preference for durability and longevity_, Budget less than* $ 120* . Till now my best buy has been Brainwavz M1. Will be driving them from Lap, Ipod, Normal Mp3. 
   
  I have narrowed it down but you are most welcome to suggest otherwise. 
  Ety HF5, MC5, RE0, Eterna and Xears TD-III Blackwood v2. I will buy 2 if the total is around 120-130 dollars. 
   
  Would be great if u can help me out.. thanks. Best


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Different presentations but the Earsonics SM2, SM3 and Westone UM3X, W3 all have good bass and very good detail overall.


 

       Thanks for the tip.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Joker, thanks a million for the entry level IEM giveaway lucky draw--I see I've won third 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 So I was looking through the phones you're giving away and noticed something--why are you giving away the UE 100 before you've even finished reviewing it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  If you still remember the graphs I posted



  (FR graphs relative to my ideal: SHE3580-red, Etys-black)
   
  Do you think there's anything in your draw that will suit my tastes for a neutral or mid-forward set with smooth / polite highs?  From your reviews I think the CX21P or if that's taken by my turn maybe the Aodia i100 or M2P?  The UE 100 is the one I don't know anything about at this point


----------



## sonnybayo

thanks for the tip. i have another one, sorry. how would you rate the ultimate ears triple fi 10? which ones would it be at par with?


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Interesting, I was told the MSRP would go up compared to the mkI.  You can thank Anaxilus for loaning me his B2 for DBA-02 comparisons and photos
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 According to their online customer support (which has not let me astray yet), they are getting in a new batch next month sometime.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aviator003 said:


> Hi Joker, You have created a monster  One of the most informative posts ever! Still gulping it down...
> 
> Bit new here, wanted your *recommendation* on buys - m looking for a *couple of pair of earphones* with distinct sound signature - one with more* accurate reproduction (preferably not too boring)* and another with the *fun of listening*. Not sure how much i could convey, hope u got the picture!
> 
> ...


 

 Well, the HF5 is my favorite on that list and definitely the one I would recommend for accurate reproduction but that really doesn't leave anything over for a 2nd pair (except maybe for a Philips SHE3580). If you don't listen at high volumes you could try to pair an Etymotic EK5 (which I only heard briefly but thought was better than the MC5) with a Fischer Consonance (over Eterna for durability) or the RE0 with an id America Spark, which has been getting blown out for ~$30.
   


  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Joker, thanks a million for the entry level IEM giveaway lucky draw--I see I've won third
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I did finish with the UE100, I just haven't had occasion (or a good pairing) to post it. I also had to have it replaced (twice) so the pair I'm giving away is brand new. 
   
  The CX21P isn't very polite in the highs but the i100 and M2P (and UE100 for that matter) aren't better than your Philips except maybe in terms of un-EQd balance. The M2P has treble that's too relaxed for me while the i100 is a little on the dry and boring side. Actually, the UE100 is a bit boring too - similar to the i100 in balance but less detailed and with a poorer soundstage.
   


  Quote: 





sonnybayo said:


> thanks for the tip. i have another one, sorry. how would you rate the ultimate ears triple fi 10? which ones would it be at par with?


 

 I think the TF10 is about on-par with the other triple-drivers of its time period - SE530, W3, UM3X, etc
   


  Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> According to their online customer support (which has not let me astray yet), they are getting in a new batch next month sometime.


 

 Thanks, so future buyers will still have an option of going for 1st gen, at least for the time being. That's good.


----------



## sonnybayo

cheers ljokerl . your help is very much appreciated. you have no idea how much you're helping people start out. hopefully we could pay it forward and contribute to the community some day. hehe.


----------



## bmur

Hey joker, ******* amazing list you've created, it must be very satisfying. I'm gonna go ahead and jump on the bandwagon to ask your advice. So I've never owned any decent earphones and am looking for a solid pair ~$100. Over the past week I've put in at least 15 hours of research. At first I was leaning towards some Etys, but I kept stumbling upon posts saying the bass is weak. That made me realize I want a good bass presence.
   
  I listen to a variety of music.. alternative/rock/dubstep/techno/electro/rap/oldies so I'm not looking for an earphone geared specifically towards a genre. After reading your review of the vPulses($79) they seem like my frontrunner at the moment. You described them as having a powerful, clean bass while still having good presentation across the spectrum. But, a few pages back you compare the Sparks to them saying they are quite similiar (although you score them lower in almost every category). I can get the Sparks on amazon for $32, and I'm having trouble justifying spending $50 more.
   
  Also, how do you compare the SE215s to the sparks/vpulses? Feel free to add any other suggestions that come to mind.


----------



## jgray91

And here I am again. Need a few suggestions for another IEM for the gym/jogging outside. Not more than $70 if possible, and a sound signature like the JVC FXT90. If possible though something from MEElec because I'm about to order some tips from them. But I'm open to suggestions from other brands too.
   
  Man that JVC really has me smitten. Really got to thank you again ljokerl.


----------



## Gofre

This is a very vague question I know, but as a rule of thumb, in the $400+ price range will you get better audio quality from IEMs or over/on ear headphones? in particular the two sets I'm currently looking into are the Hifiman HE-300 and the Westone 4, which I can get for the same price of £275 (just over $400 at current exchange rates). Any insights or other suggestions are welcome, I'm looking for the best audio quality for the aforementioned budget, everything else is secondary. Looking for a neutral sound signature more or less, with my main listening habits revolving around dubstep and other genres of EDM, so I'd like enough enough impact and extension at the low end to get a satisfying experience out of those genres.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sonnybayo said:


> cheers ljokerl . your help is very much appreciated. you have no idea how much you're helping people start out. hopefully we could pay it forward and contribute to the community some day. hehe.


 

 Thanks, glad I could help.
   


  Quote: 





bmur said:


> Hey joker, ******* amazing list you've created, it must be very satisfying. I'm gonna go ahead and jump on the bandwagon to ask your advice. So I've never owned any decent earphones and am looking for a solid pair ~$100. Over the past week I've put in at least 15 hours of research. At first I was leaning towards some Etys, but I kept stumbling upon posts saying the bass is weak. That made me realize I want a good bass presence.
> 
> I listen to a variety of music.. alternative/rock/dubstep/techno/electro/rap/oldies so I'm not looking for an earphone geared specifically towards a genre. After reading your review of the vPulses($79) they seem like my frontrunner at the moment. You described them as having a powerful, clean bass while still having good presentation across the spectrum. But, a few pages back you compare the Sparks to them saying they are quite similiar (although you score them lower in almost every category). I can get the Sparks on amazon for $32, and I'm having trouble justifying spending $50 more.
> 
> Also, how do you compare the SE215s to the sparks/vpulses? Feel free to add any other suggestions that come to mind.


 
   
  Generally speaking, I don't think the vPulse is worth $50 more than the Spark. It is a bit more user-friendly in several ways but in terms of sound it's a fair match - both have their strengths and weaknesses. The SE215 is a little more balanced overall and also more refined. The HiSound Crystal may be another one worth looking at if you're interested in the SE215.
   


  Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> And here I am again. Need a few suggestions for another IEM for the gym/jogging outside. Not more than $70 if possible, and a sound signature like the JVC FXT90. If possible though something from MEElec because I'm about to order some tips from them. But I'm open to suggestions from other brands too.
> 
> Man that JVC really has me smitten. Really got to thank you again ljokerl.


 

 Most MEElec sets (with the exception of the CX21, CW31, and A151) tend to be v-shaped. The CW31 and CC51 are the two I would recommend from them but you could also look at the id america Spark that's on sale if you don't mind slightly recessed mids. None of these are particularly gym-friendly, though - for that maybe a Soundmagic E30? It's not a great match for FXT90 sound but it is a nicely balanced set with a low price tag.

  
  Quote: 





gofre said:


> This is a very vague question I know, but as a rule of thumb, in the $400+ price range will you get better audio quality from IEMs or over/on ear headphones? in particular the two sets I'm currently looking into are the Hifiman HE-300 and the Westone 4, which I can get for the same price of £275 (just over $400 at current exchange rates). Any insights or other suggestions are welcome, I'm looking for the best audio quality for the aforementioned budget, everything else is secondary. Looking for a neutral sound signature more or less, with my main listening habits revolving around dubstep and other genres of EDM, so I'd like enough enough impact and extension at the low end to get a satisfying experience out of those genres.


 

 Depends who you ask. Not all $400 sets are made equal, and that goes both ways. I don't have any hands-on experience with the HE-300. I do use full-size sets at home a lot of the time and would probably only keep a full-size setup for home use. If you plan to go outside with them, go for IEMs.


----------



## jgray91

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Most MEElec sets (with the exception of the CX21, CW31, and A151) tend to be v-shaped. The CW31 and CC51 are the two I would recommend from them but you could also look at the id america Spark that's on sale if you don't mind slightly recessed mids. None of these are particularly gym-friendly, though - for that maybe a Soundmagic E30? It's not a great match for FXT90 sound but it is a nicely balanced set with a low price tag.


 


  Thanks for the fast reply. I see. Well from just speedily reading your reviews yesterday the E30 certainly caught my eye for a while. Will read more on your suggestions though.


----------



## Niyologist

It's weird that the MEELEC RX12 comes with a *2-Year Warranty. *


----------



## kanuka

...


----------



## Gofre

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Depends who you ask. Not all $400 sets are made equal, and that goes both ways. I don't have any hands-on experience with the HE-300. I do use full-size sets at home a lot of the time and would probably only keep a full-size setup for home use. If you plan to go outside with them, go for IEMs.


 


  Thanks for the response. I'm really just after the best degree of audio fidelity I can get. I do most of my listening at home anyway, but if they can be used outdoors then that's obviously a bonus.

 Out of interest, what would opt for on my budget?


----------



## sokre

Hi!
   
  I havent used proper IEMs and I own Yuin PK2 which I like. Can you tell me what range of iems should I look at. I dont want to downgrade...
  I was looking at these new fischer audio db2 mk2.


----------



## kanuka

joker, how do you find the Eterna v1 mids and vocals recession compared to the Crystal?


----------



## suman134

some one please message me the official website of ecci earphones . please ..


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





gofre said:


> Thanks for the response. I'm really just after the best degree of audio fidelity I can get. I do most of my listening at home anyway, but if they can be used outdoors then that's obviously a bonus.
> 
> Out of interest, what would opt for on my budget?


 

 I fi were you, i would first determine, if i want headphones or earphones - then try and narrow it down.
  (FYI: I have no experience with either of the ones u listed)
   
  A littel note by me:
 More often than not, when you compare $100 vs $400 you will notice a little difference, but more often than not, at least for me, the price increase isn't worth that audio quality increase.
  In other words:
 4x the price = 1.5x - 2x the SQ
   
  This is from what I have personally experienced with some of the earphones I've owned.
  That's why i aim to keep it ALWAYS under £200 for earphones.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> some one please message me the official website of ecci earphones . please ..


 


  www.audioecci.com
   
  ECCI just announced the new PR200 MKII, I'm really interested to see how it compares to the old PR200....
  From reading Chinese forums, I can gather that the bass is more pronounced


----------



## Swimsonny

Quote: 





gofre said:


> This is a very vague question I know, but as a rule of thumb, in the $400+ price range will you get better audio quality from IEMs or over/on ear headphones? in particular the two sets I'm currently looking into are the Hifiman HE-300 and the Westone 4, which I can get for the same price of £275 (just over $400 at current exchange rates). Any insights or other suggestions are welcome, I'm looking for the best audio quality for the aforementioned budget, everything else is secondary. Looking for a neutral sound signature more or less, with my main listening habits revolving around dubstep and other genres of EDM, so I'd like enough enough impact and extension at the low end to get a satisfying experience out of those genres.


 

 Head direct sell he-300 for 250 dollars and their is one in EU on the FS forums 175 dollars shipped to the UK! So in real terms you can get these and god pair of in ears for 275 quid


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gofre said:


> Thanks for the response. I'm really just after the best degree of audio fidelity I can get. I do most of my listening at home anyway, but if they can be used outdoors then that's obviously a bonus.
> 
> Out of interest, what would opt for on my budget?


 

 Really depends on your preferred signature. The Sony MDR-EX1000 might be a good choice as it is accurate, yet still has good bass and a large soundstage. Or you could save a chunk of change and go for a GR07 or EX600.

  
  Quote: 





sokre said:


> Hi!
> 
> I havent used proper IEMs and I own Yuin PK2 which I like. Can you tell me what range of iems should I look at. I dont want to downgrade...
> I was looking at these new fischer audio db2 mk2.


 

 Unfortunately I haven't heard the PK2 - only the PK3 and OK1. I ate the DBA-02 above both but it very different in signature from the warmer, darker PK3.
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> joker, how do you find the Eterna v1 mids and vocals recession compared to the Crystal?


 

 Worse
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> www.audioecci.com
> 
> ECCI just announced the new PR200 MKII, I'm really interested to see how it compares to the old PR200....
> From reading Chinese forums, I can gather that the bass is more pronounced


 

 That looks very sleek compared to the old ones and the PR300


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I haven't heard the PK2 - only the PK3 and OK1. I *ate the DBA-02* above both but it very different in signature from the warmer, darker PK3.


 

 Yum!


----------



## airomjosh

Between Vsonic GR01 and DBA-02MKII, which has a better overall SQ?


----------



## queerquirks

Owned a Brainwavz M2,
  How do the Meelec M9 compare to the M2?


----------



## PowerSlide

bought dunu trident for $15 from taobao, such a great value buy as the build quality is top notch
   
  1st impression is good now burning in see what it can do later on


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> Yum!


 

 Spellcheck failed me on that one.
   


  Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> Between Vsonic GR01 and DBA-02MKII, which has a better overall SQ?


 

 Neither, really - it depends on whether you prefer something more transparent and aggressive (DBA-02) or more smooth and laid-back (GR01). See the GR01 review posted here for more info.
   


  Quote: 





queerquirks said:


> Owned a Brainwavz M2,
> How do the Meelec M9 compare to the M2?


 


  Not well aside from bass depth and treble emphasis, which the M9 has more of. They are in two different price categories anyway.


  Quote: 





powerslide said:


> bought dunu trident for $15 from taobao, such a great value buy as the build quality is top notch
> 
> 1st impression is good now burning in see what it can do later on


 


  Sounds like a good deal!


----------



## Xinn3r

I am seriously really REALLY confused on what to get.... either the GR01 or the GR07...
  Technically, the GR01 seems better, but there really really a lot of people praising the GR07, including you Joker, which really counts as a lot... what really interest me the most is the "Jack of all trades, master of none" thing, which I think really suits me...
   
  Also, I'm afraid that GR01's bass will just be too little for my taste... I never owned a BA IEM before, so I really can't make a comparison....
  And I'm afraid the GR01 can't be driven properly by my iPod Touch.... 
   
  And lastly, the GR07 seems more user-friendly, being a over-the-ear style, I can use it while walking, whereas the GR01 lacks even a shirt clip, and in your review you stated pretty obviously that it's microphonic, so really a minus for me there...
   
  If comparing them on a price ratio, I'll pick up a GR07 for sure... but I found a seller here in China who just owned his GR01 for 1 month and is willing to sell it for just 130$.... really really low price.... 
   
  What will you do if you're me Joker?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> I am seriously really REALLY confused on what to get.... either the GR01 or the GR07...
> Technically, the GR01 seems better, but there really really a lot of people praising the GR07, including you Joker, which really counts as a lot... what really interest me the most is the "Jack of all trades, master of none" thing, which I think really suits me...
> 
> Also, I'm afraid that GR01's bass will just be too little for my taste... I never owned a BA IEM before, so I really can't make a comparison....
> ...


 

 Well the GR01 ascribes to the same label as it's quite middle-of-the-road in terms of signature between all of the dual-drivers. If you've never tried a BA or a flat-sounding dynamic (e.g. RE0) I would probably go for the GR07.
   
  That said, I have not had the need to wear the GR01 cable-down and suffer from microphonics. Over-the-ear works fine for me, though I would have liked a cinch for behind-the-neck wear. 
   
  Any chance you could re-sell the GR01 without losing money if the bass is insufficient?


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well the GR01 ascribes to the same label as it's quite middle-of-the-road in terms of signature between all of the dual-drivers. If you've never tried a BA or a flat-sounding dynamic (e.g. RE0) I would probably go for the GR07.
> 
> That said, I have not had the need to wear the GR01 cable-down and suffer from microphonics. Over-the-ear works fine for me, though I would have liked a cinch for behind-the-neck wear.
> 
> Any chance you could re-sell the GR01 without losing money if the bass is insufficient?


 

 Well, I'll be receiving an Etymotic MC5 tomorrow... how will the MC5 bass compare to the GR01?
  Also, GR01 is more detailed and transparent than GR07 right?
   
  I don't think I'll be comfortable wearing the GR01 over-the-ear... but perhaps I could try it
  Without losing money, no, but maybe if I lower the price 10-20$ some people will be interested....
   
  EDIT: Recieved my MC5 today, bass is adequate, not really lacking.... will the GR01 have less or more bass than the MC5?
  I'm really uncomfortable using the triple-flange though... my ears hurt... is this normal for first-time users? Will I get used to it?
  Or should I just cut it to make it a bi-flange tips
  I'm using the small ones...


----------



## suman134

what are the brands available in china ? i want a improvement over my ue 700 , and hd 280 pro , any suggestions ? can i get fischer audio dba-2 and xb700 in china ?


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> what are the brands available in china ? i want a improvement over my ue 700 , and hd 280 pro , any suggestions ? can i get fischer audio dba-2 and xb700 in china ?


 

 UE, Westone, Visang, DUNU, HifiMan, VSonic, ECCI.... alot actually, you can go to www.taobao.com to check prices and availability
   
  Some overseas products are more expensive though


----------



## gulatiishank

Which would be the best iem for me between Brainwavz pro alpha ,M1,and Soundmagic E30.(all of them has almost same rating in this thread) 
  I litsen to mostly all types of genres but more rock, hip hop and RnB.
  Hope someone will help.
  Thanks in advance


----------



## airomjosh

Quote:


gulatiishank said:


> Which would be the best iem for me between Brainwavz pro alpha ,M1,and Soundmagic E30.(all of them has almost same rating in this thread)
> I litsen to mostly all types of genres but more rock, hip hop and RnB.
> Hope someone will help.
> Thanks in advance


 

 I have  entry level iems like visang r02(brainwavz pro alpha), visang r03, soundmagic e30, music valley SP1, and GR06. To my ears, GR06 has the best overall SQ , of course YMMV.


----------



## Viperkun

I have put about 30 hours into my ViSang R02's (Brainwavz ProAlpha) listening to some of the genres you mentioned and found them to be lacking a bit on the quantity of bass for my taste.  The bass is present and fairly tight but I was looking for a little more.  The mids and highs are very clear for the $35.00 and are a great value.  I hooked them up to my FiiO E6 on EQ2 (blue LED) and it helped with the lower end quite a bit but it still feels like a little something is missing there.  The E30's might work out well for you.  Take a look at this thread as well,  it covers some more ideas on the ~$50 price range.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/601802/best-iems-for-50

  
  Quote: 





gulatiishank said:


> Which would be the best iem for me between Brainwavz pro alpha ,M1,and Soundmagic E30.(all of them has almost same rating in this thread)
> I litsen to mostly all types of genres but more rock, hip hop and RnB.
> Hope someone will help.
> Thanks in advance


----------



## gulatiishank

Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> Quote:
> 
> I have  entry level iems like visang r02(brainwavz pro alpha), visang r03, soundmagic e30, music valley SP1, and GR06. To my ears, GR06 has the best overall SQ , of course YMMV.


 


  GR06 isn't available here.


----------



## gulatiishank

Quote: 





viperkun said:


> I have put about 30 hours into my ViSang R02's (Brainwavz ProAlpha) listening to some of the genres you mentioned and found them to be lacking a bit on the quantity of bass for my taste.  The bass is present and fairly tight but I was looking for a little more.  The mids and highs are very clear for the $35.00 and are a great value.  I hooked them up to my FiiO E6 on EQ2 (blue LED) and it helped with the lower end quite a bit but it still feels like a little something is missing there.  The E30's might work out well for you.  Take a look at this thread as well,  it covers some more ideas on the ~$50 price range.
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/601802/best-iems-for-50


 

 Thanks for suggestion.
  But i am still confused b/w these 3 but inclining more towards pro alpha.


----------



## Viperkun

Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> Quote:
> 
> I have  entry level iems like visang r02(brainwavz pro alpha), visang r03, soundmagic e30, music valley SP1, and GR06. To my ears, GR06 has the best overall SQ , of course YMMV.


 


  I havn't heard the GR06 myself but I too have heard very good things about it and it is well valued at the $50 price mark.
   
  Quote: 





gulatiishank said:


> GR06 isn't available here.


 


 I am not sure where you are but if you are looking online for availability as well as local than LendMeURears might ship to you if you havn't checked yet.  The ship to All of Asia, Europe, Middle East, Africa, South America, Canada and USA for very good rates and they sell the GR06 for $51.80 USD which is a great value.
   
http://lendmeurears.com/product_info.php?cPath=13&products_id=140


----------



## gulatiishank

Quote: 





viperkun said:


> I havn't heard the GR06 myself but I too have heard very good things about it and it is well valued at the $50 price mark.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


   
  I checked that link and the price of GR06 is $65 + $16 customs so it will go way out of my budget.
  BTW i am from india.


----------



## Reomero

You do realise that the "$65" is in *SGD*, right?


----------



## gulatiishank

Quote: 





reomero said:


> You do realise that the "$65" is in *SGD*, right?


 


  Sorry, my bad. But still shipping and custom will shoot the price to about $70 so i would rather like stay with brainwavz or soundmagic.


----------



## esanthosh

You won't be charged customs for everything, it's a matter of luck. I've bought twice from Lendmeurears (PR401, GR07), but was not charged duty. You are better off taking a chance.


----------



## gulatiishank

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> You won't be charged customs for everything, it's a matter of luck. I've bought twice from Lendmeurears (PR401, GR07), but was not charged duty. You are better off taking a chance.


 

 I will prefer to buy one locally, tell me if it's available in india.
  Or else which would be best b/w pro alpha, m1, e30.


----------



## kanuka

(deleted)


----------



## nyonya

Hi all, looking for a bit of advice.  Want to buy some IEMs for a friend - budget circa $50.  Need to be either fairly shallow insertion or, if deep insertion, something as comfortable as the Klipsch Image X10 (he recently lost these, and he liked them, but I think even with how small and comfortable those are he didn't particularly like sticking something deep in his ears).  Would prefer at least average isolation, and of course the best sound quality possible given the other constraints.  Music is probably a mix of rock and more modern pop / hip-hop.  I thought I was set on the Xears TD-III v2 but they don't seem to be on Xears' website anymore.  Would the id America Spark be a good choice?  Of course open to other ideas.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## kanuka

theres the new TD4 of Xears
  seems to be the same thing or very similiar


----------



## Gilly87

Hey Joker 
   
  What advantages do you personally feel that the HisoundAudio Crystal has over the Shure SE215? If any, what are it's outright technical advantages?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Well, I'll be receiving an Etymotic MC5 tomorrow... how will the MC5 bass compare to the GR01?
> Also, GR01 is more detailed and transparent than GR07 right?
> 
> I don't think I'll be comfortable wearing the GR01 over-the-ear... but perhaps I could try it
> ...


 

 Similar bass impact with a slight advantage to the GR01 but the GR01 definitely has better depth and texture. It is more detailed than the GR07 but again the margin is tiny. Transparency is a wash - the GR01 is a little too smooth to compete with a DBA-02 mkII or Ety ER4S there.
   


  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> what are the brands available in china ? i want a improvement over my ue 700 , and hd 280 pro , any suggestions ? can i get fischer audio dba-2 and xb700 in china ?


 

 The UE700 is a good IEM, not that many of things can be considered a true 'upgrade' from it. What are you looking to improve on?
   


  Quote: 





gulatiishank said:


> Which would be the best iem for me between Brainwavz pro alpha ,M1,and Soundmagic E30.(all of them has almost same rating in this thread)
> I litsen to mostly all types of genres but more rock, hip hop and RnB.
> Hope someone will help.
> Thanks in advance


 

 Given no more information, probably the ProAlpha - it's a nice east-going sound. If you want heavy bass you could also consider the E10 or Dunu Trident.
   


  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi all, looking for a bit of advice.  Want to buy some IEMs for a friend - budget circa $50.  Need to be either fairly shallow insertion or, if deep insertion, something as comfortable as the Klipsch Image X10 (he recently lost these, and he liked them, but I think even with how small and comfortable those are he didn't particularly like sticking something deep in his ears).  Would prefer at least average isolation, and of course the best sound quality possible given the other constraints.  Music is probably a mix of rock and more modern pop / hip-hop.  I thought I was set on the Xears TD-III v2 but they don't seem to be on Xears' website anymore.  Would the id America Spark be a good choice?  Of course open to other ideas.
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  The TD4 has indeed replaced the TD-III v2. The Spark is a good choice at the current price, it's happy with a moderately shallow seal but of course isolation is proportional to how deep you fit them. Soundmagic's E10 might be another option. 
   


  Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Hey Joker
> 
> What advantages do you personally feel that the HisoundAudio Crystal has over the Shure SE215? If any, what are it's outright technical advantages?


 

 Mostly the treble not being sub-par. The Crystal is also more revealing and transparent than the SE215.


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The TD4 has indeed replaced the TD-III v2. The Spark is a good choice at the current price, it's happy with a moderately shallow seal but of course isolation is proportional to how deep you fit them. Soundmagic's E10 might be another option.


 

  
  Which of those three would be your choice?  The TD4 is only slightly more expensive than the Spark, and it sounds like it's more comfortable, more isolating and sounds better - is it also happy with a shallower seal?  Any other pairs to consider?
   
  Thanks for all the help!


----------



## suman134

i broke it , believe me its not strong , the paint faded , inspite of going for another ( i have given it to the service center they will repair the cable with charges ) ue 700 i need some thing different , what about the fischer audio dba-2 , the highs were a bit harsh too ( im just 10 years into music it takes perhaps more to love highs ) . i like dark signature not like the sony , some thing like ue but not eu again ( if triple fi prices come down ) , i may consider the re0 or re-zeros . but i have options here . i need help in headphones more , which should have mids and bass and okay highs , my hd 280 ( 3 years old ) i broke the cable . i got a hd 449 but thats not what i want , i want some thing better and closed .


----------



## suman134

why not try the soundmagic e30 , under the budget and good for what you mentioned , not bass heavy but will do the job . or in $75 bracket , you can try the meelecs , ecci , i have a cc51 that lacks some creeping highs ( awesome value ) , my friends has a a151 that lacks bass but the design is bomb proof . the cable the housing all are really strong . i will say ask him-her to invest in if you dont want to gift it purely with your love intact ( please dont mind ) , if just a friend why not he invest some $50 more and get a ue 700 or re-0 / re-zero ( both the head direct re are under $80 and are awesome value ) .


----------



## suman134

i wonder if you guys would like to pour your ideas on my review of sony xb41ex :-
   
   
      http://www.head-fi.org/t/600799/the-all-new-xb41ex-and-xb21ex-review-the-finla-verdict#post_8248714


----------



## Xinn3r

Suman134, if you're in China, I suggest strongly you try the VSonic GR01 or GR07... as it is easier and cheaper to get here in their own country
  GR01's sound signature will really be similar to the UE700, being they have the same TWFK drivers, although from Joker's review, the GR01 is less bright, toned-down treble....


----------



## ezunyan

hey joker, it seems FA eterna v1 ad consonance are solt out everywhere here
  MEE CC51 and A151 don't seem would please him in bass quantity, and it seems he wants his IEM more above 50$, so E10 is a no.
   
  how's Brainwavz M2's bass compared to eterna and consonance?
   
  and how do you think about sunrise xcape impressive edition?


----------



## Swimsonny

ezunyan said:


> hey joker, it seems FA eterna v1 ad consonance are solt out everywhere here
> MEE CC51 and A151 don't seem would please him in bass quantity, and it seems he wants his IEM more above 50$, so E10 is a no.
> 
> how's Brainwavz M2's bass compared to eterna and consonance?
> ...




I your in the EU frogbeats have some eterna rev 1s in stock!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Which of those three would be your choice?  The TD4 is only slightly more expensive than the Spark, and it sounds like it's more comfortable, more isolating and sounds better - is it also happy with a shallower seal?  Any other pairs to consider?
> 
> Thanks for all the help!


 


  It's not going to be more isolating if you're wearing it with a shallow seal. The only real reservation I have about Xears products is long-term durability. Otherwise the TD4 should be a great option.
   

  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> i broke it , believe me its not strong , the paint faded , inspite of going for another ( i have given it to the service center they will repair the cable with charges ) ue 700 i need some thing different , what about the fischer audio dba-2 , the highs were a bit harsh too ( im just 10 years into music it takes perhaps more to love highs ) . i like dark signature not like the sony , some thing like ue but not eu again ( if triple fi prices come down ) , i may consider the re0 or re-zeros . but i have options here . i need help in headphones more , which should have mids and bass and okay highs , my hd 280 ( 3 years old ) i broke the cable . i got a hd 449 but thats not what i want , i want some thing better and closed .


 
   
  I've never heard the HD280 so you're probably better off starting a separate thread with that question since I can't make proper comparisons to it. There are Sonys out there with darker signatures - the ZX700 for example. 
  
   


  Quote: 





ezunyan said:


> hey joker, it seems FA eterna v1 ad consonance are solt out everywhere here
> MEE CC51 and A151 don't seem would please him in bass quantity, and it seems he wants his IEM more above 50$, so E10 is a no.
> 
> how's Brainwavz M2's bass compared to eterna and consonance?
> ...


 

 The M2 has less bass than consonance/Eterna but a bit more than CC51. It's a good all-rounder.
   
  I wrote a separate Xcape IE review - you can probably find it using forum search. It's a great-sounding set but not bassier than the M2. Build quality is questionable.
   
  Any chance you can get an id America Spark? It sounds a lot like the Consonance. Otherwise you can maybe look at some of the Xears stuff


----------



## vlenbo

.


----------



## suman134

thats not bad to say , zx got things but its just an add up to my hd 449 , mid range is okay in the hands of hd 449 , i need upper midrange with a bit more of bass . i under stand the hd 280 was not that popular , not at my place at least . .thanks for your time . i will fall back if i need more help .


----------



## suman134

just one more help as my cx 400 II are dieing on me too , what about the eterna v2 ? are they par with the older one ?


----------



## jgray91

Hey joker, I'm wondering if you had had your hands on some GR06 yet. Found a few threads on it and curious on your thoughts of it, since they are less than $70.


----------



## vlenbo

You have to try the ckm77 joker, you'll be surprised at how they sound.


----------



## justaguy

Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> Hey joker, I'm wondering if you had had your hands on some GR06 yet. Found a few threads on it and curious on your thoughts of it, since they are less than $70.


 


  +1
 interesting to here your opinion on them


----------



## Gofre

Is anyone aware of any decent IEMs in the £50-£60 (roughly $75-$100) with an asymmetric cable length so that it can be looped around the back of the head like the CX300? It's for a friend that really hates the typical orientation, sound quality is obviously important but there's no major preference in terms of signature. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





gofre said:


> Is anyone aware of any decent IEMs in the £50-£60 (roughly $75-$100) with an asymmetric cable length so that it can be looped around the back of the head like the CX300? It's for a friend that really hates the typical orientation, sound quality is obviously important but there's no major preference in terms of signature. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!


 


  Xears. not all of them


----------



## jgray91

I believe joker put it as j-cable in his reviews here. Maybe that could speed up your search here.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> just one more help as my cx 400 II are dieing on me too , what about the eterna v2 ? are they par with the older one ?


 

 The review in this thread is actually based on the rev2 Eterna but I compared it to the rev1 in the last paragraph.

  
  Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> Hey joker, I'm wondering if you had had your hands on some GR06 yet. Found a few threads on it and curious on your thoughts of it, since they are less than $70.


 

 Yes, I have a GR06. Everything I have on hand but haven't posted reviews of yet is listed on the front page of this thread, under the table.
   
  I have been too busy with the GR01 to get to the GR06 but I have previously said that I was quite impressed with it out of the box. It didn't seem to have the bass depth of the GR07 (a little more oriented towards mid-bass than sub-bass) and isn't quite as clean and detailed but for being 1/3 the price it's remarkably capable. I wouldn't be surprised if it's ends up in the SE215-Hisound crystal range.


  
  Quote: 





gofre said:


> Is anyone aware of any decent IEMs in the £50-£60 (roughly $75-$100) with an asymmetric cable length so that it can be looped around the back of the head like the CX300? It's for a friend that really hates the typical orientation, sound quality is obviously important but there's no major preference in terms of signature. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!


 
   
  You can just search the front page of this thread for "j-cord". As kanuka said some Xears models are j-corded - I would suggest sending them an email and asking which of the current lineup has asymmetric cabling. There are some Koss and Sony (e.g. EX300, EX500) models that use j-cords as well.


----------



## justaguy

Quote: 





gofre said:


> Is anyone aware of any decent IEMs in the £50-£60 (roughly $75-$100) with an asymmetric cable length so that it can be looped around the back of the head like the CX300? It's for a friend that really hates the typical orientation, sound quality is obviously important but there's no major preference in terms of signature. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!


 


  I got the xears xe200pro about a month ago it has cloth covered j-cord
 the price also makes you happy


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, I finally decided to get a GR07, as it really receives a lot of praise from many high-regarded head-fier's such as you and ClieOS
  I just wanted to thank you for your time and help explaining to me about everything


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, I finally decided to get a GR07, as it really receives a lot of praise from many high-regarded head-fier's such as you and ClieOS
> I just wanted to thank you for your time and help explaining to me about everything


 

 Good choice, I'm sure you'll like them


----------



## bcpk

I got my DBA-02 Mk I for €85 at release... FA aren't going to be tempting many people with that price...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bcpk said:


> I got my DBA-02 Mk I for €85 at release... FA aren't going to be tempting many people with that price...


 


  Wasn't the Euro worth a lot more back then? The suggested retail price difference in USD is pretty small.


----------



## ezunyan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The M2 has less bass than consonance/Eterna but a bit more than CC51. It's a good all-rounder.
> 
> I wrote a separate Xcape IE review - you can probably find it using forum search. It's a great-sounding set but not bassier than the M2. Build quality is questionable.
> 
> Any chance you can get an id America Spark? It sounds a lot like the Consonance. Otherwise you can maybe look at some of the Xears stuff


 

  
  AFAIK there are no id America and Xears here. I think the only brand I missed (in my 1st post) was Dunu
  finally I decided and ordered M2, it should arrive in 2-3 days.
  thanks


----------



## MiniWumbo

Just wondering, can anyone verify that the Monster Turbine Pearls do not sound different from the original Monster Turbines?


----------



## XacTactX

Hey there Joker, I have a question about the RE0. I asked you several weeks ago about what eartips I should use with the RE0, and you told me to wait until I received some dual and triple-flange tips that were coming in the mail. I received them, but unfortunately, the size I ordered is too small.
   
  So what ear tips would you recommend for the RE0, to complement the neutral sound it is supposed to have. I saw your recommendations, but I do not have SoundMagic earphones, and I do not want to de-core the Shure olives (too unreliable and finicky).
   
  Thank you.


----------



## suman134

i wonder if you like few kudos to the bass , if you like , then try some sony hybrids or philips rubber tips . they enhance bass , i have tried with my cw31 and ue 700 . hope they fit the re0 , i want one of those , but cant find one here .


----------



## Mad Maniak

Dear ljokerl, a quick question: which would you prefer, Dunu Trident, Xears TD4 or Xears 200Pro?


----------



## dany74q

A quick question if one may , after reviewing this great amount of IEM`s , 
  would you say an armature pair is (generally/technically) better than a dynamic one (or vice versa) ? 
  I am pondering between the FXT90/RE262's and the DBA02-MKII 's and I have no idea which path to choose really .
   
  Many thanks ,
   
  Danny .


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





dany74q said:


> A quick question if one may , after reviewing this great amount of IEM`s ,
> would you say an armature pair is better than a dynamic one (or vice versa) ?
> I am pondering between the FXT90/RE262's and the DBA02-MKII 's and I have no idea which path to choose really .
> 
> ...


 


  I don't think anyone will say that one technology is technically superior to the other - everyone has their personal preferences.  It really comes down to the sound signature you want rather than the way the IEM creates the sound you hear.


----------



## suman134

man , its a thing no one can answer , some dynamics are really good like the rp-hje-900 and triple fi , sony ex 600 , sennh ie8 , chose any thing , but with dynamics , you may need to burn in . chose any and i dont think my pl50 is better then my e30 . ( pl is arm base e30 is dynamic ) . take you ears where your signature takes you .


----------



## kmhaynes

Joker (or anyone else):  did you get a chance to compare the DBA-02 MK2 to the ER-4, or your rememberance of it -- can't remember if you have said if you have the ER-4?
   
  I'm always wondering if there is a new universal available under $200 USD that beats the ER-4. Seems like there are some that come close, but debatable if any beat it.
   
  BTW, I'm feeding my ER-4P with a Cowon J3, and it is getting all the power and EQ needed to make the ER-4P sound outstanding to me.


----------



## Drakokirby

How long does it take you to review an IEM joker?


----------



## Gilly87

UE Triple Fi 10 is a triple BA.
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> man , its a thing no one can answer , some dynamics are really good like the rp-hje-900 and triple fi , sony ex 600 , sennh ie8 , chose any thing , but with dynamics , you may need to burn in . chose any and i dont think my pl50 is better then my e30 . ( pl is arm base e30 is dynamic ) . take you ears where your signature takes you .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xactactx said:


> Hey there Joker, I have a question about the RE0. I asked you several weeks ago about what eartips I should use with the RE0, and you told me to wait until I received some dual and triple-flange tips that were coming in the mail. I received them, but unfortunately, the size I ordered is too small.
> 
> So what ear tips would you recommend for the RE0, to complement the neutral sound it is supposed to have. I saw your recommendations, but I do not have SoundMagic earphones, and I do not want to de-core the Shure olives (too unreliable and finicky).
> 
> Thank you.


 


  I don't know what size tips you bought so what works for me may not work for you. You can actually buy bi-flanges in the same size as the Soundmagic ones from meelec (just look for M9 tips in clear). You could also get the whole M11+ variety pack and find the ones that work for you.


  Quote: 





mad maniak said:


> Dear ljokerl, a quick question: which would you prefer, Dunu Trident, Xears TD4 or Xears 200Pro?


 

 XE200, it's the most balanced based on comparisons to the TD-III rev2 (not sure if TD4 is exactly identical to TD-III).

  
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> I don't think anyone will say that one technology is technically superior to the other - everyone has their personal preferences.  It really comes down to the sound signature you want rather than the way the IEM creates the sound you hear.


 
   
  +1


  Quote: 





kmhaynes said:


> Joker (or anyone else):  did you get a chance to compare the DBA-02 MK2 to the ER-4, or your rememberance of it -- can't remember if you have said if you have the ER-4?
> 
> I'm always wondering if there is a new universal available under $200 USD that beats the ER-4. Seems like there are some that come close, but debatable if any beat it.
> 
> BTW, I'm feeding my ER-4P with a Cowon J3, and it is getting all the power and EQ needed to make the ER-4P sound outstanding to me.


 

 I only have an ER-4S and it's definitely debatable whether the DBA-02 is really better. It does improve slightly on the usual Ety weakness of having a highly elliptical (much more width than depth) soundstage. The only analytical IEM I've heard that I clearly prefer to my ER-4S is the j-Phonic K2 SP.
   
   


  Quote: 





drakokirby said:


> How long does it take you to review an IEM joker?


 

 Depends on how in-depth my listening is - higher-end products usually get a lot more ear time. I would say 4-5 hours for a low-end product and up from there. I can spend dozens of hours with a top-shelf earphone to really get a feel for it but between responding to my threads, answering PMs, and other obligations even the 4-hour ones can easily turn into days or even weeks.


----------



## Gilly87

There is no "better or worse" unless you are looking for a very specific quality. I will say that my first pair of BA IEMs, the Klipsch X10, was a HUGE shock to my system, after having owned only dynamics: everything sounded almost sterile at first, the drivers are much faster and cleaner sounding than dynamics. But you can adjust to the sound, and some people prefer it to dynamics.
   
  All of the IEMs you've listed tend to appeal to people with different sound preferences; if I were you, I would start off by buying some nice sounding budget IEMs like the Monoprice 8320 and Soundmagic PL50 to comapre the sounds of a dynamic and armature driver side by side and getting a baseline impression of different sound signatures and presentations.
   
  Quote: 





dany74q said:


> A quick question if one may , after reviewing this great amount of IEM`s ,
> would you say an armature pair is (generally/technically) better than a dynamic one (or vice versa) ?
> I am pondering between the FXT90/RE262's and the DBA02-MKII 's and I have no idea which path to choose really .
> 
> ...


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





dany74q said:


> A quick question if one may , after reviewing this great amount of IEM`s ,
> would you say an armature pair is (generally/technically) better than a dynamic one (or vice versa) ?
> I am pondering between the FXT90/RE262's and the DBA02-MKII 's and I have no idea which path to choose really .
> 
> ...


 

 Danny,
   
  You've already received some excellent advice in response to this question, especially Gilly87's suggestion to get examples of a few better bang-for-buck cheaper IEM's with different sound signatures, so that you can determine your own preference.
   
  I'll just offer my personal experience with two of these (never heard any RE's of any type).
   
  I have both FXT90's and DBA-02 Mk.I's. The latter were my long-time favorite for several years, and I still love them, but I find that there's something a bit more exciting about music through the FXT90's - I think that's the lush/thick sound of the JVC's coming through versus the Fischer's clear/dry/transparent sound. I am certainly not a basshead, and the FXT90's can sound overly bassy on tracks that have been mixed for heavy bass, but lots of folks like that emphasis. They are certainly more colored and not as accurate as the Fischers, which feel like they deliver the music exactly as it was mixed. BTW, the DBA's give me a good seal so the bass quantity seems adequate, but certainly light in comparison to the JVC's.
   
  My ears are pretty old compared to most head-fi-ers, so I don't have any problem with sibilance, and the 'aggressive' nature of both these IEM's may actually offset any high frequency hearing loss.


----------



## Gilly87

I've always wondered if this might be why it seems people lean towards brighter phones as they progress in both audiophilia and age...
  
  Quote: 





dfrost said:


> My ears are pretty old compared to most head-fi-ers, so I don't have any problem with sibilance, and the 'aggressive' nature of both these IEM's may actually offset any high frequency hearing loss.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> I've always wondered if this might be why it seems people lean towards brighter phones as they progress in both audiophilia and age...


 
  Same thoughts on brighter phones and more *neutral* sounding phones.


----------



## Gilly87

...and thus the end of the superstition of the superiority of "mature" taste in sound 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  ITS SCIENCE!


----------



## heart banger-97

hi
  I received my amp (arrow 4G) few days ago.  but I found it *a little* dark in comparison with ipod touch 3G.
  recently I want to upgrade my IEM ( I have shure se315)
  do you think that westone 4 is suitable for me? or should I choose a bright IEM may be?, something like ath-ck100 or grado gr10 !!!
   
  thanks
  (sorry for my English)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi
> I received my amp (arrow 4G) few days ago.  but I found it *a little* dark in comparison with ipod touch 3G.
> recently I want to upgrade my IEM ( I have shure se315)
> do you think that westone 4 is suitable for me? or should I choose a bright IEM may be, something like ath-ck100 or grado gr10?
> ...


 

 Unfortunately I've never heard the SE315 so I have no idea what you're coming from. The W4 is far from bright - it tends to be balanced with a very slight midrange emphasis. The CK100 generally pairs well with warmer/darker amps but its bass extension/impact is not as impressive as that of the W4. There is a new version of the CK100 - the CK100Pro - which I know nothing about. The Sony MDR-EX1000 might be something to check out as well if you don't need high isolation.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, do you have any tips on how to check for IEM failure/defect, especially when buying second-hand? Like channel imbalance or distortion,etc


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I've never heard the SE315 so I have no idea what you're coming from. The W4 is far from bright - it tends to be balanced with a very slight midrange emphasis. The CK100 generally pairs well with warmer/darker amps but its bass extension/impact is not as impressive as that of the W4. There is a new version of the CK100 - the CK100Pro - which I know nothing about. The Sony MDR-EX1000 might be something to check out as well if you don't need high isolation.


 
  thanks, do you think that ck100 (or ck-100pro or grado gr10) will benefit from an amp? or is it better to sell my amp and buy an IEM alone?


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl*
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunately I've never heard the SE315 so I have no idea what you're coming from. The W4 is far from bright - it tends to be balanced with a very slight midrange emphasis. The CK100 generally pairs well with warmer/darker amps but its bass extension/impact is not as impressive as that of the W4. There is a new version of the CK100 - the CK100Pro - which I know nothing about. The Sony MDR-EX1000 might be something to check out as well if you don't need high isolation.


 
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *heart banger-97* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> thanks, do you think that ck100 (or ck-100pro or grado gr10) will benefit from an amp? or is it better to sell my amp and buy an IEM alone?


 

 I haven't heard the SE315 either, but the CK100PRO is a neutral-to-bright IEM, without the same midrange emphasis as the CK100, though the GR10 is also a decent choice. I believe the CK100PRO is more technically proficient, but obviously more expensive. Joker's suggestion of the EX1000 is good too. And, I don't think any of them really need an amp, but it wouldn't hurt to have one. JM2C...


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> I haven't heard the SE315 either, but the CK100PRO is a neutral-to-bright IEM, without the same midrange emphasis as the CK100, though the GR10 is also a decent choice. I believe the CK100PRO is more technically proficient, but obviously more expensive. Joker's suggestion of the EX1000 is good too. And, I don't think any of them really need an amp, but it wouldn't hurt to have one. JM2C...


 

 thanks
  but ck100pro is too expensive (594$ from amazon)
   
  sound isolation is important to me (so the ex1000 is not a proper choice)
   
  about gr10; I terrify that gr10 would be too bright for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, do you have any tips on how to check for IEM failure/defect, especially when buying second-hand? Like channel imbalance or distortion,etc


 


  For balance, just run a sine sweep. The 'source' should remain relatively centered - if it goes left or right significantly and consistently in a certain frequency range, you'll know the earphones are imbalanced.


----------



## sneaglebob

Do a review of the bose IE2 or the sony MDR-EX10LP


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> Do a review of the bose IE2 or the sony MDR-EX10LP


 

 Make me a sandwich


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Joker, you ain't reviewed the Grado GR8's by any chance have you?
   
  I'll be receiving my pair from grado to review soon enough.
  I'll PM you after I have gone through them, to send them to you for a review/test
   
  How's that sound bro?


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> Joker, you ain't reviewed the Grado GR8's by any chance have you? *I'll be receiving my pair from grado to review soon enough.*


 

 You can probably copy/paste some of the things you wrote on the PFEs...


----------



## heart banger-97

^^^
  he can't write anymore


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> You can probably copy/paste some of the things you wrote on the PFEs...


 
   
  they are the same?
   
  Low bass, nice clarity?
   
  FYI:
 Just my title needs changing.
  So far I'll be doing the matrix and being a baws whilst posting with a BANNED title.
  Doesn't happen every day...well for me every other month LOL


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> Joker, you ain't reviewed the Grado GR8's by any chance have you?
> 
> I'll be receiving my pair from grado to review soon enough.
> I'll PM you after I have gone through them, to send them to you for a review/test
> ...


 

 No, I haven't. I haven't been in contact with Grado since my iGi review went up...
   
  I'll get some time with a GR10 soon, though. The GR8 is also interesting - hopefully the queue will be smaller by then.


----------



## vwinter

Hey Joker, have you had any time with the Brookstone Clear Dual Drive yet? There are some for a good price and I'm thinking of picking one up.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> No, I haven't. I haven't been in contact with Grado since my iGi review went up...
> 
> I'll get some time with a GR10 soon, though. The GR8 is also interesting - hopefully the queue will be smaller by then.


 

 let me know if ur interested (probably will be in a month) before i've burned them in and all 
  And if i end up banned again - then youtube, fb, twitter me or something


----------



## shorehead

Hey Joker, I am looking for a new pair of phones and would like to ask you for a help. I am a jazz/rock/d&b music listener and would like to buy new phones for around 100euro. I cant decide between FA Tandem/Vsonic GR04 Flagship/Vsonic GR06/Crystal. My last phones were Xcape and their microphonics drove me nuts, thus they kept falling out of my ears. Or if you have any other tips. 
   
  Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> let me know if ur interested (probably will be in a month) before i've burned them in and all
> And if i end up banned again - then youtube, fb, twitter me or something


 

 Ok
   


  Quote: 





shorehead said:


> Hey Joker, I am looking for a new pair of phones and would like to ask you for a help. I am a jazz/rock/d&b music listener and would like to buy new phones for around 100euro. I cant decide between FA Tandem/Vsonic GR04 Flagship/Vsonic GR06/Crystal. My last phones were Xcape and their microphonics drove me nuts, thus they kept falling out of my ears. Or if you have any other tips.
> 
> Thanks.


 

 Xcapes worn over-the-ear would have about the same amount of microphonics as the FA Tandem or HiSound Crystal. If you're worried about cable noise get the GR06 and maybe some aftermarket cable guides.


----------



## vwinter

After rereading it, I'm not sure how clear it was but I was making a point of the other guy being kind of rude, not telling you to make me a sandwich lol. Just wanted to put that on the record.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> After rereading it, I'm not sure how clear it was but I was making a point of the other guy being kind of rude, not telling you to make me a sandwich lol. Just wanted to put that on the record.


 


  No worries, I got it the first time.


----------



## 50an6xy06r6n

FYI, apparently the FXT90s can be had for $99 in Canada, as FutureShop is selling them...


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  dont the gr06 already come with cable guides?


----------



## shorehead

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ok
> 
> 
> Xcapes worn over-the-ear would have about the same amount of microphonics as the FA Tandem or HiSound Crystal. If you're worried about cable noise get the GR06 and maybe some aftermarket cable guides.


 


  Thanks Joker. Could you compare GR06 vs GR04 Flagship? Aren't the GR04 Flagships more suitable and accurate (like Xcape) for guitar music?


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, how well do you rate the new UE700? How well do they fare against the GR01?


----------



## airomjosh

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, how well do you rate the new UE700? How well do they fare against the GR01?


 


  maybe you can find the answer here on joker's review of GR01 http://www.head-fi.org/t/603092/review-vsonic-gr01-a-gentlemans-twfk


----------



## suman134

ue 700 is awesome but you need to handle with some care , and about sound , it dont have awesome highs , good amount of bass , and the money goes into the awesome mids and sound stage , microphonics is low , isolation is good and if joker rates cc51 as 7.7 in sound quality , the ue 700 can easily be over 8.5/10 but build and the housing and the cable is in question as the stress reliever is nearly missing . over all its my best iem , just got it back from a cable repair and i will not wind it around my cowon j3 anymore .


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> maybe you can find the answer here on joker's review of GR01 http://www.head-fi.org/t/603092/review-vsonic-gr01-a-gentlemans-twfk


 

 Thanks for the link, but I've read it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  I was just hoping for a more detailed comparison from Joker
   


  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> ue 700 is awesome but you need to handle with some care , and about sound , it dont have awesome highs , good amount of bass , and the money goes into the awesome mids and sound stage , microphonics is low , isolation is good and if joker rates cc51 as 7.7 in sound quality , the ue 700 can easily be over 8.5/10 but build and the housing and the cable is in question as the stress reliever is nearly missing . over all its my best iem , just got it back from a cable repair and i will not wind it around my cowon j3 anymore .


 

 Thanks for the impression, I do realize that the build quality on UE700 isn't that good, especially with no strain relief near the 3.5mm jack...
  And yes, bad idea to wind cable around your player, I learned this when I was 10 years old when my old PS2 controller stick broke because I wrapped it everytime I finished using it


----------



## airomjosh

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Thanks for the link, but I've read it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I have read somewhere that joker mentioned that GR01 is above UE700 in terms of SQ.


----------



## LaDolceVita

Which one would you recommend? The Shure SE215 or RE0?
   
  I listen to all types of music (except country and rap/hip hop), but most of the time I listen to rock and metal, so guitars have to sound good. I also listen occasionally to classical, electronic and jazz. 
   
  What type of sound do I want? I want a good soundstage, good vocals, great guitars, clarity... But at the same time, although I'm not a bass head, I don't want bass-anemic earphones and I want bass to be noticeable, but not muddy or too overpowering. I own a pair of Grado SR-80i, and I think they're too fatiguing and too bright. 
   
  I've narrowed it down to the SE215 and the RE0, but I'm open to other options in that price range. Also, I want an earphone that lasts, so build quality is important.


----------



## jarrett

Easily the SE215. The RE0 won't last


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





50an6xy06r6n said:


> FYI, apparently the FXT90s can be had for $99 in Canada, as FutureShop is selling them...


 

 Good price...
   


  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> dont the gr06 already come with cable guides?


 

 Yes, the Vsonic ones. Good point, I just don't like the fit of those. Phonak/MEElec ones are more comfortable for me.

  
  Quote: 





shorehead said:


> Thanks Joker. Could you compare GR06 vs GR04 Flagship? Aren't the GR04 Flagships more suitable and accurate (like Xcape) for guitar music?


 

 I've never heard the GR04 Flagship.
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, how well do you rate the new UE700? How well do they fare against the GR01?


 

 In terms of score it's about on-par with the q-JAYS and Phiaton PS200. The GR01 is a little warmer, more detailed, more textured, and has more realistic tone and timbre while the UE700 is brighter and more sparkly
   


  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> ue 700 is awesome but you need to handle with some care , and about sound , it dont have awesome highs , good amount of bass , and the money goes into the awesome mids and sound stage , microphonics is low , isolation is good and if joker rates cc51 as 7.7 in sound quality , the ue 700 can easily be over 8.5/10 but build and the housing and the cable is in question as the stress reliever is nearly missing . over all its my best iem , just got it back from a cable repair and i will not wind it around my cowon j3 anymore .


 

 Yes, definitely over 8.5, especially the current Logitech version. 
   


  Quote: 





ladolcevita said:


> Which one would you recommend? The Shure SE215 or RE0?
> 
> I listen to all types of music (except country and rap/hip hop), but most of the time I listen to rock and metal, so guitars have to sound good. I also listen occasionally to classical, electronic and jazz.
> 
> ...


 

 I think the SE215 is closer to what you want - more bass and less treble compared to the RE0, and they will last assuming the cable connectors are good on the current batch. You could also look at the HiSound Crystal although that has more treble compared to the SE215.


----------



## dustdevil

Hey joker, can you compare the Soundmagic pl50, MEElectronics a151 and Westone 1 briefly in terms of sound quality? I've heard the westone 1 a while ago and was really impressed by its mids.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Hey joker, can you compare the Soundmagic pl50, MEElectronics a151 and Westone 1 briefly in terms of sound quality? I've heard the westone 1 a while ago and was really impressed by its mids.


 


  It's been a while since I've heard the W1 and PL50 but the mids are the strong suit of both of those earphones. My lasting impression of the PL50 is that it's slightly mid-centric with a thick, smooth sound for a BA. The W1 was similarly balanced but more airy and more transparent, I really didn't have any major issues with it. The A151 has a bit more mid/upper bass compared to the PL50/W1 but not by much, and a bit less treble, though again not by much.


----------



## LaDolceVita

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think the SE215 is closer to what you want - more bass and less treble compared to the RE0, and they will last assuming the cable connectors are good on the current batch. You could also look at the HiSound Crystal although that has more treble compared to the SE215.


 


  Thanks Joker. I read your review of the HiSound Crystal and the SE215 and apparently they sound pretty much alike. And the price is similar too. To you, what are the main differences between them? I'm not looking for bass monsters, I like bass to be noticeable but without sacrificing detail and the highs and mids.


----------



## Xinn3r

Wrong thread, sorry


----------



## The Neverhood

ljokerl, 
   
  What would be the most accurate and balanced universal irrespective of price?
   
  I have previously owned the CK10, IE8, SE530, RE0, and currently own the RE262 (foam insert removed).
   
  The CK10 was the most detailed, but the treble spike accentuates sibilance, and virtually all my recordings exhibited some sibilance with the CK10. From my limited experience, the only genre that worked with the CK10 was Trance.
   
  I have been interested in the GR07, GR01, FXT90, and EX1000.


----------



## DaBomb77766

Hey, do you have any more to say about the GR06?  Or have you been focusing on other IEMs?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi
> I received my amp (arrow 4G) few days ago.  but I found it *a little* dark in comparison with ipod touch 3G.


 

 You know it has a treble switch?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> What would be the most accurate and balanced universal irrespective of price?
> 
> ...


 
   
  Definitely not the FXT90. Surprised you skipped Etys - I would say my ER4S properly inserted would be my pick.


  Quote: 





dabomb77766 said:


> Hey, do you have any more to say about the GR06?  Or have you been focusing on other IEMs?


 

 The GR06 is coming up in the queue but still a few spots back. Should know a lot more about it in a week 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Drakokirby

I recently bought what I believe to be either Sunrise Xcape IE or the v.2 and i'm looking for something more balance, not like how it feels all warm and stuffy in its sound. Looking for an IEM that has the bass impact like them with clarity and good treble. A above-average or higher soundstage, vocals, and good separation of sounds are also high on the list. My max budget is about $100. Any recommendations?


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> You know it has a treble switch?


 







 may be I was wrong on that point;[and maybe] because I expected more detail from what I waiting for it about 10 months
  anyway ; I'm sorry
  treble switch works great, and my preference treble is I (some times II )
  I want to upgrade my IEM, already I'm waiting to hear news about vsonic gr08 and UE900 to compare them with westone 4R (I think that grado gr10 will be too bright for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)
  do you have any suggestion?
  thanks


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> may be I was wrong on that point;[and maybe] because I expected more detail from what I waiting for it about 10 months
> anyway ; I'm sorry
> treble switch works great, and my preference treble is I (some times II )
> I want to upgrade my IEM, already I'm waiting to hear news about vsonic gr08 and UE900 to compare them with westone 4R (I think that grado gr10 will be too bright for me
> ...


 

 Bro the UE900 was an April Fool's joke...


----------



## ProjectDenz

Quote: 





guhmo said:


> Bro the UE900 was an April Fool's joke...


 


  What?! I was so looking forward to compare them to the upcoming JH18.


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





guhmo said:


> Bro the UE900 was an April Fool's joke...


 






  I had forgotten to look at the date that threat was started
   
   
  so I'm waiting for vsonic gr08


----------



## The Neverhood

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Definitely not the FXT90. Surprised you skipped Etys - I would say my ER4S properly inserted would be my pick.


 


  Thanks I appreciate your time and advice. 
   
  Well, I have always got the impression that the ER4S were lacking in the lower frequencies, and technically speaking, wouldn't that be a coloring? Not how the original recording was intended to be heard and perceived?
   
  I need an IEM that's accurate, being neutral, balanced, transparent, and without the treble peaks often associated with most analytical phones, therefore no false perception of detail. I'm very tempted to purchase the CK10 again, and simply EQ the treble spike out? Or possibly purchase the RE272?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ladolcevita said:


> Thanks Joker. I read your review of the HiSound Crystal and the SE215 and apparently they sound pretty much alike. And the price is similar too. To you, what are the main differences between them? I'm not looking for bass monsters, I like bass to be noticeable but without sacrificing detail and the highs and mids.


 

 The treble - crystals have more of it & it's of better quality. Neither is a bass monster and neither has heavy bass bleed.

  
  Quote: 





drakokirby said:


> I recently bought what I believe to be either Sunrise Xcape IE or the v.2 and i'm looking for something more balance, not like how it feels all warm and stuffy in its sound. Looking for an IEM that has the bass impact like them with clarity and good treble. A above-average or higher soundstage, vocals, and good separation of sounds are also high on the list. My max budget is about $100. Any recommendations?


 

 I am not familiar with the Xcape v2. ECCI PR401 might suit you - it has good space, punchy bass, and plenty of treble sparkle compared to an Xcape IE or other warmer earphones. Otherwise you'd have to add $$ and go for a Sony EX600 or JVC FXT90. 




  Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> Thanks I appreciate your time and advice.
> 
> Well, I have always got the impression that the ER4S were lacking in the lower frequencies, and technically speaking, wouldn't that be a coloring? Not how the original recording was intended to be heard and perceived?
> 
> I need an IEM that's accurate, being neutral, balanced, transparent, and without the treble peaks often associated with most analytical phones, therefore no false perception of detail. I'm very tempted to purchase the CK10 again, and simply EQ the treble spike out? Or possibly purchase the RE272?


 

 A properly-fitted ER4S really isn't any more lacking at the bottom than a CK10, maybe slightly less depth but very close overall. Etys don't have good bass body, hence a reputation for being lean on bass, but if you're looking for a more neutral tone compared to the CK10s they would be it. From a response standpoint I am pretty sure they are flatter than EX1000s, RE262, and especially FXT90s. The RE272 is pretty lean on bass too - rolls off earlier than the ER4S and generally de-emphasizes low frequencies.
   
   
  My CK10 isn't sibilant with the triple-flange tips I've got on them. The treble spike falls above the dangerous 6-8ish range that typically causes sibilance.


----------



## The Neverhood

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> A properly-fitted ER4S really isn't any more lacking at the bottom than a CK10, maybe slightly less depth but very close overall. Etys don't have good bass body, hence a reputation for being lean on bass, but if you're looking for a more neutral tone compared to the CK10s they would be it. From a response standpoint I am pretty sure they are flatter than EX1000s, RE262, and especially FXT90s. The RE272 is pretty lean on bass too - rolls off earlier than the ER4S and generally de-emphasizes low frequencies.
> 
> 
> My CK10 isn't sibilant with the triple-flange tips I've got on them. The treble spike falls above the dangerous 6-8ish range that typically causes sibilance.


 
   
  Thanks again ljokerl,
   
  I tried the triple flange tips, and were very uncomfortable, and instead used the Sony Hybrids.
   
  What about the GR01 or GR07? They seem to be very neutral and balanced phones according to your review, how would they compare to the ER4S and CK10? Obviously the GR07 would be quite different, but not to the same degree with the GR01. The EX600 looks interesting, and apparently more balanced compared to the GR07 according to Inks.
   
  Sorry for all the questions, I have had a very bad experience with sibilance on both the CK10 and RE0, which has subsequently caused myself to be very skeptical of analytical phones, hence the reason of choosing the RE262.


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





projectdenz said:


> What?! I was so looking forward to compare them to the upcoming JH18.


 

  
  Oh, when you get your JH18s, make sure to compare them to the rumoured Monster 6 armature custom! I'm looking forward to reading that comparison


----------



## Drakokirby

What exactly does treble sparkle mean? That it's clear and shines the brighest on the IEM?
  
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The treble - crystals have more of it & it's of better quality. Neither is a bass monster and neither has heavy bass bleed.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> Thanks again ljokerl,
> 
> I tried the triple flange tips, and were very uncomfortable, and instead used the Sony Hybrids.
> 
> ...


 

 They are but you asked for my one pick and the ER4S would be it, I think. The GR01 is close but comparing it to the ER4S I still think the ER4S is a bit more flatter through the midrange.
   
  That said, I don't think the RE0 is sibilant at all so I am not sure if there is some auxiliary issue with treble-prominent earphones in your particular case. I've certainly had worse sibilance accentuation out of the GR07 and GR01 than the RE0.
   


  Quote: 





drakokirby said:


> What exactly does treble sparkle mean? That it's clear and shines the brighest on the IEM?


 


  It's not necessarily a measure of overall balance (i.e. something  could be bass-heavy and still have sparkle -FX700 for example) but rather how prominent the treble is. The opposite would be a dull-sounding earphone like the Dunu Crater or Paradigm E3m, which push treble into the background and severely reduce the energy of certain instruments.


----------



## Gryphus0204

How would you compare between Fischer audio DBA mk-2, Sony MDR EX-600, vsonics GR07 and JVC ha ext 90? I see them with similar sound ratings and around the 100-200 price range? Also individually their sound signature and more on the bass thanks  I like the bass in my music


----------



## suman134

exactly the same answer will help me too , sony is easily available here in but i think other can be availed at beijing .


----------



## airomjosh

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> what are the brands available in china ? i want a improvement over my ue 700 , and hd 280 pro , any suggestions ? can i get fischer audio dba-2 and xb700 in china ?


 


  You can get almost all the brands here in China. You can easily get the two brands you mentioned.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Ultimate Ears 500 / 500vi and Paradigm Shift E3M
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C50) Ultimate Ears 500 / 500vi*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Apr 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2B15) Paradigm Shift E3m*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Apr 2012
> ...


 
   

  
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> How would you compare between Fischer audio DBA mk-2, Sony MDR EX-600, vsonics GR07 and JVC ha ext 90? I see them with similar sound ratings and around the 100-200 price range? Also individually their sound signature and more on the bass thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Similar sound ratings but different signatures - I really don't think the DBA-02 will work for you. The FXT90 is easily the safest choice IMO.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Hmm... Ok thanks


----------



## suman134

really nice review , i like the ue 500 / 400 , what about the ue 600 review ?


----------



## swbf2cheater

Do any of the top customs you've had experience with offer a down style cable option, one that does not loop behind your ear but hands downward like a normal earbud?  I really enjoy my livewire customs which have a 360 degree rotating input, looking to really move up in the world of customs as it seems the best choice for hearing loss. The Livewires are good but do not satisfy my needs at all.  I cant really enjoy my full size headphones right now, but I can enjoy the iems.  The problem I am having now is that I am a sound stage nutcase and want the absolute largest, most spacious sound presentation available. Any thoughts on what might suit my ears best?


----------



## nyonya

Hi ljokerl, would it be possible for you to share the spreadsheet that the chart on the first page comes from (the one that lists all the IEMs and score by category)?  Maybe as a downloadable Excel sheet, or a protected Google Doc?  It would be a big help in terms of sorting the list to include only the categories we might be concerned with for a particular purchase.
   
  Hopefully this wouldn't really be any work, as I'm sure that list is already in a spreadsheet.  If you don't want to share it, no worries, just an idea.  Thanks for the great reviews!


----------



## goodvibes

Completely agree with your E3m review and will add that the lower models have similar sigs. It's too bad because they actually did some effort into these.


----------



## The Neverhood

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They are but you asked for my one pick and the ER4S would be it, I think. The GR01 is close but comparing it to the ER4S I still think the ER4S is a bit more flatter through the midrange.
> 
> That said, I don't think the RE0 is sibilant at all so I am not sure if there is some auxiliary issue with treble-prominent earphones in your particular case. I've certainly had worse sibilance accentuation out of the GR07 and GR01 than the RE0.


 

 Thanks again ljokerl,
   
  I have narrowed my choice down to the ER4S, RE272, HF5, and GR01. I will most likely choose the ER4S because of your recommendation, however the below review has cast some doubt on my mind!
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/575188/re272-review-and-comparisons-to-er-4p-hd650-ath-ck10-ie8
   
  From your perspective - I would become frustrated in responding to inexperienced noobs like myself, more so considering you reply everyday!


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, is a fast decay generally good or bad? Or is it vice versa?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> really nice review , i like the ue 500 / 400 , what about the ue 600 review ?


 

 I don't have a UE600, I only had an old SuperFi5 for review.
   


  Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> Do any of the top customs you've had experience with offer a down style cable option, one that does not loop behind your ear but hands downward like a normal earbud?  I really enjoy my livewire customs which have a 360 degree rotating input, looking to really move up in the world of customs as it seems the best choice for hearing loss. The Livewires are good but do not satisfy my needs at all.  I cant really enjoy my full size headphones right now, but I can enjoy the iems.  The problem I am having now is that I am a sound stage nutcase and want the absolute largest, most spacious sound presentation available. Any thoughts on what might suit my ears best?


 

 I only have one top-level custom, really. I know a few companies do offer cable-down, though not necessarily with detachable cables. I believe Starkey is one, but no hands-on experience with their products here. Average_joe might be able to throw out a few more options.
   


  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl, would it be possible for you to share the spreadsheet that the chart on the first page comes from (the one that lists all the IEMs and score by category)?  Maybe as a downloadable Excel sheet, or a protected Google Doc?  It would be a big help in terms of sorting the list to include only the categories we might be concerned with for a particular purchase.
> 
> Hopefully this wouldn't really be any work, as I'm sure that list is already in a spreadsheet.  If you don't want to share it, no worries, just an idea.  Thanks for the great reviews!


 

 There is a link to a downloadable spreadsheet on the front page, below the table. It hasn't been updated in a few months due to lack of interest but you can always PM me your email address and I'll share the latest version when I get a chance.
   


  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> Completely agree with your E3m review and will add that the lower models have similar sigs. It's too bad because they actually did some effort into these.


 

 Thanks, and good to know. They do seem like a pretty polished product, just putting too much emphasis on too little of the spectrum for me.
   


  Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> Thanks again ljokerl,
> 
> I have narrowed my choice down to the ER4S, RE272, HF5, and GR01. I will most likely choose the ER4S because of your recommendation, however the below review has cast some doubt on my mind!
> 
> ...


 

 Note that I've never heard the ER4P, only the ER4S, which I've owned twice now.
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, is a fast decay generally good or bad? Or is it vice versa?


 
   
  You don't really want things to decay too fast or too slow - one results in a loss of musical detail because you lose note sustainment and the other usually results in a loss of resolution.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You don't really want things to decay too fast or too slow - one results in a loss of musical detail because you lose note sustainment and the other usually results in a loss of resolution.


 

 Ah I see, so it needs to be "just right", thx joker
  Also, I know this is a stupid question, but bear with me, is a shirt clip supposed to be used over or under the Y-Splitter?


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Most manufacturers who pre-install the clip for you always do it _under _the Y-split.  From memory, MEE and Etymotic both did this.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Ah I see, so it needs to be "just right", thx joker
> Also, I know this is a stupid question, but bear with me, is a shirt clip supposed to be used over or under the Y-Splitter?


 

 Keep in mind that the exact "just right" may vary from person to person.
   
  And +1 to above  - never seen a clip mounted above the y-split.


----------



## Swimsonny

Quote: 





swbf2cheater said:


> Do any of the top customs you've had experience with offer a down style cable option, one that does not loop behind your ear but hands downward like a normal earbud?  I really enjoy my livewire customs which have a 360 degree rotating input, looking to really move up in the world of customs as it seems the best choice for hearing loss. The Livewires are good but do not satisfy my needs at all.  I cant really enjoy my full size headphones right now, but I can enjoy the iems.  The problem I am having now is that I am a sound stage nutcase and want the absolute largest, most spacious sound presentation available. Any thoughts on what might suit my ears best?


 

 The Aurisonics AS-1 comes in a cable down option!
  I have the generic version off them and they are fantastic earphones!


----------



## Swimsonny

Joker, 
  I have been looking at the etymotics for long time and fine them something i really want to try as someone has offered them for a trade with me for my HD580s. They are something i love but do not use them enough as i am hardly in. Now i am wondering how they may compare to say the dba-02s so i can get a good idea if i really want them.


----------



## Gasdoc

Hi Joker,

Traded my ASG-1 for the TDK BA200 from a guy from Singapore. Stunning phone. It sounds like a smooth GR07. Ranks up there with the best items I've tried.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> Joker,
> I have been looking at the etymotics for long time and fine them something i really want to try as someone has offered them for a trade with me for my HD580s. They are something i love but do not use them enough as i am hardly in. Now i am wondering how they may compare to say the dba-02s so i can get a good idea if i really want them.


 

 Do you have a DBA-02? They really won't be too different so I doubt you'll want both. I think the DBA-02 has a more well-rounded presentation than any Ety I've tried but otherwise it is at best on-par with a well-fitted ER4S in terms of balance and resolution, with maybe slightly better note thickness in certain regions.
   


  Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Hi Joker,
> Traded my ASG-1 for the TDK BA200 from a guy from Singapore. Stunning phone. It sounds like a smooth GR07. Ranks up there with the best items I've tried.


 


  Unfortunately I haven't heard them but they seem impressive.


----------



## Pianist

Joker, I am curious what the single driver Audeo PFEs lack compared to the best in your opinion. Anything else apart from the slightly peaky treble, limited bass presence and perhaps a slightly "3 blob" soundstage? I am so impressed with them and I think they sound better than Etymotic ER4S personally because I find PFE more dynamic and with a more 3D soundstage while retaining the great transparency of the Etymotics. I also feel PFE is better than RE0 and DBA-02 being clearer and faster than the former with better timbre in the mids and much more dynamic and balanced than the latter with tighter bass and less aggressive, more subtle treble.


----------



## goodvibes

IMO, PFE is just a great all arounder. Great set of compromises. I like the gray filters but you do get a little too much upper mid presence along with the greater inner detail and extension. Not quite ringy but not quite as neutral as ETs. Rounder bottom. Black filters are less informative but warmer.


----------



## tom1l21

Any plans on reviewing the Brainwavz M4?


----------



## Swimsonny

I do have a dba so their would be no point in er4 thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

tom1l21 said:


> Any plans on reviewing the Brainwavz M4?




None at this time


----------



## Gilly87

I'm curious about these...could you say more about the sound and/or create a thread, if you are willing? 
  
  Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Hi Joker,
> Traded my ASG-1 for the TDK BA200 from a guy from Singapore. Stunning phone. It sounds like a smooth GR07. Ranks up there with the best items I've tried.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> IMO, PFE is just a great all arounder. Great set of compromises. I like the gray filters but you do get a little too much upper mid presence along with the greater inner detail and extension. Not quite ringy but not quite as neutral as ETs. Rounder bottom. Black filters are less informative but warmer.


 
   
  I found ER4p significantly less smooth in the highs than PFE and too harsh for me with a lot of music. I also found ER4, especially S version  lacking bass, whereas PFE does not. The soundstage on Etys is quite flat with little depth while PFE offers a much greater sense of depth I think. I liked ER4 mids, but in the end I couldn't tolerate their weak bass and harsh, overly emphasized treble. PFE has a slightly harsh treble with a somewhat annoying peak there, but other than that I find then pretty much flawless. I can hear tons of detail with them and the sound is lively, dynamic and natural, which I couldn't say about Etys which lack dynamics and sound unnaturally flat and metallic by comparison. It's been a while since I heard the ER4 though, but I listen to the same songs I tried with ER4 back then on the same source using PFE and PFE sounds great with music which I remember sounded much harsher and very unpleasant to me on the Etys.


----------



## Reomero

Hey Joker, what triple flange tips fit on the GR01s? Currently using the hybrids that came with them, which I find quite uncomfortable when inserting deeply.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> I'm curious about these...could you say more about the sound and/or create a thread, if you are willing?
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/584123/tdk-ba200-impressions-and-appreciation-thread
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/593670/review-tdk-ba200-back-to-black


----------



## brandenk0

Hey Joker really appreciate all the hard work you've put into these reviews. I currently have Monster Turbines right now and I have been looking around for an upgrade to them that keeps the same sound as the Turbines. I have already tried the Shure Se215s but they weren't to my liking. Any suggestions? Wanting to keep it sub $200. Thanks.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





pianist said:


> I found ER4p significantly less smooth in the highs than PFE and too harsh for me with a lot of music. I also found ER4, especially S version  lacking bass, whereas PFE does not. The soundstage on Etys is quite flat with little depth while PFE offers a much greater sense of depth I think. I liked ER4 mids, but in the end I couldn't tolerate their weak bass and harsh, overly emphasized treble. PFE has a slightly harsh treble with a somewhat annoying peak there, but other than that I find then pretty much flawless. I can hear tons of detail with them and the sound is lively, dynamic and natural, which I couldn't say about Etys which lack dynamics and sound unnaturally flat and metallic by comparison. It's been a while since I heard the ER4 though, but I listen to the same songs I tried with ER4 back then on the same source using PFE and PFE sounds great with music which I remember sounded much harsher and very unpleasant to me on the Etys.


 


 You'd like the hf series better. Not as hot and still as detailed as the PFE while more even through the mids. PFE is still slightly fuller sounding but with grey filters, maybe more glassy than HFs. 4Ps are faster, more delineated but too hot for me as well but for others, not so much. I found the GR07, and DBA too hot for my tastes as well so you can trust the HFs are not.


----------



## Gilly87

Many thanks 
  
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> http://www.head-fi.org/t/584123/tdk-ba200-impressions-and-appreciation-thread
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/593670/review-tdk-ba200-back-to-black


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





reomero said:


> Hey Joker, what triple flange tips fit on the GR01s? Currently using the hybrids that came with them, which I find quite uncomfortable when inserting deeply.


 


  MEElec M6 triples (both large and small) fit. Monster ones should fit as well.


  Quote: 





brandenk0 said:


> Hey Joker really appreciate all the hard work you've put into these reviews. I currently have Monster Turbines right now and I have been looking around for an upgrade to them that keeps the same sound as the Turbines. I have already tried the Shure Se215s but they weren't to my liking. Any suggestions? Wanting to keep it sub $200. Thanks.


 
   
   
  Turbine pro golds w/mic are $202 on amazon - they are a more relaxed & refined take on the Turbine sound. If you can describe the things you didn't like about the SE215, that might help with other options as well.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> You'd like the hf series better. Not as hot and still as detailed as the PFE while more even through the mids. PFE is still slightly fuller sounding but with grey filters, maybe more glassy than HFs. 4Ps are faster, more delineated but too hot for me as well but for others, not so much. I found the GR07, and DBA too hot for my tastes as well so you can trust the HFs are not.


 
   
  I heard the HF2 and HF5. I found them very similar to ER4 - they had a similar harshness in the highs and lacked dynamics, bass and soundstage. PFE is way more dynamic sounding. I find it plenty even through the mids - close to ER4 with maybe a tad less texture.


----------



## Bart1981

What kind of IEM's would you experts advice to go with an Cowon J3? Most of the times I play Trance/House/Hardstyle music. I like bass, but it must controlled and deep, but not to overwhelming. It must be there when it needs to be there, but it shouldn't be there when it's not supposed to be there. I also would like the IEM's to go loud. Not the whole time, but just now and then when I'm playing a really good track. 
  Price range should be somewhere around $100
   
  First I was thinking of the SE215's but an guy on a dutch forum said to me I should not take the SE215's if I want bass. While other reviews stated there was plenty of bass in the SE215's. I'm a bit confused. So what do you guys advice me?


----------



## Swimsonny

Quote: 





bart1981 said:


> What kind of IEM's would you experts advice to go with an Cowon J3? Most of the times I play Trance/House/Hardstyle music. I like bass, but it must controlled and deep, but not to overwhelming. It must be there when it needs to be there, but it shouldn't be there when it's not supposed to be there. I also would like the IEM's to go loud. Not the whole time, but just now and then when I'm playing a really good track.
> Price range should be somewhere around $100
> 
> First I was thinking of the SE215's but an guy on a dutch forum said to me I should not take the SE215's if I want bass. While other reviews stated there was plenty of bass in the SE215's. I'm a bit confused. So what do you guys advice me?


 
  From what I've read if you want some good bass go for the Futuresonics Atrio M5 with mg7 driver which can be had for $100 of atrio.me with a discount code which is easily found! Looks like a bit of a bargain!


----------



## Bart1981

Looks like atrio.me doesn't ship to The Netherlands.. So unfortunately that's not working out.


----------



## Swimsonny

Quote: 





bart1981 said:


> Looks like atrio.me doesn't ship to The Netherlands.. So unfortunately that's not working out.


 


  Oh thats a shame and i have the same problem in the UK!  Its only because you but $100.... Well if you see a pair of mono price 8320 come available in your area swipe them up their nice and clean acrros the frequency range and stupidly cheap but as for something available for you i don't know sorry! Joker will be around to help soon enough I'm sure


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





pianist said:


> I heard the HF2 and HF5. I found them very similar to ER4 - they had a similar harshness in the highs and lacked dynamics, bass and soundstage. PFE is way more dynamic sounding. I find it plenty even through the mids - close to ER4 with maybe a tad less texture.


 


 Beats me than. You do tend to speak in definites before sometimes having a change in heart. Many here have described the HFs with triples vs the PFE with stock tips as very similar overall. I agree and like both. PFEs more comfort with touch more bottom and HFs even more balanced.


----------



## monoglycer

I tend to agree with your statement about the PFEs being similar to the HF5s in sound.
   
  However...that was before I heard the PFEs with a decent source. Have you tried the HF5s on the HM601 yet pianist?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bart1981 said:


> What kind of IEM's would you experts advice to go with an Cowon J3? Most of the times I play Trance/House/Hardstyle music. I like bass, but it must controlled and deep, but not to overwhelming. It must be there when it needs to be there, but it shouldn't be there when it's not supposed to be there. I also would like the IEM's to go loud. Not the whole time, but just now and then when I'm playing a really good track.
> Price range should be somewhere around $100
> 
> First I was thinking of the SE215's but an guy on a dutch forum said to me I should not take the SE215's if I want bass. While other reviews stated there was plenty of bass in the SE215's. I'm a bit confused. So what do you guys advice me?


 


  The SE215 has ample bass by my standards but it always depends on where you're coming from. Compared to the TFTA 1V, for example, it would seem to have almost no bass at all. SE215 and HiSound Crystal are pretty safe choices in that price range for bass that has good quality and above-neutral quantity. There are bassier sets - the TFTAs, Beyer DTX 101s, or Velodyne vPulses for example - but typically in that price range you'll be risking the quality of the low end. Even the vPulses, which have mostly deep bass, can be somewhat intrusive.


----------



## Bart1981

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SE215 has ample bass by my standards but it always depends on where you're coming from. Compared to the TFTA 1V, for example, it would seem to have almost no bass at all. SE215 and HiSound Crystal are pretty safe choices in that price range for bass that has good quality and above-neutral quantity. There are bassier sets - the TFTAs, Beyer DTX 101s, or Velodyne vPulses for example - but typically in that price range you'll be risking the quality of the low end. Even the vPulses, which have mostly deep bass, can be somewhat intrusive.


 

 Well I'm coming from the Q-Jays of which I think, they can not go loud enough and sometimes lack a bit of bass. I know it's going to be a step backwards with a budget of only $100 but for now that's just the way it is.


----------



## brandenk0

> brandenk0 said:
> 
> 
> > Hey Joker really appreciate all the hard work you've put into these reviews. I currently have Monster Turbines right now and I have been looking around for an upgrade to them that keeps the same sound as the Turbines. I have already tried the Shure Se215s but they weren't to my liking. Any suggestions? Wanting to keep it sub $200. Thanks.
> ...


 
   
  The sound of the Shure SE215 wasn't the problem; I actually liked the Shure's sound. The problem was with the cable and it started to annoy me enough to become a deal breaker. So I decided to return them. I was looking at the Turbine Pro Golds but wasn't sure if there were any other IEM's out there with similar sound. Read through a lot of reviews but couldn't find any that referenced similar sound to the Turbines. The only problem I might have with the MTPG's are that they are a little flashy for me with the gold color, but that shouldn't be a deal breaker for me.
   
  Again thanks for the advice!


----------



## suman134

hey folks get a es18 from soundmagic and write back , its got flat spectrum , sharp notes and enjoyable at just under $10 .


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> hey folks get a es18 from soundmagic and write back , its got flat spectrum , sharp notes and enjoyable at just under $10 .


 


  how u got it?


----------



## suman134

brought it recently . and search it here you will find a thread with es18 measured .


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, which of all the TWFK-based IEM's is your personal favorite?
  Just wondering


----------



## Gilly87

You can't tell?
   
  $50 says its the CK10, followed by the DBA-02 mkII.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> You can't tell?
> 
> $50 says its the CK10, followed by the DBA-02 mkII.


 
   
  Yes, I have a feeling those two are the contenders, just wanted a direct answer from him I guess 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I myself just brought a UE700 for 86$, and am really impressed by the clarity, separation, and detail of these TWFK drivers, I'd say about the same with the GR07, do you agree with this Joker? Or do you rank the GR07 higher?
   
  Oh, and btw, is a chin slider and a cable cinch the same thing?


----------



## Gilly87

Can I answer this one too?
   
  XD


----------



## kakari

Is there a comparison table in jpeg which I can download? I believe I downloaded one about half a year ago and I am now looking for a updated table. Thanks~!


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Oh, and btw, is a chin slider and a cable cinch the same thing?


 


  The chin slider is, of course, the chin slider.  The cable cinch is where the main cables separate into the individual Left/Right cables.


----------



## Gilly87

Really? I always thought it was the same thing.
   
  You might be mixing it up with a cinch cable, which is a cable that splits from one stereo to two phono plugs.
  
  Quote: 





guhmo said:


> The chin slider is, of course, the chin slider.  The cable cinch is where the main cables separate into the individual Left/Right cables.


----------



## suman134

hey joker , dose the dba-2 worth as an upgrade over the ue 700 ? what you suggest . should not be too light or bright .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bart1981 said:


> Well I'm coming from the Q-Jays of which I think, they can not go loud enough and sometimes lack a bit of bass. I know it's going to be a step backwards with a budget of only $100 but for now that's just the way it is.


 
   
  The SE215 has more bass than the q-JAYS. Not sure about a direct sensitivity comparison but I didn't think they lacked any and they are more sensitive than the HiSound Crystal. 
   


  Quote: 





brandenk0 said:


> The sound of the Shure SE215 wasn't the problem; I actually liked the Shure's sound. The problem was with the cable and it started to annoy me enough to become a deal breaker. So I decided to return them. I was looking at the Turbine Pro Golds but wasn't sure if there were any other IEM's out there with similar sound. Read through a lot of reviews but couldn't find any that referenced similar sound to the Turbines. The only problem I might have with the MTPG's are that they are a little flashy for me with the gold color, but that shouldn't be a deal breaker for me.
> 
> Again thanks for the advice!


 

 If you like the SE215, maybe check out the HiSound Crystal? It's got a more conventional form factor. Cable is decent, too. There's also the pricier Golden Crystal but I don't have much experience with it. The HiSound IEMs are certainly a lot less flashy than Turbine Pros.
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, which of all the TWFK-based IEM's is your personal favorite?
> Just wondering


 

 TWFK with no additional driver? Probably the CK10 although the DBA-02 (either revision) is pretty close.

  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Yes, I have a feeling those two are the contenders, just wanted a direct answer from him I guess
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Good price on the UE700 - clarity, separation, and detail are competitive with the GR07 but other things aren't.
   
  Yes, some people call it a chin slider. I usually call it a cable cinch - force of habit.


  Quote: 





kakari said:


> Is there a comparison table in jpeg which I can download? I believe I downloaded one about half a year ago and I am now looking for a updated table. Thanks~!


 

 The table is in .png image format to prevent compression artifacts. You can just right click on it and save it to your computer.
   
   


  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> hey joker , dose the dba-2 worth as an upgrade over the ue 700 ? what you suggest . should not be too light or bright .


 

 The MK-II is definitely less bright and has more texture but it really depends on what you want out of your upgrade as well as which version (UE or Logitech) or the UE700 you have.


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Really? I always thought it was the same thing.
> 
> You might be mixing it up with a cinch cable, which is a cable that splits from one stereo to two phono plugs.


 

 Oh, that's what average joe calls it here anyways.


----------



## brandenk0

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you like the SE215, maybe check out the HiSound Crystal? It's got a more conventional form factor. Cable is decent, too. There's also the pricier Golden Crystal but I don't have much experience with it. The HiSound IEMs are certainly a lot less flashy than Turbine Pros.


 
  Hmm just looked at the HiSound Crystal and it looks pretty good for the price of it. One last thing, do you think that the $100 more for the MTPG's are worth getting rather than the $100 HiSound Crystals? Thanks for all the advice.


----------



## rt297

Has there been much interest in the new Sony XBA series? I am particularly interested in the 3 driver model.
  Thanks,
  Russ


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good price on the UE700 - clarity, separation, and detail are competitive with the GR07 but other things aren't.


 

 Yeah, I'm a real sucker for a good bargain.... I bought my GR07 for only 100$... A very sweet deal....
  I almost pulled the trigger on a FXT90 for only 70$, but I was too late, someone bought it first... oh well, better luck next time I guess
   
  Anyway, where do you think the GR07 wins over UE700? I assume because UE700 is a BA, it's quicker, am I right?
   
  Also, what would be a good song to test instrument seperation or detail?


----------



## suman134

i got ultimate ears 700 from logitech . the new design .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





brandenk0 said:


> Hmm just looked at the HiSound Crystal and it looks pretty good for the price of it. One last thing, do you think that the $100 more for the MTPG's are worth getting rather than the $100 HiSound Crystals? Thanks for all the advice.


 

 I think only you can make that decision. If you were happy with the SQ level of the SE215 and the slightly dry, punchy signature, the Crystal should work for you. If you caught yourself wanting a thicker, lusher, smoother, more laid-back sound, you should consider spending extra to get the Golds.
   


  Quote: 





rt297 said:


> Has there been much interest in the new Sony XBA series? I am particularly interested in the 3 driver model.
> Thanks,
> Russ


 

 There's a long thread on the XBAs out on the forum and an XBA-4 review on the front page of this thread. I haven't heard the 3-driver version.

  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Yeah, I'm a real sucker for a good bargain.... I bought my GR07 for only 100$... A very sweet deal....
> I almost pulled the trigger on a FXT90 for only 70$, but I was too late, someone bought it first... oh well, better luck next time I guess
> 
> Anyway, where do you think the GR07 wins over UE700? I assume because UE700 is a BA, it's quicker, am I right?
> ...


 

 If you have both, comparing them yourself is always more reliable than reading someone else's impressions. 
   
  I thought the GR07 actually gave up a bit of resolution to the UE700 in exchange for slightly warmer tone, superior bass body, depth, and impact, better bass-midrange balance, slightly thicker note presentation. better timbre with drums and guitars, and a more 3-D/enveloping presentation. This is based on the Logitech version of the UE700 - the older UE version had brighter treble and wasn't much to my liking.
   
  There was a thread somewhere (full-size forum?) that had popular test track suggestions - I would look there.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> If you have both, comparing them yourself is always more reliable than reading someone else's impressions.
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, I did compare them myself, I just wanted to know if I was hearing the same thing as you are... as I'm new to the Audio world, sometimes I doubt myself....
  But luckily, my thoughts are almost exactly like yours... although you really have a talent to write about what you hear into words... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Alright, thanks for the suggestion!


----------



## DJLEC

They warned me before I came to this Site to bring my Wallet.
   
  I am also new to the IEM World and I cannot thank Joker enough for his reviews. I cannot imagine how much time was spent compiling this but I wanted Joker to know that he has cost me money but all for the good.
   
  Many thanks again Joker for all of your hard work. 
  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Yes, I did compare them myself, I just wanted to know if I was hearing the same thing as you are... as I'm new to the Audio world, sometimes I doubt myself....
> But luckily, my thoughts are almost exactly like yours... although you really have a talent to write about what you hear into words...
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Bart1981

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SE215 has more bass than the q-JAYS. Not sure about a direct sensitivity comparison but I didn't think they lacked any and they are more sensitive than the HiSound Crystal.


 


  Thanks again for your great advice!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Yes, I did compare them myself, I just wanted to know if I was hearing the same thing as you are... as I'm new to the Audio world, sometimes I doubt myself....
> But luckily, my thoughts are almost exactly like yours... although you really have a talent to write about what you hear into words...
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Good to hear 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  
  Quote: 





djlec said:


> They warned me before I came to this Site to bring my Wallet.
> 
> I am also new to the IEM World and I cannot thank Joker enough for his reviews. I cannot imagine how much time was spent compiling this but I wanted Joker to know that he has cost me money but all for the good.
> 
> Many thanks again Joker for all of your hard work.


 

 Many hours per week for what seems like a couple of years now.
   
  Glad the thread helped!
   


  Quote: 





bart1981 said:


> Thanks again for your great advice!


----------



## vocalist

Joker - your reviews have helped so much and! I also love that everything is so clear and easy to understand!
   
  I'm torn very right now between the W4 and the SE535.  I've heard some say that the 535 is more "musical" than the W4 but that the W4 improves upon a few areas of the 535 that some have been looking for.  Is one much better than the other for classical (instrumental/orchestral and opera) and rock/alternative than the other?  Is one especially more comfortable than the other?  I'm looking to have this IEM for a long time to come as I simply don't have the money I'd love to try multiple different/new things   I want to get lost in the music - at least that's my goal.   Anyone can reply, as well as Joker.  On the low end of the spectrum, I've had a few recommendations for the DBA-02 MKII.  Thank you!!


----------



## manfrog

Thanks for the reviews...it is really appreciated!


----------



## The Neverhood

Joker,
   
  I would just like to say thank you for recommending the ER4S - they sound absolutely amazing, and found the bass to be excellent, and have not experienced sibilance!
   
  They have much wider soundstage compared to the RE0 and CK10, not quite the same with height and depth, but still good. I wouldn't call these bright phones - more refined, neutral, and balanced. My only real gripe would be the fit - though custom reshell or sleeves would solve that. Unsurprisingly the ER4S can't quite compare to the RE262 in terms of presentation, well at least in terms of absolute measure. The ER4S however has much better imaging, instrument separation, accuracy, and resolution. Overall I would call these an upgrade from the RE0, and sidegrade from the CK10.
   
  Thanks again Joker!


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, can you give me an estimate for the GR06 SQ rating? How well do you rate them?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vocalist said:


> Joker - your reviews have helped so much and! I also love that everything is so clear and easy to understand!
> 
> I'm torn very right now between the W4 and the SE535.  I've heard some say that the 535 is more "musical" than the W4 but that the W4 improves upon a few areas of the 535 that some have been looking for.  Is one much better than the other for classical (instrumental/orchestral and opera) and rock/alternative than the other?  Is one especially more comfortable than the other?  I'm looking to have this IEM for a long time to come as I simply don't have the money I'd love to try multiple different/new things   I want to get lost in the music - at least that's my goal.   Anyone can reply, as well as Joker.  On the low end of the spectrum, I've had a few recommendations for the DBA-02 MKII.  Thank you!!


 

 I find the W4 both better-sounding overall and more comfortable though I'm sure you'll find many who disagree. The SE530 and SE535 (though the latter to a lesser extent) have always seemed to be triple-drivers that don't take advantage of the range benefits of a crossover. The W4 can still be called mid-centric to an extent but it covers the full frequency range more effortlessly. In the end it will still be down to preference and coming from entry or mid-level gear I'm sure you'll be happy with either.
   
  The DBA-02 mkII sounds very different - not as rich and full but impossibly clean, crisp, and articulate. I happen to like the sort of sound it offers and think that it can definitely compete with the $200+ monitors overall. 
   


  Quote: 





manfrog said:


> Thanks for the reviews...it is really appreciated!


 

 Glad they've been useful!
   


  Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> Joker,
> 
> I would just like to say thank you for recommending the ER4S - they sound absolutely amazing, and found the bass to be excellent, and have not experienced sibilance!
> 
> ...


 

 That sounds like a match for my own impressions. I actually sold my first ER4S shortly after getting the CK10 partly because I found the fit of the CK10 much more secure and generally found it to be more convenient out and about. I bought a new ER4S after I had custom sleeves made for my HF5 and they solved most of my problems.
   


  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, can you give me an estimate for the GR06 SQ rating? How well do you rate them?


 

 Sorry, not yet. I have yet to compare them to anything in their price bracket. Hope to have the review done this coming week, though.


----------



## Cu Chulainn

Hey guys,
   
  Been looking to get some new iems, after my rather shocking CX400-IIs were stolen. This thread and reviews have helped me out a fair bit and narrowed the choice down to either MEElec CW31s or ViSang R02s...
   
  The CW31s I can get for £21, whereas the R02s are £26 - not willing to pay more than £30, as I simply cant afford it.
   
  Which is the best bet, or should I be considering the Brainwavz M6?
   
  Main genre is metal/rock, but I listen to a lot of Jazz and "Classical" (mainly classical or romantic) and am slowly edging into DnB (mainly liquid tbh). Thanks in advance!


----------



## kanuka

what Brainwavz M*6* ??


----------



## suman134

bro , may i help , my cx 400 II are worn out , so i went out and got quiet a few iems to replace it , cx 400 II i remember when was in its prime it had not the clarity or crispyness nor the sound stage , but the signature , the light hearted music which has a happy go lucky style to any thing that comes to it , did you liked that ? it had bass a bit hold up by the way . do you want bass and a improvement in other part spectrum ? or you want to ditch the bass for good clarity ?
            if clarity is what you want then under euro 30 i will say you are in the right way , go get the cw31 , one of the best lower end iems ever made , dont forget to get a pair of long , tips they dont fit awesome to me at least in their stock tips . buy a cheap philips , their tips fits nice and are longer .
            if you want bass and some improvement then go for the sound magic e30 , dont have a awesome mid , which is just a bit laid back , bass is good , a worthy replacement for the cx 400 II , cuz your coming from a so called bass earphone you may find bass missing in cw31 .
          
            i havent heard the visang r02 of the brainwavz m6 , but i must tell you you wont be sad with the above two iems .
   
           for a small reference , you can try my shoot out of one of my fav iems cx 400 precision II with some other sennheisers and some more .
                  http://www.head-fi.org/t/597823/the-new-cx-175-review-with-cx-270-cx-215-cx-400-ii-ue-350-and-klipsch-image-s3-should-we-go-details#post_8179080


----------



## suman134

or try some cheapos , a ep-600 creative  + a es18 soundmagic . go for the e30 i will say cuz it has its own areas to entertain , may not be the fastest at that price range nor the most clear too but the most value iem if insertion is not a problem . try the cheap ones they are really nice at their price point , both under 8 euros .


----------



## joyceb

I recently found this website. I love listening to music (all kinds), and I like listening to it and thinking "wow" this sound is awesome. So, I have been looking for some new earphones and this website is very informative. Thanks again for all your hard work on this website. Keep up the good work. Joyce


----------



## Cu Chulainn

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> what Brainwavz M*6* ??


 


  MEElec M6, sorry - loooong day 


  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> bro , may i help , my cx 400 II are worn out , so i went out and got quiet a few iems to replace it , cx 400 II i remember when was in its prime it had not the clarity or crispyness nor the sound stage , but the signature , the light hearted music which has a happy go lucky style to any thing that comes to it , did you liked that ? it had bass a bit hold up by the way . do you want bass and a improvement in other part spectrum ? or you want to ditch the bass for good clarity ?
> if clarity is what you want then under euro 30 i will say you are in the right way , go get the cw31 , one of the best lower end iems ever made , dont forget to get a pair of long , tips they dont fit awesome to me at least in their stock tips . buy a cheap philips , their tips fits nice and are longer .
> if you want bass and some improvement then go for the sound magic e30 , dont have a awesome mid , which is just a bit laid back , bass is good , a worthy replacement for the cx 400 II , cuz your coming from a so called bass earphone you may find bass missing in cw31 .
> 
> ...


 


  I found the bass to be quite leaky with regards to the mids and felt I was missing out on a lot of clarity and just generally in the mids and treble.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





cu chulainn said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 if that's the case , maybe the cw31 is better suited. but you could consider the gr06 for £32


----------



## Cu Chulainn

Quote:


kanuka said:


> if that's the case , maybe the cw31 is better suited. but you could consider the gr06 for £32


 


  Cant seem to find any UK stockist - same issue with Xears, would have loved the TD-III or similar but cant find any UK or EU stockists D:


----------



## zerocrack

Thank you for all the details review. It helped me a lot in picking the right IEM. I narrowed it down to 3 choices need a bit more guidance.
   
  A151 vs CC51 vs ETY MC5
   
  My budget is around $60 and these 3 fit my budget (I got the price from amazon). I listen to pretty much all kind of music. Currently, i listen to pop/electronic and a bit of rock/metal. I want it to have good isolation but if isolation come at the cost of having better sound then I would go for the one with better sound.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sorry, not yet. I have yet to compare them to anything in their price bracket. Hope to have the review done this coming week, though.


 


  No problem! Can't wait for it!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cu chulainn said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Been looking to get some new iems, after my rather shocking CX400-IIs were stolen. This thread and reviews have helped me out a fair bit and narrowed the choice down to either MEElec CW31s or ViSang R02s...
> 
> ...


 

 The CW31 and R02 are both better than the M6 if you're looking for a more or less balanced sound. The R02 is a little warmer but they are both safe bets if you don't need much isolation (if you do, the R02 is clearly the better buy). 
   


  Quote: 





joyceb said:


> I recently found this website. I love listening to music (all kinds), and I like listening to it and thinking "wow" this sound is awesome. So, I have been looking for some new earphones and this website is very informative. Thanks again for all your hard work on this website. Keep up the good work. Joyce


 

 Thank you, glad the thread's been useful!
   


  Quote: 





zerocrack said:


> Thank you for all the details review. It helped me a lot in picking the right IEM. I narrowed it down to 3 choices need a bit more guidance.
> 
> A151 vs CC51 vs ETY MC5
> 
> My budget is around $60 and these 3 fit my budget (I got the price from amazon). I listen to pretty much all kind of music. Currently, i listen to pop/electronic and a bit of rock/metal. I want it to have good isolation but if isolation come at the cost of having better sound then I would go for the one with better sound.


 

 Out of those three I certainly prefer the punchier, livelier CC51 for those kinds of genres but it has the least isolation. Still isolates well enough for public transport with a good fit.


----------



## Osaire

I've had Triple.Fi 10's for a long time. I'm really curious where they would end up in this list.


----------



## suman134

yups , go get the cw31 and some long eartips . you will not regret , nice build , low in microphonics , i love it , hope it wont disappoint you too .nice signature too .


----------



## zerocrack

http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-Clarity-Headphone-Microphone-Smartphones/dp/B004OBZ2U4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1334467799&sr=8-1
   
http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-Clarity-CC51-WT-Ceramic-Headphone/dp/B004OBZ2W2/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1334467799&sr=8-2
   
  the only different between these 2 is one has microphone and one doesnt. Is this correct? Somehow the one with microphone is cheaper but has worst review. Just wanna double check before i order.


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





zerocrack said:


> http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-Clarity-Headphone-Microphone-Smartphones/dp/B004OBZ2U4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1334467799&sr=8-1
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-Clarity-CC51-WT-Ceramic-Headphone/dp/B004OBZ2W2/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1334467799&sr=8-2
> 
> the only different between these 2 is one has microphone and one doesnt. Is this correct? Somehow the one with microphone is cheaper but has worst review. Just wanna double check before i order.


 

 Same model, as stated.  Only difference is the mic.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





cu chulainn said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> kanuka said:
> ...


 

frogbeats.com should have the gr06 by this week. drop them a email
  for the Xears you can get them directly from xears.com. but that might be 8 euro for shipping


----------



## Cu Chulainn

Thanks for all the time you put into this Joker!


----------



## Cu Chulainn

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> frogbeats.com should have the gr06 by this week. drop them a email
> for the Xears you can get them directly from xears.com. but that might be 8 euro for shipping


 


  Thanks, shipping just pushes it out of my budget.
   
  Would it be worth waiting to get the GR06s over the R02s?


----------



## kanuka

i think it's worth


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, I'm thinking of buying a CK10... will my iPod Touch / Clip+ be able to drive them properly?


----------



## justaguy

Quote: 





> Sorry, not yet. I have yet to compare them to anything in their price bracket. Hope to have the review done this coming week, though.


 


    great news!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zerocrack said:


> http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-Clarity-Headphone-Microphone-Smartphones/dp/B004OBZ2U4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1334467799&sr=8-1
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-Clarity-CC51-WT-Ceramic-Headphone/dp/B004OBZ2W2/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1334467799&sr=8-2
> 
> the only different between these 2 is one has microphone and one doesnt. Is this correct? Somehow the one with microphone is cheaper but has worst review. Just wanna double check before i order.


 

 If you don't need the mic I would suggest not getting it - adding another part into the mix can't improve reliability.
   




  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, I'm thinking of buying a CK10... will my iPod Touch / Clip+ be able to drive them properly?


 

 Yes, they are more sensitive to seal/fit than source.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, they are more sensitive to seal/fit than source.


 

 Ah.. perfect... I never had a problem with IEM fit before... hope I'll not have a problem with the CK10 either


----------



## justaguy

My turn to appreciate all your efforts joker!!
 What is the biggest soundstage among IEMs you've tried regardless the price?


----------



## leoily

Mark,tanks


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, do you know if Green House's DBA-02 is the same as Fischer's DBA-02?


----------



## insalacosm

[size=medium]Hello – for a newbie like me, I really appreciate all the good info in this threat, thanks!  I purchased my first set of IEMs a couple weeks ago to use with my new iPhone, and ended up purchasing the Klipsch S4i based on CNET and other reviews.  I was very disappointed when I first tried them out – they fell out of my ears even with the largest tips, the wires tangled like crazy, I wasn’t prepared for the microphonics and bone noise, and the mic was very sensitive to wind.  Through some research I found that some of these issues are inherent with IEMs, and after using them for a week or so I got used to much of these issues but having to push the buds back into my ear every minute was a pain. [/size]
   
  [size=medium]I wanted to try a different set so I picked up a pair of the new Sony XBA-1iP’s late last week.  The first thing I noticed was the flat wires don’t tangle as much and I was able to find a pair of tips that fit really well.  I spent some time doing a side by side comparison with the S4i’s (with the Sony tips on) and realized how much bass the S4i’s have, almost to the point where it muddles the mids and highs.  I don’t have a great ear for this stuff but the XBA-1iP’s sound pretty good to me, better than the S4i’s at least.  I listen to a variety of music (no modern rap though)  and while doing a sound comparison between  the two with a classical piece, I noticed some white noise/hum with the S4i’s.  Regarding the mic, I’ve been told my voice still sounds distant when I use the mic on the XBA-1iP’s but the wind doesn’t affect it as much so I would say it is also better than the S4i’s.  [/size]
   
  [size=medium]I have a couple more weeks to return either set but at this point I like the XBA-1iP’s better than the S4i’s.  Does anyone have any opinions to share on the XBA-1iP’s?  Any suggestions on an iPhone compatible set of earphones that are under $100?[/size]
  [size=medium]Thanks,[/size]
  [size=medium]Steve[/size]


----------



## Reomero

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, do you know if Green House's DBA-02 is the same as Fischer's DBA-02?


 
   
  A quick Google search and it does look very similar to the DBA-02 MKI. I think it's another clone like the Brainwavz B2.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Hey joker Sorry for disturbing you again, I'm trying to find a gift for a friend, preferably under 50 bucks which one would you recommend? The're not really audiophiles and just need something better than apple earbuds, with better bass if possible. I would than try finding it in my local headphone store


----------



## Techno Kid

Hey joker I would love for you to checkout the Rockit Sounds R-50 to hear what you'd think of them.  Its another Knowles TWFK based IEM but is tuned different from the others to have a detailed sound but with a smoother and warmer presentation, I'm loving them at the moment.  These are my first TWFK pair and the fact that they have a smoother sound is what lead me to get them.  So just another IEM out of the hundreds of others I'm sure people want you to review


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





justaguy said:


> My turn to appreciate all your efforts joker!!
> What is the biggest soundstage among IEMs you've tried regardless the price?


 

 Probably the Sony EX1000 / EX600 or Sennheiser IE8. 
  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, do you know if Green House's DBA-02 is the same as Fischer's DBA-02?


 

 Not a clue. I've seen those before but have never run across any impressions.
   


  Quote: 





insalacosm said:


> [size=medium]Hello – for a newbie like me, I really appreciate all the good info in this threat, thanks!  I purchased my first set of IEMs a couple weeks ago to use with my new iPhone, and ended up purchasing the Klipsch S4i based on CNET and other reviews.  I was very disappointed when I first tried them out – they fell out of my ears even with the largest tips, the wires tangled like crazy, I wasn’t prepared for the microphonics and bone noise, and the mic was very sensitive to wind.  Through some research I found that some of these issues are inherent with IEMs, and after using them for a week or so I got used to much of these issues but having to push the buds back into my ear every minute was a pain. [/size]
> 
> [size=medium]I wanted to try a different set so I picked up a pair of the new Sony XBA-1iP’s late last week.  The first thing I noticed was the flat wires don’t tangle as much and I was able to find a pair of tips that fit really well.  I spent some time doing a side by side comparison with the S4i’s (with the Sony tips on) and realized how much bass the S4i’s have, almost to the point where it muddles the mids and highs.  I don’t have a great ear for this stuff but the XBA-1iP’s sound pretty good to me, better than the S4i’s at least.  I listen to a variety of music (no modern rap though)  and while doing a sound comparison between  the two with a classical piece, I noticed some white noise/hum with the S4i’s.  Regarding the mic, I’ve been told my voice still sounds distant when I use the mic on the XBA-1iP’s but the wind doesn’t affect it as much so I would say it is also better than the S4i’s.  [/size]
> 
> ...


 

 The S4s just aren't very good when you start moving up the food chain. I've only heard the XBA-1 briefly but was impressed - more so than with the XBA-4.
   
   
  There aren't many solid iPhone-compatible (3-button) headsets out there. The Spider Realvoice, Velodyne vPulse, Etymotic MC3, Soundmagic E10M, and Ultimate Ears 500vi come to mind as sets I would pick over the S4i under $100 but it's entirely possible that the XBA-1 is better than all of these.
   


  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Hey joker Sorry for disturbing you again, I'm trying to find a gift for a friend, preferably under 50 bucks which one would you recommend? The're not really audiophiles and just need something better than apple earbuds, with better bass if possible. I would than try finding it in my local headphone store


 

 Dunu Trident might be your best bet - smooth, easy-going sound, solid build, nice packaging, looks and feels like a far more expensive product. Failing  that, maybe Soundmagic E10 or Brainwavz ProAlpha.
   


  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Hey joker I would love for you to checkout the Rockit Sounds R-50 to hear what you'd think of them.  Its another Knowles TWFK based IEM but is tuned different from the others to have a detailed sound but with a smoother and warmer presentation, I'm loving them at the moment.  These are my first TWFK pair and the fact that they have a smoother sound is what lead me to get them.  So just another IEM out of the hundreds of others I'm sure people want you to review


 

 Never heard of it. Looks like a nice design. Which other TWFKs is it smoother than? The ones already on the market vary in both overall smoothness and warmth.


----------



## Techno Kid

The way you describe the GR01 sounds a lot like how I hear the R-50, so I would love to see how you would compare the 2.


----------



## Bleether

Incredible thread joker !


----------



## H20Fidelity

Quote: 





bleether said:


> Incredible thread joker !


 


  It's totally epic.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





insalacosm said:


> [size=medium]Hello – for a newbie like me, I really appreciate all the good info in this threat, thanks!  I purchased my first set of IEMs a couple weeks ago to use with my new iPhone, and ended up purchasing the Klipsch S4i based on CNET and other reviews.  I was very disappointed when I first tried them out – they fell out of my ears even with the largest tips, the wires tangled like crazy, I wasn’t prepared for the microphonics and bone noise, and the mic was very sensitive to wind.  Through some research I found that some of these issues are inherent with IEMs, and after using them for a week or so I got used to much of these issues but having to push the buds back into my ear every minute was a pain. [/size]
> 
> [size=medium]I wanted to try a different set so I picked up a pair of the new Sony XBA-1iP’s late last week.  The first thing I noticed was the flat wires don’t tangle as much and I was able to find a pair of tips that fit really well.  I spent some time doing a side by side comparison with the S4i’s (with the Sony tips on) and realized how much bass the S4i’s have, almost to the point where it muddles the mids and highs.  I don’t have a great ear for this stuff but the XBA-1iP’s sound pretty good to me, better than the S4i’s at least.  I listen to a variety of music (no modern rap though)  and while doing a sound comparison between  the two with a classical piece, I noticed some white noise/hum with the S4i’s.  Regarding the mic, I’ve been told my voice still sounds distant when I use the mic on the XBA-1iP’s but the wind doesn’t affect it as much so I would say it is also better than the S4i’s.  [/size]
> 
> ...


 

 I've heard alot of good thing about the XBA-1, and if I were you, I'll keep the XBA-1....
  The Klipsch S4i is tuned for mainstream costumers in mind (Translate = more bass)
   
  The XBA-1 uses a BA type transducer, while the S4i uses dynamic transducers
   
  BA types are known for their more controlled, quick, and detailed nature,
  While Dynamics are known for their fuller bass and more dynamic presentation
   
*If you do like the XBA-1 more than the S4i, there's no reason not return the S4i...*


----------



## Gryphus0204

Hey joker thanks for the previous post, so I've decided to get one trident and one soundmagic E10, and based on the reviews I saw, the E10 has a larger bass,so one of my friend likes dub step while the other is pop and rock, so would the E10 be good for the dub step and trident be good for pop and rock?


----------



## Swimsonny

They seem to differ in housing and strain relief to the DBA-02s so i doubt there a direct clone. Looking at the specs sheet though they look like there a TWFK driver and are also a fair bit cheaper at 8000 yen (roughly 60 pounds or 100 dollars). Someone in Japan should give them a go!
  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, do you know if Green House's DBA-02 is the same as Fischer's DBA-02?


----------



## Xinn3r

I got this off a chinese website, www.taobao.com
  The seller stated this is the Japanese version of the DBA-02...
   
  I was just looking for more confirmation...
   
  Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> They seem to differ in housing and strain relief to the DBA-02s so i doubt there a direct clone. Looking at the specs sheet though they look like there a TWFK driver and are also a fair bit cheaper at 800 yen (roughly 60 pounds or 100 dollars). Someone in Japan should give them a go!


----------



## Swimsonny

So you have these? and oh is it?! i would not have said but fair enough!
  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> I got this off a chinese website, www.taobao.com
> The seller stated this is the Japanese version of the DBA-02...
> 
> I was just looking for more confirmation...


----------



## kanuka

from the specs looks like it is... 43ohm etc.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> So you have these? and oh is it?! i would not have said but fair enough!


 

 Ah.. sorry... I wasn't being clear enough... I got the "*pictures*" off the chinese website...
  I just ordered a CK10 though... so I'll probably won't be buying anything soon... but I am interested in it... maybe in the near future


----------



## Swimsonny

I would not see the point if was you as they both use a TWFK driver and the CK10 is renowned to be one of the best. However nice it would be i do not see this chinese one to live up to the standards of the CK10 (not that i have tried it, I'm a DBA man 
  
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Ah.. sorry... I wasn't being clear enough... I got the "*pictures*" off the chinese website...
> I just ordered a CK10 though... so I'll probably won't be buying anything soon... but I am interested in it... maybe in the near future


----------



## crzycuyler

Hello,
   
   
  I am considering the Sennheiser IE80 and the Shure SE535. I will being using them for a 50/50 split of computer games and music. I listen mostly to bluegrass but also folk, rock, and jazz. I am a critical listener. I enjoy a natural, neutral, accurate sound that still allows clarity to observe each instrument and melody. If there is any advise, it would be greatly appreciated. I have also considered Monster Turbine Pro Copper and Gold. I work at Best Buy and would like to know which of the IEMs that we sell has the greatest value for my use.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





techno kid said:


> The way you describe the GR01 sounds a lot like how I hear the R-50, so I would love to see how you would compare the 2.


 
   
  That does sound interesting, maybe I'll try to get my hands on one after the current queue clears up a bit.
   
   
  Quote: 





bleether said:


> Incredible thread joker !


 
   
  Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> It's totally epic.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Hey joker thanks for the previous post, so I've decided to get one trident and one soundmagic E10, and based on the reviews I saw, the E10 has a larger bass,so one of my friend likes dub step while the other is pop and rock, so would the E10 be good for the dub step and trident be good for pop and rock?


 
   
  The Trident is bassy too but the E10 appears more so due to the more laid-back midrange. Personally I think the E10 sounds better for pop, rock, and electronica. However, it does not have the build quality or presentation (packaging, accessories, design) of the Dunu earphones so I'm not sure I'd prefer to give it as a gift. 
   
   
  Quote: 





crzycuyler said:


> Hello,
> 
> 
> I am considering the Sennheiser IE80 and the Shure SE535. I will being using them for a 50/50 split of computer games and music. I listen mostly to bluegrass but also folk, rock, and jazz. I am a critical listener. I enjoy a natural, neutral, accurate sound that still allows clarity to observe each instrument and melody. If there is any advise, it would be greatly appreciated. I have also considered Monster Turbine Pro Copper and Gold. I work at Best Buy and would like to know which of the IEMs that we sell has the greatest value for my use.
> ...


 
   
   
  The IE8 (please note I've only heard/reviewed the old IE8, not the newer IE80) will probably work better for gaming - that headstage and the enhanced bass are desirable qualities as far as I understand. However, I wouldn't call any of the Sennheiser earphones neutral or accurate - the SE535 fits that description better.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Oh ok thanks again joker and I ordered the JVC ha-fxt 90 through your recommendation, still otw looking forward to it


----------



## shorehead

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Oh ok thanks again joker and I ordered the JVC ha-fxt 90 through your recommendation, still otw looking forward to it


 
   
   




    


  did the same thing . thanks joker!


----------



## Xinn3r

The FXT90 has gained alot of fans lately... there's alot of demand here in China too....


----------



## airomjosh

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> The FXT90 has gained alot of fans lately... there's alot of demand here in China too....


 
   
  I agree but only few sellers since they are coming directly from Japan.


----------



## Xinn3r

Just got my ATH-CK10, very impressed with the speed... so fast.. from memory, UE700 has more bass... but clarity and detail's about the same 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Not surprising considering both use same drivers...
   
  I got the most *perfect *seal using the largest stock tips... it's actually the most isolating IEM I have now... it really suits my ear...
   
  Overall very impressed and satisfied I sold my UE700 for this


----------



## crzycuyler

Quote: 





> The IE8 (please note I've only heard/reviewed the old IE8, not the newer IE80) will probably work better for gaming - that headstage and the enhanced bass are desirable qualities as far as I understand. However, I wouldn't call any of the Sennheiser earphones neutral or accurate - the SE535 fits that description better.


 
   
   
  Thanks for the reply! The 50/50 is only a potential estimate. It may end up 100 percent music. I always make time for music and not video games. How does the IE8 compare to the SE535. I have a strange tendency to lean towards the shure, but I have no good reason as to why. My main objective with any listening device is to find the best balance of neutral and detailed sound. I need versatility yet listen to mainly bluegrass. Balance is most important. Are the IE8 bass heavy, or just not lacking in bass at all? I am also worried about the isolation. Does the IE80 let sound leak in from the environment, sound escape to the environment, or both? I'd like to be in another world when I place them on. I will be playing them with a MacBook Pro 15 inch and iPod. Is this sufficient or does it change anything? I have some B&W speakers but would like to isolate myself because my room mate makes it hard to enjoy the speakers most of the time.
   
  Thanks!
   
  EDIT: I also stumbled upon your portable headphones review. I am now considering the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II and the B&W P5(I get a nice discount). What do you think of these compared to the models mentioned above? SQ vs Value.


----------



## Niyologist

Any IEM that is an upgrade to the FXT90 that is a Multi-BA or Higher-End Dynamic?


----------



## Reomero

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Just got my ATH-CK10, very impressed with the speed... so fast.. from memory, UE700 has more bass... but clarity and detail's about the same
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Niceeee, I'm quite jealous lol. I had already planned on getting the CK10 but in the end I decided to save a bit of money and got the GR01 instead.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Just got my ATH-CK10, very impressed with the speed... so fast.. from memory, UE700 has more bass... but clarity and detail's about the same
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Good to hear. I would still try some deeper-sealing tips if you have them, though.
   
  Quote: 





crzycuyler said:


> Thanks for the reply! The 50/50 is only a potential estimate. It may end up 100 percent music. I always make time for music and not video games. How does the IE8 compare to the SE535. I have a strange tendency to lean towards the shure, but I have no good reason as to why. My main objective with any listening device is to find the best balance of neutral and detailed sound. I need versatility yet listen to mainly bluegrass. Balance is most important. Are the IE8 bass heavy, or just not lacking in bass at all? I am also worried about the isolation. Does the IE80 let sound leak in from the environment, sound escape to the environment, or both? I'd like to be in another world when I place them on. I will be playing them with a MacBook Pro 15 inch and iPod. Is this sufficient or does it change anything? I have some B&W speakers but would like to isolate myself because my room mate makes it hard to enjoy the speakers most of the time.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> EDIT: I also stumbled upon your portable headphones review. I am now considering the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II and the B&W P5(I get a nice discount). What do you think of these compared to the models mentioned above? SQ vs Value.


 
   
  The IE8 is definitely bass-heavy. The SE535 has much better bass-midrange balance. It also isolates much better than the IE8 and any portable headphone. Also, you don't seem to know what type of sound you want so I would suggest doing a little more reading - the HD25-1 and SE535 (for example) sound nothing alike and the P5 is a good step down in overall performance compared to all of the rest of these.
   
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Any IEM that is an upgrade to the FXT90 that is a Multi-BA or Higher-End Dynamic?


 
   
   
  Well, I don't think anyone will say that the FXT90 is the best IEM in the world so yes. You'll have to be more specific about what you're looking for, though


----------



## crzycuyler

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The IE8 is definitely bass-heavy. The SE535 has much better bass-midrange balance. It also isolates much better than the IE8 and any portable headphone. Also, you don't seem to know what type of sound you want so I would suggest doing a little more reading - the HD25-1 and SE535 (for example) sound nothing alike and the P5 is a good step down in overall performance compared to all of the rest of these.


 
   
  The description I am most fond of is that of the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II, but from what I've read the B&W P5 really develop in overall SQ after substantial use. I want neutrality and balance for my music listening and thats all that I know. I don't have experience with what will give me a better sound for video games. So I am fairly certain of these two, I am in favor of the HD 25-1 II for music and am unsure between the two for computer games? What has a better sound for gaming/movies?


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good to hear. I would still try some deeper-sealing tips if you have them, though.


 
   
  I will, any ideas?

 I got those fake Sony Hybrids from GR07, will that seal deeper?
   
  Or will I need to use some bi-flanges/tri-flanges?


----------



## ljokerl

Added VSonic GR06 and GR01
   
  Quote: 





> *(2C51) VSonic GR06*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Apr 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(2A26) VSonic GR01*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Apr 2012
> ...


 
   
  Quote:


crzycuyler said:


> The description I am most fond of is that of the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II, but from what I've read the B&W P5 really develop in overall SQ after substantial use. I want neutrality and balance for my music listening and thats all that I know. I don't have experience with what will give me a better sound for video games. So I am fairly certain of these two, I am in favor of the HD 25-1 II for music and am unsure between the two for computer games? What has a better sound for gaming/movies?


   
  I am pretty sure neither will be great for gaming but you may want to ask in the long HD25 thread if anyone's has managed to get decent gaming performance out of them.
   
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> I will, any ideas?
> 
> I got those fake Sony Hybrids from GR07, will that seal deeper?
> 
> Or will I need to use some bi-flanges/tri-flanges?


 
   
  I use monster/meelec triples with the smallest flange cut off. Hybrids seal better for me than the stock tips but I've moved away from them over time.


----------



## NuckinFutz

Great gr06 review Joker! Really spot on. I'm now the proud owner of a gr07 as well  the gr06 are quite mid-centric in comparison which gives them a more intimate presentation and the gr07 extends better at both ends. The best way I can describe the difference is if you took a piece of string and shaped it like the gr06 FR graph with a hump in the middle....if you then pulled the string at both ends that's pretty much the gr07.

Also, despite the higher impedance, the gr07 aren't harder to drive.


----------



## Reomero

Very nice review on the GR06!
  I guess I wasn't crazy for expecting you to rate them above 8/10 when it comes to sound.. Also, if they were still priced at around $50, I guess the value would have been 11/10.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added VSonic GR06 and GR01


 
   
  VSonic certainly is on a run lately... 
  Very good SQ for the asking price, coupled with comfortable and sturdy design... really really impressed....
   
  I see you've recieved an EPH-100... how are your first impressions with them?
   
  Quote: 





reomero said:


> Very nice review on the GR06!
> I guess I wasn't crazy for expecting you to rate them above 8/10 when it comes to sound.. Also, if they were still priced at around $50, I guess the value would have been 11/10.


 
   
  Yes, too bad I didn't get them before the price went up...


----------



## dustdevil

The gr06 seems really interesting, are they even more transparent than the westone 1?


----------



## Swimsonny

GR06 still 30 quid in UK, wish I had a use to justify buying! Nice reviews anyway!


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> GR06 still 30 quid in UK, wish I had a use to justify buying! Nice reviews anyway!


 
   

 If you mean from frogbeats they are out of stock anyway!


----------



## shotgunshane

The gr06 review has me interested I picking up a pair. How are the dynamics compared to the gr07?


----------



## putente

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> GR06 still 30 quid in UK, wish I had a use to justify buying! Nice reviews anyway!


 
   
   
  Where did you find them at that price? The only place I know where they're being sold in the UK is at Frogbeats, but they're out of stock...


----------



## Swimsonny

Yeh sorry for confusion I was talking about frogbeats but they should be in stock soon and also there's a pair for £30 on for sale forum I noticed and was referring too!


----------



## GigaFi

Just a heads up:
   
  21 + 32 + 67 + 51 + 15 + 26 + 15 + 6 + 2 = 235 IEMs


----------



## Swimsonny

gigafi said:


> Just a heads up:
> 
> 21 + 32 + 67 + 51 + 15 + 26 + 15 + 6 + 2 = 235 IEMs




He'll quickly have to add another review


----------



## esanthosh

That's been the case even before #100. From that old post
   
  Quote: 





> _p.s. Joker, count your list again.  Tell me what number you get to._
> 
> Lol. You can add up the numbers in the individual categories much quicker. It should come out to 99 but I counted the ViSang R03 and Brainwavz M2 as different earphones when I added them since they were released and added to the thread at different times.


----------



## Reomero

Ahh, makes sense now. I also got confused when I added up the numbers.


----------



## NuckinFutz

gigafi said:


> Just a heads up:
> 
> 21 + 32 + 67 + 51 + 15 + 26 + 15 + 6 + 2 = 235 IEMs




You've got waaay too much time on your hands Giga!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 




   
  (sorry , couldnt help it...)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Great gr06 review Joker! Really spot on. I'm now the proud owner of a gr07 as well
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks! The string analogy sounds about right.
   
   
  Quote: 





reomero said:


> Very nice review on the GR06!
> I guess I wasn't crazy for expecting you to rate them above 8/10 when it comes to sound.. Also, if they were still priced at around $50, I guess the value would have been 11/10.


 
   
  Thanks
   
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> VSonic certainly is on a run lately...
> Very good SQ for the asking price, coupled with comfortable and sturdy design... really really impressed....
> 
> I see you've recieved an EPH-100... how are your first impressions with them?


 
   
  Punchy bass, upfront mids, pretty smooth treble. Very similar in performance to the Monster MD Tributes but balanced differently.
   
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> The gr06 seems really interesting, are they even more transparent than the westone 1?


 
   
  No, not really - that happens to be one of the strengths of the W1.
   
  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> The gr06 review has me interested I picking up a pair. How are the dynamics compared to the gr07?


 
   
  Not as good.
   
   
  Quote: 





gigafi said:


> Just a heads up:
> 
> 21 + 32 + 67 + 51 + 15 + 26 + 15 + 6 + 2 = 235 IEMs


 
   
  ViSang R03/Brainwavz M2. I counted them as separate IEMs at first for several reasons but over time the ViSang version has been slowly changed to match the Brainwavz one.
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> That's been the case even before #100. From that old post


 
   
  It's amazing that you a. remember and b. were able to find that link. I was just dreading having to go looking for that post


----------



## Gilly87

Wow, I will for sure be picking up the GR06, seems to be an insane steal...I feel sure the price will go up.
   
  Edit: I was right; $80 on lendmeurears.com...out of stock and, for good or ill, outside of impulse purchase range for me...
   
http://lendmeurears.com/index.php?cPath=13&osCsid=1cb8514173f2c702f1fa85230b020a89


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's amazing that you a. remember and b. were able to find that link. I was just dreading having to go looking for that post


 
   
  Now that I have proved that I am stalking this thread far too much and for far too long than I care to admit, can I have the TF10 review?


----------



## Magicman74

GILLY87
  Hey you read that wrong, it's only $63 in us funds and they do have them in stock in the U.S.   They ship fron IL and takes like 3 days to get them...NOTHING under $100 can touch them..They are that good..


----------



## suman134

yes yes yes , do that , it will help to compare the dba-02 and gr07 , triple ba vs dual vs dynamic . i like eu signature if it has retained or not , and hows the bass against ue 700 , cuz ue 700 got some nice bass . turn up the music and i hope she dont mind , cb and sean paul .


----------



## vaed

Hi |joker|! This is probably difficult since the FXT-90's were a loan, but should you remember, how would you compare the mid-range (particularly distorted guitar?), treble, and prat/speed of the JVC's against the CK-10's? To one-up Niyologist's inquiry, what balanced-armature or dynamic in your opinion, would best the JVC's in terms of attack, aggression, and transparency?
   
  Thank you!


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  actually i think they are getting them back in stock tomorrow


----------



## NuckinFutz

vaed said:


> Hi |joker|! This is probably difficult since the FXT-90's were a loan, but should you remember, how would you compare the mid-range (particularly distorted guitar?), treble, and prat/speed of the JVC's against the CK-10's? To one-up Niyologist's inquiry, what balanced-armature or dynamic in your opinion, would best the JVC's in terms of attack, aggression, and transparency?
> 
> Thank you!




Regarding the the FXT90, is it better than GR07 for distorted guitars? By this I mean a real aggressive bite to the sound? Or any other IEM in this price range for that matter....EPH100?


----------



## vaed

Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Regarding the the FXT90, is it better than GR07 for distorted guitars? By this I mean a real aggressive bite to the sound? Or any other IEM in this price range for that matter....EPH100?


 
   
  Read this post: http://www.head-fi.org/t/563722/jvc-ha-fxt90-appreciation-thread-user-info-buying-guide-reviews-on-page-1#post_7623915 in the appreciation thread, there are many comparisons made to the GR07 for your pleasure. I don't want to comment too much since I haven't heard the GR07, and that I haven't really heard enough headphones to plot an accurate distribution of what would constitute "aggression", but distorted guitars certainly have a bite on these things.


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Regarding the the FXT90, is it better than GR07 for distorted guitars? By this I mean a real aggressive bite to the sound? Or any other IEM in this price range for that matter....EPH100?


 
   
  Well I have all 3 of thoughs and for me the GR07 and EPH-100 sound better for distorted guitars in rock and metal for instance.  At first I liked the FXT90 but theres just something about them that just doesn't click for me.  They are very capable IEM's just not a sound signature I can really get into.
   
  Now both the GR07 and EPH-100 have a similar sound in that they both have a more laid back non-offensive sound signature and both have good detail and excellent separation.
   
  All 3 are very good IEM's so it comes down to what signature you want.


----------



## zerocrack

I just got my cc51 yesterday. So far, I noticed That on left channel, when the song going to high note or pitch, I hear a bit of echo and sound very annoying. Is the technical term for this is that it to bright? Is this normal for this set of iem? Will it go away with burn in?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Now that I have proved that I am stalking this thread far too much and for far too long than I care to admit, can I have the TF10 review?


 
   
  Fine, I'll do it after the FitEar MH334 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





vaed said:


> Hi |joker|! This is probably difficult since the FXT-90's were a loan, but should you remember, how would you compare the mid-range (particularly distorted guitar?), treble, and prat/speed of the JVC's against the CK-10's? To one-up Niyologist's inquiry, what balanced-armature or dynamic in your opinion, would best the JVC's in terms of attack, aggression, and transparency?
> 
> Thank you!


 
   
  The FXT90 is much warmer and thicker than the CK10. I really don't think you can compare the midranges of the two because they are so different but if you like your guitars up front the FXT90 is likely the ticket. The CK10 has slightly hotter treble and nothing beats it for speed from what I've heard. The EX1000 and FX700 are both dynamic-driver upgrades to the FXT90 in some ways. In the armature world, maybe the DBA-02, W3, or j-Phonic K2 SP (not that you can buy one anymore). 
   
   
  Quote: 





zerocrack said:


> I just got my cc51 yesterday. So far, I noticed That on left channel, when the song going to high note or pitch, I hear a bit of echo and sound very annoying. Is the technical term for this is that it to bright? Is this normal for this set of iem? Will it go away with burn in?


 
   
   
  Sounds like a QC issue if it's consistent across recordings. I'm sure it's something they'll warranty.


----------



## xshen79

Awesome! Thanks a lot for sharing those...I am looking forwarding to the feeling of k3003..LOL


----------



## zerocrack

can you explain a bit more about QC issue? Is it common issue for IEM for only for the cc51?


----------



## dustdevil

How about the etymotic hf5 then? Can their mids compete with the westone 1's?


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, how does EPH-100 timbre compare to FXT90?
   
  And both above compared to GR07


----------



## kova4a

I was just ready to pull the trigger and go for the DBA-02 mkII and now I saw the review of the GR01. The GR01 looks just so beautiful and lovely (like something I always thought etymotic should have done a long time ago) and I'm torn between the bass punch and the better resolution and transparency of the DBA-02 and the better looks and smoother sound of the GR01. I've never been superficial but I'm starting to think the looks will win this time.


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> I was just ready to pull the trigger and go for the DBA-02 mkII and now I saw the review of the GR01. The GR01 looks just so beautiful and lovely (like something I always thought etymotic should have done a long time ago) and I'm torn between the bass punch and the better resolution and transparency of the DBA-02 and the better looks and smoother sound of the GR01. I've never been superficial but I'm starting to think the looks will win this time.


 
   
  You might want to checkout the Rockit Sounds thread and read mine and Jupiterknights reviews on the R-50.  From the way joker describes the GR01 its almost the same as I hear the R-50 and its only $119.99 shipped.  I'm listening to them right now through my J3 and they sound amazing for how much they cost, easily punching above they're price point.  So far I've had very good customer service from Rocky at Rockit Sounds and I received my order in 4 days from Hong Kong to Dallas and thats with free shipping.
   
  So I feel its worth taking a look at even though not many people know about them as they are a very new company out of Cali (but the IEM's ship from Hong Kong).


----------



## Cu Chulainn

Did anyone manage to get a set of GR06s off Frogbeats?
   
  Re-stock was confirmed to be today, but I've been checking regularly and both the actual page and the Stock List say its out of stock??


----------



## Anaxilus

Figured I'd re-post this here which some might find slightly useful.  Mostly confirms what Joker is hearing IMO.
   
   
  GR01, very pleasant and inoffensive.  Nice resolution for the class and decent clarity, better than typical DDs at the price.  Decent PRaT but compressed dynamic range makes its really unengaging for me over the long haul.  While the phone sounds nice I can't shake the elevator music feeling of the tracks just being a background experience.  Toms feel too mushy and soft, must be the lower mid/upper bass 'laid back' character you mentioned.
   
  DBA mkII, tonally half way between the B2 and GR01.  This is for those that want the B2/DBA sig but thought it was too treble tipped and need a bit of a rounder, softer midbass. with the same impact.  More clarity than the GR01 but behind the B2.
   
  B2, stunning clarity and transparency for the money.  Still one of the best in this area I've heard.  Tighter midbass makes it seem a bit lighter but extension is the same between B2 and DBA mkII.  The amazing clarity just does wonders for making instruments and vocal holographic and real.  Still an amazing phone to me if transparency is your thing.
   
  UERM, tonally between the DBA mkII and B2 which is just about as neutral as you can get.  Doesn't have the bell like quality of the B2 but overall sounds more natural, better note weight, bass extension, fuller sound and dynamic range of the bunch.  Detail everywhere, resolves instruments the other phones didn't know were there.  Layers of sound.  Precise imaging and space.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zerocrack said:


> can you explain a bit more about QC issue? Is it common issue for IEM for only for the cc51?


 
   
  QC issue meaning it is a defective unit. I've never heard of a problem like that so I'm guessing it's not common.
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> How about the etymotic hf5 then? Can their mids compete with the westone 1's?


 
   
  Sure can, unless you like the warm tone of the W1 (which the HF5 doesn't share)
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, how does EPH-100 timbre compare to FXT90?
> 
> And both above compared to GR07


 
   
  I never got to compare the EPH-100 to the FXT90 but I think all three are very close. If I had to I'd give the nod to the FXT90 but you won't have trouble telling instruments apart with any of these.
   
   
  Quote: 





kova4a said:


> I was just ready to pull the trigger and go for the DBA-02 mkII and now I saw the review of the GR01. The GR01 looks just so beautiful and lovely (like something I always thought etymotic should have done a long time ago) and I'm torn between the bass punch and the better resolution and transparency of the DBA-02 and the better looks and smoother sound of the GR01. I've never been superficial but I'm starting to think the looks will win this time.


 
   
  If the heart desires...


----------



## dustdevil

So does that mean that the westone 1 have smoother mids than the etymotic hf5? Sorry for asking so much questions just about these 2 earphones


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





cu chulainn said:


> Did anyone manage to get a set of GR06s off Frogbeats?
> 
> Re-stock was confirmed to be today, but I've been checking regularly and both the actual page and the Stock List say its out of stock??


 
   
  Give them till close of day on Monday.  Being the weekend it probably won't get updated until then anyway.

 Could always fire them an email.

 Cheers.


----------



## Cu Chulainn

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Give them till close of day on Monday.  Being the weekend it probably won't get updated until then anyway.
> 
> Could always fire them an email.
> 
> Cheers.


 
   
  Fired them 2 in 3 weeks, no response.
   
  Yeah, I did wonder if it the cause was simply that it is a weekend...


----------



## shorehead

Quote: 





cu chulainn said:


> Fired them 2 in 3 weeks, no response.
> 
> Yeah, I did wonder if it the cause was simply that it is a weekend...


 
   
  they replied to me last week, still waiting to restock..anyhow i got the GR06 for a friend of mine from ebay from a guy - lend me your ears - for 39GBP and they arrived in 5 days.


----------



## PixelVandalism

Does anyone know if the Comply T-500 tips will fit on the MEElectronics M9's? 
  I already have the tips for my M6's.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I never got to compare the EPH-100 to the FXT90 but I think all three are very close. If I had to I'd give the nod to the FXT90 but you won't have trouble telling instruments apart with any of these.


 
   
  Gotcha... I was wondering what to get, EPH-100 or FXT90, just afraid the signature is too close with GR07...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> So does that mean that the westone 1 have smoother mids than the etymotic hf5? Sorry for asking so much questions just about these 2 earphones


 
   
  No, the HF5 is just a little cooler in tone. I don't think it lacks any smoothness and the mids are extremely clean and detailed.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





pixelvandalism said:


> Does anyone know if the Comply T-500 tips will fit on the MEElectronics M9's?
> I already have the tips for my M6's.


 
   
  The M9 nozzle is bigger, I'm pretty sure it takes the -400 size.
   
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Gotcha... I was wondering what to get, EPH-100 or FXT90, just afraid the signature is too close with GR07...


 
   
   
  Well, since I did compare the FXT90 to the GR07 quite a few times back when I had it maybe this will help (although all or most of this is already in the FXT90 review)
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> FXT90:
> -More bass body, longer decay times
> -Warmer tone
> -Bass more impactful and more forward
> ...


----------



## KimChee

Hey Joker,
   
  I think I've read you said the HF5 is 90% of the ER4S, do you still hold to this?


----------



## Mysterious

How will the Atrio M5 (with MG7 Driver ) compares with the VSonic GR06/GR07 and Sony MDR-EX600 in terms of the bass department without compromising mids and highs.
 Also will any of the IEM's above result in a significant upgrade to the V-Moda M-80 headphones i have right now


----------



## PixelVandalism

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The M9 nozzle is bigger, I'm pretty sure it takes the -400 size.


 
   
  Would it be possible? I don't want to have to buy another set of tips.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, since I did compare the FXT90 to the GR07 quite a few times back when I had it maybe this will help (although all or most of this is already in the FXT90 review)


 
   
  Ah... it's perfect, thanks alot Joker!

 But I still can't justify buying the FXT90... I'll probably wait until you finish your EPH-100 review, then we'll see what happens


----------



## suman134

yes it can be possible , cuz i have used sony hybrids on many earphones even on the m9 , m6 , cw31 , i just try which tips are sounding good , you know a combination .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kimchee said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I think I've read you said the HF5 is 90% of the ER4S, do you still hold to this?


 
   
  Yep, one of the many reasons why the HF5 is an excellent value.
   
  Quote: 





mysterious said:


> How will the Atrio M5 (with MG7 Driver ) compares with the VSonic GR06/GR07 and Sony MDR-EX600 in terms of the bass department without compromising mids and highs.
> Also will any of the IEM's above result in a significant upgrade to the V-Moda M-80 headphones i have right now


 
   
  They have different ways of not compromising the mids and highs. The MG7 has a ton of subbass but not much in the way of mid-bass bloat so it doesn't really bleed over. The GR07 and EX600 are punchy but controlled and don't bleed over either. The GR06 does bleed over but it has more forward mids so they are still kept more or less free of the bass. None of these are a significant upgrade over the M-80 overall but if you're looking for something specific they might be.
   
   
  Quote: 





pixelvandalism said:


> Would it be possible? I don't want to have to buy another set of tips.


 
   
  I wouldn't count on it, Comply cores are not very stretchy compared to something like a Sony Hybrid or even a regular silicone tip.


----------



## PixelVandalism

Is there a more "universal" fit foam tip than the comply ones? 
  For an equivalent price.


----------



## dacmo

Quote: 





pixelvandalism said:


> Is there a more "universal" fit foam tip than the comply ones?
> For an equivalent price.


 
   
  What about Shure Black Foam Sleeves (aka Shure Olives)?


----------



## PixelVandalism

Quote: 





dacmo said:


> What about Shure Black Foam Sleeves (aka Shure Olives)?


 
   
  Would they fit both the M9 and M6's? 
  Are they considered as comfortable?


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





pixelvandalism said:


> Would they fit both the M9 and M6's?
> Are they considered as comfortable?


 
   
  they won't fit the m6 or m9
   
  try these for m6 http://stores.ebay.com/Lostearbuds/Memory-Foam-/_i.html?_fsub=2613068012&_sid=102131412&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322
   
  the medium are about the size of the small shure olives!!


----------



## PixelVandalism

Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> they won't fit the m6 or m9
> 
> try these for m6 http://stores.ebay.com/Lostearbuds/Memory-Foam-/_i.html?_fsub=2613068012&_sid=102131412&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322
> 
> the medium are about the size of the small shure olives!!


 
   
  It's looking like I can't get something that will fit both.


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





pixelvandalism said:


> It's looking like I can't get something that will fit both.


 
   
  they also fit the m9


----------



## Mysterious

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They have different ways of not compromising the mids and highs. The MG7 has a ton of subbass but not much in the way of mid-bass bloat so it doesn't really bleed over. The GR07 and EX600 are punchy but controlled and don't bleed over either. The GR06 does bleed over but it has more forward mids so they are still kept more or less free of the bass. None of these are a significant upgrade over the M-80 overall but if you're looking for something specific they might be.


 
   
  I have always felt the bass of M-80 needed to be more punchy for my liking.
 Do you think the Atrio's will be a good buy then and will it complement the M-80's as a type of different sound signature ?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





pixelvandalism said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  you can de-core the olives. and fit them on the m6 easily. for the m9 donno


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> I have always felt the bass of M-80 needed to be more punchy for my liking.
> Do you think the Atrio's will be a good buy then and will it complement the M-80's as a type of different sound signature ?


 
   
  Yes. If you don't need much isolation you could also check out the JVC HA-FX500 which is quite punchy and very different in signature.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  which iem has best grip in bass, which iem is best in seismic and tight bass with overall good sound quality around $100. I feel that eterna's bass is on the boomier side.
   
  Thanks & Regards


----------



## suman134

can any one help with sony xba-3 ? is it better then the ue 700 ? or how good it is . any help is useful .
   
  thanks in advance .


----------



## rawrster

I've realized that the iem market moves way too fast for me and much faster than the full sized market. Some products here become irrelevant very quick while I can't say the same for full sized. I wonder when my JH5 will be long forgotten at the rate things are going 
   
  I do wonder where you find the space for all the iems and how you find something if you are looking for a specific one.


----------



## zycony

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I've realized that the iem market moves way too fast for me and much faster than the full sized market. Some products here become irrelevant very quick while I can't say the same for full sized. I wonder when my JH5 will be long forgotten at the rate things are going
> 
> I do wonder where you find the space for all the iems and how you find something if you are looking for a specific one.


 
   

 I'm have a JH5 too and I'm still very satisfied with it's performance against many high end universals. But some earphones like the W4 or XBA-3/4 can outdo it at times for certain music.


----------



## Niyologist

Anyone listened to this.
   
  http://www.amazon.com/OSP-EU-4-Professional-Earphones/dp/B000SKL95C/ref=pd_sim_sbs_e_7
   
  Someone reviewed it and said it's better than $1,000 headphone monitors.


----------



## esanthosh

I read that review. It bothers me a bit.
   
  Quote: 





> I have a friend who is a professional audio engineer and musician in Nashville, TN that told me about these amazing in-ear monitors. He told me that these sound better than his $1,000 pair of "pro" monitors!


 
    
  Quote:


> Bass response is better than the human ear can actually hear.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Anyone listened to this.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/OSP-EU-4-Professional-Earphones/dp/B000SKL95C/ref=pd_sim_sbs_e_7
> 
> Someone reviewed it and said it's better than $1,000 headphone monitors.


 
   
  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> TBH, these have been around for a long time under various names. Makes you think that there might just be something to them. Of course I would go for the Carvin being $59 instead of the OSP or Galaxy for $69 or $79.


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Anyone listened to this.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/OSP-EU-4-Professional-Earphones/dp/B000SKL95C/ref=pd_sim_sbs_e_7
> 
> Someone reviewed it and said it's better than $1,000 headphone monitors.


 
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/247851/new-cheap-iem-on-the-block-eu-4


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> which iem has best grip in bass, which iem is best in seismic and tight bass with overall good sound quality around $100. I feel that eterna's bass is on the boomier side.
> 
> Thanks & Regards


 
   
  If that 50% off MG7 coupon is still active that would be one. Otherwise the Hippo VB or maybe even Velodyne vPulse.
   
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I've realized that the iem market moves way too fast for me and much faster than the full sized market. Some products here become irrelevant very quick while I can't say the same for full sized. I wonder when my JH5 will be long forgotten at the rate things are going
> 
> I do wonder where you find the space for all the iems and how you find something if you are looking for a specific one.


 
   
  Agreed, I've stopped trying to keep up with the latest and greatest and just hope to hear the stuff that sticks around.
   
  IEMs don't take up much room (luckily). I have two desk drawers - one for sets I intend to sell and the other for review and reference pairs. To find the right one I just have to think back to the last time I used it and dig appropriately far back in the drawer 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> I read that review. It bothers me a bit.


 
   
  Happens a lot on amazon


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *jant71*
> 
> 
> 
> TBH, these have been around for a long time under various names. Makes you think that there might just be something to them. Of course I would go for the Carvin being $59 instead of the OSP or Galaxy for $69 or $79.


 
   
  Speaking of multiple brand names, there's also the JTS IE-1, http://www.jts.com.tw/_en/01_professional/01_detail.php?sid=505
  The company also offers a single BA and dual BA model, which I've listened to before. No exactly stellar SQ, but not horrible either, and they are built like tanks.


----------



## philip.pe

Hi, 
I'm considering the atrios mg7 but I haven't found a comparision with the mtpc that I previously owned! 
I would like to know if the mg7 is a downgrade coming from the mtpc
Thank you


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  intersting
  how are they compared to other BA and Dual BA?
  price? where're they available?


----------



## Emospence

Please review the TDK BA200


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If that 50% off MG7 coupon is still active that would be one. Otherwise the Hippo VB or maybe even Velodyne vPulse.


 
   
  PM'ed you.
   
  Thanks & Regards.


----------



## Swimsonny

Joker, out of curiosity do you still have the Radius DDM2 on hand still has i am curious of how similar they are to my able planet SI1050. They look identical apart from the vent on the radius. I would be more than happy to send them to you to try out if you have the time?
  


I would obviously like to hear for my self but I am not in a position at all to buy one and if I was purchasing and iem it'd be something else.
So I guess the secon best thing would be someone I trust as well as value there opinion so that's you!


----------



## Gilly87

Joker how would you compare the SE215 to the Xcape IE in terms of soundstage?


----------



## moracajay

Hi Joker. I've read from previous posts that Sunrise Impressive Edition will get a higher score on sound quality compared to Vsonic GR06. How about the Sunrise XCITED Edition? Would you score it higher than Vsonic GR06? 
   
  Sorry for another question.
    
         1. Which is better in treble?       Sunrise IE, Sunrise XCITED, Vsonic GR06?
         2. Which is better in midrange?  Sunrise IE, Sunrise XCITED, Vsonic GR06?
         3, Which is better in instrument separation?  Sunrise IE, Sunrise XCITED, Vsonic GR06?
         4. Which has more air/soundstage? (like Hifiman REO)? Sunrise IE, Sunrise XCITED, Vsonic GR06?
   
  Waiting for the review of Sunrise IE & XCITED. 
  I trust your ears Joker. From my purchased IEM I gotta say, your sound quality reviews are exactly what I'm hearing.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





moracajay said:


> Hi Joker. I've read from previous posts that Sunrise Impressive Edition will get a higher score on sound quality compared to Vsonic GR06. How about the Sunrise XCITED Edition? Would you score it higher than Vsonic GR06?


 
   
  The hint may be here. Even if there are revisions to that score, XCited would slot below GR06.


----------



## joyceb

Joker, after "studying" your current list of IEM's and checking at my price point (I listen to all kinds of music and I know this is subjective), but I have been pondering this decision for a while and I would like your opinion if you think the Fischer DBA-2 MKII are an overall quality set of IEM's?  I am most concerned about sound quality and build.  thanks for you input in advance.  Joyce


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





philip.pe said:


> Hi,
> I'm considering the atrios mg7 but I haven't found a comparision with the mtpc that I previously owned!
> I would like to know if the mg7 is a downgrade coming from the mtpc
> Thank you


 
   
  Not a downgrade, rather a different signature. The thing you may find most lacking on the MG7 coming from the MTPC is soundstage size.
   
   
  Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> Joker, out of curiosity do you still have the Radius DDM2 on hand still has i am curious of how similar they are to my able planet SI1050. They look identical apart from the vent on the radius. I would be more than happy to send them to you to try out if you have the time?
> 
> I would obviously like to hear for my self but I am not in a position at all to buy one and if I was purchasing and iem it'd be something else.
> So I guess the secon best thing would be someone I trust as well as value there opinion so that's you!


 
   
  Sorry, my DDM2 died while out on loan.
   
   
  Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Joker how would you compare the SE215 to the Xcape IE in terms of soundstage?


 
   
  The SE215 is a little larger/wider but the IE has good (better) layering and imaging and sounds a bit more 3-d as a result.
   
  Quote: 





moracajay said:


> Hi Joker. I've read from previous posts that Sunrise Impressive Edition will get a higher score on sound quality compared to Vsonic GR06. How about the Sunrise XCITED Edition? Would you score it higher than Vsonic GR06?
> 
> Sorry for another question.
> 
> ...


 
   
  No, the Xcited is somewhere in the upper-7 range for me. As esanthosh noted, I already reviewed the Xcited and Xcape IE. However, I have not added them to this thread as I have not been able to confirm that the build quality has improved (both of mine died in just a few weeks). The GR06 has a larger soundstage than the Sunrise products but I do think the sound quality of the IE is better overall - it is more detailed and textured through the bass and mids despite similarly warm tone and has slightly better resolution. From memory treble quality is a wash between the IE and GR06 but again my IE has not been working in quite some time. The performance of the IE was actually pretty close to the Fischer Audio Tandem (and the signature is not too far off either).
   
   
   
  Quote: 





joyceb said:


> Joker, after "studying" your current list of IEM's and checking at my price point (I listen to all kinds of music and I know this is subjective), but I have been pondering this decision for a while and I would like your opinion if you think the Fischer DBA-2 MKII are an overall quality set of IEM's?  I am most concerned about sound quality and build.  thanks for you input in advance.  Joyce


 
   
  Well, it did receive a 9.5/10 value rating and a 4/5 in build quality. So yes, it is a solid earphone all around.


----------



## luc shrine

hi Joker. i am a vocal lover.
 i love Tandem than PFE 112, am i wrong?

 i really love tandem. can u give me any suggestions those maybe the downgrade and upgrade of tandem?
 i think..
 the downgrade : GR06
 the upgrade : GR01
 but i havent heard both of them.


----------



## Swimsonny

luc shrine said:


> i really love tandem. can u give me any suggestions those maybe the downgrade and upgrade of tandem?





   
  If you look at his post above he says that the Sunrise IE is very close.
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The performance of the IE was actually pretty close to the Fischer Audio Tandem (and the signature is not too far off either).


----------



## luc shrine

Quote: 





swimsonny said:


> If you look at his post above he says that the Sunrise IE is very close.


 
   
  ah.. i am sorry  thanks.
  got it.
  "The performance of the IE was actually pretty close to the Fischer Audio Tandem (and the signature is not too far off either)."


----------



## Swimsonny

Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> ah.. i am sorry  thanks.
> got it.
> "The performance of the IE was actually pretty close to the Fischer Audio Tandem (and the signature is not too far off either)."


 
   
  I didn't ask for an apology aha, i was just helping out and i also included the quote in my post.
  Im sure he will come back with a better answer anyway but just thought id guide you to that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> hi Joker. i am a vocal lover.
> i love Tandem than PFE 112, am i wrong?
> 
> i really love tandem. can u give me any suggestions those maybe the downgrade and upgrade of tandem?
> ...


 
   
  There's no such thing as wrong when it comes to preferences. The Tandem is impossibly smooth and forgiving - more so than almost anything else out there - and also has deep, impactful bass. The GR06 is a good option but the Xcape IE is indeed more similar for under $100. Without knowing what it is exactly you like about the Tandem, I would say that higher-end sets that are similar in some ways would be the Radius HP-TWF11 "DDM" or HP-TWF21 "DDM2", Monster Turbine Pro Gold, and Earsonics SM2 (if you want to try balanced armature).


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, sorry to always bother you, but I'm really confused about what to get, the FXT90 or the EPH-100, how well do they stack against each other?
   
  Also, what natural-signature (not neutral) IEM's would recommend at under 100$...
  I'd like something that's un-fatigue-ing... perhaps a smooth sound signature but still has details...
  would EPH-100 or FXT90 fit the bill?


----------



## soullinker20

hi Joker,
   
  as you can see on my signature, i've sold those iems and had settled down on the W4 which I am really impressed with the details especially on the midbass, i have an incoming sm3s from my parents..
   
  in terms of highs details and quantity, does the sm3 have more than the um3x? i sold my um3x too because i needed some funds and also i already have the w4 and decided to have another signature so i won't be getting them again..
   
  I just wanna make sure that the sm3s won't fail me
   
   
  thanks!


----------



## Amitl

ljokerl, thank you so much for this hard work!
  i can't start to describe how i appreciate it.
  wonderful thread! 
  after going through your reviews i've narrowed my options for a new IEM to these:
  Soundmagic e10
  ID America Spark
  Visang r03 \ Brainwavz M2
   
  i was thinking you could help me pick just one...
  i like strong bass but i prefer good mids and highs over a REALLY strong bass.
  im listening mostly to metal and rock.
  i currently have the Klipsch Image S4, and my main complaint is perhaps something
  that others find good about it : the fit! .. i just find it too intrusive, reaching
  too far inside my ear canal, and yet it doesnt hold very still there, not sitting very snug.
  i love the sound of it, except for the little bit of harshness.
  id love to have better mids and highs but i love the bass.
  so i understand Visang r03 might offer better highs and mids and the Spark might sound similar to the Klipsch?
  and when i start thinking about the Spark, im thinking... is it worth the extra $ over the Soundmagic E10??
  also the E10 seems a little more comfortable the Spark.
  thank you!!


----------



## moracajay

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> No, the Xcited is somewhere in the upper-7 range for me. As esanthosh noted, I already reviewed the Xcited and Xcape IE. However, I have not added them to this thread as I have not been able to confirm that the build quality has improved (both of mine died in just a few weeks). The GR06 has a larger soundstage than the Sunrise products but I do think the sound quality of the IE is better overall - it is more detailed and textured through the bass and mids despite similarly warm tone and has slightly better resolution. From memory treble quality is a wash between the IE and GR06 but again my IE has not been working in quite some time. The performance of the IE was actually pretty close to the Fischer Audio Tandem (and the signature is not too far off either).


 
   
   
  Thank you very much Joker, specially on the build quality issue with Sunrise. I'm about to purchase XCITED but because of your response I think I've save some money.  
   
  Really looking for some IEM that have same(or almost) sound signature with RE0. Ultimate Ears 600 perhaps?
  I have Etymotic HF5(like it) but I'm longing for the air and treble that REO gaves me.  
  Budget is not more than $100 and build quality is highly considered.


----------



## suman134

if fit is you trouble , you need over ear canal , try a e30 or a vsonic - gr06 which joker says is awesome at this price , but lacks some bass .


----------



## nyonya

Hi ljokerl, could you compare the treble of the DBA-02 MkII to that of the FXT-90?  And overall, how do they compare?  I'm finding that the treble on the JVCs is a bit overwhelming at times, maybe a bit too aggressive.  Not sure if the Fischers are better in that regard, but thought I'd ask.  Thanks!


----------



## williamqh

Hi, joker, I recently bought a pair of beyer's t5p, now when I listen to UM Miracle, I find vocals sounds veiled, is it normal? or my UM miracle is broken? How to check it? Thanks!


----------



## Amitl

Suman134:
  i think i wanna stick with a straight-down setup... my problem with the Klipsch S4 fit is the tips going too
  far inside... i used to have a Sennheiser cx300 and it was totally comfortable (straight-down).
  i just can't decide between the id America Spark and the Soundmagic e10...and after picking one,
  it will be *it* vs *Visang r03*........ 
 thank you..... 
  ***please help Joker !! )***


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, sorry to always bother you, but I'm really confused about what to get, the FXT90 or the EPH-100, how well do they stack against each other?
> 
> Also, what natural-signature (not neutral) IEM's would recommend at under 100$...
> I'd like something that's un-fatigue-ing... perhaps a smooth sound signature but still has details...
> would EPH-100 or FXT90 fit the bill?


 
   
  They are a pretty even match but the EPH-100 is not as forward overall and especially in the treble. I don't think it is under $100 but the EPH-100 is not fatiguing (at least not next to an FXT90 or GR07) and definitely detailed. 
   
  The FA Tandem would be the underdog recommendation, one of the least fatiguing earphones out there IMO.
   
   
  Quote: 





soullinker20 said:


> hi Joker,
> 
> as you can see on my signature, i've sold those iems and had settled down on the W4 which I am really impressed with the details especially on the midbass, i have an incoming sm3s from my parents..
> 
> ...


 
   
  I haven't heard either set in a very long time. The SM3 is not a bright earphone, I don't think it has as much treble as a W4, but the detail level should be on-par. I remember the SM3 being able to provide all of the detail of the W3 with none of the aggression.
   
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> ljokerl, thank you so much for this hard work!
> i can't start to describe how i appreciate it.
> wonderful thread!
> after going through your reviews i've narrowed my options for a new IEM to these:
> ...


 
   
  The E10 is happier with a shallow fit than is the Spark or the M2. The Spark is definitely closest to the S4 in sound signature but better in performance - it never gets as harsh and the bass is more controlled. However, it does like a deeper fit than the E10 so I would probably advise against it. The R03 is somewhere in the middle in terms of fit dependency. Definitely no harshness there, though, and the bass is quite good. 
   
  Quote: 





moracajay said:


> Thank you very much Joker, specially on the build quality issue with Sunrise. I'm about to purchase XCITED but because of your response I think I've save some money.
> 
> Really looking for some IEM that have same(or almost) sound signature with RE0. Ultimate Ears 600 perhaps?
> I have Etymotic HF5(like it) but I'm longing for the air and treble that REO gaves me.
> Budget is not more than $100 and build quality is highly considered.


 
   
  I have not heard the UE600. I don't think there is a good alternative to the RE0/RE-ZERO in the price range now that the original Xcape has been discontinued. You may have to just save up for the Sony EX600 or something on that level. 
   
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl, could you compare the treble of the DBA-02 MkII to that of the FXT-90?  And overall, how do they compare?  I'm finding that the treble on the JVCs is a bit overwhelming at times, maybe a bit too aggressive.  Not sure if the Fischers are better in that regard, but thought I'd ask.  Thanks!


 
   
  I would not go for a DBA-02 mkII if you found the FXT90 treble overwhelming, even occasionally. It might be more controlled and accurate in the lows and mids but it's definitely an aggressive earphone with unforgiving treble (though it is not as bright as the original DBA-02). The VSonic GR01 would be a better option IMO, or maybe even the Yamaha EPH-100.
   
   
  Quote: 





williamqh said:


> Hi, joker, I recently bought a pair of beyer's t5p, now when I listen to UM Miracle, I find vocals sounds veiled, is it normal? or my UM miracle is broken? How to check it? Thanks!


 
   
  Sorry, I haven't heard the T5p so I can't comment on how they compare. The Miracle does not have forward mids so it could sound distant compared to some sets but I don't know about veiled. My FitEar ToGo MH334 has more forward and powerful mids with fantastic clarity but I still wouldn't quite call the Miracle veiled in comparison.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They are a pretty even match but the EPH-100 is not as forward overall and especially in the treble. I don't think it is under $100 but the EPH-100 is not fatiguing (at least not next to an FXT90 or GR07) and definitely detailed.
> 
> The FA Tandem would be the underdog recommendation, one of the least fatiguing earphones out there IMO.


 
  Ah... but the EPH-100 is under 100$ here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  I'm actually real interested to hear a dual-dynamic, but I already got a hot-treble earphone (looking at my CK10), so I'm looking for something more natural....
  I guess my choice is clear... thx again Joker!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  would the Shure Olives help here on the DBA-02 (either version)?


----------



## Gilly87

I have to say, EPH100 wasnt my favorite phone by any means, but it is a complete, absolute steal at under $100.
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Ah... but the EPH-100 is under 100$ here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## IDReaper

Good to see your opinion on the eph-100 joker 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I have been through your reviews many times and they have led me through a slew of Meelec products which were all great for the price. I have been in the market for a new iem for mostly Drum n' Bass, Dubstep and IDM. More of the melodic liquid-funk type of stuff. I had been looking at the JVC HA-FXT90, Vsonic GR07 and recently the Yamaha eph-100.
   
  As far as I can tell the JVC HA-FXT90 are usually described as being a very aggressive v-shaped signature. Many have described them as good for EDM but I'm not sure if their aggressive nature is right for me. The GR07 review you posted reminded me of my Superlux HD668B somewhat o.O which in my book is a very good thing. Lastly the most intriguing thing about the Yamaha eph-100 to me is what I have read about their layering and instrumental separation, as well as their bass depth and affinity for EDM. 
   
  Now a big deciding factor is the Yamaha eph-100 is down the street from me for $129.99 tax free 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 joker do you think I should just grab them or one of the former sets? I have to say the fotm craze have me fairly convinced these will be great. Maybe I should try them first and go GR07 if I don't like them? I'm confused


----------



## Amitl

Joker...thank you so much for the help!
  would you say that the SoundMAGIC e10 sound
  as good as the id America spark?
  thank you so much...


----------



## crzycuyler

What can you say about the etymotic hf3 vs sennheiser hd25-1 II in terms of sound alone?


----------



## justaguy

Quote: 





idreaper said:


> Good to see your opinion on the eph-100 joker
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  if you like your HD668B I would recommend you to buy GR07. I have them both and made an a/b comparison just yesterday. They are comparable in sound signatures but GR07 is a fantastic earphone that sounds better in almost everything than HD668B and for my ears has greater musicality. In some aspects it comes close even to my pro900.


----------



## davidcotton

Hi
   
  Whilst I've pretty much decided on the westone 3 (possibly 4 or umx3!) for daily use, I was just wondering what sounded like the sennheiser ie7 but with better isolation and easier to fit?

 Cheers.


----------



## ljokerl

The downloadable score chart has been updated. Those who want to play with the numbers can download an excel version of the table at http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?fdf0dse1tgqyetb courtesy of carfentanil
   
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Ah... but the EPH-100 is under 100$ here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  If you're talking about the Tandem, it's pretty much the exact opposite of the CK10 in the treble. In fact, I wouldn't describe any of the dual dynamics I've heard as 'hot'. The FXT90 is probably closest though. 
   
   
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> would the Shure Olives help here on the DBA-02 (either version)?


 
   
  Not significantly, and I've always found silicone tips to sound better on the DBAs.
   
   
  Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> I have to say, EPH100 wasnt my favorite phone by any means, but it is a complete, absolute steal at under $100.


 
   
  Agreed, it's a fantastic phone that just falls slightly short of higher-end sets like the GR07 and RE272 here and there.
   
   
  Quote: 





idreaper said:


> Good to see your opinion on the eph-100 joker
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I agree that the GR07 is a great Superlux match. However, I would go for the EPH-100 if it's cheapest and most easily available - it's not going to sound similar to the HD668B as the GR07 would but it's not as aggressive as the FXT90 and definitely sounds good with electronic music. 
   
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Joker...thank you so much for the help!
> would you say that the SoundMAGIC e10 sound
> as good as the id America spark?
> thank you so much...


 
   
  Not quite, but close. The Spark is a little more crisp and resolving here and there and has better layering despite the smaller soundstage. 
   
   
  Quote: 





crzycuyler said:


> What can you say about the etymotic hf3 vs sennheiser hd25-1 II in terms of sound alone?


 
   
  The HF3 is a lot flatter and more accurate. The HD25 is much bassier and has some treble accents. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi
> 
> Whilst I've pretty much decided on the westone 3 (possibly 4 or umx3!) for daily use, I was just wondering what sounded like the sennheiser ie7 but with better isolation and easier to fit?
> 
> Cheers.


 
   
   
  The IE7 is pretty unique in being mid-forward and spacious but also quite bassy. There are a number of things that have 2 of those qualities but none I can think of that have all three. The SM3 is mid-forward, spacious, and bassy to an extent but it still doesn't sound much like an IE7 when you get down to it.


----------



## Drakokirby

Do you know where I can find the ECCI 401s now? Lendmeurears doesn't stock them anymore.


----------



## Magicman74

Quote: 





drakokirby said:


> Do you know where I can find the ECCI 401s now? Lendmeurears doesn't stock them anymore.


 
   

 ???????????????
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/ECCI-PR401-/320723265391?pt=Other_MP3_Player_Accessories&hash=item4aac98a76f


----------



## Drakokirby

Well, not on their website. Thanks!
   
  Edit: Would you consider the Brainwavz ProAlpha to be more of a balanced IEM or warm? I can't really afford the ECCI's atm.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you're talking about the Tandem, it's pretty much the exact opposite of the CK10 in the treble. In fact, I wouldn't describe any of the dual dynamics I've heard as 'hot'. The FXT90 is probably closest though.


 
   
  Ah... no, I was talking about the FXT90... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I'll be getting the EPH-100, as even you think it's a steal under 100$,
   
  Thanks for the suggestion Joker!


----------



## PanicoNFL

Hi joker, 

 I'm planning to buy a GR06 and want to know in what genres they are good, and if they sound good with Blues, Progressive Rock, etc. (Mostly Pink Floyd and Clapton)
 Any suggestion for this genres ? Thanks


----------



## phantompersona

Yay your gonna review the Thermaltake Isurus!!They sound so wonderful with the Sony Hybrids on, but its a such a chore to put it on. Can't wait to hear your review on it!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





drakokirby said:


> Well, not on their website. Thanks!
> 
> Edit: Would you consider the Brainwavz ProAlpha to be more of a balanced IEM or warm? I can't really afford the ECCI's atm.


 
   
  The ProAlpha is on the warm side of neutral (more so than the ECCI, for example) but it's not overly warm. 
   
   
  Quote: 





paniconfl said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> I'm planning to buy a GR06 and want to know in what genres they are good, and if they sound good with Blues, Progressive Rock, etc. (Mostly Pink Floyd and Clapton)
> Any suggestion for this genres ? Thanks


 
   
  If you like your rock with forward mids and medium bass levels, sure. The GR06 is a versatile earphone and very hard to beat as an overall package.
   
  Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Yay your gonna review the Thermaltake Isurus!!They sound so wonderful with the Sony Hybrids on, but its a such a chore to put it on. Can't wait to hear your review on it!


 
   
  Yes, thanks to Gilly87 for sending me the Isurus along with the EPH-100. Probably going to be a while before I get to it, though.


----------



## phantompersona

i dont mind the wait, i love reading all your iem reviews, they're so entertaining! keep up the good work


----------



## rawrster

I find it amusing that a year later after pretty much losing interest in iems the TF10 is still pending


----------



## Drakokirby

Is bigbargainonline a reputable dealer?


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Edit: 08/06/09: Sound Notes.
> 
> Well, not everything is perfect soundmagic-land. After three days of critical listening (20+ hours during which the sound has not changed at all) I can no longer attribute what I'm hearing to simply being spoiled by my RE0s and Etymotics. *There is something ever-so-slightly off about the way these sound. Don't get me wrong - the notes are all there, but the overall sound is just a bit distant and veiled compared to some of the other earphones in the price range. I'm not sure this is the right term, but I think they lack resolve - i.e. the sound is slightly run-together when a lot of things are going on simultaneously on the track.* Hopefully someone else can confirm/discredit this when more people start getting their PL50s, and I will post more updates as I listen. *Confirmed*


 
  I found this on your more detailed review on the soundmagic pl50, I guess I will have to take them off my list


----------



## Remustan

Hey Joker, based on memory, can you kindly do a short comparison between the DBA/B2s and the SM3s? Would the SM3s do well for bright recordings that sound a little harsh on the DBAs? Also, do you find the SM3s dark and veiled? Thanks!


----------



## ss2625

thanks for this thread! probably the one ive read the most on headfi


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> i dont mind the wait, i love reading all your iem reviews, they're so entertaining! keep up the good work


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I find it amusing that a year later after pretty much losing interest in iems the TF10 is still pending


 
   
  Yes, I am thinking I should just keep it that way for posterity
   
  Quote: 





drakokirby said:


> Is bigbargainonline a reputable dealer?


 
   
  I've definitely heard the name before but haven't purchased anything from them personally
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> I found this on your more detailed review on the soundmagic pl50, I guess I will have to take them off my list


 
   
  Hah, that's an ancient thread. I later figured out that my problem was the thickness/creaminess in the upper mids that was sort of... 'suffocating' me. Just not my kind of sound but keep in mind that some people like that sort of thing.
   
  Quote: 





remustan said:


> Hey Joker, based on memory, can you kindly do a short comparison between the DBA/B2s and the SM3s? Would the SM3s do well for bright recordings that sound a little harsh on the DBAs? Also, do you find the SM3s dark and veiled? Thanks!


 
   
  Sure, the SM3 is not nearly as bright  as the DBA-02 so it should let those recordings slide. Overall the SM3 is much thicker and smoother, more forward in the bass and mids and less forward in the upper mids/treble. It's also got a more 3-d presentation. Compared to the DBA-02 the SM3 will certainly sound dark and veiled but that's an extreme case as the DBA-02 is much thinner-sounding and errs on the bright side. If you compare it to something like a Shure SE530 or Monster Turbines it doesn't sound dark and there's no veiling in terms of detail levels or loss of clarity. Bottom line: don't A:B it with something much brighter. Same reason that A:Bing the SM3 and EX1000 yields very negative results on both sides.
   
  Quote: 





ss2625 said:


> thanks for this thread! probably the one ive read the most on headfi


 
   
  Glad it's helpful!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  heh, i missed that when i tried the A151. the pl50 are just smoother. the meelec more aggressive


----------



## Drakokirby

Are the pro copper stock tips the same as the monster turbine stock tips?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





drakokirby said:


> Are the pro copper stock tips the same as the monster turbine stock tips?


 
   
   
  The silicone ones are but the Turbines I've had didn't come with any of the Supertips (foam, gel, or otherwise) that Monster includes with the Coppers.


----------



## shotgunshane

Hey Mike, just wanted to thank you for the UM3X recommendation you gave me a while back. They've become my favorite universal and my most reached for iem, period. Finally a keeper I won't be selling!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Hey Mike, just wanted to thank you for the UM3X recommendation you gave me a while back. They've become my favorite universal and my most reached for iem, period. Finally a keeper I won't be selling!


 
   
  Must've been a while ago 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Glad you're happy with them!


----------



## Ketopolis

hi i looked at you chart very informative and helped me narrow down some of my choices i like the shure se215 and vsonic gr06. I really like the design and built of the se and the bass is suited to my needs but i hear the gr06 can compete with this for less. Im  no audiophile i just want to have fun listening to my music Not a true bass head i love punchy and tight bass not boomy and muddy bass. Also i hear the shure and westone style earphones are best if your laying in bed or fall asleep are the best in terms of comfort is it true


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ketopolis said:


> hi i looked at you chart very informative and helped me narrow down some of my choices i like the shure se215 and vsonic gr06. I really like the design and built of the se and the bass is suited to my needs but i hear the gr06 can compete with this for less. Im  no audiophile i just want to have fun listening to my music Not a true bass head i love punchy and tight bass not boomy and muddy bass. Also i hear the shure and westone style earphones are best if your laying in bed or fall asleep are the best in terms of comfort is it true


 
   
   
  The GR06 is no less comfortable than the SE215 IMO - the housings are more ergonomic than they look. Sound-wise, the two are comparable but the GR06 has slightly less bass and more midrange. Neither is muddy or boomy but if you want the Shures just get them - I doubt they'll disappoint.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Joker...I realised just now that you've never heard the PFE 232's?
  if so, I think you might rate them quite highly vs the PFE 122s


----------



## Ketopolis

thanks man i think i will can't wait


----------



## Xinn3r

Well, fate brought me FXT90 instead...
  I found a cheap slightly used pair of FXT90 and decided to purchase it...
   
  Timbre is very very good.... Guitar is really amazing on these....


----------



## elderain

I noticed on this list that the Ety HF5's are listed as having a mic option, but I cant find this anywhere - It looks like the HF3 and below have them. Can anyone point me to something showing otherwise?


----------



## karma

Looking to get a gift for a friend. For someone who likes the Klipsch S4 sound, what would be considered a good upgrade that maintains the "consumer-friendly" sound with ample bass and added clarity?
   
  From perusing the reviews (great job, Joker), it seems like the most appealing options would be:
   

 Shure SE215
 Velodyne vPulse
 Atrio MG7
   
  Which of the above would be the safest bet? Any others I should be looking at?


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





elderain said:


> I noticed on this list that the Ety HF5's are listed as having a mic option, but I cant find this anywhere - It looks like the HF3 and below have them. Can anyone point me to something showing otherwise?


 
   
  The HF2, HF3 and HF5 are all the same earphone - the 2 has a mic, the 3 has an iPhone-specific remote, the 5 has no mic.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> Joker...I realised just now that you've never heard the PFE 232's?
> if so, I think you might rate them quite highly vs the PFE 122s


 
   
  I have one on loan, though the review might be a little delayed because I need to spend extra time with the K3003 and other high-end stuff.
   
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Well, fate brought me FXT90 instead...
> I found a cheap slightly used pair of FXT90 and decided to purchase it...
> 
> Timbre is very very good.... Guitar is really amazing on these....


 
   
  At the very least it's another data point in figuring out your ultimate sound.
   
  Quote: 





karma said:


> Looking to get a gift for a friend. For someone who likes the Klipsch S4 sound, what would be considered a good upgrade that maintains the "consumer-friendly" sound with ample bass and added clarity?
> 
> From perusing the reviews (great job, Joker), it seems like the most appealing options would be:
> 
> ...


 
   
  The SE215 and vPulse don't really have that treble emphasis that gives the S4 the extra clarity  and energy but are both good options otherwise. The MG7 is better overall IMO but it lacks the mid-bass hump of the S4 so it may not be boomy enough for the average consumer. I don't know what your price cap is but I'd say JVC FX500 and ATH-CKM99 might be worth looking at as ~$150 options. The id America Spark and Fischer Audio Consonance are more budget-conscious but remind me of the S4 more than the vPulse or SE215 do.
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> The HF2, HF3 and HF5 are all the same earphone - the 2 has a mic, the 3 has an iPhone-specific remote, the 5 has no mic.


 
   
   
  This - Etymotic uses a numbering system in place of the usual suffixes.


----------



## koonhua90

I am looking for something better than the HF5, since I sold my JH16. It was a love hate relationship with it, in my case, the build and comfort wasn't terribly good, and the sound was a tad too bassy for my liking. 
   
  I had the IE8 and SM3 and sold both of them. The IE8 had too much of a midbass hump and a midrange that is too distant sounding. The SM3 for me, was too thick and lacking air, especially in the midrange. The only iem that I really liked was the FX-700, but the treble would cause fatigue after some time. The lack of isolation was another problem, because it made me turn up the volume, which in turn caused fatigue. If the treble was slightly less tilt up and less grainy, I would have kept the FX-700. I also like the Ety HF5 which I bought 3 years ago, but it's a bit too thin sounding, and the high amount of treble, albeit smooth, can be fatiguing.
   
  So ljokerl, for something less than $300, what would you recommend? I need good isolation and comfort, and in terms of sound I want coherence, balance, and transparency. I see that you rate the CK-10 highly, but some people appear to not like it as much as you. Do you still rate it as high as it was a year ago?
   
  What are some of the best dynamic driver iems, apart from the FX-700? I haven't heard a lot of earphones, but not many have come close to achieving what my headphone can do. I would like to find something that sound as good as it, but it seems that I won't be able to find one easily without spending a lot.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> I am looking for something better than the HF5, since I sold my JH16. It was a love hate relationship with it, in my case, the build and comfort wasn't terribly good, and the sound was a tad too bassy for my liking.
> 
> I had the IE8 and SM3 and sold both of them. The IE8 had too much of a midbass hump and a midrange that is too distant sounding. The SM3 for me, was too thick and lacking air, especially in the midrange. The only iem that I really liked was the FX-700, but the treble would cause fatigue after some time. The lack of isolation was another problem, because it made me turn up the volume, which in turn caused fatigue. If the treble was slightly less tilt up and less grainy, I would have kept the FX-700. I also like the Ety HF5 which I bought 3 years ago, but it's a bit too thin sounding, and the high amount of treble, albeit smooth, can be fatiguing.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I am still very much impressed by the CK10 whenever I get a chance to use it. The linear extension of the bass and the amount of texture and detail it puts out is fantastic (especially for a mere dual BA) and the imaging is still pretty much the best I've heard from a universal. However, it is rather less neutral than the HF5 in the treble so I would not recommend it at all in your case.
   
  I am actually not aware of an earphone that fits all of your requirements, especially not for under $300. The only dynamic-driver IEM I would put on-par with the FX700 overall is the Sony EX1000 but that will probably be too bright for you. The Westone 4 and SE535 both come to mind as smooth, non-fatiguing sets that aren't overly thick like the SM3 but they are quite pricy. The RE272, while smoother than the EX1000, might be too thin and both it and the RE262 don't have anywhere near the bass quantity of an FX700. Ditto on the ACS T15 - great Ety-like sound with a touch less high end but really not nearly as bassy as an FX700 and rather restrained in terms of dynamics.
   
  With the signature you want and under $300 you would probably have to settle for something that trades off a bit of technical prowess for the right signature. I think you may like the Yamaha EPH-100 and it doesn't cost an arm and a leg to try. You would probably also like the Ortofon e-Q7 but I believe it's been discontinued in favor of the brighter e-Q5.


----------



## karma

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SE215 and vPulse don't really have that treble emphasis that gives the S4 the extra clarity  and energy but are both good options otherwise. The MG7 is better overall IMO but it lacks the mid-bass hump of the S4 so it may not be boomy enough for the average consumer. I don't know what your price cap is but I'd say JVC FX500 and ATH-CKM99 might be worth looking at as ~$150 options. The id America Spark and Fischer Audio Consonance are more budget-conscious but remind me of the S4 more than the vPulse or SE215 do.


 
   
  Thanks for the reply. What about the thinksound ts02? Forgot to include them in my original list.
   
  Price cap is around $100. The Spark sounds like it might be a good upgrade given the similar sound signature to the S4.


----------



## dogears

I think I'll wait for a T15 vs PFE-121 comparo. And any worthy dynamic driver with same sound sig?


----------



## mzso

Is it just me or the Kanen KM-948 isn't sold anymore? (I'm searching for a cheap earphone with good isolation and tolerable sound)


----------



## koonhua90

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am still very much impressed by the CK10 whenever I get a chance to use it. The linear extension of the bass and the amount of texture and detail it puts out is fantastic (especially for a mere dual BA) and the imaging is still pretty much the best I've heard from a universal. However, it is rather less neutral than the HF5 in the treble so I would not recommend it at all in your case.
> 
> I am actually not aware of an earphone that fits all of your requirements, especially not for under $300. The only dynamic-driver IEM I would put on-par with the FX700 overall is the Sony EX1000 but that will probably be too bright for you. The Westone 4 and SE535 both come to mind as smooth, non-fatiguing sets that aren't overly thick like the SM3 but they are quite pricy. The RE272, while smoother than the EX1000, might be too thin and both it and the RE262 don't have anywhere near the bass quantity of an FX700. Ditto on the ACS T15 - great Ety-like sound with a touch less high end but really not nearly as bassy as an FX700 and rather restrained in terms of dynamics.
> 
> With the signature you want and under $300 you would probably have to settle for something that trades off a bit of technical prowess for the right signature. I think you may like the Yamaha EPH-100 and it doesn't cost an arm and a leg to try. You would probably also like the Ortofon e-Q7 but I believe it's been discontinued in favor of the brighter e-Q5.


 
   
  Thanks for the advice. I have narrowed down to the e-Q5, GR-07 and am looking at the Yamaha EPH-100. I don't really like the shape of the dual flange tips though. How do these 3 compare to each other?
   
  I don't have the FX-700 now, but if I have it I might think that it's slightly bassy. And I do have the Ety HF5, which have slightly less bass quantity than what I consider as natural sounding. I am also looking at the RE-272, but I am just worried about the cable hardening issue on some of the Hifiman earphones.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> At the very least it's another data point in figuring out your ultimate sound.


 
   
  Yes it is!
  I really really love the timbre on this...
   
  On a different note, I just bought a brand-new unopened PX100 for 25$.... (I don't know where the hell the seller got it from)
  These are really not bad! Although, of course, isolation isn't on par with any of my IEM's... but I like it!
  It's lightweight, and portable!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





karma said:


> Thanks for the reply. What about the thinksound ts02? Forgot to include them in my original list.
> 
> Price cap is around $100. The Spark sounds like it might be a good upgrade given the similar sound signature to the S4.


 
   
  I haven't heard the Thinksounds in a while but I am pretty sure they aren't worth the price jump from the Spark except for the whole eco angle. The Spark also has the advantage of looking like a more expensive product with its big box and machined aluminum shells. The only real concern I have with the Spark is that it's not exactly an upgrade from the S4 in comfort or cable noise (both are a bit worse when worn cable-down).
   
   
  Quote: 





dogears said:


> I think I'll wait for a T15 vs PFE-121 comparo. And any worthy dynamic driver with same sound sig?


 
   
  Not the same sig but the VSonic GR07 and HiFiMan RE272 can probably be considered variations on the 'neutral and balanced' theme with some minor caveats.
   
   
  Quote: 





mzso said:


> Is it just me or the Kanen KM-948 isn't sold anymore? (I'm searching for a cheap earphone with good isolation and tolerable sound)


 
   
  Entirely possible, I think some of the stores I used to buy these from don't even exist anymore. If you can spend $10-15 the Philips SHE3580 isolates pretty well (3-3.5 on the scale on the front page) and sounds excellent.
   
  Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> Thanks for the advice. I have narrowed down to the e-Q5, GR-07 and am looking at the Yamaha EPH-100. I don't really like the shape of the dual flange tips though. How do these 3 compare to each other?
> 
> I don't have the FX-700 now, but if I have it I might think that it's slightly bassy. And I do have the Ety HF5, which have slightly less bass quantity than what I consider as natural sounding. I am also looking at the RE-272, but I am just worried about the cable hardening issue on some of the Hifiman earphones.


 
   
  I really would not recommend the GR07 if you're worried about treble fatigue.
   
  The e-Q5 is overall brighter than the EPH-100 and generally sounds wider and more airy. The EPH-100 has significantly more bass and a bit less treble. e-Q5 bass quantity is still bigger than that of the HF5 but not by a large chunk.
   
  The only real issue I have with the RE272 - and I say this as a fan of Etys and TWFK-based earphones that many consider bass-light - is that the bass ends up too far back in the mix.


----------



## koonhua90

Thanks ljoker. At the price of about $280 (right now $248 on musicaacoustics), the e-Q5 don't look that enticing to me. 
   
  But if I buy through Amazon Jp, and use Tenso to forward it to me, the total comes down to less than $200. At that price it becomes much more attractive. I think I can make compromise with whatever possible shortcomings that the e-Q5 might have. I realized while I am on-the-go, there is always environmental noise and I don't need the best SQ.
   
  I know from first look that the tips of the Yamaha will give me problems, and nowadays I am not too into experimenting with swapping tips on iems.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have one on loan, though the review might be a little delayed because I need to spend extra time with the K3003 and other high-end stuff.


 
  looking forward to it!

 I find them a little sibilant, but apart from that excellent - can i justify the price tag...probably not.


----------



## NuckinFutz

xinn3r said:


> Well, fate brought me FXT90 instead...
> I found a cheap slightly used pair of FXT90 and decided to purchase it...
> 
> Timbre is very very good.... Guitar is really amazing on these....




Guitars better than on gr07?


----------



## steelgtr

Klipsch S4 Reference:
   
  Are they in here?  Sorry if I missed them?
   
  thx
   
  bob


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





steelgtr said:


> Klipsch S4 Reference:


 
   
  According to Klipsch themselves (someone e-mailed them and asked) the S4 Reference is sonically identical to the S4; it merely sports an improved cable and the copper color scheme.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





nuckinfutz said:


> Guitars better than on gr07?


 
   
  IMO, yes, instruments sounds better on the FXT90... perhaps because of the thicker note presentation and/or longer decay....
   
  Also, for those wondering, there is a little driver flex... nothing serious though...


----------



## TheKillerPiglet

I would like to request some advice or general direction.
   
  Of the top, let's say 20 or so IEM's, customs excluded, which have the best isolation after the Ety ER-4's (I already own these). Alternatively, which of said subset of IEM's can be fitted with Ety tips without compromising the music.
   
  Usually travel 2-3 weeks a month, and really want have a change of pace on the planes, but the isolation of Ety's is so much better at isolation that anything else I own...
   
  KP


----------



## imackler

I'm having an issue with the GR06. One nozzle swivels _much _more freely than the other so much so that it doesn't stay in place in the ear as I insert them. The other side is movable but much more firm. This seems not right... I'm trying to determine if my pair is faulty.
   
  But they sound stellar! Really impressed w/ the mids. At this price point, shockingly good.


----------



## kanuka

why not claiming for the warranty?


----------



## imackler

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> why not claiming for the warranty?


 
   
  Just trying to figure out what normal is first! Sorry, didn't want to hijack the thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





koonhua90 said:


> Thanks ljoker. At the price of about $280 (right now $248 on musicaacoustics), the e-Q5 don't look that enticing to me.
> 
> But if I buy through Amazon Jp, and use Tenso to forward it to me, the total comes down to less than $200. At that price it becomes much more attractive. I think I can make compromise with whatever possible shortcomings that the e-Q5 might have. I realized while I am on-the-go, there is always environmental noise and I don't need the best SQ.
> 
> I know from first look that the tips of the Yamaha will give me problems, and nowadays I am not too into experimenting with swapping tips on iems.


 
   
  I thought the same about the stock Yamaha tips but they were surprisingly comfortable for me. Plus, standard silicone tips (of the 5.5mm Sennheiser/UE and many others use) generally fit on them. The e-Q5 is the more accurate earphone but has less bass than the EPH-100 and is a little brighter (albeit quite smooth). For what I think you want I would put it slightly below the e-Q7 and EPH-100 but it's definitely a solid set.
   
   
  Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> looking forward to it!
> 
> I find them a little sibilant, but apart from that excellent - can i justify the price tag...probably not.


 
   
  I think as with the first PFEs it depends on the filters. The gray filters have the best detail and resolution but overstep the sibilance/brightness line for me here and there. They remind me of the K3003 with the +treble filters, which do (almost) the same thing. 
   
   
  Quote: 





thekillerpiglet said:


> I would like to request some advice or general direction.
> 
> Of the top, let's say 20 or so IEM's, customs excluded, which have the best isolation after the Ety ER-4's (I already own these). Alternatively, which of said subset of IEM's can be fitted with Ety tips without compromising the music.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Higher-end Westone/Shure IEMs generally work with Ety tips or have their own triples and isolate quite well. q-JAYS and Fischer DBA-02 mkII can isolate a lot too.
   
   
  Quote: 





imackler said:


> I'm having an issue with the GR06. One nozzle swivels _much _more freely than the other so much so that it doesn't stay in place in the ear as I insert them. The other side is movable but much more firm. This seems not right... I'm trying to determine if my pair is faulty.
> 
> But they sound stellar! Really impressed w/ the mids. At this price point, shockingly good.


 
   
  I would consider that a defect - the nozzles on my GR06s and GR07s are equally tight/hard to move.


----------



## Techno Kid

Hey joker I hope you'll have the TF10 review up sometime soon as I've wanted to know what you think of for awhile now and it seems like they've been on your in progress list forever, also looking forward to your EPH-100 review.


----------



## mzso

ljokerl said:


> Entirely possible, I think some of the stores I used to buy these from don't even exist anymore. If you can spend $10-15 the Philips SHE3580 isolates pretty well (3-3.5 on the scale on the front page) and sounds excellent.



Thanks for the tip. Although it seems only the 3853 is sold here. I guess because its the pink variant... Isn't it?
Are other philipses of similar quality or is this the only decent one? (The 3680 looks quite the same) Or is there anything similar in the price range? (Some people mentioned Panasonic RP-HJE120 although they weren't to detailed, especially on isolation.)

(Or maybe I'll just paint it black  )


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Hey joker I hope you'll have the TF10 review up sometime soon as I've wanted to know what you think of for awhile now and it seems like they've been on your in progress list forever, also looking forward to your EPH-100 review.


 
   
  If there were 30 hours to a day the list would be a lot shorter 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
  Quote: 





mzso said:


> Thanks for the tip. Although it seems only the 3853 is sold here. I guess because its the pink variant... Isn't it?
> Are other philipses of similar quality or is this the only decent one? (The 3680 looks quite the same) Or is there anything similar in the price range?
> (Or maybe I'll just paint it black
> 
> ...


 
   
  The only other Philips IEM I have is the SHO2200 "Tread" which doesn't sound as good as the SHE3850. Other options... JVC Marshallows are a classic and you may be able to find the older versions cheaper.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think as with the first PFEs it depends on the filters. The gray filters have the best detail and resolution but overstep the sibilance/brightness line for me here and there. They remind me of the K3003 with the +treble filters, which do (almost) the same thing.


 
  Oh totally agree!
  The grey filters have the best detail and mids...but at times feel a little too sibilant and bright.
  That said, I try to tone it down with some Comply tips, and it becomes very much enjoyable.
  Using the P series complys on them at the moment.
   
  And remind u of the k3003's? This should be fun and entertaining.
  I can't really justify the £400 price tag, but don't even want to make any comments about that £1k price tag...
  Value 4/10? lol


----------



## Seijuro808

Great thread, joker. Really nice reviews with pricing and rankings.
   
  Looking forward to your in progress reviews of the UE's older line of IEM's.
   
  I've had UE Superfi5 pros for a long time, maybe 4-5yrs+. And they were my first step into the hi-fi world. Bought them for about $160 back then, and really enjoyed them.
   
  Fast forward to present day, and the Triplefi10's are now about the same price. After my puppy completely shattered my 5's, I quickly bought a new, but affordable replacement, some full sized ATH-M50. Though I enjoy the full, closed, and bassy sound, I do miss the portability of my UE's.
   
  I'm hoping to put together a cost efficient but still great sounding portable rig in the future, and I would really like to know how the superfi5's and the TF10's stack up to today's newer IEMs. Especially since the TF10's price went from $400 to $180.


----------



## Niyologist

The DUNU DC4 sounds very interesting:
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/607392/review-dunu-dc4-custom-iem-4-ways-to-virtue
   
  Sounds like a CIEM I can get into.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





totally dubbed said:


> Oh totally agree!
> The grey filters have the best detail and mids...but at times feel a little too sibilant and bright.
> That said, I try to tone it down with some Comply tips, and it becomes very much enjoyable.
> Using the P series complys on them at the moment.
> ...


 
   
  Giving an extremely low value score to a product like that doesn't really serve any purpose in my mind, and I know that's pretty much word for word what I said back when I started evaluating $200+ IEMs - how times have changed. It's pretty obvious that these types of products are blisteringly expensive but as far as I'm concerned a very low value score implies that even those who have the money are better off buying something else. Like the Fitear MH334 and several FADs these AKGs are a niche product pretty much in a class of their own and I don't see why those who can afford them shouldn't get them. From a numbers perspective, the FAD FI-BA-SS got a value score of 7 or so and the AKGs are much more versatile 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
   
  Quote: 





seijuro808 said:


> Great thread, joker. Really nice reviews with pricing and rankings.
> 
> Looking forward to your in progress reviews of the UE's older line of IEM's.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks.
   
  I really don't think the price drop on the TF10 in the past two years has been accidental as it has kept them more or less competitive with modern sets. High bang/buck dynamics such as the VSonic GR07, Yamaha EPH-100, JVC FXT90 / FX500, and others easily put the TF10s to shame at MSRP.


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Ah well said.
Thing is for me, it's a universal...not a custom, doesn't even have removal cables if I'm not mistaken
Long story short it's as you said niche, if anything very niche...


----------



## mzso

ljokerl said:


> The only other Philips IEM I have is the SHO2200 "Tread" which doesn't sound as good as the SHE3850. Other options... JVC Marshallows are a classic and you may be able to find the older versions cheaper.



Thanks again!


----------



## Amitl

hi Joker!
  i went on to order the id America Spark after reading a couple of good
  reviews and your review on them...and then i stumble upon this
  review from gadgetsteria.com which says:
   
  "Like many earphones (and headphones in general), the Sparks are built to favor the low end. For music such s rap, hip/hop, dub step, electronic, etc, the Sparks were adequate in bass quantity. Quality, however, was lacking. Even on that music any high end frequencies were heavily suppressed. Add to that a narrow sound stage and you’ve got a pretty poor listening experience.
  Venturing out to other types of music was even more disappointing. Running through Dave Matthews Band’s “Ku Krux King” as well as a couple of songs by “The Black Ghosts” was lifeless, muffled, and overall just terrible sounding. If we could come up with an easy way to describe it, we’d say it’s similar to going to a concert and putting your hands tightly over your ears. When you do that, you’ll notice that the highs and upper mid-range frequencies suffer the most. That’s what it was like with the Sparks.
  We could go on about sound quality based on a per-artist basis, but really there’s no point."
   
  how could this be? is the audio quality of an earphone THAT much of a subjective matter?
  the reviewer says he recommends the Vibrato Remix instead of the Spark...he also says
  he would think it is better to add 30$ and go for the shure 215... what do you think joker?
  thank you very much !!


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's not going to be more isolating if you're wearing it with a shallow seal. The only real reservation I have about Xears products is long-term durability. Otherwise the TD4 should be a great option.


 
   
  Hi ljokerl, thanks for the Spark recommendation, my friend is very happy with it - he says it sounds better than any other earphones he's had, and since he recently lost a pair of Image X10s, I can only assume that he's getting a proper seal for the first time, since he hates earphones that go far in his ear.  Very much appreciated!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> how could this be? is the audio quality of an earphone THAT much of a subjective matter?
> the reviewer says he recommends the Vibrato Remix instead of the Spark...he also says
> he would think it is better to add 30$ and go for the shure 215... what do you think joker?
> thank you very much !!


 
   
  Sorry, I don't comment on others' reviews. The Spark is by no means a Hi-Fi listening experience but it's fun and not terribly flawed (especially for the price). You can always just try them and find out for yourself.
   
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl, thanks for the Spark recommendation, my friend is very happy with it - he says it sounds better than any other earphones he's had, and since he recently lost a pair of Image X10s, I can only assume that he's getting a proper seal for the first time, since he hates earphones that go far in his ear.  Very much appreciated!


 
   
  Yes, sounds like a seal issue with the X10s. Glad he's enjoying the Sparks!


----------



## Amitl

Joker...im just so confused...you said the Spark is by no means a Hi-Fi
  stereo headphone...so my question is :
  is the Klipsch S4 more of a Hi-Fi earphone?
  and what about the Visang r03?
  thank you !!!


----------



## suman134

nope the image s4 is not hi-fi , its too much colored and bass heavy , vsing r03 is better but will not say them to be hifi too , for me hi-fi starts at cc51 and se215 . if you are not behind bass consider a151 and if you are behind bass then go for ue400/500 , if budget allows go for cc51 , the first look may not impress you , but after putting then nicely inside your ears you will love them .
  you should think about these three :- a151 , vsing r03 , and cc51 . if these are available there .


----------



## rroseperry

Hi |joker|, do you have a recommendation for a detailed iem with good bass? 

This thread has been such a resource. I can't thank you enough.


----------



## Amitl

Suman... thanx


----------



## suman134

your welcome amitl , have a nice buy .


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> Hi |joker|, do you have a recommendation for a detailed iem with good bass?
> This thread has been such a resource. I can't thank you enough.


 
  might be worth saying your price range


----------



## Amitl

Suman... i actually already ordered the Sparks... i have a Klipsch Image S4
  pair but i just can't stand how far it goes into my ear canal :|
  i read the Sparks aren't very shallow fitting either, but i hope i'll like'em.
  i was having a hard time deciding between the Sparks and Visang r03...and then
  the Sparks price went down to 36$ in Amazon and i went for it.
  too bad the delivery to Israel is made by an Israeli company that charges
  27$ just for that matter...but oh well! i'll be very unique here wearing these beauties


----------



## rroseperry

totally dubbed said:


> might be worth saying your price range




um, right

Up to about $300, probably


----------



## Totally Dubbed

Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> Up to about $300, probably


 
  If you want detail, I think the BA's is what you would be looking for.
   
  Something like the Westone 2's or 3's are a good/safe bet.
  Let's see what Joker says


----------



## matryx

Hi guys,
   
  I'm looking for a new earphone. I'm currently using the MEElectronics M6-BK-MEE. My budget is $50-$80 CAD. I'm from Canada and I need something I can get here. I notice there are some earphone that ships to Canada from Amazon but not all.
  I want something with amazing bass that won't affect the rest of the spectrum. Something that remains well separated and defined. I will using it for the gym and in the office. I have the Denon D2000 for home use.
   
  Music I listen to is mainly house. I sometimes listen to hip-hop and R&B.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





matryx said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I'm looking for a new earphone. I'm currently using the MEElectronics M6-BK-MEE. My budget is $50-$80 CAD. I'm from Canada and I need something I can get here. I notice there are some earphone that ships to Canada from Amazon but not all.
> I want something with amazing bass that won't affect the rest of the spectrum. Something that remains well separated and defined. I will using it for the gym and in the office. I have the Denon D2000 for home use.
> ...


 
  Hard to beat the E10 for the price.


----------



## Amitl

DannyBai : the e10 is 35$


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





amitl said:


> DannyBai : the e10 is 35$


 
  To me, the E10 beats several earphones priced $50 or more.  All I'm suggesting is that the E10 and E30 are amazing sounding iem's at a low price point.  I'd rather spend $35 and use the rest on something else then get a $80 earphone when there's such awesome competition at a lower cost.  I've had at least 70 earphones listed on this thread and the E10 and E30 stays in my stable.


----------



## matryx

Thanks for the suggestions. So the E10 and E30. Which one is better? E30 is like $5 more so it doesn't really matter to me. Only place I could find it was MP4nation. Couldn't get it to ship to Canada at the miccastore.
   
  I was looking around and found the Klipsch Image S4 for $68 and the ship to Canada. Is that a good deal?
  Also the Shure SE215-K on sale for $99 at Amazon.com looks like something I might be interested into. Is there a big difference jumping for a $40 E30 to $100 Shure SE215-K?
[size=1.7em]  [/size]


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





matryx said:


> I was looking around and found the Klipsch Image S4 for $68 and the ship to Canada. Is that a good deal?


 
  No. There are several iems that sound better than the S4, and cost less.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





matryx said:


> Thanks for the suggestions. So the E10 and E30. Which one is better? E30 is like $5 more so it doesn't really matter to me. Only place I could find it was MP4nation. Couldn't get it to ship to Canada at the miccastore.
> 
> I was looking around and found the Klipsch Image S4 for $68 and the ship to Canada. Is that a good deal?


 
  E10 has more bass and the rest of the spectrum is not lacking.  E30 is a little more balanced but generally they both sound quite similar. Never heard the S4 but I think it's bass heavy and from what I've read doesn't sound as good as the Soundmagics.  Price seems ok though.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rroseperry said:


> Hi |joker|, do you have a recommendation for a detailed iem with good bass?
> This thread has been such a resource. I can't thank you enough.


 
   
  Depends on how much bass you need - there are decidedly bass-heavy sets with good detail such as the JVC FX700//FX500 and Atrio MG7 as well as more balanced options (that are still not bass-light) - for example the VSonic GR07, Yamaha EPH-100, and Earsonics SM2.
   
   
  Quote: 





matryx said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I'm looking for a new earphone. I'm currently using the MEElectronics M6-BK-MEE. My budget is $50-$80 CAD. I'm from Canada and I need something I can get here. I notice there are some earphone that ships to Canada from Amazon but not all.
> I want something with amazing bass that won't affect the rest of the spectrum. Something that remains well separated and defined. I will using it for the gym and in the office. I have the Denon D2000 for home use.
> ...


 
   
  It's rare for heavy bass not to affect the rest of the spectrum but if you're okay ordering internationally there's a number of choices depending on the exact signature you want - Fischer Eterna and Consonance, Xears TD-III, id America Spark, Soundmagic E10, etc.


----------



## suman134

the sparks are not bad , enjoy .


----------



## suman134

the main trouble with e30 is it lacks treble badly , at least what i felt , bass is good , mid takes 60% of the music . bass is 25-30% and high is 15-10 %  . cant say about e10 , but dont go for image s4 , inspite go for image s3 if kipsch is your liking , or try others , id spark as amitl went for is better then any sound magic in over all quality ( exclude the pl50 ) . or try as i said cc51 and a151 . there is a big difference between a $ 30-40 iem and $100 iem , but dont take the se-215 , its not that awesome when stacked against the re-zero , or sw-xcape , or the m4 , just go for vsonic gr06 its awesome for the price $65 . better then the se-215 .


----------



## Remustan

Joker: I love my DBAs, they just have that fantastic treble and highs and airyness that puts even my FXT-90s to shame.  I love how the mids are just wonderfully in the middle, not forward nor recessed and their soundstage is perfect. I guess I really am a treblehead The FXT-90s just sound muddy and conjested to me, although I've seen so many positive reviews about it, from you, clieos, the appreciation thread and even i2ehan just rated the SQ 4/5, but the DBAs absolutely thrash them for me. Im looking to upgrade the DBAs( if its even possible). Are there any clear upgrades from them ( airy, forward and aggressive treble, detalied, mids , extremely fast bass, extended highs like them )? Or should I just reshell them? How do the re272s scale compared to them. Not interested in ER4s. Thanks!


----------



## FlySweep

remustan said:


> Joker: I love my DBAs, they just have that fantastic treble and highs and airyness that puts even my FXT-90s to shame.  I love how the mids are just wonderfully in the middle, not forward nor recessed and their soundstage is perfect. I guess I really am a treblehead The FXT-90s just sound muddy and conjested to me, although I've seen so many positive reviews about it, from you, clieos, the appreciation thread and even i2ehan just rated the SQ 4/5, but the DBAs absolutely thrash them for me. *Im looking to upgrade the DBAs( if its even possible). Are there any clear upgrades from them ( airy, forward and aggressive treble, detalied, mids , extremely fast bass, extended highs like them )? Or should I just reshell them? How do the re272s scale compared to them.* Not interested in ER4s. Thanks!


 
   
  I reshelled my DBA nearly a year ago & have been very happy with them.  As far as a (universal IEM) upgrade, the Audio Technica CK10 might be a good option (not sure if it's an outright 'upgrade' or more of a sidegrade with different tuning of the TWFK drivers, though).  The CK10 will certainly feed your treble fetish.
   
  As far as customs, average_joe's breathtaking custom IEM review threads should help you find what you're looking for.


----------



## hova

hey guys, i've bought the Xears Bullet XB120Pro a few months ago because i've read the review in this thread and they were cheap. But unfortunately the left earbud broke today.
  So this time i want to buy earphones that have a better build quality. Which one could you recommend? My budget is around 40€/$50. I'd like for them to be a Y-cord this time and not J-cord. thanks.


----------



## ItsMeHere

Quote: 





hova said:


> hey guys, i've bought the Xears Bullet XB120Pro a few months ago because i've read the review in this thread and they were cheap. But unfortunately the left earbud broke today.
> So this time i want to buy earphones that have a better build quality. Which one could you recommend? My budget is around 40€/$50. I'd like for them to be a Y-cord this time and not J-cord. thanks.


 
  Why not check with Xears regarding to the warranty?
  You may be able to get a replacement set.


----------



## hova

Quote: 





itsmehere said:


> Why not check with Xears regarding to the warranty?
> You may be able to get a replacement set.


 

 Thanks for the suggestion but i'm not sure if it's worth it. I got them heavily underpriced and i didn't really like them to be honest.
  I'll consider getting them replaced but please suggest other ones if the warranty doesn't work out. thank you


----------



## Niyologist

New info of the Sennheiser IE800 has been revealed:
   
  http://www.facebook.com/notes/sennheiser-electronic-gmbh-co-kg/in-ear-deluxe-the-new-ie-800-high-end-headphones-from-sennheiser/427920507237500
   
  Frequency: 5 - 46,500 Hz
   
_*"The IE 800 not only boasts innovative technology but also features a modern design and high-quality materials such as the scratch-resistant ceramic housing. Its puristic design language and black/silver finish give it that certain extra. The high-end earphones were developed and designed at Sennheiser's headquarters in Germany. And the new in-ear earphones will be produced here too."*_
   
_*"The interior of the IE 800 conceals many small but effective innovations: the centrepiece is Sennheiser’s specially developed Extra Wide Band (XWB) driver. With a diameter of just 7 mm, it is the smallest wide-band sound transducer currently available in dynamic headphones."*_
   
_*"With the IE 800, Sennheiser has succeeded for the first time in solving what is known as the ‘masking effect’. This effect, which has a negative influence on overall sound quality, is due to the way in which our ears work. “The human ear is unable to perceive low-volume frequency components of a sound if there are much louder sounds occurring in a lower frequency range at the same time,"*_
   
_*"The optimum sound properties of the IE 800 are further enhanced by excellent wearing comfort. The housing is made of scratch-resistant, skin-friendly ceramic, while the ear pads consist of skin friendly silicone. This rules out any risk of allergies or skin irritation. To guarantee a perfect fit, Sennheiser has developed new ear adapters with an oval shape based on extensive international studies in ergonomics. According to their personal preference, users can choose from a selection of oval (SM/ML) and round (S/M/L) adapters. A protective mesh on the ear cushions effectively protects the drivers against dirt contamination."*_
   
_*"This means, for example, that very loud low-frequency sounds will ‘mask’ very quiet sounds in the medium frequency range. This is particularly apparent in in-ear headphones. The sealing of the ear canal by the earphones normally causes resonances that result in a peak in the 7kHz to 8kHz range. This has the effect of masking the actual higher-frequency components. Precisely this problem has been overcome in the IE 800 by the use of an absorber. Sennheiser’s patented dual-chamber system absorbs the energy of the resonance, thus preventing any unwanted peaks. As a result, all frequency components – even the finest nuances – in the music material become audible."*_


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





remustan said:


> Joker: I love my DBAs, they just have that fantastic treble and highs and airyness that puts even my FXT-90s to shame.  I love how the mids are just wonderfully in the middle, not forward nor recessed and their soundstage is perfect. I guess I really am a treblehead The FXT-90s just sound muddy and conjested to me, although I've seen so many positive reviews about it, from you, clieos, the appreciation thread and even i2ehan just rated the SQ 4/5, but the DBAs absolutely thrash them for me. Im looking to upgrade the DBAs( if its even possible). Are there any clear upgrades from them ( airy, forward and aggressive treble, detalied, mids , extremely fast bass, extended highs like them )? Or should I just reshell them? How do the re272s scale compared to them. Not interested in ER4s. Thanks!


 
   
  I don't think there are direct upgrades from the DBA-02 - at that level you'll usually be sacrificing  something - and sometimes a whole lot of something - when moving to another model (as you've learned with the FXT90). The j-Phonic K2 SP comes to mind as one option but I don't think you can even buy it outside of Japan these days. The RE272 is a more laid-back sound compared to the DBA-02 - it is definitely airy, extended, and detailed but if you like the forwardness or the punchiness of the DBA-02 you may miss both with the HiFiMan. Getting them re-shelled or looking at higher-tier customs might be an option. The only one I have that reminds me of the DBA-02 is the ClearTunes CTM-200 but it is again not as forward as the DBAs. I'm sure average_joe or someone else with more customs experience could recommend some other good matches for the DBA sound.
   
  Quote: 





hova said:


> hey guys, i've bought the Xears Bullet XB120Pro a few months ago because i've read the review in this thread and they were cheap. But unfortunately the left earbud broke today.
> So this time i want to buy earphones that have a better build quality. Which one could you recommend? My budget is around 40€/$50. I'd like for them to be a Y-cord this time and not J-cord. thanks.


 
   
  Depends on the sound you want but some decent options might be the Dunu Trident, VSonic GR99, or Brainwavz ProAlpha.


----------



## hova

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Depends on the sound you want but some decent options might be the Dunu Trident, VSonic GR99, or Brainwavz ProAlpha.


 
  Hey man thanks, i just wanted to tell you that i really like your reviews and keep it up.
  I just found that shop called MP4nation, do you know by chance if they can be trusted?


----------



## GigaFi

MP4nation owns the Brainwavz brand.
  Quote: 





hova said:


> Hey man thanks, i just wanted to tell you that i really like your reviews and keep it up.
> I just found that shop called MP4nation, do you know by chance if they can be trusted?


----------



## senKeiser

Hello 
   
  I want to buy some good IEM for 30-40$ with great isolation (mostly for indie/rock music) 
   
  I read that Brainwavz M1 has good reviews for the money. 
   
Should I go with these?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hova said:


> Hey man thanks, i just wanted to tell you that i really like your reviews and keep it up.
> I just found that shop called MP4nation, do you know by chance if they can be trusted?


 
   
   
  Yes, I've purchased from them a number of times. As GigaFi said Brainwavz is their in-house brand and they've been an official retailer for Fiio and Soundmagic products for as long as I can remember.
   
  Quote: 





senkeiser said:


> Hello
> 
> I want to buy some good IEM for 30-40$ with great isolation (mostly for indie/rock music)
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sure, the M1 has a nicely balanced sound and is one of the strongest overall performers in its price range. I wouldn't call its isolation great but it's close to the better sets you'll find in that price range. The Dunu Trident comes to mind as something that isolates a bit more.


----------



## senKeiser

Ok joker, I just bought M1 on mp4nation for 29 bucks  
   
  thanks for your excellent reviews by the way.


----------



## matryx

suman134 said:


> the main trouble with e30 is it lacks treble badly , at least what i felt , bass is good , mid takes 60% of the music . bass is 25-30% and high is 15-10 %  . cant say about e10 , but dont go for image s4 , inspite go for image s3 if kipsch is your liking , or try others , id spark as amitl went for is better then any sound magic in over all quality ( exclude the pl50 ) . or try as i said cc51 and a151 . there is a big difference between a $ 30-40 iem and $100 iem , but dont take the se-215 , its not that awesome when stacked against the re-zero , or sw-xcape , or the m4 , just go for vsonic gr06 its awesome for the price $65 . better then the se-215 .




Thanks for the suggestions. Still a lot of suggestions but narrows it down to 4-5 IEMs. I couldn't find the Vsonic GR06 anywhere besides ebay. Where do you guys suggest I get this? I need it shipped to Canada. 
Another one I'm considering is the ID Spark.


----------



## Reomero

Quote: 





matryx said:


> Thanks for the suggestions. Still a lot of suggestions but narrows it down to 4-5 IEMs. I couldn't find the Vsonic GR06 anywhere besides ebay. Where do you guys suggest I get this? I need it shipped to Canada.
> Another one I'm considering is the ID Spark.


 
   
  The only other place I can think of that sells the GR06 apart from eBay is either LendMeURears or Frogbeats (although Frogbeats is out of stock).


----------



## chrisg4u

I'm stuck between 2 IEM's now. The Shure Se215 and the Westone 1. I don't know which one to choose from :L


----------



## Remustan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think there are direct upgrades from the DBA-02 - at that level you'll usually be sacrificing  something - and sometimes a whole lot of something - when moving to another model (as you've learned with the FXT90). The j-Phonic K2 SP comes to mind as one option but I don't think you can even buy it outside of Japan these days. The RE272 is a more laid-back sound compared to the DBA-02 - it is definitely airy, extended, and detailed but if you like the forwardness or the punchiness of the DBA-02 you may miss both with the HiFiMan. Getting them re-shelled or looking at higher-tier customs might be an option. The only one I have that reminds me of the DBA-02 is the ClearTunes CTM-200 but it is again not as forward as the DBAs. I'm sure average_joe or someone else with more customs experience could recommend some other good matches for the DBA sound.
> 
> 
> Depends on the sound you want but some decent options might be the Dunu Trident, VSonic GR99, or Brainwavz ProAlpha.


 
  How about reducing the treble just a wee bit but retaining the forwardness and airiness? Anything that fits that? How does the EX1000s compare to the DBAs?  I know theyre a little 'soft' and 'mellow'...


----------



## Inks

DBA MKII perhaps, fit and comfort should be an improvement there as well. 
   
  If the CK10 is anything to go by the EX1000 does have a smoother higher treble but it's lower treble peak can make them sound sharper. EX1000 will also not be nearly as good for commuting.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





senkeiser said:


> Ok joker, I just bought M1 on mp4nation for 29 bucks
> 
> thanks for your excellent reviews by the way.


 
   
  Thanks, glad they've been helpful.
    
  Quote:


chrisg4u said:


> I'm stuck between 2 IEM's now. The Shure Se215 and the Westone 1. I don't know which one to choose from :L


 
   
  If you want more bass emphasis go for the SE215 and if you want more midrange emphasis go for the W1.
   
   
  Quote: 





remustan said:


> How about reducing the treble just a wee bit but retaining the forwardness and airiness? Anything that fits that? How does the EX1000s compare to the DBAs?  I know theyre a little 'soft' and 'mellow'...


 
   
  I wouldn't recommend the EX1000 either. The mkII might indeed be an option but you're only looking at incremental changes there. The VSonic GR01 differs more but you give up a little of that forwardness and transparency.


----------



## kanuka

-joker
   
  i'm going for the Mk2, BUT my only worry is the cable AND the lack of cable cinch. the Eterna's cable wasnt that friendly but the cinch really helped as well as the memory effect, and i didnt (and coulndt) use the earguides, and i guess i wont use them with the mk2 too.
   
  is it really THAT bad?? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  for the Eterna price i cant complain, but for the mk2 price i expect something better and easier to use
   
   
  thank you


----------



## chrisg4u

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you want more bass emphasis go for the SE215 and if you want more midrange emphasis go for the W1.


 
  Thanks, think I'm going to go with the SE215 as I listen to a lot of bassy music. Not to mention it's slightly cheaper. Thanks for your help


----------



## james444

Quote: 





remustan said:


> Joker: I love my DBAs, they just have that fantastic treble and highs and airyness that puts even my FXT-90s to shame.  I love how the mids are just wonderfully in the middle, not forward nor recessed and their soundstage is perfect. I guess I really am a treblehead The FXT-90s just sound muddy and conjested to me, although I've seen so many positive reviews about it, from you, clieos, the appreciation thread and even i2ehan just rated the SQ 4/5, but the DBAs absolutely thrash them for me. Im looking to upgrade the DBAs( if its even possible). Are there any clear upgrades from them ( airy, forward and aggressive treble, detalied, mids , extremely fast bass, extended highs like them )? Or should I just reshell them? How do the re272s scale compared to them. Not interested in ER4s. Thanks!


 
   
  If you don't mind their outrageous price tag, you might wanna try the FI-BA-SS. I don't claim that they're better than the DBAs (which I haven't heard), but I prefer them to the Brainwavz B2 and CK10. PM me if you're in the US and want to hear them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> -joker
> 
> i'm going for the Mk2, BUT my only worry is the cable AND the lack of cable cinch. the Eterna's cable wasnt that friendly but the cinch really helped as well as the memory effect, and i didnt (and coulndt) use the earguides, and i guess i wont use them with the mk2 too.
> 
> ...


 
   
  That's something you really have to decide for yourself. I don't mind the lack of a cinch too much but I know some people who end up adding a DIY one to any earphone that hasn't got one stock. I can wear the DBA-02 over-the-ear fine without the cinch but would definitely prefer one. Same goes for my VSonic GR01 and GR06.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's something you really have to decide for yourself. I don't mind the lack of a cinch too much but I know some people who end up *adding a DIY one* to any earphone that hasn't got one stock. I can wear the DBA-02 over-the-ear fine without the cinch but would definitely prefer one. Same goes for my VSonic GR01 and GR06.


 
   
  that seems to be the best option. even for those earphone that has one
  any ideas are welcome


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





james444 said:


> If you don't mind their outrageous price tag, you might wanna try the FI-BA-SS. I don't claim that they're better than the DBAs (which I haven't heard), but I prefer them to the Brainwavz B2 and CK10. PM me if you're in the US and want to hear them.


 
   
  I think they are better than the CK10 and DBA-02 but they are so damn revealing


----------



## kanuka

ljokerl said:


> The W1 is actually pretty compact. Probably about the same as A151 in terms of volume but a little skinnier and definitely easier to sleep/lie down in. The bass is good - maybe a tad less impactful than A151 but still punchier than PL50. *IMO they shine with female vocals*.


 
   
  *this post is about a year ago ! *
   
  do you still hold on that opinion? 
  if i'm not wrong the SBA-03 uses the same driver, but even if not the case, can they match or beat the W1 on that matter?


----------



## Mph12490

I was wondering if you had any opinion about Nocs se? Particularly  Nocs NS400.


----------



## Remustan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, glad they've been helpful.
> 
> If you want more bass emphasis go for the SE215 and if you want more midrange emphasis go for the W1.
> 
> ...


 
  I see, in that case, I'l probably hunt around for a CK10 or reshell them. By the way, why wouldnt you recommend the EX1000?
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> If you don't mind their outrageous price tag, you might wanna try the FI-BA-SS. I don't claim that they're better than the DBAs (which I haven't heard), but I prefer them to the Brainwavz B2 and CK10. PM me if you're in the US and want to hear them.


 
  Oh but I do mind 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Anyway Im not in the US. If you dont mind, James, can you kindly chime in on a short comparison between the EX1000s and the B2s?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> *this post is about a year ago ! *
> 
> do you still hold on that opinion?
> if i'm not wrong the SBA-03 uses the same driver, but even if not the case, can they match or beat the W1 on that matter?


 
   
  I haven't heard the W1 since. They may use the same driver but the tuning is nothing alike. I remember the W1 being mid-centric with roll-off below 60hz and up top. The SBA-03, on the other hand, actually reproduces deep bass and has excellent bass-midrange balance. It is also on the whole a forward, aggressive earphone with very crisp note presentation while the W1 is pretty laid-back and a little smoothed-over (as if there was an acoustic filter added to the SBA-03). For female vocals you may actually want the W1 sound - that way nothing gets in the way - but for accuracy the SBA-03 is definitely superior. 
   
   
  Quote: 





mph12490 said:


> I was wondering if you had any opinion about Nocs se? Particularly  Nocs NS400.


 
   
  Nope, never heard them.
   
   
  Quote: 





remustan said:


> I see, in that case, I'l probably hunt around for a CK10 or reshell them. By the way, why wouldnt you recommend the EX1000?


 
   
  For the reason Inks stated. The EX1000 is many things but an overall reduction in treble it is not.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 





 thank you


----------



## james444

Quote: 





remustan said:


> If you dont mind, James, can you kindly chime in on a short comparison between the EX1000s and the B2s?


 
   
  Take this with a grain of salt, it's more than a year since I last heard my EX1000, plus I've only had the B2s for a short time (though I had the CK10 for longer). Very different beasts imo, the B2s are forward and aggressive, the EX1000 more relaxed and smooth. Please note that I'm not sensitive to the Sony's treble peak that Inks mentioned. On the other hand, I take offense at a certain spike on the B2s and CK10, which make them sound slightly metallic to my ear. The B2's bass is extremely fast and precise, but shows little texture in comparison to the EX1000's. Another big difference in my book is authority. The EX1000 aren't bassy IEMs, but they can effortlessly sound "big" if the music calls for. No offense to all you CK10/B2/DBA fans out there, but I just can't listen to a Mahler symphony with these. I'll gladly take them over the EX1000 though, for any kind of electronic or trance music and probably hard rock and metal too, if I'd listen more to the latter genres. As Inks said, big difference in isolation too, the EX1000 sound extremely open, which makes their presentation spacious but positioning less precise, the B2s sound more closed in but with more accurate imaging.
   
  Overall I'd say, if you want to have two reasonably balanced IEMs that are nothing like each other, it doesn't get much more different than the B2s and EX1000.


----------



## Anaxilus

The only true upgrades I'd consider (that I've heard) over the DBA/B2 are the FI-BA-SS or the UERM.  Until you're ready to make that jump just enjoy what you have in the DBA/B2s.


----------



## sneaglebob

No UE Triple Fi 10 review?


----------



## Gilly87

It's in his list of reviews to come, if you check the OP.
  Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> No UE Triple Fi 10 review?


----------



## rawrster

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> The only true upgrades I'd consider (that I've heard) over the DBA/B2 are the FI-BA-SS or the UERM.  Until you're ready to make that jump just enjoy what you have in the DBA/B2s.


 
   
  Sometimes I wish I had kept my DBA-02 since a good universal comes in handy every once in a while for me.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> No UE Triple Fi 10 review?


 
   
  It was up but I guess he took it down.  You must have missed it.  It was quite surprising.


----------



## sneaglebob

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> It was up but I guess he took it down.  You must have missed it.  It was quite surprising.


 
  Really? What did he/she said about it?


----------



## Gilly87

+1, curious as well o.o


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> Really? What did he/she said about it?


 
   
  I believe that was sarcasm...


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> Really? What did he said about it?


 
   
  That every time someone asks about the TF10 review, he feels compelled to postpone it by a month.
   
  If you go back a few pages, you will find this post


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> That every time someone asks about the TF10 review, he feels compelled to postpone it by a month.
> 
> If you go back a few pages, you will find this post


 
   
  It's good to see that Joker has a sense of humor 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I always thought he was a serious kind of person...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> It was up but I guess he took it down.  You must have missed it.  It was quite surprising.


 
   
  Best post in the thread right here.


----------



## peneloepi01

Sir joker, what will be the next upgrade IEM for me... I'm currently using SoundMagic E30. thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





peneloepi01 said:


> Sir joker, what will be the next upgrade IEM for me... I'm currently using SoundMagic E30. thanks


 
   
  That depends on what you'd like to see improved over the E30 and your budget.


----------



## sneaglebob

Can you give me a final number out of 10 of what you think of UE TF10?


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> Can you give me a final number out of 10 of what you think of UE TF10?


 
   
  I'm sure he'll get around to it after the x-Jays review...


----------



## ljokerl

Added AKG K3003i
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> *(1A3) AKG K3003i*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2012
> ...


----------



## DannyBai

Oh man, don't need that one.


----------



## suman134

mannn !! just look at the price tag , i can buy a sgs3 , and a ck-10 and a re-272 . why wont someone go for customs ? with that price jh audio 16 pro or 13 pro can be brought easily . 8 BAs in one ears will do nearly anything .


----------



## bizkit

What if said person doesn't want customs?


----------



## Ryolith

apparently new skullcandy inkd came out today. would love to know your opinion


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> mannn !! just look at the price tag , i can buy a sgs3 , and a ck-10 and a re-272 . why wont someone go for customs ? with that price jh audio 16 pro or 13 pro can be brought easily . 8 BAs in one ears will do nearly anything .


 
  More drivers doesn't always mean better.  The single dynamic driver Future Sonics MG6 Pro is arguably just as good as the JH16, and while the Westone ES5 only has 5 drivers it is a worthy competitor too.


----------



## suman134

thats why i said nearly , but by the way , i have a trouble , i got cc51p , i wonder if xba-1 and ue 600 worth a fight , i got all at nealy $80 each , cc51 is awesome no doubt , but i just wonder if these two worth a go . what happen when i get money i just cant help it , it gets on my head , got to spend it , and spend it nice . or it will get blown .


----------



## putente

Finally a great review of the K3003! All the others I've seen around here are always a kind of love or hate review! You done it again, *ljokerl*... Thanks! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
   
  P.S.: Can't wait for the GR08...


----------



## shsh

Thanks for the great review of K3003, looking forward to the Fitear MH334 To Go review.


----------



## ProjectDenz

I'm loving the MEElectronics M6. It's so cheap yet it fantastic for the price. Coming from higher end stuff the mids are a little muffled, but overall its an excellent and durable iem for the price. The bass is very nice also, sounds more natural and can feel more air movement than BA style bass.


----------



## steelgtr

Jlab jbud  J4:
   
  Is there a review here?  Just got a pair and not  that impressed.
   
  thx
   
  bob


----------



## Remustan

Oh no...you reviewed the 3003...


----------



## Niyologist

I'm going to have the VSonic GR08 in my possession soon. Maybe sometime around Late 2012. If not that, then the Sennheiser IE800.


----------



## lostid

ljokerl, I enjoyed reading your review on the K3003. How is it compared to the EX1000 in your opinion? Thanks.


----------



## hush4hire

do hifiman re0 still worth to buy today?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





hush4hire said:


> do hifiman re0 still worth to buy today?


 
   
        No, not really. The EX600 and RE272 are huge upgrades in-comparison to the RE0. I'm just going based on the reviews.


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> No, not really. The EX600 and RE272 are huge upgrades in-comparison to the RE0. I'm just going based on the reviews.


 
   
  Both are double the price of the RE0... and while the 272 is similarly analytical to the RE0, the EX600 is much more coloured.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


suman134 said:


> thats why i said nearly , but by the way , i have a trouble , i got cc51p , i wonder if xba-1 and ue 600 worth a fight , i got all at nealy $80 each , cc51 is awesome no doubt , but i just wonder if these two worth a go . what happen when i get money i just cant help it , it gets on my head , got to spend it , and spend it nice . or it will get blown .


 
   
  I only heard the XBA-1 briefly. It seemed good, I liked the signature better than that of the XBA-04, but not sure where it would rate following proper long-term listening tests.
   
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> Finally a great review of the K3003! All the others I've seen around here are always a kind of love or hate review! You done it again, *ljokerl*... Thanks!


 
   
  Quote: 





shsh said:


> Thanks for the great review of K3003, looking forward to the Fitear MH334 To Go review.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





projectdenz said:


> I'm loving the MEElectronics M6. It's so cheap yet it fantastic for the price. Coming from higher end stuff the mids are a little muffled, but overall its an excellent and durable iem for the price. The bass is very nice also, sounds more natural and can feel more air movement than BA style bass.


 
   
  I still have my original red one with copper memory wire 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Terrible cable noise on that old thing but it sounds great.
   
   
  Quote: 





steelgtr said:


> Jlab jbud  J4:
> 
> Is there a review here?  Just got a pair and not  that impressed.


 
   
  Only the J3. I wasn't overly impressed with it.
   
   
  Quote: 





lostid said:


> ljokerl, I enjoyed reading your review on the K3003. How is it compared to the EX1000 in your opinion? Thanks.


 
   
  Thanks. The EX1000 has that headphone-like out-of-the-head presentation that's so different from most IEMs out there. The K3003 is more intimate though it has excellent depth and width still. Signature-wise the K3003 has more bass (esp. mid-bass), similar midrange presence, and smoother lower treble (where the EX1000 has some emphasis). I also thought the K3003 had very good extension whereas the EX1000 didn't impress me in that regard. 
   
   
  Quote: 





hush4hire said:


> do hifiman re0 still worth to buy today?


 
   
  Can't think of anything I'd rather listen to for $79 but it's not quite as far ahead of the competition as it once was.


----------



## suman134

do you have time for any of the two ?


----------



## suman134

in ears are too much , lets go earbuds , is there a nice budget earbud that out dose the mx 470 ? should not be over $40 .


----------



## kanuka

maybe the blox m2c...
  but they'r out of stock


----------



## kanuka

are there some alternatives to the fxt90, with more isolation?


----------



## Amitl

id America Spark
  ********************
  i just received my id America Sparks today.
  unfortunately they don't seem to support my Samsung Galaxy S.
  the "Play/Pause" button has to remain being pressed for them
  to sound good.
  i wrapped a rubber band around it so that it would remain pressed down,
  and i just wanted to try and ask if anyone know of a better solution?
  and would it be likely that the button will break since it is being pressed down
  all the time?
  such a shame that this wonderful set of phones has this compatibility issue.
  they sound really good, just as i hoped.
  as good as my Klipsch Image S4 without the harshness.
  thanks


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> are there some alternatives to the fxt90, with more isolation?


 
  Have you tried the FXT90 with other tips like Sony Hybrids?
  The ergonomic FXT90 fits perfectly for me, so isolation is actually very good for me
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> id America Spark
> ********************
> i just received my id America Sparks today.
> unfortunately they don't seem to support my Samsung Galaxy S.
> ...


 
   
  That's really weird.... a normal IEM should play normally regardless of the compability of the buttons....
  Usually if the buttons are incompatible, the buttons just don't work... it shouldn't effect the playback of the phone... 
   
  Joker, what other IEM's has similar cable like the FXT90? I really really like them... it's....really soft and memory free...
  I believe the word I'm looking for is flexible... you can shape it however you like, it just doesn't fight... It's even more flexible than the CK10 cable
  I never found a cable I like as much as this...


----------



## Amitl

Xinn3r i know it's weird but it's how it is


----------



## outeirino

AKG K3003i ...... Ummm! i'm thinking in the Vsonic GR08


----------



## matryx

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Depends on how much bass you need - there are decidedly bass-heavy sets with good detail such as the JVC FX700//FX500 and Atrio MG7 as well as more balanced options (that are still not bass-light) - for example the VSonic GR07, Yamaha EPH-100, and Earsonics SM2.
> 
> 
> 
> It's rare for heavy bass not to affect the rest of the spectrum but if you're okay ordering internationally there's a number of choices depending on the exact signature you want - Fischer Eterna and Consonance, Xears TD-III, id America Spark, Soundmagic E10, etc.


 
   
  Thank you for the help. OK I'm thinking of getting the VR06. It's cheaper than the id American Sparks since it has free shipping to Canada. The Spark will cost me an extra $18 to get it to ship to Canada. The E10 looks like it has good value but I'm willing to spend a bit more for going up a tier. Is there a big difference between the E10 and sparks or VR60?


----------



## Gilly87

I can't wait to hear about the GR08...I think there's a chance it will be neck-and-neck with the UM Merlin for my next major purchase.
  Quote: 





outeirino said:


> AKG K3003i ...... Ummm! i'm thinking in the Vsonic GR08


----------



## lostid

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> I can't wait to hear about the GR08...I think there's a chance it will be neck-and-neck with the UM Merlin for my next major purchase.


 
   
  The GR08 will be sold at roughly USD 500.


----------



## ItsMeHere

Quote: 





lostid said:


> The GR08 will be sold at roughly USD 500.


 
  What's your source?
  There were rumors about a price of around $320...


----------



## imackler

Didn't ClieOS report it was going to be $320 USD?
  Quote: 





lostid said:


> The GR08 will be sold at roughly USD 500.


----------



## lostid

From the Chinese source I read, it will be priced at Chinese $ RMB3,000.


----------



## Angelopsaro

Not a biggy.. but how come Joker gave 5/5 to the k3003 for accessories? 3 pair of tips, 2 adaptors, 3 filters and a leather pouch is not something i would say plethora of accessories.. is it because the have the criteria to be considered full pack of accessories?
  Again no biggy, just chatting around.


----------



## Gilly87

Seems like plenty of accessories, and I'm assuming they are all of solid quality. The filter system is pretty advanced as far as accessories go.
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Not a biggy.. but how come Joker gave 5/5 to the k3003 for accessories? 3 pair of tips, 2 adaptors, 3 filters and a leather pouch is not something i would say plethora of accessories.. is it because the have the criteria to be considered full pack of accessories?
> Again no biggy, just chatting around.


----------



## imackler

But a leather pouch?! I wish every iem sold came with an ultimate ears case like the triple.fi 10 came with.
   
  Edit: well after actually looking at it, I guess that is not that bad. Still kind of weird. And that thing about the airline adapter fitting...I know I've used my airline adapter...never.
  Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Seems like plenty of accessories, and I'm assuming they are all of solid quality. The filter system is pretty advanced as far as accessories go.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> do you have time for any of the two ?


 
  Nope
   
   Quote:


kanuka said:


> are there some alternatives to the fxt90, with more isolation?


 
  Yamaha EPH-100
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> id America Spark
> ********************
> i just received my id America Sparks today.
> unfortunately they don't seem to support my Samsung Galaxy S.
> ...


 
   
  AFAIK the Galaxy S does not support the standard iPhone headset configuration. Pretty sure you need one of these: http://www.meelec.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=ADPTR-TRRS-35
   
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, what other IEM's has similar cable like the FXT90? I really really like them... it's....really soft and memory free...
> I believe the word I'm looking for is flexible... you can shape it however you like, it just doesn't fight... It's even more flexible than the CK10 cable
> I never found a cable I like as much as this...


 
   
  Other high-end JVCs all have similar cables.
   
   
  Quote: 





matryx said:


> Thank you for the help. OK I'm thinking of getting the VR06. It's cheaper than the id American Sparks since it has free shipping to Canada. The Spark will cost me an extra $18 to get it to ship to Canada. The E10 looks like it has good value but I'm willing to spend a bit more for going up a tier. Is there a big difference between the E10 and sparks or VR60?


 
   
  The GR06 is more balanced than bass-heavy. Doesn't seem like that's what you wanted but it is a good headphone.
   
   
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Not a biggy.. but how come Joker gave 5/5 to the k3003 for accessories? 3 pair of tips, 2 adaptors, 3 filters and a leather pouch is not something i would say plethora of accessories.. is it because the have the criteria to be considered full pack of accessories?
> Again no biggy, just chatting around.


 
   
  Quality and quantity. Everything is very well-made and I do quite like how the filters work (Phonak filters are a pain in the *** in comparison). I also appreciate that they've thought of non-apple users by including a TRS adapter (though a non-i option would have been just as good). The case is quite protective as well though I would never use it because I hate cable winders.


----------



## ringyring

Which iems would recommend for amazing vocals? Not really looking to buy, just wondering which ones stood out the most.


----------



## sneaglebob

Hey which one of these IEM's should I buy? Klipsch x10 or Monster turbine pro gold. I'm looking for pounding bass and clear detailed treble.
   
  I can find them both on a similar low price range of around 200 bucks on amazon so which one should I get?


----------



## Gilly87

US always has lower prices, duh.
  Quote: 





lostid said:


> From the Chinese source I read, it will be priced at Chinese $ RMB3,000.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> Hey which one of these IEM's should I buy? Klipsch x10 or Monster turbine pro gold. I'm looking for pounding bass and clear detailed treble.
> 
> I can find them both on a similar low price range of around 200 bucks on amazon so which one should I get?


 
  Wait till November and get a TF10 during Black Friday for $99.  Or find a used/comparable one.  Assuming you have a DAP or amp w/ low output impedance.


----------



## sneaglebob

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Wait till November and get a TF10 during Black Friday for $99.  Or find a used/comparable one.  Assuming you have a DAP or amp w/ low output impedance.


 
  I already know about the tf10. But I need headphones now so I am currently deciding between MTPG and X10


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ringyring said:


> Which iems would recommend for amazing vocals? Not really looking to buy, just wondering which ones stood out the most.


 
   
  Really depends on what type of vocal presentation you like. There's no right or wrong answer - some like vocals to be extremely clear and breathy (e.g. FAD FI-BA-SS) and others prefer a warmer, thicker, more lush and seductive presentation (e.g. Earsonics SM2). I like the FitEar MH334 myself 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> Hey which one of these IEM's should I buy? Klipsch x10 or Monster turbine pro gold. I'm looking for pounding bass and clear detailed treble.
> 
> I can find them both on a similar low price range of around 200 bucks on amazon so which one should I get?


 
   
  Honestly, neither, but if you must have one of these two go for the Golds. The X10 has strong, punchy bass but it's BA-based so really not what I would think qualifies as 'pounding'. The Golds on the other hand have thicker bass notes and move more air (though they really aren't all that bassy) but they don't have the best treble quality. Personally I would instead go for a JVC FX500.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Other high-end JVCs all have similar cables.


 
  Gotcha! Thx!
   
  Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> US always has lower prices, duh.


 
  This is not entirely true... about 90% of China's and other neighboring country's product is cheaper in China.. such as Japan... brand new FXT90 is under 100$ here, as well as the EPH-100...
  Similarly, almost all U.S brands will be cheaper in the U.S than in China


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Honestly, neither, but if you must have one of these two go for the Golds. The X10 has strong, punchy bass but it's BA-based so really not what I would think qualifies as 'pounding'. The Golds on the other hand have thicker bass notes and move more air (though they really aren't all that bassy) but they don't have the best treble quality. Personally I would instead go for a JVC FX500.


 
   
  Amen to that. Was about to say pretty much the same thing, but might add that the FX500 have noticably less isolation than the others.
   
  @Joker, once again a very nice review (K3003i), thanks. Fingers crossed for your 5/5 build quality rating, as I don't really trust their upper cables, which are allowed to move freely inside the sheath.
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, what other IEM's has similar cable like the FXT90? I really really like them... it's....really soft and memory free...
> I believe the word I'm looking for is flexible... you can shape it however you like, it just doesn't fight... It's even more flexible than the CK10 cable
> I never found a cable I like as much as this...


 
   
  Apart from the JVCs, the Philips SHE9900 have a similarly flexible cable, one of the best I've ever seen. Actually pretty amazing for the price range.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





james444 said:


> @Joker, once again a very nice review (K3003i), thanks. Fingers crossed for your 5/5 build quality rating, as I don't really trust their upper cables, which are allowed to move freely inside the sheath.


 
   
  Agreed on the cables above the split, really the only potential weakness. This type of sheath has worked well for me in the past, though, so fingers crossed. Only time will tell with certainty - I've had them since February and all good so far.


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, any first impressions on the Astrotec AM-90? How does it stack against the MEElec A151? ClieOS says it really is similar in performance and signature...
   


> Apart from the JVCs, the Philips SHE9900 have a similarly flexible cable, one of the best I've ever seen. Actually pretty amazing for the price range.


 
  Thx for the suggestion!


----------



## sneaglebob

So which one?


----------



## PakoBoy

Hey Joker could you help me getting a iem with good isolation.
  i have the brainwavz m1 but i need much better isolation. I was thinking about the PL50 but you gave it a 3 for isolation and the m1 a 3,5 so i geus that wouldn't be a good choice.
   
  budget is about $50, i prefer a over the ear design and want a mid centric or balanced sound.
   
  thx
  S.


----------



## ringyring

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Really depends on what type of vocal presentation you like. There's no right or wrong answer - some like vocals to be extremely clear and breathy (e.g. FAD FI-BA-SS) and others prefer a warmer, thicker, more lush and seductive presentation (e.g. Earsonics SM2). I like the FitEar MH334 myself
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, any first impressions on the Astrotec AM-90? How does it stack against the MEElec A151? ClieOS says it really is similar in performance and signature...


 
   
  Yeah, I think Astrotec got it right with this one. I have not A:Bed with A151 yet but without a direct comparison it does sound pretty similar. Better than that, I very much like the build quality and fit. Also the accessory pack. Pretty much everything about it, really. Keep in mind the A151 is currently pretty cheap here in the US (usually <$55) so it'll be interesting to see which comes out on top.
   
   
  Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> Hey Joker could you help me getting a iem with good isolation.
> i have the brainwavz m1 but i need much better isolation. I was thinking about the PL50 but you gave it a 3 for isolation and the m1 a 3,5 so i geus that wouldn't be a good choice.
> 
> budget is about $50, i prefer a over the ear design and want a mid centric or balanced sound.
> ...


 
   
  MEElec A151 if you're in the US. You may even have budget left over for some Complys. Otherwise you may want to go for a straight-barrel and wear it over-the-ear - an Etymotic MC5 or EtyKids would be the best bet for isolation.


----------



## Solictice

Hello
   
  My ViSang R03 have broken down, unfortunately. So I'm looking for replacements, around the same price as the ViSangs. Which would be aprox. €50 or $65.
   
  Sofar the Vsonic GR06 have caught my attention, but also the cheaper GR02 Bass edition. The last one isn't included in the reviews yet, so I'm wondering if anyone can help me out here.
  I really want the best for my money,
   
  I will use them on a iPod classic 120gb, although I'm considering getting a Sansa because I've heard many good things about it's equalizer.
  I do not have an amp. I mostly listen to metal, rock and some drum &bass/dubstep.
   
   
   
  If there are other IEM's I should look at in this price range, please tell me.
   
   

 Thanks.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah, I think Astrotec got it right with this one. I have not A:Bed with A151 yet but without a direct comparison it does sound pretty similar. Better than that, I very much like the build quality and fit. Also the accessory pack. Pretty much everything about it, really. Keep in mind the A151 is currently pretty cheap here in the US (usually <$55) so it'll be interesting to see which comes out on top.


 
   
  Yup, and it's their first IEM to boot!
  Can't wait for the review! Really interested to see who'll win... from a usability standpoint (comfort, isolation, etc) it seems both are also very good it seems....


----------



## airomjosh

> Yeah, I think Astrotec got it right with this one. I have not A:Bed with A151 yet but without a direct comparison it does sound pretty similar. Better than that, I very much like the build quality and fit. Also the accessory pack. Pretty much everything about it, really. Keep in mind the A151 is currently pretty cheap here in the US (usually <$55) so it'll be interesting to see which comes out on top.


 
  Just bought Astrotec AM90 for only 168 yuan(about 26 USD). If they sound pretty similar , then I guess, Astrotec would probably be on top of A151


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> Just bought Astrotec AM90 for only 168 yuan(about 26 USD). If they sound pretty similar , then I guess, Astrotec would probably be on top of A151


 
   
  Yes, that is true, in China, the MSRP is 168RMB....
  But the price would only be half the story... SQ and usability will be taken into account too....


----------



## matryx

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR06 is more balanced than bass-heavy. Doesn't seem like that's what you wanted but it is a good headphone.


 
   
  Didn't realize the GR06 wasn't bass-heavy. I have a friend going to the states so I'll be able to save on shipping now. Now it's back to the E10 or the id Sparks. Which one has a better soundstage? How does the bass from the E10 compare to the Sparks?
   
  I'm finding picking an IEM is a lot harder than choosing a headphone. There is much more choice under the $100 than for headphones.


----------



## sneaglebob

So nobody knows which one is better about the mtpg or the klipsch x10?


----------



## jjmai

So who's the rich billionaire that loaned K3003i to Joker?
  ......jealous.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





solictice said:


> Hello
> 
> My ViSang R03 have broken down, unfortunately. So I'm looking for replacements, around the same price as the ViSangs. Which would be aprox. €50 or $65.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Not sure what I think of the GR02 yet but the GR06 is a great buy with that budget.
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> Just bought Astrotec AM90 for only 168 yuan(about 26 USD). If they sound pretty similar , then I guess, Astrotec would probably be on top of A151


 
   
  I was thinking which one will land higher on the chart - the price only comes into play there when two IEMs tie with the same average score.
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





matryx said:


> Didn't realize the GR06 wasn't bass-heavy. I have a friend going to the states so I'll be able to save on shipping now. Now it's back to the E10 or the id Sparks. Which one has a better soundstage? How does the bass from the E10 compare to the Sparks?
> 
> I'm finding picking an IEM is a lot harder than choosing a headphone. There is much more choice under the $100 than for headphones.


 
   
  The E10 has a wider/more spacious stage but the Sparks have slightly better layering and separation. The Sparks have harder-hitting, more explosive bass while the E10's bass is a little softer and slower.
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





jjmai said:


> So who's the rich billionaire that loaned K3003i to Joker?
> ......jealous.


 
   
  It's on loan from uncle AKG


----------



## matryx

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The E10 has a wider/more spacious stage but the Sparks have slightly better layering and separation. The Sparks have harder-hitting, more explosive bass while the E10's bass is a little softer and slower.


 
   
  When you guys are talking about bass, are you talking about mid-bass or sub-bass. I realize I like more mid-bass after purchasing the Denon D2000 which everyone says have hard hitting sub-bass. At the time I was deciding between the Denon D2000 and the Ultrasone PRO 900. From what I hear the bass on the Ultrasone PRO 900 has good mid-bass. 
   
  So since I'm looking for mid-bass to listen to house music which one of these iem has a stronger mid-bass?
   
  I've also ran across the MEElectronics A151-BK selling for $52 at Amazon.com. Seems like a real good price drop considering that the MEE website sells it for $75.
   
  EDIT: Just read a review that the A151 isn't what I'm looking for but still a great deal I think.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





matryx said:


> When you guys are talking about bass, are you talking about mid-bass or sub-bass. I realize I like more mid-bass after purchasing the Denon D2000 which everyone says have hard hitting sub-bass. At the time I was deciding between the Denon D2000 and the Ultrasone PRO 900. From what I hear the bass on the Ultrasone PRO 900 has good mid-bass.
> 
> So since I'm looking for mid-bass to listen to house music which one of these iem has a stronger mid-bass?


 
   
  The D2k wasn't overly bassy for me, not in the way the lower-end D1100 was. The TFTA 1V probably has the most mid-bass I've heard from an IEM.


----------



## Sweden

joker what would be your favorite picks for two training in-ear below 100? Something that have good comfort, great cable with no microphonics and stays in the ear.
  One that is balanced, have good midrange and would work great for rock and metal and one with stronger bass that would suit bassheavy electronic music.


----------



## Spaz115

What are your thoughts on the Denon C710? No review of them in this thread, and right now im thinking of either those or the FXT-90's. How different are they, and which are better for all around use? Also what are some other options in that kind of price range? ~130USD


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> MEElec A151 if you're in the US. You may even have budget left over for some Complys. Otherwise you may want to go for a straight-barrel and wear it over-the-ear - an Etymotic MC5 or EtyKids would be the best bet for isolation.


 
   
  i dont live in the US so the A151 is more tha $50 for me.
  how does the Astrotec AM-90 isolate?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  they'r $50 at ebay, shipping is $7 though


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If that 50% off MG7 coupon is still active that would be one. Otherwise the Hippo VB or maybe even Velodyne vPulse.


 
   
  Thanks joker, I have purchased MG7 from ebay. It will take approx. 15 days to reach me.
   
  So Atrio MG7 is the best IEM when it comes to bass quantity and quality?
   
  Does it has more bass than the Brainwavz M2 and Eterna V1?
   
  Also Does Atrio MG7 needs any portable AMP to reveal it's true potential?
   
  I have Nationite Nanite N2.


----------



## AstralStorm

Hey.
   
  Here I've had the custom monitors done and these *still* need balancing. Oh well.
  (These Spiral Ear SE-5 Reference are balanced about like bright Beyerdynamic T1. Other than this, I think nothing can beat the quality.
  For fans of graphs, here's the correction: http://ompldr.org/vZG9jdg )
   
  I'd like something for portable use when I can't use the equalizer rig,
  that's balanced and built for quality like Monster Turbine Pro Gold, but with better ergonomics and less bling.
  Deep fit IEMs are better as shallow fit is hard due to a narrow part of ear canal.
  Perhaps like Brainwavz B2, but better.
  Fisher's new DBA-02 mkII? But those are for shallow fit and I have problems with that.
   
  Any recommendations?


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> (Perhaps like Brainwavz B2, but better. Fisher's new DBA-02 mkII? But those are for shallow fit and I have problems with that.)


 
   
  The MKII isn't for shallow fit. If anything, it's a lot easier to achieve a deep fit with it. What gave you that impression?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sweden said:


> joker what would be your favorite picks for two training in-ear below 100? Something that have good comfort, great cable with no microphonics and stays in the ear.
> One that is balanced, have good midrange and would work great for rock and metal and one with stronger bass that would suit bassheavy electronic music.


 
   
  Westone 1 is around that price. Also VSonic GR06 + cable guides. For stronger bass maybe the Shure SE215 or if that's not enough bass - the Eterna + cable guides. 
   
   
  Quote: 





spaz115 said:


> What are your thoughts on the Denon C710? No review of them in this thread, and right now im thinking of either those or the FXT-90's. How different are they, and which are better for all around use? Also what are some other options in that kind of price range? ~130USD


 
   
  There's a review of the C710, it's number (2B3).
   
   
  Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> i dont live in the US so the A151 is more tha $50 for me.
> how does the Astrotec AM-90 isolate?


 
   
  Almost as well as the A151 but it's a straight-barrel design so you might as well have an Ety if they're available. 
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thanks joker, I have purchased MG7 from ebay. It will take approx. 15 days to reach me.
> 
> So Atrio MG7 is the best IEM when it comes to bass quantity and quality?
> 
> ...


 
   
  The N2 should be more than sufficient for an MG7. I must have recommended it for a reason but I wouldn't have said that it has the best bass quality at a high quantity - among universals that's still the JVC FX700 in my book.
   
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> The MKII isn't for shallow fit. If anything, it's a lot easier to achieve a deep fit with it. What gave you that impression?


 
   
  +1. Although I wouldn't call it an upgrade over the B2, but then it depends on what you're after.


----------



## vkkharb

hey everybody....i need a BASS HEAVY IEM, my budget is $50
 i don't know much about highs and mids and stuff so my main concern is BASS although other things matter too, but not so much..
 so what are my options..any help will be much appreciated..


----------



## vkkharb

anybody????????????


----------



## Spaz115

Comparing the RE262's to the JVC HA-FXT-90s...what are the big differences? In the review of the RE262, what does * cable-down fit not for everyone *mean? :/ What are some other similar earphones compared to the JVC's? 
   
  also would you recommend the 262's if its not possible for me to try them out first hand before buying? Cos I can and have tried out the FXT90 but havent tried the 262's yet


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> The MKII isn't for shallow fit. If anything, it's a lot easier to achieve a deep fit with it. What gave you that impression?


 
  See, I've even had problems with GR07, mostly due to the short tips and the fact that nothing really fits it.
  With RE272, I couldn't get deep fit due to 4.5mm nozzle and lack of deep tips of that kind. It's telling when the marshmellow-like tips fit the best.
  Perhaps I should grab a Monster fit kit?
   
  I still didn't get a recommendation. Perhaps I should get MTPG and apply file and paint job to it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  (Other than that, RE272 broke due to cable hardening; I'm on to fixing them - I don't think warranty will do any good, it's a cable flaw, probably silicone sheath. Needs to be replaced in full.)


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> *See, I've even had problems with GR07, mostly due to the short tips and the fact that nothing really fits it.*
> With RE272, I couldn't get deep fit due to 4.5mm nozzle and lack of deep tips of that kind. It's telling when the marshmellow-like tips fit the best.
> Perhaps I should grab a Monster fit kit?
> 
> ...


 
   
  These should solve your problems
   
http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Triple_flange_Eartips_p/tipset3-tf35l-mrg-bk.htm


----------



## suman134

why dont you try a meelec M11+ or a yamaha eph-50 , or i think ue 350 will do too .


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The N2 should be more than sufficient for an MG7. I must have recommended it for a reason but I wouldn't have said that it has the best bass quality at a high quantity - among universals that's still the JVC FX700 in my book.


 
   
   
  ok so For pure bass quality with quantity, Your favorite is JVC FX700. But I am afraid of sibilance issue and fatigue issues with the JVC FX700. So after JVC FX700, it is MG7 which is the best in bass(quantity with quality)?
   
  So out of FX700 and MG7, which one would you call the "Quality over Quantity bass" IEM?
   
  One more question: Does amping help in the case of MG7? Any external amp like FiiO E11 or so?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> So out of FX700 and MG7, which one would you call the "Quality over Quantity bass" IEM?


 
   
  The FX700 is the definition of "no compromise." if you want both quantity AND quality, the FX700 is it. I haven't heard the MG7, but from reviews and chats with friends, the only strength the MG7 has is its sub-bass. The FX700 has everything, and one of the most addictive presentations I've heard in any iem or headphone.
   
  As for sibilance, the FX700 is energetic but never, ever sibilant.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> These should solve your problems
> http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Triple_flange_Eartips_p/tipset3-tf35l-mrg-bk.htm


 
  Nope, triple flange tips like those are far too bulky for my ears. I'd need something a lot more slim.
  Plus I'm not in the US, so getting most MEElectronics hardware is not easy.
   
  Also, I'm not quite satisfied with GR07's tonal balance.
  (high bass/low mid overload where I'd rather have more low bass, nasty sibilant boost, lacking highest end)


----------



## eke2k6

astralstorm said:


> Nope, triple flange tips like those are far too bulky for my ears. I'd need something a lot more slim.
> Plus I'm not in the US, so getting most MEElectronics hardware is not easy.
> 
> Also, I'm not quite satisfied with GR07's tonal balance.
> (mid bass overload where I'd rather have more low bass, nasty sibilant boost, lacking highest end)


 
   
  Just try them out. You may be surprised.  I find the midbass of the GR07 to be ruler flat, and the sub-bass to exceed most other non-bass oriented phones out there, producing wicked rumble when called for. As for sibilance, I just don't experience it much on my pair. It's sounds like you need some an ER4S or something lighter...
   
  PM me if you want me to proxy the meelec tips to you.


----------



## RealSlimSeto

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Nope, triple flange tips like those are far too bulky for my ears. I'd need something a lot more slim.
> Plus I'm not in the US, so getting most MEElectronics hardware is not easy.
> 
> Also, I'm not quite satisfied with GR07's tonal balance.
> (high bass/low mid overload where I'd rather have more low bass, nasty sibilant boost, lacking highest end)


 

 Strange, I find their mid bass to be rather polite, and low bass to be more than adequate for my liking.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vkkharb said:


> hey everybody....i need a BASS HEAVY IEM, my budget is $50
> i don't know much about highs and mids and stuff so my main concern is BASS although other things matter too, but not so much..
> so what are my options..any help will be much appreciated..


 
   
  MEElec M31
   
   
  Quote: 





spaz115 said:


> Comparing the RE262's to the JVC HA-FXT-90s...what are the big differences? In the review of the RE262, what does * cable-down fit not for everyone *mean? :/ What are some other similar earphones compared to the JVC's?
> 
> also would you recommend the 262's if its not possible for me to try them out first hand before buying? Cos I can and have tried out the FXT90 but havent tried the 262's yet


 
   
  The RE262/RE272 has hard stems that exit at a 90 degree angle. If you have large outer ears you probably won't be able to get a seal wearing them cable-down because the stems will push against the ear. Hence, not for everyone. 
   
  I would not recommend buying the RE262 blind - it's not very similar to the FXT90. Another earphone on that general price/performance level is the Yamaha EPH-100.


----------



## Gilly87

The GR07 are said to be sibilant until over 100 hours of burn-in, and the bass reportedly improves with time as well. They are known for changing dramatically with burn-in:


----------



## RobbaDobba

Which sub-$100 IEMs do you think most closely matches the sonic signature of the Koss KSC-35s?

I realize I'm comparing open to closed and cans to buds, but those are my favorite headphones and I'd like the same characteristics in an IEM without breaking my bank.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





robbadobba said:


> Which sub-$100 IEMs do you think most closely matches the sonic signature of the Koss KSC-35s?
> I realize I'm comparing open to closed and cans to buds, but those are my favorite headphones and I'd like the same characteristics in an IEM without breaking my bank.


 
   
  Wow, I haven't heard one of those in a very long time. I would try the Sunrise Xcape IE if I were you but do read a couple of reviews in case I'm fuzzy on what the KSC35 sounds like. .


----------



## AstralStorm

Uhm, GR07 does *not* improve. No really. Mine have more than 1k hours on them.
   


eke2k6 said:


> Just try them out. You may be surprised.  I find the midbass of the GR07 to be ruler flat, and the sub-bass to exceed most other non-bass oriented phones out there, producing wicked rumble when called for. As for sibilance, I just don't experience it much on my pair. It's sounds like you need some an ER4S or something lighter...
> 
> PM me if you want me to proxy the meelec tips to you.


 
   
  Actually GR07 have ok subbass down to 40 Hz, then it drops pretty sharp. Yes, I'm demanding there.
  The problem is the resonance from the silicone tips I think - with the foam tips the mid bass is less pronounced, but I can't find long enough foams that fit, and the short small ones tend to either lose fit or collapse.
  In fact, they fit best with the included medium (or was that small?) silicone. (which is quite sleek)
   
  Well, I have tried:
  1) UE triple flanges (w/ RE272) 2) Hifiman triple flanges (w/ RE272, worked kinda almost - was abrasive though)
  3) Sleek Audio triple flanges (w/ SA-6, nice fit but the IEM itself is lacking) 4) Etymoic triple flanges (w/ SA-6, too hard, didn't bend enough)
  None of the triple flanges fit GR07.
  Also, I have tried various Comply tips, comfortable, but too short. When I forced the Comply P on, they soaked so much treble it's not even funny, but the bass went nice, linear and better controlled. (I bet the too small nozzle was the cause of the lowpass.)
   
  I have some hope that Monster gel tips would work. Is that plausible?
   
  The problem is that my ear canal has a bent shape at the start. Have a peek:
http://ompldr.org/vZG9kMQ/IMG_20120509_083936_marked.jpg
http://ompldr.org/vZG9kMg/IMG_20120509_083945_marked.jpg
http://ompldr.org/vZG9kMA/IMG_20120509_083402_marked.jpg
   
  Those are Spiral Ear SE-5 Reference. Expensive, superb quality, bass pretty much outstripping most dynamics, but suprisingly balanced pretty bright - and they're not as comfortable as I hoped. Also they look funky in ear, like a hearing aid, not easy to put in or take out, so definitely not good for portable use. Great for anything else though.
   
  (Don't mind the green markings, the areas that are to be corrected - I'll have to get new impressions anyway.
   
  Hint for producers: ask for impressions *after* you order parts, heck, even with pre-pay. When made, these were already 3 months old!)
   
  --
  I forgot to say what's the balance I'm looking for. Beyerdynamic DT-1350 is pretty much great balance, I'd only like a tinge more subbass off them, maybe fewer high end peaks. See, flat bass is just not musical for headphones.
   
  To show you what I mean, that's the final correction curve for those DT-1350: (500 Hz reference)


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> The FX700 is the definition of "no compromise." if you want both quantity AND quality, the FX700 is it. I haven't heard the MG7, but from reviews and chats with friends, the only strength the MG7 has is its sub-bass. The FX700 has everything, and one of the most addictive presentations I've heard in any iem or headphone.
> 
> As for sibilance, the FX700 is energetic but never, ever sibilant.


 
   
  ok thanks a lot for the reply


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Uhm, GR07 does *not* improve. No really. Mine have more than 1k hours on them.


 
   
  Like I said, I simply don't experience the murderous sibilance with my pair anymore, and this is with me owning and A/B ing wing several other phones.. I'm not attributing it to anything specific. As for triple flange tips, the Meelec M6 tips are perfect for the GR07.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> <pic>


 
  Looks too large already. Make it 2/3 the diameter or tapering far faster and then we'll talk.
  Or perhaps a design that's two flange wth a longer tube part inbetween, like Hifiman's. (but small!)
  Currently I get to use small Comply T200.
   
  (Sibilance is not murderous, but still annoying at times.)


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Looks too large already. Make it 2/3 the diameter or tapering far faster and then we'll talk.
> Or perhaps a design that's two flange wth a longer tube part inbetween, like Hifiman's. (but small!)
> Currently I get to use small *Comply T200.*


 
   
  No wonder you're having bass and treble issues. The gr07's signature does not take kindly to foam or narrow bore tips.
   
  PM me so I can send you the small triple flanges that come with the m6. The one in the picture is large


----------



## mytton

There seems to be a great deal of helping people find new headphones going on here, so I hope you don't mind if I through myself in as well. 
   
  My klisch image s4's have recently broke and I'm looking for an upgrade.
   
  I'd like a sub-$100 pair, but I'd also like to have an option that's sub-$50 and see how those compare.
  I also listen to rock, hip hop, and dubstep, as well as a variety of other instrumentals from time to time. Bass is important, but not at the expense of other qualities.  
  Good isolation would also be favored, trying to tune out a lot of talking. 
  The vsonic's r04 and r06 seem quite good but I just can't stand over ear headphones unfortunately. 
   
  I'd much appreciate the help, thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mytton said:


> There seems to be a great deal of helping people find new headphones going on here, so I hope you don't mind if I through myself in as well.
> 
> My klisch image s4's have recently broke and I'm looking for an upgrade.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Similar to the S4: Fischer Audio Consonance, id America Spark (<$50). Other bassy options: Velodyne vPulse, Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE, Xears TD-III / TD4, Soundmagic E10 (<$50). More balanced but still with a bass tilt: HiSound Crysal, MEElec CC51. Best isolation would be from the HiSounds.


----------



## mytton

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Similar to the S4: Fischer Audio Consonance, id America Spark (<$50). Other bassy options: Velodyne vPulse, Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE, Xears TD-III / TD4, Soundmagic E10 (<$50). More balanced but still with a bass tilt: HiSound Crysal, MEElec CC51. Best isolation would be from the HiSounds.


 
  Thanks for that really clear comparison, your reviews are superb individually but it's hard for me to stack them up given my lack of experience.
   
  Now that I'm starting to narrow it down, how would you say the Soundmagic E10 fits in with the S4 and something a bit higher end like the Crystals?


----------



## heart banger-97

hi ljokerl ! do you think that a 75 ohm resistor can improve the SQ of w4?
  http://goldenears.net/board/files/attach/images/783980/727/049/002/239c6f0ccb9f33e0311d03adc8853719.png
   
  http://goldenears.net/board/2049727
   
  (I saw here http://www.head-fi.org/t/583981/westone-4-vs-shure-se535-special-edition-red-535-with-baldur-mk2-cable/600#post_8375315)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mytton said:


> Thanks for that really clear comparison, your reviews are superb individually but it's hard for me to stack them up given my lack of experience.
> 
> Now that I'm starting to narrow it down, how would you say the Soundmagic E10 fits in with the S4 and something a bit higher end like the Crystals?


 
   
  The E10 is not quite as bass- and treble-heavy as the S4 but more so than the Crystals. It's actually a very solid earphone for the price. With the Crystals you'll get better detail and clarity, tighter bass, and of course better isolation. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl ! do you think that a 75 ohm resistor can improve the SQ of w4?
> http://goldenears.net/board/files/attach/images/783980/727/049/002/239c6f0ccb9f33e0311d03adc8853719.png
> 
> http://goldenears.net/board/2049727
> ...


 
   
  Didn't try to add resistance.


----------



## Inks

Well, adding resistance as a general rule of thumb for multi-BAs is bad, but the W4 is clearly an exception, SE425 and ADDIEMs are as well. What rules whether resistance is bad or good are the impedance phase nature, sometimes bad, sometimes good.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Well, adding resistance as a general rule of thumb for multi-BAs is *good*, but the W4 is clearly an exception, SE425 and ADDIEMs are as well. What rules whether resistance is bad or good are the impedance phase nature, sometimes bad, sometimes good.


 
   
  You mean bad? It generally messes with the crossovers. The TF10 is disastrous with added impedance.


----------



## Inks

Typo. Yeah bad, the TF10 is a good example. For the W4, it's not the case though after what GE has shown. It's not that the resistance messes with the crossover, the crossovers mess with the impedance nature of every BA used so their curves get all over the place, resulting in incoherent changes.


----------



## Aethernum

This thread is an incredible resource! Thank you for all the work you've put into it.
   
  I was wondering what you think about IEMs for a user - like me - who primarily listens to classical music, but also wants an IEM that performs well in all genres? I listen primarily to classical, but also have a ton of jazz, rock, even heavy metal type music in my library. I used to have a set of Shure SE420s, but I had the unfortunate mishap of losing them on a plane ride back from a college school of music audition. But I'm sick of using cheap $20 replacements, and am willing to put down a good chunk of money for a listening experience that will last and serve my purposes both as a music student and as someone who just likes to listen to high quality sound. 
   
  In terms of my listening preferences...for classical music, obviously you need good bass. The Firebird Suite isn't the Firebird Suite without great timpani, tuba, and string bass sound. But I don't require the monster bass that you might find in, say, an R&B or heavy metal type genre. So for me good bass is important, but I don't need it to be overpowering - and in fact would prefer it not be. Midrange needs to be good, of course, and for me the treble is the most important. String/woodwind sound needs to come through crystal clear with no distortion. 
   
  I've never used a custom-fit IEM before, but I've thought about trying it. What is your opinion on the benefits of custom-fit versus universals? Obviously custom fits are going to (in most cases) give better sound, but is it worth the hassle? And I've never really used any sort of portable amp for my day-to-day listening, but I have looked into that, as well. Unfortunately, I have no idea where to start. Any advice you have in that department would be appreciated. The Shure SE420s worked great with just a normal Ipod, but I have a feeling higher end earphones - even the SE535's - would start to suffer from being driven by an unaided MP3 player. 
   
  My budget is fairly large, but not enormous. I'd prefer to stay under $1000 for the whole package - headphones, extra earbuds (if it's a universal), earbud fittings (if it's a custom), and accessories and what-not. Could you give me some advice for what would fit my needs?
   
  Thanks.
   
   
  Edit - The earphones I've heard the most about are the Ultimate Ear TripleFi 10 earphones, and the Shure SE535's. I see you have the SE535s on here, and your review seemed pleased, but not terribly impressed, by their performance. The UE earphones you list as being in the process of being reviewed. Those two are sort of my reference point - the ones I know the most about and have read the most about - but ANY suggestions are welcome.
   
  Also, isolation is important for me, but not a deal-breaker. I often used my SE420s to listen to jazz tracks while I played along on drum set. Their isolation was really quite good, I thought, and allowed me to play drum set while still hearing the music in my ears and being able to follow along. I'd like to still be able to do that, but I would put sound quality over isolation any day.


----------



## guhmo

Quote: 





aethernum said:


> Edit - The earphones I've heard the most about are the Ultimate Ear TripleFi 10 earphones, and the Shure SE535's. I see you have the SE535s on here, and your review seemed pleased, but not terribly impressed, by their performance. The UE earphones you list as being in the process of being reviewed. Those two are sort of my reference point - the ones I know the most about and have read the most about - but ANY suggestions are welcome.


 
   
  Classical music tends to benefit from a v or u -shaped sound signature, enhancing the bass and the treble.  The SE535 are a much more mid-centric earphone with slightly rolled off treble which may not suit classical music.  You might also want to look into the super-neutral earphones like the Etymotic ER-4 series.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aethernum said:


> This thread is an incredible resource! Thank you for all the work you've put into it.
> 
> I was wondering what you think about IEMs for a user - like me - who primarily listens to classical music, but also wants an IEM that performs well in all genres? I listen primarily to classical, but also have a ton of jazz, rock, even heavy metal type music in my library. I used to have a set of Shure SE420s, but I had the unfortunate mishap of losing them on a plane ride back from a college school of music audition. But I'm sick of using cheap $20 replacements, and am willing to put down a good chunk of money for a listening experience that will last and serve my purposes both as a music student and as someone who just likes to listen to high quality sound.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I'm not a huge classical listener but for the few dozen CDs I have, I prefer a neutral approach - my Ety ER4, for example. I don't have much to say about the whole customs vs universals debate - your budget is rather large but it's up to you whether you want to go through the trouble of getting a pair of customs fitted. Sound quality difference between similarly-priced customs and universals are incremental but a well-fitting custom can be an extremely rewarding thing to own - comfort, isolation, durability, etc. However, you have to be quite certain that you'll like the one you are buying. 
   
  I owned a Shure E4c a long time ago, which I believe was later re-badged into the SE420. I thought it had a rather balanced and inoffensive sound but it would help if you noted what you liked about it and what specifically you'd like to see improved.


----------



## Aethernum

> I'm not a huge classical listener but for the few dozen CDs I have, I prefer a neutral approach - my Ety ER4, for example. I don't have much to say about the whole customs vs universals debate - your budget is rather large but it's up to you whether you want to go through the trouble of getting a pair of customs fitted. Sound quality difference between similarly-priced customs and universals are incremental but a well-fitting custom can be an extremely rewarding thing to own - comfort, isolation, durability, etc. However, you have to be quite certain that you'll like the one you are buying.
> 
> I owned a Shure E4c a long time ago, which I believe was later re-badged into the SE420. I thought it had a rather balanced and inoffensive sound but it would help if you noted what you liked about it and what specifically you'd like to see improved.


 
  I think what I did appreciate about the SE420 was that nothing really stood out as being too overpowering. The bass was good but not in-your-face, and same with the treble. The treble was slightly more emphasized, but nothing that I couldn't change with an EQ setting, and frankly I think I liked it a little more that way anyway. I think if I went for a new IEM, I would want something with maybe a little more bass, and a similarly strong treble - like guhmo said, a V or U shaped sound signature. Do the Etymotic ER-4 do that well? What about the Ultimate Ears TripleFi10?
   
  The isolation in the SE420's was great. They fit well, were comfortable, and had an overall good sound to them. I'm actually rather annoyed that I lost them. In terms of all the things that aren't sound quality - fit, durability, accessories, looks, etc - I was satisfied with what the SE420 had to offer. What I'm looking for now is an IEM that will last like the SE420 (I only sent it back in once after about two years, and it was a small fix, which Shure was great about doing) and which will suit my purposes as a music student. On my best classical files I noticed that the SE420 couldn't always handle the lowest bass, and it struggled with some of the more dense choral music on both ends. 
   
  My hesitation about going and getting a custom fit IEM is, like you said, that I'm not positive I'll be satisfied with whatever I get, and I don't want to spend that much money and not be able to resell or return what I get. The 1964-T and the CTM-200 both seem to be great options for customs that wouldn't completely destroy my budget if I decided I didn't love them. Any thoughts on comparisons for those two in terms of classical music? How would you compare those to something like the ER-4 or the TripleFi10?


----------



## Spaz115

How different is the fit of the 262's from the 272's? I tried the 272's out at a shop and I found them quite uncomfortable wearing them straight in with Bi-Flange tips. However with over the ear wearing they were a lot more comfortable. Do you think with other tips they would be more comfortable wearing them straight down? Also how do the GR07's compare with the 262s? 
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aethernum said:


> I think what I did appreciate about the SE420 was that nothing really stood out as being too overpowering. The bass was good but not in-your-face, and same with the treble. The treble was slightly more emphasized, but nothing that I couldn't change with an EQ setting, and frankly I think I liked it a little more that way anyway. I think if I went for a new IEM, I would want something with maybe a little more bass, and a similarly strong treble - like guhmo said, a V or U shaped sound signature. Do the Etymotic ER-4 do that well? What about the Ultimate Ears TripleFi10?
> 
> The isolation in the SE420's was great. They fit well, were comfortable, and had an overall good sound to them. I'm actually rather annoyed that I lost them. In terms of all the things that aren't sound quality - fit, durability, accessories, looks, etc - I was satisfied with what the SE420 had to offer. What I'm looking for now is an IEM that will last like the SE420 (I only sent it back in once after about two years, and it was a small fix, which Shure was great about doing) and which will suit my purposes as a music student. On my best classical files I noticed that the SE420 couldn't always handle the lowest bass, and it struggled with some of the more dense choral music on both ends.
> 
> My hesitation about going and getting a custom fit IEM is, like you said, that I'm not positive I'll be satisfied with whatever I get, and I don't want to spend that much money and not be able to resell or return what I get. The 1964-T and the CTM-200 both seem to be great options for customs that wouldn't completely destroy my budget if I decided I didn't love them. Any thoughts on comparisons for those two in terms of classical music? How would you compare those to something like the ER-4 or the TripleFi10?


 
   
  The ER4 definitely isn't v-shaped. The 1964-T and CTM-200 aren't either, though the CTM is closer to what you want (neutral sound with nothing overpowering). The TF10 is v-shaped but there are also other options and with your budget you could do better if you wanted to. The Alclair Reference, which I haven't finished reviewing yet but which has been written up by average_joe, has more bass than the CTM-200 without being bass-heavy, which I think is right around the range that you want. It also has energetic treble - more so than the SE420 (from memory) but I don't remember the Shures that well.
   
  Staying in the universal realm, a high-end option would be the Phonak 232. Otherwise the Westone 3 or VSonic GR07 may be worth a looking at as TF10 alternatives... I think both perform a little better on the whole and they would certainly be easier to re-sell if you didn't like them.
   
   
  Quote: 





spaz115 said:


> How different is the fit of the 262's from the 272's? I tried the 272's out at a shop and I found them quite uncomfortable wearing them straight in with Bi-Flange tips. However with over the ear wearing they were a lot more comfortable. Do you think with other tips they would be more comfortable wearing them straight down? Also how do the GR07's compare with the 262s?
> 
> Thanks


 
   
   
  The fit is similar between the 262 and 272. I don't much like wearing them cable-down either, with any tips. The RE262 is warm and mid-centric compared to the GR07. The GR07 has more balanced presence across the range with significantly more treble and sub-bass.


----------



## kanuka

for the same price which is better, Brainwavz Beta V2 or GR99 ?


----------



## Niyologist

I'm impressed with the Sound Signature of the A151 and AF32.


----------



## Niyologist

My A151 definitely doesn't sound like a radio. My Cowon J3 fixed that and made it nearly bass heavy. 0_0


----------



## Aethernum

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The ER4 definitely isn't v-shaped. The 1964-T and CTM-200 aren't either, though the CTM is closer to what you want (neutral sound with nothing overpowering). The TF10 is v-shaped but there are also other options and with your budget you could do better if you wanted to. The Alclair Reference, which I haven't finished reviewing yet but which has been written up by average_joe, has more bass than the CTM-200 without being bass-heavy, which I think is right around the range that you want. It also has energetic treble - more so than the SE420 (from memory) but I don't remember the Shures that well.
> 
> Staying in the universal realm, a high-end option would be the Phonak 232. Otherwise the Westone 3 or VSonic GR07 may be worth a looking at as TF10 alternatives... I think both perform a little better on the whole and they would certainly be easier to re-sell if you didn't like them.


 
   
  Would earphones of this quality suffer from being unamped and only driven by an iPod Classic? I've considered buying a HiFiMan or a Cowon J3 or something like that, or using an amp with the iPod that I do have. Would that make any difference? Or is the iPod sufficient even for high end universals and customs like the ones you're suggesting?
   
  In particular, the CTM-200, Alclair, and the universals that you mentioned. To get the best sound quality, what would you use in terms of a source/amp/either?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> for the same price which is better, Brainwavz Beta V2 or GR99 ?


 
   
  My GR99 has very few hours on it so I'm not sure which one sounds better yet but as a total package the GR99 would easily be my pick.
   
   
  Quote: 





aethernum said:


> Would earphones of this quality suffer from being unamped and only driven by an iPod Classic? I've considered buying a HiFiMan or a Cowon J3 or something like that, or using an amp with the iPod that I do have. Would that make any difference? Or is the iPod sufficient even for high end universals and customs like the ones you're suggesting?
> 
> In particular, the CTM-200, Alclair, and the universals that you mentioned. To get the best sound quality, what would you use in terms of a source/amp/either?


 
   
  It really depends on the earphone. The CTM-200 and Alclairs are pretty efficient while the Phonak 232s (for example) benefit from amping more. Will the Reference still sound better than a TF10 right out of an iPod? Most definitely. Are you experiencing their full capability? No. Whether it's worth it to invest even more in an amp is up to you. I've heard my Miracle driven by an Anedio D1 and while I did think there were slight improvements over using my iBasso D10 as a source, I did not feel compelled to invest whatever the D1 costs to achieve those gains. If the question is whether you should get a higher-end IEM and use an iPod or get a cheaper one and use an amp, I would always invest in the headphone. You can always try an amp or different source down the line if you choose to pursue further improvement.


----------



## selferinoz

im considering upgrade from my Brainwavz Beta V2 and Brainwavz m1, with m1 really enjoyed their mids, but with beta i enjoyed their tighter bass and sparkling highs(althrough sometimes splashy) plus their soundstage beats m1. for me m1 trebel was too dark, beta's bass is the best for me right now, only trebel while sparkly, still sometimes too splashy(not as clean as B2<-i heard/audition this awesome IEm with their super clean treble), so any suggestion?  Budget around $150 maximum at the moment....


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> im considering upgrade from my Brainwavz Beta V2 and Brainwavz m1, with m1 really enjoyed their mids, but with beta i enjoyed their tighter bass and sparkling highs(althrough sometimes splashy) plus their soundstage beats m1. for me m1 trebel was too dark, beta's bass is the best for me right now, only trebel while sparkly, still sometimes too splashy(not as clean as B2<-i heard/audition this awesome IEm with their super clean treble), so any suggestion?  Budget around $150 maximum at the moment....


 
   
       GR07, EPH-100 or FXT90. Your choice.


----------



## YoengJyh




----------



## selferinoz

review bout FXT90 n GR07 are plenty, but not EPH-100. Neways, how is these three difer from my brainwavz beta v2 n m1's?


----------



## Amitl

Hello
  i have a question regarding Over-the-Ear IEM setup.
  i have a pair of Klipsch S4 and id America Spark.
  the S4's have this little plastic thingy on the wires that keeps
  them snug in the back of the neck, therefore i can understand using these
  phones over-the-ear (though i can't find it comfortable because when i turn my head
  the wire is being stretched and forcing the phone out of my ear)
  my question is about phones like the id America Spark.
  Joker says theyre good for over-the-ear setup, but when i try this,
  the wires around my ear just don't hold in place and they pop out quickly
  (which looks and feels really silly)
  so...it just don't hold in place this way...
  how do you actually do it? :|
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> im considering upgrade from my Brainwavz Beta V2 and Brainwavz m1, with m1 really enjoyed their mids, but with beta i enjoyed their tighter bass and sparkling highs(althrough sometimes splashy) plus their soundstage beats m1. for me m1 trebel was too dark, beta's bass is the best for me right now, only trebel while sparkly, still sometimes too splashy(not as clean as B2<-i heard/audition this awesome IEm with their super clean treble), so any suggestion?  Budget around $150 maximum at the moment....


 
   
  FXT90 IMO. Has rich, forward mids, plenty of bass, and good treble sparkle without overstepping it. GR07 can be a touch hot on the treble and the mids are distant compared to the M1 and the EPH-100 doesn't have a whole lot of treble sparkle. 
   
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Hello
> i have a question regarding Over-the-Ear IEM setup.
> i have a pair of Klipsch S4 and id America Spark.
> the S4's have this little plastic thingy on the wires that keeps
> ...


 
   
  The weight of the cable is enough to keep the Spark tucked in behind my ears. Plus I think the cable breaks in over time if you keep wearing it that way. If you need an aid MEElec cable guides work pretty well and don't cost a whole lot.


----------



## selferinoz

.


----------



## selferinoz

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> FXT90 IMO. Has rich, forward mids, plenty of bass, and good treble sparkle without overstepping it. GR07 can be a touch hot on the treble and the mids are distant compared to the M1 and the EPH-100 doesn't have a whole lot of treble sparkle.
> 
> 
> 
> The weight of the cable is enough to keep the Spark tucked in behind my ears. Plus I think the cable breaks in over time if you keep wearing it that way. If you need an aid MEElec cable guides work pretty well and don't cost a whole lot.


 
  if i cant seem to find fxt90 or fxt90 in my place if overprice, any suggestion for a cheaper alternative to fxt90?


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> if i cant seem to find fxt90 or fxt90 in my place if overprice, any suggestion for a cheaper alternative to fxt90?


 
   
   
  Well they don't sound exactly the same but the MG7 is a very good dynamic driver IEM with the most sub-bass around and it has the best bass texture also imo and the mids and highs sound really nice with a monitor type sound signature. You can get them at atrio.me and with the discount code ProgCost50% they're only $109 shipped. I love mine and think they sound better than my FXT90 as well as the other bass heavy IEM getting a lot of hype in the CKS77 (I've listen to them for a good 3 hours or so).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> if i cant seem to find fxt90 or fxt90 in my place if overprice, any suggestion for a cheaper alternative to fxt90?


 
   
  EPH-100?


----------



## SahilS

I was wondering what is the best headphone under $150 for listening to rap music on my iPod? I have no amp and i won't be buying one either so I want a headphone that sounds great out of the box. Any suggestions? Price is not fixed, I can go up to maybe $170-$180 but I would really like to keep it under that $150 mark.


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





sahils said:


> I was wondering what is the best headphone under $150 for listening to rap music on my iPod? I have no amp and i won't be buying one either so I want a headphone that sounds great out of the box. Any suggestions? Price is not fixed, I can go up to maybe $170-$180 but I would really like to keep it under that $150 mark.


 
   
   
  The Atrio MG7 for sure, its bass is just plain sick and the mids and highs are very nice as well.  They're on sale at atrio.me for $109 shipped when you use the discount code CostProg50%.


----------



## Penarin

This thread is amazing.


----------



## mikaveli06

id also recomend audio technica cks77.  Sub bass is almost equal to the mg7, but the mid bass is great and the overall gives a more fun sound imo where atrio is more moniter like in the mids and highs.  I sold my mg7 for the cks77 and do not regret it at all.  (and i listen to rap and r-n-b mainly with a lil aerosmith or journey to round things out).  $90 box version shipped from japan or $55 factory rejects from hong kong, which sound same after being well burned in.  Also  couple pair in trade section for roughly $70.  Plus fit is way better in my opinion


----------



## Amitl

Joker i thank you so much for the continuous support and advice......
   
  just wanted to share that i purchased these:
  http://dx.com/in-ear-stereo-earphones-with-removable-ear-hooks-3-5mm-13887
  just for the ear-hooks \ cable guides.... to use with my id America Spark 
  hopefully they're of nice quality...turned out much cheaper than
  ordering the stand-alone cable guides from Meelectronics (expansive delivery)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sahils said:


> I was wondering what is the best headphone under $150 for listening to rap music on my iPod? I have no amp and i won't be buying one either so I want a headphone that sounds great out of the box. Any suggestions? Price is not fixed, I can go up to maybe $170-$180 but I would really like to keep it under that $150 mark.


 
   
  There are quite a few options - really depends on what type of sound you're looking for. "Best" will vary widely depending on who you ask but some solid options in the <$150 price range would be the Yamaha EPH-100, FutureSonics Atrio MG7 (w/coupon noted above), JVC HA-FXT90 and FX500, and Audio-Technica CKM99.
   
   
  Quote: 





penarin said:


> This thread is amazing.


 
   
  Thanks!
    
  Quote:


amitl said:


> Joker i thank you so much for the continuous support and advice......
> 
> just wanted to share that i purchased these:
> http://dx.com/in-ear-stereo-earphones-with-removable-ear-hooks-3-5mm-13887
> ...


 
   
  The reason I like the MEElec ones is that they are soft silicone with no ridges - I even switched the PFE 232 I have on loan from the Phonak guides to the MEE ones. I don't like plastic guides or anything with a pre-formed shape like the Sennheiser and old V-Moda ones. I can't really tell from the picture what kind those DX ones are but hopefully they'll work for you.


----------



## dogears

All this teaser/preview on the PFE232's making me scratch (from itchiness)


----------



## Gryphus0204

Thanks Joker for your review of the GR06  I picked one up and after about 100 hours of burn in, the instrument separation is a lot better  music is clear and sharply accurate  love it, not gonna change to another soon! THANKS!!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dogears said:


> All this teaser/preview on the PFE232's making me scratch (from itchiness)


 
   
  More of that in the Spiral Ear 3-way review I posted the other day 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Thanks Joker for your review of the GR06
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  That's what they all say 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Glad you like 'em!


----------



## jarrett

I know you get this all the time, but any plans to review the Audio Technica CKS77 or CKM500? There are threads for both headphones. I'm not one to jump on the bandwagon - the last time I did was before the Sunrise Xcape v1 became popular - but these headphones seem like a new price/quality direction for Audio Technica.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> I know you get this all the time, but any plans to review the Audio Technica CKS77 or CKM500? There are threads for both headphones. I'm not one to jump on the bandwagon - the last time I did was before the Sunrise Xcape v1 became popular - but these headphones seem like a new price/quality direction for Audio Technica.


 
   
  No plans at the moment - everything I intend to review is listed on the front page of this thread, below the table.


----------



## steve2151

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You mean bad? It generally messes with the crossovers. The TF10 is disastrous with added impedance.


 
   
  Does anyone knew of any multiple armature iems that actually work well with extra impedance? My XM6 with the +75 ohm feature enabled works wonders with my X10, slightly improves my IE80 and M5, but turns my TF10 into a disorganized mess. I was thinking of adding a neutral iem that amplifies well like the ER4, but wanted to see if anyone's tried an extra impedance adapter with their W4, UM3X, SE535, SM3, etc.


----------



## Inks

I only know that it will surely work well with the W4, don't expect good results with the SE535 or SM3, who knows with the UM3X. Makes the X10 more neutral doesn't it?


----------



## steve2151

Quote: 





inks said:


> I only know that it will surely work well with the W4, don't expect good results with the SE535 or SM3, who knows with the UM3X. Makes the X10 more neutral doesn't it?


 
   
  In addition to the neutrality, I think the X10 gains some extra extension in the highs and bass. From a Clip+, it feels claustrophobic and veiled in comparison to the TF10, but can match or surpass the bigger iem when run out of the XM6.


----------



## Sweden

The AT CKM500 which are selling for around 70 bucks need to get more attention around here. I don't think there is a better sounding  in-ear under 100 out there. At least what I know about... Compared to the GR06 and Eterna this one is in another league of refinement. I would say it's up there sound wise with 150 USD in-ears like EPH-100 and GR07. Only problem is a bit of microphonics and too stiff stock tips.  
  Hope you get to review this one some day ljokerl.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





1337 gamer said:


> I've been a lurker for a long time, and finally decided to create an account.
> I have to say this thread is possibly the best thread earphone wise, in the world!
> Amazing job joker!
> I really love your writing!!


 
   
  Thanks


----------



## shotgunshane

I can't wait for you to hear the Meelec A161P. SQ value per $ just keeps getting upturned every few months.  These are seriously impressive.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





sweden said:


> The AT CKM500 which are selling for around 70 bucks need to get more attention around here. I don't think there is a better sounding  in-ear under 100 out there. At least what I know about... Compared to the *GR06 and Eterna *this one is in another league of refinement. I would say it's up there sound wise with 150 USD in-ears like EPH-100 and GR07. Only problem is a bit of microphonics and too stiff stock tips.
> Hope you get to review this one some day ljokerl.


 
  the gr06 and eterna are very different btwn themselves...imo
   
  still, i wonder how the ckm500 compares to similiar priced xba1


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> I can't wait for you to hear the Meelec A161P. SQ value per $ just keeps getting upturned every few months.  These are seriously impressive.


 
   
  They should sound very much the same as the Fischer SBA-03 I've reviewed here - it's one of my favorite reasonably-priced single-BA earphones. It seems MEElec has made some much-needed usability improvements and dropped the price $30, too.


----------



## Emospence

Joker, were the Shure single flange you used with the UM3Xs the black/grey soft flex?


----------



## Inks

\


steve2151 said:


> In addition to the neutrality, I think the X10 gains some extra extension in the highs and bass. From a Clip+, it feels claustrophobic and veiled in comparison to the TF10, but can match or surpass the bigger iem when run out of the XM6.


 
  Improved treble extension is a typical result of adding impedance to a single-ba. The X10 already had bottomless bass, perhaps there's a reduced midbass (which is common as well) which allows a better sense of it's depth. Stock, veiled and claustrophobic is what they sound like.


----------



## Sweden

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> the gr06 and eterna are very different btwn themselves...imo
> 
> still, i wonder how the ckm500 compares to similar priced xba1


 
   Sure and so are the EPH-100 and GR07 as well. I'm only talking about their being in roughly the same league of SQ according to my ears.
  XBA1 vs CKM500 seems like an interesting match-up.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





emospence said:


> Joker, were the Shure single flange you used with the UM3Xs the black/grey soft flex?


 
   
  Yes, I really like those tips


----------



## Gryphus0204

Do you have any tips to reduce the sibilance on the GR06? And also to increase the bass?


----------



## Emospence

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, I really like those tips


 
  Hmmm, the tiny opening doesn't affect the sound of the phones?
   
  And, for some phones you put your preferred tips as Shure grey flex, and for some Shure single flange. Are they the same thing?


----------



## selferinoz

Joker, sorry for bothering with this stupid question.....
 u gave dba-02 a sound score of 9.2, DDM u gave 8.9, examples, now currently im narrowing down my choices for upgrading from my brainwavz m1 to either maybe DDM or TDk BA200. Now i noe u havent review these yet, i just need a score for reference( if u havent, hopefully sum1 else who hav can help me out)
 Also if i dun hav cash to buy Earsonic SM3 v2, is getting the TDK BA200 the next best thing ? assuming, are there almost similiar on how they potray their sound signature? all i noe SM3 are known for their dynamic level for a BA, so are these TDk's the same?

 Thank you beforehand


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Do you have any tips to reduce the sibilance on the GR06? And also to increase the bass?


 
   
  Play around with longer tips and different insertion angles, give it some time, maybe try an EQ cut around the 6k region and a bump in the bass. Whatever tricks people came up with for the GR07 should work on the GR06 - I haven't been following the GR07 thread.
   
  Quote: 





emospence said:


> Hmmm, the tiny opening doesn't affect the sound of the phones?
> 
> And, for some phones you put your preferred tips as Shure grey flex, and for some Shure single flange. Are they the same thing?


 
   
  Yeah, same thing. How the tip affects sound varies by phone but much of the time the differences are tiny and I end up using whatever gives me the best, most consistent seal.
   
   
  Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> Joker, sorry for bothering with this stupid question.....
> u gave dba-02 a sound score of 9.2, DDM u gave 8.9, examples, now currently im narrowing down my choices for upgrading from my brainwavz m1 to either maybe DDM or TDk BA200. Now i noe u havent review these yet, i just need a score for reference( if u havent, hopefully sum1 else who hav can help me out)
> Also if i dun hav cash to buy Earsonic SM3 v2, is getting the TDK BA200 the next best thing ? assuming, are there almost similiar on how they potray their sound signature? all i noe SM3 are known for their dynamic level for a BA, so are these TDk's the same?
> 
> Thank you beforehand


 
   
  Can't help there as I've never been near a functional BA200.


----------



## i2ehan

ljokerl said:


> Play around with longer tips and different insertion angles, give it some time


 
   
  I'm sorry |joker|, but with all due respect, this just has to be done...


----------



## WakiDabeast

hey jokerl in your opinion, which iem in the 100 dollar range is best for electro, dubstep, hip hop, jazz, and acoustic? btw I can purchase the turbine gold's for 130. 
   
  oh and about what would you rate the Sunrise Xcap Impressive Edition on SQ


----------



## ljokerl

Added Astrotec AM-90
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A68) Astrotec AM-90*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





wakidabeast said:


> hey jokerl in your opinion, which iem in the 100 dollar range is best for electro, dubstep, hip hop, jazz, and acoustic? btw I can purchase the turbine gold's for 130.
> 
> oh and about what would you rate the Sunrise Xcap Impressive Edition on SQ


 
   
  It really depends on the sound signature you're looking for. The IE is an 8.4 on my scale.


----------



## Magicman74

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Astrotec AM-90
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thx Joker, just placed an order for the Astrotec, $43 sounds like a steal.


----------



## Anaxilus

Wow, Astrotec!  B[size=small]iddie-biddie-[/size][size=small][/size][size=small]biddie.[/size]


----------



## Emospence

Darn, too slow
  Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I'm sorry |joker|, but with all due respect, this just has to be done...


----------



## PowerSlide

from review this astrotec looks like suits my ear
   
  waiting to see any discount and i want a red one


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





powerslide said:


> from review this astrotec looks like suits my ear
> 
> waiting to see any discount and i want a red one


 
  you can try through taobao or taobao-buying-agent


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





i2ehan said:


> I'm sorry |joker|, but with all due respect, this just has to be done...


 
   
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Wow, Astrotec!  B[size=small]iddie-biddie-[/size][size=small][/size][size=small]biddie.[/size]


 
   
  Bunch of jokesters...
   
  For the record I quite like the finish of the Astrotecs - it's non-reflective (much like Twiki) and the shell is small enough that it doesn't look gaudy.
   
   
  Quote: 





powerslide said:


> from review this astrotec looks like suits my ear
> 
> waiting to see any discount and i want a red one


 
   
  Any pics of the red one? Curious how the finish looks in other colors.


----------



## Magicman74

Quote: 





powerslide said:


> from review this astrotec looks like suits my ear
> 
> waiting to see any discount and i want a red one


 

 Taobao-buying-agent.com  or Bigbarginsonline.com  Bigbarginonline doesn't list them on their ebay page but if you email him he'll send you one. Prices are $35 for silver or $38.50 for a color version, That includes shipping. Also Lend Me UR Ears for $43 for silver, not sure if they have colors?


----------



## Magicman74

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Bunch of jokesters...
> 
> For the record I quite like the finish of the Astrotecs - it's non-reflective (much like Twiki) and the shell is small enough that it doesn't look gaudy.
> 
> ...


 

 http://www.taobao-buying-agent.com/china-wholesale-16368584415.html
   
  Good pic here.


----------



## PowerSlide

the red looks great isn't it but i like red so im biased 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  i shop in taobao from some local agent in a local forum i dwell everyday, cheaper than buying from lendmeurears because of the exchange rate and i can buy other stuff as well from taobao. Shipping is around RM12 per kg which is roughly 4USD all the way from china to me.
   
  china company are making some cheap and cheerful iem nowdays


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





magicman74 said:


> http://www.taobao-buying-agent.com/china-wholesale-16368584415.html
> 
> Good pic here.


 
   
  Thanks, that does look quite nice.


----------



## Magicman74

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, that does look quite nice.


 

 I like the Black too


----------



## airomjosh

I bought red astrotec and it looks good but the best thing is the price, for only 168 yuan(26usd), you can have an IEM as good as meelectronics a151.


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> I bought red astrotec and it looks good but the best thing is the price, for only 168 yuan(26usd), you can have an IEM as good as meelectronics a151.


 
  where did you buy it? can you give the link
   
  and can the astrotec be worn over the ear??


----------



## selferinoz

Joker, do you think i will have a fit problem with the Radius DDMs ? not sure bout my ear canal size, whether its big or small, but i do have some examples to give u a picture bout my canal size...

 using the Brainwavz m1, i only can hav a good seal/confortable with the smallest single flange tip. the medium n large are too big for me. The double flange is wearable but give almost no difference with the small tip regarding sonic sound quality, but less comfort.(all tips mention are stock tips)

 using the Brainwavz Beta v2, same as above, smallest single flange tip(stock tip).

 using Brainwavz B2, the smallest tip gave me best isolation and comfort and seal. Also stock tip. never had experience a triple flange yet.


----------



## Orel

Hey, thank you very much for this excellent topic! I go here every time I want to find out about an IEM or recommend to my friends 
  Say, at about 60$, which is the better IEM: VSonic GR06 or the MEElectronics A151? I listen to metal, rock, classic, jazz and abit pop, but I don't need a very heavy bass. Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> and can the astrotec be worn over the ear??


 
   
  Yes, it is also my preferred way of wearing them as indicated by the boldface in the original review:
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Wear Style:_ Straight down or *over-the-ear*_


 
   
  Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> Joker, do you think i will have a fit problem with the Radius DDMs ? not sure bout my ear canal size, whether its big or small, but i do have some examples to give u a picture bout my canal size...
> 
> using the Brainwavz m1, i only can hav a good seal/confortable with the smallest single flange tip. the medium n large are too big for me. The double flange is wearable but give almost no difference with the small tip regarding sonic sound quality, but less comfort.(all tips mention are stock tips)
> 
> ...


 
   
  The DDM is pretty different from your IEMs in fit (the DDM2 is somewhat similar to the Beta, though). It doesn't have huge nozzles so the small tips should work for you - I'd be more concerned about the housing size and your outer ears, which is not an issue with any of your current earphones.
   
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> Hey, thank you very much for this excellent topic! I go here every time I want to find out about an IEM or recommend to my friends
> Say, at about 60$, which is the better IEM: VSonic GR06 or the MEElectronics A151? I listen to metal, rock, classic, jazz and abit pop, but I don't need a very heavy bass. Thanks


 
   
  The GR06 has more bass and treble compared to the A151. I would say it is generally more balanced than the A151 but not as smooth - more akin to the CC51 in signature and performance but without the laid-back mids. For those who don't want a lot of bass I would almost say the A151 is a safer choice but you can see from the scores that I think the GR06 is generally a better earphone.


----------



## selferinoz

The largest that i have is currently the Beta's(v2), the housing size is ok, wearing it straight down with no problems, is the DDM gonna be bigger than it or its the same/almost as the size of my beta's?


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR06 has more bass and treble compared to the A151. I would say it is generally more balanced than the A151 but not as smooth - more akin to the CC51 in signature and performance but without the laid-back mids. For those who don't want a lot of bass I would almost say the A151 is a safer choice but you can see from the scores that I think the GR06 is generally a better earphone.


 
  So GR06 is the more balanced earphone? I'm looking for a balanced sound, I just don't want the bass overpowering, since I don't really need it 
  I currently have the Q350 so I'm looking for an upgrade. So you would say the VSonic GR06 is the better choice, also for my genres of choice?
  Edit: Would you suggest me an other earphone altogether?


----------



## Gryphus0204

Joker, what do you think of the stock styrofoam eartips of the GR06? I find that it increase bass by a significant amount but i think the accuracy and and instrument seperation is lost there. Is this just my speculation? Correct me if I'm wrong please. And if so is there a foam tip that increases both bass and clarity? Comply foams maybe? Or monster gel foam? Or olive shures?


----------



## mondrin

I'm so very glad I found this forum and this wonderful set of reviews.  Hat's off to those taking the time to gather such great information.  Question for you all, do many of you buy several IEM's, testing them and return the ones you don't like?  I've done this long ago (long long ago) and am back in need of new headphones and hoping to move into the IEM world from my earbuds.  My wife has the Klipsch S4's and I do not find them to my liking.  mid bass and low mid's seem muddy and the treble is harsh.  I still prefer my old and dying sony mdr-e848 earbuds.  Sure they have no isolation and lack a lot of clarity, but I do like the overall balance of sound.  I've read through the reviews several times on this site (which rocks) and beleive I have no chance of just magically picking the right set the first time.  I'm not even sure what category I prefer but do know I must stay below $100.
   
  Are there any good sites that allow returns of IEM's?


----------



## kanuka

Meelec and Frogbeats


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, it is also my preferred way of wearing them as indicated by the boldface in the original review:


 
   
  one last question, how much to the astrotec sticks out the ear when you wear them (over the ear), because in this picture: http://chinamall.c.yimg.jp/img03.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/i3/24086955/T2Cr5oXgtaXXXXXXXX_!!24086955.jpg
   
  they stick out A LOT!!


----------



## jekostas

Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> one last question, how much to the astrotec sticks out the ear when you wear them (over the ear), because in this picture: http://chinamall.c.yimg.jp/img03.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/i3/24086955/T2Cr5oXgtaXXXXXXXX_!!24086955.jpg
> 
> they stick out A LOT!!


 
   
  The model in the picture is a tiny Asian woman with tiny ears.  Not representative.
   
  Unless you are in fact a >5 foot tall Asian woman, at which point you may have a problem.


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





jekostas said:


> The model in the picture is a tiny Asian woman with tiny ears.  Not representative.
> 
> Unless you are in fact a >5 foot tall Asian woman, at which point you may have a problem.


 
  well i am a asian but not a women neither 5 feet tall


----------



## Amitl

There's something weird about the Xears online store...
  no matter which product i chose, when i put in the coupon
  that Joker gracefully shared with us here, the phone will now
  cost 30 euros. is this a bug??


----------



## Extra

Hey Joker, I see that in your MEElectronics M6 review that the memory wire can be removed "with a bit of knife work." Could you explain to me how you removed your, the memory wire is really annoying and doesn't conform to my ears well.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> The largest that i have is currently the Beta's(v2), the housing size is ok, wearing it straight down with no problems, is the DDM gonna be bigger than it or its the same/almost as the size of my beta's?


 
   
  The DDM is a bit bigger than the Betas and also fits in the ear differently. 
   
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> So GR06 is the more balanced earphone? I'm looking for a balanced sound, I just don't want the bass overpowering, since I don't really need it
> I currently have the Q350 so I'm looking for an upgrade. So you would say the VSonic GR06 is the better choice, also for my genres of choice?
> Edit: Would you suggest me an other earphone altogether?


 
   
  The GR06 is far from flat in response but on the whole more balanced than the A151, which rolls off at either end. I haven't heard the Q350 but I have a K330 which is decent but not great. Based on the K330 the GR06 should be better all around.
   
   
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Joker, what do you think of the stock styrofoam eartips of the GR06? I find that it increase bass by a significant amount but i think the accuracy and and instrument seperation is lost there. Is this just my speculation? Correct me if I'm wrong please. And if so is there a foam tip that increases both bass and clarity? Comply foams maybe? Or monster gel foam? Or olive shures?


 
   
  I can't really get a seal with those tips. You would have to decore olives to fit them on the GR06 and I didn't really like the way my Complys sounded compared to silicone. Again, could be a fit issue.
   
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> I'm so very glad I found this forum and this wonderful set of reviews.  Hat's off to those taking the time to gather such great information.  Question for you all, do many of you buy several IEM's, testing them and return the ones you don't like?  I've done this long ago (long long ago) and am back in need of new headphones and hoping to move into the IEM world from my earbuds.  My wife has the Klipsch S4's and I do not find them to my liking.  mid bass and low mid's seem muddy and the treble is harsh.  I still prefer my old and dying sony mdr-e848 earbuds.  Sure they have no isolation and lack a lot of clarity, but I do like the overall balance of sound.  I've read through the reviews several times on this site (which rocks) and beleive I have no chance of just magically picking the right set the first time.  I'm not even sure what category I prefer but do know I must stay below $100.
> 
> Are there any good sites that allow returns of IEM's?


 
   
   
  A lot of small retailers will allow you to do so if you buy direct - MEElec is a good example. You'd have to read up on or ask about the return policy ahead of time, though. 
   
  The S4 is not a great IEM - for $100 I would start off with something on a higher SQ tier but also with a 'safe' sound signature, like an Xcape IE or Shure SE215, and go from there.
   
   
  Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> one last question, how much to the astrotec sticks out the ear when you wear them (over the ear), because in this picture: http://chinamall.c.yimg.jp/img03.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/i3/24086955/T2Cr5oXgtaXXXXXXXX_!!24086955.jpg
> 
> they stick out A LOT!!


 
   
   
  Not as much as in that photo but more than the average IEM since the housings are elongated. For me, with single-flange tips and a good seal, they stick out just enough to allow the strain relief and cable to clear the bottom of my outer ear.
   
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> There's something weird about the Xears online store...
> no matter which product i chose, when i put in the coupon
> that Joker gracefully shared with us here, the phone will now
> cost 30 euros. is this a bug??


 
   
  I think that's the way it's always worked - the coupon works for all items. 
   
   
  Quote: 





extra said:


> Hey Joker, I see that in your MEElectronics M6 review that the memory wire can be removed "with a bit of knife work." Could you explain to me how you removed your, the memory wire is really annoying and doesn't conform to my ears well.


 
   
  I used manicure scissors to carefully cut up through the rubber sheath that covers the memory wire (but not through the cable itself!). Then, once the actual wire was exposed enough, I pulled it out with a plier and then trimmed the sheath neatly around 1/8" from the strain relief. It's around 5 mins of careful labor - just make sure not to disturb the cable.


----------



## Magicman74

Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> where did you buy it? can you give the link
> 
> and can the astrotec be worn over the ear??


 

 Here you go, You can thank me later for him selling them on Ebay now. He had no plans too But I sent him some Cash and he went out and bought me a pair on his spare time...Talk about being a great seller......
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Astrotec-AM-90-Dynamic-Unit-In-Ear-High-Quality-Earphone-sliver-color-/290717445227?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item43b01c2c6b


----------



## ljokerl

Added Alclair Reference
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1B7) Alclair Reference*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2012
> ...


----------



## Anaxilus

Nice Joker, that looks like a serious price/performance winner and potential giant slayer.  
   
  Does it have that absolute crystal like clarity of the DBA mk1?  Which is smoother or less hot in the troubled treble areas?


----------



## putente

Great review, *ljokerl*! These look very promising...


----------



## luc shrine

hi joker. i've ever asked you what is the downgrade of tandem, and your answer is xcape.
 now i have bought xcape and you are right xcape sounds similar enough with tandem eventhough from my memory, tandem sounds smoother than xcape. i was really impressed. thanks joker


----------



## Niyologist

Sounds like the Alclair Reference is for me.


----------



## Niyologist

The Alclair Reference sounds like a big step up from the FXT90, but with heavier treble and an analytical midrange.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Nice Joker, that looks like a serious price/performance winner and potential giant slayer.
> 
> Does it have that absolute crystal like clarity of the DBA mk1?  Which is smoother or less hot in the troubled treble areas?


 
   
  Yes, the clarity is very good but I would say the Reference is about as hot as a GR07 or PFE 232. The DBA-02 is definitely not treble-light but I've never had a problem with its treble.
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> Great review, *ljokerl*! These look very promising...


 
   
  Thanks!
   
   
  Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> hi joker. i've ever asked you what is the downgrade of tandem, and your answer is xcape.
> now i have bought xcape and you are right xcape sounds similar enough with tandem eventhough from my memory, tandem sounds smoother than xcape. i was really impressed. thanks joker


 
   
  I would agree there, the Tandem is smoother than just about anything. Glad they're close enough!
   
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> The Alclair Reference sounds like a big step up from the FXT90, but with heavier treble and an analytical midrange.


 
   
  I think that's a fair conclusion.


----------



## PLUSSOUND

This is one giant list! Extremely helpful since I'm looking at several IEMs that I may consider getting.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





plussound said:


> This is one giant list! Extremely helpful since I'm looking at several IEMs that I may consider getting.


 
   
  Thanks


----------



## psygeist

@joker
   
  Can you briefly summarize the sound signature of FI-BA-SB. Is it similar to e-Q5 or better than that or altogether different.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## imackler

Thanks a ton for getting more of these entry level customs. I don't how your affording this but the reviews are stellar. I get more interested with every review, wondering when and what my first custom will be.


----------



## compoopers

Hello |joker|

I was referred to you because you have an amazing history of experience with IEMs.

My first IEM ever was the Miles Davis Tributes. I bought them on sale for $150 and have really enjoyed them. I listen to primarily jazz, rnb, hip hop, acoustic/folk rock, classical, house/electric and I have found the sound signature of the MDTs to be incredibly good for these things. However, having not experienced any other IEMs, this also is an uninformed opinion.

However, my problem lies here. While the MDTs sound amazing to me, their build quality cannot keep up. My strain reliefs broke and the microphonics are no good for when I am on the go. Plus, I could do without the flashiness and weight.

I am looking for an IEM with similar intimacy and lushness as the MDTs, but I am finding it hard to find something because I am so inxeperienced. Someone referred me to the Hifiman RE262s.

I'm asking you if you could possibly let me know what you think of the RE262s in comparison to the MDTs (are they any better, or at least similar? I don't want to downgrade my sound quality here), or if there are any other IEMs (price insensitive, except let's not get too crazy) that sound like the MDTs but have better build quality?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> @joker
> 
> Can you briefly summarize the sound signature of FI-BA-SB. Is it similar to e-Q5 or better than that or altogether different.
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  It's not too similar to the Ortofons, I find the SB to be pretty heavily colored. It's very forward, very clear, and a little raw a-la BA-SS. I don't have an e-Q5 anymore but I compared it to a decent TWFK-based set (the VSonic GR01) and found it to have significantly more bass (but not as much control), far more forward mids, and less treble. I think the GR01 is flatter and more accurate overall - the SB's coloration adds a certain zest/liveliness but it's not what I would call neutral. It also doesn't have a very large presentation due to being so forward.
   
   
  Quote: 





imackler said:


> Thanks a ton for getting more of these entry level customs. I don't how your affording this but the reviews are stellar. I get more interested with every review, wondering when and what my first custom will be.


 
   
  Thanks! It's but a small taste of what's out there - the custom market is moving incredibly fast and - as with universals - it can be very difficult to generalize sound signatures even between models from a single manufacturer. Not to mention that there aren't too many reviews out there for a lot of models.
   
   
  Quote: 





compoopers said:


> Hello |joker|
> I was referred to you because you have an amazing history of experience with IEMs.
> My first IEM ever was the Miles Davis Tributes. I bought them on sale for $150 and have really enjoyed them. I listen to primarily jazz, rnb, hip hop, acoustic/folk rock, classical, house/electric and I have found the sound signature of the MDTs to be incredibly good for these things. However, having not experienced any other IEMs, this also is an uninformed opinion.
> However, my problem lies here. While the MDTs sound amazing to me, their build quality cannot keep up. My strain reliefs broke and the microphonics are no good for when I am on the go. Plus, I could do without the flashiness and weight.
> ...


 
   
  If you are used to the heavy bass of the MDT the RE262 probably won't do it for you. It's also more laid-back (not as intimate) and not quite as warm and thick but otherwise very good all around. These days it's not difficult to match the SQ level of the MDT without spending a bundle-  <$150 sets such as the JVC FXT90 and Yamaha EPH-100 will do it while pursuing a sound more similar to the Monsters than the RE262 IMO. The EPH-100 would probably do it for you but you'll have to wear them over-the-ear. It's forward, has good bass (not as much as MDT, but still plenty), and sounds fluid and lush. You'd have to ask in the EPH-100 thread for opinions on longevity but the set I had in for review held up rather well.


----------



## compoopers

Funny that you should mention the Yamaha EPH-100. I actually researched into those before, but all I came up with was that it was not as musical/intimate as the MDTs. Is that exaggeration? I wish I could listen to them side by side, I just don't know how to interpret most of this stuff. I recall reading something like the "Yamahas are more technically superior, designed by sound engineers while the MDTs sound like they were designed by a musician." The EPH is reported as not as intimate/musical as the MDTs, not sure if that's true but that's just what I've read. 

That only scares me because my Sony MDR Z1000 headphones (the only comparison I can give) are very neutral, sound-engineer-y, and I definitely prefer my MDTs over my Z1000s sound. The intimacy and overall sound composition on the MDTs are amazing to me.

I actually never noticed that the MDT was bass heavy (with no comparison I am quite complacent haha), but now that I listen, wow, it really is pretty punchy, powerful bass, isn't it? I like it.

I've looked into the FXT90 before as well (wow, I actually did a little research before asking millions of questions!! This is a first for me). Some reviews show that the FXT90 has a weakness in bass, and I'm guessing I like bass/sub-bass considering my love for my MDTs. YET, some other ones describe the FXT90 as musical, powerful, and full bass/mids. I just don't get head-fi reviews sometimes! 

The FXT90 is really tempting, I just want to make sure I know what I'm getting. I wish you could more easily compare IEMs in real life...

Sorry to be a huge party pooper, sometimes reading so many reviews and opinions on head-fi just mess with my mind. Are the above things I think about those two true? Are there any other IEMs, even if they are more than $150, that are close/closer to the MDT sound sig?

PS: Why do you have to wear EPH-100 over ear?


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote:  





> Some reviews show that the FXT90 has a weakness in bass, and I'm guessing I like bass/sub-bass considering my love for my MDTs. YET, some other ones describe the FXT90 as musical, powerful, and full bass/mids. I just don't get head-fi reviews sometimes!


 
   
  IMO FXT90 has more sub-bass than the EPH-100
  FXT90 is also more intimate/aggressive than the EPH-100....


----------



## project68

joker what do you think is better between heaven IV vs atrios m5 in term of bass and details?


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote:  
   
  The sound of the MDTs is still very unique.  That's why I have two of them still.  Others have similar frequency responses and try or do other things better but the intimate, smoky jazz club seduction is simply missing.  People will start searching to improve on various technical fronts but none capture the special euphonic coloration.
   
  If nothing turns up, get a warranty replacement if they still have MDTs, some silicone earguides and wear them over the ear.  That will reduce the weight and strain on the earguides.  I've had my original for two years now and no split shell of damaged strain reliefs.  There's a lot of useful information in the MDT thread about how best to use and hear the MDTs but sadly it was never collated and updated on the first page.  Instead you get ramblings of new users repeating the same mistakes and questions over and over again while useful information gets buried.


----------



## H20Fidelity

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> The sound of the MDTs is still very unique.  That's why I have two of them still.  Others have similar frequency responses and try or do other things better but the intimate, smoky jazz club seduction is simply missing.  People will start searching to improve on various technical fronts but none capture the special euphonic coloration.
> 
> If nothing turns up, get a warranty replacement if they still have MDTs, some silicone earguides and wear them over the ear.  That will reduce the weight and strain on the earguides.  I've had my original for two years now and no split shell of damaged strain reliefs.  There's a lot of useful information in the MDT thread about how best to use and hear the MDTs but sadly it was never collated and updated on the first page.  *Instead you get ramblings of new users repeating the same mistakes and questions over and over again while useful information gets buried.  *


 

 lol, this is true, I read the whole thread last week. One must be strong willed to do so.


----------



## compoopers

anaxilus said:


> The sound of the MDTs is still very unique.  That's why I have two of them still.  Others have similar frequency responses and try or do other things better but the intimate, smoky jazz club seduction is simply missing.  People will start searching to improve on various technical fronts but none capture the special euphonic coloration.
> 
> If nothing turns up, get a warranty replacement if they still have MDTs, some silicone earguides and wear them over the ear.  That will reduce the weight and strain on the earguides.  I've had my original for two years now and no split shell of damaged strain reliefs.  There's a lot of useful information in the MDT thread about how best to use and hear the MDTs but sadly it was never collated and updated on the first page.  Instead you get ramblings of new users repeating the same mistakes and questions over and over again while useful information gets buried.




This was a fear of mine, that the MDTs were a unique little set.

I don't think I'll ever really be able to settle with them. They're too flashy, the microphonics are just toooo annoying, and although it sounds awful, the amount of effort it takes to keep them safe in the elaborate protectors is not optimal for my lifestyle as I am on the go often and listen to music impulsively, don't have time to fiddle with all that stuff.

Plus, I hear Monster is replacing tributes with trumpets... although I hate the fact that my strain reliefs are broken (man it just feels bad), I dare not risk getting trumpets through warranty.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





compoopers said:


> the microphonics are just toooo annoying,


 
   
  One reason most earphones are worn over the ear.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's not too similar to the Ortofons, I find the SB to be pretty heavily colored. It's very forward, very clear, and a little raw a-la BA-SS. I don't have an e-Q5 anymore but I compared it to a decent TWFK-based set (the VSonic GR01) and found it to have significantly more bass (but not as much control), far more forward mids, and less treble. I think the GR01 is flatter and more accurate overall - the SB's coloration adds a certain zest/liveliness but it's not what I would call neutral. It also doesn't have a very large presentation due to being so forward.


 
  Thanks. I assume the treble is not as much less making it darker like SM3 V2 ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





compoopers said:


> Funny that you should mention the Yamaha EPH-100. I actually researched into those before, but all I came up with was that it was not as musical/intimate as the MDTs. Is that exaggeration? I wish I could listen to them side by side, I just don't know how to interpret most of this stuff. I recall reading something like the "Yamahas are more technically superior, designed by sound engineers while the MDTs sound like they were designed by a musician." The EPH is reported as not as intimate/musical as the MDTs, not sure if that's true but that's just what I've read.
> That only scares me because my Sony MDR Z1000 headphones (the only comparison I can give) are very neutral, sound-engineer-y, and I definitely prefer my MDTs over my Z1000s sound. The intimacy and overall sound composition on the MDTs are amazing to me.
> I actually never noticed that the MDT was bass heavy (with no comparison I am quite complacent haha), but now that I listen, wow, it really is pretty punchy, powerful bass, isn't it? I like it.
> I've looked into the FXT90 before as well (wow, I actually did a little research before asking millions of questions!! This is a first for me). Some reviews show that the FXT90 has a weakness in bass, and I'm guessing I like bass/sub-bass considering my love for my MDTs. YET, some other ones describe the FXT90 as musical, powerful, and full bass/mids. I just don't get head-fi reviews sometimes!
> ...


 
   
  The EPH-100 and FXT90 fall closer to the MDT on the overall signature scale than the RE262 does, which is why I recommended them, but no - neither is a sonic match. I really don't think either the JVC or Yamaha sounds neutral or sterile or anything but I guess it depends on how far from the MDT signature you're willing to stray. Might be a difficult to determination to make without actually picking up something else.
   
  When consulting reviews you have to ascertain what the point of comparison is - for example the EPH-100 will sound very full, powerful, musical, etc. compared to an Ety ER4 (extreme example) but at the same time leaner and more neutral compared to an MDT. I really don't know of any great matches for the MDT signature - these are just the ones I would think may work better for you than an RE262 if you're willing to compromise on some things.
   
   
  Quote: 





compoopers said:


> PS: Why do you have to wear EPH-100 over ear?


 
   
  Because the cable noise isn't that much better compared to the Tributes unless you wear them over-the-ear.
   
  Quote: 





project68 said:


> joker what do you think is better between heaven IV vs atrios m5 in term of bass and details?


 
   
  I don't know what the Heaven IV is... FAD is difficult to keep up with.
   
   
  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Thanks. I assume the treble is not as much less making it darker like SM3 V2 ?


 
   
  Not that dark, just a little less prominent in comparison to the bass/midrange and compared to a TWFK-based set.


----------



## bruddah

heyy everyone! i was just wondering which of these 2 headphones i should get. should i get the Meelectronics new A161P or the Atrio Mg7?


----------



## dweaver

Quote: 





compoopers said:


> This was a fear of mine, that the MDTs were a unique little set.
> I don't think I'll ever really be able to settle with them. They're too flashy, the microphonics are just toooo annoying, and although it sounds awful, the amount of effort it takes to keep them safe in the elaborate protectors is not optimal for my lifestyle as I am on the go often and listen to music impulsively, don't have time to fiddle with all that stuff.
> Plus, I hear Monster is replacing tributes with trumpets... although I hate the fact that my strain reliefs are broken (man it just feels bad), I dare not risk getting trumpets through warranty.


 

 I strongly suggest you read the thread about the MDR-7550, they are much more mid forward than the EX600/1000 series which from the sounds of it is right up your alley. I have the FXT90 now and while I like it, the treble of the MDR-7550 is just superior as is the overall signature. Not sure where you stand in regards to the comfort of the EX1000 comfort wise but personally I love the comfort of the MDR-7550. Really the only flaw they have for me is wind noise outside and more often than  not I live with that noise than use another IEM.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





bruddah said:


> heyy everyone! i was just wondering which of these 2 headphones i should get. should i get the Meelectronics new A161P or the Atrio Mg7?


 
   
       If you like neutrality and high amounts of detail, then the A161. If you like lots of Sub-Bass with a balanced sound signature, then the Atrio MG7.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bruddah said:


> heyy everyone! i was just wondering which of these 2 headphones i should get. should i get the Meelectronics new A161P or the Atrio Mg7?


 
   
  Those really won't sound anything alike so I think you need to figure out what you're after first.


----------



## JohannLiebert

Can you recommend me the most romantical and emotional iem up to 500Dollar. I dont need the most neutral/analytical sound.


----------



## Arfan

Hi guys,
  I've been wanting to buy another pair of IEM's for a while now. At the moment I use my Shure SE215''s the most, mainly because its very isolating and the ever so slightly emphasized bass overcomes the rumble of the bus so it's very good for that purpose. But I was hoping to buy another pair for when I'm not the move. They'll be used mainly in quite environments so the isolation isn't as important however it would be nice. 
  
  The things I like about the sound from my pair of Shure's is the bass, the bass quantity its punchy and has a strong impact to it too. But I am getting bored of the mids and the recessed highs, although I don't want an IEM that would cause fatigue. That being said I did like the JVC/Victor FX-300's even though they had an incredibly sparkly and somewhat boosted treble.
  
  My budget at the moment is between £180-290 although I wouldn't mind stretching it a little. The IEM's I've been looking into are the following
  
 Shure SE425, SE 535
 Ultimate Ears Triple. fi 10
 Westone UM2, UM3x, W3
  
 I was wondering which of these earphones would suit me best. I have read a lot of reviews about most of these earphones however they usually rely on comparisons quite heavily which is hard to relate to being relatively new to the market, well I've been buying a slew of £30 earphones for about two years now but I only got into trying to find a better sound about half a year ago.
  
 *the primary source would be a J3, and a laptop with a discrete sound card and a computer with an external sound card.
 *the range of music I listen to is so varied, classical to heavy metal to rap such that an overall performer would be only be suitable


----------



## kanuka

(deleted)


----------



## bruddah

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those really won't sound anything alike so I think you need to figure out what you're after first.


 
   
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> If you like neutrality and high amounts of detail, then the A161. If you like lots of Sub-Bass with a balanced sound signature, then the Atrio MG7.


 
  okayy thanks you guys! i think ill be getting the MG7 cuz of the bass and balanced sound signature.  Ive also read up alot on the MG7 and i think that ill like em.  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johannliebert said:


> Can you recommend me the most romantical and emotional iem up to 500Dollar. I dont need the most neutral/analytical sound.


 
   
  You should probably define what those words mean to you.
   
   
  Quote: 





arfan said:


> Hi guys,
> I've been wanting to buy another pair of IEM's for a while now. At the moment I use my Shure SE215''s the most, mainly because its very isolating and the ever so slightly emphasized bass overcomes the rumble of the bus so it's very good for that purpose. But I was hoping to buy another pair for when I'm not the move. They'll be used mainly in quite environments so the isolation isn't as important however it would be nice.
> 
> The things I like about the sound from my pair of Shure's is the bass, the bass quantity its punchy and has a strong impact to it too. But I am getting bored of the mids and the recessed highs, although I don't want an IEM that would cause fatigue. That being said I did like the JVC/Victor FX-300's even though they had an incredibly sparkly and somewhat boosted treble.
> ...


 
   
  If you like the bass of your SE215s but want some treble sparkle why not try a JVC FXT90? Granted I am not familiar with the SE425 or UM2 but the FXT90 competes rather well against the higher-end Shures and Westones. The W3 and TF10 both have plentiful bass and good sparkle but the mids might sound a little scooped compared to the SE215.
   
   
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> does the dba-02 mk2 has the same nozzle and filters as the first version (or as the B2)?


 
   
   
  Not sure, I am not familiar with the filter revisions of the DBAs. The MK2 has similar-diameter nozzles and filters that are recessed.


----------



## Inks

Can't believe your backlog hasn't shrunk one-bit.....  
   
  Newcomers, this is a good place for those simple questions, joker answers them very well.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





inks said:


> Can't believe your backlog hasn't shrunk one-bit.....
> 
> Newcomers, this is a good place for those simple questions, joker answers them very well.


 
   
       It sure is. This is the first thread I went to as a guest.


----------



## ljokerl

Updated accessory score for the Alclairs - apparently they (and Alclair's other triple-driver models) now come with a Pelican case and not the standard clamshell I received months ago.
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Can't believe your backlog hasn't shrunk one-bit.....
> 
> Newcomers, this is a good place for those simple questions, joker answers them very well.


 
   
  Thanks.. and that makes two of us. If only all manufacturers would cease releasing new products; I could finally have a well-deserved break...


----------



## compoopers

Not to add to your never ending backlog, but I would find a review of the ATH CKM500 verrrry interesting in comparison to your JVC FXT90 review


----------



## brencho

impressive review! i'm looking to buy my first decent pair of in-ear headphones (~$100) and wondering if you have advice for what i'm looking for. i plan to use them on the go, trains, buses, streets, possibly bike, so isolation and microphonics are things to consider. i listen to a variety of music (jazz, rock, hiphop, folk, some electronic, dubstep and classical), so ideally the headphones would be good for a broad range of music. i will mostly use them from an iphone or laptop, preferably with a headset/remote. i've been looking at etymotics hf3 (but wonder if they will sound too harsh with not enough low-end), shure se215 (though the headset add-on adds some $$), brainwavz, and i like the idea of vsonics, jvc ha-fxt90, or re-0 but those don't seem to be available with a built-in headset. are there any that i've missed that i should consider more strongly given what i'm after? not having used any of these, does one seem to come out ahead? thanks in advance!


----------



## dustdevil

After months of searching for new earphones, I've ended up with the jvc fx40 which I see joker have already listed them on the in progress list, I am really impressed, especially for their price.


----------



## JohannLiebert

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You should probably define what those words mean to you.


 
   
  A fun(v-shaped),musical, not relaxed signature


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





brencho said:


> impressive review! i'm looking to buy my first decent pair of in-ear headphones (~$100) and wondering if you have advice for what i'm looking for. i plan to use them on the go, trains, buses, streets, possibly bike, so isolation and microphonics are things to consider. i listen to a variety of music (jazz, rock, hiphop, folk, some electronic, dubstep and classical), so ideally the headphones would be good for a broad range of music. i will mostly use them from an iphone or laptop, preferably with a headset/remote. i've been looking at etymotics hf3 (but wonder if they will sound too harsh with not enough low-end), shure se215 (though the headset add-on adds some $$), brainwavz, and i like the idea of vsonics, jvc ha-fxt90, or re-0 but those don't seem to be available with a built-in headset. are there any that i've missed that i should consider more strongly given what i'm after? not having used any of these, does one seem to come out ahead? thanks in advance!


 
   
  Without having used any high-end headphones it's probably difficult to say what type of sound you'll like. The SE215 is a safe, rather mainstream-sounding set. There are bassier options such as the Beyer MMX 101 iE and Velodyne vPulse and of course more accurate sets such as the HF3 and the new MEElec A161P. I really don't think the HF3 can sound harsh but opinions on whether its bass qty is sufficient will obviously vary widely.
   
  Up in the SE215 price range you can also look at the Phonak Perfect Bass (there is a version with a mic/remote), which can later be upgraded to a regular PFE by buying the other filters from Phonak's site.
   
   
   Quote:


dustdevil said:


> After months of searching for new earphones, I've ended up with the jvc fx40 which I see joker have already listed them on the in progress list, I am really impressed, especially for their price.


 
   
  I've had them for a few months now. I think the drivers are quite good, though I don't much like the sound overall.
   
   
  Quote: 





johannliebert said:


> A fun(v-shaped),musical, not relaxed signature


 
   
  JVC HA-FX700 should be a good fit for that.


----------



## holyindian

Hi Joker, i brought a GR07 IEM after reading your review months back.
  Now i would like to take a step further and get a new IEM, I like the GR07, but i think it does lack a bit of bass, and a bit harsh on treble, and  I am not a bass head, but listening to Metal on these sound like jazz, techno beats sounds like a joke (I know am i over exaggerating)  But i dont want a bassy IEM, all i want is an *all rounder IEM*, where Bass sounds right as much as it shud be, and music should sound the way its supposed to be. My DAP is a Cowon J3 player.
  I hear good things about Westone 4, but again, i also hear they are identical to GR07 but a larger version.
   
  Your Alclair Reference review puts the IEM on 4 spot in terms of sound quality. Not sure if thats the one for me. :S
  I listen to Techno, Metal, Rock, Classic Rock.. bollywood etc.
   
  Please guide.


----------



## Aizen Taicho

Hey Joker good review a bit long but very detailed, that said can you help me choose between the Jvc Ftx-90 and the Shure se215? They are around the same price at FS and they both have very high ratings but no direct comparisons. Which do you think is better for bass and has at least decent treble and mids?


----------



## monoglycer

Quote: 





aizen taicho said:


> Hey Joker good review a bit long but very detailed, that said can you help me choose between the Jvc Ftx-90 and the Shure se215? They are around the same price at FS and they both have very high ratings but no direct comparisons. Which do you think is better for bass and has at least decent treble and mids?


 
  Having owned both, the FXT90 is superior to the 215s in all aspects of sound quality. The FXT90 might not reach as low in the bass but makes up for it by having treble.


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've had them for a few months now. I think the drivers are quite good, though I don't much like the sound overall.


 
  What don't you like about their sound? and what score will you give them?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





holyindian said:


> Hi Joker, i brought a GR07 IEM after reading your review months back.
> Now i would like to take a step further and get a new IEM, I like the GR07, but i think it does lack a bit of bass, and a bit harsh on treble, and  I am not a bass head, but listening to Metal on these sound like jazz, techno beats sounds like a joke (I know am i over exaggerating)  But i dont want a bassy IEM, all i want is an *all rounder IEM*, where Bass sounds right as much as it shud be, and music should sound the way its supposed to be. My DAP is a Cowon J3 player.
> I hear good things about Westone 4, but again, i also hear they are identical to GR07 but a larger version.
> 
> ...


 
   
  You might like the W4 but don't expect it to be much bassier than the GR07. Same goes for the Alclair Reference - the GR07 is not bass-light by high-end earphone standards. You would probably like the Yamaha EPH-100 over the GR07, at least in terms of sound signature. As for an upgrade, perhaps the JVC FX700 would be up your alley - definitely bassier than the GR07 but controlled enough to be enjoyable. Same goes for the treble.
   
   
  Quote: 





aizen taicho said:


> Hey Joker good review a bit long but very detailed, that said can you help me choose between the Jvc Ftx-90 and the Shure se215? They are around the same price at FS and they both have very high ratings but no direct comparisons. Which do you think is better for bass and has at least decent treble and mids?


 
   
  I think the FXT90 is the better earphone overall unless you specifically don't want the more forward mids and treble of the JVCs. Bass quantity is not too different between the two - if you're happy with one, you'll be happy with the other as well.
   
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> What don't you like about their sound? and what score will you give them?


 
   
  I haven't finished my write-up yet but there are three basic things that bother me about it - recessed lower mids, excessive treble emphasis, and the note thickness (or lack thereof).


----------



## brencho

Thanks for the advice! THe HF3 and the A161 look intriguing. Should I consider adding the new Audio-technica ckm500 to the list, or the brainwavz M4? Both are available with inline mic/remote, but I haven't heard much about either.


----------



## Trotsk

Hey joker, what do you think a good IEM under 150$ for hardstyle would be? (http://www.fear.fm/radio/player)   I already own the Hf3, Turbines, and M6.. which all work nicely. Yet I found the turbines lacked the impact I wanted being too bassy.
   
     Anyways Im getting ready for another IEM and would value your opinion as I'm not really sure what I would look for regarding a non bass dominated punchy explosive sound or if there is such a thing.


----------



## holyindian

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You might like the W4 but don't expect it to be much bassier than the GR07. Same goes for the Alclair Reference - the GR07 is not bass-light by high-end earphone standards. You would probably like the Yamaha EPH-100 over the GR07, at least in terms of sound signature. As for an upgrade, perhaps the JVC FX700 would be up your alley - definitely bassier than the GR07 but controlled enough to be enjoyable. Same goes for the treble.


 
   
  Hi Joker, thanks for your response. I take your words like words set on the stone. I am really not looking for a bassy IEM. But a step up above GR07, Rich in every way, an all rounder. Please guide. Does westone 4 do that magic, or something else?


----------



## 2jono

Hi Joker ,
   
  Im curious of your opinion on the phillips she3580 ?
   
  Your encyclopediac iem knowledge base is appreciated and invaluable )


----------



## victorbrt

Hi Joker,
   
  Unfortunately, my ECCI PR401 broke yesterday and so, I'm looking for a new IEM.
   
  I'm looking for three models in special: Triple Fi, FX500 and FXT90, but I have a question about FXT90... how you describe the sound signature of these? It tends to the V-shaped side like the Triple Fi and FX500/FX700?
   
  And... between the FXT90 and Triple Fi, what you prefer? How you compare them?
   
  Thanks.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Hey Joker,
   
  How would you compare all these three IEMs: Xears XE200PRO, Xears Nature N3i and Brainwavz M2.
   
  Are both the Xears model better than the Brainwavz M2? If yes so how?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





brencho said:


> Thanks for the advice! THe HF3 and the A161 look intriguing. Should I consider adding the new Audio-technica ckm500 to the list, or the brainwavz M4? Both are available with inline mic/remote, but I haven't heard much about either.


 
   
  I can't comment on the M4 or CKM500 as I haven't heard either
   
   
  Quote: 





trotsk said:


> Hey joker, what do you think a good IEM under 150$ for hardstyle would be? (http://www.fear.fm/radio/player)   I already own the Hf3, Turbines, and M6.. which all work nicely. Yet I found the turbines lacked the impact I wanted being too bassy.
> 
> Anyways Im getting ready for another IEM and would value your opinion as I'm not really sure what I would look for regarding a non bass dominated punchy explosive sound or if there is such a thing.


 
   
  I don't really like giving recommendations for genres since genre selection does not always shape sound signature preferences (plus hardstyle is not something I personally listen to). If you were to state what you'd like to see improved compared to both the HF3 and Turbines that would be a good start. 
   
   
  Quote: 





holyindian said:


> Hi Joker, thanks for your response. I take your words like words set on the stone. I am really not looking for a bassy IEM. But a step up above GR07, Rich in every way, an all rounder. Please guide. Does westone 4 do that magic, or something else?


 
   
  The W4 has more mid-bass but not as much bass depth as the GR07 IMO, which is why I said it won't necessarily have more bass quantity overall. It's a good all-rounder, I just don't know if that will be sufficient for you.
   
  Quote: 





2jono said:


> Hi Joker ,
> 
> Im curious of your opinion on the phillips she3580 ?
> 
> Your encyclopediac iem knowledge base is appreciated and invaluable )


 
   
  I am a fan of the 3580. For such a cheap product it is a very capable, mildly v-shaped IEM with great bass depth.
   
   
  Quote: 





victorbrt said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Unfortunately, my ECCI PR401 broke yesterday and so, I'm looking for a new IEM.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The FXT90 is not as v-shaped as those others, it has rather strong mids. I prefer the FXT90 to the TF10 but I wouldn't really say either is clearly better than the other. I tend to like the more cohesive sound of the JVCs more.
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> How would you compare all these three IEMs: Xears XE200PRO, Xears Nature N3i and Brainwavz M2.
> 
> Are both the Xears model better than the Brainwavz M2? If yes so how?


 
   
  There are reviews of all three on the front page of the thread. They are around the same level in terms of sound quality though I tend to think the Xears sets have better presentations.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Thanks joker


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am a fan of the 3580. For such a cheap product it is a very capable, mildly v-shaped IEM with great bass depth.


 
   
  That's something that I wanted to hear from you for a long time since the SHE3580 showed up at the "Planned Review" list 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I too, am pretty amazed by the value it possess.


----------



## imackler

Are there any other sub-$500 custom iems you'd like to review?


----------



## brencho

Hi Joker, thanks for your response! I have a third (and final!) question to ask before I take a plunge and pick a pair. I'm still considering the HF3 and A161. How do you think the triple-fi 10s compare to those? Thanks and i'll post my impressions once i decide!


----------



## BloodyPenguin

Great Thread *ljokerl*!  I've used it many times to help others buy IEMs!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
   
  Subscribed.
   
  ..


----------



## Emospence

Joker, 
   
  Shure SE215, Yamaha EPH-100, Brainwavz B2.
   
  Which would you recommend for a balanced sound with clarity?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> That's something that I wanted to hear from you for a long time since the SHE3580 showed up at the "Planned Review" list
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  If only I could get around to those planned reviews..
   
  Quote: 





imackler said:


> Are there any other sub-$500 custom iems you'd like to review?


 
   
  Sure, there's plenty I would be happy to listen to. Wouldn't mind a benchmark from a more mainstream manufacturer, the JH5 for example. Also lower-end stuff that I think might perform well based on listening to other products in the line, such as the entry-level UMs and the CTM-300. And of course there are plenty of complete unknowns (to me at least), such as the entry-level models from Hidition and Starkey, that I'm curious about. 
   
  Quote: 





brencho said:


> Hi Joker, thanks for your response! I have a third (and final!) question to ask before I take a plunge and pick a pair. I'm still considering the HF3 and A161. How do you think the triple-fi 10s compare to those? Thanks and i'll post my impressions once i decide!


 
   
  The TF10s are a lot more v-shaped than either of those, with enhanced bass and added treble sparkle. 
   
  Quote: 





emospence said:


> Joker,
> 
> Shure SE215, Yamaha EPH-100, Brainwavz B2.
> 
> Which would you recommend for a balanced sound with clarity?


 
   
  The B2.


----------



## Emospence

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The B2.


 
   
  Thanks!


----------



## GigaFi

Is the DN-18 being vented a typo? I can't find any indication of it being open on mine.
   
  Also, why is this thread not stickied/put up there on useful links? This might be one of if not THE most active threads on this forum!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gigafi said:


> Is the DN-18 being vented a typo? I can't find any indication of it being open on mine.
> 
> Also, why is this thread not stickied/put up there on useful links? This might be one of if not THE most active threads on this forum!


 
   
  The isolation text was mixed up between the DN-17 and DN-18. Fixed now, thanks.


----------



## ByShine

Wow..


----------



## l00l

Amazing thread, thanks!
   
  I am looking for in ears up to € 100. I currently own Sennheiser CX300II and want to upgrade.
   
  I will be using them mainly with my ipod and really enjoyed the sound of the Sennheiser HD 598 if that is any help in terms of what I like in terms of sound. Balanced and clear with a punchy bass is what I am looking for I guess. And some sort of surround feeling is important to me, if that is at all possible with in ear headphones. Will be using them for all sorts of genres excpet electronic music.
   
  Right now I feel like the Beyerdynamics DTX101iE (€ 55) would be a good choice. Would you guys agree? How about alternatives??
   
  many thanks


----------



## FlySweep

byshine said:


> Wow..


 
   
  This should be EVERYONE'S first post at Head-Fi.


----------



## suman134

the beyersynamics are nice , a bit of bass hump not more , do you need the ie version for your ipod ? if no then try the dtx 100 . try these FXT90 , joker says they are really nice , you can try cc51
   or ue 500 ?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> byshine said:
> 
> 
> > Wow..
> ...


 
  instead of "HELP ME" (looking at myself -_-)


----------



## l00l

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> the beyersynamics are nice , a bit of bass hump not more , do you need the ie version for your ipod ? if no then try the dtx 100 . try these FXT90 , joker says they are really nice , you can try cc51
> or ue 500 ?


 
   
  Are the dtx 100 an outdated model or something since I can´t find them on the Beyer website. In any case they are not cheaper than the 101iE, or is there any other reason you would recommend the 100 over the 101iE? The others you mentioned don´t seem to be very common in Europe, lil hard to find.


----------



## suman134

for a common iem try the ultimate ears 600 , sony xba1 , they are available in europe easily . i will say get the ue 600 , they got a bit of bass and nice clarity .


----------



## suman134

beyers are not bad at all , you can go for 101ie .


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If only I could get around to those planned reviews..


 
   
  I really wish I could help in any way I can.
   
  All I can say is, thank you and don't give up!


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  if all of us just stop asking him every day


----------



## l00l

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> beyers are not bad at all , you can go for 101ie .


 
   
  What about Klipsch S4 or Shure SE215 as alternatives?
   
  Especially the SE215 seem to add more sound quality compared to the 101iE. Is that right?


----------



## suman134

se 215 is awesome for bass if you need bass , has good clarity , but is over ear styled , dont go for image s4 , its too muddy and bass is huge too , much colored and yes s4 is fun . se 215 is a nice choice , i will suggest it over the dtx 101ie , not over sony ex 600 or ue 600 , but ue dont have much bass . se 215 is best for you , just make sure your not buying the old batch , they had some trouble with the connector .


----------



## l00l

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> se 215 is best for you , just make sure your not buying the old batch , they had some trouble with the connector .


 
  I already ran into that problem reading through a review on here. Is it definetly solved with the new batch?? How can I identify the new batch? After a certain date or something?
   
  I will try the se215 in a store next week, if they are comfortable and I can make sure the cable problem is solved than I will go for the se215 (€ 88). If not Beyer 101ie (€ 60) will be my choice.


----------



## mondrin

After a week of reading this excellent thread (plus others) I have finally pulled the trigger on 3 IEM's (RE-ZERO, A161p and EPH-100) in the hopes that one will make my ears happy.  I figure at least if none of them are keepers that I'll have a much better idea of what I'm after in an IEM.  It's difficult to find places to buy the IEM's that have a good return policy.  Wish me luck!


----------



## zephyr90

Quick question:
  If you could get both the Meelec SP51 and the Brainwavz M4 for roughly 30$, which one would you pick?
  Both are with mic and mic is a necessity in my case.
  Hope you guys can enlighten me


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





l00l said:


> Are the dtx 100 an outdated model or something since I can´t find them on the Beyer website. In any case they are not cheaper than the 101iE, or is there any other reason you would recommend the 100 over the 101iE? The others you mentioned don´t seem to be very common in Europe, lil hard to find.


 
   
  The DTX60/80/100 were all discontinued in favor of the newer DTX71/DTX101. I don't think there will be much of a sound difference (if any) between the DTX100 and DTX101.
   
   
  Quote: 





l00l said:


> I already ran into that problem reading through a review on here. Is it definetly solved with the new batch?? How can I identify the new batch? After a certain date or something?
> 
> I will try the se215 in a store next week, if they are comfortable and I can make sure the cable problem is solved than I will go for the se215 (€ 88). If not Beyer 101ie (€ 60) will be my choice.


 
   
  Trying before buying is always the best way to go. For what it's worth the 101 iE won't be as clear or detailed as the SE215, partly because it has heavier bass (esp mid-bass), but it has warmer, more forward mids. 
   
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> After a week of reading this excellent thread (plus others) I have finally pulled the trigger on 3 IEM's (RE-ZERO, A161p and EPH-100) in the hopes that one will make my ears happy.  I figure at least if none of them are keepers that I'll have a much better idea of what I'm after in an IEM.  It's difficult to find places to buy the IEM's that have a good return policy.  Wish me luck!


 
   
  Sounds like three great choices, if only to pave the way for future purchases. Good luck!
   
  Quote: 





zephyr90 said:


> Quick question:
> If you could get both the Meelec SP51 and the Brainwavz M4 for roughly 30$, which one would you pick?
> Both are with mic and mic is a necessity in my case.
> Hope you guys can enlighten me


 
   
  I haven't heard the M4 but that sounds like a good price for the SP51P, especially if you like heavier bass.


----------



## suman134

just make sure your buying from a well known seller and dont go for the cheapest deal , take one in between , if encountered trouble , make sure you have a service center near by . there are some sites which give a replacement in 30 days if not happy , chose them if there is any .


----------



## abhijollyguy

@Joker
   
  Is *Xears XE200PRO* also better than the Fischer Audio Eterna Rev.1? How would you compare them bass-wise and overall sound? Is it a good decision to buy *Xears XE200PRO* and sell the Brainwavz M2?


----------



## jarrett

What do you think out of the newer Fischer Audio models would suit me most? SBA-03, Jazz, Paradigm v3, Tandem, Consonance? I guess I gravitate to the Balanced or Warm+Sweet spectrum, but do not like obviously recessed mids; the PR401 has a bit of that, but is fixable in EQ. GR07 are for sure my favourite with their sub-bass presence.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @Joker
> 
> Is *Xears XE200PRO* also better than the Fischer Audio Eterna Rev.1? How would you compare them bass-wise and overall sound? Is it a good decision to buy *Xears XE200PRO* and sell the Brainwavz M2?


 
   
  If you like the signature, the XE200Pro is better. If you don't - worse. Compared to the Eterna it is more balanced, with less relative emphasis on the bass and more on the midrange. 
   
   
  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> What do you think out of the newer Fischer Audio models would suit me most? SBA-03, Jazz, Paradigm v3, Tandem, Consonance? I guess I gravitate to the Balanced or Warm+Sweet spectrum, but do not like obviously recessed mids; the PR401 has a bit of that, but is fixable in EQ. GR07 are for sure my favourite with their sub-bass presence.


 
   
  The Consonance is somewhat v-shaped (more so than PR401) and the Tandem hasn't got nearly as much treble as the GR07. The Jazz would probably suit you best singature-wise but it's not on-par with the others technically. The SBA-03 is the flattest and most balanced, with slightly relaxed treble. It has more bass than an Ety but not as much as a GR07.


----------



## 7Heaven

hello
   
  any options for something better/upgrade to the E30 (maybe a fuller sound?) , keeping a fairly good comfort and built and offering some more isolation?
   
  thanks


----------



## rt310

Hi, joker
  Was wondering what IEMS you plan on reviewing next? Would like to see you review the ASG 1.2's if that's possible.


----------



## vaed

Hey |joker|, How do you think the FX40 matches up against the FXT90? I'm curious as they both use the same technology, but have a large price gap.


----------



## scootsit

I have been subscribed to this thread for one day and am already exhausted. Joker, you have one hell of a job!


----------



## suman134

cc51 , do you need that bass ? if yes then cc51 , if no then there are many .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





7heaven said:


> hello
> 
> any options for something better/upgrade to the E30 (maybe a fuller sound?) , keeping a fairly good comfort and built and offering some more isolation?
> 
> thanks


 
   
  Maybe the JVC FX90? Good all-rounder but warmer-sounding than E30 with a bit more bass and more forward mids. 
   
   
  Quote: 





rt310 said:


> Hi, joker
> Was wondering what IEMS you plan on reviewing next? Would like to see you review the ASG 1.2's if that's possible.


 
   
  There's a list of planned reviews on the front page of the thread, below the summary table
   
  Quote: 





vaed said:


> Hey |joker|, How do you think the FX40 matches up against the FXT90? I'm curious as they both use the same technology, but have a large price gap.


 
   
  Not well - I appreciate what the driver of the FX40 is capable of but I can't get myself to like the tuning. The lower mids are too far back (not true of the FXT90) and the top end is thin and too prominent compared to the mids. There is also a lack of a center image to the presentation, just an (admittedly very airy) left-right soundstage.
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I have been subscribed to this thread for one day and am already exhausted. Joker, you have one hell of a job!


 
   
  One hell of a hobby, though it often feels like a job 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. And thanks


----------



## kingpage

Although I have ordered a pair of M4, I think it's still a good idea if you review the M4 for others in addition to your reviews of M1/M2/M3 and B2.


----------



## 7Heaven

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Maybe the JVC FX90? Good all-rounder but warmer-sounding than E30 with a bit more bass and more forward mids.


 
  thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kingpage said:


> Although I have ordered a pair of M4, I think it's still a good idea if you review the M4 for others in addition to your reviews of M1/M2/M3 and B2.


 
   
  Unfortunately I don't have one to review and haven't really had the time to pick up new gear lately.


----------



## budha

So guys, I´m looking for and upgrade into the CIEM world, i´ve had the Etymotic MC3, love the neutral sound, missing the bass. Bought the Vsonic GR07 and its better in the bass region but not the rest. What CIEM should i be looking for if i would want a Etymotic with better bass?
   
  1964ears T?
  Alclair Ref?


----------



## zephyr90

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> cc51 , do you need that bass ? if yes then cc51 , if no then there are many .


 
   
  Many for 30$? I heard the CC51s Bass was pretty balanced with the silver ports screwed in, is that not so?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





budha said:


> So guys, I´m looking for and upgrade into the CIEM world, i´ve had the Etymotic MC3, love the neutral sound, missing the bass. Bought the Vsonic GR07 and its better in the bass region but not the rest. What CIEM should i be looking for if i would want a Etymotic with better bass?
> 
> 1964ears T?
> Alclair Ref?


 
   
  It's very difficult for an enhanced-bass IEM to still sound neutral - the VSonic is probably as close as it gets before you start to stray far from neutrality. One way to go is something extremely dynamic such as the Phonak PFE 232 or Spiral Ear 3-way but keep in mind they will only sound bassy when the track calls for it. Plu the 232, like the GR07, will likely sound edgier up top than your MC3. 
   
  The 1964-T is not an Etymotic signature at all - it's too thick and not flat enough. The Alclairs are much closer but warmer and again not as smooth up top.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's very difficult for an enhanced-bass IEM to still sound neutral - the VSonic is probably as close as it gets before you start to stray far from neutrality. One way to go is something extremely dynamic such as the Phonak PFE 232 or Spiral Ear 3-way but keep in mind they will only sound bassy when the track calls for it. Plu the 232, like the GR07, will likely sound edgier up top than your MC3.
> 
> The 1964-T is not an Etymotic signature at all - it's too thick and not flat enough. The Alclairs are much closer but warmer and again not as smooth up top.


 
  I love this honest perspective. There is no perfect especially in the world of headphones which by definition is an unnatural presentation. When you're out on the move, more bass weight sounds more neutral than actual neutral while sitting still etc. There's still better and worse and lots of great music to be had but this sort of balanced perspective is always refreshing.


----------



## WakiDabeast

can't help but notice how similar the SE215 and the Miles Davis Tributes are... slight difference in sound stage and just that odd treble spike (a small one) on the Shures. The Tributes imo are just a refined SE215 with quite a bit better detail retrieval and somehow better frequency distinction thanks to that "speaker like stage"


----------



## kingpage

M4 is only USD$28 shipped from mp4nation, in case you didn't know (or change your mind).
   
  I love reading your reviews. They are always comprehensive, well-written and fun to read. Including nozzle sizes is a nice touch.Thank you!


----------



## suman134

nope thats the cc51 , thats hippo vb or sp51 you are talking about . cant say about hippo vb , but sp51 has some huge bass settings , their bass is madness . cc51 , clear ceramic 51 has nice nad cool bass , at just $55 with awesome clarity at the price .


----------



## suman134

joker suggested jvc fxt90 which is $ 135 .


----------



## vaed

There are a ton of FXT90's available in the FS forum for <$100 right now.


----------



## budha

|joker| > Thanks for your honest opinion. So it would even be better to go for the Ety er4pt as an uppgrade. Sadly the Vsonic doesnt fit my ears good, keeps falling out.
  Regards


----------



## ljokerl

Added Spiral Ear SE 3-way Reference. Isolation score at 5.5/5 for now, until I figure out if/how I want to rescale the entire category. 
   
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> *(1A4) Spiral Ear SE 3-way Reference*
> 
> 
> Reviewed June 2012
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





kingpage said:


> M4 is only USD$28 shipped from mp4nation, in case you didn't know (or change your mind).
> 
> I love reading your reviews. They are always comprehensive, well-written and fun to read. Including nozzle sizes is a nice touch.Thank you!


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  I am just trying to avoid stockpiling more IEMs for the moment since I'm having trouble keeping up with the reviews.
   
   
  Quote: 





budha said:


> |joker| > Thanks for your honest opinion. So it would even be better to go for the Ety er4pt as an uppgrade. Sadly the Vsonic doesnt fit my ears good, keeps falling out.
> Regards


 
   
  I've never heard the ER4PT but I don't think any of the other Ety monitors pump out significantly more bass than the MC5.


----------



## FlySweep

ljokerl said:


> Isolation *(5.5/5)* – The isolation of the deep-fit silicone shells puts every other earphone in my collection to shame.  So effective your wife won't even bother _trying_ to yell at you when you're wearing them.


----------



## s0lar

Quote: 





flysweep said:


>


 
  LOL.
  I do think it's not a good idea to make a scale to 5 and then credit a 5.5.
  You have scaled down the SQ in the past, I think it's better to do the same for the isolation.
  Really liked the review, again.


----------



## kingpage

Perhaps, scaling all the sub-scores up to have 10 as maximum instead of 5, in accordance with the scores for SQ and value.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





s0lar said:


> LOL.
> I do think it's not a good idea to make a scale to 5 and then credit a 5.5.
> You have scaled down the SQ in the past, I think it's better to do the same for the isolation.
> Really liked the review, again.


 
   
  It's a temporary solution. Re-scaling the whole thread took forever when it was "just" 100 IEMs, I will probably need to dedicate an entire day to fixing it this time around. I have also toyed with the idea of making everything /10 instead of /5 for simplicity but to be honest I've always liked differentiating SQ and value from the other categories.


----------



## Tilpo

I think it's fine as it is. 
Changing it will take an incredible amount of time, and I don't really think it makes it that much better.


----------



## kingpage

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's a temporary solution. Re-scaling the whole thread took forever when it was "just" 100 IEMs, I will probably need to dedicate an entire day to fixing it this time around. I have also toyed with the idea of making everything /10 instead of /5 for simplicity but to be honest I've always liked differentiating SQ and value from the other categories.


 
  Well, you could make SQ and value 100 instead of 10, and other categories 10.


----------



## s0lar

I completely understand.
  Just keep on bringing in those great reviews!
   
  There is something I was wondering for a long time. You used to review only universals and when you started out reviewing customs I thought it was a one time thing. There were a few excpetions but now the thread contains a lot. Ever thought of making a separate thread for those?
  Like you have for the on-ears.
   
  Last one: I am stuck between IEMs. I like the mids of the RE262, but don't like to carry around an amp. I like the sound a lot.
  I like the treble of the Brainwavz B2 but they don't stay in my ears. Fit and isolation is OK but on the move it's not.
  GR07 is excellent but is nothing stands out, I prefer RE262. I have others but neither one is perfect, perhaps a suggestion?


----------



## kingpage

I wouldn't want the customs in a separate thread. Those reviews of custom IEMs put the universal IEMs in perspective.


----------



## dustdevil

I don't think making everything /10 is a good idea, let say a pair of earphones scored 4/5 on comfort, if it is changed to 8/10 the difference between the comfort that the earphones and the perfect earphones provide seems larger. Also I don't think it is worth such long period of time just to get a minor issue fixed.
  I suggest to just leave it alone or perhaps make it into a 5+.


----------



## kingpage

I totally agree with no change or a change that's easy for you to work with. We can and will adapt to whatever you have for us.


----------



## Mysterious

Would you say the Atrio m5 with mg7 drivers are the bargain of the century for 100$ or is their something much better for the same price ( Bassy IEM ) ?
 Also how would the CKS77's compare with the m5 ?


----------



## ProjectDenz

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Would you say the Atrio m5 with mg7 drivers are the bargain of the century for 100$ or is their something much better for the same price ( Bassy IEM ) ?


 
   
  Very very hard to beat for the price if you want a very bassy iem.


----------



## suman134

i brought myself this new awesome ue 600 , one thing i can say is the bass is flat and instrument separation is better then the cc51 . really nice and big sound stage . same bad cable as the cc51 , i mean weak . i hope joker will drop those old discontinued ultimate ears and will add this one in his " to be ... " list .
   

   
  the boxes and the boxers .


----------



## Anaxilus

I don't think it makes sense to rescale till you blow the sound score out.  One phone as an outlier in just isolation doesn't require rescaling the whole thread.  The Spiral Ears kick isolation butt.  Done, move on.


----------



## Mysterious

How does the cks77 compare with the atrio m5 ?


----------



## ByShine

Does anyone know where authorized dealers sell to canada?
   
  I have only bought from amazon and mp4nation before and I wanna try to astrotect 
   
does (lendmeurears.com) ship to  canada?


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





byshine said:


> Does anyone know where authorized dealers sell to canada?
> 
> I have only bought from amazon and mp4nation before and I wanna try to astrotect
> 
> does (lendmeurears.com) ship to  canada?


 
lendmeurears.com ship worldwide.
you can also search on ebay, and there's the lendmeurears ebay store too


----------



## ByShine

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> lendmeurears.com ship worldwide.
> you can also search on ebay, and there's the lendmeurears ebay store too


 
  Thanks. Do you know any other good stores that ship to canada/worldwide?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





s0lar said:


> I completely understand.
> Just keep on bringing in those great reviews!
> 
> There is something I was wondering for a long time. You used to review only universals and when you started out reviewing customs I thought it was a one time thing. There were a few excpetions but now the thread contains a lot. Ever thought of making a separate thread for those?
> ...


 
   
  I think the six (am I forgetting any?) customs would feel lonely in their own thread and I do agree that using the same scale as I use for universals makes sense for perspective (and also cuts down on the number of questions I'll have to answer about that). Plus I don't think I'll be adding any more in the near future. 
   
  Do you need the warmth of the RE262? If not, the RE272 might work. It gets the treble much more right than the RE262 IMO and the mids are still exceptional, just a bit different. Easier to drive, too. Other options - Ortofon e-Q5, maybe Sony EX600/EX1000. Not sure which will work for you in terms of fit. 
   
   
  Quote: 





kingpage said:


> I wouldn't want the customs in a separate thread. Those reviews of custom IEMs put the universal IEMs in perspective.


 
   
  Agreed
   
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> I don't think making everything /10 is a good idea, let say a pair of earphones scored 4/5 on comfort, if it is changed to 8/10 the difference between the comfort that the earphones and the perfect earphones provide seems larger. Also I don't think it is worth such long period of time just to get a minor issue fixed.
> I suggest to just leave it alone or perhaps make it into a 5+.


 
   
  Problem with 5+ (which is what I had for ACS Ety tips before) was that it doesn't factor into calculations.
   
   
  Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Would you say the Atrio m5 with mg7 drivers are the bargain of the century for 100$ or is their something much better for the same price ( Bassy IEM ) ?
> Also how would the CKS77's compare with the m5 ?


 
   
  Agree with *ProjectDenz*, very hard to beat Atrios for bass at that price. No idea what the CKS77 sounds like.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> I don't think it makes sense to rescale till you blow the sound score out.  One phone as an outlier in just isolation doesn't require rescaling the whole thread.  The Spiral Ears kick isolation butt.  Done, move on.


 
   
  This seems like the most logical course of action for the time being. When I am feeling less pressed by reviews I'll figure out how to fix it all per all of the suggestions here.
   
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> lendmeurears.com ship worldwide.
> you can also search on ebay, and there's the lendmeurears ebay store too


 
   
  +1 lendmeurears is a worldwide Astrotec distributor


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  Did you try TDK EB950? If yes so how will you compare them with the Sunrise X-IE?


----------



## mymail0808

Hi Joker;
   
  Learn that you haven't heard CKS77 before, how about the CKM500?
  You may aware that a friend next door grade the CKS77 & CKM500 sky high good.
   
  actually i am very interest about how you think about these two, any chance in the next future?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> Did you try TDK EB950? If yes so how will you compare them with the Sunrise X-IE?


 
   
  Have not heard any of the new TDKs.
   
   
  Quote: 





mymail0808 said:


> Hi Joker;
> 
> Learn that you haven't heard CKS77 before, how about the CKM500?
> You may aware that a friend next door grade the CKS77 & CKM500 sky high good.
> ...


 
   
  Haven't heard those, either. Everything I plan to review is listed in the queue on the front page of this thread.


----------



## Kaffeemann

Oh Supreme Grandmaster Joker!
   
  May I ask a question?
   
  Is there any IEM that sounds like the Brainwavz B2 (clarity, detail, treble..) but with a bit more bass?
   
(I can't afford customs...)


----------



## Tilpo

kaffeemann said:


> Oh Supreme Grandmaster Joker!
> 
> May I ask a question?
> 
> ...



Unrelated to your question, but I see you have a Tokyo Jihen avatar, very nice to see other people share my favorite band.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kaffeemann said:


> Oh Supreme Grandmaster Joker!
> 
> May I ask a question?
> 
> ...


 
   
  Not exactly like B2 but perhaps the balance of the VSonic GR07 would be up your alley. There are other sets that stray from the B2 here and there but generally offer clarity, detail, and good treble presence with more bass - the Sony EX600/1000, j-Phonic K2, and Phonak PFE 232, for example. The latter do reach into customs territory already.


----------



## WakiDabeast

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's a temporary solution. Re-scaling the whole thread took forever when it was "just" 100 IEMs, I will probably need to dedicate an entire day to fixing it this time around. I have also toyed with the idea of making everything /10 instead of /5 for simplicity but to be honest I've always liked differentiating SQ and value from the other categories.


 
  actually I like how it is 5.5/5 so people know it isolates excessively for a lot of environments. Whether or not you intended for it to be like that, I do think it is helpful, and in a way it acts as a warning.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





kaffeemann said:


> Oh Supreme Grandmaster Joker!
> 
> May I ask a question?
> 
> ...


 
   
  DBA mk2 also.  Hair less treble for hair more bass.  Might be a trade off you prefer.  Also if you aren't able to insert the B2 all the way past the start of your canal because the housing is too big, the mk 2 will be no problem.


----------



## Anasz

First of all id like to thanks joker for this terrific compilation review, it has helped a complete newbie like me in a way more than i can say. I stumbled upon this post, and forum for that matter a few days back with literally no knowledge whatsoever in this field. Since then ive been scouring the internet in search for a IEM that fits my preference. 

That said, 2days ago i finally got to audition westone UM3X , westone 4, and UM miracle. Out of those 3 the one that really blew me away was westone UM3X. I really like the um "forwardness" for the lack of more proper word. The westone 4 sounded slightly muffled for me and eventhough i tried so hard to like UM miracle and i have to admit i like its bass more than of UM3X i still keep coming back to UM3X for its forwardness. 

I also read your review about alclair reference and i am somehow hooked to it eventhough i havent tested it (it is hard to find a demo due to its relatively new in the market). 
My question is, am i better off to stick with westone UM3X or will i not be dissapointed if i take the risk and order alclair reference anyway?(Those candy colors are really picking my interest too! )

Forgive my lack of articulate words, im having a hard time putting what i hear into words.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





wakidabeast said:


> actually I like how it is 5.5/5 so people know it isolates excessively for a lot of environments. Whether or not you intended for it to be like that, I do think it is helpful, and in a way it acts as a warning.


 
   
  I guess it does make a point, though it's kind of an arbitrary line to draw - I've long thought that even 'regular' Etys could be dangerous in many situations. The 3-way is downright ridiculous, though. 
   
  Quote: 





anasz said:


> First of all id like to thanks joker for this terrific compilation review, it has helped a complete newbie like me in a way more than i can say. I stumbled upon this post, and forum for that matter a few days back with literally no knowledge whatsoever in this field. Since then ive been scouring the internet in search for a IEM that fits my preference.
> That said, 2days ago i finally got to audition westone UM3X , westone 4, and UM miracle. Out of those 3 the one that really blew me away was westone UM3X. I really like the um "forwardness" for the lack of more proper word. The westone 4 sounded slightly muffled for me and eventhough i tried so hard to like UM miracle and i have to admit i like its bass more than of UM3X i still keep coming back to UM3X for its forwardness.
> I also read your review about alclair reference and i am somehow hooked to it eventhough i havent tested it (it is hard to find a demo due to its relatively new in the market).
> My question is, am i better off to stick with westone UM3X or will i not be dissapointed if i take the risk and order alclair reference anyway?(Those candy colors are really picking my interest too!
> ...


 
   
  If you like the presentation of the UM3X I'm afraid you won't like the Alclairs - they are closer to the Miracle in presentation than to the Westones. I am sure there are intimate-sounding acrylic customs with color options out there but I haven't heard any. The 1964-T is the most so out of mine but still not at the UM3X level.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  If you have listened to VSonic GR99 and VSonic GR02 Bass Edition so what score would you give them out of 10? I just want to get an idea.


----------



## luc shrine

hi joker.
  i really like my eterna v1.
  mp4nation sale the M4 only for $28. this should be a great great deal.
  some review told that M4 is bass-heavy. so how do compare brainwavz M4 with eterna?


----------



## scootsit

Joker (or anyone else, for that matter),
  I was wondering what are some cheap tips you recommend? I picked up a pair of the Monoprice 8320s, and they're pretty great, especially for the price. I've googled tips, and seem to mostly find the Monsters or the Complys which are quite pricey. What are the Monoprice 8320s of the tip world? The first time I wore them, they fit great, but with subsequent uses, I've had a poorer and poorer seal in one ear. What are some good, cheap tips?
  
  Has anyone tried the egadgetsandtoys replacements for v-moda or skullcandy?


----------



## mondrin

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> After a week of reading this excellent thread (plus others) I have finally pulled the trigger on 3 IEM's (RE-ZERO, A161p and EPH-100) in the hopes that one will make my ears happy.  I figure at least if none of them are keepers that I'll have a much better idea of what I'm after in an IEM.  It's difficult to find places to buy the IEM's that have a good return policy.  Wish me luck!


 
  As luck would have it, the one pair with the shortest return period arrived first (A161p).  I can't believe it arrived in only 2 days.  I've run it for about 2 days now but couldn't help listening to them right out of the box.  I'm a newbie to IEM's so I need to work with the tips to find one that seals well for both ears.  Even so, I was very impressed with the clear reference quality of these compared to the Klipsch S4 my wife has.  The top end is clear with far less sibilance than the S4's.  The mids are great and the bass does have good extension.  I'm concerned with overall bass levels, but will hold off on that item until I work with the tips for a better seal.  I won't get much burn in time on the other two when they arrive but hope I can do a decent comparison before my 7 day period on the A161p expires.  I'll post my results early next week.


----------



## Magicman74

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Astrotec AM-90
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks Joker, I know I asked you about these before you posted this review, I had my finger on the trigger and your review made me hit the Buy button and I'm glad I did.
  A fantastic IEM...Thanks
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/613309/astrotec-am90-a-hidden-gem-review


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> If you have listened to VSonic GR99 and VSonic GR02 Bass Edition so what score would you give them out of 10? I just want to get an idea.


 
   
  I don't have numbers for them yet but they are undoubtedly both excellent value for money. I don't see either scoring below a 7 but I haven't done enough A:Bing yet.
   
   
  Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> hi joker.
> i really like my eterna v1.
> mp4nation sale the M4 only for $28. this should be a great great deal.
> some review told that M4 is bass-heavy. so how do compare brainwavz M4 with eterna?


 
   
  I have never heard the M4
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Joker (or anyone else, for that matter),
> I was wondering what are some cheap tips you recommend? I picked up a pair of the Monoprice 8320s, and they're pretty great, especially for the price. I've googled tips, and seem to mostly find the Monsters or the Complys which are quite pricey. What are the Monoprice 8320s of the tip world? The first time I wore them, they fit great, but with subsequent uses, I've had a poorer and poorer seal in one ear. What are some good, cheap tips?
> 
> Has anyone tried the egadgetsandtoys replacements for v-moda or skullcandy?


 
   
  I usually just recommend the MEElec M11+ fit kit (in clear) for those just starting out. Has various sizes/shapes of single- and bi-flange tips (10 pairs total). All silicone so no point in comparing to Comply or Monster Supertips but it's good to have around. 
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> As luck would have it, the one pair with the shortest return period arrived first (A161p).  I can't believe it arrived in only 2 days.  I've run it for about 2 days now but couldn't help listening to them right out of the box.  I'm a newbie to IEM's so I need to work with the tips to find one that seals well for both ears.  Even so, I was very impressed with the clear reference quality of these compared to the Klipsch S4 my wife has.  The top end is clear with far less sibilance than the S4's.  The mids are great and the bass does have good extension.  I'm concerned with overall bass levels, but will hold off on that item until I work with the tips for a better seal.  I won't get much burn in time on the other two when they arrive but hope I can do a decent comparison before my 7 day period on the A161p expires.  I'll post my results early next week.


 
   
  The A161P should sound like the Fischer SBA-03 I reviewed, in which case the S4 won't stand a chance in overall accuracy.
   
   
  Quote: 





magicman74 said:


> Thanks Joker, I know I asked you about these before you posted this review, I had my finger on the trigger and your review made me hit the Buy button and I'm glad I did.
> A fantastic IEM...Thanks
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/613309/astrotec-am90-a-hidden-gem-review


 
   
  Glad you like them! Certainly a pleasant all-rounder for not very much money.


----------



## Magicman74

I give the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition a 8.5, I like them better then The Gr06 hands down.  I know they aren't really 8.5 but IMO they are the best sounding I've heard, not counting the 01 or 07..I did a review somewhere and a few other guys posted  as well..So far we've got a few guys who like them better as well..I can't wait to see what Joker has to say?, Should be interesting...My guess, GR99 7.2/3  GR02  7.7/8  maybe even 7.9.....lol, All a guess tho


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





kaffeemann said:


> Oh Supreme Grandmaster Joker!
> 
> May I ask a question?
> 
> ...


 
  You can try HiSoundAudio Golden Crystal. It's a treblehead IEM with good bass punch, texture and speed.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





magicman74 said:


> I give the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition a 8.5, I like them better then The Gr06 hands down.  I know they aren't really 8.5 but IMO they are the best sounding I've heard, not counting the 01 or 07..I did a review somewhere and a few other guys posted  as well..So far we've got a few guys who like them better as well..I can't wait to see what Joker has to say?, Should be interesting...My guess, GR99 7.2/3  GR02  7.7/8  maybe even 7.9.....lol, All a guess tho


 
   
  That's really great.


----------



## FlySweep

psygeist said:


> kaffeemann said:
> 
> 
> > Is there any IEM that sounds like the Brainwavz B2 (clarity, detail, treble..) but with a bit more bass?
> ...


 
   
  I'd second that recommendation.  I auditioned the GC quite some time ago and still remember being quite impressed with it.  Treble reminded me of a blend between the DBA & RE0.  The GC's treble wasn't quite as articulate as either one of those (but heck, what is?), but it was about as close as I've heard (given your desire for bass as well).  The GC's bass was deep, punchy, and slightly elevated.. not excessively, though as it possessed just the right presence and control for a fun sound w/o bloat or bleed.  The overall signature reminded me of the FA-011.. a wide, u-shaped curve.


----------



## Anasz

I finally bought UM3X and been loving it eversince, thanks joker for the sound reviews and advices


----------



## Emospence

Joker,
   
  I'm hunting for my next IEMs,
   
  Which of these would you give the best value?
   
  -Etymotic Research HF5 $131
  -Vsonic GR07                 $162
  -Brainwavz B2                $169
  -Vsonic GR01                $180
   
  Converted to USD for easier comparison


----------



## suman134

all of them are awesome , go for what suits you better , in over all i will say gr07 .


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





emospence said:


> Joker,
> 
> I'm hunting for my next IEMs,
> 
> ...


 
  pre-order for $109


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't have numbers for them yet but they are undoubtedly both excellent value for money. I don't see either scoring below a 7 but I haven't done enough A:Bing yet.


 
  Thanks for the reply joker so I guess both of them will score above 7 in your scale? Also would like to know about their build quality, isolation and microphonics?


----------



## kanuka

joker,
   
   
 Panasonic RP-HJE120 vs Philips SHE3580. in short, what are the sound signature difference , and which better? same price
  
 AM-90, A151 and GR06. all got the same 4/5 isolation, but which one can isolate more?
  
 thanks!


----------



## im steppo

Brilliant thread!
   
  Thank you


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't have numbers for them yet but they are undoubtedly both excellent value for money. I don't see either scoring below a 7 but I haven't done enough A:Bing yet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 What are your thoughts on the Sony hybrid tip kit?
  Thanks!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





magicman74 said:


> I give the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition a 8.5, I like them better then The Gr06 hands down.  I know they aren't really 8.5 but IMO they are the best sounding I've heard, not counting the 01 or 07..I did a review somewhere and a few other guys posted  as well..So far we've got a few guys who like them better as well..I can't wait to see what Joker has to say?, Should be interesting...My guess, GR99 7.2/3  GR02  7.7/8  maybe even 7.9.....lol, All a guess tho


 
   
  Sounds reasonable. I actually quite like the signature of the GR99 with its sub-bass (rather than mid-bass) emphasis but it's not as impressive as the other VSonics when it comes to other things.
    
  Quote:


anasz said:


> I finally bought UM3X and been loving it eversince, thanks joker for the sound reviews and advices


 
   
  Good to hear!
   
  Quote: 





emospence said:


> Joker,
> 
> I'm hunting for my next IEMs,
> 
> ...


 
   
  Really difficult to split the last three. Personally I prefer the B2s but the other two are very good in their own right.
   
   
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> pre-order for $109


 
   
  This would be the winner, then.
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thanks for the reply joker so I guess both of them will score above 7 in your scale? Also would like to know about their build quality, isolation and microphonics?


 
   
  Cable noise is average to slightly above average (3.5-4). So is isolation. Build quality is very good on both. I prefer the R02 because of angled plug, thicker cable, and inclusion of cable cinch but really not much of a difference otherwise. 
   
   
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> joker,
> 
> 
> Panasonic RP-HJE120 vs Philips SHE3580. in short, what are the sound signature difference , and which better? same price
> ...


 
   
  The HJE120 sounds like a $10 IEM to me. Its sound is not as v-shaped as that of the SHE3580 but otherwise it doesn't really have anything going for it at the moment.
   
  Isolation will depend on the tips. The AM-90 with the triples isolates very well but is not comfortable for me.
   
   
  Quote: 





im steppo said:


> Brilliant thread!
> 
> Thank you


 
   





   
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> What are your thoughts on the Sony hybrid tip kit?
> Thanks!!


 
   
  Very good to have around and fits a variety of nozzle sizes but chances are you'll only find one size you can use in the kit.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





> Very good to have around and fits a variety of nozzle sizes but chances are you'll only find one size you can use in the kit.


 
  Is that a good place to start or is there an advantage of the Meelec? I can get the Sonys for about 1/2 the price of the Meelec, and I assume both are for more or less determining the appropriate size,etc?


----------



## olear

joker, if EX1000 has a V shaped sound signature and UM3X is mid centric, what is W4?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Is that a good place to start or is there an advantage of the Meelec? I can get the Sonys for about 1/2 the price of the Meelec, and I assume both are for more or less determining the appropriate size,etc?


 
   
  With the MEE pack you'll probably find 3, maybe 4 sets that fit but at half the price you might as well try the Hybrids first. I've always paid around the same for both (~$9 for the hybrids, $10 for the MEE pack)
   
  Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, if EX1000 has a V shaped sound signature and UM3X is mid centric, what is W4?


 
   
  W4 is balanced, maybe slightly mid-centric IMO.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With the MEE pack you'll probably find 3, maybe 4 sets that fit but at half the price you might as well try the Hybrids first. I've always paid around the same for both (~$9 for the hybrids, $10 for the MEE pack)


 
  The hybrids are ~$8, shipped the MEE pack is ~$14 shipped.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With the MEE pack you'll probably find 3, maybe 4 sets that fit but at half the price you might as well try the Hybrids first. I've always paid around the same for both (~$9 for the hybrids, $10 for the MEE pack)
> 
> 
> W4 is balanced, maybe slightly mid-centric IMO.


 
  Which would you choose between EX1000 and W4?
  Thank you.


----------



## suman134

the hybrid tips are good but i dont see much isolation compared to the ordinary sony tips , its good , but has some inside out trouble . they fit relly nice on klipsch earphones .


----------



## impoki02

Thanks ljokerl for the great review!! It's explicit, and it helps me know each product clearly and efficiently.


----------



## olear

Quote: 





olear said:


> Which would you choose between EX1000 and W4?
> Thank you.


 
  Based solely on SQ.


----------



## petralian

Great post! This makes it easier yet harder (more info haha) to choose a good heaphones now.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> Which would you choose between EX1000 and W4?
> Thank you.


 
   
  Personally? The EX1000 - it suits my preferences better and is a bit more interesting (in terms of how it fits into my collection) than the W4.
   
   
  Quote: 





impoki02 said:


> Thanks ljokerl for the great review!! It's explicit, and it helps me know each product clearly and efficiently.


 
   
  You're welcome 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





petralian said:


> Great post! This makes it easier yet harder (more info haha) to choose a good heaphones now.


 
   
  Thanks, glad it's useful. The purpose of the thread was to help IEM buyers make educated decisions. Never intended to replace the hours of research you have to do when picking out a product


----------



## mondrin

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> As luck would have it, the one pair with the shortest return period arrived first (A161p).  I can't believe it arrived in only 2 days.  I've run it for about 2 days now but couldn't help listening to them right out of the box.  I'm a newbie to IEM's so I need to work with the tips to find one that seals well for both ears.  Even so, I was very impressed with the clear reference quality of these compared to the Klipsch S4 my wife has.  The top end is clear with far less sibilance than the S4's.  The mids are great and the bass does have good extension.  I'm concerned with overall bass levels, but will hold off on that item until I work with the tips for a better seal.  I won't get much burn in time on the other two when they arrive but hope I can do a decent comparison before my 7 day period on the A161p expires.  I'll post my results early next week.


 
  The RE-ZERO's arrived yesterday.  I couldn't help but take a quick listen and can already tell they are fairly different from the A161p (guessing a lot of that is the dynamic vs BA).  Hopefully the Yamaha's will show up today and after a bit of a break in for each I can what I've got.


----------



## nyonya

Hi ljokerl, could you do a quick compare of the FXT90 vs. the HiSoundAudio Crystal and the MTPC, including the treble and the aggressiveness of each?  Thanks!


----------



## mondrin

Joker, what qualitative differences in sound should I expect from a sufficent burn in period for your typical dynaimc and BA IEM's?  I've heard the BA's don't require as much burn in as dynamics.  I've got all three of my contenders now (A161p, RE-ZERO and EPH-100).  I'm concerned by the sibilance of the A161p and the slightly overwhelming bass of the EPH-100.  Not sure either will change with enough time.  Gut feel says I'll end up wanting something between the RE-ZERO nad EPH-100, or an RE-ZERO with a bit more bass or an EPH-100 with a big less.  I will withhold final opinion until I've sat down with them after at last a few days break in and do a closer evaluation, but thought I'd ask what differences I may hear.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> The RE-ZERO's arrived yesterday.  I couldn't help but take a quick listen and can already tell they are fairly different from the A161p (guessing a lot of that is the dynamic vs BA).  Hopefully the Yamaha's will show up today and after a bit of a break in for each I can what I've got.


 
   
  You should have a good time comparing the three. Balance-wise the A161P should fall somewhere between the Yamahas and HiFiMan but it's armature-based so it will still differ from both.
   
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl, could you do a quick compare of the FXT90 vs. the HiSoundAudio Crystal and the MTPC, including the treble and the aggressiveness of each?  Thanks!


 
   
  MTPC will have the most bass, followed by the FXT90 and then the Crystal. Crystal has leanest response - the other two are more fleshed out. It also has the most recessed mids - the FXT90 has upfront mids and the MTPC isn't too far behind. Treble-wise the MTPC is probably the smoothest and the FXT90 the most sparkly and energetic, with the HiSounds not far behind. This is going off memory for the MTPC since I haven't heard them in quite some time. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> Joker, what qualitative differences in sound should I expect from a sufficent burn in period for your typical dynaimc and BA IEM's?  I've heard the BA's don't require as much burn in as dynamics.  I've got all three of my contenders now (A161p, RE-ZERO and EPH-100).  I'm concerned by the sibilance of the A161p and the slightly overwhelming bass of the EPH-100.  Not sure either will change with enough time.  Gut feel says I'll end up wanting something between the RE-ZERO nad EPH-100, or an RE-ZERO with a bit more bass or an EPH-100 with a big less.  I will withhold final opinion until I've sat down with them after at last a few days break in and do a closer evaluation, but thought I'd ask what differences I may hear.


 
   
  For the A161 I wouldn't expect any change. Sibilance probably means you're not getting a very good seal - I don't much like single-flanges on those but the bi-flanges and triples don't really give me much sibilance. I never got to test the EPH-100 pre-burn-in (it was a loan) so you'll have to check on that in the EPH-100 thread. The EPH-100 will remain pretty bassy compared to the RE0 or A161.


----------



## AstralStorm

Joker: Your SE-3 kind of parallels my own SE-5 experience, with the exception of bass sluggishness and laid back sound. Bass weight is a bit more than GR07 (w/ the new MEElec tips, thanks again), but in a good way - low bass and subbass, it's also far more solid, tangible and slightly faster. I think this is the only armature that I can say beats best dynamic drivers in bass quality. Not a tinge warmer than "modernized" GR07, zero sibilance. Sound is far more intimate.
   
  It's noticeably brighter than GR07 but actually due to the infinite extension, like RE272, but better still. Detailing and soundstaging is not comparable in any way. As I've said, nanodetail and pinpoint perfect imaging. Distance is very similar to GR07's.
   
  My own pair is being refitted using new impressions. It seems that the old ones were inaccurate, which caused some seal and major comfort problems.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote:  
   
  Your SE5 has more treble and bass than the GR07?  That worries me a bit.  Starting to sound U shaped....
   
  Also starting to remind me of the different impressions of the ES5.


----------



## cutieboy1428

how about AKG K3003 vs Fitear To Go 334  , can u give me some impression


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Joker: Your SE-3 kind of parallels my own SE-5 experience, with the exception of bass sluggishness and laid back sound. Bass weight is a bit more than GR07 (w/ the new MEElec tips, thanks again), but in a good way - low bass and subbass, it's also far more solid, tangible and slightly faster. I think this is the only armature that I can say beats best dynamic drivers in bass quality. Not a tinge warmer than "modernized" GR07, zero sibilance. Sound is far more intimate.
> 
> It's noticeably brighter than GR07 but actually due to the infinite extension, like RE272, but better still. Detailing and soundstaging is not comparable in any way. As I've said, nanodetail and pinpoint perfect imaging. Distance is very similar to GR07's.
> 
> My own pair is being refitted using new impressions. It seems that the old ones were inaccurate, which caused some seal and major comfort problems.


 
   
  It seems that bass control/resolution and treble extension are two things that would be design targets when adding two more crossovers to the 3-way.
  Quote: 





cutieboy1428 said:


> how about AKG K3003 vs Fitear To Go 334  , can u give me some impression


 
   
  They don't really sound anything alike. The MH334 has more controlled bass, more forward & transparent mids, slightly better clarity, smoother treble, and darker tone. The K3003 is bassier but also more boomy, has less even bass-midrange balance, and is less smooth up through the treble (and quite a bit brighter except with the bass filter).


----------



## kanuka

is the GR06 worth the double price from the GR99 ?


----------



## suman134

i think the gr06 worth the price , cuz sound quality dont multiply , a turbile pro gold is not 4 times better then a gr06 , but is priced 4 times more .


----------



## ich1ban

Does anyone know of any IEMs that sound similar to the GR07, however is worn straight down? not a fan of the over-the-ear design at all.
   
  Also if possible, maybe a bit bassier like the Sennheiser CX300s? 
   
  I was looking at the Vsonic GR01 and Klipsch X10i, however I'm not sure how either sound, maybe leaning towards the X10i although people say it doesn't sound as good as the GR07/GR01 however has more bass despite costing a lot more, and the GR01 doesn't have much bass. 
   
  Open to suggestions, any advice peoples?


----------



## suman134

why you are not looking at the triple fi from ultimate ears ? what happens when you tend to go up in the tree , it leans towards clarity , speed and accuracy , so the bass amount goes down , it dont boom , dont hit too hard cuz that affacts speed . triple fi dose good with 3 driver .


----------



## suman134

oh oh i forgot , bass like cx 300 ? monster , yes , yes , they got ample bass , try the turbine pros , like copper or gold .


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> why you are not looking at the triple fi from ultimate ears ? what happens when you tend to go up in the tree , it leans towards clarity , speed and accuracy , so the bass amount goes down , it dont boom , dont hit too hard cuz that affacts speed . triple fi dose good with 3 driver .


 
  I imagine it would be fit issues with those, particularly if he doesn't like over ears


----------



## ich1ban

Yes I'm looking for ones that aren't over the ears at all, was planning on the ATH-CK10 but they're over the ears as far as I know from looking at the pics and some reviews.
   
  Not looking for anything too bassy, just anything that sounds like the GR07 would be great, and a tiny bit more bass if possible would be perfect.


----------



## suman134

monster turb pro gold , and you can have triple fi with out going over ear . or just go for xba-3 ip , which comes with mic . no high end bump , but got them good . or it seems if you can get the gr01 . dont think they do bass like gr07 , or go for panas , RP-HJE900 .
   panas do bass and highs too .


----------



## suman134

i hate the over ear style too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 , have tried them straight , straighten the hard 3 inches , looks bad , falls a bit , but straight . isnt it .


----------



## eke2k6

ich1ban said:


> Yes I'm looking for ones that aren't over the ears at all, was planning on the ATH-CK10 but they're over the ears as far as I know from looking at the pics and some reviews.
> 
> Not looking for anything too bassy, just anything that sounds like the GR07 would be great, and a tiny bit more bass if possible would be perfect.




You can actually wear the gr07 straight down by reversing the channels


----------



## ich1ban

Yes I know but I use them for gaming, and they have very good directional sound.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> is the GR06 worth the double price from the GR99 ?


 
   
  Kind of a difficult question to answer - diminishing returns, personal decision, etc., etc.. If we were all trying to avoid paying double for anything much less than double the performance, we would all stop with our Monoprice 8320s and Philips SHE3580s.
   
   
  Quote: 





ich1ban said:


> Does anyone know of any IEMs that sound similar to the GR07, however is worn straight down? not a fan of the over-the-ear design at all.
> 
> Also if possible, maybe a bit bassier like the Sennheiser CX300s?
> 
> ...


 
   
  The Yamaha EPH-100. It doesn't sound like the GR01 but it's a good performer, doesn't cost more, and has more visceral bass.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  then, i'd be more specific. taken as a whole package: comfort, fit, build, versatility, maybe even isolation, and specially the sound, etc (you get the idea), are the differences noticiable to be considered an upgrade.
   
  ps: you seem to like the SHE3580...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> then, i'd be more specific. taken as a whole package: comfort, fit, build, versatility, maybe even isolation, and specially the sound, etc (you get the idea), are the differences noticiable to be considered an upgrade.
> 
> ps: you seem to like the SHE3580...


 
   
  Still very much a personal question - i.e. are _you _willing to pay double for slight gains here and there? The GR99 doesn't really have any flaws - it's built well, comes with a bunch of tips, doesn't have much cable noise when worn cable-up, and is one of the best-sounding earphones you'll find under $30. The housing size is a little above average so they might not be great for those with small ears and they don't come with quite as many tips as the GR02 and higher-end VSonics but overall they are a great value. I'll try and have the review up tonight, which may help.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Still very much a personal question - i.e. are _you _willing to pay double for slight gains here and there? The GR99 doesn't really have any flaws - it's built well, comes with a bunch of tips, doesn't have much cable noise when worn cable-up, and is one of the best-sounding earphones you'll find under $30. The housing size is a little above average so they might not be great for those with small ears and they don't come with quite as many tips as the GR02 and higher-end VSonics but overall they are a great value. I'll try and have the review up tonight, which may help.


 
   
  Chinese F/S forums are pouring with cheap GR99 (which you get free when buying GR02, GR04,GR01, GR07), I got myself one for under 10$.... 
   
  It really is one of the nicest budget phones I ever heard...


----------



## DannyBai

I've been comparing the SHE3580, FX101, FX40, Isurus and the GR99's and I'd vote for the 99's as the best all around sound sig.  My rating of these would go:  FX40 for clarity and sub-bass, GR99 for being good in all areas, FX101 for crazy bass, Isurus for big stage and the 3580 just sounds cheap to me compared to the others.


----------



## ljokerl

Added VSonic GR99 and GR02 Bass Edition
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B33) VSonic GR99*
> 
> Reviewed June 2012
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A69) VSonic GR02 Bass Edition*
> 
> Reviewed June 2012
> 
> ...


----------



## suman134

maan , those gr99 are looking like my old forgotten denon ahc-551 . i like this gr99 . orthodox big barrel . i like it dark , but is the highs better then the soundmagic e30 ?


----------



## putente

Great reviews, *ljokerl*! VSONIC keeps impressing, even in the lower range...


----------



## suman134

try sound magic es18 .


----------



## Emospence

More Vsonics with 10/10 value rating.. Wow.


----------



## Magicman74

Fantastic Reviews!!   Both are dead on.   LOL, I called the GR99 right on, in my " Guess post"...I missed the GR02 tho, I rated it a little higher at 7.8,  But 7.6 is still good.  I still like them better then the 06, I think the " Fun Factor" is what does it for me.  Both of these are at the Top of the heap for " Budget-under $50"...You have to have both, IMO...They both are very close to each other, but the small difference from each other makes both needed in your collection.


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  definitely helped!! thanks


----------



## mondrin

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For the A161 I wouldn't expect any change. Sibilance probably means you're not getting a very good seal - I don't much like single-flanges on those but the bi-flanges and triples don't really give me much sibilance. I never got to test the EPH-100 pre-burn-in (it was a loan) so you'll have to check on that in the EPH-100 thread. The EPH-100 will remain pretty bassy compared to the RE0 or A161.


 
 I had the opportunity to do more rigorous listening tests over the weekend with the A161p, the Re-ZERO and the EPH-100.  The end result is that they are all being sent back and I will have to continue my quest for the right IEM.  I'd love any input and suggestions from all the experts here to help guide my search.

 A161p - Harsh treble did this one in for me quickly.  As joker suggested, I tried various flanges to get a good seal.  The double flanges from the Re-Zero provide a good seal for me, but even these could not tame the top.  Bass was a bit lacking but not that bad.  I didn't really evaluate the mid range much.  I am very sensitive to harsh treble so this pair is a big no.  I do love extended treble response that is open and sparkles.  This can be obtained.
 EPH-100 - The treble on this is much better than the A161p's with no harsh qualities.  I did feel these were quite U or V shaped with some odd tubular type sound in the mid's.  It was the bass that tossed these out for me.  I do like bass but the quantity of bass was just too much and really interfered with some music.  Having listened to my wife's Klipsch S4's I'd say these have similar bass levels but much better low bass extension and maybe somewhat better control.  I think the S4's have a bit too much bass too plus rolled off treble and sound like I'm listening to my music in a limited box.
 RE-Zero - These were nearly the pick as they are quite a nicely balanced IEM.  They don't have a lot of bass but have good extension and respond to a little EQ well.  Treble on these is wonderful.  It's the lower mids/high bass that finally got it into trouble.  I found a lack of warmth and weight to mids, especially male vocals.  The worst sounded tinny and recessed.  I can't tell if there is a peak in the mid's or if it's a lack of supporting upper bass.  It just lacks the fullness I require.  I could find no EQ settings on my Ipod or my computer (which is very limited) to compensate for this issue and thus they must go back.
   
So it appears I'm looking for an IEM with the treble qualities of the RE-Zero and more support/fullness/warmth/weight in the high bass/low mids.  I wouldn't mind a little more bass overall but that can also be achieved with a little EQ.  Any advice on a likely candidate?


----------



## brencho

I'm wondering how the RE262, GR07, and JVC FXT90 compare to each other. I haven't had the chance to listen to any of them, so any insight is appreciated!


----------



## suman134

some flying words i have heard that says the new tdk eb950 are good .


----------



## psygeist

@joker
   
  I got FI-BA-SB. I do like the sound signature. Though it's not as balanced as e-Q5 but the presentation is lively with good instrument separation, depth and imaging. Bass is considerably much more and the warmth too.
   
  Which IEM is closest sounding to FI-BA-SB (excluding other Final Audio Designs) ?
   
  How much FI-BA-SB differs from FI-BA-SS ? I'd be much less likely to spend $1000 on a single IEM over slight updgrade.
   
  What would you suggest as an upgrade over FI-BA-SB (looking for better instrument separation, imaging and 3d soundstage) ? UM3X R or SM3 V2 ? I read contrary opinions to these, almost everyone favoring UM3X over SM3 V2.
   
  Westone 4R can be another good alternative over both ?
   
  Which are your favorite genres and artists you listen during review process ?


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> I had the opportunity to do more rigorous listening tests over the weekend with the A161p, the Re-ZERO and the EPH-100.  The end result is that they are all being sent back and I will have to continue my quest for the right IEM.  I'd love any input and suggestions from all the experts here to help guide my search.
> 
> A161p - Harsh treble did this one in for me quickly.  As joker suggested, I tried various flanges to get a good seal.  The double flanges from the Re-Zero provide a good seal for me, but even these could not tame the top.  Bass was a bit lacking but not that bad.  I didn't really evaluate the mid range much.  I am very sensitive to harsh treble so this pair is a big no.  I do love extended treble response that is open and sparkles.  This can be obtained.
> EPH-100 - The treble on this is much better than the A161p's with no harsh qualities.  I did feel these were quite U or V shaped with some odd tubular type sound in the mid's.  It was the bass that tossed these out for me.  I do like bass but the quantity of bass was just too much and really interfered with some music.  Having listened to my wife's Klipsch S4's I'd say these have similar bass levels but much better low bass extension and maybe somewhat better control.  I think the S4's have a bit too much bass too plus rolled off treble and sound like I'm listening to my music in a limited box.
> ...


 
  I didn't find A161P's high end to be sparkly enough sounding offensive. I was using medium sized Sony hybrids.
   
  Agree that RE-0 is dry sounding and lacks weight & warmth in mids.


----------



## brencho

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> I didn't find A161P's high end to be sparkly enough sounding offensive. I was using medium sized Sony hybrids.
> 
> Agree that RE-0 is dry sounding and lacks weight & warmth in mids.


 
   
  Agreed about the A161, I quite like their sound and didn't find their treble to be harsh. Probably all comes down to the seal. Since it's in your signature, how did you find the A161 compared to the JVC FXT90?


----------



## mondrin

Quote: 





brencho said:


> Agreed about the A161, I quite like their sound and didn't find their treble to be harsh. Probably all comes down to the seal. Since it's in your signature, how did you find the A161 compared to the JVC FXT90?


 
  I got quite a good seal with flanges from the RE-Zero but that made no difference.  I think I tried every flange that came with the A161p's but also heard no real difference to the treble character.  Certain guitar riffs were painful as was Sting's S's on many tracks.  Perhaps I just got a bad set, or I'm just overly sensitive to those frequencies.  It's all good data for further searching.


----------



## brencho

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> I got quite a good seal with flanges from the RE-Zero but that made no difference.  I think I tried every flange that came with the A161p's but also heard no real difference to the treble character.  Certain guitar riffs were painful as was Sting's S's on many tracks.  Perhaps I just got a bad set, or I'm just overly sensitive to those frequencies.  It's all good data for further searching.


 
  Yeah, please continue to post impressions from your search, very useful data indeed.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> maan , those gr99 are looking like my old forgotten denon ahc-551 . i like this gr99 . orthodox big barrel . i like it dark , but is the highs better then the soundmagic e30 ?


 
  Probably not better, but not worse. If you like your highs more prominent like the E10 I would go for one of the other VSonics but for a fairly smooth and competent treble presentation the GR99 works rather well. It's got a very realistic note presentation for an entry-level set, makes sets like the JVC FX40 sound 'off'. Even the pricier Xears set I tested against it (XR120ProII) had too short of a note decay in the treble compared to the VSonics. 
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> Great reviews, *ljokerl*! VSONIC keeps impressing, even in the lower range...


 
  Yes, I am getting tired of gushing over them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Quote: 





magicman74 said:


> Fantastic Reviews!!   Both are dead on.   LOL, I called the GR99 right on, in my " Guess post"...I missed the GR02 tho, I rated it a little higher at 7.8,  But 7.6 is still good.  I still like them better then the 06, I think the " Fun Factor" is what does it for me.  Both of these are at the Top of the heap for " Budget-under $50"...You have to have both, IMO...They both are very close to each other, but the small difference from each other makes both needed in your collection.


 
  If only the GR02 had a touch less bass bleed and slightly smoother treble, it would be almost impossible to fault. Then again, that would make a lot harder on some of the other options in the <$100 bracket.
   
  Quote: 





kanuka said:


> definitely helped!! thanks


 
   
  Great!
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> So it appears I'm looking for an IEM with the treble qualities of the RE-Zero and more support/fullness/warmth/weight in the high bass/low mids.  I wouldn't mind a little more bass overall but that can also be achieved with a little EQ.  Any advice on a likely candidate?


 
   
  RE262
   
   
  Quote: 





brencho said:


> I'm wondering how the RE262, GR07, and JVC FXT90 compare to each other. I haven't had the chance to listen to any of them, so any insight is appreciated!


 
   
  This has been asked before in various combinations. The GR07 is the flattest and most accurate, with a wide soundstage that's somewhat lacking in depth, great bass extension, and good treble reach. The RE262 is warmer, somewhat mid-centric, with comparatively laid-back treble. The FXT90 is more aggressive across the spectrum, with the most mid-bass of the three and the most forward presentation. 
   
   
  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> @joker
> 
> I got FI-BA-SB. I do like the sound signature. Though it's not as balanced as e-Q5 but the presentation is lively with good instrument separation, depth and imaging. Bass is considerably much more and the warmth too.
> 
> ...


 
   
   
   
  That's a lot of questions. I haven't heard the SS in a very long time and I haven't even finished reviewing the SB yet so I don't have a whole lot of recommendations to make. It's safe to say you will not find anything that sounds like Final Audio in the Earsonics or Westone lineups, though they all have good instrument separation. The SB has decent depth but its soundstage just isn't very large - the W4 and SM3 won't have any trouble beating it there. However, they will sound thicker and warmer. Also, I've never heard the SM3 V2. 
   
  I listen to a variety of music but also have a set list of two dozen lossless test tracks I use with every IEM I listen to, which include everything from death metal to classical to electropop.


----------



## Anaxilus

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> How much FI-BA-SB differs from FI-BA-SS ? I'd be much less likely to spend $1000 on a single IEM over slight updgrade.


 
   
  Sound signature is more balanced but much more analytical.  It's the most resolving and detailed universal I've ever heard even over the k3003 being mostly on par w/ my customs give or take here and there.  If you have great recordings go for it.  If you listen to poorly mastered stuff on mp3s forget about it.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





brencho said:


> Agreed about the A161, I quite like their sound and didn't find their treble to be harsh. Probably all comes down to the seal. Since it's in your signature, how did you find the A161 compared to the JVC FXT90?


 
  FXT90 is good at soundstage, timbre, instrument separation and imaging. But, for me, the mid bass hump is fairly noticeable and kind of annoying in certain tracks.
   
  Except for shallow depth perception in soundstage, I prefer A161 over FXT90. Good at resolving complex passages. It's as musical as FXT90 without the annoying mid bass hump.
   
  I'd suggest to try both and pick the one you like more. It comes down to personal preference. I personally prefer A161 in the price range.
   
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> I got quite a good seal with flanges from the RE-Zero but that made no difference.  I think I tried every flange that came with the A161p's but also heard no real difference to the treble character.  Certain guitar riffs were painful as was Sting's S's on many tracks.  Perhaps I just got a bad set, or I'm just overly sensitive to those frequencies.  It's all good data for further searching.


 
  Narrow nozzle, thick flanges will dampen higher frequencies and accentuate lower ones.
   
  Possibly the recordings are not of high quality.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's a lot of questions. I haven't heard the SS in a very long time and I haven't even finished reviewing the SB yet so I don't have a whole lot of recommendations to make. It's safe to say you will not find anything that sounds like Final Audio in the Earsonics or Westone lineups, though they all have good instrument separation. The SB has decent depth but its soundstage just isn't very large - the W4 and SM3 won't have any trouble beating it there. However, they will sound thicker and warmer. Also, I've never heard the SM3 V2.
> 
> I listen to a variety of music but also have a set list of two dozen lossless test tracks I use with every IEM I listen to, which include everything from death metal to classical to electropop.


 
   
  Thanks for the reply. I am kind of confused about next upgrade. Don't want to go custom anytime soon. Will look out for more reviews in this thread and head fi before finalizing.
   
  Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Sound signature is more balanced but much more analytical.  It's the most resolving and detailed universal I've ever heard ever over the k3003 being mostly on par w/ my customs give or take here and there.  If you have great recordings go for it.  If you listen to poorly mastered stuff on mp3s forget about it.


 
  Is it the sound signature that far off from Heaven S (FI-BA-SB) ? I'd see if I can get to have a demo first. Thanks for your opinion. I mostly listen to 320kbps mp3 and gradually shifting to FLACs (mostly from bandcamp).


----------



## Sweden

If anyone is interested in transforming a Vsonic GR06 or perhaps any in-ear with maybe not the most articulate treble/midrange I strongly suggest using the plug-in *TB EZQ *with J River media player, and while you are at it us the built it crossfeed just called Headphones.
  The change is like going from 64 kbps mp3 to flac with the switch of a button. Turning the little dot all the way to the right and slightly under the line means a jump in clarity, detail, soundstage and imaging so great it turns this OK sounding in-ear to something absolutely spectacular, and I'm not even exaggerating. I praised the CKM500 as probably the best sounding in-ear at that price. Now this thing sound better.
  You will not regret it!


----------



## giorgiocis

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> EPH-100 - The treble on this is much better than the A161p's with no harsh qualities.  I did feel these were quite U or V shaped with some odd tubular type sound in the mid's.  It was the bass that tossed these out for me.  I do like bass but the quantity of bass was just too much and really interfered with some music.  Having listened to my wife's Klipsch S4's I'd say these have similar bass levels but much better low bass extension and maybe somewhat better control.  I think the S4's have a bit too much bass too plus rolled off treble and sound like I'm listening to my music in a limited box.


 
   
  How much have u listened to them? Because after the burn-in the sound gets more balanced with less impactful bass (bass that i also found intrusive at first).


----------



## H20Fidelity

I don't mean to jump in .... my EPH-100 were exactly the same as the member above before and after break in. Bass calmed down a hefty amount compared to out of the box, 'a very noticeable amount' more so than any other IEM I've had. Afterwards it blended into the signature. I have seen other reports of the same thing. It was about 10 - 20 hours mine really settled. Now it's a lot calmer, nothing like first listen.


----------



## mondrin

I believe I had the EPH-100 playing for at least 36 hours before doing my listening tests.  I still find their bass to be too much.  I have 30 days to return those so I'll try burning them in a bit longer and see if anything changes.
   
  Joker, you recommended the RE262.  I've read that it really needs an amp and that is something I do not have and am not sure I would get.  Do you feel it will still sound ok driven only by an ipod?  I may try it anyway as head-direct has good return policies and decent shipping.  I'd like to try a Vsonic but can't find anyplace that sells them with a return policy.
   
  The more I hear about the A161 here the more I think I got a defective one.  I'm contemplating exchanging the one I got rather than returning and see if that's the case.  The S4 has a bit of the harsh treble qualities if you turn it up too high but the A161 is far far worse for the same material.  The EPH-100 and RE-ZERO had no issues at all on the same tracks.  Very odd.


----------



## Dukedudez

Alright fellow headfiers, I need a suggestion. The left earbud on my Soundmagic E30 earphones stopped working, and getting them fixed will basically cost the same as buying a new pair. So, instead, I want to buy a totally different pair of in-ear headphones. Here's what I'm looking for:

 Under $75
 Fairly large soundstage
 Comfortable (I want to be able to wear these for hours)
 Durable (I want to be able to use these while I'm running, longboarding, etc.)
 I listen to mostly alternative and folk music so I want them to go well with these genres.
   
  So far the Cyclone PR1 looks good to me and someone is selling them on headfi for $28


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> Joker, you recommended the RE262.  I've read that it really needs an amp and that is something I do not have and am not sure I would get.  Do you feel it will still sound ok driven only by an ipod?  I may try it anyway as head-direct has good return policies and decent shipping.  I'd like to try a Vsonic but can't find anyplace that sells them with a return policy.


 
   
  Depends on your source, really. iPhones are typically better than iPod Touches in my experience and I've not heard the newer Nanos/Shuffles. Chances are that while the RE262 won't be at its absolute best, it will still be more to your liking than the RE-ZERO and you can always try an amp later when you have the budget for it.
   
   
  Quote: 





dukedudez said:


> Alright fellow headfiers, I need a suggestion. The left earbud on my Soundmagic E30 earphones stopped working, and getting them fixed will basically cost the same as buying a new pair. So, instead, I want to buy a totally different pair of in-ear headphones. Here's what I'm looking for:
> 
> Under $75
> Fairly large soundstage
> ...


 
   
  The PR1 has been out of production for years. If you can find one - go for it - but they were never very durable. I would consider the VSonic GR06 or maybe even the forgotten ECCI PR401 (Cyclone became known as ECCI after the PR1).


----------



## Emospence

Quote: 





kanuka said:


> pre-order for $109


 
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Really difficult to split the last three. Personally I prefer the B2s but the other two are very good in their own right.
> 
> 
> 
> This would be the winner, then.


 
  I was just visiting the mp4nation website, intending to surf the forums and look at their products and stuff, and before I knew it, I ordered a pair.
   
  o.o


----------



## huzisong

I'm fairly new to the world of IEMs, and I'm looking to purchase one.
  I'm on a tight budget: $50 dollars at most, but preferably <$40.
   
  After extensive research, I'm currently thinking about the VSONIC GR02, maybe the DUNU Trident.
   
  I mainly listen to electronica, indie, and some rock and pop.
   
  Have you guys got any recommendations?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





huzisong said:


> I'm fairly new to the world of IEMs, and I'm looking to purchase one.
> I'm on a tight budget: $50 dollars at most, but preferably <$40.
> 
> After extensive research, I'm currently thinking about the VSONIC GR02, maybe the DUNU Trident.
> ...


 
   
  The GR02 Bass Edition should work well. The Trident would be good as well though it's not as clear and hasn't got the treble presence of the GR02. Some other alternatives to look out for - id America Spark, Soundmagic E10, MEElec SP51 (have seen all of these under $40).


----------



## Maximus472

Hi Joker :3

Firstly I just wanted to pay tribute to the unbelievable effort you've put into this comparison thread. I'm sure I'm not alone in how useful and easy it was to use the guide and its helped me make so many decisions with iems. I just wanted to say thank you 

I was wondering if I could ask for your advice (any anyone elses advice! :3) on an iem upgrade I am planning. I managed to get some money and have decided I'd like to upgrade from my Hifiman RE262's to an iem around $400-$500. I've done a fair bit of research around the iems (this thread helped massively Joker, thanks again) and seem to have settled between either the Westone 4Rs or the Shure SE535s. 

(I'm not too experienced in the world of iems and I'm sure I don't have a sound understanding of many audiophile terms so I apologize if things I say don't make sense! XD I'll try my best to use the right words )

Coming from the Hifiman RE262s, I really liked the powerful smooth mids but I found sometimes the trebles were lacking just slighty and I think I would prefer a more balanced range (why the W4Rs caught my eye). Although I appreciate good quality base, I have to admit I really dislike it when the bass takes prominence (although I have not tested them, I am guessing I would not like the sounds of the Sennheiser IE8s or the Westone 3s from what I have read). I greatly appreciate detail in sound (I'm guessing this is described by instrument separation?) and the most important part of music for me is the vocals (particularly female). 

My range of artists I like is very narrow compared to most. I'll put them here to see if they help

Absolute favourites

Taylor Swift
Carrie Underwood
Daughtry

Other favourites

Evanescence
Breaking Benjamin
Leona Lewis
30 Seconds to Mars
Staind
Kelly Clarkson
Paramore

Its a reasonably wide range (ish lol) but if a choice had to be made, I would much much prefer the iems to be best geared to Taylor Swift, Carrie Underwood and Daughtry.

I should probably mention that although I may in the future, I am not planning to get an amp and I'm playing right out of my iPhone 4. I've read in some places that although it helps, both the Shures and Westones play well without an amp. Is this right? 

As you probably have guessed, I'm leaning towards the W4Rs but a couple of things I have read have made me consider the Shures. I've heard that the W4Rs dont play relatively well at low volumes (my most frequent volume) and also that they have a "vieled" sound? Could anyone explain this? Also I've heard from a number of places that people prefer the Shures as they are more fun/dynamic? where the W4Rs have been described as simple/boring in comparison. Is this just a result of the EQ curve differences or is there some intrinsic property of the Shures the W4Rs lack?

Phew!  Thanks so much for reading guys and I would really appreciate any help with this decision. Thanks again  

P.S. I'm very open to suggestions of other iems that more closely match my preferences. I am probably not ready to go into customs yet though (definitely will think about them in the future though )


----------



## bubuchacha

i just want to thank joker for the big help to music lovers like me. i consider this thread the absolute bible for iems... i now have 5 iems in my collection an all purchases i have made are based on joker's posts. i have to say every review is accurate and helpful... thanks a lot again...


----------



## mondrin

While looking for a higher end IEM for my music, I decided that I needed a cheaper IEM to take to the gym and not have to fear if I destroy it with my sweating and thier awful DVD players.  Although I may bring my ipod from time to time I will be mostly using it for listening to DVD's.  After again reviewing the wonderful resource of information Joker has provided I chose to get the MEELC M9.  Just got them today and I'll burn them in before commenting too much.  I think they'll work out just fine for this purpose and they do have a nice carrying case.
   
  Joker, I noticed this IEM comes with flanges that have different diameter holes.  What affect does the size of the hole have on the sound?  Most of the flanges are black silicon that is close to the size of the driver.  There is a grey silicon set which has a smaller diameter hole. 
   
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## GigaFi

Quote: 





mondrin said:


> While looking for a higher end IEM for my music, I decided that I needed a cheaper IEM to take to the gym and not have to fear if I destroy it with my sweating and thier awful DVD players.  Although I may bring my ipod from time to time I will be mostly using it for listening to DVD's.  After again reviewing the wonderful resource of information Joker has provided I chose to get the MEELC M9.  Just got them today and I'll burn them in before commenting too much.  I think they'll work out just fine for this purpose and they do have a nice carrying case.
> 
> Joker, I noticed this IEM comes with flanges that have different diameter holes.  What affect does the size of the hole have on the sound?  Most of the flanges are black silicon that is close to the size of the driver.  There is a grey silicon set which has a smaller diameter hole.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
   
  The grey set is thinner and will give you less bass. Meelec dubs it the "balanced" tips.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





maximus472 said:


> Hi Joker :3
> Firstly I just wanted to pay tribute to the unbelievable effort you've put into this comparison thread. I'm sure I'm not alone in how useful and easy it was to use the guide and its helped me make so many decisions with iems. I just wanted to say thank you
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  You probably want to ask the person who complained about the fun factor of the W4s. I certainly wouldn't classify them as 'fun' but I don't mind the neutral/slightly mid-centric sound signature. I don't really think the SE535 surpasses the RE262 in overall performance but it should help a little with the treble you're missing from the RE262. Then again, so will the W4. I would not worry about over-prominent bass with either.
   
   
  Quote: 





bubuchacha said:


> i just want to thank joker for the big help to music lovers like me. i consider this thread the absolute bible for iems... i now have 5 iems in my collection an all purchases i have made are based on joker's posts. i have to say every review is accurate and helpful... thanks a lot again...


 
   
  Thank you glad the thread has been useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> While looking for a higher end IEM for my music, I decided that I needed a cheaper IEM to take to the gym and not have to fear if I destroy it with my sweating and thier awful DVD players.  Although I may bring my ipod from time to time I will be mostly using it for listening to DVD's.  After again reviewing the wonderful resource of information Joker has provided I chose to get the MEELC M9.  Just got them today and I'll burn them in before commenting too much.  I think they'll work out just fine for this purpose and they do have a nice carrying case.
> 
> Joker, I noticed this IEM comes with flanges that have different diameter holes.  What affect does the size of the hole have on the sound?  Most of the flanges are black silicon that is close to the size of the driver.  There is a grey silicon set which has a smaller diameter hole.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
   
  I wouldn't want to generalize across other IEMs but in the case of the M9 those gray tips sound a little less bassy. I actually quite like those tips on many other IEMs - they are soft and a tiny bit smaller in size than most other bi-flanges.


----------



## dustdevil

Which tips will you recommend to use with the JVC fx40 to improve the isolation without sacrificing much comfort and sound quality? I prefer them not to be foam tips as I don't want to spend so much money.Thanks.


----------



## garcsa

Hi joker, you "bought" me again a pair of new  earphones... The astrotec AM90 . Like them!   Received  before a few hours -  and  they are still in my ears , listening my favorites ( Darks Side of the Moon,  Getz/Gilberto , Kind of Blue...) again and again .   Own  just one  mor pair of BAs ,  A151 , where the vocals, cymbals ... are more believables, but music contains other instruments, too. So I do not want to spend more  than 41 bucks for other IEM. (Wish I could 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) . Have a nice day!   cSg


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Which tips will you recommend to use with the JVC fx40 to improve the isolation without sacrificing much comfort and sound quality? I prefer them not to be foam tips as I don't want to spend so much money.Thanks.


 
   
  I ended up using a set of UE bi-flange as they made the FX40 least offensive to my ears. I don't think they're available for purchase anymore, though, so maybe try a MEElec M11+ tip set? The short MEE bi-flanges were okay for me as well and are still in production. 
   
   
  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> Hi joker, you "bought" me again a pair of new  earphones... The astrotec AM90 . Like them!   Received  before a few hours -  and  they are still in my ears , listening my favorites ( Darks Side of the Moon,  Getz/Gilberto , Kind of Blue...) again and again .   Own  just one  mor pair of BAs ,  A151 , where the vocals, cymbals ... are more believables, but music contains other instruments, too. So I do not want to spend more  than 41 bucks for other IEM. (Wish I could
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Congrats, they're a very nice budget buy and a great start for Astrotec.


----------



## huzisong

How would Astrotec AM-90, VSONIC GR02, and brainwavz m4 compare, disregarding price?


----------



## Niyologist

I have the Fiio E11. Fiio E11+JVC FXT90+Heavier Upper Midrange/Lower Treble+BBE EQ: 10+High Gain+Bass Booster EQ: 1=Audiophile Heaven.


----------



## Niyologist

That new N8 and N9 from MEELEC look great. Very curious of how the N9 sounds.
   
  http://www.meelec.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=N8
   
  http://www.meelec.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=n9


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





huzisong said:


> How would Astrotec AM-90, VSONIC GR02, and brainwavz m4 compare, disregarding price?


 
   
  The AM-90 and GR02 are priced about the same to start with. You can see from the reviews/scores on the front page of this thread that they are also pretty evenly matched overall and in value-for-money but that I think the GR02 has a small edge in sound quality as long as you don't mind its greater emphasis on the bass and treble compared to the AM-90. I've never heard the M4.


----------



## huzisong

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The AM-90 and GR02 are priced about the same to start with. You can see from the reviews/scores on the front page of this thread that they are also pretty evenly matched overall and in value-for-money but that I think the GR02 has a small edge in sound quality as long as you don't mind its greater emphasis on the bass and treble compared to the AM-90. I've never heard the M4.


 
  Okay, thanks.
  Just one last thing: is the VSONIC GR06 worth the extra 25 dollars over the VSONIC GR02?
  Thanks again


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





huzisong said:


> Okay, thanks.
> Just one last thing: is the VSONIC GR06 worth the extra 25 dollars over the VSONIC GR02?
> Thanks again


 
   
  They differ in sound signature and form factor, not just price. If you like your mids more upfront, or if you prefer the over-the-ear form factor, the GR06 is definitely worth the extra money. Otherwise whether or not the differences are worth it to you is a personal call.


----------



## GL1TCH3D

I currently have the se425 and was wondering if the upgrade to the 535 would be worth it?
I like something with more prominant treble with nice, smooth mids and not as strong but still present bass.
I feel like the se425 does most of this very well in a portable and compact solution but I was wondering, since money is not an issue, if the 535 would be worth the upgrade. I'd be trading the 425 back in for the upgrade so it's not like I'm buying a completely new pair.
I really like the treble and mids of the 425so as long as they stay relatively similar, but maybe improved a bit, I'd consier that worth it but I've never really used the 535.
Can someone help me out?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gl1tch3d said:


> I currently have the se425 and was wondering if the upgrade to the 535 would be worth it?
> I like something with more prominant treble with nice, smooth mids and not as strong but still present bass.
> I feel like the se425 does most of this very well in a portable and compact solution but I was wondering, since money is not an issue, if the 535 would be worth the upgrade. I'd be trading the 425 back in for the upgrade so it's not like I'm buying a completely new pair.
> I really like the treble and mids of the 425so as long as they stay relatively similar, but maybe improved a bit, I'd consier that worth it but I've never really used the 535.
> Can someone help me out?


 
   
  Unfortunately I am not familiar with the SE425 - the last Shure '4' series IEM I heard was the old E4. There was a review of the SE425 comparing to the SE535 I remember coming across, which may be worth searching for. Otherwise maybe someone else can chime in on the differences.


----------



## GL1TCH3D

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I am not familiar with the SE425 - the last Shure '4' series IEM I heard was the old E4. There was a review of the SE425 comparing to the SE535 I remember coming across, which may be worth searching for. Otherwise maybe someone else can chime in on the differences.




I saw one or 2 of the threads here (from the search) about the differences between the 425 and 535.
The 535 has more bass, soundstaging and better extension on both ends while keeping the very smooth mids and treble that I like but I wanted another confirmation.


----------



## DigitalFreak

Quote: 





gl1tch3d said:


> I saw one or 2 of the threads here (from the search) about the differences between the 425 and 535.
> The 535 has more bass, soundstaging and better extension on both ends while keeping the very smooth mids and treble that I like but I wanted another confirmation.


 

 Thanks a lot now you're making me wonder if I should buy a 535.
  Reading this thread can sometimes be expensive


----------



## vaed

Hi again |joker|, I'm considering advancing to a more analytical, but still aggressive signature ala the Brainwavz B2. Moving on from the FXT90, how would you describe the transition from the coloredness and musicality of the 90 to the B2's? Do you think the two would compliment each other quite well?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





digitalfreak said:


> Reading this thread can sometimes be expensive


 
   
  Glad I had nothing to do with it this time..
   
  Quote: 





vaed said:


> Hi again |joker|, I'm considering advancing to a more analytical, but still aggressive signature ala the Brainwavz B2. Moving on from the FXT90, how would you describe the transition from the coloredness and musicality of the 90 to the B2's? Do you think the two would compliment each other quite well?
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  I guess you can expect a leaner, cooler sound with less bass presence and less midrange forwardness. Just like moving from any other colored-sounding IEM to a more neutral one, you may hear details you haven't noticed before just because nothing will overshadow the fine nuances with the B2. I do think they would be good compliments and they are both some of the best earphones you can get for the money with their respective signatures.


----------



## ganeshrajarajan

gr06 vs m4, which is the best? which 1 wins in most of the following attributes?
  
  
 more open sounding,
 airy n spacious,
 forward mids,
 more speed,
 best instrument seperation(definitely loves this attribute) and imaging,
 detailed highs,
 more articulating,
 some bass with quality(not boomy),
 smoother,
 not thick sounding(i dono what is opposite to thick sounding),
  
 which 1 is easy going with all type of genres??
 thanks in advance!


----------



## Niyologist

I now have my portable setup like this: FIIO E6 (Moderate Bass Booster)+FIIO E11 (Bass Booster Level 1 + High Gain) w Best pairing>/VSonic GR06, JVC HA-FXT90, A151, Ultrasone HFI-450 and Beyerdynamic DTX 910. The whole frequency is cleaner and enhanced (better detail retrieval).


----------



## dfrost

Quote: 





vaed said:


> Hi again |joker|, I'm considering advancing to a more analytical, but still aggressive signature ala the Brainwavz B2. Moving on from the FXT90, how would you describe the transition from the coloredness and musicality of the 90 to the B2's? Do you think the two would compliment each other quite well?
> 
> Thanks!



 I switch back and forth between FXT90's and Fischer DBA-02's every week or two. Joker has done his usual excellent job succinctly describing the differences, although I find the midrange to be wonderful and similarly forward on both. I notice soundstage and instrument separation a little more on the Fischers, while the JVC's are a bit more cohesive.
  
 It takes me a few tracks to get used to the different signatures: deeper, more impactful bass on the JVC's; astonishing clarity, detail and transparency with the Fischers. Both are extremely enjoyable and I'm glad to have them, but could live with either one for a long time (used DBA-02's exclusively for 1.5 years). I've experimented with tips on each to reduce those differences (short double flange from M11+ on the JVC's, Shure double flange - like Ety triples with the small end removed - on the Fischers).


----------



## scootsit

I know most of Fischer's cans are made by Yoga, is the same true of their IEMs?


----------



## vaed

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I guess you can expect a leaner, cooler sound with less bass presence and less midrange forwardness. Just like moving from any other colored-sounding IEM to a more neutral one, you may hear details you haven't noticed before just because nothing will overshadow the fine nuances with the B2. I do think they would be good compliments and they are both some of the best earphones you can get for the money with their respective signatures.





   
   Quote: 





dfrost said:


> I switch back and forth between FXT90's and Fischer DBA-02's every week or two. Joker has done his usual excellent job succinctly describing the differences, although I find the midrange to be wonderful and similarly forward on both. I notice soundstage and instrument separation a little more on the Fischers, while the JVC's are a bit more cohesive.
> 
> It takes me a few tracks to get used to the different signatures: deeper, more impactful bass on the JVC's; astonishing clarity, detail and transparency with the Fischers. Both are extremely enjoyable and I'm glad to have them, but could live with either one for a long time (used DBA-02's exclusively for 1.5 years). I've experimented with tips on each to reduce those differences (short double flange from M11+ on the JVC's, Shure grey single flex on the Fischers).







   
  First of all, thanks to both |joker| and dfrost for their perspectives, both are extremely helpful! I guess what I'm trying to compensate between the two is having a fun, musical headphone and an analytical one while retaining a forward, engaging presentation, top-notch speed, and superior instrument separation. However, another object of scrutiny is the Sennheiser HD-25 1-ii/Amperior, which has also been on my mind since my first log into head-fi! I'm just talking aloud here, but I wonder if the portable HP would work as a compromise between the two IEMs, if at all; trying to work in durability/build quality into the equation, not to mention the i-device functionality is attractive to me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ganeshrajarajan said:


> gr06 vs m4, which is the best? which 1 wins in most of the following attributes?
> 
> 
> more open sounding,
> ...


 
   
  Never heard the M4
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I know most of Fischer's cans are made by Yoga, is the same true of their IEMs?


 
   
  Doubtful, judging from the packaging and hardware the IEMs come from different factories. Of the latest batch the Paradigm v3, Tandem, and Consonance seem to come from the same manufacturer but can't say anything about the rest, 
   
   
  Quote: 





vaed said:


> First of all, thanks to both |joker| and dfrost for their perspectives, both are extremely helpful! I guess what I'm trying to compensate between the two is having a fun, musical headphone and an analytical one while retaining a forward, engaging presentation, top-notch speed, and superior instrument separation. However, another object of scrutiny is the Sennheiser HD-25 1-ii/Amperior, which has also been on my mind since my first log into head-fi! I'm just talking aloud here, but I wonder if the portable HP would work as a compromise between the two IEMs, if at all; trying to work in durability/build quality into the equation, not to mention the i-device functionality is attractive to me.


 
   
  I don't think you'll find a compromise in the HD25 (I only have the HD25-1; no Amperior) but rather a third - more v-shaped - sound signature. It is fast an engaging but difficult to call analytical as a whole because the bass is quite strong. I definitely think the DBA-02 is flatter and more accurate in response. 
   
  The FXT90 is also colored, but in a different way.


----------



## RapidPulse

Hi joker,
  Based in part on your favorable review, I feel like I would be missing a golden opportunity if I don't pick up the Brainwavz B2 at their current pre-order price ($109). But I am wondering about a couple of things:
   

 I like having a variety of different sounding IEMs.  I own the Ety HF3 (which I like very much).  Would the B2 be somewhat redundant or are they different enough to own both at the same time?
 I know the B2 treble is on the bright side...but is it more prone to sibilance than the GR07?  The GR07 is about at the limit of what I would want.
   
  As always...thanks for this thread and your input!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rapidpulse said:


> Hi joker,
> Based in part on your favorable review, I feel like I would be missing a golden opportunity if I don't pick up the Brainwavz B2 at their current pre-order price ($109). But I am wondering about a couple of things:
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The HF5 and B2 are reasonably close in terms of sound signature but aside from the signature differences (slightly more mid-bass, brighter treble, etc) I think you'll gain a little in the way of resolution, punch, and soundstaging with the B2. I actually find the B2 a little less hot in the treble than the GR07 with a good seal so you should be okay there as well.


----------



## giorgiocis

jokerl are you enjoying the eph? i can't wait for the review to come out


----------



## ich1ban

Just bought the CKM500s along with the EPH-100s, does anyone here have them both? and what do you think about them?


----------



## Gee Simpson

Hi, I'm looking for earphones with a mid or warm & sweet sound sig. I'm willing to pay around £15 -40 ($23-60).
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Cotnijoe

Quote: 





gee simpson said:


> Hi, I'm looking for earphones with a mid or warm & sweet sound sig. I'm willing to pay £15 -40 ($23-60).
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  Vsonic GR06 might work?
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/541204/concise-multi-iem-comparison-tdk-eb950-ba100-ba200-added-june-2nd-2012
   
  mite be a good place to start tho? =)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





giorgiocis said:


> jokerl are you enjoying the eph? i can't wait for the review to come out


 
   
  Sure am, the review will be up very soon
   
  Quote: 





gee simpson said:


> Hi, I'm looking for earphones with a mid or warm & sweet sound sig. I'm willing to pay around £15 -40 ($23-60).
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  The GR06 is a good option. Brainwavz M2 is another. Or, if you want the overall signature more on the 'balanced' side-  anything with a Siren armature - MEElec A151, Soundmagic PL50, Astrotec AM-90, etc.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Yamaha EPH-100 and Monster MD Trumpet
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2B16) Yamaha EPH-100SL*
> 
> 
> Reviewed June 2012
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1C16) Monster Miles Davis Trumpet*
> 
> 
> Reviewed June 2012
> ...


----------



## compoopers

Thanks for the reviews on those two, I was actually really curious about both.

Hopefully you'll get around to reviewing the ATH CKM500s so I can have a good comparison between what I have and what you've written for all these other great IEMs.


----------



## H20Fidelity

Thanks Ijokerl. Great to see a detailed  EPH-100 review up, I was very interested in your view on them.
 This gives people a great starting point when showing interest in EPH-100.


----------



## putente

More great reviews! I was also waiting for the one on the Yamaha's... Thanks, *ljokerl*!


----------



## Leo888

Hi joker, how would you rate the Westone 2  against the current crops of new Dual BA in the market. It seems that it is still one of the higher priced iem and wonder if it is still worth the money at this point of time. Thanks.


----------



## FieldingMellish

Joker, the EPH-100 review lends some vindication for the small ear canal afflicted. I had a tough time with the fit, although loving everything else about them. Regrettably, they had to be returned.


----------



## Emospence

Those Yamahas look really, really interesting.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  Thanks was desperately waiting for the review of EPH-100 from your side. Can you compare MG7 and EPH-100 in bass, mids, treble, soundstage, imaging, in almost everything.
   
  Which one do you think is the best?


----------



## giorgiocis

@jokerl 

 as i asked in the eph thread :
   
As i said i'm really enjoying my eph-100 but this is my first approach to top notch iem, so i'd like to know, what can be a good complement? by good complement i mean that i'd like to hear what i'm maybe missing with the eph. The re-zero should be a good choise right? other suggestion? 
   
Thx! and nice work  u really deserve the UM Miracle


----------



## giorgiocis

Quote: 





fieldingmellish said:


> Joker, the EPH-100 review lends some vindication for the small ear canal afflicted. I had a tough time with the fit, although loving everything else about them. Regrettably, they had to be returned.


 
   
  it took 3 weeks for me to get used to the fit, after 2 months i finally felt really comfortable...but what a pain the first days!


----------



## mondrin

Joker's review of the EPH-100 was good timing.  After my inital listen to this IEM and finding it too bass heavy I did what people suggested and burned it in for another 4 days while I was gone camping.  I now agree that the bass does calm down some after sufficient burn in, at least for me.  I find the bass level to be just fine in these.  I still love the treble of the RE-ZERO much better than the EPH-100.  The later almost sounds like it has a loudness boost to it, very splashy on symbols but missing some of the lower harmonics and weight of it.  IT's very hard to describe for me.  I don't know how Joker does all these reviews as I find after going back and forth between a few pairs of IEM's my ears start getting confused and tired.  On a fit side, while I get a really good seal with the EPH-100, my ears get sore after a while, espeically my smaller left ear.  It's a bummer to have two such different sized ear canals.  It appears the EPH-100 doesn't fit the sound signuature I'm looking for, nor does the RE-ZERO.  Perhaps if I could take the treble and mids from the RE-ZERO and and the bass of the EPH-100 to fill it out, I may have something.....Joker, you recommended the RE-262 to me earlier from my general feedback.  Does it still sound like a potential match?  Any other IEM's in that price range or lower that may fit the bill?


----------



## nyonya

Hi ljokerl, do you think the GR07 is a good complement to the UM3X and the SM3?  I'm trying to sample a good variety of high-end earphones to see what sort of sound signature I really prefer, and wondering if those 3 plus the FXT90 would give me a good diverse view.  Would you say any of these are too similar to be good complements?  Thanks!


----------



## sofastreamer

i got the eph100 yesterday and so far i do not like them. pircing treble and the whole soundstage is behind me. i wonder which ie would give me a soundstage more in front of me and has smoother treble? mids and bass are ok on the yamahas.


----------



## Katun

Not sure why, but I still have a hard time really understanding what the EPH-100 sound signature is like.
   
  From reading, I hear it's signature move is bass? If it's anything like the MG7, I think I'll pass.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





katun said:


> Not sure why, but I still have a hard time really understanding what the EPH-100 sound signature is like.
> 
> From reading, I hear it's signature move is bass? If it's anything like the MG7, I think I'll pass.


 
   
       It's a balanced signature like the FXT90. Definitely not bass heavy like the MG7. Relaxed, yet smooth treble and midrange and strong bass, but not overbearing at all after several hours of burn-in.


----------



## mondrin

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> i got the eph100 yesterday and so far i do not like them. pircing treble and the whole soundstage is behind me. i wonder which ie would give me a soundstage more in front of me and has smoother treble? mids and bass are ok on the yamahas.


 
  I had to burn in my EPH-100 for over 50 hours to smooth out some of the issues I had with the IEM (bass was my issue).  I'm not much a soundstage expert so I can't really comment there.  While the treble doesn't sound piercing to me, it definitley has an odd quality to it on the upper end which I did not like.  Burn them in for a few days without listening to them and then check them out again.


----------



## Gofre

Need a few quick responses guys before I lose the opportunity to cancel my order. Just put an order in for a pair of Phonak 122 IEMs for use at work at half price, coming in at £65 with a half price voucher, since my customs aren't suited to being yanked out every few minutes. I can't find anything else in the sub-£70 price range that competes, am I missing anything?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





compoopers said:


> Thanks for the reviews on those two, I was actually really curious about both.
> Hopefully you'll get around to reviewing the ATH CKM500s so I can have a good comparison between what I have and what you've written for all these other great IEMs.


 
   
  Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> Thanks Ijokerl. Great to see a detailed  EPH-100 review up, I was very interested in your view on them.
> This gives people a great starting point when showing interest in EPH-100.


 
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> More great reviews! I was also waiting for the one on the Yamaha's... Thanks, *ljokerl*!


 
   
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, how would you rate the Westone 2  against the current crops of new Dual BA in the market. It seems that it is still one of the higher priced iem and wonder if it is still worth the money at this point of time. Thanks.


 
   
   
  Not all current dual-drivers are equal - the Creative Aurvana 3, for example, is a recent one I didn't like all that much. The W2 is still competitive in my book, especially if you put value in the form factor (still among my favorites among all IEMs). 
   
  Quote: 





fieldingmellish said:


> Joker, the EPH-100 review lends some vindication for the small ear canal afflicted. I had a tough time with the fit, although loving everything else about them. Regrettably, they had to be returned.


 
   
   
  I was just happy the nozzles are a bit smaller compared to older microdriver designs like the MEElec CC51 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Shame they didn't work for you.
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> Thanks was desperately waiting for the review of EPH-100 from your side. Can you compare MG7 and EPH-100 in bass, mids, treble, soundstage, imaging, in almost everything.
> 
> Which one do you think is the best?


 
   
  I think the EPH-100 is the more balanced earphone, less bass, more mids, smoother treble compared to the MG7. Its presentation is a little on the laid back side but in that context imaging is rather good. I think the Yamaha is the better earphone by a narrow margin but that can easily flip if you end up preferring the more U-shaped sound of the MG7.
   
   
  Quote: 





giorgiocis said:


> @jokerl
> 
> as i asked in the eph thread :
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  I would try something armature-based instead of the ZERO, maybe an Ety HF5 or Fischer Audio SBA-03/MEElec A161 (or a Brainwavz B2 if still on pre-order) just to sample the more crisp delivery. Ultimately the bass of the EPH-100 is rather strong and the resolution in the treble leaves something to be desired. An earphone with flatter bass and better treble quality should 'fill in' whatever you are missing with the EPH-100.
   
   
  Quote: 





mondrin said:


> Joker's review of the EPH-100 was good timing.  After my inital listen to this IEM and finding it too bass heavy I did what people suggested and burned it in for another 4 days while I was gone camping.  I now agree that the bass does calm down some after sufficient burn in, at least for me.  I find the bass level to be just fine in these.  I still love the treble of the RE-ZERO much better than the EPH-100.  The later almost sounds like it has a loudness boost to it, very splashy on symbols but missing some of the lower harmonics and weight of it.  IT's very hard to describe for me.  I don't know how Joker does all these reviews as I find after going back and forth between a few pairs of IEM's my ears start getting confused and tired.  On a fit side, while I get a really good seal with the EPH-100, my ears get sore after a while, espeically my smaller left ear.  It's a bummer to have two such different sized ear canals.  It appears the EPH-100 doesn't fit the sound signuature I'm looking for, nor does the RE-ZERO.  Perhaps if I could take the treble and mids from the RE-ZERO and and the bass of the EPH-100 to fill it out, I may have something.....Joker, you recommended the RE-262 to me earlier from my general feedback.  Does it still sound like a potential match?  Any other IEM's in that price range or lower that may fit the bill?


 
   
  If you are happy with the bass quantity of the EPH-100, I am not sure the low end of the RE262 will do it for you. On a side note, you may need to use different-sized tips in each ear if you have asymmetric canals. Anyway, I would recommend the JVC FXT90 but it seems you've found both the EPH-100 and MEElec A161 offensive in the treble, and the FXT90 is more treble-happy than both. On the treble front the RE262 is still one of the more relaxing and non-fatiguing things I've heard. 
   
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl, do you think the GR07 is a good complement to the UM3X and the SM3?  I'm trying to sample a good variety of high-end earphones to see what sort of sound signature I really prefer, and wondering if those 3 plus the FXT90 would give me a good diverse view.  Would you say any of these are too similar to be good complements?  Thanks!


 
   
  Sure, the GR07 is a good alternative to those. It's definitely a different type of sound - more distant and not at all mid-focused, with more treble emphasis than the SM3/UM3X and less mid-bassy warmth.
   
  Quote: 





katun said:


> Not sure why, but I still have a hard time really understanding what the EPH-100 sound signature is like.
> 
> From reading, I hear it's signature move is bass? If it's anything like the MG7, I think I'll pass.


 
   
  Not as much bass focus as the MG7 and a different curve, with mid-bass to match the sub-bass. Also the mids tend to be stronger and much more liquid, and the treble tends to be smoother. 
   
   
  Quote: 





gofre said:


> Need a few quick responses guys before I lose the opportunity to cancel my order. Just put an order in for a pair of Phonak 122 IEMs for use at work at half price, coming in at £65 with a half price voucher, since my customs aren't suited to being yanked out every few minutes. I can't find anything else in the sub-£70 price range that competes, am I missing anything?


 
   
  I don't think you can do better than the Phonaks for that sort of money if you like their sound signature. Alternatives would be the Etymotic HF5 and the Fischer SBA-03/MEElec A161. Not sure how much those would run you and they aren't better or worse than the Phonaks, just different.


----------



## Leo888

Hi joker, thanks for your thoughts regarding the Westone 2. I'm currently looking at the Westone 2, TDK BA200, Vsonic GR01 and maybe the FA SBA-02 Mk2/Brainwaz B2 as a gift for my other half. Kind of gotten poisoned when I let her tried out my SE535 and have been making references with how much better it compares to her AT CKS90Ltd. Due to budget constrain and based on the above list of iems, which do you think would have a close sound characteristics to the SE535. I'm open to other options and would appreciate alternatives suggestion if any. She's more into mainstream genre like Kpop, RnB, Vocals, OST and some Hip Hop if that helps. Thanks in advance.


----------



## marlonmarabe

hey joker do you think re-262's mids can rival customs like um miracle and merlin?


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> I think the EPH-100 is the more balanced earphone, less bass, more mids, smoother treble compared to the MG7. Its presentation is a little on the laid back side but in that context imaging is rather good. I think the Yamaha is the better earphone by a narrow margin but that can easily flip if you end up preferring the more U-shaped sound of the MG7.


 
  so you are preferring EPH-100 in the overall sound quality.
   
  Can I say that in the bass department, MG7 wins hands-down? which one has better quality bass?
   
  I am very confused between MG7 and EPH-100 now
   
  I have ordered the MG7 on 7th May right after you recommended me but sadly I haven't received it till now may be it is lost somewhere in the middle.  My money just got drained.
   
  So I want to order again but confused between MG7 and EPH-100. I know Soundstage is better in EPH-100. What about imaging as compared to the MG7?
   
  I also appreciate the esanthosh's deeply description/comparison which he told me in TE made me confident more, his description was splendid too


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> so you are preferring EPH-100 in the overall sound quality.
> 
> Can I say that in the bass department, MG7 wins hands-down? which one has better quality bass?
> 
> ...


 
  Always opt for trackable shipping option when getting the stuff.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, thanks for your thoughts regarding the Westone 2. I'm currently looking at the Westone 2, TDK BA200, Vsonic GR01 and maybe the FA SBA-02 Mk2/Brainwaz B2 as a gift for my other half. Kind of gotten poisoned when I let her tried out my SE535 and have been making references with how much better it compares to her AT CKS90Ltd. Due to budget constrain and based on the above list of iems, which do you think would have a close sound characteristics to the SE535. I'm open to other options and would appreciate alternatives suggestion if any. She's more into mainstream genre like Kpop, RnB, Vocals, OST and some Hip Hop if that helps. Thanks in advance.


 
   
  Hey Leo888. I think she might really like the Ety HF3. IMO it's on the same SQ level as the 535


----------



## Melody303

Thanks for the massive review, *l**jo**k**e**r**l*, This thread turned out to be my main resource for choosing my first IEMs, which are currently en route to me.
  Namely the MEElectronics M9 (which reads like the ideal first pair for me to try) and M31 (which reads like a guilty pleasure).
  There were a few others I was particularly keen on, but the astronomical delivery costs Amazon wanted to add to them (or in many cases, the flat out refusal to ship them to Israel) just made them impractical this time around, those were the Brainwavz Beta, Monoprice 8320, MEElectronics  M6, and Soundmagic E10.
  I honestly didn't research these as thoroughly as I did my choice of full headphones, practically limiting myself to this resource alone, but that's partially because the costs on this side were much lower than on the full side. I didn't even glance at any of the IEM pairs beyond $60.
   
  On the other hand, if the folks all over this forum are any indication, there will be many more headphones purchases to follow.
  Then again, I did stick with my Sennheiser HD280 for well over a decade, despite not being satisfied with their sound. Maybe I'm immune to your addiction.


----------



## eke2k6

Hi joker, great reviews.
   
  Since it wasn't mentioned in the review, what did you think of the EPH-100's treble tonality?


----------



## Leo888

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Hey Leo888. I think she might really like the Ety HF3. IMO it's on the same SQ level as the 535


 
  Thanks eke2k6 for chipping in. Have read up some commends and have a feeling that it might be a little hot in the treble. Anyway, will give it a try alongside the others and when I visit my local store see how it fares. For now, will wait and see if there's others suggestions from fellow forum members.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, thanks for your thoughts regarding the Westone 2. I'm currently looking at the Westone 2, TDK BA200, Vsonic GR01 and maybe the FA SBA-02 Mk2/Brainwaz B2 as a gift for my other half. Kind of gotten poisoned when I let her tried out my SE535 and have been making references with how much better it compares to her AT CKS90Ltd. Due to budget constrain and based on the above list of iems, which do you think would have a close sound characteristics to the SE535. I'm open to other options and would appreciate alternatives suggestion if any. She's more into mainstream genre like Kpop, RnB, Vocals, OST and some Hip Hop if that helps. Thanks in advance.


 
   
  Any reason you are limiting yourself to dual-BAs? The HiFiMan RE262 is nice and musical, in some ways more reminiscent of the Shures than the GR01 and DBA-02/B2, and in that price range. Otherwise I would go with the GR01 or W2 (haven't heard the BA200). 
   
   
  Quote: 





marlonmarabe said:


> hey joker do you think re-262's mids can rival customs like um miracle and merlin?


 
   
  The RE272 is a little closer but still not quite there. It depends on what you're looking for. The note weight and overall realism of the RE262 are quite good but when you start looking at detail resolution the Miracle pulls away.
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> so you are preferring EPH-100 in the overall sound quality.
> 
> Can I say that in the bass department, MG7 wins hands-down? which one has better quality bass?
> 
> ...


 
   
  You really have too figure out what you want. The MG7 has mostly subbass, the EPH-100 has a little more mid-bass than sub-bass. Neither is really 'better', just different. Imaging is not something I like to comment on from memory, you should ask someone who owns both earphones at the same time. 
   
  Quote: 





melody303 said:


> Thanks for the massive review, *l**jo**k**e**r**l*, This thread turned out to be my main resource for choosing my first IEMs, which are currently en route to me.
> Namely the MEElectronics M9 (which reads like the ideal first pair for me to try) and M31 (which reads like a guilty pleasure).
> There were a few others I was particularly keen on, but the astronomical delivery costs Amazon wanted to add to them (or in many cases, the flat out refusal to ship them to Israel) just made them impractical this time around, those were the Brainwavz Beta, Monoprice 8320, MEElectronics  M6, and Soundmagic E10.
> I honestly didn't research these as thoroughly as I did my choice of full headphones, practically limiting myself to this resource alone, but that's partially because the costs on this side were much lower than on the full side. I didn't even glance at any of the IEM pairs beyond $60.
> ...


 
   
  I guess you'll find out once you receive the IEMs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Hi joker, great reviews.
> 
> Since it wasn't mentioned in the review, what did you think of the EPH-100's treble tonality?


 
   
  That it's not as good as the EX600/GR07/FXT90 to for my ears.
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Thanks eke2k6 for chipping in. Have read up some commends and have a feeling that it might be a little hot in the treble. Anyway, will give it a try alongside the others and when I visit my local store see how it fares. For now, will wait and see if there's others suggestions from fellow forum members.


 
   
  The HF2/3/5 is quite smooth with a good seal even compared to TWFK-based stuff like the Brainwavz B2.


----------



## Leo888

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Any reason you are limiting yourself to dual-BAs? The HiFiMan RE262 is nice and musical, in some ways more reminiscent of the Shures than the GR01 and DBA-02/B2, and in that price range. Otherwise I would go with the GR01 or W2 (haven't heard the BA200).


 
  Hi joe, I have read that the RE262 is power hungry and would like something that is easy to drive. Portability is also a consideration which is why I narrowed down to the list. Just happens to read that the Creative Aurvana 3 has a resemblance to the SE535. I did got the chance to try them out for a short moment and  feels that it lacks some refinement as compared to the Westone 2.. The thing with me is that I have short auditory memory and would appreciate your views as to how far off the Creative Aurvana 3 are to the Westone 2. Would the extra cash be worthy for the latter. Thanks in advance.


----------



## FieldingMellish

I rocked the 262 on the train in today, powered by an Arrow amp. Luscious sound. Wonderful mids.


----------



## solaregg

This thread is sooooo helpful!!!! I'm looking for my next earphone. Still digging in all the reviews.


----------



## FieldingMellish

By the way, re262 is power hungry, but sounds good un-amped. Un-amped I get good bass, excellent mids and non-sibilent highs (slightly rolled off). It's just that it gets special when amped. Full and beautiful.


----------



## Gee Simpson

Quote:  





> The GR06 is a good option. Brainwavz M2 is another. Or, if you want the overall signature more on the 'balanced' side-  anything with a Siren armature - MEElec A151, Soundmagic PL50, Astrotec AM-90, etc.


 
  Thanks. I'm interested in the SoundMAGIC E30's, how do they compare?


----------



## Leo888

fieldingmellish said:


> By the way, re262 is power hungry, but sounds good un-amped. Un-amped I get good bass, excellent mids and non-sibilent highs (slightly rolled off). It's just that it gets special when amped. Full and beautiful.




Thanks FieldingMellish for the feedback. But it would be better if I could get something that can perform near it's best straight out of the box without an amp. Anyway, my other half uses the Samsung Galaxy S2 and I don't think she would like having the battery being drain out too quickly. But you have got me intrigue with the RE262 and would really like to hear them out when the opportunity arises.

By the way, the Aurisonic ASG1.2 looks interesting and would appreciate some insight of them.
I'm not sure if you have heard them joker but will appreciate your views of them if you have. Thanks again, joker.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joe, I have read that the RE262 is power hungry and would like something that is easy to drive. Portability is also a consideration which is why I narrowed down to the list. Just happens to read that the Creative Aurvana 3 has a resemblance to the SE535. I did got the chance to try them out for a short moment and  feels that it lacks some refinement as compared to the Westone 2.. The thing with me is that I have short auditory memory and would appreciate your views as to how far off the Creative Aurvana 3 are to the Westone 2. Would the extra cash be worthy for the latter. Thanks in advance.


 
   
  I am not a fan of the Aurvana but I can't in all honesty say that the W2 is worth double the price. The W2 is better in pretty much every way but not by a large margin. I agree on the refinement, and it also sounds a little bland to me with not much deep bass or treble sparkle. The W2 isn't exactly subbass heavy or terribly sparkly either, but at least it has high levels of clarity and detail. The Creative reminds me more of the Klipsch Custom 3, which was a nice all-rounder but never really seemed all that special.
   
  Quote: 





solaregg said:


> This thread is sooooo helpful!!!! I'm looking for my next earphone. Still digging in all the reviews.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





fieldingmellish said:


> By the way, re262 is power hungry, but sounds good un-amped. Un-amped I get good bass, excellent mids and non-sibilent highs (slightly rolled off). It's just that it gets special when amped. Full and beautiful.


 
   
  +1, I thought it was still very enjoyable straight out of a portable
   
  Quote: 





gee simpson said:


> Thanks. I'm interested in the SoundMAGIC E30's, how do they compare?


 
   
  Generally, not as warm and intimate as all of these others.
   
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Thanks FieldingMellish for the feedback. But it would be better if I could get something that can perform near it's best straight out of the box without an amp. Anyway, my other half uses the Samsung Galaxy S2 and I don't think she would like having the battery being drain out too quickly. But you have got me intrigue with the RE262 and would really like to hear them out when the opportunity arises.
> By the way, the Aurisonic ASG1.2 looks interesting and would appreciate some insight of them.
> I'm not sure if you have heard them joker but will appreciate your views of them if you have. Thanks again, joker.


 
   
  I've only briefly heard the 1st rev of the ASG1. I didn't like the fit and the driver flex was horrendous. No impressions of the sound.


----------



## Niyologist

Hmmmmm.....I may get the RE262/272 or Earsonics SM2/SM3.


----------



## Gee Simpson

Quote:  





> Generally, not as warm and intimate as all of these others.


 
  Thanks


----------



## kanuka

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  back to that. i 99% agree. got the SHE last day and it can be the first and last iem to get (for non-head-fi'ers
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)
  now i'm waiting for this and the fx40 review!


----------



## luc shrine

hi joker. do u have multi thread earbuds review?
 which one is better, senn mx760, blox m2c, or yuin pk3?
   
  *sorry OOT


----------



## heart banger-97

hi ljokerl ! I think that *Creative Aurvana 3's impedance *is 28 _Ω_
  or maybe I'm missing some thing.


----------



## kingice10

Thanks for the EPH-100 review Joker...I've been waiting from your side on how it fares on your Universal IEM List. I might be having them this month as I am very curious on their sound, like somebody here commented, on another thread that it's a FX700 with much better isolation. From your description, I might get to try them..I'm collecting a bang-for-buck iems right now, like the PFE-122 - very non-fatiguing sound that can catch-up with my top-end UIEMs. And they are very comfortable. Not really good for pop and energetic music because of the bass quality but able to scale on some audiophile recordings. You can be surprise how these bang-for-back iems sound compare to the top-tiers on a very good source/dap. Not really into the 232 and K3003 right now, maybe another time. And CIEMs are just pain complicated to order, especially when I am rooting the SE5-way.
   
  Some IEMs I also want to hear are the 262, 272, GR07 (which first time I didn't like) and the EPH-100..which piqued my interest.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





luc shrine said:


> hi joker. do u have multi thread earbuds review?
> which one is better, senn mx760, blox m2c, or yuin pk3?
> 
> *sorry OOT


 
   
   
  Nope, nothing for earbuds.
    
   
  Quote:


heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl ! I think that *Creative Aurvana 3's impedance *is 28 _Ω_
> or maybe I'm missing some thing.


 
   
  Fixed, thanks.


----------



## suman134

after some 75hrs of burnin , the top firing arm of my ue 600 , sounds awesome with out the harshness of ue 700 , but kind of i miss it , but this has awesome rounded sound-stage , not tall but big , man awesome . hadnt thought of a $80 ba giving this much fun and clarity .


----------



## Dany91

Hi, i'm Daniel from Italy.
  After I broke the NuForce NE6 (I consider the best in ear headphones I've ever felt as the definitions of high, medium and low rather than good) I wanted to ask here since it's been done very well this topic: I know that everything is soggetivo but could you advise me on your next purchase? (maximum 50 €). The M2 Brainwavz Loe reputed pumped in low and medium, but as they are high compared to NuForce? Or in any case could you tell me the "best"? (I repeat, I know that is subjective, and I wish there was a store that you try all the face ... XD)


----------



## Currawong

Can I throw in the suggestion here for everyone that you include what music you like to listen to, especially when asking for recommendations or giving impressions? For example, some IEMs (or headphones) that work well with jazz or classical may sound awful and piercing with modern pop and rock.  Also mentioning if you listen at quiet, moderate or loud levels is important. Same thing again.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dany91 said:


> Hi, i'm Daniel from Italy.
> After I broke the NuForce NE6 (I consider the best in ear headphones I've ever felt as the definitions of high, medium and low rather than good) I wanted to ask here since it's been done very well this topic: I know that everything is soggetivo but could you advise me on your next purchase? (maximum 50 €). The M2 Brainwavz Loe reputed pumped in low and medium, but as they are high compared to NuForce? Or in any case could you tell me the "best"? (I repeat, I know that is subjective, and I wish there was a store that you try all the face ... XD)


 
   
  The M2 has decent treble, a little rolled-off at the top but clean and not harsh/sibilant. I think it would be a good NE6 replacement. You can also match the NE-6 a little below that price range - with the Dunu Trident, for example, or the VSonic GR99.


----------



## Leo888

Hi joker, it seems that the RE272 is much easier to drive and would like to know how much of a difference compared to the RE262. I read that the 262 is kind of tuned differently to the other Hifiman lineup and wonder does the RE272 has a similar but improved performance over the RE262. If it is,can the RE272 justify the higher price tag compared to the RE262 or it is just a completely different sound signature. Thanks.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

currawong said:


> Can I throw in the suggestion here for everyone that you include what music you like to listen to, especially when asking for recommendations or giving impressions? For example, some IEMs (or headphones) that work well with jazz or classical may sound awful and piercing with modern pop and rock.  Also mentioning if you listen at quiet, moderate or loud levels is important. Same thing again.




I think the most import thing to mention is what earphones you've been using (no matter how cheap) and what you find lacking about them. Because what works for one person in one genre may totally not work for another person even in the same genre. Me, I find that after I've found the right sound sig I like to use it on all genres with little variation.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, it seems that the RE272 is much easier to drive and would like to know how much of a difference compared to the RE262. I read that the 262 is kind of tuned differently to the other Hifiman lineup and wonder does the RE272 has a similar but improved performance over the RE262. If it is,can the RE272 justify the higher price tag compared to the RE262 or it is just a completely different sound signature. Thanks.


 
   
  I think the RE272 is slightly better than the RE262 but mostly just different in signature - brighter, cooler, etc. RE262 fans might not necessarily like the RE272 more.
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> I think the most import thing to mention is what earphones you've been using (no matter how cheap) and what you find lacking about them. Because what works for one person in one genre may totally not work for another person even in the same genre. Me, I find that after I've found the right sound sig I like to use it on all genres with little variation.


 
   
  This is my wish as well. Opinions on past IEMs and overall signature preferences make it easiest to provide good recommendations.


----------



## kostalex

ljokerl said:


> I think the RE272 is slightly better than the RE262 but mostly just different in signature - brighter, cooler, etc. RE262 fans might not necessarily like the RE272 more.



Here am I, re262 fan. I do prefer re262 over re272 due to the sound sig, though I consider re272 to be technically better. Judging by Leo888 forum sig headphones, I bet he will like re262 more too.


----------



## Leo888

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think the RE272 is slightly better than the RE262 but mostly just different in signature - brighter, cooler, etc. RE262 fans might not necessarily like the RE272 more.


 
   
  Quote: 





kostalex said:


> Here am I, re262 fan. I do prefer re262 over re272 due to the sound sig, though I consider re272 to be technically better. Judging by Leo888 forum sig headphones, I bet he will like re262 more too.


 
   
  Thanks joker and kostalex for the feedbacks. From where I am, there's no place to audition the Hifiman products but will try to look up in my local forum/owners to see if anyone can let me try out theirs. Will post back again when I've done so. Thanks again.


----------



## GL1TCH3D

Well I ended up going the route of the 535 over the 425.
My notes on this after having used the 425 for 2 weeks then hearing them side by side.
The 535 is an amazing pair with the major flaw for me being the sibilance. 
Of course mine are brand new and maybe (just maybe) burn in will help calm that sibilance.
But side by side, the 425 is really bass light while the 535 really hits each and everyone of those bass notes.
The impact is of course, much better with the 535.
I find the separation is another huge difference between the 2. I found during more complex tracks, the 425 have difficulty keeping up while the 535 seems to do it with ease.
In terms of the treble. I find it's fairly equal. Though, with more bass, it means the treble is less prominent but it still has power.
The mids are even more smooth on the 535 than the 425.

Overall, I really like the 535.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

When I bidded for the free phones ljokerl was giving away I promised to make a comparison plot between them and the Philips SHE3580.  I've finished it and it's been sitting in my hard drive a while, with me not quite knowing what to do with it.  Anyway, here it is:
   



  Black is the Ultimate Ears UE100 I got from joker, using the small (2nd smallest) stock UE tips, red is the SHE3580 using the small (smallest) stock Philips tips
  (Ignore the discrepancy past the last black and red spike, I can't really hear that high in frequency)
   
  The difference doesn't look like much, but it sums up much of the difference I hear between these two phones, because when I apply the inverse of these FR curves, they then have the same frequency response and I also can't hear any difference between them I can pinpoint.  The UE100 sounds a little less "clean" but there's not much in it (when playing sine tones through the UE100 it sounded less "pure" than other phones I've heard.  Harmonic distortion?).  These days I can take any IEM I own and get them to sound almost exactly like any other IEM I own after applying the inverse of their frequency response.  Not that I'm complaining; most of them sound about perfect. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 You can understand that given such a enormous technical finding, I am at a loss for words to describe their differences in conventional audio terms...  Although this is not exactly surprising given how close headphones are to perfection apart from frequency response: http://www.head-fi.org/t/566929/headphone-csd-waterfall-plots/735#post_8479080 (read a few posts down to see an incredibly clean waterfall plot generated by correcting the frequency response alone)
   
  I will detail my method for equalizing my phones here if anyone's interested:
  www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress
   
  The UE100 indeed have more polite highs than the SHE3580 as joker promised.  It makes most music I listen to listenable at decent volumes without EQ.  That said I won't be ditching my EQ just yet   (In fact I just gave up on ever finding a good parametric EQ for my Android phone, broke down and processed all the songs on my phone for the SHE3580 with Electri-Q through foobar.  My only regret is I left the phone without any unprocessed songs so that the other day when I happened across a shop with IEMs to audition (some House of Marley phones), I was left without any songs to audition them with...)


----------



## suman134

how mighty is the she3580 ? man , the hje120 , es18 , are invisible to many , joker said it . get it , bag it , empty the stocks , why buy something else ? no insult to any one man , i have a she3582 and i dont see it better then my es18 nor over the she 3680 .


----------



## Dany91

Quote: 





currawong said:


> Can I throw in the suggestion here for everyone that you include what music you like to listen to, especially when asking for recommendations or giving impressions? For example, some IEMs (or headphones) that work well with jazz or classical may sound awful and piercing with modern pop and rock.  Also mentioning if you listen at quiet, moderate or loud levels is important. Same thing again.


 
  I listen to many genres of music, although I most electronic music, uplifting trance, dance ... but also soundtracks, pop, rock, etc... love the emotional melodies generally
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The *M2* has decent treble, a little rolled-off at the top but clean and not harsh/sibilant. I think it would be a good NE6 replacement. You can also match the NE-6 a little below that price range - with the Dunu Trident, for example, or the *VSonic GR99*.


 
  Thanks although I still indecision about which one to try to buy ... regardless of the price / quality ratio as high, medium and low feel better the NuForce NE6?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dany91 said:


> Thanks although I still indecision about which one to try to buy ... regardless of the price / quality ratio as high, medium and low feel better the NuForce NE6?


 
   
  The M2 is pretty likable, I'd go with that.


----------



## Dany91

the review is known that the iem bass / midrange oriented, I really appreciate the orchestral trance and treble to me are still important, if less high NuForce clear of trying to look better than other


----------



## 91tyler

sorry wrong thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dany91 said:


> the review is known that the iem bass / midrange oriented, I really appreciate the orchestral trance and treble to me are still important, if less high NuForce clear of trying to look better than other


 
   
  The NE-6 isn't exactly king of treble either, so I think you'll be fine. If you want more prominent treble and don't mind more recessed mids, you can grab a VSonic GR02 Bass Edition instead.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> how mighty is the she3580 ? man , the hje120 , es18 , are invisible to many , joker said it . get it , bag it , empty the stocks , why buy something else ? no insult to any one man , i have a she3582 and i dont see it better then my es18 nor over the she 3680 .


 
   
  How does the 3680 compare to the 3580?  Do they sound any different?


----------



## Mysterious

What would you say is the best all rounder for under 100$ right now ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> What would you say is the best all rounder for under 100$ right now ?


 
   
  Out of what I've heard, I would say the Sunrise Xcape IE. But the MEElec A161P (reviewed in this thread as the pricier Fischer SBA-03) is probably a contender.


----------



## suman134

i had them sleeping for a long time , and now i brought them to life again , they both are a u shaped iems , 3680 seems to have some more clarity as it booms a little less , 3582 has nice bass and good clarity too , highs are nice , lows are good mids are a bit down . here what i have made of for some low end iems .
   
            ep600 < hje140 < ue 200 < she 3580 < hje120 < she 3680 < es18 < hje 355 .
   
  and this is my personal view ,
  

   
  a bit blur , but not bad for a 4 year old mobile .


----------



## akkib89

Hey Joker, it would be nice if you mentioned the "value" of the headphones just beside each one of them in the list you have used to categorise them according to their price range. I often get confused which phone is over where repeatedly and it would be nice if I could use the "value" just as a cross-reference. Saves a lot of time. Just an advice though.


----------



## gerasalus

Hi all,
   
  my old AKG K319 which i loved for few years broke few months ago. So after reading head-fi.org IEM comparison i bought SoundMagic E30 (best value for the price, bla bla. etc.) and frankly saying i was not impressed. They lacked that detailed sound my old K319 had. Fortunately (or maybe not) i managed to loose them, so now i have an excuse to get something better. I do not want so spend a fortune on this (AKG K319 were a bit pricier than E30), but i want to get something more than E30 gave me.
   
  So .. was thinking about Brainwavz M4, BeyerDynamic DTX 71 iE or AKG K340 (those are now hugely discounted, but i have doubts about durability, a lot of negative reviews about short life span). Any thoughts? I am kind of mainstream listener leaning a bit more towards Soft Rock, Indie and sometimes Minimal/Electro.


----------



## supernatural

Great thread Joker. As a complete noob to the IEM world this was the perfect place for me in the search of a perfect headphone. After countless hours of research, I narrowed my decision down to the VSonic GR02 Bass edition ones, mainly because of its great price/performance ratio. Now, the only thing keeping me from pulling the trigger on these is their performance in the heavy rock/metal genre. It's not that I've read that they are bad in that field or anything, it's just that due to them being new and quite unpopular I can't really find any info on how good they are for my particular taste in music. Basically, I would really appreciate if you could tell me if they are suitable for such a metalhead like me? I'm asking you this because I've read somewhere that you include metal songs in your testing playlist, so I think you are capable of giving me the feedback I want. If it's of any importance, I mainly listen to melodeath,death,black and extreme power subgenres.
  Thanks.


----------



## Sweden

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl ! I think that *Creative Aurvana 3's impedance *is 28 _Ω_
> or maybe I'm missing some thing.


 
   
  According to the innerfidelity measurements its 86 Ohms.
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/CreativeAurvanaInEar3.pdf


----------



## suman134

gerasalus , if you want bass , go for cc51 , m4 is good too , i know what happened to you with the soundmagic E30 , and this is the case with me too , low is good , mids are better but it lacks the high end badly  ( the spark which some low end iems like hje120 and she 3580 havent missed ). for that thing i can assure you cc51 , ue 600 and xb41ex will do for you , but for bass i think xb41ex and the brainwavz m4 will do your job . exclude the beyerdyns out . cant say about the akg . safe bet go for m4 or cc51 .


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Probably a JVC FX101 too, anything dsnuts picks has really good bass and treble and the FX101 is a bassier set among them.


----------



## Orel

Hey joker, my friend is looking to buy a fairly cheap IEM and he's stuck betwenn the VSonic GR99 and the Astrotec AM-90, which would you recommend? He likes rock and accoustic parts, the voice of the singer is very important to him and bass isn't very important.
  Thanks


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  Which is the most neutral signature earphone without sounding lean, bright/edgy treble?
   
  I am feeling that it's the VSonic GR01 is what I am looking at? or you have any better recommendation for me according to what I mentioned I want in a sound?


----------



## Staal

I keep coming back to this thread again and again. Such a great source for information. Great work joker!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





akkib89 said:


> Hey Joker, it would be nice if you mentioned the "value" of the headphones just beside each one of them in the list you have used to categorise them according to their price range. I often get confused which phone is over where repeatedly and it would be nice if I could use the "value" just as a cross-reference. Saves a lot of time. Just an advice though.


 
   
  The value rating is excluded because it is the most subjective of all the ratings and also makes it a little _too _easy for someone to make a decision based on the chart, which is something I've never wanted to encourage. It's really not that difficult to judge value based on overall chart position & SQ score vs price - for example things that I consider universally great value, such as the VSonic GR99/GR02/GR06/GR07, HiFiMan 262/272, Fischer DBA-02, Astrotec AM-90, MEElec M6, Monoprice 8320, etc fall far above most other sets in their price ranges. That still doesn't mean everyone will like them best for the price, however, which is why I encourage doing far more research than just looking at the chart.
   
   
  Quote: 





gerasalus said:


> Hi all,
> 
> my old AKG K319 which i loved for few years broke few months ago. So after reading head-fi.org IEM comparison i bought SoundMagic E30 (best value for the price, bla bla. etc.) and frankly saying i was not impressed. They lacked that detailed sound my old K319 had. Fortunately (or maybe not) i managed to loose them, so now i have an excuse to get something better. I do not want so spend a fortune on this (AKG K319 were a bit pricier than E30), but i want to get something more than E30 gave me.
> 
> So .. was thinking about Brainwavz M4, BeyerDynamic DTX 71 iE or AKG K340 (those are now hugely discounted, but i have doubts about durability, a lot of negative reviews about short life span). Any thoughts? I am kind of mainstream listener leaning a bit more towards Soft Rock, Indie and sometimes Minimal/Electro.


 
   
  I don't know anything about the M4 but the K340 is a pretty outdated design. I don't know how detailed the K319 is but if you're looking for maximum detail on a budget and don't mind a severely v-shaped sound signature the JVC FX40 might do it for you.
   
    
   
  Quote:


supernatural said:


> Great thread Joker. As a complete noob to the IEM world this was the perfect place for me in the search of a perfect headphone. After countless hours of research, I narrowed my decision down to the VSonic GR02 Bass edition ones, mainly because of its great price/performance ratio. Now, the only thing keeping me from pulling the trigger on these is their performance in the heavy rock/metal genre. It's not that I've read that they are bad in that field or anything, it's just that due to them being new and quite unpopular I can't really find any info on how good they are for my particular taste in music. Basically, I would really appreciate if you could tell me if they are suitable for such a metalhead like me? I'm asking you this because I've read somewhere that you include metal songs in your testing playlist, so I think you are capable of giving me the feedback I want. If it's of any importance, I mainly listen to melodeath,death,black and extreme power subgenres.
> Thanks.


 
   
  They work fine if you don't mind your metal on the bassy side. My personal listening has a good proportion of metal (from the classics to 80s thrash to modern post-metal) and I didn't mind the GR02 considering that their sound is not my preferred signature.
   
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Probably a JVC FX101 too, anything dsnuts picks has really good bass and treble and the FX101 is a bassier set among them.


 
   
  I don't know about the FX101 but I got the chance to hear an FX1X recently and it was one of the more bloated-sounding IEMs I've heard in a while.
   
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> Hey joker, my friend is looking to buy a fairly cheap IEM and he's stuck betwenn the VSonic GR99 and the Astrotec AM-90, which would you recommend? He likes rock and accoustic parts, the voice of the singer is very important to him and bass isn't very important.
> Thanks


 
   
  The AM-90 is a lot more vocal-centric than the GR99. Probably the better choice here.
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> Which is the most neutral signature earphone without sounding lean, bright/edgy treble?
> 
> I am feeling that it's the VSonic GR01 is what I am looking at? or you have any better recommendation for me according to what I mentioned I want in a sound?


 
   
  That really depends on where your personal tolerances lie. The GR01 is only a bit fuller-sounding than other TWFK-based earphones - on the overall spectrum it's still pretty darn close to the DBA-02/CK10/etc. 
   
   
  Quote: 





staal said:


> I keep coming back to this thread again and again. Such a great source for information. Great work joker!


 
   
  Thanks


----------



## Dany91

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The NE-6 isn't exactly king of treble either, so I think you'll be fine. If you want more prominent treble and don't mind more recessed mids, you can grab a VSonic GR02 Bass Edition instead.


 
  Well, depends on the comparison of NuForce 6, if the average is what the NuForce could do ... I know it's hard to make these comparisons ...


----------



## ignt

Is there an IEM that has similar musical qualities and overall perceived bass quantities as the Yamaha EPH-100, but with more sub-bass and slightly less mid-bass?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





ignt said:


> Is there an IEM that has similar musical qualities and overall perceived bass quantities as the Yamaha EPH-100, but with more sub-bass and slightly less mid-bass?


 
   
  An EPH-100 with a sub-bass EQ boost and a slight mid-bass EQ cut?


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That really depends on where your personal tolerances lie. The GR01 is only a bit fuller-sounding than other TWFK-based earphones - on the overall spectrum it's still pretty darn close to the DBA-02/CK10/etc.


 
   
  What I want is the is the most neutral signature earphone without sounding lean, bright/edgy treble.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> What I want is the is the most neutral signature earphone without sounding lean, bright/edgy treble.


 
   
  The GR07 may be what you want. Sibilance could be an issue though


----------



## Mysterious

Never knew buying my first pair of "good" IEMs would be so difficult 

 Still Confused between CKM500, CKS77, FXT90, GR06 and the Hifiman range (under 100$ ones ).

 ARGHHHHHHH


----------



## Leo888

Hi joker or anyone who might know, please kindly let me know the difference between the Ety HF2 and HF3. Are they the same phone with just a mic function for Android and Apple phones. Thanks in advance.


----------



## Reomero

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker or anyone who might know, please kindly let me know the difference between the Ety HF2 and HF3. Are they the same phone with just a mic function for Android and Apple phones. Thanks in advance.


 
   
  Yeah, they are the same IEM with one having a mic function for Apple (HF3) and the other for for anything else (HF2).


----------



## suman134

go for ftx90 man , they worth it .


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





sweden said:


> According to the innerfidelity measurements its 86 Ohms.
> http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/CreativeAurvanaInEar3.pdf


 






 thanks
  so what is the point of 28 ohm impedance here?
  I think that they measure impedance in 1.1 khz.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> The GR07 may be what you want. Sibilance could be an issue though


 
   
  This is what I am afraid of. I m prone to sibilance


----------



## putente

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> This is what I am afraid of. I m prone to sibilance


 
   
   
  Look at the GR07 MK2. *According to VSONIC*, the sibilance issue on the original GR07 has been reduced on the new version...


----------



## Leo888

Quote: 





reomero said:


> Yeah, they are the same IEM with one having a mic function for Apple (HF3) and the other for for anything else (HF2).


 
  Thanks Reomero for the info. Appreciate it.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





putente said:


> Look at the GR07 MK2. *According to VSONIC*, the sibilance issue on the original GR07 has been reduced on the new version...


 

 I am not able to see MK2 version of GR07 on their official website.


----------



## ItsMeHere

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> I am not able to see MK2 version of GR07 on their official website.


 
   Their website isn't really updated - they wrote the note regarding to the sibilance in a Chinese social-web.


----------



## scootsit

I have a question, I got the 8320s at your suggestion, and I really love them. But, I really wish they were smoother on the back, those jagged edges hurt like hell! Is there anything in the ~$20 range (a little bit more is okay) that sounds just as sweet but has a smoother back side with fewer jagged edges? I've got about 15 hrs of transit coming up and could use something to block out the world.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## putente

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> I am not able to see MK2 version of GR07 on their official website.


 
   
   
  Look in the GR07 topic. I recently posted a link there to an eBay seller who's selling that new version...


----------



## Gilly87

The 8320s are an enormous steal, most IEMs under $100 don't sound that good. If you want that level of sound quality, a similar sound signature, with more comfortable fit and REALLY good noise isolation, Shure SE215 is worth looking at, but they are tough to find for less than $100, usually $90-$100, $150 for the one with apple/android/blackberry. Maybe look for a used pair on the FS forum. I use them for commuting on the train every day, better isolation than my SM3 v2, I think they actually sound very similar to the 8320 but have better defined bass and a less grainy sound.
   
  Overall though you are going to have to work a miracle to find something that sounds as good as the 8320 for under $50, let alone $20. Fischer Audio Eterna has more bass but similar all-around sound quality with more extended treble, it has good but not stellar isolation, and will cost around $60-$70.
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I have a question, I got the 8320s at your suggestion, and I really love them. But, I really wish they were smoother on the back, those jagged edges hurt like hell! Is there anything in the ~$20 range (a little bit more is okay) that sounds just as sweet but has a smoother back side with fewer jagged edges? I've got about 15 hrs of transit coming up and could use something to block out the world.
> 
> Thanks!


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> The 8320s are an enormous steal, most IEMs under $100 don't sound that good. If you want that level of sound quality, a similar sound signature, with more comfortable fit and REALLY good noise isolation, Shure SE215 is worth looking at, but they are tough to find for less than $100, usually $90-$100, $150 for the one with apple/android/blackberry. Maybe look for a used pair on the FS forum. I use them for commuting on the train every day, better isolation than my SM3 v2, I think they actually sound very similar to the 8320 but have better defined bass and a less grainy sound.
> 
> Overall though you are going to have to work a miracle to find something that sounds as good as the 8320 for under $50, let alone $20. Fischer Audio Eterna has more bass but similar all-around sound quality with more extended treble, it has good but not stellar isolation, and will cost around $60-$70.


 

 I just thought I'd post it. I emailed monoprice and asked that if they work closely with their manufacturers, and it was possible, that they perhaps redesign the 8320 very slightly. First, a smooth back to the case. It can be the same shape internally, but remove the sharp edges, and replace the microphonic cable with something slightly nicer. They said they would compile user feedback and consider a redesign!


----------



## Extra

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I just thought I'd post it. I emailed monoprice and asked that if they work closely with their manufacturers, and it was possible, that they perhaps redesign the 8320 very slightly. First, a smooth back to the case. It can be the same shape internally, but remove the sharp edges, and replace the microphonic cable with something slightly nicer. They said they would compile user feedback and consider a redesign!


 
  What? A company that actually listens to it's customers? First V-Moda and now Monoprice, awesome.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





extra said:


> What? A company that actually listens to it's customers? First V-Moda and now Monoprice, awesome.


 

 I mean, I wouldn't expect them to be out tomorrow, but they said they would like customer feedback and want to work on designs.


----------



## Gilly87

Everyone email Monoprice


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ignt said:


> Is there an IEM that has similar musical qualities and overall perceived bass quantities as the Yamaha EPH-100, but with more sub-bass and slightly less mid-bass?


 
   
  Not that I'm aware of. The Atrio MG7 has more sub-bass and less mid-bass it may end up not having enough mid-bass for you. It is also less strong in the midrange and less musical than the Yamaha. EQing might indeed be the best bet.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> What I want is the is the most neutral signature earphone without sounding lean, bright/edgy treble.


 
   
  The problem is that you need a benchmark (or, preferably, several) to know what is too lean, too bright, or too edgy _for you_. I thought the Yamaha EPH-100 was pretty safe on the treble front but if you read back a few pages there have been some who even found that to be too trebly. A safe choice if you're worried about these things would be something like a Westone UM3X or even W4 but that's a different price range entirely. 
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I have a question, I got the 8320s at your suggestion, and I really love them. But, I really wish they were smoother on the back, those jagged edges hurt like hell! Is there anything in the ~$20 range (a little bit more is okay) that sounds just as sweet but has a smoother back side with fewer jagged edges? I've got about 15 hrs of transit coming up and could use something to block out the world.
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  Have to wonder how thick the housings are - perhaps a file and some sandpaper is all you really need...
   
  I don't think anything I've heard performs quite as well as the Monoprice with a similar signature in that price range - that's what makes the Monoprice special (aside from the terrible ergonomics). If you're willing to give up a little clarity, perhaps you can try finding a MEElec CW31 for <$25. It's got a nice and 'safe' signature - very smooth, a touch of bass enhancement - but more importantly is very small and comfortable. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I just thought I'd post it. I emailed monoprice and asked that if they work closely with their manufacturers, and it was possible, that they perhaps redesign the 8320 very slightly. First, a smooth back to the case. It can be the same shape internally, but remove the sharp edges, and replace the microphonic cable with something slightly nicer. They said they would compile user feedback and consider a redesign!


 
   
  The 8320 is likely an off-the-shelf OEM design from a company called OVC in China (they used to sell a few IEM/headphone models under their own brand). I highly doubt a redesign will happen considering it's sold for just $7 but we can hope...


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





anaxilus said:


> Your SE5 has more treble and bass than the GR07?  That worries me a bit.  Starting to sound U shaped....
> 
> Also starting to remind me of the different impressions of the ES5.


 
   
  More treble, but in a better way - far better extension, no sibilance. There's no artificial boost actually.
   
  Bass is mostly better due to being more subbass focused and far cleaner with better reverberation. The amount is not a *lot* higher in general.
   
  If anything, SE-5 are the inverse of mid-centric, not U-shaped in the usual sense (with bass boost and high boost). To my ears they're close to linear with slight upper mid and high treble accents (not emphasis) giving a slightly shimmering presentation.
  GR07 is more U-shaped than SE-5 due to slightly recessed midrange, sibilance, reduced high extension and with slight "boxy" upper bass emphasis, while RE272 is quite a bit more mid-centric and forward, bell like, with rolled off bass.
   
  Of note: Zen Stone cannot actually drive them either, gets slightly but noticeably rolled off. (Lacking power to drive high impedance?)
  So the only thing I have right now that's capable of driving them straight out of the jack is the old iRivier T30. (I bet E7 and E17 can do this.)
  FP10 lacks the power too w/ the adapter - same w/ HDA Audio and its chip amp. (HDA can be equalized to nigh-perfect though.)
  Really, these IEMs do need a nigh-perfect source for best effect.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The problem is that you need a benchmark (or, preferably, several) to know what is too lean, too bright, or too edgy _for you_. I thought the Yamaha EPH-100 was pretty safe on the treble front but if you read back a few pages there have been some who even found that to be too trebly. A safe choice if you're worried about these things would be something like a Westone UM3X or even W4 but that's a different price range entirely.


 
   
  I've ordered Yamaha EPH-100 after your review and waiting for them to receive If I do ever 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Will tell you by then.


----------



## notginger

are these the same as mine?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The 8320 is likely an off-the-shelf OEM design from a company called OVC in China (they used to sell a few IEM/headphone models under their own brand). I highly doubt a redesign will happen considering it's sold for just $7 but we can hope...


 
  You are right, here they are: http://www.ocvaco.com/products_Audio_Earphones_EP933.html
   
  But, OVC makes a zillion earphones: http://www.ocvaco.com/products_Audio.html
   
  (and headphones, like the monoprice full size cans, and some really beautiful all metal cans)


----------



## Dany91

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The NE-6 isn't exactly king of treble either, so I think you'll be fine. If you want more prominent treble and don't mind more recessed mids, you can grab a VSonic GR02 Bass Edition instead.


 
  Well, depends on the comparison of NuForce 6, if the average is what the NuForce could do ... I know it's hard to make these comparisons ..


----------



## ayaflo

rockit sounds r-50 ? twfk based and only 120$ ..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dany91 said:


> Well, depends on the comparison of NuForce 6, if the average is what the NuForce could do ... I know it's hard to make these comparisons ..


 
   
  As I said, if you were okay with the treble of the NE-6, I think the M2 will be fine. I really don't have anything else to add - it's been too long since I've heard an NE-6 to make any sort of detailed comparison.


----------



## brencho

Hey joker et al., i'm looking for a nice complementary set of iems to my lune recabled tf10s. In particular i'm looking for something that does mids and/or sub-bass well (not necessarily in the same set). I've been trying the atrio mg7s out, but I'd rather sacrifice a bit of sub bass for some more action in the mids (maybe miles davis phones?). In terms of headphones that do mids particularly well, i've heard that earsonics SM3s and westone um3x are great (but quite up there in price), and re262 (but probably need to be amped). What do you think? How's the soundstage on these, or others that i might have missed?


----------



## putente

*ljokerl*, you can now remove the Monster Miles Davis Trumpet and the Yamaha EPH-100 from your "In progress" list...


----------



## Dany91

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


>


 
   

 Thanks for the suggestions but I think I'll take the NuForce 700X .. I trust the brand and from what I understand is the evolution of improved NE6 of which I was very pleased ... Even if it costs a bit more than my current budget


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





brencho said:


> Hey joker et al., i'm looking for a nice complementary set of iems to my lune recabled tf10s. In particular i'm looking for something that does mids and/or sub-bass well (not necessarily in the same set). I've been trying the atrio mg7s out, but I'd rather sacrifice a bit of sub bass for some more action in the mids (maybe miles davis phones?). In terms of headphones that do mids particularly well, i've heard that earsonics SM3s and westone um3x are great (but quite up there in price), and re262 (but probably need to be amped). What do you think? How's the soundstage on these, or others that i might have missed?


 
   
  The RE262 is very good if you like your mids clean, yet fuller-sounding. Subbass isn't great but the soundstage is more spacious than you'd get with a set of Atrios. The EPH-100 also has very good mids IMO, as well as better subbass reach compared to the RE262 and a nicely layered soundstage. The MD Tributes have thicker, lusher mids and more bass still but the drop in clarity/increase in bleed from TF10s would also be more noticeable compared to an RE262 or EPH-100. If you're looking for the most contrast to the TF10s these might be it but otherwise I'd give them a pass, not to mention at that price you've not got much left to go to an SM2/SM3, UM3X, or maybe even SE535.
   
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> *ljokerl*, you can now remove the Monster Miles Davis Trumpet and the Yamaha EPH-100 from your "In progress" list...


 
   
   
  Yes, I realized I forgot and then got lazy and decided to put it off until the next update


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, I realized I forgot and then got lazy and decided to put it off until the next update


 
   
  My heart always flutter when you say "next update" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I always enjoy reading your thorough review


----------



## brencho

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The RE262 is very good if you like your mids clean, yet fuller-sounding. Subbass isn't great but the soundstage is more spacious than you'd get with a set of Atrios. The EPH-100 also has very good mids IMO, as well as better subbass reach compared to the RE262 and a nicely layered soundstage. The MD Tributes have thicker, lusher mids and more bass still but the drop in clarity/increase in bleed from TF10s would also be more noticeable compared to an RE262 or EPH-100. If you're looking for the most contrast to the TF10s these might be it but otherwise I'd give them a pass, not to mention at that price you've not got much left to go to an SM2/SM3, UM3X, or maybe even SE535.


 
  Yes, I suppose that's true that the difference between the MD Tributes and some of the others (SM2/3, UM3X) isn't that great. Are the SM2 and SM3 quite similar? Also I noticed that the XBA-4 are available somewhere for just over 200, which makes them another interesting choice, but not sure how complementary it would be to the TF10s in terms of mids and sub-bass?


----------



## brencho

Quote: 





brencho said:


> Yes, I suppose that's true that the difference between the MD Tributes and some of the others (SM2/3, UM3X) isn't that great. Are the SM2 and SM3 quite similar? Also I noticed that the XBA-4 are available somewhere for just over 200, which makes them another interesting choice, but not sure how complementary it would be to the TF10s in terms of mids and sub-bass?


 
  And I should mention that a pair of Refurbished MD Tributes can be had for just over 100 bucks, which makes them interesting as well.


----------



## FieldingMellish

I am finding RE-262 delivering sub-bass when it's been mixed into certain songs. Which mystifies me and is hard to make a basic statement about it. Like in basic rock songs, the bass is there but not stunning. Though put on songs such as Buddah Bar II or III, with it's Afro-centric flavor with huge, deep drums and whatnot and man, the Re-262 delivers the goods. When amped, even more so.


----------



## freemini

I've read most of the reviews until about 250$. I'm quite unsure what I'd replace my current Image S4i's with. I find they sound quite good, but the cable's getting slowly destroyed so I'm looking for replacements. I mostly listen to heavy metal and hard rock style music. I'd also like to point out I'm far from an audiophile, I know nothing about how good headphones are supposed to sound until I actually listen to them personally. Remote control for apple devices would be nice, but I can live without it as there's adapters you can buy for quite cheap prices. So I'm looking for good sounding and as little as possible microphonics, I HATE the sounds IEM's make when I walk. I also don't wear them over the ear but that can change I guess. *I'm looking with high interest at VSonic GR07, from what I understand there's a MK2 version coming soon? How do those sound when used on mobile devices?*


----------



## suman134

why dont you try the ultimate ears 500 vi/400vi . you will not like the immediate change of styles , over ear takes getting used to , get  cable guides before you switch to only over ear style iems . xb41ex are good too , a bit heavy but really nice bass good clarity . ther are many you can see , vsonic gr2 bass edition , gr06 , cc51 . any of the above will serve you good . i will say go for gr 2 for cheap price , other wise go for ue 500 .


----------



## Rope

Quote: 





freemini said:


> I've read most of the reviews until about 250$. I'm quite unsure what I'd replace my current Image S4i's with. I find they sound quite good, but the cable's getting slowly destroyed so I'm looking for replacements. I mostly listen to heavy metal and hard rock style music. I'd also like to point out I'm far from an audiophile, I know nothing about how good headphones are supposed to sound until I actually listen to them personally. Remote control for apple devices would be nice, but I can live without it as there's adapters you can buy for quite cheap prices. So I'm looking for good sounding and as little as possible microphonics, I HATE the sounds IEM's make when I walk. I also don't wear them over the ear but that can change I guess. *I'm looking with high interest at VSonic GR07, from what I understand there's a MK2 version coming soon? How do those sound when used on mobile devices?*


 
  My first IEM's were Klipsch i4s, and I thought they sounded good.  Making the transition from the i4s to GR07, is a kin the having a veil lifted from your ears.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> My heart always flutter when you say "next update"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hopefully sooner rather than later. There's a bunch of reviews I started and never got around to posting.
   
   
  Quote: 





brencho said:


> Yes, I suppose that's true that the difference between the MD Tributes and some of the others (SM2/3, UM3X) isn't that great. Are the SM2 and SM3 quite similar? Also I noticed that the XBA-4 are available somewhere for just over 200, which makes them another interesting choice, but not sure how complementary it would be to the TF10s in terms of mids and sub-bass?


 
   
  The SM3 is better than the SM2 but not by much. Its signature is more special/unique but they share many of the same traits. I don't think the XBA-4 is something I would get to compliment a TF10 and it almost certainly hasn't got the mids you are looking for. Under $200 is where it should be IMO.
   
  Quote: 





brencho said:


> And I should mention that a pair of Refurbished MD Tributes can be had for just over 100 bucks, which makes them interesting as well.


 
   
  Good price assuming they are warranted. 
   
  Quote: 





freemini said:


> I've read most of the reviews until about 250$. I'm quite unsure what I'd replace my current Image S4i's with. I find they sound quite good, but the cable's getting slowly destroyed so I'm looking for replacements. I mostly listen to heavy metal and hard rock style music. I'd also like to point out I'm far from an audiophile, I know nothing about how good headphones are supposed to sound until I actually listen to them personally. Remote control for apple devices would be nice, but I can live without it as there's adapters you can buy for quite cheap prices. So I'm looking for good sounding and as little as possible microphonics, I HATE the sounds IEM's make when I walk. I also don't wear them over the ear but that can change I guess. *I'm looking with high interest at VSonic GR07, from what I understand there's a MK2 version coming soon? How do those sound when used on mobile devices?*


 
   
  With the remote your choices would be pretty limited - pretty much to the Monster in-ears, the Klipsch X10i, and maybe the Shure SE215 + mic cable. Unless you wanted to do a complete sound signature switch and try an Etymotic HF3. 
   
  Without the remote the GR07, EPH-100, FXT90, and Sony EX600 are all solid choices for rock and a big step up from S4. They are all pretty consistent across sources, you won't have any issues with an iPhone or whatever. Of these the FXT90 has the lowest cable noise when worn cord-down.


----------



## brencho

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SM3 is better than the SM2 but not by much. Its signature is more special/unique but they share many of the same traits. I don't think the XBA-4 is something I would get to compliment a TF10 and it almost certainly hasn't got the mids you are looking for. Under $200 is where it should be IMO.
> 
> MD Tribute - Good price assuming they are warranted.


 
  What about the W4 compared to the UM3X and SM3 as compements to the recabled TF10? They seem very appealing if they could be found for a good price. 
   
  And agreed about the MD Tributes, a big part of their value comes from their lifetime warranty. Otherwise I would be more tempted by the yamahas or even trying out the GR07.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





freemini said:


> I've read most of the reviews until about 250$. I'm quite unsure what I'd replace my current Image S4i's with. I find they sound quite good, but the cable's getting slowly destroyed so I'm looking for replacements. I mostly listen to heavy metal and hard rock style music. I'd also like to point out I'm far from an audiophile, I know nothing about how good headphones are supposed to sound until I actually listen to them personally. Remote control for apple devices would be nice, but I can live without it as there's adapters you can buy for quite cheap prices. So I'm looking for good sounding and as little as possible microphonics, I HATE the sounds IEM's make when I walk. I also don't wear them over the ear but that can change I guess. *I'm looking with high interest at VSonic GR07, from what I understand there's a MK2 version coming soon? How do those sound when used on mobile devices?*


 
   
   
  The GR07 MK2 is already available, at least from one eBay seller from China. Look in the dedicated GR07 thread for more details on those...


----------



## freemini

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With the remote your choices would be pretty limited - pretty much to the Monster in-ears, the Klipsch X10i, and maybe the Shure SE215 + mic cable. Unless you wanted to do a complete sound signature switch and try an Etymotic HF3.
> 
> Without the remote the GR07, EPH-100, FXT90, and Sony EX600 are all solid choices for rock and a big step up from S4. They are all pretty consistent across sources, you won't have any issues with an iPhone or whatever. Of these the FXT90 has the lowest cable noise when worn cord-down.


 
  Thanks, now I'm even more confused. To be honest I just want better sounding IEM's, I've never changed any EQ settings or that sort of thing. I'm imagining X10i to be a better S4 which is fine by me, I'm also imagining GR07 to be better than X10 but in a different way. So I may just get X10i as they seem consumer oriented and I can actually buy them from Norway, so no import taxes like GR07. The other 3 you mentioned seem to be poor at isolating which I don't like. X10i just seem straight forward, plug in and get better sound.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





brencho said:


> What about the W4 compared to the UM3X and SM3 as compements to the recabled TF10? They seem very appealing if they could be found for a good price.
> 
> And agreed about the MD Tributes, a big part of their value comes from their lifetime warranty. Otherwise I would be more tempted by the yamahas or even trying out the GR07.


 
   
  The W4 is a bit less different from the TF10 than the UM3X/SM3 but still a much more mid-centric sound signature with better coherency and a more natural tone (though admittedly I haven't heard your aftermarket TF10 cable). You probably won't find any Monster deals on Westone products 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





freemini said:


> Thanks, now I'm even more confused. To be honest I just want better sounding IEM's, I've never changed any EQ settings or that sort of thing. I'm imagining X10i to be a better S4 which is fine by me, I'm also imagining GR07 to be better than X10 but in a different way. So I may just get X10i as they seem consumer oriented and I can actually buy them from Norway, so no import taxes like GR07. The other 3 you mentioned seem to be poor at isolating which I don't like. X10i just seem straight forward, plug in and get better sound.


 
   
  While the X10i is definitely more consumer-friendly than the GR07, they are both different from the S4. Not sure what the X10 will run you in Norway but I think they deserve recommending only at the sub-$250 prices we have here in the US. Otherwise a GR07 or FXT90 or EPH-100 wins out pretty easily. 
   
  Also confused by your statement on isolation - the EX600 is the only one I mentioned that isolates worse than the S4, and the SE215 and EPH-100 should isolate about as well as the X10 does.


----------



## freemini

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> While the X10i is definitely more consumer-friendly than the GR07, they are both different from the S4. Not sure what the X10 will run you in Norway but I think they deserve recommending only at the sub-$250 prices we have here in the US. Otherwise a GR07 or FXT90 or EPH-100 wins out pretty easily.
> Also confused by your statement on isolation - the EX600 is the only one I mentioned that isolates worse than the S4, and the SE215 and EPH-100 should isolate about as well as the X10 does.


 
  of those 4, only the X10i's and eph-100 are available here. X10i's are 1800kr(~300USD) and eph 1200kr(~200USD). I prefer not to buy from other countries as anything with a value over 300kr will be stopped at customs and I've got to pay about 25-40% tax. I'd pay the extra money for the convenience of volume buttons, but that depends if there's a big difference in sound quality/comfort or isolation. From what I understand, eph are only over the ear. I could change to that style but I'd prefer not to. I like IEM's so much because of how easy they are to carry around.


----------



## cibibikeru

Hi guys, i just recieved my Brainwavz M4 bought at 28$ from mp4 nation, is there any chance I got a fake? I own the M1 bought from the same place, good earphones but the M4 I just got are nothing compared to the M1, trebble extension is almost absent, all I can hear is bass, proeminent mids (when I turn the volume up they ''shout'' at me, I can't even listen to them) and some highs that cut off at a very early, i can bearly here a difference when I boost the 12k on my sansa clip+, they're nothing like I read about them! What could be the problem?


----------



## suman134

who told you eph-100 are over ear ?


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> Hi guys, i just recieved my Brainwavz M4 bought at 28$ from mp4 nation, is there any chance I got a fake? I own the M1 bought from the same place, good earphones but the M4 I just got are nothing compared to the M1, trebble extension is almost absent, all I can hear is bass, proeminent mids (when I turn the volume up they ''shout'' you cant even listen to them) and some highs that cut off at a very early, i can bearly here a difference when I boost the 12k on my sansa clip+, they're nothing like I read about them! What could be the problem?


 
   
  AFAIK, MP4Nation is a very legit business, and a lot of Head-Fi'ers has bought products from them.


----------



## cibibikeru

xinn3r said:


> AFAIK, MP4Nation is a very legit business, and a lot of Head-Fi'ers has bought products from them.




Ok, do they really sound that bad? The reviews say otherwise, I was expecting an upgrade over the M1, I am totally disappointed.. Is this the reason I paid only 28$ for them?


----------



## Gasdoc

Sorry for the derail. Always interesting how subjective this hobby is: I found the SM2 to be thick with bloated mid bass, almost unpleasant. The SM3 is audio nirvana.


----------



## ironbrewer

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good price assuming they are warranted.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





freemini said:


> From what I understand, eph are only over the ear. I could change to that style but I'd prefer not to. I like IEM's so much because of how easy they are to carry around.


 
   
   
  EPH-100 are pretty standard straight-barrel earphones. No reason why they should be worn over the ear except to eliminate cable noise. Same as the X10, actually.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> Hi guys, i just recieved my Brainwavz M4 bought at 28$ from mp4 nation, is there any chance I got a fake? I own the M1 bought from the same place, good earphones but the M4 I just got are nothing compared to the M1, trebble extension is almost absent, all I can hear is bass, proeminent mids (when I turn the volume up they ''shout'' at me, I can't even listen to them) and some highs that cut off at a very early, i can bearly here a difference when I boost the 12k on my sansa clip+, they're nothing like I read about them! What could be the problem?


 
   
  Bad unit, bad fit, bad something else. Shouldn't be a fake, though. I thought they were discontinued anyway...
   
   
   
  Quote: 





ironbrewer said:


> Are they poorly made, or will a 90 day warrantee be sufficient??


 
   
  I wouldn't risk it unless it was just to try them and move on. Monster gear doesn't have the best reputation for long-term durability.


----------



## FieldingMellish

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't risk it unless it was just to try them and move on. Monster gear doesn't have the best reputation for long-term durability.


 
   
  Agreed. It's more beneficial for Monster than for the buyer. Rhetorically: How it is that Monster has so many IEM's on hand for refurbishment? 
   
  On the other hand, MMDT I felt was too overloaded with extras and that the IEM's selling alone are worth the refurbished price, but at the additional expense of no where to turn once they go bad after the third month.


----------



## Leo888

Hi joker, need your insights between the Westone 2 and UM2. Which is the more musical and coherence performer? Which will have better PRAT and is non-fatiguing for long listening session and good with a wide variety of genres of music? Lastly, which is better overall based on price/performance? Your insights will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fieldingmellish said:


> Agreed. It's more beneficial for Monster than for the buyer. Rhetorically: How it is that Monster has so many IEM's on hand for refurbishment?
> 
> On the other hand, MMDT I felt was too overloaded with extras and that the IEM's selling alone are worth the refurbished price, but at the additional expense of no where to turn once they go bad after the third month.


 
   
  AFAIK monster stuff is sold in retail stores, which is not true for most other higher-end IEMs. Guessing that means a lot of returns from consumers who were expecting something else from a $400 in-ear. 
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, need your insights between the Westone 2 and UM2. Which is the more musical and coherence performer? Which will have better PRAT and is non-fatiguing for long listening session and good with a wide variety of genres of music? Lastly, which is better overall based on price/performance? Your insights will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.


 
   
  I'd be happy to comment but I haven't heard the UM2.


----------



## ayaflo

hi joker ,
  the rockit sounds r 50 has been making a wave here in head-fi ..
  twfk dual ba ... only 120 dollars ... hope you can get your hands on them at the earliest ..
  cheers


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ayaflo said:


> hi joker ,
> the rockit sounds r 50 has been making a wave here in head-fi ..
> twfk dual ba ... only 120 dollars ... hope you can get your hands on them at the earliest ..
> cheers


 
   
  It's been suggested a couple of times now. I'll see if I can make it happen but I'm not exactly struggling for lack of things to write up.


----------



## HBash

How would the EPH-100's bass compare to the regular Monster Turbines ? I am looking for something that provides good, quick bass for Hip-Hop/R&B/EDM, but would also pull off Metal & Rock, would the EPH-100 fit the bill ?
   
  I would've tried the Golds or Coppers were it not for the driver flex that's being very bothersome on my current Turbines.
   
  Thanks in advance..


----------



## abhijollyguy

@Joker
   
  I've received my EPH-100 and the first impression is WOW, I feel that EPH-100 has more sub-bass than the mid-bass which for me is a very good thing. I want to listen to it more but just want to know one thing more, If I want to upgrade so what would be the best upgrade from EPH-100??
   
  I would consider the same smooth treble which EPH-100 has but with more extension, same bass it would be better if the newer earphone has more tightness and depth with better definition in low end? better or same mid-range and soundstage? more better instrument separation???
   
  I am not going to upgrade anytime soon but just asking for the recommendation.
   
  Thanks & Regards


----------



## Leo888

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> AFAIK monster stuff is sold in retail stores, which is not true for most other higher-end IEMs. Guessing that means a lot of returns from consumers who were expecting something else from a $400 in-ear.
> 
> 
> I'd be happy to comment but I haven't heard the UM2.


 
  Ok, thanks joker. Maybe have to do more reading and try to figure it out.


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @Joker
> 
> I've received my EPH-100 and the first impression is WOW, I feel that EPH-100 has more sub-bass than the mid-bass which for me is a very good thing. I want to listen to it more but just want to know one thing more, If I want to upgrade so what would be the best upgrade from EPH-100??
> 
> ...


 
  I'm a huge fan of the EPH and purchased the JVC FXD80 recently.  I think the JVC's take it up a notch compared to the EPH.  You might want to take a look at this thread to see if it interests you.  Start at this page a read on for reviews/impressions.
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/612299/jvcs-micro-hd-line-revamped-for-2012-ha-fxd80-70-60/195


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hbash said:


> How would the EPH-100's bass compare to the regular Monster Turbines ? I am looking for something that provides good, quick bass for Hip-Hop/R&B/EDM, but would also pull off Metal & Rock, would the EPH-100 fit the bill ?
> 
> I would've tried the Golds or Coppers were it not for the driver flex that's being very bothersome on my current Turbines.
> 
> Thanks in advance..


 
   
  The EPH-100 is quicker and cleaner than the old Turbines - I think it'll be fine for what you're after. Would definitely recommend it for you over the Golds/Coppers. 
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @Joker
> 
> I've received my EPH-100 and the first impression is WOW, I feel that EPH-100 has more sub-bass than the mid-bass which for me is a very good thing. I want to listen to it more but just want to know one thing more, If I want to upgrade so what would be the best upgrade from EPH-100??
> 
> ...


 
   
  JVC HA-FX700. Maybe not quite as smooth as the EPH-100 but seems to be what you're after otherwise.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> JVC HA-FX700. Maybe not quite as smooth as the EPH-100 but seems to be what you're after otherwise.


 
   
  What do you think about Earsonics SM2 DLX and Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 as compared to the EPH-100?


----------



## Angelopsaro

To Joker and generally everyone:
   
  Regarding the highs of an IEM.. the only thing that i am not satisfied from gr07 is the highs.. When i tried the hje900 i noticed that the highs had a nice micro detailed and crispy type but not particular sibilance. It wasnt that much and i guess some of the best iems in the highs might have this thing and even more developed.. On the gr07 this is totally missing in my opinion.
  What do you thing?
   
  P.S Joker do you have in mind to audition any of the AT CKM500, Meelec A161 and jvc fxd80?


----------



## nScott89

Joker this past weekend I purchased the GR06 and RE262 thanks to your recommendations. In the past, I purchased the XE200Pro as well based on your recommendation, and absolutely love them. Thank you, |joker|. 
  Quick question: Have you ever tried the GR06 with a 70 ohm resistor cable? I hear that driving them after applying the adapter helps balance them out. I'm just wondering if you've ever tried that.
   
  Thanks |joker|!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> What do you think about Earsonics SM2 DLX and Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 as compared to the EPH-100?


 
   
  The SM2 won't really give you the tighter bass or the depth you're looking for compared to the EPH-100. The CTM-200 is much flatter in response and definitely isn't what you want.
   
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> To Joker and generally everyone:
> 
> Regarding the highs of an IEM.. the only thing that i am not satisfied from gr07 is the highs.. When i tried the hje900 i noticed that the highs had a nice micro detailed and crispy type but not particular sibilance. It wasnt that much and i guess some of the best iems in the highs might have this thing and even more developed.. On the gr07 this is totally missing in my opinion.
> What do you thing?
> ...


 
   
  The GR07 is hot in the treble for my taste as well - personally I think the GR01 does highs better. It all depends on what you're willing to spend and what you're willing to sacrifice in comparison to the GR07.
   
  I should be able to audition the CKM500 and A161 in the near future but I already know what the A161 sounds like from the Fischer version I've reviewed.
   
  Quote: 





nscott89 said:


> Joker this past weekend I purchased the GR06 and RE262 thanks to your recommendations. In the past, I purchased the XE200Pro as well based on your recommendation, and absolutely love them. Thank you, |joker|.
> Quick question: Have you ever tried the GR06 with a 70 ohm resistor cable? I hear that driving them after applying the adapter helps balance them out. I'm just wondering if you've ever tried that.
> 
> Thanks |joker|!


 
   
  I have a 64ohm adapter somewhere but I haven't tried it with the GR06.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SM2 won't really give you the tighter bass or the depth you're looking for compared to the EPH-100. The CTM-200 is much flatter in response and definitely isn't what you want.


 
  and with JVC-HA FX700, I am afraid of the isolation and being sibilant on some tracks so what left for me is again the MG7 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





, but I like EPH-100 a lot so in this case MG7 will not be the upgrade, it can be a side-grade. So MG7 has slightly recessed mid-range as compared to EPH-100 and has same or less treble extension?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> and with JVC-HA FX700, I am afraid of the isolation and being sibilant on some tracks so what left for me is again the MG7
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Can't argue about the isolation but sibilance was not at all a concern to me with the FX700. 
   
  IIRC the MG7 had similar or maybe even a bit more overall treble energy than the EPH-100 but was darker and less extended at the top. Biggest difference for me would be the presentation - I wasn't particularly impressed with the MG7's smallish, somewhat closed-in soundstage.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Can't argue about the isolation but sibilance was not at all a concern to me with the FX700.
> 
> IIRC the MG7 had similar or maybe even a bit more overall treble energy than the EPH-100 but was darker and less extended at the top. Biggest difference for me would be the presentation - I wasn't particularly impressed with the MG7's smallish, somewhat closed-in soundstage.


 
   
  Thank you for the reply.
   
  IIRC so once you told me that FX-700 has better bass quality than the MG7. Am I right?
   
  Also FX700 has slightly V-shaped signature next before EPH-100?


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thank you for the reply.
> 
> IIRC so once you told me that FX-700 has better bass quality than the MG7. Am I right?
> 
> Also FX700 has slightly V-shaped signature next before EPH-100?


 
   
  Stop asking questions and buy FX700


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thank you for the reply.
> 
> IIRC so once you told me that FX-700 has better bass quality than the MG7. Am I right?
> 
> Also FX700 has slightly V-shaped signature next before EPH-100?


 
   
  Yes, though the bass response of the FX700 mirrors the EPH-100 better than the MG7.
   
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Stop asking questions and buy FX700


 
   
  This is probably the correct response


----------



## glac1er

Hi ljokerl, between the e-Q5 and the GR07, which one do you think is more sibilant / peaky?


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, though the bass response of the FX700 mirrors the EPH-100 better than the MG7.
> 
> 
> 
> This is probably the correct response


 
   
  LOL Yeah this was the correct response


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





glac1er said:


> Hi ljokerl, between the e-Q5 and the GR07, which one do you think is more sibilant / peaky?


 
   
  For me, the GR07


----------



## ljokerl

Added Phonak PFE 232
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1B8) Phonak **Audéo ** PFE 232*
> 
> 
> Reviewed July 2012
> ...


----------



## billybob_jcv

I'm curious why accessories are given the same relative weight in the scoring as comfort, build quality, isolation, etc.  I mean, let's be realistic - I have half a dozen of the little earwax tools & clam-shell cases.  I also have lots of tips that I never plan on using because they don't fit or are uncomfortable.  I get that having multiple sizes of tips can be important - but I think that could simply be a small part of the "comfort" and "sound" categories - I wouldn't have it be a stand-alone metric.
   
  Sorry - I know I'm being critical of what was clearly a HUGE amount of work.  I do appreciate your dedication to our hobby!


----------



## james444

Quote: 





billybob_jcv said:


> I'm curious why accessories are given the same relative weight in the scoring as comfort, build quality, isolation, etc.  I mean, let's be realistic - I have half a dozen of the little earwax tools & clam-shell cases.  I also have lots of tips that I never plan on using because they don't fit or are uncomfortable.  I get that having multiple sizes of tips can be important - but I think that could simply be a small part of the "comfort" and "sound" categories - I wouldn't have it be a stand-alone metric.


 
   
  I think in case of the PFE232 that's easily justifiable, I've never seen a more complete accessory package with any IEM, tuning filters, replaceable inline mic/remote cable and all.
   
  @Joker: thanks for another great review!


----------



## anhtu1990

dear ljokerl. i am going to purchase the Gr06. and have a question about its detail and clarity : is it very good or just good in its price range. and this GR06 is a bit sibilant or much sibilant ?
  thank you very much for all of this


----------



## goodvibes

Thanks again. I really get a good sense of character from your reviews.


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





billybob_jcv said:


> I'm curious why accessories are given the same relative weight in the scoring as comfort, build quality, isolation, etc.  I mean, let's be realistic - I have half a dozen of the little earwax tools & clam-shell cases.  I also have lots of tips that I never plan on using because they don't fit or are uncomfortable.  I get that having multiple sizes of tips can be important - but I think that could simply be a small part of the "comfort" and "sound" categories - I wouldn't have it be a stand-alone metric.
> 
> Sorry - I know I'm being critical of what was clearly a HUGE amount of work.  I do appreciate your dedication to our hobby!


 
   
  I don't think |Joker| uses the score for anything.  It's just a score, none of it is weighted.  If he did weight it equally, he would have some sort of overall score that averaged all of them.  I'm sure if he did this, he would not weight accessories as much.  I don't even score accessories.  I just state what it comes with


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





billybob_jcv said:


> I'm curious why accessories are given the same relative weight in the scoring as comfort, build quality, isolation, etc.  I mean, let's be realistic - I have half a dozen of the little earwax tools & clam-shell cases.  I also have lots of tips that I never plan on using because they don't fit or are uncomfortable.  I get that having multiple sizes of tips can be important - but I think that could simply be a small part of the "comfort" and "sound" categories - I wouldn't have it be a stand-alone metric.
> 
> Sorry - I know I'm being critical of what was clearly a HUGE amount of work.  I do appreciate your dedication to our hobby!


 
   
  Legacy, mostly. When I started out every category had the same weight including sound. Over time the scale of the 'sound' score got more specific and I increased the weight of the category. I never bothered to change anything else. I've been meaning to halve the weight of the accessory score in the average but it hasn't been high on my priority list. Aside from 'boosting' things like the Phonak Perfect Bass the change really only modifies the order slightly.
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> I think in case of the PFE232 that's easily justifiable, I've never seen a more complete accessory package with any IEM, tuning filters, replaceable inline mic/remote cable and all.
> 
> @Joker: thanks for another great review!


 
   
  I don't think it's the 5/5 score that bob has an issue with but the weighting of the category in general. Agreed on the cable - AFAIK the 232 is the first IEM to include both a mic cable and a standard one, something portable headphone manufacturers have been doing for a while.
   
  And thanks, much appreciated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





anhtu1990 said:


> dear ljokerl. i am going to purchase the Gr06. and have a question about its detail and clarity : is it very good or just good in its price range. and this GR06 is a bit sibilant or much sibilant ?
> thank you very much for all of this


 
   
  In its price range. The GR06 is not as clear and detailed as an RE0 or Sunrise Xcape but still above average for its price. The treble is a bit uneven, not as bad as a Klipsch S3/S4 or anything.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> Thanks again. I really get a good sense of character from your reviews.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





tinyman392 said:


> I don't think |Joker| uses the score for anything.  It's just a score, none of it is weighted.  If he did weight it equally, he would have some sort of overall score that averaged all of them.  I'm sure if he did this, he would not weight accessories as much.  I don't even score accessories.  I just state what it comes with


 
   
   
  The only place where anything is calculated is the 'average' column of the table, and that's really only used for sorting.


----------



## scootsit

MY EARS CANNOT TAKE THE 8320 ANY LONGER!
  I just returned from a trip to Mexico for work, during which, I spent over 12hrs on a bus. I figured this would be the perfect setting for my 8320. Indeed, it was for the right ear. But, oh the left ear! In order to get the nozzle a the correct angle to extend deep into my ear, I had to twist them far backwards, to the point that it was extremely painful. Also, upon getting a seal, the driver flex was so great that they would not play for an extended time. They are great IEMs, but not worth the price unless your ears are exactly the correct size and shape. I have, on occasion gotten a good fit, but it can take me about an hour to find it. I think it's time to trade in and trade up. Next up, probably the GR99. Unless anyone can suggest anything else.


----------



## scootsit

I actually am looking at the GR02. Has anyone compared the GR02 to the GR02 Bass Edition? They are different products.


----------



## HBash

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The EPH-100 is quicker and cleaner than the old Turbines - I think it'll be fine for what you're after. Would definitely recommend it for you over the Golds/Coppers.


 
  Thanks man, The EPH-100s are on the way now.


----------



## planx

WHEW! For some reason, I was hoping you would enjoy the PFE232 as much as I do! Been sold ever since I got it; still sold. Brilliant IEM!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> MY EARS CANNOT TAKE THE 8320 ANY LONGER!
> I just returned from a trip to Mexico for work, during which, I spent over 12hrs on a bus. I figured this would be the perfect setting for my 8320. Indeed, it was for the right ear. But, oh the left ear! In order to get the nozzle a the correct angle to extend deep into my ear, I had to twist them far backwards, to the point that it was extremely painful. Also, upon getting a seal, the driver flex was so great that they would not play for an extended time. They are great IEMs, but not worth the price unless your ears are exactly the correct size and shape. I have, on occasion gotten a good fit, but it can take me about an hour to find it. I think it's time to trade in and trade up. Next up, probably the GR99. Unless anyone can suggest anything else.


 
   
  I've had a different problem in addition to fit issues... after a while the sheath on my 8320 cable has started splitting in places. 
   
  I think you'll be happy with the GR02 Bass Edition as long as you don't mind heavily enhanced bass and a more v-shaped sound overall compared to the Monoprice. 
   
  Quote: 





hbash said:


> Thanks man, The EPH-100s are on the way now.


 
   
  Enjoy!
   
  Quote: 





planx said:


> WHEW! For some reason, I was hoping you would enjoy the PFE232 as much as I do! Been sold ever since I got it; still sold. Brilliant IEM!


 
   





. Not my preferred signature but certainly a solid IEM either way.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've had a different problem in addition to fit issues... after a while the sheath on my 8320 cable has started splitting in places.
> 
> I think you'll be happy with the GR02 Bass Edition as long as you don't mind heavily enhanced bass and a more v-shaped sound overall compared to the Monoprice.


 
  It's not really my preference, but it seems to be about the best bet in the under $40 price range. I've also heard that the non-bass-edition has just as much bass, but sounds worse. I'm thinking bass edition it is, unless you have another suggestion, which I think I asked some time ago and the answer was pretty much a resounding not really.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> It's not really my preference, but it seems to be about the best bet in the under $40 price range. I've also heard that the non-bass-edition has just as much bass, but sounds worse. I'm thinking bass edition it is, unless you have another suggestion, which I think I asked some time ago and the answer was pretty much a resounding not really.


 
   
  Not going to matter how great it is if you dislike the sound signature - if that's the case it would probably be worth it to get something worse but with a more balanced signature that you'll like, like a MEElec CW31, Soundmagic E30, Maximo iM-590, or Xears XR120. Or you could hunt for a used RE0 or Ety MC5 (or even check out the EtyKids).


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not going to matter how great it is if you dislike the sound signature - if that's the case it would probably be worth it to get something worse but with a more balanced signature that you'll like, like a MEElec CW31, Soundmagic E30, Maximo iM-590, or Xears XR120. Or you could hunt for a used RE0 or Ety MC5 (or even check out the EtyKids).


 

 I'll take a look, thanks!


----------



## Trollra

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Bad unit, bad fit, bad something else. Shouldn't be a fake, though. I thought they were discontinued anyway...


 
 the M4 are not discontinued, they just ran out after the initial batch, just like with the ProAlpha's and others when they first came out.

 was kinda surprised you havent reviewed the M4's.

 One tip for anybody who gets the Brainwavz M4, the stock wide nozel tips SUCK HORRIBLY, use Hybrid style tips or the Comply tips that come with them.

 They also work well with multi flange tips from meelec(m6 tips work well in my testing) 

 saw somebody asking about monster, if your going to buy referbs, ALWAYS put a square trade on them, ALWAYS , buy via their ebay store, toss a 3 year on them at checkout and your covered,  never trust that they will have properly tested referbs either, it took me 2 returns to get a proper set of orignal turbines......if your looking at orignal turbines, take a pass and buy either brainwavz proalpha's or m2's, their built quality and support are better then monsters(monster support SUCKS....rma turn around was slower then shipping to HK and waiting for a replacement from mp4nation....and monster is on the same coast as i am....shouldnt have taken that long....

 well thanks for the reviews joker, Honestly, yours is the first place I send people looking for IEM reviews and comparisons.  I got radiopaq rock and jazz on the way at the moment, a buddy in the UK got me a set of each since they are on sale for under 10pounds each at the moment on amazon.co.uk


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not going to matter how great it is if you dislike the sound signature - if that's the case it would probably be worth it to get something worse but with a more balanced signature that you'll like, like a MEElec CW31, Soundmagic E30, Maximo iM-590, or Xears XR120. Or you could hunt for a used RE0 or Ety MC5 (or even check out the EtyKids).


 
   
  This.  I've tuned the SHE3580 to my liking with parametric EQ to such finesse that when I went to audition high-end IEMs yesterday, and listened to such heavyweights as the UM3X, XBA-3, IE80 and JVC FXD80, none of them impressed me much at all.  The XBA-3 came closest but even there I felt its timbre on vocals was off compared to my EQed SHE3580.
   
  I try to compare what I hear through phones with my memory of how sounds I hear in the natural environment sound like, and I still think the SHE3580 with EQ comes closest to reality.
   
  ljokerl, I get that you try to rate headphones in sound without letting your bias for sound signature get in the way.  How do you do it??? For example you said the UM3X has not enough treble sparkle for cymbals to sound realistic.  I hear that in the UM3X, and it just sounded low-fi, muffled with bloated midbass to me!  Yet you ranked it 9.2! (somewhere above 9 anyway)  What did you hear in it that made you think "yes, it's worth 9.2 even though I don't quite like what I hear"?  Even if you go by technical measurements there's not much in it between mid-fi and hi-fi phones in terms of stuff like THD...


----------



## suman134

bro , just wait and keep your earphones on , in 4-5 years you will be craving for the treble spark , those for ward mids as you will be faded up with the bass , will search for those symbols , and believe me , and xba-3 , wait for my review of those mid range fighters .


----------



## Joe Bloggs

I do crave the treble spark that's why i say the um3x sounds muffled. I also eq the bass of the SHE3580 way down (among many, many other tweaks) and then the midrange really comes alive. Actually I feel that the XBA-3 is still missing a bit in the 1-2kHz midrange, when I bumped it up a bit in EQ vocals sounded more realistic in timbre.


----------



## suman134

thats nice man , if you dont mind would you share your eq , i would like to try . i use cowon j3 and some times color fly dec , j3 goes like 3, 4 , 6 , 7 , 7 at freqs 80 , 220 , 1.4 , 4.1 and 13k . do you use rockbox ? i used to use with my sansa clip with that custom rom .


----------



## psygeist

@joe bloggs
  Westone 4, listen to these or ATH CK100. FAD FI-BA-SB too.


----------



## MLee

I'm looking at getting a pair of Westone 4 or the Audeo PFE 232. I currently have the Ety ER4P and the Miles Davis Trumpets. The comparative scale shows these to be 8.7 - 8.9 and the Westones and PFE 232 are rated a 9.4. What would the biggest difference the average person (No golden ear) would hear between the two models I have and the two I'm looking at? As another reference my full size headphones are the ATH W3000ANV and they are pretty close to perfect to me. Any help from someone who has heard these is appreciated.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> thats nice man , if you dont mind would you share your eq , i would like to try . i use cowon j3 and some times color fly dec , j3 goes like 3, 4 , 6 , 7 , 7 at freqs 80 , 220 , 1.4 , 4.1 and 13k . do you use rockbox ? i used to use with my sansa clip with that custom rom .


 
   
  Do you still use rockbox?  I checked that it has a 5 band parametric equalizer, which is JUUUST enough to make a good approximation of the parametric EQ I use on my computer.
   
  1. Low Shelf @276Hz, -10dB, bandwidth 2 (or Q=0.6667)
  2. Peak filter @2950Hz, -9.1dB, bandwidth 0.8 (or Q=1.78)
  3. Peak filter @5300Hz, -10.3dB, bandwidth 0.4 (or Q=3.59)
  4. Peak filter @8000Hz, -14.2dB, bandwidth 0.3 (or Q=4.8)
  5. Peak filter @11500Hz, -9.4dB, bandwidth 0.4 (or Q=3.59)
   
  The resulting EQ curve looks like this:



   
  But apart from the low shelf filter, the high frequency filters peak filters need to be customized to compensate for your ear canal's resonances (they are tuned now for my ear)
   
  You can take a look at PiccoloNamek's and my tutorial
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/413900/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-a-tutorial
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress
   
  For you (if you're using the provided tips with the SHE3580) it should be enough to just sweep the frequencies above 2kHz with Sinegen, find the frequencies where you hear a spike in loudness, and move the 4 peak filters I've made to cover those frequencies, and that should yield an EQ curve with similar general shape that covers your own ear canal resonances.
   
  That's a lot of cut in the high frequencies but I still hear plenty of treble energy coming from these Philips.  With the high frequencies smoothed out thus I get a bright but soothing sound, like a lightly overcast day--everything in the recording in seen in a soft flattering light.  With most other phones, if they are bright, it is like a sunny day at noon, everything is too harsh, or if they are dark, it's like nighttime, I can't hear anything properly.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





trollra said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> ljokerl said:
> ...


 
   
  That was my fault, I was thinking M3. I am not sure why a question about the M4 was asked here as I haven't reviewed them.
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> This.  I've tuned the SHE3580 to my liking with parametric EQ to such finesse that when I went to audition high-end IEMs yesterday, and listened to such heavyweights as the UM3X, XBA-3, IE80 and JVC FXD80, none of them impressed me much at all.  The XBA-3 came closest but even there I felt its timbre on vocals was off compared to my EQed SHE3580.
> 
> I try to compare what I hear through phones with my memory of how sounds I hear in the natural environment sound like, and I still think the SHE3580 with EQ comes closest to reality.
> 
> ljokerl, I get that you try to rate headphones in sound without letting your bias for sound signature get in the way.  How do you do it??? For example you said the UM3X has not enough treble sparkle for cymbals to sound realistic.  I hear that in the UM3X, and it just sounded low-fi, muffled with bloated midbass to me!  Yet you ranked it 9.2! (somewhere above 9 anyway)  What did you hear in it that made you think "yes, it's worth 9.2 even though I don't quite like what I hear"?  Even if you go by technical measurements there's not much in it between mid-fi and hi-fi phones in terms of stuff like THD...


 
   
  I really can't rate things based on technical measurements - for many reasons, but partly because I don't have the equipment available to me and partly because I wouldn't need to be in the equation at all if all that mattered was the response curve and THD. An algorithm could take care of all the "reviewing" if that were the case.
   
  I think I can get the read on a signature pretty well at this point but the overall score, at least approximately, comes from the overall feel a phone gives as compared to one of my reference sets. I take my time with reviews to ward off any 'new toy syndrome' and typically go back after a while and see if my residual impressions of a phone match the score given. I don't claim to be 100% consistent and if I had to do it over again certain things would probably be done differently.
   
  You have to also keep in mind that I do my reviews un-equalized, so while I realize that (for example) the JVC FX40 has excellent detail and clarity, perhaps right up there with the RE0 and Sunrise Xcited, I can't forgive the harsh treble or the heavily recessed lower mids. Higher-end sets like the UM3X, on balance, annoy me much less even if they pursue a signature I don't like and usually greatly impress in one or more ways. I really don't like the signature of the SM3, for example, but I never want to give them up whenever I get a go at a pair. The FX40 I couldn't get rid of quickly enough.
   
  Quote: 





mlee said:


> I'm looking at getting a pair of Westone 4 or the Audeo PFE 232. I currently have the Ety ER4P and the Miles Davis Trumpets. The comparative scale shows these to be 8.7 - 8.9 and the Westones and PFE 232 are rated a 9.4. What would the biggest difference the average person (No golden ear) would hear between the two models I have and the two I'm looking at? As another reference my full size headphones are the ATH W3000ANV and they are pretty close to perfect to me. Any help from someone who has heard these is appreciated.


 
   
  I've never reviewed the ER4P. The ER4S is in this thread and has a higher score than that. Aside from signature differences the biggest jump from the ER4S to the W4 and 232 will probably be in presentation - soundstaging and so on. I've never heard any ATH phones above the ES10 so can't be of any help there.


----------



## matryx

Hi guys, 
   
  My MEElectronics M9 finally broke so I'm looking for a new IEM now. I'm deciding between the Brainwavz M2 or the SoundMagic E10. They are both $35 on Amazon.com. Which one would you guys recommend? I listen to house, R&B, and hip-hop. 
  Also which one has better build quality?


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I really can't rate things based on technical measurements - for many reasons, but partly because I don't have the equipment available to me and partly because I wouldn't need to be in the equation at all if all that mattered was the response curve and THD. An algorithm could take care of all the "reviewing" if that were the case.
> I think I can get the read on a signature pretty well at this point but the overall score, at least approximately, comes from the overall feel a phone gives as compared to one of my reference sets. I take my time with reviews to ward off any 'new toy syndrome' and typically go back after a while and see if my residual impressions of a phone match the score given. I don't claim to be 100% consistent and if I had to do it over again certain things would probably be done differently.


 
  Oh, but an algorithm can rate IEMs based on frequency response and e.g. impulse response. (using waterfall graphs)
  You'd have to put some weighting to the frequency response differences from 0 dB line - and this is a matter of taste, as well as rate various kinds of ringing.
   
  It's pretty easy to classify bright/dark spectrum and describe the "kind" of brightness from the frequency response once you know what you're looking for.
  Examples: "bell-like" peak at 4 kHz (Hifiman RE-2xx series and ATH-CK10), hot 6.5 kHz peak (GR07  - combined with resonance? - and lesser Sennheiser IE7), sparkly peak at 10-11kHz (ER-4S/P, possibly FI-BA-SS); forward or recessed sound due to 2kHz or 3kHz emphasis/cut, boxy sound due to high bass emphasis (200-300 Hz, common with low end IEMs).
   
  Soundstaging is in fact directly related to the frequency response as well, esp. the highest registers, however this range is highly personal, so neither review nor measurement will tell the whole story, although I find that Joker's reviews match my own experiences 1:1.
   
  Also, ergonomics are pretty much make or break of IEMs. It doesn't matter really if it sounds perfect if the cable breaks after a few months.. (RE272 - they should ban silicone cable sheaths) or if you can't actually fit it in the ears without causing pain. (e.g. Monoprice 9320 or Radius DDM for some.) If the IEM loses seal every 30s, that's also pretty bad, but possibly fixable.
   
  It might be also useful to rate the impedance to give a recommendation like "needs an amp", "needs low impedance output" and perhaps measure the frequency response with various sources, simulating a portable player, a portable headphone amplifier and one a desktop amplifier.
   
  --
  The only people I know of who can actually rate IEMs and headphones based on measurements right now are Tyll of InnerFidelity/Headroom fame and especially people running Golden Ears site.
   
  Both actually provide subjective reviews as well.
  GE does so in a "dry" numeric form (maybe the text reviews are in Korean?), while Tyll has long winded reviews of the Stereophile kind with added measurements.
  Joker's occupy a happy medium, but the "quality" thing is quite open to interpretation (it's the "like/dislike" scale) - however he does grade various ergonomic features accurately and in a numeric form too.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





matryx said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> My MEElectronics M9 finally broke so I'm looking for a new IEM now. I'm deciding between the Brainwavz M2 or the SoundMagic E10. They are both $35 on Amazon.com. Which one would you guys recommend? I listen to house, R&B, and hip-hop.
> Also which one has better build quality?


 

 E10 are far more forward than M2 and a bit less dark.
  If you can equalize, I'd pick Brainwavz M2, they're more competent quality-wise. (and they're very easy to equalize)
   
  I also note ViSang VS-R02 (Same as Brainwavz ProAlpha? How the two companies must hate each other's guts...) on Amazon at this price point and VSonic GR02.
  GR02 should beat all of these three in general.


----------



## matryx

Are you saying the Vsonic GR02 is better than the E10, M2, and the Visang VS-R02?
   
  Only place I found the VSonic GR02 is on ebay and lendmeyourears.
   
  Are these the new ones I should be getting? 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VSONIC-GR02-R02PRO-Heavy-Bass-Version-Inner-Ear-Earphones-Earbuds-Silver-Cord-/170708747779?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item27bf08c603#ht_2191wt_1163
   
  The problem with Lendmeyourears they only provide 3 pairs of silicon tips instead of the 13.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I really can't rate things based on technical measurements - for many reasons, but partly because I don't have the equipment available to me and partly because I wouldn't need to be in the equation at all if all that mattered was the response curve and THD. An algorithm could take care of all the "reviewing" if that were the case.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I understand!  It's like there's pleasant deviations from neutral and unpleasant deviations from neutral.  Do you think you would be able to give the phones a separate "neutrality" score based on how close it is in signature to one of your reference sets that has a balanced response that is good for most genres?  Or is "neutrality" a subjective thing too?
   
   
  Quote: 





> Oh, but an algorithm can rate IEMs based on frequency response and e.g. impulse response. (using waterfall graphs)
> You'd have to put some weighting to the frequency response differences from 0 dB line - and this is a matter of taste, as well as rate various kinds of ringing.


 
   
  But you can't tell from an FR graph whether the deviations from neutral are pleasant or not.
   
  Although I would place value in an IEM that matches my neutral FR curve without EQ as that would lets me listen to all kinds of stuff with great SQ without EQ and use the EQ in a music player to EQ to taste according to the genre / recording instead of largely worrying about the IEM's own response (the latter I achieve right now by pre-EQing all music on the computer with the curve for the SHE3580.  I carry around some unprocessed songs to test phones I see in shops with.)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> *Oh, but an algorithm can rate IEMs based on frequency response and e.g. impulse response*. (using waterfall graphs)
> You'd have to put some weighting to the frequency response differences from 0 dB line - and this is a matter of taste, as well as rate various kinds of ringing.


 
   
  That's what I said. It's just not something you'll find in this thread.
   
  Quote: 





matryx said:


> Only place I found the VSonic GR02 is on ebay and lendmeyourears.
> 
> Are these the new ones I should be getting?
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/VSONIC-GR02-R02PRO-Heavy-Bass-Version-Inner-Ear-Earphones-Earbuds-Silver-Cord-/170708747779?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item27bf08c603#ht_2191wt_1163
> ...


 
   
  I think the listing you linked shows all of the GR02 tips. The GR02 bass edition has the best build quality and is perhaps the closest in signature to the M9 out of the ones you're considering. 
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> I understand!  It's like there's pleasant deviations from neutral and unpleasant deviations from neutral.  Do you think you would be able to give the phones a separate "neutrality" score based on how close it is in signature to one of your reference sets that has a balanced response that is good for most genres?  Or is "neutrality" a subjective thing too?


 
   
  I still consider a well-fitted Ety ER4S to be perhaps the most 'neutral' thing I've heard overall in terms of response. A neutrality score could be assigned by a machine using the frequency response and a set algorithm that weighs the severity of deviations. To have a human do it is a little more difficult - for example, what's more neutral - something like the CK10 that diverges from the ER4S heavily in only one area or the ACS T15, which is audibly warmer overall but would probably fall pretty close to the ER4S response curve when graphed?


----------



## matryx

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think the listing you linked shows all of the GR02 tips. The GR02 bass edition has the best build quality and is perhaps the closest in signature to the M9 out of the ones you're considering.


 
  Yeah there's a few on ebay that only comes with 3 pair of tips including the listing from "lendmeyourears"
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vsonic-GR02-Bass-/320936713941?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item4ab9519ed5#ht_762wt_1396
   
  It seems like there is the old version of the GR02 and a new version. I just want to make sure I'm getting the new improved version.
   
  Also I'm not really looking for the same signature as the M9. Wouldn't mind something better.


----------



## billybob_jcv

> I still consider a well-fitted Ety ER4S to be perhaps the most 'neutral' thing I've heard overall in terms of response.


 
   
  I don't disagree with you - however I will point out the obvious - what you hear as "neutral" may not be what I hear as neutral.  We have defined a flat FR as "neutral", which for IEMs is a very tricky metric to translate into the real-world experience of the individual listener.  With my somewhat constricted hearing range, a bit of V-shape can help - as long as it doesn't result in boominess or sibilance, and as long as the vocals & guitar riffs can still come through very clean without being recessed.  Even if my ears can no longer hear all the test tones equally, I think my brain can still generally remember what good audio is supposed to sound like!


----------



## ljokerl

double post


----------



## ljokerl

double post


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





matryx said:


> Yeah there's a few on ebay that only comes with 3 pair of tips including the listing from "lendmeyourears"
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vsonic-GR02-Bass-/320936713941?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item4ab9519ed5#ht_762wt_1396
> 
> It seems like there is the old version of the GR02 and a new version. I just want to make sure I'm getting the new improved version.
> ...


 
   
  All of the Bass Editions will be the latest version - that model wasn't around until this year.
   
  And, same signature does not mean same ability. The GR02 is still the better earphone, just not voiced as differently from an M9 as, say, an Brainwavz M2
   
  Quote: 





billybob_jcv said:


> I don't disagree with you - however I will point out the obvious - what you hear as "neutral" may not be what I hear as neutral.  We have defined a flat FR as "neutral", which for IEMs is a very tricky metric to translate into the real-world experience of the individual listener.  With my somewhat constricted hearing range, a bit of V-shape can help - as long as it doesn't result in boominess or sibilance, and as long as the vocals & guitar riffs can still come through very clean without being recessed.  Even if my ears can no longer hear all the test tones equally, I think my brain can still generally remember what good audio is supposed to sound like!


 
  That's a given - while there probably is an objective neutral in terms of signal transfer, individual variations in hearing are something that can't be accounted for. In this case you may be able to apply a consistent EQ curve to compensate, no matter the phone.


----------



## Subrising

Hey everyone I am new to the audio scene and I was wondering your opinions before I buy a new IEM. 
   
  I listen to mainly electronica styles of music as well as rock/pop and a bit of acoustic and RnB. I am not sure however what type of earphone to get.
  I live in Australia so I would prefer it if the product could be found somewhere here because of lot of them aren't. My budget is around $100 AUD but if I have to I can go over but wouldn't prefer it.
   
  Thanks so much for all your help on these forums as I've gained a lot of knowledge by reading through everything here!


----------



## AstralStorm

About the Amazon GR02, here's the link:
  http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-Silver-Earphones-Earbuds-iPhones/dp/B005EM9KRI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1341786697&sr=8-1&keywords=vsonic+gr02
   
  Was available yesterday with 3 left. Must've been bought out, it's hot goods. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Lendmeurears is probably the closest to what I'd call "authorized seller" of VSonic IEMs on ebay.
   
  --
   
  The most natural response could be a bit V-shaped when measured on an uncompensated measurement head. The manufacturer should aim either for free field (open air) or diffuse field (room) response. Some more info: http://www.head-acoustics.de/downloads/eng/application_notes/Equalization_brochure.pdf
   
  This doesn't contain "perceived bass" compensation, which typically should be ~6 dB/octave with 0 dB at 100 Hz, regardless of the mode of equalization - typically heard in low bass notes, slap bass and kick drums, but can be there in organ music and synthetic bass. It's even hard to measure those ranges. I'd say <= 35 Hz for the knee frequency of the rolloff is acceptable, anything other than this will have noticeably rolled off bass in some pieces..
   
  It's easier to make a diffuse field sounding IEM, just because most IEMs have limitations at both ends of the spectrum... unless you count (properly designed) DDMs and multiple BA.
  Single driver designs attempting free field sound tend to lack the bass and are somewhat rolled off in the highest end regardless. (Examples: ER-4S, RE272, CK10.)
  Even diffuse field attempts tend to have some highest end rolloff or annoying resonances. The true art involves placing these likely inevitable resonances so that the user is not annoyed and the sound isn't too unnatural.


----------



## suman134

can this be used on my portable pmp ?


----------



## suman134

safe bets are , soundmagic e30 , meelec , cw31 , cc51 , ultimat ears 500/400 , you need bass , and these have some good bass and nice clarity . take the ue 400/500 for bigger bass , cc51 for a really nice balance . all of them are under $75 .
     see if you can find , spider real voice , hi-sound crystal , vsonic gr06 .


----------



## Subrising

I am currently looking at the Shure SE215 as they are only $95 here on eBay in Australia and I heard they have really good bass. A lot of my music is bass or acoustic oriented but I also was an IEM that won't fall out of my ears whilst running/exercising.


----------



## suman134

this may not have awesome sound quality , but the cx 680 from sennheiser are really nice for running and exercising . se215 is good too .
  try a sports certified earphone . which are from philips , panasonic , meelec . i dont use any thing while running or exercising so its difficult to suggest .


----------



## Joe Bloggs

suman134 said:


> can this be used on my portable pmp ?



Did you look at the 5 band parametric eq setting for rockbox I posted?


----------



## suman134

rock box dont support my j3 nor the color fly not even  the samsung p3 .


----------



## Emospence

Quote: 





subrising said:


> I am currently looking at the Shure SE215 as they are only $95 here on eBay in Australia and I heard they have really good bass. A lot of my music is bass or acoustic oriented but I also was an IEM that won't fall out of my ears whilst running/exercising.


 
  I've had a bad impression of SE215s since listening to them beside the TDK BA200s back when I was deciding between them..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





subrising said:


> Hey everyone I am new to the audio scene and I was wondering your opinions before I buy a new IEM.
> 
> I listen to mainly electronica styles of music as well as rock/pop and a bit of acoustic and RnB. I am not sure however what type of earphone to get.
> I live in Australia so I would prefer it if the product could be found somewhere here because of lot of them aren't. My budget is around $100 AUD but if I have to I can go over but wouldn't prefer it.
> ...


 
   
  Any chance an EPH-100 is in budget? Otherwise the Shure SE215 should be okay for a warmer sound with enhanced bass. Not sure what other brands might be to you available locally.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> rock box dont support my j3 nor the color fly not even  the samsung p3 .


 
   
  Have you tried it on your computer yet?


----------



## suman134

yess . i have tried .


----------



## Joe Bloggs

How does it sound?  Did you try customizing the high frequency filters to your own ear?
   
  Please post your reply in the SHE3580 thread
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/561951/philips-she3580-iem-review-10-giant-killers-er-4p-gathering-dust/
   
  So we can avoid cluttering this thread...


----------



## Angelopsaro

Joker some days before i commented about the gr07 highs and you replied to me. You mentioned that the fxt90 have quite detailed nature and sparke. You think they will satisfy my need for more micro detailed over from the gr07?


----------



## glac1er

Thanks ljokerl for answering that the eQ5 is less peaky than the GR07 couple days back. 
   
  Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Joker some days before i commented about the gr07 highs and you replied to me. You mentioned that the fxt90 have quite detailed nature and sparke. You think they will satisfy my need for more micro detailed over from the gr07?


 
   
  Sorry for going from memory (I used to have the fxt90). But just in terms of treble micro detail, a good BA such as the sm3 performs better than fxt90 and just slaughters the gr07, though the gr07 and fxt90 have other better traits IMO.


----------



## Subrising

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Any chance an EPH-100 is in budget? Otherwise the Shure SE215 should be okay for a warmer sound with enhanced bass. Not sure what other brands might be to you available locally.


 
  EPH-100 gets way out of budget for me as it gets to around $170-180 when shipped from America and I'm trying to stay as close to $100 as possible. The Etymotic HF2 and the Xcape IE are only about $130 but I'm not overly sure about it. Most of my music is bass oriented but I also like good mids and highs in my trance/dnb/house music. In Australia I'm mainly looking at stores like addictedtoaudio.com.au headphones.com.au jaben.com.au and lendmeurears.com 
   
  If you want to see the types of music I listen to mainly search up Monstercatmedia on YouTube. Thanks everyone for your help!


----------



## H20Fidelity

Try Audio Affair for EPH-100, I think it comes to around $130 shipped "roughly" (depending where you are) Everyones been grabbing them there.

http://www.audioaffair.co.uk/Yamaha-EPH100-Earphones/product_5924


----------



## Subrising

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> Try Audio Affair for EPH-100, I think it comes to around $130 shipped "roughly" (depending where you are) Everyones been grabbing them there.


 
  I'd prefer to get it from somewhere in Australia just due to warranty issues and stuff and also delivery times. Most of these sites from UK or US don't have any delivery estimates to Australia which is worrying to me.
   
  EDIT: They come out to about 73 pounds which is $112AUD and that is including the Royal Mail Airmail delivery. That seems like a fantastic price however I am just going to ask them about delivery times. How good are the Yamahas with bass also since most of my music is that?


----------



## H20Fidelity

subrising said:


> I'd prefer to get it from somewhere in Australia just due to warranty issues and stuff and also delivery times. Most of these sites from UK or US don't have any delivery estimates to Australia which is worrying to me.




There's only one place I know of in Australia that has them, but they're on backorder ($99)

http://www.myshopping.com.au/GO--1220688254_shopping

Edit: Audio Affair seems the logical solution, everyone's been grabbing them there without any problems. The bass will be plenty enough for your music genres. EPH-100 can get down and dirty with the best of them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





angelopsaro said:


> Joker some days before i commented about the gr07 highs and you replied to me. You mentioned that the fxt90 have quite detailed nature and sparke. You think they will satisfy my need for more micro detailed over from the gr07?


 
   
  I don't remember the conversation where I recommended the FXT90 over the GR07 but I would say the highs will be pretty close between the two, not night and day, with a nod to the FXT90. Something like the Brainwavz B2 will do much better.
   
   
  Quote: 





subrising said:


> EPH-100 gets way out of budget for me as it gets to around $170-180 when shipped from America and I'm trying to stay as close to $100 as possible. The Etymotic HF2 and the Xcape IE are only about $130 but I'm not overly sure about it. Most of my music is bass oriented but I also like good mids and highs in my trance/dnb/house music. In Australia I'm mainly looking at stores like addictedtoaudio.com.au headphones.com.au jaben.com.au and lendmeurears.com
> 
> If you want to see the types of music I listen to mainly search up Monstercatmedia on YouTube. Thanks everyone for your help!


 
   
  The HF2 is not what you're looking for. The Xcape IE is fantastic but I don't recommend it due to construction issues.
   
  Quote: 





subrising said:


> I'd prefer to get it from somewhere in Australia just due to warranty issues and stuff and also delivery times. Most of these sites from UK or US don't have any delivery estimates to Australia which is worrying to me.
> 
> EDIT: They come out to about 73 pounds which is $112AUD and that is including the Royal Mail Airmail delivery. That seems like a fantastic price however I am just going to ask them about delivery times. *How good are the Yamahas with bass* also since most of my music is that?


 
   
  Pretty darn good.


----------



## Subrising

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't remember the conversation where I recommended the FXT90 over the GR07 but I would say the highs will be pretty close between the two, not night and day, with a nod to the FXT90. Something like the Brainwavz B2 will do much better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  What would you recommend though in terms of an SE 215 which I can get for $107 AUD including shipping or the Yamahas for $115-120 considering the majority of stuff I listen to is like MonsterCat Media things and electronica styles?


----------



## Gadabout

Just wanted to thank Joker and others who have contributed to this thread. Makes research so much easier. The thread helped again as I researched what I should try next. Really happy with PFE112's that I got last year, but it was time to see what the upper tier might sound like from the Cowon J3.
   
  Westone 4r's on order. Looking forward to seeing what they are about.
   
  Thanks again for your time and dedication.
   
  Scott


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





subrising said:


> What would you recommend though in terms of an SE 215 which I can get for $107 AUD including shipping or the Yamahas for $115-120 considering the majority of stuff I listen to is like MonsterCat Media things and electronica styles?


 
   
  The EPH-100 if you can afford them. 
    
   
  Quote:


gadabout said:


> Just wanted to thank Joker and others who have contributed to this thread. Makes research so much easier. The thread helped again as I researched what I should try next. Really happy with PFE112's that I got last year, but it was time to see what the upper tier might sound like from the Cowon J3.
> 
> Westone 4r's on order. Looking forward to seeing what they are about.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Agreed, big thanks to everyone who helps answer questions and otherwise keep this thread alive and (hopefully) helpful. 
   
  Hope you enjoy the W4s


----------



## suman134

if you are not looking for a bass monster , then you will be happy with the yamaha eph100 , cuz its superior to the shure se215 in audio quality . as its more precise sounding then the booming shure . and if you use the silicone tips , it gives huge bass .
   
  your getting some good deals out there , so grab them . you will have a really nice top tier sound experience .


----------



## Calneon

I'm looking for some new in ear headphones after my previous set died. I've used an Ultimate Ears 400vi set which I liked, but the cable became loose and started making noise whenever it moved, so I had to return it. After that I got a set of Klipsch Image S4s which I was rather disappointed with after using the UEs, they were very uncomfortable in my ears, there was a piece of plastic that poked into the side of my ear, plus the sound quality wasn't what i was expecting. Anyway, one of the ear pieces just broke on them so I have an excuse to replace them!
   
  Very tempted by the Yamaha EPH100s you recommend so much on here, only issue I have is that they don't have controls on the cord, which both my previous sets did and I found it very useful. For a similar price the Nocs NS400 seem to be what I'm looking for but I'm not sure how the image quality stands up to the Yamahas. Are there any other headphones you would recommend at a similar quality/price to the Yamahas which do have controls? If not, I'll probably just go for those and make do without the controls. Thanks for any replies.


----------



## Subrising

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The EPH-100 if you can afford them.
> 
> Agreed, big thanks to everyone who helps answer questions and otherwise keep this thread alive and (hopefully) helpful.
> 
> Hope you enjoy the W4s


 
   
 Would it be worth a $30-40 price difference compared to Xcape IE or $60-70 over HiSound Audio PoPos or Crystals? I'm not 100% sure if I want to shell out that much for IEMs just yet. What would your recommendation be for a sub $100 IEM for a bass head that also likes to listen to lighter stuff?
  
 Thanks so much for your help also and to everyone else as well. Really helping me with my situation and I'm learning a heap.


----------



## suman134

i dont know any earphone with sound and dose bass like eu400 and priced under $100 with mic and control , i have one which is like cc51p . over that there is image x10i . unless you have good brand count like spider , phonak .


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





subrising said:


> Would it be worth a $30-40 price difference compared to Xcape IE or $60-70 over HiSound Audio PoPos or Crystals? I'm not 100% sure if I want to shell out that much for IEMs just yet. What would your recommendation be for a sub $100 IEM for a bass head that also likes to listen to lighter stuff?
> 
> Thanks so much for your help also and to everyone else as well. Really helping me with my situation and I'm learning a heap.


 
   
  If you can get a FXT90 for under $100, it's a pretty good deal...
  Musical without too much coloration, and oh the sweet sweet timbre


----------



## Freefallr4545

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> If you can get a FXT90 for under $100, it's a pretty good deal...
> Musical without too much coloration, and oh the sweet sweet timbre


 

 x17


----------



## iamthem

Hi joker, between the SOUNDMAGIC PL50 and e30 which one do you think does cymbals with better clarity and sparkle?


----------



## suman134

man , i own a e30 and and heard pl50 extensively , just go for pl50 if you dont want bass , if you go with e30 you will get bass but lose the treble . pl50 has what you want .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





calneon said:


> I'm looking for some new in ear headphones after my previous set died. I've used an Ultimate Ears 400vi set which I liked, but the cable became loose and started making noise whenever it moved, so I had to return it. After that I got a set of Klipsch Image S4s which I was rather disappointed with after using the UEs, they were very uncomfortable in my ears, there was a piece of plastic that poked into the side of my ear, plus the sound quality wasn't what i was expecting. Anyway, one of the ear pieces just broke on them so I have an excuse to replace them!
> 
> Very tempted by the Yamaha EPH100s you recommend so much on here, only issue I have is that they don't have controls on the cord, which both my previous sets did and I found it very useful. For a similar price the Nocs NS400 seem to be what I'm looking for but I'm not sure how the image quality stands up to the Yamahas. Are there any other headphones you would recommend at a similar quality/price to the Yamahas which do have controls? If not, I'll probably just go for those and make do without the controls. Thanks for any replies.


 
   
  To get EPH-100 level performance with controls and a bass-heavy signature you'd have to look at the Monster Trumpets, which are a lot more expensive. If you're willing to drop to a lower tier then there's a number of options - the MEElec CC51P should be a good UE400 replacement with its v-shaped yet refined sound. The Phonak 022 (whichever one has the mic) is decent also and gives you the ability to get another set of filters later for a different sound. Plus it's one of the more comfortable earphones out there. The Shure SE215+mic cable is another solid all-rounder that should be comfortable for most ears. 
   
   
  Quote: 





subrising said:


> Would it be worth a $30-40 price difference compared to Xcape IE or $60-70 over HiSound Audio PoPos or Crystals? I'm not 100% sure if I want to shell out that much for IEMs just yet. What would your recommendation be for a sub $100 IEM for a bass head that also likes to listen to lighter stuff?
> 
> Thanks so much for your help also and to everyone else as well. Really helping me with my situation and I'm learning a heap.


 
   
  Like I said, can't recommend the Xcape IE even though it's a great earphone. The Crystal is more of a competitor for the Shure SE215. Good, just not EPH-100-good. Also not sure a Crystal would do it for a proper bass head. In that price range perhaps a Hippo VB or Fischer Audio Consonance would be more suitable. Or you could save a good chunk of change and try a Vsonic GR02 bass edition.
   
  Quote: 





iamthem said:


> Hi joker, between the SOUNDMAGIC PL50 and e30 which one do you think does cymbals with better clarity and sparkle?


 
   
  Neither is great but if I had to pick one, probably the E30. The E30 doesn't have great resolution but the PL50 rolls off earlier and its buttery smoothness works against it in some ways. I've actually never heard an earphone based on a Knowles SR driver that had great highs. Most have decent quality and somewhat less decent quantity.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've actually never heard an earphone based on a Knowles SR driver that had great highs. Most have decent quality and somewhat less decent quantity.


 
  Seems like when they use enough filter to even the lower treble bump, the extension suffers and if you don't use that much acoustic resistance the 3-4k range overshadows what's up there anyways. I still kinda like some of their low hash clarity and could understand someone preferring them at $60.


----------



## willpayne

Hey guys, just wondering if any of you had tried both the triple fi 10 and the gr07/gr07 mk2. I listen to hip hop, dubstep, dnb, and some indie and rock. Which is best for me? Thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> Seems like when they use enough filter to even the lower treble bump, the extension suffers and if you don't use that much acoustic resistance the 3-4k range overshadows what's up there anyways. I still kinda like some of their low hash clarity and could understand someone preferring them at $60.


 
   
  Not a lot of armatures out there at $60 anyway. I do think some of the new pricing with the MEElec A151 and Astrotec AM-90 at $35-45 is great for the consumer. Hopefully the days of $100 SR-based earphones are gone. 
    
  Quote:


willpayne said:


> Hey guys, just wondering if any of you had tried both the triple fi 10 and the gr07/gr07 mk2. I listen to hip hop, dubstep, dnb, and some indie and rock. Which is best for me? Thank you!


 
   
  I've only heard the mkI of the GR07 and prefer that to the TF10, personally. The TF10 is a bit more colored-sounding, more v-shaped in response with more treble sparkle. I can see someone preferring the UE but I thought the GR07 was more natural-sounding, especially in  bass.


----------



## anoxy

What IEMs would give me a big open sound similar to the Sennheiser MX980?


----------



## matryx

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> All of the Bass Editions will be the latest version - that model wasn't around until this year.
> 
> And, same signature does not mean same ability. The GR02 is still the better earphone, just not voiced as differently from an M9 as, say, an Brainwavz M2


 
   
  My iD America Sparks came in today and I placed an order for the Vsonic GR02 a couple of days ago. Haven't really listen much with the iD America Sparks but I think they are pretty good. Got good bass and sound a lot more clear than my M9. Not sure if it was worth the $80 CAD I paid for it. It's better than me M9 for sure but not that much better. I think I paid like $30 or so for the M9. Anyways I'm going to listen to it a bit more. So far I'm satisfied but it was nothing that wowed me.


----------



## gjohnst4

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not a lot of armatures out there at $60 anyway. I do think some of the new pricing with the MEElec A151 and Astrotec AM-90 at $35-45 is great for the consumer. Hopefully the days of $100 SR-based earphones are gone.
> 
> I've only heard the mkI of the GR07 and prefer that to the TF10, personally. The TF10 is a bit more colored-sounding, more v-shaped in response with more treble sparkle. I can see someone preferring the UE but I thought the GR07 was more natural-sounding, especially in  bass.


 
   


 Sounds like your TF10 review is close to complete?


----------



## eke2k6

Joker, PLEASE tell me you have this thread backed up somewhere. It would be a shame to lose such a resource.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anoxy said:


> What IEMs would give me a big open sound similar to the Sennheiser MX980?


 
   
  Never heard the MX980 but some of the more open-sounding earphones I've heard are the new Sonys - EX600, MDR-7550, and EX1000.
   
   
  Quote: 





matryx said:


> My iD America Sparks came in today and I placed an order for the Vsonic GR02 a couple of days ago. Haven't really listen much with the iD America Sparks but I think they are pretty good. Got good bass and sound a lot more clear than my M9. Not sure if it was worth the $80 CAD I paid for it. It's better than me M9 for sure but not that much better. I think I paid like $30 or so for the M9. Anyways I'm going to listen to it a bit more. So far I'm satisfied but it was nothing that wowed me.


 
   
  I'd give them some time without A:Bing with the M9s. The difference should be more clear when you go back to the MEElecs after some days.
   
   
  Quote: 





gjohnst4 said:


> Sounds like your TF10 review is close to complete?


 
   
  It's been in that state for a year or so...
   
   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Joker, PLEASE tell me you have this thread backed up somewhere. It would be a shame to lose such a resource.


 
   
  Not very good about that to be honest. Since 100 or so earphones in I've been sticking all the posted reviews (without formatting) into a separate word document, which is now 358 pages / 170k words long. Counting on google cache for the older reviews. I should probably save HTML copies of the review posts at some point.


----------



## Nickarus

I have what I think is a kind of fundamental question:  When it's stated that the EPH-100's have a 5.5mm driver, or the CC51's have a 6mm driver, is this a direct correlation to the outermost diameter of the housing going in the ear canal, or rather a measurement a part within the housing/IEM?
   
  Beyond this generic question, I have a more specific question for my case in point:  I'm presently hoping to step up from my A151's to EPH-100's, but I've become aware over time that my canals are narrower than average.  In my experience, the CC51's even with the smallest tips were terribly painful (loved the sound, but ouch!).  The A151's are most comfortable with the stock tri-flange actually - depth is not an issue and by its construction it appears the largest flange is able to compress with minimal little resistance relative to the other tips.  Some years back, a few models of the Sony EX series IEM's using the smallest tips (SS) were perhaps the comfiest fit with adequate seal I've ever experienced.
   
  Can anyone with EPH-100's relate their physical fit to any of this?  Short of Joker's general caution regarding nozzle diameter,  these appear to be a great step up.  I'm hopeful the nozzles are at least incrementally smaller than the CC51 by the driver stats (but again maybe there's no correlation). 
   
  Thanks so much!


----------



## scootsit

I cannot speak to the specifics for the phones you listed, but I can answer your first question. The diameter is the diameter of the driver, not the housing. That said, the housing must be large enough to hold the driver. Is the housing necessarily going to be different for a 5.5 or a 6mm driver? No. That's a half millimeter size difference, and there could be fairings around the driver or a different thickness of the housing walls that make the housing wider. Will a 10mm driver have a larger housing than a 6mm driver? Probably, that is a big enough difference that the housing would need to be bigger to account for the difference.
    
   
  Quote:


nickarus said:


> I have what I think is a kind of fundamental question:  When it's stated that the EPH-100's have a 5.5mm driver, or the CC51's have a 6mm driver, is this a direct correlation to the outermost diameter of the housing going in the ear canal, or rather a measurement a part within the housing/IEM?
> 
> Beyond this generic question, I have a more specific question for my case in point:  I'm presently hoping to step up from my A151's to EPH-100's, but I've become aware over time that my canals are narrower than average.  In my experience, the CC51's even with the smallest tips were terribly painful (loved the sound, but ouch!).  The A151's are most comfortable with the stock tri-flange actually - depth is not an issue and by its construction it appears the largest flange is able to compress with minimal little resistance relative to the other tips.  Some years back, a few models of the Sony EX series IEM's using the smallest tips (SS) were perhaps the comfiest fit with adequate seal I've ever experienced.
> 
> ...


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's been in that state for a year or so...


 
   
  I can gather that you really like to tease people...


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





nickarus said:


> I have what I think is a kind of fundamental question:  When it's stated that the EPH-100's have a 5.5mm driver, or the CC51's have a 6mm driver, is this a direct correlation to the outermost diameter of the housing going in the ear canal, or rather a measurement a part within the housing/IEM?
> 
> Beyond this generic question, I have a more specific question for my case in point:  I'm presently hoping to step up from my A151's to EPH-100's, but I've become aware over time that my canals are narrower than average.  In my experience, the CC51's even with the smallest tips were terribly painful (loved the sound, but ouch!).  The A151's are most comfortable with the stock tri-flange actually - depth is not an issue and by its construction it appears the largest flange is able to compress with minimal little resistance relative to the other tips.  Some years back, a few models of the Sony EX series IEM's using the smallest tips (SS) were perhaps the comfiest fit with adequate seal I've ever experienced.
> 
> ...


 
   
  You confused me there, using the term "driver".
   
  ljoker's reviews state "nozzle size".  EPH-100 nozzle size: 5.5mm, CC51 nozzle size: 6mm
   
  Yes the "nozzle size" is a direct measure of the outermost diameter of the housing going in the ear canal.


----------



## Nickarus

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I cannot speak to the specifics for the phones you listed, but I can answer your first question. The diameter is the diameter of the driver, not the housing. That said, the housing must be large enough to hold the driver. Is the housing necessarily going to be different for a 5.5 or a 6mm driver? No. That's a half millimeter size difference, and there could be fairings around the driver or a different thickness of the housing walls that make the housing wider. Will a 10mm driver have a larger housing than a 6mm driver? Probably, that is a big enough difference that the housing would need to be bigger to account for the difference.


 

 Thanks so much scootsit - this answers that misunderstanding for me very clearly!
   
  So my present question really revolves around the relative housing/nozzle size of the EPH-100's, not the driver statistic.  I'll keep digging around, but if any comparisons that can be drawn or experiences related I'd be most appreciative!
   
  Also it's been said a gazillion times but bears repeating:  Joker, your efforts are something for which I and many others are terribly grateful. For the significant fraction of my life I've spent enjoying music in my free time, I thank you and and your brethren here for improving my quality of life =).


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





nickarus said:


> Thanks so much scootsit - this answers that misunderstanding for me very clearly!
> 
> So my present question really revolves around the relative housing/nozzle size of the EPH-100's, not the driver statistic.  I'll keep digging around, but if any comparisons that can be drawn or experiences related I'd be most appreciative!
> 
> Also it's been said a gazillion times but bears repeating:  Joker, your efforts are something for which I and many others are terribly grateful. For the significant fraction of my life I've spent enjoying music in my free time, I thank you and and your brethren here for improving my quality of life =).


 
   
  The numbers you quoted are "nozzle size", not "driver size".  See my reply above.


----------



## Nickarus

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> You confused me there, using the term "driver".
> 
> ljoker's reviews state "nozzle size".  EPH-100 nozzle size: 5.5mm, CC51 nozzle size: 6mm
> 
> Yes the "nozzle size" is a direct measure of the outermost diameter of the housing going in the ear canal.


 

 Thanks Joe, perhaps I'm confusing myself most of all!  Here is an excerpt of the CC51 review that led me this route - note two bolded passages, in hindsight maybe in conflict:
   
  Quote: 





> *Nozzle Size: 6mm* | Preferred tips: _Stock single flanges_
> Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_
> 
> Accessories (4/5) – Single-flange (3 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and hard clamshell carrying case
> ...


 
  I guess I walked away from the second passage thinking the nozzle must be something larger than 6mm... I was unsure of whether 6mm listed at the top is a nominal driver size or a direct measurement of the nozzle... but with your clarification as a direct measurement I might try finding a 5.5mm object, forcing a small tip around it, and seeing if that hurts.


----------



## mondrin

After trying the RE-ZERO, A161 and EPH-100 and returning them all I decided to take a break from my IEM search.  A friend of mine bought the skull candy Titans and just for kicks I asked to listen to them (after they had been broken in).  I wasn't expecting much but it was interesting to find that the overall sonic balance was closer to what want than the above mentioned 3.  Bass levels could be a tad less and the treble is quite harsh but whatever the peaks and values or overall shape of this set, it is more what I'm after.  I won't get them as the treble would kill me over time.  If it had the treble of the RE-ZERO with the quality (not quantity of bass from the EPH-100.....that would be something special I think.  Guess I will keep looking.  May try the Rockit R-50's based on what I've read around the forum.  May still try the RE-262.  Not sure what else I'll try yet.  As my wife says, it would sure be easier if I wasn't so picky.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nickarus said:


> I guess I walked away from the second passage thinking the nozzle must be something larger than 6mm... I was unsure of whether 6mm listed at the top is a nominal driver size or a direct measurement of the nozzle... but with your clarification as a direct measurement I might try finding a 5.5mm object, forcing a small tip around it, and seeing if that hurts.


 
   
  The nozzle of the CC51 might be 6.1mm - I would just round it off to 6 anyway. The takeaway message is that the CC51 nozzle is slightly fatter than that of the EPH-100, which is confirmed by CC51 tips being a bit loose on the Yamahas.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





> It's been in that state for a year or so...


 
  i just hope the SHE3580 and FX40 wont take that long


----------



## Trollra

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That was my fault, I was thinking M3. I am not sure why a question about the M4 was asked here as I haven't reviewed them.


 

 Any Chance of a review on them?(m4)

 the m3 needed a different shell, a buddy of mine tried to sell me a set and after trying to use them over ears....told him that 35usd was to much.......(made my ears hurt...lol) 

 that said, I got a set of m2's on the latest amazon sale for 35bucks and really am enjoying them for out and about (and audio book) use, find them and my proalpha's to be very good for their prices....I have owned better but they cost so much more that taking them out and about was worrying......(i hate loosing things, specially things worth hundreds of dollars....) 

 I will say the interactions I have had with mp4nation have been nothing but positive, they have stood behind their stuff and even tossed me extra tips when the PA replacements I got had the pre-release POS tips in the box.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  which one is bright between FX700 and Westone 4?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> which one is bright between FX700 and Westone 4?


 
   
  FX700 by a good margin


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





trollra said:


> Any Chance of a review on them?(m4)
> 
> the m3 needed a different shell, a buddy of mine tried to sell me a set and after trying to use them over ears....told him that 35usd was to much.......(made my ears hurt...lol)
> 
> ...


 
   
  To be honest I was never a fan of the M3 form factor either. As for the M4, no time at the moment but maybe down the line.
   
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> which one is bright between FX700 and Westone 4?


 
   
  The FX700 has more treble energy. It's not necessarily a 'bright' earphone overall but brighter than the W4.


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> To be honest I was never a fan of the M3 form factor either. As for the M4, no time at the moment but maybe down the line.


 
   
  I'm assuming you're talking about Brainwavz M3...  If so, I agree fully with this.  Wearing them down is fine with their design, but wearing them up isn't as fun (unless you swap ears).


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> FX700 by a good margin


 
   
  Thanks for the reply 
    
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> To be honest I was never a fan of the M3 form factor either. As for the M4, no time at the moment but maybe down the line.
> 
> 
> 
> The FX700 has more treble energy. It's not necessarily a 'bright' earphone overall but brighter than the W4.


 
   
  So in this case I assume, W4 would be having slightly a tad more treble than the EPH-100 and EPH-100 would be having more bass quantity than the W4 but quality of bass would be more on W4.
   
  Am I leaning towards the W4 now


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, have you checked out the 2012 Head-Fi Summer Buying Guide?
  Congratulations on having so many of your reviews quoted!
  Hope it still will be in years to come!


----------



## sekainohakaisha

Hi all,
I'm currently looking for earphones that are neutral to bright. So far, I've been using sennheiser ie8 and jvc fx500 for my listening sessions, and I suddenly wanted to listen to another one with a different characteristics. (despite having decent highs, fx500 is still bass heavy)
Upon doing some research, I think that SE535 or W4 might give me what I want.
My questions are:
How does the sound compare to the ones I have? 
I'm not really an audiophile, will I hear any noticeable improvements with respect to my current IEMs? And what kind of improvements?
Just an additional information, I used my sony A860 as my source. Oh, and I'm also open to any suggestions. Budget-wise, SE535 and W4 are the highest price point I can afford.
Thanks in advance guys!


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





sekainohakaisha said:


> Hi all,
> I'm currently looking for earphones that are neutral to bright. So far, I've been using sennheiser ie8 and jvc fx500 for my listening sessions, and I suddenly wanted to listen to another one with a different characteristics. (despite having decent highs, fx500 is still bass heavy)
> Upon doing some research, I think that SE535 or W4 might give me what I want.
> My questions are:
> ...


 
   
  I'm going to be honest and say that I wouldn't call the W4 neutral to bright, rather, I'd call them balanced and warm.  However, I don't know what neutral to bright is to you (it all comes to degrees).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tinyman392 said:


> I'm assuming you're talking about Brainwavz M3...  If so, I agree fully with this.  Wearing them down is fine with their design, but wearing them up isn't as fun (unless you swap ears).


 
   
  Yep, the Brainwavz and whatever ViSang model is equivalent (R04?). There were also some Music Valley IEMs that used the same housing.
   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> Thanks for the reply
> 
> So in this case I assume, W4 would be having slightly a tad more treble than the EPH-100 and EPH-100 would be having more bass quantity than the W4 but quality of bass would be more on W4.
> 
> Am I leaning towards the W4 now


 
   
  Sounds about right. The W4 might sound too tame/boring next to the EPH-100.
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, have you checked out the 2012 Head-Fi Summer Buying Guide?
> Congratulations on having so many of your reviews quoted!
> Hope it still will be in years to come!


 
   
   
  Thanks, just checked it out. That's quite a few quotes, way more than last year. It seems that a quote from my PFE 112 review made it on to the 232 page and the ER4S review was used for the ER4PT 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





sekainohakaisha said:


> Hi all,
> I'm currently looking for earphones that are neutral to bright. So far, I've been using sennheiser ie8 and jvc fx500 for my listening sessions, and I suddenly wanted to listen to another one with a different characteristics. (despite having decent highs, fx500 is still bass heavy)
> Upon doing some research, I think that SE535 or W4 might give me what I want.
> My questions are:
> ...


 
   
   
  I would call either of those neutral-to-bright - the FX500 probably has the most treble quantity of the bunch. If you're serious about wanting to try a brighter signature with less bass, perhaps the Sony MDR-EX1000 would be the way to go. It'll have a large presentation like the IE8 but with a brighter, less warm signature and more accurate bass response. Of course you could try something neutral-to-bright and still very very good on a smaller budget - the RE272, for example, or Brainwavz B2 / Fischer DBA-02 mkII


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> So in this case I assume, W4 would be having slightly a tad more treble than the EPH-100 and EPH-100 would be having more bass quantity than the W4 but quality of bass would be more on W4.
> 
> Am I leaning towards the W4 now


 
   
  Conquer confusion the typical head-fi way - buy both FX700 and W4 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  PS: Otherwise, Joker's TF10 would be posted before you buy anything


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Conquer confusion the typical head-fi way - buy both FX700 and W4
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  LOL, now just waiting for your impressions on the EPH-100


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> LOL, now just waiting for your impressions on the EPH-100


 
  There is already a review made by Joker on the EPH-100


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> There is already a review made by Joker on the EPH-100


 

 I know I purchased EPH-100 after when joker reviewed it  On the basis of his review I made this purchase possible


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Conquer confusion the typical head-fi way - buy both FX700 and W4
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  And thus a new unit of time is defined.
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> There is already a review made by Joker on the EPH-100


 
   
  He means *esanthosh*'s review/impressions


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> He means *esanthosh*'s review/impressions


 
   
  Thanks for pointing that out


----------



## RedSky0

Hi ljokerl, any chance you were looking to do the TF10 review sometime soon? You seem to refer to it often and plenty of us have them, so having a review up there as a frame of reference would be helpful for those looking to upgrade, sidestep or simply how they fare in comparison to the rest of the range you have looked at.


----------



## H20Fidelity

^ Maybe he finds TF10 so absolutely amazing he's having trouble putting it into words. :rolleyes:


----------



## FlySweep

joker.. promise me you'll be posting the TF.10 review as a near-indecipherable cryptogram?  Just to absolutely _torment_ the TF.10 fanboys.
   

   
  Pretty please?


----------



## esanthosh

Sorry Flysweep! Get back in line 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
First he needs to make my job of choosing between MH334, FI-BA-SS & K3003 more difficult, then he is free to do whatever it is you want with the TF10 review!


----------



## Davidisawesome

Which IEM is better; the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 or the Klipsch s4?   
  I am looking to buy a pair of headphones under $100 and i'v narrowed my decision down to these two. Can someone tell which is better based on your personal experience or reviews you've seen online. I am also looking for more clarity in headphones without compromising the bass. Thanks a lot if you can help me out.

 Maybe you can recommend a better IEM for this price range.


----------



## scootsit

davidisawesome said:


> Which IEM is better; the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 or the Klipsch s4?
> 
> 
> I am looking to buy a pair of headphones under $100 and i'v narrowed my decision down to these two. Can someone tell which is better based on your personal experience or reviews you've seen online. I am also looking for more clarity in headphones without compromising the bass. Thanks a lot if you can help me out.
> ...






That's a price bracket with some great contenders, between the Vsonics, Sunrises, RE0 and REZERO

Edit: Wow, that sounded far meaner than I had intended, sorry!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





redsky0 said:


> Hi ljokerl, any chance you were looking to do the TF10 review sometime soon? You seem to refer to it often and plenty of us have them, so having a review up there as a frame of reference would be helpful for those looking to upgrade, sidestep or simply how they fare in comparison to the rest of the range you have looked at.


 
   
  The problem is that I'm always working on something else, not sitting here twiddling my thumbs. Currently the B&W P3, FAD Heaven S and C, and re-vising the RE262. The TF10 thing has become sort of a running joke but really I'd much rather put up reviews of newer gear than something that's got a 500 page impression thread. I did promise I'd work on it shortly after the FitEar review and I plan to stick to that.
   
  Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> ^ Maybe he finds TF10 so absolutely amazing he's having trouble putting it into words.


 
   
  Yeah... no 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> joker.. promise me you'll be posting the TF.10 review as a near-indecipherable cryptogram?  Just to absolutely _torment_ the TF.10 fanboys.


 
   
  Tempting...
   
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> First he needs to make my job of choosing between MH334, FI-BA-SS & K3003 more difficult, then he is free to do whatever it is you want with the TF10 review!


 
   
  This is true.
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Which IEM is better; the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 or the Klipsch s4?
> I am looking to buy a pair of headphones under $100 and i'v narrowed my decision down to these two. Can someone tell which is better based on your personal experience or reviews you've seen online. I am also looking for more clarity in headphones without compromising the bass. Thanks a lot if you can help me out.
> 
> Maybe you can recommend a better IEM for this price range.


 
   
  I found the DTX 101 to be better - it's got a warm, bassy sound but is smooth and not as unnatural as the v-shaped S4. For more recessed mids and harsh, prominent treble the S4 is better.


----------



## JPFrost

I'm looking for something to compliment my Yamaha EPH-100 set (which I love btw). Something that just has a different sound signature. Not especially bright or analytical, but just a bit brighter. I'm inrigued by the R-50 and perhaps the JVC FXD80. The ATH-CKM500 seem really interesting as well.
   
  Any thoughts or opinions?


----------



## Davidisawesome

I have looked at the RE0, but the TRSS adapter kind of put me off. And also the only place i can find them is on ebay where they could be fake


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The problem is that I'm always working on something else, not sitting here twiddling my thumbs. Currently the B&W P3, FAD Heaven S and C, and *re-vising the RE262*. The TF10 thing has become sort of a running joke but really I'd much rather put up reviews of newer gear than something that's got a 500 page impression thread. I did promise I'd work on it shortly after the FitEar review and I plan to stick to that.


 
  What do you plan to revise on the RE262 review?
  The newer inter-changeable cable?
  Does the SQ change?
  Also ,does the old version has a balanced cable or normal?


----------



## qilto

Hey, I've been looking to buy a new pair of IEMs and narrowed down my choices to the GR07 and RE-262. I already own a Etymotic HF5 and love the detail but want something that has a larger soundstage and maybe slightly more colored. Which of the two would compliment the Etys more?


----------



## FieldingMellish

Quote: 





qilto said:


> Hey, I've been looking to buy a new pair of IEMs and narrowed down my choices to the GR07 and RE-262. I already own a Etymotic HF5 and love the detail but want something that has a larger soundstage and maybe slightly more colored. Which of the two would compliment the Etys more?


 
   
   
  RE-262.


----------



## Davidisawesome

don't worry about it, i'm a complete noob when it comes to headphones


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jpfrost said:


> I'm looking for something to compliment my Yamaha EPH-100 set (which I love btw). Something that just has a different sound signature. Not especially bright or analytical, but just a bit brighter. I'm inrigued by the R-50 and perhaps the JVC FXD80. The ATH-CKM500 seem really interesting as well.
> 
> Any thoughts or opinions?


 
   
  Three earphones I've never heard. The GR07 is brighter than the EPH-100 and might be worth having as a compliment.
   
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> I have looked at the RE0, but the TRSS adapter kind of put me off. And also the only place i can find them is on ebay where they could be fake


 
   
  As far as I know the RE0 is still not sold in balanced configuration, only the RE-ZERO is. Head-direct.com is the official source for all things HiFiMan. They ship worldwide.
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> What do you plan to revise on the RE262 review?
> The newer inter-changeable cable?
> Does the SQ change?
> Also ,does the old version has a balanced cable or normal?


 
   
  The new one I have here is completely identical to the RE272 aside from the finish on the housings. The original one I had was very different - not balanced, no way to swap channels, and it has the stringy rubbery cable from the RE-ZERO. No SQ score change but the text needs revising.
   
  Quote: 





qilto said:


> Hey, I've been looking to buy a new pair of IEMs and narrowed down my choices to the GR07 and RE-262. I already own a Etymotic HF5 and love the detail but want something that has a larger soundstage and maybe slightly more colored. Which of the two would compliment the Etys more?


 
   
  The RE262 is more colored and will differ from the HF5 more. Both have a larger soundstage.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The new one I have here is completely identical to the RE272 aside from the finish on the housings. The original one I had was very different - not balanced, no way to swap channels, and it has the stringy rubbery cable from the RE-ZERO. No SQ score change but the text needs revising.


 
  Gotcha!
  I think the new model is a very very clever idea from HifiMan.
  This gives you the freedom to swap channels, use a balanced setup, or just plug it straight away to a normal 3.5mm jack.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Gotcha!
> I think the new model is a very very clever idea from HifiMan.
> This gives you the freedom to swap channels, use a balanced setup, or just plug it straight away to a normal 3.5mm jack.


 
   
  Agreed, I think I mentioned in the RE272 review that I'd never seen much merit in modular cables until HiFiMan used one for their TRRS configuration instead of the more cumbersome solution of the RE-ZERO.
   
  There is one downside with updating the RE262 and RE272 reviews - I can't find any mention of the 3-year warranty for the RE272 anymore


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There is one downside with updating the RE262 and RE272 reviews - I can't find any mention of the 3-year warranty for the RE272 anymore


 
  Yes


----------



## sofastreamer

hi joker, its me again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, i am in a dilemma: i am still searching for the most fatigue free iem. as for that i bought the silver bullet and the tandems. both are ok, while the tandems are still a little bit to aggressive. on the other hand the silver bullets are a little too dark to me. is there anything even smoother borderline boring up to 150 $? maybe M3? oh, and it should be a dynamic driver, as i need a little sub bass rumble.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> hi joker, its me again
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Have you looked at the Yamaha EPH-100? They sound pretty smooth to me, although not boring at all...


----------



## sofastreamer

yes, i owned them and they were much to aggressive sounding and there was a treble peak, that was piercing to me. although it seems, that i am the only one that feels so.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> yes, i owned them and they were much to aggressive sounding and there was a treble peak, that was piercing to me. although it seems, that i am the only one that feels so.


 
   
   
  Yes, indeed it seems you're the only one who felt that. I'm very sensible to treble harshness and sibilance, and I find the EPH-100 to be very smooth and enjoyable...


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> hi joker, its me again
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I would advise trying one of these EQ tutorials for smoothing out all the treble peaks with whatever phones you're using
   
  For the theory behind these EQ methods read this opening post
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/413900/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-a-tutorial
   
  But for a better way to achieve the desired results visit my ongoing updated guide
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress


----------



## sofastreamer

eq is no option because of using a lot of different sources.


----------



## Leo888

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The new one I have here is completely identical to the RE272 aside from the finish on the housings. The original one I had was very different - not balanced, no way to swap channels, and it has the stringy rubbery cable from the RE-ZERO. No SQ score change but the text needs revising.


 
  Hi joker, is this new RE262 with detachable cables on the housing or they comes with some extension cables to swap channels? Didn't see any of info on Hifiman's  website. Thanks.


----------



## psygeist

^^Not with the detachable cables from the housings.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> yes, i owned them and they were much to aggressive sounding and there was a* treble peak, that was piercing to me*. although it seems, that i am the only one that feels so.


 
   
  If you found the EPH piercing, the only IEM I could recommend is the ASG-1.2. You can maybe find them on the FS forum for <$200/210. Worth every penny.


----------



## sofastreamer

i do like treble a lot. my cans are k701 and srh940, which offer a lot of treble. but they are not piercing the way the yamaha did.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> i do like treble a lot. my cans are k701 and srh940, which offer a lot of treble. but they are not piercing the way the yamaha did.


 
   
  The treble quality of the ASG is great, but the quantity is probably nowhere near the quantity of your k701. Below is what I think is my most accurate description of them.
   
  Quote:


eke2k6 said:


> I think I've been selling my ASG-1 short.
> 
> I've been on an EQ fast for the last 24 hrs and, after months, I've just wrapped my head around its signature. It's a really sultry sounding phone. It's not one for clarity, but the details are all there. As always the bass runs circles around everything else I've heard, but the kicker is the midrange.
> 
> ...


----------



## Davidisawesome

does the beyerdynamic have good bass


----------



## OnlinePredator

What's the best IEM for my budget, which is AUD $50? (Willing to pay ~$5 more if it makes a BIG difference)
 I don't know anything about highs,mids,lows, treble, bass, v-shaped, "fun" sounding, or any of these audiophile terms.
  I listen to pretty much every genre, if that helps.


----------



## sofastreamer

so which version of the asg should i look for?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> so which version of the asg should i look for?


 
   
  ver 1.2
   
  Here's one: http://www.head-fi.org/t/615711/power-of-bass-aurisonics-asg-1-2-tf10-brainwavz-brokestone-dual-drive-worldwide-shipping


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, is this new RE262 with detachable cables on the housing or they comes with some extension cables to swap channels? Didn't see any of info on Hifiman's  website. Thanks.


 
  The detachable cables lies at the Y-Splitter, and comes with 3 cables. Balanced, Normal, Normal channels swapped.


----------



## sekainohakaisha

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would call either of those neutral-to-bright - the FX500 probably has the most treble quantity of the bunch. If you're serious about wanting to try a brighter signature with less bass, perhaps the Sony MDR-EX1000 would be the way to go. It'll have a large presentation like the IE8 but with a brighter, less warm signature and more accurate bass response. Of course you could try something neutral-to-bright and still very very good on a smaller budget - the RE272, for example, or Brainwavz B2 / Fischer DBA-02 mkII


 
   
  Quote: 





tinyman392 said:


> I'm going to be honest and say that I wouldn't call the W4 neutral to bright, rather, I'd call them balanced and warm.  However, I don't know what neutral to bright is to you (it all comes to degrees).


 
   
  Thanks for the replies guys, I am 80% decided to get the RE272. However, as these no longer have the 3 years warranty, I would like to know more on the durability of these pairs. 
  Perhaps they lifted the 3 years warranty because there's too much claims from consumers? Just a thought of mine...


----------



## proedros

go from 80% to 100% you won't be disappointed

 re-272 is a terrific iem , i have it since last september and i am in love with this little baby
   
  it has terrific highs without being edgy/sibilant and the rest of the spectrum is fine aka neutral
   
  i also have the eq5 but it don't get much listening time , poor old eq5
   
   
  Quote: 





sekainohakaisha said:


> Thanks for the replies guys, I am 80% decided to get the RE272. However, as these no longer have the 3 years warranty, I would like to know more on the durability of these pairs.
> Perhaps they lifted the 3 years warranty because there's too much claims from consumers? Just a thought of mine...


----------



## Leo888

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> ^^Not with the detachable cables from the housings.


 
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> The detachable cables lies at the Y-Splitter, and comes with 3 cables. Balanced, Normal, Normal channels swapped.


 
  Got it. Thanks guys for the info. Anyway. any thoughts on how the RE262 will response with the E7/E9 combo. Need something which isolate better at home while my family is around with their daily activities. I normally use my HD650 when they retire to bed and the M50 doesn't really isolate enough. Thanks in advance.


----------



## scootsit

I have a question, which dual flange tips do you guys recommend, or are they all pretty much the same? I think I really like dual flanges best, they seem to give me the best fit. I've so far found the Meelec Balanced Sound tips, the shorter bi-flanged tips/normal bi-flanges in the M11+ tip kit, JLabs JBuds Pro Tips, and a few others. The shorter tips like those from the Meelec M11+ and Sennheiser seem like they would be less effective. The JLabs look really nice. Do the "Balanced Sound" tips from Meelec really do anything in the way of taming bass and accentuating mids?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Failuyr

In Joker's review of the Monster Turbines, he said they would be a great pair of phones at the $100 mark. They can currently be had at $79 at Amazon. For someone who listens to Dubstep, Rock, Metal, Alternative mostly. Would the Monster Turbines be a good choice in the ~$75 range?
   
  Would there be a better pair of iems in this range?


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





sekainohakaisha said:


> Thanks for the replies guys, I am 80% decided to get the RE272. However, as these no longer have the 3 years warranty, I would like to know more on the durability of these pairs.
> Perhaps they lifted the 3 years warranty because there's too much claims from consumers? Just a thought of mine...


 
   
  You can look at Joker's Build Quality Rating for the RE272.
  From the looks of it, it's not badly built at all.
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Got it. Thanks guys for the info. Anyway. any thoughts on how the RE262 will response with the E7/E9 combo. Need something which isolate better at home while my family is around with their daily activities. I normally use my HD650 when they retire to bed and the M50 doesn't really isolate enough. Thanks in advance.


 
   
  IMO the E9 will actually be overkill.
  I don't know about the RE262, but sometimes I can't even use my Fiio E11 with my very sensitive IEM's.
  Even at the lowest volumes they're still too loud, and when I go even lower, the dreaded channel imbalance prevents me from hearing my music.


----------



## Leo888

Ok, thanks xinn3r for chipping in. Appreciate it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> hi joker, its me again
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> Have you looked at the Yamaha EPH-100? They sound pretty smooth to me, although not boring at all...


 
   
  Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> yes, i owned them and they were much to aggressive sounding and there was a treble peak, that was piercing to me. although it seems, that i am the only one that feels so.


 
   
  I think you are getting some strange in-ear resonances I'm not getting with both the Tandem and EPH-100 which is why they sound harsh to you vs the K701. I'm probably not the best person to ask for advice with that in mind but the HiFiMan RE262 could be an option. I would also play around with the fit on the Tandems, really hard to imagine them sounding aggressive.
   
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, is this new RE262 with detachable cables on the housing or they comes with some extension cables to swap channels? Didn't see any of info on Hifiman's  website. Thanks.


 
   
  The cable is modular, splits about half way down. The main part is about 2' long and has a TRRS balanced plug. Two of the three extension cables are single-ended/TRS.
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> does the beyerdynamic have good bass


 
   
  The DTX101 has plenty of bass.
   
   
  Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> What's the best IEM for my budget, which is AUD $50? (Willing to pay ~$5 more if it makes a BIG difference)
> I don't know anything about highs,mids,lows, treble, bass, v-shaped, "fun" sounding, or any of these audiophile terms.
> I listen to pretty much every genre, if that helps.


 
   
  VSonic GR02 Bass Edition if you like plentiful bass, Astrotec AM-90, Soundmagic E30, or Brainwavz M1 if you would prefer to try something a bit more balanced.
   
  Quote: 





sekainohakaisha said:


> Thanks for the replies guys, I am 80% decided to get the RE272. However, as these no longer have the 3 years warranty, I would like to know more on the durability of these pairs.
> Perhaps they lifted the 3 years warranty because there's too much claims from consumers? Just a thought of mine...


 
   
  I've had mine since fall 2011 as well. I really don't know why the 3-year warranty was removed but it was well above industry standard so I suppose HiFiMan had a right to can it. 
   
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Got it. Thanks guys for the info. Anyway. any thoughts on how the RE262 will response with the E7/E9 combo. Need something which isolate better at home while my family is around with their daily activities. I normally use my HD650 when they retire to bed and the M50 doesn't really isolate enough. Thanks in advance.


 
   
  The E7 by itself works pretty well with the RE262, better than my J3. 
   
  Quote: 





failuyr said:


> In Joker's review of the Monster Turbines, he said they would be a great pair of phones at the $100 mark. They can currently be had at $79 at Amazon. For someone who listens to Dubstep, Rock, Metal, Alternative mostly. Would the Monster Turbines be a good choice in the ~$75 range?
> 
> Would there be a better pair of iems in this range?


 
   
  That review is quite old but at $75 the Turbine is still a decent buy. Lots more competition now - you can get something just as good without waiting for a $100 discount on the Turbines - the Beyerdynamic DTX 101, for example, or Fischer Audio Consonance. You can even save a chunk of change by going with the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition instead.
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> IMO the E9 will actually be overkill.
> I don't know about the RE262, but sometimes I can't even use my Fiio E11 with my very sensitive IEM's.
> Even at the lowest volumes they're still too loud, and when I go even lower, the dreaded channel imbalance prevents me from hearing my music.


 
   
  The RE262 is one of the least sensitive earphones, I really wouldn't worry about about balance issues at listening volumes unless you like your music whisper-quiet.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The RE262 is one of the least sensitive earphones, I really wouldn't worry about about balance issues at listening volumes unless you like your music whisper-quiet.


 
  That's good to hear!
  Thank you!


----------



## AstralStorm

Yeah, for sensitive IEMs (including BA, which have special "drive" issues due to crossovers), I've checked that the following devices are reasonable:
   
  FiiO E6, FiiO E7, FiiO E17 (0 gain setting, that's 2x in reality. Ends up at about 40% of volume)
  O2 amp in low gain setting (2x gain, local custom build; also ~40% volume)
  Audiotrak Prodigy Cube (2.5x gain? ~30% volume.)
   
  In other words, you do need something that can source enough current and has a decent potentiometer. (Real imbalance issues happen below 15% usually.)
   
  Not recommended due to overly high noise floor or channel imbalance issues:
  FiiO E3, FiiO E9 (with either E7 or E17; possibly directly too, but I haven't tried that)
  Nuforce Icon (desktop one)
   
  I haven't tested others - I do not own a shop you know and most friends don't carry an amp with them at all. It's not often required with dynamic driver IEMs or headphones.
  The other interesting stuff (like Nuforces) I've auditioned in shops for a short time - the trick is either it's audibly wrong out of the box or not at all.
   
  Oh, and I've tested with RE272 as well. (GR07 is a bit less sensitive, SE-5 and SA6 are even more sensitve. Beyerdynamic DT1350 is about as sensitive as GR07.)
  In fact, RE262 should be far less sensitive than all the rest of the gear I actually own - it's kind of a special case in IEM world, where various portable devices might not sport enough volume. This includes weakest amps. (I wouldn't recommend FiiO E6 for them, will be too quiet.)


----------



## sofastreamer

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think you are getting some strange in-ear resonances I'm not getting with both the Tandem and EPH-100 which is why they sound harsh to you vs the K701. I'm probably not the best person to ask for advice with that in mind but the HiFiMan RE262 could be an option. I would also play around with the fit on the Tandems, really hard to imagine them sounding aggressive.
> 
> 
> The RE262 is one of the least sensitive earphones, I really wouldn't worry about about balance issues at listening volumes unless you like your music whisper-quiet.


 
  re262 sounds interesting. will it be able to cause some decent sub bass rumble?


----------



## putente

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> re262 sounds interesting. will it be able to cause some decent sub bass rumble?


 
   
   
  The RE262 are famous for their excellent mid-range! I don't think they have much sub bass performance as a basshead IEM...


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Yeah, for sensitive IEMs (including BA, which have special "drive" issues due to crossovers), I've checked that the following devices are reasonable:
> 
> FiiO E6, FiiO E7, FiiO E17 (0 gain setting, that's 2x in reality. Ends up at about 40% of volume)
> O2 amp in low gain setting (2x gain, local custom build; also ~40% volume)
> ...


 
  AFAIK the E17 doesn't sport any channel imbalance at any volume level because of the digital volume adjustment.


----------



## OnlinePredator

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks.


----------



## nyonya

For the SM3, how much of a difference is there between the stock biflanges and the Sensorcom biflanges?  The stock are a bit too tight in my ears, if the Sensorcoms were slightly narrower or softer they'd probably fit better, just wondering how they compare.  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sofastreamer said:


> re262 sounds interesting. will it be able to cause some decent sub bass rumble?


 
   
  Not as much as EPH-100 or even the Tandem. Bass extension is decent with a good source but it's not a bass-heavy earphone.
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> For the SM3, how much of a difference is there between the stock biflanges and the Sensorcom biflanges?  The stock are a bit too tight in my ears, if the Sensorcoms were slightly narrower or softer they'd probably fit better, just wondering how they compare.  Thanks!


 
   
  IIRC the sensorcom tips have longer stems but are approximately the same diameter, though you might want to confirm with someone who owns an SM3 (e.g. by asking in the SM3 thread)


----------



## Cotnijoe

Hey guys! I'm looking to go for a custom IEM, haven't quite decided on price range yet, certainly not some 300 dollar IEM and probably not something over 1000 either. But I've had a lot of interest in Unique Melody but from the looks of it the Merlins may be too bass heavy for me, while something like the mage may not be sufficient. Can anyone familiar with UM give me a hint at what may be a good model for me? Or any other brand with a reasonable price would be appreciated. Thanks =)


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





cotnijoe said:


> Hey guys! I'm looking to go for a custom IEM, haven't quite decided on price range yet, certainly not some 300 dollar IEM and probably not something over 1000 either. But I've had a lot of interest in Unique Melody but from the looks of it the Merlins may be too bass heavy for me, while something like the mage may not be sufficient. Can anyone familiar with UM give me a hint at what may be a good model for me? Or any other brand with a reasonable price would be appreciated. Thanks =)


 

 As awesome as this thread is, this one here :-
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/541494/multi-custom-iem-review-resource-mfg-list-discussion-21-reviews-heir-audio-8-a-added-7-08-12
   
  Could be more helpful to you.
   
  Cheers


----------



## putente

*|joker|*, allow me to make a correction to the nozzle size of the YAMAHA EPH-100's, where you have it as 5.5mm it's in fact 6.5mm. I just measured mine with a caliper. I found this as I'm looking for foam tips that will fit them...


----------



## sofastreamer

ljokerl said:


> Not as much as EPH-100 or even the Tandem. Bass extension is decent with a good source but it's not a bass-heavy earphone.




what a pitty. tandems sub bass is minimum requirement


----------



## la1n

Hi all.
  
 I'm looking at replacing my recently broken Meelectronics CC51P.. I've been recommended the A161P but the cost is a little too steep for me (and i'm not sure i would like them).
  
 I mainly listen to electronic dance music. I remember i was a little dissapointed by the sound from the CC51P but i can't recall what it was.
  
 I prefer a detailed treble (is that right?) and overall clarity. I have a tendency to be really sensitive to bass heavy headphones/iem's.
 I do enjoy the rumble from sub bass but i hate hearing the bass being overpowering.
 I use a pair of Sennheiser 25-1 ii when mixing (and music listening at home) and i really enjoy the sound of those. I have another pair of Sennheiser (i believe it's pc360) that i mainly use for gaming. They are open and iirc uses the same drivers as the 555. I prefer these only for gaming and not for music listening.
  
 Could you recommend something for me? Something around $100 and preferably available in the EU, as importing from the us/rest of the world would add taxes and such.
  
  It also needs to have a mic for use with an iphone.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## sekainohakaisha

Quote: 





proedros said:


> go from 80% to 100% you won't be disappointed
> 
> re-272 is a terrific iem , i have it since last september and i am in love with this little baby
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> You can look at Joker's Build Quality Rating for the RE272.
> From the looks of it, it's not badly built at all.


 
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> I've had mine since fall 2011 as well. I really don't know why the 3-year warranty was removed but it was well above industry standard so I suppose HiFiMan had a right to can it.


 
   
  Thanks guys, I've pulled the trigger on these yesterday. However, I'm starting to get worried. I checked my order status and it says 'Payment received. Waiting for shipping' since yesterday.
  It was also weird, they didn't ask me to give shipping address anywhere when I checked out (as far as I remembered). Regarding this I've also emailed the shipping department, and ask them that it would be the same as my paypal billing address, and still no reply whatsoever.. Does this seem normal?


----------



## ljokerl

cotnijoe said:


> Hey guys! I'm looking to go for a custom IEM, haven't quite decided on price range yet, certainly not some 300 dollar IEM and probably not something over 1000 either. But I've had a lot of interest in Unique Melody but from the looks of it the Merlins may be too bass heavy for me, while something like the mage may not be sufficient. Can anyone familiar with UM give me a hint at what may be a good model for me? Or any other brand with a reasonable price would be appreciated. Thanks =)


 
  
 The 1964-T and Alclair Reference are two customs I've heard in that price range with less bass than the Merlins. The Reference is really quite impressive for $500 but you should definitely ask average_joe for more recommendations - he's heard far more customs than I have. 
  
  


putente said:


> *|joker|*, allow me to make a correction to the nozzle size of the YAMAHA EPH-100's, where you have it as 5.5mm it's in fact 6.5mm. I just measured mine with a caliper. I found this as I'm looking for foam tips that will fit them...


 
  
 Thanks, it should have been 6. While I know that I'm off on the sizes, for consistency's sake I've chosen to keep using the same ruler I've been using from the start to take measurements. They are really quite approximate and meant for comparing/contrasting two earphones.
   
 Quote:


la1n said:


> Hi all.
> 
> I'm looking at replacing my recently broken Meelectronics CC51P.. I've been recommended the A161P but the cost is a little too steep for me (and i'm not sure i would like them).
> 
> ...


 
  
 Considering you're not in the US, there's not much I'm aware of that will best the CC51P for similar money while having a mic and bass that isn't bloated. I know others have been offered a loyalty discount on MEE gear before - maybe you can inquire about that if you want an A161P. The HD25 is pretty bassy compared to the A161P, more along the lines of a Spider Realvoice. Not sure about availability outside the US but the Realvioce is ~$90 here.


----------



## sekainohakaisha

Quote: 





sekainohakaisha said:


> Thanks guys, I've pulled the trigger on these yesterday. However, I'm starting to get worried. I checked my order status and it says 'Payment received. Waiting for shipping' since yesterday.
> It was also weird, they didn't ask me to give shipping address anywhere when I checked out (as far as I remembered). Regarding this I've also emailed the shipping department, and ask them that it would be the same as my paypal billing address, and still no reply whatsoever.. Does this seem normal?


 
  Never mind this thing guys, I've got my reply. It will be shipped today, and I can't wait to try something new in terms of character.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





la1n said:


> Hi all.
> 
> I'm looking at replacing my recently broken Meelectronics CC51P.. I've been recommended the A161P but the cost is a little too steep for me (and i'm not sure i would like them).
> 
> ...


 
  You can use code  BUY_AGAIN_20  on the meelec site to get 20% off, so the A161P will be $79.99 instead of $99.99 and you may choose the gift option, so they don't print the price on the package and send it as a gift to avoid the additional taxes


----------



## Nickarus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The nozzle of the CC51 might be 6.1mm - I would just round it off to 6 anyway. The takeaway message is that the CC51 nozzle is slightly fatter than that of the EPH-100, which is confirmed by CC51 tips being a bit loose on the Yamahas.


 
   
   
  Quote:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  putente and joker, thanks again so much for the followups!  Very much appreciated!
   
  My non-scientific "insert random object in ear" testing has revealed my threshold for pain lies about a diameter of approximately 8.5mm for relatively shallow insertion. 
   
  I realize however that nozzle diameter, regardless of accuracy/methodology, actually isn't helpful in addressing pain concerns - the statistic of interest from this perspective would be the diameter of the compressed tip installed around the nozzle - something that would be impractical at best to establish with a ruler.  Case in point:  My time trying to make the CC51's work for me revealed that while even the smallest stock tip proved unbearably painful over time, inserted "tip-less" the drivers would simply fall out without any pressure on the canal - the thickness of these tips can make all the difference.  In retrospect it may have been fruitful to seek out tips of thinner material or to modify the stock tips somehow in that regard, but I had motivation to gift that set to a friend.
   
  To the EPH-100's, I gather these are best stated "in the same ballpark" as the cc51's, but the nozzles are at least somewhat smaller from joker's tip looseness observation.  I have learned from my self-testing that a single mm can make all the difference however so I remain hopeful these IEM's may yet fit me well.  Putente, would you be able to venture the approximate diameter of the compressed flange installed around the nozzle/driver with your calipers?  If you mean the sort of pointy calipers that might damage the tips please don't risk it though =)!
   
  Thanks again to everyone!


----------



## olear

joker, which full and portable phones are of similar sound signature and SQ as EX1000?  More mid forward is better than less. Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, which full and portable phones are of similar sound signature and SQ as EX1000?  More mid forward is better than less. Thanks.


 
   
  Nothing portable I can think of for both signature and quality of EX1000. My experience with full-size cans is limited to a few dozen. The Beyer DT880/250 comes to mind, maybe the K701 and (from a brief audition) the HD800.


----------



## olamo

Hi guys,
   
  I am looking for a new pair of IEMs since my Sennheiser CX 400 II's plug is broken.
   
  I use my N9 phone as a source. I listen to various talk based podcasts, and all kind of music, though mostly rock.
   
  Things I'd want from my future IEMs:
   
  -good build quality, since I hold my phone in my front pocket the plug might get a bit twisted (that broke my current IEMs)
  -I plan to use these whilst exercising so they might be exposed to sweat
  -I'd like the cost to be under 100€ since they do get abused
   
  After reading reviews I'm on the verge of buying a pair of VSonic GR06.
   
  Do you think this is a good choice for me?


----------



## suman134

100 euros !! go for something better bro , get the yamaha eph-100 , or jvc ha-fxt-90 . i wonder if you can get a xba-3 for that price , cuz its 110 euros here .


----------



## olear

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Nothing portable I can think of for both signature and quality of EX1000. My experience with full-size cans is limited to a few dozen. The Beyer DT880/250 comes to mind, maybe the K701 and (from a brief audition) the HD800.


 
  Thank you for that. I will check into those phones.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





olamo said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I am looking for a new pair of IEMs since my Sennheiser CX 400 II's plug is broken.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Most non-sport IEMs aren't designed for such rough use so it's hard to say how they will perform in the long run. You want something with an L-plug so that the cable doesn't get destroyed. The GR06 does fit that description. There are a couple of other very sturdy IEMs out there in that price range  - the Beyer DTX 101, for example, or the Dunu sets (Trident, Hephaes, Hawkeye).


----------



## Zelda

the Hawkeye are too heavy for exercise. a earglide might help


----------



## Nickarus

Quote: 





nickarus said:


> putente and joker, thanks again so much for the followups!  Very much appreciated!
> 
> My non-scientific "insert random object in ear" testing has revealed my threshold for pain lies about a diameter of approximately 8.5mm for relatively shallow insertion.
> 
> ...


 

 I have what I hope is a helpful update for anyone else concerned with EPH100 diameter pains...
   
  A friend lent me his CC51's to subject to further measurements (using a calibrated ruler app on my phone) and I've eyeballed the following results:
  1. Bare nozzle, without tips = 6.5mm
  2. Smallest tip, uncompressed = 11mm at the widest
  3. Smallest tip, compressed* = 9.1mm  <-- taken by pulling the flange tight at the base, which resulted in a flat profile viewed against the ruler.
   
  These results marry with my "pain threshold" object-insertion measurements, and inform the CC51's passed my pain threshold (~8.5mm) by only ~0.6mm.  Small numbers matter!
   
  EDIT:
By all accounts, if the CC51 stock tips (which install fairly snugly) are "noticeably loose" on the EPH100's, I'll extrapolate their nozzle is at least a half millimeter narrower.  That would place the EPH100's (assuming equivalently compressible tips) just at my threshold.  I reckon that means they'll either be comfortable to start, or close enough that I should be able to adapt over time =).
   
  After reaching out to Putente for some extra measurements, we've learned nozzles of the EPH-100's are 6.5mm as well using a caliper, so the CC51 nozzles are measured to be identical from one source, though joker's previous tip observation would suggest the EPH nozzles are slightly smaller.  Putente also measured the smallest stock flange of the PH-100's to be 10 mm installed and uncompressed, and approximately 8mm compressed with calipers. Hopefully that serves as useful info for anyone else shopping with small canals in mind =)!
   
  Thanks again to everyone for helping to nail this down!


----------



## draven5494

Well, I was excited when I received my pair of re272s today. That excitement was short-lived however. The left channel is completely dead, no sound at all.

I would exchange the re272s but this is my second hifiman product that was defective out of the box. I suppose I'm just lucky like that but I don't think I will chance it again. 

Oh well, maybe it's for the better. I was looking for something to compliment my dba02s and now have my eyes on the eph100s.

*edit* - I wasn't using the right adapter. I retract my statement about the build quality.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





draven5494 said:


> Well, I was excited when I received my pair of re272s today. That excitement was short-lived however. The left channel is completely dead, no sound at all.
> I would exchange the re272s but this is my second hifiman product that was defective out of the box. I suppose I'm just lucky like that but I don't think I will chance it again.
> Oh well, maybe it's for the better. I was looking for something to compliment my dba02s and now have my eyes on the eph100s.


 
   
  Be sure to check the cable you're using.
  If you're using the balanced cable it will mean that there will only be sound from one channel.


----------



## RedSky0

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The problem is that I'm always working on something else, not sitting here twiddling my thumbs. Currently the B&W P3, FAD Heaven S and C, and re-vising the RE262. The TF10 thing has become sort of a running joke but really I'd much rather put up reviews of newer gear than something that's got a 500 page impression thread. I did promise I'd work on it shortly after the FitEar review and I plan to stick to that.


 
   
  That's cool, having not read through the thread comments, I thought I was the lone voice in the wilderness. Seems there's quite a story behind this ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Be sure to check the cable you're using.
> If you're using the balanced cable it will mean that there will only be sound from one channel.


 
   
  +1. I've actually had that scare with my RE-ZERO the one time when I didn't notice that the single-ended adapter had somehow become detached.
   
  Quote: 





redsky0 said:


> That's cool, having not read through the thread comments, I thought I was the lone voice in the wilderness. Seems there's quite a story behind this ...


 
   
  No worries, someone asks every few dozen pages.


----------



## FlySweep

I'm very much looking forward to your Heaven S review, joker.. I've been very curious about that phone for a long time.


----------



## alex d

Hi, I'm looking for a new pair of iems for £100 or less. I will need to be able to use them on the go, and I will use them on the bus, so good isolation is important. I'm looking at the brainwavz b2, hifiman re262 and rockit sounds r 50 at the minute. I was wondering if you could give me your opinion on the r 50, or suggest any other iems from this price range that i could consider.


----------



## suman134

hey , joker , you seem in bad mood about the trple fi 10 , but i will say , you can ditch the old ones which are not available in the market .
  im not saying about tf10 .
  by the way , i wonder if some one can help me with some awesome offline stores in uk , thinking of a tour after the olympics .


----------



## draven5494

xinn3r said:


> Be sure to check the cable you're using.
> If you're using the balanced cable it will mean that there will only be sound from one channel.




I'm just using the headphones with no adapter attached. That should work right?

*edit* - nevermind, I'm an idiot. I figured it out. Thanks for the help guys.


----------



## nyonya

Hi ljokerl,
   
  How would you describe the sound of the GR07 as compared to the SM3?  I just got the SM3 and have been really enjoying them - I think I prefer it to the UM3X because the Westones, to me, had a too forward midrange and too much bass.  I think I would actually want a bit less bass than the SM3, ideally.  On the other hand, the highs seem basically perfect to me - I guess I'm really sensitive to treble fatigue.
   
  Would the GR07 have similar highs to the SM3, or is it significantly more fatiguing?  And how does their bass compare?  Also, are they similar in isolation (the SM3 is probably the lowest I'd want to go in terms of isolation)?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## RapidPulse

Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> How would you describe the sound of the GR07 as compared to the SM3?


 
  I am not joker (not even close 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





) but the GR07 is more fatiguing to me than the SM3.  Like you, I find the highs on the SM3 to be great for longer term listening. That said, still like to rock out with the more substantial treble of the GR07 quite often.
   
  I love the bass on the GR07.  It hits a little lower than the SM3, which I like. SM3 can feel bassier on songs that have more mid-bass.
   
  I think the isolation is pretty tip dependent.  For me, the SM3 isolates better, but I am using double-flange Atrio tips rather than the single flange Vsonic tips I use on the GR07.


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





rapidpulse said:


> I am not joker (not even close
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks for your response!  Can you compare the treble of the GR07 to any other earphones (I've heard the UM3X, HF5 and FXT90).  Thanks!


----------



## ninjames

Hey Joker, I got a couple review samples from Red Giant and am posting a review soon. I'd love to shoot 'em off your way with some unused tips and see what you think of them for this thread, too.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> I'm very much looking forward to your Heaven S review, joker.. I've been very curious about that phone for a long time.


 
   
  It's certainly an interesting one - hoping it's one of the next reviews I can finish up.
   
   
  Quote: 





alex d said:


> Hi, I'm looking for a new pair of iems for £100 or less. I will need to be able to use them on the go, and I will use them on the bus, so good isolation is important. I'm looking at the brainwavz b2, hifiman re262 and rockit sounds r 50 at the minute. I was wondering if you could give me your opinion on the r 50, or suggest any other iems from this price range that i could consider.


 
   
  I haven't heard the R-50 yet. The B2 and RE262 are solid options. So is the Yamaha EPH-100 or Etymotic HF5, both of which isolate better than the HiFiMan. Really depends on what kind of sound you're looking for.
   
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> hey , joker , you seem in bad mood about the trple fi 10 , but i will say , you can ditch the old ones which are not available in the market .
> im not saying about tf10 .
> by the way , i wonder if some one can help me with some awesome offline stores in uk , thinking of a tour after the olympics .


 
   
  Those reviews are finished, I just never bothered posting them since I wanted to put them up together with the TF10.
   
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> How would you describe the sound of the GR07 as compared to the SM3?  I just got the SM3 and have been really enjoying them - I think I prefer it to the UM3X because the Westones, to me, had a too forward midrange and too much bass.  I think I would actually want a bit less bass than the SM3, ideally.  On the other hand, the highs seem basically perfect to me - I guess I'm really sensitive to treble fatigue.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Agree with RapidPulse, I don't think you will like the GR07 - it's more fatiguing than the SM3 and the isolation is a little lower on average. 
   
   
  Quote: 





ninjames said:


> Hey Joker, I got a couple review samples from Red Giant and am posting a review soon. I'd love to shoot 'em off your way with some unused tips and see what you think of them for this thread, too.


 
   
  I've actually been contacted about the Red Giant stuff in the past and I've had to turn it down for the time being. Really don't want to add to the queue since I can't seem to get through it.


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

Hey Joker could you or did you do a review on the AudioTechnica ATH-CKS77?  Thanks!  I just purchased the vPulse because I'm looking for a sub for some speakers and I stumble on the vPulse.  I just purchased it and now the ATH-CKS77 to see which one I'd like more.  But I was wondering if you did a review on the ATH-CKS77.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## gadiletta

Hello, I'm looking for an advice.
  I prefer music like John Legend, Coldplay, David Guetta, Jamiroquai. So I look into good bass (and I want my ears are isolated from the rest) but at the same time with good medium and high, before I had sennheiser cx 300 II, but some experts told me that GR02 vsonic is much better than sennheiser I used and that are perfect for my requirments. What about your opinion?
  I was considering some inears available in europe (vsonic are from singapore it will take long time) so with a fast shipment and with the same price of vsonic 30 euro more or less, any advice?
  I listen music with iphone 4.
  Thank you.


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Agree with RapidPulse, I don't think you will like the GR07 - it's more fatiguing than the SM3 and the isolation is a little lower on average.


 
   
  Thanks for the response!  Are there any other earphones you'd suggest for me to listen to, given my preferences?


----------



## compoopers

Hey, sorry to be a bother if other people already asked this/you already answered it --

Out of pure curiosity are you planning on reviewing the JVC FXD80 and/or the Audio Technica CKM500s? They're both relatively new and similarly priced IEMs and people are going bonkers about how they "sound way above their price range" (about $80 each). I have the CKM500s myself, but very little experience with IEMs, so I don't know if the claims are true, and I would love to see how your review compares them against the hundreds of other IEMs you've reviewed!


----------



## PanicoNFL

Hi Joker,

 I bought a GR06 based on your reviews and it's awesome, and I discovered that I like bright sound / forward mids 
 What upgrade do you recommend for an "In-your-face" sound, with up-front vocals ?
 Do you think the Brainwavz B2 can sound "forwarded" at the vocals while show a lot of details ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> Hey Joker could you or did you do a review on the AudioTechnica ATH-CKS77?  Thanks!  I just purchased the vPulse because I'm looking for a sub for some speakers and I stumble on the vPulse.  I just purchased it and now the ATH-CKS77 to see which one I'd like more.  But I was wondering if you did a review on the ATH-CKS77.
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  I have not heard the CKS77. 
   
   
  Quote: 





gadiletta said:


> Hello, I'm looking for an advice.
> I prefer music like John Legend, Coldplay, David Guetta, Jamiroquai. So I look into good bass (and I want my ears are isolated from the rest) but at the same time with good medium and high, before I had sennheiser cx 300 II, but some experts told me that GR02 vsonic is much better than sennheiser I used and that are perfect for my requirments. What about your opinion?
> I was considering some inears available in europe (vsonic are from singapore it will take long time) so with a fast shipment and with the same price of vsonic 30 euro more or less, any advice?
> I listen music with iphone 4.
> Thank you.


 
   
  Sure, the GR02 Bass Edition would be an upgrade over the the CX300 (haven't heard the CX300-II).
   
  Not sure what's available locally in Europe. Frogbeats in the UK carries some eastern brands - Dunu and Fischer, for example. In your price range the Dunu Trident is nice. So are the Soundmagic E10 and Philips SHE3580.
   
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Thanks for the response!  Are there any other earphones you'd suggest for me to listen to, given my preferences?


 
   
  Less bass than the SM3 and smooth treble? Westone 4, Shure SE535, HiFiMan RE262 all fit IMO.
   
  Quote: 





compoopers said:


> Hey, sorry to be a bother if other people already asked this/you already answered it --
> Out of pure curiosity are you planning on reviewing the JVC FXD80 and/or the Audio Technica CKM500s? They're both relatively new and similarly priced IEMs and people are going bonkers about how they "sound way above their price range" (about $80 each). I have the CKM500s myself, but very little experience with IEMs, so I don't know if the claims are true, and I would love to see how your review compares them against the hundreds of other IEMs you've reviewed!


 
   
  I might get a go at the CKM500 in the future. No plans for the FXD80 at this time. 
   
  Quote: 





paniconfl said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I bought a GR06 based on your reviews and it's awesome, and I discovered that I like bright sound / forward mids
> What upgrade do you recommend for an "In-your-face" sound, with up-front vocals ?
> Do you think the Brainwavz B2 can sound "forwarded" at the vocals while show a lot of details ?


 
   
  The B2 is pretty aggressive and very detailed but it might be a bit on the bright side compared to the GR06. The JVC FXT90 comes to mind as a warmer option with plentiful bass and forward mids/treble.


----------



## Zelda

hi, which one(s) would be a good upgrade over the SHE3680 , keeping the comfort factor ? thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> hi, which one(s) would be a good upgrade over the SHE3680 , keeping the comfort factor ? thanks!


 
   
  I've only heard the SHE3580, sorry


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've only heard the SHE3580, sorry


 
  from what i know they should be the same. its just the 3680 is what i have


----------



## ljokerl

Added two legacy reviews - UE Super.Fi 5 Pro and Super.Fi 5 EB. Figured there's no point in holding on to these. 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2A27) Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5 Pro*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote:


zelda said:


> from what i know they should be the same. its just the 3680 is what i have


   
  In that case, it really depends on what you'd like improved and what you're willing to spend. The JVC FX700 is a logical top-tier to pick if you like the Philips.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Does the DTX 101 have good isolation because i will be using them when running and in public places


----------



## Davidisawesome

I'v got a pair of the TDK MCR-300. I've had a few TDK headphones before and i have to say there not too good. But for 30 bucks these are great value.


----------



## putente

*ljokerl*, any news on the RE262 update?


----------



## alex d

Hi, thanks for getting back to me so quickly on my first question. To expand on that point - I use etymotic er4p's when mixing tracks on the go, and I love them, but their sound signature is just too analytical for casual listening. I have already used the brainwavz b2's and hifiman re262's and liked both, but I felt that the brainwavz would not be durable enough for daily use, and although i did like the sound of the 262's, it didn't really suit the music I listen to. Therefore I am looking for a pair of iems for £100 or less which will give similar clarity to these headphones, but with a more "market friendly" sound signature. I have looked at the vsonic gr07's and gr01's, and they both look fairly promising, as do the rockit sounds r 50's. Also, if there is any particularly good mp3 players out there, I am looking for a new one for £200 or less to replace my sansa fuze, which i think needs upgrading.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added two legacy reviews - UE Super.Fi 5 Pro and Super.Fi 5 EB. Figured there's no point in holding on to these.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  the jvc are out of my range, and the half-ear design doesnt work for me. the philips fit me perfectly great (small and a bit ergonomic), and with sony hybrids and isolation is pretty decent
  i'd like to keep the fun factor with more clarity , less muddy or muffled  sound. if uper vocals are less reccesed is a plus but not a must
  preferably under $100, but can get up to $150


----------



## kamcok

great reviews man !
 keep going
 i can't wait for you to review the ue700, i wanna compare what i have with other IEMs and decide if i should upgrade or not


----------



## xtasi

Although it's been awhile since I've bought earphones, I still check this page daily for updates.  It's nice to see that my GR06 are still the value-kings.  I'm extremely happy with them, they sound great and are built like a tank.  The wire in particular is awesome.  It is nice and thick and soft.  I also have to say that these babies have been through 2 washing machines (oops!) and still work without a hitch.
   
  Thanks for the time and effort you put in this.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





zelda said:


> the jvc are out of my range, and the half-ear design doesnt work for me. the philips fit me perfectly great (small and a bit ergonomic), and with sony hybrids and isolation is pretty decent
> i'd like to keep the fun factor with more clarity , less muddy or muffled  sound. if uper vocals are less reccesed is a plus but not a must
> preferably under $100, but can get up to $150


 
   
  You might want to try the 3580 as well.  They are not the same as the 3680 in my listening.
   




 Red: SHE3580, Black: SHE3680.  The 3580 has a high mids peak near 3000Hz that the 3680 doesn't have.  That may or may not be what you're looking for, depending on what your definition of 'upper vocals' is.


----------



## Zelda

intersting! looks like less midbass and more up-mid? is that w/o EQing?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Does the DTX 101 have good isolation because i will be using them when running and in public places


 
   
  There are scores for isolation, etc. given to each earphone on the front page of this thread. The DTX101iE isolates quite well.
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> *ljokerl*, any news on the RE262 update?


 
   
  I updated the scores but haven't updated the text yet. RE262 is quite high up the list now. 
   
  Quote: 





alex d said:


> Hi, thanks for getting back to me so quickly on my first question. To expand on that point - I use etymotic er4p's when mixing tracks on the go, and I love them, but their sound signature is just too analytical for casual listening. I have already used the brainwavz b2's and hifiman re262's and liked both, but I felt that the brainwavz would not be durable enough for daily use, and although i did like the sound of the 262's, it didn't really suit the music I listen to. Therefore I am looking for a pair of iems for £100 or less which will give similar clarity to these headphones, but with a more "market friendly" sound signature. I have looked at the vsonic gr07's and gr01's, and they both look fairly promising, as do the rockit sounds r 50's. Also, if there is any particularly good mp3 players out there, I am looking for a new one for £200 or less to replace my sansa fuze, which i think needs upgrading.


 
   
  The GR07 only isolates about as much as an RE262 but it seems like a good match for what you want - a less analytical, yet accurate sound. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> the jvc are out of my range, and the half-ear design doesnt work for me. the philips fit me perfectly great (small and a bit ergonomic), and with sony hybrids and isolation is pretty decent
> i'd like to keep the fun factor with more clarity , less muddy or muffled  sound. if uper vocals are less reccesed is a plus but not a must
> preferably under $100, but can get up to $150


 
   
  I'm not aware of anything that fits those requirements and is as small as the Philips - the JVC FXT90, Yamaha EPH-100, etc. are all arguably less ergonomic in this way or that.
   
  Quote: 





kamcok said:


> great reviews man !
> keep going
> i can't wait for you to review the ue700, i wanna compare what i have with other IEMs and decide if i should upgrade or not


 
   
  Thanks! The UE700 will rank near the other lower-end TWFK-based earphones, most likely right between the Phiaton PS200 and JAYS q-JAYS.
   
  Quote: 





xtasi said:


> Although it's been awhile since I've bought earphones, I still check this page daily for updates.  It's nice to see that my GR06 are still the value-kings.  I'm extremely happy with them, they sound great and are built like a tank.  The wire in particular is awesome.  It is nice and thick and soft.  I also have to say that these babies have been through 2 washing machines (oops!) and still work without a hitch.
> 
> Thanks for the time and effort you put in this.


 
   
  Thanks! With some of the softer MEElec earguides my GR06 (and GR07) are some of my favorite casual listening phones for when comfort is a priority.


----------



## sekainohakaisha

Thanks joker for directing me to RE272s. These are now my new favourites! Definitely keepers for me!


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Zelda* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  That graph is derived from my EQ to make both of these phones conform to my reference frequency response, by testing with sine tones by ear, as detailed here (or will be, when enough interest shows up for me to finish writing the guide)
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress
   
  I then invert the graphs to show their deviation from my reference frequency response, so yes, as far as I can tell these would be the differences between the phones with no EQ applied.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I updated the scores but haven't updated the text yet. RE262 is quite high up the list now.


 
   
   
  Thanks, just seen the score! Now waiting patiently for the text update...


----------



## szjwt63v

hi joker.
 you are checked speaker polarity before review?.
 i'm still see issue out of phase(wrong speaker polarity) problem in some non major brand earphone.
 Stereo Polarity (Phase) Sound Test http://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php


----------



## goodvibes

LOL. Old UEs. Nice to have the perspective. You know, I actually preferred the old sf3 to the sf5s back in the day just because it did the mids better and just convinced me more even though they more limited.


----------



## nicholars

I have been reading this roundup of all headphones - Excellent work BTW amazing resource for choosing some new headphones....
   
  I have a question which is not really mentioned in the roundup... Maybe you could answer this -
   
  Which headphones in the £100-£200 bracket have the absolute best bass - I would like a lot of quantity but also excellent quality bass, textured etc. with good sub bass....
   
  The other requirements are non-bright treble with minimal sibilance and also good soundstage....
   
  Please tell me which are the best options - So far the two which seem good would be the GR07 and the Sennheiser IE80 although the IE80 are a tad expensive. Currently I own the Shure SE215 and I am looking for an upgrade.


----------



## JPFrost

I have a question for all Cowon J3 users -- how well does the EQ work on IEM's?
   
  Obviously, I have used the EQ myself, but never with more analytical sounding earphones. So I'm wondering if turning up the bass for example on a thin base sounding IEM will sound natural or will it sound somewhat artificial?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sekainohakaisha said:


> Thanks joker for directing me to RE272s. These are now my new favourites! Definitely keepers for me!


 
  Good to hear 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





szjwt63v said:


> hi joker.
> you are checked speaker polarity before review?.
> i'm still see issue out of phase(wrong speaker polarity) problem in some non major brand earphone.
> Stereo Polarity (Phase) Sound Test http://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php


 
   
  Good illustrations. In my experience it's pretty noticeable form the soundstage presentation.
  
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> LOL. Old UEs. Nice to have the perspective. You know, I actually preferred the old sf3 to the sf5s back in the day just because it did the mids better and just convinced me more even though they more limited.


 
   
  The SF5Pro's signature doesn't really sit well with me... a mild v-shape doesn't work too well without good treble extension IMO. The SF5EB works better just because it makes no pretensions to accuracy. The SF3 did have very nice mids.
   
   
  Quote: 





nicholars said:


> I have been reading this roundup of all headphones - Excellent work BTW amazing resource for choosing some new headphones....
> 
> I have a question which is not really mentioned in the roundup... Maybe you could answer this -
> 
> ...


 
   
  I don't think the GR07 is what you're looking for. The IE8 (haven't heard the IE80) would be much closer to what you want IMO. The Yamaha EPH-100 would be worth considering as well - it's better match than the VSonics for your requirements. A slightly less popular choice to consider would maybe be the Radius DDM (HP-TWF11) if you can find one for sale.
   
  Quote: 





jpfrost said:


> I have a question for all Cowon J3 users -- how well does the EQ work on IEM's?
> 
> Obviously, I have used the EQ myself, but never with more analytical sounding earphones. So I'm wondering if turning up the bass for example on a thin base sounding IEM will sound natural or will it sound somewhat artificial?


 
   
  The short answer is that it depends on the IEM. In general the J3 EQs pretty well if you put in the time with the customization. There was a lot of discussion on this in the long J3 thread in the portable source forum.


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

Hey Joker have you had the chance to hear the Sony MDR-XB90EX?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> Hey Joker have you had the chance to hear the Sony MDR-XB90EX?


 
   
  Nope, only the XB40EX reviewed here.


----------



## anoxy

I'm looking for something with a sound signature almost opposite of my Etymotic ER4B. I like my Etys for classical music and analytical listening at home, but they just aren't a very fun iem that I can wear to the gym or out and about. I'm considering the Sennheiser IE8, but I wanted to see what your recommendation might be. I'd like them to pack a good amount of bass for hip-hop and upbeat electronic music genres. Any opinions are greatly appreciated. 
   
  EDIT: I don't even know why I ask questions haha. Did some super power searching through these forums over the past few hours and decided on the VSonic GR07 MK2. Now my eyes hurt from reading so much and it's time for bed. They arrive tomorrow, can't hardly wait!


----------



## qilto

Thanks Joker, I've finally decided on getting the RE262. You mentioned that it is very power hungry and really benefits from an amp, even when using a Cowon J3 Is a Fiio E5 sufficient to drive it well, or should I invest in something better?


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





qilto said:


> Thanks Joker, I've finally decided on getting the RE262. You mentioned that it is very power hungry and really benefits from an amp, even when using a Cowon J3 Is a Fiio E5 sufficient to drive it well, or should I invest in something better?


 

 Joker mentioned somewhere that his J3 is sufficient enough to drive the RE262, though I forgot where, so I can't quote his post.
  He also mentioned that Fiio E5 is more of a toy bass boost rather than an amplifier.


----------



## Failuyr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That review is quite old but at $75 the Turbine is still a decent buy. Lots more competition now - you can get something just as good without waiting for a $100 discount on the Turbines - the Beyerdynamic DTX 101, for example, or Fischer Audio Consonance. You can even save a chunk of change by going with the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition instead.


 
   
  I ended up getting the Turbines before even seeing this post. Im currently waiting to recieve them, after looking at the DTX101s and Consonance's, I could have saved between $10-20. After looking at your reviews, I feel like I made the best buy in my situation. (I didn't include this in my Original Post asking for advice) As a highschooler (my highschool of 3000, with mainly glass hallways that echo) who is trying to get a great performance-per-dollar ratio on headphones, while having them be stylish and have good isolation, whilst matching my preferred sound signature in the ~$75 range, I feel as if the Monster Turbines hit my needs right on the money.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





anoxy said:


> I'm looking for something with a sound signature almost opposite of my Etymotic ER4B. I like my Etys for classical music and analytical listening at home, but they just aren't a very fun iem that I can wear to the gym or out and about. I'm considering the Sennheiser IE8, but I wanted to see what your recommendation might be. I'd like them to pack a good amount of bass for hip-hop and upbeat electronic music genres. Any opinions are greatly appreciated.
> 
> EDIT: I don't even know why I ask questions haha. Did some super power searching through these forums over the past few hours and decided on the VSonic GR07 MK2. Now my eyes hurt from reading so much and it's time for bed. They arrive tomorrow, can't hardly wait!


 
   
  Congrats on the GR07s! They are nothing like the IE8 but should work better than the ER4B for what you want 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





qilto said:


> Thanks Joker, I've finally decided on getting the RE262. You mentioned that it is very power hungry and really benefits from an amp, even when using a Cowon J3 Is a Fiio E5 sufficient to drive it well, or should I invest in something better?


 
   
  It's actually drivable with the J3 - I don't think the E5 would help much. The E6 is supposedly better but I haven't tried it.
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker mentioned somewhere that his J3 is sufficient enough to drive the RE262 beautifully, though I forgot where, so I can't quote his post.
> He also mentioned that Fiio E5 is more of a toy bass boost rather than an amplifier.


 
   
  I doubt I said 'beautifully' but the J3/RE262 pairing is reasonably good. It does sound better from one of my external DAC/amp units, though. 
   
  Quote: 





failuyr said:


> I ended up getting the Turbines before even seeing this post. Im currently waiting to recieve them, after looking at the DTX101s and Consonance's, I could have saved between $10-20. After looking at your reviews, I feel like I made the best buy in my situation. (I didn't include this in my Original Post asking for advice) As a highschooler (my highschool of 3000, with mainly glass hallways that echo) who is trying to get a great performance-per-dollar ratio on headphones, while having them be stylish and have good isolation, whilst matching my preferred sound signature in the ~$75 range, I feel as if the Monster Turbines hit my needs right on the money.


 
   
  The best buy is the one you'll be happy with.


----------



## Failuyr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The best buy is the one you'll be happy with.


 
   
  I agree, I received them today. I'm currently burning them in, and I'm loving them, I love the bass they give in my not very bass-y music. It's definitely the sound I was looking for. Thanks for your suggestions though, I might pick one of them up down the road! Also great job creating this thread and all of these reviews. It really helped me find IEMS and compare them quickly and know exactly what I was getting. I'm sure everyone here loves this as a reference as much as I do!


----------



## Yloss

Hello folks,
   
  wish i discovered this community before .. could have saved some headaches!
  Anyway my cheap V-MODA fall apart after a year and wanted to take the chance for a (nice) improvement
  I've been reading extensively the reviews/reference above by Joker but since i'm no pro (just an enthusiast music listener) i'm still undecided.
  I'm considering the following models but i'm very open to suggestions:
  ETYMOTIC HF3
  PHONEK AUDEO PFE 122
  KLIPSCH X10i
  (also considering Fischer Audio but their site is down so cannot check/compare their models)
   
  Of course some info needed:
  - Price Range: about 100/200 USD (im in EU anyway)
  - Iphone user (looking for mic/controls model)
  - Good build (i tend to abuse them)
  - Comfortable (i use them for long periods 2/3+ hrs)
  - Listening mainly to Alt Rock/Punk rock/Grunge but also electronic music (deep warm bass welcome) 
   
  if you need any more info just ask and thanks in advance


----------



## Cotnijoe

Quote: 





yloss said:


> Hello folks,
> 
> wish i discovered this community before .. could have saved some headaches!
> Anyway my cheap V-MODA fall apart after a year and wanted to take the chance for a (nice) improvement
> ...


 
  I personally dont like the X10is too much but they sound like they may work well for you. They definitely have bass and have the iphone controls and can be bought on amazon for less than 200 i think. If the iphone controls arent necessarily needed, i would take a look at something like Vsonic GR07 or maybe the UE Triple Fi 10 (which can be found fairly cheap on amazon too) or the Shure SE215.
   
  I think shure SE215 is worth considering for 100 dollars. Definitely a lot of bass and you can buy a replaceable iphone cable (can be expensive tho). But if you want fidelity, i think the Vsonic or UE mite be a better choice.


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I doubt I said 'beautifully' but the J3/RE262 pairing is reasonably good. It does sound better from one of my external DAC/amp units, though.


 
  Ah... yes... I tend to hyperbole sometimes, I'll correct that!


----------



## dfrost

yloss said:


> Hello folks,
> 
> wish i discovered this community before .. could have saved some headaches!
> Anyway my cheap V-MODA fall apart after a year and wanted to take the chance for a (nice) improvement
> ...



Have you considered the MEElec A161P? Look at joker's review of the Fischer SBA03 to get an idea of sound characteristics. There's also an appreciation thread for the A161P on this forum.


----------



## Kuray

I'm leaving US in 11th of August and I need custom IEM.
   
  1964-T requires $75 for rush process
  CTM-200 accepts to do it in time
  and I am waiting answer from Alclair Reference
   
  My budget is $400 and I need them emergency.
   
   
  @joker
  Can you compare Reference with 1964-T and CTM-200


----------



## funsound

How do the re272 compare with the westone 3's?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





failuyr said:


> I agree, I received them today. I'm currently burning them in, and I'm loving them, I love the bass they give in my not very bass-y music. It's definitely the sound I was looking for. Thanks for your suggestions though, I might pick one of them up down the road! Also great job creating this thread and all of these reviews. It really helped me find IEMS and compare them quickly and know exactly what I was getting. I'm sure everyone here loves this as a reference as much as I do!


 
   
  Thanks, glad you're enjoying the Turbines. 
   
  Quote: 





yloss said:


> Hello folks,
> 
> wish i discovered this community before .. could have saved some headaches!
> Anyway my cheap V-MODA fall apart after a year and wanted to take the chance for a (nice) improvement
> ...


 
   
  It really sounds like the Shure SE215+mic cable is your best bet. It's comfortable in most ears, well-built, and has a warmish sound to it. Second choice would be the mic version of the Phonak Perfect Bass. Third would probably be the A161P even though I've only had hands-on time with the Fischer version. The HF3 is difficult to recommend with bass/warmth as a requirement and the X10i really isn't built for abuse in my experience.
   
  Quote: 





kuray said:


> I'm leaving US in 11th of August and I need custom IEM.
> 
> 1964-T requires $75 for rush process
> CTM-200 accepts to do it in time
> ...


 
   
  The 1964-T is a step down from the other two IMO and also has a different, much more mid-centric sound to it. It doesn't have the bass extension or treble reach of the Reference, nor the transparency of either the Reference or CTM-200. 
   
  Compared to the CTM-200 the Reference has better bass - dynamics, punch, depth, and texture. It also has a slightly more forward presentation with a touch more depth. Mids are pretty similar with the Reference a touch warmer but just as clear and detailed. Treble is smoother on the CTM-200 - I actually prefer the treble on those to both the Reference and 1964-T.
   
  The Reference is also out of your budget 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
   
  Quote: 





funsound said:


> How do the re272 compare with the westone 3's?


 
   
  Very different sound, the RE272 is much flatter and more neutral in tone. The W3s have hyped-up bass and treble while the RE272 is generally quite smooth and well-balanced.


----------



## FieldingMellish

Joker, I found RE-272 is exactly that, well balanced. It was noticeable right out of the box. The listen was brief and then they were put into a burn session. Briefly, they were hitting all the notes and nothing felt lacking. I had some Afro-centric music on that typically has remarkable production values; separation and levels were good; noticeable are deep drums and range of percussion, along with some kind of high pitched stringed instrument; vocals topping it off. It's nice when it feels like a keeper right off the bat.


----------



## Davidisawesome

This guy is awesome. He replies so quickly


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fieldingmellish said:


> Joker, I found RE-272 is exactly that, well balanced. It was noticeable right out of the box. The listen was brief and then they were put into a burn session. Briefly, they were hitting all the notes and nothing felt lacking. I had some Afro-centric music on that typically has remarkable production values; separation and levels were good; noticeable are deep drums and range of percussion, along with some kind of high pitched stringed instrument; vocals topping it off. It's nice when it feels like a keeper right off the bat.


 
   
  Indeed. I re-visited the RE272 and RE262 in a guest post in InnerFidelity yesterday: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-262-and-re-272-ear-heaphones . Tyll added some measurement interpretations if you're interested in that soft of thing. 
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> This guy is awesome. He replies so quickly


 
   
  Morning _and_ night.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Indeed. I re-visited the RE272 and RE262 in a guest post in InnerFidelity yesterday: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-262-and-re-272-ear-heaphones . Tyll added some measurement interpretations if you're interested in that soft of thing.


 
   
  Great review! A pair of RE-262 is coming my way...


----------



## FieldingMellish

Quote: 





putente said:


> Great review! A pair of RE-262 is coming my way...


 
   
   
  Good for you. I traded mine in for the 272 and I might wind up re-buying the 262.


----------



## DannyBai

Indeed. I re-visited the RE272 and RE262 in a guest post in InnerFidelity yesterday: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-262-and-re-272-ear-heaphones . Tyll added some measurement interpretations if you're interested in that soft of thing. 


That was a good read joker and I'd agree whole-heartedly on both earphones.


----------



## FlySweep

Great review of the RE262 & RE272, joker.. Even though I really like your longer, dedicated reviews (i.e. for your customs), you convey a lot of relevant info when you're working with a little less space, too.  I've often referred to the RE262 & RE272 as "kindred spirits."  They focus on the complimentary sides of the fq spectrum.. but what they also show is Fang/HiFiMan's ability to elegantly blend & artfully present a nuanced midrange in subtle, but different ways.. with breathtaking precision and detail.  A special achievement, IMO.


----------



## sandaz93

Hey Guys, time for new headphone / earbuds!.  Recommendations greatly appreciated.
   
  Previous Favorite Headphone:  Sennheiser CX500, Sennheiser IE6 (my favorite so far, but lost them , and Koss Porta Pro. While I feel the porta pros don't sound as good as the Sennheisers, they are more comfortable.
   
  Earbuds or Headphone: Preferably Earbuds, since these are for my portable rig
   
  MP3 Player in Use: Sony A series 16gb.
   
  Type of Music: Hans Zimmer, John Williams, Soundtracks (Instrumental),  Pop, Soft rock, Taylor Swift, Bollywood, Vocals.  Evenely divded
   
  Price Range - $200ish and under.
   
  Tried, but don't like so far: Logitech Ultimate Ears Triple fi 10 , Sony Extra Bass line, Sennheiser HD280.
   
  Once again, thank you


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





sandaz93 said:


> Hey Guys, time for new headphone / earbuds!.  Recommendations greatly appreciated.
> 
> Previous Favorite Headphone:  Sennheiser CX500, Sennheiser IE6 (my favorite so far, but lost them , and Koss Porta Pro. While I feel the porta pros don't sound as good as the Sennheisers, they are more comfortable.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hans Zimmer sound pretty darn good on the Vsonic GR07. Also, vocals are a good bit more upfront vs the TF10. You can look into it more on the GR07 thread.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





putente said:


> Great review! A pair of RE-262 is coming my way...


 
   
  Quote: 





dannybai said:


> That was a good read joker and I'd agree whole-heartedly on both earphones.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Great review of the RE262 & RE272, joker.. Even though I really like your longer, dedicated reviews (i.e. for your customs), you convey a lot of relevant info when you're working with a little less space, too.  I've often referred to the RE262 & RE272 as "kindred spirits."  They focus on the complimentary sides of the fq spectrum.. but what they also show is Fang/HiFiMan's ability to elegantly blend & artfully present a nuanced midrange in subtle, but different ways.. with breathtaking precision and detail.  A special achievement, IMO.


 
   
  Thanks! On the point of article length - I am finding that 1500 words is the magic target for me for a full write-up. Anything beyond that gets tedious to read. Most of my write-ups run a little on the long side of that but I'm working on keeping the sound descriptions more concise and standardized, with less flowery descriptions. The exception would of course be customs, which benefit from separate A:B comparison sections.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Should I get the Etymotic Research MC5 , the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 IE or the MEElectronics CC51


----------



## fyleow

Thanks a lot for posting this really comprehensive guide. I am shopping for a new pair of IEMs and I'm looking for some guidance. I currently own a pair of Jays q-Jays which have been fine but I'm having problems with the filters not lasting very long and requiring a lot of maintenance. I think it's due to the design with the filter being very close to the edge and the silicon tips not being very deep. I've seen others complain about it too so I'm not alone on this and certainly never had issues with the Ety ER 4s I used to own.
   
*Budget: *~$200
   
*Headphones I've liked/owned:* Ety ER4s, Sennheiser HD 600, Stax SR-404
   
*Sound:* I prefer a more detailed, neutral balanced sound. I am a huge fan of the HD 600s having come back to them many times and owning my pair for over 10 years. Tactile bass is not a huge priority to me (I loved the Stax and it had no tactile bass at all). I liked the ER4s a lot thought it may be just _slightly_ too clinical. I listen to a variety of music but mostly alternative and classical.
   
*Comfort: *From what I remember of the ER4s the triple flanges weren't very comfortable for me due to the deep insertion and I have smaller ears. I switched to the foam tips which worked better. They also stuck out quite a bit and were easier to wear straight down which was a bit uncomfortable. I wear the q-Jays straight down and they are fine due to them being smaller.
   
*Accessories/Support/Availability:* IEMs need a bit more maintenance than other headphones due to filter changes, tip changes etc. Jays discontinued the q-Jays and it's hard to even find replacement filters these days. 
   
  Do any of the IEMs stand out based on my requirements? I've been tempted by the hf5 due to the low price and my positive experience with Etys (sound, isolation) but the negatives (comfort) keep me open to trying something new.


----------



## Xinze

Joker- I love this thread btw! I've recommended it to quite a few friends who were shopping for IEMS.
  I just lost my MTPCs, and I wanted to ask, what are some iems that sound similar to the coppers? I mostly liked its sq, but it's highs were a bit to shrill and bright for my tastes. I've been looking at the triple-fi 10 and the Westone 3. Could you share your opinion on those two and give some more suggestions? Budget is $200-300.
   
  Thanks and love you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Should I get the Etymotic Research MC5 , the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 IE or the MEElectronics CC51


 
   
  That really depends on what you want - clear and well-balanced but potentially a little dull compared to most other dynamics, bass-heavy with a prominent midrange and average clarity, or clear and lively but with a mildly recessed midrange. 
   
  Quote: 





fyleow said:


> Thanks a lot for posting this really comprehensive guide. I am shopping for a new pair of IEMs and I'm looking for some guidance. I currently own a pair of Jays q-Jays which have been fine but I'm having problems with the filters not lasting very long and requiring a lot of maintenance. I think it's due to the design with the filter being very close to the edge and the silicon tips not being very deep. I've seen others complain about it too so I'm not alone on this and certainly never had issues with the Ety ER 4s I used to own.
> 
> *Budget: *~$200
> 
> ...


 
   
  Have you thought of getting custom tips for the HF5? It will still (almost) be within your budget. As far as other options go, I think you might like the HiFiMan RE262 (or used RE272) based on your HD600 experience, or the GR07 (slightly edgier than the HiFiMan stuff but not as 'clinical' as an Ety). You could also try a MEElec A161P (reviewed as the Fischer SBA-03 here) - it's got more bass and slightly more subdued highs than your average Ety but still performs similarly overall.
   
  Quote: 





xinze said:


> Joker- I love this thread btw! I've recommended it to quite a few friends who were shopping for IEMS.
> I just lost my MTPCs, and I wanted to ask, what are some iems that sound similar to the coppers? I mostly liked its sq, but it's highs were a bit to shrill and bright for my tastes. I've been looking at the triple-fi 10 and the Westone 3. Could you share your opinion on those two and give some more suggestions? Budget is $200-300.
> 
> Thanks and love you


 
   
  If you found the Coppers treble overbearing I would give the W3 and maybe event the TF10 a pass. There's a number of smoother-sounding in-ears in that price range, including the new Miles Davis Trumpets and the cheaper Yamaha EPH-100.


----------



## Hotheads

Hi,  Im planning to get either the VSonic GR02 bass edition or VSonic GR99. I have read that the GR02 BE is slightly better than the GR99 but i also read that both of these earphones are very close in sound? So i wanted to know if it was worth spending $11 more for the GR02 BE (GR02:$46, GR99:$35)? and is the gr02 more durable than the gr99, like the earphone wire for example?
   
  Great review btw. Loved it :]


----------



## Kuray

I planned to get Unique Melody Miracle. Only problem is it takes about $100 for shipping to send impressions to China.
   
  Those who bought from overseas and send their impressions from US, which shipping company they used and how much they paid?
   
  I don't have too much money to spend for shipping.
   
   
   
  Also, if anyone know good audiologist in Manhattan, New York?
   
  Thanks


----------



## Davidisawesome

Well I'm looking to buy an IEM. My preference would be bass then clarity but I don't want an excessive amount of bass. I also want a good mid range. I'm considering the beyerdynamic dtx 101, the MEelec CC51 or the Etymotic MC5. What do you think of the these phones.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hotheads said:


> Hi,  Im planning to get either the VSonic GR02 bass edition or VSonic GR99. I have read that the GR02 BE is slightly better than the GR99 but i also read that both of these earphones are very close in sound? So i wanted to know if it was worth spending $11 more for the GR02 BE (GR02:$46, GR99:$35)? and is the gr02 more durable than the gr99, like the earphone wire for example?
> 
> Great review btw. Loved it :]


 
   
  I can't tell you whether upgrading to the GR02 is worth $11 to you. I think you can surmise from the scores on the front page of the thread that it is a slightly better earphone but both VSonics easily are worth the asking price. I do think the GR02 may be a little more durable as well as a bit more comfortable in smaller ears.
   
  Quote: 





kuray said:


> I planned to get Unique Melody Miracle. Only problem is it takes about $100 for shipping to send impressions to China.
> 
> Those who bought from overseas and send their impressions from US, which shipping company they used and how much they paid?
> 
> I don't have too much money to spend for shipping.


 
   
  I used USPS Priority w/tracking. Typically runs around $30. Express (EMS) is faster and usually $5 or so extra.
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Well I'm looking to buy an IEM. My preference would be bass then clarity but I don't want an excessive amount of bass. I also want a good mid range. I'm considering the beyerdynamic dtx 101, the MEelec CC51 or the Etymotic MC5. What do you think of the these phones.


 
   
  If bass > clarity, go for the DTX101iE. It's bass-heavy but the mids are not really recessed. There are quite a few <$100 sets aside from the DTX101 that will do what you want  - the Brainwavz M2, Xears TDIII and TD4, as well as the Spider Realvoice and Monster Turbine. All of these have decent clarity with enhanced bass and strong mids. Just a matter of finding the one that fits your other requirements at a price you're willing to pay.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Thank you for the quick reply. You've really helped me a lot when it comes to buying a new pair of headphones. I might just get the Beyerdynamic


----------



## SuperFuya

ljokerl said:


> I can't tell you whether upgrading to the GR02 is worth $11 to you. I think you can surmise from the scores on the front page of the thread that it is a slightly better earphone but both VSonics easily are worth the asking price. I do think the GR02 may be a little more durable as well as a bit more comfortable in smaller ears.
> 
> 
> I used USPS



 
 For classical music, which one is better? GR 02 standard edition or the bass edition or even GR 99?


----------



## suman134

go for meelec cc51 , if you want more bass go for ue 400/500 , and sony xb41ex . try the sony they are really nice for just $55 . mc5 from ety are really low on bass , the dt 101i are bass heavy too .


----------



## suman134

why dont you try with a she 3580/3570 , they are good ( cheap and nice ) , those you mentioned have bigger bass in them , and for classical music you should go for BAs , dynamics dont do classical much justice . etymotics mc5 for a starter in classical will serve you better , a bit pricier at $55 but worth it for classical . in BA start with meelec a151 which is some $50 and awesome .


----------



## SuperFuya

^ I will try SHE 3580. thanks for the advice =)


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





kuray said:


> I planned to get Unique Melody Miracle. Only problem is it takes about $100 for shipping to send impressions to China.
> 
> Those who bought from overseas and send their impressions from US, which shipping company they used and how much they paid?
> 
> ...


 
   
        I do! Park76 Audiologist. 25 Years of Excellent service.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm really starting to focus on getting either the Heir 3.A or 4.A. Time to start saving at least $600.


----------



## fyleow

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Have you thought of getting custom tips for the HF5? It will still (almost) be within your budget. As far as other options go, I think you might like the HiFiMan RE262 (or used RE272) based on your HD600 experience, or the GR07 (slightly edgier than the HiFiMan stuff but not as 'clinical' as an Ety). You could also try a MEElec A161P (reviewed as the Fischer SBA-03 here) - it's got more bass and slightly more subdued highs than your average Ety but still performs similarly overall.


 
   
  Thanks for your thoughts Joker. I've done a bit more reading on the ones you've mentioned, but I get the feeling that unless I spring for something like the RE272 I'm going to get a different but not necessarily better overall sound. Maybe I should give the q-jays a try with some other tips while saving and looking out for a used RE272. Do you have suggestions on what tips to try with the q-jays? I have a hard time figuring out what's compatible because manufacturers never list it specifically.


----------



## scootsit

I just want to thank you, Joker for your suggestions and for this thread. Despite your cautioning against it (I'm not too fond of bass heavy sets), I went for the GR02 Bass Edition. I have to say that you are spot on in your advice and reviews. They are extremely nice phones, great sound quality, but there is a bit more bass than I would have liked. I switched my iPod eq to "Bass Reducer" and couldn't be happier. They sound balanced and analytical and not at all lean. Additionally, the GR02 can be had even cheaper from Lend Me Ur Ears without the Sony Hybrid style tips. I seem to have very finicky ears, nothing fits my left ear. I think that my inner canal is very narrow and my outer ear is very wide, so few tips fit well, including bi-flanges. On a lark, I placed an order with Meelec. I got some of their "Balanced Sound" tips, small triple flanges, over ear loops and a case. Everything they sell is reasonably priced and very well made. I couldn't get the triple flanges to fit, but the "Balanced Sound" bi-flanges are incredible! They use a much softer, thinner silicone that isolates incredibly well and is extra comfy! Do they balance the sound of the GR02? Not really, but boy are they comfortable! I found that by installing the GR02s upside down, with or without over-ear-guides, they insert deeper and the comfort is incredible!
   
  Anyway, those are my thoughts, somewhat non sequitur, but I wanted to share.


----------



## lilboozy

Can anyone help me with choosing between the meelec m9 and the jvc fx101


----------



## Davidisawesome

Do you think the Beyer DTX 101 IE has excessive bass. Does the bass make the rest of the track less clear. I'm might get them so i'm asking.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Do the DTX 101 IE need an amp???


----------



## suman134

no the dtx is not the most bassy iem , but its big , it dont need any amp , why you dont settle with the cc51 , good bass , nice clarity , not the most awesome highs , really nice mid , dtx for me are not value . and it dont need any amp .


----------



## suman134

havent heard the jvc , but the m9 are really awesome , big bass , and good clarity for just $18 .


----------



## Davidisawesome

That's good for me, I don't want to use an amp with my headphones


----------



## Davidisawesome

does the MEElec CC51 have good bass and isolation


----------



## Davidisawesome

Do the CC51 need any burn in


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> does the MEElec CC51 have good bass and isolation


 
  Bass is good quality. It's V shaped, midrange is recessed. A fun IEM to listen to. I'd probably get one if given the chance.
   
  Isolation depend on your ear canal size, nozzle diameter is 6mm. It is a vented IEM.


----------



## suman134

nice isolation , good bass , slightly v shaped , buy the dtx is a big V . there is nothing in 6mm diameter , the bigger tips fit really awesome , the mid ear tips are not bad at all . but one trouble , no other tip will fit . if bass you need , then try the ue 400 and xb41ex .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





superfuya said:


> For classical music, which one is better? GR 02 standard edition or the bass edition or even GR 99?


 
   
  I don't really like heavy bass for what little classical music I listen to but unfortunately I haven't heard the regular GR02. The GR99 is a touch less bassy than the GR02 BE overall, which might help.
   
  Quote: 





fyleow said:


> Thanks for your thoughts Joker. I've done a bit more reading on the ones you've mentioned, but I get the feeling that unless I spring for something like the RE272 I'm going to get a different but not necessarily better overall sound. Maybe I should give the q-jays a try with some other tips while saving and looking out for a used RE272. Do you have suggestions on what tips to try with the q-jays? I have a hard time figuring out what's compatible because manufacturers never list it specifically.


 
   
  The q-JAYS and ER4 are both top-tier IEMs so I wouldn't expect huge jumps in quality from there, just sound signatures more to your liking and mild jumps in performance here and there. Aside from stock silicones, I liked Klipsch gel tips and smaller Sony Hybrids on the q-JAYS.
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I just want to thank you, Joker for your suggestions and for this thread. Despite your cautioning against it (I'm not too fond of bass heavy sets), I went for the GR02 Bass Edition. I have to say that you are spot on in your advice and reviews. They are extremely nice phones, great sound quality, but there is a bit more bass than I would have liked. I switched my iPod eq to "Bass Reducer" and couldn't be happier. They sound balanced and analytical and not at all lean. Additionally, the GR02 can be had even cheaper from Lend Me Ur Ears without the Sony Hybrid style tips. I seem to have very finicky ears, nothing fits my left ear. I think that my inner canal is very narrow and my outer ear is very wide, so few tips fit well, including bi-flanges. On a lark, I placed an order with Meelec. I got some of their "Balanced Sound" tips, small triple flanges, over ear loops and a case. Everything they sell is reasonably priced and very well made. I couldn't get the triple flanges to fit, but the "Balanced Sound" bi-flanges are incredible! They use a much softer, thinner silicone that isolates incredibly well and is extra comfy! Do they balance the sound of the GR02? Not really, but boy are they comfortable! I found that by installing the GR02s upside down, with or without over-ear-guides, they insert deeper and the comfort is incredible!
> 
> Anyway, those are my thoughts, somewhat non sequitur, but I wanted to share.


 
   
  Thanks! I still have the MEE 'balanced' tips on my GR02 as well. They are meant to work with the M9 - the M9 stock tips are thicker so in a way the balanced tips do cut the bass a little. Like you, I just like them for the comfort, though. I have a second pair of them on my beater/gym phones (H2O Audio Flex) and a bunch more scattered around. 
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Can anyone help me with choosing between the meelec m9 and the jvc fx101


 
   
  I have an FX101 on loan. It's an improvement on the FX1X, which had an overly intrusive mid-bass hump for my taste. The signature is somewhat reminiscent of the M9, or even an Atrio, but without the deep bass of either. Aside from poorer deep bass it differs from the M9 with less recessed mids but slightly more hyped-up lower treble. My old M9 (which must have a thousand hours on it now) is less fatiguing but also not as clear and detailed as the JVCs.
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Do the CC51 need any burn in


 
   
  All equipment will 'burn in' naturally with use so I don't see why that should be part of a buying decision.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Do you think the CC51 is a good buy. I might pick these up sometime soon.


----------



## gadiletta

Hello, I'm looking for an advice.
  I prefer music like John Legend, Coldplay, David Guetta, Jamiroquai and some house musica. So I look into good bass (and I want my ears are isolated from the rest) but at the same time with good medium and high, before I had sennheiser cx 300 II, but some experts told me that GR02 vsonic is much better than sennheiser I used and that are perfect for my requirments, but the problem is that I live in Italy and I need that in ears in a little time max 7 days.
  What about your opinion?
  I was considering some inears available in europe (vsonic are from singapore it will take long time) so with a fast shipment and with the same price of vsonic 30/50 euro more or less, any advice (please in europe) ?
  I listen music with iphone 4.
  Thank you.


----------



## suman134

you need xears td III , its from germany , try a xb41ex at a sony store .


----------



## jhelsas

Hello, I would not like to ask anything, but to thank ljokerl for the great topic and the great informations there are here in this magnificent review!
   
  All my present earphones I bought using the information in this topic as a guideline and comparative and I don't regret ANY of them, as they are, I love all 3 of them.
   
  Please keep doing this great job!!


----------



## Zelda

(price aside) which one you prefer ? the A151 or the AM-90 , and why?


----------



## gadiletta

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> you need xears td III , its from germany , try a xb41ex at a sony store .


 
  Or it's better to take brainwavz M4 at 49.50$ inclusive fedex shipment or Dunu Trident at $34.50  inclusive fedex shipment?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Do you think the CC51 is a good buy. I might pick these up sometime soon.


 
   
  The ratings and reviews at the front of this thread should answer that.
   
  Quote: 





gadiletta said:


> Hello, I'm looking for an advice.
> I prefer music like John Legend, Coldplay, David Guetta, Jamiroquai and some house musica. So I look into good bass (and I want my ears are isolated from the rest) but at the same time with good medium and high, before I had sennheiser cx 300 II, but some experts told me that GR02 vsonic is much better than sennheiser I used and that are perfect for my requirments, but the problem is that I live in Italy and I need that in ears in a little time max 7 days.
> What about your opinion?
> I was considering some inears available in europe (vsonic are from singapore it will take long time) so with a fast shipment and with the same price of vsonic 30/50 euro more or less, any advice (please in europe) ?
> ...


 
   
  I don't know what's available to you locally. Maybe look around for a Philips SHE3580 and see if that does it for you? 
   
  Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Hello, I would not like to ask anything, but to thank ljokerl for the great topic and the great informations there are here in this magnificent review!
> 
> All my present earphones I bought using the information in this topic as a guideline and comparative and I don't regret ANY of them, as they are, I love all 3 of them.
> 
> Please keep doing this great job!!


 
   
  Glad to hear, and thanks!
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> (price aside) which one you prefer ? the A151 or the AM-90 , and why?


 
   
  I prefer the sound of the AM-90 since I like its treble better but with fit factored in I'd probably take the A151. It's one of the many lightweight over-the-ear IEMs that I can just forget about.


----------



## gadiletta

Quote: 





gadiletta said:


> Or it's better to take brainwavz M4 at 49.50$ inclusive fedex shipment or Dunu Trident at $34.50  inclusive fedex shipment?


 
_*UP*_


----------



## suman134

brainwavz m4 can be considered , dunu , maybe not .


----------



## suman134

waiting for two low end iem pl10 and cowon ce1 to arrive .


----------



## gadiletta

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> brainwavz m4 can be considered , dunu , maybe not .


 

 braiwavx m4 are better than xears right? For listening music like john legend and some house, so i look for good bass .


----------



## suman134

the m4 is good , big bass , a big v shaped sound which you will love .


----------



## pukka

ljokerl, kudos for this impressive thread!!! THANKS THANKS THANKS!
   
  I was  in the quest for the ideal (for me) IEM, so first read all your reviews from $30 to $100, and confirmed your listening taste was in line
  with mine (comparing your impressions from IEMs I owned, like a-jays three, Senheisser CX-300 II, Apple's, Ety's er6i), so I just let me "follow that light"
  and your virtual guidance has been priceless!
   
  I'm just raving with my new GR06, best money spent on a IEM on all these years. I'm even considering the GR07. Your reviews are spot on!
   
  Just out of curiosity, do you have any DIY experience? have you recabled an IEM and noticed a change in its sound?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Joker, do the regular Monster Turbines have the same insertion depth issues as the Gold and Copper? You mention the latter two being sensitive to insertion depth, but nothing was said about the original Turbines.


----------



## suman134

he may have forgot to mention them on the turbines , its the same thing with just different driver and different material housing . have to say , mtpg are the best looking earphone . i was mad about them , gave up because of bass . huge bass , the air will damage any ear .


----------



## PanicoNFL

Joker, two questions:

 1- Do you think the SE215 sounds recessed like IE8 ? because I hated the IE8, vocals sounded too far, I only liked the bass.
 2- In your reviews, you say the best isolation is achieved with the right tips, are you talking about the _Preferred tips_ or some kind of Tri-Flanges/Comply, etc. ?


----------



## Niyologist

I made my final decision. The RE262 it is. The IEM with the closest sound signature, besides the RE272 is the FAD Heaven IV, but the Build Quality and Carrying Case is much better with the Heaven IV than the RE262.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pukka said:


> ljokerl, kudos for this impressive thread!!! THANKS THANKS THANKS!
> 
> I was  in the quest for the ideal (for me) IEM, so first read all your reviews from $30 to $100, and confirmed your listening taste was in line
> with mine (comparing your impressions from IEMs I owned, like a-jays three, Senheisser CX-300 II, Apple's, Ety's er6i), so I just let me "follow that light"
> ...


 
   
  Thanks, glad you've enjoyed your purchases!
   
  I have tried a couple of recabled earphones and generally have not noticed much of a difference. My Miracle actually seemed a bit worse with the aftermarket Beat Audio cable.
   
  Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> Joker, do the regular Monster Turbines have the same insertion depth issues as the Gold and Copper? You mention the latter two being sensitive to insertion depth, but nothing was said about the original Turbines.


 
   
  I did not find the Turbines to be as bad in this respect as the Golds. Something about the sound signature of the Golds just didn't work for me with deep insertion. 
   
   
  Quote: 





paniconfl said:


> Joker, two questions:
> 
> 1- Do you think the SE215 sounds recessed like IE8 ? because I hated the IE8, vocals sounded too far, I only liked the bass.
> 2- In your reviews, you say the best isolation is achieved with the right tips, are you talking about the _Preferred tips_ or some kind of Tri-Flanges/Comply, etc. ?


 
  The IE8 is generally a more distant-sounding IEM. While the SE215 does emphasize its bass over the midrange slightly, it does not have that n-th row seating feel to it. 
   
  'Right tips' usually just means the more isolating ones of the tips I tried on that earphone. Oftentimes that's some sort of foam, such as Olives on the SE215.


----------



## qwe340

Hi joker,
   
  I am ready to buy my first good pair of IEMs now. But, from the noob suggestions, i realized the most important thing is about balance of equips and buying what you use it for.
   
  I am a college student. Currently i really only listen to music on my iphone4s, my Ipad, my computer with no soundcard (integrated), or a coby 757 when I go to the gym.
   
  I realize my source is not audiophile at all, so I am looking at your low end Vsonic IEMs. GR02bass, or GR06, should I even consider GR07?
  Could you tell me which of those is the best fit for my source, as in, my source can actually bring out their potential, and they wont expose the flaws of my source.
   
  Also, i guess my fav genre is pop.
  Avril lavigne, taylor swift, Mariah carey's "Hate you" is my fav song.
  But I also listen to pure piano music and some classical, plus some alt rock(the soft type?)
   
  Thanks.
   
  Also, I realize that Joker might not be able to answer this very specific question, so, if there is anyone in the thread who is really good with source equips, I would really love your imput.
   
  Thanks everyone.


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Thanks for the reply joker. The Turbines will be here tomorrow, so nothing better than to experience them for myself. Been about two years since I've used IEMs (RE0s were my last one).


----------



## Nupie

Hey ljokerl,
   
  Once again - amazing job, thank you for doing what you do. 
   
  One quick question from me:
   
  I've just had my pl50 bail on me after two short months and I'm sad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Any chance you could tell me which phones from your list fit this description:
   
  . over-the-ear
  . minimum microphonics
*. can be flooded with sweat *(because I'm prettty sure this is one of the reasons my PLs died)
   
  I'm open to the sound signature although would prefer something either balanced or something warm and deep. Thanks in advance!


----------



## Davidisawesome

should I get the brainwavz m2 or the MEE cc51


----------



## suman134

go for the gr06 , it will be nice .


----------



## Davidisawesome

Do the brainwavz m2 need an amp.


----------



## suman134

for sweat you need sweat proof earphone , which are really rare to find with good sound , as far as i can see ue 300 are good , but had big bolted bass ,nice sound though , but not much durable and a bit microphonic , why dont you try the ue350 which can be worn over ears , and nice sound too . if you loved your pl50 like me , you need etys mc5 or meelec a151 , cc51 , for a fact you can use any straight barrel earphone for over ear fit . there are few water proof from philips , sho2200 fits your bill nicely , but with a bit of bass .


----------



## suman134

go for any of those , m2 has a bit more bass , and none of those need a amp .


----------



## Emospence

Would the Shure grey flex go well with the B2s?


----------



## dfrost

emospence said:


> Would the Shure grey flex go well with the B2s?



I used those Shure grey soft flex tips on DBA-02's for several years and they work well, and stay very secure on the nozzles, unlike the OEM single flanges. I get just a tiny bit better balance with the large dual flanges shown in my avatar (basically a big triple flange with the smallest flange removed).


----------



## dfrost

qwe340 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> I am ready to buy my first good pair of IEMs now. But, from the noob suggestions, i realized the most important thing is about balance of equips and buying what you use it for.
> 
> ...



I use similar sources and would not consider them low-end, except for the pretty poor built-in EQ, which I leave off. Even with my old ears, the SQ differences that |joker| and ClieOS describe are very discernible. 

You prefer music with female vocals plus the piano and classical mentioned,so I'd bet you would get tired of the typical V-sound signature of most mainstream IEMs. Something with forward mids and a more balanced signature might suite you better in the long run. 

While I haven't tried Vsonics myself, the GR06 or even better GR07 would probably be excellent. And consider balanced armature IEMs like the Brainwavz B2, Fischer DBA-02, or MEElec A161P (see |joker|'s review of the Fischer SBA-03 as well as Inks' thread). If those exceed your budget, look at the MEElec A151 or very similar sounding Astrotec AM-90. I like the former as my gym phone, and enjoyed the AM-90 before giving it to my daughter.


----------



## cibibikeru

I just recieved my GR02 Bass edition, very nice but I still prefer Brainwavz M1, they soud more natural, the GR02 offers better seal, more bass, that is ok, it has more treble, a little sibilant though, so in my opinion it's not better but the real difference are the mids I think, when I listen to the M1 everything sounds more natural, fuller, it's like when the sound is coming from a larger speaker, the GR02 sounds a little laid back, it doesn't have the body of the M1, I hope someone who heard both understands what I'm saying. The thing is I'm looking for an upgrade over the M1, the GR02 is not what I'm looking for, I want something with a similar sound signature. I also had Soundmagic PL30, really liked those too, except too much mids, not too much bass, not as natural sounding, poor seal, but still the right sound signature, what should I look for? What sounds similar but better? I listen mostly to rock/pop on sansa clip+ rockboxed, flac/mp3 320k.
   
  I would like an M1 with more bass and bass extension but not too much, better treble and treble extension but not sibilant, I don't like the tendancy towards sibilance on GR02, better everything else, a very natural sound,* if I close my eyes while I listen to music on these earphones, I want to find myself in the studio where the recording has been made, with the band singing in front of me, that is the ideea right? *Am I looking for a balanced or analytical earphone?


----------



## qwe340

dfrost said:


> I use similar sources and would not consider them low-end, except for the pretty poor built-in EQ, which I leave off. Even with my old ears, the SQ differences that |joker| and ClieOS describe are very discernible.
> You prefer music with female vocals plus the piano and classical mentioned,so I'd bet you would get tired of the typical V-sound signature of most mainstream IEMs. Something with forward mids and a more balanced signature might suite you better in the long run.
> While I haven't tried Vsonics myself, the GR06 or even better GR07 would probably be excellent. And consider balanced armature IEMs like the Brainwavz B2, Fischer DBA-02, or MEElec A161P (see |joker|'s review of the Fischer SBA-03 as well as Inks' thread). If those exceed your budget, look at the MEElec A151 or very similar sounding Astrotec AM-90. I like the former as my gym phone, and enjoyed the AM-90 before giving it to my daughter.


   

   
  Hi, thanks for the help,
  I am really considering the GR07 now,
   
  But, my biggest concern is the 50 ohm impedance and only 105 sensitivity. Would my source be able to drive it, cause i have no interest in getting an amp yet (I saw some reviews here saying GR07 is great with an amp). Although, my underestimation of my source equips might be reflecting the forums prejudice against Iproducts 
   
   
  This is a question for everyone who has tried the Vsonic IEMs, i heard the strength of GR07 is in its fidelity. Although I listen to my music closely, i definitely do not work with music professionally. Thus, I am wondering if the GR07 is much better than GR06 for simple enjoyment of music. (since jokers review said GR07 appeals to the professional market) 
   
  the GR07 is not out of my price range, but i definitely would like to know if the extra 100 dollars is making a difference. 
   
  thanks. 
   
  edit: Also, joker said GR07 needs a long burn in, is this true, what does it sound like out of the box, is it really poor?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





qwe340 said:


> I am ready to buy my first good pair of IEMs now. But, from the noob suggestions, i realized the most important thing is about balance of equips and buying what you use it for.
> 
> I am a college student. Currently i really only listen to music on my iphone4s, my Ipad, my computer with no soundcard (integrated), or a coby 757 when I go to the gym.
> 
> ...


 
   
  It really depends on how much you're looking to spend in the end - I wouldn't worry at all about using an iphone or ipad as a source. For general use I think the GR06 might hit the sweet spot as long as you don't require tons of bass. The GR07 would be jumping off the deep end. I know many have been happy with that sort of jump but others (who speak out publicly less often) have been underwhelmed. I personally took my time exploring mid-fi and wouldn't change that if I had to do it all over again. 
   
  Quote: 





nupie said:


> Hey ljokerl,
> 
> Once again - amazing job, thank you for doing what you do.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I don't think any of the IEMs in this thread aside from the H2O Audio ones were designed to be flooded with sweat. You need something waterproof for that. Better yet, get a disposable earphone for use when you sweat and a nicer one for other occasions. 
   
  Quote: 





emospence said:


> Would the Shure grey flex go well with the B2s?


 
   
  Always depends on your ears but I had good results with that combination.
    

  Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> I just recieved my GR02 Bass edition, very nice but I still prefer Brainwavz M1, they soud more natural, the GR02 offers better seal, more bass, that is ok, it has more treble, a little sibilant though, so in my opinion it's not better but the real difference are the mids I think, when I listen to the M1 everything sounds more natural, fuller, it's like when the sound is coming from a larger speaker, the GR02 sounds a little laid back, it doesn't have the body of the M1, I hope someone who heard both understands what I'm saying. The thing is I'm looking for an upgrade over the M1, the GR02 is not what I'm looking for, I want something with a similar sound signature. I also had Soundmagic PL30, really liked those too, except too much mids, not too much bass, not as natural sounding, poor seal, but still the right sound signature, what should I look for? What sounds similar but better? I listen mostly to rock/pop on sansa clip+ rockboxed, flac/mp3 320k.
> 
> I would like an M1 with more bass and bass extension but not too much, better treble and treble extension but not sibilant, I don't like the tendancy towards sibilance on GR02, better everything else, a very natural sound,* if I close my eyes while I listen to music on these earphones, I want to find myself in the studio where the recording has been made, with the band singing in front of me, that is the ideea right? *Am I looking for a balanced or analytical earphone?


 
   
  What you're looking for would probably be called 'musical'. Clearly you need to stay away from v-shaped earphones. You might like one of the higher-end HiFiMan sets - the warmer RE262 or the brighter RE272, the Westone UM3X, or the Shure SE530/SE535.


----------



## DemonFox

First off Joker I've been reading this forum for weeks now and I love it!! Everyday I learn something new so thank you for helping and doing what you did here its freak'n awesome!!
   
  Ok, guys I need some help.. 
   
  I'm selling/sold my Pro 900's and I'm looking for some high quality I.E.M's... Now lets not get to crazy but I am willing to spend in the $350 range so I do it right the first time (lets hope) I tend to learn towards the bass heavier cans... Who am I kidding I'm a bass head!! If it don't wobble I dont like it!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 All kidding aside I already know that if it doesn't have the right sound I won't like it so out of the choices I have here (and others of course if you can think of something) which would you say is going to make me the happiest. Now please understand I'm sort of a sophisticated bass head (if there is such a think) so I understand that these aren't going to shake my skull but I would like the pair that has the cleanest, punchiest, and fastest bass to keep up with the music and movies I watch. So what do you guys think!! I have a e11 and that will also be upgraded soon once I find the right portable amp. If you have suggestions on that too that would be awesome!!
   
   
  Here's what I'm considering..
   
  GR07 - $179
  SM3 V2 - $349
  RE 262 - $149 (maybe) 
  Velodyne vPulse - $89
  Fischer Eterna - ?? (very hard to find a place that will ship to the US and is trustworthy.. 
  Ultimate Ears TripleFi 10 - $169
   
  Thanks again guys,


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Are the comply tips (T400) like the JVC Marshmallow tips? I fear these are the only kind of tips I can stomach for prolonged periods.


----------



## Davidisawesome

I've finally decided on the Brainwavz m2. thanks for all the help


----------



## Davidisawesome

Should I get the Brainwavz m2, MEE CC51 or the Beyerdynamic DTX 101


----------



## cibibikeru

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> I just recieved my GR02 Bass edition, very nice but I still prefer Brainwavz M1, they soud more natural, the GR02 offers better seal, more bass, that is ok, it has more treble, a little sibilant though, so in my opinion it's not better but the real difference are the mids I think, when I listen to the M1 everything sounds more natural, fuller, it's like when the sound is coming from a larger speaker, the GR02 sounds a little laid back, it doesn't have the body of the M1, I hope someone who heard both understands what I'm saying. The thing is I'm looking for an upgrade over the M1, the GR02 is not what I'm looking for, I want something with a similar sound signature. I also had Soundmagic PL30, really liked those too, except too much mids, not too much bass, not as natural sounding, poor seal, but still the right sound signature, what should I look for? What sounds similar but better? I listen mostly to rock/pop on sansa clip+ rockboxed, flac/mp3 320k.
> 
> I would like an M1 with more bass and bass extension but not too much, better treble and treble extension but not sibilant, I don't like the tendancy towards sibilance on GR02, better everything else, a very natural sound,* if I close my eyes while I listen to music on these earphones, I want to find myself in the studio where the recording has been made, with the band singing in front of me, that is the ideea right? *Am I looking for a balanced or analytical earphone?


 
   
  Quote:


> What you're looking for would probably be called 'musical'. Clearly you need to stay away from v-shaped earphones. You might like one of the higher-end HiFiMan sets - the warmer RE262 or the brighter RE272, the Westone UM3X, or the Shure SE530/SE535.


 
   
  Something less expensive? How about Brainwavz M2 or a balanced armature like Astrotec AM-90/Meelec A151, I've been reading about them, never heard a balanced armature before, do they share something with M1?


----------



## suman134

you said you made up your mind , dont think so much man , just pick one and stick to it , or you can buy them all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 .


----------



## suman134

cibibikeru , never heard a m1 , but how much balanced sound you want , cuz a151 is really balanced , it wont do much bass , not like the gr02 , may be 40% of the gr02 . you have a gr02 and m1 , buying a nice BA with nice clarity wont hurt , these are going at nearly $50 , and really nice value . the a151 will do nice clarity all over the spectrum .


----------



## Davidisawesome

Yes I said I decided, but there are so many to choose from.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Yes I said I decided, but there are so many to choose from.


----------



## suman134

DemonFox have you seen the variation in the price of your prefered earphones , sm 03 to eterna ? really ? yeah bass head okay , tf10 dont have huge rumble , gr07 is nearly same , just a bit thick , re 262 dose nearly same , cant say about sm or velodyne , but the eterna dose the biggest bass of these all . so i would say , why settle for one when you can have two or three ? get the tf10 and gr07 ( needs extensive burnin 100 hrs ) and squeeze in the eterna or vplus . or you can get the turbine pro gold  , rp-hje-900 .


----------



## i_don't_know

If I was looking for a similar IEM to replace the original Phonak PFE (used with gray filters) with a budget of $150, would the DBA-02/Brainwavz B2 be a good choice? My PFEs just broke and I've loved everything about them from first listen, but sadly their  price has been raised and I'm a broke college student so those extra $30 puts them out of my range


----------



## suman134

you are messing it up , you know ask anyone , none of the earphones are perfect ( joker says um miracle are perfect for him , i cant even think of them after seeing the price ) , so find one with good service support , and what you want from it , it seems your stuck at the dtx 101 , get them , they are not bad , but you said you need some less bass and more clarity , for that , dont think , just go for cc51 .


----------



## Nupie

suman134 said:


> for sweat you need sweat proof earphone


 
   
   
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I don't think any of the IEMs in this thread aside from the H2O Audio


 
   
  Thanks, guys. I'll probably try H2O Trax custom fit and purchase separate phones for when I'm not doing sports.


----------



## suman134

that will be the best idea .


----------



## suman134

the ue 350 is water resistant .


----------



## gadiletta

Hello, someone can make a compare between xe200pro and brainwavz m4? I really don't know which to buy.


----------



## Davidisawesome

your right, I being too picky. i'll get the brainwavz


----------



## cibibikeru

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> cibibikeru , never heard a m1 , but how much balanced sound you want , cuz a151 is really balanced , it wont do much bass , not like the gr02 , may be 40% of the gr02 . you have a gr02 and m1 , buying a nice BA with nice clarity wont hurt , these are going at nearly $50 , and really nice value . the a151 will do nice clarity all over the spectrum .


 
   
  I think I will order the Astrotec AM-90, I hope I'll stick to it although bass on GR02 sounds good 
  What about the dual BA like Brainwavz B2? Do they sound a lot better than single armature? If I knew that they were the perfect IEMs for me I would probably be making an effort to buying them.. After all, life is short, right?


----------



## Harijs

Can't wait UE 10 review... Please?


----------



## suman134

dual ba are not hugely different and are not best at bass , most of them do flat frequency , what they tend to do is speed and texture , my ue 600 and 700 sound nearly same , but the ue 700 are faster , better highs and nice body . b2 is not different at all . for starter stick to single ba , better single ba are nearly on the mark with the dual BAs like sba-3 . your choice , its all on you and the main question is what you want ? just wanna say its your first BA , dont rush in , but the b2 are really awesome , a tad better then my ue 700 , auditioned extensively , cuz i was getting mad for them , but settled for xba-3 cuz they sounded better to me with a bit more bass , b2 sounded nearly exactly same to my ue 700 . i would say get the am-90 , if you need more get the b2 .


----------



## cibibikeru

suman134 said:


> dual ba are not hugely different and are not best at bass , most of them do flat frequency , what they tend to do is speed and texture , my ue 600 and 700 sound nearly same , but the ue 700 are faster , better highs and nice body . b2 is not different at all . for starter stick to single ba , better single ba are nearly on the mark with the dual BAs like sba-3 . your choice , its all on you and the main question is what you want ? just wanna say its your first BA , dont rush in , but the b2 are really awesome , a tad better then my ue 700 , auditioned extensively , cuz i was getting mad for them , but settled for xba-3 cuz they sounded better to me with a bit more bass , b2 sounded nearly exactly same to my ue 700 . i would say get the am-90 , if you need more get the b2 .



Thank you very much, I will order the AM-90, I was going to anyway, I'm thinking the exact same thing, it's my first BA, maybe I won't feel the need for more.


----------



## DemonFox

suman134 said:


> DemonFox have you seen the variation in the price of your prefered earphones , sm 03 to eterna ? really ? yeah bass head okay , tf10 dont have huge rumble , gr07 is nearly same , just a bit thick , re 262 dose nearly same , cant say about sm or velodyne , but the eterna dose the biggest bass of these all . so i would say , why settle for one when you can have two or three ? get the tf10 and gr07 ( needs extensive burnin 100 hrs ) and squeeze in the eterna or vplus . or you can get the turbine pro gold  , rp-hje-900 .




Exactly, that was kind of my point. I want the SM3 but is it going to be worth it to me to spend that much when I can get what I want for less. I've heard that the SM3 has an excellent quality bass but "may" lack quantity so I was curious if the GR07 would fit the bill or like you said would I be better getting the TripleFi 10 and VPulse instead of just the SM3-V2. Now if there are any SM3-V2 owners out there that will say otherwise please speak up. They don't have to shake buildings but they do need a personality if that makes any sense... 

So to sum it up are the Earsonics that much better than the 10's and Vsonics. Can I get the opinion of some owners please so I can get a real idea of what to expect. 

Thank guys..


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Wow, the Sony Hybrid tips really boosted the comfort and seal on the Turbines. Those stock tips are horrible on the ears. My only grip is all the crackling while inserting the the Hybrids in your ears


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> your right, I being too picky. i'll get the brainwavz


 
   
  Well, I have a Meelectronics M6 along with a Brainwavz M4 both bought from their official websites, I listened to a lot of hours on both of them, burned 50+ houts and imo M4 is really over hyped. It was really ordinary, M6 has better bass+mids, its high is not good but M4 was too trebly. Bass was very light, but mids and highs are a bit good but not too good and often look like they are too treble based. I almost felt like how I spent 70 $ where Im more than satisfied with my 28$ m6.
   
  Better change your choice bro, Go for VSonic GR06/ Brainwavz B2!


----------



## cibibikeru

I bought 2 pairs of M4 from their official website too, very dissapointed, I sold both immediatley, they have a harsh zone at the point where mids end and treble begin, also they don't extend much in treble, I find the sound agressive, although others may like it..


----------



## dfrost

cibibikeru said:


> Thank you very much, I will order the AM-90, I was going to anyway, I'm thinking the exact same thing, it's my first BA, maybe I won't feel the need for more.



I see that Amazon is now carrying AM-90's. Lendmeurears is also a good source, but the alternate Chinese source (englishtaobao.com, that offered different colors) burned me with slow and very expensive shipping.

I enjoyed them for the time before they went to my daughter as a gift (delayed by that Chinese source), but my DBA-02's are distinctly better - not hugely, but noticeably so. I would have been quite happy with the Astrotecs as my only IEMS - they are far superior to my early IEMs - but as we know, head-fi followers are insatiable upgraders.


----------



## cibibikeru

I ordered the silver standard version from lendmeurears, I can't wait to hear them, maybe I'll go >100$ in the future if it's really worth it..


----------



## thesuperguy

Does anyone here think it's worth spending that extra 8 dollars to upgrade from a vsonic gr99 to the vsonic gr02? From the looks of things, it doesn't seem like the gr02 is a major improvement over the gr99 but rather a nice and small upgrade. Please take into consideration only the sound itself and less on the other aspects as they are not of as much importance to me. Oh and how do these IEMs fare when playing alternative rock as that is what my library is mainly composed of.
   
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> Does anyone here think it's worth spending that extra 8 dollars to upgrade from a vsonic gr99 to the vsonic gr02? From the looks of things, it doesn't seem like the gr02 is a major improvement over the gr99 but rather a nice and small upgrade. Please take into consideration only the sound itself and less on the other aspects as they are not of as much importance to me. Oh and how do these IEMs fare when playing alternative rock as that is what my library is mainly composed of.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
   
  Well, it depends. For me the GR02 Bass is worth the upgrade as its mids are cleaner and the treble is a lot more to my liking for just 8 bucks difference. About your last question - the GR02 is great with any kind of metal or rock and just makes me get up and do air drums and guitar solos.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Well, it depends. For me the GR02 Bass is worth the upgrade as its mids are cleaner and the treble is a lot more to my liking for just 8 bucks difference. About your last question - the GR02 is great with any kind of metal or rock and just makes me get up and do air drums and guitar solos.


 
  I have the 02 BE and a friend the 99. The 99 is larger, and harder to fit as well. The accessories also aren't as nice. If you don't care about the accessories, then you can get the 02 from lendmeurears for even less without all of the tips.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





demonfox said:


> First off Joker I've been reading this forum for weeks now and I love it!! Everyday I learn something new so thank you for helping and doing what you did here its freak'n awesome!!
> 
> Ok, guys I need some help..
> 
> ...


 
   
  Cleanest, punchiest, and fastest bass will probably mean less bass quantity and vice versa. The GR07 is clean and punchy but not 'bassy'. The Eterna and vPulse are bassy but not as clean. For heavy but high quality bass the best earphone I've heard is still the JVC FX700, but you probably won't find a new one in your budget. Still, I think the GR07 might not have quite enough midbass for a self-proclaimed basshead - I feel like the Yamaha EPH-100 or JVC FX500 would be a better choice in that price range.
   
  Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> Something less expensive? How about Brainwavz M2 or a balanced armature like Astrotec AM-90/Meelec A151, I've been reading about them, never heard a balanced armature before, do they share something with M1?


 
   
  Nice but definitely a sidegrade from the M1 more so than an upgrade. 
    
  Quote:


i_don't_know said:


> If I was looking for a similar IEM to replace the original Phonak PFE (used with gray filters) with a budget of $150, would the DBA-02/Brainwavz B2 be a good choice? My PFEs just broke and I've loved everything about them from first listen, but sadly their  price has been raised and I'm a broke college student so those extra $30 puts them out of my range


 
   
  I would definitely try the B2 instead of paying $170+ for another PFE. 
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> you are messing it up , you know ask anyone , none of the earphones are perfect ( *joker says um miracle are perfect for him *, i cant even think of them after seeing the price ) , so find one with good service support , and what you want from it , it seems your stuck at the dtx 101 , get them , they are not bad , but you said you need some less bass and more clarity , for that , dont think , just go for cc51 .


 
   
   
  I've never said the Miracle can't be improved on, only that it's the best IEM I've heard to date by a margin.
   
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> the ue 350 is water resistant .


 
   
  Good catch.
    
  Quote:


mad lust envy said:


> Wow, the Sony Hybrid tips really boosted the comfort and seal on the Turbines. Those stock tips are horrible on the ears. My only grip is all the crackling while inserting the the Hybrids in your ears


 
   
  That's driver flex - the Monster Turbine IEMs are quite notorious for it. 
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> Does anyone here think it's worth spending that extra 8 dollars to upgrade from a vsonic gr99 to the vsonic gr02? From the looks of things, it doesn't seem like the gr02 is a major improvement over the gr99 but rather a nice and small upgrade. Please take into consideration only the sound itself and less on the other aspects as they are not of as much importance to me. Oh and how do these IEMs fare when playing alternative rock as that is what my library is mainly composed of.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
   
  For $8 I would do it just for the comfort. Both would be too bassy for me for rock but if you want heavy bass/v-shaped sound they are among the best in the <$100 range.


----------



## suman134

thats the only reason i was stressing on cc51 , m4 is a hit and miss .


----------



## suman134

never mind man .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

I'm gonna order the comply tips for the Turbines. I'm sure I'll have to EQ the hell out of them with the tips, but I need comfort. The Hybrids are starting to bother me. I almost feel like getting the JVC Marshmallows just so I can nab the tips, but I'd like to try the Comply first.


----------



## suman134

hey  joker , you think ue350 is not water resistant ?


----------



## suman134

comply are good , but they dont last more then 3-6 months unless you clean them every month , whats wrong with monster faom tips ? i love that , cuz they dont catch dirt and easy to clean . or even the soundmagic foam tips ? monster are equally priced but the soundmagic are really cheap .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

I dunno, I just heard of Comply's awesome comfort, which is why I went for them.


----------



## suman134

didnt your turbine came with foam tips ? all the foam tips are nearly same n comly are hyped heavily . the only thing over monster is comly are squeeze able .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

No, it's all silicone.


----------



## suman134

thats bad , my friends pro gold came with those foam tips . then try the comply .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

I got the basic Turbines, so I'm sure it doesn't have all the bells and whistles as the Pros. And lol, I already ordered them. So i basically wasted $12 on the Sony Hybrids ($4 to ship next day)... :rolleyes:


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> I'm gonna order the comply tips for the Turbines. I'm sure I'll have to EQ the hell out of them with the tips, but I need comfort. The Hybrids are starting to bother me. I almost feel like getting the JVC Marshmallows just so I can nab the tips, but I'd like to try the Comply first.


 
   
  There are foam tips beyond Complys - Complys are simply the most well-known but Monster's own Foam Supertips and generic foam tips from ebay are closer to marshmallow tips and generally last longer.
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> hey  joker , you think ue350 is not water resistant ?


 
   
  I didn't test them. The UE site says they are, I'm just surprised it wasn't stressed on the packaging.


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Hmm, I'll have to cancel my order and get those then. You think they're better suited, comfort to sound quality-wise? I use the medium tips on both the stock Monster tips that came with the Turbines, and the Sony Hybrids.

http://www.amazon.com/Bluecell-Medium-Eartips-earbuds-earphones/dp/B0055XHMXK/ref=pd_sim_sbs_e_3

Think these would work?


----------



## szjwt63v

i think worst customer service mp4nation. i don't recommend mp4nation and brainwavz.


----------



## Ziilot

szjwt63v said:


> i think worst customer service mp4nation. i don't recommend mp4nation and brainwavz.



 
 Care to elaborate?


----------



## Emospence

Quote: 





ziilot said:


> Care to elaborate?


 
  I wanna hear this too :/


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





emospence said:


> I wanna hear this too :/


 
  I second that opinion. I ordered a brainwavz M4 from Mp4nation and its horrible.Too Trebly and meelectronics m6 was better for me. Its also differed in cable quality from the pics in the official site. Gave Mp4nation many emails about the same and they never bothered to reply back. I am assuming I didnt get a fake one, but M4 was horrible and I sold it off immediately!


----------



## szjwt63v

deleted


----------



## Yloss

Tks guys for al the replies/suggestions!
  Found a very nice offer on Amazon for the MEE A161P and took the chance.
  They just delivered it and im going to try them a bit on lunch break.
  I'm also very interested in the mic version of the Phonak Perfect Bass, i could give em a try in case im not too happy with the A161P (my gf is after a new pair of IEM too so i could eventually pass her on the A161P)
   
Cheers!


----------



## suman134

exactly . i have tested , they should put that on the box , it can be a selling point .


----------



## yaz125

Hey folkes
   
  NOOB alert 
   
  First of all  big kudos 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 to JOKER <.respect.> for these amazing reviews. It helped me ( immensely  to narrow down my choices.( infact confused me intially by a massive list 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  However, I am still a  bit!!! confused about the best possible headphones.
   
  My first headphones -apart from  stock apple/sony stock earphones were soundmagic e10. Mostly I loved e10 especially for its heavy bass and that high end spectacle. After loosing them I recently ordered, Phonak Audeo 022. However I was disappointed with them big time ( not high enough output for me, very thin bass and only came with green filters ). Ultimately I ended up returnin them.
   
  But from well detailed reviews I have narrowed down my search on basis of sound preference*-bit bass heavy ( punchy but not overpowering), clarity and excellent vocals is equally important*, 
  availbility on amazon uk and
  inline mic (willing to compromise if it's a major facor).
   
  With Inline Mic
  fischer audio ETERNA or CONSONANCE  ( with inline mic not sure about specified sound pref.).
  Beyerdynamic MMX101 iE
  Puresound CLARITYONE
  MEElectronics A161P
  Bose MIE2i
  Soul by ludacris
  Monster turbine
  Klipsch x10i - heavy on my pocket but can give a shot.
  soundmagic e10 ( last option )
   
  w/o inline mic
  fuure sonic MG7
  Yamaha EPH-100
  Shure Se215
  Vsonic GR07
  JVC HA-FX90
  ID AMERICA Spark .
   
  So, can you please please suggest me one from each with or w/o inline mic and best of all??
 Apologies for being demading ( but have never seen anyone responding in a more enthusiatic way you do). 
   
  Cheers

 PS - Help from other forum member will be much appreciated-especially for bose mie2, monster by dr dre/diddy beats and soul by ludricious.


----------



## suman134

for mic , klipsch x10i any day , as your a bass lover, for budget get the meelec a161p . with out mic is a tough one between the vsonic and yamaha . vsonic gr07 i think has more bass and may have side effects at start , have never heard a yamaha eph 100 .


----------



## hitme987

Hey joker, can you consider reviewing Meelectronics A161 P?


----------



## ItsMeHere

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Hey joker, can you consider reviewing Meelectronics A161 P?


 
  The Fischer Audio SBA-03, which was already reviewed in this thread, is actually a rebrand of the same product with some different accessories and without a mic.


----------



## FABZ

This is beautiful! Thank you so much!!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> Hmm, I'll have to cancel my order and get those then. You think they're better suited, comfort to sound quality-wise? I use the medium tips on both the stock Monster tips that came with the Turbines, and the Sony Hybrids.
> http://www.amazon.com/Bluecell-Medium-Eartips-earbuds-earphones/dp/B0055XHMXK/ref=pd_sim_sbs_e_3
> Think these would work?


 
   
  Those seem like generic ebay foamies but I'm not sure about the sizing. Their foam is more similar to Marshmallow tips than Complys are. Complys are softer and more porous - potentially a bit more comfortable but they do wear out much quicker. I would try the Complys if you've already ordered them and then consider other options once you wear them out. 
   
   
  Quote: 





yloss said:


> Tks guys for al the replies/suggestions!
> Found a very nice offer on Amazon for the MEE A161P and took the chance.
> They just delivered it and im going to try them a bit on lunch break.
> I'm also very interested in the mic version of the Phonak Perfect Bass, i could give em a try in case im not too happy with the A161P (my gf is after a new pair of IEM too so i could eventually pass her on the A161P)
> ...


 
   
  The Phonaks will be a little different - bassier and warmer but also boomier and not as transparent in the midrange. For the most raw and clean sound the A161P/SBA-03 is actually very difficult to beat in my experience.
   
    
  Quote:


yaz125 said:


> Hey folkes
> 
> NOOB alert
> 
> ...


 
   
  Your list seems a little confused there - the Eterna and Consonance don't have mic version as far as I know while the id America Spark always has a mic and the Shure SE215 has it as an option. In terms of bass output I don't think you would like the A161P and probably not even the GR07 - neither is significantly bassier than the Phonak 022. The rest of these tend to be pretty bass-heavy but the price ranges are pretty scattered. If you like the E10M you probably won't find the MMX101iE, id Spark, or Turbine to be a large enough upgrade to justify the price hike. If I had to pick two without the mic it would be the EPH-100 or FXT90. With the mic, another E10M would probably be the safest choice. After that - the SE215 (which may not have enough treble sparkle compared to the E10) or the Puresound C1 (which may have too much treble and not enough note thickness).
   
   
  Quote: 





itsmehere said:


> The Fischer Audio SBA-03, which was already reviewed in this thread, is actually a rebrand of the same product with some different accessories and without a mic.


 
   
  This is correct. If I get my hands on the MEElec version at some point I"ll add it to the chart with its own accessory & build scores but sound-wise they should be an exact match for the Fischer SBA-03. 
   
   
  Quote: 





fabz said:


> This is beautiful! Thank you so much!!!


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

ljokerl said:


> Those seem like generic ebay foamies but I'm not sure about the sizing. Their foam is more similar to Marshmallow tips than Complys are. Complys are softer and more porous - potentially a bit more comfortable but they do wear out much quicker. I would try the Complys if you've already ordered them and then consider other options once you wear them out.




Amazon decided for me, as I wasn't able to cancel the order and the Comply tips will be here tomorrow. It's a good thing as if it did cancel, I would've re-ordered them.

If they don't work out, I'll try the generic ones next, though not sure on the size, as they say medium feels like extra small. Oh, blind purchases. :rolleyes:

I got the Turbines for $75, and now it's beginning to be more like $100+ due to all these damn tips.


----------



## yaz125

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those seem like generic ebay foamies but I'm not sure about the sizing. Their foam is more similar to Marshmallow tips than Complys are. Complys are softer and more porous - potentially a bit more comfortable but they do wear out much quicker. I would try the Complys if you've already ordered them and then consider other options once you wear them out.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  THanks Joker, for the info.. Much appreciated..
 I  guess I may stick with E10. But on a last note do you think Atrio MG7 ( mobile version ) will be better with the specified sound preference ( in the line of e10) ??


----------



## hitme987

Hey Joker , I thank you a lot for these reviews. I have bought a Meelectronics M6 as my first IEM based on your review and it was EXACTLY how you described. 
   
  I am looking for a new pair with more budget (100~160$), I have searched the reviews of head-fi and one of Brainwavz B2, Hifiman Re 262 and VSonic GR 07 could be the perfect match for me.
   
  I basically want one for thrash/speedy metal, having reasonable mid-bass and mids,high as good as possible, and it shouldnt be much treble based such as Brainwavz M4. I want one for comfort, durability for atleast 2-3 years, best isolation and (optionally) with an inline microphone (only Etymotic Hf2/3/5 seems to have it, as it doesnt sound as good as RE262/GR07, a better alternative could be appreciated!)  
   
  Sound quality comes first and then accessories(microphone etc). So what do you suggest me to buy Joker ? Any other IEM suggestions that  you can give apart from the ones you mentioned?
  
  Thanks for your time!
   
  Regards.


----------



## Harijs

Hey Joker,
  Thank's a lot for these huge reviews.
  Will you review UE Triple Fi 10 someday?
  Interesting, which place my only IEM's takse in your comparison table.
  Thanks!


----------



## viveksaikia22

Hey Joker, Thanks for your humongous review.
   
  I have the *RE262 *and the* ATH CK10*. Both are really great warriers in their own arenas. Having said that, I somehow keep longing for that perfect sound even though these two keep surprising me from time to time.
  I sometimes find the RE262 too dull for some music and the ATH CK10 are definitely way too bright for me.
  Just for reference, I just love the sound signature of my modded Fostex T50RPs headphones. The natural mids and silky smooth highs are just to die for! The bass is also very fast and impactful, but never overwhelming. Only problem is their portability.
   
  I am searching for an IEM with similar sound traits as my Fostex. Any suggestion here? 
   
  Just to summarise, following are my requirements:
   1. Quick and natural bass. I can't stand boominess.
   2. Natural midrange. I don't want the midrange bump.
   3. Very silky smooth highs. I am sensitive to sibilance. For reference, I find the ATH CK10 "too" bright.
   
  Any suggestions for this deranged soul?


----------



## Niyologist

Hello fellow Headfiers. If you are a huge fan of music and love Fiio products, please "Like" the Fiio FB Page.
   
http://www.facebook.com/FiiOAUDIO
   
  That would be very nice. Have a nice day.


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

So I got my comply tips. HUGE comfort boost, but now everything is leaning too far into the bass side, and treble is really smoothed over. Good thing I EQ with my Fuze. Lol.


----------



## kwkarth

mad lust envy said:


> So I got my comply tips. HUGE comfort boost, but now everything is leaning too far into the bass side, and treble is really smoothed over. Good thing I EQ with my Fuze. Lol.






you can restore the missing highs when using Comply tips by shortening the length of the ear tip


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Alright, I'll try that. They are definitely long. Any method of doing this properly? Like reversing them first then using scissors, then flip them back over?


----------



## viveksaikia22

Which comply tips you are using?
  I have decreased the highs by -6dB in Rockbox to tame the highs while using the stock tips and they are sounding way too better now. Infact, I am loving them! Still would like to try out different tips as I don't want to change the freq setting in my source.


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

T400 medium. On the Turbines, its incredibly muffled sounding without EQ. I'll shorten the tips when I get home.


----------



## suman134

if you guys dont like highs , foam tips are best , rubber tips give more highs then  soft rubber , then silicone .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

I'm somewhat of a treblehead, so the foam tips were really bad for me sound-wise in stock form.


----------



## suman134

try the sony hybrids  , those without foam inside .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

I bought the Sony Hybrids. They're not much better than the stock tips in comfort. Comfort is priority one.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





yaz125 said:


> THanks Joker, for the info.. Much appreciated..
> I  guess I may stick with E10. But on a last note do you think Atrio MG7 ( mobile version ) will be better with the specified sound preference ( in the line of e10) ??


 
   
  The MG7 is a little different from the E10 - it'll have more subbass and maybe not enough mid-bass, plus less treble sparkle and a narrower soundstage in exchange for a less vague sonic image and better detail and clarity. I am also not aware of an MG7 with mic, only the lower-end Atrio X.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Hey Joker , I thank you a lot for these reviews. I have bought a Meelectronics M6 as my first IEM based on your review and it was EXACTLY how you described.
> 
> I am looking for a new pair with more budget (100~160$), I have searched the reviews of head-fi and one of Brainwavz B2, Hifiman Re 262 and VSonic GR 07 could be the perfect match for me.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've never heard the Brainwavz M4. Also, it's hard to say which of the IEMs will be durable for several years. partly because it depends heavily on how you treat them. I had a pair of RE0s for over a year and they still looked and sounded like new when I sold them. Others have had trouble getting six months' use out them. 
   
  Having to have a mic really narrows things down. The HF2/3 is very good and certainly can compete with the best in the price range. However, I am not sure what mid-bass level you consider reasonable - the HF2/3 has no mid-bass boost. An alternative would be to buy the Phonak Perfect Bass (022) and an additional filter pack to turn them into 122s if necessary. 
   
  If you drop the mic requirement, there's tons of options. The RE262 might not be heavy enough on the treble and the B2 might not have enough bass but the GR07, FXT90, or EPH-100 should be fine. The EPH-100 will have more mid-bass than the GR07 and potentially less fatiguing treble, It also isolates a lot. 
   
  Quote: 





harijs said:


> Hey Joker,
> Thank's a lot for these huge reviews.
> Will you review UE Triple Fi 10* someday*?
> Interesting, which place my only IEM's takse in your comparison table.
> Thanks!


 
   
  Someday... 
   




   
  Quote: 





viveksaikia22 said:


> Hey Joker, Thanks for your humongous review.
> 
> I have the *RE262 *and the* ATH CK10*. Both are really great warriers in their own arenas. Having said that, I somehow keep longing for that perfect sound even though these two keep surprising me from time to time.
> I sometimes find the RE262 too dull for some music and the ATH CK10 are definitely way too bright for me.
> ...


 
   
  I've never heard the T50RP but it sounds like you need to sell the RE262 and CK10 both and go for an RE272 (assuming you don't find the midrange presence on the RE262 excessive) or Ety ER4S. The Westone 4 may also be a good option, but pricy in comparison. They will have much more impact, though. Again, not sure what the T50RP sounds like so I am not sure what the balance you are looking for is. Most armature-based IEMs will not sound bloated or boomy, though.


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Edit: damn, one of my Turbine's screens is missing... doesn't sound like did anything SQ though...

Okay, so I shortened the tips, and it made it better in the treble, but still too muffled for my liking. Looks like I may have to stick to the Sony Hybrids, and deal with the comfrt loss. They are still better than the stock tips.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Final Audio FI-BA-SB Heaven S and FI-BA-SA Heaven A. Huge thanks to james444 for the loaners!
   
  Also, updated link to downloadable comparison chart for those who like to play with the numbers. The chart is now current as of 07/23/2012. It can be downloaded here and is provided by *carfentanil*.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1C17) Final Audio Design FI-BA-SB “Heaven S”*
> 
> Added June 2012
> 
> ...


----------



## suman134

man , really , weighty ? i think heavy is easy .
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 . the price is a bit high man .


----------



## phantompersona

Great review as always! FAD is overpriced and outmatched by lower priced competitors. Can't wait for your review on the MDR-7550. I hear it might make a good companion with my Hifiman RE262 since i love great mids


----------



## scootsit

I'm really excited to hear your thoughts about the newer Sunrise stuff. Given your last review on the Xcape, one of their newer IEMs may be my next purchase
   
  Also, have you heard the Vsonic GR04 at all? Vsonic's ridiculous name changes makes finding comparisons to the GR06 near impossible. Evidently, the contemporary version is not the same as the Flagship, which may have edged out the GR06. Anyway, I'm at a bit of a loss, but leaning toward the GR06, would love to hear your thoughts on the GR04, if you have any.


----------



## Davidisawesome

What would you say is the best bassy IEM in the 100 dollar price range.


----------



## Cotnijoe

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> What would you say is the best bassy IEM in the 100 dollar price range.


 
  maybe shure SE215 :O


----------



## suman134

meelec a161 / fischer audio sba-3 . or high sound crystal .


----------



## FieldingMellish

Sony MDR-XB90EX.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Joker, what do you think


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Great review as always! FAD is overpriced and outmatched by lower priced competitors. Can't wait for your review on the MDR-7550. I hear it might make a good companion with my Hifiman RE262 since i love great mids


 
   
  I don't know if I would be comfortable calling something as unique as the FADs 'overpriced', which is why their value scores are reasonably high. I can see myself recommending them to someone even at those prices if the signature is a match. Can't say the same for a Sony XBA-4 or B&W C5, for example. 
   
  The 7550 is an interesting earphone, I rather like it. 
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I'm really excited to hear your thoughts about the newer Sunrise stuff. Given your last review on the Xcape, one of their newer IEMs may be my next purchase
> 
> Also, have you heard the Vsonic GR04 at all? Vsonic's ridiculous name changes makes finding comparisons to the GR06 near impossible. Evidently, the contemporary version is not the same as the Flagship, which may have edged out the GR06. Anyway, I'm at a bit of a loss, but leaning toward the GR06, would love to hear your thoughts on the GR04, if you have any.


 
   
  I already reviewed the Xcited and Xcape IE in a separate thread but they broke before I could add them to this review and I haven't managed to get a replacement yet. 
   
  I've never heard any of the GR04s.
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Joker, what do you think


 
   
  It's not a very specific question. Depends on whether you're looking for quality or quantity, mid-bass or sub-bass (or a balance of the two), how much you're willing to sacrifice elsewhere etc. The SE215, for example, is nice and punchy but it doesn't have the ridiculous impact of something like an XB40EX or MEElec M31. The Hippo VB has great extension and rumble but again doesn't move a whole lot of air compared to an XB40. The VSonic GR02 Bass Edition is one of the better bass-heavy earphones I've heard without being a bass monster, but it's got a v-shaped signature some may not like.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't know if I would be comfortable calling something as unique as the FADs 'overpriced', which is why their value scores are reasonably high. I can see myself recommending them to someone even at those prices if the signature is a match. Can't say the same for a Sony XBA-4 or B&W C5, for example.
> 
> The 7550 is an interesting earphone, I rather like it.
> 
> ...


 

 Thank you sir for the info!


----------



## Killbox

Would like to get a pair of in-ears with the same sound signature as my primary headphones Denon Ah-d7000.My price target is below 200 $.  They are going to be used with Sandisk sansa clip+ and galaxy nexus. I mainly listen to house-music while on the go, so good bass is important. Any suggestions?


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've never heard the Brainwavz M4. Also, it's hard to say which of the IEMs will be durable for several years. partly because it depends heavily on how you treat them. I had a pair of RE0s for over a year and they still looked and sounded like new when I sold them. Others have had trouble getting six months' use out them.
> 
> Having to have a mic really narrows things down. The HF2/3 is very good and certainly can compete with the best in the price range. However, I am not sure what mid-bass level you consider reasonable - the HF2/3 has no mid-bass boost. An alternative would be to buy the Phonak Perfect Bass (022) and an additional filter pack to turn them into 122s if necessary.
> 
> If you drop the mic requirement, there's tons of options. The RE262 might not be heavy enough on the treble and the B2 might not have enough bass but the GR07, FXT90, or EPH-100 should be fine. The EPH-100 will have more mid-bass than the GR07 and potentially less fatiguing treble, It also isolates a lot.


 
   
  OK since Im not perfect in technical stuff. I would just like to have an upgraded version of MEE M6 with good bass, mid-bass, warm mids and highs should be as comfortable as possible. 
   
  FXT90 is not over ear so I could remove from consideration(I hate straight down) . EPH-100 seems to have cable microphonics ,build quality issues and also some fit and comfort issues. Else it also looks good.
   
  It looks like all options are closing on RE 262,GR 07 without mic and phonak 122 with mic. I am also looking on taking RE 262, but I heard that it needs some powering with an amp or driving or something. All I have is an android phone (both Samsung Galaxy Y and S3), I know nothing about amps and stuff, which of GR 07/RE 262 would be good to buy for my needs? Does buying RE262 needs some technical knowledge ? Since both you and ClieOS rated 262 over 07 and Im wondering whats so special about it


----------



## qilto

My RE262s finally arrived, and they sound amazing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Unamped, they really drain the J3 though... too bad it sounds better out of the J3 to me then it does from the Fiio E5.


----------



## Davidisawesome

Your review of the DTX 101 doesn't sound like a 7.4. Do you like them?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





killbox said:


> Would like to get a pair of in-ears with the same sound signature as my primary headphones Denon Ah-d7000.My price target is below 200 $.  They are going to be used with Sandisk sansa clip+ and galaxy nexus. I mainly listen to house-music while on the go, so good bass is important. Any suggestions?


 
   
  I am not familiar with the D7000. In that price range the Yamaha EPH-100 reminds me of the D2000 a little - solid, extended bass, warmish tone, decent but not particularly crisp treble.
   
  Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> OK since Im not perfect in technical stuff. I would just like to have an upgraded version of MEE M6 with good bass, mid-bass, warm mids and highs should be as comfortable as possible.
> 
> FXT90 is not over ear so I could remove from consideration(I hate straight down) . EPH-100 seems to have cable microphonics ,build quality issues and also some fit and comfort issues. Else it also looks good.
> 
> It looks like all options are closing on RE 262,GR 07 without mic and phonak 122 with mic. I am also looking on taking RE 262, but I heard that it needs some powering with an amp or driving or something. All I have is an android phone (both Samsung Galaxy Y and S3), I know nothing about amps and stuff, which of GR 07/RE 262 would be good to buy for my needs? Does buying RE262 needs some technical knowledge ? Since both you and ClieOS rated 262 over 07 and Im wondering whats so special about it


 
   
  The RE262 sounds nothing like the M6 - the M6 tends to be a little v-shaped.while the RE262 is mid-centric if anything. Also, I don't know of any build quality issues with the EPH-100 and the cable noise is fine with over-the-ear wear. If you like the enhanced bass of the M6, the EPH-100 is probably closer to what you want than the RE262 or GR07. 
    
  Quote:


qilto said:


> My RE262s finally arrived, and they sound amazing.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The E5 is hit or miss in my experience. An old-fashioned mini3 or even a decent cmoy will work better but may not be worth the extra bulk. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> Your review of the DTX 101 doesn't sound like a 7.4. Do you like them?


 
   
  Warm and bassy isn't my kind of sound but they do perform well for what they are. I still have my pair of MMX101s - they make for a good casual listening set.


----------



## Davidisawesome

and how do you compare the dtx 101 to the brainwavz m2


----------



## suman134

go for dtx 101 , better choice of the two .


----------



## Davidisawesome

suman, for some odd reason I think you are just saying random things and you don't know anything about headphones. What's with your grammar anyway.


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The RE262 sounds nothing like the M6 - the M6 tends to be a little v-shaped.while the RE262 is mid-centric if anything. Also, I don't know of any build quality issues with the EPH-100 and the cable noise is fine with over-the-ear wear. If you like the enhanced bass of the M6, the EPH-100 is probably closer to what you want than the RE262 or GR07.


 
   
  Hmm.. then my options narrow down to GR 07 and EPH 100. I cant understand really, you gave a 8.5/10 for EPH-100 and youre saying it better suits me than a 9.5/10 GR 07. Is GR 07 analytical? Which of EPH-100 and GR-07 is warm+sweet? I did like M6 only for its bass, it was pretty lacking on highs and mids. Only the triple flanges on M6 did gave me some comfort and the rest of the single/double flange tips were painful and uncomfortable for me. Since I can use my M6s triple flanges, GR 07 could be comfortable. Whats about the EPH -100? The M6s tips dont fit on those, so do they fit enough well in my ear? EPH-100 seems to be a bit costly over GR 07 (180$ over 149$ since I live far away in India, shipping for EPH-100 is high), so I would like to consider buying EPH-100 if its really a great improvement over GR 07. 
   
  Thanks for your time and replies joker. I am just trying to be sure because I want this IEM to be lasting for 2-3 years and I do manage the phones well, so I guess it could be possible. I appreciate your time on this 
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> go for dtx 101 , better choice of the two .


 
   
    
  A IEM is not simply better than other , every IEM has a + and -. You should add some technical terms before just saying its better.


----------



## Davidisawesome

blah


----------



## suman134

man what can i say , your stuck with dtx 101 , you come up always with that , im just trying to make your way to the dtx , cuz i feel you want the dtx any way , so get the dtx 101 , why bother this much man , you cant see others clearly , cc51 or se215 , what can i say .


----------



## suman134

david wants the dtx , want me to explain with technique ? but how many times ? and david , im from china , still dont see any thing wrong .
        and for you hitme987 , the gr07 , is a evenly weighty all over spectrum , good bass , good highs and smooth mids . mids do lack the detail and attack of top end ba like ck10 , what you get is good bass and some top of the class highs , do you want highs ? or you liked your meelec m6 with ok highs ok mids and big bass , if you dont like highs , gr07 is not a 9.1/10 for you , then comes the eph-100 , slightly bigger bass , lacks some texture and body , similar mids as the gr07 , but lacks that aggressive highs , if highs are not your priority , eph-100 can be your 9.2/10 .
        so it all come to one thing , and the most important thing .
                                                                                            " what you want ?" my dear friend .
        just one suggestion , why dont you try the xba-3 ? similar to the eph-100 . as far as i know , xba-3 are cheaper in asia , some $150 or less .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

So I went back to the comply tips (non-butchered by my hands). All I did was EQ the shortcomings, and I'm happy with it. The Turbines really are for work use while I walk around, and nothing too serious. The comfort and EQ-ed sound is all I need.


----------



## suman134

thats nice , just make a habit of cleaning the tips once in while , maybe once a week , it will help to prolong the life . there must be a instruction for that , if not let me help you , run through hot water , use a tissue paper to clean any wax on it , squeeze it to get rid of the excess water , leave it over night to dry . and you will get a longer life out of them , significantly better then the average 3 months .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Hmm.. then my options narrow down to GR 07 and EPH 100. I cant understand really, you gave a 8.5/10 for EPH-100 and youre saying it better suits me than a 9.5/10 GR 07. Is GR 07 analytical? Which of EPH-100 and GR-07 is warm+sweet? I did like M6 only for its bass, it was pretty lacking on highs and mids. Only the triple flanges on M6 did gave me some comfort and the rest of the single/double flange tips were painful and uncomfortable for me. Since I can use my M6s triple flanges, GR 07 could be comfortable. Whats about the EPH -100? The M6s tips dont fit on those, so do they fit enough well in my ear? EPH-100 seems to be a bit costly over GR 07 (180$ over 149$ since I live far away in India, shipping for EPH-100 is high), so I would like to consider buying EPH-100 if its really a great improvement over GR 07.
> 
> Thanks for your time and replies joker. I am just trying to be sure because I want this IEM to be lasting for 2-3 years and I do manage the phones well, so I guess it could be possible. I appreciate your time on this
> 
> ...


 

       so you had a m6 , go for a smaller upgrade like se215 , cuz you may not be ready for too much detail . just look at the first line and i think you need a eye test , or you indians are this bad at maths ?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> (lots and lots of questions)


 
   
  My advice to you:
   
  1. Make a numbered list of up to 6 earphones you can't decide between
  2. Throw a die
  3. Buy the phones on your numbered list that the die picks
  4. Follow my advanced EQ tutorial to make whatever phones you buy sound exactly like how you want them to sound
  4.5 Profit 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  5. Report back after a month and post a pic showing your final EQ curve
  6. Ask joker what phones would have the sound closest to your desired sound (as illustrated by your EQ on the phones you bought) so you can hopefully enjoy the same sound without EQ, or do like me and just kick back and enjoy your phones after you configure all your music and sound sources to work with the parametric EQ.  In my case I EQ'ed the $10 Philips SHE3580 and haven't heard anything I can put my hands on in the all-you-can-eat IEM auditioning buffet that is Hong Kong that sounds better than my EQ'ed SHE3580.  I'm not saying these are anything special (although people really like them at their price) because you should be able to do the same with any decent IEM.  And don't let people tell you you can't change the original sound signature of phones with EQ, because I did just that--I changed the SHE3580 from V-shaped to mid-forward, and the mids do not sound any worse for it--in fact they sound wonderful!
   
  tl;dr: with EQ just about any decent pair of phones can sound like whatever you want them to sound; here's a list of 10+ phones in my collection that I got to sound within 5% to exactly like each other using different EQ settings
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/612665/how-far-can-eq-really-go-towards-truly-equalizing-headphones/150#post_8505186


----------



## Davidisawesome

Wow, I think this might just help me


----------



## Ziilot

Hello guys!
   
  I'll need a replacement for my Ultimate Ears 700, which are going to break soon 
   
  I am currently using DTX101, but imo they are a bit muffled and not so detailed what I would want from my earphones.
   
  I loved my UE700 and I was thinking about getting Brainwavz B2, but I'm a little bit concerned about their durability. 
   
  Any other options? My budget is about 200€, and I'm not a basshead. (looking similar sound to AKG K601 / UE700 / Genelec)
   
  My source is rockboxed Fuze, without amp.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ziilot said:


> Hello guys!
> 
> I'll need a replacement for my Ultimate Ears 700, which are going to break soon
> 
> ...


 

      that was the exact case with me , the ue 700 is too fragile , had to get it replaced twice , for the third time , was forced to take some thing else so got the ue 600 , not that bad for a single BA , a bit less treble spark but really good for the price . you can get that . exactly equal bass , similar mids , better sound stage , and cheaper price and will suit your need far more better then the dtx 101 .
   
      for more expensive iem , you can consider the jays q-jays , sba-3 / meelec a161 may be eph-100 , if you can do with even lesser bass then consider the boss , ath-ck10 .


----------



## Killbox

I've read a lot of reviews now, but I can't decide on what to get. I have so far come up with three alternatives. 
   
  - Yamaha EPH100SI
  - VSONIC GR01
  - Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkii 
   
  As mentioned earlier I mainly listen to electronic music, and therefore need adequate bass.  Which one should I go for?


----------



## ItsMeHere

Quote: 





killbox said:


> I've read a lot of reviews now, but I can't decide on what to get. I have so far come up with three alternatives.
> 
> - Yamaha EPH100SI
> - VSONIC GR01
> ...


 
  The Yamahas would probably be the best out of these for electronic music. Both the DBAs and the VSonics utilize a TWFK BA driver, which is known to have a neutral bass, which won't really fit electronic music.
  Meanwhile, I didn't hear the Yamahas, but all of the reviews that I read mentioned that it had "full" and "healthy" bass, which'll be great for electronic music.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





itsmehere said:


> The Yamahas would probably be the best out of these for electronic music. Both the DBAs and the VSonics utilize a TWFK BA driver, which is known to have a neutral bass, which won't really fit electronic music.
> Meanwhile, I didn't hear the Yamahas, but all of the reviews that I read mentioned that it had "full" and "healthy" bass, which'll be great for electronic music.


 

        exactly , twfk are just above flat at bass , so for bass , go for dynamics , or multiple BA earphones , who have dedicated bass drivers .


----------



## Killbox

Ok, thanks for feedback!  I will order the Yamaha's and see if they suit me


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





davidisawesome said:


> and how do you compare the dtx 101 to the brainwavz m2


 
   
  The DTX101 is bassier and has a slightly more even presentation. The M2 is a little clearer.
   
   
  Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Hmm.. then my options narrow down to GR 07 and EPH 100. I cant understand really, you gave a *8.5/10* for EPH-100 and youre saying it better suits me than a *9.5/10* GR 07. Is GR 07 analytical? Which of EPH-100 and GR-07 is warm+sweet? I did like M6 only for its bass, it was pretty lacking on highs and mids. Only the triple flanges on M6 did gave me some comfort and the rest of the single/double flange tips were painful and uncomfortable for me. Since I can use my M6s triple flanges, GR 07 could be comfortable. Whats about the EPH -100? The M6s tips dont fit on those, so do they fit enough well in my ear? EPH-100 seems to be a bit costly over GR 07 (180$ over 149$ since I live far away in India, shipping for EPH-100 is high), so I would like to consider buying EPH-100 if its really a great improvement over GR 07.


 
   
  What are those numbers (8.5/9.5)? I simply made a recommendation based on your requirements. You are free to ignore it and get the one with the higher numbers but I think you will like its sound less, if at all. Fit is a personal thing - I can't say how the EPH-100 or GR07 will work for you.
   
  Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> So I went back to the comply tips (non-butchered by my hands). All I did was EQ the shortcomings, and I'm happy with it. The Turbines really are for work use while I walk around, and nothing too serious. *The comfort and EQ-ed sound is all I need.*


 
   
  This is all that matters.
    

  Quote: 





ziilot said:


> Hello guys!
> 
> I'll need a replacement for my Ultimate Ears 700, which are going to break soon
> 
> ...


 
   
  If you're worried about the durability of the B2, get the Fischer DBA-02 mkII. Sturdier construction and sounds just as good, if a bit less bright. Should run you around $180.
   
  Quote: 





killbox said:


> I've read a lot of reviews now, but I can't decide on what to get. I have so far come up with three alternatives.
> 
> - Yamaha EPH100SI
> - VSONIC GR01
> ...


 
   
  I would agree that the EPH-100 is the safest choice of the three.


----------



## funsound

I have a westone 3 with a messed up cable and $450 on amazon. I love the bass and full sound of the westone 3's but would like a bit more clarity. Any suggestions?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





funsound said:


> I have a westone 3 with a messed up cable and $450 on amazon. I love the bass and full sound of the westone 3's but would like a bit more clarity. Any suggestions?


 
   
  You could get it re-shelled into a custom or perhaps have the cables repaired for much less than that. There's really not many high-end IEMs with as much bass as a W3 and the only one I can think of with better clarity would be the Phonak PFE 232 ($599).


----------



## kurop

How do you compare ACS T15 with UE TF10? Few months ago i had TF10 but there was to much mid bass and to little deep bass and to recessed mids for me.
  I know that ACS are more neutral and maybe more natural IEM but what do you think about using them to listening rock and more often dnb.
  I'm not a huge fan of quantity of bass, but i love good quality of bass. I'm listening from Xperia P it's compareble player to Sony A84x. 
   
  And does ACS T15 benefit from amping a lot?
   
  I'm sorry for my english but i hope you'll understand me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kurop said:


> How do you compare ACS T15 with UE TF10? Few months ago i had TF10 but there was to much mid bass and to little deep bass and to recessed mids for me.
> I know that ACS are more neutral and maybe more natural IEM but what do you think about using them to listening rock and more often dnb.
> I'm not a huge fan of quantity of bass, but i love good quality of bass. I'm listening from Xperia P it's compareble player to Sony A84x.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The T15 has less mid-bass and no recessed mids but it really doesn't sound like what you're looking for. I think you would be much happier with the VSonic GR07 - it's got no mid-bass bloat, better deep bass than a T15, mids that are not recessed (though it does have a somewhat more distant presentation compared to the T15), and works well for rock. It also pairs well with Sony DAPs in my experience.


----------



## qwe340

Hi joker, 
   
  I have read some people saying they liked GR02bass than Gr06, why do you think that is? 
  If i like listening to avril lavigne, taylor swift, mariah carey type of music and maybe some piano, which one would be better? 
   
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





qwe340 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> I have read some people saying they liked GR02bass than Gr06, why do you think that is?
> If i like listening to avril lavigne, taylor swift, mariah carey type of music and maybe some piano, which one would be better?
> ...


 
   
  The GR02 BE has significantly more bass than the GR06. If you're looking for heavy bass there is a good chance you'll like it better than the GR06. However, it also tends to recess the vocals which may not be ideal for your music types. Personally I would go for the GR06 if you can afford it.


----------



## farisq

Hi, what would you consider as an upgrade to Vsonic GR02bass with more or less similar price range? Thanks


----------



## suman134

gr02 , as joker have rated , has the best value , you cant upgrade it with anything of similar price , but if you take a leap , a big one , cuz in between there quiet less no of earphones who do bass , may be se215 .


----------



## Zinks

Hey guys, so I've read all of the reviews for the $60-100 as well as the $100-150 IEM sections, and am a bit overwhelmed. I have been looking to upgrade from my Sony MDR-XB40EX for a while now, but have been reluctant to do so. A few years ago, I tried out the Klipsch Image S4, in part due to the stellar reviews it quickly received. I was not happy with the purchase, because I honestly prefer more bass. (I know, typical consumer is typical.) I swapped them for the Sony MDR-XB40EXs and was quite satisfied with the swap. I mostly listen to house music, but also some alternative/rock. The Sonys, to me at least, seem to be the best of both worlds.
   
  My budget is around $100. I am intrigued by the aesthetics and reviews of the Brainwavz M2 as well as the Hippo VB and HiFiMan RE-ZERO. On a side note, the Fischer Audio Eterna also appeals to me, but it appears to be absent online. One concern I have is that these are several-year-old products. Have any stellar, bass-emphasizing in-ears come out in the past year? If not, and bearing in mind what appeals to me, what would your ultimate recommendation be?
   
  Thank you for taking the time to read my plight! I am looking forward to any advice or recommendations!


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





zinks said:


> Hey guys, so I've read all of the reviews for the $60-100 as well as the $100-150 IEM sections, and am a bit overwhelmed. I have been looking to upgrade from my Sony MDR-XB40EX for a while now, but have been reluctant to do so. A few years ago, I tried out the Klipsch Image S4, in part due to the stellar reviews it quickly received. I was not happy with the purchase, because I honestly prefer more bass. (I know, typical consumer is typical.) I swapped them for the Sony MDR-XB40EXs and was quite satisfied with the swap. I mostly listen to house music, but also some alternative/rock. The Sonys, to me at least, seem to be the best of both worlds.
> 
> My budget is around $100. I am intrigued by the aesthetics and reviews of the Brainwavz M2 as well as the Hippo VB and HiFiMan RE-ZERO. On a side note, the Fischer Audio Eterna also appeals to me, but it appears to be absent online. One concern I have is that these are several-year-old products. Have any stellar, bass-emphasizing in-ears come out in the past year? If not, and bearing in mind what appeals to me, what would your ultimate recommendation be?
> 
> Thank you for taking the time to read my plight! I am looking forward to any advice or recommendations!


 
            why dont you try the xb41ex , try them at a sony store , at least here you can have a trail before you buy , m2 can be the way to go , hippo vb and fischer consonance are bass monsters and can be considered . but man , the xb40ex is said to be a only bass earphone that knows bass only . for that you need meelec m9 , in $100 i will say get the 1) m2 or hippo vb or the consonance along with 2) a meelec m9 which are now filthy cheap in price , i had seen them at $12 , and really good at bass .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





farisq said:


> Hi, what would you consider as an upgrade to Vsonic GR02bass with more or less similar price range? Thanks


 
   
  Unless you are just looking for a different sound signature, you won't find an 'upgrade' tot he GR02 BE for similar money - hence the 10/10 value rating.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





zinks said:


> Hey guys, so I've read all of the reviews for the $60-100 as well as the $100-150 IEM sections, and am a bit overwhelmed. I have been looking to upgrade from my Sony MDR-XB40EX for a while now, but have been reluctant to do so. A few years ago, I tried out the Klipsch Image S4, in part due to the stellar reviews it quickly received. I was not happy with the purchase, because I honestly prefer more bass. (I know, typical consumer is typical.) I swapped them for the Sony MDR-XB40EXs and was quite satisfied with the swap. I mostly listen to house music, but also some alternative/rock. The Sonys, to me at least, seem to be the best of both worlds.
> 
> My budget is around $100. I am intrigued by the aesthetics and reviews of the Brainwavz M2 as well as the Hippo VB and HiFiMan RE-ZERO. On a side note, the Fischer Audio Eterna also appeals to me, but it appears to be absent online. One concern I have is that these are several-year-old products. Have any stellar, bass-emphasizing in-ears come out in the past year? If not, and bearing in mind what appeals to me, what would your ultimate recommendation be?
> 
> Thank you for taking the time to read my plight! I am looking forward to any advice or recommendations!


 
   
   
  None of those have as much bass impact as an XB40EX, though the Eterna is not too far behind. I don't really keep up with ultra-bassy in-ears but the heaviest bass I've heard in the past year was from the TFTA 1V (which is reportedly less bassy than their XB model). If the heaviest bass is what you want I would saving up for that or getting in touch with TFTA to see if they can give you a deal on the 1V.


----------



## lostmage

So I've read over every review from around 100$ to 200$ on here and the portable headphone review, and I still can't figure out what to get. I was looking for something with a warmer sound, and was considering the Yamaha EPH-100s (if I can find them) or the V-moda M-80s, which seem to have a pretty good following around here.
   
  My main headphones at home are AKG Q701s, which I adore, but I get a bit bored of the sound after a while. They definitely are not very "fun" cans, but enjoyable nevertheless. So I was going to try to go for something that handles Progressive rock/metal, Power metal, Orchestral music, and some EDM a bit better. Focused on the guitar, piano, and string instruments, but can still handle a nice bass thump from EDM.
   
  I'm pretty sure all that rules out BA IEMs, the dynamics seem to be more focused there. How do the M-80s compare to the Yamaha EPH-100s? My goal is to stay around a 150$ budget, but I can bring it to about 175 MAX if need be (If M-80s are worth it, for example).


----------



## Cassadian

Anyone heard the new Alclair RSM?


----------



## funsound

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You could get it re-shelled into a custom or perhaps have the cables repaired for much less than that. There's really not many high-end IEMs with as much bass as a W3 and the only one I can think of with better clarity would be the Phonak PFE 232 ($599).


 
  How much better are the pfe232? are they worth the $200 price difference?


----------



## hitme987

ljokerl said:


> What are those numbers (8.5/9.5)? I simply made a recommendation based on your requirements. You are free to ignore it and get the one with the higher numbers but I think you will like its sound less, if at all. Fit is a personal thing - I can't say how the EPH-100 or GR07 will work for you


 
   
  That was the value rating that you gave for those IEMs. Fit isnt a problem I guess, I will sort it out eventually.
   
  Thanks for your suggestion joker. I will wait for your review on ultimate TF 10 and then decide it with EPH-100


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Thanks for your suggestion joker. I will wait for your review on ultimate TF 10 and then decide it with EPH-100


 
  something doesnt make sense ^


----------



## hitme987

zelda said:


> something doesnt make sense ^


 

  Only joker could understand that since I replied to his previous reply. I edited it though.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Thanks for your suggestion joker. I will wait for *your review *on ultimate *TF 10* and then decide it with EPH-100


 
  i'll be more clear


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> That was the value rating that you gave for those IEMs. Fit isnt a problem I guess, I will sort it out eventually.
> 
> Thanks for your suggestion joker. I will wait for your review on ultimate TF 10 and then decide it with EPH-100


 

 i dont know if your blind or something , those are not rated anything like that , the eph-100 is 8.9 and gr07 is 9.1 , just a 0.2 difference . and sadly the tf10 is not a bass monster like thee meelec m6 , there are 3 BA inside , and don't do bass like dynamics .


----------



## scarecrow5

Love the reviews. It practically transformed me from a mainstream junkie. I actually thought Beats by Dr. Dre were good. My bad. I got the Brainwavz B2 and I am loving them. I made a quick compilation of what I see are the best IEMs in your list, under $200 of course.  
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/621896/best-iems-under-200


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lostmage said:


> So I've read over every review from around 100$ to 200$ on here and the portable headphone review, and I still can't figure out what to get. I was looking for something with a warmer sound, and was considering the Yamaha EPH-100s (if I can find them) or the V-moda M-80s, which seem to have a pretty good following around here.
> 
> My main headphones at home are AKG Q701s, which I adore, but I get a bit bored of the sound after a while. They definitely are not very "fun" cans, but enjoyable nevertheless. So I was going to try to go for something that handles Progressive rock/metal, Power metal, Orchestral music, and some EDM a bit better. Focused on the guitar, piano, and string instruments, but can still handle a nice bass thump from EDM.
> 
> I'm pretty sure all that rules out BA IEMs, the dynamics seem to be more focused there. How do the M-80s compare to the Yamaha EPH-100s? My goal is to stay around a 150$ budget, but I can bring it to about 175 MAX if need be (If M-80s are worth it, for example).


 
   
  The M-80 is flatter than the EPH-100 and has the soundstage of a decent headphone. Because it is a headphone it will still keep up (or nearly keep up) with the EPH-100 in impact despite the lesser bass boost. Its treble also sounds more natural to me (albeit slightly lacking in energy at lower volumes) so if I had to pick one based only on sound it would likely be the M-80.
   
   
  Quote: 





funsound said:


> How much better are the pfe232? are they worth the $200 price difference?


 
   
  If you're going to buy a brand new IEM anyway - maybe. If getting your W3 fixed or reshelled for <$150 is an option, probably not. You have to understand that there's strong diminishing returns in play at that price point - the $200 "price difference" can buy a whole other top-tier IEM these days. It's been a while since I've heard the W3 but from what I remember of it, the PFE tends to have smoother treble, more controlled bass, and a more layered and versatile soundstage. 
   
  Quote: 





scarecrow5 said:


> Love the reviews. It practically transformed me from a mainstream junkie. I actually thought Beats by Dr. Dre were good. My bad. I got the Brainwavz B2 and I am loving them. I made a quick compilation of what I see are the best IEMs in your list, under $200 of course.
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/621896/best-iems-under-200


 
   
  A buyer's guide outlining my top picks is actually something I've been wanting to add to this thread for a while. Glad you like the B2s!


----------



## suman134

there is no reason to dislike the b2 , once a twfk lover , always a twfk lover .


----------



## jrcarboleda

Hello, i'm newly registered but I always check head-fi when I want to study reviews on headphones.. I play the bass guitar.. and have gigs.. and a music enthusiast

 First of all.. Does this thread have an updated table of comparison? I only saw the one on the 1st page and did not try to search anything else because this has 523 pages in it so far.. It was also posted 2 years ago if i'm right..

 I don't have much budget so I wanna hit the sweet spot on what I shall need.. I could spend $300 at most on one earphone.. and I'm looking at Etymotic-ER4S because of its build and sound accuracy.. I know it doesn't have that much bass although I need it.. But what I'm after are monitors that can distinguish every details of a music and can isolate greatly because I always need it on  studios, gigs and also applicable to sleep into.. I would greatly consider recommendations.. But please.. try not to confuse me with so many.. I hope my dread for great earphones be solved at this thread..

 Advance thank you for the replies ^^


----------



## lostmage

Thanks, That's exactly what I needed to know. I'm probably going to spring for the M-80s then.
   
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> The M-80 is flatter than the EPH-100 and has the soundstage of a decent headphone. Because it is a headphone it will still keep up (or nearly keep up) with the EPH-100 in impact despite the lesser bass boost. Its treble also sounds more natural to me (albeit slightly lacking in energy at lower volumes) so if I had to pick one based only on sound it would likely be the M-80.


----------



## scootsit

I just made a rather boneheaded discovery, and wanted to share. The Vsonic IEMs are getting suggested a lot on here, and many are using LendMeUrEars.com to purchase them. They are a great seller, I've used them a few times, and would recommend them.
   
  However, those in the US, make sure to change the currency at the top of their site to USD, not Singapore Dollars. If you do the transaction in Singapore Dollars, you will be charged an extra 2.5% by PayPal for the foreign conversion fees. If they invoice you in USD, and you pay in USD, PayPal does not collect the 2.5%. For me, this amounted to only a few dollars, but for big transactions, this could be a big deal!
   
  This likely applies to any time there is a money conversion taking place, on any site.
   
  Hope this helps someone!


----------



## Davidisawesome

ok ordering the cc51 today


----------



## funsound

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  
 Thanks for the advice. I pulled the trigger on the 232's. Hope they are as good as you say =D.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Hello, i'm newly registered but I always check head-fi when I want to study reviews on headphones.. I play the bass guitar.. and have gigs.. and a music enthusiast
> 
> First of all.. Does this thread have an updated table of comparison? I only saw the one on the 1st page and did not try to search anything else because this has 523 pages in it so far.. It was also posted 2 years ago if i'm right..
> 
> ...


 
   
  The table is updated every time I add a new earphone to the review (so, last updated 08/03/12). 
   
  For a combination of accuracy and immense isolation it doesn't get much better than the ER4S, but before jumping off the deep end you may want to consider spending 1/3 as much on an HF5. Still very accurate and very isolating but more of an 'entry' step. If you wanted a little more bass than an Ety, the Fischer Audio SBA-03 / MEElectronics A161P (same earphone) is an option as well. They run $100-130.
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I just made a rather boneheaded discovery, and wanted to share. The Vsonic IEMs are getting suggested a lot on here, and many are using LendMeUrEars.com to purchase them. They are a great seller, I've used them a few times, and would recommend them.
> 
> However, those in the US, make sure to change the currency at the top of their site to USD, not Singapore Dollars. If you do the transaction in Singapore Dollars, you will be charged an extra 2.5% by PayPal for the foreign conversion fees. If they invoice you in USD, and you pay in USD, PayPal does not collect the 2.5%. For me, this amounted to only a few dollars, but for big transactions, this could be a big deal!
> 
> ...


 
   
  Good tip!


----------



## scootsit

I just spoke to someone at lendmeurears.com and the current GR04 is the flagship edition, which is technically above the GR06 in the lineup, falling between the GR06 and the GR07. VSonic really screwed the pooch on the naming. Anyway, they are phasing out the GR04, so it is on special for about $50... Just FYI.


----------



## jrcarboleda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The table is updated every time I add a new earphone to the review (so, last updated 08/03/12).
> 
> For a combination of accuracy and immense isolation it doesn't get much better than the ER4S, but before jumping off the deep end you may want to consider spending 1/3 as much on an HF5. Still very accurate and very isolating but more of an 'entry' step. If you wanted a little more bass than an Ety, the Fischer Audio SBA-03 / MEElectronics A161P (same earphone) is an option as well. They run $100-130.


 
  I'm impressed on how you keep this thread updated.. 

 I also added HF5 on my list but here's the thing for me.. I'm from Philippines and don't have much chance to try IEMs in personal before I use it.. I know it differs from each personal preferences.. I think this best suites me because of its isolation, build (which makes it portable) and especially its sound I'd like to find the best performing IEM for me in a one time only purchase.. and I find the ER4S' build to be really built strong and I also am not bothered of microphonics that much.. also it has changeable cables which is really good for me.. It has been always the problem whenever I owned an earphone.. 

 I didn't say I didn't need an 'entry step'.. its just that with the resources I have.. I'll have very limited chance to try some for now.. Hope you understand.. I still am open to suggestions.. By the way whats the sound signature of the HifiManRE272 compared to a ER4S of course.. thanks ^^


----------



## Xinze

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you found the Coppers treble overbearing I would give the W3 and maybe event the TF10 a pass. There's a number of smoother-sounding in-ears in that price range, including the new Miles Davis Trumpets and the cheaper Yamaha EPH-100.


 
   
  How does the SQ of the EPH-100 compare to copper? And would you give any other recommendations for $150-250?


----------



## neige

I've been lurking this thread for about a month now while shopping for a beginner's budget IEM. As a casual listener, I only use my 6g Nano/PC with built in soundcard/Smartphone for my music and usually listen to mp3s of questionable quality or basic Spotify. I said to myself I will not spend more than $50 on IEMs. After spending hours on this thread, learning buzzwords and taking music quality into consideration, I ordered the CC51P off Amazon for just under 30 dollars based off of |joker|'s review. Let me just say I'm extremely happy with my purchase. Before the CC51P, I've been using EP-630 for 5+ years and Skullcandy Ink'd for a few months before it broke on me. |joker|, Thanks for putting this together. The CC51P have made music fun and extremely enjoyable regardless of genre.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





neige said:


> I've been lurking this thread for about a month now while shopping for a beginner's budget IEM. As a casual listener, I only use my 6g Nano/PC with built in soundcard/Smartphone for my music and usually listen to mp3s of questionable quality or basic Spotify. I said to myself I will not spend more than $50 on IEMs. After spending hours on this thread, learning buzzwords and taking music quality into consideration, I ordered the CC51P off Amazon for just under 30 dollars based off of |joker|'s review. Let me just say I'm extremely happy with my purchase. Before the CC51P, I've been using EP-630 for 5+ years and Skullcandy Ink'd for a few months before it broke on me. |joker|, Thanks for putting this together. The CC51P have made music fun and extremely enjoyable regardless of genre.


 

        you got saved man , cc51 are the boss of sub $50 iems .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> I'm impressed on how you keep this thread updated..
> 
> I also added HF5 on my list but here's the thing for me.. I'm from Philippines and don't have much chance to try IEMs in personal before I use it.. I know it differs from each personal preferences.. I think this best suites me because of its isolation, build (which makes it portable) and especially its sound I'd like to find the best performing IEM for me in a one time only purchase.. and I find the ER4S' build to be really built strong and I also am not bothered of microphonics that much.. also it has changeable cables which is really good for me.. It has been always the problem whenever I owned an earphone..
> 
> I didn't say I didn't need an 'entry step'.. its just that with the resources I have.. I'll have very limited chance to try some for now.. Hope you understand.. I still am open to suggestions.. By the way whats the sound signature of the HifiManRE272 compared to a ER4S of course.. thanks ^^


 
   
  The RE272 isn't all that different - slightly more spacious, softer and more relaxed in terms of note presentation, not as crisp. The ER4S has more aggressive detailing, more  punchy bass, and tends to be more forward and less airy.
   
  Quote: 





xinze said:


> How does the SQ of the EPH-100 compare to copper? And would you give any other recommendations for $150-250?


 
   
  Overall very close, with the EPH-100 being perhaps a little cleaner-sounding and the Coppers having a wider stage and touch more treble. Other options to look into would be the Turbine Pro Gold, which is a little less trebly than the Copper, one of the Radius earphones (TWF11 or TWF21), or maybe the Earsonics SM2 from the BA realm, which is about as warm and smooth as armatures get. The last one would be best to audition first.
   
  Quote: 





neige said:


> I've been lurking this thread for about a month now while shopping for a beginner's budget IEM. As a casual listener, I only use my 6g Nano/PC with built in soundcard/Smartphone for my music and usually listen to mp3s of questionable quality or basic Spotify. I said to myself I will not spend more than $50 on IEMs. After spending hours on this thread, learning buzzwords and taking music quality into consideration, I ordered the CC51P off Amazon for just under 30 dollars based off of |joker|'s review. Let me just say I'm extremely happy with my purchase. Before the CC51P, I've been using EP-630 for 5+ years and Skullcandy Ink'd for a few months before it broke on me. |joker|, Thanks for putting this together. The CC51P have made music fun and extremely enjoyable regardless of genre.


 
   
  Good deal, the CC51 is still one of my favorite mid-fi sets. Something about its sound just works for me.


----------



## putente

*ljokerl*, since I already own the GR07 and the RE-262 (and also the EPH-100), would the Sony EX1000 bring me anything significant in the lows and mids areas (I'm not a big treble fan) mostly for Rock and Metal listen, that would justify their purchase? I'm looking at my next IEM purchase, and I'm not sure if it's a good idea to go for a higher-end dynamic like the EX1000 (and I already own some good dynamics), or instead, if I should go for a multi-BA IEM (I don't own any BA, never even heard one)...


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





putente said:


> *ljokerl*, since I already own the GR07 and the RE-262 (and also the EPH-100), would the Sony EX1000 bring me anything significant in the lows and mids areas (I'm not a big treble fan) mostly for Rock and Metal listen, that would justify their purchase? I'm looking at my next IEM purchase, and I'm not sure if it's a good idea to go for a higher-end dynamic like the EX1000 (and I already own some good dynamics), or instead, if I should go for a multi-BA IEM (I don't own any BA, never even heard one)...


 

         there is a sony xb90ex in the pipe line and will be available in 2-3 months , and is said to be better then the ex1000 . im holding every thing back for that . only if you can wait that long cuz waiting can be difficult .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





putente said:


> *ljokerl*, since I already own the GR07 and the RE-262 (and also the EPH-100), would the Sony EX1000 bring me anything significant in the lows and mids areas (I'm not a big treble fan) mostly for Rock and Metal listen, that would justify their purchase? I'm looking at my next IEM purchase, and I'm not sure if it's a good idea to go for a higher-end dynamic like the EX1000 (and I already own some good dynamics), or instead, if I should go for a multi-BA IEM (I don't own any BA, never even heard one)...


 
   
  I think in your case the best thing the EX1000 will bring to the table is its open soundstage. If you don't care about that, I would definitely try and armature (multi- or single) instead.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think in your case the best thing the EX1000 will bring to the table is its open soundstage. If you don't care about that, I would definitely try and armature (multi- or single) instead.


 
   
   
  Yes, soundstage isn't the aspect I care about most when I'm listening to music! I'll take your advice and go the BA way (those new Heir Audio universals are very tempting)... Thanks!


----------



## putente

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> there is a sony xb90ex in the pipe line and will be available in 2-3 months , and is said to be better then the ex1000 . im holding every thing back for that . only if you can wait that long cuz waiting can be difficult .


 
   
   
  That's also the ETA for the new Vsonic GR08, and hopefully I'll be all over those then...


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





putente said:


> That's also the ETA for the new Vsonic GR08, and hopefully I'll be all over those then...


 

 vsonic gr08 are in the pipe line for quiet a while , but the sony mdr-xb90ex , xb60ex and xb30ex are already on sale in japan , one of my friend in japan has brought a xb30ex , and there are many hands on review of the xb90ex and are said to be better then the ex1000 in every aspect . im dying to buy it , thought you may like it , but we have to wait for it . i may get it from china .


----------



## putente

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> vsonic gr08 are in the pipe line for quiet a while , but the sony mdr-xb90ex , xb60ex and xb30ex are already on sale in japan , one of my friend in japan has brought a xb30ex , and there are many hands on review of the xb90ex and are said to be better then the ex1000 in every aspect . im dying to buy it , thought you may like it , but we have to wait for it . i may get it from china .


 
   
   
  And what's the price tag on those?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





putente said:


> And what's the price tag on those?


 

 No one knows for sure, rumors are ~$350


----------



## putente

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> No one knows for sure, rumors are ~$350


 
   
   
  But aren't they already on sale in Japan? What's the pricetag there?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





putente said:


> But aren't they already on sale in Japan? What's the pricetag there?


 

 For the GR08? I don't think so, unless you're talking about the Sonys.
   
  Edit: I thought you quoted the other post, my bad.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





putente said:


> But aren't they already on sale in Japan? What's the pricetag there?


 

  in china those are just 950 yuan which is under $160 , it will not be over $250 at other countries i think . here xba-3 i brought for just $150 , you can guess from that .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





putente said:


> But aren't they already on sale in Japan? What's the pricetag there?


 

      in japan a online sale site ebay has it up for just $140 . shipping charges applied .


----------



## putente

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> in japan a online sale site ebay has it up for just $140 . shipping charges applied .


 
   
   
  I'll be keeping a close eye on those Sony MDR-XB90EX...


----------



## cibibikeru

I just recieved the AM-90, still not what I'm looking for..
   
  Now I'm looking at something more expensive, like GR06 or RE0
  I read on this forum that many compare the GR06 to the Soundmagic E30, GR06 is almost double the price..
   
  From what I heard/owned until now:
   
  PL30 - midcentric, little bass but I like the sound and treble
  M4 - fail, agressive V-shape with proeminent, disturbing mid-high passage
  GR02 - too much bass, in a good way, brighter than M1 but sibilant, not refined, and I don't like the light V shape sound, mids don't sound that good as on the M1
  AM-90 - midcentric, flat response and lacks treble
  M1 - prefered so far, airy and natural sounding but not very bright, highs sound good but it could be better, also bass could be better
   
  I'm looking for an M1 sound, airy, natural, full, with better treble (brighter, better extended but refined, not agressive) and little more bass (not much, don't mind if not at all), should I get the GR06 or RE0?
   
  I'm going to listen to a pair of Klipsch Custom 2 these days, I have a friend who owns them, very curious how they sound..


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> I just recieved the AM-90, still not what I'm looking for..
> 
> Now I'm looking at something more expensive, like GR06 or RE0
> I read on this forum that many compare the GR06 to the Soundmagic E30, GR06 is almost double the price..
> ...


 

 If you go for the GR06, the GR04 flagship is one step above, and it's on sale from lendmeurears


----------



## Sonify

Wating for the UE TF10 review~


----------



## H20Fidelity

sonify said:


> Wating for the UE TF10 review~




Grab a ticket and get in line.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





sonify said:


> Wating for the UE TF10 review~


 

 There is a rumor that it might be review #350


----------



## David245

Today I went out and decided to get a cheap, good sounding IEM from JBHIFI. I returned home with the TDK MT300 and to my surprise they don't sound too bad for a $20 headphone.
  t


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> I just recieved the AM-90, still not what I'm looking for..
> 
> Now I'm looking at something more expensive, like GR06 or RE0
> I read on this forum that many compare the GR06 to the Soundmagic E30, GR06 is almost double the price..
> ...


 
   


 so that didnt work for you ? custom 2 , sadly is not that good , awful microphonic , not as good as anything you mentioned above . try cc51 and ue 400 , first try not buy , but cc51 dont need try , you can buy it any time any day , i have a e30 ( not pl30 ) , cc51 and the ue 400 , so i can tell you that , cc51 has a bit more bass then the e30 , similar mids and really better highs , not warm but can be a bit dark , the ue 400 has bigger bass of all , a bit laid back mids , but keep the details , highs are better of all , even better then my ue 600 , instrument separation is really awesome too . ue 400/500 is not warm or light at all , its dark but really nice . but at times it feels a bit less refined . gr06 on the other hand has mid bass hump but not huge , can be called good and impactful , mids are better then any thing i mentioned , highs are also equally better and may be similar to ue600 , smooth and well extended , sound stage wise it falls behind both ue . but its still good . and i feel gr06 can be the thing you want .


----------



## cibibikeru

My friend didn't have the Klipsch anymore, now has Shure SE215, sounds like what I'm looking for, they could be a little more treble extended but sounds really good compared to all I heard until now, it's also true that they're the most expensive I heard so far.. GR04 is rated under GR06 from what I read..


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> My friend didn't have the Klipsch anymore, now has Shure SE215, sounds like what I'm looking for, they could be a little more treble extended but sounds really good compared to all I heard until now, it's also true that they're the most expensive I heard so far.. GR04 is rated under GR06 from what I read..


 
  The GR04 classic is, the GR04 Flagship is not. The GR06 and GR04 Classical are 24ohm, the GR04 Flagship is 50ohms, like the GR07. Many reviews have said that the GR04 Flagship is not too far behind the GR07. The Flagship was, when it came out near $100, but it is being discontinued and is now ~$50. They screwed up the naming of all of the models and it became very confusing, but the GR04 Flagship is above the GR06.


----------



## heart banger-97

hi!
  one of my friend is going to decide between GR04 Flagship and gr06
  can anyone give me a comparison between these two? (sound isolation is important too)
   
   
  thanks


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi!
> one of my friend is going to decide between GR04 Flagship and gr06
> can anyone give me a comparison between these two? (sound isolation is important too)
> 
> ...


 

 http://www.head-fi.org/t/590454/vsonic-gr06-review


----------



## nicholars

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> My friend didn't have the Klipsch anymore, now has Shure SE215, sounds like what I'm looking for, they could be a little more treble extended but sounds really good compared to all I heard until now, it's also true that they're the most expensive I heard so far.. GR04 is rated under GR06 from what I read..


 
   
  You cannot really go wrong with the shures for £70 (unless you like a really bright sound)... They are not "world class" quality but they definately sound good with pretty much any genre and do not do anything badly.


----------



## FieldingMellish

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> You cannot really go wrong with the shures for £70 (unless you like a really bright sound)... They are not "world class" quality but they definately sound good with pretty much any genre and do not do anything badly.


 
   
  Isolation is amazing on Shure SE-215. If you commute in talky, noisy busses or trains, it works remarkably well. The fun sound is more fun when you don't have to blast them to cut all that noise out.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





andwii said:


> Great reading! thanks.


 
   




  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> There is a rumor that it might be review #350


 
   
  or 450 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> The GR04 classic is, the GR04 Flagship is not. The GR06 and GR04 Classical are 24ohm, the GR04 Flagship is 50ohms, like the GR07. Many reviews have said that the GR04 Flagship is not too far behind the GR07. The Flagship was, when it came out near $100, but it is being discontinued and is now ~$50. They screwed up the naming of all of the models and it became very confusing, but the GR04 Flagship is above the GR06.


 
   
  Love the VSonic nomenclature, makes perfect sense 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. GR99 is also the entry-level model and GR01 the flagship all the while the rest of them (mostly) follow the 'higher number is better' approach.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> or 450


 
         dosent matter when , but when it will be out , there is going to be a riot in here .


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Love the VSonic nomenclature, makes perfect sense
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I just got my GR04 Pro Flagship or whatever they're called. Took a little bit of doing to get a perfect fit. But, I have achieved it, and I love them. Much to my surprise, amping makes a huge difference, probably because they're 50ohm, not 24 like the GR06/02/04 ("Classical"). For $50, these are incredible. I mean, really, incredible. I think there are 7 pairs left or some such thing, and well, I'm almost tempted to pick up a second pair...
   
  Anyway, I am happier than a pig in well, let's just leave it at that!
  I have only had two other IEMs: the 8320 and GR02 BE. The 8320 sounded all right, but just did not fit me. The GR02 was too bassy, but over all, was nice. The GR04 blows them both away, it is incredibly detailed, almost as detailed as my Magnums. Without amping, it's a little warm and slow sounding (not really bad, just a tiny bit). With my CMoy, they sound great, flat, smooth, and melodic.


----------



## cibibikeru

I just ordered the GR04 "Flagship", if these don't sound the way I want either, I'll jump straight to 100$, the Shures sound really nice compared to budget iems I had so far, they sound like headphones, sound has body, it's not thin like on the AM-90, bass is good, not too much like GR02, and not too litlle like AM-90, mids are very good, they sound natural, not too forward, not laid back, the highs are good also, not very bright or extended, a little laid back and early roll off, this would be the only minus from my point of view, but overall I found the S215 fun to listen to, dynamic.
   
  I listen mostly to rock-pop (pearl jam, led zeppelin, queen, genesis, aerosmith, dave matthews band, pink floyd but also roxette, police, sting, toto, alan parson and many many others) dynamic music with lot of instruments, good recordings, mostly good remasters, lossless format, on sansa clip+ rockboxed, I can say the source is very good.
   
  I know that with the SE215, I won't hear dust particles falling on the cymbals while the band was playing, but I found them fun to listen to, I even turned up the volume more than I used to, i guess that means they are non-fatiguing (or I wansn't hearing things right?), it's the closest thing to what I'm looking for until now.. maybe someone with experience understands what I'm saying and could recomend something better for me whithin SE215's price range, i love bright but fine, sweet sound, not agressive, highs must be present but not shouting, SE215 is a little dark but everything else seems fine..
   
  Now I'm waiting for the these GR04, I hope it has better mids and more refined, less fatiguing highs compared to GR02, it would be perfect..


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> I just ordered the GR04 "Flagship", if these don't sound the way I want either, I'll jump straight to 100$, the Shures sound really nice compared to budget iems I had so far, they sound like headphones, sound has body, it's not thin like on the AM-90, bass is good, not too much like GR02, and not too litlle like AM-90, mids are very good, they sound natural, not too forward, not laid back, the highs are good also, not very bright or extended, a little laid back and early roll off, this would be the only minus from my point of view, but overall I found the S215 fun to listen to, dynamic.
> 
> I listen mostly to rock-pop (pearl jam, led zeppelin, queen, genesis, aerosmith, dave matthews band, pink floyd but also roxette, police, sting, toto, alan parson and many many others) dynamic music with lot of instruments, good recordings, mostly good remasters, lossless format, on sansa clip+ rockboxed, I can say the source is very good.
> 
> ...


 

 I would say it has both those things with respect to the GR02 Bass Edition. It has a LOT less bass, but I find that to be a plus, I turned the bass way down with the GR02. The bass is definitely there in the GR04, it's just very, very controlled. The Mids and imaging are ridiculous for $50.


----------



## cibibikeru

I must admit the GR02 sounds good if I lower 60-10Hz band but also 5K-8K, the "ss" is killing me..


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> I must admit the GR02 sounds good if I lower 60-10Hz band but also 5K-8K, the "ss" is killing me..


 

 I didn't find them to be that sibilant, but honestly, the GR04s really are drastically different, hopefully it works for you.


----------



## kova4a

Frankly, I found the bass and the highs to be just right on the GR02 BE. Can't call them bass heavy at all - with comply and decored olives they get a little boomy but far away from what I consider too much. Also, not sibilant - the highs may be slightly agressive but as I have ety er-4s and brainwavz b2 I prefer that. I'm more interested on how the GR04 flagship's mids sound compared to GR02 as even though the GR02's mids are nicely detailed and I like their thinner notes, they are slightly grainy at times and maybe a touch more laid back than I would have liked. I'll get the meelec banced bi-flages tomorrow to see how the GR02 sounds with them but I'm still interested in the GR04 flagship and mainly how it's mids and treble fare in comparison to the GR02?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Frankly, I found the bass and the highs to be just right on the GR02 BE. Can't call them bass heavy at all - with comply and decored olives they get a little boomy but far away from what I consider too much. Also, not sibilant - the highs may be slightly agressive but as I have ety er-4s and brainwavz b2 I prefer that. I'm more interested on how the GR04 flagship's mids sound compared to GR02 as even though the GR02's mids are nicely detailed and I like their thinner notes, they are slightly grainy at times and maybe a touch more laid back than I would have liked. I'll get the meelec banced bi-flages tomorrow to see how the GR02 sounds with them but I'm still interested in the GR04 flagship and mainly how it's mids and treble fare in comparison to the GR02?


 

 The Meelec balanced sound bi flanges didn't change the sound much for me, just gave me a great seal and made them super comfy. I consider the 02 to be way too bass heavy for me. The 04s have phenomenal mids.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> The Meelec balanced sound bi flanges didn't change the sound much for me, just gave me a great seal and made them super comfy. I consider the 02 to be way too bass heavy for me. The 04s have phenomenal mids.


 
  Actually, they do sound different. Apparently, there are two different versions of the meelec gray balanced bi-flange tips. I asked joker before and he said he was sure they're all the same but they are not. I ordered the so called "balanced tips for m9" right before they ran out of stock and I guess they didn't have 3 pairs, so 1 of the pairs was what meelec has now on the site as gray balanced double flange trips. The one "for m9" are harder and with overall darker one shade of gray while the other are in brighter gray, softer and the opening of the tips is slightly smaller and in a darker shade of gray. They sound different and the "for m9" version has a lot better seal and thus better bass and netter everything - the softer ones are just sub-par compared to the other ones and useless for - it's really a good thing I didn't receive 3 pairs of them.
   
  Here is a pic I just snapped for comparison (the quality isn't very good)
  GR02 BE stock bi-flanges (left), meelec balanced tips for m9 (middle), meelec balanced double-flange tips (right)

  Of course, I'm not 100% sure if itt in't the other way around and the softer version on the right is the "m9" version and the other one the "balanced sound". I just go with what I ordered - the "balanced tips for m9".


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Actually, they do sound different. Apparently, there are two different versions of the meelec gray balanced bi-flange tips. I asked joker before and he said he was sure they're all the same but they are not. I ordered the so called "balanced tips for m9" right before they ran out of stock and I guess they didn't have 3 pairs, so 1 of the pairs was what meelec has now on the site as gray balanced double flange trips. The one "for m9" are harder and with overall darker one shade of gray while the other are in brighter gray, softer and the opening of the tips is slightly smaller and in a darker shade of gray. They sound different and the "for m9" version has a lot better seal and thus better bass and netter everything - the softer ones are just sub-par compared to the other ones and useless for - it's really a good thing I didn't receive 3 pairs of them.
> 
> Here is a pic I just snapped for comparison (the quality isn't very good)
> GR02 BE stock bi-flanges (left), meelec balanced tips for m9 (middle), meelec balanced double-flange tips (right)
> ...


 

 I asked the guy at meelec if there was a difference between the for M9 and the other set, he said no. I wonder if maybe they just sent you a regular old black normal bi-flange.


----------



## kova4a

No, it's not a regular black. The regular black ones are harder like the stock vsonic ones. All the three meelec pairs are gray and you can see through them. Just one of them is slightly brighter and is softer the the other two. The two darker pairs are softer than the stock vsonic and meelec bi-flanges. I like them more than the Gr02 stock ones as I get a better seal, more balanced sound (as they are softer they have slightly less bass and thus the slithly laid back mids aren't so apparent) and I feel them less in my ears. The brighter ones are very slightly smaller and are too soft and that amount to bad seal and bass. I haven't seen so soft tips in a while. So they are deffinitely different - aside from the softer silicone their cores are thicker.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Actually, they do sound different. Apparently, there are two different versions of the meelec gray balanced bi-flange tips. I asked joker before and he said he was sure they're all the same but they are not. I ordered the so called "balanced tips for m9" right before they ran out of stock and I guess they didn't have 3 pairs, so 1 of the pairs was what meelec has now on the site as gray balanced double flange trips. The one "for m9" are harder and with overall darker one shade of gray while the other are in brighter gray, softer and the opening of the tips is slightly smaller and in a darker shade of gray. They sound different and the "for m9" version has a lot better seal and thus better bass and netter everything - the softer ones are just sub-par compared to the other ones and useless for - it's really a good thing I didn't receive 3 pairs of them.
> 
> Here is a pic I just snapped for comparison (the quality isn't very good)
> GR02 BE stock bi-flanges (left), meelec balanced tips for m9 (middle), meelec balanced double-flange tips (right)
> ...


 
   
  The middle tip looks like the "old" balanced bi-flange that came with my M9s back in 2009. My newer M9 came with the tip on the right.


----------



## scootsit

I really wish the balanced biflanges fit on the GR04. Joker, any other tips fit on your GR06? I mean, I know they come with ~15, but I love those balanced sound tips, they're so comfy!


----------



## kova4a

Then I have to say that I don't like the new ones at all - so it's a good thing that at least 2 out of the 3 pairs are the old ones.


----------



## mosshorn

So I'll be getting the SM3v2's in a couple days!!!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
  I'll probably be selling my Aurisonics ASG-1.2's simply because I feel the signature too similar. What would everyone recommend under $150 that would complement the SM3?
   

 Thanks!


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Joker, an IEM with a a v shaped sound with flat cables? I see the Ultimate Ears 500 (500vi), as one, but is there any better with better strain relief? Must be comfortable, have sparkly treble, and good bass... not overpowering.


----------



## Prashanth R

Hey Joker!! Have you heard Rockit sounds R50??? Dual BA, costs 120$.. they are giant killers.. I shall be eagerly waiting your review.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> Joker, an IEM with a a v shaped sound with flat cables? I see the Ultimate Ears 500 (500vi), as one, but is there any better with better strain relief? Must be comfortable, have sparkly treble, and good bass... not overpowering.


 

         if you would consider xb41ex , but the ue 400/500 is not bad at all . and may be the velodyne v pulse . it also lacks strain reliever at the earphone end , try a xb41ex at a sony store , they are a bit light in sig but not bad . nicely v shaped but dont have the treble spark of ue 400/500 , still is not bad at highs .


----------



## suman134

and sadly , ue written on the eu 400/500 is easily erasable .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I really wish the balanced biflanges fit on the GR04. Joker, any other tips fit on your GR06? I mean, I know they come with ~15, but I love those balanced sound tips, they're so comfy!


 
   
  Lots do, but none with great results. Have you thought of trying to make a set of adapters to use the balanced bi-flanges? 
   
  Quote: 





mosshorn said:


> So I'll be getting the SM3v2's in a couple days!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sony EX600 is about as different from the SM3 as you can get in that price range 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> Joker, an IEM with a a v shaped sound with flat cables? I see the Ultimate Ears 500 (500vi), as one, but is there any better with better strain relief? Must be comfortable, have sparkly treble, and good bass... not overpowering.


 
   
  I would say ECCI PR401 if it's still in production. Haven't seen it mentioned in a while. 
   
  Quote: 





prashanth r said:


> Hey Joker!! Have you heard Rockit sounds R50??? Dual BA, costs 120$.. they are giant killers.. I shall be eagerly waiting your review.


 
   
  I have an R-50 but unfortunately it has a channel imbalance so the review is on hold for the time being. They perform very well for the price, somewhere between the q-JAYS/Phiaton PS200 and VSonic GR01/Brainwavz B2.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have an R-50 but unfortunately it has a *channel imbalance* so the review is on hold for the time being. They perform very well for the price, somewhere between the q-JAYS/Phiaton PS200 and VSonic GR01/Brainwavz B2.


 
  i might get a pair soon. how do i check that *channel imbalance?*


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Thanks Joker. The UE 500 will be here on Friday, but if doesn't work out, I'll look into the Ecci PR401 next.


----------



## bocky

I am impressed by the massive amount of reviews. Some of the reviews are very well writen and good references.
   
  However, I am REALLY skeptical about the value for horizontal comparisons among the IEMs based on the scoring. Take IE8 as an exmple which scored 9.0 for sound quality. And a bunch of those that are etiher in the same price range or below are scored equal or higher than IE8 including those that are clearly not in the same league in terms of sound quality, eg. XBA4, RE262/272, GR07, EX600, etc. Some of the phones are also clearly not even comparable to some scored lower, such as Turbine pros, Miles Davis and MG7.
   
  Thus looking at the appendixed scoring charts can be quite confusing.


----------



## eke2k6

bocky said:


> I am impressed by the massive amount of reviews. Some of the reviews are very well writen and good references.
> 
> However, I am REALLY skeptical about the value for horizontal comparisons among the IEMs based on the scoring. Take IE8 as an exmple which scored 9.0 for sound quality. And a bunch of those that are etiher in the same price range or below are scored equal or higher than IE8 including those that are clearly not in the same league in terms of sound quality, eg. XBA4, RE262/272, GR07, EX600, etc. Some of the phones are also clearly not even comparable to some scored lower, such as Turbine pros, Miles Davis and MG7.
> 
> Thus looking at the appendixed scoring charts can be quite confusing.




I don't understand what you're saying. Every phone you just listed sounds better than the IE8, which is in turn better than the MG7.


----------



## nicholars

Looks like that old chestnut again : User preferences.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> i might get a pair soon. how do i check that *channel imbalance?*


 
   
  Channel imbalance means that the volume between the left and right earpieces is not the same across the entire frequency range. Mild channel imbalances are actually pretty common but when noticeable it gets annoying. Easiest way to check is to run a 20-20 frequency sweep. With a perfectly balanced earphone the source of the sound will seem 'centered' in your head at all times. With most earphones you'll hear mild deviations that don't really affect everyday listening but on occasion, such as with my R-50, there is a significant left- or right- leaning tendency. The R-50 actually bothers me during regular music listening which is why it probably has to go back.


----------



## Zelda

^ thanks. 
   
  now (if you had them long enough for ), how was the isolation , comfort and fit , etc, of the R-50 ?


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Got my UE 500, and I'm very satisfied with them. Many thanks, Joker.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> ^ thanks.
> 
> now (if you had them long enough for ), how was the isolation , comfort and fit , etc, of the R-50 ?


 
   
  All about on-par with the DBA-02 - no complaints whatsoever.
    
  Quote:


mad lust envy said:


> Got my UE 500, and I'm very satisfied with them. Many thanks, Joker.


 
   
  Glad you like em! Careful with the paint if you care about that sort of thing - it comes off far too easily.


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

I'll keep that in mind, though for IEMs, not really important, lol.


----------



## ianmedium

Thanks so much for your excellent review of the heaven S. I agree completely with your findings. I am glad I went for the S version over the other for the reasons you give. I too find it gives an airy presentation and I find it capable of resolving pretty much every genre of music I throw at it. For instance as I type I am listening to Simone Dinnersteins excellent Bach album, the way the weight of the notes played on the piano is portrayed really gives one a great sense of the atmospher and occasion. Likewise the tight bottom end and speed allow complex fast bass lines such as much of Peter Gabriel's work to be conveyed very well indeed.

I also have the ER4S's which I love, I find that the Etymotic's a little slower in comparison to the FAD's a little richer and warmer sounding. I think for me the high point of the FAD's is their ability to resolve transients so well, they really get the feet tapping and the hours disappear. Just listen to the piano in Bach's keyboard concerto in D minor, especially the Allegro.. Sublime!

I have found that Klipshch's opaque ovoid tips to work very well with these phones, they isolate a little more but not at the expense of the air and liveliness.


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

So I got my Ultimate Ears 500 yesterday.

They only cost $45, come with the silicone AND a pair of Comply foam tips (though I have a box of comply foam tips I got for the Monster Turbines that did not work well for them.)

The stock tips to gives me that terrible airplane pressure feel, so those tips are absolutely unusable for me.

I put the Comply foam tips on (both the ones that came with it and the ones I already had), and I was surprised that it didn't destroy the SQ like they did with the Turbines (the sound on the Turbines became pure mud and bass when using the foam tips, with absolutely no treble or other details). Dunno what the UE 500 did, but the treble still remained beautifully sparkly, the bass was just a hint deeper, and details were still basically the same.

Love the fact that they have flat cables too.

If I could compare their tonal balance to any full sized headphones, I'd say a cross between the DT880 and DT990 without the full sized soundstage or treble edginess. The bass was emphasized (more than the DT880, but not DT990 strong), the mids were akin to the DT880, and the treble was slightly less than both, meaning their is no jarring edge to them, though they are still sparkly.

For $45, these are just fantastic. They also sound fantastic with the Sony Hybrid tips I also have....



Dunno why the bass is so ridiculous looking on the graphs, but that isn't true to what you'll hear. Also, the treble was airier and sparklier than the Turbines, unlike what the graphs show. The mids are identical to the DT880 on the graph, which is how I remember it.

Unlike every IEM I have owned, the UE500 needs absolutely no equalizing for me. They sound just spot on in stock form (foam tips or Sony hybrids, stock tips sound too damn treble oriented, though I believe it's just personal fitting issues). That's saying something about their sound signature.


----------



## ExpatinJapan

When is the 334 review?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ianmedium said:


> Thanks so much for your excellent review of the heaven S. I agree completely with your findings. I am glad I went for the S version over the other for the reasons you give. I too find it gives an airy presentation and I find it capable of resolving pretty much every genre of music I throw at it. For instance as I type I am listening to Simone Dinnersteins excellent Bach album, the way the weight of the notes played on the piano is portrayed really gives one a great sense of the atmospher and occasion. Likewise the tight bottom end and speed allow complex fast bass lines such as much of Peter Gabriel's work to be conveyed very well indeed.
> I also have the ER4S's which I love, I find that the Etymotic's a little slower in comparison to the FAD's a little richer and warmer sounding. I think for me the high point of the FAD's is their ability to resolve transients so well, they really get the feet tapping and the hours disappear. Just listen to the piano in Bach's keyboard concerto in D minor, especially the Allegro.. Sublime!
> I have found that Klipshch's opaque ovoid tips to work very well with these phones, they isolate a little more but not at the expense of the air and liveliness.


 
   
  Against all sensibility I found myself preferring the SB to the SA and A1. It's definitely got that fun factor that many find lacking in other armatures. The MEElec bi-flange tips I was using gave great isolation as well. 
   
  Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> So I got my Ultimate Ears 500 yesterday.
> [...]


 
   
  +1, I don't think you can gleam how it they sound from that particular graph. They are neither hugely bassy nor dark-sounding.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





expatinjapan said:


> When is the 334 review?


 
   
  Working on it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Was moving out of my college apt. recently and then on vacation so everything got pushed back.


----------



## Tilpo

I'm really interested in the IE8's (IE80's more specifically).
However, I want to know just how bad the isolation is. Would they for example still be usable on a train or bus? Or are they really only for indoor use?
If it means anything, I find the level of isolation of my HD 25-1 II's good enough for such usage. More would be better, but not necessary. Less would be worrisome.

And would getting non-stock tips help? Or would e.g. comply tips degrade the sound quality by a significant amount?


Other suggestions for IEM's at around €200/$250 would be great too. I was interested in the TF10's as well, but they are actually more expensive than the IE80's as far as I've seen here. 

I'm having a tunnel vision on the IE80's right now, and only the isolation is putting me off from buying them at the moment.


----------



## eke2k6

Tilpo, I'd recommend looking at auditioning the IE80 before you buy them. The isolation isn't bad, but it's the sound you should be worried about. I didn't find them to be all that good due to a certain graininess to the sound. I personally found the ie8 to e a better phone overall, with the ie80 sounding like a poorly eq'ed version of its predecessor.


----------



## Tilpo

eke2k6 said:


> Tilpo, I'd recommend looking at auditioning the IE80 before you buy them. The isolation isn't bad, but it's the sound you should be worried about. I didn't find them to be all that good due to a certain graininess to the sound. I personally found the ie8 to e a better phone overall, with the ie80 sounding like a poorly eq'ed version of its predecessor.




Not many options to audition them where I live.

I have never seen a store here in the Netherlands who'd let people audition IEM's, so let alone an IE80. 
I'll have to go by my gut feeling and other's review on the sound unfortunately. And you know what? Up until know I never think I made a bad decision this way.

Having said that, do you have any other suggestions?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> Not many options to audition them where I live.
> I have never seen a store here in the Netherlands who'd let people audition IEM's, so let alone an IE80.
> I'll have to go by my gut feeling and other's review on the sound unfortunately. And you know what? Up until know I never think I made a bad decision this way.
> Having said that, do you have any other suggestions?


 
   
  It depends on your preferences, what you listen to, and your favorite full-sized.


----------



## Tilpo

eke2k6 said:


> It depends on your preferences, what you listen to, and your favorite full-sized.




My favorite full sized is the SR-202.

Heh. Now that I think about it that's almost the opposite sound signature. The SR-202 is very trebly.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> My favorite full sized is the SR-202.
> Heh. Now that I think about it that's almost the opposite sound signature. The SR-202 is very trebly.


 
   
  I haven't heard the 202 (prob never will), but from what I've heard I think you should ease into the IEM game with the JVC FX40. It's a ridiculous bang-for-buck phone that will surprise you. If you want to jump in deeper, check out the Sony EX600. I found it better than the IE80 in most areas (including soundstage). I still say go for the FX40 first though. Another option would be the UE TF10. If you want to jump all the way in, there's the FX700 that has effortlessly extended treble, and an audiophile type basshead sound. The mids are a bit laid back though.
   
  Then there's the GR07 MKII, which I'll have tomorrow. I'll put some impressions on the diary thread for you.


----------



## Tilpo

eke2k6 said:


> I haven't heard the 202 (prob never will), but from what I've heard I think you should ease into the IEM game with the JVC FX40. It's a ridiculous bang-for-buck phone that will surprise you. If you want to jump in deeper, check out the Sony EX600. I found it better than the IE80 in most areas (including soundstage). I still say go for the FX40 first though. Another option would be the UE TF10. If you want to jump all the way in, there's the FX700 that has effortlessly extended treble, and an audiophile type basshead sound. The mids are a bit laid back though.
> 
> Then there's the GR07 MKII, which I'll have tomorrow. I'll put some impressions on the diary thread for you.




I don't know about the FX40's. They seem a little TOO cheap. :rolleyes:

The thing is, I want this to be an upgrade over my HD 25-1 II's too. I know myself well enough that if they aren't, that they won't be getting any head time. 
But seriously, it's really not what I'm looking for. It may be stupid snobism, but I don't care. That's just how I am. 

I want to jump in deeper than that. I had a look at the EX600's and they cost the same as the IE80's. I'd have to look into them a bit more. 
The TF10's are actually more expensive than the IE80's, and truth be told I like the look of the IE80's better from the research I've done. I couldn't find any local prices on the GR07 or FX700's, so I'd have to decline.

I could order internationally, but then I'd have to add 19% tax (not the case if it's within Europe). The Dutch customs are evil. They _WILL_ find out what the item is really worth, even if the value on the box is set really low. Trust me, it happened multiple times that they somehow figured out the real value of the item, even though there wasn't even the slightest notice of it on the packaging documents.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> I don't know about the FX40's. They seem a little TOO cheap.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The thing about the FX40 is that they're on the same tier as the FXT90 (in my book, at least). I could send you my pair to have a listen, and decide where to go from there. Shoot me a PM if you're interested.


----------



## Tilpo

eke2k6 said:


> The thing about the FX40 is that they're on the same tier as the FXT90 (in my book, at least). I could send you my pair to have a listen, and decide where to go from there. Shoot me a PM if you're interested.




I'm just extremely skeptic, that's all.

I just want to shoot straight for mid-fi. That's what I planned to do initially, and that's what I'll really do. Still, hearing them could be fun. But seeing that the purchase costs of a new unit will be more or less equal to the shipping costs of one, I'd think it necessary for you to send on to me.
New they cost €30.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> I'm just extremely skeptic, that's all.
> I just want to shoot straight for mid-fi. That's what I planned to do initially, and that's what I'll really do. Still, hearing them could be fun. But seeing that the purchase costs of a new unit will be more or less equal to the shipping costs of one, I'd think it necessary for you to send on to me.
> New they cost €30.


 
   
   
  PM sent


----------



## ljokerl

Added Ultimate Ears 100. The downloadable chart has also been updated and now includes the 'i' column, as requested. It can be downloaded here. All work on the chart is done by carfentanil*.*
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3C22) Ultimate Ears 100*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## jjmai

arghhhh, you tricked me with the new title.
  I thought it was going to be UE TP10.


----------



## nck2205

Would love to read your opinion on the CK100pro if by any chance you get to review it.


----------



## eke2k6

Congrats on #250 j-man


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

So with my UE500, I figured out the best tips for my ears.

Stock tips: Smallest tips in the UE500 pack

Sony Hybrids: Orange/Small

Comply tips: The comply tips pdf on amazon states that the UE500 uses the T200 comply tips. I had the T400/medium from when I bought the Turbines, and I found them to actually sound the best, though they wrap around the thicker part of the UE500 shell, and not where the tips are supposed to end. 

I ordered a pack of SMALL T200 Comply tips, to see if it's as good. The stock Comply tips (I assume they're medium size, though fatter than the T400) that came in the UE500 box sounds good, but not as good as the T400...

Nothing beats that Comply comfort, but the T400 tips weren't made for them and are a pain in the ass to remove, lol. I accidentally ripped one. Good thing I have one more pair.

The small stock and hybrids sound great, but I don't see them staying on my ear all too well. The larger tips didn't sit well, caused driver flex, and ruined the balance of the sound. I guess I have small ear canals.


----------



## jgray91

Hi joker. Back again with another intention for some recommendations. I see that you referenced the MDR-7550 three times, and once on its soundstage, and you're planning to review it. So I was wondering if you have anything in mind that has a soundstage like the Sony (or close to it) with the sound signature of the JVC FXT90, with a little bit more bass extension and/or less harsh highs. Budget not more than $200 if it can be helped.
   
  EDIT: clarification.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





mad lust envy said:


> So with my UE500, I figured out the best tips for my ears.
> Stock tips: Smallest tips in the UE500 pack
> Sony Hybrids: Orange/Small
> Comply tips: The comply tips pdf on amazon states that the UE500 uses the T200 comply tips. I had the T400/medium from when I bought the Turbines, and I found them to actually sound the best, though they wrap around the thicker part of the UE500 shell, and not where the tips are supposed to end.
> ...


 
   
        yup , for two things , you may have a small ear canal and comply are really weak , you cant put any stress on them , this tip thing is really a pain for those who dont get what they want , not to mention im one of them , why dont you try out the monster super tips , its cheap for starter pack , but then gets expensive like 6 pairs of one size can set you back by $35 , at least here . i have the sony white ( clear ) tips on my ue 500/400 , its best for now till i find something else .
         

   
  i think something was written on them , but not anymore .


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

Oh, I'm too happy with the comply sound and comfort to get silicone tips. I just want the T200/small to see if they are as good as the T400, but with the proper seating on the shell.

I noticed that the comply tips make the UE500 seem harder to drive than the silicones, probably due to the distance between the driver and the ear.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

How is driver flex "good" or "bad"?  From my limited experience it seems to be either present or not present.  The stock Philips SHE3580 do not have driver flex because of the vent in front of the driver.  After I tried sealing a pair with superglue I get driver flex whenever I achieve an airtight seal with the tips; I need to pull on the ear with one hand while inserting with the other to avoid flex on insertion and after insertion, I know I have a tight seal if I get flex by pressing slightly the bud slightly in.  I assume this is a "bad" case of flex?  What would a "good" (but not nonexistent) case of flex be like?


----------



## H20Fidelity

joe bloggs said:


> How is driver flex "good" or "bad"?  From my limited experience it seems to be either present or not present.  The stock Philips SHE3580 do not have driver flex because of the vent in front of the driver.  After I tried sealing a pair with superglue I get driver flex whenever I achieve an airtight seal with the tips; I need to pull on the ear with one hand while inserting with the other to avoid flex on insertion and after insertion, I know I have a tight seal if I get flex by pressing slightly the bud slightly in.  I assume this is a "bad" case of flex?  What would a "good" (but not nonexistent) case of flex be like?




My Turbines right side flexes so bad if I crank them past a certain volume it pops everytime, and always when inserting them to a point the sound goes muffled. I either then need to lower the volume or re-seat them. I think they had a hard life. :rolleyes:


----------



## Mad Lust Envy

I notice that driver flex occurs with silicone, but never with the foam tips. on both the Turbines and the UE500.


----------



## H20Fidelity

mad lust envy said:


> I notice that driver flex occurs with silicone, but never with the foam tips. on both the Turbines and the UE500.




I think foam may allow the drivers to breath a touch.


----------



## suman134

need not to say , the ue 500 has lower sound level then others like xb41ex or even she 3590 . and yeah driver flex , mid ear madness . ue had some , not now .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> I think foam may allow the drivers to breath a touch.


 

 exactly . it dont let the pressure to build up .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jjmai said:


> arghhhh, you tricked me with the new title.
> I thought it was going to be UE TP10.


 
   





   
  Quote: 





nck2205 said:


> Would love to read your opinion on the CK100pro if by any chance you get to review it.


 
   
  Maybe someday; haven't made much of an effort to get one so far.
   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Congrats on #250 j-man


 
   
  Thank you.
   
  Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> Hi joker. Back again with another intention for some recommendations. I see that you referenced the MDR-7550 three times, and once on its soundstage, and you're planning to review it. So I was wondering if you have anything in mind that has a soundstage like the Sony (or close to it) with the sound signature of the JVC FXT90, with a little bit more bass extension and/or less harsh highs. Budget not more than $200 if it can be helped.
> 
> EDIT: clarification.


 
   
  The 7550, like the EX600 and EX1000, has less pronounced bass compared to an FXT90. For various reasons what you're looking for doesn't exist in that price range as far as I know - the JVC FX500, for example, is more harsh than the FXT90 and the GR07 doesn't sound as open as the Sonys and doesn't really share the more v-shaped sound of the JVCs. I think you'll have to give up on one of your requirements or cough up for an FX700.


----------



## jgray91

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  It's that rare?! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  How about if I put less emphasis on looking for similar soundstage and more on the refinement I'm looking for from the FXT90? (more bass extension, less harsh highs, almost the same mild U-shape). I'll still look into the FX700 still though, since it's still _a choice_.


----------



## Tilpo

eke2k6 said:


> Congrats on #250 j-man



I was just about to say that. 

Congrats, Joker. Writing 250 reviews sure is something, and it's a huge contribution to the community.


----------



## fauaad

Is there anything better than the GR02 Bass Edition when it comes to sub 50 USDs, bassy in ears?


----------



## tang63

Joker, will u be doing a review of Sennheiser IE80? Kinda looking forward to that review!  
   
  Also, Thanks for the detailed review on the wide range of headphones. Really helpful to newbies like me


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





fauaad said:


> Is there anything better than the GR02 Bass Edition when it comes to sub 50 USDs, bassy in ears?


 

      nope , but i like man utd too !!! bit off topic , hope you guys dont kind .


----------



## nicholars

Yes I would like to see an IE80 review as well.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Yes I would like to see an IE80 review as well.


 

 +1
   
  Both the IE80 and the TF10
   
  ljokerl,
   
  By the way, I remember sometime ago reading that you were going to receive an Fitear MH334 toGo!, is that true? have you received yet?(are you on the way to review it in that case???)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> It's that rare?!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Still no perfect fit IMO. You might like the EPH-100 better than the FXT90 since it has a little less treble energy and more bass response. It's also less forward than the JVCs, which helps with soundstaging.
   
   
  Quote: 





tilpo said:


> I was just about to say that.
> Congrats, Joker. Writing 250 reviews sure is something, and it's a huge contribution to the community.


 
   
  Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





fauaad said:


> Is there anything better than the GR02 Bass Edition when it comes to sub 50 USDs, bassy in ears?


 
   
  Not that I can think of, unless you require ridiculous levels of bass or are sensitive to treble unevenness. 
   
  Quote: 





tang63 said:


> Joker, will u be doing a review of Sennheiser IE80? Kinda looking forward to that review!
> 
> Also, Thanks for the detailed review on the wide range of headphones. Really helpful to newbies like me


 
   
  Sorry, no plans for an IE80 review at this time but maybe in the future.
   
  Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> +1
> 
> Both the IE80 and the TF10
> 
> ...


 
   
  An MH334 was gifted to me by the community but unfortunately life has been getting in the way of my posting its full review. It's something I've been working on (on and off) for months. Hopefully it'll be finished and posted next month.


----------



## jgray91

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Still no perfect fit IMO. You might like the EPH-100 better than the FXT90 since it has a little less treble energy and more bass response. It's also less forward than the JVCs, which helps with soundstaging.


 
  Ahh, that's what I suspected months ago. Still, thanks for all your help so far. It's remedied for now with EQ while using the 7550, but that's not a permanent set up.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> An MH334 was gifted to me by the community but unfortunately life has been getting in the way of my posting its full review. It's something I've been working on (on and off) for months. Hopefully it'll be finished and posted next month.


 
           easy man , take your time , hope these things are not taking a toll on you , i know its quiet stressful , huge archive of reviews , responding to everyone , job  and commitments are like living another life with in this small life , take your time , just take it easy  .


----------



## fauaad

Quote: 





> Not that I can think of, unless you require ridiculous levels of bass or are sensitive to treble unevenness.


 
   
   
  Suppose I did require ridiculous levels of bass, what would you recommend me?
 And treble unevenness? Could you elaborate on that a bit? I don't really know what that means.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fauaad said:


> Suppose I did require ridiculous levels of bass, what would you recommend me?


 
   
  For more bass than the GR02 you'd have to look at something like the Sony XB40EX, MEElectronics M31, or Padacs Aksent. 
   
   
  Quote: 





fauaad said:


> And treble unevenness? Could you elaborate on that a bit? I don't really know what that means.


 
   
  The GR02 has a somewhat 'hot' top end and can accentuate treble sibilance. Some people are sensitive to this and will much prefer something with a flatter or more laid-back treble presentation.


----------



## nicholars

Joker how do you get to trial so many different headphones?
   
  Do you have industry contacts or do you just buy / sell a lot of different headphones?
   
  Sorry for being nosy I am just interested how you get so many headphones lol.


----------



## AstralStorm

Since I don't think starting a new thread would bring anything useful:
  Which IEM do you consider the most extended (bandwidth) of all of the universals?
  Would any of these be suitable for deep fit and have slim build an/or narrow nozzle, preferably working well with foam?
   
  Dynamic drivers or moving armatures are preferred.
   
  Current list is perhaps:
  VSonic GR01, Etymotic MC5, Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII, Etymotic HF5.
  Also probably j-phonic K2 SP, once the site is up.
  While Westone IEMs isolate well, they are too dark for my taste.


----------



## Tilpo

astralstorm said:


> Since I don't think starting a new thread would bring anything useful:
> *Which IEM do you consider the most extended (bandwidth) of all of the universals?*
> Would any of these be suitable for deep fit and have slim build an/or narrow nozzle, preferably working well with foam?




I would think that it's a bit weird to ask that. The high frequencies are relatively easy to reproduce, so it would only be a question of how low the bass extents. 
While bass extension of IEM's is definitely sub-optimal (compared to full sized headphones, or especially sub woofers), a lot of IEM's can still extent pretty far. Not that it really matters all that much, since our hearing is insensitive to low bass notes in any case.


----------



## AstralStorm

You'd be suprised, most IEMs end around 18 kHz and roll off even earlier.
  There are a bunch of IEMs that reach 20 Hz indeed with plenty of power, but the only ones I've tried that reach all the way up were SE-5 Reference custom and Hifiman RE-272 (never again, hardening cable went brittle and broke by the earpiece - also it's not suitable for deep fit).


----------



## Tilpo

astralstorm said:


> You'd be suprised, most IEMs end around 18 kHz and roll off even earlier.
> There are a bunch of IEMs that reach 20 Hz indeed with plenty of power, but the only ones I've tried that reach all the way up were SE-5 Reference custom and Hifiman RE-272 (never again, hardening cable went brittle and broke by the earpiece - also it's not suitable for deep fit).




So what if it rolls off at 18kHz? 
Those frequencies are pretty useless, if we can hear them at all. 

With small drivers reaching all the way down to 20Hz is not really necessary either. Those are frequencies that you feel much more than that you hear them. And there is no way you're gonna feel them with such a small driver. 

Imo decent extension from 40-16kHz should be plenty for an IEM.
You should be worrying more about other sound quality factors more than bandwith, _if you ask me._


Wanting deep extension is completely fine with me, but in my personal opinion other factors are simply more important.


----------



## nicholars

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> Imo decent extension from 40-16kHz should be plenty for an IEM.


 
   
  Maybe more like 15hz - 18Khz would be optimal...
   
  Unless you are a bat or a dolphin or similar then you will not be able to hear anything higher.


----------



## AstralStorm

Except if you haven't destroyed your hearing and can hear 20-20 still. Which I happen to.
  (Pity my eyesight is nowhere near it.)
   
  The highest end is audible as "air", also helps with soundstaging and positioning.
   
  Amended list of deep fit IEMs:
  VSonic GR01, Fischer Audio DBA-02 (and mkII), any Etymotic.
  Anything else that sounds nice? I'd prefer non-lean if possible.


----------



## Tilpo

astralstorm said:


> Except if you haven't destroyed your hearing and can hear 20-20 still. Which I happen to.
> (Pity my eyesight is nowhere near it.)
> 
> The highest end is audible as "air", *also helps with soundstaging and positioning.*
> ...




No it doesn't. 
Not to be snobbish, but I have seriously studied a university text book on psychoacoustics, so I should know. 

>16kHz information is identifiable, and does add something to the overall timbre of the sound (though very subtle). However, removing it wouldn't change the fidelity. It would just make it sound 'different', with the listener having difficulty pointing out just exactly what is different.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> So what if it rolls off at 18kHz?
> Those frequencies are pretty useless, if we can hear them at all.
> With small drivers reaching all the way down to 20Hz is not really necessary either. Those are frequencies that you feel much more than that you hear them. And there is no way you're gonna feel them with such a small driver.
> Imo decent extension from 40-16kHz should be plenty for an IEM.
> ...


 
   
  I can hear and feel it just fine down at 15Hz (or 12Hz for that matter) with my IEMs (Philips SHE3580) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Have you actually tested the extension on the two ends of your headphones with something like Sinegen?


----------



## Tilpo

joe bloggs said:


> I can hear and feel it just fine down at 15Hz (or 12Hz for that matter) with my IEMs (Philips SHE3580)
> 
> Have you actually tested the extension on the two ends of your headphones with something like Sinegen?




I haven't tested it myself, but I suspect that what you're hearing at those frequencies are the distortions of the driver.
I.e. you're probably hearing harmonics, rather than the fundamental itself. 


I'm sure you can feel it. I can too. But in my opinion that is definitely not the most important factor for good sound quality.


----------



## nicholars

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> No it doesn't.
> Not to be snobbish, but I have seriously studied a university text book on psychoacoustics, so I should know.
> >16kHz information is identifiable, and does add something to the overall timbre of the sound (though very subtle). However, removing it wouldn't change the fidelity. It would just make it sound 'different', with the listener having difficulty pointing out just exactly what is different.


 
   
  Clearly astral has superior hearing ability and a greater knowledge than most normal people so do not dis-respect him. He is the dolphin man.


----------



## Tilpo

nicholars said:


> Clearly astral has superior hearing ability and a greater knowledge than most normal people so do not dis-respect him. He is the dolphin man.




Putting it that way is simply rude. Please refrain from doing that. 


I'm not trying to ridicule anyone, rather I'm attempting to be helpful and share my knowledge. If that is not appreciated, I can leave this conversation.


----------



## nicholars

I was just joking no offense meant.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





tilpo said:


> I haven't tested it myself, but I suspect that what you're hearing at those frequencies are the distortions of the driver.
> I.e. you're probably hearing harmonics, rather than the fundamental itself.
> I'm sure you can feel it. I can too. But in my opinion that is definitely not the most important factor for good sound quality.


 
   
  I doubt it; if I push them too hard there's a point beyond which I can hear distortion.  But below that it's just pure earthshaking bass.  Below this distortion threshold I can't hear it down at 10Hz but I can detect it as modulation of my breathing (ie when I breath in and out, instead of an even breathing sound I can hear and feel the breathing as a 10Hz stutter 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 )


----------



## AstralStorm

The more important part is that the lower cutoff correlates often with a sharper and lower rolloff.
  This does affect soundstaging and general brightness feeling (but the latter less than 3-8k range).
   
  Frequencies in range of about 100 Hz - 15 kHz cause noticeable soundstaging/positioning changes to my ears; highers just cause more feel of an open space as opposed to enclosed.
  For the record, I hear up to 19.5 kHz.
   
  Quite a few high fidelity dynamic drivers can reproduce some infrasonics, e.g. in 15-20 Hz range, esp. the larger ones. (relative to distance)
  The frequencies below 18 Hz feel to me like pumping or such - felt down to 16 Hz. (DT1350)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Joker how do you get to trial so many different headphones?
> 
> Do you have industry contacts or do you just buy / sell a lot of different headphones?
> 
> Sorry for being nosy I am just interested how you get so many headphones lol.


 
   
   
  I started out doing a lot of buying and selling but over time people have just started sending me things. Most of my high end IEMs come from other Head-Fi members. I still buy a few here and there but not too often these days. I used to request manufacturer samples but don't have time to deal with that anymore. Occasionally manufacturers or distributors will contact me and if I have time I'll get a review sample that way.
   
    
  Quote:


astralstorm said:


> Since I don't think starting a new thread would bring anything useful:
> Which IEM do you consider the most extended (bandwidth) of all of the universals?
> Would any of these be suitable for deep fit and have slim build an/or narrow nozzle, preferably working well with foam?
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  I think dynamics can often do better in this regard than BA-based sets - the IE8 I heard had very good extension, for example. Most IEMs don't extend past 18k in my experience but I only consider it a problem if they drop off heavily before 16 (or 15 for entry-level stuff). I don't think presence above 16k will make or break an IEM for most people but I agree that rolled-off treble tends to reduce 'air'. As a side note, I think the VSonic GR07 and Sony EX1000 are both interesting in lacking that very top bit of extension despite good overall treble energy. For the record, I currently trust my hearing to around 17.5.
   
   
  Unfortunately you're probably looking for non-lean in the wrong place with Etys and TWFK-based sets (I'm assuming your SE 5-way has good note weight similar to my SE 3-way here). Most TWFK-based sets will easily reach the limit of my hearing (the ATH-CK10, for example, is quite strong at 17k) but they won't have the note thickness of an SM3 or SE 3-way. 
   
  Sorry for the brevity, I'm on a mobile device.


----------



## jgray91

Say, joker, is the GR07 responsive with EQ? I'm thinking to get it just for the soundstage and just play with EQ for what I need.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

In my experience (as a ten-year member of team EQ  ) anything will respond to EQ as long as you don't introduce digital clipping and you aren't trying to push the phones past thier bass / treble extension limits. Soundstage can also be affected by eq, especially parametric eq shaped according to your HRTF. That's very hit and miss without measurements of course but the fact remains that the same phones can have good soundstage for one person but bad for another.


----------



## fauaad

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR02 has a somewhat 'hot' top end and can accentuate treble sibilance. Some people are sensitive to this and will much prefer something with a flatter or more laid-back treble presentation.


 
   
  Okay, that might be a problem. I'm not against bright-sounding headphones (heck, I sold off my PX 100-IIs within a month cause I found them too boring), but I do have issues with treble. At times it can be too shrill for me. Hmmm.
  Is there any other option in the same category? What about the new JVCs, the FX40? Head-fi's gone crazy about them lately. Have you had a chance to try them out yet?


----------



## alex d

Any chance of a rockit sounds r 50 review in future?


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately you're probably looking for non-lean in the wrong place with Etys and TWFK-based sets (I'm assuming your SE 5-way has good note weight similar to my SE 3-way here). Most TWFK-based sets will easily reach the limit of my hearing (the ATH-CK10, for example, is quite strong at 17k) but they won't have the note thickness of an SM3 or SE 3-way.


 
    
  The main goal is to have deep, isolating fit in an universal with foam tips and as few sonic compromises as possible. I'm not specifically looking for note thickness (heck, I had RE-272 and was pretty happy with it for a time), but would like as little roll off as possible.
   
  I cannot properly deep fit GR07 with foams, there aren't any long enough and small enough tips. I think small nozzle size will work better.
   
  Quote:


jgray91 said:


> Say, joker, is the GR07 responsive with EQ? I'm thinking to get it just for the soundstage and just play with EQ for what I need.


 
  I can say from experience that GR07 can be equalized in a very wide range without overload and distortion. You'll never get rid of a hint of sibilance though, as that seems to be caused by some resonance and not just hot 6k frequency response.


----------



## Matt V

I just want to say that I have immensely studied this thread with a couple headphones I was interested in, awesome work. Would you consider checking out a set of the JVC HA-FX1X? There is already a large discussion thread on them here. 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/577508/jvc-ha-fx1x-xtreme-xplosive-impressions-hopefully-fan-thread


----------



## Joe Bloggs

joker's policy seems to prioritize less-publicized phones over phones that already have a large discussion / fan thread.


----------



## cibibikeru

I just recieved my GR04 Pro/Flagship and all I can say is WOW.. except one thing.. like the GR02, harsh 6k-10k band and "ssss", I hope they settle in after first hundred hours or whatever, it's not an issue with all songs but when it is, it's a little disturbing, anyway I think I'll try foam tips which should absorb some of the "s" quantity, right? ..and play a little with the eq on my sansa.. Overall, incredible sound for 50$.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> I just recieved my GR04 Pro/Flagship and all I can say is WOW.. except one thing.. like the GR02, harsh 6k-10k band and "ssss", I hope they settle in after first hundred hours or whatever, it's not an issue with all songs but when it is, it's a little disturbing, anyway I think I'll try foam tips which should absorb some of the "s" quantity, right? ..and play a little with the eq on my sansa.. Overall, incredible sound for 50$.


 

 Gotta say it...toldja so! I have to ask, are you having any driver flex? I'm having a little bit in the left ear.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Gotta say it...toldja so! I have to ask, are you having any driver flex? I'm having a little bit in the left ear.


 

        driver flex is a thing which involves the earphone and a ear too , in my case , i have driver flex in my right most of the time , rarely in the left , i dont remember when i had it in my left . but had it in my right yesterday with ue 400/500 . best solution , foam tips .


----------



## alex d

Which of these is best for casual listeing (all same price)
  JVC ha fxt90l2
  Rockit sounds r 50
  Jays q jays
  acs t15 (used)
  yamaha eph 100
  radius hptwf11k (used)
  panasonic hje 900
  brainwavz b2


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





alex d said:


> Which of these is best for casual listeing (all same price)
> JVC ha fxt90l2
> Rockit sounds r 50
> Jays q jays
> ...


 

   just a bit of advice , for casual listening take the one with strong cable and build . i think for a fun listening jvc and yamaha will do it .


----------



## Add1son89

Quote: 





alex d said:


> Which of these is best for casual listeing (all same price)
> JVC ha fxt90l2
> Rockit sounds r 50
> Jays q jays
> ...


 
  I dun really like jays. I used to own one and it spoilt really fast.. So i wun recommend that.


----------



## AstralStorm

JVC is excellent sound, but shallow fit means relatively low isolation.
  Panasonic is quite heavy, thus not that great for listening on the move - otherwise rock solid. Also shallow fit.
  Yamaha has a bit smooth sound, but excellent build quality and fit.
  Jays would be nice if not for the hardening cable, which is prone to break after some time.
  ACS T15 and Brainwavz B2 are pretty bright, good for analytic listening but not necessarily casual. The latter also has some plasticky build quality.
  Radius TWF11 is supposedly pretty bad fit and not that great build quality.
  Rockit is pretty rare and I don't know it at all.
   
  You might like VSonic GR07 mkII or GR06 of course.


----------



## DEZ

Which IEM comes closest to the sound of the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II?
  I´m looking at the Meeceltronics A161, Yamaha Eph-100, REO....do any of these have a similar sound presentation to the HD 25?
  If not, any recommendations?
   
  Thanks


----------



## Tilpo

dez said:


> Which IEM comes closest to the sound of the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II?
> I´m looking at the Meeceltronics A161, Yamaha Eph-100, REO....do any of these have a similar sound presentation to the HD 25?
> If not, any recommendations?
> 
> Thanks




What exactly is it you like about the HD 25-1 II's if I may ask?

I personally found my IE80's to have a very similar sound signature to my HD 25-1 II's. Though I don't know whether this is because of my inexperience with IEM's, or because it was intentional.


----------



## zmd

@DEZ: I dumped my HD25s for a pair of Meelec CC51s and I'm still not regretting it, and I _loved _the Sennheisers. Great bass, lively highs and crunchy but a bit distant midrange. Clear and very engaging sound, in short. They're about $50 so you don't really have much to lose by trying them.
   
  Which brings me to my next point: I wanna upgrade. I have the CC51, love them, but have a bit of a fit issue (small canals). I also ordered the Meelec A151 on a whim, don't really care for the sound, too warm and a bit smudged, IMO. What I'm looking for is an upgrade to the CC51, with maybe a better midrange, while keeping the clarity and engaging sound (read slight V-shape). My first target is the A161p, but I'm a bit reluctant, as it's a BA and might be lacking in bass and treble. Budget is a factor - around $100, as is availability, since I live in Europe and things here are expensive and hard to come by.
   
  Sorry for the long post. TL;DR version: upgrade to the CC51s, 100$. A161p yes or no? Thanks for tuning in.


----------



## DEZ

I like they are well-balanced offering good clarity and detail, the bass has pretty good depth and great impact without bloating and overpowering other frequencies.


----------



## DEZ

Quote: 





zmd said:


> @DEZ: I dumped my HD25s for a pair of Meelec CC51s and I'm still not regretting it, and I _loved _the Sennheisers. Great bass, lively highs and crunchy but a bit distant midrange. Clear and very engaging sound, in short. They're about $50 so you don't really have much to lose by trying them.
> 
> Which brings me to my next point: I wanna upgrade. I have the CC51, love them, but have a bit of a fit issue (small canals). I also ordered the Meelec A151 on a whim, don't really care for the sound, too warm and a bit smudged, IMO. What I'm looking for is an upgrade to the CC51, with maybe a better midrange, while keeping the clarity and engaging sound (read slight V-shape). My first target is the A161p, but I'm a bit reluctant, as it's a BA and might be lacking in bass and treble. Budget is a factor - around $100, as is availability, since I live in Europe and things here are expensive and hard to come by.
> 
> Sorry for the long post. TL;DR version: upgrade to the CC51s, 100$. A161p yes or no? Thanks for tuning in.


 
  Thanks, zmd
   
  I´m also interested in the A161´s they fit my budget $100-$150 but I´m also reluctant because they might be lacking in Bass.  
  I´m also considering the Yamaha eph-100, i´m pretty sure Bass would be fine but not sure about the mids or treble??
  Can anybody compare either of these IEMs to the HD25?


----------



## blackmarket

YO i just got the jvc fxt90 and they sound very nice considering i got them for 112$ including tax but as mentioned, their shallow fit doesn't allow for much isolation. These also have very large nozzles and none of the tips from my other earphones fit these. Anyone know of some longer tips that would fit the fxt90?


----------



## walkman_heart

joker, i have fx500 and tf10, i'm planning to save-up for new iem
   
  just wanted to ask you, if the miracle is massive upgrade from these?
   
  i love my fx500 due to its sub bass, timbre, soundstage and airy highs
   
  and i also love my tf10 due it's midbass, details and mids
   
  can i get the best of both worlds in miracle?
   
  or any iem you may suggest?
   
  thank you,


----------



## psygeist

^^those are V shaped IEMs. Miracle is on neutral side.


----------



## dustdevil

Just bought a pair of etymotic hf5 which I thought is brand new but in fact is opened box and am not even sure if it is used or not for $130 in a store, I was pretty upset when I find out about it but not anymore when I put them in my ear, they isolates quite good which is one of the reason why I bought them, and they sounds very balanced and detailed, nothing seems to be missing from them unlike the jvc fx40, which also sounds pretty detailed but has a v-shaped frequency response with quite a few peaks and dips.
  I won't be purchasing anymore earphones until my hf5 stops working.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Mine has a I plug instead of the 45 degree plug that joker has reviewed, I suppose mine are the older version?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Here's to hoping your hf5 keep working for a long time 

I'm surprised you're not flat-out amazed by their isolation though. try some more tips?


----------



## dfrost

blackmarket said:


> YO i just got the jvc fxt90 and they sound very nice considering i got them for 112$ including tax but as mentioned, their shallow fit doesn't allow for much isolation. These also have very large nozzles and none of the tips from my other earphones fit these. Anyone know of some longer tips that would fit the fxt90?



I've used RadioShack hybrids, but find I prefer the short biflanges that are included in the MEElec M11+ tip kit in three sizes, or also available (more expensively) as Sennheiser CX300 tips from Amazon. BTW, I get a deeper, more secure fit with these and plenty of isolation, but they also keep the bass in better balance with the rest of the spectrum IMHO.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Here's to hoping your hf5 keep working for a long time
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  Probably he haven't got the tips/insertion right yet, it took me quite a while to get the triple-flange on the right depth, in the begining it was too shalow(and so didn't isolate), then I tried it too deep(yes, it was dumb, at least I stoped before I did any damage), and finaly I got the depth right, and well, half of the world around me was gone.
   
  It may be wishfull thinking, but is it possible to get the same level of isolation with the Westone 4(using some magical tips?) as I get with the HF5 + triple flange( I (sadly) accept that I won't be getting the same type of isolation I get with the ety-foam tips........)


----------



## Rangotherabbit

Wow. I've never seen a more comprehensive review of iem's. This is perfect for a reference point when deciding what to buy/suggest. Even with listening to many IEM's, i cant remember what they all sound like, and I don't get to see what they come with brand new.
  For the sennheiser ie8's, the favorite tip/buds are the single flange silicon. Mine came with foam buds that are much better then the silicon, but they might not have been included... oh wait i can check.
   
  Apparently it came with "foam hybrid" buds. That must be different from normal foam buds, which is what i got. 
  The foam buds i got are brilliant, they have a shallow fit like all the other buds, so the passive isolation isn't brilliant, but when playing music they block noise excellently, and at moderate volumes.
  The 2.5 for isolation is a bit harsh, the cx 300 got 3.5, i have them, and the ie8's isolation is much better, so it could be a 4 at least.
  It does depend highly on the foam buds though.
   
  Well, i just tested the isolation of the cx 300 and ie8 using my speakers.
  My test involved playing music at a volume of 12 on my sony walkman while turning the speakers up until i could definitely hear the music coming from them over the music from the iem's. The cx 300's achieved about 16 volume, the ie8 achieved.... about 8....
  I'm not surprised they got the 2.5 now. The isolation is enough for trains, etc, but it still sucks because of the shallow seal.
  Turning the walkman up to 18 volume still only isolated to 16/17 volume on the speakers... At that volume the cx 300's block the speakers up to about 27/28.


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Probably he haven't got the tips/insertion right yet, it took me quite a while to get the triple-flange on the right depth, in the begining it was too shalow(and so didn't isolate), then I tried it too deep(yes, it was dumb, at least I stoped before I did any damage), and finaly I got the depth right, and well, half of the world around me was gone.
> 
> It may be wishfull thinking, but is it possible to get the same level of isolation with the Westone 4(using some magical tips?) as I get with the HF5 + triple flange( I (sadly) accept that I won't be getting the same type of isolation I get with the ety-foam tips........)


 
  I'm pretty sure I'm inserting them deep enough, if I insert them any further I will damage my eardrum.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 They do isolate very good, it could just be that my expectations are too high.


----------



## suman134

hey guy , the ue 9OO is out !!! with 4 BAs , small , blue , and looks good , waiting for some hands on review . hope it will be better then some quad BA and will be the top dog .


----------



## AstralStorm

Given UE's track record IMO (yes, I know only 5 models, none custom), it should be good, but not likely groundbreaking and probably too expensive.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jgray91 said:


> Say, joker, is the GR07 responsive with EQ? I'm thinking to get it just for the soundstage and just play with EQ for what I need.


 
   
  Yes, quite responsive.
   
  Quote: 





fauaad said:


> Okay, that might be a problem. I'm not against bright-sounding headphones (heck, I sold off my PX 100-IIs within a month cause I found them too boring), but I do have issues with treble. At times it can be too shrill for me. Hmmm.
> Is there any other option in the same category? What about the new JVCs, the FX40? Head-fi's gone crazy about them lately. Have you had a chance to try them out yet?


 
   
  Yes, I have had an FX40. It did not sound right to me - too recessed in the lower midrange and too aggressive in the treble. It's very detailed and clear but I'll take the GR02 any day. 
   
    
  Quote:


alex d said:


> Any chance of a rockit sounds r 50 review in future?


 
   
  Yes! (for once I can say yes to one of these)
    
  Quote:


matt v said:


> I just want to say that I have immensely studied this thread with a couple headphones I was interested in, awesome work. Would you consider checking out a set of the JVC HA-FX1X? There is already a large discussion thread on them here.
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/577508/jvc-ha-fx1x-xtreme-xplosive-impressions-hopefully-fan-thread


 
   
  I actually have heard the FX1X recently but was very disappointed by how bloated the bass was. I have an FX101 here that I will review soon if I can find time.
    
  Quote:


cibibikeru said:


> I just recieved my GR04 Pro/Flagship and all I can say is WOW.. except one thing.. like the GR02, harsh 6k-10k band and "ssss", I hope they settle in after first hundred hours or whatever, it's not an issue with all songs but when it is, it's a little disturbing, anyway I think I'll try foam tips which should absorb some of the "s" quantity, right? ..and play a little with the eq on my sansa.. Overall, incredible sound for 50$.


 
   
  Sibilance seems to be a house thing with VSonic dynamic drivers. Only the GR99 doesn't really have any.
    
  Quote:


alex d said:


> Which of these is best for casual listeing (all same price)
> JVC ha fxt90l2
> Rockit sounds r 50
> Jays q jays
> ...


 
   
  Those are all over the place in terms of sound - you really need to figure out what kind of signature you are looking for. The EPH-100 and TWF11K would probably be the safest choices if you really don't know what you want. 
   
  Quote: 





dez said:


> Which IEM comes closest to the sound of the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II?
> I´m looking at the Meeceltronics A161, Yamaha Eph-100, REO....do any of these have a similar sound presentation to the HD 25?
> If not, any recommendations?
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  They all have their pros and cons but I wouldn't say the A161P or RE0 are particularly reminiscent of the HD25 - both have less bass (the RE0 even less than A161P), more forward mids, and smoother treble. That's not to say you won't like them, though, especially if you're just looking for balance, clarity, and detail. The EPH-100 is closer in being similar to the HD25 in bass response - still not a great match for the Sennheisers' signature overall with its darker tone but not bad. The JVCs in that price range (FXT90 or FX500) may be an even better match. 
   
  Quote: 





zmd said:


> @DEZ: I dumped my HD25s for a pair of Meelec CC51s and I'm still not regretting it, and I _loved _the Sennheisers. Great bass, lively highs and crunchy but a bit distant midrange. Clear and very engaging sound, in short. They're about $50 so you don't really have much to lose by trying them.
> 
> Which brings me to my next point: I wanna upgrade. I have the CC51, love them, but have a bit of a fit issue (small canals). I also ordered the Meelec A151 on a whim, don't really care for the sound, too warm and a bit smudged, IMO. What I'm looking for is an upgrade to the CC51, with maybe a better midrange, while keeping the clarity and engaging sound (read slight V-shape). My first target is the A161p, but I'm a bit reluctant, as it's a BA and might be lacking in bass and treble. Budget is a factor - around $100, as is availability, since I live in Europe and things here are expensive and hard to come by.
> 
> Sorry for the long post. TL;DR version: upgrade to the CC51s, 100$. A161p yes or no? Thanks for tuning in.


 
   
  The CC51 is a good match for the HD25. The A161P isn't v-shaped but it definitely is a step up over the A151 - much more balanced and clean, with deeper bass and better treble extension. The A151 is lacking a bit on both ends of the spectrum and the CC51 is a bit overzealous with midbass but the A161P is closer to 'just right'. Clearly not 'it' if you're looking for a v-shape response but one of the better IEMs in the price range IMO.  
   
  Quote: 





blackmarket said:


> YO i just got the jvc fxt90 and they sound very nice considering i got them for 112$ including tax but as mentioned, their shallow fit doesn't allow for much isolation. These also have very large nozzles and none of the tips from my other earphones fit these. Anyone know of some longer tips that would fit the fxt90?


 
   
  MEElec bi-flange tips worked for me, especially the shorter ones from the M11+.
   
  Quote: 





walkman_heart said:


> joker, i have fx500 and tf10, i'm planning to save-up for new iem
> 
> just wanted to ask you, if the miracle is massive upgrade from these?
> 
> ...


 
   
  The Miracle is not midbassy - it's definitely a large upgrade over both of your earphones but perhaps not the right upgrade for you. The AKG K3003 seems like it would be closer to what you want and I'm sure there are a bunch of customs out there that I haven't heard with bassier sound than the Miracle. 
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Just bought a pair of etymotic hf5 which I thought is brand new but in fact is opened box and am not even sure if it is used or not for $130 in a store, I was pretty upset when I find out about it but not anymore when I put them in my ear, they isolates quite good which is one of the reason why I bought them, and they sounds very balanced and detailed, nothing seems to be missing from them unlike the jvc fx40, which also sounds pretty detailed but has a v-shaped frequency response with quite a few peaks and dips.
> I won't be purchasing anymore earphones until my hf5 stops working.
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Congrats on the HF5 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Probably he haven't got the tips/insertion right yet, it took me quite a while to get the triple-flange on the right depth, in the begining it was too shalow(and so didn't isolate), then I tried it too deep(yes, it was dumb, at least I stoped before I did any damage), and finaly I got the depth right, and well, half of the world around me was gone.
> 
> It may be wishfull thinking, but is it possible to get the same level of isolation with the Westone 4(using some magical tips?) as I get with the HF5 + triple flange( I (sadly) accept that I won't be getting the same type of isolation I get with the ety-foam tips........)


 
   
  You can get pretty close with Westone triples on the W4 but the shape of your ears will play a bigger role than with the straight-barrel HF5s.


----------



## Tilpo

I'm having comfort issues on my newly bought IE80's.

All of the stock tips are too large for my right ear and cause pain and irritation on prolonged use. The only tip that kinda works is the small foam tip, but even that one is still a little bit too large. 
My left ear is problem-less and I can comfortably fit anything from small to large tips in that ear. 

I'm looking for some new tips. Ones that can fit comfortably in small ears.


----------



## AstralStorm

Those are 5.5mm nozzle - this might be the problem already.
  I'd try Comply Ts500, small. Jays foams or single flanges might work too.


----------



## kamcok

Hey joker, 
 Do you think you're gonna get the JVC nanotube series and review them at all anytime soon ?
 (HA-FX40 - HA-FXD80-Z) 
 cheers


----------



## Tilpo

astralstorm said:


> Those are 5.5mm nozzle - this might be the problem already.
> I'd try Comply Ts500, small. Jays foams or single flanges might work too.



Comply's website says the IE80 needs the 400 series. The IE8 needs the 500 series. 

How do you measure nozzle size by the way?
There is a thick part, and a recessed part. The thick part is 6.5mm, the recessed part 5mm.


And why specifically the Ts if I may ask? the T and Tx look slimmer.


----------



## AstralStorm

Oh. They did change the nozzle size. Ts400 then.

In my experience, the spherical tips change sound less and are more comfortable.


----------



## alex d

I've just seen the brookstone clear dual driver iem. Is this an exact copy of the radius hp twf11? if so why is it so cheap?


----------



## alex d

Is it worth buying and recabling a pair of klipsch custom 3's for total cost around $130


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kamcok said:


> Hey joker,
> Do you think you're gonna get the JVC nanotube series and review them at all anytime soon ?
> (HA-FX40 - HA-FXD80-Z)
> cheers


 
   
  I was not a fan of the FX40 but I'm working on an FXD80 review.
   
   
  Quote: 





alex d said:


> I've just seen the brookstone clear dual driver iem. Is this an exact copy of the radius hp twf11? if so why is it so cheap?


 
   
  Actually the TWF21, not the TWF11. QC is lacking in my experience but otherwise it is pretty close to the Radius. Actually some have said QC is lacking with Radius sets also so maybe they are not different at all.
   
  Quote: 





alex d said:


> Is it worth buying and recabling a pair of klipsch custom 3's for total cost around $130


 
   
  Probably not if you have to do the work yourself. There's tons of other great options in the $150 range and even some sub-$100 sets like the MEElec A161P that will give the Custom 3 a run for the money.


----------



## alex d

Thanks for the help. I think I've settled on a pair of sony mdr ex600s. I tried out my friends recently and loved the build quality, and they just  fit me perfectly. Sound great too.


----------



## marald

Hi guys! i recently sold my Soundmagic PL30 and got a pair of VSonic gr99.
  Vsonic's ar far the best IEM i ever tried, but i would like to try something more expensive..
   
  I listen to electronic/trance/house music (with sweet female vocals and deep bass), hip hop, and sometimes rock and metal.
  I'm looking for an IEM with a good mid and a punchy bass when it's needed
   
  I've got my eyes on:
   
  Vsonic GR06 (Mid centric with over-the-ear form factor that i loved on my PL30)
   
  Sunrise SW-Xcape impressive ed. (balanced, seem to fit my requirements)
   
  Soundmagic PL50 (or MEElec a151, astrotec AM90..i'd like to try a BA but it seems that people coming from Dinamic Drivers hear a noticeable lack of bass.. i'm afraid i would be disappointed)
   
  Any help?
  Thanks!


----------



## scootsit

marald said:


> Hi guys! i recently sold my Soundmagic PL30 and got a pair of VSonic gr99.
> Vsonic's ar far the best IEM i ever tried, but i would like to try something more expensive..
> 
> I listen to electronic/trance/house music (with sweet female vocals and deep bass), hip hop, and sometimes rock and metal.
> ...




I cannot comment on many of those, but if you're going for a Vsonic, I'd recommend the GR04 Flagship Pro if you can still find them. They're technically a step up from the 06, and can be found for about $50 because they're being discontinued.


----------



## suman134

try the cc51 ,  abit of bass lacking , but not like orthodox BAs , the bass is bigger , nearly equal to ue 400/500 . and other spectrum is also taken care of , im not explaining much , cuz its already explained in the review . a bit heavy may be , a bit weak cable , but really good sound for just $55 . or the eu 400 , my fav under $60 , neck to neck with low end BAs .


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *marald* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I listen to electronic/trance/house music (with sweet female vocals and deep bass), hip hop, and sometimes rock and metal.
> I'm looking for an IEM with a good mid and a punchy bass when it's needed


 
   
  Here's the thing: Siren and TWFK based armature IEMs don't lack bass at all. I've just grabbed Brainwavz B2 after audition and can personally vouch for that.
   
  Astrotec AM90 and MEElectronics A151 are Siren-based, while Fischer Audio DBA-02 and mkII, Brainwavz B2, VSonic GR01 and ATH K3003 (I think, never heard it) are TWFK-based.
   
  TWFK boasts superb highs quality and detailing without any lack of bass. They're definitely *not* for people who want lots of boosted bass; it is exactly the right amount. Subbass is solid but very fast. Could use a bit more impact.
  Siren boasts more liquid mids and lower amount of high end, less air and lower price. Slower bass but less solid.
   
  For comparison, VSonic GR07 (same price range dynamic) has bass about as fast as Siren, but quite a lot more impact. It lacks the air and absolute detailing of either, is about as smooth as Siren-based armature. It is warmer than either of the two armatures.
   
  Sunrise Xcape is a bad pick for electronica IMO, it's pretty mid-centric with upper vocal range boost. It will gloss over detailing required to reproduce it faithfully. The boost will also make any boost present in the track that much more jarring.
   
  Soundmagic PL50 is pretty decent pick, VSonic GR06 too, but not as airy and slightly hot. I don't like GR06 and GR07's brand of hotness on any kind of female vocals.


----------



## olear

joker, have you heard the Sony 7550? I understand they are quite similar to the ex1000, except the 7550 mids are more forward and are less bright.  Thanks


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





marald said:


> Hi guys! i recently sold my Soundmagic PL30 and got a pair of VSonic gr99.
> Vsonic's ar far the best IEM i ever tried, but i would like to try something more expensive..
> 
> I listen to electronic/trance/house music (with sweet female vocals and deep bass), hip hop, and sometimes rock and metal.
> ...


 
  I second the Vsonic GR04 Flagship - I admit I wasn't impressed at first but now I think it's definitely one of the best bang-for-bucks I've heard. Also, it's a lot more versatile than the GR06. Actually, I like it so much that my B2 has been retired from the position of iem for commuting.


----------



## EdChap

This thread is awesome. So detailed.
   
  Having difficulty knowing which are best unamped in the 150-250 range, though?


----------



## AstralStorm

Hmm, it's hard to specify best. Here's some short guide:
  VSonic GR06 and GR07 have some boost there, depending on tips, 3 (foam) - 5 dB (stock silicone). Sounds warm.
  Sennheiser IE7 has a 4 dB boost. Warm.
  Sennheiser IE8 at lowest bass setting has an 8 dB boost. Very warm.
  MEElectronics A151 has a minor boost. Mildly warm, less than GR07.
  Soundmagic PL50 already starts to roll off at the bottom of this range. Cold.
  HifiMan RE-272 also already starts to roll off. Cold, even more so than Soundmagic.
  Etymotic HF5 has a ~2 dB cut. Cold in a different way than RE-272 due to less rolloff in general.
  Brainwavz B2 is linear.
  Spiral Ear SE-5 has a 1 dB boost. Very slightly warm.
   
  @|joker|:
  Could you please take a peek at this correction for Brainwavz B2:
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress/30#post_8660716
  and perhaps tell which custom IEM has this kind of signature?
  It wouldn't happen to be UM Miracle or Merlin, would it?
   
  Oh, in case anyone is curious:
  Brainwavz B2 comes with their hard clamshell carrying case (same as for M1/M2/M3 except lacking the logo), large jack adapter, airplane dual mono adapter, 2 pairs of each of 3 sizes of single flanges and one pair of red Comply T100, M size.
  Lacks cable guides. The sliding cinch is better than the DBA-02 one and minijack is now J-shaped (120 degree) bent slim model. Comes with 1 year warranty.
   
  These indeed smack you in the face with detailing and airiness. Darn. Something like that with better deep bass and not as overblown highs would rule.


----------



## Tilpo

astralstorm said:


> Hmm, it's hard to specify best. Here's some short guide:
> VSonic GR06 and GR07 have some boost there, depending on tips, 3 (foam) - 5 dB (stock silicone). Sounds warm.
> Sennheiser IE7 has a 4 dB boost. Warm.
> Sennheiser IE8 at lowest bass setting has an 8 dB boost. Very warm.
> ...




Where did you get this information from?


----------



## AstralStorm

Experience unfortunately. Where I have provided the measurement, it was done by equalization.
  I have owned, still own or have borrowed one of these for a reasonable length of time.
   
  (Actually, rechecked SE-5, it is +2 dB in that range. Such low differences from ideal are finicky.)


----------



## james444

^ Unfortunately this information is pretty subjective. Equal-loudness contours vary noticeably, depending on sound pressure level (volume), plus your individual contours may also differ from the ISO standard and from other listener's.
   
  Talking about 1 or 2 db deviations from "ideal" or "linear" in this context is obviously problematic. jm2c.


----------



## lee730

Quote: 





james444 said:


> ^ Unfortunately this information is pretty subjective. Equal-loudness contours vary noticeably, depending on sound pressure level (volume), plus your individual contours may also differ from the ISO standard and from other listener's.
> 
> Talking about 1 or 2 db deviations from "ideal" or "linear" in this context is obviously problematic. jm2c.


 

 Agreed. These slight differences between the IE8 and IE80 made it a love hate game. The difference is enough for me to not use EQ at all on the IE80 while on the IE8 I would have to use EQ to get any enjoyment out of them....


----------



## Joe Bloggs

edchap said:


> This thread is awesome. So detailed.
> 
> Having difficulty knowing which are best unamped in the 150-250 range, though?




On top of that I think he was talking about price range not frequency range :evil:


----------



## Joe Bloggs

astralstorm said:


> Experience unfortunately. Where I have provided the measurement, it was done by equalization.
> I have owned, still own or have borrowed one of these for a reasonable length of time.
> 
> (Actually, rechecked SE-5, it is +2 dB in that range. Such low differences from ideal are finicky.)




+2dB relative to what? 1kHz on your scale? Or some kind of average across all frequencies?


----------



## AstralStorm

Relative to 500 Hz. I don't use 1000 Hz because some IEMs actually have a dip specifically in midrange and very few have any issue here. Also it's far less annoying to listen to.
   
  Regarding the $150-$250 range, there are quite many in there that don't need or benefit greatly from amplification. It might be easier to count the ones that do.
  Rule of the thumb for amping:
  1) dynamic driver and impedance < 32 Ohm needs low output impedance for good bass damping, might benefit from amp
  2) uneven impedance curve (see innerfidelity, goldenears and headroom (headphone.com) for this data)
  3) high impedance > 64 Ohm with low sensitivity, might be too quiet without amp
   
  As to HRTFs, low frequencies (barring subbass, < 80 Hz perhaps, which is heavily seal-dependent) match in almost all listeners - it's the highs that don't. I can dig up that old paper, but feel free to do that yourself.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> As to HRTFs, low frequencies (barring subbass, < 80 Hz perhaps, which is heavily seal-dependent) match in almost all listeners - it's the highs that don't. I can dig up that old paper, but feel free to do that yourself.


 
   
  Says the only guy in the EQ thread that EQs his subbass up 10+dB for all his phones even after being introduced to equal loudness contours


----------



## AstralStorm

Since I don't want to rile on this in here and mess up the thread, here you have your answer. More detailed too.
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress/30#post_8663352


----------



## LYNG2

hey joker, looking at the numerous reviews, i'm really quite impressed with the sunrise xcape IE. however, looking at some of your replies on this thread, there are actually some build quality issues right? to your knowledge, have these been resolved? or anyone else who owns/have owned xcape IE, can you please help me out with this? thanks so much!


----------



## Moosecraft

Hey ljokerl, great thread
Any plans on adding either the Aurisonics ASG-1 or the Heir Audio 3ai?


----------



## sneaglebob

What about the new denon urban raver AH-C300


----------



## heart banger-97

hi ljokerl
 one of my friend wants to buy an IEM with a cold (bright, forward treble) sound signature ( and the most analytical sounding iem)
 he really hates bass.
 I want  to suggest him ety er4s or fischer dba-02. can you have a quick comparison between these two?
 thanks


----------



## Zelda

what eartips would you suggest to improve isolation on the R-50 ?


----------



## NoGood

I'm quite sure this question has already been asked, but joker, any chance you'll be reviewing the Ultimate Ears TripleFi 10?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





nogood said:


> *I'm quite sure this question has already been asked*, but joker, any chance you'll be reviewing the Ultimate Ears TripleFi 10?


 
   
  You're quite right


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





marald said:


> Hi guys! i recently sold my Soundmagic PL30 and got a pair of VSonic gr99.
> Vsonic's ar far the best IEM i ever tried, but i would like to try something more expensive..
> 
> I listen to electronic/trance/house music (with sweet female vocals and deep bass), hip hop, and sometimes rock and metal.
> ...


 
   
  If you're looking at the Xcape IE and the siren-based BAs I think you might as well go for the MEElec A161P at $80-100 instead. It's got better deep bass than anything Siren-based and is much more likely to suit the requirement for 'punchy' bass than the armature-based sets you've listed. It's still got a pretty flat response so if you expect enhanced bass the GR06 or Xcape are more likely to do it for you but I prefer the A161P over both. You could also go for a Phonak Perfect Bass (022) and maybe get the gray filters later to turn it in a PFE 122 if you decide you'd rather swap some of its bass for clarity. 
   
  Quote: 





olear said:


> joker, have you heard the Sony 7550? I understand they are quite similar to the ex1000, except the 7550 mids are more forward and are less bright.  Thanks


 
   
  I have one but unfortunately haven't had the time to spend with it yet. First impressions are that you are correct but it also seems to lack some of that brightness that makes the EX1000 sound so clean. 
   
   
  Quote: 





edchap said:


> This thread is awesome. So detailed.
> 
> Having difficulty knowing which are best unamped in the 150-250 range, though?


 
   
  Really depends on what you want - the VSonic GR07, VSonic GR01, Fischer DBA-02 mkII, and HiFiMan RE272 come to mind as impressive performers without an amp but there are others depending on the sound you want. The Yamaha EPH-100 is a nice and safe option if you like enhanced bass.
   
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> @|joker|:
> Could you please take a peek at this correction for Brainwavz B2:
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress/30#post_8660716
> and perhaps tell which custom IEM has this kind of signature?
> ...


 
   
  Definitely not the demo Merlin that I heard. Seems closer to a Miracle or Alclair Reference except that the Alclairs have a bit of that hotness that you don't like with the VSonic GR06/GR07 and the Miracles might just have a touch too much total treble energy even though it's nice and smooth. Might be better to ask average_joe as he's heard tons of customs I haven't heard. He also scanned & posted the factory freq. response graph from my Miracle somewhere. 
   
  Thanks for the info on the B2, by the way - just added it to the front page. Next chart revision will have separate rows for the B2 and the now-discontinued DBA-02 mkI. 
   
  Quote: 





lyng2 said:


> hey joker, looking at the numerous reviews, i'm really quite impressed with the sunrise xcape IE. however, looking at some of your replies on this thread, there are actually some build quality issues right? to your knowledge, have these been resolved? or anyone else who owns/have owned xcape IE, can you please help me out with this? thanks so much!


 
   
  I was told that the issues were resolved but was never sent another unit to confirm. Mine failed in three different ways in just a few months which is why I've generally been hesitant to recommend them. 
   
  Quote: 





moosecraft said:


> Hey ljokerl, great thread
> Any plans on adding either the Aurisonics ASG-1 or the Heir Audio 3ai?


 
   
  Both are maybes at this point.
   
  Quote: 





sneaglebob said:


> What about the new denon urban raver AH-C300


 
   
  No plans at this time.
   
  Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl
> one of my friend wants to buy an IEM with a cold (bright, forward treble) sound signature ( and the most analytical sounding iem)
> he really hates bass.
> I want  to suggest him ety er4s or fischer dba-02. can you have a quick comparison between these two?
> thanks


 
   
  Go for the DBA-02 - more forward treble for a brighter signature. The ER4S is pretty neutral. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> what eartips would you suggest to improve isolation on the R-50 ?


 
   
  I've used Etymotic gray triples on mine with success. I think they are from an MC5. Really good isolation and the fit works rather well with the angled nozzle and over-the-ear form factor.
   
  Quote: 





nogood said:


> I'm quite sure this question has already been asked, but joker, any chance you'll be reviewing the Ultimate Ears TripleFi 10?


 
   
  Might get to the UE900 first but yes, it's on the planned reviews list (front page, below the table).


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Go for the DBA-02 - more forward treble for a brighter signature. The ER4S is pretty neutral.


 
  thanks
  do you think that dba-02 has more bass (quantity) than er4s?
  recently I read something about er4b, have you heard er4b?


----------



## marko93101

To all the thread readers and  Joker, here's the situation. 
   
  I'm selling my TF10s, I've gotten so bored/irritated with them. Found they were just un-enjoyable to my ears, so much so that my SE215s get most of my ear time..
   
  Guy is willing to buy them off me for 150Euro.
   
  So I seek your suggestions. 
   
  So.. 
   

 Budget is a max of 150 Euros (excluding delivery)
 Source is a Clip Zip with E6 amp.
 I do enjoy a decent bass, but I also would love it to be as clear as day. 
 Willing to buy 2nd hand.
 I know this is a IEM thread, but I'm in no means restricted, feel free to suggest Portable Headphones as well..
   
   
  Thanks in advance!


 P.S this and your headphone threads are amazing! 
  Keep it up!


----------



## H20Fidelity

Have you considered GR07 MK2?


----------



## marko93101

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> Have you considered GR07 MK2?


 
  I have indeed, I just don't know if it's going to suit what I listen to. 
   
  I've never been more confused about what to buy.


----------



## H20Fidelity

marko93101 said:


> I have indeed, I just don't know if it's going to suit what I listen to.
> 
> I've never been more confused about what to buy.




GR07 doesn't really fall short on many genres, it's fairly consistent. Depending on your source they can lack a touch of dynamics with metal / rock, Though I"m thinking that less and less recently after changing my player. If you do like their signature they're pretty hard to beat and would probably be the next logical solution. You could look at Klipsch X10, or Yamaha EPH-100 as alternatives. 

Hang in there, see what ljokerl has to say and others.


----------



## marko93101

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> GR07 doesn't really fall short on many genres, it's fairly consistent. Depending on your source they can lack a touch of dynamics with metal / rock, Though I"m thinking that less and less recently after changing my player. If you do like their signature they're pretty hard to beat and would probably be the next logical solution. You could look at Klipsch X10, or Yamaha EPH-100 as alternatives.
> Hang in there, see what ljokerl has to say and others.


 
  I appreciate the advice! 
  One of the biggest problems with the TF10s was trying to listen to music I liked that actually suited it. More of the bass heavier stuff just wasn't working for me. Hopefully the GR07 MKIIs will do what's needed. 
   
  Also, using the Zip and an E6, so I hope that'll be up to getting most of what they have to offer.
   
  Shall see what others have to say, and further my research.
   
   
  Who knew trying to find a good sound could be so stressful.


----------



## AstralStorm

Neither source offers much - they're really standard quality sources. Not doing anything really wrong, but nowhere near ideal either.
  You can ignore the E6, Clip Zip is about as good with slightly worse noise floor.


----------



## marko93101

astralstorm said:


> Neither source offers much - they're really standard quality sources. Not doing anything really wrong, but nowhere near ideal either.
> You can ignore the E6, Clip Zip is about as good with slightly worse noise floor.



I appreciate the input, but I have no way of replacing ethier. It's what I've to live with for the moment, the only reason I'm even considering getting new IEMSis because a friend is highly interested in my TF10s.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





marko93101 said:


> I have indeed, I just don't know if it's going to suit what I listen to.
> 
> I've never been more confused about what to buy.


 
   
  Last time someone had terminal buyer's indecision this was my advice to him:
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> My advice to you:
> 
> 1. Make a numbered list of up to 6 earphones you can't decide between
> 2. Throw a die
> ...


 
   
  He liked it


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, sorry if this has been asked before, but any first impressions on the FXD80?
 I am very fond of my FXT90 and I'm wondering how both of these compare in SQ, isolation, and comfort


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've used Etymotic gray triples on mine with success. I think they are from an MC5. Really good isolation and the fit works rather well with the angled nozzle and over-the-ear form factor.


 
  will the Shure triples (with the top trimmed) also work?  i just tried the Meelec's and they didnt work well


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> thanks
> do you think that dba-02 has more bass (quantity) than er4s?
> recently I read something about er4b, have you heard er4b?


 
   
  The DBA-02 has a touch more impact but you really don't have to worry about anyone finding them too bassy. 
   
  The ER4B is the original flat-response version of the ER4. It is said that flat response is difficult to tolerate in an in-ear form factor and will sound overly bright to most listeners, which is why Etymotic developed the ER4S and ER4P. Phonak talked about this when they were originally developing the PFE and its tuning filters. I personally find the treble of the ER4S sufficient (though not bright) and really wouldn't want the ER4B.
   
  Quote: 





marko93101 said:


> To all the thread readers and  Joker, here's the situation.
> 
> I'm selling my TF10s, I've gotten so bored/irritated with them. Found they were just un-enjoyable to my ears, so much so that my SE215s get most of my ear time..
> 
> ...


 
   
  It sounds like you'd enjoy a little more bass than the TF10. With that budget I would consider the EPH-100 - you'll trade off a bit of clarity compared to the TF10 but get a dynamic sound that will scale the bass very well with your hip hop, etc. It's not muddy and very efficient. You won't need that E6. 
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, sorry if this has been asked before, but any first impressions on the FXD80?
> I am very fond of my FXT90 and I'm wondering how both of these compare in SQ, isolation, and comfort


 
   
  I think I've mentioned before that I'm not too fond of the FXD80 or FX40. Isolation and comfort are fine with the FXD80 but I think the sound of the FXT90 has more of an 'it factor' where its presentation is intimate but well-layered and the timbre is rather nice. The FXD80 is good but its tone is a little on the cool side, the lower mids are recessed, and the treble is quite bright and shimmery. It's pretty much the same reasons I don't like the FX40, just much more temperate with the FXD80 to the point where I can easily tolerate them. The clarity is nice but part of it stems from the treble emphasis. When you take that away it's about as clear as the EPH-100. The detail and bass depth are good, no complaints there. Overall very nice for $100 or whatever they go for but I think they are closer in performance to the Fischer SBA-03/Klipsch X10/RE-ZERO level than the GR07, RE272, Rockit R-50, etc. 
    
  Quote:


zelda said:


> will the Shure triples (with the top trimmed) also work?  i just tried the Meelec's and they didnt work well


 
   
  I don't think I have any Shure triples but they should be pretty similar. MEElec has two sizes of triples AFAIK. The larger ones from the M6 are too long for my canals so I trim off the top flange; the remaining bi-flange is rather comfy.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The ER4B is the original flat-response version of the ER4. It is said that flat response is difficult to tolerate in an in-ear form factor and will sound overly bright to most listeners, which is why Etymotic developed the ER4S and ER4P. Phonak talked about this when they were originally developing the PFE and its tuning filters. I personally find the treble of the ER4S sufficient (though not bright) and really wouldn't want the ER4B.
> 
> 
> 
> I think I've mentioned before that I'm not too fond of the FXD80 or FX40. Isolation and comfort are fine with the FXD80 but I think the sound of the FXT90 has more of an 'it factor' where its presentation is intimate but well-layered and the timbre is rather nice. The FXD80 is good but its tone is a little on the cool side, the lower mids are recessed, and the treble is quite bright and shimmery. It's pretty much the same reasons I don't like the FX40, just much more temperate with the FXD80 to the point where I can easily tolerate them. The clarity is nice but part of it stems from the treble emphasis. When you take that away it's about as clear as the EPH-100. The detail and bass depth are good, no complaints there. Overall very nice for $100 or whatever they go for but I think they are closer in performance to the Fischer SBA-03/Klipsch X10/RE-ZERO level than the GR07, RE272, Rockit R-50, etc.


 
   
  what's the 'it factor' ??


----------



## FieldingMellish

Quote: 





zelda said:


> what's the 'it factor' ??


 
   
   
  From Wise Geek, for instance:
   
   
  In the past the “it factor” might have been defined as someone with je ne sais quoi, or the indefinable something that makes someone special. The “it factor”, was also called the X Factor in some cases, and still may be referred to as such. Most often, it is applied to celebrities or semi-celebrities that seem to radiate charisma and charm.
   
  There is considerable debate about who possesses this unknown variable. Some people look at celebreality stars like Paris Hilton and are certain she has that “it factor”. In some way she draws people to her like a lodestone. The young woman can’t seem to make the smallest movement without a host of paparazzi avidly lapping at her heels.
   
  Others look at Paris Hilton and wonder what the fuss is about. She is assuredly wealthy, and she can wear the finest clothes, make-up and jewelry that money can buy. However, people examine her and fail to see the “it factor”. Determining the “it factor” can be a matter of taste, moral background, viewpoints, and preferences.
   
  http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-it-factor.htm


----------



## Zelda

.


----------



## doosh

I just registered so I could pass on my thanks to Joker and the head-fi community. I recently decided it was time to get a decent set of IEMs and research led me to head-fi, some guide articles and this review thread. After reading and re-reading, I went with some VSonic GR06s and have been absolutely blown away with their quality and price. As an FYI they now come with a cable cinch.
   
  Thanks guys!


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





doosh said:


> I just registered so I could pass on my thanks to Joker and the head-fi community. I recently decided it was time to get a decent set of IEMs and research led me to head-fi, some guide articles and this review thread. After reading and re-reading, I went with some VSonic GR06s and have been absolutely blown away with their quality and price. As an FYI they now come *with a cable cinch*.
> 
> Thanks guys!


 
  where did you get em from?


----------



## ljokerl

Added the JVC HA-FX40 and HA-FXD80. Wasn't planning to post the FX40 write-up but there's been quite a lot of interest expressed via PM. 
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B34) JVC HA-FX40*
> 
> Added Sep 2012
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2B17) JVC HA-FXD80*
> 
> Added Sep 2012
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





fieldingmellish said:


> From Wise Geek, for instance:
> 
> In the past the “it factor” might have been defined as someone with je ne sais quoi, or the indefinable something that makes someone special. The “it factor”, was also called the X Factor in some cases, and still may be referred to as such.


 
   
  That's a nice definition - thanks for finding it. I probably wasn't thinking too clearly when I used the term at 1am last night but this is pretty much what I meant (minus the Paris Hilton bits)
   
  Quote: 





doosh said:


> I just registered so I could pass on my thanks to Joker and the head-fi community. I recently decided it was time to get a decent set of IEMs and research led me to head-fi, some guide articles and this review thread. After reading and re-reading, I went with some VSonic GR06s and have been absolutely blown away with their quality and price. As an FYI they now come with a cable cinch.
> 
> Thanks guys!


 
   
  Awesome, glad you're enjoying the GR06s!


----------



## suman134

nice review of fxd80 , was looking for this . nice upgrade from micro hd .


----------



## phantompersona

Thanks for the review on the JVC's. Been wanting to hear your take on them since they've been such a hot topic on Dsnut's thread.


----------



## FieldingMellish

I enjoyed the FXD-80 while I had it; now maintaining an A161P and RE-272 in the stable. FX-40 I am keeping for it's simplicity and ease of carry; kind of an on-the-go shopping and errand IEM.


----------



## rickdohc

So there you are.... not a suprise at all for those of us that bought the FX40,  for under 20 bucks they are very good iems at that price range, not suprised at all with that score.
   
  Yes, they are on the "trebele happy" side, but if you got tracks with good quality its not an issue at all, beacuse the highs are not harsh and not silibant once they are properly burned, unless you are a bass head then you should look to other options.
   
  My FXD80 should be arriving very soon, so i am expecting a very good sound from those, just as the JVC S500 is a very good sounding portable headphone with the same technology.

 Thanks for the review Joker!


----------



## dustdevil

Really glad that you have finally posted up the review for the fx40, joker, it describes exactly how I feel about them.
  I just realised that I havent thank you for all your hard work even after I have settled down on the ety hf5, thank you very much for the reviews!


----------



## Techno Kid

The thing I liked most about the FXD80 review was the little mention of the R-50 which means will be getting a review of them and I hope you found some good tips to use (Ety grey triple flange work great).


----------



## marko93101

Appreciate the suggestions! My friend has pulled out of buying them from me, so I'm stuck with them for the next while. I guess I'll just have to try love them.


----------



## jhelsas

@ljokerl
   
   I've been reading a lot about the Brainwavz B2, and I  was thinking in purchasing them.
   Would they be a good complement to my other iems?(HF5, PFE112 & W4r)
   
   I love detailing, and also I was looking for something brighter than the W4, and maybe not so foward as the HF5. I don't feel the need for more bass than it offers, and most of the time I don't mind the (lack of) bass quantity of the HF5, though I would like something with a bit more in this case.
   
   I listen to a bit of everything, ranging from classical, barroque, jazz, classical rock, (progessive) metal, j-music....
   
   As budget,  I wanted to keep it below the US$ 200 mark if possible.
   
  Thanks in advance


----------



## doosh

Quote: 





zelda said:


> where did you get em from?


 
  I bought them off eBay, via the seller 'lendmeurears'. They're still listed: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vsonic-GR06-/320964209663?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item4abaf52bff
   
  When I bought them they were out of stock in the US warehouse, so they shipped direct from Singapore. They still arrived here in Australia in around a week.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> I've been reading a lot about the Brainwavz B2, and I  was thinking in purchasing them.
> Would they be a good complement to my other iems?(HF5, PFE112 & W4r)
> 
> I love detailing, and also I was looking for something brighter than the W4, and maybe not so foward as the HF5. I don't feel the need for more bass than it offers, and most of the time I don't mind the (lack of) bass quantity of the HF5, though I would like something with a bit more in this case.


 
  I'm not joker, but let's answer.
   
  B2 might be what you're looking for if W4 is not bright enough (in the 3-6k range at least). General signature, aside from quite a bit more 6k-12k brightness, is similar to W4 but less sculpted. (which is not good in my case) Unlike W4, B2 actually gets more sparkle with foam tips.
   
  Personally, I'd go for W4 with somewhat brighter extreme highs (>=12k) and less of a midrange dip/low midrange boost (same thing, depends on whether I take 1 kHz or 500 Hz as center), but I don't know if it exists.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> nice review of fxd80 , was looking for this . nice upgrade from micro hd .


 
   
  Thanks! And to think it all started for the JVC with the FXC50.
   
  Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Thanks for the review on the JVC's. Been wanting to hear your take on them since they've been such a hot topic on Dsnut's thread.


 




  Quote: 





fieldingmellish said:


> I enjoyed the FXD-80 while I had it; now maintaining an A161P and RE-272 in the stable. FX-40 I am keeping for it's simplicity and ease of carry; kind of an on-the-go shopping and errand IEM.


 
   
  I have to say I preferred the A161P/SBA-03 to the FXD80s in A:B listening just because the bass on the A161s is flatter and cleaner.The mids, treble, and soundstaging are difficult to call between the two for me.
   
  Quote: 





rickdohc said:


> So there you are.... not a suprise at all for those of us that bought the FX40,  for under 20 bucks they are very good iems at that price range, not suprised at all with that score.
> 
> Yes, they are on the "trebele happy" side, but if you got tracks with good quality its not an issue at all, beacuse the highs are not harsh and not silibant once they are properly burned, unless you are a bass head then you should look to other options.
> 
> ...


 
   
  They are one of the higher-scoring budget IEMs that I personally don't like 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. The treble is interesting in not being overly harsh or sibilant as you've noted.. it's more the overall tone and balance that bothers me but at that point I'm being too critical of a $22 set. 
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Really glad that you have finally posted up the review for the fx40, joker, it describes exactly how I feel about them.
> I just realised that I havent thank you for all your hard work even after I have settled down on the ety hf5, thank you very much for the reviews!


 
   
  Glad you like the HF5s! There was an HF3 deal yesterday and I had to stop myself from picking up a set (would have been my 3rd, I've owned HF3s and HF2s already). The ER4S is nice but the HF3 has always appealed to me more as a daily carry.
   
  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> The thing I liked most about the FXD80 review was the little mention of the R-50 which means will be getting a review of them and I hope you found some good tips to use (Ety grey triple flange work great).


 
   
  Working on that. I believe someone asked about my tip selection a page or two ago. I'm using the gray Ety triples on them right now.
   
  Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> I've been reading a lot about the Brainwavz B2, and I  was thinking in purchasing them.
> Would they be a good complement to my other iems?(HF5, PFE112 & W4r)
> ...


 
   
  Difficult to say - I really don't think the B2 is less forward than the HF5 on the whole. Is the PFE112 not a brighter and more laid-back earphone than the HF5? I would think that's a better match for what you want than the Etys when used with the gray or even black filters. On that note I think you might like the Ortofon e-Q5 - I saw a couple on ebay for <$230 the other day.


----------



## Inks

Oh no, the PFE112s are not more laid back than the HF5s unfortunately due to the midhighs, unless you use black filters in which they become a slightly warmer but less coherent version of the HFs. I agree EQ5s will be a nice pick. 
   
  Thanks for the FXD80 vs A161P comparison, it astounds me how the A161P got so overlooked when it's at least on par, but seems better based on what you said.


----------



## Izeekio

Sir |joker|, question! 
   
  From your memory of your experiences with the Tier 1C IEMs, which of those did you feel had the best synergy when paired with your J3? I may be stretching your memory a bit. I ask because at times I feel my MTPC sound better on the Clip+ vs J3. It could be all in my head though. I'm very curious as to which ones you will mention. Thanks


----------



## rickdohc

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They are one of the higher-scoring budget IEMs that I personally don't like
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 




   
  Yea... i know what you mean, it can be a "love/hate" situation.  I dont listen  music over 60% of the volume, maybe thats the reason i like them, at this low volumes i can enjoy them more than my other cheap iems, once i crank the volume up those highs get a bit wild and thats the reason i only use them on very quiet places.  
   
  In any case , i was expecting a even lower score. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Dont have to answer this, but how many hous of burn in they had?
   
  Thanks again for the review.


----------



## Gasdoc

Hi Joker,

Anything with a similar sound as the awesome EX1000 but with a Westone/Earsonics fit?


----------



## Inks

Vsonic GR07


----------



## yezz12

Are the Vsonic GR06 good for rock/metal?


----------



## selferinoz

Joker, can u giv me a brief detail comparing the soundstage size n such with the Brainwavz Beta v2 and vsonic GR07 ?


----------



## NuckinFutz

yezz12 said:


> Are the Vsonic GR06 good for rock/metal?




Yes but it depends what your looking for. They are mid centric with good timbre, I think vocals and guitar sound great on them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





izeekio said:


> Sir |joker|, question!
> 
> From your memory of your experiences with the Tier 1C IEMs, which of those did you feel had the best synergy when paired with your J3? I may be stretching your memory a bit. I ask because at times I feel my MTPC sound better on the Clip+ vs J3. It could be all in my head though. I'm very curious as to which ones you will mention. Thanks


 
   
  The Coppers wouldn't really come out as my pick with any source so it's sort of a biased answer. I was surprised by how well the Earsonics SM3 paired with the J3 - it almost made them less thick and suffocating. The Klipsch Custom 3 and Ortofon's e-Q5 and e-Q7 also. Come to think of it all of the sets that come to mind as being almost as good out of the J3 as my amp/dac are higher-impedance phones with high sensitivity. 
   
  Quote: 





rickdohc said:


> Dont have to answer this, but how many hous of burn in they had?
> 
> Thanks again for the review.


 
   
  Lots and lots. I had them for about two months before sending them off to dweaver. I would say 200 easily before I did any critical listening. 
   
  Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Hi Joker,
> Anything with a similar sound as the awesome EX1000 but with a Westone/Earsonics fit?


 
   
  Inks is right - the GR07 is probably as close as it'll get. 
   
   
  Quote: 





yezz12 said:


> Are the Vsonic GR06 good for rock/metal?


 
   
  Depends on whether you like the sound signature. In general, I would say yes. 
   
  Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> Joker, can u giv me a brief detail comparing the soundstage size n such with the Brainwavz Beta v2 and vsonic GR07 ?


 
   
  The soundstages are actually not that different - they both have wide presentations with average depth. The GR07 still has a better sense of 3D space and better imaging.


----------



## yezz12

Joker, Have you tried out the Sennheiser CX400 II or the Hisoundaudio PoPo?
   
  I currently have the Sennheisers + iPod 3rd Gen, i'm thinking about buying the Rocoo-P and the PoPo IEMs for only 140 euro (!), should i buy it? Are the the PoPo IEMs good? Are they better than the Sennheisers/Vsonic GR06?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





yezz12 said:


> Joker, Have you tried out the Sennheiser CX400 II or the Hisoundaudio PoPo?
> 
> I currently have the Sennheisers + iPod 3rd Gen, i'm thinking about buying the Rocoo-P and the PoPo IEMs for only 140 euro (!), should i buy it? Are the the PoPo IEMs good? Are they better than the Sennheisers/Vsonic GR06?


 
   
  I have the PoPo but unfortunately haven't heard the CX400-II. I don't think the PoPo is better than the GR06 unless you need tons of bass. It's quite bassy but loses some resolution and refinement as a result and the bass is really not as detailed as I would like. The newer Wooduo model is better.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have the PoPo but unfortunately haven't heard the CX400-II. I don't think the PoPo is better than the GR06 unless you need tons of bass. It's quite bassy but loses some resolution and refinement as a result and the bass is really not as detailed as I would like. The newer Wooduo model is better.


 
   
  Quote: 





yezz12 said:


> Joker, Have you tried out the Sennheiser CX400 II or the Hisoundaudio PoPo?
> 
> I currently have the Sennheisers + iPod 3rd Gen, i'm thinking about buying the Rocoo-P and the PoPo IEMs for only 140 euro (!), should i buy it? Are the the PoPo IEMs good? Are they better than the Sennheisers/Vsonic GR06?


 
   
          sadly i have the cx400 II but dont have the PoPo . cx 400 II dont stand any where with the new generation of earphones . even the new cx175 is better then the cx 400 . cx 400 II has far less detail even compared to ue 400/500 , dont have good bass , just mid bass rumble , dont even go deep , neither had good sound stage . i just wonder where the cx 55 , cx 880 , cx 980 , cx 95 successors are . lost in the echo may be .


----------



## pow3rs

amazing review, hope to hear from you abt ASG-1.2 VS Heir 4.ai


----------



## yezz12

Hmm, Rocoo-P + PoPo IEMs for 140 euro still seems like a good deal.
   
  edit:
   
  Rocoo-P & PoPo beats iPod & Fiio E6 & Vsonic GR06, right?


----------



## 1974

Joker, I see you have the universal FitEar ToGo 334's and assume a review is coming soon? Can't wait to see how they shape up against the custom UM Miracles!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





yezz12 said:


> Hmm, Rocoo-P + PoPo IEMs for 140 euro still seems like a good deal.
> 
> edit:
> 
> Rocoo-P & PoPo beats iPod & Fiio E6 & Vsonic GR06, right?


 
   
  I wouldn't be so sure but I haven't heard any HiSound DAPs since the AMP3 Pro2
   
  Quote: 





1974 said:


> Joker, I see you have the universal FitEar ToGo 334's and assume a review is coming soon? Can't wait to see how they shape up against the custom UM Miracles!


 
   
  Yep, working on that.


----------



## supernatural

Ive had the GR02 bass edition IEMs for 2 months now and Im looking for an upgrade.
  Would the JVC HA-FXT90 suit a metalhead like me and would I get a much better sound than with the gr02?
  also, the GR02 are somewhat too sibilant for me. Is sibilance a problem with the JVC HA-FXT90?
  Thanks.
   
   
   
   
  on a sidenote a somewhat offtopic question: if the gr02 are too sibilant for me, are the GR07's out of the question? because i wanted to get 07 in the first place but im too scared they will be too sibilant for me


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





> Difficult to say - I really don't think the B2 is less forward than the HF5 on the whole. Is the PFE112 not a brighter and more laid-back earphone than the HF5? I would think that's a better match for what you want than the Etys when used with the gray or even black filters. On that note I think you might like the Ortofon e-Q5 - I saw a couple on ebay for <$230 the other day.


 
   Thank you ljokerl, AstralStrom & Inks for the replys,
   
     My impression of the PFE112(I have used only the grey filters) is about the same as of Inks, although I don't mind it to be foward, I would like something brighter. I'll consider the e-Q5, but it's a bit out of the budget I was intending, I've found the B2 for ~ 140€ (headsound.de) and the least that I've found the e-Q5 in europe was for about ~ 240€, sorry for putting the previous budget in dolars.
   
     Do you think it's preferable for me to wait, gather some more money and try something better than the B2?( e-Q5, the GR10 as someone here previously recomended me, or something else?)


----------



## AstralStorm

About the Westone/Earsonics fit - GR07 is compromised badly in one regard - tip selection.
  There aren't any long tips I know of that fit its 3,5mm (which can fit some 4mm too) nozzle correctly - it's very hard to have them inserted deeply because of that and the stubby body - the body is also not as rounded, so the corner might irritate the ear.
  Last I heard it Sony MDR-EX1000 was hotter in the highs (esp. lower highs) but less sibilant than GR07.
   
  I wouldn't recommend Grado GR10 over B2 - it's far less detailed and suffers from far more pronounced highest end (air) rolloff - it's also slightly darker and warmer while otherwise sporting similar signature.
  I'm pretty sure e-Q5 is far darker than B2 and possibly darker than GR07 - although I've never heard it, so take that with a grain of salt.


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Although it all depends on fit ( and the ultimate effects on signature) I think you'd be better served by the B2/DBA-02 over the eq-5. Pretty similar signature at half the cost.  Ortofon built better but  the cost is a bit high vs value since they're comparable. Though I suppose that's all subjective too.


----------



## elvergun

Quote: 





supernatural said:


> Ive had the GR02 bass edition IEMs for 2 months now and Im looking for an upgrade.
> Would the JVC HA-FXT90 suit a metalhead like me and would I get a much better sound than with the gr02?
> also, the GR02 are somewhat too sibilant for me. Is sibilance a problem with the JVC HA-FXT90?
> Thanks.
> ...


 

 I owned the GR02 and I did not find them sibilant.  I sold them them for upgrade reasons.
   
  I purchased the FXT90 along the way and I had to sell those because they were too sibilant. 
   
  I currently own the GR07...no sibilance at all to my ears.  YMMV.
   
   
  Edit:  I own the GR07 MKII.   Some people say that the first versions had more sibilance problems.


----------



## supernatural

now im completely confused. the gr07 are somewhat famous for their sibilance, the fxt90 on the other hand even if they appear sibilant out of the box, the harsh treble becomes more tamed after a good burn in. atleast thats what I found out after extensive hours of research
  i think ill just go with the fxt90's and if they are too sibilant for me than I guess im one of the few who are extremely sensitive to sibilance 
  Quote: 





elvergun said:


> I owned the GR02 and I did not find them sibilant.  I sold them them for upgrade reasons.
> 
> I purchased the FXT90 along the way and I had to sell those because they were too sibilant.
> 
> ...


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





supernatural said:


> now im completely confused. the gr07 are somewhat famous for their sibilance, the fxt90 on the other hand even if they appear sibilant out of the box, the harsh treble becomes more tamed after a good burn in. atleast thats what I found out after extensive hours of research
> i think ill just go with the fxt90's and if they are too sibilant for me than I guess im one of the few who are extremely sensitive to sibilance


 
   
   
  I'm one of those that found the FXT90 very harsh. I sold mine within a week of getting them.


----------



## Gasdoc

+1. FXT90 nasty treble to these ears. GR07 competes well against my W4, um3x and SM3.


----------



## Lourdes

Could someone suggest something with good sub bass? I listen to all sorts so I don't want really want anything obnoxiously 'bassy' but I would really like some rumble for my trip-hop and dubstep. I can spend around $300 but I don't need to, if there's something cheaper that fits the bill then I can add it to my existing 'arsenal' and change about.


----------



## elvergun

Quote: 





supernatural said:


> now im completely confused. the gr07 are somewhat famous for their sibilance, the fxt90 on the other hand even if they appear sibilant out of the box, the harsh treble becomes more tamed after a good burn in. atleast thats what I found out after extensive hours of research
> i think ill just go with the fxt90's and if they are too sibilant for me than I guess im one of the few who are extremely sensitive to sibilance


 
   
   
  If you are going to get them, buy them used or get them from a place that accepts returns.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





elvergun said:


> If you are going to get them, buy them used or get them from a place that accepts returns.


 
   
  No need. This site has a decent insurance policy


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





supernatural said:


> now im completely confused. the gr07 are somewhat famous for their sibilance, the fxt90 on the other hand even if they appear sibilant out of the box, the harsh treble becomes more tamed after a good burn in. atleast thats what I found out after extensive hours of research
> i think ill just go with the fxt90's and if they are too sibilant for me than I guess im one of the few who are extremely sensitive to sibilance


 
   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> I'm one of those that found the FXT90 very harsh. I sold mine within a week of getting them.


 
   
        at times things go bad , avoid them with some equalizer , why lose other good things of a earphone . roll the frequencies above 7k down , or hit and trail will serve best . both you guys are talking of some of the best value phones . keep the goods , sideline the unwanted . even basic to basic player come with eqs .


----------



## supernatural

now that I think of it, maybe im just listening to songs that are very poorly recorded (sibilance wise) because with 90% of my library I dont experience any sibilance whatsoever.
  for example on this song i even cringe if I listen on a higher volume
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cyq2PiHoaA (the sibilance begins @ 0:28)
  I think tonight ill listen to every song on my phone and ill see how many are actually sibilant. 
  i always thought that even if one song in the playlist hurts my ears than the IEMs are not suited for me... im probably very wrong on this


----------



## monoglycer

There are some songs that are sibilant no matter what headphone you use. For example crumbs from your table by U2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY5niA4eqmI) is probably the most sibilant song I have ever heard.


----------



## AstralStorm

I hear no excess sibilance in the above song with either equalized SE-5 or B2. There's is a clearly audible presence boost which emphasizes plosives, but it's not at the annoying levels that GR07 (mkI) has - as it is more wideband or non-resonant?
  Bad panpotted mastering with phase shift on guitars, lots of dynamic range compression.


----------



## glac1er

FXT90 was not sibilant to  my ears despite their v-shaped and bright tendencies, likewise with bright IEMs such as UE700 and dba02mk1. I was bothered more with lower treble peaks such as those found in GR07mk1 but YMMV.


----------



## psygeist

FXT90 didn't sound V shaped. It was much forward in midrange and then there was mid bass hump


----------



## glac1er

After the sub-par low bass and mid bass hump, the mids sounds comparatively thinner until the upper treble spike comes, so IMO it's v-shaped. Similar in way to tfp but less so.


----------



## nkatkamwar

hey ljokerl n all other head-fiers in this thread,
   
  need advice...
   
  I have to pick between  Bose ie2, klipsch s4 & sony XBA 3 as my gift..
   
  Which is better and why...
   
  I particularly like soundstage, true vocals, Nice treble, tight bass and most importantly instrument separation..
   
   
  Plz respond
   
  I am from india, so i only have only these IE's available around me...


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





glac1er said:


> FXT90 was not sibilant to  my ears despite their v-shaped and bright tendencies, likewise with bright IEMs such as UE700 and dba02mk1. I was bothered more with lower treble peaks such as those found in GR07mk1 but YMMV.


 
   
  Sibilnce wasn't so much the issue for me. I just found the highs harsh and unrefined


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





lourdes said:


> Could someone suggest something with good sub bass? I listen to all sorts so I don't want really want anything obnoxiously 'bassy' but I would really like some rumble for my trip-hop and dubstep. I can spend around $300 but I don't need to, if there's something cheaper that fits the bill then I can add it to my existing 'arsenal' and change about.


 
   
  Did anybody answer this?
   
  Philips SHE3580, JVC FX101, or if you feel like spending more of your budget, Monster Turbine Pro Copper?


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





nkatkamwar said:


> hey ljokerl n all other head-fiers in this thread,
> 
> need advice...
> 
> ...


 
   
          xba-3 all the way , bose ie2 is 3 years old model , image s3 is just entry level iem , and both of these are just not par with xba-3 , the new sony dont over do the bass , mids are really clear and crisp , highs are clear and dont have any harsh hiss in it like the s4 , lack sound stage but still okay , over all some mind blowing details . if you want more message me .


----------



## suman134

never mind man , the xb90ex will be there soon .


----------



## ljokerl

For anyone curious about how the PFE 232 measures, my review is now up on InnerFidelity with an additional measurements section: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/phonak-audeo-pfe-232
   
  Quote: 





supernatural said:


> Ive had the GR02 bass edition IEMs for 2 months now and Im looking for an upgrade.
> Would the JVC HA-FXT90 suit a metalhead like me and would I get a much better sound than with the gr02?
> also, the GR02 are somewhat too sibilant for me. Is sibilance a problem with the JVC HA-FXT90?
> Thanks.
> ...


 
   
  I honestly wouldn't risk the GR06 or GR07 if you have issues with the GR02 - to my ears the three share that same treble presentation that many (including myself) find very unforgiving of sibilance. I would go for an EPH-100 as a safer bet. 
   
  Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Thank you ljokerl, AstralStrom & Inks for the replys,
> 
> My impression of the PFE112(I have used only the grey filters) is about the same as of Inks, although I don't mind it to be foward, I would like something brighter. I'll consider the e-Q5, but it's a bit out of the budget I was intending, I've found the B2 for ~ 140€ (headsound.de) and the least that I've found the e-Q5 in europe was for about ~ 240€, sorry for putting the previous budget in dolars.
> 
> Do you think it's preferable for me to wait, gather some more money and try something better than the B2?( e-Q5, the GR10 as someone here previously recomended me, or something else?)


 
   
  It's not a matter of value with the B2 - it's certainly got plenty of that. Just a matter of whether it's what you're looking for. That e-Q5 price is pretty bad so you might not have any other viable options.
   
  Quote: 





lourdes said:


> Could someone suggest something with good sub bass? I listen to all sorts so I don't want really want anything obnoxiously 'bassy' but I would really like some rumble for my trip-hop and dubstep. I can spend around $300 but I don't need to, if there's something cheaper that fits the bill then I can add it to my existing 'arsenal' and change about.


 
   
  Entry level (price-wise) - Philips SHE3580. Mid-range - Velodyne vPulse. High-end - JVC FX500 or FX700, Atrio MG7
   
  Quote: 





monoglycer said:


> There are some songs that are sibilant no matter what headphone you use. For example crumbs from your table by U2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY5niA4eqmI) is probably the most sibilant song I have ever heard.


 
   
  Two words: Simon and Garfunkel. 
   
  Quote: 





nkatkamwar said:


> hey ljokerl n all other head-fiers in this thread,
> 
> need advice...
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've only heard the S4 out of those, unfortunately. Based on my experience with the XBA-4, the XBA-3 probably isn't worth the money but is likely to be the best option there by a margin.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> i've only heard the S4 out of those, unfortunately. Based on my experience with the XBA-4, the XBA-3 probably isn't worth the money but is likely to be the best option there by a margin.


 
      
         man the xba-3 is $160 there . i think it worth it . and the xba-4 is not available .


----------



## esanthosh

In India, XBA-3 is available for as low as ₹6600 ($120). Even the official price is only $145. Granted that it's more on account of the currency depreciation, it is still a decent choice for those who want to avoid the hassles of shipping and customs. But one is open to taking a little risk, plenty of better options can be found in that range. IMO, XBA-1 offers better value for money.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> In India, XBA-3 is available for as low as ₹6600 ($120). Even the official price is only $145. Granted that it's more on account of the currency depreciation, it is still a decent choice for those who want to avoid the hassles of shipping and customs. But one is open to taking a little risk, plenty of better options can be found in that range. IMO, XBA-1 offers better value for money.


 
   
  will agree with xba-1 , but he is getting it as a gift , so why not go for the best when you can , yes , wasting anyone's money is wrong but i think it worth it even over a ue 700 cuz of its build , i have rumbled with my xba-3 in my bed but its still there , but with the ue700 i had horrible experiences , even with a small stress one side goes dead . not to say 700 was entertaining , xba-3 just lacks some sound stage , and has better bass . i dont know about that site but wont trust that price .


----------



## hatecrew1992

hi guys,
   
  I really feel drawn to the Etymotic Hf5 and was thinking of getting them + the custom tips since isolation an comfort are somewaht important to me. But before pulling the trigger I wanted to ask two questions:
   
  1. : I am not sure wether they will perform well with the music I am listening to, wich would be mainly metalcore and (post-)hardcore like
       every time I die, Architects, Letlive, Sick of it all and so on...
  
  2. : A friend of mine said that the tips will influence the sound slightly, so I wanted to ask wether this was true and if so, in what way would the costum tips influence it?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Entry level (price-wise) - Philips SHE3580. Mid-range - Velodyne vPulse. High-end - JVC FX500 or FX700, Atrio MG7


 
   
  It's interesting that you put the qualifier that the SHE3580 is entry level "price-wise". 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 It also got a mention in the FX40 review--is a SHE3580 coming soon?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





hatecrew1992 said:


> hi guys,
> 
> I really feel drawn to the Etymotic Hf5 and was thinking of getting them + the custom tips since isolation an comfort are somewaht important to me. But before pulling the trigger I wanted to ask two questions:
> 
> ...


 
   
  1. There's really no set sound signature for listening to a genre, one person may prefer a bassy sound and another person prefer a bright sound (the opposite of bassy) for the same genre.  Better to list the phones you have listened to so far and what you think of them (eg too bassy, not bassy enough, vocals too recessed, etc.)


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





hatecrew1992 said:


> 1. : I am not sure wether they will perform well with the music I am listening to, wich would be mainly metalcore and (post-)hardcore like       every time I die, Architects, Letlive, Sick of it all and so on...


 
  Neutral or Analytical suits better for complex genres.


----------



## hatecrew1992

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> 1. There's really no set sound signature for listening to a genre, one person may prefer a bassy sound and another person prefer a bright sound (the opposite of bassy) for the same genre.  Better to list the phones you have listened to so far and what you think of them (eg too bassy, not bassy enough, vocals too recessed, etc.)


 

 the only IEMs I have are the Beyer DTX101 and those are way to bassy for me, other than that I never owned an IEM. I also have a V-Moda M80, wich I like and normally use on the go for now, a Beyer DT-770 wich is my standard-phone to use with my PC (but to bassy for music only use) and a Senheiser HD595, wich also is nice but a bit gloomy (if that makes any sense), what i miss from all of those is a certain level of detail, thats why I was thinking about the Etymotic


----------



## rickdohc

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> It's interesting that you put the qualifier that the SHE3580 is entry level "price-wise".
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Cant wait!!!    IMHO its one of the best IEMS under $20.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





lourdes said:


> Could someone suggest something with good sub bass? I listen to all sorts so I don't want really want anything obnoxiously 'bassy' but I would really like some rumble for my trip-hop and dubstep. I can spend around $300 but I don't need to, if there's something cheaper that fits the bill then I can add it to my existing 'arsenal' and change about.


 
  you should check the new brainwavz M5. it´s very good for the 35-40 preorder


----------



## anoxy

Earpods guys, get ready.


----------



## lilboozy

How does the vsonic gr99 compare with the philips she3580. Which one has better bass, mids, highs, soundstage etc.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> In India, XBA-3 is available for as low as ₹6600 ($120). Even the official price is only $145. Granted that it's more on account of the currency depreciation, it is still a decent choice for those who want to avoid the hassles of shipping and customs. But one is open to taking a little risk, plenty of better options can be found in that range. IMO, XBA-1 offers better value for money.


 
   
  Wow, that's less than half of what it costs here.
   
  Quote: 





hatecrew1992 said:


> hi guys,
> 
> I really feel drawn to the Etymotic Hf5 and was thinking of getting them + the custom tips since isolation an comfort are somewaht important to me. But before pulling the trigger I wanted to ask two questions:
> 
> ...


 
   
  The HF5 will work very well if you like your sound balanced and accurate. (Good) custom tips pretty much give you a perfect seal 100% of the time. I don't think they improve quality over a well-sealed triple-flange (just as an example) but they may very well be more comfortable while providing an equally good seal. 
   
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> It's interesting that you put the qualifier that the SHE3580 is entry level "price-wise".
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The vPulse is not much of an improvement over the SHE3580 sound-wise so I felt that needed saying 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I have a bunch of cheapies to add soon and the SHE3580 might be among them.
   
  Quote: 





hatecrew1992 said:


> the only IEMs I have are the Beyer DTX101 and those are way to bassy for me, other than that I never owned an IEM. I also have a V-Moda M80, wich I like and normally use on the go for now, a Beyer DT-770 wich is my standard-phone to use with my PC (but to bassy for music only use) and a Senheiser HD595, wich also is nice but a bit gloomy (if that makes any sense), what i miss from all of those is a certain level of detail, thats why I was thinking about the Etymotic


 
   
  The DTX101 is a bass-heavy earphone. You won't have that problem with the Etys or something like a MEElec A161P.
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> How does the vsonic gr99 compare with the philips she3580. Which one has better bass, mids, highs, soundstage etc.


 
   
  Pretty well overall. I think the GR99 is warmer and has more bass impact while the SHE3580 is a little brighter and clearer. The bass is tighter with the Philips while the quality of the treble is comparable with the GR99 a tiny bit smoother. I would give the GR99 the edge in presentation - it's got more out-of-the-head feel.


----------



## TAWT AMISH

i would totally like to see the review of Philips SHE3580,Panasonic RP HJE355 and Sony MDREX-10LP .As these are   the best i have found in the league. Joker w8ing for ur review on these 3 !!!


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Joker, I think you should review the Sennheiser CX880s. They've seemed pretty good from what I've read, and should fall under 8's or 7's average, and cost under $100.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Wow, that's less than half of what it costs here.


 
  But I think these are without warranty.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> But I think these are without warranty.


 
   
      that link looks bad , there must be some thing wrong .


----------



## TAWT AMISH

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Wow, that's less than half of what it costs here.
> vPulse is not much of an improvement over the SHE3580 sound-wise so I felt that needed saying
> 
> 
> ...


 
   trying picking them up for the review and the other 2 (as i mentioned Panasonic RP HJE355 and Sony MDREX-10LP).


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





tawt amish said:


> i would totally like to see the review of Philips SHE3580,Panasonic RP HJE355 and Sony MDREX-10LP .As these are   the best i have found in the league. Joker w8ing for ur review on these 3 !!!


 
  what's so good about the ex10lp??


----------



## Joe Bloggs

I think... he looked at the user reviews for those phones and the EX-10LP ranks higher than the others because it has two reviews to the others' 1?  But that doesn't mean anything, I mean... even I haven't posted a review for the SHE3580 to the review widget, so who does? lol


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





zelda said:


> what's so good about the ex10lp??


 

 ex10lp is just crap , good for nothing , she3590 is far better at $9 .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Joker, I think you should review the Sennheiser CX880s. They've seemed pretty good from what I've read, and should fall under 8's or 7's average, and cost under $100.


 
   
  Think I'd rather shoot for an IE800 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> But I think these are without warranty.


 
   
  Seems like the $145 'official' price should carry a warranty, and that's still way less than the $280-300 I'm seeing from authorized dealers here in the US.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Seems like the $145 'official' price should carry a warranty, and that's still way less than the $280-300 I'm seeing from authorized dealers here in the US.


 
   
  Just to be clear, I did buy it at the authorized Sony dealer for $145. Even at that time, plenty of online shops (and eBay) have carried XBA-3 for slightly less than the MSRP ($140). Sony does offer one year replacement warranty as long as the buyer has an invoice and a Sony warranty card (as I mentioned here). I was in the process of fixing a price for my XBA-3 sale in the forums, which is when I stumbled upon the $120 listing. I have never bought anything from naaptol nor do I know about the warranty offered, but just mentioned it for the sake of showing the price differential between India and US.


----------



## apmusson

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Think I'd rather shoot for an IE800


 
   
  Go for it - can you get an early preview from anywhere?   I am looking forward to seeing how the ie800s stack up against other non-customs... or even the ie80!


----------



## lilboozy

I think you should review the ink'd 2 and 50/50. Wait i know what your thinking: SKULLCANDY!! what are you crazy!? These are actually pretty good at least from a bassheads perspective. Skullcandy has really improved their products recently just look at the aviators, mixmasters, and hesh 2 (tyll reviewed all 3).


----------



## TAWT AMISH

I am intersted in sony MDREX-10lp bcz of all the good reviews about it on this site as well as other sites  as joe mentioned.
   
  Quote:


lilboozy said:


> I think you should review the ink'd 2 and 50/50. Wait i know what your thinking: SKULLCANDY!! what are you crazy!? These are actually pretty good at least from a bassheads perspective. Skullcandy has really improved their products recently just look at the aviators, mixmasters, and hesh 2 (tyll reviewed all 3).


 
   
  i don't know about the ink'd 2 which came recently into the scene but for 50/50, i have them with me for last one year and won't recommend them for bassheads especially.In the intial stages,it had a good bass but with longer hours of use and burn in ,they loss their bass and all i could hear is treble  and after 1 year of use,i am totally unsatisfed with my dubstep experience with them.i would recommend other brand like Senniheiser and JNC over them for a hefty price of 50$.thats one of the reason y iam looking for cheaper in ears.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





tawt amish said:


> I am intersted in sony MDREX-10lp bcz of all the good reviews about it on this site as well as other sites  as joe mentioned.
> 
> Quote:
> 
> i don't know about the ink'd 2 which came recently into the scene but for 50/50, i have them with me for last one year and won't recommend them for bassheads especially.In the intial stages,it had a good bass but with longer hours of use and burn in ,they loss their bass and all i could hear is treble  and after 1 year of use,i am totally unsatisfed with my dubstep experience with them.i would recommend other brand like Senniheiser and JNC over them for a hefty price of 50$.thats one of the reason y iam looking for cheaper in ears.


 
   
  the 10lp dont have good bass at all , you will regret it if you go for this . you need the she 3590 .


----------



## Nisten

First off, I'd like to thank you for your recommendation of the Vsonic GR02's, as I purchased them and love them!
   
  I'm now looking for a more analytical IEM, however. I'd like to keep or have more bass than the GR02's, but clearer mids-highs without being painful to listen to on a daily basis for extended periods of time. I honestly don't know if this is possible, so please correct me if it's not. I was looking at the Hippo VB, the Fischer Audio Eterna, and the Brainwavz M2, but am not sure if they are what I'm looking for.
   
  If anything stands out in your mind, or anyone else's, for something that may match this sound signature, please let me know!


----------



## GeorgyBaja

Hi all
  Today I received my headphones vsonic gr06 i test with Mac air + fidelia + wav song
  did not have good sound quality accessories are good but  I wish more clarity in the sound
  i know is cheap price.


----------



## glac1er

Too bad, that's about as good as you can get for the price IMO. Maybe try to listen to them a bit more and see how you like them later?


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





tawt amish said:


> Quote:
> 
> i don't know about the ink'd 2 which came recently into the scene but for 50/50, i have them with me for last one year and won't recommend them for bassheads especially.In the intial stages,it had a good bass but with longer hours of use and burn in ,they loss their bass


 
  Well i just got them so that explains why i hear good bass


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





apmusson said:


> Go for it - can you get an early preview from anywhere?   I am looking forward to seeing how the ie800s stack up against other non-customs... or even the ie80!


 
   
  Not sure, but it would certainly be interesting.
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> I think you should review the ink'd 2 and 50/50. Wait i know what your thinking: SKULLCANDY!! what are you crazy!? These are actually pretty good at least from a bassheads perspective. Skullcandy has really improved their products recently just look at the aviators, mixmasters, and hesh 2 (tyll reviewed all 3).


 
   
  I like the Mix Masters but the Aviators didn't sound very good compared to some of my other $150 sets. 
   
  Quote: 





nisten said:


> First off, I'd like to thank you for your recommendation of the Vsonic GR02's, as I purchased them and love them!
> 
> I'm now looking for a more analytical IEM, however. I'd like to keep or have more bass than the GR02's, but clearer mids-highs without being painful to listen to on a daily basis for extended periods of time. I honestly don't know if this is possible, so please correct me if it's not. I was looking at the Hippo VB, the Fischer Audio Eterna, and the Brainwavz M2, but am not sure if they are what I'm looking for.
> 
> If anything stands out in your mind, or anyone else's, for something that may match this sound signature, please let me know!


 
   
  If you raise the bass the entire sound signature is affected. For a reference sound signature you would need flatter bass. None of the sets you've listed have much better clarity than the GR02. The Atrio MG7 might do what you want but it's got less mid-bass than the GR02 and focuses more on low bass.


----------



## milan425

Hi all.
   
  Sorry to bother you ppl, but I need help and people at ER sent me here...
   
  Got the MEE CW31's. I wouldn't necessarily recommend as first choice to anyone now that I have them.
   
  Don't get me wrong, they really are good, especially for $20 I got em for. They are first headsets I own that have both speakers working, they don't loose connection, cable isn't flimsy, tips make full seal, sound doesn't differ left from right and they didn't fall apart within the first three days. Classical music, hard rock and jazz sound sublimely fantastic (Credence, AC/DC, Scorpions, RAM,Yo Yo Ma, Mozart, Debussy, Nora Jones, Quincy Jones, Incognito...), BUT when i try on the ones I really wanna hear- Dream T and Guardians, they just aren't... enough them. As if thers too much going one, lots of different sounds at same time, and they don't get full credit (and I'm not using EQ). I use android smartphone, poweramp player and files are flac, 500-4000kbps. The audio graph for phone is here: http://bit.ly/M7Q7WY
   
  I have listened them for about 20-ish hours now, got em two days before yesterday, and I think sound is getting.. better. Maybe its the burn-in-in thing I read so much about, where they will get better in time. How does that go? Is there wrong and worst way to do it?
   
  Also, thers not much chatter about them CW31's on forum, did I make... not good choice? Also, no one wants to deliver in my country, on paper everyone are open for business, but in real life.. Cruel joke these last two months were. 
   
  And, yes, CW31 are my first good headsets (I don't dare say audiophile, but do correct me if I'm wrong)


----------



## Nisten

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you raise the bass the entire sound signature is affected. For a reference sound signature you would need flatter bass. None of the sets you've listed have much better clarity than the GR02. The Atrio MG7 might do what you want but it's got less mid-bass than the GR02 and focuses more on low bass.


 
  I see your point. Which set would you consider for a more reference sound signature without losing punchy bass? I'm not a bass fanatic, but I do enjoy it with above-average body. I guess to narrow it down a bit I'd go up to $200.
   
  Thanks again for your help.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





milan425 said:


> Hi all.
> 
> Sorry to bother you ppl, but I need help and people at ER sent me here...
> 
> ...


 
   
  For me personally the CW31 at $20 is a very good deal but I can see where you are coming from. The reason they aren't often recommended is probably the same reason you're not enjoying them yet - they don't have much of a 'wow' factor. They are smooth, relaxed, and non-fatiguing with a pretty mild bass boost. Something like a JVC FX101, which smacks you in the face with ridiculous bass and sharp treble, is much easier to 'get' and probably much easier for a beginner to be excited about. I myself would much rather listen to a CW31 or Brainwavz M1 as the overall experience from them is more reminiscent of high-end headphones and speakers but if you are just shooting for enjoyment there is no right or wrong answer. I actually started my Head-Fi IEM journey with a Soundmagic PL30, which is tuned somewhat similarly to the CW31, and it took me a while to appreciate what it could do.
   
  Burn-in - depends on who you ask. I think most if it is a mental effect, which is not to say it should be discounted. I would use them for a while and if you end up still feeling that they aren't working for you, try something different.
   
  Quote: 





nisten said:


> I see your point. Which set would you consider for a more reference sound signature without losing punchy bass? I'm not a bass fanatic, but I do enjoy it with above-average body. I guess to narrow it down a bit I'd go up to $200.
> 
> Thanks again for your help.


 
   
  The VSonic GR07 may be as close as it gets but again it wouldn't have the same amount of bass boost as your GR02.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

ljokerl said:


> For me personally the CW31 at $20 is a very good deal but I can see where you are coming from. The reason they aren't often recommended is probably the same reason you're not enjoying them yet - they don't have much of a 'wow' factor. They are smooth, relaxed, and non-fatiguing with a pretty mild bass boost. Something like a JVC FX101, which smacks you in the face with ridiculous bass and sharp treble, is much easier to 'get' and probably much easier for a beginner to be excited about. I myself would much rather listen to a CW31 or Brainwavz M1 as the overall experience from them is more reminiscent of high-end headphones and speakers but if you are just shooting for enjoyment there is no right or wrong answer. I actually started my Head-Fi IEM journey with a Soundmagic PL30, which is tuned somewhat similarly to the CW31, and it took me a while to appreciate what it could do.
> 
> Burn-in - depends on who you ask. I think most if it is a mental effect, which is not to say it should be discounted. I would use them for a while and if you end up still feeling that they aren't working for you, try something different.




I think he meant to say that he finds the vocals recessed ( the comment about not enough them)

Sincehe is using poweramp I would recommend he try playing with the EQ first--push up the 500Hz, 1kHz and 2kHz bands (but mostly 500Hz) to taste (and make sure preamp isn't pegged to the top to prevent clipping) and that should bring the vocals forward nicely.


----------



## milan425

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> I think he meant to say that he finds the vocals recessed ( the comment about not enough them)
> Sincehe is using poweramp I would recommend he try playing with the EQ first--push up the 500Hz, 1kHz and 2kHz bands (but mostly 500Hz) to taste (and make sure preamp isn't pegged to the top to prevent clipping) and that should bring the vocals forward nicely.


 
  Vocals, I guess that's right. It was usually the vocals I didn't quite get at times. I played the EQ to frustrations now and I'm having darmn thing on OFF, but, ql as poweramp is, thers a tweak for bass boost, and I'm using it, just a little bit, 30-50%. Also I started to use double- flanged tips. Only my ears have to get used, but sound got (just tiny tiny bit) more bassy without ruining other sound. And that made overall exp better. But as time passes, as if the sound is getting more and more formed and sorted.
  By far, they ARE the best sounding things I ever heard/ owned. Don't get me wrong, I really am happy 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 , six Unaccompanied Cello Suites by Yo-Yo Ma is simply sublime.  I just like to tweak things to perfection while learning all about them. If Dream T won't be at its best, I'll ask u guys how to get other pair where they do.
  Recently I saw KRK's banner here and saw theirs 6400 over- ears, so I was thinking about them, but now Fiio's E11- there is a bit static noise when there is silence and music is off. But someone posted (can't remember who) no reason using amps on not-best IEMs, since improvement would be about 5-10% 
   
  Also, are there foam tips fow CW31's, since they don't have round nozzles?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





milan425 said:


> Vocals, I guess that's right. It was usually the vocals I didn't quite get at times. I played the EQ to frustrations now and I'm having darmn thing on OFF, but, ql as poweramp is, thers a tweak for bass boost, and I'm using it, just a little bit, 30-50%. Also I started to use double- flanged tips. Only my ears have to get used, but sound got (just tiny tiny bit) more bassy without ruining other sound. And that made overall exp better. But as time passes, as if the sound is getting more and more formed and sorted.
> By far, they ARE the best sounding things I ever heard/ owned. Don't get me wrong, I really am happy
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  From joker's description it sounds like the CW31 have a relatively balanced signature unlike most budget sets with either bassy or V-shaped sound, so if you're looking for even more forward vocals it may be hard to find an IEM that does what you want for a reasonable price.  There is one pair, reputedly mid-forward and very cheap, and got a high sound score from joker: Monoprice 8320.  But it does not fit many people's ears.  That's why I recommended you play with EQ first.  Play with it some more, I always get what I want from it eventually...
   
  Play with the sliders one at a time, push it up and down to experience which part of the sound spectrum it changes, how it affects the overall sound and where the slider is when you hear the best sound... repeat with all the sliders, and lower the preamp from the top to prevent clipping if you are boosting bands...


----------



## milan425

Thx Joe.
   
  Tried you're EQ scheme, no good like many other schemes. Sound somehow just becomes weird at other places. Now, I'm not saying that I don't like sound. More that I think about it, more I realize the great truth- I DONT KNOW what GOOD sound FEELS LIKE. My guess now it was more the fear of the unknown
   
Originally Posted by *DogMeat* 


  
yeah, but the MEE cw's,(wood housing), are not too shabby, *after decent burn in*.  
   
  The more time passes, the more I like these, without the use of EQ. In couple of days I'll get use on them and they on me. All I wanted was good first step forward an audiophile world, and good build quality, that I got.
   
  And, hehe, about em Monoprice 8320's... No one delivers em into my country, like all others. None of audio companies sell majority of them, and those that are being sold, price is about 25% higher then regular and no discounts, no coupons, no deals. Take it or leave it. It is both amazingly simple and complicated to describe why I got these via net order instead of... oh, wait, there was a list- Fischer Audio Silver Bullet, Dunu Trident, Sennheiser CX150-200-300, Brainwaws ***, AKG's***, Sony's forgot their models, but Serbia, little black spot of Euro country as it is, to put simple- there are no HUMANS around who like anything anymore, as if all good minds fled before wars. It was real mission impossible for MEElec to arive. But enough about that... Sorry for kill-joy.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





milan425 said:


> Thx Joe.
> 
> Tried you're EQ scheme, no good like many other schemes. Sound somehow just becomes weird at other places. Now, I'm not saying that I don't like sound. More that I think about it, more I realize the great truth- I DONT KNOW what GOOD sound FEELS LIKE. My guess now it was more the fear of the unknown


 
   
  I guess I can relate.  Gone through a no-EQ phase myself with the Etymotic ER-4P.  At first I thought it sounded sublime, then as the novelty of the phones wore off I just got bored and subconsciously unsatisfied with the sound until I listened to little music for several years.  Then the etys died and I was forced to buy low budget phones.  Having no illusions about the fidelity of their default sound sig I ran wild with EQ until I found what I wanted.  The thing is, unless you get very deep insertion custom IEMs and your hearing no longer goes past 13kHz there will always be at least one sound artifact that needs to be EQed out on all IEMs for optimum performance--a half-wave resonance peak in the treble that causes sibilance and harsh highs.  And in my experience, past a very low entry threshold, differences between IEMs are just differences in sound signature, much like having different EQs on the same set of reference phones.  So EQ is also about taking high fidelity sound into your own hands rather than let some company or other dictate your tastes.
   
  Normally I wouldn't "hard-sell" EQ like this but you mentioned that it's hard for you to get any earphones at all where you live, so I'd encourage you to get the most out of the pair you managed to get.
   
  This is the guide to removing the resonance peak artifact in IEMs
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/413900/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-a-tutorial
   
  This is a sequel to the guide I am trying to write that makes the peak cancellation easier and more exact, and also lets you shape the whole frequency response of your phones to a reference standard
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress
  this is still a work in progress, so if there's anything you don't understand, do please post your question in the thread and I'll try to answer it as well as expand and complete the guide.
   
  I think you'll also find more general advice on how to EQ from the members in this thread if you post a question here
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/623043/cafe-sceptico-the-objectivist-cafe


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> I think he meant to say that he finds the vocals recessed ( the comment about not enough them)
> Sincehe is using poweramp I would recommend he try playing with the EQ first--push up the 500Hz, 1kHz and 2kHz bands (but mostly 500Hz) to taste (and make sure preamp isn't pegged to the top to prevent clipping) and that should bring the vocals forward nicely.


 
   
  Ah, I guess I didn't get that from the post. Thanks. 
   
  Quote: 





milan425 said:


> Also, are there foam tips fow CW31's, since they don't have round nozzles?


 
   
  Most foam tips have a hard inner core with a circle shape. Best bet is probably de-coring some Shure Olives and stretching them on the CW nozzle without a core. A set of Olives might be too difficult/expensive to find for experimenting, though.
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> From joker's description it sounds like the CW31 have a relatively balanced signature unlike most budget sets with either bassy or V-shaped sound, so if you're looking for even more forward vocals it may be hard to find an IEM that does what you want for a reasonable price.  There is one pair, reputedly mid-forward and very cheap, and got a high sound score from joker: Monoprice 8320.  But it does not fit many people's ears.


 
   
  The cord on my monoprice has also frayed and kinked so much that I don't like using them anymore. They've been relegated to A:B duty and the SHE3580 is now my disposable out-and-about set, along with the H2O Audio Flex that's on gym duty.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

How would the Sennheiser IE7s compare to the Phonak Audeo PFE122s?


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> How would the Sennheiser IE7s compare to the Phonak Audeo PFE122s?


 

 Not at all. PFE122 is more detailed than IE7, better extended and doesn't have any bass boost or extra warmth. IE7 is noticeably darker and also more forward in the midrange, but not close to Ety forwardness. (3-5kHz)
   
  Fit is also different - IE7 "inverse Darth Vader" is quite a bit larger, so it's possible it won't fit at all - both are over the ear only. Isolation is better in the Phonaks, which is actually saying IE7 isolation is very low, as IE7 is a semi-open dynamic driver.
   
  Build quality is very good in both.


----------



## H20Fidelity

@~ljokerl.

I'm looking for an IEM between $150-$400 which excels in separation, detail, soundstage width, liquid style mid range for vocals. I'm also wanting this to have bass texture similar to EX600 / EX1000, I really enjoy the bass on those EX series. Basically I love EX600's bass, mids of EPH-100 and treble of TF10. I'm trying to track something down as an all in one package. Imaging would also be a huge plus. I prefer the signatures of EPH and TF10 over the slightly dryer GRO7 and EX600.

I'd be using Cowon players as a source unamped. 

The IEM's I have tried are:

Yamaha EPH-100,
GRO7 MK2,
TF10,
EX600.
Klipsch X10 

Cheers!


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Not at all. PFE122 is more detailed than IE7, better extended and doesn't have any bass boost or extra warmth. IE7 is noticeably darker and also more forward in the midrange, but not close to Ety forwardness. (3-5kHz)
> 
> Fit is also different - IE7 "inverse Darth Vader" is quite a bit larger, so it's possible it won't fit at all - both are over the ear only. Isolation is better in the Phonaks, which is actually saying IE7 isolation is very low, as IE7 is a semi-open dynamic driver.
> 
> Build quality is very good in both.


 
   
  Which in-ear headphone has better sound quality? I'm leaning towards the PFE122


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> The thing is, unless you get very deep insertion custom IEMs and your hearing no longer goes past 13kHz there will always be at least one sound artifact that needs to be EQed out on all IEMs for optimum performance--a half-wave resonance peak in the treble that causes sibilance and harsh highs.


 
  I can relate as well. However, you can get rid of the treble peaks by using foam - it approximates an open ear canal better than silicone due to its sound absorbing properties and lack of reflective surface. Just make sure you don't pick a foam that will occlude the tube. (e.g. overly large Comply without trimming can do that)
  For example, my SE-5 (a deep fit custom IEM) still has a remaining relatively small 14.5 kHz peak. Brainwavz B2 w/ Comply P Slim has none of that.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Is that saying that the PFE122 would be a better choice than the IE7?


 

 Better is a matter of taste and personal head-related transfer function. If you asked which is more accurate to my ears, I'd say PFE 122 (with Green filters).
  There's also some limited way to tune the sound signature to your liiking in PFE 122 with the three filters, so it's less likely to completely miss.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Better is a matter of taste and personal head-related transfer function. If you asked which is more accurate to my ears, I'd say PFE 122 (with Green filters).
> There's also some limited way to tune the sound signature to your liiking in PFE 122 with the three filters, so it's less likely to completely miss.


 
   
  In that case, could you recommend something after reading this?


----------



## dustdevil

Looks like you really like your she3580 joker, do you think I should buy one even though I havent been using the hf5 I've bought recently quite often as I should have?


----------



## david321

I seriously can't decide between the Soundmagic E10 and the Vsonic GR99. There both great value. I'm looking for the best bass performance. Can you help me out?. Thanks


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Looks like you really like your she3580 joker, do you think I should buy one even though I havent been using the hf5 I've bought recently quite often as I should have?


 
   
  these are so cheap that you should not think twice .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





david321 said:


> I seriously can't decide between the Soundmagic E10 and the Vsonic GR99. There both great value. I'm looking for the best bass performance. Can you help me out?. Thanks


 
   
           only bass minded , you need m9 , out of these gr99 .


----------



## david321

Is that the meelec m9


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





david321 said:


> Is that the meelec m9


 

 yes .


----------



## Niyologist

My Brainwavz M5 shipped out this morning. I'll have the review of it by Friday.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> My Brainwavz M5 shipped out this morning. I'll have the review of it by Friday.


 
   
   post a link here of that review .


----------



## nothingman

I would like joker's and anyone's advice on budget custom IEMs. Sub $500, and I think I've got it narrowed down to 3 choices.
   
  1) Alclair Reference (3-driver) is now $400. http://www.alclair.com/products/monitors/alclair-reference-custom-in-ear-monitor/
   
  2) Clear Tune's CT-300 Pro (3-driver model, Joker reviewed the 2-driver, $350 CT-200). $450. http://cleartunemonitors.com/CT-300pro/
   
  3) JHA's 2-driver JH5 Pro, $400.
   
   
  I'll start with what I don't want: a dry, analytic sound. To me, that sounds lifeless and unengaging.
   
  Balance across the frequency spectrum is key, as is a spatial presentation, but with a weight to the sound that makes it a fun, non-fatiguing experience.
   
  I currently own GR07s. They're good, but not as engaging as I would like, along with being uncomfortable physically and a bit fatiguing sonically.
   
  Any advice would be greatly appreciated. There's been very little written about Alclair and Clear Tune, outside of joker and average_joe. A big thanks to both of those guys for their tireless generosity.


----------



## Niyologist

suman134 said:


> post a link here of that review .




I will, by Friday.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

I thought there were a lot of people offering some help here, and I was wondering if people could recommend the best in-ear headphones suited for my requriements. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> @~ljokerl.
> I'm looking for an IEM between $150-$400 which excels in separation, detail, soundstage width, liquid style mid range for vocals. I'm also wanting this to have bass texture similar to EX600 / EX1000, I really enjoy the bass on those EX series. Basically I love EX600's bass, mids of EPH-100 and treble of TF10. I'm trying to track something down as an all in one package. Imaging would also be a huge plus. I prefer the signatures of EPH and TF10 over the slightly dryer GRO7 and EX600.
> I'd be using Cowon players as a source unamped.
> The IEM's I have tried are:
> ...


 
   
  I am really not sure I've heard what you're looking for. Which one did you feel was closest to what you want overall? Sounds like you want a K3003 crossed over higher than it is and for <$400..
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Looks like you really like your she3580 joker, do you think I should buy one even though I havent been using the hf5 I've bought recently quite often as I should have?


 
   
  That really depends on whether you're not using the HF5 because you don't like the signature (then yes, by all means get the Philips) or because you don't have occasion to use IEMs in general (in which case the Philips isn't likely to change your mind).
   
  Quote: 





david321 said:


> I seriously can't decide between the Soundmagic E10 and the Vsonic GR99. There both great value. I'm looking for the best bass performance. Can you help me out?. Thanks


 
   
  The GR99 has deeper, punchier bass than the E10. It's not as bassy as the GR02 bass edition but it's close and the rest of the sound is good as well.
   
  Quote: 





nothingman said:


> I would like joker's and anyone's advice on budget custom IEMs. Sub $500, and I think I've got it narrowed down to 3 choices.
> 
> 1) Alclair Reference (3-driver) is now $400. http://www.alclair.com/products/monitors/alclair-reference-custom-in-ear-monitor/
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've only heard the Reference out of those (and the GR07, obviously). If you find the GR07 too analytical and fatiguing I would not recommend the Reference. It's really a BA version of the GR07 sound with better clarity, dynamics, and presentation. Even the CTM-200 has a more liquid sound to it, but it's not very engaging. I don't know how the CTM-300 is tuned but if it adds a bass driver that might be interesting. 
   
  I feel like you would enjoy a JVC FX700..
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I thought there were a lot of people offering some help here, and I was wondering if people could recommend the best in-ear headphones suited for my requriements. Thanks!


 
   
  Your requirements really don't tell me what kind of sound signature you are looking for. To be safe I would try something with enhanced bass, say a Yamaha EPH-100. If you're just starting out it should be a solid all-rounder. You could even go cheaper with something like a VSonic GR06 or Shure SE215. Since it's going to be your first earphone it might be safer to spend less while honing in on your preferred sound signature.


----------



## SennHI808

Great reviews! Thanks!!


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Your requirements really don't tell me what kind of sound signature you are looking for. To be safe I would try something with enhanced bass, say a Yamaha EPH-100. If you're just starting out it should be a solid all-rounder. You could even go cheaper with something like a VSonic GR06 or Shure SE215. Since it's going to be your first earphone it might be safer to spend less while honing in on your preferred sound signature.


 
   
  I like a bright, euphonic, juicy and lush, punchy, sturdy, sweet, and transparent sound. I like to listen to accurate, clear, detailed to low sounds, balanced, focused (I find this a problem on a lot of in-ears), gripped, and brilliant music.
   
  I'm thinking the Phonak PFE122 is a good option?


----------



## Amitl

hello!
  Joker...could you please recommend me
  of some nice earphones in the range of 60$ or less
  that have dominant bass and are designed
  for shallow fit?
  i love my id america spark's sound, but
  they the depth of insertion is not very comfortable to me
  thank you!


----------



## Joe Bloggs

snappyaxolotl said:


> I like a bright, euphonic, juicy and lush, punchy, sturdy, sweet, and transparent sound. I like to listen to accurate, clear, detailed to low sounds, balanced, focused (I find this a problem on a lot of in-ears), gripped, and brilliant music.




er wut? lol

So do you like more bass, more mids, more treble or what?


----------



## H20Fidelity

ljokerl said:


> I am really not sure I've heard what you're looking for. Which one did you feel was closest to what you want overall? Sounds like you want a K3003 crossed over higher than it is and for <$400..




I'd say EX600 was probably the closest I've found though wanting better separation, obvious micro detailing, more treble extension with a wetter mid range. 

I'm not really interested in EX1000 as an option if that helps.


----------



## David245

I've got a question about the GR99. Can they be used simply with a Ipod or Iphone because I'm mostly gonna use them outside. By the way, what is the next IEM you'll be looking to put up on this thread?


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That really depends on whether you're not using the HF5 because you don't like the signature (then yes, by all means get the Philips) or because you don't have occasion to use IEMs in general (in which case the Philips isn't likely to change your mind).


 
  Yes, its the second reason, I do like the signature very much, it has just one tiny bump in the mid bass but I am still enjoying them.
  I am just thinking that since they sound pretty good(tried someone else's she3580), and most importantly they are so cheap, that I can hardly resist to throw another $10 into earphones, but I am worried that I will be using them even less than the hf5 that are already not being used quite often.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Well if you are not using them often because you are afraid of breaking them it might make sense to get the 3580 as a beater pair.


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Well if you are not using them often because you are afraid of breaking them it might make sense to get the 3580 as a beater pair.


 
  I am definitely not worrying that they are going to break as they are under warranty, it is that I can hardly find a suitable situation to use them, sure I can use them when I am on a transportation, but I would prefer to be sleeping rather than listening to music most of the times. When I am at home, I would go for a more comfortable, flatter fr, and less isolating option, my eq'ed sennheiser hd555.


----------



## nothingman

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've only heard the Reference out of those (and the GR07, obviously). If you find the GR07 too analytical and fatiguing I would not recommend the Reference. It's really a BA version of the GR07 sound with better clarity, dynamics, and presentation. Even the CTM-200 has a more liquid sound to it, but it's not very engaging. I don't know how the CTM-300 is tuned but if it adds a bass driver that might be interesting.
> 
> I feel like you would enjoy a JVC FX700..


 
   
  Joker, I appreciate the reply and the suggestion of the FX700.
   
  I've wanted to give the FX700 a try for a while, but I'd really like to move away from universals and into customs, and I love my IEMs for particularly loud environments like airplane travel and city public transportation. 
   
  If someone wanted to move into customs, and was looking for something like an FX700 sound, what would you suggest?
   
  In the meantime, I'm going to listen very closely to my GR07s to determine if I wouldn't actually like them in a custom, especially with better dynamics and presentation.
   
  Thanks again.


----------



## peter123

Quote: 





david245 said:


> I've got a question about the GR99. Can they be used simply with a Ipod or Iphone because I'm mostly gonna use them outside. By the way, what is the next IEM you'll be looking to put up on this thread?


 
   
  No problem with my Ipod Touch. I use these as my training bud's and cannot be bothered to bring  an amp while training. They even work well with my Galaxy S2.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sennhi808 said:


> Great reviews! Thanks!!


 
   
  Glad they've been helpful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I like a bright, euphonic, juicy and lush, punchy, sturdy, sweet, and transparent sound. I like to listen to accurate, clear, detailed to low sounds, balanced, focused (I find this a problem on a lot of in-ears), gripped, and brilliant music.
> 
> I'm thinking the Phonak PFE122 is a good option?


 
   
  I know what some of those words mean... 
   
  The 122 has good clarity and detail and can be considered bright with the gray filters. Anything beyond that will depend on who you ask. Still, it's a great entry into higher-end portable audio, if more expensive now than a few years ago. I think the MEElec A161P and Ety HF5 have taken its place as the single BAs to go for under $150. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> hello!
> Joker...could you please recommend me
> of some nice earphones in the range of 60$ or less
> that have dominant bass and are designed
> ...


 
   
  Bass-heavy sound and shallow fit don't go hand-in-hand very often. There are very few half in-ear designs that are properly bass-heavy. The Yamaha EPH-50 is one but it's not that great overall in my opinion. 
   
  There are also some straight-barrel earphones that still sound good with a shallow seal, for example the Xears N3i (not sure if it's still in production). 
   
  All that said, you may just want to grab a JVC FX101 and call it a day. I find them a little harsh and unrefined but there's no denying that the bass is huge and the price is right. 
   
  Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> I'd say EX600 was probably the closest I've found though wanting better separation, obvious micro detailing, more treble extension with a wetter mid range.
> I'm not really interested in EX1000 as an option if that helps.


 
   
  Yeah I haven't heard anything like that to the best of my recollection, at least not under $400.
   
  Quote: 





david245 said:


> I've got a question about the GR99. Can they be used simply with a Ipod or Iphone because I'm mostly gonna use them outside. By the way, what is the next IEM you'll be looking to put up on this thread?


 
   
  Yep, the GR99 is quite efficient.
   
  There's a list of planned reviews at the bottom of the front page. The very next set will likely either be something entry-level from a big brand or something from Rock-It Sounds.
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Yes, its the second reason, I do like the signature very much, it has just one tiny bump in the mid bass but I am still enjoying them.
> I am just thinking that since they sound pretty good(tried someone else's she3580), and most importantly they are so cheap, that I can hardly resist to throw another $10 into earphones, but I am worried that I will be using them even less than the hf5 that are already not being used quite often.


 
   
  If listening to IEMs doesn't fit in your schedule there's probably no reason to pick up more, even for $10. But yes, it's a great deal at $10. 
   
   
  Quote: 





nothingman said:


> Joker, I appreciate the reply and the suggestion of the FX700.
> 
> I've wanted to give the FX700 a try for a while, but I'd really like to move away from universals and into customs, and I love my IEMs for particularly loud environments like airplane travel and city public transportation.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Actually the FX700 played at low volumes reminded me of my Miracle. The v-shape gets more pronounced/obvious when you raise the volume, though. The Miracle has great extension on both ends of the spectrum and a similarly dynamic and refined sound while at the same time remaining smoother up top and more accurate down low. Among the lower-end customs the Alclair is probably closest but again based on your wanting a less analytical note presentation and smoother treble than the GR07, I can't 100% recommend it.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I know what some of those words mean...
> 
> The 122 has good clarity and detail and can be considered bright with the gray filters. Anything beyond that will depend on who you ask. Still, it's a great entry into higher-end portable audio, if more expensive now than a few years ago. I think the MEElec A161P and Ety HF5 have taken its place as the single BAs to go for under $150.


 
   
  Thanks! This is really helpful stuff. I recommended this to my friends, and hope I can help you raise money for an IE800 (I'm poor already, I'll try though lol). My last question is where you can get the Ety R. HF5 with ACS Tips on Amazon, and how they compare to the PFE122.


----------



## 177261

When shall we se a review of the Apple Earpods?


----------



## Niyologist

Initial thoughts on the Brainwavz M5: Very Punchy Bass, a bit overwhelming. Definitely energetic midrange and treble, but slightly blurred.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Thanks! This is really helpful stuff. I recommended this to my friends, and hope I can help you raise money for an IE800 (I'm poor already, I'll try though lol). My last question is where you can get the Ety R. HF5 with ACS Tips on Amazon, and how they compare to the PFE122.


 
   
  The ACS tips have to be custom-ordered through one of the ACS audiologists. There should be an ACS custom tip voucher in the box when you buy an Ety earphone. 
   
  There really isn't a huge performance difference between the HF5 and PFE IMO which is why I think that in many cases the HF5 (or the Fischer/MEElec SBA-03/A161P) is a better value. The Etys are maybe a little warmer while the PFEs (gray filters) are a little brighter and have more forward upper mids and slightly 'fuller' bass. 
   
  Quote: 





christianh said:


> When shall we se a review of the Apple Earpods?


 
   
  I don't know if those can really be considered IEMs.


----------



## Niyologist

After 2 Hours of Listening: The Midrange is starting to become more accurate and revealing, due to the bass simmering down a bit. The treble is slightly more energetic, but still tamed. The Soundstage opened slightly which is due to the changes just mentioned, along with the clarity. Still a long way to go with this. 
   
  So far: GR06>A151>M5>CC51>SP51


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Philips O'Neill SHO2200 Tread and Klipsch Image S3
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A70) Philips O'Neill Tread SHO2200*
> 
> Added Sep 2012
> 
> ...


----------



## suman134

image s3 seems to be a bit over paid , its some $30 here . mine is 2 years old , but still one of my fab in low end fire fighting .


----------



## suman134

the oval tips of the s3 are a concern too , it hurts some times . i replaced them with the sony hybrids .


----------



## Square Enix

joker, i saw the SHE3580 on your list. no rush as i already have them, but could you make a short comparison with the GR99 ? i'm considering getting a pair
  thank you


----------



## dustdevil

Why not the philips SHO2200 and the SHE3580???


----------



## carfentanil

To all our data-heads: I've had a change of address lately, only across town but my first permanent move since '03, - now that I'm settled in I'll probably upload the updated spreadsheet this weekend. If joker approves, I'd like to merge a new sheet into the same document that contains scores from his portable-full-size reviews...


----------



## zul56

Hello, I need recommendation for my first IEM!
  
 *Who am I?*
 Final year engineering student. I am aiming for a first class in my degree, and i need music to study efficiently. So, a geek like me need to consider an IEM as below:
  
 *What is your budget?*
 $50-$100
  
 *Are you OK with open ones?*
 No, I really don't want to disturb the person next to me in the library.. 
  
 *What equipment will be powering these IEM?*
 Macbook & My Samsung Omnia 7 (yes, it's a windows phone!) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 *What format of your music and other sounds will you be putting into these cans**?*
 I listen to anything BUT orchestra, jazz and classics. I enjoy most of the top ten songs in billboard hot 100.
  
 *Do you plan to use them outside of your home?*
 Yes! Everywhere i go: grocery shopping, on the way to lecture, in town
  
 *Describe the sound signature that you are seeking?*
 I have Sennheiser hd212 Pro and Beats Solo and Studio. I am quite tired of a bassy and muddy headphones. I really want a headphone which can give me good clarity, but with a recognizable bass (but not too much bass like in Beats Studio)
  
 To be honest, my favorite one so far is B&W P%, but its too outrageously expensive. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 *Other Specifications:*
 1. Comfortable
 2. Good Isolation
  
  
 Please help me for my IEM search, and need to ensure that this hard earned cash of mine is well spent. Thanks!  
  
 Need suggestion on IEM based on my specifications. Would love to get FiiO e5 amp too. thanks


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





zul56 said:


> Hello, I need recommendation for my first IEM!
> 
> *Who am I?*
> Final year engineering student. I am aiming for a first class in my degree, and i need music to study efficiently. So, a geek like me need to consider an IEM as below:
> ...


 
   
       you need a ue600 , mc5 , xba-1 ( has a down point of its own , asymmetrical cable ) , but ue 600 its not the best out going phone . get the gr06 , if you can do with the treble . your needs are screaming for a BA phone but BAs rarely comes with strong cable in this price range . hf 5 from ety can be a option if you can up the price a bit . if you dont want bass at all , get the a151 . i think with some care a ue 600 will do what you need . good precise bass , nice clarity , comfort is personal , and has good isolation too .


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





zul56 said:


> Hello, I need recommendation for my first IEM!


 
  rock it sounds R-50


----------



## Techno Kid

+1 Rockit R-50


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





square enix said:


> joker, i saw the SHE3580 on your list. no rush as i already have them, but could you make a short comparison with the GR99 ? i'm considering getting a pair
> thank you


 
   
GR99 is warmer and has slightly more bass impact while the SHE3580 is a little brighter and clearer and has more recessed mids. The bass is tighter with the Philips while the quality of the treble is comparable with the GR99 a little darker. The GR99 has the edge in presentation - it's got more out-of-the-head feel and gives a better sense of space with more depth.
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Why not the philips SHO2200 and the SHE3580???


 
   
  Had that review finished, plus the SHO2200 is closer in price and performance to the S3
   
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> To all our data-heads: I've had a change of address lately, only across town but my first permanent move since '03, - now that I'm settled in I'll probably upload the updated spreadsheet this weekend. If joker approves, I'd like to merge a new sheet into the same document that contains scores from his portable-full-size reviews...


 
   
  Sounds good to me!
   
  Quote: 





zul56 said:


> Hello, I need recommendation for my first IEM!
> 
> *Who am I?*
> Final year engineering student. I am aiming for a first class in my degree, and i need music to study efficiently. So, a geek like me need to consider an IEM as below:
> ...


 
   
  You don't need the E5. I think you would enjoy the Shure SE215 or HiSound Crystal. They've got a slight bump in the bass and warm tonality but still sound clear and detailed overall.


----------



## lilboozy

Don't flame me but I own the skullcandy jibs and compared it to my friends ink'd and the jibs are way better (clearer highs, slightly better bass quantity, better bass quality, mids more or less the same) and they cost 5 dollars less. Joker can you please review them so i can see a professional review.


----------



## dustdevil

Do the acs tips get as deep as the etymotic tri flanges do?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Joker, sorry to bother you again, but I found a pair of GENUINE Sennheiser IE8s for $200. Should I get it, vs the GR07, HF5, or PFE122?


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Joker, sorry to bother you again, but I found a pair of GENUINE Sennheiser IE8s for $200. Should I get it, vs the GR07, HF5, or PFE122?


 
  Mind sharing where you got it?


----------



## Zelda

joker, mind if i ask why you rated the gr06 (a bit) higher than the se215 in SQ ?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Mind sharing where you got it?


 
   
  Nice try


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Don't flame me but I own the skullcandy jibs and compared it to my friends ink'd and the jibs are way better (clearer highs, slightly better bass quantity, better bass quality, mids more or less the same) and they cost 5 dollars less. Joker can you please review them so i can see a professional review.


 
   
  Not a tall order to beat the Ink'd or Smokin'. I did like the Ink'd back when I had them but newer discoveries such as the Philips SHE3580 blow them away for me.
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Do the acs tips get as deep as the etymotic tri flanges do?


 
   
  Not mine, but it would really depend on how the original molds are taken. I asked for them to be a little longer than the canals of the customs I had at the time but didn't want them past the 2nd bend of the ear canal. 
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Joker, sorry to bother you again, but I found a pair of GENUINE Sennheiser IE8s for $200. Should I get it, vs the GR07, HF5, or PFE122?


 
   
  Really depends - if you want heavy bass and a warmer sound with a wide soundstage and mediocre isolation, go for the IE8s. If you value accuracy go for one of the others. I prefer the GR07 and HF5 personally. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> joker, mind if i ask why you rated the gr06 (a bit) higher than the se215 in SQ ?


 
   
  Yeah, aside from the bit of sibilance that the VSonic IEMs seem to share I like the treble of the GR06 much better while everything else is mostly comparable to the SE215.


----------



## rawrster

I've been lurking a bit here and the first page takes a long time to load everything 
   
  I'm a tad curious but what is your favorite earphone? You have a longer list of earphones than when I was last active in this part of head-fi


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Not mine, but it would really depend on how the original molds are taken. I asked for them to be a little longer than the canals of the customs I had at the time but didn't want them past the 2nd bend of the ear canal.


 
  So are they going to make the tips according to your requirements?? As someone has asked acs to make the tips to get very deep but after 4 tries all he recieve are shallow fitting tips...


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> So are they going to make the tips according to your requirements?? As someone has asked acs to make the tips to get very deep but after 4 tries all he recieve are shallow fitting tips...


 
   
  udauda's post was odd... he asked the tips to be remade 4 times but nowhere in the post did I read about him getting his mold taken again?  How can you make a deeper fitting tip with the same mold?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I've been lurking a bit here and the first page takes a long time to load everything
> 
> I'm a tad curious but what is your favorite earphone? You have a longer list of earphones than when I was last active in this part of head-fi


 
   
  The Miracle.. I don't suppose that's a surprise. It's still the best I've heard by a margin. The only thing that I thought may have been clsoe was a Rooth quad BA + dynamic hybrid (forgot the name). I only spent a few minutes with it, though. 
   
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> So are they going to make the tips according to your requirements?? As someone has asked acs to make the tips to get very deep but after 4 tries all he recieve are shallow fitting tips...


 
   
  I never communicated with ACS directly, I only told the audiologist how deep I wanted her to go with the impressions. The audiologist can set the dam wherever you want it. The custom ACS tips are as deep as my impressions were, which is how I wanted them.


----------



## LYNG2

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> GR99 is warmer and has slightly more bass impact while the SHE3580 is a little brighter and clearer and has more recessed mids. The bass is tighter with the Philips while the quality of the treble is comparable with the GR99 a little darker. The GR99 has the edge in presentation - it's got more out-of-the-head feel and gives a better sense of space with more depth.
> 
> 
> Had that review finished, plus the SHO2200 is closer in price and performance to the S3
> ...


 
  hey zul56, the HSA crystal sounds great. in fact, all aspects(build quality, comfort) are great for the price. except for one aspect : the worse than average microphonics was really driving me mad(worsened by the fact that it does not come with a chin slider). Unless u wear it over the ear(which is probably the only solution), I probably would not recommend that you purchase it if you wear it straight down as the microphonics can be quite bothersome even doing simple tasks such as walking around. the wire is also quite bouncy which is probably the cause of the microphonics. worst still, it has that annoying wind noise when you have fan blowing directly at you. No offense to you, joker. u r a great reviewer with great contributions to the community, but i just feel that i can provide some opinions to help him, as well as people who might be tempted to buy the HSA crystal.  cheers!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lyng2 said:


> hey zul56, the HSA crystal sounds great. in fact, all aspects(build quality, comfort) are great for the price. except for one aspect : the worse than average microphonics was really driving me mad(worsened by the fact that it does not come with a chin slider). Unless u wear it over the ear(which is probably the only solution), I probably would not recommend that you purchase it if you wear it straight down as the microphonics can be quite bothersome even doing simple tasks such as walking around. the wire is also quite bouncy which is probably the cause of the microphonics. worst still, it has that annoying wind noise when you have fan blowing directly at you. No offense to you, joker. u r a great reviewer with great contributions to the community, but i just feel that i can provide some opinions to help him, as well as people who might be tempted to buy the HSA crystal.  cheers!


 
   
  I've never discouraged anyone from sharing their experiences here. I agree that microphonics is probably the biggest weakness of the Crystal if you wear it cable down. I've always worn it cord-up personally.


----------



## Niyologist

snappyaxolotl said:


> Nice try




???


----------



## snappyaxolotl

ljokerl, I am trying to decide between 5 IEMs, if you look over here. Which headphones are best for my requirements?
   
  The comparison:
  -Sennheiser IE8 ($200 after discount)
  -Sony MDR-EX600 ($180)
  -Phonak Audeo PFE122 ($200)
  -VSonic GR07 ($180)
  -Yamaha EPH-100SL ($150)
  (I take suggestions for other things)
   
  TL;DR version of my thread:
   
  -For accessories, I use the case, clip, and possibly ear tips.
  -Use my headphones a lot and in many situations, want them to last. Like forever.
  -Noise isolation isn't too much of a problem, mediocre isolation is fine.
  -Good microphonics; don't want cable noise.
  -Needs to be comfortable; feels like it's not there after a while.
  -Listen to classical, jazz, techno, electronic, rap, hip-hop, pop; need good bass and treble.
   
  Preferred sound signature-
I like euphonic, juicy and lush, and sturdy music. I find accuracy, clarity, and attention to low sounds important. I would like my sound to be balanced, gripped, and brilliant. Punchy bass and treble is important.
   
Thanks!


----------



## AstralStorm

Yeah, this makes it easier: "I want everything".
   
  Anyway, I'd say PFE122 = GR07 > MDR-EX600 > EPH-100 > IE8.
  MDR-EX600 are too "hot" treble with some 4k ringing, EPH-100 is somewhat muffled and IE8 far too warm.
   
  Between the first two, it comes to whether you can live with 6kHz ringing in GR07, which also causes sibilance and is generally annoying. Maybe mkII has that changed, but I'm pretty sure not.
   
  I prefer PFE122 both for its signature as well as nicer fit than GR07 due to longer effective nozzle and no blocky body. It's also a bit lighter in the bass, bit more neutral - slightly worse bass decay, somewhat better mids and treble handling.


----------



## yezz12

I need a 60 euro max. Headphone/IEM. I ride with my bicycle to school. I've read both stickies and came up with this:
   
  Grado SR60i
  Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition
  VSonic GR06
   
  Which one is the best? I listen to rock/metal. Also, my source is an iPod Nano 3G. Should i replace it with a clip+? Haven't heard anything about the Nano 3G around here.

   
  ALso, is buying a Grado that risky if you haven't heard any before?


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





yezz12 said:


> I need a 60 euro max. Headphone/IEM. I ride with my bicycle to school. I've read both stickies and came up with this:
> 
> Grado SR60i
> Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition
> ...


 
   
  grado may not be the best if you dont know what it will do to you , the open back may kill all the fun , long cable can be worse while on the go , ride to school ? may be no , if you want a headphone not in ears phone , you can go for some funky style closed ones , like philips oneill  snug and stretch , just going at as low as $40 , good sound for the price , good seal , on ear with good clamp force , and looks can be good . sq is not awesome but okay .
   
  grado is good for inside home use . xcape ie , may be , gr06 , yes , if you can take the treble . its not bad , i love that treble , but some dont like it at all , easy solution , eq it man . best to show off and with good music can be some funky velodyne v plus . take that bass dont hurt .
   
  and the clip+ will do better then nano 3g .


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Listening to cans while driving or on a bike is generally not advised, as your ears tend to alert you to impending collisions...


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Yeah, this makes it easier: "I want everything".
> 
> Anyway, I'd say PFE122 = GR07 > MDR-EX600 > EPH-100 > IE8.
> MDR-EX600 are too "hot" treble with some 4k ringing, EPH-100 is somewhat muffled and IE8 far too warm.
> ...


 
  I'm quite surprised you picked the Sennheiser IE8 last, considering it seems like a really good in-ear. Most people would pick it above all others (except maybe the GR07.) Can you explain what receding factors helped you make the above comparision?


----------



## ljokerl

The downloadable spreadsheet has been updated with the latest scores. Data from the portable headphone thread is now included as well. It can be downloaded here, thanks to carfentanil
   
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> ljokerl, I am trying to decide between 5 IEMs, if you look over here. Which headphones are best for my requirements?
> 
> The comparison:
> -Sennheiser IE8 ($200 after discount)
> ...


 
   
  My read from your requirements is that you would be happiest with a GR07 or EX600.
   
  Quote: 





yezz12 said:


> I need a 60 euro max. Headphone/IEM. I ride with my bicycle to school. I've read both stickies and came up with this:
> 
> Grado SR60i
> Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition
> ...


 
   
  I would think twice about riding a bike with IEMs unless you are riding on trails or closed courses. On the other hand the SR60i might be susceptible to wind noise at speed, which would be undesirable. You'd have to find someone who's tried biking with one to know for sure.
   
  And the Grado signature isn't that outlandish, just bright and aggressive. I think first-time buyers are typically happy with Grados as they are very clear and quite a bit more exciting than stock earbuds, If you want something safer a PX100-II or Portapro would be warmer, smoother alternatives. If you're set on IEMs I'd probably go for the GR06 or something less isolating, like a Soundmagic E30. 
   
  Not familiar with the Nano 3G as a source but iPods (and even more so, iPhones) are typically decent.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> My read from your requirements is that you would be happiest with a GR07 or EX600.


 
  Are those my best options, or are there better options (that aren't listed) for the price of ~$200? I consulted ClieOS who recommended the PFE and the GR07


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Listening to cans while driving or on a bike is generally not advised, as your ears tend to alert you to impending collisions...


 
   
  thats a good advice man , but i think headphones dont isolate like iems , not saying ride with headphones on , but its hard to stop some one when they want to . one should me more cautious while these on .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Are those my best options, or are there better options (that aren't listed) for the price of ~$200? I consulted ClieOS who recommended the PFE and the GR07


 
   
  They're two of the best sub-$200 earphones I've heard and seem to suit what you are asking for. I haven't heard everything that's out there, though.


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> thats a good advice man , but i think headphones dont isolate like iems , not saying ride with headphones on , but its hard to stop some one when they want to . one should me more cautious while these on .


 
  Riders with earplugs are far more dangerous to other riders too.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 In the US, it is actually illegal in many places. I have considered something like iGrados at a low volume for it, something open and cheap, so you can still hear the music quietly, but the sound of the street dominates. I also occassionally use ear buds at low volume, as they do very little in the way of isolation.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> In the US, it is actually illegal in many places. I have considered something like iGrados at a low volume for it, something open and cheap, so you can still hear the music quietly, but the sound of the street dominates. I also occassionally use ear buds at low volume, as they do very little in the way of isolation.


 
   
  sadly , in here no one cares . people riding with earphone/headphone is rare , but when they do , not many will care . im not saying drive with them . i drive with my snug no , i can hear nearly every thing . and horns are easier to hear , unless , you have custom inears placed deep . headphone earphones are okay for casual roads with out much traffic , not for busy roads , cuz busy roads needs some thing like a helmet on . with earphones , most of the time i put only one side on , that makes things better .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Riders with earplugs are far more dangerous to other riders too.


 
   
  headphones do isolate lesser when compared to earplugs/inears , and are for casual roads , not high way and busy roads . and you dont concentrate on headphone much , it just comes , keep to your lane  and you should know what to do while changing lanes and turning , dont do rash things , keep it safe , and its not that bad .
   
       use of any type of hearing instrument while driving is dangerous , it cant be stopped , but can be done better .


----------



## Amitl

hello!
  i was interested in the Soundmagic e10 because the id America Spark
  just go too deep into my ear canals and it bothers me
  does the Soundmagic e10 make for a shallower fit?
  thanks


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





amitl said:


> hello!
> i was interested in the Soundmagic e10 because the id America Spark
> just go too deep into my ear canals and it bothers me
> does the Soundmagic e10 make for a shallower fit?
> thanks


 
   
  e10 is not different , why dont you try some larger tips . or you need some thing with bigger shell that dont get inside . some thing that has 13.5mm driver unit or like e30 .


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, which IEM have best definition: SM3, EX1000, W4, PFE 232, CK10 or DBA-02 MKII?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## sivad07

*Could you check out ultimate ears 600 these have got some rave reviews on amazon. i definitely would want to know where it stands in the chart. thanks in advance*


----------



## nyonya

Hi ljokerl, just a couple quick questions:
   
  1) Have you gotten a chance to hear the GR07 Mk. 2?  If so, what are your impressions of them vs. the Mk. 1?
  2) I'm strongly considering getting custom silicone tips made for the GR07s - do you believe this would significantly improve isolation?  Or does the fact that they're vented mean that the stock single-flanges are about as good as isolation is going to get?
  3) I'm very happy with the GR07s for now, but if I wanted to upgrade, what higher-end IEM has a similar signature?  I particularly don't want anything with more bass or more pronounced treble, as I seem to be sensitive to that stuff.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





sivad07 said:


> *Could you check out ultimate ears 600 these have got some rave reviews on amazon. i definitely would want to know where it stands in the chart. thanks in advance*


 
   
      if joker ranks eph-100 at 8.9 , ue 600 with a bit less bass and nearly flat spectrum with awesome sound stage , beautiful highs and entertaining mids , i with my personal experience will rate it at 8.5 ( i prefer ue 600 amount of bass , if i liked more bass it may have be different ) . and at just $80 its one of my best buy , may not be strongly build , but not bad . if you are thinking , i will say you are just wasting time in thinking m just go for it if you can do with it .


----------



## carfentanil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Miracle.. I don't suppose that's a surprise. It's still the best I've heard by a margin. The only thing that I thought may have been clsoe was a Rooth quad BA + dynamic hybrid (forgot the name). I only spent a few minutes with it, though.


 
  That has to be the LSX5/LS5X - probably a Merlin-like sound - average_joe posted a review (with other Rooth customs) in May, impressed with the depth and neutrality.


----------



## ra07212

Hi All,

I stumbled across head-fi.org a little while ago when I decided on purchasing a new pair of earphones. 

Looking at the threads i've found the choice of earphones overwhelming and I was hoping you guys could advise me on a pair of earphones. Unfortunately I won't have the opportunity to try before I buy so your views are important.

My music taste vary, however what i'm looking for a pair of earphones that provide clarity, crisp vocals, detail between the mids and the highs a good but not overwhelming bass response. I will be using the earphones with my iPhone 4s on my journey to and from work and in the gym so build quality is important. 

I've included a couple of links below which should give you an idea of the tracks I will be listening to:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9zBkXCz1KU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--tg0mQf8Zo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSbWfBZIjgE



My budget is £350. 

I look forward to hearing from you guys.

I'm thinking either the west one 4r which will cost me £270 or the phonak audeo pfe232 at £400. Should I be aware of any others???? Was considering the shure 535 but reads they lack in the bass department.

Have seen the UE 900 how do they compare against the above?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They're two of the best sub-$200 earphones I've heard and seem to suit what you are asking for. I haven't heard everything that's out there, though.


 
  Not sure why you, AstralStorm, and ClieOS all picked the Sennheiser IE8s last for my requirements. From what I've heard from others, they seem like really good headphones. Could you tell why they aren't too good for my style?
   
  Also, what would you recommend if I stretched my budget to $300?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





ra07212 said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I stumbled across head-fi.org a little while ago when I decided on purchasing a new pair of earphones.
> 
> ...


 
   
  THANK YOU for introducing me to Phaeleh! I can't believe I have't heard anything from him before.
   
  With that said, the Vsonic GR07 MKII will probably be your best bet. Like those songs, it has almost all it's bass emphasis in the sub regions, has clear, extended treble, and a very good midrange.
   
  Once again, thanks.


----------



## Amitl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> e10 is not different , why dont you try some larger tips . or you need some thing with bigger shell that dont get inside . some thing that has 13.5mm driver unit or like e30 .


 

 Thanks Suman!
  does the e30 make for a shallower fit than the e10 / id america spark?
  i did try larger eartips but that didnt help.
  i dont have big ears but i dont like the tips touching my inner ear canal.
  the sennheiser cx300 i used to have were so comfortable! im looking for this
  exact sort of fit.
  so now im thinking of the e30 / e10..
  is the e30 isolation really bad?


----------



## PMAP

I see MEE A161 is now listed as a copy of Fischer SBA-03.
   
  Are we 100% certain it's exactly the same thing on the inside? I recall Joe from MEE saying they were tweaked to their specs. I haven't heard either model so I can't tell.
   
  Either way even if they sound the same, the packaging differs, it would be wise to mention that and change the accessories rating accordingly IMHO.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> hello!
> i was interested in the Soundmagic e10 because the id America Spark
> just go too deep into my ear canals and it bothers me
> does the Soundmagic e10 make for a shallower fit?
> thanks


 
   
  Shallower but probably not shallow enough, Maybe try something with an angled-nozzle type fit, such as a Brainwavz Beta?
   
  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, which IEM have best definition: SM3, EX1000, W4, PFE 232, CK10 or DBA-02 MKII?
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  It would be pretty close between the DBA/CK10, EX1000, and PFE 232 - they are all very crisp-sounding. Tempted to say DBA-02 mkII but you'd have to A:B between them listening specifically for that. The SM3 would have the most smoothed-over response for sure.
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl, just a couple quick questions:
> 
> 1) Have you gotten a chance to hear the GR07 Mk. 2?  If so, what are your impressions of them vs. the Mk. 1?
> 2) I'm strongly considering getting custom silicone tips made for the GR07s - do you believe this would significantly improve isolation?  Or does the fact that they're vented mean that the stock single-flanges are about as good as isolation is going to get?
> ...


 
   
  Have not heard the mkII. Custom silicone tips should help with isolation but it will depend on how deep they are. The vent on the GR07 is very small, I highly doubt it will make a significant difference in isolation. 
   
  Regarding the upgrade, I am tempted to say PFE232 but it's such a small difference that I have trouble justifying the $400 price hike on sound quality alone. 
   
  Quote: 





carfentanil said:


> That has to be the LSX5/LS5X - probably a Merlin-like sound - average_joe posted a review (with other Rooth customs) in May, impressed with the depth and neutrality.


 
   
  Right you are, that's the one. I thought the Merlin demo didn't compete with my Miracle very well but the Rooth one definitely did. 
   
  Quote: 





ra07212 said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I stumbled across head-fi.org a little while ago when I decided on purchasing a new pair of earphones.
> 
> ...


 
   
  That's quite a budget. The W4R at 270 pounds seems like a good option. I've only had the UE900 for a week or so, so no final impressions yet but so far it seems to do what you want as well. Not sure I would recommend it if it costs the same as the Westones, though. The GR07 would also be a fantastic cheaper option that does what you want. You could also see what the Sony EX1000 or EX600 would run you if isolation is not a priority (they don't isolate very well)
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Not sure why you, AstralStorm, and ClieOS all picked the Sennheiser IE8s last for my requirements. From what I've heard from others, they seem like really good headphones. Could you tell why they aren't too good for my style?
> 
> Also, what would you recommend if I stretched my budget to $300?


 
   
  The IE8 is bass-heavy and not particularly resolving compared to something like a GR07. Just seemed like you'd be happier with one of the other sets you are looking it. And, I really don't think theres anything great to be had by stretching your budget from $200 to $300. The Final Audio FI-BA-SB is in there somewhere but I think it might be over $300, and not necessarily better than a GR07/EX600 anyway. 
   
  Quote: 





pmap said:


> I see MEE A161 is now listed as a copy of Fischer SBA-03.
> 
> Are we 100% certain it's exactly the same thing on the inside? I recall Joe from MEE saying they were tweaked to their specs. I haven't heard either model so I can't tell.
> 
> Either way even if they sound the same, the packaging differs, it would be wise to mention that and change the accessories rating accordingly IMHO.


 
   
  I just got an A161P loan from innerfidelity and they seem to be the same as my Fischers. I wasn't sure what the differences were in terms of build/accessories so I haven't added any ratings for them yet.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Thanks Suman!
> does the e30 make for a shallower fit than the e10 / id america spark?
> i did try larger eartips but that didnt help.
> i dont have big ears but i dont like the tips touching my inner ear canal.
> ...


 
   
      e30 has shallow fit , but goes over ear , if you liked the cx 300 , e30 with less emphasis on highs may feel a bit less interesting , isolation with the biggest tips was okay for me , has good bass and cleaner mids , but the less sparky highs were a heart breaker . i wonder if you have sony ex220lp available there . really cheap here at $22 its a awesome buy . not bass heavy but worth the price tag .
   
      some suggestions are , sennheiser cx175 , denon ahc-360/351 , sony ex220lp , xb41ex . may be a cowon ce1 , but that has bad isolation .
  exact sort of fit can be from a cx 400 II , cx 500 , denon ahc-260 , how did i missed it , meelec cw31 would be awesome , but dont have bass like cx300 .


----------



## PMAP

Quote:


> I just got an A161P loan from innerfidelity and they seem to be the same as my Fischers. I wasn't sure what the differences were in terms of build/accessories so I haven't added any ratings for them yet.


 
  The way the title of 2B10 is worded, it may seem to people that they're identical. Just remember your megareview has large influence on purchasing decisions 
   
  BTW found the original mention, on anythingbutipod review: http://anythingbutipod.com/2012/05/meelectronics-a161p-iem/
   
  Quote: 





> According to MEE, their Chinese manufacturing partner tunes the signature to their specifications. So even though you can purchase similar IEMs, the sound signature will most likely be a little different.


 
  Maybe not in this case, but MEE is notorious for using generic shells... Well you know that better than me surely.
   
  I'm not affiliated with either brand, just saying.


----------



## ra07212

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> THANK YOU for introducing me to Phaeleh! I can't believe I have't heard anything from him before.
> 
> With that said, the Vsonic GR07 MKII will probably be your best bet. Like those songs, it has almost all it's bass emphasis in the sub regions, has clear, extended treble, and a very good midrange.
> 
> Once again, thanks.


 
   
  thanks for the info and glad you like Phaeleh.
   
  Private message me the dubstep artists and tracks you like and I will compile a playlist.


----------



## Amitl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> e30 has shallow fit , but goes over ear , if you liked the cx 300 , e30 with less emphasis on highs may feel a bit less interesting , isolation with the biggest tips was okay for me , has good bass and cleaner mids , but the less sparky highs were a heart breaker . i wonder if you have sony ex220lp available there . really cheap here at $22 its a awesome buy . not bass heavy but worth the price tag .
> 
> some suggestions are , sennheiser cx175 , denon ahc-360/351 , sony ex220lp , xb41ex . may be a cowon ce1 , but that has bad isolation .
> exact sort of fit can be from a cx 400 II , cx 500 , denon ahc-260 , how did i missed it , meelec cw31 would be awesome , but dont have bass like cx300 .


 

 Thanks Suman and Joker!
  im thinking of the Soundmagic e30 vs. Meelec cw31
  im afraid im going to dislike the half-in-ear design of the meelec
  which of them sound better?
  i think i like the over the ear design for a better secure and microphonics.
  i sometimes try to wear the id america spark over the ear but the cable doesnt stay put
  and when i use ear guides it wraps around my neck and its like going to choke me
  does the e30 cable stay put around the ear?
  i always glimpse at the shure 215...but it seems to go real deep into the ear canals. is it true?
  thank you very much


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pmap said:


> The way the title of 2B10 is worded, it may seem to people that they're identical. Just remember your megareview has large influence on purchasing decisions
> 
> BTW found the original mention, on anythingbutipod review: http://anythingbutipod.com/2012/05/meelectronics-a161p-iem/
> 
> ...


 
   
  They sounded pretty much identical at first listen - the similarities are much more than skin deep in this case. Will do more listening later in the week.
   
  Generic shells are a common phenomenon for dynamic-driver earphones because you can just tune the driver or pop in a different one of the same size (obviously not quite that simple) and voilà - an earphone that potentially performs very differently from what you started with. Armature-based earphones are different because the shells are usually fitted to a specific armature (just look at cross-sections of the UE housings on the web). The drivers themselves are manufactured by one of the major BA manufacturers which means they probably aren't tuned at assembly level. I think it's safe to assume that the SBA-03 and A161P are at most using different variants of the same driver (Knowles ED according to that ABI review, which makes sense as they do sound rather Ety-like in many ways). 
   
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Thanks Suman and Joker!
> im thinking of the Soundmagic e30 vs. Meelec cw31
> im afraid im going to dislike the half-in-ear design of the meelec
> which of them sound better?
> ...


 
   
  I actually think the fit of the CW31 is safer but that's just me. They don't sound that different. CW31 tends to be warmer and focus on lows and mids. E30 is more balanced but still has decent bass (nowhere near as much as the Spark though). 
   
  The Shures go pretty deep, hence the excellent isolation.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Thanks Suman and Joker!
> im thinking of the Soundmagic e30 vs. Meelec cw31
> im afraid im going to dislike the half-in-ear design of the meelec
> which of them sound better?
> ...


 
   
       i will say cw31 but it cant be worn over ear at all , but the e30 has no trouble with that and it cant be worn straight . go for any that you like .


----------



## ljokerl

Since someone asked about them in this thread, my brief thoughts on the Apple EarPods vs the old iBuds can be found here, complete with a short comparison to the Monoprice 8320.


----------



## scootsit

I'm looking for some inexpensive IEMs for my phone with a mic. I'm assuming M9P is the way to go?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I'm looking for some inexpensive IEMs for my phone with a mic. I'm assuming M9P is the way to go?


 
  why not the philips SHE35* series? there are phone versions too


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





zelda said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I tried googling and couldn't find them, I assume the astrisk is replaced by a number. What number?
   
  Found em! Thanks!
   
  What signature do they have?


----------



## Zelda

V shaped sound, depends on the model. similar to the M9, but much better quality


----------



## Joe Bloggs

scootsit said:


> I tried googling and couldn't find them, I assume the astrisk is replaced by a number. What number?
> 
> Found em! Thanks!
> 
> What signature do they have?




The current with-mic version is numbered SHE3595


----------



## marald

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I cannot comment on many of those, but if you're going for a Vsonic, I'd recommend the GR04 Flagship Pro if you can still find them. They're technically a step up from the 06, and can be found for about $50 because they're being discontinued.


 
  It's been three weeks since i asked for help in this topic, two people recommended me the GR04 Pro Flagship, so i did a little research than i bought them.. Arrived last week.
   
  They are so awesome! I can feel a huge defference comparing them to my previous GR99, the overall clarity and detail are just sweet, they are very good with all the kinds of music i listen to, with a little EQing for the most bass-heavy songs.
   
  The selection of tips is impressive, and the build quality is great.. looking at details like the adjustable metal nozzles, and the large cable cinch is really satisfying!
   
  I listen to them straight from my clip+ and i couldn't be happier, i didn't believe they could be such a great product for 40€, Thanks guys!


----------



## Amitl

Joker and Suman, thanks a lot for the advice......
  i just have one last question 
  would the meelec cw31 be a noticable downgrade from my
  id america spark and klipsch image s4?
  i think i'd try harder to get used to 'em if it is.
  the sparks have such a fantastic sound, i couldn't ask more.
  anyway i'm really thinking seriously about the meelec cw31.
  thank you guys so much!


----------



## suman134

not really , i dont like the image s4 , big v shaped sound with bolted bass and harsh highs , cw31 is quiet balanced and easy on ears . not a significant down grade , not at all . if you dont want to down grade get the gr06 .


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





marald said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I agree entirely. I was quite surprised. The higher impedance of the Flagships (50z) makes them compatible with more devices, too. Anything with output impedance as high as 7 or 8 z sounds all right in my experience


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 How does the SHE3575 compare, because I found those for $7 shipped on Amazon...
   
   
  Also, thoughts on the MEElec M16, they're on sale, too, and they have a signature I would prefer, anyone have those and the SHEs?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> *How does the SHE3575 compare, because I found those for $7 shipped on Amazon*...
> 
> 
> Also, thoughts on the MEElec M16, they're on sale, too, and they have a signature I would prefer, anyone have those and the SHEs?


 
  should be same thing.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





zelda said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Great, thanks for the info. Also, for the record, this is my 500th post!


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Have not heard the mkII. Custom silicone tips should help with isolation but it will depend on how deep they are. The vent on the GR07 is very small, I highly doubt it will make a significant difference in isolation.
> 
> Regarding the upgrade, I am tempted to say PFE232 but it's such a small difference that I have trouble justifying the $400 price hike on sound quality alone.


 
   
  Is a custom tip that ends just short of the second bend fairly deep?  Not sure how far my current tips go so don't really have a basis for comparison.
   
  Also, if I wanted to get a cheaper pair of IEMs with a similar sound signature, what would be a good option?  Would the GR02 Bass Edition make sense?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Amitl

i dont like the klipsch s4 either to be honest
  from the same reasons!...too harsh and sibilant
  and lots of things sound unnatural
  but the id america spark....thats a real fantastic phone
  real amazing sound....
  well im gonna still use it but im also getting
  the meelecs cw31 
  thanks suman and joker!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I'm looking for some inexpensive IEMs for my phone with a mic. I'm assuming M9P is the way to go?


 
   
  I still enjoy my M9P. It's not as good as the SHE3580 but works well as a headset for my phone. Cable noise is low compared to the Philips and the sound is not immediately offensive to me as with many other sub-$20 IEMs. I can't listen to my Panasonic HJE120 for more than 10 minutes without thinking about everything it lacks. 
   
   
  Quote: 





marald said:


> It's been three weeks since i asked for help in this topic, two people recommended me the GR04 Pro Flagship, so i did a little research than i bought them.. Arrived last week.
> 
> They are so awesome! I can feel a huge defference comparing them to my previous GR99, the overall clarity and detail are just sweet, they are very good with all the kinds of music i listen to, with a little EQing for the most bass-heavy songs.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Glad you've found something you like! Sounds like a great deal. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Joker and Suman, thanks a lot for the advice......
> i just have one last question
> would the meelec cw31 be a noticable downgrade from my
> id america spark and klipsch image s4?
> ...


 
   
  The CW31 and S4 don't really sound anything alike. CW31 is pretty balanced, with a bump in the bass and good mids, and treble that's a bit too soft. The S4 is quite bass- and treble-heavy. The Spark is too, but doesn't go overboard like the S4.
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> How does the SHE3575 compare, because I found those for $7 shipped on Amazon...
> 
> 
> Also, thoughts on the MEElec M16, they're on sale, too, and they have a signature I would prefer, anyone have those and the SHEs?


 
   
  The M16 sounds somewhat like the M9 with weaker bass and less recessed mids. I think the strong, deep bass is one of the things that make the M9 special so I don't really like the M16 any better. And I certainly don't like it as much as my SHE3580. I would put the performance of the 3580 closer to the CW31/A151 level than the M9/M16. 
   
  Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Is a custom tip that ends just short of the second bend fairly deep?  Not sure how far my current tips go so don't really have a basis for comparison.
> 
> Also, if I wanted to get a cheaper pair of IEMs with a similar sound signature, what would be a good option?  Would the GR02 Bass Edition make sense?
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  I think that really depends on the shape of your ear - Ety triple flanges go to the second bend for me but for some they are shallower than that. 
   
  Cheaper than GR07 but with a somewhat similar signature - the pickings are pretty slim. The GR02 is way bassier. Maybe an ECCI PR401 or UE500, or even Soundmagic E30 at the way low end.


----------



## suman134

gr02 is with huge bass , and dont fit the bill , i agree with joker ue400/500 will do . but may not agree about e30 , e30 is a disappointment for me , lacks the treble spark badly , still have good bass and pleasing mids .


----------



## Daffiestlime

What would you recommend for an in-ear with a good amount of bass for dubstep, without muddling the vocals for hip-hop and such? I was looking at the SE215, but I bet there are other options. At around $100-200. I find my Sennheiser HD-25 to be a bit boring by the way.


----------



## Amitl

how could Cnet.com be so excited about the klipsch s4?
  i just dont understand...i was so disappointed of the sound...
  the harshness and sibilance...and the treble sound so unnatural
  how could it be??


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> gr02 is with huge bass , and dont fit the bill , i agree with joker ue400/500 will do . but may not agree about e30 , e30 is a disappointment for me , lacks the treble spark badly , still have good bass and pleasing mids .


 
   
  I would pick the UE500 or PR401 over the E30 as well but here in the US there's a pretty big price difference. UE500 runs $60-70 and the PR401 is even more expensive. 
   
  Quote: 





daffiestlime said:


> What would you recommend for an in-ear with a good amount of bass for dubstep, without muddling the vocals for hip-hop and such? I was looking at the SE215, but I bet there are other options. At around $100-200. I find my Sennheiser HD-25 to be a bit boring by the way.


 
   
  The SE215 is a nice pick with inoffensive sound and enhanced but not overpowering bass. However, I would consider its sound less exciting than that of the HD25. Without knowing exactly why you find the HD25 boring I would recommend a JVC FXT90 in that price range - it's got a nicely forward sound with solid bass.
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> how could Cnet.com be so excited about the klipsch s4?
> i just dont understand...i was so disappointed of the sound...
> the harshness and sibilance...and the treble sound so unnatural
> how could it be??


 
   
  Cnet reviewers really aren't audiophiles, except of course for Steve Guttenberg but he tends to rave about everything. I wouldn't go to cnet for audio reviews - if not Head-Fi then Sound & Vision or InnerFidelity or someone else at least mildly specializing in audio.


----------



## lilboozy

How would the vpulse compete against the turbine?


----------



## Amitl

Sennheiser cx200 / cx 400 / cx 500 vs. Meelec cw31...?
  for heavy metal...


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





amitl said:


> how could Cnet.com be so excited about the klipsch s4?
> i just dont understand...i was so disappointed of the sound...
> the harshness and sibilance...and the treble sound so unnatural
> how could it be??


 

        you know C.net puts ipod touch as the best mp3 player . and their reviews are hit by less number of quality phone reviews . and yeah , doubt that there are many good reviewers in there . and the s4 is just pumped by i think a v shape sound lover . or may be paid by makers .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> How would the vpulse compete against the turbine?


 
   
  Very well, they have a pretty similar sound. The vPulse is a little more sub-bass oriented while the Turbine has more mid-bass bloat with a warmer sound but otherwise they won't differ much. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Sennheiser cx200 / cx 400 / cx 500 vs. Meelec cw31...?
> for heavy metal...


 
   
  Only heard the CX200/CX250. It's wasn't bad but the cable was microphonic and it didn't really wow me overall. Might work well for metal, though.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Sennheiser cx200 / cx 400 / cx 500 vs. Meelec cw31...?
> for heavy metal...


 

 cx 500 was good , better sound stage , good smooth bass , didnt lagged like 200 /400 , has better mids and good highs , two cables 60cm and 60 cm , but not par with the modern phones , and its 5years old iem , and been out of production for last two years . so cw31 which is two years old is far better choice . i think pr401 as joker shaded light has shallow fit too but is pricy . cw31 has lower bass , keep that is mind . for me i like the signature of both in their own prospective . but cw31 is good .


----------



## incinerate

Thanks Joker for your reviews. You look competent and I appreciate it a lot.

 I've had a lot of problems and I'm sick of my former IEM's; Fischer, NuForce(poor), Epson and Etymotic because of their build quality in the sense that they all get glitches in the cables around the plugs or the housing. So I think I'm going for the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition  - which, with it's supposedly strong cables look like something more durable and looks very affordable..

 Do you know where I can buy a proper version of exactly the GR02 Bass, with international shipping, that you reviewed? Confusion seem to arrive when Vsonic apparently like to name their IEM's with the similiar names.

Fun to hear your're from SM. I love that city.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





incinerate said:


> Thanks Joker for your reviews. You look competent and I appreciate it a lot.
> 
> I've had a lot of problems and I'm sick of my former IEM's; Fischer, NuForce(poor), Epson and Etymotic because of their build quality in the sense that they all get glitches in the cables around the plugs or the housing. So I think I'm going for the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition  - which, with it's supposedly strong cables look like something more durable and looks very affordable..
> 
> ...


 
http://lendmeurears.com/product_info.php?currency=USD&cPath=13&products_id=143 is an authorized seller of Vsonic. That's the real bass version, so you don't have to worry.
   
  edit: Also, I saw that in another thread you were worrying about the plug - it comes with J-plug unless Vsonic changed the plug in the last batches.


----------



## incinerate

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> http://lendmeurears.com/product_info.php?currency=USD&cPath=13&products_id=143 is an authorized seller of Vsonic. That's the real bass version, so you don't have to worry.
> 
> edit: Also, I saw that in another thread you were worrying about the plug - it comes with J-plug unless Vsonic changed the plug in the last batches.


 
  Thanks for the quick reply.
 Yeah, it seems there have been some revision of the model in June from J to L-plug. Well well, a J-plug would certainly have been much better.


----------



## Amitl

thanks Suman and Joker...again 
  youre so helpful, im full of gratitude...
  so ill go for the Meelec CW31 according to your advice
  hopefully ill get used to the lack of bass from my Sparks 
  but i guess its sometimes better too, right?
  btw i see id America has new phones out, also seems
  to go for shallow fit 
  the id America Metropolitan
  hope to hear some comments from you guys


----------



## CalculusFTW

MP4Nation currently has a sale on the Brainwavz B2 for $130 with free FedEx shipping and a free Fiio E6(I own a L9 and E5) until October 5th so I need help soon.  I currently own a V-Moda M-80 and I love the sound very much, but would like to have a pair of iems that compliment my M-80s well, something more portable.  I have auditioned the ATH M50s and found the mids too recessed and I owned a pair of Klipsch Image S4s which I found the treble to be too harsh, edgy and sibilant.  Would the Brainwavz B2 be a good match for me?  I would like something that would have sound quality on par with the M-80s.
   
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





amitl said:


> thanks Suman and Joker...again
> youre so helpful, im full of gratitude...
> so ill go for the Meelec CW31 according to your advice
> hopefully ill get used to the lack of bass from my Sparks
> ...


 
   
         id america has got some awesome names .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





incinerate said:


> Thanks Joker for your reviews. You look competent and I appreciate it a lot.
> 
> I've had a lot of problems and I'm sick of my former IEM's; Fischer, NuForce(poor), Epson and Etymotic because of their build quality in the sense that they all get glitches in the cables around the plugs or the housing. So I think I'm going for the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition  - which, with it's supposedly strong cables look like something more durable and looks very affordable..
> 
> ...


 
   
  Epson makes IEMs?
   
  Anyway, if you're seeing multiple failures at the cable/plug it may be something in the way you are using them rather than poor construction. The GR02 is built very well for what it costs but it's not indestructible. The Philips SHO2200 is indestructible, though, and doesn't sound bad. Or you could pick up a few pairs of the Philips SHE3580 and swap them when they go bad. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> thanks Suman and Joker...again
> youre so helpful, im full of gratitude...
> so ill go for the Meelec CW31 according to your advice
> hopefully ill get used to the lack of bass from my Sparks
> ...


 
   
  No idea why I'm attracted to the Metropolitan, I've certainly got enough cheap earphones. Must be the design. 
   
  Quote: 





calculusftw said:


> MP4Nation currently has a sale on the Brainwavz B2 for $130 with free FedEx shipping and a free Fiio E6(I own a L9 and E5) until October 5th so I need help soon.  I currently own a V-Moda M-80 and I love the sound very much, but would like to have a pair of iems that compliment my M-80s well, something more portable.  I have auditioned the ATH M50s and found the mids too recessed and I owned a pair of Klipsch Image S4s which I found the treble to be too harsh, edgy and sibilant.  Would the Brainwavz B2 be a good match for me?  I would like something that would have sound quality on par with the M-80s.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
   
  The B2 sounds very different from the M-80 - not as warm, smooth, and bassy but brighter and thinner. The mids are not recessed and it certainly isn't harsh and grating like an S4 but I'm still not sure if it's the right match for you. It won't offend but it may leave you wanting for the fuller sound of the V-Modas. Someone else asked the same question here a while ago and picked up the Yamaha EPH-100 on my recommendation for an M-80 match but I don't think that posted ever came back to share his impressions.


----------



## psygeist

joker, will you do review of CIEMs from UE, Heir Audio, Hidition and Frogbeats. Also, Merlins.
   
  I see that my taste in sound signature aligns much with yours.
   
  Never knew EITS was one of you all time fav band. Try Caspian, Balmorhea, *shels, GY!BE and Mono (of japan).


----------



## incinerate

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Epson makes IEMs?
> 
> Anyway, if you're seeing multiple failures at the cable/plug it may be something in the way you are using them rather than poor construction. The GR02 is built very well for what it costs but it's not indestructible. The Philips SHO2200 is indestructible, though, and doesn't sound bad. Or you could pick up a few pairs of the Philips SHE3580 and swap them when they go bad.


 
  Wow, this reply-system is bugging.

 I meant Creative (EP-630)

 And now I want a pair that really last. I think I'll go with the GR02, they seem to have a proper build. I used and hopefully applied the IEM Maintenance that I think you posted in the beginning of this Review-thread, but all my IEM's tend to wear out and get glitchy after a while. And in the end, how good of a sound is produced by earphones that do not sound at all?
 In fact, I just now remembered that I've duct-taped my current IEM's around the housing and the plug so that it doesn't become glitchy (and it still does more and more frequently) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I tend however to always come back to your reviews when looking for a new pair.

 Again, thanks.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Joker, what in-ears would you recommend for ~$350 or less budget? I'm thinking of getting the Sennheiser IE80 (tweaked IE80; tape mod enhances sound; $300).
   
  Here's a little background on what I'm looking for-
   
 -I use ear-tips, shirt clips, case, and possibly silicon adapters as far as accessories goes. What determines it for me is how well they work with the in-ears and if all of them are included
 -I take good care of my headphones, but I will use them VERY often. Like, every single day for a long time.
 -Don't need too much isolation; average is fine
 -Need good cable microphonics, almost non-existent cable noise
 -I will wear them for long periods of time (200+ songs at times) and want to feel as if it is not there anymore or cushion for my ears
 -I enjoy listening to classical music, techno and electronic (videogames/movies/YouTube), rap, hip-hop, and pop.
 -I use them for viewing media, playing games, and calling (Skype, phone, etc.)
 -No fakes
 -Use Sansa Clip+
 -Optional but preferred: detachable cable
  
 Preferred sound signature-
 I like euphonic, juicy and lush and sturdy music. I value accuracy, clarity, and pay attention to low sounds. I would like my sound to be balanced, gripped, and brilliant. Punchy bass and treble is important.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





psygeist said:


> joker, will you do review of CIEMs from UE, Heir Audio, Hidition and Frogbeats. Also, Merlins.
> 
> I see that my taste in sound signature aligns much with yours.
> 
> Never knew EITS was one of you all time fav band. Try Caspian, Balmorhea, *shels, GY!BE and Mono (of japan).


 
   
  What, all of them? or just the flagships? In either case that's at least $5k worth of IEMs. I'd need to sell a kidney.
   
   
  And thanks! I have a few dozen post-rock/metal albums in my collection. Already have F#A#∞ and Sea of the Dying Dhow and a few tracks by Mono. Haven't been able to get into Balmorhea but I like Caspian - got a recommendation for the one must-have album?
   
  I have a number of albums from the more popular post-rock bands (65daysofstatic, ASIWYFA, Collapse Under the Empire, God Is An Astronaut, If These Trees Could Talk, etc). A year or so ago I decided to seek out more post-rock/metal from around the world. Here's a couple of lesser-known bands I like: 
   
  Chez Viking: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eByXo35vrKw
  48V: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUiuOBt__UY 
  Baulta: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Yyv6H6O9-0
  City of the Lost: http://cityofthelost.bandcamp.com/album/birds-of-tartary
  See You in the Morning: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kW2ukanwt0
   
   
  Quote: 





incinerate said:


> Wow, this reply-system is bugging.
> 
> I meant Creative (EP-630)
> 
> ...


 
   
  The GR02 should work, then. I tend to be pretty careful with cables so the only IEMs I've had die on me due to cable issues have been Skullcandies, Monster Jamz and Lil' Jamz, and Sunrise stuff. 
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Joker, what in-ears would you recommend for ~$350 or less budget? I'm thinking of getting the Sennheiser IE80 (tweaked IE80; tape mod enhances sound; $300).
> 
> Here's a little background on what I'm looking for-
> 
> ...


 
   
  If the IE80 is anything like the IE8 you'll get a lot of bass but it still won't beat the GR07 in accuracy or clarity so you'll mostly be paying the extra $150 for the name and, well, bass.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If the IE80 is anything like the IE8 you'll get a lot of bass but it still won't beat the GR07 in accuracy or clarity so you'll mostly be paying the extra $150 for the name and, well, bass.


 
  I forgot to mention that the bass is reduced with the tape mod as well.  and from what I've heard, the tape mod can beat the GR07 out in almost all areas.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I forgot to mention that the bass is reduced with the tape mod as well.  and from what I've heard, the tape mod can beat the GR07 out in almost all areas.


 
   
  Unless a piece of tape transforms the IE80 into a totally different iem, the only way that the IE8(0) bests the GR07 is in soundstage depth. Everything else just sound better done on the GR07, at least to my ears.


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'd need to sell a kidney.


 
   
  That's why we have two!


----------



## ljokerl

Added Rock-It Sounds R-20 and R-30. 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A72) Rock-It Sounds R-20*
> 
> Added Sep 2012
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C52) Rock-It Sounds R-30*
> 
> 
> Added Sep 2012
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I forgot to mention that the bass is reduced with the tape mod as well.  and from what I've heard, the tape mod can beat the GR07 out in almost all areas.


 
   
  I can't comment on a mod I've never performed done to an earphone I haven't heard.


----------



## phantompersona

Great review Joker! these rock it sounds do sound swell for their price range. I can't wait to read your review on the higher end rock it's. As always thanks for taking the time to post these reviews, your the best!


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What, all of them? or just the flagships? In either case that's at least $5k worth of IEMs. I'd need to sell a kidney.


 
       Flagships. Probably CIEM manufacturers can send you review samples.
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> And thanks! I have a few dozen post-rock/metal albums in my collection. Already have F#A#∞ and Sea of the Dying Dhow and a few tracks by Mono. Haven't been able to get into Balmorhea but I like Caspian - got a recommendation for the one must-have album?


 
   'Plains of the purple buffalo' is another good one from *shels. One of my fav from Mono and Word's End Girlfriend is 'Palmless prayer-mass murder refrain'.
   
  Caspian - Tertia (pretty different from their earlier work). Give a try to this too http://caspiantheband.bandcamp.com/album/you-are-the-conductor-the-four-trees-remastered .
   
  They released a more experimental album on 25th sep, 2012. Haven't listened to that yet.
  
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I have a number of albums from the more popular post-rock bands (65daysofstatic, ASIWYFA, Collapse Under the Empire, God Is An Astronaut, If These Trees Could Talk, etc).


 
       I have heard those and couple more, Red Sparrows, Russian Circles, I Hear Sirens, Mogwai, The Evpatoria Report, The Pirate Ship Quintent, The Seven Mile Journey, This Will Destroy You, Up-C Down-C Left-C Right-C ABC + Start, Yndi Halda etc.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Chez Viking: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eByXo35vrKw
> 48V: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUiuOBt__UY
> Baulta: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Yyv6H6O9-0
> City of the Lost: http://cityofthelost.bandcamp.com/album/birds-of-tartary
> See You in the Morning: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kW2ukanwt0


 
   
      Woah ! Those are some obscure band names I haven't heard. Listened to The Mercury Program (another one is The Calm Blue Sea). Checking them out. Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Great review Joker! these rock it sounds do sound swell for their price range. I can't wait to read your review on the higher end rock it's. As always thanks for taking the time to post these reviews, your the best!


 
   
   
  The prices are pretty amazing - the R-20 is cheaper than any other SR-based earphone I'm aware of and the R-30 is pretty much a Westone 1 at half the price.
   
   
  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> Flagships. Probably CIEM manufacturers can send you review samples.


 
   
   
  Very time-consuming to get samples but I'll see if I can arrange something with UE through InnerFidelity.
   
   
  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> I have heard those and couple more, Red Sparrows, Russian Circles, I Hear Sirens, Mogwai, The Evpatoria Report, The Pirate Ship Quintent, The Seven Mile Journey, This Will Destroy You, Up-C Down-C Left-C Right-C ABC + Start, Yndi Halda etc.


 
   
  Have an album by Mogwai and two each by Russian Circles (though I didn't like their latest) and This Will Destroy You. Will check out the rest, thanks.


----------



## Kjeldsen

Wow, this has got to be the holy grail of IEM threads on the entire interwebz.
   
  Seriously impressed!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kjeldsen said:


> Wow, this has got to be the holy grail of IEM threads on the entire interwebz.
> 
> Seriously impressed!


 
   
  Thanks


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The prices are pretty amazing - the R-20 is cheaper than any other SR-based earphone I'm aware of and the R-30 is pretty much a Westone 1 at half the price.


 
   
  well, the AM90 is at same price as the 20. 
   
  so, the 30 are great vocalist like the W1 ??


----------



## psygeist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Very time-consuming to get samples but I'll see if I can arrange something with UE through InnerFidelity.


 
  That will be nice. I'd love to see the comparison with UERM.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> well, the AM90 is at same price as the 20.
> 
> so, the 30 are great vocalist like the W1 ??


 
   
  AM-90 price must have dropped. They were around $45 when I reviewed them. I actually like the design of the AM-90 a little better just because they can be worn cord-up or cord-down but either one is a great value. 
   
  The R-30 is good with vocals - mid-forward and clear but also smooth and a touch warm. 
   
   
  Quote: 





psygeist said:


> That will be nice. I'd love to see the comparison with UERM.


 
   
  Me too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. To be honest I am curious about the Atrio MG6 Pro as well especially as I am not really a fan of FutureSonics universals.


----------



## selferinoz

I know this is just a IEM review thread, but i just had to ask....
 Im currently contemplating to get either Alessandro MS1i or VSONIC GR07 mkII, or maybe even save some money to get Superlux hd668b. I have audition 3 of these and i liked all 3 of them but im currently confuse which to picked. Asuming i can inly get one of these headphone/IEM to buy, which is the best on Sound Quality score alone?


----------



## Emospence

I recently let go of my GR07 MK2, looking for something smoother and less bright.. Have my eye on EPH-100 but sold out at most shops that carry it here =.=
   
  Any others that I may wanna try?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> AM-90 price must have dropped. They were around $45 when I reviewed them. I actually like the design of the AM-90 a little better just because they can be worn cord-up or cord-down but either one is a great value.
> 
> The R-30 is good with vocals - mid-forward and clear but also smooth and a touch warm.


 
  actually i  was wondering if they excel in female vocals too like the W1 did


----------



## Daffiestlime

Which one do you prefer, the Hippo VB or the Future Sonics Atrio MG7?
 The MG7 obvously looks horrible, but does it sound better? Seems I can get them for roughly the same price.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





emospence said:


> I recently let go of my GR07 MK2, looking for something smoother and less bright.. Have my eye on EPH-100 but sold out at most shops that carry it here =.=
> 
> Any others that I may wanna try?


 
   
       you may like the ue 700 or ue 600 for their dark signature , ha-fxt90 will be close with lesser treble and i would put these over eph-100 . fxt is warm sounding .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selferinoz said:


> I know this is just a IEM review thread, but i just had to ask....
> Im currently contemplating to get either Alessandro MS1i or VSONIC GR07 mkII, or maybe even save some money to get Superlux hd668b. I have audition 3 of these and i liked all 3 of them but im currently confuse which to picked. Asuming i can inly get one of these headphone/IEM to buy, which is the best on Sound Quality score alone?


 
   
  I would say the GR07 is the best of those by a margin. I've only heard the mkI but it shouldn't be too different. 
   
  Quote: 





emospence said:


> I recently let go of my GR07 MK2, looking for something smoother and less bright.. Have my eye on EPH-100 but sold out at most shops that carry it here =.=
> 
> Any others that I may wanna try?


 
   
  The EPH-100 fits the bill very well. Don't know what your budget is but the Monster Turbine Pros/Miles Davis Tributes come to mind as well as the Radius TWF-11R. I'd still rather have an EPH-100 though. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> actually i  was wondering if they excel in female vocals too like the W1 did


 
   
  The R-30 is a little more energetic and less forgiving of sibilance but otherwise it's just as good. 
   
  Quote: 





daffiestlime said:


> Which one do you prefer, the Hippo VB or the Future Sonics Atrio MG7?
> The MG7 obvously looks horrible, but does it sound better? Seems I can get them for roughly the same price.


 
   
  At the same price I'd take the MG7 any day unless I was worried about treble extension which the VB does a little better.


----------



## heart banger-97

hi ljokerl! can you give me a quick comparison between Soundmagic E10 and philips she3580?
  which one is more suitable for rock?
  which one has less bass quantity and more mid?
   
  thanks


----------



## atomikn00b

I'm curious to hear what your thoughts are when comparing the JVC-HAFXT90, Yamaha EPH-100, Sony MDR-EX600, Vsonic Gr07 mk2, and for fun I'll toss in the Sony XB90EX and Brainwavz M5.
  
 If you have heard any of the above, I'd like your input. They are on my short list of iems to purchase for my upcoming birthday. If you haven't guessed, the kind of sound I am looking for is excellent subbass and bass presence with non-recessed mids. (For bass, subbbass >= midbass is my taste)
  
 If any of the above happen to have fantastic treble in addition, then that makes them a more likely purchase. Factors I am also considering include detail and soundstage.
 Recommendations are also welcome.
  
 Thanks in advance.
  
 And if you happen to know a mic'd iem with the sound of the one you recommend out of those, I'd like to know as well.


----------



## Emospence

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The EPH-100 fits the bill very well. Don't know what your budget is but the Monster Turbine Pros/Miles Davis Tributes come to mind as well as the Radius TWF-11R. I'd still rather have an EPH-100 though.


 
  That's what I got. Bit heavy on the bass but otherwise pretty much what I was looking for. Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl! can you give me a quick comparison between Soundmagic E10 and philips she3580?
> which one is more suitable for rock?
> which one has less bass quantity and more mid?
> 
> thanks


 
   
   
  Sure, just took a quick listen to the Doolittle by the Pixies with both and I think it's a very close call depending on what you want. The E10 has less recessed mids and a more spacious presentation but the bass of the Philips is tighter and extends deeper and overall clarity is slightly better. Bass impact is pretty similar, the E10 is just softer-sounding while the SHE3580 is tighter. 
   
   
  Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> I'm curious to hear what your thoughts are when comparing the JVC-HAFXT90, Yamaha EPH-100, Sony MDR-EX600, Vsonic Gr07 mk2, and for fun I'll toss in the Sony XB90EX and Brainwavz M5.
> 
> If you have heard any of the above, I'd like your input. They are on my short list of iems to purchase for my upcoming birthday. If you haven't guessed, the kind of sound I am looking for is excellent subbass and bass presence with non-recessed mids. (For bass, subbbass >= midbass is my taste)
> 
> ...


 
   
  I haven't heard the XB90EX and the M5 isn't really on-par with those other ones. I haven't heard the VSonic GR07 mkII, either. There are extensive comparisons to the GR07 mkI in the FXT90, EPH-100, and EX600 reviews on the front page of this thread. The GR07 is pretty balanced with good bass extension. Not as bass-heavy as the FXT90 or EPH-100 so if you're looking for enhanced bass go for one of those. Neither has recessed mids.
   
  Mic'd IEMs - there's not a whole lot of them in the upper tiers and you usually end up paying more for the same level of performance - see the Monster Miles Davis Trumpet, for example.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





> Sure, just took a quick listen to the Doolittle by the Pixies with both and I think it's a very close call depending on what you want. The E10 has less recessed mids and a more spacious presentation but the bass of the Philips is tighter and extends deeper and overall clarity is slightly better. Bass impact is pretty similar, the E10 is just softer-sounding while the SHE3580 is tighter.


 
  That is one of my favorite records. I saw them last year and they played the entire records, it was amazing. So, I'm going to meander if you don't mind. What set-up that you've heard make the Pixies sound the best (full-size or IEM)?


----------



## Techno Kid

Hey Joker I don't know if someone has asked this but I'm just wondering when the R-50 review might be posted?  I'm really looking forward to what you have to say about them and if they score what I think they will.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> That is one of my favorite records. I saw them last year and they played the entire records, it was amazing. So, I'm going to meander if you don't mind. What set-up that you've heard make the Pixies sound the best (full-size or IEM)?


 
   
  Yes, used it for this test because it's one of my essential rock albums and I've wanted an excuse to listen to it for a while. 
   
  Would it be considered cheating if I said "UM Miracle"? If we discard customs, I would pick something with a transparent, raw type of sound and level bass. A GR07 or Sony EX1000, for example, or something flat and armature-based, such as an Ety or Ficher DBA-02. My signature preferences don't really change much with music genre but especially in this case I think an overly warm, smooth sound would ruin the magic of the record for me. 
   
  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Hey Joker I don't know if someone has asked this but I'm just wondering when the R-50 review might be posted?  I'm really looking forward to what you have to say about them and if they score what I think they will.


 
   
  It's in the queue but pretty far down because I had to get my unit exchanged. They are very good and a great value at $120, I'll say that much.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Agree entirely, I pretty much came to love the Grado sound on the Pixies and Sonic Youth (among many others, but those are up there).


----------



## Doc-holliday

Subscribed


----------



## Bola 7

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It would be pretty close between the DBA/CK10, EX1000, and PFE 232 - they are all very crisp-sounding. Tempted to say DBA-02 mkII but you'd have to A:B between them listening specifically for that. The SM3 would have the most smoothed-over response for sure.


 
   
   
  Excuse me, Joker. Forsooth, I wanted to tell resolution, not definition. Thus, which IEM have best resolution: SM3, EX1000, W4, PFE 232, CK10 or DBA-02 MKII?
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Excuse me, Joker. Forsooth, I wanted to tell resolution, not definition. Thus, which IEM have best resolution: SM3, EX1000, W4, PFE 232, CK10 or DBA-02 MKII?
> 
> Thanks again!


 
   
  You'd have a harder time figuring that out between a bunch of top-tier IEMs and picking one based on that criterion. FWIR all of these are very, very resolving - they just differ in how they present the musical nuances.


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sure, just took a quick listen to the Doolittle by the Pixies with both and I think it's a very close call depending on what you want. The E10 has less recessed mids and a more spacious presentation but the bass of the Philips is tighter and extends deeper and overall clarity is slightly better. Bass impact is pretty similar, the E10 is just softer-sounding while the SHE3580 is tighter.


 
   
  thanks allot , recently I see E30 in my country too. so what's about that? can you give me a comparison between E30 and E10 or SHE3580.
   
  here is my first post:
   
  Quote: 





> hi ljokerl! can you give me a quick comparison between Soundmagic E10 and philips she3580?
> which one is more suitable for rock?
> which one has less bass quantity and more mid?
> 
> thanks


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> thanks allot , recently I see E30 in my country too. so what's about that? can you give me a comparison between E30 and E10 or SHE3580.
> 
> here is my first post:


 
   
         if you are not bothered about treble spark , go for e30 , has lesser bass and more mids . but will go over ear . she3580 has excessive microphonics and gets annoying . if you wanna go cheap she3580 will do good .


----------



## sphinxvc

Got a UM3X.  My ears are still in line with Joker's, as I find the review on them similar to what I hear.
   
  One weird thing I have noticed is: how terrible the UM3X is off the Zodiac.  Off my iPhone 4S, they're great.  On the Zodiac, I can't take more than a few minutes.  It's impressive that they're wideband enough to actually change between the two, but it's also annoying.  The Zodiac shows the midrange to be especially overwhelming.  My theory is that the Zodiac does a better job resolving spatial cues and places the vocalist front and center depth-wise.  Most recordings are this way, and it comes off correct on speakers or headphones that can do depth, ie. HD800, HE-6, etc.  But on the UM3X, the presentation area is relatively small, and so all this depth and spatial information is truncated to nothing but a massive midrange bump.
   
  Anyway, as far as comfort goes, sound, etc, this is one purchase that I don't regret.  It took a LOT of tip rolling to find tips that didn't make things too warm, liquidey, gooey, and treble recessed, but it was well worth it in the end.


----------



## jarrett

R-50 will be next? Can't wait to read about them


----------



## Tirus

I don't know any audio terminology so bare with me. I've been using Bose IE2 headphones for about a year now but I'm not really satisfied with them. Vocals and instruments seem to get drowned out during band jams and choruses. What sort of headphones under $300 should I be looking at to fix this? I'm leaning toward GR07 headphones since those have a lot of good reviews.
   
  Also, years ago I used to have some cheap Sony MDR-A35G headphones that made vocals sound like they were being sung live directly into my ear compared to sort of a distant tinny sound most other headphones have. I don't know if that was due to isolation or what but it was amazing and I'd like to have that back.


----------



## walkman_heart

joker thanks for your advice, i've already auditioned akg3003 coming from tf10(with white angel cables) and fx500 it really blown me away
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  my impressions of akg3003 using walkman z1000 with stock player are:
   

 price is too steep for price and performance ratio
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


 everything is clear and clean it's like a mixture of fx500 and tf10(with white angel cables)
 very good highs and well extended, clear mids, very good bass in quality and quantity, good timbre and almost same soundstage as fx500
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


   
  still might go to miracle ciem which i think have better price and performance ratio (but not yet auditioned) while still saving up for it,
   
  i'm planning to buy orthofon eq-5, do you think is it step-up coming from tf10(with white angel cables) and fx500?
   
  just can't tolerate metallic tinge of tf10 and recessed mids of fx500 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  your recommendation is highly appreciated
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  thank you sooo much,


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> thanks allot , recently I see E30 in my country too. so what's about that? can you give me a comparison between E30 and E10 or SHE3580.
> 
> here is my first post:


 
   
  The E30 is quite similar to the E10, just less v-shaped with more balanced between midrange and bass, and less treble sparkle. I don't know if I would pick it over the SHE3580 either.
   
  Regarding microphonics, the SHE3580 is pretty bad unless worn over-the-ear. You could even get some of those silicone cable guides to help keep the cable in place. 
   
  Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Got a UM3X.  My ears are still in line with Joker's, as I find the review on them similar to what I hear.
> 
> One weird thing I have noticed is: how terrible the UM3X is off the Zodiac.  Off my iPhone 4S, they're great.  On the Zodiac, I can't take more than a few minutes.  It's impressive that they're wideband enough to actually change between the two, but it's also annoying.  The Zodiac shows the midrange to be especially overwhelming.  My theory is that the Zodiac does a better job resolving spatial cues and places the vocalist front and center depth-wise.  Most recordings are this way, and it comes off correct on speakers or headphones that can do depth, ie. HD800, HE-6, etc.  But on the UM3X, the presentation area is relatively small, and so all this depth and spatial information is truncated to nothing but a massive midrange bump.
> 
> Anyway, as far as comfort goes, sound, etc, this is one purchase that I don't regret.  It took a LOT of tip rolling to find tips that didn't make things too warm, liquidey, gooey, and treble recessed, but it was well worth it in the end.


 
   
  What's the output impedance of the Zodiac? You really don't want a high output impedance for a BA monitor such as the UM3X. 
   
  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> R-50 will be next? Can't wait to read about them


 
   
  Definitely not next, there's a number of things ahead of them in queue including some heavy hitters.
   
  Quote: 





tirus said:


> I don't know any audio terminology so bare with me. I've been using Bose IE2 headphones for about a year now but I'm not really satisfied with them. Vocals and instruments seem to get drowned out during band jams and choruses. What sort of headphones under $300 should I be looking at to fix this? I'm leaning toward GR07 headphones since those have a lot of good reviews.
> 
> Also, years ago I used to have some cheap Sony MDR-A35G headphones that made vocals sound like they were being sung live directly into my ear compared to sort of a distant tinny sound most other headphones have. I don't know if that was due to isolation or what but it was amazing and I'd like to have that back.


 
   
  The GR07 is nicely balanced and resolving but it's not a forward-sounding earphone. An old Sony and a Bose in-ear may not be good enough data points for determining the type of sound you like - an earphone doesn't have to be forward-sounding in order to give you great vocal clarity and intelligibility but chances are neither the Bose nor the Sony can showcase that. If you do want your vocals forward and intimate you may want to go for a JVC FXT90 over the GR07, or one of the higher-end BA monitors such as the Final Audio FI-BA-SA.
   
  Quote: 





walkman_heart said:


> joker thanks for your advice, i've already auditioned akg3003 coming from tf10(with white angel cables) and fx500 it really blown me away
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I only have a stock TF10. The e-Q5 is a more balanced than that and than the FX500 as well. Definitely no recessed mids there. It's actually still one of the most 'pleasant' earphones I've heard, maybe not the best at anything but so refined and relaxed that wanted to listen to it instead of reviewing it.


----------



## AstralStorm

If AKG K3003 is too expensive for you and you can live with the treble filters, Fischer Audio DBA-02 or Brainwavz B2 are quite comparable.
  If you cannot, then perhaps VSonic GR01.


----------



## walkman_heart

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I only have a stock TF10. The e-Q5 is a more balanced than that and than the FX500 as well. Definitely no recessed mids there. It's actually still one of the most 'pleasant' earphones I've heard, maybe not the best at anything but so refined and relaxed that wanted to listen to it instead of reviewing it.


 
   
  Hi joker,
   
  Thanks for your quick response
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I have another question about it
   
  does the e-Q5 have similar sound signature of brainwavz m1? because I've already sell my brainwavz m1 which does not fit my preference..
   
  My preference is similar to tf10 or U shape sound signature, mostly I listen to rock, rnb, pop, acoustic and hip hop
   
  My max budget for the new iem will be 200usd
   
  I'm just worried about e-Q5's treble it might not suit me, because I like sparkly and extended highs
  May be dba02 mk-II might suit me
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  but I wonder the bass of it, is it similar to tf10 and without metallic timbre? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  if yes I might go for it
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  if you have any other suggested iem, I will be gladly to consider it
   
  Thank you very much for enlightening me for my next purchase


----------



## AstralStorm

Brainwavz B2 and Fischer Audio DBA-02 (mkI; mkII probably as well, as they measure very much the same) doesn't have metallic timbre to my ears - only high amounts of 4-6k brightness if used with foams.
  Interestingly enough, this brightness is reduced noticeably (to near zero?) with silicone tips.
  (e.g. included single flanges or even better, VSonic single flanges)
   
  9/10 in my scale - pity they don't have any better subbass handling. The signature with silicones is relatively flat to my ears with minor dip in the center midrange (pushing female vocals back) and very minor aggressive boost at 5-6 kHz.
  No metallic 2-3 kHz boost, no metallic "bell-like" 4k resonance.


----------



## sphinxvc

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What's the output impedance of the Zodiac? You really don't want a high output impedance for a BA monitor such as the UM3X.


 
   
  Mismatch sounds like a much more plausible theory than mine.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Looked it up and there are conflicting reports online, some say 120 ohm, some say 5 ohm.


----------



## walkman_heart

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Brainwavz B2 and Fischer Audio DBA-02 (mkI; mkII probably as well, as they measure very much the same) doesn't have metallic timbre to my ears - only high amounts of 4-6k brightness if used with foams.
> Interestingly enough, this brightness is reduced noticeably (to near zero?) with silicone tips.
> (e.g. included single flanges or even better, VSonic single flanges)
> 
> ...


 
   
  AstralStorm, wow, that's a good news, no metallic timbre makes me jump and grab those dba-02 mkII right away
   
  usually I use silicone tips in my iems, foam tips is very expensive for me
   
  now the search begins and if possible I will audition this in our local store first
   
  thanks a lot for your advice


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





walkman_heart said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> Thanks for your quick response
> 
> ...


 
   
  No, the M1 is thicker and more mid-centric. The e-Q5 is more balanced and clean-sounding. However, it's really not v- or u-shaped. Neither is the DBA-02 mkII, but it does have more treble energy than the e-Q5. Leaner bass, though.  And both have less bass than the TF10. Even the UE900 has less bass than the TF10, and that's UE's own follow-up.
   
  Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> Mismatch sounds like a much more plausible theory than mine.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  That's a pretty wide gap


----------



## sphinxvc

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's a pretty wide gap


 
   
  I know, it's harder than it should be to find detailed information on Antelope products.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sphinxvc said:


> I know, it's harder than it should be to find detailed information on Antelope products.


 
   
  Indeed. Tech specs really shouldn't be a matter of opinion.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> If AKG K3003 is too expensive for you and you can live with the treble filters, Fischer Audio DBA-02 or Brainwavz B2 are quite comparable.
> If you cannot, then perhaps VSonic GR01.


 

 Sorry to ask, but what do you mean by "treble filters"?


----------



## ljokerl

A full review of the MEElec A161P and Fischer SBA-03, with measurements, has been posted at InnerFidelity here. I'll be adding the MEElec A161P to the chart as a separate entry in the near future. The cable, plug, and accessory pack are different from the Fischer version. Everything else is pretty much the same. 
   
   
  Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Sorry to ask, but what do you mean by "treble filters"?


 
   
  The K3003 comes with 3 sets of tuning filters that affect the sound - bass boost, treble boost, and reference. There's some info on them in the beginning of my write-up as well.


----------



## PMAP

256. Nice round number for us IT people.
   
  Are you testing the Rock-It R50 already? Would they reach at least 8.5 on your rating scale?


----------



## heart banger-97

hi ljokerl! I want to recommend some U (or even V)shaped headphone to one of my friend that listen to pop and  rock & metal songs
  I want to recommend him tf10 and w3 or even ie8 (I heard w4r and ex1000 and ie8)
   
  when I listen to metal songs with ex1000 I hear a lot of harshness in treble (in ie8 case the treble was good without any harshness) so  are w3 or tf10 safe choices?
  can you suggest me some U (or even V)shaped headphone which have not a hot treble like ex1000? (I think that something  like ie8 whit less bass quantity and tighter bass will be suitable.)
   
  thanks


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> A full review of the MEElec A161P and Fischer SBA-03, with measurements, has been posted at InnerFidelity here. I'll be adding the MEElec A161P to the chart as a separate entry in the near future. The cable, plug, and accessory pack are different from the Fischer version. Everything else is pretty much the same.
> 
> 
> 
> The K3003 comes with 3 sets of tuning filters that affect the sound - bass boost, treble boost, and reference. There's some info on them in the beginning of my write-up as well.


 

  Thanks for the answer joker, I didn't understand he was refering to the K3003


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pmap said:


> 256. Nice round number for us IT people.
> 
> Are you testing the Rock-It R50 already? Would they reach at least 8.5 on your rating scale?


 
   
  Yes and yes
   
  Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl! I want to recommend some U (or even V)shaped headphone to one of my friend that listen to pop and  rock & metal songs
> I want to recommend him tf10 and w3 or even ie8 (I heard w4r and ex1000 and ie8)
> 
> when I listen to metal songs with ex1000 I hear a lot of harshness in treble (in ie8 case the treble was good without any harshness) so  are w3 or tf10 safe choices?
> ...


 
   
  The TF10 has less treble energy than the EX1000 in my experience but it's by no means laid-back. The W3 is highly tip depend and can sound somewhat harsh. I would consider the Yamaha EPH-100 or Monster Miles Davis Trumpet as alternatives. The Trumpet is more v-shaped but not harsh or bright while the EPH-100 is a bit more laid-back up top and has a heavier midrange emphasis.


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes and yes
> 
> 
> The TF10 has less treble energy than the EX1000 in my experience but it's by no means laid-back. The W3 is highly tip depend and can sound somewhat harsh. I would consider the Yamaha EPH-100 or Monster Miles Davis Trumpet as alternatives. The Trumpet is more v-shaped but not harsh or bright while the EPH-100 is a bit more laid-back up top and has a heavier midrange emphasis.


 
   
  thanks, my friend think that the bass quantity of klipsch s4 is too much (boomy) for him. do you think that eph-100 has less bass quantity? (as you said in your review, eph-100 has less bass quantity than Monster Miles Davis Trumpet)


----------



## fauaad

Hey, Joker, I'm looking for some in ears in the $100 range. So far, I've listed down the following:

 JVC HA-FXD80
 VSonic Gr06
 Rock-It Sounds R-30
 HiSoundAudio Crystal
 Shure SE215
 Meelec A151
   
  Can you tell me which one of these to go for? I'll be using them for basically everything. Isolation isn't much of a priority. And I would prefer something on the bassier side.


----------



## basslova

This thread and this forum is quite addictive.

 I am looking for a cheap ($25 and under) headphones with tons of sub-bass and decent clarity. I ordered the FX1X and I find them too bloated (interesting that we share the same opinion, Joker).

 My choices are:

 JVC FX101
 Philips SHE3580
 anything else?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> thanks, my friend think that the bass quantity of klipsch s4 is too much (boomy) for him. do you think that eph-100 has less bass quantity? (as you said in your review, eph-100 has less bass quantity than Monster Miles Davis Trumpet)


 
   
  The EPH-100 is not exactly bass-light but when it comes to quality there's no comparing it to the Klipsch S4. 
   
   
  Quote: 





fauaad said:


> Hey, Joker, I'm looking for some in ears in the $100 range. So far, I've listed down the following:
> 
> JVC HA-FXD80
> VSonic Gr06
> ...


 
   
  Those are kind of all over the place. If you like your bass I'd go for the SE215/HiSound Crystal (if you prefer warmer tonality) or the FXD80 (if you prefer a cooler/brighter presentation). 
   
  Quote: 





basslova said:


> This thread and this forum is quite addictive.
> 
> I am looking for a cheap ($25 and under) headphones with tons of sub-bass and decent clarity. I ordered the FX1X and I find them too bloated (interesting that we share the same opinion, Joker).
> 
> ...


 
   
  I would go for the SHE3580. It has very good bass depth but the low end is well-controlled. Not as bassy overall as the FX1X/FX101 but still not flat/neutral by any means. An alternative would be the VSonic GR99 (if you can find it in your price range) or the MEElec M9 (not as good as these others but easy to find and heavier on sub-bass than mid-bass).


----------



## basslova

Thank you for the response. It must take a lot of dedication and time to do these reviews and answer questions.

 I think I will go with the SHE3580. I am not enjoying the FX1X and I suspect the FX101 might be a similar experience for me. I also read about the GR99 and M9, but I won't be able to get those. Only brand names like JVC, Philips, Sony, Klipsch etc are available where I live.


----------



## ljokerl

Added HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2B18) HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2*
> 
> Added Oct 2012
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





basslova said:


> Thank you for the response. It must take a lot of dedication and time to do these reviews and answer questions.
> 
> I think I will go with the SHE3580. I am not enjoying the FX1X and I suspect the FX101 might be a similar experience for me. I also read about the GR99 and M9, but I won't be able to get those. Only brand names like JVC, Philips, Sony, Klipsch etc are available where I live.


 

 Sorry, should have said M9 is readily available in the US. If the SHE3580 is easier to find and you don't mind a decrease in overall bass quantity then by all means go for that.


----------



## Emospence

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The EPH-100 is not exactly bass-light but when it comes to quality there's no comparing it to the Klipsch S4.


 
  That almost sounds like S4 > EPH-100


----------



## fauaad

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Those are kind of all over the place. If you like your bass I'd go for the SE215/HiSound Crystal (if you prefer warmer tonality) or the FXD80 (if you prefer a cooler/brighter presentation).


 
   
   
  Well, yea, I basically just picked the top 6 sub 100 from your list. 

 What about the GR06 or Meelecs? Aren't they bassy too?
   
  PS: I don't really want something analytical. They're gonna be for a non-audiophile.


----------



## z28dreams

Any suggestions for an IEM that fits this criteria:
  1.  < $30
  2.  Has pretty good bass, but doesn't have to be massive
  3.  *Must have* a double/triple flange-type tip to fit my ear  (The Meelectronics M9 stock style for example)
  4.  Looking for something with warmer/stronger mids than the M9.  
  5.  Prefer trebles not to be super bright


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





fauaad said:


> Well, yea, I basically just picked the top 6 sub 100 from your list.
> 
> What about the GR06 or Meelecs? Aren't they bassy too?
> 
> PS: I don't really want something analytical. They're gonna be for a non-audiophile.


 
  you'd consider the M5 if you want bass
  Quote: 





z28dreams said:


> Any suggestions for an IEM that fits this criteria:
> 1.  < $30
> 2.  Has pretty good bass, but doesn't have to be massive
> 3.  *Must have* a flange-type tip to fit my ear  (The Meelectronics M9 stock style for example)
> ...


 
  SHE3680


----------



## z28dreams

Quote: 





zelda said:


> you'd consider the M5 if you want bass
> SHE3680


 
  From what I'm seeing the SHE3680's don't have the dual flange style tips.  They also don't seem hard to find online!


----------



## Zelda

i didnt know you meant dual-flanges, as u just said flange-type
  you can get them from ebay. i got mine for ~$16


----------



## fauaad

Quote: 





zelda said:


> you'd consider the M5 if you want bass


 
   
  I don't really want all out bass. I just want something balanced that is a tad bit focused on the lower end.


----------



## Zelda

they arent bass monsters. the Eterna were bassier. they have good clarity even being focused on the mid/up bass. but it´d also depend on how loud you use them
   
  that said, i agree the HSA crystal can match your needs. but i´d take the ATHCKM500 instead, if you dont mind the lower isolation than the Crystal. the ckm are much fuller sounding


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





fauaad said:


> I don't really want all out bass. I just want something balanced that is a tad bit focused on the lower end.


 

 you no the cc51 , xba-1 and ue600 .


----------



## atistatic

why dont have any iem what is 10/10 on value? they want mean all iem it is overpriced?:S


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





emospence said:


> That almost sounds like S4 > EPH-100


 
   
  Definitely not. EPH-100 >> S4
    
  Quote:


fauaad said:


> Well, yea, I basically just picked the top 6 sub 100 from your list.
> 
> What about the GR06 or Meelecs? Aren't they bassy too?
> 
> PS: I don't really want something analytical. They're gonna be for a non-audiophile.


 
   
  I just picked the ones that I thought had the best sound for a non-audiophile. Balanced aside from a bump in the bass -> HiSound Crystal and Shure SE215. Can't really go wrong with them given no other selection criteria.
   
   
  Quote: 





z28dreams said:


> Any suggestions for an IEM that fits this criteria:
> 1.  < $30
> 2.  Has pretty good bass, but doesn't have to be massive
> 3.  *Must have* a double/triple flange-type tip to fit my ear  (The Meelectronics M9 stock style for example)
> ...


 
   
  Not a whole lot of IEMs aside from MEElecs come with a large array of tips in that price range. Sound-wise the VSonic GR99 comes to mind. Doesn't come with bi-flange tips but M9 tips would fit it if you have them. Same story with Soundmagic E10 (typically <$35) and Philips SHE3580. 3580 does leave room in the budget for some aftermarket tips. You could also stretch for the VSonic R02 Pro II or GR02 Bass Edition which come with bi-flanges and run $35-40. 
   
  Quote: 





atistatic said:


> why dont have any iem what is 10/10 on value? they want mean all iem it is overpriced?:S


 
   
  There are a bunch with 10/10s - off the top of my head the old RE0 and RE-ZERO, the original Sunrise Xcape, some of the cheaper BA-based sets (Astrotec AM-90, Rock-It Sounds R-20 & R-30), a couple of VSonics (GR99, GR02 BE, GR06) have 10/10s. There are also dozens with 9/10 or 9.5/10, which are typically fantastic except for some minor flaw. You can search for a particular score by pressing ctrl+f on your keyboard and typing "Value (10" or "Value (9.5", etc.


----------



## atomikn00b

ok. here's my situation now.
  I have the re-262 and jvc fxt90.
  
  Overall I'm pleased with the fxt90 but it is harsh "up there". Does this go away with time?
  If it doesn't, what is an alternative with reduced harshness and perhaps even more *SUB*bass without changing the rest of the spectrum?
   
  for the re-262s, I LOOOVE the mids so much. I can also clearly hear the bass and even subbass. BUT. 
  Is there an iem that offers the same sound with even more SUBbass and slightly better treble? (An effect similar to boosting frequencies 30Hz and below by about 15db?)

 So in summary. My concern with the fxt90 is harshness and my concern with the re-262s is more subbass.
  Any remedies?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> ok. here's my situation now.
> I have the re-262 and jvc fxt90.
> 
> Overall I'm pleased with the fxt90 but it is harsh "up there". Does this go away with time?
> ...


 
   
  The short answer is no, not really. There's no IEM I've heard that does exactly what you want.
   
  The long answer is that depending on what you're willing to sacrifice there may be something that will fit your preferences a bit better.
   
  The JVC FX700, for example, has better sub-bass reach than the FXT90 and was a little less 'hot' in the treble as well. It does have less forward mids however, which it doesn't seem like you want.
   
  The EPH-100 has good, flat bass extension and prominent mids, as well as more relaxed treble, but it raises the mid-bass as well compared to the RE262 and isn't quite as refined overall. It'll likely work better for you than the FXT90 but I can't say it's a better earphone than the RE262. 
   
  Those two are the best I can think of right now.


----------



## z28dreams

Has anyone heard the new BrainWavz R1?  Curious how it compares to the VSonic GR02.


----------



## atomikn00b

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The short answer is no, not really. There's no IEM I've heard that does exactly what you want.
> 
> The long answer is that depending on what you're willing to sacrifice there may be something that will fit your preferences a bit better.
> 
> ...


 

 Wow. thanks. Didn't know I was that picky with iems. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 Anyway. I'll keep using the fxt90 for now. If the harshness doesn't go away, I'll sell/trade them for the eph100s. I don't mind a slight mid-bass raise.
 That fx700 is too much of a price hike to find what I'm looking for. I'd rather save up and get some customs (even more expensive ones).
 As for those re262s. I'll most likely sell them in the coming months. I don't like having to eq iems. I'm in love with those mids but subbbass is a priority for me.

 Perhaps you can plan to review the sony xb90ex?
   
  Thanks for the help!!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> Wow. thanks. Didn't know I was that picky with iems.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  No plans at this time. I have too many IEMs to review all ready - some of them may never get written up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Sycho

The new Apple Earpods and Brainwavz R1 have to be on this list ASAP. R1 for being really hyped right now, and Earpods for the sakes of seeing where it would stand.


----------



## nehcrow

First of all, amazing work on the thread! It's been extremely useful to me
 Now, I'm wondering if you'd heard the Audiofly AF78 and could you give a quick summary of the sound and an estimation of the overall sound score?
 Also how well does it stack up to other models in it's price range? For example, the GR07?
 Sorry if this is inconvenient, but I'm really interested in this model


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sycho said:


> The new Apple Earpods and Brainwavz R1 have to be on this list ASAP. R1 for being really hyped right now, and Earpods for the sakes of seeing where it would stand.


 
   
  I posted my brief thoughts on the earpods here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/629283/mini-review-thoughts-on-apple-earpods-as-compared-to-the-old-ibuds 
   
  Technically Earpods are not IEMs since there is no seal between the housing and ear canal so I didn't add them to this thread. 
    
  Quote:


nehcrow said:


> First of all, amazing work on the thread! It's been extremely useful to me
> Now, I'm wondering if you'd heard the Audiofly AF78 and could you give a quick summary of the sound and an estimation of the overall sound score?
> Also how well does it stack up to other models in it's price range? For example, the GR07?
> Sorry if this is inconvenient, but I'm really interested in this model


 
   
  I've only heard the AF78 briefly at a show. It was bass-heavy and not all that coherent and didn't compete well with the GR07 I'd brought. I am not sure if that was the final tuning or not but at this point I wouldn't blindly count on it being a GR07 competitor.


----------



## theOS

Hi guys, what IEM do you recommend for tech house , deep house, chillout , electo, etc? (Driven by Iphone 4s and creative x fi hd )
  Here are my options (selections):
   
[size=1.7em] Audeo pfe 012 perfect bass (75€)[/size] [size=1.7em] Shure se215 (92€)[/size] [size=1.7em] Jvc Ha-fxt90 (95€)[/size]   
  and something more inexpensive:
   
MEElectronics A151 (43€)
Denon AH-C452R (39€)
PANASONIC rp-hje 355 (23€) 
panasonic rp hje900 (58€)
   
   
   
  Thank you in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

This was asked via email but I wanted to address it here - I have no idea where the rumor came from but I don't think that the Rock-It Sounds R-30 and MEElec A161P share the same driver. I don't think that the two are voiced all that similarly - the R-30 is warm and smooth while the A161P is crisp, punchy, and aggressive. The A161P uses a Knowles ED armature. I don't know what the R-30 is using but my best guess would be a BK, like the Westone 1. 
   
  Quote: 





theos said:


> Hi guys, what IEM do you recommend for tech house , deep house, chillout , electo, etc? (Driven by Iphone 4s and creative x fi hd )
> Here are my options (selections):
> 
> [size=1.7em] Audeo pfe 012 perfect bass (75€)[/size] [size=1.7em] Shure se215 (92€)[/size] [size=1.7em] Jvc Ha-fxt90 (95€)[/size]
> ...


 
   
  Depends on what kind of sound you want.  I will say that's a pretty great price for the HJE900 if you like something exciting with plenty of impact. I think that's a better price than the closeout pricing we had here in the US a few years ago. My next choice would be the FXT90 without knowing more about your signature preferences.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> This was asked via email but I wanted to address it here - I have no idea where the rumor came from but I don't think that the Rock-It Sounds R-30 and MEElec A161P share the same driver. I don't think that the two are voiced all that similarly - the R-30 is warm and smooth while the A161P is crisp, punchy, and aggressive. The A161P uses a Knowles ED armature. I don't know what the R-30 is using but my best guess would be a BK, like the Westone 1.


 
  i can confirm that. A161p uses ED,
  W1 and R-30 use BK. the dunu i 3c too


----------



## xLeira

Can I request a direct comparison between Brainwavz M2 and the Vsonic GR06? The lows, mids and highs?
   
  I have the M2's and I'm thinking of a buying an IEM that has a different signature to them. Over-the-ears would be preferred. I'd like something that focuses on clarity, less bass, soundstage, quite the opposite of the M2's. I'm currently thinking about the GR06 for it. Am I on the right direction? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Hoping for your replies guys. Thanks!


----------



## nehcrow

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I posted my brief thoughts on the earpods here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/629283/mini-review-thoughts-on-apple-earpods-as-compared-to-the-old-ibuds
> 
> Technically Earpods are not IEMs since there is no seal between the housing and ear canal so I didn't add them to this thread.
> 
> I've only heard the AF78 briefly at a show. It was bass-heavy and not all that coherent and didn't compete well with the GR07 I'd brought. I am not sure if that was the final tuning or not but at this point I wouldn't blindly count on it being a GR07 competitor.


 
  Ah, that's slightly disappointing
  Thanks for the opinion, joker!


----------



## Orel

Hello joker. I'd be happy if I could get some help from you 
  I asked you a question on your Portable Headphones guide, and I'll also ask you a question here 
  I've been wanting to buy IEM's at around 40$, I want good treble (not painful and harsh, perferably smooth and well.. good sounding  ), a wide soundstage if possible and COMFORT  I'd also love for some smooth vocals.
  I've been looking into the Rock it Sounds R-20, do you think I should buy them? I read from you and some other reviewer that the treble isn't so good. Perhaps should I get the VSonic GR02? Or will it be too bassy for me?
  I wanted to buy the VSonic GR06 originally but I want to spend as little as possible, I don't really work and have a lot of money ^^"
  As for genres, as I said in the other threads mostly Rock and Metal, but also Jazz and orchestral music. A little bit of bassy music.
  Thanks alot!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> i can confirm that. A161p uses ED,
> W1 and R-30 use BK. the dunu i 3c too


 
   
  Thanks, good to know. Funny how the pictures I've seen of the I 3C-S make the driver look like a dual BA unit. 
   
  Quote: 





xleira said:


> Can I request a direct comparison between Brainwavz M2 and the Vsonic GR06? The lows, mids and highs?
> 
> I have the M2's and I'm thinking of a buying an IEM that has a different signature to them. Over-the-ears would be preferred. I'd like something that focuses on clarity, less bass, soundstage, quite the opposite of the M2's. I'm currently thinking about the GR06 for it. Am I on the right direction?
> 
> ...


 
   
  The GR06 has a cooler signature with more treble emphasis. Overall it's quicker-sounding and more refined, with a wider stage and less intimate presentation. Bass is tighter as well. It's a good upgrade but  it doesn't really go to the absolute opposite extremes of the M2 - for that you'd need something like a Sunrise Xcited or maybe a BA-based set. 
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> Hello joker. I'd be happy if I could get some help from you
> I asked you a question on your Portable Headphones guide, and I'll also ask you a question here
> I've been wanting to buy IEM's at around 40$, I want good treble (not painful and harsh, perferably smooth and well.. good sounding  ), a wide soundstage if possible and COMFORT  I'd also love for some smooth vocals.
> I've been looking into the Rock it Sounds R-20, do you think I should buy them? I read from you and some other reviewer that the treble isn't so good. Perhaps should I get the VSonic GR02? Or will it be too bassy for me?
> ...


 
   
  The R-20 is decent all-around but really doesn't have a wide stage. The R-30 is better but also pricier. The GR02 also has the typical treble hotness of the VSonic stuff, I don't think it's what you want. You might want to chance the monoprice MEP-933 / 8320 if you think the fit might work for your ears. About as cheap as it gets, and has smooth sound with a wide stage. Otherwise a MEElec CW31 would probably be my choice, or a Soundmagic E30.


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, good to know. Funny how the pictures I've seen of the I 3C-S make the driver look like a dual BA unit.
> 
> 
> The GR06 has a cooler signature with more treble emphasis. Overall it's quicker-sounding and more refined, with a wider stage and less intimate presentation. Bass is tighter as well. It's a good upgrade but  it doesn't really go to the absolute opposite extremes of the M2 - for that you'd need something like a Sunrise Xcited or maybe a BA-based set.
> ...


 
  Thanks for the reply! 
  So do you think the monoprice 8320 will be better for me than the R20 or GR20? I have the AKG Q350 which I bought quite a while ago, they sound ok (pretty harsh treble) but the comfort is aweful, I can't walk around with them comfortably. I hope the monoprice could be comfortable for me. The shipping is very expensive if I'll be sending it to Israel, but I might be able to send it to my girlfriend's relative in the US which will be alot cheaper. I thought about buying them just for the hell of it, great reviews and very cheap XD
  Regarding the CW31, what makes you think they'd fit better for me? As I saw you gave them a lower score than most other headphones mentioned.
  Thanks alot for your help


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





orel said:


> Thanks for the reply!
> So do you think the monoprice 8320 will be better for me than the R20 or GR20? I have the AKG Q350 which I bought quite a while ago, they sound ok (pretty harsh treble) but the comfort is aweful, I can't walk around with them comfortably. I hope the monoprice could be comfortable for me. The shipping is very expensive if I'll be sending it to Israel, but I might be able to send it to my girlfriend's relative in the US which will be alot cheaper. I thought about buying them just for the hell of it, great reviews and very cheap XD
> Regarding the CW31, what makes you think they'd fit better for me? As I saw you gave them a lower score than most other headphones mentioned.
> Thanks alot for your help


 
   
  See below for why I think the CW31 or 8320 will work better for you. Doesn't really matter how good the other models sound if they don't fit what you're looking for. The CW31 is much safer than the 8320 in terms of fit, etc, and still has a decently wide soundstage and very smooth sound. The 8320 really won't work for all ears. Good news is your Q350 tips should fit it.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *The R-20 is decent all-around but really doesn't have a wide stage*. The R-30 is better but also pricier. *The GR02 also has the typical treble hotness of the VSonic stuff, I don't think it's what you want.* You might want to chance the monoprice MEP-933 / 8320 if you think the fit might work for your ears. About as cheap as it gets, and has smooth sound with a wide stage. Otherwise a MEElec CW31 would probably be my choice, or a Soundmagic E30.


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> See below for why I think the CW31 or 8320 will work better for you. Doesn't really matter how good the other models sound if they don't fit what you're looking for. The CW31 is much safer than the 8320 in terms of fit, etc, and still has a decently wide soundstage and very smooth sound. The 8320 really won't work for all ears. Good news is your Q350 tips should fit it.


 

 Lol, I actually didn't really like the Q350 tips and bought Sony hybrids from eBay, only I'm suspecting they're fake ones lol. Still uncomfortable.
  What tips would you recommend for the 8320?
  I'd love for a description of what "*typical treble hotness of the VSonic stuff" *means 
  Clarity is also quite important for me, will the CW31 be clear enough? I heard the A151 were great and a long time ago I was thinking of buying these, but then I heard the GR06 are better. In any case, i'd like to spend less at the moment, and I can buy the CW31 on eBay for 35$ with shipping which looks like a good price.
  I might even buy both the CW31 and the 8320, just for the amazing price XD


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





orel said:


> Lol, I actually didn't really like the Q350 tips and bought Sony hybrids from eBay, only I'm suspecting they're fake ones lol. Still uncomfortable.
> What tips would you recommend for the 8320?
> I'd love for a description of what "*typical treble hotness of the VSonic stuff" *means
> Clarity is also quite important for me, will the CW31 be clear enough? I heard the A151 were great and a long time ago I was thinking of buying these, but then I heard the GR06 are better. In any case, i'd like to spend less at the moment, and I can buy the CW31 on eBay for 35$ with shipping which looks like a good price.
> I might even buy both the CW31 and the 8320, just for the amazing price XD


 
   
  The GR02 is more sibilant than the average mid/high-end earphone, as are the rest of the VSonic dynamics I've heard.
   
  I don't know of any silicone tips more comfortable than Hybrids. You are either not using the right size for your ears, haven't acclimated to something being in your ear canals, or maybe IEMs just aren't for you. Last resort would be Comply foam but they are pricy. The Monoprice and CW31 are both shallow-insertion earphones which should help comfort.


----------



## Sycho

Would you consider the Gr06s sibilant or fatiguing in the highs? I'm planning to purchase those headphones if the R1s do not turn out to be the great headphones I expect (ex. fatiguing highs, low quality, etc.).


----------



## ljokerl

Added Rock-It Sounds R-10 and R-11
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B35) Rock-It Sounds R-10*
> 
> 
> Added Oct 2012
> ...


 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Sycho* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Would you consider the Gr06s sibilant or fatiguing in the highs? I'm planning to purchase those headphones if the R1s do not turn out to be the great headphones I expect (ex. fatiguing highs, low quality, etc.).


 
   
  A little sibilant. Don't get me wrong - I still enjoy my GR06 hugely. I just won't recommend it to someone asking specifically for an IEM with smooth treble. Enough excellent IEMs out there in every price range to have the luxury of doing that now.


----------



## OnlinePredator

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Is the Astrotec AM-90 still the best option for under $50?
 How about under $100?
  The VSonic GR06 is under $70, and has better sound quality than the AM-90, but it's not on Amazon(It's on ebay, but I don't know whether it's the real thing), and it doesn't look as good IMO, so will it be worth it?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> Is the Astrotec AM-90 still the best option for under $50?
> How about under $100?
> The VSonic GR06 is under $70, and has better sound quality than the AM-90, but it's not on Amazon(It's on ebay, but I don't know whether it's the real thing), and it doesn't look as good IMO, so will it be worth it?


 
   
  One of the best, as long as you like a balanced sound. The Rock-It R-20 is pretty much the same earphone in a different shell and with minor tuning differences. I am not aware of any fake VSonic products so I wouldn't worry about buying from ebay. Lendmeurears is an authorized VSonic retailer (both via their site and ebay store) if you really want to be safe. 
   
  In any price range it will depend first and foremost on what you're looking for. There are tons of high bang/buck earphones but just because it sounded best to me at a particular price point doesn't mean it will match your preferences best.


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR02 is more sibilant than the average mid/high-end earphone, as are the rest of the VSonic dynamics I've heard.
> 
> I don't know of any silicone tips more comfortable than Hybrids. You are either not using the right size for your ears, haven't acclimated to something being in your ear canals, or maybe IEMs just aren't for you. Last resort would be Comply foam but they are pricy. The Monoprice and CW31 are both shallow-insertion earphones which should help comfort.


 
   
  Ok thanks 
  It's not about the sony hybrid tips, they didn't come in the normal sony hybrids box and even though I was supposed to get only the small size (that has the green color shells), they all have the green color but are in different sizes. My left ear seems to like them but my right ear hates them, no matter which one I use lol. It might also have to do with the Q350 housings. Maybe it has to do with the fact that the Q350 have 5mm drivers and the hybrids are for 3mm drivers (the inner part is kinda stretched when they're on).
  So do you think I should buy the hybrids? (original this time). It's just that they're a little expensive, about the price of the Monoprice 8320 
  Edit: Now looking at it it appears that on the original small is orange and medium is green. They're in different sizes anyway.. Appears they are fake 
  Edit 2: Damn! Amazon are on sale, it appears.
  http://www.amazon.com/Sony-EPEX10A-BLK-Replacement-Earbuds/dp/B001RB24UA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1350312887&sr=8-1&keywords=sony+hybrid
  http://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-Enhanced-Hi-Fi-Isolating-Earphones/dp/B007VEQ2UU/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1350312887&sr=8-6&keywords=sony+hybrid
  That's pretty cheap, good chance I'm buying these XD
  Edit 3: According to this review:
  http://www.amazon.com/review/R2OPC4VXQV9QJB/ref=cm_cr_pr_cmt?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B001RB24UA&linkCode=&nodeID=&tag=#wasThisHelpful
  They don't fit well with the monoprice earphones. What's your opinon of it? Because you said they fit well in your review. Also, do CW31 tips count as "Meelec long single flange"?


----------



## nagrive

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Rock-It Sounds R-20 and R-30.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks for the review Joker. =)
   
  I am going to add those for my collection plus sell it though www.multi5enses.com in Singapore!


----------



## darkunknown88

I think this is one of the best headphone guides around. I wonder why this didn't come up when I was googling 'Headphone guide' for weeks...............
   
  [size=small]I'm planning to buy a set of earphones for around 100$ and am tempted to go for the Denon AHC560R. I actually wanted to go for the Vsonic GR6 but it is not available in my country and importing it costs double. Even Shure SE215, Etymotic costs +[/size][size=small]$150.[/size][size=small] I want something with balanced treble, mids and lows. I mainly listen to metal/rock and sometimes pop. The only earphones available around the [/size][size=small]$100 mark are the Denons and Klipsch S4 (currently). Which of these will be good to go? Any other suggestions/alternatives?[/size]
   
  [size=small]Thanks. [/size]


----------



## ayaflo

is the r 50 next?


----------



## Zelda

joker, thanks for the lower Rockit additions. kinda disapointed, as their upper models seem to be better (i only tried the R-50)
  good thing i went for the philips SHE3*


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ayaflo said:


> is the r 50 next?


 
  no way, the TF10 is first!


----------



## theOS

Quote: 





> Depends on what kind of sound you want.  I will say that's a pretty great price for the HJE900 if you like something exciting with plenty of impact. I think that's a better price than the closeout pricing we had here in the US a few years ago. My next choice would be the FXT90 without knowing more about your signature preferences.


 
  I like deep and tight bass, detailed mids and hights . Large soundstage and good instrumental separation. 
  By the way , very nice thread
Sorry for my bad english.


----------



## OnlinePredator

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  The R-20's are $23 cheaper than the GR06, so if they're pretty much the same, I guess it's either that or the Astrotec AM-90. How do they compare?
   
  I still don't know what I'm looking for, even after looking at the glossary of the audiophile terminology, so anything goes, I guess.


----------



## Inks

Think he meant the R20 is about the same as the AM90, both likely use the same Knowles drivers.

GR06 would likely be quite different from the two.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nagrive said:


> Thanks for the review Joker. =)
> 
> I am going to add those for my collection plus sell it though www.multi5enses.com in Singapore!


 
   





   
  Quote: 





darkunknown88 said:


> I think this is one of the best headphone guides around. I wonder why this didn't come up when I was googling 'Headphone guide' for weeks...............
> 
> [size=small]I'm planning to buy a set of earphones for around 100$ and am tempted to go for the Denon AHC560R. I actually wanted to go for the Vsonic GR6 but it is not available in my country and importing it costs double. Even Shure SE215, Etymotic costs +[/size][size=small]$150.[/size][size=small] I want something with balanced treble, mids and lows. I mainly listen to metal/rock and sometimes pop. The only earphones available around the [/size][size=small]$100 mark are the Denons and Klipsch S4 (currently). Which of these will be good to go? Any other suggestions/alternatives?[/size]
> 
> [size=small]Thanks. [/size]


 
   
  The term "Headphone Guide" isn't anywhere in the title or the body of this thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  Sorry, I haven't heard the C560R. The Denon C710 is pretty good, better than the S4 in my opinion, but I don't know if they still sell it. Not all that balanced but not as bad as the S4. Other good options - HiSound, MEElectronics, Rock-It Sounds, etc - would probably all require importing.
   
  Quote: 





ayaflo said:


> is the r 50 next?


 
   
  No, but soon. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> joker, thanks for the lower Rockit additions. kinda disapointed, as their upper models seem to be better (i only tried the R-50)
> good thing i went for the philips SHE3*


 
   
  Agreed. Even the R-20 isn't that much more expensive than the R-10/R-11, but it's so much better. 
   
  Quote: 





theos said:


> I like deep and tight bass, detailed mids and hights . Large soundstage and good instrumental separation.
> By the way , very nice thread
> Sorry for my bad english.


 
   
   
  I would go for the HJE900, the soundstage is not huge but the bass is good and the overall sound is clean, if a little v-shaped. It's a really good price, too.
   
   
  Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> The R-20's are $23 cheaper than the GR06, so if they're pretty much the same, I guess it's either that or the Astrotec AM-90. How do they compare?
> 
> I still don't know what I'm looking for, even after looking at the glossary of the audiophile terminology, so anything goes, I guess.


 
   
   
  I meant the AM-90, not the GR06. R-20 and AM-90 are about the same price and sound very similar. Main difference would probably be that the R-20 is more difficult to wear cable-down.
   
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Think he meant the R20 is about the same as the AM90, both likely use the same Knowles drivers.
> GR06 would likely be quite different from the two.


 
   
  Correct.


----------



## blackmarket

I'm not sure if anyone has requested this yet, but do you plan on doing a review of the Heir Audio universals?


----------



## OnlinePredator

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Ok, so how does the GR06 compare with the AM-90/R-20?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blackmarket said:


> I'm not sure if anyone has requested this yet, but do you plan on doing a review of the Heir Audio universals?


 
   
  Maybe. I am part of the loaner tour but if I feel I don't have time for them I'll have to skip my turn.
   
  Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> Ok, so how does the GR06 compare with the AM-90/R-20?


 
   
  The GR06 has deeper, fuller, more natural bass and better treble reach with more 'air' to its sound. Clarity (not a strong suit of the GR06) is similar to the AM-90. Presentation is a touch more enveloping.


----------



## nyonya

Hi ljokerl, could you compare the sound of the E-Q5 to the GR07?  Thanks!


----------



## supernatural

Joker, how would you compare the sibilance on the FXT90 to the GR07 mk2 (fully burned it)?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





supernatural said:


> Joker, how would you compare the sibilance on the FXT90 to the GR07 mk2 (fully burned it)?


 
   
  H hasn't heard the MK2 yet. I'll have to do something about that


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





orel said:


> Ok thanks
> It's not about the sony hybrid tips, they didn't come in the normal sony hybrids box and even though I was supposed to get only the small size (that has the green color shells), they all have the green color but are in different sizes. My left ear seems to like them but my right ear hates them, no matter which one I use lol. It might also have to do with the Q350 housings. Maybe it has to do with the fact that the Q350 have 5mm drivers and the hybrids are for 3mm drivers (the inner part is kinda stretched when they're on).
> So do you think I should buy the hybrids? (original this time). It's just that they're a little expensive, about the price of the Monoprice 8320
> Edit: Now looking at it it appears that on the original small is orange and medium is green. They're in different sizes anyway.. Appears they are fake
> ...


 

 Hey joker, maybe you missed it but I'd love if you can respond to this post


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





orel said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The sony hybrids fit the Monoprice just fine. They're a tad small, and it takes a bit of work to get them on, but they fit very snugly.


----------



## scootsit

Joker, have you seen these?
  $100 dynamic hybrids, and $150 BA hybrids, that allegedly rival the ER4 and PFE:
  http://cosmicears.com/
   
  Getting great reviews, too:
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/626714/cosmic-ears-new-ciem-company-with-crazy-low-prices-including-hybrid-designs
   
   
  I may spring for a pair of the Sport+ in the near future (they're the same as the Pure+, but with a detachable cable).
  May wait for new products in November.
   
  The Flex, is fully customizable, and the HY3 is a three driver (one dynamic for the low end) for about $300.
   
  Did I mention those prices include an impression kit?


----------



## darkunknown88

Thanks for the feedback.....will probably settle for the 560Rs. Might check out Meelectronics, a few select models are available.


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> The sony hybrids fit the Monoprice just fine. They're a tad small, and it takes a bit of work to get them on, but they fit very snugly.


 

 Thanks for the reply, then I'll probarly be buying the Monoprice 8320 and the Sony hybrids, and if I'm not satisfied with them (probarly comfort wise) I'll buy the CW31 
  Have you tried the monoprice 8320 with the sony hybrids? Could you comment on how they fit and if they are comfortable?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





orel said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 For me? No. I couldn't get the 8320 to fit, period. The left one made my ear feel like it was going to fall off, it hurt so bad. The bodies of the 8320 are huge, absolutely massive. I was able to get the 8320 to fit great a few times, and the sound was truly awesome - but I ended up getting rid of them because they just hurt too much. I ended up going with the VSONICs, even the GR99, which is a bit less analytical and is a bit bassier is a step up from the 8320 in my mind, because I can actually listen to the music, and stop focusing on the pain.


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> For me? No. I couldn't get the 8320 to fit, period. The left one made my ear feel like it was going to fall off, it hurt so bad. The bodies of the 8320 are huge, absolutely massive. I was able to get the 8320 to fit great a few times, and the sound was truly awesome - but I ended up getting rid of them because they just hurt too much. I ended up going with the VSONICs, even the GR99, which is a bit less analytical and is a bit bassier is a step up from the 8320 in my mind, because I can actually listen to the music, and stop focusing on the pain.


 

 Thanks alot 
  I understand you, and now I'm not sure about buying them. My main reason in buying new in ears is that my Q350 are uncomfortable, and the second main reason is that the treble is too harsh. I'm not sure I even should invest the money in the monoprice :\ The monoprice with sony hybrids and shipping will cost me about 17$, which is not alot but not really something I want to waste. I'll have to think if I should order these or just go for the CW31.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





orel said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 By the time you're at $17, you're within 5 of the GR99, and probably more than the SHE3580  (which I have not heard, but I just got a pair for my dad), which get excellent reviews.


----------



## ayaflo

musical fidelity eb 50
   
  review : 
http://www.anythingbutipod.com/forum/showthread.php?p=622478
   
  site : 
http://www.musicalfidelity.com/eb-50/


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nyonya said:


> Hi ljokerl, could you compare the sound of the E-Q5 to the GR07?  Thanks!


 
   
  Both of these are pretty well-balanced and I thought both were fairly neutral in terms of tone. The GR07 will give you more deep bass and better texturing/microdetail while the e-Q5 will be a touch smoother through the upper midrange and treble. The GR07 also tends to have a wider presentation with not-so-great depth while the e-Q5 is not as wide-sounding but more well-rounded.
   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> H hasn't heard the MK2 yet. I'll have to do something about that


 
   
  Correct, no idea what the Mk2 sounds like 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> The sony hybrids fit the Monoprice just fine. They're a tad small, and it takes a bit of work to get them on, but they fit very snugly.


 
   
  +1
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Joker, have you seen these?
> $100 dynamic hybrids, and $150 BA hybrids, that allegedly rival the ER4 and PFE:
> http://cosmicears.com/
> 
> ...


 
   
  Never seen them. Prices look very nice indeed.
   
  Quote: 





ayaflo said:


> musical fidelity eb 50
> 
> review :
> http://www.anythingbutipod.com/forum/showthread.php?p=622478
> ...


 
   
  Ha, funny to see these mentioned here. This review was re-posted on Head-Fi but the thread was deleted because the OP couldn't take any criticism. 
   
  I'll say here what I said there - these really look like they are OEM'd by Dunu (or the parent company, Topsound) and most likely contain Knowles SR (Siren) drivers - same as Dunu Ares and Crius. As far as I know the SR is the only BA with a 6mm diameter.


----------



## cocolinho

Joker, I'm looking for a new set which isolate A LOT. I'm currently using Ety HF5 but I don't find them comfortable.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Any alternative to Shure SE215? I'm also tempted by a pair of custom Cosmic ears.
  Thanks a lot


----------



## zhonghua

Hi joker, please compare soundmagic e10 and dunu trident? Don't include other iem. Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cocolinho said:


> Joker, I'm looking for a new set which isolate A LOT. I'm currently using Ety HF5 but I don't find them comfortable.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Try foam Ety tips? That or customs tips would be a well-isolating solution. All of the Shures isolate well, as does the Klipsch Image X10 and Yamaha EPH-100. You would probably have to figure what exactly makes the Etys uncomfortable before you risk another universal, though.  
    
  Quote:


zhonghua said:


> Hi joker, please compare soundmagic e10 and dunu trident? Don't include other iem. Thanks


 
   
  The E10 is a little more balanced/a touch brighter while the Trident is warmer and bassier. The two really aren't very far apart IMO - the biggest difference is probably the presentation with the E10 sounding bigger and more out-of-the-head. Also, if you listen at high volumes go with the Trident - it's stays undistorted longer.


----------



## Mini0510

joker How does the AKG K3003i compare to JVC FX 700?
  I so like the sound signature for JVC FX700 though. I also like the base quantity and treble extension and quantity.
   
  Basically I'm looking for a universal IEM that is similar to JVC FX 700, but more 3D, separation and isolation. I'm not sure if there is such item.
  Thanks


----------



## snappyaxolotl

ljokerl, I have been reading plenty of reviews of CIEMs such as the Unique Melody Miracle. In your opinion, which universal IEM <$500 sound most similar to it? Thanks!


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Try foam Ety tips? That or customs tips would be a well-isolating solution. All of the Shures isolate well, as does the Klipsch Image X10 and Yamaha EPH-100. You would probably have to figure what exactly makes the Etys uncomfortable before you risk another universal, though.
> 
> The E10 is a little more balanced/a touch brighter while the Trident is warmer and bassier. The two really aren't very far apart IMO - the biggest difference is probably the presentation with the E10 sounding bigger and more *out-of-the-head*. Also, if you listen at high volumes go with the Trident - it's stays undistorted longer.


 
  mind to explain *that ?*


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker How does the AKG K3003i compare to JVC FX 700?
> I so like the sound signature for JVC FX700 though. I also like the base quantity and treble extension and quantity.
> 
> Basically I'm looking for a universal IEM that is similar to JVC FX 700, but more 3D, separation and isolation. I'm not sure if there is such item.
> Thanks


 
   
  Unfortunately I don't have the FX700 anymore and never got the chance to compare it directly to the K3003i. From memory I would say the K3003i does have a similar signature (powerful, dynamic bass with sparkly and prominent - yet pretty smooth - treble) and a presentation with more depth and better layering. However, I can't be more precise without comparing them head to head. The only other high-end earphone I've heard that reminds me of the FX700 is the UM Miracle but it has a flatter signature with less bass power and less prominent treble, so it may not be as good a match for you as the K3003.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> ljokerl, I have been reading plenty of reviews of CIEMs such as the Unique Melody Miracle. In your opinion, which universal IEM <$500 sound most similar to it? Thanks!


 
   
  Probably the JVC FX700 at low volumes (when it sounds flattest). At higher volumes the FX700 gets increasingly v-shaped in my experience. I remember reading that this has to do with the greater sensitivity of the ear in the midrange (i.e. even at low volumes midrange sounds are easy to discern than those towards the extreme of the frequency spectrum). See also equal loudness contours. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> mind to explain *that ?*


 
   
  It's another way of saying the E10 has a larger headstage, i.e. how much of the perceived space within your head (or outside of it) the presentation is capable of covering. Had to dig up this thread as it has a much better explanation: http://www.head-fi.org/t/40313/stax-sr-007-omega-ii-a-review-after-4-years-of-ownership (just ctrl+f for 'headstage')


----------



## ljokerl

Added Thinksound MS01
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C53) Thinksound MS01*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## zhonghua

> The E10 is a little more balanced/a touch brighter while the Trident is warmer and bassier. The two really aren't very far apart IMO - the biggest difference is probably the presentation with the E10 sounding bigger and more out-of-the-head. Also, if you listen at high volumes go with the Trident - it's stays undistorted longer.




Which of them do you recommend is best?


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I don't have the FX700 anymore and never got the chance to compare it directly to the K3003i. From memory I would say the K3003i does have a similar signature (powerful, dynamic bass with sparkly and prominent - yet pretty smooth - treble) and a presentation with more depth and better layering. However, I can't be more precise without comparing them head to head. The only other high-end earphone I've heard that reminds me of the FX700 is the UM Miracle but it has a flatter signature with less bass power and less prominent treble, so it may not be as good a match for you as the K3003i




I have both and agree with that, but might add that the K3003's upper bass is less pronounced, which makes its bass overall more even and the midrange less recessed than the FX700's.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zhonghua said:


> Which of them do you recommend is best?


 
   
  Honestly I prefer the E10 but they are close enough to the point where your preferences would tilt the balance. 
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> I have both and agree with that, but might add that the K3003's upper bass is less pronounced, which makes its bass overall more even and the midrange less recessed than the FX700's.


 
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Velorium

Hello,
   
  A year and a half ago I bought a set of thinksound Rains based on comparing reviews on this thread. I turned them in for warranty twice, once because of the sound being unbalanced and once because the headphone jack shorted. The jack then died again so I then bought a second pair in early summer thinking that I was just being too hard on my headphones, despite my Zune Premium V2 having no problems for over 4 years which also had an I plug (Of course after the thinksounds, I could never go back). This new pair then had the unbalanced issue so I sent them in, and the second pair came back still unbalanced, but nowhere near as noticeable. About 4 months later the jack has died again despite no obvious external wear. I feel as though I've used up enough warranty claims and that it's time to move on even though I could probably solder a new plug. I fear returning to thinksound as a brand because out of breakage worry, but perhaps that's my fault.
   
  Regardless, in this new pair I'm looking for something that's quite sturdy, balanced range, and has decent separation (to my ears) like the Rains without being too analytical. I listen to many genres but mostly electronic, acoustic, and rock; a warm sound without being boomy is ideal to me. I understand that nothing is going to match the Rains signature exactly, but I loved them greatly for what they were and would like to find something close.
   
  I'm interested in the MC3 but worry that they may be too analytical from the reviews I've read. The Fischer Audio Eterna rev.2 and Ultimate Ears SF3 also looks interesting but hard to find. Other considerations right now are various MEElec IEMS for their build quality, and the HiFiMan RE262 although I wonder how they compare in treble to the Rains and they're a bit more expensive than what I plan to spend. Any suggestions would be much appreciated.
   
  Thanks in advance!


----------



## zhonghua

ljokerl said:


> Honestly I prefer the E10 but they are close enough to the point where your preferences would tilt the balance.
> 
> 
> Thanks!




So for overall soundstage and balanced between trident and e10, e10 wins?


----------



## atomikn00b

took me a while but i finally figured out what i want in an iem.
  what is the closest (an best) i can find to a balanced iem with an elevated subbass at a sub $180 price point?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





velorium said:


> Hello,
> 
> A year and a half ago I bought a set of thinksound Rains based on comparing reviews on this thread. I turned them in for warranty twice, once because of the sound being unbalanced and once because the headphone jack shorted. The jack then died again so I then bought a second pair in early summer thinking that I was just being too hard on my headphones, despite my Zune Premium V2 having no problems for over 4 years which also had an I plug (Of course after the thinksounds, I could never go back). This new pair then had the unbalanced issue so I sent them in, and the second pair came back still unbalanced, but nowhere near as noticeable. About 4 months later the jack has died again despite no obvious external wear. I feel as though I've used up enough warranty claims and that it's time to move on even though I could probably solder a new plug. I fear returning to thinksound as a brand because out of breakage worry, but perhaps that's my fault.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I quite like Thinksound's new MS01 (and maybe you can get a discounted price or something considering you're a current Thinksound owner). It'll certainly be close to Rain than most other options. You could also look at the Spider Realvoice for a similar sound.
   
  Aside from that, I would maybe consider the Shure SE215 and HiSound Crystal in the <$100 range. These are two earphones that have good accuracy and a fairly balanced sound aside from a mild-to-moderate bass boost for a warm-ish tone. They will have a slightly more accurate sound than your Rains but won't be as analytical is as an Ety MC3 or even the MEElec A161P. The same can be said for the VSonic GR06 except that it also has pretty forward mids. 
   
  Quote: 





zhonghua said:


> So for overall soundstage and balanced between trident and e10, e10 wins?


 
   
  Correct
    
  Quote:


atomikn00b said:


> took me a while but i finally figured out what i want in an iem.
> what is the closest (an best) i can find to a balanced iem with an elevated subbass at a sub $180 price point?


 
   
  If the emphasis is on 'balanced', probably the VSonic GR07. I think it has a pretty flat in-ear response but its subbass is stronger as compared to ruler-flat armature earphones (e.g. ATH-CK10, etc). If the emphasis is on bass quantity, maybe something like the Atrio MG7. It's got tons of subbass but isn't all that balanced overall because of slightly recessed mids and elevated lower treble. There is also the Hippo VB and HiSound Wooduo 2, which also have great bass depth and are less mid-recessed than the MG7.


----------



## theOS

Panasonic rp hje900 no longer available 
   
  add Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE / MMX 101 iE to the list


----------



## theOS

Hi guys, what IEM do you recommend for tech house , deep house, chillout , electo, etc? (Driven by Iphone 4s and creative x fi hd )
 Here are my options (selections):
  
[size=1.7em] Audeo pfe 012 perfect bass (75€)[/size] [size=1.7em] Shure se215 (92€)[/size] [size=1.7em] Jvc Ha-fxt90 (95€)[/size]   
 and something more inexpensive:
  
 MEElectronics A151 (43€)
 Denon AH-C452R (39€)
 PANASONIC rp-hje 355 (23€)
 panasonic rp hje900 (58€)
   
   
  Quote: 





theos said:


> Panasonic rp hje900 no longer available
> 
> add Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE / MMX 101 iE to the list


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





theos said:


> Panasonic rp hje900 no longer available
> 
> add Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE / MMX 101 iE to the list


 
   
  FXT90, then, if you're willing to pay that much. It's a solid earphone.


----------



## OnlinePredator

So the TF10's are gonna be ~$100 during Black Friday, is it worth the wait/money over the GR06?
  Especially as they run out in minutes.


----------



## GunGrave

Hey everyone. About a year or so ago, I bought the Xears TD4 hoping they would be similar to the TD3 V2.
  After the burn in has passed surely I can say this: they are horrible. The overall sound is not bad but I consider the headphones unusable because:
  - the cable is to rough and has not soften enough to take any shape so it hangs all over the place but is not tangle-free anymore
  - because the cable is so heavy and the drivers are so light, anything else than slow walking will result in them falling out of my ears.
  - isolation is not that great an the bass leaks all over the place.
   
  Considering the coupon is still available, will the XE2PRO be any different ? For 35 euros they do not seem expensive.


----------



## heart banger-97

hi ljokerl
  I need to check something with you, do you think that eph-100 has more bass (in term of quantity) than S4?
   
  thanks


----------



## chipstjuven

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl
> I need to check something with you, do you think that eph-100 has more bass (in term of quantity) than S4?
> 
> thanks


 
  I'm not him but definitely no.
   
  In terms of quality, yes!


----------



## Velorium

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I quite like Thinksound's new MS01 (and maybe you can get a discounted price or something considering you're a current Thinksound owner). It'll certainly be close to Rain than most other options. You could also look at the Spider Realvoice for a similar sound.
> 
> Aside from that, I would maybe consider the Shure SE215 and HiSound Crystal in the <$100 range. These are two earphones that have good accuracy and a fairly balanced sound aside from a mild-to-moderate bass boost for a warm-ish tone. They will have a slightly more accurate sound than your Rains but won't be as analytical is as an Ety MC3 or even the MEElec A161P. The same can be said for the VSonic GR06 except that it also has pretty forward mids.


 

 That gives me a bit more to think about... Thanks!


----------



## lodatom

Have you thought about using Google Docs to share the spreadsheet?  This would allow you to easily update it on the web rather than having to use Excel, and it would automatically update for everyone else.  Here is an automatic conversion of the one I just downloaded.  I can transfer ownership to you if you'd like.
   
  Otherwise, thanks for your awesome reviews.  Super helpful!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> So the TF10's are gonna be ~$100 during Black Friday, is it worth the wait/money over the GR06?
> Especially as they run out in minutes.


 
   
  The TF10 is better overall but also has a different sound signature (much less forward mids, more relative emphasis on the bass and treble). You'd have to figure out if that's something you would like.
   
  Quote: 





gungrave said:


> Hey everyone. About a year or so ago, I bought the Xears TD4 hoping they would be similar to the TD3 V2.
> After the burn in has passed surely I can say this: they are horrible. The overall sound is not bad but I consider the headphones unusable because:
> - the cable is to rough and has not soften enough to take any shape so it hangs all over the place but is not tangle-free anymore
> - because the cable is so heavy and the drivers are so light, anything else than slow walking will result in them falling out of my ears.
> ...


 
   
  I think this might be best to ask in the Xears appreciation thread - they have so many models that it's hard to keep up. You're more likely to find someone who has heard the XE2Pro there. 
   
  Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> hi ljokerl
> I need to check something with you, do you think that eph-100 has more bass (in term of quantity) than S4?
> 
> thanks


 
   
  Maybe more extension but not more bass, no. 
    
  Quote:


lodatom said:


> Have you thought about using Google Docs to share the spreadsheet?  This would allow you to easily update it on the web rather than having to use Excel, and it would automatically update for everyone else.  Here is an automatic conversion of the one I just downloaded.  I can transfer ownership to you if you'd like.
> 
> Otherwise, thanks for your awesome reviews.  Super helpful!


 
   
  To be honest I don't do any of the work on the current downloadable spreadsheet either - it's all done by carfentanil. It does seem simpler - I'll have to suggest it to him. I'll shoot you a PM if/when he gets back to me.


----------



## OnlinePredator

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  I mainly listen to rock, rap, pop, electronic, soundtracks, and instrumental music; which is better for me?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> I mainly listen to rock, rap, pop, electronic, soundtracks, and instrumental music; which is better for me?


 
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/604058/whats-all-this-best-iem-for-rock-pop-bang-nonsense?


----------



## Niyologist

O_o

http://www3.jvckenwood.com/accessory/headphone/inner/ha-fxz200/index.html

Whaaa?


----------



## jant71

Nothing earth shattering, Joker, but still curious if you will be getting a Visang VS-K1 to review?


----------



## Niyologist

Triple Dynamic Driver JVC FXZ-200 In Ear Monitor.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> I mainly listen to rock, rap, pop, electronic, soundtracks, and instrumental music; which is better for me?


 
   
  Like I said before, really depends on you sound signature preferences. If I had to guess I'd say the TF10. 
   
  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Nothing earth shattering, Joker, but still curious if you will be getting a Visang VS-K1 to review?


 
   
  Yeah, I am strangely curious about them considering ViSang hasn't released anything on the IEM front in ~2 years. I was told I would be sent a pair but it hasn't arrived yet.


----------



## PMAP

Have you heard the Xears XPA2 yet? I'm beginning to think they'd be quite worth even the 150 € RRP, not to mention the 'code' price.


----------



## lukaleo

I gathered these below for all of y'all who are looking for TF10's in |joker|'s review - .
  Quote: 





> Posted 5/2/10 at 9:51pm
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 
        This is posted back when CK10's were 10/10 and no custom IEMs were added to the review, everything's been scaled down quite a bit since then...
   
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 10/6/11 at 3:15pm
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        RE262 is currently 9.1 SQ and 8.95 overall, while EX600 is currently 9.0 SQ and 8.65 overall. Something to note is TF10's fit may bring its overall ranking down, since I do not recall anyone who liked TF10's fit very much.
   
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 3/27/12 at 12:55am
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        W3 and UM3X are both currently 9.1 SQ and 8.95 overall, while SE530 is currently 8.9 SQ and 8.95 overall. Again expect the TF10's fit to bring its ranking down...
   
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 12/29/11 at 8:30am
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        You lied 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




...
   
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 1/29/11 at 1:01pm
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        This was posted on my birthday, which gave me some hope...but it's been way over a year since this was posted. I guess there's really quite a few minor ones...
   
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 8/19/10 at 2:50am
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        This thread started on March 19th, 2010...so, you have postponed TF10 for two and a half years now. If skipping TF10 is a crime, you are getting pretty close...
   
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 11/9/11 at 2:43pm
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        Made me cry T-T 
   
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 11/15/10 at 11:03am
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        Still no pressure? there's at least 100 posts to kindly remind you to review TF10s 
   
   
  Quote: 





> 3/31/11 at 8:23pm
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        Yes, much longer than anyone would have predicted.
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 1/29/11 at 10:03pm
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        1. It should be on a clock! UE900, the succesor to TF10, already came out...
        2. It is old and common, which makes it more important to have in your review, since many wouldcompare other IEMs to these. Yes, TF10s have alot of review out there but nothing like this.
        3. Do you need a custom molded pair with silver cables like lune/acrete/chris_self? Maybe we can work something out here
   
  Quote: 





> Posted 4/20/12 at 6:11pm
> Quote:
> 
> 
> ...


 
        Some more hope...but still 6 months have passed since this post T.T
   
   
  This might seem like an angry post, but really I'm just concerned and a little dissapointed. And sorry if I do sound disrespectful, I mean no harm :|
   
  Thanks for making something wonderful like this. I do appreciate all your hard work.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pmap said:


> Have you heard the Xears XPA2 yet? I'm beginning to think they'd be quite worth even the 150 € RRP, not to mention the 'code' price.


 
   
  Haven't heard any new Xears in the past year and a half or so. 
   
  Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *lukaleo* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> This might seem like an angry post, but really I'm just concerned and a little dissapointed. And sorry if I do sound disrespectful, I mean no harm :|
> 
> Thanks for making something wonderful like this. I do appreciate all your hard work.


 
   
  If I had an unlimited amount of free time to dedicate to Head-Fi, I would have covered the TF10 long ago.


----------



## bhima

Just want to say thanks to Joker for this amazing thread. It has single-handedly renewed my audiophile interests!


----------



## ljokerl

Added Brainwavz M5
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A73) Brainwavz M5*
> 
> 
> Added Oct 2012
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





bhima said:


> Just want to say thanks to Joker for this amazing thread. It has single-handedly renewed my audiophile interests!


----------



## freemini

How do the EPH-100 and the X10i's compare? I'm concerned about problems with the EPH-100, their thread has some people saying one of the drivers fail due to moisture and/or condensation (which would happen quite often here in Norway). They are cheaper though, but lack the inline controls. Forgot to mention I listen to rock and heavy metal most of the time.


----------



## rickdohc

Those M5 are a very good deal at that price, i am gonna try them out.  Thanks for the Review Joker!!!
   
   
  Question, i got a FXD80 (and 70, but i know you have not heard the 70's), do you think the Tf10 would be a modert, big, huge or a sidegrade over the 80's? i want a big upgrade from those 80's,  big enough to be blown away.   
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




   i like bass, but if it sacrifices the mids, highs clarity and detail of the 80's its a big No.
   
   I know that the 80's are not the best in those aspects but i looking for something even better, good enough to been blown away for $200, like just plug them on my ears go like "_sweet lord, how didnt i buy these before!!_"


----------



## djvkool

I agree with the M5, purchased it 2 weeks ago and I am not able to put it down since then, until today, but thats because I have just receive my R1...


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> I agree with the M5, purchased it 2 weeks ago and I am not able to put it down since then, until today, but thats because I have just receive my R1...


 
  could you post some early impressions? and how are the R1 compared to the M5?


----------



## Sycho

Reading that review about the M5, I'm feeling even more buyer's remorse getting these R1s.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





sycho said:


> Reading that review about the M5, I'm feeling even more buyer's remorse getting these R1s.


 
  hah, wait until you listen to the CKM500


----------



## funsound

How are the mtpc compared to the pfe232? I'm planning to downgrade from my pre because I need a straight down iem and want something not significantly worse thanthe pfe232.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





freemini said:


> How do the EPH-100 and the X10i's compare? I'm concerned about problems with the EPH-100, their thread has some people saying one of the drivers fail due to moisture and/or condensation (which would happen quite often here in Norway). They are cheaper though, but lack the inline controls. Forgot to mention I listen to rock and heavy metal most of the time.


 
   
  They are similarly warm and bass-heavy but the EPH-100 will have a fuller, more fleshed-out note presentation, a smoother top end, and a less forward overall sound. The X10 is on the intimate side but the EPH-100 is rather well-rounded. 
   
  Quote: 





rickdohc said:


> Those M5 are a very good deal at that price, i am gonna try them out.  Thanks for the Review Joker!!!
> 
> 
> Question, i got a FXD80 (and 70, but i know you have not heard the 70's), do you think the Tf10 would be a modert, big, huge or a sidegrade over the 80's? i want a big upgrade from those 80's,  big enough to be blown away.
> ...


 
   
  The TF10 would be a sidegrade or mild upgrade over the FXD80. I don't think you will be blown away. Neither has great midrange presence so I wouldn't worry about that but if you are expecting a great upgrade over the FXD80 for <$200 you'll likely be disappointed, unless of course you didn't like the FXD80's sound signature in the first place. 
   
  Quote: 





djvkool said:


> I agree with the M5, purchased it 2 weeks ago and I am not able to put it down since then, until today, but thats because I have just receive my R1...


 
   




   
  I'm finding it more difficult to get excited about entry-level stuff these days but the M5 does belong in the best-under-$40 club. 
   
  Quote: 





funsound said:


> How are the mtpc compared to the pfe232? I'm planning to downgrade from my pre because I need a straight down iem and want something not significantly worse thanthe pfe232.


 
   
  It won't be as as clear, crisp, or detailed and generally will have more bass and less treble. Not a great signature match for the PFE232 IMO - I would rather save some $$ get a JVC FXD80, personally.


----------



## AstralStorm

Here's a great question: I'd love an IEM that has RE272 response, but bit (not a lot, mind you) more bass, without the hardening cable issue.
   
  Theirs is the only signature that almost matched my ears' in shallow insertion.
  RE272 only had slight 2k boost and 3k dip, combined with minor super high end shelf, but no rolloff. Great package sound-wise, but not usability-wise.
  (In very deep insertion, into the second ear canal bend, TWFK Brainwavz B2 works well - with too much bass instead and slight 5k boost. Bit rough in the midrange and bass due to some distortion. This obviously requires long foams, currently Comply P Slim.)
   
  Alternatively, someone willing to properly recable my older RE272 with some reasonable cable - it seems no small feat and the cable is broken near the earpiece.


----------



## rickdohc

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The TF10 would be a sidegrade or mild upgrade over the FXD80. I don't think you will be blown away. Neither has great midrange presence so I wouldn't worry about that but if you are expecting a great upgrade over the FXD80 for <$200 you'll likely be disappointed, unless of course you didn't like the FXD80's sound signature in the first place.


 
   

 Thanks Joker, so it seems like a No and better save my money for now.  yes, i like the sound signature, i want something with a bigger sound and better mids but with a very good bass so i dont miss the fun whe i need that bass pounding my ears.   Seems like a need to go upper to the 300 tier?


----------



## nijohc

wow........
  You put great effort putting these information together.
  Great job.


----------



## SmrkngRvng

I was redirected here from Doc Holliday, I had some questions about IEMs that I was hoping you can help me with. 
   
  From reading through your Reviews a few sets of IEMs have caught my eyes, 
   
  Monster Turbine Pro Coppers
  HiFiMan RE272's
  Westone 2's
   
  I listen to a lot of different types of music, but the majority of it is trance. I noticed that you gave the 272's and and the Westone's very hight SQ ratings which is what drew me to them, but I'm worried that they might not be as great for the type of music I listen to (not that I want blasting base or anything, just something that is great for listening to everything).
   
  Doc Holliday thought that I might like the UE TF10's and after reading this: ( http://www.head-fi.org/products/monster-turbine-pro-copper-in-ear-headphones/reviews ) I think that the Copper's will be the best fit for me, but seeing as I have tried none of them out, I was hoping that you could help me make a decision. 
   
  Thanks!
   
  Justin


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Here's a great question: I'd love an IEM that has RE272 response, but bit (not a lot, mind you) more bass, without the hardening cable issue.
> 
> Theirs is the only signature that almost matched my ears' in shallow insertion.
> RE272 only had slight 2k boost and 3k dip, combined with minor super high end shelf, but no rolloff. Great package sound-wise, but not usability-wise.
> ...


 
   
  I would love that IEMs as well. Unfortunately I haven't found it yet.
   
  Regarding recabling, this seems like it might be an ideal option for the 272 assuming it's possible to get into those shells: http://www.head-fi.org/t/601360/universals-modded-with-removable-cables-fischer-audio-dba-02-brainwavz-b2-um3x-sleek-audio 
    
   
  Quote:


rickdohc said:


> Thanks Joker, so it seems like a No and better save my money for now.  yes, i like the sound signature, i want something with a bigger sound and better mids but with a very good bass so i dont miss the fun whe i need that bass pounding my ears.   Seems like a need to go upper to the 300 tier?


 
   
  $300 doesn't open up that many possibilities compared to $200. I still think I'd go for the GR07 in that price range. Might as well shoot for $400 and get a mid-level custom like the Alclair Reference for a bigger step up from the FXD80.
   
  Quote: 





nijohc said:


> wow........
> You put great effort putting these information together.
> Great job.


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  Quote: 





smrkngrvng said:


> I was redirected here from Doc Holliday, I had some questions about IEMs that I was hoping you can help me with.
> 
> From reading through your Reviews a few sets of IEMs have caught my eyes,
> 
> ...


 
   
  It really depends on how you like to hear your music. I think the general assumption is that a somewhat v-shaped signature (or at the very least some enhanced bass) would work better for electronic music but that may not be true for everyone. Personally I think that this is more true in reverse - sometimes a not-too-great earphone with a v-shaped signature tends to sound better with EDM than other genres (saw this recently with the JVC FX101, JVC FX40, and even JVC FXD80).
   
  I certainly wouldn't go for the RE272 or Westone 2 unless you already know that a balanced sound is what you're after. The TF10 and Coppers are safer choices. I don't recommend the Copper very often these days because I feel that there are some better values out there - the VSonic GR07, JVC FXT90, and Yamaha EPH-100, for example. I don't know what your price limit is but if you're looking at the coppers I am sure you can afford the FXT90 or EPH-100, which are slightly better performers in my book and provide plentiful bass. The TF10 is also a good choice if you're not paying more than $150-200 and think you will be able to get along with its fit. I would still go for the JVCs or Yamahas, personally.


----------



## lilboozy

Joker right now I have the skullcandy smokin bud (it's complicated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) and I'm thinking about buying the she3580. How much of an improvement should I expect; better bass quality/quantity, better mids and better treble? BTW I listen to rap/dubstep


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Joker right now I have the skullcandy smokin bud (it's complicated
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Well, the Smokin but doesn't really do anything right as far as I'm concerned so I would say the SHE3580 is a big improvement. Don't make the mistake of equating quantity with quality - the Smokin buds have good bass presence but poor quality. If you like a ridiculous amount of bass the JVC FX101 might be a better fit for you than the SHE3580.


----------



## garcsa

hi there, have anybody tried the "new" meelec m6 clear? is it really new or same as that from 2009  (driver, housing, cable etc)  ?
  thanx!


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> hi there, have anybody tried the "new" meelec m6 clear? is it really new or same as that from 2009  (driver, housing, cable etc)  ?
> thanx!


 
  Its basically the same, all colors have the same drivers, build quality etc, I dont think they changed anything..You can just mail @ support@meelec.com to just confirm it though


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Its basically the same, all colors have the same drivers, build quality etc, I dont think they changed anything..You can just mail @ support@meelec.com to just confirm it though


 
  thanx, the mail was sent.


----------



## SmrkngRvng

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would love that IEMs as well. Unfortunately I haven't found it yet.
> 
> Regarding recabling, this seems like it might be an ideal option for the 272 assuming it's possible to get into those shells: http://www.head-fi.org/t/601360/universals-modded-with-removable-cables-fischer-audio-dba-02-brainwavz-b2-um3x-sleek-audio
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks for the recommendations! I really like the Yamaha's and am looking to buy them, but because I live in Canada it is extremely difficult. I haven't been able to find anybody who is selling new ones in Canada, including Yamaha! If anyone has any suggestions on where to look I'd really appreciate it. Thanks!


----------



## fuzzyash

Quote: 





smrkngrvng said:


> Thanks for the recommendations! I really like the Yamaha's and am looking to buy them, but because I live in Canada it is extremely difficult. I haven't been able to find anybody who is selling new ones in Canada, including Yamaha! If anyone has any suggestions on where to look I'd really appreciate it. Thanks!


 
  i recommend the vsonic gr07
  check out headphone bar- shipping is 1 cent, with a reasonable price, and shipping across the country took me around 4 days


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Regarding recabling, this seems like it might be an ideal option for the 272 assuming it's possible to get into those shells: http://www.head-fi.org/t/601360/universals-modded-with-removable-cables-fischer-audio-dba-02-brainwavz-b2-um3x-sleek-audio


 
  Yes, it's in fact trivial - rotate the long "strain relief" (more like strain creator) stem until the side of the case loosens. I've figured that out yesterday - now I need a good cable for not so unreasonable price.. Paying $40 for Westone cable is a bit ridiculous, even if it's a great cable.
  (Note that RE272 is $250 new.)
   
  Extra fun: it appears that RE272 is more tunable than it seems - not only the filter, but also some vents covered with paper on the back of the microdriver... and the visible vent on the back is connected to the driver chamber through another pinhole vent, also covered with paper.
  Just removing the back of the case increases bass, notably. Doesn't really sound like anything else detrimental happened - the driver seems to be fit for a custom IEM remake.
   
  Apparently the vent filter controls 2.5k resonance. Perhaps could be made slightly more absorptive than paper... Covering all the vents with polymer clay (PVC base) converts it into something almost V-shaped, weird loundess-like signature. Covering all but one works extremely well, better than original paper.
   
  With the front filter on, two uncovered vents work bit better - the result is slightly improved over the filterless variant with some resonant peak smoothed out.
  (All testing done with Hifiman's weird shaped white silicone biflange.)
   
  The case definitely chokes the driver, dropping deep bass and also creates some extra high frequency resonance. Needs replacement with something akin to what FutureSonics Ear Monitors use. (special absorptive material lining, less resonant casing)


----------



## ayaflo

Sony mh1c ? 
   
   
  clieos review : 
   
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/632892/review-sony-mh1-the-best-kept-secret
   
   
  only 30 dollars and - 
   
  rated rather high in SQ


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ayaflo said:


> Sony mh1c ?
> 
> 
> clieos review :
> ...


 

 They can be found for $20 here: http://www.amazon.com/Sony-Livesound-Headphones-Earphones-Head-sets/dp/B008CCSD7K


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





smrkngrvng said:


> Thanks for the recommendations! I really like the Yamaha's and am looking to buy them, but because I live in Canada it is extremely difficult. I haven't been able to find anybody who is selling new ones in Canada, including Yamaha! If anyone has any suggestions on where to look I'd really appreciate it. Thanks!


 
   
  I would ask in the long EPH-100 thread - I'm sure someone from Canada has already found the best way to obtain them. 
   
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Yes, it's in fact trivial - rotate the long "strain relief" (more like strain creator) stem until the side of the case loosens. I've figured that out yesterday - now I need a good cable for not so unreasonable price.. Paying $40 for Westone cable is a bit ridiculous, even if it's a great cable.
> (Note that RE272 is $250 new.)


 
   
  Using a cheap IEM as a cable donor can be the way to go. My apple dual-driver is now using a MEElec cable with mic from a ~$6 M2P. If you're not going to make it detachable you can find a great Westone-style twisted cable on the Rock-It Sounds R-11 for $25. 
   
  Quote: 





ayaflo said:


> Sony mh1c ?


 
   
  Never heard them.


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Its basically the same, all colors have the same drivers, build quality etc, I dont think they changed anything..You can just mail @ support@meelec.com to just confirm it though


 
  answer received, Mike says: "[size=14.545454025268555px]The drivers have not been changed; however, we started matching them more closely this year and a new nozzle filter was introduced in the summer to increase sweat resistance. This changed the performance very slightly but the emphasis has always been made on keeping the sound as close to the previous-gen M6 as possible as our customers are generally very happy with the way the M6 sounds for the cost"[/size]


----------



## nehcrow

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I posted my brief thoughts on the earpods here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/629283/mini-review-thoughts-on-apple-earpods-as-compared-to-the-old-ibuds
> 
> Technically Earpods are not IEMs since there is no seal between the housing and ear canal so I didn't add them to this thread.
> 
> I've only heard the AF78 briefly at a show. It was bass-heavy and not all that coherent and didn't compete well with the GR07 I'd brought. I am not sure if that was the final tuning or not but at this point I wouldn't blindly count on it being a GR07 competitor.


 
  Oh ok, so they are bass-heavy... didn't know that. I actually tend to like that over the rather bright DBA-02/B2
 Do they compete with the likes of Atrio MG7's or similar
  In other words, do they compare with other models which have a strong bass response?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Oh ok, so they are bass-heavy... didn't know that. I actually tend to like that over the rather bright DBA-02/B2
> Do they compete with the likes of Atrio MG7's or similar
> In other words, do they compare with other models which have a strong bass response?


 
   
  I only had a GR07 and UM Miracle with me to compare. If I had to guess I would say that the AF78 tuning I heard falls below the MG7 but again I did not spend long enough with them to have a complete picture.


----------



## Killerapist

Hey guys, I have a question (I'm a noob)
   
  Well you know how the old iPod earbuds that come in the box always blow out or lose its bass after ~3 months of adequate use? Does that happen with higher-end earbuds? Unless it's the cable I'd understand... But, for example, if listening to some Etymotics or Triple.Fi 10s or Westone universals at loud volumes all the time, will they "blowout?" I don't know much about earbuds right now, but I assume the dynamic microspeaker(?) blows out, but balanced armature speakers don't have that tendency because... they're balanced armatures? 
   
  It's probably confusing and the terminology is watered down, but if anyone could give me advice it'd be greatly appreciated! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Reason being I'm ordering customs soon as my first high-end pair of IEMs


----------



## atomikn00b

I just wanted to say.
  This thread is soo informative.
   
  I'll continue to anticipate and wait for a review on the Sony XB90ex, Sony XBA-3, and Brainwavz R1.


----------



## suman134

m5 looks good .


----------



## AnnonTheMouse

I'm interested to see what you think of the Sennheiser ie60's. I just bought them, and I love the sound, but I hate the isolation, or lack thereof. I'm going to try some new tips, but coming from klipsch x10's which I just had stolen; I miss the isolation the most.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





killerapist said:


> Hey guys, I have a question (I'm a noob)
> 
> Well you know how the old iPod earbuds that come in the box always blow out or lose its bass after ~3 months of adequate use? Does that happen with higher-end earbuds? Unless it's the cable I'd understand... But, for example, if listening to some Etymotics or Triple.Fi 10s or Westone universals at loud volumes all the time, will they "blowout?" I don't know much about earbuds right now, but I assume the dynamic microspeaker(?) blows out, but balanced armature speakers don't have that tendency because... they're balanced armatures?
> 
> ...


 
   
  High-end earphones can be overdriven just like any other sets. Being driven to the point of full excursion/clipping can definitely damage drivers but I am not sure if the balanced armatures are mechanically less susceptible to wear or more when the limit is reached. Now, where the limit is will depend on the set in question -  I am sure some sets will tolerate loud volume much better (and some just won't go all that loud). 
   
  I feel like this needs a hearing safety plug so here's some good reading: http://www.sciencedaily.com/videos/2007/0610-mp3_players_how_loud_is_too_loud.htm
   
  Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> I just wanted to say.
> This thread is soo informative.
> 
> I'll continue to anticipate and wait for a review on the Sony XB90ex, Sony XBA-3, and Brainwavz R1.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> m5 looks good .


 
   
  Sounds good too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





annonthemouse said:


> I'm interested to see what you think of the Sennheiser ie60's. I just bought them, and I love the sound, but I hate the isolation, or lack thereof. I'm going to try some new tips, but coming from klipsch x10's which I just had stolen; I miss the isolation the most.


 
   
  I have an IE6 here. It's pretty good and very comfortable but isolation is mediocre as with all of the Sennheiser IEs. If the IE60 is anything like my IE6, you would probably like the Yamaha EPH-100 - better sound quality and better isolation with a similarly warm sound and plentiful bass.


----------



## chipstjuven

how is the bass quantity on RE-262 compared to EPH-100? I think the bass on the EPH-100 is just perfect, but now I'm looking for a nice, spacious sounding IEM to go with my E11


----------



## putente

Quote: 





chipstjuven said:


> how is the bass quantity on RE-262 compared to EPH-100? I think the bass on the EPH-100 is just perfect, but now I'm looking for a nice, spacious sounding IEM to go with my E11


 
   
   
  Compared to the EPH-100, the RE-262 are bass light. They can perform very well with the bass boost from a portable amp, though. The main advantage of the RE-262 over the EPH-100 are the mids, highs and soundstage. For bass alone, the EPH-100 are superior... I own both, and they complement each other very well!


----------



## chipstjuven

Quote: 





putente said:


> Compared to the EPH-100, the RE-262 are bass light. They can perform very well with the bass boost from a portable amp, though. The main advantage of the RE-262 over the EPH-100 are the mids, highs and soundstage. For bass alone, the EPH-100 are superior... I own both, and they complement each other very well!


 
  ok, thanks. I might get them and see if they like the bass boost on the E11 then


----------



## AlBorland

First off, thank you for these reviews, this is an incredibly informative post.  I'm looking to bust out of the bottom of the barrel IEMs and try to move into some mid-level.  I considered posting this question in the recommendations thread, but it doesn't seem as though anyone responds there. 
   
  With that said, I currently have Sennheiser cx55s (mostly use when mowing the lawn/walking), meelectronic M16P (too uncomfortable to wear), and Audio Technica CKM50 with comply tips (very comfortable, my go to IEMs for now).  Only headphones I have are HD555's, which I just recently foam modded and like the less muddled bass (by far my favorite to listen with).
   
  I listen to a wide range of music: Arcade Fire, Arctic Monkeys, Macklemore, Cold War Kids, Grouplove, The National, Mumford & Sons.
   
  I'm looking to spend <$150 and hoping to find something comfortable (small ear canals), decently balanced, solid but non-muddled bass, with plenty of clarity in mids/highs.  Based on your reviews, these are what I have narrowed it down to (*bold* are top choices):
  [size=medium] *Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO* ($99) - $59 on head-direct [/size]
 [size=medium] *MEElectronics A151* ($100) - $50 on amazon[/size]
 [size=medium] Shure SE215 ($100)[/size]
 [size=medium] HiSoundAudio Crystal ($100)[/size]
 [size=medium] *VSonic GR06 ($65)*[/size]
 [size=medium] *HiFiMan RE262 ($150)*[/size]
 [size=medium] *Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99 ($150)*[/size]
 [size=medium] JVC HA-FXD80($105) - $75 on amazon[/size]

   
  Any recommendations from anyone based on the above list and music selection?
  Also, do many IEMs go on sale around Black Friday?  If so, I'd assume it'd be best for me to wait a few weeks till then.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alborland said:


> First off, thank you for these reviews, this is an incredibly informative post.  I'm looking to bust out of the bottom of the barrel IEMs and try to move into some mid-level.  I considered posting this question in the recommendations thread, but it doesn't seem as though anyone responds there.
> 
> With that said, I currently have Sennheiser cx55s (mostly use when mowing the lawn/walking), meelectronic M16P (too uncomfortable to wear), and Audio Technica CKM50 with comply tips (very comfortable, my go to IEMs for now).  Only headphones I have are HD555's, which I just recently foam modded and like the less muddled bass (by far my favorite to listen with).
> 
> ...


 
   
  Out of those I would probably try the GR06 to see if you can get along with the fit. It's not the clearest earphone out there but not bad for the asking price and it makes up for it in other ways. Also, that's a great price for the RE-ZERO but it might be a bit bass-lean compared to the options listed. You can also get the MEElec A161P <$100, which is a pretty big improvement on the A151 IMO. Better bass and better clarity, among other improvements. It's reviewed in this thread as the Fischer Audio SBA-03. 
   
  Black Friday - earphone solutions usually has a coupon code applicable to most items on their site. I am sure MEElec will have some promotions as well. The Chinese brands - unlikely.


----------



## scootsit

The GR04 is still about $50 on ebay and at lendmeurears.com, and is one model up from the GR06


----------



## AlBorland

Thank you both for the input, really appreciate it.


----------



## AstralStorm

Heh, I need to start an IEM dissection thread. I'll be using Brainwavz M2 as the cable donor for RE272. (Since they're not that great sounding anyway and happen to have a superb cable and a nice case that might be useful.)
   
  Now I'm also fixing GR07s, which have clogged filters in their shell. I've removed the drivers correctly, they even have a nice sparse grille and put them in the M2's case's front (to attach the back, I'd have to unsolder the cable).
   
  It seems they still sound like GR07, lighter and more controlled than original R02 drivers. However, it seems I'd have to get a deeper fit, so this case is not that good for them. They apparently have been tuned for 0.5 cm deeper fit than possible in the original case.
  M2's half-case *can* go that deep with RE272's long silicone biflanges, but it's very unpleasant, stretching the ear canal a lot.
  Alternatively, soft shorter silicone biflange (UE? It's very old and for 5mm) works well. Much better than anything that's attachable to original VSonic case.
   
  Funny thing though, the 6k resonance is all case resonance in GR07, not a driver resonance. There's not even a trace of it in those configurations.
  I'll try to print something nice for it and RE272 on a 3D printer. Might happen to be black, red, yellow or pink in color, ABS. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 (I'll find a UV filter lacquer and apply that on top, obviously.)
  The tricky part will be sourcing the metal grille. I might do a secondary hack and print it onto the M2 aluminum case instead, which has an integral grille of the same variety.
   
  (I also know now why Brainwavz doesn't use this case - aside from being expensive, oce the driver is in there's no way to remove it.)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> I'll try to print something nice for it and RE272 on a 3D printer. Might happen to be black, red, yellow or pink in color, ABS.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've been wondering myself whether it's already possible to print custom eartips with a 3-D printer and a 3-D scan of the ear. If not, it probably will be very soon. Once more audiologists start using 3-D scans in place of conventional molds you could just take a copy of the scan with you after you get impressions taken


----------



## jhelsas

Well, I pulled the trigger for the B2, It should be arriving in ~ 2 weeks.
  I hope to have done a good choice, got it by 114€ shipped.
   
  I would like to thank everyone, specialy ljokerl and AstralStorm for their help.


----------



## Sycho

I decided to purchase the Brainwavz B2. I have to say, it sounds really nice. Pretty revealing and not as enjoyable with the comply foams, and slight of that with the silicone tips it comes with, but it's much much better than the R1s I also recently got. Nothing is overpowering, but I do notice a bit more focus on the highs. It has a bit of sibilance on some of the tracks I mentioned, but it is not even close to being as bad as the Image S4s, one thing I appreciate about these. There is a lot of depth in these headphones, very spacious (though not as compared to the HD 598 for obvious reasons), but more than the ATH-M50s. I kind of have to have the mood to listen to the music to enjoy it completely, but when that happens, it's like I'm listening to that type of music with the proper headphones. They sound AMAZING in instrumental tracks due to their great positioning, non-distorted frequency ranges, a good focus on highs, S4-level bass with a wider presentation, and great clarity. I think I enjoy these more than my ATH-M50s to be honest. These tips don't give me a perfect fit, so I might try to find some Shure olive tips to replace these, but they aren't bad. It took me a few hours to find a way to fully enjoy different genres of music I listened to, and settled that to really enjoy, I have to be ready to enjoy the music, not focus on the flaws I listen to. Thanks for the review, they really convinced me to purchase them, and I have no regrets purchasing these with exception of their build quality.


----------



## atomikn00b

a friend of mine is looking for what he describes as an fx40 with thicker, fuller, and slightly more prominent mids on a sub $50 budget?
  improvement in technical ability is a plus but he's just looking for that overall sound signature he described.
 any recommendations?
   
  how do the sony mh1c's and brainwavz r1 and m5 compare?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> a friend of mine is looking for what he describes as an fx40 with thicker, fuller, and slightly more prominent mids on a sub $50 budget?
> improvement in technical ability is a plus but he's just looking for that overall sound signature he described.
> any recommendations?
> 
> how do the sony mh1c's and brainwavz r1 and m5 compare?


 
  if he can go for $60, then the CKM500, if not then maybe the FX31


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> a friend of mine is looking for what he describes as an fx40 with thicker, fuller, and slightly more prominent mids on a sub $50 budget?
> improvement in technical ability is a plus but he's just looking for that overall sound signature he described.
> any recommendations?
> 
> how do the sony mh1c's and brainwavz r1 and m5 compare?


 
   
  The M5 is pretty much the opposite of the FX40, with fleshed-out bass and forward mids. For a fuller and slightly less v-shaped sound than the FX40 I'd try the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition.


----------



## kais0r

@ljokerl:
  Hey, I'm looking for new In-Ears because my Brainwavz M1 are broken. Since I want to have more highs (I used the following Rockbox EQ settings on my M1: 150: +2, 800: -2, 4000: +6), I tried the M4. They are pretty nice, but the bass is boomy sometimes, for my music (metal, rock) I rather like dry bass which helps hearing the bass lines. Furthermore the mids were recessed a bit too much, so guitar riffs sounds shallow sometimes and were in the background. But the highs of the M4 were very good, detailed enough for me, yet not aggressive or too much in the foreground.
  You have a recommendation for me? You think the M5 could be what I'm looking for?
  Sorry for my english.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kais0r said:


> @ljokerl:
> Hey, I'm looking for new In-Ears because my Brainwavz M1 are broken. Since I want to have more highs (I used the following Rockbox EQ settings on my M1: 150: +2, 800: -2, 4000: +6), I tried the M4. They are pretty nice, but the bass is boomy sometimes, for my music (metal, rock) I rather like dry bass which helps hearing the bass lines. Furthermore the mids were recessed a bit too much, so guitar riffs sounds shallow sometimes and were in the background. But the highs of the M4 were very good, detailed enough for me, yet not aggressive or too much in the foreground.
> You have a recommendation for me? You think the M5 could be what I'm looking for?
> Sorry for my english.


 
   
  I don't think the M5 is what you want - it tends to underemphasize treble and has tons of bass compared to the M1. Not sure what your price range is and I've never heard the M4 but I think you'd enjoy something a bit more balanced, maybe a Maximo iM-590 or Xears XR120 Pro. If your budget goes up above $50, maybe a VSonic GR06, Rock-It Sounds R-30, Etymotic MC5, or MEElec A161P/Fischer SBA-03. The Rock-It Sounds has slightly more laid-back treble compared to the others but the midrange is nice and forward and it's a surprisingly detailed earphone.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the new Ultimate Ears UE 900 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1C19) Ultimate Ears UE 900*
> 
> 
> Added Oct 2012
> ...


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the new Ultimate Ears UE 900


 
  awsome!


----------



## eyal1983

How is the Clarity of the PFE 232 compared to that of the GR07 ?


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the new Ultimate Ears UE 900


 
   
  Very nice review and love the comparisons.  One of your best!


----------



## tomscy2000

Tsk tsk... you reviewed the UE900 before the TF10...


----------



## heart banger-97

great as I expected
   
  I'm waiting to see your impression on FitEar ToGo 334 and maybe heir audio 4ai 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, and I think many body are waiting too


----------



## version6

First of all.. thank you Joker for this amazing work! I am a newbie to the IEM appreciation world and am taking my first tentative steps. Based on what I have learnt from you, here is my query. 
   
  I have a Soundmagic E30 for the past 1 year and am looking to upgrade my IEM within 100$. Preferred Source - Amazon US. Primary use is with ipod in Gym and Travelling. I listen to mainly Rock and Metal  eg - Floyd and Opeth. 
   
  I find the E30 to be pretty good but wish to have more kick in the guitar riffs. just dosent get me headbanging!  I am guessing this means that I should be looking for more forward mids. Is this correct?
   
  I am happy with the bass of the E30. I also have a Senn cx300 and find the bass to be bloated and muddy.
   
  Obviously would like good definition and soundstaging. 
   
  Based on your reviews, I have shortlisted the  following IEMS in order of preference . Kindly advice which one would be the best fit for me. Also keep in mind that  it should survive the Gym.
   
  1. JVC HA-FXT90 - Trying to get it from a friend travelling to Japan - 90$ there. 
  2. Creative Aurvana 3 - 100$ on Amazon. looks like the one ill get if 1 and 3 don't work out
  3. UE TF10 - Only if it comes down to 99$ for black friday. But am concerned abt the sound signature and the built quality for gym use. 
  4. Vsonic GR06  
  5. Shure SE215
   
  Kindly give your views and also if I should consider any other models.
   
  Thanks again.


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





version6 said:


> I have a Soundmagic E30 for the past 1 year and am looking to upgrade my IEM within 100$. Preferred Source - Amazon US. Primary use is with ipod in Gym and Travelling. I listen to mainly Rock and Metal  eg - Floyd and Opeth.
> 
> I find the E30 to be pretty good but wish to have more kick in the guitar riffs. just dosent get me headbanging!  I am guessing this means that I should be looking for more forward mids. Is this correct?


 
   
  I would add the Meelec A161P and Vsonic GR04pro to the list.  Both have very good distortion guitars in your budget.


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





version6 said:


> First of all.. thank you Joker for this amazing work! I am a newbie to the IEM appreciation world and am taking my first tentative steps. Based on what I have learnt from you, here is my query.
> 
> I have a Soundmagic E30 for the past 1 year and am looking to upgrade my IEM within 100$. Preferred Source - Amazon US. Primary use is with ipod in Gym and Travelling. I listen to mainly Rock and Metal  eg - Floyd and Opeth.
> 
> ...


 
  TF10 is definitely not for gym usage, it is not durable enough, is not comfortable and doesnt isolate much (exceptions that you reshell it for 100-150$ or buy comply T400 tips).
   
  Rockit R-50 might serve the purpose better to you, it has good detailing in mids, strong performers in treble, bass less in quantity but good in depth, sounstage is great in both depth and height, vocals sound so lively. Cable is durable and so is the IEM, might serve well for gym usage. Fit, comfort, isolation are all good..
   
  A161p might also suit, but Im not sure if it suits well for gym usage.
   
  Even though, I highly suggest not using expensive IEMs for gym usage, Buy a Meelectronics M6, use it for gym .Its great in fit, comfort, durability, isolation, has a warm V-shaped signature  though SQ isnt its strength. And use TF10 or other that youre gonna buy for home usage..


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> TF10 is definitely not for gym usage, it is not durable enough, is not comfortable and doesnt isolate much (exceptions that you reshell it for 100-150$ or buy comply T400 tips).
> 
> Rockit R-50 might serve the purpose better to you, it has good detailing in mids, strong performers in treble, bass less in quantity but good in depth, sounstage is great in both depth and height, vocals sound so lively. Cable is durable and so is the IEM, might serve well for gym usage. Fit, comfort, isolation are all good..
> 
> ...


 
  +1 for the r-50 if you want to love the guitars


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> awsome!


 
  Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> great as I expected


 
  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Very nice review and love the comparisons.  One of your best!


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Tsk tsk... you reviewed the UE900 before the TF10...


 
   
  Newer, more interesting, fewer other reviews, fits my ears much better. I have lots of excuses 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> How is the Clarity of the PFE 232 compared to that of the GR07 ?


 
   
  The PFE232 is pretty similar in clarity and overall signature (with the black filter) but has better texturing/microdetail than the GR07 IMO. 
    
  Quote:


version6 said:


> First of all.. thank you Joker for this amazing work! I am a newbie to the IEM appreciation world and am taking my first tentative steps. Based on what I have learnt from you, here is my query.
> 
> I have a Soundmagic E30 for the past 1 year and am looking to upgrade my IEM within 100$. Preferred Source - Amazon US. Primary use is with ipod in Gym and Travelling. I listen to mainly Rock and Metal  eg - Floyd and Opeth.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Haven't heard the GR04 but the GR06 has forward mids and does guitars pretty well. Also not very expensive to replace if gym use kills it. The FXT90 is noticeably bassier, though its sound is quite lively and it's not bloated like the CX300. The TF10 is somewhat mid-recessed, doesn't sound like that's what you want.


----------



## mosshorn

Great UE900 review, Joker. I'm still deciding between keeping my SM3's, going for those, and just getting from 1964 V3's .
   
  First world problems


----------



## eyal1983

PFE232 vs Etymotic Research ER-4S
which has better details for vocals (singers breath- for example) ?


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





version6 said:


> First of all.. thank you Joker for this amazing work! I am a newbie to the IEM appreciation world and am taking my first tentative steps. Based on what I have learnt from you, here is my query.
> 
> I have a Soundmagic E30 for the past 1 year and am looking to upgrade my IEM within 100$. Preferred Source - Amazon US. Primary use is with ipod in Gym and Travelling. I listen to mainly Rock and Metal  eg - Floyd and Opeth.
> 
> ...


 
  I also strongly suggest the vsonic GR04 Flagship. It has slightly forward mids but is still pretty versatile, it's a good upgrade to the e30 for what you want and has been extensicely tested from me with rock and metal. I've been working out with it for a while and it is holding up nicely. The meelec A161P can also really get your head banging but the cable doesn't strike like one that can survive workouts.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've been wondering myself whether it's already possible to print custom eartips with a 3-D printer and a 3-D scan of the ear. If not, it probably will be very soon. Once more audiologists start using 3-D scans in place of conventional molds you could just take a copy of the scan with you after you get impressions taken


 
  It's possible, but most good 3D printers are relatively expensive and limited in choice of materials. You'd still have to smooth out the resulting printout as well, quite tricky.  Really, well done molding is often better than 3D printing.
   
  Since you can easily get positives in silicone (resilient, flexible, nonresonant, heavier) or PMMA (pretty hard, light, very good resonant properties) easily from a mold, why would you go with much worse ABS instead? (which requires UV protection, is slightly worse in resonance than acrylic, relatively soft)
  I'll only do that because I don't have a good enough ear impression right now.
   
  Of course ABS trumps cheaper PET casing or metal, except on durability. It's used in plenty of non-custom cases and instruments.
  I'm not sure how often PVC is used, likely rarely. PMMA = acrylic probably sees quite a bit of use in transparent cases and definitely in customs. I've never heard of anyone using polycarbonate though.
  Another interesting part is that I've never heard of anyone attempting a custom in a PMA, which is rubber-like. (think pleather)
   
  I do know that certain companies (UM for one) use UV hardened PMMA (as in, mixed with a photoinitiator) - that probably is done with a 3D scan combined with a UV laser-based 3D print. Very expensive material from what I was able to gather, but nearly perfect for the purpose. The main limitation is that it probably has to be at least translucent to UV - but you can apply acrylic lacquer to it easily.
   
  And if by 3D scans you meant a tomography or magnetic resonance scan... no, that's not going to happen any time soon. The machines are far too expensive.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

I really didn't expect you to review the UE900. Enjoyed reading it though.


----------



## rickdohc

Wow. One of your best reviews ever. Almost like reading two reviews at the same time (ue900 and tf10)

Whe only need a score for the tf10 and end of the story, seems like you would pick the ue900 over the tf10.


----------



## anoxy

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> PFE232 vs Etymotic Research ER-4S
> which has better details for vocals (singers breath- for example) ?


 
  I haven't even heard the PFE232 and I can already tell you the ER-4S wins in the details department.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mosshorn said:


> Great UE900 review, Joker. I'm still deciding between keeping my SM3's, going for those, and just getting from 1964 V3's .
> 
> First world problems


 
   
  UE900 is more accurate than the SM3, though not as warm, thick, or intimate. The V3 is somewhere between the two in signature. If you like a warm, musical sound I would go for the V3s. If you're looking for something flatter, especially through the lower mids and bass, perhaps the UE900 will suit you better. 
   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> PFE232 vs Etymotic Research ER-4S
> which has better details for vocals (singers breath- for example) ?


 
   
  Both have excellent detail retrieval. If you're looking for natural reproduction of vocals I would probably go for the ER4S just so you can be sure that enhanced bass won't get in the way (the PFE232 is a lot bassier).
   
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> And if by 3D scans you meant a tomography or magnetic resonance scan... no, that's not going to happen any time soon. The machines are far too expensive.


 
   
  I was thinking of something like the Lantos scanner: http://www.lantostechnologies.com/
   
  Only reason to use an already-available printer for custom tips/enclosures would be cost/convenience, though it seems like that's a ways down the line at this point.
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I really didn't expect you to review the UE900. Enjoyed reading it though.


 
   




   
  Quote: 





rickdohc said:


> Wow. One of your best reviews ever. Almost like reading two reviews at the same time (ue900 and tf10)
> Whe only need a score for the tf10 and end of the story, seems like you would pick the ue900 over the tf10.


 
   
  I would pick the UE900 over the TF10 9 out of 10 times. The one time I would go for the TF10 would be when I was listening to something like EDM and wanted a more lively, v-shaped sound. TF10 sound score would be somewhere in the Shure SE530 - Sony XBA-4 range on my scale.


----------



## Sycho

Do you have any recommendations on reducing the sibilance on the B2s? I feel that using the Comply foams kind of help reduce the slight sibilance when compared to the silicone tips it came with, but that could just be because of different factors. Would the Shure olive tips for the SE215 help reduce it a slight bit, yet offer a better seal compared to the silicone tips? I just don't like the extra sibilance the silicone tips add, and the lack of fullness and bass the comply foams offer.


----------



## wskl

Quote: 





sycho said:


> Do you have any recommendations on reducing the sibilance on the B2s? I feel that using the Comply foams kind of help reduce the slight sibilance when compared to the silicone tips it came with, but that could just be because of different factors. Would the Shure olive tips for the SE215 help reduce it a slight bit, yet offer a better seal compared to the silicone tips? I just don't like the extra sibilance the silicone tips add, and the lack of fullness and bass the comply foams offer.


 

 From my own experience, comply tips gave me a good seal, but the shure olives gave me a _great_ seal on the B2, but of course YMMV.


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





anoxy said:


> I haven't even heard the PFE232 and I can already tell you the ER-4S wins in the details department.


 
   
  Heck, the HF5s win in that department, and the vocals department.  So I wouldn't have any doubt that the ER4 would do better as well.  I haven't heard the ER4 though, so take my statements with a grain of salt


----------



## glac1er

Thanks for the review, ljokerl. i think you summed up the UE900 very well as ' the high-end earphone for the masses.'
  I think the UE900 is one of the best sounding universal IEM ever created for mainstream music, and for that reason alone I rank it above the SM3 and next to the ex1000. Still can't get over the delicious weighty meaty sound.


----------



## basslova

Got my SHE3590 (The 80 wasn't available). I am highly impressed. Good sub-bass and mid-bass while still sounding clean and the best part is that when you listen to music that isn't very bass heavy, they don't sound muffled. I also bought other budget models but they weren't as good.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sycho said:


> Do you have any recommendations on reducing the sibilance on the B2s? I feel that using the Comply foams kind of help reduce the slight sibilance when compared to the silicone tips it came with, but that could just be because of different factors. Would the Shure olive tips for the SE215 help reduce it a slight bit, yet offer a better seal compared to the silicone tips? I just don't like the extra sibilance the silicone tips add, and the lack of fullness and bass the comply foams offer.


 
   
  It will really depend on your ears. Personally, I got the best seal with the thicker silicone tips from Shure. You can always resort to a bit of EQ if a particular treble range is bothering you.
   
  Quote: 





glac1er said:


> Thanks for the review, ljokerl. i think you summed up the UE900 very well as ' the high-end earphone for the masses.'
> I think the UE900 is one of the best sounding universal IEM ever created for mainstream music, and for that reason alone I rank it above the SM3 and next to the ex1000. Still can't get over the delicious weighty meaty sound.


 
   
  Yep, they are good all-rounders and seem like they are tuned to be particularly inoffensive. Even my 128k mp3s and awful Megadeth remasters sound ok on them. 
   
   
  Quote: 





basslova said:


> Got my SHE3590 (The 80 wasn't available). I am highly impressed. Good sub-bass and mid-bass while still sounding clean and the best part is that when you listen to music that isn't very bass heavy, they don't sound muffled. I also bought other budget models but they weren't as good.


 
   
  Glad the 3590s were available. I've picked up a few budget IEMs in the past year but none have measured up to the SHE3580.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Even my 128k mp3s and awful Megadeth remasters sound ok on them.
> 
> 
> Glad the 3590s were available. I've picked up a few budget IEMs in the past year but none have measured up to the SHE3580.


 
  Is there a good Megadeth remaster?
   
  I've heard that the $20 Sony IEMs (according to ClieOS) represent a similar value. I'm considering checking them out.


----------



## Selenium

tomscy2000 said:


> Tsk tsk... you reviewed the UE900 before the TF10... :tongue_smile:




At this point I dont think that review will ever happen lol.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  Any comparison of UE900 to EPH-100 in bass(quantity, quality), mids, treble(quantity, quality), presentation, soundstage, instrument separation and overall?


----------



## wilzc

Still waiting for that TG334 review!!


----------



## djvkool

Superb review mate on UE900, after reading that, and TF10 being my favourite IEM of all time, made me want to rush out and buy UE900 -- better wait until the price drops to maybe $250, Amazon's Black Friday 2013 sale perhaps?


----------



## putente

*ljokerl*, how about a comparison between the UE 900 and the Westone 4?


----------



## Rednuht

wow, i really apreciated your work, especially your last review of UE900, exactly one of IEMs I'm going to buy, however, i cannot decide yet, have you ever listened to Heir Audio 4.Ai, It'd be best if you can show me even a little comparison between UE900 and 4.Ai. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Again, thank you so much for everying you've done so far


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Is there a good Megadeth remaster?


 
   
  Nope 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> Any comparison of UE900 to EPH-100 in bass(quantity, quality), mids, treble(quantity, quality), presentation, soundstage, instrument separation and overall?


 
   
  The EPH-100 is slightly bassier, especially mid-bass, but the UE900 is more detailed and textured. Both have no lower midrange recession but the EPH-100 also has pretty good upper midrange emphasis. Treble is more extended and natural on the UE900 IMO. The UE900 also has a wider presentation. Both have good soundstage depth. 
   
  Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Superb review mate on UE900, after reading that, and TF10 being my favourite IEM of all time, made me want to rush out and buy UE900 -- better wait until the price drops to maybe $250, Amazon's Black Friday 2013 sale perhaps?


 
   
  Might be a long wait... it took the TF10 three years to drop in price 
   
    
  Quote:


putente said:


> *ljokerl*, how about a comparison between the UE 900 and the Westone 4?


 
   
  I haven't heard the W4 in a while. From what I remember it had more a bit mid-bass, flatter mids, and slightly less relaxed treble. I never thought the W4 was lacking clarity but the UE900 can sound a touch veiled, especially with female vocals. 
   
  Quote: 





rednuht said:


> wow, i really apreciated your work, especially your last review of UE900, exactly one of IEMs I'm going to buy, however, i cannot decide yet, have you ever listened to Heir Audio 4.Ai, It'd be best if you can show me even a little comparison between UE900 and 4.Ai.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Have not heard the 4.Ai, sorry.


----------



## abhijollyguy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The EPH-100 is slightly bassier, especially mid-bass, but the UE900 is more detailed and textured. Both have no lower midrange recession but the EPH-100 also has pretty good upper midrange emphasis. Treble is more extended and natural on the UE900 IMO. The UE900 also has a wider presentation. Both have good soundstage depth.


 
   
  Thank you!


----------



## lvand

Hi Joker, you're doing an awesome job. Keep it up! I bought the vsonic GR02 based on your review. I bought the GR02 based on your review, they are great so far, especially for the price. You said you never heard of the sony mh1(c), but maybe you should change that: ClieOS gave them a 4.65/5 on sound quality, and they are available for only 20$ (http://www.amazon.com/Sony-Livesound-Headphones-Earphones-Head-sets/dp/B008CCSD7K). I am curious if you share his opinion.
   
  I bought the GR02's on the Chinese website TaoBao by the way. You can virtually find anything on there. It's basically the Chinese eBay, except that it requires that you have a Chinese bank account. You can circumvent this by buying through an agent (google for them if anyone's interested, I used go2tao.com). They buy the item for you, and charge 10% or so, and shipping of course. All charges included, I paid only 27 dollars for them : )


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lvand said:


> Hi Joker, you're doing an awesome job. Keep it up! I bought the vsonic GR02 based on your review. I bought the GR02 based on your review, they are great so far, especially for the price.


 
   
  Thanks, glad you're enjoying the GR02! Good tip on buying from taobao through an agent - they also have many earphones quicker than ebay sellers following release.


----------



## scootsit

The MH1C is now being compared to the GR07, FXT90, and RE262, they may really be something special.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> The MH1C is now being compared to the GR07, FXT90, and RE262, they may really be something special.


 
   
  Damn farking fantastic is what they are. I just A/B'ed with my GR07 and I can already see myself choosing the MH1C more that the 07 when I'm outdoors.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Damn farking fantastic is what they are. I just A/B'ed with my GR07 and I can already see myself choosing the MH1C more that the 07 when I'm outdoors.


 

 Are you serius?
   
  I've found them for US$ 20 in amazon?
  are these fake?
   
  What's the MSRP for this MH1C?
   
  If they are US$ 20 pieces that compete with the GR07, i'll grab them just too see how they look like, (and probably use in the gym)


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Those are real. There are two versions, MH1, and MH1C, make sure your phone/device is compatible with the version you buy (they assign different parts to the TRRS plug). But yes, the MH1C on Amazon is real, it comes with no box and no accessories.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Those are real. There are two versions, MH1, and MH1C, make sure your phone/device is compatible with the version you buy (they assign different parts to the TRRS plug). But yes, the MH1C on Amazon is real, it comes with no box and no accessories.


 
   
  What's the diference between the MH1C and MH1? just the accessories?
  The other version is ~ US$ 70, is that right?
   
  If i was to buy them, they would almost 100% be used with either a clip-zip or a fuze, would there be any problem with it?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 No difference in accessories. The MH1 is older, MH1C newer, they use a TRRS plug, and route different signals to each part of the plug. The Clip/Fuze likely use a TRS plug, which would work with the MH1C configuration (it uses the industry standard, in which the mic is just connected to ground). The older MH1 uses an older standard of where the mic connects in the TRRS, I forget the specifics, though it's covered in ClieOS' thread. The newer one will work with most newer phones, most devices without the second ring (TRS), and the like. The older is compatible with some Nokia, older Sony, and a few others (don't quote me on the specifics of which phones). The details are in ClieOS' thread, as well as on the Sony site.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Those are real. There are two versions, MH1, and MH1C, make sure your phone/device is compatible with the version you buy (they assign different parts to the TRRS plug). But yes, the MH1C on Amazon is real, it comes with no box and no accessories.


 

 So, I didn't understood your comment here. You said that the MH1C come without box and acessories, but latter you said there is no diference between them and the older model.
   
  Sorry, but i'm a bit lost here.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Both are OEM parts. There is no difference in accessories, you are correct. I explain the difference in the bit about how the TRRS plugs are connected. The C has absolutely nothing to do with the accessories. If you get the $80 version, it will come with accessories, if you get the $20, it will not, and will just be in a bag, as it comes as an OEM IEM with some of Sony's phones. The C has to do with what devices it is compatible with - which is to say, how the TRRS plug is soldered.
   
   
  ClieOS goes into a great deal more detail in the variations and confusion section here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/632892/review-sony-mh1-the-best-kept-secret


----------



## lilboozy

does the mh1c require burn in to sound that good


----------



## Ultrazino

I much prefer the UE900 over the TF10. The TF10 sounds very disharmonic to my ears. Even though its bass performance is incredible I prefer most dynamics over the Triple Fi. I also didn't like the Shure SE535 so I picked the W4 at the time. Some things did bother me and it is too mellow for my taste. The UE900 improves in that aspect.
   
  The UE900 has a very light veil over vocals, yes, but it's far less prominent than with the W4. Soundstage of the UE is smaller, but also more intimate whereas the Westone has a much further distance and mostly expanding left and right.
  One big problem with the W4 is that the bass loses all of its punch at lower volumes. It just disappears. Bass quantity scales with volume which bothers me a lot - yet you cannot get rid of the mid/upper bass and lower mids hump without proper EQ. With the Logitech I can listen at very low volumes and still have dirty bass punch on Hip-Hop tracks.
  If you don't mind the points above, I think the W4 is the slightly better IEM. Personally, I prefer the UE900.
   
  Build quality and comfort is amazing with both. I prefer the aggressive blue looks of the Logitech as it's a kinda offensive punch towards Monster Beats. 
  On other days I might prefer the humble black plastic and skinny cable of the Westone 4.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





ultrazino said:


> I much prefer the UE900 over the TF10. The TF10 sounds very disharmonic to my ears. Even though its bass performance is incredible I prefer most dynamics over the Triple Fi. I also didn't like the Shure SE535 so I picked the W4 at the time. Some things did bother me and it is too mellow for my taste. The UE900 improves in that aspect.
> 
> The UE900 has a very light veil over vocals, yes, but it's far less prominent than with the W4. Soundstage of the UE is smaller, but also more intimate whereas the Westone has a much further distance and mostly expanding left and right.
> One big problem with the W4 is that the bass loses all of its punch at lower volumes. It just disappears. Bass quantity scales with volume which bothers me a lot - yet you cannot get rid of the mid/upper bass and lower mids hump without proper EQ. With the Logitech I can listen at very low volumes and still have dirty bass punch on Hip-Hop tracks.
> ...


 
   
   
  The UE900 are starting to get more and more apealing, as I keep reading very good reviews and impressions about them... *Ultrazino*, from the location in your profile, you live in Germany, right? Can you tell me where did you get your UE900, please? PM me if you like...


----------



## Ultrazino

I sent a PM but I will share the link with all:
  http://ue.logitech.com/de-de/earphones/ue900


----------



## putente

Quote: 





ultrazino said:


> I sent a PM but I will share the link with all:
> http://ue.logitech.com/de-de/earphones/ue900


 
   
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Alan278

Quote: 





putente said:


> The UE900 are starting to get more and more apealing, as I keep reading very good reviews and impressions about them... *Ultrazino*, from the location in your profile, you live in Germany, right? Can you tell me where did you get your UE900, please? PM me if you like...


 
  Yes the UE900's appear very good - I'm debating between those and the Audeo PFE 232's... the 232's are better for my use I think - at the same price or even for $100 more than the UE900's, i'll take the 232's.  But I'm waiting another few weeks to see what happens on pricing on both.  In particular, I hope the brand new UE900's take some kind of (significant - 20% or more) drop, especially around Black Friday in the U.S.


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





alan278 said:


> Yes the UE900's appear very good - I'm debating between those and the Audeo PFE 232's... the 232's are better for my use I think - at the same price or even for $100 more than the UE900's, i'll take the 232's.  But I'm waiting another few weeks to see what happens on pricing on both.  In particular, I hope the brand new UE900's take some kind of (significant - 20% or more) drop, especially around Black Friday in the U.S.


 
   
  The 232s are an improvement (overall, not totoal) over the 900s.  Even though the TF10s take large dives during Black Friday, I don't see it happening with the UE900 anytime soon.  It could though, but I do see it happening.


----------



## goodsound

[size=medium]This thread would be incomplete without the Nuforce NE-600, its got to be in this comparison. [/size]
  [size=medium]Looking forward to seeing the "Sound" score on these as compared to others.[/size]


----------



## Velorium

After a couple weeks of deliberation I decided to give thinksound one last try and received the MS01s yesterday. I'm really enjoying the signature but they're noticeably sibilant even at low volume to the point of being fatiguing. Is something that's supposed to get better with burn in or would you say this is just the nature of these IEMs?


----------



## Crookshank

ljokerl,
   
  What the best in soundstage department(full body) with "warm" sound? (no custom)


----------



## Ultrazino

I'm guessing FX700.


----------



## eyal1983

Which has more clarity: the GR07 , or the Etymotic ER-4s ?
   
  and is the ER-4s is same as ER-4PT ?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> Which has more clarity: the GR07 , or the Etymotic ER-4s ?
> 
> and is the ER-4s is same as ER-4PT ?


 
   
  Etymotic. It achieves this clarity by having comparatively little bass, and thin notes.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





goodsound said:


> This thread would be incomplete without the Nuforce NE-600, its got to be in this comparison.
> Looking forward to seeing the "Sound" score on these as compared to others.


 
   
  Lose the extra accessories, put in cheaper casing and cable. The case is lighter and easier to fit though, so you can add at least 0,5 in Comfort.
  I'd say, 1/3 as durable from my cursory look at them. Tuning is very similar to NE-700. Tinge more bass and impact specifically, bit more midrange bleed, bit smoother sound. Lower fidelity in general.
   
  I'd say they're very competitive in their price range, if not one of the better basshead picks altogether. Their main problem is VSonic GR99.


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Lose the extra accessories, put in cheaper casing and cable. The case is lighter and easier to fit though, so you can add at least 0,5 in Comfort.
> I'd say, 1/3 as durable from my cursory look at them. Tuning is very similar to NE-700. Tinge more bass and impact specifically, bit more midrange bleed, bit smoother sound. Lower fidelity in general.
> 
> I'd say they're very competitive in their price range, if not one of the better basshead picks altogether. Their main problem is VSonic GR99.


 
  How do they compare with the gr99 and why don't i see any hf threads on this ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ultrazino said:


> I much prefer the UE900 over the TF10. The TF10 sounds very disharmonic to my ears. Even though its bass performance is incredible I prefer most dynamics over the Triple Fi. I also didn't like the Shure SE535 so I picked the W4 at the time. Some things did bother me and it is too mellow for my taste. The UE900 improves in that aspect.
> 
> The UE900 has a very light veil over vocals, yes, but it's far less prominent than with the W4. Soundstage of the UE is smaller, but also more intimate whereas the Westone has a much further distance and mostly expanding left and right.
> One big problem with the W4 is that the bass loses all of its punch at lower volumes. It just disappears. Bass quantity scales with volume which bothers me a lot - yet you cannot get rid of the mid/upper bass and lower mids hump without proper EQ. With the Logitech I can listen at very low volumes and still have dirty bass punch on Hip-Hop tracks.
> ...


 
   
  Thanks for the impressions, no arguments here. The TF10 has some coherence issues, which are more obvious next to a good dynamic-driver IEM than the UE900. I actually preferred the (lowly) Yamaha EPH-100 over the TF10 much of the time as a result.  
   
  Quote: 





alan278 said:


> Yes the UE900's appear very good - I'm debating between those and the Audeo PFE 232's... the 232's are better for my use I think - at the same price or even for $100 more than the UE900's, i'll take the 232's.  But I'm waiting another few weeks to see what happens on pricing on both.  In particular, *I hope the brand new UE900's take some kind of (significant - 20% or more) drop, especially around Black Friday in the U.S.*


 
   
  I really wouldn't count on it but I suppose anything is possible. Depends on how aggressive Logitech wants to be with pushing the new UE lineup.
   
  Quote: 





goodsound said:


> [size=medium]This thread would be incomplete without the Nuforce NE-600, its got to be in this comparison. [/size]
> [size=medium]Looking forward to seeing the "Sound" score on these as compared to others.[/size]


 
   
  I think it's safe to say that this thread will never be _complete _in the grand sense. 
   
  Quote: 





velorium said:


> After a couple weeks of deliberation I decided to give thinksound one last try and received the MS01s yesterday. I'm really enjoying the signature but they're noticeably sibilant even at low volume to the point of being fatiguing. Is something that's supposed to get better with burn in or would you say this is just the nature of these IEMs?


 
   
  I didn't really listen to them out of the box. My pair was okay on records that didn't have recorded sibilance - definitely not the smoothest treble but not as offensive as the old TS01.
   
  Quote: 





crookshank said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> What the best in soundstage department(full body) with "warm" sound? (no custom)


 
   
  IE8, FX700, maybe Radius TWF-21 if you like your treble very smooth. 
   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Etymotic. It achieves this clarity by having comparatively little bass, and thin notes.


 
   
  I think it's safe to say nothing in the universal realm, at least from what I've heard, will outright "beat" the ER4S in clarity. An argument can be made for the Final Audio FI-BA-SS but probably shouldn't be...


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> How do they compare with the gr99 and why don't i see any hf threads on this ?


 
  It's cheap and Head-Fi regulars tend to gravitate towards more expensive, usually better, IEMs.
   
  I haven't heard GR99 itself, it's supposedly somewhat unlike other VSonic IEMs. VSonic unfortunately isn't directly available in Europe, as opposed to their competitor brand, Brainwavz.
  I have heard NE-600M though vs NE-700M and they're close enough.
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think it's safe to say nothing in the universal realm, at least from what I've heard, will outright "beat" the ER4S in clarity. An argument can be made for the Final Audio FI-BA-SS but probably shouldn't be...


 
   
  Hmm. I do agree that ER4S is one of the fastest and least resonant drivers out there, but I find the signature to be doing them a huge disservice, with a large 2-4kHz boost. It also shares the lack of bass impact with most other balanced armatures.
  Etys were made for KEMAR with small pinnae, which is not considered the most accurate one. (I had some nice paper on HAT simulators somewhere. KEMAR is best, but with large pinnae.)


----------



## scootsit

I just got the MH1C, I'm not a fan of the cable. That's not true. I dig the flat cable, but no the J-shape. The mic is just below the left IEM, which is nice, as it weighs nothing. I dig these IEMs. My iPod was dead, so I gave them a quick test on my phone, which I'm starting to  think has a massive output impedance. I tried using my impedance matching transformers, but the TRRS plug was picky. Anyway, I tried them straight out of my phone, and am now listening to my iPod. I've got maybe an hour on them. They're nice! I have to disagree regarding similarity to the GR07 (which I have never heard, but I do have the model down from it, the GR04 Flagship). I think that they are a bit bassier, so some may prefer them over the GR04FE/7 for that reason, particularly subbass. I find them slightly more enjoyable than the GR02BE, in part because as someone who is not a big fan of bass, they have less midbass. Are they worth $20? Absolutely!! The $80 MSRP? Probably not.
   
  I just switched back to the GR04 Flagship. The GR04, while slightly sibilant, images better, has more texture and the music feels thicker. I find myself getting lost in it a bit more. But, the MH1C sounds pretty great, perhaps just a bit much in the bass department for my liking.
   
  I want to note, that the $20 ones on Amazon get you the IEM, three sets of tips, and a shirt clip.
   
  They are relatively slender and long, you could get crazy good insertion, but my ear canal veers upward a little bit, which makes over the ear cabling most comfortable, the flat cable/mic location means that I cannot go over the ear.
   
   
  For the price, these are a great deal, easily on par sonically with the GR02!


----------



## BoneEnterprise

Wow brain overload!
  As it has been mentioned many dozens of times now, thank you ljokerl for spending the time to assemble such a great resource on such a wide range of IEMs, it has helped me with my research greatly!
   
  I come with getting a suggestion on which IEM will best fit my needs based off of what I will be using them for.
   
  My main use for these IEMs will be for hooking up to my MSI-GT683R laptop while at work, though it from time to time be hooked to my Samsung cell phone or Zune to listen to audio as well while traveling so I do not have to lug my Sennheiser HD650s around.
  The main genre of music I listen to would be Alternative/Rock/Acoustic, though I do on occasion listen to R&B/Rap, other genres pass through my playlist but not enough to single it out as a sound profile for choosing a listening device for.
   
  I currently do not have any sort of external dac/amp, though I have thought about buying one for quite some time now and am open for suggestions on those as well, otherwise I will consult the proper sub-forum for that as this question does not pertain to dac/amps.
   
  My budget is $250 ~ $300 USD shipped if possible, and I fully intend to purchase from the internet, unless anyone knows of any good deals to be had in the Houston, Texas area.
   
  With that in mind and after spending some time reading the reviews found in this thread, I have narrowed down my search to the VSonic GR07 MkII's and the HiFiMan RE272's, from what I can see either one of these will fit with what sound stage that I intend to listen to and won't break the bank at the same time.
   
  I have found I can get the GR07 MkII's with a "free" set of GR04's for $240 @ lendmeurears.com, however that is only saving me around $20 if I was to purchase them individually, so not sure if it is worth that extra cost, the HiFiMan RE272's can be had for $249 alternatively.
   
  This will be my first set of IEMs to buy with the exception of a set of Munitio Nines I purchased from a forum member here just last night, help me make the "right" decision, thanks in advance.


----------



## shotgunshane

^^ You're seeing SGD for the 240 price USD is $201 for both. Currency converter is at the top of the page.


----------



## BoneEnterprise

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> ^^ You're seeing SGD for the 240 price USD is $201 for both. Currency converter is at the top of the page.


 
   
  Wow, yeah in that case that is a pretty good deal then, more tempting now for the VSonic's.


----------



## shotgunshane

boneenterprise said:


> Wow, yeah in that case that is a pretty good deal then, more tempting now for the VSonic's.




The GR07mk2 is my personal recommendation for guitar driven rock, which seems to encompass your main genres. It has excellent distortion guitar bite, plus very nice sub bass. I've not heard the RE272 but all of the other current RE models. Hifiman IEMs all sound excellent but won't have the same distortion guitar bite or sub bass levels. I don't think you'd be dissappointed with either though.


----------



## BoneEnterprise

Yeah that is what I gathered from the reviews and now that I realize that the GR07 MkII's are more of a better deal now than before I may go with them.
  May grab me a Fiio E17 as well.
   
  Thank you for your input.


----------



## Von krumm

Hi Guys, this is by far the best place to find info on IEM and it is very helpful!

I was wondering what Soundstage is good for acoustic music with vocals? I understand frequency and sound signature, but other subjective things like "bright", "fluid" and "hollow" all vary in different frequency bands right?

I listen to mainly prog/electro house (bright stuff) or acoustic guitar/rock and leaning towards the re262's....
Is this correct? Are these two types hard to cover in one headphone? 

Going from Brainwavz M3 ~ Enjoyed the bass and decent clarity for me!


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





boneenterprise said:


> Yeah that is what I gathered from the reviews and now that I realize that the GR07 MkII's are more of a better deal now than before I may go with them.
> May grab me a Fiio E17 as well.
> 
> Thank you for your input.


 

 If you're looking to try something interesting (I don't have them, but initial reports seem pretty good), there is a new brand of inexpensive custom IEMs. They're a little backed up on production, but those who have received them seem quite happy. Just a thought, you certainly can't go wrong with your current selections.
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/626714/cosmic-ears-new-ciem-company-with-crazy-low-prices-including-hybrid-designs


----------



## Audio addict19

Hello all, i've been viewing the IEM's and all and was wondering to anyone who has heard the Yamaha eph-100sl is it like how joker states? It must of been somewhere in this massive thread, but like I said it is massive and would be hard to find it. So any help would be greatly appreciated.  
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
  p.s Joker, this thread is one of the most awesome things on this site, your help and information is extremely valuable.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I just got the MH1C, I'm not a fan of the cable. That's not true. I dig the flat cable, but no the J-shape. The mic is just below the left IEM, which is nice, as it weighs nothing. I dig these IEMs. My iPod was dead, so I gave them a quick test on my phone, which I'm starting to  think has a massive output impedance. I tried using my impedance matching transformers, but the TRRS plug was picky. Anyway, I tried them straight out of my phone, and am now listening to my iPod. I've got maybe an hour on them. They're nice! I have to disagree regarding similarity to the GR07 (which I have never heard, but I do have the model down from it, the GR04 Flagship). I think that they are a bit bassier, so some may prefer them over the GR04FE/7 for that reason, particularly subbass. I find them slightly more enjoyable than the GR02BE, in part because as someone who is not a big fan of bass, they have less midbass. Are they worth $20? Absolutely!! The $80 MSRP? Probably not.
> 
> I just switched back to the GR04 Flagship. The GR04, while slightly sibilant, images better, has more texture and the music feels thicker. I find myself getting lost in it a bit more. But, the MH1C sounds pretty great, perhaps just a bit much in the bass department for my liking.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks, good to know!
    
  Quote:


boneenterprise said:


> Wow brain overload!
> As it has been mentioned many dozens of times now, thank you ljokerl for spending the time to assemble such a great resource on such a wide range of IEMs, it has helped me with my research greatly!
> 
> I come with getting a suggestion on which IEM will best fit my needs based off of what I will be using them for.
> ...


 
   
  The HD600 sounds neutral to slightly warm-ish to me. If you wanted to match its signature closest the RE262 might actually be a better choice than the RE272 even though I like the RE272 a little better. The only concern regarding the RE272 is its low-medium bass quantity. If you've never had a proper high-end in-ear before (the Munitio definitely doesn't count) the GR07 would be the "safer" choice.  It is quite good with rock.
    
  Quote:


von krumm said:


> Hi Guys, this is by far the best place to find info on IEM and it is very helpful!
> I was wondering what Soundstage is good for acoustic music with vocals? I understand frequency and sound signature, but other subjective things like "bright", "fluid" and "hollow" all vary in different frequency bands right?
> I listen to mainly prog/electro house (bright stuff) or acoustic guitar/rock and leaning towards the re262's....
> Is this correct? Are these two types hard to cover in one headphone?
> Going from Brainwavz M3 ~ Enjoyed the bass and decent clarity for me!


 
   
  Almost all sound characteristics show up in measurements such as frequency response - it's just difficult to know how to read them properly. Bright would imply quantitatively greater treble energy, for example. 
   
  I think EDM listeners generally prefer a more v-shaped sound than the RE262 but it will always depend on what sounds best to you. I would take the GR07 over the RE262 for those genres. Leaner mid-bass than M3 but better bass extension, clarity, detail, and so on.
   
   Quote:


audio addict19 said:


> Hello all, i've been viewing the IEM's and all and was wondering to anyone who has heard the Yamaha eph-100sl is it like how joker states? It must of been somewhere in this massive thread, but like I said it is massive and would be hard to find it. So any help would be greatly appreciated.


 
   
  There's a long EPH-100 discussion thread here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/577712/yamaha-eph-100


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks, good to know!


 
  I could probably live without em for a week or two, if you want to give them a try.
   
  I meant to say this before, the controls don't work quite right for me. + goes back, - goes forward, and the call button stops/starts. I have an HTC One V.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> The GR07mk2 is my personal recommendation for guitar driven rock, which seems to encompass your main genres. It has excellent distortion guitar bite, plus very nice sub bass. I've not heard the RE272 but all of the other current RE models. Hifiman IEMs all sound excellent but won't have the same distortion guitar bite or sub bass levels. I don't think you'd be dissappointed with either though.


 
  Actually, RE272 only lacks the low end boost. It requires specific wide large tips (or customs) to achieve its best performance. Normal silicone tips or foams with shallower insertion cut its bass, both impact and amount. (And nobody I know of makes 4,5mm tapering long foams.)
  GR07 works the other way around: it gets more of a bass boost at shallow insertion. It's also easy to accidentally cover its front vent, giving it even more bass nonlinearity.
  It is rolled off at the highest end in comparison to RE272 - but most everything is, including almost all armature-based IEMs.
   
  Both actually are made for deep fit it seems and both have casing that's not exactly made for that. Also both do very well with distortion guitar with RE272 being more dimensional to my ears - the difference is mostly in bass handling and highest end. GR07 gives more intimate sound as a result of its bass tilt, RE272 gives more distant spacious sound instead due to its lack of any tilt.
   
  Both are also more resonant than they deserve due to casing. I'll gamble a _working_ pair of RE272 on converting them to infinite baffle. (Seems to help immensely with their bass; GR07 only loses most of its 6k resonance.)


----------



## OnlinePredator

Does the GR06 require an amp?
 I'll be using it with my Galaxy Ace S5830.


----------



## BoneEnterprise

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> The HD600 sounds neutral to slightly warm-ish to me. If you wanted to match its signature closest the RE262 might actually be a better choice than the RE272 even though I like the RE272 a little better. The only concern regarding the RE272 is its low-medium bass quantity. If you've never had a proper high-end in-ear before (the Munitio definitely doesn't count) the GR07 would be the "safer" choice.  It is quite good with rock.


 
  Yeah I just now ordered the GR07's from Amazon and paid my $8.99 for Saturday delivery, I actually was peeping out the RE262's first before anything and after reading was going to settle on one of the two I mentioned.
  The Munitio's I mainly bought because of their supposed "bass head" profile and the fact that I love their gimmick of looking like actual 9mm bullets, also too since I got them for $80 so I don't have to feel bad about paying full price just for said gimmick.
   
  Thanks for the reply.


----------



## kais0r

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think the M5 is what you want - it tends to underemphasize treble and has tons of bass compared to the M1. Not sure what your price range is and I've never heard the M4 but I think you'd enjoy something a bit more balanced, maybe a Maximo iM-590 or Xears XR120 Pro. If your budget goes up above $50, maybe a VSonic GR06, Rock-It Sounds R-30, Etymotic MC5, or MEElec A161P/Fischer SBA-03. The Rock-It Sounds has slightly more laid-back treble compared to the others but the midrange is nice and forward and it's a surprisingly detailed earphone.


 
   
  Thanks for your and sorry for my late reply.
  I'm from Europe and unfortunately, most of these IEM aren't available here, the only one is the MEElec A161. What do you think about the Brainwavz M3 and MEElec A151? Budget is about 70 € (90 $).


----------



## eyal1983

How does the Westone w4 compares to Sennheiser IE80 / 8   ?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> How does the Westone w4 compares to Sennheiser IE80 / 8   ?


 
   
  tinyman392 sent me his review. Keep in mind W4 $ > IE80 $-
   
  With the bass boosted, the IE80s bass matches that of the W4R, it’s a little higher actually.  Without the boost, the quantity is a lot less than the W4R.  The signatures are very similar here, the W4 seems to have a slight warmth over the IE80s (bass down) and has less energetic treble.

 Bass: The bass on the IE80 has much greater depth than the W4R.  It has more quantity at this level as well.  Punches are actually better done with the W4R however, as are impacts.  It really matters what you value the most in terms of bass here.  The W4R has a slightly tighter punch, but much stronger impact while the IE80s tend to do much better down low.

 If you turn up the nob, however, the IE80 bring in a much stronger impact, walking the line of boomy.  The W4 will always be better with the tighter punch.  However, being able to surpass the W4 a tad bit with customization of pumping bass puts the IE80 a leg up on the W4.

 Mids:  The mids on the W4s are much warmer than that on the IE80 due to the mid-bass boost.  The detailing on the W4s seem to be a tad bit above that of the IE80.  Not the same can be said about the clarity and sweetness however.  The IE80 just simply excels here.  Although the W4 can perform lush vocals with a sweet hymn, the IE80 do much better with the instrumentals and their dynamics.  The IE80s do fare slightly better with the midrange over the W4 in this aspect.

 Highs: I’ve been able to find both of these IEMs sibilant, but in different situations.  The The IE80’s, however, occurs much more than the W4s.  Separation is also a huge leg up with the 4s over the 80s simply entering a different dimension.  Detailing as well.  The only thing the IE80 really does well over the W4 is energy in the highs.  They become a little too energetic though.  The W4s take this one by a long shot.


----------



## eyal1983

thanks,
  then the W4 is *not* an upgrade over the IE80.. did i get it right ?


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> thanks,
> then the W4 is *not* an upgrade over the IE80.. did i get it right ?


 
   
   
  There's not much that's going to be an upgrade over the W4 in the universal IEM market, maybe the K3003, Fitear 334 or another universal made by a custom company.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> thanks,
> then the W4 is *not* an upgrade over the IE80.. did i get it right ?


 
   
  I got rid of the older IE8 because the bass was too boomy and highs too veiled.  I traded them for a W3 after I lost mine.  I'd love to try the IE80 and see if they fixed things in those.
   
  Regardless, with the right tips I still prefer the W4 over all the other universal IEM I've tried.  But I haven't tried the IE80 yet or the SE535, because of my experiences with IE8 and SE530.  With the TWag V2 cable and balanced SR-72b amp my new W4R get scary good.  I preferred the W4 over the $$$$ AKG K3003i at RMAF, although the K3003 was still fun to listen to it's not worth the cost to me.  At those prices I'd get a Westone ES5 custom or JH16Pro.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I could probably live without em for a week or two, if you want to give them a try.
> 
> I meant to say this before, the controls don't work quite right for me. + goes back, - goes forward, and the call button stops/starts. I have an HTC One V.


 
   
  Appreciate the offer. Maybe if you still have them after I finally finish the MH334 and TF10 reviews 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> Does the GR06 require an amp?
> I'll be using it with my Galaxy Ace S5830.


 
   
  Doesn't need an amp but it might hiss a little in the background if your phone has a high noise floor like my HTC does. The GR06 is more forgiving in this regard than most mid/hi-fi IEMs, though.
   
    
  Quote:


boneenterprise said:


> Yeah I just now ordered the GR07's from Amazon and paid my $8.99 for Saturday delivery, I actually was peeping out the RE262's first before anything and after reading was going to settle on one of the two I mentioned.
> The Munitio's I mainly bought because of their supposed "bass head" profile and the fact that I love their gimmick of looking like actual 9mm bullets, also too since I got them for $80 so I don't have to feel bad about paying full price just for said gimmick.
> 
> Thanks for the reply.


 
   
  Yes, I rather liked the cosmetics of the Munitios and they feel very nice in the hand. 
   
  Quote: 





kais0r said:


> Thanks for your and sorry for my late reply.
> I'm from Europe and unfortunately, most of these IEM aren't available here, the only one is the MEElec A161. What do you think about the Brainwavz M3 and MEElec A151? Budget is about 70 € (90 $).


 
   
  The A161P is a pretty big upgrade over the M3 and especially A151 as far as sound quality goes. The M3 is fairly balanced but definitely bassier than the M1. Treble is slightly relaxed but not too bad. The A151 is warm-ish with clean mids and slightly dull, rolled-off treble. 
   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> thanks,
> then the W4 is *not* an upgrade over the IE80.. did i get it right ?


 
   
  I haven't heard the IE80 but the W4 was definitely an upgrade over the old IE8 for me. Cleaner sound with better detail and no need to equalize the bass to get rid of a veil.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the IE80 but the W4 was definitely an upgrade over the old IE8 for me. Cleaner sound with better detail and no need to equalize the bass to get rid of a veil.


 
   
  It's almost like you read my mind (or my previous post).


----------



## james444

^ As always, it also depends on personal preferences like music genres, listening volume and whatnot.
   
  Just for example, I agree the W4 are technically better overall, but the IE8 have better dynamics at low volume, where the W4 sound a bit lifeless. (Speaking of which, the K3003 really trounce the W4 at low volume, they're probably the best bedtime IEMs I've heard so far.) Of course, at mid to high volume, things change and the W4 come alive, whereas the IE8 turn into a boomy mess.
   
  Btw, the IE80 I A/Bed with my IE8 had only a few db less midbass emphasis, so their overall signature was still the same.


----------



## ayaflo

@ joker! 


> Glad the 3590s were available. I've picked up a few budget IEMs in the past year but none have measured up to the SHE3580.


 
   
   
  you should try the sony mh1c! they have a marvelous value!


----------



## jrcarboleda

Will someone help me to choose from this three? You're opinions will be greatly appreciated..

Westone 2
Hifiman RE272
Etymotic Research's ER4S

I considered my budget first.. I can't buy 2 earphones and unfortunately can not buy an 'entry' step level of earphones because I have raised my funds just for one IEM and also because I'm still a student. I'm asking this now for I already have my money and I'm planning to buy within a week or so.
My preferences are very durable earphones that can withstand time and reckless handling.. The cables are always the problem of my past IEMs.. 
 The sound most especially is considered.. I'll be using it as studio monitors, everyday earphones and those I can comfortably sleep with them on.. Comfort is much preferred.. I don't need much accessories but just need to find the right ear tips thaf'll fit my ear..
Microphonics may be an issue for me too but can also be neglected if the IEM chosen is what suits me most..
My country (Philippines) don't have display of these earphones and I'm going to buy it internationally.. Preferrably on e-bay.. But if you can recommend where, I'll try to make good point of it.. 

Thanks for your time.. Please be considerate of my comment.. I'll try my best to be updated..


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Will someone help me to choose from this three? You're opinions will be greatly appreciated..
> Westone 2
> Hifiman RE272
> Etymotic Research's ER4S
> ...


 
   
   
  The Ortofon e-Q5 not only sounds great but its built like a tank with an all aluminum housing and thick Y-splitter and cable, you'd have to really do something crazy to brake them imo.


----------



## goodvibes

Actually, the VG E-q5, has had cable issues for many, the finish wears if colored and while the case is plenty strong enough as assembled, the open end could be flattened between your fingers if the front cap was removed. While perfectly fine for it's purpose (cable could be more durable) it's not the tank you describe. Wouldn't stop me from buying it but it's construction isn't an advantage over it's plastic competitors.The cable exit is a disadvantage in my book but that's personal. Purposely asking a straight cable to take a 90 degree path isn't my idea of ingenuity.


----------



## jrcarboleda

Thanks for your comments but I'm currently fixed on the 3 IEMs I've mentioned ^^ hope you can provide feedbacks on those


----------



## Johnny Jumper

First, thanks for a truly great comparison of the IEM market. Gotta ask if you looked at Mee A161p when you tested the A151s. I just got the former and I'm wondering if I would be better off with the Shure SE215s. I wish I had seen this post before getting the 161s. Would have saved me a lot of research and worry!

JJ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





headphoneaddict said:


> It's almost like you read my mind (or my previous post).


 
   
  I think we've always agreed on the IE8 and the Westone earphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> ^ As always, it also depends on personal preferences like music genres, listening volume and whatnot.
> 
> Just for example, I agree the W4 are technically better overall, but the IE8 have better dynamics at low volume, where the W4 sound a bit lifeless. (Speaking of which, the K3003 really trounce the W4 at low volume, they're probably the best bedtime IEMs I've heard so far.) Of course, at mid to high volume, things change and the W4 come alive, whereas the IE8 turn into a boomy mess.
> 
> Btw, the IE80 I A/Bed with my IE8 had only a few db less midbass emphasis, so their overall signature was still the same.


 
   
  Agreed, it's ridiculous how much I enjoy the K3003 in casual & bedtime listening.
   
  Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Will someone help me to choose from this three? You're opinions will be greatly appreciated..
> Westone 2
> Hifiman RE272
> Etymotic Research's ER4S
> ...


 
   
  This is if you can only pick between those three: If you're going strictly for durability I would probably skip the HiFiMan. If you've never had a deep-insertion IEM before and are after comfort as well as being able to sleep in them, I would skip the ER4 as well. The W2 is one of the few higher-end IEMs I felt comfortable sleeping in. Comes with tons of tips and has a pleasant, balanced sound to it. 
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> First, thanks for a truly great comparison of the IEM market. Gotta ask if you looked at Mee A161p when you tested the A151s. I just got the former and I'm wondering if I would be better off with the Shure SE215s. I wish I had seen this post before getting the 161s. Would have saved me a lot of research and worry!
> JJ


 
   
  The A161P had not even been announced yet when I reviewed the A151. However, I did review a re-badged version of it later - it's found in this thread as the Fischer Audio SBA-03. I also compared the SBA-03 to the A161P here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/dandy-meelecronics-a161p-and-fischer-audio-sb-03


----------



## needbassndetail

will you review this Sunrise Xcited and Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition?
   
Its already in your on progress anyway


----------



## snappyaxolotl

The IE80 is an upgrade of the IE8. It fixes many of its problems, and reduces its bass.


----------



## atomikn00b

Dear joker.
  If it hasn't already been suggested, I am suggesting it now.
  Pleeeease.
  We are very curious to hear how you would rate the sony mh1c.
   
  Thank you


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> Dear joker.
> If it hasn't already been suggested, I am suggesting it now.
> Pleeeease.
> We are very curious to hear how you would rate the sony mh1c.
> ...


 

 Joker, I said it a page back, in case you didn't see it, I'd be happy to send you my MH1C to review, I could live without it for a week or two.


----------



## eyal1983

SM3 vs Westone 4 vs PFE232 ?
   
  what is more refined, and less harsh on treble?
  how would you rank them high-low ?


----------



## jrcarboleda

Joker.. Now that you've mention the durability of the hifiman, its now out of the question.. My question now is how does the sound of the westone2 differ with the ER4S? Which do you prefer better? Comfort is a real good thing.. But what I like most with the ER4S is its detachable cable and the respectable service of the etymotic research company. Are westone2s really that durable?

Thank you for your feedbacks.. I've researched things its just that I need a hand-on-hand advice for those who have experienced them.. 

Also, "the part you told me if those were the only 3 IEMs" gives me the itch to ask if you still have a better suggestion within $250 or less?

Again thanks ^^ I'll stay updated


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





needbassndetail said:


> will you review this Sunrise Xcited and Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition?
> 
> Its already in your on progress anyway


 
   
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/552753/review-sunrise-xcited-and-xcape-impressive-edition
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Joker, I said it a page back, in case you didn't see it, I'd be happy to send you my MH1C to review, I could live without it for a week or two.


 
   
   
  Saw it, also replied to it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> SM3 vs Westone 4 vs PFE232 ?
> 
> what is more refined, and less harsh on treble?
> how would you rank them high-low ?


 
   
   
  The SM3 has the smoothest treble by a margin. I don't really think any one of these is really better than the others. Personally I prefer the W4 or PFE232 but that's because I don't particularly like darker/warmer signatures. 
   
   
  Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Joker.. Now that you've mention the durability of the hifiman, its now out of the question.. My question now is how does the sound of the westone2 differ with the ER4S? Which do you prefer better? Comfort is a real good thing.. But what I like most with the ER4S is its detachable cable and the respectable service of the etymotic research company. Are westone2s really that durable?
> Thank you for your feedbacks.. I've researched things its just that I need a hand-on-hand advice for those who have experienced them..
> Also, "the part you told me if those were the only 3 IEMs" gives me the itch to ask if you still have a better suggestion within $250 or less?
> Again thanks ^^ I'll stay updated


 
   
  I haven't had a problem with HiFiMan products personally but others have complained. Westone products are generally durable. I haven't heard the W2 in a while so my review is probably a better source of information on its sound. I prefer the sound of the ER4S and I think the GR07 might also be a better value at $170-200 given what you are asking in an IEM (low profile, pretty balanced sound, solid build quality)


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Saw it, also replied to it


 
  Indeed you did, my mistake.
  Let me know when that is.


----------



## craziboy89

thinking of getting the aclair instead of the 1964 t as they really that much more value for monaey than the 1964 t?


----------



## jrcarboleda

Joker, the GR07 Is fantastic.. I think it really suits me well.. I don't believe in burn-in that much though.. But I'll put my faith into it.. One last thing.. Did you have or are there any reports about cable fatigue with the GR07? I Just need to make sure because the IEM costs alot.. Thanks.. I like its moving tip for extra comfort and over the ear design for eliminating the microphonics.. I believe the sound would be great based on the reviews from other sites.. 

If in case it has cable issues.. I'll still have the etymotic ER4S in mind.. I don't think I'll get much out of the W2's sound quality.. Again thanks for the reply.. By the way if ever I'll choose GR07, where can I find a great deal about those earphones? I'll keep posted..


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Joker, the GR07 Is fantastic.. I think it really suits me well.. I don't believe in burn-in that much though.. But I'll put my faith into it.. One last thing.. Did you have or are there any reports about cable fatigue with the GR07? I Just need to make sure because the IEM costs alot.. Thanks.. I like its moving tip for extra comfort and over the ear design for eliminating the microphonics.. I believe the sound would be great based on the reviews from other sites..
> If in case it has cable issues.. I'll still have the etymotic ER4S in mind.. I don't think I'll get much out of the W2's sound quality.. Again thanks for the reply.. By the way if ever I'll choose GR07, where can I find a great deal about those earphones? I'll keep posted..


 
  http://lendmeurears.com/product_info.php?cPath=13&products_id=109
   
  GR02 mk2 with free GR04


----------



## jrcarboleda

pakoboy said:


> http://lendmeurears.com/product_info.php?cPath=13&products_id=109
> 
> GR02 mk2 with free GR04




I can't differentiate them.. Whats with the flagship edition of the gr04 compared to the gr07?


----------



## jrcarboleda

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> I can't differentiate them.. Whats with the flagship edition of the gr04 compared to the gr07?


 
  I was using my iphone to look at the link you gave me.. I now understand that there is a free GR04 included with the GR07.. I don't need it because it raised the price to nearly $80 more..
   
  Thanks anyways..
   
  To Joker, are there different versions of the GR07? I think I am seeing 3 different versions..

 The flagship version http://www.ebay.com/itm/VSONIC-GR07-R07-Flagship-Version-Inner-Ear-Earphones-/290567696399
   
  This one with the hard shell which says new version case http://www.ebay.com/itm/VSonic-GR07-Pro-Dynamic-Noise-Isolation-Earbuds-Innovic-Hard-Shell-Case-/200828144549?forcev4exp=true&forceRpt=true
   
  And the last one as GR07 Bass edition http://www.ebay.com/itm/VSONIC-GR07-BASS-Edition-High-Fidelity-Professional-Stereo-Inner-Ear-Earphones-/380504885821?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item5897dbca3d
   
  I'm getting confused out here.. Please help.. Advance thanks for the replies..


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The GR04 Flagship is one model below the GR07, it originally retailed for just about $100, but is being discontinued and can readily be found for about half that.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Half-way through production, they replaced the cable to one with more Ag in it, those are called the MK2. They also made them in different colors.
  Also, if you're looking at the link on lendmeurears, their prices are in Singapore Dollars. I believe that in USD, the GR07 is currently ~$200, which is probably about $20 more than on ebay. Which, is an amazing deal for the GR04.


----------



## jrcarboleda

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> The GR04 Flagship is one model below the GR07, it originally retailed for just about $100, but is being discontinued and can readily be found for about half that.


 
  Thank you scootsit.. I've been enlightened.. Though I'm still going to buy the GR07 only


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Ya, I was prostelatizing not too long ago when I got my hands on the GR04, they really sound great. In the GR04/GR06 threads, it was established that the GR04 is a significant step above the GR06. I'm quite happy with the GR04, and the price is so good right now (~$50) that it's really quite mindblowing. There is one major problem, the GR04 makes me really curious about the GR07, but I think I'd rather try something different all together. Anyway, you can't go wrong with the Vsonic line up, I've heard the GR99-GR04 and each represents a fantastic value at their respective price points. The only thing to consider is the soon-to-be-released VSonics, like the GR08, GR09, and VC02... The first two will be a bit more expensive, but the GR08 is going to have the same driver set up as the $1000 AKG K3003...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Indeed you did, my mistake.
> Let me know when that is.


 
   
  Thanks, will do.
   
  Quote: 





craziboy89 said:


> thinking of getting the aclair instead of the 1964 t as they really that much more value for monaey than the 1964 t?


 
   
  Yes, now that they are $400. They were $500 until a month or so ago. There is also the new 1964-V3. which is a sizable improvement over the 1964-T and nearly on-par with the Alclair Reference. 
   
  Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Joker, the GR07 Is fantastic.. I think it really suits me well.. I don't believe in burn-in that much though.. But I'll put my faith into it.. One last thing.. Did you have or are there any reports about cable fatigue with the GR07? I Just need to make sure because the IEM costs alot.. Thanks.. I like its moving tip for extra comfort and over the ear design for eliminating the microphonics.. I believe the sound would be great based on the reviews from other sites..
> If in case it has cable issues.. I'll still have the etymotic ER4S in mind.. I don't think I'll get much out of the W2's sound quality.. Again thanks for the reply.. By the way if ever I'll choose GR07, where can I find a great deal about those earphones? I'll keep posted..


 
   
  I haven't seen any complaints about GR07 cables. You want to find something explicitly labeled "GR07 MK2", like on the lendmeurears page. I don't know what all of these other editions are. VSonic nomenclature is confusing even before you bring in the different editions because GR01 > GR07 > GR04 > GR06 > GR02 > GR99. The numbers seem to be pretty much random.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> I was using my iphone to look at the link you gave me.. I now understand that there is a free GR04 included with the GR07.. I don't need it because it raised the price to nearly $80 more..
> 
> Thanks anyways..
> 
> ...


 
  there´s the old one , original, mk1
  the new mk2 with silver cable
  and seems there´s this mysterious one, BASS. the read and silver cable. it labeled "BASS" at the box


----------



## eyal1983

the Vsonic GR01 is more "flagshippy" than the GR07?
  how different does it sound?
  and why isn't it on their official website ?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> the Vsonic GR01 is more "flagshippy" than the GR07?
> how different does it sound?
> *and why isn't it on their official website ?*


 
  another mystery


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





zelda said:


> another mystery


 

 it seems to be in the Chinese version of their website:
  http://www.vsonic.com.cn/earphone_product_cn/GR01.htm


----------



## lilboozy

Noob question but what are microphonics


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Noob question but what are microphonics


 
  the noise of the cable


----------



## Reomero

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> the Vsonic GR01 is more "flagshippy" than the GR07?
> how different does it sound?


 
   
  Yeah the GR01 is technically the current flagship for Vsonic, although didn't gain as much interest as the GR07 since there are already excellent TWFKs out there. As for the sound, I like to sum it up to be somewhat similar to the GR07, but with less bass quantity although quality is top notch, and with a much better treble. Detail wise, the GR01 edges out the GR07.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> it seems to be in the Chinese version of their website:
> http://www.vsonic.com.cn/earphone_product_cn/GR01.htm


 
  oh great, obrigado amigo! now i need to learn chino


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> the noise of the cable


 
  what does it sound like?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> what does it sound like?


 
   
  Microphonics are just how much static and noise is produced in the earphones if the cable is moved, tangled, played with, etc. Less microphonics is better.


----------



## lilboozy

Would playing music loud make it unnoticable even on high microphonic iems


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Would playing music loud make it unnoticable even on high microphonic iems


 
  NO


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Would playing music loud make it unnoticable even on high microphonic iems


 
   
  No, XD


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> the Vsonic GR01 is more "flagshippy" than the GR07?
> how different does it sound?


 
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/603092/review-vsonic-gr01-a-gentlemans-twfk


----------



## musicinmymind

I am looking for GR07 bass with or without free GR04, can someone in this thread please give link for best price from an [size=11pt]Authentic[/size] seller
   
  also please suggest which one is better allrounder GR07 mk2 bass or GR07 mk2


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





musicinmymind said:


> I am looking for GR07 bass with or without free GR04, can someone in this thread please give link for best price from an [size=11pt]Authentic[/size] seller
> 
> also please suggest which one is better allrounder GR07 mk2 bass or GR07 mk2


 
  Well not many people have the bass edition as it was release pretty soon after the mk2 and most people like me already had the mk2. Lendmeurears is an authorized seller of Vsonic but they still don't carry the gr07 bass. You may want to wait till next Tuesday as lendmeurears said they'll will be announcing new products and the gr07 might be among them adn if so it's interesting how they will price it.


----------



## musicinmymind

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks, will keep watching Lendmeurears site


----------



## ljokerl

Added the 1964EARS 1964-V3
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1B9) 1964EARS 1964-V3*
> 
> 
> Reviewed November 2012
> ...


----------



## Johnny Jumper

I found the cable noise to be annoying on the A161s though they did sound incredible.  I like to lay on my side while I listen to music and I couldn't get them to feel comfortable after trying a couple of different tips.  I'm a noobie on audiophile equipment, but I decided to send them back.  Seems like the SE215s might provide better comfort at this price point.  They should also provide better bass since they're using dynamic drivers instead of BAs, correct? 
   
  I'm not a bass head but the music I listen to has a lot of deep tones (think "If 6 was 9" by Jimi Hendrix or the "Gayene Ballet Adagio" from the 2001 soundtrack if you're familiar.  (Yeah, I'm a grey beard...)  
   
  Any recommendations for this kind of listening? 
  
  Thanks!
   
  JJ


----------



## jrcarboleda

Quote: 





musicinmymind said:


> Thanks, will keep watching Lendmeurears site


 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VSONIC-GR07-BASS-Edition-High-Fidelity-Professional-Stereo-Inner-Ear-Earphones-/380504885821?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item5897dbca3d
   
  here try this.. Its on ebay that's why I think its a true seller.. Just always be careful though


----------



## anoxy

joker you should get some Heir 4.Ai soon and do comparisons


----------



## audiobot

Joker!! How about a review of the ATH-CKW1000/CKM1000? Would really like to see how good you consider their sound to be. I would send you my pair if i can part with them when I eventually purchase them (CKM1000 within 2-3 weeks). Just so as long as you burn them in for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





, I would consider it to be a great honor to add another top tier iem to your legendary list. How does one go about assisting you in this endeavor? What is the wait time?


----------



## audiobot

And a quick question for anyone who can reply, are their any customs that go with a straight down cable approach? I am not a big fan of the behind the ear iem. Sucks because I would spend top dollar for them and the best reviewed phones happen to be as such.


----------



## jrcarboleda

Joker,
   
  Have you tried the bass edition of the Vsonic GR07? It could have been much easier if there were no different editions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.. Although I don't think the bass edition will be good for me I want accuracy not a bass boost.. Even if I'm a bass guitar player. I just like to hear music as how they would accurately be.

 I'm fixed on the GR07 maybe I'll just try to find the Mkii.. I found one which sells for $160.. That's why I still hesitate with the free GR04.. Is it also good? I know the GR07 is better but in a sense, are they good?


----------



## garcsa

Hi, maybe somebody knows -  exactly which Knowles BA drivers used in Meelec A161P?
 Thanks.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> Hi, maybe somebody knows -  exactly which Knowles BA drivers used in Meelec A161P?
> Thanks.


 
   



zelda said:


> i can confirm that. A161p uses ED,
> W1 and R-30 use BK. the dunu i 3c too


----------



## Alan278

Joker,
   
  I've ordered the Phonak 232's but they have not shipped yet.  I was able to get them for $450 delivered.
  Now I am reconsidering, and your input would be appreciated.
  .  
  The review you give the 1964-v3 makes them very tempting. 
   
  I chose the phonak's in part because they were your highest rated earphones with phone/mic/control capability (excluding the much much pricier AKG's).  I've checked with 1964 and they say that their buds are compatible with some cables with that control such as this one:
http://www.jhaudio.com/product/mic-cable-smart-phones
   
  (do you have experience with JHAudio buds and how they compare with 1964's?)
   
  Now with impressions and that second cable the 1964's are likely to cost closer to $550 for me, where the Phonak's are $450.
   
  So which should I go for?
   
  Now I will say that I listen to a variety of music - not much electronic/dub type stuff that many other posters seem to enjoy.  I listen to rock, classical, and jazz.  And I have been using the "5" series shure's, mostly the 530's, for many years.  I do really like their sound - cheaper phones when i try them seem to have way over extended bass that is very unrealistic.
   
  That said, the "V" signature of the 232's may be less appealing to me than the 1964's.  Absolute isolation is less of a priority to me than sound quality (I am a listener, not a stage musician!) and I do have some concern about the "maintenance" that would be required with customs - do I need to replace them every few years if my ears change?  (I am 54 years old, if that matters.)
   
  Anyway, any thoughts you have would be appreciated.


----------



## Orel

Hey joker, one more question before I buy the Meelectronics CW31, are they good for metal? That's the most problematic genre I have with headphones, will it work well with these? Thanks


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





zelda said:


>


 
  Yes ED, but which one : http://www.knowles.com/search/family.do?family_id=ED/FED&x_sub_cat_id=10  ???


----------



## OnlinePredator

Is the GR06 comfortable enough to go to sleep with?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I found the cable noise to be annoying on the A161s though they did sound incredible.  I like to lay on my side while I listen to music and I couldn't get them to feel comfortable after trying a couple of different tips.  I'm a noobie on audiophile equipment, but I decided to send them back.  Seems like the SE215s might provide better comfort at this price point.  They should also provide better bass since they're using dynamic drivers instead of BAs, correct?
> 
> I'm not a bass head but the music I listen to has a lot of deep tones (think "If 6 was 9" by Jimi Hendrix or the "Gayene Ballet Adagio" from the 2001 soundtrack if you're familiar.  (Yeah, I'm a grey beard...)
> 
> ...


 
   
  It's not always the case that a dynamic would have more bass than the balanced armature but it's true for the SE215 vs A161P. The SE215 was not 100% comfortable for me for laying on my side as the cable connectors can get in the way but it's still much better than an A161P. I found the VSonic GR06 to be better for sleeping in. 
   
  Quote: 





audiobot said:


> Joker!! How about a review of the ATH-CKW1000/CKM1000? Would really like to see how good you consider their sound to be. I would send you my pair if i can part with them when I eventually purchase them (CKM1000 within 2-3 weeks). Just so as long as you burn them in for me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  From what I understand, they were not tuned to be a huge upgrade over the CKM99 so I never was actively interested in them. Happy to take a listen, though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





audiobot said:


> And a quick question for anyone who can reply, are their any customs that go with a straight down cable approach? I am not a big fan of the behind the ear iem. Sucks because I would spend top dollar for them and the best reviewed phones happen to be as such.


 
   
  There are some companies that offer you the choice between having them molded cable-up or cable-down (e.g. Fabs), and one or two that use rotating cable connectors (e.g. Livewires). Other companies may be able to do it as well with a non-detachable cable but you'd have to ask. 
   
  Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Joker,
> 
> Have you tried the bass edition of the Vsonic GR07?


 
   
  I have not.
   
  Quote: 





alan278 said:


> Joker,
> 
> I've ordered the Phonak 232's but they have not shipped yet.  I was able to get them for $450 delivered.
> Now I am reconsidering, and your input would be appreciated.
> ...


 
   
  I have not heard a JHAudio product yet and when I do it will most likely be way outside the 1964-V3's price category.
   
  Regarding maintenance - from what I understand your ears don't change over time once you're past your late teens. If you gain or lose a significant amount of weight you may have to get them remolded (which is still cheaper than buying a whole new earphone). Other maintenance is minimal - remove wax from the nozzles once in a while and don't leave them in moist areas. 
   
  Also, the 1964-T has quite a bit more bass than the SE530. 
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> Hey joker, one more question before I buy the Meelectronics CW31, are they good for metal? That's the most problematic genre I have with headphones, will it work well with these? Thanks


 
   
  They may be a bit more laid-back in the highs than I like for metal but for $30 you won't do a whole lot better. Soundstage is also a touch flat in terms of depth but not too bad. They are resolving, clear, and not too mid-bassy, which is where a lot of cheap earphones break down for me when it comes to metal. Metal is a pretty broad category, though. I keep a few metal albums on hand for quick benchmarking but the two I use most often are Panopticon by Isis and Arrows & Anchors by Fair to Midland. I think both are quintessential modern metal and both sound just awful with sub-par headphones.


----------



## lilboozy

Joker how would you compare the soundmagic e10 and the she3580 (the es18 uses the e10 drivers and are priced around the she3580)?


----------



## charlesjeon

Hope some of these go on sale for black friday!


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





charlesjeon said:


> Hope some of these go on sale for black friday!


 
   
  +1


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  I'm currently trying to decide between yamaha eph-100 and westone um3x (I own both) and I saw that you gave slightly higher score to UM3X in terms of sound quality. However, I have not been able to notice any difference between them maybe except slightly more laid back treble on the yamahas which may actually be something good for long listening sessions. Vocals sound exactly the same, bass is pretty much equal too. Instrument separation and imaging seems more or less same too. What is your take on these 2 head to head ? I also have SM3 V2 but I already decided to return them since bass is slightly weaker compared to UM3X and EPH-100. I mostly listen to vocal jazz and edm/trance. Should I maybe try something else ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Joker how would you compare the soundmagic e10 and the she3580 (the es18 uses the e10 drivers and are priced around the she3580)?


 
   
  Answered recently: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-263-iems-compared-1964ears-1964-v3-added-11-04-12/8310#post_8751761
   
  Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> I'm currently trying to decide between yamaha eph-100 and westone um3x (I own both) and I saw that you gave slightly higher score to UM3X in terms of sound quality. However, I have not been able to notice any difference between them maybe except slightly more laid back treble on the yamahas which may actually be something good for long listening sessions. Vocals sound exactly the same, bass is pretty much equal too. Instrument separation and imaging seems more or less same too. What is your take on these 2 head to head ? I also have SM3 V2 but I already decided to return them since bass is slightly weaker compared to UM3X and EPH-100. I mostly listen to vocal jazz and edm/trance. Should I maybe try something else ?


 
   
  You should keep the one that sounds best to you. I would only look at other options if neither is satisfactory--both are solid earphones with no major flaws.


----------



## jrcarboleda

Thanks alot Joker, I will be buying the GR07 as soon as possible.. I'm confirming the source I have found that sells it for $160. They still include the hard shell case. Thanks again This thread really helped


----------



## ACST

Hey Joker, first of all thanks for this thread helped me a lot with buying a good set of iems (Vsonic GR07).
   
  But now I'm looking for something a little more easy for on the road (from and to university, work, short trips).
  So I'm searching for a pair of iems which are easy to put in and out, can be worn cable down and don't are to isolated (because I wan't to hear at least something when I'm driving my bike).
  Do you know what would be a good pair for that kind of work?
  Sound signature in the same region as the Vsonic preferably. Budget is around $50,- but a little more or less doesn't really matter.


----------



## harmattan

I know this has been asked may times before, but... any idea when you may be able to get to the TF10s review?  
   
  I recently lost an earphone on my TF10 set and am looking at all options for a replacement set. I really enjoy the TF10s (and the fit is perfect for my gi-normous canals, better than any other IEM I've tried), but there may be something else out there that's comparable in the $150 range that's a better sonic fit for me (looking at RE262s and GR07s). I understand there are dozens of TF10 reviews and impressions out there, but putting it in the context of your discerning ear and rating would be highly useful in my (and I expect, many other's) decision.  Anyways, my 2 cents...


----------



## scootsit

jrcarboleda said:


> Thanks alot Joker, I will be buying the GR07 as soon as possible.. I'm confirming the source I have found that sells it for $160. They still include the hard shell case. Thanks again This thread really helped



isn't that the mk1, with the case, not the two?


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They may be a bit more laid-back in the highs than I like for metal but for $30 you won't do a whole lot better. Soundstage is also a touch flat in terms of depth but not too bad. They are resolving, clear, and not too mid-bassy, which is where a lot of cheap earphones break down for me when it comes to metal. Metal is a pretty broad category, though. I keep a few metal albums on hand for quick benchmarking but the two I use most often are Panopticon by Isis and Arrows & Anchors by Fair to Midland. I think both are quintessential modern metal and both sound just awful with sub-par headphones.


 
  So to sum it up, they would be the best for the price for metal and with smooth treble? 
  The metal I listen to is mostly Panetra, Iron Maiden, Lamb of God, Metallica and more


----------



## jrcarboleda

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> isn't that the mk1, with the case, not the two?


 
  It's the Mk2, they just provide the hard shell case.. I confirmed it from them.. Well.. now that you mention it, I'll make my best efforts to confirm it again maybe with pictures.. Besides, there is nothing to lose for caring too much right?


----------



## ibuckeye

Quick question - is there a better sounding/value IEM than the Hifiman RE-ZERO at its current price of $60? I just ordered a pair and would like to know if I'm missing out. Thanks!


----------



## Zelda

cant say about the ZERO, but had the 0, and the CKM500 is MUCH better


----------



## eyal1983

what is the difference (SQ, Comfort, and Microphonics) between "AKG K3003" and "Fitear togo 334"  ?


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Quote: 





ibuckeye said:


> Quick question - is there a better sounding/value IEM than the Hifiman RE-ZERO at its current price of $60? I just ordered a pair and would like to know if I'm missing out. Thanks!


 
  IMO depends on your priorities. I like the bass of the Sunrise Xcape slightly more as well as the fit, that said, the GR04 is great and the RE-Zero is really hard to beat. $99 meh, $59 yup.


----------



## Bola 7

Joker,

 Did you hear the TF10 with Null Audio Lune Cable? If so, did you like?


----------



## Audio addict19

Hm a yamaha eph-100sl page joker recommended me closed, any other reviews out there? I'd appreciate the help.


----------



## AstralStorm

Interesting, new RE272 arrived, identical to my previous pair in everything (at least it seems so).
  I've managed to unlock potential in those microdrivers. Here's the mod, it's so simple in concept it's funny.
  Execution is a different matter though.
   
  1) Remove the back of the casing - to do so, you need to remove the rubber ring, then use a thin, wide screwdriver to lift the side of the case. A good, relatively safe point to lift it is below the rubber ring.
  Warning: the casing is easy to scratch.
   
  2) Put in as much Comply foam as will fit there, taking care to not fully obscure the "white paper" area, which is the vent.
  (About the size of the ring, 1.5mm deep, with a cutout for the vent.)
  Other kinds of soundproofing closed cell high density foam should also work, perhaps glass wool as well, but this might be hard to pull off.
  3) Put the case back together, it does snap in place with a bit more effort. Remember to rotate the strain reliefs if they dislodged. No excessive force is necessary.
  4) (Optional, recommended) Remove the unnecessary mesh grille.
   
  If someone is really interested, I can make a wiki page with photos later.
   
  Results: vastly increased bass impact, somewhat increased bass levels, much less 2.5kHz resonance giving cleaner midrange, slightly tighter/faster sound in general. Increased isolation, est. 3 dB. Reduced occlusion effect.
  Removal of the mask also increases air slightly. (also about 3 dB?)
   
  Bass is much more agreeable than analytic, "impactless" Brainwavz B2 bass or the original thin bass. Slightly colder than B2, with much more impact and more subbass. Slightly less visceral than extremely powerful SE-5 bass, but that might have something to do with large contact area of the latter - I will experiment with ear molding later.
   
  Again, keep the front foam, it cuts 4 kHz resonance significantly. (More than 6 dB; I think that one is due to the shape of the metal nozzle; foam acting both as a filter and to remove the reflection from the weird flange.)
   
  Tips I used: stock short soft biflange (best), stock long biflange. Comply do something ungainly to the treble.
  Next on the agenda - trimming of the overly long cable strain reliefs if possible (makes fit unstable), otherwise recabing,


----------



## akdapc

Joker
  Thanks for a great review of Thinksound MS01.
  Can you compare MS01 to TS02 and Xears XE200Pro? I am interested in how MS01 compares to these, quantity/quality of bass and the size of soundstage/out-of-headness, etc.  I believe that you no longer have TS02 and XE200Pro so guess it would be from memory 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. 
  I have XE200Pro and TD4 and found XE200Pro to be just as you described in your review and enjoy it a lot and its out-of-head soundstage 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.   TD4, however, seems to be quite different from TD3 as you mentioned before.
  I am guessing MS01 vs TS02 is somewhat simliar to XE200Pro vs TD3: A little more balanced and a bit brighter treble.  I read in another review that bass quantity is similar between TS02 and MS01 but MS01 has better quality and extension..  
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





acst said:


> Hey Joker, first of all thanks for this thread helped me a lot with buying a good set of iems (Vsonic GR07).
> 
> But now I'm looking for something a little more easy for on the road (from and to university, work, short trips).
> So I'm searching for a pair of iems which are easy to put in and out, can be worn cable down and don't are to isolated (because I wan't to hear at least something when I'm driving my bike).
> ...


 
   
  The Ultimate Ears 500 might be your best bet. Seems to be ~$50 on amazon currently. With silicone tips the isolation isn't too great (though still better than many) and the sound, while slightly v-shaped, is clean and competent. Bass is nice for outside use but not overwhelming.
   
  Other options - Xears XR120 (still rather well-isolating and not as easy to get), Soundmagic E10 (bassier than the rest but low isolation and very user-friendly), Maximo iM-590, or MEElec SP51 with the neutral bass port.
   
  Quote: 





harmattan said:


> I know this has been asked may times before, but... any idea when you may be able to get to the TF10s review?
> 
> I recently lost an earphone on my TF10 set and am looking at all options for a replacement set. I really enjoy the TF10s (and the fit is perfect for my gi-normous canals, better than any other IEM I've tried), but there may be something else out there that's comparable in the $150 range that's a better sonic fit for me (looking at RE262s and GR07s). I understand there are dozens of TF10 reviews and impressions out there, but putting it in the context of your discerning ear and rating would be highly useful in my (and I expect, many other's) decision.  Anyways, my 2 cents...


 
   
  I definitely rate the GR07 and RE262 higher than the TF10 - the TF10 for me is in the Shure SE530 - Sony XBA-4 range in terms of sound quality. In fact, I preferred the EPH-100 to the TF10 most of the time when I had it in for review. Keep in mind that they are all different sound signatures, though. 
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> So to sum it up, they would be the best for the price for metal and with smooth treble?
> The metal I listen to is mostly Panetra, Iron Maiden, Lamb of God, Metallica and more


 
   
  The E10 has smoother treble so that's probably the safer choice. Both are very good earphones.
   
  Quote: 





ibuckeye said:


> Quick question - is there a better sounding/value IEM than the Hifiman RE-ZERO at its current price of $60? I just ordered a pair and would like to know if I'm missing out. Thanks!


 
   
  Not that I've heard, personally.
   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> what is the difference (SQ, Comfort, and Microphonics) between "AKG K3003" and "Fitear togo 334"  ?


 
   
  I haven't finished my listening with the TG334 yet but I consider it to be slightly better than the K3003 in comfort and sound quality. Neither has much cable noise. Review should be up late this month.
   
  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker,
> 
> Did you hear the TF10 with Null Audio Lune Cable? If so, did you like?


 
   
  I have not.
   
  Quote: 





audio addict19 said:


> Hm a yamaha eph-100sl page joker recommended me closed, any other reviews out there? I'd appreciate the help.


 
   
  There's a very long EPH-100 thread out in the forum. EPH-100 and EPH-100SL are the same thing.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





akdapc said:


> Joker
> Thanks for a great review of Thinksound MS01.
> Can you compare MS01 to TS02 and Xears XE200Pro? I am interested in how MS01 compares to these, quantity/quality of bass and the size of soundstage/out-of-headness, etc.  I believe that you no longer have TS02 and XE200Pro so guess it would be from memory
> 
> ...


 
   
  The MS01 does improve on the biggest faults I found with the TS02 - the somewhat average clarity and upper treble presence. It won't be as wide-sounding as the XE200Pro but I don't think it'll be far behind. Bass will be cleaner but perhaps slightly less even between mid-bass and sub-bass (the XE200Pro has pretty good deep bass from what I remember). The treble is definitely sparklier on the MS01.


----------



## BleaK

Thank you so much for your hard work, and for the new review of the V3. I placed the order for them a couple of days ago, and I am really looking forward to hearing them.
   
  At the moment I use my Denon 710 and I like the soundstage alot, if you remember what is the difference between the soundstage of 710 and V3?
   
  Again thank you!


----------



## suman134

i just brought an er-4p from dixons at the istanbul airport . are there fake er-4p in the market ? cuz the unit was priced as low as 102 euro , and the shure se215 were 105 euros . can it be fake ?


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The E10 has smoother treble so that's probably the safer choice. Both are very good earphones.


 
  From your review the E10 sounds too bassy, if that's the case I think I'll go with the CW31, I'm liking it. Thanks for the help


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





orel said:


> From your review the E10 sounds too bassy, if that's the case I think I'll go with the CW31, I'm liking it. Thanks for the help


 

               cw31 will be the best choice .


----------



## atistatic

when will we have got Heir IEM and CIEMS reviews, duuuuuuuuuuuuuDE?


----------



## Johnny Jumper

I just saw the spreadsheet (duh) and did some analysis.  Based on ljokerl's excellent reviews, here is a list sorted by the most comfortable and best sound under $120 (for anyone interested...)  Sort order is least to most expensive, the best to worst comfort and then best to worst sound.  All of them scored at least 4/5 on comfort and 7.5/10 on sound:


 Xears TD-III Blackwood v2 VSonic GR06 Fischer Audio Consonance Fischer Audio Eterna ECCI PR401 Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE0 Etymotic Research MC5 / MC2 / MC3 Phiaton PS 20 MEElectronics CC51 / CC51P Audéo Phonak Perfect Bass Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO HiSoundAudio Crystal JVC HA-FXD80 Etymotic Research HF5 / HF2 / HF3 
   
  Now, where to spend my $100...
   
  JJ


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I just saw the spreadsheet (duh) and did some analysis.  Based on ljokerl's excellent reviews, here is a list sorted by the most comfortable and best sound under $120 (for anyone interested...)  Sort order is least to most expensive, the best to worst comfort and then best to worst sound.  All of them scored at least 4/5 on comfort and 7.5/10 on sound:
> 
> 
> Xears TD-III Blackwood v2 VSonic GR06 Fischer Audio Consonance Fischer Audio Eterna ECCI PR401 Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE0 Etymotic Research MC5 / MC2 / MC3 Phiaton PS 20 MEElectronics CC51 / CC51P Audéo Phonak Perfect Bass Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO HiSoundAudio Crystal JVC HA-FXD80 Etymotic Research HF5 / HF2 / HF3
> ...


 
   
         where your signature man , what you want ?  balance hf5 , bass td III , eterna and pr401 , but for a cheap price and all round performance , imo the cc51 and gr06 will top the charts . my vote is for cc51 , awesome under $60 , gr06 not too far but to me it lacks bass and for many it has harsh treble . and for under $120 , i got a er-4p at nearly that price .
   
          ask me , what sounds best , i will say , pick a ety hf5 . but you may not like the ruler flat sound sig .


----------



## AstralStorm

Xears doesn't make the TD3 Blackwood anymore (replaced by TD4 Black Ebony Wood) and their prices have risen (or at least are high in EU).
   
  The safest picks from these are JVC HA-FXD80, Hifiman RE0 and VSonic GR06 in my opinion, in this order. Though RE0 is a bit picky about ears and fit - and has much thinner sound as well as notably worse build quality, but sports superior highs performance. JVC is subbass oriented with low mids cut, while GR06 is somewhat hotter sound with more midbass, kind of similar to a rolled off version of GR07.
  I prefer JVCs in terms of comfort - VSonic's case is blocky and large, yet they require deep insertion for best sound.
   
  RE-ZERO perhaps are an option too, but they're much harder to find, limited edition and whatnot. Better cabling is the most important difference from RE0. Sound is almost identical.
   
  Audeo PFE012 is nice, but a step or two behind the top three in all regards except comfort, which is near perfect.
  Phiaton PS20 is all about pretty midrange and soundstaging, not much else to recommend it.
  Eternas and MEElec CC51 are plain lower quality than the abovementioned competitors.
  Etys HF are, well, balanced armature through and through - with superfast impactless bass (at least correct quantity now, unlike ER4S, but less precise in highs) and excellent precision in the midrange. Highs don't compare to ER4S or RE0 even.
  Etys MC are instead rolled off noticeably and can't compete in general with anything on this list.
   
  I haven't heard Crystal, FA Consonance or ECCI PR401 yet out of this list.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I just saw the spreadsheet (duh) and did some analysis.  Based on ljokerl's excellent reviews, here is a list sorted by the most comfortable and best sound under $120 (for anyone interested...)  Sort order is least to most expensive, the best to worst comfort and then best to worst sound.  All of them scored at least 4/5 on comfort and 7.5/10 on sound:
> 
> 
> Xears TD-III Blackwood v2 VSonic GR06 Fischer Audio Consonance Fischer Audio Eterna ECCI PR401 Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE0 Etymotic Research MC5 / MC2 / MC3 Phiaton PS 20 MEElectronics CC51 / CC51P Audéo Phonak Perfect Bass Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO HiSoundAudio Crystal JVC HA-FXD80 Etymotic Research HF5 / HF2 / HF3
> ...


 
   
  Please provide more details about the type of sound signature you are looking for, and what sound genres you like. I would personally go after the GR06, PFE Perfect Bass, or the HF5.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> where your signature man , what you want ?  balance hf5 , bass td III , eterna and pr401 , but for a cheap price and all round performance , imo the cc51 and gr06 will top the charts . my vote is for cc51 , awesome under $60 , gr06 not too far but to me it lacks bass and for many it has harsh treble . and for under $120 , i got a er-4p at nearly that price .
> 
> ask me , what sounds best , i will say , pick a ety hf5 . but you may not like the ruler flat sound sig .


 

 don't need a lot of bass but I like just about everything from blues to beebop, classical to classic rock.  I'm wondering if flat is what I really want and let the source dictate the highs, mids, and lows? 
   
  HF5's are a little out of my price, I'm pushing it at $100 already, so the GR06 seems pretty good from your rec.  Right form factor for my ears and a lot of agreement on the excellent sound for the price. 
   
  Shure SE215s are still in the mix but lots of folks have trouble with the fit. I did try MEE A161Ps but didn't like the fit.  They seemed really balanced, tho.  I hear mixed reviews for Klipsch S4's but I'm still thinking about them too.
   
  Problem is I don't have a place I can test drive, so it feels like I'm gambling on my first real IEMs...
   
  JJ


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> don't need a lot of bass but I like just about everything from blues to beebop, classical to classic rock.  I'm wondering if flat is what I really want and let the source dictate the highs, mids, and lows?
> 
> HF5's are a little out of my price, I'm pushing it at $100 already, so the GR06 seems pretty good from your rec.  Right form factor for my ears and a lot of agreement on the excellent sound for the price.
> 
> ...


 

 http://www.amazon.com/Etymotic-Research-Portable-In-Ear-Earphones/dp/B000XP8DJC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1352341561&sr=8-1&keywords=hf5
   
  it still may be a bit over your budget, but I think it was one of my best buys. I lost my first pair just to buy them again. The first pair I bought was @ US$ 89 from amazon
   
  Still, the alternatives are not bad.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> don't need a lot of bass but I like just about everything from blues to beebop, classical to classic rock.  I'm wondering if flat is what I really want and let the source dictate the highs, mids, and lows?
> 
> HF5's are a little out of my price, I'm pushing it at $100 already, so the GR06 seems pretty good from your rec.  Right form factor for my ears and a lot of agreement on the excellent sound for the price.


 
  HF5's are perfect for you. Amazon (JR retailer) sells it for $100.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bleak said:


> Thank you so much for your hard work, and for the new review of the V3. I placed the order for them a couple of days ago, and I am really looking forward to hearing them.
> 
> At the moment I use my Denon 710 and I like the soundstage alot, if you remember what is the difference between the soundstage of 710 and V3?
> 
> Again thank you!


 
   
  I haven't heard the C710 in a long time. The V3 isn't extremely spacious but it's really nice and versatile with good depth and layering. I don't think you'll be disappointed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> i just brought an er-4p from dixons at the istanbul airport . are there fake er-4p in the market ? cuz the unit was priced as low as 102 euro , and the shure se215 were 105 euros . can it be fake ?


 
   
  Not that I've heard. I would think the ER4 is pretty safe - not enough room in there for a dynamic driver, which is what every counterfeit I know of has used.
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> From your review the E10 sounds too bassy, if that's the case I think I'll go with the CW31, I'm liking it. Thanks for the help


 
   
  CW31 has less bass for sure. Also not a trebly/fatiguing sound at all.
   
  Quote: 





atistatic said:


> when will we have got Heir IEM and CIEMS reviews, duuuuuuuuuuuuuDE?


 
   
  No set plans at this time but I may get my hands on an 8.A eventually. 
   
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> don't need a lot of bass but I like just about everything from blues to beebop, classical to classic rock.  I'm wondering if flat is what I really want and let the source dictate the highs, mids, and lows?
> 
> HF5's are a little out of my price, I'm pushing it at $100 already, so the GR06 seems pretty good from your rec.  Right form factor for my ears and a lot of agreement on the excellent sound for the price.
> 
> ...


 
   
  What didn't you like about the fit of the A161P? It's one of the more comfortable deep-insertion earphones I've used. If that deep of a seal didn't work for you, the HF5 probably won't either. In that case I'd try something with a shallower fit, like the GR06 or Rock-It R-30.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> don't need a lot of bass but I like just about everything from blues to beebop, classical to classic rock.  I'm wondering if flat is what I really want and let the source dictate the highs, mids, and lows?
> 
> HF5's are a little out of my price, I'm pushing it at $100 already, so the GR06 seems pretty good from your rec.  Right form factor for my ears and a lot of agreement on the excellent sound for the price.
> 
> ...


 
   
              gr06 i think will suit you best , not a bass phone , really nice mids and a bit peaky highs , and i like those highs . only trouble is over the ear is the only way with gr06 .
              and man , hf5 worth that push of $10 , at $110 you are getting gem of a phone . best balance for the price range . jhelsas has shared a well priced link too .
              se215 is over priced , here it is $120 , and at the price i can get a gr06 and a ue500 . and image s4 is the least you need , least refined phone for $70 . unless you want big bass with
              harsh high . MEE a161p , sadly is not available here .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not that I've heard. I would think the ER4 is pretty safe - not enough room in there for a dynamic driver, which is what every counterfeit I know of has used.


 
               thanks , it sounds like genuine , but the price is what got my attention .


----------



## AstralStorm

Well, I wouldn't recommend GR06 for classic rock, they add unwarranted hotness and bite to its sound; less than GR07 though. JVCs on the other hand may have too much bass changing the focus.
  RE0 is nice if you expect to fix it if it breaks - it's a bit distorted in the mids. Ety HF5 is also nice for this genre, a bit 4k-shouty, but they have too little bass impact, so drums don't sound exactly natural even if they do sound neutral. They also require very deep fit too.


----------



## BleaK

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the C710 in a long time. The V3 isn't extremely spacious but it's really nice and versatile with good depth and layering. I don't think you'll be disappointed


 
  Thank you for your response, this is my first plunge into customs so I hope I will be satisfied! I placed the order a day or so before your review came out and I am really happy they ended up almost on top of your point scale


----------



## lootr5858

can anyone tell me how ue700 fares? the sound quality and build
  i have one here but have mixed feelings about it (sometimes sound very marvelous in my ears but at times can be irritating)
  please ignore the price comparison between ue700 and triple fi 10 cos ue 700 is priced at S$189 and the latter is at S$649, though i noe amazon sell ue 700 at US$160+ currently


----------



## suman134

the sound quality is good for the price , i paid $135 for the ue 700 , sound is flat , bass is good as its got two drivers . but cant take on dynamics at all , vocal mids are awesome , upper mid is a bit off and highs are not bad , still 90% people wont notice that at all , cuz the sound is so involving and cohesive that it keeps you engaged for the whole time unless you are using low quality audio tracks which have flaws in themselves . ue700 is not forgiving like its big brother triple fi10 . but not worst too .
            build is bad , the chrome paint comes off with time , i had cable problem with both of my units ( one i brought and one they replaced ) . at the end i ended up with a ue600 replacement and a gaming mouse . i had to take the ue600 cuz they refused to give me the third ue700 , its not that bad but still bad enough to call it bad . i loved the sound quality but sadly the build is not for me . after use , put it in the case , dont put stress on the cable , take care of the entry points at earphones as they dont have any stress reliever . ue 600 is nearly same in build but its still running . may be i have become cautious .


----------



## Joe Bloggs

johnny jumper said:


> HF5's are a little out of my price, I'm pushing it at $100 already, so the GR06 seems pretty good from your rec.  Right form factor for my ears and a lot of agreement on the excellent sound for the price.
> 
> Shure SE215s are still in the mix but lots of folks have trouble with the fit. I did try MEE A161Ps but didn't like the fit.  They seemed really balanced, tho.  I hear mixed reviews for Klipsch S4's but I'm still thinking about them too.
> 
> ...




Get the ety MC5, sounds 90% the same as the hf5 or even ER4 for well within your price range. Most important thing with etys is to get a deep fit somehow, not how expensive the model.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the C710 in a long time. The V3 isn't extremely spacious but it's really nice and versatile with good depth and layering. I don't think you'll be disappointed
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Couldn't get a good over the ear fit with the A161Ps.  I also sometimes like to lay on my side when I'm listening and the shell fo the A161P is a little large.  Worried that a deep insertion tip may not be for me anyway.  GR06 keeps coming up as a possibility but I did a lot of reading about Phonak 021/022s last night.  Very interesting especially with the filters that change the sound signature.  Might be a good starter for me so I can experiment and discover what signature I'm most comfortable with.
   
  Besides relax time, I listen for hours at work, so comfort, isolation and build quality are important.
   
  JJ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> gr06 i think will suit you best , not a bass phone , really nice mids and a bit peaky highs , and i like those highs . only trouble is over the ear is the only way with gr06 .
> and man , hf5 worth that push of $10 , at $110 you are getting gem of a phone . best balance for the price range . jhelsas has shared a well priced link too .
> se215 is over priced , here it is $120 , and at the price i can get a gr06 and a ue500 . and image s4 is the least you need , least refined phone for $70 . unless you want big bass with
> harsh high . MEE a161p , sadly is not available here .


 
   
  Doesn't meelec ship worldwide from their site?
   
  Quote: 





bleak said:


> Thank you for your response, this is my first plunge into customs so I hope I will be satisfied! I placed the order a day or so before your review came out and I am really happy they ended up almost on top of your point scale


 
   
   
  There's some work to be done on the scale and more customs incoming but I expect them to stay top 3 for a while 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
   
  Quote: 





lootr5858 said:


> can anyone tell me how ue700 fares? the sound quality and build
> i have one here but have mixed feelings about it (sometimes sound very marvelous in my ears but at times can be irritating)
> please ignore the price comparison between ue700 and triple fi 10 cos ue 700 is priced at S$189 and the latter is at S$649, though i noe amazon sell ue 700 at US$160+ currently


 
   
   
   
  Sound-wise it's quite good though maybe not worth $150+ when you can get the Brainwavz B2 or Rock-It Sounds R-50, both superior tunings of the same driver in my opinion, for $120-140. Bass is linear but not very powerful as with all TWFKs. Treble is bright, I thought more so than B2 and definitely more so than R-50. I found the two different types of UE700s to sound different: http://www.head-fi.org/t/599247/heads-up-two-versions-of-the-ue700
   
   
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Couldn't get a good over the ear fit with the A161Ps.  I also sometimes like to lay on my side when I'm listening and the shell fo the A161P is a little large.  Worried that a deep insertion tip may not be for me anyway.  GR06 keeps coming up as a possibility but I did a lot of reading about Phonak 021/022s last night.  Very interesting especially with the filters that change the sound signature.  Might be a good starter for me so I can experiment and discover what signature I'm most comfortable with.
> 
> Besides relax time, I listen for hours at work, so comfort, isolation and build quality are important.
> 
> JJ


 
   
  You won't be able to lay on your side with Etys, either.
   
   
   
  FYI, the Phonak 021 only comes with 1 type of filters. Additional ones have to be purchase separately.


----------



## Gandasaputra

Dear Joker,
   
  I have owned a yamaha eph-100 for 5 months and love with the sound quality. Then I bought westone 4 and thought (and in regard to your review) that its sound would be far superior than the yamaha. I've spent 2 months listening to westone 4 almost everyday, and realize that it sounds...quite boring? I tend to crank up the volume to make it sounds fuller, which could hurt my hearing.
   
  Then I went back to the yamaha and its sound quality destroys the westone because I feel that yamaha got the sub-bass while the westone don't. I think westone is more analytic than fun?


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> MEE a161p , sadly is not available here .


 
  You can obtain any MEELEC product from their site meelec.com, it ships to all the countries. If USPS first class international isnt displayed there, you can mail to their customer service, mike@s2einc.com, he is a great sport and provides excellent customer service one can imagine. Shipping rates are reasonable and they ship worldwide with worldwide warranty, they have a very good warranty service so no need to panic for 1 year


----------



## kova4a

There's one thing you're forgetting and that's the a161p has been out of stock for several weeks on the meelec site.


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> There's one thing you're forgetting and that's the a161p has been out of stock for several weeks on the meelec site.


 

 Yeah, they would be in stock in december at the earliest(got info from mike@s2einc.com), I happened to be the last one to grab em, thats too due to in stock inventory count off by 1..mike checked them for me and I got it shipped, I might get it soon...
   
  A151 would also take december to get restocked, even though amazon has a lot units left of both a151 and a161p.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> You can obtain any MEELEC product from their site meelec.com, it ships to all the countries. If USPS first class international isnt displayed there, you can mail to their customer service, mike@s2einc.com, he is a great sport and provides excellent customer service one can imagine. Shipping rates are reasonable and they ship worldwide with worldwide warranty, they have a very good warranty service so no need to panic for 1 year


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Doesn't meelec ship worldwide from their site?


 
            it does , but they dont have the model out here in the market and the service person says they wont cover it with warranty , so i had to turn down a customer and disappoint my self too . they ship world wide ( x-ears and may more ) but when you have to send it to the service center , the shipping is on you . i had a scene with ue , they covered it but made a issue of it , for me , no service , no buy .


----------



## aras

Quote: 





gandasaputra said:


> Dear Joker,
> 
> I have owned a yamaha eph-100 for 5 months and love with the sound quality. Then I bought westone 4 and thought (and in regard to your review) that its sound would be far superior than the yamaha. I've spent 2 months listening to westone 4 almost everyday, and realize that it sounds...quite boring? I tend to crank up the volume to make it sounds fuller, which could hurt my hearing.
> 
> Then I went back to the yamaha and its sound quality destroys the westone because I feel that yamaha got the sub-bass while the westone don't. I think westone is more analytic than fun?


 
   
  Eph-100 is one underrated earphone for sure. At $150 I think they are a steal. I'm comparing them to $350 Westone UM3X and Earsonics SM3 right now. I certainly like it more than SM3. UM3X is very difficult. I think they sound very similar if not the same but then UM3X costs more than twice the Yamahas...


----------



## CommanerKeen

Hi,I'm looking for recommendations for a new pair of IEMs. Budget under 100$.
  Currently with the MEelectronic's A151 for close to a year but I've had some problems with them recently,and I'll try to send it back for RMA. Before that, I had the Brainwavz M2 that didn't last long(few months,and didn't bother sending for repair) but it sounded great. And before that,it was the MEe's M9. Currently listening mostly to rock\stoner and such,like to have details with a good bass. I'm in Canada,so the availability\price of few pairs might not be the same. Few deals that I noticed are the Brainwavz M4 for 30$,Klipsch S4 for 40$ or the RE-Zero for ~70$
  Thanks!


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Get the ety MC5, sounds 90% the same as the hf5 or even ER4 for well within your price range. Most important thing with etys is to get a deep fit somehow, not how expensive the model.


 
  No it doesn't. General signature is similar, but MC5 rolls at 11 kHz, while HF5 far, far higher, I think 17 kHz. MC5 has some semblance of impact, while HF5 has almost none.
  Less technically, HF5 is airier and has larger soundstage, but MC5 has slightly better bass. The airiness helps much more than the bit of bass impact.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gandasaputra said:


> Dear Joker,
> 
> I have owned a yamaha eph-100 for 5 months and love with the sound quality. Then I bought westone 4 and thought (and in regard to your review) that its sound would be far superior than the yamaha. I've spent 2 months listening to westone 4 almost everyday, and realize that it sounds...quite boring? I tend to crank up the volume to make it sounds fuller, which could hurt my hearing.
> 
> Then I went back to the yamaha and its sound quality destroys the westone because I feel that yamaha got the sub-bass while the westone don't. I think westone is more analytic than fun?


 
   
  And that is why personal preferences matter...
   
  Quote: 





kova4a said:


> There's one thing you're forgetting and that's the a161p has been out of stock for several weeks on the meelec site.


 
   
  Good point.
   
  Quote: 





commanerkeen said:


> Hi,I'm looking for recommendations for a new pair of IEMs. Budget under 100$.
> Currently with the MEelectronic's A151 for close to a year but I've had some problems with them recently,and I'll try to send it back for RMA. Before that, I had the Brainwavz M2 that didn't last long(few months,and didn't bother sending for repair) but it sounded great. And before that,it was the MEe's M9. Currently listening mostly to rock\stoner and such,like to have details with a good bass. I'm in Canada,so the availability\price of few pairs might not be the same. Few deals that I noticed are the Brainwavz M4 for 30$,Klipsch S4 for 40$ or the RE-Zero for ~70$
> Thanks!


 
   
  If you like the M2 you'll probably like the new M5 also. Haven't heard the M4. The VSonic GR06 is a good deal and will have more bass than your A151 along with better treble presence. Closer to $100 there's also the Shure SE215, HiSound Crystal, and Phonak 012. With the exception of the M5 these are all less bassy than the M2 but more bassy than the A151, providing a well-measured punch.


----------



## Dissonant

Hi Joker, I would just like your recommendation for an IEM that has the openness and soundstaging of the EX600 with a slightly more extended bass and smoother treble (I can accept a very little bit less crispness), yet keeping pretty much the same level of resolution and bass texture with a black background and little, if any graininess. My budget would be around the same price as the EX600, and I was considering the Rock-it R50, Vsonic GR07 mk2 and the EPH-100. Would any of these fit the bill, or are there any other options out there? I can accept waiting for something higher-end on the used market on the same budget ($120 -150)
   
  I am looking to drive them out of my Nokia N9, possibly an ODAC + Fiio E5 at most in the future.
  Thanks!


----------



## lootr5858

thanks joker and suman
  i noe the cable's bad and got mine replaced once
  the one i bought is the old version and the replaced ue700 is the new version
  don't have very big sound diff though, but still like the replacement better
  Brainwavz B2 is too expensive for me (S$300+) and cant find R-50 in singapore for the moment, but maybe its just the singapore's pricing
  thanks anyways


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dissonant said:


> Hi Joker, I would just like your recommendation for an IEM that has the openness and soundstaging of the EX600 with a slightly more extended bass and smoother treble (I can accept a very little bit less crispness), yet keeping pretty much the same level of resolution and bass texture with a black background and little, if any graininess. My budget would be around the same price as the EX600, and I was considering the Rock-it R50, Vsonic GR07 mk2 and the EPH-100. Would any of these fit the bill, or are there any other options out there? I can accept waiting for something higher-end on the used market on the same budget ($120 -150)
> 
> I am looking to drive them out of my Nokia N9, possibly an ODAC + Fiio E5 at most in the future.
> Thanks!


 
   
  Seems like you want an upgrade from the EX600 with none of the weaknesses and all of the strengths for the same amount of money. That's quite unrealistic. The R-50 is probably closest to what you want but it doesn't quite have the out-of-the-head headstage of the EX600, or the same amount of mid-bass impact. Its bass is very linear but don't expect much deep bass rumble. The GR07 (mkI) is better on the bass front but has some treble unevenness so I wouldn't say it does what you want either. The EPH-100 has the deep bass and smooth treble but gives up the out-of-the-head feel and some of the clarity of the EX600.


----------



## Inks

GR07 MKII perhaps, it's not offensive IMO despite still having the inevitable spike at 6k (sibilance region). As long as you don't turn them up too loud and the recordings don't suck, it's pleasant. 7550 fits the bill as well in sound, but not price range. 
   
  R50 is a nice choice, but it's quite more different than the GR07 is, as joker states.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

I'm down to three I think: vsonic GR06, phonak audeo PFE012, or shure SE215. Any last recommendation on these based on comfort and build quality? Based on the reviews they should all be real treats for my ears,

I don't believe the Etys will work as all round IEMs simply because I won't be able to lay on my side with them. If I could get two pair I'd get HF5s plus Mee m6. Perfect isolation for work and something for quiet listening at home. I keep coming back to the shures as a safe choice... Good sound, comfort, and warranty.

JJ


----------



## lootr5858

if you mean an upgrade you may consider EX1000 which is way over your price range ($400+ i think not sure) and may have been discountinued
  as far as i read, there is no iem that really matches EX600 and 1000 in terms of soundstage, unless you want those custom iem above $1000, plus the sound signature of EX600 is very unique, few iem can mimic it
  i've not heard any iem with soundstage as good as EX600 though and that price range is near impossible
  ue700 is quite good in terms of soundstage but severely lacking in bass and definitely not better than EX600
  get headphones if you want good soundstage, like bose AE2


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I'm down to three I think: vsonic GR06, phonak audeo PFE012, or shure SE215. Any last recommendation on these based on comfort and build quality? Based on the reviews they should all be real treats for my ears,
> I don't believe the Etys will work as all round IEMs simply because I won't be able to lay on my side with them. If I could get two pair I'd get HF5s plus Mee m6. Perfect isolation for work and something for quiet listening at home. I keep coming back to the shures as a safe choice... Good sound, comfort, and warranty.
> JJ


 
   
          go for gr06 , they will go over the ear and will not bother much even if you lay on your side with them on ( none of the above too ) the reason im pushing for gr06 is its a better value for money between these 3 .


----------



## CommanerKeen

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> And that is why personal preferences matter...
> 
> 
> Good point.
> ...


 
  Thanks,I'll look into that!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I'm down to three I think: vsonic GR06, phonak audeo PFE012, or shure SE215. Any last recommendation on these based on comfort and build quality? Based on the reviews they should all be real treats for my ears,
> I don't believe the Etys will work as all round IEMs simply because I won't be able to lay on my side with them. If I could get two pair I'd get HF5s plus Mee m6. Perfect isolation for work and something for quiet listening at home. I keep coming back to the shures as a safe choice... Good sound, comfort, and warranty.
> JJ


 

 I had problems laying down with the SE215 and SE535 because of the bulky cable connectors but it's probably just my ears. Other than that they are pretty good all-rounders.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I'm down to three I think: vsonic GR06, phonak audeo PFE012, or shure SE215. Any last recommendation on these based on comfort and build quality? Based on the reviews they should all be real treats for my ears,


 
  If comfort is the main factor, Audeo PFE012 is the best of the lot, but Shure SE215 is relatively close. I like PFE's sound much more than these Shures though. VSonic's bulky squarish body, the need for deep insertion for best sound and relative dearth of tips that fit 3.5mm nozzle causes comfort problems.
   
  (Actually, PFE also take 3.5mm nozzle tips, but they don't need deep insertion and they have non-tapering nozzle, so many 4,5mm tips also fit well and don't slip.)


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  Is 1964 Ears V3 sound signature similar to UM3X or SM3 ?


----------



## RickH9

Hey,

Would you recommend the Westone 4 or the Ultimate Ears Ue 900, regardless of price?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> Is 1964 Ears V3 sound signature similar to UM3X or SM3 ?


 
   
  No, it's more "fun" and colored.
   
  Quote: 





rickh9 said:


> Hey,
> Would you recommend the Westone 4 or the Ultimate Ears Ue 900, regardless of price?


 

 They are priced similarly in the first place so it really depends on what type of sound you are after.


----------



## EveTan

ljokerl said:


> No, it's more "fun"




Ive always wondered, what is the standard definition of a "fun" signature around head-fi.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





evetan said:


> Ive always wondered, what is the standard definition of a "fun" signature around head-fi.


 

 I think V-shape of the frequency response with no lack of bass impact. In other words, some low bass boost and high mids/low treble boost; perhaps some mid treble boost.
   
  It's also commonly known as "enhanced" signature. Think a slight turn on the "loudness" control.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> I think V-shape of the frequency response with no lack of bass impact. In other words, some low bass boost and high mids/low treble boost; perhaps some mid treble boost.
> 
> It's also commonly known as "enhanced" signature. Think a slight turn on the "loudness" control.


 
   
  +1.
   
  In a more general sense, I think 'fun' is a blanket term people use for when something is not neutral in regards to source but sounds good nonetheless.


----------



## EveTan

ljokerl said:


> +1.
> 
> In a more general sense, I think 'fun' is a blanket term people use for when something is not neutral in regards to source but sounds good nonetheless.




Which signature would you say brings the most clarity? My ideal signature is something that has both clarity in vocals, strings, piano etc but also still has some of the umpf of the bass.


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> it does , but they dont have the model out here in the market and the service person says they wont cover it with warranty , so i had to turn down a customer and disappoint my self too . they ship world wide ( x-ears and may more ) but when you have to send it to the service center , the shipping is on you . i had a scene with ue , they covered it but made a issue of it , for me , no service , no buy .


 

 Meelectronics has the best customer service you can ever imagine. I had 2-3 issues with their products(that too due to my mishandling) and their response was very good. For some products, I didnt even need to send them back. You can rely on buying from meelectronics, they reply fast and replace things fast. Check out others who had the same experience with meelectronics, you cant really find even 1 customer with bad experience..I found all of their products worth for their price overall, though SQ isnt their strength, they score big in all other aspects. I have 5 meelectronics products till now (M6,S6,R1,a161p and AF32) and I liked all of them with their price/performance considering the whole package..
   
  I just got my Meelectronics a161p, the packaging is absolutely great, so bright and attractive to the eyes, accessories as well as everything seems great. I will give my impressions after some sessions of listening, overall from the outset of the package it looks great, the IEM itself is attractive and all. Fit seems comfortable and isolating than all of my IEMs with over-the-ear cable guides and Triple Flanges(large). Overall , impressed for now with the purchase


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





evetan said:


> Which signature would you say brings the most clarity? My ideal signature is something that has both clarity in vocals, strings, piano etc but also still has some of the umpf of the bass.


 
   
  Sounds like a V signature.  The hardest part is to have a smooth but elevated treble.  This depends on the seal and tips used as well as the IEM's own sound.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





evetan said:


> Which signature would you say brings the most clarity? My ideal signature is something that has both clarity in vocals, strings, piano etc but also still has some of the umpf of the bass.


 

 Generally, a flat one. However, enhanced treble and brighter sound can sometimes create the illusion of even greater clarity, depending on where the boost is. This is how earphones such as the JVC FX40 and PureSound ClarityOne generally sound clearer than the competition. 
   
  If you also want enhanced bass then I agree with Joe, a v-shaped sound is probably best.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Okay, pulled the trigger on Shure SE215s.  wish me luck...
   
  Gonna continue to use my Koss KSC75's for listening while lying down.  Maybe I'll get MEE M6/S6 later for casual listening.
   
  I might post a noob review once I get the Shures.
   
  JJ


----------



## Nisten

Hey Joker, would you pull the trigger on a pair of UE 900s for $250, new? I was thinking about saving up for 1964 Ears' V3s but am wondering if this is a deal too good to pass up.


----------



## RickH9

nisten said:


> Hey Joker, would you pull the trigger on a pair of UE 900s for $250, new? I was thinking about saving up for 1964 Ears' V3s but am wondering if this is a deal too good to pass up.




Where are you finding these for $250 new!? I want to get a pair!!! :eek:


----------



## hitme987

+1!!


----------



## Saraguie

Quote: 





rickh9 said:


> Where are you finding these for $250 new!? I want to get a pair!!!


 
  + 2


----------



## christobit

Hi Joker,
   
  Love your work!  My current rig is Fisher DBA-O2 (mk2) with JDS Labs O2.  Love the aggressive analytical detailed sound, though at times the sibilance is bothersome.  Have been thinking of an upgrade, and have been considering the Alclair Reference.  Also looking at the 1964 V3 and the CTM 200.  The Reference sounded good as it provides a nice sounding blend of musicality and detail.  Am ok with full shell monitors.  However since I can't demo all 3 was wondering what your view is - my perfect sound is that of my current rig sans sibilance, and with a flat presentation, a nice blend of musicality and detail, leaning toward detail.  My prefered music is prog, jazz, rock.  I use a ipod classic and only bit rate 256 and above.
   
  Many thanks!


----------



## Nisten

Quote: 





rickh9 said:


> Where are you finding these for $250 new!? I want to get a pair!!!


 
   
  Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> +1!!


 
   
  Quote: 





saraguie said:


> + 2


 
  Believe me guys, if this was a retailer I would spread the word! I found a local, private seller wanting to get rid of his.


----------



## RickH9

nisten said:


> Believe me guys, if this was a retailer I would spread the word! I found a local, private seller wanting to get rid of his.




I had my hopes up


----------



## impoki02

Hi Joker,

 Any schedule in reivewing DUNU  DN-19 Tai Chi. A little bit thoughts could be great. （Not to rush you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




）
   
  I am very interested in those kind of tunable products. The Meelectronics sp51, I have tried it but it's unfortunate not so good with the tuning out come.
   
  It's simply only able to tune by yourself. To me it's like a toy and not to mention the SQ. I already tried IE8. It's very good sound thought tuning effect still not so prominent.
   
  Just wondering How you see the DN-19's tuning and SQ.  I may probably get one if you think it's good.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nisten said:


> Hey Joker, would you pull the trigger on a pair of UE 900s for $250, new? I was thinking about saving up for 1964 Ears' V3s but am wondering if this is a deal too good to pass up.


 
   
  It really depends on whether the signature is right for you. The V3 sounds pretty different - bassier, more forward in the midrange, and more intimate in the way records are presented. As an all-rounder the UE900 is pretty darn good for $250 and you'll probably be able to re-sell it and not lose much when you're done with it.
   
  Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Love your work!  My current rig is Fisher DBA-O2 (mk2) with JDS Labs O2.  Love the aggressive analytical detailed sound, though at times the sibilance is bothersome.  Have been thinking of an upgrade, and have been considering the Alclair Reference.  Also looking at the 1964 V3 and the CTM 200.  The Reference sounded good as it provides a nice sounding blend of musicality and detail.  Am ok with full shell monitors.  However since I can't demo all 3 was wondering what your view is - my perfect sound is that of my current rig sans sibilance, and with a flat presentation, a nice blend of musicality and detail, leaning toward detail.  My prefered music is prog, jazz, rock.  I use a ipod classic and only bit rate 256 and above.
> 
> Many thanks!


 
   
  Just wrote this up for a PM but figured I might as well re-post it here:
   
  Alclair Reference: good bass and clarity, spacious presentation, high levels of detail, can be a bit hot in the treble. Universal counterparts: Phonak PFE232, VSonic GR07

 1964EARS 1964-V3: enhanced bass with prominent mids; good dynamics; well-layered presentation; overall "fun" sound. Universal counterparts: AKG K3003, JVC HA-FXT90

 ClearTuneMonitors CTM-200: Neutral tone with a balanced signature; spacious presentation, smooth treble, lacks a bit of deep bass; Universal counterparts: HiFiMan RE272, VSonic GR01
   
  None of these are perfect - you'll be making trade-offs whichever way you go. The CTM-200 has the smoothest treble but also won't be as detailed and effortless as the Reference (especially in the bass region). The V3 is not as neutral as either of those two but very enjoyable nonetheless. Personally I prefer the signature of the CTM-200 but the technical ability of the Reference 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
  Quote: 





impoki02 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Any schedule in reivewing DUNU  DN-19 Tai Chi. A little bit thoughts could be great. （Not to rush you
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, I have a DN-19 in the queue. Currently working on the I 3-CS, though. 
   
  The SP51 remains one of the more 'tunable' ones I've heard. Generally the differences with tuning ports are pretty mild. With the DN-19, based on the very limited listening I've done so far, the tuning seems to only affect the bass. I prefer it with the 'flatter' tuning. Not quite sure where it ranks overall at this point but its review shouldn't be far off.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





impoki02 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Any schedule in reivewing DUNU  DN-19 Tai Chi. A little bit thoughts could be great. （Not to rush you
> 
> ...


 
   
  You can have much more fun with an EQ


----------



## christobit

Thanks a ton!  You have helped me rule out the V3.  I'm thinking that CTM-200 paired with JDS O2 would be closer to my current rig (DBA-O2 with JDS O2).  Would that be right?  If so, I'm probably better off going with the Reference for a different yet upgraded option.  Would you agree?
   
  Cheers


----------



## eyal1983

how does one decide between W4 to UM3x ?
   
  and in general: what is the difference between "Universal Monitors" and "Westone Series"?
  ( http://www.westone.com/music/index.php/products/custom-or-universal.html )
   
  so far, had experience with gr06, and fxt90, and waiting on ie80 to arrive...
   
   
  thanks!


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  What do you think is the most natural non-fatiguing sound signature for listening to both male and female vocals and also what is your perception EPH-100's vocal performance lets say compared to SM3 or UM3X ? I feel like EPH-100 sounds slightly more raw and realistic with vocals whereas SM3 and UM3X make vocals sounds smoother, more silk like but in return slightly less realistic I guess.  I especially notice this with Melody Gardot - Our love is easy. Just wanted to ask your take on this


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> how does one decide between W4 to UM3x ?
> 
> and in general: what is the difference between "Universal Monitors" and "Westone Series"?
> ( http://www.westone.com/music/index.php/products/custom-or-universal.html )
> ...


 
   
  Westone series provide a more audiophile-like sound, while the Universal Monitors are designed more for on-stage usage.


----------



## impoki02

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, I have a DN-19 in the queue. Currently working on the I 3-CS, though.
> 
> The SP51 remains one of the more 'tunable' ones I've heard. Generally the differences with tuning ports are pretty mild. With the DN-19, based on the very limited listening I've done so far, the tuning seems to only affect the bass. I prefer it with the 'flatter' tuning. Not quite sure where it ranks overall at this point but its review shouldn't be far off.


 
   
  Thanks man appreciate the quick response. And looking forward to you review 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> You can have much more fun with an EQ


 
   
  Great saying and I agree what you said.
   
  However, I think following the manufacture's tuning should be more nature (uncertain about this).

 I don't like the player's EQ that make me feel that I will get not really nature sound by digital tuning.
   
  There should be some degree that sound have been altered by digital tuning except simply the frequency boost or reduction.


----------



## Zariz

Hello joker, you seem extremely knowledgeable (and laborious!), so here's me asking for a recommendation (I made a thread):
   



zariz said:


> I need IEMs for listening to FLACs/LAME MP3s w/ my old Cowon D2 in the subway
> 
> I listen to classical, hardcore, 90's rap and everything in between except for metal and 'droning dance electronica'
> 
> ...


 

   
  thread is http://www.head-fi.org/t/636185/kid-looking-for-veterans-experience-using-cowon-starting-audiophilia
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





christobit said:


> Thanks a ton!  You have helped me rule out the V3.  I'm thinking that CTM-200 paired with JDS O2 would be closer to my current rig (DBA-O2 with JDS O2).  Would that be right?  If so, I'm probably better off going with the Reference for a different yet upgraded option.  Would you agree?
> 
> Cheers


 
   
  I have no idea how the DBA-02 sounds from your setup but I can say that the Reference will have comparatively more bass and more treble than the CTM-200. The DBA-02 is between the two, probably closer to the CTM-200 in bass and the Reference in treble. 
   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> how does one decide between W4 to UM3x ?
> 
> and in general: what is the difference between "Universal Monitors" and "Westone Series"?
> ( http://www.westone.com/music/index.php/products/custom-or-universal.html )
> ...


 
   
  The UM3X is more forward and intimate, with less treble energy. Generally, the W series are Westone's consumer/audiophile monitors though their signatures vary quite a bit (when comparing the W1 to the W3, for example).
   
  Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> What do you think is the most natural non-fatiguing sound signature for listening to both male and female vocals and also what is your perception EPH-100's vocal performance lets say compared to SM3 or UM3X ? I feel like EPH-100 sounds slightly more raw and realistic with vocals whereas SM3 and UM3X make vocals sounds smoother, more silk like but in return slightly less realistic I guess.  I especially notice this with Melody Gardot - Our love is easy. Just wanted to ask your take on this


 
   
  I haven't heard the UM3X in a very long time and the SM3 is a little different in signature. If pressed I would say the EPH-100 does female vocals better than the SM2 and SM3, partly because there is more upper midrange energy (the lack of which is part of what makes the SM2 and SM3 sound so soft and smooth).
   
   
  Quote: 





zariz said:


> Hello joker, you seem extremely knowledgeable (and laborious!), so here's me asking for a recommendation (I made a thread):


 
   
  There are quite a few earphones that will do what you want - under $70 I would recommend checking out the VSonic GR06, Rock-It Sounds R-30, and maybe the Ultimate Ears 500 or MEElec CC51 if you're willing to concede some durability. Under $120 you have tons of choices depending on the exact signature you want, from properly balanced and detail-oriented monitors such as the Rock-It R-50, MEElec A161P, and Etymotic HF5 to slightly 'safer' enhanced-bass options like the Shure SE215 and HiSound Crystal (these two are very well-built as well). You won't have to worry about muddy bass with any of these, especially if they will be your first higher-end in-ears.


----------



## Zariz

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There are quite a few earphones that will do what you want - under $70 I would recommend checking out the VSonic GR06, Rock-It Sounds R-30, and maybe the Ultimate Ears 500 or MEElec CC51 if you're willing to concede some durability. Under $120 you have tons of choices depending on the exact signature you want, from properly balanced and detail-oriented monitors such as the Rock-It R-50, MEElec A161P, and Etymotic HF5 to slightly 'safer' enhanced-bass options like the Shure SE215 and HiSound Crystal (these two are very well-built as well). You won't have to worry about muddy bass with any of these, especially if they will be your first higher-end in-ears.


 
  Thank you for the quick answer, I've been reading your reviews for those sets-
   
  Unfortunately I'm not very experienced with IEMs, so what worries me is: is it possible for the more analytical sets to sound boring to me? I'm not necessarily looking for very revealing 'studio monitor' earphones, and those comments about phones like the RE0 sounding 'sterile' worry me, but maybe those comments come from boomy-sound fans?
   
  Also, considering that I'm concerned about diminishing returns, say I would stretch my budget to ~$250, would you say there's an ideal bet for what I'm looking for, and would it be 'worth it' for a newcomer?
  Edit: On the same note, is there a pair of phones that constitute, in your opinion, an 'ultimate value', that do more or less what I want them to do?
   
  I hope answering these questions is enjoyable for you and not tiring, hehe.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

ljokerl, I read your take on the demo UM Miracle compared to the custom UM Miracle, and it really made me disappointed about the universal model. However, is it possible that you can rate its sound quality on a scale of 1-10 or compare it with a high end universal such as the PFE232 or K3003? Sorry if you can't remember the sound since I know its been over a year.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zariz said:


> Unfortunately I'm not very experienced with IEMs, so what worries me is: is it possible for the more analytical sets to sound boring to me? I'm not necessarily looking for very revealing 'studio monitor' earphones, and those comments about phones like the RE0 sounding 'sterile' worry me, but maybe those comments come from boomy-sound fans?
> 
> Also, considering that I'm concerned about diminishing returns, say I would stretch my budget to ~$250, would you say there's an ideal bet for what I'm looking for, and would it be 'worth it' for a newcomer?
> Edit: On the same note, is there a pair of phones that constitute, in your opinion, an 'ultimate value', that do more or less what I want them to do?
> ...


 
   
  Yes, it's very possible you won't like a more analytical earphone as your first, which is why I recommended the SE215 or Crystal as 'safer' choices that still have controlled bass and good overall sound quality.
   
  Diminishing returns are always a concern. I usually recommend starting small (in fact, it's difficult to justify spending more than $200 on a universal IEM these days with all of the great sub-$200 sets) unless you know that you're the type of person who won't rest knowing that you could have gotten something 'better'. All of the earphones I've recommended represent good value as far as I'm concerned.
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> ljokerl, I read your take on the demo UM Miracle compared to the custom UM Miracle, and it really made me disappointed about the universal model. However, is it possible that you can rate its sound quality on a scale of 1-10 or compare it with a high end universal such as the PFE232 or K3003? Sorry if you can't remember the sound since I know its been over a year.


 
   
  Back then I remember comparing it to the CK10 and SM3 and thinking it had no real advantage over those, unlike my custom Miracle, so it would probably be somewhere in that range.


----------



## AstralStorm

Joker, are you planning to review Alclair RSM? (Like Reference, but 3-way, 4 drivers - 2x bass like Reference.)


----------



## Techno Kid

Hey joker are you planing on reviewing the Heir 3.Ai and 4.Ai?


----------



## Inks

He skipped on them on the tour. 
   
  I'm sure he has good reasons.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Joker, are you planning to review Alclair RSM? (Like Reference, but 3-way, 4 drivers - 2x bass like Reference.)


 
   
  I am but it might be a while -- I haven't shipped off my impressions yet.
   
  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Hey joker are you planing on reviewing the Heir 3.Ai and 4.Ai?


 

 Not at this time.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

ljokerl said:


> Back then I remember comparing it to the CK10 and SM3 and thinking it had no real advantage over those, unlike my custom Miracle, so it would probably be somewhere in that range.




Did you think the universal Miracle was better or worse than the SM3 or the CK10? I'm really considering those since my ears are growing and I cannot afford reshells.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Did you think the universal Miracle was better or worse than the SM3 or the CK10? I'm really considering those since my ears are growing and I cannot afford reshells.


 
   
  I didn't spend much time comparing it to my other universals, mostly to the real Miracle. I would say about on-par with the SM3.


----------



## Hente

Edit: Deleted.


----------



## vpr555

I've been racking my brain reading different reviews in the first couple pages of this thread, but I've got a complete headache. I need some suggestions on what to get. I'd like to spend at most around $75, but would feel better in the $50-$60 range. I generally listen to music that tends to have female vocals, but not always. I also listen to songs of other languages, especially Chinese and Japanese. Some examples of music I listen to: Etro Anime (Musical genres used by the band include drum and bass, deep house, trip hop, and breakbeat), Bang Gang, Telepopmusik, Flunk, Utada Hikaru (JPop), KOTOKO, Two Steps From Hell, Trifonic, Elsaine, Aproaching Nirvana, Brad Sucks, BoA, as well as Video Game and Movie Soundtracks (Star Wars, Chrono Trigger for example), and some more mainstream stuff like Incubus, Korn, Metallica, etc. Occasionally I'll also listen to some Stevie Ray Vaughn or Jimmy Hendrix too. I want something that doesn't muddy the bass but gives it some emphasis but not too overpowering. I also want something that highlights the Mids for the vocals and has a large soundstage. They need to be able to handle the wide variety of genres that I listen to and need to be comfortable. I'll be travelling to China in January (My 4th time) and I've had some issues with my right ear not being able to pop after flying so I don't know if that should be something I worry about in my decision making process.
   
  Can anyone help me choose a pair of IEMs that will work for me that are currently available from a reliable website (I don't consider ebay reliable) - thank you so much!


----------



## ljokerl

Added the MEElec A161P to the chart. Scores are the same as Fischer SBA-03 with the only differences being in the accessories, price, and presence of mic/remote.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


>


----------



## Saraguie

Quote: 





vpr555 said:


> I've been racking my brain reading different reviews in the first couple pages of this thread, but I've got a complete headache. I need some suggestions on what to get. I'd like to spend at most around $75, but would feel better in the $50-$60 range. I generally listen to music that tends to have female vocals, but not always. I also listen to songs of other languages, especially Chinese and Japanese. Some examples of music I listen to: Etro Anime (Musical genres used by the band include drum and bass, deep house, trip hop, and breakbeat), Bang Gang, Telepopmusik, Flunk, Utada Hikaru (JPop), KOTOKO, Two Steps From Hell, Trifonic, Elsaine, Aproaching Nirvana, Brad Sucks, BoA, as well as Video Game and Movie Soundtracks (Star Wars, Chrono Trigger for example), and some more mainstream stuff like Incubus, Korn, Metallica, etc. Occasionally I'll also listen to some Stevie Ray Vaughn or Jimmy Hendrix too. I want something that doesn't muddy the bass but gives it some emphasis but not too overpowering. I also want something that highlights the Mids for the vocals and has a large soundstage. They need to be able to handle the wide variety of genres that I listen to and need to be comfortable. I'll be travelling to China in January (My 4th time) and I've had some issues with my right ear not being able to pop after flying so I don't know if that should be something I worry about in my decision making process.
> 
> Can anyone help me choose a pair of IEMs that will work for me that are currently available from a reliable website (I don't consider ebay reliable) - thank you so much!


 
Sony MH1-C  < Head Fi- thread.
   
  You can buy on Amazon and stay under your budget. I have not tested many so take my next statement in this context : I think it impossible to find anything better under $100 .(maybe even up to 200)
   
  One thing is the cable........as good as the sound quality is.....thats how bad the cable is.


----------



## luisdent

Is there a newer set of reviews compared like this?  It seems like every time I find a reasonable priced well reviewed set, they aren't available from any stores any longer...


----------



## Peculier

Quote: 





luisdent said:


> Is there a newer set of reviews compared like this?  It seems like every time I find a reasonable priced well reviewed set, they aren't available from any stores any longer...


 
  You may want to order them online, like from earphonesolutions or headroom.


----------



## AstralStorm

In this range, you cannot really beat RE0 and especially slightly darker, more impactful, more sensitive (as in no need for an amp at all) and smoother RE-ZERO. (currently $50 and $60 on head-direct.com; $10 international S&H)
  The one gripe with these is that you really have to use their largest tips (either single or biflange) and make them stick out of the ear.
  (Again, Hifiman putting great drivers into too small cases. I'd say this fit gives +0.8 on my own SQ scale, bringing them beyond RE272 stock. I'll be attempting a custom case.)
  For a later upgrade, you can make custom silicone eartips.
  Minor warning: these don't have any kind of bass boost. No rolloff though in the above onfiguration. If shoved in deeper, they have bass rolloff and become dry sounding.
  Oh, forgot to mention - these have the same cable as RE272/RE262 now, if not a tiny bit thicker in RE-ZERO.
   
  GR06, the closest competitor, can try, but is nowhere near as articulate and is more expensive. But if you prefer it bassier and especially warmer, it's also a good IEM.


----------



## scootsit

astralstorm said:


> In this range, you cannot really beat RE0 and especially slightly darker, more impactful, more sensitive (as in no need for an amp at all) and smoother RE-ZERO. (currently $50 and $60 on head-direct.com; $10 international S&H)
> The one gripe with these is that you really have to use their largest tips (either single or biflange) and make them stick out of the ear.
> (Again, Hifiman putting great drivers into too small cases. I'd say this fit gives +0.8 on my own SQ scale, bringing them beyond RE272 stock. I'll be attempting a custom case.)
> For a later upgrade, you can make custom silicone eartips.
> ...




the gr04 flagship. is by all accounts only slightly behind the gr07 and is $55,,shipped


----------



## ibuckeye

ljokerl, I recently upgraded from RE-ZERO (which I bought thanks to your review thread over 2 years ago! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





) to the RE262 and while I like them a lot and intend to keep them for a while, I miss the ZERO's treble presentation and relatively balanced sound signature. Do the 272's have comparable treble and bass quantity and similar sound signature to the ZEROs? I would love to have a ZERO with better soundstage, instrument separation and (as a bonus) better quality bass as my second IEM, and I'm hoping you can help me find the right replacement. On the other hand, I also wouldn't mind something similar to the 262 with a more forward better treble. I tried the GR07 and couldn't stand the sibilance. Budget is $250, but willing to stretch up to $350 if there's something that blows all of these out the water. Thanks in advance, your advice as always is much appreciated!


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, it's very possible you won't like a more analytical earphone as your first, which is why I recommended the SE215 or Crystal as 'safer' choices that still have controlled bass and good overall sound quality.


 
   
  Breaking in my new SE215s now.  Comparing them to the Philips SHE3590 I originally bought, I actually like the Philips a little better.  Being a newb, I don't have a "sound signature" yet, but since the Shure's are reputed to have a warmer sound, I'm guessing the SE215s are not going to sound real "bright" without some EQ treatment?  I am enjoying the Shures, but now I'm wondering about other sound signatures.
   
  What would be a good low-cost, more analytic sounding IEM?
   
  P.S. I'm getting SHE3590s for several people on my gift list.  Too good a deal...
   
  JJ


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ibuckeye said:


> ljokerl, I recently upgraded from RE-ZERO (which I bought thanks to your review thread over 2 years ago!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Treble yes, bass quantity without the foam mod is lower and less impactful. (The drivers are even more choked.) Mids are much smoother, in fact too smooth and reverberated to my ears - somewhat recessed perhaps too. RE-ZERO is faster out of my best, low impedance source.
  In fact, I get better, more coherent soundstaging out of RE-ZERO with the soft biflange - same ones that worked best with RE272. I even suspect that RE272 and RE-ZERO share the same driver - they do share impedance curves...
   
  RE272 improve a lot after the foam stuffing mod - but comfort-wise RE-ZERO are better to my ears and sound quality is very comparable, in fact RE-ZERO are more detailed and perfectly flat on eq to my ears, while modded RE272 have a minor midrange 3.5-4k cut. (Foam is too effective? Perhaps difference in the case, nozzle or mesh vs "material" filter.)
   
  They're very much technically on par, suprisingly. Funny thing that Joker rates them differently on SQ, perhaps he got worse fit on RE-ZERO.
  The only thing I can think of that might be able to blow these out of the water while being as neutral is... RE-ZERO with custom tips (or better yet, properly done full silicone shell) or perhaps Alclair RSM or Unique Melody Miracle custom IEMs. (I'll be able to tell you when I check these out. Alclair will come first.)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vpr555 said:


> I've been racking my brain reading different reviews in the first couple pages of this thread, but I've got a complete headache. I need some suggestions on what to get. I'd like to spend at most around $75, but would feel better in the $50-$60 range. I generally listen to music that tends to have female vocals, but not always. I also listen to songs of other languages, especially Chinese and Japanese. Some examples of music I listen to: Etro Anime (Musical genres used by the band include drum and bass, deep house, trip hop, and breakbeat), Bang Gang, Telepopmusik, Flunk, Utada Hikaru (JPop), KOTOKO, Two Steps From Hell, Trifonic, Elsaine, Aproaching Nirvana, Brad Sucks, BoA, as well as Video Game and Movie Soundtracks (Star Wars, Chrono Trigger for example), and some more mainstream stuff like Incubus, Korn, Metallica, etc. Occasionally I'll also listen to some Stevie Ray Vaughn or Jimmy Hendrix too. I want something that doesn't muddy the bass but gives it some emphasis but not too overpowering. I also want something that highlights the Mids for the vocals and has a large soundstage. They need to be able to handle the wide variety of genres that I listen to and need to be comfortable. I'll be travelling to China in January (My 4th time) and I've had some issues with my right ear not being able to pop after flying so I don't know if that should be something I worry about in my decision making process.
> 
> Can anyone help me choose a pair of IEMs that will work for me that are currently available from a reliable website (I don't consider ebay reliable) - thank you so much!


 
   
  The GR06 would be my pick though I haven't heard the GR04. It's got a decent soundstage, prominent mids, and good bass.
   
  You may have to unseal them in the plane a couple of times but otherwise should be fine with altitude changes.
   
  Quote: 





luisdent said:


> Is there a newer set of reviews compared like this?  It seems like every time I find a reasonable priced well reviewed set, they aren't available from any stores any longer...


 
   
  Examples?
   
  I try to note everything that's been discontinued in the reviews and by graying out the price in the table. 
   
  Quote: 





ibuckeye said:


> ljokerl, I recently upgraded from RE-ZERO (which I bought thanks to your review thread over 2 years ago!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The 272s are definitely closer to the ZERO than the 262s are but the differences from the RE262 aren't huge. I reviewed both in more detail at innerfidelity. The bass of the 272 is not really an upgrade to the ZERO. The mids and treble are great to me, though, and they are what you're looking for in terms of an RE262 upgrade. 
   
  Much of the time when you have an earphone with prominent treble you risk sibilance. The VSonic dynamic IEMs I've tried have this issue and the Sony monitors do as well, to a more limited degree (the MDR-7550 is the best in this regard but still not as forgiving as the RE272 and RE-ZERO IMO). 
   
  I would honestly consider giving the Rock-It R-50 a try. It's on the low end of your budget and still doesn't have much bass but it's a good BA take on a balanced sound. Comparable to the VSonic GR01 but without the massive pricetag. Not exactly what you're looking for but it's in the ballpark and you might like it better than the RE262 and RE-ZERO (or maybe rule out BAs once and for all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Breaking in my new SE215s now.  Comparing them to the Philips SHE3590 I originally bought, I actually like the Philips a little better.  Being a newb, I don't have a "sound signature" yet, but since the Shure's are reputed to have a warmer sound, I'm guessing the SE215s are not going to sound real "bright" without some EQ treatment?  I am enjoying the Shures, but now I'm wondering about other sound signatures.
> 
> What would be a good low-cost, more analytic sounding IEM?
> 
> ...


 
   
  No, the SE215 doesn't really sound bright at all. If you're sure you want balanced sound you might want to try one of the solid single BAs (MEElec A161P, Ety HF5, or Phonak 022+gray filters) or a HiFiMan RE-ZERO. Otherwise you could try something more v-shaped, like the Philips are. Most v-shaped IEMs under $100 won't be much of an upgrade over the Philips - maybe the FXD80s could work. I have a CKM500 here which is v-shaped as well and came highly recommended but I'm not sure what I think about it yet.


----------



## dustdevil

I am trying to get rid of some of my earphones that I don't listen to anymore(not the etymotic hf5 for sure, I am loving them more than ever) and am thinking of using those money to purchase a new pair of earphones, guessing that I would get around $50 after selling all the earphones I want to sell.
  I am thinking of the vsonic gr06/gr04 and the hifiman re-zero/re-0 as most of them have dropped in price and are within my price range($50).
  So which of those do you think is going to compliment my etymotic hf5 well?
  My concern with the re-0 is that my ipod touch 2G won't be able to drive them properly, is that going to happen?
  Thanks.


----------



## AstralStorm

Well, if by complement you mean "be unlike", then GR06 - it's warm, kinda classic Sennheiser tuning dynamic driver signature with a bit of 6k sibilance/hotness. Much smoother than HF5 and less resolving.
   
  If you mean "be similar but better in everything", I'd say RE-ZERO. (but not RE0) That one is near perfectly flat and has reasonable bass impact unlike HF5, while keeping up speed-wise and in general quality. Heck, it even has the similar "bite" quality to the sound while being endlessly extended upwards. (HF5 ends high at 18k, RE0 is similar to RE-ZERO, but has a highest frequency peak or two.)
   
  RE0 may be ever so slightly quiet on Touch 2G, but should still be workable. RE-ZERO and GR06 will definitely be fine.


----------



## ibuckeye

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Treble yes, bass quantity without the foam mod is lower and less impactful. (The drivers are even more choked.) Mids are much smoother, in fact too smooth and reverberated to my ears - somewhat recessed perhaps too. RE-ZERO is faster out of my best, low impedance source.
> In fact, I get better, more coherent soundstaging out of RE-ZERO with the soft biflange - same ones that worked best with RE272. I even suspect that RE272 and RE-ZERO share the same driver - they do share impedance curves...
> 
> RE272 improve a lot after the foam stuffing mod - but comfort-wise RE-ZERO are better to my ears and sound quality is very comparable, in fact RE-ZERO are more detailed and perfectly flat on eq to my ears, while modded RE272 have a minor midrange 3.5-4k cut. (Foam is too effective? Perhaps difference in the case, nozzle or mesh vs "material" filter.)
> ...


 
   
  Thanks AstralStorm! I'm definitely interested in your comparisons to the RE-ZERO when you get a chance to A/B them
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The 272s are definitely closer to the ZERO than the 262s are but the differences from the RE262 aren't huge. I reviewed both in more detail at innerfidelity. The bass of the 272 is not really an upgrade to the ZERO. The mids and treble are great to me, though, and they are what you're looking for in terms of an RE262 upgrade.
> 
> Much of the time when you have an earphone with prominent treble you risk sibilance. The VSonic dynamic IEMs I've tried have this issue and the Sony monitors do as well, to a more limited degree (the MDR-7550 is the best in this regard but still not as forgiving as the RE272 and RE-ZERO IMO).
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks ljokerl! The R50s do look intriguing with (if I read it right) *dual* BA drivers at $119 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 The only BA's I've heard are the Etymotic HF5 and ER4 (s & p config), and while I enjoyed the brighter treble, the BAs didn't move much air to satisfy me on the low end of the frequency spectrum. I listen to classic rock mostly so I don't need tons of sub-bass, just good impact and decay and the ZEROs did a fairly good job for me. I was just wondering if there was something better out there in terms of quality. I'm perfectly happy with both ZERO and 262 quantity-wise. Sorry, I should have been more specific in my previous post.


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> If you mean "be similar but better in everything", I'd say RE-ZERO. (*but not RE0*) That one is near perfectly flat and has reasonable bass impact unlike HF5, while keeping up speed-wise and in general quality.


 
  Well actually I still am wondering whether to get something with similar/different signature to the hf5...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Why not the re0?
  By the way I don't really find the bass impact on the hf5 lacking, but if it keeps up in speed then it shouldn't be a problem I guess.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> I am trying to get rid of some of my earphones that I don't listen to anymore(not the etymotic hf5 for sure, I am loving them more than ever) and am thinking of using those money to purchase a new pair of earphones, guessing that I would get around $50 after selling all the earphones I want to sell.
> I am thinking of the vsonic gr06/gr04 and the hifiman re-zero/re-0 as most of them have dropped in price and are within my price range($50).
> So which of those do you think is going to compliment my etymotic hf5 well?
> My concern with the re-0 is that my ipod touch 2G won't be able to drive them properly, is that going to happen?
> Thanks.


 
   
  +1 for the GR06 though I still haven't heard the GR04 .$50 is not a huge budget for something that won't sound poor compared to the HF5 but the GR06 does reasonably well with a different signature. 
   
  Quote: 





ibuckeye said:


> Thanks ljokerl! The R50s do look intriguing with (if I read it right) *dual* BA drivers at $119
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, dual BA. Same driver as lots of other models from the UE700 to the ATH-CK10, but this one is tuned very well and on the low end of the price continuum. You are correct about the bass - there's not too much "body" to the bass of an R-50 but it's very clean and the extension is linear. The 262 is IMO warmer and fuller-sounding but the R-50 is satisfactory in that regard for me.


----------



## DefBringer

After having several nightmare experiences returning IEMs to various online vendors after disappointing experiences with the monitors, I am no longer interested in patronizing anything other than brick-and-mortar stores for IEMs.  Brands such as Sony, Monster, Ultimate Ears, Q-Jays, Sennheiser, Shure, JVC, Audio Technica, Klipsch, etc are easily found in your local Best Buy, Apple, Microsoft, and audio specialty shops.  
   
  Other brands like Dunu, Phiaton, 1964Ears, etc are really boutique brands that can only be accessed through high-risk purchases online with vendors who may/may not enforce restocking fees, who may/may not properly receive and credit the returned merchandise, etc.  
   
  I live in a major US metropolitan area and at least 50% of the IEMs on this list are completely unavailable to me for purchase unless I am willing to purchase online.  This is a complete failure of those manufacturers to get their products into stores against the Skullcandy/Beats juggernaut.
   
  I wish this IEM list would make mention of which headsets are available to purchase in stores and which are online-only models.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





defbringer said:


> After having several nightmare experiences returning IEMs to various online vendors after disappointing experiences with the monitors, I am no longer interested in patronizing anything other than brick-and-mortar stores for IEMs.  Brands such as Sony, Monster, Ultimate Ears, Q-Jays, Sennheiser, Shure, JVC, Audio Technica, Klipsch, etc are easily found in your local Best Buy, Apple, Microsoft, and audio specialty shops.
> 
> Other brands like Dunu, Phiaton, 1964Ears, etc are really boutique brands that can only be accessed through high-risk purchases online with vendors who may/may not enforce restocking fees, who may/may not properly receive and credit the returned merchandise, etc.
> 
> ...


 
  You're completely wrong. Its not a failure on the manufacturers side. Its the stores that need to do some research and stock. Do you think the manufacturers are stopping stores abroad  to buy from them - no. You have to understand that most stores sell what is popular and advertised by celebrities or brands that are popular - like sony, jvc etc., which people know for their other electronics. How many people outside of head-fi know about 99% of the listed here brands and their iems? Companies like Vsonic, for instance, are investing into production and quality and think about Chinese sales - they won't be paying stupid celebs to carry their products around, just so some US vendors can stock on them. Also its unrealistic to expect to have a database of which store sells what - there are millions of stores worldwide and some of them carry like 80% of what is on this list and some carry none. Just because you don't have a store like that in your city doesn't mean there aren't such stores for instance in Europe or Asia. Do you seriously expect someone will list every city and every store and their inventory?


----------



## thehumantornado

Just wanted to say thanks Joker!  
  Was looking for a fun, sub $100 iem and went with the Thinksound TS02 after reading through your reviews.  
  Quite happy with them as a first > $20 in-ear....
   
  Thanks,
  ht


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





defbringer said:


> I wish this IEM list would make mention of which headsets are available to purchase in stores and which are online-only models.


 
   
   
  Completely impractical considering this thread is viewed all around the world and even in the US availability may differ by area. If you know which brands are available in your area just focus you search on those. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





thehumantornado said:


> Just wanted to say thanks Joker!
> Was looking for a fun, sub $100 iem and went with the Thinksound TS02 after reading through your reviews.
> Quite happy with them as a first > $20 in-ear....
> 
> ...


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> +1 for the GR06 though I still haven't heard the GR04 .$50 is not a huge budget for something that won't sound poor compared to the HF5 but the GR06 does reasonably well with a different signature.


 
  In your review you said that the gr06 have a slightly mid-forward sound, how forward is it? even more so than the bass?
  Also are you going to get a chance to listen to the gr04 in the near future? If you are then I am going to wait for your comparison between thr gr06 and gr04 and decide which to purchase.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ibuckeye said:


> Thanks AstralStorm! I'm definitely interested in your comparisons to the RE-ZERO when you get a chance to A/B them


 

 Comparisons of what to RE-ZERO? RE272, GR06 or HF5? I typically don't keep that many IEMs on me. The RE272 is fresh on memory though, tested again and modded last week. HF5 is a tinge older, three weeks. GR06 I have heard twice, in the shop, but then I have owned GR07, a slightly upscale for a longer stretch of time. (also ended last week)
  Now, I perhaps *could* get another RE272 or go to a nice shop for a head to head comparison, but unfortunately I'm busy at work hours and the shops don't stock these high end IEM models that often in this country, so I'd have to buy another pair. I don't see any reason to do so.
   
  For a direct AB test, I can say that TWFK from Brainwavz B2 is left in the dust on highs (minor 5k boost, less body), lows (much less impact, added warmth), mids (less body) note sustain, dynamics and clarity - and I do get perfect fit with those as well. The TWFK is about as edgy as RE-ZERO, except it's more distorted everywhere, especially in the lows. RE-ZERO's (not overblown) bass impact adds to their sense of speed.
   
  Here's some really suprisingly even comparison: SE-5 with equalization. SE-5's bass impact is a bit stronger, edgier, more visceral and more filled in, clarity is very comparable. Being a custom, it is more comfortable and disappear in the ear despite their large size. (they stick out of ears and people tend to give funny looks - customs are rare and look like hearing aids)
  RE-ZERO are a tinge edgier everywhere except the bass, sounding a bit faster? They also have some reverberation at the highest end, most likely from the case - sounds a bit like tiny plate reverb, very smooth. This actually helps soundstaging immensely, moving the highs nicely to the right position. Yes, SE-5 are suprisingly left in the dust on soundstaging.
   
  On the downsides, RE-ZERO do have a minimal amount of driver flex and can't disappear in ear due to their bulk. I won't be attempting to recase them yet, since RE0 were impossible to remove from the shell - without the use of some advanced tools, which I'll try later too.
  RE-ZERO has some subbass rattle, perhaps due to fit? There is actually a small bit of shelf (not rolloff) <50 Hz too, 6 dB, Stax-like. Equalizing this out makes the bass complete. Probably custom tips could help with this. Highest highs are similarly 6 dB shelved. There's a minor "aggressive" 3.5k-10k shelf boost too, 1 dB, reminiscent of GR07, but without the sibilance - narrows the soundstage slightly. That's all. It's more linear than SE-5 or GR07.
   
  Without equalization, I'd echo Joker's words, but instead of calling it grayscale, I'd call it yellow grayscale - the kind you get from wearing those silly "anti-fatigue" tinted glasses.
   
  RE0 has identical flaws, but more of them - with the exception of air, which has only 3 dB shelf instead of 6 dB, but has some mild resonant peak around 15k instead.
   
  Come to think of it, the closest comparison I can draw is with Sennheiser HD800 (note: heard only briefly) - precise, perfect detailing with some hotness added on top. RE-ZERO is less hot than that, but about as detailed.
  I'm pretty sure they're on sale because they put most every other product to shame. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  (Perhaps not HE-400 or HE-500)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> In your review you said that the gr06 have a slightly mid-forward sound, how forward is it? even more so than the bass?
> Also are you going to get a chance to listen to the gr04 in the near future? If you are then I am going to wait for your comparison between thr gr06 and gr04 and decide which to purchase.


 

 Volume-wise it's pretty even. I can't say for sure how they will graph but I would guess the bass will still be enhanced compared to the midrange. I don't have any plans to hear the GR04. I believe it's been discontinued.


----------



## Jhzaeth

Hi. I've been a longtime lurker at Head-Fi - and especially at this thread - but this is my first actual post asking for information.
   
   
  I'm looking for a decent pair of IEMs to use for listening on a daily basis, not amped. So far, the pairs I'm most interested in are the HiFiman RE262s and the VSonic GR01s.
   
  I listen to all kinds of music but value mids and bass the most (though I want some treble too). Which of the two would you recommend and why?
   
   
  Thanks.
   
  J


----------



## ozkan

How does FA Silver Bullet sound in comprasion to RE0? Is it heavy on bass?


----------



## Selenium

I know this is a little late, but nice review on the Trumpets. I kinda feel like they should have been scored a little higher, since I think they're better than the Tributes which also got an 8.9. But at the same time I don't think they're as good as the EX600 which got a 9.0. Scoring this stuff must be difficult.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ozkan said:


> How does FA Silver Bullet sound in comprasion to RE0? Is it heavy on bass?


 

 I know exactly one shop around here that maybe stocks Silver Bullets. Unfortunately they're out at the moment. (also out of DBA-02, but Eternas are still available)
  I'll ask and try to snatch a short listen, the comparison will be against RE-ZERO, Eternas, Brainwavz B2, Spiral Ear SE-5 and perhaps Phonak Audeo 022 if they're on site. They might have RE0 too, they used to in the past. I'm pretty sure all of these will be inferior, but it's best to check how much.
  I'll also check the new Brainwavz R1 dual dynamic driver, M4.and M5, just for the kicks. They're really stocked in the brand.
  They might have AKG K3003i soon as well, I hope to snatch a prolonged listen of these.
   
  From Silver Bullets, based on the review, I expect a pleasant slightly bass boosted and/or warmed listen at the very least with smooth sound. Perhaps closer to delicate smooth RE272 than more aggressive RE-ZERO. They're supposedly pretty airy as well, but slightly less than the Hifimans. The real snag might be that they might not fit my ears at all.


----------



## ozkan

Thank you AstralStorm! Is RE-ZERO more suitable for me than Silver Bullet? I love my RE0 but I feel like I need a little more omph in bass and a thicker midrange.


----------



## AstralStorm

Thicker midrange you'll definitely get from RE-ZERO. Not sure how much more you need from the bass. If a lot more, then no, RE-ZERO doesn't have that much extra. It's still flat bass, but much more impactful. It does have slightly better downward extension too. (the shelf starts bit lower and is less deep)
   
  Checking out Silver Bullets will take time. I'll probably drop into that shop (Audiomagic.pl) tomorrow - but it's highly likely they won't have them - they used to, but it currently says "waiting for restock".


----------



## tomscy2000

Hey Joker,
   
  I was wondering if you could give your thoughts on the RE262 against the TO GO! 334; I've heard the 334 many, many times, but have yet to try the RE262. I've been looking for something affordable that is sort of like a "mini-334" --- forward but relatively accurate vocals, extended but relaxed highs, with a lighter, tighter bass line. I think the 334 can get a little loose with its bass, despite its natural BA speed. I'm not expecting the dynamic RE262 to match a BA in bass speed, as that wouldn't be what I'd be using it for, but otherwise the RE262 seems to fit the bill. Mostly, I'm looking for something that will melt away in my ears and I'll never have to worry about it. I spend long periods of time studying or typing in front of the computer, so I like using something that can perform well at low volumes (not a problem with the high impedance) and still preserve that mellow, mid-centric character.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jhzaeth said:


> Hi. I've been a longtime lurker at Head-Fi - and especially at this thread - but this is my first actual post asking for information.
> 
> 
> I'm looking for a decent pair of IEMs to use for listening on a daily basis, not amped. So far, the pairs I'm most interested in are the HiFiman RE262s and the VSonic GR01s.
> ...


 
   
  It really depends on whether you value bass that is accurate and controlled or powerful and enhanced. If it's the latter, chances are neither the RE262 or GR01 will do it for you. In general, the RE262 is warmer and smoother, with fuller bass, thicker mids, more laid-back treble and a mellower overall sound. The GR01 is brighter and leaner-sounding, with flat bass and typically "quicker" sound.
   
  Quote: 





ozkan said:


> How does FA Silver Bullet sound in comprasion to RE0? Is it heavy on bass?


 
   
  Significantly heavier bass than RE0. It's a warmer and more spacious sound, but perhaps not as true to source as you may be used to with the RE0. 
   
  Quote: 





selenium said:


> I know this is a little late, but nice review on the Trumpets. I kinda feel like they should have been scored a little higher, since I think they're better than the Tributes which also got an 8.9. But at the same time I don't think they're as good as the EX600 which got a 9.0. *Scoring this stuff must be difficult.*


 
   
  Yep. I do like the Trumpets better than the Tributes but chalked it up to signature preference. The Tributes do certain things very well for those into heavy bass and warm tone. 
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I was wondering if you could give your thoughts on the RE262 against the TO GO! 334; I've heard the 334 many, many times, but have yet to try the RE262. I've been looking for something affordable that is sort of like a "mini-334" --- forward but relatively accurate vocals, extended but relaxed highs, with a lighter, tighter bass line. I think the 334 can get a little loose with its bass, despite its natural BA speed. I'm not expecting the dynamic RE262 to match a BA in bass speed, as that wouldn't be what I'd be using it for, but otherwise the RE262 seems to fit the bill. Mostly, I'm looking for something that will melt away in my ears and I'll never have to worry about it. I spend long periods of time studying or typing in front of the computer, so I like using something that can perform well at low volumes (not a problem with the high impedance) and still preserve that mellow, mid-centric character.
> 
> Thanks.


 

 I agree on the MH334 bass - in comparison to my Miracles it's very dynamic-driver sounding (not necessarily in a good way) whereas the Miracle is clean and tight. 
   
  I do think the RE262 is a great relaxed-listening earphone (though I prefer the RE272).
   
  Anyway, RE262 vs MH334 - The MH334 has deeper and more powerful bass (as expected) but the RE262 is a tiny bit tighter. Mostly its bass just sounds recessed in comparison. I tried some dubstep just to see what electronic bass sounds like on both and they are not that different once you turn the RE262 way up to compensate for quantity, with the RE262 a touch more controlled but lacking the deep bass presence and overall impact of the 334.
   
  The midrange of the 334 is clearer/has a darker background but the tone is actually not that different with both sounding a little warmer/darker than what I would consider neutral (the RE262 is maybe a little warmer). The FitEar also sounds a touch thicker to me. The treble of the RE262 is a little more laid-back but not too bad and the overall balance seems to benefit from the lighter bass.
   
  Soundstaging--the MH334 wins easily with a more out-of-the-head soundstage but at the same time better layering and a very good on-center feel (what I've seen called a strong center image). This can also make the FitEar sound more aggressive at higher volumes. I do like the presentation of the 262 and think it's pretty spacious but it's just not on-level here.


----------



## ozkan

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Significantly heavier bass than RE0. It's a warmer and more spacious sound, but perhaps not as true to source as you may be used to with the RE0.


 
        
  Hey Joker,
   
  Do you think it is an upgrade over RE0? I really love RE0, but I need an iem resembles RE0 with a little more bass (not bass heavy) and just a little thicker midrange and similar treble or should I get RE-ZERO instead? Please I need an advice.


----------



## AstralStorm

Well, RE-ZERO is as much direct upgrade over RE0 as they come. The other IEMs of the line are somewhat sideway treks, even RE272, which is the closest. Still, I bet you'd get more mileage out of custom tips for RE0 than from RE-ZERO alone. Or perhaps combine both ideas.
  It's one of a kind IEM...


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I agree on the MH334 bass - in comparison to my Miracles it's very dynamic-driver sounding (not necessarily in a good way) whereas the Miracle is clean and tight.
> 
> I do think the RE262 is a great relaxed-listening earphone (though I prefer the RE272).
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks. I guess I'm looking for less of a facsimile of the 334 and more of an ideal relaxed listening earphone. I don't expect many things (if any) to really match the midrange character of the 334; it just maintains such intense center focus and beautiful black space in between that it makes the midrange feel so precise.
   
  It seems like the bass is pretty acceptable in my book. I was worried when people said the bass on the 262 was slow, but from the data presented, it shouldn't be all that slow in the realm of dynamic drivers. I think it's just the general relaxed character of the RE262 that leads people to believe that it's a step slow. With regard to the treble, as long as I can hear everything, I'd be okay with it; I'm not looking for an in-your-face earphone. I have other choices for that.
   
  How would you compare the RE272? It just seems like it's an earphone with relatively minor improvements over the RE262 for a lot more coin... The steeper rise in the midrange and less of a shelf in the treble makes it less midcentric and more treble-present, I can tell, but by how much?


----------



## mosshorn

I would say if you haven't tried it, try the 262. It is to this day one of my loves, and if they have a clearance I might get a couple pairs just so I have them for a long long time.
   
   
  I miss them Q_Q


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Do you think it is an upgrade over RE0? I really love RE0, but I need an iem resembles RE0 with a little more bass (not bass heavy) and just a little thicker midrange and similar treble or should I get RE-ZERO instead? Please I need an advice.


 

 Not an upgrade over the RE0 unless you are willing to sacrifice the refinement and clarity of the RE0 for having bassier, more colored sound. In that context the SB is quite good but I just can't call it an upgrade over the RE0. The RE-ZERO is closer to an RE0 upgrade but it depends on how far away from the RE0 signature you want to go (the ZERO is not too far..). If they still made the Sunrise Xcape v.1 I'd recommend that but I don't think you'll be able to find one.
   
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> How would you compare the RE272? It just seems like it's an earphone with relatively minor improvements over the RE262 for a lot more coin... The steeper rise in the midrange and less of a shelf in the treble makes it less midcentric and more treble-present, I can tell, but by how much?


 
  I covered the differences in more detail than I can probably recall now at innerfidelity here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-262-and-re-272-ear-heaphones-page-2
   
  I find the improvements of the RE272, when taken summarily, to be 'worth it' for me. The 272 matches my signature better than the RE262 as a result and its shortcomings are easier for me to ignore in casual listening. I think the mids and treble of the RE272 are very good - more to my liking than, for example, those of the UE900 or EX1000.


----------



## AstralStorm

Here's the sorting order for confused people. I haven't heard RE252 yet.
   
  Bass amount: RE262 = RE-ZERO > RE0 > RE272 (spread: 30%)
  Bass impact: RE-ZERO > RE262 > RE0 > RE272 (50%)
  Mids smoothness: RE272 = RE262 > RE-ZERO > RE0 (30%)
  Mids body: RE262 > RE-ZERO > RE272 = RE0 (30%)
  Highs peakiness: RE0 > RE-ZERO = RE272 > RE262 (20%)
  Highs amount: RE0 > RE-ZERO = RE272 > RE262 (20%)
  Soundstage width: RE272 > RE-ZERO > RE262 = RE0 (20%)
  Soundstage depth: RE-ZERO = RE272 > RE262 > RE0 (20%)
  Reverberation: RE-ZERO > RE0 > RE272 = RE262 (30%)
  General clarity: RE272 = RE-ZERO > RE262 > RE0 (20%)
  Amping improvement: RE262 > RE0 > RE-ZERO > RE272 (10%)
   
  For me, RE-ZERO is the optimum combination. (RE272 w/ foam case mod is close too due to more bass impact and bit more volume, but loses on mids.) I can't really understand why Joker calls RE-ZERO claustrophobic in comparison with RE262, which is laid back, but not as spacious. I did notice that RE-ZERO gets "squashed" when it's put in too deep or with the wrong tips. (with too high ear canal air pressure?)
  (Similar issue with RE0.)
  Funny thing: Head-direct is now out of RE-ZERO. I suspect lurkers reading this thread bought some.


----------



## Jhzaeth

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It really depends on whether you value bass that is accurate and controlled or powerful and enhanced. If it's the latter, chances are neither the RE262 or GR01 will do it for you. In general, the RE262 is warmer and smoother, with fuller bass, thicker mids, more laid-back treble and a mellower overall sound. The GR01 is brighter and leaner-sounding, with flat bass and typically "quicker" sound.


 
  Thanks for the reply. I'm leaning towards the RE262s, but your comment about bass has made me hesitate a little. I'm not sure a fan of analytical headphones when it comes IEMs, rather wanting a 'fun' pair for daily use.


----------



## FlySweep

Tom.. the Fischer Audio Tandem might be something to look into.  I'd consider it a more (tonally) neutral take on the RE262.


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Tom.. the Fischer Audio Tandem might be something to look into.  I'd consider it a more (tonally) neutral take on the RE262.


 
   
  Thanks, though I'm not necessarily looking for something neutral here; the 262 actually seems like a good choice, though I'm curious about what the new RE400/600 bring to the table.


----------



## putente

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Thanks, though I'm not necessarily looking for something neutral here; the 262 actually seems like a good choice, though I'm curious about what the new RE400/600 bring to the table.


 
   
   
  The only "problem" I find in the RE-262 it's their bass. It's there, the quality is good, but the quantity is lacking. The thing is that I can completely solve this problem with my JDSLabs c421, just by turning the bass bost on. This simple action transforms the RE-262 into a totally different IEM in the low-end, making it very pleasing and with very good bass response...


----------



## Satanic Pope

Howdy Joker,

 I would like to have your recommendation for IEM's in $20-$30 price range. I own an HD 238 however I am bit reluctant to use them while traveling. I mostly listen to metal, rock, jazz, blues and a lot of fusion. I wouldnt mind bass heavy IEM's. Looking to bag a deal during the black friday weekend. Thanks.


 P.S : Appreciate your effort on the forum Man. Judging by the list of cans you owned and reviewed, you have to be the craziest audiophile I've ever come across. Would love to test as many cans as you have.


----------



## ozkan

Hey Joker,
   
  I am waiting eagerly for your Rockit Sounds R-50 review.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  My friend wonders if it is better than Dba 02.


----------



## egosumlux

I suggest you add the Brainwavz R1 dual driver dynamic iem to your list it is a very interesting entry to the iemdom


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jhzaeth said:


> Thanks for the reply. I'm leaning towards the RE262s, but your comment about bass has made me hesitate a little. I'm not sure a fan of analytical headphones when it comes IEMs, rather wanting a 'fun' pair for daily use.


 
   
  I don't consider the 262 analytical but it's just not bass-enhanced. I imagine putente's complaint would be echoed by much of the music-listening public on hearing the RE262. 
   
  Quote: 





satanic pope said:


> Howdy Joker,
> 
> I would like to have your recommendation for IEM's in $20-$30 price range. I own an HD 238 however I am bit reluctant to use them while traveling. I mostly listen to metal, rock, jazz, blues and a lot of fusion. I wouldnt mind bass heavy IEM's. Looking to bag a deal during the black friday weekend. Thanks.


 
   
  For something that's that price every day I'd consider the Philips SHE3580. The VSonic GR99 may be another option. It's hard to predict what other IEMs may fall into the $30 range with black Friday promos so you might have to just wait in and see. With these two you certainly aren't settling anyway. 
   
   
  Quote: 





satanic pope said:


> P.S : Appreciate your effort on the forum Man. Judging by the list of cans you owned and reviewed, you have to be the craziest audiophile I've ever come across. Would love to test as many cans as you have.


 
   
  Thanks! I think it's the passion for hearing music with some concern for quality that makes one an audiophile. You can certainly have just one pair of headphones. You can also have many also, but at the end of the day it still has to be about the music 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I am waiting eagerly for your Rockit Sounds R-50 review.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The DBA-02 is out of production but the R-50 is at least as good as the DBA-02 mkII. Review should be either the next one posted or the one after that.
   
  Quote: 





egosumlux said:


> I suggest you add the Brainwavz R1 dual driver dynamic iem to your list it is a very interesting entry to the iemdom


 

 Maybe someday. I had a chance to briefly try one and I didn't think it was as good as their new M5 but I hope to revisit it in the future.


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  Are entry level custom IEMs such as Alclair Reference any better than a high end universal IEM such as Westone 4 in terms of SQ assuming isolation is comparable?  I can buy W4 for $350 or buy a custom IEM which will cost me around $500 with impressions, shipping etc. Whats your take on this ?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> Are entry level custom IEMs such as Alclair Reference any better than a high end universal IEM such as Westone 4 in terms of SQ assuming isolation is comparable?  I can buy W4 for $350 or buy a custom IEM which will cost me around $500 with impressions, shipping etc. Whats your take on this ?


 

 I'd seriously consider looking at the cosmic ears thread. They had a supplier issue, but all reports suggest that their $500 triple driver hybrids are pretty great, with a fun signature rivaling many high priced universals, and they can be made with a lot or a little bass. They also have twin driver BA (two drivers one BA unit) and a dual driver BA (two drivers, in two separate housings), and a quad driver BA, all very reasonably priced. And, regardless of SQ, they are very well made customs, so isolation is supposed to be phenomenal, on par with any top of the line custom. They have single BA models and dynamic models which are both only ~$100
   
  They are burried in the thread, but there are a number of reviews peppered throughout: http://www.head-fi.org/t/626714/cosmic-ears-new-ciem-company-with-crazy-low-prices-including-hybrid-designs


----------



## EveTan

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I'd seriously consider looking at the cosmic ears thread. They had a supplier issue, but all reports suggest that their $500 triple driver hybrids are pretty great, with a fun signature rivaling many high priced universals, and they can be made with a lot or a little bass. They also have twin driver BA (two drivers one BA unit) and a dual driver BA (two drivers, in two separate housings), and a quad driver BA, all very reasonably priced. And, regardless of SQ, they are very well made customs, so isolation is supposed to be phenomenal, on par with any top of the line custom. They have single BA models and dynamic models which are both only ~$100
> 
> They are burried in the thread, but there are a number of reviews peppered throughout: http://www.head-fi.org/t/626714/cosmic-ears-new-ciem-company-with-crazy-low-prices-including-hybrid-designs


 
  I thought their triple driver hybrid was only around $300 not $500. Their 4BA model will be $400.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





evetan said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 You're probably right.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> Are entry level custom IEMs such as Alclair Reference any better than a high end universal IEM such as Westone 4 in terms of SQ assuming isolation is comparable?  I can buy W4 for $350 or buy a custom IEM which will cost me around $500 with impressions, shipping etc. Whats your take on this ?


 
   
  In the case of the Reference, yes, but not all entry-level monitors perform as well. Whether the gap is worth an extra $150 to you is a different question, however.


----------



## eyal1983

I wonder how will the T-Peos H-100 perform (175$)
  also, the TDK IE800 (180$)


----------



## dustdevil

Since black friday is coming soon, I am planning to purchase something on amazon, however some of the items that I wish to purchase can't be shipped to my country, does anyone know any trustworthy mail forwarding agent that doesn't charge much?(quite a few I found online is rather expensive compared to the items that I wish to purchase)
  Thanks.


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Since black friday is coming soon, I am planning to purchase something on amazon, however some of the items that I wish to purchase can't be shipped to my country, does anyone know any trustworthy mail forwarding agent that doesn't charge much?(quite a few I found online is rather expensive compared to the items that I wish to purchase)
> Thanks.


 
  i dont know any agent but no one will be able to help to till they know where you live


----------



## ljokerl

If anyone is interested in Innerfidelity measurements of the new UE 900, they can be found here along with Tyll's intepretation.


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> I wonder how will the T-Peos H-100 perform (175$)


 
   
  H-100 is actually $120 including express shipping to us HF-ers, just email swp@swpshinwoo.com and mention HF discount.
   
  Read the appreciation thread here http://www.head-fi.org/t/630235/t-peos-h-100-hybrid-iem-appreciation-thread/765


----------



## ljokerl

Added Dunu I 3C-S and DN-19 Tai Chi
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2B19) Dunu I 3C-S*
> 
> 
> Added Nov 2012
> ...


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Dunu I 3C-S and DN-19 Tai Chi


 






 arigatou!
   
  PS: the 3c-s isnt the first Dunu BA. the Ares and Crius were


----------



## kaixax555

Yes I noticed that too
   
  Great reviews on these, hope to see reviews on the Rockit Sounds R-50 and TDK BA-200 too


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





zelda said:


> arigatou!
> 
> PS: the 3c-s isnt the first Dunu BA. the Ares and Crius were


 
  I think those are Siren type drivers so sort of hybrid BA. This may be the 1st non diaphragm Dunu.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> arigatou!
> 
> PS: the 3c-s isnt the first Dunu BA. the Ares and Crius were


 
   
  Fine, first _BA-sounding_ BA 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> Yes I noticed that too
> 
> Great reviews on these, hope to see reviews on the Rockit Sounds R-50 and TDK BA-200 too


 

 R-50 should be the next one up. Not planning to cover the BA-200 at this time.


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> Not planning to cover the BA-200 at this time.




Someone should really send one your way. IMHO, it's bar-none one of the best values around. Period. In my view, it definitely rivals the R-50 in terms of value. The R-50 won't ingratiate itself to everyone, while the BA200 will definitely appeal to a wider audience, while accuracy-minded folks will still appreciate it, as even when it doesn't have the top-end sizzle, it is very well-extended on both ends.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Fine, first _BA-sounding_ BA


 
  lol. ok, you win!


----------



## shotgunshane

The R50 was pretty boring to me. C-span is more exciting.


----------



## ozkan

Just a quick question. Does R-50 perform better than PFE 112? Especially at mid bass region.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> The R50 was pretty boring to me. *C-span* is more exciting.


 
  is that a custom iem?


----------



## chipstjuven

Hello joker!
  Maybe a difficult question - but how do the Yamaha EPH100s compare to the Brainwavz HM5/Fischer Audio FA-003 in terms of sound signature? I know those cans are full-sized, but I _desperately_ need to find a full-sized, well-isolationg headphone that can hold a candle to the Yams; they just have such a satisfying sound sig.


----------



## musiclife

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> Well, RE-ZERO is as much direct upgrade over RE0 as they come. The other IEMs of the line are somewhat sideway treks, even RE272, which is the closest. Still, I bet you'd get more mileage out of custom tips for RE0 than from RE-ZERO alone. Or perhaps combine both ideas
> It's one of a kind IEM...


 

 I still have the old RE2 from few years agol, and still love them. Is the RE0 a direct evolution ?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Enjoyed reading the review of the DN-19.


----------



## ozkan

Do I get a better sound on my Pfe 112's if I add an 75 ohm adapter to it? Is there anyone who tried it with Pfe's?


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Do I get a better sound on my Pfe 112's if I add an 75 ohm adapter to it? Is there anyone who tried it with Pfe's?


 

  I have the PFE 112 and I'm waiting for my 75 ohm adaptar to arrive, so, if you with, I can post my impressions (I still have to wait the mail service to deliver it).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Someone should really send one your way. IMHO, it's bar-none one of the best values around. Period. In my view, it definitely rivals the R-50 in terms of value. The R-50 won't ingratiate itself to everyone, while the BA200 will definitely appeal to a wider audience, while accuracy-minded folks will still appreciate it, as even when it doesn't have the top-end sizzle, it is very well-extended on both ends.


 
   
  Someone graciously offered but I had to turn it down due to lack of spare time. I'll try and get my hands on it next year. I like R-50 but even that review has been delayed for months already 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
  Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Just a quick question. Does R-50 perform better than PFE 112? Especially at mid bass region.


 
   
  Answered your PM. 
   
  Quote: 





chipstjuven said:


> Hello joker!
> Maybe a difficult question - but how do the Yamaha EPH100s compare to the Brainwavz HM5/Fischer Audio FA-003 in terms of sound signature? I know those cans are full-sized, but I _desperately_ need to find a full-sized, well-isolationg headphone that can hold a candle to the Yams; they just have such a satisfying sound sig.


 
   
  I only heard the FA-003 briefly something like 2 years ago so I don't think I can be of much help there. For what it's worth someone else asked for a EPH-100 competitor in headphone form and I recommended the V-Moda M-80. Maybe the M-100 is worth looking at as far as full-size cans go. 
   
  Quote: 





musiclife said:


> I still have the old RE2 from few years agol, and still love them. Is the RE0 a direct evolution ?


 
   
  It is and it isn't. Because it's a lower-end product, the RE2's frequency response is less extended and skewed in favor of the treble and away from the bass, resulting a brighter sound. The RE0 is more balanced, more refined, and more neutral in tone. If you like the RE2 you probably will like the RE0 and RE-ZERO as well but they are not an exact signature match.
   
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Enjoyed reading the review of the DN-19.


 

 Thanks


----------



## dustdevil

How would you compare the hf5 to the re0? Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> How would you compare the hf5 to the re0? Thanks.


 

 It's been years since I've had an RE0 and a while since I sold my last HF5 for the ER4. I don't think I can or should attempt a comparison from memory as they are both balanced and neutral-sounding earphones with more similarities than differences. If you already own the HF5 (which I think you do) I probably wouldn't bother with the RE0. The ZERO, maybe.


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's been years since I've had an RE0 and a while since I sold my last HF5 for the ER4. I don't think I can or should attempt a comparison from memory as they are both balanced and neutral-sounding earphones with more similarities than differences. If you already own the HF5 (which I think you do) I probably wouldn't bother with the RE0. The ZERO, maybe.


 
  Well then how do the re-zero compare with the hf5 since head-direct have them back in stock now?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> Well then how do the re-zero compare with the hf5 since head-direct have them back in stock now?


 

 Still pretty similar, the ZERO has more of a dynamic-driver note presentation with softer, rounder notes. It sounds a little fuller and smoother and more mid-forward (and just more forward overall) while the Etys are more crisp, a bit less forgiving up top, and to my ears clearer.


----------



## dustdevil

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Still pretty similar, the ZERO has more of a dynamic-driver note presentation with softer, rounder notes. It sounds a little fuller and smoother and more mid-forward (and just more forward overall) while the Etys are more crisp, a bit less forgiving up top, and to my ears clearer.


 
  Head-direct ran out of re-zero again, I'll probably never get a chance to purchase them, I guess I will be saving up for a more expensive iem then, anyway thanks for the comparison.


----------



## eyal1983

CTM-200 vs W4 ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> CTM-200 vs W4 ?


 

 You've requested about a dozen comparisons in the past few weeks. I don't mind doing them but they do take time. If you're asking only out of curiosity, I recommend just reading the reviews. If you're actually looking to make a buying decision, it might be best for you to state what you're looking for. It's easier for me to say which fits your criteria better than to come up with a from-memory comparison of two products you might not even want in the first place.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Wow, how much time do you put into these reviews to start with joker?  About time you put the foot down on frivolous requests


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Agree with |joker|, you should look through reviews if out of curiosity, but if you want a recommendation, please give details about what you're looking for.

3 weeks ago he was asking me about the PFE232 and W4...


----------



## dauhak

Hope there will be joker's review for sony MH1C, here....with sound quality rated out of 10.


----------



## eyal1983

*OK*
  i'll rephrase my question.. which is now, officially, a problem of mine- both financially AND of taste...;
   
  I have the Sennheiser IE80.
  I find it too warm and veiled on the mid's.. especially when listening to classical music.
   
  my "baseline" for comparison, is the Shure 940.
  BUT, besides that; IF classical music wasn't an issue, I would sell the Shure's, in favor of the IE80.
  I really like the portability, the comfort, the better isolation, and the easier-to-drive factor, an IEM offers.
   
   
  I looked at the table, and saw the 232 above the W4, then read the "battle of 50...", there the W4 is above..  _i cannot buy both, and then decide_.
   
  UPDATE (from today): I heard that W4 is somewhat less bassy then IE80, but still might be of a disappointment to me (for *my* issue at hand).
  I am looking for more AIR, and probably less bass- more Neutral kind of HP. already using bass level 1 (lowest setting) on the IE80,
  and it is still sometimes too bassy for my tastes.
   
  Now, what remains are three (i might be missing something..):
  PFE232 (been told they are less warm than W4)
  ER-4s
  and... -your advise comes here-
   
  Then i looked at the table again, and noticed that the CTM-200 is lower cost than both (I CAN go to an audiologist if necessary) 
   
  BTW i have an RE0 on its way.. just because i wanted to try those, and the resale value is something i can live with...
   
  thanks for your help!
  and sorry for asking so many questions... But I really have to know.. 
   
  ...help 
  /Eyal


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Given your criteria I think you will be happy with the RE0.  Why not wait for them to arrive and listen to them before thinking of buying other stuff?


----------



## eyal1983

this is probably the right thing to do..
  it's just that, from my experience with full size cans.. there is no such thing as a 59$ beating a 450$+ can..
   
  BTW the 232's are selling for 420$ now at some coupon sites.
  but if i understand that "monitor" / "analytic" is my type of sound.. then an upgrade would be to ER-4s
  and then maybe the CTM-200, right?
   
   
  EDIT: not going to buy the 232.. V / U is certainly NOT my type.


----------



## Impulse

dauhak said:


> Hope there will be joker's review for sony MH1C, here....with sound quality rated out of 10.




They certainly look intriguing, given the price.


----------



## Mini0510

joker, I'm wondering if there is an universal IEM that has slightly less bass than JVC FX700, but equal or better than FX700 in terms of sound quality in all the other regions. Well, except mids, since FX700 seems has slightly recessed mids.
  Ignoring the price, some IEM that comes to my mind are Sony EX1000, AKG K3003 with maybe treble filter and Sennheiser IE 800.
   
  I just want an idea so I can eliminate the iems that I probably won't like. Thanks


----------



## GWagon

Hello joker, had a lot of fun reading through your reviews.
   
  Would you, or anyone else with experience of the two IEMs, say that the PFE-232's are a significant upgrade to the Miles Davis Tributes? I currently have the Miles Davis, but I'm looking for something with a bit more clarity and detail. By going to the PFE-232's will I expect to lose much in the bass department? As I still want the impact for the type of music I listen to.
   
  How do the two sound signatures compare?
   
   
  Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Wow, how much time do you put into these reviews to start with joker?


 
   
  Probably too much 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> this is probably the right thing to do..
> it's just that, from my experience with full size cans.. there is no such thing as a 59$ beating a 450$+ can..
> 
> BTW the 232's are selling for 420$ now at some coupon sites.
> ...


 
   
  I agree, try the RE0 - another data point always helps. If you like the accuracy compared to the IE80, you'll know where to go from there. If you find yourself missing bass or otherwise bored with it, you'll know that you need something between the two.
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, I'm wondering if there is an universal IEM that has slightly less bass than JVC FX700, but equal or better than FX700 in terms of sound quality in all the other regions. Well, except mids, since FX700 seems has slightly recessed mids.
> Ignoring the price, some IEM that comes to my mind are Sony EX1000, AKG K3003 with maybe treble filter and Sennheiser IE 800.
> 
> I just want an idea so I can eliminate the iems that I probably won't like. Thanks


 
   
  The K3003 has slightly less bass than the FX700 and slightly less recessed mids. The EX1000 has quite a bit less bass and even more midrange presence but you might not like it as much if you like the warmth and thickness of the FX700. I haven't heard the IE800. 
   
  Quote: 





gwagon said:


> Hello joker, had a lot of fun reading through your reviews.
> 
> Would you, or anyone else with experience of the two IEMs, say that the PFE-232's are a significant upgrade to the Miles Davis Tributes? I currently have the Miles Davis, but I'm looking for something with a bit more clarity and detail. By going to the PFE-232's will I expect to lose much in the bass department? As I still want the impact for the type of music I listen to.
> 
> How do the two sound signatures compare?


 
   
  They're an upgrade but also quite a bit different in sound. The PFE 232 still has enhanced bass but not as much as the Tributes. It's still quite impactful but you'll lose some of that power and rumble, as well as the warmth. You'll also lose the lush, prominent mids and the treble smoothness in favor of the better clarity and detail.


----------



## GWagon

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> They're an upgrade but also quite a bit different in sound. The PFE 232 still has enhanced bass but not as much as the Tributes. It's still quite impactful but you'll lose some of that power and rumble, as well as the warmth. You'll also lose the lush, prominent mids and the treble smoothness in favor of the better clarity and detail.


 
   
  You're going to start having to charge for advice. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  When I got the Tributes, I was lead to believe that the bass was more impactful than on the Sennheiser HD25-1 II, but for me this was not the case at all. The HD25's that I had seemed to hit harder, while the Tributes had more sub bass rumble. I'm actually looking for the hard hitting, quick whack of bass/ driver slam, but I guess it would be too much to ask for in IEM's and their small drivers? Do the PFE-232's offer this type of slam at all, or is it only achievable with full size cans?


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The K3003 has slightly less bass than the FX700 and slightly less recessed mids. The EX1000 has quite a bit less bass and even more midrange presence but you might not like it as much if you like the warmth and thickness of the FX700. I haven't heard the IE800.
> 
> Does K3003 has the same treble presence as FX700? And am i missing any IEMs that I should consider?


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I had problems laying down with the SE215 and SE535 because of the bulky cable connectors but it's probably just my ears. Other than that they are pretty good all-rounders.


 

 I've been using the Shure SE215s for a little over a week now.  You were absolutely correct on the rather bulky feel.  I like the sound signature okay but being my first IEMs, I'm wondering if I should try some other types.  I'm thinking about something with at least dual BA drivers to get a balanced sound.  Any suggestions for something under $200?
   
  JJ


----------



## lootr5858

i'm wondering which has better sound? creative in-ear 3, shure 215 or ue 700
  i noe that they have different sound signature but which is better
  i like forward mids and highs, and not too much of bass
  all 3 are in the same price range in singapore so ignore the price


----------



## ffh2303

So here's my situation, i've got a ATH-M50 that I absolutely love. They just seem to be perfectly balanced to my ears [a bit more mids would be nice though ]. As such i've been trying to be find an IEM that sounds similar to it. First i bought a Brainwavz M4, but the sound turned out to be too V like for my taste . Then I read about the MH1c and bought one . Again I am disappointed as it seemed to have trebles that are too emphasized and bass that's too much. 
Would the GR07 MkII be the one i'm searching for this whole time? What about the Rock-It R50?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gwagon said:


> You're going to start having to charge for advice.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Bass from an in-ear will always be different due to the amount of air moved. The Tributes probably graph with a lot more bass than the HD25 but it's just not the same. Armatures like the PFE 232 certainly won't do any better. There are a few sets that move a ton of air but those typically end up not sounding that great overall.
   
  Quote:  





> Does K3003 has the same treble presence as FX700?


 
   
  Yes; depends on the filter used.
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I've been using the Shure SE215s for a little over a week now.  You were absolutely correct on the rather bulky feel.  I like the sound signature okay but being my first IEMs, I'm wondering if I should try some other types.  I'm thinking about something with at least dual BA drivers to get a balanced sound.  Any suggestions for something under $200?


 

 Depends on what you want to see improved over the sound of the SE215. There are a lot of options under $200, though most of the dual-drivers in that price range will be using the Knowles TWFK and will sound very different from the SE215. If you're set on a dual-driver at $200 I would recommend the Fischer DBA-02 mkII as a nice user-friendly one with good overall performance and a bit more bass than your average TWFK. 
   
  Quote: 





lootr5858 said:


> i'm wondering which has better sound? creative in-ear 3, shure 215 or ue 700
> i noe that they have different sound signature but which is better
> i like forward mids and highs, and not too much of bass
> all 3 are in the same price range in singapore so ignore the price


 
   
  For what you are after, the UE700.
   
  Quote: 





ffh2303 said:


> So here's my situation, i've got a ATH-M50 that I absolutely love. They just seem to be perfectly balanced to my ears [a bit more mids would be nice though ]. As such i've been trying to be find an IEM that sounds similar to it. First i bought a Brainwavz M4, but the sound turned out to be too V like for my taste . Then I read about the MH1c and bought one . Again I am disappointed as it seemed to have trebles that are too emphasized and bass that's too much.
> Would the GR07 MkII be the one i'm searching for this whole time? What about the Rock-It R50?


 
   
  I've never heard either of the sets you've already tried but I don't think the R-50 is the answer. I haven't tried the GR07 mkII yet but the mkI might be a little hot in the treble next to the M50. Should be a pretty good choice otherwise, but less impactful. If you don't mind a bit warmer than the M50 I would check out the Yamaha EPH-100 as well.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> this is probably the right thing to do..
> it's just that, from my experience with full size cans.. there is no such thing as a 59$ beating a 450$+ can..


 

 In case of headphones, that's mostly true, but there are cases of ridiculous price tags. (Say, relatively cheap DT770/HD-25-II/DT1350 on one end and not that great Audeze LCD-2 on the other.)
  In IEM world, we have $100 VSonic GR07 very close in quality to $600 PFE 232.
  I'll hazard saying that RE-ZERO with just the right tips and fit are actually more accurate than either of the two, heck most everything that's possibly not a CIEM. This includes K3003, which is much more expensive. SE-5 is only thing I heard that is comparable when equalized slightly less gritty, more precise and more filled in subbass, but tiny bit less impactful. Whether the 15x price difference (and the need for eq) is worth it is an entirely different matter...
   
  (The difference is almost completely as DF vs ID equalization. Adding DF difference to SE-5 eq gives similar [slightly farther] soundstaging to RE-ZERO. Conversely, cutting DF and fixing some 2.5 dB wide 5k peak from RE-ZERO makes the soundstage further and wider.)
   
  Brainwavz B2 (TWFK) only approaches similar quality after major eq.and with Comply T100. (More than 15 dB wide peak at 5k and highly resonant - Comply reduce this resonance noticeably.) I don't know why TWFK would have such a huge peak, but it does.


----------



## ozkan

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> In case of headphones, that's mostly true, but there are cases of ridiculous price tags. (Say, relatively cheap DT770/HD-25-II/DT1350 on one end and not that great Audeze LCD-2 on the other.)
> In IEM world, we have $100 VSonic GR07 very close in quality to $600 PFE 232.
> I'll hazard saying that RE-ZERO with just the right tips (custom silicone or at least their silicone biflange) and deep fit are actually more accurate than either of the two, heck most everything that's possibly not a CIEM. This includes K3003, which is much more expensive. SE-5 is only slightly less gritty, more precise and slightly more filled in subbass (when the rest of the bass is equalized). Whether the 15x price difference (and the need for eq) is worth it is an entirely different matter... (bonus points: RE-ZERO sounds very similar, if slightly bass lighter, with oversize Comply)


 
   
  Which tips do you think give the best isolation and add a bit more bass for RE-ZERO? Do you recommend MEelectronics M11p tips over stock bi-flange tips?


----------



## AstralStorm

I haven't tried MEElect M11p tips yet. In what way are they different from other generic silicone biflanges?
  They look much the same - this shape of biflange tends to highly irritate my ear canal.
   
  I haven't found yet a way to increase the isolation beyond the shallow inserted stock biflanges without sacrificing highs.
  Possibly very long silicone custom tips would be a way. Isolation isn't too bad either way.
   
  --
  Suprisingly, both SE-5 and B2 have that ugly 4.5k resonance. SE-5 is very well tuned to hide it as best as possible (It has an FK apparently? Is that the trademark of that armature?), but it's still there giving slight unnatural grain to the sound. B2 is just unbearable without eq.
  (peak combined with resonance = ouch. Extra trace of 8k resonance makes it even worse.
  RE-ZERO has no resonance, just a small wide peak of, 2 dB, completely equalizable, unlike the armature one which has resonance too.
  RE272 had a trace of it, but it was way overdampened - had bass impact dropped and suckout around 3k giving it somewhat weird smooth sound. (this also hid the resonance)
   
  Removing the white foam filter from RE causes the resonance to show up, albeit in less ugly way than the harsh armature one.
   
  By the way, my T70p have a resonance at double that frequency, 9k, and it's also "sharp", but more brittle than grainy.
  (It might have a trace of 4.5k resonance too, but not enough to bother me.)


----------



## rawrster

So I been thinking of getting a second custom and outside of the usual companies couldn't think of too many companies until the Alclair Reference was brought to my attention. I currently have the JH5 which I like a lot. It's warm yet balanced but also with a pretty powerful bass but never overpowering. How do you think the Alclair Reference would stack up for me? The bass I'm assuming has a bit more weight and punch than the 1964T which I used to own. Since I only really own the JH5 hard to compare but would you say the bass is at the level of the usual analytical earphones such as the CK10, DBA02, etc or something closer to say the W4.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Yes; depends on the filter used.


 
  quantity aside, are the treble, mids, bass quality better on K3003 than FX700?
  if K3003 sound better, is the difference in sound quality overall great enough to declare that one is than the other just from memory? without comparing them side by side?
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> So I been thinking of getting a second custom and outside of the usual companies couldn't think of too many companies until the Alclair Reference was brought to my attention. I currently have the JH5 which I like a lot. It's warm yet balanced but also with a pretty powerful bass but never overpowering. How do you think the Alclair Reference would stack up for me? The bass I'm assuming has a bit more weight and punch than the 1964T which I used to own. Since I only really own the JH5 hard to compare but would you say the bass is at the level of the usual analytical earphones such as the CK10, DBA02, etc or something closer to say the W4.


 
   
  The way you're describing the JH5 would also fit the Alclair Reference. Don't know if I'd necessarily call the Reference more punchy than the 1964-T - the T has a bit more mid-bass but with a rolled-off bass curve while the Reference has a flatter profile with more deep bass. The bass quantity is definitely greater than with the CK10, DBA-02, etc. and closer to the W4. Actually, closer still to the VSonic GR07 and Phonak PFE 232, if you've heard either of those.
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> quantity aside, are the treble, mids, bass quality better on K3003 than FX700?
> if K3003 sound better, is the difference in sound quality overall great enough to declare that one is than the other just from memory? without comparing them side by side?
> Thanks


 
   
  Probably not on the second question. The K3003 does have certain advantages - slightly better clarity from the BA driver due to the thinner note presentation, better imaging, and impressive treble extension, for example, but it would be difficult to justify the price difference if you've already got an FX700.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Probably not on the second question. The K3003 does have certain advantages - slightly better clarity from the BA driver due to the thinner note presentation, better imaging, and impressive treble extension, for example, but it would be difficult to justify the price difference if you've already got an FX700.


 
  So the difference in sound quality can't be compared from memory? has to be compared side by side? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Well, I don't know if you still have the Monster Turbine Coppers/gold. I had those before JVC FX700. I can still remember the difference in presentation, imaging and and timbre difference between the Coppers and FX700.
  Well, the difference is not big though.
  Is the difference between K3003 and FX700 greater or less than between FX700 and Monster Turbine Copper/Turbine? 
  Thanks


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  Is there an universal IEM equal to Westone 4 but with slightly punchier and flatter bass response extending well in to sub bass region such as UM3X or EPH-100? I like clear (slightly forward) mids with airy and sparkling treble extension.  For reference purposes; EPH-100 is perfect including bass,mids and soundstage however, highs could use a little bit more air and sparkle. I did not like UM3X or SM3 too much because of lack of clarity in the mids and they didn't do wonders with treble extension as well however, UM3X had strong bass response which I liked. I truly enjoyed the clear mids and airy/sparkling treble of Grado G10 but it didn't have the soundstage and bass response for me. Finally I bought W4s. They have fairly clear mids and airy treble with huge soundstage and they are slightly better than GR10s in bass response yet still not upto my taste. Thanks for all your help!


----------



## dustdevil

So I thought why not get some headphones this time, and I have read your review on the superlux HD668B, seems to be a good alternative to the re-zero, what do you think?
  Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Innerfidelity's holiday buyers guide is up with a couple of my "best value" picks: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/2012-holiday-headphone-gift-guide-ljokerl
   
  Some of the listed pricing is a bit off and the recommendations probably won't be a surprise for anyone keeping up with this thread but at least it's concise 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Is the difference between K3003 and FX700 greater or less than between FX700 and Monster Turbine Copper/Turbine?


 
   
  Probably a little smaller. I think the FX700 is noticeably better than the Copper but as you've noted the difference between them still isn't that big, especially without comparing them side by side. 
   
  Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> Is there an universal IEM equal to Westone 4 but with slightly punchier and flatter bass response extending well in to sub bass region such as UM3X or EPH-100? I like clear (slightly forward) mids with airy and sparkling treble extension.  For reference purposes; EPH-100 is perfect including bass,mids and soundstage however, highs could use a little bit more air and sparkle. I did not like UM3X or SM3 too much because of lack of clarity in the mids and they didn't do wonders with treble extension as well however, UM3X had strong bass response which I liked. I truly enjoyed the clear mids and airy/sparkling treble of Grado G10 but it didn't have the soundstage and bass response for me. Finally I bought W4s. They have fairly clear mids and airy treble with huge soundstage and they are slightly better than GR10s in bass response yet still not upto my taste. Thanks for all your help!


 
   
  There's nothing I've heard with those characteristics. 
   
  Quote: 





dustdevil said:


> So I thought why not get some headphones this time, and I have read your review on the superlux HD668B, seems to be a good alternative to the re-zero, what do you think?
> Thanks.


 

 Not quite there with the RE-ZERO but they are good for what they cost.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Probably a little smaller. I think the FX700 is noticeably better than the Copper but as you've noted the difference between them still isn't that big, especially without comparing them side by side.


 
  ah man. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I had the Monster Turbine Gold for a year and the copper for a year and half. I don't have them anymore, but I do recall the the bass is like pretty much the same as FX700. FX700 has more timbre on all the instruments except deep bass. But timbre is only better by a small margin. Well, string instruments sounds much better. It's hard to justify spending 3-4 times as much to get AKG K3003.
   
  and when you compare IEMs, do you use portable devices without amp or with amp?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> and when you compare IEMs, do you use portable devices without amp or with amp?


 

 I'm sure this is answered in the 1st post. I do at the very least try both a portable player and a portable player + portable amp with everything but the actual comparative listening happens with a reasonably-priced DAC/Amp combo.


----------



## OnlinePredator

The GR06 has a cable cinch now. (Mine does, anyway-bought from lendmeurears on ebay)
  How much burn in time do you recommend for it, and what do you do/how long?


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'm sure this is answered in the 1st post. I do at the very least try both a portable player and a portable player + portable amp with everything but the actual comparative listening happens with a reasonably-priced DAC/Amp combo.


 
   
  I only use portable players like ipod touch or android phones (galaxy s3, galaxy note 2).
  Then would there be a little or a significantly difference between AKG K3003 and JVC FX700 on a decently priced DAC/amp than a portable player/phone?


----------



## Parmesan

I have tried Shure SE535 after reading many recommendations on those pieces. I think there is a really good balance, however, I'm looking for a pair which have a bit more bass than se535. There are so many pieces out there that I'm having difficulties to decide. I'm using iphone 5 as device. My budget would be around $400. Inputs?


----------



## Satanic Pope

Hey Joker,

 That concern of listening to music with certain quality and detail is kind of addictive you know and hence I yearn to test some of the best cans out there. In the end though, as you said, its still about music 

 Thanks for the recommendation man. I looked up to what you suggested and certain posts i read on the forum, I am finally willing to settle on JVC HA-FX101. I couldnt find any lucrative deals if I may say so within my budget on amazon/hifiman/lendmeurears/others. Amazon's golden box does list MEElectronics S6 for 25 bucks, however they dont come across to me as appealing as the 101's.

 Some other which I thought were quite decent :
   
  JVC HA-FX40B
 Sennheiser MX470/471
 "Black buds" HDSS
 Sony MH1C
 Philips SHE3580
 Brainwavz R1
 MH650

 Your take? Should I settle down with JVC's? Also, are FX40 better than FX101. I'm looking for bass heavy IEM's since my pref is mostly metal and fusion.


----------



## msmiller

Hey Joker,  thank you for the outstanding IEM reviews!  I've spent hours going through the reviews, table and the rest of the thread.
   
  I'm looking to replace Shure SE530s that I left on an airplane (d'oH!).  My listening, music and source:

 Listening is primarily on airplanes, at the gym, and while skiing.  Comfort and isolation are two important factors here, and a must have is inline iPhone control and mic similar to Shure's.  All I need is the single button which allows answering/ending calls, starting/stoping music, and invoking Siri.  I don't need volume or track control.
 Music is a bit eclectic but primarily pop, rock, some jazz ... no country.  I really liked the clarity and sound signature of the SE530s, but from the reviews it seems clear I can get better for the money.
 Source is primarily iPhone
   
  After reading the reviews I'm interested in perhaps doing customs 1964EARs 1964-V3 or perhaps the Alclair Reference.  Unfortunately neither have inline iPhone control or mic options.  I heard back from Alcair that they may have this option in the future.
   
  Are there any customs that have inline iPhone control and mic?  If not customs, what universal IEM would you recommend that have excellent sound, good isolation, low microphonics ... and inline control and mic?
   
  Thanks,
  -MSM


----------



## james444

Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> Is there an universal IEM equal to Westone 4 but with slightly punchier and flatter bass response extending well in to sub bass region such as UM3X or EPH-100? I like clear (slightly forward) mids with airy and sparkling treble extension.  For reference purposes; EPH-100 is perfect including bass,mids and soundstage however, highs could use a little bit more air and sparkle. I did not like UM3X or SM3 too much because of lack of clarity in the mids and they didn't do wonders with treble extension as well however, UM3X had strong bass response which I liked. I truly enjoyed the clear mids and airy/sparkling treble of Grado G10 but it didn't have the soundstage and bass response for me. Finally I bought W4s. They have fairly clear mids and airy treble with huge soundstage and they are slightly better than GR10s in bass response yet still not upto my taste. Thanks for all your help!


 
   
  I hate to bring bad news to your wallet, but the IE800 sound pretty much like a love child of the EPH-100 and GR10. Same bass characteristics (with just a little less quantity) and wide soundstage as the Yamahas, similar ultra clear mids and airy highs to the Grados.
   
  However, there are some oversights/shortcomings that shouldn't be there with a TOTL phone imo, and I suggest reading my early impressions, if you haven't already been scared off by their price tag.


----------



## AstralStorm

Yes, I concur, IE8/80/800 are very respectable if bass heavy and a bit expensive for what they are. Equalization is trivial. Their main drawbacks are that they do need a bass cut, minor highs boost and have low isolation.
  Their problem is that many dynamic drivers on much lower shelf are reasonably comparable and some flat out beat them at quality.
  One of the main advantages is lack of any resonance peaks, meaning they can be equalized perfectly as necessary. (Though the highest end >17k can require a lot of boost)


----------



## atomikn00b

Has anyone offered to send joker a burned in sony mh1c yet?
 I have my own opinion of them but just curious how joker would rate/review them.
  I have a guess what he'll think based on how he's reviewed other iems I've tried, but I'm especially curious considering the price.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> The GR06 has a cable cinch now. (Mine does, anyway-bought from lendmeurears on ebay)
> How much burn in time do you recommend for it, and what do you do/how long?


 
   
  I burn in everything for the same 100 hours using a pre-set mix of audio tracks, white noise, and pink noise. 
   
  Good to know they added a cinch to the GR06. 
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> I only use portable players like ipod touch or android phones (galaxy s3, galaxy note 2).
> Then would there be a little or a significantly difference between AKG K3003 and JVC FX700 on a decently priced DAC/amp than a portable player/phone?


 
   
  You would have to ask someone who owns those phones and has compared them to a decent DAC/amp. My HTC phone has terrible audio quality. 
   
  Quote: 





parmesan said:


> I have tried Shure SE535 after reading many recommendations on those pieces. I think there is a really good balance, however, I'm looking for a pair which have a bit more bass than se535. There are so many pieces out there that I'm having difficulties to decide. I'm using iphone 5 as device. My budget would be around $400. Inputs?


 
   
  There are lots of earphones out there with more bass than the SE535. If you only want a bit more the UE900 should work for you as something iPhone-compatible at $400.
   
  Quote: 





satanic pope said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> That concern of listening to music with certain quality and detail is kind of addictive you know and hence I yearn to test some of the best cans out there. In the end though, as you said, its still about music
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've only tried the SHE3580, FX101, and FX40. I like the SHE3580 the best of those - it's decently balanced, has good but not overwhelming bass, and generally sounds clear and surprisingly refined. The FX101 has got a ton of bass and harsh treble but it's quite capable for the price. The FX40 is even more capable technically but I don't like the way it presents the midrange or treble. 
   
  Quote: 





msmiller said:


> Hey Joker,  thank you for the outstanding IEM reviews!  I've spent hours going through the reviews, table and the rest of the thread.
> 
> I'm looking to replace Shure SE530s that I left on an airplane (d'oH!).  My listening, music and source:
> 
> ...


 
   
  The good thing about customs is that the cable is (usually) detachable. With Alclair or 1964EARS you can just pick up a mic cable from Westone or JHAudio. They're pricy but may be worth it if you've got to have one. I think the V3 has the more easy-going signature tuned for everyday/casual listening while the Alclairs, as the name implies, are a more accurate and analytical product. The V3 is also incredibly efficient, not that the iPhone has an problem with lack of power. 
   
  Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> Has anyone offered to send joker a burned in sony mh1c yet?
> I have my own opinion of them but just curious how joker would rate/review them.
> I have a guess what he'll think based on how he's reviewed other iems I've tried, but I'm especially curious considering the price.


 

 Unfortunately I haven't had time to look into the MH1C yet.


----------



## tomscy2000

For the 334, are you just going to do a singular summary-type review, or are you planning to do a joint review with Tyll? I'd love to see Tyll give his thoughts on it, as well as impluse, square wave analysis...


----------



## Nalin

Hi joker 

I have been following this thread since the starting and wanted to thank you for such an effort and dedication to Head-Fi.I have been using brainwavz r1 and wanted to to when are you going to add it's review as i am in a dilemma of swapping it by gr06 .


----------



## lilboozy

jvc marshmallow vs philips she3580?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> jvc marshmallow vs philips she3580?


 

 Probably the 3580, though if you're a bit of a basshead, you may wish to check out the Sony MH1C, they have gotten a lot of attention of late, and while I find them a bit dark for my liking, they are technically very impressive, certainly beating out my GR02, and some have put them roughly on par with the UE700. And, for the ~$20 that they go for on Amazon, the risk is not too big.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> jvc marshmallow vs philips she3580?


 
   
  The FX101 and FX40 should be quite a few steps above the marshmallows in JVC's line and joker says above that he prefers the SHE3580 to those two.


----------



## WakiDabeast

Hey joker  
  I've been down and back with a few IEMs recently, and I was wondering if there were any IEM's you can think of that are extremely similar to the Tributes in sound? I have a pair, but one driver is substantially quieter than the other (assuming they are defective) and I but them used so the warranty won't be of use. I would buy another pair, but I honestly hated the weight of the driver coupled with the relatively insecure fit of the IEM. 
   
  Essentially have you heard of IEMs with a similar sound signature and similar sound quality to the Miles Davis Tributes


----------



## ozkan

Hey Joker,
  I'm dying for your R-50 review. When are you planning to review it?


----------



## 1ofamillion

Nice thread!!


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Not married to dual BA drivers, just want to try the different technology.  I was thinking that dual drivers provide a more accurate sound.  Maybe i should stick with something more mainstream like the MEe A151's to see the difference between balanced armature and dynamic drivers?


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Not married to dual BA drivers, just want to try the different technology.  I was thinking that dual drivers provide a more accurate sound.  Maybe i should stick with something more mainstream like the MEe A151's to see the difference between balanced armature and dynamic drivers?


 
   
  To me dual BA's are more full sounding compared to singles along with better soundstage size.  A really good cheap in price not in performance dual BA is the R-50 which sounds as good as most IEM's costing twice as much.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> For the 334, are you just going to do a singular summary-type review, or are you planning to do a joint review with Tyll? I'd love to see Tyll give his thoughts on it, as well as impluse, square wave analysis...


 
   
  I'm doing one of my standard Head-Fi reviews but I have a bunch of stuff I want to send to Tyll for measurement including the 334. If he likes it maybe we'll do an IF piece as well. 
   
  Quote: 





thearcade12 said:


> Hi joker
> I have been following this thread since the starting and wanted to thank you for such an effort and dedication to Head-Fi.I have been using brainwavz r1 and wanted to to when are you going to add it's review as i am in a dilemma of swapping it by gr06 .


 
   
  I have no plans to add the R1 at this time. I've heard it briefly and did not think it was as good as their M5, which is still not as much to my liking as the GR06. 
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> jvc marshmallow vs philips she3580?


 
   
  SHE3580
    
  Quote:


wakidabeast said:


> Hey joker
> I've been down and back with a few IEMs recently, and I was wondering if there were any IEM's you can think of that are extremely similar to the Tributes in sound? I have a pair, but one driver is substantially quieter than the other (assuming they are defective) and I but them used so the warranty won't be of use. I would buy another pair, but I honestly hated the weight of the driver coupled with the relatively insecure fit of the IEM.
> 
> Essentially have you heard of IEMs with a similar sound signature and similar sound quality to the Miles Davis Tributes


 
   
  Can't think of anything extremely similar to the Tributes but depending on what you like about them you might enjoy one of the higher-end JVC dynamics or maybe the EPH-100. 
   
  Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Hey Joker,
> I'm dying for your R-50 review. When are you planning to review it?


 
   
  It should be the next one posted.
   
  Quote: 





1ofamillion said:


> Nice thread!!


 
   
   
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Not married to dual BA drivers, just want to try the different technology.  I was thinking that dual drivers provide a more accurate sound.  Maybe i should stick with something more mainstream like the MEe A151's to see the difference between balanced armature and dynamic drivers?


 
   
  The entry-level BAs typically have much more glaring weaknesses than the mid-level ones. Signatures also vary quite a bit--the entry-level BAs I like (A151, Rock-It R-20/R-30, Astrotec AM-90, etc) tend to be warmer and smoother than most higher-end ones. If you want to really try an armature but still have reservations I would recommend something decent in the ~$100 range - an A161P, Ety HF5, Phonak 022, Brainwavz B2, Rock-It R-50, etc. Less of an investment than going all out at $200 and you shouldn't lose a whole lot on resale value if you don't like them.


----------



## Sycho

Hey Joker, having the B2s for about 3 weeks, what do you think is the best way of controlling the sibilance? I replaced the tips with the Shure olives but I feel that more of the bass was reduced rather the sibilance. Knowing that the Galaxy S2 has a terrible DAC that reduces the soundstage, increases the sibilance to a certain extent, would changing the source to a Clip Zip help (I am planning to get it anyways)? Would a burn-in also help? I have only used these for 14 hours max.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Really looking forward to the review of the FitEar 334, SHE3580, and UE700. I will also drop a look at the TF10 review (if it comes out XD) the IE7, and MDR-7550.
   
  And you might want to remove the AKG K330 from your list of planned reviews.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





sycho said:


> Hey Joker, having the B2s for about 3 weeks, what do you think is the best way of controlling the sibilance? I replaced the tips with the Shure olives but I feel that more of the bass was reduced rather the sibilance. Knowing that the Galaxy S2 has a terrible DAC that reduces the soundstage, increases the sibilance to a certain extent, would changing the source to a Clip Zip help (I am planning to get it anyways)? Would a burn-in also help? I have only used these for 14 hours max.


 
  Comply T100, Ts100 or (best) P of the right size. (e.g. included one) However, the IEM is not really sibilant, but has lots of 4.5k edge, very wide ridge too. Far too much, about 20 dB with silicone and 14 dB with Comply. It can't even be equalized out, since it's too long resonance.
   
  S2 has a great DAC, but too high output impedance for B2, which happens to exaggerate the rigde even more, furthering soundstage collapse.
   
  (TW)FK sound is a "biting" sound - it has huge unnatural sharpness to it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sycho said:


> Hey Joker, having the B2s for about 3 weeks, what do you think is the best way of controlling the sibilance? I replaced the tips with the Shure olives but I feel that more of the bass was reduced rather the sibilance. Knowing that the Galaxy S2 has a terrible DAC that reduces the soundstage, increases the sibilance to a certain extent, would changing the source to a Clip Zip help (I am planning to get it anyways)? Would a burn-in also help? I have only used these for 14 hours max.


 
   
  Triple-flange tips plus a deep insertion or Comply tips just stuffed in your ear. I am not familiar with the S2 or new Clips. If the output impedance of the Galaxy is on the high side that might be a problem and would not be an issue with the Clip. 
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> And you might want to remove the AKG K330 from your list of planned reviews.


 

 Why?


----------



## Impulse

Clip Zip is mostly the same as the old Clip+, they fixed some things in firmware and whatnot but it's still the same amp etc.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Clip Zip is mostly the same as the old Clip+, they fixed some things in firmware and whatnot but it's still the same amp etc.


 

 Thanks, good to know.


----------



## Mini0510

joker, for the two question I asked your below, you mentioned that the difference between K3003 and FX700 is a bit smaller between FX700 and Monster Turbine Copper. 
  I remember when i first listen to FX700, the immediate difference was more timbre and clarity. It was more 3D.
  I'm not sure about your definition of "noticeably better". I think it's noticeable. Pretty much everything is better except isolation.  I guess I was being a little harsh saying that it's a little better. I just think that FX700 is a good step up for me from Monster Turbine Copper if the price is within $150, which it is.
   
  For the other question I asked you, you pointed out that it's difficult to justify the price difference between FX700 and K3003. But what I'm surprised is that you stated that you can't determine the difference between these two IEMs from memory. That means the difference between these two IEMs are really really small?
  I see that in the reviews, you gave K3003 a 9.6 and FX700 a 9.3 in sound quality. Is that actually the difference? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  For Copper, you gave 8.8. Between FX700 and Copper, I can see/hear the 0.5 difference, even from memory.
   
  I just want to make sure that if I can't really tell the difference between FX700 and K3003 from memory, then it's probably not worth getting it then. By memory, I mean like say, listening to FX700 for a day or week. Move on to K3003 the next day or week, I want to think to my myself that, "hmm, the AKG sounds better. The treble is better, more extension. Bass is deeper, more detailed. The midrange is not laid back and etc."
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Is the difference between K3003 and FX700 greater or less than between FX700 and Monster Turbine Copper/Turbine?


 
   
  Probably a little smaller. I think the FX700 is noticeably better than the Copper but as you've noted the difference between them still isn't that big, especially without comparing them side by side. 
   
  Quote:


mini0510 said:


> quantity aside, are the treble, mids, bass quality better on K3003 than FX700?
> if K3003 sound better, is the difference in sound quality overall great enough to declare that one is than the other just from memory? without comparing them side by side?
> Thanks


 
  
 Probably not on the second question. The K3003 does have certain advantages - slightly better clarity from the BA driver due to the thinner note presentation, better imaging, and impressive treble extension, for example, but it would be difficult to justify the price difference if you've already got an FX700.
  
   
   
   
  Sorry if this is a difficult question or being repetitive. I just would like as much information as possible so I can make the best decision. Thanks


----------



## ypwong

Hi joker,

I listen to some piano and classical, along mostly with pop music.

Struggling between 1964 v3 and Alclair Reference(bad reputation from livewires) and CTM-200.

Can I run them on iphone4/5? Any thoughts on this?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *Mini0510* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> ...


   
   
   
   
   

  I think this question has been sufficiently answered. I don't know how good your audio memory is so I really can't speak for that and the scores pretty much tell the rest of the story.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





ypwong said:


> Hi joker,
> I listen to some piano and classical, along mostly with pop music.
> Struggling between 1964 v3 and Alclair Reference(bad reputation from livewires) and CTM-200.
> Can I run them on iphone4/5? Any thoughts on this?


 
   
   
  The V3 is the most efficient of those if you're worried about getting the most out of your customs with your phone but I don't think an iPhone 4/5 will have trouble with any of these. It really depends on what you want signature-wise. If you're not sure then the V3 is probably safest.


----------



## RickH9

Hey,

Currently, I've been using my friend's Yamaha EPH-100, but I'll soon have to return those to him. In the mean time, I've been looking at some IEM's to purchase. I quite enjoy the sound signature of the EPH-100, would IEM's such as the Miles Davis Trumpets ($149 from Monster) or Ortofon e-Q5 be a step up from the EPH-100 with a similar sound signature, or should I just jump up and get a pair of Westone 4? I'm particularly interested in the Trumpets at the moment.

Thanks!


----------



## bhima

I too would love to know Joker's take on the Sony MH1C. This is mainly because I purchased the RE-ZEROs based on your review in which you called them warm. Maybe they are warm for an analytical IEM but to my ears they sounded thin and hallow (though man where you right about the detail and the highs). Would love to know what you think about them. I'm guessing they get an 8.0 
   
  I also totally agree with your short assessment of the Brainwavz R1.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





bhima said:


> I too would love to know Joker's take on the Sony MH1C. This is mainly because I purchased the RE-ZEROs based on your review in which you called them warm. Maybe they are warm for an analytical IEM but to my ears they sounded thin and hallow (though man where you right about the detail and the highs). Would love to know what you think about them. I'm guessing they get an 8.0
> 
> I also totally agree with your short assessment of the Brainwavz R1.


 

 I have the Vsonic GR02 and GR04, the MH1C is far warmer than either.
  I'm hanging on to them just so that Joker can try them, they're far too warm for my tastes.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rickh9 said:


> Hey,
> Currently, I've been using my friend's Yamaha EPH-100, but I'll soon have to return those to him. In the mean time, I've been looking at some IEM's to purchase. I quite enjoy the sound signature of the EPH-100, would IEM's such as the Miles Davis Trumpets ($149 from Monster) or Ortofon e-Q5 be a step up from the EPH-100 with a similar sound signature, or should I just jump up and get a pair of Westone 4? I'm particularly interested in the Trumpets at the moment.
> Thanks!


 
   
  I referenced the EPH-100 a bit in the Miles Davis Trumpet review. The scores should tell you that I think they are about equal in sound quality, just somewhat different in signature. The e-Q5 is more balanced, neutral, and refined. If you want a flatter sound go for the Ortofons. Otherwise, stick with one of the dynamics. 
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I have the Vsonic GR02 and GR04, the MH1C is far warmer than either.
> I'm hanging on to them just so that Joker can try them, they're far too warm for my tastes.


 

 I had no idea you were keeping them just for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. If you don't want them I'll gladly borrow them or buy them off you for when i do finally have time to give them a listen..


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I had no idea you were keeping them just for me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Either way, we can figure that out when you get to them, I'm not too worried. I am moving in June, so all of my non-essential gear will go then, but other than that, take your time.
   
  Also, I know my girlfriend would like these, if and when her GR99s ever break.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Rock-It Sounds R-50
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2B21) Rock-It Sounds R-50*
> 
> 
> Added Nov 2012
> ...


----------



## hitme987

Wow, great, thanks for the R-50 review, now easy to flatten out my buying choices


----------



## glac1er

Didn't expect the R-50 review to come out. Thanks for the review, joker . They sound great for the price.
   
  On another note, my second hand R-50 recently broke on on side despite being babied quite a bit. I think the drivers might be affected by moisture. It doesn't help that Rock-it has one of the more complicated warranty claim procedures.


----------



## yalper

Hi Joker, thanks for the R-50 review, based on the comparisons part, what would be the SQ rate of DBA-02 mkII ?


----------



## suman134

r50 looks awesome man and the price is really low . thanks man . been waiting for this one . i wonder if you can do a ah-c260 .


----------



## kaixax555

Nice review on the R-50. However I ending up buying the BA200 instead as the R-50 proved to be a bit too harsh for me. And yes I do agree that the R-50 is awesome at its price though.


----------



## djvkool

Wow...supreme scoring on the R-50, this must be one one of your favourite IEM joker?


----------



## atomikn00b

Without moving much in price (whether up or down), what would be your recommendation of one falls into the category of
  "those looking for rumbly sub-bass or thick, full-bodied impact" who also find the treble on the brainwavz b2 bright?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Wow, great, thanks for the R-50 review, now easy to flatten out my buying choices


 
   




   
  Quote: 





glac1er said:


> Didn't expect the R-50 review to come out. Thanks for the review, joker . They sound great for the price.
> 
> On another note, my second hand R-50 recently broke on on side despite being babied quite a bit. I think the drivers might be affected by moisture. It doesn't help that Rock-it has one of the more complicated warranty claim procedures.


 
   
  Balanced armatures in general don't like moisture. It's why they sell hearing aid dryers.
   
  Quote: 





yalper said:


> Hi Joker, thanks for the R-50 review, based on the comparisons part, what would be the SQ rate of DBA-02 mkII ?


 
   
  The DBA-02 mkII is in the thread - review # 2A25. It's also right next to the R-50 in the summary table. 
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> r50 looks awesome man and the price is really low . thanks man . been waiting for this one . i wonder if you can do a ah-c260 .


 
   
  After the AH-C360 I don't really want to try any more Denon 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> Nice review on the R-50. However I ending up buying the BA200 instead as the R-50 proved to be a bit too harsh for me. And yes I do agree that the R-50 is awesome at its price though.


 
   
  For long-term listening I ended up with triple-flange tips and an impedance adapter to smooth out the treble a bit. I'll try the BA200 someday. 
   
  Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Wow...supreme scoring on the R-50, this must be one one of your favourite IEM joker?


 

 It's good for the price but I've heard better. I also still prefer the DBA-02 mkII and ATH-CK10 to it among the TWFK setups.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> Without moving much in price (whether up or down), what would be your recommendation of one falls into the category of
> "those looking for rumbly sub-bass or thick, full-bodied impact" who also find the treble on the brainwavz b2 bright?


 
   
  EPH-100 or maybe Dunu DN-19 with the tuning vents open.


----------



## nyonya

Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> Without moving much in price (whether up or down), what would be your recommendation of one falls into the category of
> "those looking for rumbly sub-bass or thick, full-bodied impact" who also find the treble on the brainwavz b2 bright?


 
  The EPH-100 will be a popular suggestion I'd guess.  I personally find the GR07 meets those requirements but might be too bright / not thick enough for you.  I find them very well balanced, and when the track calls for it the sub-bass really tickles my spine.  I think these earphones have made me sort of a lean bass-head - listening to the B2s I was shocked at the total removal of the rumble.


----------



## Zoide

@ljokerl

First of all, thanks for your R-50 review!

Unfortunately, you should update your DBA-02 mkII review because the price is now $198.90 plus $10 shipping: http://www.musicaacoustics.com/wp/headphones/fischer-audio-dba-02-mkii/


----------



## ba113leia

Meelectronics A-161 is a good choice? I prefer classical music..


----------



## ba113leia

Meelectronics A-161 is a good choice? I prefer classical music..


----------



## Techno Kid

Very nice review of the R-50 and I figured you'd give it a 9.2 like most of the other TWFK.  Now a lot more people will buy them because my words don't carry the weight yours does.


----------



## atomikn00b

Thanks for your answer and reviews joker.
  I've got one final question.
   
  If the only shortcomings one finds on the gr07 is sibilance and want of more subbass quantity, what would be your recommendation?
  Does the eph-100 suffice? Or are there better options?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zoide said:


> @ljokerl
> First of all, thanks for your R-50 review!
> Unfortunately, you should update your DBA-02 mkII review because the price is now $198.90 plus $10 shipping: http://www.musicaacoustics.com/wp/headphones/fischer-audio-dba-02-mkii/


 
   
  Oh wow, that's a bit of a hike. I'll have to update the price with the next edit. Doesn't look like the $10 shipping is mandatory, though:
  Quote: 





> All Musica Acoustics product prices include shipping. However, if you would prefer Express Mail Service (EMS), choose it from the pull down menu. EMS is trackable, signatory, and delivers almost anywhere within five business days. Its cost is $10.00 on top of your purchase.


 
   
  Quote: 





ba113leia said:


> Meelectronics A-161 is a good choice? I prefer classical music..


 
   
   
  Should work very well unless you require a large/out-of-the-head soundstage.
   
    
  Quote:


techno kid said:


> Very nice review of the R-50 and I figured you'd give it a 9.2 like most of the other TWFK.  Now a lot more people will buy them because my words don't carry the weight yours does.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I feel like I could happily use them as my main earphones with the tiny bit of tweaking I've done.
   
   
  Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> Thanks for your answer and reviews joker.
> I've got one final question.
> 
> If the only shortcomings one finds on the gr07 is sibilance and want of more subbass quantity, what would be your recommendation?
> Does the eph-100 suffice? Or are there better options?


 
   
  Maybe one of the two new versions of the GR07? There's an MKII and a Bass Edition. I've heard neither but supposedly they are tuned in the direction you want to go.
   
  The EPH-100 has the right tuning but it just isn't quite as clean-sounding as the GR07. Otherwise it's as good a choice as any.


----------



## Niyologist

Excellent. I love the R-50 review. Makes me want to go for it.


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Excellent. I love the R-50 review. Makes me want to go for it.


 
   
  That proves my point about since Joker rated them high more people are going to get them even though I've been telling people the same thing for months.


----------



## scootsit

I'm told the MH1C needs ~100 hrs of burn in for the bass to become tight and controlled, I'm skeptical, but giving it a try. We shall see.


----------



## kaixax555

Quote: 





techno kid said:


> That proves my point about since Joker rated them high more people are going to get them even though I've been telling people the same thing for months.


 
  I think the same thing happens to the BA200 lol


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





techno kid said:


> That proves my point about since Joker rated them high more people are going to get them even though I've been telling people the same thing for months.


 

 Yeah, I'm glad that I got them from your suggestions..Was looking @ R-50,GR07 , EPH-100 and TF10, hopped up on TF10 and R-50 from your suggestions ..I should get a BA-200 soon 
   
  I'm liking my MH1C a bit more than R-50 for my musical preferences, could BA-200 an upgrade on this or which one do you suggest? or eQ-5? Whats your opinion too |joker|?


----------



## ba113leia

Sorry for the insistence. Here in Portugal, the choice is reduced. I listen to mostly classical music and rock. My hypotheses are:
  Astrotec AM-90 .. £ 34
  I3C-S Dunu .......... £ 50
  Creative Auvarna In Ear 2 .. £ 50
  Head-Direct RE0 .. £ 55
  Etymotic MC5 reserch .. £ 55
  Meelectronic A161 ... £ 70
  What is the best chance for me? (2 or 3 best)
   The RE0 will need to amp since I have a Sansa Clip +?
  Thank you


----------



## Hank_Venture

Edit : Will post in its own thread


----------



## jcotteri

killer thread! Grado GR10 someday! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks! Appreciate the reviews!


----------



## phantompersona

Great Review joker!I'm definitely craving me some R-50's now.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Excellent. I love the R-50 review. Makes me want to go for it.


 
   
  Quote: 





jcotteri said:


> killer thread! Grado GR10 someday!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Great Review joker!I'm definitely craving me some R-50's now.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





hitme987 said:


> Yeah, I'm glad that I got them from your suggestions..Was looking @ R-50,GR07 , EPH-100 and TF10, hopped up on TF10 and R-50 from your suggestions ..I should get a BA-200 soon
> 
> I'm liking my MH1C a bit more than R-50 for my musical preferences, could BA-200 an upgrade on this or which one do you suggest? or eQ-5? Whats your opinion too |joker|?


 
   
  I haven't heard the BA-200 and the e-Q5 is not an upgrade over the R-50 per se, just a smoother and mellower sound.
   
  Quote: 





ba113leia said:


> Sorry for the insistence. Here in Portugal, the choice is reduced. I listen to mostly classical music and rock. My hypotheses are:
> Astrotec AM-90 .. £ 34
> I3C-S Dunu .......... £ 50
> Creative Auvarna In Ear 2 .. £ 50
> ...


 

 Really don't know what sound signature you prefer. The AM-90 is a safe way to try balanced armature sound without breaking the bank. The I 3C-S is a good deal if it's cheaper even than the MC5. The RE0 or A161P would be jumping straight into the deep end as far as fairly neutral/accurate sound signatures go. The RE0 actually sounds quite good with the clip. The RE-ZERO is even better.


----------



## ozkan

Great review as always Joker! Man, you are unbelievable! After your R-50 review, I ordered my R-50s but I think I will need replacement tips for them. Which aftermarket tips work best for R-50? Should I choose Etymotic triple flanges or MEElectronics triple flanges? Which one is more comfortable and offers better sound?


----------



## hitme987

Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Great review as always Joker! Man, you are unbelievable! After your R-50 review, I ordered my R-50s but I think I will need replacement tips for them. Which aftermarket tips work best for R-50? Should I choose Etymotic triple flanges or MEElectronics triple flanges? Which one is more comfortable and offers better sound?


 
  I like the MH1C sony Hybrids/Regular Sony Hybrids on these, much comfortable than stock tips. Meelectronics Triple Flanges also do a great job on these, but could be slightly uncomfortable and more isolating than hybrids. Some had better fit with meelec double flanges


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Great review as always Joker! Man, you are unbelievable! After your R-50 review, I ordered my R-50s but I think I will need replacement tips for them. Which aftermarket tips work best for R-50? Should I choose Etymotic triple flanges or MEElectronics triple flanges? Which one is more comfortable and offers better sound?


 

 I felt that the stock tips really didn't provide the optimal insertion depth. I ended up with Ety triples but I have lots of experience with deep-sealing tips. They are a little thicker than MEElec tips and give me a better seal.


----------



## Techno Kid

The Ety triples it what I used as well, not only did that provide the best isolation but because of the deep insertion it sounded a little better to.


----------



## ozkan

Do they also fit to Pfe 112?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Do they also fit to Pfe 112?


 

 PFEs have larger nozzles. They'll stretch on but I'm not sure it's necessary since Phonaks have pretty decent stock tips.


----------



## poisonroses

hi, joker, just want to ask, how do you compare the R-50 to GR01 since u gave both 9.2 for sound quality. i'm actually planning to get myself the gr01.


----------



## domino584

I'm trying to find something that has better or similar micro detail to the iM716s but with a bit more on the highs. Would the Rock-It Sounds R-50 be an upgrade compared to my iM716s?


----------



## Malabarista

That's an amazing compilation of reviews ljokerl, and it's helped me a lot to pick out my first set of IEM's. Thanks a ton, It must have taken an incredibly long time to put together!  Have you ever tried Cosmic ears?  Are you thinking of adding a review of them to this thread?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





malabarista said:


> That's an amazing compilation of reviews ljokerl, and it's helped me a lot to pick out my first set of IEM's. Thanks a ton, It must have taken an incredibly long time to put together!  Have you ever tried Cosmic ears?  Are you thinking of adding a review of them to this thread?


 
   
  This is not a compilation.  He reviewed every single one of them himself.


----------



## lostmage

Could anyone recommend a pair of IEMs as an alternative to the Audio Technica CK10s since they seem to be discontinued? Something around or slightly above the same price (~290) that have a similar sound signature.
   
  Edit- Looking at the UE900s, but they seem to be a bit overpriced right now at about 430$


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





lostmage said:


> Could anyone recommend a pair of IEMs as an alternative to the Audio Technica CK10s since they seem to be discontinued? Something around or slightly above the same price (~290) that have a similar sound signature.
> 
> Edit- Looking at the UE900s, but they seem to be a bit overpriced right now at about 430$


 
  As always, the Fischer Audio's DBA MKII is said to have very similar sound signature to the CK10's.
  Furthermore, the Brainwavz B2 has the same driver as the DBA MKII, and is more readily available.
Here's a link to the phones at the mp4nation store, a trusted Head-Fi retailer.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





> The entry-level BAs typically have much more glaring weaknesses than the mid-level ones. Signatures also vary quite a bit--the entry-level BAs I like (A151, Rock-It R-20/R-30, Astrotec AM-90, etc) tend to be warmer and smoother than most higher-end ones. If you want to really try an armature but still have reservations I would recommend something decent in the ~$100 range - an A161P, Ety HF5, Phonak 022, Brainwavz B2, Rock-It R-50, etc. Less of an investment than going all out at $200 and you shouldn't lose a whole lot on resale value if you don't like them.


 
  Are any of these dual BAs?  Phonak 021/022 and the Ety's are single, aren;t they?  I probably should have taken your advice on the A161Ps the first time.  I was worried about the brand...  
   
  Got the Ety's on my wish list now.  Maybe I'll sell my Shure SE215s and trade up a little...
   
  JJ


----------



## Jhzaeth

|joker|, just wanted to say thank you for your help a few weeks back with my IEM dilemma. I ended up getting the Hifiman re262s and they'll be keeping my happy for a very long while.
   
  J


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





poisonroses said:


> hi, joker, just want to ask, how do you compare the R-50 to GR01 since u gave both 9.2 for sound quality. i'm actually planning to get myself the gr01.


 
   
  The GR01 is a little warmer and smoother but gives up some of the transparency of the R-50. The GR01 is the more forgiving and non-fatiguing earphone but the performance of the R-50 is technically on-par. 
   
  Quote: 





domino584 said:


> I'm trying to find something that has better or similar micro detail to the iM716s but with a bit more on the highs. Would the Rock-It Sounds R-50 be an upgrade compared to my iM716s?


 
   
  I've never heard the iM716 so I can't be of help there.
   
  Quote: 





malabarista said:


> That's an amazing compilation of reviews ljokerl, and it's helped me a lot to pick out my first set of IEM's. Thanks a ton, It must have taken an incredibly long time to put together!  Have you ever tried Cosmic ears?  Are you thinking of adding a review of them to this thread?


 
   
  No, I've never heard a Cosmic ears product and have no plans to add any at this time. 
   
  Quote: 





lostmage said:


> Could anyone recommend a pair of IEMs as an alternative to the Audio Technica CK10s since they seem to be discontinued? Something around or slightly above the same price (~290) that have a similar sound signature.
> 
> Edit- Looking at the UE900s, but they seem to be a bit overpriced right now at about 430$


 
   
  The UE900 doesn't really sound like a CK10. The UE700 is closer (and, in fact, uses a similar driver) but I would recommend the Rock-It R-50, Brainwavz B2, VSonic GR01, or Fischer Audio DBA-02 instead. They all sound pretty similar to each other and the CK10, with minor differences here and there. 
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Are any of these dual BAs?  Phonak 021/022 and the Ety's are single, aren;t they?  I probably should have taken your advice on the A161Ps the first time.  I was worried about the brand...
> 
> Got the Ety's on my wish list now.  Maybe I'll sell my Shure SE215s and trade up a little...
> 
> JJ


 
   
  The two pricier ones (R-50 and DBA-02) are dual BAs. The rest are single BAs. 
   
  Quote: 





jhzaeth said:


> |joker|, just wanted to say thank you for your help a few weeks back with my IEM dilemma. I ended up getting the Hifiman re262s and they'll be keeping my happy for a very long while.
> 
> J


 






 Glad you're enjoying them!


----------



## domino584

ljokerl said:


> I've never heard the iM716 so I can't be of help there.




They are somewhat of a crossbreed between the ER4S and ER4P (via inline switch) but don't have the treble like the ER4S and slightly less micro-detail. It's the same technology but just branded under Antec Lancing.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





domino584 said:


> They are somewhat of a crossbreed between the ER4S and ER4P (via inline switch) but don't have the treble like the ER4S and slightly less micro-detail. It's the same technology but just branded under Antec Lancing.


 

 In that case, why not the ER4?


----------



## domino584

ljokerl said:


> In that case, why not the ER4?




I just bought the Q701s for my desktop set up.  And I a bit more microdetails but a bit more body to the sound as opposed to being so dry. I think the CK10s would be perfect, but again, I just spent 270 on importing the Q701s (whih still saved me 100 )


----------



## vergeLaD

Hi Joker and all I'm a newbie to IEM looking for an entry level IEM. so far I have narrow down my target to Westone UM1 or Westone1 or Shure 215. I can't search for a review of Westone UM1 in your post so I would just ask here, hope you don't mind 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  

 the music I listen to the most is vocal,guitar music and instrumental music, so I'm looking for an IEM with clear and analytical sound. I've read your reviews on Westone1 and it doesn't sound too good haha  some people also comment on that UM1 is very boring while Shure215 offers very rich and playful listening experience.
   
  well, according to the genre of music I listen to, which one would you guys recommend me? thanks a lot


----------



## Impulse

johnny jumper said:


> Are any of these dual BAs?  Phonak 021/022 and the Ety's are single, aren;t they?  I probably should have taken your advice on the A161Ps the first time.  I was worried about the brand...
> 
> Got the Ety's on my wish list now.  Maybe I'll sell my Shure SE215s and trade up a little...
> 
> JJ




MEElec's great, good warranty/support... I haven't tried their more expensive models tho, ended up with my Ety's cause I caught a great deal on them ($55 @ Cowboom), otherwise I probably would've gone for the A161P.


----------



## scootsit

In case anyone is interested (you're not). My GR04s broke, so I've been giving the MH1C more attention. They supposedly need 100hrs of burn in(not sure I buy it, but why not?), which they are maybe 1/3 of the way through.  Despite my earlier criticisms, they're not bad. The bass is actually whimsically ridiculously overdone, but behind that is a really competent IEM. The mids are absolutely fantastic, and with the "bass reducer" eq on my ipod, I'm pretty happy. Though, the bass is still a tad overwhelming (yes, there really is THAT much). I think I still prefer the GR04 (and lack of need for eq), but the margin isn't huge. The MH1Cs are a bit harder to get into the right spot, too deep and they flex oddly, and form too good of a seal, they need to just perch in your ear, which given the long slender design isn't always easy. Anyway, I think they certainly are well above the GR02, and for a basshead, they may even beat out the GR04, the mids really are spectacular, when I eq down the bass, the mids sound slightly less impressive, for some reason. I notice that when using the bass reducer, the midbass is a tad light, while the subbass is a tad excessive, so that may be why the mids impress less on bass reducer.
   
  Joker, hurry up, you need to give these a try.


----------



## Mysterious

Ok So I am looking to buy a new earphones (preferably for under 50$). I currently have V-Moda M80's and I want something with the similar sound, maybe a tad more bass impact.
   
  Any Suggestions?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Ok So I am looking to buy a new earphones (preferably for under 50$). I currently have V-Moda M80's and I want something with the similar sound, maybe a tad more bass impact.
> 
> Any Suggestions?


 

 I'd say that you should check out the MH1C. They're ~$20-$30, and have insane amounts of detail, image really well. Honestly, I would love these things if there wasn't so much bass. Also, they have controls for smartphones and mp3 players. With my iPod, only the start/stop really works, but they're still there.
   
  With my phone, the start/stop and forward/back buttons work.


----------



## Mysterious

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> I'd say that you should check out the MH1C. They're ~$20-$30, and have insane amounts of detail, image really well. Honestly, I would love these things if there wasn't so much bass. Also, they have controls for smartphones and mp3 players. With my iPod, only the start/stop really works, but they're still there.
> 
> With my phone, the start/stop and forward/back buttons work.


 
  Is it this ?
 http://www.amazon.com/Sony-Livesound-Headphones-Earphones-Head-sets/dp/B008CCSD7K

 My only concern is that the bass overpowering the detail.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Probably, I explain below.
   
  I mean, when I first got them the bass was a bit overpowering, after a few days of burn in, it's pretty crazy how much detail there is, even with the bass. I'd say that you won't be disappointed.
   
  What device will you be using them with? Because they have the mic and all that, they use a TRRS plug. There are two ways to wire a TRRS plug, basically switching the ground and the controls. The vast majority of devices use the MH1C way of wiring it (which is what you linked to). A few older devices use the MH1 wiring.


----------



## Mysterious

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Probably, I explain below.
> 
> I mean, when I first got them the bass was a bit overpowering, after a few days of burn in, it's pretty crazy how much detail there is, even with the bass. I'd say that you won't be disappointed.
> 
> What device will you be using them with? Because they have the mic and all that, they use a TRRS plug. There are two ways to wire a TRRS plug, basically switching the ground and the controls. The vast majority of devices use the MH1C way of wiring it (which is what you linked to). A few older devices use the MH1 wiring.


 
  Primarily gonna use it with my MacBook Pro and my Galaxy SII ( and the next phone I am going to upgrade to).
   
  Also is there any different between MH1 and MH1C?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, as I just explained, there is a difference in the way the plug is wired. With both of those devices, the MH1C will work, the MH1 will not.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





domino584 said:


> I just bought the Q701s for my desktop set up.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  In that case the GR01 or DBA-02 mkII. Not much cheaper the ER4S but a little thicker-sounding.
   
  Quote: 





vergelad said:


> Hi Joker and all I'm a newbie to IEM looking for an entry level IEM. so far I have narrow down my target to Westone UM1 or Westone1 or Shure 215. I can't search for a review of Westone UM1 in your post so I would just ask here, hope you don't mind
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've never actually heard the UM1. I don't think the W1 is a great value, not compared to something like a Rock-It R-30. I don't find either to be particularly analytical but I would recommend the SE215 over the W1 any day if you don't mind the enhanced bass of the Shures. 
   
  Quote: 





mysterious said:


> Ok So I am looking to buy a new earphones (preferably for under 50$). I currently have V-Moda M80's and I want something with the similar sound, maybe a tad more bass impact.
> 
> Any Suggestions?


 

 From what I've tried (which doesn't include the MH1C) i'd check out the Brainwavz M5 and maybe the Dunu DN-12. They won't be a match for the M-80's performance but they're good for the asking price and have the sound signature you want.


----------



## CommanerKeen

Just received my GR06,listened to it few mins and i'm pretty sure it's going to be awesome.
  Can't wait to have them burn in correctly.
  Thanks to ljokerl for the suggestion!


----------



## Muessig

I'm looking for a new set of $100 (or about £50-70) IEMs. I'm completely new to IEM's; the last pair of headphones I had were Sennheiser OMX-181's which sounded average but never properly fitted. I'll be using them mainly while walking/commuting on busses etc around town and with some cycling too, so I want a pair that will fit properly, won't be uncomfortable when worn for hours at a time and offers fairly good isolation. I tend to listen to a fairly wide variety of music, so some piano pieces, rock, pop, easy listening, r+b and some folk but I'm more centred around rock. I like my music to have rich bass but not so that it smothers the rest of the trebels and mids. I'd like a set that would keep a good sense of the bass while giving me the detail in the mids and highs that I've not had in my previous earphones up to now... something that will give a good sense of balance all around and help me to hear every note.
   
  I posted in the advice threads and I've got a few to consider but I honestly don't know which will suit my needs better:
   
  1) VSonic GR06
  2) MEElectronics A161P
  3) PFE012
  4) SE215
   
  With either of these IEM's are they proven to be reliable? Will the stock tips provided be comfortable or can you recommend other tips that will be more comfortable and provide the best sound? How long is the burn in with these IEM's? How big of an issue is it for the GR06 not to have a cable clinch? Are there some different IEM's in my price range that will fit my needs better that I've missed?
   
  I'll be using whatever set with a Nokia Lumia 920 for music as well as a Creative Zen X-Fi MP3 player.


----------



## salad

I've got about 150$ to burn on a replacement for my eph-100.
  I'm looking for an iem with a very clear presentation over a dark background (similar or better then the eph-100). I listen to a lot of classical music but can't say I enjoy a very analytical listen. I'd rather a warm detailed sound. Also, hopefully the treble isn't as absent as on the eph  
   
   
  With that said, considering a dark background being my primary criteria. Would the gr01 fit the bill (should I really stray from a dynamic driver) or are there any better/other suggestions?


----------



## syd-silver

[size=medium]Hi guys, Hoping for some advise. Currently in the market for a good pair of IEM’s. Just bought the Mile Davis Trumpets with or without an E11 amp a couple of months ago which I have to say really does have a really nice sound, particularly the bass. Looking to replace them with something else, but am hoping to be able to get something with similar bass levels, excellent clarity and strong isolation.[/size]
   
  [size=medium]Always confused by looking at options like the q-JAYS or DBA-02, CK90Pro or [/size][size=10pt]TripleFi 10 [/size][size=medium]and not knowing the whether they will meet the criteria of their bass levels and isolation. I love the fact that the Trumpets have nice punchy bass and not muddy.[/size]
   
  [size=medium]The music I listen to is usually House, Trance or Rnb.[/size]
   
  [size=medium]Not particularly fussed about the amount, just wanted to get something which was good quality[/size]
   
  [size=medium]Is anyone able to provide some suggestions?[/size]


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





commanerkeen said:


> Just received my GR06,listened to it few mins and i'm pretty sure it's going to be awesome.
> Can't wait to have them burn in correctly.
> Thanks to ljokerl for the suggestion!


 
   
  Glad you are liking them so far 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





muessig said:


> I'm looking for a new set of $100 (or about £50-70) IEMs. I'm completely new to IEM's; the last pair of headphones I had were Sennheiser OMX-181's which sounded average but never properly fitted. I'll be using them mainly while walking/commuting on busses etc around town and with some cycling too, so I want a pair that will fit properly, won't be uncomfortable when worn for hours at a time and offers fairly good isolation. I tend to listen to a fairly wide variety of music, so some piano pieces, rock, pop, easy listening, r+b and some folk but I'm more centred around rock. I like my music to have rich bass but not so that it smothers the rest of the trebels and mids. I'd like a set that would keep a good sense of the bass while giving me the detail in the mids and highs that I've not had in my previous earphones up to now... something that will give a good sense of balance all around and help me to hear every note.
> 
> I posted in the advice threads and I've got a few to consider but I honestly don't know which will suit my needs better:
> 
> ...


 
   
  I think the SE215, GR06, and PFE012 are all safe choices. The A161P is a little more aggressive and probably not a good first "higher-fi" model unless you already know that that's the type of sound you like. Picking between these three won't be easy as they all isolate reasonably well, are comfortable to wear, and sound good for the money. Also, the GR06 now has a cable cinch apparently so don't pay attention to that. Personally, I would want lower isolation for cycling and would probably go with the PFEs. Plus, you get the ability to pick up some extra filters later and turn them into 112s. 
   
   
  Quote: 





salad said:


> I've got about 150$ to burn on a replacement for my eph-100.
> I'm looking for an iem with a very clear presentation over a dark background (similar or better then the eph-100). I listen to a lot of classical music but can't say I enjoy a very analytical listen. I'd rather a warm detailed sound. Also, hopefully the treble isn't as absent as on the eph
> 
> 
> With that said, considering a dark background being my primary criteria. Would the gr01 fit the bill (should I really stray from a dynamic driver) or are there any better/other suggestions?


 
   
  The GR01 is a strange choice as it's so very different from the EPH-100. It does have great clarity but it's more balanced overall, with near-flat bass and pretty prominent treble. You might like the VSonic GR07 if you're willing to go up in price a bit.
   
  Quote: 





syd-silver said:


> [size=medium]Hi guys, Hoping for some advise. Currently in the market for a good pair of IEM’s. Just bought the Mile Davis Trumpets with or without an E11 amp a couple of months ago which I have to say really does have a really nice sound, particularly the bass. Looking to replace them with something else, but am hoping to be able to get something with similar bass levels, excellent clarity and strong isolation.[/size]
> 
> [size=medium]Always confused by looking at options like the q-JAYS or DBA-02, CK90Pro or [/size][size=10pt]TripleFi 10 [/size][size=medium]and not knowing the whether they will meet the criteria of their bass levels and isolation. I love the fact that the Trumpets have nice punchy bass and not muddy.[/size]
> 
> ...


 
   
  You probably don't want the DBA-02, q-JAYS, or CK90Pro if you hope to match the bass of the trumpets. I would recommend the EPH-100 if you don't mind a slightly warmer sound with a bit less treble and more midrange. Fit is similar to the Trumpets but they isolate quite well and are more reasonably-priced.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Joker sorry for bothering you again. So currently i am using the Vsonics GR06. And I'm planning to get a new one. So right now my eyes are set on either the GR07 or Rock-It Sounds R50. Both very detailed reviews. But between this 2, what are the most promising differences that the 2 IEM display? I like my music brimming with brightness and accuracy in the treble, with good separation. Any advice?


----------



## Mini0510

joker, does EX1000, PFE 232 and AKG K3003 match JVC FX700's timbre?
   
  And can you briefly compare JVC FX700 and PFE 232?
  bass quantity and extension, treble quantity and extension, presentation (3D, soundstage)


----------



## james444

^
  And while you're at it, could you please post the TF10 review?
   
  And will we get the ToGo 334 review before the first anniversary?
   
  And will there be a boy or a girl for Will and Kate?
   
  (sorry, got carried away... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## scootsit

More on the MH1C, there is a vent at the back of the IEM, I taped over it, all of a sudden the ridiculous subbass vanished. It's still emphasized, but not like before. Now, on the bass reducer eq on my iPod, they sound fantastic. Truly fantastic.
   
  My GR04s broke yesterday, and while lendmeurears takes their usual week to return an email (don't get me started, when it comes to warranty stuff, they take FOREVER), I'm finding these quite suitable. More burn in in the future, but I really don't think it does much.


----------



## Impulse

Plugging the vent doesn't kill off the bass too much? I'd guess not since you mention even with that you're still EQ'ing it down... So Sony made an unintentional tunable IEM? 

Is the cable very microphonic? Never had one of those flat cables...


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Plugging the vent doesn't kill off the bass too much? I'd guess not since you mention even with that you're still EQ'ing it down... So Sony made an unintentional tunable IEM?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yes. But, if you put it behind your neck, it's not that bad.


----------



## Muessig

Quote: 





> I think the SE215, GR06, and PFE012 are all safe choices. The A161P is a little more aggressive and probably not a good first "higher-fi" model unless you already know that that's the type of sound you like. Picking between these three won't be easy as they all isolate reasonably well, are comfortable to wear, and sound good for the money. Also, the GR06 now has a cable cinch apparently so don't pay attention to that. Personally, I would want lower isolation for cycling and would probably go with the PFEs. Plus, you get the ability to pick up some extra filters later and turn them into 112s.


 
   
   
   
  I've been looking into the PFE's and I like the idea that I can go to the Phonak website and order the filters/guides or whatever I want for the set. I'm hearing that the filters need to be replaced fairly often though and I'm wondering why? Do they just get blocked up with ear wax and there's no way to clean them? Also wondered about if the PFE's have removable cables or not? I'm also hearing that the PFE's can be a little low volume without an amp. I'm gonna be using a Creative Xen X-Fi and while I've never had problems with the output I don't really want to resort to getting an amp; especially not while I'm out and about. I'm leaning towards the PFE's but these points concern me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Joker sorry for bothering you again. So currently i am using the Vsonics GR06. And I'm planning to get a new one. So right now my eyes are set on either the GR07 or Rock-It Sounds R50. Both very detailed reviews. But between this 2, what are the most promising differences that the 2 IEM display? I like my music brimming with brightness and accuracy in the treble, with good separation. Any advice?


 
   
  Biggest difference would be the bass quantity (GR07 wins), overall presentation (R-50 is more well-rounded; GR07 is just wide), and location of treble peaks/energy (lower on GR07 mkI, resulting in bigger potential for sibilance)
   
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, does EX1000, PFE 232 and AKG K3003 match JVC FX700's timbre?
> 
> And can you briefly compare JVC FX700 and PFE 232?
> bass quantity and extension, treble quantity and extension, presentation (3D, soundstage)


 
   
  I don't have an FX700 in my inventory so I never got to compare it to any of the new releases.
   
  I've already answered a ton of questions you've asked about the K3003, FX700, and other earphones so I feel like I have to post this again:
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't mind doing comparisons but they do take time and effort. If you're asking only out of curiosity, I recommend just reading the reviews. If you're actually looking to make a buying decision, it might be best for you to state what you're looking for. It's easier for me to say which fits your criteria better than to come up with a from-memory comparison featuring products you might not even want in the first place.


 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> ^
> And while you're at it, could you please post the TF10 review?
> 
> And will we get the ToGo 334 review before the first anniversary?
> ...


 
   
  How I feel:
   

   
  Quote: 





muessig said:


> I've been looking into the PFE's and I like the idea that I can go to the Phonak website and order the filters/guides or whatever I want for the set. I'm hearing that the filters need to be replaced fairly often though and I'm wondering why? Do they just get blocked up with ear wax and there's no way to clean them? Also wondered about if the PFE's have removable cables or not? I'm also hearing that the PFE's can be a little low volume without an amp. I'm gonna be using a Creative Xen X-Fi and while I've never had problems with the output I don't really want to resort to getting an amp; especially not while I'm out and about. I'm leaning towards the PFE's but these points concern me.


 
   
  I've been using the same set of filters on the 232s since summer and haven't noticed a change. My ears aren't very waxy; maybe others need to swap filters often.
   
  232s have removable cables. All of the lower-end ones do not.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


>


 
   
  Minus the part where people insert cash 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Still, thanks for all your work on reviews.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't have an FX700 in my inventory so I never got to compare it to any of the new releases.
> 
> I've already answered a ton of questions you've asked about the K3003, FX700, and other earphones so I feel like I have to post this again:


 
   
  I'm actually serious of buying. Sorry for all the questions.
  I currently own FX700. To give you an idea, I kind of want more extended treble and brass shimmering from the cymbals (not thin roll offs), not laid back mids, and slightly, just slightly less bass. Perhaps better instrument separation. Those are the improvements I'm mainly concerned about FX700. The sound quality and everything has to be more or less on par or better.
   
  I'm just torn between spending 3-4 times as much as FX700, getting a slightly better sound. I narrowed my search to AKG K3003 and Sennheiser IE 800. Since you haven't hear the IE 800, I can't get any input from you. I'm not sure if there is another IEM that satisfies all those characteristics I've described above. By reading the reviews, PFE 232 seems similar.
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Minus the part where people insert cash
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  *Looks at FitEar TG334 & UM Miracle*
   
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> I'm actually serious of buying. Sorry for all the questions.
> I currently own FX700. To give you an idea, I kind of want more exteneded treble and brass shimmering from the cymbals (not thin roll offs), not laid back mids, and slightly, just slightly less bass. Perhaps better instrument separation. Those are the improvements I'm mainly concerned about FX700. The sound quality and everything has to be more or less on par or better.
> 
> I'm just torn between spending 3-4 times as much as FX700, getting a slightly better sound. I narrowed my search to AKG K3003 and Sennheiser IE 800. Since you haven't hear any the IE 800, I can't get any input from you. I'm not sure if there is another IEM that satisfies all those characteristics I've described above. By reading the reviews, PFE 232 seems like it.
> ...


 

 The PFE232, while bassy, really doesn't quite have the sheer power, rumble, and richness of the dynamic drivers used by the FX700 or K3003. It's also got somewhat recessed mids in my opinion, which doesn't seem to suit your requirements.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The PFE232, while bassy, really doesn't quite have the sheer power, rumble, and richness of the dynamic drivers used by the FX700 or K3003. It's also got somewhat recessed mids in my opinion, which doesn't seem to suit your requirements.


 
   
  So the K3003 is the closest to what I've described?
  If I used High boost filter for K3003, the highs are more forward, bright, while the mids and bass gets completely unaffected?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> So the K3003 is the closest to what I've described?
> If I used High boost filter for K3003, the highs are more forward, bright, while the mids and bass gets completely unaffected?


 

 Seems that way to me. The high boost filters makes the K3003 pretty bright.
   
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> If I used High boost filter for K3003, the highs are more forward, bright, *while the mids and bass gets completely unaffected*?


 
   
  Anytime you change part of the spectrum the entire sound signature changes but insofar as possible that seems to be the case with the AKGs.


----------



## Gryphus0204

So between the Gr07 and Rock IT R50, which has better instrument seperation. And what are the difference between the highs and mids of the 2. And how does the R50 bass compare to the GR06 bass?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> So the K3003 is the closest to what I've described?
> If I used High boost filter for K3003, the highs are more forward, bright, while the mids and bass gets completely unaffected?


 
   
  Compared to customs, the K3003 is overpriced and customs of similar price or cheaper offer superior sound quality. I would recommend going the custom route if possible.
   
  Otherwise, you should consider the Tralucent Audio 1Plus2. It compares well to high-end customs, and is claimed to best the K3003 and TG334, while being at a similar price.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Compared to customs, the K3003 is overpriced and customs of similar price or cheaper offer superior sound quality. I would recommend going the custom route if possible.
> 
> Otherwise, you should consider the Tralucent Audio 1Plus2. It compares well to high-end customs, and is claimed to best the K3003 and TG334, while being at a similar price.


 
  Well, I kind of want to sell my IEMs at a decent price when better ones come out.
  Customs do not have good resale value.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Compared to customs, the K3003 is overpriced and customs of similar price or cheaper offer superior sound quality. I would recommend going the custom route if possible.


 
  Compared to customs, there's no hassle with making bad ear impressions repeatedly. (Audiologists cannot make nice deep impressions around here.) The universal fit of K3003 is very nice, but indeed it is a "luxury" device, overpriced at least 2x.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Compared to customs, the K3003 is overpriced and customs of similar price or cheaper offer superior sound quality. I would recommend going the custom route if possible.
> 
> Otherwise, you should consider the Tralucent Audio 1Plus2. It compares well to high-end customs, and is claimed to best the K3003 and TG334, while being at a similar price.


 
   
  Dear cookie eating robot, your post makes me wonder...
   
  1. Have you heard the K3003?
  2. Have you heard the 1Plus2?
  3. Are you aware that the original 1Plus2 are out of production and (afaik) no one here has heard the new version yet?
  4. Do you think that your honest answers to 1.-3. are good grounds to base a recommendation on?
   
  Regards,
  James


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





james444 said:


> Dear cookie eating robot, your post makes me wonder...
> 
> 1. Have you heard the K3003?
> 2. Have you heard the 1Plus2?
> ...


 
   
  I have not heard the K3003, but have demo'd the CK10 in store and have read that they are similar sounding. I have not heard the Tralucent 1Plus2, in which I stated "claim." The 1Plus2 are not out of production, you can obtain them at Musica Acoustics.
   
  I don't want to start an argument here, so, I guess I apologize.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Well, I kind of want to sell my IEMs at a decent price when better ones come out.
> Customs do not have good resale value.


 
   
  Customs (at least those made with a deep-fitting mold) have inherent acoustic advantages over shallow-fitting IEMs like the K3003.
   
  I would also look into EQing your FX700 to obtain the slight change in signature you are describing without spending anything at all.  Properly implemented digital EQ is totally transparent.


----------



## AstralStorm

I think you meant it doesn't add any distortion. It's obviously not transparent if it changes the sound audibly.
   
  K3003 equivalent in customs would be one of the hybrids, or perhaps something bass boosted like JH16. I don't know about Tralucent.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Customs (at least those made with a deep-fitting mold) have inherent acoustic advantages over shallow-fitting IEMs like the K3003.
> 
> I would also look into EQing your FX700 to obtain the slight change in signature you are describing without spending anything at all.  Properly implemented digital EQ is totally transparent.


 
  I kind of want to get something better too. I'm current using FX700 with EQing


----------



## james444

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I have not heard the K3003, but have demo'd the CK10 in store and have read that they are similar sounding. I have not heard the Tralucent 1Plus2, in which I stated "claim." The 1Plus2 are not out of production, you can obtain them at Musica Acoustics.
> 
> I don't want to start an argument here, so, I guess I apologize.


 
   
  Don't wanna start an argument either, but jeez, you're giving a $1000+ recommendation without having heard any of these phones? Think about it!
   
  I stand corrected regarding the 1Plus2, and thanks for letting me know that MA are still selling the old model. I've been offered a demo and thought they were the new one.
   
  Btw, don't know who told you that the K3003 and CK10 sound similar, but if I still had my CK10, I'd send you both to hear for yourself that it's a pretty far fetched claim.
   
  Anyway, no hard feelings, you seem to be a reasonable guy robot, so


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> So between the Gr07 and Rock IT R50, which has better instrument seperation. And what are the difference between the highs and mids of the 2. And how does the R50 bass compare to the GR06 bass?


 

 The R-50 images slightly better in my opinion but neither is congested to any degree. The GR06 has more bass than the R-50 by a margin.


----------



## lilboozy

Klipsch s4 vs Philips she3580 ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Klipsch s4 vs Philips she3580 ?


 

 SHE3580. Better deep bass and not as harsh/sibilant.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Klipsch s4 vs Philips she3580 ?


 
   
  What do you want to compare?


----------



## yalper

what is the cheapest, no microphonics issue iem to use its cable for recabling job?


----------



## AstralStorm

I'd say MEElectronics AI-M2. Very nice looking and sturdy too.


----------



## Gryphus0204

So the R-50 bass is really that little?If it is Iguess I'll be going for the GR07 MkII i guess. R-50 sounds like it has too little bass.


----------



## lilboozy

So the she3580 is really that good!? On your sq squale where would the she3580 be, like a 7 or what


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> I'd say MEElectronics AI-M2. Very nice looking and sturdy too.


 
   
  +1, definitely the cheapest way to go for a decent cord. M2P model also has an inline mic. If you're willing to spend more you can also get a westone-style twisted cable with the Rock-It R-11. 
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> So the she3580 is really that good!? On your sq squale where would the she3580 be, like a 7 or what


 

 I haven't finished my review but there's a whole thread dedicated to the SHE3580 out on the forum.


----------



## scootsit

If you're just after a cable, vmoda and a few others sell just cables. Meelec might even do it. I know cosmic ears does.


----------



## AstralStorm

They're typically more than $10 the Ai-M2 costs.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> They're typically more than $10 the Ai-M2 costs.


 

 Excellent point.


----------



## Impulse

$20 for V-moda cables... MEElec sells some cables and adapters but nothing nice enough that would be desirable for a hardwired recable IMO, they just sell useful/utilitarian stuff like TRSS to mic + stereo adapters and that kinda stuff. Although the extension they sell for their sport IEM might be worth a look (I forget the IEM's name, S6 I think?).

Is the M2's cable the same one as the M9's? That one's fantastic, it makes cables on much more expensive IEM look shoddy.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impulse said:


> $20 for V-moda cables... MEElec sells some cables and adapters but nothing nice enough that would be desirable for a hardwired recable IMO, they just sell useful/utilitarian stuff like TRSS to mic + stereo adapters and that kinda stuff. Although the extension they sell for their sport IEM might be worth a look (I forget the IEM's name, S6 I think?).
> Is the M2's cable the same one as the M9's? That one's fantastic, it makes cables on much more expensive IEM look shoddy.


 

 I think scootsit meant that you can just email meelec and ask if they have any spare cables from their earphones. I've done that in the past, when I needed a new cable for my apple duals.
   
  And yes, the M2 cable is the same as the M9 except the color. I don't really like the striped color scheme of the M2 cord but it is what it is. You can also get the M16 somewhere around that price, which has other cable colors.


----------



## rawrster

It looks like I may be back in the higher options for earphones non custom. I'll probably get another mid tier custom down the line but can't see having time to go to an audiologist anytime soon and it does depend on if I see any Christmas sales 
   
  I think I'll be picking up a FX700 to use at work. I'll be using it with the SGS3 and my Nuforce HDP. Hopefully they still are good among similarly priced earphones but not too many don't have good isolation as I do need to hear if someone is trying to call me. Thanks for your review on them as it did help in buying them as always


----------



## yezz12

I'm looking for earphones to listen to hard rock/metal. A few examples of bands i listen to: Iron Maiden, Metallica, Megadeth, Judas Priest... I have a budget of 20-80 euro. Buying from amazon.de or ebay unless someone knows a better site for Europe. I want good sound stage. Pretty much everything is important for metal because of how complex the songs are. My setup is FLAC>Sansa Clip+, i'll add a Fiio E7 soon.
   
  Currently considering:
  -Vsonic GR06
  -Astrotec AM-90
  -Visang R03
  -Sunrise Xcape Impressive Edition
   
  Other recommendations are welcome.


----------



## suman134

gr06 is good , it has something of every thing and a bit more treble .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> It looks like I may be back in the higher options for earphones non custom. I'll probably get another mid tier custom down the line but can't see having time to go to an audiologist anytime soon and it does depend on if I see any Christmas sales
> 
> I think I'll be picking up a FX700 to use at work. I'll be using it with the SGS3 and my Nuforce HDP. Hopefully they still are good among similarly priced earphones but not too many don't have good isolation as I do need to hear if someone is trying to call me. Thanks for your review on them as it did help in buying them as always


 
   
  I think the FX700 is still the best thing out there with low isolation. The EX600 or MDR-7550 might be nice lower-priced options if you don't need that much bass. 
   
  Quote: 





yezz12 said:


> I'm looking for earphones to listen to hard rock/metal. A few examples of bands i listen to: Iron Maiden, Metallica, Megadeth, Judas Priest... I have a budget of 20-80 euro. Buying from amazon.de or ebay unless someone knows a better site for Europe. I want good sound stage. Pretty much everything is important for metal because of how complex the songs are. My setup is FLAC>Sansa Clip+, i'll add a Fiio E7 soon.
> 
> Currently considering:
> -Vsonic GR06
> ...


 

 It depends on what kind of sound signature you prefer. The Xcape IE is very good if you like a warmer sound. The GR06 is good for something mid-forward, yet pretty spacious with good bass. Personally I'd go for something relatively balanced, with good resolution and maybe a bit of added bass kick. The AM90 is nice but you can easily get a Rock-It R-30 or maybe even a Dunu I 3C-S in that price range, which are better and definitely more spacious. You could also get a Shure SE215 or even the long-forgotten ECCI PR401 which always sounded good with rock & metal to me.


----------



## jarrett

LOVE the ECCI PR401! Too bad their distribution kind of vanished.


----------



## Mini0510

joker, does K3003's treble sound more "brassy" (not thin) than FX700?
  similar to MTPC or MTPG?
  I liked the brassy treble the MTPC and MTPG when I had them.
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> LOVE the ECCI PR401! Too bad their distribution kind of vanished.


 
   
  Yes, not sure if they're just seeing less orders from overseas and are therefore cutting back on distribution or if they're actually shifting gears altogether and moving away from IEMs. I haven't seen much mention of their newer models on here. I think lendmeurears still carries the PR401, at least.
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, does K3003's treble sound more "brassy" (not thin) than FX700?
> similar to MTPC or MTPG?
> I liked the brassy treble the MTPC and MTPG when I had them.
> Thanks


 

 Like I said, I never got the chance to A:B the K3003 with all of these older IEMs and I can't answer such specific questions from memory.


----------



## Love Music

Joker,
   
   
  How does the ck100 sound with rock and metal?


----------



## scootsit

ljokerl said:


> jarrett said:
> 
> 
> > LOVE the ECCI PR401! Too bad their distribution kind of vanished.
> ...





iI don't think they carry ecci at all any longer


----------



## TwoSongs

So my Silver Bullets kinda bit the dust: the wire leading to the left phone seems to be making making a false contact and so it doesn't work until I tug the wire in a certain way. So, I'll probably stick to my Monoprices for a while and relearn to take proper care of my IEMs. Still, eventually a new purchase will be made, this time the HiFiMan RE262 if I find them on a sale somewhere ($149 is still a bit too rich for my blood).

I do, however, have a couple questions: first of all, the RE262s look to be much more comfortable than the abysmality of the Silver Bullets. Is that the case? I really had to get used to the latters in order to justify having bought them, and they never really felt more than ok in the comfort department. The wiring always got it the way and involountary yankings always dislodged the plugs from my ears. I really would not want either of these to happen with the RE262s, would that be a reasonable expectation?

How about sound signature/quality? One thing the Silver Bullets spoiled me to was great instrument separation, openness, and satisfying amount of quality bass. How would you guys compare the RE262s to them it in that regard?


----------



## scootsit

Does anyone else find the top end of the Vsonics to be very slightly grainy?


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Does anyone else find the top end of the Vsonics to be very slightly grainy?


 
  Aside from the GR02 BE, no.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





love music said:


> Joker,
> 
> 
> How does the ck100 sound with rock and metal?


 
   
  Mid-forward. Most people tend to prefer a flat or v-shaped signature for rock/metal so perhaps it will be a little on the dull side with insufficient deep bass and treble sparkle. 
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> iI don't think they carry ecci at all any longer


 
   
  Ouch. I stand corrected, then.
   
  Quote: 





twosongs said:


> So my Silver Bullets kinda bit the dust: the wire leading to the left phone seems to be making making a false contact and so it doesn't work until I tug the wire in a certain way. So, I'll probably stick to my Monoprices for a while and relearn to take proper care of my IEMs. Still, eventually a new purchase will be made, this time the HiFiMan RE262 if I find them on a sale somewhere ($149 is still a bit too rich for my blood).
> I do, however, have a couple questions: first of all, the RE262s look to be much more comfortable than the abysmality of the Silver Bullets. Is that the case? I really had to get used to the latters in order to justify having bought them, and they never really felt more than ok in the comfort department. The wiring always got it the way and involountary yankings always dislodged the plugs from my ears. I really would not want either of these to happen with the RE262s, would that be a reasonable expectation?
> How about sound signature/quality? One thing the Silver Bullets spoiled me to was great instrument separation, openness, and satisfying amount of quality bass. How would you guys compare the RE262s to them it in that regard?


 

 The RE262 is much more mid-centric than the SB. The SB has enhanced bass and some treble sparkle whereas the RE262 really doesn't - it's pretty flat from the midrange down and a little more laid-back up top compared to the SB. It's much more comfortable for me and there's 3 or 4 different ways you can wear it.
   
  If you're looking for more SB-like bass quantity you may be better off with at least a GR07, if not a Yamaha EPH-100 or JVC FXT90.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ouch. I stand corrected, then.


 
   
  not cheap but 
   
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/ECCI-PR401-HiFi-In-ear-High-Performance-Headphones-/380329267636?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item588d6411b4
   
  or 
   
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hifi-In-ear-ECCI-PR401-Pinch-of-pepper-dash-of-salt-/110609232072?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item19c0d2f0c8


----------



## kazaakas

Okay... I was looking for a pair of nice gym IEM's around $40-$50 and stumbled upon Xears.
  Anyone knows anything about the higher priced models at http://www.xears.com/produkte ? With the discount code in the opening post EVERYTHING goes down to €35 a pair.
  At first I just wanted to get a pair of XR120PRO's but now doubts are kicking at all these other models of the same price.


----------



## eastPride

Thanks so much for your reviews ljokerl!
   
  Between the TF10s and Rockit R-50s, which one has better treble sparkle, upper extension, and overall competency?


----------



## dfrost

impulse said:


> $20 for V-moda cables... MEElec sells some cables and adapters but nothing nice enough that would be desirable for a hardwired recable IMO, they just sell useful/utilitarian stuff like TRSS to mic + stereo adapters and that kinda stuff. Although the extension they sell for their sport IEM might be worth a look (I forget the IEM's name, S6 I think?).
> Is the M2's cable the same one as the M9's? That one's fantastic, it makes cables on much more expensive IEM look shoddy.



I used an M9P cable for recabling some DBA-02's. I was surprised how quickly the MEElec cable stiffened (over ear) compared to the stock Fischer cable.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> not cheap but
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/ECCI-PR401-HiFi-In-ear-High-Performance-Headphones-/380329267636?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item588d6411b4
> 
> ...


 
   
  Funny, that second listing uses the title from one of my old ECCI reviews.
   
  $75+ has always been the going price as far as I know so those prices aren't too bad.
   
  Quote: 





kazaakas said:


> Okay... I was looking for a pair of nice gym IEM's around $40-$50 and stumbled upon Xears.
> Anyone knows anything about the higher priced models at http://www.xears.com/produkte ? With the discount code in the opening post EVERYTHING goes down to €35 a pair.
> At first I just wanted to get a pair of XR120PRO's but now doubts are kicking at all these other models of the same price.


 
   
  I wouldn't trust Xears build quality under gym use. In general the Xears stuff tends to sound good (most of them are quite bassy, though) and be pretty average in all other categories. The XR120 is still my favorite Xears set and easily holds its own even though it has a lower everyday price than some of the other ones. 
   
  Quote: 





eastpride said:


> Thanks so much for your reviews ljokerl!
> 
> Between the TF10s and Rockit R-50s, which one has better treble sparkle, upper extension, and overall competency?


 
   
  The TF10 has more sparkly treble but the R-50 is more accurate. Really depends on what you mean by overall competency. If it's accuracy, get the R-50.
   
  Quote: 





dfrost said:


> I used an M9P cable for recabling some DBA-02's. I was surprised how quickly the MEElec cable stiffened (over ear) compared to the stock Fischer cable.


 

 Weird, I still have a 2009 M9P that's pretty flexible. Maybe it's sweat or skin oils - I never used mine at the gym or anything. 
   
  Speaking of sweat, I've completely dissolved all if the hardware on my H2O audio gym buds. The cable cinch and rubber bit at the y-split simply came off and even the plug sheath now feels like it's made of play-doh.


----------



## kazaakas

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't trust Xears build quality under gym use. In general the Xears stuff tends to sound good (most of them are quite bassy, though) and be pretty average in all other categories. The XR120 is still my favorite Xears set and easily holds its own even though it has a lower everyday price than some of the other ones.


 
  Thanks for the response.
  Well, the point is, I'm looking for a tad bassy IEM's, normally I'm more of a flat response-curve lover but a bit of extra bass tends to give you a bit more energy to do that last rep 
  But what other IEM would you recommend over the Xears then, in the price range of <$50 for gym use?
   
  In terms of Xears, there is just SO much to choose from here, all for the same price, (some even with replacable calbes) and no information at all found about most of the models, even on this forum :S


----------



## TwoSongs

Thanks for the recs, ljokerl, I'll check them out.

kazaakas: how about the Brainwavz ProAlphas? They are quite bassy, mp4nation has them for sale at $29.50 and from what I recall from having them, were decently built.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Funny, that second listing uses the title from one of my old ECCI reviews.
> 
> $75+ has always been the going price as far as I know so those prices aren't too bad.


 
   
  Bringing up ECCI allows me to mention that I bought a PR200 MKII. They are on special from Light In The Box for $24.99 shipped. Seems a steady price since I first saw it on Halloween. A really nice deal other than the fact that super saver free shipping is fairly slow.
   
  The PR200-II is pretty much a return to the PR1 Pro. 85% accurate to your review of the PR1 pro. They differ, IME, in that the PR200-II is not quite as wide or airy but resolves a bit better and has a bit better extension on the ends. Going back to the lively, well balanced, clear and natural sound of the older model and away from the polite, smoothed over, rather unremarkable sound of the original PR100/200 puts the new model back into the well recommended category esp. at the $25 price.


----------



## Impulse

dfrost said:


> I used an M9P cable for recabling some DBA-02's. I was surprised how quickly the MEElec cable stiffened (over ear) compared to the stock Fischer cable.




Interesting, I've had a pair of M9P for a couple of years and the cable's still fine... Was it sweat that did yours in or maybe constant sun exposure? I could see a mix of both having such an effect on the rubber sleeve they seem to use.

I never used my M9P for exercise and I actually just gave them away, I got a pair of M6P for running tho so I guess I'll find out how they hold up...

FWIW, the slightly thicker cable on my old JVC Marshmellows has held up well after using them for running in the sun over a few years, probably gonna keep them for biking now, not sure what isolates less so I'll test it out (foamy JVC tips or M6 triple flanges).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kazaakas said:


> Thanks for the response.
> Well, the point is, I'm looking for a tad bassy IEM's, normally I'm more of a flat response-curve lover but a bit of extra bass tends to give you a bit more energy to do that last rep
> But what other IEM would you recommend over the Xears then, in the price range of <$50 for gym use?
> 
> In terms of Xears, there is just SO much to choose from here, all for the same price, (some even with replacable calbes) and no information at all found about most of the models, even on this forum :S


 
   
  It's difficult to say how an earphone will perform during gym use if it's not designed to handle sweat, etc, but in terms of overall build quality I would probably trust something from Brainwavz or VSonic more. If heavy bass is okay you can land a VSonic GR02 BE or Brainwavz M5 under $50. For something with milder bass there's the Soundmagic E30 and Philips SHE3580. At $10 the Philips are pretty much disposable but you'd have to combat the cable noise somehow. 
   
  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Bringing up ECCI allows me to mention that I bought a PR200 MKII. They are on special from Light In The Box for $24.99 shipped. Seems a steady price since I first saw it on Halloween. A really nice deal other than the fact that super saver free shipping is fairly slow.
> 
> The PR200-II is pretty much a return to the PR1 Pro. 85% accurate to your review of the PR1 pro. They differ, IME, in that the PR200-II is not quite as wide or airy but resolves a bit better and has a bit better extension on the ends. Going back to the lively, well balanced, clear and natural sound of the older model and away from the polite, smoothed over, rather unremarkable sound of the original PR100/200 puts the new model back into the well recommended category esp. at the $25 price.


 

 I am glad ECCI is going back to the PR1 sound signature - it was pretty unique. I still have my PR1 Pro all these years later. Can't agree with you more - the old PR100/PR200 sounded pretty bland and the PR300 got lost among similar-sounding competition.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, does K3003's treble sound more "brassy" (not thin) than FX700?
> similar to MTPC or MTPG?
> I liked the brassy treble the MTPC and MTPG when I had them.
> Thanks


 
  I'm not Joker, but here are my 2 cents:
  AKG K3003 has a notable 4.5k ring due to the darned TWFK. This makes it go beyond brassy and into painfully metallic and flat. The 3k dip makes it even more audible.
  MTPG are quite flat in the treble. However, they're not nearly as fast.
  MTPC have very similar treble, slightly less bass, giving better detailing in my opinion, but still too bassy and slow.
  There's no real competition in bass boosted IEMs vs MTPG, not considering CIEMs perhaps. (Such as Futuresonics Ear Monitors or certain BA ones.)
   
  Until Hifiman releases the next version of RE IEMs, you're quite out of luck trying to match BA IEMs in speed and treble quality while not sacrificing bass slam.
  RE-ZERO were as good there as they come, if a bit uneven. RE272 is far too smooth and recessed in upper mids (due to filter; filterless it rings) and overdampened in bass.
  The only reasonable competition in dynamic drivers, VSonic GR07 and Sony MDR-EX1000, have much hotter treble prone to sibilance due to 6k ringing.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

astralstorm said:


> The only reasonable competition in dynamic drivers, VSonic GR07 and Sony MDR-EX1000, have much hotter treble prone to sibilance due to 6k ringing.




I liked the IE8 and the Atrio MG7...


----------



## AstralStorm

Yes, but those two are ever so slightly inferior to MTPG/MTPC in the treble in my opinion. Even IE8, which is reasonably close.
  (Guess why I mentioned Ear Monitors - they're like new Atrio, but far more refined.)


----------



## Love Music

Thanks Joker,
   
  What are my choices for a headphone thats good with rock/metal. I like vocal centric headphones but the instruments also have to be engaging and does not get congested in complex passages. Budget around $500.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## iamthem

Does anyone know how the DBA-02 MKII and GR01 compare in terms of build quality?


----------



## Sycho

All we need are the Philips SHE3580 and the Sony MH1Cs to be reviewed, and we can then see the ultimate showdown between the four hype monsters (being the JVC HA-FX40 w/ 500 hours of burn-in, Philip SHE3580, Monoprice 8320 and Sony MH1C). The R1s need to be rated as well, some people even claim for them to be better than the M5s. I personally can't stand their terrible sound.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





sycho said:


> All we need are the Philips SHE3580 and the Sony MH1Cs to be reviewed, and we can then see the ultimate showdown between the four hype monsters (being the JVC HA-FX40 w/ 500 hours of burn-in, Philip SHE3580, Monoprice 8320 and Sony MH1C). The R1s need to be rated as well, some people even claim for them to be better than the M5s. I personally can't stand their terrible sound.


 
  Well, I think the mh1c is hyped enough and even if joker doesn't review it people will still buy it. Do we seriously need joker to buy every iem out there and review it so we get an approval that what we bought and like is actually good? The R1 is pretty hard to rate for me. I've been burning it in for more than 150 hours and it's still changing - kinda weird and that continues to make it hard for me to rate it let alone judje after a short listen like joker did, which doesn't mean that joker should buy it. The R1 is still pretty good and fun sounding iem for the money but its comparison to the other similarly priced hyped iems will be down to personal preference.


----------



## HeroicPenguin

Quote: 





love music said:


> Thanks Joker,
> 
> What are my choices for a headphone thats good with rock/metal. I like vocal centric headphones but the instruments also have to be engaging and does not get congested in complex passages. Budget around $500.
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  Not Joker, but that's pretty much my desired sound signature too. Try the SM3 or UM3X, they're both well-regarded for mids. If you're on more of a budget, the RE262.


----------



## AlexCheca

Let me recommend headphones between these 5 (no matter the price)

 1. - Sony EX1000
 2. - Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99
 2. - Vsonic GR07
 4. - Hifiman RE272
 5. - JVC FX700

 I got to have MTPC and IE8. Overall I really like the IE8, but I want to try others with a similar scenario to IE8, many

 Thank you very much for these amazing reviews


----------



## AlexCheca

Let me recommend headphones between these 5 (no matter the price)

 1. - Sony EX1000
 2. - Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99
 2. - Vsonic GR07
 4. - Hifiman RE272
 5. - JVC FX700

 I got to have MTPC and IE8. Overall I really like the IE8, but I want to try others with a similar scenario to IE8, many

 Thank you very much for these amazing reviews


----------



## devoker

re272 is a lot different than the others, treble oriented, sounding like armatures.
  I would say either jvc or ex1000 depending on your choice. Jvc is more like ie8 imo.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





devoker said:


> re272 is a lot different than the others, treble oriented, sounding like armatures.
> I would say either jvc or ex1000 depending on your choice. Jvc is more like ie8 imo.


 
   
  I wouldn't say so. The FX700 is V shaped, with aggressive bass and treble, and comparatively recessed mids. The only one that's somewhat close on that list to the IE8, is the GR07.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





love music said:


> Thanks Joker,
> 
> What are my choices for a headphone thats good with rock/metal. I like vocal centric headphones but the instruments also have to be engaging and does not get congested in complex passages. Budget around $500.
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  I guess the CK100 could be a contender if you like vocal-centric. Other options - UM3X, SM2/SM3, Shure SE530/535. These tend to have more bass than the CK100 and less bright treble. 
   
  Quote: 





iamthem said:


> Does anyone know how the DBA-02 MKII and GR01 compare in terms of build quality?


 
   
  I would definitely go for the DBA-02 mkII if that's what you're after. 
   
  Quote: 





alexcheca said:


> Let me recommend headphones between these 5 (no matter the price)
> 
> 1. - Sony EX1000
> 2. - Audio-Technica ATH-CKM99
> ...


 

 Those don't sound much alike so it would really depend on what you'd like to see improved over the IE8 and what you're willing to give up. FX700 would probably be the safest choice that doesn't give up the IE8's bass quantity.


----------



## winkyeye

Hey joker, I'm coming from a really old pair of Westone 3s and I'm looking to get something new before the cables break. I'm currently debating between the Earsonic SM2 v2 and the Rockit Sound R-50. I know these have pretty different sound signature but I was wondering if I'm coming from the W3, will I find the R-50 to be extremely thin? Also how does the SM2 compare with the W3? Will the SM2 be worth the extra 100$ over the R-50?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





winkyeye said:


> Hey joker, I'm coming from a really old pair of Westone 3s and I'm looking to get something new before the cables break. I'm currently debating between the Earsonic SM2 v2 and the Rockit Sound R-50. I know these have pretty different sound signature but I was wondering if I'm coming from the W3, will I find the R-50 to be extremely thin? Also how does the SM2 compare with the W3? Will the SM2 be worth the extra 100$ over the R-50?
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  Both are very different from the W3. The W3 is actually not a very thick-sounding earphone overall, but it's got a lot of bass. With the R-50 you'll notice a big drop in bass quantity. Punch, slam, whatever you want to call it - the impact with the R-50 just won't be the same. The mids will be more forward as well, which is a good thing in my view. 
   
  The SM2 is very very smooth and quite laid-back up top. If anything, it's thicker-sounding than the W3 in the midrange. Bass quantity will be closer to the W3 than R-50 and the mids will still be very prominent but you'll lose much of the top-end energy of the other two. Whether that's good or bad depends on what you're looking for.


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





heroicpenguin said:


> Not Joker, but that's pretty much my desired sound signature too. Try the SM3 or UM3X, they're both well-regarded for mids. If you're on more of a budget, the RE262.


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I guess the CK100 could be a contender if you like vocal-centric. Other options - UM3X, SM2/SM3, Shure SE530/535. These tend to have more bass than the CK100 and less bright treble.


 
   
  Thanks. I'll look into those too.


----------



## Moby1

Hi joker, 
After damaging my eph100 it is that time to upgrade again, about a year ago I picked up a acs t15 thanks to your helpful thread, unfortunantly I misplaced them after moving out, while the eph100 was nice I always felt the t15 was a level above, what would you recommend as the next step from the t15, something with a balanced sound and bigger sound stage is my preference? Any advice would be greatly appreciated from anyone


----------



## lilboozy

philips she3580 vs brainwavz m1


----------



## winkyeye

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Both are very different from the W3. The W3 is actually not a very thick-sounding earphone overall, but it's got a lot of bass. With the R-50 you'll notice a big drop in bass quantity. Punch, slam, whatever you want to call it - the impact with the R-50 just won't be the same. The mids will be more forward as well, which is a good thing in my view.
> 
> The SM2 is very very smooth and quite laid-back up top. If anything, it's thicker-sounding than the W3 in the midrange. Bass quantity will be closer to the W3 than R-50 and the mids will still be very prominent but you'll lose much of the top-end energy of the other two. Whether that's good or bad depends on what you're looking for.


 
   
  Ah thanks for your response. Do you have any other recommendations for non-custom alternatives to the Westone 3 (preferably with good isolation)?


----------



## Johnny Jumper

I really like my SHE3590s (same as the 3580s from what I've read).  I'm giving them as presents to some of my work buddies.  Never listened to the brainwavz so I can't compare...
   
  JJ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Hi joker,
> After damaging my eph100 it is that time to upgrade again, about a year ago I picked up a acs t15 thanks to your helpful thread, unfortunantly I misplaced them after moving out, while the eph100 was nice I always felt the t15 was a level above, what would you recommend as the next step from the t15, something with a balanced sound and bigger sound stage is my preference? Any advice would be greatly appreciated from anyone


 
   
  The RE272 would probably be my top pick for what you seem to be after. The Ety ER4S or Ortofon e-Q5 would be some other options around that price and the Vsonic GR01 and Rock-It R-50 at a lower price. If you're willing to go custom you'd probably also like the ClearTuneMonitors CTM-200 at ~$350. 
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> philips she3580 vs brainwavz m1


 
   
  What sound signature are you looking for?
   
  Quote: 





winkyeye said:


> Ah thanks for your response. Do you have any other recommendations for non-custom alternatives to the Westone 3 (preferably with good isolation)?


 

 Really depends on what characteristics of the W3 you are looking to retain, what you want to improve on, and what you'd be willing to give up. The PFE232 comes to mind as a somewhat v-shaped earphone with fewer overall tradeoffs compared to the W3. The VSonic GR07 is a good budget alternative with a flatter response.


----------



## djvkool

Joker -- (or anyone else who have heard all 3)
   
  I am interested in pulling the trigger on XBA-3, as price here locally in Australia is cheap as they are being phased out and replaced by the XBA30 - can you help and advise the sound of XBA-3 in comparison to Westone3 and TF10?


----------



## AznInvasion138

Hey there joker, so I'm looking to give a mid tier IEM to a family member for the holidays. Price range $100-200. Sound signature looking for a great all arounder with maybe a little more emphasis on bass. Will be listening to mostly hip hop, r&b, trance, alternative rock, and acoustic music. Some of the options I was looking at were the Yamaha EPH-100, Vsonic GR07, RE262, JVC FXT90, Rock It R50, Hippo VB, JVC FXD80, Future Sonic MG7 Pro, and TDK BA2000. I know its a lot but just wondering if you can help narrow the list down. Thanks!


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Joker -- (or anyone else who have heard all 3)
> 
> I am interested in pulling the trigger on XBA-3, as price here locally in Australia is cheap as they are being phased out and replaced by the XBA30 - can you help and advise the sound of XBA-3 in comparison to Westone3 and TF10?


 

 wait for the xba30 , xba-3 has J cord and xba30 has Y cord . i have tried the tf10 and i would not say that xba-3 beats the tf10 , but has a bit better highs , mids are a bit lean and bass has lesser impact . if i were you , i would have gone for tf10 any day , not for anything but for its beautiful presentation , softer and solid bass , yes it has some mid bass hump but not bothering at all .


----------



## Click

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Joker -- (or anyone else who have heard all 3)
> 
> I am interested in pulling the trigger on XBA-3, as price here locally in Australia is cheap as they are being phased out and replaced by the XBA30 - can you help and advise the sound of XBA-3 in comparison to Westone3 and TF10?


 
   
  I'm a newbie here, but I don't believe Joker has listened to the XBA-3. He has reviewed the XBA-4, but it was loaned to him. There's a XBA-3 appreciation thread where you may find some more info on the IEM: http://www.head-fi.org/t/633755/xba-3-overlooked-the-appreciation-thread
   
Groupon currently has a sale on the XBA-3iP for $130. Not sure if they ship to Aussie-land though. 
   
  BTW, I just want to say how much I appreciate Joker and this thread. I've been a long-time lurker on Head-Fi and this thread has helped me a lot in determining the quality of IEMs. Truly a valuable resource!


----------



## czqdtc

After trying all the good IEMs out there, including JH13, ES5, even togo 334. I still can't find something that represent the W4R signature but with improvements overall.
  JH13 almost did the job there but the vocal is too thin and too transparent, lack the solid imaging of the voice.
  ES5 doesn't have the fluffy highs up top, actually I think they don't extend as well as the W4.
  334 is amazing but there is a hotspot in the treble that annoys me sometimes and the bass is a bit loose for my taste.
   
  Jesus, I really don't know what to do now. How about the 1964 V6? Does this one has the magical mids of W4?
  How about... maybe the fitear MH335?
  Or, does it mean W4 is the ideal/perfect IEM for me ?


----------



## DPCyric

Hi Joker,
   
  I listen to a lot of a bass heavy industrial music (KMFDM mainly) but I also like some very elaborate metal as well (Tristania, Dream Theater, Therion) with a little bit of pop as well (Depeche Mode is the big one here). I plan on getting a set of Velodyne vPulse's for every day listening but for higher end at home listening I havent decided on what to get. The Monster Miles Davis Tribute I am interested in thanks to your review but they are pretty hard to find now. I am fairly picky about design and the Tributes look nice (as do the MTPC, trumpets and the vPulse) and I am also concerned that if I pick them up I will still need something better suited for the metal I like. Would it serve me well to track down a pair of Tributes if I want something that blows my brains out listening to KMFDM and maybe a pair of MTPC for the metal where I don't want as much bass? Should I look into a more analytical pair of IEMS for my metal? If so what do you think would be great and also fit my tastes look wise?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Joker -- (or anyone else who have heard all 3)
> 
> I am interested in pulling the trigger on XBA-3, as price here locally in Australia is cheap as they are being phased out and replaced by the XBA30 - can you help and advise the sound of XBA-3 in comparison to Westone3 and TF10?


 
   
  I haven't listened to the XBA-3
   
  Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Hey there joker, so I'm looking to give a mid tier IEM to a family member for the holidays. Price range $100-200. Sound signature looking for a great all arounder with maybe a little more emphasis on bass. Will be listening to mostly hip hop, r&b, trance, alternative rock, and acoustic music. Some of the options I was looking at were the Yamaha EPH-100, Vsonic GR07, RE262, JVC FXT90, Rock It R50, Hippo VB, JVC FXD80, Future Sonic MG7 Pro, and TDK BA2000. I know its a lot but just wondering if you can help narrow the list down. Thanks!


 
   
  If you want a bump in the bass, you probably don't want the RE262 or R-50. While perhaps not completely flat, they do not have emphasized bass. The rest are all solid options depending on the requirements (except the BA200, can't say anything about that as I haven't heard it yet). I personally think the EPH-100 or FXT90 would maybe have more of a "wow factor" for the casual listener.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





click said:


> BTW, I just want to say how much I appreciate Joker and this thread. I've been a long-time lurker on Head-Fi and this thread has helped me a lot in determining the quality of IEMs. Truly a valuable resource!


 
   





   
   
   
  Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> does it mean W4 is the ideal/perfect IEM for me ?


 
   
  Sure sounds that way.
   
  Quote: 





dpcyric said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I listen to a lot of a bass heavy industrial music (KMFDM mainly) but I also like some very elaborate metal as well (Tristania, Dream Theater, Therion) with a little bit of pop as well (Depeche Mode is the big one here). I plan on getting a set of Velodyne vPulse's for every day listening but for higher end at home listening I havent decided on what to get. The Monster Miles Davis Tribute I am interested in thanks to your review but they are pretty hard to find now. I am fairly picky about design and the Tributes look nice (as do the MTPC, trumpets and the vPulse) and I am also concerned that if I pick them up I will still need something better suited for the metal I like. Would it serve me well to track down a pair of Tributes if I want something that blows my brains out listening to KMFDM and maybe a pair of MTPC for the metal where I don't want as much bass? Should I look into a more analytical pair of IEMS for my metal? If so what do you think would be great and also fit my tastes look wise?


 

 You're probably better off getting the vPulses, spending some time with them, and seeing where you want to go from there. Doesn't seem like you know what type of sound you are after at this point and there's a number of options available to you. It might take trying the vPulse and a few other sets in order to get your sound signature bearings. I would definitely advise against getting both the Tributes and Coppers - they sound different, but probably not enough to warrant owning both.


----------



## kingice10

Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> After trying all the good IEMs out there, including JH13, ES5, even togo 334. I still can't find something that represent the W4R signature but with improvements overall.
> JH13 almost did the job there but the vocal is too thin and too transparent, lack the solid imaging of the voice.
> ES5 doesn't have the fluffy highs up top, actually I think they don't extend as well as the W4.
> 334 is amazing but there is a hotspot in the treble that annoys me sometimes and the bass is a bit loose for my taste.
> ...


 
  I suggest you try the MH335. Its bass is more controlled than the MH334. For me, im okay with the treble of MH334 but the bass should have a bit of control for a BA iem. Its not that loose but if you compare to SM3 or W4, you can hear it.


----------



## Wild

Just want to say thanks for the awesome and comprehensive review IjokerI.  It's been a huge help to me in my quest for some solid IEM's.


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> wait for the xba30 , xba-3 has J cord and xba30 has Y cord . i have tried the tf10 and i would not say that xba-3 beats the tf10 , but has a bit better highs , mids are a bit lean and bass has lesser impact . if i were you , i would have gone for tf10 any day , not for anything but for its beautiful presentation , softer and solid bass , yes it has some mid bass hump but not bothering at all .


 
   
  Thanks buddy, yeah I own both TF10 and W3, I love my BA-based IEM and XBA-3 is cheap here locally at the moment, so yeah have been thinking about it


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Thanks buddy, yeah I own both TF10 and W3, I love my BA-based IEM and XBA-3 is cheap here locally at the moment, so yeah have been thinking about it


 

 if its going for $150 or 160 , its good . any thing over $180-200 is over priced .


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> if its going for $150 or 160 , its good . any thing over $180-200 is over priced .


 
   
  Yep it is going for $147 here in Australia currently for clearance, not the remote/mic version, just straight up XBA-3, and $196 for XBA-4


----------



## Moby1

ljokerl said:


> The RE272 would probably be my top pick for what you seem to be after.



Thanks joker will start reading into them.


----------



## exsomnis

Hi joker...thanks for your awesome roundup!  I got myself the DBA-02 MKII's based on your roundup sorted by SQ and filtered by price and they're my favourite IEMs so far.  I love their precision, clarity and ability to reproduce details.  While these are my first quality IEMs, since then I've auditioned some others and I agree with your high SQ rating in comparison - ie, I would pick these over a pair of XBA-4's which are twice as expensive here.  
   
  My only complaint about them is that occasionally, mid to treble instruments (strings, alto sax, etc) lack a bit of substance and can sound smaller than they should.  Is this a characteristic of IEMs in general that I can expect with other IEMs or is it just the nature of single balanced armatures?  
   
  For an upgrade, I'm considering the Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200...if there are any other worthy alternatives I will not go higher than $400.  Should I just stick with the MKII's or will the CTM-200 and/or other >9.2 SQ phones at $400 and below make a worthwhile difference?


----------



## czqdtc

kingice10 said:


> I suggest you try the MH335. Its bass is more controlled than the MH334. For me, im okay with the treble of MH334 but the bass should have a bit of control for a BA iem. Its not that loose but if you compare to SM3 or W4, you can hear it.



yeah, I'm thinking of 335, but it cost 2200 dollars!!! What!!! No!!!
I'm actually looking into much cheaper ones like the 1964 v6 or UM miracle.


----------



## czqdtc

Hi, joker.
How does the UM miracles or 1964 v6's mids(vocal) compare to westone 4?


----------



## AznInvasion138

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you want a bump in the bass, you probably don't want the RE262 or R-50. While perhaps not completely flat, they do not have emphasized bass. The rest are all solid options depending on the requirements (except the BA200, can't say anything about that as I haven't heard it yet). I personally think the EPH-100 or FXT90 would maybe have more of a "wow factor" for the casual listener.


 
   
  Just want to echo everyone else on this thread and say thanks for helping narrowing down my possible choices joker. Thanks!


----------



## lilkhmerkid4u

Hello boys,
   
   
  Need an IE headphone thats durable preferably less than ~$60. Using it strictly for working out

 I run about 5mi everyday and hit the gym 5days/week

 I listen to mainly orchestra type music along with some trance music with the occasional rap music for my workout
   
  How are the Meelectionrics S6?
   
  Suggestions? Thanks!


----------



## Impulse

Haven't tried the S6 but I'm pretty happy with the cheaper/older M6P, been running a few miles with them every few days and I no longer need to adjust them frequently like I had to with my JVC Marshmallow.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





wild said:


> Just want to say thanks for the awesome and comprehensive review IjokerI.  It's been a huge help to me in my quest for some solid IEM's.


 
   
  Thanks, glad to hear that.
   
  Quote: 





exsomnis said:


> Hi joker...thanks for your awesome roundup!  I got myself the DBA-02 MKII's based on your roundup sorted by SQ and filtered by price and they're my favourite IEMs so far.  I love their precision, clarity and ability to reproduce details.  While these are my first quality IEMs, since then I've auditioned some others and I agree with your high SQ rating in comparison - ie, I would pick these over a pair of XBA-4's which are twice as expensive here.
> 
> My only complaint about them is that occasionally, mid to treble instruments (strings, alto sax, etc) lack a bit of substance and can sound smaller than they should.  Is this a characteristic of IEMs in general that I can expect with other IEMs or is it just the nature of single balanced armatures?
> 
> For an upgrade, I'm considering the Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200...if there are any other worthy alternatives I will not go higher than $400.  Should I just stick with the MKII's or will the CTM-200 and/or other >9.2 SQ phones at $400 and below make a worthwhile difference?


 
   
  There are BA-based earphones that sound much thicker/fuller than the DBA-02  (which is a dual armature, by the way), That said, the CTM-200 is not very thick-sounding either, though slightly more so than the DBA-02. The Alclair Reference might be a better option if you can swing the price. If you wanted to try a solid, balanced-sounding dynamic-driver set just to see if you like the note presentation better, you could do so without spending a lot, for example with the HiFiMan RE272 or even Sony EX600 or MDR-7550. 
   
  Quote: 





czqdtc said:


> Hi, joker.
> How does the UM miracles or 1964 v6's mids(vocal) compare to westone 4?


 
   
  I haven't heard the V6. The midrange of the Miracle is, if anything, a little laid-back. I don't think it's exactly what you're after. 
   
  Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Just want to echo everyone else on this thread and say thanks for helping narrowing down my possible choices joker. Thanks!


 
   





   
  Quote: 





lilkhmerkid4u said:


> Hello boys,
> 
> 
> Need an IE headphone thats durable preferably less than ~$60. Using it strictly for working out
> ...


 

 I personally wouldn't risk anything that wasn't designed for sports for running/heavy gym use unless it was priced as a disposable item. I used an H2O Audio Flex until recently. The M6 worked well before that, just had a bit more bass than I like. Haven't tried the S6 but from what I understand it's pretty similar to the M6.


----------



## AznInvasion138

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you want a bump in the bass, you probably don't want the RE262 or R-50. While perhaps not completely flat, they do not have emphasized bass. The rest are all solid options depending on the requirements (except the BA200, can't say anything about that as I haven't heard it yet). I personally think the EPH-100 or FXT90 would maybe have more of a "wow factor" for the casual listener.


 
   
  Sorry to keep bothering you joker but I just found out that my brother (the guy im buying these IEMs for) doesn't really care for an extra emphasize of bass, so that basically screwed up my selection of headphones lol. The important aspects to him would probably be isolation and comfort since he will be using them on transits everyday. He listens to mostly alternative stuff like Lana Del Ray and Ed Sheeran with a mix of hip hop like J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, Frank Ocean so what would be a best all-rounder I guess. The GR07 looks good at this point but don't know anymore haha. Thanks again for the help!


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Sorry to keep bothering you joker but I just found out that my brother (the guy im buying these IEMs for) doesn't really care for an extra emphasize of bass, so that basically screwed up my selection of headphones lol. The important aspects to him would probably be isolation and comfort since he will be using them on transits everyday. He listens to mostly alternative stuff like Lana Del Ray and Ed Sheeran with a mix of hip hop like J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, Frank Ocean so what would be a best all-rounder I guess. The GR07 looks good at this point but don't know anymore haha. Thanks again for the help!


 

 get the er4p .


----------



## Portable Mink

Joker,
  I just read your entire review catalogue and i must say that i am just absolutely applauding what a job you have done.
 Words to not express my gratitude nor do they do justice to the time and effort that you have obviously put in to what you have compiled.
  I am at the semi-beginner stage of wanting to really understand and appreciate quality sound and devices that deliver it so apologies for my inability to convey what it is that im after with much clarity.
   
  18 months ago i purchased some Triple Fi 10s on here from a user by the name of mvw2. I really enjoyed them but wasnt really ready to dive properly into the world of IEM's and head-fi. After a while i didnt really look after them and i simply used them with my laptop, iPhone and iPod, never buying any specific gear to really reap the rewards of having some quality IEM's.
  Recently i noticed that the sound in the left side was diminished so i tried to clean them out and i think i damaged both of them unfortunately. They still work, just do not have the punch they did and have lost about 40% volume. As such, i have decided to really stop trying to take the easy way out and dedicate myself to learning as much as i can and making smart decisions to really try and appreciate what i want from my FI gear.
   
  My plan is to purchase some IEM's around christmas time and then purchase a proper audio player some time after that and really take care of my gear and get involved. As i mentioned, i have just read all of your review and im trying to narrow down what is best for me to get going.
  Its a lot of information to take in over a short time so your table at the bottom really helped remind me of what id read and what i liked and what i thought could be an option for me.
   
  I dont really have a specific genre that i listen to. I love my stoner rock, metal, acoustic quiet stuff, some electronic stuff as well like The Prodigy. From reading a lot of your reviews i believe that i would really enjoy a pretty even bass/midrange/treble set that is fun and not to analytical. i like my music to sound big and fun, but not to the point of reducing its clarity or accuracy. I like the idea of a large but obviously not over the top soundstage and liked what you had to say about the soundstage of the SM3 and how it helped you determine what is the perfect size stage for an IEM. Those things i think are important to me. the immersion and 3d qualities without obviously going overboard. Something that is rich and cohesive but you can still identify the individual frequencies if you look for them.
   
  If you do get a chance to reply to my post, i hope that helps define the kind of sound i am looking for.
   
  I guess moving along to your table i see quite an interesting trend. The top 6 are all custom IEMs, which makes sense, but the next 4 are universal and actually more expensive than 3 of the custom ones ahead of them on the list. I am wooed by the review of the 1964EARS V3, and also the price, yet i want to make sure im ready for a custom IEM like that. Like i said, i dont currently own a premium player for high quality audio so until i made that commitment as well (of which i have not begun to look at possible answers), any of the top rated IEM's would obviously be under-utilised.
   
  Before i read your thread i was leaning towards the UM3x, Earsonic SM3 or RE272. But now after diving in, my decision seems harder. The price of the Alclair and the V3 Ears is really not that much more than those i was initially looking at, and reading the reviews, it appears as though they are clearly highly rated.
   
  I guess what im after from yourself or anyone who would like to reply (appreciate it so much if possible), is some direction on where to go from here, How to make my decision, how i should go about building a kit up for myself, and generally a guide for myself to get from tonnes of data to using it to make an informed decision and purchases.
  As it stands, i am now tempted by the V3 Ears, the Alclair, CK10, CK100 as well as a bunch of others and also still holding a nice soft spot for the UM3x and SM3.
   
  I cant even ask my questions right because i just dont know where to go from here!
 Any help from anyone would be appreciated and thanks again for the remarkable job with your reviews.
  Cheers,
 Mink.


----------



## DPCyric

ljokerl said:


> You're probably better off getting the vPulses, spending some time with them, and seeing where you want to go from there. Doesn't seem like you know what type of sound you are after at this point and there's a number of options available to you. It might take trying the vPulse and a few other sets in order to get your sound signature bearings. I would definitely advise against getting both the Tributes and Coppers - they sound different, but probably not enough to warrant owning both.




Thanks, I will be ordering the vPulses today (will be nice every days with my iPhone). You are right about getting my bearings because the only nice headphones I have atm are a pair of Astro A50's. Also thanks for advising against getting both the Tributes and Coppers. I believe post Christmas I will get the Tributes (since their rarity is going up) and then after spending some time with them coming back here if I need anymore help. Is there a cheap pair of analytical IEMs you would recommend to help get my bearings ?


----------



## BleaK

Quote: 





portable mink said:


> I guess moving along to your table i see quite an interesting trend. The top 6 are all custom IEMs, which makes sense, but the next 4 are universal and actually more expensive than 3 of the custom ones ahead of them on the list. I am wooed by the review of the 1964EARS V3, and also the price, yet i want to make sure im ready for a custom IEM like that. Like i said, i dont currently own a premium player for high quality audio so until i made that commitment as well (of which i have not begun to look at possible answers), any of the top rated IEM's would obviously be under-utilised.
> 
> Before i read your thread i was leaning towards the UM3x, Earsonic SM3 or RE272. But now after diving in, my decision seems harder. The price of the Alclair and the V3 Ears is really not that much more than those i was initially looking at, and reading the reviews, it appears as though they are clearly highly rated.
> 
> ...


 
  I got the V3 yesterday, they sound really really good. I have posted my impressions in the V3-review thread if you want to take a look.


----------



## Impulse

dpcyric said:


> Thanks, I will be ordering the vPulses today (will be nice every days with my iPhone). You are right about getting my bearings because the only nice headphones I have atm are a pair of Astro A50's. Also thanks for advising against getting both the Tributes and Coppers. I believe post Christmas I will get the Tributes (since their rarity is going up) and then after spending some time with them coming back here if I need anymore help. Is there a cheap pair of analytical IEMs you would recommend to help get my bearings ?




Should've asked yesterday when Amazon had the MEElec A151 for like $30! MEElec's been running a lot of excellent deals on their website and on Amazon this holiday season tho, might be worth signing up for their newsletter and keeping an eye out.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Sorry to keep bothering you joker but I just found out that my brother (the guy im buying these IEMs for) doesn't really care for an extra emphasize of bass, so that basically screwed up my selection of headphones lol. The important aspects to him would probably be isolation and comfort since he will be using them on transits everyday. He listens to mostly alternative stuff like Lana Del Ray and Ed Sheeran with a mix of hip hop like J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, Frank Ocean so what would be a best all-rounder I guess. The GR07 looks good at this point but don't know anymore haha. Thanks again for the help!


 
   
  The GR07 is a safe option because it doesn't have an intrusive bass presentation but still has more punch and bass depth compared to something like an RE262 or Ety. Not the greatest isolation but should be good for commuting. 
   
  Quote: 





portable mink said:


> Joker,
> I just read your entire review catalogue and i must say that i am just absolutely applauding what a job you have done.
> Words to not express my gratitude nor do they do justice to the time and effort that you have obviously put in to what you have compiled.
> I am at the semi-beginner stage of wanting to really understand and appreciate quality sound and devices that deliver it so apologies for my inability to convey what it is that im after with much clarity.
> ...


 
   
  Since you've owned the Triple.Fi 10 for so long you should have some idea of what your liked/didn't like about its sound. It's difficult to make a decision with only one data point and you could spend time and money exploring different sound signatures to figure out what you really like. However, it seems like you are ready to take a larger leap and if you're the type of person who will be always be wondering whether there's something better out there after buying an RE262 or UM3X, I would just jump right into it and get a V3. The beauty of the V3 is that it's a pretty forgiving earphone (compared to the Alclair Reference, for example) and also tends towards a more fun sound. It'll more than match the bass of your TF10s while still providing some treble sparkle and pushing the midrange forward. It should allow you to put your system together over time as it will play well with a Sansa Clip or another decent cheap-o device. 
   
  Quote: 





dpcyric said:


> Thanks, I will be ordering the vPulses today (will be nice every days with my iPhone). You are right about getting my bearings because the only nice headphones I have atm are a pair of Astro A50's. Also thanks for advising against getting both the Tributes and Coppers. I believe post Christmas I will get the Tributes (since their rarity is going up) and then after spending some time with them coming back here if I need anymore help. Is there a cheap pair of analytical IEMs you would recommend to help get my bearings ?


 

 Not really cheap but the Etymotic HF5 at ~$100 is always a great option. If you just want to try a balanced armature the Rock-It R-30 is a good deal at ~$70 as well. It's not as balanced as the Ety but for the price it's very good.


----------



## germanturkey

hey joker, long time!
   
  any chance you could give me a quick comparison between the ATH-CK10 (still rocking these) and the UE900?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





germanturkey said:


> hey joker, long time!
> 
> any chance you could give me a quick comparison between the ATH-CK10 (still rocking these) and the UE900?
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  It's pretty similar to the Rock-It R-50 comparison I included in the review: 

 UE900: warmer tone, smoother treble, more impactful bass, better bass depth and power, more forward lower midrange, more natural timbre
  CK10: brighter, thinner note presentation, slightly tighter bass, slightly wider soundstage, better imaging, less forward midrange


----------



## exsomnis

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There are BA-based earphones that sound much thicker/fuller than the DBA-02  (which is a dual armature, by the way), That said, the CTM-200 is not very thick-sounding either, though slightly more so than the DBA-02. The Alclair Reference might be a better option if you can swing the price. If you wanted to try a solid, balanced-sounding dynamic-driver set just to see if you like the note presentation better, you could do so without spending a lot, for example with the HiFiMan RE272 or even Sony EX600 or MDR-7550.


 
   
  Thanks!  I will definitely have a look at these.


----------



## germanturkey

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's pretty similar to the Rock-It R-50 comparison I included in the review:
> 
> UE900: warmer tone, smoother treble, more impactful bass, better bass depth and power, more forward lower midrange, more natural timbre
> CK10: brighter, thinner note presentation, slightly tighter bass, slightly wider soundstage, better imaging, less forward midrange


 
  hmm, so the the ue900s have less detail?  interesting.  given that your preference is pretty close to mine, would you recommend one over the other?  also, i've read a bit that the ue900s have a veil on them, do you find this to be true?


----------



## vidro3

I'd appreciate a recommendation based on the following parameters, in order of importance
   
  1. Around $50-$60 max
  2. earbud
  3. noise cancelling
  4. Fabric, or tangleless cords.
   
  No smart phone integration/remote necessary.
   
  They are for my girlfriend, who of course, doesn't want large headphones that will mess her hair. She mainly listens to stuff like Johnny Cash, gillian welch. I would say that about half the use will be no music, just noise cancelling while on the subway since one of her biggest annoyances is the sound leaking from other people's headphones.
   
  I'm considering the following:
   
  http://www.amazon.com/Sony-MDREX86LP-BLK-Headphones-Black/dp/B0046ZSWX2
  http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-ATH-ANC23-QuietPoint--ear/dp/B004K09H32/ref=sr_1_17?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1355510159&sr=1-17&keywords=sony+noise+cancelling+in+ear


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





vidro3 said:


> I'd appreciate a recommendation based on the following parameters, in order of importance
> 
> 1. Around $50-$60 max
> 2. earbud
> ...


 

  you can consider ue 400/500 , meelec cc51 , cw31 , velodyne vplus and the best one is gr06 . for isolation i think , ue 400/500 and cc51 will do good , you can consider ety mc5 too .


----------



## Amitl

hey everyone!
  i love my id America Spark and thinking to upgrade to
  something with less microphonics and more secure (and comfortable) fit.
  obviously the sound is the most important factor.
  i was wondering :
  Shure SE215  -vs-  Vsonic gr06/gr04
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





germanturkey said:


> hmm, so the the ue900s have less detail?  interesting.  given that your preference is pretty close to mine, would you recommend one over the other?  also, i've read a bit that the ue900s have a veil on them, do you find this to be true?


 
   
  I wouldn't say one has more detail than the other. I like them for different things, can't really say I prefer one strongly. I did experience the upper midrange veil with the UE900. It's quite noticeable next to something like the RE272.
   
  Quote: 





vidro3 said:


> I'd appreciate a recommendation based on the following parameters, in order of importance
> 
> 1. Around $50-$60 max
> 2. earbud
> ...


 
   
  Are you set on that half in-ear form factor like the sets you linked? Those typically don't have the best noise isolation compared to proper in-ears.
   
  There are tons of choices in that price range - I agree that the CW31 is a good all-rounder at ~$30 except that it has that half in-ear shape and doesn't isolate all that much. The UE500 is a safe choice, flat cables, decent isolation, and pleasant sound. The MC5 isolates quite a lot more (probably more than anything else in that price range) but the sound is flatter, probably less friendly towards the average non-audiophile listener. Another option would be one of the entry-level BAs (for example Astrotec AM-90, Rock-It R-20, or MEElec A151). These don't have very much bass but they typically have a warmer sound and good-to-great isolation. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> hey everyone!
> i love my id America Spark and thinking to upgrade to
> something with less microphonics and more secure (and comfortable) fit.
> obviously the sound is the most important factor.
> ...


 
   
  I've only heard the SE215 and GR06. Neither of these have as much bass as the Spark and the SE215 has a lot less treble as well. The GR06 is much more forward in the midrange, too.


----------



## lilkhmerkid4u

Thanks joker. Amazing job!!!


----------



## Harijs

Hello, there!
  Help me choose a new ''BETTER'' pair of IEM's.
 My current IEM's - UE triple.fi 10

 Target:

 -Soundstage
 -Deep sub bass
 -Crisp hights
 -Imagining

 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilkhmerkid4u said:


> Thanks joker. Amazing job!!!


 
   





   
  Quote: 





harijs said:


> Hello, there!
> Help me choose a new ''BETTER'' pair of IEM's.
> My current IEM's - UE triple.fi 10
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sounds like a JVC HA-FX700


----------



## Harijs

Thank You, Joker!
   
  So you prefer JVC HA-FX700 over the triple.fi 10 ?

 Slightly prefer or clearly prefer on Your personal taste?

 Thanks! You do an amazing reviews!


----------



## kaixax555

hmm I am waiting for new reviews from you joker


----------



## Amitl

what is an upgrade to the id america spark (soundwise), considering
  i love the spark's signature and want a more secure fit?
  (in the 70-150$ range)
  thanks...


----------



## Johnny Jumper

impulse said:


> Should've asked yesterday when Amazon had the MEElec A151 for like $30! MEElec's been running a lot of excellent deals on their website and on Amazon this holiday season tho, might be worth signing up for their newsletter and keeping an eye out.




Bought my nephew a set of A151s for Christmas. Haven't tried them myself but I'm gonna give them a listen after he gets them going...

JJ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





harijs said:


> Thank You, Joker!
> 
> So you prefer JVC HA-FX700 over the triple.fi 10 ?
> 
> ...


 
   
  Clearly prefer - the FX700 sounds more natural to me despite its heavy bass. The FX500 is a budget substitute around the TF10's price with a somewhat similar signature but has harsher treble and less midrange presence than the FX700, and isn't really an upgrade over the TF10. 
   
  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> hmm I am waiting for new reviews from you joker


 
   
  More on the way
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> what is an upgrade to the id america spark (soundwise), considering
> i love the spark's signature and want a more secure fit?
> (in the 70-150$ range)
> thanks...


 

 JVC HA-FXT90 (slightly less bass than the spark, more mids, larger housing size but angled fit, sits more flush in the ear)
  JVC HA-FX500 (a little larger than the Spark but again has angled-nozzle fit)
  Futuresonics Atrio (better deep bass but less mid-bass impact, also less bloat, nice and secure fit esp. over-the-ear with foam tips) 
  ATH-CKM99 (half in-ear form factor, not quite as much bass at Spark but definitely not lean; ATH-CKM500 is a nice budget alternative but not sure where it ranks overall yet)
   
  Also the VSonic GR02 bass edition might work for you - it tends to sit a little more flush than the Spark and has lighter shells. Not much of a sound upgrade, though, and a bit more difficult to wear cord-up.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the FitEar TG334
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1A5) FitEar To Go! 334*
> 
> 
> Added Dec 2012
> ...


----------



## shotgunshane

Very enjoyable read on the TG334!


----------



## rawrster

That Fit Ear earphones reminds me of that UE earphone with the extra bass. I think it was UE5 EB?


----------



## DannyBai

Another good read.  Glad to know the Miracles are still highly regarded and I don't need to shell out for the FitEar or anything else top-tier.  Thanks joker.


----------



## H20Fidelity

Thanks ljokerl dude!


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Enjoyed reading the TG! 334 review. Now all we need is to get you a 1plus2 to compare to


----------



## goodvibes

Sounds like a great travel sig.


----------



## suman134

tg 334 not for we poor people . looks big too . like a tf10 on steroids . but a nice review with useful comparisons .


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> tg 334 not for we poor people . looks big too . like a tf10 on steroids . but a nice review with useful comparisons .


 
  TF10 didn't have anything resting on the ear outside of the canal and needed wire support. This looks like it should stay put without help.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> TF10 didn't have anything resting on the ear outside of the canal and needed wire support. This looks like it should stay put without help.


 

 agree , i must , tf10 was just a curved barrel , but TG334 has better ergonomics . still , to me , its a tf10 with muscles .


----------



## zachchen1996

snappyaxolotl said:


> Enjoyed reading the TG! 334 review. Now all we need is to get you a 1plus2 to compare to




+1

Maybe the 1plus2 just might be able to top the "king"


----------



## Techno Kid

The TG334 is the only really expensive IEM I'd think about buy but having said that I'm extremely happy with the SM3 V2 and see no reason to spend $1000 more to get them.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the FitEar TG334


 
   
  And it only took a century


----------



## atomikn00b

This TG334 review makes me want joker to get an fxz200 or fxz100 (both only availabe through Japan).
 Especially because the cost is sooo much lower with the 100 in same range as gr07


----------



## soullinker20

I think after the tg334, everyone's more excited of the tg334 goin toe-to-toe with the newly revised tralucent audio 1plus2 w/ gold plated cable..
   
  I wish joker had the chance to also listen on the tg334s with 000 cables..


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the FitEar TG334


 
  wow!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Very enjoyable read on the TG334!


 
   
  Thanks. You took a big part in giving me the chance to write it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> That Fit Ear earphones reminds me of that UE earphone with the extra bass. I think it was UE5 EB?


 
   
  Been a while since I've been near a pair of those. I think they were significantly uglier, better not say what they remind me of here in case any young'uns are reading. 
   
   

   
  Quote: 





dannybai said:


> Another good read.  Glad to know the Miracles are still highly regarded and I don't need to shell out for the FitEar or anything else top-tier.  Thanks joker.


 
   
  Highly regarded by myself, not sure what the consensus is these days. There are probably other customs that sound as good as or better than the Miracle, though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> Thanks ljokerl dude!


 
   




   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Enjoyed reading the TG! 334 review. Now all we need is to get you a 1plus2 to compare to


 
   
  Maybe next year.
   
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> Sounds like a great travel sig.


 
   
  It does work well out and about but they look a little freaky and the isolation was too good for some of my commuting (also too good for the office). Should be great for those who take the subway. 
   
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> TF10 didn't have anything resting on the ear outside of the canal and needed wire support. This looks like it should stay put without help.


 
   
  This. For me the MH334 is much more secure in the ear than the TF10 and much more comfortable in the long run than some of the smaller ergo-fit IEMs such as the Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3 and SM3 v1.
   
  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> The TG334 is the only really expensive IEM I'd think about buy but having said that I'm extremely happy with the SM3 V2 and see no reason to spend $1000 more to get them.


 
   
  No doubt a difficult spend to swing for most. 
   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> And it only took a century


 
   
  By that metric I started the TF10 review some time in the 1600s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## omastic

Hi Joker!!
   
  i am quite interested in the 1964 V3, and your comparisons with the FitEar 334 really piqued my interest today! How would you rate the V3 compared to the SM3 and westone 4? I owned the SM3 for a long time before I got tired with the thick mid range. My last high end IEM was the Heir Audio 4.Ai which I believe is somewhat similar to the westone 4, but had to get rid of it due to quite horrible fit issues. 
   
  Thanks a lot!!


----------



## scootsit

If anyone is interested, the SHE3580 and SHE3590 (basically the same thing, just newer) can both be had for $6 and $7, respectively at Marshalls (granted each store has a different inventory, but any that do have them will likely have them for under $10).
   
  I've got to say, for the price, they're pretty great. I've got very limited experience with IEMs, but I really haven't heard that much of an improvement between the 3580 and other sets. Frankly, all IEMs I've heard sound slightly artificial to me, and the 3580 is no different, but hey, it's under $10...


----------



## Innox

@ljokerl, 
 are you gonna make a review of the new vsonic vc-02 ?
 I'm thinking between the vc-02 and the gr-02 (gr-02 because in your review it sounds(reads) pretty good
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )
  And since you make such awsome detailed reviews and comparisons, i think it would make my decision easier.

 or do you suggest an other IEM in the same price range


----------



## putente

Great review on the TG334, and a very interesting read! Thanks!


----------



## ace8888

Very nice review man, thanks! And I think you really described the tg334 very well. But, Joker you should listen the tg334 with cable 000, to my ears everything is a notiable step up. Especially the highs, with stock cable I find some track has this uncomfortable piercing highs, but with cable 000 it becomes really smooth and more extended! I could swear it's not just in my head, but I really do hear it like that. Plus the soundstage becomes taller and wider and bass become 'tighter' but still speed remains the same.


----------



## kingice10

Very nice review |joker|...you have compared them also with the current very good price-to-performance ratio iems which I had never heard yet. Currently this is one of the best sounding IEM that I have, only that it's very expensive (like a CIEM). I liked the presentation more than my JH16s, which has almost the same price here, and admittedly my favorite SM3. It's such a jewel.


----------



## bhima

As always, great review Joker. I enjoy reading all of your reviews. I also liked your comparisons... I love how you have such a high regard for the RE-262 that you'd compare it to this IEM costing 10x as much haha. Now, how about going back to reviewing IEMs not priced in the stratosphere  so as to increase our hunger to purchase more IEMS?


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





bhima said:


> As always, great review Joker. I enjoy reading all of your reviews. I also liked your comparisons... I love how you have such a high regard for the RE-262 that you'd compare it to this IEM costing 10x as much haha. Now, how about going back to reviewing IEMs not priced in the stratosphere  so as to increase our hunger to purchase more IEMS?


 
  It's great reading balanced yet affirmative reviews sans a fanboy hype.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





omastic said:


> i am quite interested in the 1964 V3, and your comparisons with the FitEar 334 really piqued my interest today! How would you rate the V3 compared to the SM3 and westone 4? I owned the SM3 for a long time before I got tired with the thick mid range. My last high end IEM was the Heir Audio 4.Ai which I believe is somewhat similar to the westone 4, but had to get rid of it due to quite horrible fit issues.
> 
> Thanks a lot!!


 
   
  The ratings are found on the front page of the thread - I would pick the V3 over both the SM3 and W4. The V3 doesn't have that same thickness of the SM3. It has more emphasis in the upper midrange and treble and the sound is overall brighter and more airy. 
   
  Quote: 





innox said:


> @ljokerl,
> are you gonna make a review of the new vsonic vc-02 ?
> I'm thinking between the vc-02 and the gr-02 (gr-02 because in your review it sounds(reads) pretty good
> 
> ...


 
   
  I'll review the VC02 but probably not for a while. The VC02 and GR02 BE sound nothing alike - the VC02 is pretty balanced and neutral-to-bright in tone from the 5 mins I've listened to it. The GR02 BE is v-shaped with a lot more bass and less smooth treble. If you like heavy bass, go for the GR02 BE. Otherwise the VC02 is probably better based on what little I've heard of it so far.
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> Great review on the TG334, and a very interesting read! Thanks!


 
   
  Quote: 





ace8888 said:


> Very nice review man, thanks! And I think you really described the tg334 very well. But, Joker you should listen the tg334 with cable 000, to my ears everything is a notiable step up. Especially the highs, with stock cable I find some track has this uncomfortable piercing highs, but with cable 000 it becomes really smooth and more extended! I could swear it's not just in my head, but I really do hear it like that. Plus the soundstage becomes taller and wider and bass become 'tighter' but still speed remains the same.


 
   
  Quote: 





kingice10 said:


> Very nice review |joker|...you have compared them also with the current very good price-to-performance ratio iems which I had never heard yet. Currently this is one of the best sounding IEM that I have, only that it's very expensive (like a CIEM). I liked the presentation more than my JH16s, which has almost the same price here, and admittedly my favorite SM3. It's such a jewel.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





bhima said:


> As always, great review Joker. I enjoy reading all of your reviews. I also liked your comparisons... I love how you have such a high regard for the RE-262 that you'd compare it to this IEM costing 10x as much haha. Now, how about going back to reviewing IEMs not priced in the stratosphere  so as to increase our hunger to purchase more IEMS?


 
   
  I'm all out of super high end stuff until I get around to trying the Ultrasone IQ. 
   
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> It's great reading balanced yet affirmative reviews sans a fanboy hype.


 
   
   
  I just haven't been able to find a brand to hype. All the good ones are taken


----------



## goodvibes

LOL


----------



## AznInvasion138

Hey Joker, thanks for the recommendations before ended up getting the RE262 for my brother. Now I'm looking for some good IEMs for the gym since my MEElectronics M9 got messed up at the gym the other day. Trying to stay under $100, something with great isolation and comfort as well as good fun sound quality with great bass. Looking at the JVC FX40, JVC FX101, Soundmagic E10, Brainwaves M5, Atrio MG7. Any others I should be looking at? Thanks!


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Trying to stay under $100, something with great isolation and comfort as well as good fun sound quality with great bass. Looking at the JVC FX40, JVC FX101, Soundmagic E10, Brainwaves M5, Atrio MG7. Any others I should be looking at? Thanks!


 
   
  My 2 cents: I am trying out the TDK MT300, and although it's still early in the evaluation, I must say that I am a bit blown away by how good they are.
  http://www.tdkperformance.com/en-au/Headphones/EB900-In-Ear-Headphones/MT-300/
   
  It looks like you can get them for about $25.Here's a thread discussing them:
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/640889/surprise-tdk-mt-300-4-97-of-awesome-for-canadians


----------



## AznInvasion138

Quote: 





waynes world said:


> My 2 cents: I am trying out the TDK MT300, and although it's still early in the evaluation, I must say that I am a bit blown away by how good they are.
> http://www.tdkperformance.com/en-au/Headphones/EB900-In-Ear-Headphones/MT-300/
> 
> It looks like you can get them for about $25.Here's a thread discussing them:
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/640889/surprise-tdk-mt-300-4-97-of-awesome-for-canadians


 
   
  Thanks for the recommendation waynenumm, how are the build quality and sound isolation on these things. I sweat a good amount so hopefully they are built pretty well haha.


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Thanks for the recommendation waynenumm, how are the build quality and sound isolation on these things. I sweat a good amount so hopefully they are built pretty well haha.


 
   
  The cable is fairly thin, so that might be the first thing to go, but the rest of them seem quite well built. As far as isolation is concerned, I am using the medium sized mh1c tips and the combo isolates quite well. It seems that finding better tips than the stock tips helps a lot for SQ as well. I used them at the gym yesterday and they worked great - just enjoyed the tunes without getting distracted by the gym noise. The amount of bass these things have also helps.


----------



## IsOlAtIOn

Hi guys,
   
  Since I'm totally new in the IEM-universe, I looked for and found a great deal of basic information on head-fi. Moreover, Jokers multi-review is a great start when one has no idea where to look for great value for money.
   
  I'm planning to buy a first decent IEM to use with my Sandisk Sansa Clip Zip, with a pricetag of max. 50-60€.
  At first, I selected the Astrotec AM-90 and the Vsonic GR06 (which I can find for about 50€), but then my brother found a bargain UE700 (61€).
   
  So now I'm wondering what I should do... My bro (who owns a shure535 and some other IEM's and knows his stuff) says I have to go for the UE700, but I have some questions about it:
   
  - It seems to be the 'UE' version, and not the newer 'Logitech' version, the latter being generally considered the better one (less sibilance in the highs, better cable?), so it seems. Is the 'old UE-version' worth the purchase?
  - I also wonder whether the GR06 hasn't a more forgiving sound signature than the UE700, considering it is my 1st IEM... On the one hand, I think I can learn to appreciate the level of detail the UE delivers, but on the other hand, the sound signature can't be too fatiguing, since this will be my main IEM for everyday use...
  - Which one do you guys consider as the most polyvalent IEM, meaning: which of these IEM's can handle the most different music styles (since I listen to everything from metal over pop, dance, trance, jazz, classical music,..)?
   - I'm thinking 'bout bying one for my GF too, and she likes a bit of bass and good vocals (not a real basshead, but it has to be there). Maybe the GR06 for her then (allthough it doesn't look very feminin in my opinion)?
   
  Thanks for your opinion!
   
  IsO


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Don't forget cheapies like the mh1c and the Vsonic GR04. Not sure why the Gr06 gets so much press. They've still got the RE0 at $50. There's honestly so many option out there, while the UE700 is hovering around $100 there's the Rockit R-50 (check review here) or the B2. Many options ! happy hunting


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





azninvasion138 said:


> Hey Joker, thanks for the recommendations before ended up getting the RE262 for my brother. Now I'm looking for some good IEMs for the gym since my MEElectronics M9 got messed up at the gym the other day. Trying to stay under $100, something with great isolation and comfort as well as good fun sound quality with great bass. Looking at the JVC FX40, JVC FX101, Soundmagic E10, Brainwaves M5, Atrio MG7. Any others I should be looking at? Thanks!


 
   
  Most earphones aren't really designed to handle gym use, aside from sports ones obviously. I don't know if I would risk something in the $100 range. In any case, there are several dozen good bass-heavy IEMs under $100. Really depends on just how much bass you want. The FX101 and Philips SHE3580 are good disposable sets (<$20) so you could replace them easily if the sweat kills them. The FX101 is very bassy, pretty bloated, and a little harsh. The SHE3580 is smoother and less colored-sounding. 
   
  Quote: 





isolation said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> Since I'm totally new in the IEM-universe, I looked for and found a great deal of basic information on head-fi. Moreover, Jokers multi-review is a great start when one has no idea where to look for great value for money.
> 
> ...


 

 I found the old UE700 a bit too bright and sibilant but overall it's a pretty good earphone - a step up over the GR06 and AM-90. It should be a good all-rounder assuming you don't need enhanced bass. The AM-90 is much smoother and more forgiving but it'll also sound a lot less clear compared to the UE700. 
   
  The GR06 is quite a bit bassier - getting both that and the UE700 would be a good idea, to sample the differences.


----------



## engelhaft

Hi joker your thread is awesome I have bought the ex1000 based on your review and I was very happy with them until they got in the washing machine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  I loved the clarity and the soundstage but I would like a bit more bass (without interfering too much with the mids) keeping the soundstage and the clarity of the EX1000, soundstage and clarity are my priority I could live with the same bass of the EX1000 which IEM would you suggest?
   
  Thanks a lot, you are doing an excellent job on this


----------



## christobit

Hi Joker,
   
  I own both Fisher Audio DBA-O2 mk2 and PFE 121.  I use them both with a JDS Labs O2 amp.  Source is Ipod Classic.  Material is mostly mp3 320 and above, and ALAC.
   
  The DBA amazes with slightly better all round speed, and fast accurate bass.  It sounds aggressive - both mids and treble.  The PFE (with grey filters) is silky smooth in mids and treble, and its base a hair slower than the DBA.  I like the more analytical and aggressive sound of the DBA.
   
  However, I am bothered by sibilance in the DBA which is completely absent in the PFE.  I have tried multiple tips (comply foam were surpsisingly not good at all).  Maybe it is due to some poorly mastered stuff which it doesn't tolerate, but it is quite bothersome, I need to use the EQ to tone it down.
   
  The question is, would a RE-272 be a better option for my prefered sound signature ( paired with the O2 amp)?  I don't plan to move to a semi or fully balanced amp anytime soon.
   
  Many thanks


----------



## Sylaw

Dude if u dnt mind? why dont u do a review on Sennheiser IE80 's and IE800s....


----------



## IsOlAtIOn

Without any doubt a noob question, but can you filter a bit of that sibilance out using rockbox?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





sylaw said:


> Dude if u dnt mind? why dont u do a review on Sennheiser IE80 's and IE800s....


 
   
  I think ljokerl is looking forward to review the IE800s and considering the IE8 and IE80 have the same drivers and similar build, I wouldn't think he would go the extra mile to do it. Don't get me wrong, I love my IE80s, but I just don't think it would be worth paying an extra $450 to review, and his current loan list is full.
   
  Also, ljokerl, could you rate the Miracles on a scale of 10 for sound signature, 1 being flat, 5 being neutral/balanced, 10 being fun?


----------



## jrcarboleda

Joker, after 6 weeks.. I finally got my Vsonic GR07 Mkii.. 

Thanks a lot ^^ it really suits me well.. i have the right balance of sound, i can sleep well with it.. It really is comfortable.. I like the fit of the earphones.. Although they don't provide the hard shell case anymore.. The leather pouch with metal clasps that comes with it has a good quality.. I only got 50 hours of listening with it.. I don't believe in burn-in hence I think this will sound much like as it is today until it last.. I also find this extremely durable and of course coupled with proper handling.. 

I use them on everything.. It doesn't need much power to be driven right? Although is there any way to enhance how this sounds? Like amps? Dacs? I'm just wild guessing so please bare with me.. By the way thanks again for recommending me these pairs..


----------



## jrcarboleda

Joker, after 6 weeks.. I finally got my Vsonic GR07 Mkii.. 

Thanks a lot ^^ it really suits me well.. i have the right balance of sound, i can sleep well with it.. It really is comfortable.. I like the fit of the earphones.. Although they don't provide the hard shell case anymore.. The leather pouch with metal clasps that comes with it has a good quality.. I only got 50 hours of listening with it.. I don't believe in burn-in hence I think this will sound much like as it is today until it last.. I also find this extremely durable and of course coupled with proper handling.. 

I use them on everything.. It doesn't need much power to be driven right? Although is there any way to enhance how this sounds? Like amps? Dacs? I'm just wild guessing so please bare with me.. By the way thanks again for recommending me these pairs..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





engelhaft said:


> Hi joker your thread is awesome I have bought the ex1000 based on your review and I was very happy with them until they got in the washing machine
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I don't think I've heard anything that sounds exactly like the EX1000 with more bass. The EX1000 has a very wide and open sound to it that most other in-ears can't really match. Maybe the FX700 if you are willing to give up a little of the soundstage and clarity. You could go the cheap way and try an EX600 or MDR-7550 equalized to your preferences. 
   
  Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I own both Fisher Audio DBA-O2 mk2 and PFE 121.  I use them both with a JDS Labs O2 amp.  Source is Ipod Classic.  Material is mostly mp3 320 and above, and ALAC.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The RE272 has very smooth treble, you won't get any sibilance with it. I prefer its midrange and treble to that of the DBA-02. Bass is kind of a wash, depending on what you prefer. Not sure how it pairs with the O2 but I'm sure someone has tried that combination. 
   
  Quote: 





sylaw said:


> Dude if u dnt mind? why dont u do a review on Sennheiser IE80 's and IE800s....


 
   
  I didn't have all that much interest in the IE80. The IE800 review might still happen in the future but I'm not certain at this point.
   
  Quote: 





isolation said:


> Without any doubt a noob question, but can you filter a bit of that sibilance out using rockbox?


 
   
  Depending on the cause of the sibilance it may be more or less effective but EQ should generally work. In my experience sibilance typically centers around 6k but peaks anywhere from 4k to 10k can result in bouts of it. Not sure how much play the rockbox EQ gives you these days.
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I think ljokerl is looking forward to review the IE800s and considering the IE8 and IE80 have the same drivers and similar build, I wouldn't think he would go the extra mile to do it. Don't get me wrong, I love my IE80s, but I just don't think it would be worth paying an extra $450 to review, and his current loan list is full.
> 
> Also, ljokerl, could you rate the Miracles on a scale of 10 for sound signature, 1 being flat, 5 being neutral/balanced, 10 being fun?


 
   
  I don't think that scale makes sense...
   
  To me the Miracle is very slightly laid back in the midrange but mostly very balanced and accurate. I think there is a hair more deep bass than a truly _flat _earphone (which may still be _flat_ in the sense that it compensates for the ear's deep bass roll-off) but other than that no real deviations from what I would consider a reference sound.
   
  Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Joker, after 6 weeks.. I finally got my Vsonic GR07 Mkii..
> Thanks a lot ^^ it really suits me well.. i have the right balance of sound, i can sleep well with it.. It really is comfortable.. I like the fit of the earphones.. Although they don't provide the hard shell case anymore.. The leather pouch with metal clasps that comes with it has a good quality.. I only got 50 hours of listening with it.. I don't believe in burn-in hence I think this will sound much like as it is today until it last.. I also find this extremely durable and of course coupled with proper handling..
> I use them on everything.. It doesn't need much power to be driven right? Although is there any way to enhance how this sounds? Like amps? Dacs? I'm just wild guessing so please bare with me.. By the way thanks again for recommending me these pairs..


 

 The GR07 is pretty good at sounding consistent across sources... I really doubt you'll get a lot of value out of adding an amp unless it colors the sound and moves the GR07 closer to your preferred signature. Of course it depends on your source - if you're using something subpar like a middle-of-the-road smartphone it's a different story.
   
  That's too bad about the case... pouches are annoying.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Sorry for being a bit confusing about the UM Miracle. Would you consider the Miracle neutral (boring like IERM), balanced (ES5) or fun (JH16). I am looking into the Miracles, but some say they seem to be a bit boring. Would it be more lively sounding compared to the 334 or V3?


----------



## christobit

The RE272 has very smooth treble, you won't get any sibilance with it. I prefer its midrange and treble to that of the DBA-02. Bass is kind of a wash, depending on what you prefer. Not sure how it pairs with the O2 but I'm sure someone has tried that combination.
   
  Thanks for the above Joker - how does the bass compare on both?  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Sorry for being a bit confusing about the UM Miracle. Would you consider the Miracle neutral (boring like IERM), balanced (ES5) or fun (JH16). I am looking into the Miracles, but some say they seem to be a bit boring. Would it be more lively sounding compared to the 334 or V3?


 
   
  Again, the Miracle has a bit more bass and warmth than earphones that you usually see called "analytical" (e.g. the ER4S) but is mostly very balanced and neutral. If you consider that boring, then it will be boring to you. The 334 has stronger bass and more forward mids. It sounds more colored overall. The V3 is the most fun-sounding of the three. It seems to have less concern for accuracy and more for delivering the most visceral and lively musical experience. 
   
  Quote: 





christobit said:


> Thanks for the above Joker - how does the bass compare on both?  Thanks


 

 The DBA-02 is quick and punchy and seems to have more immediate impact. It has a touch more mid-bass while the RE272 is more linear but almost too soft and polite in bass presentation. I guess I shouldn't call it bass-light but it doesn't have the impact that many other in-ears can deliver.


----------



## Krim

Hi all,
   
  Might buy Ety HF5 on the cheap from a friend because he's planning on upgrading. But before I do, what genres suit the HF5 well?


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I own both Fisher Audio DBA-O2 mk2 and PFE 121.  I use them both with a JDS Labs O2 amp.  Source is Ipod Classic.  Material is mostly mp3 320 and above, and ALAC.
> 
> ...


 

 If your definition of accurate is DBA-02 mkII, then you haven't heard accurate bass yet. It has some weird decay, kind of a hash, in midbass. Subbass lacks impact a bit and is mostly heard, but it is quite a bit better than armatures of old. Heck, mkI/B2 has better bass handling with less of a midbass bump, but still not stellar.
   
  If you're bothered about DBA's sibilance (or rather calling it straight, ringing), then RE-ZERO would be probably the best pick, barring that, RE-262 or maybe RE-272 indeed. If you manage to grab RE-ZERO and have a great fit, then you'll hear truly accurate bass. (262 is very slightly worse, 272 is choked) RE262/RE272 might be perhaps too smooth due to dips in 3-4k range.
  The other near hits (GR07, EX1000) have sibilance issues.
   
  The fully balanced thing is a joke with IEMs. You should never need that and the difference is none (via ABX here; tested on FiiO E17) vs a competent unbalanced output amp given a short lead cable.
   
  One issue with Hifimans you might or might not run into is the cable, which for me hardens near the ear pieces - this is a critical flaw, as a brittle cable in this place will break sooner or later.
  I'm looking for another IEM with nice fit and without this issue, dynamic driver - or some hardcore modder who can open and replace the cable with something more respectable, perhaps increasing "cup" damping with better foam (Comply) while doing so.
   
  For me, the best RE fit is with reversed or trimmed small Comply T400. (perhaps small Ts400 would work too, need to order some more soon) The main issue of this fit is that comply cause midbass to elevate slightly.
   
  Have a picture of a high accuracy eq of RE-ZERO with Comply T400 Small reversed, reference 500 Hz:

  RE272 is very similar, but needs a few dB bass boost and more of a boost at 3k. RE-ZERO stays (almost completely) within +/-6 dB 25-16.5k.
  The general signature stays close with silicones with more peaking at the highest end (not good), slightly more mids (not good) and slightly flatter midbass (ok).
  Insertion depth is not critical, but the ear canal must not be stretched stiff.
   
  For comparison, here's one for Brainwavz B2 with Comply P Slim (which is same as DBA-02, very similar to DBA-02 mkII), also reference 500 Hz:

  This peak goes to -36 dB. (-12 dB vs reference.) Insertion depth is critical - shallower insertion exaggerates the peak further and adds weird peak/dip pairs in the highs.
  Medium Comply T100 (such as included) sound very similar with tiny bit worse bass quality. Note that this bass cut is similar to RE272's, slightly less pronounced.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





krim said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Might buy Ety HF5 on the cheap from a friend because he's planning on upgrading. But before I do, what genres suit the HF5 well?


 
   
  The sound of the HF5 is very nicely balanced, with no real faults. As such, there's really no genre it's inherently unsuitable for. The rest would depend on your sound preferences.


----------



## ajoyce

Joker, you must be absolutely tireless. Long-time lurker here in nothing short of total awe for your contributions to Head-Fi.

I'm looking for a new pair of IEMs. Currently own some RE0 but finding them a bit thin and bass-lacking, as well as poorly spaced. Wanting something more well-rounded as I listen to downtempo, classical, jazz, dub/chillstep, house, acoustic, and more. Good soundstage and good separation would be nice - unfortunately, since the RE0, I seem to unfairly associate the term 'analytical' with 'lacking bass', but I don't think I would mind either analytical or slightly-warm as long as the bass was represented better than the HiFiMan.

At the moment I'm leaning towards the R-50, but was eyeing up the GR06 and GR07 before that. Can anyone help with my indecision? I'm having an aneurysm!


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The sound of the HF5 is very nicely balanced, with no real faults. As such, there's really no genre it's inherently unsuitable for. The rest would depend on your sound preferences.


 
  HF5 is the weakest at genres requiring bass impact.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ajoyce said:


> Joker, you must be absolutely tireless. Long-time lurker here in nothing short of total awe for your contributions to Head-Fi.
> I'm looking for a new pair of IEMs. Currently own some RE0 but finding them a bit thin and bass-lacking, as well as poorly spaced. Wanting something more well-rounded as I listen to downtempo, classical, jazz, dub/chillstep, house, acoustic, and more. Good soundstage and good separation would be nice - unfortunately, since the RE0, I seem to unfairly associate the term 'analytical' with 'lacking bass', but I don't think I would mind either analytical or slightly-warm as long as the bass was represented better than the HiFiMan.
> At the moment I'm leaning towards the R-50, but was eyeing up the GR06 and GR07 before that. Can anyone help with my indecision? I'm having an aneurysm!


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I think the GR06 will be disappointing after the RE0 on the clarity front. The R-50 won't have a whole lot more bass overall though it is punchier. Really good all-rounder but perhaps a more drastic change would be better in your case. The GR07 has nice overall bass impact, good depth, and still maintains good clarity. The soundstage is wider compared to the RE0 but not as 3D as some of the higher-end sets. The treble would probably be less impressive than with the RE0 - not nearly as smooth and refined, though still crisp.  
   
   
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> HF5 is the weakest at genres requiring bass impact.


 

 That's one way of putting it. However, just which genres require more bass impact than the HF5 provides will depend on who you ask.


----------



## ipadman

I really do not know how to start this post? I must congratulate Joker on a supreme piece of work,which is mind boggling in it`s scope and incredible in it`s sheer detail
You must just love Audio in a way I can not begin to relate to?
   
I am very new really to the world of real Audio and quite old at 57,I have only ever put a toe in the water when it comes to my personal  Audio History and that was basically a disaster which was a very costly experience!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
Now ill health is getting the better of me,and I am looking at a very compact Audio system based around a _yet to be purchased_* IPAD *I have a lot of high quality 24/96 Music Files and I suppose I will use spotify & Itunes (have never owned anything Apple before)
   
I suppose I will require a goood  *DAC/AMP* from* IPad* to* Head/Ear* phones;& if I can afford it a pair of Nice speakers?But I have not forgot that this superb thread is about earphones
and my question relates to two makes in particular :-
   
*MEELECTONICS A161P *
*ATOMIC FLOYDseveral Models stand out)*
   
For some reason I started my quest looking for suitable ear/head phones and these two makes seemed to stand out + one or two of the *KLIPSCH *I am looking at maybe *BLUETOOTH? *but I do not wish to compromise sound quality because I may use Earphones for Skype e.t.c.I could probably get two seperate sets to cover all eventualities..
   
I listen to Led Zep/Pink Floyd and similar
   
Jusy wondered if you could give me some feedback on the above,it would certainly help me greatly
   
Best wishes & a Very~Happy~Christmas!
   
Steve


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ipadman said:


> I really do not know how to start this post? I must congratulate Joker on a supreme piece of work,which is mind boggling in it`s scope and incredible in it`s sheer detail
> You must just love Audio in a way I can not begin to relate to?
> 
> I am very new really to the world of real Audio and quite old at 57,I have only ever put a toe in the water when it comes to my personal  Audio History and that was basically a disaster which was a very costly experience!
> ...


 

 I've never heard an Atmoic Floyd product so I can't provide any feedback on how they compare to the A161P. The A161P sounds good with rock as long as your own preferences for sound lean towards _accurate_. There's no point in buying an amp for the A161P - efficiency is one of its strong suits and if you're willing to put down another $100 for a decent amp you may as well forget that and get a higher-end earphone instead. If you're buying a high-end DAC for the iPad to hook up to a higher-end speaker amp, that's a different story. Also, the A161P does have a mic for Skype, etc. If you need wireless, a second set is probably best. I don't have much experience with bluetooth sets but mine (a Sennheiser MM450) doesn't sound anywhere near as good as some similarly-priced wired sets. I am sure there is a lot of variation with bluetooth sets just as there is with wired ones and some of them are probably great.


----------



## ipadman

Hello
Really good of you to reply I know it was not exactly in tune with your superb thread but I really do need a lot of help to avoid the pitfalls of past mistakes!
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I only came across ATOMIC FLOYD a British company,I think both your good self and fellow members maybe interested in them they are very different,hope I am allowed to link to there web site?http://www.atomicfloyd.com/
   
I am not at all sure what the IPAD 4 is capable of music wise and just what I should add to make it rock?
   
   
   
Quote:


> Also, the A161P does have a mic for Skype, etc. If you need wireless, a second set is probably best. I don't have much experience with bluetooth sets but mine (a Sennheiser MM450) doesn't sound anywhere near as good as some similarly-priced wired sets. I am sure there is a lot of variation with bluetooth sets just as there is with wired ones and some of them are probably great.


 
I agree keep the two sets of Phones seperate is probably best,I am really open to any and all suggestions re- headphones and could even consider full size Phones to? but some of the *SHURE`s.WESTONES* e.t.c. sound(read superb!)
   
   
   
Quote:


> The A161P sounds good with rock as long as your own preferences for sound lean towards _accurate_. There's no point in buying an amp for the A161P - efficiency is one of its strong suits and if you're willing to put down another $100 for a decent amp you may as well forget that and get a higher-end earphone instead. If you're buying a high-end DAC for the iPad to hook up to a higher-end speaker amp, that's a different story.


 
Very Good Advice most sensible,Not sure what to do about the higher end DAC & Higher End speaker amp? will take feedback and further suggestions on this,but the IPAD will be my only music source and I would like to get the best out of it I can musically,as I am sure you can understand.I have just started looking at some of these wired and bluetooth speakers like the well reviewed The Jawbone Jambox Range Speakers.
   
anyway once again many thanks
   
  [size=18.399999618530273px]best wishes Steve[/size]


----------



## Impulse

Bluetooth's kind of got an artificial ceiling to a certain extent, by the very nature of how audio's compressed and streamed... It's often not worth investing a lot on Bluetooth-only headphones IMO. You could get the A161P and use them straight off the iPad when convenient or when you was want to get the best of them and your audio, and then pair them with a clip-on BT receiver like the Sony MW600 when you wanna go wireless. 

There's a thread or two on Head Fi discussing the MW600, the newer MW1, and other similar receivers from Samsung.


----------



## ipadman

Hello & A Very Merry Christmas!
I really appreciate your reply and the very good advice.you are not the first person who as suggested this route to me.
   
Quote:


> or could get the A161P and use them straight off the iPad when convenient or when you was want to get the best of them and your audio,


 
   
Can they be wired directly in to the ipad not just via Bluetooth?
   
   
   
Quote:


> and then pair them with a clip-on BT receiver like the Sony MW600 when you wanna go wireless


 
I must admit to knowing very little about how all this technology works but I will eventually get there?so if I understand your above comment I use the A161Ps wired to ipad direct for top audio (or of course an alternative?) I am open to any and all suggestions.
   
How does the above BT receiver like Sony MW600 work?? please.
   
once again many thanks
regards Steve


----------



## ozkan

Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I own both Fisher Audio DBA-O2 mk2 and PFE 121.  I use them both with a JDS Labs O2 amp.  Source is Ipod Classic.  Material is mostly mp3 320 and above, and ALAC.
> 
> ...


 
  Etymotic triple flanges or shure grey flex tips may help to reduce/overcome your sibilance issues. My friend have bought a R-50 last week  and it was quite sibilant with original tips but when he changed to etymotic triple flanges, the sibilance was all gone. Another good option is to buy shure grey flex tips (PA758/EA410). They all tune down the treble region significantly.


----------



## Impulse

ipadman said:


> Hello & A Very Merry Christmas!
> I really appreciate your reply and the very good advice.you are not the first person who as suggested this route to me.
> 
> 
> ...




Yeah the A161 would work best just connected to the iPad, but you can use them wirelessly by hooking them up to a BT dongle like the MW600 and then connecting the IPad thru Bluetooth to the MW600.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ipadman said:


> Hello
> Really good of you to reply I know it was not exactly in tune with your superb thread but I really do need a lot of help to avoid the pitfalls of past mistakes!
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Definitely heard of the company, just haven't tried their products.  
   
   
  Quote: 





ipadman said:


> I am not at all sure what the IPAD 4 is capable of music wise and just what I should add to make it rock?


 
   
  There's nothing worth adding for a $100 IEM. The iPad has decent audio hardware already and a cheap amp is just as likely to do nothing at all for you.
   
  Quote: 





ipadman said:


> Very Good Advice most sensible,Not sure what to do about the higher end DAC & Higher End speaker amp? will take feedback and further suggestions on this,but the IPAD will be my only music source and I would like to get the best out of it I can musically,as I am sure you can understand.I have just started looking at some of these wired and bluetooth speakers like the well reviewed The Jawbone Jambox Range Speakers.


 
   
   
  You won't need anything extra to run a bluetooth speaker off an iPad but I've tried the Jambox and a lot of the other 1-piece bluetooth speakers and none of them sound as good as a decent entry-level ($200 or so) wired set. Of course the bluetooth ones have a size and weight advantage, are wireless, and are usually battery powered so it's not a fair fight, but on sound there is no comparison to a decent set of full-size or even compact desktop speakers. My current speaker setup ran me around $120 not including my mid-90s Sony CD player/100W receiver stack (probably worth very little today): <$20 for a very simple optical D/A converter and $100 for a pair of lightly used JBL 3-way floorstanders. It's decidedly Lo-Fi by speaker standards but it's leagues better than any set of wireless or store-bought 2.0/2.1 PC speakers I've ever heard. 
   
   
  Quote: 





impulse said:


> Bluetooth's kind of got an artificial ceiling to a certain extent, by the very nature of how audio's compressed and streamed... It's often not worth investing a lot on Bluetooth-only headphones IMO. You could get the A161P and use them straight off the iPad when convenient or when you was want to get the best of them and your audio, and then pair them with a clip-on BT receiver like the Sony MW600 when you wanna go wireless.
> There's a thread or two on Head Fi discussing the MW600, the newer MW1, and other similar receivers from Samsung.


 

 I am curious about the limit of APT-X with some of the more high-end BT sets. A lot of the older BT sets I've tried were truly horrific but I've heard a few in the past year that weren't too bad all. It would be interesting to see what can be done with APT-X and a pair of well-designed BT headphones with a decent onboard dac/amp.
   
   
  The receiver is a good idea, though the benefit is limited because you're still stuck with the entire length of A161P cord.


----------



## ipadman

Hello Again joker
   
I really must thank you for a really superb set of answers and all are top class and very sensible propositions for me and others.I have always wondered about wireless speakers & Bluetooth even though I know little about the technology or if it works or not(generally) I basically parrot what I have read as I have little personal experience of Audio!
   
I am very sure wired speakers is the way to go really,you just confirmed this for me,I did own the Audio engine A5s and believe it or not I really did not like them
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




unlike most folk.
Not sure which speakers to look at as an alternative? No matter onwards to Earphones/Headphones
   
   
  
  
   


> There's nothing worth adding for a $100 IEM. The iPad has decent audio hardware already and a cheap amp is just as likely to do nothing at all for you


 
Excuse my slowness at times Joker,so a good pair of IEM $100 upwards is maybe best over adding a DAC/AMP?in which case I need to put togetgher a short list of maybe 5 or so really good Earphones and just for comparison a top 5 full size headphones which I suspect may require an Head amp~Am i correct?? striking the right balance cost wise as I suppose spending $250 upwards on phones for IPAD maybe overkill?some more advice welcome please.
   
I am like a kid in a candy/sweet shop!
   
very best wishes
and many,many thanks Steve


----------



## pokpokgei

can threadstarter please do a review for panasonic HJE450-K?
   
  thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ipadman said:


> Excuse my slowness at times Joker,so a good pair of IEM $100 upwards is maybe best over adding a DAC/AMP?in which case I need to put togetgher a short list of maybe 5 or so really good Earphones and just for comparison a top 5 full size headphones which I suspect may require an Head amp~Am i correct?? striking the right balance cost wise as I suppose spending $250 upwards on phones for IPAD maybe overkill?some more advice welcome please.


 
   
  It's a generalization but yes, many full-size headphones will benefit from an amp more than most IEMs. As for the iPad, it's a solid multi-function device. I'm not an Apple user but I do love my tablet. If you need something just for music you can probably find a portable player that sounds better for less but it would be a different type of experience entirely.  
   
  Quote: 





pokpokgei said:


> can threadstarter please do a review for panasonic HJE450-K?
> 
> thanks.


 

 Sorry, don't have one at this time.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





pokpokgei said:


> can threadstarter please do a review for panasonic HJE450-K?
> 
> thanks.


 
  here's Clieos'
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/545188/review-panasonic-rp-hje450


----------



## ipadman

Hello Joker
Once again many thanks for your most helpful answers ,really means a lot to me.I just have to put together a short list of say *6= 3 Earphones & 3 x Full size???*
Really wish you and your family a very merry Christmas
   
best Wishes Steve


----------



## Ryan1411

Hey guys, I'm looking for a new IEM. Trying to find the right one is overwhelming with all the info out there but I'm still doing my research. Just want to maybe get a quick opinion for my needs:
  
  -Less than $200 ($230 tops)
  -Listen to mostly electronic (a lot of energetic house/dance type stuff, trance, dubstep etc). Some rap/hip-hop, rock and pop.
  -I want it to be one that is easily powered. So no amp required. (Preferably using a Sansa Clip.)
   
   
  Thanks.
   
   
  Edit: Oh and I was looking at the Dba-02 mkII and saw that it had great sound quality at a great price. Then I researched it and saw that it probably wouldn't be most suitable for electronic. I guess I'm just really interested in great sound quality, but have very little experience with IEMs and wouldn't know if less sound quality, but with a more fun sound is what I'm really looking for. Would you say I should avoid Dba-02 mkII?


----------



## Selenium

UE700? Same TWFK that you've scored 9+ for a few earphones. If that's the case as well with the UE700 that would mean you score them higher sonically than the TF10.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ryan1411 said:


> Hey guys, I'm looking for a new IEM. Trying to find the right one is overwhelming with all the info out there but I'm still doing my research. Just want to maybe get a quick opinion for my needs:
> 
> -Less than $200 ($230 tops)
> -Listen to mostly electronic (a lot of energetic house/dance type stuff, trance, dubstep etc). Some rap/hip-hop, rock and pop.
> ...


 
   
  You'd probably want something with enhanced bass - the EPH-100 and JVC FXT90 are good entry-level choices. Very efficient, less than $150 in cost, fun-sounding. 
   
  Quote: 





selenium said:


> UE700? Same TWFK that you've scored 9+ for a few earphones. If that's the case as well with the UE700 that would mean you score them higher sonically than the TF10.


 

 Actually the original UE700 reminded me most of the tuning of the Phiaton PS200 (also TWFK), which didn't do so hot. The logitech version is a little better, though.


----------



## ipadman

> Multi-IEM Review - 267 IEMs compared (FitEar To Go! 334 added 12/16/12)
> 
> 
> Selenium replied to this thread on December 23, 8:29 pm
> ...


 
Can you please explain what the above comment meant?and more to the point why?


----------



## pokpokgei

Quote: 





pokpokgei said:


> can threadstarter please do a review for panasonic HJE450-K?
> 
> thanks.


 
   


zelda said:


> here's Clieos'
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/545188/review-panasonic-rp-hje450


 


   
  i've seen clieOS's review but i suspect the HJE450-K is a super underrated earphone i wish for another expert to review it and post honest opinions that are unaffected by it's price category 

 i've seen ranking elsewhere on the web that ranks the HJE450 higher than HJE900 in terms of overall performance (higher being better) so i just want to know better. 

_perhaps if possible, can the threadstarter review the *JBL J33i* or *J33, *they look promising at $80 with that built-in bend before the wires enter the driver to reduce microphonics._


----------



## sprucemaple

Hello all, I'm helping a friend look for a new pair of IEMs after his CX500s gave out. 
   
  Budget would be about $300USD, to be used with an iPhone 5 or iPod Classic, without an amp. 
  Listens to Dream Theater, but also some Celine Dion. 
   
  Preferably a durable pair to be worn over-ear, with decent noise isolation. 
  Looking for a pair with a good deal of warmth and solid bass. 
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sprucemaple said:


> Hello all, I'm helping a friend look for a new pair of IEMs after his CX500s gave out.
> 
> Budget would be about $300USD, to be used with an iPhone 5 or iPod Classic, without an amp.
> Listens to Dream Theater, but also some Celine Dion.
> ...


 

 Yamaha EPH-100, Earsonics SM2v2, maybe Dunu Tai Chi if you're willing to give up some sound quality for better construction.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





sprucemaple said:


> Hello all, I'm helping a friend look for a new pair of IEMs after his CX500s gave out.
> 
> Budget would be about $300USD, to be used with an iPhone 5 or iPod Classic, without an amp.
> Listens to Dream Theater, but also some Celine Dion.
> ...


 

 image x10i , priced around $240 .


----------



## Selenium

ipadman said:


> Can you please explain what the above comment meant?and more to the point why?:confused_face(1):




I was being a jerk. Sorry.

Thanks Joker, I've been thinking of getting a TWFK for ages now. First the DBA-02 but these days I'm leaning towards the R-50.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> image x10i , priced around $240 .


 

 Good pick in general for the requirements but not very durable IMO


----------



## sprucemaple

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yamaha EPH-100, Earsonics SM2v2, maybe Dunu Tai Chi if you're willing to give up some sound quality for better construction.


 
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> image x10i , priced around $240 .


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good pick in general for the requirements but not very durable IMO


 
   
  Thanks for the suggestions! However, the housings of the Yamaha don't look very comfortable.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sprucemaple said:


> Thanks for the suggestions! However, the housings of the Yamaha don't look very comfortable.


 

 That's what I thought but they are more comfortable than they look and isolate better than almost all other dynamics. Regardless, there are other options.


----------



## Mini0510

Hi, joker, I just bought PFE 232 on eBay.
  It hasn't been shipped yet.
  But how does the sound signature with grey filter compare with K3003 with reference filter?
  and how does the sound signature with black filter compare with K3003 treble boost filter?
  and I hope PFE 232 is punchy on the base drums. Had Sony EX300, thought the punch is a bit light compared to copper.
   
  I didn't buy the K3003 (yet) since i'm not sure if I'm willing to spend that much. If PFE 232 sounds similar to K3003, I think I'll just stick with PFE 232 for now.
  Thanks


----------



## ipadman

Good Evening [size=18.399999618530273px]Selenium from a very snowy Norway![/size]
I really appreciate your apology and i accept it with no hard feelings,I am sorry if my posts annoyed you a little.I am not very good on Forums as I think I pointed out in my very first thread/Intro page,But I am honest and always grateful for help and advcie from folk far more expert than I
   
Wishing you and your family a very merry Christmas!
Cheers Steve


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Hi, joker, I just bought PFE 232 on eBay.
> It hasn't been shipped yet.
> But how does the sound signature with grey filter compare with K3003 with reference filter?
> and how does the sound signature with black filter compare with K3003 treble boost filter?
> ...


 
   
   
  I think you're better off trying the PFE 232 and figuring out which filter you like best first. I think you've got your filters backwards, too - the gray one is the one you'd probably want to compare to the K3003's treble+ setting. In any case the black filters really don't keep up with the K3003 - they sound consistently veiled in comparison and still have less bass impact and hotter treble.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good pick in general for the requirements but not very durable IMO


 

       yamaha is good . sadly i havent got my hands on them .


----------



## 177261

Regarding the UE900 *(1C19) *how are they compared to the Shure SE535's?


----------



## 177261

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Bluetooth's kind of got an artificial ceiling to a certain extent, by the very nature of how audio's compressed and streamed... It's often not worth investing a lot on Bluetooth-only headphones IMO. You could get the A161P and use them straight off the iPad when convenient or when you was want to get the best of them and your audio, and then pair them with a clip-on BT receiver like the Sony MW600 when you wanna go wireless.
> There's a thread or two on Head Fi discussing the MW600, the newer MW1, and other similar receivers from Samsung.


 
   
  Could you link it?
   
  Thanks!
   
   
  Also are the JH7 Pro gonna be reviewed? I want to see them compared to the 1964-V3.


----------



## Moby1

Hey guys, Which earphones for the best out of ear headphone type sound?


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Hey guys, Which earphones for the best out of ear headphone type sound?


 

 In my experience, the following are the best:
  Sennheiser IE8
  Hifiman RE-ZERO
  Etymotic ER4S


----------



## engelhaft

I think Sony MDR-EX1000 is one of the biggest soundstage IEMS I have heard but my experience is limited 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





,  with the appropiate music the soundstage is considerably bigger than the ATH-M50
   
  The sound of the EX1000 is kind of bright  with very well controlled bass
   
  In words of |joker|
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think I've heard anything that sounds exactly like the EX1000 with more bass. The EX1000 has a very wide and open sound to it that most other in-ears can't really match. Maybe the FX700 if you are willing to give up a little of the soundstage and clarity. You could go the cheap way and try an EX600 or MDR-7550 equalized to your preferences.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





christianh said:


> Regarding the UE900 *(1C19) *how are they compared to the Shure SE535's?


 
   
  Not that different overall. I think the UEs have a hair more bass and remain better textured and more natural-sounding down in the subbass region. However, the Shures are more even across the entire midrange whereas the UE900 dips down in the upper mids. Treble presence and extension is better with the UE900 and it sounds a bit more spacious and airy overall. 
   
  Quote: 





christianh said:


> Also are the JH7 Pro gonna be reviewed? I want to see them compared to the 1964-V3.


 
   
  No plans to review the 7
   
  Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Hey guys, Which earphones for the best out of ear headphone type sound?


 
   
  Definitely the Sony EX1000, EX600, and MDR-7550. The Sennheiser IE8 is up there as well, along with a few of my customs.


----------



## lilboozy

Joker how come you say the monster lil jamz are bright sounding when this graph suggests otherwise (er4s for reference)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Joker how come you say the monster lil jamz are bright sounding when this graph suggests otherwise (er4s for reference)


 
   
  I don't review graphs. If you want to listen the Lil Jamz and tell me they sound smooth and lack treble presence, I'd maybe feel the need to explain myself.


----------



## Inks

Monster likely has batch differences and you also have to account that perhaps that's a response from the reference plane which can't be achieved  due to the housing.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Joker how come you say the monster lil jamz are bright sounding when this graph suggests otherwise (er4s for reference)


 

 graphs dont speak the whole truth . they lie most of the time .


----------



## Inks

Lol...then I guess the data is made out of thin air. There are small details which would explain such things. At this rate I hope this thread just moves on.


----------



## Moby1

ljokerl said:


> Definitely the Sony EX1000, EX600, and MDR-7550. The Sennheiser IE8 is up there as well, along with a few of my customs.





engelhaft said:


> I think Sony MDR-EX1000 is one of the biggest soundstage IEMS I have heard but my experience is limited :bigsmile_face: ,  with the appropiate music the soundstage is considerably bigger than the ATH-M50
> 
> The sound of the EX1000 is kind of bright  with very well controlled bass
> 
> In words of |joker|





astralstorm said:


> In my experience, the following are the best:
> Sennheiser IE8
> Hifiman RE-ZERO
> Etymotic ER4S




Thanks guys, appreciate the help.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think you're better off trying the PFE 232 and figuring out which filter you like best first. I think you've got your filters backwards, too - the gray one is the one you'd probably want to compare to the K3003's treble+ setting. In any case the black filters really don't keep up with the K3003 - they sound consistently veiled in comparison and still have less bass impact and hotter treble.


 
   
  Ok. I'm currently using FX700 EQing with treble boost with +2dB 4kHz, +5dB 8kHz and 16kHz. Without EQ, it's sounds a bit muffled. I can imagine it people would like this kind of signature when they listen to rock but that's not how I like it though. I want more treble. 
  I thought the black filter of PFE 232 boost treble and bass while lessens midrange a bit?
  So PFE 232 has more treble than K3003 with High Boost filter right?
  I'll listen the bass myself once I get it. I'm pretty sure it's my first BA earphone.


----------



## ajoyce

ljokerl said:


> Thanks
> 
> I think the GR06 will be disappointing after the RE0 on the clarity front. The R-50 won't have a whole lot more bass overall though it is punchier. Really good all-rounder but perhaps a more drastic change would be better in your case. The GR07 has nice overall bass impact, good depth, and still maintains good clarity. The soundstage is wider compared to the RE0 but not as 3D as some of the higher-end sets. The treble would probably be less impressive than with the RE0 - not nearly as smooth and refined, though still crisp.




Thanks for your help Joker. I've just checked the uk suppliers and I can get the Fischer DBA-02 mkii for the same price as the GR07. Should I go for that instead?


----------



## AstralStorm

DBA-02 mkII is quite risky. My experience with these TWFKs was quite negative - for the price they're great, just not what I was looking for at all. Mostly due to that 4.5k ringing.
  GR07 is a far safer choice with some 6k ringing, much less noticeable to my ear than TWFK's.


----------



## hh3808

Hey ljokerl, I had some questions about the um3x, but first let me say thanks for making a great review thread.  
   
  My question is would someone who disliked the mids on the w3 and image x10's also dislike the mids on the um3x?
  Not quite sure what it is maybe they were to thick/warm sounding.  I'm currently using ba200's and mtpg's and like the mids
  on these, especially the ba200. But they also have warm mids so I can't really place what I dislike about the w3/x10.
   
  I am sending back my w3's and need to choose something else and from reviews it seems that the um3x is possibly
  a good upgrade from the ba200, but I was worried the mids would be similar to the w3 or x10 in tone.  So should should I
  get the um3x or should I look at something else (shure or phonak)?
   
  Thanks


----------



## nuke70

hello head-fi masters I'm a newbi here
   
  I was going to buy my first ever IEM and im such an idiot in this kind of line.
   
  I was gonna ask what to buy with my budget of 50-150$ also if possible could anyone direct me where audioshop i can avail it.
   
   
  Best Regards,
   
  PS:
  Im from the Philippines.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





nuke70 said:


> hello head-fi masters I'm a newbi here
> 
> I was going to buy my first ever IEM and im such an idiot in this kind of line.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Can you sort of give us a description of the sound your looking for, or what you'll be listening to? I would say the Yamaha EPH-100 would be a good all-rounder, but I only had it for a couple of days before my friend asked for it back.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Monster likely has batch differences and you also have to account that perhaps that's a response from the reference plane which can't be achieved  due to the housing.


 
   
  Could be. I am not bashing measurements at all - with the right compensation I think they can be very useful to those who are able to interpret them properly.  
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Ok. I'm currently using FX700 EQing with treble boost with +2dB 4kHz, +5dB 8kHz and 16kHz. Without EQ, it's sounds a bit muffled. I can imagine it people would like this kind of signature when they listen to rock but that's not how I like it though. I want more treble.
> I thought the black filter of PFE 232 boost treble and bass while lessens midrange a bit?
> So PFE 232 has more treble than K3003 with High Boost filter right?
> I'll listen the bass myself once I get it. I'm pretty sure it's my first BA earphone.


 
   
  The effect of the black filter on treble energy with the PFE232 is pretty mild in my experience. The K3003 has a lot of treble but it's not as hot as that of the 232. 
   
  Quote: 





ajoyce said:


> Thanks for your help Joker. I've just checked the uk suppliers and I can get the Fischer DBA-02 mkii for the same price as the GR07. Should I go for that instead?


 
   
  Maybe but it's only slightly bassier than the R-50 but still doesn't have the deep bass power of the GR07. 
   
   
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> DBA-02 mkII is quite risky. My experience with these TWFKs was quite negative - for the price they're great, just not what I was looking for at all. Mostly due to that 4.5k ringing.
> GR07 is a far safer choice with some 6k ringing, much less noticeable to my ear than TWFK's.


 
   
  This was not my experience with the DBA-02 mkII. I find it to be less bright than some of my other TWFKs (e.g. CK10, UE700, Phiaton PS200, and even stock R-50) and don't think it's fatiguing at reasonable volumes. The GR07 bothers me more. 
   
  The R-50 with added impedance and triple-flange tips and the VSonic GR01 are also contenders for least annoying TWFK treble. 
   
  Quote: 





hh3808 said:


> Hey ljokerl, I had some questions about the um3x, but first let me say thanks for making a great review thread.
> 
> My question is would someone who disliked the mids on the w3 and image x10's also dislike the mids on the um3x?
> Not quite sure what it is maybe they were to thick/warm sounding.  I'm currently using ba200's and mtpg's and like the mids
> ...


 

 If you're worried about the thick/warm-sounding mids I would give the UM3X a pass. However, I didn't find the W3 to be particularly thick-sounding. On second thought, I think the W3 and X10 both lack the fluid presentation of the MTPG, which may be what's bothering you. I haven't tried the BA200 to confirm that that has the same characteristic. If that is indeed the case you may enjoy the Shure SE535 or something like a HiFiMan RE262/RE272 for the clean, liquid mids without heavy bass. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





nuke70 said:


> hello head-fi masters I'm a newbi here
> 
> I was going to buy my first ever IEM and im such an idiot in this kind of line.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Really depends on what you're looking for in terms of sound and other characteristics. Some solid options for a beginner might be the Yamaha EPH-100  JVC FXT90, Shure SE215, HiSoundAudio Crystal, or Dunu Tai Chi. Those are warmer-sounding earphones with slightly enhanced bass and should be beginner-friendly.


----------



## nuke70

my preference music is r&b/pop/acoustic/rap. not really sure though because i just listen to any music that i liked no matter what genre is.
   
  i would like to try that yamaha eph-100 buy i'm having a hard time finding an audio shop locally to buy or test one.
   
  BTW thanks really for the fast reply


----------



## nuke70

oh ok. ill try to look those iem's at our local store. i hope i can find some.


----------



## Jozurr

Hi Joker,
   
  I need some help with this please:
   
  I've had the PL30, Brainwavz M1, KSC-75, Creative Aurvana Live and Brainwavz R1.
   
  Now here's what I feel about them:
   
  PL30: Extremely smooth sounding, really liked the sound of these, but slightly lacking in bass.
   
  M1: Not as smooth as the PL30, but perfect amount of bass. VERY good sounding vocals and saxophone, just the way I'd want them.
   
  KSC-75: Treble seemed too high.. very tiring
   
  Creative aurvana live: Close to the same as M1 except maybe slightly BETTER bass. The vocals might be slightly better on the M1?
   
  Brainwavz R1: Don't like these. They're good with electronic music, but I don't like them at all for anything else. The vocals seem to be coming from another room. Very distant and what not. Not pleasing at all.
   
   
  Now I don't really know HOW to describe the sound signature I like. I've been trying to read up a lot, but I don't know how to describe my preferences. Can you tell me what it exactly is so I look for it when I read reviews? 

 Secondly, considering all the above, what earphones would you recommend under the $60 mark?
   
  Thanks a lot for all the work that you put in. My PL30, M1 and CAL and KSC-75 have all been purchased based on your specific recommendations and I'm happy with them.
   
  Edit: Just to inform you, I've lost both the PL30 and the M1 when I was moving. I was thinking of just getting the M1 again, but then I thought maybe I have some other options. Looking at all the hype about the Sony MH1C maybe I could get those or maybe you can recommend something.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I need some help with this please:
> 
> ...


 
   
  I guess it depends on what, if anything, you'd like to see improved over the M1. The M1 is a re-tuned ViSang model characterized by higher impedance compared to its ViSang equivalents. Well, ViSang has actually released their own 32-ohm earphone now, the VS-K1: http://www.ebay.com/itm/VISANG-VS-K1-Inner-Ear-Silver-Cord-HiFi-Stereo-Audio-Earphones-/380487914079 . It sounds quite good, like an M1 slightly re-tuned in favor of the bass and lower midrange. It's a little thicker-sounding and warmer but it also has slightly better bass depth and a more spacious presentation. If you don't want a warmer-sounding and smoother earphone, you're probably better off just getting another M1 while it's still in production.


----------



## Jozurr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I guess it depends on what, if anything, you'd like to see improved over the M1. The M1 is a re-tuned ViSang model characterized by higher impedance compared to its ViSang equivalents. Well, ViSang has actually released their own 32-ohm earphone now, the VS-K1: http://www.ebay.com/itm/VISANG-VS-K1-Inner-Ear-Silver-Cord-HiFi-Stereo-Audio-Earphones-/380487914079 . It sounds quite good, like an M1 slightly re-tuned in favor of the bass and lower midrange. It's a little thicker-sounding and warmer but it also has slightly better bass depth and a more spacious presentation. If you don't want a warmer-sounding and smoother earphone, you're probably better off just getting another M1 while it's still in production.


 
  Like I said, I can't really explain what sound signature I like. From what I've defined, is it mid forward? I do like some bass as well, so what should I be looking for in a sound signature if I want a mix of M1, PL30 and the CAL?
   
  What I'd like in the M1 is the smoothness. It felt slightly "dry" (if that word is correct). What would be a general upgrade over the M1? I read that the M4s are kind of v/u shaped. How do the M5s fit in this picture? Do you think I should go for the MH1C instead since it costs roughly the same? would it be a logical upgrade over the M1?


----------



## hh3808

Thanks ljokerl for answering my questions and the recommendations.  Hope you have a happy new year!


----------



## rossk26

Hello,
   
  I am after some help and advice on picking some in ear headphones/in ear monitors.
   
  The main use will be with portable devices whilst travelling, and my budget is around £20-30 (yes I'm English)!!
   
  I like all kinds of music genre from Hip Hop, Rock, Pop, Jazz and Folk, so an all rounder would be ideal.  Comfort and sound quality are my priorities.
   
  I have a gift voucher to use at a high street store, and the following brands are available (Fischer Audio, VIBE, Sennheiser, Monster, AKG, Eers, Philips, Skullcandy, Bose, Beats, Bowers & Wilkins, Harmon Kardon, WeSc, Yamaha)
   
  Thank you


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





jozurr said:


> Like I said, I can't really explain what sound signature I like. From what I've defined, is it mid forward? I do like some bass as well, so what should I be looking for in a sound signature if I want a mix of M1, PL30 and the CAL?
> 
> What I'd like in the M1 is the smoothness. It felt slightly "dry" (if that word is correct). What would be a general upgrade over the M1? I read that the M4s are kind of v/u shaped. How do the M5s fit in this picture? _*Do you think I should go for the MH1C*_ instead since it costs roughly the same? would it be a logical upgrade over the M1?


 
  If you could deal with the j cord cable. Some people say a flat cable is bad for wearing over the ear but I don't wear iems over the ear so I wouldn't know. If all that doesn't matter to you than definitely get it.


----------



## nuke70

Hi I'm here again. 
   
  after looking for a yamaha eph-100 and jvc ha-fxt90 locally here in PH it appears its not available here.
   
  Can you direct me to a trusted online store where i can buy a yamaha eph-100 or jvc ha-fxt90.
   
  Many Thanks again!
  Cheers!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jozurr said:


> Like I said, I can't really explain what sound signature I like. From what I've defined, is it mid forward? I do like some bass as well, so what should I be looking for in a sound signature if I want a mix of M1, PL30 and the CAL?
> 
> What I'd like in the M1 is the smoothness. It felt slightly "dry" (if that word is correct). What would be a general upgrade over the M1? I read that the M4s are kind of v/u shaped. How do the M5s fit in this picture? Do you think I should go for the MH1C instead since it costs roughly the same? would it be a logical upgrade over the M1?


 
   
  I've never heard an MH1C or Brainwavz M4. I would not recommend the M5 for you - it would be much too bassy if you are happy with the M1's bass.  I really think you might like the ViSang VS-K1 but I don't know if there are any other reviews of it out there, or how it compares to the MH1C.
   
  Quote: 





hh3808 said:


> Thanks ljokerl for answering my questions and the recommendations.  Hope you have a happy new year!


 
  Hard to believe another year has come and gone 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





rossk26 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am after some help and advice on picking some in ear headphones/in ear monitors.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Some of those brands don't have any products in your price range..
  The Philips SHE3580 might be a good choice - cheap, comfortable, and good-sounding. Sennheiser CX280 is not bad if you're not paying more than $30 for it. The Fischer Audio Paradigm v.3 is the cheapest good Fischer if it's available and in your price range.
   
   
  Quote: 





nuke70 said:


> Hi I'm here again.
> 
> after looking for a yamaha eph-100 and jvc ha-fxt90 locally here in PH it appears its not available here.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Lots of FXT90 Japan imports on eBay, many from trusted sellers. For more specific info you may be better off asking in these earphones' individual discussion/appreciation threads - there are many more owners there.


----------



## Techno Kid

Hey joker is the TG334 worth the $1000 more than the SM3 they cost as far as SQ goes because I know build quality is much better?  From reading your review I'd say no but your the one that's heard both.  I know you get diminishing returns the higher in price you go but that just seems to diminished imo with only a .3 better score on your scale.


----------



## kingice10

Nuke70, I sent you a PM. Im letting go of my Yammies.

The TG334 is technically better but imo only 10% of it on regular usage or regular daps coz it scales better with good gears. You might be surprised if you compare it with W4. W4 also shines well with good gear. The TG334s also advantage is the build quality.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Hey joker is the TG334 worth the $1000 more than the SM3 they cost as far as SQ goes because I know build quality is much better?  From reading your review I'd say no but your the one that's heard both.  I know you get diminishing returns the higher in price you go but that just seems to diminished imo with only a .3 better score on your scale.


 

 That's really not a question I can answer. I do think the MH334 sounds appreciably better than the SM3 and my scale was never meant to be quantitative. It just positions things in a hierarchy as I hear them.
   
  It's kind of a slippery slope to talk about value like that. You could say the same comparing the SM3 to some $120-150 earphones, and also comparing said $120-150 earphones to the RE0 at $49. Eventually you'll get down to something like the Philips SHE3850, which looks to be 70% as good as the MH334 on my scale at 0.7% of the cost. It's a winner on paper, and yet somehow many choose to move past it. Same goes for the SM3 (or W4, PFE232, EX1000, CK10, etc) - it's good value next to the $1000+ monitors, but it doesn't render them irrelevant.


----------



## nuke70

Hi Joker after thorough searching of earphones on the local stores in my area it appears the noticeable earphone i saw was klipsch image and dunu dn-19 tai chi though personally i dont like the look of overhead earphone what can you say between the two? Best Regards,


----------



## rossk26

Quote: 





> Some of those brands don't have any products in your price range..  The Philips SHE3580 might be a good choice - cheap, comfortable, and good-sounding. Sennheiser CX280 is not bad if you're not paying more than $30 for it. The Fischer Audio Paradigm v.3 is the cheapest good Fischer if it's available and in your price range.


 
   
  Thanks for the reply
   
  I have the following to choose from:
   
  - Sennheiser CX200-II Street
  - Sennheiser CX 275s In-Ear Headphones with Microphone, Black
  - Sennheiser CX160 In-Ear Headphones, Black
  - Sennheiser OMX185 Around-Ear Headphones, Black
  - Sennheiser MX375 In-Ear Headphones, Black
  - Sennheiser MX170 In-Ear Headphones, Black
  - Philips SHE8000/10 In-Ear Headphones, Black
  - Philips SHE8000WT In-Ear Headphones, White
  - Philips SHE3590 In-Ear Headphones, White
  - Philips SHQ4200/10 In-Ear Neckband Headphones, Red/Grey
  - Philips SHE3590 In-Ear Headphones, Black
   
  All are less than $30, which would you recommend?
   
  Thanks again for your help


----------



## Techno Kid

Yeah I know your scale isn't meant for that I'm just saying that at least for me I don't know if spending $1300 will justify the price vs SQ compared to the SM3.  I have become a mid junkie along with needing a spacious soundstage and I know the TG334 is excellent at thoughs things so I just don't know and spending that kind of money on an IEM I want to make darn sure its something that will give me a substantial up grade over the SM3 and by most accounts it seems like they would but its hard for me to pull the trigger on them because of the cost.  I'm sure I'll brake down and buy them sometime this coming year because they really seem like a great fit for the kind of sound signature I like but for now I'm extremely happy with the SM3's.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





rossk26 said:


> Thanks for the reply
> 
> I have the following to choose from:
> 
> ...


 

        she 3590 will do good , cheap and up to the mark .


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





kingice10 said:


> Nuke70, I sent you a PM. Im letting go of my Yammies.
> The TG334 is technically better but imo only 10% of it on regular usage or regular daps coz it scales better with good gears. You might be surprised if you compare it with W4. W4 also shines well with good gear. The TG334s also advantage is the build quality.


 
   
  That's something I've been thinking about lately.
  In your opinion, what would be a good gear for the W4? (I have a W4r and I certanly love them, but I would like to get the most out of them)


----------



## soullinker20

Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Yeah I know your scale isn't meant for that I'm just saying that at least for me I don't know if spending $1300 will justify the price vs SQ compared to the SM3.  I have become a mid junkie along with needing a spacious soundstage and I know the TG334 is excellent at thoughs things so I just don't know and spending that kind of money on an IEM I want to make darn sure its something that will give me a substantial up grade over the SM3 and by most accounts it seems like they would but its hard for me to pull the trigger on them because of the cost.  I'm sure I'll brake down and buy them sometime this coming year because they really seem like a great fit for the kind of sound signature I like but for now I'm extremely happy with the SM3's.


 
   
  I own those too. tg334 w/ 000 cables makes $1,700+
   
  and all i can say is the sound is night and day difference for me in terms of soundstage, detail, transparency
   
  the dynamics on these are crazy..
   
  another thing to consider is the 1p2 hybrid by tralucent audio probably at $1,300++ too


----------



## BangOn

Nice thread. Do you plan to add the Philips SHE3580/SHE3590 and the Panasonic RP-HJE355? Thanks.
   
  Btw. which forum engine is this? Not the best.


----------



## kaixax555

Quote: 





bangon said:


> Nice thread. Do you plan to add the Philips SHE3580/SHE3590 and the Panasonic RP-HJE355? Thanks.
> 
> Btw. which forum engine is this? Not the best.


 

 vbulletin
   
  still much better than the free ones IMO


----------



## M i L i P i X

maybe its time to buy new iem again

Fitear togo 334


----------



## ktan3142

Hey Joker, I love your review (inspired me to get the RE-ZERO and RE-262). Can I please ask you to make a direct comparison between the RE-262 and Meelec A161p? I'm loving the mids, highs, and soundstage of the former, but my impressions with its subbass don't match with other people's impressions.
   
  I got the RE-262 for $100 and will be receiving the A161 for $66, and I want to know which is the better value. This way, I don't have to return the 161 as open-box.
   
  Very best.


----------



## AstralStorm

From personal test of RE-ZERO vs Fisher Audio SBA-03 (similar to A161p) at the shop:
  - RE-ZERO is on average flatter, but SBA-03 has a singular large peak.
  - RE-ZERO has quite a bit more bass impact.
  - RE-ZERO has better dynamics, less distortion in bass and mids. Highs are comparable.
  - RE-ZERO is way more responsive to equalization.
  - SBA-03 is faster, like any nice BA. But not a whole lot. It's no TWFK or ER4S.
  - SBA-03 is quite a bit warmer due to more midbass. No bleed.
  - SBA-03 has atypical armature pattern ringing at 1, 3 and 5 kHz, but not huge. Much less than most other armatures.
  - SBA-03 is less extended both ways.
  - Fit is very comparable, but RE-ZERO are shorter.
  - When playing overly loud, RE-ZERO becomes slightly shouty, while SBA-03 becomes way too ringy. (imagine dentist drill)
   
  RE-262 is very similar to RE-ZERO, with some choking on bass and slightly more linear highest end. (It has less bass in general and less bass impact.)
  It is shorter decay everywhere. RE-ZERO instead has some plate-like reverb sound (or bell-like) due to metal case.
   
  To match RE-ZERO and RE-262, you'd need something more expensive in BA world. Perhaps VSonic GR01? (but I haven't heard it yet - it depends on how that TWFK was tuned and tamed)
  Or maybe Phonak PFE121 (heard, would have to AB), PFE232 (haven't heard), ATH CK10 (haven't heard)...


----------



## BangOn

Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> vbulletin
> 
> still much better than the free ones IMO


 
  Not bad, truly. Just the actual settings or layout maybe not the most fortunate maybe. OK, if it's just me ten I didn't complain.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nuke70 said:


> Hi Joker after thorough searching of earphones on the local stores in my area it appears the noticeable earphone i saw was klipsch image and dunu dn-19 tai chi though personally i dont like the look of overhead earphone what can you say between the two? Best Regards,


 
   
  Which Klipsch Image? The X10 is pretty good if you're getting it for less than $150. Questionable durability but otherwise a good started earphone. The DN-19 is better-built and gives you some play with the sound (with the tuning ports) but it doesn't have the clarity and detail levels of the X10. It's pretty good overall, especially if you don't prioritize sound quality. 
   
  Quote: 





rossk26 said:


> Thanks for the reply
> 
> I have the following to choose from:
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've heard almost none of those but I have no trouble recommending the SHE3590 (which should be the same as the SHE3850 I recommended originally). 
   
  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> Yeah I know your scale isn't meant for that I'm just saying that at least for me I don't know if spending $1300 will justify the price vs SQ compared to the SM3.  I have become a mid junkie along with needing a spacious soundstage and I know the TG334 is excellent at thoughs things so I just don't know and spending that kind of money on an IEM I want to make darn sure its something that will give me a substantial up grade over the SM3 and by most accounts it seems like they would but its hard for me to pull the trigger on them because of the cost.  I'm sure I'll brake down and buy them sometime this coming year because they really seem like a great fit for the kind of sound signature I like but for now I'm extremely happy with the SM3's.


 
   
  It's not exactly a bargain, but then the very best never is.
   
  Quote: 





bangon said:


> Nice thread. Do you plan to add the Philips SHE3580/SHE3590 and the Panasonic RP-HJE355? Thanks.
> 
> Btw. which forum engine is this? Not the best.


 
   
  I have a SHE3580. I do plan to add it eventually. 
   
  Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> Hey Joker, I love your review (inspired me to get the RE-ZERO and RE-262). Can I please ask you to make a direct comparison between the RE-262 and Meelec A161p? I'm loving the mids, highs, and soundstage of the former, but my impressions with its subbass don't match with other people's impressions.
> 
> I got the RE-262 for $100 and will be receiving the A161 for $66, and I want to know which is the better value. This way, I don't have to return the 161 as open-box.
> 
> Very best.


 
   
  Two pretty different earphones - if you like the smooth and laid-back nature of the RE262 you may not like the A161P much, but as with all things audio you won't really know until you try it, especially if you haven't heard a decent armature-based earphone before. The A161P has more treble energy and presence. It also has good bass depth for a single armature, I have no issues with its punch or extension. That said, it tends to be pretty forward and in-your-face compared to the 262/272. I imagine it will be pretty tempting to open it and try it anyway 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  As for which is a better deal, they are both well-priced at their original prices and they are still equally well-priced with the proportionally lower pricing you got. The RE262 has been or is being discontinued, which is a shame.


----------



## rG-tom

Hey joker, please can you compare the ue900, CT-200 and 1964 V3s? I really do like the idea of customs after having had a terrible time with the TF10s, and the CT200 and v3s seem the two logical choices.
   
  Or any other suggestions under £300?


----------



## ktan3142

Thanks a lot, AstralStorm and joker, for the prompt responses. I find the RE-262's vocals to be pretty euphoric, so I guess I can deal with the slight lack of bass. Having said that, I'm not going to try the A161P, because I'll more than likely gift it to a metal/rock friend of mine.
   
  Also, I've owned the Ety HF3 for a short while and liked them a lot, aside from their claustrophobic soundstage. I don't know if it counts as a "decent" BA IEM, but I think my RE-ZERO will serve me well enough to cover for the 262's shortcomings.
   
  Therefore, I'm gonna return either


----------



## Rope

|Joker| -
  I have but one question, which is not related to IEM's, but still relative.
   
  After preparing all the concise but detailed reviews of what seems a gazillion IEMs, then answering a berrage of questions relating to those reviewed items.  How do you cram 48 hours into 24, and more importantly, do you ever sleep?


----------



## Googolplex147

Hey Joker, I have a question about hifiman re262's. I will not be using an amp, but everyone says that you need one for these. Will they sound better or as good as some other choices in the price range, like turbine pro golds or EPH-100, considering I won't be using an amp? Just how much SQ do you loose if you don't use one? If the re262's are not better, what would you recommend? Thanks in advance.


----------



## scootsit

You could pick up the ultra tiny, and very nice-performing Fiio E5 for $19 from Amazon. Add a CD, and you get free shipping, too.
   
  The E5 should be more than enough for the RE262.


----------



## scootsit

Double.


----------



## AstralStorm

RE-262 are an entirely different beast from EPH-100 and MTPG. For starters, RE-262 have linear (or slightly dropping) bass and they have that 2k "diffuse field" boost combined with 3-5k cut.
   
  Both EPH-100 and MTPG are bass boosted, the former more so. EPH-100 also has some high end boost for a V-shaped frequency response. None of those is as fast either. MTPG is comparably smooth, EPH-100 is not.
   
  Those are the major differences - it's harder to describe than to hear.


----------



## Amitl

considering sound quality in general,
  how much would the Thinksound ms01 be and upgrade over the id America Spark?
  and how much would the Future Sonics Atrio MG7 be an upgrade over the Thinksound ms01?
  thanks...


----------



## Love Music

Joker,
   
  I am looking to upgrade my eq-7's. I was wondering which one of these earphones is most suitable for my need. So far i've been recommended the Westone UM3X, Westone 4, Sony EX1000 (though i'm not sure about these since I need isolation and comfort), SM3 V2, CK100, CK100PRO, FitEar F111, SE535.
   
   
*MUSIC GENRES:* Female vocals, pop, acoustic, rock, metal.
   
   
*SOUND PREFERENCES:  *
   

 Clarity.
 airy/transparent.
 articulate.
 good mids.
 treble thats smooth (not harsh, sibilant or overly bright).
 good soundstage (engaging, feels as if your listening to a live concert).
 not too bassy since i'm not a basshead (the eq-7's bass is adequate for my needs).
 vocals more forward than instruments. I tend to like mid/vocal centric earphones but the instruments also have to be engaging.
 Good imaging (able to pinpoint where intruments are and must not get congested in complex passages. Vocals being more upfront and the listener is positioned in the first/second row). 
 not that revealing of bad quality tracks since I do have some mp3's that are below 320 (maybe 15%) but apart from that it is either wav or 320.
   
   
*SOURCE:* Sony Walkman Z, no amp.
   
   
  Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rg-tom said:


> Hey joker, please can you compare the ue900, CT-200 and 1964 V3s? I really do like the idea of customs after having had a terrible time with the TF10s, and the CT200 and v3s seem the two logical choices.
> 
> Or any other suggestions under £300?


 
   
  You already requested the CT-200 vs UE900 comparison in the CT-200 thread, which I provided. You can also find full comparisons between the 1964-V3, CT-200, and UE900 in the 1964-V3 review.
   
  Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> Thanks a lot, AstralStorm and joker, for the prompt responses. I find the RE-262's vocals to be pretty euphoric, so I guess I can deal with the slight lack of bass. Having said that, I'm not going to try the A161P, because I'll more than likely gift it to a metal/rock friend of mine.
> 
> Also, I've owned the Ety HF3 for a short while and liked them a lot, aside from their claustrophobic soundstage. I don't know if it counts as a "decent" BA IEM, but I think my RE-ZERO will serve me well enough to cover for the 262's shortcomings.
> 
> Therefore, I'm gonna return either


 
   
  The HF3 is very decent.
   
  Quote: 





rope said:


> |Joker| -
> I have but one question, which is not related to IEM's, but still relative.
> 
> After preparing all the concise but detailed reviews of what seems a gazillion IEMs, then answering a berrage of questions relating to those reviewed items.  How do you cram 48 hours into 24, and more importantly, do you ever sleep?


 
   
  With great difficulty, and not enough 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





googolplex147 said:


> Hey Joker, I have a question about hifiman re262's. I will not be using an amp, but everyone says that you need one for these. Will they sound better or as good as some other choices in the price range, like turbine pro golds or EPH-100, considering I won't be using an amp? Just how much SQ do you loose if you don't use one? If the re262's are not better, what would you recommend? Thanks in advance.


 
   
  The 262 isn't that bad without an amp - I would still pick them over the Golds or EPH-100 but the sound signature is also different. Depending on the type of sound you want the GR07 might also be an option as it's pretty easy to drive and arguably better than the EPH-100 and MTPG.
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> considering sound quality in general,
> how much would the Thinksound ms01 be and upgrade over the id America Spark?
> and how much would the Future Sonics Atrio MG7 be an upgrade over the Thinksound ms01?
> thanks...


 
   
  I don't know how I can quantify these things any more than the numbers in the reviews already have done. If you can afford the MG7 and don't mind losing some of the mid-bass and bloat and some of the treble sparkle of the id America, go for it.
   
  Quote: 





love music said:


> Joker,
> 
> I am looking to upgrade my eq-7's. I was wondering which one of these earphones is most suitable for my need. So far i've been recommended the Westone UM3X, Westone 4, Sony EX1000 (though i'm not sure about these since I need isolation and comfort), SM3 V2, CK100, CK100PRO, FitEar F111, SE535.
> 
> ...


 

 What are you unsatisfied with in the e-Q7? It's got what you're looking for, maybe not the best in the world at each of those but more than competent.
   
  Just from reading that it sounds like the CK100 (I haven't heard the CK100Pro).


----------



## Zelda

say Joker,
   
  do you think this year brought something that sounds like the original Xcape, even at a higher price?
  those are somthing i really miss now


----------



## Johnny Jumper

ljokerl said:


> The entry-level BAs typically have much more glaring weaknesses than the mid-level ones. Signatures also vary quite a bit--the entry-level BAs I like (A151, Rock-It R-20/R-30, Astrotec AM-90, etc) tend to be warmer and smoother than most higher-end ones. If you want to really try an armature but still have reservations I would recommend something decent in the ~$100 range - an A161P, Ety HF5, Phonak 022, Brainwavz B2, Rock-It R-50, etc. Less of an investment than going all out at $200 and you shouldn't lose a whole lot on resale value if you don't like them.




A lot of bargains online right now. Still thinking about adding BA IEMs to my little collection. Klipsch X10 is under $100 right now. Is this worth looking into or are there better dual BA units out there?

JJ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> say Joker,
> 
> do you think this year brought something that sounds like the original Xcape, even at a higher price?
> those are somthing i really miss now


 
   
  Nothing that I can think of. There's still very few dynamic-driver earphones pursuing the type of detailed and balanced sound the Xcape v.1 had.
    
  Quote:


johnny jumper said:


> A lot of bargains online right now. Still thinking about adding BA IEMs to my little collection. Klipsch X10 is under $100 right now. Is this worth looking into or are there better dual BA units out there?
> JJ


 

 The X10 is atypical of an armature-based earphone in that it's rather bass-heavy. I do think you can find something more accurate for the money but it's a good starter earphone. Not a great representation of BA capability though, due to its tuning.


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What are you unsatisfied with in the e-Q7? It's got what you're looking for, maybe not the best in the world at each of those but more than competent.
> 
> Just from reading that it sounds like the CK100 (I haven't heard the CK100Pro).


 
   
   
  I find the upper mids/treble of the eq-7's can be overly bright/harsh at times and can sound a bit grainy. 
   
  Is it worth upgrading if you want something to sound better than the eq-7's or are they already one of the best? The reason I ask is because some people will say it's much improved. I know it comes down to preferences, but I just want to here your thoughts.
   
  Thanks Joker.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





love music said:


> I find the upper mids/treble of the eq-7's can be overly bright/harsh at times and can sound a bit grainy.
> 
> Is it worth upgrading if you want something to sound better than the eq-7's or are they already one of the best? The reason I ask is because some people will say it's much improved. I know it comes down to preferences, but I just want to here your thoughts.
> 
> Thanks Joker.


 
  I don't know the EQ7 precisely but I have some familiarity with the design. I'd stay with the stock tips or get some if you don't have them and use the smallest that allow a seal for deep insertion to warm up the mids. I know there's a physical diameter issue that can restrict deep insertion for some but you're already in the ballpark for VG phone and may just need some tweaking. If you're already setup like this, try some sony hybrids, meelec duals etc before you let them go.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Creative Aurvana 3 (under $100) or MEE A151 (under $70)?  Looking for analytical plus a non-fatiguing sound...
   
  JJ


----------



## airomjosh

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Creative Aurvana 3 (under $100) or MEE A151 (under $70)?  Looking for analytical plus a non-fatiguing sound...
> 
> JJ


 
  if you like Mee A151, better get Astrotec AM90 (35USD) . Theyre a lot cheaper and the sound signature is almost similar to A151. Some people who have them both prefer AM90 than A151. Just my 2 cents.


----------



## kaixax555

hehe waiting for a review of the BA200 from you one day (if you ever do it)


----------



## Keshav

Hey Joker,
   
  Iam looking for a new earphone under 50 . I mostly listen to rock and grunge bands like def leppard,pink floyd,alice in chains etc..
  The ones i have shortlisted are Brainwavz r1,m4,m5,am90,gr02be.
   
  Which one should I buy or anything else you can recommend ?


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





keshav said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Iam looking for a new earphone under 50 . I mostly listen to rock and grunge bands like def leppard,pink floyd,alice in chains etc..
> The ones i have shortlisted are Brainwavz r1,m4,m5,am90,gr02be.
> ...


 
   
             keep the BA out man , and i think m5 or the gr02 bass edition will do good . m4 has some extensive complains of harsh sibilance , so keep that out too .i think m5 with precise and controlled bass , will do good for you rock needs .


----------



## KevinWolf

soullinker20 said:


> I own those too. tg334 w/ 000 cables makes $1,700+
> 
> and all i can say is the sound is night and day difference for me in terms of soundstage, detail, transparency
> 
> ...




That's very interesting, for a long time I had been wanting a $1000+ universal IEM but I were between the fi-ba-ss and the tg334.
The 334 sound good with eq? I'm afraid they will sound too dark for my tastes, also the difference with the 000 cable is really big?


----------



## suman134

happy new year guys , have a nice year ahead , enjoy !! just ordered a jbl j88 , lets see .


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Quote: 





keshav said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Iam looking for a new earphone under 50 . I mostly listen to rock and grunge bands like def leppard,pink floyd,alice in chains etc..
> The ones i have shortlisted are Brainwavz r1,m4,m5,am90,gr02be.
> ...


 

 Gr02Be - my favorites right now - I listen to hairbands and buckcherry and the like. Awesome IEMs and you cannot beat the price.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





love music said:


> I find the upper mids/treble of the eq-7's can be overly bright/harsh at times and can sound a bit grainy.
> 
> Is it worth upgrading if you want something to sound better than the eq-7's or are they already one of the best? The reason I ask is because some people will say it's much improved. I know it comes down to preferences, but I just want to here your thoughts.
> 
> Thanks Joker.


 
   
  The e-Q7 sounds very decent overall. I don't think there are huge improvements to be made objectively but you can definitely find something with smoother treble if you're giving up on the Ortofons - the UM3X, SE535, or SM3, for example, or maybe a HiFiMan RE262/272. 
   
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> I don't know the EQ7 precisely but I have some familiarity with the design. I'd stay with the stock tips or get some if you don't have them and use the smallest that allow a seal for deep insertion to warm up the mids. I know there's a physical diameter issue that can restrict deep insertion for some but you're already in the ballpark for VG phone and may just need some tweaking. If you're already setup like this, try some sony hybrids, meelec duals etc before you let them go.


 
   
  This is good advice.
   
  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> hehe waiting for a review of the BA200 from you one day (if you ever do it)


 
   
  Don't have one yet so it might be a while.
   
  Quote: 





keshav said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Iam looking for a new earphone under 50 . I mostly listen to rock and grunge bands like def leppard,pink floyd,alice in chains etc..
> The ones i have shortlisted are Brainwavz r1,m4,m5,am90,gr02be.
> ...


 

 Really depends on the sort of sound you are after. I haven't heard the M4 or R1 but the M5 is good if you like bass-heavy sound with laid-back highs and moderate clarity. AM90 is more mid-centric, much less bass. GR02 BE is v-shaped, with recessed mids and strong, slightly unrefined treble. AM-90 is a safe choice for "balanced". M5 is a safe choice for "bassy". Another option might be the new ViSang VS-K1 (review coming soon). It's balanced like the AM-90 but focuses a little more on the mid/upper bass and lower midrange than the upper midrange/treble. The result is a fuller, warmer sound with a bit less clarity and energy. Again, comes down to preference but it's a good performer at the $50 mark.


----------



## phantompersona

Quote: 





love music said:


> I find the upper mids/treble of the eq-7's can be overly bright/harsh at times and can sound a bit grainy.
> 
> Is it worth upgrading if you want something to sound better than the eq-7's or are they already one of the best? The reason I ask is because some people will say it's much improved. I know it comes down to preferences, but I just want to here your thoughts.
> 
> Thanks Joker.


 
  You can try sony hybrid tips or other smaller bore tips to reduce the treble. I hate overly bright phones and usually the hybrid tip fixes that issue for me.


----------



## Keshav

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The e-Q7 sounds very decent overall. I don't think there are huge improvements to be made objectively but you can definitely find something with smoother treble if you're giving up on the Ortofons - the UM3X, SE535, or SM3, for example, or maybe a HiFiMan RE262/272.
> 
> 
> This is good advice.
> ...


 
  Thanks. And which will be more versatile among them ?


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> You can try sony hybrid tips or other smaller bore tips to reduce the treble. I hate overly bright phones and usually the hybrid tip fixes that issue for me.


 
   
  Thanks. I've tried them before but the mids and sounstage tends to suffer from it so I rather just use the normal stock tips.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The e-Q7 sounds very decent overall. I don't think there are huge improvements to be made objectively but you can definitely find something with smoother treble if you're giving up on the Ortofons - the UM3X, SE535, or SM3, for example, or maybe a HiFiMan RE262/272.
> 
> 
> This is good advice.


 
   
  Thanks Joker, actually I have the RE262, not really a big fan it though.
  Hope you have a great new year Joker, thanks for all your help


----------



## ljokerl

Well, it's 2013 here in SoCal. Happy New Year everyone! Thanks for all the feedback and support. Here's to another year filled with exciting new products and to not forgetting that it's still about the music 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





keshav said:


> Thanks. And which will be more versatile among them ?


 

 Probably the VS-K1 or GR02.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, it's 2013 here in SoCal. Happy New Year everyone! Thanks for all the feedback and support. Here's to another year filled with exciting new products and to not forgetting that it's still about the music
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for all you do!  Happy New Year!
   
  JJ


----------



## ellis ip

An u add ie80 , ie800 , ultrasone iq , tio ,akg 374 also u miss earsonic sm3v2, grado gr10,8


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Thanks for all you do!  Happy New Year!
> 
> JJ


----------



## suman134

should the tf10 be driven without a amp , will there be a difference in sq ? source is cowon c2 .


----------



## djvkool

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> should the tf10 be driven without a amp , will there be a difference in sq ? source is cowon c2 .


 
   
  TF10 responds quite well when amped, but equally awesome unamped


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> TF10 responds quite well when amped, but equally awesome unamped


 
   
           my boss dont let me , take the tf10 home . seems like i got to buy one .


----------



## JamesB123

On another thread I was recommended the VSonic VR06, but seemingly the only place to get them in the UK is from eBay, which I'd rather avoid. I was wondering if there were any other earphones around for about £50/60 (unfortunately that translates to about the same in $.. rip off! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





)?
   
  Here's the posts I made to narrow down a search:
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/596233/buying-portable-or-in-ear-headphones-seeking-guidance-dont-start-a-new-thread-ask-for-advice-here/1875#post_8966351
http://www.head-fi.org/t/596233/buying-portable-or-in-ear-headphones-seeking-guidance-dont-start-a-new-thread-ask-for-advice-here/2100#post_8994703
   
  Basically; about £50/60 maybe more (or less) if they're really worth it... bang for the buck essentially,
  an all rounder, mainly rock but pretty much anything,
  good build quality, 
  warm, forward and according to a glossary thread; lush, but not bass heavy that it takes over to the detriment of everything else,
  good isolation and low leakage,
  preferably worn straight down, though I can be convinced otherwise.
  unamped, from a laptop and a Samsung P3, so nothing too taxing.
   
  Any help would be really appreciated.


----------



## lododo

Hello,

 I'm looking a for a new set of IEM's. Mine broke with New years eve, so it's time to pick up a new set.

 Previously I've owned a Klipsch S4, it was decent, but I found the bass too overwhelming and I had a hard time distinguishing between instruments.

 I've been looking up some reviews and I found the following;

 Head-direct RE0

 Phonak Audeó 012/022

 Beyerdynamic MMX 101ie
   
  Etymotic Research MC5 / MC2 / MC3
   
  I mainly listen to metal (Metallica, Megadeth etc), Blues (Stevie ray vaughn, Rory gallagher) and funk.
   
  So overall I listen to a lot of guitar music.

 Can someone help me out?


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Quote: 





jamesb123 said:


> On another thread I was recommended the VSonic VR06, but seemingly the only place to get them in the UK is from eBay, which I'd rather avoid. I was wondering if there were any other earphones around for about £50/60 (unfortunately that translates to about the same in $.. rip off!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Avoiding ebay - maybe the soundmagic E10 - very good all around especially for rock. RE0 is very detailed but the bass is just too little for my liking.


----------



## thesuperguy

Hi.
   
  I'm just wondering if you've had the chance to listen to the VSonic GR04s and if so, how do they compare to the GR06s. It seems there is a very divided opinion on the GR06s and many are preferring the GR02s over the GR06s.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> Hi.
> 
> I'm just wondering if you've had the chance to listen to the VSonic GR04s and if so, how do they compare to the GR06s. It seems there is a very divided opinion on the GR06s and many are preferring the GR02s over the GR06s.


 

 Never heard the GR06, but the GR04 is awesome. It's much flatter than the GR02. The 50z GR04 Flagship (or pro, but NOT the classical) is amazing. It was once positioned in the lineup between the GR06 and the GR07, and if you look at the GR04 Flagship thread, compared quite well to the GR07, especially at its current $50 price point.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> TF10 responds quite well when amped, but equally awesome unamped


 
   
  Also depends on the source when running unamped. Have to be wary of people trying to use non-Apple smartphones as sources these days. 
   
  Quote: 





jamesb123 said:


> On another thread I was recommended the VSonic VR06, but seemingly the only place to get them in the UK is from eBay, which I'd rather avoid. I was wondering if there were any other earphones around for about £50/60 (unfortunately that translates to about the same in $.. rip off!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Don't know which of these are available to your outside of eBay but maybe the Brainwavz M2 or Dunu Trident would work in addition to the Soundmagic E10 recommended above.
   
  Quote: 





lododo said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm looking a for a new set of IEM's. Mine broke with New years eve, so it's time to pick up a new set.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The MMX101 is nearly as bass-heavy as the S4 so I would skip it. The RE0 and MC5 are on the other end of the spectrum and might be too big of a risk. The PFE 012 is in the safe zone between flat and bass-heavy, along with sets such as the Shure SE215 and HiSound Crystal. These are on the warm side but none of them are as bass-heavy as the Klipsch S4. I'd throw the Rock-It R-30 in that category as well as a great value at $70. It does guitars pretty well, as do the SE215 and Crystal.
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> Hi.
> 
> I'm just wondering if you've had the chance to listen to the VSonic GR04s and if so, how do they compare to the GR06s. It seems there is a very divided opinion on the GR06s and many are preferring the GR02s over the GR06s.


 

 The GR06 and GR02 pursue different sound signatures so it's easy to see someone preferring the GR02 over the GR06. I have not heard the GR04.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Also depends on the source when running unamped. Have to be wary of people trying to use non-Apple smartphones as sources these days.


 
   
         will the c2 or j3 do it ?


----------



## ljokerl

Added ViSang VS-K1.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A74) ViSang VS-K1*
> 
> 
> Added Jan 2013
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> will the c2 or j3 do it ?


 

 Not sure about the C2. The J3 is fine.


----------



## KasVa

Whay about Earsonics SM64


----------



## KasVa

Whay about Earsonics SM64


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Not sure about the C2. The J3 is fine.


 

 thnaks man , appreciated . and the new vs-k1 looks good . do the tf10 man .


----------



## Tom Yum Goong

Quote: 





kasva said:


> Whay about Earsonics SM64


 

 Until you get a professional review from Mr. Portables Reviewerus Prolificus, you can read some of my first impressions here http://www.head-fi.org/t/640630/sm64-to-replace-sm3/30#post_9010398


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added ViSang VS-K1.


 
  nice one!


----------



## listen4joy

ljokerl[size=medium] first let me congrat you for great thread. you help a lot of people here to found the best iem for them. for me the re262 is the best bang for buck and i enjoy quality of the best iem world has to offer in reasonable price. i dont think they fall a lot in quality from one thousand dollars [/size]
  [size=medium]earphones. i understand that earphones like unique melody miracle and others high end IEM are the best in the market but most of people cant spend soo much money on iem. so for the re262 was the best solution to enjoy this world. before your thread i didnt know what to choose and didnt know a lot about iem. but after i read carefully your thread i enjoy them very much and didnt have regret at all. the re262 is superb for me and i suppuse to a lot of others. anyway i want to ask you if you can review the Sony MH1C (30-40$)  there are a lot of hype and a lot of people said they are awasome for their price[/size]
   
  link!
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/634136/the-king-of-value-sony-mh1c-impressions-appreciations-thread
   
   
   
  [size=medium]i really curious to see where they will place in the comprasion.[/size]
   
   
   
  [size=medium]are you going to review them in the future?[/size]
   
  if yes i cant wait for your review about them


----------



## NoGood

Hey gus/girls,
   
  Some basic info about me:
  I'm more of a neutral/analytical guy.
   
  I listen to rock, metal, pop, classic, reggae...in that order.
  I don't wanna break the bank, so which one of these would suit me and the sansa clip+ best?
   
  Etymotic Research HF5 w/ACS Tips, where I can buy the acs tips if i go for the etys?
 Rock-it Sounds R-50, seems really promising
 GR07 MKii
 DBA 02 mkii, heard great things about it.
 Sony EX600
   
  Thanks


----------



## thesuperguy

An IEM with an impedance of 50ohms is on the border of needing an amp. I would just like to know from your personal experience how much more improved is the sound coming from an amped source vs. directly from an ipod.


----------



## JamesB123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Don't know which of these are available to your outside of eBay but maybe the Brainwavz M2 or Dunu Trident would work in addition to the Soundmagic E10 recommended above.


 
  Thanks for the reply - and to the person who originally suggested the E10s.
   
  On Amazon.co.uk at least the M2s are £40, the Dunu Tridents £22, E10s about £35. 
   
  How about the Brainwavz M4 or M5s; they are both about £30; cheaper than the M2s. From what I've read the M4s seem to be abit better than the M5s, though the M5s are apparently a little duller, but both are alot better than the M2s? It's quite conflicting on the M4/5s as well, some reviews say they're both quite bassy, some say neither are and some say they're completely different.
   
  I think I've discounted the Tridents, but of the others which ones are best overall? As I say I listen to pretty much anything and reading around a couple of them seem to lack clarity or general sound quality when listening to other genres. The plus points about all three seem to be build quality, which is good.


----------



## torro32

which one would you recommend for about 10$. I need ones that are comfortable, have clear midrange and sensitivity.


----------



## mosshorn

Quote: 





torro32 said:


> which one would you recommend for about 10$. I need ones that are comfortable, have clear midrange and sensitivity.


 
  Monoprice 8320.


----------



## torro32

Quote: 





mosshorn said:


> Monoprice 8320.


 
  I can't stand the headphones that doesn't fit well. Ok, maybe for the 10 - 20$ which are the best overall? I'm an adult, medium size head.


----------



## star watcher

Thanks for the Visang VS-K1 review! Thanks for all the reviews! Long time lurker love this thread!


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Quote: 





torro32 said:


> which one would you recommend for about 10$. I need ones that are comfortable, have clear midrange and sensitivity.


 

 Phillips 3580


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Quote: 





nogood said:


> Hey gus/girls,
> 
> Some basic info about me:
> I'm more of a neutral/analytical guy.
> ...


 

 GR07 BE or MK or the DBA (possibly the EX600 as well)


----------



## torro32

Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> Phillips 3580


 
  I'm a little bit worried they will be too small. Also I see they are V-shaped, I need good mid range clarity.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





torro32 said:


> I'm a little bit worried they will be too small. Also I see they are V-shaped, I need good mid range clarity.


 

 panasonic hje-355 or sony ex220lp . soundmagic es18 can do too .


----------



## NewForce

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I am curious about the limit of APT-X with some of the more high-end BT sets. A lot of the older BT sets I've tried were truly horrific but I've heard a few in the past year that weren't too bad all. It would be interesting to see what can be done with APT-X and a pair of well-designed BT headphones with a decent onboard dac/amp.


 
   
  Hi ljokerl
   
  I'm a newbie to this forum. From your lengthy great review of 268 IEM, I am very curious/suprise that TDK BA200 wasn't in your review list. Is there any reason stopping you from reviewing this great IEM from TDK?
   
  Btw, your mentioning about APT-X enabled bluetooth also interest me if you can do a review on Samsung HS3000 Bluetooth Headset. Just a small thing to note, if you indeed going to review it, please review it with a more mainstream or better IEM together with a APT-X enabled cellphone like Samsung Galaxy Note2 or Galaxy S3.


----------



## Gilly87

ljokerl said:


> Also depends on the source when running unamped. Have to be wary of people trying to use non-Apple smartphones as sources these days.




Depends on which one...Voodoo Sound for Android phones using Wolfson DACs puts them on the level of higher-end DAPs that fall above any Apple product sans LOD. My new Nexus 4 is no slouch either, and the HTC One S and Galaxy S3 variants using the Snapdragon S4 dual-core chip set test with even lower distortion levels than any iPhone.


----------



## Gilly87

nogood said:


> Hey gus/girls,
> 
> Some basic info about me:
> I'm more of a neutral/analytical guy.
> ...




Etys will probably be underwhelming for metal and reggae, some people are fine with their bass, but it is definitely south of neutral and I know it would be too little for me for those genres.


----------



## torro32

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> panasonic hje-355 or sony ex220lp . soundmagic es18 can do too .


 
  I will buy es18, they look best for me and the cheapest price i could find them is 18$ on ebay shipping included. What do you guys think?


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





torro32 said:


> I will buy es18, they look best for me and the cheapest price i could find them is 18$ on ebay shipping included. What do you guys think?


 

        the asking price is a bit high , with $18 i can buy two es18 .


----------



## Johnny Jumper

ES18 is $12 on Amazon.  You might want to look into the Philips SHE3800 or SHE3900 earphones.  Very well reviewed (I have a pair for everyday use).  They run between $10 and $15.
   
  JJ


----------



## torro32

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> ES18 is $12 on Amazon.  You might want to look into the Philips SHE3800 or SHE3900 earphones.  Very well reviewed (I have a pair for everyday use).  They run between $10 and $15.
> 
> JJ


 
  Amazon doesn't ship anything to my country. I can only buy stuff from ebay or taobao. Those philips are not on ebay.
   
  I'm also a little bit audiohile and I like a good sound. I will listen them on samsung galaxy 3 cell phone, it really has good sound, bass is deep, highs are a little bit tamed. Mids are beautiful and sound stage is very good.
   
  I prefer headphones with deep soft bass, natural mids and highs. Also comfort must be very good. The cheapest i can find es18 is 18$.


----------



## ljokerl

Someone is re-posting my reviews under my name on amazon... not sure if I should feel flattered or worried. Not cool either way.
   
  http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-reviews/A3BYW2V9YR6B9O/ref=cm_cr_pr_auth_rev?ie=UTF8&sort_by=MostRecentReview
   
   
  Quote: 





listen4joy said:


> ljokerl[size=medium] first let me congrat you for great thread. you help a lot of people here to found the best iem for them. for me the re262 is the best bang for buck and i enjoy quality of the best iem world has to offer in reasonable price. i dont think they fall a lot in quality from one thousand dollars [/size]
> [size=medium]earphones. i understand that earphones like unique melody miracle and others high end IEM are the best in the market but most of people cant spend soo much money on iem. so for the re262 was the best solution to enjoy this world. before your thread i didnt know what to choose and didnt know a lot about iem. but after i read carefully your thread i enjoy them very much and didnt have regret at all. the re262 is superb for me and i suppuse to a lot of others. anyway i want to ask you if you can review the Sony MH1C (30-40$)  there are a lot of hype and a lot of people said they are awasome for their price[/size]
> 
> link!
> ...


 
   
  Someone was going to send me a pair but I think he liked them so much he decided to keep them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I'll probably get my hands on them at some point. 
   
  Quote: 





nogood said:


> Hey gus/girls,
> 
> Some basic info about me:
> I'm more of a neutral/analytical guy.
> ...


 
   
  All great options. The HF5 is very good value if you're certain you don't need enhanced bass. Very efficient and you can listen to it before committing to ACS tips and spending more - once you do you just need to take the included coupon to an ACS audiologist in your area. They pretty much do the rest.
   
  The rest are great options as well, without knowing more it's hard to say which one is most worth the premium over the HF5.
   
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> An IEM with an impedance of 50ohms is on the border of needing an amp. I would just like to know from your personal experience how much more improved is the sound coming from an amped source vs. directly from an ipod.


 
   
  Not really something that can be quantified and there's more to it then just the impedance rating. Sensitivity is what tells you how much volume you'll get from a given earphone and something can still be difficult to drive with a lower impedance. You may hit a voltage limit with high impedance but you'll also hit a current limit with low impedance. Anyway, case-by-case basis and all that.
   
  Quote: 





jamesb123 said:


> Thanks for the reply - and to the person who originally suggested the E10s.
> 
> On Amazon.co.uk at least the M2s are £40, the Dunu Tridents £22, E10s about £35.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I haven't heard the M4. The M5 has quite a lot of bass (too much for me) - didn't seem like that's what you're looking for. The M2 is different in signature - less bass and more mids. I guess out of all those I would personally go for the E10 for rock - it's not perfect but if the rest satisfies (medium isolation, etc), it's easily worth the money. 
   
  Quote: 





star watcher said:


> Thanks for the Visang VS-K1 review! Thanks for all the reviews! Long time lurker love this thread!


 
   




   
  Quote: 





newforce said:


> Hi ljokerl
> 
> I'm a newbie to this forum. From your lengthy great review of 268 IEM, I am very curious/suprise that TDK BA200 wasn't in your review list. Is there any reason stopping you from reviewing this great IEM from TDK?
> 
> Btw, your mentioning about APT-X enabled bluetooth also interest me if you can do a review on Samsung HS3000 Bluetooth Headset. Just a small thing to note, if you indeed going to review it, please review it with a more mainstream or better IEM together with a APT-X enabled cellphone like Samsung Galaxy Note2 or Galaxy S3.


 
   
   
  Pretty much just the time factor - I do this in my spare time and even if it was my full-time job there's just not enough hours in the day to cover everything. 
   
  I'd like to review some wireless stuff in the future but again there just isn't the time to delve into it. Perhaps I'll do it at InnerFidelity at some point.


----------



## NewForce

ljokerl said:


> Pretty much just the time factor - I do this in my spare time and even if it was my full-time job there's just not enough hours in the day to cover everything.
> 
> I'd like to review some wireless stuff in the future but again there just isn't the time to delve into it. Perhaps I'll do it at InnerFidelity at some point.



Thank you very much for your prompt reply. I've just released this was your part time thing.
Given the nature, it's considered a huge achievement for you to be able to review this huge number of IEM and give an appropriate rating to all of them.

Most of us in this forum are really grateful and benficial to and from your great reviews. Thank you again for all this make possible and happening to most of us.


----------



## JamesB123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the M4. The M5 has quite a lot of bass (too much for me) - didn't seem like that's what you're looking for. The M2 is different in signature - less bass and more mids. I guess out of all those I would personally go for the E10 for rock - it's not perfect but if the rest satisfies (medium isolation, etc), it's easily worth the money.


 
  I was siding toward the E10, and at this price I'm not going to be getting perfection. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Cheers.


----------



## ellis ip

I want to buy a new iem, u think gr10, sm3v2 or w4r is more suitable for classical and some pop music?


----------



## Johnny Jumper

torro32 said:


> Amazon doesn't ship anything to my country. I can only buy stuff from ebay or taobao. Those philips are not on ebay.
> 
> I'm also a little bit audiohile and I like a good sound. I will listen them on samsung galaxy 3 cell phone, it really has good sound, bass is deep, highs are a little bit tamed. Mids are beautiful and sound stage is very good.
> 
> I prefer headphones with deep soft bass, natural mids and highs. Also comfort must be very good. The cheapest i can find es18 is 18$.




Sorry, I meant the Philips SHE3580 or SHE3590 in-ear phones. They should be available on eBay for around $15 US. They are great little earphones for the price.

Have not heard the ES18 so I cannot compare them.

JJ


----------



## Jozurr

Hey Joker.
   
  What IEMS under $60 do you think would be the closest sounding to the CALs? Preferably from Mp4nation


----------



## DavvyJones96

About when will we see the addition of the UE 700 and TripleFi 10 Pros?


----------



## torro32

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Sorry, I meant the Philips SHE3580 or SHE3590 in-ear phones. They should be available on eBay for around $15 US. They are great little earphones for the price.
> Have not heard the ES18 so I cannot compare them.
> JJ


 
  I just bought es18 black-red for 18$. I think no one but chinese can make a better product at the cheaper price. And the included bag will come in handy


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





torro32 said:


> I just bought es18 black-red for 18$. I think no one but chinese can make a better product at the cheaper price. And the included bag will come in handy


 
   
        nice choice , i too prefer es18 over she3590 . enjoy your music .


----------



## NoGood

Damn, now I'm confused after reading some more reviews. I heard the RE0(currently $49) at head direct is quite similar to the ETY ER4S($250). But I'm looking for a portable rig and would prefer not to carry an amp with me.
   
  Seems the RE0 seems an amp to meet the quality of sound I need(neutral and not warm). And only the mini3 would get me these and it's DIY 
   
  The fischer audio dba-02 are out of stock and unavailable at the moment.
  R-50 seems a bit warm as well as the GR07.
   
  Will a sansa fuze do? As the clip + seems to be underpowering to the re0(mentioned in kostalex review thread).
   
  How will the HM601 pair with the re0?


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> nice choice , i too prefer es18 over she3590 . enjoy your music .


 
  which is bassier?


----------



## torro32

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> which is bassier?


 
  based on the rewievs i have read she3590 should be bassier. But I prefer more neutral sound, with natural mids and deep soft bass which e18 should reproduce.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





newforce said:


> Thank you very much for your prompt reply. I've just released this was your part time thing.
> Given the nature, it's considered a huge achievement for you to be able to review this huge number of IEM and give an appropriate rating to all of them.
> Most of us in this forum are really grateful and benficial to and from your great reviews. Thank you again for all this make possible and happening to most of us.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





ellis ip said:


> I want to buy a new iem, u think gr10, sm3v2 or w4r is more suitable for classical and some pop music?


 
   
  I have only heard the W4 and SM3 v1. Of those two I would pick the W4 but based on what I've been told I would imagine the GR10 is a strong contender. 
   
  Quote: 





jozurr said:


> Hey Joker.
> 
> What IEMS under $60 do you think would be the closest sounding to the CALs? Preferably from Mp4nation


 
   
  From mp4nation - Brainwavz M2. 
   
  Quote: 





davvyjones96 said:


> About when will we see the addition of the UE 700 and TripleFi 10 Pros?


 
   
  I need a *shrug* smiley.
   
  Quote: 





nogood said:


> Damn, now I'm confused after reading some more reviews. I heard the RE0(currently $49) at head direct is quite similar to the ETY ER4S($250). But I'm looking for a portable rig and would prefer not to carry an amp with me.
> 
> Seems the RE0 seems an amp to meet the quality of sound I need(neutral and not warm). And only the mini3 would get me these and it's DIY
> 
> ...


 

 The RE0 doesn't do so bad without an amp. There's always the Ety HF5 at ~$100 and the R-50 is really not warm - I don't see how anyone would complain about it being _too_ warm.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Have there been any definitive reviews of the Brainwavz M3?  They look really good but I'm really pushing my budget at $90.  Astrotec AM-90 are more in my budget, but they don't look comfortable.  Deep ear insertion isn't working for me and I don't like too heavy bass.  My Shure SE215's sound fantastic but I can't wear them for more than a couple of hours without an earache (too heavy, too deep, I guess)
   
  Joker, thanks for your advice and patience with all us newbies!  I really like this hobby but like a lot of us, I'm budget constrained and hate making the wrong decision!
   
  JJ


----------



## JamesB123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


>


 
  Sorry to bug 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





; is it worth getting Comply tips with the Soundmagic E10s?
   
  And if so, the T400s (isolation), rather than the TS400s (comfort)?
   
  And are the TX (isolation/comfort plus) worth the extra £5?
   
  And if not, are there any other replacement tips worth getting?


----------



## scootsit

Joker, I still have the mh1c waiting for you, you said you weren't ready for them


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> which is bassier?


 

 she 3590 . goes deep too .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





jamesb123 said:


> Sorry to bug
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
          i use sony hybrids . they are just fine .


----------



## Amitl

hi!
  a few questions for you helpful guys... 
  i read in a Vsonic gro06 review that an impedance adapter + a little Fiio
  would do good things to the earphones mentioned.
  so first of all...what is an impedance adapter..? i didnt find anything that made sense..
  and why would you need it if using an amp like Fiio?
  and if using it + the amp, so basically the adapter connects
  to the phone, then the adapter connects to the amp, *then* to the earphones?
  also, would this adapter improve the sound of most IEM's?
  and what about an amp?
  thanks


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

ljokerl, what iems do you suggest for both gym and running? I want something that dont fall off and got good audio quality.

 Apple controls will be a great welcome as well but not totally needed. iSport is $60(great discount), wondering if thats worth it or just get something cheaper. Thanks!

 Oh and my vPulse Ill be sending to Velodyne soon(10 months old, starting to die), glad they are easy to contact with when it comes to warranty.


----------



## tomasskalnin

johnny jumper said:


> Have there been any definitive reviews of the Brainwavz M3?  They look really good but I'm really pushing my budget at $90.  Astrotec AM-90 are more in my budget, but they don't look comfortable.  Deep ear insertion isn't working for me and I don't like too heavy bass.  My Shure SE215's sound fantastic but I can't wear them for more than a couple of hours without an earache (too heavy, too deep, I guess)
> 
> Joker, thanks for your advice and patience with all us newbies!  I really like this hobby but like a lot of us, I'm budget constrained and hate making the wrong decision!
> 
> JJ




M3 isnt worth to buy. I strongly suggest Sony MH1-C. Sound signature is like on se215, only more detail and refinement.


----------



## NoGood

Ok I've finally made my decision. It's gonna be the Rockit R-50 and clip+ along with a 32GB card(not sure if clip+ supports 64gb) but i guess it should be enough to accomodate some of my FLAC albums. I intend to rockbox it 
   
  Btw any idea about the synergy of the clip+ with the R50? Or would a fuze/zip be better? I'm quite sure the sound signaure will fit me, being a neutral/analytical guy and my genres being rock, metal, classic.... Also I wear spectacles, will the memory cable intefere with the legs of my spectacles?


----------



## ktan3142

Quote: 





nogood said:


> Ok I've finally made my decision. It's gonna be the Rockit R-50 and clip+ along with a 32GB card(not sure if clip+ supports 64gb) but i guess it should be enough to accomodate some of my FLAC albums. I intend to rockbox it
> 
> Btw any idea about the synergy of the clip+ with the R50? Or would a fuze/zip be better? I'm quite sure the sound signaure will fit me, being a neutral/analytical guy and my genres being rock, metal, classic.... Also I wear spectacles, will the memory cable intefere with the legs of my spectacles?


 
   
  I don't know about the sound signature differences between the zip/clip(+)/fuze, but my RE-ZERO and Ety HF3 sounds really good with the clip+. Since these two are balanced/analytical, I figured this would help with your decision. However, I feel that the RE-262 is missing something when I use my clip+ though...


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





amitl said:


> hi!
> a few questions for you helpful guys...
> i read in a Vsonic gro06 review that an impedance adapter + a little Fiio
> would do good things to the earphones mentioned.
> ...


 
   
  It will not improve the sound of GR06, which have flat impedance curve. This applies to certain balanced armature IEMs with their impedance changing wildly depending on frequency.
  Amplification will not help GR06 much, they're very easy to drive. Unless your source is full of crud, in which case a buffer might slightly clean it up.
   
  Quote: 





nogood said:


> Damn, now I'm confused after reading some more reviews. I heard the RE0(currently $49) at head direct is quite similar to the ETY ER4S($250). But I'm looking for a portable rig and would prefer not to carry an amp with me.
> 
> Seems the RE0 seems an amp to meet the quality of sound I need(neutral and not warm). And only the mini3 would get me these and it's DIY
> 
> ...


 
   
  Is it too quiet with Clip+? If not, then it's not underpowered. Granted, RE0 will strain some portable sources to the maximum capabilities.
   
  I'd be loathe to recommend HM601 for anything, it is a flawed amp with major high end rolloff. It will destroy its airiness quality.
   
  Brainwavz B2 is a direct equivalent of DBA-02 mkI. These do not sound that similar to RE0, but they're closer to ER4S... except that huge 4kHz peak.
  There's also DBA-02 mkII, which has more bass, but dirtier. Neither of those matches RE0 quality actually to my ears - which only has "grainy" problems due to uneven signature, correctable with eq, and a slight bass drop. (which RE-ZERO lacks)
  GR07 is indeed 3 dB too warm, but smoother. Unfortunately, it has major solitary 6.5kHz ringing, adds an annoying rough quality to the sound.
   
  It's a hard task trying to find something that doesn't have ringing and sounds as neutral as ER4S or HF5, and doesn't lack bass impact. Even harder if it's to be inexpensive.


----------



## Jozurr

Don't you think the mids are more forward on the CAL which are much more similar to the M1s?
   
   


> From mp4nation - Brainwavz M2.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Have there been any definitive reviews of the Brainwavz M3?  They look really good but I'm really pushing my budget at $90.  Astrotec AM-90 are more in my budget, but they don't look comfortable.  Deep ear insertion isn't working for me and I don't like too heavy bass.  My Shure SE215's sound fantastic but I can't wear them for more than a couple of hours without an earache (too heavy, too deep, I guess)
> 
> Joker, thanks for your advice and patience with all us newbies!  I really like this hobby but like a lot of us, I'm budget constrained and hate making the wrong decision!
> 
> JJ


 
   
  I don't know what a definitive review is but I tried the M3 a while back. I did like the sound a lot but not so much the fit and wasn't sold on the overall value over the M1/M2.
   
  The AM-90 is not bass heavy and if you don't like its fit there's always the similar-sounding Rock-It R-20 and MEElec A151 at similar prices (at least here in the US).
   
  Quote: 





jamesb123 said:


> Sorry to bug
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I don't think the Tx does anything for isolation or comfort over the regular T and I'm not a huge fan of the spherical shape of the TS series. Honestly, I wouldn't bother with pricy foam tips for the E10 unless the stock silicone ones don't work for you.
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Joker, I still have the mh1c waiting for you, you said you weren't ready for them


 
   
  Last I remember you'd started enjoying them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. How is that going?
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> hi!
> a few questions for you helpful guys...
> i read in a Vsonic gro06 review that an impedance adapter + a little Fiio
> would do good things to the earphones mentioned.
> ...


 
   
  Impedance - see AstralStorm's reply above. Most dynamics don't benefit from added impedance per se unless there are other factors in play. Balanced armatures are a different story, though. You can get the adapters for $18-25 on ebay. Just looks for "Ety P to S adapter" or something to that effect. The adapter would go on the earphone cable, no between the amp and source. 
   
  Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> ljokerl, what iems do you suggest for both gym and running? I want something that dont fall off and got good audio quality.
> 
> Apple controls will be a great welcome as well but not totally needed. iSport is $60(great discount), wondering if thats worth it or just get something cheaper. Thanks!
> 
> Oh and my vPulse Ill be sending to Velodyne soon(10 months old, starting to die), glad they are easy to contact with when it comes to warranty.


 
   
  I haven't tried a whole lot of sweat-rated IEMs. I would say get something disposable and toss it when it goes bad. Never heard the iSport or any of the Senn sports sets. 
   
  Quote: 





nogood said:


> Ok I've finally made my decision. It's gonna be the Rockit R-50 and clip+ along with a 32GB card(not sure if clip+ supports 64gb) but i guess it should be enough to accomodate some of my FLAC albums. I intend to rockbox it
> 
> Btw any idea about the synergy of the clip+ with the R50? Or would a fuze/zip be better? I'm quite sure the sound signaure will fit me, being a neutral/analytical guy and my genres being rock, metal, classic.... Also I wear spectacles, will the memory cable intefere with the legs of my spectacles?


 
   
  The Clip+ will be fine. I wear glasses on occasion and I've not had issues with any memory wire except for that used by Sony, which doesn't have that much memory and keeps getting in the way. 
   
  Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> It will not improve the sound of GR06, which have flat impedance curve. This applies to certain balanced armature IEMs with their impedance changing wildly depending on frequency.
> Amplification will not help GR06 much, they're very easy to drive. Unless your source is full of crud, in which case a buffer might slightly clean it up.


 
   
  Exactly this. I would go so far as to say most dynamics have flat impedance curves and don't benefit from added inline resistance.


----------



## JamesB123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think the Tx does anything for isolation or comfort over the regular T and I'm not a huge fan of the spherical shape of the TS series. Honestly, I wouldn't bother with pricy foam tips for the E10 unless the stock silicone ones don't work for you.


 
  I'm glad you said that; my debit card has taken a hammering the last few days.
   
  Thanks for the help.


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Hello mr. Joker - I am looking at getting some phones around the $150 range (maybe 2 sets, 1 for critical listening and 1 for pure fun). I am definitely a rock and roll guy with some pop and techno thrown in and like a v shape signature (own gr02 be, mtpg, x10, re0, mh1c) and gr02 be is currently my favorite set. Good bass with punch is a must and some sub bass (car stereo has 2 sealed 10s for punch) but most of the sets I have now do not have the very detailed highs (I like them crisp), better instrument separation and wider soundstage. IEMs on my short list right now are eph100, ba200 ( I know you have not reviewed them yet), gr07 be, t Peos h100, pfe112, re-262. Please let me know your thoughts.


----------



## ChristmaSFnatic

Many thanks Mr. J, as usual.

 Now lets go destroy Batbrain!


----------



## rDomingues

Hello Joker! Before anything, I have to say it: impressive job you did there, congratulations! I like to believe that you actually liked doing it, but still, it surely took some hard work, so thank you!
   
   
  Now I shall request your help 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. After some research, Audio Fischer DBA-02 MKII seemed to match what I was looking for, at an afordable price range, in fact,_ _I was just waiting for it to come back to stock in topdogheadphones.
   
  But today another IEM catched my eye: Musical Fidelity EB-50. Besides being single armature, it seems to be a nice IEM (at least all the reviews I saw are positive) with a pricing similar to DBA-02 MKII.
   
  From what I've read (my experience is somewhat limited), they seem to have similar signatures, but I don't really know how different are they. Any word on the EB-50?


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> Hello mr. Joker - I am looking at getting some phones around the $150 range (maybe 2 sets, 1 for critical listening and 1 for pure fun). I am definitely a rock and roll guy with some pop and techno thrown in and like a v shape signature (own gr02 be, mtpg, x10, re0, mh1c) and gr02 be is currently my favorite set. Good bass with punch is a must and some sub bass (car stereo has 2 sealed 10s for punch) but most of the sets I have now do not have the very detailed highs (I like them crisp), better instrument separation and wider soundstage. IEMs on my short list right now are eph100, ba200 ( I know you have not reviewed them yet), gr07 be, t Peos h100, pfe112, re-262. Please let me know your thoughts.


 
   
         may you consider the triple fi 10 , you should get what you asking for . but may be priced over your budget .


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Yep too spendy and I do not like the egonomics.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jamesb123 said:


> Thanks for the help.


 
   
  Quote: 





christmasfnatic said:


> Many thanks Mr. J, as usual.
> 
> Now lets go destroy Batbrain!


 




   
  Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> Hello mr. Joker - I am looking at getting some phones around the $150 range (maybe 2 sets, 1 for critical listening and 1 for pure fun). I am definitely a rock and roll guy with some pop and techno thrown in and like a v shape signature (own gr02 be, mtpg, x10, re0, mh1c) and gr02 be is currently my favorite set. Good bass with punch is a must and some sub bass (car stereo has 2 sealed 10s for punch) but most of the sets I have now do not have the very detailed highs (I like them crisp), better instrument separation and wider soundstage. IEMs on my short list right now are eph100, ba200 ( I know you have not reviewed them yet), gr07 be, t Peos h100, pfe112, re-262. Please let me know your thoughts.


 
   
  I haven't heard the T-Peos either. The PFE112 and RE262 are almost guaranteed not to have the bass you are looking for. The EPH-100 is more like it but it's not too v-shaped. The JVC FXT90 is more so in my opinion. I have a less popular suggestion - the older JVC FX500. It's got very natural bass with little mid-bass bloat and crisp, sharp highs. If you can find one and don't mind the poor isolation, it would be a better match for the GR02's signature than the EPH-100 or FXT90. 
   
  Quote: 





rdomingues said:


> Hello Joker! Before anything, I have to say it: impressive job you did there, congratulations! I like to believe that you actually liked doing it, but still, it surely took some hard work, so thank you!
> 
> 
> Now I shall request your help
> ...


 

 I have not heard the EB-50 but as far as I can tell it uses a Knowles SR armature and may very well be manufactured by Dunu/Topsound. I would be very surprised if it's serious competition for the DBA-02 mkII but stranger things have happened.


----------



## christobit

Hi Joker,
   
  Interested to hear your views on comparison of the bass of DBA-O2 Mk2 vs RE-271.  I know that you prefer the mids and highs of the RE-271 and I am tempted in tha direction, as I need another iem.  However, not sure about the bass quantity on the 271.  I like the bass on the DBA, its quantity is enough for me, and I like the punch and the quality.  How do you rate the 271 against it.  Many thanks..


----------



## rDomingues

I guess I'll stick to the DBA-02 then. Thanks for your help!


----------



## MetalLaserSteel

Thanks for putting this all together, this info is appreciated. I spent hours reading this stuff recently, ha time flies for a newbie.
   
  One way of organizing it I was curious about, has this ever been arranged by sound quality/price? Like a list organized twice, first by price then by sound rating, so you can see what has the best sound rating for the price range you're comfortable with.
   
  Since pretty much what I've been doing is cutting and pasting names of ones I'm interested in or seen on amazon in my price range, then seeing what the sound rating and review is. I recently ordered some, but it's possible there are some with great sound in my range I've missed so far. Anybody know? Thanks.
   
  Anyways, based on these reviews I recently got the Brainwavz M5, Astrotec AM-90, and ME CW31. These got 7.6, 7.4, and 6.9 sound rating, and I got them for about $40, $45, and $25 for the CW21. Also got the Monoprice 8320 which I haven't tried yet, with 7.5 rating. My previous favs have been the Brainwavz Beta ones, which I always got on excellent sales for 13 bucks., rated 6.7 here.
   
  I dig your reviews, they're informative and straight-shooting etc. A question on sound, how much of a difference would you say there is between a 7, 7.5, and an 8? Then from that to 8.5 etc? How notable, and how worth the price, though that's pretty subjective true. I've never spent more than 50 bucks on earphones, usually a lot less than that. Since they always die on me after less than a couple years, it's hard to justify spending a lot. But I am curious to hear some higher quality to compare.
   
  So, I guess a long story short, what are some that have the highest sound quality available for the lowest price? I notice for example the VSonic GR-06 has an 8.1, higher than anything I've heard, but for 70 bucks how much better is that than a 7.6? Anything else with around an 8 with a lower price than that, etc? Thanks again for all the great info.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Interested to hear your views on comparison of the bass of DBA-O2 Mk2 vs RE-271.  I know that you prefer the mids and highs of the RE-271 and I am tempted in tha direction, as I need another iem.  However, not sure about the bass quantity on the 271.  I like the bass on the DBA, its quantity is enough for me, and I like the punch and the quality.  How do you rate the 271 against it.  Many thanks..


 
   
  The overall bass quantity is somewhat similar but the bass is presented differently - the RE272 generally sounds slightly softer and fuller of note. Its bass is not as punchy as that of the mkII but it decays more naturally. The mkII is punchy and quick, as is the case with most TWFK-based earphones, and that immediacy is what's lacking in the 272. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





metallasersteel said:


> Thanks for putting this all together, this info is appreciated. I spent hours reading this stuff recently, ha time flies for a newbie.
> 
> One way of organizing it I was curious about, has this ever been arranged by sound quality/price? Like a list organized twice, first by price then by sound rating, so you can see what has the best sound rating for the price range you're comfortable with.
> 
> ...


 
   
  You can play with the google doc to get a better feel for the numbers. Not sure if sorting by multiple criteria is allowed but you can always copy/paste the data into excel and use the sorting feature. 
   
  Regarding the numbers - they are not meant to tell you how much better something is, only to organize things one after the other. Obviously I do think a GR06 sounds better than a CW31 but there would be important factors such as your personal affinity for their sound signatures to pay attention to as well. The Brainwavz Beta, for example, is somewhat v-shaped in sound so you won't necessarily like the more mid-centric AM-90 better. 
   
  As for overall value for money, I feel that there are sweet spots all over the sub-$200 range. There is always something that performs a little better so if you're flexible and know what you're after, it may not be a bad idea to avoid 'what ifs' by splurging on one set. Otherwise setting a hard budget is probably the way to go.


----------



## alterndog

Hey |Joker|,
   
  I'm mainly writing to say thank you very much for the reviews. They have definitely helped me along the way. Just got the RE-262 today ($99!!) and am loving Paul Simon's Graceland on them from my computer. Unfortunately from my 4S/E5 amp they don't sound as good. I know the 262's need more power then normal and was wondering if the E11 would be a good amp to pair with them and the 4s? Budget is $60 minus. Thanks!


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Hi ljokerl,
   
  I am looking for a custom which can compliment the custom JH16 Pro Freqphase or Rooth LS8+, because I wish to be listening for a similar sound signature on the go without attracting attention. Here's a bit more info on what I'm looking for:
   
*[size=10pt]-Usage:[/size]*[size=10pt] I will be using these for a long time, so I hope they can last a while. I will be using them on the go, so I don't want them to be too "flashy" or attracting attention. I also want it easily driven by lightweight, portable sources (no amp). I also use them for performing (I play alto sax in concert and marching band). When not on the go I often watch videos, play video games, watch movies, call and conference, and play audio related media on my computer. Sometimes I sleep with them on.[/size]*[size=10pt] [/size]*
   
*[size=10pt]-Song Genres:[/size]*[size=10pt] I listen to pop and DJ (popular songs), rap, electronic (trance, techno, house, synth pop), soundtracks and instrumental, jazz, classical, song remixes and parodies, and rock most often. Majority of my songs are modern (2000 and newer), but I do listen to jazz and classical music and sometimes poorly recorded songs/audio.[/size]*[size=10pt] [/size]*
   
*[size=10pt]-Bass: [/size]*[size=10pt]The majority of the music I listen to is bass inclined, so I enjoy listening to bass that is good quality and a fair amount of quantity, but I do want a bit of mid-bass over low-bass (not too much though).[/size]*[size=10pt] [/size]*
   
*[size=10pt]-Mids: [/size]*[size=10pt]As for the mids, vocals and instruments also play a large role in my music selection. I'm looking for smooth, lush, clear, detailed, and imaging mids. I do not want the mids to be laid back or forward but presented more naturally.[/size]*[size=10pt] [/size]*
   
*[size=10pt]-Treble: [/size]*[size=10pt]For treble, I like a smooth, crisp, and sparkly presentation with good clarity, but not extended treble to the point it becomes fatiguing or creating treble spikes. [/size]
   
*[size=10pt]-Presentation: [/size]*[size=10pt]I wish for the overall presentation to be clear, detailed, natural, realistic, 3D and imaging, punchy, transparent, balanced, and have a wide soundstage. However, most importantly, I would like it to be musically fun to listen to and to "be true to the recording".[/size]
   
Thanks!


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> I am looking for a custom which can compliment the custom JH16 Pro Freqphase or Rooth LS8+, because I wish to be listening for a similar sound signature on the go without attracting attention. Here's a bit more info on what I'm looking for:


 
   
  What happened to the super-duper-awesometasticsauce Translucent 1Plus2?


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> What happened to the super-duper-awesometasticsauce Translucent 1Plus2?


 
   
  I thought it was too risky to bring out in public, its 1400 D:


----------



## MetalLaserSteel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You can play with the google doc to get a better feel for the numbers. Not sure if sorting by multiple criteria is allowed but you can always copy/paste the data into excel and use the sorting feature.
> 
> Regarding the numbers - they are not meant to tell you how much better something is, only to organize things one after the other. Obviously I do think a GR06 sounds better than a CW31 but there would be important factors such as your personal affinity for their sound signatures to pay attention to as well. The Brainwavz Beta, for example, is somewhat v-shaped in sound so you won't necessarily like the more mid-centric AM-90 better.
> 
> As for overall value for money, I feel that there are sweet spots all over the sub-$200 range. There is always something that performs a little better so if you're flexible and know what you're after, it may not be a bad idea to avoid 'what ifs' by splurging on one set. Otherwise setting a hard budget is probably the way to go.


 
  Right on. I don't have Excel and when clicking on say the "I" cost column in google docs I'm not seeing how to sort it by price. But thanks anyway, good info.
   
  I dig the Beta, and I have liked V-shaped, but I'm thinking more clarity and also less listening fatigue may be a good thing.


----------



## zerocoolhifi

It's an overpriced MH1C - sorry couldn't resist.


----------



## MetalLaserSteel

Ha, oh actually I just noticed changing it from "normal" view to "list" view lets me sort it, cool.


----------



## christobit

Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Interested to hear your views on comparison of the bass of DBA-O2 Mk2 vs RE-271. I know that you prefer the mids and highs of the RE-271 and I am tempted in tha direction, as I need another iem. However, not sure about the bass quantity on the 271. I like the bass on the DBA, its quantity is enough for me, and I like the punch and the quality. How do you rate the 271 against it. Many thanks..


 
   
  The overall bass quantity is somewhat similar but the bass is presented differently - the RE272 generally sounds slightly softer and fuller of note. Its bass is not as punchy as that of the mkII but it decays more naturally. The mkII is punchy and quick, as is the case with most TWFK-based earphones, and that immediacy is what's lacking in the 272.
   
  Thank you Joker.  Another one..how do you compare the GR-01 against both the above.  Thanks


----------



## Niyologist

You guys are gonna be awe struck about the CES for Meelec today. Lovin' the new models of IEMs/OEMs they have. I'll post them later today. 
   
  I'll post other companies new releases such as Beyerdynamic, Ultrasone, Sony and Sennheiser.


----------



## Impulse

MEElec's expansion has been very interesting to watch.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alterndog said:


> Hey |Joker|,
> 
> I'm mainly writing to say thank you very much for the reviews. They have definitely helped me along the way. Just got the RE-262 today ($99!!) and am loving Paul Simon's Graceland on them from my computer. Unfortunately from my 4S/E5 amp they don't sound as good. I know the 262's need more power then normal and was wondering if the E11 would be a good amp to pair with them and the 4s? Budget is $60 minus. Thanks!


 
   
  I'm not an iPhone user so I can't comment on how anything pairs with it - you may be better off asking in the RE262 thread. $99 for the earphones is a great deal, though.
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> I am looking for a custom which can compliment the custom JH16 Pro Freqphase or Rooth LS8+, because I wish to be listening for a similar sound signature on the go without attracting attention. Here's a bit more info on what I'm looking for:
> 
> ...


 
   
  I can't suggest a compliment to two earphones I've never heard, especially considering I only have one custom in that price range. Also, unless you had your customs coated with gold and diamonds, I don't see how another will attract less attention. All of my customs are plain and I've never been bothered by anyone when they are in my ears 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
  Quote: 





christobit said:


> Thank you Joker.  Another one..how do you compare the GR-01 against both the above.  Thanks


 

 The GR01 is pretty similar to the mkII, a little less mid-bass punch and not as short decay but still very close.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I can't suggest a compliment to two earphones I've never heard, especially considering I only have one custom in that price range. Also, unless you had your customs coated with gold and diamonds, I don't see how another will attract less attention. All of my customs are plain and I've never been bothered by anyone when they are in my ears


 
   
  I meant a universal model. Can you name a universal model (or a few) that matches my requirements? Thanks!


----------



## Niyologist

The M-Duo Dual Dynamic Earphones, EDM Universe Full Size Headphones, X6 Bluetooth Headphones and Air-Fi RUNAWAY Bluetooth Headphones were all announced today from Meelectronics.


----------



## Niyologist

From Meelectronics on FB:
   
  M-Duo Dual Dynamic Driver Earphones:
 It has two dynamic drivers - a 9mm woofer and a 5mm midrange/tweeter - and a crossover like you would find on a multi-armature earphone.


----------



## Niyologist

Also there's the EDM Universe Earphones.


----------



## Niyologist

Here's a link: 
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/578118/meelectronics-appreciation-fan-thread/270#post_9033940
   
  Enjoy!


----------



## ACST

Joker, have you already heard the Astrotec AX7 and/or in the same price range the T-Peos H-100
  and if so what do you think of them in comparison to the vsonic GR07 and the Rockit R-50.
  Also are you planning a review of the Astrotec and/or the T-Peos?


----------



## JK1

Joker, how about reviewing the Panasonic RP-HJE355 IEM? I was just comparing it again to the JVC HA-FX40. Both are around $20. Imo the RP-HJE355 has a much better midrange, and more natural sound overall. The RP-HJE355 seems to be ignored by many, however imo it is an even better value than the JVC HA-FX40.
   
http://www.head-fi.org/t/622091/review-of-soundmagic-es10-es18-creative-ep600-cowon-ce1-jbl-tempo-in-ear-review-of-philips-she-3590-feat-the-she-3580-rp-hj3-120-and-panasonic-rp-hje355-and-more


----------



## zerocoolhifi

I believe I have decided on my $150 ish Dynamic headphone (GR07 BE) but would like some opinions on my flagship (at least for me) BA. Looking to spend at most $350 and am currently considering the DBA-02, BA200 and SM3. For those that don't already know I am a rock and roll junkie (80 hair bands, Metal (but mine are like megadeath etc.) and current rock like Buckcherry, Seather, Theory of a dead man, The Pretty reckless etc. Bass lite is not my thing but slabby subs are not me either. Like my bass deep and punchy, mids are lush but detailed and crisp highs. no veil on the vocals and upper range. Wide sound stage but recessed is not one of the things I like. Don't worry about suggesting something that might be little light on the Bass becuase my GR07 BE will probably fit the bill when the need hits. Thanks in advance - man this is fun.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> I meant a universal model. Can you name a universal model (or a few) that matches my requirements? Thanks!


 
   
  Those are not really requirements, more of a laundry list of desirable traits. I'm sure that none of the universals I've heard hit all of those. The K3003 may be the closes match minus the lush mids and some potential for listening fatigue. 
   
  Quote: 





acst said:


> Joker, have you already heard the Astrotec AX7 and/or in the same price range the T-Peos H-100
> and if so what do you think of them in comparison to the vsonic GR07 and the Rockit R-50.
> Also are you planning a review of the Astrotec and/or the T-Peos?


 
   
  I haven't heard either of those and have no plans to at this time.
   
  Quote: 





jk1 said:


> Joker, how about reviewing the Panasonic RP-HJE355 IEM? I was just comparing it again to the JVC HA-FX40. Both are around $20. Imo the RP-HJE355 has a much better midrange, and more natural sound overall. The RP-HJE355 seems to be ignored by many, however imo it is an even better value than the JVC HA-FX40.
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/622091/review-of-soundmagic-es10-es18-creative-ep600-cowon-ce1-jbl-tempo-in-ear-review-of-philips-she-3590-feat-the-she-3580-rp-hj3-120-and-panasonic-rp-hje355-and-more


 
   
  I believe this has been asked before. I have no plans to review these at this time. 
   
  Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> I believe I have decided on my $150 ish Dynamic headphone (GR07 BE) but would like some opinions on my flagship (at least for me) BA. Looking to spend at most $350 and am currently considering the DBA-02, BA200 and SM3. For those that don't already know I am a rock and roll junkie (80 hair bands, Metal (but mine are like megadeath etc.) and current rock like Buckcherry, Seather, Theory of a dead man, The Pretty reckless etc. Bass lite is not my thing but slabby subs are not me either. Like my bass deep and punchy, mids are lush but detailed and crisp highs. no veil on the vocals and upper range. Wide sound stage but recessed is not one of the things I like. Don't worry about suggesting something that might be little light on the Bass becuase my GR07 BE will probably fit the bill when the need hits. Thanks in advance - man this is fun.


 
   
  I would try that GR07 first - you may be surprised by how competitive it is with higher-end products. Trying the GR07 will also give you a better idea of what you are looking for in your ideal earphone as the SM3 and DBA-02, both of which you are considering, don't sound anything alike.


----------



## bojuju

New here.
   
  Is there a queue in which IEMs are reviewed? I would really love if someone can review the Klipsch Image X7 / X7i. I bought a pair for $99 (retails $150+ normally?) here in Canada. It was the lowest price anywhere I could find.
   
  They sound great but I would love to see where they stand compared to other IEMs. 
   
  Here's the product link: http://www.futureshop.ca/en-CA/product/klipsch-klipsch-image-x7i-in-ear-headphones-black-imagex7ib/10218496.aspx?path=2fa5cb823051c1bc0289be5f378ec163en02


----------



## christobit

Hi Joker, have you reviewed the RE-400 yet?  Went to Head direct to buy a RE-272 and found they have stopped production.  They refered me to the Re-400.  It is available at $99, half the price of the discounted RE-272 still available at Amazon!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bojuju said:


> New here.
> 
> Is there a queue in which IEMs are reviewed? I would really love if someone can review the Klipsch Image X7 / X7i. I bought a pair for $99 (retails $150+ normally?) here in Canada. It was the lowest price anywhere I could find.
> 
> ...


 
   
  My personal queue is on the front page of this thread, below the table. I need to update it, actually.
   
  I have no plans to try the X7 at this time.
   
  Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker, have you reviewed the RE-400 yet?  Went to Head direct to buy a RE-272 and found they have stopped production.  They refered me to the Re-400.  It is available at $99, half the price of the discounted RE-272 still available at Amazon!


 

 Yes I've heard the same from someone who tried to buy an RE262. Unfortunately I haven't heard any of the new HiFiMan releases yet.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





jk1 said:


> Joker, how about reviewing the Panasonic RP-HJE355 IEM? I was just comparing it again to the JVC HA-FX40. Both are around $20. Imo the RP-HJE355 has a much better midrange, and more natural sound overall. The RP-HJE355 seems to be ignored by many, however imo it is an even better value than the JVC HA-FX40.
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/622091/review-of-soundmagic-es10-es18-creative-ep600-cowon-ce1-jbl-tempo-in-ear-review-of-philips-she-3590-feat-the-she-3580-rp-hj3-120-and-panasonic-rp-hje355-and-more


 
   
          the only complain is , the speed .


----------



## Mini0510

joker, how does PFE 232 compare to AKG K3003 in other areas except bass? mainly sound quality wise
  and I'm only going to use these IEMs on portable device.


----------



## sanakaku

I still refer this as to my reference when, purchasing a new IEM. very very thankful and great addition to the community!


----------



## speller26

Thank you so much for taking the time to make this!
   
  Do you have plans for the Sennheiser IE 800 and IE 80, FitEar ToGo! 111 and universals from Heir Audio? Oh, and what about customs from JH Audio, Ultimate Ears, Westone, and Heir Audio?
   
  Sorry if I'm asking too much (^^). I greatly appreciate your work!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> joker, how does PFE 232 compare to AKG K3003 in other areas except bass? mainly sound quality wise
> and I'm only going to use these IEMs on portable device.


 
   
  I believe this has been asked before. The PFE 232 has similar resolution and detail but the K3003 is perhaps a little more transparent in the midrange. The K3003 also has better soundstage depth and layering and is more airy and open-sounding. It also has more even treble with slightly better extension and is slightly less prone to harshness/sibilance. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





sanakaku said:


> I still refer this as to my reference when, purchasing a new IEM. very very thankful and great addition to the community!


 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
   
  Quote: 





speller26 said:


> Thank you so much for taking the time to make this!
> 
> Do you have plans for the Sennheiser IE 800 and IE 80, FitEar ToGo! 111 and universals from Heir Audio?


 
   
  Not at this time
   
   
  Quote: 





speller26 said:


> Oh, and what about customs from JH Audio, Ultimate Ears, Westone, and Heir Audio?
> 
> Sorry if I'm asking too much ^^ I greatly appreciate your work!


 
   
  Likely, except for UE.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I believe this has been asked before. The PFE 232 has similar resolution and detail but the K3003 is perhaps a little more transparent in the midrange. The K3003 also has better soundstage depth and layering and is more airy and open-sounding. It also has more even treble with slightly better extension and is slightly less prone to harshness/sibilance.


 
   
  So basically not that much difference? and definitely not much difference from a portable device like ipod?
  Although my tracks are mostly 320 kbps aac and some 320 kbps mp3


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> So basically not that much difference? and definitely not much difference from a portable device like ipod?
> Although my tracks are mostly 320 kbps aac and some 320 kbps mp3


 

 I didn't say that. I think the difference is very noticeable, just maybe not worth $700 for the average listener.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Hello ljokerl,
   
  Do you know any IEM with a sound signature similar to the TF10, but cleaner, clearer, more detailed, better imaging, better soundstage, and less veiled? Thanks!


----------



## Selenium

FX700. I'd have to A/B to say for certain if the mids are more forward though.


----------



## Zelda

Joker
  how is the mids and vocals presented on the she3580 compared to the Xcited? i found the xcited´s very distant and thin/cold, more than the RE0


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Hello ljokerl,
> 
> Do you know any IEM with a sound signature similar to the TF10, but cleaner, clearer, more detailed, better imaging, better soundstage, and less veiled? Thanks!


 
   
  If by similar you mean somewhat v-shaped, the FX700 is a good choice. The PFE232 is another option. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> Joker
> how is the mids and vocals presented on the she3580 compared to the Xcited? i found the xcited´s very distant and thin/cold, more than the RE0


 

 The Xcited is a very laid-back/distant earphone. The SHE3580 is not - it's pretty average in that regard. It also has quite a bit more bass for a warmer tone. So, no similarities to the Xcited.


----------



## Harijs

UE 10 review still in progress. And I'm still patiently waiting.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Quote: 





harijs said:


> UE 10 review still in progress. And I'm still patiently waiting.


 
   
  UE700 and UE TF10 reviews still in progress. And I'm also patiently waiting


----------



## kova4a

LOL I can't believe people are sill waiting for that mythical tf10 review. I don't think it will ever see the light of day honestly. Anyway, if it ever does then based on joker's reviews and his taste I'll hive to make a wild guess that the tf10 will get something like 8.8 tops and that's if it's lucky 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## TheGame21x

I think people were bugging Joker to post the TF10 review back when I joined, and that was early 2010!


----------



## ljokerl

Ah, the TF10 review. My favorite topic...


----------



## H20Fidelity

My theory is I don't think he likes TF10.  So if he was to review it and give a honest low score he would be burnt at the steak by TF10 fanboy's who would then question his credibility. That's the theory I've conjured up over time.


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> LOL I can't believe people are sill waiting for that mythical tf10 review. I don't think it will ever see the light of day honestly. Anyway, if it ever does then based on joker's reviews and his taste I'll hive to make a wild guess that the tf10 will get something like 8.8 tops and that's if it's lucky
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I think he'd give the TF10 more like a 9, I mean it is better than the Turbine Copper and the MG7 which both got 8.8 but that really doesn't mean much.


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> My theory is I don't think he likes TF10.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The TF10 isn't a bad IEM, I mean its not the best 3 BA anymore but I still think its a decent IEM.


----------



## H20Fidelity

techno kid said:


> The TF10 isn't a bad IEM, I mean its not the best 3 BA anymore but I still think its a decent IEM.




I really enjoyed it, I guess because it was my first reachable triple armature IEM also the first BA I'd ever tried. But there's better out there now, it will never die though, the troops are strong!


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> I really enjoyed it, I guess because it was my first reachable triple armature IEM also the first BA I'd ever tried. But there's better out there now, it will never die though, the troops are strong!


 
   
  Yeah it was one of my first good IEM's and my first triple BA but its just past its prime next to sets like the SM3 and UM3X.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





techno kid said:


> I think he'd give the TF10 more like a 9, I mean it is better than the Turbine Copper and the MG7 which both got 8.8 but that really doesn't mean much.


 
  That's debatable but ok, Iet's say 8.9 tops and I'm willing to put money on that. Anyway, this thread doesn't need more tf10 talk - joker will probably never post that legendary review that has been in the making forever.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ah, the TF10 review. My favorite topic...


 

 Only one way to put a stop to it once and for all!


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ah, the TF10 review. My favorite topic...


 
   
        man you are a teaser .


----------



## suman134

may be he is waiting for the tf10 to get discontinued .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> I really enjoyed it, I guess because it was my first reachable triple armature IEM also the first BA I'd ever tried. But there's better out there now, it will never die though, the troops are strong!


 
   
        cheap triple BAs like xba-3 cant take on tf10 man , tf10 is tf10 , once a fan ,  always a fan .


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> may be he is waiting for the tf10 to get discontinued .


 
  it already is. Unless that was meant tongue in cheek


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





themarkremains said:


> it already is. Unless that was meant tongue in cheek


 
   
          still rolling here , for $220 . and i was to buy one , but gave up on it , for some other needs .


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Xcited is a very laid-back/distant earphone. The SHE3580 is not - it's pretty average in that regard. It also has quite a bit more bass for a warmer tone. So, no similarities to the Xcited.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> Only one way to put a stop to it once and for all!


 
   
  Clearly...


----------



## shotgunshane

Maybe your twin on amazon will review it!


----------



## Amitl

hi!
  i just read the 2 new great reviews of the Brainwavz M5 and Visang VS-K1...
  what i understand is thatthe main differences between them appear to be that the Visnag has more
  prominent mids while the Brainwavz has more prominent bass,
  while secondly the Visnag has less cable noise.
  if that is the case... why did the Brainwavz got a total value of 9.5 and the Visnag only 9?
  sorry for being naggy... i just can't decide which one i might buy 
  i already have the id America Spark but i just fell in love with all this earphones thing i just wanna buy more! 
  also.. considering i have the Sparks and Klipsch S4 and Meelec CW31...would the Astrotec M90 be a nice addition? i never heard a BA phone before...would this open something new for me considering i listen to rock/metal?
  thanks 
  it's interesting to mention that the VS-K1 doesn't appear on the Visang website


----------



## Niyologist

I'll be reviewing the Meelectronics M-Duo Dual Dynamic and the EDM Universe Headphones soon.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Clearly...


 
   
       lol man , nice one .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'll be reviewing the Meelectronics M-Duo Dual Dynamic and the EDM Universe Headphones soon.


 
   
        just let us know when you are done .


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> just let us know when you are done .


 
   
  I'll have them by the time period of release.


----------



## jrcarboleda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR07 is pretty good at sounding consistent across sources... I really doubt you'll get a lot of value out of adding an amp unless it colors the sound and moves the GR07 closer to your preferred signature. Of course it depends on your source - if you're using something subpar like a middle-of-the-road smartphone it's a different story.
> 
> That's too bad about the case... pouches are annoying.


 
  yeah.. Even though the case didn't came that good.. its still sturdier than pouches.. Although the pouch is leather and has a metal clasp.. its also kind of nice.. 

 what does subpar means?.. You also got it right.. I'm only using my Iphone4s as a source.. I don't want it to sound colored and I just want it to sound accurate.. that's my preferred signature.. I agree that it can be driven by almost all sources.. I still want to know if anything enhances what its capable of specially if I only use it on my iphone.. Again, Accuracy is my target.. By the way, with the iphone I only put it to 75% or less of the maximum volume.. It sounds too loud on my ears maybe because of its isolation.. so I also thought that an amp would rather not help..


----------



## james444

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> My theory is I don't think he likes TF10.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I have another theory that he loves the TF10 to bits, more than anything else that's ever graced his golden ears, but he's simply too lazy to re-adjust his rating scale. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  On a more serious note, belated thanks @ljokerl for the excellent ToGo 334 review, I'm expecting a loaner pair in a week or two and am really looking forward to hear these.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





james444 said:


> I have another theory that he loves the TF10 to bits, more than anything else that's ever graced his golden ears, but he's simply too lazy to re-adjust his rating scale.


 
   
         i agree , that can be the case .


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





james444 said:


> I have another theory that he loves the TF10 to bits, more than anything else that's ever graced his golden ears, but he's simply too lazy to re-adjust his rating scale.


 
   
  Or it could be the 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 of his existence.


----------



## Johnny2ears

Hi, first i would like thank you (ljokerl). This is a great compendium and help to newcomers and buyers, so cheers.
   
  Now, since this is my first post, and first entrance into this "world" i'll try to explain my self the best i can in order to obtain your help.
   
  I moved from regular earbuds, to over the ear headphones (the crappy kind ones) to finnaly a in-ear headphones. The first Headphone i eard (and comparing to earbuds)blowned me away was the apparently much hated CX 300 II. They lasted 4 years, now they RIP in my closet. So now, i'm looking for an adequate substitute. 
   
  CX 300 II, had a nice bass, yet i've always felt like in other fields it was a bit recessed, namely in mids (i suppose). The voices were kinda backgrounded and not clear at all. Now i want something with a warm signature, good bass, but not so much lacking in other areas. Initialy i was inclined to a E30, but from the review i find there are other, better alternatives. Also considered the Xears, for 43€ whatever the model, yet, none of the above are available, there are only new models, for wich i don't find any good reviews.
   
  So after stuying inumerous posts, i found yours one of the best and more complete. So i'm looking for something up to 50€ and taking account of your reviews i've reduced the list to the following:
   
   

 Brainwavz M5 7.6 30€
 
 Astrotec AM-90 7.4  42€

 
 ViSang R02 / Brainwavz ProAlpha 6.8 28€
 
 Brainwavz Beta 6.7 19,5€ MEElectronics CW31 6.7 23€ Brainwavz M3 / ViSang R04 7.756€​
   
   
  Beeing from another tear, is M3 so much different from M5? Is it worth the extra 26€?
   
   
  I had other ones, but they were kinda ruled off by reviews or prices.  
   
  Tl;DR section: Moving from Cx300 II - Wich of the above should i choose?
   
  Thanks in advance for your help. Cheers
   
   
   
  ps: i also could buy the RadioPaqJazz for 10,5€, but the review kinda sent me off, despite the really nice price.
   
  ps2: This is the final considered list, from wich i reduced to the ones above in case you're wondering
   
   

 Brainwavz M5 7.6 30€ Cyclone PR1 Pro/PR100 PR200 7.423/30€​ id America Spark 7.4 46€ Astrotec AM-90 7.4 42€ JVC HA-FX40 7.2 29€ SoundMAgic e30 7.0 40€ Brainwavz M1 7.0 29,5€ RadioPaq Jazz 6.9 10,5€ ViSang R02 / Brainwavz ProAlpha 6.8 28€ Brainwavz Beta 6.7 19,5€ MEElectronics CW31 6.7 23€ Brainwavz M3 / ViSang R04 7.756€​ MEElectronics A151 7.445€​ Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE / MMX 101 iE 7.451/70€​ ViSang R03 / Brainwavz M2 7.245€​ Pioneer SE-CLX60 7.244€​ Beyerdynamic DTX 71 iE 7.248€​ MEElectronics SP51 Sound  6.937€​


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Maybe your twin on amazon will review it!


 
   
  That would be welcome. Makes me wish I could clone myself. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> hi!
> i just read the 2 new great reviews of the Brainwavz M5 and Visang VS-K1...
> what i understand is thatthe main differences between them appear to be that the Visnag has more
> prominent mids while the Brainwavz has more prominent bass,
> ...


 
   
  Yes, that's pretty much the difference. I do think the sound of the M5 is a hair more impressive overall (as it does have a lot more bass to contend with). It's also cheaper and better-accessorized, and there's a mic/remote version, which is still pretty rare among high-value earphones. I thought I saw the K1 and K2 on ViSang's site in the new release section but I can't find the link right now.  
   
  Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> yeah.. Even though the case didn't came that good.. its still sturdier than pouches.. Although the pouch is leather and has a metal clasp.. its also kind of nice..
> 
> what does subpar means?.. You also got it right.. I'm only using my Iphone4s as a source.. I don't want it to sound colored and I just want it to sound accurate.. that's my preferred signature.. I agree that it can be driven by almost all sources.. I still want to know if anything enhances what its capable of specially if I only use it on my iphone.. Again, Accuracy is my target.. By the way, with the iphone I only put it to 75% or less of the maximum volume.. It sounds too loud on my ears maybe because of its isolation.. so I also thought that an amp would rather not help..


 
   
http://www.google.com/search?client=opera&q=define+subpar
   
  The iPhone4 is a good source, well above average. The GR07 should be fine straight out of the iPhone. 
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> I have another theory that he loves the TF10 to bits, more than anything else that's ever graced his golden ears, but he's simply too lazy to re-adjust his rating scale.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Ha, you've got me. Actually, it's looking like the scale may need re-adjusting in the future, but not for the TF10. 
   
  Surprised you haven't heard the TG334 by now. It's an interesting one, that's for sure. 
   
   
  Quote: 





johnny2ears said:


> Hi, first i would like thank you (ljokerl). This is a great compendium and help to newcomers and buyers, so cheers.
> 
> Now, since this is my first post, and first entrance into this "world" i'll try to explain my self the best i can in order to obtain your help.
> 
> ...


 

 If you want enhanced bass a-la CX300 but with better midrange presence, the Brainwavz M2 or Beyer DTX101 would be good choices. The problem with the M5 is that the mids are still a little recessed compared to the bass so it may not be exactly what you're after. The Beta is a little v-shaped as well.
   
  If you can give up a bit of bass for better overall balance, the Brainwavz M3 (if you can still find them), MEElec CW31, and Soundmagic E30 are all worth considering. The M3 is pricy compared to the others but it really doesn't have many weaknesses sonically, though I still don't like the fit.


----------



## Johnny2ears

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you want enhanced bass a-la CX300 but with better midrange presence, the Brainwavz M2 or Beyer DTX101 would be good choices. The problem with the M5 is that the mids are still a little recessed compared to the bass so it may not be exactly what you're after. The Beta is a little v-shaped as well.
> If you can give up a bit of bass for better overall balance, the Brainwavz M3 (if you can still find them), MEElec CW31, and Soundmagic E30 are all worth considering. The M3 is pricy compared to the others but it really doesn't have many weaknesses sonically, though I still don't like the fit.


 
   
  Well, i really don't mind giving some bass in order to have more detail in the other areas, thats why i'm considering these other options. All of the above i found this weekend, and the price i listed was the cheapest i could find. In tearms of audio, the cx 300 didn't work for me specially in some voice reproduction, not as much in films, but for instance in games, everything sounded really muffled.
   
  So, sorry to bother, but 2 questions really pop out for me:
   
  1- so the almost 100% price increase in the m3 (m5 beeing 30€ and M3 56€) justifies? I saw some cases where you say that in fact the difference between some moddels is negligible. This is not the case?
  2- i was under the impression from what i read here, in forum, is that the E30 is somewhat neutral ^^
   
  I don't know if its really possible or not, since i'm new at this, but i would love to experience a warm sound experience like i had with closed-headphones, doesn't have to have a overwhelming bass, i just like to hear the warmth of some artists like Bob Marley in redeption song, or a portuguese artist Jorge Palma in an acustic album with piano and guitar (http://myway.pt.msn.com/#/album/no_tempo_dos_assassinos_ao_vivo_no_teatro_villaret.aspx), but still listen to St. Anger and love it in all its might. Like i said, heard closed-headphones that didnt sound bassy, but felt warm. Sorry, its still hard for me to explain, but guess i mean something that h«falls on the low mids and lows in terms of signatures.
   
   
  Maybe you just read this and got the urge to slap me real hard for the discription, but bear with me 
   
  Agains thanks in advance.


----------



## zerocoolhifi

I would throw the GR02 Bass Edition in there...


----------



## Johnny2ears

Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> I would throw the GR02 Bass Edition in there...


 
  I couldn't find that one in europe. Don't trust in ebay buys in this cases, since i don't want to end up with a fake.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That would be welcome. Makes me wish I could clone myself.
> 
> 
> Yes, that's pretty much the difference. I do think the sound of the M5 is a hair more impressive overall (as it does have a lot more bass to contend with). It's also cheaper and better-accessorized, and there's a mic/remote version, which is still pretty rare among high-value earphones. I thought I saw the K1 and K2 on ViSang's site in the new release section but I can't find the link right now.


 
the mic version , Visang VS-K2M , is on ebay


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, have you had any chance to hear the new JVC FXZ100 or 200?
  I'm wondering if it'll be worth it to upgrade from the FXT90


----------



## dweaver

xinn3r said:


> Joker, have you had any chance to hear the new JVC FXZ100 or 200?
> I'm wondering if it'll be worth it to upgrade from the FXT90



I'm not Joker but thought I would chime in since I own the FXZ100 and have owned the FXT90. I tried the FXT90 twice and just never enjoyed their sound enough to keep them. I struggled with the upper mids and treble, finding them to grainy and at times harsh. The FXZ100 on the other hand has none of these issues. The mids are full and clean and the treble has no harshness to it. I did have to switch the tips though as the stock tips just do not fit in my ears properly. I will warn you, the FXZ100 do stick out of the ear quite a way if that would bother you. But looks aside they are a clear upgrade in sound in my opinion.


----------



## Xinn3r

double post!


----------



## Xinn3r

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> I'm not Joker but thought I would chime in since I own the FXZ100 and have owned the FXT90. I tried the FXT90 twice and just never enjoyed their sound enough to keep them. I struggled with the upper mids and treble, finding them to grainy and at times harsh. The FXZ100 on the other hand has none of these issues. The mids are full and clean and the treble has no harshness to it. I did have to switch the tips though as the stock tips just do not fit in my ears properly. I will warn you, the FXZ100 do stick out of the ear quite a way if that would bother you. But looks aside they are a clear upgrade in sound in my opinion.


 
  Thanks for the comparison!
  The FXT90 is one of my favorite earphones though, easy comfortable fit and very natural timbre, I love how guitars sound on it, bass is perfect amount for me, highs and mids are there, just never really annoyed me, but didn't really wow-ed my either.
  To each his own I guess


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That would be welcome. Makes me wish I could clone myself.
> 
> 
> Yes, that's pretty much the difference. I do think the sound of the M5 is a hair more impressive overall (as it does have a lot more bass to contend with). It's also cheaper and better-accessorized, and there's a mic/remote version, which is still pretty rare among high-value earphones. I thought I saw the K1 and K2 on ViSang's site in the new release section but I can't find the link right now.
> ...


 
  I've been using the MEElec CW31 for a couple of weeks now.  They are becoming my favorite earphones.  They have a larger soundstage than my SE215's and good bass.  They're also comfortable and well built (I stepped on mine by accident and they survived!)
   
  JJ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johnny2ears said:


> Well, i really don't mind giving some bass in order to have more detail in the other areas, thats why i'm considering these other options. All of the above i found this weekend, and the price i listed was the cheapest i could find. In tearms of audio, the cx 300 didn't work for me specially in some voice reproduction, not as much in films, but for instance in games, everything sounded really muffled.
> 
> So, sorry to bother, but 2 questions really pop out for me:
> 
> ...


 
   
  It's not that the M3 is necessarily worth the price increase over the M5, it's that I think its sound will suit what you're looking for better. But again, there are other, cheaper options for the more balanced sound including the E30 and CW31. The CW31 is the warmer of these two. The M2 and DTX 101 are on the warm side as well.
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Joker, have you had any chance to hear the new JVC FXZ100 or 200?
> I'm wondering if it'll be worth it to upgrade from the FXT90


 
   
  Sorry, haven't heard either yet.


----------



## ljokerl

Updated Dunu DN-17 Crater and DN-18 Hawkeye reviews with impressions of the newly re-tuned versions. The new Crater is noticeably a bit better than the old one, now much easier to recommend. 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C45) Dunu DN-17 Crater*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2012
> ...


----------



## ba113leia

Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> I would throw the GR02 Bass Edition in there...


 
   
  
 Those looking ever reaches (just googling "VSONIC IN EUROPE")
  
 http://www.digifi.cz/index.php?prod=42


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Quote: 





ba113leia said:


> Those looking ever reaches (just googling "VSONIC IN EUROPE")
> 
> http://www.digifi.cz/index.php?prod=42


 

 These are the ones:
  http://www.lendmeurears.com/product_info.php?cPath=15&products_id=41


----------



## Mini0510

Joker, I received my PFE 232. My first impression is that it sounds slightly *more veiled/less clear/transparent* (I'm not sure the correct word to describe) than FX700 with gray filter. Apparently, it sounds less veiled to me when I used the black filter, which doesn't seem to agree with your review. I'm satisfied with the sound signature but the presentation not crystal clear. 
 Yes, just like you told me, it has less rumble than FX700 in bass, which I'm ok with. I'm happy with the treble quantity and quality. The treble quality is like same as FX700. I thought BA drivers are better in the mid to treble region.
  
 Lastly, just wondering, is PFE 232's treble less, equilvalent, or more "brassy" than AKG K3003?
  
 Edit: Oh I know why now. I think PFE 232 is recessed or laid back in midrange. I tried to eq the midrange a bit, It seems a little more transparent.
Is there an Iem sound like PFE 232 without recessed midrange? K3003 is too expensive.


----------



## Gilly87

n/a


----------



## Amitl

can anyone please explain to me what is 'driver flex'..?
  i read its something about the housing pushing on the driver
  but what does it actually sound like???
  or...what are the symptoms?


----------



## Impulse

Sounds like a plastic soda bottle being dented as you push into it with your finger, tho somewhat more muted... At a high level it's basically the same thing, a concave enclosed surface being reversed or flexed against it's natural shape by outside pressure. Should only be happening as you adjust them in your ears but it's a sign of build quality.


----------



## Impulse

Double post


----------



## Amitl

got it 
  thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Lastly, just wondering, is PFE 232's treble less, equilvalent, or more "brassy" than AKG K3003?


 
   
  Yes, the 232 is a little v-shaped which is my complaint with it as well. 
   
  I don't know what you mean by _brassy_.
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> can anyone please explain to me what is 'driver flex'..?
> i read its something about the housing pushing on the driver
> but what does it actually sound like???
> or...what are the symptoms?


 

 It's not the housing, it's the air pressure in your ear canal (with a good seal) that flexes the driver.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, the 232 is a little v-shaped which is my complaint with it as well.
> 
> I don't know what you mean by _brassy_.


 
  You some IEM produce very thin treble like Sennheiser CX300. I believe PFE 232's treble sounds thinner than K3003.
  I wasn't happy with the transparency of PFE 232, I eventually eq'ed it to sound similar to FX700 with less mid/upper bass. But it's still not as transparent no matter how I eq'ed it and falls slightly behind of the timbre of FX700.
   
  For EX1000, I believe that it has less mid/upper bass than FX700. But is there impact on the drums, like does the drums hit hard at all?
   
  Thanks


----------



## AstralStorm

CX300 treble is anything but thin. It's veiled and soft. No high end IEM produces treble like that.
  What CX300 has going for it there is low magnitude high order harmonic distortion in the treble. (unlike some BA)
   
  Thin treble would be something that's produced by e.g. Etymotic ER4S. Perhaps too crisp even.
   
  EX1000 hits relatively hard, but not as hard as FX700. Only Atrios hit as hard.
  Are you sure you're getting correct seal with PFE232? These have plenty bass and ok subbass... in fact a bit too much high bass.
  K3003 has TWFK treble - it is very thin, much thinner than PFE232.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> CX300 treble is anything but thin. It's veiled and soft. No high end IEM produces treble like that.
> What CX300 has going for it there is low magnitude high order harmonic distortion in the treble. (unlike some BA)
> 
> Thin treble would be something that's produced by e.g. Etymotic ER4S. Perhaps too crisp even.
> ...


 
  I've been spoiled and slowly turning in a basshead. I can't really complain about PFE 232 bass.
  When I say thin, I meant like the cymbals are almost as if they were hit with pencils instead of drumsticks.
  Therefore, there are less brassy feeling/sound on the sennheisers than AKGs (thats what someone else described, I don't own K3003)


----------



## james444

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> K3003 has TWFK treble - it is very thin, much thinner than PFE232.


 
   
  Probably different interpretations of "thin".
   
  In terms of note weight, the K3003 are quite balanced across the FR to my ears, whereas the PFE232 have an imbalance towards the lower half, with rather weighty bass and rather light/thin/feathery treble.
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> When I say thin, I meant like the cymbals are almost as if they were hit with pencils instead of drumsticks.


 
   
  Reminds me of something I've read somewhere.


----------



## AstralStorm

K3003 are not neutral, they're V-shaped, with major bass boost at midbass and highs. The bass timbre is good, yes, but these did fail the drumstick test similar to the one above, because the highs are just TWFK and sound identically (in terms of timbre) to ones by my Brainwavz B2.
  SE-5 and RE-ZERO (both equalized) do way, way better.
   
  SE-5 accentuates brass, too near soundstage for some reason (phase artifacts?), sounds like instruments were recorded separately
  B2 drumsticks sound like plastic, accentuates plates and slightly brass too, very slightly too wide soundstage (feels like a hole or a wall in the center)
  RE-ZERO accentuates nothing in particular, but is a tiny bit too smooth, has narrowest, most laid back soundstage. (pretty nice presentation all in all)
  Mids detailing is best on SE-5, closely followed by TWFK (slightly too fast, less rich), RE-ZERO is worst, slightly resonant, bell-like. (residual shoutiness? kinda like RE-272 from memory, but less)
   
  Unequalized signatures: SE-5: warm and rolled off (more than GR07); RE-ZERO: neutral with mid focus; B2: v-shape with treble slant.
  Best pairings: SE-5: something very analytical, like O2 or Leckertons; RE-ZERO: anything not too rolled off; B2: mid forward thicker amp like FiiO E10.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> K3003 are not neutral, they're V-shaped, with major bass boost at midbass and highs.


 
   
  Like I said, I was talking about balance in note-weight, not frequency response.


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





astralstorm said:


> K3003 are not neutral, they're V-shaped, with major bass boost at midbass and highs. The bass timbre is good, yes, but these did fail the drumstick test similar to the one above, because the highs are just TWFK and sound identically (in terms of timbre) to ones by my Brainwavz B2.


 
   
  I found the K3003 treble to sound nothing like the DBA-02 but did have similarity to the CK10, which IMO have great cymbals but can get a little hot at times.  The K3003 treble was not thin to me and has some of my favorite and most realistic cymbals to my ears without ever getting hot.  Not all twfk's are the same.


----------



## ritvik93

Guys what do you think of the sony MDR ex220lp? Are they any good?


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> I found the K3003 treble to sound nothing like the DBA-02 but did have similarity to the CK10, which IMO have great cymbals but can get a little hot at times.  The K3003 treble was not thin to me and has some of my favorite and most realistic cymbals to my ears without ever getting hot.  Not all twfk's are the same.


 
  Actually, these are exactly the same kind of hotness - the 4-8k kind and something 12-14k too. (Both B2 and K3003. K3003 reference filter _slightly _tames the 4-5k component.)


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ritvik93 said:


> Guys what do you think of the sony MDR ex220lp? Are they any good?


 
   
         i think they are quite good . just make sure that you are using the right sized tips .


----------



## ritvik93

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> i think they are quite good . just make sure that you are using the right sized tips .


 
  So uh are the 220lp comparable to the soundmagic e10m ? Im sorry but you dont know how much youre helping me right now


----------



## argel59

hi everyone! i'm a new headfier, this whole review is awesome. i only have meelec sp51 which i saved for 2 months to buy.
  i'm a basshead guy so i came to the idea of removing the filters inside the silver/metallic ports and "drilled" slightly larger holes
  on them, and wow there it is larger bass suited for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





argel59 said:


> hi everyone! i'm a new headfier, this whole review is awesome. i only have meelec sp51 which i saved for 2 months to buy.
> i'm a basshead guy so i came to the idea of removing the filters inside the silver/metallic ports and "drilled" slightly larger holes
> on them, and wow there it is larger bass suited for me.


 

 Doesn't removing the filters just turn the silver/metallic ports in the black ports? I think filter presence/thickness is how they all differ. You can also just leave the ports off altogether, though that makes the bass quite uncontrolled.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Could you do a comparison between the j-phonic K2 SP, Earsonics SM3, and Audeo PFE232? Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Could you do a comparison between the j-phonic K2 SP, Earsonics SM3, and Audeo PFE232? Thanks!


 

 I don't think you can get the K2 SP anymore and the other two don't sound anything alike. I feel like this needs restating:
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't mind doing comparison but they do take time. If you're asking only out of curiosity, I recommend just reading the reviews. If you're actually looking to make a buying decision, it might be best for you to state what you're looking for. It's easier for me to say which fits your criteria better than to come up with a from-memory comparison of two products you might not even want in the first place.


----------



## NoGood

Hey joker, will you be reviewing the TDK BA200 in the near future? Any brief idea of how it compares to the Rockit R50?
   
  Thanks


----------



## jhelsas

ljokerl,
   
     You know what I think?
   
     I think you should take some vacations far from head-fi. You have done and still is doing a marvelous and incredible job here, simply reviewing extensively and compartively lots and lots of headphones, and it's impossible to count how many people between forum members and lurkers that you have helped. 
    
     Just to think about the amount of money, headache and buyer's remorse you have been saving a lot of people from is enough to show the value of this thread. Not only that, the fact you are readily accessible and willing to answer everyone's questions (not forgeting the whole lot of other people that helps this thread too) is in itself more than any seller that I've know have done for their clients, it's much closer to what someone does to his or her friends.
   
     I belive you deserve and earned the right for a break!
   
     What about writing reviews about drinks or beaches?
     That's something I would love to read!!
   
     And again, my thanks for you and all the great people in this thread and in head-fi


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nogood said:


> Hey joker, will you be reviewing the TDK BA200 in the near future? Any brief idea of how it compares to the Rockit R50?
> 
> Thanks


 

 I haven't heard the BA200 yet. I'll try and fit it in some time this year. 
   
  Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> You know what I think?
> 
> ...


 






 I appreciate that and agree 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Still quite a few pending reviews to complete but I'll be sure to take the break if I can ever get out of this rut.


----------



## Aellius

Hi everyone!
   
  I don't know if this is the best thread to ask this, but... My CX300 cable broke and I'm looking for new IEMs around $70.
   
  The IEMs I was looking at are:
*Vsonic GR04, GR06*
*Rockit R30*
  (all for lendmeurears prices)
   
  I listen to all kinds of music, except hiphop, rap maybe. Which one would be the best choice? Or any other recommendation within my budget?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





aellius said:


> Hi everyone!
> 
> I don't know if this is the best thread to ask this, but... My CX300 cable broke and I'm looking for new IEMs around $70.
> 
> ...


 

 The GR04 Flagship are AWESOME! They are supposed to best the GR06, what type of music do you listen to? Also, consider the VC02.


----------



## Aellius

Quote:


scootsit said:


> The GR04 Flagship are AWESOME! They are supposed to best the GR06, what type of music do you listen to? Also, consider the VC02.


 

   
  I see. Thank you!
  My listening mostly consists of metal (heavy, metalcore), rock (all kinds), a lot of movie soundtracks and also electronic music, exclusively instrumental like Rom Di Prisco, Deadmau5. Occasionally some Pop.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aellius said:


> Hi everyone!
> 
> I don't know if this is the best thread to ask this, but... My CX300 cable broke and I'm looking for new IEMs around $70.
> 
> ...


 

 I haven't heard the GR04 but the GR06 and R30 both sound quite good with modern music. The GR06 is more mid-forward but also has better bass impact. The R-30 is a little more laid-back but has an advantage in overall balance and treble smoothness. Really depends on what you think you'll like better. The R30 may seem a little bass-light after the CX300 but it's got good bass for a single armature and will be a big step up in clarity.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 If you like your bass, the MH1C may be a good choice. It's nice, cheap, and has gobs of bass.


----------



## jhelsas

ljokerl,
   
   I have a question for you, although it's not about iems, it's about an amp in your profile, the heed canamp, I would like your impressions about it (if you have it already written, please, just send the link). I hear it once, and like it, but I haven't found a lot of reviews about it here in head-fi.
   
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> I have a question for you, although it's not about iems, it's about an amp in your profile, the heed canamp, I would like your impressions about it (if you have it already written, please, just send the link). I hear it once, and like it, but I haven't found a lot of reviews about it here in head-fi.
> 
> thanks


 

 I haven't written anything about the Heed for two reasons
   
  1. It's my only proper full-size amp, so I have no real basis for proper comparison when I say it sounds 'good'
  2. It's not stock. The are quite a few mods performed by the previous owner meant to get it to sound its best with the AKG K601. I don't have a list of those mods on hand, unfortunately.


----------



## haquocdung

Hi ljokerl,
   
  Thanks for all the effort that you put into these review. It's amazing and I can't read all of them so I will just ask you here.
  Can you please recommend me an universal fit/ciem neutrual sound with liquid mids and slight emphasis on bass (LCD2.2, Mad Dog or Vmoda M100 equalivent)? The lower the price the better.
   
  Thank you.


----------



## Aellius

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the GR04 but the GR06 and R30 both sound quite good with modern music. The GR06 is more mid-forward but also has better bass impact. The R-30 is a little more laid-back but has an advantage in overall balance and treble smoothness. Really depends on what you think you'll like better. The R30 may seem a little bass-light after the CX300 but it's got good bass for a single armature and will be a big step up in clarity.


 
   
  Thank you! I might go with the GR06 just in case. I don't have a problem with my AD700 not having much bass, but considering that reviews say the CX300 is bass-heavy, the GR06 would be the safer choice.
  Does armature drives have an advantage at the same price point like the GR06 vs the R30? The only thing I know that most of the top tier IEMs have armatures.
  Thank you for your reply!
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> If you like your bass, the MH1C may be a good choice. It's nice, cheap, and has gobs of bass.


 
   
  Unfortunately the MH1Cs cost about $65-70 in my country, it's outright robbery. At that price range I wouldn't consider the MH1C. Thank you for suggesting tho!


----------



## christobit

Hi Joker..could you recommend an appropriate headphone upto 300$.  My prefered signature is -
   
  Slighlty leaning toward analytical, but not complete left field
  Great detail
  Tight, fast, detailed base but with natural decay
  Flat mid section, but of course great clarity in upper and lower end
  Crisp, detailed but not 'hot' treble
  Soundstage does not have to be endless
  IEM not overly dependant on fit
  Would be paired with JDS Labs O2
   
  Cheers, many thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





haquocdung said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> Thanks for all the effort that you put into these review. It's amazing and I can't read all of them so I will just ask you here.
> Can you please recommend me an universal fit/ciem neutrual sound with liquid mids and slight emphasis on bass (LCD2.2, Mad Dog or Vmoda M100 equalivent)? The lower the price the better.
> ...


 
   
  Someone asked this about the M-80 and I recommended the Yamaha EPH-100. If the M-100 follows the sound of its smaller sibling, that should still be a pretty good choice. It actually has quite a bit of bass but it not bloated/intrusive, much like the M-80 and LCD2. That's probably the smallest spend for something decent with that signature, too. 
   
  Quote: 





aellius said:


> Thank you! I might go with the GR06 just in case. I don't have a problem with my AD700 not having much bass, but considering that reviews say the CX300 is bass-heavy, the GR06 would be the safer choice.
> Does armature drives have an advantage at the same price point like the GR06 vs the R30? The only thing I know that most of the top tier IEMs have armatures.
> Thank you for your reply!


 
   
   
  The R-30 has no innate advantages over a dynamic-driver earphone such as the GR06 just because it is an armature but it is the more balanced-sounding set of the two.
   
   
  Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker..could you recommend an appropriate headphone upto 300$.  My prefered signature is -
> 
> Slighlty leaning toward analytical, but not complete left field
> Great detail
> ...


 
   
  You might like the VSonic GR01 or ACS T15 - both pretty neutral with a bit less treble than the average 'analytical' earphone for a more forgiving sound. The T15 more so than the GR01, and it is especially easy-going when it comes to fit. For something a little more fun, I think the Ortofon e-Q5 might be a good choice.


----------



## haquocdung

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Someone asked this about the M-80 and I recommended the Yamaha EPH-100. If the M-100 follows the sound of its smaller sibling, that should still be a pretty good choice. It actually has quite a bit of bass but it not bloated/intrusive, much like the M-80 and LCD2. That's probably the smallest spend for something decent with that signature, too.


 
  Hi Joker,
  Thanks for your recommendation. Do you think the new UE400 will be a good fit for me? 
  I am willing to spend around $500 and I may consider reshell to have a nice fit with it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





haquocdung said:


> Hi Joker,
> Thanks for your recommendation. Do you think the new UE400 will be a good fit for me?
> I am willing to spend around $500 and I may consider reshell to have a nice fit with it.


 

 The UE900? Probably, though if you're willing to spend that much I would say the SE535 might be a better signature match for the LCD-2 I heard with flatter mids and maybe a bit less treble energy than the UE900.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Reid & Heath Audio MA-350
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A75) RHA MA-350*
> 
> 
> Added Jan 2013
> ...


----------



## haquocdung

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The UE900? Probably, though if you're willing to spend that much I would say the SE535 might be a better signature match for the LCD-2 I heard with flatter mids and maybe a bit less treble energy than the UE900.


 
  I read through your and headfi holiday gift guide, I saw that the W4R is more favorable than Shure535 or UE400.
  Is there a mini version of JH16 around?


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't written anything about the Heed for two reasons
> 
> 1. It's my only proper full-size amp, so I have no real basis for proper comparison when I say it sounds 'good'
> 2. It's not stock. The are quite a few mods performed by the previous owner meant to get it to sound its best with the AKG K601. I don't have a list of those mods on hand, unfortunately.


 
   
  Thanks for the answers
   
  I was curious because they don't seem to receive a lot of attention here in head-fi.


----------



## lilboozy

rha ma 350 vs she3580?


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Reid & Heath Audio MA-350
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 

 Does this mean you're ready for the MH1C?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





haquocdung said:


> I read through your and headfi holiday gift guide, I saw that the W4R is more favorable than Shure535 or UE400.
> Is there a mini version of JH16 around?


 
   
  I haven't heard the JH16. 
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> rha ma 350 vs she3580?


 
   
  MA-350 has deeper bass and a warmer, more bottom-heavy sound. SHE3580 is clearer and more balanced/v-shaped.
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Does this mean you're ready for the MH1C?


 

 Sure, I'll take a listen. The RHA was definitely not the set holding me up, though.


----------



## scootsit

ljokerl said:


> haquocdung said:
> 
> 
> > I read through your and headfi holiday gift guide, I saw that the W4R is more favorable than Shure535 or UE400.
> ...





PM me your address?


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> MA-350 has deeper bass and a warmer, more bottom-heavy sound. SHE3580 is clearer and more balanced/v-shaped.


 
  Nice review by the way


----------



## precsmo

Hi Joker, really hope Compact Monitors especially the Stage 3 and Stage 4 will be reviewed. The Stage 3 sounds amazing to me and I'm so tempted over it! Wondering why not really many talk about this brand whereas it is amazing to me


----------



## MrEleventy

Hey joker, I saw that you kinda started with the ER6i and went to the ER4, is there a step in between that you would recommend that's similar to the Ety sound sig? ER6i was my first quality IEMS and I find that I'm missing the sound of them recently. I was looking at the REs, (RE0, Re-Zero, RE262) as well as the Ety HF5. Looking to stay <= 100. Thanks. Awesome thread btw, I love this and your portable HPs thread. Keep up the great work.


----------



## dleblanc343

How would you compare the AKG K3003i to the Fit Ear 334 to go!?
   
  I recently tried the AKG K3003 and I am about to buy it; however, I was not that impressed with it. Which is the best all-arounder in your opinion? I have to say the freq response balance of the AKG is fantastic, bass is a bit more impactful than neutral, but that's fun for on the go. The highs were also very simmery without ever being too glary. They sound a lot like a baby HE-6.
   
  Which of the AKG and fitear have a more spacious presentation over all? Not only sound stage width, but also depth and height?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scootsit said:


> PM me your address?


 
   
  Done, thanks!
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Nice review by the way


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  Quote: 





precsmo said:


> Hi Joker, really hope Compact Monitors especially the Stage 3 and Stage 4 will be reviewed. The Stage 3 sounds amazing to me and I'm so tempted over it! Wondering why not really many talk about this brand whereas it is amazing to me


 
   
  They are rarely mentioned, I think I've only stumbled on their products once or twice before. I will have more custom monitors to add but sadly not those.
   
  Quote: 





mreleventy said:


> Hey joker, I saw that you kinda started with the ER6i and went to the ER4, is there a step in between that you would recommend that's similar to the Ety sound sig? ER6i was my first quality IEMS and I find that I'm missing the sound of them recently. I was looking at the REs, (RE0, Re-Zero, RE262) as well as the Ety HF5. Looking to stay <= 100. Thanks. Awesome thread btw, I love this and your portable HPs thread. Keep up the great work.


 
   
  I would go with the HF5, it slots right in between the ER6i and ER4 and is a terrific value at $100 for the Ety lover (and in general). 
   
  Quote: 





dleblanc343 said:


> How would you compare the AKG K3003i to the Fit Ear 334 to go!?
> 
> I recently tried the AKG K3003 and I am about to buy it; however, I was not that impressed with it. Which is the best all-arounder in your opinion? I have to say the freq response balance of the AKG is fantastic, bass is a bit more impactful than neutral, but that's fun for on the go. The highs were also very simmery without ever being too glary. They sound a lot like a baby HE-6.
> 
> ...


 

 The MH334 has slightly tighter bass and a little less of it, but still enhanced. It has much more forward and transparent mids. The overall tone is a little darker and the treble is smoother. The K3003 sounds more dynamic with that big bass but also a bit boomier. The treble is not as smooth but extends better. The presentation of the MH334 is more forward overall. Both have very impressive depth but I personally give the K3003 a slight edge in overall spaciousness.


----------



## Mimouille

Hello ljokerl, I never had the chance to thank you so I will do it now. I really love the work you did here. This is really helpfull to all people who want to buy IEMs, and it's great that you put customs as well. I just received my Miracles (upgrade from Shure SE530x6) and even after just a few minutes, I can hear they sound great...so balanced, everything at its place. You were one of the reasons I chose the Miracles. What other customs do you plan on reviewing ?


----------



## vincentistan

hi joker,
  i have both the pfe 122 (grey filters) and the fischer audio silver bullet. i got both of them after reading your reviews 
  i was just wondering how would you compare the key differences between the two? its really obvious theres a big difference when i compare them but im not sure how to put it in words  i know the soundstage is apparent but i wanna know how to describe the two very different sound signatures so i know what to look for when im moving on to other iems 
   
  p.s. i like them both, their enjoyable in different ways, like the silver bullet has a very nice full sound and bass that makes me smile, while the pfe is very relaxing and clear


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Hello ljokerl, I never had the chance to thank you so I will do it now. I really love the work you did here. This is really helpfull to all people who want to buy IEMs, and it's great that you put customs as well. I just received my Miracles (upgrade from Shure SE530x6) and even after just a few minutes, I can hear they sound great...so balanced, everything at its place. You were one of the reasons I chose the Miracles. What other customs do you plan on reviewing ?


 
   
  Thanks, I appreciate that. Glad you're enjoying the Miracles.
   
  I currently have plans for adding 8 or 9 new, mostly higher-end customs to the thread over the course of this year but I'd rather not reveal which ones they are just yet. 
   
  Quote: 





vincentistan said:


> hi joker,
> i have both the pfe 122 (grey filters) and the fischer audio silver bullet. i got both of them after reading your reviews
> i was just wondering how would you compare the key differences between the two? its really obvious theres a big difference when i compare them but im not sure how to put it in words  i know the soundstage is apparent but i wanna know how to describe the two very different sound signatures so i know what to look for when im moving on to other iems
> 
> p.s. i like them both, their enjoyable in different ways, like the silver bullet has a very nice full sound and bass that makes me smile, while the pfe is very relaxing and clear


 
   
  I haven't heard the Silver Bullet in quite a long time so my from-memory comparison will surely be worse than your direct A:B. When deciding which upgrade path to pursue, you'll want to figure out which aspects of each you like better (i.e. whether you like the quicker, tighter bass of the 112 or the more impactful low end of the SB, and so on).


----------



## NoahG

How does the Earsonic sm2 compare to Hifiman re-272 (for vocals only)?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





noahg said:


> How does the Earsonic sm2 compare to Hifiman re-272 (for vocals only)?


 

 It's much thicker and warmer, with an emphasis on the bass and lower midrange vs the HiFiMan which is flatter through the upper mids and treble and more transparent overall. I personally prefer the 272.


----------



## OnTheSky

hello i have a few questions to you.
   
  do you think eph-100 would not get messy with warm and dark player like samsung p3? can you compare for me ne700x and ex85 to eph-100? i mean darkness/warmness of them.
   
  do you really scored ex85 sound 4.7 and ne6 6.1 ? its missmatch for me. ex85 sounds much better in my opinion. in ne6 bass interact with mids, vocal is hidden and the trebles are just bad. ex85 has everything better in my opinion. you scored brainwavz beta for almost 7 and these are almost the same (or just the same, hard to tell because of diffrent sources i used) like ex85.
   
  sorry for my english


----------



## gnarlee

I am looking for iems around 40 with good bass for rap and rock and nice mids and highs also build quality case and foam tips but the case or foam tips are not deciding factors just nice to have
I was between the
Dunu trident
Brainwavs m5
Vsonics gr02 be
Vsonics vco2
Rha ma 350
Astrotec am90
Soundmagic e10


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Soundmagic e10 is nice, not quite as much bass as the gr02 be which is an excellent choice for a v shaped sounds, I hae heard the vc02 is more linear. For rock gr02 be is one of my favorites.


----------



## gnarlee

Yeah the forerunner of my group was the brainwavs m5 but i will keep a open mind but that was because of accessories i regretbly haven't heard any of these


----------



## Mimouille

Hello again !
  What according to you is the ideal source for the Miracle. I have a DX100 and it sounds great with the Miracle, but I am considering amps. So far I tried Glacier, RSA 71A, Triad L3 and Continental V3 and they were all good, but no wow for me. Any ideas ? I was thinking maybe Portaphile 627
   
  Thanks


----------



## stara

Hi Joker,
   
  Apart Grado itself, can you recommend in-ear phones with similar sound at price range of under $250. Cheaper the better, I'm looking for SR60 performance/$.


----------



## rt310

Hi joker,
  First of all i'd like to thank you for putting in your time and effort into this thread. I really appreciate it and know many others do too!
   
  Secondly, i have a question about my current GR07s.
  Are there any contenders at a similar price range to the GR07s? I'm having trouble finding any that equal/best its sound quality. If it's any help, the genres i listen to are composed of mainly vocals (Asian pop) and instruments (classical)


----------



## Mini0510

Joker, I uploaded screenshot of eq the FX700 and PFE 232 (black filter).
   
  FX700

   
  PFE 232
   

   
   
  Disregarding the numbers, I don't think this EQ app for iPhone is very strong. What kind of sound signature do you think I'm preferring? U or V shape?
   
  additional info:
  I'm ok with the bass quantity of PFE 232 gray filter with that EQ setting as well. But I prefer black filter over gray.
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





onthesky said:


> do you think eph-100 would not get messy with warm and dark player like samsung p3? can you compare for me ne700x and ex85 to eph-100? i mean darkness/warmness of them.


 
   
   
  Should be fine. I do not have any of these earphone anymore so I can't provide a good set of comparisons. They are all on the warm side but I don't find the EPH-100 to be particularly dark. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





gnarlee said:


> I am looking for iems around 40 with good bass for rap and rock and nice mids and highs also build quality case and foam tips but the case or foam tips are not deciding factors just nice to have
> I was between the
> Dunu trident
> Brainwavs m5
> ...


 
   
  The VC02 is really not a bassy earphone so probably not what you're looking for. The E10 or GR02 BE would sound good with a variety of genres and have solid bass without being overwhelmingly bassy.
   
  Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Hello again !
> What according to you is the ideal source for the Miracle. I have a DX100 and it sounds great with the Miracle, but I am considering amps. So far I tried Glacier, RSA 71A, Triad L3 and Continental V3 and they were all good, but no wow for me. Any ideas ? I was thinking maybe Portaphile 627
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  I don't have any experience with any of those amps. I've tried the Miracle out of the DX100 and liked it, but I think any neutral source will do just fine. 
   
  Quote: 





stara said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Apart Grado itself, can you recommend in-ear phones with similar sound at price range of under $250. Cheaper the better, I'm looking for SR60 performance/$.


 
   
  I'm not familiar with the higher-end Grado IEMs so I can't say if it's a worse or better choice but I'd consider the Sony EX600 and Fischer Audio SBA-03/MEElec A161 at the low end of that price range. These tend to have pretty solid bass but can't be called warm or bassy and have strong midrange presence, much like an SR60. 
   
  Quote: 





rt310 said:


> Hi joker,
> First of all i'd like to thank you for putting in your time and effort into this thread. I really appreciate it and know many others do too!
> 
> Secondly, i have a question about my current GR07s.
> Are there any contenders at a similar price range to the GR07s? I'm having trouble finding any that equal/best its sound quality. If it's any help, the genres i listen to are composed of mainly vocals (Asian pop) and instruments (classical)


 
   
  Sure - there's a few of the TWFK-based sets such as the Brainwavz B2/Fischer DBA-02 mkII/Rock-It R-50. There's also the HiFiMan RE272 now available for <$200, at least in the US. They rival or better the GR07, depending on your preferred signature. There are also many other models that may not be as good as the GR07 to me but might work better for you.


----------



## canikickit1

Would you deem the gr01 or er4p an upgrade from hf5s? I currently have a CMoyBB amp and the hf5 set up is pretty good. I was looking to see if any iem would be considered an upgrade. I tried the gr07 but didn't like the sound leakage and the over the ear application . 

Any upgrades you would suggest to the hf5 in terms of non-leakage and wire down use? $250 max. Any different sound sig is appreciated.

AWESOME reviews btw.


----------



## psion84

Quote: 





precsmo said:


> Hi Joker, really hope Compact Monitors especially the Stage 3 and Stage 4 will be reviewed. The Stage 3 sounds amazing to me and I'm so tempted over it! Wondering why not really many talk about this brand whereas it is amazing to me


 

 +1. had the chance to audit the stage 3 with the JH13s and JH16s (Freqphase). simply preferred the stage 3. sounds so musical and engaging. wish more were said bout these. great tuning by compact. saving up for these at the moment.


----------



## nehcrow

Hey joker! 
 Wondering if you've heard the XBA-3 yet and how would you compare them to the XBA-4?


----------



## phantompersona

I smell a VC02 review coming out soon


----------



## bowlofsoup

This is a pretty general question, but of these iems, which would work best for someone who listens to a lot of metal? I don't really have a preferred sound, but I do like the way my brainwavz HM3's sound.

Gr06
Am90
Brainwavz M2
Anything you would recommend under $100


----------



## -sandro-

Anyone knows if the VSonic r04 sounds like the GR04 Flagship?


----------



## gnarlee

@joker vsonic gro2 be vs brainwavs m5 vs klipsch s4 i mostly listen to rap and want build quality


----------



## ktan3142

So as to not clog up the forums, does anyone know of a direct upgrade to the RE-ZERO in terms of sound signature? I returned the RE-262 I got recently due to not enough isolation, so now I have funds to upgrade (I tip-rolled like crazy and cannot get enough isolation without compromising the mids). Here's what I'm looking at and what I'm worried about for each:
   

 TDK BA200 - flat cables are annoying, and the shape looks like the RE-262, so I'm afraid for bad isolation/fit 
 GR07 - I heard these isolate less than the BA200, but seems to be the sound I'm looking for
 Brainwavz B2 - so-so build quality
 Rockit Sounds R-50 - so-so build quality and memory/hard wire (I hate it)
 Astrotec AX-7 - seems to be the best build quality of the bunch, but not enough reviews to become informed
   
  I am looking for an RE-ZERO with slightly more subbass and wider soundstage (everything else seems perfect) - mainly at the GR07 and BA200. Yet, if the R-50 is closer to my ideal sound sig and its build quality not as bad as I make it out to be, then I'll get it. If neither of these are "upgrades," then I'll just stick to my RE-ZERO since I love it to death.
   
  Thanks in advance
   
  EDIT: I liked the RE-ZERO's sound sig much more than the RE-262.


----------



## awtryau89

Joker,
  I have a quick question about the UE900 and the GR07s. I read your comments about them. I have the GR07 BEs. I like them alot and they are fun with most but I find they seem to collapse and don't really give the best separation and detail when listening to complex music. I have been listening to Holst Planets recently as my preferred test. I also ordered some TDK BA200s. These seem to do a better job with the issues I am having with the GR07 keeping the soundstage outside of my head during more complex passages. Even so, I have a brand new pair that is giving me shorting issues in an earpiece. They also aren't built to the overall quality of the GR07s. Finally we enter the UE900s. I have an opportunity to grab some of these at a great price (around $100 more than the GR07s). Will they do a better job than the GR07s at resolving detail and not "collapsing" as it were? Not sure if I am saying that right but during complex passages the GR07s just seem to lose any soundstage width and I feel as if I am listening to earphones instead of the music swimming around me. 
   
  I think you like the UE900s from all I have read. At what point in a price drop would you put them as the "bang for the buck" IEM?


----------



## precsmo

Quote: 





psion84 said:


> +1. had the chance to audit the stage 3 with the JH13s and JH16s (Freqphase). simply preferred the stage 3. sounds so musical and engaging. wish more were said bout these. great tuning by compact. saving up for these at the moment.


 
  hope you will get yours in no time . I've done 2nd audition, this time with the Stage 4 which I've requested from Jaben, and the boss buddy (I knew him for years) generous enough to bring in the demo set for me all the way from Singapore. However, I was disappointed. It was too boomy, the bass was way too enhanced and forward to me, it affects the mid and vocal. I will not take risk and pay more for it hoping that the final custom shell will fix all that which I don't think so.
   
  I've made comparisons with FitEar ToGo! 334 and in the same night UM Miracle. I've made another careful audition with the Stage 3 again during the 2nd audition. Due to the price factor, great services from Jaben, warranties, especially and most importantly, I really love the Stage 3 with its smooth and musical characteristic, I've decided to go for it. I'm assuming that the Stage 3 will be very much better with the final custom shells against the universal demo set. FitEar is another amazing earphone to me, I can't say it is better than Stage 3, they are just different, and I love it very much too. I would have gone for FitEar instead, however, the price is crazily expensive to me, I don't justify the improvements vs the price difference with the stage 3. Comparing the universal FitEar alone is already more expensive than the Stage 3 which the Stage 3 is already considerably towards the high side too, on the other hand, I personally will go for custom as my Livewire dual upgrade, I never like using any universal in-ear for more than 30 mins. And the FitEar custom is way too crazy with the price, I really don't justify those are improvements at all vs the much more costlier factor, I would rather consider it as different sounding and different characteristic, but I definitely love and amazed by FitEar, the sound performance alone.
   
  Also, I think I'm amazed by the UM Miracle too. I had a hard time struggling for a good fit because the owner put a comply foam on it and he left the rubber tips at home, it did not work well for me at all, and the surrounding was quite noisy. Even without a good seal and poor surroundings, the Miracle was still good enough to amaze me. I was thoroughly amazed by the bass. I always have in mind that more drivers do not mean better, and I always have the perception that too many drivers and with the extra attention with the multiple bass drivers can be over killing. But the Miracle wasn't so at all, I was amazed how the Miracle was so finely tuned across the whole sound spectrum. Probably Miracle has the best bass among all IEMs I've ever tried. I find the mid and high is more analytic, I can't really confirm this because Miracle was the loudest I've ever cranked up with my Cowon J3, I believe it was the poor seal and the noisy surrounding again, so, it is very hard to audition it properly. Again, even with the poor condition, I really find Miracle is very very good overall, I'm very confident that it is one of the best CIEM in the market. Due to the reason that I can't really get a very precise impressions from the Miracle, and due to the fact that I've to do the ordering and ear impressions all by myself, I rather go for the CM Stage 3, which again, Jaben do it all for me. After all, I really like the Stage 3 overall smooth and musical characteristic. I find the Stage 3 sounds very alike to full size dynamic driver headphone other than the "sound" from balanced armature, if everyone gets what I mean. These were all my personal experience and impressions from all the 2 auditions I've done (JH13, JH16, FitEar, UM Miracle, CM Stage 3 and Stage 4), my impressions can be totally unreliable to anyone, but this is my share of thoughts  I love the Stage 3 at the end and I will start ordering it in no time  
   
  **thanks Joker for the reply, I still hope that there will be a very slight chance for you to having a review of the Compact Monitors Stage 3, it sounds amazing to me, maybe not to you, really curious on your findings out of it. But I knew the chance is close to impossible


----------



## ibuckeye

ktan3142 said:


> So as to not clog up the forums, does anyone know of a direct upgrade to the RE-ZERO in terms of sound signature? I returned the RE-262 I got recently due to not enough isolation, so now I have funds to upgrade (I tip-rolled like crazy and cannot get enough isolation without compromising the mids). Here's what I'm looking at and what I'm worried about for each:
> 
> 
> TDK BA200 - flat cables are annoying, and the shape looks like the RE-262, so I'm afraid for bad isolation/fit
> ...




I strongly recommend trying out the new Hifiman RE400. I own both revisions of the ZEROs and 262 and now have the 400. It has a flat neutral sig like the ZERO, but has better bass impact and isolation with the smaller housing design. It has an inoffensive treble, although probably a tad less sparkly than the ZERO but still much closer to it than the 262. The 262s sound downright muffled on some tracks in comparison due to the rolled off highs. The soundstage is closer to the 262 than the ZERO - definitely much wider but also better depth and height perception. The thing I love about the 400 is Hifiman seem to have boosted the upper frequencies just right to make the snares and cymbals and kicks sound crisp...drum rolls are fun and distinct. The 262 have this cardboad effect, and it's because some of the frequencies on the upper end of the spectrum are rolled off too steep. The new design is also by far the most comfortable and isolating of the three. Funny you have the gr07 in your list, because the 400 in one sentence can be summed up IMO as a gr07 with better design, less sibilance and a narrower soundstage. Hope this helps...


----------



## psion84

Quote: 





precsmo said:


> hope you will get yours in no time . I've done 2nd audition, this time with the Stage 4 which I've requested from Jaben, and the boss buddy (I knew him for years) generous enough to bring in the demo set for me all the way from Singapore. However, I was disappointed. It was too boomy, the bass was way too enhanced and forward to me, it affects the mid and vocal. I will not take risk and pay more for it hoping that the final custom shell will fix all that which I don't think so.
> 
> I've made comparisons with FitEar ToGo! 334 and in the same night UM Miracle. I've made another careful audition with the Stage 3 again during the 2nd audition. Due to the price factor, great services from Jaben, warranties, especially and most importantly, I really love the Stage 3 with its smooth and musical characteristic, I've decided to go for it. I'm assuming that the Stage 3 will be very much better with the final custom shells against the universal demo set. FitEar is another amazing earphone to me, I can't say it is better than Stage 3, they are just different, and I love it very much too. I would have gone for FitEar instead, however, the price is crazily expensive to me, I don't justify the improvements vs the price difference with the stage 3. Comparing the universal FitEar alone is already more expensive than the Stage 3 which the Stage 3 is already considerably towards the high side too, on the other hand, I personally will go for custom as my Livewire dual upgrade, I never like using any universal in-ear for more than 30 mins. And the FitEar custom is way too crazy with the price, I really don't justify those are improvements at all vs the much more costlier factor, I would rather consider it as different sounding and different characteristic, but I definitely love and amazed by FitEar, the sound performance alone.
> 
> ...


 

 I think i have a fellow Msian buddy here.  i may have just audited the exact same compact stage 3 universal as u. hehe. we had a mini meet at Kuching with Yu Heng of Jaben back in early Jan. that was where i got the chance to audit the compact,JHs and the fitear. i agree that the fitear is a beast but different from the compact. i liked both, but preferred the compact. i also had the chance to try out the miracles for a week. i have to agree that the bass was amazing, textured and layered. however i found the mids to be a little forward for my liking and sounds analytical overall,i prefer a more musical SS iem like the compact. but mind you it was a universal demo set, so the custom mold might vary from the universal version. wow, congratz on ur stage 3 buddy. im still miles away to owning one. hopefully by this year end i would be able to afford that cheeky compact. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Sorry for my wallet? I may not even need the use for a wallet after i purchase the compact. will be too broke then. haha


----------



## ktan3142

Quote: 





ibuckeye said:


> I strongly recommend trying out the new Hifiman RE400. I own both revisions of the ZEROs and 262 and now have the 400. It has a flat neutral sig like the ZERO, but has better bass impact and isolation with the smaller housing design. It has an inoffensive treble, although probably a tad less sparkly than the ZERO but still much closer to it than the 262. The 262s sound downright muffled on some tracks in comparison due to the rolled off highs. The soundstage is closer to the 262 than the ZERO - definitely much wider but also better depth and height perception. The thing I love about the 400 is Hifiman seem to have boosted the upper frequencies just right to make the snares and cymbals and kicks sound crisp...drum rolls are fun and distinct. The 262 have this cardboad effect, and it's because some of the frequencies on the upper end of the spectrum are rolled off too steep. The new design is also by far the most comfortable and isolating of the three. Funny you have the gr07 in your list, because the 400 in one sentence can be summed up IMO as a gr07 with better design, less sibilance and a narrower soundstage. Hope this helps...


 
   
  I've been lurking on the RE-400 / RE-600 thread, and I read that the 400 was stale/polite, to the point where 2-3 users immediately returned them. I have been considering the RE-400 as my next upgrade, but am worried about the cable hardening like my RE-ZERO did. Some claimed that the cable no longer hardens, some claim that it's still the same old cable. I'll wait for more people to get the RE-400 before seriously considering it, but thanks for the input.
   
  How does the sibilance of the GR07 (or MKII) compare to that of the RE-ZERO. I did not find the ZERO to be sibilant at all, so it's probably not my biggest concern. Also, it's weird how you said that the 400 is the GR07 done right, because the 400 is claimed to be "polite," while the GR07 is deemed "fun."


----------



## shotgunshane

To my ears, the RE400 and GR07 don't really have much in common.


----------



## precsmo

psion84 said:


> I think i have a fellow Msian buddy here.  i may have just audited the exact same compact stage 3 universal as u. hehe. we had a mini meet at Kuching with Yu Heng of Jaben back in early Jan. that was where i got the chance to audit the compact,JHs and the fitear. i agree that the fitear is a beast but different from the compact. i liked both, but preferred the compact. i also had the chance to try out the miracles for a week. i have to agree that the bass was amazing, textured and layered. however i found the mids to be a little forward for my liking and sounds analytical overall,i prefer a more musical SS iem like the compact. but mind you it was a universal demo set, so the custom mold might vary from the universal version. wow, congratz on ur stage 3 buddy. im still miles away to owning one. hopefully by this year end i would be able to afford that cheeky compact.
> 
> 
> Sorry for my wallet? I may not even need the use for a wallet after i purchase the compact. will be too broke then. haha




Wow, nice hearing u here! Yes, indeed Yuheng has only one Stage 3 demo. You have very very similar listening preference like I do probably. But I did not have very good impressions with the Miracle, I feel the same like u do, the Miracle is amazingly good I think, but like what you have said, it has more forward mid and it is more analytic type, but really not sure if my audition was reliable at all. I really wish I have a chance to test it out again, but I do not want to trouble Calmshot to meet up again with the proper rubber tips. He is a very friendly person btw! 

Take your time bro, it took me many years to get to this stage too, and I really want to make a move to settle with a top end CIEM. I'm very confident CM Stage 3 will serve me very long time without ever needing to upgrade anymore.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





canikickit1 said:


> Would you deem the gr01 or er4p an upgrade from hf5s? I currently have a CMoyBB amp and the hf5 set up is pretty good. I was looking to see if any iem would be considered an upgrade. I tried the gr07 but didn't like the sound leakage and the over the ear application .
> 
> Any upgrades you would suggest to the hf5 in terms of non-leakage and wire down use? $250 max. Any different sound sig is appreciated.
> 
> AWESOME reviews btw.


 
   
  If you're looking for a different sound signature you probably shouldn't be looking at the ER4 at all. The GR01 is a little different and may be considered an upgrade if you'd give up some of the transparency of the HF5/ER4 sound for a slightly fuller sound and better deep bass presence.
   
  Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Hey joker!
> Wondering if you've heard the XBA-3 yet and how would you compare them to the XBA-4?


 
   
  Yes, I have one here. I tried it and wasn't really impressed (much the same story as with the XBA-4) so back on the shelf it went. It wasn't as bassy as the XBA-4 but otherwise has pretty similar characteristics and some of the same issues. If I ever have a chunk of spare time I'll come back to it. 
   
  Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> I smell a VC02 review coming out soon


 
   
  Yes. Received it, tried it, liked it, put it back on the shelf due to lack of time and haven't had a chance to get back to it yet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'll definitely get to it in a week or two. 
   
   
  Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> This is a pretty general question, but of these iems, which would work best for someone who listens to a lot of metal? I don't really have a preferred sound, but I do like the way my brainwavz HM3's sound.
> 
> Gr06
> Am90
> ...


 
   
  The AM90 may not have enough bass and the M2 might have too much. I'd go for the GR06 out of those but you can also get a better BA earphone than the AM-90 in that price range - the Rock-It Sounds R-30, for example, or even the MEElec A161P. Personally, I'd take one of the more accurate BAs for rock and metal, or a dynamic-driver set that's a little more v-shaped than the GR06. The Ultimate Ears 500 comes to mind as a "safe" choice that's been popping up pretty cheap lately.
   
  Quote: 





gnarlee said:


> @joker vsonic gro2 be vs brainwavs m5 vs klipsch s4 i mostly listen to rap and want build quality


 
   
  I'd go for the GR02. Have had a few earphones with that housing and they've all been very reliable, and the sound is arguably the best of the bunch. 
   
  Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> So as to not clog up the forums, does anyone know of a direct upgrade to the RE-ZERO in terms of sound signature? I returned the RE-262 I got recently due to not enough isolation, so now I have funds to upgrade (I tip-rolled like crazy and cannot get enough isolation without compromising the mids). Here's what I'm looking at and what I'm worried about for each:
> 
> 
> TDK BA200 - flat cables are annoying, and the shape looks like the RE-262, so I'm afraid for bad isolation/fit
> ...


 
   
  I would stick with the RE-ZERO. I don't think any of the ones I've heard are exactly what you are looking for with no additional drawbacks.
   
  Quote: 





awtryau89 said:


> Joker,
> I have a quick question about the UE900 and the GR07s. I read your comments about them. I have the GR07 BEs. I like them alot and they are fun with most but I find they seem to collapse and don't really give the best separation and detail when listening to complex music. I have been listening to Holst Planets recently as my preferred test. I also ordered some TDK BA200s. These seem to do a better job with the issues I am having with the GR07 keeping the soundstage outside of my head during more complex passages. Even so, I have a brand new pair that is giving me shorting issues in an earpiece. They also aren't built to the overall quality of the GR07s. Finally we enter the UE900s. I have an opportunity to grab some of these at a great price (around $100 more than the GR07s). Will they do a better job than the GR07s at resolving detail and not "collapsing" as it were? Not sure if I am saying that right but during complex passages the GR07s just seem to lose any soundstage width and I feel as if I am listening to earphones instead of the music swimming around me.
> 
> I think you like the UE900s from all I have read. At what point in a price drop would you put them as the "bang for the buck" IEM?


 
    
  I haven't heard the BA200. The UE900 has a very good presentation, with noticeably better depth and layering compared to the GR07. I think it's the lack of depth that you have an issue with with the GR07. There's not really a price point I can name - for those who don't mind it's minor foibles, the UE900 is definitely worth the price as is. 
   
  Quote:


ktan3142 said:


> How does the sibilance of the GR07 (or MKII) compare to that of the RE-ZERO. I did not find the ZERO to be sibilant at all, so it's probably not my biggest concern. Also, it's weird how you said that the 400 is the GR07 done right, because the 400 is claimed to be "polite," while the GR07 is deemed "fun."


 
   
  It's worse, on the MkI at least. I've never found any of the HiFiMan products sibilant but the GR07 bothers me on occasion, as do its little brothers, the GR06 and GR02 BE.


----------



## bowlofsoup

Ok, to build on the question, I have a pair of FX40's that I think are all right for what I listen to. Is there anything you would think of as a direct upgrade with that sound? The reason the GR06 were so high up on the list is because of the number of tips it comes with. I also hear that they're great for people that like listening to drummers. I have a horrible time getting a fit with even the most basic straight barrels. I guess I should start saving for a pair of customs. Thanks for the help, as always.


----------



## Gasdoc

Hey Joker,
   
  Just got the new Earsonic SM64.  It is a brilliant sounding phone bordering on analytical but retaining some of the best features of the SM3.  The mids/bass are awesome, as is the fit/build.  The treble is detailed, bright but smooth.  Amazing soundstage....Hmmm.  This could be the total package.  Will report back after a week of listening.


----------



## psion84

Quote: 





precsmo said:


> Wow, nice hearing u here! Yes, indeed Yuheng has only one Stage 3 demo. You have very very similar listening preference like I do probably. But I did not have very good impressions with the Miracle, I feel the same like u do, the Miracle is amazingly good I think, but like what you have said, it has more forward mid and it is more analytic type, but really not sure if my audition was reliable at all. I really wish I have a chance to test it out again, but I do not want to trouble Calmshot to meet up again with the proper rubber tips. He is a very friendly person btw!
> 
> Take your time bro, it took me many years to get to this stage too, and I really want to make a move to settle with a top end CIEM. I'm very confident CM Stage 3 will serve me very long time without ever needing to upgrade anymore.


 

 I guess we do have quite similar sound signature preference.haha. i kinda have a feeling y we didnt have good impressions on the miracle was because it was a universal. honestly the miracles in universal form just sounded cramped up in complex songs though they do separate but there is lack of distance between the separation. and the mids just sounded a bit disconnected from the rest of the spectrum making it unnaturally forward. i guess the customs will be so much better. and yea calmshot is awesome.  i had the chance to audit his universal miracle for a week. at least i know we are on the same page that u and i tried the exact same iems. haha. will be looking forward to hearing ur impressions of the compact in custom form. maybe post it in the compact appreciation thread. haha. sorry guys for derailing this awesome thread by joker. back to topic then.


----------



## Sniping

I've heard many good things about the BA-200, do you see yourself reviewing those anytime soon?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> Ok, to build on the question, I have a pair of FX40's that I think are all right for what I listen to. Is there anything you would think of as a direct upgrade with that sound? The reason the GR06 were so high up on the list is because of the number of tips it comes with. I also hear that they're great for people that like listening to drummers. I have a horrible time getting a fit with even the most basic straight barrels. I guess I should start saving for a pair of customs. Thanks for the help, as always.


 
   
  If you can give up a bit of the bass impact, the FXD80 may be considered a more refined take on that signature - still a little thin and mid-recessed, but not as overbearing up top and just more balanced overall. It is straight-barrel, though.
   
  Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Just got the new Earsonic SM64.  It is a brilliant sounding phone bordering on analytical but retaining some of the best features of the SM3.  The mids/bass are awesome, as is the fit/build.  The treble is detailed, bright but smooth.  Amazing soundstage....Hmmm.  This could be the total package.  Will report back after a week of listening.


 
   
  Good to know. Hopefully I'll get a chance to try these at some point.
   
  Quote: 





sniping said:


> I've heard many good things about the BA-200, do you see yourself reviewing those anytime soon?


 

 No plans to do so at this time.


----------



## bowlofsoup

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you can give up a bit of the bass impact, the FXD80 may be considered a more refined take on that signature - still a little thin and mid-recessed, but not as overbearing up top and just more balanced overall. It is straight-barrel, though.
> 
> 
> Good to know. Hopefully I'll get a chance to try these at some point.
> ...


 
   
  Thanks again. Anyone know a reliable place to order these up in the US? Amazon only has imports at the moment.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bowlofsoup said:


> Thanks again. Anyone know a reliable place to order these up in the US? Amazon only has imports at the moment.


 

 As far as I know it's not a JVC US model.


----------



## AstralStorm

Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> So as to not clog up the forums, does anyone know of a direct upgrade to the RE-ZERO in terms of sound signature? I returned the RE-262 I got recently due to not enough isolation, so now I have funds to upgrade (I tip-rolled like crazy and cannot get enough isolation without compromising the mids). Here's what I'm looking at and what I'm worried about for each:
> 
> 
> TDK BA200 - flat cables are annoying, and the shape looks like the RE-262, so I'm afraid for bad isolation/fit
> ...


 

 Well, I'd say of these, B2 have very good build quality - though the cable is quite generic, it is reasonably sturdy yet flexible. Has a small tendency to unbraid. Plastic is better than it feels - I think it's ABS - it isn't stomp-proof I suppose like a metal shell.
  However, it is not a real upgrade from RE-ZERO - more of a side grade. You get more V-shape (midbass and treble boost), more even (smooth) frequency response and less extension (16kHz only), far less reverberation, somewhat less bass impact. Sounds harsher in general, despite smooth frequency response.
  A non-existent improved Etymotic HF5 descendant would be the actual upgrade. Or maybe upcoming Hifiman RE-600.
   
  GR07 aren't an upgrade over RE-ZERO either. In my opinion they're way less refined, though reasonably balanced as well, more even than RE-ZERO. These have boosted bass (not a lot), but hit less hard. Mids are way lower fidelity with these. I wouldn't even consider them. Much less reverberation in these of course. Extension upwards is a bit lesser too, bottom is comparable.
   
  Perhaps TDK IE800? I haven't heard it myself yet. Raw sound signature measurement looks similar to RE-ZERO's, a bit brighter at the highest end, more even with slight subbass boost.


----------



## ktan3142

Thanks for all the replies, everyone. Seems like I won't be upgrading as soon as I imagined, which is always a pity 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Hopefully more people get the AX-7 so I can see how it sounds like. If not, will probably get the BA200 or R-50 for an up/sidegrade.
   
  I tried the HF3 (similar to HF5?) but didn't like it. The dry mids and small soundstage didn't appeal to me, but I can see it being similar to the RE-ZERO.


----------



## dweaver

ktan3142 I have the HF3 and have a pair of TDK IE800 coming in either today or tomorrow. I am a mid/treble lover who is also wanting a headphone with good sub bass and good sound stage. If the IE800 accomplish this I will post something here for you to read.


----------



## ktan3142

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> ktan3142 I have the HF3 and have a pair of TDK IE800 coming in either today or tomorrow. I am a mid/treble lover who is also wanting a headphone with good sub bass and good sound stage. If the IE800 accomplish this I will post something here for you to read.


 
   
  Thanks for suggesting the TDK IE800. I've just looked into it and it looks promising already (aside from the flat cable that is). I'm definitely looking forward for your review.
   
  EDIT: I went through the TDK IE800 "appreciation thread," and wow, I'm definitely hyped for all the impressions.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> Thanks for all the replies, everyone. Seems like I won't be upgrading as soon as I imagined, which is always a pity
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I should get my hands on the AX-7 in a few weeks but I don't expect it to have a performance advantage over the TWFK-based earphones currently on the market. Hoping its build makes it a better overall value, though.


----------



## dweaver

Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> Thanks for all the replies, everyone. Seems like I won't be upgrading as soon as I imagined, which is always a pity
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  OK, I have my IE800 and have let them burn-in for about 20hrs so feel like I can make a post about them for you. I will have to say that out of the box I wasn't as impressed as I hoped to be and I have done a significant amount of tip rolling to see if I can find I tip I like (right now I am actually using the large single flange tip that came with my JVC FXZ100 (which I hated on that IEM) and am getting the best sound out of these so far. These are a deeper insertion IEM but not an uncomfortable one. I do think the burn in has helped these improve and will continue to let them burn in for a another day/evening or two.
   
  Currently I would say these are more of a midrange lover IEM than my desired Mid/treble oriented signature. They do have more bass than HF3 (but possibly not as visceral), they also are not as dry in the mids and they definitely have a larger sound stage. The treble is not poor though, just not as sharp and sparkly as I like. In fact I may a bit of your opposite in that I like the dryer mids of the HF3 so find the IE800 a bit lacking in that area for my tastes. In my case what I want is my SRH-940 or SRH-1440 in an IEM form and the IE800 isn't quite that IEM. But it may be a very good choice for you.


----------



## djvkool

Joker - I'm not sure if you have heard both, how similar/different are the signature between 3.Ai and W3?
   
  Thank you


----------



## jwusoccer

Hey everyone, could anyone point me in the right direction? I've been looking for a pair of iems with an emphasis on bass. The only iem i've tried so far is the re-zero, which i hated. Right now i'm looking at the atrio m5 mg7. Are there any other good choices around that price range? I would like it to keep it ~120 dollars.


----------



## ktan3142

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I should get my hands on the AX-7 in a few weeks but I don't expect it to have a performance advantage over the TWFK-based earphones currently on the market. Hoping its build makes it a better overall value, though.


 
   
  Cheers to that, as I'm really interested in products created from Chinese/Asian companies - so far Hifiman, VSonic, and Fiio haven't disappointed yet.
   
  Quote: 





dweaver said:


> OK, I have my IE800 and have let them burn-in for about 20hrs so feel like I can make a post about them for you. I will have to say that out of the box I wasn't as impressed as I hoped to be and I have done a significant amount of tip rolling to see if I can find I tip I like (right now I am actually using the large single flange tip that came with my JVC FXZ100 (which I hated on that IEM) and am getting the best sound out of these so far. These are a deeper insertion IEM but not an uncomfortable one. I do think the burn in has helped these improve and will continue to let them burn in for a another day/evening or two.
> 
> Currently I would say these are more of a midrange lover IEM than my desired Mid/treble oriented signature. They do have more bass than HF3 (but possibly not as visceral), they also are not as dry in the mids and they definitely have a larger sound stage. The treble is not poor though, just not as sharp and sparkly as I like. In fact I may a bit of your opposite in that I like the dryer mids of the HF3 so find the IE800 a bit lacking in that area for my tastes. In my case what I want is my SRH-940 or SRH-1440 in an IEM form and the IE800 isn't quite that IEM. But it may be a very good choice for you.


 
   
  Thanks for posting your impression of the IE800. I've read your reviews of the 940/1440/1840 a while back, and I have tried my friend's 840 before - found it a *tiny* bit boring. If those three are similar to the 840 in terms of sound signature, then perhaps the IE800 may really be what I'm looking for. AstralStorm also claims that its FR graph makes it sound slightly brighter than the RE-ZERO, which I definitely won't mind. Can you comment on the build quality? If it's good enough, then I think I'll settle with it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Joker - I'm not sure if you have heard both, how similar/different are the signature between 3.Ai and W3?
> 
> Thank you


 
   
  I have not heard the 3.Ai
    
  Quote:


jwusoccer said:


> Hey everyone, could anyone point me in the right direction? I've been looking for a pair of iems with an emphasis on bass. The only iem i've tried so far is the re-zero, which i hated. Right now i'm looking at the atrio m5 mg7. Are there any other good choices around that price range? I would like it to keep it ~120 dollars.


 
   
  The MG7 probably has the best sub-bass-oriented signature but there's other options. The JVC FXT90 is one I liked quite a bit - it has very good impact with less sub-bass rumble and more midrange presence compared to the Atrio.


----------



## dweaver

Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> Cheers to that, as I'm really interested in products created from Chinese/Asian companies - so far Hifiman, VSonic, and Fiio haven't disappointed yet.
> 
> 
> Thanks for posting your impression of the IE800. I've read your reviews of the 940/1440/1840 a while back, and I have tried my friend's 840 before - found it a *tiny* bit boring. If those three are similar to the 840 in terms of sound signature, then perhaps the IE800 may really be what I'm looking for. AstralStorm also claims that its FR graph makes it sound slightly brighter than the RE-ZERO, which I definitely won't mind. Can you comment on the build quality? If it's good enough, then I think I'll settle with it.


 
  Actually I didn't like the 840 that much either and much prefer the 940 which is much more "alive" if you will. The mids and treble of the 940 are insanely detailed and I personally enjoy the bass slam of the 940, it is not as big as some headphones but goes deep and pretty darn hard and the sound stage is amazing for a closed headphone. The 1440 is more or less an open version of the 940 with bit warmer signature and even larger sound stage. The 1840 on the other heand is more "balanced" sounding losing some of the "life" I hear and feel in the 940/1440 models. If you can you should see if you can hear the 940 just to help give you a better perspective on how I am hearing them and the IE800. BTW while I have the 940 listed as for sale I actually will be removing that AD as I have decided to keep them.
   
  The IE800 is not the best built IEM I have owned I would say it is average for the IEM housing and slightly below average for the cable, strain relief (what little there is), and the jack


----------



## Phosphenetre

Dear |joker| and everyone reading this thread, I am looking for a new recommendation after my Rock It Sounds R-50 showed up defective (left earpiece sound dropping off depending on positioning of cable near earpiece housing). Rock It Sounds offered to refund my purchase amount, so I am now looking for an alternative.
   
  I loved the clarity, detail, resolution and separation of the R-50, along with the airy presentation, but I felt it lacked a bit in terms of low-end body and weight. I compared them to my brother's BA200, and the BA200 brought back the more realistic body and weight I was missing, but lost the airy top-end and sounded less detailed and a bit too smoothed-over to me.
   
   In short, I am looking for an IEM that can give me the R-50's fantastic airy presentation and detail, but with a bit of the body, weight and low-end fullness of the BA200. I am open to both armature and dynamic drivers, but I feel armatures might give me more of the detail and resolution I love about the R-50.
   
  Please help, |joker| and other knowledgeable members!


----------



## ktan3142

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> Actually I didn't like the 840 that much either and much prefer the 940 which is much more "alive" if you will. The mids and treble of the 940 are insanely detailed and I personally enjoy the bass slam of the 940, it is not as big as some headphones but goes deep and pretty darn hard and the sound stage is amazing for a closed headphone. The 1440 is more or less an open version of the 940 with bit warmer signature and even larger sound stage. The 1840 on the other heand is more "balanced" sounding losing some of the "life" I hear and feel in the 940/1440 models. If you can you should see if you can hear the 940 just to help give you a better perspective on how I am hearing them and the IE800. BTW while I have the 940 listed as for sale I actually will be removing that AD as I have decided to keep them.
> 
> The IE800 is not the best built IEM I have owned I would say it is average for the IEM housing and slightly below average for the cable, strain relief (what little there is), and the jack


 
   
  I see where you're getting at, because I keep hearing people say that Shure's typical sound sig is mid-centric / good for vocals, but the 840 just didn't impress me much. I do have access to the 940 at J&R - do you think a CMoyBB is enough to drive it to its full potential?
   
  Concerning the ad, I was considering buying the 940 off you to gift to that same friend with the 840. You just saved my wallet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Hmm, I was hoping for a more positive answer on the build quality. It certainly doesn't _look_ that bad, but one never knows - I just hate flat cables


----------



## dweaver

The 940 and 1440 both can be driven well by even just an iPhone or mp3 player so that amp will be plenty good enough. I predict if you have a listen to the 940 and like it, it may become your "upgrade" I have struggled listening to IEM's ever since I found these headphones because I haven't been able to find anything in the IEM world that matches them.


----------



## dweaver

Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> I see where you're getting at, because I keep hearing people say that Shure's typical sound sig is mid-centric / good for vocals, but the 840 just didn't impress me much. I do have access to the 940 at J&R - do you think a CMoyBB is enough to drive it to its full potential?
> 
> Concerning the ad, I was considering buying the 940 off you to gift to that same friend with the 840. You just saved my wallet
> 
> ...


 
  I have been having a listen to the IE800 again this morning and these do seem to be changing with burn in. Let me see what happens after another couple of days of burnin. As of now my appreciation has gone up. The bass sounds a bit fuller and the treble seems to be improving as well. The over all sound is definitely more open.
   
  I am with you in regards to flat cables. To be really honest no one know how durable these will be because they are to new. While I am not a fan of no strain reliefs these may end up being as durable as any other IEM. One thing also, I have found the microphonics on these to be pretty good once I use them over ear. Also this IEM really does benefit from an amp which can be a good or bad thing depending on your point of view.


----------



## ktan3142

Quote: 





dweaver said:


> I have been having a listen to the IE800 again this morning and these do seem to be changing with burn in. Let me see what happens after another couple of days of burnin. As of now my appreciation has gone up. The bass sounds a bit fuller and the treble seems to be improving as well. The over all sound is definitely more open.
> 
> I am with you in regards to flat cables. To be really honest no one know how durable these will be because they are to new. While I am not a fan of no strain reliefs these may end up being as durable as any other IEM. One thing also, I have found the microphonics on these to be pretty good once I use them over ear. Also this IEM really does benefit from an amp which can be a good or bad thing depending on your point of view.


 
   
  That is definitely welcome news. As for the 940, I'm looking strictly at IEMs, since I don't think I can fit a headphone into my bag (despite it being more durable). My main gripe with flat cables is how uncomfortable it is when worn over-the-ears. Also, if they were ever to break, is it possible to recable them with regular round cables - I sure hope so =/. As far as amping goes, I don't mind bringing one along.
   
  EDIT: If it feels like I'm hijacking this thread, we could move this to PMs.


----------



## Leveler

Hello, I have $100 dollars ready to be dropped on some IEMs, I was going to get the Shure SE215s but they where sold out at my local distributor. After looking for a bit, these are my choices:
   
  wait a little bit and get the SE215, for $100
   
  get the Sony XBA1 directly from the sony store, for around $80
   
  or save up a little and go for the XBA2, which are $150 at the sony store
   
  based on value and sound alone, which are more worth it? The Shure dealer also have the SE315s for retail ($200) But I'm not too thrilled about paying that much for a single driver BA, though I do prefer the overall look of the Shure's more
   
  Thanks,
   
  Diego


----------



## Zalithian

Quote: 





leveler said:


> Hello, I have $100 dollars ready to be dropped on some IEMs, I was going to get the Shure SE215s but they where sold out at my local distributor. After looking for a bit, these are my choices:
> 
> wait a little bit and get the SE215, for $100
> 
> ...


 
   
  Just buy them from Amazon. Or is it not possible for you to order online?
   
  http://www.amazon.com/Shure-SE215-K-Sound-Monitor-Black/dp/B004PNZFZ8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359869690&sr=8-1&keywords=SE215
   
  Make sure to buy specifically from Amazon, and not a third party vendor.


----------



## Leveler

Quote: 





zalithian said:


> Just buy them from Amazon. Or is it not possible for you to order online?
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Shure-SE215-K-Sound-Monitor-Black/dp/B004PNZFZ8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359869690&sr=8-1&keywords=SE215
> 
> Make sure to buy specifically from Amazon, and not a third party vendor.


 
  Hello, for me it's kind of a hassle to buy online, and it's close to a month from when I order till I get them. But basically what you are saying is that the Shures are better right? If so, I'd rather just wait till they have them locally
   
  Thanks a lot for the response,
   
  Diego


----------



## Zalithian

Ah I see, because of your location. Well, I can't say as I haven't heard any of those. Hopefully someone with experience can chime in, but generally the XBA series is not well regarded here, especially for their price.


----------



## Leveler

Quote: 





zalithian said:


> Ah I see, because of your location. Well, I can't say as I haven't heard any of those. Hopefully someone with experience can chime in, but generally the XBA series is not well regarded here, especially for their price.


 
  Yes, I figured, since most say the XBA-3s are good for $100, so it's a big no for the other two at the prices I can get them. I guess I'll have to wait till the Shure's are here, if anything, ordering online is an option, but the waiting, oh the waiting


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





danielkrego said:


> Dear |joker| and everyone reading this thread, I am looking for a new recommendation after my Rock It Sounds R-50 showed up defective (left earpiece sound dropping off depending on positioning of cable near earpiece housing). Rock It Sounds offered to refund my purchase amount, so I am now looking for an alternative.
> 
> I loved the clarity, detail, resolution and separation of the R-50, along with the airy presentation, but I felt it lacked a bit in terms of low-end body and weight. I compared them to my brother's BA200, and the BA200 brought back the more realistic body and weight I was missing, but lost the airy top-end and sounded less detailed and a bit too smoothed-over to me.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Unfortunately I haven't heard the BA-200 yet. Not sure of your budget but the PFE 232 would be an option for a clear-sounding BA-based earphone with plenty of bass punch. 
   
  Quote: 





leveler said:


> Hello, I have $100 dollars ready to be dropped on some IEMs, I was going to get the Shure SE215s but they where sold out at my local distributor. After looking for a bit, these are my choices:
> 
> wait a little bit and get the SE215, for $100
> 
> ...


 
   
  I've only heard the XBA-1 briefly and the XBA-2 not at all. It will really depend on what you want from your IEMs - the SE215 follows an enhanced-bass signature with a warm tonal character. The XBA-1 is more balanced and neutral - its sonic competitors would be things like the UE 600 and Etymotic MC5.


----------



## Leveler

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've only heard the XBA-1 briefly and the XBA-2 not at all. It will really depend on what you want from your IEMs - the SE215 follows an enhanced-bass signature with a warm tonal character. The XBA-1 is more balanced and neutral - its sonic competitors would be things like the UE 600 and Etymotic MC5.


 
  But then, quality wise, they are similar?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





leveler said:


> But then, quality wise, they are similar?


 

 I've only heard the XBA-1 briefly. I had just the GR07 and Fischer SBA-03 with me and I didn't think it was as good as either of those, but it's also cheaper now. For me it comes down to the type of sound you want - it won't matter if the XBA-1 is technically better than the SE215 if you prefer enhanced bass, for example.


----------



## Leveler

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've only heard the XBA-1 briefly. I had just the GR07 and Fischer SBA-03 with me and I didn't think it was as good as either of those, but it's also cheaper now. For me it comes down to the type of sound you want - it won't matter if the XBA-1 is technically better than the SE215 if you prefer enhanced bass, for example.


 
  Thanks a lot for the advice, I'll wait some time and if the store doesn't call me to say the have some 215s in stock I'll pick up the XBA-1... I know I'll be happy with either but I like the 215s better aesthetically
   
  Again, Thanks!
   
  Diego


----------



## Phosphenetre

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I haven't heard the BA-200 yet. Not sure of your budget but the PFE 232 would be an option for a clear-sounding BA-based earphone with plenty of bass punch.
> 
> 
> I've only heard the XBA-1 briefly and the XBA-2 not at all. It will really depend on what you want from your IEMs - the SE215 follows an enhanced-bass signature with a warm tonal character. The XBA-1 is more balanced and neutral - its sonic competitors would be things like the UE 600 and Etymotic MC5.


 
   
  My budget is about USD 200 or less. The PFE232 is unfortunately too expensive for me.
   
  After reading through your epic thread again from scratch (I cannot thank you enough for the amount of work and detail you put into this), I am closely looking at the Fischer Audio DBA-02 MkII and the *VSonic GR01 *as possible candidates. Of these two earphones, which do you think comes closer to a neutral, accurate signature with a bit more body than the R-50? I like the idea of the DBA-02 MkII, will it offer a bit more low-end body and presence without straying too far from neutral? The GR01 sounds like it falls more towards a warm sound than neutral.


----------



## scootsit

Just throwing this out there. Rumor has it, the GR01 will be ~$130 after 10 Feb.


----------



## IIMaxII

Why isn't this sticked?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





danielkrego said:


> My budget is about USD 200 or less. The PFE232 is unfortunately too expensive for me.
> 
> After reading through your epic thread again from scratch (I cannot thank you enough for the amount of work and detail you put into this), I am closely looking at the Fischer Audio DBA-02 MkII and the *VSonic GR01 *as possible candidates. Of these two earphones, which do you think comes closer to a neutral, accurate signature with a bit more body than the R-50? I like the idea of the DBA-02 MkII, will it offer a bit more low-end body and presence without straying too far from neutral? The GR01 sounds like it falls more towards a warm sound than neutral.


 
   
  Both the DBA-02 MkII and GR01 would work for you - it just seemed like you were looking for a more drastic change from the R-50. The GR01 and DBA-02 use the same driver and the sound signature differences you're looking at with them are at most a few dB here and a few dB there. The GR01 is slightly less neutral than the mkII but honestly I'd go for that just because it's more dissimilar to the R-50. Also, if the price drop does occur in a few days, it'll be quite a bit cheaper. 
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Just throwing this out there. Rumor has it, the GR01 will be ~$130 after 10 Feb.


 
   
  Good stuff.
   
  Quote: 





iimaxii said:


> Why isn't this sticked?


 

 That's up to the admin team.


----------



## NewForce

Quote: 





leveler said:


> Thanks a lot for the advice, I'll wait some time and if the store doesn't call me to say the have some 215s in stock I'll pick up the XBA-1... I know I'll be happy with either but I like the 215s better aesthetically
> 
> Again, Thanks!
> 
> Diego


 
  Leveler, I've tested XBA-1 last year. To me,
   
  1. Bass response not articulate (muddy?)
  2. Mid & treble clarity was not good and soundstage are not good either.
   
  Lastly, it's not even 1/3 of what TDK BA200 capable of.


----------



## iBringDaLULZ

Quick question: Has anyone converted all of Joker's IEM statistics from the spreadsheet into a relational database yet? I feel like using this to brush up on my database-building skills but I don't wanna waste my time on it if it's already been done D:


----------



## johnnycr

Thanks for all these reviews Joker.  I have a question for you (or anyone else).  I'm looking to get a pair of IEMs under $20 and I'm overwhelmed by the options.  I'm really interested in the Meelectronics M9s for accessories, build, sound quality, etc.  However, I see that you gave the JVC FX40s a much better score on sound.  Both got 9/10 for value.  Are the JVCs a better buy on the basis of sound alone?  I guess what I really want to know is whether the difference in SQ is enough to overlook the limited accessories, quality, etc. of the FX40s?


----------



## thesuperguy

I've been monitoring your reviews and advice on this thread for quite a while and I must ask, how have you become so adept at distinguishing the quality of sound, any minor fluctuations and being able to give a rating on sound essentially out of 100? I seem to have quite some trouble at noticing these small changes in sound quality and because of that, I am apprehensive in investing in a higher end pair of earphones even though I really want to do so. I currently own the VSonic GR99s and possibly plan on upgrading to either the Rock-it Sounds R50 or perhaps the Etymotic HF5. I'm just scared that this upgrade won't sound like much to my seemingly untrained ears.
   
  How do you do it and do you have any advice for others?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ibringdalulz said:


> Quick question: Has anyone converted all of Joker's IEM statistics from the spreadsheet into a relational database yet? I feel like using this to brush up on my database-building skills but I don't wanna waste my time on it if it's already been done D:


 
   
  Not that I know.
   
  Quote: 





johnnycr said:


> Thanks for all these reviews Joker.  I have a question for you (or anyone else).  I'm looking to get a pair of IEMs under $20 and I'm overwhelmed by the options.  I'm really interested in the Meelectronics M9s for accessories, build, sound quality, etc.  However, I see that you gave the JVC FX40s a much better score on sound.  Both got 9/10 for value.  Are the JVCs a better buy on the basis of sound alone?  I guess what I really want to know is whether the difference in SQ is enough to overlook the limited accessories, quality, etc. of the FX40s?


 
   
  That's why they both have the same value score- the FX40 wins on sound (technically, though I don't personally like its signature) while the M9 is better in other ways. Accessories may not be a big deal but I do prefer the fit of the M9 over the FX40, too. If you're going to give up the accessories you might as well just get a Philips SHE3850 or 3590 instead. Sound is up there with the FX40 and it's small and comfortable. The only area where it loses to the FX40 IMO is cable noise, which is still not that bad if you wear it over-the-ear. 
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> I've been monitoring your reviews and advice on this thread for quite a while and I must ask, how have you become so adept at distinguishing the quality of sound, any minor fluctuations and being able to give a rating on sound essentially out of 100? I seem to have quite some trouble at noticing these small changes in sound quality and because of that, I am apprehensive in investing in a higher end pair of earphones even though I really want to do so. I currently own the VSonic GR99s and possibly plan on upgrading to either the Rock-it Sounds R50 or perhaps the Etymotic HF5. I'm just scared that this upgrade won't sound like much to my seemingly untrained ears.
> 
> How do you do it and do you have any advice for others?


 

 It's just experience, plus the ability to A:B a lot of different products and read what has already been written about them quite extensively (the first 10 or 15 sets I bought were all past head-fi favorites). All of my scoring is hierarchical, done via a series of direct A:B comparisons. The scale was also a 20-point scale originally, then 40 points, and now 100 points. I think anyone can learn to distinguish finer differences given time and a few different sets of headphones. The GR99 and an R-50/HF5 would be a good start as they're quite different. You will want to use the higher-end set exclusively for a while and then more back to the GR99 - that way you'll notice the changes more easily.


----------



## thesuperguy

Thanks, and I would also like to ask if my Fiio E6 amp connected to my ipod would make a worthy improvement in sound for either the R50 or the HF5 for the inconvenience of having that extra bit of stuff to carry around and the slightly annoying square bulge coming out of my pocket


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> Thanks, and I would also like to ask if my Fiio E6 amp connected to my ipod would make a worthy improvement in sound for either the R50 or the HF5 for the inconvenience of having that extra bit of stuff to carry around and the slightly annoying square bulge coming out of my pocket


 

 Only you can make that decision. Do you already have the E6? Are you using the LOD cable? I would guess that it would make a bit of a difference, given the lower output impedance. I would consider the E5 over the E6, if you haven't bought one yet.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> Thanks, and I would also like to ask if my Fiio E6 amp connected to my ipod would make a worthy improvement in sound for either the R50 or the HF5 for the inconvenience of having that extra bit of stuff to carry around and the slightly annoying square bulge coming out of my pocket


 

 The R-50 probably more so than the HF5 but for the same money I would invest in some aftermarket tips instead.


----------



## Mani ATH 87

Thanks for this in depth (huge understatement!) review of so many IEM's IjokerI.

 I've been using public transit and walking a lot since I started a new job recently and for the first time I've decided to buy a quality pair of IEM's. I'm not going overboard on the spending as it's more of a casual daily listen I'll be doing, but I decided on the Audeo Perfect Bass PFE 012. They seem to get many positive reviews as well as being recommended as a solid earphone for the price. Comfort has always been a huge issue for me with earphones, but these look to be pretty comfy!


----------



## Impulse

thesuperguy said:


> I've been monitoring your reviews and advice on this thread for quite a while and I must ask, how have you become so adept at distinguishing the quality of sound, any minor fluctuations and being able to give a rating on sound essentially out of 100? I seem to have quite some trouble at noticing these small changes in sound quality and because of that, I am apprehensive in investing in a higher end pair of earphones even though I really want to do so. I currently own the VSonic GR99s and possibly plan on upgrading to either the Rock-it Sounds R50 or perhaps the Etymotic HF5. I'm just scared that this upgrade won't sound like much to my seemingly untrained ears.
> 
> How do you do it and do you have any advice for others?




FWIW, I went thru a couple of different low budget IEM over the last couple of years (see my signature/profile) and even tho I could tell the difference between them, if I was comparing them directly one after the other, it wasn't really something that stuck out a day later or something I could easily remember and identify them by (CX300 being the possible exception).

However, I was definitely impressed once I stepped up to the hf3 (same as hf5), it was very noticeable even without having having my other IEM on hand to compare. I'm sure the vastly different sound signature of the Etys (compared to my MEEs, JVC, etc.) plays a role in that, but it wasn't the sole differentiation or improvement.

I went thru a few cheaper IEM not because I was looking for a different sound per se btw, mostly just because I had different uses for them (exercise pair, travel/beater pair, etc.). Still do, only got the hf3 because I found them for a great price, but I'm quite glad I did. Would probably pay the regular price if I had to replace them for some reason.




ljokerl said:


> The R-50 probably more so than the HF5 but for the same money I would invest in some aftermarket tips instead.




Any recommendations for the hf5? I'd reference the first post but it tends to wreck my phone's browser so I'll have to check later

I've gotten used to the triple flanges, tho they still feel odd after an hour or so and it still takes me some fidgeting to get them in proper... Been thinking about the custom tips they offer, guess I should at least try some of the MEElec tips I have first tho, I have no issues with those on my M6 or the M9 I had.


----------



## thesuperguy

I'm sorry for posing so many questions one after another but I managed to find the Hifiman RE262s on amazon for a very respectable price and I noticed that they require quite a bit of extra oomph to get going well. I would like to know if my E6 will provide sufficient power to these earphones and if the sound quality would remain near the 9.1 rating given with this relatively cheap amp.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mani ath 87 said:


> Thanks for this in depth (huge understatement!) review of so many IEM's IjokerI.
> 
> I've been using public transit and walking a lot since I started a new job recently and for the first time I've decided to buy a quality pair of IEM's. I'm not going overboard on the spending as it's more of a casual daily listen I'll be doing, but I decided on the Audeo Perfect Bass PFE 012. They seem to get many positive reviews as well as being recommended as a solid earphone for the price. Comfort has always been a huge issue for me with earphones, but these look to be pretty comfy!


 
   






 Good choice!
   
  Quote: 





impulse said:


> Any recommendations for the hf5? I'd reference the first post but it tends to wreck my phone's browser so I'll have to check later
> 
> I've gotten used to the triple flanges, tho they still feel odd after an hour or so and it still takes me some fidgeting to get them in proper... Been thinking about the custom tips they offer, guess I should at least try some of the MEElec tips I have first tho, I have no issues with those on my M6 or the M9 I had.


 
   
   
  l was thinking more in terms of the Rock-It R-50 - the HF5 already comes with some nice tips. I do have the ACS custom tips for the HF5 and think they are worth it for those who can't get comfortable with the Ety triples. 
   
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> I'm sorry for posing so many questions one after another but I managed to find the Hifiman RE262s on amazon for a very respectable price and I noticed that they require quite a bit of extra oomph to get going well. I would like to know if my E6 will provide sufficient power to these earphones and if the sound quality would remain near the 9.1 rating given with this relatively cheap amp.


 

 I don't have any of the small Fiio amps but my E7 works well with the HiFiMan sets.


----------



## thesuperguy

:/ the E7 is undeniably more expensive but more importantly, not very portable looking...


----------



## mike017

Just want to thank IjokerI for the review, this is frankly the best and most extensive review of any sort I have ever read. I have already made a few purchases solo based on it.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the JVC HA-FX101 and Spider TinyEar
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B37) JVC HA-FX101*
> 
> 
> Added Feb 2013
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A76) Spider TinyEar*
> 
> 
> Added Feb 2013
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





mike017 said:


> Just want to thank IjokerI for the review, this is frankly the best and most extensive review of any sort I have ever read. I have already made *a few purchases* solo based on it.


 






 I hope they were good ones!


----------



## raykoh5

Thanks for the reviews! Bought the re262 and lovin every single thing about them, especially  the incredible mids. Too bad they're discontinued. Hope to see a review of the new re400 if you can fit that into your list.


----------



## goodvibes

I liked the tinyear except for the top. The doubles were best suited of those given.


----------



## esteebin

Hello Joker,
   
  First of all great job on the ever expanding review of IEMs. Keep up the great info!
   
  Second, i purchased the Sony XBA-4ip a few weeks ago after a sticker price error had it at the XBA-2 range. The sound is very nice, clear and smooth. These are my first BA driver IEM, let alone quad drivers! What amazed me was the energy on the high end. Very nice without having sibilance or piercing. My previous IEM (aside from the horrible apple earbuds and the one that came with the Sony NWZ-A818, which I liked) are the Skullcandy FMJ, V-Moda Vibe Duo, and the Sol Republic Amps HD. After listening to the XBA-4ip, I cannot go back to the Vibe Duo or the Amps HD; just too much low end and not enough highs-almost muddy. But I only want to use the XBA-4ip occasionally.
   
  My questions is, I am looking for a daily use IEM with similar sound characteristic (nice highs with some bass) as the XBA-4 but in the 50-and-under range. I was thinking of the astrotec AM-90, Rockit R-20 or maybe the Brainwavz R1 dual dynamic. Or something else that you can suggest. Thank you!


----------



## thesuperguy

After further research into the E7, I realized that the amp portion of it seems to be actually inferior in terms of sound quality to the E6 itself! The E7 also happens to have the same output power as the E6 and taking your word for the E7 being sufficient, I can only assume that the E6 will be better. As you can expect, the RE262s are on my way.
   
  Thanks a bunch Joker!


----------



## MisterCats

Cool stuff, Joker. Now I'm torn:
   
  - NuForce NE-700X. Had a pair months ago and my cat ate it (don't ask). Before that, they were the love of my life. NuForce updated and re-released the NuForce NE-700M and 700X not even three days ago, and I'm really curious.
   
  - Rockit-Sounds R-50. Not too sure if I should take a chance on these, but they seem to be supremely bang-for-buck.
   
  No DACs or Amps at the moment, and my only two sources are a Rockboxed Clip Zip and a Nexus 4 (if the output impedance is anything like its identical brother, the LG Optimus G, then it should be up to the task of driving solo without much fuss).
   
  Do I put forth the extra dollars for Rockit-Sounds?
   
  Edit: It's mostly on-the-go listening to just about every genre to exist


----------



## nick n

What did NuForce change or tweak about the 700 series?
   
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





raykoh5 said:


> Thanks for the reviews! Bought the re262 and lovin every single thing about them, especially  the incredible mids. Too bad they're discontinued. Hope to see a review of the new re400 if you can fit that into your list.


 
   
  I have the RE400 on hand. Pre burn-in it sounds very good. I'll get back to it in a week or two.  
   
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> I liked the tinyear except for the top. The doubles were best suited of those given.


 
   
  I think they went a little too far with the whole small ears thing - all of the included tips are on the smaller side and the bi-flanges don't seal for me.
   
  Quote: 





esteebin said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> First of all great job on the ever expanding review of IEMs. Keep up the great info!
> 
> ...


 
   
  I would go for the VSonic VC02. Review should be posted pretty soon. The R-20 and AM-90 are very decent but the Knowles SR armature generally doesn't have the best treble energy and is stronger in the midrange.  
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> After further research into the E7, I realized that the amp portion of it seems to be actually inferior in terms of sound quality to the E6 itself! The E7 also happens to have the same output power as the E6 and taking your word for the E7 being sufficient, I can only assume that the E6 will be better. As you can expect, the RE262s are on my way.
> 
> Thanks a bunch Joker!


 
   
  Good call - seems they will all be gone soon. 
   
  Quote: 





mistercats said:


> Cool stuff, Joker. Now I'm torn:
> 
> - NuForce NE-700X. Had a pair months ago and my cat ate it (don't ask). Before that, they were the love of my life. NuForce updated and re-released the NuForce NE-700M and 700X not even three days ago, and I'm really curious.
> 
> ...


 

 The R-50 and NE-700X probably couldn't sound more different. You'd be taking a huge chance on the R-50 if you liked the sound of the Nuforces. I would consider something closer to the NE-700X signature but from a higher tier - the Yamaha EPH-100, for example. But, who knows - maybe you'll like the R-50 anyway. It is very good for a BA monitor.


----------



## esteebin

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would go for the VSonic VC02. Review should be posted pretty soon. The R-20 and AM-90 are very decent but the Knowles SR armature generally doesn't have the best treble energy and is stronger in the midrange.


 
   
  Looking forward for that review! Went ahead and googled the VC02 and liked what I see. Nice that the cable detaches- If ever the cable needs to be replaced, where could I get a new one? - Is it like the Westone or TF10?
  3mm micro driver- should mean it's light and compact. Bass still there though, right?


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think they went a little too far with the whole small ears thing - all of the included tips are on the smaller side and the bi-flanges don't seal for me.


 
  I'd have to agree. I remember they said it was for folks with small ears. Kind of limiting. I just got a seal with the doubles and good push. I played with other tips as well and nothing quite made them go. Seemed like they had more to offer and be really good but I couldn't find it. Just a nice option. They guy I gave them too really enjoys them. He's got small canals.


----------



## max the noob

ljokerl thanks for the great and very comprehensive review.  I wanted to ask your advice or anyone else about what I should do regarding replacing/upgrading my current IEM's.  I am very inexperienced so please bear with me.  I currently have 2 sets of Audeo pf 112's.  I use one as a beater set and one that I try to keep nice.  My beater set is now not working correctly and I wanted to get a new set that I will use as my nice set.  I was about to order the the Audeo PFE 232's but I decided to do a little reasearch first, that is how I found your review.  I read some of the review mostly concentrating on the IEM's >$150. I like the fit and sound of the PFE 112's with the grey filter I also occasionally use the black filter.  That is why I wanted to order the PFE 232's but I was intrigued by the Hifiman 262's and as I scrolled down I also thought I might as well go all the way and possibly get the Miracle or the Spiral Ear.
   
I did have some questions.  I haven't used and amp before and I would prefer not to use one due to having another device and having to charge another item but if it will greatly improve my experience I am open to the idea.  The volume on my PFE 122's are adequate for me but I hear that an amp can improve the experience.  I will be using these on an iphone 4s 80% of the time.  I do not take care of my equipment very well so a robust design is important to me.  In your opinion what would you recommend?  Should I just go with a less expensive set, amp or no amp, if an amp what would you recommend? I can afford a higher end set but if it is just a waste of money I would prefer not to do it.  Sorry for the long post and thanks for any help you might provide.


----------



## davidcotton

Hi
   
  Been a while since I posted as have been on quest for customs.  Been more of a pita than I thought it would be.
   
  Anyway if this lot don't work out (and I'm hopeful) I'm going to be in the market for a top notch pair of iems once and for all.  Music is progressive/melodic rock (along with audiobooks).  Been thinking along the lines of either earsonics sm3 v2, Phonak Audeo pf 232 and Westone 4 or um3x (had the w3 which I liked but went through the wash).   Isolation is very important for me as I need these to block out the crap going on at work.  Also considering either of the two heir universals 3ai or 4ai, but don't think you've heard those.
   
  Any other suggestions with good to great isolation (atm I'm using klipsch x10 but don't like the lack of durability)accepted!
   
  Cheers


----------



## max the noob

I would have added this to my original post but I am so new I can't edit.  I just saw on the Phonak website that the will no longer be making any IEM's, this removes the PFE 232's for me.  I can't see spending $500 on a product and not be assured of getting replacement parts, several years in the future.  Like I said earlier I have 2 PFE 122's so I do like their products so I am disappointed that they have decided to just concentrate on their hearing aid products.  I would like to add that I use the large silicone tips that come with the PFE 122's.  They seem to fit my ear better than any other silicone tip that I have tried (I will admit that I haven't tried many).  I was wondering if most tips fit most IEM's because I noticed in Joker's review of the PFE122's that he used another brands tip and got a better fit for his ears.  Specifically will the PFE tips fit the Hifiman RE262's.  I have ordered a set of RE262's but I am anxiously awaiting the review of the RE400's.  I am still thinking about a high end IEM that is custom so any help in that department would be appreciated.


----------



## max the noob

Another post from me.  I am trying to get my post count up so I can access other features of this site.  Is their a good thread for a simpleton like me discussing lower priced portable amps.  I looked in that section but was a little overwhelmed.  Can anyone recommend a good starting point for someone looking for their first amp around $100?


----------



## zerocoolhifi

max the noob said:


> Another post from me.  I am trying to get my post count up so I can access other features of this site.  Is their a good thread for a simpleton like me discussing lower priced portable amps.  I looked in that section but was a little overwhelmed.  Can anyone recommend a good starting point for someone looking for their first amp around $100?




C&C BH


----------



## max the noob

Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> C&C BH


 
  Thanks you have any recommendations about where to buy?  I saw a few on eBay but they all gave a disclaimer about shipping if the item was defective or under warranty.  Basically I was responsible fro shipping back and if after 10 days I would have to pay shipping to return as well.


----------



## max the noob

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi
> 
> Been a while since I posted as have been on quest for customs.  Been more of a pita than I thought it would be.
> 
> ...


 
  What customs have you been looking at?  Just so I know what has been so much of a pita from your prospective about customs.  I am also thinking about customs and would like to know.  
   
  Thanks, or as they say on your side of the pond Cheers


----------



## zerocoolhifi

max the noob said:


> Thanks you have any recommendations about where to buy?  I saw a few on eBay but they all gave a disclaimer about shipping if the item was defective or under warranty.  Basically I was responsible fro shipping back and if after 10 days I would have to pay shipping to return as well.




Pollychen on eBay is where most of us have purchased from, transaction was excellent for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





esteebin said:


> Looking forward for that review! Went ahead and googled the VC02 and liked what I see. Nice that the cable detaches- If ever the cable needs to be replaced, where could I get a new one? - Is it like the Westone or TF10?
> 3mm micro driver- should mean it's light and compact. Bass still there though, right?


 
   
  My custom cables seem to fit so anything Westone ES-compatible should work. Customs cables aren't perfect for these, though - the connectors are straight instead of angled. Maybe VSonic will make the stock cable available separately at some point. 
   
  The bass is nice for a balanced-sounding earphone. I really don't have many complaints with these.
   
  Quote: 





max the noob said:


> ljokerl thanks for the great and very comprehensive review.  I wanted to ask your advice or anyone else about what I should do regarding replacing/upgrading my current IEM's.  I am very inexperienced so please bear with me.  I currently have 2 sets of Audeo pf 112's.  I use one as a beater set and one that I try to keep nice.  My beater set is now not working correctly and I wanted to get a new set that I will use as my nice set.  I was about to order the the Audeo PFE 232's but I decided to do a little reasearch first, that is how I found your review.  I read some of the review mostly concentrating on the IEM's >$150. I like the fit and sound of the PFE 112's with the grey filter I also occasionally use the black filter.  That is why I wanted to order the PFE 232's but I was intrigued by the Hifiman 262's and as I scrolled down I also thought I might as well go all the way and possibly get the Miracle or the Spiral Ear.
> 
> I did have some questions.  I haven't used and amp before and I would prefer not to use one due to having another device and having to charge another item but if it will greatly improve my experience I am open to the idea.  The volume on my PFE 122's are adequate for me but I hear that an amp can improve the experience.  I will be using these on an iphone 4s 80% of the time.  I do not take care of my equipment very well so a robust design is important to me.  In your opinion what would you recommend?  Should I just go with a less expensive set, amp or no amp, if an amp what would you recommend? I can afford a higher end set but if it is just a waste of money I would prefer not to do it.  Sorry for the long post and thanks for any help you might provide.


 
   
  The iPhone 4S has very positive sound characteristics in my experience. I wouldn't shrug at using it to drive a top-tier earphone. However, I can't tell you if getting a high-end set as a daily beater is a "waste of money". Only you can make that decision. I will say that I have not been very careful with some of my customs just to see what would happen. I once got my Alclair Reference caught in door in a really bad way. The cable detached from both earpieces and from my mp3 player. Had to bend the cable pins back into place but other than that no permanent damage. 
   
  If you're looking to stay reasonably close to the PFE 112 sound signature without spending a whole lot the ClearTuneMonitors CTM-200 might be an option - it's about as durable as any other custom would be and offers a reasonably balanced sound slightly focused on the midrange and treble.
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi
> 
> Been a while since I posted as have been on quest for customs.  Been more of a pita than I thought it would be.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The SM3 sounds very different from the PFE 232 so either you are open to all different sound signatures or aren't quite sure what you are after. I prefer the Phonaks for rock over the SM3 and UM3X, personally.  If you're focusing on similarly-priced customs, the Alclair Reference would be my pick - it has a somewhat similar signature to the 232 with some added bass punch and energetic, slightly hot treble. Keep in mind I only have a couple of entry-level customs and haven't heard things like the heir 3ai/4ai but I have compared the Alclairs and Phonaks at length and almost always ended up favoring the Reference.


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, did you heard the ATH-CKM500?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Mr. Joker - what is your recommendation for a Dual/Triple BA for mostly rock. I really like the deep punchy bass and mids yet clear crisp highs. I currently have the GR07 BE and will be getting the FX700 on your recommendation but would also like an upper end BA. I already have the X10 which I like when amped but looking for an upgrade to those. Would like be around $200-$250 range but can alter that if needed. I do not need the exact same sound signature as I do like to change things up but they just cannot be bass lacking or muddy/veiled highs. Thank you Sir.


----------



## famas48

Hi, excellent work on reviews.
   
   
  I wanted to ask how would u compare soundmagic e10 to beyerdybamic dtx101e or brainwavs m4/m5?
  How is the sound compared to these? Also would like to know if u have tried sony mh1c and tell hows the bass compared to soundmagic?
  Looking to earphone with great bass, but also with clear and good sound


----------



## max the noob

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


>


 


> The iPhone 4S has very positive sound characteristics in my experience. I wouldn't shrug at using it to drive a top-tier earphone. However, I can't tell you if getting a high-end set as a daily beater is a "waste of money". Only you can make that decision. I will say that I have not been very careful with some of my customs just to see what would happen. I once got my Alclair Reference caught in door in a really bad way. The cable detached from both earpieces and from my mp3 player. Had to bend the cable pins back into place but other than that no permanent damage.
> 
> If you're looking to stay reasonably close to the PFE 112 sound signature without spending a whole lot the ClearTuneMonitors CTM-200 might be an option - it's about as durable as any other custom would be and offers a reasonably balanced sound slightly focused on the midrange and treble.


 
  Thanks for responding Joker.  I wasn't very clear in my post so I will attempt to clarify.  I will be using my PFE 122's or the Hm RE 262's as the beater set but I was thinking about going the custom route for my nice set.  I don't want to go though the trouble of a custom just to get a mid level set.  I would prefer to go all the way, just from quick reading of this site and others I was thinking of the UM Miracle.  It seems like it is well balanced, (the detractors just have minor complaints and it is not an item where some hate it and some love it).  I personally prefer to spend the money up front and not spent the next 6 months worrying if I made the right choice and if another option would have been worth the money.  Let me know if you or anyone else has some advice for me.  
   
  I have learned so much in the past 24 hours that I have been on this site.  Thanks to all.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, did you heard the ATH-CKM500?
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  Yep, have one right here. It's a little v-shaped but not bad overall, reminds me of the CKM99. Review coming soon. 
   
  Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> Mr. Joker - what is your recommendation for a Dual/Triple BA for mostly rock. I really like the deep punchy bass and mids yet clear crisp highs. I currently have the GR07 BE and will be getting the FX700 on your recommendation but would also like an upper end BA. I already have the X10 which I like when amped but looking for an upgrade to those. Would like be around $200-$250 range but can alter that if needed. I do not need the exact same sound signature as I do like to change things up but they just cannot be bass lacking or muddy/veiled highs. Thank you Sir.


 
   
  In that price range most of the dual BAs will have a TWFK, which doesn't have a whole lot of bass. You might just be best off with a plain ol' Triple.Fi 10. 
   
  Quote: 





famas48 said:


> Hi, excellent work on reviews.
> 
> 
> I wanted to ask how would u compare soundmagic e10 to beyerdybamic dtx101e or brainwavs m4/m5?
> ...


 
   
  I have not heard the MH1C yet, or the Brainwavz M4. Between the E10, DTX101, and M5 the M5 is the bassiest with the most laid-back treble. The DTX101 has a similar but more balanced sound and the E10 has the least bass and is the most v-shaped, with slightly more treble energy compared to the M5 and DTX101. It's also the most spacious. 
   
  Quote: 





max the noob said:


> Thanks for responding Joker.  I wasn't very clear in my post so I will attempt to clarify.  I will be using my PFE 122's or the Hm RE 262's as the beater set but I was thinking about going the custom route for my nice set.  I don't want to go though the trouble of a custom just to get a mid level set.  I would prefer to go all the way, just from quick reading of this site and others I was thinking of the UM Miracle.  It seems like it is well balanced, (the detractors just have minor complaints and it is not an item where some hate it and some love it).  I personally prefer to spend the money up front and not spent the next 6 months worrying if I made the right choice and if another option would have been worth the money.  Let me know if you or anyone else has some advice for me.
> 
> I have learned so much in the past 24 hours that I have been on this site.  Thanks to all.


 

 Well, I prefer the Miracle to pretty much everything else I've reviewed here so that's an easy choice for me. You just have to have diminishing returns in mind and not expect a 5x improvement over the PFE112.


----------



## funsound

I'm pondering on whether I should get the mtpc, miles Davis tribute, miles trumpet or Yamaha eph-100. I listen mostly to modern pop, hiphop, and instrumentals. I had the pfe232 before and wouldve liked a tiny bit more bass. I also look for soundstage, seperation, and isolation. What would you recommend?


----------



## Selenium

Out of the Monsters I'd recommend the Trumpets.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





selenium said:


> Out of the Monsters I'd recommend the Trumpets.


 

 Yeah, that or the EPH-100 for me. They are not too different.


----------



## famas48

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have not heard the MH1C yet, or the Brainwavz M4. Between the E10, DTX101, and M5 the M5 is the bassiest with the most laid-back treble. The DTX101 has a similar but more balanced sound and the E10 has the least bass and is the most v-shaped, with slightly more treble energy compared to the M5 and DTX101. It's also the most spacious.


 
  Thanks for answer. Looking for deep, good bass but which doesnt desort other frequences like mids and such. I heard hippo vb has clear mids with amazing bass. So which one would u recommend m5, hippo vb or dtx101ie?


----------



## MidNightx

Spoiler: ASK%20comparison%20Brainwavz%20R1%20vs%20MEElec%20M6%20vs%20Soundmagic%20E30



 
  Hi all Head-Fi'ers / Head-Fi addict / Audiophiliac or whatever they said... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 greetings I'm a newbie,
 I didn't see Brainwavz R1 on the first page...
 I want to ask about comparison Brainwavz R1 vs MEElec M6 vs Soundmagic E30
  because three of them are *over the ear *types under $50
 it will very precious for me about your advice.

 Thanks before
 Bless U All
  
  *Sorry for my bad english 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   


   
  or please answer on my thread http://www.head-fi.org/t/650512/ask-comparison-brainwavz-r1-vs-meelec-m6-vs-soundmagic-e30-over-the-ear-under-50


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





famas48 said:


> Thanks for answer. Looking for deep, good bass but which doesnt desort other frequences like mids and such. I heard hippo vb has clear mids with amazing bass. So which one would u recommend m5, hippo vb or dtx101ie?


 
   
  The VB has good deep bass but not much mid-bass. In that respect it has the least bass bleed but I'm not sure that's the type of bass you are looking for. It's definitely not the type of bass I think of when I see a request for "bass-heavy" earphones. I would say M5 (bassier) or DTX101 (more balanced) would both be good options.  
   
  Quote: 





midnightx said:


> Spoiler: ASK%20comparison%20Brainwavz%20R1%20vs%20MEElec%20M6%20vs%20Soundmagic%20E30
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I have not reviewed the R1. Between the M6 and E30 I would always go for the E30 unless you must have the heavier bass of the M6.


----------



## OmarCCX

I currently got a V Sonic GR06. Here's my problem. They're too sensitive, and I get headaches from the noise / slight hiss. On my ipod touch it's fairly evident, but out of my iPhone it's headache inducing. And considering I only use IEMs with portables sources, I don't see a portable dac as a solution. I also don't want to deal with the weight/size of another device on my portable rig.
   
  I was thinking about selling my GR06 for $40-$50 and get something under $100 that has a fairly dark background. Any opinions? 
   
  I also got a pair of MH1c, but I can't use them as my daily IEMs. They're too uncomfortable and have channel imbalance issues after an hour of use. It also doesn't help that they have too much bass, which makes them sound veiled to my ears.
   
  I was looking at the Ety HF5. I like fairly neutral sound signatures.


----------



## scootsit

Quote: 





omarccx said:


> I currently got a V Sonic GR06. Here's my problem. They're too sensitive, and I get headaches from the noise / slight hiss. On my ipod touch it's fairly evident, but out of my iPhone it's headache inducing. And considering I only use IEMs with portables sources, I don't see a portable dac as a solution. I also don't want to deal with the weight/size of another device on my portable rig.
> 
> I was thinking about selling my GR06 for $40-$50 and get something under $100 that has a fairly dark background. Any opinions?
> 
> ...


 

 Just a thought to tide you over. Try putting a piece of tape over the little vent on the top of the MH1C. It doesn't cure the insane bass, but it does get rid of some of it. They do have decent, smooth treble and mids, it's just hidden. They're not the best, but the quick mod may buy you a bit more time to find something that's closer to what you want.


----------



## jarrett

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yep, have one right here. It's a little v-shaped but not bad overall, reminds me of the CKM99. Review coming soon.


 
   
  I'll definitely be interested in reading about that. I own a pair (CKM500) and certainly had reservations about its sound quality versus the extreme hype surrounding it.


----------



## howardroak

Hi ljokerl. 
Magnificent stuff. Your review of 1964 ears V3 made me want to jump into CIEM waters there and then. 
Now I made my appointment for the impressions and will proceed to order next week. 
One thing i still need to figure out is whether I can wear the phones over the ear, the anatomy of my right ear is an obstacle in tgat regard. Anyhow i digress. 
What actually triggered my post was what i found in the 1964 ears appreciation thread (see pic). 
I'm glad you changed your mind on 1964 and smile at the pist from memory lane.


----------



## zerocoolhifi

"In that price range most of the dual BAs will have a TWFK, which doesn't have a whole lot of bass. You might just be best off with a plain ol' Triple.Fi 10."

So how far do I need to go up in price to get decent bass and punch out of a BA? (The triples do not fit me well at all)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





omarccx said:


> I currently got a V Sonic GR06. Here's my problem. They're too sensitive, and I get headaches from the noise / slight hiss. On my ipod touch it's fairly evident, but out of my iPhone it's headache inducing. And considering I only use IEMs with portables sources, I don't see a portable dac as a solution. I also don't want to deal with the weight/size of another device on my portable rig.
> 
> I was thinking about selling my GR06 for $40-$50 and get something under $100 that has a fairly dark background. Any opinions?
> 
> ...


 
   
  The HF5 should be good - it's not very sensitive and very well-balanced. The HiFiMan RE-400 may be another good one.
   
   
  Quote: 





howardroak said:


> Hi ljokerl.
> Magnificent stuff. Your review of 1964 ears V3 made me want to jump into CIEM waters there and then.
> Now I made my appointment for the impressions and will proceed to order next week.
> One thing i still need to figure out is whether I can wear the phones over the ear, the anatomy of my right ear is an obstacle in tgat regard. Anyhow i digress.


 
   
  I think memory wire makes it easier to get used to over-the-ear fit compared to over-the-ear sets without memory wire. The 1964-V3 has average-length memory wire which is good. A few of my customs have very short memory sections which can be an annoyance. 
   
   
  Quote: 





howardroak said:


> What actually triggered my post was what i found in the 1964 ears appreciation thread (see pic).
> I'm glad you changed your mind on 1964 and smile at the pist from memory lane.


 
   
   
  False start - it happens.
   
   Quote:


zerocoolhifi said:


> "In that price range most of the dual BAs will have a TWFK, which doesn't have a whole lot of bass. You might just be best off with a plain ol' Triple.Fi 10."
> 
> So how far do I need to go up in price to get decent bass and punch out of a BA? (The triples do not fit me well at all)


 

 Earsonics SM2/SM3 or Westone 3/UM3X, I suppose.


----------



## nehcrow

Hey joker! 
 Looking at IEM's that will do justice to hip-hop/edm and recreate a club-like experience... I was looking at Yamaha EPH-100 mainly
  Is this the best option? Could you direct me to other IEM's that might be better


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Hey joker!
> Looking at IEM's that will do justice to hip-hop/edm and recreate a club-like experience... I was looking at Yamaha EPH-100 mainly
> Is this the best option? Could you direct me to other IEM's that might be better


 

 Depends on what you mean by club-like and how much you are willing to spend. The EPH-100 is great for a bass-heavy (but not overly bassy) sound with good mids and a good sense of space, especially for the price. If that's what you want by all means go for it.


----------



## dak125

Joker,
   
  Great post, thanks for the effort.
   
  My Brainwavz M3s (which I quite liked) went bust after 1.5 years so I'm looking for a replacement. I'd like to stay around the $100 price range, though I would consider $150 for the right set. I like a balanced sound to reflect a rather broad music collection. 
   
  Any thoughts?


----------



## jarrett

I wonder what made the M3s always so much more expensive


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dak125 said:


> Joker,
> 
> Great post, thanks for the effort.
> 
> ...


 

 The Dunu Tai Chi reminded me of the M3 when I was listening to it. If you're willing to live with a little less bass body than with the M3, the Meelec A161P may be a good option as well.


----------



## johnnycr

Joker,
  Thanks for the recommendation on the Philips she3580.  I decided to go with them instead of the JVC FX40 and I really like the Philips. They are a nice companion to my Panasonic hje120s.  Totally different sound.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johnnycr said:


> Joker,
> Thanks for the recommendation on the Philips she3580.  I decided to go with them instead of the JVC FX40 and I really like the Philips. They are a nice companion to my Panasonic hje120s.  Totally different sound.


 

 Glad to hear that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I prefer the Philips to the HJE120, personally


----------



## johnnycr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Glad to hear that
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Agreed.  I still like the HJE120, but they have a darker sound overall and the treble sounds muffled.  The SHE3580 are much better for the music that I listen to most often.  I'm impressed with how powerful the bass can get on the SHE3580 and the treble sound great compared to the HJE120.


----------



## cwill51

Joker, if there was an Internet Forum Hall of Fame this thread would be first ballot.  Great work!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cwill51 said:


> Joker, if there was an Internet Forum Hall of Fame this thread would be first ballot.  Great work!


 

 Funny, thanks!


----------



## audiobot

Yo joker!! When will you possibly have the HiFiman RE-400 review up? Interested to read your take on them. I got them without your consent. I know it's blasphemy but I couldn't resist!! Sold my JVC HA-FX700 to make room for them.


----------



## kmd107

Quote: 





audiobot said:


> Yo joker!! When will you possibly have the HiFiman RE-400 review up? Interested to read your take on them. I got them without your consent. I know it's blasphemy but I couldn't resist!! Sold my JVC HA-FX700 to make room for them.


 

 I'm looking forward to this review as well.  I think he mentioned a week or so a few pages back.


----------



## audiobot

Thanks for the heads up.


----------



## zerocoolhifi

How would you compare the fx700 to the re400?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





audiobot said:


> Yo joker!! When will you possibly have the HiFiman RE-400 review up? Interested to read your take on them. I got them without your consent. I know it's blasphemy but I couldn't resist!! Sold my JVC HA-FX700 to make room for them.


 
   
  Still just burning it in. It'll be around 2-3 weeks, most likely. 
   
  Quote: 





kmd107 said:


> I'm looking forward to this review as well.  I think he mentioned a week or so a few pages back.


 

 I thin that was the VC02 from VSonic.


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  What would be a good upgrade from W4? I love the overall sound signature but would like to have slightly more rumbling bass. Thanks!


----------



## Freddopoops

Hey there Joker, awesome reviews! thanks for your time and effort.
   
  I have a quick question.. my klipsch s4i broke recently and im trying to find new IEMs under 100$. Im stuck on Vsonic GR06 and Vsonic GR02 Bass edition. I listen to hip-hop, 'modern day' music and would like tight bass but definitely not overpowering. Im using an iphone4s to drive my mostly 320kbps music. Which of the Vsonic IEMs would suit me better? (I heard that the Vsonic GR06 has hissing problems on iphone4s? is this true?) If there is another model that suits my needs better that is under the 100$ mark it would be great if you could give them a mention too!
   
  PS: I have the popular ATH-M50 headphones and would like a little less bass for my IEMs.


----------



## OmarCCX

The hissing problem is only evident if your ears are extremely sensitive to such noises like mine. I'd recommend the GR06. I love them with almost anything. They don't have enough bass punch for something like dubstep though, but I really don't mind.


----------



## Amitl

hi!
  i'm looking for an upgrade from my id america Sparks.
  i'm in love with their sound, but the cable is driving me crazy sometimes.
  it's so microphonic, even when worn over the ear with guides theres lots of microphonics.
  i also have the Klipsch S4 and hate their sound...so unnatural and hissy.
  i want something which will sound at least as good or better than the Sparks
  but much more secure and less microphonic.
  also i should mention i have the Meelec CW31 which is good microphonics-wise, but
  simply sounds not very good at ALL to my opinion...simply incomparable to the sparks in every way.
  i was thinking of the Phonak Perfect Bass vs. Shure SE215.
  any advice? thanks


----------



## kristianflindt

First of all, thanks ljokerl for the fantastic collection of reviews! 
   
  I'm looking for a new pair of IEM's, as i suddenly can't find my Klipsch Custom-3's anymore. 
  My max budget is around $250. I live in Denmark, but are traveling to the USA in a month, so if can save anything, im waiting 

 Right now im leaning towards the Monster Turbine Pro Copper, but they cost around $450 dollars in Denmark, or the Yamaha EPH-100, which i can get for a little under 200$ here. 
  I've had Etymotic ER6i's, Jays Q Jays and the Custom-3's, but none of them really blew me away (maybe because im used to a very high-end stereo HIFI setup at home)
   
  Can you recommend any?
  If they are really worth the money, i can up my budget a bit. But if i'm going to buy them in America, i need to get some advise about where i can buy them in Washington DC.
   
  Regards Kristian


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





amitl said:


> hi!
> i'm looking for an upgrade from my id america Sparks.
> i'm in love with their sound, but the cable is driving me crazy sometimes.
> it's so microphonic, even when worn over the ear with guides theres lots of microphonics.
> ...


 
   
          there are a few more phones you can consider , i think you like bass and some audio quality too so here are some .
        meelec cc51 , velodyne vplus . ue 400/500 , and may be brainwavz m5 . m5 got some microphonics .
        cw31 lacks bass but good enough for its price .
        shure and phonak can be your top priority though , and may i stress on cc51 , for just $60 , its awesome .


----------



## noobflakes

Thanks for this! Please add the Audiobahn AEP240J Killa's in this.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





freddopoops said:


> Hey there Joker, awesome reviews! thanks for your time and effort.
> 
> I have a quick question.. my klipsch s4i broke recently and im trying to find new IEMs under 100$. Im stuck on Vsonic GR06 and Vsonic GR02 Bass edition. I listen to hip-hop, 'modern day' music and would like tight bass but definitely not overpowering. Im using an iphone4s to drive my mostly 320kbps music. Which of the Vsonic IEMs would suit me better? (I heard that the Vsonic GR06 has hissing problems on iphone4s? is this true?) If there is another model that suits my needs better that is under the 100$ mark it would be great if you could give them a mention too!
> 
> PS: I have the popular ATH-M50 headphones and would like a little less bass for my IEMs.


 
   
  If you enjoyed the S4 I would go for the GR02 BE over the GR06. More bass but still not quite overpowering. I have not had any hissing problems with either but I don't use apple devices. 
   
    
  Quote:


amitl said:


> hi!
> i'm looking for an upgrade from my id america Sparks.
> i'm in love with their sound, but the cable is driving me crazy sometimes.
> it's so microphonic, even when worn over the ear with guides theres lots of microphonics.
> ...


 
   
  It sounds like you prefer a v-shaped sound. You probably won't like the Phonaks or Shures. Maybe something like a JVC FX500 or a CKM-series audio-technica (CKM500, CKM99). 
   
  Quote: 





kristianflindt said:


> First of all, thanks ljokerl for the fantastic collection of reviews!
> 
> I'm looking for a new pair of IEM's, as i suddenly can't find my Klipsch Custom-3's anymore.
> My max budget is around $250. I live in Denmark, but are traveling to the USA in a month, so if can save anything, im waiting
> ...


 

 That's a much better deal on the EPH-100 than the Coppers. $450 is way too much for those.
   
   It seems like you've always had relatively flat/balanced earphones in the past but are now going for something more bass-heavy. If that's on purpose, the EPH-100 is probably a good choice. However, if you're still after something more balanced and are willing to spend $450 when you're here in the US you can probably pick up a top-tier BA flagship for that much. Even the inmotion kiosks at airports typically have high-end Shure, Westone, Klipsch, etc., though you'll likely be paying full (US) MSRP for them.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Ultrasone IQ
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1A6) Ultrasone IQ*
> 
> 
> Added Feb 2013
> ...


----------



## kristianflindt

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you enjoyed the S4 I would go for the GR02 BE over the GR06. More bass but still not quite overpowering. I have not had any hissing problems with either but I don't use apple devices.
> 
> 
> It sounds like you prefer a v-shaped sound. You probably won't like the Phonaks or Shures. Maybe something like a JVC FX500 or a CKM-series audio-technica (CKM500, CKM99).
> ...


 
  I'm willing to spend up to $350, if i can get a good deal in the US. 
  I just read the amazing reviews about the EPH-100, and thought they would be a good idea and the same with the Copper's, they seem easy to use, and i guess they can be used for a bit of running aswell with the things that goes around your ears.
  I mostly listen to music like Mumford & Sons, Johnny Cash, Otis Redding, Al Green, some oldschool R&B and hiphop, but sometimes some house and trance too. So they need to sound great with male voices, and if there's some quality bass, it will be nice too! 
   
  Do you know of any special shops that sell headphones, when i search, i mainly find internet shops, and that's not really gonna work


----------



## shotgunshane

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Ultrasone IQ


 
   
  Wow, thanks for the review!  The comparisons to the K3003 are intriguing.


----------



## dleblanc343

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Audio quality aside, the IQ scores high marks for its superb construction, including die-cast housings, detachable cords, and soft, tangle-free cabling. Cable noise is nil and noise isolation is good compared to the Sennheiser IE 800 and AKG K3003. High sensitivity and a secure, over-the-ear fit add to its versatility.


 
  Can we expect to get a IE800 review soon?


----------



## james444

Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Wow, thanks for the review!  The comparisons to the K3003 are intriguing.


 
   
  X2, and agreed. The comparisons to the HFI-780 however, ...


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





esteebin said:


> Looking forward for that review! Went ahead and googled the VC02 and liked what I see. Nice that the cable detaches- If ever the cable needs to be replaced, where could I get a new one? - Is it like the Westone or TF10?
> 3mm micro driver- should mean it's light and compact. Bass still there though, right?


 
  Yaaah the cables we're like that  I've tried my cousin's fiio tf10 cables on my vc02's and it fits!  I'm quite very excited for |joker|'s review!


----------



## forceofnature

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added Ultrasone IQ


 

 I have the Ultrasone IQ's and have been searching for something better since and just cant do it without going custom. I agree with the review on ensuring a good seal. For me the comply tips work well as long as they stay sealed well.  The silicone tips for me were horrible in sibilance so I threw them out. Seeing the comments on the triple flange I will have to try those and see if the fit and sound works for me.
   
  I use mine on the go and working out.  One issue i have encountered is that the connector type to the IEMs which is same as the Shure SE series is prone to intermittent disconnection while jogging.  This is frustrating to me having to adjust the cables while running on treadmill. 
   
  The bass is generally very good however sub bass performance is not strong as expected for IEM. The detail in the mids and for me the highs more than makes up for the sub bass performance. Maybe the Triple flange tips will fix the sub frequencies.


----------



## Orel

Forgot to post here, but I got those CW31 you recommended me a while back, if you happen to remember lol. I'm a tad dissappointed, but I guess that for their price it's still an amazing value. The thing is that they're not very good with heavy metal, it sounds too.. Raw? Dirty maybe? I don't know quite how to explain it. When I put the iPod on bass booster it feels a little more tamed on some of the songs. On more classical, accoustic pieces and such it sounds great though


----------



## Amitl

Thank for comments Joker and Suman!
  Orel: i also have the CW31 and a metalhead... and i tell ya i just love the id america Sparks sound!
  3 times better than the CW31 to my opinion...much deeper, smoother, bassier (not bloated), cleaner, engaging...
  my only gripe about the Sparks is the cable...which annoys me a little...it just gets in my way all the time and
  doesnt lack microphonics.
  but the suond is great


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kristianflindt said:


> I'm willing to spend up to $350, if i can get a good deal in the US.
> I just read the amazing reviews about the EPH-100, and thought they would be a good idea and the same with the Copper's, they seem easy to use, and i guess they can be used for a bit of running aswell with the things that goes around your ears.
> I mostly listen to music like Mumford & Sons, Johnny Cash, Otis Redding, Al Green, some oldschool R&B and hiphop, but sometimes some house and trance too. So they need to sound great with male voices, and if there's some quality bass, it will be nice too!
> 
> Do you know of any special shops that sell headphones, when i search, i mainly find internet shops, and that's not really gonna work


 
   
  Many online vendors will deliver to a hotel and most hotels will hold mail for their patrons. I am not familiar with the area but I am sure DC has all of our standard electronics stores (Best Buy, etc). Best Buy can do ship to store, too, if you buy online. 
   
  Quote: 





shotgunshane said:


> Wow, thanks for the review!  The comparisons to the K3003 are intriguing.


 
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> X2, and agreed. The comparisons to the HFI-780 however, ...


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I don't like drawing parallels between IEM and full-size but I thought this was a special case with the IQ being their first IEM and all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





dleblanc343 said:


> Can we expect to get a IE800 review soon?


 
   
  Probably not for a while.
   
  Quote: 





forceofnature said:


> I have the Ultrasone IQ's and have been searching for something better since and just cant do it without going custom. I agree with the review on ensuring a good seal. For me the comply tips work well as long as they stay sealed well.  The silicone tips for me were horrible in sibilance so I threw them out. Seeing the comments on the triple flange I will have to try those and see if the fit and sound works for me.
> 
> I use mine on the go and working out.  One issue i have encountered is that the connector type to the IEMs which is same as the Shure SE series is prone to intermittent disconnection while jogging.  This is frustrating to me having to adjust the cables while running on treadmill.
> 
> The bass is generally very good however sub bass performance is not strong as expected for IEM. The detail in the mids and for me the highs more than makes up for the sub bass performance. Maybe the Triple flange tips will fix the sub frequencies.


 
   
   
  One of the things I like about them most is that the bass isn't extremely overpowering. The bass is not linear but it still extends pretty well - easily audible at 25-30Hz with my setup. It's similar to what I'm hearing out of the IE 800 so far (i.e. gentle roll-off below 70 Hz or so) and more severe than the roll-off of the K3003.
   
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> Forgot to post here, but I got those CW31 you recommended me a while back, if you happen to remember lol. I'm a tad dissappointed, but I guess that for their price it's still an amazing value. The thing is that they're not very good with heavy metal, it sounds too.. Raw? Dirty maybe? I don't know quite how to explain it. When I put the iPod on bass booster it feels a little more tamed on some of the songs. On more classical, accoustic pieces and such it sounds great though


 
   
   
  A lot of metal isn't recorded all the well, which could be part of what you're hearing. IIRC the iPod bass booster just cuts down on the other frequencies, which may make the deficiencies harder to hear.


----------



## scootsit

B&H, adorama, newegg, amazon, and tiger direct would all be places (websites) to look. They all have regular sales. Then, just have it shipped to your hotel a few days before you arrive and have them hold it.
   
  Alternatively, Fry's electronics has an amazing selection, there's probably a Fry's near DC.


----------



## nehcrow

Hi joker! 
 Massive, massive thread and extremely helpful!
 I have the Philips SHE3580 and I generally love their sound for hip hop, r'n'b, electronic music... they do seem to get a little muddled in faster more noisier music
  What models would be a significant upgrade over them but still retaining the same sound signature?
  Also what's your preferred tips with SHE3580?


----------



## Impulse

scootsit said:


> Alternatively, Fry's electronics has an amazing selection, there's probably a Fry's near DC.




Nah, I wish there was... Fry's generally more of a west coast/south chain (outside of the two locations in Illinois and Indiana). There's Microcenters near DC, but I don't think they have quite as much variety when it comes to things outside of the PC space.

There should be some high end audio stores somewhere in DC tho, no? I'd actually love to find out too since I travel there every once in a while (there or Baltimore).


----------



## audionewbi

Darn should have bought the IQ for 500 when I had the chance 
 Thanks for the review.


----------



## truckdriver

The UE900 has slightly nicer (though smaller) mids and better treble sparkle than my Shure SE535. However, the UE900 doesn't isolate well enough for the truck and doesn't have enough bass energy (at low volume) to overcome the noise. I was concerned that the UE900's treble would eventually be fatiguing for me. I'm returning the UE900 later today.
   
  Having stated that, unfortunately, it appears that I've contracted upgraditis. At $500, I wouldn't even hesitate to get the IQ. At over $900 however, I have concerns.
   
  @ ljokerl
   
  Is the IQ vented and does that effect isolation?
   
  Shure tips should fit the IQ, right? (If so, that's a definite plus)
   
  I want a similar treble sparkle as the UE900. Is treble sparkle present with the IQ using the Etymotic triple-flange tips? Are the Ety tips of similar thickness as the Shures?
   
  You mentioned sub-bass roll-off being similar to your preliminary assessment of the IE800. I assume the IE800 has heavier bass presence? How would you briefly compare the IE800 and IQ in midrange clarity and soundstage?


----------



## forceofnature

Quote: 





truckdriver said:


> @ ljokerl
> 
> Is the IQ vented and does that effect isolation?
> 
> ...


 
  I can help with this.
   
  IQs are vented and I think isolation is affected but only slightly.(It may be impacted by the metal housing and not the venting.)
   
  Treble sparkle to me is superior to the SE530s that I can compare.  Sparkle is a little much with silicon tips but for the triple flange I have not tried it.  The tips are same as the Shures and are interchangable.
   
  As for Bass presence it is powerful and fast but to me the very low frequency bass is rolled off.  I will have to use a tone generator to tell you exactly the turning point for my ears.
   
  I cant compare the IE800s but the IQ mid clarity and soundstage is fantastic compared to the Shures, at least to my ears.


----------



## forceofnature

Quote: 





impulse said:


> There should be some high end audio stores somewhere in DC tho, no? I'd actually love to find out too since I travel there every once in a while (there or Baltimore).


 
  I live in Baltimore, I have not been to any high end audio shops around here not sure there are any left. Most are now Home Theater install shops that are more office space and will do special orders.
   
  I will keep an eye out.


----------



## truckdriver

Quote: 





forceofnature said:


> I can help with this.
> 
> IQs are vented and I think isolation is affected but only slightly.(It may be impacted by the metal housing and not the venting.)
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks forceofnature!
   
  So, venting with isolation effects and bass roll-offs are strikes against the IQ.
   
  I chuckled when I read the last line of your post as I was thinking to myself that this would be THE worst upgrade EVER if the IQ was not superior to the Shures. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I'd still like to know ljokerl's take on the IE800 and IQ.


----------



## nhat_thanh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With the stock tips the treble response of the IQ peaks heavily right in the sibilance region, making many tracks sibilant and some - downright uncomfortable. The silicone tips are the worst offenders, followed closely by the Complys.


 
  Hmm interesting.
  From my experience, the stock tips and silicone ones have plenty of sibilance but are still listenable for me. It's the Complys that sounds horrendous in the treble region to my ears!!
  Complys are well known for dampening a good a mount of highs, which makes them sibilance free most of the time, but it shocked me when I try Complys with the IQs, the treble is even brighter than other tips, they sound extremely harsh and unbearable to me!
   
  Though I found the IQ don't really sound terrible, but they are overpriced and don't sound good to me, the bass and treble are too much for my taste, which is fine but in these regards, I prefer the IE800 overall.
  I tried both of them with ZuneHD and iTouch gen 3 + iQube v2 btw.
   
  Anyway, I actually like the Ultrasone Tio, they don't have the treble and bass emphasis, they sound much more balance and coherent, though extensions at both ends are not as good as the IQ.


----------



## forceofnature

Quote: 





truckdriver said:


> Thanks forceofnature!
> 
> So, venting with isolation effects and bass roll-offs are strikes against the IQ.
> 
> ...


 
  Yes if you are listening in noisy environments most of the time, IQs are not worth it in my opinion.  It would have to be pretty noisy though,
   
  I would like to compare the IE800 myself but I know of no one near me that remotely cares about audio quality other than my son and I still seem to fund his ears as well.
   
  I would like to heare ljoker's take on isolation as well as the comparison to the IE800s.  
   
  For now I am really enjoying the IQs and haven't found something better for me.


----------



## forceofnature

Quote: 





nhat_thanh said:


> Hmm interesting.
> From my experience, the stock tips and silicone ones have plenty of sibilance but are still listenable for me. It's the Complys that sounds horrendous in the treble region to my ears!!
> Complys are well known for dampening a good a mount of highs, which makes them sibilance free most of the time, but it shocked me when I try Complys with the IQs, the treble is even brighter than other tips, they sound extremely harsh and unbearable to me!
> 
> Anyway, I actually like the Ultrasone Tio, they don't have the treble and bass emphasis, they sound much more balance and coherent, though extensions at both ends are not as good as the IQ.


 
   
  I just cant get those silicones to seal up right or something because the sound is just all treble to me without the complys.
   
  I was thinking of the Tio but wanted to drivers in the IQs.


----------



## eyal1983

Coming from the HiFiMAN RE-272 (analytical, not bright), -which is the better upgrade: the Alclair reference, or the CTM-200 ?
   
  my preferences:
  i don't like too bright IEMs (such as: ER-4s)
  and i also don't like too dark a tone (Westone 4)
   
  thanks!


----------



## ysyung

IQ sounds extremely harsh and unbearable (high freq.) to me....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Hi joker!
> Massive, massive thread and extremely helpful!
> I have the Philips SHE3580 and I generally love their sound for hip hop, r'n'b, electronic music... they do seem to get a little muddled in faster more noisier music
> What models would be a significant upgrade over them but still retaining the same sound signature?
> Also what's your preferred tips with SHE3580?


 
   
  I would go for the JVC FXT90 but it really depends on what you're willing to spend and where you want to see improvement. 
   
  I am using some Meelec M6 bi-flanges on my 3580 but it's pretty forgiving of different tips and sounds good to me even with the stock ones. 
   
  Quote: 





truckdriver said:


> The UE900 has slightly nicer (though smaller) mids and better treble sparkle than my Shure SE535. However, the UE900 doesn't isolate well enough for the truck and doesn't have enough bass energy (at low volume) to overcome the noise. I was concerned that the UE900's treble would eventually be fatiguing for me. I'm returning the UE900 later today.
> 
> Having stated that, unfortunately, it appears that I've contracted upgraditis. At $500, I wouldn't even hesitate to get the IQ. At over $900 however, I have concerns.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I'm not sure if that's a vent on the IQ but the isolation is average for a high-end monitor. It's better than with the K3003 or IE800, though. The IE 800 isolates pretty poorly. 
   
  Shure tips fit but my Shure gray flex sleeves (which I normally like) sounded pretty bad. The IQ has way more treble than the UE 900 with the stock tips or with the shure flex sleeves. I found some other tips that work decently well but most just sound bad.
   
  The IE 800 has some strange ringing in the treble, there's a lot of treble energy and slow decay. The treble actually sounds brighter and more splashy than that of my IQ. The bass is heavier with the Sennheiser, but not by much. Soundstaging and clarity are very good - I would say the IE 800 beats the IQ in soundstaging and keeps up with it in clarity. 
   
  Quote: 





nhat_thanh said:


> Hmm interesting.
> From my experience, the stock tips and silicone ones have plenty of sibilance but are still listenable for me. It's the Complys that sounds horrendous in the treble region to my ears!!
> Complys are well known for dampening a good a mount of highs, which makes them sibilance free most of the time, but it shocked me when I try Complys with the IQs, the treble is even brighter than other tips, they sound extremely harsh and unbearable to me!
> 
> ...


 
   
  For me the Complys don't work and the silicone tips don't work either. With added impedance and a deep insertion the IQ can sound much darker but they are still a somewhat v-shaped IEM with enhanced bass. 
   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> Coming from the HiFiMAN RE-272 (analytical, not bright), -which is the better upgrade: the Alclair reference, or the CTM-200 ?
> 
> my preferences:
> i don't like too bright IEMs (such as: ER-4s)
> ...


 
   
  Depends on what you want to see improved over the RE272. If it's the midrange and/or treble, none of the mid-level customs I've heard will do it, really. 
   
  Quote: 





ysyung said:


> IQ sounds extremely harsh and unbearable (high freq.) to me....


 

 ...
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With the stock tips the treble response of the IQ peaks heavily right in the sibilance region, making many tracks sibilant and some - downright uncomfortable.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I'm not sure if that's a vent on the IQ but the isolation is average for a high-end monitor. It's better than with the K3003 or IE800, though. The IE 800 isolates pretty poorly.
> 
> ...


 
   
  If I'm going to listen outside all the time (with the traffic noise, people speaking, etc), wouldn't a high end IEM with mediocre isolation defeat the purpose since I won't be able to hear/make out all the details and etc. I own the JVC FX700 and PFE 232


----------



## pokpokgei

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> If I'm going to listen outside all the time (with the traffic noise, people speaking, etc), wouldn't a high end IEM with mediocre isolation defeat the purpose since I won't be able to hear/make out all the details and etc. I own the JVC FX700 and PFE 232


 
   
  can you hear details from the jvc fx700 while outside with traffic noise and such?


----------



## Love Music

Hi Joker,
   
  i'm looking for an iem with good clarity and something that has natural/tube-like/airy vocals of the eq-7's. With a bigger soundstage of the eq-7's (or atleast on par) but still maintaining the forward/lush mids.  I am also looking for the same amount of and accurate bass that they provide. However, I find that there upper mids/treble are harsh, piercing and unrefined. They also seem more forward which could pose a problem for high pitched female vocals and distorted/bass guitars which can cause fatigue. Is there anything that keeps the positive aspects of the eq-7 that i've mentioned but with better clarity/refinement/air on the upper mids/highs. Also looking for good fit, comfort and isolation. Would the FAD Heaven C fit these criteria? Or are there any other suggestions.
   
  iem's I curently have: re262, eq-7, ck100.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Amitl

I'm really waiting for the dual-dynamic-driver from Meelec to come out...
  are there high hopes for this one?
  could it compete with the JVC HA-FXT90???
  and while speaking of the HA-FXT90... how's it's microphonics compared to
  the Meelec CW31? (not sound quality...just microphonics  )


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





pokpokgei said:


> can you hear details from the jvc fx700 while outside with traffic noise and such?


 
  I just turn my ipod to 50%. I normally listen at 35-40%. FX700 is fairly easy to drive, I don't want to listen at 75%, just feels a bit loud. But I think that volume wouldn't damage your hearing as long as you don't listen to it for too long.
  In busy streets, yes, it's a bit annoying. Normally, I don't walk on the busiest streets. But PFE 232 is a bit better.


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> A lot of metal isn't recorded all the well, which could be part of what you're hearing. IIRC the iPod bass booster just cuts down on the other frequencies, which may make the deficiencies harder to hear.


 
  Yea but it's also stuff that sound awesome on my PX200II for example, and they're all in 320kbps 
  By the way, they're also very comfortable which is awesome, it was a real issue for me on my last earphones


----------



## Joe Bloggs

ljokerl said:


> I would go for the JVC FXT90 but it really depends on what you're willing to spend and where you want to see improvement.
> 
> I am using some Meelec M6 bi-flanges on my 3580 but it's pretty forgiving of different tips and sounds good to me even with the stock ones.
> 
> ...




If they sound bad with stock tips or indeed most tips do they deserve such a high score?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





love music said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> i'm looking for an iem with good clarity and something that has natural/tube-like/airy vocals of the eq-7's. With a bigger soundstage of the eq-7's (or atleast on par) but still maintaining the forward/lush mids.  I am also looking for the same amount of and accurate bass that they provide. However, I find that there upper mids/treble are harsh, piercing and unrefined. They also seem more forward which could pose a problem for high pitched female vocals and distorted/bass guitars which can cause fatigue. Is there anything that keeps the positive aspects of the eq-7 that i've mentioned but with better clarity/refinement/air on the upper mids/highs. Also looking for good fit, comfort and isolation. Would the FAD Heaven C fit these criteria? Or are there any other suggestions.
> 
> ...


 
   
  What to you think of the CK100? I don't think the FAD sets I've heard fit those requirements much better than the e-Q7 or CK100 (or RE272, which is brighter than the RE262 but still somewhat similar to it).
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> I'm really waiting for the dual-dynamic-driver from Meelec to come out...
> are there high hopes for this one?
> could it compete with the JVC HA-FXT90???
> and while speaking of the HA-FXT90... how's it's microphonics compared to
> the Meelec CW31? (not sound quality...just microphonics  )


 
   
  No idea about the MEElec dual-driver. From what I understand it has a crossover element, which is promising (as opposed to the FXT90, which uses differences in driver composition, and Fischer Audio Tandem, which uses differences in driver positioning). 
   
  The cable noise tends to be very low with modern JVC earphones, so should be similar to CW31 cable noise.
   
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> I just turn my ipod to 50%. I normally listen at 35-40%. FX700 is fairly easy to drive, I don't want to listen at 75%, just feels a bit loud. But I think that volume wouldn't damage your hearing as long as you don't listen to it for too long.
> In busy streets, yes, it's a bit annoying. Normally, I don't walk on the busiest streets. But PFE 232 is a bit better.


 
   
  The IQ isolates better than the PFE 232. Does the mediocre isolation defeat the purpose of the 232?
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> If they sound bad with stock tips or indeed most tips do they deserve such a high score?


 

 Good question. My reasoning was that it does not make sense to take off points for both sound and accessories for the same issue (i.e. lack of tips that fit _me _properly) - sort of a double jeopardy situation. In the end I decided to knock the accessory score down rather than try to figure out what the sound score should be with stock tips while listening to them with aftermarket tips.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The IQ isolates better than the PFE 232. Does the mediocre isolation defeat the purpose of the 232?


 
  Well, I almost sold my PFE 232 (because I disliked the upper mids) until I found an EQ application for my iPod Touch. Since you rated FX700's isolation as 2.5 and PFE 232's isolation as 3.5. IQ is 4 in isolation. It seems like just slightly better. As you mentioned before, the difference between FX700 and $800-$100 high end universal is small, plus the fact that I'm not using an amp and a mediocre source (iPod Touch), it doesn't seem like it's worth it.
   
  How are the sound quality of PFE 232 and IQ compare? Small difference? Sound signature aside, do you have to listen carefully to differentiate the sound quality between the two?


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Hi joker!
> Massive, massive thread and extremely helpful!
> I have the Philips SHE3580 and I generally love their sound for hip hop, r'n'b, electronic music... they do seem to get a little muddled in faster more noisier music
> What models would be a significant upgrade over them but still retaining the same sound signature?
> Also what's your preferred tips with SHE3580?


 
  she9700


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Well, I almost sold my PFE 232 (because I disliked the upper mids) until I found an EQ application for my iPod Touch. Since you rated FX700's isolation as 2.5 and PFE 232's isolation as 3.5. IQ is 4 in isolation. It seems like just slightly better. As you mentioned before, the difference between FX700 and $800-$100 high end universal is small, plus the fact that I'm not using an amp and a mediocre source (iPod Touch), it doesn't seem like it's worth it.
> 
> How are the sound quality of PFE 232 and IQ compare? Small difference? Sound signature aside, do you have to listen carefully to differentiate the sound quality between the two?


 
   
  I always preferred the IQ in my comparisons to the PFE232. The difference is immediately apparent with no careful listening required, but of course part of it is sound signature.


----------



## EPICFAILXD

Wow.... couldn't believe the IQ got such a good rating on sound. On almost every other review, it seems to be panned as an outrageously overpriced overpolished dog turd. oh btw Joker... would you mind testing the Sennheiser IE800?


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Hi Joker,
> 
> ...


 
  I find the CK100 definitely have better instrument seperation, clarity and definitely smoother highs in most cases than eq-7's but not as extended. Maybe because the pairing is not the best with the walkman Z I find the vocals sound a bit accented. On some tracks it feels as if vocals are a bit squashed because of the intimate soundstage. Guitars, especially acoustic sounds more realistic on CK100. Comfort, fit and isolation is great, the best i've tried actually.


----------



## Zelda

joker, 
   
  dont know if´s been asked but... have you tried the JVC fx3x?


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I always preferred the IQ in my comparisons to the PFE232. The difference is immediately apparent with no careful listening required, but of course part of it is sound signature.


 
  Assuming you didn't EQ, I definitely like PFE 232 with black filter instead of gray filter. I'm not surprised that the difference is immediately apparent. But how about just sound qualities and instrument separation alone?
  Other factors like soundstage, presentation, etc are not that big of a deal to me.


----------



## forceofnature

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> If they sound bad with stock tips or indeed most tips do they deserve such a high score?


 

 I thought they sounded good with stock tips. The complys were provided and for me they work great.  I ordered the triple flange to try on friday.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





epicfailxd said:


> Wow.... couldn't believe the IQ got such a good rating on sound. On almost every other review, it seems to be panned as an outrageously overpriced overpolished dog turd. oh btw Joker... would you mind testing the Sennheiser IE800?


 
   
  I have the IE 800 but it's going to take me a little while to get around to writing it up. Might do a review over at InnerFidelity first. 
   
  Quote: 





love music said:


> I find the CK100 definitely have better instrument seperation, clarity and definitely smoother highs in most cases than eq-7's but not as extended. Maybe because the pairing is not the best with the walkman Z I find the vocals sound a bit accented. On some tracks it feels as if vocals are a bit squashed because of the intimate soundstage. Guitars, especially acoustic sounds more realistic on CK100. Comfort, fit and isolation is great, the best i've tried actually.


 
   
  The CK100 generally has pretty forward vocals. To be honest I haven't heard a set that combines all of the positives of the e-Q7 with the CK100, which seems to be what you want. You should like the Ultimate Ears 900 if you raise the midrange up a bit. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> joker,
> 
> dont know if´s been asked but... have you tried the JVC fx3x?


 

 Nope, only the FX1X and FX101.


----------



## The Neverhood

I find the treble of the ER4S slightly elevated, and I was wondering what you would recommend as an alternative. I still want that analytical sound, but with slightly less treble. The GR01, PFE, and RE-400 seem to be good alternatives. I noticed that some have said the HF5 are somewhat less bright compared to the ER4S. 
   
  I have an OEM of the Fischer Audio FA-003, and I really like them.


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The CK100 generally has pretty forward vocals. To be honest I haven't heard a set that combines all of the positives of the e-Q7 with the CK100, which seems to be what you want. You should like the Ultimate Ears 900 if you raise the midrange up a bit.


 
  Ah, ok. Is there anything that has a big/out of head soundstage but still mid forward, with neutral bass. Good treble extension but never harsh/sibilant. With very good clarity, I don't like a veiled or metallic sound. The only ones I know of that are known for a big soundstage are IE8, FX700, EX1000, SM3, TF10.
   
  The TF10, IE8 and FX700 are v-shaped and will be too bassy for my liking based on reviews.
   
  The SM3 I find is too thick and lack the clarity i'm looking for.
   
  The closest is probably the EX1000, but the treble tilt may pose a problem for me and the isolation and fit is bad.


----------



## saurabh

need some help getting a lo mid fi iem. i am using e30 & like them a lot and would like to have something which has the same open and airy sound with better soundstage. i just hate closed sound. i am open to try a different signature but soundstage has to be very wide and decently deep from iem standards with more clarity than e30. more like 3Dimensional with openess & airyness out of the head feel. i am eyeing on these as of now i can only get these in my country.
>vsonic gr06 --$65(rated quite high)





>brainwavz m4--$40(1st owner but sealed unit), $70(new)
>brainwavz R1--$30(idea of dual dynamic is tempting)
   
  would like to know about the soundstage and instrument seperation of the above mentioned iems. which one you think would be a decent upgrade over the e30?
  no basshead by any means and like it to be clean, tighter with good body, mids to be clear and good textured, treble with good extension with some decent sparkle.
any other suggestion is appreciated but i have to see the availabilty at my place.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





love music said:


> Ah, ok. Is there anything that has a big/out of head soundstage but still mid forward, with neutral bass. Good treble extension but never harsh/sibilant. With very good clarity, I don't like a veiled or metallic sound. The only ones I know of that are known for a big soundstage are IE8, FX700, EX1000, SM3, TF10.
> 
> The TF10, IE8 and FX700 are v-shaped and will be too bassy for my liking based on reviews.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I'd say MDR-7550, but isolation and fit are the same as with the EX1000.


----------



## Seekky

james444 said:


> I'd say MDR-7550, but isolation and fit are the same as with the EX1000.



Agreed, more forward mid than EX1000 and less sibilan, from what I heard about ex800(7550)


----------



## dweaver

+3 on the MDR-7550


----------



## audionewbi

Hey, any plans in reviewing the 1Plus2 and RDB+ hybrids?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> I find the treble of the ER4S slightly elevated, and I was wondering what you would recommend as an alternative. I still want that analytical sound, but with slightly less treble. The GR01, PFE, and RE-400 seem to be good alternatives. I noticed that some have said the HF5 are somewhat less bright compared to the ER4S.
> 
> I have an OEM of the Fischer Audio FA-003, and I really like them.


 
   
  I would skip the PFE and go for a HiFiMan set over the GR01. The RE-400 or RE272 should work nicely.
   
  Quote: 





love music said:


> Ah, ok. Is there anything that has a big/out of head soundstage but still mid forward, with neutral bass. Good treble extension but never harsh/sibilant. With very good clarity, I don't like a veiled or metallic sound. The only ones I know of that are known for a big soundstage are IE8, FX700, EX1000, SM3, TF10.
> 
> The TF10, IE8 and FX700 are v-shaped and will be too bassy for my liking based on reviews.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I still think the UE 900 would work but the 7550 is a good option too.
   
   Quote:


saurabh said:


> need some help getting a lo mid fi iem. i am using e30 & like them a lot and would like to have something which has the same open and airy sound with better soundstage. i just hate closed sound. i am open to try a different signature but soundstage has to be very wide and decently deep from iem standards with more clarity than e30. more like 3Dimensional with openess & airyness out of the head feel. i am eyeing on these as of now i can only get these in my country.
> >vsonic gr06 --$65(rated quite high)
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I haven't reviewed the M4 or R1 and the GR06 isn't the most open-sounding earphone, though it's certainly not bad in that regard. If Sony sets are available to you and reasonably-priced, you would probably like the EX300 or EX500.
   
  Quote: 





audionewbi said:


> Hey, any plans in reviewing the 1Plus2 and RDB+ hybrids?


 

 Not at this time.


----------



## The Neverhood

Thanks, ljokerl. 
   
  I have the opportunity to have the HF5 for £50, but I think I will get the RE-400 now. 
   
  I once had the ATH-CK10, and I really liked them, only the treble was too much for me.
   
  Any reason for skipping the PFE? Are the RE-400s technically superior? 
   
  Anyway, I have ordered the RE-400, I can not wait to hear them.


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I still think the UE 900 would work but the 7550 is a good option too.


 
   
  Thanks Joker.
  Quote: 





dweaver said:


> +3 on the MDR-7550


 
   
   
  Quote: 





seekky said:


> Agreed, more forward mid than EX1000 and less sibilan, from what I heard about ex800(7550)


 
   
  Cool. Thanks.
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> I'd say MDR-7550, but isolation and fit are the same as with the EX1000.


 
  Thanks james.


----------



## VisceriousZERO

Can't believe I haven't done this before, but... Subscribed!
   
  Great job/s on the reviews joker... Keep em coming


----------



## forceofnature

Joker,
   
  I tried the Triple Flange Etyomics in the Ultrasone IQ but did not here much difference from the Comply tips.  Both seal well for me and provide the quality of music I like. I did a bass tone sweep test and can hear down to somewhere between 10-20hz fine but it does roll off from 70hz and below.
   
  I purchased some X10s since they had a good deal on Amazon.  Needed something for running since the IQs connections seemed to cut out at times while running. I will have to see what the Klipsh X10s can do for bass extension. The X10s just don't compare to the Ultrasone IQs in mid and high range detail or tightness of the bass.  They seem to have more bass but less quality.  Doesn't matter much when working out because you just don't bother with the music detail as much.To me the IQs sound is more realistic in mids and highs.  I tapped some cymbals on the drum kit and its pretty close for me.  Listening to live music as well the IQs are pretty close to me.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> Thanks, ljokerl.
> 
> I have the opportunity to have the HF5 for £50, but I think I will get the RE-400 now.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I just think the RE-400 is smoother than the PFE with the gray filters that I like.
   
   
  Quote: 





visceriouszero said:


> Can't believe I haven't done this before, but... Subscribed!
> 
> Great job/s on the reviews joker... Keep em coming


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





forceofnature said:


> Joker,
> 
> I tried the Triple Flange Etyomics in the Ultrasone IQ but did not here much difference from the Comply tips.  Both seal well for me and provide the quality of music I like. .


 

 I can get a decent seal with Comply P-series tips on them but sadly don't have a pair of those anymore.
   
  Quote: 





forceofnature said:


> I did a bass tone sweep test and can hear down to somewhere between 10-20hz fine but it does roll off from 70hz and below.


 
   
  That's pretty typical of dynamic drivers to be honest. The IE 800 does the same and the K3003 is somewhat more extended but still not completely linear. 
   
  Quote: 





forceofnature said:


> I purchased some X10s since they had a good deal on Amazon.  Needed something for running since the IQs connections seemed to cut out at times while running. I will have to see what the Klipsh X10s can do for bass extension. The X10s just don't compare to the Ultrasone IQs in mid and high range detail or tightness of the bass.  They seem to have more bass but less quality.  Doesn't matter much when working out because you just don't bother with the music detail as much.To me the IQs sound is more realistic in mids and highs.  I tapped some cymbals on the drum kit and its pretty close for me.  Listening to live music as well the IQs are pretty close to me.


 
  I would be careful with the X10 for exercise use - the pair I had split along the seam on the back of the strain relief.


----------



## forceofnature

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would be careful with the X10 for exercise use - the pair I had split along the seam on the back of the strain relief.


 
  Thanks for the tip. Still its cheaper to lose the X10 than the IQs


----------



## saurabh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't reviewed the M4 or R1 and the GR06 isn't the most open-sounding earphone, though it's certainly not bad in that regard. If Sony sets are available to you and reasonably-priced, you would probably like the EX300 or EX500.


 
  thanks for one more option. sony are available at my place. EX300 is in my range but as per your review, it does have more wide & open sound but at the cost of some clarity & crispness than E10 and e30 is slightly more clearer than e10. As you have rated gr06 so high & even if it has similar or slightly more open & airy sound than e30 with more clarity, then i guess i'll go with gr06. even a slight upgrade would do as i am moving up the ladder of sound gradually enjoying each n every slightest of the updates trying different signatures & understanding them rather than be straight on top






. many thanks for such a huge list of reviews and detailed info on most of the iems


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





saurabh said:


> thanks for one more option. sony are available at my place. EX300 is in my range but as per your review, it does have more wide & open sound but at the cost of some clarity & crispness than E10 and e30 is slightly more clearer than e10. As you have rated gr06 so high & even if it has similar or slightly more open & airy sound than e30 with more clarity, then i guess i'll go with gr06. even a slight upgrade would do as i am moving up the ladder of sound gradually enjoying each n every slightest of the updates trying different signatures & understanding them rather than be straight on top
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
           best way to move up the ladder .


----------



## thesuperguy

After spending a little bit more time with RE262s, I can say the mids are amazing but there is a constant feeling of shallowness mostly due the anemic bass. While sub bass is clearly audible, anything below 50hz suddenly just blends with the mids leaving some songs that have a very prominent bassline feeling incomplete. I've read many reviews stating that they are able to feel this bass and that it has good impact but I'm just not feeling it. Note, I have yet to burn them in (if it really does anything ) and I am using an E6 (considering to upgrade to E11), but are the RE262s supposed to be like this?
   
  I will admit though, this impression might be a side effect of spending the past couple of months with quite a bass heavy IEM in comparison...


----------



## kristianflindt

Hi again ljokerl, i think i have boiled down my list a bit, but i need some help choosing. What would choose pf the following: UE 900, SE535, Westone 3/4 or the MTPC's? Maybe you have other recommendations?

 I'm gonna use my Galaxy Nexus or Ipad as a source, with 320kbps mp3 files


----------



## james444

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The IE 800 has some strange ringing in the treble, there's a lot of treble energy and slow decay. The treble actually sounds brighter and more splashy than that of my IQ.


 
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's pretty typical of dynamic drivers to be honest. The IE 800 does the same and the K3003 is somewhat more extended but still not completely linear.


 
   
  Just a heads-up, assuming from your description that the IE800 is the same that Tyll measured, you guys may possibly have a defective pair.
   
  Quote: 





kaffeemann said:


> Guys, did you take a look at the Inner Fidelity measurements?
> 
> http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/SennheiserIE800.pdf
> 
> Looks like Tyll got a defective pair.


 
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> X2, doesn't remotely look like what I'm hearing from my pair.
> 
> Rin's preliminary graph is much closer to the truth, except for the usual mids suck-out from diffuse-field EQ (that I consistently fail to hear that way, but that's another story)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> After spending a little bit more time with RE262s, I can say the mids are amazing but there is a constant feeling of shallowness mostly due the anemic bass. While sub bass is clearly audible, anything below 50hz suddenly just blends with the mids leaving some songs that have a very prominent bassline feeling incomplete. I've read many reviews stating that they are able to feel this bass and that it has good impact but I'm just not feeling it. Note, I have yet to burn them in (if it really does anything ) and I am using an E6 (considering to upgrade to E11), but are the RE262s supposed to be like this?
> 
> I will admit though, this impression might be a side effect of spending the past couple of months with quite a bass heavy IEM in comparison...


 
   
  No, that never goes away. The bass is extended but never all that punchy, especially if you are used to bassier earphones. 
   
  Quote: 





kristianflindt said:


> Hi again ljokerl, i think i have boiled down my list a bit, but i need some help choosing. What would choose pf the following: UE 900, SE535, Westone 3/4 or the MTPC's? Maybe you have other recommendations?
> 
> I'm gonna use my Galaxy Nexus or Ipad as a source, with 320kbps mp3 files


 
   
  If it were me I would choose the UE900 or W4.
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> Just a heads-up, assuming from your description that the IE800 is the same that Tyll measured, you guys may possibly have a defective pair.


 

 It's the same pair. I'll see if I can convince him that it's defective. I haven't seen the graphs but the treble doesn't sound great.


----------



## ljokerl

Added VSonic VC02. 3rd post of the thread is broken but that's okay. 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A77) VSonic VC02*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Feb 2013
> ...


----------



## phantompersona

Superb review Joker, the VC02 sound like something magical especially for it's price point. As always your reviews always makes me want to purchase headphones, i placed a order on the Vsonic VC02 on ebay. My wallet hates you very much^^ I hope your happy


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Superb review Joker, the VC02 sound like something magical especially for it's price point. As always your reviews always makes me want to purchase headphones, i placed a order on the Vsonic VC02 on ebay. My wallet hates you very much^^ I hope your happy


 
   
  x2
   
  I had to remind myself that I still had to pay this month's electricity bill.
   
  Careful, joker. If you keep giving these Vsonic phones such high ratings, you may get labelled as a fan boy/man


----------



## zerocoolhifi

I concur even though I rated the GR02 BE a hair higher because I do like my bass a little deeper and punchier, I have been enjoying the heck out the VC02 because of its awesome clarity. I like better than the RE0. GR02 BE is just a bit more fun.


----------



## TwinQY

ljokerl I tried linking to one of the posts on the 1st page...it wasn't there?
   
  Oh, also first post here, love this thread - indescribably immense work, invaluable resource. I link it to all my non-head-fi friends and they love it as well. Probably the greatest thread on this site.


----------



## ayaflo

nice review on the VC02 - Ah micro-drivers FTW
   
  Hope the next one is the MH1c!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> Superb review Joker, the VC02 sound like something magical especially for it's price point. As always your reviews always makes me want to purchase headphones, i placed a order on the Vsonic VC02 on ebay. My wallet hates you very much^^ I hope your happy


 
   




   
  I was pretty surprised by the performance (especially clarity) gap between the VC02 and some of my favorite entry-level monitors - sets like the Monoprice 8320, Brainwavz M1, and Astrotec AM-90, which all still sound very decent to me on their own.
   
  Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> x2
> 
> I had to remind myself that I still had to pay this month's electricity bill.
> 
> Careful, joker. If you keep giving these Vsonic phones such high ratings, you may get labelled as a fan boy/man


 
   
  I may just start avoiding VSonic IEMs altogether so that I don't have to re-scale the whole damn thread. 
   
   
  Quote: 





twinqy said:


> ljokerl I tried linking to one of the posts on the 1st page...it wasn't there?
> 
> Oh, also first post here, love this thread - indescribably immense work, invaluable resource. I link it to all my non-head-fi friends and they love it as well. Probably the greatest thread on this site.


 
   
   
  There is a problem with one of the posts. I think I may have hit a per-post character/image/word cap of some kind. I posted in a bug report thread so hopefully it will get fixed before long.
   
   
  Quote: 





ayaflo said:


> nice review on the VC02 - Ah micro-drivers FTW
> 
> Hope the next one is the MH1c!


 

 Not next... but soon (hopefully)


----------



## papijoe08

Rice review of the VC02, Vsonic and other companies *SHOULD* pay you consultation fees for your recommendations. (LOL just kidding)
 I'm a fan of good low end iems and VC02's is the best I've tried and had under $100 to my ears its better than GR06 even if GR06 has more bass.
 If I may ask, how long did you burn them in before making this review? others said that it sounded better after 300hours.


----------



## 23t23dS

Really nice review on the VC02, they sound absolutely fantastic for the price.
   
  Short question though, did you reverse the polarity on them?


----------



## papijoe08

I forgot to ask that too  +1 with that


----------



## RollerBall

Quick question regarding microphonics on the VC02, can you just clarify how bad it is when worn straight down? I straight up can't wear over the ear headphones so it rules out a lot of the stand out IEMs at the 30-60 price range. I'm used to wearing a J-Corded set so I get almost no microphonics at the moment.
  
  They'll be used to commute so I'll be walking around a reasonable amount in them (transfers between tubes) and audible (to the point where the interfere with music) microphonics would drive me up the wall.


----------



## djvkool

Nice review on the VC02, I can sense people are flocking to LMUE's site and purchase...


----------



## tinphamhuu0212

Can you review the* *The Brainwavz R1 , I'm very curios how they compare to the 30-60$ Vsonic headphones
[size=1em] 
  [/size]


----------



## Zelda

Nice review on the VC02. 
  how is the clarity compared with the FX40 and RE0 ?


----------



## kova4a

NIce review on the VC02 - pretty much how I would rate it. I still think the GR04 flagship is superior but the VC02 is definitely on par with the GR06 with a different sound to suite the different people. I don't think it can replace any of the current vsonic line-up but it's a great addition to it.


----------



## jarrett

While we're on that topic...GR06 versus VC02? Can someone remind me what lendmeurears facebook coupon code is...the one that gives 5% off all the time...Thanks


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> While we're on that topic...GR06 versus VC02? Can someone remind me what lendmeurears facebook coupon code is...the one that gives 5% off all the time...Thanks


 
*LMUECUST *It's 15% on all items that aren't currently discounted. It should probably still work


----------



## thesuperguy

I am really sorry to be *that *guy, but I just can't help but notice that when you mention that the cables come off easily in your "cons" list for the VC02, you say *"*can come off _*to*_ easily" instead of "can come off *too* easily.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





papijoe08 said:


> Rice review of the VC02, Vsonic and other companies *SHOULD* pay you consultation fees for your recommendations. (LOL just kidding)
> I'm a fan of good low end iems and VC02's is the best I've tried and had under $100 to my ears its better than GR06 even if GR06 has more bass.
> If I may ask, how long did you burn them in before making this review? others said that it sounded better after 300hours.


 
   
   
  I prefer the VC02 to the GR06 but only because it suits my preferred signature better. It is very difficult to split them on performance IMO. 
   
  Burn-in was the usual 100-150 hours like all of the IEMs in this review. I did not bother listening to it before burn-in but I usually don't hear much change. 
   
   
  Quote: 





23t23ds said:


> Really nice review on the VC02, they sound absolutely fantastic for the price.
> 
> Short question though, did you reverse the polarity on them?


 
   
   
  I did not - with how easy it is to reverse polarity on these you'd think VSonic left it as is intentionally, either for tuning reasons or because it doesn't matter. 
   
   
  Quote: 





rollerball said:


> Quick question regarding microphonics on the VC02, can you just clarify how bad it is when worn straight down? I straight up can't wear over the ear headphones so it rules out a lot of the stand out IEMs at the 30-60 price range. I'm used to wearing a J-Corded set so I get almost no microphonics at the moment.
> 
> They'll be used to commute so I'll be walking around a reasonable amount in them (transfers between tubes) and audible (to the point where the interfere with music) microphonics would drive me up the wall.


 
   
  I would say borderline. Wearing them over-the-ear is annoying for me because of the lack of a cinch so I always wear them cable-down. The cable is smooth and doesn't bounce around a lot. If you're going to move around all the time I would probably look for something quieter. 
   
  Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Nice review on the VC02, I can sense people are flocking to LMUE's site and purchase...


 
   
  They are so cheap that I don't feel bad about it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





tinphamhuu0212 said:


> Can you review the* *The Brainwavz R1 , I'm very curios how they compare to the 30-60$ Vsonic headphones
> [size=1em]
> [/size]


 
   
  I'll try to do so later but don't have a pair on hand so it'll be some number of months.
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> Nice review on the VC02.
> how is the clarity compared with the FX40 and RE0 ?


 
   
   
  Better than FX40 and just behind the RE-ZERO (don't have the RE0 anymore). On some tracks it keeps up with the ZERO and on others the ZERO sounds just a touch cleaner and less congested. 
   
  Quote: 





kova4a said:


> NIce review on the VC02 - pretty much how I would rate it. I still think the GR04 flagship is superior but the VC02 is definitely on par with the GR06 with a different sound to suite the different people. I don't think it can replace any of the current vsonic line-up but it's a great addition to it.


 
   




   
  Quote: 





jarrett said:


> While we're on that topic...GR06 versus VC02? Can someone remind me what lendmeurears facebook coupon code is...the one that gives 5% off all the time...Thanks


 
   
   
  GR06: bassier, warmer, thicker, fuller, may sound more natural depending on track, larger presentation (depth/height)

 VC02: clearer, more detailed, more balanced, thinner-sounding, cooler tone, tighter bass but also less body and presence
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> I am really sorry to be *that *guy, but I just can't help but notice that when you mention that the cables come off easily in your "cons" list for the VC02, you say *"*can come off _*to*_ easily" instead of "can come off *too* easily.


 

 I actually appreciate that - I was in a rush to get it posted on Sunday and didn't do my usual once-over after posting.


----------



## meltie

The 3A group including the VSonic is completely gone. Just mentioning it in case you hadn't noticed.


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ah, ok. Is there anything that has a big/out of head soundstage but still mid forward, with neutral bass. Good treble extension but never harsh/sibilant. With very good clarity, I don't like a veiled or metallic sound. The only ones I know of that are known for a big soundstage are IE8, FX700, EX1000, SM3, TF10.
> 
> The TF10, IE8 and FX700 are v-shaped and will be too bassy for my liking based on reviews.
> 
> ...


 
  Joker,
   
  would the Westone 4 or the BA200 fit my requirements also?


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ah, ok. Is there anything that has a big/out of head soundstage but still mid forward, with neutral bass. Good treble extension but never harsh/sibilant. With very good clarity, I don't like a veiled or metallic sound. The only ones I know of that are known for a big soundstage are IE8, FX700, EX1000, SM3, TF10.
> 
> The TF10, IE8 and FX700 are v-shaped and will be too bassy for my liking based on reviews.
> 
> ...


 
  Joker,
   
  would the Westone 4 or the BA200 fit my requirements also?


----------



## Impulse

meltie said:


> The 3A group including the VSonic is completely gone. Just mentioning it in case you hadn't noticed.







ljokerl said:


> There is a problem with one of the posts. I think I may have hit a per-post character/image/word cap of some kind. I posted in a bug report thread so hopefully it will get fixed before long.




It's also mentioned on the first line of the post for the Vsonic review. Broken posts are indeed broken...


----------



## RollerBall

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would say borderline. Wearing them over-the-ear is annoying for me because of the lack of a cinch so I always wear them cable-down. The cable is smooth and doesn't bounce around a lot. If you're going to move around all the time I would probably look for something quieter.


 
  I'd use them for 5 minute walks between tubes/buses and 5-10 minute walks either side. My perception of microphonics has dissapeared after using these J-corded ones for so long where there is essentially no microphonics. The headphones I had before them were the Klipsch X1/S2s and I never had a problem with microphonics with those (they were Y corded) that I can remember so a comparison to those would be fantastic.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





love music said:


> Joker,
> 
> would the Westone 4 or the BA200 fit my requirements also?


 
   
  I haven't heard the BA200. The W4 doesn't seem like as good a match as the UE 900 to me. 
   
   
  Quote: 





impulse said:


> It's also mentioned on the first line of the post for the Vsonic review. Broken posts are indeed broken...


 
   
  Oddly they seem to un-break some number of hours after I make an edit. Not very convenient. 
   
  Quote: 





rollerball said:


> I'd use them for 5 minute walks between tubes/buses and 5-10 minute walks either side. My perception of microphonics has dissapeared after using these J-corded ones for so long where there is essentially no microphonics. The headphones I had before them were the Klipsch X1/S2s and I never had a problem with microphonics with those (they were Y corded) that I can remember so a comparison to those would be fantastic.


 

 It's been a while since I had the S2 but I would say its cable noise was no better than that of the VSonics.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





rollerball said:


> I'd use them for 5 minute walks between tubes/buses and 5-10 minute walks either side. My perception of microphonics has dissapeared after using these J-corded ones for so long where there is essentially no microphonics. The headphones I had before them were the Klipsch X1/S2s and I never had a problem with microphonics with those (they were Y corded) that I can remember so a comparison to those would be fantastic.


 
   
  A $1 shirt clip helps eliminate microphonics almost entirely.


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the BA200. The W4 doesn't seem like as good a match as the UE 900 to me.


 
  Thanks Joker


----------



## FrequencyBlue

I am going to grab the HA-FX40 mostly because of the clarity, but I listen to Rock most of the time, is it worth the purchase?
   
  edit: I am currently using SHE3580 and I love them to death <3


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> I am going to grab the HA-FX40 mostly because of the clarity, but I listen to Rock most of the time, is it worth the purchase?
> 
> edit: I am currently using SHE3580 and I love them to death <3


 

 Depends on budget, I suppose. I actually prefer the SHE3580 to the FX40. If you really want clarity spend a little more and get a VC02


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Well I am more into v-shaped signature now, and I only have $26 (enough to get the FX40), but I will consider the VC02


----------



## zerocoolhifi

frequencyblue said:


> Well I am more into v-shaped signature now, and I only have $26 (enough to get the FX40), but I will consider the VC02




Save for another $10 and get the GR02 BE for that V shape.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zerocoolhifi said:


> Save for another $10 and get the GR02 BE for that V shape.


 

 Agreed, for a v-shape the GR02 BE is a great choice.


----------



## veryhumble

hi all and thanks for a great  forum,  and joker  especially thanks to you and this great thread! fantastic job youre doing.
   
  thought that i could get some help in choosing my next iem here! am a very happy owner of Vsonic gr02Be, great earphone but now I'm looking for an upgrade (and another pair of Iems as i often forget whete I put things).The gr 02be fits me great, as did crestive labs ep30 but never Meelec M9, I love the strong mid-bass and the lack of boomines (too much bass annoyes me, f.e Meelecs M9:s was a bit to bassy I felt) , but feel the middle section of my current Vsonics are a bit to recessed and a tad to influenced by the warm bass. - also I would like a little more spark in the high notes, ex. the sound of an hi-hat. As I gather the gr 07 fit this description but is sadly over my budget. I have read your reviews, though Vsonic Gr04fe is not included (but hey, the list is impressive either way!!!). I have narrowed my choises down to these contenders: Vsonic gr 06 Vsonic gr 04 flagship Vsonic vc 02 Brainvaws m5 (I have trouble finding out the main diferences between gr 04fe   and 06 though- some say 04 actually is closer to gr 07 than gr 06!) I think (my guess) is that the M5 is a bit to recessed in the mid for me? I was very thrilled by your (joker) review of vc02 but wonder if they are to flat (as I like the warmt of 02be even if I can loose a tiny bit without problem), and then there is the 06 and 04.... Kind regards 
  i


----------



## Phosphenetre

Any early impressions on the HiFiMan RE-400, Joker? Specifically in terms of neutrality, detailing and transparency?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





veryhumble said:


> hi all and thanks for a great  forum,  and joker  especially thanks to you and this great thread! fantastic job youre doing.
> 
> thought that i could get some help in choosing my next iem here! am a very happy owner of Vsonic gr02Be, great earphone but now I'm looking for an upgrade (and another pair of Iems as i often forget whete I put things).The gr 02be fits me great, as did crestive labs ep30 but never Meelec M9, I love the strong mid-bass and the lack of boomines (too much bass annoyes me, f.e Meelecs M9:s was a bit to bassy I felt) , but feel the middle section of my current Vsonics are a bit to recessed and a tad to influenced by the warm bass. - also I would like a little more spark in the high notes, ex. the sound of an hi-hat. As I gather the gr 07 fit this description but is sadly over my budget. I have read your reviews, though Vsonic Gr04fe is not included (but hey, the list is impressive either way!!!). I have narrowed my choises down to these contenders: Vsonic gr 06 Vsonic gr 04 flagship Vsonic vc 02 Brainvaws m5 (I have trouble finding out the main diferences between gr 04fe   and 06 though- some say 04 actually is closer to gr 07 than gr 06!) I think (my guess) is that the M5 is a bit to recessed in the mid for me? I was very thrilled by your (joker) review of vc02 but wonder if they are to flat (as I like the warmt of 02be even if I can loose a tiny bit without problem), and then there is the 06 and 04.... Kind regards
> i


 
   
  Hmm... you don't mention a budget but you can currently get a JVC FXT90 right around the $100 mark on ebay. That would be a good choice. The VC02 sounds like it may be too flat for you and the M5 has no treble sparkle. The GR06 is fuller-sounding and has more bass than the VC02, but less than the GR02BE. It's a good earphone but it's not a huge upgrade over the GR02.
   
  The FXT90 has plentiful bass and a milder overall v-shape for more forward mids compared to the GR02BE. It also has good treble presence. One reservation would be that it still has some bass bleed and warmth, but because the midrange is not as recessed as that of the GR02BE it might still work better for you in that respect.
   
  Fit-wise it has an unusual shape, but the angled nozzles help in my experience.
   
  Quote: 





danielkrego said:


> Any early impressions on the HiFiMan RE-400, Joker? Specifically in terms of neutrality, detailing and transparency?


 

 Yeah, it's all top notch. I was listening to them all day today and not once did I think about the earphones, which is about the biggest compliment I can give. Normally I'll find myself distracted from my music reflecting on this flaw or that, even during casual listening. I was using the ATH-CKM500 a few days ago and all I could hear was that big ol' mid-bass hump. The RE-400 is pretty darn transparent.


----------



## Phosphenetre

Wow! This is one review I cannot wait for. Sounds like it might be the perfect IEM for me, at the moment. The only thing that's making me hesitate is the top-end of the RE-400, some putting the IEM in the 'warm' camp.


----------



## raisedbywolves

i realize getting questions like this might be annoying, but i hope you can help me out. my vsonic gr07 mk1's just broke and i plan to buy a replacement pair and probably get them recabled. but i'm also looking at potentially getting the mk2's or the be's, and i'm also considering just going for a different style phone like the mid-centric tdk ie800 (which i'm not sure if you've heard yet or not) or the hifiman re-400's. i listen to a large variety of genres, and i found the gr07's were great for that, and i was wondering what you'd recommend. i really like the gr07 sound, and from what i've read, the re-400's definitely have less bass but i don't think it'd bug me too much. and the build quality and looks are really superb to me. i'm also thinking of just buying a super cheap pair like the vsonic vc02's. i have had the sony mh1c's and gave them to my brother because i found them a little bloated bass-wise, but i know they're both small driver phones. anyway, i'm rambling, so i'll wrap this up now. thanks for the help.


----------



## OmarCCX

I'm intrigued too about how the RE 400 compares to the GR07. Still contemplating selling my GR06 and getting those.


----------



## Phosphenetre

Me too, very intrigued about RE-400 vs GR07 and also Ortofon E-Q5.


----------



## Phosphenetre

Double post. Damn phone connection.


----------



## garcsa

Hi joker, respect for all these reviews!Here is  Mr. Lennon's #9Dream performed by R.E.M. :
   
  https://mega.co.nz/#!oAoiHKwa!cQp_DgHkr_vklUAlFlsoG1375bgHj3zLvwdqgQL5lkY
   
please tell me just few words more about sibilance, harshness of Vsonic VC02 listening this song. Compare with Meelec A151 and CC51,. Something between...., ? Thanks!


----------



## Selenium

How long are the housings of the VC02 vs. the ER4? Like half of the ER4 sticks out of my ears, shallow-fit phones work best for me.


----------



## soundstige

About 3/4.
  Quote: 





selenium said:


> How long are the housings of the VC02 vs. the ER4? Like half of the ER4 sticks out of my ears, shallow-fit phones work best for me.


----------



## tinphamhuu0212

Get a VC02 after reading Joker review , Very satisfied with it , very balance Just what I want and My VC02 come with shirt clip lucky me


----------



## ljokerl

UE 600 review with measurements up on InnerFidelity: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/logitech-ue-600-ear-monitor
   
  Very respectable performance, though personally I still prefer the Ety HF5 or MEElec A161P among the $100 armatures.
   
  Quote: 





danielkrego said:


> Wow! This is one review I cannot wait for. Sounds like it might be the perfect IEM for me, at the moment. The only thing that's making me hesitate is the top-end of the RE-400, some putting the IEM in the 'warm' camp.


 
   
  While it may be warmer than the RE272 or ER4S, I really don't think the RE-400 is a warm earphone in the negative sense of that term. I have to spend more time with it but so far it's a difficult set to find fault with.
   
  Quote: 





raisedbywolves said:


> i realize getting questions like this might be annoying, but i hope you can help me out. my vsonic gr07 mk1's just broke and i plan to buy a replacement pair and probably get them recabled. but i'm also looking at potentially getting the mk2's or the be's, and i'm also considering just going for a different style phone like the mid-centric tdk ie800 (which i'm not sure if you've heard yet or not) or the hifiman re-400's. i listen to a large variety of genres, and i found the gr07's were great for that, and i was wondering what you'd recommend. i really like the gr07 sound, and from what i've read, the re-400's definitely have less bass but i don't think it'd bug me too much. and the build quality and looks are really superb to me. i'm also thinking of just buying a super cheap pair like the vsonic vc02's. i have had the sony mh1c's and gave them to my brother because i found them a little bloated bass-wise, but i know they're both small driver phones. anyway, i'm rambling, so i'll wrap this up now. thanks for the help.


 
   
  I have not heard the IE800 from TDK. The VC02 might be a safer choice than the RE-400 as its bass quantity is somewhere between that and the GR07. It's not bloated at all and it is dirt cheap. I don't think it has the overall refinement of the HiFiMan, especially in the treble region, but then that's still a $40 earphone being compared to one of the best $100 sets. I definitely prefer the VC02 to the MH1C.

  
  Quote: 





omarccx said:


> I'm intrigued too about *how the RE 400 compares to the GR07*. Still contemplating selling my GR06 and getting those.


 
   
  In a sentence, less punchy and smoother through the treble. 
   
  Quote: 





danielkrego said:


> Me too, very intrigued about RE-400 vs GR07 and also Ortofon E-Q5.


 
   
  Answered your PM. 
   
  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> Hi joker, respect for all these reviews!Here is  Mr. Lennon's #9Dream performed by R.E.M. :
> 
> https://mega.co.nz/#!oAoiHKwa!cQp_DgHkr_vklUAlFlsoG1375bgHj3zLvwdqgQL5lkY
> 
> please tell me just few words more about sibilance, harshness of Vsonic VC02 listening this song. Compare with Meelec A151 and CC51,. Something between...., ? Thanks!


 
   
  You know, I never found the CC51 to be harsh-sounding. Crisp and with a bit of added sparkle/excitement, yes, but not harsh or sibilant. I would say the VC02 is a little hotter than that, and also than the A151 which, like most SR-based earphones, is pretty laid-back past the upper midrange. 
   
  Quote: 





tinphamhuu0212 said:


> Get a VC02 after reading Joker review , Very satisfied with it , very balance Just what I want and My VC02 come with shirt clip lucky me


----------



## garcsa

Thanks joker! Useful info.VC02 ordered.


----------



## snailmale

Great review on the VC02! Would love to see one on the GR04 Flagship, I find it extremely underrated, even though those who own one (including me) all seem to love it. Am angling at ordering another pair as a gift, but the choice between GR04 Flagship, VC02 and GR02BE is really tough!


----------



## Niyologist

Anyone want me to review the Astrotec AM-800 or 900?


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

joker have you heard the ATH CKS1000?


----------



## Spiderman

hey joker,
   
  I actually saw your post on innerfidelity and I was hoping you could help me out on something. I really need a few headphone recommendations, see I have tried many headphones the hd -650, the v-moda m100's, the he-400's, the m50. And I haven't found anything I like, for me personally the most important thing about music is hearing the singer above everything else. I want to be able to hear the singer up close and personal, instrument separation and soundstage are other things I look for but not as important.


----------



## goodvibes

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> UE 600 review with measurements up on InnerFidelity: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/logitech-ue-600-ear-monitor


 
  Just a note. The PFEs aren't side firing like the 600 and have a curved rubber horn attached.to a front firing BA. I know because I made the same error and opened them up to check. One of the few (I wish
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) times I've inserted foot in mouth. Overall, it matters not to another great review but I know you like accuracy.


----------



## smeghead

I'm considering the VC02s, but I've never had a pair of IEMs that have detachable cables before. What are the benefits of them, because unless the seller sells replacement cables, which I don't think VSonic do, then it just seems like something else to potentially lose.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





snailmale said:


> Great review on the VC02! Would love to see one on the GR04 Flagship, I find it extremely underrated, even though those who own one (including me) all seem to love it. Am angling at ordering another pair as a gift, but the choice between GR04 Flagship, VC02 and GR02BE is really tough!


 
   
  There's also the new R02 Silver, which seems to be better than the GR02BE unless you need the extra bass 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> joker have you heard the ATH CKS1000?


 
   
  I have not.
   
  Quote: 





spiderman said:


> hey joker,
> 
> I actually saw your post on innerfidelity and I was hoping you could help me out on something. I really need a few headphone recommendations, see I have tried many headphones the hd -650, the v-moda m100's, the he-400's, the m50. And I haven't found anything I like, for me personally the most important thing about music is hearing the singer above everything else. I want to be able to hear the singer up close and personal, instrument separation and soundstage are other things I look for but not as important.


 
   
  I'm not that well-versed in full-size headphones but in the world of IEMs you'd probably like something like an ATH-CK100 or Westone UM3X. Those two really put the vocals front and center.
   
  Quote: 





goodvibes said:


> Just a note. The PFEs aren't side firing like the 600 and have a curved rubber horn attached.to a front firing BA. I know because I made the same error and opened them up to check. One of the few (I wish
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for the info. I guess I've always assumed they were side-firing even since reading dfkt's 2008 review, which calls them "edge-firing". I'll see if I can make the correction on IF.
   
  Quote: 





smeghead said:


> I'm considering the VC02s, but I've never had a pair of IEMs that have detachable cables before. What are the benefits of them, because unless the seller sells replacement cables, which I don't think VSonic do, then it just seems like something else to potentially lose.


 
   
  Generally speaking, the advantage is that if you wear out the cable, you have to replace only the cable and not the whole earphone. The VC02 is a special case because it's so cheap - a replacement cable would probably cost as much as a new unit. VSonic doesn't sell them yet but it's a standard 2-pin connection so there are a lot of cables that will work. I think the Fiio TF10 cables (~$30) should work, though I don't have a pair here.


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> A $1 shirt clip helps eliminate microphonics almost entirely.


 
   
  If anyone knows of a good online source to get shirt clips, please let me know. I am looking but not having much luck. Thanks.


----------



## H20Fidelity

waynes world said:


> If anyone knows of a good online source to get shirt clips, please let me know. I am looking but not having much luck. Thanks.




Option:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/3x-New-Headphone-Cable-Nip-Clamp-Collar-Holder-Clip-For-Earphone-MP3-Cell-Phone-/190773000826?pt=AU_MobilePhoneAccessories&hash=item2c6af4fa7a&_uhb=1


----------



## Love Music

Just brought the UE900 and loving every moment of it. The mids and highs are so clean and clear. The spacious soundstage sounds really natural and makes my music really involving, especially female vocals and classical music. Piano pieces sounds magical.
   
  Thanks Joker for the recommendation


----------



## DonRadlauer

waynes world said:


> If anyone knows of a good online source to get shirt clips, please let me know. I am looking but not having much luck. Thanks.



 
 Here's what I bought: http://www.ebay.com/itm/230927118915 This vendor shipped fast, and the clips (supposedly Sennheiser) are quite nice.


----------



## countolaf

I wanted to get the ER4PT but thought they were too expensive for what I can spend and thus I'm looking at the HF5. I like the Ety in general because of the isolation (will be using this for commute) and the 'neutrality' (I don't have any headphone I think that have this characteristic). Now is HF5 totally fine or would you recommend maybe a handful of other IEMs within the same price range that would fit those requirements? Or even if HF5 is fine (which Im guessing is), please still give me others to choose from. lol.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





love music said:


> Just brought the UE900 and loving every moment of it. The mids and highs are so clean and clear. The spacious soundstage sounds really natural and makes my music really involving, especially female vocals and classical music. Piano pieces sounds magical.
> 
> Thanks Joker for the recommendation


 
   
  Glad you like them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> Option:
> 
> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/3x-New-Headphone-Cable-Nip-Clamp-Collar-Holder-Clip-For-Earphone-MP3-Cell-Phone-/190773000826?pt=AU_MobilePhoneAccessories&hash=item2c6af4fa7a&_uhb=1


 
   
  Quote: 





donradlauer said:


> Here's what I bought: http://www.ebay.com/itm/230927118915This vendor shipped fast, and the clips (supposedly Sennheiser) are quite nice.


 
   
  Anyone ever seen these sold separately? Would totally buy some. 
   
   
  Quote: 





countolaf said:


> I wanted to get the ER4PT but thought they were too expensive for what I can spend and thus I'm looking at the HF5. I like the Ety in general because of the isolation (will be using this for commute) and the 'neutrality' (I don't have any headphone I think that have this characteristic). Now is HF5 totally fine or would you recommend maybe a handful of other IEMs within the same price range that would fit those requirements? Or even if HF5 is fine (which Im guessing is), please still give me others to choose from. lol.


 

 Yeah the HF5 would be a great ER4 alternative. If you have to have some other BA options there's the MEElec A161P, which is a little more biased towards the low end, and the UE600, which is a little more biased towards the midrange, at least the way I hear it. I would just go ahead and get the HF5.


----------



## The Neverhood

I love my RE-400! 
   
  I love them that much, I might make some custom sleeves! 
   
  I was curious about the PFE, I ordered the 012, and some grey filters. The highs do seem uneven, definitely forward, or at least to my ears, though not harsh.  Not only that, but wearing them over the ear has been somewhat problematic for me. The RE-400s are very good.
   
  Anyway, thanks for the recommendation.


----------



## waynes world

Thanks for the tips about the clips guys!
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Anyone ever seen these sold separately? Would totally buy some.


 
   
  Me too! That is exactly like the one that I had and lost - it was great. I think I got mine along with my fxd70's. But  as you know, they appear to be difficult (if not impossible) to find online.
   
  So for now, I went with the option that DonRadlauer presented. Thanks again.


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

When is the Re600 going to be released?  Hoping for something pretty amazing at almost $500.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





the neverhood said:


> I love my RE-400!
> 
> I love them that much, I might make some custom sleeves!
> 
> ...


 
   
  Glad you like 'em 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> When is the Re600 going to be released?  Hoping for something pretty amazing at almost $500.


 

 Not a clue. The RE-400 will certainly be a tough act to follow so I'll be very curious to hear it.


----------



## Alias Gu

Hi, joker:
   
  I just sent my impressions to UM lab, and right now just want to make some guesses of my pending Miracles by comparing with EX1000. And you might be the few people who really heard both. *So could you please offer a little more comparisons between Sony EX1000 and Miracles? *(I also have TG334, but Miracles and TG 334 are quite different.)
  Someone told me that EX1000 and Miracles sound quite similar, but, to my ear, i even don't think EX1000 is extremely balanced though it sounds just balanced. EX1000's midrange to highs is too thin and bright to me. It makes me feel slightly fatiguing. Spending an hour listening to certain songs with my EX1000 is torturing. I like EX1000's spacious soudstage and bass, which is tight, quick and impactful, however, lacks midbass. So it sounds a little dull to me.* Does Miracles offer a thicker vocal, a smoother and neutral highs and more quantities of bass?(only compared to EX1000)*
   
  Thanks 
  Alias G


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

hey joker you planning on getting the RE600?  I'll be getting the ATH CKS1000.  IF you want after I do about 100 hrs of burn in I can send them to you to do some impressions.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Hi, joker:
> 
> I just sent my impressions to UM lab, and right now just want to make some guesses of my pending Miracles by comparing with EX1000. And you might be the few people who really heard both. *So could you please offer a little more comparisons between Sony EX1000 and Miracles? *(I also have TG334, but Miracles and TG 334 are quite different.)
> Someone told me that EX1000 and Miracles sound quite similar, but, to my ear, i even don't think EX1000 is extremely balanced though it sounds just balanced. EX1000's midrange to highs is too thin and bright to me. It makes me feel slightly fatiguing. Spending an hour listening to certain songs with my EX1000 is torturing. I like EX1000's spacious soudstage and bass, which is tight, quick and impactful, however, lacks midbass. So it sounds a little dull to me.* Does Miracles offer a thicker vocal, a smoother and neutral highs and more quantities of bass?(only compared to EX1000)*
> ...


 
   
  I don't think the MIracle and EX1000 are too similar. The Miracle is smoother and a little warmer, with less strident upper midrange and treble. I don't think you'll get much more mid-bass out of the Miracle so it may not quite satisfy in that respect but it rolls off less in sub-bass. It's also almost as spacious as the EX1000 without losing its excellent depth and layering (which the EX1000 can't quite match). 
   
  Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> hey joker you planning on getting the RE600?  I'll be getting the ATH CKS1000.  IF you want after I do about 100 hrs of burn in I can send them to you to do some impressions.


 

 I don't really know much about the RE-600 at this point. I think I should finish the RE-400 review first before making additional plans. I don't think I can fit in an additional stint with a CKS1000 at this time, either. If it's leagues ahead of your MG7 I might change my mind, though


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think the MIracle and EX1000 are too similar. The Miracle is smoother and a little warmer, with less strident upper midrange and treble. I don't think you'll get much more mid-bass out of the Miracle so it may not quite satisfy in that respect but it rolls off less in sub-bass. It's also almost as spacious as the EX1000 without losing its excellent depth and layering (which the EX1000 can't quite match).
> 
> 
> I don't really know much about the RE-600 at this point. I think I should finish the RE-400 review first before making additional plans. I don't think I can fit in an additional stint with a CKS1000 at this time, either. If it's leagues ahead of your MG7 I might change my mind, though


 
  Thanks, dear joker. You just reassured my decision has been exactly right.
  You might be asked for thousands of times: would you like to write a review about IE800?
  Because the sound of IE800 seems very controversial among my friends.


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't think the MIracle and EX1000 are too similar. The Miracle is smoother and a little warmer, with less strident upper midrange and treble. I don't think you'll get much more mid-bass out of the Miracle so it may not quite satisfy in that respect but it rolls off less in sub-bass. It's also almost as spacious as the EX1000 without losing its excellent depth and layering (which the EX1000 can't quite match).
> 
> 
> I don't really know much about the RE-600 at this point. I think I should finish the RE-400 review first before making additional plans. I don't think I can fit in an additional stint with a CKS1000 at this time, either. If it's leagues ahead of your MG7 I might change my mind, though


 
  Sure I'll let you know.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Thanks, dear joker. You just reassured my decision has been exactly right.
> You might be asked for thousands of times: would you like to write a review about IE800?
> Because the sound of IE800 seems very controversial among my friends.


 
   
  It was posted a few pages ago that the IE800 unit I received via InnerFidelity may not be representative of what others are hearing out of theirs (based on its measurements) so we're exploring getting it replaced or getting another one to confirm.


----------



## abhijollyguy

@joker
   
  1. Out of EPH-100, Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X, Which one has more bass? I guess it's EPH-100? if yes so which one has more bass out of SM3 and UM3X?
   
  2. Out of EPH-100, Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X, Which one has better bass quality?
   
  3. Out of EPH-100, Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X, Which one has better instrument separation? I guess it's UM3X?
   
  4. Out of EPH-100, Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X, I guess SM3 has the best soundstage of the three?
   
  5. Out of EPH-100, Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X, Which one has the best quality treble?
   
   
  TIA


----------



## zhangjiaqinelly

any chance that you could add Grado GR10 to this list? thanks


----------



## koisounds

Big thanks for this, Incredible work. Just bought some rockit r-50s


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Hey joker, I think I got my eyes on the HA-FXT90. I can get those for 65$ (and possibly cheaper if there's a nice offer availabe in the future).
  Do you think they are a worth while upgrade of SHE3580 (lol I started to think this is a stupid question)? Beside I listen to male vocal and Rock on a daily basic, will these IEMs unleash their full potential with this genre of music?
  Any more suggestion within this price range? Preferable Japanese brands because I have a friend who study over there and he can buy and send stuff back to me easily


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





abhijollyguy said:


> @joker
> 
> 1. Out of EPH-100, Earsonics SM3 and Westone UM3X, Which one has more bass? I guess it's EPH-100? if yes so which one has more bass out of SM3 and UM3X?
> 
> ...


 
   
  The EPH-100 has more bass, followed by the SM3 and then UM3X (not far apart IMO). They all have good bass quality. I preferred the SM3 to the EPH-100 but not by much. The UM3X has the best separation. The SM3 has the most enveloping soundstage, which is not to say it's the one you'll necessarily like best. I think the treble is too laid-back on both the SM3 and UM3X but I would still still take those over the EPH-100 for their smoothness. Can't be more specific than that since I don't have access to a UM3X for A:B comparisons.  
   
   
  Keep in mind I only have heard the SM3 v1. 
   
  Quote: 





zhangjiaqinelly said:


> any chance that you could add Grado GR10 to this list? thanks


 
   
  No plans to add it at this time.
   
  Quote: 





koisounds said:


> Big thanks for this, Incredible work. Just bought some rockit r-50s


 
  Great, glad it was useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> Hey joker, I think I got my eyes on the HA-FXT90. I can get those for 65$ (and possibly cheaper if there's a nice offer availabe in the future).
> Do you think they are a worth while upgrade of SHE3580 (lol I started to think this is a stupid question)? Beside I listen to male vocal and Rock on a daily basic, will these IEMs unleash their full potential with this genre of music?
> Any more suggestion within this price range? Preferable Japanese brands because I have a friend who study over there and he can buy and send stuff back to me easily


 

 I think that's a good price for the FXT90. I did enjoy them for rock and vocals on it are nice and non-recessed. Unless you can get the FX700 for the same price I would go for it


----------



## FrequencyBlue

I checked the fx700... yeah no, over 200 bucks (19000 yen, while the fxt90 only cost 6000 yen ~ $64)


----------



## BriGuy31

Any timeframe on the review of the Ultimate Ears 700?


----------



## Techno Kid

Quote: 





briguy31 said:


> Any timeframe on the review of the Ultimate Ears 700?


 
   
  I don't think he's ever going to do the review for the UE700 or the TF10 because both are discontinued and there's plenty of reviews for the TF10 already.


----------



## Sladeophile

First of all, huge thanks on the encyclopedia of knowledge here. Top notch.
   
  I am a proud owner of the UM3X, and I use them everyday.  I would like to get into the low end customs, 350-450$ range.  Any comparisons or advice in relation to the UM3X would be much appreciated.  I'm not quite sure which direction I would like to go yet, but hearing some comparisons would help me make that decision.  Sorry if this has been discussed, but this is a massive thread to search through.


----------



## Hipgig

I have got so much out and have spent so much fun time reading this thread~!!! Really appreciated!!!


----------



## casanova

I have ordered a pair of Vsonic VC02 for my sister just a few minutes after reading ljoker review.
   
  My sister does not like bass or heavy music at all, she likes fairly light music, take the country music for example.
  I hope the VC02 fits the bill well.
   
  Thank you ljoker. I always follow your guide when it comes to buying the IEMs including ( the Phonak 012 for myself , the Vsonic G07 for my wife ) both of them has always given us much satisfied in terms of sound quality.
   
  Much appreciated!!!


----------



## Phenony

One of the best reviews I have seen. Thanks for the sharing.
   
  Truly appreciated.


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





phenony said:


> One of the best reviews I have seen. Thanks for the sharing.
> 
> Truly appreciated.


 
  Do any other same best reviews exist in this world?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





briguy31 said:


> Any timeframe on the review of the Ultimate Ears 700?


 
   
  Sorry, no. 
   
  Quote: 





techno kid said:


> I don't think he's ever going to do the review for the UE700 or the TF10 because both are discontinued and there's plenty of reviews for the TF10 already.


 
   
  For the UE700 it's also that I think there are better-yet-similar-sounding TWFK-based sets in that price range, including the Brianwavz B2 and Rock-It R-50. 
   
  Quote: 





sladeophile said:


> First of all, huge thanks on the encyclopedia of knowledge here. Top notch.
> 
> I am a proud owner of the UM3X, and I use them everyday.  I would like to get into the low end customs, 350-450$ range.  Any comparisons or advice in relation to the UM3X would be much appreciated.  I'm not quite sure which direction I would like to go yet, but hearing some comparisons would help me make that decision.  Sorry if this has been discussed, but this is a massive thread to search through.


 
   
  It's been a while since I've heard the UM3X. Are you looking for any particular sound improvements/changes in relation to the UM3X? None of the entry-level customs I've tried (though there's only 4 I've heard in that price range) reminded me of the UM3X.
    
  Quote:


hipgig said:


> I have got so much out and have spent so much fun time reading this thread~!!! Really appreciated!!!


 
   
  Thanks, glad to hear that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





casanova said:


> I have ordered a pair of Vsonic VC02 for my sister just a few minutes after reading ljoker review.
> 
> My sister does not like bass or heavy music at all, she likes fairly light music, take the country music for example.
> I hope the VC02 fits the bill well.
> ...


 
   
  Good choice, hope she likes them! 
   
  Quote: 





phenony said:


> One of the best reviews I have seen. Thanks for the sharing.
> 
> Truly appreciated.


 

 Thanks


----------



## scottgibson73

I am a noob here, I just joined about a month ago and I want to say thank you for the reviews on all of the headphones. This will help me a lot in making some informed decisions. I never knew this place existed until recently and it is top notch!!! I look forward to talking to you guys and once my probationary period is over I will update my profile to include my gear. Although it is very,very modest compared to what you guys are sporting!!! Take care All and jam on!


----------



## Tuco1965

Welcome to Head-Fi and sorry about your wallet.


----------



## Sladeophile

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's been a while since I've heard the UM3X. Are you looking for any particular sound improvements/changes in relation to the UM3X? None of the entry-level customs I've tried (though there's only 4 I've heard in that price range) reminded me of the UM3X.


 
  Well, I guess mostly I would like a more open soundstage and probably just a different sound signature.  I don't want something super analytical, something with a good sound that makes music interesting, kind of like the UM3X does, but a different flavor, if that makes sense.  This is for enjoying music, not for picking it apart.  I'll use my studio monitors for that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





scottgibson73 said:


> I am a noob here, I just joined about a month ago and I want to say thank you for the reviews on all of the headphones. This will help me a lot in making some informed decisions. I never knew this place existed until recently and it is top notch!!! I look forward to talking to you guys and once my probationary period is over I will update my profile to include my gear. Although it is very,very modest compared to what you guys are sporting!!! Take care All and jam on!


 
   
  Welcome to Head-Fi! 
   
  Quote: 





sladeophile said:


> Well, I guess mostly I would like a more open soundstage and probably just a different sound signature.  I don't want something super analytical, something with a good sound that makes music interesting, kind of like the UM3X does, but a different flavor, if that makes sense.  This is for enjoying music, not for picking it apart.  I'll use my studio monitors for that.


 

 I would go with the 1964-V3, then. It's quite solid for an entry-level custom with a colored but not downright unbalanced sound signature. I think most would qualify it is a fun-sounding set and not at all a reference monitor.


----------



## Alias Gu

Joker
  I really want to read your review on another high-end CIEM that can totally surpasses Miracles! 

  Hope you will do it in the near future.


----------



## PereUbu

After reading your review I'm still deciding between VSonic VC02, VSonic GR06 and Astrotec AM90.
 Due to the price of these IEMs and my growing curiosity towards this hobby, I'm thinking about buying two of them to have a chance to try different sound signatures.
 I'd like one of the IEM to be a neutral one, so that I can start appreciating a more natural sound, but the other one could be a little more "fun".
 What do you think I should go with?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Joker
> I really want to read your review on another high-end CIEM that can totally surpasses Miracles!
> 
> Hope you will do it in the near future.


 
   
  This might happen sooner than you think 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





pereubu said:


> After reading your review I'm still deciding between VSonic VC02, VSonic GR06 and Astrotec AM90.
> Due to the price of these IEMs and my growing curiosity towards this hobby, I'm thinking about buying two of them to have a chance to try different sound signatures.
> I'd like one of the IEM to be a neutral one, so that I can start appreciating a more natural sound, but the other one could be a little more "fun".
> What do you think I should go with?


 
   
  Go for the VC02 as the neutral one - I think it is noticeably better than the AM-90 and other SR-based single-armature earphones. For the more fun one I would get something v-shaped, maybe a GR02BE or Audio-Technica CKM500.


----------



## zerocoolhifi

I will carry the VC02 and GR02 BE on a plane and they are a great compliment.


----------



## jarrett

VC02 vs RE0? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  My way old RE0 (a replacement for a pair that died) are failing. I have better IEMs in general now, but since ordering the VC02 I haven't bought anything as straight up analytical


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> This might happen sooner than you think


 
  Would you like to give some hints?


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For the UE700 it's also that I think there are better-yet-similar-sounding TWFK-based sets in that price range, including the Brianwavz B2 and Rock-It R-50.


 
  I haven't been able to find the B2's anywhere. Are they still in production?
   
  JJ


----------



## kaixax555

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I haven't been able to find the B2's anywhere. Are they still in production?
> 
> JJ


 

 They are still available in mp4nation
   
  http://www.mp4nation.net/brainwavz-earphones/brainwavz-b2-dual-balanced-armature-earphones/
   
  I don't think they will be out of production anytime soon


----------



## VisceriousZERO

Any plans on reviewing the EarSonics SM64 V2?


----------



## PereUbu

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Go for the VC02 as the neutral one - I think it is noticeably better than the AM-90 and other SR-based single-armature earphones. For the more fun one I would get something v-shaped, maybe a GR02BE or Audio-Technica CKM500.


 

 Thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> VC02 vs RE0?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I have the RE-ZERO but not the RE0. I thought the ZERO was slightly more spacious than the VC02, the midrange was a bit more natural-sounding compared to the thinner VC02, and the treble was smoother and more refined. Definitely not a big difference overall, however, and much smaller than it should be considering the price difference.
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Would you like to give some hints?


 
   
  There are 3 competitors for the top spot that I've heard so far. No additional info at this time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> I haven't been able to find the B2's anywhere. Are they still in production?
> 
> JJ


 
   
  I think so. I wouldn't panic if they are not on listed on Mp4nation - they have been known to remove products that are out of stock from their site and then add them again later.
   
  Quote: 





visceriouszero said:


> Any plans on reviewing the EarSonics SM64 V2?


 

 Nope, couldn't get hold of Earsonics.


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> Hey joker, I think I got my eyes on the HA-FXT90. I can get those for 65$ (and possibly cheaper if there's a nice offer availabe in the future).
> Do you think they are a worth while upgrade of SHE3580 (lol I started to think this is a stupid question)? Beside I listen to male vocal and Rock on a daily basic, will these IEMs unleash their full potential with this genre of music?
> Any more suggestion within this price range? Preferable Japanese brands because I have a friend who study over there and he can buy and send stuff back to me easily


 
  ath ckn70 for sure


----------



## mark2410

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, not sure if they're just seeing less orders from overseas and are therefore cutting back on distribution or if they're actually shifting gears altogether and moving away from IEMs. I haven't seen much mention of their newer models on here. I think lendmeurears still carries the PR401, at least.


 
   
  oh thats a shame i always rather liked the PR401


----------



## Bina

Hi, can you pelase just qucikly compare sound signature of RE400 to 1964-V3? Thank you


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mark2410 said:


> oh thats a shame i always rather liked the PR401


 
   
  Yeah, same here. 
   
  Quote: 





bina said:


> Hi, can you pelase just qucikly compare sound signature of RE400 to 1964-V3? Thank you


 

 They don't really have anything in common. The RE-400 is mostly neutral with a slight mid-bass hump. The V3 is quite a lot bassier and has an overall livelier, more colored signature. It places the mids farther forward and has a little more energy in the lower treble. The RE-400 is smoother and a little more dull-sounding up top.


----------



## lesterq

Hi joker , 
  May i ask if you would suggest the Astrotec AM-90 or the VSonic VC02?  
[size=1.7em] (GR02 Bass)? Keep seeing this popping up in this thrread[/size]   
  I've ruled out Dunu trident because it seems weaker compared to this two. 
  I prefer the Astrotec's design but if the VSonic is much better design doesnt really matter?
  My previous earpiece were the CX880 and those had really bad cable noise. . 
   
  Hmm just back read and found this. But i am quite afraid that i would be irritated with the detachable driver?
  Read in the appreciation thread that it is very loose , and comes off from the cable when removing them from the ear. 


ljokerl said:


> Go for the VC02 as the neutral one - I think it is noticeably better than the AM-90 and other SR-based single-armature earphones. For the more fun one I would get something v-shaped, maybe a GR02BE or Audio-Technica CKM500.


 

   
  Also may i ask what is cable cinch? And has anybody bought the VC02 from the ebay seller bigbargainseller?


----------



## james444

Quote: 





lesterq said:


> Also may i ask what is cable cinch?


 
   
  Quote: 





xinn3r said:


> Oh, and btw, is a chin slider and a cable cinch the same thing?


 
  Quote: 





guhmo said:


> The chin slider is, of course, the chin slider.  The cable cinch is where the main cables separate into the individual Left/Right cables.


----------



## giantry

Hi,
   
  I have had my brainwavz b2 for around 2 years now and i was thinking of upgrading.  What iem would you recommend that has a similar sound sig but a little more bass to it.
   
  Thanks


----------



## naruse07

hello joker have you reviewed about this IEM
   
  Gr02 silver?


----------



## Love Music

Joker,
   
  I was wondering how much the sound improves on the CK100 if you pair it with the right source? At the moment none of my sources seems to have good synergy with it. The vocals sound nasal/veiled and strident.
   
  I was thinking of buying a portable amp for them, what would you recommend? 
   
  Preferably small in size and in the $100-$300 price range.
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Useless

So, when we will see RE-400 review?  How they compare to RE-0 and VC02?


----------



## davidcotton

Hi
   
  I'm curious more than anything.  I quite like the klipsch x10 sound and along with the comply ts100's bomb proof isolation.  However what I don't like is the fragile construction (particularly that cable!).  Is there something else out there that sounds similar and isolates as well as the klipsch, but has better build qualities?
   
  Listen to progressive rock and metal out of an iriver modded 120.
   
  Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lesterq said:


> Hi joker ,
> May i ask if you would suggest the Astrotec AM-90 or the VSonic VC02?
> [size=1.7em] (GR02 Bass)? Keep seeing this popping up in this thrread[/size]
> I've ruled out Dunu trident because it seems weaker compared to this two.
> ...


 
   
  Well, one of the first rules of earphones (if you want them to last) is not to pull them out of your ear by the cable. The seal with your ear can create quite a lot of suction so you can put a lot of strain on the cable by doing that. If you pull the VC02 out by the cable then yes, the housing will be left in your ear a lot of the time. It's annoying and I wish they made the connectors tighter but it's far from a deal breaker if you're careful.
   
  I call the sliding part above the y-split the cable cinch. The y-split (part where the left and right cables separate) I just call a y-split.
   
  Quote: 





giantry said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have had my brainwavz b2 for around 2 years now and i was thinking of upgrading.  What iem would you recommend that has a similar sound sig but a little more bass to it.
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  Depending on what you're looking to spend and how far from the B2 sound you want to stray, I would check out the VSonic GR07. Sony EX600/EX1000, or Phonak PFE 232. Not going to say any of these are a straight up B2 upgrade but they have more or less accurate sound, good clarity, and definitely more bass.
   
   
  Quote: 





naruse07 said:


> hello joker have you reviewed about this IEM
> 
> Gr02 silver?


 
   
  I have a pair that I haven't listened to much yet. It's a pleasant-sounding thing, warmer and thicker than the VC02 but not as clear, detailed, or balanced.
   
  Quote: 





love music said:


> Joker,
> 
> I was wondering how much the sound improves on the CK100 if you pair it with the right source? At the moment none of my sources seems to have good synergy with it. The vocals sound nasal/veiled and strident.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The difference will be noticeable but not huge. I don't have the CK100 anymore and haven't tried any of the new crop of amps anyway. I would try playing with the equalizer to see if you can get them to sound the way you want - it'll make more difference than trying to get a colored-sounding amp for it.
   
  Quote: 





useless said:


> So, when we will see RE-400 review?  How they compare to RE-0 and VC02?


 
   
  Soon. I think the RE-400 is better than the VC02 and a little better than the RE0/RE-ZERO.
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi
> 
> I'm curious more than anything.  I quite like the klipsch x10 sound and along with the comply ts100's bomb proof isolation.  However what I don't like is the fragile construction (particularly that cable!).  Is there something else out there that sounds similar and isolates as well as the klipsch, but has better build qualities?
> 
> ...


 

 That's tough because the X10 isolates so much and yet has a pretty bassy signature, which is usually more common with dynamic-driver earphones, which in turn tend to isolate less than the X10. I would say you'd have to try one of the few highly-isolating dynamics (such as the Yamaha EPH-100) or go straight for one of multi-armature monsters (e.g. the Earsonics SM2/SM3 or Westone 3/UM3X).


----------



## Love Music

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The difference will be noticeable but not huge. I don't have the CK100 anymore and haven't tried any of the new crop of amps anyway. I would try playing with the equalizer to see if you can get them to sound the way you want - it'll make more difference than trying to get a colored-sounding amp for it.


 
  I see. I have tried using EQ on them but the voices still sound unnatural. I think i might just sell them then. Thanks Joker.


----------



## naruse07

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have a pair that I haven't listened to much yet. It's a pleasant-sounding thing, warmer and thicker than the VC02 but not as clear, detailed, or balanced.


 
   

  so the SQ  is on par with VC02? with  different soundsig? ( gr02 silver is  warmer and thicker  than VC02 which is more natural and analytical)
   
  how about gr02 bass edition. ? is gr02silver complete upgrade from gr02 bass edition?


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's tough because the X10 isolates so much and yet has a pretty bassy signature, which is usually more common with dynamic-driver earphones, which in turn tend to isolate less than the X10. I would say you'd have to try one of the few highly-isolating dynamics (such as the Yamaha EPH-100) or go straight for one of multi-armature monsters (e.g. the Earsonics SM2/SM3 or Westone 3/UM3X).


 
  Hmm interesting!
   
  From what I've read the yamahas tend to be a bit finnicky in fit.  As I use them at work I need to keep it fairly simple!  With regards to the westone 3 recommmendation I did indeed have one and enjoyed it immensely.  Right up until the point they went in the wash!  Sadly it did nothing for the treble but the bass went on them, hence why I picked the x10 as a cheapish replacement (amazon offer+voucher anyway).  Nice to see I was on the right track (backwards!).
   
  Cheers


----------



## Sladeophile

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hmm interesting!
> 
> From what I've read the yamahas tend to be a bit finnicky in fit.  As I use them at work I need to keep it fairly simple!  With regards to the westone 3 recommmendation I did indeed have one and enjoyed it immensely.  Right up until the point they went in the wash!  Sadly it did nothing for the treble but the bass went on them, hence why I picked the x10 as a cheapish replacement (amazon offer+voucher anyway).  Nice to see I was on the right track (backwards!).
> 
> Cheers


 
  Did you keep your W3s?  If you did, I would recommend sending them in to be recabled by Westone.  I had my UM3Xs sent through the wash a couple times due to my carelessness and my wife's unwillingness to care about my carelessness 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			



.  As you said, the treble was fine, but the bass would rattle above anything more than a whisper.  I emailed Westone, and they said to send them in.  They took a look at them and recabled them for 40 bucks, and they are perfect again.  I am also very glad because they gave me a newer, smaller plug that is much easier to deal with than the original I had.  I would say it is at least worth looking into for such a nice and costly IEM.


----------



## davidcotton

Fair enough, I wouldn't of thought it would have been the cables though.
   
  Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





naruse07 said:


> so the SQ  is on par with VC02? with  different soundsig? ( gr02 silver is  warmer and thicker  than VC02 which is more natural and analytical)
> 
> how about gr02 bass edition. ? is gr02silver complete upgrade from gr02 bass edition?


 
   
  I don't think it's quite on par with the VC02. It's really a different (less v-shaped) flavor of the GR02BE but I haven't compared them head to head yet to be able to say it's better. The signature is quite pleasant taken on its own, with no real harshness and no overwhelming bass.
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hmm interesting!
> 
> From what I've read the yamahas tend to be a bit finnicky in fit.  As I use them at work I need to keep it fairly simple!  With regards to the westone 3 recommmendation I did indeed have one and enjoyed it immensely.  Right up until the point they went in the wash!  Sadly it did nothing for the treble but the bass went on them, hence why I picked the x10 as a cheapish replacement (amazon offer+voucher anyway).  Nice to see I was on the right track (backwards!).
> 
> Cheers


 

 I thought the Yamahas were pretty straightforward and those weird tips were comfier than I expected. Had more trouble finding a well-fitting tip for the Monster Trumpets, which come with at least a dozen different pairs.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah, same here.
> 
> 
> They don't really have anything in common. The RE-400 is mostly neutral with a slight mid-bass hump. The V3 is quite a lot bassier and has an overall livelier, more colored signature. It places the mids farther forward and has a little more energy in the lower treble. The RE-400 is smoother and a little more dull-sounding up top.


 
   
  You realize that you've just described the V3 as bassier, more middy and more trebly than the RE-400 all at the same time?


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> You realize that you've just described the V3 as bassier, more middy and more trebly than the RE-400 all at the same time?


 
   
          nothing wrong with that .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> You realize that you've just described the V3 as bassier, more middy and more trebly than the RE-400 all at the same time?


 

 I realized that's the way it reads when I was typing it, but I promise I haven't lost it. The V3 is more aggressive/forward in general than the rather laid-back RE-400, but this is most noticeable in the midrange. It also has a larger bass boost than the mild one of the RE-400 (which is the case with many other IEMs as the RE-400 is pretty flat). Lastly, it has more treble energy and is a little more peaky overall. The RE-400's treble is quite smoothed-over so this is also going to be true for many IEMs, including the Ety ER-4S and the old RE-ZERO.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

This would be so much more understandable with FR charts in hand... even just the by-ear makeshift charts I make listening to Sinegen


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> This would be so much more understandable with FR charts in hand... even just the by-ear makeshift charts I make listening to Sinegen


 
   
  Really can't afford to put in the time on that - it would take a while to get it right and do so consistently. Sadly the InnerFidelity testing rig can't measure customs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





lesterq said:


> Hi joker ,
> May i ask if you would suggest the Astrotec AM-90 or the VSonic VC02?
> [size=1.7em] (GR02 Bass)? Keep seeing this popping up in this thrread[/size]
> I've ruled out Dunu trident because it seems weaker compared to this two.
> ...


 
  Hi, received the VC02 at this very moment from bigbargainonline seller. Received within 10  days from HK to Hungary . Also bought Astrotec AM90 from the same seller. Everything was ok


----------



## Sladeophile

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Fair enough, I wouldn't of thought it would have been the cables though.
> 
> Cheers


 
  Me neither, but that was the best cast scenario as it was only 40 dollars to fix a near $400 IEM rather than finding out they were toasted.  I'm glad I had them checked out, and I am still using them every day.


----------



## OliverBB

Right now I'm trying to decide between Visang Ro2, Brainwavz M1, and Vsonic vco2
   
  What I am most interested in is bass. Vsonic VCO2 gets great review but I worry there isn't enough bass.
   
  I'm not a basshead-MEELECTRONICs M9 has much more bass than I like. 
   
  Any thoughts?
   
  Thanks!!!!!


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





oliverbb said:


> Right now I'm trying to decide between Visang Ro2, Brainwavz M1, and Vsonic vco2
> 
> What I am most interested in is bass. Vsonic VCO2 gets great review but I worry there isn't enough bass.
> 
> ...


 
  you'll only get disappointed with vc02's and m1 if you're a basshead, R02 is a bassheavy one but I suggest you get something like hisound popo bass light (doesn't mean its basslight the bass heavy version is just tooooo bass heavy) | sony mh1c | gr02 bass ed


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





oliverbb said:


> Right now I'm trying to decide between Visang Ro2, Brainwavz M1, and Vsonic vco2
> 
> What I am most interested in is bass. Vsonic VCO2 gets great review but I worry there isn't enough bass.
> 
> ...


 

 With the M9 as your only reference it's pretty hard to gauge just how much low end you need. The M9 is quite bassy, though it doesn't have as big a mid-bass hump as many of the other entry-level bass monster. It does have tons of sub-bass, though.
   
  The VC02 bass is tight and punchy and I think would be just enough for most listeners, but to be on the safe side you might want to settle for the GR02 Bass Edition instead as papijoe08 stated. That said, bass-heavy sets like the M9 have a tendency to skew what a "normal" amount of bass sounds like so for all we know you may love the VC02 after you get used to it.


----------



## Impulse

It probably depends on how open you are to appreciating and enjoying a new kind of sound... Some people have very specific and absolute preferences, others are more flexible.

I went from MEElec M9/M6s to Ety hf3s and frankly it didn't take me long at all to get used to it... I can still enjoy the MEElec's for what they are, actually bought the M6 for running after I already had the hf3, since I had given the M9 away.

That rumble gets the blood pumping when I'm a few miles into a run... But I rather enjoy the detail and isolation I get from the Ety's when I'm out and about. I guess I'm just not terribly hard to please...


----------



## ljokerl

Added the HiFiMan RE-400
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C54) HiFiMan RE-400 Waterline*
> 
> 
> Added Mar 2013
> ...


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the HiFiMan RE-400


 
   GREAT WORK!


----------



## FlySweep

Excellent RE-400 review, Joker.. I hear them in very much the same way.  Only thing I might (slightly) disagree with was that I didn't find their detail retrieval ability particularly noteworthy.. but surely impressive (given the price point).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Excellent RE-400 review, Joker.. I hear them in very much the same way.  Only thing I might (slightly) disagree with was that I didn't find their detail retrieval ability particularly noteworthy.. but surely impressive (given the price point).


 

 Well, I do agree that the RE272 and to an extent the RE-ZERO have an advantage in detail retrieval because they don't have that slight mid-bass hump to obscure some of the detail. However, with those two out of the picture now I was struggling to think of other dynamic-driver sets that can beat the RE-400 on that front.


----------



## OliverBB

.


----------



## OliverBB

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> With the M9 as your only reference it's pretty hard to gauge just how much low end you need. The M9 is quite bassy, though it doesn't have as big a mid-bass hump as many of the other entry-level bass monster. It does have tons of sub-bass, though.
> 
> The VC02 bass is tight and punchy and I think would be just enough for most listeners, but to be on the safe side you might want to settle for the GR02 Bass Edition instead as papijoe08 stated. That said, bass-heavy sets like the M9 have a tendency to skew what a "normal" amount of bass sounds like so for all we know you may love the VC02 after you get used to it.


 
   
 Ok-what I should have added was that I do have the UE 600 and I really like them. I consider it my more "neutral" set. 
 I'm looking for another low cost set that is more "fun" that I would use for a bit more casual listening. It's just that the M9 had too much bass for me. I kind of liked the Klisch S4 but had fit issues.
  
 So I guess as long as the bass wasn't more/equal to M9 or any less prominent that the UE600.
  
 I was looking at sets like the M1/R2 because of the good reviews and the style is one that would have a good fit. Today I have been also researching Brainwavz M5. From your reviews Joker that might suit me best?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





oliverbb said:


> Ok-what I should have added was that I do have the UE 600 and I really like them. I consider it my more "neutral" set.
> I'm looking for another low cost set that is more "fun" that I would use for a bit more casual listening. It's just that the M9 had too much bass for me. I kind of liked the Klisch S4 but had fit issues.
> 
> So I guess as long as the bass wasn't more/equal to M9 or any less prominent that the UE600.
> ...


 

 Well, you don't have to worry about the VC02 having less bass than the UE600 -- its bass is definitely punchier. The M1 has similar bass with a little less depth. The M5 is much bassier, possibly too bassy for you. If you liked the S4 you might just be better off with a v-shaped set like the GR02BE.


----------



## casanova

Great review and great great job, Mr.Joker.
  I've been reading your reviews for many years now and not going to stop reading in any time sooner or later.
  All the best.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





casanova said:


> Great review and great great job, Mr.Joker.
> I've been reading your reviews for many years now and not going to stop reading in any time sooner or later.
> All the best.


 

 Thank you


----------



## Amitl

is it just me or do most earphone manufacturers simply ignore cable noise..?
  i mean, take the new Hifiman RE-400 for example
  i see Joker gave it high marks across the board, with only cable noise being "bothersome".
  of course you can wear most phones cable up, but they were not designed for it (like Shure phones)
  personally i find cable noise very bothersome.


----------



## cloudycloud

|joker| - I just want to start off by thanking you for all you contribute!
   
  Request: I am looking for a replacement for my R-50s.  I LOVE the separation overall quickness of their sound.  I also have a pair of x10s, and while they are a great for when I want a bit more bass, I really miss the detail when listening to them over the R-50s.  I plan to pair these with my C&C BH and my old 6th gen Ipod Mini.
   
  Pros:

 Separation and soundstage is the best I have ever heard
 Tight bass (not a bass head as I plan to wear these for long periods at a time)
 Nimbleness with sound (I know that is not really a trait, but best way I could describe) 
   
   
  My biggest gripes with the R-50s:

 Super fragile construction as I fly a lot for work and feel it is only a matter of time before they break
 Sibilance and super-super brightness: just so much of it regardless of what tips I try - Especially can be heard on this one track I love
 Over the ear guide wire - dont mind them in general, but the guides on the R-50 just plain suck.
   
  Looking to stay in the <= $150 range.  Would the RE-400 meet my needs?  Do not wish to EQ at all as that defeats the purpose of different sounding IEMs.  Thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> is it just me or do most earphone manufacturers simply ignore cable noise..?
> i mean, take the new Hifiman RE-400 for example
> i see Joker gave it high marks across the board, with only cable noise being "bothersome".
> of course you can wear most phones cable up, but they were not designed for it (like Shure phones)
> personally i find cable noise very bothersome.


 
    
  There are definitely some who pay attention - JVC, for example, always has low or no cable noise. 
   
  Quote:


cloudycloud said:


> |joker| - I just want to start off by thanking you for all you contribute!
> 
> Request: I am looking for a replacement for my R-50s.  I LOVE the separation overall quickness of their sound.  I also have a pair of x10s, and while they are a great for when I want a bit more bass, I really miss the detail when listening to them over the R-50s.  I plan to pair these with my C&C BH and my old 6th gen Ipod Mini.
> 
> ...


 

 I think the bass of the R-50 is tighter than that of the RE-400 and the soundstage is a little wider. If you're willing to give that up the RE-400 should fit your needs just fine. I would still recommend wearing the RE-400 over-the-ear, even if you need to buy some cable guides to do so.


----------



## cloudycloud

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think the bass of the R-50 is tighter than that of the RE-400 and the soundstage is a little wider. If you're willing to give that up the RE-400 should fit your needs just fine. I would still recommend wearing the RE-400 over-the-ear, even if you need to buy some cable guides to do so.


 
   
  Are there any other possibilities in the sub $150 range that you would recommend, or is the RE-400 my best option?  What if I were to go up to the $200 range?


----------



## scootsit

Couldn't some of the IEMs that share the same driver work? Like the Astrotec AX7, Vsonic GR01, Cosmic Ears BA2...
  All share the R50 driver, but tuned slightly. So, the Astrotec and Vsonic are all metal, and are tuned slightly differently.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cloudycloud said:


> Are there any other possibilities in the sub $150 range that you would recommend, or is the RE-400 my best option?  What if I were to go up to the $200 range?


 

 There's really not many things in the price range that can compete with the R-50 in the first place, never mind keeping its strengths and improving on its weaknesses. At a stretch the ACS T15 might be an option but it's hard to justify its price over the RE-400.
   
   
  Quote: 





scootsit said:


> Couldn't some of the IEMs that share the same driver work? Like the Astrotec AX7, Vsonic GR01, Cosmic Ears BA2...
> All share the R50 driver, but tuned slightly. So, the Astrotec and Vsonic are all metal, and are tuned slightly differently.


 
   
  Well, the R-50 isn't the brightest of the bunch. In fact, with deep-sealing tips and an impedance adapter it's one of the most neutral. So, if it's too bright, it might be safer to avoid the TWFKs all together. The one I could recommend (GR01 from VSonic) is not as durable as it could be if it used the VC02 housing/cable setup. Hopefully it will get updated. The AX7 is built better but it's not less bright than the R-50.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There's really not many things in the price range that can compete with the R-50 in the first place, never mind keeping its strengths and improving on its weaknesses. At a stretch the ACS T15 might be an option but it's hard to justify its price over the RE-400.
> 
> 
> 
> Well, the R-50 isn't the brightest of the bunch. In fact, with deep-sealing tips and an impedance adapter it's one of the most neutral. So, if it's too bright, it might be safer to avoid the TWFKs all together. The one I could recommend (GR01 from VSonic) is not as durable as it could be if it used the VC02 housing/cable setup. Hopefully it will get updated. *The AX7 is built better but it's not less bright than the R-50*.


 
  joker, you got the AX7?


----------



## jant71

Hope he does have an AX7 as I'm am interested in the AX9 so the AX7 is a good starting point to gauge/guesstimate the adding of the dynamic in to the mix.
   
  Not less bright than the R-50, hmmm. But there are the two nozzles and they have different filters in them right? So, I'm thinking one should be brighter and one attenuating the treble a bit.


----------



## ljokerl

Finally had a chance to work on the table. Isolation scores have been fixed with 5/5 as the maximum instead of 5.5/5. Additionally, the accessory score now has half the weight of the other categories. Have been meaning to do that for a while. The "i" column also now has the number of buttons on the remote for those earphones that have remotes. 3-button remotes have the Apple iDevice volume controls on them. 
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> (000) Short Take: Comparison by numbers
> 
> To summarize, I've taken all of the data and calculated numerical averages of all of the scores for each earphone.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> joker, you got the AX7?


 
   
  Yes, though my pair has a channel imbalance so it's a little annoying to listen to. Need to get it exchanged. 
   
  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Hope he does have an AX7 as I'm am interested in the AX9 so the AX7 is a good starting point to gauge/guesstimate the adding of the dynamic in to the mix.
> 
> Not less bright than the R-50, hmmm. But there are the two nozzles and they have different filters in them right? So, I'm thinking one should be brighter and one attenuating the treble a bit.


 

 One of the nozzle pairs has no filters (way bright) and the other pair (came on the earphones and sounds better) has what looks to be standard Knowles acoustic dampeners (the gray ones, not the green ones that my Ety ER4 uses).


----------



## Impulse

Thanks for keeping that chart up to date and taking care of the score weights etc joker! I hadn't even that i column, very very useful for quick reference.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The one I could recommend (GR01 from VSonic) is not as durable as it could be if it used the VC02 housing/cable setup. Hopefully it will get updated. The AX7 is built better but it's not less bright than the R-50.


 
   
  Maybe the new Vsonic VC1000 is the upgrade / sidegrade or gr01? It could have the same housing/cable setup with vc02 (They look the same except the color)  It looks interesting too and its cheaper than gr01.
 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/380597556592


----------



## ffh2303

Hi joker,I've got a question. How does the RE-400 fare against the ATH-M50 [just sound quality,please ignore everything else] ? I've had a Brainwavz M4 [too V sounding] and a Sony MH1C [too much bass,exaggerated cymbals] which didn't satisfy me when compared to my M50 [which i find to be just nice]. Any input is much appreciated.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Thanks for keeping that chart up to date and taking care of the score weights etc joker! I hadn't even that i column, very very useful for quick reference.


 

 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I try to keep it as up-to-date as possible... when I have the time. 
   
  Quote: 





papijoe08 said:


> Maybe the new Vsonic VC1000 is the upgrade / sidegrade or gr01? It could have the same housing/cable setup with vc02 (They look the same except the color)  It looks interesting too and its cheaper than gr01.
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/380597556592


 
   
  Sure does look promising at that price. 
   
  Quote: 





ffh2303 said:


> Hi joker,I've got a question. How does the RE-400 fare against the ATH-M50 [just sound quality,please ignore everything else] ? I've had a Brainwavz M4 [too V sounding] and a Sony MH1C [too much bass,exaggerated cymbals] which didn't satisfy me when compared to my M50 [which i find to be just nice]. Any input is much appreciated.


 

 The M50 is more v-shaped than the RE-400. If you're expecting similar bass quantity you'll be disappointed but otherwise I think the HiFiMan is generally better than the M50.


----------



## ffh2303

I think a little less bass compared to the M50 wouldn't bother me,I don't listen to bass heavy tracks anyway. Thanks for the input.


----------



## Godinhovsky

I would like to see reviews over the 3A tier but seems posts #3 is gone.


----------



## JosephKim

Helpful reviews but I'm curious how the ratings work. For the numbers to have any value the IEMs have to be rated against each other.. if so you are going by superhuman audio memory and you are assuming your taste/hearing hasn't changed since you've started reviewing IEMs. Am I missing something? It seems like the numbers are completely arbitrary. Oh well. Still helpful nonetheless!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ffh2303 said:


> I think a little less bass compared to the M50 wouldn't bother me,I don't listen to bass heavy tracks anyway. Thanks for the input.


 
   
  You should be okay, then. For me personally I still wish the RE-400 emphasized deep bass a little more a-la VSonic GR07 but it has a little more impact to make up for that compared to previous HiFiMan sets. 
   
  Quote: 





godinhovsky said:


> I would like to see reviews over the 3A tier but seems posts #3 is gone.


 

 According to Head-Fi admins that post has reached some sort of character limit and as a result takes a while (something like 24 hours) to show up after each edit now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





josephkim said:


> Helpful reviews but I'm curious how the ratings work. For the numbers to have any value the IEMs have to be rated against each other.. if so you are going by superhuman audio memory and you are assuming your taste/hearing hasn't changed since you've started reviewing IEMs. Am I missing something? It seems like the numbers are completely arbitrary. Oh well. Still helpful nonetheless!


 

 Who said anything about audio memory? I have a lot of IEMs here that have been used as benchmarks since I started the thread or since they were originally reviewed.


----------



## waynes world

Hey Joker! If you feel like playing along.... you gave the GR07's a sound score of 9.1 and an average of 8.75. _If_ the GR07 Bass Editions rated a higher score such as 9.2, and if you could get them for $139 (which you can do periodically from Lendmeurears), what kind of average score would that give them?


----------



## markychas

Hi Joker-
  I wonder if you could give me some advice. I just bought the Etymotic HF-5. I absolutely love their level of clarity and the ability to pick up every detail. I still feel I'm craving a little better soundstage and the ability to do the deepest most accurate  bass. I only listen to classical and the Ety level of clarity is paramount with this upgrade. I am very sensitive to the microphonics you get with iems even the amount you get with the HF-5 is ultimately a deal killer. Is this too big of a request to fill with a universal iem?


----------



## Impulse

Have you tried wearing them with the cable around your ear? I haven't had much issues with mine and microphonics, sound stage isn't the greatest but I think no IEM's gonna approach full size headphones in that regard.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





waynes world said:


> Hey Joker! If you feel like playing along.... you gave the GR07's a sound score of 9.1 and an average of 8.75. _If_ the GR07 Bass Editions rated a higher score such as 9.2, and if you could get them for $139 (which you can do periodically from Lendmeurears), what kind of average score would that give them?


 
   
  Sure, it's as easy as changing a value in a spreadsheet. The "average" score is just a weighted numerical average. With 9.2 for sound the average for the GR07 goes up to 8.85 and falls right below the Rock-It R-50 on the table. The price does not factor into the average score - it only affects the tier the unit falls in and the value score. 
   
  Quote: 





markychas said:


> Hi Joker-
> I wonder if you could give me some advice. I just bought the Etymotic HF-5. I absolutely love their level of clarity and the ability to pick up every detail. I still feel I'm craving a little better soundstage and the ability to do the deepest most accurate  bass. I only listen to classical and the Ety level of clarity is paramount with this upgrade. I am very sensitive to the microphonics you get with iems even the amount you get with the HF-5 is ultimately a deal killer. Is this too big of a request to fill with a universal iem?


 

 You would probably like the VSonic GR07 - more deep bass than the Etys and a slightly wider sonic space at the expense of a bit of treble smoothness. 
   
  I agree with Impulse - the cable noise really isn't bad if you wear them cord-up.


----------



## markychas

thanks for the advice. I will consider looking into the Vsonics. I'm weird but the only time I listen to iems is in a reclining position (bed) and the over ear probably won't work.


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





markychas said:


> thanks for the advice. I will consider looking into the Vsonics. I'm weird but the only time I listen to iems is in a reclining position (bed) and the over ear probably won't work.


 
   
  Make sure you look into the GR07 Bass Editions - they are getting a lot of praise. And as far as using them in bed, they are my most comfortable iem's for that because they have a very flush profile (ie don't stick out very much) and I can lay the side of my head down without much discomfort if any (in fact, I fall asleep like that fairly often which I can't do with my other iem's). And I find that they stay in better being over the ears (especially if you use the guides).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





markychas said:


> thanks for the advice. I will consider looking into the Vsonics. I'm weird but the only time I listen to iems is in a reclining position (bed) and the over ear probably won't work.


 

 Not sure how you're getting microphonics while reclining but together with the cable slider over-the-ear wear should still work. You could even get some cable guides to fix the cable in place.


----------



## bhima

Really insightful review on the RE-400... I have no business owning them as I have enough IEMs right now but that review makes me scratch my wallet.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bhima said:


> Really insightful review on the RE-400... I have no business owning them as I have enough IEMs right now but that review makes me scratch my wallet.


 

 It's the thrill of the chase. I have tons of IEMs and still get it every time something new is in the mail.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's the thrill of the chase. I have tons of IEMs and still get it every time something new is in the mail.


 

 I've had Atrio M5 (MG7), Audio Technica WS55, a traded for pair of PFEs and GR07 Bass Editions come in through the mail in the past month. I know that feeling all too well.


----------



## herng

which model  i should choose soundmagic e30 or e10? or other brand?


----------



## rupert3k

G'day everyone,
   
  thanks for all your work ljokerl, outstanding.
   
  Been using a old battered pair of ER6i a mate gave me a looong time ago.
   
  They've been reconditioned four times with new leads but I'm ready for something new and Vsonic GR01 are top of my list.
   
  I'm also considering Go-Dap 4.0, reckon it'd work well with GR01?
   
  Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





herng said:


> which model  i should choose soundmagic e30 or e10? or other brand?


 
   
   
  You'll have to be more specific about your budget and requirements. The Soundmagics are both solid IEMs, along with about about a dozen others in that price bracket.
   
  Quote: 





rupert3k said:


> G'day everyone,
> 
> thanks for all your work ljokerl, outstanding.
> 
> ...


 

 I'm not familiar with the Go-Dap but on the GR01 - you might want to wait for some impressions of the new VSonic VC1000 (mentioned on the previous page) to roll in. Seems like it might be a better deal than the GR01 if it sounds good.


----------



## putente

*ljokerl*, do you have any experience with the Sennheiser HD650 headphones? I'm trying to find the closest sounding IEM to the HD650, and I wonder what's you opinion about this (if you know the HD650's sound, of course)...
   




   
   
  Thanks.


----------



## eke2k6

putente said:


> *ljokerl*, do you have any experience with the Sennheiser HD650 headphones? I'm trying to find the closest sounding IEM to the HD650, and I wonder what's you opinion about this (if you know the HD650's sound, of course)...
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Not joker but the closest I've heard to the HD6xx is the Senn IE 8. It has that rich grain free sound, but just sliiightly warmer.


----------



## Pianist

Never mind


----------



## putente

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Not joker but the closest I've heard to the HD6xx is the Senn IE 8. It has that rich grain free sound, but just sliiightly warmer.


 
   
   
  Well, someone already pointed that one to me on another thread, and it makes perfect sense that the closest sounding IEM to the HD650 would be a Sennheiser too! I'm looking into those, but I can only find new units of the IE8i. I guess they're supposed to be the same IEM except for the cable, right? What about the IE80? It's a newer model and easier to find, but I'm not sure what the sound differences are to the older IE8...


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





putente said:


> Well, someone already pointed that one to me on another thread, and it makes perfect sense that the closest sounding IEM to the HD650 would be a Sennheiser too! I'm looking into those, but I can only find new units of the IE8i. I guess they're supposed to be the same IEM except for the cable, right? What about the IE80? It's a newer model and easier to find, but I'm not sure what the sound differences are to the older IE8...


 
   
  IMO, the IE80 is inferior to the IE8. It's quite a bit grainier, and doesn't sound as fluid.


----------



## Pianist

IE8 has a lot more bass than HD650...


----------



## putente

Quote: 





pianist said:


> IE8 has a lot more bass than HD650...


 
   
   
  Even in the lowest bass setting? And what's your opinion about the closest sounfing IEM to the HD650?


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





putente said:


> Even in the lowest bass setting? And what's your opinion about the closest sounfing IEM to the HD650?


 
   
  I don't believe I even tried any of the bass settings other than the stock one, so yeah - I think IE8 has overblown bass even on the stock setting, unless you don't really have a seal. But in that case, the highs will become too thin and peaky.
   
  I don't believe I've heard an IEM that sounds like HD650. Maybe Shure SE530/535 sounds similar, but they are too incoherent IMO. What qualities are you looking for exactly?


----------



## putente

Quote: 





pianist said:


> I don't believe I even tried any of the bass settings other than the stock one, so yeah - I think IE8 has overblown bass even on the stock setting, unless you don't really have a seal. But in that case, the highs will become too thin and peaky.
> 
> I don't believe I've heard an IEM that sounds like HD650. Maybe Shure SE530/535 sounds similar, but they are too incoherent IMO. What qualities are you looking for exactly?


 
   
  Well, the HD650 is my favourite headphone, all-around! Since the summer here where I live is really hot, I can't really use the HD650 in those hotter months, so I'm after an IEM that will sound as close as possible to them...


----------



## eke2k6

I'm referring to the overall tone. Yes, the IE8 is bassier, but not by much. It's about a notch above the GR07, with the dial at stock.
   
  The IE8 is simply the closest I've heard.


----------



## Pianist

Quote: 





putente said:


> Well, the HD650 is my favourite headphone, all-around! Since the summer here where I live is really hot, I can't really use the HD650 in those hotter months, so I'm after an IEM that will sound as close as possible to them...


 
   
  Well, I can recommend an Etymotic HF series or ER4 as great alternatives to HD650 _to my ears_. No, they don't sound like HD650 - they are certainly less warm, dryer and more upfront. But the difference is not that great actually. The Etys are very well balanced like HD650, they just have emphasis on different qualities. What really matters is the sound quality IMO. HF5 is a bit behind HD650 in sound quality, but only slightly so. ER4S has a higher sound quality than HD650 - more resolving, neutral, accurate and natural IMO.


----------



## jhelsas

As far my memory go, the SE535 is very similar to the HD600, but not so much to the HD650, but that's based on memory and on the feelings that they caused me.
   
  For some strange reason, not in every music, but in *some* music, both the HD600 and the SE535 made me stop, listen and say: "WOW"
  I was realy, realy, close to buy the HD600, but chose the DT880-250 instead, mainly due do the fact that I found it more flexible genders-wise. And I didn't buy the SE535 basicaly because I had just spent months-worth saving between my speakers, a new headphone and dac/amp.
   
  Still, I would try them before buying if you have the chance. In case you travel inside US, there is an airport store in some airports (at least in NYC and in Dulles airports) that sell lots of air gear, but they also sell IEMs, very good iems(I had the chance to try the SE425, SE535, UM3x and the AKG K3003i), and they have them in expo, for you to try. I belive it's inMotion Entertainment.


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

Whats the difference between BA IEM and hybrid IEM?


----------



## herng

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You'll have to be more specific about your budget and requirements. The Soundmagics are both solid IEMs, along with about about a dozen others in that price bracket.
> 
> 
> I'm not familiar with the Go-Dap but on the GR01 - you might want to wait for some impressions of the new VSonic VC1000 (mentioned on the previous page) to roll in. Seems like it might be a better deal than the GR01 if it sounds good.


 
  thanks man for the reply, i have a tight budget ,around usd 45 dollar. i m looking for iem that provide high detail sound, clarity ,not so bass,in short just clear music. I m from malaysia, is very hard for me to get a good pair of earphone.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> Whats the difference between BA IEM and hybrid IEM?


 

 Hybrid uses at least one BA and one Dynamic driver


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





putente said:


> *ljokerl*, do you have any experience with the Sennheiser HD650 headphones? I'm trying to find the closest sounding IEM to the HD650, and I wonder what's you opinion about this (if you know the HD650's sound, of course)...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  I only have an HD580 (which later became the HD600). It sounds pretty balanced (a touch warm) to me, though like *jhelsas *I preferred the DT880/250 (in my case for its treble energy). I would seriously consider the RE-400 at just $100 if that's the kind of sound you are after. 
   
   
  Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> Whats the difference between BA IEM and hybrid IEM?


 
   
  A hybrid IEM would have both BA and dynamic drivers.
   
  Quote: 





herng said:


> thanks man for the reply, i have a tight budget ,around usd 45 dollar. i m looking for iem that provide high detail sound, clarity ,not so bass,in short just clear music. I m from malaysia, is very hard for me to get a good pair of earphone.


 
   
  VSonic VC02 should do the trick nicely if you have it available to you. Otherwise I would go for the E30 over the E10 if you don't mind wearing it over-the-ear.


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

And what are some of the benefits of having hybrids?


----------



## Impulse

AFAIK none of the designs are inherently superior, even BA aren't better than dynamics by default (tho multi-BAs obviously dominate the high end), just different approaches that may suit different preferences depending on how they're built and tuned.


----------



## james444

Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> And what are some of the benefits of having hybrids?


 
   
  Hybrids try to combine the strengths of both technologies, the clarity and detail resolution of BAs for mids/treble and the texture and visceral feeling of dynamic drivers for bass.


----------



## herng

thanks again, is a great community here, what about this brand? 
 http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_M11_In_Ear_Headphones_silver_p/earphone-m11-sl-mee.htm


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





herng said:


> thanks again, is a great community here, what about this brand?
> http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_M11_In_Ear_Headphones_silver_p/earphone-m11-sl-mee.htm


 
  well built, bad sound


----------



## herng

Quote: 





zelda said:


> well built, bad sound


 
  tanx man, well i think i think i ll go for soundmagic e30.


----------



## damex

hello,
   i'v found here positive feedback for *Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII* and *Yamaha EPH-100* headphones and want to interest few things about them. its 133$ for Yamaha and 166$ for Fischer Audio here (including shipping).
   
   should i prefer Fischer Audio for that price? (its nearly impossible to find something with right prices here aka not overpriced) that DBA-02 mkII does cable noise if it worn cable-down and that cable can become hard on cold, right? there are nothing else wrong with them?
   
   will that headphones require additional amplifer? (maybe recommended to use with?) i will use it with cowon c2.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





herng said:


> tanx man, well i think i think i ll go for soundmagic e30.


 
  i was refering to the M11+ model


----------



## giantry

Quote: 





damex said:


> hello,
> i'v found here positive feedback for *Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII* and *Yamaha EPH-100* headphones and want to interest few things about them. its 133$ for Yamaha and 166$ for Fischer Audio here (including shipping).
> 
> should i prefer Fischer Audio for that price? (its nearly impossible to find something with right prices here aka not overpriced) that DBA-02 mkII does cable noise if it worn cable-down and that cable can become hard on cold, right? there are nothing else wrong with them?
> ...


 
   
  I don't have the dba's but I have the B2's which is basically the same thing and I can say that I love mine and I've had them for around 2 years.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





hawaiiancerveza said:


> And what are some of the benefits of having hybrids?


 
   
   
  It really depends on who you ask - both James' and Impulse's answers are correct IMO. In theory it might allow the manufacturer to use the strengths of each type of driver to the advantage of the tuning, just as a multi-BA setup may allow the individual armatures to be tuned specifically for a more limited frequency range. But, it's definitely possible for a hybrid to sound worse than a single BA or single dynamic (see the Scosche hybrid and the Audiofly AF78).
    
  Quote:


herng said:


> thanks again, is a great community here, what about this brand?
> http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_M11_In_Ear_Headphones_silver_p/earphone-m11-sl-mee.htm


 
   
  The M11 is probably my least favorite MEElec model in terms of sound. I agree that it's nicely built. If you want to go MEElec the CW31 will compete with the similarly-priced Soundmagics. The "M" models will not.
  Quote: 





damex said:


> hello,
> i'v found here positive feedback for *Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII* and *Yamaha EPH-100* headphones and want to interest few things about them. its 133$ for Yamaha and 166$ for Fischer Audio here (including shipping).
> 
> should i prefer Fischer Audio for that price? (its nearly impossible to find something with right prices here aka not overpriced) that DBA-02 mkII does cable noise if it worn cable-down and that cable can become hard on cold, right? there are nothing else wrong with them?
> ...


 
   
  The DBA-02 mkII and EPH-100 sound very different - you should pick the one that meets your needs better. I don't really have any problems with the DBA-02 cable when worn cord-up. It's never very cold here in Southern California so I can't speak for its performance in cold weather. I think either one will run fine with the Cowon without an amp. They work fine with my J3.


----------



## herng

Quote: 





zelda said:


> i was refering to the M11+ model


 
  ya,get it. that why i will go for soundmagic.. =)


----------



## herng

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It really depends on who you ask - both James' and Impulse's answers are correct IMO. In theory it might allow the manufacturer to use the strengths of each type of driver to the advantage of the tuning, just as a multi-BA setup may allow the individual armatures to be tuned specifically for a more limited frequency range. But, it's definitely possible for a hybrid to sound worse than a single BA or single dynamic (see the Scosche hybrid and the Audiofly AF78).
> 
> The M11 is probably my least favorite MEElec model in terms of sound. I agree that it's nicely built. If you want to go MEElec the CW31 will compete with the similarly-priced Soundmagics. The "M" models will not.
> 
> The DBA-02 mkII and EPH-100 sound very different - you should pick the one that meets your needs better. I don't really have any problems with the DBA-02 cable when worn cord-up. It's never very cold here in Southern California so I can't speak for its performance in cold weather. I think either one will run fine with the Cowon without an amp. They work fine with my J3.


 
  hi joker, get it. come across with vsonic seller in my place,but out of stock,will wait for it. hopefully can get it as soon as possible.


----------



## livejamie

Anybody know how the Soul SL99s are? I was looking at them or the vPulse IEMs.


----------



## Hawaiiancerveza

Thanks guys!


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Dunu Trident vs. SoundMagic E10 for trance music??


----------



## TR3v

I bought the Logitech Ultimate Ears 500 based on these reviews. They are a great value on amazon.com right now for 33 dollars. I got them for 28. They have just enough sound quality for me to enjoy music without wishing I was using better headphones. They sound better than my old shure e2cs, much better bass. Now


----------



## BigCabDaddy

Seeking out what might prove a kind of unique recommendation for an unusual situation: I'm looking for IEMs to use inside a motorcycle helmet. Two things I know I'll need is NON isolation and a flat profile. Also prefer if they'll drive off an iPhone 4s and/or Nano without amplification, so that means efficiency since I'll be using higher than usual volumes.
   
  The sound signature I generally prefer tends towards warmth. I've found that riding usually masks bass to mids. Not sure though whether that should be deal with that situation through the IEM or through eq. Kind of leading towards EQ so I find the IEMs listenable when not riding.
   
  Music ranges from Americana to jazz/blues to funk.
   
  I'd like to keep the price < $100 and I don't mind buying used. I'll exceed $100 if need be.


----------



## leogodoy

bigcabdaddy said:


> Seeking out what might prove a kind of unique recommendation for an unusual situation: I'm looking for IEMs to use inside a motorcycle helmet. Two things I know I'll need is NON isolation and a flat profile. Also prefer if they'll drive off an iPhone 4s and/or Nano without amplification, so that means efficiency since I'll be using higher than usual volumes.
> 
> The sound signature I generally prefer tends towards warmth. I've found that riding usually masks bass to mids. Not sure though whether that should be deal with that situation through the IEM or through eq. Kind of leading towards EQ so I find the IEMs listenable when not riding.
> 
> ...




I see our point, NON-isolation is a must. I am not sure even these are safe enough, but what about single-sided, one ear phones? They mix the stereo channel into one ear, so it's not like only putting one phone and leaving the other dangling:

http://gizmodo.com/5878473/single+sided-headphones-let-you-cheat-death-by-keeping-one-ear-open

They are your best shot, IMHO, of staying aware of the environment while listening to music.

I wouldn't have any recommendations on any specific model.


----------



## BigCabDaddy

Quote: 





leogodoy said:


> I see our point, NON-isolation is a must. I am not sure even these are safe enough, but what about single-sided, one ear phones? They mix the stereo channel into one ear, so it's not like only putting one phone and leaving the other dangling:
> 
> http://gizmodo.com/5878473/single+sided-headphones-let-you-cheat-death-by-keeping-one-ear-open
> 
> ...


 
  It might not be the safest practice, but it's frequently done. Those riders that don't wear earphones generally wear earplugs if they're concerned about their hearing, still... I definitely don't want to have them too isolating. Good idea though.


----------



## Impulse

bigcabdaddy said:


> It might not be the safest practice, but it's frequently done. Those riders that don't wear earphones generally wear earplugs if they're concerned about their hearing, still... I definitely don't want to have them too isolating. Good idea though.




http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/great-motorcycling-headphones-jays-q-jays-and-etymotic-er6i

I'm not sure if the ER6i is still made but I figured the link would be of interest anyway, if you haven't read it.


----------



## leogodoy

bigcabdaddy said:


> It might not be the safest practice, but it's frequently done. Those riders that don't wear earphones generally wear earplugs if they're concerned about their hearing, still... I definitely don't want to have them too isolating. Good idea though.




I hear you, brother. I sometimes used to ride bycicles while listening to music. I used to put only one earbud. It sounded like crap but back in those days I didn't know I could find stereo-to-mono earphones.

Nowadays I don't feel safe doing that anymore, but I know some people are capable of doing it though.


----------



## damex

thx for answers, ordered Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII with LineaRossa W1 (got nice discount).


----------



## BigCabDaddy

Quote: 





impulse said:


> http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/great-motorcycling-headphones-jays-q-jays-and-etymotic-er6i
> 
> I'm not sure if the ER6i is still made but I figured the link would be of interest anyway, if you haven't read it.


 
   
  Thanks! Great read. Now if I can only find a used ER6i...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





livejamie said:


> Anybody know how the Soul SL99s are? I was looking at them or the vPulse IEMs.


 
   
  Never tried the SL99. The vPulse is quite good for what it is. 
   
  Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Dunu Trident vs. SoundMagic E10 for trance music??


 
   
  Depends on whether you like warmer (Trident) or slightly more v-shaped (Soundmagic). Personally I would go for the E10 since I like its treble better and generally prefer a more v-shaped signature for electronic music. 
   
  Quote: 





tr3v said:


> I bought the Logitech Ultimate Ears 500 based on these reviews. They are a great value on amazon.com right now for 33 dollars. I got them for 28. They have just enough sound quality for me to enjoy music without wishing I was using better headphones. They sound better than my old shure e2cs, much better bass. Now


 
   
  Good price, no doubt. Very competent earphones. 
   
  Quote: 





bigcabdaddy said:


> Seeking out what might prove a kind of unique recommendation for an unusual situation: I'm looking for IEMs to use inside a motorcycle helmet. Two things I know I'll need is NON isolation and a flat profile. Also prefer if they'll drive off an iPhone 4s and/or Nano without amplification, so that means efficiency since I'll be using higher than usual volumes.
> 
> The sound signature I generally prefer tends towards warmth. I've found that riding usually masks bass to mids. Not sure though whether that should be deal with that situation through the IEM or through eq. Kind of leading towards EQ so I find the IEMs listenable when not riding.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Most of the IEMs that fit deep inside the canal (i.e. have a lower profile) tend to also isolate more. One way to go might be an ergo-fit IEM that would be housed mostly in the outer ear. A few that come to mind that don't isolate super well are the MEElec M6 (most bass, medium isolation), Soundmagic E30 (less bass, lowest isolation), and Soundmagic PL50 (not much bass, low isolation)
   
  Quote: 





bigcabdaddy said:


> Thanks! Great read. Now if I can only find a used ER6i...


 

 The ER6i actually isolates quite well, like all Etys, and isn't warm-sounding at all. It would make sense to do one or the other - either high isolation (which reduces the bass loss) and a more balanced sound or a bassy IEM that doesn't isolate much. It's clear that Tyll (of InnerFidelity) prefers the first way.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





bigcabdaddy said:


> Seeking out what might prove a kind of unique recommendation for an unusual situation: I'm looking for IEMs to use inside a motorcycle helmet. Two things I know I'll need is NON isolation and a flat profile. Also prefer if they'll drive off an iPhone 4s and/or Nano without amplification, so that means efficiency since I'll be using higher than usual volumes.
> 
> The sound signature I generally prefer tends towards warmth. I've found that riding usually masks bass to mids. Not sure though whether that should be deal with that situation through the IEM or through eq. Kind of leading towards EQ so I find the IEMs listenable when not riding.
> 
> ...


 
   
  My experience with the $10 SHE3580/3590/3500 leads me to believe they have just the right amount of "non-isolation" for your needs as they have a small port between the driver and the eartip that serves the triple purpose of leaking sound in, preventing a total vacuum seal and creating a more open sound.  They also happen to be very low profile.  I've been annoyed by their relative lack of isolation while riding transit and walking the busy streets of Hong Kong but that makes them sound like just the right ticket for you! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  There's also the SHE3575/3595 models which add a mic and button, should you find that useful


----------



## Ziilot

What would be the next logical step after Ultimate Ears 700 and Brainwavz B2? Maybe Ultimate Ears 900?
   
  I like them both but I'm little concerned about the build quality of Logitech/UE, since UE700 cable is about to crack soon :/


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ziilot said:


> What would be the next logical step after Ultimate Ears 700 and Brainwavz B2? Maybe Ultimate Ears 900?
> 
> I like them both but I'm little concerned about the build quality of Logitech/UE, since UE700 cable is about to crack soon :/


 

 I'm not a fan of that UE cable either. The UE900 uses a different one, thankfully. In terms of sound, it'll have more bass than the 700, including depth and impact, better imaging, and smother treble, but if you like the brighter sound of the UE700 you may not enjoy it as much.


----------



## ljokerl

Added two old Sennheisers - CX980 and IE7
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2A29) Sennheiser CX980*
> 
> 
> Added Mar 2013
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(1C20) Sennheiser IE7*
> 
> 
> Added Mar 2013
> ...


----------



## kmd107

I need some help choosing my next IEM's.

 Budget: under $200
 Source: Clip+ and Galaxy Nexus, Fiio E6, Flac and 320mp3's
  Music: R&B, Jazz, some Rock, Hip Hop
  
  I currently have the RE-Zero's and love them, I feel they are great for about 70% of my music, the other 30% the bass on the Zero's falls short.  I use the Fiio E6 bass boost with the Zero's and I do feel it fills the gap and helps for most of my music.  I am hoping to find something where the amp's added bass is not needed.

 I do like the mids and highs on the Zero's, so I am basically just looking for another IEM with similiar mids and highs but with the added low end.  I was hoping the RE-400 would meet me needs but from reviews it sounds like it may still not have enough bass for me (although it sounds like it does have more than the Zero's).
  
  I have been considering the the GR07 BE's, but am open to other suggestions.
  
  Thanks in advance for the help.


----------



## TheGame21x

He finally added the IE7! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Great reviews as always Joker. But, wow, if you're getting to the IE7, the TF10 review can't be far behind! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Kidding of course. (Or am I?)


----------



## ZomG123

Hey Joker, looks like a section of your thread is missing. Post #3 is blank


----------



## extrabigmehdi

@Joker
  Great that you finally reviewed the senn IE7. I  though their bass is great, at least compared to the yamaha eph-100 (better impact & texture).
  Off course the yamaha eph-100 has better  clarity, but it's with the senn ie7 that I  learned true bass excitement.
  Thinking they deserve a better rating.


----------



## esanthosh

Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> But, wow, if you're getting to the IE7, the *TF10 review can't be far behind!*


 
   
  Coming to a browser near you on 13.13.13


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Coming to a browser near you on 13.13.13


----------



## RedSky0

Hi Joker,
   
  Was hoping your opinion across the PFE232, CK100, UE900 and EX1000.
   
  How would you rank them in terms of level of perceptible detail and bass extension, and would you recommend any other universals on those two fronts? Coming from the TF10s as an upgrade (and also because my aftermarket cables keep on breaking ...) so leaning towards the UE900s.
   
  Much appreciated.


----------



## GN-0015

Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Coming to a browser near you on 13.13.13


 
  That sounds like pro wrestling to me.


----------



## Impulse

Because of the phrasing or because the thirteenth month is just as fake as pro wrestling?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kmd107 said:


> I need some help choosing my next IEM's.
> 
> Budget: under $200
> Source: Clip+ and Galaxy Nexus, Fiio E6, Flac and 320mp3's
> ...


 
   
   
  I think even the non-BE GR07 has that deep bass that the ZERO (and to a lesser extent the RE-400) lacks. I had to send my GR07BE away as soon as I got it to get some measurements taken so I didn't spend that much time with it but it seemed to be a little smoother up top than my mkI GR07, so that might be an added bonus. It probably still won't be as refined as a HiFiMan set but if you're just getting it as an alternative that shouldn't be a problem. 
   
   
  Quote: 





thegame21x said:


> He finally added the IE7!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





esanthosh said:


> Coming to a browser near you on 13.13.13


 
   
  Maybe on the next triple date 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





zomg123 said:


> Hey Joker, looks like a section of your thread is missing. Post #3 is blank


 
   
   
  Yeah, that post has reached some sort of word/character/size limit and now takes about 24 hours to refresh after each edit. Not too thrilled about that. 
   
   
  Quote: 





extrabigmehdi said:


> @Joker
> Great that you finally reviewed the senn IE7. I  though their bass is great, at least compared to the yamaha eph-100 (better impact & texture).
> Off course the yamaha eph-100 has better  clarity, but it's with the senn ie7 that I  learned true bass excitement.
> Thinking they deserve a better rating.


 
   
   
  If you just want impactful bass the Senns (most Senn IEMs, actually) are great but the EPH-100 does pretty much everything else better than the IE7 to my ears. I didn't clearly prefer the IE7 to the VSonic GR06, which is pretty disappointing considering the price gap.
   
   
  Quote: 





redsky0 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Was hoping your opinion across the PFE232, CK100, UE900 and EX1000.
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  The CK100 has mediocre bass extension so that's probably not what you want. The EX1000 drops off a little, but not too much. The PFE and UE900 are pretty flat. They are all very detailed IMO, though the PFE is a little too recessed in the lower midrange for me and the UE900 is a little recessed in the upper midrange. I might be wrong but hasn't Phonak closed down? That would put a question mark by the 232 for me in case of warranty issues, etc. As for the UE900, as long as you're okay with it being flatter and more accurate than the TF10 overall it shouldn't be a problem.


----------



## Amitl

Shure SE215 vs Shure SE215LTD anyone?


----------



## GN-0015

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Shure SE215 vs Shure SE215LTD anyone?


 
  Here you go:
   
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/643955/review-shure-se215-vs-se215-spe-blue


----------



## Rinx7

Hey I am thinking about getting some new IEMs soon, but I can't figure out which pair would be the best for me. I listen to mostly Rock, EDM, and Hip-Hop. The ones I have been considering are the HiFiMAN RE-400 and the Rockit Sounds R50. I am going to be using them for traveling so I need them to isolate decently as well as be relatively robust and not likely to break. If you could help me out that would be really cool.


----------



## Amitl

yeah thanx GN-0015


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rinx7 said:


> Hey I am thinking about getting some new IEMs soon, but I can't figure out which pair would be the best for me. I listen to mostly Rock, EDM, and Hip-Hop. The ones I have been considering are the HiFiMAN RE-400 and the Rockit Sounds R50. I am going to be using them for traveling so I need them to isolate decently as well as be relatively robust and not likely to break. If you could help me out that would be really cool.


 

 They are both neutral-sounding earphones and both isolate well but not as well as some others. Biggest differences between the two would be in fit (R-50 has to be worn over the ear) and sound, with the RE-400 sounding warmer and smoother and the R-50 being quicker and brighter. Not sure which to trust for long-term durability - none of my earphones from either brand have malfunctioned... yet.


----------



## kylezo

Can I suggest adding the "value" rating to the charts?


----------



## kylezo

Also had a post to make, haha.
   
  So, 
   
  I'm looking for some new IEM's. Been using some FXT-90's for a long time now. I love them, and recently switched them out for a pair of M5s (MG7 driver). I noticed a huge shift in sound with the M5s which have a much darker signature and learned a lot about my preferences. So now, I'm looking for a new set of IEM's with a more analytical, spacious sound. I love detail, separation, and imaging. One thing I also loved about the FXT-90 is it's dynamic presentation. It has a musical quality and much more intimate portrayal of vocals and strings, as compared with say the M5s, which sound distant in comparison. This is great for some music, but not most of what I listen to (which tends to be orchestrated film score or soundtrack type of music, or intimate acoustic stuff).
   
  Been looking at GR07, DBA-02, ER-4S, RE272/262, and someone recently turned me on to the R-50. I posted a thread if people would prefer to reply in there, but I'm just looking to get some input and comparisons, suggestions, etc. I know a lot of the things I'm looking at are hard to get ahold of right now...specifically, there's a *couple* new GR07s, the 262/272 don't exist in a retail space anymore I don't think, etc etc. So I'm kind of relegated to looking in the FS forum, which is fine, but it means I can't always find what I'm looking for. Anyways, I'd appreciate any input.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kylezo said:


> Can I suggest adding the "value" rating to the charts?


 
   
  I took it out because there wasn't much of a point - having the table arranged by average score and clearly displaying the price pretty much takes care of that. Most of the value scores are clustered in the 6-9 range anyway.
   
  Quote: 





kylezo said:


> Also had a post to make, haha.
> 
> So,
> 
> ...


 

 The FXT90 is the most intimate of all those - the 'analytical' IEMs tend to sound wide and spacious, and all of them are different in signature from the FXT90. The FXT90 would actually make a nice compliment to an accuracy-oriented IEM. The sets you're considering are about on-par IMO so if you don't have more specific requirements just try whichever one you can get the best deal on and go from there. It would probably be the Brainwavz B2 or R-50 at ~$120 new.


----------



## monkmobile

Hello im intending to purchase a um3x but just wondering if there are any other iem that is priced around $300 and is better than the um3x? in terms of detail and soundstage


----------



## Masquerader

Are there any review for these CIEM?
   
  1. JH Audio 16 Pro
  2. Heir 8.A
  3. Spiral Ear 5 way
  4. Stage 4
  5. Fitear MH335DW
  6. 1964EARS V6


----------



## Mimouille

masquerader said:


> Are there any review for these CIEM?
> 
> 1. JH Audio 16 Pro
> 2. Heir 8.A
> ...



All yes in the multi custom thread or their dedicated threads, except stage 4


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





monkmobile said:


> Hello im intending to purchase a um3x but just wondering if there are any other iem that is priced around $300 and is better than the um3x? in terms of detail and soundstage


 

 The UM3X has very good detail and images well but its presentation was mostly in-the-head for me. If that's what you're looking for it's very hard to beat. There are a bunch of in-ears with a more out-of-the-head presentation, though.


----------



## kylezo

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The FXT90 is the most intimate of all those - the 'analytical' IEMs tend to sound wide and spacious, and all of them are different in signature from the FXT90. The FXT90 would actually make a nice compliment to an accuracy-oriented IEM. The sets you're considering are about on-par IMO so if you don't have more specific requirements just try whichever one you can get the best deal on and go from there. It would probably be the Brainwavz B2 or R-50 at ~$120 new.


 
   
  Hmmm, very good insight, thank you. How much price increase are we talking for an upgrade that would be a good soundstage with that kind of intimate feel the FXT90s give? Any recommendations along those lines?


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Quote: 





kylezo said:


> Hmmm, very good insight, thank you. How much price increase are we talking for an upgrade that would be a good soundstage with that kind of intimate feel the FXT90s give? Any recommendations along those lines?


 
   
  I think we need more clarification. In my definition your requests seem to be at odds. Intimate and soundstage seem to reflect opposite terms.an Hf5 is "intimate", a monster copper perhaps less so, the Westone 'W' series and Earsonics have more 'soundstage', then there's ie8 and SM64. I think you need to decide what it is exactly you're looking for.


----------



## jant71

To me soundstage has no quantifier/qualifier on it's own. An intimate soundstage is certainly available. I think the person needs to clarify their term "good soundstage". Intimate, deep, wide, tall, airy, etc. are fine basic descriptors but "good", not so much 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.


----------



## kylezo

Quote:


jant71 said:


> To me soundstage has no quantifier/qualifier on it's own. An intimate soundstage is certainly available. I think the person needs to clarify their term "good soundstage". Intimate, deep, wide, tall, airy, etc. are fine basic descriptors but "good", not so much
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
    
  That's definitely a legitimate point. I find that, at least in comparison to other IEM's I've owned, the FXT90 has both a larger soundstage/better imaging and separation, AND more intimate feel of the mids (vocals/strings). I think this may be a more direct result of the sound signature of what I'm comparing with, however. To me, a "good" soundstage involves nice separation, imaging/placement, and an "out-of-the-head" feel. This, combined with the kind of musical presentation the FXT90 signature has, creates both intimacy and good imaging. 
   
  Quote:


themarkremains said:


> I think we need more clarification. In my definition your requests seem to be at odds. Intimate and soundstage seem to reflect opposite terms.an Hf5 is "intimate", a monster copper perhaps less so, the Westone 'W' series and Earsonics have more 'soundstage', then there's ie8 and SM64. I think you need to decide what it is exactly you're looking for.


 
   
   
  Read what I said above re: soundstage/intimacy, however, it's true that I don't really know what I'm looking for. I mean, that's why I'm asking, haha. I'm considering just getting a "warmer" sounding IEM with a well-regarded soundstage; for instance, I've heard it said that the GR07 is on the "warmer" end of the spectrum for still being an "anaytical" IEM, so this may be what I'm looking for. With the recent mkii release, the prices on the older ones are coming down a bit as well, which may make a decision even easier to make


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kylezo said:


> Hmmm, very good insight, thank you. How much price increase are we talking for an upgrade that would be a good soundstage with that kind of intimate feel the FXT90s give? Any recommendations along those lines?


 

 I agree with jant - "good" soundstage is a bit general - but I understand what you mean in this case. The FXT90 has good depth/layering and what I sometimes call a "strong center image", meaning it can center things on its soundstage very well instead of doing the left blob - right blob thing. Earsonics sets tend to be very good at this but they may not have the signature you want. The Westone UM3X is very good at this kind of presentation as well.


----------



## herng

Get my vsonic gr02.but with not much eartipis like promised, according to the retailers, VSONIC cut down the quantity cause of bad manufacturing.


----------



## egosumlux

Have you ever tested/auditioned the Vsonic GR04 pro's?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





herng said:


> Get my vsonic gr02.but with not much eartipis like promised, according to the retailers, VSONIC cut down the quantity cause of bad manufacturing.


 
   
  Hmm.. that's definitely too bad. Maybe the colors proved difficult. What tips does it come with now?
   
  Quote: 





egosumlux said:


> Have you ever tested/auditioned the Vsonic GR04 pro's?


 

 I have not


----------



## herng

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm.. that's definitely too bad. Maybe the colors proved difficult. What tips does it come with now?
> 
> 
> I have not


 
  just 3 normal hybrids and one double flange. that all.


----------



## Chubby-sama

joker, can you recommend an iem with the best build quality for under $40? i'm not too particular about the other qualities, as long as they perform decently. thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





herng said:


> just 3 normal hybrids and one double flange. that all.


 
   
  Hmm.. all black in color?
   
  Quote: 





chubby-sama said:


> joker, can you recommend an iem with the best build quality for under $40? i'm not too particular about the other qualities, as long as they perform decently. thanks!


 

 The Philips "The Tread" is probably as good as it gets - it was designed from the ground up to be indestructible. Sound is okay - you can get better for less money but not with the same level of construction quality. If you're going to prioritize sound over build, I'd go for the RHA MA-350 or Dunu Trident. Both sound better than the Philips and are almost as well-made.


----------



## Letchy

Hello Joker, thank you for this informative thread!
   
  I am stuck between two IEM choices at the moment... I am looking at the MEElectronics M6 and the MEElectronics M9. They both seem to be pretty similar in terms of sound, however the M9s are relatively cheaper than the M6 model. One key factor in my choice is that I will be using these IEMs most of the time, while at College or running/working out... I notice both can be worn over the ear which is a good option for sporty activities, but I am unsure.
   
  If you could provide some extra insight and aid me in choosing, that would be awesome!
   
  Thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





letchy said:


> Hello Joker, thank you for this informative thread!
> 
> I am stuck between two IEM choices at the moment... I am looking at the MEElectronics M6 and the MEElectronics M9. They both seem to be pretty similar in terms of sound, however the M9s are relatively cheaper than the M6 model. One key factor in my choice is that I will be using these IEMs most of the time, while at College or running/working out... I notice both can be worn over the ear which is a good option for sporty activities, but I am unsure.
> 
> ...


 

 The M9 can be worn over the ear but it's not nearly as secure when worn that way as the M6. For sports use there's really no competition - I still use my M6 sometimes when I need the secure fit.


----------



## Impulse

Have newer M6 revs changed anything significant? I noticed it says rev 1/3 on your profile, not sure if the refresh at the start of this year is #3 or what... I guess rev 2 was when they went to the less microphonic cable and hockey stick plug? That's the one I've got, it's held up well and I run with it a lot.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Have newer M6 revs changed anything significant? I noticed it says rev 1/3 on your profile, not sure if the refresh at the start of this year is #3 or what... I guess rev 2 was when they went to the less microphonic cable and hockey stick plug? That's the one I've got, it's held up well and I run with it a lot.


 

 Nothing significant as far as I can tell - my newer one has a standard L-shaped plug, though. I've had this one since 2011. The rev.1 I have is an old maroon one with a straight plug and noisy cable.


----------



## Impulse

Hmm, think they've had like four different build revisions then (including this year's, or did only the M9 get a refresh announcement at CES? I forget).


----------



## herng

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm.. all black in color?
> 
> 
> The Philips "The Tread" is probably as good as it gets - it was designed from the ground up to be indestructible. Sound is okay - you can get better for less money but not with the same level of construction quality. If you're going to prioritize sound over build, I'd go for the RHA MA-350 or Dunu Trident. Both sound better than the Philips and are almost as well-made.


 
  ya, all r black color.


----------



## hobbyone

I would be interested to know more about Samsung's two BA headset:
   
  - Samsung EHS71 (probably with Knowles TWFK)
  - Samsung EHS70 (single BA)


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





hobbyone said:


> I would be interested to know more about Samsung's two BA headset:
> 
> - Samsung EHS71 (probably with Knowles TWFK)
> - Samsung EHS70 (single BA)


 
  Both are single armature. PCmag has an EHS71 review. Sounds like they were overpriced at $129 and phone compatibility could be an issue as well.
   
  http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2403703,00.asp


----------



## Johnny Jumper

MEE A161p vs Shure SE215 vs B2 anyone? Woot has 161p for $65.i have the Shures but I find them to be a little muddy and not too comfortable (yes, joker, you told me to beware!). Now I'm thinking about adding the A161's to my little collection. Now that i have more experience with IEMs i think i want a more analytic sound.

Advice?

JJ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Hmm, think they've had like four different build revisions then (including this year's, or did only the M9 get a refresh announcement at CES? I forget).


 
   
  According to this: http://www.meelec.com/Articles.asp?ID=325 (all the way at the bottom) there is a new M9PG2 this year and an M6P with a volume control.
   
  Quote: 





herng said:


> ya, all r black color.


 
   
  Ok, thanks. I'll see if I can find out whether they are all like that now.
   
  Quote: 





hobbyone said:


> I would be interested to know more about Samsung's two BA headset:
> 
> - Samsung EHS71 (probably with Knowles TWFK)
> - Samsung EHS70 (single BA)


 
   
  Sorry, never heard them.
   
  Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> MEE A161p vs Shure SE215 vs B2 anyone? Woot has 161p for $65.i have the Shures but I find them to be a little muddy and not too comfortable (yes, joker, you told me to beware!). Now I'm thinking about adding the A161's to my little collection. Now that i have more experience with IEMs i think i want a more analytic sound.
> 
> Advice?
> 
> JJ


 

 Well, if you found the SE215 muddy then armature-based sets like the A161P and B2 should be right up your alley. Signature-wise the A161P is going to be a little bassier while the B2 will be brighter and cooler-sounding. $65 should be a great price for the A161s if they are new w/warranty, etc.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> MEE A161p vs Shure SE215 vs B2 anyone? Woot has 161p for $65.i have the Shures but I find them to be a little muddy and not too comfortable (yes, joker, you told me to beware!). Now I'm thinking about adding the A161's to my little collection. Now that i have more experience with IEMs i think i want a more analytic sound.
> 
> Advice?
> 
> JJ


 
  Well, the A161P is a great iem and quite a bargain at this price (actually meelec themselves had that price few times for the past 3 months). What the A161P isn't though is analytical. It has a great bass for a BA iem fast, punchy and relatively flat though a bit boosted. And while the mids are only a bit forward and have good clarity and detail you can't call it analytical because the treble rolls off a bit early like the SE215 though a bit better than it in that regard. IMO the A161P is a good upgrade of the SE215 with better sound and better comfort although it can be microphonic if worn straight down without the included shirt clip or if you have a beard. The B2 on the other hand might be up to your requirements for analytical sound but its treble can be pretty aggressive and revealing sibilance - also tiring. As far as comfort - it does the job although its nozzle is a bit too angled and you do need a deep seal which can be uncomfortable depending on the person because of that nozzle. Also the bass might be too weak for you. Honestly, I'll highly recommend the etymotic HF5 for someone looking for analytical sound because the B2 can be picky at times and can be a love it or hate it iem but you can always risk it and get one and see if it's something you'll enjoy. Or go safe and jump on the A161P at that price with a take on a signature you're more familiar with.


----------



## herng

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> According to this: http://www.meelec.com/Articles.asp?ID=325 (all the way at the bottom) there is a new M9PG2 this year and an M6P with a volume control.
> 
> 
> Ok, thanks. I'll see if I can find out whether they are all like that now.
> ...


 
   
  Thanks man.


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Well, the A161P is a great iem and quite a bargain at this price (actually meelec themselves had that price few times for the past 3 months). What the A161P isn't though is analytical. It has a great bass for a BA iem fast, punchy and relatively flat though a bit boosted. And while the mids are only a bit forward and have good clarity and detail you can't call it analytical because the treble rolls off a bit early like the SE215 though a bit better than it in that regard. IMO the A161P is a good upgrade of the SE215 with better sound and better comfort..


 
  What about sound stage for the A161p?
   
  JJ


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> What about sound stage for the A161p?
> 
> JJ


 
  Well, just like joker says it's about average. Instrument separation and positioning is good but because of the treble roll off it isn't particularly airy. It's more of an intimate sounding iem, which I like but if you want a very airy and grand sounding presentation you might be disappointed. It boils down to personal preference but the A161P is still a very competent iem soundstage-wise


----------



## Letchy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The M9 can be worn over the ear but it's not nearly as secure when worn that way as the M6. For sports use there's really no competition - I still use my M6 sometimes when I need the secure fit.


 

 Thanks for the answer!
   
  I think I'll be buying the M6 from Amazon... I was looking for a more cheaper headphone, but it looks like these will be perfect for my needs.


----------



## Moby1

Hey Joker, trying to decide between the GR07 mk2, RE-400 & the R-50s. I am coming from the eph-100 which was nice but comfort was a pain and they just would not sit. Which out of the above did you find the most comfortable in order? I have a preference for over the ear, also which out of the 3 is most closest to the eph-100 sound? Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Well, just like joker says it's about average. Instrument separation and positioning is good but because of the treble roll off it isn't particularly airy. It's more of an intimate sounding iem, which I like but if you want a very airy and grand sounding presentation you might be disappointed. It boils down to personal preference but the A161P is still a very competent iem soundstage-wise


 
   
  +1. I don't find it lacking when I'm listening to it or A:Bing with most similarly-priced sets, but it isn't great compared to many higher-end IEMs. 
   
   
    
  Quote:


letchy said:


> Thanks for the answer!
> 
> I think I'll be buying the M6 from Amazon... I was looking for a more cheaper headphone, but it looks like these will be perfect for my needs.


 
   
  It used to be a good value at $40-50 back in 2009 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
   
  Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Hey Joker, trying to decide between the GR07 mk2, RE-400 & the R-50s. I am coming from the eph-100 which was nice but comfort was a pain and they just would not sit. Which out of the above did you find the most comfortable in order? I have a preference for over the ear, also which out of the 3 is most closest to the eph-100 sound? Thanks.


 
   
  I find the RE-400 the most comfortable, personally. It's very small and I like the flexibility of being able to wear it both cord-up and cord down. The next would be the GR07. The GR07 is also closest to the EPH-100 sound.


----------



## tcz515

Joker, amazing work with this compilation. I had a question though. I currently have a TF10 and am looking to upgrade to customs. I have had the TF10's for a while and found them satisfactory but just bought a Sennheiser Momentum which just blows them out of the water with their crisp yet non-sibilant highs. In comparison the TF10 now just sounds muddy and vocals just don't shine. I listen to a variety of alternative, pop, vocal, and instrumental music, so it's important to have some bass presence yet really allow vocals to be sweet.
  
 My budget is around $500 and based on your review some potential choices include the V3, CTM200, and alclair reference. Would any of these be a noticeable upgrade over the TF10's for the sound signature I'm looking for (Momentums)? FYI I don't actually like completely neutral headphones like the Sennheiser HD380's which just sound too dull and muted.
  
 Thanks in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tcz515 said:


> Joker, amazing work with this compilation. I had a question though. I currently have a TF10 and am looking to upgrade to customs. I have had the TF10's for a while and found them satisfactory but just bought a Sennheiser Momentum which just blows them out of the water with their crisp yet non-sibilant highs. In comparison the TF10 now just sounds muddy and vocals just don't shine. I listen to a variety of alternative, pop, vocal, and instrumental music, so it's important to have some bass presence yet really allow vocals to be sweet.
> 
> My budget is around $500 and based on your review some potential choices include the V3, CTM200, and alclair reference. Would any of these be a noticeable upgrade over the TF10's for the sound signature I'm looking for (Momentums)? FYI I don't actually like completely neutral headphones like the Sennheiser HD380's which just sound too dull and muted.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 
   
  I've never heard the Momentum but I think the 1964-V3 is a good spiritual successor for the TF10. It's more fun-sounding than neutral, with plenty of bass. The mids are not recessed as they are with the TF10 and everything is clearer and more well-separated overall.


----------



## Moby1

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I find the RE-400 the most comfortable, personally.


 
  Is it smaller than the eph-100? It looks very much like the eph-100 in design, just worried I will have the same fit issues.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





moby1 said:


> Is it smaller than the eph-100? It looks very much like the eph-100 in design, just worried I will have the same fit issues.


 

 It's smaller, especially the nozzle.


----------



## thesuperguy

Joker, would you say that it is more worthwhile upgrading a decent source (ipod touch 4g) or upgrading a budget amp (e6)? I had purchased an e11 but I want to be sure it was a worthwhile choice.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Astrotec DX-60 and AM-800
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3B38) Astrotec DX-60*
> 
> 
> Added Mar 2013
> ...


 
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C55) Astrotec AM-800*
> 
> 
> Added Mar 2013
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> Joker, would you say that it is more worthwhile upgrading a decent source (ipod touch 4g) or upgrading a budget amp (e6)? I had purchased an e11 but I want to be sure it was a worthwhile choice.


 

 I'm not familiar with the current generation of Fiio amps. For me the headphone/earphone is much more important than the amp/dap and as long as you've got something decent for a source the rip/source file quality is more important as well. If you've got something that benefits from amping in one way or another, then the amp becomes more important. I suppose the E6 is already better than the headphone out of the touch 4G, which should be good enough for most IEMs.


----------



## Letchy

Hi Joker, what is your opinion on the Philips SHE8000 IEM? I have found them on sale - they are usually £24.99 ($38.00) but are currently half price in the store I will be using. Thanks!
   
  EDIT: Regarding my question, how would the Philips SHE8000 compare to the Sennheiser CX160? I am leaning more toward the Sennheisers... Thanks!


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Added the Astrotec DX-60 and AM-800


 
  thanks for the reviews. i liked reading about the AM800. 
  any plan on reviewing the new ECCI´s PR200 mk2 and PR300 mk2 ?


----------



## Johnny Jumper

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Well, just like joker says it's about average. Instrument separation and positioning is good but because of the treble roll off it isn't particularly airy. It's more of an intimate sounding iem, which I like but if you want a very airy and grand sounding presentation you might be disappointed. It boils down to personal preference but the A161P is still a very competent iem soundstage-wise


 
   
  Well, I ordered them while the sale was on.  I've been wanting to experience them anyway. This will be IEM number five that I've purchased since joining Head-Fi.  Still haven't found a favorite but they have all been under $100 and they each have their pluses and minuses.
   
  JJ


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





johnny jumper said:


> Well, I ordered them while the sale was on.  I've been wanting to experience them anyway. This will be IEM number five that I've purchased since joining Head-Fi.  Still haven't found a favorite but they have all been under $100 and they each have their pluses and minuses.
> 
> JJ


 
  Well, I hope you like it. Sometimes it's hard to find the right sound for you, so it's always a good idea to try several sub-$100 iems before going for the higher-end stuff. The a161p is often my iem for commuting, which was previously my B2's job.


----------



## Deviltooth

Thanks for the Astrotec reviews.  For the money I'm very pleased with my AM90 (fantastic cord, Astrotec should use it for all their products).  I was considering the AM-800 as a possible gym option but the lack of isolation makes it a pass.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





letchy said:


> Hi Joker, what is your opinion on the Philips SHE8000 IEM? I have found them on sale - they are usually £24.99 ($38.00) but are currently half price in the store I will be using. Thanks!
> 
> EDIT: Regarding my question, how would the Philips SHE8000 compare to the Sennheiser CX160? I am leaning more toward the Sennheisers... Thanks!


 
   
  Sorry, never heard the SHE8000. Philips has tons of IEMs but I've only tried a handful so far. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> thanks for the reviews. i liked reading about the AM800.
> any plan on reviewing the new ECCI´s PR200 mk2 and PR300 mk2 ?


 
   
  Thanks! The ECCIs look interesting but no plans to try them at this time.


----------



## Letchy

Ah, no problem Joker! I bought the SHE8000 IEMs today and so far they are very, very good for the price I paid.
   
  If I may, would you mind me posting a small review of them in the format you have used in your first post? (Accessories, Microphonics, Isolation etc.) If you don't want me to, that's fine with me - just trying to help you out.


----------



## SyCo87

Which of our of these two sound more enveloping(3D), the RE-400, GR06, or the GR04?


----------



## Genia4

Hi joker, thanks for the great work!
   
  I'm currently looking to upgrade my current set of IEM (Soundmagic E30), and the top two contenders are Etymotic HF5 ($120) and MEElectronics A161p ($100).
  I'm not satisfied with the E30 at all. Isolation and comfort are just about OK, although sound quality is reasonable. I enjoyed my Soundmagic PL50 much more.
   
  Which of the above two IEMs would you recommend? What is the main difference between them. My priorities are Isolation & comfort, and obviously sound quality.
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





letchy said:


> Ah, no problem Joker! I bought the SHE8000 IEMs today and so far they are very, very good for the price I paid.
> 
> If I may, would you mind me posting a small review of them in the format you have used in your first post? (Accessories, Microphonics, Isolation etc.) If you don't want me to, that's fine with me - just trying to help you out.


 
   
  Well, I don't own this format but I really only use it to conserve space on the front page of the thread. When I post separate reviews, I use a more fleshed-out style.
   
   
  Quote: 





syco87 said:


> Which of our of these two sound more enveloping(3D), the RE-400, GR06, or the GR04?


 
   
   
  I haven't heard the GR04 but the RE-400 has a broader presentation than the GR06. The GR06 sounds more enveloping but the difference isn't large.
   
   
  Quote: 





genia4 said:


> Hi joker, thanks for the great work!
> 
> I'm currently looking to upgrade my current set of IEM (Soundmagic E30), and the top two contenders are Etymotic HF5 ($120) and MEElectronics A161p ($100).
> I'm not satisfied with the E30 at all. Isolation and comfort are just about OK, although sound quality is reasonable. I enjoyed my Soundmagic PL50 much more.
> ...


 

 The HF5 isolates slightly more than the A161P IMO. Comfort is comparable - the MEElec has angled nozzles but they really don't make a difference because both earphones are so small. Sound-wise, the A161P has more bass while the HF5 remains flatter through the treble. The Ety is a little more balanced IMO, but they are both clear, detailed, and close to neutral.


----------



## cibibikeru

Hi there,
   
  I owh a pair of GR04 Flagship Edition and they sound very good except for sibilance, I listen to many old recordings (mostly classic rock) and it's annoying, where can I get similar SQ without sibilance?
  I had:
  Soundmagic PL30 - good mids, open sound but that's about it
  Brainwavz M1 - very good overall, not so good bass and trebble extension
  Brainwavz M4 - very proeminent ~10KHz frequency, strange v-shape curve, didn't like it
  Astrotec AM-90 - good sounding but FLAT
  Vsonic GR02 Bass - better than the M1 but can't stand sibilance and a little too v-shape
  Shure SE215 - didn't listen much but very good overall, trebble extension not so good
  Vsonic GR04 - best sounding but can't stand sibilance
   
  What I am searching for: SE215 with trebble, GR04 without sibilance, M1 with better everything


----------



## Amitl

Hello!
  is the ShureSE215 / Shure SE215 LTD cable smartphone friendly?
  it seems rather fat
  and also..is the sound still competitive after all this time since they were released?
  i'm really looking for an IEM in this price range that offers
  a very secure fit with minimal microphonics and punchy bass.
  thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> Hi there,
> 
> I owh a pair of GR04 Flagship Edition and they sound very good except for sibilance, I listen to many old recordings (mostly classic rock) and it's annoying, where can I get similar SQ without sibilance?
> I had:
> ...


 
   
  I haven't heard the GR04 but based on what I have heard from VSonic, you'll likely have to look outside of VSonic for a sibilance-free dynamic-driver earphone. It doesn't have the best treble but the Yamaha EPH-100 might be a good option. It's not as relaxed up top as the SE215 but really isn't sibilant and has no real midrange recession. Another option would be the Dunu Tai Chi - it's not as bassy as the Yamaha but still not bass-lean, and has smooth highs. The HiSound Crystal also reminded me of an SE215 without the treble dip and missing some of the smoothness. Good bass, though, and under $100.
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Hello!
> is the ShureSE215 / Shure SE215 LTD cable smartphone friendly?
> it seems rather fat
> and also..is the sound still competitive after all this time since they were released?
> ...


 

 The regular SE215 worked with my (non-otterbox) case. There is also an aftermarket smartphone cable with mic/remote that should be more case-friendly. The sound is fine - bass is definitely punchy. When you factor in build quality it's still a very good deal.


----------



## cibibikeru

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the GR04 but based on what I have heard from VSonic, you'll likely have to look outside of VSonic for a sibilance-free dynamic-driver earphone. It doesn't have the best treble but the Yamaha EPH-100 might be a good option. It's not as relaxed up top as the SE215 but really isn't sibilant and has no real midrange recession. Another option would be the Dunu Tai Chi - it's not as bassy as the Yamaha but still not bass-lean, and has smooth highs. The HiSound Crystal also reminded me of an SE215 without the treble dip and missing some of the smoothness. Good bass, though, and under $100.
> 
> 
> The regular SE215 worked with my (non-otterbox) case. There is also an aftermarket smartphone cable with mic/remote that should be more case-friendly. The sound is fine - bass is definitely punchy. When you factor in build quality it's still a very good deal.


 

 If I switch for example to a more expensive set like Rockit R-50 which is on top of your list, will I be satisfied?


----------



## Alias Gu

Hi, Joker.
  Here is a very complicated but very practical question for you 
  How do you usually tell the difference between different soundstage? because my experience might be a little off your review.
  According to your Fitear 334 review, you said Fitear 334 has an out-of-brain and very 3D soundstage. 
  But my ear tells me Fitear 334's has a very 3D soundstage but locates in my brain, and when wearing 334 i hardly can imagine there is a singer  singing in front of me out of my brain.
  Have any clues about what causes this different experience between you and me?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cibibikeru said:


> If I switch for example to a more expensive set like Rockit R-50 which is on top of your list, will I be satisfied?


 
   
  It's not more expensive than the EPH-100 and it doesn't really fit your requirements.
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Hi, Joker.
> Here is a very complicated but very practical question for you
> How do you usually tell the difference between different soundstage? because my experience might be a little off your review.
> According to your Fitear 334 review, you said Fitear 334 has an out-of-brain and very 3D soundstage.
> ...


 

 Are you comparing the 334 to other IEMs or to something else - headphones, speakers, etc? My reviews are written in the context of the IEM being an IEM. I use speakers for much of my casual listening these days and I don't expect any IEM to match them. For an IEM the FitEar is spacious - the width of its soundstage is (subjectively) better than with most top-tier universals and mid-tier customs and the imaging is quite good. 
   
  Also, I may be a little unclear on what you are referencing exactly because here's what I posted about the TG334:
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The ambient presentation is my second favorite aspect of the TG334 after the euphonic midrange. The earphone provides a very good sense of space for a universal – it may not sound as wide as the Sony EX1000, but the headstage has excellent height and depth in addition to good width. Add in great separation and it’s clear why the TG334 images extremely well. *Due to the forward mids, it has a slight tendency to stay intimate and in-the-head *but the overall versatility is impressive*.* The soundstaging is noticeably better than that of the PFE232 and the Alclair Reference customs – two very solid mid-tier earphones – and the imaging is at least as good as with any other universal-fit earphone I’ve heard.


----------



## Amitl

Joker...please dont hate me but...arrr
what do you think about Thinksound MS01 microphonics VS. id America spark microphonics?
and is a straight barrel IEM + ear guides' fit securely like a Shure SE 215 fit, or does the
Shure provide a more *secure* fit?
AND.....would you say the Thinksound MS01 is sibilant/harsh like the Klipsch S4??
thank you...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Joker...please dont hate me but...arrr
> what do you think about Thinksound MS01 microphonics VS. id America spark microphonics?
> and is a straight barrel IEM + ear guides' fit securely like a Shure SE 215 fit, or does the
> Shure provide a more *secure* fit?
> ...


 

 I think the MS01 is a little less microphonic but I still recommend wearing them over-the-ear. As for the fit, I suppose it depends on your ears. I can get a very secure fit with many straight barrel IEMs, though I think a memory wire set like the SE215 would still have an advantage. By the way, cable guides are sold separately if you need them for your Spark. 
   
  Harshness - the MS01 isn't as bad as the S4. More similar to the Spark.


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's not more expensive than the EPH-100 and it doesn't really fit your requirements.
> 
> 
> Are you comparing the 334 to other IEMs or to something else - headphones, speakers, etc? My reviews are written in the context of the IEM being an IEM. I use speakers for much of my casual listening these days and I don't expect any IEM to match them. For an IEM the FitEar is spacious - the width of its soundstage is (subjectively) better than with most top-tier universals and mid-tier customs and the imaging is quite good.
> ...


 
  i might misread about your Fitear 334 review.
  Actually i compared my 334 to headphone because i I have PX200 and i still find PX200 has a much more realistic and accurate out-of-brain soundstage. 
  I know this comparison is quite unfair because IEMs, CIEMs and headphones are different stuffs. 
  But i still want to find a CIEM or IEM, at least approaching those soundstage made by low-end headphones


----------



## Amitl

Thank you Joker!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> i might misread about your Fitear 334 review.
> Actually i compared my 334 to headphone because i I have PX200 and i still find PX200 has a much more realistic and accurate out-of-brain soundstage.
> I know this comparison is quite unfair because IEMs, CIEMs and headphones are different stuffs.
> But i still want to find a CIEM or IEM, at least approaching those soundstage made by low-end headphones


 

 I would try the MDR-EX600 or EX1000. Beyond that, i don't know.


----------



## thesuperguy

I'd like to ask if the sound ratings are scaled the same for your IEMs and headphone threads? So if a headphone and an IEM both get 9/10, do you prefer them equally?


----------



## SenG

Awesome thread with a huge list of IEMs reviewed with detailed description and comparisons!

 Thank you for your effort and time to continually update this thread with more reviews and answering everyone's questions, which helps to cut down on Thread spam so that threads like these can continue to shine, cheers!

 Now I just have to decide between the FitEar To Go! 334 and Unique Melody Miracle, for long-term use and music enjoyment, mostly because I may lose a bit of weight, and thus risk losing the seal and comfort of the UM Miracle. Also, the FitEar To Go! 334 is such a challenging IEM to get your hands on, as it is constantly Out Of Stock, LOL!


----------



## Mimouille

Quote: 





seng said:


> Awesome thread with a huge list of IEMs reviewed with detailed description and comparisons!
> 
> Thank you for your effort and time to continually update this thread with more reviews and answering everyone's questions, which helps to cut down on Thread spam so that threads like these can continue to shine, cheers!
> 
> Now I just have to decide between the FitEar To Go! 334 and Unique Melody Miracle, for long-term use and music enjoyment, mostly because I may lose a bit of weight, and thus risk losing the seal and comfort of the UM Miracle. Also, the FitEar To Go! 334 is such a challenging IEM to get your hands on, as it is constantly Out Of Stock, LOL!


 

 Having both underhand now, they are nothing alike in terms of signature. The 334 have slow bass decay and thick mids whereas the Miracles have tight bass and thinner mids, and huge, airy soundstage...so it really depends on what you are looking for. 1plus2 are also very good, closer to the Miracles than the 334, but more dynamic.


----------



## SenG

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Having both underhand now, they are nothing alike in terms of signature. The 334 have slow bass decay and thick mids whereas the Miracles have tight bass and thinner mids, and huge, airy soundstage...so it really depends on what you are looking for. 1plus2 are also very good, closer to the Miracles than the 334, but more dynamic.


 
  Thanks for the heads-up!

 I have considered the Tralucent 1plus2, but I have reservations about the long-term aspects of it, as it seems to be a new company, despite amazing reviews of its sound quality and headstage.

 Ultimately, I really crave for a UM Miracle, with excellent Customer Service by Stephen Guo from custom-iem, but I have to weight in the cons such as misfitting (due to poor ear impressions) and change in ear canal (weight loss). I am leaning towards what is described as a V-shaped frequency, as I am now used to this signature from my ATH-M50, though it is a closed headphone.

 Another reason I did not mind the FitEar To Go! 334 is because I had considered the SM64v2, with its thick and creamy mids, but would prefer to avoid Earsonics' products' common issue, such as shells cracking.


----------



## MariusHLG

Hi guys,just signed in for this awesome thread, great job ljoker!
  Second, I am looking for some advices.
  I wanna buy some cheap and good in ear headphones for me and my gf to use on the daily commute.
  I want to be able to isolate some of the subway noise and to be able to hear all the music, a mix of good bass and good mids/highs, but without having to listen to max volume, lets say around 70-80% volume.
  My searches led up to 2 models, Philips SHE3590 and the Sony MDR EX10.
  What to you guys advice to buy? Or propose another model in the 8-15$ range better than my suggestions.
  Thanks in advance.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





mariushlg said:


> Hi guys,just signed in for this awesome thread, great job ljoker!
> Second, I am looking for some advices.
> I wanna buy some cheap and good in ear headphones for me and my gf to use on the daily commute.
> I want to be able to isolate some of the subway noise and to be able to hear all the music, a mix of good bass and good mids/highs, but without having to listen to max volume, lets say around 70-80% volume.
> ...


 
  Philips SHE3*68*0/82


----------



## OttoRobba

Hi Joker, great thread!!
   
  I was looking at getting a budget iem and you seem to be the best person to ask this, I have pretty much only used my samsung galaxy S2 headphone, as far as iems go.
   
  I tend to listen to rock, folk, acoustic, orchestral soundtracks and a bit of electronic and pop music, for hours on end, mostly while I draw, so I guess that something smoother, less fatiguing would be better - I do love clarity though.
   
  I'd say it is comfort = sound quality > durability > isolation > microphonics > anything else
   
  The UE 500 are available for U$28 on Amazon. Should I go for them or spring a bit more and go for something else, like the gr02 or the Brainwavz M5?


----------



## MariusHLG

zelda said:


> Philips SHE3*68*0/82



Thanks for the advice, but they are overbudget at 25 $ one pair.
From my suggestions, which is better?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> I'd like to ask if the sound ratings are scaled the same for your IEMs and headphone threads? So if a headphone and an IEM both get 9/10, do you prefer them equally?


 
   
  I wasn't trying to scale them the same but they seem to correspond within 0.25 of a point or so. 
   
  Quote: 





seng said:


> Awesome thread with a huge list of IEMs reviewed with detailed description and comparisons!
> 
> Thank you for your effort and time to continually update this thread with more reviews and answering everyone's questions, which helps to cut down on Thread spam so that threads like these can continue to shine, cheers!
> 
> Now I just have to decide between the FitEar To Go! 334 and Unique Melody Miracle, for long-term use and music enjoyment, mostly because I may lose a bit of weight, and thus risk losing the seal and comfort of the UM Miracle. Also, the FitEar To Go! 334 is such a challenging IEM to get your hands on, as it is constantly Out Of Stock, LOL!


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  From what I understand you need to lose a good amount of weight for your ears to be affected - I've heard anything from 20 to 50 lbs. If you lose seal you'd either have to get a re-fit or sell the unit and go for something else.
   
  Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Having both underhand now, they are nothing alike in terms of signature. The 334 have slow bass decay and thick mids whereas the Miracles have tight bass and thinner mids, and huge, airy soundstage...so it really depends on what you are looking for.


 
   
  +1
   
   Quote:


mariushlg said:


> Hi guys,just signed in for this awesome thread, great job ljoker!
> Second, I am looking for some advices.
> I wanna buy some cheap and good in ear headphones for me and my gf to use on the daily commute.
> I want to be able to isolate some of the subway noise and to be able to hear all the music, a mix of good bass and good mids/highs, but without having to listen to max volume, lets say around 70-80% volume.
> ...


 
   
  Can't comment on the EX10 but I can definitely recommend the SHE3580/3590. It's a great earphone on the cheap and isolation is very reasonable. The other earphones I like in that price range (e.g. Monoprice 8320) don't isolate as much.
   
   
  Quote: 





ottorobba said:


> Hi Joker, great thread!!
> 
> I was looking at getting a budget iem and you seem to be the best person to ask this, I have pretty much only used my samsung galaxy S2 headphone, as far as iems go.
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  That's a very good deal if you're looking for a mild v-shape as your signature. The UE500 is pretty smooth - certainly more so than the GR02BE. Clarity is about on-par. The M5 is smoother but the tradeoff is less treble in general and also a touch less clarity.


----------



## cyrusxd

can anyone suggest a good replacement for my soon to retire vsonic gr07, its getting worn out already. A close sounding iem to vsonic gr07 would be great. I listen to various genres and i dont stick to one. I dont have an amp but i think i can drive some iems fairly. A price range not exceeding 150$ can stretch to 175$ but thats it. hope to get some feedback


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





mariushlg said:


> Thanks for the advice, but they are overbudget at 25 $ one pair.
> From my suggestions, which is better?


 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Philips-SHE3682-In-Ear-Headphones-Blue-Colour-/130864874254?pt=UK_AudioVisualElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Headphones&hash=item1e7827830e


----------



## kmd107

Quote: 





zelda said:


> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Philips-SHE3682-In-Ear-Headphones-Blue-Colour-/130864874254?pt=UK_AudioVisualElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Headphones&hash=item1e7827830e


 

 Or even better price, depending on your location
   
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-New-White-Philips-SHE3581-In-Ear-Headphones-/200912848980?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item2ec756c854


----------



## EPICFAILXD

Joker, have you by any chance heard about the Philips Fidelio S1 and S2? I'm intrigued by the design and the few impressions that have been written about them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cyrusxd said:


> can anyone suggest a good replacement for my soon to retire vsonic gr07, its getting worn out already. A close sounding iem to vsonic gr07 would be great. I listen to various genres and i dont stick to one. I dont have an amp but i think i can drive some iems fairly. A price range not exceeding 150$ can stretch to 175$ but thats it. hope to get some feedback


 
   
  What are you looking to change compared to the GR07? I've been enjoying the newer GR07BE lately. If you don't want another VSonic set I don't think you'll find anything with quite the same signature in that price range. Some alternatives with different signatures may be the JVC FXT90, Yamaha EPH-100, or HiFiMan RE-400.
   
  Quote: 





epicfailxd said:


> Joker, have you by any chance heard about the Philips Fidelio S1 and S2? I'm intrigued by the design and the few impressions that have been written about them.


 

 I have both. Currently working on a review. So far they sound very good (and very similar to each other). I think the cheaper $100 one (forgot which number goes with which) is at least as good a value as the RE-400 from HiFiMan.
   
  Two small nitpicks so far: I am not a big fan of the stock silicone tips and the housings are a little on the large side (13.5mm drivers and all that). Once sealed properly they definitely deliver, though.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





kmd107 said:


> Or even better price, depending on your location
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-New-White-Philips-SHE3581-In-Ear-Headphones-/200912848980?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item2ec756c854


 
  well i linked the 3*6*80/2, while that´s the 3580. they´re a bit different, and the 36 look much cooler


----------



## danikus

Hi Joker!
  Do you think she3580 is better than sm e30 in terms of sound quality? Thanks!


----------



## insidedrive

Joker, this thread is perhaps the one I go to the most on _any _website thanks for your work! 
  Anyways I have a quick question regarding the GR07 Bass Editions. I am interested in them and am wondering if they are an absolute upgrade from my GR07 MK1s. I am in love with every part of the MK1's except for the sibilance issue, are they corrected in the Bass Editions? Also which one of them do you prefer? Thanks a lot!


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Joker, this thread is perhaps the one I go to the most on _any _website thanks for your work!
> Anyways I have a quick question regarding the GR07 Bass Editions. I am interested in them and am wondering if they are an absolute upgrade from my GR07 MK1s. I am in love with every part of the MK1's except for the sibilance issue, are they corrected in the Bass Editions? Also which one of them do you prefer? Thanks a lot!


 
   
  Another place to consider asking is in this gr07be thread... quite a few people there have had the various GR07's.
   
  Btw, this is a link to the GR07BE FR graph at Innerfidelity, and this is the GR07.


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would try the MDR-EX600 or EX1000. Beyond that, i don't know.


 
  Do you think Miracles and SE 3ways can be one of them?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





danikus said:


> Hi Joker!
> Do you think she3580 is better than sm e30 in terms of sound quality? Thanks!


 
   
  Yes, I like it better. Better deep bass and more crisp-sounding overall. 
   
  Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Joker, this thread is perhaps the one I go to the most on _any _website thanks for your work!
> Anyways I have a quick question regarding the GR07 Bass Editions. I am interested in them and am wondering if they are an absolute upgrade from my GR07 MK1s. I am in love with every part of the MK1's except for the sibilance issue, are they corrected in the Bass Editions? Also which one of them do you prefer? Thanks a lot!


 
   
  I wouldn't call the GR07BE an upgrade to the GR07mkI but it's certainly on-par. The BE is a little less sibilant but "corrected" is too strong a word for the amount of improvement. If I remember correctly the GR07BE is based on the GR07 mkII, which some reported to be less sibilant than the mkI. 
   
  Other than the treble, I think the BE has a touch more bass but poorer bass-midrange balance as a result, causing the mids of my mkI to appear more prominent in comparison. If I had to put them together, I would take the bass and midrange of my mkI with the treble of the BE.
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Do you think Miracles and SE 3ways can be one of them?


 

 Not if you want an IEM that sounds like a headphone. Most of the higher-end in-ear sets have a more 3D/enveloping soundstage that's not as out-of-the-head as that if most headphones. The EX600/EX1000 are some of the few exceptions.


----------



## MDFMK

New poster here!  I've been following this thread for a while - thank you Joker, it's an amazing resource.
   
  I'm in the market for a new IEM in the $100 range or so, but I'm a bit of a newbie in the audio realm so I've been stumped.  I primarily listen to EDM with some metal as well, so I would like to find something that suits both.  Angled nozzle would also be a _huge_ plus, I strongly prefer that sort of fit.  For a while I was eying the CKM99, but I'm a bit wary of the hot treble - as well, the only buying options I see for it on Amazon are Japanese sellers, and I've no idea which might be authorized and which might be more dubious.


----------



## EPICFAILXD

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have both. Currently working on a review. So far they sound very good (and very similar to each other). I think the cheaper $100 one (forgot which number goes with which) is at least as good a value as the RE-400 from HiFiMan.
> 
> Two small nitpicks so far: I am not a big fan of the stock silicone tips and the housings are a little on the large side (13.5mm drivers and all that). Once sealed properly they definitely deliver, though.


 
  So would you say the S2 (more expensive) is worth the extra over the S1,  since you mentioned they sound very similar.


----------



## dagraham

Hi ljoker,
   
  Have to say this thread is amazingly helpful and I would appreciate some advice.
   
  After alot of research, mainly on this forum, I bought my first set of IEM's , the Brainwwavz M2.
   
  Overall i'm quite happy with it and it sounds good but I think it just has too much bass for my taste. The level of detail has impressed me and on some genres like EDM and pop, it sounds great (something like Blondie's Atomic just sounds awesome!).
   
  Problem is, for me anytime there is a bass heavy track I feel the bass takes over too much and more often than not i find myself reaching for the bass reducer setting on my iphone.
   
  It is very musical but when i listen to something like Simon & Garfunkel the bass resonates too much for me and detracts from the sound. My favoutite band is Pink Floyd and I find that the guitars and highs seem recessed for me and I want them to stand out more.
   
  I like to hear the bass but there is just a bit too much rumble for me.
   
  I'm not an audiophile so i'm probably not making any sense but that's the best way I can describe it. I do still want something which sounds good across genres though as i listen to all sorts(except dubstep and very rarely R & B and Hip Hop).
   
  I'm considering the Fischer Audio DBA -02 Mark11. Do you think this is a good choice for me sound wise?
   
  I'm concerned about a couple of things
   
  1) Are the microphonics that bad? i wear glasses so ear hooks are out of the question. I found on the m2 it is difficult to wear over the ear as the cable is really springy.
   
  The DBA-02 Mark 11 now comes with a cable cinch. Will this help?
   
  2) I'll be listening to mp3 dowloaded at 256 and ripped CD's. Will the fischer's make all my music sound awful?
   
  3) my source will be the iphone 4 or maybe Samsung Galaxy S4. Is this sufficient for these headphones?
   
  Sorry about the long and rambling post and thanks for any advice


----------



## dfrost

Dagraham,

I've been using DBA-02's (Mk I version) for about three years straight out of iPod, iPad and Blackberry, and they are still fabulous. Micrphonics have never been an issue with them, with or without using a cable clinch. I did have BTG Audio add Westone-type sockets to my second pair and I'm using them with a Westone EPICS cable that includes memory wire that is absolutely no problem with my glasses. The original twisted Fischer cable was fine over ear, but not sure how the flat cable of the Mk II would behave. 

I, too, notice that bass-heavy IEM's, like my JVC FXT-90's are less pleasant with bass-heavy mixes, and listen to apparently some of same musical genres as you (love Pink Floyd on the DBA's). My music is all 256 and 320 mbs AAC, and my older ears think it all sounds great from the Fischers. I have always gotten a good seal using Shure "grey soft flex" single flange tips so no bass complaints here. If I were buying in this price class again, I'd go immediately to the Brainwavz B2 (same as DBA-02 Mk I). I have also been quite happy with my newer MEElec A161P's (also worn over-ear, BTW), but still find the DBA's to be clearer and slightly "better", despite theA161's slightly nicer bass.


----------



## tan1415

Hi,
   
  I joined the deal offered by hisound. I am real curious how these bassheavy IEM will sound.
   
  In the past i have been looking to other Bassheavy IEMs like the Atrio or Hippo VB. How does this compare with those older IEMs?
  Really curious about this IEMs and can't wait till i get it.
  I love subbass and use subwoofer for my HT setup. To be honest I was never able to integrate it perfectly for music. So I am curious how a bassmonster would work with IEM. Good integration i hope.
   
  PS Hope it's not like the meelec M6/9 soundwise. Wasn't my cup of tea. Just highs and bass.


----------



## kylezo

Quote: 





dfrost said:


> Dagraham,
> 
> I've been using DBA-02's (Mk I version) for about three years straight out of iPod, iPad and Blackberry, and they are still fabulous. Micrphonics have never been an issue with them, with or without using a cable clinch. I did have BTG Audio add Westone-type sockets to my second pair and I'm using them with a Westone EPICS cable that includes memory wire that is absolutely no problem with my glasses. The original twisted Fischer cable was fine over ear, but not sure how the flat cable of the Mk II would behave.
> 
> I, too, notice that bass-heavy IEM's, like my JVC FXT-90's are less pleasant with bass-heavy mixes, and listen to apparently some of same musical genres as you (love Pink Floyd on the DBA's). My music is all 256 and 320 mbs AAC, and my older ears think it all sounds great from the Fischers. I have always gotten a good seal using Shure "grey soft flex" single flange tips so no bass complaints here. If I were buying in this price class again, I'd go immediately to the Brainwavz B2 (same as DBA-02 Mk I). I have also been quite happy with my newer MEElec A161P's (also worn over-ear, BTW), but still find the DBA's to be clearer and slightly "better", despite theA161's slightly nicer bass.


 
   
  This is great input. I wonder, have you ever listened to GR07's? I'm tossed up between them and the B2/DBA-02.


----------



## jam3s121

could anyone recommend the best balanced iem around $70? I listen to mainly edm music and isolation is important planning to use them in a gym and outside walking around. I could spend $100 if its warranted, i could use some advice this thread has so many to pick from I'm not sure where to go.
   
  My personal headphones are v moda m100's (which I love) and my ad700's (which are great for gaming) I prefer the sound signature of my v moda m100s.


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

Quote: 





jam3s121 said:


> could anyone recommend the best balanced iem around $70? I listen to mainly edm music and isolation is important planning to use them in a gym and outside walking around. I could spend $100 if its warranted, i could use some advice this thread has so many to pick from I'm not sure where to go.


 
  One option is the HiFiMan RE-400, great balanced sound (but not boring in any way, quite musical, nice tuning), good clarity and soundstage and very small, great fit for the ears with good noise isolation. It is $99 and it is an audiophile IEM. Only bad thing, it doesn't have a mic/iPod controls.


----------



## jam3s121

I usually just throw a 40minute mix on anyway, how is the re-400 in terms of bass? Will it have some impact?


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





jam3s121 said:


> I usually just throw a 40minute mix on anyway, how is the re-400 in terms of bass? Will it have some impact?


 
  It has good, tight and accurate bass but it is not a bass monster and it doesn't extend that deep and its impact is not that strong.  It really depends on your taste, I suggest you audition if 1st before buying one.


----------



## Change is Good

Hello all. I just want to clarify something after briefing through this guide and searching this thread. I am looking for a sound signature similar to my Q701s... if that is possible for a reasonable budget. From what I researched... I came up with the VSonic GR01. Is this the right choice for me?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mdfmk said:


> New poster here!  I've been following this thread for a while - thank you Joker, it's an amazing resource.
> 
> I'm in the market for a new IEM in the $100 range or so, but I'm a bit of a newbie in the audio realm so I've been stumped.  I primarily listen to EDM with some metal as well, so I would like to find something that suits both.  Angled nozzle would also be a _huge_ plus, I strongly prefer that sort of fit.  For a while I was eying the CKM99, but I'm a bit wary of the hot treble - as well, the only buying options I see for it on Amazon are Japanese sellers, and I've no idea which might be authorized and which might be more dubious.


 
   
  A safe bet would probably be something with a milder v-shape. The CKM99 is a little pricy and aggressive but a JVC FXT90 might be just the ticket - I've seen them on ebay at just over $100. It's oddly shaped, but angled-nozzle and pretty comfortable.
   
  Quote: 





epicfailxd said:


> So would you say the S2 (more expensive) is worth the extra over the S1,  since you mentioned they sound very similar.


 
   
  Purely for sound, probably not. It's a little smoother and warmer-sounding and the treble response seems a touch more extended (or maybe just flatter) but the differences are small. I have to admit that the S2 looks a lot better up close with its glossy finish (it almost looks ceramic) and all-metal housings (the S1 has some cheap-looking plastic bits). I also had some trouble getting the stock tips of the S1 to seal. Ended up using tips off of a MEElec A151. The S2 was not a problem with the included Comply Ts tips. So, looking at them as an overall package, I can see why Philips chose to release two earphones. I see the S1 as more of a 'barebones' S2 for value seekers.
   
  Quote: 





dagraham said:


> Hi ljoker,
> 
> Have to say this thread is amazingly helpful and I would appreciate some advice.
> 
> ...


 
   
   
  The M2 wasn't really tuned for balance. The DBA-02 mkII will be a huge improvement if that's what you're looking for.
   
   
  1. Cable noise is worse compared to the mkI. If you have to wear cable-down go for the Brainwavz B2 (a rebrand of the DBA-02 mkI) instead. I don't really have a problem with over-the-ear IEMs when I wear glasses so it's not a problem for me.
   
  2. No. 256 is a decent bitrate. Unless you are A:Bing with a lossless copy you will be fine, and even then you may not be able to tell the difference right away.
  3. The iPhone 4 sounds very good.  I don't know about the Galaxy S4. My android phone (an HTC Desire HD) doesn't perform very well.
   
   
  Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> Hi,
> 
> I joined the deal offered by hisound. I am real curious how these bassheavy IEM will sound.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I am not sure which HiSound you are referring to. If it's the Wooduo 2, it does remind me of the M9 but the mids are not so recessed. There is tons of deep bass, as with the Atrio. The original VB was not quite this bassy.
   
  Quote: 





jam3s121 said:


> I usually just throw a 40minute mix on anyway, how is the re-400 in terms of bass? Will it have some impact?


 

 Some, yes - but it is not an enhanced-bass earphone by any means. You might want to consider the new Philips Fidelio S1 - it's newly-released but it sounds very good to me. Has a bit of enhanced deep bass to it but still maintains clarity. If you'd rather get something cheaper, the VSonic VC02 is pretty darn balanced and overall great at $40-45. It's got slightly punchier bass than the RE-400.
   
  Quote: 





change is good said:


> Hello all. I just want to clarify something after briefing through this guide and searching this thread. I am looking for a sound signature similar to my Q701s... if that is possible for a reasonable budget. From what I researched... I came up with the VSonic GR01. Is this the right choice for me?


 
   
   
  In the realm of IEMs the GR01 is rather flat-sounding, which is probably why you came across it in your search. However - and this is part of the reason I don't like comparing IEMs and headphones - the bass and presentation come across differently between similarly-tuned IEMs and headphones, with the bass always being more visceral on the headphone. You won't get the same sensation of air moved from a GR01 as you do from a Q701 (I am basing this on my old K701, which I am assuming is similar) - to get that you would need a slightly enhanced-bass earphone like the GR07. Again, I say this only because I am familiar with the K701 - if you discount that one caveat, the two should be fairly similar.


----------



## Impulse

Hey joker (or whomever), have you seen the Fidelio S1/2 on sale in the US yet? 

Also, what are the plastic bits you alluded to, is it in the face side of the housing? Philip's renders make them look really similar and the description makes it sound like the S2 has a copper alloy housing and the other one's just Al or whatever.


----------



## christobit

Hi Joker..thank you so much for all you do for us!  My current set up is DBA-02 (Mk2) paired with JDS Labs O2 or Fiio E-11, and I have settled on this after trying countless other options/pairings.  I love the IEM sound its signature is perfect for me, apart from 2 things - 1) I need a hair more bass and more natural decay 2) I need a hair less treble sibilance.  I love the speed and quality of the bass and I love the incredible treble energy apart from these 2 quibs.  I don't plan to upgrade my amps just yet.  Do you have any suggestions on what would be a better IEM that allows me to retain all the current characteristics, and yet address my 2 needs?  Many thanks...Cheers


----------



## getmassiff

Hello ALL!, signed up because I'm in need of some advice.

 First of all thank you joker for the overwhelming and incredibly useful amount of information, only just breaking into the scene at the moment, so I've never owned a good pair of IEM's, thus I'm clueless.
   
  I'm shopping around the 100-150($) mark (pretty flexible), judging from your reviews the HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2 & JVC HA-FXT90 seem very good, in terms of not having many cons and overall conclusion. Now I'm not sure how old these 2 are, and if there are better / updated versions out there, or better IEMs in terms of bang for your buck. So any help in picking an IEM out would be greatly appreciated ! I listen to mostly EDM, trance & house music, plan on using them at the gym and for my general commuting. Going to be using them on my ipod touch, not really sure what to expect in terms of isolation, and having controls is not an option I'm really fussy over.
   
  Thanks for your time.
   
  p.s. I live in Australia, notsureif that even matters though, as I'm willing to pay for shipping for anything you highly recommend.


----------



## needbassndetail

need help a good IEM at 50$ - 150$ price range
  listening most to EDM and some blues and metal
  never had any advance iem before just couple of cheap headphone
   
  any advice?
  thanks b4


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





getmassiff said:


> Hello ALL!, signed up because I'm in need of some advice.
> 
> First of all thank you joker for the overwhelming and incredibly useful amount of information, only just breaking into the scene at the moment, so I've never owned a good pair of IEM's, thus I'm clueless.
> 
> ...


 
   
  if you'r in australia you can get the eph100 for ~$100


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have both Philips. Currently working on a review. So far they sound very good (and very similar to each other). I think the cheaper $100 one (forgot which number goes with which) is at least as good a value as the RE-400 from HiFiMan.
> 
> Two small nitpicks so far: I am not a big fan of the stock silicone tips and the housings are a little on the large side (13.5mm drivers and all that). Once sealed properly they definitely deliver, though.


 
   
  Any plans to add the Phiaton MS200 Moderna into the mix seeing how similar a design they share?


----------



## Change is Good

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> In the realm of IEMs the GR01 is rather flat-sounding, which is probably why you came across it in your search. However - and this is part of the reason I don't like comparing IEMs and headphones - the bass and presentation come across differently between similarly-tuned IEMs and headphones, with the bass always being more visceral on the headphone. You won't get the same sensation of air moved from a GR01 as you do from a Q701 (I am basing this on my old K701, which I am assuming is similar) - to get that you would need a slightly enhanced-bass earphone like the GR07. Again, I say this only because I am familiar with the K701 - if you discount that one caveat, the two should be fairly similar.


 
   
  First, thank you for your response and also for this guide. Second, forgive me for having you compare IEMs and headphones... not what I intended. It's just that I love the sound signature I get from my Q701s. So now I'm in the market for some IEMs so I can use on the go.
   
  I recently purchased the Shure SE215-LTDs but had to return them (too bassy). This is why I asked if there were any IEMs that sounded like the Q701s. And yes, though different, they are very similar to the K701s (from what I have read). But mine have different pads (from K702 Annies) that raise the bass just a little... perfect enough for me.
   
  So anyways, from what I understand is I am better off with the GR07 instead of the GR01. Are there any more IEMs under $200 that may be what I'm looking for?


----------



## dfrost

kylezo said:


> This is great input. I wonder, have you ever listened to GR07's? I'm tossed up between them and the B2/DBA-02.



Sorry, I'm apparently one of the few who have never heard the GR07. It certainly has plenty of fans around Head-fi.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





kylezo said:


> This is great input. I wonder, have you ever listened to GR07's? I'm tossed up between them and the B2/DBA-02.


 
   
  An excellent read: http://www.head-fi.org/t/556556/comparison-russia-china-showdown-dba-02-vs-gr07


----------



## OttoRobba

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's a very good deal if you're looking for a mild v-shape as your signature. The UE500 is pretty smooth - certainly more so than the GR02BE. Clarity is about on-par. The M5 is smoother but the tradeoff is less treble in general and also a touch less clarity.


 
   
  Thank you for the reply Joker, this made me think and research more into what sound signature would fit me better and I decided to play it safe and get something warm/sweet, I managed to get a MEElec A151 for U$30 on Amazon. Should be a good enough intro iem for me 
   
  Once again, thanks for the help and for making this topic, it is invaluable!


----------



## Impulse

Wow, nice price on the A151.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Hey joker (or whomever), have you seen the Fidelio S1/2 on sale in the US yet?
> 
> Also, what are the plastic bits you alluded to, is it in the face side of the housing? Philip's renders make them look really similar and the description makes it sound like the S2 has a copper alloy housing and the other one's just Al or whatever.


 
   
  I thought I saw the S1 on ebay for ~$95. They are up on the Philips USA website so I'm sure they will hit major distribution soon. 
   
   
  The official pics do look very similar but the finish is definitely different and they use different materials in places. The S1 feels lighter as well. Here's a picture of the housings from the front:
   

   
   
   
  Quote: 





christobit said:


> Hi Joker..thank you so much for all you do for us!  My current set up is DBA-02 (Mk2) paired with JDS Labs O2 or Fiio E-11, and I have settled on this after trying countless other options/pairings.  I love the IEM sound its signature is perfect for me, apart from 2 things - 1) I need a hair more bass and more natural decay 2) I need a hair less treble sibilance.  I love the speed and quality of the bass and I love the incredible treble energy apart from these 2 quibs.  I don't plan to upgrade my amps just yet.  Do you have any suggestions on what would be a better IEM that allows me to retain all the current characteristics, and yet address my 2 needs?  Many thanks...Cheers


 
   
  For the sibilance issue I would try adding an inline impedance adapter - it seems to slightly reduce treble quantity with TWFKs.
   
   
  It's hard to find an earphone with the strengths of the DBA-02 but none of the drawbacks. The RE272, for example, has similarly great clarity and smoother treble but doesn't give you any more bass quantity. The RE-400 has a bit more bass and smoother treble but that bass hump is noticeable in comparison to the DBA-02/RE-272 and you lose a small amount of the clarity. The GR07 (mkI) has the bass but is more sibilant, and so on. You may have to go high-end, like the UE900, and still do a little of EQing to bring the treble energy up to DBA-02 levels if you need.
   
   
  Quote: 





getmassiff said:


> Hello ALL!, signed up because I'm in need of some advice.
> 
> First of all thank you joker for the overwhelming and incredibly useful amount of information, only just breaking into the scene at the moment, so I've never owned a good pair of IEM's, thus I'm clueless.
> 
> ...


 
   
  They are both 2012 additions so no updated versions yet as far as I know (unless you consider JVC's pricier triple dynamic models). I don't consider the Wooduo 2 to be as good as the FXT90 unless you favor its massive subbass. The FXT90 is nice, with plenty likable sound. Not sure how it will hold up for gym use - I would probably pick up a cheaper/disposable set if you sweat a lot. The EPH-100 as recommended by Zelda is also something I like a lot, unless its higher isolation will be dangerous during your commute.
   
  Quote: 





needbassndetail said:


> need help a good IEM at 50$ - 150$ price range
> listening most to EDM and some blues and metal
> never had any advance iem before just couple of cheap headphone
> 
> ...


 
   
  Really depends on the type of sound you favor. Someone asked a similar question on the previous page with a ~$100 limit and I recommended the JVC FXT90 - I think its mildly v-shaped signature works well for both genres as long as you don't favor neutral sound. It's a safe option that won't leave you wanting more bass. The Yamaha EPH-100 is another safe one with an overall warmer, smoother sound.
   
  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> Any plans to add the Phiaton MS200 Moderna into the mix seeing how similar a design they share?


 
   
  I have a pair here but was planning to skip them - the performance is a little underwhelming. One of the most unique-looking IEMs I have but so far just doesn't seem to be a very strong performer. I am not sure what the price is at but they sound like a bassier - but not necessarily better - Phiaton PS20. 
   
  Quote: 





change is good said:


> First, thank you for your response and also for this guide. Second, forgive me for having you compare IEMs and headphones... not what I intended. It's just that I love the sound signature I get from my Q701s. So now I'm in the market for some IEMs so I can use on the go.
> 
> I recently purchased the Shure SE215-LTDs but had to return them (too bassy). This is why I asked if there were any IEMs that sounded like the Q701s. And yes, though different, they are very similar to the K701s (from what I have read). But mine have different pads (from K702 Annies) that raise the bass just a little... perfect enough for me.
> 
> So anyways, from what I understand is I am better off with the GR07 instead of the GR01. Are there any more IEMs under $200 that may be what I'm looking for?


 
   
  Yes, the SE215 is in a different league of bass-heavy compared to the GR07. The bass of the GR07 is just north of neutral. You may want to look at the new Philips Fidelio S1/S2 as well. Not much out there on them at the moment (they are new) but they sound very good. I think the S2 is about on-par with the GR07 and will run just $150. I'm not yet sure which sound signature I favor. One key difference outside of the sound is the fit - the Philips has to be worn cable-down while the GR07 has to be worn cord-up. 
   
  Quote: 





ottorobba said:


> Thank you for the reply Joker, this made me think and research more into what sound signature would fit me better and I decided to play it safe and get something warm/sweet, I managed to get a MEElec A151 for U$30 on Amazon. Should be a good enough intro iem for me
> 
> Once again, thanks for the help and for making this topic, it is invaluable!


 
   
  Good price for the A151, cheaper even than the Astrotec and Rock-It Sounds competition.


----------



## Impulse

Thanks for the S1/S2 pic joker!


----------



## needbassndetail

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Really depends on the type of sound you favor. Someone asked a similar question on the previous page with a ~$100 limit and I recommended the JVC FXT90 - I think its mildly v-shaped signature works well for both genres as long as you don't favor neutral sound. It's a safe option that won't leave you wanting more bass. The Yamaha EPH-100 is another safe one with an overall warmer, smoother sound.


 
  I like bass but I'm not a basshead. I like balance all around sound but with more bass or sub-bass 
  if I extend my budget to $200 what are you recommend?
  currently aiming GR07 mk2 but after read GR07 Bass Edition I become confused @@
  and I found TDK BA200 is in GR07 price range
  any advice?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have a pair here but was planning to skip them - the performance is a little underwhelming. One of the most unique-looking IEMs I have but so far just doesn't seem to be a very strong performer. I am not sure what the price is at but they sound like a bassier - but not necessarily better - Phiaton PS20.


 
  $120 (+ shipping, depending in location) from ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Phiaton-MS-200-Moderna-Earphones-Comply-Tips-Mic-Music-Control-Free-Shipping-/380536392279?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item5899bc8a57


----------



## cyrusxd

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What are you looking to change compared to the GR07? I've been enjoying the newer GR07BE lately. If you don't want another VSonic set I don't think you'll find anything with quite the same signature in that price range. Some alternatives with different signatures may be the JVC FXT90, Yamaha EPH-100, or HiFiMan RE-400.


 
  So this made me think that "vsonic it is then", but then i read about this rockit sound r-50 and vsonics gr01, what can you say about vsonic gr07 BE and mk2, gr01 and r-50. these are my last choices for my replacement iems, reading alot of reviews didnt help as i will for example like gr07 but after reading a post then switch to gr01 after reading another, i really want the balanced sound maybe a tad leaning in the bass side for the sound signature. thanks for the opinions again.


----------



## damex

hello again.
  im satisfied with Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII while using with favourite powerful/clear leading vocal. It sounds clear and gives me "feeling of scene" (it still far behind/flat compared to akg k702) + im getting nice isolation ... and that nice monitor sound with all creepy mastering fails =/.
   
  i'v wanted to interest as if is there are IEMs that suitable for a bit different music? i'v found out that it gives me headache (im not sure how to describe that sound but at the powerful/fastest parts of the song im getting sort of "peak sound" changing to "a bit metallic/plastic/flat" (i rly dunno how else to describe that) and its not suitable) whan i try to hear Skillet, Lacuna Coil or Cascada with it. Sometimes Gamma Ray too ...
  i am ready to buy another pair for testing. wich one i should try now? its again around 200$ per pair.


----------



## koflok

Hi all
   
  So from what I read the HiFiMan RE 400 is rated pretty highly around here.
   
  You guys reckon, if for the same price I can get TDK IE 800. Which one would you choose?
   
  I listen to all range of musics but mainly EDM and pop jazz and a bit of rock and hip hop. I want mainly the clarity really in my IEM.
   
  Cheers


----------



## kylezo

eke2k6 said:


> An excellent read: http://www.head-fi.org/t/556556/comparison-russia-china-showdown-dba-02-vs-gr07




What?! This doesn't make my life any easier at all. Now I want both of them. Crap!


----------



## EPICFAILXD

Quote: 





koflok said:


> Hi all
> 
> So from what I read the HiFiMan RE 400 is rated pretty highly around here.
> 
> ...


 
  Haven't heard RE400, but the IE800 sounds amazing. If you're in HK, then the TDK's are probably cheaper and are (IMO) the ones you should buy. However, as an all rounder (build, comfort etc) the RE400 would be a much better choice.


----------



## JMBrown322

Joker, thanks so much for maintaining this thread and keeping up with all these reviews.  This is an amazing source of information!  

 I am in the market for a new IEM and was hoping you could offer some input.  I have the newer Atrios (MG7), but I find them to be too dark, and at times too bassy.  I think I would like a brighter IEM, that still has very good, strong bass.  Basically, I'm looking for an IEM with a mild v-shaped sounds signature (something "fun") and decent separation.  The FX700 has been recommended, but it is (1) out of my budget ($150-ish) and (2) I need isolation.
   
  Do you have any recommendations?  The TF10 sounds close to what I want, but prices have gone up and it's well in the $200s now.  Are there any slightly less expensive (and maybe dynamic instead of BA) IEMs similar in sound to the TF10?  Would the FXT90 work?  Any thoughts or recommendations would be great!

 Thanks again for your contributions to head-fi!


----------



## ljokerl

Full Philip Fidelio S1/S2 review (with measurements) is now up at Innerfidelity: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones 
   
  Quote: 





impulse said:


> Thanks for the S1/S2 pic joker!


 
   
  Sure thing!
   
  Quote: 





needbassndetail said:


> I like bass but I'm not a basshead. I like balance all around sound but with more bass or sub-bass
> if I extend my budget to $200 what are you recommend?
> currently aiming GR07 mk2 but after read GR07 Bass Edition I become confused @@
> and I found TDK BA200 is in GR07 price range
> any advice?


 
   
  I am not familiar with the BA200. The bass difference between the GR07BE and regular GR07 (mkI) is not that big - I think it's safe to get the BE as your first GR07. Its bass definitely won't be overbearing, it just has slightly more bass than mids compared to my regular GR07.
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> $120 (+ shipping, depending in location) from ebay
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Phiaton-MS-200-Moderna-Earphones-Comply-Tips-Mic-Music-Control-Free-Shipping-/380536392279?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item5899bc8a57


 
   
  Yeah... that'll be a tough sell for the sound. The design is great, though. 
   
  Quote: 





cyrusxd said:


> So this made me think that "vsonic it is then", but then i read about this rockit sound r-50 and vsonics gr01, what can you say about vsonic gr07 BE and mk2, gr01 and r-50. these are my last choices for my replacement iems, reading alot of reviews didnt help as i will for example like gr07 but after reading a post then switch to gr01 after reading another, i really want the balanced sound maybe a tad leaning in the bass side for the sound signature. thanks for the opinions again.


 
   
  The GR01 and R-50 use similar transducers and sound more similar to each other than to most other earphones. The GR07 BE is close to the regular GR07, just has a little more bass relative to the midrange. I would consider the regular GR07 the safest option as it fits between the GR07BE and the GR01 (closer to the GR07BE). 
   
    
  Quote:


damex said:


> hello again.
> im satisfied with Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII while using with favourite powerful/clear leading vocal. It sounds clear and gives me "feeling of scene" (it still far behind/flat compared to akg k702) + im getting nice isolation ... and that nice monitor sound with all creepy mastering fails =/.
> 
> i'v wanted to interest as if is there are IEMs that suitable for a bit different music? i'v found out that it gives me headache (im not sure how to describe that sound but at the powerful/fastest parts of the song im getting sort of "peak sound" changing to "a bit metallic/plastic/flat" (i rly dunno how else to describe that) and its not suitable) whan i try to hear Skillet, Lacuna Coil or Cascada with it. Sometimes Gamma Ray too ...
> i am ready to buy another pair for testing. wich one i should try now? its again around 200$ per pair.


 
   
  I would try something warm and smooth, probably built around a dynamic driver. Too bad the RE262 has been discontinued. The EPH-100 from yamaha might work but it has significantly more bass than the DBA-02. The new Philips Fidelio S2 is worth looking at as well - not as much bass or warmth as with the EPH-100 but still definitely a dynamic-driver earphone.
   
  Quote: 





koflok said:


> Hi all
> 
> So from what I read the HiFiMan RE 400 is rated pretty highly around here.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Unfortunately I haven't heard the IE800. The RE-400 is a rather neutral-sounding earphone whereas most seem to prefer some enhanced bass for genres such as EDM and hip-hop. If you're after clarity it's a great option at $99.
   
  Quote: 





jmbrown322 said:


> Joker, thanks so much for maintaining this thread and keeping up with all these reviews.  This is an amazing source of information!
> 
> I am in the market for a new IEM and was hoping you could offer some input.  I have the newer Atrios (MG7), but I find them to be too dark, and at times too bassy.  I think I would like a brighter IEM, that still has very good, strong bass.  Basically, I'm looking for an IEM with a mild v-shaped sounds signature (something "fun") and decent separation.  The FX700 has been recommended, but it is (1) out of my budget ($150-ish) and (2) I need isolation.
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, the FXT90 should be one of your best options - solid bass and sparkly treble. It rolls off the bass quicker than the Atrios but so do most other earphones. Isolation is not exactly stellar but better than with the FX700 for sure.


----------



## cyrusxd

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR01 and R-50 use similar transducers and sound more similar to each other than to most other earphones. The GR07 BE is close to the regular GR07, just has a little more bass relative to the midrange. I would consider the regular GR07 the safest option as it fits between the GR07BE and the GR01 (closer to the GR07BE).


 
   
  thanks again joker, this really helped me


----------



## cosmicjoker

thanks bro joker!


----------



## Peculier

Read almost all these reviews a dozen times over.. Hoping earnestly for a substantial FitEar F111 review...


----------



## koflok

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I haven't heard the IE800. The RE-400 is a rather neutral-sounding earphone whereas most seem to prefer some enhanced bass for genres such as EDM and hip-hop. If you're after clarity it's a great option at $99.


 
   
  Cheers bud. Yeah I like EDM but I don't really need a very bass-y IEM. I prefer the clarity really.
   
  And regarding the build quality and comfort. Is it any good? The cables of my Klipsch S4 and Shure SE21 got torn off like in less than a year.


----------



## Change is Good

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, the SE215 is in a different league of bass-heavy compared to the GR07. The bass of the GR07 is just north of neutral. You may want to look at the new Philips Fidelio S1/S2 as well. Not much out there on them at the moment (they are new) but they sound very good. I think the S2 is about on-par with the GR07 and will run just $150. I'm not yet sure which sound signature I favor. One key difference outside of the sound is the fit - the Philips has to be worn cable-down while the GR07 has to be worn cord-up.


 
   
  I think I'm leaning more towards the Fidelios because they look more appealing than the GR0... and you said the s2 is "about on-par with the G07." Thank you  for the feedback... I will give impressions once I get them and burn them in.
   
  Edit: Is there a significant difference between the S1 and S2 sound wise? Which would be better suited for the sound signature I'm looking for? If the difference is not night and day, then I think I'll go for the S1 and save 50 bucks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





peculier said:


> Read almost all these reviews a dozen times over.. Hoping earnestly for a substantial FitEar F111 review...


 
   
   
  Sadly I don't have a FitEar contact but it does look like an interesting earphone.
   
    
  Quote:


koflok said:


> Cheers bud. Yeah I like EDM but I don't really need a very bass-y IEM. I prefer the clarity really.
> 
> And regarding the build quality and comfort. Is it any good? The cables of my Klipsch S4 and Shure SE21 got torn off like in less than a year.


 
   
   
  I think the RE-400 is very comfortable. As for the longevity, it's only been out for a few months so I don't think anyone really knows at this point.
   
   
  Quote: 





change is good said:


> I think I'm leaning more towards the Fidelios because they look more appealing than the GR0... and you said the s2 is "about on-par with the G07." Thank you  for the feedback... I will give impressions once I get them and burn them in.
> 
> Edit: Is there a significant difference between the S1 and S2 sound wise? Which would be better suited for the sound signature I'm looking for? If the difference is not night and day, then I think I'll go for the S1 and save 50 bucks.


 
   
   
  The difference is not night and day. My full review can currently be found here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones


----------



## cloudycloud

Joker - can you give me a direct upgrade to the X10?  I love the sound a lot but sometimes I feel like the speed is lacking (I became spoiled with the R-50).


----------



## Impulse

Hey joker, gonna add the Fidelio S1/S2 to this round up eventually? (after the Inner Fi review's been up a while I imagine?) Just curious how their scores would line up against the field.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cloudycloud said:


> Joker - can you give me a direct upgrade to the X10?  I love the sound a lot but sometimes I feel like the speed is lacking (I became spoiled with the R-50).


 
   
  I really don't know of many universals with similar signatures that aren't worse than the X10 overall _and_ beat it in speed/detail resolution. The Heir 8.A reminds me of the X10 but that's... pricy.
   
  Quote: 





impulse said:


> Hey joker, gonna add the Fidelio S1/S2 to this round up eventually? (after the Inner Fi review's been up a while I imagine?) Just curious how their scores would line up against the field.


 

 I have a few other things I have to finish up in a hurry but I'll definitely add the S1/S2 when I get a chance. They should score in the RE-400 - GR07 range on SQ since they are definite competition for those.


----------



## jhelsas

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I really don't know of many universals with similar signatures that aren't worse than the X10 overall _and_ beat it in speed/detail resolution. The Heir 8.A reminds me of the X10 but that's... pricy.
> 
> 
> I have a few other things I have to finish up in a hurry but I'll definitely add the S1/S2 when I get a chance. They should score in the RE-400 - GR07 range on SQ since they are definite competition for those.


 

 ljokerl
   
  you own the 8.A?
   
  Have you also heard the 4.A or the 4.Ai? (in this case I'm particularly interested with the comparison between them and the W4)


----------



## Horsethief

Hi Joker,
   
  I've been using the Brainwavz M2 on a daily basis and really enjoy their sound.  As with all things I enjoy I find I'm ready to upgrade.  I probably have more classic consumer sensibilities and after reading your reviews have narrowed down the field to about a dozen iems (including a couple of customs).  I'm tentatively setting a $500-$600 limit since this is more about comparison and less about paradigm.  I'd ultimately like to get a good BA and dynamic since I need to hear both to truly appreciate the difference.  I liked your comment about fully appreciating the Miracle due to sheer experience with everything else.
   
  I know there's no direct correlation but I really enjoy my Denon AH-D5000 at home since it's so capable of handling any additional bass I EQ into it but also sounds great without it.  On the other hand my K702s just can't live up to the bass impact I like and the sound level really degrades when I push them with an EQ.  The have great clarity but I only plug them in when I want to remember why I'm not as excited by them.  (I'd love to get my hands on the LCD-2 but that's another story for another day.)
   
  I use my M2s on a daily basis with my iPhone 4S and my Digizoid ZO2.  I really prefer the warmth provided by that mini EQ booster.  I also tend to use the Equalizer app and push the lower frequencies even higher.  I find the M2 is quite capable of handling my combined EQing and doesn't sound particularly muddy with the boost to my ears.  I'm afraid if I start with something boomy/muddy I'll have less flexibility for the tracks that I drop to a flat EQ.  However I have no desire for the ability to reach a completely analytical sound so I'm good with something that's warm with a flat EQ.  I listen primarily to very melodic metal and enjoy the strong (not recessed) mids of the M2.  I'd like to have a good level of detail for some of the more intricate guitar solos.  I also like the fit/isolation with the M2.  I'd like something that doesn't necessarily need to be loud to sound good.  I generally listen in the office so I keep the volume at low/medium listening levels so that I can hear the phone ring.
   
  Based on all of that would you have any suggestion(s)?  Thanks in advance for any advice!
   
   
  Here's a picture of one of my usual EQ settings for the M2s with the Equalizer app.


----------



## Killashell421

Hey joker do you know whats a good upgrade from the klipsch image s4 for under a 100$
  i mostley listen to hip hop


----------



## kobetastic

Hi joker, I was wondering if you could recommend me an upgrade from the Westone w2s. I really enjoy them but I was wondering how much better can it get. Is there an iem with a much different sound signature or improved sound quality that would be better than the w2s? Also my budget would be around $300. Thank you for your reviews i bought three iems based on your thread!


----------



## cloudycloud

Joker - Any interest in the Vsonic VC1000's foudn here?  Vsonic has a great track record and they are another knowles duel BA found around the price range of the R-50.  Apparently from initial reviews they are more fun and with more bass than the typical dual BA.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jhelsas said:


> ljokerl
> 
> you own the 8.A?
> 
> Have you also heard the 4.A or the 4.Ai? (in this case I'm particularly interested with the comparison between them and the W4)


 
   
  I have an 8.A but no experience with the 4.A or 4.Ai
   
  Quote: 





horsethief said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I've been using the Brainwavz M2 on a daily basis and really enjoy their sound.  As with all things I enjoy I find I'm ready to upgrade.  I probably have more classic consumer sensibilities and after reading your reviews have narrowed down the field to about a dozen iems (including a couple of customs).  I'm tentatively setting a $500-$600 limit since this is more about comparison and less about paradigm.  I'd ultimately like to get a good BA and dynamic since I need to hear both to truly appreciate the difference.  I liked your comment about fully appreciating the Miracle due to sheer experience with everything else.
> 
> ...


 
   
  First off, I don't test how tolerant earphones are of being EQ'd these days so I won't be of much help on that front, but I would think a dynamic driver would be more up your alley than an armature. I know it's nowhere near the top of your price range but I think you would enjoy the Yamaha EPH-100 for its natural (i.e. un-EQd) deep bass and strong midrange presence.
   
  That plus the 1964-V3 as your armature might be a good combo for you, if you want to risk a custom as your first high-end armature earphone.
   
  Quote: 





killashell421 said:


> Hey joker do you know whats a good upgrade from the klipsch image s4 for under a 100$
> i mostley listen to hip hop


 
   
  If you are looking to stay with a v-shaped sound, you can pick up a JVC FXT90 for around that much these days. It's more balanced than the S4 but still far from flat/neutral. If you want to spend a little less, the Audio-Technica CKM-500 would be a good one as well. Even less than that - VSonic GR02 Bass Edition. 
   
  Quote: 





kobetastic said:


> Hi joker, I was wondering if you could recommend me an upgrade from the Westone w2s. I really enjoy them but I was wondering how much better can it get. Is there an iem with a much different sound signature or improved sound quality that would be better than the w2s? Also my budget would be around $300. Thank you for your reviews i bought three iems based on your thread!


 
   
  Unless you have specific improvements in mind I doubt you can really upgrade from the W2 for less than $300. There's tons with a different signature that are good - the VSonic GR07BE would be one, for example, for a less mid-centric sound. 
   
  Quote: 





cloudycloud said:


> Joker - Any interest in the Vsonic VC1000's foudn here?  Vsonic has a great track record and they are another knowles duel BA found around the price range of the R-50.  Apparently from initial reviews they are more fun and with more bass than the typical dual BA.


 

 I've reviewed the GR01, which is a VSonic dual BA with a Knowles driver. I am not sure how the VC1000 differs from that model.


----------



## Killashell421

Ayo joker thanks for the advice im gonna get the vsonic gr02 
Just one more question does the bass edition have the grey cable? Because theres three models on amazon and i dont kno which ones which?
Heres the link. http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s_ss_i_3_8?ie=UTF8&k=vsonic+gr02&i=aps&spre


----------



## putente

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have an 8.A ...


 
   
  Will you review it soon and add it to your chart?


----------



## zerocoolhifi

Quote: 





killashell421 said:


> Ayo joker thanks for the advice im gonna get the vsonic gr02
> Just one more question does the bass edition have the grey cable? Because theres three models on amazon and i dont kno which ones which?
> Heres the link. http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s_ss_i_3_8?ie=UTF8&k=vsonic+gr02&i=aps&spre


 
  Just get them from here - direct from lendmeurears - ships from the US arrives in about 4 days.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vsonic-GR02-Bass-/321086063296?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item4ac23882c0


----------



## danikus

Hi Joker, thank you for answering my question i asked you recently and now i've another, more difficult question. I'm planning on moving on from soundmagic e30, my budget is <100$. I listen to a lot of ambient music, metal (death, black, doom..), folk, new age, post rock and many other genres. The sound i think i would prefer is: enveloping and the-bigger-the-better soundstage, separation, balanced, not fatiguing. I'm thinking of buying fxt-90, but i'm not sure that soundstage will be big enough and highs may be too fatiguing. 
  Thank you for your work here! Really looking forward to coming reviews


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





killashell421 said:


> Ayo joker thanks for the advice im gonna get the vsonic gr02
> Just one more question does the bass edition have the grey cable? Because theres three models on amazon and i dont kno which ones which?
> Heres the link. http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s_ss_i_3_8?ie=UTF8&k=vsonic+gr02&i=aps&spre


 
   
  You would want something that specifically says _bass edition_. The cable on it is gray, but it's gray on some other versions of the GR02 as well (for example the "silver edition").
   
   
  Quote: 





putente said:


> Will you review it soon and add it to your chart?


 
   
   
  In due time - I just got it a week or so ago 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





danikus said:


> Hi Joker, thank you for answering my question i asked you recently and now i've another, more difficult question. I'm planning on moving on from soundmagic e30, my budget is <100$. I listen to a lot of ambient music, metal (death, black, doom..), folk, new age, post rock and many other genres. The sound i think i would prefer is: enveloping and the-bigger-the-better soundstage, separation, balanced, not fatiguing. I'm thinking of buying fxt-90, but i'm not sure that soundstage will be big enough and highs may be too fatiguing.
> Thank you for your work here! Really looking forward to coming reviews


 
   
  How do you find the bass and treble quantity of the E30? Because the FXT90 has more of both and if you find the balance of the E30 to your liking you may want to look something that's flatter than the FXT90.


----------



## Horsethief

Thanks Joker,
   
  I appreciate the recommendation.  I'm leaning toward the EPH-100 right now.  What would you think of the MTPG vs. the EPH-100?  I only ask because I see the MTPG is $150 on Amazon right now (and is Prime eligible).


----------



## Amitl

can anyone please explain to me...why would
  anyone go for a 150$ BA IEM instead of a 150$ Dynamic IEM?
  i don't have any experience with BA but i understand
  then generally if you go for BA you get some sibilance and lack of bass,
  but if you go for dynamic you get more bass and less sibilance and harshness.
  i mean...do some people just dont like the bass?
  sorry for being naive maybe
  im not talking about overpowering bass.
  i mean, for example :
  why would anyone chose the VSonic GR01 over the Yamaha EPH100?
  the Yamaha has more bass and less chance of harshness....


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Just wanna say the Yamaha EPH100 are amazing. Anyone who buys them and enjoys their electronic music won't be disappointed.


----------



## Impulse

That seems like a big generalization Amitl...


----------



## rawrster

Seeing as I haven't bought much earphones since I got the JH5 things have certainly changed. I was thinking about getting a universal as my S4 died. I was thinking the $200-300 range and looking at Amazon there's the W3 and the SM2 from Earsonics. Are those still good options or has the quality gone up since then? The signature I'm looking for is more towards the W3 kind of signature however but never heard an Earsonics so not sure how that would go really.


----------



## danikus

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> How do you find the bass and treble quantity of the E30? Because the FXT90 has more of both and if you find the balance of the E30 to your liking you may want to look something that's flatter than the FXT90.


 
  Well, a little bit punchier and faster bass would work for me, as well as more treble quantity, but again - just a little bit. Do you think the hifiman re-400 is a safer choice for me? And what about soundstage? Thanks again!


----------



## Peculier

Just curious... How does the CK10 stack up against more recent models of IEMs? Is it still relevant?


----------



## Amitl

if the Yamaha EPH100 had the RockIt 50 housing and cable, i'd buy it
  i just don't get why don't most IEM manufacturers solve the micrphonics thing already
  by doing what RockIt Sounds is doing!!


----------



## Lifted Andreas

amitl said:


> if the Yamaha EPH100 had the RockIt 50 housing and cable, i'd buy it
> i just don't get why don't most IEM manufacturers solve the micrphonics thing already
> by doing what RockIt Sounds is doing!!




Seriously? 

Yamaha has even better Housing! I see the R50s as rubbery pieces of plastic death, and if I saw someone with them I wouldn't be giddy that I don't have them. Which is a different story with the Yamaha. 

Oh and the reason not all earphones are like the R50s (gladly), its because not everyone wants to wear them over the ear.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





amitl said:


> if the Yamaha EPH100 had the RockIt 50 housing and cable, i'd buy it
> i just don't get why don't most IEM manufacturers solve the micrphonics thing already
> by doing what RockIt Sounds is doing!!


 
  why not the Astrotec AX7 then?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





horsethief said:


> Thanks Joker,
> 
> I appreciate the recommendation.  I'm leaning toward the EPH-100 right now.  What would you think of the MTPG vs. the EPH-100?  I only ask because I see the MTPG is $150 on Amazon right now (and is Prime eligible).


 
   
  I would take the EPH-100 still. The MTPG won't be as tight and controlled when it comes to bass and has few other advantages over the EPH-100. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> can anyone please explain to me...why would
> anyone go for a 150$ BA IEM instead of a 150$ Dynamic IEM?
> i don't have any experience with BA but i understand
> then generally if you go for BA you get some sibilance and lack of bass,
> ...


 
   
  I would choose the GR01 over the EPH100 most of the time. For me the EPH-100 has more bass than I need, to the point of not being entirely true to the recording, while the GR01 is more in line with what I want to hear. It's also hugely incorrect to say all BA IEMs are sibilant and lack bass, but that's another story.
   
  Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Just wanna say the Yamaha EPH100 are amazing. Anyone who buys them and enjoys their electronic music won't be disappointed.


 
   
  Agreed, they are a very good match for EDM. 
   
  Quote: 





rawrster said:


> Seeing as I haven't bought much earphones since I got the JH5 things have certainly changed. I was thinking about getting a universal as my S4 died. I was thinking the $200-300 range and looking at Amazon there's the W3 and the SM2 from Earsonics. Are those still good options or has the quality gone up since then? The signature I'm looking for is more towards the W3 kind of signature however but never heard an Earsonics so not sure how that would go really.


 
   
  I don't think you will like the SM2 - it's warm, thick, and smooth. More UM3X than W3, really. The W3 is a much better match for the S4 type signature. 
   
  Quote: 





danikus said:


> Well, a little bit punchier and faster bass would work for me, as well as more treble quantity, but again - just a little bit. Do you think the hifiman re-400 is a safer choice for me? And what about soundstage? Thanks again!


 
   
  The RE-400 doesn't have more bass than the E30. The Philips Fidelio S1 does and would be a good choice. It has a wider soundstage much like the E30. The FXT90 has even more bass and treble than that and its presentation has better depth. The FXD80 from JVC would be another good option with less bass than the FXT90 but you lose some of the midrange presence with that.
   
  Quote: 





peculier said:


> Just curious... How does the CK10 stack up against more recent models of IEMs? Is it still relevant?


 

 It's been discontinued so it doesn't really matter but its score is worth no less now than it was two years ago. You can see how it stacks up in the chart.


----------



## Amitl

geko95gek: the yamahas are prettier, i agree, but that doesnt mean much.
  Joker: which earphone is your recommendation for death/black/doom/extreme metal?
            (with no sibilance/harshness)


----------



## thesuperguy

Quote: 





amitl said:


> if the Yamaha EPH100 had the RockIt 50 housing and cable, i'd buy it
> i just don't get why don't most IEM manufacturers solve the micrphonics thing already
> by doing what RockIt Sounds is doing!!


 

 I specifically chose not to buy the R50 for the sole purpose of its untrustworthy build quality. I've seen people saying that the cable you very much praise splits and starts tearing off the housing after only a couple of months.


----------



## Deviltooth

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> I specifically chose not to buy the R50 for the sole purpose of its untrustworthy build quality. I've seen people saying that the cable you very much praise splits and starts tearing off the housing after only a couple of months.


 
   
  I don't think the R-50 is built badly (average).  The real problem is how uncomfortable the cable is.  I have no problem wearing my cables over the ear, the R-50 is an exception with the worst memory wire I've encountered.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> geko95gek: the yamahas are prettier, i agree, but that doesnt mean much.
> Joker: which earphone is your recommendation for death/black/doom/extreme metal?
> (with no sibilance/harshness)


 

 I don't really listen to that sort of thing except for Agalloch, some older Opeth, and whatever Katatonia/Paradise Lost albums fall under those labels. I'm happy with a neutral sound (etys and the like) for these.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Hey Joker! I need some advice! I'm getting a birthday present for a friend, and I've narrowed it down to the Astrotec Am-90, Dunu Trident or GR02. Which one would you recommend? My friend isn't really an audiophile, so she wouldn't be too picky or detailed about the sound. She generally likes night core and pop.


----------



## bangdomarkin

Joker, which iem below U$ 120.00 has a sound signature more like the 1964 V3?


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Hey Joker! I need some advice! I'm getting a birthday present for a friend, and I've narrowed it down to the Astrotec Am-90, Dunu Trident or GR02. Which one would you recommend? My friend isn't really an audiophile, so she wouldn't be too picky or detailed about the sound


 
  just to save you some time, he might ask you your friend's music preference


----------



## colonelclaypool

Quote: 





horsethief said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I've been using the Brainwavz M2 on a daily basis and really enjoy their sound.  As with all things I enjoy I find I'm ready to upgrade.  I probably have more classic consumer sensibilities and after reading your reviews have narrowed down the field to about a dozen iems (including a couple of customs).  I'm tentatively setting a $500-$600 limit since this is more about comparison and less about paradigm.  I'd ultimately like to get a good BA and dynamic since I need to hear both to truly appreciate the difference.  I liked your comment about fully appreciating the Miracle due to sheer experience with everything else.
> 
> ...


 
   
  which eq app is that?


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Agreed, they are a very good match for EDM.


 
   
  Indeed mate!
   
  Btw, I got the SoundMAGIC E10 about a week ago now on your recommendation and they sound really good with EDM as well. Thanks for your input!
   
  I got them at a steal price as well from MP4Nation, £16 shipped which is around $24. Wicked deal!


----------



## gunnertown

Greetings. 
I had been to a Shure dealer today in my city for se 215. He told me that he had only 1 in stock . As soon as he gave me the box I noticed that the box had been messed around with. He went ahead to make the bill and immediately I requested that I needed to check those out . I found that the foam tips were deformed and hence requested for a new set of IEM. 
I have a few questions in mind.. 
Does the pack have a seal like the ones found in cell phone box? 
Does the connector swivel with ease.. I mean are they that loose? 
I read in a head fi post that the connectors are copper plated and oxidise quickly and hence the sound cut. 
Although I have booked these I would still love to have all these doubts cleared. 
And one important point, these were manufactured in June 2012. So connector problems may have been resolved?


----------



## Horsethief

> which eq app is that?


 
   
  The app is called Equalizer.  Here's the Apple link:  https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/equalizer/id321267949?mt=8
   
  I don't know if it's available for Android.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Hey Joker! I need some advice! I'm getting a birthday present for a friend, and I've narrowed it down to the Astrotec Am-90, Dunu Trident or GR02. Which one would you recommend? *My friend isn't really an audiophile, so she wouldn't be too picky or detailed about the sound*. She generally likes night core and pop.


 
   
  You probably don't want to buy an armature-based earphone, then. As for the other two, the GR02 has that "wow" factor because of its v-shaped signature, with plenty of bass but also very prominent treble that most novice listeners will take for fantastic clarity. The Trident is more on the warm and smooth side, it will probably remind them more of their (older relative's) Bose set. The Trident also wows with its construction and overall presentation - it looks and feels like a higher-end product. If you're not too worried about all that, for pop I would probably go GR02. But really, either would be a great choice. 
   
   
  Quote: 





bangdomarkin said:


> Joker, which iem below U$ 120.00 has a sound signature more like the 1964 V3?


 
   
  Interesting question... probably the JVC FXT90 in terms of overall signature and presentation. 
   
  Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Indeed mate!
> 
> Btw, I got the SoundMAGIC E10 about a week ago now on your recommendation and they sound really good with EDM as well. Thanks for your input!
> 
> I got them at a steal price as well from MP4Nation, £16 shipped which is around $24. Wicked deal!


 
   
  Good price! 
   
  Quote: 





gunnertown said:


> Greetings.
> I had been to a Shure dealer today in my city for se 215. He told me that he had only 1 in stock . As soon as he gave me the box I noticed that the box had been messed around with. He went ahead to make the bill and immediately I requested that I needed to check those out . I found that the foam tips were deformed and hence requested for a new set of IEM.
> I have a few questions in mind..
> Does the pack have a seal like the ones found in cell phone box?
> ...


 

 Unfortunately I don't take photos of packaging and I really don't remember what SE215 packaging looked like. June 2012 should be fine, though - supposedly the issues were solved soon after I wrote my review, which was back in 2011.
   
  The connectors do swivel pretty easily so that really doesn't you anything.


----------



## colonelclaypool

Quote: 





horsethief said:


> The app is called Equalizer.  Here's the Apple link:  https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/equalizer/id321267949?mt=8
> 
> I don't know if it's available for Android.


 
  unfortunatealy not but thanks anyways.


----------



## nicholars

This is an excellent resource for finding the right IEM... I think that IEM you get a lot more sound for your money compared to headphones... In sound quality a pair of £100 IEM is better than pretty much any headphones under £300.... Except for maybe comfort and soundstage.


----------



## karistep

What is the best 3d iem under 300$ ?


----------



## kaixax555

Quote: 





karistep said:


> What is the best 3d iem under 300$ ?


 

 SM3 if you can get it under 300, or else it would be SM2 I guess


----------



## Endcode

Hey guys, I'm in the market for some IEMs $150 and below. I got recommended the EX-600's, because my priority was for piano/ orchestral music, and I would favor in the timbre and note presentation. The point of reference for me is the B2's, which are absolutely wonderful sounding, although the note presentation seems to be a little lean for me to call realistic, and I'd like something with a slightly more tame treble. Would an IEM that is (slightly) on the darker side of neutral suit my needs? The IEMs i am looking at are the HA-FXT90, TDK BA200s, RE-400s, SM2s, and the EX-600, My price strecher is the GR01, if the difference to the B2s is quite a bit. Any recommendations?
 Thanks!


----------



## dweaver

I would say RE -400 or SE215, or Fidelio S1


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> This is an excellent resource for finding the right IEM... I think that IEM you get a lot more sound for your money compared to headphones... In sound quality a pair of £100 IEM is better than pretty much any headphones under £300.... Except for maybe comfort and soundstage.


 
   




   
   
  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> SM3 if you can get it under 300, or else it would be SM2 I guess


 
   
  Agree.
   
   
  Quote: 





endcode said:


> Hey guys, I'm in the market for some IEMs $150 and below. I got recommended the EX-600's, because my priority was for piano/ orchestral music, and I would favor in the timbre and note presentation. The point of reference for me is the B2's, which are absolutely wonderful sounding, although the note presentation seems to be a little lean for me to call realistic, and I'd like something with a slightly more tame treble. Would an IEM that is (slightly) on the darker side of neutral suit my needs? The IEMs i am looking at are the HA-FXT90, TDK BA200s, RE-400s, SM2s, and the EX-600, My price strecher is the GR01, if the difference to the B2s is quite a bit. Any recommendations?
> Thanks!


 
  The RE-400 would be a good one, or the RE262 if you can still find one. From Philips both the Fidelio S1 and S2 would work. I think the S2 is a little warmer-sounding overall so it might be better for you. I would not recommend the GR01 as it's probably not different enough from the B2, or the SM2/FXT90 because they may be too different. No experience with the BA200.


----------



## Katun

Am I the only one that didn't like the RE262's scooped out upper midrange? Reminded me of the W2's sig. I find the RE-400 quite superior to both.


----------



## DannyBai

I find the RE400 superior to the 262 but not the 272.


----------



## Katun

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> I find the RE400 superior to the 262 but not the 272.


 
   
  I'm guessing that's where the RE600 comes in...


----------



## DannyBai

Quote: 





katun said:


> I'm guessing that's where the RE600 comes in...


 
  If only it was going to be cheaper I might take the chance to find out.


----------



## Amitl

i just won the MEElectronics Instagram contest 
  and i'm supposed to get a 100$ gift certificate...
  which earphones should i chose?


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> This is an excellent resource for finding the right IEM... I think that IEM you get a lot more sound for your money compared to headphones... In sound quality a pair of £100 IEM is better than pretty much any headphones under £300.... Except for maybe comfort and soundstage.


 
   
  I disagree.
   
  My £34 JVC HA-S500 are just as good if not better than the Yamaha EPH-100 which I bought for £100.


----------



## Amitl

can anyone give me please a link to a impedance adapter?
  i keep hearing about it, and i read it might make the MEElec A161 sound better,
  but i just can't find anything on amazon/ebay


----------



## H20Fidelity

amitl said:


> can anyone give me please a link to a impedance adapter?
> i keep hearing about it, and i read it might make the MEElec A161 sound better,
> but i just can't find anything on amazon/ebay




http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Etymotic-ER4P-to-ER4S-3-5MM-plug-resistor-adaptor-/271187691903?pt=US_MP3_Player_Cables_Adapters&hash=item3f240bc97f&_uhb=1


----------



## FlySweep

> Originally Posted by *Amitl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> can anyone give me please a link to a impedance adapter?
> i keep hearing about it, and i read it might make the MEElec A161 sound better,
> but i just can't find anything on amazon/ebay


 
   
  Many people, including myself, have ordered one from this vendor.


----------



## karistep

kaixax555 said:


> SM3 if you can get it under 300, or else it would be SM2 I guess





What do you think of heir audio 4ai or 5 compare to sm3 regarding 3d ?


----------



## Amitl

thanks for the links!
  should i be specific about the ohm for the MEElec A161
  or is 75ohm good?


----------



## Soul_Est

Quick question |joker|. When you reviewed the Rock-It-Sounds R-50, did you try the Shure Olives on it since the nozzle is a mere 3 mm in diameter (same diameter as the barb on the SE215 nozzle)? I'm looking into getting either the R-50 for out of the house and the Somics MH463 for home or to just get the SoundMagic HP100 for listening to music wherever I am.


----------



## bangdomarkin

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Interesting question... probably the JVC FXT90 in terms of overall signature and presentation.


 


 Very Thanks!


----------



## Radiohead99

I'm in a quandary between IEM, custom IEM and on ear portable headphone. Please help me out.
   
  - Between IEM and custom IEM: My understanding is that its universally agreed that custom IEM is all around better in general.
   
  - Its not so clear about C/IEM vs portable on/over the ear headphones. I've researched quite a bit and all the threads here in here discusses IEM vs full size headphones.
   
  If you compare |joker| epic thread about IEM vs portable headphone, its evident that most expensive portable headphones can be head under ~$350. Where as the expensive IEMs are north of one grand. Does that indicative of their respective sound quality too?
   
  Say, if I've a budget of $500 max for headphone that I want to use in my daily NYC subway commute. Which would be a best investment: a universal fit IEM, custom fit IEM (alclaire reference, 1964 Ears V3 etc) or the cream of the crop protable headphone (beyerdynamic dt1350, Sennheiser HD-25-1 II, V-MODA M100 etc)?
   
  I'll start a new thread if thats more appropriate. I would love to hear opnions regarding this.
   
  P.S. My music preferrence is mostly indie rock. I exclusively listen to headphones on my subway commute. I have a earsonic sm3 and vsonic gr07.


----------



## ChavaC

Love this thread, easily the best resource on headfi imo.

 Quick question. Couple weeks ago I spent couple hours scouring headfi for a value warm/midcentric IEM with solid soundstage and a bit of sparkle. Thanks to this thread I wound up with GR06 which I absolutely have been amazed with it at its price point. So much so, in fact, that I'm leaning towards crowning it as my new hiking IEM and getting something better for casual listening. I'm wondering if there's a clear step up from the GR06 with a similar sound sig, with perhaps a little more sparkle/soundstage? So far I've been looking at MDR EX600 vs JVC HA-FXT90 vs GR07 mkII. I have an SM3 that almost fits the bill, but my balanced IEMs have all really lacked that cohesive dynamic-IEM sound that I love with the GR06. Any thoughts?
 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dannybai said:


> If only it was going to be cheaper I might take the chance to find out.


 
   
  Hmm... looks like $399. Is it shipping already?
   
  Quote: 





soul_est said:


> Quick question |joker|. When you reviewed the Rock-It-Sounds R-50, did you try the Shure Olives on it since the nozzle is a mere 3 mm in diameter (same diameter as the barb on the SE215 nozzle)? I'm looking into getting either the R-50 for out of the house and the Somics MH463 for home or to just get the SoundMagic HP100 for listening to music wherever I am.


 
   
  Yeah, Olives work. Kind of a tight fit but not a danger to the earphones.
   
  Quote: 





radiohead99 said:


> I'm in a quandary between IEM, custom IEM and on ear portable headphone. Please help me out.
> 
> - Between IEM and custom IEM: My understanding is that its universally agreed that custom IEM is all around better in general.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Not everyone agrees that customs are always better but no matter..
   
  I have not tried any of the current crop of portable headphones (Momentum, etc). I prefer my customs to the portables I do have (such as the M-80 and HD25) but those are cheaper as well. There are very expensive portables I have not tried, such as Ultrasone's Edition line and the Beyer T5p.
   
  Anyway, if you want to be totally isolated from your surroundings, then custom IEM is definitely the way to go. If you like the GR07 more, go for the Alclair Reference. If you like the SM3 better but wish it had more bass and treble, go for the 1964-V3.
   
  Quote: 





chavac said:


> Love this thread, easily the best resource on headfi imo.
> 
> Quick question. Couple weeks ago I spent couple hours scouring headfi for a value warm/midcentric IEM with solid soundstage and a bit of sparkle. Thanks to this thread I wound up with GR06 which I absolutely have been amazed with it at its price point. So much so, in fact, that I'm leaning towards crowning it as my new hiking IEM and getting something better for casual listening. I'm wondering if there's a clear step up from the GR06 with a similar sound sig, with perhaps a little more sparkle/soundstage? So far I've been looking at MDR EX600 vs JVC HA-FXT90 vs GR07 mkII. I have an SM3 that almost fits the bill, but my balanced IEMs have all really lacked that cohesive dynamic-IEM sound that I love with the GR06. Any thoughts?
> Thanks


 
   
  The GR07 would be very good except that its mids are not as forward as those of the GR06. The FXT90's are, but it has more bass than the GR06 and is not quite as refined overall as the GR07.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a short write-up for new Sunrise Ray DAC/Amp: http://www.head-fi.org/t/660291/short-review-sunrise-audio-ray-excellent-portable-dac-amp . I don't usually take the time off from headphone reviews but this is a very enjoyable little unit, and tempting as a replacement for my iBasso D10, which has been my main source for years despite its various quirks.


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





amitl said:


> thanks for the links!
> should i be specific about the ohm for the MEElec A161
> or is 75ohm good?


 
  According to this an impedance adapter should be bad for the a161p





http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/04/meelectronics-a161p.html


----------



## Inks

Ya it's bad, only good if you have knowles dampers handy to damp it and even things out


----------



## Impulse

radiohead99 said:


> If you compare |joker| epic thread about IEM vs portable headphone, its evident that most expensive portable headphones can be head under ~$350. Where as the expensive IEMs are north of one grand. Does that indicative of their respective sound quality too?
> 
> Say, if I've a budget of $500 max for headphone that I want to use in my daily NYC subway commute. Which would be a best investment: a universal fit IEM, custom fit IEM (alclaire reference, 1964 Ears V3 etc) or the cream of the crop protable headphone (beyerdynamic dt1350, Sennheiser HD-25-1 II, V-MODA M100 etc)?
> 
> P.S. My music preferrence is mostly indie rock. I exclusively listen to headphones on my subway commute. I have a earsonic sm3 and vsonic gr07.




I think you're focusing a bit too much on pricing tiers... That being said, if I was riding the subway every single day I'd be wearing IEM (custom or otherwise), no question about it. The isolation factor's just a lot more effective, and they're more conspicuous or easy to stow. 

I don't find IEM terribly uncomfortable in general tho, even my Etys, which I guess are about as invasive it gets (tho I'm also considering getting custom tips for them). I wear IEM when I need the isolation, when I exercise, or when I need something pocketable... Between those three scenarios I spend enough time with my IEM stuffed in my ears so I reach for my M-80 when I don't want to be quite as isolated or for when I expect to be needing to take them off often (and I wear full size headphones at home because they're just more comfortable and open headphones are hard to beat, specially for gaming).

If I was you I'd figure out what'd you like to improve upon with the GR07 or SM3 and go from there, but I wouldn't go for on ears or any other kind of portable if your main use for them is riding the subway.


----------



## Amitl

lilboozy: thanks


----------



## Amitl

i was wondering how do a top 200$ on-ear phone like the Sennheiser HD25 II compare
  to a top 200$ IEM... ?
  i know this can be answered by "incomparable" but..still....
  thanks..


----------



## Radiohead99

Some wise advice there, Impulse. Thanks! The reason I brought the portable over/on the ears in the equation is that, if they offer more in terms of sound quality, I'm open to sacrifice the isolation, portability of IEM a bit. I don't want to sacrifice sound quality for the sake of ultimate portability. But ofcourse there's a sweet spot.


----------



## Impulse

I don't know that you can argue you'll get better sound quality out of closed portables, there's so many variables in play, tho lower end closed headphones by their very nature always make some sacrifices (just like many/most IEM do, compared to full size open headphones in either case)...

There's also a bit of a catch 22 tho in that as you sacrifice isolation then sound quality inherently suffers, or you end up blasting the volume which isn't good for long term daily use. Plus the best isolating portables also tend to be the hardest clamping (potentially less comfortable) and most closed sounding, which would be the one thing they could otherwise do much better than IEM (sound stage).


----------



## Amitl

so soundstage is the main difference when it comes to
  pure sound comparing?
  (thanks for collaborating!)


----------



## nicholars

It is completely up to the individual.... Maybe you just really like the sound of over ear and dont like IEM, or the other way round.... But I would say that in actual sound quality, such as distortion etc. You get much better quality from IEM for much less money.
   
  Also with over ear headphones there is always something which you have to sacrifice for example the HD650 have very good sound quality but no sub bass... Denon D2000 very good bass but not so good in other areas etc. A pair of IEM costing £100-£200 you can get excellent sound quality through the whole frequency range.
   
  For an over ear headphone which is excellent through the whole frequency range you need to spend £400 or more for some top tier headphones HD800, LCD2, hifiman etc. So from my experience you get the best sound quality / value ratio from IEM....


----------



## nicholars

Quote: 





amitl said:


> so soundstage is the main difference when it comes to
> pure sound comparing?
> (thanks for collaborating!)


 
   
  IEM is more like it is funnelling the sound into your ear whereas good over ear headphones can do a more "out of head" soundstage that sounds like music is coming from across the room or behind you etc. Apparently some IEM such as Sennheiser IE80 are good at this as well but I have never tried them.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

nicholars said:


> It is completely up to the individual.... Maybe you just really like the sound of over ear and dont like IEM, or the other way round.... But I would say that in actual sound quality, such as distortion etc. You get much better quality from IEM for much less money.
> 
> Also with over ear headphones there is always something which you have to sacrifice for example the HD650 have very good sound quality but no sub bass... Denon D2000 very good bass but not so good in other areas etc. A pair of IEM costing £100-£200 you can get excellent sound quality through the whole frequency range.
> 
> For an over ear headphone which is excellent through the whole frequency range you need to spend £400 or more for some top tier headphones HD800, LCD2, hifiman etc. So from my experience you get the best sound quality / value ratio from IEM....




Unless you get the JVC HA-S500 which are easily worth £100-£150 in sound quality but only cost £35.  

To me they are just as good if not better than my £100 Yamaha EPH-100.


----------



## Amitl

are you serious? these 40$ JVC's top the 150$ Yamahas?


----------



## nicholars

That is just his opinion.... I doubt they actually are as good... Usually you get what you pay for with sound quality, build quality etc. Also on ears are horrible in my opinion.


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> That is just his opinion.... I doubt they actually are as good... Usually you get what you pay for with sound quality, build quality etc. Also on ears are horrible in my opinion.


 
   
  I'm not going to try assigning a dollar value to them, but they definitely punch way above their weight. Quite a few people have very high opinions of them (myself included), as this thread attests to. And you can get HM5 pads for them which turn them into very comfortable over the ear headphones.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

amitl said:


> are you serious? these 40$ JVC's top the 150$ Yamahas?




Yes I'm serious. 

I've been playing about with both for over 6 months and I can honestly say the gap in sound quality isn't that large. 

Lots of other people praise them for the ability to kill much more expensive headphones.


----------



## nicholars

Probably they are good yes but I take these comments with a "pinch of salt" when people say £30 headphones are as good as £150.... Would be interesting to hear them though... But I cannot stand on ears because they hurt my ears after a short amount of time... Is there an "over ear" version?


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> But I cannot stand on ears because they hurt my ears after a short amount of time... *They are "on ear" aren't they?*


 
   
  Yes, but as I mentioned above, you can get HM5 pads for them to turn them into very comfortable over the ears headphones.


----------



## nicholars

Hmmm Interesting maybe I will give them a try. Where do you get the HM5 pads? Do they have a good soundstage?


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Hmmm Interesting maybe I will give them a try. Where do you get the HM5 pads? Do they have a good soundstage?


 
   
  I think I got them from mp4nation. They are $8.50 a piece though, so that adds to the price. I would say that the soundstage is average for close headphones. Their strength lies in a very good and impactful bass, and a nicely detailed treble. Overall an agressive and energetic, slightly V shaped signature, but the mids are still quite present. With the HM5 pads, both the bass and the treble are reduced slightly, which for me actually improves the signature (the bass is a bit much for me with the stock pads). Many people (myself included) also swear that they improve with significant burn-in, so if you do get them, keep that in mind.


----------



## nicholars

I might get some to replace my CAL... I am a bit skint at the moment so I am looking for bargains... Also I am interested in what sound quality can be had for cheap prices... I like the CAL but the bass on them is pretty lame. Have you compared them to the CAL by any chance?


----------



## waynes world

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> I might get some to replace my CAL... I am a bit skint at the moment so I am looking for bargains... Also I am interested in what sound quality can be had for cheap prices... I like the CAL but the bass on them is pretty lame. Have you compared them to the CAL by any chance?


 
   
  I see the CAL mentioned quite a bit in the S500 thread. Here's an example.


----------



## Radiohead99

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm... looks like $399. Is it shipping already?
> 
> 
> Yeah, Olives work. Kind of a tight fit but not a danger to the earphones.
> ...


 
   
  Thanks for the helpful reply |joker|. I believe at this point, I'm leaning more towards IEM. Now its a question of, custom vs universal IEM. Btw, I'm planning to buy portable dac/amp to go with my ipod classic such as Fostex HP-P1, HIFI-M8, SONY PHA-1 etc. It seems most of the dac/amp works better with less sensitive headphoens (pico may be an exception). and IEMs are in general more sensitive. So my question is, while shopping for IEMs, should I be looking for a less sensitive IEM if I'm planning to use a dac/amp add on?
   
  Regarding custom and universal IEM, within a budge of say $400-$600, do you think there's any universal IEM that can compete with similarly priced custom IEM? I'm not looking after the complete isolation that custom provides. But if the custom provides better sound quality in general I'd be tempted. But the wait time for a custom is a killer. Buying a good universal IEM and then experimenting with  good tips for perfect fit, wouldn't that lessen the gap between customs and unviersal a bit? What I meant is, apart from the good fit and isolation factor (which ofc contributes to the overall SQ), is there any inherent engineering process that distinguishes customs from IEMs in the favor of customs?
   
  I'd really like to hear your opinion on your favorite universals that you think can go neck to neck with similarly priced customs. (I like the sound of both EarSonic and Vosnics. But VSonics bass is better and more dynamic with some excitement factor. I wish VSonic GR07 had smoother midrange and highs.)
   
  Thanks for your immense contribution to the headphone lovers around the world.


----------



## adrift02

Hey |joker|,
   
  Just wanted to mention that I received my RE-400 from Head Direct this week and they included a clamshell carrying case. Might be worth contacting them and confirming this is standard, as it's a common complaint about the RE-400.
   
  And fantastic job with this amazing thread. You led me to a purchase which I'm very happy with.


----------



## Amitl

i have this exact same generic case which i purchased from ebay for 2$ i think
  it's quite good


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





radiohead99 said:


> Thanks for the helpful reply |joker|. I believe at this point, I'm leaning more towards IEM. Now its a question of, custom vs universal IEM. Btw, I'm planning to buy portable dac/amp to go with my ipod classic such as Fostex HP-P1, HIFI-M8, SONY PHA-1 etc. It seems most of the dac/amp works better with less sensitive headphoens (pico may be an exception). and IEMs are in general more sensitive. So my question is, while shopping for IEMs, should I be looking for a less sensitive IEM if I'm planning to use a dac/amp add on?
> 
> Regarding custom and universal IEM, within a budge of say $400-$600, do you think there's any universal IEM that can compete with similarly priced custom IEM? I'm not looking after the complete isolation that custom provides. But if the custom provides better sound quality in general I'd be tempted. But the wait time for a custom is a killer. Buying a good universal IEM and then experimenting with  good tips for perfect fit, wouldn't that lessen the gap between customs and unviersal a bit? What I meant is, apart from the good fit and isolation factor (which ofc contributes to the overall SQ), is there any inherent engineering process that distinguishes customs from IEMs in the favor of customs?
> 
> ...


 
   
  If you're getting a DAC/amp that's known to have issues with sensitive IEMs, you would probably want a less sensitive one. However, a DAC that limits your options in terms of headphones/IEMs may not be a great investment as a portable solution in the first place.
   
  As for your other question, even if I say universal X competes with similarly-priced customs I have, it may not have the signature you're looking for so that information would be useless to you. Signature really does trump technical performance in my opinion.
   
  It sounds like you want some enhanced bass with smoother mids and highs and low sensitivity, which rules out all three sub-$600 customs I have here (the CTM-200 for lack of enhanced bass, the Reference for treble that's similar to the GR07, and the 1964-V3 because it is super sensitive). I am sure there is a sub-$600 custom somewhere out there that matches this description but I haven't come across it. 
   
  Quote: 





adrift02 said:


> Hey |joker|,
> 
> Just wanted to mention that I received my RE-400 from Head Direct this week and they included a clamshell carrying case. Might be worth contacting them and confirming this is standard, as it's a common complaint about the RE-400.
> 
> And fantastic job with this amazing thread. You led me to a purchase which I'm very happy with.


 
   
   
  Yes, Fang mentioned that he was looking to improve the accessory pack. I wasn't sure it would happen so soon. I'll confirm and then update my review accordingly. Looks like a good case - I have a few similar ones.

 Glad you like the sound!


----------



## NotSoSerious

Would you say the VSonic GR02/GR99 would last longer than something like the M9/M6 when it comes to long-term durability and use?
   
  I'm trying to get some earphones for a friend, but he has a terrible habit of destroying every headphone he touches that it has come to a point where durability has a higher priority than sound.
   
   
  Thanks.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Would you say the VSonic GR02/GR99 would last longer than something like the M9/M6 when it comes to long-term durability and use?
> 
> I'm trying to get some earphones for a friend, but he has a terrible habit of destroying every headphone he touches that it has come to a point where durability has a higher priority than sound.
> 
> ...


 
   
  GR02 have good cables and good body, GR99 cables sucks big time but have good body, GR99 silver editon I believe have TPU cables which are durable enough. M9 and M6 both have really good quality. If you want good sound quality with good durability get GR02 or get something like VC02 that have detachable TPU coated cables and well machined body.


----------



## adrift02

ljokerl said:


> Yes, Fang mentioned that he was looking to improve the accessory pack. I wasn't sure it would happen so soon. I'll confirm and then update my review accordingly. Looks like a good case - I have a few similar ones.
> 
> 
> Glad you like the sound!




FYI, Fang just replied to my email and confirmed that they're including a carrying case with the RE400 now.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Would you say the VSonic GR02/GR99 would last longer than something like the M9/M6 when it comes to long-term durability and use?
> 
> I'm trying to get some earphones for a friend, but he has a terrible habit of destroying every headphone he touches that it has come to a point where durability has a higher priority than sound.
> 
> ...


 
   
  At that point it's probably down to the user and not the earphone. The VSonic models really haven't been around that long but I haven't heard of anyone having a problem with them. I've also had my M9 and one of my M6s since 2009 and they're working fine. 
   
  If durability is the priority, just get the Philips O'Neill Tread. It doesn't sound that bad and it's a tank. 
   
   
  Quote: 





adrift02 said:


> FYI, Fang just replied to my email and confirmed that they're including a carrying case with the RE400 now.


 

 Thanks, I'll change it when I update the thread.


----------



## Radiohead99

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you're getting a DAC/amp that's known to have issues with sensitive IEMs, you would probably want a less sensitive one. However, a DAC that limits your options in terms of headphones/IEMs may not be a great investment as a portable solution in the first place.
> 
> As for your other question, even if I say universal X competes with similarly-priced customs I have, it may not have the signature you're looking for so that information would be useless to you. Signature really does trump technical performance in my opinion.
> 
> ...


 
   
  What custom IEM close to 1k, would more likely to have that sound signature? Would you say UM Miracle? Btw, have you heard JH13? I wonder how they compare to UM Miracle.


----------



## NotSoSerious

Hi, can you or anyone of you confirm whether: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-Silver-Earphones-Earbuds-iPhones/dp/B005EM9KRI this is the real Bass edition or not? It says GR02, which makes me believe it's the bass edition but it also says R02Proii in 2 pictures. (I've seen both pictures elsewhere on Ebay though, so it's kinda generic.)
   
  I'd rather not waste my time and buy the lower edition


----------



## Change is Good

Hey joker,
  I decided to go with the GR07 as a gut instinct over the new Fidelios. I must say this is exactly what I was looking for. Thank you so much for all your suggestions. I still am curious about the Fidelios, but am totally happy with my purchase


----------



## NotSoSerious

Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Hi, can you or anyone of you confirm whether: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-Silver-Earphones-Earbuds-iPhones/dp/B005EM9KRI this is the real Bass edition or not? It says GR02, which makes me believe it's the bass edition but it also says R02Proii in 2 pictures. (I've seen both pictures elsewhere on Ebay though, so it's kinda generic.)
> 
> I'd rather not waste my time and buy the lower edition
> 
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





radiohead99 said:


> What custom IEM close to 1k, would more likely to have that sound signature? Would you say UM Miracle? Btw, have you heard JH13? I wonder how they compare to UM Miracle.


 
   
  Not sure yet, will know more next month. 
   
  Quote: 





notsoserious said:


> Hi, can you or anyone of you confirm whether: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-Silver-Earphones-Earbuds-iPhones/dp/B005EM9KRI this is the real Bass edition or not? It says GR02, which makes me believe it's the bass edition but it also says R02Proii in 2 pictures. (I've seen both pictures elsewhere on Ebay though, so it's kinda generic.)
> 
> I'd rather not waste my time and buy the lower edition


 
   
  Beats me. They look like GR02s but at least four of the pics show the R02ProII, which is an older model. The Bass Edition has a slight tint on the metal part at the front of the housing (looks more bronze-ish). This is clearly visible in photo #5 on the listing but not so much the other pics.
   
  Quote: 





change is good said:


> Hey joker,
> I decided to go with the GR07 as a gut instinct over the new Fidelios. I must say this is exactly what I was looking for. Thank you so much for all your suggestions. I still am curious about the Fidelios, but am totally happy with my purchase


 

 That's good to hear, glad you like them!


----------



## nicholars

Please can someone answer a few questions about the GR07 BE....
   
  Currently I have Atrio MG7 and Shure SE215.... I had some Yamaha EPH-100 before...
   
  Bass quantity I found the EPH-100 slightly low but good quality, the MG7 are awesome although I could live with slightly less bass, but I do really like the quantity and quality of the bass on these... the Shure SE215 have good quantity but the quality is a bit bad....
   
  I found the EPH-100 bordering on being too bright for me.... The MG7 are not too bad but a bit edgy in the treble with bad recordings...
   
  1) Will I find the bass level on a GR07 BE dissapointing? Are they bass light compared to MG7, EPH-100 and SE215? I would certainly not want less bass than the EPH-100 but I could live with slightly less than the MG7.
   
  2) Will I find the GR07 BE too bright and sibilant / peaky in the treble, I find the EPH-100 and MG7 about right in brightness, wouldnt really want anything more sibilant / sharp than these two?
   
  3) I would like similar to the MG7 but with better midrange and soundstage, Will the GR07 BE be good for this?


----------



## extrabigmehdi

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Bass quantity I found the EPH-100 slightly low but good quality, the MG7 are awesome although I could live with slightly less bass, but I do really like the quantity and quality of the bass on these... the Shure SE215 have good quantity but the quality is a bit bad....
> I found the EPH-100 bordering on being too bright for me.... The MG7 are not too bad but a bit edgy in the treble with bad recordings...


 
  The eph-100 have more bass than what what is considered neutral. You probably didn't achieve a good seal. Also , there are no way bright.


----------



## nicholars

Yeh I did have a good seal... Look at what I am comparing them to... Not neutral... My other headphones, which are not neutral either. It was not so much the brightness that was the problem with the treble it was the extremely short decay times and thin sound of it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Please can someone answer a few questions about the GR07 BE....
> 
> Currently I have Atrio MG7 and Shure SE215.... I had some Yamaha EPH-100 before...
> 
> ...


 

 1) yes
  2) yes
  3) no


----------



## nicholars

lol thanks for the concise answer, so it would really be either one of the monster turbine headphones or the sennheiser IE80 for a dynamic driver with good sound quality and bass that is not too bright? Dont really want the turbines as they look quite "bling" and also not really a fan of monster as a company + build quality etc... IE80 look good but out of my price range at the moment.... Not sure what other options there are in my price range than the GR07 BE? Maybe I should just keep the Atrios until I can afford the IE80....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> lol thanks for the concise answer, so it would really be either one of the monster turbine headphones or the sennheiser IE80 for a dynamic driver with good sound quality and bass that is not too bright? Dont really want the turbines as they look quite "bling" and also not really a fan of monster as a company + build quality etc... IE80 look good but out of my price range at the moment.... Not sure what other options there are in my price range than the GR07 BE? Maybe I should just keep the Atrios until I can afford the IE80....


 

 Yeah, I would try to find a Miles Davis Tribute. Not sure if they still manufacture it. I haven't heard the IE80 but based on the old IE8 that would also be an option.


----------



## nicholars

Are the differences with the GR07 BE small or are they literally a lot less bassy and a lot brighter? Sorry for all the questions but I would have to buy them from hong kong and would be difficult to return them...
   
  For reference I have had the MG7 for a few days and I am finding that even they give me a bit of tinnitus and sound a bit bright if I listen to them for too long... I quite like bright sounding treble but I cannot listen to it without getting tinnitus and ear pain.... Especially sibilance and around 4-10khz range.


----------



## nicholars

I think I will just avoid the GR07 then because I even find the MG7 a bit too bright so I dont think the GR07 will be a good idea!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> I think I will just avoid the GR07 then because I even find the MG7 a bit too bright so I dont think the GR07 will be a good idea!


 

 Good plan IMO. The GR07 would definitely be a risky try.


----------



## ljokerl

Anyone remember the pic that started my original IEM review thread?
  

   
  Had the chance to take a few photos this week and tried to re-capture the magic:
   

   
   
  I can summarize 3.5 years thusly: much better earphones, much better camera, no improvement in photography skills


----------



## kaixax555

Well as an amateur photographer I think it is still good haha


----------



## dtmhtk




----------



## nicholars

Do you actually buy all the IEM you review and keep them? Or do you borrow them from people?


----------



## kaixax555

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Do you actually buy all the IEM you review and keep them? Or do you borrow them from people?


 
  He buys some, and he borrows some
  Customs are either bought by himself or a gift from Headfi for his excellent reviews
   
  For those he borrowed he will usually credit the person involved


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Do you actually buy all the IEM you review and keep them? Or do you borrow them from people?


 

 I buy some, I borrow some, I get some as samples. These days a good chunk are loans from InnerFidelity. Of course almost all of the Head-Fi FOTM ones are still loaners from other Head-Fiers. 
   
  Edit: what kaixax555 said. And yes, two of my most prized sets were actually gifts from the community here.


----------



## Deviltooth

I'm drooling over the picture of all those customs.  In the past 3 years would you say universal IEMs are closing on the sonic quality of customs or that customs continue to improve at an equal pace?


----------



## Ivabign

I think I know why you haven't reviewed the Earsonics SM1 - you didn't want to describe the type of driver it has - lol.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





deviltooth said:


> I'm drooling over the picture of all those customs.  In the past 3 years would you say universal IEMs are closing on the sonic quality of customs or that customs continue to improve at an equal pace?


 

 I didn't have any customs that far back so I don't think I can give anything near a fair assessment of the market then vs now. There were definitely far fewer high-end universals than there are today and no hyper-expensive ones like the MH334 and K3003. I'm just not sure how much better (if at all) today's customs are compared to what was around then (JH13 was just released IIRC and the UE10 was still popular in 2009).


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Anyone remember the pic that started my original IEM review thread?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  nice pics! (where's the TF10?? ... cough...cough...
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. oh, i'm sorry was that a Taboo in this thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




?)


----------



## nicholars

Have you ever just stopped and thought to yourself one day "hmmm maybe I have enough IEM's now" hahah 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Na keep up the good work it is an amazing resource probably the best on head-fi and I have used it for all my recent IEM purchases, I think you are pretty much spot on with the reviews and I like the way that they are presented.


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Quote: 





ivabign said:


> I think I know why you haven't reviewed the Earsonics SM1 - you didn't want to describe the type of driver it has - lol.


 
  Awesome ! That was quite funny


----------



## Zelda

say, Joker, would the Philips tread deserve a 5.5/5 or 6/5 in Build Quality ? i mean compared to the others that gor 5/5


----------



## TwinQY

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Have you ever just stopped and thought to yourself one day "hmmm maybe I have *enough IEM's* now" hahah


 
  That statement is fallacious in and of itself. One can never have enough


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> nice pics! (where's the TF10?? ... cough...cough...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The it-which-must-not-be-named.
   
  Doesn't belong in the picture with the customs. Unless I drop it in the center just to confuse anyone who stumbles on the pic 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Have you ever just stopped and thought to yourself one day "hmmm maybe I have enough IEM's now" hahah
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I don't pick up headphones because I need more - it's more the pursuit of getting the most sound quality per dollar that's exciting. My favorite IEMs from the past year are probably a few top-tier ones, a few in the $100-150 range, and a bunch below $45. Those are the magic price ranges where the big shifts are happening as far as I am concerned.  
   
  Quote: 





themarkremains said:


> Awesome ! That was quite funny


 
   
  Is there some controversy on the SM1 driver? I always assumed it was a single BA. I believe it was advertised as such on release.
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> say, Joker, would the Philips tread deserve a 5.5/5 or 6/5 in Build Quality ? i mean compared to the others that gor 5/5


 

 Maybe, but it's not like there's lots of other earphones in that price range with a 5/5 so I think that score gets the point across. I am not sure they will actually last longer than something with detachable cables or something like a Dunu Crater, they just look more impressive out of the box. If anything were to get a 5.5/5 it would probably be the FitEar MH334. But again, not necessary, IMO.


----------



## rawrster

I'll gladly take some good iem's off your hands 
   
  The crazy part about that picture is with all those customs how much have you paid for ear impressions and do you get a discount after your 2nd or 3rd or 8th impression


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Is there some controversy on the SM1 driver? I always assumed it was a single BA. I believe it was advertised as such on release.

Yes. Unknown design and origin. Advertised as a dual input single armature with crossover. Confusing terminology. Good vibes thinks its a dual armature single output and not actually a single armature. An " off the shelf" design. 

It was getting a little heated. Apologies to the administrator. We were on the deals thread


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> I'll gladly take some good iem's off your hands
> 
> The crazy part about that picture is with all those customs how much have you paid for ear impressions and do you get a discount after your 2nd or 3rd or 8th impression


 
   
  I do my own impressions now. All it takes is two tubs of impression goo, some dams, and a syringe. Cost per impression is probably $2 or so. I screw up sometimes but it takes maybe 5-10 mins to do one so they're easy to re-do.

 Better pic:
   

   
  Quote: 





themarkremains said:


> Yes. Unknown design and origin. Advertised as a *dual input single armature with crossover*. Confusing terminology. Good vibes thinks its a dual armature single output and not actually a single armature. An " off the shelf" design.
> 
> It was getting a little heated. Apologies to the administrator. We were on the deals thread


 

 Hmm... that sounds very odd to me. Not sure how it would work and even if it did what the benefit would be in crossing over a signal before feeding it to the (single) driver.
   
  Sounds like it might be a case of "lost in translation" like Fischer Audio advertising their SBA-03 as "dual armature" at first before elaborating that it's actually 1 per side / 2 total.


----------



## TheMarkRemains

Hmm... that sounds very odd to me. Not sure how it would work and even if it did what the benefit would be in crossing over a signal before feeding it to the (single) driver.

Sounds like it might be a case of "lost in translation" like Fischer Audio advertising their SBA-03 as "dual armature" at first before elaborating that it's actually 1 per side / 2 total.
[/quote]


My thoughts exactly. I pictured it as a dual voice coil speaker. Why bother with a crossover then ? 

I think you'd enjoy the sound, but it doesn't explain the cryptic description.


----------



## Niyologist

What a coincidence. I started off with the Sansa Fuze and I now have the Cowon J3.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I do my own impressions now. All it takes is two tubs of impression goo, some dams, and a syringe. Cost per impression is probably $2 or so. I screw up sometimes but it takes maybe 5-10 mins to do one so they're easy to re-do.
> 
> Better pic:


 
  you should start a new photography style, "CIEM art"


----------



## kaixax555

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I do my own impressions now. All it takes is two tubs of impression goo, some dams, and a syringe. Cost per impression is probably $2 or so. I screw up sometimes but it takes maybe 5-10 mins to do one so they're easy to re-do.
> 
> Better pic:


 
  This is just beautiful


----------



## dtmhtk

You still need a green and a yellow one to complete the rainbow.


----------



## raymon

Man this is really outstanding work you've done!
   
  However ECCI has intruduced the pr100mkii, pr200mkii last year and pr3002 this year, which are the newer version of pr100/200/300.
   
  Waiting for your review :3


----------



## MDFMK

Big thanks for the JVC FXT90 suggestion Joker - picked them up for $89 on Amazon and they arrived yesterday.  Signature and fit are just what I was looking for!  I can stop looking...until the inevitable upgrade, anyway...


----------



## Ivabign

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I do my own impressions now. All it takes is two tubs of impression goo, some dams, and a syringe. Cost per impression is probably $2 or so. I screw up sometimes but it takes maybe 5-10 mins to do one so they're easy to re-do.
> 
> Better pic:
> 
> ...


 

 Joker,
   
  I see you are in Santa Monica - would you do mine for a 6 pack of imported beer and a Monoprice 9927? (I'm only half-kidding)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> you should start a new photography style, "CIEM art"


 
   
  That's about the extent of my creativity 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. 
   
  Quote: 





dtmhtk said:


> You still need a green and a yellow one to complete the rainbow.


 
   
  Not my favorite colors but I don't really want duplicates so it might happen eventually. 
   
  Quote: 





raymon said:


> Man this is really outstanding work you've done!
> 
> However ECCI has intruduced the pr100mkii, pr200mkii last year and pr3002 this year, which are the newer version of pr100/200/300.
> 
> Waiting for your review :3


 
   
  I was aware that ECCI introduced new version of the PR100 and PR200. I've never heard of the PR3002. No plans to review them at this time. There's so much new stuff coming out every month that it's impossible to keep up.
   
  Quote: 





mdfmk said:


> Big thanks for the JVC FXT90 suggestion Joker - picked them up for $89 on Amazon and they arrived yesterday.  Signature and fit are just what I was looking for!  I can stop looking...until the inevitable upgrade, anyway...


 
   
  Glad to hear that! I enjoyed them quite a bit and think I would be pleased with them as a daily commuter phone. 
   
  Quote: 





ivabign said:


> Joker,
> 
> I see you are in Santa Monica - would you do mine for a 6 pack of imported beer and a Monoprice 9927? (I'm only half-kidding)


 

 I am not a licensed audiologist, so while I am happy to do my own impressions, I don't think it would be safe for me to do someone else's. A few of the hearing professionals I've talked to had horror stories to share about impressions gone wrong. I have a pretty good feel for what I'm doing when it's in my own ear but that's the extent of my confidence.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

joker, which UE double-flanges are compatible with HA-FX40? I saw you mentioned them in the preferred tips field but I don't know which one exactly.
   
  Edit: I think I found them on amazon, are they UE 600vi?


----------



## jrcarboleda

Joker,
   
  there are lots of ear buds that comes with the Vsonic GR07.. I've found the hybrid to be the most comfortable.. but there's a problem in the form of my ears.. my left ear has more inner bone than my right ear which lets me fit the GR07 right earphone easily while I haven't found any comfortable position for my swiveling GR07 for my left ear.. I think because of the greater inner bone, the opening in my left ear is a little smaller than the right.. I'm asking if there is any more ear bud pair that I can use to fit both my ears perfectly? I find the bass on my left ear lacking because of the wrong insertion.. and the noise isolation is also reduced because of that.. I don't have a problem with the body of the earphones just the ear tips.. I hope you understand what I'm saying here.. 

 would you think that comply foam tips would solve my problem here? or is there any other you'd recommend? I wouldn't like to go for customized ear tips because of its swiveling function.. I do think I wouldn't need it that much.. But still I enjoy mo GR07 and think it'd last for a long time..


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


>


 
   
  Is that a perfect log spiral?


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Is that a perfect log spiral?


 

 Must not stare... directly... at it...
  It's too late for me. Go. Save the others.


----------



## Impulse

dtmhtk said:


> You still need a green and a yellow one to complete the rainbow.




It's not a bowl of Lucky Charms...


----------



## Ivabign

Quote: 





> I am not a licensed audiologist, so while I am happy to do my own impressions, I don't think it would be safe for me to do someone else's. A few of the hearing professionals I've talked to had horror stories to share about impressions gone wrong. I have a pretty good feel for what I'm doing when it's in my own ear but that's the extent of my confidence.


 
  No worries, I was half joking - I did find out one nice thing - I spoke to an Heir Audio representative and they offer free impressions if you can find your way to San Diego - in fact, they like to do it because many audiologists are used to hearing aid molds and there is a difference. Of course, you have to be buying an Heir Audio product.
   
  Thanks anyway!


----------



## Amitl

If balanced armature technology is being used in IEM,
  could we be seeing it in other speaker formats such as on-ear or
  bookshelf loudspeakers???


----------



## Bananiq

Ljoker how would you compare RE-400 and DBA02 / Brainwavz B2?
  RE-400 should have better low-end.


----------



## cel4145

Got a particular problem, joker, and I bet you are the best person to know: *need a recommendation for extreme durability.* 

My 13 year old son loves his earphones with his Sansa Clip, but he's hard on them. Uses them every day on the bus to and from school. Broke a set of Soundmagic E10s and some hand me down JVC FXT90s (previously mine, but light usage), both within 6 months. My guess is that the Soundmagics had strain relief problems, and somehow he broke apart the casing around the drivers on the FXT90s. Now he has a pair of Vsang R03s, but I'm wondering how long they will last. (sigh)

I know. I'm working on teaching him to treat them well, but he is a middle-school aged boy. We all remember what that age was like 

What would you recommend with the highest build quality for durability from your reviews? I know you have ratings that talk about some of that, but I thought maybe there might be a few standouts in particular. Some bass emphasis is fine, but not super heavy bass (he likes the ones I've listed above). Could be neutral frequency response phones, too. Say the $30 to $80 range, although I probably would stay under $50 (but sometimes earphones end up sale). He really does like better sound. But if this keeps up, he'll have to live with your Tier 3C earphones. 

Thanks for any recommendations. You could save me a lot of money over the next few years. LOL


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> joker, which UE double-flanges are compatible with HA-FX40? I saw you mentioned them in the preferred tips field but I don't know which one exactly.
> 
> Edit: I think I found them on amazon, are they UE 600vi?


 
   
  I am using a set from an old SuperFi3. I don't think they make this kind of tip anymore. Closest modern equivalent is probably the standard (Meelec, etc) 5mm bi-flange. 
   
  Quote: 





jrcarboleda said:


> Joker,
> 
> there are lots of ear buds that comes with the Vsonic GR07.. I've found the hybrid to be the most comfortable.. but there's a problem in the form of my ears.. my left ear has more inner bone than my right ear which lets me fit the GR07 right earphone easily while I haven't found any comfortable position for my swiveling GR07 for my left ear.. I think because of the greater inner bone, the opening in my left ear is a little smaller than the right.. I'm asking if there is any more ear bud pair that I can use to fit both my ears perfectly? I find the bass on my left ear lacking because of the wrong insertion.. and the noise isolation is also reduced because of that.. I don't have a problem with the body of the earphones just the ear tips.. I hope you understand what I'm saying here..
> 
> would you think that comply foam tips would solve my problem here? or is there any other you'd recommend? I wouldn't like to go for customized ear tips because of its swiveling function.. I do think I wouldn't need it that much.. But still I enjoy mo GR07 and think it'd last for a long time..


 
   
  I am not sure what size Complys the GR07s use (200?) but they should work for you. You may have to use a different-sized tip in each ear, though.
   
  You could also simply try a longer tip, such as the MEElec/Monster triple-flange. Might allow you to position the housing farther outside your ear and angle the canal portion better.
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Is that a perfect log spiral?


 
   
  Nope 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (square superimposed):
   

   
  Quote: 





ivabign said:


> No worries, I was half joking - I did find out one nice thing - I spoke to an Heir Audio representative and they offer free impressions if you can find your way to San Diego - in fact, they like to do it because many audiologists are used to hearing aid molds and there is a difference. Of course, you have to be buying an Heir Audio product.
> 
> Thanks anyway!


 
   
  Probably not worth the gas from LA, though. 
   
  Etymotic does something similar with their audiologist network when you're getting their custom tips. Impressions are included in the price. I think Westone has an audiologist partner program as well.
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> If balanced armature technology is being used in IEM,
> could we be seeing it in other speaker formats such as on-ear or
> bookshelf loudspeakers???


 
   
  As far as I know it's not practical to build a large balanced armature because you lose any efficiency advantage when the armature itself becomes large and heavy. I believe there were some speakers that used armature-like designs a long time ago, which didn't sound too good.
   
  Quote: 





bananiq said:


> Ljoker how would you compare RE-400 and DBA02 / Brainwavz B2?
> RE-400 should have better low-end.


 

 Yeah, I would say the RE-400 is warmer, smoother, and has a bit more bass body while the B2 is clearer, cooler in tone, and has slightly better separation. It would also be harsher/less forgiving and a bit thinner-sounding.


----------



## kaixax555

Phillips Oneil Treads should be able to stand much more abuse
   
  though eventually he has to learn that earphones are sensitive, fragile electromechanical devices


----------



## RollerBall

Bit stuck on a sub-£50 IEM. Want something cable down, decent isolation/microphonics. Not sure on what sound style, but I suppose I just want a balanced, detailed but non-fatiguing sound? I can't stand sound which is bloated or muddy, I equally don't want something too harsh either as I think it will become draining to listen to over time. Genre wise, rock mostly. Bit of electric/acoustic/punk/metal.
   
Looking at E10, E30 or the M2 at the moment. Thoughts?


----------



## Amitl

any thoughts on inearcustom.com?
  do you have to pay a visit to an audiologist for that?


----------



## KainXS

does anyone if the headphone jack on a fx101 is supposed to say china on it


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

I was wondering what i should look for, i was looking into Atrio MG7's for IEM's.
   
  My taste is Bass, Vocals(Priority), Good Treble as well. I listen To Hip-Hop like Kendrick Lamar, 90's old school rap, some rock, and trance/techno.
   
  I currently own the Klipsch S4 and i'm looking for same amount of bass if not better but, i want better vocals. i also looked into Westone however hate the over the ear feeling


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am using a set from an old SuperFi3. I don't think they make this kind of tip anymore. Closest modern equivalent is probably the standard (Meelec, etc) 5mm bi-flange.


 
   
  I took a look at meelectronic website but I couldnt find the 5mm ones, they didnt mention it in the specs... 
   
  Quote: 





kainxs said:


> does anyone if the headphone jack on a fx101 is supposed to say china on it


 
   
  JVC HA-FX40 owner here, the jack does have the word "china" on it


----------



## MDFMK

Quote: 





kainxs said:


> does anyone if the headphone jack on a fx101 is supposed to say china on it


 

 Yeah, I've got one and it says China on the jack.  Picked mine up in a retail store too, so I wouldn't worry about it being the indicator of a fake or anything.


----------



## kaixax555

Quote: 





rollerball said:


> Bit stuck on a sub-£50 IEM. Want something cable down, decent isolation/microphonics. Not sure on what sound style, but I suppose I just want a balanced, detailed but non-fatiguing sound? I can't stand sound which is bloated or muddy, I equally don't want something too harsh either as I think it will become draining to listen to over time. Genre wise, rock mostly. Bit of electric/acoustic/punk/metal.
> 
> Looking at E10, E30 or the M2 at the moment. Thoughts?


 

 Think E30 would be most comfortable for your preferred type of sound


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rollerball said:


> Bit stuck on a sub-£50 IEM. Want something cable down, decent isolation/microphonics. Not sure on what sound style, but I suppose I just want a balanced, detailed but non-fatiguing sound? I can't stand sound which is bloated or muddy, I equally don't want something too harsh either as I think it will become draining to listen to over time. Genre wise, rock mostly. Bit of electric/acoustic/punk/metal.
> 
> Looking at E10, E30 or the M2 at the moment. Thoughts?


 
   
  The E30 is the more balanced of those three but it's worn over-the-ear. Is the UE500 available to you? They've been really cheap here in the US lately: http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Ultimate-Ears-Noise-Isolating-Earphones/dp/B003YKG2XM. Good option for what you're after.
   
  The Brainwavz M1 is also a better option for balanced sound than the M2. Similar isolation and cable noise, just less bassy and more mid-centric, but in a pleasant way.
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> any thoughts on inearcustom.com?
> do you have to pay a visit to an audiologist for that?


 
   
  No experience with them but it looks like they provide a DIY impression kit or give you a $10 discount if you send in your own impressions (from an audiologist, for example).
  
  Quote: 





lost dark soul said:


> I was wondering what i should look for, i was looking into Atrio MG7's for IEM's.
> 
> My taste is Bass, Vocals(Priority), Good Treble as well. I listen To Hip-Hop like Kendrick Lamar, 90's old school rap, some rock, and trance/techno.
> 
> I currently own the Klipsch S4 and i'm looking for same amount of bass if not better but, i want better vocals. i also looked into Westone however hate the over the ear feeling


 
   
  If you're prioritizing vocals you may want to pass on the MG7 - it's better than the S4 in that regard but it still puts more emphasis on bass. I don't think any of the Westone models will have enough bass for you except the W3.

 If vocals are a priority, followed by bass, and the price range is ~MG7 or below, I would go for the Yamaha EPH-100. If you want something a little more v-shaped like the S4, the FXT90 from JVC should do it without giving up much vocal presence.
   
  Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> I took a look at meelectronic website but I couldnt find the 5mm ones, they didnt mention it in the specs...


 

 These are the ones I was thinking of: http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Eartips_p/ts1-df-50-cl.htm


----------



## RollerBall

Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> Think E30 would be most comfortable for your preferred type of sound


 
   
  I was originally leaning towards these but I've heard some negative things about them being worn straight down with regards to isolation, microphonics and comfort. Any thoughts on straight down E30s?
   



ljokerl said:


> The E30 is the more balanced of those three but it's worn over-the-ear. Is the UE500 available to you? They've been really cheap here in the US lately: http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Ultimate-Ears-Noise-Isolating-Earphones/dp/B003YKG2XM. Good option for what you're after.
> 
> The Brainwavz M1 is also a better option for balanced sound than the M2. Similar isolation and cable noise, just less bassy and more mid-centric, but in a pleasant way.


 
  I'll take a look at the M1 and after a quick look I can't seem to source the UE500 easily. I'll have a better look around when I have time later.
   
  I've seen in some places that the E30s can be worn down but at some sacrifice, can you shed any light on wearing them straight down? Unsure if you still have access to them after review.


----------



## Impulse

Kind of ridiculous that right now the mic version of the UE500 is going for 3x the price of the regular version... I was looking at it for a gift.


----------



## yalper

joker, please update these list such as; 281 IEMs compared Philips S1/S2, Sony MH1c added ... etc ...


----------



## Impulse

What's there to update? Pretty sure he always updates it when he actually adds reviews to the first post(s), AFAIK his S1/2 review is only at Inner Fidelity right now... Did he get around to reviewing the MH1C? I looked around but didn't see it posted anywhere...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rollerball said:


> I was originally leaning towards these but I've heard some negative things about them being worn straight down with regards to isolation, microphonics and comfort. Any thoughts on straight down E30s?
> 
> 
> I'll take a look at the M1 and after a quick look I can't seem to source the UE500 easily. I'll have a better look around when I have time later.
> ...


 
   
  I tried but couldn't really wear the E30 cable-down. I find cable-up comfortable myself, and that's what the E30 was designed for anyway.
   
  Quote: 





impulse said:


> Kind of ridiculous that right now the mic version of the UE500 is going for 3x the price of the regular version... I was looking at it for a gift.


 
   
  Glass half empty. You can also say it's ridiculous that the regular one is down to $25 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I am guessing headsets are overtaking normal stereo earphones in popularity/sales. 
   
  Quote: 





yalper said:


> joker, please update these list such as; 281 IEMs compared Philips S1/S2, Sony MH1c added ... etc ...


 
   
  All in due time. I haven't finished the MH1C review yet and the Philips reviews need to be re-written / re-formatted for Head-Fi


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> These are the ones I was thinking of: http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Eartips_p/ts1-df-50-cl.htm


 
   
  Thanks! I assume the other colors (black, grey) are similar as well? Going to grab the grey ones
   
  btw, are you still writing that SHE3580 review?


----------



## kaixax555

Just curious
   
  When will the BA200 and the Phillips SHE3580 be reviewed?


----------



## vwinter

Hey Joker. I'm hoping you can help me out with a general sound question that I can't seem to shake wanting to figure out and have had little luck.

I've heard a few IEM's that have what you've described as a more rounded note presentation and would like to know if you have any idea, from a more technical perspective, why some reproductive systems exhibit this type of response characteristic? Something like gentler slopes or lower peaks/compression of its impulse response in relation to another system and/or to the source?

I don't even know if that makes any sense. I'm pretty much thinking out loud. Anyone, feel free to chime in.


----------



## quartertone

Joker, what SQ rating would/will you give the Philips Fidelios?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> Thanks! I assume the other colors (black, grey) are similar as well? Going to grab the grey ones
> 
> btw, are you still writing that SHE3580 review?


 
   
   
  IMO they are all different. The clear ones are thicker and softer. The black ones are a little smoother (I don't like them as much). The gray ones are a slightly different size (shorter). 
   
   
  I still have to do the SHE3580 review, yes.
   
   
  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> Just curious
> 
> When will the BA200 and the Phillips SHE3580 be reviewed?


 
   
   
  I don't have a BA200. I'll review the SHE3580 but first I have to clear up some of the things I've been loaned, such as the MH1C and TDK MT300.
   
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Hey Joker. I'm hoping you can help me out with a general sound question that I can't seem to shake wanting to figure out and have had little luck.
> 
> I've heard a few IEM's that have what you've described as a more rounded note presentation and would like to know if you have any idea, from a more technical perspective, why some reproductive systems exhibit this type of response characteristic? Something like gentler slopes or lower peaks/compression of its impulse response in relation to another system and/or to the source?
> 
> I don't even know if that makes any sense. I'm pretty much thinking out loud. Anyone, feel free to chime in.


 
   
   
  I wouldn't know where to start with that. I think that's a good question to ask Tyll @ InnerFidelity. 
   
  Certain things definitely produce thicker, softer notes. The Heir 8.A, for example - it's not really a bass monster but it sounds very thick and full, which gives its bass a lot of weight. 
   
   
  Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Joker, what SQ rating would/will you give the Philips Fidelios?


 

 Somewhere in the RE-400 - GR07 range for both.


----------



## quartertone

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Somewhere in the RE-400 - GR07 range for both.


 
   
  OK, so pretty much 9. The S2 no higher than the S1?


----------



## ExpatinJapan

Didnt the UE Triple Fi 10s used to be on this list? I would like to see a Joker review of them also. Thanks Joker!


----------



## truckdriver

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Certain things definitely produce thicker, softer notes. The Heir 8.A, for example - it's not really a bass monster but it sounds very thick and full, which gives its bass a lot of weight.


 
  Hey, so does this mean an Heir 8.A review and score rating is coming? If so, how 'bout a score leak?
   
  I wonder if an earphone will ever cause you to reevaluate the 10 you gave to the Miracle?


----------



## Bina

Wow, you now have 8 new customs? Can you at least tell us all manufacturers please?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





quartertone said:


> OK, so pretty much 9. The S2 no higher than the S1?


 
   
  A tenth at most. I still have to A:B them with a few of my older sets.
   
  Quote: 





expatinjapan said:


> Didnt the UE Triple Fi 10s used to be on this list? I would like to see a Joker review of them also. Thanks Joker!


 
   
  Nope, never got around to it. I still have one, just haven't done a review.
   
  Quote: 





truckdriver said:


> Hey, so does this mean an Heir 8.A review and score rating is coming? If so, how 'bout a score leak?
> 
> I wonder if an earphone will ever cause you to reevaluate the 10 you gave to the Miracle?


 
   
  I've only had it for a week or two so no score yet. It is probable that the Miracle will get knocked off the top, but not necessarily by the Heir.
   
  Quote: 





bina said:


> Wow, you now have 8 new customs? Can you at least tell us all manufacturers please?


 

 Can you guess them?


----------



## nicholars

Those pictures make me want to try out some multi driver BA IEM... I think after reading these reviews my next purchase I might just go straight for some custom fit multi BA IEM... What would be the best for : Cheapest, smooth treble, big bass, good soundstage/imaging? £300 price limit.... How much does it cost to get the moulds done ?


----------



## superayush

Hello all I am a new head fier here

First of all my deepest and heartiest congratulations to joker for his effort and his really helpful and comprehensive iem review really just the thing one would need :,)(could u make one for other electronic items like tv ,phones too ? ;p)

Now onto important stuff.i am having soundmagic es18 currently and looking forward to upgrade
Them now,
I have 2 options
Either I spend around 60$ and get an iem like gr06 or so..
Or I save up a little and go for some high end around 150$ like gr07 eph100 etc

My requirements: not a bass head but definitely nuf bass >= of es18.
Music I listen to dubstep/trance/pop/rock. Sound signature...well sadly I am not audio expert but I would want an iem with Gud clarity, feel ,durable and 1 I can really enjoy listening to long.
Thanks a lot in advance(hopefully I was able to explain well...)


----------



## Bina

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Can you guess them?


 
  Well, clearly one is JHaudio, it seems like two bore system, but not 13, so my guess is JH11?
  Than Alclair,  RSM?
  Than Lime ears, one with wooden faceplate and second clear with lime ears logo. Also both have that strange cable just EU companies uses. Lime ears LE3 in linear and bass tunign, or new 4 driver model?
   
  One in Bronze/brown and magnus cable will be heir 8A
  Dark blue are Hidition 6.
  Clear silicon are Sensaphonics
   
  And last one, blue with clear tip, truly I have no idea, nothing unusual to identify them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Those pictures make me want to try out some multi driver BA IEM... I think after reading these reviews my next purchase I might just go straight for some custom fit multi BA IEM... What would be the best for : Cheapest, smooth treble, big bass, good soundstage/imaging? £300 price limit.... How much does it cost to get the moulds done ?


 
   
  I've only heard one in that price range that fits all those requirements - the 1964-V3. Impression cost varies by audiologist - call around for the best price. Back when I paid to get them done, it was in the $30-40 range for the pair. An ACS network audiologist I visited quoted $100 so it really depends.
   
  Quote: 





superayush said:


> Hello all I am a new head fier here
> 
> First of all my deepest and heartiest congratulations to joker for his effort and his really helpful and comprehensive iem review really just the thing one would need :,)(could u make one for other electronic items like tv ,phones too ? ;p)
> 
> ...


 
   
  Unfortunately I haven't heard the ES18 so I have no idea where the bass quantity and overall SQ level are on that. If think you'll be satisfied with a mid-level earphone and not tempted to upgrade for a while, something like the GR06 would be a good choice, or the Astotec AM-800, which is similar in performance but less forward in the midrange. Again, I don't know if either of these will have more bass than the ES18 but they are quite good overall at $60 or so. The GR07 may not have enough bass but there are other options in that price range, such as the EPH-100 and FXT90, that should have plenty of bass.
   
  Quote: 





bina said:


> Well, clearly one is JHaudio, it seems like two bore system, but not 13, so my guess is JH11?
> Than Alclair,  RSM?
> Than Lime ears, one with wooden faceplate and second clear with lime ears logo. Also both have that strange cable just EU companies uses. Lime ears LE3 in linear and bass tunign, or new 4 driver model?
> 
> ...


 
   
  Color me impressed, especially on the Lime Ears catch 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Both are triple-drivers, just different tunings. 
   
  The blue one with the clear tip has a "W" on the faceplate


----------



## Ivabign

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Probably not worth the gas from LA, though.
> 
> Etymotic does something similar with their audiologist network when you're getting their custom tips. Impressions are included in the price. I think Westone has an audiologist partner program as well.


 
  I got my impressions done today - within a mile of my home - by Heir themselves. Amazing customer service - it helps to be in somewhat of close proximity of San Diego - The dedication of their representatives is admirable. Now the wait begins - no worries - I have plenty of IEM's purchased in the last few months to mess around with until my 8A & 4A's arrive.


----------



## papijoe08

> Unfortunately I haven't heard the ES18 so I have no idea where the bass quantity and overall SQ level are on that. If think you'll be satisfied with a mid-level earphone and not tempted to upgrade for a while, something like the GR06 would be a good choice, or the Astotec AM-800, which is similar in performance but less forward in the midrange. Again, I don't know if either of these will have more bass than the ES18 but they are quite good overall at $60 or so. The GR07 may not have enough bass but there are other options in that price range, such as the EPH-100 and FXT90, that should have plenty of bass.


 
   
  ES18 is quite similar to e10, about 80-90% of it. 
  
  By the way I hope you'll do a review of Soungmagic's ES20 in the future, I think its the best build/sound Soundmagic iem I've seen and tried. Cheers!

 It looks premium for the price its about $25 to $30.


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> If you're prioritizing vocals you may want to pass on the MG7 - it's better than the S4 in that regard but it still puts more emphasis on bass. I don't think any of the Westone models will have enough bass for you except the W3.
> 
> If vocals are a priority, followed by bass, and the price range is ~MG7 or below, I would go for the Yamaha EPH-100. If you want something a little more v-shaped like the S4, the FXT90 from JVC should do it without giving up much vocal presence.


 
   
  Okay thanks but in regard to comparing the S4 and MG7 are the vocals the same? Or is one better than the other?
   
  And my budget can go about to 250$ so if there is anything better than those you mentioned, can i afford it.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ivabign said:


> I got my impressions done today - within a mile of my home - by Heir themselves. Amazing customer service - it helps to be in somewhat of close proximity of San Diego - The dedication of their representatives is admirable. Now the wait begins - no worries - I have plenty of IEM's purchased in the last few months to mess around with until my 8A & 4A's arrive.


 
   
  Congrats, the 8.A is quite good 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I'm sure the 4.A is too. 
    
  Quote:


papijoe08 said:


> ES18 is quite similar to e10, about 80-90% of it.
> 
> By the way I hope you'll do a review of Soungmagic's ES20 in the future, I think its the best build/sound Soundmagic iem I've seen and tried. Cheers!
> 
> It looks premium for the price its about $25 to $30.


 
   
  Never heard of it before. Looks nice, like a Hippo 10 with ViSang cables.
   
  Quote: 





lost dark soul said:


> Okay thanks but in regard to comparing the S4 and MG7 are the vocals the same? Or is one better than the other?
> 
> And my budget can go about to 250$ so if there is anything better than those you mentioned, can i afford it.


 
   
  Like I said, the MG7 is better but perhaps not $100 better. There's not much in the $150-250 price range that I'm aware of to better serve your needs so I don't think you need to spend the extra $$ (though admittedly there's lots I haven't heard).
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *If you're prioritizing vocals you may want to pass on the MG7 - it's better than the S4 in that regard but it still puts more emphasis on bass*. I don't think any of the Westone models will have enough bass for you except the W3.
> 
> If vocals are a priority, followed by bass, and the price range is ~MG7 or below, I would go for the Yamaha EPH-100. If you want something a little more v-shaped like the S4, the FXT90 from JVC should do it without giving up much vocal presence.


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Never heard of it before. Looks nice, like a Hippo 10 with ViSang cables.


 
   
  It's decent-sounding; good, balanced sound for the price, better than the Brainwavz Beta (newer version) and Superlux HD381B definitely, but like most semi-open earphones, lacks isolation. It's not quite hi-fi sound, but then again, the price isn't either. The Phiaton PS210 is still the highest quality semi-open in-ear IMHO, though (but also the most expensive).


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't know where to start with that. I think that's a good question to ask Tyll @ InnerFidelity.
> 
> Certain things definitely produce thicker, softer notes. The Heir 8.A, for example - it's not really a bass monster but it sounds very thick and full, which gives its bass a lot of weight.




Haha, thanks anyway. Is there a good way to contact Tyll that isn't just leaving a comment on post at InnerFidelity?

Sounds like how I hear the ASG-1. Looking forward to the 8.A review 

BTW, did the upcoming and in progress reviews portion on page one disappear?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> It's decent-sounding; good, balanced sound for the price, better than the Brainwavz Beta (newer version) and Superlux HD381B definitely, but like most semi-open earphones, lacks isolation. It's not quite hi-fi sound, but then again, the price isn't either. *The Phiaton PS210 is still the highest quality semi-open in-ear IMHO*, though (but also the most expensive).


 
   
  Not the Philips S1/S2? 
   
  Anyway, the Soundmagics sound promising. 
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Haha, thanks anyway. Is there a good way to contact Tyll that isn't just leaving a comment on post at InnerFidelity?
> 
> Sounds like how I hear the ASG-1. Looking forward to the 8.A review
> 
> ...


 

 IF has a forum where people ask questions. 
   
  Yes, I took off the upcoming reviews because I no longer review everything I get my hands on. There's dozens of earphones I've had to skip due to time constraints, mostly stuff that didn't impress me. They are all sitting in a huge box in case someone asks a questions about them. 
   
  Didn't think anyone looked at that bit anyway 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Bina

Can you make just list of what is sitting there and isnt worth it? I found out, these are clear signs what to avoid


----------



## Radiohead99

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Congrats, the 8.A is quite good
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I just ordered 8.A. I'm curious when you say its quite good, where does it stand in terms sound quality. If UM Miracle is a 10 in SQ, how much would you give a 8.A?


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not the Philips S1/S2? Anyway, the Soundmagics sound promising.


 
   
  Well, I haven't heard the S1/2, so I can't comment. In all likelihood, they've already taken the crown away from the PS210, though. IIRC, you liked the prototypes?


----------



## jam3s121

any good iem's for sport type actitivies with a good bass, mids and isolation presence? Mainly listen to dance music, prog house and electro house. I need something around $30-$60 with a carrying case if possible!! thanks. It doesn't need to be neutrel sounding just not muddly and not lacking clarity.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bina said:


> Can you make just list of what is sitting there and isnt worth it? I found out, these are clear signs what to avoid


 
   
  Good idea, I'll see if I can go through and catalog them all. Two I can recommend steering way clear of right now:
   
  http://www.torque-audio.com/products-headphones/t103z-headphones/
   
  and
   
  http://www.air-buds.com/product/air-buds-ear-buds/
   
   
   

  Quote: 





radiohead99 said:


> I just ordered 8.A. I'm curious when you say its quite good, where does it stand in terms sound quality. If UM Miracle is a 10 in SQ, how much would you give a 8.A?


 
   
  This was asked on the previous page and unfortunately I don't have an answer yet. See here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-278-iems-compared-astrotec-am-800-dx-60-added-03-31-13-p-659/10110#post_9388731
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Well, I haven't heard the S1/2, so I can't comment. In all likelihood, they've already taken the crown away from the PS210, though. IIRC, you liked the prototypes?


 
   
  I liked the final production versions, too. See here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones
   
  Quote: 





jam3s121 said:


> any good iem's for sport type actitivies with a good bass, mids and isolation presence? Mainly listen to dance music, prog house and electro house. I need something around $30-$60 with a carrying case if possible!! thanks. It doesn't need to be neutrel sounding just not muddly and not lacking clarity.


 
   
  MEElectronics M6 if you don't mind the mids being a little recessed. Very cheap and it fits your other requirements, including being a good match for electronic music.


----------



## Radiohead99

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good idea, I'll see if I can go through and catalog them all. Two I can recommend steering way clear of right now:
> 
> http://www.torque-audio.com/products-headphones/t103z-headphones/
> 
> ...


 
  Sorry, missed that post regarding the 8.A review. So I'm guessing its in your review queue. Can't wait to hear your evaluation regarding the 8.A.


----------



## superayush

"Unfortunately I haven't heard the ES18 so I have no idea where the bass quantity and overall SQ level are on that. If think you'll be satisfied with a mid-level earphone and not tempted to upgrade for a while, something like the GR06 would be a good choice, or the Astotec AM-800, which is similar in performance but less forward in the midrange. Again, I don't know if either of these will have more bass than the ES18 but they are quite good overall at $60 or so. The GR07 may not have enough bass but there are other options in that price range, such as the EPH-100 and FXT90, that should have plenty of bass."

Should vsonic gr07 *bass edition* do the trick?  could pls describe me major differences between gr07 and gr06 and if gr07 is worth the extra 100$ or I should go for gr06?pls give me some best iems in 60$ range which will suit me ...


----------



## jam3s121

Thanks for the recommendation joker! Anything else possibly in the $30-$60 range or not really worth spending more then what the m6 costs unless I went much higher?
   
  I was considering just buying some ear hooks/guides and buying something different like the astrotec am80 or sound magic e30, any comment on those vs the meelectronic m6? I like the over the ear style on the m6's but I definitly don't mind spending slightly more and v-moda offers ear hooks for iems for $8 and i need a reason to buy something from them to get my xl pads for my m100's anyway.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





jam3s121 said:


> Thanks for the recommendation joker! Anything else possibly in the $30-$60 range or not really worth spending more then what the m6 costs unless I went much higher?
> 
> I was considering just buying some ear hooks/guides and buying something different like the astrotec am80 or sound magic e30, any comment on those vs the meelectronic m6? I like the over the ear style on the m6's but I definitly don't mind spending slightly more and v-moda offers ear hooks for iems for $8 and i need a reason to buy something from them to get my xl pads for my m100's anyway.


 
  Sorry for butting in, e30 do have free ear hooks and its much better sounding than m6 but the cables aren't suitable for sport activities, your other option that's much better sounding than e30 is gr06 ($50-$60) it also have free ear hooks and its cable is almost as good if not better than m6.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> IF has a forum where people ask questions.
> 
> Yes, I took off the upcoming reviews because I no longer review everything I get my hands on. There's dozens of earphones I've had to skip due to time constraints, mostly stuff that didn't impress me. They are all sitting in a huge box in case someone asks a questions about them.
> 
> Didn't think anyone looked at that bit anyway  .




I didn't even realize they had a forum. I'll give it a shot.

The upcoming reviews part was like finding out what you were gonna get for Christmas, eventually.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





superayush said:


> Should vsonic gr07 *bass edition* do the trick?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The bass edition is only a little bassier than the regular GR07 so not really competition for the EPH-100 in the bass quantity department. My review of the GR06 covers the differences between that and the GR07 in more detail than I can recall now.
   
  Quote: 





jam3s121 said:


> Thanks for the recommendation joker! Anything else possibly in the $30-$60 range or not really worth spending more then what the m6 costs unless I went much higher?
> 
> I was considering just buying some ear hooks/guides and buying something different like the astrotec am80 or sound magic e30, any comment on those vs the meelectronic m6? I like the over the ear style on the m6's but I definitly don't mind spending slightly more and v-moda offers ear hooks for iems for $8 and i need a reason to buy something from them to get my xl pads for my m100's anyway.


 
   
  The problem is that it's hard to say how higher-end units will fare during workouts, especially if they weren't designed for active use. For example, I know that BA drivers don't fare particularly well with moisture so I really wouldn't recommend the AM90 from Astrotec or A151 from MEElec for active use. I tend to think that cheaper is better for something that might fail due to sweat or an accidental cable yank.
   
  The E30 might not be what you're looking for due to its more polite bass and poorer isolation (compared to the M6, at least) but it does sound great. The Astrotec AM-800 and VSonic GR06 sound even better, though again not as bassy as the M6, but I don't know how well they will hold up to gym use. 
   
  I use MEElec earhooks on a lot of my earphones (all of my GR07s and my GR06, for example). I think they were $5 for 3 pairs or something like that. I like them better than most other hooks since they are soft silicone and don't have any annoying seams or ridges. Thinksound earhooks are nice but pricy at $10 or so. Sennheiser and my old V-Moda ones hurt my ears. 
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> The upcoming reviews part was like finding out what you were gonna get for Christmas, eventually.


 

 You just weren't sure which Christmas


----------



## jam3s121

I think I'm gonna go with the soundmagic e30's, i noticed you gave it a higher overall sound/value than the m6. Although I love electro music I don't particularly need earphones or headphones that cater to it, slightly lower bass is okay, I really didn't like the last pair of earphones I used (some jvc $20 pair with huge bass emphasis). Thanks again. I hear you on going cheaper for something that might break easily, I'm pretty careful though and I would honestly just be putting them on in my gym, then putting them in the case and back in the glove box daily so I think I'd be okay. I hear you on not going crazy though. I just bought $310 headphones (m100's) and almost thought of buying the mg7 but someone talked me out of it for just using them for the gym.
   
  is there possibly anything with great isolation and great overall sound for  $20-$40?


----------



## CyrusCR

Sony MDR EX1000 Vs Klipsch X10 ?!?!?!?!?!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?
  please help me too choice
  i love Extra Bass and listen to Pop &Hip hop music


----------



## Gilly87

X10 for sure. If the EX1000 are in your budget you might look at the IE8 or IE80 as well.





cyruscr said:


> Sony MDR EX1000 Vs Klipsch X10 ?!?!?!?!?!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?
> please help me too choice
> i love Extra Bass and listen to Pop &Hip hop music


----------



## Amitl

hey i just got my pair of MEE's A161P (which i won!) 
  i dont have too many other IEM's to compare them with,
  but i read a lot about the "not-so-excellent" cable,
  and i wanted to say that yes, it might be stringy with a tendency to tangle up,
  BUT it is much less noisy then i expected.
  it is less prone to microphonics than the id America Spark's cable.
  perhaps even a bit less prone to noise than the Klipsch S4.
  also it is very comfortable to wear cable up, without even using cable guides,
  unlike the Sparks which i find requiring the guides to stay over the ear,
  and the S4 which i simply can't use cable-up.
  it's interesting that the mic on the right cable seem to swallow a bit of
  noise traveling through the cable, reducing microphonics from the right ear-piece.
  the sound of these IEMs is wonderful!


----------



## jhii07

Coming from SoundMagic E30 which one will suit me best VSonic GR06 or VC02?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## VanillaSound

Dang, it's been over a year since I came to this forum and Joker's still updating this and helping out other noobies like me. Once I get out of college and get a decent paying job I'll be sure to donate or send you a new product or something.
   
  Anyways, Joker, I need your help once again . My Brainwavz M2 broke so I'm looking for a new pair of IEM's. I was thinking of the VSonic GR06 or the Rock-it R-30's.. can't really decide. Or should I just pay more and get the R-50's? I think that's the most expensive pair I can afford atm . Does the R-50 have any noteable competitors in the same price range? I saw the comparisons you had with the earphones but they weren't in the same price range so I'm not really sure? Joker, what do you recommend?
   
  EDIT: Actually, would it better to get Gr06/R-30/VC02 + an external headphone amplifier? Or would the R-50's sound better than that?


----------



## Impulse

The answer to your last question probably hinges on what you're actually using as a source right now, might wanna add that


----------



## NIVEBL

How about F111?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jam3s121 said:


> I think I'm gonna go with the soundmagic e30's, i noticed you gave it a higher overall sound/value than the m6. Although I love electro music I don't particularly need earphones or headphones that cater to it, slightly lower bass is okay, I really didn't like the last pair of earphones I used (some jvc $20 pair with huge bass emphasis). Thanks again. I hear you on going cheaper for something that might break easily, I'm pretty careful though and I would honestly just be putting them on in my gym, then putting them in the case and back in the glove box daily so I think I'd be okay. I hear you on not going crazy though. I just bought $310 headphones (m100's) and almost thought of buying the mg7 but someone talked me out of it for just using them for the gym.
> 
> is there possibly anything with great isolation and great overall sound for  $20-$40?


 
   
  Well, even the E10 isolates (a little) better than the E30 IMO. Has a bit more bass, too. For more isolation than that there's also the Dunu Trident, though its metal shells might be a little heavy for gym use. Can't remember if it came with cable guides or not but aftermarket ones should fit.
   
  Quote: 





cyruscr said:


> Sony MDR EX1000 Vs Klipsch X10 ?!?!?!?!?!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?
> please help me too choice
> i love Extra Bass and listen to Pop &Hip hop music


 
   
  The EX1000 doesn't really have "extra bass". Between those two I'd go for the X10. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> hey i just got my pair of MEE's A161P (which i won!)
> i dont have too many other IEM's to compare them with,
> but i read a lot about the "not-so-excellent" cable,
> and i wanted to say that yes, it might be stringy with a tendency to tangle up,
> ...


 
   
  Yeah the MEE cable is a little less noisy than the more rubbery one on the Fischer SBA-03 equivalent. Congrats on your first (?) accurate IEM! 
   
   Quote:


jhii07 said:


> Coming from SoundMagic E30 which one will suit me best VSonic GR06 or VC02?
> 
> Thanks!


 
   
  Depends on what you're looking for. Neither sounds like the E30, if that's what you want. The GR06 has a larger bump in the bass and hotter treble. The VC02 has less bass but still more treble (although it's a little smoother than the GR06). 
   
  Quote: 





vanillasound said:


> Dang, it's been over a year since I came to this forum and Joker's still updating this and helping out other noobies like me. Once I get out of college and get a decent paying job I'll be sure to donate or send you a new product or something.
> 
> Anyways, Joker, I need your help once again . My Brainwavz M2 broke so I'm looking for a new pair of IEM's. I was thinking of the VSonic GR06 or the Rock-it R-30's.. can't really decide. Or should I just pay more and get the R-50's? I think that's the most expensive pair I can afford atm . Does the R-50 have any noteable competitors in the same price range? I saw the comparisons you had with the earphones but they weren't in the same price range so I'm not really sure? Joker, what do you recommend?
> 
> EDIT: Actually, would it better to get Gr06/R-30/VC02 + an external headphone amplifier? Or would the R-50's sound better than that?


 

 The R-50 sounds way different than the M2, GR06, and even R-30. It does have some competitors - the Brainwavz B2, Astotec AX7. new VSonic VC1000. There's also the HiFiMan RE-400, Philips Fidelio S1, etc. at a slightly lower price point. But, first you have to establish whether its sound is what you want - it's an accuracy-oriented earphone with less bass and a brighter sound than the other ones you're looking at. If you're looking to stay relatively close to the M2, the R-50 signature it won't do at all. 
   
  Even if you've already decided to try something more accurate and it's going to be your first armature earphone it might be too much of a shock initially. It may be better to start with something smoother and warmer, such as the MEElec A161P or R-30.
   
  And, if you have a decent source I would say better earphone >>> cheaper earphone + amp. 
   
   
  Edit:
  Quote: 





nivebl said:


> How about F111?


 

 No clue, never heard it.


----------



## laowai

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For more isolation than that there's also the Dunu Trident, though its metal shells might be a little heavy for gym use. Can't remember if it came *with cable guides* or not but aftermarket ones should fit.


 
  Do you mean earhooks? No, Dunu Trident has no earhooks by default. Nethertheless, I wear them over the ear, with no cable guides.
  And yes, they stay sturdy in my ears while moving ... but I don't practice such intense sports as basketball


----------



## jhii07

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Depends on what you're looking for. Neither sounds like the E30, if that's what you want. The GR06 has a larger bump in the bass and hotter treble. The VC02 has less bass but still more treble (although it's a little smoother than the GR06).


 
  Thank you for the reply. One last question. Which is more durable?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





laowai said:


> Do you mean earhooks? No, Dunu Trident has no earhooks by default. Nethertheless, I wear them over the ear, with no cable guides.
> And yes, they stay sturdy in my ears while moving ... but I don't practice such intense sports as basketball


 
   
  Ear hooks, cable guides, whatever you want to call them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. It stays in my ears too but it's heavy so it seems like it might slip out if I go for a run or something. 
   
  Quote: 





jhii07 said:


> Thank you for the reply. One last question. Which is more durable?


 

 Hard to say. The GR06 seems more solidly built but the VC02 has replaceable cables. My gut feeling is it would still be the GR06.


----------



## Impulse

Wouldn't removable cables be counter productive (as far as durability) for something like running? Obviously for daily use that would be an advantage but unless you're running thru the woods it just seems like another point of failure in that context (as far as moisture/sweat, etc.). I'm just curious, I've never had an IEM with removable cables...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





impulse said:


> Wouldn't removable cables be counter productive (as far as durability) for something like running? Obviously for daily use that would be an advantage but unless you're running thru the woods it just seems like another point of failure in that context (as far as moisture/sweat, etc.). I'm just curious, I've never had an IEM with removable cables...


 

 Yeah, I wouldn't recommend it for running. I still just use my an M6. Used to be an H2O Audio unit but it disintegrated (literally) from exposure to sweat.


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Like I said, the MG7 is better but perhaps not $100 better. There's not much in the $150-250 price range that I'm aware of to better serve your needs so I don't think you need to spend the extra $$ (though admittedly there's lots I haven't heard).


 
  Alrighty then what would you recommend for me then in a higher tier bracket i.e say $350.00 that would sound much better than Klipsch S4 or even the Atrio MG7's at bass, or about the same. i like the S4 bass but i think the MG7 without a doubt will blow it away, but with vocals i think like you said something in a higher money bracket is all.


----------



## rawrster

That sounds like a W3


----------



## Jodiuh

What a great thread!

I recently broke/lost a pair of Triple.Fi 10's and Grados 325i's. I loved both of these for their strengths.

Would I be happy with some Westone W4's?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rawrster said:


> That sounds like a W3


 
   
  Agreed, or maybe the JVC FX700 if I isolation is not important, though I'm still not sure spending $350 is necessary to upgrade from the S4 with good bass and better vocals. The EPH-100 does that for $150.
   
  Quote: 





jodiuh said:


> What a great thread!
> 
> I recently broke/lost a pair of Triple.Fi 10's and Grados 325i's. I loved both of these for their strengths.
> 
> Would I be happy with some Westone W4's?


 

 If you can also love them for their strengths... 
   
   
  The W4 is darker than both of your sets and generally a little more mid-centric, especially next to the v-shaped TF10s. If you're looking for something between the TF10 and Grado signature I think the UE900 might be a better option.


----------



## Jodiuh

vshaped...perfect description of the tf10 and exactly what I do not want. So darker ~ more low end?

I listen to mostly pop, worship, trance, classical, r&b, and rock.

I did love my grados tho. Ill look into the ue900, thx!


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Agreed, or maybe the JVC FX700 if I isolation is not important, though I'm still not sure spending $350 is necessary to upgrade from the S4 with good bass and better vocals. The EPH-100 does that for $150.


 
   
  Not that it matters to your point, but fwiw the FX700 has been going for around $270 shipped from Japan for a little while now. I'd say thats a win win.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Audio-Technica CKM500
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C56) Audio-Technica ATH-CKM500*
> 
> 
> Added May 2013
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





jodiuh said:


> vshaped...perfect description of the tf10 and exactly what I do not want. So darker ~ more low end?
> 
> I listen to mostly pop, worship, trance, classical, r&b, and rock.
> 
> I did love my grados tho. Ill look into the ue900, thx!


 
   
  Typically less treble more so than more bass. The UE900 is pretty well-balanced with linear and extended bass. If you like a little more excitement something like the Sony EX1000 (brighter) or JVC FX700 (bassier) would do that for you.
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Not that it matters to your point, but fwiw the FX700 has been going for around $270 shipped from Japan for a little while now. I'd say thats a win win.


 
   
  Indeed


----------



## jhii07

[size=medium] Still undecided on what to get between GR06 and VC02. Which one of these is closer to GR07?[/size]


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jhii07 said:


> [size=medium] Still undecided on what to get between GR06 and VC02. Which one of these is closer to GR07?[/size]


 

 Probably the GR06


----------



## garcsa

Vsonic VC02. 
   
  You were right Joker: "It utilizes a conventional 2-pin socket, though it detaches a little more easily than I’d have liked" 
   
Yesterday lost both drivers... 





Ok, there was few beers in me ... and it was a good party... 




   
  Almost new IEM cable, somebody?


----------



## jhii07

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Probably the GR06


 
  Thank you! I'll be getting gr06 then 
  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> Vsonic VC02.
> 
> You were right Joker: "It utilizes a conventional 2-pin socket, though it detaches a little more easily than I’d have liked"
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks that help me decide on what to get


----------



## garcsa

However the VC02 is a great IEM (ordered the another pair , before few minutes) ! 
  If you do not intend to replace the cable, one little drop of super glue will help.


----------



## quartertone

I think the Astrotec AM-800 are much better than the rating here suggests - see the discovery thread for more details.


----------



## amzies01

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> However the VC02 is a great IEM (ordered the another pair , before few minutes) !
> If you do not intend to replace the cable, one little drop of super glue will help.


 
  That's what I did. And since replacement/after-market cables probably cost more than the IEM itself, it made more sense. I don't worry about losing drivers anymore.


----------



## quartertone

Same here. The detachable cables are a pointless gimmick in this case, as they come off too easily and it's probably cheaper to buy a new IEM. Plus they aren't even sellling spare cables yet!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> Vsonic VC02.
> 
> You were right Joker: "It utilizes a conventional 2-pin socket, though it detaches a little more easily than I’d have liked"
> 
> ...


 
   
  Yeah other cables work though not as well because they don't have the exit angle of the VSonic cables. My Heir Magnus-1 cable is a complete disaster because it adds like 1/2 inch to the length of the housings. I am still holding out hope for replacements directly from VSonic or maybe even an optional mic upgrade cable.
   
   
  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> However the VC02 is a great IEM (ordered the another pair , before few minutes) !
> If you do not intend to replace the cable, one little drop of super glue will help.


 
   
  Well, that's definitely one solution...


----------



## papijoe08

I think there's another budget iem that could beat gr06 and vc02 in the future from vsonic the newly released vsd1. It just cost around $32 and the vsonic people are saying that it have the closest sound sig to gr07 among its budget iems.  It looks sturdier than vc02 and have free colorful foamies.  I'm looking forward for your review with this item in the near future.


----------



## zzffnn

Thanks joker for your review. Re ATH-CKM500, I can wear them over my ears comfortably, although I have to wear left driver in right ear and right driver in left ear with help of a rubber band as cable cinch. I prefer deeper insertion using Meelectornics long double flanges (which are a bit longer than stock tips). In my configuration, the CKM500s have a good soundstage depth.

I would love to see CKM500's FR curve at Innerfidelity. Is it almost flat, a slight V, or a slight downward slope (like Philips Fidelio S1/S2)? Joker, do you prefer S1 over CKM500s (please kindly comment on pros and cons of each)? Thanks again.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





papijoe08 said:


> I think there's another budget iem that could beat gr06 and vc02 in the future from vsonic the newly released vsd1. It just cost around $32 and the vsonic people are saying that it have the closest sound sig to gr07 among its budget iems.  It looks sturdier than vc02 and have free colorful foamies.  I'm looking forward for your review with this item in the near future.


 
   
   
  Can't tell what the housing shape looks like at all. RE262? 
   
  Sounds like another interesting release. If only there were 36 hours to a day...
   
  Quote: 





zzffnn said:


> Thanks joker for your review. Re ATH-CKM500, I can wear them over my ears comfortably, although I have to wear left driver in right ear and right driver in left ear with help of a rubber band as cable cinch. I prefer deeper insertion using Meelectornics long double flanges (which are a bit longer than stock tips). In my configuration, the CKM500s have a good soundstage depth.
> 
> I would love to see CKM500's FR curve at Innerfidelity. Is it almost flat, a slight V, or a slight downward slope (like Philips Fidelio S1/S2)? Joker, do you prefer S1 over CKM500s (please kindly comment on pros and cons of each)? Thanks again.


 

 Swapping channels is a no no for me. FR curve below. It has more bass boost than I expected.
   
  I prefer the S1 by a pretty big margin. Bass is much more accurate and as a result sounds tighter, faster, and cleaner. The midrange is entirely clean of bass bleed with the Philips and the top end is a little smoother as well. The CKM500 isn't harsh or sibilant per se but there's an edginess to its treble I don't really like.


----------



## papijoe08

Here's a clearer view of the vsd1 
   
  Unfortunately we only have 24 hours a day and sleep is eating most of our time. LOL


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





papijoe08 said:


> Here's a clearer view of the vsd1


 
   
  That's interesting, looks a bit like one of the Audiofly models. Those types of housings don't always work super well for me but we'll see.


----------



## casanova

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> However the VC02 is a great IEM (ordered the another pair , before few minutes) !
> If you do not intend to replace the cable, one little drop of super glue will help.


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, that's definitely one solution...


 
   
  My sister always complained to me that, for a frequent of times, the housing of Vsonic VC02 did stay in her ears when she tried to pull them out.
  The pins from the cable to the house of this iems don't seem to attach strongly to the house.
  Hopefully, this would help sort this issue out.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's interesting, looks a bit like one of the Audiofly models. Those types of housings don't always work super well for me but we'll see.


 

 Hopefully that design would work with you.


----------



## tseliottt

Have you ever reviewed the Sony 7550? You make a few comparisons in reviews, but there's no actual entry


----------



## gtmaster303

Can you review the Monoprice 9396?
  Wondering how they stack up to the value king 8320s...
  Especially considering they should be much easier to fit
   
  Looking to get another pair of headphones from monoprice, but i'm not sure if should get the white 8320s or the 9396


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





casanova said:


> My sister always complained to me that, for a frequent of times, the housing of Vsonic VC02 did stay in her ears when she tried to pull them out.
> The pins from the cable to the house of this iems don't seem to attach strongly to the house.
> Hopefully, this would help sort this issue out.


 
   
  It might help to not pull them out of the ear by the cable (which actually you shouldn't do with any IEMs, even fixed-cable ones).
    
  Quote:


tseliottt said:


> Have you ever reviewed the Sony 7550? You make a few comparisons in reviews, but there's no actual entry


 
   
  Not yet, just haven't gotten around to writing it.
   
  Quote: 





gtmaster303 said:


> Can you review the Monoprice 9396?
> Wondering how they stack up to the value king 8320s...
> Especially considering they should be much easier to fit
> 
> Looking to get another pair of headphones from monoprice, but i'm not sure if should get the white 8320s or the 9396


 

 I've never heard of the 9396. I have the Monoprice cans (8323?) but no plans to review any more of their IEMs at this time.


----------



## superayush

Joker which iem reviews are gonna come up in coming days? Couldn't find in 001 conclusions sections of ur op


----------



## nicholars

I bought some IE8 second hand, I am not sure about whether they are real or fake.... They have removable cable, working bass dials and look good quality etc. I think they are probably real from this, although they have straight L/R lettering and the red chip is quite hard to see on right cable...
   
  Anyway my point is that these seem to have a good soundstage and lower mids but where is this amazing bass that "blows your head off"? Compared to the Atrio these have not much sub bass in songs and the bass does not seem very present? Is this the sound signature of these headphones or is there something wrong? They seem to have really good lower mids and some upper bass but there is not very much of it even with full bass mode and these is not a lot of sub bass either.


----------



## countolaf

Hey Ljoker, I saw Tyll's measurements of Thermaltake Isurus and was astounded how it measured so well. But obviously, frequency response is not everything. My question is, why is Thermaltake Isurus not reviewed here and is there a possibility that they will be reviewed here if it indeed sounds good as how its measured?
   
  Also, does this headphone have multiple models? Because I searched it in Amazon and there seems to be plenty of 'Thermaltake Isurus' or is it just mostly a difference in color?


----------



## Amitl

Joker...do you really use the MEElec M6 for running,
  when you have all those custom in ears?


----------



## casanova

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It might help to not pull them out of the ear by the cable (which actually you shouldn't do with any IEMs, even fixed-cable ones).


 
   
   
  This is an good advice, maybe she pulls the cable not the housing.
 I'll forward these words to her.
 Thank you.


----------



## pukka

ljokerl, and any other with wide experience with IEMs, I would like to ask for some orientation:
   
  After "discovering" the Vsonic GR06 thanks to this thread, I started to have the "itch" to upgrade, so the quest began...
   
  I don't use amps, the IEMs should sound fine with a naked iphone, ipad or ipod.
   
  I love the GR06 for their superb qualities in terms of bass and  music enjoyment, I hate analitic IEMs and these made me wanting to keep listening to all my music. They're not precise, but very fun and enjoyable.
   
  They can of course be better in terms of detail, precision, "cleanliness" and imaging.
   
  I tried the rockit sound R-50, not my cup of tea: inexistent bass, tooo analitic, too fast (for me)
   
  I got the GR07 BE right now. After letting them 300 hours of burn-in, I'm starting to bear with their initial unbearable, harsh, brain-grating sibilances.
   
  They are a significant improvement in terms of detail, imaging, speed (w/o being tooo fast), and overall "balance".
   
  My ideal sound signature: IEMs that make most music (Rock, Pop, Indie) sound powerful, highly dynamic and enjoyable while keeping detail.
   
  Most of my preferred songs belongs to BritRockPop genre (Travis, Richard Ashcroft, Skunk Anansie, Coldplay,  Stereophonics, etc...) and are exquisitely produced and mixed,  but my music tastes are rather wide, from Heavy/Nu metal, Grunge to Jack Johnsson,  Reggae, etc. (almost anything but Classical) and some groups (Red Hot Chili Peppers, Metallica)  Mids in their mixes in combination with IEMs that portray  mids in a "rough" manner render their music unlistenable for me, when the feeling I'm looking for is wanting to keep on listening and listening to more and more music. 
   
  My ideal IEM: powerful, defined bass and subbass, detailed, slightly laidback mids, and silky, lusty smoooth airy highs, while keeping resolution: instrument timbre, nuances, imaging etc.
   
  Though I prefer to trade enjoyability to precision anytime. I'm not working with or analyzing the sound, but ENJOYING.
   
  That's what made me think about the hybrid IEMs combo, guess the point is getting that bass/sub bass presence with a meaty dynamic driver while letting the precision and silkyness in mids/highs to BAs??? 
   
  I'm aware of the upcoming release of the V7007. Do you think guys these could be just what I'm looking for?
   
  Additionally, I always have problems to get a good fit with universals. One ear cavity is smaller than the other, the earcanal seems to go in a upright direction making fitting universals rather tricky, etc... So the initial un-thinkable option of getting CIEMs started to wander through my mind, as the IEMs/iphone combo has been unbeatable for me, providing me the option to enjoy music ANYWERE, so I will definitely recover the investment.
   
  I wonder how would the new Unique Melody 3DD fit my tastes, though they're all dynamic, don't know if dynamic mids/highs translate to roughness/harsh sound, or simply could not be as detailed and fast as BAs, which could be a plus for me. 
   
  ljokerl after reading tons of your reviews and comparisons I think you hit the nail in every one I have owned, so your opinion/guidance is very appreciated!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





superayush said:


> Joker which iem reviews are gonna come up in coming days? Couldn't find in 001 conclusions sections of ur op


 
   
  I took it off because I no longer review everything I get my hands on. It's going to be something like this (no particular order):
   
  VSonic GR07BE and R02 Silver
  UE600
  Dunu Landmine and Detonator
  Sony MH1C
  TDK MT300
  Bunch of customs
  Philips Fidelio S1/S2
  Sennheiser IE 800
  Philips SHE3580
   
  and dozens of maybes...
   
   
  Quote: 





nicholars said:


> I bought some IE8 second hand, I am not sure about whether they are real or fake.... They have removable cable, working bass dials and look good quality etc. I think they are probably real from this, although they have straight L/R lettering and the red chip is quite hard to see on right cable...
> 
> Anyway my point is that these seem to have a good soundstage and lower mids but where is this amazing bass that "blows your head off"? Compared to the Atrio these have not much sub bass in songs and the bass does not seem very present? Is this the sound signature of these headphones or is there something wrong? They seem to have really good lower mids and some upper bass but there is not very much of it even with full bass mode and these is not a lot of sub bass either.


 
   
  I'm pretty sure the consensus is that the IE8 has plenty of bass, mine certainly did. Not Atrio level sub-bass but plenty of mid-bass and overall way more than neutral. I'm not an expert on fake Sennheiser products so I can't be of much help there.
   
  Quote: 





countolaf said:


> Hey Ljoker, I saw Tyll's measurements of Thermaltake Isurus and was astounded how it measured so well. But obviously, frequency response is not everything. My question is, why is Thermaltake Isurus not reviewed here and is there a possibility that they will be reviewed here if it indeed sounds good as how its measured?
> 
> Also, does this headphone have multiple models? Because I searched it in Amazon and there seems to be plenty of 'Thermaltake Isurus' or is it just mostly a difference in color?


 
   
  It's a little too harsh for me but overall it sounds good. I just haven't had time to review it. I'm pretty sure it comes in several colors. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Joker...do you really use the MEElec M6 for running,
> when you have all those custom in ears?


 
   
  Balanced armatures don't like moisture and I'd rather not kill one of my custom in-ears. I would use the Kozee X1 but it doesn't have enough bass to really get the blood pumping. 
   
  Quote: 





pukka said:


> ljokerl, and any other with wide experience with IEMs, I would like to ask for some orientation:
> 
> After "discovering" the Vsonic GR06 thanks to this thread, I started to have the "itch" to upgrade, so the quest began...
> 
> ...


 
   
  I think it's hard to say anything about the V7007 at this point. My experience with hybrids so far has been that they either have somewhat recessed treble (for example with Super.Fi 5EB and K3003 +Bass tuning) or a slightly v-shaped signature (K3003 +Treble or Reference setting, or Ultrasone IQ). I haven't heard anything from T-Peos at this point. There are BA-based customs that fit your requirements but the ones I've heard run a pretty penny ($700+). You would love the Heir 8.A, for example.
   
  You don't have to spend that much to upgrade from the GR06 per se, but if you will always be wondering "what if", the investment might be worth it considering you've pretty much figured out what you want already.


----------



## nicholars

Maybe I just need to accept I am a basshead... I like everything else just as much but without good bass everything sounds thin to me.


----------



## superayush

Vsonic gr06 vs sony mdr v6 ...(basically at around 60$ which will give me better sound quality for price over the ear or in ear...If over the ear pls give me names of some good over the ear headphones around 60$)


----------



## pukka

Quote: 





> I think it's hard to say anything about the V7007 at this point. My experience with hybrids so far has been that they either have somewhat recessed treble (for example with Super.Fi 5EB and K3003 +Bass tuning) or a slightly v-shaped signature (K3003 +Treble or Reference setting, or Ultrasone IQ). I haven't heard anything from T-Peos at this point. There are BA-based customs that fit your requirements but the ones I've heard run a pretty penny ($700+). You would love the Heir 8.A, for example.
> 
> You don't have to spend that much to upgrade from the GR06 per se, but if you will always be wondering "what if", the investment might be worth it considering you've pretty much figured out what you want already.


 
   
  Problem with "trying" those (K3003, Ultrasone IQ, Super.Fi 5EB, Heir 8.A, etc its all reach the $1000 mark, while CIEMs are around $600-700!
   
  what about $300-$600 range? UE-900 maybe?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





superayush said:


> Vsonic gr06 vs sony mdr v6 ...(basically at around 60$ which will give me better sound quality for price over the ear or in ear...If over the ear pls give me names of some good over the ear headphones around 60$)


 
   
  The best will always depend on your preferred sound signature and desired application. I prefer the GR06 to the MDR-V6 but I also dislike comparing headphones and IEMs. Headphones have their purpose but for on-the-go use I have been favoring IEMs for a very long time now. 
   
  Quote: 





pukka said:


> Problem with "trying" those (K3003, Ultrasone IQ, Super.Fi 5EB, Heir 8.A, etc its all reach the $1000 mark, while CIEMs are around $600-700!
> 
> what about $300-$600 range? UE-900 maybe?


 

 I didn't recommend trying them - just relaying my experience with Hybrid designs and the fact that they may not automatically be what you are looking for. Also, the Super.Fi5 EB is discontinued (and was only $200 or so when it was in production) and the 8.A is very much a CIEM. 
   
  The UE900 may not have enough bass for you but otherwise is pretty good. Treble is smoother than the GR07 for sure.


----------



## ljokerl

An article featuring 9 of my CIEM reviews has been added on InnerFidelity here.
   
  A few are recycled from this thread - namely the UM Miracle and Spiral Ears SE 3-way Reference, but 7 are new:

 -Westone ES5
  -Sensaphonics 3MAX
  -JHAudio JH13 Pro FreqPhase
  -Heir Audio 8.A
  -Lime Ears LE3 and LE3B
  -Hidition NT 6
   
  They will be added to this thread over time as well. 
   
   
  Quote: 





superayush said:


> Joker which iem reviews are gonna come up in coming days? Couldn't find in 001 conclusions sections of ur op


 
   
   
   
  Just put the "upcoming reviews" section back and also added a few earphones (off the top of my head) that I have here but didn't find interesting enough to review right below. Not all of them are downright terrible - mostly just lackluster.


----------



## kingice10

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> An article featuring 9 of my CIEM reviews has been added on InnerFidelity here.
> 
> A few are recycled from this thread - namely the UM Miracle and Spiral Ears SE 3-way Reference, but 7 are new:
> 
> ...


 






 Thank you ljokerl for adding the CIEMs!


----------



## tseliottt

Review the 7550s! Or can you just give me your quick impression on them? Especially compared to Etymotic ER4s.


----------



## Amitl

if i put the volume just a bit up with my MEElec A161P i get
  some pretty evident distortion\grain... i mean, its the kind of distortion i remember
  from cheap not-in-ear earbuds that appears when the volume gets higher...
  my A161P is connected to my Samsung Galaxy S1 and i do have
  the sound-chip hack thing installed, but it doesnt help much
  is this something you have to get used to?
  i do love the sound overall though


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> An article featuring 9 of my CIEM reviews has been added on InnerFidelity here.
> 
> A few are recycled from this thread - namely the UM Miracle and Spiral Ears SE 3-way Reference, but 7 are new:
> 
> ...




Great write-up. It was interesting to see the different thought patterns and writing styles describing the same things from varying experienced perspectives.

Also, I feel responsible for mentioning the upcoming reviews section and the ensuing carnage =/
But I'm glad it's back.


----------



## Mimouille

Nice global review you guys did. Of course some are missing but it is impossible to get them all and it gives a great alternative to Joe s thread. I have the Miracles and se5 and I am considering Fitear and NT6 pro. Do you think the jh13 is worth it having the Miracles or are they too close sounding ?
Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kingice10 said:


> Thank you ljokerl for adding the CIEMs!


 
   
  That was a fun one to write
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> Review the 7550s! Or can you just give me your quick impression on them? Especially compared to Etymotic ER4s.


 
   
  They are pretty similar to the EX600/EX1000 minus some of the treble presence. Warmer and more punchy than an ER4, and more spacious as well. Really depends on whether you want something a little more accurate (ER4) or a little more spacious and relaxed, with good mids (7550).
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> if i put the volume just a bit up with my MEElec A161P i get
> some pretty evident distortion\grain... i mean, its the kind of distortion i remember
> from cheap not-in-ear earbuds that appears when the volume gets higher...
> my A161P is connected to my Samsung Galaxy S1 and i do have
> ...


 
   
  Not familiar with the Galaxy as a source but the A161P doesn't really distort except at max volume. There is some grain in the treble, but it's not really noticeable unless you're looking for it. 
   
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Great write-up. It was interesting to see the different thought patterns and writing styles describing the same things from varying experienced perspectives.
> 
> Also, I feel responsible for mentioning the upcoming reviews section and the ensuing carnage =/
> But I'm glad it's back.


 
   
  Yeah, I guess I should have re-organized it instead of removing it in the first place. 
   
  Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Nice global review you guys did. Of course some are missing but it is impossible to get them all and it gives a great alternative to Joe s thread. I have the Miracles and se5 and I am considering Fitear and NT6 pro. Do you think the jh13 is worth it having the Miracles or are they too close sounding ?
> Thanks


 

 Not too close - compared to the Miracle the JH13 has more midrange presence (and a more forward presentation), better clarity, and more mid-bass by a few dB. The JH13 is more punchy and impactful but also a little more resolving overall. I suppose it could be called more analytical when it comes to how it presents music. The Miracle’s treble seemed a touch smoother to me but they are similar in presence and extension at the top.


----------



## insidedrive

Hello Joker, what are your initial impressions of the Sony MH1C? Thanks!


----------



## nicholars

Does this sound correct to you?
   
  Shure SE215 vs Atrio MG7 vs Sennheiser IE8
   
  Shure SE215 has slightly more bass and impact than IE8 whereas atrio has a lot more than both.
   
  Sennheiser IE8 is slightly brighter and less forgiving of bad recordings compared to the Shures but smoother than the Atrios. Treble is very good with good recordings but not with worse / lower bitrate on the IE8.
   
  I wonder why the IE8 is said to have massive bass when to me it sounds like  less bass than the Shures and Atrio. I must say that overall I am impressed with the IE8 sound, it is nicely balanced and the soundstage / imaging are excellent, Just seems like they don't have as much bass as people say...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Hello Joker, what are your initial impressions of the Sony MH1C? Thanks!


 
   
  It's pretty good. Good bass depth and very smooth overall. Reminds me of a bassier Shure SE215. Bass is not as tight as I would like and there's a bit too much of it but for $30 there's really no reason to complain.
   
  Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Does this sound correct to you?
> 
> Shure SE215 vs Atrio MG7 vs Sennheiser IE8
> 
> ...


 

 I never got the chance to compare the IE8 to the SE215. From memory their bass quantity shouldn't be far apart. The rest sounds about right - I liked the IE8 treble a lot.


----------



## Mimouille

Thanks a lot ! So according to you the JH13 seems to perform better overall. And to your tastes ?





ljokerl said:


> Not too close - compared to the Mirace the JH13 has more midrange presence (and a more forward presentation), better clarity, and more mid-bass by a few dB. The JH13 is more punchy and impactful but also a little more resolving overall. I suppose it could be called more analytical when it comes to how it presents music. The Miracle’s treble seemed a touch smoother to me but they are similar in presence and extension at the top.


----------



## quartertone

Joker, I've seen some brief references to the Astrotec AX7 as being bright, but what else can you say about it? How does it compare to the other TWFK earphones?


----------



## nicholars

I think the impressive thing about the IE8 is not really any of the individual parts of the sound but the overall balance and how well integrated it all is... The soundstage on them and the way it is presented just sounds awesome sometimes, sort of like a faster HD650 with more bass and brighter treble .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Thanks a lot ! So according to you the JH13 seems to perform better overall. And to your tastes ?


 
   
  Close call, but the clarity of the JH13 would cinch it for me. Maybe I would like a little less bass but overall that thing is just an eye-opener when it comes to clarity and imaging. The Hidition NT 6 would also be in the running for me - it's more balanced aside from the treble peak and has some fantastically clean sound.
   
  Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Joker, I've seen some brief references to the Astrotec AX7 as being bright, but what else can you say about it? How does it compare to the other TWFK earphones?


 

 I sent it in for repair and haven't gotten it back yet so I haven't done any listening with it lately. It reminded me of the Brainwavz B2 and Rock-It R-50 more so than the VSonic GR01 but I didn't get a chance to do the A:Bs.


----------



## Mimouille

Thanks Joker, I think I will skip the JH13 to get more different CIEMs such as Fitear 335 or NT6 pro.


----------



## nicholars

What is the best relatively cheap amplification for IEM? I guess one of the Fiio products?
   
  I find that my DAP (sansa clip) actually sounds better than my Desktop amp / dac with IEM's (NAD 326bee and Dacmagic) Probably because the NAD is 60ohm impedance.... However the Sansa clip is a bit lacking in bass etc. Would a fiio or similar be an improvement for IEM?


----------



## Mimouille

Ibasso T3d is great and ultra small. Or for a.level above Tralucent T1. Beats 400$ amps IMO.





nicholars said:


> What is the best relatively cheap amplification for IEM? I guess one of the Fiio products?
> 
> I find that my DAP (sansa clip) actually sounds better than my Desktop amp / dac with IEM's (NAD 326bee and Dacmagic) Probably because the NAD is 60ohm impedance.... However the Sansa clip is a bit lacking in bass etc. Would a fiio or similar be an improvement for IEM?


----------



## nicholars

Is the ibasso better than the fiio products?


----------



## Mimouille

Never tried Fiio. But Shizgeo who is a trusted reviewer also considers it as a reference for iems.





nicholars said:


> Is the ibasso better than the fiio products?


----------



## nicholars

Is there any with a built in dac because I just realised my dacmagic only has one output except for balanced.


----------



## nicholars

Nice pic by the way What is that?! Looks like something from Dr.who lol


----------



## Mimouille

Cannot help you there...sorry. the ones I know with dac are 450+





nicholars said:


> Is there any with a built in dac because I just realised my dacmagic only has one output except for balanced.


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That was a fun one to write
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  It sounds like you love JH13pro more.
  If they really sound very differenet, i will go for JH13 next. But according to others' words, JH13 sometime sounds "boring" (have no idea if it's the proper word to decribe it.)


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Agreed, or maybe the JVC FX700 if I isolation is not important, though I'm still not sure spending $350 is necessary to upgrade from the S4 with good bass and better vocals. The EPH-100 does that for $150.
> 
> 
> If you can also love them for their strengths...
> ...


 
  But i dont care for the EPH-100 there is no support from comply for that specific model. as well the way the tips are inserted or design TBH.


----------



## nicholars

I find that the IE8 do not actually have very much sub bass... I think it is the "sennheiser sound"...
   
  Anything from about 50hz upwards is really nice but there is not much sub bass compared to Atrio MG7 for example which has everything down to about 20hz right in your face.
   
  Overall though very nice IEM, would be nice to have sennheiser IE8 with Atrio MG7 bass though. I guess that either doesn't exist or would cost a lot lol.


----------



## jayextreme

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> I find that the IE8 do not actually have very much sub bass... I think it is the "sennheiser sound"...
> 
> Anything from about 50hz upwards is really nice but there is not much sub bass compared to Atrio MG7 for example which has everything down to about 20hz right in your face.
> 
> Overall though very nice IEM, would be nice to have sennheiser IE8 with Atrio MG7 bass though. I guess that either doesn't exist or would cost a lot lol.


 
  I agree with nicholars' statement. IE8 has lots of good bass but seems to lack a bit of control. I heard that IE80 addresses this issue nicely.


----------



## nicholars

Its not too bad quality, its just that it does not seem to extend very low compared to something like Atrio MG7. Would be nice to have a bit more extension and clarity though. Are the IE80 actually better for quantity and extension of the bass? Or is it just that they removed the midbass on the IE80?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> What is the best relatively cheap amplification for IEM? I guess one of the Fiio products?
> 
> I find that my DAP (sansa clip) actually sounds better than my Desktop amp / dac with IEM's (NAD 326bee and Dacmagic) Probably because the NAD is 60ohm impedance.... However the Sansa clip is a bit lacking in bass etc. Would a fiio or similar be an improvement for IEM?


 
   
  You would probably want something with bass boost in that case, because having a higher-end source does not automatically equal more bass. The Fiio E7 (or E07k) has built-in bass boost and a DAC.

  
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> It sounds like you love JH13pro more.
> If they really sound very differenet, i will go for JH13 next. But according to others' words, JH13 sometime sounds "boring" (have no idea if it's the proper word to decribe it.)


 
   
  I only have the JH13Pro Freqphase. I never tried the original JH13. The Freqphase is not boring at all to me, it actually has a very mildly v-shaped sound with a hint of added mid-bass kick and some treble sparkle. 

  
  Quote: 





nicholars said:


> I find that the IE8 do not actually have very much sub bass... I think it is the "sennheiser sound"...
> 
> Anything from about 50hz upwards is really nice but there is not much sub bass compared to Atrio MG7 for example which has everything down to about 20hz right in your face.
> 
> Overall though very nice IEM, would be nice to have sennheiser IE8 with Atrio MG7 bass though. I guess that either doesn't exist or would cost a lot lol.


 
   
  But if you're comparing it to the Atrio, which has elevated deep bass, pretty much everything will seem like it's lacking in deep bass. With the bass screw turned up the IE8 has a fairly balanced amount of deep bass vs mid-bass, with maybe a little more mid-bass. The Atrio is the exception, not the rule.


----------



## IAMTHERE4IAM

Hi all. New head-fier here. Can anyone suggest a good iem under $150 that can be considered a good upgrade over the Sunrise xcited. I am currently considering the r50 and the vc1000 but since ljokerl hasn't heard the vc1000 yet, can you please give more models. Any opinion is much appreciated, thanks.


----------



## pukka

I'm lost...
   
  ljokerl, could you please point me to something in the $200-$600 range, either universal, or even preferred, CIEM that would suit my tastes?
   
  After reading a lot of other reviews I'm still lost.
   
  I want bass, I especially want great dynamics, cannot stand the most subtle grain or harshness in mids/highs, like "thick note" presentation... and usually also have problems to get good fit. And should be fine with iphone/ipad, etc.
   
  GR07 BE after 400 hours of burn in are more bearable, but tracks like Red Hot Chili Peppers "Can't Stop" cause me lots of hearing fatigue... and I find them to be too "flat", I definitely don't wan't a monitor, I would like to enjoy ALL kind of music!
   
  I'm very curious regarding your statement of the Heir 8.A... the price is really steep but you got me wondering...


----------



## Radiohead99

|joker|, If you were mostly a rock music (mostly indie, classic rock, alt, punk, avant garde, psychodelic) and some pop (indie, dream) lover, which CIEM would you pick between Heir 8.A and JH13 pro or Miracle? And when you will be mostly listening to them on your daily commute.


----------



## nicholars

Quote: 





pukka said:


> I'm lost...
> 
> ljokerl, could you please point me to something in the $200-$600 range, either universal, or even preferred, CIEM that would suit my tastes?
> 
> ...


 
   
  Im not joker but.... Sennheiser IE80 sounds like something you might like....


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I only have the JH13Pro Freqphase. I never tried the original JH13. The Freqphase is not boring at all to me, it actually has a very mildly v-shaped sound with a hint of added mid-bass kick and some treble sparkle.


 
  Sorry for making you confuse. Actually i meant JH13 Pro with Freqphase. I have no interest in the original JH13.
I think Miracle is quite versatile. Do you think Freqphase also is able to handle as many generics as Miracle?


----------



## nicholars

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> But if you're comparing it to the Atrio, which has elevated deep bass, pretty much everything will seem like it's lacking in deep bass. With the bass screw turned up the IE8 has a fairly balanced amount of deep bass vs mid-bass, with maybe a little more mid-bass. The Atrio is the exception, not the rule.


 
   
  I think you are right.... I have got used to the amount of bass on the ie8 now and they do have a good amount... It balances well with the rest of the sound. I think it is because of a lack of distortion in the midbass it seems like there is less bass compared to the SE215.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





iamthere4iam said:


> Hi all. New head-fier here. Can anyone suggest a good iem under $150 that can be considered a good upgrade over the Sunrise xcited. I am currently considering the r50 and the vc1000 but since ljokerl hasn't heard the vc1000 yet, can you please give more models. Any opinion is much appreciated, thanks.


 
   
  The Xcited is an interesting earphone... for a dynamic-driver it's quite lean-sounding, especially in the midrange. Do you like its sound? If so, the JVC FXD80 is the closest-sounding upgrade I can think of.
   
  If you don't mind a little more bass and a fuller overall sound, the Philips Fidelio S1/S2 earphones could be a contender as well. The R-50 will be more balanced than the Xcited but you'll give up some of the bass punch, which you wouldn't be doing with an FXD80 or Fidelio S2. 
   
  Quote: 





pukka said:


> I'm lost...
> 
> ljokerl, could you please point me to something in the $200-$600 range, either universal, or even preferred, CIEM that would suit my tastes?
> 
> ...


 
   
  1964EARS V3. Lots of bass, very "fun" sound, custom-fit, smoother treble than the GR07. Also super sensitive and works great with mobile devices. 
   
  Quote: 





radiohead99 said:


> |joker|, If you were mostly a rock music (mostly indie, classic rock, alt, punk, avant garde, psychodelic) and some pop (indie, dream) lover, which CIEM would you pick between Heir 8.A and JH13 pro or Miracle? And when you will be mostly listening to them on your daily commute.


 
   
  For me, JH13Pro, but then I prefer it over the 8.A in general and the Miracle much of the time.The Miracle might have a better bass quantity for me (less boost than the JH13) but its mids just aren't as rich and inviting in comparison, and it's not quite as clear, either. The 8.A has more of a warm and smooth signature. Not really my kind of sound, but it's the most forgiving of the bunch. 
   
  Isolation-wise these are all pretty similar. I think the shells of the 8.A are a touch thicker so it has a very slight edge but nothing substantial. The sets that isolate better are the silicone ones (Sensaphonics, Spiral Ear), the Westones with their vinyl tips, and monitors with a musician fit (like the Hidition NT 6).
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Sorry for making you confuse. Actually i meant JH13 Pro with Freqphase. I have no interest in the original JH13.
> I think Miracle is quite versatile. Do you think Freqphase also is able to handle as many generics as Miracle?


 

 Yep, I think it's very easy-going and I've enjoyed it with everything I threw it at. Tyll (@Innerfidelity) thought the JH13 was vastly more genre-neutral than the Miracle, IIRC.


----------



## IAMTHERE4IAM

Thanks for the help ljokerl. I think the R-50 would do best. I like the sound sig of the Xcited but I think I can live with less bass. Btw, will you do a review of the vc1000?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





iamthere4iam said:


> Thanks for the help ljokerl. I think the R-50 would do best. I like the sound sig of the Xcited but I think I can live with less bass. Btw, will you do a review of the vc1000?


 

 I don't have one at this time and there are lots of other things in the queue, so probably not for a while.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Xcited is an interesting earphone... for a dynamic-driver it's quite lean-sounding, especially in the midrange. Do you like its sound? If so, the JVC FXD80 is the closest-sounding upgrade I can think of.
> 
> If you don't mind a little more bass and a fuller overall sound, the Philips Fidelio S1/S2 earphones could be a contender as well. The R-50 will be more balanced than the Xcited but you'll give up some of the bass punch, which you wouldn't be doing with an FXD80 or Fidelio S2.


 
  interesting. i didnt liked the Xcited. how exactly is the fxd80 and upgrade?


----------



## pukka

Hi!
   
   


nicholars said:


> Im not joker but.... Sennheiser IE80 sounds like something you might like....


 
    
  Thanks a lot for the pointer nicholars! Also being Senheisser a more widely available brand I may locate somewhere to try them!
   
   


lcfiner said:


> consider the fidelio S2 (or S1) but I can vouch for the S2 hitting above it's price point. there is zero treble harshness, great bass and excellent clarity and speed.
> 
> The heir 4.ai has almost all that you want and is more refined than the S2 with more audible texture and fine details but lacks the bass impact you may want. in my experience, that is usually found in dynamic IEMs.


 
   
  Thanks LCfiner! Maybe I could try them also, being Philips!
   
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> 1964EARS V3. Lots of bass, very "fun" sound, custom-fit, smoother treble than the GR07. Also super sensitive and works great with mobile devices.


 
   
  Didn't thought there were "affordable" CIEMs! Now I think I'm on track and made up my mind, I'm troublesome when it comes to universal fit, even with GR06/07 I have to be always repositioning and tinkering with the seal.
  I made up my mind, I'm going for a CIEM.
   
  I note you advised the V3 and not the Q (Quad) whereas they supposedly have more bass, I suspect you did that for a reason?
   
  Also, Heir 3.A looks to be similar to the V3, looking for vs reviews but still reading. Anyone has listened to both?
   
  Thanks a lot guys! the more models I know that may suit me, the more info for reference I have to process all the info and reviews!


----------



## tinphamhuu0212

Joker . Have you ever heard of http://www.385audio.com/ . Their headphones loooks great and some looks like the other company's headphone for example : http://www.385audio.com/products/vigor looks like Philips Citiscape uptown and http://www.385audio.com/collections/earphones/products/vibe-trio looks like meelectronic SP51


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> interesting. i didnt liked the Xcited. how exactly is the fxd80 and upgrade?


 
   
  Well, if you didn't like the Xcited then it doesn't really matter, but I thought they both had the same type of cold-ish, mildly v-shaped sound with a wide (but not very deep) presentation.
   
  Quote: 





pukka said:


> I note you advised the V3 and not the Q (Quad) whereas they supposedly have more bass, I suspect you did that for a reason?


 
   
  Yeah, it's because I've never heard the Quad. 
   
  Quote: 





tinphamhuu0212 said:


> Joker . Have you ever heard of http://www.385audio.com/ . Their headphones loooks great and some looks like the other company's headphone for example : http://www.385audio.com/products/vigor looks like Philips Citiscape uptown and http://www.385audio.com/collections/earphones/products/vibe-trio looks like meelectronic SP51


 
   
  Nope, never heard of them. The SP51 shares housings with other earphones, such as the Hippo VB. They sound different, though.


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yep, I think it's very easy-going and I've enjoyed it with everything I threw it at. Tyll (@Innerfidelity) thought the JH13 was vastly more genre-neutral than the Miracle, IIRC.


 
  Now i am really interested in JH13Pro Freqphase, since you give a really high comment on it.  Like what you said, the Cons i found from Miracle so far is its unclear midrange, and separation isn't as good as i imagined. The bass is just right to me. Its treble is great as well.
  How about JH13Pro's soundstage. Is that as deep and wide as that of Miracle?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, if you didn't like the Xcited then it doesn't really matter, but I thought they both had the same type of cold-ish, mildly v-shaped sound with a wide (but not very deep) presentation.


 
  i found the Xcited very very recessed on vocals. even with hybrid tips. and way too laid back sound
  clarity was great, but bass was  missing a lot. i prefered the RE0, and the Zero even more.
  dont know, maybe i had a bad pair


----------



## ktan3142

Speaking of the ZERO's, I just realized mine had channel imbalance after a year and a half of usage (always assumed it was my ears). Can anyone suggest a $100-150 upgrade with:
   
  RE-262 soundstage and mids
  RE-ZERO clarity
   
  Soundstage and clarity are my main interests. Lush mids are preferable but not a must, and bass (presence) isn't that important. I tried the XBA-3 and felt that it was inferior to the RE-ZERO due to unnatural treble and comparable soundstage (for a ~$300 MSRP IEM you'd figure it'd be better than the RE-ZERO 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





).


----------



## Gilly87

Heya joker,
   
  How would you compare the mids of the UM3X and UE900? Does the UE900 manage to impress with the mids, with good body and emotion to vocals, or are they still more of a secondary element, as with the TF10? I like my UM3X, but want something with a bigger soundstage and slightly tighter bass, and perhaps slightly more prominent treble; do you think there's a chance the UE900 might do the trick?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Now i am really interested in JH13Pro Freqphase, since you give a really high comment on it.  Like what you said, the Cons i found from Miracle so far is its unclear midrange, and separation isn't as good as i imagined. The bass is just right to me. Its treble is great as well.
> How about JH13Pro's soundstage. Is that as deep and wide as that of Miracle?


 
   
  The Miracle is wider IMO but the JH13 has a nice balance of depth and width so it sounds very well-rounded. Imaging is great, too. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> i found the Xcited very very recessed on vocals. even with hybrid tips. and way too laid back sound
> clarity was great, but bass was  missing a lot. i prefered the RE0, and the Zero even more.
> dont know, maybe i had a bad pair


 
   
  Well, if you read my FXD80 review it kind of does the same thing with vocals. The Xcited is not as good as the HiFiMan sets, or even the original SW-Xcape, IMO. 
   
  Quote: 





ktan3142 said:


> Speaking of the ZERO's, I just realized mine had channel imbalance after a year and a half of usage (always assumed it was my ears). Can anyone suggest a $100-150 upgrade with:
> 
> RE-262 soundstage and mids
> RE-ZERO clarity
> ...


 
   
  Channel imbalance can be caused by earwax build-up also, so maybe it wasn't always as bad as it is now. Anyway, not too many can match the ZERO in clarity at $150 or less. The Philips Fidelio S1/S2 would be an option - they do have a little more bass than HiFiMan sets but they also have good clarity and a slightly wider presentation than the ZERO. Or you could try to find a used RE262 or even RE272 if you liked the 262.
   
  Quote: 





gilly87 said:


> Heya joker,
> 
> How would you compare the mids of the UM3X and UE900? Does the UE900 manage to impress with the mids, with good body and emotion to vocals, or are they still more of a secondary element, as with the TF10? I like my UM3X, but want something with a bigger soundstage and slightly tighter bass, and perhaps slightly more prominent treble; do you think there's a chance the UE900 might do the trick?


 

 It's been a while since I've heard the UM3X so I would have to go off memory and I'd rather not provide a comparison per se. I can't quantify emotion but I felt that the UE900 mostly did vocals justice. The TF10 is more mid-recessed, which is probably what you weren't happy with. Yeah, the UE900 would have more treble energy than the UM3X and it has very tight bass and a nice soundstage (the UM3X was mostly in-the-head for me, though it had nice separation).


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, if you read my FXD80 review it kind of does the same thing with vocals. The Xcited is not as good as the HiFiMan sets, or even the original SW-Xcape, IMO.


 
  well, if found the Xcited really bad on vocals, so i didnt get  it was like that from the review. good thing i didnt buy them. 
  you would say the eph100 have  enough/better/fuller vocals? closer to the FXT90 than the 80?


----------



## Gasdoc

Hi Joker, awesome ciem round-up and review.  How is the JH13fp from portable sources?  I love keeping everything on the trusty iphone 4S....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> well, if found the Xcited really bad on vocals, so i didnt get  it was like that from the review. good thing i didnt buy them.
> you would say the eph100 have  enough/better/fuller vocals? closer to the FXT90 than the 80?


 
   
  Yeah, definitely. I actually like the mids of the EPH-100.
   
  Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Hi Joker, awesome ciem round-up and review.  How is the JH13fp from portable sources?  I love keeping everything on the trusty iphone 4S....


 

 Quite good, I'm sure the iPhone will be fine. I know some of the other IF writers went crazy with $3k sources and whatnot but for me a custom in-ear should sound great portably so I only used them straight from a DAP or (at most) with a portable amp or mini-DAC. Anyway, iPhone on the go and USB DAC at home is something I'd be happy with.


----------



## kamcok

Hey joker,
if I can get them for the same price of 95 dollars which one do you think has better value for money, Philips fidelio s1 or sony xba3?


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Miracle is wider IMO but the JH13 has a nice balance of depth and width so it sounds very well-rounded. Imaging is great, too.


 
  I have the Miracles right now. Do you think JH13 Pro Freqphase should be my next step? From your words, they sound very different, and JH13pro might be a bit better?


----------



## Mimouille

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> I have the Miracles right now. Do you think JH13 Pro Freqphase should be my next step? From your words, they sound very different, and JH13pro might be a bit better?


 

 I know this is not your question, but if you just had them and enjoy them, maybe you should postpone your next step (look who's talking)


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> I know this is not your question, but if you just had them and enjoy them, maybe you should postpone your next step (look who's talking)


 
  I won't say anything bad in Miracle Appreciation Thread. But, here, i can tell you the Miracles don't amaze me at all (though it is a very very good CIEM, which IMO is way better than Fitear 334)
  One of the reasons is because neither UM Aus and UM Lab offers a good service to me. Both of them, especially UM Aus, are irresponsible for their customers. Leaving my questions unsolved, and ignoring my email for a week. I should have been able to make my decision whether i will need another pair of impressions for refit last week, if they had replied my email and answered my questions.
  Another reason is the Miracles sound too polite just as you wrote in your review. The very first impressions is the Miracles sounds really natural. It expressed what the music should be like. Beyond this, I am not looking for something more impressive, but UM haven't shown anything special yet


----------



## Mimouille

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> I won't say anything bad in Miracle Appreciation Thread. But, here, i can tell you the Miracles don't amaze me at all (though it is a very very good CIEM, which IMO is way better than Fitear 334)
> One of the reasons is because neither UM Aus and UM Lab offers a good service to me. Both of them, especially UM Aus, are irresponsible for their customers. Leaving my questions unsolved, and ignoring my email for a week. I should have been able to make my decision whether i will need another pair of impressions for refit last week, if they had replied my email and answered my questions.
> Another reason is the Miracles sound too polite just as you wrote in your review. The very first impressions is the Miracles sounds really natural. It expressed what the music should be like. Beyond this, I am not looking for something more impressive, but UM haven't shown anything special yet


 

 The customer service is a not acceptable. I never had any issues, but I understand how you feel. Concerning the SQ, I still think they are top performers, and what you may want to do is try various sources, because they scale up very well. I like them a lot with my AK100 stage 2 for instance. However, I am glad I have other iems for different moods like SE5 for more natural tone and deeper bass, or 1Plus2 for more forward details and more punch. Or Kaede for more crystal clear brightness.


----------



## pukka

Mimouille how would you say the heir audio 5.0 compares to those you just mentiomed??


----------



## Mimouille

They are fairly dynamic but still a bit laid back. In terms of size they are smaller than Kaede and MUCH smaller than 1plus2. Customs are necessarily bigger, but not comparable.


----------



## Genia4

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The HF5 isolates slightly more than the A161P IMO. Comfort is comparable - the MEElec has angled nozzles but they really don't make a difference because both earphones are so small. Sound-wise, the A161P has more bass while the HF5 remains flatter through the treble. The Ety is a little more balanced IMO, but they are both clear, detailed, and close to neutral.


 
   
  Well, eventually I got both ($55 for the A161P and $64 for the HF2) and I'd like to thank you very much for the recommendation. I will be keeping both as to me they are absolute opposites in terms of good sound quality, with the HF2 being accurate to the note, but a bit tiring compared to the A161P's more "fun" and low-min emphasized sound. Isolation is absolutely amazing with both pairs (I use the large triple-flange).
   
  Best $100 I spent on earphones, they make everything else I've owned sound so... dull.


----------



## saintfrenz

Thank you sooo much |joker|, for this. I am new to IEMs and your posts here and at innerfidelity is a goldmine of information... I should know, I have been consuming it voraciously for the past few days, hours at a time.
   
  What would you recommend as a "first" IEM from among the UE 600 and the Meelectronics A161P? I see that you have rated them on par with each other over at innerfidelity. I mostly listen to trance and house.
   
  P.S. Due thanks also to ClieOS for his posts and reviews too...


----------



## nicholars

Quote: 





saintfrenz said:


> Thank you sooo much |joker|, for this. I am new to IEMs and your posts here and at innerfidelity is a goldmine of information... I should know, I have been consuming it voraciously for the past few days, hours at a time.
> 
> What would you recommend as a "first" IEM from among the UE 600 and the Meelectronics A161P? I see that you have rated them on par with each other over at innerfidelity. I mostly listen to trance and house.
> 
> P.S. Due thanks also to ClieOS for his posts and reviews too...


 
   
  Think you would be better with a dynamic driver than a single balanced armature for house/trance because of the bass.


----------



## insidedrive

Joker, do you think that the Fidelio S1, being roughly the same price, is a better value than the RE400? In other words, which one do you slightly prefer over the other?


----------



## SNSDGeeGee

Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Joker, do you think that the Fidelio S1, being roughly the same price, is a better value than the RE400? In other words, which one do you slightly prefer over the other?


 
  I would also like to know bass quantity compared to GR07.  If it is more like the GR07 MKII or GR07 BEs.  Does the S2 have more bass quantity then S1?


----------



## saintfrenz

Quote: 





nicholars said:


> Think you would be better with a dynamic driver than a single balanced armature for house/trance because of the bass.


 
   
  Although trance/house is bass-heavy and bass is of course important, it is not just bass I'm looking for. I also listen to ambient electronic and new age stuff... so melodies, mids and treble are also important which is why I wanted to go with a BA set. Also, I want to use it with my iPhone... so back to the original question... UE 600 or Meelectronics A161P?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kamcok said:


> Hey joker,
> if I can get them for the same price of 95 dollars which one do you think has better value for money, Philips fidelio s1 or sony xba3?


 
   
  I prefer the S1 but that might just be me. The Sonys seem a little more v-shaped.  
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> I have the Miracles right now. Do you think JH13 Pro Freqphase should be my next step? From your words, they sound very different, and JH13pro might be a bit better?


 
   
  I do like the JH13Pro better, but I don't know if I would call it an upgrade over the Miracle unless you're looking specifically for what it offers over the Miracle, namely a bit more bass punch, clearer and more prominent mids, and a more forward presentation.
   
  Quote: 





genia4 said:


> Well, eventually I got both ($55 for the A161P and $64 for the HF2) and I'd like to thank you very much for the recommendation. I will be keeping both as to me they are absolute opposites in terms of good sound quality, with the HF2 being accurate to the note, but a bit tiring compared to the A161P's more "fun" and low-min emphasized sound. Isolation is absolutely amazing with both pairs (I use the large triple-flange).
> 
> Best $100 I spent on earphones, they make everything else I've owned sound so... dull.


 
   
  Glad to hear that, those are definitely my two favorite $100 armatures. Getting both for a little over that is a darn good deal 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
   
  Quote: 





saintfrenz said:


> Thank you sooo much |joker|, for this. I am new to IEMs and your posts here and at innerfidelity is a goldmine of information... I should know, I have been consuming it voraciously for the past few days, hours at a time.
> 
> What would you recommend as a "first" IEM from among the UE 600 and the Meelectronics A161P? I see that you have rated them on par with each other over at innerfidelity. I mostly listen to trance and house.
> 
> P.S. Due thanks also to ClieOS for his posts and reviews too...


 
   
  The UE600 is a little more mid-centric whereas the A161P is more bass-heavy. I favor the A161P slightly overall but it really depends on what you're looking for. When I say the A161P is more bass-heavy, I mean compared to the UE600 and other direct competitors. In reality it has only a few dB of bass boost, so if you're used to pretty much any entry-level earphone you have to be prepared to give up some bass.
   
  Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Joker, do you think that the Fidelio S1, being roughly the same price, is a better value than the RE400? In other words, which one do you slightly prefer over the other?


 
   
  For sound, I slightly prefer the S1. Overall, however, I would be tempted to pick the RE-400 still because I'm not a huge fan of the Philips form factor (in particular the fit and lower isolation).
   
   
   
  Quote: 





snsdgeegee said:


> I would also like to know bass quantity compared to GR07.  If it is more like the GR07 MKII or GR07 BEs.  Does the S2 have more bass quantity then S1?


 
   
   
  Good question. I only have the GR07 mkI and the GR07 BE, no mkII. The bass quantity of both Philips is closer to the GR07 than the GR07BE, but they are all pretty close together. The S2 sounds a touch bassier than the S1 to me, which puts it a little closer to the GR07BE.


----------



## insidedrive

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> For sound, I slightly prefer the S1. Overall, however, I would be tempted to pick the RE-400 still because I'm not a huge fan of the Philips form factor (in particular the fit and lower isolation).


 
   
  Just how bad is the isolation of the Phillips, I know that it is semi-open, is it worse than the GR07? Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Just how bad is the isolation of the Phillips, I know that it is semi-open, is it worse than the GR07? Thanks!


 

 I've come across worse but it's not as good as with the GR07.


----------



## jeffrodigital

Are there any IEMs under probably $50 or so that sound similar to the JVC Riptidz ? Heck, if you know one that meets my criteria for $20 and is a steal let me know that too !!

Theres been a few threads about them and they really do sound good all around. Nice and balanced, maybe could be a lil more detailed- which stepping up a price class or 2 can def remedy if buying the right one. 

Another thing I'd like is better build quality. The reason the Riptidz are $8 is they got the old school flimsey wire, lightweight jack and all that jive. Once again, stepping up in price could remedy this. 

Any suggestions ? I mostly listen to hip hop, and that whole big bass for hip hop doesnt apply to my tastes. For the commercial stuff that a lot of people listen to its all about the rattling bass. I pump some stuff like that because the bass effect is kinda cool haha. 

For what I like its all about what the rapper is saying, the beat is just that, a beat for him to rhyme over. The beat is the background, which you just need tight, clear bass for. The focus is all on the vocals, so you need good clarity. On top of that, a lot of the beatmakers use many many sounds in their beats, you need good clairty to hear them all. 

Sorry for the long winded question- longtime lurker finally posting and I got carried away !! Thanks guys !!


----------



## 88mbd

Hi joker!
   
  Thank you so much for all of your sharing! Thanks to your great review on VC02, I got myself and a pair and am now so enjoying them. However some days ago I read on a blog that VC02 has a a inverted polarity http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/01/vsonic-vc02-wonder-of-3mm.html
   
  Is this true? If yes, how can I test my pair whether they are inverted or not. The site says that we can fix this by replugging the driver unit upside down, if so, should I do this for both L and R or just for 1 side.
   
  Thank you again and look forward to hearing from you soon ^^


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jeffrodigital said:


> Are there any IEMs under probably $50 or so that sound similar to the JVC Riptidz ? Heck, if you know one that meets my criteria for $20 and is a steal let me know that too !!
> 
> Theres been a few threads about them and they really do sound good all around. Nice and balanced, maybe could be a lil more detailed- which stepping up a price class or 2 can def remedy if buying the right one.
> 
> ...


 

 I've never heard the Riptidz so I'm not sure what their signature is like but there's lots of well-built earphones under $50 these days. For more smooth and bass-heavy, there's the RHA MA-350 and Dunu Trident. For more v-shaped, there's the VSonic GR02 bass edition. For more mid-centric, there's the VSonic R02 Silver and ViSang VS-K1. For more flat/balanced there's the Astrotec AM-90. If you want focus on vocals with some clean bass on top, I'd go for the VSonic R02 Silver.
   
   
  Quote: 





88mbd said:


> Hi joker!
> 
> Thank you so much for all of your sharing! Thanks to your great review on VC02, I got myself and a pair and am now so enjoying them. However some days ago I read on a blog that VC02 has a a inverted polarity http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/01/vsonic-vc02-wonder-of-3mm.html
> 
> ...


 
   
  I have tried but have never been able to hear differences when absolute polarity (i.e. the polarity of both channels) is reversed. 
   
  This is not to be confused with something that is out of phase (i.e. the polarity of only one channel reversed) - that you can hear very easily because your brain gets confused. You can try that with the VC02 - just flip the connector on one of the earpieces (but not the other) and everything will immediately sound out of whack.


----------



## daleb

So, I was thinking about getting the MC5s, but now that I think about it, I already have headphones for studio use, and will be getting some more soon. While I am very much into the "neutral-like" sound, and I  need a fair amount of  isolation (at least a 3.5 on this scale, but the more the better), I want something that still sounds fun. Any suggestions while still in that price range (from $30 to $70)?
   
  Edit: If it isn't neutral-like, I'd rather it have a slight lean towards treble. When out and about, I usually maintain a focus of electronic (dubstep, house) and sometimes more orchestral music. I'm not much of a bass lover, though, so I'd rather keep that around average levels. Thanks!


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I do like the JH13Pro better, but I don't know if I would call it an upgrade over the Miracle unless you're looking specifically for what it offers over the Miracle, namely a bit more bass punch, clearer and more prominent mids, and a more forward presentation.


 
  Yeah, i am looking for another CIEM that is able to express some music in a wilder more powerful way. The only thing i worry about JH13pro is its bass that will bleed into mids. 
  My Miracles sound, just like what Mimouille said, "too" polite, though Miracles is really good at classical.


----------



## Horsethief

Joker,

Thanks for the EPH-100 recommendation. I picked up the MTPGs for a few weeks. They performed well. I notice the Yamahas push an equal if not higher amount of bass. They do so with more detail. And they offer more detail throughout the spectrum. 

Overall I'm very pleased with the Yamahas for portable/work use. Once they're fully broken in I bet I'll enjoy them for a long time. 

Time to improve my source/headphones for home use!


----------



## Mimouille

Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Yeah, i am looking for another CIEM that is able to express some music in a wilder more powerful way. The only thing i worry about JH13pro is its bass that will bleed into mids.
> My Miracles sound, just like what Mimouille said, "too" polite, though Miracles is really good at classical.


 

 You know some source / cable rolling can also push the sound of your Miracles. Otherwise I am thinking 1plus2.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

horsethief said:


> Joker,
> 
> Thanks for the EPH-100 recommendation. I picked up the MTPGs for a few weeks. They performed well. I notice the Yamahas push an equal if not higher amount of bass. They do so with more detail. And they offer more detail throughout the spectrum.
> 
> ...




The Yamaha EPH100 are the bomb for EDM music! 

I've been enjoying them for over 7 months already, still going strong.


----------



## Orel

Hey joker, don't know if you remember me, You recommended me the CW31 and I told you my first impressions of them back then. Turns out I wasn't getting a good fit, I needed to push them back deeper by sort of pulling up my ear. I've been listening to them like this for about two months I think, and it's alot better. The bass is alot more.. Well, existing, and the treble is smoother. I would love more transparency in more crowded recordings, but it really is pretty great with every genre. Thanks for the recommendation


----------



## -sandro-

I just read the *ATH-CKM500 *review and I must say it completely matches my description.


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> You know some source / cable rolling can also push the sound of your Miracles. Otherwise I am thinking 1plus2.


 
  Yes, i know. The reason i sold out my To Go! 334 is not because it sounds worse than my Miracles, but To Go! 334 can't provide the ideal fit to me since i got my Miralce. Same to universal 1+2, (if 1+2 is a CIEM, that will be a different story.) 
  About source, cable is not affordable to me, so i will never think about purchasing an extremely expensive cable to improve my Miracle. About source, i do care about portability of devices such as AK100 and Ipod Classic. But they sound really bad. The only device i will think about in the near future is DX100. AK120 probably will be a wise choice until its price bounces back to normal.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daleb said:


> So, I was thinking about getting the MC5s, but now that I think about it, I already have headphones for studio use, and will be getting some more soon. While I am very much into the "neutral-like" sound, and I  need a fair amount of  isolation (at least a 3.5 on this scale, but the more the better), I want something that still sounds fun. Any suggestions while still in that price range (from $30 to $70)?
> 
> Edit: If it isn't neutral-like, I'd rather it have a slight lean towards treble. When out and about, I usually maintain a focus of electronic (dubstep, house) and sometimes more orchestral music. I'm not much of a bass lover, though, so I'd rather keep that around average levels. Thanks!


 
   
  The VSonic VC02 should be up your alley. Isolation isn't as great as with an Ety but it's good for commuting and it has a balanced but still punchy and enjoyable signature. Another option might be a MEElec A161P. Last I remember amazon had some open box ones at the $60 mark and someone mentioned getting one for $55 a few days ago. Bass is good by balanced armature standards and it has a neutral-ish sound overall. Treble is present, though it is a bit less bright than the VC02. Good introduction to BA sound - probably as good as it gets for the money. 
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Yeah, i am looking for another CIEM that is able to express some music in a wilder more powerful way. The only thing i worry about JH13pro is its bass that will bleed into mids.
> My Miracles sound, just like what Mimouille said, "too" polite, though Miracles is really good at classical.


 
   
  Well, you will give up a tiny bit of the Miracle's complete lack of bleed with the JH13. The only set I've heard that has similar bass tightness but a bit more quantity is the Hidition NT 6. The rest of the ones I've heard are either warmer/bassier than the Miracle (e.g. Westone ES5, Heir 8.A) or have less low end (e.g. Lime Ears LE3).
   
  Quote: 





horsethief said:


> Joker,
> 
> Thanks for the EPH-100 recommendation. I picked up the MTPGs for a few weeks. They performed well. I notice the Yamahas push an equal if not higher amount of bass. They do so with more detail. And they offer more detail throughout the spectrum.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Glad you like them! Yeah, I really can't think of a reason to get the MTPG over the EPH-100 except maybe soundstage width, if that's important, or if you like your mids less prominent than with the EPH-100. 
   
   
  Quote: 





orel said:


> Hey joker, don't know if you remember me, You recommended me the CW31 and I told you my first impressions of them back then. Turns out I wasn't getting a good fit, I needed to push them back deeper by sort of pulling up my ear. I've been listening to them like this for about two months I think, and it's alot better. The bass is alot more.. Well, existing, and the treble is smoother. I would love more transparency in more crowded recordings, but it really is pretty great with every genre. Thanks for the recommendation


 
   
  Glad to hear that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. They are not the clearest things out there these days but as you said the bass is decent and the treble is quite smooth. 
   
  Quote: 





-sandro- said:


> I just read the *ATH-CKM500 *review and I must say it completely matches my description.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The VSonic VC02 should be up your alley. Isolation isn't as great as with an Ety but it's good for commuting and it has a balanced but still punchy and enjoyable signature. Another option might be a MEElec A161P. Last I remember amazon had some open box ones at the $60 mark and someone mentioned getting one for $55 a few days ago. Bass is good by balanced armature standards and it has a neutral-ish sound overall. Treble is present, though it is a bit less bright than the VC02. Good introduction to BA sound - probably as good as it gets for the money.


 
  I think I am going to go with the VC02s, those sound like they are the ones for me. Right now I have the M9s, so I don't know if I want anymore MEElecs. Thanks for the suggestion!


----------



## Orel

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Glad to hear that
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Yea, I said more existing because I barely heard it before I inserted it properly, I actually think the bass is pretty good  I agree with your review of it and using the Bi-Flange tips the isolation is quite good in my opinion


----------



## Amitl

my A161P just fell off the table and hit the floor :\
  doesnt seem like anything happened...but i was wondering
  if balanced armatures are resistant to shock like dynamics?
  please don't laugh at me


----------



## vwinter

amitl said:


> my A161P just fell off the table and hit the floor :\
> doesnt seem like anything happened...but i was wondering
> if balanced armatures are resistant to shock like dynamics?
> please don't laugh at me




I'm kind or curious as to why you think dynamics are resistant to shock. I have no idea either way, unless you mean when more parts are involved, like crossovers possibly disconnecting, but that wouldn't affect the A161.

Anyway, interested in anyone's response.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





amitl said:


> my A161P just fell off the table and hit the floor :\
> doesnt seem like anything happened...but i was wondering
> if balanced armatures are resistant to shock like dynamics?
> please don't laugh at me


 
  Earbuds can break from hitting the floor?


----------



## vwinter

daleb said:


> Earbuds can break from hitting the floor?



Sarcasm?


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Sarcasm?


 

 I've never had mine break from hitting the floor, they are just so light. On the other hand, the wire breaks so easily its not even funny.
   
  Edit: Is their anyway to check if a pair of IEMs are being discontinued? I can't find them on Vsonic's website, and there is only 1 left in stock on amazon...


----------



## daleb

Are IEMS supposed to hurt your ears after you take them out? The M9s I currently have are very pianful to my ears, they put a ton of pressure on the ear canal walls, and afterwards my ears end up feeling like they are constantly being pricked by a needle. I only use them because I have to have isolation.


----------



## vwinter

daleb said:


> I've never had mine break from hitting the floor, they are just so light. On the other hand, the wire breaks so easily its not even funny.
> 
> Edit: Is their anyway to check if a pair of IEMs are being discontinued? I can't find them on Vsonic's website, and there is only 1 left in stock on amazon...




Never had them break on me either due to being dropped, but if they did I wouldn't exactly be shocked. Tiny, delicate parts, adhesives, thin wires, anything could get jarred loose on a pinpoint impact.

The VC02 is a relatively new product and VSonic isn't the best at updating their website =/



daleb said:


> Are IEMS supposed to hurt your ears after you take them out? The M9s I currently have are very pianful to my ears, they put a ton of pressure on the ear canal walls, and afterwards my ears end up feeling like they are constantly being pricked by a needle. I only use them because I have to have isolation.




Is this your first time using IEM's? If so your ears should get used to the pressure a bit more. But the I slept on my arm feeling is a bit weird because that might mean lack of blood flow until you remove them... Maybe use a smaller tip? Or a smaller nozzle IEM? Dunno but it's a start.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Never had them break on me either due to being dropped, but if they did I wouldn't exactly be shocked. Tiny, delicate parts, adhesives, thin wires, anything could get jarred loose on a pinpoint impact.
> 
> The VC02 is a relatively new product and VSonic isn't the best at updating their website =/
> Is this your first time using IEM's? If so your ears should get used to the pressure a bit more. But the I slept on my arm feeling is a bit weird because that might mean lack of blood flow until you remove them... Maybe use a smaller tip? Or a smaller nozzle IEM? Dunno but it's a start.


 
  I guess they could break, then, it just always feels like the IEMs are too light weight to even be pushed by falling, as if they are feathers.
   
  I don't think I described the feeling well enough, Its a lot more like pain then it is like having an arm fall asleep. It makes me feel like I damaged my hearing, which makes no sense, because I can just wear them with no sound playing and it does this. I don't know if its because of a huge difference in pressure or what... I also am wondering if I can even wear deep insertion IEMs, my ears don't feel like they would let the IEMs go in that far, like my ears are blocked off past that point. And I'm not new to IEMs, either. While, yes, the M9s were my first pair, I've had them for over a year now, and  I'm easily used to the feeling. I think it has something more to with the insertion and removal process of the IEMs, messing with my eardrums because of pressure. Maybe I just don't know how to wear IEMs. Though the way I maximize pressure increases isolation a ton, almost doubles it I'd say. Even at normal pressures, these things still cause pain, though.
   
  The reason I want new earbuds is because I lost one of the tips to the E9, and those were the only tips that could isolate even moderately without adding tons of pressure. Without those, I have to use the other tips in very unconvential, painful manners, and those isolate even less then the stock tips. I don't know whether the M9s are just painful to my ears, or my search for overly powerful isolation is the one killing my ears.
   
  Maybe I should just go with an Etymotic, instead. I don't know if the VC02 will isolate enough that I will not end up forcing it to isolate through bad-for-the-ear insertion.


----------



## vwinter

I'm not sure I'm helping you by telling you this what with it making your ears fall asleep but you can get replacement tips for the M9 shipped pretty cheap on the meelectronics website. 

I feel like you might want to look into customs, which would be a much larger expenditure unfortunately. Great isolation and probably little to no pressure on the ear canal.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> I'm not sure I'm helping you by telling you this what with it making your ears fall asleep but you can get replacement tips for the M9 shipped pretty cheap on the meelectronics website.
> 
> I feel like you might want to look into customs, which would be a much larger expenditure unfortunately. Great isolation and probably little to no pressure on the ear canal.


 
  I could also spray paint my HD280s like I've been planning and start taking those everywhere (seeing as I'm getting some new higher end headphones anyways). I have lots of possibilities, and I don't have to figure this out for a while, so I'll check into it. I'm upgrading my M9s anyways, I don't like the sound signature in the first place.
   
  I will get some customs maybe 10 years from now, but not yet. Though, actually... I should have the funds to get customs this summer, maybe... I'll actually see if that's a possibility.
   
  edit: ugh... I just tried putting on my M9s again, with no sound, and no trying to make it isolate. Whenever I take them out, it just hurts my ears. How do you make it not hurt so much?!


----------



## vwinter

This is probably not what you want to hear but if smaller tips don't help, maybe see an ENT doctor?


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> This is probably not what you want to hear but if smaller tips don't help, maybe see an ENT doctor?


 
  Actually the tips that are on right now are even bigger then the originals XD
  I don't have any small tips, sadly, so I can't check for this.
  Also, the pain does seem the be caused by the giant decrease in pressure when I take them out. it really pulls on the ear drums. Anyway to not have that happen?
   
  Edit: Do the VC02s come with small tips? That would probably make it so I can actually use them... Maybe my ear canals are thinner then most peoples?


----------



## vwinter

Maybe, if possible, try compressing the tip on one side to break the seal before pulling it out?

The VC02 should come with a relative ton of tips.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Maybe, if possible, try compressing the tip on one side to break the seal before pulling it out?
> 
> The VC02 should come with a relative ton of tips.


 

 While I can't seem to break the seal in that way, breaking the seal at all does seem to help a ton. But not fully, because these tips right now are just way too big and cause way too much pressure in all directions...
   
  Yeah, I just checked them here, how are these only a 3 on accessories, they come with so much!


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You may be using the wrong size of eartip for your ear. Foam tips might be a worthwhile investment for you.


 
  It seems I am using the wrong size. Problem is, none of the other tips the M9 came with have any isolation... I'll check into foam tips if the VC02s don't come with tips that work for me.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





daleb said:


> I guess they could break, then, it just always feels like the IEMs are too light weight to even be pushed by falling, as if they are feathers.
> 
> I don't think I described the feeling well enough, Its a lot more like pain then it is like having an arm fall asleep. It makes me feel like I damaged my hearing, which makes no sense, because I can just wear them with no sound playing and it does this. I don't know if its because of a huge difference in pressure or what... I also am wondering if I can even wear deep insertion IEMs, my ears don't feel like they would let the IEMs go in that far, like my ears are blocked off past that point. And I'm not new to IEMs, either. While, yes, the M9s were my first pair, I've had them for over a year now, and  I'm easily used to the feeling. I think it has something more to with the insertion and removal process of the IEMs, messing with my eardrums because of pressure. Maybe I just don't know how to wear IEMs. Though the way I maximize pressure increases isolation a ton, almost doubles it I'd say. Even at normal pressures, these things still cause pain, though.
> 
> ...


 
  I'm quite sure that vc02's (ety like isolation depends on your tips) can give you great isolation with good comfort. Just choose the right tips, you'll have a good number of tips you can choose from. Deep insertion is also very comfortable with the vc02's I'm not having any problems at all and I'm very happy with its isolation.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





daleb said:


> Actually the tips that are on right now are even bigger then the originals XD
> I don't have any small tips, sadly, so I can't check for this.
> Also, the pain does seem the be caused by the giant decrease in pressure when I take them out. it really pulls on the ear drums. Anyway to not have that happen?
> 
> Edit: Do the VC02s come with small tips? That would probably make it so I can actually use them... Maybe my ear canals are thinner then most peoples?


 
  VC02's comes with the smallest tips I've seen in an iem package haha maybe that would fit you.


----------



## daleb

Okay,i will get the vc02s then!
Do they really come with all those colorful tips?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daleb said:


> Okay,i will get the vc02s then!
> Do they really come with all those colorful tips?


 

 Mine did but VSonic have changed their accessory sets in the past without notice. You may want to confirm with the listing or even the seller, depending on where you are buying them.


----------



## nNAVID

thanks to you for all of these hard massive reviews.can you add heir audio headphones(like heir audio 4.ai) also???


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nnavid said:


> thanks to you for all of these hard massive reviews.can you add heir audio headphones(like heir audio 4.ai) also???


 

 The only Heir set I have is the 8.A , which I do plan to add a full review for.


----------



## daleb

"...but still has some of the slightly hot character that all higher-end VSonic dynamics seem to share."
  What does this mean? I don't think I've ever heard of a "hot" sounding treble, unless it means harsh and aggressive.


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Mine did but VSonic have changed their accessory sets in the past without notice. You may want to confirm with the listing or even the seller, depending on where you are buying them.


 
  How about JH13pro? Will you add a full review too?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daleb said:


> "...but still has some of the slightly hot character that all higher-end VSonic dynamics seem to share."
> What does this mean? I don't think I've ever heard of a "hot" sounding treble, unless it means harsh and aggressive.


 
   
  There's one or more treble features that fall within the "potential for sibilance" range.
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> How about JH13pro? Will you add a full review too?


 

 Yes, I will. That one's a little more difficult since I'll have to rescale the sound score.


----------



## Radiohead99

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There's one or more treble features that fall within the "potential for sibilance" range.
> 
> 
> Yes, I will. That one's a little more difficult since I'll have to rescale the sound score.


 
  Reading between the lines, JH13 Pro is probably going to get a 10 out of 10 from you.


----------



## Amitl

are the Sony hybrids compatible with the MEElec A161P?


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, I will. That one's a little more difficult since I'll have to rescale the sound score.


 
  Joker, you really don't have to rescale your score table. Personally, i just want to see the scores of IEMs or CIEMs in the similar price range. For example, if you really think JH13Pro is better than Miracle a bit, you can straightly score JH13Pro as 10.5 instead of 10.5/10. So It doesn't matter whether the score is over denominator 10 anymore. IMO, it's clearer to show how much those high end CIEM/IEMs better than the lower end 
   
  Another question on CIEMs. What are the differences between Miracle and NT6? Which one you love better?


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There's one or more treble features that fall within the "potential for sibilance" range.


 
  Oh, that doesn't really bother me, so that is fine! I can't wait to get these.


----------



## Hijodelbrx

Sooooo.....my UE5 Pro's have finally failed me for the last time!  The shell on the right bud broke, when I tried to plug in the cable the fine wire (that WAS protected by the shell) snapped.  So I'm looking for a replacement and came across this excellent thread!  I was thinking ER 4P or a Westone 4 but now I'm looking at the ER HR5 and the Rockit R50 as a cheaper alternative.  Being a longtime audiophile, I'll probably wind up with one of the more expensive IEM's but I just wanted to thank you for this thread, it's exactly what I hoped I'd find here!


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Yes, I will. That one's a little more difficult since I'll have to rescale the sound score.




Oooo scandalous. Do you ever feel that by rescaling it, you squeeze yourself a bit at the top, ie making things seem closer than they are?


----------



## SNSDGeeGee

Hey Joker.  I'm debating between Vsonic GR07 and the Philips S1.  I was wondering where you feel S1 lacks compared to the GR07 in terms of sound.  Trying to decide if the GR07 is worth the extra cash.  Isolation isn't important to me and I know you said that is one area S1 falls short.  Also it isn't as comfortable or able to get as good of a fit.  But just in terms of sound how they compare.  Thanks a bunch!


----------



## kobetastic

Hey joker, 
I was wondering if there was a significant difference from the gr07 mk1 compared to the bass edition I found a mk1 for $90 and was wondering if it was worth spending the extra t get the bass edition.


----------



## vwinter

kobetastic said:


> Hey joker,
> I was wondering if there was a significant difference from the gr07 mk1 compared to the bass edition I found a mk1 for $90 and was wondering if it was worth spending the extra t get the bass edition.




New?


----------



## kobetastic

No.


----------



## vwinter

Darn.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





radiohead99 said:


> Reading between the lines, JH13 Pro is probably going to get a 10 out of 10 from you.


 
   
  Probably...
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> are the Sony hybrids compatible with the MEElec A161P?


 
   
  Yes, they fit.
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Joker, you really don't have to rescale your score table. Personally, i just want to see the scores of IEMs or CIEMs in the similar price range. For example, if you really think JH13Pro is better than Miracle a bit, you can straightly score JH13Pro as 10.5 instead of 10.5/10. So It doesn't matter whether the score is over denominator 10 anymore. IMO, it's clearer to show how much those high end CIEM/IEMs better than the lower end
> 
> Another question on CIEMs. What are the differences between Miracle and NT6? Which one you love better?


 
   
   
  While I may just do that as a temporary measure, there's some math I use that wouldn't make a lot of sense with a >1 value for sound quality. Plus, the off-site sortable table may glitch if I do that.
   
  Truth be told, high-end CIEMs aren't necessarily leagues and bounds better than certain top-tier universals and mid-level customs (diminishing returns and all that), so I'd rather not introduce an artificial gap there. 
   
   
  I like the NT 6 a little better than the Miracle. Generally speaking, it's brighter, clearer, and more crisp. The mids are more present and vocals are more intelligible. The presentation is not as laid-back as with the Miracle, either. There's also a touch more bass impact but not as much as with the JH13. I really like the bass and midrange of the NT 6 but I do prefer the smoother treble of the Miracle, and it's a tough call on which presentation I like best. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





hijodelbrx said:


> Sooooo.....my UE5 Pro's have finally failed me for the last time!  The shell on the right bud broke, when I tried to plug in the cable the fine wire (that WAS protected by the shell) snapped.  So I'm looking for a replacement and came across this excellent thread!  I was thinking ER 4P or a Westone 4 but now I'm looking at the ER HR5 and the Rockit R50 as a cheaper alternative.  Being a longtime audiophile, I'll probably wind up with one of the more expensive IEM's but I just wanted to thank you for this thread, it's exactly what I hoped I'd find here!


 
   
   
  Glad it's been helpful!
   
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Oooo scandalous. Do you ever feel that by rescaling it, you squeeze yourself a bit at the top, ie making things seem closer than they are?


 
   
  Actually, sometimes I feel things are closer than they seem... Anyway, because the ranking is more qualitative than quantitative I think rescaling it doesn't detract from the accuracy. The actual order of things typically doesn't change when I re-scale.
   
  Quote: 





snsdgeegee said:


> Hey Joker.  I'm debating between Vsonic GR07 and the Philips S1.  I was wondering where you feel S1 lacks compared to the GR07 in terms of sound.  Trying to decide if the GR07 is worth the extra cash.  Isolation isn't important to me and I know you said that is one area S1 falls short.  Also it isn't as comfortable or able to get as good of a fit.  But just in terms of sound how they compare.  Thanks a bunch!


 
   
   
  Not much, I would call them nearly even in terms of sound quality. The S1 has slightly cooler tone, sounds a little thinner, and isn't quite as spacious overall as the GR07.
   
  Really what you're paying for with the GR07 is the better isolation and over-ear fit. I have an easier time getting a good seal with the GR07 than with the S1/S2, though that may not necessarily be the case for you. 
   
   
  Quote: 





kobetastic said:


> Hey joker,
> I was wondering if there was a significant difference from the gr07 mk1 compared to the bass edition I found a mk1 for $90 and was wondering if it was worth spending the extra t get the bass edition.


 

 If you think the regular GR07 won't have enough bass - yes. Otherwise, no. The GR07 BE review will be up this week but they are quite similar overall.


----------



## prakalejas

List is amazing 
   
  I just have simple question - I like the sound of Koss PortaPro, but I would like to purchase in-ear analogy. Could You recommend some similarly sounding earphones for a reasonable price? I've read lots of reviews, but cannot choose the right ones, because none of them are compared to PortaPro's (which I know how they sound like).
   
  Thank You!


----------



## ljokerl

Added VSonic R02 Silver and GR07 Bass Edition
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A78) VSonic R02 Silver*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2013
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2A30) VSonic GR07 Bass Edition*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2013
> ...


 
   
   
  Quote: 





prakalejas said:


> List is amazing
> 
> I just have simple question - I like the sound of Koss PortaPro, but I would like to purchase in-ear analogy. Could You recommend some similarly sounding earphones for a reasonable price? I've read lots of reviews, but cannot choose the right ones, because none of them are compared to PortaPro's (which I know how they sound like).
> 
> Thank You!


 
   
   
  Generally speaking, the PortaPro is warm and smooth-sounding. If we were to assume that "reasonable price" means <$50, I would go for the Dunu Trident. It won't be as clear or open-sounding, but it'll have a similarly warm, smooth, mid-bassy sound on top of its great build quality. If you wanted to spend a little more, the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE (~$80) or Monster Turbine (~$100). A little more than that and you could go for a Fischer Audio Tandem (~$129) or Yamaha EPH-100 (~$149).


----------



## Lifted Andreas

ljokerl said:


> Added VSonic R02 Silver and GR07 Bass Edition
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't Brainwavz M5 and SoundMAGIC E10 fit the bill as well?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't Brainwavz M5 and SoundMAGIC E10 fit the bill as well?


 

  They would, but not quite as well as the Trident IMO. The M5 is close but bassier than the PortaPro, so potentially too bassy. The E10 is more v-shaped and has some treble emphasis the PortaPro doesn't share.


----------



## suman134

is the " tier 3a " missing ? or its just me ?


----------



## superayush

Yup tier 3a missing


----------



## vwinter

It's a glitch with the system when updating the post because of the size of the post (if i'm not mistaken). It'll be back soon.


----------



## FlySweep

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> They would, but not quite as well as the Trident IMO. The M5 is close but bassier than the PortaPro, so potentially too bassy. The E10 is more v-shaped and has some treble emphasis the PortaPro doesn't share.


 
   
  Another option might be the FXT90.  Like the PP, it's got warm, slightly aggressive, mid-forward "Grado-esque' character.


----------



## gelocks

ljokerl
   
  Hello.
  Awesome thread you have here. Had seen it before but since I'm not really a fan of IEMs I didn't pay more attention . Now, I want to try a couple of IEMs (just because...) and actually asked in other thread about which IEMs were similar to my gear or my faves (MrSpeakers Mad Dogs, Sennheiser HD600s, Ultrasone Signature Pro/DJ)
   
  I got a recommendation for the Hifiman RE-400 which I think will "fit the bill" for the "neutral but with a warm tilt" signature similar to the Senns and MDs. However, for my "bassy" selection to emulate the Signature DJs I was going to choose the *VSonic GR07 Bass Edition* but instead found a deal for the Denon AH-C300s. I don't see these on your list, nor hardly any reviews so, question, have you tried the Denons? If not, what IEM would you say would deliver something similar to my Signature DJs (or if you haven't tried those Ultrasones, V-Moda M100, Yamaha Pro 500, etc.)?
   
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I like the NT 6 a little better than the Miracle. Generally speaking, it's brighter, clearer, and more crisp. The mids are more present and vocals are more intelligible. The presentation is not as laid-back as with the Miracle, either. There's also a touch more bass impact but not as much as with the JH13. I really like the bass and midrange of the NT 6 but I do prefer the smoother treble of the Miracle, and it's a tough call on which presentation I like best.


 
  Thanks so much joker.
  Now i am going for either NT6 or NT6 Pro, since it might be better than Miracle with its soudstage, bass quantity, bright treble, and a lot more clearer details!
  Cheer!


----------



## atomikn00b

joker.
  might want to change the 3A30 you have for the BE to 2A30.
  confused my search function for a second there till I spotted the error.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> It's a glitch with the system when updating the post because of the size of the post (if i'm not mistaken). It'll be back soon.


 
   
  This is correct. The post is too long and takes 24 hours or so to update 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. 
   
  Quote: 





gelocks said:


> ljokerl
> 
> Hello.
> Awesome thread you have here. Had seen it before but since I'm not really a fan of IEMs I didn't pay more attention . Now, I want to try a couple of IEMs (just because...) and actually asked in other thread about which IEMs were similar to my gear or my faves (MrSpeakers Mad Dogs, Sennheiser HD600s, Ultrasone Signature Pro/DJ)
> ...


 
   
  I am not familiar with the Denon C300s (or the Signature DJs for that matter). The GR07 BE is not super bassy - maybe on-level with my V-Moda M-80. It'll be a good compliment to the RE-400 but if you want bass you can feel through your eardrums you may want to grab something else, like the Yamaha EPH-100. 
   
  Quote: 





alias gu said:


> Thanks so much joker.
> Now i am going for either NT6 or NT6 Pro, since it might be better than Miracle with its soudstage, bass quantity, bright treble, and a lot more clearer details!
> Cheer!


 
   




   
  Quote: 





atomikn00b said:


> joker.
> might want to change the 3A30 you have for the BE to 2A30.
> confused my search function for a second there till I spotted the error.


 

 That was my bad. Should be fixed now.


----------



## daleb

If the normal tips that come with IEMs irritate me, what type of tips should I get? I see foam tips, and I also see memory foam tips... Which kind and brand of those should I get, if that's what I'm supposed to be getting?


----------



## Lifted Andreas

daleb said:


> If the normal tips that come with IEMs irritate me, what type of tips should I get? I see foam tips, and I also see memory foam tips... Which kind and brand of those should I get, if that's what I'm supposed to be getting?




Foam = Comply tips

Standard = Sony Hybrids


----------



## gelocks

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am not familiar with the Denon C300s (or the Signature DJs for that matter). The GR07 BE is not super bassy - maybe on-level with my V-Moda M-80. It'll be a good compliment to the RE-400 but if you want bass you can feel through your eardrums you may want to grab something else, like the Yamaha EPH-100.


 
   
  Thanks!


----------



## F-F-




----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daleb said:


> If the normal tips that come with IEMs irritate me, what type of tips should I get? I see foam tips, and I also see memory foam tips... Which kind and brand of those should I get, if that's what I'm supposed to be getting?


 
   
  Comply pretty much has the market on foam tips cornered - IIRC they hold the patent on foam tips with an inner core. If you're talking about the M9, you'll want the T400 size tips. 
   
  Quote: 





f-f- said:


> Hello - thank you for all of these reviews!
> 
> I was wondering if you had any opinions about the *Westone UM1* and *UM2* models as I didn't see them listed here. I'm a visual person and have fallen in love with these. I also read that soft and twisted cords reduce microphonics, and think that these may be my best options.
> 
> ...


 

 Unfortunately I've never heard the UM1 or UM2. I can't provide ratings, or even an opinion, on items I haven't had firsthand experience with.
   
  The W2 is pretty good though - arguably the most balanced of the Westone IEMs. It is true that over-ear earphones with twisted cables typically have zero or almost zero microphonics.


----------



## zzffnn

Thanks ljokerl for your always helpful reviews. Please kindly comment on isolation measurements of some VSonic IEMs.
  
 Do you happen to have isolation measurements (i.e., broadband isolation by Innerfidelity) of VSonic VC1000s and GR01s? GR01s' isolation seems to be inconsistent among people; some said it's isolation is average, while others said it is good enough for train/plane.
  
I am also surprised by Tyll / Innerfidelity's isolation measurement of VC02s. Their isolation value of -21 db sounds very surprisingly low for a pair deeply-inserted IEMs. I understand that they have micro drivers and not BAs, but based on their shape, I would expect broadband isolation around -30 db (if not -40 db like ER4s with foam).

Tyll's measurement indicates that VC02s may not isolate much more than GR07s. Does that match your experience? I also saw a 5 db difference in Tyll's isolation measurement of the GR07s (-19 db) and GR07 BEs (-24 db). Was that caused by different tips, different insertion depth or something else?
  
Thanks so much.
  
Eidt: The reason why I am asking is because I am looking for isolation IEMs, which do not sound as bright as ER4s but get close in terms of isolation (want close to -40 db broadband isolation). VCR02s or VC1000s look promising and are not expensive  , though I am not sure about their isolation. Sound quality is not a concern (I have acrylic CIEM for that task, which sound good but only isolate around -30db). I have Sleek SA6s which isolation very well with Shure olives (they can be inserted deeply) but it's cable broke on me twice.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Comply pretty much has the market on foam tips cornered - IIRC they hold the patent on foam tips with an inner core. If you're talking about the M9, you'll want the T400 size tips.


 
  Which size should I get of the T400s? I will still be getting the VC02s, so I probably need more then one size...


----------



## Change is Good

I'm sorry if this has been asked already. Which comply tips fit on the GR07? I prefer foam tips and the grey ones that came in stock work well but are slightly big for my ears. Are those large sized? I ask so I have a better idea of which size to get once I find out which model fits.


----------



## jdg0717

how come impedance for the fitear 334 is N/A ??


----------



## Alias Gu

Quote: 





jdg0717 said:


> how come impedance for the fitear 334 is N/A ??


 
  Not much information is posted on Fitear.
  So that's N/A.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daleb said:


> Which size should I get of the T400s? I will still be getting the VC02s, so I probably need more then one size...


 
   
  The T400s will fit on the M9 but not the VC02 so you may want to hold off on getting them if you're switching earphones.
   
  Quote: 





change is good said:


> I'm sorry if this has been asked already. Which comply tips fit on the GR07? I prefer foam tips and the grey ones that came in stock work well but are slightly big for my ears. Are those large sized? I ask so I have a better idea of which size to get once I find out which model fits.


 
   
  I am not sure which size fits but I know mine don't fit - the *200s are too small and the *400s are too large. The stock GR07 tips are medium-ish in size but Comply foam is softer so medium Complys may still work well for you.
   
  Quote: 





jdg0717 said:


> how come impedance for the fitear 334 is N/A ??


 

 Couldn't find the number.


----------



## Change is Good

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I am not sure which size fits but I know mine don't fit - the *200s are too small and the *400s are too large. The stock GR07 tips are medium-ish in size but Comply foam is softer so medium Complys may still work well for you.


 
   
  So which Comply model should I choose? Will these (Ts500) fit on the Gr07?
   
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AQU2U48/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2QWCGRX6ZBEDE


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





change is good said:


> So which Comply model should I choose? Will these (Ts500) fit on the Gr07?
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AQU2U48/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2QWCGRX6ZBEDE


 
   
  Nope. Too wide.


----------



## Change is Good

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Nope. Too wide.


 
  Ok then which ones?


----------



## jdg0717

ok thanks... was curious about impedance for pairing purposes


----------



## garcsa

RE-400 USD 99,- shipped: http://head-direct.com/Products/?act=detail&id=143 .
  3 days from HKG to HUN.


----------



## amzies01

Quote: 





change is good said:


> Ok then which ones?


 
   
  For the VC02s, Comply size 100 foam tips will do...any kind.. .Ts or T,.. .


----------



## Change is Good

Quote: 





amzies01 said:


> For the VC02s, Comply size 100 foam tips will do...any kind.. .Ts or T,.. .


 
  Thank you for the response but I was referring to the GR07. Will they fit on those,also?


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





change is good said:


> Ok then which ones?


 
   
  I'm not quite sure, but I have the 500s here, and they're too big. 
   
  Sorry


----------



## amzies01

Quote: 





change is good said:


> Thank you for the response but I was referring to the GR07. Will they fit on those,also?


 
  Yes they will... If you stretch the inner tube with a pen first. It's prolly the same size nozzle with the VC02 anyway. But reading around Head-fi, I found people saying T-200 will fit GR07.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> RE-400 USD 99,- shipped: http://head-direct.com/Products/?act=detail&id=143 .
> 3 days from HKG to HUN.


 

 Is that not the regular price? Unless they changed it I thought it was always $99


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Is that not the regular price? Unless they changed it I thought it was always $99


 
  it is the shipping  that´s free


----------



## lilboozy

Joker I'm looking for a bassy in ear for 35$. The more bass the better and it's only too much when it starts overshadowing stuff. I would prefer a balanced mid to treble ratio however it could be vshaped/dark if the sq makes up for it e.g. vsonic gro2


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Is that not the regular price? Unless they changed it I thought it was always $99


 
*I don"t know... Just paid on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 and received from DHL on Friday, May 17, 2013.*
*Thats all for USD 99,00 , included postage . HongKong  -  Hungary as I said 3 days.*
   
*Just out box - very satisfied - can"t stopped with listening ! If yes the RE400 is on pink noise.*


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Joker I'm looking for a bassy in ear for 35$. The more bass the better and it's only too much when it starts overshadowing stuff. I would prefer a balanced mid to treble ratio however it could be vshaped/dark if the sq makes up for it e.g. vsonic gro2


 
   
  You can't really have a ton of bass without it getting in the way. I guess something with a ton of subbass boost would be closest - the RHA MA-350, for example. 
   
  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> *can"t stopped with listening ! *


 

 Agreed. Just got back from my morning walk with something similar:


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You can't really have a ton of bass without it getting in the way. I guess something with a ton of subbass boost would be closest - the RHA MA-350, for example.


 
  I meant when it gets ridiculously overshadowed.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> I meant when it gets ridiculously overshadowed.


 

 Yeah, MA-350 would be an option, then. If you just want a ton of bass there's also the cheaper JVC FX101 but it bleeds more and the treble is more harsh.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

barry cheddar said:


> By the way - *best value iems I have ever had and which I now use are the Sound magic E10s.* Can't believe I wasted so much time and money in the past trying to satisfy an itch that was clearly delusional.




Amen to that!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





barry cheddar said:


> Joker - a couple of questions:
> 
> 1) what what sort of music do you like? What are your favourite albums?
> 2) do you ever wonder if you miss the wood for the trees in all of this?


 

 I lean towards rock/metal but I enjoy a mix of everything. There are a lot of albums I consider essential - if my music library were wiped tomorrow I'd need to re-purchase at least 100 the next day (yes, I have a list). They range from classics like _Friday Night in San Francisco_ to Porcupine Tree's _The Sky Moves Sideways _to more recent releases such as Isis' - _Panopticon_.
   
   
  I still take time to listen to music. At home I often use speakers so I am not temped to think about the medium. On the go, whatever IEMs I have handy are fine, as long as they are not complete crap.


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  how would you compare W4 and G07 bass edition? I'm looking for a slightly bassier, fuller sounding W4. Would G07 be a good move or will it be a downgrade?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> how would you compare W4 and G07 bass edition? I'm looking for a slightly bassier, fuller sounding W4. Would G07 be a good move or will it be a downgrade?


 

 I'm not sure it's what you're after. It might have better subbass but the mid-bass should be similar to the W4 and the mids are farther back, so it won't really sound fuller than the W4.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

I have a question: if I plan to buy a double flanges tip, which size should I pick given that I use medium size tips? should it be the same size or one size smaller?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> I have a question: if I plan to buy a double flanges tip, which size should I pick given that I use medium size tips? should it be the same size or one size smaller?


 

 It really depends on the type of double flange - e.g. not all medium double-flanges are the same size. It really varies quite a bit by manufacturer.


----------



## garcsa

...


----------



## garcsa

...


----------



## garcsa

... sorry ...


----------



## Mimouille

Is this a long silence to build up the atmosphere before a killer post ?


----------



## aras

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'm not sure it's what you're after. It might have better subbass but the mid-bass should be similar to the W4 and the mids are farther back, so it won't really sound fuller than the W4.


 
  Thanks Joker! What IEMs should I look for in that case which will provide me slightly more bass and fuller sound than W4 without overshadowing the mids?


----------



## Sweden

Quote: 





change is good said:


> Thank you for the response but I was referring to the GR07. Will they fit on those,also?


 
   
  No Comply Foam tip will fit the GR07 according to Comply Foam.


----------



## RapidPulse

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Is this a long silence to build up the atmosphere before a killer post ?


 
  Now that's funny 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





aras said:


> Thanks Joker! What IEMs should I look for in that case which will provide me slightly more bass and fuller sound than W4 without overshadowing the mids?


 
  Not Joker obviously....but SM3 would do the trick


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Is this a long silence to build up the atmosphere before a killer post ?


 
  lol


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





sweden said:


> No Comply Foam tip will fit the GR07 according to Comply Foam.


 
  LOL Seriously? I've fitted t100 on gr07, so t200 is pretty easy for me without even extra stretching. That's a pic of gr04 flagship which has exactly the same size nozzle with red comply t100 but honestly gr07 doesn't sound its best with foam tips at all - the sony mh1c tips were my favorites


----------



## hi-fi amateur

I was on the verge of buying the ba200 but opted for the gr07 mk2 instead. Did I make the right choice? Ultimately I want to know which one of those two is better.


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





hi-fi amateur said:


> I was on the verge of buying the ba200 but opted for the gr07 mk2 instead. Did I make the right choice? Ultimately I want to know which one of those two is better.


 
   
  They're pretty close, I would say.  Depending on what you are looking for, it could go either way.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





aras said:


> Thanks Joker! What IEMs should I look for in that case which will provide me slightly more bass and fuller sound than W4 without overshadowing the mids?


 
   
  I agree that the SM3 does that, but I’ve only heard the v1 and not the v2 or the new SM64. I would also considering going custom with the 1964-V3 instead.
   
  Quote: 





hi-fi amateur said:


> I was on the verge of buying the ba200 but opted for the gr07 mk2 instead. Did I make the right choice? Ultimately I want to know which one of those two is better.


 

 I haven't heard the BA200 myself.


----------



## hi-fi amateur

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> They're pretty close, I would say.  Depending on what you are looking for, it could go either way.


 
  I would like to consider my music library eclectic but most of what I listen to is hip-hop/bass dominant tracks. Which IEM between the gr07 and ba200 is best with those tracks?


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





hi-fi amateur said:


> I would like to consider my music library eclectic but most of what I listen to is hip-hop/bass dominant tracks. Which IEM between the gr07 and ba200 is best with those tracks?


 
  It would go with your preference for balance of low to mid bass. You already ordered so don't second guess yourself. Wait until you get it, burn it in for just a few hours, nothing drastic like 300, and have a listen to a few tracks. If you think its great, then great, if you feel its lacking something, PM me and I'll tell you if the BA200 has what you think is lacking.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the BA200 myself.


 
   
  Let me know if you ever want to.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It really depends on the type of double flange - e.g. not all medium double-flanges are the same size. It really varies quite a bit by manufacturer.


 
  well looks like you no longer have the HA-FX40 but I will ask anyway. One guy bought these tips http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Eartips_p/ts1-df-50-cl.htm  for his FX40 and he said they are too big for his ears, so I would like to know which double flange tips has similar size with fx40 stock tips, also any tip for choosing tips size?


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

Have you guys heard of the Meze 11 Classics?
http://www.mezeheadphones.com/meze11classics.html
   
  And if so what's your opinion on those.


----------



## nicholars

Deleted


----------



## Bina

Quote: 





lost dark soul said:


> Have you guys heard of the Meze 11 Classics?
> http://www.mezeheadphones.com/meze11classics.html
> 
> And if so what's your opinion on those.


 
  From my information, Meze are just rebranded and heavily overpriced headphones from ESmooth http://www.woodheadphones.com/products


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





bina said:


> From my information, Meze are just rebranded and heavily overpriced headphones from ESmooth http://www.woodheadphones.com/products


 

 but where to buy them?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Let me know if you ever want to.


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> well looks like you no longer have the HA-FX40 but I will ask anyway. One guy bought these tips http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Eartips_p/ts1-df-50-cl.htm  for his FX40 and he said they are too big for his ears, so I would like to know which double flange tips has similar size with fx40 stock tips, also any tip for choosing tips size?


 
   
  Then you probably want the shorter double-flanges from here: http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_M11_Earphones_p/tipset10-m11-cl-mee.htm . I would say medium or even small to get close to the stock FX40 tips in size. You could probably just get all three to be safe.
   
  Quote: 





lost dark soul said:


> Have you guys heard of the Meze 11 Classics?
> http://www.mezeheadphones.com/meze11classics.html
> 
> And if so what's your opinion on those.


 
   
  Never heard of them.
   
  Quote: 





bina said:


> From my information, Meze are just rebranded and heavily overpriced headphones from ESmooth http://www.woodheadphones.com/products


 

 Ah, I remember seeing those long ago. They have some nice-looking designs.


----------



## tinara

Is it a big difference between the VSonic GR07 BE, JVC FXT90 and the Westone UM2? I'm currently owner of the UM2 and I'm looking after the GR07 BE or/and the FXT 90 to replace them. Is it a downgrade on SQ or not? Thank you


----------



## TheQsanity

I have yet to read the whole thread by OP but I just would like to thank OP for all the work and time for this thread! It's a great resource!


----------



## TheQsanity

oops repeat


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

what would you consider joker the MG7 Pro or GR07 BE? seeing how i like bass in all but, vocals need to be really decent like or close to the Westone's? Seeing how their the same price in all.


----------



## Niyologist

I'll have the MEElectronics M-DUO Review link posted here soon.


----------



## aras

Joker,
   
  What do you think is a direct upgrade from eph-100 under $600?  I like the sound signature but I would like maybe slightly tighter bass.


----------



## quartertone

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'll have the MEElectronics M-DUO Review link posted here soon.


 
  Nice! Any clues?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tinara said:


> Is it a big difference between the VSonic GR07 BE, JVC FXT90 and the Westone UM2? I'm currently owner of the UM2 and I'm looking after the GR07 BE or/and the FXT 90 to replace them. Is it a downgrade on SQ or not? Thank you


 

 I’m not familiar with the UM2. The FXT90 is a little more v-shaped than the GR07BE, with more mid-bass emphasis and a bit more treble sparkle overall. No idea if they are an upgrade to the UM2 or not.
   
  Quote: 





theqsanity said:


> I have yet to read the whole thread by OP but I just would like to thank OP for all the work and time for this thread! It's a great resource!


 
  Thanks, glad the thread has been useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





lost dark soul said:


> what would you consider joker the MG7 Pro or GR07 BE? seeing how i like bass in all but, vocals need to be really decent like or close to the Westone's? Seeing how their the same price in all.


 
   
   
  The GR07BE, especially if you care about vocals. The MG7 has good mids, considering the bass quantity, but it's not as balanced and refined as the GR07 in that respect.
   
   
  Quote: 





aras said:


> Joker,
> 
> What do you think is a direct upgrade from eph-100 under $600?  I like the sound signature but I would like maybe slightly tighter bass.


 

 Unfortunately I'm not aware of one. I would say the Westone ES5 is a direct upgrade but that's quite pricy.


----------



## RoKr93

Thank you very much to Joker for a truly astounding effort with this thread. I only joined the forums very recently, but about a year back I used this thread (the result of some Googling) to select a pair of VSonic GR06s for myself. Unfortunately I never really found them to be extremely comfortable in my ears, but the sound quality was definitely on point, so thanks for that! Sadly the left ear has stopped working on them already, and I got them online for a really low price with no warranty. Caveat emptor, I suppose.
   
  I was wondering if you could possibly point me toward a pair of IEMs with these criteria:
   
  - $50 or under
  - Preferably worn straight down, but I can deal with over-the-ear
  - Isolation is paramount; I do a lot of flying and airplane noise behind my music annoys me if it's too overwhelming. This was my main problem with the GR06s: for some reason, despite the massive variety of earbud tips it came with, I was unable to get a truly complete seal with them, which was bothersome and generally uncomfortable.
  - I tend to prefer an analytical-ish sound, though not on the level of, say, Etymotic Research stuff. I listen to a very wide variety of music including classical, jazz, indie rock, and electronic.
   
  I realize that I won't be getting something crazy good for $50, but hopefully I can find a solid pair- I would be willing to stretch the price range a little bit for something really great.
   
  Thanks again!


----------



## tinara

ljokerl said:


> I’m not familiar with the UM2. The FXT90 is a little more v-shaped than the GR07BE, with more mid-bass emphasis and a bit more treble sparkle overall. No idea if they are an upgrade to the UM2 or not.




Thank you for your answer. By crossing reviews, your answers to other people, I think I have a better umderstanding of the strengh and weakness for each iem.


----------



## Niyologist

quartertone said:


> Nice! Any clues?




Not yet. I haven't gotten it yet, but I will very soon. Very near in the future (In about 10 days).


----------



## Free167

Hi all,
   
  I have owned my JVC-FXT90L2 for over a month now.  The SQ is better than all of my previous IEMs, however, I found that for some songs the vocals are sibilant while for others the vocals are not strong enough (compared to the instruments).  Should I have chosen EPH-100?


----------



## Lifted Andreas

free167 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I have owned my JVC-FXT90L2 for over a month now.  The SQ is better than all of my previous IEMs, however, I found that for some songs the vocals are sibilant while for others the vocals are not strong enough (compared to the instruments).  Should I have chosen EPH-100?




EPH100 would be better for trance and general EDM music.


----------



## prakalejas

I have just recieved Trident DN-12 and boy oh boy, what a disappointment - they sound no where near PortaPro and compared to samsungs S3 original headphones fixes only annoying sound at high frequencies (but still too much highs for my taste). Compared even to stock samsung headphones, Trident has almost no bass and sounds flat. Overall Trident sounds like outside the window, music is somewhere else (sorry, but this the only way I can describe it). Middle range and clarity is good. Do I do something wrong or should I wait for that good sound to arrive? Or is it even possible to get that solid sound of PortaPro's in an in-ear headphones?
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Generally speaking, the PortaPro is warm and smooth-sounding. If we were to assume that "reasonable price" means <$50, I would go for the Dunu Trident. It won't be as clear or open-sounding, but it'll have a similarly warm, smooth, mid-bassy sound on top of its great build quality. If you wanted to spend a little more, the Beyerdynamic DTX 101 iE (~$80) or Monster Turbine (~$100). A little more than that and you could go for a Fischer Audio Tandem (~$129) or Yamaha EPH-100 (~$149).


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Then you probably want the shorter double-flanges from here: http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_M11_Earphones_p/tipset10-m11-cl-mee.htm . I would say medium or even small to get close to the stock FX40 tips in size. You could probably just get all three to be safe.


 
   
Okay, will check them out
   
   
   
  Quote:


free167 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I have owned my JVC-FXT90L2 for over a month now.  The SQ is better than all of my previous IEMs, however, I found that for some songs the vocals are sibilant while for others the vocals are not strong enough (compared to the instruments).  Should I have chosen EPH-100?


 
   
  Could it be that the tracks are recorded/mixed/mastered differently?


----------



## prakalejas

No, same device/same track, just switching between earphones. Trident just sound distant and flat. Vocal music would be nice, but pop/rock/techno music sounds without energy.
  Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> Could it be that the tracks are recorded/mixed/mastered differently?


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





prakalejas said:


> No, same device/same track, just switching between earphones. Trident just sound distant and flat. Vocal music would be nice, but pop/rock/techno music sounds without energy.


 
  uhm I was replying to Free167, I don't own any Trident so I cant help you sorry


----------



## Free167

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> Could it be that the tracks are recorded/mixed/mastered differently?


 

 They are did recorded differently, but some do sound sibilant compared to my old Denon.  Maybe the JVC somehow exaggerate those tracks' sibilance?


----------



## Grayson73

Anyone compare the Audio Technica ATH-CLR100, ATH-COR150, ATH-CKN50, and ATH-CKN70 to the IEMs on this list?  They are getting some buzz in the discovery thread.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





free167 said:


> They are did recorded differently, but some do sound sibilant compared to my old Denon.  Maybe the JVC somehow exaggerate those tracks' sibilance?


 
   
  Possibly. It seems like many JVC's models tend to emphasize sibilance at some point. I did buy FXT90 but they are not in my hands now, though I can say same thing happens to my HA-FX40


----------



## justblue

Great job |joker|, your IEMs ranking is just superb! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 I've been looking for a long time for something better than Brainwavz ProAlpha (more refined, more wow factor) but with similar sound signature: warm (reasonably bassy), sweet but detailed and airy - especially natural sounding, like ProAlpha does for me. What would you recommend?


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The GR07BE, especially if you care about vocals. The MG7 has good mids, considering the bass quantity, but it's not as balanced and refined as the GR07 in that respect.


 
   
  Ok how do you feel about the over the ear part i never liked sony's over the head design for earbuds. i'm not highly sure what it feels like and if i dont care for them its going to suck seeing how you cant wear those straight down.
   
  And do you think its worth the upgrade from the Klipsch s4's? TIA


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rokr93 said:


> Thank you very much to Joker for a truly astounding effort with this thread. I only joined the forums very recently, but about a year back I used this thread (the result of some Googling) to select a pair of VSonic GR06s for myself. Unfortunately I never really found them to be extremely comfortable in my ears, but the sound quality was definitely on point, so thanks for that! Sadly the left ear has stopped working on them already, and I got them online for a really low price with no warranty. Caveat emptor, I suppose.
> 
> I was wondering if you could possibly point me toward a pair of IEMs with these criteria:
> 
> ...


 
   
  Etymotic Etykids, maybe? They aren’t as thin-sounding as the BA-based Ety sets. I haven’t done a full review but I’ve heard them three times now and have always been impressed. You simply won’t beat the isolation for the price. The Etys won’t have as much bass the GR06 but (without A:Bing) I would say the quality of the mids/treble would be nearly on-par. Another option might be the VSonic VC02 but it won’t isolate as much as the Etykids and sounds brighter overall. If you want something with more bass and are willing to give up a chunk of isolation the UE500 might work for you - it comes with Comply tips and has above-average isolation. Most of the appeal is in that it's currently quite cheap, typically <$40 on amazon.

  
  Quote: 





free167 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I have owned my JVC-FXT90L2 for over a month now.  The SQ is better than all of my previous IEMs, however, I found that for some songs the vocals are sibilant while for others the vocals are not strong enough (compared to the instruments).  Should I have chosen EPH-100?


 
   
  Sounds like you don’t like the v-shaped sound. The EPH100 has more focus on the mids relative to the treble so in that respect it should be better. The only caution would be if you’re used to very forward upper mids, which present forward and sort of ‘shouty’ vocals, from some other headphone. The EPH-100 doesn’t do that.
  
  Quote: 





prakalejas said:


> I have just recieved Trident DN-12 and boy oh boy, what a disappointment - they sound no where near PortaPro and compared to samsungs S3 original headphones fixes only annoying sound at high frequencies (but still too much highs for my taste). Compared even to stock samsung headphones, Trident has almost no bass and sounds flat. Overall Trident sounds like outside the window, music is somewhere else (sorry, but this the only way I can describe it). Middle range and clarity is good. Do I do something wrong or should I wait for that good sound to arrive? Or is it even possible to get that solid sound of PortaPro's in an in-ear headphones?


 
   
  It sounds like you’re not getting a proper seal with the Trident – the lack of proper imaging, weak bass, and excessive treble are all indicators of a bad acoustic seal.
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> Great job |joker|, your IEMs ranking is just superb!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  It depends on your budget. The aging Brainwavz M2 is a more refined ProAlpha at $50 or so. It’s not a huge step up, though. If you’re okay with a brighter sound something a little more v-shaped, like the Astrotec AM-800 ($65), would be a good option. 
   
  Quote: 





lost dark soul said:


> Ok how do you feel about the over the ear part i never liked sony's over the head design for earbuds. i'm not highly sure what it feels like and if i dont care for them its going to suck seeing how you cant wear those straight down.
> 
> And do you think its worth the upgrade from the Klipsch s4's? TIA


 
   
  That's down the individual. I prefer over-the-ear earphones, personally - the fit is typically very stable and cable doesn't bother me at all. 
   
  I don't like the S4 all that much so for me it's a worthwhile upgrade but again it really depends on what you're looking for. The S4 is pretty biased towards mid-bass and treble. The GR07BE is not.


----------



## kobetastic

Hey joker,
   
  What would you say is a good dac to purchase around $300 that would work well with the GR07 or Westone W2's. Do you think using a dac with these iem's would make a difference in sound quality?
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Etymotic Etykids, maybe? They aren’t as thin-sounding as the BA-based Ety sets. I haven’t done a full review but I’ve heard them three times now and have always been impressed. You simply won’t beat the isolation for the price. The Etys won’t have as much bass the GR06 but (without A:Bing) I would say the quality of the mids/treble would be nearly on-par. Another option might be the VSonic VC02 but it won’t isolate as much as the Etykids and sounds brighter overall. If you want something with more bass and are willing to give up a chunk of isolation the UE500 might work for you - it comes with Comply tips and has above-average isolation. Most of the appeal is in that it's currently quite cheap, typically <$40 on amazon.


 
  sound like a better sounding and better deal than the MC's series?


----------



## justblue

ljokerl said:


> It depends on your budget. The aging Brainwavz M2 is a more refined ProAlpha at $50 or so. It’s not a huge step up, though. If you’re okay with a brighter sound something a little more v-shaped, like the Astrotec AM-800 ($65), would be a good option.




Thanks. I can spend up to 170$. M2 are a little bit too bassy compared to more balanced ProAlpha (I like bass, it should be strong but not too much and overwhelming like in SoundMAGIC E10). I would prefer smooth treble and sweet sounding. Recently I've tried Yamaha EPH-100 (I couldn't stand quite harsh high frequency drums like tambourine and its horrible microphonics - except that, they are great). After your last reviews I bought Vsonic R02 Silver in hope they deliver better sound, I'll see. Of course I'm open to your suggestions.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

justblue said:


> Thanks. I can spend up to 170$. M2 are a little bit too bassy compared to more balanced ProAlpha (I like bass, it should be strong but not too much and overwhelming like in SoundMAGIC E10). I would prefer smooth treble and sweet sounding. Recently I've tried Yamaha EPH-100 (I couldn't stand quite harsh high frequency drums like tambourine and its horrible microphonics - except that, they are great). After your last reviews I bought Vsonic R02 Silver in hope they deliver better sound, I'll see. Of course I'm open for your suggestions.




Did you let the EPH100 burn in? 

Mine have no harsh treble whatsoever. I find them quite smooth and balanced.


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Did you let the EPH100 burn in?
> 
> Mine have no harsh treble whatsoever. I find them quite smooth and balanced.


 
   
  Yes, it took over 50 hours. It's strange, because I don't find EPH-100's treble harsh entirely - I noticed only problem with excessively exposed drums (cymbals, tambourines ect). Nevermind, maybe I'm to sensitive to it, now I'm searching for something different, but in line with my sounding expectations. I like ProAlpha, they're great for the money, but I want something better quality, more accurate but still sweet, warm and natural.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Quote: 





justblue said:


> Yes, it took over 50 hours. It's strange, because I don't find EPH-100's treble harsh entirely - I noticed only problem with excessively exposed drums (cymbals, tambourines ect). Nevermind, maybe I'm to sensitive to it, now I'm searching for something different, but in line with my sounding expectations. I like ProAlpha, they're great for the money, but I want something better quality, more accurate but still sweet, warm and natural.


 
   
  Ah I see, yeah it could be many things... source, audio itself etc...
   
  Maybe the Fischer Audio Tandem fits the bill for you?


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Maybe the Fischer Audio Tandem fits the bill for you?


 
   
  I know them, nope, they're too mid-centric, like earbuds - focused on vocals with lacking bass. Also I don't find them better enough than ProAlpha in other aspects, to make it profitable spending 89$ for FA Tandem.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Quote: 





justblue said:


> I know them, nope, they're too mid-centric, like earbuds - focused on vocals with lacking bass. Also I don't find them better enough than ProAlpha in other aspects, to make it profitable spending 89$ for FA Tandem.


 
   
  Might be good for you to check out the discovery thread, you will probably find something you like there:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/586909/the-discovery-thread-new-jant71s-take-on-the-new-ath-clr100-pg-618-zero-audio-carbo-basso-pg-601
   
  I ordered these yesterday, really hoping they might be an improvement over the Yams:
  http://www.amazon.co.jp/ZERO-AUDIO-%E3%82%A4%E3%83%B3%E3%83%8A%E3%83%BC%E3%82%A4%E3%83%A4%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B9%E3%83%86%E3%83%AC%E3%82%AA%E3%83%98%E3%83%83%E3%83%89%E3%83%9B%E3%83%B3-%E3%83%86%E3%83%8E%E3%83%BC%E3%83%AC-ZH-DX200-CT/dp/B0093VVP0Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1369305991&sr=8-1&keywords=carbo+tenore+zh-dx200-ct


----------



## Free167

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sounds like you don’t like the v-shaped sound. The EPH100 has more focus on the mids relative to the treble so in that respect it should be better. The only caution would be if you’re used to very forward upper mids, which present forward and sort of ‘shouty’ vocals, from some other headphone. The EPH-100 doesn’t do that.


 
   
  Wish I could find a shop in Hong Kong which has EPH-100 for demo ... anyway, I would say I'm happy with the sound of FXT-90 for most of my tracks.  Thanks for the reply.


----------



## Astrud

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You can't really have a ton of bass without it getting in the way. I guess something with a ton of subbass boost would be closest - the RHA MA-350, for example.
> 
> 
> Agreed. Just got back from my morning walk with something similar:


 
  Hi ljoker, Seems that your ear canals a bit tighter than mine...I have enormous ones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





!  Resolved this with Meelec big short double flanges - enhanced with some 3M foams. Prefer short  tips , better soundstage IMO.
  BTW great reviews! Thanks


----------



## prakalejas

You are right! I've tested all seals and with only 1 set the sound turn from bad/awful to wonderful and just right for me  Never had in-ear headphones and didn't realise, that seals makes most of the sound properties.
  THANK YOU for good recommendation and a professional advice.
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It sounds like you’re not getting a proper seal with the Trident – the lack of proper imaging, weak bass, and excessive treble are all indicators of a bad acoustic seal.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kobetastic said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> What would you say is a good dac to purchase around $300 that would work well with the GR07 or Westone W2's. Do you think using a dac with these iem's would make a difference in sound quality?
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  It depends on your source. A good-quality portable player isn't far behind a good DAC in sound quality and probably not worth upgrading. A (non-Apple) smartphone or sub-par computer sound card, on the other hand, can definitely be worth switching from. I've only tried one new DAC in recent history - the Sunrise Audio Ray. My thoughts can be found here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/660291/short-review-sunrise-audio-ray-excellent-portable-dac-amp
    
  Quote:


zelda said:


> sound like a better sounding and better deal than the MC's series?


 
   
  Yeah, I thought so, I wanted to do a full write-up but haven't had the time.
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> Thanks. I can spend up to 170$. M2 are a little bit too bassy compared to more balanced ProAlpha (I like bass, it should be strong but not too much and overwhelming like in SoundMAGIC E10). I would prefer smooth treble and sweet sounding. Recently I've tried Yamaha EPH-100 (I couldn't stand quite harsh high frequency drums like tambourine and its horrible microphonics - except that, they are great). After your last reviews I bought Vsonic R02 Silver in hope they deliver better sound, I'll see. Of course I'm open to your suggestions.


 
   
  Hmm... I didn't get any harshness from the EPH-100 either. It wasn't a smooth as the Tandem (for example) but it wasn't really harsh. I think you should try the R02 Silver and see what you think, then go from there. Might not have enough subbass if the Tandem didn't. I haven't heard the ProAlpha in a while (though I still have my M1 and M2) so the R02 Silver might be a better starting point for an upgrade.
   
  Quote: 





astrud said:


> Hi ljoker, Seems that your ear canals a bit tighter than mine...I have enormous ones
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Wow, that makes them look positively tiny...
   
  Quote: 





prakalejas said:


> You are right! I've tested all seals and with only 1 set the sound turn from bad/awful to wonderful and just right for me  Never had in-ear headphones and didn't realise, that seals makes most of the sound properties.
> THANK YOU for good recommendation and a professional advice.


 

 Great, glad they're sounding better


----------



## MastermindJapan

Thanks for the informative thread.
   
Just something I wanted to clarify, with the ratings given to each IEM within their respective price sections;
   
are the values standard and linear across the price platforms?
   
For example in the $0-$15, we have* **(3C21)** Monoprice 8320 (MEP-933)** rated with a Sound rating of 7.5/10.*
   
*Would this 7.5 rating be directly comparable to something from the $30-$60 section, for example (3A5) **Soundmagic PL50* rated 6.9/10 in terms of sound?
   
Would this mean that The monoprice 8320 has a better sound than the soundmagic PL50?
   
Or are the ratings confined within their own price range?
   
Thanks for the clarification.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mastermindjapan said:


> Thanks for the informative thread.
> 
> Just something I wanted to clarify, with the ratings given to each IEM within their respective price sections;
> 
> are the values standard and linear across the price platforms?


 

 Yep, it's all the same scale. No discrimination based on price, which is why things like the MEP-933 are such good value (for sound at least, not so much everything else).


----------



## MastermindJapan

Thanks for the clarification, really helpful!


----------



## Grayson73

I'm a purist at heart; I want to hear what the sound mixer intended for me to hear.  Which type of IEM am I looking for?


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> I'm a purist at heart; I want to hear what the sound mixer intended for me to hear.  According to the first page categorizations, which type of IEM am I looking for?


 
  Anything your mixer(s) use, because every headphones/IEMs sounds different from each other, you will never reach the so called "hearing what music musicians intended" unless you use the same equipment as they do- oh wait you even need same ear shape, same brain and maybe even same skull shape because people have different hearing too eh?
   
  Anyway, sounds like you are up to some thing with neutral sound signature.


----------



## NIVEBL

Is MC5 hard to drive?I would like to use IP5 or IPC+HP-P1 to drive it.


----------



## KorkiPoo

The Etymotic MC5 runs great on my Sansa Clip+, I tried using it with an amp but I haven't noticed any improvements in sound when amping it.


----------



## vwinter

Hey Joker, which of the Ety Kids models did you like, the 3 or the 5?

My friend is looking for a model with good clarity and decent soundstage for about $35. The Ety Kids 5 is there which is why I ask. Is there anything you can recommend that is easy to purchase in the US pretty quickly?

Thanks


----------



## daleb

What would be the best IEMs for isolation and  comfort under $50? I have never had a pair of IEMs not cause very strong pain from the build up of pressure (both in air pressure to the ear drums and pressure to the outer walls), and they never isolate as much as I want. Sounds actually secondary to all that, but I don't want a painful sound quality if I can... so neutral or laid-back, something to relax to.


----------



## InRainbows

Does anyone know if these http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B005EM9KRI/ref=pd_aw_sbs_cps_1?pi=SL500_SS115 are the same as the vsonic gr02 silver that were recently added to this thread? If not what are they?!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> I'm a purist at heart; I want to hear what the sound mixer intended for me to hear.  Which type of IEM am I looking for?


 
   
   
  Probably something balanced to introduce the least coloration. Etymotic would be a good start.
   
   
  Quote: 





nivebl said:


> Is MC5 hard to drive?I would like to use IP5 or IPC+HP-P1 to drive it.


 
   
   
  No, not really. A portable device should be okay without an amp.  
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Hey Joker, which of the Ety Kids models did you like, the 3 or the 5?
> 
> My friend is looking for a model with good clarity and decent soundstage for about $35. The Ety Kids 5 is there which is why I ask. Is there anything you can recommend that is easy to purchase in the US pretty quickly?
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  I’m pretty sure the 3 and 5 are the same except for the mic/remote, same as with the HF3/HF5. I can’t say much about the soundstage since I don’t have a pair here but the clarity is great for the price.

 I think the VSonic VC02 is available on amazon now as well so that would be another option.
   
  Quote: 





daleb said:


> What would be the best IEMs for isolation and  comfort under $50? I have never had a pair of IEMs not cause very strong pain from the build up of pressure (both in air pressure to the ear drums and pressure to the outer walls), and they never isolate as much as I want. Sounds actually secondary to all that, but I don't want a painful sound quality if I can... so neutral or laid-back, something to relax to.


 
   
  Comfort is quite subjective but I would go for something sealed with foam tips. If you can’t tolerate a deep insertion, maybe something like a UE500 - it's been hovering at $30 or so on amazon and already comes with some Complys.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





inrainbows said:


> Does anyone know if these http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B005EM9KRI/ref=pd_aw_sbs_cps_1?pi=SL500_SS115 are the same as the vsonic gr02 silver that were recently added to this thread? If not what are they?!


 
   
   
  No. The Silver is a different color and has a different diameter nozzle.


----------



## goldtuba

i just wanted to give you another thank you post for all of your hard work for this thread.  because of you, i've bought a hifiman re262 and an meelec 6.  with your combined review with DavidMahler's flagship reviews i also got a pair of westone 4's.  no questions here, just wanted to say thank you


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I’m pretty sure the 3 and 5 are the same except for the mic/remote, same as with the HF3/HF5. I can’t say much about the soundstage since I don’t have a pair here but the clarity is great for the price.
> 
> I think the VSonic VC02 is available on amazon now as well so that would be another option.


 
   
  The VC02 were my "on the other hand" thought but she is unfortunately firm with the $35 lol. I just need to get her past the cute box that says Kids on it when we go to the store. Thanks!


----------



## NIVEBL

Is MC5 made in U.S.A?


----------



## higbvuyb

Quote: 





nivebl said:


> Is MC5 made in U.S.A?


 
  "Assembled in China" on the box.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





goldtuba said:


> i just wanted to give you another thank you post for all of your hard work for this thread.  because of you, i've bought a hifiman re262 and an meelec 6.  with your combined review with DavidMahler's flagship reviews i also got a pair of westone 4's.  no questions here, just wanted to say thank you


 
   
  Thanks, glad it's been useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> The VC02 were my "on the other hand" thought but she is unfortunately firm with the $35 lol. I just need to get her past the cute box that says Kids on it when we go to the store. Thanks!


 
   
  It is an Etymotic product and I think it's oriented towards the concerned parents more so than the kids so hopefully not too cutesy...


----------



## Niyologist

I'm getting my MEElectronics M-DUO by Tuesday. I'll probably have a full review by Thursday.


----------



## bhima

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> I'm getting my MEElectronics M-DUO by Tuesday. I'll probably have a full review by Thursday.


 
  Right on, those Duo's look like the nicest of the Corecool v2 IEM variants that have been popping up here on head-fi. I'm interested to see how they stack up.


----------



## ich1ban

What other IEMs are similar to the IE80s in terms of soundstage and bass?
   
  Preferably around the same cost as well.


----------



## kartikk

hello joker 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  i know you aren't done reviewing the sony mh1c but can we hear your initial impressions on them?
  & also is the bass on them overpowering(even after sealing the vent)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ich1ban said:


> What other IEMs are similar to the IE80s in terms of soundstage and bass?
> 
> Preferably around the same cost as well.


 
   
   
  I've only tried the IE8, not the IE80.
   
  The Sony EX-series earphones have the soundstage but less bass.
   
  The FX700 has fantastic bass but isn't quite as large in terms of soundstage/headstage as the IE8. It's the closest I've heard in terms of a compromise, though.
   
   
  Quote: 





kartikk said:


> hello joker
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Yeah, I actually like it a lot. Yes, the bass towers over the mids and highs too much and isn't as tight as I would like but it has good depth and the rest of the sound is surprisingly refined. I would say they are at least on-par with the best budget stuff from VSonic, different sound signature aside. Great value at $35 or even at the MSRP.


----------



## justblue

I agree, the Sony MH1C sounds pretty good for the money (for me more analytical than fun, with a timbre close to neutral) but its dreadful asymmetric ribbon cable and issues with seal or driver flex... can really pester.
My Vsonic R02 Silver, where are you?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





justblue said:


> I agree, the Sony MH1C sounds pretty good for the money (for me more analytical than fun, with a timbre close to neutral) but its dreadful asymmetric ribbon cable and issues with seal or driver flex... can really pester.
> My Vsonic R02 Silver, where are you?


 

 No driver flex here but I do hate the cable. Went back to using the Dunu Detonator as my phone headset for the time being because the cable on the MH1C is just too annoying.


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> No driver flex here but I do hate the cable. Went back to using the Dunu Detonator as my phone headset for the time being because the cable on the MH1C is just too annoying.


 
  Joker what iem would you say has a similar sound signature with the mh1c but with a better cable and 50$?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Joker what iem would you say has a similar sound signature with the mh1c but with a better cable and 50$?


 

 Hmm... under $50 probably the RHA MA-350 for a similar signature, but I don't think it's as refined overall, especially in the treble region, and is a little more bass-biased as well.


----------



## Amitl

if i connect one of my phones (Klipsch S4, id America Spark, MEElec CW31, MEElec A161P, AKG K518)
  to a usb dac (like the Fiio e10 connected to a pc) instead of straight to a smartphone,
  should i notice any major difference in sq?
  im sorry i just havn't realized the whole headphone amp thing yet...
  i read ppl saying headphone amps are useless for IEM's...yet all these pricey headphone amps are being sold... are these only useful for not-iem phones??


----------



## Niyologist

I got the M-DUO. I have taken pictures. I'll start a new thread later for the pre-review and final review.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

niyologist said:


> I got the M-DUO. I have taken pictures. I'll start a new thread later for the pre-review and final review.




Wow really? 

How on earth did you get them so early? They aren't even on sale yet lol


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Wow really?
> 
> How on earth did you get them so early? They aren't even on sale yet lol


 
   
  Tester + I gave MEElec a helping hand for the M-DUO Contest Promotional.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

niyologist said:


> Tester + I gave MEElec a helping hand for the M-DUO Contest Promotional.




Aha right, I thought you'd won a contest or something lol

Looking forward to your impressions and review mate.


----------



## Niyologist

Early impressions: The M-DUO definitely has the deep bass of the MEElec M6, but it's sooooo much clearer. It's like listening to a 2.1 and the clarity is around the same level as the GR06, with the help of the EQ/Fiio E11. With burn-in, I'm very sure it'll  easily surpass the Clarity level of the GR06. Wow, but the bass detail is great. It really doesn't mess with the mid-range that much. Still the mid-range is slightly recessed. The dynamics is leaning towards slightly above average ATM. The treble is there but not edgy at all, it's more like shimmering (On the High Quality tracks).


----------



## MDFMK

Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Early impressions: The M-DUO definitely has the deep bass of the MEElec M6, but it's sooooo much clearer. It's like listening to a 2.1 and the clarity is around the same level as the GR06, with the help of the EQ/Fiio E11. With burn-in, I'm very sure it'll  easily surpass the Clarity level of the GR06. Wow, but the bass detail is great. It really doesn't mess with the mid-range that much. Still the mid-range is slightly recessed. The dynamics is leaning towards slightly above average ATM. The treble is there but not edgy at all, it's more like shimmering (On the High Quality tracks).


 

 Interesting!  Seeing as you have the JVC FXT90, how does it compare?


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





mdfmk said:


> Interesting!  Seeing as you have the JVC FXT90, how does it compare?


 
   
  It actually sounds more detailed. It's very impressive.


----------



## Niyologist

Wow! The M-DUO actually sounds more detailed than the FXT-90. There's actually micro-detail involved. @_@


----------



## MDFMK

That sounds very promising!  I would have to listen myself before I considered replacing the FXT-90(which I love), but I'm intrigued now.  Based on your initial impression, it sounds like the M-DUO has deeper/fuller bass than the JVC's but more recessed in the midrange, correct?  Like a slightly more V shape?


----------



## Jozurr

Hey joker
   
  Can you tell me how similar the MH1C and the R02 Silver are? I dont like the cables or the fit on the MH1c but I really like the sound. I'd love to replace them with something very comfortable.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





mdfmk said:


> That sounds very promising!  I would have to listen myself before I considered replacing the FXT-90(which I love), but I'm intrigued now.  Based on your initial impression, it sounds like the M-DUO has deeper/fuller bass than the JVC's but more recessed in the midrange, correct?  Like a slightly more V shape?


 
   
  Kinda. It's U-Shaped than V-Shaped. Although the detail retrieval is impressive.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> if i connect one of my phones (Klipsch S4, id America Spark, MEElec CW31, MEElec A161P, AKG K518)
> to a usb dac (like the Fiio e10 connected to a pc) instead of straight to a smartphone,
> should i notice any major difference in sq?
> im sorry i just havn't realized the whole headphone amp thing yet...
> i read ppl saying headphone amps are useless for IEM's...yet all these pricey headphone amps are being sold... are these only useful for not-iem phones??


 
   
  Probably not with those except for the A161P. The A161P is pretty sensitive and has low, non-linear impedance, so it can be susceptible to impedance interactions if you have a source with high output impedance (for example), or just one with a lot of line noise (the average non-Apple smartphone would likely have both of these problems, for example). In that particular case you may get a noticeable improvement with almost any decent DAC. This is more because your source is not ideal in the first place and not because the A161P needs lots of power.
   
  Quote: 





niyologist said:


> Early impressions: The M-DUO definitely has the deep bass of the MEElec M6, but it's sooooo much clearer. It's like listening to a 2.1 and the clarity is around the same level as the GR06, with the help of the EQ/Fiio E11. With burn-in, I'm very sure it'll  easily surpass the Clarity level of the GR06. Wow, but the bass detail is great. It really doesn't mess with the mid-range that much. Still the mid-range is slightly recessed. The dynamics is leaning towards slightly above average ATM. The treble is there but not edgy at all, it's more like shimmering (On the High Quality tracks).


 
   
  Interesting. The “M” in the name is probably telling of the signature to some extent. I would definitely expect enhanced bass. 
   
  Quote: 





jozurr said:


> Hey joker
> 
> Can you tell me how similar the MH1C and the R02 Silver are? I dont like the cables or the fit on the MH1c but I really like the sound. I'd love to replace them with something very comfortable.


 
   
  Not too similar. The MH1C has a focus on deep bass and is otherwise pretty smooth and level. The R02 Silver has a midrange bump and quite a bit less bass, and is brighter overall. The bass on the VSonics is tighter and less prone to bleeding up into the midrange, probably in large part because there is less of it. The treble is smoother and a little more refined on the Sonys.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Interesting. The “M” in the name is probably telling of the signature to some extent. I would definitely expect enhanced bass.


 
   
  That's exactly the thing. It has the M-Series signature, but it's a mixture of the nature of the A161 (Enhanced Upper Midrange/Treble). It also has the M-Series Signature Bass, but far more detailed of course.


----------



## Niyologist

The T-400 Comply foam tips (Medium) fit like a glove with the M-DUO. Although it does enhance the bass, but the rest of the frequency is still intact.


----------



## tseliottt

Top 5 best soundstage?
   
  I bought myself the Sony 7550, and they're phenomenal. They're the first headphones I have found to be adequate complements to my ER4. Mostly because of their soundstage, which I think has to do with their open design. Never experienced this presentation from an IEM before.
   
  I think anything more than the 7550s would be too bright for me though, so I don't think the ex1000s or ex600s will work for me. Also looking at the fx700s. Any other suggestions?


----------



## MikePortnoy

Hello, would you please give me some advice?
   
  I am looking for a natural and v shaped sounding iem. I have a pair of sm3 v2 and I am trying to make a decision to buy a fx700... I had um3x and westone 4 before. But their sounds were dry to me..
   
  Should I try a pair of fx700?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tseliottt said:


> Top 5 best soundstage?
> 
> I bought myself the Sony 7550, and they're phenomenal. They're the first headphones I have found to be adequate complements to my ER4. Mostly because of their soundstage, which I think has to do with their open design. Never experienced this presentation from an IEM before.
> 
> I think anything more than the 7550s would be too bright for me though, so I don't think the ex1000s or ex600s will work for me. Also looking at the fx700s. Any other suggestions?


 
   
  Yeah, I would say EX600/1000/MDR-7550 and Sennheiser IE8 would be the obvious ones. The FX700 isn’t exactly small-sounding but it doesn’t quite have the sheer width of these others. Radius TWF11 / TWF21 is up there as well.
   
  Quote: 





mikeportnoy said:


> Hello, would you please give me some advice?
> 
> I am looking for a natural and v shaped sounding iem. I have a pair of sm3 v2 and I am trying to make a decision to buy a fx700... I had um3x and westone 4 before. But their sounds were dry to me..
> 
> Should I try a pair of fx700?


 

 Yes, v-shaped, yet natural sounds like the FX700 to me. It has pretty natural note sustainment so it shouldn't sound dry in the sense of having overly quick decay.


----------



## vitzijak

ljokerl,
   
  First, thanks for the awesome resource.  Concise, accurate, evenhanded!
   
  I was wondering if you could use your overall Sound Quality score for some of the "classic" full size cans such as ATH-M50, HD-650, HD-800, LCD2 and LCD3.  This would enormously helpful in comparing the 2 worlds.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## Cunnifferous

Hi Joker,
   
  I had the Vsonic Gr02 Bass but it broke so I had to return it. I liked the bass on it but I found the overall sound slightly 'hollow' and slightly harsh on the treble side on certain tracks. Instead of getting a direct replacement I went for the R02 silver. I've never had mid-centric earphones before so I was just wondering does the mid over power the bass and treble at all or are they still clearly defined as well. I'm not a bass head but a for lot of the music I listen to (EDM) bass is a large componant  so I just hope the bass doesn't fade into the backround with these iems. Also, any idea when/if you'll be reviewing the VSD1s?
   
  Thanks,


----------



## slpierce1988

Love these threads. If only I could find an IEM that is actually conforms to my ear (can't afford a custom mold)!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vitzijak said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> First, thanks for the awesome resource.  Concise, accurate, evenhanded!
> 
> ...


 
   
  I don't really like comparing cans to IEMs so that would be tough, plus I have a lot more experience with IEMs.
   
  For me IEMs are indispensable for on the go use. At home I'd rather skip full-size cans and go for speakers (sorry!). The Emotiva monitors I'm using right now sound way better than my HD580. 
   
  Quote: 





cunnifferous said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I had the Vsonic Gr02 Bass but it broke so I had to return it. I liked the bass on it but I found the overall sound slightly 'hollow' and slightly harsh on the treble side on certain tracks. Instead of getting a direct replacement I went for the R02 silver. I've never had mid-centric earphones before so I was just wondering does the mid over power the bass and treble at all or are they still clearly defined as well. I'm not a bass head but a for lot of the music I listen to (EDM) bass is a large componant  so I just hope the bass doesn't fade into the backround with these iems. Also, any idea when/if you'll be reviewing the VSD1s?
> 
> Thanks,


 
   
  The bass and treble are definitely well-defined on the Silver but they are downright dominant on the R02 Bass Edition, so there's a very obvious difference there. The Bass Edition enhances bass whereas the Silver just tells it how it is. I prefer how the Silver does both bass and treble.
   
  I don't have a VSD1 on hand. I have another VSonic model I need to review after which I'll maybe get to check out the VSD1. 
   
  Quote: 





slpierce1988 said:


> Love these threads. If only I could find an IEM that is actually conforms to my ear (can't afford a custom mold)!


 

 Just get something small and with a foam tip 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. The dB Logic EP-100 + Shure Olives will fit any ear.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I don't have a VSD1 on hand. I have *another VSonic model I need to review* after which I'll maybe get to check out the VSD1.


 





 which one? which one?


----------



## airomjosh

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I have another VSonic model I need to review after which I'll maybe get to check out the VSD1.


 
  let me guess, they're Vsonic VC1000?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





airomjosh said:


> let me guess, they're Vsonic VC1000?


 

 Bingo.


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Bingo.


 
  sweet!
  another 10/10 value ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> sweet!
> another 10/10 value ?


 
   
  Haven’t actually listened to it yet. I almost hope not...


----------



## ellis ip

Pick between iq, pfe232, sm64 which one provide more accurate, neutral , uncoloured soundings, i am using ue900 now, i want slightly more bass which one should i choose?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ellis ip said:


> Pick between iq, pfe232, sm64 which one provide more accurate, neutral , uncoloured soundings, i am using ue900 now, i want slightly more bass which one should i choose?


 

 I am not familiar with the SM64. Between the rest of those, the UE 900 is the most accurate. Both the 232 and IQ have more bass and more v-shaped signatures overall.


----------



## H20Fidelity

I was rather impressed with VC1000, would I dare say I found it hitting up around R-50 territory.


----------



## ellis ip

Then pfe232 or iq more neutral?


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Haven’t actually listened to it yet. I almost hope *not*...


 
  not??


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> I was rather impressed with VC1000, would I dare say I found it hitting up around R-50 territory.


 
   
  Aren't they more expensive than the R-50? I'm curious as to why VSonic decided to do another dual BA. The GR01 is decent and is tuned slightly differently from the other ones on the market already.
   
  Anyway, both the VC1000 and Astrotec AX-7 seem to be very well built and priced right so we'll see which one comes out on top. 
   
  Quote: 





ellis ip said:


> Then pfe232 or iq more neutral?


 

 The IQ has slightly fuller and more impactful bass but also less recessed mids so it really depends on what you're willing to sacrifice. The Ultrasone also has smoother treble with the right tips but of course the issue is that it takes a lot of playing around with the fit to get at its full potential. I actually found even better tips for it than the Ety triples I used in my review - the Westone True-Fit Foams. They are deep-insertion foam tips. Comply doesn't work on the IQ for me but these do. 
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> not??


 
   
   
  Well, giving out too many 10/10s makes it less meaningful. But of course the cards will fall where they may.


----------



## H20Fidelity

ljokerl said:


> Aren't they more expensive than the R-50? I'm curious as to why VSonic decided to do another dual BA. The GR01 is decent and is tuned slightly differently from the other ones on the market already.
> 
> Anyway, both the VC1000 and Astrotec AX-7 seem to be very well built and priced right so we'll see which one comes out on top.




You can purchase VC1000 for $119 US on eBay, so pretty much neck and neck with R-50 $120 price tag.


----------



## countolaf

I'm glad the VC1000 isn't detachable like VC02. After spending some time with VC02, I realized the detachable stuff is more of a hassle than it is of convenience.


----------



## Liveartonline

Has anyone tried the Aurisonics ASG-1 1.2? I'm looking for the best mids and soundstage in an iem under $300.


----------



## vwinter

liveartonline said:


> Has anyone tried the Aurisonics ASG-1 1.2? I'm looking for the best mids and soundstage in an iem under $300.




What do you look for in mids and in soundstage? "Best" is kind of relative. It'll help people help you.


----------



## Liveartonline

Yeah good point...I prefer clean, impactful bass, forward, intimate mids, and non-fatiguing treble with low sibilance. Good separation and imaging. A wide soundstage. A warmish sound signature.


----------



## Niyologist

Quote: 





liveartonline said:


> Yeah good point...I prefer clean, impactful bass, forward, intimate mids, and non-fatiguing treble with low sibilance. Good separation and imaging. A wide soundstage. A warmish sound signature.


 
   
  Based on reviews from many source, the H-200 is very close to wait you're asking for, but there is also the BA200. I know that ljokerl will have better suggestions. :3


----------



## vwinter

liveartonline said:


> Yeah good point...I prefer clean, impactful bass, forward, intimate mids, and non-fatiguing treble with low sibilance. Good separation and imaging. A wide soundstage. A warmish sound signature.




The BA200 hits mostly all of those points except soundstage width. It's a very satisfying soundstage, well rounded with height and very good depth, but just good width. It's enveloping without being congested and closed in at all. 

I don't know if it's the best under 300 but it's absolutely easy to recommend under 200. Hopefully others can chime in.


----------



## ellis ip

Aurisonics v 1.1 is more tune to live stage but v1.2 is change to studio type. v1.1 have better soundstage


----------



## FlySweep

> Originally Posted by *Liveartonline* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> ..I prefer clean, impactful bass, forward, intimate mids, and non-fatiguing treble with low sibilance. Good separation and imaging. A wide soundstage. A warmish sound signature.


 
   
  I've owned the BA200 & (currently own) the H-200.  Both are terrific phones.  While some here have found the H-200 to have forward mids; to my ears, they're positioned quite neutrally in that I wouldn't consider them forward or recessed.  The BA200's mids are, relative to the H-200's mids, more forward & warmer in tone.
   
  I found the midrange on both phones to be quite smooth & euphonic.  The BA200's mids are a bit more analog-sounding (reminiscent of the dusty warmth some vinyl rigs tend to emphasize) while the H-200's mids are more tonally neutral and clean.  Separation & imaging are excellent between both phones.  The BA200 might get the edge in soundstage width. but both phones have excellent depth (probably on par with each other).  That being said, I don't find the H-200 to sound particularly constrained.  In fact, it seems to be able to throw a pretty wide stage.. depending on what the recording (quality) offers up (as well as what you upstream gear is capable of).
   
  The H-200 is a tad brighter than the BA200.. but neither phone's signature seems predisposed to sibilance (unless, again, your source files serve it up).  The BA200 is probably the safer choice between the two.. but I don't think gambling on the H-200 for this aspect is risky at all.  One thing to consider is that the BA200 needs a _deep_ fit to attain it's intended signature.  It's not Etymotic deep.. but it's close.  The H-200 can get its groove on with a comparatively shallower fit.  The H-200 is bulkier, relative to the sleek, svelte BA200, so if you anticipate using either of these phones during (even) moderate physical activity, the BA200 might be the better choice.
   
  I think both the BA200 & H-200 would fit your needs in terms of sound.. but the BA200 might suit you better since you explicitly stated that you wanted something with a 'warmer' sound.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> You can purchase VC1000 for $119 US on eBay, so pretty much neck and neck with R-50 $120 price tag.


 
   
  Ah, gotcha 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





countolaf said:


> I'm glad the VC1000 isn't detachable like VC02. After spending some time with VC02, I realized the detachable stuff is more of a hassle than it is of convenience.


 
   
  After fishing my VC02 left driver from under my desk for 2nd time this week, I tend to agree. The VSonic GR01 didn't have a detachable cable either. Still unclear on what the difference is supposed to be between that and the VC1000. 
   
  Quote: 





liveartonline said:


> Has anyone tried the Aurisonics ASG-1 1.2? I'm looking for the best mids and soundstage in an iem under $300.


 

 I tried a 1.1 rev shortly. Seemed to be lacking in treble so I didn't really give it another go. Out of what I have heard at length your description sounds like a Sennheiser IE8 (not much for the intimate mids, but everything else), Yamaha EPH-100 (soundstage is not that wide but it has good layering; treble is not super-smooth but avoids harshness and sibilance), and Earsonics SM2 (again, not that wide but nicely 3-dimensional. No harshness/sibilance). I am lacking hands-on experience with the BA200 and many other sets that are popular these days. The market is simply too crowded to keep up with.


----------



## Amitl

why do most custom iem are ba while only a select few dynamic?
  does the vent make for such a nuisance?
  and why don't dj's use iem which offer better isolation?


----------



## Lifted Andreas

amitl said:


> why don't dj's use iem which offer better isolation?




Because the DJ's tend to put their headphones on and take them off frequently, for example when queuing tracks, monitoring or mastering. 

Doing that with IEMs would be a massive chore and rather uncomfortable.


----------



## Eugguy

Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Because the DJ's tend to put their headphones on and take them off frequently, for example when queuing tracks, monitoring or mastering.
> 
> Doing that with IEMs would be a massive chore and rather uncomfortable.


 
  15 year experienced DJ here. I've used headphones for the past 14 years. Tried out IEMs with the Xone92. Perfection. My mixes have been coming out even better! It's not the norm to use IEMs, but more and more DJs are using them!


----------



## Amitl

do you guys think this is fake?
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Free-Shipping-NEW-Sennheiser-IE-80-Headphones-Earphones-NEW-IN-BOX-/190849880760?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c6f8a12b8
  its tempting


----------



## vwinter

Great comparison FlySweep. Thanks for that. Could you post that in the BA200 thread? I think it would be of use to people there.


----------



## HeadHoncho

Iv been using a pair of VSonic GR02 Bass Edition for over a year. Though I really loved the set overall, I really felt it lacking in the bass department. Didnt quite "Feel" the punch/thump much with these. Now that they have developed an issue (the left bud keeps shutting down all the time, starts working when I tweak the plug. That obviously does not work when I am on the move, and even when I am stationary, I have to keep tweaking it from time to time), I figured I might have to upgrade soon. So I dont have a very big budget (say about INR 5000 ~ USD 100 tops after extending my budget as much as I possibly can), and I am in India, so options are limited too, kind of. I havent been able to figure out the additional cost (customs/taxes/duties) of importing sets. So I need advice on which set to go in for next. As I had said, I really loved the GR02 BEs, except for the bass, which was actually what I had been looking for when I purchased them. So I want something similar overall, with a lot more bass. And they have to be durable too, hate to spend so much on a set and have it breaking on me. I am not a very rough user per se, but still. Some of the names from the top of my head are (In no specific order of preference, and in no way am I limited to these):
  > Brainwavz M5/M2/ProAlpha (dont know whether this would be an upgrade or not)
  > Fischer Audio. Now im confused between 3 of their sets, Eterna, Silver Bullets, and Consonance.
  > Shure SE215
  > Meelectronics M11+/M21
  > SoundMagic E10
  > Audio Technica CKM500
  > Anything Else


----------



## Liveartonline

The seller ships from Guangzhou, China, so it could be a knock off. Chinese sellers sell many knock offs on ebay for a reduced price, like fake badminton rackets and such. I guess you can take a chance if you think the reward outweighs the risks here.


----------



## Liveartonline

So I checked his feedback on ebay and several people have said that his merchandise are cheap copies of the real product. I'd be careful here.


----------



## MDFMK

Quote: 





amitl said:


> do you guys think this is fake?
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Free-Shipping-NEW-Sennheiser-IE-80-Headphones-Earphones-NEW-IN-BOX-/190849880760?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c6f8a12b8
> its tempting


 

 Ships from China at a too good to be true price...I would not touch it, personally.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Quote: 





liveartonline said:


> So I checked his feedback on ebay and several people have said that his merchandise are cheap copies of the real product. I'd be careful here.


 
   
  It's better to be extra careful of anything bought on eBay.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> why do most custom iem are ba while only a select few dynamic?


 
   
  Good question - I am not sure there is a way to really know. If I had to guess I'd say it's just the way that market evolved. You have to remember that the custom IEM market isn't very old and wasn't pioneered by the big audio brands with tons of experience on the headphone side of things (Sennheiser, AKG, etc). It was started by guys doing live sound in order to make the lives of musicians easier on stage. Also, I don't know if this had anything to do with it but Etymotic had already proven the accuracy of the balanced armature by that point with the ER4 launched sometime in the late 80s. Anyway, under different conditions it's conceivable that a lot of stage monitors would be dynamic - there's just no way to really know.
   
  Quote: 





headhoncho said:


> Iv been using a pair of VSonic GR02 Bass Edition for over a year. Though I really loved the set overall, I really felt it lacking in the bass department. Didnt quite "Feel" the punch/thump much with these. Now that they have developed an issue (the left bud keeps shutting down all the time, starts working when I tweak the plug. That obviously does not work when I am on the move, and even when I am stationary, I have to keep tweaking it from time to time), I figured I might have to upgrade soon. So I dont have a very big budget (say about INR 5000 ~ USD 100 tops after extending my budget as much as I possibly can), and I am in India, so options are limited too, kind of. I havent been able to figure out the additional cost (customs/taxes/duties) of importing sets. So I need advice on which set to go in for next. As I had said, I really loved the GR02 BEs, except for the bass, which was actually what I had been looking for when I purchased them. So I want something similar overall, with a lot more bass. And they have to be durable too, hate to spend so much on a set and have it breaking on me. I am not a very rough user per se, but still. Some of the names from the top of my head are (In no specific order of preference, and in no way am I limited to these):
> > Brainwavz M5/M2/ProAlpha (dont know whether this would be an upgrade or not)
> > Fischer Audio. Now im confused between 3 of their sets, Eterna, Silver Bullets, and Consonance.
> > Shure SE215
> ...


 

 If you found the bass of the GR02 BE lacking you can pretty much forget about most Brainwavz, the Silver Bullet, the SE215, the MEElecs, and the Soundmagics. 
   
  The CKM500 is a little bassier than the GR02 BE (mostly more emphasized in the mid-range region) and very good overall, especially for ~$60. The Brainwavz M5 has a lot of bass but is less similar to the BE than the CKM500 with its much more recessed treble. The Consonance is a slight downgrade from the GR02 IMO. 
   
  I would go for the CKM500 - it's tough to beat for the price. You do need a good seal with it to feel that punch but it's there. Another option might be the HiSound Wooduo 2. Not sure how much it costs these days but that's the most bass I can think of with an overall sound signature close to the GR02 BE. Tons of deep bass on it - as much as with the FutureSonics Atrios - which is how it differs from the CKM500 (which emphasizes mid-bass more than sub-bass).


----------



## peter123

I've noticed that the Sony XBA-1 is being sold for USD30 at the moment (making space for the xba-10 I'd guess) and I've never tried any BA's so I'm tempted to give them a shot..
  
 My current favourite IEM's (among the ones I own) is the Vsonic GR06,GR99,VSD1 and the ATH-CKN70.
  
 Will the XBA-1 be in the same league as these or would I be better of saving up some more money and getting something else as my first BA's?


----------



## AzatHead-Fier

hi,
  I wonder how fxt90 compares to hf5 in terms of detail level and imaging. thanks.


----------



## Amitl

thank you very much for commenting Joker and everyone!


----------



## sinquito

Quote: 





peter123 said:


> I've noticed that the Sony XBA-1 is being sold for USD30 at the moment (making space for the xba-10 I'd guess) and I've never tried any BA's so I'm tempted to give them a shot..
> 
> My current favourite IEM's (among the ones I own) is the Vsonic GR06,GR99,VSD1 and the ATH-CKN70.
> 
> Will the XBA-1 be in the same league as these or would I be better of saving up some more money and getting something else as my first BA's?


 
  I don't have any earphone that you own but I do own the xba-1 and for 30 bucks I think it's a good price, I got mine for a little bit more and I don't regret it even thought I don't use them much, anyway, they are well made and fit really find, they are small so if you have big ears I guess you could even lay down on the side of your head without problem, they look really nice too. They sound is mid centric, but not smooth or liquid, is just that they lack a bit of bass and highs, the mids are upfront, so to my ears they sound 2D, they have a sense of clarity thought. I don't think you could get any BA at 30 bucks than sounds good and is well made, plus if you can get it locally it's a plus, instead of waiting, just my 2 cents.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





peter123 said:


> I've noticed that the Sony XBA-1 is being sold for USD30 at the moment (making space for the xba-10 I'd guess) and I've never tried any BA's so I'm tempted to give them a shot..
> 
> My current favourite IEM's (among the ones I own) is the Vsonic GR06,GR99,VSD1 and the ATH-CKN70.
> 
> Will the XBA-1 be in the same league as these or would I be better of saving up some more money and getting something else as my first BA's?


 
   
  I've only tried the XBA-1 briefly. At the time I had just the Fischer Audio SBA-03 (same as the MEElec A161) to compare it to and I thought it was a little less accurate, but not too far behind. Based on that short impression, I would say $30 is a good deal.
   
  Quote: 





azathead-fier said:


> hi,
> I wonder how fxt90 compares to hf5 in terms of detail level and imaging. thanks.


 

 Both are high-end earphones and have good detail retrieval and imaging. The detailing of the FXT90 is handicapped slightly by its emphasizes mid-bass but in terms of presentation I thought it sounded a little more 3-dimensional than my Etys.


----------



## Niyologist

Wow. Never noticed how dark my FXT90 was until I did a head to head comparison to the M-DUO. o_O


----------



## cubota890

Hi, ljokerl!
  Amazing job done here from you. Big thanks.
  I have question about Audio Technica CKM500. Have you tested it on only Cowon J3 or other device too?
  Because it sound on cowons dirrerent, than on other sources i have.
  With Cowon C2 it sounds like you describe -  with big bass that overshadows mids and realy deserves score 8.
  But with other players, like rockboxed ipod, teclast x19hd or hisound rocco ba, that big bass dissapears( but still keeps Soundmagic E30 level for example). But clarity and mids are far better! They sound then exatly  like Senn HD595 with same clarity, mids and highs but only with more lows! They are superior to westone 2, Miles davis tributes and so on.


----------



## peter123

Quote: 





sinquito said:


> I don't have any earphone that you own but I do own the xba-1 and for 30 bucks I think it's a good price, I got mine for a little bit more and I don't regret it even thought I don't use them much, anyway, they are well made and fit really find, they are small so if you have big ears I guess you could even lay down on the side of your head without problem, they look really nice too. They sound is mid centric, but not smooth or liquid, is just that they lack a bit of bass and highs, the mids are upfront, so to my ears they sound 2D, they have a sense of clarity thought. I don't think you could get any BA at 30 bucks than sounds good and is well made, plus if you can get it locally it's a plus, instead of waiting, just my 2 cents.


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've only tried the XBA-1 briefly. At the time I had just the Fischer Audio SBA-03 (same as the MEElec A161) to compare it to and I thought it was a little less accurate, but not too far behind. Based on that short impression, I would say $30 is a good deal.


 
   
  Thank you both for your input. I'll guess I've got little to loose at that price so I'll give them  a try.


----------



## cubota890

according to clieos xba-1 is inferior in sq to mh1-c. xba has 4.4 out of 5, but mh1-c 4.65.


----------



## peter123

Quote: 





cubota890 said:


> according to clieos xba-1 is inferior in sq to mh1-c. xba has 4.4 out of 5, but mh1-c 4.65.


 
  I don't really like the mh1c at all. My understanding is the xba-1 is pretty different from the mh1c so I'm hoping for a sound that I like better.


----------



## sinquito

Quote: 





cubota890 said:


> according to clieos xba-1 is inferior in sq to mh1-c. xba has 4.4 out of 5, but mh1-c 4.65.


 
  So what? first, that's according to him, everyone hears different, second, the MH1c has an awful cable, the cable on the xba-1 isn't super nice but it's good, second, the MH1c has a bloated bass, not everyone can stand to it, so it all comes down to the signature preference of the listener.


----------



## peter123

Quote: 





sinquito said:


> So what? first, that's according to him, everyone hears different, second, the MH1c has an awful cable, the cable on the xba-1 isn't super nice but it's good, second, the MH1c has a bloated bass, not everyone can stand to it, so it all comes down to the signature preference of the listener.


 
  Amen to that


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





cubota890 said:


> Hi, ljokerl!
> Amazing job done here from you. Big thanks.
> I have question about Audio Technica CKM500. Have you tested it on only Cowon J3 or other device too?
> Because it sound on cowons dirrerent, than on other sources i have.
> ...


 
   
  I don't do any of my critical listening on the J3.
   
  If you use the equalizer or have some other form of DSP that turns down the bass hump (or just have a bass-shy source) the CKM500 will indeed sound clearer but it's just got a lot of mid-bass.
   
   
  Quote: 





sinquito said:


> So what? first, that's according to him, everyone hears different, second, the MH1c has an awful cable, the cable on the xba-1 isn't super nice but it's good, second, the MH1c has a bloated bass, not everyone can stand to it, so it all comes down to the signature preference of the listener.


 

 The cable on the MH1C is very perplexing. Sony doesn't usually sell j-corded earphones in the US so I am not sure why they did so with this one.


----------



## coryeeeee

Thank you for the time for this post. I didn't realize there were so many different kinds of IEMs out there.


----------



## peter123

One more question:
   
  I need a good set od IEM's with line in mic that work with my android phone. Maximum price about USD 200, any suggestions?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





coryeeeee said:


> Thank you for the time for this post. I didn't realize there were so many different kinds of IEMs out there.


 
   
  Glad it's been useful! 
   
  Quote: 





peter123 said:


> One more question:
> 
> I need a good set od IEM's with line in mic that work with my android phone. Maximum price about USD 200, any suggestions?


 

 Philips Fidelio S1 or S2 is my go-to suggestion. Very consistent sound across various sources and a generally nice signature with a slight bass bump but good overall accuracy. Both have a mic.


----------



## Liveartonline

http://www.amazon.com/Scosche-IEM856MD-Reference-Monitors-Microphone/dp/B005HIS6II


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





liveartonline said:


> http://www.amazon.com/Scosche-IEM856MD-Reference-Monitors-Microphone/dp/B005HIS6II


 
   
  Ah yes, the condom phones. Good times.


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Ah yes, the condom phones. Good times.


 
   
  Took me a few minutes to figure out what this meant XD  The actual IEMs weren't too bad.  I let my friend take them though (kind of wish I didn't).


----------



## ljokerl

I tried them briefly and wasn't too impressed. Reminded me of the old UE SF5 EB.


----------



## sinquito

Quote: 





tinyman392 said:


> Took me a few minutes to figure out what this meant XD  The actual IEMs weren't too bad.  I let my friend take them though (kind of wish I didn't).


 
  I didn't understand it, but I did manage to read the forma definition of limit that you have in your signature.


----------



## vwinter

eke2k6 said:


> Ah yes, the condom phones. Good times.




LOL. Good times indeed.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Dunu DN-22M Detonator and DN-23 Landmine
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(3A79) Dunu DN-22M Detonator*
> 
> 
> Added Jun 2013
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *(2C57) Dunu DN-23 Landmine*
> 
> 
> Added Jun 2013
> ...


----------



## rotter2142

I can't seem to find the 3A Section!


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





rotter2142 said:


> I can't seem to find the 3A Section!


 

 An editing ooooopsie !!!


----------



## Gascogne

First post here, found this great thread after some google search for earphones/in-ear monitors. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Currently I have Sony DR-BT50 Stereo Headset for my iPhone/iPad but I want earphones/in-ear monitors due to they are a lot easier to carry around (they need to have a mic).
  Problem is that I am not really sure which earphones/in-ear monitors I want.. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I listen mostly to: electro-industrial, industrial-rock to cut the list short real short.
  Price range haven't really decided yet but something in between UE 900 and Philips Fidelio S2 price ranges?


----------



## peter123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Philips Fidelio S1 or S2 is my go-to suggestion. Very consistent sound across various sources and a generally nice signature with a slight bass bump but good overall accuracy. Both have a mic.


 
  Thank you. I've been reading up on these and S2 looks like a very good choice. My only concern is that I've got very narrow earchannels so I'm afraid they will be to big (given the driver size and fit), I once bougt the MEE CC51P but were never able to get a good fit with them. Do you think that the design of S2 would make fit a problem with narrow earchannels?


----------



## MikePortnoy

Are Monster tips are suitable for fx700 by the way? Or should I buy some Ue tips for it?


----------



## NoGood

Hi *ljokerl,*
   
  As always, many thanks for all your effort and hardwork you put into this thread. Just wanted to know if there is a chance you might review the sony xba-3/xba-30 in the near future?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rotter2142 said:


> I can't seem to find the 3A Section!


 
   
  Due to the size of that post it takes about 24 hours to update.
   
  Quote: 





gascogne said:


> First post here, found this great thread after some google search for earphones/in-ear monitors.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The S2 should be a good choice if you think you'll enjoy a balanced sound. It has a slight bump in the bass but is otherwise quite accurate. The UE900 is a little smoother for me and maybe sounds a touch more layered and 3-dimensional. It also has a form factor I prefer, and better isolation, but I still think its difficult to justify the cost increase over the S2. Do keep in mind that the S2 has a 1-button remote, not a 3-button like the UE900 and stock Apple headsets.
   
  Quote: 





peter123 said:


> Thank you. I've been reading up on these and S2 looks like a very good choice. My only concern is that I've got very narrow earchannels so I'm afraid they will be to big (given the driver size and fit), I once bougt the MEE CC51P but were never able to get a good fit with them. Do you think that the design of S2 would make fit a problem with narrow earchannels?


 
   
  The design of the S2 actually keeps its driver in the outer ear. The CC51 and most other microdriver earphones do the opposite, putting the driver in the ear canal. Unless you have small outer ears also, you shouldn't have a problem.
   
  Quote: 





mikeportnoy said:


> Are Monster tips are suitable for fx700 by the way? Or should I buy some Ue tips for it?


 
   
  I didn't try Monster tips but they should fit. I didn't find the FX700 particularly sensitive to eartip changes. The stock singles worked. The UE tips maintained their seal a little better for me. 
   
  Quote: 





nogood said:


> Hi *ljokerl,*
> 
> As always, many thanks for all your effort and hardwork you put into this thread. Just wanted to know if there is a chance you might review the sony xba-3/xba-30 in the near future?


 

 I sent mine off on an extended loan because I wasn't a big fan of the sound. Might give them another try when I get them back.


----------



## ellis ip

Thanks ljokerl, iq sounds great, but i kind of want to have more isolation, but don't no what tips to choose, also what amp will match with iq, since i want the vocal to be more forward and clear, because it sound a bit cover by the instrument and bass


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ellis ip said:


> Thanks ljokerl, iq sounds great, but i kind of want to have more isolation, but don't no what tips to choose, also what amp will match with iq, since i want the vocal to be more forward and clear, because it sound a bit cover by the instrument and bass


 

 The IQ is an enhanced-bass earphone so if you want more vocals in comparison it might be easiest to just use a bass reducer EQ setting (or play around with a parametric EQ in general).
   
  For me the Westone True-Fit foam tips and small Ety triple-flanges work best on the IQ but as usual YMMV.


----------



## Amitl

Hey guys, i'm thinking of getting my first custom iem in the form
  Of Shure SE215 reshelled in advance through custominear.com.
  it is basically a new SE215 driver in a reshelled custom mold for 199$.
  http://www.inearcustom.com/index.php/we-customize-your-existing-shure-se-in-ear-monitors-8/we-customize-your-existing-shure-se215-in-ear-monitors.html
  is this a reliable provider? i've sent them a msg via facebook long ago and was never replied.
  thanks..


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Hey guys, i'm thinking of getting my first custom iem in the form
> Of Shure SE215 reshelled in advance through custominear.com.
> it is basically a new SE215 driver in a reshelled custom mold for 199$.
> http://www.inearcustom.com/index.php/we-customize-your-existing-shure-se-in-ear-monitors-8/we-customize-your-existing-shure-se215-in-ear-monitors.html
> ...


 
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/643894/inearcustom-cheapest-re-shell-ever    The few reports seem to be generally positive, though apparantly they are slammed with business right now.  You will probably be best off sending them a "proper" email, but even then according to the thread there's a bit of a delay.
   
  Also this thread is for iems (though as your talking about the 215 it should be ok!)  there's more info on customs etc here if that's any use :-
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/541494/multi-custom-in-ear-monitor-review-resource-mfg-list-discussion-26-reviews-um-pp6-added-3-12-13
   
  Cheers


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm... I didn't get any harshness from the EPH-100 either. It wasn't a smooth as the Tandem (for example) but it wasn't really harsh. I think you should try the R02 Silver and see what you think, then go from there. Might not have enough subbass if the Tandem didn't. I haven't heard the ProAlpha in a while (though I still have my M1 and M2) so the R02 Silver might be a better starting point for an upgrade.


 
   
  Instead of the R02 Silver I got the GR02 Balanced by mistake. Well, I find them a bit worse than the ProAlpha. The GR02 Balanced are darker (but a bass is somehow dry) and less clear than the ProAlpha, also a stereophony is better performed by the latter.
 A seller promised to send me the correct ones... nice, after all, but I'm stuck with searching for the ProAlpha replacement...


----------



## Amitl

thanks very much davidcotton !


----------



## Liveartonline

Have you tried the t-peos h-200, tdk ba-200, or the aurisonics asg-1 1.2?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Hey guys, i'm thinking of getting my first custom iem in the form
> Of Shure SE215 reshelled in advance through custominear.com.
> it is basically a new SE215 driver in a reshelled custom mold for 199$.
> http://www.inearcustom.com/index.php/we-customize-your-existing-shure-se-in-ear-monitors-8/we-customize-your-existing-shure-se215-in-ear-monitors.html
> ...


 
   
  Not familiar with the company but selling pre-customized earphones is an interesting concept. You have to pretty sure you like the SE215 though because the resale value is going to be zip.
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> Instead of the R02 Silver I got the GR02 Balanced by mistake. Well, I find them a bit worse than the ProAlpha. The GR02 Balanced are darker (but a bass is somehow dry) and less clear than the ProAlpha, also a stereophony is better performed by the latter.
> A seller promised to send me the correct ones... nice, after all, but I'm stuck with searching for the ProAlpha replacement...


 
   
  Never even heard of the GR02 “Balanced”.
   
  Quote: 





liveartonline said:


> Have you tried the t-peos h-200, tdk ba-200, or the aurisonics asg-1 1.2?


 

 I have not.


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Never even heard of the GR02 “Balanced”.


 
   
  Me neither until I got them. But apparently it's on the market. Under "GR02" below in the bracket it says "Balanced".


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Hope you'll get to review these at some point.


----------



## lilboozy

^ he'll have to completely rescale his value rating for iems after reviewing that


----------



## Lifted Andreas

lilboozy said:


> ^ he'll have to completely rescale his value rating for iems after reviewing that




He'll be speechless for the first time in the whole time of running this thread lol


----------



## Gascogne

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The S2 should be a good choice if you think you'll enjoy a balanced sound. It has a slight bump in the bass but is otherwise quite accurate. The UE900 is a little smoother for me and maybe sounds a touch more layered and 3-dimensional. It also has a form factor I prefer, and better isolation, but I still think its difficult to justify the cost increase over the S2. Do keep in mind that the S2 has a 1-button remote, not a 3-button like the UE900 and stock Apple headsets.


 
   
  Hmm I missed that S2 only have 1-button remote.
  Too bad that one can't change the cable on the S2 to a 3-button one, otherwise they look great.
   
  Are there any you could recommend that have 3-buttons remote?


----------



## Liveartonline

> ^ he'll have to completely rescale his value rating for iems after reviewing that


 
   
  Are they the best iems under $100 or something? I've never heard of them.


----------



## ljokerl

IE 800 review is up on InnerFidelity for anyone interested: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor

 I’ll add it to this thread in due time. For what it’s worth, I prefer its sound to the Ultrasone IQ slightly but still like the K3003 better.
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> Me neither until I got them. But apparently it's on the market. Under "GR02" below in the bracket it says "Balanced".


 
   
  Interesting. Looks like the GR02 BE.
  
  Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Hope you'll get to review these at some point.


 
   
  Is that the best of the Zero Audio IEMs?

 I tried contacting them once about one of their old single BA models but I think the language barrier was an issue. IIRC their website was all in Japanese back then.
   
  Quote: 





gascogne said:


> Hmm I missed that S2 only have 1-button remote.
> Too bad that one can't change the cable on the S2 to a 3-button one, otherwise they look great.
> 
> Are there any you could recommend that have 3-buttons remote?


 
   
  You can go to the interactive table and select “With Mic/3button remote” to see everything I’ve reviewed with a 3-button. I’ve done that filtering here. 

 The UE900 becomes one of the top choices in that case.


----------



## MastermindJapan

Quote: 





> Is that the best of the Zero Audio IEMs?
> 
> I tried contacting them once about one of their old single BA models but I think the language barrier was an issue. IIRC their website was all in Japanese back then.


 
  These are being hyped pretty hard in several threads.

 It would be nice to get a review from you Joker, as you'll be better positioned to compare these Zero Audios' to their respective categories.

 From what I've gathered, the Basso and Tenores are the ones being hyped hard.
   
  Looking forward to your review of these - if you are planning to do them.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

ljokerl said:


> IE 800 review is up on InnerFidelity for anyone interested: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor
> 
> Is that the best of the Zero Audio IEMs?
> 
> I tried contacting them once about one of their old single BA models but I think the language barrier was an issue. IIRC their website was all in Japanese back then.




Well, the DX210 Basso and DX200 Tenore seem to be the most popular at the moment.

I have the Tenore myself and love them, maybe even more than the Yamaha EPH100.

Btw, the thread for them is here:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/665111/zero-audio-zh-dx200-carbo-tenore-zh-dx210-carbo-basso-carbon-aluminium-iem-information-appreciation-and-impressions-thread

PS. Oh and their site is still all in Japanese lol




mastermindjapan said:


> These are being hyped pretty hard in several threads.
> 
> 
> It would be nice to get a review from you Joker, as you'll be better positioned to compare these Zero Audios' to their respective categories.
> ...




They are being hyped for sure, most likely coz they have an amazing sound quality for the money.

The Tenore for example have the most widest soundstage I've ever heard in an IEM.


----------



## lorenzini

Where did the VSonic VC02 go? I literally can't find it on the page!


----------



## blueangel2323

lorenzini said:


> Where did the VSonic VC02 go? I literally can't find it on the page!



 
 Looks like the enture "3A" review section disappeared somehow


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





lorenzini said:


> Where did the VSonic VC02 go? I literally can't find it on the page!


 
   
  Quote: 





blueangel2323 said:


> Looks like the enture "3A" review section disappeared somehow


 
   
  It'll be back. Glitch in the system.
   
   
  We need to all put our heads together and figure out a warning system. Maybe bright red at the very top of the first post on page 1?


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





lorenzini said:


> Where did the VSonic VC02 go? I literally can't find it on the page!


 
  Lost them after a crazy party...
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Just the drivers , of course...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mastermindjapan said:


> These are being hyped pretty hard in several threads.
> 
> It would be nice to get a review from you Joker, as you'll be better positioned to compare these Zero Audios' to their respective categories.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks for the info. I've still not caught up with some of the other popular (hyped) sets such as the MH1C but I'll see if I can contact Zero Audio later in the month. 
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> It'll be back. Glitch in the system.
> 
> 
> We need to all put our heads together and figure out a warning system. Maybe bright red at the very top of the first post on page 1?


 

 Yeah that's simple enough. I'll add a note where that tier is listed in the first post. Personally I am still hoping for a fix (bug/feedback thread here) but it's looking like the post is just too long/large for the system to handle properly.


----------



## ljokerl

The post is now fixed thanks to the tech team at huddler. VC02 review (and about 78 others) should now be visible.


----------



## pablobaluba

I don't know if it's the right place to ask, but I'm undecided about a future purchase. I plan to get a pair of IEMs. I'm mostly listening to Electronic, Hip-Hop and some OSTs. So I'd prefer something bass oriented. They should be used on a portable gear (Colorfly C3 + C&C BH Amp). So if there are IEMs with good synergy with this combo it'd be great.
   
  I put on my list until now Atrio Mg7 and JVC FX700. Maybe add T-Peos H-200 ? There's a lot of info in this topic/forum and if I'd have a list with 5-6 choices it would be great to read only about those. Budget can be up to 200$. Maybe more if it's really worth!?
  Thanks!


----------



## Lifted Andreas

^ATH CKS1000 should be on your list too.


----------



## quang010692

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> While it may be warmer than the RE272 or ER4S, I really don't think the RE-400 is a warm earphone in the negative sense of that term. I have to spend more time with it but so far it's a difficult set to find fault with.
> 
> 
> I have not heard the IE800 from TDK. The VC02 might be a safer choice than the RE-400 as its bass quantity is somewhere between that and the GR07. It's not bloated at all and it is dirt cheap. I don't think it has the overall refinement of the HiFiMan, especially in the treble region, but then that's still a $40 earphone being compared to one of the best $100 sets. I definitely prefer the VC02 to the MH1C.
> ...


 
   
  I bought a Brainwavz M4 1 year ago and now thinking of changing my earphone. Hope you add HiFiMan RE-400 soon


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





quang010692 said:


> Hope you add HiFiMan RE-400 soon


 
   
  It was added on 3/14.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





pablobaluba said:


> I don't know if it's the right place to ask, but I'm undecided about a future purchase. I plan to get a pair of IEMs. I'm mostly listening to Electronic, Hip-Hop and some OSTs. So I'd prefer something bass oriented. They should be used on a portable gear (Colorfly C3 + C&C BH Amp). So if there are IEMs with good synergy with this combo it'd be great.
> 
> I put on my list until now Atrio Mg7 and JVC FX700. Maybe add T-Peos H-200 ? There's a lot of info in this topic/forum and if I'd have a list with 5-6 choices it would be great to read only about those. Budget can be up to 200$. Maybe more if it's really worth!?
> Thanks!


 
   
  I doubt you'll find an IEM that benefits significantly from that amp unless the Colorfly is a poor source to start with. Your post doesn't mention the type of sound you're looking for so I'll just say that I think the FX700 is generally better than the MG7 if you don't need isolation. Haven't tried the H-200.


----------



## peter123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The S2 should be a good choice if you think you'll enjoy a balanced sound. It has a slight bump in the bass but is otherwise quite accurate. The UE900 is a little smoother for me and maybe sounds a touch more layered and 3-dimensional. It also has a form factor I prefer, and better isolation, but I still think its difficult to justify the cost increase over the S2. Do keep in mind that the S2 has a 1-button remote, not a 3-button like the UE900 and stock Apple headsets.
> 
> 
> The design of the S2 actually keeps its driver in the outer ear. The CC51 and most other microdriver earphones do the opposite, putting the driver in the ear canal. Unless you have small outer ears also, you shouldn't have a problem.


 
   
  Sounds good. I just ordered the S2 yesterday so it will arrive during next week, I'm really looking forward to try it out. Thank you for your help.


----------



## pablobaluba

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I doubt you'll find an IEM that benefits significantly from that amp unless the Colorfly is a poor source to start with. Your post doesn't mention the type of sound you're looking for so I'll just say that I think the FX700 is generally better than the MG7 if you don't need isolation. Haven't tried the H-200.


 
  Thanks for the answer. Unfortunately FXZ700 has that lack of isolation that some mention and also a slightly short cable, which could be a problem for me as I'm quite tall. Still, I didn't cut them from my list
   
  I don't know how to define the type of sound I prefer, but I think it's something warm, slightly v shaped. At home I have Beyerdynamic DT990 (which are known for bass+treble and details) and I enjoy them a lot! Of course, they are open headphones and don't have that punch. JVC FXZ700 seem to be quite similar to those (which is good).
  I'm not really sure about Atrio MG7 as they are already a few years old and I'm thinking new IEMs should have better technologies and should be improved. Of course, this might be just a gimmick or my snob logic . But I would rather buy an IEM which was recently launched vs an old one.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





peter123 said:


> Sounds good. I just ordered the S2 yesterday so it will arrive during next week, I'm really looking forward to try it out. Thank you for your help.


 
   
  Make sure to play around with the fit - I think the S1/S2 are a little harder to get right than most, at least for me. Enjoy!
   
  Quote: 





pablobaluba said:


> Thanks for the answer. Unfortunately FXZ700 has that lack of isolation that some mention and also a slightly short cable, which could be a problem for me as I'm quite tall. Still, I didn't cut them from my list
> 
> I don't know how to define the type of sound I prefer, but I think it's something warm, slightly v shaped. At home I have Beyerdynamic DT990 (which are known for bass+treble and details) and I enjoy them a lot! Of course, they are open headphones and don't have that punch. JVC FXZ700 seem to be quite similar to those (which is good).
> I'm not really sure about Atrio MG7 as they are already a few years old and I'm thinking new IEMs should have better technologies and should be improved. Of course, this might be just a gimmick or my snob logic . But I would rather buy an IEM which was recently launched vs an old one.


 

 In that case you could save a bunch and just get the JVC FXT90. Slightly v-shaped signature with plenty of mid-bass for a warmer sound and it's newer than the MG7 and FX700. Better yet, you can grab them on ebay for $120-125 or maybe even less.


----------



## Liveartonline

http://www.amazon.com/electronics/dp/B004VHAJJU
   
  They average $80-90 from different sellers on Amazon.com
  I would jump on that deal if I wasn't so short on $ right now
  It sucks to be a student sometimes =(


----------



## MikePortnoy

Hello

I am considering buying a pfe 232. But I need an information about the volume level. I had w4 before, sometimes I had to turn the volume max in order to reach to my listening level (i have a hearing disability) If I get an pfe, will I have difficulty about volume level? Btw I have hm601 Sansa clip and iPod 5.5.. Thank you for your consideration.


----------



## ToneDeafNoob

Hi, I'm pretty new and was wondering what you would usually recommend for IEMs in the 70-120 price range? Ideally, I would want something in the 70 area but if the upgrade is worth it, I can extend my price range to 120. What do you guys recommend? I read reviews of some of the IEMs based on the graph but it's hard to judge what I would like when my experience with IEM's are limited to apple earphones and brainwavs m1.
   
  I listen to mostly hiphop/rap, rock, instrumentals, etc. (Muse, Explosions in the Sky, Hans Zimmer, 2Pac, Nas, Blue Scholars, Blu & Exile, etc.)


----------



## ljokerl

Sony MH1C review below. Since I can't edit tier 3A on the front page of this thread due to a technical glitch, I have posted it off-site for the time being. 
   
  Also, an abridged Buyer's Guide featuring 26 of my favorite sets, grouped by price and sound signature, can now be found here.
   
   
*(3A80) Sony MH1C*
   

Added Jun 2013
   
Details: Sony headset designed for the Xperia line of smartphones 
Current Price:* $35* from ebay.com (bulk packaging) (MSRP: $79.99)
Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _15Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB/V_ | Freq: _1-20k Hz _| Cable: _3.9' L-plug J-cord_
Nozzle Size: _3mm_ | Preferred tips: _stock single-flanges_
Wear Style: _Straight down_
   
Accessories *(1.5/5) *- Single-flange silicone tips (4 sizes) and shirt clip
Build Quality *(3.5/5) *– The MH1C is rather well-made, with a metal housing, flexible strain reliefs, and a sturdy flat cable. However, it is this rubbery, j-style (asymmetric) cable that can also make the earphones very to use. The 4-button remote is designed for Sony Xperia phones but offers partial functionality with many other devices
Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Isolation is quite good
Microphonics *(3/5) *– J-corded IEMs typically manage to avoid microphonics but the rubbery flat cable in the MH1C still carries a lot of noise 
Comfort *(4/5)* – The skinny housings and flexible tips of the MH1C provide a comfortable fit but the j-cord makes it difficult to wear the earphones cable-up
   
Sound* (8.1/10) *– Designed for smartphone users in search of great audio quality, the MH1C provides a warm, clear, and smooth sound only made more impressive by the reasonable price of the headset. The bass is deep and full, with an emphasis on sub-bass rather than mid-bass. Generally speaking, the MH1C has rather good bass quality with less mid-bass bloat than the Audio-Technica CKM500, for example. Considering the bass quantity, control is rather good although it’s still not as tight as the bass of the VSonic VC02 or the pricier Philips Fidelio S1. 
   
The mids of the MH1C are not as prominent as the low end, but they are pleasantly warm and smooth. The treble, likewise, is very inoffensive without sacrificing overall refinement. I did sometimes wish for better overall balance as the bass emphasis of the MH1C results in occasional veiling, but the clarity is generally very good. 
   
Better still is the high volume performance of the MH1C – the earphone remains very composed when played loud and its silky-smooth signature is conducive toward high-volume listening. Compared to the Brainwavz M5, for instance, the MH1C has less prominent mids and highs but is also smoother and more natural. Whereas the M5 can begin to distort slightly at high volumes, the MH1C produces no audible distortion. 
   
The soundstage of the MH1C is a little narrower compared to the half in-ear ATH-CKM500 and the pricier Philips Fidelio S1 but the overall presentation is very good, providing a moderately airy and open sound despite the warm tone with good sounstage width and depth. 
   
*Select comparisons:*
   
LG Quadbeat HSS-F420 ($32)
   
Not unlike the MH1C, the Quadbeat is a stock headset included with many LG smartphones. The sound signature of the Quadbeat is on the v-shaped side compared to the MH1C and its bass, especially subbass, is lower in quantity. The low end of the Quadbeat is a little tighter but the difference isn’t drastic. The LGs also sacrifice some of the warmth and fullness of the Sonys, giving up the excellent note thickness of the MH1C for a bit of added clarity, aided also by the extra treble energy of the Quadbeat. Next to the warm and smooth MH1C, the treble of the Quadbeat sounds brighter and harsher overall. 
   
I ended up preferring the sound of the MH1C, which overall sounded more natural and convincing despite the extra bass. On a user-friendliness note, while I found the cable of the Quadbeat to be a lot more tolerable than that of the MH1C, its extra-soft stock eartips did not work for me and had to be replaced with a set of standard bi-flanges of the MEElectronics variety. The Quadbeat was also more sensitive, reaching loud volumes very easily. 
   
VSonic VC02 ($49)
   
The VC02 is one of clearest and most balanced sub-$100 earphones I’ve ever heard, with a tiny 3mm dynamic driver providing a uniquely delicate, yet punchy sound. Unsurprisingly, the MH1C has a lot more bass and much warmer overall tone than the VC02. Its mids and treble are recessed in comparison to its bass whereas the VSonic set is rather well-balanced. The VC02 sounds brighter and thinner overall than the MH1C. It is clearer and more accurate, but the treble is harsher in comparison. The bass of the VC02 is surprisingly punchy considering its commitment to an accurate sound but remains tighter than that of the Sony.
   
In terms of overall usabilit, both sets can be a little frustrating – the VC02 sounds best with a rather deep fit and has detachable cables that are not connected to the housings as securely as I’d like. It really is an enthusiast’s IEM, requiring some care in use and storage. The MH1C is easier to fit and has a built-in remote and mic but also utilizes a cable that is rubbery and microphonic in comparison to the soft and flexible cord of the VC02. 
   
VSonic VSD1 ($43)
   
The VSD1 was released as a budget version of VSonic’s popular GR07 model, providing a less analytical sound than the VC02 but retaining its technical performance. In comparison to the MH1C, the VSD1 is less bassy, boasting better overall balance and more neutral tone. Bass quality is similar between the two but the VSD1 is a touch clearer overall and boasts more treble presence. As with the pricier GR07, its treble does have a slight predisposition towards sibilance in comparison to the buttery-smooth MH1C. The soundstage is a touch wider with the VSD1 and again the VSonic is noticeably more sensitive than the Sony.
   
Value *(10/10) *– Despite my issues with its j-style cable, microphonics, and proprietary remote, the MH1C offers fantastic sound quality for the asking price, and beyond. The bass is deep and full, and the overall sound is smooth and inviting. As long as its skew towards bass is not an issue, this is a fantastic mid-range earphone for beginners and veterans alike, and one that offers as much audio quality per dollar as anything else I’ve come across.
   
*Pros: Great deep bass & outstanding overall sound quality; comfortable form factor; good noise isolation*
*Cons: Rubbery, flat, j-style cable can be aggravating*
   
  Big thanks to *scootsit* for the MH1C unit!
   
  Quote: 





liveartonline said:


> http://www.amazon.com/electronics/dp/B004VHAJJU
> 
> They average $80-90 from different sellers on Amazon.com
> I would jump on that deal if I wasn't so short on $ right now
> It sucks to be a student sometimes =(


 

 Good price.


----------



## MikePortnoy

Hello

I am considering buying a pfe 232. But I need an information about the volume level. I had w4 before, sometimes I had to turn the volume max in order to reach to my listening level (i have a hearing disability) If I get an pfe, will I have difficulty about volume level? Btw I have hm601 Sansa clip and iPod 5.5.. Thank you for your consideration.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mikeportnoy said:


> Hello
> 
> I am considering buying a pfe 232. But I need an information about the volume level. I had w4 before, sometimes I had to turn the volume max in order to reach to my listening level (i have a hearing disability) If I get an pfe, will I have difficulty about volume level? Btw I have hm601 Sansa clip and iPod 5.5.. Thank you for your consideration.


 
   
  I think the PFE has been discontinued. It is also less sensitive than the W4 so it probably is not ideal for you.
   
  Quote: 





tonedeafnoob said:


> Hi, I'm pretty new and was wondering what you would usually recommend for IEMs in the 70-120 price range? Ideally, I would want something in the 70 area but if the upgrade is worth it, I can extend my price range to 120. What do you guys recommend? I read reviews of some of the IEMs based on the graph but it's hard to judge what I would like when my experience with IEM's are limited to apple earphones and brainwavs m1.
> 
> I listen to mostly hiphop/rap, rock, instrumentals, etc. (Muse, Explosions in the Sky, Hans Zimmer, 2Pac, Nas, Blue Scholars, Blu & Exile, etc.)


 
   
  Well, it's hard to recommend something without knowing what type of sound you are after. What you like/dislike about the M1 would be a good place to start.


----------



## MikePortnoy

Thank you very much for the response.


----------



## Liveartonline

Joker you should really consider writing a book based on your first few posts, its very detailed and easy to follow. I would totally buy it.


----------



## insidedrive

Joker, have you had the Chance to hear the vc1000? If so how does it compare with the gr01?


----------



## lilboozy

How does the sub and mid bass quantity of the soundmagic e10 compare with the she3580.


----------



## ToneDeafNoob

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, it's hard to recommend something without knowing what type of sound you are after. What you like/dislike about the M1 would be a good place to start.


 
  Hmm.. well overall I was very satisfied with the M1's. The only reason I'm buying a new one is that a few months ago the right one broke. So I don't actually remember too much of what it sounded like with both earphones on (I think that makes a difference since sound is distributed differently). From what I can remember and what I'm hearing now, I'm satisfied with the bass and low end but more "impact" or more of a "punch" would be nice. Not too much, but a little more would be nice. Also, I think my biggest disappointment in the sound of the M1's was the high's, it was all right but I definitely wanted more... "detail"? I think a bigger soundstage would have also been nice. I've also tried Sony MDR-ZX700 (the headphones, brand new ones my friend got so out of the box) and remember it sounded too "warm"/slightly boring for me. Sorry for my bad audio vocabulary haha, it's hard for me to describe what I want :/. Hope this helps in describing what I'm looking for.
   
  Last note, I felt my biggest gripe with the M1's were the comfort of it, even with the smallest tips that the IEM came with I would have to take it off within an hour or so. So hopefully, a comfortable IEM would be ideal. So I guess if I were ranking what is important to me according to your graph it would be Sound = Comfort > Build = Isolation > Accessories > Microphone.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mikeportnoy said:


> Thank you very much for the response.


 
   
  Sure!
   
  Quote: 





liveartonline said:


> Joker you should really consider writing a book based on your first few posts, its very detailed and easy to follow. I would totally buy it.


 
   
  Let's see how this one does first 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Joker, have you had the Chance to hear the vc1000? If so how does it compare with the gr01?


 
   
  Sorry, haven't had a chance to really give them a thorough listen yet. Been bogged down with the latest bunch of great budget sets. 
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> How does the sub and mid bass quantity of the soundmagic e10 compare with the she3580.


 

 Mid-bass is pretty similar but subbass is stronger on the Philips.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Let's see how this one does first


 
  Oh man I am so gonna get a copy of this


----------



## giorgiocis

hi ljokerl! i've enjoyed my yamaha eph-100 so far for almost one year and a half, soundwise they are amazing and i like the signature, but i have extremely narrow ear canals and i have already broken them twice (for constant readjustments i guess)...they weren't comfortable for my ear either so can you please suggest me a good comfortwise alternative in the same price range? i don't need the same level of bass of the yamaha, a warm not fatiguing sound is enough...what about GR07BE? and the philips s2? i have the philips x1, have you got the occasion of listening to them? if yes do they have the same sound signature? thank you very much for your work here and  at innerfidelity!


----------



## HeadHoncho

ljokerl said:


> Good question - I am not sure there is a way to really know. If I had to guess I'd say it's just the way that market evolved. You have to remember that the custom IEM market isn't very old and wasn't pioneered by the big audio brands with tons of experience on the headphone side of things (Sennheiser, AKG, etc). It was started by guys doing live sound in order to make the lives of musicians easier on stage. Also, I don't know if this had anything to do with it but Etymotic had already proven the accuracy of the balanced armature by that point with the ER4 launched sometime in the late 80s. Anyway, under different conditions it's conceivable that a lot of stage monitors would be dynamic - there's just no way to really know.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Thanks for the advice joker! If I can ask something else now, how would you compare these 3, sound wise.

GR02 BE - 36$
MH1C - 35$ (I have a Sony Xperia)
HiSound Wooduo 2 - 129$ (I found a person who had ordered a HiSoundAudio DAP, and was selling the 3 complimentary ear phones he received with it. So I ordered the Wooduo 2 from him, just the IEM and no box/accessories, for something around 50$. Keeping my fingers crossed that its all genuine and working properly)

Also, considering the huge-actual-price difference, would you say the Wooduo 2 is about the same as the GR02 BE, but with enhanced bass, or is it better in other ways too?


----------



## JonasG

Hey Joker! Thanks a lot for the tons of reviews and content you've provided.
   
  I've had some BeyerDynamic DTX 101 for two years, with which I've been happy, but the wire broke and I'm in need of new IEM's.
   
  Through some research, I've found that in my price-range, people are very fond of the Shure SE215 and new Philips Fidelio S1. Which should I choose?
   
  I'll be using them along with my iPod Touch 5'th Gen. when I'm transporting myself from A to B or otherwise outside, so isolation is important. I hear the SE215 have nice isolation while the S1 is lacking a little. Is that true? However, I have somewhat small ears and I've read that the SE215 might not fit properly. What do you think? And do you have any other IEM's which may be better?


----------



## Liveartonline

Quote: 





> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > Let's see how this one does first
> ...


 
   
  I second that. Thanks for the link. I didn't know stuff like this existed.


----------



## Liveartonline

Double Post.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





giorgiocis said:


> hi ljokerl! i've enjoyed my yamaha eph-100 so far for almost one year and a half, soundwise they are amazing and i like the signature, but i have extremely narrow ear canals and i have already broken them twice (for constant readjustments i guess)...they weren't comfortable for my ear either so can you please suggest me a good comfortwise alternative in the same price range? i don't need the same level of bass of the yamaha, a warm not fatiguing sound is enough...what about GR07BE? and the philips s2? i have the philips x1, have you got the occasion of listening to them? if yes do they have the same sound signature? thank you very much for your work here and  at innerfidelity!


 
   
  I think both the GR07BE and S2 have more potential for listening fatigue than the EPH-100 but at reasonable volumes neither should give you any trouble. Keep in mind that neither sounds as warm as the EPH-100 but if you're okay with a balanced sound with a bass bump, the GR07BE should be a good pick for tricky ear canals. The nozzles are small and nozzle angles are adjustable but, more importantly, the main housing is smaller compared to the S2 so you should have an easier time positioning the entire thing in your ear. 
   
  Quote: 





headhoncho said:


> Thanks for the advice joker! If I can ask something else now, how would you compare these 3, sound wise.
> 
> GR02 BE - 36$
> MH1C - 35$ (I have a Sony Xperia)
> ...


 
   
  The Wooduo 2 has tons and tons of sub-bass. Other than that it's a little tighter than the GR02 in the mid-bass region and slightly clearer as well, but the retail price difference does not correspond to the gap in sound quality in this case. If you already bought the Wooduo it makes sense to try and see where you want to go from there. 
   
  Quote: 





jonasg said:


> Hey Joker! Thanks a lot for the tons of reviews and content you've provided.
> 
> I've had some BeyerDynamic DTX 101 for two years, with which I've been happy, but the wire broke and I'm in need of new IEM's.
> 
> ...


 
   
  It's true that the SE215 has good isolation while the S1 is average in that respect. If isolation is most important I would go for the SE215 - it's not too likely that they won't fit. Otherwise you need to first decide whether you want th enhanced bass of the SE215 or the more balanced, clear, and accurate sound of the S1. The DTX 101 has quite a bit of bass so the SE215 will be closer to that in overall balance. Another option might be the HiSound Crystal, which has great isolation, a sound similar to the SE215 but with less bass emphasis, and a good fit for small ears.


----------



## ToneDeafNoob

Oh no, OP skipped replying to my reply post . Does that mean he won't answer it or he will answer it later? If he isn't going to answer it, anyone else have any other recommendations?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tonedeafnoob said:


> Oh no, OP skipped replying to my reply post . Does that mean he won't answer it or he will answer it later? If he isn't going to answer it, anyone else have any other recommendations?


 
   
  Sorry, you posted as I was replying to something else.
   
  Quote: 





tonedeafnoob said:


> Hmm.. well overall I was very satisfied with the M1's. The only reason I'm buying a new one is that a few months ago the right one broke. So I don't actually remember too much of what it sounded like with both earphones on (I think that makes a difference since sound is distributed differently). From what I can remember and what I'm hearing now, I'm satisfied with the bass and low end but more "impact" or more of a "punch" would be nice. Not too much, but a little more would be nice. Also, I think my biggest disappointment in the sound of the M1's was the high's, it was all right but I definitely wanted more... "detail"? I think a bigger soundstage would have also been nice. I've also tried Sony MDR-ZX700 (the headphones, brand new ones my friend got so out of the box) and remember it sounded too "warm"/slightly boring for me. Sorry for my bad audio vocabulary haha, it's hard for me to describe what I want :/. Hope this helps in describing what I'm looking for.
> 
> Last note, I felt my biggest gripe with the M1's were the comfort of it, even with the smallest tips that the IEM came with I would have to take it off within an hour or so. So hopefully, a comfortable IEM would be ideal. So I guess if I were ranking what is important to me according to your graph it would be Sound = Comfort > Build = Isolation > Accessories > Microphone.


 
   
  Sounds like a slightly v-shaped signature would be good for you but the comfort issue is troublesome because the M1 is so small and lightweight already. Maybe the UE500 - it's just as light as the M1 but also comes with some Comply tips and has a slightly angled housing. I know it's pretty cheap right now but its sound is competitive in the $50-80 range. Another option would be the Astrotec AM-800. Its housings are larger but they are designed to sit rather shallowly in the ear, which might work better for you. Again, v-shaped sound with stronger bass and treble compared to the M1. Another option - the CKM500. Personally, I find it to have too much mid-bass but it fits your other requirements and again is a shallow-fit earphone - the driver sits in the outer ear.


----------



## ToneDeafNoob

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sorry, you posted as I was replying to something else.
> 
> 
> Sounds like a slightly v-shaped signature would be good for you but the comfort issue is troublesome because the M1 is so small and lightweight already. Maybe the UE500 - it's just as light as the M1 but also comes with some Comply tips and has a slightly angled housing. I know it's pretty cheap right now but its sound is competitive in the $50-80 range. Another option would be the Astrotec AM-800. Its housings are larger but they are designed to sit rather shallowly in the ear, which might work better for you. Again, v-shaped sound with stronger bass and treble compared to the M1. Another option - the CKM500. Personally, I find it to have too much mid-bass but it fits your other requirements and again is a shallow-fit earphone - the driver sits in the outer ear.


 
  Thanks a lot! I'll research all three of those and choose one of them. One question, what about the RockIt R-50's? According to your graph and review they seem mighty tempting...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tonedeafnoob said:


> Thanks a lot! I'll research all three of those and choose one of them. One question, what about the RockIt R-50's? According to your graph and review they seem mighty tempting...


 

 It's a somewhat analytical-sounding earphone, definitely doesn't sound fuller or more impactful than the M1. It's an option if you want to try something radically different but not necessarily the safe choice.


----------



## higbvuyb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Sony MH1C review below.


 
   
  As always, nice review!
   
  Have you tried these with the +10dB or so of bass equalized out ( Joe's example is similar to what I do)? That gives me a completely different sound and I'm interested in your opinion.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

He did state that he is not interested in EQing so dont bother


----------



## papijoe08

mh1c + 10db bass? 0_o
 Too much bass everywhere.


----------



## Zelda

thanks for the  mh1c review. was waiting for it
   
  how do you find those new hybrid tips?


----------



## tman1

My walkman and MEE A161s have disappeared. I now have a new Clip Zip with backup Koss in-ear phones and need to get a new primary pair. I've been away for awhile - has anything come along that can compete with or beat the A161 for under around $100 in terms of overall quality (sound quality, isolation, and build quality)? I listen to rock so something with a bit more punch would be nice, but I love the isolation and customer service of MEE. Any advice is appreciated.


----------



## sinquito

Quote: 





tman1 said:


> My walkman and MEE A161s have disappeared. I now have a new Clip Zip with backup Koss in-ear phones and need to get a new primary pair. I've been away for awhile - has anything come along that can compete with or beat the A161 for under around $100 in terms of overall quality (sound quality, isolation, and build quality)? I listen to rock so something with a bit more punch would be nice, but I love the isolation and customer service of MEE. Any advice is appreciated.


 
  I haven't heard the MEE A161 nor the Etymotics HF sereis but I do belive that they are more or less the same just better made, with more isolation and sound a bit better (according to what I have read). I'm very interested in those etys so I know that they can be had for less than 100 bucks on amazon, the cobalt version with mic for android and windows phone I believe.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





higbvuyb said:


> As always, nice review!
> 
> Have you tried these with the +10dB or so of bass equalized out ( Joe's example is similar to what I do)? That gives me a completely different sound and I'm interested in your opinion.


 


 FrequencyBlue is correct - introducing the EQ as another variable would add more complexity to reviews than I wish to have at this time.
   
   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> thanks for the  mh1c review. was waiting for it
> 
> how do you find those new hybrid tips?


 
   
   
  They are really good. Funny because the other storied OEM phone headset I have here (LG Quadbeat) has absolutely atrocious stock tips.

  
  Quote: 





tman1 said:


> My walkman and MEE A161s have disappeared. I now have a new Clip Zip with backup Koss in-ear phones and need to get a new primary pair. I've been away for awhile - has anything come along that can compete with or beat the A161 for under around $100 in terms of overall quality (sound quality, isolation, and build quality)? I listen to rock so something with a bit more punch would be nice, but I love the isolation and customer service of MEE. Any advice is appreciated.


 
   
  Ouch. Well, the A161P does have a good combination of above-average quantity bass (for a single armature) and high isolation, and is still one of the better sub-$100 sets I've heard. The Philips Fidelio S1 is a good one with a bit more impact but you lose a chunk of the isolation of the A161. The JVC FXD80 also offers good clarity with more bass compared to the A161 but is not as accurate as the A161 or the S1 for that matter. Good build quality and isolation, though. 
   
  Quote: 





sinquito said:


> I haven't heard the MEE A161 nor the Etymotics HF sereis but I do belive that they are more or less the same just better made, with more isolation and sound a bit better (according to what I have read). I'm very interested in those etys so I know that they can be had for less than 100 bucks on amazon, the cobalt version with mic for android and windows phone I believe.


 
   
  The MEEs actually have a few db more bass while the Etys are flatter in the treble but generally they are pretty similar. I wouldn't think twice about paying $100 for an HF2 if I wanted a balanced-sounding earphone.


----------



## nNAVID

hello joker

can you tell me which one I must buy and which one has more value?sony mh1c or phillips fidellio s1?(also what score you give to s1for sound and value)my current headphone is sennheizer cx350.also do both of them can be used with normal mp3s(like cowon e2)not smartphonts? 

thanks

navid


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm... I didn't get any harshness from the EPH-100 either. It wasn't a smooth as the Tandem (for example) but it wasn't really harsh. I think you should try the R02 Silver and see what you think, then go from there. Might not have enough subbass if the Tandem didn't. I haven't heard the ProAlpha in a while (though I still have my M1 and M2) so the R02 Silver might be a better starting point for an upgrade.


 
   
  Eventually, I've got them. The R02 Silver is indeed more refined than the ProAlpha, but for me its mids, especially upper-mids, are too exposed, even strident and harsh (in some tracks).
 The ProAlpha has open, soft and warm background for smooth vocals and highs - that's what fun is about (correct me if I'm wrong).
 Whereas in the R02 Sliver all is shifted and exposed into mids. I miss balance, warmth (mid-bass) and musicality in the R02.
 So, I'd like something warmer and more balanced across all the frequency than the GR02 Silver (which have too strong vocals and mid-centric sound). The only thing which is quite accurate in the GR02 Silver is the clarity.
 Well, what's now, what should I try?


----------



## tman1

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ouch. Well, the A161P does have a good combination of above-average quantity bass (for a single armature) and high isolation, and is still one of the better sub-$100 sets I've heard. The Philips Fidelio S1 is a good one with a bit more impact but you lose a chunk of the isolation of the A161. The JVC FXD80 also offers good clarity with more bass compared to the A161 but is not as accurate as the A161 or the S1 for that matter. Good build quality and isolation, though.
> 
> 
> The MEEs actually have a few db more bass while the Etys are flatter in the treble but generally they are pretty similar. I wouldn't think twice about paying $100 for an HF2 if I wanted a balanced-sounding earphone.


 
   
  Thanks! I checked out the Philips - I have a Sony pair with a similar design and yeah although they sound good the isolation isn't enough for my use (commuting on subway). Those JVCs look interesting but I have a feeling I'm going to end up just getting another set of A161s.


----------



## jhii07

Hi Sir joker, is it safe to say that VSD1 is better than MH1C?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nnavid said:


> hello joker
> 
> can you tell me which one I must buy and which one has more value?sony mh1c or phillips fidellio s1?(also what score you give to s1for sound and value)my current headphone is sennheizer cx350.also do both of them can be used with normal mp3s(like cowon e2)not smartphonts?
> 
> ...


 
   
  I know I answered this off-site but in case anyone else is curious - the Philips S1 is quite well-balanced in terms of frequency response and is more accurate and true to source than the MH1C. It has a very small bass boost but if you want a warmer, bassier sound like that of your Sennheisers I would definitely go for the MH1C. The S1 is a great headset for accurate sound. The MH1C is great for warm and smooth sound. Both offer great value in their respective price categories.

 Not sure about the E2 specifically but the J3 and D2/D2+ Cowon models are definitely compatible with headset connectors. I am sure someone has tried a TRRS (headset) plug with the E2, maybe on ABI forum.
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> Eventually, I've got them. The R02 Silver is indeed more refined than the ProAlpha, but for me its mids, especially upper-mids, are too exposed, even strident and harsh (in some tracks).
> The ProAlpha has open, soft and warm background for smooth vocals and highs - that's what fun is about (correct me if I'm wrong).
> Whereas in the R02 Sliver all is shifted and exposed into mids. I miss balance, warmth (mid-bass) and musicality in the R02.
> So, I'd like something warmer and more balanced across all the frequency than the GR02 Silver (which have too strong vocals and mid-centric sound). The only thing which is quite accurate in the GR02 Silver is the clarity.
> Well, what's now, what should I try?


 
   
  Yes, the Silver is not too similar to the old R02/ProAlpha. Hmm... I really don't know of anything that sounds exactly like the ProAlpha but on a higher tier in sound quality. I take it you've tried the MH1C?

 Maybe the Dunu Landmine but again you have bass on-level with the M2 and not the ProAlpha. Ditto for the Monster Turbine series (except maybe the Pro Gold). I don't think I have an answer for this one out of what I've tried. The Shure SE215 might be the closest to having tight but emphasized bass with low bleed, a (slightly) warm tone, and smooth treble. It's not quite as warm or as thick-sounding as the R02, but not far behind. 
   
  Quote: 





tman1 said:


> Thanks! I checked out the Philips - I have a Sony pair with a similar design and yeah although they sound good the isolation isn't enough for my use (commuting on subway). Those JVCs look interesting but I have a feeling I'm going to end up just getting another set of A161s.


 
   
  Nothing wrong with that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  Quote: 





jhii07 said:


> Hi Sir joker, is it safe to say that VSD1 is better than MH1C?


 

 If you want warm and smooth sound, the VSonic won't beat the MH1C. If you want something overall more neutral or slightly v-shaped (like the GR07), then the VSD1 is the one to get. I think the VSonic is better overall but again preference towards a warm and smooth sound can easily swing it the other way.


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yes, the Silver is not too similar to the old R02/ProAlpha. Hmm... I really don't know of anything that sounds exactly like the ProAlpha but on a higher tier in sound quality. I take it you've tried the MH1C?
> 
> Maybe the Dunu Landmine but again you have bass on-level with the M2 and not the ProAlpha. Ditto for the Monster Turbine series (except maybe the Pro Gold). I don't think I have an answer for this one out of what I've tried. The Shure SE215 might be the closest to having tight but emphasized bass with low bleed, a (slightly) warm tone, and smooth treble. It's not quite as warm or as thick-sounding as the R02, but not far behind.


 
   
  I'm baffled, 248 IMEs and non of them upgrades the ProAlpha...
  If only the MH1C would has a normal cable believe me I would have it. In terms of sound I find it though a tad more analitycal and technical than the ProAlpha, but it is still sweet and warm rank. I was impressed by the MH1C but at the same time through the cable and problems with seal I was sick of them.
  I'm enquiring guys on the Zero Audio Basso in another thread. Hope it will fit the bill. There must be something out there.


----------



## PakoBoy

hey joker,
  could you compare the bass quality and quantity of VSD1, GR02 Bass and MH1C? and which one has most forward mids ?


----------



## lorenzini

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> If you want warm and smooth sound, the VSonic won't beat the MH1C. If you want something overall more neutral or slightly v-shaped (like the GR07), then the VSD1 is the one to get. I think the VSonic is better overall but again preference towards a warm and smooth sound can easily swing it the other way.


 
  Very interested in this comment. How does the VC02 sit in this comparison? I'm currently on the fence of the VC02 and VSD1, because my old GR07's broke (left channel dead). So to get something closer to my old GR07's I should go for the VSD1's or VC02's? I would like to have the same amount of bass and treble, but perhaps a more accurate midrange than the GR07's.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





justblue said:


> I'm baffled, 248 IMEs and non of them upgrades the ProAlpha...
> If only the MH1C would has a normal cable believe me I would have it. In terms of sound I find it though a tad more analitycal and technical than the ProAlpha, but it is still sweet and warm rank. I was impressed by the MH1C but at the same time through the cable and problems with seal I was sick of them.
> I'm enquiring guys on the Zero Audio Basso in another thread. Hope it will fit the bill. There must be something out there.


 
   
  It's not that, it's just that your rather specific requirements eliminate almost all of the possibilities I can think of.
   
   
  Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> hey joker,
> could you compare the bass quality and quantity of VSD1, GR02 Bass and MH1C? and which one has most forward mids ?


 
   
   
  Bass quantity: MH1C > VSD1 > VC02
  Bass quality: VC02 > VSD1 >= MH1C
   
  The VC02 has the best balance (least recessed mids), mostly because it has very little bass enhancement. The VSD1 is second, achieving a pretty good balance (IMO) with the mids not overly recessed. The MH1C has the most recessed mids and treble relative to the low end. 
   
   
  Quote: 





lorenzini said:


> Very interested in this comment. How does the VC02 sit in this comparison? I'm currently on the fence of the VC02 and VSD1, because my old GR07's broke (left channel dead). So to get something closer to my old GR07's I should go for the VSD1's or VC02's? I would like to have the same amount of bass and treble, but perhaps a more accurate midrange than the GR07's.


 

 The VC02 is brighter and thinner-sounding than the VSD1. The VSD1 has more bass and a fuller sound. If you want to get closer to the GR07, get the VSD1, but don't expect to have an upgrade to the GR07 at $43.


----------



## Mini0510

Hey joker, I tried those AKG K3003 and Ultrasone IQ. What you said is true. The difference between going from $100 IEM to $300 IEM is slightly bigger than going from $300 - $1000 IEM.
   
  Ultrasone IQ has good bass. More or less equal to FX700. IQ's treble is a bit weird though. It's extended, but it seems like it need a buff in the 4KHz region. But that can create sibilance. This might be the reason why it's tone down around that frequency. Mids are good, not much to complain. Putting those in my ear is a bit weird. Once is in my ear, then it's all good.
   
  K3003 has better treble for sure. But it has less bass on reference filter. Even with bass filter, it might match IQ's bass or slightly fall short. Can't remember. Slightly V shaped I believe.
  The soundstage is pretty big.
   
  At the end of the day, I don't see it's worth spending that much. Why? Because I can't really tell the difference. I can't speak for other people.
   
  I EQ'ed the sound signature of both IQ and K3003 similar to FX700. Ultimately, I think that's the most fair comparison. There shouldn't be distortion because I only EQ'ed like around 3dB. At least I can't hear the distortion. The sound quality is more or less the same. Perhaps ok, Perhaps, K3003 is slightly better in the treble region. But this is not confirmed. I kind of have the feeling. I didn't swap the IEMs back and forth comparing because I feel kind of guilty. The store owner was nice enough to let me try them out.
   
  So that's my conclusion. James444 said FX700 do pretty much 90-95% of K3003 with a little EQ. And you said, if I'm 90% happy with FX700's sound signature, it's really unjustified to buy the K3003.
   
  It was an exciting and disappointing day. I was excited to hear IQ and K3003. But I'm disappointed that I can't really tell the difference of sound quality between $300 and $1000 IEM. Nevertheless, I was expecting this (you told me) and I got the feeling after I bought PFE 232.
   
  Well, my wallet is safe at least!
   
  So I'm curious. *Is this normal for a person not being able to hear the difference between FX700 and AKG K3003 or Ultrasone IQ? *Without EQ, it seems like it's all about the presentation. If you EQ the IEMs to a similar sound signature and then compare the sound quality, well, as least in my ears, I can't tell the difference. 
   
  By the way, I only tried them for about 20min. Also, I'm using an ipod touch 5th gen with 320 aac music files without amp.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Hey joker, I tried those AKG K3003 and Ultrasone IQ. What you said is true. The difference between going from $100 IEM to $300 IEM is slightly bigger than going from $300 - $1000 IEM.
> 
> Ultrasone IQ has good bass. More or less equal to FX700. IQ's treble is a bit weird though. It's extended, but it seems like it need a buff in the 4KHz region. But that can create sibilance. This might be the reason why it's tone down around that frequency. Mids are good, not much to complain. Putting those in my ear is a bit weird. Once is in my ear, then it's all good.
> 
> ...


 

 That sounds about right, especially considering the signature of the FX700 works well for you. Saying there's a 10% difference between the K3003 and a good sub-$500 universal is probably generous.


----------



## mechgamer123

Hi Joker, 
  First time poster in your thread and I just wanted to say a huge thanks for this thread. It's because of your thread that I've made all my IEM purchases in the past.
  I'm now stuck though. I currently own the GR07, and I like it a lot, but I am in need of an upgrade. I like the slightly elevated sub bass and intimate female vocals and such, but I don't like the few odd dips and spikes in the treble, and the isolation is a bit lacking IMO.
  What would you recommend for an upgrade from the GR07 that would be better at isolation and smoother in the treble at or below $400? Possibly the UM3X?
  Thank you.


----------



## MusicL0ver

Philips Fidelio vs A161P
  which one is better for person who listens to a wide range of musics?


----------



## PakoBoy

ljokerl said:


> Bass quantity: MH1C > VSD1 > VC02
> Bass quality: VC02 > VSD1 >= MH1C
> 
> The VC02 has the best balance (least recessed mids), mostly because it has very little bass enhancement. The VSD1 is second, achieving a pretty good balance (IMO) with the mids not overly recessed. The MH1C has the most recessed mids and treble relative to the low end.




Thx but could you add thr gr02 bass edition instead of vc02 :s


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Is it right if FXT90 has fewer bass quantity than FX40, I wonder?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mechgamer123 said:


> Hi Joker,
> First time poster in your thread and I just wanted to say a huge thanks for this thread. It's because of your thread that I've made all my IEM purchases in the past.
> I'm now stuck though. I currently own the GR07, and I like it a lot, but I am in need of an upgrade. I like the slightly elevated sub bass and intimate female vocals and such, but I don't like the few odd dips and spikes in the treble, and the isolation is a bit lacking IMO.
> What would you recommend for an upgrade from the GR07 that would be better at isolation and smoother in the treble at or below $400? Possibly the UM3X?
> Thank you.


 
   
  If you like the treble quantity (just not the peakiness) of the GR07, you'll probably think the UM3X lacks treble. Isolation is very good.
   
  If you don't want to sacrifice that much treble energy, the UE 900 might be a better pick sound-wise, though it's not quite as ergonomic as the UM3X IMO and needs foam tips to get near UM3X levels of isolation. 
   
  Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Philips Fidelio vs A161P
> which one is better for person who listens to a wide range of musics?


 
   
  Probably the S1 - a little more dynamic-sounding and spacious. However, if you need isolation or have small outer ears, definitely go for the A161.
   
   
  Quote: 





pakoboy said:


> Thx but could you add thr gr02 bass edition instead of vc02 :s


 
   
  Bass quantity: MH1C >= GR02 BE > VSD1
 Bass quality: VSD1 >= MH1C > GR02 BE

 The VSD1 has the best balance (least recessed mids). The GR02 BE and MH1C are more recessed in the midrange due to the enhanced bass on both. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> Is it right if FXT90 has fewer bass quantity than FX40, I wonder?


 
   
  It's been a while since I had the FX40. I don't remember them being very far apart in bass quantity.


----------



## Inks

Oh boy, hope you didn't get a bass bloated version of the MH1C. VC02 has nice bass quantity but little subbass, even less than a lot of single BAs. A good MH1 has a wee bit less bass than XBA3 with similar quality. That's the problem though, the MH1C has QC issues and MH1 requires an adapter


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > Hi Joker,
> ...



Hmm, at the moment I'm used to the mad dog, which is a fairly dark headphone, so I might not mind the decreased treble...
How does the UE900 handle female vocals?


----------



## PakoBoy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Bass quantity: MH1C >= GR02 BE > VSD1
> Bass quality: VSD1 >= MH1C > GR02 BE
> 
> The VSD1 has the best balance (least recessed mids). The GR02 BE and MH1C are more recessed in the midrange due to the enhanced bass on both.


 
  Thanks.
  looks like no need to get the GR02 BE even at the price of $32 as i already have the MH1 and the VSD1 is on the way.


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's not that, it's just that your rather specific requirements eliminate almost all of the possibilities I can think of.


 
   
  But I require just something warm, smooth and balanced with a good bass response and also clarity. In fact it's the popular high-end Sennheiser HD600/650's signature, I wouldn't call it a special expectations...


----------



## Gryphus0204

Hey Joker. I was wondering what between the R-50 and the HF5, which has better soundstage and instrument seperation? I'm currently using the Gr07MKII, and would maybe try something new. I was also either thinking of maybe saving up on both and go for maybe the a custom like the 1964 V3? I prefer a good V-shape sound signature however still focusing more on the imaging and instrument separation and slightly foward mids


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





justblue said:


> But I require just something warm, smooth and balanced with a good bass response and also clarity. In fact it's the popular high-end Sennheiser HD600/650's signature, I wouldn't call it a special expectations...


 
  Perhaps you could email btg-audio to see if they could do the mod for you to turn it into detatchable cables so you could get your own set of cables on there?


----------



## davidcotton

Hi Joker
   
  Would you recommend the westone 4r for mainly progressive/hard rock?  I've been going round in a circle trying to decide between the heir 3ai and 4ai (I know you haven't heard/reviewed them) and the 4r (not sure if the ue900 (hate swivel connectors so might rule it out on that alone!) or phonak pf232 would be suitable either).  I listen to music for 5-6 hours a day (at work).  Had the westone 3's and quite liked it until they went through the wash, now they just don't sound the same.  Did find the 3's a little bass heavy for my taste and was wondering if the smoother sound of the 4's would sit well for long period listening? I can get 3-4 albums a day in fairly easily so a non fatiguing sound is obviously important.  Sources would be either an ipod classic or a sansa clip plus mainly (need to keep it simple).  Isolation is also very important to me.

 Thanks


----------



## Grayson73

VGP2013 just came out with rankings.  Any thoughts on their winners?  Has anyone heard the Sony XBA-10?
   
http://www.visualgrandprix.com/vgp2013/vgp_p2_12.html
   
 [size=medium]
  Earbud Headphones (¥ 30,000 or more)  






  Gold  SENNHEISER IE 800　　



  Silver  SONY XBA-40



  Bronze  AKG K3003



  Winning  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CK100PRO



  Winning  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CKM1000



  Winning  DENON AH-C400



  Winning  SENNHEISER IE 80





   - (Less than 30,000 yen 20,000 yen or more) earbud headphones  





  Gold  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CKS1000



  Silver  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CK90PROMK2



  Bronze  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CKS1000LTD



  Winning  DENON AH-C300



  Winning  JVC HA-FXZ200



  Winning  KLIPSCH Image X10



  Winning  KLIPSCH Image X7i



  Winning  SONY XBA-30





   · (¥ 20,000 less than 10,000 yen or more)-ear headphones  





  Gold  JVC HA-FXZ100



  Silver  SENNHEISER IE 60



  Bronze  SONY XBA-20



  Winning  9WAVE NW-STUDIO PRO



  Winning  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CKS99



  Winning  B & W C5



  Winning  BOSE BOSE SIE2 SPORT HEADPHONES



  Winning  HARMAN / KARDON harman / kardon AE



  Winning  KLIPSCH Image X5



  Winning  SONY MDR-XB90EX



  Winning  TDK LIFE ON RECORD IE800





   · (¥ 10,000 less than 5,000 yen or more) earbud headphones  





  Gold  SONY XBA-10



  Silver  JVC HA-FXD80



  Bronze  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CKM500



  Winning  BOSE BOSE IE2 AUDIO HEADPHONES



  Winning  JVC HA-FXD70



  Winning  KLIPSCH Image S4 II



  Winning  PIONEER SE-CL541



  Winning  PIONEER SE-CL551



  Winning  SENNHEISER CX 685 SPORTS



  Winning  SENNHEISER OCX 685i BLACK SPORTS



  Winning  SENNHEISER OCX 685i WHITE SPORTS



  Winning  SENNHEISER PMX 685i SPORTS



  Winning  SENNHEISER PX 685i BLACK SPORTS



  Winning  SENNHEISER PX 685i WHITE SPORTS



  Winning  SHURE SE215 Special Edition



  Winning  THE HOUSE OF MARLEY Redemption Song IE





   - Earbud Headphones (5,000 yen)  





  Gold  AUDIO-TECHNICA ATH-CKM300



  Silver  SONY MDR-XB30EX



  Bronze  SENNHEISER MX 375



  Winning  BEYERDYNAMIC DTX41iE



  Winning  MAXELL HP-CN17



  Winning  MAXELL HP-NZ16



  Winning  MAXELL HP-RC16



  Winning  SENNHEISER CX 175



  Winning  SENNHEISER MX 685 SPORTS



  Winning  SENNHEISER OMX 185



  Winning  THE HOUSE OF MARLEY Smile Jamaica with Mic & Remote



  Winning  ZERO AUDIO ZH-DX200-CT



  Winning  ZERO AUDIO ZH-DX210-CB


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Perhaps you could email btg-audio to see if they could do the mod for you to turn it into detatchable cables so you could get your own set of cables on there?


 

 Before I start playing with cables I have to pick new IEMs (besides, I don't believe in cables 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)


----------



## davidcotton

Ah I meant send the mh1s in for the cable mod if you liked the mh1!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Oh boy, hope you didn't get a bass bloated version of the MH1C. VC02 has nice bass quantity but little subbass, even less than a lot of single BAs. A good MH1 has a wee bit less bass than XBA3 with similar quality. That's the problem though, the MH1C has QC issues and MH1 requires an adapter


 
   
  Mine has plenty of bass, mostly subbass. I sent it over to Tyll so there might be a measurement of it up on IF. It is not as tight and controlled as the VC02 but not far behind the VSD1. 
   
  Quote: 





mechgamer123 said:


> Hmm, at the moment I'm used to the mad dog, which is a fairly dark headphone, so I might not mind the decreased treble...
> How does the UE900 handle female vocals?


 
   
  Pretty well - not as well as something like the Ety ER4S or RE272 but not worse than the SM3 or UM3X IMO. 
   
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Hey Joker. I was wondering what between the R-50 and the HF5, which has better soundstage and instrument seperation? I'm currently using the Gr07MKII, and would maybe try something new. I was also either thinking of maybe saving up on both and go for maybe the a custom like the 1964 V3? I prefer a good V-shape sound signature however still focusing more on the imaging and instrument separation and slightly foward mids


 
   
  The R-50 but realistically the difference between them will be very small. 
   
  The V3 sounds very different from the GR07 and even more different from the HF5/R-50. It has a colored, exciting sound to it with plenty of bass. If that sounds like what you are after, I would go for it. 
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Would you recommend the westone 4r for mainly progressive/hard rock?  I've been going round in a circle trying to decide between the heir 3ai and 4ai (I know you haven't heard/reviewed them) and the 4r (not sure if the ue900 (hate swivel connectors so might rule it out on that alone!) or phonak pf232 would be suitable either).  I listen to music for 5-6 hours a day (at work).  Had the westone 3's and quite liked it until they went through the wash, now they just don't sound the same.  Did find the 3's a little bass heavy for my taste and was wondering if the smoother sound of the 4's would sit well for long period listening? I can get 3-4 albums a day in fairly easily so a non fatiguing sound is obviously important.  Sources would be either an ipod classic or a sansa clip plus mainly (need to keep it simple).  Isolation is also very important to me.
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  Isn't the PFE 232 discontinued? It is closer in signature to your W3s than the UE900 or even W4. In terms of bass quantity, I would say W3 >= PFE232 > W4 >= UE 900 (with the W4/UE900 having more or less "balanced" amounts of bass). I think the UE900 is very non-fatiguing without sacrificing treble energy and I like its sound with rock. The W4 doesn't bother me either. I can listen to it for a long time. Can't say the same for the W3 and PFE232.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Isn't the PFE 232 discontinued? It is closer in signature to your W3s than the UE900 or even W4. In terms of bass quantity, I would say W3 >= PFE232 > W4 >= UE 900 (with the W4/UE900 having more or less "balanced" amounts of bass). I think the UE900 is very non-fatiguing without sacrificing treble energy and I like its sound with rock. The W4 doesn't bother me either. I can listen to it for a long time. Can't say the same for the W3 and PFE232.


 
   
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Would you recommend the westone 4r for mainly progressive/hard rock?  I've been going round in a circle trying to decide between the heir 3ai and 4ai (I know you haven't heard/reviewed them) and the 4r (not sure if the ue900 (hate swivel connectors so might rule it out on that alone!) or phonak pf232 would be suitable either).  I listen to music for 5-6 hours a day (at work).  Had the westone 3's and quite liked it until they went through the wash, now they just don't sound the same.  Did find the 3's a little bass heavy for my taste and was wondering if the smoother sound of the 4's would sit well for long period listening? I can get 3-4 albums a day in fairly easily so a non fatiguing sound is obviously important.  Sources would be either an ipod classic or a sansa clip plus mainly (need to keep it simple).  Isolation is also very important to me.
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  Agree with joker, PFE 232 is a bit lighter on bass but it's brighter in treble. More treble quantity. PFE 232 and Westone 4r isolate pretty well with 4r has the upper hand in isolation.
  If you want non fatigue sound, then probably 4r since the some find that the treble is a bit bright on the PFE 232. The treble on 4r is more neutral.
  I think I'm right. Hopefully someone can verify this about Westone 4r.


----------



## MusicL0ver

Interesting.
   
  So If I am looking for a IEM with mic with good isolation
  Which one would be the best under $150 range?
 Been looking at the a161p, but the Phonak PFE 012 also looks great..
   
  I listen to a wide range of music and like something that is a little bass strong.
   
  Been using the nuforce ne6 for couple years, which I enjoyed. Recently, the right side died on me.
   
  TIA


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Interesting.
> 
> So If I am looking for a IEM with mic with good isolation
> Which one would be the best under $150 range?
> ...


 
   
  PFE 012 has decent amount of bass. Maybe Monster Turbine for more bass quantity?


----------



## MusicL0ver

Wait, I thought Monster Turbine is like Beats, overpriced for performance (?)


----------



## msavic6

I mainly listen to pop, dance, hip hop and modern music and I would want an IEM that is fun sounding. I value isolation and comfort greatly so what IEM would fit my needs?


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> I mainly listen to pop, dance, hip hop and modern music and I would want an IEM that is fun sounding. I value isolation and comfort greatly so what IEM would fit my needs?


 
  tell us your budget
   
  Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Wait, I thought Monster Turbine is like Beats, overpriced for performance (?)


 
  I was assuming you can get this online for like $100. But what kind of mids and treble do you want?


----------



## msavic6

mini0510 said:


> tell us your budget



Up to $200, although that is not set in stone.


----------



## alienfox

Epic


----------



## MusicL0ver

Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> I was assuming you can get this online for like $100. But what kind of mids and treble do you want?


 
  Not that picky about treble but I would like clarity for mids.
   
  I originally thought about the turbines, but after seeing reviews like this
  http://www.amazon.ca/product-reviews/B002NTKV5A/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
  I passed on it
   
   
  What about the Sony MH1C?
  Btw. I am able to get a a161p for $90 tax in. Is that good?


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Not that picky about treble but I would like clarity for mids.
> 
> I originally thought about the turbines, but after seeing reviews like this
> http://www.amazon.ca/product-reviews/B002NTKV5A/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
> ...


 

 The bass (force?) is strong on the turbines, but I did find it swamped the details a bit.  I kept turning the volume up to compensate which led to a headache in the end.  If you want clarity I would pass.  I should add that this was out of the usual clip plus/ipod touch sources listening to rock and metal.
   
  Cheers


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Mine has plenty of bass, mostly subbass. I sent it over to Tyll so there might be a measurement of it up on IF. It is not as tight and controlled as the VC02 but not far behind the VSD1.
> 
> 
> Pretty well - not as well as something like the Ety ER4S or RE272 but not worse than the SM3 or UM3X IMO.
> ...


 

 Discontinued but still available with the likes of amazon and earphonesolutions.  I guess what I'm after is a westone 2 with a little more thump in it (but not too much) if that makes sense.  The ue900 seems to be polarizing opinion and I've never liked swivel connecters after the se215's.
   
  Cheers


----------



## justblue

Joker
  Sorry to harass you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Could you tell which ones of these 283 are closest to the Shure SE535 in terms of sound and SQ (I'd prefer straight down wear style)?


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Ah I meant send the mh1s in for the cable mod if you liked the mh1!


 
   
  Oh, you mean recable.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I thought about it, its an option. In fact I could replace it with a headset to work with my mobile. But first I would pick Joker's brain for ideas of the SE535-like IEMs.


----------



## vwinter

musicl0ver said:


> Interesting.
> 
> So If I am looking for a IEM with mic with good isolation
> Which one would be the best under $150 range?
> ...




I haven't heard either 161 or the phonak but I recently heard my gf's NE-6 again and that thing is literally a bass cannon, a ton of quantity and impact but not flabby. What's shocking about it is that it doesn't sound dark or congested keeping good midrange and treble presence and a good soundstage. Really a unique sound if you ask me.

I'm sorry for your loss.

I don't think either of those choices will have nearly as much bass. If you want a similar sound but higher end, it might be a bit of a challenge. 

FWIW, my gf likes my Sony XBA-4iP, which has a mic and 3 button remote. Kind of over your price range but you can probably find one for around $200 if you look hard enough. Worth looking into some reviews at least, if you want a similar enough but higher end sound that is. Maybe even the XBA-3iP that can be found cheaper but with a bit less bass and more balance overall probably.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Not that picky about treble but I would like clarity for mids.
> 
> I originally thought about the turbines, but after seeing reviews like this
> http://www.amazon.ca/product-reviews/B002NTKV5A/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
> ...


 
  Don't know about that review. Seems kind of BS. Haven't heard the Sony MH1C. Joker just reviewed, so might as well read the review.
  If you don't want to go with Monster, then maybe go with Shure line ups. They follow a bassy, good mids, dark treble sound signature.
  But I could be wrong. I haven't heard many of the low end models.
   
   



justblue said:


> Joker
> Sorry to harass you
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Maybe Monster Turbine Pro Copper? Or Westone 3? Yeah, I can't really answer this question. Joker will have to.


----------



## msavic6

msavic6 said:


> I mainly listen to pop, dance, hip hop and modern music and I would want an IEM that is fun sounding. I value isolation and comfort greatly so what IEM would fit my needs?



I guess I got buried in the influx of posts but my budget would be up to $200.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> So If I am looking for a IEM with mic with good isolation
> Which one would be the best under $150 range?
> Been looking at the a161p, but the Phonak PFE 012 also looks great..
> 
> ...


 
   
  The NE-6 is more than a little bass strong. If you want that quantity of bass you'd probably be better off with a Shure SE215+mic cable. Much more user-friendly and better-isolating than the MH1C, though perhaps not an upgrade in sound quality. If you do want to try something a lot more accurate, the A161P would be good but it only has a few db of bass boost over something like an Ety ER4. 
   
  Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Wait, I thought Monster Turbine is like Beats, overpriced for performance (?)


 
   
  Not as bad, and they've been known to go on sale (unlike beats).
   
  Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> I mainly listen to pop, dance, hip hop and modern music and I would want an IEM that is fun sounding. I value isolation and comfort greatly so what IEM would fit my needs?


 
   
  Yamaha EPH-100 is great if you have average-size (or larger) ear canals. Good isolation and the sound works well for modern music (e.g. EDM). 
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Discontinued but still available with the likes of amazon and earphonesolutions.  I guess what I'm after is a westone 2 with a little more thump in it (but not too much) if that makes sense.  The ue900 seems to be polarizing opinion and I've never liked swivel connecters after the se215's.
> 
> Cheers


 
   
  Yeah, in that case you're better off with the W4.
   
    
  Quote:


justblue said:


> Joker
> Sorry to harass you
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hmm... most high-end BA monitors are worn cable-up. There's not much that's cable down. The HiFiMan RE262 comes to mind - it has been discontinued but you may still be able to find one used or even NOS.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> I guess I got buried in the influx of posts but my budget would be up to $200.


 
  what about bass/mids/treble?


----------



## msavic6

mini0510 said:


> what about bass/mids/treble?



I'm not good at describing with technical terminology but
I want tight bass that is not overpowering, mids that are clear and for treble, I'm not quite sure on my preference but overall I want the iems to be exciting and fun to listen too. I guess that means I don't want 100% balance in the sound.


----------



## Sycho

By any chance have you tried out the HiFiMan RE400, and if you have, how would you compare it to the Brainwavz B2 and MH1C?


----------



## MusicL0ver

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> The bass (force?) is strong on the turbines, but I did find it swamped the details a bit.  I kept turning the volume up to compensate which led to a headache in the end.  If you want clarity I would pass.  I should add that this was out of the usual clip plus/ipod touch sources listening to rock and metal.
> 
> Cheers


 
  Hmm I see. Thank you
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> I haven't heard either 161 or the phonak but I recently heard my gf's NE-6 again and that thing is literally a bass cannon, a ton of quantity and impact but not flabby. What's shocking about it is that it doesn't sound dark or congested keeping good midrange and treble presence and a good soundstage. Really a unique sound if you ask me.
> 
> I'm sorry for your loss.
> 
> ...


 
  Yea. Really liked the NE-6, although a little 'bass-y'.
  I will look into the 4iP!
  Quote: 





mini0510 said:


> Don't know about that review. Seems kind of BS. Haven't heard the Sony MH1C. Joker just reviewed, so might as well read the review.
> If you don't want to go with Monster, then maybe go with Shure line ups. They follow a bassy, good mids, dark treble sound signature.
> But I could be wrong. I haven't heard many of the low end models.


 
  Yea. Was really interested in the MH1C after reading Joker's review.
  Which shure do you suggest?
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The NE-6 is more than a little bass strong. If you want that quantity of bass you'd probably be better off with a Shure SE215+mic cable. Much more user-friendly and better-isolating than the MH1C, though perhaps not an upgrade in sound quality. If you do want to try something a lot more accurate, the A161P would be good but it only has a few db of bass boost over something like an Ety ER4.
> 
> 
> Not as bad, and they've been known to go on sale (unlike beats).


 
   
  Hmm I see. I will give the A161P a try first then. Bought it yesterday for $90 tax in. Just kind of worried if it warrants such a price tag (never really spent more than $70 for IEMs...)
  Mic cables. First time I actually heard of them lol.
  Will give it a look.
   
  Btw, is there any good MH1C tips? to improve isolation.
  Cheers.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> I'm not good at describing with technical terminology but
> I want tight bass that is not overpowering, mids that are clear and for treble, I'm not quite sure on my preference but overall I want the iems to be exciting and fun to listen too. I guess that means I don't want 100% balance in the sound.


 
  I'm not sure then. Sorry.
   
  Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Yea. Was really interested in the MH1C after reading Joker's review.
> Which shure do you suggest?


 
  what joker suggested. SE215. That's seems to be in your price range.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> I'm not good at describing with technical terminology but
> I want tight bass that is not overpowering, mids that are clear and for treble, I'm not quite sure on my preference but overall I want the iems to be exciting and fun to listen too. I guess that means I don't want 100% balance in the sound.


 
   
  I still think the EPH-100 would be a good choice. 
   
  Quote: 





sycho said:


> By any chance have you tried out the HiFiMan RE400, and if you have, how would you compare it to the Brainwavz B2 and MH1C?


 
   
  RE-400 is review #2C54. It's nowhere near as bassy as the MH1C but not as analytical as the B2, with a bit more mid-bass and less treble sparkle. 
   
  Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Hmm I see. I will give the A161P a try first then. Bought it yesterday for $90 tax in. Just kind of worried if it warrants such a price tag (never really spent more than $70 for IEMs...)
> Mic cables. First time I actually heard of them lol.
> Will give it a look.
> 
> ...


 

 Probably a good idea to try the A161P if you already bought it but don't expect much more than a 'reference' quantity of bass. The mic cable is a Shure thing - the SE215 doesn't come with a microphone so Shure sells a mic/remote accessory cable for it separately. Together with the mic cable it's still within your budget.
   
  And, the MH1C stock tips are actually very nice. I didn't find any aftermarket ones that were an improvement.


----------



## MusicL0ver

The A161P sounds great.
   
  But, another problem came up. Darn.
  There's only sound from the L bud, unless it's at certain angles while in the audio jack. Consider 360 degree, only about 270 degree where both buds work. This is the Samsung Galaxy Note II.
  I then plugged the A161P into my computer. Works fine, all 360 degree.
   
  So maybe it's a NOTE II problem. Nope (?)
  Tried my Klipsch S4, and both sides work in any angle.
  This is really weird...
   
  Any suggestions?


----------



## msavic6

As far as I can tell, no store carries the eph-100 near me and I will not purchase online so I guess eph-100 is out of the picking. Any other viable options that are available at headphone bar in Vancouver or like best buy/future shop?


----------



## doctorjazz

Sony XBA-3iP was discontinued, could be found for under $100, probably still some around. I like these, do have bass presence requested. I have both the 161 and  the Phonak, really like them both but they aren't strong on bass (the Phonak has different filters that change the sound, gray is neutral, black is supposed to increase the bass, but I haven't tried the black filter). Fit/comfort on the Phonaks are better than any other iem I've tried, though. They disappear.


----------



## AUDIOBREEDER

They ain't discontinued as of June 15 2013.
  Look here
  http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666414113
  Quote: 





doctorjazz said:


> Sony XBA-3iP was discontinued, could be found for under $100, probably still some around. I like these, do have bass presence requested. I have both the 161 and  the Phonak, really like them both but they aren't strong on bass (the Phonak has different filters that change the sound, gray is neutral, black is supposed to increase the bass, but I haven't tried the black filter). Fit/comfort on the Phonaks are better than any other iem I've tried, though. They disappear.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> The A161P sounds great.
> 
> But, another problem came up. Darn.
> There's only sound from the L bud, unless it's at certain angles while in the audio jack. Consider 360 degree, only about 270 degree where both buds work. This is the Samsung Galaxy Note II.
> ...


 
   
  The S4 has a 3-pole plug. The A161P has a 4-pole plug. Some Samsung phones have had a problem with 4-pole Apple compatible plugs, though I am not sure of the Note II is among those.
   
  Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> As far as I can tell, no store carries the eph-100 near me and I will not purchase online so I guess eph-100 is out of the picking. Any other viable options that are available at headphone bar in Vancouver or like best buy/future shop?


 

 In that case you're better off listing what you have available to you. I, for one, have no idea what the headphone bar is, or what best buy carries in Canada.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> The A161P sounds great.
> 
> But, another problem came up. Darn.
> There's only sound from the L bud, unless it's at certain angles while in the audio jack. Consider 360 degree, only about 270 degree where both buds work. This is the Samsung Galaxy Note II.
> ...


 
  That's weird - the newer Samsung phones use the standard CTIA plug, so the a161p should work fine but if you have issues use the adapter included in the package. That's the strong side of a161p - with the adapter it covers both CTIA and OMTP standards and works with everything from old Samsung phones to apple products.


----------



## msavic6

ljokerl said:


> In that case you're better off listing what you have available to you. I, for one, have no idea what the headphone bar is, or what best buy carries in Canada.




Here is headphonebar: http://www.headphonebar.com/

Bestbuy and future shop do not really carry too many iems here in Canada. They have the BnW C5, the new monster iem(DNA,N-ergy) and that's about it.


----------



## Mini0510

Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> Here is headphonebar: http://www.headphonebar.com/
> 
> Bestbuy and future shop do not really carry too many iems here in Canada. They have the BnW C5, the new monster iem(DNA,N-ergy) and that's about it.


 
  buy online is the best way. Bestbuy/futureshop in Canada aren't the best when it comes to headphone/earphone selections and prices.


----------



## higbvuyb

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> The A161P sounds great.
> 
> But, another problem came up. Darn.
> There's only sound from the L bud, unless it's at certain angles while in the audio jack. Consider 360 degree, only about 270 degree where both buds work. This is the Samsung Galaxy Note II.
> ...


 
  Is the jack plug damaged?


----------



## MusicL0ver

Quote: 





higbvuyb said:


> Is the jack plug damaged?


 
  Is there any ways to find that out?
 Through the naked eyes, things look good. Everything looks symmetrical.
  Quote: 





kova4a said:


> That's weird - the newer Samsung phones use the standard CTIA plug, so the a161p should work fine but if you have issues use the adapter included in the package. That's the strong side of a161p - with the adapter it covers both CTIA and OMTP standards and works with everything from old Samsung phones to apple products.


 
  Yea.. exactly.
  I have just tried the adapters.
  Only with the splitter does both buds work at any angle. The splitter is the one that splits into ear piece and mic. The green/audio plug is only 3 poles.
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The S4 has a 3-pole plug. The A161P has a 4-pole plug. Some Samsung phones have had a problem with 4-pole Apple compatible plugs, though I am not sure of the Note II is among those.


 
  The one I was using is actually 4 plug. It's the S4i white, if that helps.
  Tried another 4 plug IEM and same result. Only music from both buds around 270 degree and loses the other right one. It's always the right one.
  Also, the mic is on the right for the A161p so I was able to test it out.
  The mic works. So does the button.
   
   
  So weird!
  Seems like that the other ring of the NOTE II is kind of iffy. However, how come the S4i works at all angle then... man..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> That's weird - the newer Samsung phones use the standard CTIA plug, so the a161p should work fine but if you have issues use the adapter included in the package. That's the strong side of a161p - with the adapter it covers both CTIA and OMTP standards and works with everything from old Samsung phones to apple products.


 
   
  Good point, forgot the A161 came with an adapter. 
   
  Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> Here is headphonebar: http://www.headphonebar.com/
> 
> Bestbuy and future shop do not really carry too many iems here in Canada. They have the BnW C5, the new monster iem(DNA,N-ergy) and that's about it.


 
   
  Not a great selection to be honest. The SE215 should be fine fine. Better than the C5 anyway. 
   
   
  Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> So weird!
> Seems like that the other ring of the NOTE II is kind of iffy. However, how come the S4i works at all angle then... man..


 
   
  Ah, okay. If it's the S4i it will have the same plug configuration as the A161P. Seems odd. I would try the A161 with another smartphone/tablet if you have one to rule out issues with yours.


----------



## MusicL0ver

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Ah, okay. If it's the S4i it will have the same plug configuration as the A161P. Seems odd. I would try the A161 with another smartphone/tablet if you have one to rule out issues with yours.


 
  Yea.. weird indeed.
  Tried it with my tablet. Works fine. It seems like my note II's audio port is broken? But how come the S4i works fine, at all angles too?
  Anyone got any ideas?
   
  Going to see if Samsung can do anything for me....


----------



## msavic6

ljokerl said:


> Not a great selection to be honest. The SE215 should be fine fine. Better than the C5 anyway




I was browsing the deals thread recently and saw that the monster isport livestrong ear buds are $49 from the previous $179. Would these be an any good for my specific genres? I'm also thinking I should maybe look at headphones since the iems available to me are not quite meeting my needs.


----------



## dweaver

Hey there msavic6, didn't want to respond to much in the deals thread as that is a bit against the rules of that thread.

you state you listen to mainly modern music and pop. Would that include hippop and dubstep? If so those are genres I do not listen to as I mostly listen to classic rock, jazz, Celtic music and accoustic. Also what volume do you listen at?

if your a low volume listener the Monster sport I mentioned is a great performer and would be a fun listen for you I think and has decent isolation and is very comfortable once you figure out inserting them.

If you listen at mid to loud volumes I think the Monster sport would be fatiguing and a bit shouty. If you like bass and also listen at louder volumes you might enjoy the new Westone ADV which is quite dark with monster bass and again is very comfortable. For me they are to dark and I have to listen at volume levels I am no longer comfortable with for longer listening sessions so I am going to either return mine or resell them for the loss price I take sending them back to the vendor. But for the genres you listen to they might be a perfect IEM choice for you.


----------



## msavic6

dweaver said:


> Hey there msavic6, didn't want to respond to much in the deals thread as that is a bit against the rules of that thread.
> 
> you state you listen to mainly modern music and pop. Would that include hippop and dubstep? If so those are genres I do not listen to as I mostly listen to classic rock, jazz, Celtic music and accoustic. Also what volume do you listen at?
> 
> ...




I usually listen at relatively low volumes, 20-30% or so depending on my mood i will raise the volume a bit. Thanks for the suggestion and I will look into it a bit more. The enticing aspect of the monsters is the price point they are at, otherwise I probably would never even look at them. Regarding genres, I will listen to hip hop occasionally but dubstep is maybe a song here or there, over all the majority is pop, dance and electronic music.


----------



## dweaver

Jump on the Monsters then. I think you will enjoy the heck out of them and you should be able to return them if you don't. They are a very good low/mid volume IEM.


----------



## up late

kudos to you joker for the fantastic resource. your take on the se530, ex1000, fi ba ss and iq is so close to mine it's scary. it's so cool to come across a reviewer who hears alike. really looking forward to trying the k3003 based on your review. will you be reviewing the ie800? i'd be interested in what you think. should be giving it a try along with the k3003 this week. keep up the great work man.


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Hmm... most high-end BA monitors are worn cable-up. There's not much that's cable down. The HiFiMan RE262 comes to mind - it has been discontinued but you may still be able to find one used or even NOS.


 
   
  OK I surrender, let it be OTE style. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Which ones are similar to the Shure SE535?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





musicl0ver said:


> Yea.. weird indeed.
> Tried it with my tablet. Works fine. It seems like my note II's audio port is broken? But how come the S4i works fine, at all angles too?
> Anyone got any ideas?
> 
> Going to see if Samsung can do anything for me....


 
   
  I'm out of ideas...
   
  Quote: 





msavic6 said:


> I was browsing the deals thread recently and saw that the monster isport livestrong ear buds are $49 from the previous $179. Would these be an any good for my specific genres? I'm also thinking I should maybe look at headphones since the iems available to me are not quite meeting my needs.


 
   
  I have no experience with any of the newer Monster IEMs. Seems there's been quite a few released in the past year or so.
   
  Quote: 





up late said:


> kudos to you joker for the fantastic resource. your take on the se530, ex1000, fi ba ss and iq is so close to mine it's scary. it's so cool to come across a reviewer who hears alike. really looking forward to trying the k3003 based on your review. will you be reviewing the ie800? i'd be interested in what you think. should be giving it a try along with the k3003 this week. keep up the great work man.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  I did review the IE 800 on InnerFidelity here. It will be added to this thread when I get a chance. Sound-wise I like it a little better than the Ultrasone IQ but still prefer the K3003. Usability-wise I think both the IQ and K3003 are a little better.
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> OK I surrender, let it be OTE style.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The SE535... followed by the SE530


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SE535... followed by the SE530


 
   
  Great 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (I thought I could find something cheaper)


----------



## davidcotton

I would of thought the 530's could be found relatively cheaper on the boards by now...


----------



## Ultrazino

Quote: 





justblue said:


> Great
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I found the Fischer Amps FA-3 to sound similar. There are two versions, one with an E (FA-3E) and one without. Sonically they should be identical and the non-concha housing is considerably cheaper but does not feature removable cables.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





justblue said:


> Great
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3 reminded me of a cheaper, less capable SE530.


----------



## up late

cool joker - i'll check it out. gotta say that I thought the iq was a nice sounding phone but a pain to fit. didn't like the design at all. but it was easier on the ears than the hyper revealing fi ba ss.


----------



## doctorjazz

Quote: 





audiobreeder said:


> They ain't discontinued as of June 15 2013.
> Look here
> http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666414113
> Quote:
> ...


 
  That's good, I like them...I had read they were being discontinued when the XBA-30 and the other times 10 Sony iem's were released, and it certainly looked that way with the discounted prices on the 3's and others in the line.If they're available at such good prices and NOT discouned, even sweeter.


----------



## ljokerl

LG Quadbeat and TDK MT300 reviews below. The post containing Tier 3A still cannot be modified due to a technical issue so the LG Quadbeat review is hosted off-site for now. It can be found here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/lg-quadbeat-hss-f420/
   
   
 
*(3A81) LG Quadbeat HSS-F420*


Added Jun 2013

 Details: Stock headset for several LG smartphones; also sold separately
 Current Price: *$32* from ebay.com (MSRP: est $35)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic _| Imp: _24Ω _| Sens: _98 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _5.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Generic bi-flanges_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(1/5) *- Single-flange (2 sizes) and bi-flange silicone tips
 Build Quality *(3.5/5)* – Much like the Sony MH1C, the Quadbeat utilizes aluminum housings and lightweight, tangle-resistant flat cables. There is a single-button mic and remote on the right-side cable
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Good when well-sealing eartips are used
 Microphonics* (3.5/5)* – Bothersome when worn cable-down but tolerable with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(3.5/5)* – The shells of the Quadbeat are on the large side and the nozzles are extremely short. The stock tips are longer than average, designed to offset the issue with the housing shape, but are very soft and don’t provide a great seal for me. Those with small outer ears may have an issue finding a comfortable fit due to the housing shape 

 Sound *(7.9/10) *– The sound of the Quadbeat takes on a slightly v-shaped character with present but not overbearing bass and crisp, bright highs. Overall, it strongly reminds me of the Sunrise Audio Xcited. The low end has good extension and slight mid-bass boost for a punchy, yet clean sound. The Quadbeat lacks the depth and thickness of the Sony MH1C, so it won’t be a good match for those who prefer a fuller, weightier low end. However, its bass competes well with more neutral VSonic VC02, which has slightly less bass quantity.

 The midrange of the Quadbeat is clear and detailed, cleaner of bass bleed than the mids of the Philips SHE3580 and Astrotec AM-800, for example. Note thickness is similar to the VSonic VC02 and again lacking some of the fullness of sets like the Sony MH1C and VSonic VSD1.

 The treble is energetic, giving the overall tone a slightly bright tilt. Though the VSonic VC02 and VSD1 are slightly more predisposed towards sibilance, the Quadbeat has more overall energy in the upper midrange and lower parts of the treble, which gives it a brighter, slightly splashy sound. Next to the silky-smooth MH1C, it sounds a bit harsh but on its own the treble quality is decent enough. The presentation of the Quadbeat is wide and uncongested, as tends to be the case with other earphones with similar signatures. It is more out-of-the-head than that of the Sony MH1C and even the VSonic VSD1 and retains good separation and imaging.

 Value *(10/10) *– The LG Quadbeat provides a clean and detailed, yet minimally offensive sound with a slightly v-shaped signature. It’s also rather user-friendly, boasting flat cables that are less annoying than those on the Sony MH1C and a universal single-button remote. Not all is ideal - the wide, straight-barrel housings won’t work for all ear shapes and the stock tips may need replacing, but even with the cost of new tips factored in the Quadbeat offers great value for money. It also means that owners of certain LG phones will have to spend a good chunk of change to upgrade from their stock headsets. Whether this is a curse or a blessing, I’m not quite sure.

*Pros: Great audio quality
 Cons: Wide housings not ideal for small ears; flimsy stock tips*

 Big thanks to *Fernito *for the LG Quadbeat loan!
   
   
   
   
*(3B39) TDK MT300*
   

Added Jun 2013

 Details: Entry-level earphone from TDK
 Current Price: *$24* from amazon.com (MSRP: $29.99)
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _16Ω_ | Sens: _89 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Sony hybrid_
 Wear Style: _Straight down_

 Accessories *(1/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes)
 Build Quality *(3/5) *– The metal housings of the MT300 are solid but the thin, plasticky cable is a reminder of the earphone’s low price
 Isolation *(3/5) *– Good, but limited by the shallow insertion of the earphones
 Microphonics *(3.5/5)* – Tolerable, but the MT300 is difficult to wear cable-up to eliminate cable noise entirely
 Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The small, angled-nozzle housings are lightweight and very comfortable, though wearing the MT300 over-the-ear can be tough.

 Sound *(5.5/10) *– The MT300 is an entry-level earphone with a bass-heavy, consumer-oriented sound. It impresses with the depth and power of its sub-bass response, though there is also mid-bass to match. The bass emphasis of the MT300 gives it a full-bodied, albeit boomy, sound. The Philips SHE3580, which is also rather bass-heavy, keeps its bloat to a minimum due to its thinner, quicker note presentation but the MT300 is not quite so capable, sounding thicker and more bloated.

 The weighty low end of the MT300 dominates the sound, producing a veil over the midrange and treble. Comparing the MT300 to the aging MEElectronics M9 reveals a lack of mid-bass bloat - and veiling - with the MEElecs but at the same time shows that the MT300’s mid-bass gives it a warmer, fuller sound with thicker, more natural mids. The midrange of the MT300 is recessed compared to the bass, but not too much so. The mids of the Philips SHE3580, for example, appear more recessed, likely due to its thinner sound and slightly more v-shaped response.

 The tone of the MT300 has a dark tilt due to a lack of treble energy. The benefit is a nicely non-fatiguing sound – although the treble is not entirely smooth, its features are masked at lower volumes. It is of better quality than the treble of the MEElec M9 but not nearly as refined as that of the pricier Sony MH1C.

 While the MT300 is no MH1C when it comes to presentation, its soundstage is wide for an entry-level set. Size-wise, it is about on-par with the M9 and would probably be even more impressive were it not for the mild congestion resulting from the bass emphasis - something the MH1C manages to do a better job of avoiding. As for the extremely low sensitivity figure in the manufacturer specs of the TDKs, it does not seem to correspond very well to reality in this case – the MT300 reaches high volumes rather easily.

 Value *(7.5/10)* – The TDK MT300 is a capable earphone, performing better than entry-level sets from such big audio brands as Sennheiser and Ultimate Ears. At $25, it is a solid but not entirely outstanding budget earphone that is nonetheless worthy of recommendation due to its pleasant sound, great comfort, and good overall usability. Interestingly, it seems to be pricier and more limited in availability in the US than in Canada, for example, so those outside of the States might find a better deal still in the MT300.

*Pros: Good bass response; smooth at reasonable volumes; very comfortable
 Cons: Lacks a bit in the way of clarity and bass control*

 Huge thanks to* inline79 *for sending in the MT-300 and making this review happen!


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Still churning out the reviews I see joker :etysmile: I wrote like what, 6? And gave up trying to find new descriptions for the phones I heard D: You could apply for a Guinness World Record for most IEMs ever reviewed by one person I think :basshead:

The SHE3580 is becoming one of the standards by which almost every budget IEM is measured?  (can't say I've been reading all your reviews recently so can't be sure) If you gather every quote you wrote about them in reviews for other IEMs I would think you would quickly finish that review of them. Otherwise it could also be interesting for them to retain the enigma of the omnipresent, always referred to IEMs that no one can ever be sure about :veryevil:


----------



## Joe Bloggs

frequencyblue said:


> He did state that he is not interested in EQing so dont bother







ljokerl said:


> FrequencyBlue is correct - introducing the EQ as another variable would add more complexity to reviews than I wish to have at this time.




If you found that adding EQ makes it possible for most IEMs to sound like anything you want them to be, I can relate--even with just my ears "measuring" and tweaking the frequency response with Electri-Q I wrote myself into a corner within ten phones :eek:

Given that you find sub $300 and $1000+ headphones so close at times as is I can imagine the grading nightmare adding EQ would introduce :veryevil:


----------



## Alientank

I'm having a hard time finding a lot of the IEMs in the sub $100 range available still. Is there any that stand out to anyone that are still available online? Many of the ones with 10/10 values I can't find anywhere, they seem to be discontinued :/
   
  Thanks.


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





alientank said:


> I'm having a hard time finding a lot of the IEMs in the sub $100 range available still. Is there any that stand out to anyone that are still available online? Many of the ones with 10/10 values I can't find anywhere, they seem to be discontinued :/
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  RE-400's ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Still churning out the reviews I see joker
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Pretty much, yes. The SHE3580 is a great pick-up-and-go IEM. I don’t think it sounds quite as good as the MH1C or Quadbeat but it’s close, cheaper, more readily available, and very comfortable. I was hoping to pick up a 3590 to verify that they are identical before posting the 3580 review but haven’t gotten around to it yet. 
   
  Do Guinness records require a second trial for verification? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





alientank said:


> I'm having a hard time finding a lot of the IEMs in the sub $100 range available still. Is there any that stand out to anyone that are still available online? Many of the ones with 10/10 values I can't find anywhere, they seem to be discontinued :/
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  HiFiMan RE-400, MEElec A161P, Sony MH1C, VSonic VC02, HiSound Crystal. Also the Philips Fidelio S1 (not yet added to this thread). Other sets such as the Etymotic HF5 and FXT90 dip below $100 on occasion on ebay/amazon. The shortened buyer's guide only has sets that are currently available.


----------



## Mops123

Hi, first of all, THANK YOU JOKER, for this thread and the full earphones shootout.
   
  i am looking for budget iems mainly for traveling (bus and subway )
   
  in my country all of these are more or less the same price, i cant deside between which one:
   
   
  1) philips Shh 3580 ( i dont like the mic but cant finde she 3580 )



 2) Philips She3570



 3) Panasonic Rp-hje290 ( there is good review on 395, but there are a few good comments on 290/295 , no serius review)



 4)Philips Sho 2200 O´neill ( excellent build quality, not that good sound )



 5) Philips SHE3575



 6) sennheiser Mx 400
   
  i think the best two options are the sho2200 and shh3580 , i dont know if i should priorize sound or build quality, actually i coundt find opinion on the build quility over the 3580, if its at least 3.5/5 i think its a no brainer, if its less i dont know :S-
  help 
   
  ps: i use sansa clip+ rockbox + 32gb ( i am noob so no eq for now, i plan to learn on the future)
  i listen:
   
  Punk rock ( bad religion, rise against, nofx, ramones, etc)
 Rock (acdc, led zeppeli )
 Reggea (bob)
 Ska punk (ska-p)


----------



## Joe Bloggs

mops123 said:


> Hi, first of all, THANK YOU JOKER, for this thread and the full earphones shootout.
> 
> i am looking for budget iems mainly for traveling (bus and subway )
> 
> ...




If you're looking for the SHE3580 you can substitute with the SHE3590 or SHE3500. 99% sure that the 3590 is the same thing (even the mic'd 3595 that I own sound exactly the same). Less sure about the 3500, but it looks more well-built than the 3590.

The SHH3580 that I own have less bass than the SHE3580. That can be a good or bad thing depending on how much bass you like. They're the only pair I know of in the SHE3xx00 series that sounds significantly different from the SHE3580 and still I'd say the difference is not big.


----------



## Mops123

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> If you're looking for the SHE3580 you can substitute with the SHE3590 or SHE3500. 99% sure that the 3590 is the same thing (even the mic'd 3595 that I own sound exactly the same). Less sure about the 3500, but it looks more well-built than the 3590.
> 
> The SHH3580 that I own have less bass than the SHE3580. That can be a good or bad thing depending on how much bass you like. They're the only pair I know of in the SHE3xx00 series that sounds significantly different from the SHE3580 and still I'd say the difference is not big.


 
  i dont have those models in argentina, jsut the ones i posted
  i read somewhere that the 3570 was the same as 3580, but i dont know.,


----------



## MastermindJapan

It would be interesting to see the reviews of the Zero Audio Tenore/Basso and the Vsonic VSD1 on the Buyers list. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
Trying my best to wait patiently...


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mops123 said:


> Hi, first of all, THANK YOU JOKER, for this thread and the full earphones shootout.
> 
> i am looking for budget iems mainly for traveling (bus and subway )
> 
> ...


 

 It look like the SHE3570 is the same thing as the 3580. I'd go for that - I thought the 3580 sounded significantly better than the 2200 no matter the genre. I can live with its construction. For a $15-20 earphone it's fine - it's all plastic and the cables are a little thin but again it's $15. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





mastermindjapan said:


> It would be interesting to see the reviews of the Zero Audio Tenore/Basso and the Vsonic VSD1 on the Buyers list.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  The VSD1 is definitely coming.


----------



## takowhut

How does the transparency of the gr07 compare to the similarly priced dual balanced armatures like dba-02 mkii or rockit sounds re-50? I'm considering a replacement just in case my dba-02 (original) breaks down from severe channel imbalance (it's already showing signs of this problem)


----------



## Joe Bloggs

ljokerl said:


> It look like the SHE3570 is the same thing as the 3580. I'd go for that - I thought the 3580 sounded significantly better than the 2200 no matter the genre. I can live with its construction. For a $15-20 earphone it's fine - it's all plastic and the cables are a little thin but again it's $15.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Subway and bus aren't exactly demanding use for IEMs, the 3580/3570 should last just fine with moderate care. I haven't had a set break down in two years.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





takowhut said:


> How does the transparency of the gr07 compare to the similarly priced dual balanced armatures like dba-02 mkii or rockit sounds re-50? I'm considering a replacement just in case my dba-02 (original) breaks down from severe channel imbalance (it's already showing signs of this problem)


 
   
  Different strengths and weaknesses. Personally I think the DBA-02 is more transparent than the GR07 and even the R-50 but the gap is small. You're better off considering if you'll like the extra bass of the GR07.


----------



## peter123

Joker, picked up the Philips Fidelio S2 for my HTC One on your recommendation. Could not be more happy with result, thank you
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I was afraid that they would not match the vsd1 and the CKN70's that I like a lot but I'm happy to say that they surpases both of these with quite some margin.


----------



## phantompersona

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Pretty much, yes. The SHE3580 is a great pick-up-and-go IEM. I don’t think it sounds quite as good as the MH1C or Quadbeat but it’s close, cheaper, more readily available, and very comfortable. I was hoping to pick up a 3590 to verify that they are identical before posting the 3580 review but haven’t gotten around to it yet.
> 
> Do Guinness records require a second trial for verification?
> 
> ...


 
   
  That's an extremely useful site you got there joker.I recommend anyone who reads joker's thread to have a look at his buyer guide and interactive headphone table.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Just want to pass by and say thank you joker. It's your review that I decided to buy a pair of FXT90, and even though my pair is a little bit faulty, I really love the sound of it.
  Keep up the good work man!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





peter123 said:


> Joker, picked up the Philips Fidelio S2 for my HTC One on your recommendation. Could not be more happy with result, thank you
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Glad to hear that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Philips did a good job with these. Even the S1 surpasses my VSD1, though it is twice as expensive. 
   
  Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> That's an extremely useful site you got there joker.I recommend anyone who reads joker's thread to have a look at his buyer guide and interactive headphone table.


 
   
  Still merely a work in progress with lots to be done 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> Just want to pass by and say thank you joker. It's your review that I decided to buy a pair of FXT90, and even though my pair is a little bit faulty, I really love the sound of it.
> Keep up the good work man!


 

 Glad you like them. Just curious - is it channel balance? I've been curious whether it's more difficult for manufacturers to match drivers in dual- and triple-dynamic systems.


----------



## Leo888

Hi Joker, I'll be picking up a pair of Philips S2 but would like your thoughts before I do that.

Currently, I'm rotating between the SE535, FXT90 and CKN70 for my daily commute and my work place. From reviews I've read, the S2 is leaning towards neutral with a slight boost in bass. 

The question is whether the boost is in the sub bass or mid bass. Also, I'm looking forward to a different take on sound signature and would like to know if it will be different enough in comparison to the iems I'm using now.

Thanks in advance and my regards to you.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

well it's the left earpiece that causes discomfort/unfit, but yeah it somewhat affects channel balance


----------



## lukEM22

Can someone link me to those $30 Sony MH1s, I think I have found them but they are listed as new other. I just want to make sure I get the right ones.
  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sony-MH1c-Headset-SmartKey-Control-Xperia-Bulk-Packing-Black-/170876113045#vi-content


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi Joker, I'll be picking up a pair of Philips S2 but would like your thoughts before I do that.
> 
> Currently, I'm rotating between the SE535, FXT90 and CKN70 for my daily commute and my work place. From reviews I've read, the S2 is leaning towards neutral with a slight boost in bass.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Well I haven't heard the CKN70 but the S2 is different from the SE535 and especially the FXT90. I guess it falls between those two. It doesn't have as much mid-bass as the FXT90 and the treble is smoother, so the overall sound is not v-shaped as with the FXTs. At the same time, there's a more bass than with the SE535 (with a proper seal, of course) and the treble is more prominent and energetic.
   
  Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> well it's the left earpiece that causes discomfort/unfit, but yeah it somewhat affects channel balance


 
   
  Interesting, thanks. 
   
  Quote: 





lukem22 said:


> Can someone link me to those $30 Sony MH1s, I think I have found them but they are listed as new other. I just want to make sure I get the right ones.
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sony-MH1c-Headset-SmartKey-Control-Xperia-Bulk-Packing-Black-/170876113045#vi-content


 
   
  Yeah, that's them.


----------



## Leo888

Hi Joker, thanks for the thoughts. 

Now I have a better idea what to expect. Maybe one last question if you don't mind. Being close to neutral, does it sound cold and causes fatigue for prolong listening. 

I do understand very individual hears differently and would appreciate if you could let me know your thoughts regarding this. 

Thanks again, joker.


----------



## jekostas

Huh.  I actually have that LG headset and I never bothered to listen to it until now as I kind of assumed that bundled headset for phones are mostly awful.
   
  Listened to them today.  They're pretty good.  The stock double flange tips are terrible, like really, really terrible, though.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Now I have a better idea what to expect. Maybe one last question if you don't mind. Being close to neutral, does it sound cold and causes fatigue for prolong listening.


 

 No, I don't find it fatiguing but one thing I noticed was that both of the Fidelios are very sensitive to fit/seal. I was actually slightly disappointed with them (and yes, did find them a little harsh) until I found better tips. Just for reference, I do find the GR07 (and GR06 and GR02BE) and certain TWFK-based sets (e.g. Rock-It R-50 and UE 700) slightly fatiguing over long periods.


----------



## Leo888

That will be great. Out of the iems you've mentioned, I've only heard the UE700 and I think I have s good idea what to expect from the S2.

Thanks again joker for the thoughts and being here to provide a helping hand.

Appreciate it and my best regards to you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jekostas said:


> Huh.  I actually have that LG headset and I never bothered to listen to it until now as I kind of assumed that bundled headset for phones are mostly awful.
> 
> Listened to them today.  They're pretty good.  The stock double flange tips are terrible, like really, really terrible, though.


 
   
  Yeah, it's like those tips were designed to collapse when inserted.
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> That will be great. Out of the iems you've mentioned, I've only heard the UE700 and I think I have s good idea what to expect from the S2.
> 
> Thanks again joker for the thoughts and being here to provide a helping hand.
> 
> Appreciate it and my best regards to you.


 

 I should clarify that I was annoyed with the old (UE) version of the 700, not the newer Logitech version. There's a slight difference in sound, among other things.


----------



## Leo888

Joker, thanks for the clarification.

 I think the last time I heard the UE700 was the Logitech version. Just curios, what's the difference between them.


----------



## Emospence

Any plans to review the T-PEOS H-200?


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





emospence said:


> Any plans to review the T-PEOS H-200?


 
  ClieOS  also has a quite good ears 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/667441/review-t-peos-d-202-h-100-and-h-200


----------



## up late

hey joker! just wanted to say that I tried the k3003 and agree with your review.


----------



## SyCo87

How does the VSD1 and VC02 compares to the LG Quadbeats posted? I have the GR06 but, I'm looking for something with a bit more energy.


----------



## Mops123

i bought the philips she 3570, 
   
  its pretty comfortable, overall good sound ( lacks a little bass).
  but i am having trouble and confusion.
   
  if i put them on my sansa, the plug does not connect very well and if i move arround i hear like cable noise or stop listening for a milisec etc. then i decided to try with the adapter, that problem dissapears BUT, it looses power, it feels like bathroom busic, AND i can only hear instruments, like half of the sounds are gone.
   
  I tried them on my computer (trough an amp, technics cu-s04) , if i use the adapter it sounds great, if i dont use the afapter it sounds HORRIBLE, i mean HORRIBLE, lots of treeble, kinda feels like its away , i dont know :S
   
  it might have smthg to do with the resistance that the adapter offers, i dont know, any comment s?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Joker, thanks for the clarification.
> 
> I think the last time I heard the UE700 was the Logitech version. Just curios, what's the difference between them.


 
   
  They differ in design. Here's an old thread on them: http://www.head-fi.org/t/599247/heads-up-two-versions-of-the-ue700 
   
  Quote: 





emospence said:


> Any plans to review the T-PEOS H-200?


 
   
  Only the H-100 at this time.
   
  Quote: 





up late said:


> hey joker! just wanted to say that I tried the k3003 and agree with your review.


 
   
  Glad to hear that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





syco87 said:


> How does the VSD1 and VC02 compares to the LG Quadbeats posted? I have the GR06 but, I'm looking for something with a bit more energy.


 

 The Quadbeat is plenty energetic. 
   
  Quadbeat vs VSD1: The Quadbeat is wider/more spacious but has a thinner note. Its treble is not as sibilant but still brighter overall. It has sort of a hollower sound to it compared to the fuller-sounding VSD1. The VSD1 also has more impactful bass and, to me at least, sounds more natural overall. 
   
  The VC02 is flatter and more neutral than the more v-shaped Quadbeat. Overall, its sound is a little more crisp and clear but doesn't have the added bass impact of the Quadbeat. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





mops123 said:


> i bought the philips she 3570,
> 
> its pretty comfortable, overall good sound ( lacks a little bass).
> but i am having trouble and confusion.
> ...


 
   
  What adapter?


----------



## Mops123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What adapter?


 
  the one on the third image http://www.headphonesfactory.com/philips-she3575bw-28-pop-color-in-ear-headset-with-microphone-black-white.html#.UcJhDD5O0W4
   
  i bought 3575, think i should have bought 3570 :S


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mops123 said:


> the one on the third image http://www.headphonesfactory.com/philips-she3575bw-28-pop-color-in-ear-headset-with-microphone-black-white.html#.UcJhDD5O0W4
> 
> i bought 3575, think i should have bought 3570 :S


 

 Ah, that's most likely an adapter that reverses the microphone and ground pins on the headset. Didn't realize Philips included it with an entry-level model.

 It looks like the microphone connector is giving you trouble with the Sansa, which is not designed for headsets (though I've never had a problem with my old Clip). You might be able to restore audio (either with or without the adapter) by holding down the remote button. The 3570 wouldn't have that problem.


----------



## Y2HBK

I have found myself struggling with deciding where my next move with IEMs will be. I, like many I'm sure, made small and incremental investments with full size cans, amps and DACs over the years. I am very happy with where I am at at this time. I have, however, been traveling for work more and more and find myself revisiting my IEMs. I have always been content with my IEMs based on the small amount of time per week that I used them, but now that that time has increased I've been looking for more. 

I think I would like to stick with an IEM, rather than a CIEM at this time. I have enjoyed the clarity and balance of my GR07 (wishing it had more to offer in the low end), but appreciate the soundstage of the EPH-100 more. Comparing apples to oranges of course, but I have been completely happy with my HD800s in the full size headphone field, so I would ideally like something that has a similar sound signature with maybe a touch more low end. I spend most of my time listening to classic rock, but spend plenty of time listening to acoustic tracks (where my HD800s _really_ shine), classical, techno, etc. 

I've toyed with budget, not wanting to play quite so much with several incremental updates in the IEM field as I did with full size cans. I think my preference would be to keep it no more than $800, but flexible. I've drooled a bit over reviews of IEMs like the K3003, but do not want to spend _quite_ that much on IEMs. I spent a lot of time researching the QI and the IE800, but am not convinced that I would be happy with either of those (I can be an incredibly indecisive person). Ive been toying with the idea of trying out the PFE 232s since some can still be found around $400. 

Any recommendations?


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





mops123 said:


> i bought the philips *SHE3575* (edited),
> 
> its pretty comfortable, overall good sound ( lacks a little bass).
> but i am having trouble and confusion.
> ...


 
   
  The adapter switches around the position of the mic and ground connectors.  Since there is no standard for where the ground connector on headphone-only sockets goes, one socket may require the adapter and another not.
   
  From your description it sounds like the sansa does not require the connector while the computer's socket requires it.  As for why there's "cable noise" or the music cuts out--it may just be a bad connection.  Try twisting the jack in the socket a few turns or wiping any oxidation off with some contact cleaner (or your shirt or something 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




)  It's odd, I've had this issue even with the headphone-only 3580, even when the jack looks brand spanking new.  It's not a break in the cable, since wiggling the cable doesn't break the sound.  Only wiggling the jack in the socket breaks the sound. (sometimes)  Twisting the jack a few turns or wiping off the jack did the trick for me.


----------



## eyal1983

Ety Kids (300 ohm), does it has the same SQ as "normal" MC3/5 ?


----------



## mikeaj

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> Ety Kids (300 ohm), does it has the same SQ as "normal" MC3/5 ?


 
   
  Supposedly similar in some ways but different. I have not heard them, so you'll want to hear from those who have.
   
  In the meantime, have you seen this?
http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2012/12/etymotic-research-ek-5-etykids.html
http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2012/04/etymotic-research-mc5.html
   
  They both look fairly diffuse-field equalized (which may be perceptually a little bright), but the EK5 sample there has worse channel matching and a peak at 6 kHz, among other differences. It's of course much quieter by design, as it's a for-kids product.


----------



## Mimouille

y2hbk said:


> I have found myself struggling with deciding where my next move with IEMs will be. I, like many I'm sure, made small and incremental investments with full size cans, amps and DACs over the years. I am very happy with where I am at at this time. I have, however, been traveling for work more and more and find myself revisiting my IEMs. I have always been content with my IEMs based on the small amount of time per week that I used them, but now that that time has increased I've been looking for more.
> 
> I think I would like to stick with an IEM, rather than a CIEM at this time. I have enjoyed the clarity and balance of my GR07 (wishing it had more to offer in the low end), but appreciate the soundstage of the EPH-100 more. Comparing apples to oranges of course, but I have been completely happy with my HD800s in the full size headphone field, so I would ideally like something that has a similar sound signature with maybe a touch more low end. I spend most of my time listening to classic rock, but spend plenty of time listening to acoustic tracks (where my HD800s _really_ shine), classical, techno, etc.
> 
> ...


Ocharaku Flat 4


----------



## Y2HBK

mimouille said:


> Ocharaku Flat 4




Which one?


----------



## Mimouille

y2hbk said:


> Which one?


I only have Kaede but it ran out...so try Kuro...these iems are amazing...if you value dynamics, space and clarity.


----------



## Leo888

Hi joker, thanks for the thoughts with regards to the Philips S2. 

Have picked them up today and they are really an enjoyable iem to have around.


----------



## superayush

Hey I recently bought vsonic gr06 and though the sound nice (bass good mids good treble fine) I somehow find sound little congested I.e. iem not seem to sound openly/fully is it normal at start and will this improve after some burn in or they have this little narrow kinda sound? Otherwise they are fine


----------



## Amitl

hello!
  one of my weird questions again...hope some of you may relate 
  so...i like to my Sparks / Meelec A161P around the ear,
  but what happens is that using this method the cables are always
  being a little wrapped around my neck which i really dislike.
  if i use a clip to attach the cable to my shirt it solves it,
  but i also don't like that..
  are all iem like this? it seems if the cable were longer and thicker it might solved it,
  but i don't want to spend 100$ for the Shure SE215 just for that matter without
  any real sound improvement.....


----------



## sinquito

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, thanks for the thoughts with regards to the Philips S2.
> 
> Have picked them up today and they are really an enjoyable iem to have around.


 
  Jesus, why don't search a bit before posting?
   
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones
   
  He has a full review of them here and if you had searched this thread you would have known.


----------



## gg48gg

At $69.99 shipped, these A161P's are about 40% off from Amazon.  If they were value rated 8.5, before, just curious as to what would you rate these out at the sale price?
   
  I picked up a set that I plan on using on motorcycle trips, since these are supposed to isolate well.  I am using a Westone UM2 now and I hope I will like the A161P's much better.  I always thought the UM2's sounded meh.  Not much clarity in the highs, and not great bass.  Just alot of muddy mids, IMHO
   
  Thank you for your post.  This has got to be the most comprehensive review of any one type of product I have ever seen.  I appreciate it and have bookmarked it!


----------



## Leo888

sinquito said:


> Jesus, why don't search a bit before posting?
> 
> http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones
> 
> He has a full review of them here and if you had searched this thread you would have known.




Hi sinquito, I did my search about it and have read the IF reviews. I sought for joker's thoughts in regards to the differences to the iems I currently own.

Perhaps you should read through all the post I've posted leading to this post before commenting.

Anyway, it's a long thread and you might have missed some post but please kindly hold your guns before you shoot aimlessly. 

Sorry joker for side tracking and thanks again for your thoughts.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> I have found myself struggling with deciding where my next move with IEMs will be. I, like many I'm sure, made small and incremental investments with full size cans, amps and DACs over the years. I am very happy with where I am at at this time. I have, however, been traveling for work more and more and find myself revisiting my IEMs. I have always been content with my IEMs based on the small amount of time per week that I used them, but now that that time has increased I've been looking for more.
> 
> I think I would like to stick with an IEM, rather than a CIEM at this time. I have enjoyed the clarity and balance of my GR07 (wishing it had more to offer in the low end), but appreciate the soundstage of the EPH-100 more. Comparing apples to oranges of course, but I have been completely happy with my HD800s in the full size headphone field, so I would ideally like something that has a similar sound signature with maybe a touch more low end. I spend most of my time listening to classic rock, but spend plenty of time listening to acoustic tracks (where my HD800s _really_ shine), classical, techno, etc.
> 
> ...


 
   
  It really does sound like the K3003 is the way to go. Personally, I don't think the PFE 232 will cut it for you. It's similar enough the GR07, especially on the soundstage front, where it is still more like the GR07 than the K3003, that you may well be left wondering where the extra $300 went. 
   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> Ety Kids (300 ohm), does it has the same SQ as "normal" MC3/5 ?


 
   
  It sounds slightly different but is pretty close and a better value IMO if you can deal with the lower volume. My pair has good channel balance, at least that I can hear. Yes, it's a little hard to drive but I still don't come anywhere near maxing the volume on my J3 or E7. 
   
  Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi joker, thanks for the thoughts with regards to the Philips S2.
> 
> Have picked them up today and they are really an enjoyable iem to have around.


 
   
  Glad you like 'em!
   
  Quote: 





superayush said:


> Hey I recently bought vsonic gr06 and though the sound nice (bass good mids good treble fine) I somehow find sound little congested I.e. iem not seem to sound openly/fully is it normal at start and will this improve after some burn in or they have this little narrow kinda sound? Otherwise they are fine


 
   
  I think what you're hearing and not liking is the forward mids. The GR06 is the "worst" of the VSonic IEMs in this regard. You may get used to it (i.e. "brain burn-in") over time. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> hello!
> one of my weird questions again...hope some of you may relate
> so...i like to my Sparks / Meelec A161P around the ear,
> but what happens is that using this method the cables are always
> ...


 
   
  Running the cables down your back might work better. I do so when I'm doing housework or otherwise being active to prevent them getting caught on stuff.
   
  Quote: 





gg48gg said:


> At $69.99 shipped, these A161P's are about 40% off from Amazon.  If they were value rated 8.5, before, just curious as to what would you rate these out at the sale price?
> 
> I picked up a set that I plan on using on motorcycle trips, since these are supposed to isolate well.  I am using a Westone UM2 now and I hope I will like the A161P's much better.  I always thought the UM2's sounded meh.  Not much clarity in the highs, and not great bass.  Just alot of muddy mids, IMHO
> 
> Thank you for your post.  This has got to be the most comprehensive review of any one type of product I have ever seen.  I appreciate it and have bookmarked it!


 

 Probably the same. There's no getting around the mediocre cable so it would take a very deep discount for me to rate them a 9/10 or higher. Although I haven't heard the UM2, the A161 shouldn't have any issues with clarity.


----------



## sinquito

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi sinquito, I did my search about it and have read the IF reviews. I sought for joker's thoughts in regards to the differences to the iems I currently own.
> 
> Perhaps you should read through all the post I've posted leading to this post before commenting.
> 
> ...


 
  You know what, for some I reason I miss read your post and thought that you were asking for his thoughts about the philips s2, anyway, I'm sorry if I offended you, was a real mistake but I should take note to read well before posting something, it's just that I have read so many post here asking things that have been asked before, it's not cool. I apologise and promise to read well before posting some righteously crap. Must quit drugs...


----------



## Leo888

sinquito said:


> You know what, for some I reason I miss read your post and thought that you were asking for his thoughts about the philips s2, anyway, I'm sorry if I offended you, was a real mistake but I should take note to read well before posting something, it's just that I have read so many post here asking things that have been asked before, it's not cool. I apologise and promise to read well before posting some righteously crap. Must quit drugs...




Hi sinquito,

No worries man, just needed to clear the misunderstanding. 

As I said, it's a long fast flowing thread. It does occurs to me that I could forget what was mentioned before and have to back track. 

Let's move on.


----------



## eyal1983

Is there such a thing as a universal IEM with an Etymotic class isolation, but WITH a better soundstage?
  I love my HF5 for isolation and accuracy, but hate it for not having a soundstage. (


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> Is there such a thing as a universal IEM with an Etymotic class isolation, but WITH a better soundstage?
> I love my HF5 for isolation and accuracy, but hate it for not having a soundstage. (


 

 Not that I've heard.


----------



## Y2HBK

ljokerl said:


> It really does sound like the K3003 is the way to go. Personally, I don't think the PFE 232 will cut it for you. It's similar enough the GR07, especially on the soundstage front, where it is still more like the GR07 than the K3003, that you may well be left wondering where the extra $300 went.




I was afraid you were going to say that. Sorry about my wallet :blink:

Thanks for the feedback. Sounds like it may be time to save a bit more.


----------



## eyal1983

if the HF5 gives 35-42 db of isolation, how much can a Custom give?


----------



## sinquito

Quote: 





leo888 said:


> Hi sinquito,
> 
> No worries man, just needed to clear the misunderstanding.
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks, you are a better head-fi'er than I am


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> I was afraid you were going to say that. Sorry about my wallet
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sorry 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





eyal1983 said:


> if the HF5 gives 35-42 db of isolation, how much can a Custom give?


 

 Not a clue, but my Spiral Ear silicone custom isolates more than even my silicone-tipped Etymotic ER4S. I use it for flights. Can't hear the announcements even with no music playing.


----------



## ljokerl

I promised to post updates on IEMs in my possession that I don't plan to review due to lack of time. Most of these are simply unexciting but in keeping with my promise I'll post short thoughts and add them to the list on the front page of the thread. I used three benchmarks just to see where all of these sets fall - the TDK MT300, Dunu Trident, and Sony MH1C. These are just very brief listening impressions done over the course of two evenings.
   
*XTZ EarPhone-12 (Manufacturer's page)*
   
  An interesting-looking earphone, but lacking in ergonomics. The squared-off tips are terrible. The buds are magnetic, which is good for storage. I've seen this before with the Zune Premium Earbuds. The packaging and build are extremely cheap, so I figured they would cost $20-30. With that assumption they actually don't sound bad - somewhere on the level of the Dunu Trident or Soundmagic E10. The sound has decent clarity and a slight bass boost, but lacks deep bass. It also lacks treble energy, and the presentation is oddly vague. The earphones do come with a DSP app, but it only works on iOS devices. In seeking info on the app, I ran across the manufacturer's website, and the price. € 70,00. Next!
   
*JBL J22i (Manufacturer's page)*
   
  Nicely designed and overall quite well-built for $60. The cable is a little longer than average. Mild driver flex is present. The sound is extremely bassy but also quite bloated. It's not as muffled and veiled as the $24 TDK MT300, but not much better. Compared to my benchmark, the Dunu Trident, it seriously lacks in clarity and treble presence. If you're a basshead in need of a headset, just get the JVC FR201 instead.
   
*AKG K376*
   
  Can't even find the product page for this but amazon.de shows a price of € 102,87. It also shows some very nice product images - ones that look much better than the actual thing. The earphone feels quite cheap compared to the JBL J22 - mostly plastic and with a memory-prone plastic cable. The sound is much better, however - there is still good bass but it's not nearly as bloated as the JBL. The mids are much clearer and more prominent and the treble is nice and smooth. Overall it easily beats the Dunu Trident and can compete with the Sony MH1C. All in all, it really isn't bad so it might get a full review down the line, especially if it's introduced to the US market.
   
*Harman Kardon AE (Manufacturer's page)*
   
  The bass-heavy version of Harman's in-ear range. Construction is excellent - very tight and solid-feeling. As for the sound, there's definitely plenty of bass, and tends to be boomy. Sounded better than the Trident but not by much, and didn't keep up with the MH1C or AKG K376. Hard to take it seriously at $150.
   
*Harman Kardon NI (Manufacturer's page)*
   
  This is the "balanced-sounding" version of Harman's new in-ears. For some reason Harman decided that it doesn't need to be as well-made as the AE version, so it feels cheaper and more plasticky. The sound is definitely less bassy than the AE version, but overall it doesn't sound much better - better than the Trident but a little flat and harsh compared to the MH1C. Probably a better value than the AE, but still not great. 
   
   
  All of the above are going on my "review not planned" list (found on the front page under the Planned Reviews heading) for the time being.
   
  There are two more sets that do sound good - the *Steelseries Flux In-Ear *and *In-Ear Pro*. I certainly didn't expect two IEMs from a gaming headset company to sound as good as these do and beat entries from JBL and Harman, but they do.
   
In-ear
In-ear Pro
   
  The *In-ear* uses a dynamic driver. It looks a lot like the HiSound Crystal and is very comfortable, like the Crystal. The stock tips are also very nice. Quite impressed by these at $50, so I'll see if I can squeeze them in at some point in the future.
   
  The *In-ear Pro *uses a single BA, as far as I can tell from the specs. Sound seems to be competitive with the UE 600, which is good. Priced at $130, I don't think it's quite as impressive a value as the regular Flux In-ear, but it's definitely good-sounding. Seems to be let down by some design choices - the cable uses an extender system with a proprietary connector, which seems unnecessary, and though it is advertised for both cable-down and cable-up wear, it seems to only work over-the-ear.
   
  All in all, the Flux In-Ear is going in the "to review" pile. The In-Ear Pro and K376 are a maybe. The rest are best not mentioned again.


----------



## Leo888

sinquito said:


> You know what, for some I reason I miss read your post and thought that you were asking for his thoughts about the philips s2, anyway, I'm sorry if I offended you, was a real mistake but I should take note to read well before posting something, it's just that I have read so many post here asking things that have been asked before, it's not cool. I apologise and promise to read well before posting some righteously crap. Must quit drugs...







Hi sinquito, have already demostrated thru action with your post to be worthy and good headfi'er yourself. 

Cheers.


----------



## peter123

I see that mp4nation has the Brainwavz b2 on sale for $109. Are these different enough from the fidelio s2 that it will be worth having both?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





peter123 said:


> I see that mp4nation has the Brainwavz b2 on sale for $109. Are these different enough from the fidelio s2 that it will be worth having both?


 

 They are both neutral-ish, so not a night and day difference, but different enough. I think in the long run you'll end up preferring one to the other, though.


----------



## lksndr

Hello, I have a question ... I had seen ie8 ... Didn't like its muddied sound ... Had 535se and I was pretty happy with it but I sold it in the end ...
Today I went to store and listened to re 400, gr 07 and shure 215 ... And LCD 3, after which everything else just sounded sad ... But ok, I need up to 150-200 earphone ... 
I find that re 400 definitely has enough bass for my taste, but highs seem dead a bit ... Or like u can't hear reverb of the snare on some songs that I could hear with 535 ... 
On the other hand ... 215 has that mid bass hump that I hated on the ie8 so they are out of the question ...
Than I listened to gr07 and as u said high end is just plain offensive and for me at least impossible to listen.

So I suppose what I'm looking for is something like re-400 with more lively sound representation ... I don't mind less bass if the headphone is darker or flat cuz I can turn it up and extract more of the details and get bigger sound, while if highs are offensive it is quite impossible to do that ... So ... Is there a earphone that u would recommend for me? I can see my self being happy with re400 I just want to check is there any significant improvement in up to 200 price range? 
Maybe even a bit less mid bass would be ok, I don't care at all for that bass hump in the mid bass, but I dont like when bass is soft on the other hand ... After everything I said it seems to me like I'm looking for 535 sound for less money haha


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lksndr said:


> Hello, I have a question ... I had seen ie8 ... Didn't like its muddied sound ... Had 535se and I was pretty happy with it but I sold it in the end ...
> Today I went to store and listened to re 400, gr 07 and shure 215 ... And LCD 3, after which everything else just sounded sad ... But ok, I need up to 150-200 earphone ...
> I find that re 400 definitely has enough bass for my taste, but highs seem dead a bit ... Or like u can't hear reverb of the snare on some songs that I could hear with 535 ...
> On the other hand ... 215 has that mid bass hump that I hated on the ie8 so they are out of the question ...
> ...


 

 Seems like the RE272 would have been good for you but sadly it's been discontinued. The lesser treble quantity of the RE-400 makes it the 'safe' choice but you would probably like the new Philips Fidelio S1/S2 IEMs - they do have more bass than the RE-400, especially subbass, but as a result the mid-bass is actually not as prominent. More importantly, the Philips IEMs are a little brighter. I would recommend you try them first because I can see the treble being at the limit of someone's tolerance but they are definitely not as "hot" up top as the GR07.


----------



## peter123

ljokerl said:


> They are both neutral-ish, so not a night and day difference, but different enough. I think in the long run you'll end up preferring one to the other, though.




Ok, thank you. I think I will pass on the b2's then since I like the s2's so much and they have a mic.


----------



## kaixax555

Any plans to review the TDK BA200 and TDK IE800 anytime soon?


----------



## ljokerl

Review of the Hidition NT 6 CIEM is below. Had to re-scale the Sound Quality scoring slightly to accommodate it. Additional maintenance has been done on the thread - the missing pictures have been re-uploaded and more discontinued items have been marked as such.
   

*(1A7) Hidition NT 6*
   

Added Jun 2013

 Details: One of two flagship models from Korea-based Hidition
 Current Price: est. *$1200* from hidition.co.kr
 Specs: Driver: _6 BA / 4-way crossover_ | Imp: N/A | Sens: N/A | Freq: N/A | Cable: _4.2' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: N/A | Preferred tips: N/A
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5) *– Custom hard-shell carrying case, cleaning tool, and cleaning cloth
 Build Quality *(5/5)* – The build quality of the NT 6 is excellent, with thick acrylic shells and a well-made cable featuring angled connectors and a metal Palics plug. The cable is braided and covered in heatshrink tubing for extra protection but is prone to the memory effect, maintaining its shape after being coiled up for storage. On the cosmetic side, Hidition offers a massive number of customization options, including some very unique mother of pearl faceplates (one of which is shown)
 Isolation *(4.5/5)* - The isolation provided by the deep-sealing shells is excellent - slightly below that of my silicone-shelled customs but higher than with my other acrylic-shelled units
 Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – The heatshrink-wrapped cable produces slightly more microphonics than the cables on my other customs
 Comfort *(5/5)* – My NT 6 was built with a musician fit, extending to the second bend of the ear canal. As with all acrylic customs, the shells are hard but comfortable when fitted correctly. If the earphones remain uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit may be required

 Sound *(10/10)* – Hidition’s lineup is notable for having not one but two six-driver flagships – the NT 6, which features a 4-way passive crossover, and the NT 6-PRO, which adds another crossover point for a 5-way setup. The PRO model promises enhanced bass, while the vanilla NT 6 is said to be more neutral.

 The overall signature of the NT 6 is balanced, with a slight treble emphasis. The earphone impresses most with its bell-like clarity, but there’s a whole lot more to like. The bass is linear, with a small boost in the sub-bass region. The low end is a little leaner compared, for example, to the JH13 Pro and Westone ES5, but remains extremely tight and controlled at all times. Overall accuracy is great and the neutral bass quantity is very welcome, though perhaps a little surprising considering the triple bass drivers of the NT 6. One may expect more bass boost, but the low end of the NT 6 is punchy when it needs to be, otherwise staying out of the way.

 The midrange is flat and level, boasting striking clarity and detail. There is no bass bleed and the mids are not in the least bit recessed. With nothing to get in the way of the midrange, detail resolution and overall definition are fantastic. Vocal intelligibility is excellent as well – better compared to the UM Miracle and Heir Audio 8.A, for example. Only the JH13 Pro competes in clarity, and even then its mild bass boost puts it at a slight disadvantage to the NT 6.

 On the whole, the NT 6 is well-balanced aside from an upper treble bump, which gives it a characteristically brighter, cooler tone. It is not a forgiving earphone but, happily, the top-end emphasis falls above the 4-8 kHz range where sibilance typically originates, so the NT 6 does not introduce sibilance or harshness to recordings. Treble extension is excellent, contributing to an airy and open sound with entirely unconstrained dynamics.

 The tight, clean sound of the NT 6 does wonders for the presentation of the earphone. The Hidition boasts a wide and spacious soundstage but does not lack in the way of a central image. Overall imaging is excellent, resulting in a convincing presentation, and while soundstage depth and layering aren’t quite on-par with the JH13Pro or UM Miracle, they are certainly close enough to compete.

*Select Comparisons*

JH Audio JH13 Pro Freqphase ($1099)

 Like that of Hidition, JHA’s lineup offers two flagships, the 8-driver JH16 and the 6-driver JH13, and, like the NT 6, the JH13 is the more neutral-sounding of JHA's two flagships. For me, these two monitors are the cream of the crop – both impossibly clear and resolving, with very good imaging and lifelike presentations. The differences between them lie largely in sound signature, with the JH13 being very close to – but a pinch on the warm side of - neutral and the NT 6 being slightly bright.

 While the low end of the NT 6 is extended, punchy, and dynamic, the Hidition just doesn’t crank out quite as much bass the JH13. Personally, I don’t find the low end of the JH13 excessive but the bass of the Hidition is flatter in profile and a little tighter as a result. The bassier JH13 carries a slightly warmer tone as well, though the mids on both earphones are completely free of veiling and fantastically clear. The NT 6 is brighter, with more emphasis on higher frequencies, but it also has a more fluid note presentation. On the soundstage front, the JH13 sounds a little more 3-dimensional and enveloping while the NT 6 has slightly less depth to it. The JH13Pro is significantly more sensitive.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

 Unique Melody’s 6-driver flagship remains one of my favorite earphones even after more than two years of ownership. On the whole, it keeps up rather well with the NT 6. The NT 6 is overall brighter, crisper, and more resolving than the Miracle, with a flatter midrange presentation and better vocal intelligibility. Despite its cooler tone, the NT 6 has a bit more bass impact while the Miracle is a little softer and more polite.

 The Miracle boasts smoother, more relaxed treble while the NT 6 has more energy, coupled with outstanding treble extension and a very wide and airy presentation. The Miracle, in comparison, is a little more constrained, with a narrower soundstage and slightly less dynamic overall sound. Like the JH13, it gives up some of the width of the NT 6 for better depth and a slightly more enveloping presentation, but unfortunately loses some of the effortlessness of the Hidition and JHA sets in the process.

Lime Ears LE3 (est. $690)

 The LE3 from Poland-based Lime Ears may be a mere triple-driver, but it is the most balanced such setup I’ve heard. Compared to the Lime Ears, the much-pricier NT 6 has some advantages – its bass is both tighter and more impactful, and the earphone is a little clearer overall – but the difference on all counts is not night and day. Tonally, the LE3 has less treble emphasis for a more neutral overall sound compared to the brighter NT 6. Its treble is smoother, but also doesn’t quite have the extension of the Hidition. The presentation of the NT 6 is also larger and more dynamic, though the LE3 is no slouch itself.

 Value *(9/10)* – The market has changed a lot since my first review of a high-end custom IEM, the UM Miracle, more than two years ago. The inception of a new breed of hyper-expensive universals and dozens of new CIEM companies from all around the world have made the market more crowded – and more confusing – than ever before. One thing is clear in trying to make sense of it all – sound signature remains the key to finding the perfect earphone, custom or otherwise, for every individual.

 That said, the NT 6 is undoubtedly one of the very best earphones I’ve had the pleasure of trying, combining incredible clarity and resolution with tight, level bass and extended treble with plenty of energy. Top to bottom, the NT 6 does not lack presence at any frequency and is the ideal earphone for those who want accuracy, avoiding any and all bass bloat and providing a leaner sound with a neutral-to-bright tone. Hiditon’s excellent build quality, deep-sealing shells, and plethora of customization options are just icing on the cake.

*Pros: Great finish; high isolation due to deep fit; outstanding audio quality
 Cons: Cable more Microphonic than most custom cables*
  
   
  Quote: 





kaixax555 said:


> Any plans to review the TDK BA200 and TDK IE800 anytime soon?


 

 Sorry, not yet


----------



## VanillaSound

Hi Joker,
   
  It seems that I prefer a more v-shape sound. I think I'm going to get a Thinksound MS01 for $70. Is there any IEM's that might be a better fit for me? I need good comfort and good build quality as I'll be using it quite actively.


----------



## FlySweep

Very nice review of the NT6, joker.  My choice was between the JH13Pro FP & the NT6.  Your review confirms the JH13 was the right choice for me.. though I still want the NT6 cause I like neutral-leaning-bright phones.  Glad to see the signatures of these two may be complementary for the listener that still favors a neutral signature.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Review of the Hidition NT 6 CIEM is below.




It kind of sounds like the CK10 finally got a worthy successor.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vanillasound said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> It seems that I prefer a more v-shape sound. I think I'm going to get a Thinksound MS01 for $70. Is there any IEM's that might be a better fit for me? I need good comfort and good build quality as I'll be using it quite actively.


 
   
  The MS01 is quite good for $70. You can get the one that comes with ear guides if you're going to be using them actively and need an over-the-ear fit. The Astrotec AM-800 would be another option in that same price range.
   
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Very nice review of the NT6, joker.  My choice was between the JH13Pro FP & the NT6.  Your review confirms the JH13 was the right choice for me.. though I still want the NT6 cause I like neutral-leaning-bright phones.  Glad to see the signatures of these two may be complementary for the listener that still favors a neutral signature.


 
   
  Thanks! That's a tough choice - those are currently my two favorites 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> It kind of sounds like the CK10 finally got a worthy successor.


 

 Indeed it did.


----------



## Mops123

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> The adapter switches around the position of the mic and ground connectors.  Since there is no standard for where the ground connector on headphone-only sockets goes, one socket may require the adapter and another not.
> 
> From your description it sounds like the sansa does not require the connector while the computer's socket requires it.  As for why there's "cable noise" or the music cuts out--it may just be a bad connection.  Try twisting the jack in the socket a few turns or wiping any oxidation off with some contact cleaner (or your shirt or something
> 
> ...


 

 rofl ty
  i clenaed with my tshirt and now it works just fine (dispite it was new)


----------



## TooLate

In the re-400 portion, you mention a zippered carrying case, but my package of my own re-400s did not include one. Where did you hear of this case?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





toolate said:


> In the re-400 portion, you mention a zippered carrying case, but my package of my own re-400s did not include one. Where did you hear of this case?


 

 Several months ago someone mentioned that they bought an RE-400 and got a case. I confirmed with HiFiMan that all RE-400s were shipping with them now (not in the packaging, but on the side). I didn't get a chance to add the info until recently. Might only apply to those RE-400s purchased directly from Head-Direct. Where did you get yours?


----------



## quartertone

Huh? I got my RE-400 last week from Head Direct, and there was no case. No cable winder either, though that doesn't bother me in the slightest.


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Huh? I got my RE-400 last week from Head Direct, and there was no case. No cable winder either, though that doesn't bother me in the slightest.


 
   
  I didn't think that I got the cable winder either until I turned that foam packing material upside down.   It was underneath.
   
  No case though, and I too bought mine from Head Direct fulfilled by Amazon.


----------



## TooLate

Yeah, I got mine directly from Head Direct and I didn't get a case. I did get a cable winder but it's kind of unwieldy.


----------



## ljokerl

I guess I will ask about it again and see if you all should've received carrying cases


----------



## Amitl

Westone Adventure Alpha seems interesting.......i wonder why they're not selling them on Amazon


----------



## garcsa

Let me show you my perfect seal with my DIY multi flanges for RE-400. Prefer silicone than foams.
   
  Earcanaleus Giganticus.


----------



## Amitl

are the RE-400's tips especially small?


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





amitl said:


> are the RE-400's tips especially small?


 
   
  The small ones are.   The big one isn't.


----------



## lksndr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Seems like the RE272 would have been good for you but sadly it's been discontinued. The lesser treble quantity of the RE-400 makes it the 'safe' choice but you would probably like the new Philips Fidelio S1/S2 IEMs - they do have more bass than the RE-400, especially subbass, but as a result the mid-bass is actually not as prominent. More importantly, the Philips IEMs are a little brighter. I would recommend you try them first because I can see the treble being at the limit of someone's tolerance but they are definitely not as "hot" up top as the GR07.


 
   
  There is just not enough reviews for philips in-ears, and waterline is for now my choice number one, i went trough your review once more and as waterline is missing that top end something, i found 10 other in-ears that are all missing something, but more or less fit the description of what i want: 
  VSonic R02 Silver
  Head-Direct RE0
  Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO
  Sunrise SW-Xcape v. 1
  VSonic GR06
  VSonic VC02
  HiFiMan RE-400 Waterline
  HiFiMan RE262
   Rock-It Sounds R-50
  VSonic GR01
  Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII
   
  What would be most analytic but not fatiguing and musical, most extended and flat headphone in both ways, with neither bass or highs overshadowing mids, and without mid bass hump? It can definitly lean more towards analytic, but just not all the way, cuz it is my only pair for now.
  Also, if there is the need, if there is tremendous difference i can go up to 200, but since this is just a temporary solution, i would like to buy cheapest one that fits the description.
   
  Thank you for your reviews, they are very helpful, its not like im lazy and just want u to chew up and spit the answer for me, i have red the reviews several times, but im still a bit confused about what the best in ear for me would be at the moment, because i still have to live with it for at least 6 months if not a year or more.


----------



## lksndr

I couldnt wait any more, i ordered r-50


----------



## CrystalT

can someone recommend mid-centric/bright shallow insertion dynamic driver iems to me? :3


----------



## mosshorn

Quote: 





crystalt said:


> can someone recommend mid-centric/bright shallow insertion dynamic driver iems to me? :3


 

 One off the top of my head is the Hifman RE-272. For cheaper, you could also do the RE400.


----------



## CrystalT

How do they compare to Hisoundaudio Golden Crystal, or Shure SE315?


----------



## mosshorn

To tell you the truth I haven't heard a single thing about the SE315, so take that as you will. As for the Golden Crystal, there are a couple reviews around here I remember reading, saying they were very bright.


----------



## mikaveli06

Im considering the re-400 or rockit r50 (possibly tdk ie800) as something a lil different from eph100 and carbo basso.  Those two have good bass, so im looking for something very detailed, large stage, instrument seperation, but not completely lacking bass.  I understand neither will match the bass iems i already have, just dont want completely anemic bass.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Westone Adventure Alpha seems interesting.......i wonder why they're not selling them on Amazon


 
   
  Brand new product, probably not in distribution yet. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> are the RE-400's tips especially small?


 
   
  The bi-flanges shown in the picture are quite small. There are two sizes, though.
   
  Quote: 





lksndr said:


> There is just not enough reviews for philips in-ears, and waterline is for now my choice number one, i went trough your review once more and as waterline is missing that top end something, i found 10 other in-ears that are all missing something, but more or less fit the description of what i want:
> VSonic R02 Silver
> Head-Direct RE0
> Head-Direct (HiFiMan) RE-ZERO
> ...


 
   
  I would still go for the HiFiMan, personally. You said you don't want something overly analytical, and the RE-400 fits that description better than the R-50. Even the VC02 fits that description better than the R-50, but it's just not as good overall. 
   
   
  Quote: 





crystalt said:


> can someone recommend mid-centric/bright shallow insertion dynamic driver iems to me? :3


 
   
  VSonic R02 Silver. Stock tips give a medium insertion but the sound doesn't really change much if you use a larger single-flange and wear them shallow. 
   
  Quote: 





mikaveli06 said:


> Im considering the re-400 or rockit r50 (possibly tdk ie800) as something a lil different from eph100 and carbo basso.  Those two have good bass, so im looking for something very detailed, large stage, instrument seperation, but not completely lacking bass.  I understand neither will match the bass iems i already have, just dont want completely anemic bass.


 

 The RE-400 would be a safer option than the more analytical R-50. You could also go for a VSonic GR07 or Philips Fidelio S1/S2 for a little more bass than those with a relatively balanced signature nonetheless.


----------



## CrystalT

Larger single flange tips don't isolate properly. My ear canal forces them out. Medium presses too tightly against my canal. dual and triple flange tips cause irritation deeper in my canal, and foam tips are too dark.

I usually use small single flanges. Specifically, I use SoundMAGIC small single flanges.

I own the HSA Golden Crystal, and have owned the Shure SE315. The Crystal's are broken currently, but not quite what I want currently. I was hoping for something with better mids.


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





lwien said:


> The small ones are.   The big one isn't.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





crystalt said:


> Larger single flange tips don't isolate properly. My ear canal forces them out. Medium presses too tightly against my canal. dual and triple flange tips cause irritation deeper in my canal, and foam tips are too dark.
> 
> I usually use small single flanges. Specifically, I use SoundMAGIC small single flanges.
> 
> I own the HSA Golden Crystal, and have owned the Shure SE315. The Crystal's are broken currently, but not quite what I want currently. I was hoping for something with better mids.


 

 Then I guess the answer is small single-flanges 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. HSA Crystal tips should fit the R02 Silver. Soundmagic ones will probably fall off.


----------



## steven-026

Hifiman RE-400 vs Rock-It Sound R-50 vs Etymotic HF5?  They all seem really good, but I'm not really sure which to get.  I mainly listen to underground/old school hip-hop, and also to some R&B, indie rock, and XXYYXX style electronic music.  The HF5 seems to have the best isolation, the R-50 has the best sound quality, while the RE-400 has the best build quality.  But I'm not sure which is best overall.


----------



## amzies01

Quote: 





steven-026 said:


> Hifiman RE-400 vs Rock-It Sound R-50 vs Etymotic HF5?  They all seem really good, but I'm not really sure which to get.  I mainly listen to underground/old school hip-hop, and also to some R&B, indie rock, and XXYYXX style electronic music.  The HF5 seems to have the best isolation, the R-50 has the best sound quality, while the RE-400 has the best build quality.  But I'm not sure which is best overall.


 
  I don't know... For me, the best sound quality would have to go to the RE-400. I also listen to that kind of hip-hop, or what i fondly call "real" hip-hop. I had Brainwavz M3 and it went well with those genres you mentioned. I assume that's the price range you lookin for. Of those 3 I think the best would be the RE-400. From different impressions, the R-50 seems to be on the bright side, and the HF5 is too cold and analytical for one to enjoy the genres u just mentioned. The RE-400 is neutral with a slight bass emphasis... good for those Primo beats (you know what I'm talkin bout...).. . if you are only looking at those 3..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





steven-026 said:


> Hifiman RE-400 vs Rock-It Sound R-50 vs Etymotic HF5?  They all seem really good, but I'm not really sure which to get.  I mainly listen to underground/old school hip-hop, and also to some R&B, indie rock, and XXYYXX style electronic music.  The HF5 seems to have the best isolation, the R-50 has the best sound quality, while the RE-400 has the best build quality.  But I'm not sure which is best overall.


 
   
  They are all very good, and also close to each other in sound quality. All three have balanced sound signatures, although in my experience listeners of your genres tend to favor more bass than any of these provide. Anyway, if you're sure about wanting a balanced frequency response and don't need the extra isolation I do think the RE-400 is the safest choice of the three signature-wise.


----------



## Kashtan

Spiral Ear SE 5-way Reference, Ocharaku Flat-4, Hidition NT-6 Pro enable you in the future in his great review?


----------



## ellis ip

Ljokerl, i want to buy a iem for my friend for birthday gift, which iem should i buy my buget is around $100us , she like to listen electronics music and western pop. she use mobile phones to listen music, i wondering choice between s4i and acoustic research s700m or any other suggestions? thanks


----------



## Kashtan

Also Superlux? I was the owner of Superlux HD381, they went down after 3 months, but the sound they left the best memories.


----------



## Radiohead99

|Joker|, Another excellent review of Hidtion. They recently came out with follow up revision the Tears 6 Pro, which reportedly is warmer than NT 6/pro and better.
   
http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/06/hidition-new-tears-6-new-vs-old.html?m=0
   
  Anyway, I'm considering another pair of CIEM to pair with my Heir 8.A. I mostly listen to various form of indie rock and some folk rock, EDM. Between JH13 pro and Hidition, which one do you think would be better suited for rock music?
   
  Btw, I currently use a ipod classic and have a HiFi-M8 on order to power the CIEM in future.


----------



## shuriken

hi, Joker.
  Thank you for all your reviews.
  your charts is my "hearing aid" for earphones.
  (bought 5 already with your help)
  Now I'm using the gr99 on a daily basis and I'm really enjoy them.
  last earphones I bought was the Astrotec-90.
  at the begining -great, I liked them, the clarity is amazing.
  but when I compared them to the gr99 I was missing the more deep fun bass.
  I didn't thought I would miss it, but I did.
so I returned back to gr99.
   
  my question is:
  50$ budget (can stretch it a bit),
  I look for a combination of the clarity sound
  of the astrotec with more deep bass like the gr99. 
  any suggestion? (VC02 maybe


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kashtan said:


> Spiral Ear SE 5-way Reference, Ocharaku Flat-4, Hidition NT-6 Pro enable you in the future in his great review?


 
   
  My ears were too small for the SE 5-way Reference. As for the rest, no plans yet but they might happen in the future. 
   
   
  Quote: 





ellis ip said:


> Ljokerl, i want to buy a iem for my friend for birthday gift, which iem should i buy my buget is around $100us , she like to listen electronics music and western pop. she use mobile phones to listen music, i wondering choice between s4i and acoustic research s700m or any other suggestions? thanks


 
   
   
  I'm not a big fan of the S4i and I'm not familiar with acoustic research. My recommendations for mainstream-sounding smartphone headsets around $100 would be the Velodyne vPulse (big, deep bass but mostly clear and smooth otherwise), Audio Technica ATH-CKM500i (lots of mid-bass and prominent but not overly harsh treble), or Ultimate Ears 500vi (again solid bass and slightly v-shaped overall).
   
   
  Quote: 





kashtan said:


> Also Superlux? I was the owner of Superlux HD381, they went down after 3 months, but the sound they left the best memories.


 
   
  The HD381 has always looked interesting but not something I've had a chance to try yet.
   
   
  Quote: 





radiohead99 said:


> |Joker|, Another excellent review of Hidtion. They recently came out with follow up revision the Tears 6 Pro, which reportedly is warmer than NT 6/pro and better.
> 
> http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/06/hidition-new-tears-6-new-vs-old.html?m=0
> 
> ...


 
   
  The link you have provided talkes about the *N*ew *T*ears 6, or the *NT* 6, which is the exact model I reviewed. I have the latest version. The NT 6*-Pro* is a different model that is said to provide more bass with an extra crossover at the bottom end. 
   
  The NT 6 is a great compliment to the 8.A because it's so vastly different. The JH13 is somewhere between, though still closer to the more neutral Hidition than to the warmer 8.A. Both work well for rock but if you're looking for a contrast to the 8.A, go for the NT 6.
   
    
  Quote:


shuriken said:


> hi, Joker.
> Thank you for all your reviews.
> your charts is my "hearing aid" for earphones.
> (bought 5 already with your help)
> ...


 
   
  The VC02 won't do it - it's got punchy mid-bass but the deep bass is not on-level with the GR99. I would go for the Sony MH1C or maybe Philips SHE3850. The SHE3580 isn't really better than the GR99 overall but it has a small clarity advantage.


----------



## Kashtan

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> My ears were too small for the SE 5-way Reference. As for the rest, no plans yet but they might happen in the future.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Thanks ljokerl.


----------



## zubin111

Hi ljoker, I have Brainwavz M2, alpha, and GR06, now even though after various A-B's i am not liking the GR06, i feel it very congested and usually get fatigued pretty easily. I then just picked up the alpha and found it pretty easy to listen and not sure if this is what is called "airy"!! I find even M2 much easy going than gr06. vsonics are sometimes too sibilant on top, and i find mids pretty congested. Now i want an earphone which should be easy to listen, airy, can do with low bass but not entirely missing, but mids and highs should be clear with enough instrument seperation... I know its a lot... But i am looking at something in the range of $40-$50 but if re-400 is something you think i am looking at, i dont mind spending $100 for once... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Thanks again for the thread!! Great Work!!


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Hmm, UE500 or Vsonic VSD1 for this month's second purchase... decisions decisions.


----------



## DannyBai

I'll get the UE500's tomorrow so I'll let you know. The vsd1s should be shipping next week too hopefully.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

dannybai said:


> I'll get the UE500's tomorrow so I'll let you know. The vsd1s should be shipping next week too hopefully.




Ah nice one, it seems from joker's description that UE500 might be good for trance. Plus they are way cheaper at the moment. 

On the other hand, I've been planning to get VSD1 for over a month now and people have already reported that they are good with trance. 

Like I say, decisions lol


----------



## DannyBai

Can't go wrong with the vsd1. Very good with your mixes.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Ah nice one, it seems from joker's description that UE500 might be good for trance. Plus they are way cheaper at the moment.
> 
> On the other hand, I've been planning to get VSD1 for over a month now and people have already reported that they are good with trance.
> 
> Like I say, decisions lol


 
  Nah, you know it - you should get the VSD1. I knew it was going to be good when I saw the $37 launch price, which for some weird coincidence is exactly how much my s500 cost me.


----------



## wje

Please ... someone pinch me!  I've been following this thread for a while in a desire to move ahead with purchasing some better IEMs for work use.  As with most articles and reviews on this site, I always try to read through it with a bit of an objective viewpoint.  If there's too much hype, then I'll step back and give it some thought in the event I might be overlooking something. 
   
  During this past week, I was seriously frustrated with my current IEMs (Skullcandy Titan, TDK 300, Sennheiser (very anemic model)).  I had some IEMs on order (Vsonic GR02, GR06) as well was a few pair of MEElectronics that I found on the forum here.  I was getting impatient and thought I could just pull the plug on the Shure SE215 for $99 or so locally.  Yet, the reviews of the SE215 didn't fully grab me and pull me in.  So, I waited patiently.  Today, the Vsonics arrived and my family delivered them to me at work.  Wow ... Just, Wow.  I'm pushing them with an iPod Nano and the Fiio E12 / Monte Blanc amp.  I believe when I placed the order at Lendmeurears, the GR02 and GR06 were priced as a bundle special for about $68.00.  In the U.S., Lendmeurears has a distribution center so you don't have to wait to get them from China.  My order was placed on last Friday evening and I received them today (Thursday) as they ship from Illinois.
   
  I truly never thought I could get a very nice IEM unless I was willing to drop $300, or more.  However, Vsonic changed all that.  Their cables are pretty nice compared to some of my previous cable experiences with the Klipsch S4 and others.  About 10 pair of tips are in the package for each set of earphones, too.  Double flange, single flange, etc. really makes it easy to find a pair that will fit nicely for comfort and sound purposes.
   
  In conclusion, I'm really impressed on where the market has gotten with respect to the $35.00 IEM market (mail order, that is).  Nothing short of amazing.  Also, a big *Shout Out* to *ljokerl* for being so committed to keep on testing so many IEMs and keeping this thread all nice and fresh.  *Bravo !!*


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





wje said:


> In conclusion, I'm really impressed on where the market has gotten with respect to the $35.00 IEM market (mail order, that is).  Nothing short of amazing.  Also, a big *Shout Out* to *ljokerl* for being so committed to keep on testing so many IEMs and keeping this thread all nice and fresh.  *Bravo !!*


 
  Yeah, vsonic is one of the manufacturers that really changed the sub-$100 range of iems. You should try all of them


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Nah, you know it - you should get the VSD1. I knew it was going to be good when I saw the $37 launch price, which for some weird coincidence is exactly how much my s500 cost me.


 
   
  Yeah I'm gonna see if the LMUE keep their promise and let me have the VDS1 at that price still.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Hi ljoker, I have Brainwavz M2, alpha, and GR06, now even though after various A-B's i am not liking the GR06, i feel it very congested and usually get fatigued pretty easily. I then just picked up the alpha and found it pretty easy to listen and not sure if this is what is called "airy"!! I find even M2 much easy going than gr06. vsonics are sometimes too sibilant on top, and i find mids pretty congested. Now i want an earphone which should be easy to listen, airy, can do with low bass but not entirely missing, but mids and highs should be clear with enough instrument seperation... I know its a lot... But i am looking at something in the range of $40-$50 but if re-400 is something you think i am looking at, i dont mind spending $100 for once...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  Yeah, it seems to be the forward mids of the GR06 that cause problems for some listeners, combined with the top end issue that the GR07 also has. I am not familiar with the Alpha unless you mean the proalpha. 
   
  I think you would enjoy the LG Quadbeat - it's well within your price range, bass is not lacking (more impact than with the RE-400, for example), and has a wide and open sound to it. It's different from the M2 and ProAlpha, which are both warmer, but seems like something you would like. If you want to stay safe and stick to a warmer sound like the M2 and ProAlpha, the Sony MH1C would be a good one to pick up.
   
  Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> Hmm, UE500 or Vsonic VSD1 for this month's second purchase... decisions decisions.


 
   
  One more vote for the VSD1. I like the UE 500 but I like the VSonics better.
   
  Quote: 





wje said:


> Please ... someone pinch me!  I've been following this thread for a while in a desire to move ahead with purchasing some better IEMs for work use.  As with most articles and reviews on this site, I always try to read through it with a bit of an objective viewpoint.  If there's too much hype, then I'll step back and give it some thought in the event I might be overlooking something.
> 
> During this past week, I was seriously frustrated with my current IEMs (Skullcandy Titan, TDK 300, Sennheiser (very anemic model)).  I had some IEMs on order (Vsonic GR02, GR06) as well was a few pair of MEElectronics that I found on the forum here.  I was getting impatient and thought I could just pull the plug on the Shure SE215 for $99 or so locally.  Yet, the reviews of the SE215 didn't fully grab me and pull me in.  So, I waited patiently.  Today, the Vsonics arrived and my family delivered them to me at work.  Wow ... Just, Wow.  I'm pushing them with an iPod Nano and the Fiio E12 / Monte Blanc amp.  I believe when I placed the order at Lendmeurears, the GR02 and GR06 were priced as a bundle special for about $68.00.  In the U.S., Lendmeurears has a distribution center so you don't have to wait to get them from China.  My order was placed on last Friday evening and I received them today (Thursday) as they ship from Illinois.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks, I am glad the thread has been useful. Good to hear you like your VSonics! Their new releases have been consistently impressive, one after the other, and are making it more difficult to give good 'value' scores to pricy IEMs


----------



## Y2HBK

ljokerl said:


> It really does sound like the K3003 is the way to go. Personally, I don't think the PFE 232 will cut it for you. It's similar enough the GR07, especially on the soundstage front, where it is still more like the GR07 than the K3003, that you may well be left wondering where the extra $300 went.




Well i was able to scrounge up the extra cash and managed to pick up the k3003. Ive had the past few days to spend with them. So far i am very impressed. Blown away, not so much, but very impressed. I think the law of diminishing returns takes effect here. I have had the privilege of hearing the W4 recently. While not my cup of tea, I have had a few moments here and there since then where I have had to ask myself if the k3003 is really worth the price tag or if would have been just as pleased with something a bit cheaper like the IE800s. I do have a couple of weeks left to decide before I am outside of the return policy, so I'll see how much I grow to like them. 

Since Ive primarily been using the GR07 for such a long time and still own them I was able to A/B them. There is certainly a difference in overall clarity and quality, especially with the mids it seems. I will likely hold onto them to use when I jog since they still impress when I use them. I did, however, sell my EPH-100 to a co-worker.


----------



## zubin111

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah, it seems to be the forward mids of the GR06 that cause problems for some listeners, combined with the top end issue that the GR07 also has. I am not familiar with the Alpha unless you mean the proalpha.
> 
> I think you would enjoy the LG Quadbeat - it's well within your price range, bass is not lacking (more impact than with the RE-400, for example), and has a wide and open sound to it. It's different from the M2 and ProAlpha, which are both warmer, but seems like something you would like. If you want to stay safe and stick to a warmer sound like the M2 and ProAlpha, the Sony MH1C would be a good one to pick up.


 

 Okay i have ordered the quadbeat based on your recommendation... lets see hows that one... How much is mh1c different from the quadbeat? Is it technically better? or would it be better for EDM, trance etc? I havent heard something like RE0 or Re-400, how different would that be from these mainstream? I am just curious why would something be superior if it is not say 'enjoyable'? I know its a noobish cliche, just was wondering....


----------



## up late

y2hbk said:


> Well i was able to scrounge up the extra cash and managed to pick up the k3003. Ive had the past few days to spend with them. So far i am very impressed. Blown away, not so much, but very impressed. I think the law of diminishing returns takes effect here. I have had the privilege of hearing the W4 recently. While not my cup of tea, I have had a few moments here and there since then where I have had to ask myself if the k3003 is really worth the price tag or if would have been just as pleased with something a bit cheaper like the IE800s. I do have a couple of weeks left to decide before I am outside of the return policy, so I'll see how much I grow to like them.
> 
> Since Ive primarily been using the GR07 for such a long time and still own them I was able to A/B them. There is certainly a difference in overall clarity and quality, especially with the mids it seems. I will likely hold onto them to use when I jog since they still impress when I use them. I did, however, sell my EPH-100 to a co-worker.




yeah the whole diminishing returns thang kicks in when you're paying that kind of money for an earphone. I've been trying high-end universals over the last few months including the ie800 and the k3003 wowed me because it got the balance most right IMO. it's not a "fun" phone but that's not what I'm after in high-end audio.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

*@joker* Cheers for the input on UE500 vs VSD1. 

Think that's put the final nail in my decision. 

Btw you gonna be trying the VSD1S when LMUE get the stock?


----------



## davidcotton

Hi Joker
   
  Would you recommend the 1964 v3 model for someone in to rock and metal out of the usual ipod/sansa clip sources?  Still on the fence about a westone 4 (though the westones are easier to get hold off)and wondered if the v3 would be a better bet for longer term listening than a westone 3.  Not interested in the custom version but the universal model that's available.  Had a look at the 1964 ears quads but feel they may have too much bass for my taste. 
   
  Cheers


----------



## shuriken

Quote: 





shuriken said:


> hi, Joker.
> Thank you for all your reviews.
> your charts is my "hearing aid" for earphones.
> (bought 5 already with your help)
> ...


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The VC02 won't do it - it's got punchy mid-bass but the deep bass is not on-level with the GR99. I would go for the Sony MH1C or maybe Philips SHE3850. The SHE3580 isn't really better than the GR99 overall but it has a small clarity advantage.


 
   
   thank you for your reply,
  I want a sound improvement overall so I think 
  the Philips SHE3850 wouldn't do it for me.
  as for the sony MH1C, it comes I notice,
  only with controllers for smartphones, something I don't need.
  so I found it a bit silly hanging around with it.
  If I'll extend my budget, do you think the Vsonic GR06
  will do the trick?


----------



## justblue

*|joker|* could you please compare the Astrotec AM-800 to the Brainwavz M2/ProAlpha? I would go for the AM-800 if it's not too cold/neutral, otherwise I think the MH1 + recabling is an option.


----------



## quartertone

If I can just chime in, I personally think the AM800 is quite a bit better than Joker's rating suggests (I'd give it more like 8.7 rather than 7.8). It has a great mixture of richness and clarity (rather like MH1 meets GR07 to my ears) that works with most genres but is still 'fun'. It really is a great deal for $50, easily worth twice that imo.


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





quartertone said:


> If I can just chime in, I personally think the AM800 is quite a bit better than Joker's rating suggests (I'd give it more like 8.7 rather than 7.8). It has a great mixture of richness and clarity (rather like MH1 meets GR07 to my ears) that works with most genres but is still 'fun'. It really is a great deal for $50, easily worth twice that imo.


 
   
  Thanks for your comment. Does it mean the AM800 is on the bright side? I can't stand any sibiliance or too bright sound lacking in warm bass.


----------



## quartertone

It has warm bass, hence my MH1 comparison. I wouldn't exactly call it a bright phone overall, but it certainly has the necessary treble to give a good reproduction of the whole range. I don't know how sensitive you are, perhaps you can give some examples?


----------



## justblue

I don't like the Audeo and Rock it Sounds R50 - too bright and analytic. Because of outdoor use it should be quite fun with a competent bass to avoid sound leaking. How does it apply to the AM800 in your opinion? 
Oh and BTW I also think that 6.7 for the ProAlpha is underrated, I would give it 7.8


----------



## quartertone

It's definitely not as bright as a TWFK phone (don't have the R50, but have two others) and has plenty of bass. One caveat for outside use though: it has a shallow fit and weak isolation, unless you can work around that with a tip solution (I find that pushing Meelec double flanges right up over the housing improves that).


----------



## AFireInAsa

About Lendmeurears and the GR07 BE - I ordered a pair 10 days ago and when I messaged them about how long it would take, I was told that they have none in stock at their U.S. distributor so they had to send me it from Singapore (did not say this on their eBay page). They also said I would be getting a tracking number which I haven't received yet. It's possible they haven't been shipped yet which is disappointing. Might be possible that I will only get that when it reaches the U.S. though, not sure how it works. Very excited, though.


----------



## sandsha2

Hi ljoker,

 I have ATH-CKM500.
  Its mid bass annoys me, can you please suggest an IEM with lesser mid bass, better mids, treble and depth. I can spend $130.
   
  Thanks


----------



## AFireInAsa

Quote: 





sandsha2 said:


> Hi ljoker,
> 
> I have ATH-CKM500.
> Its mid bass annoys me, can you please suggest an IEM with lesser mid bass, better mids, treble and depth. I can spend $130.
> ...


 
  Check out his review for the *(2B21) Rock-It Sounds R-50*


----------



## a11Earz

Hi,
  I am willing to buy a new iem (<180$) to replace my brainwavz m2, and I am looking for your advice.
  I mainly listen to trance (vocal trance - armin van buuren, etc) and metal (iron maiden, rammstein).
  The sound I am looking for is: detailed, deep, good quality and *quatity* bass (I am not a basshead
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





), forward and detailed mids, not very bright, emphasized or distracting highs and the overall presentation to be fun, full sounding and not dry, thin or too analytical.
  I got my eyes on the vsonic gr07 *BE* and the yamaha eph-100 as good iems characterized by deep, good quality and quatity bass. However, I have read that the gr07BE may be good with metal but not with trance, and that the eph-100 are excellent with trance but not that aggressive to handle metal.
  So which iem may suit my needs better? the vsonic gr07 BE? the yamaha eph-100? or another iem like the carbo basso, the fxt90...?
  Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Huh? I got my RE-400 last week from Head Direct, and there was no case. No cable winder either, though that doesn't bother me in the slightest.


 
   
  Quote: 





lwien said:


> I didn't think that I got the cable winder either until I turned that foam packing material upside down.   It was underneath.
> 
> No case though, and I too bought mine from Head Direct fulfilled by Amazon.


 
   
  Quote: 





toolate said:


> Yeah, I got mine directly from Head Direct and I didn't get a case. I did get a cable winder but it's kind of unwieldy.


 
   
  Update on the above - cases should be included with RE-400s purchased directly or via Amazon from Head-Direct in the past couple of weeks. You guys should be getting PMs from HiFiMan to verify your orders and get cases shipped out.
   
   
  Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> Well i was able to scrounge up the extra cash and managed to pick up the k3003. Ive had the past few days to spend with them. So far i am very impressed. Blown away, not so much, but very impressed. I think the law of diminishing returns takes effect here. I have had the privilege of hearing the W4 recently. While not my cup of tea, I have had a few moments here and there since then where I have had to ask myself if the k3003 is really worth the price tag or if would have been just as pleased with something a bit cheaper like the IE800s. I do have a couple of weeks left to decide before I am outside of the return policy, so I'll see how much I grow to like them.
> 
> Since Ive primarily been using the GR07 for such a long time and still own them I was able to A/B them. There is certainly a difference in overall clarity and quality, especially with the mids it seems. I will likely hold onto them to use when I jog since they still impress when I use them. I did, however, sell my EPH-100 to a co-worker.


 
   
  Yeah, diminishing returns are a bitch. Top-tier has always offered fairly marginal improvements over "near top-tier" but with the priciest universals now costing $900 or more this is becoming especially apparent. I think this is good news for everyone - those who are willing to pay the premium have the option of doing so and those who are just looking for value can pick up something like the GR07. 
   
   
  Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Okay i have ordered the quadbeat based on your recommendation... lets see hows that one... How much is mh1c different from the quadbeat? Is it technically better? or would it be better for EDM, trance etc? I havent heard something like RE0 or Re-400, how different would that be from these mainstream? I am just curious why would something be superior if it is not say 'enjoyable'? I know its a noobish cliche, just was wondering....


 
   
  Comparison of the MH1C and Quadbeat pulled from the MH1C review:
   
  Quote: 





> Not unlike the MH1C, the Quadbeat is a stock headset included with many LG smartphones. The sound signature of the Quadbeat is on the v-shaped side compared to the MH1C and its bass, especially subbass, is lower in quantity. The low end of the Quadbeat is a little tighter but the difference isn’t drastic. The LGs also sacrifice some of the warmth and fullness of the Sonys, giving up the excellent note thickness of the MH1C for a bit of added clarity, aided also by the extra treble energy of the Quadbeat. Next to the warm and smooth MH1C, the treble of the Quadbeat sounds brighter and harsher overall.
> 
> I ended up preferring the sound of the MH1C, which overall sounded more natural and convincing despite the extra bass. On a user-friendliness note, while I found the cable of the Quadbeat to be a lot more tolerable than that of the MH1C, its extra-soft stock eartips did not work for me and had to be replaced with a set of standard bi-flanges of the MEElectronics variety. The Quadbeat was also more sensitive, reaching loud volumes very easily.


 
   
  I do think the MH1C is slightly better overall but it's not as airy-sounding so I'm think you'll like the Quadbeat better. In any case the Quadbeat is very different from what you currently have 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Quote: 





lifted andreas said:


> *@joker* Cheers for the input on UE500 vs VSD1.
> 
> Think that's put the final nail in my decision.
> 
> Btw you gonna be trying the VSD1S when LMUE get the stock?


 
   
  Probably after I finish both of the VSonic reviews I'm currently working on. There's been too many VSonic releases in the past 6 months or so 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Would you recommend the 1964 v3 model for someone in to rock and metal out of the usual ipod/sansa clip sources?  Still on the fence about a westone 4 (though the westones are easier to get hold off)and wondered if the v3 would be a better bet for longer term listening than a westone 3.  Not interested in the custom version but the universal model that's available.  Had a look at the 1964 ears quads but feel they may have too much bass for my taste.
> 
> Cheers


 
   
  Probably not - I thought the W4 had a fairly inoffensive sound signature. The V3 has more in-your-face bass and no less treble energy. I didn't realize there was a universal V3 available. Wonder how that compares to a customized unit...
   
  Quote: 





shuriken said:


> thank you for your reply,
> I want a sound improvement overall so I think
> the Philips SHE3850 wouldn't do it for me.
> as for the sony MH1C, it comes I notice,
> ...


 
   
  I don't think so - the GR06 doesn't really have the subbass of the MH1C or GR99, or even GR02BE. Hmm... there's not much else that fits the bill in that price range - to get that deep bass with great clarity you'd then have to go for something like the Shure SE215, which is a lot more expensive.
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> *|joker|* could you please compare the Astrotec AM-800 to the Brainwavz M2/ProAlpha? I would go for the AM-800 if it's not too cold/neutral, otherwise I think the MH1 + recabling is an option.


 
   
  The AM-800 is not cold/neutral. It's got plenty of bass. it won't be as smooth up top as an M2/ProAlpha, though.
   
  Quote: 





quartertone said:


> If I can just chime in, I personally think the AM800 is quite a bit better than Joker's rating suggests (I'd give it more like 8.7 rather than 7.8). It has a great mixture of richness and clarity (rather like MH1 meets GR07 to my ears) that works with most genres but is still 'fun'. It really is a great deal for $50, easily worth twice that imo.


 
   
  I actually like the AM800 myself - I even included it in my shortened buyer's guide, which only holds the earphones I personally liked best for every sound signature and price range. At $65 I maintain that it's a very good value. It just has a bit of mid-bass bloat and not entirely smooth treble. Compared to the Sony MH1C, for example, the subbass doesn't come through as well because of the mid-bass and the treble is not as extended or refined. 
   
   
  Quote: 





afireinasa said:


> About Lendmeurears and the GR07 BE - I ordered a pair 10 days ago and when I messaged them about how long it would take, I was told that they have none in stock at their U.S. distributor so they had to send me it from Singapore (did not say this on their eBay page). They also said I would be getting a tracking number which I haven't received yet. It's possible they haven't been shipped yet which is disappointing. Might be possible that I will only get that when it reaches the U.S. though, not sure how it works. Very excited, though.


 
   
  That's unfortunate, hopefully it will arrive soon. Int'l post tracking numbers aren't super reliable in my experience so not having tracking may not be a big loss.
   
   
  Quote: 





sandsha2 said:


> Hi ljoker,
> 
> I have ATH-CKM500.
> Its mid bass annoys me, can you please suggest an IEM with lesser mid bass, better mids, treble and depth. I can spend $130.
> ...


 
   
  Do you still want similarly powerful bass, just with less bloat? Or are you looking for something less bassy? If the former, I would try and stretch for the Yamaha EPH-100 as it emphazes sub-bass and not so much mid-bass and has great mids and depth. If you are okay with a similarly mid-bassy sound but less bloat, the JVC FXT90 would be an option. If you're looking for significantly more balanced sound, I would go for the Philips Fidelio S1 (not so much an improvement on the depth front, but everything else) or maybe even the HiFiMan RE-400.
   
   
  Quote: 





a11earz said:


> Hi,
> I am willing to buy a new iem (<180$) to replace my brainwavz m2, and I am looking for your advice.
> I mainly listen to trance (vocal trance - armin van buuren, etc) and metal (iron maiden, rammstein).
> The sound I am looking for is: detailed, deep, good quality and *quatity* bass (I am not a basshead
> ...


 
   
  The EPH-100 would be my pick simply because you're worried about bright highs. That can definitely be an issue with VSonic IEMs but the Yamahas seem to avoid the harsh upper midrange/lower treble regions. I do think the GR07BE is quicker and perhaps better-suited for metal due to that and its more balanced sound but the EPH-100 is far from poor. I'm not familiar with the Carbo Basso.


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Update on the above - cases should be included with RE-400s purchased directly or via Amazon from Head-Direct in the past couple of weeks. You guys should be getting PMs from HiFiMan to verify your orders and get cases shipped out.


 
   
  Thanks so much.   Will await PM.


----------



## ktan3142

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Update on the above - cases should be included with RE-400s purchased directly or via Amazon from Head-Direct in the past couple of weeks. You guys should be getting PMs from HiFiMan to verify your orders and get cases shipped out.


 
  
 I can confirm, I received my RE-400 three days ago and it came with the case. The sound was quite different from the RE-ZERO but it's a welcome change.


----------



## lukEM22

Did I recieve a super defected MH1C or is the cable supposed to be so wierd?
  Although in terms of sound, these might be my new favorite. Might have to sell my Turbines now.


----------



## higbvuyb

Quote: 





lukem22 said:


> Did I recieve a super defected MH1C or is the cable supposed to be so wierd?


 
  It's a behind-the-neck design. The cable splits just behind your neck. On one side you have the left earphone and the right earphone goes the other way.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lukem22 said:


> Did I recieve a super defected MH1C or is the cable supposed to be so wierd?
> Although in terms of sound, these might be my new favorite. Might have to sell my Turbines now.


 

 If you mean the uneven cable lengths, it's a j-cord setup. They are popular in Asia, not so much in the US.


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Probably not - I thought the W4 had a fairly inoffensive sound signature. The V3 has more in-your-face bass and no less treble energy. I didn't realize there was a universal V3 available. Wonder how that compares to a customized unit...


 
  Hi
   
  Thanks for that, little surprised.  I seem to be always coming back to westone and thought I'd look around for something different but all paths lead back to them it seems.  Customs have been nothing but a pita for me which is why I was looking at the universal of the 1964 ears.  I was on the fence though as I would more than likely be whacked for import duties which I obviously don't like.  So for long term listening (2hours then break etc) a westone 4 is still a good place to look at then for even for rock and metal?  Maybe I should stop fighting the inevitable and just order a pair already!  Levanter over on the 1964 ears thread has got the 1964 ears v6 universal incoming so might be worth keeping an eye out for any impressions of those if your interested.  I should clarify that the westone 3's went through the wash which is why I'm looking for a new universal.
   
  Cheers


----------



## quartertone

Got my PM from Hifiman, nice to see them sorting that out.


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The AM-800 is not cold/neutral. It's got plenty of bass. it won't be as smooth up top as an M2/ProAlpha, though.
> 
> 
> I actually like the AM800 myself - I even included it in my shortened buyer's guide, which only holds the earphones I personally liked best for every sound signature and price range. At $65 I maintain that it's a very good value. It just has a bit of mid-bass bloat and not entirely smooth treble. Compared to the Sony MH1C, for example, the subbass doesn't come through as well because of the mid-bass and the treble is not as extended or refined.


 
   
  Thanks. I guess that's all I can get from your description, now it's time to experience it.
  BTW, how do you find the following RE-400 measures:
  http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/03/hifiman-re-400-evolution-or-devolution.html
  http://en.goldenears.net/19626
  ?
  Do they reflect what you hear?
  I also liked the Brainwavz M1 and I'm wondering if the RE-400 could be regarded as its upgrade (in terms of a similar sound signature, balance, soundstage)?


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Got my PM from Hifiman, nice to see them sorting that out.


 
   
  Got mine as well.   Thanks to all.


----------



## OliverBB

Hi!
   
  Would anyone be able to compare the Vsonic GR02 pro (silver cable) vs Maximo IM 590?  I'm looking to spend about 40 bucks and I have narrowed it down to these 2.
   
  Thanks in advance!


----------



## snappyaxolotl

Triple.Fi 10, when is the review coming XD


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi
> 
> Thanks for that, little surprised.  I seem to be always coming back to westone and thought I'd look around for something different but all paths lead back to them it seems.  Customs have been nothing but a pita for me which is why I was looking at the universal of the 1964 ears.  I was on the fence though as I would more than likely be whacked for import duties which I obviously don't like.  So for long term listening (2hours then break etc) a westone 4 is still a good place to look at then for even for rock and metal?  Maybe I should stop fighting the inevitable and just order a pair already!  Levanter over on the 1964 ears thread has got the 1964 ears v6 universal incoming so might be worth keeping an eye out for any impressions of those if your interested.  I should clarify that the westone 3's went through the wash which is why I'm looking for a new universal.
> 
> Cheers


 
   
  Well, if all roads lead to the W4...
   
  It might be worth trying first, if that's an option. The W4 is not too like the W3, but I would say it's less fatiguing, if anything.
   
   
  Quote: 





justblue said:


> Thanks. I guess that's all I can get from your description, now it's time to experience it.
> BTW, how do you find the following RE-400 measures:
> http://rinchoi.blogspot.com/2013/03/hifiman-re-400-evolution-or-devolution.html
> http://en.goldenears.net/19626
> ...


 
   
  The measurements make sense. I'm more used to InnerFidelity's compensation but I think Rin's reflects what I actually hear a little better. IF measurements of the RE-400 and RE-600 should be up pretty soon.
   
  The M1 rolls off its bass and treble so it's more mid-centric overall, which the RE-400 isn't. Other than that, the RE-400 is a good upgrade.
   
  Quote: 





oliverbb said:


> Hi!
> 
> Would anyone be able to compare the Vsonic GR02 pro (silver cable) vs Maximo IM 590?  I'm looking to spend about 40 bucks and I have narrowed it down to these 2.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 
   
  It's been a while since I've heard the im-590 but I would say go for the Maximos if you want brighter/more accurate and the VSonics if you want something a little warmer and smoother. There are newer options in that price range though - both of those earphones are several years old.
   
  Quote: 





snappyaxolotl said:


> Triple.Fi 10, when is the review coming XD


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, if all roads lead to the W4...
> 
> It might be worth trying first, if that's an option. The W4 is not too like the W3, but I would say it's less fatiguing, if anything.


 
  Well quite, thing is though whilst I have a disposable fund it's not unlimited sadly and I don't really do the buying and selling thing.  Trying to get the custom situation sorted first but if I ever call it quits on that I guess it'll have to be the westones again 
   
  Cheers


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> The measurements make sense. I'm more used to InnerFidelity's compensation but I think Rin's reflects what I actually hear a little better. IF measurements of the RE-400 and RE-600 should be up pretty soon.




I never really thought the FR graphs aligned too closely with how I heard things. Recently, I sent Rin my Heaven V and at the bottom of his analysis he posted the FR graph to the new Olive-Welti target and it was literally one of those "Aha!" moments. It was practically dead on. 

Do you know if Tyll plans to look into that sort of compensation?


----------



## Inks

Tyll is going to implement the curve but it will take him a while

Here is the RE400 with that compensation


----------



## lilboozy

Yeah the new olive target is supposed more accurately show how one would perceive flatness.


----------



## vwinter

inks said:


> Tyll is going to implement the curve but it will take him a while
> 
> Here is the RE400 with that compensation




Nice. Thanks for posting the graph!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Nice. Thanks for posting the graph!


 

 +1. That looks better to me.


----------



## vaxick

Hey Joker, was looking over your buying guide as I'm trying to get a new set of IEM's before I travel and I'm a fan of the v shape sound signature (I'm a sucker for the fun sounding IEM's).  My favorite IEM of all time was the CKM500, I found it even more fun than the FXT90's, but that driver housing on the CKM500's was not designed for small ears at all leaving me in pain after 30+ minutes of use.
   
  What would you recommend for someone who is a fan of the CKM500 sound?
   
  Thanks.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

inks said:


> Tyll is going to implement the curve but it will take him a while
> 
> Here is the RE400 with that compensation



Is there a different Olive-Welti curve for IEMs vs over-ears?


----------



## Inks

Nope





joe bloggs said:


> Is there a different Olive-Welti curve for IEMs vs over-ears?



Nope same application


----------



## Joe Bloggs

inks said:


> Nope
> Nope same application



Ah, but the HRTF of the dummy head itself is different for different kinds of phones. *Smacks head*


----------



## Inks

The 





joe bloggs said:


> Ah, but the HRTF of the dummy head itself is different for different kinds of phones. *Smacks head*



The HRTF is constant on the Head, but the interaction due to placement is tricky. It's why Rin and Tyll have to make different measurements and get an average for over the ears


----------



## justblue

Quote: 





inks said:


> Tyll is going to implement the curve but it will take him a while
> 
> Here is the RE400 with that compensation


 
   
  Nice, really balanced one. I put it on my wish list


----------



## garcsa

Hi all, 
  I have some contact  problem with my RE400 jack plug. Sent an email just now, I'm waiting for Head-Directs answer.
  Anybody same problem?


----------



## FrequencyBlue

I am using your thread to find and add some IEMs to http://www.head-fi.org/t/670395/the-new-v-shaped-club, will credit you as list builder
   
  btw, do you think the FXT90s belong to entry-level or mid-fi IEMs?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vaxick said:


> Hey Joker, was looking over your buying guide as I'm trying to get a new set of IEM's before I travel and I'm a fan of the v shape sound signature (I'm a sucker for the fun sounding IEM's).  My favorite IEM of all time was the CKM500, I found it even more fun than the FXT90's, but that driver housing on the CKM500's was not designed for small ears at all leaving me in pain after 30+ minutes of use.
> 
> What would you recommend for someone who is a fan of the CKM500 sound?
> 
> Thanks.


 
   
  I honestly don't know of anything v-shaped, with as much mid-bass as the CKM500, that wouldn't also have larger (or equally large) housings. If the JVC FX500 was still in production that may have been an option (it's not as large as the FX700) but I think it's been discontinued.


----------



## justblue

Joker, do you know the Brainwavz M4? What do you think of it? I was shure it was measured and ranked, though it's not apparently. Today it's on heavy sale at MP4Nation ($29 instead of $69), isn't it a bang for the buck?


----------



## vaxick

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I honestly don't know of anything v-shaped, with as much mid-bass as the CKM500, that wouldn't also have larger (or equally large) housings. If the JVC FX500 was still in production that may have been an option (it's not as large as the FX700) but I think it's been discontinued.


 

 Thanks, I see a few places where I can still get them so I'll have to check them out.  JVC's have always fit my ears perfectly.  The FXT90's were always a pleasure to wear, just always wished those had a bit more in the bass department.


----------



## matt4109

Hi Joker
   
  Fantastic thread, thanks for posting all this. I got a pair of Vsonic GR02 Bass Editions recently and love them. But my right ear canal is apparently tiny and even the smallest tips provided by vsonic (which are quite small) are uncomfortable enough that I cant wear the headphones in more than a couple hours as my right ear canal becomes bruised from the tip. I've always used comply tips in the past as I've never before found silicone tips small enough to fit and stay in my ear. The smallest vsonic tip stays in my ear and I don't notice until its been in there for a while and the ear canal starts to bruise.Otherwise they are great. Do you have any recommendations on a pair on a pair with even smaller tips? 
   
  I considered getting the astrotec am-90s or rock-it r-20s or etymotic mc5 but didn't know if I would be happy with the sound since they all have smaller frequency ranges listed. Honestly the bass in the gr02 BE is more heavy than I really need but I really like that it has such great extension. Budget would be up to $100ish I guess though I do tend to lose my headphones every 4 months or so which is why I was looking at cheaper sets. I also fly at least twice a week so decent isolation would be nice.
   
  Again thanks for making this thread and for any advice you might have. It's an incredible resource.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





justblue said:


> Joker, do you know the Brainwavz M4? What do you think of it? I was shure it was measured and ranked, though it's not apparently. Today it's on heavy sale at MP4Nation ($29 instead of $69), isn't it a bang for the buck?


 
   
  I skipped over the M4. From what I understand it was tuned for a more v-shaped sound than the older M1-M3 but I don't know how it actually performs. 
   
  Quote: 





vaxick said:


> Thanks, I see a few places where I can still get them so I'll have to check them out.  JVC's have always fit my ears perfectly.  The FXT90's were always a pleasure to wear, just always wished those had a bit more in the bass department.


 
   
  Careful - there were fakes of the FX500 when it was still in production. Also, the FX500 has great capacity for bass but to match the mid-bass of the CKM500 you will still need to raise the mid-bass on the EQ. There are very few things out there with the mid-bass intensity of the CKM500 that are still on a similar SQ level. 
   
  Quote: 





matt4109 said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Fantastic thread, thanks for posting all this. I got a pair of Vsonic GR02 Bass Editions recently and love them. But my right ear canal is apparently tiny and even the smallest tips provided by vsonic (which are quite small) are uncomfortable enough that I cant wear the headphones in more than a couple hours as my right ear canal becomes bruised from the tip. I've always used comply tips in the past as I've never before found silicone tips small enough to fit and stay in my ear. The smallest vsonic tip stays in my ear and I don't notice until its been in there for a while and the ear canal starts to bruise.Otherwise they are great. Do you have any recommendations on a pair on a pair with even smaller tips?
> 
> ...


 
   
  Why not get Complys for the GR02? Seems like that might be the cheapest solution with the most certain outcome unless you actually want something with less bass.


----------



## iRo-Fi

Joker, what would be all-around upgrade from Meelec A151? A bit more bass and better soundstage would be good, but i don't really want to give anything in exchange. Several suggestions would be nice, no particular budget in mind.


----------



## Jill

Quote: 





matt4109 said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Fantastic thread, thanks for posting all this. I got a pair of Vsonic GR02 Bass Editions recently and love them. But my right ear canal is apparently tiny and even the smallest tips provided by vsonic (which are quite small) are uncomfortable enough that I cant wear the headphones in more than a couple hours as my right ear canal becomes bruised from the tip. I've always used comply tips in the past as I've never before found silicone tips small enough to fit and stay in my ear. The smallest vsonic tip stays in my ear and I don't notice until its been in there for a while and the ear canal starts to bruise.Otherwise they are great. Do you have any recommendations on a pair on a pair with even smaller tips?
> 
> ...


 

 I have really narrow ear canals too. The smallest tips I've found so far are the Jays silicones.  They come in xx-small, but can be hard to find.

 If you are in the US or Canada, the only place I know that you can buy them is here: http://stereotypeaudio.com/our-brands/jays/jays-silicon-sleeve-xxs-black.html
  http://stereotypeaudio.com/our-brands/jays/jays-silicon-sleeve-xxs-white.html

 Maybe you can find them on eBay.  I know that someone posted other places you can get them if you're in Europe, but I don't remember where.

 Reading reviews, several people have had luck with them using them on various Vsonic earphones, so I'm sure they will fit the GR02 nozzle. I've read that because the opening is very slightly wider than the Vsonics, they tend to slightly increase the treble emphasis in comparison.

 I haven't actually ordered them yet, because the smallest Vsonic tips fit my ears, but just barely.  Although, I just bought another earphone, TDK BA200, and I'm considering buying them for that, as none of the stock tips are small enough.

 Based on the measurements posted at the website above, the xxs Jays silicones appear to be just a bit smaller than the smallest Vsonics (8.8 mm versus 9-9.5 mm for the Vsonics). Here's a link to a review with pics of the different sizes of Jays silicone eartips. http://anythingbutipod.com/2007/10/jays-q-jays-review/


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





iro-fi said:


> Joker, what would be all-around upgrade from Meelec A151? A bit more bass and better soundstage would be good, but i don't really want to give anything in exchange. Several suggestions would be nice, no particular budget in mind.


 

 Well, the A161P is one – it’s a more aggressive sound but it also has better imaging and more bass. The deep bass is especially more prominent compared to the A151.
   
  Another one in a similar price range is the HiFiMan RE-400. It doesn't have a whole lot more bass depth than the A151 but it has slightly more mid-bass impact, along with very smooth mids and treble and a well-rounded presentation.
   
  Along those same lines, the Philips Fidelio S1/S2 have more deep bass than the RE-400 but also are a little more energetic in the treble region. They have wider soundstages but lack the layering of the RE-400 and VSonic GR07.  
   
  The VSonic GR07 has more bass and a wider soundstage and doesn’t really give anything up except for the treble smoothness of the A151 (although the A151 doesn't have quite enough treble energy in my opinion). 
   
  The UE900, if you really want to spend a lot, has smoother treble than the GR07 and fits all of your other requirements.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





jill said:


> I have really narrow ear canals too. The smallest tips I've found so far are the Jays silicones.  They come in xx-small, but can be hard to find.
> 
> If you are in the US or Canada, the only place I know that you can buy them is here: http://stereotypeaudio.com/our-brands/jays/jays-silicon-sleeve-xxs-black.html
> http://stereotypeaudio.com/our-brands/jays/jays-silicon-sleeve-xxs-white.html
> ...


 
  Try vc02's smallest tips, they're the smallest tip I've seen in an iem 
http://cdn.head-fi.org/c/cd/350x700px-LL-cd52ea7c_IMG_20121122_093353.jpeg


----------



## kskwerl

Hey guys, I have a question and I know this really isn't the place to ask but I haven't been getting much help posting in the "Help and Introduction" section. 

Anyways, I am looking to get a new pair of IEMs and I'm about to get the Westone 4Rs, I don't want to spend more than 400. Is there any other IEMs that I should be considering at that price range? I like neutral sound and some color but nothing with unnatural bass. Again I know this wasn't the place to ask but I appreciate your guys patience.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kskwerl said:


> Hey guys, I have a question and I know this really isn't the place to ask but I haven't been getting much help posting in the "Help and Introduction" section.
> 
> Anyways, I am looking to get a new pair of IEMs and I'm about to get the Westone 4Rs, I don't want to spend more than 400. Is there any other IEMs that I should be considering at that price range? I like neutral sound and some color but nothing with unnatural bass. Again I know this wasn't the place to ask but I appreciate your guys patience.


 

 It's one of the places to ask... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  There are lots of other high-end IEMs you can snag for under $400. The Westones happen to be versatile and fit your requirements of not being completely neutral but also not having heavily enhanced bass. I don't see anything wrong with them as your pick. As for alternatives, I would say the UE900, VSonic GR07 / GR07 Bass Edition, and maybe the Sony MDR-7550 also fit your requirements, all with slightly different sound signatures and form factors.


----------



## kskwerl

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> It's one of the places to ask...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks for the suggestions, those were pretty much the others I had in my head. I really want to try the Westone 4Rs tho and maybe get some custom tips down the road as I have a limited budget. Otherwise I would just get some customs


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


> I am using your thread to find and add some IEMs to http://www.head-fi.org/t/670395/the-new-v-shaped-club, will credit you as list builder
> 
> btw, do you think the FXT90s belong to entry-level or mid-fi IEMs?


----------



## phantompersona

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


>


 
  Xp he overlooked your comment.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

By price or by SQ?


----------



## kskwerl

joe bloggs said:


> By price or by SQ?




SQ


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





frequencyblue said:


>


 

 Missed the post. I would say mid-fi for the FXT90.


----------



## FrequencyBlue

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Missed the post. I would say mid-fi for the FXT90.


 
  Cool~


----------



## iRo-Fi

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, the A161P is one – it’s a more aggressive sound but it also has better imaging and more bass. The deep bass is especially more prominent compared to the A151.
> 
> Another one in a similar price range is the HiFiMan RE-400. It doesn't have a whole lot more bass depth than the A151 but it has slightly more mid-bass impact, along with very smooth mids and treble and a well-rounded presentation.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks Joker. With those recommendations in mind, do you think i might get comfort issues with some of them? I guess i've a small ears, because A151 is pretty small IEM and it still gets uncomfortable after some time wearing it over the ear - it pushes on my antihelix and start hurting there. Maybe it's just A151 shape, but i still only use them with small to medium tips since my ear canals are quite narrow.


----------



## Exesteils

Hi Joker, great thread. My TF10 cables were sent back for RMA as such I'm looking for a replacement/alternative. 

I mostly listen to songs with heavy vocals(think Snake Eater - Cynthia Harrell, ) along with some DnB and Rock. So I prefer vibrant mids/highs, with good bass response. I'm currently considering the GR07 BE and Fidelio S2. Which of them, in your mind, would match my choice in music better? Or are there better matches?


----------



## neronator

thanks for the thread IjokerI,
   
  I guess you could say I'm a basshead and I'm looking for some good budget IEM's.
  I'm leaning towards the Vsonic GR02 Be, Audio-Technica ATH-CKS55 or the MH1C's
  the audio-technica seems the best on paper, but I can't really find any proper reviews. 
  who will help me out guys?
[size=1.4em]  [/size]


----------



## Lifted Andreas

neronator said:


> thanks for the thread IjokerI,
> 
> I guess you could say I'm a basshead and I'm looking for some good budget IEM's.
> I'm leaning towards the Vsonic GR02 Be, Audio-Technica ATH-CKS55 or the MH1C's
> ...




How about Zero Audio Carbo Basso?


----------



## lonewolf210

Hey great thread. It was a huge help when I was trying to pick out a new set of IEMs. Nvm found the bottom of the front page


----------



## matt4109

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Why not get Complys for the GR02? Seems like that might be the cheapest solution with the most certain outcome unless you actually want something with less bass.


 
   
  Good idea. Just bought some. The only problem I have with those is that they are annoying to put in and take out repeatedly, like when going through security or having a conversation. So I would like to find some that are easy to remove and reinsert. Do you think the etymotics mc5s tips would fit my ears? I've been planning to get custom tips for a while now maybe I should just do that, just dont want to have to pay $100+ for tips every time I lose a pair.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





iro-fi said:


> Thanks Joker. With those recommendations in mind, do you think i might get comfort issues with some of them? I guess i've a small ears, because A151 is pretty small IEM and it still gets uncomfortable after some time wearing it over the ear - it pushes on my antihelix and start hurting there. Maybe it's just A151 shape, but i still only use them with small to medium tips since my ear canals are quite narrow.


 
   
  Well, the UE900 and especially the Philips are a little on the large side so they would be risky. The UE900 shape also makes my ears sore after a few hours for some reason. The RE-400 and A161P, on the other hand, should be slim enough to miss that spot of your ear entirely (though of course it will depend on the size/shape of your ears)
   
  Quote: 





exesteils said:


> Hi Joker, great thread. My TF10 cables were sent back for RMA as such I'm looking for a replacement/alternative.
> 
> I mostly listen to songs with heavy vocals(think Snake Eater - Cynthia Harrell, ) along with some DnB and Rock. So I prefer vibrant mids/highs, with good bass response. I'm currently considering the GR07 BE and Fidelio S2. Which of them, in your mind, would match my choice in music better? Or are there better matches?


 
   
  They are both great earphones and among my favorites in the price range. The GR07BE is a little bassier than the S2 so I would probably go for that so that you're not missing out on much bass compared to your TF10.
   
  Quote: 





neronator said:


> thanks for the thread IjokerI,
> 
> I guess you could say I'm a basshead and I'm looking for some good budget IEM's.
> I'm leaning towards the Vsonic GR02 Be, Audio-Technica ATH-CKS55 or the MH1C's
> ...


 
   
  I'm not familiar with the CKS55. The CKM500 has plenty of bass, though - it's more impactful than the GR02 and MH1C. The type of bass you favor is important, as the GR02 BE and MH1C both balance out nicely between deep bass and mid-bass. This is a good thing if you want a more natural sound but if you just want something to shake your eardrums, something with a larger boost in the mid-bass region may actually work better for you. The CKM500, Padacs Aksent, and JVC FX101 come to mind as good mid-bassy options at three different price points.
   
  Quote: 





lonewolf210 said:


> Hey great thread. It was a huge help when I was trying to pick out a new set of IEMs. Nvm found the bottom of the front page


 
   
  Thanks, glad it was useful!
   
  Quote: 





matt4109 said:


> Good idea. Just bought some. The only problem I have with those is that they are annoying to put in and take out repeatedly, like when going through security or having a conversation. So I would like to find some that are easy to remove and reinsert. Do you think the etymotics mc5s tips would fit my ears? I've been planning to get custom tips for a while now maybe I should just do that, just dont want to have to pay $100+ for tips every time I lose a pair.


 

 The MC5 comes with a few different tips, though the silicone ones are triple-flanges and work best with deep insertion. They might not be the best if you have easily-irritated ear canals and also need to pop your earphones in and out often. Custom tips are the same way, by the way - they take longer to remove and re-insert than standard silicones.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Wait, MC5 tips fit the GR02? In that case I recommend trying the tips that come with the Panasonic RP-HJE355. The small tips from those are really long and slender and when fitted on my mc5 slid in and out of my narrow ear canals like butter. A breeze to insert and remove too (they're single flanges)


----------



## ljokerl

More short impressions of stuff I probably won't get a chance to review in full:
   
  Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I promised to post updates on IEMs in my possession that I don't plan to review due to lack of time. Most of these are simply unexciting but in keeping with my promise I'll post short thoughts and add them to the list on the front page of the thread.


 

*Westone Adventure Series (ADV) Alpha*: http://www.westone.com/music/index.php/adventure-series.html 

 Bass-heavy and a little too dark-sounding - not a very natural sound. For $200 seems to lack bass control and overall refinement, the latter especially compared to the similarly-priced Westone 2. Build and fit seem good but the cloth cable is more microphonic than I would have liked for a sports earphone.

*Cardas EM5813 Ear Speakers*: http://cardas.com/earspeakers

 Interesting design with the thickest cable I’ve ever seen on an IEM. I think a cable this thick might get annoying over time, though. Only one size of tips is included and the cheap pouch doesn’t fit the earphones properly. All of that wouldn’t matter if the sound blew me away but it hasn’t yet. It’s definitely not bad – warm and smooth, with a very good sense of space - but it lacks the clarity and finesse of the earphones I like in that price range. They remind me somewhat of a Monster Turbine Pro Gold with a little less bass, but the bass is still not nearly as tight and accurate as the similarly-priced HiFiMan RE-600, for example.
   
  Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Wait, MC5 tips fit the GR02? In that case I recommend trying the tips that come with the Panasonic RP-HJE355. The small tips from those are really long and slender and when fitted on my mc5 slid in and out of my narrow ear canals like butter. A breeze to insert and remove too (they're single flanges)


 

 No, they won't fit. I think matt4109 is just thinking of buying the MC5 to supplement his GR02.


----------



## DannyBai

Ouch on the Ear Speaker, lol.


----------



## quartertone

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> the bass is still not nearly as tight and accurate as the similarly-priced HiFiMan RE-600, for example.


 
  Ah, so you've heard the RE-600. Would you say the price difference from the RE-400 adequately reflects the quality difference?


----------



## Icehawk

I want someone to pull the filters of their Westone ADV and see if that helps, I love the design but the sound isn't right.


----------



## nehcrow

Curious to how much of an improvement you think the RE600 is over the RE400? Also where would you think you'd rank them in the realm of IEM's you've listened to?


----------



## garcsa

My Meelec CC51 has died.Loved it. R.I.P. Want to obtain an another dynamic microdriver IEM., similar sound signatuge like  MEE . JVC FXD80? Welcome any suggestion. Max 100 bucks.
   
  joker?
   
  Thanks!
   
   
  LLRNR!


----------



## ACST

Hi Joker,
   
  I'm looking for a new iem since I destroyed my GR07 and I want something else now.
   
  Choices are:
  Rock-it Sounds R-50
  Philips Fidelio S1/S2
  T-peos H100
  Fischer Audio DBA-02
   
  Music taste is too diverse too mention. I would appreciate a wide 3d soundstage and 'not to clean' sounding (a bit 'warmish', but not too much).
  I can all get them for approx. the same price.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





acst said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I'm looking for a new iem since I destroyed my GR07 and I want something else now.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Noooo!


----------



## Towwers

HI!
   
  I want to upgrade from my Westone 4. I generally listen to electronic, rock, metal and classical. I do like the sound of the W4. However, I want a fun earphone. I would love a Westone 4 with a little more bass. What would yo recommend me?


----------



## Mimouille

towwers said:


> HI!
> 
> I want to upgrade from my Westone 4. I generally listen to electronic, rock, metal and classical. I do like the sound of the W4. However, I want a fun earphone. I would love a Westone 4 with a little more bass. What would yo recommend me?


Inear StageDiver 3. Great build and comfort, 3D sound, fun, and bassy.


----------



## Towwers

Quote: 





mimouille said:


> Inear StageDiver 3. Great build and comfort, 3D sound, fun, and bassy.


 
  How's the sound in that one? I'm just worried it resembles the Westone 3 which I don't like much... To bassy for my taste.


----------



## Mimouille

towwers said:


> How's the sound in that one? I'm just worried it resembles the Westone 3 which I don't like much... To bassy for my taste.


I do not know the Westone range but people who have heard both think sd3 is technically superior. I could not vouch for that. However, I can say that they are a great iem, but clearly bassy. The bass is textured and controlled though, i.e. not bleeding in the mids.


----------



## Superman07

Good day!  I've posted a few threads in help section, but didn't get any response.  Perhaps somebody in this thread discussing multiple IEM's can lend some insight!
   
  I have an old pair of UE Super.Fi 3s and the cabling is seriously breaking down.  Rather than get a replacement cable I'm leaning towards getting a new set of headphones since I now use them daily.  I was leaning towards $100, but I'm willing to spend more if the sound is improved. However, frustrating since you typically can't hear before buying.  Based on my research, these are the models that seem to repeatedly come up with good marks.
   
  Shure SE215s - Lower cost, good fit, nice range of sound and, re-placable cable, a good amount of noise isolation.
  VSONIC GR07 - All around great sound, nice bass extension, good fit, double armature construction, flat cable.
  Fischer Audio DBA-02 MkII - Similar sound to GR07s (??), but questionable build quality
   
  Anybody able to compare these, offer insights, or other thoughts?  My biggest question is sound quality difference between top end dynamic IEMs vs step up to entry level armature construction.
   
  Thanks!!


----------



## vwinter

Quote: 





superman07 said:


> Good day!  I've posted a few threads in help section, but didn't get any response.  Perhaps somebody in this thread discussing multiple IEM's can lend some insight!
> 
> I have an old pair of UE Super.Fi 3s and the cabling is seriously breaking down.  Rather than get a replacement cable I'm leaning towards getting a new set of headphones since I now use them daily.  I was leaning towards $100, but I'm willing to spend more if the sound is improved. However, frustrating since you typically can't hear before buying.  Based on my research, these are the models that seem to repeatedly come up with good marks.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The dual balanced armature vsonic IEMs are GR01 which you likely meant, and the the newer and cheaper VC1000. The GR07 is their current flagship dynamic driver. I don't think any vsonics have flat cables...
   
  Recent bang for your buck sound quality contenders at the $100 price point are the HiFiMAN RE-400 and the Philips Fidelio S1.
   
  There are many dynamics that are more than a match for balanced armatures, and vice versa.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Ah, so you've heard the RE-600. Would you say the price difference from the RE-400 adequately reflects the quality difference?


 
   
  I've only had the RE-600 for a few days so it will be a while before I have a solid grasp of it. I like what I'm hearing. A $400 earphone never sounds 4x as good as a $100 one, though.
   
   
  Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Curious to how much of an improvement you think the RE600 is over the RE400? Also where would you think you'd rank them in the realm of IEM's you've listened to?


 
   
  See above. I think it's going to be another case of RE262 vs RE272, where I clearly preferred the RE272 in almost every way but the difference in each individual aspect wasn't huge. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> My Meelec CC51 has died.Loved it. R.I.P. Want to obtain an another dynamic microdriver IEM., similar sound signatuge like  MEE . JVC FXD80? Welcome any suggestion. Max 100 bucks.
> 
> joker?
> 
> ...


 
   
  Another CC51?
   
  The FXD80 is similar but brighter/colder in tone, if that's okay with you. The Monster Miles Davis Trumpet would be better signature-wise but that's way over $100 and probably not worth its coin. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





acst said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I'm looking for a new iem since I destroyed my GR07 and I want something else now.
> 
> ...


 
   
  It depends on what you liked/didn't like about the GR07. The Fidelio S2 would be closer to the sound of the GR07 than the H-100 or R-50, for example. The S2 fits your requirements nicely, actually - its soundstage wide, though not overly 3D, and it is warm-ish. 
   
   
  Quote: 





towwers said:


> HI!
> 
> I want to upgrade from my Westone 4. I generally listen to electronic, rock, metal and classical. I do like the sound of the W4. However, I want a fun earphone. I would love a Westone 4 with a little more bass. What would yo recommend me?


 
   
  Custom or universal? Among the universals I've heard it would probably have to be K3003. The IE 800 and even Ultrasone IQ will likely have too much bass for you. Haven't tried the SD3, though.
   
   
  Quote: 





superman07 said:


> Good day!  I've posted a few threads in help section, but didn't get any response.  Perhaps somebody in this thread discussing multiple IEM's can lend some insight!
> 
> I have an old pair of UE Super.Fi 3s and the cabling is seriously breaking down.  Rather than get a replacement cable I'm leaning towards getting a new set of headphones since I now use them daily.  I was leaning towards $100, but I'm willing to spend more if the sound is improved. However, frustrating since you typically can't hear before buying.  Based on my research, these are the models that seem to repeatedly come up with good marks.
> 
> ...


 

 There are dynamic IEMs that outperform similarly-priced BA ones and vice versa. You should focus on the type of signature you want. Among those three, the SE215 is the bassiest and lightest on the treble, the GR07 is balanced with a slight bass bump and plenty of treble energy. The DBA-02 mkII is very balanced with less bass than the GR07. There are also tons and tons of other options in that price range as well. 
   
   
  The SF3 is a good earphone but it's rolled off in the bass and treble. It's very smooth though, and has nice mids, but you don't need to spend $179 on a GR07 to upgrade from it. If you want something that's reminiscent of the SF3 but covers more of the frequency spectrum, without spending too much, the UE 600 would work for you. Spending a little more, the HiFiMan RE-400 is a good, balanced-sounding option.


----------



## Inks

Hmm doesn't RE600 have even less treble than RE400?


----------



## shotgunshane

inks said:


> Hmm doesn't RE600 have even less treble than RE400?




I would like to see Rin measure the 262 and 600. I can't make sense of the IF 262 and 272 measurements. They are very similar yet sound so different.


----------



## Inks

shotgunshane said:


> I would like to see Rin measure the 262 and 600. I can't make sense of the IF 262 and 272 measurements. They are very similar yet sound so different.




I though they sounded similar, 262s were just much more midforward. But that small difference of the 272s made them much better IMO


----------



## Change is Good

Hello, again, joker.
   
  I am still on my journey of finding my most suitable IEM. SO far I have been satisfied with both the GR07 mk2 and the Gr07 BE. I have no major gripes with either, I just wish the bass was somewhere in between the two. The BE seems to have a bit too much compared to my other cans. It's not a bad thing, it's just sticking out like a sore thumb and want to avoid a major transition period when switching to a portable setup. The BE was a better match when I had the Fidelio X1 for home use.
   
  I also would rather have an IEM that doesn't have to go over my ears. I am currently looking at the DBA-02, Klipsh X10, and Etymotic ER-4P. I am still looking for that balance/neutral sound, with enough bass response that doesn't hamper the other frequencies... preferably a similar sound signature to that of my recent Mad Dogs v.3.2 purchased from MrSpeakers.
   
  If those don't compare well with the GR07 I may just have to go back to the MK2 and EQ its bass to my likings. I may also just give the Fidelio S2 before doing so.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





inks said:


> Hmm doesn't RE600 have even less treble than RE400?


 
   
  I've only listened to the RE-600 a few times so far. TBD.
   
  Quote: 





change is good said:


> Hello, again, joker.
> 
> I am still on my journey of finding my most suitable IEM. SO far I have been satisfied with both the GR07 mk2 and the Gr07 BE. I have no major gripes with either, I just wish the bass was somewhere in between the two. The BE seems to have a bit too much compared to my other cans. It's not a bad thing, it's just sticking out like a sore thumb and want to avoid a major transition period when switching to a portable setup. The BE was a better match when I had the Fidelio X1 for home use.
> 
> ...


 

 The X10 may have too much bass for you and the ER4/DBA-02 probably won't have enough (based on the fact that you want something between the GR07 and GR07BE). The S2 would be a good buy, I think. Its bass is in the vicinity of my non-BE GR07 but it's a cable-down earphone, generally has good balance, and EQs well.


----------



## Change is Good

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I've only listened to the RE-600 a few times so far. TBD.
> 
> 
> The X10 may have too much bass for you and the ER4/DBA-02 probably won't have enough (based on the fact that you want something between the GR07 and GR07BE). The S2 would be a good buy, I think. Its bass is in the vicinity of my non-BE GR07 but it's a cable-down earphone, generally has good balance, and EQs well.


 
   Thank you. I was also told of the more expensive Westone W4. Any impressions when comparing to the GR07 and GR07 BE?


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Another CC51?
> 
> The FXD80 is similar but brighter/colder in tone, if that's okay with you. The Monster Miles Davis Trumpet would be better signature-wise but that's way over $100 and probably not worth its coin.


 
  Another CC51 - not bad idea ...  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, but to be honest I'll want to try something else, too. FXD80 ordered, I'm curious... Thanks.


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





change is good said:


> Hello, again, joker.
> 
> I am still on my journey of finding my most suitable IEM. SO far I have been satisfied with both the GR07 mk2 and the Gr07 BE. I have no major gripes with either, I just wish the bass was somewhere in between the two.
> If those don't compare well with the GR07 I may just have to go back to the MK2 and EQ its bass to my likings. I may also just give the Fidelio S2 before doing so.


 
  Here's how to improve the bass response on the regular GR07, block the front vent next to the nozzle with a piece of tape, and boom, subbbass kick is improved. If you think this is too much, puncture a hole with a needle and it's tamed a little, but still with a boosted subbass, better than stock.


----------



## Superman07

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> The dual balanced armature vsonic IEMs are GR01 which you likely meant, and the the newer and cheaper VC1000. The GR07 is their current flagship dynamic driver. I don't think any vsonics have flat cables...
> 
> Recent bang for your buck sound quality contenders at the $100 price point are the HiFiMAN RE-400 and the Philips Fidelio S1.
> 
> There are many dynamics that are more than a match for balanced armatures, and vice versa.


 
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There are dynamic IEMs that outperform similarly-priced BA ones and vice versa. You should focus on the type of signature you want. Among those three, the SE215 is the bassiest and lightest on the treble, the GR07 is balanced with a slight bass bump and plenty of treble energy. The DBA-02 mkII is very balanced with less bass than the GR07. There are also tons and tons of other options in that price range as well.
> 
> 
> The SF3 is a good earphone but it's rolled off in the bass and treble. It's very smooth though, and has nice mids, but you don't need to spend $179 on a GR07 to upgrade from it. If you want something that's reminiscent of the SF3 but covers more of the frequency spectrum, without spending too much, the UE 600 would work for you. Spending a little more, the HiFiMan RE-400 is a good, balanced-sounding option.


 
   
  Thanks for the replies.  So many choices...gah!  I certainly don't dislike the SF3s, but I've had them for probably a good 5 years and didn't do extensive research when I purchased them.  I'd say they sound balanced, but lean towards hollow.  They aren't warm, and certainly don't have a lot of bass.
   
  Two other's I'd throw in to the mix after researching are the Brainwavz B2 and the TDK BA-200.
   
  Ideal - full spectrum, clear separation between treble, mids and bass, with good noise isolation.


----------



## Towwers

Hi Joker!
   
  Do you know if there's a difference in sound between the Westone 4 and westone 4R?? I'm just curious.
   
  Thank you!


----------



## Superman07

Actually had the chance to listen to the B&O H3s today. I liked the sound. I think it may have been a bit heavy on the bass, but it sounded full. Definitely could tell it had a broader frequency than my SF 3s. Given name I think they are overpriced by 50-100$. I am curious to hear where others think the G07, SE 215, B B2, Hifiman 400, and DBA-02 MkII compare sound for dollar.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





superman07 said:


> Thanks for the replies.  So many choices...gah!  I certainly don't dislike the SF3s, but I've had them for probably a good 5 years and didn't do extensive research when I purchased them.  I'd say they sound balanced, but lean towards hollow.  They aren't warm, and certainly don't have a lot of bass.
> 
> Two other's I'd throw in to the mix after researching are the Brainwavz B2 and the TDK BA-200.
> 
> Ideal - full spectrum, clear separation between treble, mids and bass, with good noise isolation.


 
   
  The B2 is not something I would recommend if you want at least as much warmth as the SF3. The BA-200 I'm not familiar with. If you do want a warmer, fuller, bassier sound compared to the SF3, I would go for the SE215 or GR07/GR07 Bass Edition out of your original choices. The SE215 isolates better but the GR07 is clearer and has quite a bit more treble energy.
   
  Quote: 





towwers said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> Do you know if there's a difference in sound between the Westone 4 and westone 4R?? I'm just curious.
> 
> Thank you!


 
   
  According to Westone there is not (at least not intentionally). The W4 does not appear on Westone's site anymore so it seems like the W4R is the only extant -4 model. 
   
  Quote: 





superman07 said:


> Actually had the chance to listen to the B&O H3s today. I liked the sound. I think it may have been a bit heavy on the bass, but it sounded full. Definitely could tell it had a broader frequency than my SF 3s. Given name I think they are overpriced by 50-100$. I am curious to hear where others think the G07, AS215, B B2, Hickman 400, and DBA-02 MkII compare sound for dollar.


 

 I haven't heard any B&O headphones.


----------



## ljokerl

Logitech Ultimate Ears 600 review below
   
   
*(2C58) Ultimate Ears 600 / 600vi / **Logitech UE 600*
   

Added July 2013
   
  Details: Long-running staple of the UE lineup previously known as the Super.Fi 5
  Current Price: *$60 *from amazon.com (MSRP: $119.99); $120 for 600vi w/mic & 3-button remote
  Specs: Driver: _BA_ | Imp: _13Ω_ | Sens: _115 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4' I-plug_
  Nozzle Size: _4.5mm _| Preferred tips: _Stock Comply, generic bi-flange_
  Wear Style: _*Over-the-ear *or straight down_
   
  Accessories* (4/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), Comply foam tips (2 sets), and hard plastic carrying case
  Build Quality* (3.5/5)* - All-plastic construction, color-coded nozzles, and chromed housings are all reminiscent of the lower-end UE earphones. The cable is identical to the one used by the UE 700 - soft and flexible, but plasticky and not very well-relieved
  Isolation *(3.5/5)* - Nozzles are long and lend themselves to deep insertion fairly well. Isolation is good but still lags behind many pricier BA-based earphones
  Microphonics *(4.5/5)* - Quite low in the soft and flexible cable, and can be eliminated completely with over-the-ear wear
  Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The curved shells and long nozzles of the SF5 allow them to be worn either cord-up or cord-down quite easily, though the position of the mic suggests over-the-ear wear. The housings are very light and rarely come in contact with the ear, much like those of the Phonak PFE and Future Sonics Atrio earphones
   
  Sound *(8.6/10)* - Originally known as the Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5, the single-armature UE 600 took its spot in the UE lineup over from the dual-armature Super.Fi 5 Pro model. Sonically, it differs greatly from its predecessor, taking on a more balanced and accurate sound. At the low end, the UE 600 sounds like a typical single-armature earphone, lacking the enhanced bass of UE’s dynamic-driver models. The bass is very level and controlled, with impact that is on-par with the Etymotic Research HF5 and lags slightly behind the MEElec A161P.
   
  The midrange, on the other hand, is more prominent. The UE 600 places the mids front and center. It is still more neutral than the vast majority of entry-level earphones but for me sounds slightly mid-centric, albeit very clear and refined. This could be due to an impedance interaction with my sources, but it is consistent across all of the ones I’ve tried. Tonally, the UE 600 is a touch warmer than the UE 700 and other TWFK-based sets, as well as the Etymotic HF5, but detail and overall transparency are still very good.
   
  The top end of the UE 600 is clean and smooth, if not particularly sparkly. The UE can’t quite match the delicacy and detail of the HiFiMan RE-400 but still impresses with the slightly relaxed nature of its treble. There is absolutely no grain and the earphone tends to avoid harshness and sibilance. It is also not overly critical of lower-bitrate files. I would say this was done on purpose due to its low price point, but the flagship UE 900 model has similar tendencies. Admittedly, the UE 900 does have better treble presence, energy, and extension, sounding more natural overall, but there is also a huge price gap in play there.
   
The UE 600 possesses an impressively wide soundstage but doesn’t keep up too well with higher-end earphones. I found it lacking overall dynamics and the separation of higher-end sets such as the quad-driver UE 900 model. As a result, the soundstage has comparatively poor depth and layering and the overall sonic image is a bit flat, much like that of the similarly-priced Creative Aurvana In-Ear 3.
   
  Value *(9.5/10) *- The UE 600 is a little plasticky in build but remains lightweight, comfortable, and fairly well-isolating courtesy of the included Comply eartips. The sound is neutral to somewhat mid-centric, with very good clarity, decent bass presence, and smooth, forgiving treble. It sounds great with music and is especially well-suited for audiobooks and phone calls with its forward, highly intelligible vocal presentation. Simply put, it’s a great fit for anyone in search of a comfortable earphone with excellent mids.
   
*Pros: Comfortable form factor; very low cable noise; smooth, yet accurate sound*
*Cons: Plasticky build quality and typical UE cable; prone to impedance interactions with high-OI sources*


----------



## jarrett

Definitely the highest sound quality to lowest price ratio I've seen. Amazon is selling them for $50 now (50% off)


----------



## GForceXIII

Hi joker

 Do you have any recommendations for something similar to the RE-0 but with more sub-bass? Not a lot, I'm not a basshead, I just want slightly more bass.
 Thanks!


----------



## Grayson73

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Logitech Ultimate Ears 600 review below
> 
> 
> *(2C58) Ultimate Ears 600 / 600vi / **Logitech UE 600*
> ...


 
   
  Have you heard the Vsonic VSD1?  If so, what sound rating would you give it?  Curious whether the Ultimate Ears is now the best sound at $50.


----------



## Live with Sound

That price is a discounted one Grayson; if you want to get it at that price, better order fast. Also, I'm praying that the Zero Audio Basso's kick the VSD1's ass, as I've ordered those. If you haven't yet, I suggest you look into those IEMs also 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 (anyone owning those two? I'd love to hear your opinion on that!)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> Definitely the highest sound quality to lowest price ratio I've seen. Amazon is selling them for $50 now (50% off)


 
   
  Good price although that's a 3rd party seller. Looks like amazon is out of stock. 
   
  Quote: 





gforcexiii said:


> Hi joker
> 
> Do you have any recommendations for something similar to the RE-0 but with more sub-bass? Not a lot, I'm not a basshead, I just want slightly more bass.
> Thanks!


 
   
  Philips Fidelio S1 or VSonic GR07. They have more treble presence than the RE0 as well, but if you don't mind that both have good bass reach and presence but are still balanced-sounding overall.
   
  Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> Have you heard the Vsonic VSD1?  If so, what sound rating would you give it?  Curious whether the Ultimate Ears is now the best sound at $50.


 

 I haven't had the VSD1 long enough to have a score in mind yet but I do think it'll score higher than the VC02 and Sony MH1C. The UEs have a very different sound than the VSD1s - a lot more mid-oriented, with less bass and treble.


----------



## GForceXIII

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Philips Fidelio S1 or VSonic GR07. They have more treble presence than the RE0 as well, but if you don't mind that both have good bass reach and presence but are still balanced-sounding overall.


 
  I can't find the original GR07 anywhere over here, is the mk2 any different?


----------



## Deviltooth

Of all the universal IEMs I've tried the UE600 is tied with Phonak's models for the most comfortable.  I have small ears so what works for me might not work for others, but they're very easy to put in place and unlike many others require much less fiddling to stay there.  Also, kudos to the design ethic making the right side red and the left black, there's no eye strained searching for tiny L and R markers.
   
  Joker nailed the sonic characteristics dead on.


----------



## gadiletta

Hello, is it better sony MH1C for 44 euro or sony MH1 for 28 euro, or any others for this price?


----------



## Froststep

Quote: 





> I haven't had the VSD1 long enough to have a score in mind yet but I do think it'll score higher than the VC02 and Sony MH1C. The UEs have a very different sound than the VSD1s - a lot more mid-oriented, with less bass and treble.


 
  Have been trying to decide between vsonic gr06 and the vsd1, looking forward to see how you rate them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gforcexiii said:


> I can't find the original GR07 anywhere over here, is the mk2 any different?


 
   
  Yeah it's supposed to be a little smoother in the treble, like the GR07 BE. I haven't heard it, though. 
   
  Quote: 





deviltooth said:


> Of all the universal IEMs I've tried the UE600 is tied with Phonak's models for the most comfortable.  I have small ears so what works for me might not work for others, but they're very easy to put in place and unlike many others require much less fiddling to stay there.  Also, kudos to the design ethic making the right side red and the left black, there's no eye strained searching for tiny L and R markers.
> 
> Joker nailed the sonic characteristics dead on.


 
   
  I agree, the fit of the UE600 is very easy-going. It does remind me of the Phonaks as well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





gadiletta said:


> Hello, is it better sony MH1C for 44 euro or sony MH1 for 28 euro, or any others for this price?


 
   
  You might want to double-check in the long MH1C thread but I think the MH1 uses an alternate pinout and only works if you have one of the older Nokia or Sony smartphones. It will need an adapter to work with newer ones. Not sure how it interacts with a simple stereo jack (one without headset functionality).
   
  Quote: 





froststep said:


> Have been trying to decide between vsonic gr06 and the vsd1, looking forward to see how you rate them.


 
   
  Unless you want the more forward mids and/or the adjustable-nozzle housings of the GR06 I would go for the VSD1.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Unless you want the more forward mids and/or the adjustable-nozzle housings of the GR06 I would go for the VSD1.


 
  The VSD1 have the articulating nozzles 
   
  Any more time with the VC1000? The F.R. looks quite nice down low. Similar looking to the S1 down low. Any chance to compare those two? Dynamic vs. armature but the tuning seem similar.


----------



## Amitl

Hello everyone!
  I'm looking for a dynamic custom in-ear which is 200$ maximum.
  is there such a thing besides inearcustom.com?
  i know this might not be the *right* place to ask, but this is my
  favorite thread in head-fi to please understand 
  thank you


----------



## Ivabign

I don't think you are going to find anything cheaper than the SE215 reshell from inearcustom - If you are looking to get it in your hands quickly, you are in for a disappointment - but if you are okay with middle/end of September - you might like what you get.


----------



## Y2HBK

Hey Joker (or anyone for that matter  )- of the CIEMs you have heard, which do you believe carries a signature closest to that of the HD800 or K3003? 

I have had my K3003 for about 2 weeks now. Quite the step up from my GR07 and a leapfrog jump compared to the incremental upgrades I made over time to get to my HD800s. While I truly enjoy the sound that the K3003 provides (and find it difficult now to go back to the GR07 - which have become my workout IEMs), I can't help in the back of my mind but feel like I could have better spent that money on finally diving into the field of CIEMs (despite my original hesitations). This is different compared to the early "buyer's remorse" I had due to the law of diminishing returns with my HD800s (which I came to love love love very quickly after). I would rather save the cash and procure an upgraded amp/dac combo if I will be just as satisfied with something like the Alclair, 1964Ears or even the SE3 leaves some room for other upgrades. Unfortunately, it sounds like the SE3 may be out of the picture since it looks like they won't ship to the US anymore? But I have been giving serious thought to 1964...

Thoughts?


----------



## Froststep

> Unless you want the more forward mids and/or the adjustable-nozzle housings of the GR06 I would go for the VSD1.


 
  Thanks for the advice. im also looking at the JVC HA FXD80  and the logitech UE 600, has anyone else also tried these and able to comment on the sound in comparison to the GR06/VSD1?


----------



## ljokerl

I'm not aware of any <$200 dynamic customs other than re-shells.
   
  Quote: 





jant71 said:


> The VSD1 have the articulating nozzles
> 
> Any more time with the VC1000? The F.R. looks quite nice down low. Similar looking to the S1 down low. Any chance to compare those two? Dynamic vs. armature but the tuning seem similar.


 

 Hmm... I thought VSonic had cut costs and just used a fixed nozzle. Turns out they were just extremely tight. Took a plier to move get them to start moving. Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  The VC1000 is actually quite nice - not as much bass as the Fidelio S1 for sure but that's the biggest difference. The VC1000 is one of the best TWFKs I've heard. Working on the review. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





y2hbk said:


> Hey Joker (or anyone for that matter
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 There's nothing I've heard that matches the signature of the K3003 exactly. The 1964-V3 is one that comes to mind but compared to the K3003 it is

 Less v-shaped in signature
 More forward/intimate and not as layered in terms of presentation
 Touch more harsh
 A lot more sensitive
   
  It's not an upgrade to the K3003 at all, just a different sound signature. 
   
  The Reference, too, is different but not an upgrade. Compared to the K3003 it is

 More controlled at the low end but also its bass is not as deep and powerful as that of the AKGs
 Slightly wider in presentation but not as layered
 A little less bright
   
  The Spiral Ear SE 3-way is not a good match for the K3003 signature. 
   
   
  I'll throw in an option not yet listed in this thread - the Lime Ears LE3B (enhanced-bass version of the LE3), which so far I've only reviewed over at InnerFidelity. While it's still not as v-shaped as the K3003 in signature, the bass is very close. The bass boost of the LE3B is located lower down than that of the K3003 but I don't think you will miss the extra mid-bass of the AKGs. All it really lacks is the extra treble sparkle of the K3003 to make it sound similar overall.
   
  It's the best compromise I can think of to get sound at least on-par with the AKGs while still spending less. The LE3/LE3B runs a little less than $700.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





froststep said:


> Thanks for the advice. im also looking at the JVC HA FXD80  and the logitech UE 600, has anyone else also tried these and able to comment on the sound in comparison to the GR06/VSD1?


 
   
  As mentioned on the previous page, the UE 600 and VSD1 don't sound similar. If you're deciding between those two you should first make up your mind as to what sound signature you want.


----------



## Y2HBK

ljokerl said:


> There's nothing I've heard that matches the signature of the K3003 exactly. The 1964-V3 is one that comes to mind but compared to the K3003 it is
> 
> Less v-shaped in signature
> More forward/intimate and not as layered in terms of presentation
> ...




Thanks for the response. I think my issues with the K3003 are a bit similar to that of the HD800s in the sense that I wish there was just a tad more low end. While I really enjoy what the K3003 has to offer, I do wish they were a bit more "fun" so to speak. Some tracks really wow me, but not all. 

I do more analytical listening when Im at home with my HD800s, but never find myself tapping my foot or wondering if someone in the office will catch me bobbing my head with the K3003s. They certainly have their place in my collection but I feel like rather than having two options of such similar sound signature now, that I would like something to "get me into the groove" so to speak when I'm on the go. Im not really sure how best to describe it. 

I will certainly take a look at the LE3B that you mentioned, thanks for that. I was even looking at the 1964-V6 for a bit just to see what it had to offer.


----------



## jarrett

How are Knowles' TWFK drivers tuned by the 3rd party sellers (Brainwavz, Fischer Audio, Rock-It Sounds, VSONIC, etc)? We all know by now the scores for such dual BA headphones are the same or within 0.1 points. I'm sure a lot of people are wondering this. Is it just internal housing tweaks or housing material?
   
  Are the TDK BA200 a Knowles driver? I received mine in the mail last week


----------



## vwinter

The BA200 uses Sonion drivers as far as I've heard.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jarrett said:


> How are Knowles' TWFK drivers tuned by the 3rd party sellers (Brainwavz, Fischer Audio, Rock-It Sounds, VSONIC, etc)? We all know by now the scores for such dual BA headphones are the same or within 0.1 points. I'm sure a lot of people are wondering this. Is it just internal housing tweaks or housing material?


 

 From what I understand, Knowles will work with manufacturers to custom-tune their drivers (with a large enough order, I'm assuming). Also, I don't know about TWFKs, but certain other Knowles models, such as the ED, have several versions, which probably differ in sound. The rest comes down to physical design of the earphones - sound tubes, housings, external crossovers, etc.


----------



## eccom

ljokerl, I'm looking to get a CIEM made and as isolation is key for me Spiral Ear 3-way ref seems to be the best fit. I'm not familiar with any of the iems you compare it to, so would you please give a few sentences based on any of these below, in regards to clarity, soundstage, tonal balance or whatever seems relevant to mention?
   
  ety hf5, senn hd650, vmoda m-80, vsonic gr06, sony MH1c.
   
  Thanks for an awesome thread!


----------



## tan1415

Hi joker,
   
  Hope you can help me out.
  A few months ago bought the Wooduo. |Great bass IEM. Mids and highs were good, but its bass is excellent. Making me really enjoy my dance music or basically any songs with a good beat. Giving me BAss that I have never heard before from any headphone. But still to me...the bass a bit to much to make it my goto headphone.
   
  Than a few weeks ago I bought the Go Dap GD3. And combined it with my Ipod Nano 5G. The sound when I combined it with the Wooduo was simply amazing. The GD3 enhances the mids and highs while teh wooduo still kept its great bass. And the result is almost perfection to me. Never been so close to a the sound I want. I would almost call it balanced or is it just a combination that i like.
   
  Anyway could you suggest other headphones that would give the same sound as this combination or a headphone that is even better than the wooduo that i can combine to getthe same effect? So a tight and punchy bass with teh ability to get the sub bass.


----------



## GForceXIII

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah it's supposed to be a little smoother in the treble, like the GR07 BE. I haven't heard it, though.


 
   
  Thanks joker! I think I'll go for the Mk2s


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eccom said:


> ljokerl, I'm looking to get a CIEM made and as isolation is key for me Spiral Ear 3-way ref seems to be the best fit. I'm not familiar with any of the iems you compare it to, so would you please give a few sentences based on any of these below, in regards to clarity, soundstage, tonal balance or whatever seems relevant to mention?
> 
> ety hf5, senn hd650, vmoda m-80, vsonic gr06, sony MH1c.
> 
> Thanks for an awesome thread!


 
   
  A full review of the SE 3-way Reference can be found here. It does have the best isolation of all my custom earphones, but also the most bass. Clarity is good considering that it has a thick and bassy sound, not a balanced on like your Etys. Tone is neutral-to-warm. The soundstage is not too out-of-the-head, but well-rounded. Imaging and separation are good. The key characteristic for me is still the bass - when the track calls for bass these can really belt it out. If you want a more balanced-sounding custom there might be better options out there. The Sensaphonics 3MAX and Westone ES5, for example, both isolate nearly as well as my 3-way, though they are also pricier. There are cheaper silicone customs as well, though I have not heard any of them yet.
   
  Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> Hope you can help me out.
> A few months ago bought the Wooduo. |Great bass IEM. Mids and highs were good, but its bass is excellent. Making me really enjoy my dance music or basically any songs with a good beat. Giving me BAss that I have never heard before from any headphone. But still to me...the bass a bit to much to make it my goto headphone.
> ...


 

 There are very few earphones I've heard with the subbass of the Wooduo. The only one of the top-tiers that comes close to that level of subbass with better overall sound quality, IMO, is the Futuresonics Atrio MG7.


----------



## jekostas

Hey, have a question for you.  After trial and error I've found that I really prefer headphones that follow a "smooth and warm" sound signature.  I've got a pair of Monster Yao Solars that follow this sig to a T but they're kind of lacking in ergonomics.  As long as I'm sitting still and listening to music they're great but I can't lay down or move around much.
   
  The UE 600 seems to be a good replacement and I can get them at quite a reasonable price locally.  The problem I have is that I have very narrow, very highly angled ear canals and I generally have problems with deep insertion IEMs eg. Etymotic.  Do you think they would work for me?


----------



## iRo-Fi

Joker, any CIEM recommendations as an upgrade from A151? I thought about getting CIEM at first, but quickly give up on that idea because i thought i won't find any decent audiologists in my hometown and i was planning on working out and getting some additional weight mass. I recently found an audiologist recommendation and i'm just thinking about forgetting all those UIEMs comfort issues and getting a custom. If my ear canals change the shape with mass gain, i'll just reshell it.
   
  I was initially set on ES5, but after reading grand CIEM article at IF again, some other sources and just rethinking my needs - i'm not sure i really want warm signature with mid-bass emphasis, even tho it looked like most non-fatiguing CIEM from the bunch. From the read, JH13 and NT6 seems to be too revealing of not so good recording material, with JH13 having bass emphasis and NT6 being quite bright. Not sure how non-fatiguing JH13 is, but i'm dunno if i could use NT6 for long periods of time - i got some problems with overly bright phones in the past, especially 'em being hyper revealing and in addition sibilant. Miracle looks interesting - spacious sound, laid-back presentation, balanced across the spectrum. Better treble than A151, maybe even tighter bass too? Not sure if that's it.
   
  Anyway, hope you can help me out yet again.


----------



## tan1415

> There are very few earphones I've heard with the subbass of the Wooduo. The only one of the top-tiers that comes close to that level of subbass with better overall sound quality, IMO, is the Futuresonics Atrio MG7.


 
  Wow that's quite a comparison.
   
  How about with regard to Over/on ears? Any suggestions?


----------



## insidedrive

Hello Joker,
   
  How does the Vsonic VC1000 compare with the UE900 or GR01?


----------



## daleb

Is there an IEM around $60 (maybe a little more) that is heavily isolating, and insanely comfortable for someone with hypersensitivity? The comfort issue should be fixable with a small enough tip (that still isolates. I have small ear canals and any pressure on the walls of my ear (shallow or deep insert) is highly painful. Maybe a foam tip would help? I'm not sure if that could cause pain. I was thinking about an etymotic, but I'm not sure if that would work.
   
  If it is possible to have good sound to go with it, I would like it to be warm and smooth. I'd rather have amazing isolation and comfort then good sound from something that feels like fire to the ears, though.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jekostas said:


> Hey, have a question for you.  After trial and error I've found that I really prefer headphones that follow a "smooth and warm" sound signature.  I've got a pair of Monster Yao Solars that follow this sig to a T but they're kind of lacking in ergonomics.  As long as I'm sitting still and listening to music they're great but I can't lay down or move around much.
> 
> The UE 600 seems to be a good replacement and I can get them at quite a reasonable price locally.  The problem I have is that I have very narrow, very highly angled ear canals and I generally have problems with deep insertion IEMs eg. Etymotic.  Do you think they would work for me?


 
   
  I doubt the UE600 has as much bass as anything from Monster. It's a rather well-balanced earphone. They also probably won't work specifically for laying down on your side - the housing is positioned outside of your ear when wearing them. Something like the RE-400 is less likely to give you trouble when laying on your side.
   
  On the upside, the UE600s are very lightweight and don't seem to be particularly sensitive to insertion depth. With the included Complys and a shallower seal comfort is excellent.
   
  Quote: 





iro-fi said:


> Joker, any CIEM recommendations as an upgrade from A151? I thought about getting CIEM at first, but quickly give up on that idea because i thought i won't find any decent audiologists in my hometown and i was planning on working out and getting some additional weight mass. I recently found an audiologist recommendation and i'm just thinking about forgetting all those UIEMs comfort issues and getting a custom. If my ear canals change the shape with mass gain, i'll just reshell it.
> 
> I was initially set on ES5, but after reading grand CIEM article at IF again, some other sources and just rethinking my needs - i'm not sure i really want warm signature with mid-bass emphasis, even tho it looked like most non-fatiguing CIEM from the bunch. From the read, JH13 and NT6 seems to be too revealing of not so good recording material, with JH13 having bass emphasis and NT6 being quite bright. Not sure how non-fatiguing JH13 is, but i'm dunno if i could use NT6 for long periods of time - i got some problems with overly bright phones in the past, especially 'em being hyper revealing and in addition sibilant. Miracle looks interesting - spacious sound, laid-back presentation, balanced across the spectrum. Better treble than A151, maybe even tighter bass too? Not sure if that's it.
> 
> Anyway, hope you can help me out yet again.


 
   
  The bass of the ES5 is really not bloated considering its quantity but if you're worried about that the JH13 or Miracle would be better options. I don't find either to be fatiguing. The Miracle is more laid-back and balanced while the JH13 has a few db of bass boost and a more forward presentation. Here's what I wrote previously regarding the JH13 vs Miracle:
   
  Quote: 





> Compared to the Miracle, the JH13 has more midrange presence (and a more forward presentation), better clarity, and more mid-bass by a few dB. The JH13 is more punchy and impactful but also a little more resolving overall. I suppose it could be called more analytical when it comes to how it presents music. The Miracle’s treble seemed a touch smoother to me but overall they are similar in presence and extension at the top.


 
   
  Quote: 





tan1415 said:


> Wow that's quite a comparison.
> 
> How about with regard to Over/on ears? Any suggestions?


 

 I'm not big on over-ears these days. Of the old stuff the M-Audio Q-40 had quite a bit of subbass but I'm sure there's something newer out there that fits the bill even better.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





daleb said:


> Is there an IEM around $60 (maybe a little more) that is heavily isolating, and insanely comfortable for someone with hypersensitivity? The comfort issue should be fixable with a small enough tip (that still isolates. I have small ear canals and any pressure on the walls of my ear (shallow or deep insert) is highly painful. Maybe a foam tip would help? I'm not sure if that could cause pain. I was thinking about an etymotic, but I'm not sure if that would work.
> 
> If it is possible to have good sound to go with it, I would like it to be warm and smooth. I'd rather have amazing isolation and comfort then good sound from something that feels like fire to the ears, though.


 
   
   
  Most highly-isolating earphones do so via deep insertion but you're probably better off just getting foam tips. Etymotic is not a good idea for warm sound. If you want good sound quality my recommendation would be Sony MH1C plus Comply T200s (I think that's the size that fits... might want to double-check in the long MH1 thread). If you just want something super cheap and super comfortable, the best I've tried is the db Logic EP-100 plus Shure Olive foam tips. In this case the earphones and tips cost about the same but the comfort is hard to match. They are volume-limited but I found the volume more than sufficient even in noisy environments.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





insidedrive said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> How does the Vsonic VC1000 compare with the UE900 or GR01?


 

 Missed this one - haven't had a chance to A:B with the VC1000 with those yet.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Most highly-isolating earphones do so via deep insertion but you're probably better off just getting foam tips. Etymotic is not a good idea for warm sound. If you want good sound quality my recommendation would be Sony MH1C plus Comply T200s (I think that's the size that fits... might want to double-check in the long MH1 thread). If you just want something super cheap and super comfortable, the best I've tried is the db Logic EP-100 plus Shure Olive foam tips. In this case the earphones and tips cost about the same but the comfort is hard to match. They are volume-limited but I found the volume more than sufficient even in noisy environments.


 
  The MH1Cs are sadly not available anymore. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Noisy environments should not be a problem, because the isolation should be at least -30, -40 db. I want to spend the day with this just on me, at all times, keeping every bit of sound out. Plus comfort >> sound. If the Etymotics can provide that, then that's my choice. No idea if they do that, though.


----------



## jekostas

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I doubt the UE600 has as much bass as anything from Monster. It's a rather well-balanced earphone. They also probably won't work specifically for laying down on your side - the housing is positioned outside of your ear when wearing them. Something like the RE-400 is less likely to give you trouble when laying on your side.
> 
> On the upside, the UE600s are very lightweight and don't seem to be particularly sensitive to insertion depth. With the included Complys and a shallower seal comfort is excellent.


 
   
  Thanks for the info.  The Solar's aren't particularly bass-heavy earphones, especially with the stock tips.  They have less bass quantity than something like the SE215, for example.  What about a Phonak Perfect Bass with black filters?


----------



## iRo-Fi

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The bass of the ES5 is really not bloated considering its quantity but if you're worried about that the JH13 or Miracle would be better options. I don't find either to be fatiguing. The Miracle is more laid-back and balanced while the JH13 has a few db of bass boost and a more forward presentation. Here's what I wrote previously regarding the JH13 vs Miracle:
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 
   
  I see. I guess i'll still look in all three, add UERM too and try to read a bit more. Best thing would be to fly over to next big audio show, try the demos and decide on the spot. Might even get discount this way. Thanks Joker.


----------



## Deviltooth

Quote: 





daleb said:


> The MH1Cs are sadly not available anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The Etymotics provide awesome isolation but even with comply tips they're still raping you ear... you need to go deep with them and over long periods of time (for me) this isn't comfortable.  You might want to look into customs.  Something designed for your ear specifically; I've found this makes IEM use possible for far longer than I could endure universals.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





deviltooth said:


> The Etymotics provide awesome isolation but even with comply tips they're still raping you ear... you need to go deep with them and over long periods of time (for me) this isn't comfortable.  You might want to look into customs.  Something designed for your ear specifically; I've found this makes IEM use possible for far longer than I could endure universals.


 

 Unless I can get customs for $60, I don't think this is happening


----------



## dnullify

Quote: 





daleb said:


> Unless I can get customs for $60, I don't think this is happening


 

  I find ety's very uncomfortable.
   
  http://hearingaccessories.ca/phonak-pfe012-high-quality-headphones.html
   
  bam
   
  insanely comfortable and they isolate pretty well.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> I find ety's very uncomfortable.
> 
> http://hearingaccessories.ca/phonak-pfe012-high-quality-headphones.html
> 
> ...


 

 That actually looks less comfortable to me then the etys... My last IEMs were the Meelctronic M9s, and those things felt like fire to my ears, maybe even worse. I'm thinking a deep insertion IEM would be less painful because they make much smaller tips for it, but I don't know.


----------



## Deviltooth

Quote: 





daleb said:


> That actually looks less comfortable to me then the etys... My last IEMs were the Meelctronic M9s, and those things felt like fire to my ears, maybe even worse. I'm thinking a deep insertion IEM would be less painful because they make much smaller tips for it, but I don't know.


 

 The Ety Kids model is cheap (on Amazon) and comes with very tiny deep insertion tri-flange tips..  They are volume limited and the sound is very 'flat/neutral'.  I find them more comfortable than my Etymotic HF2 but equally isolating.  Sound isn't as good but the price difference is substantial.


----------



## vocalist

Quote: 





daleb said:


> That actually looks less comfortable to me then the etys... My last IEMs were the Meelctronic M9s, and those things felt like fire to my ears, maybe even worse. I'm thinking a deep insertion IEM would be less painful because they make much smaller tips for it, but I don't know.


 
  never tried the Ety's but the PFE's are ridiculously comfortable as I have the PFE 232 and was planning to sell them but due to the openness of the soundstage and comfort, I'm really having a hard time letting them go.
   
  That brings me to a question: I was originally planning to trade the 232 for the Westone 4 but because of some sonic differences, I can't bring myself to do it.  I'm wondering if there's another universal that might give me what I'm looking for?   I love the 4 for the rich mids/vocals, cable, fit and overall sound though I wish they were a bit more open and a little more bass.  I love the PFE for the soundstage, fit and energy but sometimes the vocals are just a little thinner than I'd like - especially when talking about Adele, Amy Lee and other female vocals. I love both for classical though I'll admit that the 232 can be a tad fatiguing at times which is a problem I've never come across or even close to with the 4.  Should I just hold onto the 232 as being discontinued, there's no guarantee of getting them back?  Curious to get some thoughts - really don't have anywhere to audition iem's without driving about 2-ish hours but it is possible.  Main genres are Rock, Classical/Opera, Jazz and acoustic.


----------



## daleb

I'm also considering the Astrotec Am-90s. They are $40 on amazon, and they do have a 10/10 value on here... They have a 3.5 isolation rating, which should, under normal conditions, give me the isolation I need. Plus, it has a 4.5/5 rating on comfort. It seems to come with a ton of tips, so that's also nice.


----------



## dnullify

Quote: 





daleb said:


> That actually looks less comfortable to me then the etys... My last IEMs were the Meelctronic M9s, and those things felt like fire to my ears, maybe even worse. I'm thinking a deep insertion IEM would be less painful because they make much smaller tips for it, but I don't know.


 

 Well, the PFE comes with small tips. some of the best tips ever made, and the actual earphones are tiny, lightweight, and ergonomically shaped.
   
  Let me put it this way: they didn't name it the "Perfect Fit Earphone" for nothing.


----------



## Deviltooth

Quote: 





daleb said:


> I'm also considering the Astrotec Am-90s. They are $40 on amazon, and they do have a 10/10 value on here... They have a 3.5 isolation rating, which should, under normal conditions, give me the isolation I need. Plus, it has a 4.5/5 rating on comfort. It seems to come with a ton of tips, so that's also nice.


 

 I have the Astrotecs.  They're very smooth and with a Fiio E17 gain some extension (over being driven purely out of a clip).  The cable is among the best universal cables I've seen.  For the money I think it's damn good sound.  Isolation is middling and the foam tips they supplied will not stay on even with the (also supplied) little rubber sleeves.  The silicone tips are average.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Well, the PFE comes with small tips. some of the best tips ever made, and the actual earphones are tiny, lightweight, and ergonomically shaped.
> 
> Let me put it this way: they didn't name it the "Perfect Fit Earphone" for nothing.


 

 I went and checked his review, and they only got a 3 on isolation. That's the same as the M9s, which I would constantly jam as far into my head as I could go to block out the sound. I don't know if a 3.5 is enough either, hmm...
   
   
  Quote: 





> Isolation is middling


 
  How good is middling? I've only owned one IEM before (which I then instantly gave up on because of the horrible comfort issues), so I don't know how good that isolation is.


----------



## dnullify

Ah,
   
  Hmm, well i think you're in a bit of a pinch. Short of foam - which does apply pressure to your inner ear, i can't think of anything that both has a loose-comfortable fit AND isolation in your price range.
   
  Only thing i can think of is customs.... you can actually get silicone custom molded IEMs for ~$100.


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Ah,
> 
> Hmm, well i think you're in a bit of a pinch. Short of foam - which does apply pressure to your inner ear, i can't think of anything that both has a loose-comfortable fit AND isolation in your price range.
> 
> Only thing i can think of is customs.... you can actually get silicone custom molded IEMs for ~$100.


 

 Well, its also that with the IEMs I had, I only had one tip, and it was gigantic for my small ear canals (normally they come with more but the carrying case with all of them in it disappeared the day I bought it o.O).


----------



## dnullify

Ah, well I'd suggest you either give something else a shot, or pick up some comply tips and see if you're satisfied with the isolation those have on your current IEMs. 

At the very least that will give you a good picture as to what you should look for in your next pair


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Ah, well I'd suggest you either give something else a shot, or pick up some comply tips and see if you're satisfied with the isolation those have on your current IEMs.


 
  I don't have the IEMs anymore, sadly.
   
  I am _seriously_ considering the AM-90s, though.


----------



## ljokerl

For those interested VSonic GR07 and GR07 BE measurements, as well as a fresh review, are now available at InnerFidelity here.
   
  Quote: 





daleb said:


> The MH1Cs are sadly not available anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I still see some MH1s on ebay. Etymotics have the isolation but the generally deep insertion is not comfortable for some people. Also, they don't have warm sound.
   
   If getting Etys, would get a cheaper model (like the Etykids mentioned above) and leave room in your budget for foam tips. The Etykids only come with the glider tips and some triple-flanges. 
   
  Quote: 





jekostas said:


> Thanks for the info.  The Solar's aren't particularly bass-heavy earphones, especially with the stock tips.  They have less bass quantity than something like the SE215, for example.  What about a Phonak Perfect Bass with black filters?


 
   
  Yeah, the Perfect Bass should work. I would start out with the Green filters (the ones that come with the Perfect Bass) and move to the Black ones once you feel you want to sacrifice some more bass for clarity.
   
  Quote: 





vocalist said:


> never tried the Ety's but the PFE's are ridiculously comfortable as I have the PFE 232 and was planning to sell them but due to the openness of the soundstage and comfort, I'm really having a hard time letting them go.
> 
> That brings me to a question: I was originally planning to trade the 232 for the Westone 4 but because of some sonic differences, I can't bring myself to do it.  I'm wondering if there's another universal that might give me what I'm looking for?   I love the 4 for the rich mids/vocals, cable, fit and overall sound though I wish they were a bit more open and a little more bass.  I love the PFE for the soundstage, fit and energy but sometimes the vocals are just a little thinner than I'd like - especially when talking about Adele, Amy Lee and other female vocals. I love both for classical though I'll admit that the 232 can be a tad fatiguing at times which is a problem I've never come across or even close to with the 4.  Should I just hold onto the 232 as being discontinued, there's no guarantee of getting them back?  Curious to get some thoughts - really don't have anywhere to audition iem's without driving about 2-ish hours but it is possible.  Main genres are Rock, Classical/Opera, Jazz and acoustic.


 
   
  I would go for the W4 - it seems to suit your preferences a little better. It does have very nice mids and is less fatiguing than the PFE232. I also don't mind its soundstage - it might not have the airiness of the PFE but it's still quite versatile. It sounds like you've already tried them and got the same impressions, anyway. If you end up missing the Phonaks you could later on pick up a GR07, which has like 95% of the sound at 1/3 the price, later on. 
   
  Quote: 





daleb said:


> I'm also considering the Astrotec Am-90s. They are $40 on amazon, and they do have a 10/10 value on here... They have a 3.5 isolation rating, which should, under normal conditions, give me the isolation I need. Plus, it has a 4.5/5 rating on comfort. It seems to come with a ton of tips, so that's also nice.


 
   
  The AM-90 are good but I doubt they will solve your hypersensitivity problem. I would almost recommend the Soundmagic PL50 (do they still make those?) and some modified Shure Olives instead for the combination of lighter weight + less pressure from the tips.


----------



## waynes world

> Wall of fame...  Submitted by ljokerl on July 8, 2013 - 1:02am.
> 
> [size=14.44444465637207px]  While I am a long-time fan of the GR07s, I think they are a little too close in signature and performance to the Philips Fidelios that are on the Wall of Fame already. Usability-wise the GR07 wins, hands-down, and I slightly prefer its sound as well, *but I have plans to put a different VSonic product on the WoF in the future.*
> [/size]


 
   
  Awesome - I knew that the VSD1's would make it! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Just kidding - I don't have a clue which ones you are referring to of course (although I think the VSD1's are rather amazing for the price!).
   
  p.s. I hope it was OK to quote your comment here. If not, my apologies (and I will edit them out).


----------



## quartertone

Concerning the GR07's usability, I've never had great fit/comfort with them. The best result has been with some DIY tips out of earplug foam, which isn't ideal in terms of longevity... Also, the cable (MK I) only really behaves with the ear guides, though they're at least pleasantly small  and thin.


----------



## daleb

The SoundMagic PL50s are still available on Amazon! I don't know how I'd deal with stuff laying on the top of my ear, though (I wear IEMs cord down). So the AM90s don't come with any small tips? That's saddening...


----------



## dnullify

They come with 3 sizes of tips. I'm not sure what you mean by small.
   
  honestly the only way you're going to get the level of comfort and isolation you want is either with foam (shure olives, comply, ect), or with silicone customs.
   
  those black things on the pl50s are just ear hooks, which can be removed.


----------



## daleb

I'm more then willing to buy foam tips.
   
   
  According to the innerfidelity measurements, the AM90s have more then enough isolation for what I need. Are the numbers about right for your experience with them?


----------



## Deviltooth

Quote: 





daleb said:


> I'm more then willing to buy foam tips.
> 
> 
> According to the innerfidelity measurements, the AM90s have more then enough isolation for what I need. Are the numbers about right for your experience with them?


 
  That all depends on the tips you use.  The tips that come with AM90 are very average and none of them fit my small ear canals very well.


----------



## Bina

Hmm, how much will lime ears score in sound quality? Do you see them as step between 1964 v3 and high end models like miracle? I got interested when you described them as jh13-lite, which is something I'm looking for.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





waynes world said:


> Awesome - I knew that the VSD1's would make it!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I do think that the VSD1 is fantastic and deserving of recommendation, unless the VSD1S (is that the other version?) is somehow better. 
   
  Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Concerning the GR07's usability, I've never had great fit/comfort with them. The best result has been with some DIY tips out of earplug foam, which isn't ideal in terms of longevity... Also, the cable (MK I) only really behaves with the ear guides, though they're at least pleasantly small  and thin.


 
   
  The MKII cable is more pliable. The mkI works for me without ear guides only by tightening the cinch.
   
  Quote: 





daleb said:


> I'm more then willing to buy foam tips.
> 
> 
> According to the innerfidelity measurements, the AM90s have more then enough isolation for what I need. Are the numbers about right for your experience with them?


 
   
  The isolation is above average but beyond that it will depend on the fit/tips. Can't really say what it comes to out to in db.
   
  Quote: 





bina said:


> Hmm, how much will lime ears score in sound quality? Do you see them as step between 1964 v3 and high end models like miracle? I got interested when you described them as jh13-lite, which is something I'm looking for.


 

 I'm not settled on a score for the LE3 yet but it will probably be in the AKG K3003-FitEar MH334 range. It's a very neutral earphone, more so than the JH13 and 1964-V3 for sure.


----------



## MikuLover

Hmm after 300 hrs of burn with gr07 what will it sound like compared to the original out of the box sound???@


----------



## H20Fidelity

Ijokerl,

I left you a PM but I gather you're very busy.....

I have a question for you regarding VC1000 which you currently have heard to my understanding and GR01. I want to know if they share a similar tonality on the warm/cold spectrum, and if you still have both do you think think GR01 is that much ahead of the VC1000?

Basically, I really enjoyed VC1000 and have found GR01 for a good price, however in reviews for GR01 some members say they lean warm, (well warmer than B2 / DBA-02). If they're around the same tonality as VC1000 then that's fine to go ahead, . I've heard R-50 too if that helps to compare in anyway.


----------



## 23t23dS

Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> Ijokerl,
> 
> I left you a PM but I gather you're very busy.....
> 
> ...


 
   
  I would be very interested in a comparision between the VC1000, the GR01 and the R-50 as well.


----------



## daleb

So I found out today that the walls in the dorms I'll be staying in block absolutely no sound. Now I'm kind of considering the Etys with comply tips again...
   
  Edit: is there a difference sound wise between the old AM90s that came with the hard carrying case and the new one with the bag?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mikulover said:


> Hmm after 300 hrs of burn with gr07 what will it sound like compared to the original out of the box sound???@


 
   
  I had an mkI GR07 which seemed to smooth out a little over time (assuming I didn't just get used to it). The newer Bass Edition I had sounded pretty much the same out of the box.
   
   
  Quote: 





h20fidelity said:


> Ijokerl,
> 
> I left you a PM but I gather you're very busy.....
> 
> ...


 
   
  Sorry, I think I only replied to it today. I'll share the same info here:
   
  Quote: 





> The VC1000 is a little cooler (in tone) than the GR01 IMO. I am waiting to get my R-50 back from a loan so I can compare those two and get a better picture of where the VC1000 falls. So far I have only compared it to the Astrotec AX7 TWFK and it's not as bright as those (which is a good thing).
> 
> Oh and I really don't think you will find the GR01 overly warm - they are warmer than other TWFKs, but that's not saying a whole lot.
> 
> My preliminary thought is that the GR01 isn't really worth the $$$ over the VC1000, but I'm still not set on that.


 
    
  Quote:


daleb said:


> Edit: is there a difference sound wise between the old AM90s that came with the hard carrying case and the new one with the bag?


 
   
  Not a clue. Mine had a case and a bunch of tips. What does it come with now?


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Not a clue. Mine had a case and a bunch of tips. What does it come with now?


 

   
  I believe one of the pairs is foam, but I'm not quite sure.
   
  I have to order something tomorrow or they won't arrive in time before I leave. Tomorrow is going to be fun


----------



## zubin111

Hi Joker... Based on your recommendation i recieved the LG Quadbeat, and on an initial impression i am pretty impressed... Its much airier than the Gr06, but i just dont  get the point of those stupid ear tips with them!! Not sure what they were thinking!! As these are also the Nexus 4 ofiicial headphones from the play store, many people crib about its non-bass nature but thats just the wrong fit with those tips. Changing to foams or Sony hybrids brings out the best in them!! Still burning in so lets see how it shapes out.... Anyways i have also ordered an MH1C (Just cant get over the hype train...), it should be good comparison with them... Again thanks for the awesome recommendation.... I am sure you're gonna lighten up my wallet even more....


----------



## phantompersona

Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker... Based on your recommendation i recieved the LG Quadbeat, and on an initial impression i am pretty impressed... Its much airier than the Gr06, but i just dont  get the point of those stupid ear tips with them!! Not sure what they were thinking!! As these are also the Nexus 4 ofiicial headphones from the play store, many people crib about its non-bass nature but thats just the wrong fit with those tips. Changing to foams or Sony hybrids brings out the best in them!! Still burning in so lets see how it shapes out.... Anyways i have also ordered an MH1C (Just cant get over the hype train...), it should be good comparison with them... Again thanks for the awesome recommendation.... I am sure you're gonna lighten up my wallet even more....


 
  didn't realize they were available from the playstore! Thats nice to know.


----------



## zubin111

Quote: 





phantompersona said:


> didn't realize they were available from the playstore! Thats nice to know.


 

 Well, there is a slight difference, afaik, playstore has the model hs-400 and the newer quadbeat which i have is 420 model. Supposedly, they are slightly better than the 400 one...


----------



## MikuLover

I am starting to feel that the gr07 don't deserve a 9.1 rating for sound. Even though I am using the MKII instead I feel that the quality is not there. Since the only difference with the original and MKII is just the cabling.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daleb said:


> I believe one of the pairs is foam, but I'm not quite sure.
> 
> I have to order something tomorrow or they won't arrive in time before I leave. Tomorrow is going to be fun


 
   
  Thanks for the pic. I'll have to update the review. Pretty sure the gray ones are the foam tips (they are a harder type of foam compared to Complys for example). It appears they've also gotten rid of the triple-flanges 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker... Based on your recommendation i recieved the LG Quadbeat, and on an initial impression i am pretty impressed... Its much airier than the Gr06, but i just dont  get the point of those stupid ear tips with them!! Not sure what they were thinking!! As these are also the Nexus 4 ofiicial headphones from the play store, many people crib about its non-bass nature but thats just the wrong fit with those tips. Changing to foams or Sony hybrids brings out the best in them!! Still burning in so lets see how it shapes out.... Anyways i have also ordered an MH1C (Just cant get over the hype train...), it should be good comparison with them... Again thanks for the awesome recommendation.... I am sure you're gonna lighten up my wallet even more....


 
   
  That's a good point about people shelving (or worse) the Quadbeat because they don't know any better than to accept the poor fit with the stock tips. That makes me sad


----------



## daleb

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks for the pic. I'll have to update the review. Pretty sure the gray ones are the foam tips (they are a harder type of foam compared to Complys for example). It appears they've also gotten rid of the triple-flanges


 
   
  According to the product description, the tri-flanges are gone, but it still says they have a blue foam tip...
   
  Edit: How about the *dB Logic EP-100?* they are only $15 now, so they could be a pretty simple impulse buy. They have a 3.5 in isolation and a 4.5 in comfort, plus they are small so that works well with my ears.. A pack of Shure Olives would also do some good.
  Edit2: Can you wear those facing down?
   
  Edit3: A few reviews are saying these can't block out anything... Why would they say that? I think they don't know what they're talking about 
   
  Edit4: Ended up getting them in blue.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





daleb said:


> According to the product description, the tri-flanges are gone, but it still says they have a blue foam tip...
> 
> Edit: How about the *dB Logic EP-100?* they are only $15 now, so they could be a pretty simple impulse buy. They have a 3.5 in isolation and a 4.5 in comfort, plus they are small so that works well with my ears.. A pack of Shure Olives would also do some good.
> Edit2: Can you wear those facing down?
> ...


 

 Lol...
   
  They are best worn over-the-ear although I think you can wear them down if your ears are small. You'll want the Olives as well (either small or medium) because the stock tips are deep insertion and not something I'd recommend for sensitive canals.


----------



## MikuLover

Quote: 





mikulover said:


> I am starting to feel that the gr07 don't deserve a 9.1 rating for sound. Even though I am using the MKII instead I feel that the quality is not there. Since the only difference with the original and MKII is just the cabling.


 
  Bump


----------



## Exesteils

mikulover said:


> Bump




Why the bump? Seriously. Your previous post had no inquiry in it, which is probably why Joker didn't reply to it(or he could have just missed it). Either way, it's just your opinion on the Gr07's SQ rating. Maybe actually present a question instead of just "bump"?


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





exesteils said:


> Why the bump? Seriously. Your previous post had no inquiry in it, which is probably why Joker didn't reply to it(or he could have just missed it). Either way, it's just your opinion on the Gr07's SQ rating. Maybe actually present a question instead of just "bump"?


 
  +1.
  joker says in the first page of this thread, 3rd sentence is: "The observations reflect my personal experience with each earphone and should be taken as such - audio, after all, is extremely subjective."


----------



## Gryphus0204

Hi Joker sorry to bother you again. I'm looking for an upgrade from my Gr07. But i also dug out my old MeeElec M6, which i found that i preferred the M6 sound signature better to the Gr07. I'm looking for something with a good treble energy but with a balancing of something like the M6. And here's a few I've shortlisted
  1. V-moda M100
  2. 1964-V3
  3. Heir Audio 4.0
   
  So what are you're recommendations? I have a budget of around... 500 USD. And getting the V3 might be troublesome as I'm not from the USA. Is the V3 worth the hassle? I would be playing from the Fiio X3 without a Amp


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mikulover said:


> Bump


 
   
  Please do not bump meaningless posts. Your post has no content for me to reply to. You don't mention your grievances, how long you've had them, what other earphones you've compared them to, your source, music, etc. I have no idea where you are coming from with that. Ergo, no response. You are free to publish a review of the GR07 to address any issues you have with it. Actually, I would encourage that. But please do not clog up my thread with junk. 
   
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Hi Joker sorry to bother you again. I'm looking for an upgrade from my Gr07. But i also dug out my old MeeElec M6, which i found that i preferred the M6 sound signature better to the Gr07. I'm looking for something with a good treble energy but with a balancing of something like the M6. And here's a few I've shortlisted
> 1. V-moda M100
> 2. 1964-V3
> 3. Heir Audio 4.0
> ...


 

 The M6 has more recessed mids and generally more bass than the GR07. Is that what you like about it? It would help if I had some idea of the direction you want to go with the signature. The V3 definitely does not have more recessed mids than the GR07, for example. Also, I have not heard the M100 or the 4.0 - sorry.


----------



## ToneDeafNoob

Hi Joker, great work as always. I bought the Astrotec AM-800 on your recommendation and I am quite pleased with them. However, my one grievance with them is that they don't come with smaller tips (is this the right word? lol). Do you have any recommendation for smaller tips that I can buy for more comfort. Thanks again!


----------



## Gryphus0204

Oh sorry. Hmm I would prefer a very fun, engaging and lively IEM or CIEM. But still maintaining a decent level of accuracy and instrument separation, if possible similar to the Gr07. I would say mids are the vital point of my preference, but without a lack of bass like the problem i have with the Gr07. I read your review on the 1964 V3, and it seems like the CIEM that I should go for next, but is there any alternatives? ( Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume mids are the instruments and certain male vocals, and highs are female voices and other high pitch sounding instruments right?)
   
  And also,I've also always wondered about reshelling+ driver adding for my Gr07. As far as I know, Rooth has a local distributor in my country that reshells and add drivers for a decent price. What do you think about this?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tonedeafnoob said:


> Hi Joker, great work as always. I bought the Astrotec AM-800 on your recommendation and I am quite pleased with them. However, my one grievance with them is that they don't come with smaller tips (is this the right word? lol). Do you have any recommendation for smaller tips that I can buy for more comfort. Thanks again!


 
   
  Sony Hybrids fit the AM-800, are a bit softer than the stock tips, and come in both S and XS sizes. 
   
  Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Oh sorry. Hmm I would prefer a very fun, engaging and lively IEM or CIEM. But still maintaining a decent level of accuracy and instrument separation, if possible similar to the Gr07. I would say mids are the vital point of my preference, but without a lack of bass like the problem i have with the Gr07. I read your review on the 1964 V3, and it seems like the CIEM that I should go for next, but is there any alternatives? ( Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume mids are the instruments and certain male vocals, and highs are female voices and other high pitch sounding instruments right?)
> 
> And also,I've also always wondered about reshelling+ driver adding for my Gr07. As far as I know, Rooth has a local distributor in my country that reshells and add drivers for a decent price. What do you think about this?


 

 Well, the V3 is lively and engaging and has more bass impact than the GR07. I don't find the GR07 lacking personally but hey, that's why there's a Bass Edition. The other CIEMs I've tried in that price range all have less bass and aren't as forward as the V3. If you want to go up in price there are other options - the Westone ES5, for example. 
   
  See here for a handy (and approximate) chart of what instruments cover what frequencies: http://reaktorplayer.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/freq-chart.jpg 
   
  As for the GR07 reshell, I've never gotten any of my earphones reshelled, never mind a dynamic-driver one with an added driver, so I have no idea if that would make sense. Unless they add a crossover I don't see it working all that well as the GR07 is a full-range earphone.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Oh........... Wow. Heheh maybe it is worth that hassle after all. Thanks joker! You're always a great help


----------



## ljokerl

Added the T-Peos H-100
   
   
*(2B22) T-Peos H-100*


Added Jul 2013

 Details: BA-dynamic hybrid from Korea-based T-Peos
 Current Price: est. *$120 *from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $170)
 Specs: Driver: _BA+Dynamic Hybrid_ | Imp: _32Ω_ | Sens: _101 dB_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' I-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock single-flanges_ 
 Wear Style: _Straight down or *over-the-ear*_

 Accessories *(5/5) *– Single-flange hybrid-style (4 sizes) and foam-stuffed (4 sizes) silicone tips, foam tips, lanyard, airline adapter, cleaning tool, and padded zippered carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* – The construction is above average, with sturdy metal housings bearing engraved T-Peos logos at the rear. They don’t look particularly elegant but should last. The cables are plasticky near the housings but become much thicker and gain a nylon sheath below the y-split. Mild driver flex is present
 Isolation *(3.5/5)* – Isolation is above average
 Microphonics *(4/5)* – Can be bothersome with cable-down wear; nonexistent when worn over-the-ear
 Comfort *(4/5) *– The metal housings of the H-100 are not particularly light or compact, but they have a smooth and ear-friendly shape that isn’t bothersome in long-term listening. The stock tips are of good quality

 Sound *(8.7/10)* – The T-Peos H-100 is part of the still-rare breed of reasonably-priced hybrid earphones. I’ve reviewed and/or auditioned a few others in this price range – the old UE Super.Fi 5EB, the Scosche IEM856MD, and the Audiofly AF78. None of those were particularly impressive so the T-Peos H-100, with its bright, crisp sound and added sub-bass kick, sort of defaults to being the best of the bunch.

 The sound of the H-100 is rather unique, with the overall tone on the cool and bright side but plenty of deep bass kick afforded by the dynamic driver. Bass depth and presence are quite impressive, but not excessive – the sub-bass extends well and affords the bright sound some footing. There is little mid-bass boost, however, and almost no mid-bass bloat. This makes the deep bass seem more prominent and also prevents veiling of the midrange.

 The midrange and treble seem to be handled by the armature of the H-100, with the signature being v-shaped overall. The mids, especially the lower mids, appear a little thin and withdrawn, reminding me of JVC’s FX40 model. Many BA-based earphones, such as the VSonic VC1000, MEElectronics A161P, and Ultimate Ears 600 - not to mention dynamic-driver competitors - have more filled-in and prominent mids compared to the thinner-sounding H-100.

 The treble of the H-100 is bright but not overbearing at reasonable volume levels. It sounds clean and crisp and boasts plenty of energy and sparkle, yet isn’t as harsh as may be expected. The H-100 is less prone to sibilance than several of my VSonic earphones and lacks the graininess of the MEElec A161P, for example. The bright treble gives the sound an added clarity – the same principle used by the JVC FX40 and PureSound ClarityOne. In fact, despite its bass boost and recessed mids, the H-100 has very intelligible vocals and works well at low volumes.

 The presentation of the H-100 is wide and spacious, as tends to be the case with earphones that share these types of v-shaped signatures. The soundstage is good overall and the sound is very airy, making earphones such as the VSonic VC1000 and MEElec A161P sound quite intimate in comparison. Soundstage depth isn’t great, however, and the earphone doesn’t produce properly centered vocals the way a less mid-recessed set, such as the A161P, can.


*Select Comparisons:*

_HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)_

 HiFiMan’s latest mid-range offering combines a balanced sound with a compact, user-friendly form factor and sub-$100 price tag. Next to the v-shaped sound signature of the H-100, the RE-400 sounds very well-balanced, perhaps even a little mid-centric. The H-100, on the other hand, lacks midrange weight and sounds a little “hollow” in comparison. It has significantly better deep bass presence but also more treble than the HiFiMan. The added treble results in a brighter overall tone compared to the more neutral and natural RE-400, but also causes the H-100 to appear clearer, akin to using a treble boost equalizer setting. Naturally, the brighter H-100 is more revealing of sibilance and overall less forgiving than the smoother RE-400.

 The H-100 does have an advantage in soundstage width, appearing a lot more spacious and less intimate than the HiFiMan set. All in all, these two earphones sound vastly different and make each other sound bad in comparison – after listening to the RE-400, the H-100 sounds overly bright and hollow in the midrange. Switching back to the RE-400 after using the H-100 makes the HiFiMan sound overly intimate and lacking in bass depth.

_VSonic GR07 ($179)_

 VSonic’s dynamic-driver GR07, like the HiFiMan RE-400, follows a rather balanced sound signature but, due to its greater bass depth and treble sparkle, does not sound like a complete antithesis to the T-Peos the way the RE-400 does. Admittedly, the GR07 is still quite a bit flatter than the H-100, offering up a sound that is less bright and more coherent, but it doesn't sound downright mid-centric in comparison.
   
  The tone of the GR07 is warmer than that of the T-Peos due to its greater emphasis on mid-bass and less subbass quantity. It is also thicker in the midrange and again makes the T-Peos sound a bit hollow with its thinner, more withdrawn mids. The bright treble of the H-100 gives vocals good clarity and intelligibility but ultimately the sound is thin and not entirely natural. Interestingly, though the H-100 is brighter, the GR07 is still more prone to sibilance. Overall, I found the pricier GR07 to be better than the T-Peos for its more accurate and natural sound, though when listening to EDM music the H-100 makes a very strong case for itself and may even be preferable to the VSonics.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– The T-Peos H-100 is a BA+dynamic hybrid earphone with a rather unique sound signature. V-shaped, with an emphasis on subbass and treble, the H-100 sounds bright, but with a sizable deep bass kick. It reminds me of a more refined JVC HA-FX40, and like the FX40 provides a uniquely lively experience with EDM. With very nice packaging and an all-around competent design, the H-100 is a standout in value as well, as long as its signature meshes well with the listener.

*Pros: Good clarity, strong subbass, and a spacious and airy sound; packaged like a higher-end product
 Cons: Lacks a bit of midrange presence and thickness*


----------



## Towwers

Hi joker!

What's the difference between the GR07 bass edition vs GR07 MK2? You mentioned in a previous comment that one of these share 95% similarities with the Phonak audeo PFE232 which I can't afford. But I can afford the gr07! What would you recommend me? I want to try the sound signature of the PFE232 but at a more affordable price.

Thank you!


----------



## yalper

joker, wish you have reviewed t-peos h200 too


----------



## quartertone

Interesting that joker and ClieOs have both given the H-100 very favourable reviews, considering how much criticism it drew from some quarters.


----------



## zubin111

Hi Joker, based on what i have, (Quadbeat, MH1C, GR06, VSD1, in future may be 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 (re-400)), does Comply t-400 fit all of these? or i need to get different ones for each?? Its cheaper to buy any one type of multiple quantity....


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





towwers said:


> Hi joker!
> 
> What's the difference between the GR07 bass edition vs GR07 MK2? You mentioned in a previous comment that one of these share 95% similarities with the Phonak audeo PFE232 which I can't afford. But I can afford the gr07! What would you recommend me? I want to try the sound signature of the PFE232 but at a more affordable price.
> 
> Thank you!


 
   
  The difference is (surprise surprise) bass quantity but the bass has some additional effects - it makes the midrange of Bass Edition sound more recessed in comparison to that of the regular GR07, for example. See paragraphs 4-5 here for more info. The Bass Edition has a little more mid-bass punch than a PFE232 with my preferred (gray) filters. The GR07 has a little less bass overall. IMO it's more about how much bass you want instead of which matches the 232 better, because they are both pretty close. 
   
  Quote: 





yalper said:


> joker, wish you have reviewed t-peos h200 too


 
   
  Someday 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Interesting that joker and ClieOs have both given the H-100 very favourable reviews, considering how much criticism it drew from some quarters.


 
   
  Well, it's not without issues but if you get past the sound signature if performs on-par with a lot of good earphones. In A:B comparisons it really did make the RE-400 sound pretty bad, and vice versa. It was a hard call to say which is "better" overall because they are so different, and I am sure there are many who will love the sound of the T-Peos 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
   
  Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker, based on what i have, (Quadbeat, MH1C, GR06, VSD1, in future may be
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I don't think the T-400 fits on any of those except the Quadbeat and RE-400. VSonics have a tricky nozzle, they take a T-200 but it's a little loose for my liking. The MH1C seems be somewhere between a T-200 and T-100. The T-200 is definitely too loose on it.


----------



## Tyow

Could you do a review on the MEElectronics M-duo? http://www.ifans.com/blog/86501/


----------



## stimer

*Vsonic VSD9 will compete sennheiser IE800, akg K3003, the cost will be 550$ usa *
   
   
Vsonic VSD 3 will have a sound level shure se535, westone 4, Sony MDR-EX1000
 [url=http://i40.tinypic.com/wk3i2o.jpg%5B/IMG]http://i40.tinypic.com/wk3i2o.jpg[/IMG[/url]][/font]
 [font=verdana] [IMG][url=http://i41.tinypic.com/wbdqxi.jpg%5B/IMG]http://i41.tinypic.com/wbdqxi.jpg[/IMG[/url]][/font]
 [font=verdana]  [/font]
 [font=verdana] Vsonic VSD7/VSD9[/font]
 [font=verdana] [IMG][url=http://i41.tinypic.com/4l2dyq.jpg%5B/IMG]http://i41.tinypic.com/4l2dyq.jpg[/IMG[/url]][/font]


----------



## Towwers

That red color with red cables inside is NUTS!!


----------



## daleb

So I received my IEM today... How do I put it in and take it out? I've seen that it involves pulling on the top of the ear but I don't exactly understand what I should be doing.


----------



## stimer

They will be red, blue, yellow, transparent, many colors


----------



## daleb

So, I decided to switch over to the bigger tips, and use it as a shallow insert, instead. So, these things are actually comfortable (and it turns out I can wear them over ear)! Two things, though. The cable seems really weak, and easily breakable. I hope these last for at least a while.
   
  Two, are the normal tips (the type used in flanges) supposed to be itchy? These make the inside of my ear itchy somehow. I had this problem with my last IEM, but I thought if was caused by them putting so much pressure on my ear canal.
   
  I'll find out tomorrow how much they isolate. I hope these work well!
   
  Edit: I still have problems with taking IEMs out. I can't figure out how to make it so the era drum isn't pulled on from the change in air pressure...


----------



## airomjosh

hi joker, nice review of t-peos h-100. do you consider T-peos h-100 and RE-400 a big upgrade coming from VSD1?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tyow said:


> Could you do a review on the MEElectronics M-duo? http://www.ifans.com/blog/86501/


 
   
  Don't have one at the moment. Maybe in the future.
   
  Quote: 





stimer said:


> *Vsonic VSD9 will compete sennheiser IE800, akg K3003, the cost will be 550$ usa *
> 
> 
> Vsonic VSD 3 will have a sound level shure se535, westone 4, Sony MDR-EX1000
> ...


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, Sounds the TF10 a little hollow?


----------



## jekostas

Quote: 





daleb said:


> So, I decided to switch over to the bigger tips, and use it as a shallow insert, instead. So, these things are actually comfortable (and it turns out I can wear them over ear)! Two things, though. The cable seems really weak, and easily breakable. I hope these last for at least a while.
> 
> Two, are the normal tips (the type used in flanges) supposed to be itchy? These make the inside of my ear itchy somehow. I had this problem with my last IEM, but I thought if was caused by them putting so much pressure on my ear canal.
> 
> ...


 
   
  If you've tried pulling the tip of your earlobe away and it isn't working, try pushing the back of your ear, right where the canal entry would be.  This is another way to break the ear canal seal.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





stimer said:


> *Vsonic VSD9 will compete sennheiser IE800, akg K3003, the cost will be 550$ usa *
> 
> 
> Vsonic VSD 3 will have a sound level shure se535, westone 4, Sony MDR-EX1000
> ...


----------



## RugaL

Hello everyone!
   
  I'm looking for an iem with a very long cable, about 2-3 meters (8' or more inches). I'm not interested in using an extension cord. Anyone know some model with this specs?
   
  Thanks a lot, guys!


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





rugal said:


> Hello everyone!
> 
> I'm looking for an iem with a very long cable, about 2-3 meters (8' or more inches). I'm not interested in using an extension cord. Anyone know some model with this specs?
> 
> Thanks a lot, guys!


 
  iSK SEM5 and SEM6 have 3m cables but I don't know how they sound.


----------



## daleb

The EP-100s block out a good amount of sound. It makes me happy


----------



## Harijs

Joker, would the H-100 be an upgrade to TF10? How would you compare these three:
  TF10 ; H-100 and FX-700
  Which is better for dubstep and EDM?
  I always use an amp.
  Thanks.


----------



## RugaL

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> iSK SEM5 and SEM6 have 3m cables but I don't know how they sound.


 
   
  Thanks for the help, kova4a!
   
  I'll look at them!


----------



## Sweden

Really looking forward to the upcoming reviews of Triple.Fi 10, IE800, S1/S2, 7550!
  A bit sad you won't include the Dirac DSP corrected XTZ EarPhone-12.
  The technology have great potential.
   
  Would be interesting to see CK100Pro, Stagediver SD-2/3 and JH13 Pro added to the list.


----------



## BluePhoenixHD

Hope this is okay to post here. First off, thank you for all the information/review of the IEM's. I am looking for a balanced/warm/neutral set of IEM"s that are comfortable. Problem is the budget, just $30. =P I was thinking of trying to get the Vsonic GR99, if I can find it. Or a Nuforce NE-600X. Any suggestions out there? If this is not a good place to post, please, Moderator or Admin delete it. =D Posted in the Introductions, Help and Recommendations Sub-Forum.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rugal said:


> Hello everyone!
> 
> I'm looking for an iem with a very long cable, about 2-3 meters (8' or more inches). I'm not interested in using an extension cord. Anyone know some model with this specs?
> 
> Thanks a lot, guys!


 
   
  I haven't come across any, personally. Closest in my collection would be a detachable-cable IEM and the Westone 64" cord. 
   
  Quote: 





bola 7 said:


> Joker, Sounds the TF10 a little hollow?


 
   
  Not compared to the H-100, at least not to my ears. I think the mid-bass emphasis helps in the case of the TF10, keeping the overall fullness of the sound good.
   
  Quote: 





daleb said:


> The EP-100s block out a good amount of sound. It makes me happy


 
   
   Great 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





harijs said:


> Joker, would the H-100 be an upgrade to TF10? How would you compare these three:
> TF10 ; H-100 and FX-700
> Which is better for dubstep and EDM?
> I always use an amp.
> Thanks.


 
   
  Not really an upgrade - the H-100 and TF10 are about on the same level IMO. The H-100 is more v-shaped to me, brighter, and emphasizes subbass over midbass. The TF10 has more mid-bass and isn't as bright. Also, the note thickness is more uniform and the overall tone is warmer. If you can afford it and don't mind the (lack of) isolation, I would go for the FX700 still - it's just very coherent and powerful with those dynamic drivers. Otherwise, it really depends on whether you want the H-100 for more of a wow factor (plenty of subbass, wide soundstage, bright and clear sound, etc) or the more restrained TF10. 
   
  Quote: 





sweden said:


> Really looking forward to the upcoming reviews of Triple.Fi 10, IE800, S1/S2, 7550!
> A bit sad you won't include the Dirac DSP corrected XTZ EarPhone-12.
> The technology have great potential.
> 
> Would be interesting to see CK100Pro, Stagediver SD-2/3 and JH13 Pro added to the list.


 
   
  If the XTZ had an Android DSP app I'd give it another try. Without any correction it sounds pretty meh. 
   
  I do have a JH13Pro that will be added eventually. It's one of my favorite CIEMs.
   
  Quote: 





bluephoenixhd said:


> Hope this is okay to post here. First off, thank you for all the information/review of the IEM's. I am looking for a balanced/warm/neutral set of IEM"s that are comfortable. Problem is the budget, just $30. =P I was thinking of trying to get the Vsonic GR99, if I can find it. Or a Nuforce NE-600X. Any suggestions out there? If this is not a good place to post, please, Moderator or Admin delete it. =D Posted in the Introductions, Help and Recommendations Sub-Forum.


 

 The GR99 is not very neutral but it's a solid earphone for the money. I would actually recommend the LG Quadbeat over it though if you don't mind a slightly v-shaped sound. It's more neutral than the GR99 overall and sounds very good for the $25-30 it runs on eBay. Only caveat is that you might have to invest in some aftermarket eartips because the stock ones aren't great, but with some planning you can still stay within a $30 budget.


----------



## Thr0waway

Hey joker, can you confirm that this is the Vsonic GR02 and not the R02 ProII?: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-Silver-Earphones-Earbuds-iPhones/dp/B005EM9KRI
  They claim it is the GR02 but it has a weird name "VSONIC GR02 Pro GR-02 Silver Cord Earphones."
   
  Some other questions:
  • Is this "silver cable edition" GR02 the same as the GR02 Bass Edition?
   
  • Is the sound quality of the GR02 Bass Edition better than the Id America Spark ($30)? I'm looking for a pair of V-shape signiture IEM no more than $40 to replace my broken Id America Sparks and I was wondering whether the GR02 Bass Edition would be the best option.


----------



## FlySweep

ljokerl said:


> I do have a JH13Pro that will be added eventually. It's one of my favorite CIEMs.




I have a JH13Pro FP now, so a review isn't "needed" (for me), but nevertheless, I always look forward to reading your reviews. Hope your JH13 review will be one of the lengthier ones (with it's own thread)... I think it deserves that kind of space so you can (deservedly) wax poetic on it. LOL.

The JH13Pro is one of the few phones that, IMO, has _entirely/I] lived up to the hype (for me anyways). You and the other IF folks nailed the review on it. I'm finding it damn hard to identify a glaring weakness.. let alone a subtle one._


----------



## Zelda

Joker, very good review of the H-100.!
   
  apart from the sound score, they seem similar to the FXD80 overall. but what are their differences?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thr0waway said:


> Hey joker, can you confirm that this is the Vsonic GR02 and not the R02 ProII?: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-Silver-Earphones-Earbuds-iPhones/dp/B005EM9KRI
> They claim it is the GR02 but it has a weird name "VSONIC GR02 Pro GR-02 Silver Cord Earphones."
> 
> Some other questions:
> ...


 
   
  I can't. Someone has asked before about that same link and the images are quite confusing. A few of them show the GR02 BE for sure but one of the shots is of the old R02 ProII. Perhaps someone who purchased from that seller would know for sure but I can't tell with any certainty from the photos.
   
  The Silver Cable GR02 is not the Bass Edition as far as I know. The ones I've tried are
  -The old R02 ProII Silver (this is what I think of when someone says GR02 Silver Cable). It has a silver and black housing.
  -The GR02 Bass Edition, which has a slightly more yellowish/gold hue to it
  -The new R02 Silver, which has a gray, all-plastic housing and is easy to tell apart from the others
   
  As for the GR02 BE vs id America Spark, they are about on-par sound-wise. The GR02 is a bit more balanced and has better bass control and treble extension. The Spark has a deeper v-shape and boomier, more club-type sound to it. 
   
   
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> I have a JH13Pro FP now, so a review isn't "needed" (for me), but nevertheless, I always look forward to reading your reviews. Hope your JH13 review will be one of the lengthier ones (with it's own thread)... I think it deserves that kind of space so you can (deservedly) wax poetic on it. LOL.
> 
> The JH13Pro is one of the few phones that, IMO, has _entirely/I] lived up to the hype (for me anyways). You and the other IF folks nailed the review on it. I'm finding it damn hard to identify a glaring weakness.. let alone a subtle one._


 
   
  Right, I was expecting it to fall short of what I'd read about it as well but it surpassed my expectations. That in itself was almost disappointing 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





zelda said:


> Joker, very good review of the H-100.!
> 
> apart from the sound score, they seem similar to the FXD80 overall. but what are their differences?


 
   
  They are not too different IMO. The biggest difference would probably be that the FXD80 is bassier and a little warmer. Just more presence in the mid-bass region. I also didn't find it quite as bright as the H-100.


----------



## stimer

Quote: 





thr0waway said:


> Hey joker, can you confirm that this is the Vsonic GR02 and not the R02 ProII?: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-Silver-Earphones-Earbuds-iPhones/dp/B005EM9KRI
> They claim it is the GR02 but it has a weird name "VSONIC GR02 Pro GR-02 Silver Cord Earphones."
> 
> Some other questions:
> ...


 
  lendmeurears official dealer, you will have guarantee maintenance.


----------



## SaigonGrandFunk

Hello Joker,
 Thanks for the nice work and informative Multi IEM review.
 When possible could you test out the XBA-40 with the tips below, I think these are Re0/Zero black tips.
  Having these tips on I found the XBA40 sounds as good or better than EX1000. (Amped with arrow 4G) XBA40 has EX1000 like timbre with better layering and 3D sound.
  Interesting to see how you will find its performance compared to EX1000 or good IEM like Westone 4, as I am still pondering about Westone 4xxx or something better than EX1000 so your finding will be very helpful  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Thr0waway

If I listen to "dubstep" that has bass and high vocals, kpop that has a bass beat and vocal both male (mid/treble) and female (treble), and rap that has bass and "vocal" that ranges from bass to treble depending on the song would I be better off with V-shaped, balanced, or some other sound signature?
   
  Edit: Also you said that "The GR02 is a bit more balanced and has better bass control and treble extension." Would this mean that the GR02 does not have a very deep V-shaped sound signature? I guess I enjoy the V-shape sound signature but I don't want the mids to be too recessed.


----------



## daleb

You'd want something bassy, of course. For me, personally, dubstep requires a strong treble. V shaped is great for dubstep. Vocals are mid and treble focused. A strong treble (with a v shape) would make the vocals strong, but not very smooth. It depends on how you enjoy your music. V shaped is the most likely to work in your favor, though.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





saigongrandfunk said:


> Hello Joker,
> Thanks for the nice work and informative Multi IEM review.
> When possible could you test out the XBA-40 with the tips below, I think these are Re0/Zero black tips.
> Having these tips on I found the XBA40 sounds as good or better than EX1000. (Amped with arrow 4G) XBA40 has EX1000 like timbre with better layering and 3D sound.
> ...


 
   
  Sorry, I don't have an XBA-40
   
  Quote: 





thr0waway said:


> If I listen to "dubstep" that has bass and high vocals, kpop that has a bass beat and vocal both male (mid/treble) and female (treble), and rap that has bass and "vocal" that ranges from bass to treble depending on the song would I be better off with V-shaped, balanced, or some other sound signature?
> 
> Edit: Also you said that "The GR02 is a bit more balanced and has better bass control and treble extension." Would this mean that the GR02 does not have a very deep V-shaped sound signature? I guess I enjoy the V-shape sound signature but I don't want the mids to be too recessed.


 

 If you don't want the mids too recessed that means you are looking for a shallow v-shape like the GR02. With a deeper v-shape you get more recessed mids. Anyway, I think the GR02BE will work well for you.


----------



## tomscy2000

Any comments on the SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro?
   
  They measure well (but high THD; most of the Sonion 23XX series do), and I'm almost sure they use the Sonion 2359, which is a nice choice.
   
  The Audio-Technica ATH-CK70PRO uses the same driver, and while it wasn't a world beater, I liked it, mostly. However, the CK70PRO will differ in FR because it uses a tapered acoustic horn and uses custom foam damping instead of the standard dampers from KA/S.
   
  At any rate, I'm pegging it as a good mainstream buy (look forward to Black Friday for this thing), and as a good "gateway IEM" for casual listeners to get into hi-fi. It has the trendy flat cables (but only below the Y-Split (?), which is good) and all that jazz, and gamers will like it because of the brand. Good product planning on SteelSeries' part.
   
  At the same time, people in Asia should probably take a look at the CK70PRO, which is being heavily discounted (at least in Japan). It's <$70 at the moment, which would make it a steal. Add on some forwarding fees, at it should still be less than the Flux Pro. It's certainly one of the most overlooked IEMs to come out this side of the International Date Line.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Any comments on the SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro?
> 
> They measure well (but high THD; most of the Sonion 23XX series do), and I'm almost sure they use the Sonion 2359, which is a nice choice.
> 
> ...


 

 They sound good, no doubt about that. I did some quick A:Bs with some of the entry-level single-armatures I like - the UE 600 and MEElec A161P - and they about held their ground. Don't know if I would recommend it over those in general since there are some odd design choices like the modular plug with proprietary connector, but it's a solid buy and surprisingly on the balanced end of the spectrum for something from a "gaming" company.
   
  I also quite like the regular Flux, the dynamic-driver one. It's a lot cheaper and seems to really get into the value-for-money territory. That one will get a review.


----------



## davidcotton

Hi joker

Would you happen to know the driver used inside the klipsch x10i by any chance please?

Thanks


----------



## enyls

Hi,
   
  I'm extremely new to IEMs and am looking to buy one for around 130 dollars max. I've been looking at the Brainwavz B2, Re--400, a-jays(the five is coming out soon, should I wait for that one do you think?), Shure 215 and audio technicas, and the velodyne vpulse. 
   
  I like to listen to rap(jayz, kanye), all the pop songs on the radio, rock(rhcp), alternative. I do like bass, but don't like it to be overpowering. 
   
  What can you suggest?
   
  thanks


----------



## lwien

RE-400's.


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





lwien said:


> RE-400's.


 
  +1


----------



## TheGame21x

Another vote for the RE-400 here.


----------



## thesuperguy

Yet another vote for dem 400s.
   
  Looks like it's unanimous.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Hi joker
> 
> Would you happen to know the driver used inside the klipsch x10i by any chance please?
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  One of the Klipsch KG drivers. I was under the impression Sonion manufactured them but I can't remember where I got that idea.
   
  Quote: 





enyls said:


> Hi,
> 
> I'm extremely new to IEMs and am looking to buy one for around 130 dollars max. I've been looking at the Brainwavz B2, Re--400, a-jays(the five is coming out soon, should I wait for that one do you think?), Shure 215 and audio technicas, and the velodyne vpulse.
> 
> ...


 

 Well, looks like everyone else thinks it should be the RE-400 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. I agree that it's a great earphone but my one concern would be its bass quantity - it's got a little more punch than the B2 you were also looking at but not nearly as much as the SE215 and vPulse, for example. The statement "I do like bass, but don't like it to be overpowering." is pretty vague - it could mean that you want enhanced bass but just not completely overblown (which would lead me away from recommending the RE-400) or that you are okay with a balanced-sounding earphone as long as it's not bass-deficient (which would make the RE-400 a good choice).


----------



## BluePhoenixHD

Hope it is okay to post again. XD After careful consideration and multiple threads, reviews, etc. I have thought about the following headphones:
   
  Vsonic GR99 - Amazon
  LG Quadbeat - Amazon [ Like Joker suggested. ]
  Philips SHE3590 - Amazon
  Donu Trident - Ebay
  Vsonic GR02 - Ebay
  VSonic R02 Silver - Ebay
  Astrotec AM-90 - Ebay
   
  The Ebay ones are from Lendmeurears. The reason I upped the budget alittle is due to the free shipping on the Ebay items. Out of all these, what do you think is the best deal? Comfort is a big deal for a small - medium size ears. Sound, I believe would be like Warm/Neutral/Balanced. Something that does not shake my head with the bass. =P Though I can enjoy it.
   
  Thanks for helping!


----------



## enyls

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Well, looks like everyone else thinks it should be the RE-400
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Is there anything similar to the re400s that come with a remote/more accessories? It can be a little bit more expensive.
  thanks


----------



## dnullify

Philips fidelio s1 / s2. from what I have read so far, I would think that would fit the bill. You should check those out.


----------



## quartertone

Had the S1 for a few days, loving it. It's a bit crisper and brighter than the RE400, so if you want that smooth relaxed vibe it might not be for you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bluephoenixhd said:


> Hope it is okay to post again. XD After careful consideration and multiple threads, reviews, etc. I have thought about the following headphones:
> 
> Vsonic GR99 - Amazon
> LG Quadbeat - Amazon [ Like Joker suggested. ]
> ...


 
   
  I am not sure what I can add to what I've already written on these in this thread. I can't tell you which signature you'll like best but I think they all represent a great value (which seems to be the criterion by which you chose them). The safest ones to get would probably be the GR99 or Quadbeat as their signatures are quite likable and fit your requirements. For the Quadbeat you'll probably want to grab an aftermarket tip set as well.
   
  Quadbeat ($27): http://www.ebay.com/itm/LG-Special-Red-Edition-QuadBeat-LG-optimus-G-Premium-EarPhone-BLACK-HSS-F420-/171076931198?pt=Bluetooth_Wireless_Products&hash=item27d4face7e
  4-piece tip set (~$7): http://www.ebay.com/itm/MEElectronics-Eartips-for-M2-M9-M11-M16-M21-M31-R1-N8-N9-SP51-Earphone-/140822041036?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item20c9a5d1cc 
   
  Quote: 





enyls said:


> Is there anything similar to the re400s that come with a remote/more accessories? It can be a little bit more expensive.
> thanks


 
   
  Yep, Philips Fidelio S1. I agree with quartertone's assessment.


----------



## Exesteils

ljokerl said:


> Yep, Philips Fidelio S1. I agree with quartertone's assessment.




Just a small query, Joker. When you tried the S2/S1, did you notice slight sibilance and maybe a little sloppiness on overall bass? I just tried a brand new pair and that was what I noticed next to my well-burnt in pair. Never noticed it as I threw them into burn-in the instant they got here and left them for 3 days before actually listening to them.


----------



## garcsa

[size=small] Hi joker,[/size]
 [size=small]  [/size]
 [size=small] I'm just curious about your habit , do you use sometimes  the EQ on your DAP?  . As we know from your profile, one of your player is J3, which have a tons of preset EQs (IMO pretty good ones) .[/size]
 [size=small]  [/size]
 [size=small] I know the music isn't the same with EQ, but I'm also pretty sure that we'll never hear the same sound what the engineers wanted to 'tell'  us.[/size]
 [size=small] Portable or home systems the same .[/size]
 [size=small] I'm also sure that we have to enjoy the MUSIC comes from IEMs, HPs, speakers ... [/size]
 [size=small]  [/size]
 [size=small] BTW are there any thread about this?[/size]
 [size=small] Thanks[/size]


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Would you happen to know the driver used inside the klipsch x10i by any chance please?


 
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> One of the Klipsch KG drivers. I was under the impression Sonion manufactured them but I can't remember where I got that idea.


 
   
  Yes, Klipsch always orders from Sonion. They've never worked with Knowles.
   
  Outwardly, it's code-named the KG926, but that doesn't mean anything to anyone. In terms of form factor and electroacoustic properties (FR, impedance, THD pattern, etc.), it's most similar to the 26A005/8, but it may not be identical. If anything the KG926 is the progenitor to the 26A005/8, as it came to market earlier.
   
  However, the Sleek Audio SA6/CT6 are confirmed to utilize the 26A005/8, and with some tweaks, the SA6 can be tuned to measure very similarly to the X10, with matching first and second resonance points, suggesting that the two share at least a similar driver family.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





exesteils said:


> Just a small query, Joker. When you tried the S2/S1, did you notice slight sibilance and maybe a little sloppiness on overall bass? I just tried a brand new pair and that was what I noticed next to my well-burnt in pair. Never noticed it as I threw them into burn-in the instant they got here and left them for 3 days before actually listening to them.


 
   
  The units I have weren't brand new when I got them. 
   
  Quote: 





garcsa said:


> [size=small] Hi joker,[/size]
> [size=small]  [/size]
> [size=small] I'm just curious about your habit , do you use sometimes  the EQ on your DAP?  . As we know from your profile, one of your player is J3, which have a tons of preset EQs (IMO pretty good ones) .[/size]
> [size=small]  [/size]
> ...


 
   
  I rarely use EQ - mostly when I'm trying to figure why a certain headphone's sound is bothering me. The Cowon has nice presets but the adjustable EQ could be better. I use a parametric EQ plug-in on my PC instead.
   
  As for why I don't attempt to use the EQ for reviews - introducing the EQ as another variable would add more complexity to reviews than I wish to have at this time.
   
  Yes, there are definitely threads dealing specifically with EQ.
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Yes, Klipsch always orders from Sonion. They've never worked with Knowles.
> 
> Outwardly, it's code-named the KG926, but that doesn't mean anything to anyone. In terms of form factor and electroacoustic properties (FR, impedance, THD pattern, etc.), it's most similar to the 26A005/8, but it may not be identical. If anything the KG926 is the progenitor to the 26A005/8, as it came to market earlier.
> 
> However, the Sleek Audio SA6/CT6 are confirmed to utilize the 26A005/8, and with some tweaks, the SA6 can be tuned to measure very similarly to the X10, with matching first and second resonance points, suggesting that the two share at least a similar driver family.


 

 Thanks, good stuff.


----------



## elvergun

Quote: 





quartertone said:


> Interesting that joker and ClieOs have both given the H-100 very favourable reviews, considering how much criticism it drew from some quarters.


 
   
  It's a shame that a couple of member's negative reviews (more like an inquisition) gave this model a bad reputation.  The H-100 is quite good (specially if you like sub-bass).


----------



## davidcotton

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> One of the Klipsch KG drivers. I was under the impression Sonion manufactured them but I can't remember where I got that idea.


 
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Yes, Klipsch always orders from Sonion. They've never worked with Knowles.
> 
> Outwardly, it's code-named the KG926, but that doesn't mean anything to anyone. In terms of form factor and electroacoustic properties (FR, impedance, THD pattern, etc.), it's most similar to the 26A005/8, but it may not be identical. If anything the KG926 is the progenitor to the 26A005/8, as it came to market earlier.
> 
> However, the Sleek Audio SA6/CT6 are confirmed to utilize the 26A005/8, and with some tweaks, the SA6 can be tuned to measure very similarly to the X10, with matching first and second resonance points, suggesting that the two share at least a similar driver family.


 
  Thanks to both of you!
   
  Reason I ask is because I sent a klipsch x10i into be reshelled aaages ago.  Had fit issues, but the sound wasn't what I remembered and it seems to be for good reason!


----------



## davidcotton

One other quick question (it is all related I promise!) is do either of you (tom or joker) know what drivers the westone 2 uses please?


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The units I have weren't brand new when I got them.
> 
> 
> I rarely use EQ - mostly when I'm trying to figure why a certain headphone's sound is bothering me. The Cowon has nice presets but the adjustable EQ could be better. I use a parametric EQ plug-in on my PC instead.


 
  May I know which player use on your PC? And no more personal questions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. BTW all questions in this great thread  are moreles personal - yours empirical opinions about IEMs. Thanks and Respect Man!


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> Reason I ask is because I sent a klipsch x10i into be reshelled aaages ago.  Had fit issues, but the sound wasn't what I remembered and it seems to be for good reason!


 
   
  The X10 has some tuning done to the housing by Klipsch as well. Recently, a DIYer-turned-MOT, a Japanese chap who goes by the handle of KumitateK, remolded an X10 with the anterior housing intact, and it still yielded differences. Remolding is always going to alter the sound, whether it be due to the possibility of insertion depth, tip-related resonance differences, venting differences, or other small factors, a custom remold is almost never going to be exactly the same as the original. Read his blog entry (or just look at the pictures) for more information: http://diy-ciem.blogspot.jp/2013/07/klipsch-x10.html
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> One other quick question (it is all related I promise!) is do either of you (tom or joker) know what drivers the westone 2 uses please?


 
   
GQ-30783... this one I'm quite (~98%) sure of. In the future, for driver information, instead of bothering the good Joker (kidding), refer to the chart.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





garcsa said:


> May I know which player use on your PC? And no more personal questions
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  I use mediamonkey, mostly for its library management features. It natively supports winamp plugins including the parametric EQ that I use.
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> GQ-30783... this one I'm quite (~98%) sure of. In the future, for driver information, instead of bothering the good Joker (kidding), refer to the chart.


 
   
  Added the chart thread to the "useful links" section at the front of this thread.


----------



## FlySweep

Oh yeah.. and I'm happy to see you liked the H-100. I heard it just the way you did (and was, apparently, one of the ten people on earth who liked it). When I said so way back when I had it, everyone thought I was crazy. Sweet, sweet validation.. so this is what victory tastes like.. LOL.


----------



## eke2k6

flysweep said:


> Oh yeah.. and I'm happy to see you liked the H-100. I heard it just the way you did (and was, apparently, one of the ten people on earth who liked it). When I said so way back when I had it, everyone thought I was crazy. Sweet, sweet validation.. so this is what victory tastes like.. LOL.





Boooo! Hisss!!! 

As the resident h100 hater, I am obliged to disparage your reputation. Joker, I no longer consider you my sensei.


----------



## elvergun

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Oh yeah.. and I'm happy to see you liked the H-100. I heard it just the way you did (and was, apparently, one of the ten people on earth who liked it). When I said so way back when I had it, everyone thought I was crazy. Sweet, sweet validation.. so this is what victory tastes like.. LOL.


 
   
  I remember...H20 came within a hair's breadth of being lynched.    It's amazing how a couple of guys with high post counts (by shouting loud enough) can change the collective opinion on how good (flavors of the month) or bad (like in the K550 and H-100 threads) a model is.


----------



## elvergun

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> Boooo! Hisss!!!
> 
> As the resident h100 hater, I am obliged to disparage your reputation. Joker, I no longer consider you my sensei.


 
   
   
  You might hate it, but the H-100 is actually a good IEM with unique qualities (great sub-bass and crystal clear highs).


----------



## FlySweep

eke2k6 said:


> Boooo! Hisss!!!
> 
> As the resident h100 hater, I am obliged to disparage your reputation. Joker, I no longer consider you my sensei.


 
   

   


> Originally Posted by *elvergun* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I remember...H20 came within a hair's breadth of being lynched.    It's amazing how a couple of guys with high post counts (by shouting loud enough) can change the collective opinion on how good (flavors of the month) or bad (like in the K550 and H-100 threads) a model is.


 
   
  Good thing I'm a lover.. not a shouter.
   


elvergun said:


> You might hate it, but the H-100 is actually a good IEM with unique qualities (great sub-bass and crystal clear highs).


 
   
  I agree.. it's a unique sounding phone.. the sig doesn't have "mass appeal".. and even for us nerdy audiophiles, it's a bit odd at first.  To my ears, the mids weren't recessed as much as they were thin.. and it was kind of cool (literally and figuratively).


----------



## FrequencyBlue

I would love to hear the H-100 too,  given that they have some similarity with the FX40


----------



## Thr0waway

Hey Joker,
   
  How does the LG Quadbeat HSS-F420 compare to the Vsonic GR02 BE in terms of its V-shaped signature and the general sound quality?
   
  You say that the Sony MH1C's treble "is very inoffensive without sacrificing overall refinement." However, you label the Sony MH1C's sound signature as Warm and Smooth; would the treble of the MH1C be less prominent than that of the V-Shaped Quadbeat or R02 BE?
   
  Sorry for all the questions but I want to make sure I buy the right pair of IEM so I don't have to go through the hassle of returning them.


----------



## MoonYeol

Someone send ASG-1 and 2 the way of ljokerl?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thr0waway said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> How does the LG Quadbeat HSS-F420 compare to the Vsonic GR02 BE in terms of its V-shaped signature and the general sound quality?
> 
> ...


 

 Yes, the treble of the MH1C is less prominent compared to the Quadbeat and GR02 BE. Calling the earphones warm and smooth, and calling the treble inoffensive, are not mutually exclusive.
   
  The Quadbeat is more balanced than the GR02 BE and has better treble extension. The GR02 BE has more bass and more treble energy overall but also sounds a little thicker (in a good way) than the Quadbeat.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> Someone send ASG-1 and 2 the way of ljokerl?


 

 I was supposed to get a set from Aurisonics. Keep forgetting to follow up.


----------



## MoonYeol

Somehow I just wonder how you can even keep up with all of this.. What you're doing is really admirable. And it would be awesome if you got your hands on the ASG-1 and 2.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> *Somehow I just wonder how you can even keep up with all of this*.. What you're doing is really admirable. And it would be awesome if you got your hands on the ASG-1 and 2.


 

 I can't


----------



## eke2k6

ljokerl said:


> I can't




I think you deserve a few months hiatus after you hit 300 reviews.

Maybe the mods could lock the thread while you're away.


----------



## MoonYeol

eke2k6 said:


> I think you deserve a few months hiatus after you hit 300 reviews.
> 
> Maybe the mods could lock the thread while you're away.




+1


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





eke2k6 said:


> I think you deserve a few months hiatus after you hit 300 reviews.
> 
> Maybe the mods could lock the thread while you're away.


 

 Can't say I disagree 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
Scares me how much farther behind I'll fall, though.


----------



## MoonYeol

ljokerl said:


> Can't say I disagree
> 
> 
> Scares me how much farther behind I'll fall, though.




I mean NO DISRESPECT but do you really think you would stop listening to new phones when you were away? I just mean that somewhere deep down that's what you love to do and just a break from feeling that you have to produce reviews and respond to questions might be enough to make you feel better.


----------



## eke2k6

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Can't say I disagree
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
   Nah, you'd only be gone from reviews for a few months. I'm sure you can still log on and browse the forums every now and then.


----------



## thesuperguy

All this mention of giving joker a vacation makes me wonder, does joker have an actual job?


----------



## MoonYeol

From the looks of it, he works somewhere where he can listen to music all day long and write reviews while he's working. Otherwise I don't know how he does it.


----------



## MoonYeol

Again I want to clarify that I mean NO DISRESPECT. I'm merely amazed by your commitment and I want to point out that your reviews are actually what showed me that iems were more than just small conductors of sound, all sounding about the same, and that hearing is elemental but listening closely and understanding what you are hearing is an art.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> I mean NO DISRESPECT but do you really think you would stop listening to new phones when you were away? I just mean that somewhere deep down that's what you love to do and just a break from feeling that you have to produce reviews and respond to questions might be enough to make you feel better.


 
   
  I would probably listen to just two or three pairs. When I'm just casually listening to music I don't need the best of the best - something at the RE-400 level would be sufficient. 
   
  Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> Again I want to clarify that I mean NO DISRESPECT. I'm merely amazed by your commitment and I want to point out that your reviews are actually what showed me that iems were more than just small conductors of sound, all sounding about the same, and that *hearing is elemental but listening closely and understanding what you are hearing is an art*.


 






 It took me years to get to that point.


----------



## MoonYeol

Reading reviews from passionate reviewers who are really able to paint a picture of the way something sounds does help a lot in the process.


----------



## stimer

VSD3 & VSD5
   

   
   
 VSD3 competitor shure 535
 VSD5/VSD3S competitor westone 4R, Sony EX1000
  
 VSD3 - 299RMB (49$ us)
 VSD5 - 399RMB (65$ us)
  
 Day of release - 1 January, 2014


----------



## hi-fi amateur

Anyone know how much the vsonic VSD7 will retail for?


----------



## jant71

The whole range is:
   
  VSD1 and S - ~$32
  VSD3 and S - ~$49
  VSD5 - $65
  VSD7 and 7 Bass - ~$199
  VSD9 - ~$500


----------



## thesuperguy

I just can't believe that a $65 IEM is being set to compete with IEMs several hundred dollars more.


----------



## TheGame21x

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> I just can't believe that a $65 IEM is being set to compete with IEMs several hundred dollars more.


 

 Well, this is VSONIC, and I'd like to think they're known (at least in some capacity) for pushing the envelope on what we should expect at a given price point.
   
  I know I wouldn't have pegged the VSD1 to be around $50, considering how good it sounded.


----------



## Emospence

Then what is the VSD9 competing with? Rofl


----------



## thesuperguy

Quote: 





emospence said:


> Then what is the VSD9 competing with? Rofl


 

 The Orpheus.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





emospence said:


> Then what is the VSD9 competing with? Rofl


 

 Live performance. You may as well stay home and listen to your VSD9.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





thesuperguy said:


> The Orpheus.


 
  LOL at this ))))


----------



## hi-fi amateur

Anyone know what the new VSD7 is being compared to by Vsonic, I am keenly interested in them. Also, is it the direct succesor to the gr07?


----------



## ljokerl

Added EarSonics SM64 Review



*(1C21) EarSonics SM64 (v2)*
   

Added Jul 2013

 Details: EarSonics 3-way, triple-armature follow-up to the SM3
 Current Price: *$399* from amazon.com (MSRP: $399)
 Specs: Driver: _3-BA / 3-way crossover_  Imp: _98Ω_ | Sens: _122 dB_ | Freq: _10-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.2' L-plug_
 Nozzle Size:_ 2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock bi-flanges; Westone STAR tips_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(4/5) *– Double-flange silicone tips (2 pairs), foam tips (2 sizes), cleaning tool, and clamshell carrying case
 Build Quality* (4.5/5) *– Like the first-gen EarSonics models I’ve reviewed, the SM64 uses plastic shells reminiscent of the Westone stage monitors. The cords are now detachable, however, utilizing a common 2-pin socket, and have a memory wire section for a more secure fit. The twisted cables are similar to those used by Westone universals and most custom-fit earphones
 Isolation *(4/5) *– Quite good with both the included silicone and foam tips
 Microphonics *(5/5) *– Basically nonexistent, as with all similar designs
 Comfort *(4.5/5) *– The new smooth, rounded housings are a major improvement over the angular design of the old SM2/SM3, fitting securely without applying pressure to parts of the outer ear like the SM3 shells did

 Sound* (9.3/10)* – The sound of the SM64 bears a resemblance to its predecessor, the SM3, but at the same time offers a more conventional balance and presentation. First the sound signature – the SM64 is a warmish earphone with impressive bass quality and clear, yet forgiving sound. The low end of the earphones is outstanding – the bass has very good depth and control. It is boosted, yet maintains a good balance of mid- and subbass. The result is a low end that’s extended and powerful, yet very clean and controlled. It makes the bottom end of the VSonic GR07 sound a touch loose and intrusive and competes in quality with the decidedly less bassy Ultimate Ears 900.

 The midrange of the SM64 maintains good presence but is not overly forward. Tonally, the EarSonics are slightly warm – warmer, for example, than Philips’ flagship Fidelio S2 model and the Ultimate Ears 900. Note thickness is impressive as well, and while the SM64 doesn’t have the emphasized upper midrange and treble that typically accentuate clarity, it is still about as clear as the flatter and more accurate-sounding VSonic VC1000 and Philips Fidelio S2, among others.

 On the point of accuracy – the SM64 has an upper midrange dip, not unlike its predecessor, the SM3. However, the dip of the SM3 seems to be broader and has a greater effect on the sound, resulting in greater veiling and a darker overall tone compared to the SM64. The SM64 still cannot be called neutral, however, and lacks some of upper midrange presence and accuracy compared to earphones such as the Fidelio S2, UE 900, and VC1000, just to name a few.

 The treble of the new EarSonics has pretty good presence, appearing more energetic than, for example, the EarSonics SM3, Westone UM3X, and Sony MDR-7550, but not harsh or sibilant. It seems to be a case of taking the middle ground- a little smoothed-over compared to accuracy-oriented in-ears such as the VSonic VC1000 and Philips Fidelio S2 but at the same time is not as smooth as the Sony MDR-7550. Still, while not perfect, it’s an improvement on the old SM3 and a fair compromise between risking harshness and losing crispness. The VSonic GR07, for example, is quite sibilance-prone compared to the EarSonics.

 The presentation of the SM64 has good depth and width, and appears to be tuned for more universal appeal than the uniquely enveloping sound of the older SM3. Good bass control and a lack of midrange recession help the SM64’s separation and imaging. The VSonic GR07, for example, sounds a bit congested and lacking in soundstage depth in comparison and even the UE900, while spacious overall and more impressive in this regard than the GR07, still doesn’t quite have the depth of the SM64.

 One last thing worth noting is that the SM64 is not very sensitive and was less efficient than all of the earphones I compared it against, especially the SM3.

*Select Comparisons*

EarSonics SM3 (discontinued)

 Pitting the SM64 against its predecessor is telling of the direction EarSonics has taken with the tuning of the new model. While the SM3 remains a very unique earphone with its thick, lush mids and enveloping presentation, the SM64 boasts a more conventional – but at the same time more capable – sound. The low end of the SM64, for instance, is more focused on subbass and less on mid-bass, resulting in sound that is tighter and cleaner overall. The mids of the SM64 are not as forward as those of the SM3 and the note presentation is not as thick and creamy.

 The thinner note presentation affords the SM64 a slightly clearer sound, which is also helped along by greater treble energy compared to the previous-gen model. The brighter treble results in a more neutral tone compared to the warmer SM3 – though the SM64 is not flat in FR, it is more balanced than its predecessor. The more mid-forward SM3 also boasts a more enveloping presentation, which is something that resulted in a lot of polarized opinions and heated debate. The new SM64 has a wider soundstage and a more conventional out-of-the-head presentation. Overall, while the two earphones are more different in sound signature than technical ability, I would rather listen to the new SM64 nine out of ten times.

Phonak PFE 232 ($599)

 Phonak’s PFE 232 is a dual-driver design with a mildly v-shaped sound signature – quite a contrast to all EarSonics models, especially the old SM3. Compared to the new SM64, the 232 has brighter, more energetic treble and at times seems clearer and crisper, as tends to be the case with brighter earphones. However, the 232 also sounds a little “hot” and has a greater tendency towards sibilance when pitted against the more relaxed treble of the SM64. Its sound, especially the top end, seems thinner and less natural compared to that of the EarSonics.

 The bass of the PFE is greater in quantity compared to the SM64 and tends to intrude on the more recessed mids of the Phonaks. The EarSonics, on the other hand, boast less aggressive bass and a fuller, more prominent midrage. That, combined with the smoother treble of the SM64, makes it more natural and easier to listen to than the PFE, which is why it has won my ear here.

Sennheiser IE 800 ($1000)

 Sennheiser’s flagship in-ear boasts plentiful bass and a more v-shaped overall sound compared to the EarSonics. It offers greater mid- and subbass presence, as well as greater impact and note weight. The EarSonics, on the other hand, exercise a bit more bass control. The lower midrange of the IE 800 is more recessed but maintains clarity very well. At the same time the SM64, with its laid-back upper mids, sounds smoother than the somewhat splashy IE 800. Subjectively, the performance of these two is actually rather close, though the IE 800 did win my ear more often than the SM64 for its greater midrange accuracy and huge bass that does not sacrifice clarity.

AKG K3003 ($1300)

 AKG’s BA-dynamic hybrid is yet another earphone with a more v-shaped sound compared to the EarSonics SM64. The K3003 is a set I’ve always rather liked, and that doesn’t change in head-to-head comparisons with the EarSonics. The AKG boasts more treble presence, energy, and sparkle, and the upper midrange is more filled-in, resulting in the K3003 appearing more detailed overall.

 The bass of the K3003 is a little more powerful than that of the SM64, though the difference is not night and day. The mids of the SM64 are fuller and more forward, on the other hand, and the overall tone is warmer. The brighter, more v-shaped K3003 nonetheless sounds a little more neutral to me than the SM64, but it’s difficult to fault the bass and lower midrange of the EarSonics even next to the hugely pricy AKGs.

Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 ($350)

 The CTM-200 is an entry-level dual-driver custom monitor priced right near the SM64. Tuned for an accurate, musician-friendly sound, the CTM-200 is not as warm in tone as the SM64, with bass that rolls off earlier and lacks the impact of the EarSonics. The lack of proper subbass extension hurts the realism and accuracy of the low end – simply put, the EarSonics sound much more effortless and realistic when it comes to bass.

 Aside from the bass, the dual-driver CTM-200 actually does offer some advantages over the SM64 – its mids, for example, are flatter overall and provide better accuracy. The upper midrange is more filled-in and the overall tone is cooler. Despite this, clarity is actually on-par between the two earphones and while the presentation of the CTM-200 is a bit more out-of-the-head, the SM64 keeps up very well in soundstage size, imaging, and overall sense of space. Choosing between these two earphones is a matter of choosing between the superior bass of the SM64 or the more accurate sound and marginally larger presentation of the CTM-200.

 Value* (8.5/10) *– EarSonics broke onto the worldwide audio scene a few years back with the rather controversial SM3 – an earphone that, with some reservations, I quite liked. The sound of the new SM64 retains resemblance to its predecessor but also seems to be tuned for more universal appeal. It’s not tonally neutral, but it refines the formula in many ways - even the fit has been improved dramatically compared to the first-gen EarSonics products.
   
  These days there are dozens of great-sounding earphones available at almost all price points so all high-end purchases are tough to justify, but there’s one thing I’ll freely admit - the SM64 is much more proficient than most at getting my toes tapping.

*Pros: Great bass and presentation; very comfortable, especially next to old EarSonics models; good isolation and overall user-friendliness
 Cons: Could be flatter between the upper midrange and treble*


----------



## KimbaWLion

I just got a Pair of TDK BA 200s off Amazon for $122 with FREE shipping since I am a member. I am really amazed at the sound I get.
  JUST another another thought about IEMS in the $120 range... There are a lot of reviews here for you to look at. I like the base I get it is not
  over powering and just really like them. Others here can give you a LOT more in depth  reviews. They are quite worth the money IMHO...


----------



## klipschman70

Hi Ijokerl
   
  I see you were comparing the Earsonics SM64 among others with Sennheiser IE800. Are you going to write a review on the IE800 soon? Wondering how it would stack up against the Fitear 334.


----------



## Tom Yum Goong

I've been waiting for this SM64 review for so long 
 Great as always.

 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kimbawlion said:


> I just got a Pair of TDK BA 200s off Amazon for $122 with FREE shipping since I am a member. I am really amazed at the sound I get.
> JUST another another thought about IEMS in the $120 range... There are a lot of reviews here for you to look at. I like the base I get it is not
> over powering and just really like them. Others here can give you a LOT more in depth  reviews. They are quite worth the money IMHO...


 
   
  Yeah, I've heard a lot of good things about these now. They're on my 'want' list for the future. I believe they started at a higher price and are getting more and more interesting now that they're <$150 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
   
  Quote: 





klipschman70 said:


> Hi Ijokerl
> 
> I see you were comparing the Earsonics SM64 among others with Sennheiser IE800. Are you going to write a review on the IE800 soon? Wondering how it would stack up against the Fitear 334.


 
   
  I posted one on InnerFidelity here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor . I'll add it to this thread as well but there's a bit of a queue. It's a lot more v-shaped sounding than the 334. More similar to the Ultrasone IQ IMO.
   
  Quote: 





tom yum goong said:


> I've been waiting for this SM64 review for so long
> Great as always.
> 
> Thanks!


 

 Thanks


----------



## InternetSandman

Hey Joker

Just wanna say that this is a brilliant roundup, massively impressed with the work you've put into this, and it's helped influence my last couple IEM purchases; I bought a set of Shure SE 535's a few months back (as my first pair of IEM's, actually) and I love them, but I had a problem with them staying in my ears so I decided to go custom and, again using your reviews as guidance, I bought a set of UM Miracle CIEM's. I actually tried to get the Spiral Ear 3-way but apparently my ears aren't suited for that, according to the rep I was emailing, so now I'm just waiting for the Miracle to ship, and then I can pair them with my HDP-R10 DAP. Can't wait to drown out transit with those beauties in my ears


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





internetsandman said:


> Hey Joker
> 
> Just wanna say that this is a brilliant roundup, massively impressed with the work you've put into this, and it's helped influence my last couple IEM purchases; I bought a set of Shure SE 535's a few months back (as my first pair of IEM's, actually) and I love them, but I had a problem with them staying in my ears so I decided to go custom and, again using your reviews as guidance, I bought a set of UM Miracle CIEM's. I actually tried to get the Spiral Ear 3-way but apparently my ears aren't suited for that, according to the rep I was emailing, so now I'm just waiting for the Miracle to ship, and then I can pair them with my HDP-R10 DAP. Can't wait to drown out transit with those beauties in my ears


 

 Thanks, glad the thread has been useful!
   
  SE535 to Miracle, that's an interesting move. I'd be curious as to your opinion of the latter. I am thinking it will sound a little bright at first 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## killerfrenzi

Hey Joker, what are a couple of IEMs you would say have the best value in that; starting from around this tier of iems do the quality/price ration begin to fall out or become highly subjective? And which ones would be under that but with almost to no microphonics. To me, if I can notice the microphonics when I'm walking with my IEMs, it just ruins the SQ.

 Right now I'm using TF10 but the comfort and my new wire's  microphonics are kind of ruining it, I'm thinking about some Vsonic GR07 MKII (or BE depending on if I want more bass or mids) to change up the pace.
  Alternatively, I could reshell my TF10 and get new cables. Decisions decisions..


----------



## MoonYeol

I'm not ljokerl but I just want to say that a really good seal on a phone with minimal or no venting might create the thumping effect when you walk. I think it's those factors. I get it with Re0 but not with GR07. Both using the same size MH1C hybrids. It gets less annoying if I wear running shoes or other soft shoes and watch how I walk. And yes, I wear both with cables over my ear and with no microphonics from clothes touching the cable. Just my own footsteps.


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> I'm not ljokerl but I just want to say that a really good seal on a phone with minimal or no venting might create the thumping effect when you walk. I think it's those factors. I get it with Re0 but not with GR07. Both using the same size MH1C hybrids. It gets less annoying if I wear running shoes or other soft shoes and watch how I walk. And yes, I wear both with cables over my ear and with no microphonics from clothes touching the cable. Just my own footsteps.


 
   
  It actually depends on the IEMs shape and housing...  The RE0 is an open phone, there is a vent on the back.  It depends on the shape of the phone, the cabling used, and how you wear it (up or down).  All of those will contribute to this.


----------



## elvergun

Quote: 





killerfrenzi said:


> Right now I'm using TF10 but the comfort and my new wire's  microphonics are kind of ruining it, I'm thinking about some Vsonic GR07 MKII (or BE depending on if I want more bass or mids) to change up the pace.
> Alternatively, I could reshell my TF10 and get new cables. Decisions decisions..


 
   
  I used to own (and love) the TF10 - I sold it because of the fit and the microphonics.  I bought the GR07 and when I first got them, being accustomed to the TF10's signature, I hated them...but that hate only lasted for a couple of days.  The GR07 is now one of all time favorite headphones. 
   
  Try to find a GR07 in the sales forum.  If you don't like it just sell it and get your money back.


----------



## killerfrenzi

elvergun said:


> I used to own (and love) the TF10 - I sold it because of the fit and the microphonics.  I bought the GR07 and when I first got them, being accustomed to the TF10's signature, I hated them...but that hate only lasted for a couple of days.  The GR07 is now one of all time favorite headphones.
> 
> Try to find a GR07 in the sales forum.  If you don't like it just sell it and get your money back.


 

   
  I'm having a tough decision of whether re-shell or GR07 (and MKII or BE).


----------



## esteebin

killerfrenzi said:


> I'm having a tough decision of whether re-shell or GR07 (and MKII or BE).




There's a sale going on now at lendmeurears. Either the MkII or BE for $133.25

Tick tock

I purchased the BE because I prefer my low end to have a bit more rumble.


----------



## Inks

You can have mkii have more bass by blocking the front vent, subbass is boosted.


----------



## killerfrenzi

basically depends if I value the mids or the bass more since having one would muddle the other.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





killerfrenzi said:


> Hey Joker, what are a couple of IEMs you would say have the best value in that; starting from around this tier of iems do the quality/price ration begin to fall out or become highly subjective? And which ones would be under that but with almost to no microphonics. To me, if I can notice the microphonics when I'm walking with my IEMs, it just ruins the SQ.
> 
> Right now I'm using TF10 but the comfort and my new wire's  microphonics are kind of ruining it, I'm thinking about some Vsonic GR07 MKII (or BE depending on if I want more bass or mids) to change up the pace.
> Alternatively, I could reshell my TF10 and get new cables. Decisions decisions..


 
   
  A proper custom re-fit with custom (Westone ES-type) cables shouldn't really have any microphonics. If you like the sound of the TF10 I don't see anything wrong with re-shelling it. If you want a change then moving to VSonic would be a better option but to me customs have a bit less microphonics. 
   
  In regards to your more general first question, at this point there are a bunch of sub-$50 earphones that will hit you hard with diminishing returns when you try to upgrade from them. I am talking about the Sony MH1C, LG Quatbeat, a few of the VSonics, Philips SHE3580s, etc. 
   
  Then above the $150-200 range or so, a lot of it starts coming down to preference. This is why I have trouble suggesting upgrades to sets such as the VSonic GR07, Ety HF5, and HiFiMan RE-400 (among others) when asked. 
   
  Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> I'm not ljokerl but I just want to say that a really good seal on a phone with minimal or no venting might create the thumping effect when you walk. I think it's those factors. I get it with Re0 but not with GR07. Both using the same size MH1C hybrids. It gets less annoying if I wear running shoes or other soft shoes and watch how I walk. And yes, I wear both with cables over my ear and with no microphonics from clothes touching the cable. Just my own footsteps.


 

 That's called the occlusion effect, it's distinct from microphonics.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Wow Joker with the review of the Sm64... I feels like a new competitor for the V3 has come up to change my decision!  But I believe the V3 still sounds a tad better?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gryphus0204 said:


> Wow Joker with the review of the Sm64... I feels like a new competitor for the V3 has come up to change my decision!  But I believe the V3 still sounds a tad better?


 

 Pretty different sound, the V3 is more aggressive and engaging and has brighter treble and more of a mid-bass hump. If you want something more mid-centric the SM64 might actually be a better option.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Pretty different sound, the V3 is more aggressive and engaging and has brighter treble and more of a mid-bass hump. If you want something more mid-centric the SM64 might actually be a better option.


 
  Really? Haha thanks! It's always interesting how all IEM are different


----------



## Frankyspanky

I would love to see the Fxz100/200 included in this review. But anyways: Great thread, helped me a lot with choosing IEM's!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





frankyspanky said:


> *I would love to see the Fxz100/200 included in this review*. But anyways: Great thread, helped me a lot with choosing IEM's!


 

 I would too. Someday...
   
  Glad the thread has been helpful


----------



## MoonYeol

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I would too. Someday...
> 
> Glad the thread has been helpful


 
   
  It is the closest thing to we have to a Holy Book in this religion we call audiophilism.


----------



## jhii07

Hi Sir Joker, what can you say about these?
   
  via TranslateGoogle
   
[New] [four-color detail exposure map] VSD1 series new details: Sao red fluorescent green √ √ √ sky blue black √. With VSD3 series and D5 is different, VSD1 new version of the shell with a smooth surface, while VSD3 series and D5 is used polished diamond irregular plane (outline style is more distinctive, polished design can improve the wearing comfort). VSD1 new price not yet set, time to market 2014.06.01.
   
*[SOURCE]*


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jhii07 said:


> Hi Sir Joker, what can you say about these?
> 
> via TranslateGoogle
> 
> [New] [four-color detail exposure map] VSD1 series new details: Sao red fluorescent green √ √ √ sky blue black √. With VSD3 series and D5 is different, VSD1 new version of the shell with a smooth surface, while VSD3 series and D5 is used polished diamond irregular plane (outline style is more distinctive, polished design can improve the wearing comfort). VSD1 new price not yet set, time to market 2014.06.01.


 

 Someone who knows more than I do about these explained their purpose on page 736 of this thread. That was the first I'd heard of them except for the VSD7, which supposed to replace the GR07.


----------



## MoonYeol

jant71 said:


> The whole range is:
> 
> VSD1 and S - ~$32
> VSD3 and S - ~$49
> ...




The best thing is that the release date is almost a year from now. Then I have time to save up to buy all of them. Except for 9 maybe..


----------



## RochRx7

hmm. for the WooDUO 2 at $64 instead of msrp $125... would I be foolish *not* to get it?


----------



## KimbaWLion

You know since I got my TDK BA-200s I am really impressed how they sound. I have not heard super high end IEMs but I have heard a few mid to high and mostly use the standard headphones I own and really wonder 
  if an IEM can really be had to sound like my full sized cans... I do not mind spending a little more but I DO wonder what the law of diminishing returns would be after awhile! 
  I have seen nice customs like the CT-200 starting out a decent price but after awhile I wonder how much I really gain... I know there are IEMS lots better, that IS a given, it's the how much better I truly wonder about..
  I think I saw somewhere posted that once you get past around $200 is matter of it being a personal thing... I want better, I have wait a little, these nicely priced TDKs work well...
  I do want better but if spending double is getting me only marginally better I have to wonder if that works for me given my use overall use. 
   
  I scoured the guides and reviews here. I heard the Astrotec AM-800s which for $50 are are very well reguarded! The TDK BA-200s at least to me are easily twice as good and cost JUST over double at $122...
  From what I have read here the next step is wait for the new line of Vsonics to come at because if the pattern holds $240 with the new models coming out may sound twice at good as the TDKs... I have read a few
  reviews where SOME members here liked the TDKs better than the GR 07s. I have no idea, I am happy for the moment... It will last me until the new models come out. I have to ask myself are CIEMs worth it to me, 
  the CT-200s at the price are REALLY tempting.. I will stay tuned here and read...


----------



## Peculier

Joker, I'm curious.. many of the new top tier multi-armature IEM models all seem to have an upper midrange dip of varying degrees (Heir 4.Ai, UE 900 to a less extent, and now the SM64), slightly boosted bass, and an inoffensive treble presentation. I'm fine with the treble and bass, but why do people tune IEMs with an upper midrange dip that can cause a veiled effect, and a decrease in perceived clarity? (Most noticeable with female vocals). Is there some psycho-acoustic effect of the sucked out upper midrange that we're subtly enjoying? Or is it entirely developer preference to tune IEMs in such a manner? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  PS If anyone has any insight to this topic do share!


----------



## edyeded

Amazing!! What an effort!
   
  Any chance you'll be reviewing the JH16 Pro's?


----------



## quartertone

Quote: 





rochrx7 said:


> hmm. for the WooDUO 2 at $64 instead of msrp $125... would I be foolish *not* to get it?


 
  Where?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





rochrx7 said:


> hmm. for the WooDUO 2 at $64 instead of msrp $125... would I be foolish *not* to get it?


 
   
  Don't buy something just for the value - make sure it suits your needs first. The Wooduo 2 especially is a pretty peculiar earphone. It's got tons of very deep bass and slightly edgy treble. Not the most natural sound, but great for bassheads who like a clarity and less mid-bass bloat compared to mainstream bass-heavy sets.
   
   
  Quote: 





kimbawlion said:


> You know since I got my TDK BA-200s I am really impressed how they sound. I have not heard super high end IEMs but I have heard a few mid to high and mostly use the standard headphones I own and really wonder
> if an IEM can really be had to sound like my full sized cans... I do not mind spending a little more but I DO wonder what the law of diminishing returns would be after awhile!
> I have seen nice customs like the CT-200 starting out a decent price but after awhile I wonder how much I really gain... I know there are IEMS lots better, that IS a given, it's the how much better I truly wonder about..
> I think I saw somewhere posted that once you get past around $200 is matter of it being a personal thing... I want better, I have wait a little, these nicely priced TDKs work well...
> ...


 

 If the BA-200 is as good as everyone says it is (i.e. top-tier or near top-tier), it's not likely you'll find something twice as good on the market, period. However, quantifying sound quality improvement is a tricky thing so who knows, maybe the VSD07 will be twice as good to you.
   
   
   
  Quote: 





peculier said:


> Joker, I'm curious.. many of the new top tier multi-armature IEM models all seem to have an upper midrange dip of varying degrees (Heir 4.Ai, UE 900 to a less extent, and now the SM64), slightly boosted bass, and an inoffensive treble presentation. I'm fine with the treble and bass, but why do people tune IEMs with an upper midrange dip that can cause a veiled effect, and a decrease in perceived clarity? (Most noticeable with female vocals). Is there some psycho-acoustic effect of the sucked out upper midrange that we're subtly enjoying? Or is it entirely developer preference to tune IEMs in such a manner?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
  My guess is to avoid the perception of hard treble and edgy vocals with complaint-prone mainstream users who crank the volume all the way and then listen to 96kbps mp3s. It's just a "safe" tuning compared to going the GR07 route. There are plenty of other IEMs (dynamic and armature) that do the opposite - the PFE232, Sony EX1000, and Westone 3, just to name a few. By the way, I've heard from a few people now who found the UE900 treble excessive for their purposes so for them even the UE tuning isn't quite inoffensive enough.
   
  By the way, I have seen the measurements for the SM64 - saw them before I got a chance to try it. I expected to dislike it but I had to be honest with myself and say that the opposite is true, that I enjoy the SM64 more than several other established high-end earphones. While it is probable that the SM64 would sound even better with a flatter upper midrange and lower treble, in listening to the earphones I can’t say that the issue bothers me as much as, for example, the sibilance of a VSonic GR07, the broader upper midrange dip of the SM3, or the bloated bass of a Sennheiser IE8. 
   
   
  Quote: 





edyeded said:


> Amazing!! What an effort!
> 
> Any chance you'll be reviewing the JH16 Pro's?


 

 I only have the JH13Pro, which I will add in due time. I like it quite a lot.


----------



## Change is Good

Hello, again...
   
  I'm looking for an IEM to use in the gym, and would like to avoid using my W4s. Is there a cheaper sub $100 alternate... while possibly still keeping the same sound signature? I know the clarity won't be the same, but would like a similar tone...


----------



## stimer

Quote: 





change is good said:


> Hello, again...
> 
> I'm looking for an IEM to use in the gym, and would like to avoid using my W4s. Is there a cheaper sub $100 alternate... while possibly still keeping the same sound signature? I know the clarity won't be the same, but would like a similar tone...


 
  hifiman re400, head-direct.com - 99$


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





change is good said:


> Hello, again...
> 
> I'm looking for an IEM to use in the gym, and would like to avoid using my W4s. Is there a cheaper sub $100 alternate... while possibly still keeping the same sound signature? I know the clarity won't be the same, but would like a similar tone...


 

 Was going to recommend a BA but if you're going to use it at the gym that's probably not a great idea - armatures don't handle moisture well. RE-400 would be a good choice, then, though I am not sure how the cable will hold up to sweat (it might harden in the long run).


----------



## Grayson73

I just received the new and improved NuForce NE-700X.  For anyone looking for IEMs around $50, check these out as well as the Zero Audio CB-DX210 Carbo Basso and CB-DX200 Carbo Tenore.


----------



## Thr0waway

I just received my Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition and I really enjoy them. However, when the plug is moved I hear a static sound. How worried should I be?
  Edit: to add on to this when I move the plug while listening to music, in addition the static sound the music sounds as if it's in the background for a few seconds then return to being in the "front"
  Edit2: Nevermind, I stuck a qtip in the jack and now the static is gone.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





thr0waway said:


> I just received my Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition and I really enjoy them. However, when the plug is moved I hear a static sound. How worried should I be?
> Edit: to add on to this when I move the plug while listening to music, in addition the static sound the music sounds as if it's in the background for a few seconds then return to being in the "front"
> Edit2: Nevermind, I stuck a qtip in the jack and now the static is gone.


 
   


 Try wiping the plug on your phones with your shirt or something


----------



## mechgamer123

Quote: 





rochrx7 said:


> hmm. for the WooDUO 2 at $64 instead of msrp $125... would I be foolish *not* to get it?


 
  No, you would be foolish to get it.
  I heard two different WooDUOs and I thought both of them were horrid. I'm surprised Joker rated them so highly... The sound is just horrid IMO and I would've probably rated them even lower. Get the MH1C if you want that kind of sound 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  Welp, I have the UE900s and I think my impressions with them are just about on par with yours Joker. They definitely have too much lower midrange, but once I EQ that area down, they sound wonderful. Now to figure out how to apply a custom EQ on my iPod and I'll be good.
  I also noticed that female vocals are indeed a little bit muffled. Would you say the 1964ears V3s would do a better job at handling female vocalists? I'm looking for a GR07-esque sound where the bass is a bit boosted and center stage is nice and intimate with female vocalists.


----------



## lukEM22

Joker, could I get a reccomendation;
  I have the Vsonic GR99 and I like them a lot, even compared to my more expensive IEMs. I boght my dad some GR02s and I like them a lot too, and am looking to upgrade (want something better than both) I like the design of both of these IEMs and love the Vsonic sound except for one thing, the "S" sound has a little too much hiss to it ex: instead of the word sounding like "something" it sounds like "sssomething" Looking at some UE, Sony model, the RE-400 and also the higher Vsonic models. One thing I do not want is for the IEMs to protrude too much out of my ear because I may be sleeping in them. Budget is >$200. Basically just want a more refined version of the two low end vsonics.
  I listen to some laid back rock, alternative, and rap music.


----------



## RochRx7

Quote: 





mechgamer123 said:


> No, you would be foolish to get it.
> I heard two different WooDUOs and I thought both of them were horrid. I'm surprised Joker rated them so highly... The sound is just horrid IMO and I would've probably rated them even lower. Get the MH1C if you want that kind of sound


 
  I already purchased the WooDUO2's.. just waiting for them to ship it.. I hope I don't share that same experience. O_o
  And I ordered the MH1C's off of eBay last week.. so I expect those in soon too..
   
  I have a list of budget-fi gear that I'm going after.. Whether I like them or not.. it's still a fun journey *experiencing gear* up next = Soundmagic e10, GR07BE, TDK BA200, Sony XBA3, Ety HF5 (eventually.. not all at once lol)

 Or I just might get *half* from that list.. and aim for Westone 4's or UE900s (I like the UE sound sig so far.. but I've only experienced 6000 and 600 from UE)


----------



## Amitl

Hi everyone!
  i was wondering what would be considered a similar or better phone than the
  Meelec A161P with a similar sound profile?
  i really love my A161P but i always make sure bass boost is on.
  i use a special app with my Galaxy phone ("DSP Manager") that enables direct access
  to the phone's DAC, and the bass boost really adds a lot and i can't notice it being
  at the cost of anything else.
  i wonder why they didn't make the phone like that to begin with,
  and i wonder what happens if i upgrade my phone.
  is the Meelec A161P the bassiest single-ba around?
  i also love the fact it's not sibilant.
  i think it makes a lot of sense to tweak a phone towards the bass...that way you get
  to enjoy both the ba's clarity tendency + bass...
  what a wonderful little earphone this is


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mechgamer123 said:


> No, you would be foolish to get it.
> I heard two different WooDUOs and I thought both of them were horrid. I'm surprised Joker rated them so highly... The sound is just horrid IMO and I would've probably rated them even lower. Get the MH1C if you want that kind of sound


 
   
  The Wooduo has quite a bit more bass than the MH1C, though, so it's not really the same type of sound. The Wooduo is safely in basshead territory.
   
   
  Quote: 





mechgamer123 said:


> Welp, I have the UE900s and I think my impressions with them are just about on par with yours Joker. They definitely have too much lower midrange, but once I EQ that area down, they sound wonderful. Now to figure out how to apply a custom EQ on my iPod and I'll be good.
> I also noticed that female vocals are indeed a little bit muffled. Would you say the 1964ears V3s would do a better job at handling female vocalists? I'm looking for a GR07-esque sound where the bass is a bit boosted and center stage is nice and intimate with female vocalists.


 
   
   
  The V3 is bassier and more intimate/aggressive than the UE900. I do think it does a better job with female vocalists but it's also not very similar to the GR07 overall - the GR07 is more akin to the Alclair Reference, with milder bass boost and less in-your-face mids compared to the 1964-V3.
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





lukem22 said:


> Joker, could I get a reccomendation;
> I have the Vsonic GR99 and I like them a lot, even compared to my more expensive IEMs. I boght my dad some GR02s and I like them a lot too, and am looking to upgrade (want something better than both) I like the design of both of these IEMs and love the Vsonic sound except for one thing, the "S" sound has a little too much hiss to it ex: instead of the word sounding like "something" it sounds like "sssomething" Looking at some UE, Sony model, the RE-400 and also the higher Vsonic models. One thing I do not want is for the IEMs to protrude too much out of my ear because I may be sleeping in them. Budget is >$200. Basically just want a more refined version of the two low end vsonics.
> I listen to some laid back rock, alternative, and rap music.


 
   
  The "S" sound you are referring to is called sibilance. Sibilance, to varying degrees, is present in all of the VSonic dynamic-driver IEMs I've tried. It's actually least prominent on the GR99 or maybe the R02 Silver. If you're worried about it VSonic is probably not the way to go for an upgrade. The RE-400 does not accentuate sibilance but it also doesn't have the bass quantity of the GR99 or R02. It's very small, though. For a more bass-heavy option that still avoids sibilance pretty well, the Yamaha EPH-100 would be worth a look. 
   
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> Hi everyone!
> i was wondering what would be considered a similar or better phone than the
> Meelec A161P with a similar sound profile?
> i really love my A161P but i always make sure bass boost is on.
> ...


 
   
  Probably because it's already got enough bass for those who like a balanced sound. Make it bassier and it's no longer a "reference" earphone.
   
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> is the Meelec A161P the bassiest single-ba around?


 
   
   
  The Phonak Perfect Bass (022) has more bass. The Final Audio Heaven S/C have more bass. The Klipsch X10 has a lot more bass.
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> i also love the fact it's not sibilant.
> i think it makes a lot of sense to tweak a phone towards the bass...that way you get
> to enjoy both the ba's clarity tendency + bass...
> what a wonderful little earphone this is


 
   
  Tuning the hardware for more bass will affect the sound in other ways, e.g. by reducing the clarity. See: all of the earphones out there that come with tuning filters. At that point you're better off using a parametric EQ to get the sound you want.


----------



## mechgamer123

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  So, would it be safe to say the V3 is a bit more "fun" or "crazy" than the GR07? Sounds like it might be right up my alley.


----------



## lukEM22

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The "S" sound you are referring to is called sibilance. Sibilance, to varying degrees, is present in all of the VSonic dynamic-driver IEMs I've tried. It's actually least prominent on the GR99 or maybe the R02 Silver. If you're worried about it VSonic is probably not the way to go for an upgrade. The RE-400 does not accentuate sibilance but it also doesn't have the bass quantity of the GR99 or R02. It's very small, though. For a more bass-heavy option that still avoids sibilance pretty well, the Yamaha EPH-100 would be worth a look.


 
   
  Thank you joker, another question, similair to my first one really. Just need a reccomendation:
 The sound of a Sony MH1C without the J-cable. I cant stand that cable but absolutely love how they sound.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mechgamer123 said:


> So, would it be safe to say the V3 is a bit more "fun" or "crazy" than the GR07? Sounds like it might be right up my alley.


 
   
  Yes. More "colored" would be another way to say it...
   
  Quote: 





lukem22 said:


> Thank you joker, another question, similair to my first one really. Just need a reccomendation:
> The sound of a Sony MH1C without the J-cable. I cant stand that cable but absolutely love how they sound.


 

 Hmm.. I wish I had something that sounds like the MH1C without that cable. Best bet in the same price range would probably be the Shure SE215. It's a little less bassy but still a warmer earphone. Going up in price, best option is probably something like a Monster Turbine Pro Gold but that's quite expensive.


----------



## reckca

Hi joker,
  i would like upgrade my senn ie8, do you think that jvc ha-fx700 is a good idea?
  Thanks


----------



## ctantra

Hi ljokerl,
   
  Can't wait your review of Vsonic VSD1 compared with GR02 BE and GR07 BE  Mine has already burned in for about 100 hours, but still there is very noticeable sibilance. Do you think burning in further would minimize it?
   
  What would you suggest IEM that can compete with ATH-M50 in term of SQ, but with more forward midrange, preferably under $200.


----------



## stimer

del


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





reckca said:


> Hi joker,
> i would like upgrade my senn ie8, do you think that jvc ha-fx700 is a good idea?
> Thanks


 
   
  Depends on what you're looking for from your "upgrade". The FX700 is one of the best bass-heavy universals I've heard and enjoys less bloat than the IE8 and a bit more clarity and resolution. The IE8 isn't too shabby itself, though. 
   
  Quote: 





ctantra said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> Can't wait your review of Vsonic VSD1 compared with GR02 BE and GR07 BE  Mine has already burned in for about 100 hours, but still there is very noticeable sibilance. Do you think burning in further would minimize it?


 

 I doubt it. You're better off playing with different tips and insertion depth. Mine is mildly sibilant as well after a month or so. 
    
  Quote:


ctantra said:


> What would you suggest IEM that can compete with ATH-M50 in term of SQ, but with more forward midrange, preferably under $200.


 

 I haven't heard the M50 in a while. If you're worried about sibilance I would say the Philips Fidelio S2. It'll sound like a more accurate version of the your VSD1, with less bass boost, mids that are in line with the rest of the sound, and less tendency to exaggerate sibilance. Another option is the JVC HA-FXT90, which is more colored-sounding than the Fidelios, with more mid-bass boost, but has a pretty aggressive sound that doesn't distance the mids.


----------



## reckca

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Depends on what you're looking for from your "upgrade". The FX700 is one of the best bass-heavy universals I've heard and enjoys less bloat than the IE8 and a bit more clarity and resolution. The IE8 isn't too shabby itself, though.


 
   
  And what do you think are the best bass heavy universals, better than ie8?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





reckca said:


> And what do you think are the best bass heavy universals, better than ie8?


 

 For me it's probably the IE 800.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Lime Ears LE3 and LE3B CIEMs
   
   

*(1A8/1A9) Lime Ears LE3 and LE3B*
   
 
Added Jul 2013

 Details: sister flagship CIEMs from Poland-based Lime Ears
 Current Price: 529€ (est. *$700*) from limeears.com 
 Specs: Driver: _3 BA / 3-way crossover_ | Imp: _46Ω_ | Sens: _109 dB_ | Freq: _N/A_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
 Wear Style: _Over-the-ear_

 Accessories* (4/5)* - Hard-shell crushproof carrying case and tube of ear lubricant
 Build Quality *(5/5) *– Construction is on-par with the likes of 1964EARS and Alclair, falling just short of pricier UM and Hidition sets. The acrylic shells have a very smooth finish and while my LE3B unit has some mild internal imperfections, the shells of the newer LE3 are very clear. The earphones boast recessed 2-pin connectors in the common configuration. There are five standard colors and myriad other customization options available. The cables have a smooth feel but suffer from a bit of memory character, maintaining their shape after being coiled up for storage. On the upside, unlike most clear cables found on custom monitors, these don’t seem to oxidize and turn green over time
 Isolation *(4/5) *– Similar to my other shallow-fit acrylic customs and slightly below that of the Hidition NT6 and Etymotic Research universals
 Microphonics *(5/5)* – Nearly nonexistent in the smooth clear-coated cable
 Comfort *(5/5) *– The LE3 and LE3B have medium length nozzles and are very comfortable when fitted correctly. As usual, if the CIEMs seem uncomfortable after an initial break-in period, a refit is probably a good idea. There is added cost with shipping and, if necessary, getting new impressions but on the whole a perfect fit is well worth the trouble

 Sound *(9.6/10)* – Lime Ears currently offers two different configurations of their triple-driver flagship. The standard LE3 provides a balanced and neutral sound while the LE3B, built by request only at this time, is an alternate tuning meant to supply a warmer tone with more bass kick. This review will cover both units.

 The standard LE3 offers up a balanced sound with a very mild warm tilt, akin to the JHAudio JH13 or, from the realm of universals, a newer HiFiMan set. To my ears, it is more uncolored than the vast majority of my other custom-fit earphones. The Hidition NT6, for example, is brighter than the LE3 and tends to emphasize treble more while the Spiral Ear SE-3 is warmer with its deep, visceral bass. The bottom end of the LE3 lacks a little in the way of extension – while not exactly poor in this regard, it definitely gives up depth to its enhanced-bass sibling.

 That’s pretty much the extent of the LE3’s concessions, however – moving up from the subbass region, it boasts punchy and controlled bass and clean, accurate mids with no hint of recession. It remains smooth through the upper midrange and treble, coming across as quite forgiving for an IEM with such a neutral tone. There is a bit of crispness missing compared to higher-end sets but nothing drastic and despite the soft treble character, the LE3 does not sound dark, again reminding me of current-gen HiFiMan earphones. The LE3 also provides a sonic image that’s neither forward nor too far back, thanks to its prominent, veil-free midrange. Compared to higher-end custom-fit sets, the only thing its presentation is a bit of depth – in this regard it is similar to top-tier universals such as the AKG K3003.

 Switching over to the LE3B, the enhanced bass immediately makes itself known. The two earphones have many similarities – as they should, using identical drivers and all, but the LE3B delivers on its promise of extra bass, putting out perhaps the best combination of quantity and quality I’ve heard out of a single bass driver. In this regard the LE3B competes with the pricier Westone ES5. Compared to the LE3, the warmer and bassier LE3B boasts not only more punch but also less roll-off while the extra bass impact and depth lend it a richer, fuller, more dynamic sound.

 The bass of the LE3 on the other hand, lacks the depth and rumble of the LE3B’s bass and its presentation actually seems more intimate next to the more dynamic LE3B. The less prominent bass of the LE3 results in a cooler overall tone and slightly cleaner mids. The difference in clarity is small between the two, however, and the treble is very similar - smooth but not lacking in presence.


*Select Comparisons – Lime Ears LE3*

Clear Tune Monitors CTM-200 ($350)

 The most reasonably-priced of my customs, the CTM-200 is a dual driver that strives towards a flat/neutral sound, which made it the perfect starting point for LE3 comparisons. Compared to the CTM-200, the LE3 has better bass presence and sounds a little warmer overall. The bass is both deeper and more impactful, which results in the Lime Ears having a more natural and dynamic sound. The midrange of the CTM-200 seems more forward overall while the LE3 is more relaxed. The treble of the LE3 is smoother, though the CTM-200 is not a harsh-sounding earphone. The differences in the midrange and treble are minor and can easily be chalked up to preference. Presentation, however, is a win for the Lime Ears – they are simply more spacious and well-separated, with better imaging and depth that cause the CTM-200, with its more forward mids, to sound a bit flat and dull in comparison.

Alclair Reference ($399)

 While still pricier than the CTM-200, the Alclair Reference recently underwent a $100 price drop to a more comfortable price point, which has worked in favor of its value proposition. The Reference keeps up with the LE3 very well, with the only major differences stemming from its midrange and treble presentation. Signature-wise, the Reference is a very mildly v-shaped earphone that reminds me more of the UM Miracle and VSonic GR07. Its lower midrange sounds a little withdrawn compared to the more balanced Lime Ears but otherwise the two earphones have a lot in common right up to the upper midrange, which is noticeably grainier on the Reference. This theme continues through the treble, which is more harsh and sibilant with the Alclairs. The extra treble energy of the Reference does make it seem clearer at times, but it’s a dubious tradeoff that causes me to choose the LE3 almost every time.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

 A top-tier flagship that has been popular for several years running, the Miracle is a mildly v-shaped earphone, though one with fewer caveats than the cheaper Alclair Reference. Compared to the LE3, the Miracle has better deep bass, with extension that easily matches the bass-heavy LE3B tuning of the Lime Ears, but without of the bloat. The UM is a little warmer overall and suffers from a slightly recessed midrange in comparison to the LE3, which actually appears more balanced as a result. The Miracle does catch up in treble presence, with a top end that is more prominent but still a little more refined and just as smooth as that of the Lime Ears. Overall, I was impressed with how well the LE3 kept up with the Miracle - its downsides were not as obvious as those of the LE3B and its midrange was actually preferable much of the time.

JHAudio JH13 Pro Freqphase ($1099)

 Currently my CIEM of choice, the JH13 Freqphase is yet another neutrality-oriented custom that made for a natural comparison with the LE3 – indeed, I found the signature of the JH13 to be more similar to the Lime Ears than those of the Alclair and Unique Melody sets. In terms of performance, the LE3 is less extended at either end and not as clean, crisp, and resolving as the JH13. The JH13 also offers up a bit more bass punch, exercises tighter control over its low end, and provides slightly more convincing imaging but the two earphones definitely share a similar sound signature, with the LE3 approximating the sound and performance of the JH13 as well as can be expected for the price.


*Select Comparisons – Lime Ears LE3B*

EarSonics SM64 ($399)

 Like the LE3B, EarSonics’ universal-fit flagship utilizes a 3-way, triple-armature setup and pursues a sound on the warm side of neutral. Compared to the SM64, the bass of the LE3B is a little more enhanced – not in depth, but certainly in impact and overall power. Despite this, the clarity of the LE3B is slightly better and overall detailing appears better as well, likely because the upper midrange dip of the SM64 is not present. There also is more treble energy with the LE3B which, combined with the flatter midrange-treble transition, makes it less forgiving and more prone to exposing sibilance. That’s not to say the LE3B is sibilant on its own – it isn’t – but the SM64 is a more tolerant of such artifacts in recordings. Lastly, the presentation of the LE3B is slightly wider whereas the SM64 appears more intimate, though still far from congested.

1964EARS 1964-V3 ($425)

 1964EARS’ triple-BA model is tuned for a decidedly consumer-friendly sound with big bass and sparkly, energetic, treble. The enhanced-bass Lime Ears boast a bit less bass than the V3 and offer a slightly clearer and more neutral overall sound. The midrange of the LE3B is flatter, in contrast to the bumped-up, more forward mids of the V3. The treble is smoother, with less sparkle but also less danger of harshness and sibilance. The V3, on the other hand, tends to be fairly revealing of sibilance and more colored-sounding overall. In terms of presentation, the V3 is more aggressive while the Lime Ears are more laid-back.

Unique Melody Miracle ($949)

 Unique Melody’s flagship IEM offers a level sound signature more in line with the regular LE3, but for the sake of posterity I decided to compare it to the LE3B as well. Unsurprisingly, the results are much the same as when the LE3B is pitted against the LE3. Next to the Miracle, the LE3B sounds mid-bassy and bloated, with a warmer overall tone and a slight loss in overall clarity and refinement. The Miracle boasts more treble presence/energy, is more neutral in tone, and enjoys a slightly more spacious presentation. Still, though I found myself leaning towards the Miracle more here than in the LE3/Miracle comparison, the difference between the two can easily be negated by signature preferences.

FitEar To Go! 334 ($1345)

 The TG334 is quite similar in performance to the LE3B but whereas the FitEar is unabashedly warm and dark, the Lime Ears at least make an attempt at a reference sound. Overall, the LE3B is more balanced and neutral while still offering good bass punch. The more prominent treble of the LE3B makes it sound a touch clearer and its soundstage is a little more out-of-the-head. Other than that, the two earphones are about even in performance, with both lacking a bit of treble extension and some of the refinement of more neutral sets. I preferred one or the other on most of the tracks used in the comparison, but never strongly.

 Value *(8.5/10) *– Operational for only a few months so far, Lime Ears is off to a very good start with their first flagships, the LE3 and LE3B. Functionally and aesthetically, the earphones are identical, with the same customization options, construction, and accessories. In terms of sound, the LE3 is a reference monitor that sacrifices a bit of bass depth to maintain a clearer, more prominent midrange while the LE3B is warmer and bassier without throwing accuracy under the bus. Both units offer advantages over the entry-level customs I’ve previously come across and compete with pricier earphones. As for choosing between the two, there’s no right or wrong answer, but I have found the bass depth and dynamics of the LE3B very persuasive in day to day listening.

*Pros: Both tunings offer competitive performance for their sound signatures; cables resist oxidation
 Cons: Cables prone to memory effect*


----------



## Deviltooth

Great review of the Lime Ears offerings; I especially enjoyed the comparisons.  It's always a positive thing to see detailed CIEM reviews.
   
  Though I note at the asking price it would be up against Alclair's RSM 4 driver model, not the Reference.  Against Clear Tunes it competes directly with the 5 driver CT-500 (my daily driver for a good many months).


----------



## mangatmodi

@ljokerl

Sir, I need your opinion on the following as you are the one who has listened to both Ultimate Ears 500 & 600.

I like both Rap (Eminem) and classical rock(Led Zepp, Nirvana) equally. After reading your reviews, I am unable to decide between these two.

I would like clear guitar riffs which is better in UE600 but I am worried to miss deep bass beats in Rap songs (Which I believe will be better in UE500). As I understand that bass is extremely low in UE600 where UE500 still manages to do ok in highs. Should I go for UE500 or UE600? Which will be a better trade-off?

I am also worried about cable durability on UE500 as pointed by many head-fiers here, I broke my she3590 and soundmagic es-18 recently. How is the build quality of UE500 compared to these two? Should taping a duct tape at the jack-wire joint will solve the issue?

Thanks in advance...

PS: I am sticking with UE because this is the only decent headphone brand available in India with good after sales service. You won't find shure, Hifi-man etc. here.


----------



## RochRx7

Quote:


mangatmodi said:


> @ljokerl
> I like both Rap (Eminem) and classical rock(Led Zepp, Nirvana) equally. After reading your reviews, I am unable to decide between these two.
> 
> I would like clear guitar riffs which is better in UE600 but I am worried to miss deep bass beats in Rap songs (Which I believe will be better in UE500). As I understand that bass is extremely low in UE600 where UE500 still manages to do ok in highs. Should I go for UE500 or UE600? Which will be a better trade-off?


 
  Is getting both an option? As you already know the dynamic vs, ba sentiment.. they compliment each other very well. And you've got a grasp on how they sound already.
  
  I like the UE600s a lot... vocals guitars soundstage is simply amazing for what I paid ($37 at midnightbox.com) .. but if you like detail/accurate treble (high hats cymbals etc..) I don't think the 600's do AS good a job as their midrange.. eq'ing made them sound unnatural.. atleast to my ears..
   
  and UE500s are $18.55 at compuplus.com .. Not sure how much int'l shipping will cost ya.. but it's worth a try.


----------



## Chude Mleko

Hi Joker,
   
  Great reviews, I'm really impressed and inspired by your work.
   
  My experiences:
  I got Xears Nature N3i a good while ago following your reviews. I enjoyed them for some 8-9 months but they broke (cable issue) and were replaced with same model. In a meantime I ordered Xears Amazing A330M and I was disappointed with them hugely so I send them back for another pair of Xears Nature N3i. First (second really) pair broke after 7 months but Xears refused to replace them.
  I got MEElectronics A161P again following good reviews and I enjoyed them even more until they broke (cable again). New pair is on a way as MEElectronics accepted guarantee claim.
  While A161P was not working I was using N3i but they broke as well (third pair) (this time looks like a driver.)
   
  I'm very disappointed with Xears quality and customer service. I'm happy with MEE customer service.
  I wonder if all earphones have to brake under 12 month if are used day in day out? That way they are not really good value for money. Especially when I think my stock Sony Ericsson earphones are still going well after maybe 2 years of usage.
   
  To the point:
  I very much like A161P sound but I can imagine they could be better. I think they are missing some air or space or whatever you want to call it.
  N3i sounds OK but have a too much bass and not enough mid to my liking.
  I've just ordered VSonic GR06 hoping they will be close to A161P.
   
  What else would you recommend I try? I'm only learning about my sound signature preference but what I know for sure is I don't like when bass or high tones are exaggerated. I do enjoy bass though, I do listen to bass centric stuff like Marcus Miller, Primus or Bill Laswell. I listen to jazz mostly but some rock / metal as well.
   
  Sorry for long and messy message. I hope you'll give me some tips / recommendations anyway!
   
  Keep the good work!
   
  Mleko


----------



## mangatmodi

@RochRx7

I am very tight on budget and both UE500 and U600 costs almost same, around 100$ each in all the offline and online stores in India. Headphones are extremely costly in India as they are assumed to be a luxury commodity, very high taxes and import duty. I am really dying to own both, but currently I can choose only one of them. So Any Idea which will be better pick for my taste. Which one will give better sound if we combine scores from both bass and treble performance.


----------



## ALuckyChance

Hey ljokerl, another new poster here. I'm looking for an IEM less than $25 that has as good a soundstage and depth/width as I can get for such a budget price. I'm not a basshead or anything (though I guess I don't mind a bit of punch to my lower frequencies), and I dislike harsh or overly exaggerated treble.
   
  For reference: My first step into portable headphones was a pair of Koss KSC-75 clip-ons, which I liked except for the somewhat fatiguing and shrill highs. I later tried the Monoprice 8320s and really didn't like them - the sound was wide but it had a huge lack of depth or detail to my ears.


----------



## RochRx7

>


  @ALuckyChance
 Check out his review on Soundmagic PL30 (older version) and E30 (new version) It's what you're looking for in that price range/sound preference.
   
  @mangatmodi
 What genre takes up more of your listening time? My personal vote would be the UE600.. but that's because a lot of my weight in points is for the better accuracy/detail/style/vocal presentation and SOUNDSTAGE!


----------



## mangatmodi

@ RochRx7

I listen Classical rock, specifically Led Zeppelin and Jimmi Hendrix. Just wondering which one is worst? Bass amount in UE600 or Treble in UE500? If Bass in UE600 is enjoyable, I would go for it as I am not much bass-headed, I just want bass to be there in the music as the original one. Led Zeppelin is a great rock band but they do have some great bass work in their songs


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





mangatmodi said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> Sir, I need your opinion on the following as you are the one who has listened to both Ultimate Ears 500 & 600.
> 
> ...


 
   
          man get the ue600 , its got enough bass and ue500 wont blow you out of the water , xb90ex can but wont blow your brains out .
       all the ue's have bad build quality bar ue350/200/900 , 700 was a bad day for me , 600 needs some care too , and ue500 dont build much confidence , but the 500 is the strongest of these three . my ue500 is still going good for last 12 months , just take a bit more care of them . earpiece build quality is not upto the mark too .
   
  to avoid the jack wire issue , keep it at 0 degree with your device , and dont pull the wire while disconnecting .
   
  brother ( i will get my name in voter list as soon as 2014 ) , try the xb90ex at a sony store . auditions wont cost any thing , reach out to your nearest sony center and ask them if you can have a go at them . xb90ex doesnt have the awesome clarity of ue600 but overall it can beat the ue500 imo . im not a bass fan , but man this xb90ex goes deep , as deep as hell .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





mangatmodi said:


> @RochRx7
> 
> I am very tight on budget and both UE500 and U600 costs almost same, around 100$ each in all the offline and online stores in India. Headphones are extremely costly in India as they are assumed to be a luxury commodity, very high taxes and import duty. I am really dying to own both, but currently I can choose only one of them. So Any Idea which will be better pick for my taste. Which one will give better sound if we combine scores from both bass and treble performance.


 

        grab it from grabmore.com , may be under 4800rs .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





aluckychance said:


> Hey ljokerl, another new poster here. I'm looking for an IEM less than $25 that has as good a soundstage and depth/width as I can get for such a budget price. I'm not a basshead or anything (though I guess I don't mind a bit of punch to my lower frequencies), and I dislike harsh or overly exaggerated treble.
> 
> For reference: My first step into portable headphones was a pair of Koss KSC-75 clip-ons, which I liked except for the somewhat fatiguing and shrill highs. I later tried the Monoprice 8320s and really didn't like them - the sound was wide but it had a huge lack of depth or detail to my ears.


 

        if you are not a bass huger , try the panas for a change , the hje-355 will suit you , and the cw31 from meelec will do too , if you want your bass to kick in at times and can give up the treble spark get the e30 ( i hate the e30 just becuz it lacks the treble spark ) . sadly your are on a tighter budget .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





deviltooth said:


> Great review of the Lime Ears offerings; I especially enjoyed the comparisons.  It's always a positive thing to see detailed CIEM reviews.
> 
> Though I note at the asking price it would be up against Alclair's RSM 4 driver model, not the Reference.  Against Clear Tunes it competes directly with the 5 driver CT-500 (my daily driver for a good many months).


 
   
  Thanks!
   
  Unfortunately I don't have the RSM or the CT-500 yet. I had an early (pre-production, I think) RSM for a little while but sent it back for a treble re-tune and never got i back 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. It was competitive with the Lime Ears except for the treble, which was a little harsh, as with the 3-driver Reference. 
   
  The reason for comparing to models priced lower (and higher) is for perspective. I also try to find approximate signature matches so that the comparisons are potentially useful to someone making a buying decision. A comparison between the Lime Ears and Spiral Ear SE-3, for example, won't do much good as they sound quite different. 
   
  Quote: 





mangatmodi said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> Sir, I need your opinion on the following as you are the one who has listened to both Ultimate Ears 500 & 600.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I think the UE500 is the safe choice here (for sound, not construction). The clarity, detail, etc really aren't that bad and you won't find the bass lacking coming from the SHE3590 (which has quite a bit of bass). Build quality is pretty average with all of these UEs - not sure how to fix the issue with the jack. Maybe some heatshrink as a preemptive measure - duct tape might void UE warranty. 
   
  I'm surprised Shure is not more widely available in India. That's unfortunate as the SE215 would suit you well. 
   
  Quote: 





chude mleko said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Great reviews, I'm really impressed and inspired by your work.
> 
> ...


 
   
  I think after the A161P the GR06 might sound a bit congested but who knows, you may like it. If not, try the LG Quadbeat. Bass is somewhere between the N3i and A161P in quantity but more importantly it's got a wide sound that makes even the A161P sound a little closed-in. I think you might like it, and it's cheap enough to replace should anything go wrong. 
   
  Quote: 





aluckychance said:


> Hey ljokerl, another new poster here. I'm looking for an IEM less than $25 that has as good a soundstage and depth/width as I can get for such a budget price. I'm not a basshead or anything (though I guess I don't mind a bit of punch to my lower frequencies), and I dislike harsh or overly exaggerated treble.
> 
> For reference: My first step into portable headphones was a pair of Koss KSC-75 clip-ons, which I liked except for the somewhat fatiguing and shrill highs. I later tried the Monoprice 8320s and really didn't like them - the sound was wide but it had a huge lack of depth or detail to my ears.


 
   
  All of the good stuff will probably run closer to $35 - the Sony MH1C, Soundmagic E10/E30, and even VSonic GR99. With a hard $25 limit I would just go for the Philips SHE3580. It's not as wide-sounding as the 8320 but it's more well-rounded.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I'm surprised Shure is not more widely available in India. That's unfortunate as the SE215 would suit you well.


 
           man shure's prices out here are breath taking , $150+ for se215 .


----------



## mangatmodi

@ suman134
xb90ex looks good in reviews and they are way cheaper than UE500. I will try them out, however where did you found sure headphones in India? I could not find them anywhere online. The ones on ebay, naaptol are imports by people, so no warranty in India. Risky deals. Shures are never official launched in India. (Offtopic: Good you are getting voter id, vote carefully to eliminate all corrupt leaders, otherwise headphones could have been lot cheaper in India.)

@ljokerl
Really its very frustrating for all music lovers in India. I will try xb90x once and decide. I am more inclined towards UE600 as I want to try BA once.

PS: I will not be available for a week. I will catch the discussion later


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





mangatmodi said:


> @ suman134
> xb90ex looks good in reviews and they are way cheaper than UE500. I will try them out, however where did you found sure headphones in India? I could not find them anywhere online. The ones on ebay, naaptol are imports by people, so no warranty in India. Risky deals. Shures are never official launched in India. (Offtopic: Good you are getting voter id, vote carefully to eliminate all corrupt leaders, otherwise headphones could have been lot cheaper in India.)
> 
> @ljokerl
> ...


 
   
        man in getting kind of green card , will vote wisely never the less , yes shures were never lunched in india , snapdeal have them for sale with cod , i like the se210 over the se215 but yes they have the risk . and man get the ba , a ba any day over a midrange dynamic . even a pl50/she9850 will do , cc51 will rock , ue600 will rule .


----------



## suman134

and a er-4pt is all need to end the day .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> man shure's prices out here are breath taking , $150+ for se215 .


 
   
  Ouch. I guess it makes sense if there's no official distribution.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

mangatmodi said:


> @ suman134
> xb90ex looks good in reviews and they are way cheaper than UE500. I will try them out, however where did you found sure headphones in India? I could not find them anywhere online. The ones on ebay, naaptol are imports by people, so no warranty in India. Risky deals. Shures are never official launched in India. (Offtopic: Good you are getting voter id, vote carefully to eliminate all corrupt leaders, otherwise headphones could have been lot cheaper in India.)
> 
> @ljokerl
> ...




Is your player an iDevice or a rooted android phone by any chance? You could get the UE600 and accudio for iDevices and have it simulate many many different earphones for you  (ue500 unfortunately not included) Or you could get Viper4Android and ask me to make a ue600 to ue500 filter for you


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





joe bloggs said:


> Is your player an iDevice or a rooted android phone by any chance? You could get the UE600 and accudio for iDevices and have it simulate many many different earphones for you
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
   
         for android device , i like rock box . it rules but is complicated how good is viper4 .


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





suman134 said:


> for android device , i like rock box . it rules but is complicated how good is viper4 .


 
   
  Its claim to fame (for me anyway) is the ability to load impulse response files for convolution.  This essentially lets you export 90% of the sound processing effects out there (EQ, reverb, etc.) to your android.  My main application for it is to create precision crafted corrective equalization for my headphones using Electri-Q on the computer and export them to Viper4Android.  In the conventional sense, Rockbox has the best parametric equalizer out there for portable devices, but Viper4Android lets you load the most advanced EQ preset with one button once you've exported it from the PC (and editing an advanced EQ preset is much easier on a PC than on a phone anyway).
   
  I've made a thread on correcting headphone response (like Accudio for apple) using Viper4Android here:
  http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2372750


----------



## BLACKSasquatch

Hello all, I'm in the market for a pair of CIEMs and have a budget of $1200, I am, however, looking for a specific sound. I have previously owned several pairs of Universal IEMs among which the Monster Turbine Copper had my favorite sound signature. After smoothing out the bass and bringing out the vocals I had a signature that I really loved and enjoyed until they were taken from my possession recently. I figured with your pooled experiences one of you may have discovered an CIEM with similar signature that has that same level of effortless fun in it. Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blacksasquatch said:


> Hello all, I'm in the market for a pair of CIEMs and have a budget of $1200, I am, however, looking for a specific sound. I have previously owned several pairs of Universal IEMs among which the Monster Turbine Copper had my favorite sound signature. After smoothing out the bass and bringing out the vocals I had a signature that I really loved and enjoyed until they were taken from my possession recently. I figured with your pooled experiences one of you may have discovered an CIEM with similar signature that has that same level of effortless fun in it. Thank you.


 

 That sounds like a Westone ES5 to me. It's got a smooth signature with forward mids for prominent vocals. Bass is plentiful - it is the third bassiest CIEM I've heard after the Spiral Ear SE-3 and 1964EARS 1964-V. The Heir Audio 8.A has similar bass power and overall sound quality but it's got more laid-back mids, and since you had to EQ the mids of the Copper forward, I think the ES5, with its more forward mids, might be a better option for you (not to mention the price difference).
   
  I haven't had a chance to add the ES5 to this thread yet but I reviewed it here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/totl-madness-24-top-line-custom-ear-monitors-reviewed-ljokerl


----------



## BLACKSasquatch

It seems like may be a bit _too_ bass heavy, could you also recommend a few others just in case (I was considering UM as a possible candidate if that helps)
   
  My primary genre is Acoustic, Alternative, Post-Hardcore, Punk and Ska with a primary focus on vocals.


----------



## mangatmodi

@suman134 @ljokerl

With such positive response, I've decided to buy UE600. I'll let you know once I get my hands on them.

@Joe Bloggs
I will be using my headphones on Cowon E2, however I am purchasing HTC One. I will ping you then for Viper4Android filter. Thanks for the recommendation. However where could I read more about music EQ practices? I am really interested to try my hands on custom EQ modes!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blacksasquatch said:


> It seems like may be a bit _too_ bass heavy, could you also recommend a few others just in case (I was considering UM as a possible candidate if that helps)
> 
> My primary genre is Acoustic, Alternative, Post-Hardcore, Punk and Ska with a primary focus on vocals.


 

 It's bass-heavy by balanced armature standards, but you're coming from a Turbine Pro. Anyway, pretty much everything else will have less bass. The UM Miracle is pretty lean, it has a fraction of the Coppers' bass boost. The JH13Pro Freqphase would be a better option if you're looking for something closer to flat but not entirely lacking in bass, but again it does not sound like any Monster earphone I've heard.


----------



## BLACKSasquatch

I was thinking something like the JH16Freq's or the UE Merlin, I just want to make sure I get the signature right before buying, there is nowhere in my area where I can try on universal fit versions sadly. Thanks again.


----------



## audionewbi

First of all thank you for your wonderful thread, I am really interested to see where in your list would you place the ck100pro. I think it is the best universal IEM there is in the market, it is one of the most under-rated IEM there is.


----------



## vwinter

audionewbi said:


> First of all thank you for your wonderful thread, I am really interested to see where in your list would you place the ck100pro. I think it is the best universal IEM there is in the market, it is one of the most under-rated IEM there is.




If by underrated you mean that not many people have reviewed it then yea lol, but I haven't heard many people, if anyone, say it was anything but really good. It's one of those unfortunate IEMs that will likely never see widespread appeal, probably because it's expensive without having that niche company appeal.

The new FAD Heaven V and VI are likely in a similar camp. They have the niche company appeal but not many people will feel comfortable ponying up $300-500 on a single BA IEM.


----------



## audionewbi

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> If by underrated you mean that not many people have reviewed it then yea lol, but I haven't heard many people, if anyone, say it was anything but really good. It's one of those unfortunate IEMs that will likely never see widespread appeal, probably because it's expensive without having that niche company appeal.
> 
> The new FAD Heaven V and VI are likely in a similar camp. They have the niche company appeal but not many people will feel comfortable ponying up $300-500 on a single BA IEM.


 
  you got PM my friend 
   
  As far as CK100PRO goes I say under-rated as the infamous reviewers of head-fi and various audio-blogs have neglected reviewing this. Only Tai informally considered them as the best universal he has heard but their price point did not interest him. But with the current low prices ranging from 350-450 USD I think that places them in a category where many are able to risk purchasing them. 
   
  Having auditioned W4, SE535,F111 and UE900 in my ears they easily outclass all those IEM. It even bested the EX-1000, meaning it kept all the good part of EX-1000 dynamic sound and added the goodness BA have with them in terms of accuracy and speed.


----------



## vwinter

audionewbi said:


> you got PM my friend
> 
> As far as CK100PRO goes I say under-rated as the infamous reviewers of head-fi and various audio-blogs have neglected reviewing this. Only Tai informally considered them as the best universal he has heard but their price point did not interest him. But with the current low prices ranging from 350-450 USD I think that places them in a category where many are able to risk purchasing them.
> 
> Having auditioned W4, SE535,F111 and UE900 in my ears they easily outclass all those IEM. It even bested the EX-1000, meaning it kept all the good part of EX-1000 dynamic sound and added the goodness BA have with them in terms of accuracy and speed.




Ever since I first read about them, they've been on my try if you possibly can list. And I've always had a soft spot for Audio Technica since my first headphone upgrade was the CK7.

Anyway, that's quite an endoresement so I hope more people do give them a shot. Maybe then I can talk someone into giving me go at them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





audionewbi said:


> First of all thank you for your wonderful thread, I am really interested to see where in your list would you place the ck100pro. I think it is the best universal IEM there is in the market, it is one of the most under-rated IEM there is.


 

 Unfortunately Audio-Technica doesn't deem the US audience worthy of their BA models. We just get the enhanced-bass junk.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Quote: 





mangatmodi said:


> @suman134 @ljokerl
> 
> With such positive response, I've decided to buy UE600. I'll let you know once I get my hands on them.
> 
> ...


 
   
  For the most part, unless you're aiming hard at correcting the earphones, just twiddle the knobs and sliders until you get something you like, and remember to keep the signal level below clipping by lowering the preamp slider or keeping all the sliders below zero if there's no preamp slider.
   
  People have written "guides" on EQing, like these
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/413900/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-a-tutorial
  http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress
   
  I wrote the last one myself and even I won't say it's up to much good 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 It takes either a lot of experience or more explaining than anyone cares to do.  I'm guessing the ones who found the right way to do it disappeared from the forums because they've found audio nirvana and are too busy enjoying music to explain how they did it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  The canned presets I'm making for Viper4Android should go a long way towards bettering the sound from a variety of phones but for the best results, custom tuning is still desirable


----------



## lukEM22

Joker, which do you think I would like better, the FXD-80 or the EPH-100? I listen to rap and rock music, and sometimes a little jazz. Are the EPH's worth $60 more than the FXD-80s? I want good isolation and comfort, as well as a smooth sound.


----------



## esteebin

lukem22 said:


> Joker, which do you think I would like better, the FXD-80 or the EPH-100? I listen to rap and rock music, and sometimes a little jazz. Are the EPH's worth $60 more than the FXD-80s? I want good isolation and comfort, as well as a smooth sound.




Amazon has the EPH-100 for under $115. I do not have either one, but based on reviews and the type of music you listen to, and if your ear canal is not too small, you might enjoy the EPH-100.


----------



## Grayson73

Joker,
   
  What would you recommend for jogging, around $75 or less?  I suppose for jogging, they have to be able to hook on the ear?


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> Joker,
> 
> What would you recommend for jogging, around $75 or less?  I suppose for jogging, they have to be able to hook on the ear?


 
  Take the Meelec M6 or S6 - you'll enjoy it!


----------



## RochRx7

Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> Joker,
> 
> What would you recommend for jogging, around $75 or less?  I suppose for jogging, they have to be able to hook on the ear?


 
  Would probably help if you gave him your preferred music preference or sound signature.. there's a couple great options with over-ear wears.


----------



## meat01

Quote: 





rochrx7 said:


> Would probably help if you gave him your preferred music preference or sound signature.. there's a couple great options with over-ear wears.


 

 I am guessing it isn't jazz, opera or classical 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.  Probably something upbeat like rock or hip hop.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lukem22 said:


> Joker, which do you think I would like better, the FXD-80 or the EPH-100? I listen to rap and rock music, and sometimes a little jazz. Are the EPH's worth $60 more than the FXD-80s? I want good isolation and comfort, as well as a smooth sound.


 
   
  They are pretty well-matched in everything aside from sound signature but for smooth sound I'd choose the EPH-100 despite the price gap.
   
  Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> Joker,
> 
> What would you recommend for jogging, around $75 or less?  I suppose for jogging, they have to be able to hook on the ear?


 

 The MEElec M6 mentioned above is a good cheap option. I don't really recommend buying non-sport earphones even if they sound better because it's not clear how they will hold up to sweat, etc. However, I've seen some good feedback on the soundmagic E30 being used for sports and I used my older soundmagic PL30 at the gym for years, so I'd make an exception for that. It lacks the memory wire of the M6 but has a more hi-fi sound to it and still doesn't cost an arm and a leg.


----------



## Grayson73

Quote: 





meat01 said:


> I am guessing it isn't jazz, opera or classical
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  You got it, mostly rock and pop!


----------



## d marc0

Hi Joker!
   
  I was wondering if you've tried the HTC bundled headset? They sound pretty good to me for a bundled headphone and if my memory is at least close to accurate, they sound more enjoyable compared to the MH1c. Really nice bassy iem I must say; comparable to the Zero Audio Basso. Although not as refined but definitely worth keeping.
   
http://compare.ebay.com.au/like/190876808013?ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&cbt=y&_lwgsi=y&item_id=190876808013


----------



## BLACKSasquatch

The Westones sound like I good fit, however, from what I've read, the UE Merlin might also be worth a shot, I just want to make sure I get the signature right before buying, there is nowhere in my area where I can try on universal fit versions sadly. Thanks again.


----------



## Deviltooth

For the gym I still like my Brainwavz R1.  It's held up to a lot of sweat and abuse, including getting yanked out of my ears when it gets caught on a weight etc....


----------



## MoonYeol

Deleted.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





d marc0 said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> I was wondering if you've tried the HTC bundled headset? They sound pretty good to me for a bundled headphone and if my memory is at least close to accurate, they sound more enjoyable compared to the MH1c. Really nice bassy iem I must say; comparable to the Zero Audio Basso. Although not as refined but definitely worth keeping.
> 
> http://compare.ebay.com.au/like/190876808013?ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&cbt=y&_lwgsi=y&item_id=190876808013


 
   
  My HTC phone came with a set of HTC-branded earbuds (not an in-ear headset). Never seen that one before.
   
  Quote: 





blacksasquatch said:


> The Westones sound like I good fit, however, from what I've read, the UE Merlin might also be worth a shot, I just want to make sure I get the signature right before buying, there is nowhere in my area where I can try on universal fit versions sadly. Thanks again.


 
   
  No doubt. Getting the customs with the right sound signature is 100% worth your time.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> Joker,
> 
> What would you recommend for jogging, around $75 or less?  I suppose for jogging, they have to be able to hook on the ear?


 

 Mee M6 / S6  If you want armature goodness try Sony XBA - 65


----------



## Towwers

Hi Joker,
   
  I'm saving a lot of cash for a high quality in-ear earphone. I'm between the Shure SE846 or a custom Westone ES5.  My musical tastes are varied, I listen electronic, rock, metal, classic and instrumental music. I do like warm sound with good amount of bass but not overwhelming, I like the sound of the westone 4 I currently own. What would yo recommend me? If you where in my shoes which one would you go for? 
   
  Thank You!!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





towwers said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I'm saving a lot of cash for a high quality in-ear earphone. I'm between the Shure SE846 or a custom Westone ES5.  My musical tastes are varied, I listen electronic, rock, metal, classic and instrumental music. I do like warm sound with good amount of bass but not overwhelming, I like the sound of the westone 4 I currently own. What would yo recommend me? If you where in my shoes which one would you go for?
> 
> Thank You!!


 

 I haven't heard the SE846. Has it been released?
   
  The ES5 is an earphone I actually quite like even though it doesn't match my preferred sound signature. It fits your requirements of a warm sound with plentiful but not overwhelming bass. It's quite similar to the Lime Ears LE3B I reviewed recently, except with slightly tighter bass, better clarity, and more forward mids. But as for how it compares to the SE846 and whether it's a better fit for you than the Shure, I can't be of any help.


----------



## nick n

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the SE846. Has it been released?


 
  apparently  now it has been. AT least Singapore
http://www.head-fi.org/t/476455/c-c-tu-portable-tube-amp-review#post_9675305


----------



## edyeded

Any chance the JH16 freqphase are going to reviewed?
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





nick n said:


> apparently  now it has been. AT least Singapore
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/476455/c-c-tu-portable-tube-amp-review#post_9675305


 
   
  Thanks. Too bad I've never had any luck getting in touch with Shure. 
   
  Quote: 





edyeded said:


> Any chance the JH16 freqphase are going to reviewed?
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  Sorry, only the JH13s.


----------



## Amitl

any plans on reviewing the KEF M200?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> any plans on reviewing the KEF M200?


 

 Not at this time.


----------



## ljokerl

Couple of new higher-end IEM releases from RHA. Hopefully more of the good stuff that made the entry-level MA-350 enjoyable.
   
  MA-600i
   

   
  MA-750i:
   
   

   
   
   
  Posted the press release here.


----------



## tomscy2000

Looks nice --- the MA750 looks like the CK100PRO and the K3003 had a baby delivered by Reid Heath. I like the stainless steel tips tray too.


----------



## james444

^ Ha, I'd rather say the K3003 had a bit on the side with a FAD 1601.


----------



## audionewbi

I am sold on MA750, will order it for sure.


----------



## tomscy2000

Quote: 





james444 said:


> ^ Ha, I'd rather say the K3003 had a bit on the side with a FAD 1601.


 

 So promiscuous...


----------



## music_4321

Can one trust manufacturers' FR graphs?


----------



## FlySweep

> Originally Posted by *music_4321* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Can one trust manufacturers' FR graphs?


 
   
  The dip at ~22K makes it a deal breaker for me.. such lazy tuning.


----------



## audionewbi

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> The dip at ~22K makes it a deal breaker for me.. such lazy tuning.


 
  You are joking about this right?


----------



## Inks

That's a very smoothed graph so there's not much one can get it from it, except bandwidth looks great.


----------



## erde

Hi,
   
  it's time for a new iem and i have limit circa 130$. I read many of reviews and i'm choosing between sennheiser ie60 and hifiman re-400 but i can't find any comparison between them (maybe it's obvious). Or vsonic gr06 seems to be great considering it's price, but is it comparable with ie60 and re400?
  I listen to rock-metal, but also classical and accoustic, mostly while traveling (train, bus).
  What would you suggest?
   
  Thanks!


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> The dip at ~22K makes it a deal breaker for me.. such lazy tuning.


 

      thats not what you hear .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> Can one trust manufacturers' FR graphs?


 

      nope , its not totally reliable .


----------



## higbvuyb

Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> Can one trust manufacturers' FR graphs?


 
  Look at the scale. It suddenly drops off 30 dB from 7 kHz to 12 kHz.


----------



## vwinter

Looks closer to 20dB from 7k. But it also looks really smoothed like Inks said so...
Sexy design though. That's worth a few dBs I think.


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> The dip at ~22K makes it a deal breaker for me.. such lazy tuning.


 
   
  I know!
   
  Quote: 





suman134 said:


> nope , its not totally reliable .


 
   
  It was more of a rhetorical question.
   
  Quote: 





higbvuyb said:


> Look at the scale. It suddenly drops off 30 dB from 7 kHz to 12 kHz.


 
   
  It's actually 25dB not 30 — yes, a pretty steep dip, but I remain curious. If that graph turns out to be fairly close to the real thing, I wonder what these IEMs will sound like. At least good old grumpy sparrows already know that a FR graph does _not_ always correlate to what they hear in the real world.


----------



## warrenpchi

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Couple of new higher-end IEM releases from RHA. Hopefully more of the good stuff that made the entry-level MA-350 enjoyable.


 
   
  ljokerl, did you get one yet?  If not, will you be getting one in soon?
   
  Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Looks nice --- the MA750 looks like the CK100PRO and the K3003 had a baby delivered by Reid Heath. I like the stainless steel tips tray too.


 
   
  Schmexy!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Need someone to cover it for Cymba?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> Can one trust manufacturers' FR graphs?


 
   
  Lol, I don't even remotely care about their graph right now... but to answer your question, nope.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  I just want to hear the thing
   
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> The dip at ~22K makes it a deal breaker for me.. such lazy tuning.


 
   
  LOL!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
   
  Also, more info and pics here:  http://www.head-fi.org/t/675848/new-rha-iems-the-ma750i-and-ma600i


----------



## blueangel2323

What's with the supersonic peak? That's probably around 25-30k :O


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tomscy2000 said:


> Looks nice --- the MA750 looks like the CK100PRO and the K3003 had a baby delivered by Reid Heath. I like the stainless steel tips tray too.


 
   
  Quote: 





james444 said:


> ^ Ha, I'd rather say the K3003 had a bit on the side with a FAD 1601.


 
   
  No complaints here, I would have all of my favorite IEMs in stainless steel if I could. Especially my customs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





flysweep said:


> The dip at ~22K makes it a deal breaker for me.. such lazy tuning.


 
   




   
  Quote: 





erde said:


> Hi,
> 
> it's time for a new iem and i have limit circa 130$. I read many of reviews and i'm choosing between sennheiser ie60 and hifiman re-400 but i can't find any comparison between them (maybe it's obvious). Or vsonic gr06 seems to be great considering it's price, but is it comparable with ie60 and re400?
> I listen to rock-metal, but also classical and accoustic, mostly while traveling (train, bus).
> ...


 
   
  I haven't heard the IE60 but I have the IE6 and it's not as good as the RE-400. Neither is the GR06. If you want a pretty flat/neutral sound with smooth treble, the RE-400 is the one to get in that price range.
   
  Quote: 





warrenpchi said:


> ljokerl, did you get one yet?  If not, will you be getting one in soon?


 

 All I got is a press release 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I'm a sucker for stainless steel, though, so I'll see if I can get one.


----------



## music_4321

Quote: 





warrenpchi said:


> Lol, I don't even remotely care about their graph right now... but to answer your question, nope.


 
   
  Oh, rest assured I learned my lesson when FAD had claimed the Piano Fortes had a perfectly flat FR curve — when I saw that, I eagerly went ahead and ordered a pair of PF IXs, only to later realise the FR was ever so slightly skewed.


----------



## warrenpchi

Quote: 





music_4321 said:


> Oh, rest assured I learned my lesson when FAD had claimed the Piano Fortes had a perfectly flat FR curve — when I saw that, I eagerly went ahead and ordered a pair of PF IXs, only to later realise the FR was ever so slightly skewed.


 
   
  Just a _tad_ off in spots eh?


----------



## jekostas

That is a really weird, compressed FR graph.
   
  Anyways, joker, I guess neither of the PNY headphones intrigued you as they're on the "not going to get a full review" list, but how are the cables?  They midtowns are cheap, I figured I might get them just to cannibalize the cable for another project.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jekostas said:


> That is a really weird, compressed FR graph.
> 
> Anyways, joker, I guess neither of the PNY headphones intrigued you as they're on the "not going to get a full review" list, but how are the cables?  They midtowns are cheap, I figured I might get them just to cannibalize the cable for another project.


 

 Actually there are a whole bunch of earphones I haven't had a chance to categorize yet (thanks for the reminder!).
   
  I have the PNY Midtowns and the Uptowns and they are both not bad. Nice deep bass that's reasonably tight, and good overall clarity. They sound like a lot of other cheaper earphones that are decent but generally lackluster - the Noontec Rio, for example. Good news is the PNYs are like $15 on Amazon and at that price I have no complaints.


----------



## macrocheesium

Hey Joker, great thread you have here! I'm just getting into IEMs and need something portable to replace my full-sized cans. What would you recommend that's "fun" but still relatively neutral, with tight bass and easy highs? For reference I love my FA-003/HM5, although I wouldn't mind something a little more exciting either. The one thing I can't stand is harsh highs. I'm just going to be using these while walking around campus, so I couldn't care less about soundstage and detail retrieval, but isolation needs to be good. I'm really just interested in getting that sound signature and clarity. $150 is my budget but buying used is totally a possibility.


----------



## zubin111

Hi Joker, hope you are doing good... Now what would be an ideal upgrade to MH1c and Quadbeat, i got both and although i think both are superbly good for the price, would GR07BE at discounted prices be worth the investment? Or RE400?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





macrocheesium said:


> Hey Joker, great thread you have here! I'm just getting into IEMs and need something portable to replace my full-sized cans. What would you recommend that's "fun" but still relatively neutral, with tight bass and easy highs? For reference I love my FA-003/HM5, although I wouldn't mind something a little more exciting either. The one thing I can't stand is harsh highs. I'm just going to be using these while walking around campus, so I couldn't care less about soundstage and detail retrieval, but isolation needs to be good. I'm really just interested in getting that sound signature and clarity. $150 is my budget but buying used is totally a possibility.


 
   
  A few that come to mind:
  HiFiMan RE-400 - smooth and very clear, with tight bass and neutral tone. However, it has less bass than what I remember of the FA-003. If you're using them primarily in noisy environments you may not be satisfied with the bass response.
  Yamaha EPH-100 - these are the opposite of the RE-400 on the bass front, deep and powerful. They are a warm and fun-sounding IEM with pretty inoffensive treble. Too much bass might be a problem in this case but I thought the low end was rather well-done on these and their isolation would work nicely for use outside.
  Sony MH1C - much cheaper than the others but they have a very smooth sound with bass that is pretty well-controlled considering its quantity. Isolation is above average and clarity is generally good, though behind the two sets mentioned above.
  Shure SE215 - somewhat similar to the MH1C but a bit less refined. Makes up for it in user-friendliness, construction quality, and isolation. Again, a warmer sound, but this type of signature is probably your best bet if you want smooth treble and a bit of added "fun".
   
  Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker, hope you are doing good... Now what would be an ideal upgrade to MH1c and Quadbeat, i got both and although i think both are superbly good for the price, would GR07BE at discounted prices be worth the investment? Or RE400?


 

 While I do consider the VSonic and HiFiMan to be upgrades over those two, you may be surprised how close the Sony/LG already are to the good $100-200 earphones. Anyway, you should expect something along these lines:
   
  RE-400: good if you like the clarity and more neutral tone of the Quadbeat over the warmer, fuller sound of the MH1C. It won't have the bass depth of the Sony or the soundstage width of the LG, but it makes up for it with a balanced and neutral presentation, treble smoothness, and very clean bass.
  GR07BE: bassier than the RE-400 but also has more prominent treble a-la Quadbeat. Wider presentation than the RE-400 but the top end is not as smooth.


----------



## zubin111

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> While I do consider the VSonic and HiFiMan to be upgrades over those two, you may be surprised how close the Sony/LG already are to the good $100-200 earphones. Anyway, you should expect something along these lines:
> 
> RE-400: good if you like the clarity and more neutral tone of the Quadbeat over the warmer, fuller sound of the MH1C. It won't have the bass depth of the Sony or the soundstage width of the LG, but it makes up for it with a balanced and neutral presentation, treble smoothness, and very clean bass.
> GR07BE: bassier than the RE-400 but also has more prominent treble a-la Quadbeat. Wider presentation than the RE-400 but the top end is not as smooth.


 
  Hmmm... While i do love the energetic quadbeat and a little eqing gets me to a completely comfortable bass levels, but the truth is i end up keeping MH1c more in the ears than the LG, so now building up from here, i find MH1C a touch warm, so does something comes off your mind which retains the fatigue free character of the MH1c but improves upon clarity? I love the thump though...


----------



## ljokerl

More short impressions of IEMs I probably won't review in full (thanks to jekostas for the reminder)
   
   
  Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I promised to post updates on IEMs in my possession that I don't plan to review due to lack of time. Most of these are simply unexciting but in keeping with my promise I'll post short thoughts and add them to the list on the front page of the thread.


 
   
*Air Buds* - http://www.air-buds.com/product/air-buds-ear-buds/
   
  The foam tips are quite comfortable (though I think Complys are better) but other than that these are pretty generic. Build quality is not bad but the flat cable is a little noisy when worn down. Sound has lots of mid-bass and is pretty veiled overall, with a distinct hollow quality. Solid deep bass is lacking and the top end isn't all that smooth. There are better options, even with comfort in mind - the dB Logic EP-100 plus Shure Olives, still the most comfortable budget IEMs I've tried, or the PNY Uptown/Midtown, for example.
   
*Final Audio Adagio III* - http://final-audio-design.com/en/archives/898
   
  Very unique-looking design with different-colored left and right plastic earphones that somehow still look classy. Nice and lightweight fit with Final Audio's usual smooth and non-microphonic cabling. Generally a pleasure in everyday use. Sonically, though, they have some issues. Bass has nice impact and depth but there's a bit too much mid/upper bass presence, causing it to sound slightly boomy and bleed into the midrange. Sets like the RBH EP1 and PNY Midtown sound cleaner and tighter overall because the focus is on the sub-bass more so than the mid-bass. The midrange is prominent and has good clarity but there is an unusual coloration. Some may enjoy it but I would prefer smoother mids. The top end could also be flatter for my taste - it starts out strong, even a little harsh, but seems to lack the refinement and extension of comparable sets such as the Philips Fidelio S1. The Adagio is an interesting earphone but ultimately it's coloration didn't do much for me. I'd rather listen to the Sony MH1C. 
   
*HiSoundAudio HiPhone 4* - http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hisoundaudio-Hiphone-4-Red-HiFi-Grade-Earphones-for-Apple-iPhone-/380412961491
   
  Generic-looking earphone with metal housings and plasticky cables. Sounds much better than it looks, though. Lots of bass gives it a warm overall tone but the low end extends nicely and the sound is pleasant overall. Could use better bass control and more midrange clarity to be truly competitive but it's better than most other bassy sets in the $40 range.
   
*Noontec Rio *- http://en.noontec.com/En/Products/MusicalHeadphone/rio.html
   
  Very nice packaging and the earphones themselves seem well-built and nicely designed. The sound is yet again heavy on the deep bass a-la the RHA MA-350/450i and HiSound HiPhone. In this case there's too much bass and not enough midrange to keep up. In addition, the upper midrange seems overemphasized. Not a good combination - it makes the earphones sound both muffled and hollow at the same time. This one is best avoided. 
   
*Phiaton Moderna MS 200* - http://phiaton.com/moderna-ms-200
   
  I'm a long-time fan of Phiaton products - the bold aesthetic and generally pleasant sound easily wins me over, and the MS 200 is no exception - carbon fiber on the plug and earpieces, plus red accents and cables, all look very sharp. The build is nice, too, with well-integrated strain reliefs and slightly flattened cable. The sound is bassy, as with most Phiaton products, and a little boomy but the midrange and treble are not overly recessed. The MS 200 is not a neutral-sounding earphone but it's not as annoyingly unnatural as the Noontec Rio, for example. The biggest problem is that I'm not convinced that it is superior to the cheaper PS 20 model, and it generally struggles to keep up with the far cheaper Sony MH1C. The $120 price tag is hard to swallow unless aesthetic is key.

*RHA MA-450i* - http://www.rha-audio.com/us/ma450i-black.html
  Very similar to the MA-350 reviewed already in this thread. Sound is a hair clearer and it adds a 3-button remote and a couple of extra eartips. Build quality is excellent as with the MA-350. Quite nice for the price for those who need a sturdy, bassy earphone with a 3-button remote but not different enough from the MA-350 for a separate review at this time.
   
*RHA MA-150*
   
  Entry-level RHA earphones. Much wimpier in build and lacks the sub-bass emphasis, tight mid-bass, and clarity that make the MA-350/MA-450i special. Bass is more intrusive in comparison and the mids seem more veiled. Not bad for the price but not the best option, either.
   
*Torque t103z* - http://www.torque-audio.com/products-headphones/t103z-headphones/
   
  Incredibly well-done packaging and fantastic design and construction overall reminiscent of the $1300 AKG K3003. The fit is reminiscent of the K3003 as well except that these are actually lighter and more comfortable. Seems that a lot of engineering work went into the way these look and function. There is also a tuning system where the entire nozzle can be unscrewed and swapped for one of two other ones. There are three tunings to choose from - "reference" for "flat" sound, "clear" for a brighter tone, and "deep" for enhanced bass. The good news is that the tuning system works and drastically changes the sound. The bad news is that all three tunings sound like crap.
   
  The "reference" tuning has horribly veiled mids, reminding me of the $25 TDK MT300 and making the Sony MH1C sound like a top-tier earphone. Unacceptable. The bass-heavy "deep" tuning still has veiled mids and slightly more bass but mostly it just cuts the treble quantity even more, resulting in a very dull sound. Equally unacceptable. The "clear" tuning is the most tolerable of the bunch. However, it rolls off the bass and loses impact compared to the "deep" filter. Tonally, the "clear" filter leans a bit too far towards brightness and sounds a bass-light even next to the decidedly un-bassy VSonic VC02. Overall, the "clear" tuning is tolerable, even pleasant at low to moderate volumes, but doesn't justify the $180 price tag. Avoid.
   
   
The following are rather enjoyable and will get a full review if I can find the time in the near future.
   
   
*PNY Midtown 200* *Series -* http://www3.pny.com/Midtown-200-Series-Earphone-with-Mic-BlackSilver-P3150C514.aspx
   
  Very small and comfortable form factor with good build quality. Cables are especially nice on these - internally twisted, with a clear outer sheath a-la MEElec cords. The stock tips are of very nice quality as well. The Midtown has a mic and 1-button remote.
   
  Sound is nice and clear, with enhanced bass and good deep bass presence. Overall tone has a warm tilt but not overly so. The Sony MH1C is, in comparison, a little tighter in terms of bass bass, boasts a thicker note, and has a more spacious presentation but it's not far ahead. These seem to be <$25 from many retailers and are a good buy.
   
*PNY Uptown 200 Series - *http://www3.pny.com/-Uptown-200-Series-Earphone-with-Apple-Controller-Black-font-colordc0431Special-Offerfont-P3151C514.aspx
   
  Same form factor and build as the Midtown but with slightly more balanced sound. Adds a 3-button Apple remote as well. Compared to the Midtown, clarity is slightly better and bass impact is reduced. Very likable sound overall and really quite good for the price.
   
*RBH EP1* - http://rbhsound.com/ep1.php
   
  RBH is one of the many home audio manufacturers investing in headphones these days. The build quality of the EP1 is nice, with a metal housing and cloth cable, and makes up for the somewhat lackluster half in-ear design. The earphone sounds quite good, too - the bass is solid but not overbearing. Depth and control are both good. The mids are clear and not recessed. Treble is generally smooth, though some unevenness is noticeable, especially at higher volumes. Overall it might not quite be on-par with the RE-400 or Philips Fidelio S2 but definitely closer to that level than the mid-tier VSonic GR06/Sony MH1C and the like. 
   
   
   
  Quote: 





zubin111 said:


> Hmmm... While i do love the energetic quadbeat and a little eqing gets me to a completely comfortable bass levels, but the truth is i end up keeping MH1c more in the ears than the LG, so now building up from here, i find MH1C a touch warm, so does something comes off your mind which retains the fatigue free character of the MH1c but improves upon clarity? I love the thump though...


 

 Hmm. The GR07BE has the thump but not the fatigue-free character. The Yamaha EPH-100 has smoother treble and better clarity than the MH1C but also a bit more bass. Perhaps the RBH EP1 mentioned above - quick A:B with the MH1C and it has all of the bass thump but with significantly better clarity


----------



## UncleG

Hello, I'm currently looking for a new IEM to replace my Sony MH1C. I really liked its sound signature, being musical and all. I mostly listen to pop, dance & some rock. Can you guys provide me options?
   
  What I need is a bass-centric iem that effortlessly produces deep THUMPING (I needed more thump coming from MH1C) but QUALITY bass at the same time w/o the use of external amps. That is of course w/o sacrificing the overall sound quality. Big soundstage and better instrument separation is also needed. To make it short, I need the best basshead iems below $150.
   
  Per reviews posted, I'm currently looking at these :
   
  - Sony XB90EX
  - ATH-CKS99
  - Yamaha EPH-100
  - Denon AH-C300
   
  How do they compare? If you guys know a better basshead iem than these feel free to post it here. Thanks in advance!


----------



## BLACKSasquatch

> Hello, I'm currently looking for a new IEM to replace my Sony MH1C. I really liked its sound signature, being musical and all. I mostly listen to pop, dance & some rock. Can you guys provide me options?
> 
> What I need is a bass-centric iem that effortlessly produces deep THUMPING (I needed more thump coming from MH1C) but QUALITY bass at the same time w/o the use of external amps. That is of course w/o sacrificing the overall sound quality. Big soundstage and better instrument separation is also needed. To make it short, I need the best basshead iems below $150.
> 
> ...


 
   
  The Dunu Tai-Chi might be a good choice for you if you want *thumping* bass.
   
  |Joker| has already done a review of them too *(2B20)*


----------



## dnullify

Never heard of PNY.
   
  Joker, would you be willing to comment on the "sound" or "value" rating of these a bit early?
  It seems both the uptown and midtown are $16 or so, are they worth a shot?


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





uncleg said:


> Hello, I'm currently looking for a new IEM to replace my Sony MH1C. I really liked its sound signature, being musical and all. I mostly listen to pop, dance & some rock. Can you guys provide me options?
> 
> What I need is a bass-centric iem that effortlessly produces deep THUMPING (I needed more thump coming from MH1C) but QUALITY bass at the same time w/o the use of external amps. That is of course w/o sacrificing the overall sound quality. Big soundstage and better instrument separation is also needed. To make it short, I need the best basshead iems below $150.
> 
> ...


 
   
         audition a xb90ex at the nearest sony center , cks99 has huge bass , a bit of midbass hump but its good enough , and the ahc-300 has plenty of bass too .


----------



## macrocheesium

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> A few that come to mind:
> ...................................


 

 Great, I'll check those out. Thanks!


----------



## jekostas

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Never heard of PNY.
> 
> Joker, would you be willing to comment on the "sound" or "value" rating of these a bit early?
> It seems both the uptown and midtown are $16 or so, are they worth a shot?


 
   
  PNY is a computer equipment manufacturer - video cards, memory and the like.  They've been around for quite a while but I think the headphone selection is quite new.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





uncleg said:


> Hello, I'm currently looking for a new IEM to replace my Sony MH1C. I really liked its sound signature, being musical and all. I mostly listen to pop, dance & some rock. Can you guys provide me options?
> 
> What I need is a bass-centric iem that effortlessly produces deep THUMPING (I needed more thump coming from MH1C) but QUALITY bass at the same time w/o the use of external amps. That is of course w/o sacrificing the overall sound quality. Big soundstage and better instrument separation is also needed. To make it short, I need the best basshead iems below $150.
> 
> ...


 
   
  Out of these I'm only familiar with the EPH-100, and I like it. It's bassier than the MH1C but I probably wouldn't classify either as a true basshead earphone. The presentation is nice and the bass is definitely solid, just not overwhelming.
   
  Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Never heard of PNY.
> 
> Joker, would you be willing to comment on the "sound" or "value" rating of these a bit early?
> It seems both the uptown and midtown are $16 or so, are they worth a shot?


 

 Yep, I would say definitely worth a shot for a warmer but not overly thick sound. I would expect a sound score in the mid-upper 7.x range and a value score (at $16) in the 9-10 range.


----------



## dnullify

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yep, I would say definitely worth a shot for a warmer but not overly thick sound. I would expect a sound score in the mid-upper 7.x range and a value score (at $16) in the 9-10 range.


 
  Awesome,
  Thanks. Placed an order, maybe they'll replace my UE200s as my EDC IEMs.


----------



## mocoheavy

The VSONIC GR99 and its luxury edition are essentialy the same right? I am planning to buy those IEM, and I found them here (http://www.ebay.es/itm/261131530551) at a good price with a lot of accessories, so i think they are a good deal taking into account the great review they have here.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Awesome,
> Thanks. Placed an order, maybe they'll replace my UE200s as my EDC IEMs.


 
   
  Cool, you might be the second person on Head-Fi to own a set. Did you grab the Midtown or the Uptown?
   
  Quote: 





mocoheavy said:


> The VSONIC GR99 and its luxury edition are essentialy the same right? I am planning to buy those IEM, and I found them here (http://www.ebay.es/itm/261131530551) at a good price with a lot of accessories, so i think they are a good deal taking into account the great review they have here.


 
   
  Never heard of the luxury edition but it looks the same as my GR99. I wonder if some resellers are just making up editions of VSonic earphones as they go.


----------



## dnullify

ljokerl said:


> Cool, you might be the second person on Head-Fi to own a set. Did you grab the Midtown or the Uptown?



I got the midtowns based on your description. I figured, at the very least they have a mic, and should ride over that IEM itch.


----------



## Levanter

Joker, have you tried the 1964 Ears V6?
  Am curious over the comparisons with the higher end universals, i.e K3003 and TG334,
  and also how it fairs against the top CIEMS given the V6 more reasonable pricing =)


----------



## mocoheavy

ljokerl said:


> Cool, you might be the second person on Head-Fi to own a set. Did you grab the Midtown or the Uptown?
> 
> 
> Never heard of the luxury edition but it looks the same as my GR99. I wonder if some resellers are just making up editions of VSonic earphones as they go.



Finally I will probably buy the GR02 bass edition. Is lendmeurears reliable and do they send to europe?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> I got the midtowns based on your description. I figured, at the very least they have a mic, and should ride over that IEM itch.


 
   
  Indeed. They actually both have a mic (at least the ones I have) but one has the Apple remote and the other one has the more universal 1-button.
   
  Quote: 





levanter said:


> Joker, have you tried the 1964 Ears V6?
> Am curious over the comparisons with the higher end universals, i.e K3003 and TG334,
> and also how it fairs against the top CIEMS given the V6 more reasonable pricing =)


 
   
  Nope, haven't tried the V6.
   
  Quote: 





mocoheavy said:


> Finally I will probably buy the GR02 bass edition. Is lendmeurears reliable and do they send to europe?


 

 Yes and yes. As far as I know they ship worldwide.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





mocoheavy said:


> Finally I will probably buy the GR02 bass edition. Is lendmeurears reliable and do they send to europe?


 
  Yeah, they ship worldwide and the shipping is free for vsonic iems. LMUE use Singapore Post, so the package usually arrives in 5-10 days after ordering.


----------



## Amitl

i wish the Sony MH1C didnt have that huge mic/remote thing...


----------



## PeterDLai

Quote: 





amitl said:


> i wish the Sony MH1C didnt have that huge mic/remote thing...


 
   
  I think everyone wishes that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I reckon a DIY'er would be pretty successful selling recabled MH1c.


----------



## MoonYeol

Standard cable and something to make over ear use more comfortable. Would be huge.


----------



## davidcotton

So send an email to btg-audio to see what they can do for you, may be possible may be not!


----------



## vwinter

Hey Joker,
   
  My friend really liked the Senn IE800. Do you have any recommendations for a lower range universal model with a similar sound? The subbass was a factor I'd say 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 but it was also the midrange. Based on some reading, I was thinking along the lines of the MH1 or the RHA450 (for iphone remote). If you have any other recommendations, she'd be willing to spend up to $300 if the signature and quality can get close.
   
  Thanks!


----------



## LordKtulu

The past couple of days I've been looking for some bass heavy earphones with decent clarity around $30 and I've narrowed it down to five choices either Sennheiser CX250, Soundmagic E10, or TDK EB900, (IEMS) OR Koss Porta Pro or Koss KSC35 (both over ear). I'm hearing a lot of good about Soundmagic E10 but I am a little concerned about being sent a fake. Out of the five that I named which do you believe would be the most suitable for a bass head?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> My friend really liked the Senn IE800. Do you have any recommendations for a lower range universal model with a similar sound? The subbass was a factor I'd say
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hmm... that's an interesting question. The MH1 and RHA MA-450 would indeed be good choices if he was capping the budget at $60 or so, and the Velodyne vPulse if he was capping it a little higher. However, with a $300 budget, I would probably go for the Yamaha EPH-100. There is no remote but the Yamahas have great deep bass, rich mids, and decent treble. The bass is not as quick, tight, and clean as with the IE800 and the overall clarity and refinement lag behind the Sennheisers, but there's also a 6x difference in price.
   
  Quote: 





lordktulu said:


> The past couple of days I've been looking for some bass heavy earphones with decent clarity around $30 and I've narrowed it down to five choices either Sennheiser CX250, Soundmagic E10, or TDK EB900, (IEMS) OR Koss Porta Pro or Koss KSC35 (both over ear). I'm hearing a lot of good about Soundmagic E10 but I am a little concerned about being sent a fake. Out of the five that I named which do you believe would be the most suitable for a bass head?


 

 I wouldn't call the E10 or CX250 basshead earphones. They have enhanced bass for sure but not basshead quantities. The E10 is my favorite of those - it's a very clear-sounding earphone with a pleasant overall sound. If you want really heavy bass, however, see if you have the JVC HA-FX101 or RHA MA-350 available to you.


----------



## LordKtulu

What about Koss KSC35 or the Porta Pros is the bass good?


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Hmm... that's an interesting question. The MH1 and RHA MA-450 would indeed be good choice is he was capping the budget at $60 or so, and the Velodyne vPulse if he was capping it a little higher. However, with a $300 budget, I would probably go for the Yamaha EPH-100. There is no remote but the Yamahas have great deep bass, rich mids, and decent treble. The bass is not as quick, tight, and clean as with the IE800 and the overall clarity and refinement lag behind the Sennheisers, but there's also a 6x difference in price.




Thanks! I'll let her know.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lordktulu said:


> What about Koss KSC35 or the Porta Pros is the bass good?


 
   
  Yes, but again not what I would consider basshead levels.
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Thanks! I'll let *her* know.


 
   
  Sorry, bad assumption on my part 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Sorry, bad assumption on my part  .




Haha yea. The IE800, oh man, I have no doubt that if I had walked into a bar with them and went, "here listen to this." I wouldn't be leaving alone.


----------



## LordKtulu

Ok sorry if I sound a little clueless because I am but I think I'm going with the RHA MA350 I hear really good about the bass hope I'm not unsatisfied but they have to be better than Skullcandy Inkd LOL


----------



## Amitl

some questions regarding the JVC HA-FXT90...
  is the fit snug? or does it fall out of the ear with cable movement.....?
  does the design provide a more secure fit than the id America Spark, for example, or less?
  and is it harsh/sibilant a-la Klipsch S4? (i hate the S4's treble)
  thank you so much.....


----------



## tim_j_thomas

For a ~$100 IEM, what would be your choice and why: Brainwavz B2 or HifiMan RE-400?


----------



## tinyman392

Quote: 





tim_j_thomas said:


> For a ~$100 IEM, what would be your choice and why: Brainwavz B2 or HifiMan RE-400?


 
   
  That's actually a tough question.  I know you were asking |Joker|.  I personally have to choose the RE-400.  It's an easier IEM for me to digest and it offers great imaging, ample treble detailing and presence, good mids and bass as well.  It's been a while since I put in my B2 though.  Both a really, more or less great IEMs.  It's basically a more treble-happy phone vs a warmer phone XD


----------



## tim_j_thomas

Quote: 





tinyman392 said:


> That's actually a tough question.  I know you were asking |Joker|.  I personally have to choose the RE-400.  It's an easier IEM for me to digest and it offers great imaging, ample treble detailing and presence, good mids and bass as well.  It's been a while since I put in my B2 though.  Both a really, more or less great IEMs.  It's basically a more treble-happy phone vs a warmer phone XD


 
  Thanks!
   
  It looks like the Philips Fidelio S1 might be a good choice as well.  Thoughts?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> Haha yea. The IE800, oh man, I have no doubt that if I had walked into a bar with them and went, "here listen to this." I wouldn't be leaving alone.


 
   
   
  Only if it's the bar at CanJam.
   
   
  Quote: 





lordktulu said:


> Ok sorry if I sound a little clueless because I am but I think I'm going with the RHA MA350 I hear really good about the bass hope I'm not unsatisfied but they have to be better than Skullcandy Inkd LOL


 
   
  They have good bass, just make sure to get a good fit with them or you'll lose out on the sound quality. 
   
  Quote: 





amitl said:


> some questions regarding the JVC HA-FXT90...
> is the fit snug? or does it fall out of the ear with cable movement.....?
> does the design provide a more secure fit than the id America Spark, for example, or less?
> and is it harsh/sibilant a-la Klipsch S4? (i hate the S4's treble)
> thank you so much.....


 
   
  It depends on your ear, I suppose. I had no issues whatsoever with the fit of the FXT90 but it is larger than the Spark/S4. 
   
  It is not the smoothest earphone but definitely not as harsh/sibilant as the S4. Should be close to the Spark.
   
  Quote: 





tim_j_thomas said:


> For a ~$100 IEM, what would be your choice and why: Brainwavz B2 or HifiMan RE-400?


 
   
  Quote: 





tim_j_thomas said:


> It looks like the Philips Fidelio S1 might be a good choice as well.  Thoughts?


 

 It depends on what you're after. The RE-400 is the smoothest of the three with very slightly boosted mid-bass for a warmer tone. The S1 has very linear bass with better deep bass presence than the RE-400 but it also has treble that's brighter and less forgiving and a presentation that's more distant compared to the RE-400. The B2 is the brightest of the three with superb clarity, but perhaps not as 'safe' an option as the other two unless you know you prefer a leaner type of sound. All three are great options in my book and just offer slightly different interpretations of a balanced sound signature.


----------



## Astrud

Hi joker,
  Own RE400 - enjoy it mainly  with my jazz , vocal and acoustic recordings,  but I want some another IEM with more bass quantity and accuracy too. Have 100 usd for it .
  I have opportunity to buy EPH100 for some 100 usd incl. shipping. Are these hitting the bass like on Stones (I mean Charlie and Darryl...) live concert in Montenegro, Budva beach 2007? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  Or CC51 for 30 usd? Or....


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





tim_j_thomas said:


> For a ~$100 IEM, what would be your choice and why: Brainwavz B2 or HifiMan RE-400?


 
   
       b2 any time any day .


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





astrud said:


> Hi joker,
> Own RE400 - enjoy it mainly  with my jazz , vocal and acoustic recordings,  but I want some another IEM with more bass quantity and accuracy too. Have 100 usd for it .
> I have opportunity to buy EPH100 for some 100 usd incl. shipping. Are these hitting the bass like on Stones (I mean Charlie and Darryl...) live concert in Montenegro, Budva beach 2007?
> 
> ...


 
   
         cc51 has bass , but might not be able compliment your re-400 when it comes to clarity and accuracy , its inferior to re-400 in every aspect except bass . but then its far more price efficient . you can bag it , as one of the best value for money phone . i would suggest the hisound crystal , havent heard eph100 sadly .


----------



## heart banger-97

Hi ljokerl!
Do you recommend any specific tip, to improve sound isolation of fxt90?

If anybody can helps I appreciate that too. 
Thanks


----------



## SittesJoe

hi there I was advised to look at this thread for some good advices. I'm looking for a new IEM to replace my dying sennheiser cx300. The budget is max 60 USD. I mainly listen to rock, classic rock, metal (rhytmic). Some main names: Creedence clearwater revival, Foghat, Billy Idol, John Petrucci, Elvenking, Kansas, Motley Crude, Gary Moore, Kiss, Trivium, Bon Jovi, Foreigner, REO Speedwagon, Styx, Guano Apes, Metallica, Lordi, Queen, Bob Marley, RHCP, 3 doors down, ACDC, Alice Cooper, Bad COmpany, Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Disturbed, Nightwish, Pantera, Seether, ZZ Top Could you please offer me something which would fit to this type of music, at a maximum price of 60 USD? I was told to check the VSonic VSD1, or the Sony MH1C. The Vsonic looks better to me, but is there any other best offer ?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





astrud said:


> Hi joker,
> Own RE400 - enjoy it mainly  with my jazz , vocal and acoustic recordings,  but I want some another IEM with more bass quantity and accuracy too. Have 100 usd for it .
> I have opportunity to buy EPH100 for some 100 usd incl. shipping. Are these hitting the bass like on Stones (I mean Charlie and Darryl...) live concert in Montenegro, Budva beach 2007?
> 
> ...


 
   
  The EPH-100 has plenty of bass; it's nothing like the RE-400, so it would be a good compliment. Definitely worth $100 if you're looking for a bassier - but not overly bloated - IEM. The CC51 is somewhere between the two in bass quantity but not quite as good overall.
   
   
  Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> Hi ljokerl!
> Do you recommend any specific tip, to improve sound isolation of fxt90?
> 
> If anybody can helps I appreciate that too.
> ...


 
   
  There won't be a big difference becase the FXT90 is kind of limited in isolation by the way it fits but a short bi-flange tip works pretty well. You can get Sennheiser ones for the IE7/IE8 or the ones from the MEElec M11+. 
   
   
  Quote: 





sittesjoe said:


> hi there I was advised to look at this thread for some good advices. I'm looking for a new IEM to replace my dying sennheiser cx300. The budget is max 60 USD. I mainly listen to rock, classic rock, metal (rhytmic). Some main names: Creedence clearwater revival, Foghat, Billy Idol, John Petrucci, Elvenking, Kansas, Motley Crude, Gary Moore, Kiss, Trivium, Bon Jovi, Foreigner, REO Speedwagon, Styx, Guano Apes, Metallica, Lordi, Queen, Bob Marley, RHCP, 3 doors down, ACDC, Alice Cooper, Bad COmpany, Black Sabbath, Deep Purple, Disturbed, Nightwish, Pantera, Seether, ZZ Top Could you please offer me something which would fit to this type of music, at a maximum price of 60 USD? I was told to check the VSonic VSD1, or the Sony MH1C. The Vsonic looks better to me, but is there any other best offer ?


 
   
  The VSonic VSD1 is pretty awesome. Punchy, controlled bass and crisp, prominent treble. It'll be a great match for your music for the price. The MH1C is more similar to the CX300 in sound signature - warm and smooth, with more bass than the VSD1. It's also pretty great and the smoother treble would be an asset if you listen at higher volumes but I prefer the tighter, brighter VSD1 personally, especially for rock and metal.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Etymotic Research ETYKids
   
   

*(3B40) Etymotic Research ETY-Kids 5 / 3*


Reviewed Aug 2013

 Details: Etymotic’s volume-limiting safe listening earphones
 Current Price: $30 from amazon.com (MSRP: $49); $79 for ETY-Kids 3 with 3-button remote and microphone
 Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _300Ω _| Sens: N/A | Freq: _20-15k Hz_ | Cable: _4’ 45º-plug_
 Nozzle Size: _2.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Stock triple-flanges, Shure Olives_
 Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_

 Accessories *(3.5/5) *– Triple-flange silicone tips (2 sizes), Etymotic Glider tips, shirt clip, and zippered soft carrying pouch
 Build Quality *(4.5/5)* –Though the ETY-Kids are lightweight and made of plastic, the cords are Kevlar-reinforced and well-relieved all around. The cabling is very flexible and doesn’t stick or tangle, making the entry-level Etys feel like a quality product
 Isolation* (4/5) *– Typical of Ety earphones, isolation doesn’t get much better than this
 Microphonics *(4/5) *– Quite low when worn cable-down, nonexistent with over-the-ear wear
 Comfort *(4/5)* –The slim housings don’t put pressure on the outer ear and the cable exit angle works well for over-the-ear wear. The included assortment of tips is on the smaller side but it should fit most listeners comfortably as long as they don’t mind the deeper fit of Etymotic earphones

 Sound *(7.6/10)* – The ETY-Kids are the second dynamic-driver earphone from Etymotic Research and the company’s most budget-friendly set yet, marketed to parents as a child-friendly safe hearing model. Volume-limiting earphones are not a novel concept - we’ve previously seen similar designs from brands such as Ultimate Ears and Harman-owned dB Logic. The ETY-Kids achieve this with their 300Ω impedance, which makes it difficult to power the earphone to dangerous volume levels. Unlike headphones with dB Logic’s SPL2 technology, the Etys will still hit high volumes when driven with a powerful enough source, but they do a good job limiting output with conventional mp3 players.

 The limited volume of the Etys should be sufficient for most Head-Fiers. At worst, it is a minor inconvenience to turn up the volume, and on more powerful sources such as my desktop amp and HiFiMan HM-901, it is barely noticeable that the volume pot needs another ¼ turn. More importantly the ETY-Kids, low price and all, sound very much like an Ety should. The bass is tight and clean, albeit a touch rolled-off at the bottom. This means the ETY-Kids won’t produce the type of deep, rumbling bass the Beats by Dre generation may be expecting, but it also keeps the tone neutral and midrange free of bleed. In comparison, the VSonic VC02 has slightly punchier bass but keeps it just as clean and controlled as the Etys while the warmer, bassier VSonic VSD1 sounds a bit more bloated.

 The midrange of the ETY-Kids is likewise clear and neutral, bumped slightly in presence to make vocals more prominent and intelligible. Due to this, and because of the lack of bass and treble emphasis, the Etys can sound a bit mid-centric – more so, for example, than the VSonic VC02. On the other hand, the fantastic midrange clarity means there is no need to turn the earphones up to discern vocals, which fits nicely in with the whole “safe hearing” push. The ETY-Kids are clearer even than the balanced armature Astrotec AM-90, though they lack some of the warmth and fullness of the Astrotecs as well.

 The treble of the ETY-Kids is nicely filled in, though it seems to lack a bit of extension and presence next to the higher-end armature-based Ety models. It is smoother than the treble of the VSonic VC02 and VSD1 but not as smooth as the similarly-priced balanced armature sets from Astrotec and Rock-It sounds. The overall tone of the Etys is a bit on the cool side and the presentation tends to be a little laid-back. Soundstage depth and overall dynamics could be better, but for the price the junior Etys do a great job.

 Value *(9.5/10)* – The ETY-Kids name may be off-putting to some but there is nothing childish about the design or sound of these earphones. Like all things Etymotic, the ETY-Kids are well-built, highly isolating, and boast sound that is clear, accurate, and neutral, though for some listeners perhaps lacking in desired bass presence. They promote hearing safety with a combination of immense noise isolation and volume-limiting impedance. All in all, the ETY-Kids are a great entry-level audiophile IEM that – we can only hope – will help introduce the next generation to Etymotic’s signature sound.

*Pros: Stellar noise isolation; solid build quality; clear, balanced, and accurate sound
 Cons: Deep-insertion form factor can take some getting used to for new users. Volume-limiting design may be undesirable for some*


----------



## heart banger-97

Quote: 





heart banger-97 said:


> Hi ljokerl!
> Do you recommend any specific tip, to improve sound isolation of fxt90?
> 
> If anybody can helps I appreciate that too.
> ...



  
 Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> There won't be a big difference becase the FXT90 is kind of limited in isolation by the way it fits but a short bi-flange tip works pretty well. You can get Sennheiser ones for the IE7/IE8 or the ones from the MEElec M11+.



  
 thanks man,
 so do you think that does it worth to get those tips (ie8 or MEEElec tips)?
 in fact one of my friends wants to buy fxt90, and he's worried about the sound isolation, according to what I've understood, he likes a V sound signature headphone with good isolation and good build quality, according to your review I thought that fxt90 is the best match for him. but I'm kind of worried about the isolation of fxt90. do you know any substitution for this?
  
 thanks


----------



## SittesJoe

ljokerl said:


> The EPH-100 has plenty of bass; it's nothing like the RE-400, so it would be a good compliment. Definitely worth $100 if you're looking for a bassier - but not overly bloated - IEM. The CC51 is somewhere between the two in bass quantity but not quite as good overall.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




And how does the VSD1 perform, if compared to the GR06? The gr06 costs just 4-5 usd more than the upper limit of my budget, does this extra worth iso the vsd1?


----------



## ohvercome

Hey, I was wondering if the soundmagic E10 would be the clearest sounding headphones at that price range? I've been looking around for a few days and have seen these recommended many times. Also, will I notice a difference between the soundmagic and my current ( the newer default earbuds)?
   
   
  Thanks a lot.


----------



## stimer

Quote: 





ohvercome said:


> Hey, I was wondering if the soundmagic E10 would be the clearest sounding headphones at that price range? I've been looking around for a few days and have seen these recommended many times. Also, will I notice a difference between the soundmagic and my current ( the newer default earbuds)?
> 
> 
> Thanks a lot.


 
  please look at that http://www.head-fi.org/t/541204/concise-multi-iem-comparison-final-update-march-1st-2013
  E10 - have balanced sound signature, not basshead or bassier


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *heart banger-97* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> thanks man,
> so do you think that does it worth to get those tips (ie8 or MEEElec tips)?
> ...


 
   
  I wouldn't say it's worth it but if every bit of isolation is important, it doesn't hurt to try the aftermarket tips. The JVC FXD80 has better isolation so that might be an option as well. I prefer the sound of the FXT90, though.
   
  Quote: 





sittesjoe said:


> And how does the VSD1 perform, if compared to the GR06? The gr06 costs just 4-5 usd more than the upper limit of my budget, does this extra worth iso the vsd1?


 
   
  I know it's cheaper but I actually prefer the VSD1 to the GR06. If you want more forward mids and the over-the-ear form factor, the GR06 might be a better buy but I like the more v-shaped signature of the VSD1. 
   
  Quote: 





ohvercome said:


> Hey, I was wondering if the soundmagic E10 would be the clearest sounding headphones at that price range? I've been looking around for a few days and have seen these recommended many times. Also, will I notice a difference between the soundmagic and my current ( the newer default earbuds)?
> 
> 
> Thanks a lot.


 

 The E10 is a nice and inoffensive earphone. It's a popular recommendation for a "first step" because it combines good clarity with punchy bass and is neither overly unforgiving nor too dark. I even included it in my concise buyer's guide, for this reason and because it's readily available in many countries.
   
  However, if you're purely after clarity, there are better options, like the recently-reviewed ETY-Kids, the LG Quadbeat, or the VSonic VC02.


----------



## MoonYeol

.


----------



## MoonYeol

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> However, if you're purely after clarity, there are better options, like the recently-reviewed ETY-Kids, the LG Quadbeat, or the VSonic VC02.


 
   
  VC02 is really marvelous. I previously wrote something on how I stuffed some paper in the nozzles to deal with the sibilance. After listening some to them they weren't as clear as I remembered. So I took the paper out and REALLY PUSHED them as far into my ears as I could. I guess that extra mm had something to do with it but I'm not experiencing as much sibilance now. It took a few seconds to get them in there, moving slowly and just imaging the air pressure on my eardrum. It felt more like a medical procedure than preparing for enjoying music. But oh boy was it worth it!


----------



## vv2v

Hey ljokerl, just wanted to show some appreciation here.  I was looking for a cheap pair of IEM for jogging about 2 years ago when I stumble upon this thread, and bought the Meelectronic M6 based on your review.  Now I am looking for an upgrade for office use, and have decided on the Astrotec AM-800 based on your review and recommendation ("Buyer's Guide").  Awesome work reviewing all these IEMs, and thank you.
   
  Since I can't find direct references between these two sets, any major differences that I should prepared for before the order gets here?


----------



## Free167

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't say it's worth it but if every bit of isolation is important, it doesn't hurt to try the aftermarket tips. The JVC FXD80 has better isolation so that might be an option as well. I prefer the sound of the FXT90, though.


 
   
  I have used the gold edition of FXT-90 for 4 months ... I would say the isolation is good enough for me.  I listen to songs at a medium volume and most of the time I can't hear external noise (when the music is on) - that is something when I walk in a crowded Hong Kong street


----------



## Grayson73

Joker, if you get a chance, I think it would be worthwhile to review the Zero Audio Carbo Basso, Zero Audio Carbo Tenore, and new and improved NuForce NE-700X.  They could outperform your top performers under $70 (Ultimate Ears UE600, VSonic GR06, VSonic VC02).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> VC02 is really marvelous. I previously wrote something on how I stuffed some paper in the nozzles to deal with the sibilance. After listening some to them they weren't as clear as I remembered. So I took the paper out and REALLY PUSHED them as far into my ears as I could. I guess that extra mm had something to do with it but I'm not experiencing as much sibilance now. It took a few seconds to get them in there, moving slowly and just imaging the air pressure on my eardrum. It felt more like a medical procedure than preparing for enjoying music. But oh boy was it worth it!


 
   
  They do seem to like a deeper seal. Glad you're enjoying them!
   
  Quote: 





vv2v said:


> Hey ljokerl, just wanted to show some appreciation here.  I was looking for a cheap pair of IEM for jogging about 2 years ago when I stumble upon this thread, and bought the Meelectronic M6 based on your review.  Now I am looking for an upgrade for office use, and have decided on the Astrotec AM-800 based on your review and recommendation ("Buyer's Guide").  Awesome work reviewing all these IEMs, and thank you.
> 
> Since I can't find direct references between these two sets, any major differences that I should prepared for before the order gets here?


 
   
  The M6 is nice but lacks the refinement of higher-end sets. My guess is you'll most notice the clarity improvement and the less recessed mids. 
   
  Quote: 





free167 said:


> I have used the gold edition of FXT-90 for 4 months ... I would say the isolation is good enough for me.  I listen to songs at a medium volume and most of the time I can't hear external noise (when the music is on) - that is something when I walk in a crowded Hong Kong street


 
   
  It was good enough for me as well - I expected worse when I first saw it.
   
  Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> Joker, if you get a chance, I think it would be worthwhile to review the Zero Audio Carbo Basso, Zero Audio Carbo Tenore, and new and improved NuForce NE-700X.  They could outperform your top performers under $70 (Ultimate Ears UE600, VSonic GR06, VSonic VC02).


 

 I was supposed to get a new NE-700X when it came out. Nuforce was calling it a major improvement. Not sure what happened to that. As for the rest, I'll keep them in mind.


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> Joker, if you get a chance, I think it would be worthwhile to review the Zero Audio Carbo Basso, Zero Audio Carbo Tenore, and new and improved NuForce NE-700X.  They could outperform your top performers under $70 (Ultimate Ears UE600, VSonic GR06, VSonic VC02).


 
   
        are you sure about ue600 ?


----------



## ozkan

Hey Joker,
  Do you think that UE600 has better bass than PFEs in both quality and quantity-wise? Thank you. Btw, you do a such great work.


----------



## ellis ip

from my memory i think the pfe is better than ue600 both quality and quaranty but they were pretty close


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





ozkan said:


> Hey Joker,
> Do you think that UE600 has better bass than PFEs in both quality and quantity-wise? Thank you. Btw, you do a such great work.


 

 Nope, I think the UE600 is at best on-par with the PFE in terms of bass quantity and quality but also has the disadvantage of poorer consistency between sources. You need a source with very low output impedance to experience the bass of the UE 600 at its best.


----------



## Exesteils

suman134 said:


> are you sure about ue600 ?




You wouldn't ask that if you've heard the Zero Audios already. They really are amazing for their price point(driver flex aside)


----------



## SittesJoe

I see your point, however I like to consider build quality and accessories as well. And the GR06 seems to better than VSD1 in this.
   
   
  My only concern is that I do not like the 90 degree jack, the cable gets really easily broken. I listen music from my htc one x with jack plug on it`s top, and put it in my pocket.Using that with a 90 degree jack is just a cable killer!
   
  Do you might have any other recommendations around 60 usd with a comfortable shell (possibly not plastic), linear jack, ideal for the above mentioned music, mainly rock?


----------



## Towwers

Hi Joker!
   
  Is it true that the Vsonic GR07 MK2 sounds better and more balanced than the Westone 4?


----------



## starfly

Hey Joker,
   
  First of all, great work you've done in this thread and on your own site reviewing so many different IEMs. If you don't mind, I'd like to ask you for some advice.
   
  I currently own the Shure SE530. Have owned these for about 4 years now. I'm anything but an audio expert and lack the vocabulary to accurately describe how they sound to me. I do like how they sound, though. I listen to various styles of music of which not all of them neatly fit into a specific category. But I can really enjoy Pink Floyd / David Gilmour, the guitar solos can give me goosebumps at times when listening through the SE530s. Or when listening to the song Spies by Coldplay (from their first Parachutes album), the opening guitar riff sounds really great and when the vocals kick in it's really something to behold. In addition to all that, the queer vocals with the mildly depressing tunes from Radiohead can also give me shivers at times when listening to them through the SE530s.
   
  I also listen to a lot of electronic music though, such as for instance Underworld, Kruder & Dorfmeister, Tosca and Thievery Corporation. And other than that, depending on my mood I might put on some reggae, hip-hop, ambient, Hans Zimmer soundtracks, etc.
   
  I usually only listen to FLAC and use an iPod classic modded with Rockbox firmware as my main listening source. Don't use any headphone amps as I feel like the Shure doesn't really need it. I have the EQ slightly V-shaped as I overall prefer a somewhat warmer sound (I'm not a basshead, but I do appreciate a nice full bass).
   
  So after 4 years I feel like it's time to try something else. I'm looking in the € 400 / $ 500 price range. I'm wondering if there are IEMs out there that will retain the goodness of the SE530, yet add more other stuff as well, such as perhaps more detail, more instrumental separation, a wider soundstage (the SE530s sometimes do sound as if the music is right in the center of my head) and maybe even more/better bass? I'm not necessarily a treble head and the rolled-off treble everyone talks about has never really bothered me. But honestly, the SE530s were my first high-end IEM purchase, before that it was always low-budget stuff so the SE530 is also my only point of reference and I don't really know what I might be missing out on 
   
  Based on what I've read in this thread I've come up with Westone 4R, Earsonics SM64, UE900, Audeo PFE232, J Phonic K2 SP, 1964 Ears and perhaps other ones I haven't seen. I'm just not really sure how they compare to the SE530 and which ones I'd actually like. And here in the Netherlands most stores don't allow you to return IEMs once you've used them so it's not like I can try them all out myself 
   
  So can you perhaps give me a recommendation? I would greatly appreciate that.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





sittesjoe said:


> My only concern is that I do not like the 90 degree jack, the cable gets really easily broken. I listen music from my htc one x with jack plug on it`s top, and put it in my pocket.Using that with a 90 degree jack is just a cable killer!
> 
> Do you might have any other recommendations around 60 usd with a comfortable shell (possibly not plastic), linear jack, ideal for the above mentioned music, mainly rock?


 
   
  Hmm... most higher-end earphones these days have an L-plug. One that comes to mind is the Astrotec AM-800. It's got a straight plug and a wood-and-metal construction. Sounds good, too. 
   
  Quote: 





towwers said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> Is it true that the Vsonic GR07 MK2 sounds better and more balanced than the Westone 4?


 
   
  I would agree the GR07 (I don't have the MK2) competes with the Westone 4 but saying that it sounds better is probably overstating it. If we're talking purely about balance, the GR07 has an advantage, being the flatter of the two earphones, but whether it's "better", or even as good, will come down to who you ask. Personally, I feel that both of these earphones make concessions but those of the GR07 are greater. For example, the treble peaks of the GR07 might be a dealbreaker for some listeners while the Westone 4 may sound a little boring, but not downright offensive. 
   
  Quote: 





starfly said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> First of all, great work you've done in this thread and on your own site reviewing so many different IEMs. If you don't mind, I'd like to ask you for some advice.
> 
> ...


 

 As far as I know the K2 SP is currently only available in Japan and the PFE 232 has been discontinued recently. You can probably still find a pair but I don't think its sound will work for you. The UE900 is nice but doesn't have any more bass than the SE530 and might not have the midrange presence you are used to.
   
  The W4 and SM64 would be better options. However, my pick would be the 1964-V3. It'll retain the rich mids of your Shures but add more bass and treble presence for a livelier, more exciting sound. It also has a more out-of-the-head presentation than most universal-fit earphones including the SE530. The V3 would be a larger change from your Shures than going to the SM64/W4 and isn't the 'safe choice' per se, but it should be easier to justify spending $450+ on.


----------



## FlySweep

Can't wait to read your JH13 review (whenever it comes).  I've had it for approx. two months.. and I'm completely stunned by it.  I never thought it would happen, but I've practically lost all interest in (buying any more) IEMs.  I still plan on hearing many.. but buying.. why?  The JH13 does it all for me.
   
  As you said in the IF shootout, I find it incredibly difficult to find any real faults with its sound.  When I'm not using the JH13, my ears are spoiled by the HD800 (most of the time).. I'm not exaggerating when I say that it feels like I'm making very few, if any, real concessions when moving from the Senn flagship to the JHA flagship.  Yes, the HD800 has an ungodly soundstage.. but the JH13's stage is no slouch.. it smokes any other IEM's (and many headphones') soundstage I've heard.  In many ways, it's a more practical investment than the HD800 cause the JH13 doesn't require quite the outlay on upstream gear (to get the most out of it) as the JH13 does.  It's that impressive (to me).
   
  I've been very happy with most every IEM I've owned.. but this might be the first time I can say I'm truly, honestly, 100% _satisfied_.


----------



## head-fi lover

hi

I want to buy some pair of high end headphones(300-500$).I almost lesson to pop,trance,and even rock geners.can you tell me which in ear I must buy? one problem that I have is that I dont know that which company has shiping to my country(iran-in middle east).can you help me please?(senheizer Ie 8 and maybe Ie80 can be found here )

best regards


----------



## starfly

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> As far as I know the K2 SP is currently only available in Japan and the PFE 232 has been discontinued recently. You can probably still find a pair but I don't think its sound will work for you. The UE900 is nice but doesn't have any more bass than the SE530 and might not have the midrange presence you are used to.
> 
> The W4 and SM64 would be better options. However, my pick would be the 1964-V3. It'll retain the rich mids of your Shures but add more bass and treble presence for a livelier, more exciting sound. It also has a more out-of-the-head presentation than most universal-fit earphones including the SE530. The V3 would be a larger change from your Shures than going to the SM64/W4 and isn't the 'safe choice' per se, but it should be easier to justify spending $450+ on.


 
   
  Joker, thanks for your reply. I'll look into if it's possible to easily obtain the 1964-V3 here in the Netherlands. If you were to recommend a universal IEM, what would you recommend? Also, are you familiar with the Fischer Amp IEMs? If so, what are your thoughts on those?


----------



## soundbear

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Can't wait to read your JH13 review (whenever it comes).  I've had it for approx. two months.. and I'm completely stunned by it.  I never thought it would happen, but I've practically lost all interest in (buying any more) IEMs.  I still plan on hearing many.. but buying.. why?  The JH13 does it all for me.
> 
> As you said in the IF shootout, I find it incredibly difficult to find any real faults with its sound.  When I'm not using the JH13, my ears are spoiled by the HD800 (most of the time).. I'm not exaggerating when I say that it feels like I'm making very few, if any, real concessions when moving from the Senn flagship to the JHA flagship.  Yes, the HD800 has an ungodly soundstage.. but the JH13's stage is no slouch.. it smokes any other IEM's (and many headphones') soundstage I've heard.  In many ways, it's a more practical investment than the HD800 cause the JH13 doesn't require quite the outlay on upstream gear (to get the most out of it) as the JH13 does.  It's that impressive (to me).
> 
> I've been very happy with most every IEM I've owned.. but this might be the first time I can say I'm truly, honestly, 100% _satisfied_.


 
  Don't worry, the 1P2 will top it.   Just let me know first when your 13's are up for sale!


----------



## awtryau89

Joker, I have been toying around with a few IEMs and was hoping you can steer me in the right direction from your vast experience. I have some Shure 215s but I always long for more detail. So I purchased a set of Ety HF5s and liked them but missed my bass. So I sold those. Now I am trying the Brainwavz B2s. Again I love their detail but miss my bass. I probably like the Etys a bit more than the B2s actually. They seem a bit more natural sounding to my ear. Even so, I am looking for something that gives me all the detail and high end presence of the latter 2 IEMs with some bass weight. It doesn't have to be as thick as the Shures and I don't want it to bleed into the mids but definitely more than I am hearing from the 5s or B2s. As a side note, I do like to use Complys or Shure Olives as my preferred tips. I love isolation for travel and planes. I am not going to put price restrictions but I would like to find that bang for the buck under $200. Thanks. EA


----------



## mc21

Well Joker, your review single-handedly convinced me to get a pair of UM Miracles. This is funny because I actually decided on this pair over 2 years ago as my first CIEM but then changed my mind and went with multiple high end universals. Recently decided to try CIEM and was looking at the top tiers like the JH16 and 8.a. I wanted to avoid having to ship to and from China so decided on a pair of JH16. There was a pair on the B/S forum but it didn't quite work out. Then I did a little more research and actually decided that the JH16 had too much bass for my liking. Then a pair of UM Miracles popped up on the B/S forum. This peaked my interest as I have stated before, I had previously picked this pair but decided last minute to stick to universals. After seeing the thread, I did a bit more research and I swear this must have been the thread that made me picked the Miracles 2 years ago. The description/review made it sound like the perfect CIEM for me. Well I bit the bullet and have an appointment with the audiologist scheduled. Will be getting my impressions and sending them for a remold next week. I knew my headfi journey will eventually lead me to customs. It took 7 years, which to be honest, is longer than I would have expected myself to hold out for. Anyways, I've always wanted customs and can't wait to get these in my ear!


----------



## dnullify

Hey Joker I got those PNY Midtowns today. Holy cow, $17 well spent!
  They're nicely warm sounding, much nicer than I was expecting, and the single button mic works really well too!
   
  I'm surprised these aren't a bigger deal, they're not exactly new releases are they?
   
  Thanks for the tip!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





flysweep said:


> Can't wait to read your JH13 review (whenever it comes).  I've had it for approx. two months.. and I'm completely stunned by it.  I never thought it would happen, but I've practically lost all interest in (buying any more) IEMs.  I still plan on hearing many.. but buying.. why?  The JH13 does it all for me.
> 
> As you said in the IF shootout, I find it incredibly difficult to find any real faults with its sound.  When I'm not using the JH13, my ears are spoiled by the HD800 (most of the time).. I'm not exaggerating when I say that it feels like I'm making very few, if any, real concessions when moving from the Senn flagship to the JHA flagship.  Yes, the HD800 has an ungodly soundstage.. but the JH13's stage is no slouch.. it smokes any other IEM's (and many headphones') soundstage I've heard.  In many ways, it's a more practical investment than the HD800 cause the JH13 doesn't require quite the outlay on upstream gear (to get the most out of it) as the JH13 does.  It's that impressive (to me).
> 
> I've been very happy with most every IEM I've owned.. but this might be the first time I can say I'm truly, honestly, 100% _satisfied_.


 
   
  That definitely mirrors my feelings about it I was almost annoyed when I first got my hands on it – you usually expect the big-brand sets to be good but ultimately not better – and definitely not better value – than the “underdogs”. In this case, however, I simply can’t find much fault at all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
   
   
  Quote: 





head-fi lover said:


> hi
> 
> I want to buy some pair of high end headphones(300-500$).I almost lesson to pop,trance,and even rock geners.can you tell me which in ear I must buy? one problem that I have is that I dont know that which company has shiping to my country(iran-in middle east).can you help me please?(senheizer Ie 8 and maybe Ie80 can be found here )
> 
> best regards


 
   
  I guess it’ll really depend on what’s available to you. IMO you don’t have to spend $300 to get IE8 (I haven’t heard the IE80) – level performance these days. You can just go for the $150 Yamaha EPH-100 (which may or may not be available to you) instead. Coincidentally, the EPH-100 sounds pretty darn great with pop and trance so I would definitely recommend. If you are limited to specific models, however, you may want to figure out which ones those are and post the list here so we can help you find the best of those options.
   
   
  Quote: 





starfly said:


> Joker, thanks for your reply. I'll look into if it's possible to easily obtain the 1964-V3 here in the Netherlands. If you were to recommend a universal IEM, what would you recommend? Also, are you familiar with the Fischer Amp IEMs? If so, what are your thoughts on those?


 
   
  Probably the SM64 if you don’t mind a less neutral sound. It is fun, though, with that big bass and large presentation.

 I’ve never heard a Fischer Amps product.
   
  Quote: 





awtryau89 said:


> Joker, I have been toying around with a few IEMs and was hoping you can steer me in the right direction from your vast experience. I have some Shure 215s but I always long for more detail. So I purchased a set of Ety HF5s and liked them but missed my bass. So I sold those. Now I am trying the Brainwavz B2s. Again I love their detail but miss my bass. I probably like the Etys a bit more than the B2s actually. They seem a bit more natural sounding to my ear. Even so, I am looking for something that gives me all the detail and high end presence of the latter 2 IEMs with some bass weight. It doesn't have to be as thick as the Shures and I don't want it to bleed into the mids but definitely more than I am hearing from the 5s or B2s. As a side note, I do like to use Complys or Shure Olives as my preferred tips. I love isolation for travel and planes. I am not going to put price restrictions but I would like to find that bang for the buck under $200. Thanks. EA


 
   
  There are many options that have various amounts of enhanced bass (compared to an HF or B2). To stay relatively neutral, you would probably want a GR07/GR07BE or Philips Fidelio S1/S2, though. Bass-wise I would rank them:
   
  GR07 < Fidelio S1 =< Fidelio S2 < GR07BE
   
  They all have more bass than the B2/HF5 so they should fit your requirements there.
  
  Quote: 





mc21 said:


> Well Joker, your review single-handedly convinced me to get a pair of UM Miracles. This is funny because I actually decided on this pair over 2 years ago as my first CIEM but then changed my mind and went with multiple high end universals. Recently decided to try CIEM and was looking at the top tiers like the JH16 and 8.a. I wanted to avoid having to ship to and from China so decided on a pair of JH16. There was a pair on the B/S forum but it didn't quite work out. Then I did a little more research and actually decided that the JH16 had too much bass for my liking. Then a pair of UM Miracles popped up on the B/S forum. This peaked my interest as I have stated before, I had previously picked this pair but decided last minute to stick to universals. After seeing the thread, I did a bit more research and I swear this must have been the thread that made me picked the Miracles 2 years ago. The description/review made it sound like the perfect CIEM for me. Well I bit the bullet and have an appointment with the audiologist scheduled. Will be getting my impressions and sending them for a remold next week. I knew my headfi journey will eventually lead me to customs. It took 7 years, which to be honest, is longer than I would have expected myself to hold out for. Anyways, I've always wanted customs and can't wait to get these in my ear!


 
   
  That's a lot of build-up for a pair of Miracles! I've never tried the JH16 but the Miracle has way less bass than my Heir 8.A and is more to my liking. I hope the remold sounds as good as my unit does!
   
  Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Hey Joker I got those PNY Midtowns today. Holy cow, $17 well spent!
> They're nicely warm sounding, much nicer than I was expecting, and the single button mic works really well too!
> 
> I'm surprised these aren't a bigger deal, they're not exactly new releases are they?
> ...


 
   
  Good stuff!
   
  They came out a year and a half ago IIRC. Noone bothered to check them out, I guess. I am guilty of the same - they ended up sitting in a box for months before I gave them a try. 
   
  It's been a bit confusing because they originally cost about $25-30, then the MSRP shot up to $45, and now they can be found for <$20. 
   
  I decided to go for the Steelseries Flux first (another budget in-ear without an audiophile brand behind it that I thought sounded surprisingly good for the price) but will make time to review the PNY afterwards.


----------



## Gasdoc

flysweep said:


> Can't wait to read your JH13 review (whenever it comes).  I've had it for approx. two months.. and I'm completely
> stunned
> by it.  I never thought it would happen, but I've practically lost all interest in (buying any more) IEMs.  I still plan on hearing many.. but buying.. why?  The JH13 does it all for me.
> 
> ...



I hear that. I picked up the jh13 a month ago and love it. Thanks to Joker and the other reviewers for pushing me over the tipping point. It is the first headphone I've had that does it all. Amazing isolation & sound. The sound reminds me of the SM3 but with better extension & soundstage. The sound is almost the ideal for me (fitear 334 organic presentation still bests it but it has poor isolation). The jh13 is more neutral than the TG334 but feels less transparent and lacks the visceral bass. That being said, they compete well for ear time.


----------



## Gasdoc

Translation of above: the jh13 is awesome.


----------



## dnullify

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Good stuff!
> 
> They came out a year and a half ago IIRC. Noone bothered to check them out, I guess. I am guilty of the same - they ended up sitting in a box for months before I gave them a try.
> 
> ...


 
  I'm rather blown away at $17. Weirdly enough, i'm enjoying them more out of my amp than my iphone. I'm liking them a lot more than anything i've purchased in this price range in the past - although i suspect i will eventually have to get some M1HC, but i don't think those are available at the same price as the midtowns. I'm seriously thinking about trying the uptowns as well.


----------



## mc21

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's a lot of build-up for a pair of Miracles! I've never tried the JH16 but the Miracle has way less bass than my Heir 8.A and is more to my liking. I hope the remold sounds as good as my unit does!


 
  Maybe I missed it but could you compare the Miracle to the 8.a? Just a quick overview, no need to waste your time with a thorough description. I was only wondering because on paper, the 8.a actually appealed to me more but I couldn't justify the extra ~$400. Thanks!


----------



## Ap616

Hey Joker,

I know you probably get it a lot, but I just wanted to thank you for all the hard work you put into your reviews and on HF in general. I feel it is very helpful & informative to newcomers like me and those with more experience alike.

I saw on your Buyer's Guide that you were going to review the VC1000 and VSD1/1S next. I was wondering if you had an idea of when you are going to review the SHE3580(90) and the S1/S2 in your priority of your upcoming to-be-reviewed list. If not, it's cool.

Also, I was curious if you had read or even heard anything about the new dynamic Astrotec AM-700...? I'm in the US and there are a few foreign websites that have some manufacturer material on them using Google Translate. The only place that has them right now is MP4 Nation that I can find. At $47 they are between the AM-90 and AM-800 in price($7 more and $1 less than the latter). I really like my AM-90 and it's build quality/comfort. The design on both of them looks great in my opinion. That cable is so nice! I like me some good bass--as they are marketed--with good clarity as well. I was thinking about ordering them and seeing what they're like. Do you think they'll be of good value? And I wonder how they compare to the two previously mentioned Astrotecs... 

Here's a visual:


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





gasdoc said:


> Translation of above: the jh13 is awesome.


 
   
  Thanks for the clarification 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





dnullify said:


> I'm rather blown away at $17. Weirdly enough, i'm enjoying them more out of my amp than my iphone. I'm liking them a lot more than anything i've purchased in this price range in the past - although i suspect i will eventually have to get some M1HC, but i don't think those are available at the same price as the midtowns. I'm seriously thinking about trying the uptowns as well.


 
   
  The MH1C is slightly better but - although it seems to be in the same price range from where I'm sitting with my RE-600 - it's actually more than 2x the current price of the PNYs...
   
  Quote: 





mc21 said:


> Maybe I missed it but could you compare the Miracle to the 8.a? Just a quick overview, no need to waste your time with a thorough description. I was only wondering because on paper, the 8.a actually appealed to me more but I couldn't justify the extra ~$400. Thanks!


 
   
  Their sound signatures are actually very different but I did happen to compare the two. The 8.A had a more intimate presentation, a lot more bass (especially midbass) with greater impact, and an overall tone that's warmer and darker compared to the Miracle. The Miracle's signature seems slightly v-shaped next to the 8.A. It has a lot less bass, a wider soundstage, thinner note presentation, and more treble energy/sparkle. On the whole, I felt that the Miracle was more neutral and a touch clearer than the 8.A. Honestly, I don't think they are direct competitors - it's sort of like comparing the Earsonics SM3 to an Ety ER4. 
   
  Quote: 





ap616 said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I know you probably get it a lot, but I just wanted to thank you for all the hard work you put into your reviews and on HF in general. I feel it is very helpful & informative to newcomers like me and those with more experience alike.
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks, glad the thread has been useful!
   
  The SHE3580 is a pretty low priority TBH. There's already a pretty long thread on it and it looks like it's been discontinued in favor of the 3590, which I don't have. The S1/S2 are a higher priority and will get done most likely next month. 
   
  I hadn't heard of the AM-700 before reading your post but it seems like price difference between that and the AM-800 is negligible. The AM-800 is a pretty great earphone, so I would probably just get that instead of grabbing the AM-700 blind. It'd be a good complement to the AM-90.


----------



## listen4joy

waiting for jh13 and jh16 reviews and placings in the comprasion * table *


----------



## head-fi lover

I guess it’ll really depend on what’s available to you. IMO you don’t have to spend $300 to get IE8 (I haven’t heard the IE80) – level performance these days. You can just go for the $150 Yamaha EPH-100 (which may or may not be available to you) instead. Coincidentally, the EPH-100 sounds pretty darn great with pop and trance so I would definitely recommend. If you are limited to specific models, however, you may want to figure out which ones those are and post the list here so we can help you find the best of those options.


hello again

I hope your heard sennheizer momentum beacause I can buy it here easyly.if yes,can you tell me how it sounds in compare to weston 4.

thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





listen4joy said:


> waiting for jh13 and jh16 reviews and placings in the comprasion * table *


 
   
  Sorry, no JH16, but the JH13 will be added in due time.
   
  Quote: 





head-fi lover said:


> hello again
> 
> I hope your heard sennheizer momentum beacause I can buy it here easyly.if yes,can you tell me how it sounds in compare to weston 4.
> 
> thanks


 

 I have not heard the Momentum.


----------



## stimer

IjokerI thank you for your work, I wish you a lot of patience to answer all the questions.


----------



## d m41n man

@ljokerl
  Nice! Seeing the planned reviews section, here's looking forward to what you've got to say about the UE 700 and TripleFi10 despite both being discontinued especially with your extensive experience in comparison with all the IEMs in this database.  Brands left and right are cranking their own version of the Knowles TWFK armature iems that it's good to see/hear how they tuned them differently to their accord. Can't wait.
   
  OT: Still no word on the M-100 and the Momentum review over at the portables section? Anyway, kudos!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





stimer said:


> IjokerI thank you for your work, I wish you a lot of patience to answer all the questions.


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





d m41n man said:


> @ljokerl
> Nice! Seeing the planned reviews section, here's looking forward to what you've got to say about the UE 700 and TripleFi10 despite both being discontinued especially with your extensive experience in comparison with all the IEMs in this database.  Brands left and right are cranking their own version of the Knowles TWFK armature iems that it's good to see/hear how they tuned them differently to their accord. Can't wait.
> 
> OT: Still no word on the M-100 and the Momentum review over at the portables section? Anyway, kudos!


 

 Sorry, still no M-100 or Momentum


----------



## drm870

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> *RBH EP1* - http://rbhsound.com/ep1.php
> 
> RBH is one of the many home audio manufacturers investing in headphones these days. The build quality of the EP1 is nice, with a metal housing and cloth cable, and makes up for the somewhat lackluster half in-ear design. The earphone sounds quite good, too - the bass is solid but not overbearing. Depth and control are both good. The mids are clear and not recessed. Treble is generally smooth, though some unevenness is noticeable, especially at higher volumes. Overall it might not quite be on-par with the RE-400 or Philips Fidelio S2 but definitely closer to that level than the mid-tier VSonic GR06/Sony MH1C and the like.


 
   
  Interesting. I bought the EP2 a couple weeks ago after being recommended them by a friend, and found them to be relatively bass-heavy and quite sibilant. Granted, I listen to music relatively high volumes, but I have to ask: assuming the EP1 and EP2 sound the same, what are your preferred tips with these? I generally prefer silicone tips, but didn't like the ones that RBH provided with the 'phones. The Comply tips are what I'm using now, but they did change the sound signature to my ears.
   
  I'm just trying to figure out if I'm doing something wrong. That may seem silly, but I do like the design of these babies and want to like their sound, too. More importantly, though, my observations on various IEMs I've tried have often lined up with yours pretty well, which makes me all the more confused now. Any ideas?


----------



## hippo2012

This is great review and very helpful, thank you ljokerl


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





drm870 said:


> Interesting. I bought the EP2 a couple weeks ago after being recommended them by a friend, and found them to be relatively bass-heavy and quite sibilant. Granted, I listen to music relatively high volumes, but I have to ask: assuming the EP1 and EP2 sound the same, what are your preferred tips with these? I generally prefer silicone tips, but didn't like the ones that RBH provided with the 'phones. The Comply tips are what I'm using now, but they did change the sound signature to my ears.
> 
> I'm just trying to figure out if I'm doing something wrong. That may seem silly, but I do like the design of these babies and want to like their sound, too. More importantly, though, my observations on various IEMs I've tried have often lined up with yours pretty well, which makes me all the more confused now. Any ideas?


 
   
  Hmm... I haven't really listened to them in depth but comparing them to the RE-400 right now the highs are a little more harsh. I agree that they are enhanced-bass earphones, probably on-par with the Shure SE215 in bass boost. More importantly, I am not noticing much sibilance. They are somewhere between the silky-smooth RE-400 and the more sibilance-prone VSonic VSD1 that I also have on my desk, but probably closer to the RE-400. I tried turning them up a bit compared to how I normally listen, though I still wouldn't call that "loud", and the treble issues became more noticeable so you might want to try lower volumes. It might also come down in part to the recordings and/or source you're using. 
   
  I usually have a bit of trouble getting a perfect seal with half in-ear designs (the fit of the Philips Fidelio S1/S2 took me some time to figure out) but these aren't bad. I don't have the stock tips for them since they are a loaner unit so I'm using some narrow-channel single-flanges. I believe they are from a MEElec A151 or from a Rock-It Sounds earphone. 
   
  And, I don't know if the EP1 and EP2 sound the same. While the EP1 does sound better than 90% of the earphones I set aside, I still don't think it's a great value and probably won't bother reviewing it in full. 
   
  Quote: 





hippo2012 said:


> This is great review and very helpful, thank you ljokerl


----------



## drm870

Hmm...the EP2 is, from what I've read and can tell, simply the EP1 with a universal microphone and a slightly different cosmetic look. That said, I suspect my higher listening volume and the Comply tips are affecting the sound, then. At the very least, I remember the bass being less pronounced with the stock silicone tips; can't remember the treble differences. I've misplaced those tips, in any case, so I can't check for sure (careless, I know). I'll probably try some other silicone tips from my other 'phones to see if they help before deciding whether get rid of them.
   
  Anyway, thanks for the reply!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





drm870 said:


> Hmm...the EP2 is, from what I've read and can tell, simply the EP1 with a universal microphone and a slightly different cosmetic look. That said, I suspect my higher listening volume and the Comply tips are affecting the sound, then. At the very least, I remember the bass being less pronounced with the stock silicone tips; can't remember the treble differences. I've misplaced those tips, in any case, so I can't check for sure (careless, I know). I'll probably try some other silicone tips from my other 'phones to see if they help before deciding whether get rid of them.
> 
> Anyway, thanks for the reply!


 

 Maybe also try giving them some more time. The unit I have is a loaner so I have no idea how many hours are on it.


----------



## Chude Mleko

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think after the A161P the GR06 might sound a bit congested but who knows, you may like it. If not, try the LG Quadbeat. Bass is somewhere between the N3i and A161P in quantity but more importantly it's got a wide sound that makes even the A161P sound a little closed-in. I think you might like it, and it's cheap enough to replace should anything go wrong.


 
  Hi Joker,
   
  Thank you for your response.
   
  GR06 came and although I was really impressed with the packaging and general feel I'm not too sure about the sound. I mean it sounds very nice and pleasant, but it lacks character; It's somewhat boring to me. I like the balance it produces but I wish it had more of everything. I spend some hours comparing them to N3i, MEElectronics CW31P, A161P and some stock earphones and to me they are closest to CW31P but noticeably better.
   
  At the end I decided to follow your recommendation and ordered LG Quadbeat to see what are they like. I wander how would GR07BE compare to A161P, does it make sense to upgrade from GR06 to them?
   
  The real reference for me at the moment are A161P which are by far the best sounding earphones I have access to but I have to admit I very much enjoy N3i in some tracks.
  How would you describe sound signature of N3i are they v-shaped?
   
  Cheers
  Mleko


----------



## AgentJ

This guide - although really useful - has left me really confused. I'm looking for some IEMs for when I'm on my bike, and when I'm out as I prefer not to have my Bose On Ears if I'm not at home. 
   
  I had some JVC XX's, which I thought were very good, although a bit lacking in the trebles...
   
  So far, Ive got my eyes on the VSonic GR02BE, but now I've also found the Astrotec AM800, MEElectronics SP51, and the RHA MA350 (mainly because I don't have to ship it in, and I get a long 3 year warranty).
   
   
  Can anyone help me?
   
  (sorry if this should be somewhere else, but I posted it here as  it's relating to this thread, and the other thread I posted in was relating to the GR06 vs GR02)


----------



## stimer

del


----------



## mc21

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Their sound signatures are actually very different but I did happen to compare the two. The 8.A had a more intimate presentation, a lot more bass (especially midbass) with greater impact, and an overall tone that's warmer and darker compared to the Miracle. The Miracle's signature seems slightly v-shaped next to the 8.A. It has a lot less bass, a wider soundstage, thinner note presentation, and more treble energy/sparkle. On the whole, I felt that the Miracle was more neutral and a touch clearer than the 8.A. Honestly, I don't think they are direct competitors - it's sort of like comparing the Earsonics SM3 to an Ety ER4.


 
  Not sure if you're doing it on purpose but everything you answer one of my questions, you make the Miracles sound absolutely amazing for me. Well I should get them today or tomorrow and then off to inearz they go. Can't wait till I get my first set of customs fitted to my ears 
   
  Also, I am trying not to play the numbers game but in the back of my mind it always seem better to have more drivers, hence why I asked about the 2 CIEM haha


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





chude mleko said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Thank you for your response.
> 
> ...


 
   
  More of everything like... louder 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





? 
   
  Anyway, the GR06 is not an overly colored earphone, though more so than the A161P. The A161P is the most accurate of everything you have by a margin. The N3i I would characterize as warm and bassy. It's a very nice-sounding earphone, just lacking a little in clarity. The way up from that would be something like a Yamaha EPH-100. 
   
  The LG Quadbeat is more v-shaped (less bass, more treble than N3i and more of both than A161P). It's still pretty well-balanced, though. I guess we'll see if you like it as a compromise. It has one thing the GR06 lacks - a wider and airier soundstage. 
   
  Quote: 





agentj said:


> This guide - although really useful - has left me really confused. I'm looking for some IEMs for when I'm on my bike, and when I'm out as I prefer not to have my Bose On Ears if I'm not at home.
> 
> I had some JVC XX's, which I thought were very good, although a bit lacking in the trebles...
> 
> ...


 
   
  Hmm...  those all sound slightly different. The SP51 and AM-800 are more balanced, though still with slight bass emphasis. The AM-800 has some emphasis on treble as well whereas with the SP51 it depends on which tuning port you use. The GR02BE and MA-350 are better if you want to maintain the heavy bass of your JVC XX. Of the two, the GR02 gas more treble emphasis whereas the MA-350 is more smooth level the midrange up. If you like some treble emphasis, which it seems like you do, I would go for the AM-800 for more balanced overall sound or the GR02BE for a more bass-heavy (but still not as bassy as a JVC XX) sound signature. 
   
  Quote: 





mc21 said:


> Not sure if you're doing it on purpose but everything you answer one of my questions, you make the Miracles sound absolutely amazing for me. Well I should get them today or tomorrow and then off to inearz they go. Can't wait till I get my first set of customs fitted to my ears
> 
> Also, I am trying not to play the numbers game but in the back of my mind it always seem better to have more drivers, hence why I asked about the 2 CIEM haha


 

 Well, the Miracle is one of my favorite earphones


----------



## Chude Mleko

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> More of everything like... louder
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Louder! Ha ha ha, yes it crossed my mind. 
   
  What I meant was the sound wasn't clear enough, wide enough, crisp enough etc. I don't think colored earphone is what I'm looking for though. A161P is great I use it all the time and love it, just reading this forum you (and others) made me think it could be better.
  N3i is too bassy for my taste in most tracks but I find it amazing in some. Not better than A161P but different enough so I can appreciate the same track in completely different way. 
   
  This makes me think that maybe one set of IEM is not enough for me? Do you change them for different albums / type of music or do you have an ultimate set which is close to perfect in everything? For the record I've no interest in going above $100-$150.  Not yet anyway.
   
  I'm trying to define my taste as well thus my (probably naive) questions.
   
  Is there a point in comparing GR07/BE and A161P?
   
  I'll wait for LG to arrive and come back with more questions I guess. 
   
  Cheers!


----------



## SyCo87

I'm kind of going on the comparison that you've made between the GR06 and Quadbeats. I have the Quadbeats, and while I enjoy it, I can't help but wonder if there is something with the wide soundstage and slightly better depth and mids. Is that even possible, does less prominant mids equate to better sense of distance. I was wondering if there is something under $100 with those attributes. IEMs such as VSD1(s) and RE-400s come to mind. I love what the Quadbeats put out with ambiance and a sense of width, but, I long for something that's more engaging while still having a decent stage and better depth without weaker mids.


----------



## AgentJ

@Joker (CBA to edit the quote on my phone) 
Thanks for the help! 
As I said before, I liked the bass on the XX but it was a little 'boomy', which is why I'm not going for a 'extreme bass' IEM. I think you've ruled the others out for me, and then, out of the GR02BE and AM800 it gets a bit more difficult-bass vs treble, but I guess if the Am800 aren't going to be 'lacking' in the lower end, they'd probably be better overall - I'm used to my Bose On Ears and whenever I listen to music on anything else, I often find I'm appreciating the high notes more than the bass, but I still like that bass to be present (I listen to a bit of dubstep and the like) 
Still recommend the AM800? If you do, would you say that I should be fine with the included tips or should I get some other ones? 

Thanks again!

Edit: I've just realised that you're the one who reviewed these IEMs in the OP, sorry! You mention a slight difference in bass (which makes me think I can live with it) but is the noise isolation that bad? (compared to the gr02)


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





chude mleko said:


> Louder! Ha ha ha, yes it crossed my mind.
> 
> What I meant was the sound wasn't clear enough, wide enough, crisp enough etc. I don't think colored earphone is what I'm looking for though. A161P is great I use it all the time and love it, just reading this forum you (and others) made me think it could be better.
> N3i is too bassy for my taste in most tracks but I find it amazing in some. Not better than A161P but different enough so I can appreciate the same track in completely different way.
> ...


 
   
  I use a couple of IEMs but most often it's to match what I'm doing rather than the music I'm listening to. For example, I often use the K3003 out and about because it has a mic and lower isolation than my customs. I generally like the sound signatures of everything I use.
   
  The GR07BE compares well to the A161P - more bass and treble for a more v-shaped signature but still on the accurate side compared to something like the N3i. I did A:B the GR07BE with the GR06 and found it to be more coherent and more natural, clearer, especially in the midrange, and more well-separated. Compared to the GR07 BE, the GR06 sounds uneven and congested, with an unnatural, plasticky timbre.
   
  Anyway, I think trying the LG and seeing if you like the signature is a good idea before ordering anything else.
   
   
  Quote: 





syco87 said:


> I'm kind of going on the comparison that you've made between the GR06 and Quadbeats. I have the Quadbeats, and while I enjoy it, I can't help but wonder if there is something with the wide soundstage and slightly better depth and mids. Is that even possible, does less prominant mids equate to better sense of distance. I was wondering if there is something under $100 with those attributes. IEMs such as VSD1(s) and RE-400s come to mind. I love what the Quadbeats put out with ambiance and a sense of width, but, I long for something that's more engaging while still having a decent stage and better depth without weaker mids.


 
   
  You are correct, the wide soundstage of the Quadbeat is a result of the v-shaped signature and somewhat withdrawn mids. This is the case with a lot of other earphones with similar signatures - the UE500, for example, and the T-Peos H-100. If you want more intimate mids, you'll have to give up some of that presentation. The VSD1 (or maybe VSD1S - have yet to compare the two) is a good compromise, though it still has slight midrange recession (but a warmer, fuller overall tone). The RE-400 is more mid-centric and probably not something to recommend if you like the Quadbeat for its sense of space. 
   
  Quote: 





agentj said:


> @Joker (CBA to edit the quote on my phone)
> Thanks for the help!
> As I said before, I liked the bass on the XX but it was a little 'boomy', which is why I'm not going for a 'extreme bass' IEM. I think you've ruled the others out for me, and then, out of the GR02BE and AM800 it gets a bit more difficult-bass vs treble, but I guess if the Am800 aren't going to be 'lacking' in the lower end, they'd probably be better overall - I'm used to my Bose On Ears and whenever I listen to music on anything else, I often find I'm appreciating the high notes more than the bass, but I still like that bass to be present (I listen to a bit of dubstep and the like)
> Still recommend the AM800? If you do, would you say that I should be fine with the included tips or should I get some other ones?
> ...


 

 None of the ones you are looking at are as boomy as the XX, certainly not the AM-800. The AM-800 has slightly enhanced bass - it is not lacking at the low end except maybe in comparison to the XX itself. The stock tips are alright. 
   
  GR02 isolation is better than that of the AM-800 but not by much, I would consider both pretty average.


----------



## Amitl

Joker...would you consider the V-Moda LP suitable for commuting and walking busy streets?
  i'm interested in the M100 which share similar design.
  would one need to push the volume up to dangerous levels in order to overcome
  the lack of IEM-ish isolation?
  thank you ...


----------



## AgentJ

Ok, looks like I'm getting me some AM800s then. There seems to be no real reason I shouldn't  

Thanks again!


----------



## shakur1996

Joker, which CIEM in our opinion is similar in sound signature to Etymotic ER4S and which could be regarded as an upgrade to Etys?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> Joker...would you consider the V-Moda LP suitable for commuting and walking busy streets?
> i'm interested in the M100 which share similar design.
> would one need to push the volume up to dangerous levels in order to overcome
> the lack of IEM-ish isolation?
> thank you ...


 
   
  Yeah, the isolation of LP actually wasn't bad. It's no IEM but I definitely didn't have to blast it uncomfortably. 
   
  Quote: 





shakur1996 said:


> Joker, which CIEM in our opinion is similar in sound signature to Etymotic ER4S and which could be regarded as an upgrade to Etys?


 
   
  What are you looking to change about your Etys? I haven't heard a custom that follows Etymotic's target curve as closely as the ER4S.


----------



## shakur1996

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> What are you looking to change about your Etys? I haven't heard a custom that follows Etymotic's target curve as closely as the ER4S.


 
  More micro details
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, slightly more bass, in particular subbass, slightly wider and deeper soundstage.
   
  Maybe remold of my Etys is an option. However, I'm afraid that the remolded Etys will have worser sound that the originals. Additionally, after the remold I will end up with just one pair of IEMs and I want to have backup (just in case).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shakur1996 said:


> More micro details
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The ER4S extracts pretty much all the detail there is except maybe in the subbass where it doesn't have the greatest presence.
   
  For balanced, accurate sound my favorite is the Hidition NT 6. Except for a bit of treble emphasis, it's got some of the clearest, most balanced, and most detailed sound I've heard so far. The bass is punchy and doesn't drop off (I actually think it rises a little in the subbass region) and the presentation is wide and well-layered, in contrast to the Etys. 
   
  I would agree with not remolding the Etys. You're not likely to gain anything and you'll lose the ability to vary the insertion depth.


----------



## kkcc

ljokerl said:


> The ER4S extracts pretty much all the detail there is except maybe in the subbass where it doesn't have the greatest presence.
> 
> For balanced, accurate sound my favorite is the Hidition NT 6. Except for a bit of treble emphasis, it's got some of the clearest, most balanced, and most detailed sound I've heard so far. The bass is punchy and doesn't drop off (I actually think it rises a little in the subbass region) and the presentation is wide and well-layered, in contrast to the Etys.
> 
> I would agree with not remolding the Etys. You're not likely to gain anything and you'll lose the ability to vary the insertion depth.




I did the er4s custom reshell and lost all the transparency I loved about it. Ended up buying another pair.


----------



## Inks

Joker, I'll suggest adding a white damper to the tweeter bore of your NT-6, Rin got great results with his loaner pair, makes the treble less edgy and more neutral. link


----------



## shakur1996

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The ER4S extracts pretty much all the detail there is except maybe in the subbass where it doesn't have the greatest presence.
> 
> For balanced, accurate sound my favorite is the Hidition NT 6. Except for a bit of treble emphasis, it's got some of the clearest, most balanced, and most detailed sound I've heard so far. The bass is punchy and doesn't drop off (I actually think it rises a little in the subbass region) and the presentation is wide and well-layered, in contrast to the Etys.
> 
> I would agree with not remolding the Etys. You're not likely to gain anything and you'll lose the ability to vary the insertion depth.


 
  Hidition is very pricey and currently I can't afford them.
   
  Which cheaper CIEM you would consider as most balanced and accurate (and thus similar to Etys). Did you hear Spiral Ear SE 1-way Pro?
   
  I'm curious about your impressions on The Custom Art's Music One; hope to see the review soon.
   
  Regarding remold I actually use my Etys with custom tips made by piotrus-g (I stop using triple flange due to that sometimes I very easily lost seal and this was very annoying).


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kkcc said:


> I did the er4s custom reshell and lost all the transparency I loved about it. Ended up buying another pair.


 
   
  Ouch
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Joker, I'll suggest adding a white damper to the tweeter bore of your NT-6, Rin got great results with his loaner pair, makes the treble less edgy and more neutral. link


 
   
  I only have green/red/orange dampers 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
   
  Has anyone found a place to order this thing http://hal-hen.com/cgi-bin/info.cgi?id=2506&ls=dc~P~107 ? I want to be able to extract filters without damaging them.
   
   
  Quote: 





shakur1996 said:


> Hidition is very pricey and currently I can't afford them.
> 
> Which cheaper CIEM you would consider as most balanced and accurate (and thus similar to Etys). Did you hear Spiral Ear SE 1-way Pro?
> 
> ...


 

 The SE-3 is the only Spiral Ear I've tried but I should have my hands on the Music One soon.
   
  Is the Lime Ears LE3 still out of budget?


----------



## shakur1996

Quote: 





> The SE-3 is the only Spiral Ear I've tried but I should have my hands on the Music One soon.
> 
> Is the Lime Ears LE3 still out of budget?


 
  I've listened to Peter's Music One and I've read review of average_joe, but due to your sound taste" I'm very curious about your impressions and how you will rate them in terms of sound quality.
   
  I'm considering buying Peter's Pro210. However, I want to chose wisely so I need more options (so I'm also thinkg about Grzegorz's SE 1-way Pro).
   
  Unfortunately yes - Lime Ears are out of my budget. I can spend around USD 400. But, from what I have read it seems that LE are rather warm IEMs; so maybe they would not be good for me.
   
  What about CTM-200? Alclair Reference or Dual?
   
  My new CIEMs don't have to be exact as Etys but I would like to them being as close as possible to Etys in terms of accuracy; more subbass is more than welcome.


----------



## ljokerl

Upcoming release from EarSonics:



 http://theheadphonelist.com/category/news/
   
   
  Quote: 





shakur1996 said:


> Unfortunately yes - Lime Ears are out of my budget. I can spend around USD 400. But, from what I have read it seems that LE are rather warm IEMs; so maybe they would not be good for me.
> 
> What about CTM-200? Alclair Reference or Dual?
> 
> My new CIEMs don't have to be exact as Etys but I would like to them being as close as possible to Etys in terms of accuracy; more subbass is more than welcome.


 
   
   
  I think you’re thinking of the Lime Ears LE3B. The LE3 is pretty neutral, maybe slightly warm but no more so than a HiFiMan RE-400, for example.

 The CTM-200 doesn’t have any more deep bass than the Etys (in fact, I think it drops off a little more quickly) so it doesn’t really fit your requirements.

 The Alclair Reference has the bass but lacks the level treble of the Etys. It sounds more like the GR07 at the top with some hotness/peaks. Other than that it’s quite good. Not sure what the Alclair dual sounds like. The quad-driver RSM is pretty consistent with the sound of the 3-driver reference, just better in terms of imaging, bass quality, and overall balance.

 Will hopefully know how the Music One sounds in a few weeks!


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Has anyone found a place to order this thing http://hal-hen.com/cgi-bin/info.cgi?id=2506&ls=dc~P~107 ? I want to be able to extract filters without damaging them.




X2


----------



## lilboozy

Joker what would you recommend as a very bassy (but still good sq) ~20$ iem preferably through amazon? I've been thinking about the she3580 but i'm worried since i would also use these iems for running (mostly just walking from place to place though) and wear my iems cable down that the microphonics would be too much? I listen at 85-90db.


----------



## Deviltooth

I'm excited to learn about a new Earsonics product.  Half a dozen times I've come close to pulling the trigger on a set.  Maybe this will be the one.


----------



## omastic

HI Joker! I would like to ask, is there any possibility of you reviewing the TDK BA200 in future? I know it is not in your planned review list but still just wanted know. I am very impressed with these iems and to me they sound better than anything I have heard thus far, including the likes of w4, um3x, sm3 v1/2, gr07,xba 40, fidelio s2 and even the heir audio 4a customs. I absolutely love it and it would be of great interest to know your opinion of them relative to all the high end iems that you have heard so far.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Joker what would you recommend as a very bassy (but still good sq) ~20$ iem preferably through amazon? I've been thinking about the she3580 but i'm worried since i would also use these iems for running (mostly just walking from place to place though) and wear my iems cable down that the microphonics would be too much? I listen at 85-90db.


 
   
  The SHE3580 isn't even that bassy. JVC FX101, maybe? JVC cable is quieter, too.
   
  Quote: 





omastic said:


> HI Joker! I would like to ask, is there any possibility of you reviewing the TDK BA200 in future? I know it is not in your planned review list but still just wanted know. I am very impressed with these iems and to me they sound better than anything I have heard thus far, including the likes of w4, um3x, sm3 v1/2, gr07,xba 40, fidelio s2 and even the heir audio 4a customs. I absolutely love it and it would be of great interest to know your opinion of them relative to all the high end iems that you have heard so far.


 

 Yes, there's a good chance I'll get to try them soon.


----------



## eccom

For a





shakur1996 said:


> Hidition is very pricey and currently I can't afford them.
> 
> Which cheaper CIEM you would consider as most balanced and accurate (and thus similar to Etys). Did you hear Spiral Ear SE 1-way Pro?
> 
> ...




I think that you should check out project86's review of the cosmic ears BA4 either here or on innerfidelity. Just be sure to look at the review of the R-revision and not the F.


----------



## yalper

I still hope that joker will begin to review philips iems sometime soon...


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





yalper said:


> I still hope that joker will begin to review philips iems sometime soon...


 
  well, he's pretty much reviewed the fidelio s1 and s2 on innerfidelity, so I guess he might add them here soon when he decides on the final scores.


----------



## puckshock

My trusty SHE3570s finally died out and I need a recommendation for a new go to IEM.
   
  Based on my price range, I've narrowed it down to the Sony MH1C, LG Quadbeat, Dunu Trident, JVC HA-FX40, and the Sony MDR-EX300. I do enjoy a good V-shaped sound signature, but I can't stand poor microphonics which is why I haven't immediately chosen the MH1Cs. If anyone has any personal insights and comparisons to the SHE35XX series, I'd love to hear them.


----------



## Prakhar

Hey joker, I bought the SHE3580 and was looking for an upgrade and was hoping you could help me out. I was looking for something with more bass than the SHE3580, better build quality and slightly better isolation. Any suggestions?


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a short article on IEM fitment on InnerFidelity, now linked on the front page of this thread:


ljokerl said:


> For a brief overview of IEM fitment, see my article on InnerFidelity:
> How to Insert In-Ear Monitors


 

    
   
   
  Quote:


kova4a said:


> well, he's pretty much reviewed the fidelio s1 and s2 on innerfidelity, so I guess he might add them here soon when he decides on the final scores.


 
   
  Yep, will add them when I get a chance. There seems to always be several in-progress reviews I want to finish ASAP. 
   
  I do use the Fidelios as a benchmark these days and even included the S1 in the short buyer’s guide.
   
  Quote: 





puckshock said:


> My trusty SHE3570s finally died out and I need a recommendation for a new go to IEM.
> 
> Based on my price range, I've narrowed it down to the Sony MH1C, LG Quadbeat, Dunu Trident, JVC HA-FX40, and the Sony MDR-EX300. I do enjoy a good V-shaped sound signature, but I can't stand poor microphonics which is why I haven't immediately chosen the MH1Cs. If anyone has any personal insights and comparisons to the SHE35XX series, I'd love to hear them.


 
   
  The MH1C and Trident aren’t notably v-shaped IMO. The Quadbeat has some cable noise, though it’s a little better than the MH1C. The EX300 and FX40 are much better in this regard.
   
  How about the VSonic VSD1? It’s v-shaped, but not too v-shaded (reminds me of the VSonic GR07 Bass Edition) and the cable noise isn’t terrible, especially when worn cable-up.
    
  Quote: 





prakhar said:


> Hey joker, I bought the SHE3580 and was looking for an upgrade and was hoping you could help me out. I was looking for something with more bass than the SHE3580, better build quality and slightly better isolation. Any suggestions?


 
   
   
  Hmm… that sounds like the Yamaha EPH-100 to me. Great bass with good depth, very good isolation for a dynamic-driver earphone, and the build is pretty solid.


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The SHE3580 isn't even that bassy. JVC FX101, maybe? JVC cable is quieter, too.


 
  Also do they have decent stock tips because i don't have any extras? Then again they are only $15 so i could get some sony hybrids if needed


----------



## ljokerl

Signature Acoustics Elements C-12 review below
   
   
*(3A82) Signature Acoustics Elements C-12*
   

Added Aug 2013

   
  Details: Entry-level earphone from the first Indian IEM manufacturer 
  Current Price: est. *$50 *from ebay.com (MSRP: est. $60)
  Specs: Driver: _Dynamic_ | Imp: _18Ω_ | Sens: _102 dB_ | Freq: _17-20k Hz_ | Cable: _3.9' L-plug_
  Nozzle Size: _5.5mm_ | Preferred tips: _Generic single-flanges_
  Wear Style: _Straight down or over-the-ear_
   
  Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Single-flange silicone tips (3 sizes), replacement filters, shirt clip, and genuine leather zippered carrying pouch (limited first run also comes with heavy screw-top brass case)
  Build Quality *(4/5)* – The wooden housings of the C-12 are a little plain but well put-together. The earphones feature replaceable filters, which is a rarity these days. The textured cable is nice and sturdy, reminding me of the cords on the Brainwavz M1/M2/M3 earphones. No cable cinch is present
  Isolation *(3/5)* – Shallow fit results in average noise isolation
  Microphonics *(4.5/5)* – Good with cable-down wear; even better when worn over-the-ear
  Comfort *(4/5)* – The wooden housings are very lightweight and not overly large, allowing for a comfortable fit
   
  Sound *(7.3/10)* – The C-12 is an unabashedly bass-heavy earphone that focuses on presenting listeners with a big and impactful low end. The midbass region is hyped up, resulting in a slightly boomy sound and making the deep bass appear less prominent. Earphones such as the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition and Dunu Trident, which are by no means lacking in bass, both yield to the C-12 in overall impact, offering a more linear response better balanced between midbass and subbass. Suffice it to say that no one will find the bass of the C-12 deficient. 
   
  As a result of the bass boost, the mids of the C-12 are mildly veiled but at the same time maintain a warm and rich tone. Note thickness is rather good, though for my tastes the earphones could use more midrange presence and clarity. Clarity and detail levels are about on-par with the Brainwavz M2 and the older bass-heavy Xears models. The top end rolls off gently for a slightly dark overall tone and has a smoother character than, for example, VSonic earphones and the Astrotec AM-800. This makes it less fatiguing and more tolerable at high volumes. At the same time, the C-12 has a bit more sparkle than the aging Brainwavz M1 and M2 models, which is a plus.
   
  The presentation of the C-12 is nice and spacious, making competitors such as the Dunu Trident sound closed-in and congested in comparison. It’s not quite at the level of the pricier Astrotec AM-800 but comes very close, which is all the more impressive considering the more bass-heavy balance and darker tone of the C-12. Combined with the powerful bass, the spacious presentation makes for a very enjoyable listening experience.
   
  Value *(8/10)* – The Signature Acoustics Elements C-12 is a very capable earphone from the first India-based IEM manufacturer. A solid all-rounder with even more solid bass response, the Elements C-12 boasts slightly rolled-off treble and a spacious, reverberant presentation. The wooden housings are lightweight and comfortable in the ear while the twisted cables are strong and non-microphonic, making for convenient listening while out and about. Minor details such as packaging are slightly rough around the edges but one thing is certain: the Elements C-12 doesn’t look – or sound – like a freshman effort. 
   
*Pros: Lightweight housings & strong cables; impactful bass; good sense of space*
*Cons: Somewhat veiled midrange*
   
   
   
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> Also do they have decent stock tips because i don't have any extras? Then again they are only $15 so i could get some sony hybrids if needed


 
   
  In my experience stock JVC tips are usually acceptable. I didn't have any trouble with the FX101.


----------



## shakur1996

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think you’re thinking of the Lime Ears LE3B. The LE3 is pretty neutral, maybe slightly warm but no more so than a HiFiMan RE-400, for example.
> 
> The CTM-200 doesn’t have any more deep bass than the Etys (in fact, I think it drops off a little more quickly) so it doesn’t really fit your requirements.
> 
> ...


 
  Joker, many thanks for you help. I've decided to go for Peter's Pro210 (one of the members of our local Polish audio forum told me that pro210 share commonalities with Spiral Ears' dual driver SE 2-way pro).
   
  However, maybe in one year or so I will buy myself more expensive CIEM. Correctly if I'm wrong but if I want to find the sound similar to Ety with more subbass and wider soundstage I should look at: Hidition NT 6 pro, Cosmic Ears BA4 or Canal works CW-L05QD; and what about 1964 Ears V3?


----------



## AgentJ

Last question : AM800 vs http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/a-jays-one-earphones-black-p32359.htm 
I've realised that because the headset isn't in the OP, you've either not heard them or heard of them but any info at all would be very useful. Main question is whether the Am800 +something to turn it into a headset is going to be better than the jays headset
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Tyow

One quick question; I am currently eyeing the HiFiMan RE-400 Waterline.
  Before I was looking at the rockit sounds r-50, but my songs have a bitrate of 210-224, and was told it would bring out the errors in the compression.
  So my question is, will the RE-400 still sound good with those bitrates?
   
  Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shakur1996 said:


> Joker, many thanks for you help. I've decided to go for Peter's Pro210 (one of the members of our local Polish audio forum told me that pro210 share commonalities with Spiral Ears' dual driver SE 2-way pro).
> 
> However, maybe in one year or so I will buy myself more expensive CIEM. Correctly if I'm wrong but if I want to find the sound similar to Ety with more subbass and wider soundstage I should look at: Hidition NT 6 pro, Cosmic Ears BA4 or Canal works CW-L05QD; and what about 1964 Ears V3?


 
   
  I only have the regular NT6, not the pro. The Pro has an extra crossover and an extra bass driver and is said to have more bass, which is not necessary IMO as the NT 6 already improves on the ER4S with much better subbass response and more natural, fleshed-out bass overall. The 1964-V3 sounds way too colored to be an Ety upgrade.
    
  Quote:


agentj said:


> Last question : AM800 vs http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/a-jays-one-earphones-black-p32359.htm
> I've realised that because the headset isn't in the OP, you've either not heard them or heard of them but any info at all would be very useful. Main question is whether the Am800 +something to turn it into a headset is going to be better than the jays headset
> Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2


 
   
  I haven't heard the a-JAYS. The t-JAYS were somewhat mediocre-sounding and the j-JAYS were crap.
   
  Quote: 





tyow said:


> One quick question; I am currently eyeing the HiFiMan RE-400 Waterline.
> Before I was looking at the rockit sounds r-50, but my songs have a bitrate of 210-224, and was told it would bring out the errors in the compression.
> So my question is, will the RE-400 still sound good with those bitrates?
> 
> Thanks


 
   
  I think the RE-400 is more forgiving than the Rock-It but at the same time those bitrates aren't too bad. VBR mp3s can sound quite good. I'd still go with the RE-400 to be safe.


----------



## shakur1996

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I only have the regular NT6, not the pro. The Pro has an extra crossover and an extra bass driver and is said to have more bass, which is not necessary IMO as the NT 6 already improves on the ER4S with much better subbass response and more natural, fleshed-out bass overall. The 1964-V3 sounds way too colored to be an Ety upgrade.


 
  What about Canal works and Cosmic Ears BA4 (I found on innerfidelity that Cosmic Ears 4 driver model Reference is very similar to Ety).


----------



## Tyow

ljokerl said:


> I think the RE-400 is more forgiving than the Rock-It but at the same time those bitrates aren't too bad. VBR mp3s can sound quite good. I'd still go with the RE-400 to be safe.


 
  Okay, thanks, also. Is the RE-400 the best neutral IEM I can get while still sounding good with those bitrates?


----------



## MoonYeol

The R-50 almost require different tips than the stock ones to not be sibilant. Or they require very well mastered records with singers who don't emphasize their "S"-es. But I haven't heard Re-400.


----------



## Tyow

moonyeol said:


> The R-50 almost require different tips than the stock ones to not be sibilant. Or they require very well mastered records with singers who don't emphasize their "S"-es. But I haven't heard Re-400.


 
  I think I would get the etymotic tri-flange tips.


----------



## Prakhar

Hmm… that sounds like the Yamaha EPH-100 to me. Great bass with good depth, very good isolation for a dynamic-driver earphone, and the build is pretty solid.
[/quote]

Thanks for the reply joker. I thought the EPH100 seemed like the best option as well. My only concern was the size of the nozzle. I use the small tips on the SHE3580, so do you think I would have fit/comfort issues?


----------



## garcsa

Quote: 





prakhar said:


> Hmm… that sounds like the Yamaha EPH-100 to me. Great bass with good depth, very good isolation for a dynamic-driver earphone, and the build is pretty solid.


 
 Thanks for the reply joker. I thought the EPH100 seemed like the best option as well. My only concern was the size of the nozzle. I use the small tips on the SHE3580, so do you think I would have fit/comfort issues?[/quote]

  Am I right that the Philips is some 15 USD - and the Yamaha is some 150 USD ? What we're talking about   ???


----------



## MoonYeol

Quote: 





prakhar said:


> Hey joker, I bought the SHE3580 and* was looking for an upgrade* and was hoping you could help me out. I was looking for something with more bass than the SHE3580, better build quality and slightly better isolation. Any suggestions?


----------



## davidcotton

So then Joker, any ideas what the iem is going to be that is number 300 (!) in the review list?  Perhaps the tf10 finally  ?
   
  Thanks for all the help and recommendations along the way.


----------



## vwinter

davidcotton said:


> So then Joker, any ideas what the iem is going to be that is number 300 (!) in the review list?  Perhaps the tf10 finally  ?
> 
> Thanks for all the help and recommendations along the way.




If he ever posted that TF10 review, it would likely break the internets.


----------



## awtryau89

Joker,
  I asked about an alternative to the Brainwavz B2. I have since found it is very sensitive to sources IMO. Direct from my iPhone, it just hurts. But when I add in the little Fiio E6 amp, it really takes the edge off. Also the Bass Eq really does wonders for these things. 
   
  In the mean time, I am trying the GR07 BE again (had a set before) and the Yamaha EPH-100. I am still burning in the EPH-100s. The GR07s are loaners and broken in. I must say, I prefer the sound of the EPH-100s much better. The GR07s have a little more presence at the top but do not seem nearly as coherent overall. I am not sure how to put what I am hearing but the Yamaha's just have a fuller sound. Not really in a bass-mid-treble sort of way but fuller in that they just sound more musical to my ears. And this is with all types of music. 
   
  So for now, I am going to put some more time in this weekend but I am leaning to giving my buddy the 07s back and just keeping the Yamaha's to supplement the B2s.


----------



## Deviltooth

Why are people asking for reviews of IEMs that have been covered in depth by countless other reviewers?  For me the best part of this thread is that Joker covers esoteric and less popular options sometimes uncovering gems in the process.


----------



## vwinter

deviltooth said:


> Why are people asking for reviews of IEMs that have been covered in depth by countless other reviewers?  For me the best part of this thread is that Joker covers esoteric and less popular options sometimes uncovering gems in the process.




The depth of experience here engenders a sense of trust that is relatively lacking from other reviewers.

It's the course of things. Would you rather get laser eye surgery from the opthamologist who's done 20 or the one who's done 2000?


----------



## yalper

> Would you rather get laser eye surgery from the opthamologist who's done 20 or the one who's done 2000?


 
   
  you opened a new window to me master vwinter


----------



## Deviltooth

Quote: 





vwinter said:


> The depth of experience here engenders a sense of trust that is relatively lacking from other reviewers.
> 
> It's the course of things. Would you rather get laser eye surgery from the opthamologist who's done 20 or the one who's done 2000?


 

 A good point.  On the other hand if you have a dozen opthamologists and three quarters of them agree on a diagnosis then the odds are it's the right one.  Or in this case if many reviewers agree on a similar performance level and sound signature.
   
  Joker's expertise isn't in question but his time seems more valuable when it's put to use introducing us to something new.  I also question the value of reviewing a product that's no longer being offered by the manufacturer.
   
  Just my viewpoint.


----------



## vwinter

deviltooth said:


> A good point.  On the other hand if you have a dozen opthamologists and three quarters of them agree on a diagnosis then the odds are it's the right one.  Or in this case if many reviewers agree on a similar performance level and sound signature.
> 
> Joker's expertise isn't in question but his time seems more valuable when it's put to use introducing us to something new.  I also question the value of reviewing a product that's no longer being offered by the manufacturer.
> 
> Just my viewpoint.




Lol! It's always that damn last dentist.

I don't disagree with you now nor did I before. I was just trying to explain the actions you were questioning, not justify them.


----------



## kova4a

Hey, joker, can you help me with this conundrum http://www.head-fi.org/t/678408/need-help-identifying-tri-flange-tips? I remember you were able to help me before with the meelec balanced bi-flanges. These are just great sound and fit-wise with the a161p and pretty good with the vsd1 but I don't want to swap one pair of tips between different iems all the time.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





shakur1996 said:


> What about Canal works and Cosmic Ears BA4 (I found on innerfidelity that Cosmic Ears 4 driver model Reference is very similar to Ety).


 
   
  I'm not familiar with either of those brands.
   
  Quote: 





tyow said:


> Okay, thanks, also. Is the RE-400 the best neutral IEM I can get while still sounding good with those bitrates?


 
   
  Yes, I would say it's one of the more forgiving of the IEMs I'd call "neutral". The RE-600 even more so, but also a lot more expensive. 
   
  Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> The R-50 almost require different tips than the stock ones to not be sibilant. Or they require very well mastered records with singers who don't emphasize their "S"-es. But I haven't heard Re-400.


 
   
  I would recommend an impedance adapter as well for the R-50.
   
  Quote: 





prakhar said:


> Thanks for the reply joker. I thought the EPH100 seemed like the best option as well. My only concern was the size of the nozzle. I use the small tips on the SHE3580, so do you think I would have fit/comfort issues?


 
   
  Not sure, I don't have very small ears. I thought the tips on the EPH-100 were surprisingly comfortable vs how they look. You might want to ask in the long EPH-100 thread - surely someone with an EPH-100 has small ears.
   
  Quote: 





davidcotton said:


> So then Joker, any ideas what the iem is going to be that is number 300 (!) in the review list?  Perhaps the tf10 finally  ?
> 
> Thanks for all the help and recommendations along the way.


 
   
  Good call, I haven't thought about it yet. I think my queue is currently planned out until #299 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  Quote: 





awtryau89 said:


> Joker,
> I asked about an alternative to the Brainwavz B2. I have since found it is very sensitive to sources IMO. Direct from my iPhone, it just hurts. But when I add in the little Fiio E6 amp, it really takes the edge off. Also the Bass Eq really does wonders for these things.
> 
> In the mean time, I am trying the GR07 BE again (had a set before) and the Yamaha EPH-100. I am still burning in the EPH-100s. The GR07s are loaners and broken in. I must say, I prefer the sound of the EPH-100s much better. The GR07s have a little more presence at the top but do not seem nearly as coherent overall. I am not sure how to put what I am hearing but the Yamaha's just have a fuller sound. Not really in a bass-mid-treble sort of way but fuller in that they just sound more musical to my ears. And this is with all types of music.
> ...


 
   
  Glad you're enjoying the EPH-100 - I think that it's a very capable earphone with a uniquely easy-going sound signature. 
   
  Quote: 





vwinter said:


> It's the course of things. Would you rather get laser eye surgery from the opthamologist who's done 20 or the one who's done 2000?


 
   
  Lol.
   
  Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Hey, joker, can you help me with this conundrum http://www.head-fi.org/t/678408/need-help-identifying-tri-flange-tips? I remember you were able to help me before with the meelec balanced bi-flanges. These are just great sound and fit-wise with the a161p and pretty good with the vsd1 but I don't want to swap one pair of tips between different iems all the time.


 
   
  I think you are correct - it seems to be some revision of the meelec small triple-flange tip. My newest M6 (a purple one) has the same tips. I'm sure if you send the image to meelec they'll be able to tell you how to get those.


----------



## Tyow

ljokerl said:


> Yes, I would say it's one of the more forgiving of the IEMs I'd call "neutral". The RE-600 even more so, but also a lot more expensive.


 
  Okay, thanks. And yeah.. RE-600 is way out of my comfort zone.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I think you are correct - it seems to be some revision of the meelec small triple-flange tip. My newest M6 (a purple one) has the same tips. I'm sure if you send the image to meelec they'll be able to tell you how to get those.


 
  Ah, I thought they might have been from one of the m6 or s6 that i bought for friends and they left me some of the tips but I probably just put them with the rest of my tips without looking at them and assumed they are the same as the old ones. Thanks, now I can contact meelec and get more of these.


----------



## ljokerl

Looks like you don't have to choose between the Lime Ears LE3 and LE3B anymore - the new LE3SW incorporates a switch that swaps between the sound signatures of the more neutral LE3 and bassier LE3B models reviewed in this thread at a 50€ premium over the regular LE3. Very interesting option IMO.
   

   
  http://theheadphonelist.com/category/news/


----------



## BlastAway

Guys, and/or joker, I currently have the GR02 BE in use. I work in a loud environment, and would really like as much isolation as possible. I really like IEM's that can hit sub bass well (I mainly listen dance, house, drum and bass, and dubstep)

I love the GR02's sound and it's sub bass is sufficient, but the isolation simply isn't. I have a max budget of $100. Now I read your reviews over and over again, and checked the headphone list and recommendations.

Simply put I keep ending up with the same conclusion: it's either good isolation (ba), or good bass (vented dynamic).

The only IEM's which I think are not vented and isolate well, and also offer good bass (even sub bass) are the following IEM's:

The RHA MA-350
Sony MH1C

Are there other IEM's which I've overseen and also provide great isolation and sub bass, but also better overall sound quality (soundstage and better sub, bass, mid and high seperation)?

A well isolated (sealed) in ear that offers the same sound signature as the GR02 BE would ofcourse be the best


----------



## stimer

Quote: 





blastaway said:


> Guys, and/or joker, I currently have the GR02 BE in use. I work in a loud environment, and would really like as much isolation as possible. I really like IEM's that can hit sub bass well (I mainly listen dance, house, drum and bass, and dubstep)
> 
> I love the GR02's sound and it's sub bass is sufficient, but the isolation simply isn't. I have a max budget of $100. Now I read your reviews over and over again, and checked the headphone list and recommendations.
> 
> ...


 
 [size=x-small]Sony MDR XB90EX have [/size][size=small]16mm[/size][size=small] driver, yamaha eph 100, gr07be[/size]


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





blastaway said:


> Guys, and/or joker, I currently have the GR02 BE in use. I work in a loud environment, and would really like as much isolation as possible. I really like IEM's that can hit sub bass well (I mainly listen dance, house, drum and bass, and dubstep)
> 
> I love the GR02's sound and it's sub bass is sufficient, but the isolation simply isn't. I have a max budget of $100. Now I read your reviews over and over again, and checked the headphone list and recommendations.
> 
> ...


 
   
  A used Yamaha EPH-100 would probably be your best option but failing that there's the Shure SE215. Dynamic driver and high isolation.


----------



## dnullify

Hey Joker, these PNY I'm still rocking these PNY Midtowns! They sound really good, and they're built surprisingly well. I really like the cable, and the unobtrusive mic.
   
  are you planning on doing a double review on the uptowns and midtown? i'm still considering buying the uptown, although i'm enjoying the midtown 200 a lot.


----------



## nehcrow

Hey Joker,
 Great thread! 
 Wonder where you would ballpark the RE-600? Really interested in this model as a step up to RE-400's.


----------



## lilboozy

Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Hey Joker,
> Great thread!
> Wonder where you would ballpark the RE-600? Really interested in this model as a step up to RE-400's.


 
  It's a re400 with less treble


----------



## MoonYeol

Oh.. good that awful post was removed.. My S4 was like "dafuq u telling me to render?"


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





dnullify said:


> Hey Joker, these PNY I'm still rocking these PNY Midtowns! They sound really good, and they're built surprisingly well. I really like the cable, and the unobtrusive mic.
> 
> are you planning on doing a double review on the uptowns and midtown? i'm still considering buying the uptown, although i'm enjoying the midtown 200 a lot.


 
   
  Agreed, I thought the cable was superb and the fit is great.
   
  I will review them but probably not for a while. The uptown is very similar to the midtown, just has a midrange bump and a touch less midbass for a more balanced sound. Mine also has a 3-button remote (as opposed to the 1-button on the midtown). I never did figure out which was supposed to be the higher-end model. PNY's website lists the midtown at a higher price but has the uptown described as "top of the line". I don't think they got the whole marketing and product placement thing down yet when it comes to earphones.
   
  Quote: 





nehcrow said:


> Hey Joker,
> Great thread!
> Wonder where you would ballpark the RE-600? Really interested in this model as a step up to RE-400's.


 
   
  It's not too different from the RE-400. I probably wouldn't recommend it if you already have the RE-400.
   
  Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> It's a re400 with less treble


 
   
  In a half sentence, yes, but it's a bit more than that when you listen to the two side by side.


----------



## suman134

that was a spam , i hope people wont do that again , i reported , did you too ?


----------



## Amitl

is the Brainwavz M5's fit as shallow as the Visang VS-K1?
  and how does these two phones' depth-of-insertion compare to the id America Spark?
  thank you............


----------



## GodBless

joker, what is the best soundstage for < $100 ?
  because I want to use it for gaming...
   
  sorry for weird question..


----------



## Sokolnitz

@Godbless Fischer audio silver bullet ?


----------



## lwien

Quote: 





lilboozy said:


> It's a re400 with less treble


 
   
  There is soooo much more that goes into how a particular IEM will sound than just the freq response.


----------



## garcsa

Yep Dr. Fang Bian is a great businessman .....


----------



## Inks

Even outside of frequency response they're almost the same, the RE600 does have better bass extension but....

Add resistance to the RE400 with a cloth damper and they're completely matched except RE600 is easier to drive so tends to sound a bit more dynamic


----------



## puckshock

Quote: 





> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> The MH1C and Trident aren’t notably v-shaped IMO. The Quadbeat has some cable noise, though it’s a little better than the MH1C. The EX300 and FX40 are much better in this regard.
> 
> How about the VSonic VSD1? It’s v-shaped, but not too v-shaded (reminds me of the VSonic GR07 Bass Edition) and the cable noise isn’t terrible, especially when worn cable-up.


 
   
  The VSD1s look good but out of my price range. Also I'm not sure if any retailers would be willing to ship to Canada affordably. I ended up being frugal and going with the Philips SHE9700 since I loved my 3580s so much. I also love my Monoprice 8320s and 8323s, and my JVC S400s. So far all the recommendations by Head-Fi has been spot on, now if only I had more petty cash lying around haha.
   
  I may also get a pair of white Quadbeats since I can get those shipped to me for a reasonable rate. Oh how frustrating it is to be Canadian at times.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> is the Brainwavz M5's fit as shallow as the Visang VS-K1?
> and how does these two phones' depth-of-insertion compare to the id America Spark?
> thank you............


 
   
  The M5 fit is very similar to the K1. Both are designed to sit more shallowly in the ear than the Spark, I think.
   
  Quote: 





godbless said:


> joker, what is the best soundstage for < $100 ?
> because I want to use it for gaming...
> 
> sorry for weird question..


 
   
Hmm… I’ve never used an IEM for gaming but I would expect you want soundstage width and good stereo separation. Silver Bullet would be fine. So would an Astrotec AM-800 or even LG Quadbeat if you don't want to spend a whole lot. 
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Even outside of frequency response they're almost the same, the RE600 does have better bass extension but....
> 
> Add resistance to the RE400 with a cloth damper and they're completely matched except *RE600 is easier to drive* so tends to sound a bit more dynamic


 
   
  The fun thing about this is that it makes them impossible to A:B properly without volume matching. I don’t have a source for this handy but I remember reading that all other things equal the louder test track is usually found to be “better” in listener tests when the differences are kept to a few decibels.
   
  Quote: 





puckshock said:


> The VSD1s look good but out of my price range. Also I'm not sure if any retailers would be willing to ship to Canada affordably. I ended up being frugal and going with the Philips SHE9700 since I loved my 3580s so much. I also love my Monoprice 8320s and 8323s, and my JVC S400s. So far all the recommendations by Head-Fi has been spot on, now if only I had more petty cash lying around haha.
> 
> I may also get a pair of white Quadbeats since I can get those shipped to me for a reasonable rate. Oh how frustrating it is to be Canadian at times.


 
   
  Never heard the SHE9700 but I hope you like em. 
   
  By the way I'm pretty sure lendmeurears ships to Canada. They're an authorized dealer for VSonic, Atrotec, and a bunch of other Asian brands.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> The fun thing about this is that it makes them impossible to A:B properly without volume matching. I don’t have a source for this handy but I remember reading that all other things equal the louder test track is usually found to be “better” in listener tests when the differences are kept to a few decibels.




I've definitely noticed this "phenomenon" when I A:B. I try really hard to subjectively volume match, but it's one of the reasons I don't like doing it as much these days.


----------



## Amitl

i'm debating between the Brainwavz M5 and JVC FXD80... listening mostly to metal and
  looking for a shallow fit.
  or maybe the Signature Acoustics C-12?
  does the FXD80 worth the extra $?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





amitl said:


> i'm debating between the Brainwavz M5 and JVC FXD80... listening mostly to metal and
> looking for a shallow fit.
> or maybe the Signature Acoustics C-12?
> does the FXD80 worth the extra $?


 
   
  Different signatures but overall the FXD80 sounds vastly better than the M5 unless you just want tons of bass. The C12 is about on-par with the M5, just has a more v-shaped signature vs the more laid-back treble of the M5. Coming from the Spark I think you may miss the treble there...


----------



## Amitl

Thank you very much Joker


----------



## Mad Maniak

Hi Joker,
   
  First off, thanks a lot for this wonderful resource of information. I have used it to pick an IEM in the past - the Xears 200 Pro. That was 1 1/2 years ago, and it has served me well. The sound was a big step up (coming from a Creative EP 630). However, like all other IEMs before it, the cable gave yesterday. One of the earpieces has stopped working. A sad day, but exciting as well - time for a new set!
   
  I have decided to spend a little more $$$ this time - I set my max at about 100 euros, although less is better. My picks:
  - Shure SE215. ~100 euro. I LOVE the fact that, once the cable undoubtedly breaks, I can just get a new cable for 20 euro.
  - Monster Turbine. ~100 euro. They look fantastic, but is the sound quality up to par?
  - VSonic GR07. ~130 euro. Too expensive... but a lot of people seem to love them.
  - Brainwavz B2. ~120 euro. Also too expensive, and they look kinda cheap on images.
  (One euro is 1.33 US dollar. Prices are higher here than in America, sadly.)
   
  I would really like to hear your thoughts, especially on these Q's:
  - How significant is the quality difference between my 50$ Xears, going to the SE215 and then the GR07. Is the quality difference significant? (The price difference is...)
  - I listen to all kinds of music: from classical to pop to hiphop to electronic. Will the Brainwavz be too analytical / bass-less?
  - Am I missing any good contenders?
  - Most importantly, which would you recommend most?
   
  ... but mostly I am just interested to hear your thoughts!
   
  Thanks a lot in advance. Also, you should post a Paypal account, I'll buy you a beer. 
  MM


----------



## docked seaman

1 This is the Best forum on the whole headfi.
   
  2 I am currently using a fx-700 but i cant deal with the "foggy" mids anymore. also the bass is too much for me.  tried the yamaha eph100s but hate the treble (also the bass is still a little to much- although they have more "energy" than the fx700). What can you recommend? (200-300$ price range, but will go up to 500$ if necessary or worth the upgrade)
   
  3 This is the Best forum on the whole headfi.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





mad maniak said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> First off, thanks a lot for this wonderful resource of information. I have used it to pick an IEM in the past - the Xears 200 Pro. That was 1 1/2 years ago, and it has served me well. The sound was a big step up (coming from a Creative EP 630). However, like all other IEMs before it, the cable gave yesterday. One of the earpieces has stopped working. A sad day, but exciting as well - time for a new set!
> 
> ...


 
   
  Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




   
  I think the Xears fall significantly short of a top-tier earphones such as the GR07 when it comes to clarity and overall balance. They are good at pumping out bass and still give you pretty decent mids and highs but nothing like the accuracy the GR07 is capable of. If you go for the GR07 you'll probably want the Bass Edition, by the way.
   
  If you want to stick to your budget I would definitely take the Shures over the Turbine (for both durability and sound quality). 
   
  As for the B2, it most likely will be a shock coming from the bass-heavy Creatives and bass-heavy Xears. 
   
  You are also missing a lot of mid-level (below GR07 but above the SE215) contenders such as the JVC FXT90 and Yamaha EPH-100. It may be because they are not available in your area, of course. By the way, you can get a pretty good approximation of the GR07 sound signature with the VSonic VSD1 at a much lower price. I think these compete with the SE215 quite easily and are better than the Xears and the Turbine as long as you're willing to give up some bass quantity. 
   
  Quote: 





docked seaman said:


> 1 This is the Best forum on the whole headfi.
> 
> 2 I am currently using a fx-700 but i cant deal with the "foggy" mids anymore. also the bass is too much for me.  tried the yamaha eph100s but hate the treble (also the bass is still a little to much- although they have more "energy" than the fx700). What can you recommend? (200-300$ price range, but will go up to 500$ if necessary or worth the upgrade)
> 
> 3 This is the Best forum on the whole headfi.


 
   




   
  Sounds like you just want something relatively accurate with punchy but tight bass. I would probably go for the GR07 Bass Edition from VSonic (unless the treble of the EPH-100/FX700 was too energetic for you, in which case I take that back). If you want to spend more the EarSonics SM64 may be a good option, with good bass, more (lower) midrange emphasis, and less energetic treble compared to the GR07.


----------



## Bloodflowerz

The problem I have with IEM is they never last long. I've had 2 x Beyer DTX101, Yuin PK2, Audio Technica and they've all developed a cable fault within a year. My GF is now in the market for a new IEM since her 20 month old Phonak IEM have developed an problem.
   
  Is there such a thing as a solid, well built IEM?


----------



## awaish

Hi all
   
  So I've been buying £10-20 IEMs for the past few years, for them all to either break or get lost within a few months.
  I want an IEM that would give me a balanced sound, and one that I would want to keep for a long time without having to keep changing the pair.
  I was looking at the Sennheiser CX 400, the Klipsch S4i, and the Sony MDRX50 - these are all around the £50 bracket - but as mentioned, the highest I will go is around the £100 if I'm paying for a great pair.
   
  I listen to literally everything. Rock/Jazz/Hip-hop/Dance/R&B/Blues/Easy listening, you name it.
  I don't really care too much about aesthetics, just great sound.
   
  All advice is welcomed, thanks!


----------



## Mad Maniak

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  Fantastic advice, thanks!
  Out of the VSonic VSD1 and VSD1S, which has your preference and why?
   
  I may still go for the Shure SE215, just for the security of detachable cables... Then again, they are twice (!) as expensive as the VSD1(S)... Decision, decisions!


----------



## esteebin

bloodflowerz said:


> The problem I have with IEM is they never last long. I've had 2 x Beyer DTX101, Yuin PK2, Audio Technica and they've all developed a cable fault within a year. *My GF is now in the market for a new IEM since her 20 month old Phonak IEM have developed an problem.*
> 
> Is there such a thing as a solid, well built IEM?




Phonak has a 2 year warranty. You can get that replaced.


----------



## Bloodflowerz

Quote: 





esteebin said:


> Phonak has a 2 year warranty. You can get that replaced.


 
   
  Thank you. Yes, Amazon will be providing a full refund. I'm rather hesitant to be going Phonak again and was looking for alternatives.


----------



## Prakhar

Hey joker

You refer to the EPH100 as mid end and the Gr07 as high end. How much of an upgrade are the GR07 bass edition over the EPH100. And how much does their bass quantity differ by?


----------



## Tommy C

@ ljokerl Between the Fischer Audio Silver Bullet and the Ultimate Ears Superfi 5vi which one would you choose for good soundstage, instrument separation and overall better balanced sound signature? Both can be purchased for $60-$70 nowadays, and I am just looking for a replacement as a daily pair of IEM to my MEElectronics CC-51P when I am at work. Thanks!


----------



## suman134

Quote: 





awaish said:


> Hi all
> 
> So I've been buying £10-20 IEMs for the past few years, for them all to either break or get lost within a few months.
> I want an IEM that would give me a balanced sound, and one that I would want to keep for a long time without having to keep changing the pair.
> ...


 
   
            get the xb90ex , i had the cx 400 was one of my fav back in 2009 . or for a bit more of a analytical listening meelec a161p , ue600 jvc fxd80 are there , for fun sound there are shure se215 , xb90ex , ue400/500 , wooduo 2 , and many more . i would suggest you to try a xb90ex , they are i think what you need .


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





bloodflowerz said:


> The problem I have with IEM is they never last long. I've had 2 x Beyer DTX101, Yuin PK2, Audio Technica and they've all developed a cable fault within a year. My GF is now in the market for a new IEM since her 20 month old Phonak IEM have developed an problem.
> 
> Is there such a thing as a solid, well built IEM?


 
   
  Sure: http://www.usa.philips.com/c/headphones/oneill-black-sho2200bk_28/prd/en/
   
   
  Quote: 





awaish said:


> Hi all
> 
> So I've been buying £10-20 IEMs for the past few years, for them all to either break or get lost within a few months.
> I want an IEM that would give me a balanced sound, and one that I would want to keep for a long time without having to keep changing the pair.
> ...


 
   
  I don't know about the others but the S4i is not a balanced-sounding earphone. Try an LG Quadbeat or VSonic VSD1 - still a little on the v-shaped side but better than the S4, and cheaper as well. 
   
  Quote: 





mad maniak said:


> Fantastic advice, thanks!
> Out of the VSonic VSD1 and VSD1S, which has your preference and why?
> 
> I may still go for the Shure SE215, just for the security of detachable cables... Then again, they are twice (!) as expensive as the VSD1(S)... Decision, decisions!


 
   
  I hadn't had a chance to A:B them until now. They are quite similar. The VSD1 seems a little more v-shaped and reminds me more of the GR07 Bass Edition. As a result of the v-shape it appears to emphasize the bass more and seems to have a slightly wider presentation. The VSD1S seems less v-shaped/more mid-focused. The good thing about this is that there is less sibilance. They both have their advantages but I guess the sibilance is the one thing that bothers me about VSonic IEMs so at this point I'd have to take the 1S.
   
  Quote: 





prakhar said:


> Hey joker
> 
> You refer to the EPH100 as mid end and the Gr07 as high end. How much of an upgrade are the GR07 bass edition over the EPH100. And how much does their bass quantity differ by?


 
   
  In that case I just meant that the EPH-100 and FXT90 slot below the GR07s in price. In performance they are not far behind the VSonics at all. In terms of bass quantity there's a difference, though - the EPH-100 is significantly bassier. It's a bigger difference than between the regular GR07 and the GR07 Bass Edition.
   
  Quote: 





tommy c said:


> @ ljokerl Between the Fischer Audio Silver Bullet and the Ultimate Ears Superfi 5vi which one would you choose for good soundstage, instrument separation and overall better balanced sound signature? Both can be purchased for $60-$70 nowadays, and I am just looking for a replacement as a daily pair of IEM to my MEElectronics CC-51P when I am at work. Thanks!


 
   
  The SF5, assuming it sounds the same as my UE600. Coming from the more v-shaped CC51 you'll find it to be a much more mid-centric earphone but it does have a decent soundsage, good separation, and very good overall balance.


----------



## Thr0waway

Hey Joker, I noticed that you like to suggest the LG Quadbeats frequently for a good V-Shaped headphone for its price. Is there a reason why you haven't added it to your Earphone Buyer's Guide on your website? And will you update the guide or is there no reason to do so at the moment?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





thr0waway said:


> Hey Joker, I noticed that you like to suggest the LG Quadbeats frequently for a good V-Shaped headphone for its price. Is there a reason why you haven't added it to your Earphone Buyer's Guide on your website? And will you update the guide or is there no reason to do so at the moment?


 
   
Indeed - the reason I didn't add it to the guide is that I couldn't neatly categorize it. To me it's somewhere between "balanced" and "v-shaped" as they are currently defined by the guide. It's close to balanced, but still not at the level of the VSonic VC02 or an Ety. At the same time, it's doesn't have as much bass as the sets I have categorized under "v-shaped". It's unfortunate but it's bound to happen when you try to pidgeonhole a whole bunch of different earphones into a few sound categories.
   
  And, I updated the guide very recently to put the Ety-Kids in there 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> I hadn't had a chance to A:B them until now. They are quite similar. The VSD1 seems a little more v-shaped and reminds me more of the GR07 Bass Edition. As a result of the v-shape it appears to emphasize the bass more and seems to have a slightly wider presentation. The VSD1S seems less v-shaped/more mid-focused. The good thing about this is that there is less sibilance. They both have their advantages but I guess the sibilance is the one thing that bothers me about VSonic IEMs so at this point I'd have to take the 1S.


 
  That's interesting. I personally don't find VSD1 sounding wider - more like a bit fuller in the lower mids giving the impression the soundstage is bigger but rather in depth and very slightly in height than in width. But yeah, the VSD1S is a bit less prone to pointing out sibilance and to be honest lately I'm also leaning more towards it because of that and because of its flatter bass. Both are still great though.


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Indeed - the reason I didn't add it to the guide is that I couldn't neatly categorize it. To me it's somewhere between "balanced" and "v-shaped" as they are currently defined by the guide. It's close to balanced, but still not at the level of the VSonic VC02 or an Ety. At the same time, it's doesn't have as much bass as the sets I have categorized under "v-shaped". It's unfortunate but it's bound to happen when you try to pidgeonhole a whole bunch of different earphones into a few sound categories.


 
  Quadbeats 2 coming out next month anyway. According to measurements better subbass and less sibilant as claimed by the manufacturer


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> That's interesting. I personally don't find VSD1 sounding wider - more like a bit fuller in the lower mids giving the impression the soundstage is bigger but rather in depth and very slightly in height than in width. But yeah, the VSD1S is a bit less prone to pointing out sibilance and to be honest lately I'm also leaning more towards it because of that and because of its flatter bass. Both are still great though.


 
   
  Maybe you're right - the soundstage just seemed larger on the VSD1. In any case I had a good session with the VSD1S last night. They really can run with some very high-end earphones. 
   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> Quadbeats 2 coming out next month anyway. According to measurements better subbass and less sibilant as claimed by the manufacturer


 
   
  That's good news. Would be nice if they also came with tips that didn't collapse.


----------



## Tommy C

Thanks for the useful info ljokerl


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Maybe you're right - the soundstage just seemed alrger on the VSD1. In any case I had a good session with the VSD1S last night. They really can run with some very high-end earphones.
> 
> 
> That's good news. Would be nice if they also came with tips that didn't collapse.


 
  VS1S, second-best Vsonic dynamic yet?
   
  Luckily LGQ2s will use fairly reliable single flange tips.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





inks said:


> VS1S, second-best Vsonic dynamic yet?


 
  I think both the VSD1 and VSD1S are amazingly good for the price and IMO the best bang for buck vsonic has released (especially in China where it's like $32). It's a shame the VSD1 Limited Edition that's coming out on 15th next month was only for the Chinese market coz I really wanted to try it but it sold out in 2 days - aside from the higher impedance it's supposed to be tuned like the new VSD7.
  Anyway, with such a price to performance ratio from vsonic I'm really wondering what their VSD9 will be like coz for a single dynamic driver iem from vsonic to cost $600 it should really be spectacular. Unfortunately, we might never get the chance to here it given there will be only 120 units made a year and how big the Chinese market is.


----------



## stimer

I want vsd7 like astrotec ax60 or t-peos h-200)))


----------



## Marleybob217

Quote: 





bloodflowerz said:


> The problem I have with IEM is they never last long. I've had 2 x Beyer DTX101, Yuin PK2, Audio Technica and they've all developed a cable fault within a year. My GF is now in the market for a new IEM since her 20 month old Phonak IEM have developed an problem.
> 
> *Is there such a thing as a solid, well built IEM*?


 
  Heck yes, take a look at the shure SE series. They have detachable cables. Actually, every IEM with detachable cables is way more durable, since you can easily swap the flimsiest part of it.


----------



## docked seaman

Quote: 





> Sounds like you just want something relatively accurate with punchy but tight bass. I would probably go for the GR07 Bass Edition from VSonic (unless the treble of the EPH-100/FX700 was too energetic for you, in which case I take that back). If you want to spend more the EarSonics SM64 may be a good option, with good bass, more (lower) midrange emphasis, and less energetic treble compared to the GR07


 
   Thanks.     i love the treble on the fx700  [and my ety er4 ].    is there any other higher end like the earsonics sm64- but with better trebble?


----------



## MoonYeol

marleybob217 said:


> Heck yes, take a look at the shure SE series. They have detachable cables. Actually, every IEM with detachable cables is way more durable, since you can easily swap the flimsiest part of it.




Instead you can have a failing connector. That's the new weakest link. But I like replacable cables. Thinking about my cat chewing up a pair of IE800's sends shivers down my spine..


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





tommy c said:


> Thanks for the useful info ljokerl


 
   
  Any time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



   
  Quote: 





inks said:


> *VS1S, second-best Vsonic dynamic yet?*
> 
> Luckily LGQ2s will use fairly reliable single flange tips.


 
   
  Sure looks that way.
   
  I also find myself enjoying the VC1000. Thought I was over TWFKs...
   
  Quote: 





kova4a said:


> I think both the VSD1 and VSD1S are amazingly good for the price and IMO the best bang for buck vsonic has released (especially in China where it's like $32). It's a shame the VSD1 Limited Edition that's coming out on 15th next month was only for the Chinese market coz I really wanted to try it but it sold out in 2 days - aside from the higher impedance it's supposed to be tuned like the new VSD7.
> Anyway, with such a price to performance ratio from vsonic I'm really wondering what their VSD9 will be like coz for a single dynamic driver iem from vsonic to cost $600 it should really be spectacular. Unfortunately, *we might never get the chance to here it given there will be only 120 units made a year and how big the Chinese market is.*


 
   




   
  Quote: 





stimer said:


> I want vsd7 like astrotec ax60 or t-peos h-200)))


 
   
  You mean a BA-dynamic hybrid?
   
  Anyway, I’m not super impressed with how Astrotec tuned their TWFK-based AX7. Time will tell if the AX60 is a hit or a miss. 
   
  Quote: 





docked seaman said:


> Thanks.     i love the treble on the fx700  [and my ety er4 ].    is there any other higher end like the earsonics sm64- but with better trebble?


 
   
  Not without giving up something else. The UE900 for example, has more treble energy and extension but doesn’t have the bass of the SM64.


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> You mean a BA-dynamic hybrid?
> 
> Anyway, I’m not super impressed with how Astrotec tuned their TWFK-based AX7. Time will tell if the AX60 is a hit or a miss.


 
  Well, apparently VSD9's diaphragm is made of something super rare and hard to obtain, so they can produce only a limited number of units a year. Vsonic's ceo said they changed the diaphragm like 5 times until they settled on this one.
  As far as Astrotec's ax60 I'm slightly interested as vsonic is still silent about their k3003 clone but it's pretty funny how the vsonic's ceo is constantly making fun of Astrotec and even offered to help them with the ax60's tuning coz they obviously didn't know what they are doing.
  edit: I just saw that Rin actually measured the ax60 and his opinion is that ax60 is "more of a fun college product gone weird" LOL, so I guess vsonic's ceo has a reason to mock them.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





kova4a said:


> Well, apparently VSD9's diaphragm is made of something super rare and hard to obtain, so they can produce only a limited number of units a year. Vsonic's ceo said they changed the diaphragm like 5 times until they settled on this one.
> As far as Astrotec's ax60 I'm slightly interested as vsonic is still silent about their k3003 clone but it's pretty funny how the vsonic's ceo is constantly making fun of Astrotec and even offered to help them with the ax60's tuning coz they obviously didn't know what they are doing.
> edit: I just saw that Rin actually measured the ax60 and his opinion is that ax60 is "more of a fun college product gone weird" LOL, so I guess vsonic's ceo has a reason to mock them.


 
   
  That's an interesting culture they've got over there. Can't imagine a US brand issuing such a condescending statement about one of their competitors.


----------



## jant71

From the people who took 3 years and 3 months to get the GR07 out and didn't seem to finish the tuning till another year and a half with the MKII. They release a VSD1 and then a month later a limited edition of a low model like that. Why, cause they didn't finish tuning it! Annnnnd there will be another VSD1 re-tuned again early next year.
   
  They should talk about tuning. They can't seem to finish tuning one before they put it out. Why buy a VSD7 when it comes out? They won't have finished tuning it yet, lol. Wait a couple months for the Limited or Flagship, or Silver, or MKII, or whatever version comes next.
   
  The CEO should pipe down. At least Aurisonics, Dunu, Astrotec, TPEOS got their flagship products out there for better or for worse. Where is your flagship
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




?


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> That's an interesting culture they've got over there. Can't imagine a US brand issuing such a condescending statement about one of their competitors.


 
  Well, in his defense, he usually deletes these posts shortly after he's made them but I guess he either can't stand competition or just finds it hilarious or insulting that Astrotec is considered vsonic's competitor. Who knows? He often bashes on other companies for their high prices and low performing products. Maybe he just feels obliged to share his opinion and findings on certain stuff.


----------



## vwinter

When vsonic's "half-assed" tuning is better than most balls to the wall tunings that other companies are putting out, they might get an occasional pass. 

Other companies probably take just as long; they just don't tell you how long they've been working on it.


----------



## MoonYeol

At least now they will have a lineup with names that make sense!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> At least now they will have a lineup with names that make sense!


 
   
  Yeah just wait for the VSD7 Silver Treble Edition...


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> At least now they will have a lineup with names that make sense!


 
  Yeah, VSD1, VSD1S, VSD3, VSD3S, VSD5, VSD7, VSD7S, VSD9 - it's not confusing at all


----------



## Zelda

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah just wait for the VSD7 Silver Treble *Limited Special Flagship* Edition...


 
  there, fixed for you


----------



## MoonYeol

ljokerl said:


> Yeah just wait for the VSD7 Silver Treble Edition...




Still kinda makes sense. At least it's not 99<02<02<06~04~1~1<1000<07=01


----------



## kova4a

Quote: 





moonyeol said:


> Still kinda makes sense. At least it's not 99<02<02<06~04~1~1<1000<07=01


 
  Nah, it just seems like it makes sense right now but you have no idea whether the sound improvement will be going higher with the number of the iem's name or whatever. There's still high chance that VSD1/S is better than VSD3 or is better than VSD5. Or whther VSD3/S turns out to be better than VSD5, especially now when vsonic's ceo was kinda challenged to tune the VSD3 to sound like SE864 instead of SE535 and he just said he's getting a SE864 without even worrying for a second that the VSD3 might not turn out to be as good as something that costs more than 20 times more. We'll just have to wait.


----------



## MoonYeol

But if they stick to the pricing previously mentioned here it does at least look like a nice ladder. Then the actual performance will vary and of course a lot will be down to preference. But hey, some kind of brain exercise is good for us.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





zelda said:


> there, fixed for you


 
   
  Yeah... perfect. 
   
  In any case, if one of them can provide the sound of the GR07 with smoother treble at a lower price, I won't much care what it's called


----------



## MoonYeol

ljokerl said:


> Yeah... perfect.
> 
> In any case, if one of them can provide the sound of the GR07 with smoother treble at a lower price, I won't much care what it's called




That would be VSD5S mkII Limited Flagship Professional Gold Bass Edition.


----------



## jant71

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah... perfect.
> 
> In any case, if one of them can provide the sound of the GR07 with smoother treble at a lower price, I won't much care what it's called


 
   
  GR07 Classic, which is supposed to be $98 may fit the bill.


----------



## papijoe08

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> Yeah... perfect.
> 
> In any case, if one of them can provide the sound of the GR07 with smoother treble at a lower price, I won't much care what it's called


 
   
VSD7 Silver Treble *Limited Special Flagship  PRO MKII Ultimate *Edition?????... 





 Maybe they should just stick with the new naming convention and then make its upgrade or version to be named like "VSD7 MKII" and not with those Limited, Flagship, etc etc names. LOL

 Yet, as long as they sound really good, then it's very very very much tolerable


----------



## SyCo87

I've been looking at various comparisons between the two but, I want to ask you personally; what's the difference between the VSD1 and the VSD1S?


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> GR07 Classic, which is supposed to be $98 may fit the bill.


 
   
  Let's hope..
   


syco87 said:


> I've been looking at various comparisons between the two but, I want to ask you personally; what's the difference between the VSD1 and the VSD1S?


   


  Sure, see this post: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-294-iems-compared-signature-acoustics-elements-c-12-added-08-22-13-p-753/11340#post_9752749 and the ones below it.


----------



## JohannLiebert

Hi Joker,
  the Ex1000 has the best Soundstage of all Univerals I've heard. 
  How do the JH13 or Hidition compare with the Ex1000's Soundstage? Are they as spacious?


----------



## enyls

What is your personal favorite IEM for around 100-150 pounds?


----------



## SyCo87

> Sure, see this post: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-294-iems-compared-signature-acoustics-elements-c-12-added-08-22-13-p-753/11340#post_9752749
> and the ones below it.




Thanks, I'll take some time to think. The Quadbeats have me yearning for soundstage now.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





johannliebert said:


> Hi Joker,
> the Ex1000 has the best Soundstage of all Univerals I've heard.
> How do the JH13 or Hidition compare with the Ex1000's Soundstage? Are they as spacious?


 
   
  No, I don't think so. The NT6 is close but still not as out-of-the-head as the IE8 or EX1000. I feel like that sensation is something only a vented dynamic driver can provide. The EX1000 doesn't sound very 3-dimensional compared to these customs, though. It just has good width whereas the JH13 and NT6 are more well-rounded when it comes to depth and imaging.
   
  Quote: 





enyls said:


> What is your personal favorite IEM for around 100-150 pounds?


 
   
  If I had to choose just one for my preferred sound, it would be either the HiFiMan RE-400 or the Etymotic Research HF5


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Quote: 





johannliebert said:


> Hi Joker,
> the Ex1000 has the best Soundstage of all Univerals I've heard.
> How do the JH13 or Hidition compare with the Ex1000's Soundstage? Are they as spacious?


 
  I'm actually very curious about this too. I quite like the EX1000's soundstage and how natural it sounds. Would you have any recommendations for an upgrade?

 I prefer a slightly V shaped signature with slightly warm, punchy bass (bass quantity between EX1000 and TF10), slightly forward upper mids and sparkly highs (didn't find W4 sparkly enough, EX1000 was quite nice). Thought the Alclair Reference looked like a great fit from your review. 

 Thanks again for such a detailed and comprehensive thread! I've found it extremely useful in looking up IEMs for myself and friends!


----------



## Inks

Quote: 





jant71 said:


> From the people who took 3 years and 3 months to get the GR07 out and didn't seem to finish the tuning till another year and a half with the MKII. They release a VSD1 and then a month later a limited edition of a low model like that. Why, cause they didn't finish tuning it! Annnnnd there will be another VSD1 re-tuned again early next year.
> 
> They should talk about tuning. They can't seem to finish tuning one before they put it out. Why buy a VSD7 when it comes out? They won't have finished tuning it yet, lol. Wait a couple months for the Limited or Flagship, or Silver, or MKII, or whatever version comes next.
> 
> ...


 
  GR07 when it came out was a finished product and a successful one, getting praise throughout. The MKII is just a tweak from the previous, it doesn't mean the previous one wasn't finished, there is always room for improvement...I don't like the CEO's offensive comments, but Hifiman is probably the only other Chinese manufacturer that competes in fidelity. You mean hybrid? Well, I bet it's going to be better than those of the mentioned manufacturers based on credentials, but of course nothing is concrete.


----------



## JohannLiebert

> No, I don't think so. The NT6 is close but still not as out-of-the-head as the IE8 or EX1000. I feel like that sensation is something only a vented dynamic driver can provide. The EX1000 doesn't sound very 3-dimensional compared to these customs, though. It just has good width whereas the JH13 and NT6 are more well-rounded when it comes to depth and imaging.


 
   
  I listened to the UERM Demo today. I found it equally good as the EX1000 in Soundstage. cue: out of head
  With way better resolution, isolation and no sharp treble spike. the definite upgrade. Oh boy, I am so excited again.


----------



## stimer

Quote: 





inks said:


> GR07 when it came out was a finished product and a successful one, getting praise throughout. The MKII is just a tweak from the previous, it doesn't mean the previous one wasn't finished, there is always room for improvement...I don't like the CEO's offensive comments, but Hifiman is probably the only other Chinese manufacturer that competes in fidelity. You mean hybrid? Well, I bet it's going to be better than those of the mentioned manufacturers based on credentials, but of course nothing is concrete.


 
  Vsonic using the simulator Torso Simulator (HATS) and real audio measurement company was able to achieve a clear and soft sound. I think they have a great future.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





fimbulvetr said:


> I'm actually very curious about this too. I quite like the EX1000's soundstage and how natural it sounds. Would you have any recommendations for an upgrade?
> 
> I prefer a slightly V shaped signature with slightly warm, punchy bass (bass quantity between EX1000 and TF10), slightly forward upper mids and sparkly highs (didn't find W4 sparkly enough, EX1000 was quite nice). Thought the Alclair Reference looked like a great fit from your review.
> 
> Thanks again for such a detailed and comprehensive thread! I've found it extremely useful in looking up IEMs for myself and friends!


 
   
  The Reference should be good. It's not as bright overall as the EX1000 but it does have pretty good bass quantity and doesn't have the more intimate presentation of a lot of other monitors.


----------



## Fimbulvetr

Quote: 





ljokerl said:


> The Reference should be good. It's not as bright overall as the EX1000 but it does have pretty good bass quantity and doesn't have the more intimate presentation of a lot of other monitors.


 
  Oh okay, thanks for the help!


----------



## Grayson73

I've been on a quest to find the best IEMs around $50 and the Zero Audio Carbo Basso and Carbo Tenore are better than the Audio Technica ATH-CKN70, MEElectronics A161P, NuForce NE-700X (new and improved version).  If you're looking for IEMs around $50, I highly recommend them.  Both sound amazing, especially when slightly EQ'd to your taste.
   
  If anyone has any other recommendations at this price point, let me know.  Otherwise, I think I'm finished with my quest.
   
  Next quest, to find the best around $75-$100


----------



## waynes world

+1. I agree about the Bassos (haven't tried the Tenores). I would also add the Vsonic VSD1's to that list.


----------



## jekostas

Quote: 





grayson73 said:


> I've been on a quest to find the best IEMs around $50 and the Zero Audio Carbo Basso and Carbo Tenore are better than the Audio Technica ATH-CKN70, MEElectronics A161P, NuForce NE-700X (new and improved version).  If you're looking for IEMs around $50, I highly recommend them.  Both sound amazing, especially when slightly EQ'd to your taste.
> 
> If anyone has any other recommendations at this price point, let me know.  Otherwise, I think I'm finished with my quest.
> 
> Next quest, to find the best around $75-$100


 
   
  Monster Gratitude.


----------



## MoonYeol

jekostas said:


> Monster Gratitude.




$75-$100 is a tough bracket...


----------



## nehcrow

Quote: 





jekostas said:


> Monster Gratitude.


 
  RE-400?


----------



## ljokerl

VSonic VC1000 review below
   
   
   
   
*(2B23) VSonic VC1000*
   

Added Sep 2013

   
  Details: VSonic’s second, more reasonably-priced dual BA earphone
  Current Price: *$137* from lendmeurears.com (MSRP: est. $159)
  Specs: Driver: _Dual BA_ | Imp: _50Ω_ | Sens: _105 dB (@500 Hz)_ | Freq: _20-20k Hz_ | Cable: _4.3' L-plug_
  Nozzle Size: _4mm_ | Preferred tips: _MEElec M6 Bi-flange tips_
  Wear Style: _*Straight down* or over-the-ear_
   
  Accessories *(3.5/5)* - Single-flange (10 pairs), foam-stuffed (3 pairs), and bi-flange silicone tips, shirt clip, and soft drawstring carrying pouch 
  Build Quality *(4/5)* – The VC1000 utilizes a slim, straight-barrel form factor similar to the dynamic-driver VSonic VC02 and the pricier GR01. It lacks the detachable cables of the VC02 and removable filters of the GR01, but both of those features were poorly implemented so their exclusion is no big loss. The cable is smooth but on the thin side and lacks a sliding cinch. A bump on the inside of the right strain relief differentiates the left and right earpieces
  Isolation *(4/5)* – Similar to that of the GR01 - good, but not at the level of an Etymotic monitor
  Microphonics *(4/5) *- Cable noise is bothersome when worn cable-down but becomes low with over-the-ear wear
  Comfort *(4.5/5)* - The housings are very slim and the variety of included eartips should allow the fit to work for anyone. The cable exits at an angle so those with smaller ears may have trouble wearing the VC1000 cable-up. The inclusion of a cable cinch would have helped in this regard
   
  Sound *(9.2/10)* – The VC1000, like VSonic’s pricier GR01 model, is based on the popular TWFK dual balanced armature transducer from Knowles, and offers a balanced sound signature and overall performance on-par with the GR01. Its bass is tight and level, about even in quantity with the Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII. Both depth and punch are good for a balanced-sounding BA-based earphone. 
   
  The midrange is likewise level and not clouded or veiled by the bass in any way. The VC1000 sounds a little warmer and fuller than the similarly-priced Rock-It Sounds R-50 and is again more akin to the Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII and the VSonic GR01. Next to the R-50 its mids are thicker and more filled-in. It is still less warm and thinner-sounding than the dynamic-driver VSonic GR07, however, presenting its midrange in a decidedly BA-like fashion.
   
  The top end of the VC1000 is a bit more forgiving compared to the DBA-02 and Rock-It R-50, again reminding me of the GR01. The R-50 especially sounds brighter and harsher in comparison unless modified with aftermarket eartips and an inline impedance adapter. The treble of the VC1000 is also a bit smoother and less sibilant than that of my first-generation GR07, and more refined and extended than that of the single-armature MEElec A161P. 
   
  The VC1000 also sounds airier than the more intimate A161P. In general, its presentation is similar to other TWFK-based sets. It lacks a bit of soundstage width next to the Rock-It Sounds R-50 but sounds plenty spacious and well-rounded overall.
   
*Select Comparisons*
   
HiFiMan RE-400 ($99)
   
  The RE-400 is a dynamic-driver monitor with a neutral-to-warm sound signature. Compared to the VC1000, its sound is warmer and fuller and its balance is more mid-centric. The VC1000 carries very similar overall bass punch but sounds a bit thinner in the midrange. It is also brighter, with significantly more treble energy than the RE-400. The HiFiMan set is smoother, but also a bit dull-sounding in comparison. In a way, the VC1000 sounds more balanced and complete due to the added treble intensity, but is also less forgiving and on some tracks less natural overall. The presentations of the two earphones are equally capable, with the VC1000 having a very slightly wider soundstage. The optimal choice between the more forgiving and mid-focused RE-400 and the brighter, more crisp-sounding VC1000 will definitely depend on the listener.
   
Philips Fidelio S1 ($99) 
   
  Another balanced-sounding dynamic-driver earphone, the S1 reminds me in many ways of VSonic’s pricier dynamic-driver sets. Compared to the VC1000, it boasts more bass, especially deep bass, and has a warmer overall tone. While less powerful, the low end of the VC1000 is tighter and a bit clearer and its midrange is more prominent in comparison. As the HiFiMan RE-400 sounds more mid-centric compared to the VC1000, so the VC1000 sounds more mid-centric next to the Fidelio S1. Interestingly, while the VC1000 boasts similar, or even slightly greater, treble energy, it actually does a better job of keeping its treble smooth. The Fidelio S1 appears a little harsher and more peaky in comparison and tends to be even less forgiving than the VC1000, which itself is not exactly smoothed-over. 
   
Etymotic Research ER4S ($299)
   
  Long-renowned for its accuracy, the ER4S remains the fidelity standard for many listeners. The performance of the more reasonably-priced VC1000 falls in the same ballpark, offering up a slightly less neutral – but still well-balanced – sound. The VC1000 has fuller bass, boasting a bit more impact, while the ER4S sounds thinner. The Etys have more forward upper mids and as a result appear to be a little clearer. The upper and midrange and treble sound a little more accurate and refined with the Etys, while the VC1000 is a bit more splashy and sibilance-prone. Overall, the two earphones really aren’t very far apart - those concerned with bass will be happier with the VC1000 but otherwise it’ll come down to preference – and budget. 
   
  Value *(9.5/10) *– Yet another competitive monitor from VSonic, the VC1000 uses the familiar TWFK formula, taking advantage of the drivers’ small size and capacity for accurate sound. Unlike the similarly-priced Rock-It Sounds R-50, which required some minor modification, I was impressed with the sound of the VC1000 right out of the box. It has more going for it than just the sound, too – the slim form factor is very comfortable and the construction is good as well. The earphones utilize a simplified design that gets away from some of the quirks of VSonic’s GR01 and VC02 models. All in all, the VC1000 is a lower-priced – but not less capable – alternative to the GR01 and a very solid earphone for those who tend to prefer a flatter sound signature.
   
*Pros: Small, lightweight, and comfortable; balanced and articulate sound*
*Cons: Lacks cable cinch; subpar carrying pouch*


----------



## jekostas

The suggestion was for the $50 bracket (they're ~$53 on Amazon right now) but yes, I think they could compete against the RE-400.  Try reading the write-up in the Summer Buying Guide.


----------



## djvkool

Nice review on the VC1000 joker, I was proud to be one of the first owners of this outstanding dual-BA, and with your glowing review which I completely agreed, it should get the attention it deserves


----------



## stimer

*VC1000 *Thank you Joker!


----------



## Sokolnitz

Little mistake at the end of the MH1c review : "with good soun*D*stage width and depth"


----------



## ljokerl

Quote: 





djvkool said:


> Nice review on the VC1000 joker, I was proud to be one of the first owners of this outstanding dual-BA, and with your glowing review which I completely agreed, it should get the attention it deserves


 
   
  It's good stuff,
   
  Now I'm wondering if the BAs from VSonic's upcoming releases will get the GR01 and/or VC1000 killed off.
   
  Quote: 





stimer said:


> *VC1000 *Thank you Joker!


 
   





   
  Quote: 





sokolnitz said:


> Little mistake at the end of the MH1c review : "with good soun*D*stage width and depth"


 
   
  Crap, I don't see it. What line is it on?


----------



## Sokolnitz

At the end of the SQ section : "The soundstage of the MH1C is a little narrower compared to the half in-ear ATH-CKM500 and the pricier Philips Fidelio S1 but the overall presentation is very good, providing a moderately airy and open sound despite the warm tone with good *sounstage* width and depth."


----------



## Hitesh

Hi Joker
  Is there any chance of SM ES18 review in future ?


----------



## ljokerl

More complete RE-400 review, along with thoughts on the RE-600, now up at InnerFidelity: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors
  


sokolnitz said:


> At the end of the SQ section : "The soundstage of the MH1C is a little narrower compared to the half in-ear ATH-CKM500 and the pricier Philips Fidelio S1 but the overall presentation is very good, providing a moderately airy and open sound despite the warm tone with good *sounstage* width and depth."


 
  
 Thank you - fixed it!
  


hitesh said:


> Hi Joker
> Is there any chance of SM ES18 review in future ?


 
  
 I don't have a unit at this time. Maybe be in the more distant future.


----------



## meat01

above link is bad Joker.
  
 should be
  
 http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors


----------



## ljokerl

meat01 said:


> above link is bad Joker.
> 
> should be
> 
> http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors


 
  
 Very odd. Replaced with yours, thanks.


----------



## Hitesh

Is Vsonic GR02 BE really better than SM E30 ? I thought it was the opposite
 Also does the former needs a good audio player (I have a Samsung Wave 525. Yeah ancient I know that ) ? If yes then what do you think how much sound quality I'll lose ?


----------



## Hitesh

ljokerl said:


> I don't have a unit at this time. Maybe be in the more distant future.


 
 Ok


----------



## airomjosh

hitesh said:


> Hi Joker
> Is there any chance of SM ES18 review in future ?


 
 Many people say that they have the same driver with Soundmagic E10 and almost identical sound. The only difference is that , ES18 have inferior build quality compare to E10. Joker had reviewed E10 so you can still get an idea how ES18 sound.


----------



## Hitesh

airomjosh said:


> Many people say that they have the same driver with Soundmagic E10 and almost identical sound. The only difference is that , ES18 have inferior build quality compare to E10. Joker had reviewed E10 so you can still get an idea how ES18 sound.


 
 Thanks for the info !


----------



## suman134

get the es18 .


----------



## Hitesh

suman134 said:


> get the es18 .


 
 I think I would avoid them. Just tested a friend's ES18 and these are the issues I faced - Less than average isolation, too much micro-phonics and bad highs . I know they really value for money I think spending a little more (*cough* triple *cough*) would be a better idea


----------



## enyls

Do you think the new a-jay fives will be a big improvement?


----------



## ljokerl

Another teaser of the upcoming EarSonics release. Looks like it might be a 6-driver universal (the first?)
  

 http://theheadphonelist.com/category/news/
  
  
 Quote:


hitesh said:


> Is Vsonic GR02 BE really better than SM E30 ? I thought it was the opposite
> Also does the former needs a good audio player (I have a Samsung Wave 525. Yeah ancient I know that ) ? If yes then what do you think how much sound quality I'll lose ?


 
  
 Ultimately it'll come down to what you're looking for. The GR02 BE has more bass than the E30 by quite margin but still manages to sound very good overall. It does not need an amp.
  


enyls said:


> Do you think the new a-jay fives will be a big improvement?


 
  
 I never got to hear the previous a-JAYS so I really don't know. I was not particularly impressed with the JAYS dynamics I have tried but that doesn't mean the new ones won't be good.


----------



## suman134

hitesh said:


> I think I would avoid them. Just tested a friend's ES18 and these are the issues I faced - Less than average isolation, too much micro-phonics and bad highs . I know they really value for money I think spending a little more (*cough* triple *cough*) would be a better idea


 
  
     the best you can get is e10 ( in india ) , use sony tips , they will help with isolation . by the way what are you looking for , bass clarity , or just sq ?


----------



## suman134

just got the ha-fx40 , and i love every thing about it , these peaks are awesome , been looking for them , nicely complimented by good amount of bass , is pny midtwon / uptown any better when it comes to sq ?


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> just got the ha-fx40 , and i love every thing about it , these peaks are awesome , been looking for them , nicely complimented by good amount of bass , is pny midtwon / uptown any better when it comes to sq ?


 
  
 Warmer tone, lower mids fuller and not recessed, and less bright treble on the PNYs.


----------



## NIVEBL

How about ASG-1/2?


----------



## alpha421

Hi ya joker,
  
 I read your review on the Hidition NT 6.  For someone who really digs the ER4S sound signature and presentation, would you say that it's a safe bet that the NT6 is the closest form of the ER4S in a custom format with the added benefits of ciem including a more prominent but still balanced low end?


----------



## ljokerl

nivebl said:


> How about ASG-1/2?


 
  
 I've heard the original ASG-1 (I believe it was a rev 1.1). I wasn't a fan. Never got to try the newer versions. 
  


alpha421 said:


> Hi ya joker,
> 
> I read your review on the Hidition NT 6.  For someone who really digs the ER4S sound signature and presentation, would you say that it's a safe bet that the NT6 is the closest form of the ER4S in a custom format with the added benefits of ciem including a more prominent but still balanced low end?


 
  
 That's correct. The NT 6 improves on the ER4S with much better subbass response and more natural, fleshed-out bass overall. Someone asked a similar question here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-295-iems-compared-vsonic-vc1000-added-09-03-13-p-760/11265#post_9729619


----------



## shakur1996

ljokerl said:


> I've heard the original ASG-1 (I believe it was a rev 1.1). I wasn't a fan. Never got to try the newer versions.
> 
> 
> That's correct. The NT 6 improves on the ER4S with much better subbass response and more natural, fleshed-out bass overall. Someone asked a similar question here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-295-iems-compared-vsonic-vc1000-added-09-03-13-p-760/11265#post_9729619




project86 wrote that Cosmic Ears BA4R is very similar to Etys ER4 sound signature.

joker, when can we expect your first impressions on CA Music One?


----------



## Hitesh

ljokerl said:


> Ultimately it'll come down to what you're looking for. The GR02 BE has more bass than the E30 by quite margin but still manages to sound very good overall. It does not need an amp.


 
 Thanks.
 After some research I have narrowed down to these 3 - MH1C, GR02 and E30
 Which one of them is best suited for rock music ?


----------



## Hitesh

suman134 said:


> the best you can get is e10 ( in india ) , use sony tips , they will help with isolation . by the way what are you looking for , bass clarity , or just sq ?


 
 Kind of an all rounder


----------



## stimer

hitesh said:


> Kind of an all rounder


 
 gr2be good for electronic bass music, but for guitar or female vocal is not good because middle recessed and have sibilance. Maybe lg quadbeat or vsd1s is more better for you.


----------



## suman134

hitesh said:


> Kind of an all rounder


 
  
      get the mh1c , it will do , if you can , then get the vsd1/vsd1s they have really nice feedback .
    now these days even mobile companies are ready to up the ante , sony has mh1/mh1c , lg got quadbeat and now samsung has the dual driver ones floting with the s4 . nice going .


----------



## RapidPulse

Hi Joker,
  
 I don't seem to be able to get a great fit with any over-the-ear IEMs for any length of time.  I have larger size ear canals and lose the seal frequently. Even the GR-07's adjustable nozzle only helps so much.
  
 I have much better luck with IEMs like the XBA-3 and HF3 that can be worn straight down.
  
 Any suggestions for IEMs that provide the best combination of sound quality and comfort, that can be worn cable down?
  
 Ideally, I am looking for a "natural" sound signature, rather than strictly neutral, with some low-end extension and good treble. Timbre important. (I think I would like it if the W4 and PFE232 had a baby 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) Cost not necessarily a factor.
  
 Thanks!


----------



## Tyow

I currently have the VSonic VC02's and a month ago or so one of the ears stopped working, they were still in warranty so I sent them out, and got a new pair
 and that pair broke yesterday, one of the ears stopped working again!
 I have been storing the VC02's with the cable detached because they detach WAY to easily and it was just easier, and I thought maybe because of that,
 and the fact that it has been quite humid here lately, it probably damaged the connector, and that's why it won't play anymore.
  
 Have you experienced this?
 Is this kind of thing normal?
 Should I send them out again and maybe tape it so it can't detach?
  
 Thanks for your help in advance.


----------



## Kaveh

Hi Joker.
  
 According to your review, VSonic GR07 Bass Ed. is suitable for me. There is just one little question: Can I get a high output amount of sound and completely drive it with iPod Touch 5thG? I love listening to music in high volume, and when usuing Klipsch S4, the volume is increased to 90 percent. Can I get the same amount of sound when usuing GR07 Bass Ed. with 100 percent of iPod Touch 5thG volume?
  
 Best Regards


----------



## ljokerl

shakur1996 said:


> project86 wrote that Cosmic Ears BA4R is very similar to Etys ER4 sound signature.
> 
> joker, when can we expect your first impressions on CA Music One?


 
  
 Well, I just got them this week. So far they seem to have good bandwidth for a single driver. The tone is neutral to slightly warm and it's got a thicker sound than most single BAs and more bass as well. Compared it to the GR07 and the treble is smoother/less sibilant and the midrange is clearer and more prominent. The presentation is good, too. 
  
 It's also got my favorite build of all the silicone customs I've come across. Very low profile and the cable, even though it's not detachable, is excellent quality. 
  


hitesh said:


> Thanks.
> After some research I have narrowed down to these 3 - MH1C, GR02 and E30
> Which one of them is best suited for rock music ?


 
  
 I would go for the MH1C. It's not my preferred signature but out of those it's the most well-rounded, and it still sounds pretty great overall. 
  


rapidpulse said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I don't seem to be able to get a great fit with any over-the-ear IEMs for any length of time.  I have larger size ear canals and lose the seal frequently. Even the GR-07's adjustable nozzle only helps so much.
> 
> ...


 
  
 There's not a whole lot of cable-down options in the higher price tiers. What did you think was missing from the HF3, i.e. what changes would you like from your upgrade compared to the Etys? 
  
 The PFE232 is v-shaped while the W4 is pretty well-balanced, maybe a touch rolled-off. A combination of the two would be mildly v-shaped, like a TF10 or something. But obviously the TF10 can't be worn over-the-ear (and generally isn't all that comfortable).
  


tyow said:


> I currently have the VSonic VC02's and a month ago or so one of the ears stopped working, they were still in warranty so I sent them out, and got a new pair
> and that pair broke yesterday, one of the ears stopped working again!
> I have been storing the VC02's with the cable detached because they detach WAY to easily and it was just easier, and I thought maybe because of that,
> and the fact that it has been quite humid here lately, it probably damaged the connector, and that's why it won't play anymore.
> ...


 
  
 My VC02 is fine. Did you ever hear back RE: what went wrong with the first pair? That would probably go a ways towards figuring out how to stop it from happening again.
  


kaveh said:


> Hi Joker.
> 
> According to your review, VSonic GR07 is suitable for me. There is just one little question: Can I get a high output amount of sound and completely drive it with iPod Touch 5thG? I love listening to music in high volume, and when usuing Klipsch S4, the volume is increased to 90 percent. Can I get the same amount of sound when usuing GR07 Bass Ed. with 100 percent of iPod Touch 5thG volume?
> 
> Best Regards


 
  
 Is your iPod volume limited? Because if it isn't, you're almost certainly damaging your hearing by running the S4 at 90% volume. The GR07 is less efficient than the S4, but only slightly. It should be able to match the S4 with the 10% headroom you have left. It will also damage your hearing.


----------



## shakur1996

If possible, I would like to hear your thoughts on comparison between M1 and ER4s


----------



## hova

I like the Meelectronics M9 but dislike the cable because it kinks and has a very hard memory character to it. Are there some IEMs in that price range that are better cabled, maybe something like flat cables?


----------



## Tyow

No one told me what happened to them, I just got a new pair delivered.


----------



## ljokerl

shakur1996 said:


> If possible, I would like to hear your thoughts on comparison between M1 and ER4s


 
  
 M1 to me means Brainwavz M1. Let's call the Custom Art the "Music One". Based on a short A:B, I'm finding the Music One fuller and warmer than the ER4S. The bass is weightier but the overall sound still seems more mid-centric. The treble is more forgiving. The ER4S sounds leaner and a bit clearer overall. Overall SQ is pretty close.
  


hova said:


> I like the Meelectronics M9 but dislike the cable because it kinks and has a very hard memory character to it. Are there some IEMs in that price range that are better cabled, maybe something like flat cables?


 
  
 You mean like this newer M9?
  


tyow said:


> No one told me what happened to them, I just got a new pair delivered.


 
  
 Hmm... not sure then. The connectors are all gold-plated so if they got layer of something over them because of the humidity you should have been able to wipe/polish them off.


----------



## Grayson73

ljokerl said:


> The MEElec M6 mentioned above is a good cheap option. I don't really recommend buying non-sport earphones even if they sound better because it's not clear how they will hold up to sweat, etc. However, I've seen some good feedback on the soundmagic E30 being used for sports and I used my older soundmagic PL30 at the gym for years, so I'd make an exception for that. It lacks the memory wire of the M6 but has a more hi-fi sound to it and still doesn't cost an arm and a leg.


 
 Would the VSonic VSD1S be better than these for jogging?  I saw that they come with over-ear hooks.


----------



## Tyow

ljokerl said:


> Hmm... not sure then. The connectors are all gold-plated so if they got layer of something over them because of the humidity you should have been able to wipe/polish them off.


 
 I just tried them, since the humidty is gone in the area they seem to work now, do you have any tips for storing them?
 Because they disconnect really really easily..


----------



## RapidPulse

ljokerl said:


> There's not a whole lot of cable-down options in the higher price tiers. What did you think was missing from the HF3, i.e. what changes would you like from your upgrade compared to the Etys?
> 
> The PFE232 is v-shaped while the W4 is pretty well-balanced, maybe a touch rolled-off. A combination of the two would be mildly v-shaped, like a TF10 or something. But obviously the TF10 can't be worn over-the-ear (and generally isn't all that comfortable).


 
 I had the TF10 awhile back...but sold it due to comfort issues.
  
 I LOVE the HF3 and absolutely plan on keeping it...but I am looking for something a little warmer, more enveloping soundstage, weightier bass this time.
  
 I am using the W4 mod suggested by Rin/Inks, which extends the treble nicely. This is close to perfect, except for the fit.
  
 I like the bass of the PFE232 and also the airy treble. But I wish the mids were a little smoother, and had a tiny bit more weight, prominence to make vocals sound less thin.
 I was thinking the K3003 might be a possibility at the high end, assuming the cable down fit works ok. Does that make sense?  (Of course, any lower cost possibilities would be great too!)


----------



## ljokerl

grayson73 said:


> Would the VSonic VSD1S be better than these for jogging?  I saw that they come with over-ear hooks.


 
  
 They do come with earhooks, but they're not designed for sports use. No idea if they'll stand up to sweat and, if they do not, whether the warranty cover that. 
  


tyow said:


> I just tried them, since the humidty is gone in the area they seem to work now, do you have any tips for storing them?
> Because they disconnect really really easily..


 
  
 The included pouch is not good so I just use a generic clamshell case. I've never had them come apart while in the case. 
  


rapidpulse said:


> I had the TF10 awhile back...but sold it due to comfort issues.
> 
> I LOVE the HF3 and absolutely plan on keeping it...but I am looking for something a little warmer, more enveloping soundstage, weightier bass this time.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I prefer to wear the K3003 over-the-ear. The point where the cable exits the housings hurts my ear when I wear them cable down. However, there just aren't a lot of other cable-down options among top-tier IEMs - I can probably count them all on my fingers.  I guess the Senn IE 800 would be an option also - it might have too much bass but its mids are not as thin and definitely not as recessed as those of the PFEs.


----------



## Hitesh

I may be able to get MH1C (white one) quite cheap, for around 1k rs (16usd). I wanted to know if there is any way differentiate between a legit and a fake ?
  
 Also would MH1C be compatible with my Samsung Wave 525 ?


----------



## lilboozy

Joker what would you suggest as an upgrade to the fx101 keeping similar bass response? Doesn't matter if it loses or keeps it's bright treble.


----------



## ljokerl

hitesh said:


> I may be able to get MH1C (white one) quite cheap, for around 1k rs (16usd). I wanted to know if there is any way differentiate between a legit and a fake ?


 
  
 Are there fakes of the MH1C? I don't think there are but you might want to ask in the long MH1C thread: http://www.head-fi.org/t/632892/review-sony-mh1-the-best-kept-secret/
  


hitesh said:


> Also would MH1C be compatible with my *Samsung Wave 525* ?


 
  
 Never heard of it.
  


lilboozy said:


> Joker what would you suggest as an upgrade to the fx101 keeping similar bass response? Doesn't matter if it loses or keeps it's bright treble.


 
  
 There's only a few things I've tried with that much impact. Currently I would go for this if I were you: 
http://www.padacs.com/cart/product.php?id=72 . I reviewed them at $50 and though they were quite good for massive bass. Now they're $10. They are very similar to the massively bassy TFTA earphones that were popular for a while and cost something like $150. The housings are large and you might need some better tips but I think for $10 they'll be tough to beat.


----------



## Inks

There are versions of the MH1C with more bass than normal, semi-fake I guess


----------



## alpha421

ljokerl said:


> That's correct. The NT 6 improves on the ER4S with much better subbass response and more natural, fleshed-out bass overall. Someone asked a similar question here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-295-iems-compared-vsonic-vc1000-added-09-03-13-p-760/11265#post_9729619


 
  
 Thanks Joker.  I'll keep the NT6 on the back burner for now due to the cost.  I'm going to check with Project86 regarding the Cosmic BA4R.  I'm sure the NT6 is technical superior, but the latter is much more wallet friendly.


----------



## esanthosh

hitesh said:


> I may be able to get MH1C (white one) quite cheap, for around 1k rs (16usd). I wanted to know if there is any way differentiate between a legit and a fake ?


 
  
 The one you are talking about is the old MH1 version (I asked on the other forum via PM) and not the MH1C. Probably may not work with your phone.
  
 @ljokerl
  
 Any chance that JH13FP is #300? I am looking forward to S1 and S2 reviews as well (as well as TF10 review you promised. Sorry couldn't resist 






)
  
 How does Signature Acoustics C-12 stack up against MH1C?


----------



## Amitl

i saw the Sony MH1 on ebay for 15$ and without much hesitation decided
 to go for it...thinking to myself, the cable can't be THAT bad...
 and damn, it IS that bad... the earphones are unusable!
 i don't understand how could Sony produce such a thing...
 i think the cable is as bad as it gets...


----------



## MoonYeol

amitl said:


> i saw the Sony MH1 on ebay for 15$ and without much hesitation decided
> to go for it...thinking to myself, the cable can't be THAT bad...
> and damn, it IS that bad... the earphones are unusable!
> i don't understand how could Sony produce such a thing...
> i think the cable is as bad as it gets...




Recable it and show me how you did! Do it


----------



## ljokerl

alpha421 said:


> Thanks Joker.  I'll keep the NT6 on the back burner for now due to the cost.  I'm going to check with Project86 regarding the Cosmic BA4R.  I'm sure the NT6 is technical superior, but *the latter is much more wallet friendly*.


 
  
 no doubt
  


esanthosh said:


> The one you are talking about is the old MH1 version (I asked on the other forum via PM) and not the MH1C. Probably may not work with your phone.
> 
> @ljokerl
> 
> ...


 
  
 C-12 didn't hold up too well against the MH1C - boomier bass, more veiling, not as spacious in terms of presentation. It's not too far behind and the cable is certainly better, but for sound I'd go with the MH1C.
  
 Not sure what #300 will be. If I go in the order I have planned, it'll be something from either Nuforce, VSonic, or Steelseries. I'll try not to make it something too boring, though.


----------



## Tommy C

ljokerl said:


> no doubt
> 
> 
> C-12 didn't hold up too well against the MH1C - boomier bass, more veiling, not as spacious in terms of presentation. It's not too far behind and the cable is certainly better, but for sound I'd go with the MH1C.
> ...



 


@ljokerl

That will be great. 

+1 for SteelSeries. I sometimes wonder how is their Flux In-Ear Pro which is a balance armature headset with swappable cable.
http://steelseries.com/products/audio/steelseries-flux-in-ear-pro-headset


----------



## ljokerl

tommy c said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> That will be great.
> 
> ...


 
  
 It's very good, though I wouldn't say the cable is swappable. It detaches about two inches from the plug and you can use either a combined 3.5mm 4-pole plug (smartphone type) or two separate 3-pole plugs (one for mic and one for headset). Unless you use your earphones with a PC a lot, this is of limited utility.
  
 Other than that, and a bit of cable noise, the design is very nice. The sound reminds me of a UE600 but is less sensitive to source and is a bit heavier on the bottom end. Good earphones.


----------



## Leveler

Hey everyone! My birthday it's coming soon and I feel like it's to upgrade my IEMs!
  
 My budget is around $0 t0 $500, and the 3 models I'm considering the most are 1. Heir Audio 4.Ai   2. Logitech UE900 3. Shure SE535
  
 I'm upgrading from Shure SE215s which I have to admit I really enjoy, but sometimes wish for a more coherent sound, some less bass and better treble extension and reproduction (I find sometimes really high noises hurt my ears on them). As far as on/over ear headphones go I have DT880s which I really enjoy with pop and acoustic music but I find they have something lacking when listening to faster paced music, and V Moda M80s which I think are about perfect but sometimes could use some more sparkle in the highs.
  
 i listen to Many different types of music including Hip Hop, some pop, classic rock, alternative rock and a a good amount of indie/ acoustic/ folk (Elliott Smith, Nick Drake, Animal Collective etc) but probably 30-40% of my music is faster/harder types of music, mostly modern (1990s-now) hardcore, metal. progressive, post hardcore music. some reference bands could be Converge, Between The Buried and Me, and La Dispute.
  
 Any feedback on what you think would suit my tastes better would be infinitely appreciated.
  
  
 Cheers!
  
 Diego


----------



## ljokerl

leveler said:


> Hey everyone! My birthday it's coming soon and I feel like it's to upgrade my IEMs!
> 
> My budget is around $0 t0 $500, and the 3 models I'm considering the most are 1. Heir Audio 4.Ai   2. Logitech UE900 3. Shure SE535
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'm not sure what the coherency issue you're having with the SE215 is - it uses a single dynamic driver. Unless you mean that you just want something more balanced across the frequency spectrum, I don't think a multi-balanced-armature system would be the answer. 
  
 That said, while I have not heard the Heir 4.Ai, the SE535 is a good upgrade to the SE215 - flatter, more accurate bass and the treble, while not necessarily more energetic overall, is smoother. It's a good fit, especially if, as you said, you find the treble of the SE215 too aggressive at times.
  
 The UE900 is not as warm and tends to have brighter, more energetic treble. It has great treble extension (better than the SE535) and again very tight bass but it's not as good a match for the M-80's sound as the SE535.


----------



## Zalithian

I forgot this is Joker's special thread. I'll leave recommendations up to him here. . You never did the TDK BA200, Joker?


----------



## Leveler

ljokerl said:


> I'm not sure what the coherency issue you're having with the SE215 is - it uses a single dynamic driver. Unless you mean that you just want something more balanced across the frequency spectrum, I don't think a multi-balanced-armature system would be the answer.
> 
> That said, while I have not heard the Heir 4.Ai, the SE535 is a good upgrade to the SE215 - flatter, more accurate bass and the treble, while not necessarily more energetic overall, is smoother. It's a good fit, especially if, as you said, you find the treble of the SE215 too aggressive at times.
> 
> The UE900 is not as warm and tends to have brighter, more energetic treble. It has great treble extension (better than the SE535) and again very tight bass but it's not as good a match for the M-80's sound as the SE535.


 
  
 Yes pretty much I just meant a somewhat more balanced sound, I suck at everything that describing is. The SE535s sound great, I'll highly consider them since they are the only pair I can get locally, though $100 more expensive than the UE900 or Heir 4.Ai.
  
 Thanks a lot for your input IjokerI!!!!


----------



## Tommy C

zalithian said:


> I forgot this is Joker's special thread. I'll leave recommendations up to him here. . You never did the TDK BA200, Joker?


 
  
 Yeah the TDK BA200 should be an interesting earphones. I think the v2 comes with a regular cable. Too bad TDK doesn't offer a mic and a more reasonable size Y splitter or  I would be all over it.


----------



## Astrud

Hi, 
 Please compare A161P  vs.  VC1000 bass quantity.
 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

zalithian said:


> I forgot this is Joker's special thread. I'll leave recommendations up to him here. . You never did the TDK BA200, Joker?


 
  
 By all means recommend away. I have not heard the BA200 or (I'm sure) dozens of other worthy earphones.
  


leveler said:


> Yes pretty much I just meant a somewhat more balanced sound, I suck at everything that describing is. The SE535s sound great, I'll highly consider them since they are the only pair I can get locally, though $100 more expensive than the UE900 or Heir 4.Ai.
> 
> Thanks a lot for your input IjokerI!!!!


 
  
 Sure 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


astrud said:


> Hi,
> Please compare A161P  vs.  VC1000 bass quantity.
> Thanks


 
  
 Very similar. The A161P has more midrange emphasis overall so the little extra bass it does have over the VC1000 doesn't really stand out.


----------



## Zalithian

ljokerl said:


> By all means recommend away. I have not heard the BA200 or (I'm sure) dozens of other worthy earphones.


 
 I was going to offer to send you the BA200 if you're interested.


----------



## kaixax555

ljokerl said:


> By all means recommend away. I have not heard the BA200 or (I'm sure) dozens of other worthy earphones.
> 
> 
> Sure
> ...




Would really like to send mine to you for a review but I guess mine isn't in a really good condition I guess


----------



## ElectronicLover

Hey, I was looking to purchase the VC1000 for EDM music, and apparently the Bass is pretty good for an armature driver because it has two drivers. I was hoping to confirm this. If I were to purchase this where should I purchase it from? Is lendmeyourears.com a good website or are there others that are better?


----------



## ljokerl

zalithian said:


> I was going to offer to send you the BA200 if you're interested.


 
  
 Someone did offer me one but they were supposed to get it exchanged for a new one under warranty first. Not sure what happened to that... I'll find out,
  


electroniclover said:


> Hey, I was looking to purchase the VC1000 for EDM music, and apparently the Bass is pretty good for an armature driver because it has two drivers. I was hoping to confirm this. If I were to purchase this where should I purchase it from? Is lendmeyourears.com a good website or are there others that are better?


 
  
 The VC1000 is still pretty neutral in the grand scheme of things. Unless you already know that you like a fairly flat/balanced sound, it wouldn't be my first choice for EDM. I think something like GR07 Bass Edition would be a better option for EDM. It has more bass but still sounds more accurate overall compared to most mainstream/big brand sets.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Someone did offer me one but they were supposed to get it exchanged for a new one under warranty first. Not sure what happened to that... I'll find out,




Was that me? I can't remember lol. If so, I totally forgot. 

Yea, shoot me a PM if it was.


----------



## Sycho

My Brainwavz B2 are close to dead now, and although they were nice, the signature was just not for me. I listen to many genres; rock, EDM, trailer, instrumental, D&B, dance, you name it. After trying out various different IEMs and headphones, I'm become more sensitive to sibilance, little to no sub-bass and recessed mids. I guess I'm looking for a warmer pair of IEM (or headphone) with full sounding mids, good impact (more than the B2, maybe around the 9927, but to or less than the MH1C) and to an extent sparkly mids, low of sibilance. I'm still gearing towards the RE-400, and after reading the VC-1000 review, maybe those, or even the GR07 bass edition or the Philips Fidelio S1. I'm kind of asking for the perfect pair of IEMs, all under $200, though anything above $200 or good portable headphones like the Momentum could be noted. Thanks.


----------



## ElectronicLover

> The VC1000 is still pretty neutral in the grand scheme of things. Unless you already know that you like a fairly flat/balanced sound, it wouldn't be my first choice for EDM. I think something like GR07 Bass Edition would be a better option for EDM. It has more bass but still sounds more accurate overall compared to most mainstream/big brand sets.


 
My friend has the klipsch x10, and he primarily plays house music. My only reference to sound would be the Crossfade LP1 from vmoda I guess, but I'm not looking for too much bass, just a fun sound. Thank you for your reply


----------



## ljokerl

vwinter said:


> Was that me? I can't remember lol. If so, I totally forgot.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Just checked and it wasn't you. I get so many PMs that usernames totally skip my mind sometimes. 
  


sycho said:


> My Brainwavz B2 are close to dead now, and although they were nice, the signature was just not for me. I listen to many genres; rock, EDM, trailer, instrumental, D&B, dance, you name it. After trying out various different IEMs and headphones, I'm become more sensitive to sibilance, little to no sub-bass and recessed mids. I guess I'm looking for a warmer pair of IEM (or headphone) with full sounding mids, good impact (more than the B2, maybe around the 9927, but to or less than the MH1C) and to an extent sparkly mids, low of sibilance. I'm still gearing towards the RE-400, and after reading the VC-1000 review, maybe those, or even the GR07 bass edition or the Philips Fidelio S1. I'm kind of asking for the perfect pair of IEMs, all under $200, though anything above $200 or good portable headphones like the Momentum could be noted. Thanks.


 
  
 I wouldn't recommend the VC1000, the GR07, or even the Fidelio S1 for that matter if you thought the B2's treble was too unforgiving. The VC1000 is slightly less bright, but has a similar response overall. The GR07 has some sibilance-prone features, and the S1 is still a little edgy, like the GR07 without the peaks. 
  
 The RE-400, on the other hand, has the right treble and midrange balance but may not have enough bass for you. It's certainly nowhere near MH1C levels and is only a little more full-bodied than the B2. I guess to date I haven't really heard anything in the price range that would not be a downgrade from the B2 and ticks all of those boxes as far as sound signature goes. 
  


electroniclover said:


> My friend has the klipsch x10, and he primarily plays house music. My only reference to sound would be the Crossfade LP1 from vmoda I guess, but I'm not looking for too much bass, just a fun sound. Thank you for your reply


 
  
 Yeah, I would not recommend the VC1000. Compared to the X10 and the LP1 it has much less bass. The GR07 Bass Edition is probably the most accurate set I would recommend coming from a Crossfade. There will still be less bass on the VSonics, but at least you'll feel some of it.


----------



## garcsa

I'm enjoying the sound signature of the A161P but don't like the mic and the thin cables - anyway I want to upgrade . If I like the Meelec maybe I'd like the VC1000 to....? Reading the reviews - suppose yes. What you think joker, guys ?


----------



## hobbyone

Hi! You rated the sound of the ADDIEM (2009) 64%, despite the positive words. Was it because the name? Reading Rin-Choi's blog, he describes the revised model as "budget wonder", especially when a 33Ω impedance resistor is added. That should mean at least 85-90% for sound. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 According to the graphs, there are no big differences between the old, and new model.
  
 And I would like to hear something about the cheapest knowles twfk iem of the planet, the Samsung EHS 71. It's $49.99 in the US.


----------



## jekostas

hobbyone said:


> And I would like to hear something about the cheapest knowles twfk iem of the planet, the Samsung EHS 71. It's $49.99 in the US.


 
  
 Um...  there's no specifications anywhere that says the EHS-71 uses the Knowles TWFK driver.  Just about anything I can find state that it's a single balanced armature driver.
  
 Oh, and that it sounds like crap.


----------



## MoonYeol

The HS330 could well be the cheapest DD-iem on the planet however.


----------



## ljokerl

garcsa said:


> I'm enjoying the sound signature of the A161P but don't like the mic and the thin cables - anyway I want to upgrade . If I like the Meelec maybe I'd like the VC1000 to....? Reading the reviews - suppose yes. What you think joker, guys ?


 
  
VC1000 vs A161P
  
 The VC1000 is more refined, more spacious, more accurate, more balanced, mids not as forward, more airy and open-sounding. 
 A161P is more intimate overall with more forward mids. Doesn't quite have the treble extension of the VC1000 and the overall balance is not as good as a result.
  
 Cable thickness is actually not too different between the two but the VSonic cables feel stronger. 
  
  


hobbyone said:


> Hi! You rated the sound of the ADDIEM (2009) 64%, despite the positive words. Was it because the name? Reading Rin-Choi's blog, he describes the revised model as "budget wonder", especially when a 33Ω impedance resistor is added. That should mean at least 85-90% for sound.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 There are no percentages... it's a sliding scale based on how it compares to other IEMs. And unfortunately my ADDIEM died years ago so I don't have it for comparisons anymore. Lastly, I don't go off measurements when writing reviews - according to measurements the Earsonics SM64 (for example) is a terrible earphone and inferior to the preceding SM3 model. Yet, I quite like mine and can easily notice where it performs better than the SM3.


----------



## hobbyone

jekostas said:


> Um...  there's no specifications anywhere that says the EHS-71 uses the Knowles TWFK driver.  Just about anything I can find state that it's a single balanced armature driver.
> 
> Oh, and that it sounds like crap.


 
 The Samsung EHS 70 is/was the single BA of Samsung's line. The EHS-71 uses 100% TWFK. The sound of them (what I get from the few reviews) is harsh, and very light in bass. I think it is because of the white acoustic damper it uses, and the bad stock tips. The first gen UE700, came with the same tips. + The UE700 used green acoustic damper, which is better for taming the mid, high frequencies.
  
  
*Ljokerl*
  
 Do you understand all the graphs, used in Rin Choi's measurements or in the reviews of Goldenears? I'm not. But Rin at least provides a summary, which can help. I like written reviews better. You are the one of only few people man can trust in the IEM world. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 By the ADDIEM (II), people's opinion confirmed the measurements. And I was a little surprised by your sound rating. That's why I wrote you.


----------



## ljokerl

Earsonics S-EM6 has been annouced. 6-BA / 3-way universal.
  

  
http://theheadphonelist.com/category/news/
  


hobbyone said:


> Do you understand all the graphs, used in Rin Choi's measurements or in the reviews of Goldenears? I'm not. But Rin at least provides a summary, which can help. I like written reviews better. You are the one of only few people man can trust in the IEM world.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yes, I understand the graphs. My reviews on InnerFidelity include measurements. However, I tend to trust my ears first and measurements second. Some things sound better than they measure and some - worse. The UE600 measures very well, for example, but every time I listen to it I just don't get the feeling that it's quite a top-tier earphone. This is very obvious next to the UE900.


----------



## superayush

Hey joker I need your advice please
Few months back I bought vsonic gr06 as an upgrade over my sound magic es18 .(thanks to your detailed review)
Despite finding gr06 congested/narrowed in beginning now I am in love with its sound clarity and reproduction 
Probably I am loving this mid centric signature very much  
I wanted to ask in future if I wish to get an upgrade for my gr06 which IEM would u recommend having *similar sound signature*(mid centric) but would obviously give me more enhanced taste of music,budget (upto 200$)
(Not that I am not contended with my existing earphone just the desire to hear even better if any )
In case u wanna know my existing consideration ...I am getting attracted to Yamaha eph100.
Thanks


----------



## Makiah S

... Joker I do hate and love you... I HATE iems and I SWEAR I recommend this thread to people like 6 times a day q.q I'm SO tired of NOT being able to enjoy this thread due to my hate of Iems xD you've done such an EPIC job of reviewing them... and sadly no such  Headphone thread of THIS magnitude exists... or not one as pretty as yours so
  
 THANKS and go jump off a small cliff


----------



## jant71

hobbyone said:


> The Samsung EHS 70 is/was the single BA of Samsung's line. The EHS-71 uses 100% TWFK. The sound of them (what I get from the few reviews) is harsh, and very light in bass. I think it is because of the white acoustic damper it uses, and the bad stock tips. The first gen UE700, came with the same tips. + The UE700 used green acoustic damper, which is better for taming the mid, high frequencies.
> 
> 
> *Ljokerl*
> ...


 
 I thought we debunked this:
 · Driver Type: Metal balanced armature driver (4.3mm x 3mm rectangular)
  
 The TWFK is not that small. Why not say dual if it is one? The dual dynamic HS330 touts dual speakers. Always seems to be a siren style driver in the 70 and the better driver in the 71.The ED series measurements match up(4.3 X 2.97). Someone crack one open if they are only $50  
  
  
  
 BTW, interesting to know the new Earsonics is a universal. Most thought it was a custom.


----------



## hobbyone

jant71 said:


> I thought we debunked this:
> · Driver Type: Metal balanced armature driver (4.3mm x 3mm rectangular)
> 
> The TWFK is not that small. Why not say dual if it is one? The dual dynamic HS330 touts dual speakers. Always seems to be a siren style driver in the 70 and the better driver in the 71.The ED series measurements match up(4.3 X 2.97). Someone crack one open if they are only $50
> ...


 
  

  
 The right one Is the TWFK from my UE700. In the middle is a Knowles 30103 (Pionner CLX9), on the left is a Sonion 17A003 (Microsonic Epic X from 2009). Monoprice 9927 represents the dynamic type.


----------



## shotgunshane

I hope you get a chance to review the Brainwavz Delta. Truly a new budget benchmark at $20 and a new rival to Soundmagic's SQ value.


----------



## ljokerl

Looks like the Earsonics will be priced at 790€ (around $1050) for non-VAT countries. 
  
  


superayush said:


> Hey joker I need your advice please
> Few months back I bought vsonic gr06 as an upgrade over my sound magic es18 .(thanks to your detailed review)
> Despite finding gr06 congested/narrowed in beginning now I am in love with its sound clarity and reproduction
> 
> ...


 
  
 The EPH-100 is a good option. It can't be called mid-centric because it has a ton of bass but the mids are nice and prominent still. Treble is smoother than that of the GR06, or at least avoids the sibilance-prone ranges. Truth be told higher-end IEMs typically do not have sound signatures like the GR06 because, as you said, it can sound congested and that's not something you want said about your product when its priced at $200.
  
 The RE-400 can sound a little mid-centric due to the relaxed treble and level, non-enhanced bass but it won't have the bass impact of the GR06. The treble is much smoother, though, and it doesn't sound congested in the least. The MEElec A161P can sound mid-centric for similar reasons.
  
 Another option would be the JVC FXT90, which has solid bass and sparkly treble (like the GR06) but doesn't sound mid-recessed. It's a nicely layered earphone so you don't really hear the v-shape of the sound. I liked it a lot. 
  


mshenay said:


> ... Joker I do hate and love you... I HATE iems and I SWEAR I recommend this thread to people like 6 times a day q.q I'm SO tired of NOT being able to enjoy this thread due to my hate of Iems xD you've done such an EPIC job of reviewing them... and sadly no such  Headphone thread of THIS magnitude exists... or not one as pretty as yours so
> 
> THANKS and go jump off a small cliff


 
  
 Glad this thread causes such mixed emotions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


jant71 said:


> BTW, interesting to know the new Earsonics is a universal. Most thought it was a custom.


 
  
 The early teaser showed an eartip so I assumed it was a universal. I guess it could have been a custom demo. In any case I'm glad it's a universal 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
  


hobbyone said:


> [...]
> 
> The right one Is the TWFK from my UE700. In the middle is a Knowles 30103 (Pionner CLX9), on the left is a Sonion 17A003 (Microsonic Epic X from 2009). Monoprice 9927 represents the dynamic type.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Is any of these the EHS-71?
  
  


shotgunshane said:


> I hope you get a chance to review the Brainwavz Delta. Truly a new budget benchmark at $20 and a new rival to Soundmagic's SQ value.


 
  
 Interesting... might have to get my hands on one


----------



## Gandasaputra

Holy crap....first Universal 6 BA IEM?? I thought 4 BAs is already at limit... -head explodes- I can foresee that there'll be 10+ BAs universal IEM in the future


----------



## MoonYeol

gandasaputra said:


> Holy crap....first Universal 6 BA IEM?? I thought 4 BAs is already at limit... -head explodes- I can foresee that there'll be 10+ BAs universal IEM in the future




Either they have to make smaller BA's, peoples outer ears need to get bigger or they're just going to stick out several centimeters from the ears. 10 BA's, I mean What. 6 is already a lot.


----------



## DigitalFreak

moonyeol said:


> Either they have to make smaller BA's, peoples outer ears need to get bigger or they're just going to stick out several centimeters from the ears. 10 BA's, I mean What. 6 is already a lot.


 
 Actually if they go the more BA route the companies would have to start looking into development and implementation of micro drivers.


----------



## jekostas

digitalfreak said:


> Actually if they go the more BA route the companies would have to start looking into development and implementation of micro drivers.


 
  
 I want a 10 dynamic driver universal.   A pair of IEMs that you'd have to wear with a headband because they're so big.


----------



## vwinter

jekostas said:


> I want a 10 dynamic driver universal.   A pair of IEMs that you'd have to wear with a headband because they're so big.




Hmmmm...



spkrs01 said:


> Forget about headphones......................:blink:
> 
> http://mikekimindustrialdesign.com/Audionauts-Hi-Fi-Marketing-Campaign


----------



## eke2k6

vwinter said:


> Hmmmm...


 
  
  
 And they thought the HE-6 was hard to drive...


----------



## piotrus-g

gandasaputra said:


> Holy crap....first Universal 6 BA IEM?? I thought 4 BAs is already at limit... -head explodes- I can foresee that there'll be 10+ BAs universal IEM in the future


 
 I don't really think this going to happen.
 I mean look at custom IEMs when 6 and 8 BA IEMs came out people were freaking about it and now. 8driver earphones is still very rare.
  
 Going up with the count of drivers doesn't mean that IEM will sound better. The more driver the harder it is to tune it correctly and it's a long known truth that properly tuned 2 driver can sound even better than 4 or 6 driver IEM.


----------



## davidcotton

Actually I thought that the universal 1964 ears  v6 was the first universal ba driver no?


----------



## piotrus-g

davidcotton said:


> Actually I thought that the universal 1964 ears  v6 was the first universal ba driver no?


 
 When what about JH13 and JH16Pro?


----------



## davidcotton

Can you get universal models of those?


----------



## tomscy2000

There are plenty of CIEM demo universals with 6, 8, etc. drivers. In that case, I heard two different ten driver universals before!
  
 The S-EM6 is the first purpose-built universal that has 6 BAs. At the same time, however, it doesn't seem all that innovative. It's basically just an EM6 shoehorned to output through a tiny little 2mm tube. Sure, the manifold should be plenty complex, but I'd still say that something like a TO GO! 334 has more complex construction and pushed the limits of construction more.


----------



## piotrus-g

davidcotton said:


> Can you get universal models of those?


 
 I don't know honestly, but say UM is willing to make universal versions of its official IEMs.


----------



## tomscy2000

Technically, it's not the world's first even if we're more strict about the definition of "universal IEM".
  
 A while back, Rhapsodio was selling the R8P, which was an eight-driver CIEM-derived universal that was only made to be a universal --- it apparently wasn't available as a custom unless you decided to remold it. Just a fun fact.


----------



## vwinter

eke2k6 said:


> And they thought the HE-6 was hard to drive...




Portable rig:


----------



## Mimouille

tomscy2000 said:


> There are plenty of CIEM demo universals with 6, 8, etc. drivers. In that case, I heard two different ten driver universals before!
> 
> The S-EM6 is the first purpose-built universal that has 6 BAs. At the same time, however, it doesn't seem all that innovative. It's basically just an EM6 shoehorned to output through a tiny little 2mm tube. Sure, the manifold should be plenty complex, but I'd still say that something like a TO GO! 334 has more complex construction and pushed the limits of construction more.


I agree that I do not see any inmovation justifying this new model and its price. However for me tuning and SQ are the most important, so if it sounds wonderful then the heck with innovation. There is quite a significant chance that it will sound similar to the EM6 but few people here own it. It is bound to sound better than the demo versions of the EM6 IMO as much more effort will have been but in making it a true universal.


----------



## Makiah S

vwinter said:


> Portable rig:


 
  
 lawl


----------



## ljokerl

vwinter said:


> Hmmmm...


 
  


vwinter said:


> Portable rig:


 
  
 I'd try it...
  
  


mimouille said:


> I agree that I do not see any inmovation justifying this new model and its price. *However for me tuning and SQ are the most important, so if it sounds wonderful then the heck with innovation. *There is quite a significant chance that it will sound similar to the EM6 but few people here own it. It is bound to sound better than the demo versions of the EM6 IMO as much more effort will have been but in making it a true universal.


 
  
 Same.


----------



## Gandasaputra

Hey joker, I've tried the PNY Uptown 200 from Fry's (paid  $27 w/ tax, did not care bout the price) and the sounds really good for the price
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 very non fatiguing, comfortable, pleasant sound with good amount bass to impress. Oh God, I can sleep with this phones on my ears. 
  
 I think these deserve a review from you!


----------



## ljokerl

Clear Tune Monitors is running a sweepstakes for their CT-200 customs on their facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/cleartunemonitors/app_478544205586977 
  
 Looks like anyone with a facebook account can enter to win. 
  
  


gandasaputra said:


> Hey joker, I've tried the PNY Uptown 200 from Fry's (paid  $27 w/ tax, did not care bout the price) and the sounds really good for the price
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, they are quite good. So are the Midtowns (I forget which one is the higher-end model). I've mentioned both before in this thread but haven't had the chance to do a full write-up yet. Will get around to it eventually.


----------



## piotrus-g

So I listened to S-EM6 today. I also took time to run some measurements on it as well I don't know but it seemed that the unit I had was somehow faulty.
  
 Anyways... S-EM6's sound is a continuation of the Ear Sonics' sound signature. It has all the best futures of SM3 v2 and SM64 combined. What really impressed me was bass, which is really "big" but in a good way it goes really really low and has that fine deep texture. Next thing was soundstage - simply wow - one of the best from Universal IEMs. It has spaciousness and airness of a regular custom IEM. And the resolution - also wow - there are layers and layers of sound. Very impressive.
 Highs remind a lot of SM64 - they can sound a bit harsh but overall are quite extended and detailed. Mids are typical for Ear Sonics - close, slightly intimate and a bit thick on the low note and bright and light on higher notes.


----------



## shakur1996

piotrus-g said:


> So I listened to S-EM6 today. I also took time to run some measurements on it as well I don't know but it seemed that the unit I had was somehow faulty.
> 
> Anyways... S-EM6's sound is a continuation of the Ear Sonics' sound signature. It has all the best futures of SM3 v2 and SM64 combined. What really impressed me was bass, which is really "big" but in a good way it goes really really low and has that fine deep texture. Next thing was soundstage - simply wow - one of the best from Universal IEMs. It has spaciousness and airness of a regular custom IEM. And the resolution - also wow - there are layers and layers of sound. Very impressive.
> Highs remind a lot of SM64 - they can sound a bit harsh but overall are quite extended and detailed. Mids are typical for Ear Sonics - close, slightly intimate and a bit thick on the low note and bright and light on higher notes.



Can it be compared to any of your CIEMs?


----------



## Mimouille

shakur1996 said:


> Can it be compared to any of your CIEMs?


As MOT I am not sure if he can say that.


----------



## shakur1996

mimouille said:


> As MOT I am not sure if he can say that.



Why?
I'm just curious whether for example Peter's pro330 share some similarities with Earsonics new product.


----------



## piotrus-g

shakur1996 said:


> Can it be compared to any of your CIEMs?


 
 As a MOT I have to refrain from answering this question in public.


----------



## shakur1996

piotrus-g said:


> As a MOT I have to refrain from answering this question in public.



Understood.


----------



## zenpunk

Whooooaaa! A non-fautly S-EM6 must sound wonderful.
 What was exactly wrong  with your unit, Piotrus?


----------



## Deviltooth

piotrus-g said:


> So I listened to S-EM6 today. I also took time to run some measurements on it as well I don't know but it seemed that the unit I had was somehow faulty.
> 
> Anyways... S-EM6's sound is a continuation of the Ear Sonics' sound signature. It has all the best futures of SM3 v2 and SM64 combined. What really impressed me was bass, which is really "big" but in a good way it goes really really low and has that fine deep texture. Next thing was soundstage - simply wow - one of the best from Universal IEMs. It has spaciousness and airness of a regular custom IEM. And the resolution - also wow - there are layers and layers of sound. Very impressive.
> Highs remind a lot of SM64 - they can sound a bit harsh but overall are quite extended and detailed. Mids are typical for Ear Sonics - close, slightly intimate and a bit thick on the low note and bright and light on higher notes.


 
 These are almost all very positive impressions.
  
 What was possibly 'faulty' about the unit you had?  Was it something that was revealed by measurements as opposed to listening or did it correspond with the not-as-perfect highs?


----------



## piotrus-g

The channel imbalance on measurement was kinda scary. I redid my measurements like 10time to insure it's not my mistake. And also measured some different IEMs to be sure I did everything ok.
 This imbalance was not audible at the first listen (I don't know ...excitement etc.) but once measured I knew what to look for and it became pretty obvious what was wrong.


----------



## ljokerl

piotrus-g said:


> So I listened to S-EM6 today. I also took time to run some measurements on it as well I don't know but it seemed that the unit I had was somehow faulty.
> 
> Anyways... S-EM6's sound is a continuation of the Ear Sonics' sound signature. It has all the best futures of SM3 v2 and SM64 combined. What really impressed me was bass, which is really "big" but in a good way it goes really really low and has that fine deep texture. Next thing was soundstage - simply wow - one of the best from Universal IEMs. It has spaciousness and airness of a regular custom IEM. And the resolution - also wow - there are layers and layers of sound. Very impressive.
> Highs remind a lot of SM64 - they can sound a bit harsh but overall are quite extended and detailed. Mids are typical for Ear Sonics - close, slightly intimate and a bit thick on the low note and bright and light on higher notes.


 
  
 Thanks for these impressions!


----------



## FullCircle

piotrus-g said:


> The channel imbalance on measurement was kinda scary. I redid my measurements like 10time to insure it's not my mistake. And also measured some different IEMs to be sure I did everything ok.
> This imbalance was not audible at the first listen (I don't know ...excitement etc.) but once measured I knew what to look for and it became pretty obvious what was wrong.


 
  
 How many dB is the imbalance, and at what region?


----------



## johndu13

i'm lost 
  
  
 very good test 
  
  
 moe information !!1
  
 that's the same person  who's test the all ears ?


----------



## maybe4sg

Can you do an evaluation of Sony XBA 40? The updated version of XBA 4 which has quite some improvements.


----------



## ljokerl

A chance to win some CT-200 customs from Clear Tune Monitors (facebook required):
  


> Enter the Clear Tune Monitors “Hit the Road” sweepstakes for a chance to win not one but two pairs of the CT-200 In-Ear Monitors reviewed here.
> 
> See the complete details and enter to win here, or click the image below (facebook required).


 
  
http://theheadphonelist.com/category/news/ 
  


johndu13 said:


> i'm lost
> 
> 
> very good test
> ...


 
  
 Yes, same person 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


maybe4sg said:


> Can you do an evaluation of Sony XBA 40? The updated version of XBA 4 which has quite some improvements.


 
  
 I don't have access to one at this time.


----------



## Cortlendt

I'm looking to buy straight barrel armature IEMs so I'm currently looking at VSonic GR01 and VC1000. Its hard to decide - I have AT CK10 which I like but form-factor of theirs is not always handy. I've had RE400, but they re too boring for my taste. How GR01 and VC1000 compare to AT CK10? Thanks in advance.


----------



## johndu13

it's a titan work ! what do you mean for me ? xears ? visang ? vsonic ? brainwavz? soundmagic ? Fischer audio ? if you need to rank them ps/ i know your test but i didn't find a rank of models


----------



## hobbyone

I wonder why people love or hate Sony MH1C. Maybe member _borrego_ has the answer.
  
 Quote from his post (Sony MH1 forum):
 ..
 "Bad:
 1. Cables, like everyone has mentioned
 2. Cannot take high volume: I think my pair of MH1a hasn't burnt in but it seems that the micro drivers in it cannot take high volume. If I listen at low volume (in mid-night quiet living room), it is an absolutely wonderful earphones. But if I turn up the volume a bit to the similar sound level I would normally listened to outdoor, it sounds "bloat". I suppose this might be why some other people think they have got a bad pair of MH1
 3. Proper insertion is a must for good sound: The tips definitely play a big part of the MH1a sound tuning_._"


----------



## blueangel2323

ljokerl said:


> A chance to win some CT-200 customs from Clear Tune Monitors (facebook required):


 
 Nice, thanks for sharing!


----------



## ljokerl

cortlendt said:


> I'm looking to buy straight barrel armature IEMs so I'm currently looking at VSonic GR01 and VC1000. Its hard to decide - I have AT CK10 which I like but form-factor of theirs is not always handy. I've had RE400, but they re too boring for my taste. How GR01 and VC1000 compare to AT CK10? Thanks in advance.


 
  
 The GR01 is a little smoother and more forgiving than the VC1000 but they are quite similar overall. The VC1000 is more similar to the CK10 IMO. I honestly find it hard to justify the extra $$ for the GR01 (and I didn't much like the removable nozzles) so I would go for the more basic VC1000. 
  


johndu13 said:


> it's a titan work ! what do you mean for me ? xears ? visang ? vsonic ? brainwavz? soundmagic ? Fischer audio ? if you need to rank them ps/ i know your test but i didn't find a rank of models


 
  
 There is a ranking at the bottom of the first page of this thread and also an interactive one you can sort and drill down here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/
  


hobbyone said:


> I wonder why people love or hate Sony MH1C. Maybe member _borrego_ has the answer.
> 
> Quote from his post (Sony MH1 forum):
> ..
> ...


 
  
 Inks also mentioned earlier in the thread that one of the units he tested had more bass than the other. Manufacturing differences between units can definitely be an issue for lower-end models. 
  


blueangel2323 said:


> Nice, thanks for sharing!


 
  
 Hope someone from head-fi wins. These earphones need more impressions


----------



## johndu13

i don't need to see the list (the list give the vsonic are the best of the best  in my budget -50$
  
 for ex : vsonic vc02
  
 i had seeing them !
  
  
 i ask you what do you mean about this 
  
 vsonic are the best for you ? are you sure ?
  
 xears ? visang ? brainwavz? soundmagic  e10 ?


----------



## MoonYeol

According to the sound scores, the VC02 are technically superior. However they are pretty neutral and sound signature preference may result in that perhaps E10 will be better for you. If you don't need boosted bass but instead like accurate bass (by no means lacking bass) and you can take deep inserted iems, VC02 are great price/performance.


----------



## lisagorbin

*ljokerl, i would really like to see where vsd1 stack up in the beautifully constructed *"Multi-IEM Review Table"

 If you can, can you give me a rough estimate of its score on "Sound"? thanks


----------



## johndu13

the big problem , i can't choice the ear phone
  
  
 brainwavz beta, pro alpha, m5,m1,r1,and s1
  
 soundmagic e10, es18
  
 vsonic gr02 bass, gr99, r02 silver, vc02, vsd1, vsd1s


----------



## suman134

johndu13 said:


> the big problem , i can't choice the ear phone
> 
> 
> brainwavz beta, pro alpha, m5,m1,r1,and s1
> ...


 
  
 your a bit too worried man , easy , dont stress , you can take the s1 , vc02 or vsd1/s , they are the best sounding phones to me , but you can pick any , and the most important question is , what you want from your phone ? bass , mids , treble , isolation ? definition , and so on . everything has its con and pro .


----------



## johndu13

i don't stress (maybe a little )
  
 just i don't like  a most models existing 
 its complicated  for the client 
  
  
 its for my macbook , and my smartphone, 
  
 i search a good sound  a models outsider 
  
 i'm doing a choice, finally  i think :
  
 soundmagic e10  
 The es18 are not recent )
  
 or brainwavz m5
 (i don't like the look of m1 and pro alpha)
  
 or vsonic gr04, vsd1 , vsd1s
  
 hat do you mean of ''redgiant a00 and a04"
  
 thank you very much for your help


----------



## johndu13

i''ll add 
  
 a good product , with isolation correct 
 with bass.middle and treble correct


----------



## suman134

johndu13 said:


> i''ll add
> 
> a good product , with isolation correct
> with bass.middle and treble correct


 
  
   i think you can opt for vsd1/s , they are better then m5 and e10 when it comes to sq . or if you can , try a xb90ex .
  
 i have no idea about the redgiants , clieos got them , heres the link .
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/637377/review-redgiant-audio-s-a00-malleus-and-a03-ossicle


----------



## Hitesh

Earlier I had narrowed it down to MH1C, GR02 and E30
 Well now I have decided to increase the budget a little and include AM-90 and C-12 in the mix. Also have excluded MH1C solely due to its design and E30 main due to low isolation (and that I have increased my budget).
  
 Now I have some queries
 Does AM-90 needs an amp ( as its impedance is quite high compared to others I have looked at) ?
 Does AM-90 lacks in bass ? How is it compared to GR02 ? Idk why but got such impression after reading this -
  
 "_The sound signature of the AM-90, while slightly warm, is not unbalanced. Bass depth is decent enough – no match for dynamic-driver sets such as the id America Spark or VSonic GR99 but good for a single armature. Mid-bass impact is a hair lower than that of the A151 but control and detail are similarly good. The low end can be classified as punchy, but also not lacking in body and fullness for a BA-based earphone – seemingly a hallmark of the SR armature_."
 Should be at least at a level of ES18/E10
  
 Also how is VSD1 compared to VC02 ? Just in case I decide to buy from lendmeurears


----------



## johndu13

thank you 
  
 you help me to detele a models
  
  
 my choice are
  
 soundmagic e10 
  
 or vsonic vsd1 / vsd1s
  
 or redgiant a00 / a04


----------



## justblue

ljokerl said:


> The RE-400, on the other hand, has the right treble and midrange balance but may not have enough bass for you. It's certainly nowhere near MH1C levels and is only a little more full-bodied than the B2. I guess to date I haven't really heard anything in the price range that would not be a downgrade from the B2 and ticks all of those boxes as far as sound signature goes.


 
  
 I just want to say that the RE-400 are very prone to equalizing. Besides I don't get how someone can call it boring, the RE-400 sounds really natural and musical - if it's boring then maybe the problem is a source or previous coloured/inaccurate IEM, not the RE-400 itself (?).
 BTW |joker| thanks for your review which, after seeing this, finally encouraged me to buy the RE-400. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 I only wish it has a mic/remote version, but it's really great to listen to any music.


----------



## Amitl

look at the strain relieves of these :
 http://www.amazon.com/JBL-J33-Premium-In-Ear-Headphones/dp/B009IKCFP6/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
 i wonder how effective it really is at reducing microphonics.
 by the way it appears, it should block all noise, just like a cable clip.
 i wonder why is it such a rare thing to see then, and why something like the 1000$ Sennheiser IE800
 doesn't incorporate *at least* something like this solution.
 interesting!


----------



## johndu13

help me ?


----------



## esteebin

johndu13 said:


> help me ?




I normally quietly follow this thread and I think Joker and Suman has helped you. I was going to suggest VSD1 also since I have that and think it's an amazing price-to-performance IEM. But you still want help. I see from your posts from other threads that it seems you're not liking what is being suggested since you don't like VSonic.
So why not go with what you really want and get the Soundmagic e10?


----------



## enyls

I've narrowed my choices down to yamaha eph 100 and hifiman re400. Which one should I get?


----------



## ljokerl

lisagorbin said:


> *ljokerl, i would really like to see where vsd1 stack up in the beautifully constructed *"Multi-IEM Review Table"
> 
> If you can, can you give me a rough estimate of its score on "Sound"? thanks


 
  
 Yeah I think it's a little better than VC02 and LG Quadbeat. I would estimate at least an 8.2, maybe a bit higher.
  


hitesh said:


> Earlier I had narrowed it down to MH1C, GR02 and E30
> Well now I have decided to increase the budget a little and include AM-90 and C-12 in the mix. Also have excluded MH1C solely due to its design and E30 main due to low isolation (and that I have increased my budget).
> 
> Now I have some queries
> ...


 
  
 The AM-90 does not need an amp. It's actually easier to drive (slightly) than something like the VSD1 and MH1C. Bass is almost flat on the Astrotecs. If you're looking at the Bass Edition of the GR02, it's going to have a lot more bass. The VC02 and AM-90 have similar bass qty. while the others (VSD1, MH1C, GR02BE) all have more.
  
VSD1 vs VC02
VSD1 is warmer in tone, fuller, and has more bass impact. It is also more sensitive
 VC02 is thinner, more analytical, brighter, less bass impact but also appears a touch quicker and more textured at the low end
  


johndu13 said:


> thank you
> 
> you help me to detele a models
> 
> ...


 
  
 For me it's the VSD1S as an all-rounder but I haven't heard anything by redgiant. 
  


justblue said:


> I just want to say that the RE-400 are very prone to equalizing. Besides I don't get how someone can call it boring, the RE-400 sounds really natural and musical - if it's boring then maybe the problem is a source or previous coloured/inaccurate IEM, not the RE-400 itself (?).
> BTW |joker| thanks for your review which, after seeing this, finally encouraged me to buy the RE-400.
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 For an example of someone who didn't like them at all, see the mess that is the comment section on the InnerFidelity review. 
  
 I agree with you though, and the RE-400 would probably be my #1 choice in the price range if I had to pick just one earphone. 
  
 To do a microphone version HiFiMan would have to give up on going balanced for good. I guess for the RE-400 it wouldn't be a problem but the RE-600 wouldn't work. 5-pole TRRRS plug 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


amitl said:


> look at the strain relieves of these :
> http://www.amazon.com/JBL-J33-Premium-In-Ear-Headphones/dp/B009IKCFP6/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
> i wonder how effective it really is at reducing microphonics.
> by the way it appears, it should block all noise, just like a cable clip.
> ...


 
  
 It's not a novel idea but I've actually never gotten my hands on one of those. No clue if it works or not.
  
 There are some manufacturers that consistently do a good job of eliminating microphonics - JVC, for example - and some that struggle. Probably comes down to whether the design team thought of cable noise as an important issue and/or was able to find a fix.
  


esteebin said:


> I normally quietly follow this thread and I think Joker and Suman has helped you. I was going to suggest VSD1 also since I have that and think it's an amazing price-to-performance IEM. But you still want help. I see from your posts from other threads that it seems you're not liking what is being suggested since you don't like VSonic.
> So why not go with what you really want and get the Soundmagic e10?


 
  
 Actually I hadn't gotten a chance to reply until now but for me the VSD1S seems like the best all-rounder (though admittedly I haven't tried anything from redgiant).
  


enyls said:


> I've narrowed my choices down to yamaha eph 100 and hifiman re400. Which one should I get?


 
  
 For flatter and more accurate sound - RE-400. For a fun, warm signature with enhanced bass, EPH-100. I like them both (see here)


----------



## lisagorbin

ljokerl said:


> Yeah I think it's a little better than VC02 and LG Quadbeat. I would estimate at least an 8.2, maybe a bit higher.


 
 Thank you. As always, constantly delivers


----------



## OnlinePredator

I've had my VSonic GR06 for almost a year now(they're my first pair of IEMs), and I honestly don't think it sounds any different from any of the earbuds I've worn over the years. The only thing I like about it, and the only difference I notice, is the isolation, which I like, however, it still isn't enough sometimes.
 So what's the best IEM for <$300, with at least a 4 for isolation, and better sound than the GR06?
 Some of the models that fit the criteria aren't on ebay or amazon, like the ACS T15, and I also want something that looks decent, so no Etymotic Research.
 How about the TripleFi 10's? They've been on the upcoming reviews for probably 3 years now, are they good?


----------



## lisagorbin

onlinepredator said:


> I've had my VSonic GR06 for almost a year now(they're my first pair of IEMs), and I honestly don't think it sounds any different from any of the earbuds I've worn over the years. The only thing I like about it, and the only difference I notice, is the isolation, which I like, however, it still isn't enough sometimes.


 
 do you mean the earbuds that came with your player?


----------



## johndu13

i think  ill take vsd1 or vsd1s (when you explain the difference)
  
 but I want to know the position  with redgiant a00 or a04 than the sound magic e10 or vsonic vsd1(s)
  
 i hope anyone can to help me


----------



## lisagorbin

johndu13 said:


> i think  ill take vsd1 or vsd1s (when you explain the difference)
> 
> but I want to know the position  with redgiant a00 or a04 than the sound magic e10 or vsonic vsd1(s)
> 
> i hope anyone can to help me


 
 dont stress out. all of them are good. (except for red giant, i am not familiar with them)
 if you really want to know every detail of these phones, you got to read about them and you can find it here in head fi.
 there are really lots of choices, so many of them that its really hard to pinpoint what you want unless you try it yourself. because judging an earphone is somewhat subjective. but these reviews will give you a good idea of what you can expect from them.
 if i were you, i'd stop being indecisive and just get any of your choices, i know you want the best for your money. and by the way, i recommend vsonic vsd1 or soundmagic e10, you cant go wrong with them, im pretty sure you will enjoy them. Bonne chance


----------



## tomscy2000

VSD1S is probably the right choice. I've heard the RedGiants and they're "fun" oriented, both the A00 and A04 have bass enhancement and lifted treble --- mainstream orientation, if you will, not really a "hi-fi" emphasis. They're quite fun and enjoyable for what they are, though. Plus, they look kinda cool.


----------



## johndu13

i' sorry i don't understand all you said 
  
 i don't speak english very well 
  
 can you explain with a simply word ? or with a score sound ?
  
 sound magic e10……………
  
 redgiant a00………
  
 redgiant a04………………
  
 vsonic vsd1 (s)……………


----------



## lisagorbin

johndu13 said:


> i' sorry i don't understand all you said
> 
> i don't speak english very well


 
 i just used a translator to bridge what i want to say earlier.
 Il ne faut pas souligner. Elles sont toutes bonnes. (À l'exception de redgiant, je ne suis pas familier avec eux)
 si vous voulez vraiment d'en connaître tous les détails de ces earphones, vous avez obtenu de lu des choses à ce sujet, vous pouvez le trouver ici en head fi.
 il y a vraiment beaucoup de choix, de sorte que beaucoup d'entre eux qu'il est vraiment difficile de cerner ce que vous voulez sauf si vous essayez par vous-même. parce qu'à en juger d'écouteurs est quelque peu subjectif. mais ces examens vous donnera une bonne idée de ce que vous pouvez attendre d'eux.
 si j'étais vous, je reviendrais avoir tâtonné et juste obtenir un de vos choix, je sais que vous voulez le meilleur pour votre argent. et en passant, je vous recommande vsonic vsd1/s ou soundmagic e10, vous ne pouvez pas Aller mal avec eux, im assez sûr que vous apprécierez les. Bonne chance


----------



## johndu13

mdr i prefer in english !!


----------



## lisagorbin

johndu13 said:


> mdr i prefer in english !!


 
  

 you said you cant understand us because you dont speak english, i tried to find a way and now you say you prefer the conversation in english.
 i think i did everything to help you. and you are being too indecisive.


----------



## johndu13

i prefer in english but with a simply word  with punctuation 
  
 i'm complicated I'm sorry


----------



## lisagorbin

johndu13 said:


> i prefer in english but with a simply word  with punctuation
> 
> i'm complicated I'm sorry


 
 no, its alright. but still. you should not be too indecisive. as i read, most of us are recommending the vsd1s. i know you have no experience on any headphones, some of us think vsd1s is a good phone to start with. so just buy it, alright? and hopefully you will like it. im confident you will.


----------



## johndu13

i don't like a lot vsonic  because they aren't capable to update her website 
 vsonic.cn 
  
  
 they are a bad image


----------



## suman134

johndu13 said:


> i don't like a lot vsonic  because they aren't capable to update her website
> vsonic.cn
> 
> 
> they are a bad image


 
  
    then go for soundmagic e10 , they are fine , lacks the definition of vsd1/s , but still have their own fan following , or you can get the redgiants and tell us how they are . or i think brainwavz s1 can do your job , review on the home page .


----------



## H20Fidelity

SoundMAGIC E10 are an excellent little IEM.


----------



## johndu13

i like the design of redgiant but i don't know the difference with the sound magic 
  
 i think i don't take the vsonic 
 i don't like the idea  to had a website not update with the sell product


----------



## suman134

johndu13 said:


> i like the design of redgiant but i don't know the difference with the sound magic
> 
> i think i don't take the vsonic
> i don't like the idea  to had a website not update with the sell product


 
  
     thats a bit annoying , but its the way it is , take the soundmagic then . i had given a link about the redgiants , you can refer them .


----------



## johndu13

i had reading the review  but not reference to the redgiant than the sound magic  
  
 it's dommage


----------



## lisagorbin

johndu13 said:


> i had reading the review  but not reference to the redgiant than the sound magic
> 
> it's dommage


 
 i think i want to ignore you from now on, or maybe not but why did you even ask us about vsonic vsd1/s, and even ask what is the difference between the vsd1 and vsd1s, when in the end, you will say you dont like vsonic. you even put it in your choices, like you narrowed it down to vsd1 and vsd1s, i dont know if you understand this and i think i dont even care. its not that you dont speak english well but, i dont know, its your logic or common sense or just your indecisiveness. im kind of annoyed, really. you put the vsonic on your choices and then after we recommend it, you tell us you dont want it. why put it in your choices in the first place. vsonics website is not updated but their products are good. i dont think any of us will convince you to get v sonic so just go for soundmagic e10. just finish this. you want suggestions but dont take ANY of them.


----------



## johndu13

i'm difficult , i'sorry 
  
 just i don't like vsonic because  the website doesn't update
 and i found its an error importante , a bad picture of the brands
  
 i reading you , i' confirm that , but i need a lot information , i know you recommend me the vsonic , but i don't know 
 not just an answer "" take vsd1
 its exist vsd1 and vsd1S
  
 and i search again information with redgiant 
  
 sorry again


----------



## applevalleyjoe

I agree...Etymotics. However, etymotics do not produce a "rich" sound.


----------



## garcsa

johndu13 said:


> i'm difficult , i'sorry
> 
> just i don't like vsonic because  the website doesn't update
> and i found its an error importante , a bad picture of the brands
> ...


 
  
 No problem man, dont sorry, I like your uncertainty. I was something like you (before some 40 years  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 ). Just relax and buy what is most sympatic for you - and the cheapest one. You have to to start somewhere... If you dont like it just RMA it. Welcome and best wishes to this very interesting hobby!


----------



## suman134

garcsa said:


> No problem man, dont sorry, I like your uncertainty. I was something like you (before some 40 years
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
     and madly too , confusing at times , i compare it with cameras , cameras have lesser brands and less confusing , but , your most welcome , to the maddest and most demanding hobby in this world , here you can find people with hundreds of phones , and they are still asking for more .


----------



## esteebin

So Johndu13 is asking us for which IEM is recommended between Soundmagic e10, Vsonic VSD1/VSD1S and RedGiants. The unanimous vote for the VSD1S by different people and Joker himself does not jive well with them. He puts it as not a good sign that Vsonic does not keep their website up to date. But to me, it's the consumer reviews and impressions that make a company because the manufacturers will spew out market speak to sell their products.
  
 Like I posted before, He wants so see how close the Soundmagic is to the Vsonics to justify a purchase of the Soundmagic, like a numerical value that's already posted on the reviews. But we've settled with recommending him the Soundmagic with being good too- but not the best in the price range.
  
 I think the community has helped him enough. Good luck with your choices. Happy listening!


----------



## Hitesh

ljokerl said:


> Yeah I think it's a little better than VC02 and LG Quadbeat. I would estimate at least an 8.2, maybe a bit higher.
> 
> VSD1 vs VC02
> VSD1 is warmer in tone, fuller, and has more bass impact. It is also more sensitive
> VC02 is thinner, more analytical, brighter, less bass impact but also appears a touch quicker and more textured at the low end


 
 Now if you can just comment on isolation and microphonics too, that would be the icing on the cake


----------



## ljokerl

onlinepredator said:


> I've had my VSonic GR06 for almost a year now(they're my first pair of IEMs), and I honestly don't think it sounds any different from any of the earbuds I've worn over the years. The only thing I like about it, and the only difference I notice, is the isolation, which I like, however, it still isn't enough sometimes.
> So what's the best IEM for <$300, with at least a 4 for isolation, and better sound than the GR06?
> Some of the models that fit the criteria aren't on ebay or amazon, like the ACS T15, and I also want something that looks decent, so no Etymotic Research.
> How about the TripleFi 10's? They've been on the upcoming reviews for probably 3 years now, are they good?


 
  
 That's not really a lot go do on - lots of IEMs isolate well and sound better than a GR06. Something like the Yamaha EPH-100 would be a nice safe option.
  
 The TF10 has been discontinued as far as I know. It's a good earphone but the design is a little outdated at this point. 
  


hitesh said:


> Now if you can just comment on isolation and microphonics too, that would be the icing on the cake


 
  
 It's pretty much the same cable the VC02 uses. Cable noise is similar - not a problem if you wear them up over the ear. Isolation on the VSD1 is similar to GR06/GR07 and VC02.


----------



## johndu13

eestebin its right 
  
 if i don't error , the site of vsonic   are not update and i not like this 
  
 an i added , the vsd1 are more money than the sound magic .
  
  
  
 so i reading the test and the bilan 
  
 redgiant a00
  
 or soundmagic e10
  
  
 but than you anybody  for your help , maybe soon i ll take order


----------



## suman134

johndu13 said:


> eestebin its right
> 
> if i don't error , the site of vsonic   are not update and i not like this
> 
> ...


 
  
      i order you to buy the soundmagic e10 .
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . cuz i dont know about the redgiant .


----------



## MoonYeol

Vsonic  such a good brand. Too bad you don't feel like you can trust them based on a website that's outdated. I bought GR07 used, then a pair of new GR07mkII just because they're worth having. Also bought a pair of VC02 which are awesome value. Going to buy VSD1(S) later just to hear how much sound you can get with <$50. It's insane really. My brief audition with E10 made them feel like McDonalds vs a home cooked traditional Bolognese with freshly made pasta. That's how I feel about Vsonic vs E10.


----------



## OnlinePredator

ljokerl said:


> onlinepredator said:
> 
> 
> > I've had my VSonic GR06 for almost a year now(they're my first pair of IEMs), and I honestly don't think it sounds any different from any of the earbuds I've worn over the years. The only thing I like about it, and the only difference I notice, is the isolation, which I like, however, it still isn't enough sometimes.
> ...


 
 It's still on ebay and amazon though. What do you mean the design is outdated?
  


lisagorbin said:


> onlinepredator said:
> 
> 
> > I've had my VSonic GR06 for almost a year now(they're my first pair of IEMs), and I honestly don't think it sounds any different from any of the earbuds I've worn over the years. The only thing I like about it, and the only difference I notice, is the isolation, which I like, however, it still isn't enough sometimes.
> ...


 
 Yeah, like the Apple ones.


----------



## lisagorbin

> Yeah, like the Apple ones.


 
 do you still have the apple earbuds? or at least can you borrow one? because i believe if you compare the gr06 and the apple earbuds side by side, you'll notice the difference, even if you dont notice the difference in quality, youll notice that the gr06 has a different presentation. im not at all an audiophile but before you upgrade to a pricier iem, maybe try to find the difference between the gr06 and he apple earbuds. im just saying this because i have gr06 and compared to the apple earbude i have, gr06 is better.

 be sure that you have a good seal on those gr06.


----------



## justblue

ljokerl said:


> I agree with you though, and the RE-400 would probably be my #1 choice in the price range if I had to pick just one earphone.


 
  
 So which earphones do you use most often and like best?


----------



## Fordy314

shotgunshane said:


> I hope you get a chance to review the Brainwavz Delta. Truly a new budget benchmark at $20 and a new rival to Soundmagic's SQ value.


 
 Another vote for the Delta review. I'd love to know how they stack up in the price range.


----------



## ljokerl

onlinepredator said:


> It's still on ebay and amazon though. What do you mean the design is outdated?


 
  
 It's big and not very ergonomic. I've never had an easy time with its fit. The UE900 model that replaced it is better in this regard.
  


justblue said:


> So which earphones do you use most often and like best?


 
  
 I probably use my UE600 the most just because it's my phone headset. 
  
 Specifically for music my favorite is the JH13Pro FP but I use whatever customs I'm reviewing at the time more often. I also use the RE-400 and GR07 quite a bit as my grab-and-go universals. 
  


fordy314 said:


> Another vote for the Delta review. I'd love to know how they stack up in the price range.


 
  
 Noted!


----------



## hobbyone

The LG Quadbeat 2 is already for sale on ebay for *~*40 bucks. Measurements can be found on Goldenars.
  
 And there is another LG headset: LG GS100. No info about that IEM on the internet.


----------



## docked seaman

ljoker how would you compair the Audeo PFE 122 and the Vsonic gr07BE. you seem to have givin the vsonics higher ratings, wondering why?  am i wrong that they sound sonicly similar?


----------



## ljokerl

hobbyone said:


> The LG Quadbeat 2 is already for sale on ebay for *~*40 bucks. Measurements can be found on Goldenars.
> 
> And there is another LG headset: LG GS100. No info about that IEM on the internet.


 
  
 That looks nice! Guess I have to get my hands on the Quadbeat 2 now. 
  


docked seaman said:


> ljoker how would you compair the Audeo PFE 122 and the Vsonic gr07BE. you seem to have givin the vsonics higher ratings, wondering why?  am i wrong that they sound sonicly similar?


 
  
 It depends on the filter you use. If you're using the Audeo with the gray filter (the one I like), it'll be brighter (and less natural in tone) than the GR07BE and definitely won't have the bass punch/impact of the VSonics. Definitely not a night and day difference, though.
  
 If you use the PFE with the green filter, you'll have the bass but the clarity and overall performance would not touch the VSonics.


----------



## lin0003

Hey ljokerl, I recently bought the Astrotec AX7 and I was wondering why you don't like itnas much as other TWFK driver IEMs? It is overall my favourite TWFK IEM. 
 Also, someone told me that you thought that it was brighter than the other TWFKs? 
 Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

lin0003 said:


> Hey ljokerl, I recently bought the Astrotec AX7 and I was wondering why you don't like itnas much as other TWFK driver IEMs? It is overall my favourite TWFK IEM.
> Also, someone told me that you thought that it was brighter than the other TWFKs?
> Thanks.


 
  
 The tuning is odd - it has a lot of treble energy and but not enough thickness/note sustainment to support it. It even sounds thinner and less impactful than the VC1000. Using the alternate filters makes it worse. It's not terrible but it doesn't sound natural next to the VC1000 or DBA-02 mkII. 
  
 Plus, both of my units have had a mild (but noticeable) channel imbalance.


----------



## lin0003

ljokerl said:


> The tuning is odd - it has a lot of treble energy and but not enough thickness/note sustainment to support it. It even sounds thinner and less impactful than the VC1000. Using the alternate filters makes it worse. It's not terrible but it doesn't sound natural next to the VC1000 or DBA-02 mkII.
> 
> Plus, both of my units have had a mild (but noticeable) channel imbalance.


 
  
 Is it maybe possible that yours is defective? Mine is a bit thicker than even the DBA-02 MKII.


----------



## vicaya

johndu13 said:


> i don't like a lot vsonic  because they aren't capable to update her website
> vsonic.cn
> 
> 
> they are a bad image


 
 vsonic.cn is a parked domain. vsonic.com is the official website.


----------



## johndu13

it's the same website !!!

gr01/06/07 

not vc1000
not vc02
not…


not ….


----------



## MoonYeol

In my opinion. Still not enough to ignore the wonderful in ears from Vsonic. But as someone said. We have said what we can, nobody can force you. But I think that you will have a hard time finding a lot of people who are not satisfied with their Vsonic iems compared to what they paid for them. Maybe the feel (like I do) that they don't NEED their VC02 and that they don't USE them. But I think that they still think they are great performance for the money. But good luck with whatever you choose. Vsonic is a company that I trust produces good in ears. If they work and if the sellers handle returns and warranty in a good way, I don't care about their website at all.


----------



## Emre9110

Astrotec Am-90 Or Auidio Technica cks55x which one is the best. They are same price.


----------



## suman134

emre9110 said:


> Astrotec Am-90 Or Auidio Technica cks55x which one is the best. They are same price.


 
  
     both are hugely different phones , what you want ? can you do with lesser amount of bass , do you like clarity and precision ? go for am-90 , if you want bolted mid bass and you dont care about mids and definition go for cks55x .


----------



## ljokerl

lin0003 said:


> Is it maybe possible that yours is defective? Mine is a bit thicker than even the DBA-02 MKII.


 
  
 Yeah that's what I thought. I got it replaced and the second one was almost exactly the same. Measurements of my second one should be on InnerFidelity.
  
 Anyway, it's not a bad earphone and the build quality is fantastic but I'd rather listen to the VC1000 or even GR01. 
  


emre9110 said:


> Astrotec Am-90 Or Auidio Technica cks55x which one is the best. They are same price.


 
  
 Never heard the CKS55x but from what I understand of the ATH lineup, suman is right.


----------



## shakur1996

joker, when you will post your impressions on Custom Art Music One?


----------



## lin0003

ljokerl said:


> Yeah that's what I thought. I got it replaced and the second one was almost exactly the same. Measurements of my second one should be on InnerFidelity.
> 
> Anyway, it's not a bad earphone and the build quality is fantastic but I'd rather listen to the VC1000 or even GR01.
> 
> ...


Right, thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

shakur1996 said:


> joker, when you will post your impressions on Custom Art Music One?


 
  
 In a few weeks. They're in the queue, should be around #300 posted.


----------



## ljokerl

Added SteelSeries Flux In-Ear & Flux In-Ear Pro. One more 10/10 with the Flux! 
  


> *(3A83) SteelSeries Flux In-Ear *
> 
> 
> Added September 2013
> ...


----------



## papijoe08

Steelseries in ear caught my interest  Thanks for the info and detailed review joker! cheers will grab one asap!


----------



## Tommy C

@ ljokerl

Thanks for the great reviews!


----------



## NimbleRabit

I'm looking for an iem to complement my current pair, Audio Technica CK10's. While I'm really happy with these and literally use them for hours a day, I would like to have something different available at times. I also sometimes feel the ck10's timbre and decay make things sound a bit unnatural, especially cellos and violins (of course those are the instruments I'm most familiar with). 

Would you have any specific recommendations for something to go along with a ck10? Looking through your reviews I was considering the re400 since it's a dynamic and a little warmer, but I'm worried that might be too similar. Is the sound pretty different from the ck10 or should I be looking in another direction altogether?


----------



## muzikfrrrik

I'm looking for a pair of iems that have neutral bass, very fluid and non-sibilant highs and great detail in the price range of 160$. If there's nothing along these lines in this price range something first above it that meet the requirements. I'd also like to mention that I find phonak audeo ofe 112 with grey filters or etymotic hf3 to generate sibilance and sound harsh at times. Any recommendations?


----------



## shotgunshane

nimblerabit said:


> I'm looking for an iem to complement my current pair, Audio Technica CK10's. While I'm really happy with these and literally use them for hours a day, I would like to have something different available at times. I also sometimes feel the ck10's timbre and decay make things sound a bit unnatural, especially cellos and violins (of course those are the instruments I'm most familiar with).
> 
> Would you have any specific recommendations for something to go along with a ck10? Looking through your reviews I was considering the re400 since it's a dynamic and a little warmer, but I'm worried that might be too similar. Is the sound pretty different from the ck10 or should I be looking in another direction altogether?




They are not too similar. The RE400 would be my suggestion. It's on the warmer side of neutral, whereas the ck10 can be a bit on the bright side of neutral; and is much more polite with longer decay than the ck10. Also it's petty tiny in its own right. It should be a very nice compliment. 

I don't think you'd want to go excessively warm and bassy. Maybe something more mid centric might be fun, like the discontinued re262...


----------



## MoonYeol

muzikfrrrik said:


> I'm looking for a pair of iems that have neutral bass, very fluid and non-sibilant highs and great detail in the price range of 160$. If there's nothing along these lines in this price range something first above it that meet the requirements. I'd also like to mention that I find phonak audeo ofe 112 with grey filters or etymotic hf3 to generate sibilance and sound harsh at times. Any recommendations?




I find that Rockit R-50 with comply tips and an impedance adapter (should be included), sounds very smooth up top with neutral bass. Stock tips are horrible and sibilant. For me the comply tips are a must. Might take away too much but I've found that I like the less peaky and very smooth sounding treble which to me sounds more detailed however less prominent. I can strongly recommend it.


----------



## ljokerl

papijoe08 said:


> Steelseries in ear caught my interest  Thanks for the info and detailed review joker! cheers will grab one asap!


 
  
 Hope you like 'em - they really hit the spot for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


tommy c said:


> @ ljokerl
> 
> Thanks for the great reviews!


 




  


nimblerabit said:


> I'm looking for an iem to complement my current pair, Audio Technica CK10's. While I'm really happy with these and literally use them for hours a day, I would like to have something different available at times. I also sometimes feel the ck10's timbre and decay make things sound a bit unnatural, especially cellos and violins (of course those are the instruments I'm most familiar with).
> 
> Would you have any specific recommendations for something to go along with a ck10? Looking through your reviews I was considering the re400 since it's a dynamic and a little warmer, but I'm worried that might be too similar. Is the sound pretty different from the ck10 or should I be looking in another direction altogether?


 
  
 I agree with shotgunshane - the RE-400 is a good match. Who knows, you might even like its take on "neutral" better than that of the CK10s, and it's not all that expensive. 
  


muzikfrrrik said:


> I'm looking for a pair of iems that have neutral bass, very fluid and non-sibilant highs and great detail in the price range of 160$. If there's nothing along these lines in this price range something first above it that meet the requirements. I'd also like to mention that I find phonak audeo ofe 112 with grey filters or etymotic hf3 to generate sibilance and sound harsh at times. Any recommendations?


 
  
 HiFiMan RE-400 should be a good fit. Its treble is rather polite despite it being a balanced-sounding earphone.


----------



## Amitl

With the new Flux review...i was wondering:
 just how much is the cable better than the MH1C's?
 what bothered me most about the Sonys' cable wasn't the J-cord config.,
 but the behavior of the cable itself. even if i use the cable clip,
 and the tips seal my ears with suction, any movement of the head
 causes horrendous cable noise and the phones slip out of my ears!
 so i was wondering if the Flux has a better cable...
 Thank you Joker !!


----------



## SyCo87

I was just going to purchase the Vsonic VDS1's until I came across your review of the SteelSeries Flux In-ear IEMs. How would you compare the two(which one has a better soundstage[depth and width])? I have the Quadbeats and I would prefer something that's similar to it sound signature wise. Also, I would also like to add that I listen to Rap, R&B, Pop (mostly female voalist's), jazz with a little country mixed in so I'd prefer the more versatile one of the two.


----------



## ljokerl

amitl said:


> With the new Flux review...i was wondering:
> just how much is the cable better than the MH1C's?
> what bothered me most about the Sonys' cable wasn't the J-cord config.,
> but the behavior of the cable itself. even if i use the cable clip,
> ...


 
  
 Honestly, the cable quality is not that different - the biggest difference is that the MH1C cable is thicker and more stiff while the Flux cable is soft and flexible. If you're going to wear them cord-down the cable will still be noisy.
  


syco87 said:


> I was just going to purchase the Vsonic VDS1's until I came across your review of the SteelSeries Flux In-ear IEMs. How would you compare the two(which one has a better soundstage[depth and width])? I have the Quadbeats and I would prefer something that's similar to it sound signature wise. Also, I would also like to add that I listen to Rap, R&B, Pop (mostly female voalist's), jazz with a little country mixed in so I'd prefer the more versatile one of the two.


 
  
 The Flux is a little warmer and more smooth than the VSD1, but not quite as wide in terms of presentation. Compared to the Quadbeat, the Flux has more solid bass and sounds thicker and richer but again doesn't have the soundstage size of the LG. If that's what you're after, the VSD1S would be a better option, probably.


----------



## muzikfrrrik

> HiFiMan RE-400 should be a good fit. Its treble is rather polite despite it being a balanced-sounding earphone.


 
  
 And if you were to recommend a pair that has BAs what would it be?


----------



## ljokerl

muzikfrrrik said:


> And if you were to recommend a pair that has BAs what would it be?


 
  
 UE600 or maybe the SteelSeries Flux Pro. Both have slightly laid-back treble compared to gray-filtered Phonaks and Etys.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> UE600 or maybe the SteelSeries Flux Pro. Both have slightly laid-back treble compared to gray-filtered Phonaks and Etys.


 
  
       ue 600 , my fav single ba phone , any day .


----------



## n0str3ss

Where could you get ue600 in europe for a reasonable price?


----------



## Amitl

anything in tier 3a beyond the Xears TDIII is currently off site


----------



## kova4a

n0str3ss said:


> Where could you get ue600 in europe for a reasonable price?


 
  
 Well, the German Amazon http://www.amazon.de/Ultimate-Ears-985-000200-600-In-Ear-Kopfh%C3%B6rer/dp/B004WIUL0U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1380295981&sr=8-1&keywords=ultimate+ears+ue600


----------



## ljokerl

amitl said:


> anything in tier 3a beyond the Xears TDIII is currently off site


 
  
 Yes, that post has hit some sort of limit. It's now doing all sorts of weird things. Every time I edit it a little more seems to disappear. I'm working on transferring the reviews here from my backup copy.
  


kova4a said:


> Well, the German Amazon http://www.amazon.de/Ultimate-Ears-985-000200-600-In-Ear-Kopfh%C3%B6rer/dp/B004WIUL0U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1380295981&sr=8-1&keywords=ultimate+ears+ue600


 
  
 Wow, that's some awful reviews.


----------



## n0str3ss

ljokerl said:


> Yes, that post has hit some sort of limit. It's now doing all sorts of weird things. Every time I edit it a little more seems to disappear. I'm working on transferring the reviews here from my backup copy.
> 
> 
> Wow, that's some awful reviews.


 
 Should I be worried about possibly being fakes? I don't know what kind of fakes are in the market right now.


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> Wow, that's some awful reviews.


 
 Well, there aren't that many reviews to begin with. The US amazon has way more reviews and thus actually more bad reviews than the German.


----------



## bhazard

Would love to see some impressions from Joker on Somic earphones. The headphones that I have from them are top notch, along with being very inexpensive for the sound. The $20 MH401 earphones I just got from them punch well above their price point.
  
 These seem to be the newest and best so far:
 MH401 - "moving iron" dynamic -$20
 MH407 - balanced armature -$60


----------



## ljokerl

n0str3ss said:


> Should I be worried about possibly being fakes? I don't know what kind of fakes are in the market right now.


 

 Not sure if there are any fakes of this model. I haven't heard of any.
  
  


kova4a said:


> Well, there aren't that many reviews to begin with. The US amazon has way more reviews and thus actually more bad reviews than the German.


 
  
 Yeah, it's not the number of reviews but the ratio of bad to good that surprised me. I know UE products don't do that bad on amazon US.
  


bhazard said:


> Would love to see some impressions from Joker on Somic earphones. The headphones that I have from them are top notch, along with being very inexpensive for the sound. The $20 MH401 earphones I just got from them punch well above their price point.
> 
> These seem to be the newest and best so far:
> MH401 - "moving iron" dynamic -$20
> MH407 - balanced armature -$60


 
  
 "moving iron" as in conventional dynamic driver? 
  
 Anyway, I've heard of them before but never got a chance to try their stuff. Will keep them in mind.


----------



## FlySweep

ljokerl said:


> "moving iron" as in conventional dynamic driver?


 
  
 I read that as probably being a "moving armature".. like the e-Q5.


----------



## Inks

Moving iron is just your run of the mill BA.


----------



## tomscy2000

In Chinese, people informally refer to 'moving iron' (動鐵, 动铁) as balanced armature (平衡電樞, 平衡电枢), and 'moving coil' (or rather 'moving loop', 動圈, 动圈) as dynamic. Something got lost in translation there.


----------



## Inks

Yup, moving iron=BA, moving coil=Dynamic. Yeah definitely not a MA.


----------



## n0str3ss

Amazon reviews can be pretty random, and usually in this kind of items they only check if the sound is decent and thats enough for the everyday John. They usually rate the visuals not the actual sound of the iem, it is a very superficial rating about looks, build materials...


----------



## suman134

kova4a said:


> Well, the German Amazon http://www.amazon.de/Ultimate-Ears-985-000200-600-In-Ear-Kopfh%C3%B6rer/dp/B004WIUL0U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1380295981&sr=8-1&keywords=ultimate+ears+ue600


 
  
      dont worry man , ue600 is my personal favorite single ba phone , if you can get a good seal , you can enjoy the blissful music . and its really cheap .
   i dont think there are knock offs of this phone , but they can be refurbished , but i doubt it too .
   the first one with 11/11 helpful is just not fair , he says hes coming from etys , complaining about bass , etys dont even have the bass as ue600 , i have a er-4pt , i know how they sound .
   these reviews are just rogue .


----------



## n0str3ss

Yeah you are quite right man.


----------



## Adel

Hello all members on Head-fi and great thread and reviews.
  
 I am considering buying either monster turbines pro copper or gold but i am a bit confused about which one to choose. The main music genres i listen to is rap, hip hop and techno which requires a lot of bass(basshead). I dont have the right amount of knowledge to tell how i like the the low, mids and highs to be but i want a lot of bass but without lacking/destorying the soundstage/Accurasity. I have readed alot of reviews on both and i have  find the copper to have bass but also more accurate than the gold but i am just afraid that they are less bassy than how i want them to be. 
 actually i was thinking about buying the copper but i am confused and afraid if it does not meet my requirments.
 which one do you think i should choose and will be perfect for my music taste forgot to say that i am going to use the Iems with my iphone 4s
  
 -best regards Adel


----------



## ljokerl

adel said:


> Hello all members on Head-fi and great thread and reviews.
> 
> I am considering buying either monster turbines pro copper or gold but i am a bit confused about which one to choose. The main music genres i listen to is rap, hip hop and techno which requires a lot of bass(basshead). I dont have the right amount of knowledge to tell how i like the the low, mids and highs to be but i want a lot of bass but without lacking/destorying the soundstage/Accurasity. I have readed alot of reviews on both and i have  find the copper to have bass but also more accurate than the gold but i am just afraid that they are less bassy than how i want them to be.
> actually i was thinking about buying the copper but i am confused and afraid if it does not meet my requirments.
> ...


 
  
 How come you're picking between these two? They've been around for a while and I think you can do better for the money these days. For example, I would pick a Yamaha EPH-100 over either. 
  
 Anyway, the Copper and Gold are pretty similar. The gold is smoother and warmer while the copper is a little more balanced. Not a big difference, though - just get whichever is cheaper.


----------



## n0str3ss

Which would be some good iems under the 135$ mark with a warm sound signature and good for vocals?


----------



## Artem

Gr07 bass edition/Mk2 will probably fit your budget. It has a nice warm signature, but as for vocals, I'm not too sure. They are great all-rounders to me at least.


----------



## Adel

> Originally Posted by ljokerl
> 
> How come you're picking between these two? They've been around for a while and I think you can do better for the money these days. For example, I would pick a Yamaha EPH-100 over either.
> 
> Anyway, the Copper and Gold are pretty similar. The gold is smoother and warmer while the copper is a little more balanced. Not a big difference, though - just get whichever is cheaper.


 
  
 thanks for your answer and suggestions. I a
 cutally dont have so much knowledge about soundquality and how i like the low and mid and high to be. I saw the coppers and i have readed good reviews as i understand theese are maybe getting old? also that i can get the choppers for 149 pound brand new from amazon in Uk. The seller got great rating and reviews but i am waiting for pictures of the package from the so i can compare it and see if it fake or not beside that i am open for all sugestions i do like the design or shape of the in ear to be like the coppers or gold. I do like the design of the yamaha so i am going to check them out thanks


----------



## Zalithian

n0str3ss said:


> Which would be some good iems under the 135$ mark with a warm sound signature and good for vocals?


 
  
 GR07 MK2 and BA200


----------



## n0str3ss

Nice options, let's see now if I can find them in Europe at a reasonable price.


----------



## Zelda

n0str3ss said:


> Nice options, let's see now if I can find them in Europe at* a reasonable pric*e.


 
  
 ^ the GR07 MK2 and BE from LMUE at $130


----------



## n0str3ss

But since they are based outside of Europe I would have to pay taxes what would inflate the price, it would be nice if they had european warehouse.


----------



## Zalithian

n0str3ss said:


> Nice options, let's see now if I can find them in Europe at a reasonable price.


 
  
 Yep the GR07 from Lend me ur ears is probably your best bet in terms of price. The BA200 is quite expensive in Europe it seems. The GR07 isn't too badly priced at Amazon.UK


----------



## kova4a

zalithian said:


> Yep the GR07 from Lend me ur ears is probably your best bet in terms of price. The BA200 is quite expensive in Europe it seems. The GR07 isn't too badly priced at Amazon.UK


 
  
 Well, not too badly price is like the original Gr07 price. Anyway, I'm in Europe and I never had to pay taxes on stuff from Lendmeurears. The list very low prices on the package and as the weight is pretty low - like 300 grams or so such packages usually pass through the customs without a thorough check. Of course, there's always a chance a package is held at the customs


----------



## MoonYeol

You can always ask them to put some lower value on the package. Check the taxes and tolls for your country. Gr07 mkII are great overall but I don't know if they are great for vocals in particular. I feel that they are more balanced in that they don't emphasize any part but instead let you listen to the music as a whole. But great all rounder.


----------



## kova4a

They put low price on their own, you don't have to ask them. I think last time it was like $0.98 or something LOL A lot of sellers put low prices but like 15-20 bucks. LMUE takes it to a different level with the prices the put on the packages


----------



## Tommy C

kova4a said:


> They put low price on their own, you don't have to ask them. I think last time it was like $0.98 or something LOL A lot of sellers put low prices but like 15-20 bucks. LMUE takes it to a different level with the prices the put on the packages


 
  
 The problem with this is that in case it gets lost or stolen in the mail you are not insured.


----------



## kova4a

tommy c said:


> The problem with this is that in case it gets lost or stolen in the mail you are not insured.


 
  
 Well, you're not insured anyway. None of all these Asian sellers is collecting money for insuring the packages or providing such an option but if you don't receive a package the reputable sellers usually send a new package. And if the package is stolen or lost in your post office then good luck making the post office pay for it even if it has the real price on it. Hell, they won't pay even that $0.98. Actually I worry much more when the price is the real one coz this is something that someone may spot and make him steal the package and otherwise the insane taxes are draining my wallet.


----------



## Tommy C

kova4a said:


> Well, you're not insured anyway. None of all these Asian sellers is collecting money for insuring the packages or providing such an option but if you don't receive a package the reputable sellers usually send a new package. And if the package is stolen or lost in your post office then good luck making the post office pay for it even if it has the real price on it. Hell, they won't pay even that $0.98. Actually I worry much more when the price is the real one coz this is something that someone may spot and make him steal the package and otherwise the insane taxes are draining my wallet.


 
  
 I won't buy anything above $50 if I cannot get it insured tbh. I buy watches from Japan and Singapore and they do insure their packages that they ship with fedex or regular post.  Just thought people should know this before they drop a couple of hundreds on something that may or may not reach to them.


----------



## kova4a

Nah, as I said these sellers usually send you a new package if something happens. There are destinations they won't ship to if they had previous issues with missing packages but that's it. Almost evеryone on head-fi is buying vsonic iems from LMUE without any issues.
 And yeah, fedex, dhl, usps packages and such are usually insured but I try to avoid them as much as hell coz not only do I get to deal with the customs on my own but I have to pay all the taxes - even VAT on the shipping cost. Seriously, when my BH amp arrived I ended up paying close to $60 for taxes and that's just because I told DHL I'll deal with the customs on my own, so I didn't pay them brokerage fees and I convinced the clerks to not pay VAT on the shipping coz I didn't pay for it otherwise I would have ended paying like $90. Now, I don't know about you but paying $90 more to receive your $100 amp is obscene.


----------



## Tommy C

kova4a said:


> Nah, as I said these sellers usually send you a new package if something happens. There are destinations they won't ship to if they had previous issues with missing packages but that's it. Almost evеryone on head-fi is buying vsonic iems from LMUE without any issues.
> And yeah, fedex, dhl, usps packages and such are usually insured but I try to avoid them as much as hell coz not only do I get to deal with the customs on my own but I have to pay all the taxes - even VAT on the shipping cost. Seriously, when my BH amp arrived I ended up paying close to $60 for taxes and that's just because I told DHL I'll deal with the customs on my own, so I didn't pay them brokerage fees and I convinced the clerks to not pay VAT on the shipping coz I didn't pay for it otherwise I would have ended paying like $90. Now, I don't know about you but paying $90 more to receive your $100 amp is obscene.


 
  
 I hear you. I live in Canada so I guess my experience is different. Brokerage fee of DHL is $10 + tax which is a few $$$ more and I never got charged with fedex. Having said that though, I bought multiple items from china through ebay and not all of f them arrived. They were cheap so I didn't bother with insurance. Some refunded me and some didn't. Just the other day I was reading here that someone ordered earphones and when he opened the box the earphones were missing. No go figure how you prove them that they were stolen.... it's a headache.


----------



## kova4a

Well, I think we kinda flooded this thread with offtopic but I have to say that in this case it's not about some random Chinese sellers on ebay - we're talking about reputable sellers, which in the case of LMUE may take their sweet time to respond and communicate but they always come through and people get their goods.


----------



## Emre9110

http://www.ebay.com/itm/LG-HSS-F530-W-earphones-QuadBeat2-Built-in-microphone-For-Smartphone-White-/221289843422?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item3385e70ade
  
 How about this ? I couldn't find any review. New Quick Beat2.


----------



## T.R.A.N.C.E.

Ljokerl could you possibly compare the Hisound Wooduo 2 and the Atrio MG7 for me? I Listen  to electronic music mostly, but I like a lively sound as well as strong deep bass. An option I've been thinking of also is getting the JVC FXT90 and equing the bass up, how would that compare to the bassy phones?


----------



## Adel

Other who can help me and answer my question at page 774


----------



## n0str3ss

kova4a said:


> Well, I think we kinda flooded this thread with offtopic but I have to say that in this case it's not about some random Chinese sellers on ebay - we're talking about reputable sellers, which in the case of LMUE may take their sweet time to respond and communicate but they always come through and people get their goods.


 
 Off-topic: In Portugal the customs problems is much much worse. You have to pay taxes from every item above 40€  or if the package is above 200gr and the little tag with the price one in does´t mean **** to them, if they feel like the item is more expensive than the price indicated they will held the package until you deliver them a buy proof, and as you can imagine that will end with you paying the value of the item 2 times.
  
 Another interesting thing is if you a member of you familily ships to you a pair of glasses they owned, guitar chords,.... if you don´t give them a payment proof you will have to pay the taxes even if you bought the item 10 years agol... Sick customs in here.
  
 On-topic: It will be a pain in the ass to get some good iems, with the signature I like for a decent price.


----------



## kova4a

n0str3ss said:


> Off-topic: In Portugal the customs problems is much much worse. You have to pay taxes from every item above 40€  or if the package is above 200gr and the little tag with the price one in does´t mean **** to them, if they feel like the item is more expensive than the price indicated they will held the package until you deliver them a buy proof, and as you can imagine that will end with you paying the value of the item 2 times.
> 
> Another interesting thing is if you a member of you familily ships to you a pair of glasses they owned, guitar chords,.... if you don´t give them a payment proof you will have to pay the taxes even if you bought the item 10 years agol... Sick customs in here.
> 
> On-topic: It will be a pain in the ass to get some good iems, with the signature I like for a decent price.


 
  
 Nah, everyone always thinks he has it worse. I have to pay taxes on anything that costs more than 15 euro. And this are iems, the package is super light and even if they open it, they'll see a cheap cardboard box with Chinese symbols and tacky colored tips - I doubt they'll be thinking this package costs a lot. Anyway, it's your choice. I was worried like you before but then I overcame it and now I enjoy good audio products that I want instead of settling for something I can buy locally. 
 You can always go for something like the vsonic VSD1 or VSD1S. They are not on gr07's level but are very very good and a great bang for the buck at 1/3 of gr07's price.


----------



## T.R.A.N.C.E.

t.r.a.n.c.e. said:


> Ljokerl could you possibly compare the Hisound Wooduo 2 and the Atrio MG7 for me? I Listen  to electronic music mostly, but I like a lively sound as well as strong deep bass. An option I've been thinking of also is getting the JVC FXT90 and equing the bass up, how would that compare to the bassy phones?


 
  
 Nevermind, I have just discovered the JVC FXZ100, which are FXT90's with a third driver, a subwoofer!, strapped to them. Basshead heaven here I come! Although I will get the higher FXZ200 model as it is improved all round.


----------



## kova4a

t.r.a.n.c.e. said:


> Nevermind, I have just discovered the JVC FXZ100, which are FXT90's with a third driver, a subwoofer!, strapped to them. Basshead heaven here I come! Although I will get the higher FXZ200 model as it is improved all round.


 
  
 You might wanna go to the Discovery thread and consult with the other bassheads over there coz there have been a whole bunch of new hyped iems after the fxz100/200


----------



## n0str3ss

kova4a said:


> Nah, everyone always thinks he has it worse. I have to pay taxes on anything that costs more than 15 euro. And this are iems, the package is super light and even if they open it, they'll see a cheap cardboard box with Chinese symbols and tacky colored tips - I doubt they'll be thinking this package costs a lot. Anyway, it's your choice. I was worried like you before but then I overcame it and now I enjoy good audio products that I want instead of settling for something I can buy locally.
> You can always go for something like the vsonic VSD1 or VSD1S. They are not on gr07's level but are very very good and a great bang for the buck at 1/3 of gr07's price.


 
 Yeah, I think I am gonna take the risk and order the gr07 since this kinda hobby is still uncharted territory in my country and no one buys iem/earphones for more than 10 euros, hope everything will end up well.


----------



## stimer

I think vsd more balanced then gr07 I would not overpay 100$, better take a good armature.


----------



## n0str3ss

You guys sure like to confuse me, I think I am gonna buy a low end bang for the buck iem and wait for the new generation of vsonics. Now I saw a few other options in this level, such as ue 600, vsd1 and the brainwavz s1. Which do you guys think it will suit better for a warm, good in lows signature but not bassy signature and that performs well with vocals and symphonics?


----------



## stimer

n0str3ss said:


> You guys sure like to confuse me, I think I am gonna buy a low end bang for the buck iem and wait for the new generation of vsonics. Now I saw a few other options in this level, such as ue 600, vsd1 and the brainwavz s1. Which do you guys think it will suit better for a warm, good in lows signature but not bassy signature and that performs well with vocals and symphonics?


 
  
 brainwavz S1 new model not enough reviews, look cheap and bulky. Vsd1 have a good midbass more than gr02be or gr07be, but not enough subbass extension like gr02be, the sound is very balanced, look neat and even have something premium.


----------



## xpok

I am looking for IEMs with great bass. I cant find new Future Sonics Atrio M8.
 Whats the difference between M8, M7 and M5? 
 Mabye there is something new in these price range with good bass and good isolatnion?


----------



## suman134

n0str3ss said:


> You guys sure like to confuse me, I think I am gonna buy a low end bang for the buck iem and wait for the new generation of vsonics. Now I saw a few other options in this level, such as ue 600, vsd1 and the brainwavz s1. Which do you guys think it will suit better for a warm, good in lows signature but not bassy signature and that performs well with vocals and symphonics?


 
  
      close your eyes , and get the ue600 .


----------



## n0str3ss

stimer said:


> brainwavz S1 new model not enough reviews, look cheap and bulky. Vsd1 have a good midbass more than gr02be or gr07be, but not enough subbass extension like gr02be, the sound is very balanced, look neat and even have something premium.


 
  
  


suman134 said:


> close your eyes , and get the ue600 .


 
  
 The confusion right now is overwhelming


----------



## stimer

n0str3ss said:


> The confusion right now is overwhelming


 
  
 I have not heard ue600 but comparing vsd1 and gr07be I realized that overpay 100$ there is no sense, vsd1 to me to be more balanced. You have to listen to both models and your ears decide what to take.


----------



## ljokerl

Forgot to mention that the abridged buyer's guide has been updated with the SteelSeries Flux taking the place of the HiSoundAudio Crystal. 
  
 The review queue at the front of this thread has also been updated.
  


n0str3ss said:


> Which would be some good iems under the 135$ mark with a warm sound signature and good for vocals?


 
  
 JVC HA-FXT90 is pretty good with a non-recessed vocal presentation and good bass. It's now around $100 on ebay. The Shure SE215 is another option. The RHA MA-750 is sounding promising so far but I'm not sure what the price is on it outside of the UK.
  


emre9110 said:


> http://www.ebay.com/itm/LG-HSS-F530-W-earphones-QuadBeat2-Built-in-microphone-For-Smartphone-White-/221289843422?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item3385e70ade
> 
> How about this ? I couldn't find any review. New *Quick Beat2*.


 
  
 Quadbeat 2. It's brand new. I haven't heard it (yet).
  


xpok said:


> I am looking for IEMs with great bass. I cant find new Future Sonics Atrio M8.
> Whats the difference between M8, M7 and M5?
> Mabye there is something new in these price range with good bass and good isolatnion?


 
  
 If I remember correctly those are just the different colors. M8 = blue, M5 = black, etc. I think it's still a great option for bass and isolation. The Yamaha EPH-100 would be another.


----------



## xD4rkFire

Which sub-$60 IEMs would be suitable for electronic/synth and female vocals? (artists such as Chvrches and Purity Ring for example)


----------



## Emre9110

ljokerl said:


> Forgot to mention that the abridged buyer's guide has been updated with the SteelSeries Flux taking the place of the HiSoundAudio Crystal.
> 
> The review queue at the front of this thread has also been updated.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah you are right quadbeat 2  It is LG G2's headphone. It has 3 buttons. But need to test it. There is no review on the internet.


----------



## peter123

xd4rkfire said:


> Which sub-$60 IEMs would be suitable for electronic/synth and female vocals? (artists such as Chvrches and Purity Ring for example)




The Monster Gratitudes are currently $59 on Amazon. They're a steal at that price and great for your kind of music.


----------



## xD4rkFire

peter123 said:


> The Monster Gratitudes are currently $59 on Amazon. They're a steal at that price and great for your kind of music.


 
  
 Can't seem to find much information on the Gratitudes and Monster doesn't exactly have a good track record. 
  
 I thought about it and I actually would say I don't want to spend more than $35 on IEMs


----------



## jekostas

xd4rkfire said:


> Can't seem to find much information on the Gratitudes and Monster doesn't exactly have a good track record.
> 
> I thought about it and I actually would say I don't want to spend more than $35 on IEMs


 
  
 ********.  Monster makes a number of very good headphones and the Gratitudes/Yao Solars definitely fall in that category.


----------



## ljokerl

Heads up for anyone who wants a great cheap in-ear - the PNY Uptown is down to $8.99 on the official site: http://www3.pny.com/category_buymulti.aspx?Category_ID=514 . Not sure about shipping costs but this is one of the best earphones for the money - better than tons of other sub-$50 sets. 
  


xd4rkfire said:


> Can't seem to find much information on the Gratitudes and Monster doesn't exactly have a good track record.
> 
> I thought about it and I actually would say I don't want to spend more than $35 on IEMs


 
  
 Something warm and smooth, with mids that aren't too recessed, would be a safe choice. Dunu Trident, Sony MH1C, even the PNYs mentioned above.


----------



## DannyBai

ljokerl said:


> Heads up for anyone who wants a great cheap in-ear - the PNY Uptown is down to $8.99 on the official site: http://www3.pny.com/category_buymulti.aspx?Category_ID=514 . Not sure about shipping costs but this is one of the best earphones for the money - better than tons of other sub-$50
> 
> 
> *$10.15 shipping. Ouch!*


----------



## xD4rkFire

dannybai said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > Heads up for anyone who wants a great cheap in-ear - the PNY Uptown is down to $8.99 on the official site: http://www3.pny.com/category_buymulti.aspx?Category_ID=514 . Not sure about shipping costs but this is one of the best earphones for the money - better than tons of other sub-$50
> ...


 
  
 $10.71 shipping for me which brings the Uptowns up to $19.70. Would they still be worth purchasing at that price?
  
 Seems kind of funny how much it costs to ship a set of IEMs from a US-based company.


----------



## bhazard

The PNY Uptown is $12.99 at Macmall, and if you have a shoprunner account, you get free shipping.


----------



## Zelda

ljokerl said:


> Forgot to mention that the abridged buyer's guide has been updated with the SteelSeries Flux taking the place of the HiSoundAudio Crystal.


 
 unfortunately for international buyers the Flux prices are ridiculous. and the HSA Crystal are now cheaper, $70-75 shipped


----------



## ljokerl

xd4rkfire said:


> $10.71 shipping for me which brings the Uptowns up to $19.70. Would they still be worth purchasing at that price?
> 
> Seems kind of funny how much it costs to ship a set of IEMs from a US-based company.


 
  
 Ouch. That's pretty much the same as the amazon price from a few weeks ago. Still a great earphone for the money but not as hot as I thought. 
  


zelda said:


> unfortunately for international buyers the Flux prices are ridiculous. and the HSA Crystal are now cheaper, $70-75 shipped


 

 Hopefully that will change given time. It's still a fairly fresh release.


----------



## quartertone

zelda said:


> unfortunately for international buyers the Flux prices are ridiculous. and the HSA Crystal are now cheaper, $70-75 shipped


 
  
 The Crystal is a very good deal at that price.


----------



## Adel

I need help guys. which in ear headphones for rap, hip hop and techno. monster turbine pro copper or yamaha eph-100?
 also any suggestion is welcome. I am looking for in ear headphones for my music genre and i like deep bass but without comprimising the sound.


----------



## stimer

adel said:


> I need help guys. which in ear headphones for rap, hip hop and techno. monster turbine pro copper or yamaha eph-100?
> also any suggestion is welcome. I am looking for in ear headphones for my music genre and i like deep bass but without comprimising the sound.


 
  
 sony xb90ex


----------



## duckz

I currently have the GR07 MK2, and was looking to upgrade to the Westone 4R. I can get them for 320 dollars. Is the upgrade worth it, or should I hold off on getting them? I do really like the GR07, but a slightly more impactful low bass wouldn't be bad. I've also had the RE0, but that was almost too balanced, and lacked a little in the bass department.


----------



## drm870

Just thought I'd thank you for your reviews of the SteelSeries earphones. Up until now, I had predominantly been using my Hifiman RE-400's with a bass increase EQ'd in. The problem, of course, is that depending on what I am doing (or what playback program I'm using) equalization isn't always available. Based on your review the non-pro variant of the SteelSeries Flux earphone seemed to be just what I was looking for, and after receiving them today and having a listen, I can say that they were.


----------



## ljokerl

quartertone said:


> The Crystal is a very good deal at that price.


 
  
 No argument here, it's a shame it never got more popular. 
  


adel said:


> I need help guys. which in ear headphones for rap, hip hop and techno. monster turbine pro copper or yamaha eph-100?
> also any suggestion is welcome. I am looking for in ear headphones for my music genre and i like deep bass but without comprimising the sound.


 
  
 For me, EPH-100. Bass is definitely deep but it still sounds very good overall.
  


duckz said:


> I currently have the GR07 MK2, and was looking to upgrade to the Westone 4R. I can get them for 320 dollars. Is the upgrade worth it, or should I hold off on getting them? I do really like the GR07, but a slightly more impactful low bass wouldn't be bad. I've also had the RE0, but that was almost too balanced, and lacked a little in the bass department.


 
  
 It's not much of an upgrade on the bass front - if you want more bass I would just get a GR07 Bass Edition instead. Cheaper and more likely to fill that particular need. 
  


drm870 said:


> Just thought I'd thank you for your reviews of the SteelSeries earphones. Up until now, I had predominantly been using my Hifiman RE-400's with a bass increase EQ'd in. The problem, of course, is that depending on what I am doing (or what playback program I'm using) equalization isn't always available. Based on your review the non-pro variant of the SteelSeries Flux earphone seemed to be just what I was looking for, and after receiving them today and having a listen, I can say that they were.


 
  
 Thanks, very glad you like 'em!


----------



## Shawn71

@ Joker - not sure somebody posted this query OR you suggested so.......Can the Vsonic VC02 cable (2 pins) be used with TF10s?


----------



## suman134

how is the speed of tf10 , is it faster then ue600/700 , can it take on er-4pt ? how is the decay .


----------



## FlySweep

ljokerl said:


> No argument here, it's a shame it never got more popular.


 
  
 I actually think the _Golden_ Crystal is one of the most overlooked IEMs I've heard in my time with portable audio.  At the time of the release, perhaps it was priced a little higher than many expected ($300-ish, right?), so it never caught on.. but even at that price, I remember it sounding quite impressive and competitive.  It had a pleasant coloring: a wide, u-shaped signature that had punchy, fun bass (that was focused in the lower-mid-bass & sub-bass focused).. a clean, articulate, tonally impressive midrange.. and a crisp, open, fast, sparkly treble.  It was surprisingly good compared to many IEMs I had heard around the time/price of its release.  Plus, the build was terrific.  I've moved onto "bigger & better" phones since then.. but it remains one of the few dynamic-driver universals I still crave to hear again.


----------



## suman134

adel said:


> I need help guys. which in ear headphones for rap, hip hop and techno. monster turbine pro copper or yamaha eph-100?
> also any suggestion is welcome. I am looking for in ear headphones for my music genre and i like deep bass but without comprimising the sound.


 
  
      if you have it in your bank , go for eph-100 any day , they are better then xb90ex in every department but bass , man , xb90ex bass is the best i have heard to date , bad decay , not fast enough , but not dominating the overall sq , fun sounding , nothing spectacular but the bass .


----------



## quartertone

flysweep said:


> I actually think the _Golden_ Crystal is one of the most overlooked IEMs I've heard in my time with portable audio.  At the time of the release, perhaps it was priced a little higher than many expected ($300-ish, right?), so it never caught on.. but even at that price, I remember it sounding quite impressive and competitive.  It had a pleasant coloring: a wide, u-shaped signature that had punchy, fun bass (that was focused in the lower-mid-bass & sub-bass focused).. a clean midrange, articulate, tonally impressive midrange.. and a crisp, open, fast, sparkly treble.  It was surprisingly articulate and clear compared to many IEMs I had heard around the time/price of its release.  Plus, the build was terrific.  I've moved onto "bigger & better" phones since then.. but it remains one of the few dynamic-driver universals I still crave to hear again.


 
  
 They're now available for about $130.


----------



## ljokerl

shawn71 said:


> @ Joker - not sure somebody posted this query OR you suggested so.......Can the Vsonic VC02 cable (2 pins) be used with TF10s?


 
  
 Theoretically - yes, but I wouldn't recommend it. The pins are arranged wrong for the VC02 cable so the strain relief ends up perpendicular to the body of the TF10. It's all very awkward. Plus, the pins on the VSonic cable are slightly recessed which doesn't make for a great fit with the TF10 socket. 
  


suman134 said:


> how is the speed of tf10 , is it faster then ue600/700 , can it take on er-4pt ? how is the decay .


 
  
 It's a bassier earphone than the 600/700/ER4 so it doesn't sound as tight and quick. For its signature it's quite good but I think other multi-BA sets sound more natural these days when it comes to bass - the SM64, for example.


----------



## bartlett

Hey my JVC FXT90's just went out on me so I am in the market for headphones that are similar but under $50. Any recommendations? Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

bartlett said:


> Hey my JVC FXT90's just went out on me so I am in the market for headphones that are similar but under $50. Any recommendations? Thanks!


 
  
 Without any additional info I would say SteelSeries Flux, assuming you're in the US and can get them for $50. It's a little flatter than the FXT90 - less of a mid-bass hump and less treble sparkle - but it still has a slightly v-shaped signature with a warm-of-neutral tone and a bit of added deep bass. If you'd rather have more bass than the FXT90 and not less, something more v-shaped, like a GR02 Bass Edition or id America Spark, might be a better option.


----------



## notoriousjim

I currently have a pair of Phonak PFEs and I quite enjoy them especially for acoustics but I do not like to carry an amp with me on the go and these definitely need an amp to get the most out of them.
  
 I'm currently thinking of buying two out of the three of JVC FXT 90, the MEElectronics A161P and the Flux in Ears. FXT I'm able to purchase for 100, the A161P I can get for 90 and the Flux the normal price of 50 dollars, which is pretty good considering I'm in Canada, we tend not to get the best deals on audio gear. 
  
 I'm looking for one of the two to have better vocals and soundstage than the Phonaks and the other to be a better all around headphone since I listen to a variety of genres. Also are all of the three above easy to power from an Ipod compared to the Phonaks?


----------



## Auditore

Hello am looking for my next upgrade in audio. Is anyone able to help me compre the UM3x with the 1964 V3? I posted this previously in the V3 thread but that thread seemed kind of dead so i will try my luck here ^^


----------



## Mimouille

auditore said:


> Hello am looking for my next upgrade in audio.


 Aren't we all? Is this not the bane of the Homo Audiophilus?


----------



## bartlett

Thanks for the suggestions. Does the GR02 have decent microphonics and a decent cable? How would it compare to the MEElectronics M9? I feel like the M9 lacks the soundstage and separation and the good cable the FTX90 had. The last thing I want to do is a slight upgrade form the M9 for $40. 
  
 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

notoriousjim said:


> I currently have a pair of Phonak PFEs and I quite enjoy them especially for acoustics but I do not like to carry an amp with me on the go and these definitely need an amp to get the most out of them.
> 
> I'm currently thinking of buying two out of the three of JVC FXT 90, the MEElectronics A161P and the Flux in Ears. FXT I'm able to purchase for 100, the A161P I can get for 90 and the Flux the normal price of 50 dollars, which is pretty good considering I'm in Canada, we tend not to get the best deals on audio gear.
> 
> I'm looking for one of the two to have better vocals and soundstage than the Phonaks and the other to be a better all around headphone since I listen to a variety of genres. Also are all of the three above easy to power from an Ipod compared to the Phonaks?


 
  
 Not sure what you mean by "better" vocals but you really won't be upgrading from the PFE with any of those - the A161P is more forward and aggressive, with a little better deep bass presence and less treble energy (compared to phonaks with gray filters at least). It has a smaller soundstage. The FXT90 is has a lot more mid-bass for a warmer sound than the PFE and more treble sparkle, but less extension. Its soundstage is well-rounded but not too wide. The Flux is bassier than the PFE/A161P but not as bassy as FXT90. It has slightly more recessed mids compared to the other three and less overall treble presence (but still more grain than PFE, for example). It has a wider soundstage but the depth is not as good as with the FXT90. For me personally, PFE >= FXT90 > A161P >= Flux but the Flux is quite possible the best deal being half the price. 
  
 The A161P is very efficient and super easy to drive (though you need a source with low output impedance). The FXT90 is about average. The Flux takes a little more power than average but it sounds very consistent betweens sources and doesn't really need an amp - just a few more notches on the volume control. 
  
  


auditore said:


> Hello am looking for my next upgrade in audio. Is anyone able to help me compre the UM3x with the 1964 V3? I posted this previously in the V3 thread but that thread seemed kind of dead so i will try my luck here ^^


 
  
 It's been a while since I had the UM3X but in very general terms the V3 will have more bass (esp mid-bass) and more treble presence and energy, with a less in-the-head, but still pretty forward, presentation. 
  


bartlett said:


> Thanks for the suggestions. Does the GR02 have decent microphonics and a decent cable? How would it compare to the MEElectronics M9? I feel like the M9 lacks the soundstage and separation and the good cable the FTX90 had. The last thing I want to do is a slight upgrade form the M9 for $40.
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 The GR02 is quite a bit better than the M9 - clearer, tighter, more natural-sounding overall. Microphonics are about on par, though.  JVC is pretty much the one company that's consistently mindful of microphonics.


----------



## notoriousjim

Thanks for the response. It would probably be best for me to just spend more on something else then. I enjoy the PFEs quite a bit but want something that has at least the same level of clarity with a bit more warmth, and a better overall soundstage. And I should have been more clear on what I meant by better vocals, for me it would be vocals that are more prominent, just slightly forward. Is there something in the 200-250 dollar range that fits the bill and is a decent upgrade over the PFEs?


----------



## ljokerl

notoriousjim said:


> Thanks for the response. It would probably be best for me to just spend more on something else then. I enjoy the PFEs quite a bit but want something that has at least the same level of clarity with a bit more warmth, and a better overall soundstage. And I should have been more clear on what I meant by better vocals, for me it would be vocals that are more prominent, just slightly forward. Is there something in the 200-250 dollar range that fits the bill and is a decent upgrade over the PFEs?


 
  
 GR07 is probably the closest - it's great for PFE-like clarity with more bass and a wider stage, but it doesn't have more prominent vocals.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Sensaphonics 3MAX CIEM
  


> *(1A10) Sensaphonics 3MAX*
> 
> 
> Reviewed October 2013
> ...


 
  
 The *table* has been updated to include the 3MAX.


----------



## Auditore

It's been a while since I had the UM3X but in very general terms the V3 will have more bass (esp mid-bass) and more treble presence and energy, with a less in-the-head, but still pretty forward, presentation. 
 
 


Thanks alot for your help!


----------



## suman134

alert for , indians , not sure if they will ship or not , but , what if they do ? xba-3 for rs3915 from flipkart .


----------



## Hitesh

suman134 said:


> alert for , indians , not sure if they will ship or not , but , what if they do ? xba-3 for rs3915 from flipkart .


 
 Out of stock


----------



## Xinn3r

Been out of the IEM buying field for awhile and thought I'd stop by to check on the forum.
 I see you're nearing that 300 review mark, keep it up Joker, and thank you for the hard work and contribution!


----------



## suman134

hitesh said:


> Out of stock


 
  
    seems like people were tight on it . awesome discount any way .


----------



## getclikinagas

suman134 said:


> alert for , indians , not sure if they will ship or not , but , what if they do ? xba-3 for rs3915 from flipkart .


 
  
 Must be an error. Too good to be true.
  
 I wish Philips would just release the Fidelio S1/S2 already.
  
_Me: When will the Fidelio S1/S2 be launched in India?_
_Philips customer care: Sir, We regret to inform you that the mentioned product is not launched in India yet_
_Me: I know it isn't released. Which is why I used the word "When"_
_Philips customer care: As informed you before, we would like to update you that the product is not launched in India yet._
  
 Sigh...


----------



## n0str3ss

It shows that is out of stock.


----------



## suman134

getclikinagas said:


> Must be an error. Too good to be true.
> 
> I wish Philips would just release the Fidelio S1/S2 already.
> 
> ...


 
  
    they just wont answer your questions , cuz its not planed for an indian launch .
    there are others on sale too , like skullcandy mix master , nokia purity hd .
    i too believe that we should have the s1 at least if not the s2 , we dont have most of the "sho" line , but a few fidelios will do .


----------



## drm870

Sigh...your review of the 3MAX has only further convinced me that the Heir Audio 8.A theoretically should be my end-game IEM, given the sound signature I've gradually come to realize is my preference over the past couple years. As a college student, though, I currently don't have the needed funds. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Thanks for the review anyway, Joker! ;P


----------



## ljokerl

xinn3r said:


> Been out of the IEM buying field for awhile and thought I'd stop by to check on the forum.
> I see you're nearing that 300 review mark, keep it up Joker, and thank you for the hard work and contribution!


 
  
 Thank you, much appreciated! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


getclikinagas said:


> Must be an error. Too good to be true.
> 
> I wish Philips would just release the Fidelio S1/S2 already.
> 
> ...


 
  





...
  
 For what it's worth the S1/S2 are only officially launching in the US this month. 
  
  


drm870 said:


> Sigh...your review of the 3MAX has only further convinced me that the Heir Audio 8.A theoretically should be my end-game IEM, given the sound signature I've gradually come to realize is my preference over the past couple years. As a college student, though, I currently don't have the needed funds.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 The 8.A is a great earphone but it has a funny ability to make the UM Miracle and Westone ES5 seem reasonably-priced


----------



## MoonYeol

Hey, I'm looking for an iem to complement my ASG-2 and UE900. I'm looking for a flatter FR and my budget is ~$400. I don't want to pay more as I want to upgrade my amp soon as well. The one iem I'm looking at right now is the CK100pro. Is there any option that is pretty flat, preferably with a little elevated sub bass/lower bass. Mid bass bloat is a no and so is 8kHz sibilance (I don't find 10kHz boosts as piercing). I do however like comply tips (TS). The level of sibilance in the 8kHz area I can tolerate is about the level of GR07. You could actually say that I'm looking for an upgrade to Rockit R-50. Keeping that signature but with greater detail, separation, height and depth.


----------



## Auditore

Is there an IEM/CIEM similar to the UM3X with those oh-so warm mids, with a better treble response? Thats one of the main things pulling me back from buying the UM3X due to the rather lackluster treble. Any help is appreciated ^^


----------



## ljokerl

moonyeol said:


> Hey, I'm looking for an iem to complement my ASG-2 and UE900. I'm looking for a flatter FR and my budget is ~$400. I don't want to pay more as I want to upgrade my amp soon as well. The one iem I'm looking at right now is the CK100pro. Is there any option that is pretty flat, preferably with a little elevated sub bass/lower bass. Mid bass bloat is a no and so is 8kHz sibilance (I don't find 10kHz boosts as piercing). I do however like comply tips (TS). The level of sibilance in the 8kHz area I can tolerate is about the level of GR07. You could actually say that I'm looking for an upgrade to Rockit R-50. Keeping that signature but with greater detail, separation, height and depth.


 
  
 I've personally never even been near an ASG-2 or CK100Pro. The UE900 has a little more bass than the R-50 and the treble is smoother. It's a little less flat and level through the midrange than the R-50, though. I wouldn't say it has greater detail or separation than the Rock-It but the soundstage is quite good. 
  


auditore said:


> Is there an IEM/CIEM similar to the UM3X with those oh-so warm mids, with a better treble response? Thats one of the main things pulling me back from buying the UM3X due to the rather lackluster treble. Any help is appreciated ^^


 
  
 Part of the reason the UM3X is as warm as it is, is that there is less treble emphasis compared to, say, a TF10 or ER4. On the upper end of things there are options - the Westone ES5 and Heir 8.A, for example. In the universal world there's the Shure SE535 - I wouldn't say it has better treble energy than the UM3X overall, but it is a little flatter and perhaps slightly more extended.


----------



## MoonYeol

ljokerl said:


> I've personally never even been near an ASG-2 or CK100Pro. The UE900 has a little more bass than the R-50 and the treble is smoother. It's a little less flat and level through the midrange than the R-50, though. I wouldn't say it has greater detail or separation than the Rock-It but the soundstage is quite good.


 
  
 I already own the UE900. Dammit, I just wrote some of my requirements for my next iem. Halfway through I understood that it would be almost impossible to get.


----------



## ljokerl

moonyeol said:


> I already own the UE900. Dammit, I just wrote some of my requirements for my next iem. Halfway through I understood that it would be almost impossible to get.


 
  
 Whoops, rushed and misread. Yeah, I don't really know of anything that fits all of those requirements unless you go custom with the Alclair Reference.


----------



## MoonYeol

I'm currently thinking about Fischer Amps FA-4E and CK100pro. Two quite overlooked iems. But I'll read everything there is to be read and make up my mind. If anybody have any thought on them. Feel free to PM me.


----------



## lisagorbin

What are the differences between vsonic vsd1 and vsd1s. Im wondering because i have vsd1 right now and and dont really collect iems, so what will i get if i get a vsd1s? thank you.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

lisagorbin said:


> What are the differences between vsonic vsd1 and vsd1s. Im wondering because i have vsd1 right now and and dont really collect iems, so what will i get if i get a vsd1s? thank you.


 
  
 The VSD1S I hear is more tuned for female vocals.  The first hit on google for "vsd1 vsd1s" turned up this page
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/663709/vsonic-vsd1-vsd1s-reviews-impression-thread/795
  
 Anyway they are the same earphone with different tuning, such as can be achieved with EQ.


----------



## hobbyone

Does anybody have experience with these original looking tips, which are made for Hifiman RE-400/600? 
  

  
http://www.head-direct.com/Products/?cid=3


----------



## mrs1986

Hi!
 I would like to get a pair of IEMs, I will say max 150, such is best from these in the price range?
  
 The shure se215, Gr06, gr07, etymotic HF5 or r-50
  
 I would like them to be comfortable to wear for at least a couple of hours...
  
 For reference, I had some grados Sr60i, while I like them, I think they make my ears hurt after a while of hearing them....
  
 Thanks for any help


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> Hi!
> I would like to get a pair of IEMs, I will say max 150, such is best from these in the price range?
> 
> The shure se215, Gr06, gr07, etymotic HF5 or r-50
> ...


 
  
     keep the ety out . they are the most uncomfortable brand around , but they sound awesome .


----------



## mrs1986

suman134 said:


> keep the ety out . they are the most uncomfortable brand around , but they sound awesome .


 
 Great, but about the others? Which one don't have a punching perforing treble?


----------



## Zalithian

mrs1986 said:


> Hi!
> I would like to get a pair of IEMs, I will say max 150, such is best from these in the price range?
> 
> The shure se215, Gr06, gr07, etymotic HF5 or r-50
> ...


 
  
 GR07 or TDK BA200 imo.


----------



## mrs1986

Do you know which one is the most confortable of those?


----------



## ljokerl

moonyeol said:


> I'm currently thinking about Fischer Amps FA-4E and CK100pro. Two quite overlooked iems. But I'll read everything there is to be read and make up my mind. If anybody have any thought on them. Feel free to PM me.


 
  
 Too bad Audio-Technica doesn't consider the USA a market for their BA earphones. 
  


lisagorbin said:


> What are the differences between vsonic vsd1 and vsd1s. Im wondering because i have vsd1 right now and and dont really collect iems, so what will i get if i get a vsd1s? thank you.


 
  
 They are very similar - no need to pick up the VSD1S if you already have a VSD1.
  


hobbyone said:


> Does anybody have experience with these original looking tips, which are made for Hifiman RE-400/600?
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.head-direct.com/Products/?cid=3


 
  
 I have the third tips from the top on the left from my MEElec M11. They work well on a number of earphones. I also have the ones below them - don't remember from where. Might be Auvio tips from RadioShack. Never could get a good seal with those.  
   
 Quote:


mrs1986 said:


> Do you know which one is the most confortable of those?


 

 Always depends on your ears but I can wear a GR07 for hours.


----------



## Zalithian

mrs1986 said:


> Do you know which one is the most confortable of those?


 
  
 They are both comfortable for me but the BA200 is more ergonomic.


----------



## mrs1986

Ok thanks to both i see.
  
 One more question, it is better to get lets say, the gr07 or the BA 200 that are more "high end" and use them just like that whitout amp, or its maybe better to get something like the gr06 or se215 or fxt90 and a fiio E11 amp? 
  
 I'm not looking to listen at super hight volumes, i want them to be clear i think, listen to all the instrument and dont loose too much of the sounds that were recorded... 
  
 Sorry for my english, some times i lack the vocabulary to get my thoughts to be understandable... 
  
 EDIT: Sorry i forgot to mention, i would like them to last a while, im very careful with al my gear, but i dont want them to break cause where i live i have no warranty for any of them...


----------



## Amitl

how's the Meelec A161P's bass compared to the HiFiman RE400?
 and how do they compare overall...?
 thank you..


----------



## Gandasaputra

Hello Joker,
  
 How do you compare the bass quantity of JVC HA-FXT90 with the Yamaha EPH-100?
  
 Best,
 Sam


----------



## ljokerl

mrs1986 said:


> Ok thanks to both i see.
> 
> One more question, it is better to get lets say, the gr07 or the BA 200 that are more "high end" and use them just like that whitout amp, or its maybe better to get something like the gr06 or se215 or fxt90 and a fiio E11 amp?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I can't speak for the BA-200 but the GR07 is pretty consistent between sources. There's no real need for an amp. VSonic build quality holds up well in my experience. 
  


amitl said:


> how's the Meelec A161P's bass compared to the HiFiman RE400?
> and how do they compare overall...?
> thank you..


 
  
 The A161's bass is slightly more punchy/immediate while the RE-400 bass is a little softer but also more full-bodied. They are similar in bass quantity and overall sound but on the whole the RE-400 sounds a little more natural to me - the top end is more extended and not at all grainy and the softer note presentation works well. The RE-400 is also a little more spacious while the A161P isolates better. 
  


gandasaputra said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> How do you compare the bass quantity of JVC HA-FXT90 with the Yamaha EPH-100?
> 
> ...


 
  
 The EPH-100 has more bass, esp. deep bass. The FXT90 has a mid-bass hump but overall it's still not a very bassy earphone.


----------



## Damix

I'am looking for little upgrade from my Phonak's audeo pf112 . My budget is ~200$ . I need big soundstage, keep nice and clear sound (i had IE8 but didn't like them). I should look for brainwavz b2 or Sony XBA-3 or something else ?


----------



## mrs1986

Thanks a lot for the help.
  
 I don't wan't to look like a troll, but each time that i get more aknowledge about the IEMs less i know which one I should buy :/
  
 Beeing so far away of places where these things are reachable makes the decision pretty hard... If i could go and buy try and resell the IEMs it would be much much easier...
  
 Thanks a lot again for the help, i'm still debating and should be making my mind in these days because the GR07 MKII are discounted and at 130...


----------



## suman134

damix said:


> I'am looking for little upgrade from my Phonak's audeo pf112 . My budget is ~200$ . I need big soundstage, keep nice and clear sound (i had IE8 but didn't like them). I should look for brainwavz b2 or Sony XBA-3 or something else ?


 
  
     xba-3's sound stage is not big enough , every thing else is nice , bass is good , decay is acceptable , highs are nice , okay spark , mids are a bit washed off but still good enough , brainwavz b2 will do , may lack some rumble in bass region , but , man , they are fast , decay is good , i dont remember much about the sound stage . and a turn off for me is the j cable from xba-3 , they are okay , but a y cable would have been nice , like xba-30 . or grab a xba-h1 if you can , and tell us how you like it .


----------



## stimer

damix said:


> I'am looking for little upgrade from my Phonak's audeo pf112 . My budget is ~200$ . I need big soundstage, keep nice and clear sound (i had IE8 but didn't like them). I should look for brainwavz b2 or Sony XBA-3 or something else ?


 
  
 I listened to vsonic gr02be, vsonic vsd1, vsonic gr07BE, hifiman re-400, t-peos h-100, rock-it sound r-50, sony xba-3, sony xba-4, shure 215 and the biggest impression on me sony xba-3 I had goosebumps. There is a new model xba-30 but its hard to get it goes to the domestic market of Japan.


----------



## suman134

stimer said:


> I listened to vsonic gr02be, vsonic vsd1, vsonic gr07BE, hifiman re-400, t-peos h-100, rock-it sound r-50, sony xba-3, sony xba-4, shure 215 and the biggest impression on me sony xba-3 I had goosebumps. There is a new model xba-30 but its hard to get it goes to the domestic market of Japan.


 
  
     " and the biggest impression on me sony xba-3 I had goosebumps " , you liked it ? you didnt like it ?


----------



## stimer

suman134 said:


> " and the biggest impression on me sony xba-3 I had goosebumps " , you liked it ? you didnt like it ?


 
  
 this is the best that I have yet heard, they met all of my requirements.


----------



## Damix

suman134 said:


> xba-3's sound stage is not big enough , every thing else is nice , bass is good , decay is acceptable , highs are nice , okay spark , mids are a bit washed off but still good enough , brainwavz b2 will do , may lack some rumble in bass region , but , man , they are fast , decay is good , i dont remember much about the sound stage . and a turn off for me is the j cable from xba-3 , they are okay , but a y cable would have been nice , like xba-30 . or grab a xba-h1 if you can , and tell us how you like it .


 
  
 Brainwavz b2 have less bass than phonak audeo  ? I thought that they have more  .
 Sony XBA-H1 aren't avaiable yet . 
 I had etymotic HF5 for few days. Soundstage not big as in audeo and sound was just flat, no fun. 
 I'am using ibasso D3 as AMP and DAC, galaxy s3 and ipod touch 2g as players.


----------



## Shawn71

stimer said:


> "the biggest impression on me sony xba-3 I had goosebumps.


 
 surprising how sony's 3BAs surpasses GR07. really interesting.


----------



## mrs1986

Well I should make a decision soon, I don't want to loose the discount, which should I get, ba 200, gr07 or re400??
 How would this compare to an apple headphones the white old ones??


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> Well I should make a decision soon, I don't want to loose the discount, which should I get, ba 200, gr07 or re400??
> How would this compare to an apple headphones the white old ones??


 
  
      go for ba 200 , dont thing much , you will be happy , unlike we people , you just cant help it , can you ? by the way , all are just awesome . in my opinion ba 200 tops the list , then gr07 , then re400 . with apple earbuds ? these phones are light years ahead .


----------



## stimer

mrs1986 said:


> Well I should make a decision soon, I don't want to loose the discount, which should I get, ba 200, gr07 or re400??
> How would this compare to an apple headphones the white old ones??


 
  
 you have to drop all the advice and listen to yourself your palate will tell what to take.


----------



## suman134

damix said:


> Brainwavz b2 have less bass than phonak audeo  ? I thought that they have more  .
> Sony XBA-H1 aren't avaiable yet .
> I had etymotic HF5 for few days. Soundstage not big as in audeo and sound was just flat, no fun.
> I'am using ibasso D3 as AMP and DAC, galaxy s3 and ipod touch 2g as players.


 
  
    b2 is flat man , dead flat at bass , better then er-4pt , but still flat enough . go for eph-100 may be , may be for gr07 .


----------



## mrs1986

Sorry to be annoying, but as I never had IEMs and I'm actually far far away to understand music like you people do, I just can't decide which one go for :/


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> surprising how sony's 3BAs surpasses GR07. really interesting.


 
  
     even i think they are better then the xba-4 .


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> Sorry to be annoying, but as I never had IEMs and I'm actually far far away to understand music like you people do, I just can't decide which one go for :/


 
  
       are you comfortable with over ear fit ? do you want bass or anything specific ? everyone has to start one day , but it think you are jumping a bit too far ahead .


----------



## mrs1986

suman134 said:


> are you comfortable with over ear fit ? do you want bass or anything specific ? everyone has to start one day , but it think you are jumping a bit too far ahead .


 
  
 you are maybe right... I had grados Sr60i, I liked how they sounded but I found them tiring after a while, I guess the treble or highs were too "high" didn't have any good IEM or headphone since them, that was a year back...


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> you are maybe right... I had grados Sr60i, I liked how they sounded but I found them tiring after a while, I guess the treble or highs were too "high" didn't have any good IEM or headphone since them, that was a year back...


 
  
     gr07 will suit you the most , but they are over ear phones , i dont like cable guides but over ear phones have good fit , for comfort and peace of mind , i will suggest , go for straight barrel phones , re400 is good , eph-100 are good too .
     is it helping ? no , it just cant , take my word , go for gr07 and try to get along . as you are new , you can adopt to any thing , its like a blank page , you can write any thing .


----------



## mrs1986

suman134 said:


> gr07 will suit you the most , but they are over ear phones , i dont like cable guides but over ear phones have good fit , for comfort and peace of mind , i will suggest , go for straight barrel phones , re400 is good , eph-100 are good too .
> is it helping ? no , it just cant , take my word , go for gr07 and try to get along . as you are new , you can adopt to any thing , its like a blank page , you can write any thing .


 
  
 Thats a good one,I'm a blank page 
  
 So gr07 gets the better than the ba 200, I should get those then...
  
 Oh and I never tried over the ear phones, but they make lot of sense to me, as I always have problem with in ear headphones (had some Phillips before the grados, and the apple and HTC one x ones) they always fell of my ear... This design seems to not have this problem...


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> Thats a good one,I'm a blank page
> 
> So gr07 gets the better than the ba 200, I should get those then...
> 
> Oh and I never tried over the ear phones, but they make lot of sense to me, as I always have problem with in ear headphones (had some Phillips before the grados, and the apple and HTC one x ones) they always fell of my ear... This design seems to not have this problem...


 
  
      yup , go ahead , let us know how you like it . gr07 has good sound stage and a not so annoying fit due to shallow fit . ba200 is a bit difficult to fit in , cuz they go deep in the canal . dont worry , gr07 is a beautiful phone to have .


----------



## mrs1986

suman134 said:


> yup , go ahead , let us know how you like it . gr07 has good sound stage and a not so annoying fit due to shallow fit . ba200 is a bit difficult to fit in , cuz they go deep in the canal . dont worry , gr07 is a beautiful phone to have .


 
  
 Great, thank you so much I will go ahead and get the Vsonics


----------



## Damix

suman134 said:


> b2 is flat man , dead flat at bass , better then er-4pt , but still flat enough . go for eph-100 may be , may be for gr07 .


 
  
 But i dont search bassy earphones  with warm sound like yamaha eph-100. Audeo very little bass in quanlity but with rly good quality - and i love it . 
 When i want to hear strong and deep bass - i use srh750DJ


----------



## suman134

damix said:


> But i dont search bassy earphones  with warm sound like yamaha eph-100. Audeo very little bass in quanlity but with rly good quality - and i love it .
> When i want to hear strong and deep bass - i use srh750DJ


 
  
     b2 is even flatter , with really nice pace .


----------



## n0str3ss

mrs1986 said:


> Sorry to be annoying, but as I never had IEMs and I'm actually far far away to understand music like you people do, I just can't decide which one go for :/


 
  
  


suman134 said:


> are you comfortable with over ear fit ? do you want bass or anything specific ? everyone has to start one day , but it think you are jumping a bit too far ahead .


 
 Start finding a solution for this questions and you will find one of the best options out there suited for you. And one of things that helps the most is read, gather information about different signatures, fits,... And don't worry the majority of us started with from the nothing too, it just takes time to get started (and to ruin your wallet, sorry btw).


----------



## mrs1986

n0str3ss said:


> Start finding a solution for this questions and you will find one of the best options out there suited for you. And one of things that helps the most is read, gather information about different signatures, fits,... And don't worry the majority of us started with from the nothing too, it just takes time to get started (and to ruin your wallet, sorry btw).


 
  
 Yeah i know, all the hobbies are like this lol.
  
 My problem is my country, i CANT find a thing in here, and is almost impossible to re sell one of these IEMs, nobody know even they exist (all the brands and models, they just know xion (chinese cheap) and phillips...) and is pretty hard to not to loose almost all the money...


----------



## n0str3ss

mrs1986 said:


> Yeah i know, all the hobbies are like this lol.
> 
> My problem is my country, i CANT find a thing in here, and is almost impossible to re sell one of these IEMs, nobody know even they exist (all the brands and models, they just know xion (chinese cheap) and phillips...) and is pretty hard to not to loose almost all the money...


 
 Pretty much the same in my country, the only solution for me until now was to buy online and this way you can get better prices. There plenty of trustable online stores. Amazons, lendmeurears, mp4nation,... and many many more.


----------



## mrs1986

Well, for some reason lendmeurears wont accept my payment... I dont know what is the problem :/
  
 What should i do now, that was the best price for the GR07


----------



## n0str3ss

Contact them. They will take some days to reply tho.


----------



## mrs1986

there isn't another place to buy? the ones you show me do not have our are too expensive...


----------



## mrs1986

Should I get the ba200 instead? As I'm a blank page could they be much worse??


----------



## Amitl

does anyone know if the new id America Spark has different sq?


----------



## Leo888

Hi, I'm in need of some thoughts in regards to the Heir Audio 5.0. Not much have been written about them and hopefully can gather some opinions from here. joker, wonder if you had listened to them before and could kindly share some thoughts. Also, would appreciate thoughts and impression from all helpful souls in here to help me out on this.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Gandasaputra

ljokerl said:


> The EPH-100 has more bass, esp. deep bass. The FXT90 has a mid-bass hump but overall it's still not a very bassy earphone.


 
  
 Thanks for clarifying that! I have the FXT90 and thought the earphones' drivers broke because the bass is lacking. Quite surprised that FXT90 isn't bassy earphone although it has the woofer driver.


----------



## jekostas

gandasaputra said:


> Thanks for clarifying that! I have the FXT90 and thought the earphones' drivers broke because the bass is lacking. Quite surprised that FXT90 isn't bassy earphone although it has the woofer driver.


 
  
 The FXT90 doesn't have a "woofer", it uses two full range drivers without a crossover.


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> Should I get the ba200 instead? As I'm a blank page could they be much worse??


 
  
       dont worry , its fine , was my first choice of the three .


----------



## ljokerl

Lots of new posts. If I missed any specific questions I apologize. 
  
 For those who haven't heard, The Wizard (of Heir Audio fame) is back with Noble Audio. I reviewed the Heir Audio flagship, the 8.A, over at InnerFidelity but never got a chance to add it here. It is a solid earphone but I like the quad-driver Noble 4S just as much, if not better. A review of the 4S will be added here in due time.  
  

  
 Additional hi-res photos of my 4S can be found here: http://theheadphonelist.com/october-7-noble-audio-wizard-back/
  


damix said:


> I'am looking for little upgrade from my Phonak's audeo pf112 . My budget is ~200$ . I need big soundstage, keep nice and clear sound (i had IE8 but didn't like them). I should look for brainwavz b2 or Sony XBA-3 or something else ?


 
  
 The B2 probably won't have enough bass if you found the Etys overly flat. I would go for the GR07 or even GR07 Bass Edition, depending on your bass tolerance. Neither of these will have the issues of the IE8 (potentially excessive bass and veiled mids). They aren't really a major upgrade to the PFE, which is darn good already, but should provide a good compliment (especially the Bass Edition with its juicy low end). 
  


leo888 said:


> Hi, I'm in need of some thoughts in regards to the Heir Audio 5.0. Not much have been written about them and hopefully can gather some opinions from here. joker, wonder if you had listened to them before and could kindly share some thoughts. Also, would appreciate thoughts and impression from all helpful souls in here to help me out on this.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
  
 Sorry, the closest I've gotten to the Heir 5.0 is the 8.A (presumably, not very close at all).
  


gandasaputra said:


> Thanks for clarifying that! I have the FXT90 and thought the earphones' drivers broke because the bass is lacking. Quite surprised that FXT90 isn't bassy earphone although it has the woofer driver.


 
  
 jekostas is correct - there's no low driver per se in the FXT90. It relies on two different materials to differentiate its two drivers. Multiple drivers don't necessarily guarantee a particular quality to the sound. The single-driver FX700, for example, has more bass than the FXT90.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

mrs1986 said:


> Yeah i know, all the hobbies are like this lol.
> 
> My problem is my country, i CANT find a thing in here, and is almost impossible to re sell one of these IEMs, nobody know even they exist (all the brands and models, they just know xion (chinese cheap) and phillips...) and is pretty hard to not to loose almost all the money...




Which country is that? If you are having trouble buying online you could try Philips. The SHE3580 was held in high regard by ljokerl and you can still get its successors like the SHE3590 or SHE3500 (they ran out of numbers and started from zero again ) they should sound similar or the same  And they are much cheaper than the models you're contemplating


----------



## ljokerl

joe bloggs said:


> Which country is that? If you are having trouble buying online you could try Philips. The SHE3580 was held in high regard by ljokerl and you can still get its successors like the SHE3590 or SHE3500 (they ran out of numbers and started from zero again
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Or the 3680, which is the same thing with translucent housings. Philips really didn't try to make this easy.


----------



## Emre9110

Hello Joker 
  
 If you have any friend who has LG G2. It is coming with new quadbeat2 headphones. I am waiting your review.
  
 It is 25.20$ here http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=151138341534 .


----------



## drm870

ljokerl said:


> The 8.A is a great earphone but it has a funny ability to make the UM Miracle and Westone ES5 seem reasonably-priced


 
  
 I was under the impression the Miracle had a much different sound signature. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Interesting point about ES5, though. At any rate...now that the Noble 5C has been announced and priced to compete, this all has become much more complicated for me, hasn't it?


----------



## ljokerl

emre9110 said:


> Hello Joker
> 
> If you have any friend who has LG G2. It is coming with new quadbeat2 headphones. I am waiting your review.
> 
> It is 25.20$ here http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=151138341534 .


 
  
 Thanks, will keep the G2 in mind. 
  


drm870 said:


> I was under the impression the Miracle had a much different sound signature.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I meant purely in terms of price. The Miracle does not sound like the 8.A or ES5.


----------



## mattstevenfishe

Hey joker, can you give a brief rundown/direct comparison of the various VSonic models?
  
 I have a pair of gr07s and re400s (love them both for their respective sound signatures) at work and want a cheaper VSonic (in the ~$50 price range) to leave at home or in my backpack. What would you suggest? I'm open to other suggestions as well..


----------



## NIVEBL

Does j-phonic k2 sounds like 2X-S?
 They said k2's sonud tuned from 2X-S


----------



## Amitl

what would be considered an upgrade to the Meelec CW31 (with similar fit)?


----------



## ljokerl

mattstevenfishe said:


> Hey joker, can you give a brief rundown/direct comparison of the various VSonic models?
> 
> I have a pair of gr07s and re400s (love them both for their respective sound signatures) at work and want a cheaper VSonic (in the ~$50 price range) to leave at home or in my backpack. What would you suggest? I'm open to other suggestions as well..


 
  
 For the sub-$50 ones, in order of how much I like them:
 GR99: emphasized bass with inoffensive treble compared to most other VSonic models. Sounds a little dark and muffled compared to pricier ones.
 GR02 Bass Edition: more v-shaped than GR99 with greater bass enhancement and better reach/sparkle up top. Loses some treble smoothness as a result. 
 GR02 Silver: balanced with an emphasis on the midrange and upper midrange. Different from most other VSonic earphones, which tend to be a little v-shaped. 
 VC02: flat with a slightly bright tone. Bass is punchy but has less emphasis than the other VSonic dynamics. Almost sounds like a balanced armature. The most analytical of the bunch.
 VSD1: sounds most like the pricier GR07 Bass Edition. Good amount of bass with sparkly treble and great overall clarity. 
 VSD1S: very similar to the VSD1 with a slightly less v-shaped sound. I did a short comparison of these two a ways back in this thread. It's also found in the comments here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/jvc-ha-fxd80-2/ 
  
 I would go for the VSD1S personally. I won't be too different (signature-wise) from your GR07, but is that really such a bad thing?
  


nivebl said:


> Does j-phonic k2 sounds like 2X-S?
> They said k2's sonud tuned from 2X-S


 
  
 No clue, but from what I remember the internals should be exactly like the 2X-S (same drivers and crossover).
  


amitl said:


> what would be considered an upgrade to the Meelec CW31 (with similar fit)?


 

 Philips Fidelio S1. Although it's significantly bigger and heavier, it still has that half in-ear, angled-nozzle form factor. It also has a near-neutral sound with some bass emphasis.


----------



## hobbyone

Hi ljokerl! Have you experimented with different acoustic filters/dampers? If I remember correctly, you searched for a damper removing tool some times ago.


----------



## ljokerl

hobbyone said:


> Hi ljokerl! Have you experimented with different acoustic filters/dampers? If I remember correctly, you searched for a damper removing tool some times ago.


 
  
 I bought a bunch of Knowles filters/dampers to try with my Ety ER4S per this thread but ended up going back to stock (the green ones) as I liked the balance better and it sounded more natural to me overall. I guess the engineers at Ety know what they are doing. Who knew...


----------



## ljokerl

Added Nuforce NE-700M (2013 version)
  


> *(2C59) Nuforce NE-700X / NE-700M (2013 version)*
> 
> 
> Reviewed October 2013
> ...


----------



## Shawn71

Nice review as always. adv. congrats on ur 300 mark! :-D


----------



## garcsa

Anybody some info or experience about this seller and product : http://www.ebay.com/itm/171146202023?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649   ?
 Thanks.


----------



## davidcotton

Wrong place to ask but there was a thread awhile ago, inearcustom is the seller.  Here you go :-
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/643894/inearcustom-cheapest-re-shell-ever


----------



## garcsa

davidcotton said:


> Wrong place to ask but there was a thread awhile ago, inearcustom is the seller.  Here you go :-
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/643894/inearcustom-cheapest-re-shell-ever


 
 Thanx dude!


----------



## alan73

Hi Joker,
  
 You said in your review that PFE 122 is one of the IEMs that benefit substantially from amping, and you gave it 8.8. I assume that's before amping? When it's amped, how do you think it performs in comparison to other iems like gr07 MII, er4s, etc? Do you think it performs at the same level as those other iems? How would you score it?
  
 Thanks.


----------



## goodvibes

I will give my take which is that the PFE and GR07 are comparable and preference reins. I personally prefer the PFE due to slightly better low level resolution with gray filters and it doesn't have the GR07 peak on top. That said the PFE is a bit lean this way and gr07 has a nice warm without being too thick balance overall and on most kit and files, you won't notice the difference in res. The 4s is in another league but also has a lean but not hot presentation. 4p version has the same detail but is also a bit hot sounding for some like me. If Etymotic fit is acceptable to you, I think them best with the deep triples, the HF5 is as good as the pfe.


----------



## shufujiala

if there turns out to be a super incredible ridiculously good iem at $400 then what choice do we have really.


----------



## alan73

goodvibes said:


> I will give my take which is that the PFE and GR07 are comparable and preference reins. I personally prefer the PFE due to slightly better low level resolution with gray filters and it doesn't have the GR07 peak on top. That said the PFE is a bit lean this way and gr07 has a nice warm without being too thick balance overall and on most kit and files, you won't notice the difference in res. The 4s is in another league but also has a lean but not hot presentation. 4p version has the same detail but is also a bit hot sounding for some like me. If Etymotic fit is acceptable to you, I think them best with the deep triples, the HF5 is as good as the pfe.


 

 I actually own both PFE 112 and GR07 MKII. I love both and at the end of the day that's what matters. I'm just curious to know what Joker's take is on this matter. In my experience, 112 sounds a bit thin sounding out of my ipod nano 7 while my GR07 sounds just fine direct from the ipod. But when it's amped, the PFE's becomes more robust and I can even hear low-end rumble in some songs (that's without the bass boost from the amp) while retaining all the good qualities that the BA iem has (spacious soundstage, airy highs, tight lows, good clarity overall). I also love how my amp gives instruments like guitar a weightier sound. The drums sound more realistic on the GR07, though. In my opinion, the PFE, when amped, competes well with GR07and personally I would give them both the same score.


----------



## ljokerl

shawn71 said:


> Nice review as always. adv. congrats on ur 300 mark! :-D


 
  
 Thanks! 
  


davidcotton said:


> Wrong place to ask but there was a thread awhile ago, inearcustom is the seller.  Here you go :-
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/643894/inearcustom-cheapest-re-shell-ever


 
  
 Wow, that sockpuppeting on the last page is damning
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/643894/inearcustom-cheapest-re-shell-ever/480
  


alan73 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> You said in your review that PFE 122 is one of the IEMs that benefit substantially from amping, and you gave it 8.8. I assume that's before amping? When it's amped, how do you think it performs in comparison to other iems like gr07 MII, er4s, etc? Do you think it performs at the same level as those other iems? How would you score it?
> 
> Thanks.


 

 I don't think you should get hung up on a small score difference rather than the actual review. I agree with goodvibes - they are about on-par and at that level it's all preference anyway. The PFE, at the time, sounded a little lean to me and was still a little less refined than my Etys. I do really like the GR07's consistency between sources and that did bump it up a little. I should also mention that my original PFE quit working a long time ago so the last time I heard one was when I was loaned a Perfect Bass 022 and switched the filters.


----------



## alan73

ljokerl said:


> I don't think you should get hung up on a small score difference rather than the actual review. I agree with goodvibes - they are about on-par and at that level it's all preference anyway. The PFE, at the time, sounded a little lean to me and was still a little less refined than my Etys. I do really like the GR07's consistency between sources and that did bump it up a little. I should also mention that my original PFE quit working a long time ago so the last time I heard one was when I was loaned a Perfect Bass 022 and switched the filters.


 
  
 Thx for the reply Joker,
 You're right, I think GR07 is more consistent between sources. I read somewhere that the Vsonic's FR does not change much even when paired with sources with higher output impedance. Just like I said I like them both. They both have their own strengths and weaknesses. They're both quite neutral, with the PFE on the colder side and the Vsonic on the warmer side.


----------



## garcsa

ljokerl said:


> Thanks!
> 
> 
> Wow, that sockpuppeting on the last page is damning
> ...


 
 Agree!


----------



## ljokerl

alan73 said:


> Thx for the reply Joker,
> You're right, I think GR07 is more consistent between sources.* I read somewhere that the Vsonic's FR does not change much even when paired with sources with higher output impedance. *Just like I said I like them both. They both have their own strengths and weaknesses. They're both quite neutral, with the PFE on the colder side and the Vsonic on the warmer side.


 
  
 Yes, it has very linear impedance. You can find the measurements for my GR07 here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/headphone-data-sheet-downloads


----------



## Deviltooth

Interesting review of the Nuforce NE-700M.  I have the older version and I assume this one (2013) must be tuned differently as the original had bass that constantly crept into the mids making everything sound very muddy.  Also, I'll second your assessment of comfort; anyone with smaller ears would do well to choose something else.


----------



## Emre9110

Hi buddy,
  
 I wanna ask a question about ue 600. On your table, it says i (mic+single button remote)  but ue 600 has mic+3 buttons.
  
 Ue 600 has single button and mic, ue 600 vi 3 buttons and mic ? Or ue 600 don't have mic, ue600vi 3 buttons+mic ?


----------



## ljokerl

deviltooth said:


> Interesting review of the Nuforce NE-700M.  I have the older version and I assume this one (2013) must be tuned differently as the original had bass that constantly crept into the mids making everything sound very muddy.  Also, I'll second your assessment of comfort; anyone with smaller ears would do well to choose something else.


 
  
 The bass is still not for the faint of heart but I think it's more because it is slow rather than due to the conventional mid-bass hump (as is the case, for example, with the Signature Acoustics Elements C12). It is still intrusive compared to higher-end sets but my old NE-700X was worse. 
  


emre9110 said:


> Hi buddy,
> 
> I wanna ask a question about ue 600. On your table, it says i (mic+single button remote)  but ue 600 has mic+3 buttons.
> 
> Ue 600 has single button and mic, ue 600 vi 3 buttons and mic ? Or ue 600 don't have mic, ue600vi 3 buttons+mic ?


 

 Sorry, it should be 3-button for the new UE 600s. I must have forgotten to change it because I started the review back when I had the old ones. This earphone has been around forever and has been called different things:
  
1st generation
 Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5 - no remote
 Ultimate Ears Super.Fi 5vi - 1-button remote
  
2nd generation (discontinued but still stocked by some retailers)
 Ultimate Ears 600 - no remote
 Ultimate Ears 600vi - 3-button remote
  
3rd generation (current)
 Logitech UE 600 - 3-button remote


----------



## ChrisRPM12

Hi |Joker|!
  
 I want to deeply congratulate you for being one review away from hitting the 300 milestone! I personally believe that your reviews has influenced many readers into choosing the iem that suits them the most! Are you going to celebrate your 300th mark with the review of the JH13 Freqphase?


----------



## n0str3ss

emre9110 said:


> Hi buddy,
> 
> I wanna ask a question about ue 600. On your table, it says i (mic+single button remote)  but ue 600 has mic+3 buttons.
> 
> Ue 600 has single button and mic, ue 600 vi 3 buttons and mic ? Or ue 600 don't have mic, ue600vi 3 buttons+mic ?


 
 From reading your stuff I got so confused


----------



## alan73

chrisrpm12 said:


> Hi |Joker|!
> 
> I want to deeply congratulate you for being one review away from hitting the 300 milestone! I personally believe that your reviews has influenced many readers into choosing the iem that suits them the most! *Are you going to celebrate your 300th mark with the review of the JH13 Freqphase?*


 
 Yes, please. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 A review of JH13 freqphase would be fitting to celebrate it..


----------



## dleblanc343

alan73 said:


> Yes, please.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 I second this!


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


chrisrpm12 said:


> Hi |Joker|!
> 
> I want to deeply congratulate you for being one review away from hitting the 300 milestone! I personally believe that your reviews has influenced many readers into choosing the iem that suits them the most!


 

 Thank you, I very much hope thats the case! 
  


chrisrpm12 said:


> Are you going to celebrate your 300th mark with the review of the JH13 Freqphase?


 
 Maybe


----------



## yalper

Philips S2 is currently $104 on amazon. I'd like to jump on it but I am still waiting for S2 review and Re400 comparison, especially imagining, soundstage wise.


----------



## Tommy C

yalper said:


> Philips S2 is currently $104 on amazon. I'd like to jump on it but I am still waiting for S2 review and Re400 comparison, especially imagining, soundstage wise.


 
 +1 
  
 Same here


----------



## ljokerl

yalper said:


> Philips S2 is currently $104 on amazon. I'd like to jump on it but I am still waiting for S2 review and Re400 comparison, especially imagining, soundstage wise.


 
  
 I did take notes on the comparison when I was writing the InnerFidelity RE-400 review.
  
S2 vs RE-400
  
 The RE-400 is more efficient, warmer in tone, and boasts more intimate mids and a more in-the-head presentation overall. 
 The Fidelio S2 has more subbass & bass in general but is also less warm overall and a touch clearer as a result. The mids on the S2 are less forward. Tonally, it is somewhat brighter and has more upper midrange presence. It is also more spacious overall and has a wider soundstage but gives up the intimate feel and more well-rounded presentation (in terms of depth and width being more even) of the RE-400.


----------



## ericr

Hey Joker,
  
 Wished I lived down in CA.  There needed to be a _*party*_ when you post that 300th review!  Your ongoing effort is really appreciated.
  
 Subliminal impressions follow:
  
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
  
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
  
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
  
  
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
  
  
  
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
  
  
  
  
  
 1964 v6 stage for # 300
  
  
  
 *Thanks again* for all you've done to help educate me (and thousands of others)!
  
 -E


----------



## ljokerl

ericr said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Wished I lived down in CA.  There needed to be a _*party*_ when you post that 300th review!  Your ongoing effort is really appreciated.
> 
> ...


 

 Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
  
 P.S. The 300th review will likely be a custom, but maybe not the V6 as I haven't had it very long 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## shakur1996

ljokerl said:


> Thank you  .
> 
> P.S. The 300th review will likely be a custom, but maybe not the V6 as I haven't had it very long  .



Custom Art Music One?


----------



## ljokerl

shakur1996 said:


> Custom Art Music One?


 

 One of the possibilities


----------



## egosumlux

tommy c said:


> +1
> 
> Same here


 

 The S1 is even cheaper now, take a plunge now http://www.amazon.com/Philips-S1-28-Fidelio-Headsets/dp/B00EP9RPRI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1381891905&sr=8-2&keywords=fidelio+s1


----------



## egosumlux

Nice review thank you very much, congrats for the 300 mark achieved. I would like to see your opinions on the NE600X as well


----------



## Tommy C

egosumlux said:


> The S1 is even cheaper now, take a plunge now http://www.amazon.com/Philips-S1-28-Fidelio-Headsets/dp/B00EP9RPRI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1381891905&sr=8-2&keywords=fidelio+s1


 
 I think they were going for $60+shipping on Amazon Japan. Was really tempted! Having said that, I might go with S2 as I think I would enjoy the fact they are less dry.


----------



## LordZero

Hi, I got the SteelSeries FLux In-Ear and also 3 pairs of comply T-100, because I was expecting that they used the same size as the Pro version,but I was wrong :\ Anyone know what is the size of Comply Foams they use?


----------



## jekostas

lordzero said:


> Hi, I got the SteelSeries FLux In-Ear and also 3 pairs of comply T-100, because I was expecting that they used the same size as the Pro version,but I was wrong :\ Anyone know what is the size of Comply Foams they use?


 
  
 Based on nozzle size it should be T400s


----------



## drm870

I bought a T-200 series pack for my non-Pro Flux's and they're too loose. I'm guessing this is one of those earphones that has a nozzle size that's incompatible with Comply's current line-up. Looking into it, I suspect VSonic's foam tips would fit, but I myself have just settled with Sony Hybrids (which grip my ear slightly better than the stock tips).


----------



## ericr

ljokerl said:


> Thank you  .
> 
> P.S. The 300th review will likely be a custom, but maybe not the V6 as I haven't had it very long  .




OK. I'll just be patient then. And hope maybe you'll get to the V6 Stage before the Black Friday sales. 

Very interested in the V6-s and you're one of the few who have also reviewed the SM64 (which I'm really enjoying).


----------



## ljokerl

egosumlux said:


> Nice review thank you very much, congrats for the 300 mark achieved. I would like to see your opinions on the NE600X as well


 
  
 Thanks, much appreciated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


lordzero said:


> Hi, I got the SteelSeries FLux In-Ear and also 3 pairs of comply T-100, because I was expecting that they used the same size as the Pro version,but I was wrong :\ Anyone know what is the size of Comply Foams they use?


 
  
 The *200 and *400 Complys I have are loose. Shure Olives and Westone True-Fit Foams don't fit. Not sure about the rest.
  


ericr said:


> OK. I'll just be patient then. And hope maybe you'll get to the V6 Stage before the Black Friday sales.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 It'll be done before black Friday. I'd give it a month at most.


----------



## ericr




----------



## Amitl

Something happened to my Sparks.
 whenever i twist the 3.5mm plug just a little, it pauses the music.
 i was wondering what's causing this popular issue.
 what could go wrong with a 3.5mm plug??


----------



## MoonYeol

If it loses connection a phone should recognize it as the connector being disconnected = pause the music. Maybe that's the problem.


----------



## rawrster

I think your 300th review should be the custom from Noble Audio 
  
 With all these iems along with what you haven't reviewed it's a wonder how you don't lose your iems and start wondering where things are.


----------



## n0str3ss

First world problems...


----------



## ljokerl

moonyeol said:


> If it loses connection a phone should recognize it as the connector being disconnected = pause the music. Maybe that's the problem.


 
  
 Or it recognizes a button press when there is none, which a phone or iPod would interpret as a pause command. Could be a connection problem with the plug or a short somewhere in the mic/remote lead near the plug
  


rawrster said:


> I think your 300th review should be the custom from Noble Audio


 
  
 I haven't had the Noble long enough yet, but I'm really liking what I'm hearing so far.
  
  


rawrster said:


> With all these iems along with what you haven't reviewed it's a wonder how you don't lose your iems and start wondering where things are.


 
  
 When I was reviewing the SM64 I had to go and find my Ultrasone IQ, which I hadn't used in months. I completely forgot that I'd put it in a generic carrying case because the one that came with it was unwieldy. Took me a few days to find. 
   
 Quote:


n0str3ss said:


> First world problems...


 
  
 First-world Head-Fier problems


----------



## ljokerl

Added the JH Audio JH13 Pro Freqphase at #300. This centennial marks a new sound quality benchmark 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 Thank you all for your support in reaching this milestone - it could not have been reached without all of your feedback, discussion, and encouragement!
  


> *(1A11) JH Audio JH13 Pro Freqphase*
> 
> 
> Added Oct 2013
> ...


 
  
 The JH13 sits atop the comparison table, the sortable version of which can be found here.


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> ...after a year spent with the JH13 Pro I still marvel most at its ability to simply fade away, leaving only the music.


 
  
 Having heard the demo, it makes sense that you'd find it to at the top of your heap. Personally, I found that it forced me to listen to the music, and I couldn't tune out. It was a bit disconcerting in that sense, similar to how I found the 1Plus2. However, I am very, very impressed by its technical ability --- I'm not thrilled by the 6k spike and I'd like the bass shelf about 2.5 dB lower, but I can definitely understand why so many are so enamored with this monitor.


----------



## Cotnijoe

Great review!! Makes the 13s just that much more tempting!

And thank you for bringing so much guidance to this community


----------



## ericr

*Three freaking hundred!*  *CoNgRaTuLaTiOnS!*
  
 You have my greatest respect and sincere appreciation.
  
 Thank-you Joker!


----------



## peter123

ericr said:


> *Three freaking hundred!*  *CoNgRaTuLaTiOnS!*
> 
> You have my greatest respect and sincere appreciation.
> 
> Thank-you Joker!


 
 +300


----------



## phantompersona

Congratulations on your 300th review!!! Your are definitely THE best headphone/iem reviewer out there. I hope your planning on taking a long vacation or something  because you definitely deserve one.


----------



## n0str3ss

Congrats on the 300th!


----------



## shakur1996

And congratulations from me joker. I'm still waiting for the review of the Custom Art Music One


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Congratulations on the awesome landmark 300th review


----------



## H20Fidelity

Well done on 300 reviews! (Whoa)


----------



## d marc0

Congrats Joker! 300 reviews! That is amazing!





 Good on you mate.


----------



## kaixax555

Congratulations on the 300th review
  
 What a way to reach this milestone with a class leading IEM like the JH13 Pro


----------



## Deviltooth

I have to admit the JH13Pro is absolutely excellent.  I enjoyed the different comparisons and I hope you have your eye on the upcoming Roxanne.


----------



## MoonYeol

And now you should take a hiatus. Get some well deserved rest. As probably the most knowledgable man on the planet when it comes to iems, you deserve a break to get your energy back up after doing all of these incredible reviews. I've gotten so much help from your reviews.


----------



## Mimouille

moonyeol said:


> *And now you should take a hiatus. Get some well deserved rest.* As probably the most knowledgable man on the planet when it comes to iems, you deserve a break to get your energy back up after doing all of these incredible reviews. I've gotten so much help from your reviews.


 
 Are you kidding !!?? Get back to work !


----------



## goodvibes

tomscy2000 said:


> Having heard the demo, it makes sense that you'd find it to at the top of your heap. Personally, I found that it forced me to listen to the music, and I couldn't tune out. It was a bit disconcerting in that sense, similar to how I found the 1Plus2. However, I am very, very impressed by its technical ability --- I'm not thrilled by the 6k spike and I'd like the bass shelf about 2.5 dB lower, but I can definitely understand why so many are so enamored with this monitor.


 
 I don't hear that 6k spike but they do smooth out over time and hard use so perhaps it's just receded on mine. I hit them pretty hard for a couple hundred hours after initial break in while running in a Moon cable I was trying. I do hear a bit of needed presence that sounds appropriate to me but not a spike sort of resonance. Depth of insertion could change where standing wave reinforcement may occur as would ear shape to certain degree. Perhaps what you're hearing is universal related or we just hear it differently though the stock cable does have some of that etched, character. They're absolutely lush with an after market copper cable and really do take on about any sig with cable changes. Of course the slightly elevated low bass is always there but really, if you tend to use them on the go as I do, it's welcome.
  
 I don't find the midbass elevated as Joker does but do agree that the low bass is elevated. I'm a neutral kinda guy but think Joker prefers things a bit leaner than I do though we certainly agree on these overall. He's probably surprised he likes something with this much weight as much as he does.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 Congrats on 300, Joker.


----------



## shotgunshane

Nice review on the JH13 joker. I hear it very similar in the midrange and bass. I do hear a bit more treble energy and quantity compared to the ER-4s, which sounds a little smoother next to the crisper JH13. 

I find the JH13 very forward overall and the soundstage is very enveloping, which gives a pretty big wow factor when combined with the clarity. 

Regarding imaging- the JH13 is the best I've heard in this regard, besting even the 1+2.


----------



## Gilly87

Cool writeup on the JH13, thanks again |joker|  and congrats on 300 reviews. 
  
 I'd be interested to see the JH13 compared to the UERM, if you ever get the chance, as they are the only two custom's I've ever seriously considered buying...


----------



## tomscy2000

gilly87 said:


> Cool writeup on the JH13, thanks again |joker|  and congrats on 300 reviews.
> 
> I'd be interested to see the JH13 compared to the UERM, if you ever get the chance, as they are the only two custom's I've ever seriously considered buying...


 
  
 From your history, I'm going to take a stab and say that you'll prefer the JH13 over the UERM. You'll most likely be more used to the sound. I'm sure the JH13FP sound is what a lot of people "want" in an IEM. JM2C... not that the UERM is "worse" by any means, it's just a flatter flavor that won't be as enveloping and engrossing as the JH13FP. With the UERM, you're led to hear the artifacts of music and an honest lay of the land. The JH13 is for pinpoint accuracy of a bauble of music swirling around your head --- you won't stop listening to the music --- you can't. It won't let you.


----------



## ScuderiaHeadFi

300 reviews... and counting!


----------



## jjforums

I'm thinking in ATH-CKM300 or ATH-CKM500, the difference is about US$ 20, worth it?
  
 Thanks!


----------



## Deviltooth

I'm interested in Joker's take on 'burn in' especially regarding balanced armature drivers.  Personally I've yet to experience any sonic changes over time.  I understand how it might be possible for a dynamic driver (though again if there are changes for me they've been negligible at best) but I thought BAs were immune to this phenomenon.
  
 My JH13s are getting a lot of use and I don't think the sound has 'smoothed out'.  It was great from the start and remains equally great now.


----------



## Xsoldier416

Congratulations on 300!  I will be devoting a good amount of time to reading through many of your reviews.  Although I have made up my mind that the next pair of headphones I buy will be CIEMs (aside from possibly getting another pair of cans, just don't tell my wallet), I think reading up on some universals in the same price range or lower might lead to a more informed decision.  Your time and efforts are monumental and extremely helpful to the rest of us.  Thank you for what you do.


----------



## FlySweep

You couldn't have picked a better phone for #300, joker   Excellent review, as usual!
  
 I'm in agreement with goodvibes that the JH13 is transparent enough to pick on the slight audible differences between cables.  I recently got a Moon Audio Silver Dragon.. and it's my favorite cable to use (both ergonomically and acoustically) w/ the JH13.


----------



## DairyProduce

I'm pleasantly surprised the JH-13's did so well against the NT-6, especially when the NT-6's are said to be about equal in quality to the SE-5's which are much more expensive.


----------



## goodvibes

deviltooth said:


> I'm interested in Joker's take on 'burn in' especially regarding balanced armature drivers.  Personally I've yet to experience any sonic changes over time.  I understand how it might be possible for a dynamic driver (though again if there are changes for me they've been negligible at best) but I thought BAs were immune to this phenomenon.
> 
> My JH13s are getting a lot of use and I don't think the sound has 'smoothed out'.  It was great from the start and remains equally great now.


 
 So you didn't feel the midbass was stronger when new and low bass more apparent in time? They didn't move as much as dynamics for me but it was something I noticed. I once had access to 2 pairs of se530s, one a year old and one new. On it's own, the change in the new one wouldn't have been apparent to most but comparing made it more discernible. It moved slowly besides so normal use and brain EQ would easily mask it from day to day. There's cables and xover involved as well but I don't see how a wire can break in but the windings or mechanical hinge points of an armature not, even if subtle. 
  
 My last comment regarding this as I know where these discussions tend to go.


----------



## eke2k6

I remember being in awe of this thread when it was still in the 100s. There's no way to say this except, you're the man, Joker. I know how time consuming it is to write a single review, much less 300 of them.
  
 Now just take a well-deserved break.


----------



## shotgunshane

eke2k6 said:


> Now just take a well-deserved break.




Double or nothing. No rest for the weary!


----------



## eke2k6

shotgunshane said:


> Double or nothing. No rest for the weary!


 
  
 No, no. We don't want to turn this
  




  
  
 into this


----------



## CantScareMe

Surely IJokerI you've got to celebrate like this


----------



## lin0003

Congrats ljokerl! 
This thread has been of immense help to myself and heaps of other people.


----------



## squallkiercosa

Congrats but No offense Joker, but a good chunk of the headphones' list are already out of production. Maybe we could find a few popular ones like the TF10, but still. Don't you think we could filter the ones unavailable on a new/different list? for educational purposes only?


----------



## Deviltooth

goodvibes said:


> So you didn't feel the midbass was stronger when new and low bass more apparent in time? They didn't move as much as dynamics for me but it was something I noticed. I once had access to 2 pairs of se530s, one a year old and one new. On it's own, the change in the new one wouldn't have been apparent to most but comparing made it more discernible. It moved slowly besides so normal use and brain EQ would easily mask it from day to day. There's cables and xover involved as well but I don't see how a wire can break in but the windings or mechanical hinge points of an armature not, even if subtle.
> 
> My last comment regarding this as I know where these discussions tend to go.


 
 Honestly no and it was something I was listening for.  I've used a few songs I'm very familiar with and revisited them over many hours of use.  The only differences I note are when I change the source.
  
 Currently I've been listening for differences in the new Onkyo IEM as it uses a large dynamic driver which seems more likely to be subject to break in.  So far I'm coming up blank.  Could just be me... I prefer that people not expect grand positive changes in C/IEMs over time, if so I think many would be disappointed.
  
 In the past I do believe I've heard burn in with floor standing KEF, Paradigm and possibly Mirage speakers (though Omnisats make the last a touch more difficult as there are more room reflections).


----------



## ljokerl

Thank you all very much! It's been a hell of a journey and it certainly isn't over yet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. No rest for the wicked!
  


tomscy2000 said:


> Having heard the demo, it makes sense that you'd find it to at the top of your heap. *Personally, I found that it forced me to listen to the music, and I couldn't tune out*. It was a bit disconcerting in that sense, similar to how I found the 1Plus2. However, I am very, very impressed by its technical ability --- I'm not thrilled by the 6k spike and I'd like the bass shelf about 2.5 dB lower, but I can definitely understand why so many are so enamored with this monitor.


 
  
 Yeah, it tends to do that too. 
  
 I actually wouldn't mind the JH13 with less bass - really couldn't pick a favorite between it and the NT 6 (which is flatter and leaner) in that regard.
  
 The treble appears to be less smooth than I would like is when compared to a Miracle or Westone ES5 (that latter of which IMO is darker than it needs to be). It's still an improvement over things like the K3003 and Senn IE800 and on its own doesn't bother me in the least.
  


deviltooth said:


> I have to admit the JH13Pro is absolutely excellent.  I enjoyed the different comparisons and I hope you have your eye on the upcoming Roxanne.


 
  
 At this rate, expect a Roxanne review in 2017 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




! 
  


goodvibes said:


> I don't hear that 6k spike but they do smooth out over time and hard use so perhaps it's just receded on mine. I hit them pretty hard for a couple hundred hours after initial break in while running in a Moon cable I was trying. I do hear a bit of needed presence that sounds appropriate to me but not a spike sort of resonance. Depth of insertion could change where standing wave reinforcement may occur as would ear shape to certain degree. Perhaps what you're hearing is universal related or we just hear it differently though the stock cable does have some of that etched, character. They're absolutely lush with an after market copper cable and really do take on about any sig with cable changes. Of course the slightly elevated low bass is always there but really, if you tend to use them on the go as I do, it's welcome.
> 
> I don't find the midbass elevated as Joker does but do agree that the low bass is elevated. I'm a neutral kinda guy but think Joker prefers things a bit leaner than I do though we certainly agree on these overall. He's probably surprised he likes something with this much weight as much as he does.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 To be honest I have a slight distrust for demos after the UM Miracle demo that was a disaster compared to my customized one. JH ones are probably better, though. 
  


shotgunshane said:


> Nice review on the JH13 joker. I hear it very similar in the midrange and bass. I do hear a bit more treble energy and quantity compared to the ER-4s, which sounds a little smoother next to the crisper JH13.
> 
> I find the JH13 very forward overall and the soundstage is very enveloping, which gives a pretty big wow factor when combined with the clarity.
> 
> Regarding imaging- the JH13 is the best I've heard in this regard, besting even the 1+2.


 
  
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I've got to get my hands on one of those 1+2s everyone is talking about.
  


gilly87 said:


> Cool writeup on the JH13, thanks again |joker|  and congrats on 300 reviews.
> 
> I'd be interested to see the JH13 compared to the UERM, if you ever get the chance, as they are the only two custom's I've ever seriously considered buying...


 
  
 From what I understand the UERM might be more similar to the Hidition than the JH13. Still would be an interesting one to compare, though.
  


jjforums said:


> I'm thinking in ATH-CKM300 or ATH-CKM500, the difference is about US$ 20, worth it?
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 Sorry, never tried the CKM300. The CKM500 is pretty fantastic at $60 if you like things bassy. 
  


deviltooth said:


> I'm interested in Joker's take on 'burn in' especially regarding balanced armature drivers.  Personally I've yet to experience any sonic changes over time.  I understand how it might be possible for a dynamic driver (though again if there are changes for me they've been negligible at best) but I thought BAs were immune to this phenomenon.
> 
> My JH13s are getting a lot of use and I don't think the sound has 'smoothed out'.  It was great from the start and remains equally great now.


 
  
 Sorry, I like to stay out of that debate. I give my BA stuff 50 hours of run-in "just in case" but I don't pay attention to changes. By the time I get enough of a feel for a higher-end IEM to start listening critically it usually has dozens more hours on it. 
  


xsoldier416 said:


> Congratulations on 300!  I will be devoting a good amount of time to reading through many of your reviews.  Although I have made up my mind that the next pair of headphones I buy will be CIEMs (aside from possibly getting another pair of cans, just don't tell my wallet), I think reading up on some universals in the same price range or lower might lead to a more informed decision.  Your time and efforts are monumental and extremely helpful to the rest of us.  Thank you for what you do.


 
  
 Thanks, glad the thread continues to be useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


dairyproduce said:


> I'm pleasantly surprised the JH-13's did so well against the NT-6, especially when the NT-6's are said to be about equal in quality to the SE-5's which are much more expensive.


 
  
 I thought it was the NT 6 Pro that can compete with the S35. In any case, the NT 6 and JH13 Pro are both great earphones! 
  


squallkiercosa said:


> Congrats but No offense Joker, but a good chunk of the headphones' list are already out of production. Maybe we could find a few popular ones like the TF10, but still. Don't you think we could filter the ones unavailable on a new/different list? for educational purposes only?


 

 I grayed out the discontinued ones in the table. I guess I could take them out completely but then if someone was trying to figure out where they would place they would have trouble doing so. 
  
 The interactive version of the table found here hides the discontinued products by default. You can "Show Discontinued Products" to display them and they'll be highlighted in red. 
  
 By the way, I don't keep an eye on every earphone out there so if there are any that should be long gone, please let me know.


----------



## goodvibes

deviltooth said:


> Honestly no and it was something I was listening for.  I've used a few songs I'm very familiar with and revisited them over many hours of use.  The only differences I note are when I change the source.
> 
> Currently I've been listening for differences in the new Onkyo IEM as it uses a large dynamic driver which seems more likely to be subject to break in.  So far I'm coming up blank.  Could just be me... I prefer that people not expect grand positive changes in C/IEMs over time, if so I think many would be disappointed.
> 
> In the past I do believe I've heard burn in with floor standing KEF, Paradigm and possibly Mirage speakers (though Omnisats make the last a touch more difficult as there are more room reflections).


 
 Change doesn't necessarily mean it will get better so I agree with not assuming but by the same token, I wouldn't discard anything before 100hrs either.


----------



## jjforums

Some say that is difference in quality between the CKM500 and CKM500iS.
  
 So I searched more options, the options are:
  
 SoundMAGIC MP21 ($35)
 Brainwavz M4 ($40)
 ATH-CKM300iS ($45)
 Sony DR-EX102VP ($47)
 ATH-CKM500iS ($63)
 Ultimate Ears 350VM ($65)
 Sennheiser CX275s ($66)
  
 Any help to reduce this list is welcome... I saw comments about ATH-CKM500iS saying it's not good for rock music, and it's my kind of music...


----------



## ozkan

From your list, I would pick up Ultimate Ears which I assume is UE600 for rock music if bass is not your priority.


----------



## jjforums

Its UE350VM, UE600 costs US$120+...


----------



## MoonYeol

Sony MH1C


----------



## ozkan

No, Sony Mh1c is too bassy and slow for rock music and the cable is terrible.


----------



## jjforums

I forgot to mention the DUNU DN-22M for  $45.
  
 The thing about MH1C is that I can't find a reliable seller, and it's $43. Now it's not good to rock music too, the cable wouldn't be a deal to me I think.


----------



## suman134

jjforums said:


> Its UE350VM, UE600 costs US$120+...


 
  
     where do you belong from , you are thunderously over priced on these , you can opt for ue400/500 , try a balanced armature , like xba-10 , xba-c10 , pl50 , she9850 , these are cheap ones , i got an she9850 for rs 999 , roughly $17 . xba-3 for rs3915 , $65 roughly .


----------



## jjforums

Most prices are from eBay, I'm from Brazil, I'm considering the shipping costs too... And the headphone must have a Microphone, and it make the IEM expensive, I think.


----------



## ozkan

Pm.


----------



## suman134

jjforums said:


> Most prices are from eBay, I'm from Brazil, I'm considering the shipping costs too... And the headphone must have a Microphone, and it make the IEM expensive, I think.


 
  
      try finding a dealer of ultimate ears , they might get you a cheaper deal .


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Thank you all very much! It's been a hell of a journey and it certainly isn't over yet
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Uh-oh, better late than never: congrats on reaching 300!


----------



## vwinter

Man i can't even remember where you were up to when I first came here. It was like 150. Kind of mind boggling when I still owe someone impressions on a loan from a month ago.

Congrats!


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, it tends to do that too.
> I actually wouldn't mind the JH13 with less bass - really couldn't pick a favorite between it and the NT 6 (which is flatter and leaner) in that regard.
> 
> The treble appears to be less smooth than I would like is when compared to a Miracle or Westone ES5 (that latter of which IMO is darker than it needs to be). It's still an improvement over things like the K3003 and Senn IE800 and on its own doesn't bother me in the least.


 
  
 I'm very curious to hear the NT6 myself. It seems to share a lot in common with the UERM, which I've been using for the last week or so, except with greater midrange presence, though it seems to be even more greatly lifted in the upper treble region, which is a nice effect on the UERM, but it doesn't play nice with tracks that don't scrutinize mastering and can get tiring after a while. It's just so difficult to keep the upper treble even keeled in IEMs, though...
  
 And also, very silly of me not to congratulate you on 300 --- it's a milestone!


----------



## drm870

cantscareme said:


> Surely IJokerI you've got to celebrate like this


----------



## AUDIOBREEDER

Congrats on your 300!


----------



## soullinker20

Congrats on your 300th review |Joker|,your reviews have always been my reference and go -to.
Loving my Jh13 more. Hope u get to review Roxanne


----------



## Solude

Alright gents, I'm officially lost on where to go with my iem.  I have the UM3X now and while it's okay on the commute it's bloody awful out of the big rig.
  
 Preference would be a universal with Audeze type tonal balance.  No massive spikes or droops along the way please 
  
 I had considered the ER4P or 535 maybe split the difference with the 425.  Long story short my headphone experience has been more or less limited to full sized open cans so I'm for all intents and purposes... a noob


----------



## jjforums

I think I'm going with the DUNU DN-22M, Brainwavz M4 pr SoundMAGIC MP21 hope I don't regret.


----------



## Don Lehrer

I always like reviews where you got the opportunity to compare more options. I think my next move would be some Custom IEMs.


----------



## helllooooooo

dayumm, that's a lot. 

 grats!


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> i got an she9850 for rs 999 , roughly $17 . xba-3 for rs3915 , $65 roughly .


 
 mind sharing the info........


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> mind sharing the info........


 
  
     was on sale , she9850 was on surplus sale at gobol.in , with 80% discount , 5 of these are sold at this price , have no idea about the no of xba-3s , but i bagged one at least from flipkart . i already had one of these but at higher prices , paid the mrp for my first xba-3 .
    
 now both are out of stock .
  

OD31003004514 
Sony XBA-3 In-the-ear Headphone...Rs. 3915*Delivered *
 View Details


----------



## Shawn71

jjforums said:


> I think I'm going with the DUNU DN-22M, Brainwavz M4 pr SoundMAGIC MP21 hope I don't regret.


 

 M4 - chk whether its the same cable as M4 if you plan to order M4 w/mic, as there's a quality difference where M4 w/o mic is better. it was a bitter experience those ordered w/mic long ago/some time back complained about. make sure u get it right.....now.
  
 Detonator is a better choice imo. the BQ,accessories...B for the B.
  
 I owned PL21 (w/o mic),pretty decent bass and highs for the price.angled nozzle perfect seal.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> was on sale , she9850 was on surplus sale at gobol.in , with 80% discount , 5 of these are sold at this price , have no idea about the no of xba-3s , but i bagged one at least from flipkart . i already had one of these but at higher prices , paid the mrp for my first xba-3 .
> 
> now both are out of stock .
> 
> ...


 

 TY. btw how's 9850 single BA? decent on mid's and sparkling highs but once u get a perfect seal Bass reveals?....I have the muzx 606 which is of same SQ as described. some tracks it equals on highs par with tf10.


----------



## jjforums

shawn71 said:


> M4 - chk whether its the same cable as M4 if you plan to order M4 w/mic, as there's a quality difference where M4 w/o mic is better. it was a bitter experience those ordered w/mic long ago/some time back complained about. make sure u get it right.....now.
> 
> Detonator is a better choice imo. the BQ,accessories...B for the B.
> 
> I owned PL21 (w/o mic),pretty decent bass and highs for the price.angled nozzle perfect seal.


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 I saw a review about the DN-22M, I get a little disappointed... Even with a lot of accessories. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbM33TYyAJ4 Feels that it lacks in quality. But I don't any alternative with Mic in the same price.
  
 Maybe I have to forget the M4 with Mic too, some reviews say the build quality isn't good...
  
 The MP21 comes with a lot of accessories too, but no hard case, but for $35 I start to think that it's a bit overpriced in the seller that I saw on eBay.
  
 Now I'm considering the Ultimate Ears with Mic, Logitech products are generally well built and it's a thing that matters for me, I want a earphone that longs, comes with a hardcase and sound quality seems to be balanced. I saw a UE200 review and I think it's more the kind of earphone I'm looking for. Found it for $25.
  
 The JVC HA-FR201 for $25 has good comments but no accessories.


----------



## MoonYeol

UE200 is good. It lacks in treble extension and detail but there is some sparkle and it's mostly neutral, not dark. However the sub bass is severely lacking. But there is enough mid bass to cover it and get some decent impact. But UE200 is pretty nice.


----------



## jekostas

The UE200 is very harsh and it doesn't smooth out even given substantial burn in.


----------



## MoonYeol

jekostas said:


> The UE200 is very harsh and it doesn't smooth out even given substantial burn in.


 
 Wow, that's not my impression at all. But hey, we're all different.


----------



## vovain

Is it possible to buy reinforcing headphones for $ 45? Prompt what. 'm Going to use the phone. yamaha audio chip


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> TY. btw how's 9850 single BA? decent on mid's and sparkling highs but once u get a perfect seal Bass reveals?....I have the muzx 606 which is of same SQ as described. some tracks it equals on highs par with tf10.


 
  
     i like my she9850 more then the xba-3 ( lacks a bit of pace and not my loving type of sound sig , but i like it ) , 9850 has blistering ( just under my er-4p ) pace , lacks in bass amount ( ue600 has more bass ) but precise , mids are to the mark ( just below ue600 ) , highs are with nice spark ( just below ue600 ) if ue600 is 8.6 , this will be closer to 8.2 or a solid 8 may be ( on jokers list ) .
  
 you have got a nice deal i must say , a BA is better then any dynamic under $40 .
   
     just lost my hand off a tf10 , time to move on , will try to get a gr07 now on , will make a trip to thailand , have plans of a xba-c10 , gr07 at least .


----------



## jjforums

Still not decided, help me please. Looking for a IEM with Mic for my Android source (Nexus 4).
  
 Updating the options available:
  
 ------------------------------------------
 Ultimate Ears UE200vm ($25)
 JVC HA-FR201 ($25)
 LG HSS F420 ($25)
 ------------------------------------------
 SoundMAGIC MP21 ($35)
 ------------------------------------------
 Sony MH1C ($45)
 DUNU DN-22M ($45)
 ------------------------------------------
 Astrotec AM-90 ($50)
 ------------------------------------------


----------



## doctorjazz

Congrats on the 300, Joker!!!
 Haven't compared the above,do like my XBA-3's, waiting for the Sony hybrids about to come out.


----------



## suman134

doctorjazz said:


> Congrats on the 300, Joker!!!
> Haven't compared the above,do like my XBA-3's, waiting for the Sony hybrids about to come out.


 
  
      me too . have some hefty expectations .


----------



## getclikinagas

suman134 said:


> me too . have some hefty expectations .


 
 XBA H1 are on sale for Rs.6990 (6500 on ebay). Many impressed people over on the dedicated thread.


----------



## Amitl

Any thoughts on the Audio Technica CKS77 or CKS99 anyone?
 i'm really into the half-in-ear design because of it being a more *secure* fit,
 but i'm also looking for isolation.
 also, though i like bass, i don't like the mids too recessed, and i hate sibilance/harshness.
 i was gonna go for the CKM500 but i'm afraid of the microphonics people describe!
 would also go for the Fidelio S2/S1... but no isolation! :|


----------



## n0str3ss

getclikinagas said:


> XBA H1 are on sale for Rs.6990 (6500 on ebay). Many impressed people over on the dedicated thread.


 
 Not bad.


----------



## ljokerl

james444 said:


> Uh-oh, better late than never: congrats on reaching 300!


 
  


vwinter said:


> Man i can't even remember where you were up to when I first came here. It was like 150. Kind of mind boggling when I still owe someone impressions on a loan from a month ago.
> 
> Congrats!


 
  


tomscy2000 said:


> I'm very curious to hear the NT6 myself. It seems to share a lot in common with the UERM, which I've been using for the last week or so, except with greater midrange presence, though it seems to be even more greatly lifted in the upper treble region, which is a nice effect on the UERM, but it doesn't play nice with tracks that don't scrutinize mastering and can get tiring after a while. It's just so difficult to keep the upper treble even keeled in IEMs, though...
> 
> And also, very silly of me not to congratulate you on 300 --- it's a milestone!


 
  


audiobreeder said:


> Congrats on your 300!


 
  


soullinker20 said:


> Congrats on your 300th review |Joker|,your reviews have always been my reference and go -to.
> Loving my Jh13 more. Hope u get to review Roxanne


 
  


helllooooooo said:


> dayumm, that's a lot.
> 
> grats!


 
  


doctorjazz said:


> Congrats on the 300, Joker!!!


 
  
 Thanks, all! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  


solude said:


> Alright gents, I'm officially lost on where to go with my iem.  I have the UM3X now and while it's okay on the commute it's bloody awful out of the big rig.
> 
> Preference would be a universal with Audeze type tonal balance.  No massive spikes or droops along the way please
> 
> I had considered the ER4P or 535 maybe split the difference with the 425.  Long story short my headphone experience has been more or less limited to full sized open cans so I'm for all intents and purposes... a noob


 
  
 What do you want changed about the UM3X? 
  
  
 The most LCD-2 like IEM I've heard is probably the Heir 8.A but failing that the SE535 should be a good choice. 
  
  


vovain said:


> Is it possible to buy *reinforcing headphones *for $ 45? Prompt what. 'm Going to use the phone. yamaha audio chip


 
  
 I'm not sure what that means.
  


jjforums said:


> Still not decided, help me please. Looking for a IEM with Mic for my Android source (Nexus 4).
> 
> Updating the options available:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Of those the MH1C and LG F420 sound the best IMO. The MH1C is typically the "safer" choice because it's smoother and has more bass but for rock I prefer the Quadbeat (F420). The LG should be good as long as you don't need heavy bass.


----------



## Solude

ljokerl said:


> What do you want changed about the UM3X?


 
  
 Mostly the massive scoop out from 2-8KHz.  I find it overly warm and lacking in definition and air.  Kind of like an early LCD-2 Rev1 on an already warm rig.
  
 Measurements wise the interesting ones all seem to be duals DBA-02, W2, UE700 etc.  Don't know however if measurements and actual presentation match.  Also odd that the universal $300+ market is full of wildly inaccurate iems


----------



## dleblanc343

solude said:


> Alright gents, I'm officially lost on where to go with my iem.  I have the UM3X now and while it's okay on the commute it's bloody awful out of the big rig.
> 
> Preference would be a universal with Audeze type tonal balance.  No massive spikes or droops along the way please
> 
> I had considered the ER4P or 535 maybe split the difference with the 425.  Long story short my headphone experience has been more or less limited to full sized open cans so I'm for all intents and purposes... a noob


 
 The Shure SE846 is very very similar to the LCD2/LCD3 imo. It sits right in between in terms of sound sig, and also sound quality imo.


----------



## jjforums

ljokerl said:


> Of those the MH1C and LG F420 sound the best IMO. The MH1C is typically the "safer" choice because it's smoother and has more bass but for rock I prefer the Quadbeat (F420). The LG should be good as long as you don't need heavy bass.


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 So I think I'm going with LG F420 or F530 because it's cheaper and I listen to rock.


----------



## Solude

dleblanc343 said:


> The Shure SE846 is very very similar to the LCD2/LCD3 imo. It sits right in between in terms of sound sig, and also sound quality imo.


 
  
 My problem or hesitance on the Shure front is the cliff that is 10KHz+ on all Shure IEMs.


----------



## LordZero

ljokerl said:


> Thanks, much appreciated
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 With some stretching =P I was able to fit the T-100 on my SteelSeries Flux In-ear
  


 Oh and Happy 300!


----------



## papijoe08

Happy 300 joker! A job well done! )) Cheeeeeeeeers!


----------



## jjforums

Bought the LG HSS-F420 for $22, hope it arrives, hope it works.
  
 Thanks!


----------



## esanthosh

Congrats on the 300th review. Looking forward to the 500th!
  
 Hope you will add Philips S1 and S2 soon.


----------



## Don Lehrer

esanthosh said:


> Congrats on the 300th review. Looking forward to the 500th!
> 
> Hope you will add Philips S1 and S2 soon.


 
 +1


----------



## ljokerl

solude said:


> Mostly the massive scoop out from 2-8KHz.  I find it overly warm and lacking in definition and air.  Kind of like an early LCD-2 Rev1 on an already warm rig.
> 
> Measurements wise the interesting ones all seem to be duals DBA-02, W2, UE700 etc.  Don't know however if measurements and actual presentation match.  Also odd that the universal $300+ market is full of wildly inaccurate iems


 
  
 Well, the DBA-02 and UE700 are definitely brighter than the LCD2. Measurements are tricky when it comes to treble. For example with the compensation InnerFidelity uses, earphones that are more or less flat in the treble, such as the Audio-Technica CKM500, tend to sound overly edgy and unrefined while those with a sculpted response (e.g. HiFiMan RE272) can sound pretty good.
  


lordzero said:


> With some stretching =P I was able to fit the T-100 on my SteelSeries Flux In-ear
> 
> 
> 
> Oh and Happy 300!


 
  
 I've tried stretching the Comply cores before but they were tough so bravely I gave up. Glad you managed! 
  


papijoe08 said:


> Happy 300 joker! A job well done! )) Cheeeeeeeeers!


 
  


esanthosh said:


> Congrats on the 300th review. Looking forward to the 500th!
> 
> Hope you will add Philips S1 and S2 soon.


 
  


don lehrer said:


> +1


 

 Thank you all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 The Philips S1 and S2 will be added before the 500th


----------



## esanthosh

ljokerl said:


> The Philips S1 and S2 will be added before the 500th


 
  
 I am fondly hoping TF10 will be even more special - 1000th


----------



## airomjosh

Congrats on your 300th review. This calls for a celebration!!!


----------



## suman134

n0str3ss said:


> Not bad.


 
  


getclikinagas said:


> XBA H1 are on sale for Rs.6990 (6500 on ebay). Many impressed people over on the dedicated thread.


 

 " indian prices are supposed to be lower , if lunched . " sorry , its lunched . will we get the h3 or h2 !!! i will bag one in a month at least .


----------



## dleblanc343

solude said:


> My problem or hesitance on the Shure front is the cliff that is 10KHz+ on all Shure IEMs.


 
 You should definitely give it a try at least!
  
 If you're in Montreal sometime before the holidays, you can try mine. After that, I may only have the JH Roxanne


----------



## ljokerl

esanthosh said:


> I am fondly hoping TF10 will be even more special - 1000th


 
  
 Wonder how different the headphone market will be in 2027 when that happens 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


airomjosh said:


> Congrats on your 300th review. This calls for a celebration!!!


 

 Thanks


----------



## getclikinagas

ljokerl said:


> Wonder how different the headphone market will be in 2027 when that happens


 
  
 There'll be just one IEM model and everybody will have tunable ears! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 Congrats on this unbelievable milestone *ljokerl *





.


----------



## rawrster

joker, have you ever heard the SA7? I'm wondering what you think of them. I decided to pick one up as I've never owned a Sleek Audio iem and price wasn't too bad as they have a sale right now.


----------



## Solude

dleblanc343 said:


> If you're in Montreal sometime before the holidays, you can try mine. After that, I may only have the JH Roxanne


 
  
 This quest is pretty much about finding an alternative to the JH13fp.  Once I approach that price point... no point stay universal.


----------



## sound22

Dude happy 300th! 

On a side note, what do you mean by narrow ear canals i do not know if mine is since i have none to compare it to. Please help, i was planning to buy yamaha eph100sl.

Thanks in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

rawrster said:


> joker, have you ever heard the SA7? I'm wondering what you think of them. I decided to pick one up as I've never owned a Sleek Audio iem and price wasn't too bad as they have a sale right now.


 
  
 Sorry, never heard any Sleek stuff except the SA1.
  


getclikinagas said:


> There'll be just one IEM model and everybody will have tunable ears!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I can live with that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 And thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


sound22 said:


> Dude happy 300th!
> 
> On a side note, what do you mean by narrow ear canals i do not know if mine is since i have none to compare it to. Please help, i was planning to buy yamaha eph100sl.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 
  
 I guess if you normally use the smallest tips with any other earphone and get a better seal than with, say, a medium, you have narrow ear canals.


----------



## bartlett

Hey, got one last question. I know I said I wanted an IEM for under $50 but at this point I just want something like the FXT90 but with a bit more bass/subbass. I listen to R&B and Hip-Hop mostly with a good amount of Rock and Pop thrown in as well. The M11s that I have just are not cutting it, the music is not as immersive anymore lol. 
  
 Thanks a lot!


----------



## Gilly87

I'd check out Shure SE215 if I were you. Insane isolation, super ergonomic fit, and sounds just like what you bare describing: healthy bass that's not overdone, very clear mids, and smooth treble. The AT phones tend to be brighter and more aggressive so if you dislike harshness they might not be for you.





amitl said:


> Any thoughts on the Audio Technica CKS77 or CKS99 anyone?
> i'm really into the half-in-ear design because of it being a more *secure* fit,
> but i'm also looking for isolation.
> also, though i like bass, i don't like the mids too recessed, and i hate sibilance/harshness.
> ...


----------



## stimer

bartlett said:


> Hey, got one last question. I know I said I wanted an IEM for under $50 but at this point I just want something like the FXT90 but with a bit more bass/subbass. I listen to R&B and Hip-Hop mostly with a good amount of Rock and Pop thrown in as well. The M11s that I have just are not cutting it, the music is not as immersive anymore lol.
> 
> Thanks a lot!


 
 sony xb90ex


----------



## ichbinder

Congrats to the 300 ljokerl! Awesome job! Still can't believe that you are a single guy! I've recommended this thread to so many people already, cause it's better than many "professional", non-free reviews!
  
 Enough flowers, the reason why I write this time: 
  
 For all of you who think about - or might one day think about - getting the Westone 2: I got a pair as a gift in April 2011 and immediately liked their imho clean sound and loved their very sturdy fit, something not all non-customized IEMs have.
  
 However, after a few months they got damaged and thanks to Westones one-time-exchange-without-any-questions policy I got a new pair. Now, after approx. 22 months of daily and intensive usage, the jack starts to have a loose contact, causing dropouts every now and then. As always in the beginning of such problems, it now only occurs during movement, e.g. while riding a bike. But soon, they will be pretty useless.
  
 Sad, cause I really liked them and hoped and expected them to be a bit more resistant, given their design and all. I already contacted Westone and they will give me an offer for a discounted exchange pair or upgrade for other Westone products.
  
 As always, ljokerl's thread is my trusted place to see what I might choose, exchange or upgrade.
  
 Thanks again!!
 ichbinder
  
*Edit*: Anybody (ljokerl?) any thoughts on the Westone Adventure series? They sound like their robust design is for me, but given that they are about as expensive as the Westone 2 (I think), I fear that the more robust material causes less good sound for the overall same price...?


----------



## MoonYeol

A failing jack can easily be repaired with $30 (?) worth of material and tools.. If it's only your jack that's failing and not the housings or something else, then you should reterminate them. Simply because it's damn cheap (someone you know probably has a voltmeter, soldering iron and soldering tin, you just have to get the plug) and then you can start to look around if you feel like it, without the pressing need to get a new pair within a week. That's how I would do if I had a failing jack.


----------



## ichbinder

moonyeol said:


> A failing jack can easily be repaired with $30 (?) worth of material and tools.. If it's only your jack that's failing and not the housings or something else, then you should reterminate them. Simply because it's damn cheap (someone you know probably has a voltmeter, soldering iron and soldering tin, you just have to get the plug) and then you can start to look around if you feel like it, without the pressing need to get a new pair within a week. That's how I would do if I had a failing jack.


 

 Thanks for the reply, MoonYeol!
  
 Yeah, I considered that, too. However, I am total noob when it comes to such things... But I was planning to ask a professional electrician, whom I know, before getting anything from Westone. Nearly forgot about it, though. Thanks for reminding!
  
 Hm, I'm nevertheless interested in thoughts on the Adventure series.


----------



## d marc0

ichbinder said:


> *Edit*: Anybody (ljokerl?) any thoughts on the Westone Adventure series? They sound like their robust design is for me, but given that they are about as expensive as the Westone 2 (I think), I fear that the more robust material causes less good sound for the overall same price...?




Not so good...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo260iE9Jm4&feature=youtube_gdata_player


----------



## Deviltooth

ichbinder said:


> Congrats to the 300 ljokerl! Awesome job! Still can't believe that you are a single guy! I've recommended this thread to so many people already, cause it's better than many "professional", non-free reviews!
> 
> Enough flowers, the reason why I write this time:
> 
> ...


 

 You should hunt down the Adventure Series thread here; a lot has been said about them.  Though in short your inference is likely correct.


----------



## stimer




----------



## Solude

Here is what I keep reading... JH13fp is like an ER4S with great bottom end.  Use this filter or that filter, inline impedance adapter yada yada.  So my thought is to get a ER-4PT use a slightly brighter filter and an amp with a bass boost.  Boom poor mans universal JH13fp   I am high or is this doable?
  
 In other news, can anyone confirm the the ER-4S is just a 4P with an inline impedance that can't be removed?


----------



## suman134

solude said:


> Here is what I keep reading... JH13fp is like an ER4S with great bottom end.  Use this filter or that filter, inline impedance adapter yada yada.  So my thought is to get a ER-4PT use a slightly brighter filter and an amp with a bass boost.  Boom poor mans universal JH13fp   I am high or is this doable?
> 
> In other news, can anyone confirm the the ER-4S is just a 4P with an inline impedance that can't be removed?


 
  
     i had tried both , and i went for 4p cuz it sounds better straight out of my j3 with out an amp , i dont like carrying an additional amp every time i go out . i agree , 4s is just a 4p with a inline impedance that cant be removed , and if you want a 4s out of 4p , you can buy that extension from ety research .


----------



## ljokerl

bartlett said:


> Hey, got one last question. I know I said I wanted an IEM for under $50 but at this point I just want something like the FXT90 but with a bit more bass/subbass. I listen to R&B and Hip-Hop mostly with a good amount of Rock and Pop thrown in as well. The M11s that I have just are not cutting it, the music is not as immersive anymore lol.
> 
> Thanks a lot!


 
  
 Use an equalizer to slightly boost the bass on the FXT90 - they should be able to handle it. You may also want to look into the JVC triple dynamics. I haven't heard them but the early feedback I got was that they sound like the FXT90 with an extra woofer + more overall refinement. There should be a dedicated thread somewhere...
  


ichbinder said:


> Congrats to the 300 ljokerl! Awesome job! Still can't believe that you are a single guy! I've recommended this thread to so many people already, cause it's better than many "professional", non-free reviews!
> 
> Enough flowers, the reason why I write this time:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks, I appreciate that. Maybe the new Westone 20 (is that what it's called?) will sound the same and have a detachable cable. Could be a good long-term upgrade. 
  
 Also, *MoonYeol* is right - if it's failing at the jack it's probably not irreparable. Might not be pretty but a DIY fix is possible. 
  
 Regarding the ADV - i posted my (very) short thoughts on them here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-300-iems-compared-jh-audio-jh13-pro-added-10-17-13-p-786/10830#post_9585512 . Haven't touched them since. 
  


moonyeol said:


> A failing jack can easily be repaired with $30 (?) worth of material and tools.. If it's only your jack that's failing and not the housings or something else, then you should reterminate them. Simply because it's damn cheap (someone you know probably has a voltmeter, soldering iron and soldering tin, you just have to get the plug) and then you can start to look around if you feel like it, without the pressing need to get a new pair within a week. That's how I would do if I had a failing jack.


 
  
 My thoughts exactly.
  
  


stimer said:


>


 
  
 That's about how they feel in the ear 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


solude said:


> Here is what I keep reading... JH13fp is like an ER4S with great bottom end.  Use this filter or that filter, inline impedance adapter yada yada.  So my thought is to get a ER-4PT use a slightly brighter filter and an amp with a bass boost.  Boom poor mans universal JH13fp   I am high or is this doable?
> 
> In other news, can anyone confirm the the ER-4S is just a 4P with an inline impedance that can't be removed?


 
  
 The ER4S is just a 4P with inline impedance that can't be removed.
  
 As for the JH13 thing, I honestly don't know how close you would get in overall performance but that would get the signature closer.


----------



## Kain96z

Is their any review like this for headphones because that was an amazing amount of info in one place. Thank you for putting this together.


----------



## Shawn71

kain96z said:


> Is their any review like this for headphones because that was an amazing amount of info in one place. Thank you for putting this together.


 
 for portable headphones..........again by our great |joker|
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/433318/shootout-108-portable-headphones-reviewed-denon-dn-hp1000-added-09-07-13


----------



## Tommy C

@ ljokerl
Congrats on the 300th. Keep up the good work.


----------



## asdfvtn

Congrats on the 300th joker! 
  
 Question though. I'm trying to pick out a budget IEM (~<$50) for classical music, so I suppose a fairly balanced IEM with an above average sound stage. I own quite a few bass-focused IEMs and headphones, so this change will be nice. What do you recommend?
 Some IEMs I'm considering right now include Sony XBA C10, Vsonic VC02, Astrotec AM-90, Brainwavz Delta, and EtyKids 5. 
 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

kain96z said:


> Is their any review like this for headphones because that was an amazing amount of info in one place. Thank you for putting this together.


 
  
 The one Shawn71 linked is my thread for portable/semi-portable headphones. Admittedly I don't dedicate as much time to it as this one, though. 


tommy c said:


> @ ljokerl
> Congrats on the 300th. Keep up the good work.


 
  
 Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





asdfvtn said:


> Congrats on the 300th joker!
> 
> Question though. I'm trying to pick out a budget IEM (~<$50) for classical music, so I suppose a fairly balanced IEM with an above average sound stage. I own quite a few bass-focused IEMs and headphones, so this change will be nice. What do you recommend?
> Some IEMs I'm considering right now include Sony XBA C10, Vsonic VC02, Astrotec AM-90, Brainwavz Delta, and EtyKids 5.
> Thanks!


 

 LG Quadbeat would be a good one - it's got a mild v-shape to its response but it's pretty balanced and has a wider presentation than most. The VC02 is also very good if you don't mind slightly hotter treble. It's definitely one of the tightest and clearest sets in the price range. The Etykids are good for a slightly more mid-centric sound with smoother treble but the presentation is more intimate.


----------



## Kain96z

Thanks, I completely missed that on your profile. I can't wait to spend some time reading that.


----------



## glorkaglickflic

That's it !!!  My mind is made up  !!!!  Its the CLASSIC Etymotics ER 4S for me  !!!!


----------



## asdfvtn

Thanks for the help joker!


----------



## ljokerl

kain96z said:


> Thanks, I completely missed that on your profile. I can't wait to spend some time reading that.


 


asdfvtn said:


> Thanks for the help joker!


 
  




  


glorkaglickflic said:


> That's it !!!  My mind is made up  !!!!  Its the CLASSIC Etymotics ER 4S for me  !!!!


 
  
 An oldie but definitely a goodie...


----------



## kartikk

Hello ljokerl  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 I was wondering how the soundmagic e10,philips she3580 & jvc ha fx 40 compare for rock/metal music?
 Which do you think would be better? this will be for a friend who is a metal drummer (he owned a e10 previously which he seemed to like but the cables broke so he is looking for a replacement).
 Also do you have any other suggestions below the price of 35$?


----------



## suman134

kartikk said:


> Hello ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

     go for ha fx 40 , he will like it for sure , good for rock and metal , better then e10 , just a bit of sibilance , you can try pny midtown uptown .


----------



## MoonYeol

3580 is a bit thin for rock in my opinion. Haven't heard the others. However VC02 is good for almost anything.


----------



## ljokerl

kartikk said:


> Hello ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 They're all pretty good earphones. Out of those three I personally like the 3580 the best (slightly) but it does have a somewhat v-shaped signature. If you can still find it for sale and don't mind the mic, the LG Quadbeat is a good one as well as long as your friend doesn't need greatly enhanced bass. It's clearer and more balanced than the SHE3580, FX40, and E10. Used to be $20-25 on ebay but they've been getting scarce.


----------



## ChrisRPM12

Congratulations on your 300th review! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I have a question...what are your thought on the LG GS100 as I am planning to purchase one of these. Golden Ears has also posted the measurements here.. http://en.goldenears.net/index.php?mid=GR_Earphones&document_srl=22924


----------



## ljokerl

chrisrpm12 said:


> Congratulations on your 300th review!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Haven't tried it. Measurements make it look like it'll more v-shaped than the Quadbeat, though.


----------



## ozkan

Hi Joker,
  
 The left driver of my RE0 started to distort on some bassy songs. Can you please recommend me an iem to replace the RE0? I loved its treble and looking for a new iem which sounds as good as it. Do you think  LG Quadbeat is for me?
  Btw, congratulations on your 300th review.


----------



## MoonYeol

I can vouch for the Rockit R-50 as an upgrade from Re0.


----------



## Zelda

moonyeol said:


> I can vouch for the Rockit R-50 as an upgrade from Re0.


 
 +1


----------



## ozkan

moonyeol said:


> I can vouch for the Rockit R-50 as an upgrade from Re0.


 
  
  
 R-50 is not my cup of coffee. I had it in the past and tried it with etymotic triple flanges. Its treble is also different from RE0s and those triple flanges gave me some discomfort and muffled the sound a bit.


----------



## Deviltooth

ozkan said:


> R-50 is not my cup of coffee. I had it in the past and tried it with etymotic triple flanges. Its treble is also different from RE0s and those triple flanges gave me some discomfort and muffled the sound a bit.


 
 I'd go with the RE-400, it's even more engaging than the previous generation Hifiman products.


----------



## MoonYeol

If you liked the treble of Re0 and want similar, then Re400 is not for you. It has a really smooth and rolled off treble that to my ears doesn't bring the excitement that the Re0 does (did).
  
 Interesting how you found it very engaging and I just found it incredibly boring without EQ. But I think that my ears were busy drooling over CK100Pro then and weren't at all interested in Re400.


----------



## Deviltooth

moonyeol said:


> If you liked the treble of Re0 and want similar, then Re400 is not for you. It has a really smooth and rolled off treble that to my ears doesn't bring the excitement that the Re0 does (did).
> 
> Interesting how you found it very engaging and I just found it incredibly boring without EQ. But I think that my ears were busy drooling over CK100Pro then and weren't at all interested in Re400.


 

 I have an RE-Zero and for me the RE-400 is a much improved version of that earphone.  I've read that the signature of the RE-0 and RE-Zero are very close.  The RE-400 may not be as obviously bright but that's not due to a lack of treble, it's just giving you more of everything else for a better balance.


----------



## Amitl

any thoughts on the Sony xb90ex and Audio Technica CKS99?


----------



## ljokerl

ozkan said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> The left driver of my RE0 started to distort on some bassy songs. Can you please recommend me an iem to replace the RE0? I loved its treble and looking for a new iem which sounds as good as it. Do you think  LG Quadbeat is for me?
> Btw, congratulations on your 300th review.


 
  
 The Quadbeat is not quite an upgrade from the RE0 but it's not far behind considering the price. It's got a more v-shaped signature. Treble is a little brighter and harsher but overall not bad. The newer Quadbeat 2 is supposed to be better in this regard but unfortunately I haven't tried it yet. 
  
 The now-defunct RE272 is still the closest I've heard to an RE0 upgrade. The newer RE-400 has more laid-back treble, which may or may not be a plus for you.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Congratulations on your 300th review Joker! 

Just a quick question, would you be getting the Noble 3C for a review? And how do you think it will stand against the 1964 V3 or even the Alclair Reference? I'm seriously considering either this, or maybe a quad driver universal like the SM64s. What do you think?


----------



## imackler

I loved the JH13 review...but now I have hope you might get the UERM, too! Like many, I'd be eager to hear your comparison.


----------



## suman134

amitl said:


> any thoughts on the Sony xb90ex and Audio Technica CKS99?


 
  
     the thought on xb90ex is , deep rumbling not too much dominating but pleasant bass , simply put , beautiful bass , nice mids , clear , crisp , instruments are separable , layering is good , sound stage is nice , better then xba-3 ( on sound stage ) , female vocal is not so enjoyable , good highs , sharp but not as sharp as hafx40 , if you are looking for bass , this is it , havent heard something as good as this under $60 with a bass signature . nice zipper carry pouch , obvious bunch of tips , 4 with out foam and 3 with foam stuffed , i use jvc foams , and a cable clip completes the package . and a beautiful sound signature for a bass phone , not dry like xb30ex ( gave it to a friend ) or xb21ex  ( gave it to my uncle ) , has better clarity then xb41ex . not so clear , clarity is not up to the mark of a good ba like she9850 , but clear enough . a bit v shaped sig you can say . but man , beautiful is the word comes out my mouth , and is available in india at just under $60 . a sweet sweet bass phone . it just brings the bass out of any given track , like , it can invent bass from just a hint .
  
 for test i use , george barnett - super hero in a ball , and rise against - hairline fracture .
  
 blank about the other one .


----------



## ljokerl

gryphus0204 said:


> Congratulations on your 300th review Joker!
> 
> Just a quick question, would you be getting the Noble 3C for a review? And how do you think it will stand against the 1964 V3 or even the Alclair Reference? I'm seriously considering either this, or maybe a quad driver universal like the SM64s. What do you think?


 
  
 I have the Noble 4S, but not the 3C. The 4S is great - I like it better than my old 8.A from Heir. 
  


imackler said:


> I loved the JH13 review...but now I have hope you might get the UERM, too! Like many, I'd be eager to hear your comparison.


 
  
 I'll get a chance to try a demo UERM soon but I won't be getting a customized one, at least not for a while 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Not really able to keep up with all of my other reviews as is.


----------



## rawrster

I think you should get a UERM  You would probably like it.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> I have the Noble 4S, but not the 3C. The 4S is great - I like it better than my old 8.A from Heir.
> 
> 
> I'll get a chance to try a demo UERM soon but I won't be getting a customized one, at least not for a while  . Not really able to keep up with all of my other reviews as is.




I just noticed that you were getting the demo next. Which thread will you be posting impressions on?


----------



## Love Music

Hi Joker,
  
 I am looking for an new iem with a big soundstage, forward vocals , good detail and clarity. I am not a basshead so I want my bass to be accurate/neutral. In terms of treble I like some sparkle but never harsh/sibilant with good extension. I listen to a wide variety of different music ranging from rock, metal, jazz, vocals, post rock, shoegaze, pop, r'n'b, hip hop, rap, instrumentals, classical. Some of the music can be really complex so this iem must also have good instrument seperation and imaging. I had previously owned an UE900, which was quite a good iem but I found vocals to sound distant and hollow at times so I returned it in the end. Currently I'm thinking of the W4, SM64 and the new FAD heaven iem's. What do you think will be most suitable?


----------



## justblue

love music said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I am looking for an new iem with a big soundstage, forward vocals , good detail and clarity. I am not a basshead so I want my bass to be accurate/neutral. In terms of treble I like some sparkle but never harsh/sibilant with good extension. I listen to a wide variety of different music ranging from rock, metal, jazz, vocals, post rock, shoegaze, pop, r'n'b, hip hop, rap, instrumentals, classical. Some of the music can be really complex so this iem must also have good instrument seperation and imaging. I had previously owned an UE900, which was quite a good iem but I found vocals to sound distant and hollow at times so I returned it in the end. Currently I'm thinking of the W4, SM64 and the new FAD heaven iem's. What do you think will be most suitable?


 
  
 not to me, though I want to help |joker| with his reviews in progress (especially one of them) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 well, the SE535 has almost all what you want, prominent vocals, big realistic soundstage and a balanced detail and clarity as well (I mean something between musicality and analyticity - they're on-stage monitors after all). the treble is a bit laid back (but you know, you can't have everything 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). as far as sibilance is concerned it depends on the track. the SE535 (like monitors do) is quite accurate, so it would reproduce sibilants which weren't removed in a studio production. there is also a variable tolerance and sibilance sensibility depending on the individual hearing, you should take into account.
 thank you for your attention


----------



## MoonYeol

I think the UE900 with semi blocked pinholes and 100 ohm adapter has all that except large soundstage which is ok but is pretty good in depth and height. It's a shame you sold them if you didn't try the "mod".


----------



## Lifted Andreas

live with sound said:


> That price is a discounted one Grayson; if you want to get it at that price, better order fast. Also, I'm praying that the Zero Audio Basso's kick the VSD1's ass, as I've ordered those. If you haven't yet, I suggest you look into those IEMs also
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Check the Zero Audio thread mate, I think a couple of users have compared those already.


----------



## ljokerl

rawrster said:


> I think you should get a UERM  You would probably like it.


 
  
 We'll see 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


vwinter said:


> I just noticed that you were getting the demo next. Which thread will you be posting impressions on?


 
  
 This one, probably. I let the organizers know I didn't have much time so I'll be brief.
  


love music said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I am looking for an new iem with a big soundstage, forward vocals , good detail and clarity. I am not a basshead so I want my bass to be accurate/neutral. In terms of treble I like some sparkle but never harsh/sibilant with good extension. I listen to a wide variety of different music ranging from rock, metal, jazz, vocals, post rock, shoegaze, pop, r'n'b, hip hop, rap, instrumentals, classical. Some of the music can be really complex so this iem must also have good instrument seperation and imaging. I had previously owned an UE900, which was quite a good iem but I found vocals to sound distant and hollow at times so I returned it in the end. Currently I'm thinking of the W4, SM64 and the new FAD heaven iem's. What do you think will be most suitable?


 

 Not familiar with the FAD heaven. The W4 is good but it might have a little too much mid-bass if you want neutral, and there's not much treble sparkle. The SM64 is closer than the W4 to what you're after. It's definitely not a neutral earphone but it seems like it would be a good fit. It has more sub-bass than a strictly accurate earphone but overall the bass is not intrusive. There's an upper midrange dip, but the vocals are not dull as they can be with the UE900. The SE535 would also be good except for the lack of treble sparkle.


----------



## Amitl

Suman! thanx for the xb90ex comments!
 i'm enjoying the MEElec CW31 that you and joker recommended me about 
 i owe a big thank you to both of you.
 how's the xb90ex's cable? i have a big traumatic feeling for the MH1's cable... can't use these, even with a clip, i find these unusable because of the cable.
 so is the xb90ex's cable better?
 and how is comfort?
 thanks!!


----------



## suman134

amitl said:


> Suman! thanx for the xb90ex comments!
> i'm enjoying the MEElec CW31 that you and joker recommended me about
> i owe a big thank you to both of you.
> how's the xb90ex's cable? i have a big traumatic feeling for the MH1's cable... can't use these, even with a clip, i find these unusable because of the cable.
> ...


 

 xb90ex cable are better then anything i have seen so far on a earphone , they are a bit heavy but nothing serious . comfort is good , dont go deep , serrated flat cable are really nice , better then xba-3 and dont tangle much .


----------



## justgotlucky123

hey joker, can you do a review of tdk eb950 and the nuforce ne-650m?


----------



## Love Music

moonyeol said:


> I think the UE900 with semi blocked pinholes and 100 ohm adapter has all that except large soundstage which is ok but is pretty good in depth and height. It's a shame you sold them if you didn't try the "mod".


 
 The thing I liked most about the UE900 was the treble extension and the height of there soundstage. Also the bass was just the right level.
  
  


justblue said:


> not to me, though I want to help |joker| with his reviews in progress (especially one of them)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks for the suggestion. I already have a CK100 and I believe that they have quite similar sound sigs, but I think the CK100 performs better technically and it hasn't got that treble roll off. I have not heard it though that is what I got from reading Joker's review on them.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> Not familiar with the FAD heaven. The W4 is good but it might have a little too much mid-bass if you want neutral, and there's not much treble sparkle. The SM64 is closer than the W4 to what you're after. It's definitely not a neutral earphone but it seems like it would be a good fit. It has more sub-bass than a strictly accurate earphone but overall the bass is not intrusive. There's an upper midrange dip, but the vocals are not dull as they can be with the UE900. The SE535 would also be good except for the lack of treble sparkle.


 
  
 Thanks Joker. How does the SM64 perform unamped straight through an mp3 player, since the impedance on these are quite high. I have tried the SM3 briefly before and the thing that bothered me the most about them is the lack of clarity in the mids due to the note thickness. Does the SM64 have the same issues? 
  
 I have the CK100 at the moment as my main iem. From reading the review the Se535 sounds quite similar to the CK100's since they both have forward mids, light bass and an intimate soundstage.


----------



## ljokerl

amitl said:


> i'm enjoying the MEElec CW31 that you and joker recommended me about
> i owe a big thank you to both of you.


 
  
 Glad you like the CWs! It's a shame they seem to have been discontinued.
  


justgotlucky123 said:


> hey joker, can you do a review of tdk eb950 and the nuforce ne-650m?


 
  
 Sorry, don't have either on hand at this time. 
  


love music said:


> The thing I liked most about the UE900 was the treble extension and the height of there soundstage. Also the bass was just the right level.
> 
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion. I already have a CK100 and I believe that they have quite similar sound sigs, but I think the CK100 performs better technically and it hasn't got that treble roll off. I have not heard it though that is what I got from reading Joker's review on them.


 
  
 IIRC it also has a bit of bass roll-off compared to the 535 or SM64. It's a unique-sounding earphone even by today's standards. I've always hope the replacement CK100Pro would perform even better overall 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
  


love music said:


> Thanks Joker. How does the SM64 perform unamped straight through an mp3 player, since the impedance on these are quite high. I have tried the SM3 briefly before and the thing that bothered me the most about them is the lack of clarity in the mids due to the note thickness. Does the SM64 have the same issues?
> 
> I have the CK100 at the moment as my main iem. From reading the review the Se535 sounds quite similar to the CK100's since they both have forward mids, light bass and an intimate soundstage.


 
  
 The SM64 is clearer than and not quite as thick as the SM3 - there's a short A:B at the end of my SM64 review. It didn't seem very hard to drive with decent sources like the Cowon J3 - it forces you to crank up the volume but the sound quality doesn't really suffer. If you're using a poorer source there will likely be a larger difference between amped and unamped.


----------



## ericr

FWIW the Clip Zip drives the SM64 quite nicely.


----------



## Amitl

thanx Suman and Joker!


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Custom Art Music One 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


> *(1C22) Custom Art Music One*
> 
> 
> Reviewed October 2013
> ...


 
  
 The Music One has also been added to the comparison table at http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/


----------



## Deviltooth

I'm not surprised the Music One is a winner.  My Custom Art Pro 330 is absolutely excellent.


----------



## justblue

But the Music One is exceptional because of its smooth natural sounding, without any harshness or sibilance. As far as I know it's hard to find such fun earphones among CIEMs.
 |joker| thanks for the review!


----------



## Love Music

ericr said:


> FWIW the Clip Zip drives the SM64 quite nicely.


 
 Great thanks.
  


ljokerl said:


> IIRC it also has a bit of bass roll-off compared to the 535 or SM64. It's a unique-sounding earphone even by today's standards. I've always hope the replacement CK100Pro would perform even better overall
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 The CK100 is a really special iem indeed, I really like the way they present vocals. Really looking forward to your review on the CK100Pro's 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Thanks Joker. Now to decide between the SM64, Heaven V and Heaven VI...


----------



## TooLazy

I'm in search of a fairly good IEM in the price range of $20-25. I've been thinking about the Brainwavz Delta and the Quadbeat 2 - neither of which have reviews here, but the initial impressions make me think these would be the best choices - though obviously I'm open to new ideas. My preferred sound signature is a slight V-shape with a lot of detail, or at least as much as one can get in this price range.
  
 Backstory: After a lot of hesitation, roughly two months ago I bought a JVC HA-FXD80, seeing a great offer for it. I was really impressed (though a slightly less recessed midrange would've been nice, but it was still alright), especially by their clarity, but two days ago they broke - the right side became incredibly quiet, barely audible. This happening after such a short time is really disappointing, but I don't see how I could get them repaired, since this doesn't seem to be a cable issue.
  
 Thanks in advance. :x


----------



## esteebin

toolazy said:


> I'm in search of a fairly good IEM in the price range of $20-25. I've been thinking about the Brainwavz Delta and the Quadbeat 2 - neither of which have reviews here, but the initial impressions make me think these would be the best choices - though obviously I'm open to new ideas. My preferred sound signature is a *slight V-shape with a lot of detail*, or at least as much as one can get in this price range.
> 
> Backstory: After a lot of hesitation, roughly two months ago I bought a JVC HA-FXD80, seeing a great offer for it. I was really impressed (though a slightly less recessed midrange would've been nice, but it was still alright), especially by their clarity, but two days ago they broke - the right side became incredibly quiet, barely audible. This happening after such a short time is really disappointing, but I don't see how I could get them repaired, since this doesn't seem to be a cable issue.
> 
> Thanks in advance. :x


 
 Other headphones work fine with your source? Maybe try to wipe the plug or Q-tip the port clean. Is the FXD80 still under warranty?
  
 if you're willing to up your price range to ~$50, the Vsonic VSD1 lineup may suit your preference.
  
 Joker's review:
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/more-less-vsonic-vsd1-and-vsd1s
  
 Discussion thread:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/663709/vsonic-vsd1-vsd1s-reviews-impression-thread/1050#post_9932408


----------



## garcsa

ljokerl said:


> Glad you like the CWs! It's a shame they seem to have been discontinued.


 
 Yep, agree. Discontinued - like CC51 and CX21, a really good ones.
  
 BTW , before a month bought my VC1000 and really  enjoy it ! Yesterday (or today?)  reed your Custom Art Music One review... So what to say , am I need one more pair of  IEM (rhetorical question....) ? 
 1.) Never had a custom ones. 
 2.) Poland is my neighborhood. 
 3.) Price seems very affordable!. 
 4.) My 55th birthday is very soon : in March...
 5.) My wifes gift will be a pair of socks. 
 Yes I need!
 Waiting for your 333rd review. Congrats in advance!


----------



## modulor

toolazy said:


> I'm in search of a fairly good IEM in the price range of $20-25. I've been thinking about the Brainwavz Delta and the Quadbeat 2 - neither of which have reviews here, but the initial impressions make me think these would be the best choices - though obviously I'm open to new ideas. My preferred sound signature is a slight V-shape with a lot of detail, or at least as much as one can get in this price range.
> 
> Backstory: After a lot of hesitation, roughly two months ago I bought a JVC HA-FXD80, seeing a great offer for it. I was really impressed (though a slightly less recessed midrange would've been nice, but it was still alright), especially by their clarity, but two days ago they broke - the right side became incredibly quiet, barely audible. This happening after such a short time is really disappointing, but I don't see how I could get them repaired, since this doesn't seem to be a cable issue.
> 
> Thanks in advance. :x


 
 There is actually a decent bit of information (with more impressions to come) on the QB 2 over here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/686412/lg-quadbeat-2-appreciation-thread Seems like it could be a great budget-friendly option the way the MH1/MH1C is, and to a slightly lesser extent the original Quadbeat.


----------



## Artem

toolazy said:


> I'm in search of a fairly good IEM in the price range of $20-25. I've been thinking about the Brainwavz Delta and the Quadbeat 2 - neither of which have reviews here, but the initial impressions make me think these would be the best choices - though obviously I'm open to new ideas. My preferred sound signature is a slight V-shape with a lot of detail, or at least as much as one can get in this price range.
> 
> Backstory: After a lot of hesitation, roughly two months ago I bought a JVC HA-FXD80, seeing a great offer for it. I was really impressed (though a slightly less recessed midrange would've been nice, but it was still alright), especially by their clarity, but two days ago they broke - the right side became incredibly quiet, barely audible. This happening after such a short time is really disappointing, but I don't see how I could get them repaired, since this doesn't seem to be a cable issue.
> 
> Thanks in advance. :x


 
  
 you might want to check out this thread. It has quite a few budget IEMs that can be gotton from amazon for 20 or less.


----------



## TooLazy

esteebin said:


> Other headphones work fine with your source? Maybe try to wipe the plug or Q-tip the port clean. Is the FXD80 still under warranty?
> 
> if you're willing to up your price range to ~$50, the Vsonic VSD1 lineup may suit your preference.
> 
> ...


 
 Yes, I've checked the FXD80 with other sources and the same sources with other earphones. I've also cleaned the ports, checked the earphones for possible wax - to no effect. Unfortunately that $25 jump would be a bit too steep for me right now. :x
  


modulor said:


> There is actually a decent bit of information (with more impressions to come) on the QB 2 over here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/686412/lg-quadbeat-2-appreciation-thread Seems like it could be a great budget-friendly option the way the MH1/MH1C is, and to a slightly lesser extent the original Quadbeat.


 
  
 Yes, I've seen that thread and am subscribed to it. That overwhelmingly positive feedback is what made me consider it, though I'm still a little worried it might just be hype.


artem said:


> you might want to check out this thread. It has quite a few budget IEMs that can be gotton from amazon for 20 or less.


 
 I visit that thread quite frequently, though lately it seems like most of the "discoveries" have been a bit pricier. It does seem like a good resource, though.
  
 Thanks for the replies everyone! I'll wait for a few more, since I'm horribly indecisive, but I'm leaning towards the Quadbeat 2 despite the flat cable.


----------



## carfentanil

love music said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I am looking for an new iem with a big soundstage, forward vocals , good detail and clarity. I am not a basshead so I want my bass to be accurate/neutral. In terms of treble I like some sparkle but never harsh/sibilant with good extension. I listen to a wide variety of different music ranging from rock, metal, jazz, vocals, post rock, shoegaze, pop, r'n'b, hip hop, rap, instrumentals, classical. Some of the music can be really complex so this iem must also have good instrument seperation and imaging. I had previously owned an UE900, which was quite a good iem but I found vocals to sound distant and hollow at times so I returned it in the end. Currently I'm thinking of the W4, SM64 and the new FAD heaven iem's. What do you think will be most suitable?




 Love Music, that description is close to what many people say about Sony's MDR-7550. *ljokerl* or others care to comment?


----------



## modulor

toolazy said:


> Yes, I've seen that thread and am subscribed to it. That overwhelmingly positive feedback is what made me consider it, though I'm still a little worried it might just be hype.
> I visit that thread quite frequently, though lately it seems like most of the "discoveries" have been a bit pricier. It does seem like a good resource, though.
> 
> Thanks for the replies everyone! I'll wait for a few more, since I'm horribly indecisive, but I'm leaning towards the Quadbeat 2 despite the flat cable.


 
  
 I trust Inks opinion as his impressions on various things I've heard myself seem to be fairly accurate.  It is early on as they were recently released in Korea, so naturally you have to expect a bit of hype.  For me personally, the massive hype turned me off the MH1/MH1C when that was all anyone could talk about, so after it died down I decided to try them out.  Definitely a worthwhile investment - I am hoping the case is the same with the QB 2 as well.  If the cable is similar to the QB 1, it's not all that bad.  Also, I believe the mic/control has universal functionality with Android devices if that is any benefit to you.


----------



## TooLazy

modulor said:


> I trust Inks opinion as his impressions on various things I've heard myself seem to be fairly accurate.  It is early on as they were recently released in Korea, so naturally you have to expect a bit of hype.  For me personally, the massive hype turned me off the MH1/MH1C when that was all anyone could talk about, so after it died down I decided to try them out.  Definitely a worthwhile investment - I am hoping the case is the same with the QB 2 as well.  If the cable is similar to the QB 1, it's not all that bad.  Also, I believe the mic/control has universal functionality with Android devices if that is any benefit to you.


 

 That's good to hear. Judging from pictures, the cable does look similar to that of the first one. How is it in terms of microphonics (worn over the ear)?


----------



## goodvibes

I'm assuming that the Custom Art Music One is vented into a small interior chamber and not to the outside. Hard to tell from pics.


----------



## piotrus-g

goodvibes said:


> I'm assuming that the Custom Art Music One is vented into a small interior chamber


 
 That's correct


----------



## modulor

toolazy said:


> That's good to hear. Judging from pictures, the cable does look similar to that of the first one. How is it in terms of microphonics (worn over the ear)?


 
 Microphonics are not bad when worn cable up but pretty noticeable cable down, like most flat cables I've tried.  Not nearly as bad as the stock MH1 cable, which had to go. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I will say that with the original QB, the large driver housing, shorter nozzle and odd silicone tips it can be a bit challenging to get them in, especially over ear.  Once they are in place though it's no problem.  The QB2 seems to resolve all those issues plus improve on the sound of the original and purportedly compete with much higher tier IEMs.  I am awaiting further impressions myself, but primarily holding off because I just got two MH1s and a QB1 in the past month.


----------



## TooLazy

modulor said:


> Microphonics are not bad when worn cable up but pretty noticeable cable down, like most flat cables I've tried.  Not nearly as bad as the stock MH1 cable, which had to go.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I absolutely hate wearing IEMs cable down, so that's not a big problem. I'll probably take a chance and go for it, then. It's still pretty sad that the money spent on the FXD80 is down the drain, but not much I can do at this point, I think. :c
  
 Thanks for the help! :>


----------



## modulor

ljokerl said:


> Added the Custom Art Music One


 
 Great write-up (as always) and these have caught my attention now.  This is the first time hearing about Custom Art, actually...reading up on the appreciation thread now.  I've been considering venturing into BA territory after hearing an HF5 recently and also tossing around the idea of cIEMs but as far as cost goes they've been a bit out of my range.  The Music One seems like it could bridge that gap and serve me well based on your description, and the prospect of silicone housing is appealing from a comfort standpoint.


----------



## modulor

toolazy said:


> I absolutely hate wearing IEMs cable down, so that's not a big problem. I'll probably take a chance and go for it, then. It's still pretty sad that the money spent on the FXD80 is down the drain, but not much I can do at this point, I think. :c
> 
> Thanks for the help! :>


 
 That is truly a shame on the JVCs, but hopefully the QB2 (or whatever you decide on) will serve you well.  They can be had on Ebay for $25-$30 shipped from Korea at the moment.  Definitely post your results on the QB2 thread if you decide to pull the trigger


----------



## Emre9110

Patiently waiting your quadbeat 2 rewiev Joker


----------



## ljokerl

Looks like esteebin beat me to it, but my review of the VSD1 and VSD1S from VSonic, complete with measurements, has been posted on InnerFidelity: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/more-less-vsonic-vsd1-and-vsd1s . I'll add them to this thread next month but the preliminary scoring puts them just above the Sony MH1C sound-wise. More than a little impressive for $50.
  
 Also, RHA is holding a review giveaway for their MA650 and MA750 models. Seems like you nominate yourself and one other person to receive a sample, which is a great idea for a community like Head-Fi. Not sure about the MA650 but the MA750 is thus far a very fun listen with superb build quality. Anyone curious about it may want to give the thread a visit here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/687315/rhas-running-a-ma750-and-ma600-review-programme .
  


deviltooth said:


> I'm not surprised the Music One is a winner.  My Custom Art Pro 330 is absolutely excellent.


 
  


justblue said:


> But the Music One is exceptional because of its smooth natural sounding, without any harshness or sibilance. As far as I know it's hard to find such fun earphones among CIEMs.
> |joker| thanks for the review!


 
  
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


love music said:


> The CK100 is a really special iem indeed, I really like the way they present vocals. Really looking forward to your review on the CK100Pro's


 
  
 Maybe when Audio-Technica deems the US market worthy of their BA models again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


toolazy said:


> I'm in search of a fairly good IEM in the price range of $20-25. I've been thinking about the Brainwavz Delta and the Quadbeat 2 - neither of which have reviews here, but the initial impressions make me think these would be the best choices - though obviously I'm open to new ideas. My preferred sound signature is a slight V-shape with a lot of detail, or at least as much as one can get in this price range.
> 
> Backstory: After a lot of hesitation, roughly two months ago I bought a JVC HA-FXD80, seeing a great offer for it. I was really impressed (though a slightly less recessed midrange would've been nice, but it was still alright), especially by their clarity, but two days ago they broke - the right side became incredibly quiet, barely audible. This happening after such a short time is really disappointing, but I don't see how I could get them repaired, since this doesn't seem to be a cable issue.
> 
> Thanks in advance. :x


 
  
 From the measurements someone posted a few pages back it seems like the Quadbeat 2 is more v-shaped than the original Quadbeat. The original Quadbeat is actually rather well-balanced, just has a very mild v-shape to it. Certainly not as bad in that regard as the FXD80. Not knowing much about the Quadbeat 2 I would definitely recommend the original one for you.
  


garcsa said:


> Yep, agree. Discontinued - like CC51 and CX21, a really good ones.
> 
> BTW , before a month bought my VC1000 and really  enjoy it ! Yesterday (or today?)  reed your Custom Art Music One review... So what to say , am I need one more pair of  IEM (rhetorical question....) ?
> 1.) Never had a custom ones.
> ...


 
  
 I think you have more than enough excuses lined up.
  


carfentanil said:


> Love Music, that description is close to what many people say about Sony's MDR-7550. *ljokerl* or others care to comment?


 
  
 Minus the treble sparkle it's a pretty good fit. Tends to be a little laid-back overall like all of these large-driver Sony IEMs. 
  


modulor said:


> Great write-up (as always) and these have caught my attention now.  This is the first time hearing about Custom Art, actually...reading up on the appreciation thread now.  I've been considering venturing into BA territory after hearing an HF5 recently and also tossing around the idea of cIEMs but as far as cost goes they've been a bit out of my range.  The Music One seems like it could bridge that gap and serve me well based on your description, and the prospect of silicone housing is appealing from a comfort standpoint.


 
  
 As far as I'm concerned you can't really beat a lightweight silicone-shelled earphone on the comfort front 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
  


emre9110 said:


> Patiently waiting your quadbeat 2 rewiev Joker


 

 Maybe if LG includes it with the Nexus 5...


----------



## kamcok

|joker| you're tempting me to buy the custom art music one now
 I was gonna buy the V3 but i'm now stuck between the two hahaha


----------



## quartertone

A question about the ratings: I noticed that some of the higher scores have been slightly reduced, while others have not; the PFE232, for example, now has the same sound quality rating as the DBA-02. Are more scores still going to be lowered, or are these your final assessments?


----------



## ljokerl

kamcok said:


> |joker| you're tempting me to buy the custom art music one now
> I was gonna buy the V3 but i'm now stuck between the two hahaha


 
  
 Different beasts - the V3 is way bassier and has more treble sparkle as well. It sounds more full-bodied but is also a little clearer except for the bass, which is a bit more bloated next.
  
 The Custom Art is smooth and pretty neutral, with tighter bass as well. 
  


quartertone said:


> A question about the ratings: I noticed that some of the higher scores have been slightly reduced, while others have not; the PFE232, for example, now has the same sound quality rating as the DBA-02. Are more scores still going to be lowered, or are these your final assessments?


 

 Unfortunately there can't be final assessments, at least not until I've heard everything these is to hear (probably safe to say that's never going to happen). As I hear more stuff it makes sense to adjust things accordingly, e.g. if the JH13 gets knocked down from the 10/10 then I will have to readjust the upper end of the scale again.


----------



## quartertone

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately there can't be final assessments, at least not until I've heard everything these is to hear (probably safe to say that's never going to happen). As I hear more stuff it makes sense to adjust things accordingly, e.g. if the JH13 gets knocked down from the 10/10 then I will have to readjust the upper end of the scale again.


 
 Sure, obviously that's the idea - but I'm curious about the changes of distance between different phones, like the Fischer and Phonak now being on equal footing. Have you concluded that they're on the same level sonically, or do you still plan to lower the Fischer score in relation  to the Phonak?


----------



## ljokerl

quartertone said:


> Sure, obviously that's the idea - but I'm curious about the changes of distance between different phones, like the Fischer and Phonak now being on equal footing. Have you concluded that they're on the same level sonically, or do you still plan to lower the Fischer score in relation  to the Phonak?


 
  
 I just concluded that doing this was more representative of how I felt about the sound quality than the alternative (i.e. lowering the DBA-02 and other stuff that's equal to it). Won't be changing any more scores unless necessitated by new releases.


----------



## carfentanil

Recommending IEMs for a friend who has different tastes than I, plus I've never heard a near-reference system, but what would you suggest as the closest IEM to reference - but with excellent extension - for $100 - and for $200 - and would an under-$300 custom be hugely better than them? (Kozee X1, Custom Art...)


----------



## ljokerl

carfentanil said:


> Recommending IEMs for a friend who has different tastes than I, plus I've never heard a near-reference system, but what would you suggest as the closest IEM to reference - but with excellent extension - for $100 - and for $200 - and would an under-$300 custom be hugely better than them? (Kozee X1, Custom Art...)


 

 ER4S from Etymotic (or HF if your friend on a $100 budget) would still be my rec for that. The Custom Art is a good reference but it has its own strengths and weaknesses vs the ER4S so it depends on whether he wants his earphone a little warmer (Custom Art) or a little brighter (ER4S)


----------



## Leo888

Hi joker, wonders if you have heard the Cardas EM5813. If you do have, would you mind giving a little run down on the SQ. I do understand that you would prefer to evaluate thoroughly before putting up a review but would appreciate some of your general thoughts. Thanks.


----------



## getclikinagas

leo888 said:


> Hi joker, wonders if you have heard the Cardas EM5813. If you do have, would you mind giving a little run down on the SQ. I do understand that you would prefer to evaluate thoroughly before putting up a review but would appreciate some of your general thoughts. Thanks.


 
 Yes, he has posted a short impression. Here
 I'll quote him here anyway, 
  


> *Cardas EM5813 Ear Speakers*: http://cardas.com/earspeakers
> 
> Interesting design with the thickest cable I’ve ever seen on an IEM. I think a cable this thick might get annoying over time, though. Only one size of tips is included and the cheap pouch doesn’t fit the earphones properly. All of that wouldn’t matter if the sound blew me away but it hasn’t yet. It’s definitely not bad – warm and smooth, with a very good sense of space - but it lacks the clarity and finesse of the earphones I like in that price range. They remind me somewhat of a Monster Turbine Pro Gold with a little less bass, but the bass is still not nearly as tight and accurate as the similarly-priced HiFiMan RE-600, for example.


----------



## Leo888

getclikinagas said:


> Yes, he has posted a short impression. Here
> I'll quote him here anyway,




Hi, thanks for the link. Appreciate it.


----------



## ljokerl

getclikinagas said:


> Yes, he has posted a short impression. Here
> I'll quote him here anyway,


 
  
 Thanks. Yeah, I gave it another listen later on and was still underwhelmed so I just put it aside. Too much veiling.


----------



## d marc0

ljokerl said:


> Thanks. Yeah, I gave it another listen later on and was still underwhelmed so I just put it side. Too much veiling.




Thanks for the initial impression joker! I was seriously considering those but I'm really used to clarity from IEMs like H200 and DN1000. Have you got any suggestions for the next step for me based on those two sound signatures? I wouldn't mind a bit smoother treble as long as the clarity is top notch. My budget is under $300. Cheers!


----------



## mattstevenfishe

joker, you review of the music one is really intriguing... would you consider it an upgrade or side-grade form the RE-400 or gr07?
  
 I have a pair of reshelled TF10s, but I could never wear them for long periods of time due to a slight fit issue making it fairly painful. How would you compare the TF10s to the music one? The silicone shells sounds much more comfortable than hard acrylic ones.


----------



## modulor

mattstevenfishe said:


> joker, you review of the music one is really intriguing... *would you consider it an upgrade or side-grade form the RE-400 or gr07?*
> 
> I have a pair of reshelled TF10s, but I could never wear them for long periods of time due to a slight fit issue making it fairly painful. How would you compare the TF10s to the music one? The silicone shells sounds much more comfortable than hard acrylic ones.


 
 I guess I'm also curious about this but there is a good bit of information in the M1 review regarding these two in comparison, so it really must depend on preference and trade-offs.  More details are always welcome though comparing the three.  I am considering the M1 as a single cIEM solution so I am trying to weigh the pros/cons myself since I have both of those mentioned already.


----------



## ljokerl

d marc0 said:


> Thanks for the initial impression joker! I was seriously considering those but I'm really used to clarity from IEMs like H200 and DN1000. Have you got any suggestions for the next step for me based on those two sound signatures? I wouldn't mind a bit smoother treble as long as the clarity is top notch. My budget is under $300. Cheers!


 
  
 I haven't heard the H200 and haven't spent enough time with the DN1000 yet to have an opinion on it (I sent it off for a while to have measurements done). It does sound pretty good, though.
  
 Ignoring those two, what signature are you looking for?
  


mattstevenfishe said:


> joker, you review of the music one is really intriguing... would you consider it an upgrade or side-grade form the RE-400 or gr07?
> 
> I have a pair of reshelled TF10s, but I could never wear them for long periods of time due to a slight fit issue making it fairly painful. How would you compare the TF10s to the music one? The silicone shells sounds much more comfortable than hard acrylic ones.


 
  
 An upgrade, but not a sizable one.  There's a GR07 comparison in the review - I preferred the GR07's bass but the Music One's midrange and treble.
  
  
 Music One vs RE-400 (this one wasn't in the original review in this format)
 Music One has more bass, esp deep bass. It has that slight lack of bass texture that all of my silicone IEMs suffer from but it's not as noticeable vs the RE-400 as it is vs the GR07. It also has a thicker and more full-bodied sound overall while the RE-400 is leaner and a touch clearer in the midrange. Overall the RE-400 seems a little more mid-centric because it lacks the bass impact of the Music One. Treble quality is comparable. 
  
  
 I've never found a properly fitted acrylic shell uncomfortable. Silicone does have an advantage IMO but when everything fits properly the difference will be negligible.


----------



## d marc0

ljokerl said:


> I haven't heard the H200 and haven't spent enough time with the DN1000 yet to have an opinion on it (I sent it off for a while to have measurements done). It does sound pretty good, though.
> 
> Ignoring those two, what signature are you looking for?




I like warm and balanced sound but don't mind a little bump in the highs for more air and sparkle. A bit v-shape I think. I did love the mh1c and xba 3 sound sigs.


----------



## ljokerl

d marc0 said:


> I like warm and balanced sound but don't mind a little bump in the highs for more air and sparkle. A bit v-shape I think. I did love the mh1c and xba 3 sound sigs.


 
  
 The Music One doesn't have a bump in the highs or a v-shaped signature. It is balanced/slightly warm but doesn't really sound like an MH1C (not as warm, not as much bass, midrange is more prominent) or XBA-3 (not as v-shaped, more neutral overall).
  
 I guess when I've spent more time with the DN1000 I'll have a better idea of what would encompass an upgrade from that. GR07 Bass Edition, maybe?


----------



## reihead

Amazing, thanks for all this valuable information!


----------



## d marc0

ljokerl said:


> The Music One doesn't have a bump in the highs or a v-shaped signature. It is balanced/slightly warm but doesn't really sound like an MH1C (not as warm, not as much bass, midrange is more prominent) or XBA-3 (not as v-shaped, more neutral overall).
> 
> I guess when I've spent more time with the DN1000 I'll have a better idea of what would encompass an upgrade from that. GR07 Bass Edition, maybe?




Yeah, thanks joker! I guess it's getting harder to find an upgrade at this price range...


----------



## Nexodon

Hey! For just a little difference (about 10 euros), it would be a better buy the Vsonic VC1000 or the GR07 MK2?
 I was kind of sold with the VC1000 but then I found some GR07 MK2 in discount, so now I'm still undecided.
 Which one has better soundstage? Which one has better detail? Which is more bright and/or have a better refined treble? And, is sibilance still an issue with the MK2?
  
 Thanks in advance,
 Nexodon


----------



## reihead

nexodon said:


> Hey! For just a little difference (about 10 euros), it would be a better buy the Vsonic VC1000 or the GR07 MK2?
> I was kind of sold with the VC1000 but then I found some GR07 MK2 in discount, so now I'm still undecided.
> Which one has better soundstage? Which one has better detail? Which is more bright and/or have a better refined treble? And, is sibilance still an issue with the MK2?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I have a similar question, I'm going for the Vsonic since they are a great fit for me in the performance and value. But not sure which one to get. 
 I'm between the GR07 MK2 and the GR07 Bass Edition. I read the reviews and the similarities, also the impressions of them on other sites.
 I mostly listen to Rock, Rap, Industrial and ocassionally Salsa and Latin music, so I lean more to the "fun" of the Bass Edition.
 Which would you recommend? 
 My plan is to pair them with an Fiio X3.
  
 Thanks in advance
 Cheers


----------



## ozkan

reihead said:


> I have a similar question, I'm going for the Vsonic since they are a great fit for me in the performance and value. But not sure which one to get.
> I'm between the GR07 MK2 and the GR07 Bass Edition. I read the reviews and the similarities, also the impressions of them on other sites.
> I mostly listen to Rock, Rap, Industrial and ocassionally Salsa and Latin music, so I lean more to the "fun" of the Bass Edition.
> Which would you recommend?
> ...


 
  
 Gr07 Bass Edition will suit more to your music preference.


----------



## Rage038

I have a question about the Music One's. How would their sound signature compare with that of the EPH-100's. I've had these and really loved the sound but they hurt after 15 minutes of use.

Also would the Music One be a (albeit minor) upgrade to the EPH-100. Or are there other (better) IEM's that don't need the deep insertion that boast the same sound signature as the EPH-100?

Thanks in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

reihead said:


> Amazing, thanks for all this valuable information!


 
  





  


nexodon said:


> Hey! For just a little difference (about 10 euros), it would be a better buy the Vsonic VC1000 or the GR07 MK2?
> I was kind of sold with the VC1000 but then I found some GR07 MK2 in discount, so now I'm still undecided.
> Which one has better soundstage? Which one has better detail? Which is more bright and/or have a better refined treble? And, is sibilance still an issue with the MK2?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't have a GR07 mkII but my GR07 Bass Edition (which is based on the mkII) has more refined treble than my original GR07. Still not as good at avoiding sibilance VC1000, though. Can't really split them on soundstaging and detail - both are very good. The VC1000 is a little thinner so it can be perceived as having more detail but realistically it won't make much difference at that level.
  


reihead said:


> I have a similar question, I'm going for the Vsonic since they are a great fit for me in the performance and value. But not sure which one to get.
> I'm between the GR07 MK2 and the GR07 Bass Edition. I read the reviews and the similarities, also the impressions of them on other sites.
> I mostly listen to Rock, Rap, Industrial and ocassionally Salsa and Latin music, so I lean more to the "fun" of the Bass Edition.
> Which would you recommend?
> ...


 
  
 They aren't that different. If you're leaning towards the Bass Edition, go for it.
  


rage038 said:


> I have a question about the Music One's. How would their sound signature compare with that of the EPH-100's. I've had these and really loved the sound but they hurt after 15 minutes of use.
> 
> Also would the Music One be a (albeit minor) upgrade to the EPH-100. Or are there other (better) IEM's that don't need the deep insertion that boast the same sound signature as the EPH-100?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 

 They are much flatter and more neutral than the EPH-100. Coming from the Yamahas you'll notice much lower bass quantity and better balance through the midrange and treble, as well as a slightly thinner note presentation. If you're looking for accuracy they definitely are an upgrade to the Yamahas. Bigger question is whether that type of sound will appeal to you as much as the EPH-100. To be honest I'm not aware of any shallow-fit earphones that sound like the EPH-100 in that price range. The Senn IE800 comes to mind but it's quite a bit more expensive. The JVC FX700, too, but it's a smaller step up and a thicker, more v-shaped-sound.


----------



## nehcrow

Hi Joker!
 Curious to what are your favourite earphones for EDM (trance, house, trouse, d'n'b, etc.)?


----------



## FightBrothers

Art Music One is a extremely intriguing headphone you have reviewed. I would like to know how the Music One compares to FXT-90 in terms of the whole sound signature, soundstage, naturalness, and realism of the sound.


----------



## ljokerl

nehcrow said:


> Hi Joker!
> Curious to what are your favourite earphones for EDM (trance, house, trouse, d'n'b, etc.)?


 
  
 Customs aside, probably the EPH-100 from Yamaha (for value, at least). I also very much liked the Phonak PFE232 and Ultrasone IQ. 
  


fightbrothers said:


> Art Music One is a extremely intriguing headphone you have reviewed. I would like to know how the Music One compares to FXT-90 in terms of the whole sound signature, soundstage, naturalness, and realism of the sound.


 
  
  
 Same as with the EPH-100 comparison above, the Music One is much flatter and more neutral. Coming from the JVCs there will be less mid-bass and less treble sparkle/energy, with better accuracy throughout. Personally I think this type of sound is more natural but it'll come down to what you prefer. The soundstage oft the Music One is a little wider/more out-of-the-head but otherwise will be similar as the JVCs already have good depth.


----------



## Rage038

ljokerl said:


> They are much flatter and more neutral than the EPH-100. Coming from the Yamahas you'll notice much lower bass quantity and better balance through the midrange and treble, as well as a slightly thinner note presentation. If you're looking for accuracy they definitely are an upgrade to the Yamahas. Bigger question is whether that type of sound will appeal to you as much as the EPH-100. To be honest I'm not aware of any shallow-fit earphones that sound like the EPH-100 *in that price range*. The Senn IE800 comes to mind but it's quite a bit more expensive. The JVC FX700, too, but it's a smaller step up and a thicker, more v-shaped-sound.




Good thing then I'm willing to spend more. I was think off about 400 euros. Which would not get me close enough to the Sennheiser IE-800 but are there more IEM's in that price bracket that can get me this sound. Maybe a JVC FXZ-200. Thing is I really fell in love with the sound of the EPH-100 but that awful fit.


The much lower bass quantify of the MusicOne would be a turn off. I'm not a basshead (at least I think so) but I do like some impact. A more neutral sounding IEM is not a problem. But I do not like analytical, there should be a hint of warmthness and smoothness.


----------



## widdyjudas

Joker, have you ever used silver cable to IE8 and notice sound difference?
 I'm trying to keep my ie8 for maybe another year before moving to CIEM. JH13 or UM Miracle your opinion? I want airy large soundstage, like IE8, but less bass and more balanced sound.
 Also, Any thoughts for UM 3DD?
http://www.uniquemelodyshop.com/unique-melody-customs/unique-melody-3dd/


----------



## ss2625

belated congrats on the 300! keep up the great work!


----------



## esteebin

I was wondering what's the best sounding (balanced/ natural with slight bass and nice treble - no extreme bass boost) IEM that has very LOW on isolation that is below $125? Is it the semi-open Philips Fidelio S2 that's currently $100? Any of the "sport/exercise" headphones (Sennheiser/Adidas OCX 685i)? Something else? I'd like it with a mic, but it's not critical.
  
 I work in a lab on graveyard shift and I need to still be aware of equipment alarms and my coworker calling for me, so I need to be alert. I could play my music over the computer speakers but I would like to keep my music with me for calls or when I go to the different rooms.
  
 For reference, my favorite IEM is the GR07BE but its isolation is good. Recently I've rediscovered my Monoprice 9927 with a double flange tip and a microfiber cloth over the nozzle that I enjoy. The isolation is poor, which I'm looking for.
  
 Thanks


----------



## MoonYeol

You could also consider earbuds or open cans. If I were in a lab or similar I'd want to hear as much as possible. A Yuin PK3 is practically free and it sounds decent, the openness is very nice and it's a real treat to listen to in quiet environments. My recommendation is that you try a cheaper earbud, if the nonexistent isolation is too little for you, then a semi-open iem could work.


----------



## Love Music

Joker, 
  
 I'm still unsure of what to get between the SM64 or W4, the W4 are cheaper though. I'm still not sure if they will fit me though since I like forward vocals. The iem's I have currently all have very forward vocals/mids (CK100, E-Q7, RE262). The reason why I returned the UE900 was because ithe vocals was too distant and hollow. Also which of the two have bigger soundstages and how does it compare to the E-Q7?


----------



## Ymer

Which would you say are the best for classical music, still Etys? Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

widdyjudas said:


> Joker, have you ever used silver cable to IE8 and notice sound difference?
> I'm trying to keep my ie8 for maybe another year before moving to CIEM. JH13 or UM Miracle your opinion? I want airy large soundstage, like IE8, but less bass and more balanced sound.
> Also, Any thoughts for UM 3DD?
> http://www.uniquemelodyshop.com/unique-melody-customs/unique-melody-3dd/


 
  
 The IE8 I had was a loan from another Head-Fier. Never tried any aftermarket cables with it.
  
 I think both the JH13 or Miracle would be good for a more balanced sound with good imaging. The JH13 has more mid-bass so it would be less of a shock coming from the IE8. Never tried the 3DD.
  


ss2625 said:


> belated congrats on the 300! keep up the great work!


 
  
 Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




!
  


esteebin said:


> I was wondering what's the best sounding (balanced/ natural with slight bass and nice treble - no extreme bass boost) IEM that has very LOW on isolation that is below $125? Is it the semi-open Philips Fidelio S2 that's currently $100? Any of the "sport/exercise" headphones (Sennheiser/Adidas OCX 685i)? Something else? I'd like it with a mic, but it's not critical.
> 
> I work in a lab on graveyard shift and I need to still be aware of equipment alarms and my coworker calling for me, so I need to be alert. I could play my music over the computer speakers but I would like to keep my music with me for calls or when I go to the different rooms.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't think the S2 is that low on isolation, unfortunately - it seems to isolate better than my Sony MDR-7550, for example. 
  
 If I were you I'd grab a pair of these: http://www.amazon.com/Clear-Dual-Drive-Earbuds-iPhone-Devices/dp/B004F4W8G6 . They use the same housing as the Radius DDM2. Isolation is poor, they are cheap, and they have a mic, but they still sound quite good.
  


love music said:


> Joker,
> 
> I'm still unsure of what to get between the SM64 or W4, the W4 are cheaper though. I'm still not sure if they will fit me though since I like forward vocals. The iem's I have currently all have very forward vocals/mids (CK100, E-Q7, RE262). The reason why I returned the UE900 was because ithe vocals was too distant and hollow. Also which of the two have bigger soundstages and how does it compare to the E-Q7?


 

 The SM64 has more bass than midrange. The W4 still has some mid-bass emphasis but on the whole I think it's more mid-forward than the SM64 and would suit your better. Both have good soundstage size, no complaints. The e-Q7 didn't sound as spacious to me.
  


ymer said:


> Which would you say are the best for classical music, still Etys? Thanks


 

 If you like the Ety-neutral sonic balance then yes, Etys are great and still at the top of their game.
  
 In general, even with the same genres people look for different things in their earphones so it really depends more on the type of sound you enjoy.


----------



## widdyjudas

Thanks for the reply and recommendation joker. I think I will consider the jh13pro, but its a very steep investment for me now. 
I will also eyeing for the um 3DD, interesting it got multi dynamic driver. I wonder how it compared to multi ba sound.
Plus its not too expensive (599usd custom fit), and custom iem site also offer universal fit for 499usd, 100 less than the custom one.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> The SM64 has more bass than midrange. The W4 still has some mid-bass emphasis but on the whole I think it's more mid-forward than the SM64 and would suit your better. Both have good soundstage size, no complaints. The e-Q7 didn't sound as spacious to me.


 
 Thanks Joker.


----------



## Solude

Does anyone make a "better" ER4 in a universal? Better being say a 3-6dB boost at 20Hz tapering down to no boost in the mid range.


----------



## proedros

RE-272 , but you can only find a used one (if lucky).
  
 Quote:


solude said:


> Does anyone make a "better" ER4 in a universal? Better being say a 3-6dB boost at 20Hz tapering down to no boost in the mid range.


----------



## shotgunshane

The 272 has more mid bass but not sub bass, and doesn't have the tapering effect he's looking for. It's also much brighter in treble to my ears, with an audiophile 'hi-fi' sparkle.


----------



## Solude

I should have specified current production in my post.


----------



## Rage038

rage038 said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > They are much flatter and more neutral than the EPH-100. Coming from the Yamahas you'll notice much lower bass quantity and better balance through the midrange and treble, as well as a slightly thinner note presentation. If you're looking for accuracy they definitely are an upgrade to the Yamahas. Bigger question is whether that type of sound will appeal to you as much as the EPH-100. To be honest I'm not aware of any shallow-fit earphones that sound like the EPH-100 *in that price range*. The Senn IE800 comes to mind but it's quite a bit more expensive. The JVC FX700, too, but it's a smaller step up and a thicker, more v-shaped-sound.
> ...




Please? Are there more IEM's with the EPH-100 sound signature under 400 euros/dollars. Does the Dunu DN-1000 come close maybe.


----------



## ljokerl

widdyjudas said:


> Thanks for the reply and recommendation joker. I think I will consider the jh13pro, but its a very steep investment for me now.
> I will also eyeing for the um 3DD, interesting it got multi dynamic driver. I wonder how it compared to multi ba sound.
> Plus its not too expensive (599usd custom fit), and custom iem site also offer universal fit for 499usd, 100 less than the custom one.


 
  
 Interesting... didn't know it was that "cheap". 
  


solude said:


> Does anyone make a "better" ER4 in a universal? Better being say a 3-6dB boost at 20Hz tapering down to no boost in the mid range.


 

 Not that I've heard. 
  


rage038 said:


> Please? Are there more IEM's with the EPH-100 sound signature under 400 euros/dollars. Does the Dunu DN-1000 come close maybe.


 

 Not that I know of. The DN-1000 is different. I loaned mine out temporarily after a brief listen so I won't have more info until I get it back. The only one I could think of with a shallow fit was the FX700 that I recommended, but it's not a great signature match.


----------



## widdyjudas

Yes, its "cheap" at 499 for the 3dd universal... from initial review, it got bad separation and imaging... so, i think its not for me.
Time to safe money for jh13...


----------



## Rage038

ljokerl said:


> Not that I know of. The DN-1000 is different. I loaned mine out temporarily after a brief listen so I won't have more info until I get it back. The only one I could think of with a shallow fit was the FX700 that I recommended, but it's not a great signature match.


 
 Well I generally don't have problems with fitting in IEM's. The only problem I've had to date is with the EPH-100 and I would place a bet on me having the same problem with the Miles Davis Trumpet but I haven't tried those. I'm looking for a slight V-shape. Neutral sounding leaning towards warm. I'm not a true bass-head but the IEM's should have an emphasis on bass.
  
 Top contenders:
 VSonic GR-07 BE
 Heir Audio 3.Ai
 Dunu DN-1000
 JVC HA FX-700
  
 Based on review I believe all of these fit my sound signature but if there are any more would you be so kind to inform me.


----------



## Ymer

For your taste/in your experience, which one would you say sounds best witch classical?


----------



## calpiyuki

I posted on Introductions, Help and Recommendations but no one seems to visit the forum section that much.  Can someone recommend an upgrade for my tdk ba200? I primarily listen to classical orchestra, korean Indie and jazz.  The tdk ba200's major strong point is its mids.  Thus what I am looking for is an overall improving on everything.  My budget is $200~$300.  Thanks guys.


----------



## Mimouille

widdyjudas said:


> Yes, its "cheap" at 499 for the 3dd universal... from initial review, it got bad separation and imaging... so, i think its not for me.
> Time to safe money for jh13...


 
 I do not know which review, but I totally disagree. Separation is excellent and imaging is good. Only default it that it is not very smooth sounding.


----------



## ljokerl

rage038 said:


> Well I generally don't have problems with fitting in IEM's. The only problem I've had to date is with the EPH-100 and I would place a bet on me having the same problem with the Miles Davis Trumpet but I haven't tried those. I'm looking for a slight V-shape. Neutral sounding leaning towards warm. I'm not a true bass-head but the IEM's should have an emphasis on bass.
> 
> Top contenders:
> VSonic GR-07 BE
> ...


 
  
 I don't know if I would classify the VSonic or Dunu as shallow fit. They are just... average. If that's okay with you then they should work, but the VSonic has a lot less bass than the EPH-100. By the way, the Dunu comes with these little rings that you put on the nozzle to vary how far the eartip sits on the nozzle and thereby insertion depth.
  
 The trumpet fits very similar to the EPH100 but it comes with "normal" tips and not multi-flanged ones like the Yamaha.
  


ymer said:


> For your taste/in your experience, which one would you say sounds best witch classical?


 
  
 The Noble 4C 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


calpiyuki said:


> I posted on Introductions, Help and Recommendations but no one seems to visit the forum section that much.  Can someone recommend an upgrade for my tdk ba200? I primarily listen to classical orchestra, korean Indie and jazz.  The tdk ba200's major strong point is its mids.  Thus what I am looking for is an overall improving on everything.  My budget is $200~$300.  Thanks guys.


 

 Unfortunately I haven't heard the BA200. From what I've been told, it might be one of the best sets under $300, period, so I'm not sure where you would go in terms of upgrading. 
  
 Not sure how much of an upgrade it is over the BA200 but you can get the W4 for about $350 these days.


----------



## FightBrothers

In addition to the fxt90, how does the custom art one sound in comparison to the re400?


----------



## ljokerl

fightbrothers said:


> In addition to the fxt90, how does the custom art one sound in comparison to the re400?


 
  
Music One vs RE-400
 Music One is thicker-sounding overall and has more bass incl. depth. The bass is a touch less detailed on the Music One. The RE-400 sounds leaner and seems more mid-centric in comparison because it has less bass and treble.


----------



## suman134

hey joker , do you think you can have a go at the xb90ex ? thanks .


----------



## justblue

ljokerl said:


> Music One vs RE-400
> Music One is thicker-sounding overall and has more bass incl. depth. The bass is a touch less detailed on the Music One. The RE-400 sounds leaner and seems more mid-centric in comparison because it has less bass and treble.


 
  
 Don't you think that the RE-400's sound presentation and sound stage are somehow congested and stifled comparing to the Music One (or the SE535 even more)?


----------



## modulor

justblue said:


> Don't you think that the RE-400's sound presentation and sound stage are somehow congested and stifled comparing to the Music One (or the SE535 even more)?


 
 Based on the review, it seems like the M1 has a fair amount of sound stage depth and height with similar width compared to the GR07, which I'd say sounds noticeably wider compared to my RE-400.  I may not be the best at judging it, but I find the sound stage on the RE-400 to be fairly natural sounding with good dimensionality (or more well rounded with equal width/height/depth, slightly out of the head and fairly 3-dimensional).
  
 I think the Music One is going to be my next purchase and first cIEM based off jokers impressions and comparison between those two (and the warm tone sounds appealing), but I have to wonder about the comments on comparative bass detail.  The tight, well extended and impactful bass described sound appealing to me but I am hoping this characteristic joker mentioned of the silicone shells that affects resolution and texture detail doesn't bring them below the RE-400 in that regard.  I suspect I'd still keep my GR07 and RE-400 regardless because both are excellent universals and it's always good to have back-ups.


----------



## imackler

Hey ljokerl. I've been seriously enjoying the RE-400 after owning a lot of the under $400 iems. Its an amazing bang for your buck. But I've been thinking about customs for a while. Is the JH13 really enough improvement in quality to justify the price, especially when stuff is on the market like the RE-400? I would wear it a lot, probably 5 to 6 hours most days, but it would require me selling my over ear headphones to fund it. I'm on a budget and will probably only get the chance once to make this kind of purchase. And honestly, since we adopted our second daughter, finances have been tight; I'm already selling stuff to help cover costs so this would have to be an incredible value to make it worth what you can get from $100 RE-400 or a $300 HD600, etc. 
  
 And on a side issue, do you find it pretty easy to take them out/reinsert them? I work in an office, but with my door open. When you're used to wearing customs, do they come in and out quick, or will I always be fiddling with them while someone is waiting, kind of like you do with an obnoxious memory wire like the SE535, a little iem like the er6i or a deep insertion iem.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> hey joker , do you think you can have a go at the xb90ex ? thanks .


 
  
 I doubt it. I don't have a PR/marketing contact for Sony and if I ever have a chance (i.e. spare time) to buy another set from Sony it would likely be one of their new EX-based hybrids.
  


justblue said:


> Don't you think that the RE-400's sound presentation and sound stage are somehow congested and stifled comparing to the Music One (or the SE535 even more)?


 
  
 Yeah, I think that's true. It's a side effect of the more mid-centric balance. Better overall range usually gives better dynamics and a larger presentation. Some mildly v-shaped sets have unusually wide soundstages, e.g. the LG Quadbeat. 
  


modulor said:


> *Based on the review, it seems like the M1 has a fair amount of sound stage depth and height with similar width compared to the GR07, which I'd say sounds noticeably wider compared to my RE-400.*  I may not be the best at judging it, but I find the sound stage on the RE-400 to be fairly natural sounding with good dimensionality (or more well rounded with equal width/height/depth, slightly out of the head and fairly 3-dimensional).
> 
> I think the Music One is going to be my next purchase and first cIEM based off jokers impressions and comparison between those two (and the warm tone sounds appealing), but I have to wonder about the comments on comparative bass detail.  The tight, well extended and impactful bass described sound appealing to me but I am hoping this characteristic joker mentioned of the silicone shells that affects resolution and texture detail doesn't bring them below the RE-400 in that regard.  I suspect I'd still keep my GR07 and RE-400 regardless because both are excellent universals and it's always good to have back-ups.


 
  
 That's fair to say. 
  
 The bass is pretty much the only area of the GR07 I preferred to the Music One. 
  


imackler said:


> Hey ljokerl. I've been seriously enjoying the RE-400 after owning a lot of the under $400 iems. Its an amazing bang for your buck. But I've been thinking about customs for a while. Is the JH13 really enough improvement in quality to justify the price, especially when stuff is on the market like the RE-400? I would wear it a lot, probably 5 to 6 hours most days, but it would require me selling my over ear headphones to fund it. I'm on a budget and will probably only get the chance once to make this kind of purchase. And honestly, since we adopted our second daughter, finances have been tight; I'm already selling stuff to help cover costs so this would have to be an incredible value to make it worth what you can get from $100 RE-400 or a $300 HD600, etc.
> 
> And on a side issue, do you find it pretty easy to take them out/reinsert them? I work in an office, but with my door open. When you're used to wearing customs, do they come in and out quick, or will I always be fiddling with them while someone is waiting, kind of like you do with an obnoxious memory wire like the SE535, a little iem like the er6i or a deep insertion iem.


 
  
 Justifying the price is a difficult concept. Does the RE-400 justify its price increase over the Monoprice 8320? It's definitely a better earphone, but it's also 15 times more expensive. I can enjoy the RE-400 and would definitely be happy with it as my sole earphone if it was my only remaining set, but I would without a doubt occasionally catch myself thinking of what might have been. That part probably depends on the person as much as the earphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Regarding the sound differences, I'll quote from my JH13 vs RE-600 comparison since, for most purposes, the RE-600 and RE-400 are similar enough to substitute for each other when comparing them with other earphones:
  


> The biggest difference between the RE-600 and JH13 is the treble – the HiFiMan set sounds dull and lacks treble presence in comparison. Its tone is a little warmer overall and there is a touch more bass bleed and less clarity than with the armature-based JH13. The JH13, due in large part to its tighter bass and superior treble presence, appears a little more detailed and textured, and boasts a more spacious and airy presentation with better imaging.


 
  
 As for reinserting them, it really depends on how they were made and how they fit in your ear (and probably your ear shape as well). Some of my customs are tighter than others and some have longer canals. The JH13 is not too tight and has a medium-to-long canal length so it's pretty easy to take off and put on. It also has a very smooth shell, which helps. There's a rotating motion that goes into putting them on/taking them off. Takes only a second to do - there was a 1964EARS video floating around somewhere showing it. You can probably gauge how long it takes from that (let me know if you can't find it and I'll take a look). 
  
 For fast/no-frills removal/reinsertion I still think a shallow-fit universal is unbeatable but a well-fitting acrylic custom is easier and quicker than, say, an Ety, at least for me.


----------



## widdyjudas

Joker, Aside from CIEM, can you please recommend me with universal below 500usd. With airy, large soundstage, good separation and imaging like the IE8, but more balanced and less bass.


----------



## Deviltooth

modulor said:


> Based on the review, it seems like the M1 has a fair amount of sound stage depth and height with similar width compared to the GR07, which I'd say sounds noticeably wider compared to my RE-400.  I may not be the best at judging it, but I find the sound stage on the RE-400 to be fairly natural sounding with good dimensionality (or more well rounded with equal width/height/depth, slightly out of the head and fairly 3-dimensional).
> 
> I think the Music One is going to be my next purchase and first cIEM based off jokers impressions and comparison between those two (and the warm tone sounds appealing), but I have to wonder about the comments on comparative bass detail.  The tight, well extended and impactful bass described sound appealing to me but I am hoping this characteristic joker mentioned of the silicone shells that affects resolution and texture detail doesn't bring them below the RE-400 in that regard.  I suspect I'd still keep my GR07 and RE-400 regardless because both are excellent universals and it's always good to have back-ups.


 

 My Pro 330s from The Custom Art offer up amazing texture.  The bass may not be as tight/sharp as the JH13pro but voices and other analog instruments seem a little more real.  I don't believe silicone robs texture.


----------



## suman134

vivianrichard said:


> Hi, *Joker, *
> *Sony XB90EX* is expensive for me.  But I really interested in why it is at this price??? Beyond USD 100.
> Voice quality?
> Perfect Design?
> ...


 
  
   thanks joker ,
  ahh , i forgot about the price in us , its cheaper here , $60 , xb90 has not been officially lunched in us i think , thats why the prices are high .


----------



## Jozurr

Hi Joker,
  
 Can you please tell me how the EPH-100 compares to the MH1C? Is it a significant upgrade in the sound? Is it a logical upgrade to the Mh1C or does it sound different? Also, how comfortable are these for smaller canals? I use the smallest size tips for all IEMs. If not these what would you recommend as an upgrade to the MH1c with slightly more forward mids?


----------



## ljokerl

vivianrichard said:


> Hi, *Joker, *
> *Sony XB90EX* is expensive for me.  But I really interested in why it is at this price??? Beyond USD 100.
> Voice quality?
> Perfect Design?
> ...


 
  
 Are you asking why certain IEMs cost over $100 or why the XB90EX does specifically? There are earphones that cost way more than that...
  


widdyjudas said:


> Joker, Aside from CIEM, can you please recommend me with universal below 500usd. With airy, large soundstage, good separation and imaging like the IE8, but more balanced and less bass.


 
  
 Sony MDR-EX1000. Doesn't really get larger and airier than that. 
  


jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Can you please tell me how the EPH-100 compares to the MH1C? Is it a significant upgrade in the sound? Is it a logical upgrade to the Mh1C or does it sound different? Also, how comfortable are these for smaller canals? I use the smallest size tips for all IEMs. If not these what would you recommend as an upgrade to the MH1c with slightly more forward mids?


 

 More bass, more mids, and the treble is not as smooth as with the MH1C.
  
 I think it is a good upgrade but I wouldn't recommend it if you have smaller canals. The MH1C is not easy to upgrade from - there's just not many higher-end dynamics that have such warm and smooth sound. The RBH EP2 comes to mind but it's not a very significant upgrade for a whole lot more $$. You might be better off keeping the MH1C and playing with the EQ a little.


----------



## widdyjudas

Joker, thanks for the reply. However, I heard that the ex1000 have a bad isolation, so its not very good for commuting. I want to use this for outdoor.
 Any other recommendation from universal Multi BA (shure/westone or other)? It doesn't need to have the largest soundstage and airy, maybe on IE8 level or below 1 level?


----------



## suman134

are mh-1 and mh1c same phones with some cosmetic changes ?


----------



## getclikinagas

suman134 said:


> are mh-1 and mh1c same phones with some cosmetic changes ?


 
 Quoting ClieOS from the MH1 thread
  


clieos said:


> They are pretty much same sounding. The different in sound for old and new MH1(including MH1C) is a result of different filter material, and has nothing to do with whether it is a MH1 or MH1C - and the only way to know what kind if filter is used is to buy a pair and look at the filter yourself. However, as far as I know, the difference between the different filter is not that big.


 
  
 Apart from compatibility of course


----------



## imackler

Thanks, as always, for the input and advice!


----------



## modulor

deviltooth said:


> My Pro 330s from The Custom Art offer up amazing texture.  The bass may not be as tight/sharp as the JH13pro but voices and other analog instruments seem a little more real.  I don't believe silicone robs texture.


 
 That's good to hear, but from the impressions and descriptors on the site it seems that is a trait of that model.  I'd probably be more apt to pick up the Pro330-P based on the the description and impressions I've seen, but it is quite a bit more expensive comparatively and I think it may be a bit overkill for the state of my portable system (just the Clip+ for now).  I suspect that is an advantage to having a dedicated driver for the lower frequencies, but joker's very helpful comparisons lead me to believe that the Music One will bring me closer to what I'm after in regards to imaging, soundstage, treble and mids and be a somewhat 'medium ground' between the RE-400 and GR07 in terms of bass...which I can live with.  It still may be more advantageous for me to wait and save a bit more for them or to see what is around the corner in the Music Art series.  I'm thinking since I'm looking at the M1 as my first cIEM, it'll be a more accessible option to 'test the waters' so to speak.  I'm very intrigued by the M1's acoustic tuning via the voice canal as well.


----------



## suman134

getclikinagas said:


> Quoting ClieOS from the MH1 thread
> 
> 
> Apart from compatibility of course


 
  
       thanks man , they are really different .


----------



## kova4a

suman134 said:


> thanks man , they are really different .


 
 Well, the mh1 I got recently is less bassy than my mh1c. It does have a different filter though - unlike the mh1c, which I have modded a bit and removed some of the foam in the nozzle, I haven't touched the mh1 and it still has less bass


----------



## suman134

kova4a said:


> Well, the mh1 I got recently is less bassy than my mh1c. It does have a different filter though - unlike the mh1c, which I have modded a bit and removed some of the foam in the nozzle, I haven't touched the mh1 and it still has less bass


 
  
     will the mh1 work with mp3players like cowon c2 ? they have omtp plug . i dont care about those buttons not working , i never use them .


----------



## kova4a

suman134 said:


> will the mh1 work with mp3players like cowon c2 ? they have omtp plug . i dont care about those buttons not working , i never use them .


 
 I haven't tried it with a cowon DAP. Both versions work fine on my colorfly c3.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> will the mh1 work with mp3players like cowon c2 ? they have omtp plug . i dont care about those buttons not working , i never use them .


 

 any TRRS jack will work on any audio device,only the vol +/- and play/pause/call buttons won't function on specific devices, like apple compatible controls won't respond on android and vice-versa.......But the same TRRS plugs with just microphone only will work on apple and android devices(universal).....guess might work on BB as well but I haven't tried/used so i'm clueless.


----------



## ljokerl

widdyjudas said:


> Joker, thanks for the reply. However, I heard that the ex1000 have a bad isolation, so its not very good for commuting. I want to use this for outdoor.
> Any other recommendation from universal Multi BA (shure/westone or other)? It doesn't need to have the largest soundstage and airy, maybe on IE8 level or below 1 level?


 
  
 You'll have to give up a bit of soundstage size. The W4 is pretty good in that regard, as are the UE900 and PFE232 (if you can still find the PFE232 for sale). Or you could save a big chunk of change and get a GR07 Bass Edition at about $130 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. 
  


imackler said:


> Thanks, as always, for the input and advice!


----------



## kova4a

shawn71 said:


> any TRRS jack will work on any audio device,only the vol +/- and play/pause/call buttons won't function on specific devices, like apple compatible controls won't respond on android and vice-versa.......But the same TRRS plugs with just microphone only will work on apple and android devices(universal).....guess might work on BB as well but I haven't tried/used so i'm clueless.


 
 Nah, that's not true. There are different standards and the mh1 used the old connection. I guess it could work on any DAP as long as the DAP doesn't have a recording option. Otherwise you'll need an adapter or to keep the call button pressed down all the time.


----------



## suman134

kova4a said:


> Nah, that's not true. There are different standards and the mh1 used the old connection. I guess it could work on any DAP as long as the DAP doesn't have a recording option. Otherwise you'll need an adapter or to keep the call button pressed down all the time.


 
  
     what do you mean by recording option ? now a days all these daps come with a voice recorder .


----------



## kova4a

suman134 said:


> what do you mean by recording option ? now a days all these daps come with a voice recorder .


 
 I mean like on a smartphone. If the DAP can use the mic on an iem or a headphone to record sound? Coz that means it supports a certain standard. You should know if the cowon can do that or test it if you cave an iem with a mic. If it doesn't and the cowon only has a separate mic for recording then I guess there's a good chance the mh1 will work with it without an adapter. 
 Still there have been people reporting that either their mh1 or mh1c doesn't work with a certain device. For instance, the mh1c for some weird reason does not work through the line-out of an asus xonar sound card unless the call button is pressed.


----------



## modulor

The only way to get the MH1 to work on standard devices is to hold down the 'call' button which grounds the thrid ring on the TRRS plug (so essentially works the same as a standard TRS at that point I assume).  It can be done with a small piece of metal/plastic (like a tiny bead) and a small zip tie, but it is a bit obtrusive.  I don't like the virtually useless remote and J-style cable so I am planning on attempting a recable of my pair soon, but for the time being that works well enough to listen to them.


----------



## MoonYeol

Or buy an adapter. Shouldn't be very bulky and should be almost free. Maybe 1 beer.


----------



## ljokerl

modulor said:


> The only way to get the MH1 to work on standard devices is to hold down the 'call' button which grounds the thrid ring on the TRRS plug (so essentially works the same as a standard TRS at that point I assume).  It can be done with a small piece of metal/plastic (like a tiny bead) and a small zip tie, but it is a bit obtrusive.  I don't like the virtually useless remote and J-style cable so I am planning on attempting a recable of my pair soon, but for the time being that works well enough to listen to them.


 
  
 Something like this would work: http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronic_TRRS_Adapter_for_P_Version_Headphones_p/adptr-trrs-35.htm
  
 Astrotec makes one as well - it came with my DX60.


----------



## widdyjudas

ljokerl said:


> You'll have to give up a bit of soundstage size. The W4 is pretty good in that regard, as are the UE900 and PFE232 (if you can still find the PFE232 for sale). Or you could save a big chunk of change and get a GR07 Bass Edition at about $130
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Joker, Thanks again for the recommendation. I think I will consider the W4. Based on your review and david mahler, it got the sound signature close to my liking. UE900 I think a bit too unbalanced for me based on review and PFE 232, I dont even know if any store in Hongkong got it. No thanks for the GR07 bass edition, dont want too much bass.
 I will try the W4 and UE900 later and compare it with IE8, to see what will I gain and loss. JH13 or UM miracle I think is too expensive for me, especially when I'm also craving for akg k712.
 Just curious, How do you compare simply between the W4 with UM miracle and JH13?
 Are the price difference really justify the sound quality difference between the universal like w4 and hi-end CIEM like um Miracle and jh13?


----------



## Shawn71

kova4a said:


> Nah, that's not true. There are different standards and the mh1 used the old connection. I guess it could work on any DAP as long as the DAP doesn't have a recording option. Otherwise you'll need an adapter or to keep the call button pressed down all the time.


 

 My Klipsch S5i rugged and Altec MUZX606(both are apple ONLY compatible) have no issues when connected to non-apple devices(SGP 5") though it has the apple remote but when I connect to a samsung cell phone it won't out audio, so I gotta have to press play/call button once,it works fine. This temp "shorting/grounding" makes it work,no need to press the play/call button continuously.may be because of CTIA standard than OMTP allows.
  
 At the same time the meelec M9P,Brainwavz M5,samsung SGP's and my cell's stock earphone cable(single button/ MIC only ) works fine with all devices,the mic for calls,play/pause.


----------



## suman134

cant quot everyone , thanks guys , for this huge help .


----------



## ljokerl

widdyjudas said:


> Joker, Thanks again for the recommendation. I think I will consider the W4. Based on your review and david mahler, it got the sound signature close to my liking. UE900 I think a bit too unbalanced for me based on review and PFE 232, I dont even know if any store in Hongkong got it. No thanks for the GR07 bass edition, dont want too much bass.
> I will try the W4 and UE900 later and compare it with IE8, to see what will I gain and loss. JH13 or UM miracle I think is too expensive for me, especially when I'm also craving for akg k712.
> Just curious, How do you compare simply between the W4 with UM miracle and JH13?
> Are the price difference really justify the sound quality difference between the universal like w4 and hi-end CIEM like um Miracle and jh13


 
  
 Bass edition is a bit of a misnomer... the GR07 BE is barely bassier than the PFE232. It's definitely no IE8.
  
 The W4 is not as refined or extended end to end as the Miracle, has more mid-bass, and sounds darker overall and less level in the treble. Never got a chance to compare it to the JH13.
  
 As for whether a top-tier custom is worth it, that really depends on you - how much of a difference you can discern, how much that matters to you, and of course how much disposable income you have


----------



## spurxiii

First post in this thread and now subbed. A bit late but grats on passing 300 joker


----------



## widdyjudas

Thanks for the reply then Joker. Will definitely try out the GR07, W4 and UE900.
 Even though the CIEM are more refined, but those high price for just an IEM is not possible for me now.


----------



## ljokerl

spurxiii said:


> First post in this thread and now subbed. A bit late but grats on passing 300 joker


 
  
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


widdyjudas said:


> Thanks for the reply then Joker. Will definitely try out the GR07, W4 and UE900.
> Even though the CIEM are more refined, but those high price for just an IEM is not possible for me now.


 

 Good luck


----------



## neo5468

Does steelseries flux have good soundstage? I want to use them for watching movies on phone/tablet. But I also listen to a lot of instrumental, movie scores and soundtracks. So highs have to be good aswell. Is it a good deal or do you prefer something else for 50€.


----------



## ljokerl

neo5468 said:


> Does steelseries flux have good soundstage? I want to use them for watching movies on phone/tablet. But I also listen to a lot of instrumental, movie scores and soundtracks. So highs have to be good aswell. Is it a good deal or do you prefer something else for 50€.


 

 The Flux has a pretty good soundstage - they will work fine for movies. The only set I may prefer in that price range sometimes is the VSonic VSD1S (review here). The VSD1S is not as balanced as the Flux and has harsher treble, but it does sound a little more spacious and has slightly better clarity. You really can't go wrong with either of these.


----------



## ericdeez

My DBA-MK1 finally died on me last night after almost 3 years of service. Finally thinking of upgrading to customs - likely the JH13 FreqPhase - but eagerly awaiting for the 1964 v6 Stage review before pulling the trigger


----------



## ljokerl

ericdeez said:


> My DBA-MK1 finally died on me last night after almost 3 years of service. Finally thinking of upgrading to customs - likely the JH13 FreqPhase - but eagerly awaiting for the 1964 v6 Stage review before pulling the trigger


 
  
 It'll be up soon.


----------



## owais

ljokerl said:


> It'll be up soon.


 
  
 Have you heard the Sony MDR7550? and the XBA-H3? 
 If so, how do you reckon they compare to the EX1000.
  
 Also, how would you rate the quality/quantity of bass on the 7550/EX1000 compared to the GR07BE?


----------



## Solude

Ety ER-4PT/S vs Fischer DBA-02 MkII... go!
  
 My gut right now is ER-4PT, now comes with the P2S cable, order some red maybe white filters to play around with, JDS C5D and call it a day.  Though if someone knows a more direct path to that type of sound... let me know.  My wallet will thank you!


----------



## rawrster

I think a lot of people are waiting for that V6 Stage review. It definitely is a nice custom.


----------



## Artem

Recently I've borrowed my friend's Fischer Audio Fa-004 and got blown away by it. The treble is a little too bright for me but the rest of the spectrum is absolutely amazing. Is there anything out there that is similar to this signature but with a slightly less bright treble?


----------



## Shawn71

rawrster said:


> I think a lot of people are waiting for that V6 Stage review. It definitely is a nice custom.


 

 +1 > pls dont think 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.....we ARE eagerly waiting(sure thing) that wonderful moment to happen soon very next to #301. the features like 3 way,tri-bore,6 drivers are definitely to be given a priority shot(Yes Joker).


----------



## Makiah S

If I had a dollar for every new member I link this thread to... I'd proably have an HD 800 by now... as you guys know I hate iems passionatly, that aside. I am SUPER JEALOUS of you iem guys! You have this AWESOME thread which has a TON of info about iems all in one EPIC thread... we Full size headphone dudes have a mini version of this but only with uber price TOTLS and only 50 of them :[
  
 needless to say once again ljokerl I tip my hat to you, and offer another lost soul to your thread of guidance!


----------



## MygpuK

I wish to thank the TOPIC STARTER. It's amazing how much did the man for head-fi, all of us!!
  
 Guys, tell me please where I can buy VSONIC VC1000 with shipment to Moldova, Republic of?? (I know only Aliexpress.com, because amazon and ebay have troubles with shipments in my country)
  


mshenay said:


> If I had a dollar for every new member I link this thread to... I'd proably have an HD 800 by now... as you guys know I hate iems passionatly, that aside. I am SUPER JEALOUS of you iem guys! You have this AWESOME thread which has a TON of info about iems all in one EPIC thread... we Full size headphone dudes have a mini version of this but only with uber price TOTLS and only 50 of them :[
> 
> needless to say once again ljokerl I tip my hat to you, and offer another lost soul to your thread of guidance!


 
 What exactly did the man mean?? I thought VSONIC VC1000 would satisfy my "full-size dude" tastes 
 Why only TOTLS can do so, whatever it is?


----------



## KorkiPoo

mygpuk said:


> I wish to thank the TOPIC STARTER. It's amazing how much did the man for head-fi, all of us!!
> 
> Guys, tell me please where I can buy VSONIC VC1000 with shipment to Moldova, Republic of?? (I know only Aliexpress.com, because amazon and ebay have troubles with shipments in my country)
> 
> ...


 
 You can try lendmeurears.com they sell it there + worldwide shipping


----------



## MygpuK

korkipoo said:


> You can try lendmeurears.com they sell it there + worldwide shipping


 
 Can you say their service is ok? (regarding warranty issues)


----------



## KorkiPoo

mygpuk said:


> Can you say their service is ok? (regarding warranty issues)


 

 I haven't ordered anything from them before but I've seen many people on this forum buying from lendmeurears and not having problems with them.


----------



## kaixax555

Hmm lendmeurears is reliable but warranty might be a tad slower since it is a one man show


----------



## ljokerl

owais said:


> Have you heard the Sony MDR7550? and the XBA-H3?
> If so, how do you reckon they compare to the EX1000.
> 
> Also, how would you rate the quality/quantity of bass on the 7550/EX1000 compared to the GR07BE?


 
  
 I have a 7550 but no H3. The MDR7550 is basically an EX1000 sans treble emphasis. I actually like it less tonally than the EX1000 but it's a solid buy.
  
 The GR07 BE has more bass than these, but not by much. I actually thought the EX1000 was pretty close to the original GR07 in bass quantity, if a little more dynamic and less mid-recessed. The BE will beat it in bass quantity and quality should be close, as with the regular GR07.
  


solude said:


> Ety ER-4PT/S vs Fischer DBA-02 MkII... go!
> 
> My gut right now is ER-4PT, now comes with the P2S cable, order some red maybe white filters to play around with, JDS C5D and call it a day.  Though if someone knows a more direct path to that type of sound... let me know.  My wallet will thank you!


 
  
 If you're looking for flat, I would just get the Etys. If you expect you'll be trying to tune it for more bass, you might want to consider the DBA-02. The DBA-02 has a touch more bass and is just a hair warmer overall but also comes back up in the treble. That is to say, it's a touch more v-shaped than an Ety. 
  


artem said:


> Recently I've borrowed my friend's Fischer Audio Fa-004 and got blown away by it. The treble is a little too bright for me but the rest of the spectrum is absolutely amazing. Is there anything out there that is similar to this signature but with a slightly less bright treble?


 
  
 It's been a while since I've listened to any Fischer cans. If you let me know what you like about the FA-004 I might be able to recommend something but from memory I probably won't be too accurate. A budget might help as well.
  


mshenay said:


> If I had a dollar for every new member I link this thread to... I'd proably have an HD 800 by now... as you guys know I hate iems passionatly, that aside. I am SUPER JEALOUS of you iem guys! You have this AWESOME thread which has a TON of info about iems all in one EPIC thread... we Full size headphone dudes have a mini version of this but only with uber price TOTLS and only 50 of them :[
> 
> needless to say once again ljokerl I tip my hat to you, and offer another lost soul to your thread of guidance!


 
  
 Thanks for your kind words! 
  


mygpuk said:


> I wish to thank the TOPIC STARTER. It's amazing how much did the man for head-fi, all of us!!
> 
> Guys, tell me please where I can buy VSONIC VC1000 with shipment to Moldova, Republic of?? (I know only Aliexpress.com, because amazon and ebay have troubles with shipments in my country)


 
  
 Thanks, I appreciate that!
  
 And I second lendmeurears.


----------



## tomscy2000

Hey, joker, would you mind chiming in on the MOE SS01?
  
 I personally found the the SS01 to be quite impressive for its price, though I have reservations about its looks/design.
  
 It seems to be an evolution over the JVC FXT90, as Aipon, MOE's parent company makes all of JVC's (and ATH's) micro-driver products.


----------



## ljokerl

tomscy2000 said:


> Hey, joker, would you mind chiming in on the MOE SS01?
> 
> I personally found the the SS01 to be quite impressive for its price, though I have reservations about its looks/design.
> 
> It seems to be an evolution over the JVC FXT90, as Aipon, MOE's parent company makes all of JVC's (and ATH's) micro-driver products.


 
  
 Yeah, sure. I like the SS01 - definitely a good value for the price. The bass to me is pretty solid, very extended and good punch without much bloat. Mids are pretty good, mostly level, maybe a touch thin, The treble is nice and energetic, a little edgy but not too bad. Reminds me of the ATH-CKM500 - not really peaky, but has an edge to it that occasionally bothers me (with metal, for example, especially poorly-mastered stuff). 
  
 I know it's supposed to be related to the FXT90 but its voicing is pretty different - not nearly as much of a mid-bass hump, which takes away the warmth and fullness of the JVCs, and less treble sparkle (though I don't remember the FXT90 having this edgy character).  
  
 By the way, call me crazy but I don't mind the look of these. They won't get a spread in Maxim any time soon but I won't mistake them for anything else in my collection and I really like how the packaging and earphone design revolve around the "S". The name also looks much better when you write it in all caps like that. I've been calling it "Moe" in my notes.


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, sure. I like the SS01 - definitely a good value for the price. The bass to me is pretty solid, very extended and good punch without much bloat. Mids are pretty good, mostly level, maybe a touch thin, The treble is nice and energetic, a little edgy but not too bad. Reminds me of the ATH-CKM500 - not really peaky, but has an edge to it that occasionally bothers me (with metal, for example, especially poorly-mastered stuff).
> 
> I know it's supposed to be related to the FXT90 but its voicing is pretty different - not nearly as much of a mid-bass hump, which takes away the warmth and fullness of the JVCs, and less treble sparkle (though I don't remember the FXT90 having this edgy character).
> 
> By the way, call me crazy but I don't mind the look of these. They won't get a spread in Maxim any time soon but I won't mistake them for anything else in my collection and I really like how the packaging and earphone design revolve around the "S". The name also looks much better when you write it in all caps like that.* I've been calling it "Moe" in my notes. *


 
  
 Thanks. Your thoughts mirror mine pretty closely.
  
 Perhaps this was the inspiration for the double barrel design?


----------



## ljokerl

tomscy2000 said:


> Thanks. Your thoughts mirror mine pretty closely.
> 
> Perhaps this was the inspiration for the double barrel design?


 
  
 That was certainly the first Moe that came to mind. 
  
 I bet it looks better in black or white, too. Mine's red.


----------



## tomscy2000

My guess is that white will look the best.


----------



## Artem

ljokerl said:


> It's been a while since I've listened to any Fischer cans. If you let me know what you like about the FA-004 I might be able to recommend something but from memory I probably won't be too accurate. A budget might help as well.


 
 This set of fischer cans were labeled fun and natural, and also near monitor grade in this review. So I guess this is something that caught my attention. The low ends sounded quite similar to my GR07BE, but with a more forward mid range and better treble extension. Perhaps my only gripe with the FA-004 is that I find myself wanting to tune down that treble a little at times. A good description of my preferred signature would be something a little darker, or at least something with a nice bass response to balance the treble. 
  
 Budget? I'm keeping an open mind for now so go crazy i guess? IEM/CIEM are all good suggestions..


----------



## MoonYeol

The FA-4E XB are not really dark. They have a strong bass, slightly laid back mids, with comply tips they're almost never harsh (I don't dare say never harsh but as long as you don't feed them crap they're smooth) and they are just so damn good. The thing about them that's slightly less good is the upper mids lack that bite or edge. If you value a totally flat signature they're a touch too laid back. The soundstage is larger than UE900 but slightly smaller than ASG-2 in height and depth, it lacks some air around the instruments but the positioning is great. (The sound of air between instruments is more of a taste thing though, some prefer a black background, others want to hear the air.)
  
 Anyway. I haven't properly reviewed them yet, but come over to the FA-4E-thread and read more. These need to be discovered by more is my opinion because they're really good. ~400€ 
  
 There is also a sale on UE900 from Logitech themselves on some sites. You might be able to bag a pair even if they seem like they're out of stock, you can try. They're 50% off. There's a thread for that as well. I assume that because it's from Logitech it's not a group buy and therefore it's ok if I recommend it here? At that price they're really good and buying straight from the manufacturer feels good at least for me. I paid £169 for mine. Maybe it's a bit more compared to the price in USD.


----------



## Makiah S

ljokerl said:


> That was certainly the first Moe that came to mind.
> 
> I bet it looks better in black or white, too. Mine's red.


 
 Found a pic of them in Black... and I see the resembalnce! 
  


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## MygpuK

HiFiman Re-400 vs VSONIC VC1000?
  
 Tastes are: Heavy Metal/Speed Metal/Rock/Dubstep (Treble+Treble/mid_drops+Vocal tastes, groull also in there) and Bass_heavy-Dubstep (meaning high-quality bass drops with little_to_no treble). Of course, Dubstep may combine everything %) Just look at this band if interested - Medusa In My Knickers (- Pig, Pig 2, Check your knickers, Spit) (may be taken as an example of what i listen to). Not a bass-head, but still sympathize it much. Also as an example: Koven - Whoopi's back in the habit (Original Mix).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyw5ky2FWZg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W9y-XV0f-E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04Asvu9IwJY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsmKKxo8oyQ
 (sorry for your wallet ears )
  
 Of course, wishing the best comfort I can get (not sure what a 0.5 difference means, i've read the descriptions).
 Preferably, less leakage of sound.
 And of course full satisfaction of tastes %).
  
 Thanks guys!


----------



## ljokerl

artem said:


> This set of fischer cans were labeled fun and natural, and also near monitor grade in this review. So I guess this is something that caught my attention. The low ends sounded quite similar to my GR07BE, but with a more forward mid range and better treble extension. Perhaps my only gripe with the FA-004 is that I find myself wanting to tune down that treble a little at times. A good description of my preferred signature would be something a little darker, or at least something with a nice bass response to balance the treble.
> 
> Budget? I'm keeping an open mind for now so go crazy i guess? IEM/CIEM are all good suggestions..


 
  
 A bump in the bass with a darker monitor-type signature makes me think Westone UM3X or EarSonics, or even Sony MDR-7550, but none of those have better extension than a GR07 in the treble. Darker usually implies not only less treble energy, but less extension as well. Take the Westone ES5, for example - it's a top-tier custom with excellent bass and mids, but it doesn't have the reach of the GR07 in the treble. The JH13, on the other hand, has fantastic treble extension but it sounds energetic and probably is brighter than you would want. Have you tried applying some EQ to the midrange of the GR07 Bass to see if you can get it where you want it? Bumping up the mids should allow you to listen at lower volumes, reducing the treble intensity a bit. 
  


mygpuk said:


> HiFiman Re-400 vs VSONIC VC1000?
> 
> Tastes are: Heavy Metal/Speed Metal/Rock/Dubstep (Treble+Treble/mid_drops+Vocal tastes, groull also in there) and Bass_heavy-Dubstep (meaning high-quality bass drops with little_to_no treble). Of course, Dubstep may combine everything %) Just look at this band if interested - Medusa In My Knickers (- Pig, Pig 2, Check your knickers, Spit) (may be taken as an example of what i listen to). Not a bass-head, but still sympathize it much. Also as an example: Koven - Whoopi's back in the habit (Original Mix).
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyw5ky2FWZg
> ...


 
  
 There's a full RE-400 / VC1000 comparison in the VC1000 review. 
  
 In general they are both neutral-sounding earphones so if you want enhanced bass for your dubstep, look elsewhere. Personally, I would go for the less mid-focused VC1000 for rock and electronic music.


----------



## MygpuK

Thank you! A problem which is my wallet makes me choose carefully at the moment


----------



## Artem

Thanks Joker,
  
 I'm thoroughly enjoying my GR07BE, using a good equalizer improves the performance too. It's just that I'm looking at some potential upgrades to it, not many IEMs are a significant improvement over these things.


----------



## ljokerl

artem said:


> Thanks Joker,
> 
> I'm thoroughly enjoying my GR07BE, using a good equalizer improves the performance too. It's just that I'm looking at some potential upgrades to it, *not many IEMs are a significant improvement over these things*.


 
  
 Yep, that is a "problem" with having a top-tier universal like the GR07.


----------



## shockdoc

AWESOME resource. Refer to it often. Thanks for all your hard work putting it together.


----------



## ljokerl

shockdoc said:


> AWESOME resource. Refer to it often. Thanks for all your hard work putting it together.


 
  
 Thanks, glad it's been helpful!


----------



## ljokerl

Added the 1964EARS V6-Stage
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1A12) 1964EARS V6-Stage*
> 
> 
> Reviewed November 2013
> ...


 
  
 The updated ranking can be found here.


----------



## ericr

Thank you (esp. the SM64 compare).

YOU 'DA MAN!


----------



## ChrisRPM12

ljokerl said:


> EarSonics SM64 ($399)
> 
> The SM64 is a quad-armature universal-fit earphone that impresses, among other things, with its bass response. Compared to the V6-Stage, its bass reaches deeper and hits harder but still maintains excellent control. In the midrange, the 1964EARS perform better – while the SM64 is biased towards the lower midrange, the V6-Stage is quite level throughout, offering flatter upper mids and a more balanced and neutral sound. It sounds clearer, less congested, and more refined than the SM64 except for a bit of peakiness in the treble, which makes the V6-Stage sound a little hotter and more “tizzy” next to the darker EarSonics.


 
 Wait..isn't the SM64 supposed to be a three driver per ear iem? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 Btw the V6-Stage appears to be a bargain.


----------



## Don Lehrer

Originally Posted by *ljokerl* 


  
*(1A12) 1964EARS V6-Stage*
  
  
  
 Joker!!! you did it again, superb. I like the way you present information and provide  good comparison parameters with other well known CEIMs.
 I own some IEM (GR07, Triple Fi10, XB-4, XB-3..) and have always been thinking about getting some CEIMs, at the top of my list sits always 1964 ears together with JH Audio (right under them is alwas a place for Cosmic Ears). May ask about a quick comparison between 1964Ears and JH Audio??


----------



## rawrster

That's an excellent review of the V6 Stage. It sounds very good and at the price it goes for it really is a no brainer and even better for those who got them at the introductory price of $100 off.


----------



## OziasEvangeline

Wow the V6 Stage sounds awesome, can't wait to try it out soon! Might become my on-the-go ciem but I'll have to save up some money first... :/


----------



## ljokerl

ericr said:


> Thank you (esp. the SM64 compare).
> 
> YOU 'DA MAN!


 
  
 I try 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


chrisrpm12 said:


> Wait..isn't the SM64 supposed to be a three driver per ear iem?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Whoops, brain fart.
  
 The V6 is a good value for sure. I wasn't expecting as a large a gap between the V3 and V6-Stage. 
  


don lehrer said:


> Originally Posted by *ljokerl*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
JH13 vs V6-Stage
 Not a huge difference between them but the JH13 wins out mostly in treble quality and overall presentation/soundstaging. The V6-Stage has similar clarity but tends to have a little less bass impact and less forward mids. It is a little more sibilant as well. The JH13Pro has more prominent mids and more bass impact. Tonally it sounds slightly warmer than the V6 and is more rich and full-bodied overall, with a slightly more convincing and dynamic presentation. Its treble is smoother and a little more extended. 
  


rawrster said:


> That's an excellent review of the V6 Stage. It sounds very good and at the price it goes for it really is a no brainer and even better for those who got them at the introductory price of $100 off.


 
  
 Thanks, and agreed! 
  


oziasevangeline said:


> Wow *the V6 Stage sounds awesome*, can't wait to try it out soon! Might become my on-the-go ciem but I'll have to save up some money first... :/


 
  
 That it does


----------



## tehsprayer

Hey joker, since you have a ton of experience with a variety of IEMs how would something like the TF10 compare with the Westone 3 and the Klipsch x10(i)??
  
 If either go on sale on black friday I might get it. But I like how the x10s are just an easy in and out rather than over the ear and possibly an uncomfortable fit from the TF10s but if the sound quality does not match them I may have to get the TF10 or Westone 3.


----------



## ljokerl

tehsprayer said:


> Hey joker, since you have a ton of experience with a variety of IEMs how would something like the TF10 compare with the Westone 3 and the Klipsch x10(i)??
> 
> If either go on sale on black friday I might get it. But I like how the x10s are just an easy in and out rather than over the ear and possibly an uncomfortable fit from the TF10s but if the sound quality does not match them I may have to get the TF10 or Westone 3.


 
  
 The TF10 is pretty good, I would rate it above the X10 but a little below the W3. I really doubt we'll be seeing a TF10 deal again this black friday, though, now that it has been officially discontinued for more than a year. Plus, both the TF10 and W3 tend to be more v-shaped while the X10 dips down in the treble. If you like the dull-ish treble of the X10 these others might not be such a good fit.


----------



## IBelieveIcanFly

can someone take a look? im rlly noobish
 ill keep browsing this thread to try to learn more


----------



## tehsprayer

ljokerl said:


> The TF10 is pretty good, I would rate it above the X10 but a little below the W3. I really doubt we'll be seeing a TF10 deal again this black friday, though, now that it has been officially discontinued for more than a year. Plus, both the TF10 and W3 tend to be more v-shaped while the X10 dips down in the treble. If you like the dull-ish treble of the X10 these others might not be such a good fit.


 
 If they don't go on sale on Black Friday I may just get the re-400 with some comply eartips. Seems to be the best iem at $100 from the looks of it.


----------



## zhongyanjiu

yes,there is a fine line for transparency that can be crossed and that clarity and detail need to be balanced against smoothness and cohesiveness – otherwise minor imperfections can simply get too distracting.thanks


----------



## ljokerl

ibelieveicanfly said:


> can someone take a look? im rlly noobish
> ill keep browsing this thread to try to learn more


 
  
 I would just get a Yamaha EPH-100 as a single set. Good isolation and a good sound for Electronic music. However, if you think you're going to damage it, maybe it's best to get a detachable cable unit like the Shure SE215 instead. Doesn't sound quite as good as the EPH-100 but still pretty good and it isolates very well, top. Plus, as an added bonus, you can get a longer cable for it later.


----------



## proedros

Joker great thread , i keep coming back and reading your reviews 3 years now.

 I have a question . I own the *re262 and re272* and i love both very much - amped with my arrow 4G they both sound terrific , especially for the money i spent to get them (50$ for the 262 -dont'a sk how , and 150$ for the 272)

 My question is , which one would you pick as a worthy upgrade if i decide to kill my wallet once more ? let's stay *up to 400$* , cause after that limit we enter CIEMs territory (the final destination remains the JH13 which must sound just like i want my fantasy iem to sound)

 I like a sound that is balanced but not completely sterile , as you can see by my preference for 262/272 , and it should be something significantly better than those 2 iems in order to justify shelling out that much money (i wish i was rich like all these people who own 3-4 1000$ iems lol)
 Thanx again and keep up the great work here


----------



## Endcode

Hey guys, could someone give me a comparison of the fidelio s1 vs re-400. My ideal iem would be rivaling a dba02/b2, but with a slight decrease in treble


----------



## ljokerl

proedros said:


> Joker great thread , i keep coming back and reading your reviews 3 years now.
> 
> I have a question . I own the *re262 and re272* and i love both very much - amped with my arrow 4G they both sound terrific , especially for the money i spent to get them (50$ for the 262 -dont'a sk how , and 150$ for the 272)
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks, much appreciated.
  
 Unfortunately, IMO there is no significant upgrade to the RE272/RE262 to be found short of going custom. They are truly top-tier earphones and at that level it's all signature differences. It seems like the RE2x2 earphones are the right signature for you, so a large percentage of similarly-performing sets will actually be a downgrade for you.
  


endcode said:


> Hey guys, could someone give me a comparison of the fidelio s1 vs re-400. My ideal iem would be rivaling a dba02/b2, but with a slight decrease in treble


 
  
 The RE-400 is more efficient, warmer in tone, and boasts more intimate mids and a more in-the-head presentation overall. 
  
 The Fidelio S1 has more subbass & bass in general but is also less warm overall and a touch clearer as a result. The mids on the S1 are less forward. Tonally, it is brighter and has more upper midrange presence. It is also more spacious overall and has a wider soundstage but gives up the intimate feel and more well-rounded presentation (in terms of depth and width being more even) of the RE-400.
  
 For a decrease in the treble, go for the RE-400.


----------



## signmeuptoo

Could we get a separate review thread for IEMs with mic and also with remote and mic?  My iMetal 590s have finally failed, the cord has a short in it, so I need some new IEMs with similar quality or better for less than 50 bucks, with mic and remote for both my iPhone and my Cowon D2.  I must have mic and remote.  I don't find a good review of the Cowon EM1 model.
  
 I want some phones that have punchy but not dominant bass, mids that have presence, minimal siblance with treble that gives sizzling cymbals.  I listen to podcasts, XM, Progressive Rock, Indie Rock, Classical (no opera), Jazz, Fusion, Classical Rock, Hard Rock, unplugged, ethnic...


----------



## MoonYeol

here, use this interactive version. You can filter out the ones with mic.


----------



## alota

subscribed


----------



## hobbyone

I listened to a basshead iem for a few days. When I got back to my neutralish iem's I missed the low end on them, they have now less/zero bass quantity. They sound little bright. This was a few days back, and the problem is still there. (I listen to music at low volume: 5-7/30.)
  
 It is hearing loss at the low spectrum, or it is my brain that plays with me?


----------



## NIVEBL

Have you try InEar StageDiver 2/3 ?
 Will you add this brand in your review?


----------



## ljokerl

hobbyone said:


> I listened to a basshead iem for a few days. When I got back to my neutralish iem's I missed the low end on them, they have now less/zero bass quantity. They sound little bright. This was a few days back, and the problem is still there. (I listen to music at low volume: 5-7/30.)
> 
> It is hearing loss at the low spectrum, or it is my brain that plays with me?


 
  
 It's your brain. Spend a week listening only to your balanced earphone and when you go back to the bass-heavy one it'll sound overly bassy again - maybe not as much as before, because your expectations have changed, but more so than now.
  
 This is one of the reasons headphone/audio comparisons from memory tend to be unreliable, and also one of the potential contributing factors to "burn-in". 
  


nivebl said:


> Have you try InEar StageDiver 2/3 ?
> Will you add this brand in your review?


 
  
 Yes on both counts. The SD-2 and SD-3 are currently over at InnerFidelity being measured and reviews will be published once I get them back.
  
 Just FYI, there is a partial (and very optimistic...) list of upcoming reviews on the front page of this thread:
  


ljokerl said:


> (001) Upcoming Reviews
> 
> A list of planned reviews, in no particular order
> 
> ...


----------



## vwinter

TF10 still on there. Keeping the hope alive. 

I had some time with the Cardas recently and came away with much the same thoughts as you (missed them the first time around). It was a little disheartening.


----------



## Zelda

ljokerl said:


> It's your brain. Spend a week listening only to your balanced earphone and when you go back to the bass-heavy one it'll sound overly bassy again - maybe not as much as before, because your expectations have changed, but more so than now.
> 
> This is one of the reasons headphone/audio comparisons from memory tend to be unreliable, and also one of the potential contributing factors to "burn-in".
> 
> ...


 
 oh, you got the HSA BA100 too? some impressions?


----------



## ljokerl

vwinter said:


> TF10 still on there. Keeping the hope alive.
> 
> I had some time with the Cardas recently and came away with much the same thoughts as you (missed them the first time around). It was a little disheartening.


 
  
 Yeah... it's a very optimistic list.
  
 I might revisit the Cardas someday but it's signature did not appeal to me at all. 
  


zelda said:


> oh, you got the HSA BA100 too? some impressions?


 
  
 Seemed to be decently-balanced and a step above most cheap BAs (e.g. Knowles Siren-based ones) in clarity and detail retrieval. However, there was something that was bothering me about the treble and it doesn't seem to live up to the claims made by HiSound about competing with much pricier sets. There are definitely single-driver BAs out there that sound better, albeit at price higher than $60 or whatever the BA100 costs. 
  
 It's current over at InnerFidelity along with the StageDivers but I should have it back for review soon.


----------



## Shawn71

hobbyone said:


> It is hearing loss at the low spectrum, or it is my brain that plays with me?


 
 No worries your ears are perfect but the brain differentiates so......Also we lose the ability of hearing only on the hi frequency range over age.down from 20Khz>19,18,17,16KHz and so......Right now I have my VSD1LE doing it's burn-in course for the 90th hr while I write this and I didn't give a chance to listen to my other IEMs or HPs as it might  deviate my perception.


----------



## EraserXIV

Joker, can you give me any insight into what I may gain or lose going from the GR01 to the RE-600? I always loved the mids of the RE262 and have been waiting to return to something that might give me that again. Thanks.


----------



## mechgamer123

Hey Joker, could you recommend me a new IEM? I'm looking for something with elevated, thumpy bass, forward/engaging female vocals, and good clarity overall really good isolation.
 From my experience so far:
 -GR07 had a bit of the forward vocals I was looking for, but the bass wasn't quite strong enough. Or maybe it was just because I also felt the treble was grainy and slightly harsh. Not very good isolation.
 -UE900s with bass vent blocked and 50 ohm resistor: Not quite enough bass impact for me. Treble has good smoothness, and overall pretty decent clarity, but female vocalists don't come out and grab my attention as much as I'd like. The isolation was great though.
 -DN-1000s are almost perfect in the bass department, but like the UE900s they don't quite have the vocal excitement, and I find the "TWFK peak" as I'll call it around 8-10k to make some music a little sibilant. Isolation was pretty decent for having a dynamic driver.
  
 Any recommendations? Ideally, cheaper is better, probably below $500?


----------



## ljokerl

eraserxiv said:


> Joker, can you give me any insight into what I may gain or lose going from the GR01 to the RE-600? I always loved the mids of the RE262 and have been waiting to return to something that might give me that again. Thanks.


 
  
 I don't have the GR01 anymore, only the VC1000, but from what I remember of it the RE-600 will be warmer, smoother, fuller-sounding, and more mid-centric overall. The treble will be more dull-sounding compared to the GR01.
  
 The GR01 should be brighter, with extra treble energy, and a little thinner overall. It can be argued that a GR01 or VC1000 sound more balanced than the RE-600 due to their treble energy being greater but it'll come down to listener preferences IMO. 
  
  


mechgamer123 said:


> Hey Joker, could you recommend me a new IEM? I'm looking for something with elevated, thumpy bass, forward/engaging female vocals, and good clarity overall really good isolation.
> From my experience so far:
> -GR07 had a bit of the forward vocals I was looking for, but the bass wasn't quite strong enough. Or maybe it was just because I also felt the treble was grainy and slightly harsh. Not very good isolation.
> -UE900s with bass vent blocked and 50 ohm resistor: Not quite enough bass impact for me. Treble has good smoothness, and overall pretty decent clarity, but female vocalists don't come out and grab my attention as much as I'd like. The isolation was great though.
> ...


 
  
 Do you have the luxury of trying before buying? If you can live with its slightly odd treble character, the Yamaha EPH-100 might a good option for you. It's got more bass, better isolation, and less treble harshness than the GR07. Obviously more bass than UE900 as well. Unfortunately I haven't spent enough time with the DN-1000 to have a strong opinion about those but they sound pretty darn good.


----------



## MoonYeol

The FA-4E XB have everything except sharp female vocals. They tend to have a more relaxed upper midrange. Paired with a cleaner source/amp however they sound better and I don't find them lacking in that apartment either. I'm using an Apex Glacier and it's a good pairing to my ears. But unless you have a source with good soundstage and good clarity/edge in upper mids, you will find them slightly too soft. But otherwise the bass is strong but controlled and the treble is, with Comply tips, controlled, detailed and fairly extended. Almost never harsh. They're better than the UE900 (which I hold in very high regards) in all departments except the versatility of pinholes and adapters.


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> ...


 
 I actually owned the EPH-100 previously. I thought the bass was a bit too boomy, but that was coming from when I had the Brainwavz B2s, so I don't know how accurate that impression is. Also, I don't remember it being particularly exciting with female vocalists. Looking at Golden Ear's FR graphs (not that FR graphs are necessarily the most accurate things in the world, especially GE's) but it looks like there's a dip in the 4k area, which is where the female vocal range is centered, correct?

  
 I like the DN-1000's sound quite a bit. The problem is that with these single flange tips: 


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






  
 I don't get very good isolation, and with the bi-flange tips, I believe the spike is there a bit more. I haven't done any direct A/B comparisons yet though.
 Also, the shells are a little bit too big for my ears to get a good deep insertion, even with the red 2mm spacers.


moonyeol said:


> The FA-4E XB have everything except sharp female vocals. They tend to have a more relaxed upper midrange. Paired with a cleaner source/amp however they sound better and I don't find them lacking in that apartment either. I'm using an Apex Glacier and it's a good pairing to my ears. But unless you have a source with good soundstage and good clarity/edge in upper mids, you will find them slightly too soft. But otherwise the bass is strong but controlled and the treble is, with Comply tips, controlled, detailed and fairly extended. Almost never harsh. They're better than the UE900 (which I hold in very high regards) in all departments except the versatility of pinholes and adapters.


 
 I've heard good things about the fischer amps FA-4E XB, but getting them over here to the states seems like quite a bit of work. And if I don't like them, I would have a tough time returning them.


----------



## walkman_heart

@ljokerl

do you find ie800 to be bargain at 700 usd?

also what will be your ranking it case of these iems?

top1 - ie800
top2 - tg334
top3 - akg k3003


thanks,

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


----------



## ljokerl

mechgamer123 said:


> I like the DN-1000's sound quite a bit. The problem is that with these single flange tips:
> 
> I don't get very good isolation, and with the bi-flange tips, I believe the spike is there a bit more. I haven't done any direct A/B comparisons yet though.
> Also, the shells are a little bit too big for my ears to get a good deep insertion, even with the red 2mm spacers.


 
  
 To my ears the EPH-100 has a smaller upper midrange dip than the UE900. Maybe it's less noticeable because the overall sound isn't as flat. Not sure.
  
 I haven't tried the Dunu bi-flange tips. Will see if I can dig them out when I get the DN1000 back. There might be a spacer + eartip combination that will work properly for you. I think the MEElec M6 bi-flange tips pair well with these. 
  


walkman_heart said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> do you find ie800 to be bargain at 700 usd?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't think anything can be a "bargain" at $700 USD, except maybe the JH13, lol.
  
 It's a good price if the IE 800 is your end-all sound, which it may be for some listeners but certainly not for everyone.
  
 The IE800 is a nice-sounding earphone with good bandwidth and excellent clarity but it's sensitive to insertion depth and has other issues (e.g. microphonics). I like it a little more than the Ultrasone IQ, but not as much as the K3003. The K3003 actually fits my preferred sound best out of all the hyper-expensive universals. After that I would probably pick the MH334 over the IE 800.


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > I like the DN-1000's sound quite a bit. The problem is that with these single flange tips:
> ...


 
 Hmm, maybe I'll have to look a pair of EPH-100s to demo then.
 Thanks. I only have one pair of MEElec tri-flange tips that I cut off the third tip to, which I use for my UE900s. I will give those a try tomorrow.
  
 What do you think about the 1964 V3s fitting my requirements? Their Portland office is only a three hour drive away, and I could conceivably go down there and demo them.


----------



## ljokerl

mechgamer123 said:


> Hmm, maybe I'll have to look a pair of EPH-100s to demo then.
> Thanks. I only have one pair of MEElec tri-flange tips that I cut off the third tip to, which I use for my UE900s. I will give those a try tomorrow.
> 
> What do you think about the 1964 V3s fitting my requirements? Their Portland office is only a three hour drive away, and I could conceivably go down there and demo them.


 
  
 If you can demo them, I would definitely recommend that. My hunch is that they might be a little too v-shaped for you - they have more mid-bass than the GR07/UE900/DN1000 and the treble is closer to the GR07 in energy (albeit not quite as harsh). It's not as smooth as the UE900.


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > Hmm, maybe I'll have to look a pair of EPH-100s to demo then.
> ...



Okay, I'll try to get a demo unit sometime.
This is completely throwing the budget out the window, but have you heard the ASG-2?


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a new buyer's guide of the best sets under $50 for a few different criteria: http://theheadphonelist.com/holiday-buyers-guide-best-earphones-under-50/ 
  


mechgamer123 said:


> Okay, I'll try to get a demo unit sometime.
> This is completely throwing the budget out the window, but have you heard the ASG-2?


 
  
 Unfortunately no. I heard the ASG-1 a while ago and it wasn't really my cup of tea.


----------



## alterndog

/Hello,
  
 I was just looking at the earphone buying guide. I saw that the *PADACS Aksent PD114 * were on sale for $10. I've been looking for a good bass earphone on the cheap to enjoy my trance (everything else I use my 262s and HD 598). I really liked the punchy bass of the xb500. I already have the Brainwavz M4 and Meelecs M9. How do the Askent compare to the M4 and M9 in bass and in general sound?


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> Posted a new buyer's guide of the best sets under $50 for a few different criteria: http://theheadphonelist.com/holiday-buyers-guide-best-earphones-under-50/
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Alright, thanks for all your help!


----------



## ljokerl

alterndog said:


> /Hello,
> 
> I was just looking at the earphone buying guide. I saw that the *PADACS Aksent PD114 * were on sale for $10. I've been looking for a good bass earphone on the cheap to enjoy my trance (everything else I use my 262s and HD 598). I really liked the punchy bass of the xb500. I already have the Brainwavz M4 and Meelecs M9. How do the Askent compare to the M4 and M9 in bass and in general sound?


 
  
 The M9 has very good bass depth but not as much bass overall as the Aksent. The Aksent is warmer, smoother, more rich and full-sounding, and definitely has more mid-bass than the M9. The bass is a little slow but not bad considering the quantity (and the price). Biggest issue with the Aksent is the sheer size of the housings, and the weird tip sizing, but it sounds like you should already have plenty of tips.
  
 Overall it sounds quite a similar to the TFTA 1V, which with this new pricing is at least 10x more expensive: http://www.head-fi.org/t/573007/tfta-2100-2v1s-1v-tfta-2100-3v2b-1xb-review-pictures-videos 
  
 Unfortunately I've never heard the M4 - only the M3 and M5.


----------



## MoonYeol

The ASG-2 has a beautiful rendition of voices. Although female voices with a brighter tone can sound a bit less sharp. It also holds a grudge against poor quality in thay it can show sibilance you didn't even know existed. So listening to anything of Eva Cassidy is a mistake unless you're using comply tips which darkens the overall sound. But otherwise, stunning vocals.


----------



## ia1234

Wow that's an amazing collection of reviews. Just wondering, will you review the brainwavz delta soon? Curious to hear your thoughts about them.
BTW, would you recommand Vsonic VSD1S for rock music or something else in this price range?


----------



## mechgamer123

moonyeol said:


> The ASG-2 has a beautiful rendition of voices. Although female voices with a brighter tone can sound a bit less sharp. It also holds a grudge against poor quality in thay it can show sibilance you didn't even know existed. So listening to anything of Eva Cassidy is a mistake unless you're using comply tips which darkens the overall sound. But otherwise, stunning vocals.


 
 Thanks for your impressions. I'll be getting to try them sometime in the future, not sure when though..
 Also, Joker, I just tried the Meelec tri-flange tips I cut down to bi-flanges on the DN-1000. They just slid right off without any effort, so I didn't even try putting them in my ears.
 Using the stock bi-flanges on the DN-1ks just makes the treble sound a bit... Steely to me or something like that. The single flange tips I mentioned above seem better, but also have less isolation and are more awkward to get into my ears.


----------



## ljokerl

ia1234 said:


> Wow that's an amazing collection of reviews. Just wondering, will you review the brainwavz delta soon? Curious to hear your thoughts about them.
> BTW, would you recommand Vsonic VSD1S for rock music or something else in this price range?


 
  
 Unfortunately I don't have a Delta on hand to review. I have a Brainwavz R3 but it probably won't get a full review - the fit is pretty awkward and the sound hasn't blown me away.
  
 I personally like the VSD1S for rock. If you're okay with its signature (a little v-shaped but mostly balanced), it's a good fit. 
  


mechgamer123 said:


> Also, Joker, I just tried the Meelec tri-flange tips I cut down to bi-flanges on the DN-1000. They just slid right off without any effort, so I didn't even try putting them in my ears.
> Using the stock bi-flanges on the DN-1ks just makes the treble sound a bit... Steely to me or something like that. The single flange tips I mentioned above seem better, but also have less isolation and are more awkward to get into my ears.


 
  
 Fair enough, I haven't tried those tips on them myself.


----------



## widdyjudas

I tried the W4, UE900 and vsonic gr07. Although the tonality is better than IE8, especially the W4, however all sound very cramped. I think I'll stick to the IE8 until I can afford Ciem.
 Thanks again for this very helpful thread Joker.


----------



## H20Fidelity

mechgamer123 said:


> Thanks for your impressions. I'll be getting to try them sometime in the future, not sure when though..
> Also, Joker, I just tried the Meelec tri-flange tips I cut down to bi-flanges on the DN-1000. They just slid right off without any effort, so I didn't even try putting them in my ears.
> Using the stock bi-flanges on the DN-1ks just makes the treble sound a bit... Steely to me or something like that. The single flange tips I mentioned above seem better, but also have less isolation and are more awkward to get into my ears.


 

 These are what I'm using on the DN-1000. 

 http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Small-Medium-Large-V-Moda-Replacement-In-Ear-Buds-Tips-Covers-Gels-Cushions-Pads-/220853034254?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var&hash=item336bdddd0e&_uhb=1

 And another member is mentioning good results with these.

 http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/261173315851?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649


 And.....Whoever said the Dunu DN-1000 sounds 'pretty darn good', I very much 'darn agree' with them.


----------



## SibeiKnowHow

Hey Joker,
  
 Any idea on when you'll be reviewing the Astro AX7? They seem pretty interesting, and i can't keep reading Chinese reviews for much longer!


----------



## PanamaHat

Can anyone help me out comparing re-400 to the w4r. I'm loving the re-400 for use at home, but I'm looking for something new


----------



## tehsprayer

panamahat said:


> Can anyone help me out comparing re-400 to the w4r. I'm loving the re-400 for use at home, but I'm looking for something new


 
 There is tons on both IEMs, the W4r is obviously a decent upgrade from the re-400s.


----------



## ljokerl

Some impressions of the UERM from the $99 vs $999 challenge/experiment. My thoughts on the modified TF10 can be found here. Below are just some short impressions of the universal/demo UERM.
  
 First impression – “man, the UERM demo unit is huge”. It’s bigger than all of the custom demos I’ve tried in the past, including those from Unique Melody, Rooth, Westone, Altec Lansing, and so on. It’s also larger than all of the custom-come-universal units I have, such as the FitEar TG334 and InEar StageDiver SD-3.
  
 Surprisingly it’s not less comfortable than a Triple.Fi 10 once fitted (should be noted that I’ve never liked the fussy fit of the TF10), and sounds pretty darn good. As far as universal demos go, the best I’ve heard previously was the Rooth LS-X5 hybrid, but I think this universalized UERM might be better. Its sound is a little warmer than I expected but otherwise falls right in line with what I figured it would sound like – punchy and clear, with good treble energy and a spacious presentation.
  
Tuned in collaboration with recording artists and studio engineers, the UERM is billed as a hallmark of accuracy. I figured it would be a good match for some of my more accurate custom monitors and performed some A:B comparisons. Keep in mind that this is a universalized UERM unit. In my experience, a full-shell custom can differ a little or a lot from a universal Demo. In this case I would bank on “a little” just based on the demo unit’s performance, but who knows.
  
UERM Demo vs Unique Melody Miracle ($950)
  
 The Miracle is a balanced earphone but has a laid-back and very slightly v-shaped signature. Compared to the Miracle, the UERM has more forward mids and a brighter overall tone. The treble of the UERM is a touch more metallic-sounding but the unit sometimes seems clearer than the Miracle as a result of its treble emphasis and greater midrange presence.
  
 The Miracle sounds a little more refined overall. It has less midrange emphasis but generally keeps up with the UERM in clarity. Its presentation is a little more laid-back and it seems slightly more spacious overall. Most noticeably, the smoother treble of the Miracle is more tolerant of harshness and sibilance, and arguably makes the earphones a touch more natural tonally.
  
UERM Demo vs Hidition NT 6 ($1200)
  
 Hidition’s reference monitor, the NT 6 is a brighter-sounding earphone with lots of aces up its sleeves. It is brighter than the UERM and a touch thinner-sounding as well. As a result, the Hidition unit seems a little clearer and more resolving. However, its triple bass drivers also provide a low end that’s more natural and filled-in. The low end of the NT 6 is more textured and deeper (although perhaps bass depth would be better with the full-shell contact of a custom UERM). In comparison, the bass of the universal UERM sounds a little hollow, albeit not lacking in punch.
  
 The tone of the UERM is warmer and the mids are a little fuller and more fluid. The treble of the NT 6 is a little smoother but very similar overall until the spike at ~10k, which is what gives the NT 6 its bright character. Happily, the NT 6 is smooth in the sibilance-prone region below ~8k and overall it still comes across as sounding a touch more natural despite its brighter tone.
  
UERM Demo vs JH Audio JH13 Pro ($1099)
  
 The JH13 is my favorite custom monitor but admittedly the universal UERM isn’t too far behind in overall performance. The signatures of these earphones aren’t too different – there is greater variation in soundstage and note presentation, with the UERM sounding a little more smoothed-over and “fluid” and the JH13 being more transparent and “raw”.
  
 Overall, I thought the JH13 was clearer and more natural than the UERM, especially in the midrange. The UERM is smoother and tends to gloss over fine texture a bit in comparison. This continued up into the treble, where the UERM is actually a touch more forgiving of sibilance than the JH13. The largest difference, however, is in the presentation, where the UERM sounds more laid-back and out-of-the-head while the JH13 is more three-dimensional, with better depth allowing for more realistic portrayal of intimate, forward soundscapes and more convincing imaging.
  
UERM Demo vs 1964EARS V6-Stage ($699)
  
 The V6-Stage is the newest flagship from Portland, OR-based 1964EARS. Signature-wise the V6-Stage is not very different from the UERM and performance is really a toss-up as well. The earphones have similar clarity with perhaps a slight advantage going to the V6 due to its thinner note presentation. As with the NT 6 comparison, the UERM has a bit more mid-bass than the V6-Stage for a fuller sound and again sounds smoother overall, partly because of the lushness afforded by its warmer signature. It is smoother up top, as well, with the V6-Stage being more prone to sibilance. On the whole, however, these two earphones are remarkable close in performance despite the price difference between them.
  
UERM Demo vs Noble 4C ($999)
  
 The quad-driver, silicone-shelled Noble is different from my other “reference” custom IEMs in that its sound is more mid-centric. Sets like the JH13, UERM, V6-Stage, and even the Miracle tend to have more impactful bass and stronger, more energetic treble than the Noble. The 4C, on the other hand, almost reminds me of a HiFiMan product in the way it presents a neutral signature in a more mid-centric way. It sounds very flat, with less bass compared to the UERM and a more neutral tone. It’s an amazingly smooth earphone that makes the UERM seem a little peaky in the treble region. Tonally, the 4C makes the UERM sound colored – no small feat by any means. In comparison to the more level Noble, the UE Reference Monitor has a warmer, bassier sound and added treble energy. 
  
UERM Demo vs Ultimate Ears 900 ($399)
  
 This one was a disappointment. I wasn’t expecting great things from the UE 900 compared to one of UE’s flagship customs, but even Rin’s modified TF10 held up much better than this. Frankly, next to the UERM, the UE 900 – a pretty decent earphone on its own – sounded like crap. Overall clarity was nowhere near the UERM and the bass sounded boomy and unrefined. The only thing the UE 900 had going for it here was good bass extension.
  
 The upper mids, which I’ve always thought were dull and lacking in energy on the UE 900, seem especially veiled next to the UERM. The UERM is flatter through the midrange and sounds much more transparent as a result. The midrange, and vocals especially, come through much clearer. The UE 900 gets better from there – the treble and presentation really aren’t bad at all, but there is just no comparing these two in overall realism.
  
  
 Big thanks to *eke2k6, james444, Rin,* and everyone else who made this tour happen!
  


widdyjudas said:


> I tried the W4, UE900 and vsonic gr07. Although the tonality is better than IE8, especially the W4, however all sound very cramped. I think I'll stick to the IE8 until I can afford Ciem.
> Thanks again for this very helpful thread Joker.


 
  
 Good luck 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


sibeiknowhow said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> Any idea on when you'll be reviewing the Astro AX7? They seem pretty interesting, and i can't keep reading Chinese reviews for much longer!


 
  
 It's on the back burner because I liked the similarly-priced VSonic VC1000 better. To me the AX7 is a little bright even for a TWFK earphone and I thought the VC1000 was fuller, more impactful, and more natural overall. I'll get around to the AX7, though. 
  


panamahat said:


> Can anyone help me out comparing re-400 to the w4r. I'm loving the re-400 for use at home, but I'm looking for something new


 
 ​ I don't have the W4 anymore but from what I remember it tends to be more mid-bassy than the RE-400, has a larger presentation, and the treble is not quite as smooth.


----------



## Shawn71

vivianrichard said:


> I bought this elago earphone for my phone from Shopitchina.com  and received the item as follow pictures:
> 
> Very Nice in design, and comfortable, soft for my ears.  Voice sounds absolutely clear.
> 
> http://www.shopitchina.com/item/24373248622


 
 Cool pictures and looks......like NuForce 700 bullets.......btw,didn't you buy the other model E3 $6.xx from same Elago?


----------



## SibeiKnowHow

> It's on the back burner because I liked the similarly-priced VSonic VC1000 better. To me the AX7 is a little bright even for a TWFK earphone and I thought the VC1000 was fuller, more impactful, and more natural overall. I'll get around to the AX7, though.


 
  
 Thanks for the reply! If it's not too much to ask i would love to hear maybe a short impression on the SQ for the AX7, or maybe a comparison to another TWFK IEM like the DBA-02. 
  
 Thanks and good luck with the reviews!


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> UERM Demo vs JH Audio JH13 Pro ($1099)
> The JH13 is my favorite custom monitor but admittedly the universal UERM isn’t too far behind in overall performance. The signatures of these earphones aren’t too different – there is greater variation in soundstage and note presentation, with the UERM sounding a little more smoothed-over and “fluid” and the JH13 being more transparent and “raw”.
> 
> Overall, I thought the JH13 was clearer and more natural than the UERM, especially in the midrange. The UERM is smoother and tends to gloss over fine texture a bit in comparison. This continued up into the treble, where the UERM is actually a touch more forgiving of sibilance than the JH13. The largest difference, however, is in the presentation, where the UERM sounds more laid-back and out-of-the-head while the JH13 is more three-dimensional, with better depth allowing for more realistic portrayal of intimate, forward soundscapes and more convincing imaging.


 
  
 I've listened to the reverse situation (JH13FP demo, custom UERM), and my observations were similar. Personally, I came away enjoying the UERM more, and not just because I have one, but because I probably enjoy the more laid-back feel of the UERM more than the ultra-3D, things constantly warping around my head, kind of feel with the JH13FP. I noticed that the UERM, in a direct comparison against the JH13, felt a little "sleepy" and "uninvolved", though I wouldn't believe so if I were only listening to it. I think, however, the biggest discrepancy between our observations is the part about the UERM glossing over fine texture more. It might be because I was using the demo version of the JH13, but I actually though the JH13 was more forgiving, at least between 500-2000 Hz. I would bump up the midrange and upper midrange on the UERM by a few dB myself for a truly realistic presentation, but I found that the UERM allowed me to examine the vocals on a track very deeply. As an experience, the JH13 is more exciting, and it reveals spatial representation better. Nevertheless, while I fully concede that the JH13 is superior technically, my personal preferences make me lean toward the UERM. They're both excellent, though.


----------



## UnityIsPower

ljokerl said:


> Yep, that is a "problem" with having a top-tier universal like the GR07.




Let me tell u a story...


----------



## alterndog

Hey, 
  
 So I saw the sound signature guide you had. What I wasn't able to really find a good answer to my question. I'm looking for about $50-$70 a pair of IEMs that have good deep, powerful bass very much like the old XB500. Any possibilities or is my quest a pipe dream?


----------



## ljokerl

sibeiknowhow said:


> Thanks for the reply! If it's not too much to ask i would love to hear maybe a short impression on the SQ for the AX7, or maybe a comparison to another TWFK IEM like the DBA-02.
> 
> Thanks and good luck with the reviews!


 
  
 Sure, though I only have the DBA-02 mkII. The AX7 is a little more laid-back (when used with the filter - otherwise it's too bright). Bass is similar but the DBA-02 is a touch clearer in the midrange. Both have plenty of treble but the AX7 seems to drop off a little earlier and lacks some of the energy of the DBA-02. The DBA-02 also has  a slightly more dynamic sound with a more 3-D presentation. 
  
 The downside of the DBA-02 is that it can be less tolerant of sibilance and is more sensitive to insertion depth so I can see the AX7 working better for some people from that standpoint. 
  


tomscy2000 said:


> I've listened to the reverse situation (JH13FP demo, custom UERM), and my observations were similar. Personally, I came away enjoying the UERM more, and not just because I have one, but because I probably enjoy the more laid-back feel of the UERM more than the ultra-3D, things constantly warping around my head, kind of feel with the JH13FP. I noticed that the UERM, in a direct comparison against the JH13, felt a little "sleepy" and "uninvolved", though I wouldn't believe so if I were only listening to it. I think, however, the biggest discrepancy between our observations is the part about the UERM glossing over fine texture more. It might be because I was using the demo version of the JH13, but I actually though the JH13 was more forgiving, at least between 500-2000 Hz. I would bump up the midrange and upper midrange on the UERM by a few dB myself for a truly realistic presentation, but I found that the UERM allowed me to examine the vocals on a track very deeply. As an experience, the JH13 is more exciting, and it reveals spatial representation better. Nevertheless, while I fully concede that the JH13 is superior technically, my personal preferences make me lean toward the UERM. *They're both excellent, though.*


 
  
 That's a good takeaway! 
  
 Thanks for the comparison. Perhaps I'll get to try a customized UERM someday to see if it bests the JH13 for me.
  
  
  


alterndog said:


> Hey,
> 
> So I saw the sound signature guide you had. What I wasn't able to really find a good answer to my question. I'm looking for about $50-$70 a pair of IEMs that have good deep, powerful bass very much like the old XB500. Any possibilities or is my quest a pipe dream?


 
  
 If you have larger ears, the Padacs Aksent may be enough. Last I checked it was on sale for $10 directly from the manufacturer. Otherwise the Nuforce NE-700X is probably your best bet - plenty of bass and pretty good overall SQ.  Runner up would be the RHA MA-350.


----------



## mkv1500

i have JVC Extreme Explosives. I am planning on getting SteelSeries Flux In Ear. 
  
 Is it a good idea? I like bass on JVC. Will i be satisfied in that department in Flux? The reason for upgrade is comfort and build. On left ear, JVC hurts my ears at some angles. 
  
 I heard really good review for Flux but don't know how good the bass is. 
  
 thanks


----------



## bhazard

I just got the Moe SS-01. Really nice, clear dual driver for the price ($60). The 3-4k treble peak kills my ears at times though.
  
 Looking forward to Joker's opinion of it.


----------



## drm870

mkv1500 said:


> i have JVC Extreme Explosives. I am planning on getting SteelSeries Flux In Ear.
> 
> Is it a good idea? I like bass on JVC. Will i be satisfied in that department in Flux? The reason for upgrade is comfort and build. On left ear, JVC hurts my ears at some angles.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Joker has an IEM buyer's guide on his website. As you can see, the Xtreme Xposives is labeled as a Basshead earphone, while the Flux is listed under the Warm & Smooth section. If that doesn't tell you let me be clear: the Flux is more refined sounding than the JVCs, but the bass quantity isn't nearly as plentiful. My Velodyne vPulse is as close as I've heard to being a direct upgrade to the Xplosives -- indeed, that's the reason I originally bought my vPulse's.
  
 That said, given that comfort and build is your primary concern, I'd wait to see what Joker's suggestion ends up being.


----------



## suman134

mkv1500 said:


> i have JVC Extreme Explosives. I am planning on getting SteelSeries Flux In Ear.
> 
> Is it a good idea? I like bass on JVC. Will i be satisfied in that department in Flux? The reason for upgrade is comfort and build. On left ear, JVC hurts my ears at some angles.
> 
> ...


 
  
     you can opt for xb90ex , they have deep , thumping bass , may not have huge bass , but satisfying .


----------



## ljokerl

mkv1500 said:


> i have JVC Extreme Explosives. I am planning on getting SteelSeries Flux In Ear.
> 
> Is it a good idea? I like bass on JVC. Will i be satisfied in that department in Flux? The reason for upgrade is comfort and build. On left ear, JVC hurts my ears at some angles.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Flux has a lot less bass than the Xtreme Xplosivs. In that price range to get the bass of the JVCs you'd probably want something like a Nuforce NE-700X (though the housings are a little on the large side) or the vPulse drm870 recommended. 
  
 By the way, which JVC XX do you have? I found the old FX1X a little large but the newer FX101 uses smaller drivers and fits better.
  


bhazard said:


> I just got the Moe SS-01. Really nice, clear dual driver for the price ($60). The 3-4k treble peak kills my ears at times though.
> 
> Looking forward to Joker's opinion of it.


 
  
 Yeah, the top end has a little too much edginess for me as well. It reminds me of the ATH-CKM500. Still very good for $60, especially the clarity.


----------



## Zelda

bhazard said:


> I just got the Moe SS-01. Really nice, clear dual driver for the price ($60). The 3-4k treble peak kills my ears at times though.
> 
> Looking forward to Joker's opinion of it.


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> Yeah, the top end has a little too much edginess for me as well. It reminds me of the ATH-CKM500. Still very good for $60, especially the clarity.


 
 Weird. I find them even smoother than the RE400 w/ sony hybrids. well, i only tried them for less than 10 hours. how much burn-in yours have?


----------



## bhazard

zelda said:


> Weird. I find them even smoother than the RE400 w/ sony hybrids. well, i only tried them for less than 10 hours. how much burn-in yours have?


 
 Less than 5 hours. Stock Bi-Flanges.
  
 Innerfidelity has a FR chart that sort of confirms the peak. It is easily cut with EQ though, so it's not that big of an issue. I'm also sensitive to that region. A small midbass and peak cut make them really good.


----------



## Zelda

bhazard said:


> Less than 5 hours. *Stock Bi-Flanges*.
> 
> Innerfidelity has a FR chart that sort of confirms the peak. It is easily cut with EQ though, so it's not that big of an issue. I'm also sensitive to that region. A small midbass and peak cut make them really good.


 
 oh, i didnt get bi-flanges. just 3 pair of singles. will try them with some meelec ones. but still strange, i;m not that forgiving when i comes to peaks. far from the CKM500 for sure. actually i'd like some extra treble on these ss01


----------



## bhazard

zelda said:


> oh, i didnt get bi-flanges. just 3 pair of singles. will try them with some meelec ones. but still strange, i;m not that forgiving when i comes to peaks. far from the CKM500 for sure. actually i'd like some extra treble on these ss01


 
 Extra 12khz and up could use some, yes. It drops off sharply there.


----------



## ljokerl

zelda said:


> Weird. I find them even smoother than the RE400 w/ sony hybrids. well, i only tried them for less than 10 hours. how much burn-in yours have?


 
  
 Mine has tons of burn-in. It just has quite a bit more presence in the 3-6k range than the RE-400.


----------



## Jozurr

jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Can you please tell me how the EPH-100 compares to the MH1C? Is it a significant upgrade in the sound? Is it a logical upgrade to the Mh1C or does it sound different? Also, how comfortable are these for smaller canals? I use the smallest size tips for all IEMs. If not these what would you recommend as an upgrade to the MH1c with slightly more forward mids?


 
  
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> More bass, more mids, and the treble is not as smooth as with the MH1C.
> 
> I think it is a good upgrade but I wouldn't recommend it if you have smaller canals. The MH1C is not easy to upgrade from - there's just not many higher-end dynamics that have such warm and smooth sound. The RBH EP2 comes to mind but it's not a very significant upgrade for a whole lot more $$. You might be better off keeping the MH1C and playing with the EQ a little.


 
  
 Hi Joker,
  
 Do you think the TDK BA-200 would be a better fit than the EPH100SL as an upgrade from the MH1c? The fit of the MH1C is what is putting me off completely and I can hardly wear them. However I do like the signature. A little more mids/bass is fine as long as the treble is smooth.


----------



## esteebin

SteelSeries Flux in-ear $25
PRO version $75
 EDIT: It's from Amazon
 I also posted on DEALS III thread.DEALS III


----------



## ljokerl

jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Do you think the TDK BA-200 would be a better fit than the EPH100SL as an upgrade from the MH1c? The fit of the MH1C is what is putting me off completely and I can hardly wear them. However I do like the signature. A little more mids/bass is fine as long as the treble is smooth.


 
  
 Sorry, the BA-200 continues to elude me - I've never heard it. The RBH EP1 reminded me of an upgraded MH1C when I tried it but I'd have to spend more time with it for more specific impressions. I also didn't think it was quite as good as the EPH-100 overall. 
  


esteebin said:


> SteelSeries Flux in-ear $25
> PRO version $75
> EDIT: It's from Amazon
> I also posted on DEALS III thread.DEALS III


 
  
 Wow, that's very impressive, especially for the Flux. Also makes the Flux Pro more or less competitive with the UE 600.


----------



## esteebin

ljokerl said:


> Wow, that's very impressive, especially for the Flux. Also makes the Flux Pro more or less competitive with the UE 600.




After your glowing review I placed it in my "Save for Later" cart on Amazon. When I saw the price change notification, I immediately pulled the trigger. Excited to get them in 2 days with Prime shipping!


----------



## ljokerl

esteebin said:


> After your glowing review I placed it in my "Save for Later" cart on Amazon. When I saw the price change notification, I immediately pulled the trigger. Excited to get them in 2 days with Prime shipping!


 
  
 I'd be curious as to your thoughts. Hopefully I'm not crazy with these - the few people who did buy them on my recommendation (at full price) seemed pleased, but there's certainly no hype or buzz or whatnot, which is almost too bad. I still use these with my phone because the MH1C's cable bugs me.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a short custom IEM buyer's guide outlining six of the sets I like best here.


----------



## Change is Good

Hello,
  
 I'm looking for an IEM that has a slightly stronger bass emphasis than the W4R, neutral mids and a slightly lower treble peak. Any suggestions?
  
 I used to own the GR07 BEs and have been thinking about re-buying them. I see VSONIC, however, has a new line up coming so I've been reluctant to pull the trigger on them again.


----------



## spook76

change is good said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm looking for an IEM that has a slightly stronger bass emphasis than the W4R, neutral mids and a slightly lower treble peak. Any suggestions?
> 
> I used to own the GR07 BEs and have been thinking about re-buying them. I see VSONIC, however, has a new line up coming so I've been reluctant to pull the trigger on them again.




What is your budget and are you looking for universal or custom IEM?


----------



## Change is Good

Oh, sorry... my budget is $350 and would rather stick to universals.

I have, howevever, been reading up on the custom 1964-Qs at the $500 range.

I'm looking for an IEM with a similar sound to that of my newly acquired SRH1540 for on the go. So, all suggestions under the $500 range will be greatly appreciated, both universal and custom.


----------



## tehmightynapkin

I'm looking for a comparable replacement for my Phonak PFE 022s, I had the grey filters but I much preferred the green.  Phonak is no longer manufacturing these (sad).
 - The bass was just about perfect for me, I wouldn't want to go much less than the PFE 012/022, but I don't need to go a ton more either
 - I would like a bit bigger sound stage, but this is ancillary
 - Comfort was amazing, this is huge for me
 - Mic/ + 1-button control was very handy
 - I got VERY little fatigue from these, I am prone to fatigue when the highs are too pronounced.
 - I've grown to prefer over-the-ear
 - Looking to spend $100ish
  
 I'm waiting to hear some reviews on the HiSound BA100.  I know that's in the queue, so I'll be patient.  If anyone has heard the PFE 022's and knows of a similar off the top of their head, I would love to hear your recommendations.
  
 If it helps, I went back to listening to my Xears TD II 100 Titans, and my ears are mourning the loss of my PFE 022's.
  
 I've been a long-time lurker here, and I love this thread, I've been sending people to it for years now, so thanks for that Joker.


----------



## bfettd

I just want to bestow a HUGE thank you for making this thread. Working my way through it but wow - just unbelievably enlightening. Thank you for helping this luddite up his game dramatically. 
  
 --Dan


----------



## ljokerl

change is good said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm looking for an IEM that has a slightly stronger bass emphasis than the W4R, neutral mids and a slightly lower treble peak. Any suggestions?
> 
> I used to own the GR07 BEs and have been thinking about re-buying them. I see VSONIC, however, has a new line up coming so I've been reluctant to pull the trigger on them again.


 
  
 There aren't many details available on the new VSonic lineup yet. The performance of the upcoming sets is still a total mystery.
  
 Sounds like GR07 BE is still a good choice for you, especially at the current $130 price. The only alternative I can think of with neutral mids and bass qty similar to the VSonics is the Philips Fidelio S2, which I don't really recommend over the GR07s now that the GR07s are down to $130.
  


tehmightynapkin said:


> I'm looking for a comparable replacement for my Phonak PFE 022s, I had the grey filters but I much preferred the green.  Phonak is no longer manufacturing these (sad).
> - The bass was just about perfect for me, I wouldn't want to go much less than the PFE 012/022, but I don't need to go a ton more either
> - I would like a bit bigger sound stage, but this is ancillary
> - Comfort was amazing, this is huge for me
> ...


 
  
 The PFE was one of the best earphones in that price range so it's not going to be easy to match.
  
 The BA100 has much more in common with a gray-filtered PFE than a green-filtered one, so it's not a good fit for you. Your best bet might be the SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro that's currently on sale for $75 (normally $120 or so). It's still a little more neutral than the 022 (green filters) but the bass quantity shouldn't be far behind and it's got the right form factor and feature set for you, plus very smooth treble. 
  
 Other options would be
 -Shure SE215 - over-the-ear form factor, mic available as optional accessory, but has more bass than 022 and isn't quite as comfortable for me
 -SteelSeries Flux (non-Pro) - these have the right amount of bass (more than the Flux Pro, a little more than the PFE022) but have a conventional form factor (can be worn over-the-ear, but not as easily as the Flux Pro) and a slightly more v-shaped sound to them. They're just $25 on sale right now, though
 -Sony MH1C - better signature match than SE215 with even smoother treble but again might be too bassy for you, like the Shures, and can't really be worn over-the-ear
  


bfettd said:


> I just want to bestow a HUGE thank you for making this thread. Working my way through it but wow - just unbelievably enlightening. Thank you for helping this luddite up his game dramatically.
> 
> --Dan


 
  
 Glad the thread is coming in handy


----------



## bfettd

Wait you don't wear your Shures over the ear? I know they're different but I assume the shells are the same from the 215 to the 535 - I feel like the only way to wear those is over. Heck even on my old EC2s I'd wear them over. 
  
 Also - where does Shure come up with the "37db" isolation nonsense from? Don't get me wrong, I love my 535s, but I find it impossible to believe that they do a better job of isolating than any CIEM would (which we all know is on the order of ~26db).
  
 --Dan


----------



## MoonYeol

bfettd said:


> Wait you don't wear your shure's over the ear? I know they're different but I assume the shells are the same from the 215 to the 535 - I feel like the only way to wear those if over. Heck even on my old EC2s I'd wear them over.
> 
> Also - where the heck does Shure come up with the "37db" isolation nonsense from? Don't get me wrong, I love my 535s, but I find it impossible to believe that they do a better job of isolating than any CIEM would (which we all know is on the order of ~26db).
> 
> --Dan




Read it again, slowly.

They're probably quoting their measurements and that's their peak value. Just an example; if they reach 37dB of attenuation on let's say 4kHz, the isolation down at 125Hz might be "only" 28dB. And a semi hollow acrylic shell should not give the same isolation as a pretty solid shell with triple flanges or compact foam. Those two should attenuate more.


----------



## bfettd

moonyeol said:


> Read it again, slowly.
> 
> They're probably quoting their measurements and that's their peak value. Just an example; if they reach 37dB of attenuation on let's say 4kHz, the isolation down at 125Hz might be "only" 28dB. And a semi hollow acrylic shell should not give the same isolation as a pretty solid shell with triple flanges or compact foam. Those two should attenuate more.


 
  
 Totally spot on and I can't believe that I'm suffering from the same complex I dislike in others: not reading far enough into the material. 
  
 Although I have no experience with CIEMs (yet) and I don't have a background in material science - the idea that foam (which is naturally pretty airy) or flanges (again, thin material on the actual flange) would attentuate more than a custom-fit and molded shell seems unintuitive to me. If that is the case, it makes me seriously reconsider the entire premise of CIEMs (isolation is a big factor to me). My annoyance with holding my IEMs in while I wait for the foam to expand seems like it's not worth upgrading to the convenience of how quickly CIEMs can be placed in if the overall attentuation is better with the foam/flange on universals.
  
 --Dan


----------



## MoonYeol

Just by guessing I would say that foam and acrylic shells have different attenuation profiles and could also create different bone conductions so that they sound a bit different when you have them in? Or maybe I'm wrong. Anyway, think of sound attenuation the same way you do about dressing children when it's cold.


----------



## bfettd

moonyeol said:


> Just by guessing I would say that foam and acrylic shells have different attenuation profiles and could also create different bone conductions so that they sound a bit different when you have them in? Or maybe I'm wrong. Anyway, think of sound attenuation the same way you do about dressing children when it's cold.


 
  
 Can't speak to the first part because I just don't know (but good thinking - I know who to ask). As for the kids thing - I don't get it? Forgive me for being obtuse, too young to have kids (well, too immature anyway).
  
 --Dan


----------



## MoonYeol

The important part about isolation is to keep the air still. Not letting anything in and not letting anything out. With clothes it's best done with layers upon layers. In iems I would say it's also done with layers, completed with air that's standing still between the layers (triple flanges) or using something that's soft enough to absorb sound pressure waves but yet has enough structural integrity to not be compressed to the point that it conveys the pressure wave. (I hope that my English is adequate to describe this. It's all clear in my head but I fear it's less coherent when it reaches yours...)


----------



## SibeiKnowHow

Hey Joker!
  
 Regarding the VC1000, have yours suffered any damage so far? Because the main thread has several complaints on the drivers cutting out from time to time. It sounds pretty solid for the price, but if it is prone to damage i probably would not consider it.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Interested in the isolation performance of acrylic customs vs universals too. Used to own etys and about to own my first customs


----------



## rawrster

The isolation is pretty comparable to Westone iems. I think it's slightly better but not at the level of an Etymotic.


----------



## tehmightynapkin

ljokerl said:


> The PFE was one of the best earphones in that price range so it's not going to be easy to match.
> The BA100 has much more in common with a gray-filtered PFE than a green-filtered one, so it's not a good fit for you. Your best bet might be the SteelSeries Flux In-Ear Pro that's currently on sale for $75 (normally $120 or so). It's still a little more neutral than the 022 (green filters) but the bass quantity shouldn't be far behind and it's got the right form factor and feature set for you, plus very smooth treble.
> 
> Other options would be
> ...


 
 Joker, you are a man among men.  This is exactly what I was looking for.  I very well may go with the Flux Pros.
  
 One question, if I ditch the mic/button, where does the RE 400 lie?  As to bass, it sounds like it's in the realm I'm considering, sound-stage is fantastic, my only worry is whether the highs will sparkle too much and cause fatigue with longer listening sessions.  I will probably use these often during the upcoming tax season after hours   I'm not a hardcore audiophile (yet, right?), but I do value fidelity.  I may be willing to sacrifice a little bit of my favoring the warm sound signature, but I'm paranoid about sound fatigue.  What are your thoughts there?
  
 I very much appreciate your help and value your opinion.  This thread is basically my IEM bible. Thanks again!


----------



## Amitl

i was wondering about the Audio Technica CKM500's cable.
 how bad the microphonics are?
 is the cable bouncy? i hate how bouncy my id America Spark's cable is... it really makes the
 noise issue a lot worse.
 i'm trying to decide between Shure SE215 and CKM500, but only based on fit.
 i read some people are saying the Shure keeps falling out of the ear and the memory-wire
 has to be really pressed around the ear.
 and than theres the CKM500 which people say exhibit severe microphonics...


----------



## tehmightynapkin

Joker,
  
 I appreciate your help, I saw mention of a coupon code on Audeo's in the deal thread.  Just ordered a pair of PFE 022's for $59.40 shipped (40% off code)...crazy deal.
  
 http://www.earphonesolutions.com/audeo-perfect-bass-microphone.html
  
 Thanks for your help, I can't justify $100 for the RE400s or even $75 for the Flux when I already know I love these buds for $60.
  
 I do have one question, could you place the green filters into the 122s?  If so, what would be the advantage over the 022s?  After the 40% discount, those are $96 shipped.


----------



## ljokerl

Noble Audio (founded by The Wizard and team, previously of Heir Audio) unveiled their universal-fit lineup today with 3-, 4-, 5-, and 6-driver models ranging in price from $350 to $999. 
  
 In addition, a 20% off black friday promotion for all Noble Audio earphones (custom and universal) was announced. More info here.
  
 My review of the Noble 4S will be up within a day or two.
  
  


sibeiknowhow said:


> Hey Joker!
> 
> Regarding the VC1000, have yours suffered any damage so far? Because the main thread has several complaints on the drivers cutting out from time to time. It sounds pretty solid for the price, but if it is prone to damage i probably would not consider it.


 
  
 No issues with my VC1000, I still use it pretty often. If you want a TWFK that's well-built I still recommend the DBA-02 mkII, though.
  
  


joe bloggs said:


> Interested in the isolation performance of acrylic customs vs universals too. Used to own etys and about to own my first customs


  

 What rawrster said - acrylic customs don't really isolate at the Etymotic level. There's a little bit more variation to it than just shell material, though - first off, some customs fit tighter than others, whether due to the process used to manufacture them or the initial impressions. Second, they vary a lot in canal length. Some are specifically built with a "musician's fit" - i.e. with the canal portion extended to the second bend of the ear canal. A few manufacturers give you the option to have a comfort fit or musician's fit. etc. The units that extend to the second bend, such as my Hidition NT 6 and Clear Tune Monitors WLS-5, definitely isolate better.
  
  


amitl said:


> i was wondering about the Audio Technica CKM500's cable.
> how bad the microphonics are?
> is the cable bouncy? i hate how bouncy my id America Spark's cable is... it really makes the
> noise issue a lot worse.
> ...


 
  
 Microphonics are similar to the Spark. Not very good, if that type of thing bothers you.
  


tehmightynapkin said:


> Joker,
> 
> I appreciate your help, I saw mention of a coupon code on Audeo's in the deal thread.  Just ordered a pair of PFE 022's for $59.40 shipped (40% off code)...crazy deal.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Good deal.
  
 Yes, you can put green filters on the 122, which is why Phonak's pricing didn't make a lot of sense. Basically 
 -022: you get the green filters and pretty much no other accessories
 -122: you get the more "Hi-Fi" gray and black filters and much more tips, accessories, etc., along with nicer packaging. 
  
 If you buy a 022 you can still get the gray/black filters separately and save some $$ over the 122, but it won't be much and you won't have the extra tips, case, etc.


----------



## Izeekio

Hi |joker|,
  
 I have a question I feel you may be well equipped to answer due to your extensive experience with many headphones. I have MTPCs, and I know it's difficult to compare IEMs with Full-sized headphones...But do you think the sound signature difference between the MTPC and Sennheiser HD598 (open-circumaural; wide soundstage) would be expectedly drastic? I recently got my MTPCs back after they've been broken for a year and coming from the HD598s to the MTPCs have been quite shocking. It almost feels like the sound quality is so bad on the MTPCs that I'm wondering if it's damaged. It sounds so "muffled". I'm trying to get my brain to get used to these IEMs again. Could it be the ones with control talk have worse sound quality? I appreciate any wisdom or comments regarding this issue, but understand that you may not remember enough to compare the two. Thanks.


----------



## Jozurr

Hi Joker,
  
 if you had to give the VSD1S/VSD1 a sound score what would it be? secondly, are the mids as recessed and treble as harsh as people say it is? and how good are these compared to the R02 Silver?


----------



## ljokerl

izeekio said:


> Hi |joker|,
> 
> I have a question I feel you may be well equipped to answer due to your extensive experience with many headphones. I have MTPCs, and I know it's difficult to compare IEMs with Full-sized headphones...But do you think the sound signature difference between the MTPC and Sennheiser HD598 (open-circumaural; wide soundstage) would be expectedly drastic? I recently got my MTPCs back after they've been broken for a year and coming from the HD598s to the MTPCs have been quite shocking. It almost feels like the sound quality is so bad on the MTPCs that I'm wondering if it's damaged. It sounds so "muffled". I'm trying to get my brain to get used to these IEMs again. Could it be the ones with control talk have worse sound quality? I appreciate any wisdom or comments regarding this issue, but understand that you may not remember enough to compare the two. Thanks.


 
  
 I think between those two it will more be down to signature than headphone vs earphone. The MTPC is a warm, enhanced-bass unit while the HD598, from what I understand, is pretty balanced. I've never listened to it for an extended period of time, though, so I can't comment firsthand, but my guess is a balanced-sounding in-ear will sound better to you coming from an HD598.
  
 Controltalk can only be a problem if you're using a device that doesn't support it and the 4-pole 3.5mm plug is not lining up properly with the headphone jack on your device. 
  


jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> if you had to give the VSD1S/VSD1 a sound score what would it be? secondly, are the mids as recessed and treble as harsh as people say it is? and how good are these compared to the R02 Silver?


 
  
 Around the SteelSeries Flux level, +/- 0.1. It's a slightly v-shaped signature and like most VSonics the treble is not entirely smooth, so yes, I can see people saying that the treble is harsh and the mids are recessed. Then again, the same treble characteristic is a problem with the GR07 as well and it's well-loved at $100+, so it'll really depend on who you ask.
  
 The R02 silver sounds very different - smoother treble, less enhanced and more rolled-off bass, and a bump in the upper midrange. It doesn't really sound like a VSonic product to be honest.


----------



## esteebin

ljokerl said:


> I'd be curious as to your thoughts. Hopefully I'm not crazy with these - the few people who did buy them on my recommendation (at full price) seemed pleased, but there's certainly no hype or buzz or whatnot, which is almost too bad. I still use these with my phone because the MH1C's cable bugs me.


 
  
 You, sir are spot on with your review. Here are a few of your quotes that I agree with:
  
 "The bass is not enhanced enough for the Flux to sound bloated – in fact, it is only a touch more boomy compared to the pricier and more neutral-sounding RE-400 and VSonic GR07"
  -I always look at the bass as how it's presented on the overall sound. I sense it as a half-step forward than the midrange.
  
 "The midrange of the Flux is among clearest I’ve heard in the price range and maintains a neutral-to-warm tone."
  -Vocals are nice and clear. Nice.
  
 "The top end is extended, has good energy, and sounds mostly smooth, with just a bit of grain compared to higher-end sets such as the Flux In-Ear Pro, UE 600, and HiFiMan RE-400"
  -I am enjoying the top end on the Flux. Less splashy than the GR07BE but still prominent enough to hear. Not sibilant to my ears.
  
 My only negatives:
 *the straight plug - I prefer L-plugs
 *I'm not liking the sticky, rubbery cable. It would have been nice if it had the feel of the XBA-4 flat cable.
  
 But overall, I like these especially at $25.
  
 Thanks, Joker


----------



## ljokerl

esteebin said:


> You, sir are spot on with your review. Here are a few of your quotes that I agree with:
> 
> "The bass is not enhanced enough for the Flux to sound bloated – in fact, it is only a touch more boomy compared to the pricier and more neutral-sounding RE-400 and VSonic GR07"
> -I always look at the bass as how it's presented on the overall sound. I sense it as a half-step forward than the midrange.
> ...


 
  
 Thanks, appreciate the impressions. Glad you like them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 To be honest there's very few flat cables I actually like. The Sony ones are good, as is the one on the Moe SS01 (but it's so narrow it barely qualifies as a flat cable at all). More often than not they are a nuisance and sometimes add unnecessary weight to the earphones.


----------



## th3answer

joker,
  
 what would you reccomend as an upgrade to a brainwavz B2/ fischer audio dba 02 ?
 looking for IEMs with good clarity. my current b2 is a little loose on the right ear as a slight touch on the wire would cause a disturbance / loss in sound momentarily.
  
 many thanks


----------



## Deviltooth

ljokerl said:


> Thanks, appreciate the impressions. Glad you like them
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The Onkyo IE-FC300 has a very good quality flat cable as does part of the Torque t103z.  Of course neither earphone can be worn over the ears but I find the flat cables help to minimize microphonics and give the appearance of long term strength.


----------



## 5fteleven

suman134 said:


> you can opt for xb90ex , they have deep , thumping bass , may not have huge bass , but satisfying .


 

 which IEMs do have huge bass? jvc fx1x/3x?


----------



## ljokerl

th3answer said:


> joker,
> 
> what would you reccomend as an upgrade to a brainwavz B2/ fischer audio dba 02 ?
> looking for IEMs with good clarity. my current b2 is a little loose on the right ear as a slight touch on the wire would cause a disturbance / loss in sound momentarily.
> ...


 
  
 Depends on what you would like to see (hear?) different from your B2 and how much you spend. If you're happy with the sound of the B2 you can't really "upgrade" too far as those are already top-tier earphones. You can get an Ety ER4S for a slightly different balance and the ultimate clarity but I can't really call it a full-blown "upgrade" either. Or you can just a VC1000 from VSonic for a similar but not identical alternative to the B2 at ~$125.
  
  


deviltooth said:


> The Onkyo IE-FC300 has a very good quality flat cable as does part of the Torque t103z.  Of course neither earphone can be worn over the ears but I find the flat cables help to minimize microphonics and give the appearance of long term strength.


 
  
 My Onkyo IEMs have a clear-coated cable with a round cross section. It's very microphonic 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  

  
  


5fteleven said:


> which IEMs do have huge bass? jvc fx1x/3x?


 
  
 Not sure about the FX3X but the FX1X definitely does, as does the FX101.


----------



## Deviltooth

ljokerl said:


> Depends on what you would like to see (hear?) different from your B2 and how much you spend. If you're happy with the sound of the B2 you can't really "upgrade" too far as those are already top-tier earphones. You can get an Ety ER4S for a slightly different balance and the ultimate clarity but I can't really call it a full-blown "upgrade" either. Or you can just a VC1000 from VSonic for a similar but not identical alternative to the B2 at ~$125.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Your Onkyo cables are the more expensive, premium variety.  The 3 other colours (red, violet and white) are flat and minimally microphonic.


----------



## suman134

5fteleven said:


> which IEMs do have huge bass? jvc fx1x/3x?


 

 fx1x has bigger bass obviously , but boomy .


----------



## ljokerl

Added Noble 4S 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1A13) Noble 4S*
> 
> 
> Reviewed November 2013
> ...


 
  
 The updated IEM ranking can be found here.


----------



## nehcrow

Hey joker!
 Does your Westone 3 impressions/score still stand?
 Wondering how well they would do with EDM now that they are discounted pretty heavily... Or do the EPH-100 outperform them is that regard?


----------



## tehsprayer

nehcrow said:


> Hey joker!
> Does your Westone 3 impressions/score still stand?
> Wondering how well they would do with EDM now that they are discounted pretty heavily... Or do the EPH-100 outperform them is that regard?


 
 Most people would say the Westone 3 is better than EPH-100, I bought them yesterday for $179, great deal.


----------



## getclikinagas

Excellent review ljokerl 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 One of the most beautiful sets available today.
  
 Among the top tier which would be the best for some classic rock and jazz?


----------



## Alanaudio

Hey joker， any plan to add Tralucent 1Plus2 in your list?


----------



## engelhaft

Hi all, I was wondering if you can recommend me a set of really good IEMs that on with a warm signature in the style of the LCD2, I am not familiar with that sound signature and I would like to try it before jumping into really expensive earphones or IEM/CIEM, but I am willing to spend some money to listen IEMs with clean and detailed warm signature.


----------



## ericr

Joker,

Thanks again for the V6-Stage review (and comparison to the SM64). With 1964ears offering 15% off for BF I'm about to pull the trigger on a pair of these. My only concern is sibilance, which I don't tolerate well. I'm not treble sensitive though and appreciate bright / detailed highs (if realistic / natural). My first higher-end IEM was the Denon C700 (aka 751) and as nice as they were compared to the cheap phone I had been using the sibilance was annoying. The SM64 is very good in this regard (maybe due to the 5k dip).

I don't need the phone to cover bad recordings - but no emphasis of sibilance is important.

Any thoughts regarding the V6-s and sibilance?


----------



## yalper

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> The bass of the two earphones is similar in impact but the Noble is tighter and resolves detail better in the bass region. The midrange, where the RE-400’s focus lies, sounds veiled with the HiFiMan set compared to the 4S.
> 
> The treble of the RE-400, too, is dull and lacks crispness in comparison, causing it to sound muffled next to the crystal-clear Noble. The brighter Noble is nonetheless very smooth-sounding when it comes to treble and has a wider presentation as well, making the RE-400 sound a bit small and in-the-head. There is, of course, a tenfold price difference between these two earphones and much less than a tenfold difference in performance, but, great as the RE-400 is, it can’t keep up here.


 
  
 It may hurt the feelings of Re-400 owners a bit..


----------



## ljokerl

nehcrow said:


> Hey joker!
> Does your Westone 3 impressions/score still stand?
> Wondering how well they would do with EDM now that they are discounted pretty heavily... Or do the EPH-100 outperform them is that regard?


 
  
 I don't have the unit anymore but I don't have a reason to think it's gotten worse over time. The W3 is the better performer but specifically for EDM I'd be tempted to get the EPH-100 with that juicy deep bass. 
  


getclikinagas said:


> Excellent review ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Depends on your preference, really - could be the neutral 4S, the slightly more exciting JH13, or the warm, bassy, and extremely smooth Heir 8.A. For me it's the 4S or JH13, or even the more laid-back UM Miracle, depending on my mood. 
  


alanaudio said:


> Hey joker， any plan to add Tralucent 1Plus2 in your list?


 
  
 Sorry, don't have access to one.
  


engelhaft said:


> Hi all, I was wondering if you can recommend me a set of really good IEMs that on with a warm signature in the style of the LCD2, I am not familiar with that sound signature and I would like to try it before jumping into really expensive earphones or IEM/CIEM, but I am willing to spend some money to listen IEMs with clean and detailed warm signature.


 
  
 I've only heard the LCD-2 a couple of times. It really depends on how much you want to spend but the Shure SE535 and Sony MDR-7550 come to mind for that type of sound. 
  
 Keep in mind that the LCD-2 will have an advantage in bass "feel" - rumble and impact and all that - because it can move lots more air. To get that from an IEM you would need a significantly bassier one, like an SE215 or RBH EP1 or something. Of course those won't have the clarity or overall refinement of the SE535 or 7550. Point is, if you try either of those keep in mind that you'll get more tactile bass from an LCD-2.
  


ericr said:


> Joker,
> 
> Thanks again for the V6-Stage review (and comparison to the SM64). With 1964ears offering 15% off for BF I'm about to pull the trigger on a pair of these. My only concern is sibilance, which I don't tolerate well. I'm not treble sensitive though and appreciate bright / detailed highs (if realistic / natural). My first higher-end IEM was the Denon C700 (aka 751) and as nice as they were compared to the cheap phone I had been using the sibilance was annoying. The SM64 is very good in this regard (maybe due to the 5k dip).
> 
> ...


 
  
 It's not that bad but compared to my other customs, most of which have super-smooth highs, it's noticeable. To be fair, after my review went up I got an email from 1964EARS saying that they should be able to resolve that issue, but we'll see what happens when I get them back. The V6-Stage is certainly nowhere near as forgiving as the SM64, though.
  


yalper said:


> It may hurt the feelings of Re-400 owners a bit..


 
  
 Well, I'm one of said RE-400 owners 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. It's one of my favorite universals.


----------



## 96rubberduckys

Joker, in very general terms, how would you rate the Custom Art Music One against the Westone 4 or 2, or maybe SM64 for classical?
  
 It seems perfect for me, just a little worried about soundstage.


----------



## engelhaft

@Joker, could you make brief comparison between the Yamaha EPH-100, the Sony MDR 7550 and the Sure SE535?


----------



## godlyatheist

Wow the Noble 4S gets such a high review. Is it safe to assume the 4C version will sound the same as the 4S but with acrylic shell? I'm trying to decide which CIEM to get and right now I'm stuck between the Noble 4S/4C and the JH13.


----------



## djvkool

godlyatheist said:


> Wow the Noble 4S gets such a high review. Is it safe to assume the 4C version will sound the same as the 4S but with acrylic shell? I'm trying to decide which CIEM to get and right now I'm stuck between the Noble 4S/4C and the JH13.


 
  
 Yeah I'm on the same boat, wanting to utilise BF's 20% off on Noble, keen on the 4C...


----------



## godlyatheist

djvkool said:


> Yeah I'm on the same boat, wanting to utilise BF's 20% off on Noble, keen on the 4C...




Well both places have 20% off and cost isn't a big issue for me. Noble is local and their lab in China is in my home city so I can get easy access. From what I read the customer service at JH is not as top notch as Heir/Noble. So if the Noble is comparable in performance I'd give them serious consideration.


----------



## Poimandres

John and the crew are great and the build quality is nice however if you are in the US and need a refit it would be easier and likely a quicker turn around if your ciems are made within the US. When I originally ordered my 4as I went through 3 different refits which took close to 3 months total.


----------



## Sil3nce

I come back. And this is the first thing I see. 
 Well done buddy.
 You're still keeping things alive haha/


----------



## MoonYeol

Someone needs to send a pair of Fischer Amps FA-4E your way... I'd rather not send mine since I'm in EU and I'm basically married to them. Would be extremely jealous if someone else were to put them in their ears for a longer period of time. Also, if that person had lots of ear wax my little OCD-brain would go berserk. Anyway. You need to hear them  they are what the UE900 should've been. (I find them significantly better in every aspect of the sound.)


----------



## djvkool

godlyatheist said:


> Well both places have 20% off and cost isn't a big issue for me. Noble is local and their lab in China is in my home city so I can get easy access. From what I read the customer service at JH is not as top notch as Heir/Noble. So if the Noble is comparable in performance I'd give them serious consideration.


 
  
 Heir 30% off everything - that makes 5.0 to be $419
  
 DAMMNNN!!! decisions decisions...


----------



## smashdroid

Hi ljoker.. i have always taken your reviews for purchasing headphones..need a little help now..
 I have sony mh1c... whats ur take on moe ss01 vs vsonic vsd1s.. i listen to more of rap, hiphop, rock, more of aggressive music.. bass is important for me.. but not much of "v" response.


----------



## zubin111

Hi Joker, hope everything is good on your side. First of all thank you for your recommendations and time for us helping decide the IEM. Now i have a MH1C and Quadbeat, MH1C i tried to adapt but cable is a nightmare and so is the fit, i like the sound but its starting to make some static too. Coming to Quadbeat, it is airy and clear and bass is enough for me with moderate EQing but i am unable to get a proper fit for it and don't find the large housings comfortable. So now comes your work... What next? I am totally confused as to what could form an upgrade from these two, i love the warmth of MH1C but i need some airy feel for a prolonged listening. So something on lines of Quadbeat with same airiness along with a better low end response with a good firm fit is what i am looking at. I am contemplating VSD1S/VSD1, Astrotec AM90, SM E10. Your recommendation is highly appreciated as always!!


----------



## nehcrow

Hey Joker, seeing as the Noble 4S is based on a 4 driver configuration, do you think the Noble 4 would be similar or even the same sounding? If so that would be a steal at $360...
 Maybe this is a question I should ask the Noble reps haha


----------



## kamcok

Hey joker,
  
 Regarding the Noble 4, do you think there would be much difference between the acrylic, silicone and the universal fit ?
  
 Thanks


----------



## nehcrow

kamcok said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> Regarding the Noble 4, do you think there would be much difference between the acrylic, silicone and the universal fit ?
> 
> Thanks


 
 Haha, just asked the same question above mate 
 Black Friday Noble Audio sale + joker's review of the 4S has really piqued my interest


----------



## nehcrow

kamcok said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> Regarding the Noble 4, do you think there would be much difference between the acrylic, silicone and the universal fit ?
> 
> Thanks


 

 Here's your answer from the Noble Audio thread mate:
  
 "The 4c, 4s, and the Noble 4 IEM all have the same internals. Each configuration would yield the same 2cc coupler measurement but may not have the same insitu measurement due to the differences in insertion depth, and reflection characteristics of the shell/housing material.

Are these differences audible? That is a question that is wide open for debate, and I'd prefer not to go into that as really it is a subjective interpretation of events/results.

I use iems Brannen uses ciems. As a company and a tam we embrace both housings."

 Damn, this Noble Audio 4 is becoming really appealing now


----------



## djvkool

nehcrow said:


> Here's your answer from the Noble Audio thread mate:
> 
> "The 4c, 4s, and the Noble 4 IEM all have the same internals. Each configuration would yield the same 2cc coupler measurement but may not have the same insitu measurement due to the differences in insertion depth, and reflection characteristics of the shell/housing material.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Well I have had my eyes on the 5 and MUST decide within the next 24 hours - Heir 5.0 ($419) vs Noble 5 ($520), which I think are a steal with either one on such a quality universal 
  
 Is it safe to assume that both signature would be somewhat similar? surely it won't be like heaven and earth different, will it?


----------



## nehcrow

djvkool said:


> Well I have had my eyes on the 5 and MUST decide within the next 24 hours - Heir 5.0 ($419) vs Noble 5 ($520), which I think are a steal with either one on such a quality universal
> 
> Is it safe to assume that both signature would be somewhat similar? surely it won't be like heaven and earth different, will it?


 
 Must be an incredibly tough decision mate 
 I'm going to stick with Noble, mainly due to something I've read... Can't discuss it here, as it's probably slanderous but can message ya


----------



## Bananiq

Brainwavz B2 or Rock it R-50?
  
 I heard that R-50 might be warmer with better bass. But the DBA02 mkII seems to have even better bass?


----------



## d marc0

nehcrow said:


> Must be an incredibly tough decision mate
> I'm going to stick with Noble, mainly due to something I've read... Can't discuss it here, as it's probably slanderous but can message ya


 
  
 Man! Joker's review on those Noble's has gotten everyone's attention! I for one is also really eyeing on the Noble series. Can you fill me in with that as well mate?


----------



## godlyatheist

I gave in and ordered a JH13, since it is a safe and known quantity at this point. Now my wallet is drier than a desert.


----------



## ljokerl

96rubberduckys said:


> Joker, in very general terms, how would you rate the Custom Art Music One against the Westone 4 or 2, or maybe SM64 for classical?
> 
> It seems perfect for me, just a little worried about soundstage.


 
  
 The Music One is the most neutral and accurate of the bunch. If that's your type of sound, go for it. The W2 would be the closest to that from the other sets you're considering but from memory a little darker and with less bass body than the Music One. The SM64 is on the opposite end of the spectrum - lots more bass, less upper midrange presence, and some treble sparkle but the tone is still at least as dark as that of the W2. Very different from the neutral Music One. Presentation-wise the Music One is pretty good - maybe not quite at the W4 level but not bad at all. I'd still take the Music One for its accuracy, especially with classical.
  


engelhaft said:


> @Joker, could you make brief comparison between the Yamaha EPH-100, the Sony MDR 7550 and the Sure SE535?


 
  
 The EPH-100 is way bassier than the other two - it's got tons of bass and some enhanced treble presence as well (though on the whole it's mostly smooth through the upper mids and treble).
  
 The SE535 is the flattest save for a bit of top-end roll-off. It's got accurate bass, is maybe a touch warmer than neutral, and has very clear and not at all recessed mids. The 7550 is similar but has a bit more bass body, a slightly thicker sound overall, and a more out-of-the-head presentation. 
  


godlyatheist said:


> Wow the Noble 4S gets such a high review. Is it safe to assume the 4C version will sound the same as the 4S but with acrylic shell? I'm trying to decide which CIEM to get and right now I'm stuck between the Noble 4S/4C and the JH13.


 
  
 No idea how the 4C compares. From what I've been told silicone vs acrylic does have an effect on the sound even with all other things equal but the degree, and whether it's an audible difference, is unclear. 
  


sil3nce said:


> I come back. And this is the first thing I see.
> Well done buddy.
> You're still keeping things alive haha/


 
  
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


moonyeol said:


> Someone needs to send a pair of Fischer Amps FA-4E your way... I'd rather not send mine since I'm in EU and I'm basically married to them. Would be extremely jealous if someone else were to put them in their ears for a longer period of time. Also, if that person had lots of ear wax my little OCD-brain would go berserk. Anyway. You need to hear them
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'll try to get in contact with Fischer Amps when I have more spare time.
  


smashdroid said:


> Hi ljoker.. i have always taken your reviews for purchasing headphones..need a little help now..
> I have sony mh1c... whats ur take on moe ss01 vs vsonic vsd1s.. i listen to more of rap, hiphop, rock, more of aggressive music.. bass is important for me.. but not much of "v" response.


 
  
 Both of those are more v-shaped than the MH1C. What don't you like about the MH1C?
  


zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker, hope everything is good on your side. First of all thank you for your recommendations and time for us helping decide the IEM. Now i have a MH1C and Quadbeat, MH1C i tried to adapt but cable is a nightmare and so is the fit, i like the sound but its starting to make some static too. Coming to Quadbeat, it is airy and clear and bass is enough for me with moderate EQing but i am unable to get a proper fit for it and don't find the large housings comfortable. So now comes your work... What next? I am totally confused as to what could form an upgrade from these two, i love the warmth of MH1C but i need some airy feel for a prolonged listening. So something on lines of Quadbeat with same airiness along with a better low end response with a good firm fit is what i am looking at. I am contemplating VSD1S/VSD1, Astrotec AM90, SM E10. Your recommendation is highly appreciated as always!!


 
  
 The VSD1S has a more v-shaped response. It has good bass and soundstage and as long as you don't mind slightly less forgiving treble it's a good choice.
  
 AM-90 has less bass than the Quadbeat and is about as "airy" as the MH1C so you can eliminate that.

 E10 lacks a little clarity compared to the Quadbeat but it has nice bass and a pretty airy feel. Can't think of a reason to buy it over the VSD1S, though, except if you're very worried about treble smoothness.
  
 You might also want to read up on the Quadbeat 2- I haven't tried it but it looks a lot more comfortable.
  


kamcok said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> Regarding the Noble 4, do you think there would be much difference between the acrylic, silicone and the universal fit ?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Sorry, not sure (see above).
  


bananiq said:


> Brainwavz B2 or Rock it R-50?
> 
> I heard that R-50 might be warmer with better bass. But the DBA02 mkII seems to have even better bass?


 
  
 If you go for the DBA-02 mkII it would be mostly for the build quality, which is better than with most other sets of this type. It has a little more bass than the R-50 IMO but so does the VSonic VC1000, which is cheaper.
  


godlyatheist said:


> I gave in and ordered a JH13, since it is a safe and known quantity at this point. Now my wallet is drier than a desert.


 
  
 That's a funny way of resolving all the uncertainty with the different Nobles 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## godlyatheist

ljokerl said:


> That's a funny way of resolving all the uncertainty with the different Nobles
> 
> 
> 
> .


 
 Well, I figured if I'm splurging, I might as well go for broke. Really though, since you said the Noble 4S had less bass than the GR07  it kinda turned me off. I'm using the GR07 and I'm don't think less bass will work for me.


----------



## kova4a

Joker, how's the power handling of that Noble 4S? Does it start distorting if you push the volume higher or boost the bass?


----------



## ljokerl

godlyatheist said:


> Well, I figured if I'm splurging, I might as well go for broke. Really though, since you said the Noble 4S had less bass than the GR07  it kinda turned me off. I'm using the GR07 and I'm don't think less bass will work for me.


 
  
 Fair enough, the JH13 is definitely a better fit in that case.
  


kova4a said:


> Joker, how's the power handling of that Noble 4S? Does it start distorting if you push the volume higher or boost the bass?


 

 Nope, not at the volumes I want to test. I didn't try giving it more than a few dB of bass boost - it's just not the right earphone for those who need that much bass. The Noble is for those who feel at home with a TWFK or a HiFiMan set.


----------



## ericdeez

Having just recently purchased the 1964 ears V6 Stage, I now find myself with an order for the Noble 4 Universal. Thank you/Curse you head fi


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> Nope, not at the volumes I want to test. I didn't try giving it more than a few dB of bass boost - it's just not the right earphone for those who need that much bass. The Noble is for those who feel at home with a TWFK or a HiFiMan set.


 
 Thanks for that. I'm not really looking for much bass. I'm just considering getting the Noble 4 as an upgrade for my er4s and b2. But given it's a universal version and it will have less isolation and the drivers will be pushed harder because the volume will have to be higher. That's why i'm asking about power handling coz some BAs don't always perform at their best when pushed harder and start to distort.
 I guess I might get the universal version now to try it out and eventually reshell it to a 4c or 4s.


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> Thanks for that. I'm not really looking for much bass. I'm just considering getting the Noble 4 as an upgrade for my er4s and b2. But given it's a universal version and it will have less isolation and the drivers will be pushed harder because the volume will have to be higher. That's why i'm asking about power handling coz some BAs don't always perform at their best when pushed harder and start to distort.
> I guess I might get the universal version now to try it out and eventually reshell it to a 4c or 4s.


 
  
 Fair enough. Just tried the Noble with the parametric EQ again and I begin to hear distortion at about +5dB at ~60Hz. Without EQing I can't get distortion out of it at any tolerable listening volume.


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> Fair enough. Just tried the Noble with the parametric EQ again and I begin to hear distortion at about +5dB at ~60Hz. Without EQing I can't get distortion out of it at any tolerable listening volume.


 
 Thanks again.


----------



## RixNox

Guys, I have spotted the Rockitsounds R50 model, however the review shows a poor isolation due to single flange tip. Is anyone aware of a good aftermarket better tip, compatible?


----------



## ozkan

Etymotic triple flanges or shure black olives isolate more.


----------



## godlyatheist

I wonder if I should upgrade my DAC when the JH13 arrive. I had ordered a Fiio E17 but decided to cancel it. I'm using a laptop and I want to have a small DAC, not necessarily portable but small. The Audioquest Dragonfly is interesting (about $70 with promos). Anyone have some recommendations? Prefer USB and neutral


----------



## AristoNYC

First, This is one of the best lists I have seen, thank you very much. 
  
 I have looked over this list many times but I am still having trouble finding the "best" IEM for me. I currently use some cheap Panasonic RPHJE120K which I like but the quality isn't really there. I also have the Monoprice buds but I find the size/fit to be awkward  & uncomfortable and I find the bass too overpowering.  I would rather not spend over $60 as these will only be used on the subway or walking around the city, I have many fullsized headphones for home use. They will be in my jeans pocket when not in use so they should be durable. 
  
 bullet points:
 <$60
 good isolation (subway & city use)
 to be used with a Samsung Galaxy phone or Sansa Clip (no amp)
 Nothing too bass forward as I mostly listen to Rock music (not a lot of electronic or rap, but some).
 durable
  
  
 The ones I've checked off to be contenders based off this list:
 Astrotec AM-800 (lacks isolation?)
 Astrotec AM-90
 Brainwavz M4 
 Brainwavz M5
 Soundmagic E30
 Vsonic VC02 (might not be durable enough to throw in jeans)
 UE600
  
 On a higher price note I've considered these:
 Shure SE215 ($100) - are the Shures worth the $30 increase over the UM1's?
 Westone UM1 ($70) 
  
 I am open to spend more if necessary but I would prefer not to. 
  
  
 **
 I'm leaning towards the UM1 for $70 from Amazon. It is a bit more than I was looking to spend but the reviews are good. Any reason why I shouldn't go with the UM1? 
 **


----------



## MoonYeol

I can vouch for VC02. Awesome. Period. Use some tape or superglue or whatever to attach the cable to the earpieces. May not be replacable anymore but damn it's worth it.


----------



## Harijs

Joker, can you do quick comparison: TF10 vs EPH 100? Specially the sub bass quantity/quality. Thanks.


----------



## modulor

aristonyc said:


> First, This is one of the best lists I have seen, thank you very much.
> 
> I have looked over this list many times but I am still having trouble finding the "best" IEM for me. I currently use some cheap Panasonic RPHJE120K which I like but the quality isn't really there. I also have the Monoprice buds but I find the size/fit to be awkward  & uncomfortable and I find the bass too overpowering.  I would rather not spend over $60 as these will only be used on the subway or walking around the city, I have many fullsized headphones for home use. They will be in my jeans pocket when not in use so they should be durable.
> 
> ...


 
 I'd throw the Vsonic VSD1S and the SteelSeries Flux on your list - the Flux is a bit less expensive and has a built in remote/mic that will work with your Android, and they isolate a bit better than the dynamic Vsonics I've tried with silicone tips.  They are certainly on par with one another and can be had sub-$50.  The Flux has the smooth-yet-crisp treble and less mid-bass (though more sub-bass) of the two, but the UE600 from what I've read will be more neutral/flat in the bass, more mid-centric and with fairly smooth treble.  The bass on the Flux is actually quite pleasant and engaging, all without affecting the midrange.  I imagine the UE600 to sound lean compared to these two.  I found the balance on the Flux to be a good fit with rock and metal - I've personally not heard the UE600 yet but I suspect they will be similar to my RE-400 which is also mid-focused and best with things like vocals and acoustic, but still performs well for rock IMO. The UE600 may be a bit more refined in some cases like soundstage and clarity.  Durability should be good enough on those three for pocket use.
  
 On that note, I'd be interested in a brief comparison of the UE600 with the VSD1S and Flux


----------



## AristoNYC

modulor said:


> I'd throw the Vsonic VSD1S and the SteelSeries Flux on your list - the Flux is a bit less expensive and has a built in remote/mic that will work with your Android, and they isolate a bit better than the dynamic Vsonics I've tried with silicone tips.  They are certainly on par with one another and can be had sub-$50.  The Flux has the smooth-yet-crisp treble and less mid-bass (though more sub-bass) of the two, but the UE600 from what I've read will be more neutral/flat in the bass, more mid-centric and with fairly smooth treble.  The bass on the Flux is actually quite pleasant and engaging, all without affecting the midrange.  I imagine the UE600 to sound lean compared to these two.  I found the balance on the Flux to be a good fit with rock and metal - I've personally not heard the UE600 yet but I suspect they will be similar to my RE-400 which is also mid-focused and best with things like vocals and acoustic, but still performs well for rock IMO. The UE600 may be a bit more refined in some cases like soundstage and clarity.  Durability should be good enough on those three for pocket use.
> 
> On that note, I'd be interested in a brief comparison of the UE600 with the VSD1S and Flux


 
 Thanks for your input. I went and ordered the Flux from Amazon since I wanted to lock in on the price of $25 and I can still search since they aren't shipping yet (not in stock). $25 seems like a good price. 
 If I end up getting something else I can cancel these or keep them and use them with my PS Vita. 
  
 I'm leaning towards the UM1 for $70 from Amazon. It is a bit more than I was looking to spend but the reviews are good. Any reason why I shouldn't go with the UM1?


----------



## insidedrive

Hello joker how do you think the RHA MA750 compares with iems in its price range such as the gr07, re400, and Fidelio s2?


----------



## MikonJuice

I think I need help. This "audiophile thing" is no fun at all.
 From an ignorant stand point, which is mine when it comes to audio, my last 4 years are a nightmare.
 Here's the deal: I had an RE0, an RE262 and GR07. Only the last one comes close to what I want when it comes to sound signature (which I do not know how to put into technical words): detail specially from guitars, good vocals but don't need to be the focal point, good bass but, again, don't need to be the focal point and detailed drums. The "airy", spacious feeling that the GR07 brought to my ears just made me even more confused, as I started loving to listen to acoustic rock (oh boy, Kiss and Jimmy Page & Robert Plant sound spectacular on the GR07...) and live drums (John Bohan is the best when it comes to hearing every detail from the drums).
 So, after this very ignorant description, is is possible to give me opinions regarding the Dunu DN-1000, Rockit 50M and Astrotec AX-7, or any other good brand/model) so that I can hear all types of rock(from 1960 to 2000's) while having guitars and drums in detail and with great separation?
 By the way, I do feel the bass on Gr07 are more than enough, but for live concerts, specially guitars, it kind of sounds a little boring.

 Sorry for the horrible description of my sound signature, but please, help!


----------



## ljokerl

godlyatheist said:


> I wonder if I should upgrade my DAC when the JH13 arrive. I had ordered a Fiio E17 but decided to cancel it. I'm using a laptop and I want to have a small DAC, not necessarily portable but small. The Audioquest Dragonfly is interesting (about $70 with promos). Anyone have some recommendations? Prefer USB and neutral


 
  
 It sounds great out of my Fiio E7, which is not exactly a high-end source. 
  


harijs said:


> Joker, can you do quick comparison: TF10 vs EPH 100? Specially the sub bass quantity/quality. Thanks.


 
  
 Luckily that was one of the few comparisons I had time to do with the EPH-100.
  
TF10 vs EPH-100
  
 The EPH-100 has more subbass and on the whole sounds warmer, more coherent, smoother, and more natural. Its presentation also has better depth/layering.
The TF10 has less bass and sounds thinner overall. It's a little clearer, though, and seems to resolve detail a little better. Tonally it's brighter thanks to greater overall treble energy. Soundstaging is wider/more out-of-the-head. 
  
  


modulor said:


> I'd throw the Vsonic VSD1S and the SteelSeries Flux on your list - the Flux is a bit less expensive and has a built in remote/mic that will work with your Android, and they isolate a bit better than the dynamic Vsonics I've tried with silicone tips.  They are certainly on par with one another and can be had sub-$50.  The Flux has the smooth-yet-crisp treble and less mid-bass (though more sub-bass) of the two, but the UE600 from what I've read will be more neutral/flat in the bass, more mid-centric and with fairly smooth treble.  The bass on the Flux is actually quite pleasant and engaging, all without affecting the midrange.  I imagine the UE600 to sound lean compared to these two.  I found the balance on the Flux to be a good fit with rock and metal - I've personally not heard the UE600 yet but I suspect they will be similar to my RE-400 which is also mid-focused and best with things like vocals and acoustic, but still performs well for rock IMO. The UE600 may be a bit more refined in some cases like soundstage and clarity.  Durability should be good enough on those three for pocket use.
> 
> On that note, I'd be interested in a brief comparison of the UE600 with the VSD1S and Flux


 
  
 Yeah, I think you're spot-on. UE600 is more mid-centric with flatter bass and smoother treble compared to both the Flux and VSD1S. Mids are more prominent compared to the Flux and VSD1S and the overall sound is more lean.
  


aristonyc said:


> Thanks for your input. I went and ordered the Flux from Amazon since I wanted to lock in on the price of $25 and I can still search since they aren't shipping yet (not in stock). $25 seems like a good price.
> If I end up getting something else I can cancel these or keep them and use them with my PS Vita.
> 
> I'm leaning towards the UM1 for $70 from Amazon. It is a bit more than I was looking to spend but the reviews are good. Any reason why I shouldn't go with the UM1?


 
  
 Good call on the $25 Flux. Never tried the UM1 but I like both the Flux and Flux Pro better than the ~$100 Westone 1.
  


insidedrive said:


> Hello joker how do you think the RHA MA750 compares with iems in its price range such as the gr07, re400, and Fidelio s2?


 
  
 They are warmer, bassier, and sometimes seem to lack a little energy in the highs but on the whole not bad at all. Strengths so far seem to be bass power/depth and soundstaging, plus I love the build quality 
  


mikonjuice said:


> I think I need help. This "audiophile thing" is no fun at all.
> From an ignorant stand point, which is mine when it comes to audio, my last 4 years are a nightmare.
> Here's the deal: I had an RE0, an RE262 and GR07. Only the last one comes close to what I want when it comes to sound signature (which I do not know how to put into technical words): detail specially from guitars, good vocals but don't need to be the focal point, good bass but, again, don't need to be the focal point and detailed drums. The "airy", spacious feeling that the GR07 brought to my ears just made me even more confused, as I started loving to listen to acoustic rock (oh boy, Kiss and Jimmy Page & Robert Plant sound spectacular on the GR07...) and live drums (John Bohan is the best when it comes to hearing every detail from the drums).
> So, after this very ignorant description, is is possible to give me opinions regarding the Dunu DN-1000, Rockit 50M and Astrotec AX-7, or any other good brand/model) so that I can hear all types of rock(from 1960 to 2000's) while having guitars and drums in detail and with great separation?
> ...


 
  
 Better to list what you don't like/want improved compared to the GR07. In general, the R-50M and AX7 are both flatter and brighter than the GR07 with more midrange presence and less bass. The DN-1000 so far sounds more v-shaped than the GR07 and has more bass than even the GR07 Bass Edition.


----------



## MikonJuice

Is it possible to have:
  - an even better separation of instruments?
  - more proeminent guitars, or at least a little more fun than the GR07?
  - With same vocals and same drum sounds?

 Thanks for the rpevious reply!


----------



## godlyatheist

ljokerl said:


> It sounds great out of my Fiio E7, which is not exactly a high-end source.


 
 I guess I'll just wait and see, thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

mikonjuice said:


> Is it possible to have:
> - an even better separation of instruments?
> - more proeminent guitars, or at least a little more fun than the GR07?
> - With same vocals and same drum sounds?
> ...


 
  
 Guitars and vocals span a similar frequency range so you can't really get a change in one without affecting the other. That said, I would give the Philips Fidelio S1 or S2 a try. They have a little more presence in the upper midrange where guitars have their "bite". They also tend to have a bit more bass than a regular GR07, which can be a pro or con, depending on the recording. Instrument separation is no better than with the GR07, though, and I really wouldn't call them an 'upgrade' from the GR07 at all, except that they seem like they might suit your needs better.


----------



## suman134

will you do a review of brainwavz delta ?


----------



## Sauntere

Hi Joker,
  
 In your experience how much difference in sound are UF versions vs Customs. I am asking this in relation to your review on the Noble 4S. I have a pair of Fitear F111 and have the impression that the Noble 4 may have the same basic sig but overall better clarity. Would this be correct ? Can i make such assmuptions about the UF version ? 
  
 Cheers


----------



## estreeter

Joker, long time - great to see the old thread still going strong  
  
 I will come back to this thread when I'm ready to agonise over descriptions of sound quality again, but for now I'm ecstatic that I was able to get a solid recommendation and order a pair of EPH-100s within 30 minutes of logging onto Head-Fi this morning : for me, that's a record. Life is a lot simpler when you can abandon the usual _'I need detailed, but not analytical, and warm, but not too warm' _provisos - I liked your reviews from day one because you covered such a huge range of 'phones, and readily admit that you bought some of them purely for their 'fun' factor. Keep the faith.
  
 estreeter


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> will you do a review of brainwavz delta ?


 
  
 No plans at this time - don't have one on hand. I have an R3 but it's probably not going to get a full review because I don't really like the form factor.  
  


sauntere said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> In your experience how much difference in sound are UF versions vs Customs. I am asking this in relation to your review on the Noble 4S. I have a pair of Fitear F111 and have the impression that the Noble 4 may have the same basic sig but overall better clarity. Would this be correct ? Can i make such assmuptions about the UF version ?
> 
> Cheers


 
  
 I have no idea how close the Noble 4 and 4S are. The universal UERM I reviewed recently was very good. The universal Miracle that I tried didn't stack up to the customized one. Haven't had occasion to compare any other universals to their custom versions but my guess is it varies on a case by case basis, and also depends on how good a fit you can get with the universal. The universal UERM was not particularly comfortable for me in any position. 
  
 Unfortunately I haven't tried the F111 so I can't say how the 4S compares. 
  


estreeter said:


> Joker, long time - great to see the old thread still going strong
> 
> I will come back to this thread when I'm ready to agonise over descriptions of sound quality again, but for now I'm ecstatic that I was able to get a solid recommendation and order a pair of EPH-100s within 30 minutes of logging onto Head-Fi this morning : for me, that's a record. Life is a lot simpler when you can abandon the usual _'I need detailed, but not analytical, and warm, but not too warm' _provisos - I liked your reviews from day one because you covered such a huge range of 'phones, and readily admit that you bought some of them purely for their 'fun' factor. Keep the faith.
> 
> estreeter


 
  
 Thanks, I appreciate that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 The EPH-100 is fun indeed. Hope you like it!


----------



## Sauntere

Thank you for responding...


----------



## neo5468

I just recieved my SS flux and they are absolutely unbelievable. I can't belive that so powerful sound is comming from so tiny IEM's. Thanks for input joker. Without your thread and your review, I would never consider "gaming" earphones for listening to music but they are just brilliant. Thanks again for this. Im so happy :*


----------



## alterndog

Joker,
  
 I saw you hadn't reviewed the TDK BA200 yet. I recently got a pair from Ross for $25, but already have the RE-262. They are pretty amazing, but they will compete with my 262s and HE300 for play. I say this because if you are ever interested in demoing the BA200, I'd be more than willing to lend them to you.


----------



## 96rubberduckys

alterndog said:


> Joker,
> 
> I saw you hadn't reviewed the TDK BA200 yet. I recently got a pair from Ross for $25, but already have the RE-262. They are pretty amazing, but they will compete with my 262s and HE300 for play. I say this because if you are ever interested in demoing the BA200, I'd be more than willing to lend them to you.


 
 Could you do a quick comparison between the two iems, even if only brief impressions?


----------



## ljokerl

neo5468 said:


> I just recieved my SS flux and they are absolutely unbelievable. I can't belive that so powerful sound is comming from so tiny IEM's. Thanks for input joker. Without your thread and your review, I would never consider "gaming" earphones for listening to music but they are just brilliant. Thanks again for this. Im so happy :*


 
  
 Awesome, glad you like them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





! 
  
  


alterndog said:


> Joker,
> 
> I saw you hadn't reviewed the TDK BA200 yet. I recently got a pair from Ross for $25, but already have the RE-262. They are pretty amazing, but they will compete with my 262s and HE300 for play. I say this because if you are ever interested in demoing the BA200, I'd be more than willing to lend them to you.


 
  
 Thanks - it appears I actually have someone else sending me a pair for review now but I really appreciate the offer!


----------



## alterndog

96rubberduckys said:


> Could you do a quick comparison between the two iems, even if only brief impressions?


 
  
 Do you mind if I do it in about a week or so? I'm in finals week for grad school and swamped with school.


----------



## 96rubberduckys

alterndog said:


> 96rubberduckys said:
> 
> 
> > Could you do a quick comparison between the two iems, even if only brief impressions?
> ...


 
 of course--please don't feel pressured to do anything


----------



## heart banger-97

Hi  ljokerl  !
  
 Have you had a chance to hear brainwavz r3?
  
 Thanks


----------



## Harijs

Joker, what's the best sounding hybrids you've heard so far? Thanks again for this amazing job you're doing!


----------



## Zelda

>


----------



## goodvibes

Wow on the 4s review. Makes the 4 universal certainly look like a steal. It won't be as good in fit or sound exactly like the custom (especially the silicone) but will have the availability of tip tuning so neutral and informative with a personal twist at $450 sure sounds appealing.


----------



## ericr

godlyatheist said:


> I wonder if I should upgrade my DAC when the JH13 arrive. I had ordered a Fiio E17 but decided to cancel it. I'm using a laptop and I want to have a *small DAC*, not necessarily portable but small. The Audioquest Dragonfly is interesting (about $70 with promos). Anyone have some recommendations? Prefer *USB and neutral*


 
  
 Been listening to the HRT Microstreamer for a couple of months now and really like what I hear.  It's a very small USB DAC (+ headphone amp) with a big, clear and detailed sound.


----------



## Deviltooth

ericr said:


> Been listening to the HRT Microstreamer for a couple of months now and really like what I hear.  It's a very small USB DAC (+ headphone amp) with a big, clear and detailed sound.


 

 I love my Microstreamer.  I might jump on the new Leckerton in a few months but I'm very happy with the Microstreamer performance right now (I'm only using C/IEMs not full sized cans).


----------



## ljokerl

heart banger-97 said:


> Hi  ljokerl  !
> 
> Have you had a chance to hear brainwavz r3?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Yes. They actually sound quite good but I don't like the fit so they probably won't get a full review.
  
 Very smooth sound though, but perhaps a little dull up top. Reminds me of an RHA MA750 with not nearly as much bass. 
  


harijs said:


> Joker, what's the best sounding hybrids you've heard so far? Thanks again for this amazing job you're doing!


 
  
 The Rooth LS5X Demo. Among proper universals, the K3003.
  


goodvibes said:


> Wow on the 4s review. Makes the 4 universal certainly look like a steal. It won't be as good in fit or sound exactly like the custom (especially the silicone) but will have the availability of tip tuning so neutral and informative with a personal twist at $450 sure sounds appealing.


 
  
 Indeed - hope it's as good as the 4S!


----------



## Mimouille

goodvibes said:


> Wow on the 4s review. Makes the 4 universal certainly look like a steal. It won't be as good in fit or sound exactly like the custom (especially the silicone) but will have the availability of tip tuning so neutral and informative with a personal twist at $450 sure sounds appealing.:bigsmile_face:


I would think the fact that it is silicone makes a difference in the sonics. The 4 universal is supposedly an improvement over the Hier 4ai which eas supposedly good, but according to several reviewers I know, not THAT good.


----------



## heart banger-97

ljokerl said:


> Yes. They actually sound quite good but I don't like the fit so they probably won't get a full review.
> 
> Very smooth sound though, but perhaps a little dull up top. Reminds me of an RHA MA750 with not nearly as much bass.


 
 Thanks for responding. can you give me a brief comparison between r3 and some thing that you already have done a review (like b2 or something else)?


----------



## Gandasaputra

I wish upon a star that ljokerl would review sony XBA-30 in future


----------



## goodvibes

mimouille said:


> I would think the fact that it is silicone makes a difference in the sonics. The 4 universal is supposedly an improvement over the Hier 4ai which eas supposedly good, but according to several reviewers I know, not THAT good.


 
 What I said.


----------



## tomscy2000

A lot of people are going to start confusing the 4S and the 4S if we continue talking like this...


----------



## Mimouille

goodvibes said:


> What I said. :bigsmile_face:


I understand what you are saying  I am just saying that I think (without having ever heard any of them so it is pure speculimagination) the silicone gives it that extra mile that makes it so nice, and the Noble 4 might not be at the same level. Even a small difference matters at this level. I am juet saying because people getting the Noble 4 and expecting JH13FP level could be disappointed. Once again I have nothing to back it up.


----------



## kova4a

mimouille said:


> I understand what you are saying
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 I doubt anyone is buying a Noble 4 expecting it to be as good as jh13fp. I ordered mine looking for an er4s upgrade and if Noble really worked on fixing the heir 4ai weaknesses the Noble 4 will be a real winner, especially at the Black Friday's price.


----------



## Mimouille

kova4a said:


> I doubt anyone is buying a Noble 4 expecting it to be as good as jh13fp. I ordered mine looking for an er4s upgrade and if Noble really worked on fixing the heir 4ai weaknesses the Noble 4 will be a real winner, especially at the Black Friday's price.


I was saying that in the context of the 4S being ranked by Joker almost at JH13 level.


----------



## Deviltooth

mimouille said:


> I was saying that in the context of the 4S being ranked by Joker almost at JH13 level.


 

 I have a JH13pro and I ordered a Noble 4 Universal.  When I get the latter I'll do some comparisons, though with the price difference it's not really fair to the 4.


----------



## ljokerl

heart banger-97 said:


> Thanks for responding. can you give me a brief comparison between r3 and some thing that you already have done a review (like b2 or something else)?


 
  
 Just tried them against the HiFiMan RE-400
  

 They are actually not that different - both are balanced with pretty level bass and smooth treble. The R3 sounds a little dull in comparison, like there's an upper midrange dip. At the same time, it has a little more treble energy overall than the RE-400. The RE-400 has more midrange emphasis in comparison, slightly better clarity, and smoother highs with less dips and peaks. I like the RE-400 a little better sound-wise and a lot better in terms of form factor.
  
  


gandasaputra said:


> I wish upon a star that ljokerl would review sony XBA-30 in future


 
  
 Sorry, not too likely. The XBA-3 and XBA-4 didn't really strike my fancy so I'm not super excited for the XBA-30.
  


tomscy2000 said:


> A lot of people are going to start confusing the 4S and the 4S if we continue talking like this...


 
  
 Yeah, hopefully not. 
  


deviltooth said:


> I have a JH13pro and I ordered a Noble 4 Universal.  When I get the latter I'll do some comparisons, though with the price difference it's not really fair to the 4.


 
  
 I'm interested in your comparison


----------



## alpha421

kova4a said:


> I ordered mine looking for an* er4s upgrade* and if Noble really worked on fixing the heir 4ai weaknesses the Noble 4 will be a real winner, especially at the Black Friday's price.


 
  
 Hmm.  Coming from a 4.ai and 4.A past owner, my ER4S upgrade path was the Tzar 350 (waiting for delivery).


----------



## kova4a

alpha421 said:


> Hmm.  Coming from a 4.ai and 4.A past owner, my ER4S upgrade path was the Tzar 350 (waiting for delivery).


 
 Well, the Noble 4 was the logical choice for me. With Wizard working on fixing the 4ai's shortcomings and supposedly providing a reference quad driver iem done right.
 I guess a lot of people were tempted by the bigger 30% discount Heir provided for Black Friday and with zero reviews of the Noble 4 they were a bit skeptical but I personally decided to take that leap of faith and chose the newer product.


----------



## alpha421

I plan to wait for the impressions to roll in. Who knows. Maybe Noble can do what JH Audio did with the Jh freq phase tweaks.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Clear Tune Monitors WLS-5 5-driver CIEM
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1A14) Clear Tune Monitors WLS-5*
> 
> 
> Reviewed November 2013
> ...


 
  
  
 The updated ranking can be found here.


----------



## FlySweep

I took advantage of Noble Audio's BF sale and ordered a NA4 universal IEM, as well... comparison to my UERM & JH13 FP are sure to follow.  I figure I need to have at least one universal IEM around.. and being that I prefer a neutral/ish signature, this looks like a good choice.
  
 I owned the Heir 4.A custom approx a year ago, too.. I was less than enthused with its sound.  The steep 4K dip (which wasn't 'revealed' when I received my 4.A) was something I caught onto immediately.. I went as so far to have my pair re-inspected cause I was certain a damper or something was missing.. the upper mids through treble sounded unnaturally dull.. so here's hoping the NA4 soundly addresses this as has been stated on the product page.


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> Added the Clear Tune Monitors WLS-5 5-driver CIEM


 
  
 I wish you'd gotten the WLS-3 --- it was my preferred one of the three WLS demos I heard.


----------



## Benik3

Nice reviews! But still I don't know, what to choose under $100 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I had MEE SP51 which I used with the "gun silver" tip. I like stronger but deep bass (sub-bass), warmer sound.
 I looked on Sunrise Xcape IE or JVC HA-FXT90, but I'm still afraid, if it's not to "bass weak" for me...
 I listen to rock, pop-rock, but also The Prodigy, Pendulum or Movits!
  
 Any recommendations please? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 EDIT: Brookstone Dual drivers looks great for the price. Pity that you don't have them in review :/


----------



## Hitesh

@Joker
 Have you listened to Denon AH-C260R ?
 Which would be a better option between AH-C260R and E10M ? Need an IEM around that budget with mic


----------



## suman134

hitesh said:


> @Joker
> Have you listened to Denon AH-C260R ?
> Which would be a better option between AH-C260R and E10M ? Need an IEM around that budget with mic


 
  
     dont go for ahc-260 , you can opt for e10m , they are far better then c-260 .


----------



## ljokerl

flysweep said:


> I took advantage of Noble Audio's BF sale and ordered a NA4 universal IEM, as well... comparison to my UERM & JH13 FP are sure to follow.  I figure I need to have at least one universal IEM around.. and being that I prefer a neutral/ish signature, this looks like a good choice.
> 
> I owned the Heir 4.A custom approx a year ago, too.. I was less than enthused with its sound.  The steep 4K dip (which wasn't 'revealed' when I received my 4.A) was something I caught onto immediately.. I went as so far to have my pair re-inspected cause I was certain a damper or something was missing.. the upper mids through treble sounded unnaturally dull.. so here's hoping the NA4 soundly addresses this as has been stated on the product page.


 
  
 I've never heard the 4.A but I don't think the Noble has that problem.
  


benik3 said:


> Nice reviews! But still I don't know, what to choose under $100
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Seems like the Yamaha EPH-100 would be a great fit for you. Last I checked it was around $115 on amazon with a few used ones available for less.
  
 Other than that the FXT90 should be a decent fit. It doesn't have the best deep bass but it has good impact, certainly not worse than the SP51 on the medium setting you were using.

 The Brookstone Dual isn't that bassy, either. I do have one but it's broken on me twice so I have been putting off the review. Great sound, just don't really trust the construction.
  


hitesh said:


> @Joker
> Have you listened to Denon AH-C260R ?
> Which would be a better option between AH-C260R and E10M ? Need an IEM around that budget with mic


 
  
 Never tried the C260 but the C360 was pretty sub-par. I'd go with the E10M.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

*sigh*
  
 I am stuck.
  
 My Minerva Mi-1 customs (absolutely fantastic in every day) have packed in and the repair cost for a single driver unit is just far too rich for my bank account and financial position for the foreseeable future so after over 2 1/2 years, I am on the hunt for a pair of quality universal IEM's.
  
 And beyond this thread I have absolutely no idea where it is best to turn...
  
 My last universals were the HeadDirect RE-ZERO's. Not much on the bass end, reasonable speed for a dynamic but highs and mids that could soothe even the most angry beast on the right tracks. I loved them but they weren't in the same league as my Mi-1's for sound. Recently I've been using my Dad's pair of sub-$50 Meelec universals and they weren't too bad but they took some effort to EQ out and make them fun.
  
 Ideally I'd love something like the RE-ZERO but of a higher grade/quality, analytic with fantastic mids and highs and controlled bass but I know that's not an easy task. I'm not a huge fan of Dynamic drivers as I find they can fatigue me easily (health issue which makes them fatigue my ears a bit faster than most) but I don't mind them, especially if the bass quality is reasonable and it's not thumping hard (Monster Turbines).
  
 Personally I've been looking at the old stable Fischer Audio DBA-02's and the Mk II (£120) versions, as well as the Brainwavz B2 (£64) or R3's (£80, dual dynamics, I know). 
  
 Could anyone give me a hand? Yes, I'm picky. With my health condition I can have sore ears/quickly fatigued ears with too much impact behind the bass for which I found the Monster Turbines to be awful for, even if it was enjoyable until that certain point.
  
 I really do appreciate any advice given. As the Mi-1's would cost me over £200 to replace, the Brainwavz offerings sound fantastic and ideally I'd like to spend no more than £100 (about $160 in US currency, give or take $10). Alternatives are very much appreciated as the references and ideas I have posted above are just for reference/curiousity sake.


----------



## davidcotton

Ouch, still 2 and half years isn't bad for a set of headphones.  What's up with the mi's anyway? Know what you mean about the monster turbines.  The bass on those gave me a headache as well.  I think it's to do with the fact that the bass swamps the details so you turn it up to hear vocals etc more clearly and end up with a headache!
  
 Just a thought but if you can a)wait and b) stretch to cover impressions and postage (don't know how much they are where you are for impressions) and want to stick with customs you could do worse than have a look at Cosmic Ears single ba which is going for a £100 atm.  The downside is they aren't taking orders until the 20th after clearing a mammoth backlog though so you wouldn't get anything back till January at the earliest.  They are also acrylic not silicone if that makes a difference.
  
 Good luck getting em sorted.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

davidcotton said:


> Ouch, still 2 and half years isn't bad for a set of headphones.  What's up with the mi's anyway? Know what you mean about the monster turbines.  The bass on those gave me a headache as well.  I think it's to do with the fact that the bass swamps the details so you turn it up to hear vocals etc more clearly and end up with a headache!
> 
> Just a thought but if you can a)wait and b) stretch to cover impressions and postage (don't know how much they are where you are for impressions) and want to stick with customs you could do worse than have a look at Cosmic Ears single ba which is going for a £100 atm.  The downside is they aren't taking orders until the 20th after clearing a mammoth backlog though so you wouldn't get anything back till January at the earliest.  They are also acrylic not silicone if that makes a difference.
> 
> Good luck getting em sorted.


 
  
 The left monitor in my Mi's developed a bit of a crunch/crackle noise on certain tracks (tried difference sources, different versions of the track ie. YouTube Vs. my own FLAC rip Vs. my own CD) and I returned them to Minerva. They said there was a bit of wax blockage in there and moisture ingress which dropped volumes by 4dB in that monitor, which was said to be 'barely noticeable' . £12 to remove the blockage, £137 for a part rebuild or £205 for impressions and full rebuild with 12mo warranty... I picked the cleaning option, got them back and the left monitor is now quite even worse than when I sent it in. Much lower volume across the board, almost silent in some parts of some tracks, the audio quality is much reduced and the crunch/crackle is still there. My left ear is, as proved by hearing tests, my stronger and more sensitive ear so it's like my whole world has been shattered even if I've been tweaking EQ's and stereo balance settings to try to alleviate my issue and smooth things out.
  
 The part-rebuild option doesn't take my fancy and it could easily be 6-12 months before I am readily able to afford a full new build with impressions (£205 is what I was offered and includes postage + new impressions, as opposed to the £215 normal). Plus, Lee Kennedy back in the day set me up with a certain kind of filters inside the Mi-1's as I found the standard sound to be a bit ... opposite of intimate ... and a bit, well I can't remember but I did review them and Lee fixed me up with a custom filter set which was epic for my tastes. There's no guarantee I'd be able to get those back either.
  
 As far as customs go I've only ever had the Mi's and those were fantastic. I'm not sure I'd like to risk £100 and more I'm assuming for impressions and other bits on new, single driver custom made from acrylic. They could be fine but it's a fair chunk of change and I know universals are reasonably comfortable for my ears with single/double/tripled flange silicone or Comply foam tips.
  
 Until I get financially back on my feet, £100'ish is the max I can spend and I think it's likely to be best spent on some universals. I can't live with my Dad's Meelcs for another week


----------



## Zelda

ljokerl said:


> Seems like the Yamaha EPH-100 would be a great fit for you. Last I checked it was around $115 on amazon with a few used ones available for less.
> 
> Other than that the FXT90 should be a decent fit. It doesn't have the best deep bass but it has good impact, certainly not worse than the SP51 on the medium setting you were using.
> 
> The Brookstone Dual isn't that bassy, either. I do have one but it's broken on me twice so I have been putting off the review. Great sound, just don't really trust the construction.


 
 or try the Moe SS01!


----------



## Benik3

Wow! They are little over my budget, but I like the design (otherwise is also long as the MEE SP51).
  
 BTW what about the Sunrise? You gave the v1 really high rating, and what I read, the version IE is only little warmer and with little more bass. That also looks promising...


----------



## ljokerl

elcomesoft said:


> *sigh*
> 
> I am stuck.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The DBA-02/mkII/B2 are all brighter than the RE-ZERO so they might be fatiguing for you (although I'm honestly not sure how the Mi-1 sounds). The R3 is smoother/less bright but the fit is not nearly as easy-going as the similarly-priced HiFiMan RE-400 and the sound is not better. The RE-400 is honestly the better option of the two. 
  
 The VSonic GR07 and Philips Fidelio S2 are good options in your price range but again both have more treble energy and can be more harsh than the RE-ZERO and RE-400. The Etymotic HF5 is another very solid earphone - again a little more treble presence than the RE-ZERO/RE-400 but still a little more forgiving than the DBA-02/B2. 
  
 TL;DR - The HiFiMan RE-400 is the safe option, the HF5 is the neutral option with more treble presence, the GR07/Fidelio S2 have more bass impact but still not too much (definitely not at Turbine level). The DBA-02/B2 can be fatiguing if you aren't used to energetic treble but have very fast and level bass.
  


benik3 said:


> Wow! They are little over my budget, but I like the design (otherwise is also long as the MEE SP51).
> 
> BTW what about the Sunrise? You gave the v1 really high rating, and what I read, the version IE is only little warmer and with little more bass. That also looks promising...


 

 The V1 doesn't have enough bass for you and I can't really recommend the Xcape IE because of the build quality. You have to be very gentle with it.


----------



## tomscy2000

Joker, I was hoping you could comment on the aesthetic quality (amount of bubbles, overall transparency, lacquer polish/smoothness, etc.) of the silicone CIEMs you possess. AFAIK, you have the Noble 4S, CustomArt Music One, Spiral Ears SE 3-Way Reference, and Sensaphonics 3MAX?


----------



## ElcomeSoft

ljokerl said:


> The DBA-02/mkII/B2 are all brighter than the RE-ZERO so they might be fatiguing for you (although I'm honestly not sure how the Mi-1 sounds). The R3 is smoother/less bright but the fit is not nearly as easy-going as the similarly-priced HiFiMan RE-400 and the sound is not better. The RE-400 is honestly the better option of the two.
> 
> The VSonic GR07 and Philips Fidelio S2 are good options in your price range but again both have more treble energy and can be more harsh than the RE-ZERO and RE-400. The Etymotic HF5 is another very solid earphone - again a little more treble presence than the RE-ZERO/RE-400 but still a little more forgiving than the DBA-02/B2.
> 
> TL;DR - The HiFiMan RE-400 is the safe option, the HF5 is the neutral option with more treble presence, the GR07/Fidelio S2 have more bass impact but still not too much (definitely not at Turbine level). The DBA-02/B2 can be fatiguing if you aren't used to energetic treble but have very fast and level bass.


 
  
 As my Mi-1's had a custom filter, different from the standard Mi-1's, I am not sure how to categorise them either 
  
 Joker, as always, you go above and beyond what I expected to deliver experience, details and advice to provide assistance to people who pop in here. I'll spend a little while looking at the options you've put forward, check and compare prices (right now, the B2's are just over £60 which is at the $95 USD mark, seems tempting). 
  
 As I have just been helping deliver Level 1 Principles in Customer Service at my place of work I wish I could use this thread and posts like these as demonstrations of good customer service for the learners 
  
 Thank you for all of your help.


----------



## Samurai Boy

Joker,

 I posted a thread in the Help section, but I haven't gotten much info, but here's what I wanted from my new IEM:

 A somewhat balanced sound (no harsh treble or monster bass)
 Low microphonics (an absolute must)
 If possible one with a flat impedance curve from 20Hz-20kHz (dynamic), so I kind of want to stay aware from armature/multi-armature (I plan to use it with multiple sources)
*Not *an over the ear design
 Low isolation (so if a classmate near me calls me out, I can still hear while listening on medium volumes)
 Around $100 USD

 I originally settled on the JVC FX500 because of the low isolation and microphonics, but it's not easily acquired in the US. I've switched my choice to the Philips Fidelio S1 going by your reviews on InnerFidelity and on The Headphone List.

 So I want to ask you, any alternatives worth considering again? Or is the Fidelio S1 the best for my situation?

 Oh, and thanks for being an awesome community member who takes his time to do all these reviews and even help on recommendations.


----------



## ljokerl

tomscy2000 said:


> Joker, I was hoping you could comment on the aesthetic quality (amount of bubbles, overall transparency, lacquer polish/smoothness, etc.) of the silicone CIEMs you possess. AFAIK, you have the Noble 4S, CustomArt Music One, Spiral Ears SE 3-Way Reference, and Sensaphonics 3MAX?


 
  
 Sure, in short, Noble >= Custom Art >> Spiral Ear > Sensaphonics
  
 The Noble has the advantage of using acrylic faceplaces so you can't see the silicone artifacts so well, plus you get artwork and all that. Even ignoring that the quality is still excellent - not as clear as acrylic, obviously, but pretty transparent and with no visible bubbles or other imperfections. Finish is fairly smooth, not grooved or rough. The Custom Art is much the same except no acrylic faceplates. The clear parts of my Music One are actually a little "clearer" than the Noble but it's not a big difference.
  
 The SE 3-way Reference has some roughness to the finish and feels a little more "rubbery" at first. This goes away over time. No bubbles that I can see but it's a dark shell. The Sensaphonics have some bubbles, etc, and aren't as transparent as the Music One or Noble.
  
  


elcomesoft said:


> As my Mi-1's had a custom filter, different from the standard Mi-1's, I am not sure how to categorise them either
> 
> Joker, as always, you go above and beyond what I expected to deliver experience, details and advice to provide assistance to people who pop in here. I'll spend a little while looking at the options you've put forward, check and compare prices (right now, the B2's are just over £60 which is at the $95 USD mark, seems tempting).
> 
> ...


 
  
 That's funny. Glad to help! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


samurai boy said:


> Joker,
> 
> I posted a thread in the Help section, but I haven't gotten much info, but here's what I wanted from my new IEM:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 The FX500 definitely has enhanced bass so I do think the Fidelio is more along the lines of what you're looking for even just for sound. I can't think of a better option than the S1 - the alternatives all have more bass and some of them have other issues (e.g. microphonics on the Onkyo IE-HF300). The S1 has a bit of microphonics but definitely isn't bad at all. Isolation is average-ish - it actually isolates better than the FX500 but not too well.


----------



## Roasty

I've previously owned the Etymotic ER4P and ran it with a P-S converter, RSA Hornet, and lineout dock. This was years ago, and i've since sold off all of my gear.
  
 If i'm looking to get back in the game, which (more recent) IEM in the Ety ER4 price range is a comparable buy in terms of sound quality? or should i just get another pair of the ER4P?


----------



## suman134

i think you can live with dba-2 / brainwavz b2 , these have more treble energy but are nearly as clear as er-4p , and are cheaper too .


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> Sure, in short, Noble >= Custom Art >> Spiral Ear > Sensaphonics
> The Noble has the advantage of using acrylic faceplaces so you can't see the silicone artifacts so well, plus you get artwork and all that. Even ignoring that the quality is still excellent - not as clear as acrylic, obviously, but pretty transparent and with no visible bubbles or other imperfections. Finish is fairly smooth, not grooved or rough. The Custom Art is much the same except no acrylic faceplates. The clear parts of my Music One are actually a little "clearer" than the Noble but it's not a big difference.
> 
> The SE 3-way Reference has some roughness to the finish and feels a little more "rubbery" at first. This goes away over time. No bubbles that I can see but it's a dark shell. The Sensaphonics have some bubbles, etc, and aren't as transparent as the Music One or Noble.


 
  
 Thanks!


----------



## Benik3

ljokerl said:


> The V1 doesn't have enough bass for you and I can't really recommend the Xcape IE because of the build quality. You have to be very gentle with it.


 
  
 Thanks for the help, really appreciate it! 
  
 For now I'm decided for the MOE SS01...


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Hey joker,

I see that you're becoming an expert in CIEMs as well 

I got my first CIEMs a few days ago, the Mingo CM3 (single-BA acrylics OEMed by Unique Melody)

The issue: I'm getting a non-so-consistent seal. I get excellent seal with my head tilted down, less so with my head level, and no seal when lying down on a pillow.

Looking at the CIEMs they appear to be a 1st-bend "comfort fit". Reviewing the earmold instructions from Unique Melody (which I wasn't aware of at the time), it appears my molds were taken the right way (it amounts to "bite block" right?)

Not sure how to proceed. average_joe advised me to get a remold with a second bend fit. I am looking into doing that but two worries I have are:
1. Does a second-bend fit really improve fit across different postures, or does it just "improve" fit by making movements that would otherwise break the seal impossible? I am imagining the CIEMs "remolding" my ear canals when I try to lie down :rolleyes:
2. Wondering about durability of the CIEMs. I'm careful to store the CIEMs only in the hard case they come in whenever I'm not using them. It seems a pair of CIEMs with longer canals and a narrow neck would be even more fragile, especially given how narrow my 2nd bend appears to be (judging by the end opening of my 1st bend CIEMs). I'm actually asking Mingo to ask Unique Melody if a 2nd bend molded pair of CIEMs is actually possible for me?

Hope average_joe doesn't mind me asking for a second opinion


----------



## mannkind246

Hello ljokerl,
 I'm  looking for a good IEM that has sound signature close to Beyerdynamic DT880 (semi-opened big cans).
 Someone suggests the Fischer Audio DBA-02 MKII. Do you have any comment?
 What are the other IEMs can you suggest to me?


----------



## garcsa

Hi there, 
 Anybody heard , about fake Yamaha EPH-100?


----------



## modulor

garcsa said:


> Hi there,
> Anybody heard , about fake Yamaha EPH-100?


 
 I couldn't find anything specific but I suspect I may have one (purchased used) - there's something odd about it with the finish and strain reliefs so I'm curious if that is the case.  I just ordered another from a different seller with full retail packaging and will compare the two and post impressions here.


----------



## garcsa

modulor said:


> I couldn't find anything specific but I suspect I may have one (purchased used) - there's something odd about it with the finish and strain reliefs so I'm curious if that is the case.  I just ordered another from a different seller with full retail packaging and will compare the two and post impressions here.


 
 Thanks, saw them on Aliexpress for some 40 bucks...
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Christmas-Gift-Genuine-Original-EPH-100-Premuim-Aluminium-Noise-Cancelling-Deep-Bass-In-Ear-Stereo-Earphones/1536158860.html
 Feedback: 0...


----------



## Cotnijoe

Ive never dealt with them before but I've heard a few bad things about them. Might want to be cautious going in?


----------



## neo5468

I want to make an update about my SS flux that I bought few days ago. Although, they sound good, I discovered something. Since I wanted to test how better my flux are against my standard, white, original earbuds that are shipped with samsung galaxy s3, I found out that both of them sound equal. Now how is this possible?
  
 I just listened to my mp3's on my s3 for about 2 hours, and was changing from ss flux to original samsung earbuds and for the love of god I could not make a difference between them. If I was not looking I would not have guessed to which of them I was listening to. That is insane, since ss flux has cost me 56€ and this samsung earbuds came with the phone. I always though that OEM earbudds are crap but since I listened to them for my first time today, I almost didnt belive to the sound I was hearing. They sounded exactly the same as SS flux (with less noise isolation).
  
 Now, is something wrong with me, or is this normal? I was listening through original music player on my s3 and equalizor was set on "Rock".
  
 Should I try .flac songs and see if there is any difference? Which songs are you recommending to be complex to see if there is any difference between those 2 in more complex songs. Because if I wont find any difference I will just return SS flux and use my original samsung earbuds that came with the fun. This is outrageous !!!


----------



## Za Warudo

I bought the Meelectonrics A161P during their CM sale due to your review.  Listening to them right now and this is so clear and detailed, easily the best IEM I've ever listened to.  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

roasty said:


> I've previously owned the Etymotic ER4P and ran it with a P-S converter, RSA Hornet, and lineout dock. This was years ago, and i've since sold off all of my gear.
> 
> If i'm looking to get back in the game, which (more recent) IEM in the Ety ER4 price range is a comparable buy in terms of sound quality? or should i just get another pair of the ER4P?


 
  
 I would get another pair of the Etys unless you wanted to save some $$ by going with a different set. In the same price range and for the same sound, go for the ER4.
  
  


joe bloggs said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> I see that you're becoming an expert in CIEMs as well
> 
> ...


 
  
 Completely unintended, I assure you. I love universals. 
  
 I have quite a few shallowly-fitted CIEMs and even between those the seal differs. Some are a tighter than others and will stay sealed no matter what I do. Others - not so much. Canals that extend to the second bend help, but not as much as having a tight fit in the first place. One of my most secure customs is my 1964-V3, which has a fairly average canal length. 
  
 When taking impressions for acrylic customs it's important to keep very still in my experience - no chewing, talking, smiling, etc, and to keep your head level to ensure that your ear canals will be in the same resting state as when you're listening. Other that the standard instructions are bite block + second bend impressions (even if you're getting shallow customs it helps for the technician to know where the ear canal is "headed", so to speak). 
  
 Even with proper impressions there's a bit of a luck factor. I'm at about 85% success rate in terms of getting a perfect fit with identical impressions. Always a small chance of failure. 
  
 As for durability, I'm ashamed to say I've not been kind to many of my CIEMs and haven't had any problems. Just be careful not to yank the cable in a way that breaks the pins off inside the earphones. Other than that, I doubt there's any danger no matter how your ears are shaped. I might have thicker canals than you but I'm quite sure my musician's fit sets wouldn't be damaged from a drop onto concrete.
  


mannkind246 said:


> Hello ljokerl,
> I'm  looking for a good IEM that has sound signature close to Beyerdynamic DT880 (semi-opened big cans).
> Someone suggests the Fischer Audio DBA-02 MKII. Do you have any comment?
> What are the other IEMs can you suggest to me?


 
  
 It's been a while since I heard the Beyers but from what I remember they were pretty neutral so the DBA-02 would be a pretty good match. You can also go for the less expensive but similarly-voiced VSonic VC1000.
  
 Keep in mind that even with an IEM that closely matches its frequency response, the DT880 will still have an advantage in bass "feel" - rumble and impact and all that - because it can move lots more air. To get that from an IEM you would need a significantly bassier one than the DBA-02, like a Philips Fidelio S2 or GR07. Anyway, just keep in mind that you'll get more tactile bass from a DT880 compared to an "accurate" IEM.
  


garcsa said:


> Hi there,
> Anybody heard , about fake Yamaha EPH-100?


 
  
 Ooof. Never heard of EPH-100 fakes but I would have trouble trusting that $40 one.
  


neo5468 said:


> I want to make an update about my SS flux that I bought few days ago. Although, they sound good, I discovered something. Since I wanted to test how better my flux are against my standard, white, original earbuds that are shipped with samsung galaxy s3, I found out that both of them sound equal. Now how is this possible?
> 
> I just listened to my mp3's on my s3 for about 2 hours, and was changing from ss flux to original samsung earbuds and for the love of god I could not make a difference between them. If I was not looking I would not have guessed to which of them I was listening to. That is insane, since ss flux has cost me 56€ and this samsung earbuds came with the phone. I always though that OEM earbudds are crap but since I listened to them for my first time today, I almost didnt belive to the sound I was hearing. They sounded exactly the same as SS flux (with less noise isolation).
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, never heard the Samsung stock buds. LG didn't even bother including any earphones with my new Nexus. Couple of possibilities to consider.
  
 1. The Samsung buds really are that good
 2. Whatever mp3 compression, DSP, and equalizer settings you are using are taking away from the overall sound quality and closing the gap between different earphones
 3. Comparing two sets of earphones right away may not yield the best results. Take some time to get used to the Flux, use it exclusively for a week or so, and then switch back to see if you still can't tell a difference. It's likely the difference will be greater then, though again I haven't heard any Samsung stock earphones
 4. Sensitivity to sound quality does vary a lot between listeners and with experience. It happens. For some people it takes time and training to pick up on audio subtleties. I know it did for me. 
  
  


za warudo said:


> I bought the Meelectonrics A161P during their CM sale due to your review.  Listening to them right now and this is so clear and detailed, easily the best IEM I've ever listened to.  Thanks!


 
  
 That was an excellent price. Glad you like them


----------



## mannkind246

ljokerl said:


> It's been a while since I heard the Beyers but from what I remember they were pretty neutral so the DBA-02 would be a pretty good match. You can also go for the less expensive but similarly-voiced VSonic VC1000.
> 
> Keep in mind that even with an IEM that closely matches its frequency response, the DT880 will still have an advantage in bass "feel" - rumble and impact and all that - because it can move lots more air. To get that from an IEM you would need a significantly bassier one than the DBA-02, like a Philips Fidelio S2 or GR07. Anyway, just keep in mind that you'll get more tactile bass from a DT880 compared to an "accurate" IEM.


 
 So DBA-02 is the only option? Anything better than DBA-02?


----------



## james444

neo5468 said:


> I want to make an update about my SS flux that I bought few days ago. Although, they sound good, I discovered something. Since I wanted to test how better my flux are against my standard, white, original earbuds that are shipped with samsung galaxy s3, I found out that both of them sound equal. Now how is this possible?
> 
> I just listened to my mp3's on my s3 for about 2 hours, and was changing from ss flux to original samsung earbuds and for the love of god I could not make a difference between them. If I was not looking I would not have guessed to which of them I was listening to. That is insane, since ss flux has cost me 56€ and this samsung earbuds came with the phone. I always though that OEM earbudds are crap but since I listened to them for my first time today, I almost didnt belive to the sound I was hearing. They sounded exactly the same as SS flux (with less noise isolation).
> 
> ...


 


ljokerl said:


> Sorry, never heard the Samsung stock buds. LG didn't even bother including any earphones with my new Nexus. Couple of possibilities to consider.
> 
> 1. The Samsung buds really are that good
> 2. Whatever mp3 compression, DSP, and equalizer settings you are using are taking away from the overall sound quality and closing the gap between different earphones
> ...


 
  
 5. There's absolutely nothing wrong with you. To the contrary, yours are symptoms of a sanity that most of us here can't even faintly remember. Forget about trying flac and looking for more complex songs to help you spot minute differences in sound quality. That will only make you listen more to gear and less to music. Just return those SS Flux and enjoy what you have. There's still time for you to run and never look back. Good luck!


----------



## quartertone

garcsa said:


> modulor said:
> 
> 
> > I couldn't find anything specific but I suspect I may have one (purchased used) - there's something odd about it with the finish and strain reliefs so I'm curious if that is the case.  I just ordered another from a different seller with full retail packaging and will compare the two and post impressions here.
> ...


 
 The name Yamaha doesn't appear anywhere on that page...
  
Style:​ In-Ear
Brand Name:​ OEM


----------



## mangatmodi

@ljokerl @others

 Guys I have been UE-600 from four months, however I planning to move onto my next headphone. I've shortlisted Hifiman 400 Waterline and Rock-it 50 based on your reviews here. I have following questions in my mind, could you please help me deciding.

 1. I like clear highs and mid in UE600. They were perfect to my taste. Bass was tight but slightly less deep than I would prefer. Since Hifiman 400  has dynamic driver, I'm little worried about moving from BA driver. What difference in sound should I expect when moving from UE600 to Hifiman 400?

 2. Rockit 50 seems overall good in review but there is 20$ difference in Hifiman 400 and Rockit 50. Is that leap worth it? Second what difference I will feel coming from UE600.

 3. I generally listen classical rock any other recommendations for me apart from these headphones? I live in India and I have found only Hifiman and Rockit which deliver headphones in India.

 At last, I would like to thank you for all your effort and time you put here to help everyone. You are a legend sir.

 Regards,
 Mangat Rai Modi


----------



## garcsa

quartertone said:


> The name Yamaha doesn't appear anywhere on that page...
> 
> Style:​ In-Ear
> Brand Name:​ OEM


 
 Hi quartertone, you're right, thanks!


----------



## Astrud

Hi joker,
 Short comparison please between Vsonic VC1000 vs. Custom Art Music One - is it upgrade from VC1000 or "just" something else?. Thanks.
 Own the VC1000 and I really like its sound signature. Never had CIEM.


----------



## Zelda

benik3 said:


> Thanks for the help, really appreciate it!
> 
> For now I'm decided for the *MOE SS01*...


 
 good choice! great IEM


----------



## ljokerl

mannkind246 said:


> So DBA-02 is the only option? Anything better than DBA-02?


 
  
 There's lots of other options but I'm not familiar enough with the DT880 to say any of them are better for you with confidence. The DBA-02 is a nice earphone with a fast and clear sound and plenty of treble energy. However, if you think the bass slam of the 880 is something you'll miss dearly you might be better off with a GR07 or Philips S2. 
  


james444 said:


> 5. There's absolutely nothing wrong with you. To the contrary, yours are symptoms of a sanity that most of us here can't even faintly remember. Forget about trying flac and looking for more complex songs to help you spot minute differences in sound quality. That will only make you listen more to gear and less to music. Just return those SS Flux and enjoy what you have. There's still time for you to run and never look back. Good luck!


 
  
 Right you are, I guess I'm too far gone 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


mangatmodi said:


> @ljokerl @others
> 
> Guys I have been UE-600 from four months, however I planning to move onto my next headphone. I've shortlisted Hifiman 400 Waterline and Rock-it 50 based on your reviews here. I have following questions in my mind, could you please help me deciding.
> 
> ...


 
  
I wouldn't worry about moving from BA to dynamic in this case. I actually preferred the bass of the RE-400 - it is just as controlled as that of the UE600 but has a more natural presence with better note weight. Midrange clarity is pretty similar but the RE-400 is more balanced overall. The presentation of the UE600 also lacks some depth in comparison. Overall I think the RE-400 is a good reasonably-priced option coming from the UE600.
  
 The Rock-It R-50 is brighter than both, especially in the stock configuration. Not sure it's what you're after but it's less of a direct UE600 upgrade than the RE-400.
  
  


astrud said:


> Hi joker,
> Short comparison please between Vsonic VC1000 vs. Custom Art Music One - is it upgrade from VC1000 or "just" something else?. Thanks.
> Own the VC1000 and I really like its sound signature. Never had CIEM.


 
  
 More of an alternative.
  
Overall, the VC1000 sounds leaner, a bit clearer as a result, and its bass is a little tighter. The Music One has more bass weight and warmer tone but both are pretty close to neutral. Note presentation is a little thicker and more natural with the Music One and it has more emphasis on its midrange and less on treble. It also sounds a little more forgiving as a result.


----------



## godlyatheist

So I finally received my Audioquest Dragonfly. Upon the first listen there really isn't much of a difference compared to my Musiland Monitor 01 US. Best I can tell is the bass is punchier(attack is more prominent) and the overall clarity is pretty much the same. My questions is this: would a JH13 benefit from the low output impedance of the Dragonfly? Musiland lists the 01 with 100 ohm impedance (kinda high?). The Dragonfly has that annoying problem of pops when the laptop processor changes speed, a lot more often than the Musiland.


----------



## Astrud

Seems like nice alternative. I'll call the audiologist today for appointment. Thanks


----------



## mannkind246

ljokerl said:


> There's lots of other options but I'm not familiar enough with the DT880 to say any of them are better for you with confidence. The DBA-02 is a nice earphone with a fast and clear sound and plenty of treble energy. However, if you think the bass slam of the 880 is something you'll miss dearly you might be better off with a GR07 or Philips S2.


 
  
 Among your recommendation for below IEMs:
  
 1) Philips S2BK/28 Fidelio ($108)
 2) VSonic GR07 ($179)
 3) VSonic GR07 MK2 ($169)
 4) Fischer Audio DBA-02 MKII ($196)
 5) Fischer Audio DBA-02 ($???)
  
 Which IEM has the best in term of the most detail and mid range?
 In another word, I can hear many details which I cound not possible hear with ordinary IEM?
  
 In the case of VSonic & Ficher Audio, is there any different in sound for those IEM with and without "MK2" or "MK II"?


----------



## ljokerl

godlyatheist said:


> So I finally received my Audioquest Dragonfly. Upon the first listen there really isn't much of a difference compared to my Musiland Monitor 01 US. Best I can tell is the bass is punchier(attack is more prominent) and the overall clarity is pretty much the same. My questions is this: would a JH13 benefit from the low output impedance of the Dragonfly? Musiland lists the 01 with 100 ohm impedance (kinda high?). The Dragonfly has that annoying problem of pops when the laptop processor changes speed, a lot more often than the Musiland.


 
  
 100 ohm output impedance? Are you sure? That's poor design by any measure, but especially unsuitable for Balanced Armature IEMs. 
  


astrud said:


> Seems like nice alternative. I'll call the audiologist today for appointment. Thanks


 
  
 Enjoy! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


mannkind246 said:


> Among your recommendation for below IEMs:
> 
> 1) Philips S2BK/28 Fidelio ($108)
> 2) VSonic GR07 ($179)
> ...


 
  
 For the VSonic GR07 you want the mkII - it's a little less sibilant from what I understand (and based on my experience with the GR07BE).
  
 For Fischer it depends on the price difference (as far as I know they don't make the mkI anymore but you can buy it as the Brainwavz B2). I tend to favor the DBA-02 mkII for its sturdier build and more compact/comfortable form factor.
  
 Anyway, the GR07 and S2 put the bass a bit ahead of the mids so if you want to prioritize midrange go for one of the DBA-02 variations. The Brainwavz B2 might be significantly cheaper than the Fischer version.


----------



## MoonYeol

100 Ohms seems right. I suppose it's mainly designed to be used as a DAC feeding an amp. So the Dragonfly would be better for your purpose and also smaller which (at least to me) could be the final argument to throw it into the cpu case.


----------



## suman134

can you do me a fidelio s1 and re-400 shoot out ? which one is better when it comes to sq ?


----------



## mannkind246

ljokerl said:


> 100 ohm output impedance? Are you sure? That's poor design by any measure, but especially unsuitable for Balanced Armature IEMs.
> 
> 
> Enjoy!
> ...



Among these IEMs, which one has less fatigue to the ear and also the most comfortable to wear for a long time like 2 to 3 hrs nonstop?


----------



## modulor

mannkind246 said:


> Among these IEMs, which one has less fatigue to the ear and also the most comfortable to wear for a long time like 2 to 3 hrs nonstop?


 
 Depends on a few factors like the source and/or files you'll be using, type of music and if you're sensitive to treble.  I've not heard the B2/DBA-02 but I understand most TWFK-based IEMs tend to be on the brighter side.  I can speak on the GR07 MKII though, and it does have a tendency to be harsh/sibilant depending on what you're listening to primarily.  I know the GR07 is quite comfortable and I can have them in for 3+ hours with no issues, and I imagine similar can be said with the B2/DBA-02 as well, but again it could be dependent on what sleeves work best for you.  The GR07 will have more bass and thus be warmer comparatively, but the B2/DBA-02 reportedly has the upper hand in clarity and resolution with more forward midrange comparatively...but either will be quite neutral in general in the grand scheme.
  
 Perhaps you may also want to consider the HiFiMan RE-400?  It may not have quite the prominence, resolution or be as analytical in the treble but it is still well extended and would likely be less fatiguing (certainly when compared to the GR07 MKII in some cases).  The midrange is very pleasing, present and detailed and the bass is also well extended and gives them a sense of warmth without overshadowing anything...very coherent  sound if you ask me.  The midrange is special on these for sure, and they remain very transparent...probably not on the level of the B2/DBA-02 but still really impressive.  If you are concerned with listening fatigue, this would be my first recommendation.  Otherwise, the GR07 is probably more comfortable physically.


----------



## modulor

garcsa said:


> Hi there,
> Anybody heard , about fake Yamaha EPH-100?


 
  
 Quote:


modulor said:


> I couldn't find anything specific but I suspect I may have one (purchased used) - there's something odd about it with the finish and strain reliefs so I'm curious if that is the case.  I just ordered another from a different seller with full retail packaging and will compare the two and post impressions here.


 
  
 To follow up on this as I've received my new pair, I think what I originally got was indeed a fake.  Even at a short distance they look almost identical, but I've got an eye for detail and there was just something off even comparing them to pictures others have taken.  I don't know if there was a change in how the EPH-100 is made but I couldn't find anything on that.  I've got a small comparison so others can see what I mean (and I'll post this to the EPH-100 thread as well):
  
http://imgur.com/a/7fsiE
  
 I placed a red F next to the suspected fake pair - here are a few points in the visual comparison:
  
 - In the first picture, the nozzles look different but I think that is just a fingerpint 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 - size wise they are pretty identical.
 - The aluminum shell appears to be CNC routed as per usual but the grooves are more apparent.  The real one seems more finished...if you look very closely you can see that it has very fine grooves from when it was made but it appears to have been polished smooth afterwards.
 - The strain reliefs are a bit smaller/softer on the alleged fake, and the cable has a slightly smaller diameter and is a bit softer with the real one being stiffer.  TRS plugs and y-split look identical.
 - The printing is a bit lighter, slightly off center in the case of the logo.
 - The driver mesh seems to be woven and more transparent so you can see the reflection of the driver beneath on the fake.  The real one which appears to be a single perforated cover with the driver not visible beneath, so most likely the drivers are completely different.  The driver mesh is also a bit off/crooked when viewed at an angle.
  
 I don't have any in depth listening results at this point, but after trying the real pair for about 15 minutes it seems apparent this is what they should sound like.  I'll try to do an A-B comparison later today but I'm sending the other pair back tomorrow.  It's a shame, but my advice is to always buy from a reputable dealer or head-fier, especially if you get anything used.


----------



## peter123

modulor said:


> To follow up on this as I've received my new pair, I think what I originally got was indeed a fake.  Even at a short distance they look almost identical, but I've got an eye for detail and there was just something off even comparing them to pictures others have taken.  I don't know if there was a change in how the EPH-100 is made but I couldn't find anything on that.  I've got a small comparison so others can see what I mean (and I'll post this to the EPH-100 thread as well):




Interesting reading (and pictures), thanks for sharing.


----------



## bigjim

Hi Folks, 
  
 Just a quick question. I am in the UK and am getting my new portable rig sorted for Christmas.
  
 It should be something like this Note 3 -> USBOTG -> Microstreamer (or alternative) -> IEM's. However I am struggling what IEM's to go for. I am in the UK and we seem to have a few good deals available at the moment. I have Sony MH1C at the moment, which I like, but too warm for my liking. My home set-up is Grado SR-80i's (vent modded) and I love the forward sound, so I would ideally like something similar to the Grado sound, I have read that the Microstreamer can be a bit bright though. These are my options at the moment:
  
 Super.fi 5vi @ £32 
 RE-400's @ £78
 Brainwavz B2 @ £86
 Rock IT R50 @ £75
 Sony XBA-H1 @ £78
  
 I see Joker gave the Super.fi 5's an 8.6 for sound quality, so going by that £32 seems to be a bargain. But do you think that the B2's or R50's are going to be a lot better (baring in mind the price difference)?
 I can also get the Sony XBA-3ip's for £104, which seems a good deal for triple armature, that's really at the top of my budget though, as the Microstreamer is £170. Any help making a choice would be fantastic. I listen to a broad range of music, from rock to reggae. 
  
 Thanks in advance folks, and happy Christmas, 
  
 Jim


----------



## MoonYeol

I think getting a Microstreamer for £170 and pairing with £50-100 iems will most likely not give you the best sound quality you can for your money. I originally bought my S4 just because of the ability to use USB-sound out to a DAC. I just found it to be too much of a hassle. And my Apex Glacier doesn't work with my S4. Anyway. I would go ahead and get some iems that suit you first. Put in as much as you feel is appropriate. Pairing a pair of £32 S.fi 5vi with a £170 microstreamer will most likely sound worse than buying a pair of UE900, W4 or similar.

The R-50 with comply tips (Ts) are awesome btw.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> can you do me a fidelio s1 and re-400 shoot out ? which one is better when it comes to sq ?


 
  
 The RE-400 is more efficient, warmer in tone, and boasts more intimate mids and a more in-the-head presentation overall. 
  
 The Fidelio S1 has more subbass & bass in general but is also less warm overall and a touch clearer as a result. The mids on the S1 are less forward. Tonally, it is somewhat brighter and has more upper midrange presence. It is also more spacious overall and has a wider soundstage but gives up the intimate feel and more well-rounded presentation (in terms of depth and width being more even) of the RE-400.
  
 They're about on-par for me, just different signatures. 
  


mannkind246 said:


> Among these IEMs, which one has less fatigue to the ear and also the most comfortable to wear for a long time like 2 to 3 hrs nonstop?


 
  
 Sound-wise for me the S2 is the least fatiguing, followed closely by the GR07 and DBA-02. But like modulor said if listening fatigue is a big consideration, a less bright earphone like the RE-400 might be worth looking at.
  
 I find the DBA-02 mkII the most comfortable, then the GR07, then the DBA-02 mkI, and then the S2, partly because I prefer over-the-ear to cable-down.
  
  


peter123 said:


> Interesting reading (and pictures), thanks for sharing.


 
  
  
 +1, thanks for sharing!
  


bigjim said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> Just a quick question. I am in the UK and am getting my new portable rig sorted for Christmas.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I agree with MoonYeol, it's tough to justify spending way more on a source than earphones in this tier. However, I don't know how bad the headphone out of your Galaxy is. I can't use my HTC phone with many IEMs because of its crappy audio hardware.
  
 Anyway, to get closer to the Grado sound you probably will want a brighter set than the SF5 and RE-400. The B2 and R-50 (the latter with a tip change and maybe impedance adapter) would be good. The Ety HF5 would be good too if it's available at a reasonable price. The Fidelio S1 is good but has quite a bit more bass than these other options. Not sure how the H1 sounds but if the EX600 is any indication it could also be quite excellent.


----------



## suman134

can the brainwavz b2 be driver our of cowon j3 ? or does it need an amp .


----------



## FARfromHOME

Planning to upgrade from Vsonic R07 MKII.
 What do you recommend? 
 I'm not a basshead but dont like total lack of it, like brainwavz b2 mentioned above. Previous page.
 For that reason I prefer dynamic.
 If there is a balanced, better in all aspects? Maybe?
 Budget around £300 / $500
 Thank you


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Just got my Brainwavz B2's... 3 days from China to the UK, £61... cannot complain at all. They were at least 50% cheaper than everything else recommended around my query. They have been lauded as pretty darn good IEM's so why not save a bit of my budget and spend it on my family? 

They are quite fun but I do get that brightness on the higher end of the spectrum and I'm picking up on sibilance on . They're certainly enjoyable and I'll be tweaking and playing around with EQ settings to get something lovely.

Is it possible to slightly tame the treble/brightness without trashing my love of the highs? I'm thinking of simple things like -dB on the EQ or maybe different tips. Not really talking of anything drastic as I've only had these in my ears for less than 2 hours now and I'm just thinking ahead


----------



## MoonYeol

Try comply tips if you like foamies. I don't know about B2 but R-50 does improve in the sibilance department if you add some impedance.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> can the brainwavz b2 be driver our of cowon j3 ? or does it need an amp .


 
  
 It's fine out of the J3. Perhaps not ideal as it pairs well with a warmer player, but it's more than enough to see the B2's potential. 
  


farfromhome said:


> Planning to upgrade from Vsonic R07 MKII.
> What do you recommend?
> I'm not a basshead but dont like total lack of it, like brainwavz b2 mentioned above. Previous page.
> For that reason I prefer dynamic.
> ...


 
  
 I'm not aware of anything that's better all around than the GR07. You'll always be giving something up. For example the Phonak PFE232 - it has a similar balance to the GR07 (a little more bass perhaps) and is more resolving overall with better soundstage depth, layering, and imaging. However, it has more recessed mids than the GR07, there's no improvement in clarity, and it's at least twice as expensive as the GR07.
  


elcomesoft said:


> Just got my Brainwavz B2's... 3 days from China to the UK, £61... cannot complain at all. They were at least 50% cheaper than everything else recommended around my query. They have been lauded as pretty darn good IEM's so why not save a bit of my budget and spend it on my family?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Playing around with different tips is definitely a good idea. Not sure what the B2 comes with these days but there should be some Complys included. I also got good results with thick/narrow opening single-flange tips (from an older Shure set) as well as triple-flanges if they are comfortable for you.
  
 Beyond that there's always the EQ - the 5 - 8k range usually contains most of the sibilance.


----------



## godlyatheist

ljokerl said:


> I'm not aware of anything that's better all around than the GR07. You'll always be giving something up. For example the Phonak PFE232 - it has a similar balance to the GR07 (a little more bass perhaps) and is more resolving overall with better soundstage depth, layering, and imaging. However, it has more recessed mids than the GR07, there's no improvement in clarity, and it's at least twice as expensive as the GR07.


 
 When I had the Westone 4R for 3 weeks I thought they were technically superior to the GR07 all around, just the fit wasn't for me. That was the clearance sale @ $299 though.


----------



## MDFMK

How does the GR07 Bass Edition compare to the JVC FXT-90?


----------



## ElcomeSoft

ljokerl said:


> Playing around with different tips is definitely a good idea. Not sure what the B2 comes with these days but there should be some Complys included. I also got good results with thick/narrow opening single-flange tips (from an older Shure set) as well as triple-flanges if they are comfortable for you.
> 
> Beyond that there's always the EQ - the 5 - 8k range usually contains most of the sibilance.


 
  
 They come with a few sets of standard silicone tips and a pair of Comply foamies. With the savings I made I'd already ordered some Westone True Tips as I find the foam style tips to be really comfortable for longer listening. I have my own collection of assorted tips which I'll have a go with over the course of the weekend/next week. I'll certainly be trying out the Comply's and triple-flanges first.
  
 As for the EQ, excellent. I'll drop a couple of dB on that range and see how it goes.
  
 Joker... you're the best


----------



## suman134

thanks for the reply , im thinking of going with ie800 or fidelio s1 or rha 750 , i want some bass , nice mids , and sparky highs , which one should i go for ?


----------



## cibibikeru

I thank Joker and the rest for helping people choose an earphone, I finally found something I fell inlove with, Sony MH1C, low cost, butter smooth, nothing too much or too less, almost perfect to my ears.
 MH1 for me sounds almost perfect, it has an incredible smoothness that no matter how loud you listen there is nothing in particular to disturb you except for the volume itself.
  
 The thing is I HATE the heavy CABLE, mic and asimetrical design, I want something with small housings and normal cable, no mic, that can be worn both straight or over the ear, is there something similar to MH1C that fits my description?


----------



## modulor

cibibikeru said:


> I thank Joker and the rest for helping people choose an earphone, I finally found something I fell inlove with, Sony MH1C, low cost, butter smooth, nothing too much or too less, almost perfect to my ears.
> MH1 for me sounds almost perfect, it has an incredible smoothness that no matter how loud you listen there is nothing in particular to disturb you except for the volume itself.
> 
> The thing is I HATE the heavy CABLE, mic and asimetrical design, I want something with small housings and normal cable, no mic, that can be worn both straight or over the ear, is there something similar to MH1C that fits my description?


 
  
 I'd suggest the SteelSeries Flux, which is an excellent value at around $50 but sometimes it has gone on sale for as low as $25.  I too hated the cable of the MH1 to the point of not using it but the Flux has a thinner, more flexible flat cable that still has a mic/remote and works with any android/iphone as well.  Comparatively it has a little less warmth and less of a bass tilt, but the mids are a bit more forward and it is definitely more transparent side by side.  Treble is never harsh like the MH1 and is a bit more extended it seems.  It would sound great out of your Clip+ too


----------



## ljokerl

mdfmk said:


> How does the GR07 Bass Edition compare to the JVC FXT-90?


 
  
 The FXT90 has a bit more mid-bass while the GR07 is more level in the bass region and sounds a bit tighter. The FXT90 is more forward overall. The GR07 is less warm, brighter, a bit clearer, and has a more out-of-the-head presentation.
  


elcomesoft said:


> They come with a few sets of standard silicone tips and a pair of Comply foamies. With the savings I made I'd already ordered some Westone True Tips as I find the foam style tips to be really comfortable for longer listening. I have my own collection of assorted tips which I'll have a go with over the course of the weekend/next week. I'll certainly be trying out the Comply's and triple-flanges first.
> 
> As for the EQ, excellent. I'll drop a couple of dB on that range and see how it goes.
> 
> Joker... you're the best


 
  
 Good luck! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


suman134 said:


> thanks for the reply , im thinking of going with ie800 or fidelio s1 or rha 750 , i want some bass , nice mids , and sparky highs , which one should i go for ?


 
  
 The TDK IE800? Never tried it. The RHA is more bass-oriented than the S1 and has less presence in the upper midrange and a less bright tone. The upper mids/treble of the S1 are more like the GR07 (good energy, not very forgiving) than the MA750. Anyway, both good earphones, just very different flavors.
  


cibibikeru said:


> I thank Joker and the rest for helping people choose an earphone, I finally found something I fell inlove with, Sony MH1C, low cost, butter smooth, nothing too much or too less, almost perfect to my ears.
> MH1 for me sounds almost perfect, it has an incredible smoothness that no matter how loud you listen there is nothing in particular to disturb you except for the volume itself.
> 
> The thing is I HATE the heavy CABLE, mic and asimetrical design, I want something with small housings and normal cable, no mic, that can be worn both straight or over the ear, is there something similar to MH1C that fits my description?


 
  
 In that price range the Flux is probably your best bet. Personally I don't think it's notably smoother than the MH1C but it definitely has a bit less bass and a more accurate overall sound. The cable on the Flux isn't great but it's symmetric and can be used over-the-ear. It does have a mic though. Staying in the price range there's just not much that can compete with the MH1C, especially considering you like the signature. Moving up into the $100-$150 range there's more options but nothing I can think of that ticks ALL the boxes per your requirements. 
  
 Someone should really start recabling MH1Cs for a fee... it's easy to find a $10-20 donor IEM with vastly better cables.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> The TDK IE800? Never tried it. The RHA is more bass-oriented than the S1 and has less presence in the upper midrange and a less bright tone. The upper mids/treble of the S1 are more like the GR07 (good energy, not very forgiving) than the MA750. Anyway, both good earphones, just very different flavors.


 
  
    big help man ,  but have you heard klipsch imave x7i ?


----------



## ljokerl

Added Moe Audio MOE-SS01 - a dual dynamic driver IEM closely related to the pricier JVC HA-FXT90.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C60) Moe Audio MOE-SS01*
> 
> 
> Reviewed December 2013
> ...


 
  
 The ranking table has been updated here.


----------



## yugopotamia

hi joker, is there any chance for you to review entry-level ciems such as um mage, jh5, jh7, um aero, rooth, cosmic ears?


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> big help man ,  but have you heard klipsch imave x7i ?


 
 I will step away from it......


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> I will step away from it......


 
  
      you wanna say they are not good ? dis you had an encounter with these ? whats you say about these ?


----------



## mannkind246

Just for sharing.

 I found below IEMs are *not so good* when pairing with portable amp. like Tralucent TI:
  
 1) Shure SE215 ($99): Less detail and poor sound stage comparing to DT880
  
 2) Hisound Audio PAA-1 ($20) Too much texture (rough sounding) and too bright (ear fatigue) comparing to DT800


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> you wanna say they are not good ? dis you had an encounter with these ? whats you say about these ?


 
   
Well, there are lot better model IEMs available with the same price tag of X7i. The other ones you requested Joker are reasonably priced for their build and SQ,accessories etc.

  
 I had S4 and S5i Rugged and they are good but not that good for that price.Fit wise Klipsch's oval tips and nozzle(comfort insertion) are stellar. If it's on sale for $45-$55 I'll take a bite.


----------



## mannkind246

ljokerl said:


> Sound-wise for me the S2 is the least fatiguing, followed closely by the GR07 and DBA-02. But like modulor said if listening fatigue is a big consideration, a less bright earphone like the RE-400 might be worth looking at.
> 
> I find the DBA-02 mkII the most comfortable, then the GR07, then the DBA-02 mkI, and then the S2, partly because I prefer over-the-ear to cable-down.


 
  
 I would like your opinion in term of *detail/micro detail, sound stage/3D imaging, smoothness, bass amount, treble (ear fatigue)* for below IEMs:
   

 1) Fischer Audio DBA-02MKII ($195)

 2) Heir 3.Ai ($299)

 3) LogitechUE 900 ($299)


  
 Which is a better pick?


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> Well, there are lot better model IEMs available with the same price tag of X7i. The other ones you requested Joker are reasonably priced for their build and SQ,accessories etc.
> 
> I had S4 and S5i Rugged and they are good but not that good for that price.Fit wise Klipsch's oval tips and nozzle(comfort insertion) are stellar. If it's on sale for $45-$55 I'll take a bite.


 
  
     thanks man , i think i should stick to ei800/ fidelio s1 / rha ma750 .


----------



## ellis ip

mannkind246 said:


> Just for sharing.
> 
> 
> I found below IEMs are [COLOR=FF0000]*not so good*[/COLOR] when pairing with portable amp. like Tralucent TI:
> ...



how can those iem compare to ex flagship -.-


----------



## ellis ip

I use ue900 before , I'd like to try and buy heir 3.a.i  , for ue900 the soundstage is ok , quite good presentation , bass is ok but a bit loose , not tight compare to w4, the mids and treble is bright and neutral , very detail and clear , more forward than w4


----------



## MoonYeol

Nowadays I use my UE900 with meelec balanced tips and 3/4 blocked pinholes. Hard to fault for anything really. If you only listen to them you have a hard time asking for anything else. Maybe tighter bass. It's only when comparing to my FA-4E that I understand what I'm missing. But I find myself using them quite much due to sentimental reasons and because I don't want them to go unused. Anyway. The UE900 are good allrounders.

From what I know the R-50 (which I had for quite some time) should be pretty similar to DBA-02. VERY COMFORTABLE. With comply tips they're like a glass of cold water. However more wide than deep. So less 3D than UE900. Less bass as well and a colder tonality with a bit more treble. Details should be pretty even actually. But to me the UE900 sounds nore natural and less clinical. Haven't heard 3Ai.

If you can stretch your budget though, FA-4E...


----------



## mannkind246

moonyeol said:


> Nowadays I use my UE900 with meelec balanced tips and 3/4 blocked pinholes. Hard to fault for anything really. If you only listen to them you have a hard time asking for anything else. Maybe tighter bass. It's only when comparing to my FA-4E that I understand what I'm missing. But I find myself using them quite much due to sentimental reasons and because I don't want them to go unused. Anyway. The UE900 are good allrounders.
> 
> From what I know the R-50 (which I had for quite some time) should be pretty similar to DBA-02. VERY COMFORTABLE. With comply tips they're like a glass of cold water. However more wide than deep. So less 3D than UE900. Less bass as well and a colder tonality with a bit more treble. Details should be pretty even actually. But to me the UE900 sounds nore natural and less clinical. Haven't heard 3Ai.
> 
> If you can stretch your budget though, FA-4E...



How FA-4E comparing to UE900 in term of detail, sound stage/3D imaging, separation, treble?


----------



## cibibikeru

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> In that price range the Flux is probably your best bet. Personally I don't think it's notably smoother than the MH1C but it definitely has a bit less bass and a more accurate overall sound. The cable on the Flux isn't great but it's symmetric and can be used over-the-ear. It does have a mic though. Staying in the price range there's just not much that can compete with the MH1C, especially considering you like the signature. Moving up into the $100-$150 range there's more options but nothing I can think of that ticks ALL the boxes per your requirements.
> 
> Someone should really start recabling MH1Cs for a fee... it's easy to find a $10-20 donor IEM with vastly better cables.


 
  
 Just read you review on the Flux, what do you mean by "not nearly as prone to sibilance as many of the popular VSonic" ? Are they in any way sibilant? I really love the smoothness of MH1, even the most sibilant recordings which I couldn't stand with previously owned GR04 Flaghsip doesn't bother me at all with the MH1.


----------



## MoonYeol

mannkind246 said:


> moonyeol said:
> 
> 
> > Nowadays I use my UE900 with meelec balanced tips and 3/4 blocked pinholes. Hard to fault for anything really. If you only listen to them you have a hard time asking for anything else. Maybe tighter bass. It's only when comparing to my FA-4E that I understand what I'm missing. But I find myself using them quite much due to sentimental reasons and because I don't want them to go unused. Anyway. The UE900 are good allrounders.
> ...




Better, better, better. Or well, treble is about the same. Only less prone to sibilance but still detailed and very present. The most apparent differences are in the tighter, more impactful bass and the imaging. More immersive. The detailing is also better. I've heard things on them that I haven't heard before. They were my 4th hallelujah moment. First one was going from $30 iems to GR07. Second one was listening to a heavily EQ'd ASG-2 and the third one was UE900 through output 2 on the BH. The fourth is listening to FA-4E, with meelec balanced and on my Apex Glacier. The others were quite short lived and they felt like they also had their shortcomings. The FA-4E are just... amazing. I can't sleep when I listen to them. I always sleep on my bus rides in the afternoon. Can't sleep if I'm listening to them, they're just that good and that engaging to me.

If you can try them, you should do it.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> big help man ,  but have you heard klipsch imave x7i ?


 
  
 Missed this one before. I personally haven't heard it. 
  



yugopotamia said:


> hi joker, is there any chance for you to review entry-level ciems such as um mage, jh5, jh7, um aero, rooth, cosmic ears?


 
  
 Unfortunately there's not enough hours in the day to cover all the stuff I want to cover. I'd love to try all those, especially Rooth (I really liked the LS5X demo) but don't have any plans to do so at this time. 
  


> Originally Posted by *mannkind246* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I would like your opinion in term of *detail/micro detail, sound stage/3D imaging, smoothness, bass amount, treble (ear fatigue)* for below IEMs:
> 
> ...


 
  
 I haven't heard the 3Ai or any Heir universal for that matter. The UE 900 sounded a little more 3D to me than the DBA-02mkII, and also a little smoother/less fatiguing and with more bass impact. It does not have an advantage in micro detail compared to the DBA-02. On the contrary, the mkII with its more prominent upper mids might have an advantage in overall detail retrieval. 
  


cibibikeru said:


> Just read you review on the Flux, what do you mean by "not nearly as prone to sibilance as many of the popular VSonic" ? Are they in any way sibilant? I really love the smoothness of MH1, even the most sibilant recordings which I couldn't stand with previously owned GR04 Flaghsip doesn't bother me at all with the MH1.


 
  
 Almost all of the VSonic dynamics I've heard tend to exaggerate sibilance. The Flux does not - if it's on the track, you'll hear it, but it won't be emphasized.


----------



## mannkind246

moonyeol said:


> Better, better, better. Or well, treble is about the same. Only less prone to sibilance but still detailed and very present. The most apparent differences are in the tighter, more impactful bass and the imaging. More immersive. The detailing is also better. I've heard things on them that I haven't heard before. They were my 4th hallelujah moment. First one was going from $30 iems to GR07. Second one was listening to a heavily EQ'd ASG-2 and the third one was UE900 through output 2 on the BH. The fourth is listening to FA-4E, with meelec balanced and on my Apex Glacier. The others were quite short lived and they felt like they also had their shortcomings. The FA-4E are just... amazing. I can't sleep when I listen to them. I always sleep on my bus rides in the afternoon. Can't sleep if I'm listening to them, they're just that good and that engaging to me.
> 
> If you can try them, you should do it.


 
 FA-4E might be the right IEM that I'm looking for.
 Need to do more research before deciding to get it since it is an expensive stuff.


----------



## Gilly87

Hiya Joker,

A quick one for ya: of the GR07, SE535, and SM2, which would you say has the best combo of out-of-head presentation and a generally fun, punchy, dynamic sound? Also how would you compare the bass of the 535 to the SM2?


----------



## TooLazy

With Christmas coming up, I think I may have the chance to settle down, after a bunch of pretty great cheapos, with a nice mid-range ($100-120) IEM, which should last me quite a while. There are a few I've had my eye on, so I'd like to ask you for some advice. As they are quite sturdy and the most easily available (especially with warranty), I'm considering the RHA MA750, which may not fit my sound preference (strong, but quick and not overpowering bass (also more subbass than midbass focus), a nice and not too recessed midrange with a fair bit of hights. also as much separation and detail as possible), but otherwise seem like a decent choice. Unfortunately the GR07, which seem closer to my preference, would be much harder to obtain. I've also been looking at the new Audio-Technica IM50 and IM70, which are in this range. Any tips perhaps?


----------



## MDFMK

toolazy said:


> With Christmas coming up, I think I may have the chance to settle down, after a bunch of pretty great cheapos, with a nice mid-range ($100-120) IEM, which should last me quite a while. There are a few I've had my eye on, so I'd like to ask you for some advice. As they are quite sturdy and the most easily available (especially with warranty), I'm considering the RHA MA750, which may not fit my sound preference (strong, but quick and not overpowering bass, a nice and not too recessed midrange with a fair bit of hights. also as much separation and detail as possible), but otherwise seem like a decent choice. Unfortunately the GR07, which seem closer to my preference, would be much harder to obtain. I've also been looking at the new Audio-Technica IM50 and IM70, which are in this range. Any tips perhaps?


 
  
 The JVC FXT-90 is another option in that range with a sound similar to what you seem to want.  Strong and impactful(but far from overwhelming) bass, sparkly treble with no real harshness and a midrange that doesn't give up much emphasis either.  Detail is supposedly almost on par with the GR07.  My pair have been going strong since I got them with no defects and the build quality is quite good, although since you have to import them I'm not sure about the warranty.  Still, you can get a pair from about $80 from Amazon sellers now, which is a pretty awesome deal for how good they sound.  The Meelectronics M-DUO is similar but with a stronger V shape sound to my ears, although it's also more readily available in the US of course.


----------



## TooLazy

mdfmk said:


> The JVC FXT-90 is another option in that range with a sound similar to what you seem to want.  Strong and impactful(but far from overwhelming) bass, sparkly treble with no real harshness and a midrange that doesn't give up much emphasis either.  Detail is supposedly almost on par with the GR07.  My pair have been going strong since I got them with no defects and the build quality is quite good, although since you have to import them I'm not sure about the warranty.  Still, you can get a pair from about $80 from Amazon sellers now, which is a pretty awesome deal for how good they sound.  The Meelectronics M-DUO is similar but with a stronger V shape sound to my ears, although it's also more readily available in the US of course.


 

 Thanks for the reply! The biggest issue here is that while those are easy to get in the US, I'm European and neither is available around here, unfortunately.


----------



## quartertone

The lower treble on the FXT90 is pretty harsh to a lot of people, myself included; I need Complys to enjoy them.
  
 EDIT: I can heartily recommend the IM50.


----------



## TooLazy

quartertone said:


> The lower treble on the FXT90 is pretty harsh to a lot of people, myself included; I need Complys to enjoy them.
> 
> EDIT: I can heartily recommend the IM50.


 
 Could you please give me a quick comparison of the IM50 and the Quadbeat 2, which I see you own? Also, how sturdy/durable do they seem?


----------



## quartertone

The IM50 has much fuller mids - I don't think of the QB2 as V-shaped, but they sounded like it when I switched from the IM50 earlier today. They both have good soundstages, with the IM50 a bit more immersive and 3D. The IM50 are built very solidly, though I don't know how reliable the cable connectors are yet. They're also quite big and bulky; any more so and they'd be too uncomfortable for me. The LG are smaller and lighter, and mostly disappear in your ears, while the AT stick out a bit (and the memory wire may be annoying to some). I'd say the IM50 are better in most ways, though if you like pronounced treble sparkle you might find them a bit tame up top. The QB2 have more sparkle, but still stay smooth, plus they have the headset functionality (including volume controls, which not many Android headsets have). They're both bargains.


----------



## TooLazy

quartertone said:


> The IM50 has much fuller mids - I don't think of the QB2 as V-shaped, but they sounded like it when I switched from the IM50 earlier today. They both have good soundstages, with the IM50 a bit more immersive and 3D. The IM50 are built very solidly, though I don't know how reliable the cable connectors are yet. They're also quite big and bulky; any more so and they'd be too uncomfortable for me. The LG are smaller and lighter, and mostly disappear in your ears, while the AT stick out a bit (and the memory wire may be annoying to some). I'd say the IM50 are better in most ways, though if you like pronounced treble sparkle you might find them a bit tame up top. The QB2 have more sparkle, but still stay smooth, plus they have the headset functionality (including volume controls, which not many Android headsets have). They're both bargains.


 

 Thanks! You aren't making this a lot easier though.  The sound signature of the IM50 might be better for me than the  QB2, though I really quite like these as well (at least as far as sound goes, I'm not a big fan of their comfort, or lack thereof). How's the bass of the IM50 comparatively? Ideally, I'd be looking for a bit less midbass and a bit more subbass, but I don't really expect the latter here.


----------



## mannkind246

quartertone said:


> The lower treble on the FXT90 is pretty harsh to a lot of people, myself included; I need Complys to enjoy them.
> 
> EDIT: I can heartily recommend the IM50.


 
 Between FXT90 and DBA02-MKII, which one has a smoother treble, more detail, larger sound stage and better separation?


----------



## quartertone

The Fischer wins on all those fronts. It's quite light on bass though.


----------



## ljokerl

gilly87 said:


> Hiya Joker,
> 
> A quick one for ya: of the GR07, SE535, and SM2, which would you say has the best combo of out-of-head presentation and a generally fun, punchy, dynamic sound? Also how would you compare the bass of the 535 to the SM2?


 
  
 I would have a tough time labeling the SE535 as "fun". It doesn't have as much as the SM2, that's for sure. In general I think of "fun" as more of a v-shaped signature (think "rock" EQ present) which in this is case is closest to the GR07 (or better yet GR07 BE). The SM2 has a warmer sound with more relaxed upper mids. Again, not really "fun" for me, personally at this stage - more of a UM3X competitor in the musician's monitor space. 
  


toolazy said:


> With Christmas coming up, I think I may have the chance to settle down, after a bunch of pretty great cheapos, with a nice mid-range ($100-120) IEM, which should last me quite a while. There are a few I've had my eye on, so I'd like to ask you for some advice. As they are quite sturdy and the most easily available (especially with warranty), I'm considering the RHA MA750, which may not fit my sound preference (strong, but quick and not overpowering bass (also more subbass than midbass focus), a nice and not too recessed midrange with a fair bit of hights. also as much separation and detail as possible), but otherwise seem like a decent choice. Unfortunately the GR07, which seem closer to my preference, would be much harder to obtain. I've also been looking at the new Audio-Technica IM50 and IM70, which are in this range. Any tips perhaps?


 
  
 I like the MA750. It has plenty of bass but I think it does a good job of keeping it under control. Subbass is certainly impressive. Mids are not notably recessed. Treble is forgiving but not too dark. Build quality is amazing. It's not the most resolving IEM but if we're talking stuff in that price range, with a warranty, from a Western brand that's probably as good as it gets. Its sound definitely beats $100 models from brands like Onkyo and Shure, which also have very solid build quality.


----------



## TooLazy

Great, thanks! Just some quick follow-up quiestions: How's the isolation? I haven't found a whole lot about that. Also, in your upcoming review, roughly what score can we expect the sound to get?

EDIT: Also, if we consider eastern manufacturers as well, would any IEM best it by a significant margin?


----------



## mannkind246

After listening to DBA02-MKII, I found it has a very good detail and good sound stage stage and separation. However I found the treble is a bit bright and sometimes fatigue my ear.
Another problem is the bass is too light and loose.

Is there any IEM has good detail, sound stagestage and separation like in DBA02-MKII but has tight and deep base with less fatigue treble?


----------



## quartertone

mannkind246 said:


> After listening to DBA02-MKII, I found it has a very good detail and good sound stage stage and separation. However I found the treble is a bit bright and sometimes fatigue my ear.
> Another problem is the bass is too light and loose.
> 
> Is there any IEM has good detail, sound stagestage and separation like in DBA02-MKII but has tight and deep base with less fatigue treble?


 
 The T-PEOS H-200 comes to mind, if you want to spend that much.


----------



## airomjosh

mannkind246 said:


> After listening to DBA02-MKII, I found it has a very good detail and good sound stage stage and separation. However I found the treble is a bit bright and sometimes fatigue my ear.
> Another problem is the bass is too light and loose.
> 
> Is there any IEM has good detail, sound stagestage and separation like in DBA02-MKII but has tight and deep base with less fatigue treble?


 
 You can try Dunu DN-1000.


----------



## ljokerl

Does this thread look messed up to anyone else?
  


toolazy said:


> Great, thanks! Just some quick follow-up quiestions: How's the isolation? I haven't found a whole lot about that. Also, in your upcoming review, roughly what score can we expect the sound to get?
> 
> EDIT: Also, if we consider eastern manufacturers as well, would any IEM best it by a significant margin?


 
  
 Isolation is surprisingly good, a little better than with the GR07. Sound score will probably be around a 9, not sure of the exact number yet. 
  
 In that price range I can't think of anything that's significantly better all around and meets your other requirements (including those for sound signature) as well.


----------



## abhijollyguy

ljokerl said:


> Does this thread look messed up to anyone else?


 
  
 Yes, to me


----------



## ericr

ljokerl said:


> Does this thread look messed up to anyone else?



Seems OK viewed with my phone (using the mobile version of the site)


----------



## quartertone

Now it's OK again.


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks.. posted a tech support/bug thread. Seems to be all better now.


----------



## ljokerl

Double post...


----------



## quartertone

Do you think you'll give the DN-1000 a substantially higher rating than the MA750?


----------



## mannkind246

airomjosh said:


> You can try Dunu DN-1000.


 
 Can you tell us more how DN-1000 sounds better than DBA02-MKII in term of bass & treble?


----------



## lin0003

quartertone said:


> Do you think you'll give the DN-1000 a substantially higher rating than the MA750?



Yes, definitely. Tighter, more detailed bass, clearer, colder mids and a more emphasized treble makes the DN-1000 a much better IEM IMO. To be fair it does cost almost twice as much. 



mannkind246 said:


> Can you tell us more how DN-1000 sounds better than DBA02-MKII in term of bass & treble?


The bass is much better, having much more impact and veing very fast. From memory, the mids are a bit warmer and the treble less bright. Vocals are a bit more upfront on the DN 1000 if I remember correctly.


----------



## Gilly87

Gotcha. Well I've got the SM2 now and definitely don't want less bass; I'm after more aggressive upper mids and treble for rock/metal. Even without the filters they still sound unnatural with "real" music; you're right to compare them to the UM3X, I'd say they are basically the same but with a slightly more blended sound and bigger soundstage. Luckily I got them for $100 so I'm not too disappointed 
  
 I've been delaying a GR07 purchase for ages on principle due to their lack of replaceable cable...*whine* I refuse to give in though! I've heard rumors so I'm holding out.
  
 Can't wait to hear your take on the InEar SD3, it's been tickling my fancy for some time.
  
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I would have a tough time labeling the SE535 as "fun". It doesn't have as much as the SM2, that's for sure. In general I think of "fun" as more of a v-shaped signature (think "rock" EQ present) which in this is case is closest to the GR07 (or better yet GR07 BE). The SM2 has a warmer sound with more relaxed upper mids. Again, not really "fun" for me, personally at this stage - more of a UM3X competitor in the musician's monitor space.


----------



## ljokerl

quartertone said:


> Do you think you'll give the DN-1000 a substantially higher rating than the MA750?


 
  
 Not sure of the rating for the DN-1000 yet. I like it quite a lot but its treble is not entirely smooth and can be a little excessive. For example it's more prone towards sibilance than the MA750. Different sound signatures, with the DN-1000 being more v-shaped.
  


gilly87 said:


> Can't wait to hear your take on the InEar SD3, it's been tickling my fancy for some time.


 
  
 It's a very good earphone. I prefer the less bassy SD-2, though. Reviews should be up soon.


----------



## mannkind246

Is it possible to improve the bass tighter and to reduce the brightness in DBA02-MKII by different type of the ear buds tips?


----------



## DerGeldMann

Could you do a review on the Audio Technica IM-50? Thanks man, I'm glad to have such a knowledgeable source to look to for IEM advice.


----------



## MoonYeol

mannkind246 said:


> Is it possible to improve the bass tighter and to reduce the brightness in DBA02-MKII by different type of the ear buds tips?




Why do you want a tighter bass on something thay already has tight bass? Comply tips soften the sound but they don't tighten the bass.


----------



## quartertone

mannkind246 said:


> Is it possible to improve the bass tighter and to reduce the brightness in DBA02-MKII by different type of the ear buds tips?


 
 I like Shure Olive tips, they take away just a bit of the bright edge without effecting the overall sound as much as Complys - plus they're more durable and more comfortable. Don't know what you mean about the bass, it's very tight already.


----------



## mannkind246

quartertone said:


> I like Shure Olive tips, they take away just a bit of the bright edge without effecting the overall sound as much as Complys - plus they're more durable and more comfortable. Don't know what you mean about the bass, it's very tight already.



Sorry I misunderstood the bass in DBA02-MKII. It is tight.

Does the Shure Olive tip fit well on the nozzle of DBA02-MKII ?
Does it make the bass more punchy and deeper?


----------



## MoonYeol

I don't think foam tips make the bass deeper and more punchy. From my experience single flange silicone tips (this is a VERY diverse category) tend to give the punchiest and deepest bass. But I haven't used any olives, just comply and vsonic foams. I did however love comply tips on my R-50 because they do add some kind of texture to the bass. Like the soft reverberations of a finger plucked bass guitar. You can almost see the string vibrate.


----------



## mannkind246

moonyeol said:


> I don't think foam tips make the bass deeper and more punchy. From my experience single flange silicone tips (this is a VERY diverse category) tend to give the punchiest and deepest bass. But I haven't used any olives, just comply and vsonic foams. I did however love comply tips on my R-50 because they do add some kind of texture to the bass. Like the soft reverberations of a finger plucked bass guitar. You can almost see the string vibrate.


 
 After changing to Shure's olive tip, I found it cuts down a bit of brightness of the original sound of DBA02-MKII.
 I feel DBA02-MKII is no so good for song that emphasize heavy bass like dance/rock music.


----------



## ljokerl

dergeldmann said:


> Could you do a review on the Audio Technica IM-50? Thanks man, I'm glad to have such a knowledgeable source to look to for IEM advice.


 
  
 Don't have one at this time. Maybe (hopefully) next year, especially if ATH decides to release these in the US...


----------



## smashdroid

Hi joker, thanx to you i bought mh1c 6 months back. they are awesome but have terrible fitting and cord. they just keep falling when on the move. so im thinking of buying another sets better sounding than these. I listen to almost all types of genres, more of hip hop, edm , classic rock. IMHO amount of bass on the mh1c should be the minimum for the iem, i cant comment on the quality.
 Please suggest me good iem. my budget max 150 usd. My choices till now-* Westone 3 , vsonic gr07be, vsonic vc1000, vsonic vsd1s, jvc fxt90, yamaha eph100*.. Any help is appreciated by anyone.


----------



## PowerSlide

i look at the Moe-SS01 and think it's a weapon from video game lol


----------



## DerGeldMann

ljokerl said:


> Don't have one at this time. Maybe (hopefully) next year, especially if ATH decides to release these in the US...


 
  
 Yeah, that would help. Thanks anyway man!


----------



## modulor

smashdroid said:


> Hi joker, thanx to you i bought mh1c 6 months back. they are awesome but have terrible fitting and cord. they just keep falling when on the move. so im thinking of buying another sets better sounding than these. I listen to almost all types of genres, more of hip hop, edm , classic rock. IMHO amount of bass on the mh1c should be the minimum for the iem, i cant comment on the quality.
> Please suggest me good iem. my budget max 150 usd. My choices till now-* Westone 3 , vsonic gr07be, vsonic vc1000, vsonic vsd1s, jvc fxt90, yamaha eph100*.. Any help is appreciated by anyone.


 
 If you want to retain most of the bass quantity, but improve on the quality my vote goes to the EPH-100.  I believe the rest will be considerably less bass-tilted comparatively, but the GR07 BE should also be a consideration.


----------



## mannkind246

modulor said:


> If you want to retain most of the bass quantity, but improve on the quality my vote goes to the EPH-100.  I believe the rest will be considerably less bass-tilted comparatively, but the GR07 BE should also be a consideration.


 
 Is Yamaha EPH-100SL still able to have the similar detail, seperation & sound stage like in DBA02-MKII?


----------



## ljokerl

smashdroid said:


> Hi joker, thanx to you i bought mh1c 6 months back. they are awesome but have terrible fitting and cord. they just keep falling when on the move. so im thinking of buying another sets better sounding than these. I listen to almost all types of genres, more of hip hop, edm , classic rock. IMHO amount of bass on the mh1c should be the minimum for the iem, i cant comment on the quality.
> Please suggest me good iem. my budget max 150 usd. My choices till now-* Westone 3 , vsonic gr07be, vsonic vc1000, vsonic vsd1s, jvc fxt90, yamaha eph100*.. Any help is appreciated by anyone.


 
  
 Modulor is right. You can definitely eliminate the VC1000, GR07BE, and VSD1S - they have less bass than the MH1C. The FXT90 and W3 may have similar midbass quantity but less deep bass than the MH1C. Only the EPH-100 can really compete with the Sony and is a good upgrade IMO. 
  


powerslide said:


> i look at the Moe-SS01 and think it's a weapon from video game lol


 
  
 I can see that.
  


mannkind246 said:


> Is Yamaha EPH-100SL still able to have the similar detail, seperation & sound stage like in DBA02-MKII?


 
  
 The enhanced bass and warm overall tone will mask some of the detail compared to something as flat as the DBA-02.


----------



## MoonYeol

Hmm... someone really needs to recable MH1... Maybe it's time to buy a multimeter and lots of cable...


----------



## mannkind246

Among RE-400, EPH-100SLand Dunu DN1000,

which one has the closest detail, sound stage and separation like in DBA02-MKII but has a punchy, fast, extended and deep bass?


----------



## raptor18

Anyone has tips on what would be nice for me?
  
 Neutral and detailed
 well extended in both frequency ends, 
 Cold,
 BIG soundstage, i sooo love huge soundstages =)
 non sibilant,
 not very bassy, but rather neutral, and not like ER4s, thats way to little.


----------



## MoonYeol

Interesting combinations of characteristics. I find that some of them might be conflicting... Intriguing to see the answer. I think you're bound to end up with a CIEM with those requirements.


----------



## raptor18

I was suspecting that answer 
  
 I see your from Sweden, so am I.
 And i know you have the UE900, so do i. Black Friday from elgiganten 
  
 I love the UE900, but i understand i can get better, and i'm a little addicted to this hobby


----------



## Zelda

mannkind246 said:


> Among RE-400, EPH-100SLand Dunu DN1000,
> 
> which one has the closest detail, sound stage and separation like in DBA02-MKII but has a punchy, fast, extended and deep bass?


 
 Dunu.


----------



## Mimouille

raptor18 said:


> Anyone has tips on what would be nice for me?
> 
> Neutral and detailed
> well extended in both frequency ends,
> ...


Hidition NT6.


----------



## ljokerl

mannkind246 said:


> Among RE-400, EPH-100SLand Dunu DN1000,
> 
> which one has the closest detail, sound stage and separation like in DBA02-MKII but has a punchy, fast, extended and deep bass?


 
  
 DN1000.
  


raptor18 said:


> Anyone has tips on what would be nice for me?
> 
> Neutral and detailed
> well extended in both frequency ends,
> ...


 
  
 That's a pretty rare signature. If you don't want to go all out and get a custom I would say T-Peos H-100
  


mimouille said:


> Hidition NT6.


 
  
 Lol. Yeah, this.


----------



## nehcrow

Oohhhh, so I take it you are really liking the the DN1000?
 Would you recommend them over the GR07 MK2/BE? These two IEM's are the only ones I've really enjoyed a lot so if the DN-1000 can better them then that's great 
 How well do they do with EDM?
 Sorry for bombarding you with questions lol


----------



## MisterCats

Going just a little farther than curious here: What would be a natural step up from the Yamaha EPH-100? There's not a lot I don't listen to in the way of styles/genres, and I'm a sucker for the V shape.

edit: I'd be willing to save up no more than maybe $450 for customs (if that's even a price point for customs anywhere), and BA drivers are fine, too.


----------



## ljokerl

nehcrow said:


> Oohhhh, so I take it you are really liking the the DN1000?
> Would you recommend them over the GR07 MK2/BE? These two IEM's are the only ones I've really enjoyed a lot so if the DN-1000 can better them then that's great
> How well do they do with EDM?
> Sorry for bombarding you with questions lol


 
  
 Different sound signatures - the DN1000 is a lot more v-shaped than even the GR07 Bass Edition. I happen to think its signature works very well with EDM.
  


mistercats said:


> Going just a little farther than curious here: What would be a natural step up from the Yamaha EPH-100? There's not a lot I don't listen to in the way of styles/genres, and I'm a sucker for the V shape.
> 
> edit: I'd be willing to save up no more than maybe $450 for customs (if that's even a price point for customs anywhere), and BA drivers are fine, too.


 
  
 Only one custom I've heard in that price range can do what the EPH-100 can do - the 1964EARS V3. Still, it really depends on what you're trying to see improved. Bass quantity won't go up from EPH-100, for example, but clarity and imaging will.


----------



## MoonYeol

raptor18 said:


> I was suspecting that answer
> 
> I see your from Sweden, so am I.
> And i know you have the UE900, so do i. Black Friday from elgiganten
> ...




Nice, a fellow countryman! Anyway. If you like the UE900, the FA-4E is almost a straight upgrade in all fields. And as I've said before the meelec balanced tips help the veil a bit and give a more open sound if that's the issue. The Fiio cable also helps a little bit but only marginally.


----------



## Sinocelt

Regarding the Noble 4S, does the plate merge seemlessly into the silicone shell?


----------



## Bauchspeck

Hello Joker,
 thanks to your magnificent list I ended up buying a pair of rs-50's and vc-1000's, which I both quite enjoyed (especially the rs-50).
  
 Now I wondered which would be the next logical step up, just in terms of sound quality, from the RockIt Sounds.
 My preferences are neutrality; tight, punchy yet not emphasized bass; good soundstage and overall clarity (money isn't of importance, I would also consider buying customs).
  
 Thanks in advance,
 Bauchspeck


----------



## calpiyuki

Price not necessary? Go for custom-iem roxanne.


----------



## Bauchspeck

Sorry, I guess I didn't put it very well.
 I just wanted to know which would be the next improvement over the rs-50's, not the best IEM's I could possibly get.
 Can't afford to buy 1000 euro headphones, I would like to spend 300 euro (or less), but can stretch it up to 480 if improvements justify it.


----------



## garcsa

Contact Piotrs Custom Art, and I'm sure you'll find the solution,


----------



## nehcrow

ljokerl said:


> Different sound signatures - the DN1000 is a lot more v-shaped than even the GR07 Bass Edition. I happen to think its signature works very well with EDM.
> 
> 
> Only one custom I've heard in that price range can do what the EPH-100 can do - the 1964EARS V3. Still, it really depends on what you're trying to see improved. Bass quantity won't go up from EPH-100, for example, but clarity and imaging will.


 
 Thanks! 
 Can you ballpark the overall rating you'd give to the Dunu's? That would be swell


----------



## ljokerl

sinocelt said:


> Regarding the Noble 4S, does the plate merge seemlessly into the silicone shell?


 
  
 I can see where the silicone meets acrylic (mostly because the faceplate is colored) but in terms of feel there's no boundary. I'd say it's quite seamless.
  


bauchspeck said:


> Hello Joker,
> thanks to your magnificent list I ended up buying a pair of rs-50's and vc-1000's, which I both quite enjoyed (especially the rs-50).
> 
> Now I wondered which would be the next logical step up, just in terms of sound quality, from the RockIt Sounds.
> ...


 
  
 Next step would probably be an Ety ER4S. After that you'd have to go for at least a mid-level custom like the Lime Ears LE3 or 1964 V6-Stage in order to really "upgrade".
  
  


nehcrow said:


> Thanks!
> Can you ballpark the overall rating you'd give to the Dunu's? That would be swell


 
  
 Ballpark - RE-400/GR07 level.


----------



## AznInvasion138

Hey Joker hope you're having a happy holidays.
  
 So I'm looking for an upgrade over my current Klipsch X10s. I've tried IEMs over the past year from Westone 3, Sennheiser IE80, UE TF10, Yamaha EPH-100. All of them have been pretty good but not exactly what I've been looking for. I'm looking for a comfortable IEM that isolates pretty good with clear mids & highs with an impactful bass but not so bloated to the point where it intrudes on everything else. I listen to mostly r&b, hip hop, alternative rock, acoustic, and some trance/electronica.
  
 I've been looking at the Audeo PFE 232 for the longest time and now that they have been discounted finally are something in my ballpark. I've also been eyeing the Shure SE846 and Sennheiser IE800 but I'm kind of afraid to spend that much on an IEM. Also at the prices I'm looking at it would it just be better to go with customs? I will be using these mostly on the go through my ipod and on my laptop. Still looking into a portable amp/dac to go along with it.
  
 Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


----------



## lin0003

I think that the Dunu is heaps better than the GR07 MKII but I guess we all have our preferences...


----------



## Amitl

i was wondering: how well do the Yamaha EPH-100 lend themselves to over-the-ear fitment?
 would they stay in place without cable-guides?
 do these generally fit securely? (straight down and over-the-ear)
 thank you.....


----------



## modulor

amitl said:


> i was wondering: how well do the Yamaha EPH-100 lend themselves to over-the-ear fitment?
> would they stay in place without cable-guides?
> do these generally fit securely? (straight down and over-the-ear)
> thank you.....


 
 I typically wear them over-ear with no problems - the cable is a little springy but once they are in place they stay there just fine.  Even better if you wear glasses actually (at least for me anyway).  I find them to fit quite securely both ways as long as you have tips that fit/seal your ear well.
  


lin0003 said:


> I think that the Dunu is heaps better than the GR07 MKII but I guess we all have our preferences...


 
 Hmm, perhaps these are the next to try with all this talk over them recently 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I understand they are more of a slight v-shape comparatively but they sound engaging and fun.  Going to check out a few reviews on them now!


----------



## lin0003

modulor said:


> I typically wear them over-ear with no problems - the cable is a little springy but once they are in place they stay there just fine.  Even better if you wear glasses actually (at least for me anyway).  I find them to fit quite securely both ways as long as you have tips that fit/seal your ear well.
> 
> Hmm, perhaps these are the next to try with all this talk over them recently   I understand they are more of a slight v-shape comparatively but they sound engaging and fun.  Going to check out a few reviews on them now!


 I don't find the mids recessed at all actually. 

Brooko has a long review and I posted one a while back as well. Do check out H20Fidelity's comparison of the H-200, DN1K and AX60.


----------



## H20Fidelity

lin0003 said:


> I think that the Dunu is heaps better than the GR07 MKII but I guess we all have our preferences...




I too find the Dunu quite a bit better than GR07, especially clarity, seperation and soundstage. I don't really consider them on similar levels.


----------



## Gilly87

EPH100 work fine over-ear and the fit is really secure either way with their unique double flanges. The cable isn't ultra along though so if you're tall like me, you might prefer wearing them down.





amitl said:


> i was wondering: how well do the Yamaha EPH-100 lend themselves to over-the-ear fitment?
> would they stay in place without cable-guides?
> do these generally fit securely? (straight down and over-the-ear)
> thank you.....


----------



## ljokerl

azninvasion138 said:


> Hey Joker hope you're having a happy holidays.
> 
> So I'm looking for an upgrade over my current Klipsch X10s. I've tried IEMs over the past year from Westone 3, Sennheiser IE80, UE TF10, Yamaha EPH-100. All of them have been pretty good but not exactly what I've been looking for. I'm looking for a comfortable IEM that isolates pretty good with clear mids & highs with an impactful bass but not so bloated to the point where it intrudes on everything else. I listen to mostly r&b, hip hop, alternative rock, acoustic, and some trance/electronica.
> 
> ...


 
  
 May I ask why you chose the X10 over the TF10 and EPH-100 in the long run? Might help figure out if the PFE 232 or IE 800 is the right step for you, or if a similarly-priced custom or other earphone would be better. Also, the IE 800 really doesn't isolate a whole lot, especially since it sounds best with a shallow seal. 
  


lin0003 said:


> I think that the Dunu is heaps better than the GR07 MKII but I guess we all have our preferences...


 
  
 I've listened to them for maybe five or six hours, just providing some very initial thoughts when asked. Full review is still weeks away. I did send them in to InnerFidelity for measurements also, which we should see next month, hopefully.
  


gilly87 said:


> EPH100 work fine over-ear and the fit is really secure either way with their unique double flanges. The cable isn't ultra along though so if you're tall like me, you might prefer wearing them down.


 
  
 +1. I wore them over-the-ear and found them secure and comfortable with no cable guides. No issues with the cable length here but I'm only 5'10.


----------



## AznInvasion138

ljokerl said:


> May I ask why you chose the X10 over the TF10 and EPH-100 in the long run? Might help figure out if the PFE 232 or IE 800 is the right step for you, or if a similarly-priced custom or other earphone would be better. Also, the IE 800 really doesn't isolate a whole lot, especially since it sounds best with a shallow seal.


 
  
 I ultimately chose the X10 over the others primarily based off fit and comfort. I could never get a good seal/fit with the TF10 and EPH-100. I think out of all the ones I've tried I liked the sound signature of the EPH-100 and the JVC FXZ-200. But for me comfortability is a pretty high priority for me. I was also wondering if there are other IEMs I should be looking at in that price range. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

azninvasion138 said:


> I ultimately chose the X10 over the others primarily based off fit and comfort. I could never get a good seal/fit with the TF10 and EPH-100. I think out of all the ones I've tried I liked the sound signature of the EPH-100 and the JVC FXZ-200. But for me comfortability is a pretty high priority for me. I was also wondering if there are other IEMs I should be looking at in that price range. Thanks!


 
  
 Makes sense, because the EPH-100 is the one I'd have recommended based on your request. Haven't heard the FXZ-200 though. 
  
 Unfortunately most high-end IEMs don't have a form factor as nice as that of the X10, and those that do lack the enhanced bass. The PFE232 is one of the rare exceptions, but it's also quite a bit brighter than the X10 unless you use the green filters (which I'm not a huge fan of). Anyway, wearing comfort alone pretty much eliminates all of the other options I can think of in terms of X10 upgrades, so the PFE 232 might just be it. Of the other IEMs you mentioned in your last post, I haven't tried the SE846 but the IE 800 has pretty low isolation.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the In-Ear StageDiver 2 and StageDiver 3. 
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1B10) InEar StageDiver 2 (SD-2)*
> 
> 
> Reviewed December 2013
> ...


 
  
 The updated ranking table can be found here.


----------



## lin0003

Nice reviews Joker!


----------



## getclikinagas

Excellent reviews joker.
I love how the RE400 keeps coming up in comparisons well outside its price bracket . 

Sent from my LG-D802 using Tapatalk


----------



## mannkind246

Hi |Joker|, very good review about "In-Ear StageDiver 2 and StageDiver 3".
 I'm very interested to know how they are comparing to less expensive Dunu DN-1000?
 Thanks.


----------



## yalper

There should be a RE-400BE sounds like SD-2


----------



## TekeRugburn

yalper said:


> There should be a RE-400BE sounds like SD-2




Re400BE? Hopefully not, not everyone is a basshead


----------



## Migou67

.
 Thank you for this excellent review of the SD!


----------



## Amitl

i'm sorry if i may sound a little stupid but.... if straight-barrel iem's, such as the EPH-100,
 fit so nicely looped-over-the-ear, then who needs a design such as the Shue SE215...?? (--aside from the removable cable--)


----------



## dezane222

ljokerl
 how do you rank the clarity and detail beetween eph100,gr07be,vc1000,re400, and fxt90 ?


----------



## davidcotton

Hi joker
  
 Nice review of the stagediver series.  I've been interested in these for quite a while (they are also available at advancedmp3players) but was a bit nervous about the bass, particularly in the sd3.  Last time I heard a bassy iem it was the monster turbine which I really didn't like.  Is the bass anything like that (I'm aware that the turbines were a dynamic and the stagedivers aren't).  The problem I found with the bass in the turbines was that it would swamp the details making vocals etc hard to make out, so I'd end up turning up the volume which just gave me a headache.  The only bassy ba iem I've heard is the westone 3 which I liked more than the turbines.  From the sound of it I think I would be better off with the 2 than the 3 though.  Listen to progressive/hard rock.  It's hard making a choice in europe as there are so few places that offer a return on iems.  Oh and will you be reviewing the fischer amps fa4xb anytime?  They are another german brand that seem to be gaining traction on headfi.
  
 Cheers


----------



## Deviltooth

The Stagediver reviews were excellent and I'd have been interested if not for the possible fit issued for those with small ears.  Now it's not something I'd buy before I tried and I'm not likely to get a chance to do the former.


----------



## godlyatheist

Just got my JH13 a day early, right before I fly home so the timing is perfect. Looking at the IEM the bores have a slightly rough finish to them. I put them in (took a while to figure out right from left) and the right side is a lot tighter than the left. I'm running them through the Audioquest Dragonfly and I keep hearing low hums  with no music playing, DAC problem? First listen is not WOW. They are more detailed than the GR07, placement of instrument in the music is a bit different but the soundstage is about the same. I don't if it has to do with my stuffed nose from chronic allergy, but the bass sounds boomy because it sounds like it came from within a cereal box, but they do hit harder and deeper than the GR07. Also, the isolation isn't what I thought it would be since I can clearly hear my phone ring(yet I can hear my heartbeat and feel the pulse in my ear....). Do I have a fit issue?
  
 Edit: the JH13 are A LOT more detailed using the GR07 as a reference.


----------



## Don Lehrer

ljokerl said:


> Added the In-Ear StageDiver 2 and StageDiver 3.
> 
> 
> The updated ranking table can be found here.


 
  
 Nice!! and just right before christmas, thanks!!


----------



## ericr

azninvasion138 said:


> Hey Joker hope you're having a happy holidays.
> 
> So I'm looking for an upgrade over my current Klipsch X10s. I've tried IEMs over the past year from Westone 3, Sennheiser IE80, UE TF10, Yamaha EPH-100. All of them have been pretty good but not exactly what I've been looking for. I'm looking for a comfortable IEM that isolates pretty good with clear mids & highs with an impactful bass but not so bloated to the point where it intrudes on everything else. I listen to mostly r&b, hip hop, alternative rock, acoustic, and some trance/electronica.
> 
> ...



The SM64 is well worth your consideration. Wanting more than my W4s were giving I bought both the SM64 and the 232 at the same time and it was the 232s that got returned. The 64s came across as more refined, balanced and coherent. By comparison the 232s had somewhat recessed mids and seemed to strain a bit with the highs. 

They sound great with just a clip zip and are wonderful with the HRT Microstreamer.


----------



## Komuso

Thank you Joker for this extensive comparison and review of IEMs.  I really liked the Heir Audio 4Ai and was planning on trying the Noble Audio 4.  I don't buy a lot of IEMs so I figure one really nice one and done.  Well, at least that's the plan.  I was wondering whether you would also get the opportunity to try the Noble 6 and compare it to the 4?


----------



## heliuscc

nice stagediver review. I have the SD3 but am wondering whether the 2 would be better as I listen to stuff with more vocals. Some EDM, mainly electronica, more chilled than i used to be


----------



## ljokerl

lin0003 said:


> Nice reviews Joker!


 
  
 Thanks!
  


getclikinagas said:


> Excellent reviews joker.
> I love how the RE400 keeps coming up in comparisons well outside its price bracket .
> 
> Sent from my LG-D802 using Tapatalk


 
  
 Thanks. The RE-400 competes pretty well outside of its price bracket, plus its signature made it a natural point of comparison for the SD-2 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. 
  


mannkind246 said:


> Hi |Joker|, very good review about "In-Ear StageDiver 2 and StageDiver 3".
> I'm very interested to know how they are comparing to less expensive Dunu DN-1000?
> Thanks.


 
  
 They sound very different. The DN-1000 on the whole is a lot more v-shaped than either of the StageDivers. It has lots of subbass but overall has less bass than the SD-3. It's also not as tight as the less bassy SD-2. The treble of the Dunu is brighter and not nearly as smooth. It's much less tolerant of sibilance than either of the StageDivers. The Dunu is a little clearer than the SD-3 and about on-par with the SD-2. The largest difference, however, is that the StageDivers have mids that are warmer and more prominent, and sound more full-bodied and natural.
  
 Personally, I like the SD-2 best by a margin, followed by the SD-3 and then the DN1000 close behind it. The SD-3 and DN-1000 really accentuate each others' flaws and each makes the other sound "off". The SD-2 is more inoffensive.
  


migou67 said:


> .
> Thank you for this excellent review of the SD!


 
  




  


amitl said:


> i'm sorry if i may sound a little stupid but.... if straight-barrel iem's, such as the EPH-100,
> fit so nicely looped-over-the-ear, then who needs a design such as the Shue SE215...?? (--aside from the removable cable--)


 
  
Probably a rhetorical question but there’s a few reasons I can think of
1.     For the average consumer (non head-fier) it’s much easier to figure out how to wear SE215 over the ear than EPH-100

2.     Forcing over-the-ear wear eliminates complaints of microphonics

3.     Over-the-ear with memory wire makes for a very secure fit, even for beginner IEM users

4.     Ergonomic (Shure/Westone type) form factor makes earphones less visible (e.g. for use on stage)

5.     Ergonomic form factor often has less wind noise

6.     Ergonomic form factor fits under helmets, etc

7.     Multi-driver setups (e.g. SE535) take up a lot of room and wouldn’t work well with EPH-100 form factor

 
There are probably more that are eluding me right now. 
 


dezane222 said:


> ljokerl
> how do you rank the clarity and detail beetween eph100,gr07be,vc1000,re400, and fxt90 ?


 
  
 VC1000 is the best, followed closely by the RE-400, then GR07BE, and then the FXT90 and EPH-100 are about the same bringing up the rear...
  


davidcotton said:


> Hi joker
> 
> Nice review of the stagediver series.  I've been interested in these for quite a while (they are also available at advancedmp3players) but was a bit nervous about the bass, particularly in the sd3.  Last time I heard a bassy iem it was the monster turbine which I really didn't like.  Is the bass anything like that (I'm aware that the turbines were a dynamic and the stagedivers aren't).  The problem I found with the bass in the turbines was that it would swamp the details making vocals etc hard to make out, so I'd end up turning up the volume which just gave me a headache.  The only bassy ba iem I've heard is the westone 3 which I liked more than the turbines.  From the sound of it I think I would be better off with the 2 than the 3 though.  Listen to progressive/hard rock.  It's hard making a choice in europe as there are so few places that offer a return on iems.  Oh and will you be reviewing the fischer amps fa4xb anytime?  They are another german brand that seem to be gaining traction on headfi.
> 
> Cheers


 
  
The SD-3 has BA bass. It’s not really loose or bloated, and there’s not as much of it as with the Turbines. However, I do think the SD-2 is generally better if you’re worried about bass getting in the way as it doesn’t have that problem at all. 
 
I don’t have a set plan to review FA4 – would like to try it sometime but there’s lots of other IEMs to get through. Lear also has some high-end custom-come-universal sets on the way that are interesting.
  


deviltooth said:


> The Stagediver reviews were excellent and I'd have been interested if not for the possible fit issued for those with small ears.  Now it's not something I'd buy before I tried and I'm not likely to get a chance to do the former.


 
  
 I understand why they are designed the way they are but I do feel the pressure from the housings after a while. This is where a true custom fit is hugely advantageous. 
  


godlyatheist said:


> Just got my JH13 a day early, right before I fly home so the timing is perfect. Looking at the IEM the bores have a slightly rough finish to them. I put them in (took a while to figure out right from left) and the right side is a lot tighter than the left. I'm running them through the Audioquest Dragonfly and I keep hearing low hums  with no music playing, DAC problem? First listen is not WOW. They are more detailed than the GR07, placement of instrument in the music is a bit different but the soundstage is about the same. I don't if it has to do with my stuffed nose from chronic allergy, but the bass sounds boomy because it sounds like it came from within a cereal box, but they do hit harder and deeper than the GR07. Also, the isolation isn't what I thought it would be since I can clearly hear my phone ring(yet I can hear my heartbeat and feel the pulse in my ear....). Do I have a fit issue?
> 
> Edit: the JH13 are A LOT more detailed using the GR07 as a reference.


 
  
 Give your ears a few days to get used to the fit. If one ear is still significantly tighter it's probably a good idea to get a refit. Isolation should be better than GR07 by a margin - 5-10dB at least.
  


don lehrer said:


> Nice!! and just right before christmas, thanks!!


 
  
 A StageDiver would certainly make a nice gift to oneself 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


ericr said:


> The SM64 is well worth your consideration. Wanting more than my W4s were giving I bought both the SM64 and the 232 at the same time and it was the 232s that got returned. The 64s came across as more refined, balanced and coherent. By comparison the 232s had somewhat recessed mids and seemed to strain a bit with the highs.
> 
> They sound great with just a clip zip and are wonderful with the HRT Microstreamer.


 
  
 Only problem is, if he didn't find the W3 very comfortable, I'm not sure the SM64 will be significantly better. 
  


komuso said:


> Thank you Joker for this extensive comparison and review of IEMs.  I really liked the Heir Audio 4Ai and was planning on trying the Noble Audio 4.  I don't buy a lot of IEMs so I figure one really nice one and done.  Well, at least that's the plan.  I was wondering whether you would also get the opportunity to try the Noble 6 and compare it to the 4?


 
  
 Sorry, the 4S is the only Noble set I've tried.
  
   


heliuscc said:


> nice stagediver review. I have the SD3 but am wondering whether the 2 would be better as I listen to stuff with more vocals. Some EDM, mainly electronica, more chilled than i used to be


 

  
 Depends - do you ever find the SD-3 too bassy? Do you wish it's low end was tighter, even if it means a drop in impact and rumble? Do you wish the mids were more prominent relative to the bass? Do you wish the overall tone was a little brighter and less warm? (I sound like an advert).
  
 If you said yes to any or all of these questions, the SD-2 is probably right for you.


----------



## heliuscc

Thanks joker!


----------



## Sludig

Excellent SD-2 and SD-3 reviews, like all the other ones. 

What of this iems do you think has a LCD-2 sound signature? I think maybe SD-3, but SD-2 has more mids...


----------



## dezane222

thanks a lot joker


----------



## FastAndClean

Joker you are the best !


----------



## Gilly87

We love joker!


----------



## lin0003

Merry Christmas everyone and of course, special thanks to Joker!


----------



## VinniePaz

Hello Joker,congratulations for this post and thank you for your help,I cameform  a Klipsch S4,and I listen to hip hop,Can you sayto me a upgrade for the Klipsch  S4,or whit a similar sound betwen 50-100$?thank you.If you give me 3 or 4 references better.What sound signature is Klipsch S4?


----------



## stormmilk

An extraordinary review like no other! Please test the new sony xba h3 too.


----------



## EH-Yeon

Thanks for this post. wondering whether worth to change or upgrade from sm3 to westone 4


----------



## suman134

merry christmas guys , have a beautiful time with friends and family .
 hey man joker , thanks man , for these beautiful reviews , and we are still hungry for more !!
 and im gona repeat , have you been exposed to xba-h3/h1 , or do you have any plans for these phones .


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks everyone, and Merry Christmas! All the best wishes to you and yours!
  


heliuscc said:


> Thanks joker!


 
  


dezane222 said:


> thanks a lot joker


 
  


fastandclean said:


> Joker you are the best !


 
  


gilly87 said:


> We love joker!


 
  


lin0003 said:


> Merry Christmas everyone and of course, special thanks to Joker!


 
  




  


sludig said:


> Excellent SD-2 and SD-3 reviews, like all the other ones.
> 
> What of this iems do you think has a LCD-2 sound signature? I think maybe SD-3, but SD-2 has more mids...


 
  
 Normally I recommend the Shure SE535 and Sony MDR-7550. However, I now think the SD-2 is an excellent option as well. Signature-wise it's a better match for the LCD-2 than the SD-3, which has fantastic bass impact but not really an "enhanced" low end. 
  
 Keep in mind that the LCD-2 will definitely have an advantage in bass "feel" - rumble and impact and all that - because it can move lots more air. To get that from an IEM you would need a significantly bassier one, like an SD-3. Of course then you are sacrificing some of the overall balance and poise of the SD-2 (and LCD-2). Point is, you'll always get more tactile bass from an LCD-2 than an IEM with similar tuning but if you compensate with a more bass-heavy IEM you'll probably have to sacrifice other things. 
  

  


vinniepaz said:


> Hello Joker,congratulations for this post and thank you for your help,I cameform  a Klipsch S4,and I listen to hip hop,Can you sayto me a upgrade for the Klipsch  S4,or whit a similar sound betwen 50-100$?thank you.If you give me 3 or 4 references better.What sound signature is Klipsch S4?


 
  
 The S4 is pretty v-shaped - it has enhanced bass and treble. If you don't think you could do with less bass, a good alternative would be the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition or id America Spark, or maybe the Audio-Technica CKM500. The CKM500 sounds a little different but has very good audio quality overall.
  
 If you can live with somewhat less bass quantity, you can get better sound quality with something like the VSonic VSD1 - better accuracy, a more neutral tone, etc. 
  
  


stormmilk said:


> An extraordinary review like no other! Please test the new sony xba h3 too.


 
  
 Thanks! No plans to review the Sony hybrids at this time, but maybe next year.
  


eh-yeon said:


> Thanks for this post. wondering whether worth to change or upgrade from sm3 to westone 4


 
  
 Not really, unless the SM3 is too warm/thick for you.
  


suman134 said:


> merry christmas guys , have a beautiful time with friends and family .
> hey man joker , thanks man , for these beautiful reviews , and we are still hungry for more !!
> and im gona repeat , have you been exposed to xba-h3/h1 , or do you have any plans for these phones .


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 I have never been able to get in touch with Sony so the H1/H3 will be left to chance. Right now I don't have either but I won't rule them out.


----------



## drm870

Joker,
  
 I noticed you recommended the RHA MA-750 in InnerFidelity's Holiday Gift Guide. It sounds like it would fit into the "Warm & Smooth" sound signature area described on The Headphone List. That said, I was wondering how it compares to the Yamaha EPH-100. Any input?
  
 Also, Merry Christmas!


----------



## Amitl

thanks for always being so helpful Joker


----------



## mannkind246

Hi |Joker|, 

Among the DN-1000, SD-2 and SD-3:

1) Which one has the micro details/details which is very close to DBA02-MKII?

2) Which one has the best 3D imaging and the widest sounds stage?

3) Which one has the best separation for vocal and instrument?

4) Which one has the best "QUALITY" (not "QUANTITY" ) bass that punchy, fast, deep and extended?

Thanks again.


----------



## VinniePaz

Cita: 





> Iniciado porción  *VinniePaz*
> 
> 
> Hola Joker, felicidades porción Este mensaje y gracias Por Tu assistance, cameform sin Klipsch S4, y me Escuchan hip hop, el usted me Florerias sayto Una ACTUALIZACIÓN párrafo el Klipsch S4 o sonido sin pizca similares Transcurrirá 50-100 $? Agradecimiento you.If me dan 3 o 4 referencias better.What firma de sonido es Klipsch S4?


 
  
 El S4 es Bastante en forma de V -. Tumbas y agudos sí ha Mejorado  Si USTED no cree Que USTED PODRIA HACER estafa Menos bajo, Una buena alternativa seria la VSonic GR02 Bass Edición o identificacion Spark Latina, o Tal Vez el Audio-Technica CKM500 .  El CKM500 SUENA DIFERENTE Poco ONU, Pero Tiene Muy buena calidad de audio en general.
  
 Si Puedes Vivir con algoritmos Menos De La CANTIDAD De tumbas, Florerias Obtener Mejor Calidad de sonido estafa algoritmo de como el VSonic VSD1 - Precisión alcalde una, tono Un Mas neutral, etc 
  
  
 Thanks a lot Joker,what do you think about JVC FX80 is similar to Klipsch S4 signature?,and for  have  a cheap replace what you think about Dunu Trident and rha 350? .If there arent similars to  my sound cand you recomend me a cheap ones betwen 30-60?.Thanks  and sorry for my English I am spanish,you are great!
 ​


----------



## Sludig

> Normally I recommend the Shure SE535 and Sony MDR-7550. However, I now think the SD-2 is an excellent option as well. Signature-wise it's a better match for the LCD-2 than the SD-3, which has fantastic bass impact but not really an "enhanced" low end.
> 
> Keep in mind that the LCD-2 will definitely have an advantage in bass "feel" - rumble and impact and all that - because it can move lots more air. To get that from an IEM you would need a significantly bassier one, like an SD-3. Of course then you are sacrificing some of the overall balance and poise of the SD-2 (and LCD-2). Point is, you'll always get more tactile bass from an LCD-2 than an IEM with similar tuning but if you compensate with a more bass-heavy IEM you'll probably have to sacrifice other things.


 
  
 Thanks a lot for your answer ljokerl. Certainly is very difficult to find an IEM like LCD-2, but these ones you say can be good. SD-2 seem an excellent option.
  
 And Merry Christmas!!!


----------



## 177261

I found a nice deal on the Logitech UE900. Currently owning the Shure SE535. Is the Logitechs better than the SE535 sound quality wise? I am after as much neutral sound as possible. Thanks!


----------



## heliuscc

Where did you find a deal on the ue900??


----------



## MusicalChillies

Glad the SD2 and SD3 have more exposure now. The SD3 I can`t fault, just keeps improving, stunning and never sibilant as per your findings. Good stuff Joker.


----------



## dezane222

joker
 how do you compare bass quality and especially quality beetween gr07be and monoprice 8320 (i know it's silly to compare them, but it's only my iem i have)?
 which has bigger impact and more powerfull?


----------



## dezane222

dezane222 said:


> joker
> how do you compare bass quality and especially quality beetween gr07be and monoprice 8320 (i know it's silly to compare them, but it's only my iem i have)?
> which has bigger impact and more powerfull?


 

 and one more thing, do you thing gr07be has the balance sound of monoprice?


----------



## Artem

dezane222 said:


> and one more thing, do you thing gr07be has the balance sound of monoprice?


 
 The bass edition has a slight bass emphasis. If you are looking for a balance signature, then i think you should look at the Mk2 version.


----------



## Deviltooth

dezane222 said:


> and one more thing, do you thing gr07be has the balance sound of monoprice?


 
 Wow.  The Monoprice is crap.  Heavily hyped crap and definitely among the IEMs I regret buying (regardless of it's tiny price tag).  Any version of the GR07 will be an enormous step up in quality.


----------



## ljokerl

drm870 said:


> Joker,
> 
> I noticed you recommended the RHA MA-750 in InnerFidelity's Holiday Gift Guide. It sounds like it would fit into the "Warm & Smooth" sound signature area described on The Headphone List. That said, I was wondering how it compares to the Yamaha EPH-100. Any input?
> 
> Also, Merry Christmas!


 
  
 It does! I think the MA-750 is great for that type of sound. So far I'd say it's at least on-par with the EPH-100 in overall sound quality with slightly diminished bass quantity (not a bad thing, the EPH-100 has tons) and maybe a little less upper midrange presence. 
  


amitl said:


> thanks for always being so helpful Joker


 
  






mannkind246 said:


> Hi |Joker|,
> 
> Among the DN-1000, SD-2 and SD-3:
> 
> ...


 
  
 I feel like you should be more concerned with the fact that the DN-1000, StageDivers, and DBA-02 mkII have completely different sound signatures. Imaging and separation are just details - these IEMs sound nothing alike on the most basic level and choosing between them based on which has the best detail level is just strange.
  
 Anyway, the SD-2 and SD-3 are way too different from the DBA-02 MKII. I think the DN-1000 is closer to what you want (a DBA-02 with a lot more bass but no drop in clarity/detail/separation except where the bass is too big to keep up with the DBA-02).
  


vinniepaz said:


> El S4 es Bastante en forma de V -. Tumbas y agudos sí ha Mejorado  Si USTED no cree Que USTED PODRIA HACER estafa Menos bajo, Una buena alternativa seria la VSonic GR02 Bass Edición o identificacion Spark Latina, o Tal Vez el Audio-Technica CKM500 .  El CKM500 SUENA DIFERENTE Poco ONU, Pero Tiene Muy buena calidad de audio en general.
> 
> Si Puedes Vivir con algoritmos Menos De La CANTIDAD De tumbas, Florerias Obtener Mejor Calidad de sonido estafa algoritmo de como el VSonic VSD1 - Precisión alcalde una, tono Un Mas neutral, etc
> 
> ...


 
  
 The FXD80 has a different type of sound than the Klipsch - not so much bass impact and more emphasis on upper mids and the top half of the frequency spectrum in general. The Trident and MA-350 don't have the v-shaped signature of the S4.
  
  Quote:


sludig said:


> Thanks a lot for your answer ljokerl. Certainly is very difficult to find an IEM like LCD-2, but these ones you say can be good. SD-2 seem an excellent option.
> 
> And Merry Christmas!!!


 
  
 Happy holidays!
  


christianh said:


> I found a nice deal on the Logitech UE900. Currently owning the Shure SE535. Is the Logitechs better than the SE535 sound quality wise? I am after as much neutral sound as possible. Thanks!


 
  
 If you find the SE535 to be lacking a bit of treble presence and extension, then the UE900 would be better. It's also less mid-focused overall. Otherwise it doesn't really have any strong advantages over the Shures.
  


musicalchillies said:


> Glad the SD2 and SD3 have more exposure now. The SD3 I can`t fault, just keeps improving, stunning and never sibilant as per your findings. Good stuff Joker.


 
  
 They are very nice earphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
  


dezane222 said:


> joker
> how do you compare bass quality and especially quality beetween gr07be and monoprice 8320 (i know it's silly to compare them, but it's only my iem i have)?
> which has bigger impact and more powerfull?


 
  
 The GR07BE has quite a lot more bass and is more impactful and  powerful. The Monoprice is more mid-centric with less emphasis on bass and treble.


----------



## ljokerl

Got an email this morning for the Etymotic MC2 at $19.99 + shipping from amazon. Very good deal for an MC5 variant, cheaper even than the Ety-Kids.
  
 http://theheadphonelist.com/deal-alert-etymotic-research-mc2-19-99shipping-amazon/


----------



## Pastapipo

Thanks for the notice Joker, much appreciated! 
 I think this is a US only deal by the way. They don't ship to The Netherlands. 
 But I'll keep my eyes on your site for other deals.


----------



## 0b095

Hello guys, I have been trying to search this forum for a while, but I still could not decide what IEM to buy. Please help me out.
  
 I need microphone, and volume up/down buttons.
 I will use it with my nexus 5 and computer.
 My budget is up to $20.
 I live in Canada ON.
 I can buy it from any trusted and famous website that accepts paypal, although I prefer ebay.ca.
  
 Let me know if you need any other information.
 Thanks.


----------



## mannkind246

ljokerl said:


> I feel like you should be more concerned with the fact that the DN-1000, StageDivers, and DBA-02 mkII have completely different sound signatures. Imaging and separation are just details - these IEMs sound nothing alike on the most basic level and choosing between them based on which has the best detail level is just strange.
> 
> Anyway, the SD-2 and SD-3 are way too different from the DBA-02 MKII. I think the DN-1000 is closer to what you want (a DBA-02 with a lot more bass but no drop in clarity/detail/separation except where the bass is too big to keep up with the DBA-02).


 
 Thanks a lot |Joker| because your opinion will help me to decide which IEM to go for.


----------



## d marc0

Great review on the Stage Divers @|joker|; thank you!

I'm currently looking for a good reference signature universal with great natural sound/timbre. Should I consider the noble 4 and the SD-2 in my priority list? Which of the two is closest to natural sound?

Cheers!


----------



## eke2k6

d marc0 said:


> Great review on the Stage Divers @|joker|; thank you!
> 
> I'm currently looking for a good reference signature universal with great natural sound/timbre. Should I consider the noble 4 and the SD-2 in my priority list? Which of the two is closest to natural sound?
> 
> Cheers!


 
  
  
 If I may, I'd recommend the Etymotic HF5. I think it's probably the best deal in audiophilia. IMO it's top tier sound at a true steal of a price. I say this because it produces notes with the refinement and effortlessness of summit-fi earphones (look at my profile to see what I've heard). It's also very much reference a reference signature.
  
 The downsides are this:
 -the proper insertion is deep enough to make you dizzy for the first few times. I imagine it's like losing one's anal virginity. You'll get used to it over time, and the sound you get is truly worth the initial discomfort. Plus, the isolation is ridiculous. I took it on a flight, and I only remembered I was on a plane because of the vibration of the seats. I couldn't hear the engine.
 -secondly, the bass drops off rapidly after 50Hz. Above that, it's huge and impactful when needed. It almost rivals my ASG-2 in impact and attack (but obviously not quantity). It's truly impressive bass. You can choose to boost the sub-bass if you please.
  
 IMO, it's one of those iems I think everyone should give a shot, along with the GR07.


----------



## d marc0

eke2k6 said:


> If I may, I'd recommend the Etymotic HF5. I think it's probably the best deal in audiophilia. IMO it's top tier sound at a true steal of a price. I say this because it produces notes with the refinement and effortlessness of summit-fi earphones (look at my profile to see what I've heard). It's also very much reference a reference signature.
> 
> The downsides are this:
> -the proper insertion is deep enough to make you dizzy for the first few times. I imagine it's like losing one's anal virginity. You'll get used to it over time, and the sound you get is truly worth the initial discomfort. Plus, the isolation is ridiculous. I took it on a flight, and I only remembered I was on a plane because of the vibration of the seats. I couldn't hear the engine.
> ...


 
  
 That is quite interesting. I'll read about them... thanks!


----------



## Reomero

Hi Joker, can you (or someone else) who has heard both the Vsonic GR07 (mk.1) and Dunu DN-1000, give a brief comparison of both IEMs?


----------



## tan1415

Hi joker,

I don't like trebly sybilance. My iems now are the wooduo and qjays. Love them.
But saw the w3 amazon deal. 160$. Including shipping turns out only 160€. Great deal. 

But after reading your post have my doubts. Not sure if w3 is for me .scared of its highs. What do you think.?

For example the dt 770 is a bit to much for me.


----------



## 0b095

My post is above please help me out


----------



## modulor

0b095 said:


> Hello guys, I have been trying to search this forum for a while, but I still could not decide what IEM to buy. Please help me out.
> 
> I need microphone, and volume up/down buttons.
> I will use it with my nexus 5 and computer.
> ...


 
 First off, do you have any sound signature preferences?  Like it bassy, or neutral, or brighter sounding for example?
  
 You may be able to get an LG Quadbeat 1 or 2 for around that price from Ebay (more likely the Quadbeat 1) but beyond that, I can't think of much that is good that also includes a remote.  I do remember someone mentioning the Etymotic MC2 was on sale or going for around $20 recently and that has a remote...sounds like a steal to me.  Etys are typically deep insert though, so that is something to consider.  There's also the Vsonic GR02 Bass as sometimes those can be found sub $30, but I'm not sure about availability in Canada.  Even though it doesn't have a remote/mic, that is one of the better deals out there purely in terms of sound quality.  One of the Quadbeats will most likely suit your requirements though.


----------



## 0b095

modulor said:


> First off, do you have any sound signature preferences?  Like it bassy, or neutral, or brighter sounding for example?
> 
> You may be able to get an LG Quadbeat 1 or 2 for around that price from Ebay (more likely the Quadbeat 1) but beyond that, I can't think of much that is good that also includes a remote.  I do remember someone mentioning the Etymotic MC2 was on sale or going for around $20 recently and that has a remote...sounds like a steal to me.  Etys are typically deep insert though, so that is something to consider.  There's also the Vsonic GR02 Bass as sometimes those can be found sub $30, but I'm not sure about availability in Canada.  Even though it doesn't have a remote/mic, that is one of the better deals out there purely in terms of sound quality.  One of the Quadbeats will most likely suit your requirements though.


 
 I do not really have any sound signature preferences, but I can say; clean and neutral voice. I kind of except to buy something on sale... I'll check out quadbeats... thanks a lot.
  
 guys let me know if you have any other suggestions.


----------



## blast0id

I need some help making a decision. I want to spend 125-150 (180 absolute tops) 

I listen mostly to high quality (for podcasts) talk radio style internet podcasts. when I'm not listening to that stuff I really like electronic dance music, and if it matters my fav. sub-genre's are: drum-n-bass, acid jazz, acid house/techno, broken beat, electro (both "straightbeat" and "breakbeat" styles), electro-house and fidget styles. I also like Jazz, Blues and Hip-Hop, with some occasional metal, hard-rock type stuff... 

*edit:* I like bass, but would prefer clarity/brightness over muddiness. I wear my earbuds (currently nuforce NE600X) for as long as 12hrs sometimes, and honestly the nuforce's are a bit heavy and my ears are a little sore after a long day. So if there is something lighter but will be a substantial upgrade to the nuforce's I'd be ecstatic!

I would mostly be listening to stuff through a blue-ant ribbon bluetooth 4.0 device (which supports the aptx profile). but my phone is an HTC One.

*further edit:* I forgot to stipulate, it must also be available on Amazon (preferrably prime, but that's not the deal breaker). I have considered GR07BE/GR07mkII, JVC HA-FXZ100 and phiaton ps 210 bluetooth headset, my only hangup with the phiaton's set is it's bluetooth 3.0 not 4.0, but does still support aptx and has a neat pass through so you can use it directly bypassing the bluetooth portion...


----------



## VinniePaz

HiJoker,thank you very much for answering.I have one more question ,what kind of sound signature or type  thinks is the best  forhiphop?, I say it because it's almost 90 percent of what I hear, j, If you could put some example of iem sound signature you recommend?I.bough tin the past few Senheisser Ie8 because in Spain around me everyone was talking of his bass,but not nothing like me,veryboring for me,I dont want to fall into error  with the purchaseas because my economic situation is not good.Thans a lot,and sorry for my english.


----------



## ljokerl

pastapipo said:


> Thanks for the notice Joker, much appreciated!
> I think this is a US only deal by the way. They don't ship to The Netherlands.
> But I'll keep my eyes on your site for other deals.


 
  
 Ah, sorry – I guess because this deal is by 3rd party seller it would be US only.
  


0b095 said:


> Hello guys, I have been trying to search this forum for a while, but I still could not decide what IEM to buy. Please help me out.
> 
> I need microphone, and volume up/down buttons.
> I will use it with my nexus 5 and computer.
> ...


 
  
 Volume up/down buttons are usually meant for Apple/iOS devices. None of the ones I have work with the Nexus. You could either relax that requirement and get one of the many single-button headsets out there (like the Philips SHE3575, which should be in your budget) or try to find something with an analog volume slider, which works with all devices, like the Padacs Aksent 
  


d marc0 said:


> Great review on the Stage Divers @|joker|; thank you!
> 
> I'm currently looking for a good reference signature universal with great natural sound/timbre. Should I consider the noble 4 and the SD-2 in my priority list? Which of the two is closest to natural sound?
> 
> Cheers!


 
  
 I’ve only tried the Noble 4S. To me the SD-2 is a little darker than what I consider natural while the 4S is pretty spot-on (and more like the Etys eke mentioned).
  
 P.S. What is ‘neutral’ and ‘natural’ will always depend on who you ask. Check out the “discussion” here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors#comment-489901
  


eke2k6 said:


> IMO, it's one of those iems I think everyone should give a shot, along with the GR07.


 
  
 I fully agree, everyone should at least try an Ety. My first was the ER6i – not Etymotic’s best but it was enough to get me hooked.
  


reomero said:


> Hi Joker, can you (or someone else) who has heard both the Vsonic GR07 (mk.1) and Dunu DN-1000, give a brief comparison of both IEMs?


 
  
 Yeah, sure, here's a quick one:
  
 The DN1000 has more bass, especially deep bass. On the whole its sound signature is more v-shaped (more akin to the GR02 Bass Edition than any of my other VSonics). The GR07 is overall more balanced with less bass emphasis/more linear bass response and mids that are more in line with everything else. Due in part to the treble boost the DN1000 sounds a little clearer than the GR07 and, like the GR07, can be a little sibilant thanks to its treble emphasis. I think the DN1000 also has a slight advantage in soundstage depth/layering but need more listening to be sure.
  
  


tan1415 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> I don't like trebly sybilance. My iems now are the wooduo and qjays. Love them.
> But saw the w3 amazon deal. 160$. Including shipping turns out only 160€. Great deal.
> ...


 
  
 If you’re worried about sibilance I would honestly skip the W3. It might be a great deal at this price but if it’s not the right sound for you, it won’t matter how little you paid.
  
  


blast0id said:


> I need some help making a decision. I want to spend 125-150 (180 absolute tops)
> I listen mostly to high quality (for podcasts) talk radio style internet podcasts. when I'm not listening to that stuff I really like electronic dance music, and if it matters my fav. sub-genre's are: drum-n-bass, acid jazz, acid house/techno, broken beat, electro (both "straightbeat" and "breakbeat" styles), electro-house and fidget styles. I also like Jazz, Blues and Hip-Hop, with some occasional metal, hard-rock type stuff...
> *edit:* I like bass, but would prefer clarity/brightness over muddiness. I wear my earbuds (currently nuforce NE600X) for as long as 12hrs sometimes, and honestly the nuforce's are a bit heavy and my ears are a little sore after a long day. So if there is something lighter but will be a substantial upgrade to the nuforce's I'd be ecstatic!
> I would mostly be listening to stuff through a blue-ant ribbon bluetooth 4.0 device (which supports the aptx profile). but my phone is an HTC One.
> *further edit:* I forgot to stipulate, it must also be available on Amazon (preferrably prime, but that's not the deal breaker). I have considered GR07BE/GR07mkII, JVC HA-FXZ100 and phiaton ps 210 bluetooth headset, my only hangup with the phiaton's set is it's bluetooth 3.0 not 4.0, but does still support aptx and has a neat pass through so you can use it directly bypassing the bluetooth portion...


 
  
 If you're prioritizing comfort these are the sets that stand out to me in that price range, arranged (approximately) by bass boost amount from highest to lowest:
  
 RHA MA750 - The weight of the stainless steel housings is offset by the over-the-ear form factor, I've been consistently impressed with how comfortable these are despite their weight. Smooth sound with plenty of bass - no complaints there.
 Klipsch X10 - Enhanced-bass earphones with good clarity. Can be worn cable-up or down. A real standout in comfort even if it doesn't sound as good as the MA750 or GR07.
 GR07 BE - I've always found GR07s to be plenty comfortable. Has the most treble energy of the bunch here and good overall sound quality.
 SteelSeries Flux - least expensive of the bunch. Has a punchy, warm sound and a slim, lightweight form factor
 Phonak 012 - one of the most comfortable earphones I've tried. Over-the-ear fit and extremely lightweight. Very decent bass for a BA earphone.
  
  


vinniepaz said:


> HiJoker,thank you very much for answering.I have one more question ,what kind of sound signature or type  thinks is the best  forhiphop?, I say it because it's almost 90 percent of what I hear, j, If you could put some example of iem sound signature you recommend?I.bough tin the past few Senheisser Ie8 because in Spain around me everyone was talking of his bass,but not nothing like me,veryboring for me,I dont want to fall into error  with the purchaseas because my economic situation is not good.Thans a lot,and sorry for my english.


 
  
 I can’t really tell you what type of sound _you_ will enjoy with hip-hop but you seem to gravitate towards a more v-shaped sound if you like the Klipsch S4. The IE8 is not really a great match for the S4 sound signature – it’s more laid back, warm, and smooth.


----------



## d marc0

Thank you @|joker| ! That's very helpful.


----------



## tan1415

Thanks joker.


----------



## 0b095

@ljokerl
 thanks, I'll get something with just a mic feature then, most likely philips she3575, btw is there any website you suggest me to buy it from? It's sold for $5  to $20 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 also, those are the ones I can find in Walmart, best buy, future shop etc. should I get one of these or for instance philips she3575 is better than all of these? 
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8003876
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8013369
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8003874
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8013072
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8004387
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8004358
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8003873
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8009758
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8002534
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8004384
http://www.thesource.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&catalog=Online&category=Earbud+Headphones&product=8003871
  
 thank you.


----------



## Grayson73

Joker,
  
 I'd like your opinion on an IEM upgrade for me.  To give you an idea of the sound I'm looking for, here are some that I have and my impressions of them.
  
*IEM comparison*
 
TDK BA200 (stock comply tips).
VSonic GR07 MK2 (largest stock purple tips)
Monster Gratitude (Meelectronics double flanged tips)
Zero Audio Carbo Tenore (Meelectronics double flanged tips)
Zero Audio Carbo Basso (Meelectronics double flanged tips)
HiFiman RE400 (Meelectronics double flanged tips)
 
Music preferences:  Rock and Pop.  
 
I would rank them as following:  Tenore > BA200 > Gratitude > GR07 MK2 > Basso > RE400.  Shocking, but you'll see why.
 
Treble:  Gratitude and GR07 MK2 sound the brightest, then Tenore, then Basso, then BA200.  I think the RE400 is equal to the Gratitude/GR07 MK2 or Tenore,  but don't recall exactly.  I found that the Gratitude was tuned too high (e.g. snare drums sound too bright).  BA200 treble is too smooth and not enough quantity.  Tenore is my favorite in this category because they aren't as smooth as BA200 and not as harsh as Gratitude/GR07 MK2.
 
Mids:   For vocals, the best are Tenore and BA200.  Female vocals sound like they are in the room singing to you and are so buttery; gives me chills.  I give a slight edge to Tenore because they sound more airy.  Gratitudes are clear but singer sounds farther away.
 
Bass:  My favorite in this category is the Gratitude.  In terms of quantity, Basso > Gratitude > Tenore > BA200=GR07 MK2 > RE400.  However, I found the Basso to have too much bass and not as good mids.  Gratitude has the best quality bass.  For my tastes, Gratitude and Tenore have the quantity that I desire.  Tenore bass hits hard enough and is punchy.  Bassos have too much and BA200, GR07 MK2, and RE400 have too little.
 
Detail:  GR07 MK2 and Gratitude have the most detail (and maybe RE400), then Tenore and Basso then BA200.
 
Efficiency:  GR07 MK2 is the most efficient, then Gratitude, BA200, Tenore/Basso.  Don't have the RE400 any longer to compare.
 
My favorite is the Tenore because they sound the most natural and true to life and they have the combination and quantity of bass/mid/treble that I desire.  Female vocals give me chills and have the most texture.  Next would be BA200 (smooth and great mids) and Gratitude (big and energetic).  Basso has too much bass and GR07 MK2 and RE400 had too little bass and sounded a little boring.
 
 
 *Improvements to my favorite 4 that I would love to find*
 
*Tenore*: Would like slightly darker tuning (but not as dark as BA200), and bass quality of the Gratitude
*BA200:  *Would like more bass, more treble extension.
*Gratitude*:  Love the bass quantity and quality, detail, and treble extension.  Wish they were tuned darker so that they would sound more natural and true to life.  Snare drums too bright sounding.
*GR07 MK2*:  Would like more bass (maybe I'd like the Bass Edition?)

 
Any suggestions on what would fit the sound sig I'm looking for?  They need to have incredible vocals, have life-like tuning, quality bass and decent quantity bass, and detailed, but slightly smooth treble.
 
M200, MA750, S2, IM70?


----------



## Solarium

Dear Joker,

I was wondering if you can help me decide on which IEM's to get, as an upgrade for my Klipsch S4i. I'm looking for the best bang for the buck IEM's with the following preferences (ranked in order of ones I most value to least):

1. Comfort - I have narrow ear canals and I want to wear these without knowing they're there, and if possible no ear fatigue for long listening periods. I also want them to be as light as possible.

2. Isolation - I will use these in subway commutes and long plane rides, I want to hear as less outside noise as possible.

3. Sound Quality - I listen mostly to electronic music and sometimes rock, and want to emphasize on having a good bass quality and quantity. Mids and treble are important but less so than bass. Good speed will be nice too. For these IEM's usage, I tend to focus less on neutrality and transparency.

4. Durability / Build Quality - I will do a lot of travel with these, and will likely yank out the headphone from my ears a few times. I don't want headphones that are so delicate that the cable will be disconnected from the earpiece if I do so. At the same time, I don't want excessive durability with unnecessary added weight. I do want them as light as possible.


Looking at this thread http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-307-iems-compared-inear-stagediver-2-stagediver-3-added-12-23-13-p-829 so far I've came up with only:

1. Klipsch X10 ($110 @ ebay) 
2. Westone 3 ($160 @ amazon) 
3. VSonic GR07 Bass Edition ($130 @ lendmeurears)
4. Yamaha EPH-100SL ($140 @ amazon)

that matches my preferences. I prefer to stay under $150 unless there's something that's significantly better for the price.


----------



## nupersatural

Hello oh almighty IEM guru Joker. For the third time I'm here to seek guidance with my next purchase.
 I've had EPH-100 since august and I just LOVE them. Coming from FXT-90 which I didn't like even near as much, they are just exactly what I was looking for. However my addiction to music has lead me to yet another purchase. Now I'm going into the 200$+ zone and I am looking for recommendations.
 Which IEM in your opinion would be the closest to an "upgraded yamahas"? I just love everything about them and I want all that but more. For music preferences, I'm mostly a metal and EDM type of listener. I'm willing to spend as much as 350$ on them, and I'm willing to go with custom monitors as well.
 THANK YOU!!!!
  
  
 EDIT: Looking at your OP, I'm reaaaally attracted to the *Custom Art Music One. *They have everything I want basically. How do they compare to the yamahas sound wise? Mostly interested in the bass since I just LOVE the bass on the EPH-100 and I'm pretty sure they trump the yams in every other aspect.
  
 EDIT2: Ok so I just found out about the Custom Art Music Two arriving in january, they are supposedly an upgraded version to the Music Ones. The preorder price for them is cheaper than the official one so its, again, tempting as hell to just preorder them now and be done with it. Do you think there's a high chance I'll not like the sound of them at all? Or are the yamahas not THAT far off which would assure me a lot.


----------



## blast0id

ljokerl said:


> If you're prioritizing comfort these are the sets that stand out to me in that price range, arranged (approximately) by bass boost amount from highest to lowest:
> RHA MA750 - The weight of the stainless steel housings is offset by the over-the-ear form factor, I've been consistently impressed with how comfortable these are despite their weight. Smooth sound with plenty of bass - no complaints there.
> Klipsch X10 - Enhanced-bass earphones with good clarity. Can be worn cable-up or down. A real standout in comfort even if it doesn't sound as good as the MA750 or GR07.
> GR07 BE - I've always found GR07s to be plenty comfortable. Has the most treble energy of the bunch here and good overall sound quality.
> ...


 
 Is the only reason you didn't mention the brainwavz b2 because of price? I found them on amazon for 129.95 (or so) and from reading your review in the first page, decided on those... I doubt I'll be disappointed, but if I am I guess I can always return and go for the GR07BE's ... thanks for your input though, much appreciated, I was just getting ancy and had to pull the trigger on something... it was almost the GR07BE's but when I saw the price on the B2's I couldn't resist...


----------



## meggerman

Im so lost with IEM's right now. Im new to the scene and was just about trigger ready for the RE400's but complaints about build quality and a hollow sound for some has swayed me a bit. The GR07 MKII seem to be 'not bad' but not the best, still great which is actually a real compliment given peoples differing tastes but is there something simular in sound or better for upto £200 / $260 ?
  
 I already have some Sennheiser HD-600's (with HD650 cable) but a recent foray into IEM's via some cheap Sony units has given me a new insight into how comfortable vs a large openback headphone they can be, i was listening in low-fi to my Sony's for hours with no head itch, heat or weight and i wont now go to full size again for hi-fi especially as the bass amount (not quality) is equal on these IEM's to a full size headphone ?!
  
 What IEM's can Match the HD-600 / HD650 for sub £200 or get close ? 
  
 I bow to your superior knowlage. I need light, comfortable and small hence the RE400's seemed perfect..


----------



## 0b095

Do these IEMs have mic ? 
http://www.jr.com/denon/pe/DNN_AHC360K/
http://www.jr.com/sennheiser/pe/SEN_CX215BZ/


----------



## ljokerl

d marc0 said:


> Thank you @|joker| ! That's very helpful.


 
  


tan1415 said:


> Thanks joker.


 




  


0b095 said:


> @ljokerl
> thanks, I'll get something with just a mic feature then, most likely philips she3575, btw is there any website you suggest me to buy it from? It's sold for $5  to $20
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Of those I’ve only tried the Skullcandy Smokin (best not mentioned on this forum) and the JVC FR201 (which are good if you like tons of bass but not as good as the SHE3575 overall). Probably doesn’t matter where you buy the Philips as long as you get warranty.
  


grayson73 said:


> Joker,
> 
> I'd like your opinion on an IEM upgrade for me.  To give you an idea of the sound I'm looking for, here are some that I have and my impressions of them.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don’t think I can be of much help here – I’ve only heard half of the headphones you use in your comparisons and half of the ones you’re considering (S2 and MA750). The GR07 BE has somewhat more bass than the GR07 but not tons more. It’s not what I would really consider a fun-sounding headphone still. The same goes for the S2 – it’s more “accurate” than “fun”. The MA750 is definitely different – very smooth and fluid, with plenty of bass and warm tone. This one might work for you, I think, but I haven’t heard your Carbos. The RHA doesn't have a whole lot of treble but it doesn't seem to lack extension. Still haven't finished my listening with it, though.
  


solarium said:


> Dear Joker,
> 
> I was wondering if you can help me decide on which IEM's to get, as an upgrade for my Klipsch S4i. I'm looking for the best bang for the buck IEM's with the following preferences (ranked in order of ones I most value to least):
> 
> ...


 
  
 I wouldn't recommend the EPH-100 or any other IEM with a nozzle-mounted microdriver if you have narrow ear canals. The X10 fits your requirements pretty well but it's not very durable in my experience. The GR07 has good but not great isolation. Out of those four it seems like the W3 would be your best bet.
  
 I also think the RHA MA750 might work well for you. It's not very light but the weight is offset but the molded ear hook bits. Isolation is surprisingly good - better than with the GR07 IMO. Build quality is outstanding. Sound is very competent, at least on-par with the EPH-100.
  


nupersatural said:


> Hello oh almighty IEM guru Joker. For the third time I'm here to seek guidance with my next purchase.
> I've had EPH-100 since august and I just LOVE them. Coming from FXT-90 which I didn't like even near as much, they are just exactly what I was looking for. However my addiction to music has lead me to yet another purchase. Now I'm going into the 200$+ zone and I am looking for recommendations.
> Which IEM in your opinion would be the closest to an "upgraded yamahas"? I just love everything about them and I want all that but more. For music preferences, I'm mostly a metal and EDM type of listener. I'm willing to spend as much as 350$ on them, and I'm willing to go with custom monitors as well.
> THANK YOU!!!!
> ...


 
  
 The Music One is very different from the EPH-100 - much less bass slam and a lot more neutral-sounding. I don't think you will like it.
  
 I'm not at all familiar with the Music Two. You might want to just ask Custom Art how much bass the Music Two has - they should have a pretty good idea of how it compares to the current model. If its anything like the Music One, it probably won't be for you. 
  
 The 1964-V3 has the most bass out of all my customs and is the only sub-$600 that I think can compete with the Yamahas in bass quantity and slam but in terms of how the mids and treble are presented it's more reminiscent of the FXT90 than the EPH-100.
  


blast0id said:


> Is the only reason you didn't mention the brainwavz b2 because of price? I found them on amazon for 129.95 (or so) and from reading your review in the first page, decided on those... I doubt I'll be disappointed, but if I am I guess I can always return and go for the GR07BE's ... thanks for your input though, much appreciated, I was just getting ancy and had to pull the trigger on something... it was almost the GR07BE's but when I saw the price on the B2's I couldn't resist...


 
  
 I didn't mention the B2 because it probably doesn’t have enough bass for you based on your post.
  


meggerman said:


> Im so lost with IEM's right now. Im new to the scene and was just about trigger ready for the RE400's but complaints about build quality and a hollow sound for some has swayed me a bit. The GR07 MKII seem to be 'not bad' but not the best, still great which is actually a real compliment given peoples differing tastes but is there something simular in sound or better for upto £200 / $260 ?
> 
> I already have some Sennheiser HD-600's (with HD650 cable) but a recent foray into IEM's via some cheap Sony units has given me a new insight into how comfortable vs a large openback headphone they can be, i was listening in low-fi to my Sony's for hours with no head itch, heat or weight and i wont now go to full size again for hi-fi especially as the bass amount (not quality) is equal on these IEM's to a full size headphone ?!
> 
> ...


 

 I’d go with your gut and get the RE-400, or the BA200 from TDK for something a touch warmer (i.e. more HD650 than HD600). The GR07 does not remind me of the HD600/HD650, more the DT770 or DT880. 
  
 These won't have the slam of the big Sennheiser cans because they just can't move as much air. If that's important to you then you'll want a more bass-heavy IEM to compensate. However, if you can live with less tactile bass, the RE-400 or BA200 are pretty damn nice and very close to the Sennheisers in detail and overall refinement considering their price.


----------



## Solarium

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Sounds like a lot of others are recommending the W3, but you only graded its isolation and comfort both as a 3.5/5. Will it fit well with my narrow ear canals?
  
 I'm also interested in the MA750, it's only $130 at amazon even with the remote and mic, which are a huge plus for me. How do they compare to the W3 if I only care about comfort and isolation? The stainless steel construction sounds pretty durable, but heavy. At this point, as long as the sound quality is similar I don't mind subtle differences.


----------



## ljokerl

solarium said:


> Sounds like a lot of others are recommending the W3, but you only graded its isolation and comfort both as a 3.5/5. Will it fit well with my narrow ear canals?
> 
> I'm also interested in the MA750, it's only $130 at amazon even with the remote and mic, which are a huge plus for me. How do they compare to the W3 if I only care about comfort and isolation? The stainless steel construction sounds pretty durable, but heavy. At this point, as long as the sound quality is similar I don't mind subtle differences.


 
  
 The W3 is not problematic at all with narrow canals. My issue was that the tubby housings prevented a comfortable deep insertion to minimize sibilance and maximize isolation with my ears. I think the new W30 is better designed for this, at least based on my experience with the Westone Adv, but it's also a lot more than $160.
  
 The MA750 is heavier than the W3 but I've been genuinely surprised by its comfort. I expected that the non-angled nozzles would be a problem, as well as the weight, but the form-fitted cables work surprisingly well and the weight and design are not an issue. It's nearly as comfortable for me as the GR07. Isolation is a little better than with the GR07.


----------



## meggerman

ljokerl said:


> Of those I’ve only tried the Skullcandy Smokin (best not mentioned on this forum) and the JVC FR201 (which are good if you like tons of bass but not as good as the SHE3575 overall). Probably doesn’t matter where you buy the Philips as long as you get warranty.
> 
> 
> I don’t think I can be of much help here – I’ve only heard half of the headphones you use in your comparisons and half of the ones you’re considering (S2 and MA750). The GR07 BE has somewhat more bass than the GR07 but not tons more. It’s not what I would really consider a fun-sounding headphone still. The same goes for the S2 – it’s more “accurate” than “fun”. The MA750 is definitely different – very smooth and fluid, with plenty of bass and warm tone. This one might work for you, I think, but I haven’t heard your Carbos. The RHA doesn't have a whole lot of treble but it doesn't seem to lack extension. Still haven't finished my listening with it, though.
> ...


 
  
  
 Thanks for the reply. I do fear they miss some slam. Im not a 'bass head' but i do listen to IDM. Its more about vast swirling soundscapes and technical details for me than pure bass drive. Having said that I imagine i might play a few PC games on them from time to time ..
  
 what would be simulary neutral and transparent to the RE-400 but with a tiny bit more bass presence?


----------



## 991 Carrera 4S

Hi ljokerl, reading through your reviews since days. Absolutely fabulous work!
 Now seeking your advice for final decision making:
  
 What I have:
 - UE700 logitech-version (they were 50% off, got them from amazon germany for approx. $127 incl. shipping&tax; had no idea of dynamic drivers, BA, TWFK, sound signatures, ... at that time)
 - used with ts comply foams (not for sound, but for fitting concerns)
 - played a bit with equalizer presets (have no other IEMs for comparison) and seemed to like non-equalized most
  
 What I search for:
 - sound-upgrade and preferably better comfort
 - for listening at home with my Nokia Lumia 920
 - preferably a CIEM or at least custom-molded ear tips
 - price limit about $400 incl. shipping&tax
  
 Preferred sound signature:
 - especially important (in alphabetical order): definition, detail, imaging, presence, transparence
 - furthermore: analytical (for at-home-listening; don't know whether a most-analytic sound would be too much), forward
 - maybe also: bright, brilliant, natural, sparkling, tight
 - not: coloured (slightly at most), distant
  
 Possible issues:
 - small/narrow/strange ears/canals? (not sure, but the UE700 with comply foams are the first not tending to fall out of my ears ^^)
 - could be disappointed if the new (C)IEM is missing something compared to my UE700?
  
 Options in no particular order (non-custom-IEMs excl. (!) approx. $84 for custom-molded ear tips):
 - Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII (from amazon germany approx. $344 o_O incl. shipping&tax)
 - Etymotic Research ER-4S (from amazon uk approx. $297 incl. shipping&tax)
 - Brainwavz B2 (from amazon uk approx. $98 incl. shipping&tax)
 - j-phonic K2 SP (how/where to get?)
 - other non-custom IEMs available inside EU?
 - other non-custom IEMs available outside EU?
 - Custom Art Music One (approx. $291 incl. shipping&tax)
 - Custom Art Music Two (pre-order price approx. $374 incl. shipping&tax) (frequence response: Music One, Music Two; Music Two sound description by piotrus-g)
 - other custom-IEMs shipping from EU?
 - other custom-IEMs shipping from outside EU?
  
 Also considered InEar StageDiver 2, but they cost approx. $496 incl. shipping&tax + additional approx. $84 for custom-molded ear tips = approx. $580, so almost 50% above limit. Moreover, SD-2 with dual-armature 2-way design you have scored 9.3 in sound quality, whereas Custom Art Music One with single-armature 1-way only costs half the money and scored 9.2, and the upgraded Custom Art Music Two with dual-armature 1-way is on pre-order for only $374 incl. shipping&tax.
  
 Opinions on the aforementioned (C)IEMs regarding my requirements?
 Other recommendations?
 What would be a noticeable upgrade worth the money?
  
 Many thanks in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

meggerman said:


> Thanks for the reply. I do fear they miss some slam. Im not a 'bass head' but i do listen to IDM. Its more about vast swirling soundscapes and technical details for me than pure bass drive. Having said that I imagine i might play a few PC games on them from time to time ..
> 
> what would be simulary neutral and transparent to the RE-400 but with a tiny bit more bass presence?


 
  
 Take a look at the BA200 from TDK. It has slightly more bass presence than the RE-400 and should be in your budget at $150 or so.   
  


991 carrera 4s said:


> Hi ljokerl, reading through your reviews since days. Absolutely fabulous work!
> Now seeking your advice for final decision making:
> 
> What I have:
> ...


 

 Wow, at those prices ($350 for a DBA-02??) it really seems like the Music One is your best bet for the following reasons -
 1. It's really hard to upgrade from the UE700 in comfort without going custom, period
 2. It ticks most of your boxes, at least as much as an IEM in your price range can
 3. It seems like with that you're not getting a hugely worse price than if you were located in the US or Asia
 4. No need to invest an extra $80+ in custom tips
  
 Things to consider
 1. The Music One is less bright than the UE700. If you're used to the UE700's treble it may take a little bit of time to get used to having less "sparkle" but I still think the Music One sounds more natural overall
 2. The Music One is not clearer than the UE700, in part because it is not as bright
 3. Not sure about the audio of the Lumia 920 but a lot of the (android) smartphones I've tried don't sound great with BA earphones. I would expect the UE700 to be more sensitive to this than the Music One, though, so it seems like you're okay there.
  
 From Peter's description the Music Two sounds awesome as well but of course I can't really have an opinion on it based on just graphs.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Take a look at the BA200 from TDK. It has slightly more bass presence than the RE-400 and should be in your budget at $150 or so.




Do you finally have the BA200 in your queue?


----------



## Solarium

ljokerl said:


> The W3 is not problematic at all with narrow canals. My issue was that the tubby housings prevented a comfortable deep insertion to minimize sibilance and maximize isolation with my ears. I think the new W30 is better designed for this, at least based on my experience with the Westone Adv, but it's also a lot more than $160.
> 
> The MA750 is heavier than the W3 but I've been genuinely surprised by its comfort. I expected that the non-angled nozzles would be a problem, as well as the weight, but the form-fitted cables work surprisingly well and the weight and design are not an issue. It's nearly as comfortable for me as the GR07. Isolation is a little better than with the GR07.




The MA750's form fitted cables makes me wonder if it's going to be a pain storing them. What if you bend the form fitted cables, are they going to break? The price of MA750 makes me wonder what did they leave out making this stuff, compared to the W3 what would you say the MA750 lack?

I'm also very interested in the GR07-BE's sound. It sounds like it has the best sound out of the bunch and the only thing it lacks is isolation. How much more isolation does the W3 or MA750 provide over the GR07?


----------



## ljokerl

Short impressions one the TDK BA200, Brainwavz R3, Fidue A63, and Fidue A81. Reposted from http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-thoughts-tdk-ba200-brainwavz-r3-fidue-a63-a81-ear-earphones/ .
  


> Below are a few thoughts on a couple of my new IEMs. These are either noteworthy sets that are not near the top of my queue yet or IEMs that I’ve listened to but don’t plan to review at all for one reason or another. These notes are based on brief listening impressions done over the course of a few evenings.
> 
> *TDK BA200 ($150)*
> 
> ...


 
 



vwinter said:


> Do you finally have the BA200 in your queue?


 
  
 Yep 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  


solarium said:


> The MA750's form fitted cables makes me wonder if it's going to be a pain storing them. What if you bend the form fitted cables, are they going to break? The price of MA750 makes me wonder what did they leave out making this stuff, compared to the W3 what would you say the MA750 lack?
> 
> I'm also very interested in the GR07-BE's sound. It sounds like it has the best sound out of the bunch and the only thing it lacks is isolation. How much more isolation does the W3 or MA750 provide over the GR07?


  
 The MA750 comes with a really spacious case but I store them in a standard clamshell. The wire hasn't been a problem.
  
 I don't know how to quantify isolation other than to say the W3 and MA750 isolate a little better than the GR07. It's noticeable, but it won't make a huge difference in day to day use. 
  
 There's nothing wrong with the pricing on the MA750. The W3 uses balanced armatures which are a lot more expensive than dynamic drivers but there are dynamic-driver earphones that cost more than the W3. It's really up to the manufacturer what price tag to put on an earphone and it's up to us, the consumers, to figure out if that price is worth paying.


----------



## Solarium

ljokerl said:


> The MA750 comes with a really spacious case but I store them in a standard clamshell. The wire hasn't been a problem.
> 
> I don't know how to quantify isolation other than to say the W3 and MA750 isolate a little better than the GR07. It's noticeable, but it won't make a huge difference in day to day use.
> 
> There's nothing wrong with the pricing on the MA750. The W3 uses balanced armatures which are a lot more expensive than dynamic drivers but there are dynamic-driver earphones that cost more than the W3. It's really up to the manufacturer what price tag to put on an earphone and it's up to us, the consumers, to figure out if that price is worth paying.


 
 I'm just going to buy all 4 headphones (W3, X10, MA750i, and GR07-BE) from amazon to test them out. Since I have prime anyway I'll just return all but the one I want the most. It's difficult to judge anyway unless I try them all out myself 
  
 BTW, any aftermarket tips that I should absolutely include to really get the most out of those IEM's? Like without them, the listening experience would be completely different.


----------



## lamnidae

Hey Joker,
  
 I'm new around here, & similarly a complete noob when it comes to the wonderful world of audiophillia - but having read through this review thread extensively along with your other links whilst lurking for the past couple of weeks - I think it's safe to say that you are one of the 'benchmark authorities' to seek advice from regarding IEMs due to the sheer expanse of the market that you seem to have sampled & experienced first hand.
  
 So I was hoping that you might be able to help me out with my current situation. This was my original thread that I posted outlining what my dilemma was in fairly thorough & extensive detail (explaining my history, musical preferences, sources to be utilised, ideal sound signature, shortlist, thoughts so far, etc.): http://www.head-fi.org/t/696783/best-sub-600-iems-for-metalcore-melodic-hardcore-post-hardcore-melodic-death-metal-technical-death-metal-pop-punk-alternative-rock-guitar-centric-music-caution-massive-essay-ahead
  
 But if that's a bit too much to get through - basically I've finally decided that it's the right time to upgrade my old Shure SE210s & really dive headfirst into a genuine audiophile-grade portable listening equipment - the real issue being that there is just such a range of options & unfortunately my location means that I have no practical way of testing any of them out for myself first hand prior to purchase. Which is why I have joined this site & posted in the hope that some of the many knowledgable & experienced users like yourself will be able to provide me with some much needed guidance & advice so that I can make the right decision since I'm potentially spending more than half a grand on these.
  
 Anyway, I will attempt to summarise the most imporant parts of the thread that I posted.
  
  
 I'm looking for a pair of sub-$600 IEMs that are going to bring the best out from well-produced metalcore/melodic hardcore/post-hardcore/technical death metal/pop punk & other genres with a distinct focus & emphasis on the melodic & technical aspects of the guitar work in particular.
  
 Here are some downloadable examples in 320kbps as a reference to the range of stuff that I want them to excel at portraying if that helps at all:
  
 - Erra - Spirits Away - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/29727834/file.html
 - Erra - Alpha Seed - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/18064516/file.html
 - Funeral for a Friend - All The Rage - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/9918121/file.html
 - Funeral for a Friend - Roses For The Dead - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/38585131/file.html
 - The Story So Far - The Glass - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/82056500/file.html
 - Unearth - Arise The War Cry - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/73347622/file.html
 - August Burns Red - Salt & Light - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/52058574/file.html
 - Sylosis - Where The Sky Ends - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/44893918/file.html
 - Sylosis - After Lifeless Years - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/18534370/file.html
 - This or the Apocalypse - Hard Branch To Snap - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/39239113/file.html
 - Counterparts - The Constant - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/62133368/file.html
 - Corelia - The Sound Of Glaciers Moving - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/26319914/file.html
 - Underoath - Reinventing Your Exit - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/92693435/file.html
 - Underoath - Writing On The Walls - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/47012111/file.html
 - Saosin - Collapse - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/31536920/file.html
 - Darkest Hour - A Paradox With Flies - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/90234818/file.html
 - Killswitch Engage - Rose Of Sharyn - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/63955287/file.html
 - All That Remains - Six - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/85921316/file.html
 - The Faceless - Leica - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/39400742/file.html
 - Decrepit Birth - Diminishing Between Worlds - http://www35.zippyshare.com/v/453618/file.html
  
  
 The short of it is - I want control & composure as a bit of finesse is important to me - but ultimately a fairly expansive & lush sound with plenty of articulate detail & dynamic impact that's going to enhance my overall listening experience & allow me to immerse myself in the music & it's inherent intricacies.
  
 Being a guitarist myself, my main focus is on the guitars & particularly their tone & note definition, as well as the aggression, drive & impact of the drums. Vocals, both harsh & clean, are also important to me & should have plenty of prescence; but never at the obtuse expense of the guitars' coherence. I guess I'm ideally looking for a pair of IEMs that possess a certain poise & balance to provide an accurate, appealing, organic soundscape full of virility & texture with a sense of depth & intensity - but without sacrificing the clarity & instrument separation that is so vital to the kind of music that I listen to & my own personal tastes.
  
  
 Low-end: Not really a basshead in terms of sheer power & quantity, but needs to be relatively deep - & as responsive, tight & punchy as possible, the kind that really hits you - but without any noticeable flubbiness/boominess.
  
 Mids: I would prefer them to be slightly more prominent, certainly not significantly scooped, & rich in detail - but simultaneously quite smooth, natural & unobtrusive with good balance between upper/lower ends of the spectrum. No abrasive grainy 'ice pick' kind of phenomenons - but at the same time I don't want them to be veiled or muddy.
  
 Highs: I do like my treble, so ideally it should be quite extended in range with plenty of sparkle & clarity to provide a bit of a distinctive edge to guitars & clean vocals & a nice shimmer to cymbals - somewhat bright, but short of entering sibilance-inducing territory.
  
  
 I realise what I have described above may not be entirely possible within my financial limitations - but if you could provide me with anything that at least satisfies the majority of the criteria or is some sort of compromise between the characteristics, that would be absolutely wonderful.
  
 True luxury high-end IEMs such as the Translucent 1Plus2, Unique Melody Miracle & JH-13/JH-16 seem as though they'd be pretty much exactly what I'm looking for judging from the reviews I've read - however they are all double my budget & simply unfeasible to justify coming from $100 SE210s.
  
 So I suppose what I'm really after is a pair of IEMs that can at least stake a claim of coming close to the aforementioned heavy-hitters in most aspects. I've realised that may be what I have to settle for until I have the financial capability to construct a true audiophile-standard rig that will do justice to that kind of quality & price tag.
  
  
 Here's the shortlist I've got so far from browsing through this thread & various others on the forum (including the prices they're available to me for at the moment):
  
 Shure SE535 Special Edition - $465
 Audio Technica ATH-CK100PRO - $385
 Audio Technica ATH-IM04 - $550
 Audio Technica ATH-IM03 - $370
 Noble 4 - $450
 Cardas EM5813 - $390
 Westone UMX3-RC - $380
  
 Heir 4.Ai - $400+
 Tzar 90 - $360+
 1964EARS 1964-V3 - $425+
 1964EARS 1964-Q - $525+
  
  
 Any help with figuring out which of these is really going to provide the kind of performance that I'm looking for would be truly appreciated. I really do want to get it right the first time since it is a substantial purchase & I can only really afford to own one set of high-end IEMs at this current point in time.
  
 Right now, I'm leaning towards the Shure SE535 SE due to the SE210s serving me so well for so many years - as well as the IM04 since I've been extremely happy with my M50s & what I've heard so far indicates it might be able to satisfy my desires, but unfortunately there are very limited reviews of it right now & being the most expensive IEM on the current shortlist, it is therefore difficult to discern whether it would truly outperform everything else or not.
  
 Any input on any of this whatsoever would be amazing.
  
 Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

solarium said:


> I'm just going to buy all 4 headphones (W3, X10, MA750i, and GR07-BE) from amazon to test them out. Since I have prime anyway I'll just return all but the one I want the most. It's difficult to judge anyway unless I try them all out myself
> 
> BTW, any aftermarket tips that I should absolutely include to really get the most out of those IEM's? Like without them, the listening experience would be completely different.


 
  
 With those IEMs you should get a pretty good idea of what you're looking at with just the stock tips.
  


lamnidae said:


> The short of it is - I want control & composure as a bit of finesse is important to me - but ultimately a fairly expansive & lush sound with plenty of articulate detail & dynamic impact that's going to enhance my overall listening experience & allow me to immerse myself in the music & it's inherent intricacies.
> 
> Being a guitarist myself, my main focus is on the guitars & particularly their tone & note definition, as well as the aggression, drive & impact of the drums. Vocals, both harsh & clean, are also important to me & should have plenty of prescence; but never at the obtuse expense of the guitars' coherence. I guess I'm ideally looking for a pair of IEMs that possess a certain poise & balance to provide an accurate, appealing, organic soundscape full of virility & texture with a sense of depth & intensity - but without sacrificing the clarity & instrument separation that is so vital to the kind of music that I listen to & my own personal tastes.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I can't provide any feedback on most of the sets you're considering. The only ones I have heard are the 1964-V3, Westone UM3X, and the Cardas. I thought the Cardas was lacking in clarity for the price and can't recommend it at all. It's still sitting in my desk. The 1964-V3 has borderline basshead bass and doesn't seem like it would be a good fit for you, especially coming from an SE210. In that price range the Alclair Reference would be the custom I'd recommend but I still don't think it's a great fit for you. The SE535 would work better for you than all of those, although I haven't heard the SE535 SE.
  
 From your requirements I would also suggest the StageDiver SD-2, which is not unlike the SE535 except that I didn't have as many nitpicks with its treble. It doesn't really have enhanced bass, but no less than the SE535. The mids are not forward, but not recessed either. Treble isn't bright and doesn't have too much sparkle, but again it's better than the SE535 I heard in that respect. Other than these reservations it ticks all of your boxes.


----------



## dezane222

Hi joker,
  
 i'm really confuse to choose between gr07be, ba200, vc1000, re400, and eph100
 i like to listen to jazz audiophile song, sometimes poprock songs like maroon5.
 i really like clarity and detail, but also want some bass impact/quantity.
 which one should i choose?
 can you rank based on clarity from the list? (you had answered this question previously, but i add ba200)
 and can you rank them based on bass quantity only? (may i add monoprice 8320 and vsd1s on the list  )
 thanks joker


----------



## mannkind246

dezane222 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> i'm really confuse to choose between gr07be, ba200, vc1000, re400, and eph100
> i like to listen to jazz audiophile song, sometimes poprock songs like maroon5.
> ...



Just curious why you did not consider Fischer Audio DBA02-MKII because it has very detail and good clarity?


----------



## dezane222

mannkind246 said:


> Just curious why you did not consider Fischer Audio DBA02-MKII because it has very detail and good clarity?


 

 because many reviews i read about it say it lack of bass impact/quantity. so i think maybe it is not for my taste. just my guess


----------



## ericr

lamnidae said:


> ...
> 
> I'm looking for a pair of sub-$600 IEMs that are going to bring the best out from well-produced metalcore/melodic hardcore/post-hardcore/technical death metal/pop punk & other genres with a distinct focus & emphasis on the melodic & technical aspects of the guitar work in particular.
> 
> ...




Hope you don't mind my jumping in here. Reading your explanation of what you're looking for I would recommend you give the Earsonics SM64 serious consideration. Joker rated them highly and you can read the various comments I've made by doing a search on my user name. 

-Eric


----------



## 991 Carrera 4S

ljokerl said:


> Wow, at those prices ($350 for a DBA-02??) it really seems like the Music One is your best bet for the following reasons -
> 1. It's really hard to upgrade from the UE700 in comfort without going custom, period
> 2. It ticks most of your boxes, at least as much as an IEM in your price range can
> 3. It seems like with that you're not getting a hugely worse price than if you were located in the US or Asia
> ...


 
  
 Long price-story short: DBA-02 are $200 ~ 140€, add 20% VAT and 20% strong-currency-penalty and they are 200€ (the usual dollar w/o VAT == euro w/ VAT). Add awful availability (official german reseller: not listed; official uk reseller: out of stock; amazon uk: not listed; amazon germany: not listed; ...) so the sole amazon marketplace seller asks 249€ incl. VAT ~ $344. Finally I also found them on fischer-products.eu for 116€ with free shipping from the russian federation o_O.
  
 Reading my last postig again ignoring crazy euro-prizes, non-availability, and custom-eartips-markup, what would be your answers then?
  
 DBA-02 mkII? ER-4S? Brainwavz B2? j-phonic K2 SP? Custom Art Music One?
 Others?
  
 Are they noticeable upgrades? (For example I remeber reading between the lines, that, from all TWFK-implementations, you don't like the UE700 much. On the other hand: Would an upgrade from TWFK to TWFK be worth even only $150 anyway?)
 How do they meet my wished-for requirements?


----------



## eccom

991 carrera 4s said:


> Long price-story short: DBA-02 are $200 ~ 140€, add 20% VAT and 20% strong-currency-penalty and they are 200€ (the usual dollar w/o VAT == euro w/ VAT). Add awful availability (official german reseller: not listed; official uk reseller: out of stock; amazon uk: not listed; amazon germany: not listed; ...) so the sole amazon marketplace seller asks 249€ incl. VAT ~ $344. Finally I also found them on fischer-products.eu for 116€ with free shipping from the russian federation o_O.
> 
> Reading my last postig again ignoring crazy euro-prizes, non-availability, and custom-eartips-markup, what would be your answers then?
> 
> ...




The brainwavz b2 is currently 55 gbp on amazon UK. By far the best for the money at that price, and joker's ranking is the same as the DBA mkii.


----------



## Hitesh

@Joker
 Can you give a quick E10M vs Quadbeat 2 ?


----------



## ljokerl

dezane222 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> i'm really confuse to choose between gr07be, ba200, vc1000, re400, and eph100
> i like to listen to jazz audiophile song, sometimes poprock songs like maroon5.
> ...


 
  
 The BA200 has similar clarity to the RE-400 IMO. It would be whatever ranking I gave before with the BA200 on-par with the RE-400
  
 For bass quantity I would rank them as follows: EPH-100 >> VSD1S ~ GR07BE > BA200 > RE-400 ~ VC1000 ~ Monoprice
  
  


991 carrera 4s said:


> Long price-story short: DBA-02 are $200 ~ 140€, add 20% VAT and 20% strong-currency-penalty and they are 200€ (the usual dollar w/o VAT == euro w/ VAT). Add awful availability (official german reseller: not listed; official uk reseller: out of stock; amazon uk: not listed; amazon germany: not listed; ...) so the sole amazon marketplace seller asks 249€ incl. VAT ~ $344. Finally I also found them on fischer-products.eu for 116€ with free shipping from the russian federation o_O.
> 
> Reading my last postig again ignoring crazy euro-prizes, non-availability, and custom-eartips-markup, what would be your answers then?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I liked the Logitech UE700 (which is the one you have IIRC) better than the pre-Logitech one so I wouldn't really recommend "upgrading" to the B2 or DBA-02.
  
 Last time I was just commenting on the pricing off hand. My recommendation won't change even ignoring pricing and availability. The only other set I would consider based on sound quality and your requisites would be the Etymotic, mostly because it is a little clearer and brighter overall than the Music One. There's a full ER4S/Music One comparison in the Music One review: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/custom-art-music-one-review/  
  


hitesh said:


> @Joker
> Can you give a quick E10M vs Quadbeat 2 ?


 
  
 I've never tried a Quadbeat 2


----------



## starcraft2

Hi guys.

First a huge merry Xmas to all and happy 2014.

Second, I want some opinions/sugestions.
I have been in love with a pair of eph 100. I even use them over my hd598. Since I AM enjoying thia new IEM experiente I would like to try something new. I am considering a ba IEM. As I did with the eph 100 I want as much bang for the buck as possible. 

My options so far:
TDK bá 2000
Ety hf5
Sony xba 1 and xba h1
Rock it sounds r50

And all the others you might consider.

I have read the list over and over...


----------



## ljokerl

starcraft2 said:


> Hi guys.
> 
> First a huge merry Xmas to all and happy 2014.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Those all sound very different from the EPH-100. It seems like you are looking for a contrast to the EPH-100, but that's still a very wide set of requirements. Anything specific you're after?


----------



## Hitesh

ljokerl said:


> I've never tried a Quadbeat 2


 
 Umm what about Quadbeat 1 vs E10m ?


----------



## dezane222

ljokerl said:


> The BA200 has similar clarity to the RE-400 IMO. It would be whatever ranking I gave before with the BA200 on-par with the RE-400
> 
> For bass quantity I would rank them as follows: EPH-100 >> VSD1S ~ GR07BE > BA200 > RE-400 ~ VC1000 ~ Monoprice


 
  
 thanks for reply
 so for jazz audiophile (susan wong, stacey kent,etc, AND poprock like maroon5) which one is more suitable for me ?


----------



## ozkan

Quote:


hitesh said:


> @Joker
> Can you give a quick E10M vs Quadbeat 2 ?



  
 Let me answer this question. E10m has more sub-bass and treble than Qb2 while Qb2 has more midbass and forward mids than E10m. Qb2 will sound punchy and mid-centic while E10m is "V" shaped and energytic. I think Qb2 is more detailed than E10m. Just take it with a grain of salt.


----------



## ozkan

starcraft2 said:


> Hi guys.
> 
> First a huge merry Xmas to all and happy 2014.
> 
> ...


 
 If you are looking for an iem with less bass than EPH 100, you might consider Etymotic Hf5 and a 75 ohm adapter which makes it sound almost similar to ER4s.


----------



## 991 Carrera 4S

ljokerl said:


> I liked the Logitech UE700 (which is the one you have IIRC) better than the pre-Logitech one so I wouldn't really recommend "upgrading" to the B2 or DBA-02.
> 
> Last time I was just commenting on the pricing off hand. My recommendation won't change even ignoring pricing and availability. The only other set I would consider based on sound quality and your requisites would be the Etymotic, mostly because it is a little clearer and brighter overall than the Music One. There's a full ER4S/Music One comparison in the Music One review: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/custom-art-music-one-review/


 
  
 Many thanks |joker|.  So I think I'm going to stick with the Music Two – seems too enticing on pre-order.


----------



## adriano86

Hi there ljokerl, im new to this forum but thank you very much for your awesome review. I was hoping something like that existed on the internet but the more i searched the less hope i had to stumble across a review like that. Keep it up!
  
 Im not a expert by any means though I have a huge passion for music and spending hours listening to various of styles but mainly hiphop and r&b. I just ordered a new pair of Klipsch S4 which i think are good for exercising but Im now looking for a BIG upgrade. I dont want to spend a lot of money just to realise they are just a "little" bit better then my Klipsch.

 Which of the following earphones would you recommend (maybe you could rank them according to your taste):
  
*Klipsch x10*
Im bit worried they are too similiar to the Klipsch S4 and having that narrow sound spectrum as I want to try something new.. i think.
  
*Philips Fidelio S1*
The open style of the S1 is worrying me because Im so used to having good isolation from using the Klipsch.
  
*Nocs 800*
Looks good on paper but do you think the bassline is too weak ?
  
*Monster Cable Turbine with headset*
They look good on first glance however im bit concerned that they lack the clarity im looking for. For example i listen to some african music like P-Square and on the Klipsch it just sounds aweful. Sure the track was only 128kbps but still..
  
*SteelSeries Flux Pro*
Only because you recommended them . I dont like the tanglefree cable though, not big fan of any earphones using such cables at all matter of fact as they create extra weight and not too good for exercising.
  
  
 Sorry for the complicated question but ive spent days trying to figure this out ;/
  
 thx once again!


----------



## starcraft2

The eph are excelent but I am looking for a different sound sig. I like the definition, soundstage. The BA are a technology I never tried.

What could you tell me? By the reviews I am leaning towards the Sony or the Ety. The er4 are espensive and from what i read very analitic and I want to enjoy the music, thats why I thought about the hf5. The sony are good?



ljokerl said:


> Those all sound very different from the EPH-100. It seems like you are looking for a contrast to the EPH-100, but that's still a very wide set of requirements. Anything specific you're after?


----------



## egosumlux

starcraft2 said:


> The eph are excelent but I am looking for a different sound sig. I like the definition, soundstage. The BA are a technology I never tried.
> 
> What could you tell me? By the reviews I am leaning towards the Sony or the Ety. The er4 are espensive and from what i read very analitic and I want to enjoy the music, thats why I thought about the hf5. The sony are good?


 
 It looks like the new line of Sony BA's is much better I'd say that trying the xba-10 will prove the point. Can someone take the hint?


----------



## egosumlux

Merry Xmas Joker and a great 2014 wooden horse year!!!
  
 Reading your thread enlightened me and made me discover my preferences in a much more detailed fashion. Like most people say here "Wellcome to head-fi, sorry for your wallet"


----------



## ljokerl

hitesh said:


> Umm what about Quadbeat 1 vs E10m ?


 
  
 The Quadbeat is a little more balanced with less recessed mids and an overall clearer, more detailed sound. The E10 is more mid-bassy and a little more v-shaped overall.
  


dezane222 said:


> thanks for reply
> so for jazz audiophile (susan wong, stacey kent,etc, AND poprock like maroon5) which one is more suitable for me ?


 
  
 Depends on your preferred sound signature. Safest bets would probably be the VSD1S (due to price/performance) and BA200.
  


adriano86 said:


> Hi there ljokerl, im new to this forum but thank you very much for your awesome review. I was hoping something like that existed on the internet but the more i searched the less hope i had to stumble across a review like that. Keep it up!
> 
> Im not a expert by any means though I have a huge passion for music and spending hours listening to various of styles but mainly hiphop and r&b. I just ordered a new pair of Klipsch S4 which i think are good for exercising but Im now looking for a BIG upgrade. I dont want to spend a lot of money just to realise they are just a "little" bit better then my Klipsch.
> 
> ...


 
  
Aside from the Fidelio S1 (which I very much like) and the Nocs 800 (which I haven’t heard) they are all ranked on the front page of this thread.
 
Why not try the EPH-100? It's got a powerful sound that should be good for hip-hop - very Monster Turbine Pro-like but for a lot less money. They also have good isolation. 
 
P.S. how "big" an upgrade is is very subjective and partly in the eye of the beholder. Some people think anything beyond the monoprice 8320 is a waste while others will squeeze out every last note with a Stax O2 or whatever the highest-end headphones are these days.
 
P.P.S. using higher-end earphones on a track encoded in 128kbps mp3 is kind of a waste…
 


starcraft2 said:


> The eph are excelent but I am looking for a different sound sig. I like the definition, soundstage. The BA are a technology I never tried.
> 
> What could you tell me? By the reviews I am leaning towards the Sony or the Ety. The er4 are espensive and from what i read very analitic and I want to enjoy the music, thats why I thought about the hf5. The sony are good?


 
  
I haven’t tried either of the Sonys. The HF5 sounds similar to the ER4 but it’s still a great sound to try. Huge contrast to the EPH-100, but in a good way 





  


egosumlux said:


> Merry Xmas Joker and a great 2014 wooden horse year!!!
> 
> Reading your thread enlightened me and made me discover my preferences in a much more detailed fashion. Like most people say here "Wellcome to head-fi, sorry for your wallet"


 
  
 Thank you, hope 2014 is kinder to your wallet!


----------



## adriano86

Thx for your reply. Would 320kbps be minimum for higher end earphones? 

The Yamaha EPH-100 dont have a headset which is why i didint list them :/


----------



## Hitesh

Thanks for the reply ! Gonna buy QB2 now


----------



## Pastapipo

adriano86 said:


> Thx for your reply. Would 320kbps be minimum for higher end earphones?
> 
> The Yamaha EPH-100 dont have a headset which is why i didint list them :/


 
  
 I think 192 kbps MP3 / 160kbps Ogg Vorbis  is the minimum, 320 kbps is great for hiphop. Which is, with all due respect, not the most instrumental demanding genre of music.
 I believe the way music is encoded in MP3 format is quite suitable for hiphop due tot the use of electronic samples and voice/bass centred sound.
 For other more detail rich genres of music (i.e. Classical or Metal), FLAC is the best choice in theory. But everybody has his opinion on this matter and the internet is full with it.


----------



## adriano86

I fully agree with you. This just so damn hard, due to limited offer here in Sweden i cant get ny hands on neither the Yamaha with mic or Klipsch x10 to a afforsqble price. For some reason Amazon had a nice offer on the x10 but shipping cost was set at 100 pounds lol. Now it seems that the Steelseries Flux Pro which arent on the same level as the rest of the listed options is my last choice. The Fidelio seem way to big and too weak of a bassline since im going from S4.


----------



## james444

^ I see a X10i for €140 on Amazon Germany. They should ship to Sweden at reasonable cost.


----------



## adriano86

james444 said:


> ^ I see a X10i for €140 on Amazon Germany. They should ship to Sweden at reasonable cost.


 
 Its a bit over my budget, i was hoping to get away with a set around 110 euros or less in total including shipping :/


----------



## ozkan

adriano86 said:


> Thx for your reply. Would 320kbps be minimum for higher end earphones?
> 
> The Yamaha EPH-100 dont have a headset which is why i didint list them :/


 
 320kps is more than enough for listening when you are out and around. Flac or any other lossless formats are only essential for critical listenings. Keep in mind that hi-end headphones really benefit from lossless formats and show their potential other than that 320kbps mp3 is the way to go.


----------



## quartertone

Audiophile talk of lossless files always amuses me a bit, because people were listening to lossless audio long before the advent of DAPs in the form of CDs anyway... Never mind.


----------



## MoonYeol

It's quite natural that the evolution of music as a medium is as it has been. The technical development now allows people to store lossless again without bringing 100+ CD's which aren't technically lossless. If I were to be a bit philosophical, the music loses something as soon as it reaches your flawed human ears even in a live performance. There's always a limiting factor.

But there's to my knowledge also a difference in quality between similar bitrates and techniques. So to my ears, 320 ogg vorbis (Spotify extreme) sounds good enough for me under most circumstances. I don't own any high end system so I'm more biased towards availability and legal issues compared to price and performance. I need some real concentration to pick out the difference between a CD quality flac and a 320 ogg vorbis and I'd like to say that some tracks are 50/50, some 75/25 or so. I don't think I'll ever be 100% certain about the difference in an A/B test. And I think my ears are pretty good and sensitive. Then there's the placebo effect.


----------



## blupblup

I was wondering if joker or someone would be able to help?
 I asked in the basshead forum but to no avail as yet.
  
 "Hey what would people recommend between the Wooduo 2 and the AH-C300?
 I have read both have plenty of bass and sub bass but which maintains detail and has a wider soundstage?
 Are they similar or is one just pure bass and no high end sparkle?
  
 Been listening to a lot more electronica and hip-hop and reggae and finding that without amping, my current iems just ain't up to it really.
  
 I dont want to sacrifice clarity, detail and so on, I just want better lows, particularly sub.
  
 Thanks"
  
  
 Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

adriano86 said:


> Thx for your reply. Would 320kbps be minimum for higher end earphones?
> 
> The Yamaha EPH-100 dont have a headset which is why i didint list them :/


 
  
 I agree with *Pastapipo,* for me 192kbps is the _minimum_. 320 is really rather good, especially for hip-hop, and I don't mind 320kbps files at all, especially on the go.
  
 Also, I missed the mic requirement. In that case you might also want to consider the new JVC FRD80. It's the mic/remote version of the FXD80. Seems to be pretty cheap on ebay at the moment.
  


adriano86 said:


> I fully agree with you. This just so damn hard, due to limited offer here in Sweden i cant get ny hands on neither the Yamaha with mic or Klipsch x10 to a afforsqble price. For some reason Amazon had a nice offer on the x10 but shipping cost was set at 100 pounds lol. Now it seems that the Steelseries Flux Pro which arent on the same level as the rest of the listed options is my last choice. The Fidelio seem way to big and too weak of a bassline since im going from S4.


 
  
 The Fidelios have more bass than the Flux Pro. It's the regular (non-pro) Flux that's the bassier SteelSeries earphones. 
  


quartertone said:


> Audiophile talk of lossless files always amuses me a bit, because people were listening to lossless audio long before the advent of DAPs in the form of CDs anyway... Never mind.


 
  
 I think it's a natural progression. Highly compressed mp3s were a concession caused by expensive digital storage and low internet bandwidths/speeds, even in the mainstream. Now we are course-correcting back to less compressed audio as low-bitrate files are becoming less common all around.
  


blupblup said:


> I was wondering if joker or someone would be able to help?
> I asked in the basshead forum but to no avail as yet.
> 
> "Hey what would people recommend between the Wooduo 2 and the AH-C300?
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, as far as I know I've never even been in the same room as an AH-C300.


----------



## Louis8ball

Joker,
  
 Do you (or anyone else here) happen to know of a good aftermarket tip to use on the *id America Spark*? Comply doesn't list this brand/model in their Tip-Finder menu.
  
 The nozzles on these IEs are larger than a lot of others, but I am not really too impressed with the stock tips which came with these phones.
  
 I wonder if there might be an appreciation thread here at Head-Fi for this earphone. The SQ sure does seem to be very impressive.
  
  
 Thanks.


----------



## MoonYeol

Comply tips can be stretched with a pencil or a chopstick. The 500-series stretched should fit even the widest nozzles. Auvio tips are wide diameter and are usually good in bringing out treble while keeping an open sound with a good bass response (my own experience) can be a bit harsh.


----------



## Louis8ball

Cool, I'll look into that. Thanks.


----------



## lamnidae

ljokerl said:


> With those IEMs you should get a pretty good idea of what you're looking at with just the stock tips.
> 
> 
> I can't provide any feedback on most of the sets you're considering. The only ones I have heard are the 1964-V3, Westone UM3X, and the Cardas. I thought the Cardas was lacking in clarity for the price and can't recommend it at all. It's still sitting in my desk. The 1964-V3 has borderline basshead bass and doesn't seem like it would be a good fit for you, especially coming from an SE210. In that price range the Alclair Reference would be the custom I'd recommend but I still don't think it's a great fit for you. The SE535 would work better for you than all of those, although I haven't heard the SE535 SE.
> ...


 
  
  
 Sorry for taking a while to get back to you, been away without a laptop for the last few days. Thanks for the response & recommendations! Really appreciate it mate.
  
 I've had a look into the SD-2 & it does seem rather intriguing based on your review as well as others - certainly a strong contender next to the SE535 SE. It is the priciest option though, so I'm determined to find out how it measures up against the SE535 SE & some of the others before I make a final decision. How would you say it compares to the W4/W4R, as that was an option that I was initially considering? Following some more extensive research, I decided that the bass might not be quite fast & responsive enough for what I'm looking for straight out of the box, along with a lot of comments about it being somewhat 'flat' in a sense & was led to believe I would need an amp to really appreciate it's unique signature.
  
 Also, how would you rate those the SD-2 & W4 against higher end custom models such as the 1964EARS V6 & Unique Melody Miracle purely in terms of sound quality since you've tried them as well?
  
 Cheers


----------



## lamnidae

ericr said:


> Hope you don't mind my jumping in here. Reading your explanation of what you're looking for I would recommend you give the Earsonics SM64 serious consideration. Joker rated them highly and you can read the various comments I've made by doing a search on my user name.
> 
> -Eric


 
  
 Hey man no worries, thanks for the input! Really appreciate any & all info, advice & recommendations that I can get at the moment.
  
 I did consider the SM3 V2 intially, but heard that the SM64 isn't necessarily a marked improvement for some. But it definitely gets plenty of good reviews & your comments only prove as further reinforcement of it's abilities. I may possibly have overlooked it a little.
  
 Have you by any chance tried out or owned the Shure SE535 SE, InEar StageDiver SD-2, Westone W4 or 1964EARS Q such that you could give me a comparison of the SM64 to any of those?
  
 Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

I guess we're among the last to reach the new year here in California.
  
 Just want to wish everything a healthy, happy, and prosperous 2014 filled with great music!


----------



## derrickmarvel

ljokerl said:


> I guess we're among the last to reach the new year here in California.
> 
> Just want to wish everything a healthy, happy, and prosperous 2014 filled with great music!


 

 Happy 2014 to you to |joker|!


----------



## getclikinagas

Happy New year to you too!
 Can't believe its only been 4 years since this:
  


ljokerl said:


> (*5/9/09*)
> 
> Thanks a lot for the comprehensive guide!
> 
> I'm pretty new here and only on my 2nd set of IEM's. This guide had pretty much everything I wanted to know (and sume stuff I didn't know I wanted).


  

 to this :
  
*Multi-IEM Review - 307 IEMs compared : Portables Reviewerus Prolificus**"* Thank god for your long commutes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 
  
 Thank you from us all Mike!
  
What have been the highlights this year for 'you'? (iems, headphones, music)


----------



## adriano86

ljokerl said:


> I agree with *Pastapipo,* for me 192kbps is the _minimum_. 320 is really rather good, especially for hip-hop, and I don't mind 320kbps files at all, especially on the go.
> 
> Also, I missed the mic requirement. In that case you might also want to consider the new JVC FRD80. It's the mic/remote version of the FXD80. Seems to be pretty cheap on ebay at the moment.
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks for your reply and happy new year to you. Alright so I checked out the FXD80 and they seem promising based on your review. They are definately within my price range but can i trust ordering from ebay? I see most of those sellers are based in China so im afraid of cheap pirated copies...
  
 Secondly, which would you say would suit me best Yamaha 100-SL or JVC FRD80 ? both has a mic it seems but I wonder if im able to order either of them from manufacturers website or something?
  
 I guess i forgot to add that im striving for that full and richness sound so by what I read the Yamaha seem to be the better choice if im not wrong?


----------



## Love Music

Happy New Year everyone!
  
 Joker,
  
 just wondering how the sd-2 compares to the UE900 in terms of mid, highs, soundstage, clarity, imaging and seperation?


----------



## Solude

One more kick of the can, anyone can feel free to chime in...
  
 What iems, custom or universal, that has the tonal balance and character of the LCD-3 at these price points...
  
 $300
 $500
 $700
 $1100
 $1600


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Tried the Westone TruFit tips with my Brainwavz B's and they're good, don't get me wrong, but I didn't quite enjoy them and found them difficult to get a good fit/seal so they're consigned to the back burner for the moment (may self-mod them to see if I can make them more usable for me).
  
 The Comply tips that they use are the 100 Series. I've had the T-series before and the B2's came with a set of T-100's which are good but I am wondering whether the Tx-100 versions would be worth the extra cash. They only seem to offer a small wax guard over the standard T-100's.
  
 Any opinions on the T Vs the Tx Complys? Main concern is any change in sound from the wax guard. If that's fine, secondary concern would be "apart from the wax guard, what else does my extra money buy me?",
  
 Many thanks!


----------



## MoonYeol

The filter potentially takes away from the highs. It should do to some small amount but not sure how much.


----------



## adriano86

Why is it impossible to find Yamaha EPH-100SL ? I mean it seems to be such a shortage of retailers selling themm.. whyyyy!?!?!?! Gah going nuts..


----------



## Deviltooth

adriano86 said:


> Why is it impossible to find Yamaha EPH-100SL ? I mean it seems to be such a shortage of retailers selling themm.. whyyyy!?!?!?! Gah going nuts..


 

 It's not impossible, try Amazon.com


----------



## ozkan

You can also check ebay. http://www.ebay.com/ctg/Yamaha-EPH-100-In-Ear-only-Headphones-Silver-Black-/114560858


----------



## TR3v

So I have had 3 pairs of ue500s break in the past 10 months. Pretty lame imo. When is someone going to a truly durable IEM? Detachable cables are going to be a must for my next purchase.


----------



## ljokerl

lamnidae said:


> Sorry for taking a while to get back to you, been away without a laptop for the last few days. Thanks for the response & recommendations! Really appreciate it mate.
> 
> I've had a look into the SD-2 & it does seem rather intriguing based on your review as well as others - certainly a strong contender next to the SE535 SE. It is the priciest option though, so I'm determined to find out how it measures up against the SE535 SE & some of the others before I make a final decision. How would you say it compares to the W4/W4R, as that was an option that I was initially considering? Following some more extensive research, I decided that the bass might not be quite fast & responsive enough for what I'm looking for straight out of the box, along with a lot of comments about it being somewhat 'flat' in a sense & was led to believe I would need an amp to really appreciate it's unique signature.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The SD-2 is more balanced than the W4 IMO. Its bass is more level with no real subbass roll-off and no mid-bass lift. I liked the mids on the Westones so I don't think either really has an advantage there. Treble-wise the SD-2 again sounded more linear to me. The W4 maybe a had a little more energy but wasn't as extended.
  
 I stopped my A:B between the Miracle and SD-2 short. There really wasn't much of a comparison. The Miracle is much clearer, much more 3-dimensional, and sounded more neutral and more natural. The V6-Stage (the only V6 I've tried) is pretty close to the Miracle.
  


getclikinagas said:


> Happy New year to you too!
> Can't believe its only been 4 years since this:
> 
> to this :
> ...


 
  
 Wow, imagine that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I totally don't remember making that comment but it was well-deserved by ClieOS. Never in a million years could I have predicted what my time on Head-Fi would be like. I also vaguely remember a thread I started the day I heard a set of Etys for the first time. That was an eye-opening experience for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 Aside from the sets that had redefined (for me) price/performance this year and all of my new favorites (e.g. RE-400, VSD1S, JH13) my highlight this year was finally getting the interactive table off the ground. That's been a long time coming.
  
 Happy new year 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  


adriano86 said:


> Thanks for your reply and happy new year to you. Alright so I checked out the FXD80 and they seem promising based on your review. They are definately within my price range but can i trust ordering from ebay? I see most of those sellers are based in China so im afraid of cheap pirated copies...
> 
> Secondly, which would you say would suit me best Yamaha 100-SL or JVC FRD80 ? both has a mic it seems but I wonder if im able to order either of them from manufacturers website or something?
> 
> I guess i forgot to add that im striving for that full and richness sound so by what I read the Yamaha seem to be the better choice if im not wrong?


 
  
 Do the Yamahas have a mic version? I thought they didn't. If they do, I still think the EPH-100 fits your requirements better sound-wise. 
  


love music said:


> Happy New Year everyone!
> 
> Joker,
> 
> just wondering how the sd-2 compares to the UE900 in terms of mid, highs, soundstage, clarity, imaging and seperation?


 
  
 I thought the SD-2 sounded smoother and had a little more bass impact with similar extension. Its mids are more prominent overall and it sounded more natural to me. Not much technical difference in presentation or overall clarity. The UE900 seemed to have slightly better treble extension and is brighter/has more treble energy but I liked the SD-2 better overall. 
  


solude said:


> One more kick of the can, anyone can feel free to chime in...
> 
> What iems, custom or universal, that has the tonal balance and character of the LCD-3 at these price points...
> 
> ...


 
  
 I personally haven't tried the LCD-3.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the RBH EP1/EP2
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2B25) RBH EP1 / EP2*
> 
> 
> Reviewed December 2013
> ...


 
  
 The ranking has been updated here.


----------



## vwinter

Quick question that might sound a bit insane after all this:

Can you describe how you define impact and slam?


----------



## Railius

Hey Guys, i've been in this thread but in the full cup headphone section, i've learned a lot! ended up buying AKG Q701 with amp+dac and soundcard, they are coming next week ! Now to the point! I recently earned 130$ so since i bought a great system audio for my PC, i really really would love to have a pretty decent IE headphone for outside, running, aireplanes, etc etc. So at first i went straight into the Bose IE2 why? because my dad has those, and they are pretty comfortable, they dont fall! because of the stayhear tips, which is great, now im not an audiophile but they sound good, but for the most important thing here is audio and the fact that they dont fall out while jogging..
  
 So i've been searching and apparently bose is like beats lol, just a famouse sucky brand, what headphones do you recommend me to buy, i gotta buy them in like 2 days :/, i saw this RHA MA750I pretty awesome reviews on amazon, but they are not even mention on this guide.. any help given would be much appreciated.


----------



## ljokerl

vwinter said:


> Quick question that might sound a bit insane after all this:
> 
> Can you describe how you define impact and slam?


 
  
 I use impact in the conventional sense - pretty much how powerful the bass "punch" is. This is mostly defined by mid-bass quantity. "Slam" is a term I use more loosely but I think it's easier for a non-audio person to understand. It's related to that visceral quality of air being moved in to your ear and is more related to sub-bass quantity.
  


railius said:


> Hey Guys, i've been in this thread but in the full cup headphone section, i've learned a lot! ended up buying AKG Q701 with amp+dac and soundcard, they are coming next week ! Now to the point! I recently earned 130$ so since i bought a great system audio for my PC, i really really would love to have a pretty decent IE headphone for outside, running, aireplanes, etc etc. So at first i went straight into the Bose IE2 why? because my dad has those, and they are pretty comfortable, they dont fall! because of the stayhear tips, which is great, now im not an audiophile but they sound good, but for the most important thing here is audio and the fact that they dont fall out while jogging..
> 
> So i've been searching and apparently bose is like beats lol, just a famouse sucky brand, what headphones do you recommend me to buy, i gotta buy them in like 2 days :/, i saw this RHA MA750I pretty awesome reviews on amazon, but they are not even mention on this guide.. any help given would be much appreciated.


 
  
 The IE2 isn't really an in-ear but if you like the way they fit and sound, by all means keep using them. 
  
 I haven't had a chance to add the MA750 yet but I quite like it. For example, I recommended it in the InnerFidelity Holiday Gift Guide. I also commented on it a bit here and probably elsewhere. It's a very nice earphone.


----------



## MoonYeol

The IE2 is decent in SQ but really don't sound substantially better than ear pods or PK3. So the big setback is the overprice. Otherwise they're quite nice and I think it's always good to have at least one pair of earbuds. Could save your life if you're close to traffic.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> I thought the SD-2 sounded smoother and had a little more bass impact with similar extension. Its mids are more prominent overall and it sounded more natural to me. Not much technical difference in presentation or overall clarity. The UE900 seemed to have slightly better treble extension and is brighter/has more treble energy but I liked the SD-2 better overall.


 
 I see sounds like the iem i'm looking for. I'm kind of on the fence between the sd-2 and the Noble 4 universals, what are the differences between them? They are both at the same price.


----------



## adriano86

ljokerl said:


> I use impact in the conventional sense - pretty much how powerful the bass "punch" is. This is mostly defined by mid-bass quantity. "Slam" is a term I use more loosely but I think it's easier for a non-audio person to understand. It's related to that visceral quality of air being moved in to your ear and is more related to sub-bass quantity.
> 
> 
> The IE2 isn't really an in-ear but if you like the way they fit and sound, by all means keep using them.
> ...


 
 Damn your right. See what i mean now, I cant find one pair of earphones that suits me though I might buy the Yamaha later on if it really is this good.

 It needs to have a mic, so i assume the JVC is my last option?
http://www.dagspris.se/PartDetail.aspx?q=p:5899474


----------



## Railius

Have any of you run with in ear headphones? do you think they would fall off with all those tips?


----------



## ozkan

railius said:


> Have any of you run with in ear headphones? do you think they would fall off with all those tips?


 
 Which in ear headphones are you talking about? If you can wear them over your ears it may help to fall off from your ears when you are running.


----------



## adriano86

Nevermind I went for the Yamaha EPH-100 plus a cheap Samsung headset for 15 bucks 

 Cant wait to hear em and see what the hype is all about, especially comming from a S4 Klipsch which is the best earphone ive used thus far !


----------



## lamnidae

ljokerl said:


> The SD-2 is more balanced than the W4 IMO. Its bass is more level with no real subbass roll-off and no mid-bass lift. I liked the mids on the Westones so I don't think either really has an advantage there. Treble-wise the SD-2 again sounded more linear to me. The W4 maybe a had a little more energy but wasn't as extended.
> 
> I stopped my A:B between the Miracle and SD-2 short. There really wasn't much of a comparison. The Miracle is much clearer, much more 3-dimensional, and sounded more neutral and more natural. The V6-Stage (the only V6 I've tried) is pretty close to the Miracle.


 
  
 Cool, thanks so much again for your assessments.
  
 With regards to the SD-2 vs Miracle - that's exactly what has been the cause of much concern & contemplation as I have realised that I will likely feel the inevitable need to opt for a high-calibre custom at some point in the near-future if I'm truly going to reap the rewards for doing so.
  
 The Miracle & the $1000+ range in general is definitely out of reach for the moment though - which is why I'm looking for something that will give me at least some degree of that kind of performance, whilst remaining in the immediately affordable budget.
  
 I've also been contemplating the idea of possibly stretching that budget a little to accomodate the V6-Stage if that's going to truly satsify my needs & hold off my desire for more expensive customs a lot longer. Would you possibly be able to give me some more detailed comparisons between that & the Miracle? Additionally, would you say that the price difference between the SD-2 & V6-Stage is justified in the comparative sound quality?


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> I use impact in the conventional sense - pretty much how powerful the bass "punch" is. This is mostly defined by mid-bass quantity. "Slam" is a term I use more loosely but I think it's easier for a non-audio person to understand. It's related to that visceral quality of air being moved in to your ear and is more related to sub-bass quantity.




Ahhh thanks for the descriptions. That makes it a clearer. Does impact for you take into account edge definition?


----------



## davidcotton

railius said:


> Hey Guys, i've been in this thread but in the full cup headphone section, i've learned a lot! ended up buying AKG Q701 with amp+dac and soundcard, they are coming next week ! Now to the point! I recently earned 130$ so since i bought a great system audio for my PC, i really really would love to have a pretty decent IE headphone for outside, running, aireplanes, etc etc. So at first i went straight into the Bose IE2 why? because my dad has those, and they are pretty comfortable, they dont fall! because of the stayhear tips, which is great, now im not an audiophile but they sound good, but for the most important thing here is audio and the fact that they dont fall out while jogging..
> 
> So i've been searching and apparently bose is like beats lol, just a famouse sucky brand, what headphones do you recommend me to buy, i gotta buy them in like 2 days :/, i saw this RHA MA750I pretty awesome reviews on amazon, but they are not even mention on this guide.. any help given would be much appreciated.


 

 Here's a link to the review on headfi, but not by joker.
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/687690/rha-ma-750i-review


----------



## Solarium

Got the 4 IEM's today. It's snowing crazy out so it's a good excuse to test them out


----------



## MoonYeol

solarium said:


> Got the 4 IEM's today. It's snowing crazy out so it's a good excuse to test them out


 
 Happy listening!


----------



## lamnidae

nvm lol read the post above wrong


----------



## Solarium

lamnidae said:


> nvm lol read the post above wrong


 
 what did you read it as 
  
 So far took out the GR07 1st, then the X10, then the MA750. I think I deafened myself when I plugged in the GR07 and forget to tone down my iphone volume from 100% and had trouble pulling the head pieces out of my ear. Then I basically struggled with each one and tried to drill them into my ears. Man I wish I can wear my 650's everywhere, these IEM's are literally killing my ears. My ears hurt so much right now from the constant raping and so far I've been unimpressed by any of the sounds except for the GR07. The GR07 actually has so far the best sound, built quality, and packaging IMO. The MA750 is my least favorite, they're way too big, heavy, and the metallic design really makes it look cheap. It was also very uncomfortable and the way its cables are bent at the end makes it hard to adjust it. I took it out after about a minute or 2 because it was so bulky. I guess I'm just too spoiled by my 650 8/


----------



## lostmage

After my Brainwavz B2s broke for the second time, I think it's time to get them fixed yet again and just sell them off. So, What would be a good replacement? Something a little bit more warm would be nice, under 250$. How would the CustomArt Music One match up?


----------



## lamnidae

solarium said:


> what did you read it as


 
  
 Got a little overexcited in my still currently intoxicated state & thought '4 IEMs' was actually 'IM04' (Audio-Technica's new high end universals) having just been perusing the web & this site for reviews/thoughts of any sort just prior to that. Apologies for the notification mate!
  
 Sorry to hear that the actual IEMs aren't doing much for you so far btw. I've heard the 650s a fair bit as one of my mates has them, so I can understand your views in terms of cans vs IEMs to an extent. However, I would encourage you to try what I am currently attempting to do, in picking out a higher end universal, or even consider going custom in order to truly experience what IEMs are sonically capable of.
  
 It may not be the same situation for you - but IEMs are a necessity in my life as I spend so much time listening to my ipod when I'm out - which is why I've decided that it's time to take the plunge & invest in a superior product that can satisfy all (or at least most) of my audiophilic desires


----------



## Solarium

W3's with the Comply P series tips are the only tips that can stick into my right ear. I'm not sure if it's my right ear canal has a weird anatomy but none of the other IEM's can even fit right. It's sound isolation is by far the best with these tips, better than the X10. Sounds INTOXICATING with my EDM music, much much more clear than the X10's muddy sounds, perhaps not as "accurate" and neutral/transparent as the GR07-BE's but who cares if you're on the run and the 07's isolation IMO is worst than my S4's. Sound quality on the run is only as good as the isolation. The W3's isolation reminds me of my old Shure E3C's, superb while not as bulging and intruding as the E3C's. I've tested the other 3 IEM's each less than 10 minutes but after properly adjusting the W3's with these tips the search is over. I'll be going to work with these tomorrow  I can't stress how high quality the W3 is too, everything from the case, the accessories, the ear piece screams of a >$300 product vs the others tested. Perhaps I just had a revelation that I enjoy "V shaped" sounds more than flat and neutral ones, and fun sounds more than analytical ones.


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> I see sounds like the iem i'm looking for. I'm kind of on the fence between the sd-2 and the Noble 4 universals, what are the differences between them? They are both at the same price.


 
  
 I haven't tried the Noble universals. The Noble 4S is IMO more accurate than the SD-2 - brighter and more energetic. It's a lot more Etymotic-like than the SD-2 and also has advantages in clarity, resolution, imaging, etc. The SD-2 has a slight advantage in bass depth but that's about it. But again, this is compared to the $999 Noble 4S and I'm not sure how that compares to the universal version. 
  


railius said:


> Have any of you run with in ear headphones? do you think they would fall off with all those tips?


 
  
 I use my MEElec M6 - never had them get loose or fall out. It really depends on both the particular earphones - both the design (how they fit in the ear, how they stay in place, etc) and the eartips. 
  


lamnidae said:


> Cool, thanks so much again for your assessments.
> 
> With regards to the SD-2 vs Miracle - that's exactly what has been the cause of much concern & contemplation as I have realised that I will likely feel the inevitable need to opt for a high-calibre custom at some point in the near-future if I'm truly going to reap the rewards for doing so.
> 
> ...


 
  
 See here for direct V6-Stage vs Miracle comparison: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/1964ears-v6-stage/ 
  
 As for diminishing returns, that's really hard to gauge. Is the SD-2 worth 3x the price of the RE-400 from HiFiMan? The difference is about the same there as it is between the SD-2 and a high-end custom IMO, so which leap is harder to justify - $99 -> $450 or $450 -> $699? I don't really have a good answer for this question...
  


vwinter said:


> Ahhh thanks for the descriptions. That makes it a clearer. Does impact for you take into account edge definition?


 
  
 When I want to make note of earphones where the bass lacks a strong/sharp leading edge I usually just say that the bass sounds "soft" or has a "soft" note presentation. Hasn't been an issue with many of the sets I've heard lately, come to think of it. 
  


lostmage said:


> After my Brainwavz B2s broke for the second time, I think it's time to get them fixed yet again and just sell them off. So, What would be a good replacement? Something a little bit more warm would be nice, under 250$. How would the CustomArt Music One match up?


 
  
 The Music One would be good - not necessarily an "upgrade" in SQ but a warmer sound and of course the construction should be more robust.


----------



## DestinyBear

The Miles Davis Trumpets as well as the Monster Turbine Pro Gold are on sale at Visions Electronics for 98$ and I was considering getting a pair.
  
 Is it a great value at this price. The Coppers are sold out, but they might restock. I was wondering for that price which model I should go with. Coming from the SE215, i expect something that has about the same bass quantity, but slightly tighter. I also prefer something that has more soundstage. I mostly listen to classical and hiphop and I would really appreciate any kind of feedback on which of the 3 models to pick. I'm leaning more towards the Trumpets but I'm worried that the sound might be too neutral, avoiding extremes as you mentioned in your review. 
  
 Could you recommend one that has those but sounds just as "fun" as the se215


----------



## godlyatheist

To the people that have custom IEM, I have some questions:
  
 1) How much isolation do you get with a proper fit? Are you able to clearly hear people next to you talk? If you walk around on the street, are the noises all very dim or just slightly dim? 
  
 I tried my JH13 for a week and it seems the isolation varies greatly between the type of sound that's around me. If someone stands in front of me and talk to me, I can hear them clearly. Sometimes even standing several feet away I can hear people's voice clearly. But sounds like plane engine are greatly reduced.
  
 2) Is it normal to have the faceplate of the CIEM not vertical to the ground after I insert it?
  
 The left size of my JH13 has the faceplate at an angle after I insert it. The fit is good I suppose, not pushing against anything but I'm always reminded of their presence so it's not ultra comfortable. The angled insertion makes it quite hard to take the left side out since I can't just twist it.
  
 As far as the sound of the JH13, I like it and a pretty good improvement from what I had. I just went to a conference where they had some really nice subwoofer putting out massive bass, and the sound of the the stick hitting the drum from the speaker is so real I don't think any IEM can even touch it. Every time the bass hit, I felt like I was the drum with both my ear drum and the air in my lungs vibrating.


----------



## ljokerl

destinybear said:


> The Miles Davis Trumpets as well as the Monster Turbine Pro Gold are on sale at Visions Electronics for 98$ and I was considering getting a pair.
> 
> Is it a great value at this price. The Coppers are sold out, but they might restock. I was wondering for that price which model I should go with. Coming from the SE215, i expect something that has about the same bass quantity, but slightly tighter. I also prefer something that has more soundstage. I mostly listen to classical and hiphop and I would really appreciate any kind of feedback on which of the 3 models to pick. I'm leaning more towards the Trumpets but I'm worried that the sound might be too neutral, avoiding extremes as you mentioned in your review.
> 
> Could you recommend one that has those but sounds just as "fun" as the se215


 
  
 These days I don't recommend the Monster IEMs at retail price at all. $98 makes them a pretty decent value, though. I think all Monster earphones are fun-sounding to an extent but the Trumpet is my overall favorite - it's brighter than the SE215 but that's not a bad thing in my book. Bass is thumpy, definitely sufficient for me. Maybe a touch less deep than the SE215 but not hugely so.  
  


godlyatheist said:


> To the people that have custom IEM, I have some questions:
> 
> 1) How much isolation do you get with a proper fit? Are you able to clearly hear people next to you talk? If you walk around on the street, are the noises all very dim or just slightly dim?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Careful with the lungs there, might have earphone naysayers coming up with new health risks of IEM use...
  
 Isolation really depends on how tight the molds are in your ears and how far they extend into your ear canal. Most of my customs isolate about as much as well-isolating universals. If you don't have music playing you should hear most of the sounds around you, albeit at a somewhat reduced volume. The reduction does vary with type of noise.
  
 Not sure about the faceplates - I don't look at myself wearing my customs much but as far as I can tell they're mostly symmetric. I can do the rotation pretty easily to insert/remove except with silicone sets. Everyone's ears are different, though.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> I haven't tried the Noble universals. The Noble 4S is IMO more accurate than the SD-2 - brighter and more energetic. It's a lot more Etymotic-like than the SD-2 and also has advantages in clarity, resolution, imaging, etc. The SD-2 has a slight advantage in bass depth but that's about it. But again, this is compared to the $999 Noble 4S and I'm not sure how that compares to the universal version.


 
 I see, thanks. How does the sd-2 stack up to the ck100 which is the main iem i'm using now.


----------



## TR3v

Just out of curiosity joker how many IEMs do you currently own?


----------



## Solarium

I'm actually really digging the GR07-BE too, it's more serious sounding, more true to the original sound, and the bass IMO is perfect not muddy at all and very full. I tried using the foam tips and it works better than any other tips (I think my ears can only take foam tips). Because of the longer nozzle it fits into my ear canal easier than the W3 (which has a tubby body preventing further insertion). The isolation is actually much better than the gel tips with the foam tips, I would say very close to W3's levels (4.5/5), better than the S4's (3.5/5), maybe a 4/5 with the foam tips. It plays perfectly with my Magni, no noise floor at all. I'm beginning to understand what's all the fuss surrounding the GR07 is about. I can't stop appreciating how well the cable is made, the material feels very high end and the red/silver stripes has a good taste.


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> I see, thanks. How does the sd-2 stack up to the ck100 which is the main iem i'm using now.


 
  
 Very different signature - the CK100 rolls off in the bass region and has pretty bright "audio-technica" treble, as well as forward mids. The SD-2 has extended bass, the mids are not at all forward, and the treble is a little relaxed.
  


tr3v said:


> Just out of curiosity joker how many IEMs do you currently own?


 

 About 120


----------



## ljokerl

Forgot to mention - my review of the Onkyo IE-HF300 IEMs is now up over at InnerFidelity, along with measurements of the same: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/onkyo-ie-hf300s-and-ie-fc300-ear-headphones


----------



## getclikinagas

ljokerl said:


> Forgot to mention - my review of the Onkyo IE-HF300 IEMs is now up over at InnerFidelity, along with measurements of the same: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/onkyo-ie-hf300s-and-ie-fc300-ear-headphones


 
 Considering the Fidelio S2 is going for 94$ would you prefer the Onkyos at the same price range? The fidelios are less "fun" I presume?


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> Very different signature - the CK100 rolls off in the bass region and has pretty bright "audio-technica" treble, as well as forward mids. The SD-2 has extended bass, the mids are not at all forward, and the treble is a little relaxed.


 
 Thanks. How much darker is the treble of the SD-2 compared to the CK100?  I've kind of got accustomed to that sort of treble energy.


----------



## dezane222

hi joker
 recently i listened to Brainwavz B2, wow, the detail is very good, but the clarity that make me like it very very much.
 but i don't buy it because the bass quantity is nowhere to find and very unsufficient for me.
 compare to vc1000, do you thing vc1000 will have the detail and especially the clarity of B2?
 and more important, do it has more bass quantity and impact than B2?


----------



## dezane222

can i add r-50 and gr01 in the list
 thanks


----------



## ljokerl

getclikinagas said:


> Considering the Fidelio S2 is going for 94$ *would you prefer the Onkyos at the same price range*? *The fidelios are less "fun" I presume*?


 
  
 No; yes. The Onkyos have a few things going for them but they are not at the level of the Philips or the RE-400 or the GR07 when it comes to fidelity. They're more competition for the RBH EP1 I reviewed the other day - fun and consumer-friendly, but with room to grow on the fidelity side. Best thing about them is probably the presentation, which is spacious, open, and airy. They can easily give the GR07 or Fidelio S2 a run for the money there.
  


love music said:


> Thanks. How much darker is the treble of the SD-2 compared to the CK100?  I've kind of got accustomed to that sort of treble energy.


 
  
 Don't know how to quantify it really other than to say it's noticeably darker. 
  


dezane222 said:


> can i add r-50 and gr01 in the list
> thanks


 
  
 All of these earphones you're looking at have similar bass quantity. The GR01 is the best of the bunch but there's a very good chance it still won't have enough bass for you - it only has a few dB on the B2. If you found the B2 to have no bass you might be better off with a hybrid design like the T-Peos H-100 or Dunu DN-1000.


----------



## ozkan

dezane222 said:


> hi joker
> recently i listened to Brainwavz B2, wow, the detail is very good, but the clarity that make me like it very very much.
> but i don't buy it because the bass quantity is nowhere to find and very unsufficient for me.
> compare to vc1000, do you thing vc1000 will have the detail and especially the clarity of B2?
> and more important, do it has more bass quantity and impact than B2?


 
 You can add Ortofon e-Q5 in your list. It has more bass than B2 but treble is clearer and has more presence on B2. It will be a though decision for you.


----------



## Mr Trev

Hi.
  I'm looking to get a new pair of dynamic driver IEMs. I'm looking to spend ~$50-100 and am hoping to find something that has the roughly same sound as my Phonak PFE 111's (grey filter. Although I'd be happier if Phonak made a dark grey one). Right now I'm looking towards the Audio-Technica IM50 or the Vsonic VSD3 when they get released. I'll be primarily listening on my Fiio X3 so I need something that'll play well with it's warm sig. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
 Cheers.


----------



## ljokerl

mr trev said:


> Hi.
> I'm looking to get a new pair of dynamic driver IEMs. I'm looking to spend ~$50-100 and am hoping to find something that has the roughly same sound as my Phonak PFE 111's (grey filter. Although I'd be happier if Phonak made a dark grey one). Right now I'm looking towards the Audio-Technica IM50 or the Vsonic VSD3 when they get released. I'll be primarily listening on my Fiio X3 so I need something that'll play well with it's warm sig. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> Cheers.


 
  
 The Phonaks are BA-based and are still very competitive, especially if you're only looking at dynamic earphones with a similar sound signature. Can't comment on the IM50 or VSD3, though.


----------



## dezane222

> All of these earphones you're looking at have similar bass quantity. The GR01 is the best of the bunch but there's a very good chance it still won't have enough bass for you - it only has a few dB on the B2. If you found the B2 to have no bass you might be better off with a hybrid design like the T-Peos H-100 or Dunu DN-1000


 
 do you think h-100 will have same clarity of B2?
 between vc1000 and b2, which one do you think have better clarity and detail ? or is it on the same level?
 i will pair vc1000 with fiio e11 to boost the bass if it has same clarity as b2, coz vc1000 is much cheaper in indonesia.


----------



## dezane222

ozkan said:


> You can add Ortofon e-Q5 in your list. It has more bass than B2 but treble is clearer and has more presence on B2. It will be a though decision for you.


 
 thanks for reply
 but i'm afraid e-Q5 would be out of budget for me


----------



## ljokerl

dezane222 said:


> do you think h-100 will have same clarity of B2?


 
  
 It's pretty close. 
  


dezane222 said:


> between vc1000 and b2, which one do you think have better clarity and detail ? or is it on the same level?
> i will pair vc1000 with fiio e11 to boost the bass if it has same clarity as b2, coz vc1000 is much cheaper in indonesia.


 
  
 They both use the Knowles TWFK driver. I don't think either has an advantage in clarity or detail over the other. If VC1000 is cheaper than B2 then by all means go for the VSonics.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> Don't know how to quantify it really other than to say it's noticeably darker.


 
 Ok, thanks for the help joker much appreciated.


----------



## raptor18

Joker
  
 I think its amazing to have a person like you. What you are contributing with to the whole IEM scene is probably bigger than we all can imagine.
  
 I don't want to imagine what is happening at the R&D departments at headphone makers, stressing them making better and cheaper headphones.
 Also proving that if you are a small headphone maker and make good headphones, you will sell.


----------



## dezane222

thanks for the reply joker
 much appreciated


----------



## 177261

When are you going to test the Sony XBA-H1 and H3?
  
 Again i am very glad for you contribution for us all consumers!
   
Cheers!


----------



## Mr Trev

ljokerl said:


> The Phonaks are BA-based and are still very competitive, especially if you're only looking at dynamic earphones with a similar sound signature. Can't comment on the IM50 or VSD3, though.


 
 Thanks, you're doing some excellent work here.
 I'm very happy with the 111s, but since they're now discontinued I want to get a secondary pair for when I'm out and about (I'd really hate to freeze them to death). I figured I'd look at a dynamic mostly to get a different sound, but with a similar sig. Although maybe if I can find a cheap pair of 012s I might get 'em and use one of my spare greys with them. Also I kinda want a new toy for the new year
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Still if you could offer some suggestions for under $100 that might pair well with the X3 I'll check em out.
 Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> Ok, thanks for the help joker much appreciated.


 


dezane222 said:


> thanks for the reply joker
> much appreciated


 
  





  


raptor18 said:


> Joker
> 
> I think its amazing to have a person like you. What you are contributing with to the whole IEM scene is probably bigger than we all can imagine.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks! I doubt my reviews have as much effect as you think (sales in the hundreds or even thousands of units don't make or break a headphone company, unless we're talking customs) but I'm very pleased with being able to guide some buyers to a better IEM or headphone than they'd otherwise have gotten. 
  


christianh said:


> When are you going to test the Sony XBA-H1 and H3?
> 
> Again i am very glad for you contribution for us all consumers!
> 
> Cheers!


 
  
 Unfortunately I don't have either of the Sony hybrids in the queue at this time.


----------



## ljokerl

mr trev said:


> Thanks, you're doing some excellent work here.
> I'm very happy with the 111s, but since they're now discontinued I want to get a secondary pair for when I'm out and about (I'd really hate to freeze them to death). I figured I'd look at a dynamic mostly to get a different sound, but with a similar sig. Although maybe if I can find a cheap pair of 012s I might get 'em and use one of my spare greys with them. Also I kinda want a new toy for the new year
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't have an X3 but since you like a fairly accurate sound I have no problem recommending a HiFiMan RE-400 as a warmer, less treble-happy contrast to the 111. Another option would be a Fidelio S1 from Philips.


----------



## Tharagz08

Hi Joker,
  
First off thank you for this MASSIVE review thread, this is insane. I hope you can understand the thousands of people you've greatly assisted in making a purchasing decision for IEMS by doing all of this.
  
Now if you don't mind I am conflicted and have narrowed down my choices to 4 earbuds.
  
My budget is anywhere from $100-$450USD. Because I am on the go often the majority of my music collection right now is in 320 bitrate, while about 20% of it is loseless.
  
I am not a "bass head" though I do enjoy powerful and impactful bass, but it must be controlled (I can't stand Beats by Dre, the bass is bloated and leaks everywhere) whereas my Monster Turbine IEMs had great bass quality but it leaked a bit much into the mid.
  
My favorite listening experience was with my HiFiMan HE-400 Headphones with my 02 amp, but I no longer work from home and am unable to take them with me. The bass though on the headphones, while I LOVED how deep it went it had next to no impact. I loved the open sound stage of them and the clarity but I wanted more "passion" from acoustic albums - The songs just weren’t that powerful sounding to me on the HE-400. I needed a more alive and powerful signature.
  
I had a pair of Bose QC20 IEMs and the sound was flat sounding to me. I seriously thought they weren’t much better than my Klipsch S4i's. The S4i's again do not impress me on any front, weak bass poor clarity poor sound stage. This could have been a fit issue with the Bose QC20's ear design.
  
Now to my choices - I am down to the GR07 BE (though I worry about sibilance, my ears are extremely sensitive to high pitched sounds), Alclair Reference, Custom Art Music One (or the new Music Two), and 1964 v3. I worry about sibilance on the GR07, I worry about the lack of bass impact from the Music One/Two and 1964 v3, and I worry about the Alclair Reference being too "neutral". 
  
Sorry if any of my wordage is not clear here. I am relatively new to all of this. I am not a musician but music plays a very important role in my life and I'd like to do whatever I can to enjoy it to its fullest. Any further advice you can give is great. Thank you again for what you do, and I hope you have a great 2014! Congrats again on getting your interactive site up http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list !!
  
Mike


----------



## ljokerl

tharagz08 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> First off thank you for this MASSIVE review thread, this is insane. I hope you can understand the thousands of people you've greatly assisted in making a purchasing decision for IEMS by doing all of this.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hmm... the S4 had weak bass? Could it have been a fake? If it's a genuine S4 worn properly, then it seems you like quite a bit of bass. On that basis I don't think the GR07BE, and especially not the Alclair Reference or Custom Art Music One, will be a good fit for you. The 1964-V3 has more impactful bass than all of these and is the only set of the ones you're considering that can beat the S4 in that respect. 
  
 However, I don't often recommend jumping straight into customs from budget sets, especially as you don't seem to be entirely honed in on the type of sound you want yet - perhaps you should first try a higher-end enhanced-bass universal like the Yamaha EPH-100?


----------



## Tharagz08

Hi Joker,
  
 Well there was an interesting turn of events - my Wife had ordered the GR07 BEs for me as a late Christmas present and they arrived today! I have read that these need some breakin, but WOW these are pretty awesome out of the box! I will wait until they have had time to burn in before I take them too seriously, but right away this is the level of bass I want. Anything more than this would be too much for me. It was tricky finding the right size tip for my ear, I'm determined that the tips on my S4's were not a good fit either and that's why I was missing bass. It's a shame I've gone this long with a bad fit on my ear buds, can't believe what I've been missing.
  
 Looks like my decision was made for me and looks like it was a good one. I am going to give these a good burn in for a few days then jump back with some impressions. I do appreciate your response and will take your advice on the CIEMs, I will give it some time to dig into my music collection with these GR07 BEs and see what I do and do not like about them before dropping $400+. She grabbed the combo that came with the GR06s also, need to find something to do with those next.
  
 Mike


----------



## ljokerl

tharagz08 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Well there was an interesting turn of events - my Wife had ordered the GR07 BEs for me as a late Christmas present and they arrived today! I have read that these need some breakin, but WOW these are pretty awesome out of the box! I will wait until they have had time to burn in before I take them too seriously, but right away this is the level of bass I want. Anything more than this would be too much for me. It was tricky finding the right size tip for my ear, I'm determined that the tips on my S4's were not a good fit either and that's why I was missing bass. It's a shame I've gone this long with a bad fit on my ear buds, can't believe what I've been missing.
> 
> ...


 
  
 All's well that ends well!
  
 I would agree that your S4 didn't fit properly, or maybe was a counterfeit one, if it didn't have as much bass as the GR07.


----------



## Solarium

After trying out the GR07 BE, Westone 3, MA750, and even the X10's, none of them inserts as easily to get a good seal and as comfortable as my old S4's. I'm not sure why since the S4's aren't even rated that well in the comfort department


----------



## AgentJ

Hi again Joker 
  
 You had previously advised me to get the Astrotec AM800s which I have to say do sound great - the highs and mids are great compared to what I remember of my old JVC XXs. 
  
 I've been looking for BT and wired adapters to control my phone's music playback, and act as a mic, but I soon realised that some new IEMs might be in order (does this mean I'm hooked now?)
  
 The best ones I've found are the MEElec A161P. They're a good price (£50 compared to the £30 of the Astrotec + £20 for the BT adapter) and wanted to know how they compare to the Astrotecs and also the Shure SE215s edit: or the MEElec M-Duo?
  
 I know you have rated the A161Ps higher but I also see that they have a lower frequency range, and you describe them as dry, compared to the AM800s being airy.
  
 And I've just realised that although the Shures and the A161P would be great for over the ear, that would stop me using the mic :S and so I might need to get one of those BT adapters anyway, although I wear my IEMs cable down more often than not (but I do now know why so many prefer over the ear)
  
 Thanks again!


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> Hi again Joker
> 
> You had previously advised me to get the Astrotec AM800s which I have to say do sound great - the highs and mids are great compared to what I remember of my old JVC XXs.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The A161P is more accurate and also more analytical than the Astotec. The AM-800 is more v-shaped in comparison with some added bass and a bit more treble sparkle.
  
 The SE215 is warmer and bassier than both the A161P and AM-800. Not sure about the M-Duo - never tried it. Also, the SE215 is always worn over-the-ear so doing that will not stop you from using the mic. However, the mic doesn't come standard on those so you have to either buy the mic accessory cable separately or make sure to get them already with the optional mic cable. 
  
 You might want to consider the JVC FRD80. It seems to be pretty cheap on ebay and is the mic version of the FXD80 I reviewed: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/jvc-ha-fxd80/.


----------



## Gilly87

Hey joker,

I'm curious about the Alclair Reference; I'm looking for a cheaper alternative to the UERM. I want something a bit v shaped, like my DT770 and former (soon to be repurchased) HD25, with a neutral or ever so slightly warm tone in the mids, punchy bass and sparkly treble. I liked the TF10 a lot, I only wish the fit was better, and they could be a bit less colored. Do you think the Alclair could offer a decent balance of these elements? Otherwise I am looking at the W3(0) again, which had too much midbass for my taste but was otherwise pretty close to what I want. Any thoughts?


----------



## Gilly87

Everyone's ears are different 


solarium said:


> After trying out the GR07 BE, Westone 3, MA750, and even the X10's, none of them inserts as easily to get a good seal and as comfortable as my old S4's. I'm not sure why since the S4's aren't even rated that well in the comfort department


----------



## FlySweep

@Gilly87 .. have you considered the UE4?  It's said to be _very_ similar to the UERM in tuning.


----------



## ljokerl

gilly87 said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> I'm curious about the Alclair Reference; I'm looking for a cheaper alternative to the UERM. I want something a bit v shaped, like my DT770 and former (soon to be repurchased) HD25, with a neutral or ever so slightly warm tone in the mids, punchy bass and sparkly treble. I liked the TF10 a lot, I only wish the fit was better, and they could be a bit less colored. Do you think the Alclair could offer a decent balance of these elements? Otherwise I am looking at the W3(0) again, which had too much midbass for my taste but was otherwise pretty close to what I want. Any thoughts?


 
  
 Hmm.. interesting question. Your description does sound like the Reference except that the UERM (demo) quite honestly sounded noticeably better to me and had a slightly different sound presentation - fuller, smoother, thicker, and more coherent. 
  
 Have you heard the GR07? In terms of overall balance that's what I'd liken the Reference to over the W3 or TF10. Or the PFE232, though it's bassier.


----------



## ikjadoon

Joker, any thoughts about replacing an Etymotic HF5? They were unfortunately run into the vacuum cleaner, the earbuds torn right off the cabling. 
  
 I listen to many different kinds of music: rock, pop, folk, piano, vocal, some hip-hop, and a touch of spoken word, so all-arounders seem like the best option. I often wear IEMs for hours on end, so comfort is important, and while running, so the fewer microphonics, the better. I'd like to hear the music as close to a live performance. I don't mind if the headphones color the spectrum whichever way to make that sound.
  
 What I liked about the Ety HF5s: super-detailed and clear sound and amazing isolation. What I did not like: bass felt weak for hip-hop and pop (even with a great fit), microphonics were troublesome in quiet settings (I wore them cable-down), after long sessions, I had some ear discomfort (as the Ety HF5s seem to go pretty deep), and the "sound stage" was disappointing (exactly as your review; good left/right, but I didn't discern any other depth).
  
 I'd like to keep my next IEMs for years, so I wanted to get the best I could under $500. For me, the CustomArt Music One was unequivocally the winner that checked all the boxes. It seems like the *best* IEMs at that price-point, competing with cans nearly 4-5x the price.
  
 Did I miss other IEMs that might fit me? Do the Music Ones have any big flaws? I mean, if you care about isolation, microphonics, and sound quality, they sound like the absolute best for $200-$800 or something, haha. I don't know why they aren't just flying off the shelves....


----------



## suman134

i may not be exactly correct but , customs are difficult to fly by , they have fitting issues at times , even after molding it to your initial ear impression . and they will just cut you out off your surroundings , im thinking of getting one , may be a cheaper one from ue .


----------



## Chude Mleko

Happy New Year Joker!
  
 I wonder what would be your favorite set with mic? Something sounding similar to RE-400? Could you compare it (whatever that set is) to A161P? Similarly priced as well...
  
 Cheers


----------



## Gilly87

I've not heard the GR07, been holding out for replaceable cables but...maybe I should let that one go for now...or be zen and see what their new models are like.
  
 Based on what I've read I think I'd prefer the BE, though; I like a slight u/v shape. PFE232 would probably be my IEM of choice if it wasn't so expensive. 
  
 I'm guessing the Reference might not have the bass I'm looking for, though; how would you compare it in terms of quantity and impact to something like the SM3?
  
 Thanks again! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Hmm.. interesting question. Your description does sound like the Reference except that the UERM (demo) quite honestly sounded noticeably better to me and had a slightly different sound presentation - fuller, smoother, thicker, and more coherent.
> 
> Have you heard the GR07? In terms of overall balance that's what I'd liken the Reference to over the W3 or TF10. Or the PFE232, though it's bassier.


----------



## Gilly87

It is intriguing, but given its graph, I'd probably just as soon buy an ER4 and save on impressions; from what I've read it's said to be more analytical/less musical than UERM, with a smaller soundstage, and without that special musicality that makes the UERM what it is, it's basically just an analytical custom with a big soundstage; without that addictive musicality, I would probably be left craving more bass. Thanks for the rec though 
  
 Quote:


flysweep said:


> @Gilly87 .. have you considered the UE4?  It's said to be _very_ similar to the UERM in tuning.


----------



## ozkan

ikjadoon said:


> Joker, any thoughts about replacing an Etymotic HF5? They were unfortunately run into the vacuum cleaner, the earbuds torn right off the cabling.
> 
> I listen to many different kinds of music: rock, pop, folk, piano, vocal, some hip-hop, and a touch of spoken word, so all-arounders seem like the best option. I often wear IEMs for hours on end, so comfort is important, and while running, so the fewer microphonics, the better. I'd like to hear the music as close to a live performance. I don't mind if the headphones color the spectrum whichever way to make that sound.
> 
> ...


 
 I have also had Etymotic HF5 in the past. While the isolation was pretty good, I didn't like its sound because of the weak bass and rolled off treble. You might also consider Tdk Ba-200s as they don't have that bass weakness that HF5 suffers and the soundstage is also wider and much deeper. The presentation is quite big and with Westone star tips, the fit is very good. It is more analog sounding iem than HF5 and Super Fi 5.


----------



## yalper

ozkan said:


> I have also had Etymotic HF5 in the past. While the isolation was pretty good, I didn't like its sound because of the weak bass and rolled off treble. You might also consider Tdk Ba-200s as they don't have that bass weakness that HF5 suffers and the soundstage is also wider and much deeper. The presentation is quite big and with Westone star tips, the fit is very good. It is more analog sounding iem than HF5 and Super Fi 5.


 
 Good point!


----------



## AgentJ

ljokerl said:


> agentj said:
> 
> 
> > Hi again Joker
> ...




But now I have too many options  

Out of those three, which would you say is the best (I'm guessing they're worth an upgrade ? Going on the ratings you had given I would've thought the A161P would be but the shures are beginning to sound pretty nice and now I'm confused. You said the JVC aren't that great for smaller ears, so I'm not sure if they'd be that great for me 
But now I have too many options  

And I wouldn't need an amp for any of these, would I?


----------



## ljokerl

ikjadoon said:


> Joker, any thoughts about replacing an Etymotic HF5? They were unfortunately run into the vacuum cleaner, the earbuds torn right off the cabling.
> 
> I listen to many different kinds of music: rock, pop, folk, piano, vocal, some hip-hop, and a touch of spoken word, so all-arounders seem like the best option. I often wear IEMs for hours on end, so comfort is important, and while running, so the fewer microphonics, the better. I'd like to hear the music as close to a live performance. I don't mind if the headphones color the spectrum whichever way to make that sound.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Music One's flaws are hardly big, but if I were to sum them up they would be
 1. Bass could stand to be a little tighter
 2. I would prefer more treble energy, a-la HF5
  
 Barring those two things I highly recommend them. The cable is excellent, the isolation is excellent, the comfort is excellent, etc., etc. They don't have tons of bass, but more than your old Etys, and meet your requirements otherwise. Not really sure how a silicone CIEM would work during running, either - if you get sweaty your ear canal might get humid with no ability to vent if a silicone CIEM is inserted, which could lead to issues with the earphones. 
  
 There are certainly other (universal-fit) options - the TDKs mentioned above, the VSonic GR07, the StageDiver SD-2, the Phonak 232, etc., but I won't try to make a case for any of them over the Music One. 
  


chude mleko said:


> Happy New Year Joker!
> 
> I wonder what would be your favorite set with mic? Something sounding similar to RE-400? Could you compare it (whatever that set is) to A161P? Similarly priced as well...
> 
> Cheers


 
  
 Compared to the A161P, the RE400 is more spacious and has slightly more full-sounding bass, as well as smoother treble. The A161P's bass is also punchy but it's more armature-like in character, with quicker decay. Its treble is also a little more grainy. To me the RE-400 sounds more natural overall. 
  
 In that price range, purely for sound quality and with a mic, I like the Philips Fidelio S1 better than the A161P.
  
 Compared to the RE-400, the S1 has better bass depth and more bass overall. Its upper midrange and treble are more energetic whereas the RE-400 is smoother and more laid-back up top with a warmer overall tone. The S1 also has a wider soundstage than the RE-400.
  


gilly87 said:


> I've not heard the GR07, been holding out for replaceable cables but...maybe I should let that one go for now...or be zen and see what their new models are like.
> 
> Based on what I've read I think I'd prefer the BE, though; I like a slight u/v shape. PFE232 would probably be my IEM of choice if it wasn't so expensive.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Expensive and discontinued as far as I know.
  
 The bass of the Reference is less enhanced compared to the SM2/SM3/SM64.
  


agentj said:


> But now I have too many options
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Well, the one I prefer (the A161P) wouldn't necessarily be the one you like best. It has less bass than your AM-800, for example. The FXD80/FRD80 sounds more like the AM-800 than the A161 does. 
  
 I think they're all great earphones - if the warmer/bassier signature of the Shures appeals to you and the pricing (with the mic cable factored in) makes sense, by all means go for the Shures. Shure is also bringing out a new $50 model soon - the SE112. Not sure there are any reviews of it out there yet, though.


----------



## AgentJ

Even less bass? I liked the v shape on the AM800 but I do feel like there could be more bass. Looks like it's gonna be the Shures then. 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk


----------



## Chude Mleko

ljokerl said:


> Compared to the A161P, the RE400 is more spacious and has slightly more full-sounding bass, as well as smoother treble. The A161P's bass is also punchy but it's more armature-like in character, with quicker decay. Its treble is also a little more grainy. To me the RE-400 sounds more natural overall.
> 
> In that price range, purely for sound quality and with a mic, I like the Philips Fidelio S1 better than the A161P.
> 
> Compared to the RE-400, the S1 has better bass depth and more bass overall. Its upper midrange and treble are more energetic whereas the RE-400 is smoother and more laid-back up top with a warmer overall tone. The S1 also has a wider soundstage than the RE-400.


 
 Thanks joker!
  
 I noticed fidelio doesn't appear on your Multi-IEM Review Table yet. Any idea when you might review it and add it there?
 BTW if I can make a suggestion the table would greatly benefit from another column which describes sound signature. No point in looking at similar scores for sound if they sound very different. I hope you know what I mean.
  
 Anyway, I look at that table filtering by price up to $120 and sorting by sound score. R-50M comes first even in front of RE-400 (it's 20% more expensive in fairness though). You described HF2 the way that put's me off for some reason. MA750i looks interesting and it scored better than A161P as well. Do you think S1 will beat them in terms of sound quality? All 4 of them R50M, MA750i, A161P and S1 have similar sound signatures, don't they?
  
 I'm wasting your time splitting hairs?
  

 Cheers!


----------



## ikjadoon

suman134 said:


> i may not be exactly correct but , customs are difficult to fly by , they have fitting issues at times , even after molding it to your initial ear impression . and they will just cut you out off your surroundings , im thinking of getting one , may be a cheaper one from ue .


 
  
 Hi! I'm not sure if you were replying to me, but I've actually heard customs fitting extremely well. Was that not your experience? About the isolation: haha, perfect. Just what I'm looking for! 
  


ozkan said:


> I have also had Etymotic HF5 in the past. While the isolation was pretty good, I didn't like its sound because of the weak bass and rolled off treble. You might also consider Tdk Ba-200s as they don't have that bass weakness that HF5 suffers and the soundstage is also wider and much deeper. The presentation is quite big and with Westone star tips, the fit is very good. It is more analog sounding iem than HF5 and Super Fi 5.


 
  
 OK, solid, I'll give them a look. Thank you for the tip! 
  


ljokerl said:


> The Music One's flaws are hardly big, but if I were to sum them up they would be
> 1. Bass could stand to be a little tighter
> 2. I would prefer more treble energy, a-la HF5
> 
> ...


 
  
 OK, whew, good to hear. I appreciate the response. So, I was perusing the CustomArt's forum post and apparently they're releasing a "Music Two" this month which is actually a dual BA design! Ostensibly, it seems to be all upgrades from the Music Ones.
  
 Concerning sweat: OK, right. My ears don't really sweat, but I'll send an email to CustomArt and see if they have any thoughts about it.
  
 Haha, OK, right. Universal fit used to be my game, but I might as well get customs if I can fit them in my price range (and on such a good set of IEMs, anyways!). Thank you for your help!


----------



## AgentJ

> > Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> > Well, the one I prefer (the A161P) wouldn't necessarily be the one you like best. It has less bass than your AM-800, for example. The FXD80/FRD80 sounds more like the AM-800 than the A161 does.
> >
> > I think they're all great earphones - if the warmer/bassier signature of the Shures appeals to you and the pricing (with the mic cable factored in) makes sense, by all means go for the Shures. Shure is also bringing out a new $50 model soon - the SE112. Not sure there are any reviews of it out there yet, though.
> ...


----------



## kova4a

^ ^ ^The a161p's bass will start to distort if you boost it a lot but "neutral" does not meant the a161p has an ety level of bass and it's lacking - its bass actually has pretty good impact and is fairly aggressive, so you might not find it lacking as much as you expect.


----------



## AgentJ

kova4a said:


> ^ ^ ^The a161p's bass will start to distort if you boost it a lot but "neutral" does not meant the a161p has an ety level of bass and it's lacking - its bass actually has pretty good impact and is fairly aggressive, so you might not find it lacking as much as you expect.


 
 Ah right. I was thinking it might start distortion.
  
 Joker said it had less bass than my AM800s, which I thought didn't have that much, which is why I wasn't so sure. When connected to my PC, they feel more bassy (although I realised I had the EQ which made more of a difference than I had thought)
  
 Now that I've been sat here listening to them for a while, I think they're actually pretty good in a quiet room - and I hardly ever listen to them in a quiet room (mainly on my bike or in the school study room [which tends to get loud]) I'm not sure if it's placebo, but they do sound slightly better when connected to my PC, so I hope the new phone I'll be getting will be better than my current one. 
  
 (I've turned the volume up, and they are actually pretty great )


----------



## kova4a

agentj said:


> Ah right. I was thinking it might start distortion.
> 
> Joker said it had less bass than my AM800s, which I thought didn't have that much, which is why I wasn't so sure. When connected to my PC, they feel more bassy (although I realised I had the EQ which made more of a difference than I had thought)
> 
> ...


 
 Well, there are a lot of factors that can affect the bass aside from the source's signature. Most phones have high output impedance, which will cause a bass roll off in something like the 16ohm am800. Also phones are made with low-power sound chips, so the output power is usually pretty low, especially android phones as most of them have a lot less power in that department than an iphone for instance and this can also affect the bass, in particular its control and impact. And yeah, while the a161p has pretty good bass for a single BA iem, the am800 has more. It's also good to mention that the a161p is more of a mid-forward iem unlike the V-shaped am800, which has emphasis on the bass and the treble, so with a161p you might also not like the soundstage size and the treble, which rolls off a bit early and is low on sparkle.


----------



## AgentJ

Alright, thanks for the quick reply!
  
 I think I'm gonna cross the A161Ps off my list of potential list then. What about the Shure 215? I know they're warmer and bassier, but would their highs/mids be any better than the AM800? 
 Yeah, I think I like the sparkle and the v shape signature  I get with the AM800, so would you think I should avoid the 215s then?
  
 The JVC FD80 that joker recommended do look great but I think I'll have to rule them out if they're liely to not fit well.
  
 Looking at the guide sorted by sound signature, the only other recommended V shaped IEMs are the Thinksound MS01 and the JVC HA-FXT90, both of which are more than I'd like to spend, but I'm happy getting them if they're gonna be worth it.


----------



## kova4a

agentj said:


> Alright, thanks for the quick reply!
> 
> I think I'm gonna cross the A161Ps off my list of potential list then. What about the Shure 215? I know they're warmer and bassier, but would their highs/mids be any better than the AM800?
> Yeah, I think I like the sparkle and the v shape signature  I get with the AM800, so would you think I should avoid the 215s then?
> ...


 
 Well, I guess you can alwso consider something slightly less v-shaped like the VSD1 or you might go look and ask around The discovery thread as most people there seem to prefer V-shaped and bassy sound and they do buy and try a lot of stuff that joker hasn't reviewed and heard - I know that they were praising the Zero Audio Carbo Basso few months ago and some other iems in your price range.


----------



## quartertone

The AM-800 is only mildly v-shaped. I hardly hear it that way, really.


----------



## ljokerl

chude mleko said:


> Thanks joker!
> 
> I noticed fidelio doesn't appear on your Multi-IEM Review Table yet. Any idea when you might review it and add it there?
> BTW if I can make a suggestion the table would greatly benefit from another column which describes sound signature. No point in looking at similar scores for sound if they sound very different. I hope you know what I mean.
> ...


 
  
 Yeah I've been slacking off on adding stuff I've already reviewed over at InnerFidelity. That review of the S1/S2 is here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones . I did also put the S1 in my Buyer's Guide here: http://theheadphonelist.com/articles/earphone-buyers-guide/ 
  
 Adding a way to filter by sound signature is on my to-do list. I've tried doing it in the past but always stop when I run into the issue of blurred lines between sound signatures. Do I just leave that column blank when I'm not sure how to classify something? For example the LG Quadbeat is somewhere between "flat" and "v-shaped". I couldn't add it to my current Buyer's Guide because I couldn't figure out where to put it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Anyway, signature-wise the sets you are looking at are all somewhat different. The R-50 is the most "analytical", followed by the A161P which has less treble (including extension) but a little bit more bass punch and a more forward sound. Then comes the S1 which has nice, deep dynamic-driver bass but not still not something I would consider "bassy". It has a more laid-back/spacious presentation than the A161P. The MA750 is the warmest and bassiest of these, I would not classify it as "neutral" in any context, unlike these others. 
  
 P.S. the R-50M is a little more expensive than the regular R-50. 
  


ikjadoon said:


> OK, whew, good to hear. I appreciate the response. So, I was perusing the CustomArt's forum post and apparently they're releasing a "Music Two" this month which is actually a dual BA design! Ostensibly, it seems to be all upgrades from the Music Ones.
> 
> Concerning sweat: OK, right. My ears don't really sweat, but I'll send an email to CustomArt and see if they have any thoughts about it.
> 
> Haha, OK, right. Universal fit used to be my game, but I might as well get customs if I can fit them in my price range (and on such a good set of IEMs, anyways!). Thank you for your help!


 
  
 The Music Two seems very promising from everything I've been told.
  


kova4a said:


> Well, there are a lot of factors that can affect the bass aside from the source's signature. Most phones have high output impedance, which will cause a bass roll off in something like the 16ohm am800. Also phones are made with low-power sound chips, so the output power is usually pretty low, especially android phones as most of them have a lot less power in that department than an iphone for instance and this can also affect the bass, in particular its control and impact. And yeah, while the a161p has pretty good bass for a single BA iem, the am800 has more. It's also good to mention that the a161p is more of a mid-forward iem unlike the V-shaped am800, which has emphasis on the bass and the treble, so with a161p you might also not like the soundstage size and the treble, which rolls off a bit early and is low on sparkle.


 
  
 This is my reservation in recommending the A161P in this case as well. It's just a different sound, and it will likely be even more sensitive to source than the dynamic AM-800 if that's currently a factor. 
  


agentj said:


> Alright, thanks for the quick reply!
> 
> I think I'm gonna cross the A161Ps off my list of potential list then. What about the Shure 215? I know they're warmer and bassier, but would their highs/mids be any better than the AM800?
> Yeah, I think I like the sparkle and the v shape signature  I get with the AM800, so would you think I should avoid the 215s then?
> ...


 
  
 The fit of the JVCs is not that bad - certainly better than many other microdriver earphones even if you have small ear canals. There's a long FXD80/FXD70/FXD60 thread somewhere that you might want to look through to see how many people actually had any issues.
  


quartertone said:


> The AM-800 is only mildly v-shaped. I hardly hear it that way, really.


 
  
 Yep, mostly the treble energy that does it in this case rather than bass boost. Still a different sound from the A161P.


----------



## AgentJ

What about the Beyerdynamic DTX101? Where do they fit in the scale of things? 
If those JVC FDX aren't that bad, then I have even more options :/ 
What about the MS01 or FXT90?
The VSDS1 looks pretty nice as well :/
(from you last post I've almost completely ruled out the A161p, although I might try to see if i can try a pair to see how they sound. And after a bit more listening to my AM800 I think it is the sparkle/treble that I like, along with a nice but not overpowering bass (boss on ears + bass booster is a bit boomy )


----------



## Solarium

It turns out that I don't have narrow canals, and the Comply P-series slim tips I was using with the W3 was too "slim" for my ears. I used the regular sized tips that came with the W3 and they worked perfectly for noise isolation, but they expanded too much and made my ears feel like there's too much pressure trapped inside. I bought some Comply P regular sized tips and holy mother of God they are AMAZING. I never loved another IEM so much as the W3 with these tips, I would rank the noise isolation as 5/5 and comfort 5/5, and it has the most enjoyable SQ out of my other 3 IEM's that I bought (GR07-BE, X10, MA750), build quality 5/5 and accessories 5/5. It complements my HD650 perfectly as the W3 is very energetic, speedy and has elevated shimmery treble, making my EDM's sound the best I've ever heard. Man I'm freakin in LOVE with the W3!


----------



## Chude Mleko

ljokerl said:


> Yeah I've been slacking off on adding stuff I've already reviewed over at InnerFidelity. That review of the S1/S2 is here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones . I did also put the S1 in my Buyer's Guide here: http://theheadphonelist.com/articles/earphone-buyers-guide/
> 
> Adding a way to filter by sound signature is on my to-do list. I've tried doing it in the past but always stop when I run into the issue of blurred lines between sound signatures. Do I just leave that column blank when I'm not sure how to classify something? For example the LG Quadbeat is somewhere between "flat" and "v-shaped". I couldn't add it to my current Buyer's Guide because I couldn't figure out where to put it
> 
> ...


 
 Thank you joker, you are always great help.
 Regarding sound signature column I would probably try to add all key-words if one doesn't fit. maybe not strictly sound signature related but few components that make the set belong to some group or make it unique. Then in extended search people could choose key words they are interested in like clarity, enhanced bass, wide stage, etc. You could allow to make negative choices as well, like show me all but bassy and siblant.


----------



## Sauntere

chude mleko said:


> Thank you joker, you are always great help.
> Regarding sound signature column I would probably try to add all key-words if one doesn't fit. maybe not strictly sound signature related but few components that make the set belong to some group or make it unique. Then in extended search people could choose key words they are interested in like clarity, enhanced bass, wide stage, etc. You could allow to make negative choices as well, like show me all but bassy and siblant.


 
 Or you could just use a symbol like V, U, - as appropriate...


----------



## MoonYeol

sauntere said:


> chude mleko said:
> 
> 
> > Thank you joker, you are always great help.
> ...


 
  
 And combinations of properties would indicate that it's somewhere between. V + F would be somewhere between V-shaped and Flat. Easy as pie... OR? Whatever you come up with I'm sure that it will be awesome. Just like this thread and the interactive guide.


----------



## heliuscc

Ljokerl, have you tried the Fischer Audio FA4-E XB, in comparison to SD2 & 3. I felt SD3 was too much, but fun, and SD2 too little, and boring in comparison. Hunting for the middle ground really.


----------



## Gilly87

ljokerl said:


> Expensive and discontinued as far as I know.




That's a shame.



> The bass of the Reference is less enhanced compared to the SM2/SM3/SM64.




I assumed as much. I found a good deal on a pair of TF10s, I'll stick with them for now and maybe get a reshell/driver upgrade from IM when I get sick of them. Thanks for helping me sift through yet again


----------



## TR3v

Does anyone have any recommendations for a highly durable headphone in the 30-100 dollar range. Pretty much every iem i have owned has broken in 6 months of daily use. My solution to this problem seems to be to recable my headphones and use stronger cabling. Perhaps not the best or most time efficient solution. This question has been asked before and I have never seen a good answer to it.


----------



## Sinocelt

tr3v said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for a highly durable headphone in the 30-100 dollar range. Pretty much every iem i have owned has broken in 6 months of daily use. My solution to this problem seems to be to recable my headphones and use stronger cabling. Perhaps not the best or most time efficient solution. This question has been asked before and I have never seen a good answer to it.


 
  
The Rocket?
   
 Quote:


> *Problem 1 //. It broke... again* ROCKETS aren't just designed in the USA - they're made in USA... in fact, we make pretty much everything ourselves, in-house at our production facility in Nashville, TN, using space-age manufacturing technologies.  These babies are mil-spec durable and are built to take the use (and abuse) of daily wear (and the occasional accident).
> 
> Titanium shells - Super strong, super light, super sound.
> Kevlar tri-weave military grade cables are able to withstand the abuse of  daily use.
> ...


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> What about the Beyerdynamic DTX101? Where do they fit in the scale of things?
> If those JVC FDX aren't that bad, then I have even more options :/
> What about the MS01 or FXT90?
> The VSDS1 looks pretty nice as well :/
> (from you last post I've almost completely ruled out the A161p, although I might try to see if i can try a pair to see how they sound. And after a bit more listening to my AM800 I think it is the sparkle/treble that I like, along with a nice but not overpowering bass (boss on ears + bass booster is a bit boomy )


 
  
 The DXT101 is honestly a bit of a downgrade from your AM-800. Bass is boomier and the treble is not as clean and clear. The MS01 is also not much of an upgrade from the AM-800, more of a sidestep. It has more bass but a little less clarity. The VSD1 is better but has its own downsides (a little sibilant compared to AM-800 and bass not quite as tight). The FXT90 is very nice but a little large for small ears and has more mid-bass than AM-800 and a more forward and aggressive sound in general. I still like it but the FXD80 is a better match for the AM-800's sound signature. 
  


solarium said:


> It turns out that I don't have narrow canals, and the Comply P-series slim tips I was using with the W3 was too "slim" for my ears. I used the regular sized tips that came with the W3 and they worked perfectly for noise isolation, but they expanded too much and made my ears feel like there's too much pressure trapped inside. I bought some Comply P regular sized tips and holy mother of God they are AMAZING. I never loved another IEM so much as the W3 with these tips, I would rank the noise isolation as 5/5 and comfort 5/5, and it has the most enjoyable SQ out of my other 3 IEM's that I bought (GR07-BE, X10, MA750), build quality 5/5 and accessories 5/5. It complements my HD650 perfectly as the W3 is very energetic, speedy and has elevated shimmery treble, making my EDM's sound the best I've ever heard. Man I'm freakin in LOVE with the W3!


 
  
 Glad you found what you were looking for!
  


chude mleko said:


> Thank you joker, you are always great help.
> Regarding sound signature column I would probably try to add all key-words if one doesn't fit. maybe not strictly sound signature related but few components that make the set belong to some group or make it unique. Then in extended search people could choose key words they are interested in like clarity, enhanced bass, wide stage, etc. You could allow to make negative choices as well, like show me all but bassy and siblant.


 
  
 Yep, see my reply to MoonYeol below. Allowing filtering by different combinations of sound signatures would be a whole another challenge but if it leads to better results it'll be worth it.
  
 Good idea on allowing certain specific ones to be excluded!
  


moonyeol said:


> And combinations of properties would indicate that it's somewhere between. V + F would be somewhere between V-shaped and Flat. Easy as pie... OR? Whatever you come up with I'm sure that it will be awesome. Just like this thread and the interactive guide.


 
  
 This is what I was thinking. For things in-between "signatures" the one that applies best would go first and the secondary would go second. For example "V-Shaped/neutral" would be a slightly v-shaped earphone learning towards neutrality (e.g. LG Quadbeat), "Neutral/warm" would be a neutral earphone leaning towards warmth (e.g. StageDiver 2 or HiFiMan RE-600), "Bassy/v-shaped" would be an bass-heavy earphone with a v-shaped overall characteristic (e.g. JVC Xtreme Xplosives). Still needs more thought...
  


heliuscc said:


> Ljokerl, have you tried the Fischer Audio FA4-E XB, in comparison to SD2 & 3. I felt SD3 was too much, but fun, and SD2 too little, and boring in comparison. Hunting for the middle ground really.


 
  
 Sorry, haven't tried any Fischer Amps.
  


gilly87 said:


> That's a shame.
> I assumed as much. I found a good deal on a pair of TF10s, I'll stick with them for now and maybe get a reshell/driver upgrade from IM when I get sick of them. Thanks for helping me sift through yet again


 
  
 I still like the sound of the TF10, personally. Just not the fit in stock form.
  


tr3v said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for a highly durable headphone in the 30-100 dollar range. Pretty much every iem i have owned has broken in 6 months of daily use. My solution to this problem seems to be to recable my headphones and use stronger cabling. Perhaps not the best or most time efficient solution. This question has been asked before and I have never seen a good answer to it.


 
  
 This: http://www.usa.philips.com/c/headphones/oneill-black-sho2205bk_28/prd/en/


----------



## AgentJ

Thanks again Joker!
  
 So it's basically narrowed down to the Shure 215 and the FXD80 (not too bothered about the mic version as I'll probably get the Bluetooth adapter)
  
 If the FXD80 is basically just a better version of the AM800 (as in similar V shapeness), how do the Shures fit in?
  
 (also looking at some Jaybird BlueBuds, going on ebay atm for £80, which is out of budget but then again, they do look pretty cool)


----------



## nehcrow

solarium said:


> It turns out that I don't have narrow canals, and the Comply P-series slim tips I was using with the W3 was too "slim" for my ears. I used the regular sized tips that came with the W3 and they worked perfectly for noise isolation, but they expanded too much and made my ears feel like there's too much pressure trapped inside. I bought some Comply P regular sized tips and holy mother of God they are AMAZING. I never loved another IEM so much as the W3 with these tips, I would rank the noise isolation as 5/5 and comfort 5/5, and it has the most enjoyable SQ out of my other 3 IEM's that I bought (GR07-BE, X10, MA750), build quality 5/5 and accessories 5/5. It complements my HD650 perfectly as the W3 is very energetic, speedy and has elevated shimmery treble, making my EDM's sound the best I've ever heard. Man I'm freakin in LOVE with the W3!


 
 Same!
 Best IEM I've heard in that price range


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> Thanks again Joker!
> 
> So it's basically narrowed down to the Shure 215 and the FXD80 (not too bothered about the mic version as I'll probably get the Bluetooth adapter)
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Shures are not v-shaped. They have more bass than your AM-800 but are warmer and not as bright, with not nearly as much treble sparkle.


----------



## TR3v

These hopefully durable http://www.usa.philips.com/c/headphones/oneill-black-sho2205bk_28/prd/en/ can be had for for 20 bucks on amazon, but not in black. Black ones cost like 3x to 4x more for some strange reason. Def worth a shot for 20 bucks. TY


----------



## ljokerl

Posted the first part of my CES impressions here: http://theheadphonelist.com/ces-2014-headphone-coverage-part-1-klipsch-phiaton-westone-and-more/ . I went through the show trying to test out IEMs and headphones that were new to me. The first set of impressions includes IEMs from Westone and Bell'O Digital, as well as headphones from Phiaton, Klipsch, and others.
  
Cliffnotes verson - part 1
  
 **Bell'O Digital* had several headphones available for demo but none of them impressed me
 **Klipsch*'s new Status over-ear cans were better, but did not keep up with the similarly-priced Sennheiser, Sony, and Phiaton cans I tried. I was able to learn about the new X11 model but neither it nor the X7 were available for demo
 **Wicked Audio*'s new Revolt headphones felt a little cheap and didn't sound good enough for $200. Built-in DSP by Bongiovi Acoustics boosted the bass and treble.
 **Phiaton*'s MS 430 was among the best portable headphones I tried, with clear sound, nice materials, and a reasonable price tag. The pricier MS 500 was less impressive.
 **Etymotic*'s new HD5 model is internally identical to the ETY-Kids
 **Jabra*'s Revo headphones feature nice construction and overwhelming bass
 **Westone* has a full-size headphone forthcoming. Most of the new models are rehashes of previous sets with no changes to the tuning, but feature new housings (for the universal-fit sets) and MMCX coaxial connectors. The W50 and W60 were not available for demo.
  
 For full impressions and photos, see here: http://theheadphonelist.com/ces-2014-headphone-coverage-part-1-klipsch-phiaton-westone-and-more/


----------



## Solude

Confirming the W50 is a universal ES50 is awesome.  Now if only JHAudio would release a universal JH13fp


----------



## Leo888

Nice to know that. Have always wanted to hear the great mids presentation people said of the ES5. Given up on custom as I faced fitting issues thus have to let go of my 8A. Any idea how much will the W50 retails for and any expected release date. Thanks in advance.

Edit: Ok. Did some reading and found my answer. Thanks again.


----------



## TR3v

leo888 said:


> Nice to know that. Have always wanted to hear the great mids presentation people said of the ES5. *Given up on custom as I faced fitting issues* thus have to let go of my 8A. Any idea how much will the W50 retails for and any expected release date. Thanks in advance.
> 
> Edit: Ok. Did some reading and found my answer. Thanks again.


 
 I thought that was the whole point of customs. Getting a perfect fit? What kind of issues did you have just out of curiosity?


----------



## Leo888

Well. Let's just say the builder deem I'm the odd one out who can't be fitted with custom. After 3 refits, guess I'll call it a day and stick with universal. Though I may have better luck with another builder but not gonna take any chances. Will put the money into gears that can be easily pass on to another with the least damage to the wallet. So, let's put this behind and move on. There's a whole lot to look forward to with uiem and joker have done a stupendous job of bringing them forward for the benefit of all. Thanks for the great thread joker.


----------



## suman134

tr3v said:


> I thought that was the whole point of customs. Getting a perfect fit? What kind of issues did you have just out of curiosity?


 
  
     man , as our ear shape changes , customs can get fitting issues , and to tackle that , companies lets you get your phones remolded in a month or likes for free , i suggest silicone molds , but not every phone has that option . still you can get it remolded for something like $50-100 .


----------



## AhhHoNG

Reviewing the new audio tech IM series soon? the most bang of the buck earphone tis year could be the IM70. pretty impressive stuff


----------



## AgentJ

ljokerl said:


> The Shures are not v-shaped. They have more bass than your AM-800 but are warmer and not as bright, with not nearly as much treble sparkle.


 
  
 One last question - how much better are the JVCs compared to the AM800?
  
 Also just found out today that I have infact been using an EQ on my phone, and when turned off, the AM800 actually sound a tad better than I had previously thought, and bass wise they're not as lacking as I once thought. 
  
Thanks again
  
Actually, another question - a bluetooth adapter for the headphones wont affect SQ, will it?


----------



## Gilly87

O_O You heard the new Senns? 
  
 *drool*
  
 And yeah, the TF10 is great...I would kill to get one in a Shure or new Westone housing with MMXC connector. I've heard people say that the new W series sound different and I'm incredibly curious to see the difference, if there is one, between W3 and W30; if they've even managed to tame the midbass by a few dB, I will be waiting very patiently for the price to drop (or to see a used one in the FS section ).
  
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> **Klipsch*'s new Status over-ear cans were better, but did not keep up with the similarly-priced Sennheiser,


----------



## suman134

agentj said:


> Actually, another question - a bluetooth adapter for the headphones wont affect SQ, will it?


 
  
     bluetooth adapter for headphone ? i feel im confused , but bluetooth devices just cant have that amount of clarity , they just cant at times keep up with the amount of complicate data being transmitted , and can come short when it comes to spectrum , extension and frames at times , had an small encounter with 10rbt , it lags at times and extension at treble , but its just fine . mw1 just lacks spectrum . they do bass but lacks extension at treble .


----------



## Gilly87

Yeah bluetooth is generally inferior, but Sony has a couple of cheaper transmitters that will do justice to most <$150 earphones IME.
  
 Quote:


suman134 said:


> bluetooth adapter for headphone ? i feel im confused , but bluetooth devices just cant have that amount of clarity , they just cant at times keep up with the amount of complicate data being transmitted , and can come short when it comes to spectrum , extension and frames at times , had an small encounter with 10rbt , it lags at times and extension at treble , but its just fine . mw1 just lacks spectrum . they do bass but lacks extension at treble .


----------



## AgentJ

gilly87 said:


>


 
  
  


suman134 said:


> bluetooth adapter for headphone ? i feel im confused , but bluetooth devices just cant have that amount of clarity , they just cant at times keep up with the amount of complicate data being transmitted , and can come short when it comes to spectrum , extension and frames at times , had an small encounter with 10rbt , it lags at times and extension at treble , but its just fine . mw1 just lacks spectrum . they do bass but lacks extension at treble .


 
  
 Yeah, something like this HTC Bluetooth one or maybe a wired one and a female-femalecoupler, although I'm not sure if it'd actually work. 
 Would the difference in SQ be noticeable?


----------



## quartertone

Joker, if one already has the Fidelio S1 and the S2 can be had for a similar price, do you think it's worth it? Is it really an upgrade?


----------



## suman134

agentj said:


> Yeah, something like this HTC Bluetooth one or maybe a wired one and a female-femalecoupler, although I'm not sure if it'd actually work.
> Would the difference in SQ be noticeable?


 
  
      its noticeable if you put a good earphone to work , or something with a spark in its treble , most of the time they lose the treble in the air , but if you dont love treble they can be good , some thing like a bit more premium will do good , may be a sony mw1 to be the least expensive and is best for the price , but still a mw1 wont get you a sq even with a er-p4 over 8.0 , for me , cuz to me cutting off the treble is the 2nd worst thing . but if you can do with that , go get one , it will save you from some hassle .


----------



## ljokerl

ahhhong said:


> Reviewing the new audio tech IM series soon? the most bang of the buck earphone tis year could be the IM70. pretty impressive stuff


 
  
 I generally like Audio-Technica IEMs but unfortunately no plans to do those yet. And as far as I could tell Audio-Technica has no plans to officially bring them to the US 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
  


agentj said:


> One last question - how much better are the JVCs compared to the AM800?
> 
> Also just found out today that I have infact been using an EQ on my phone, and when turned off, the AM800 actually sound a tad better than I had previously thought, and bass wise they're not as lacking as I once thought.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Not too different, a little bassier and with slightly more “withdrawn” lower mids and a bit more clarity and resolution all around.
 I haven't tried an APT-X bluetooth adapter yet. The cheap ones I have tried did degrade the sound.
  


> Originally Posted by *Gilly87* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> O_O You heard the new Senns?
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 I got to try the Momentums as well as their new DJ series (HD6/7/8) and of course the high-end stuff that they always have. I wasn’t too interested in their flagships as I’ve already tried those. Writing up my brief Senn impressions now – they’ll be CES Thoughts Part 3.
  


quartertone said:


> Joker, if one already has the Fidelio S1 and the S2 can be had for a similar price, do you think it's worth it? Is it really an upgrade?


 
 Not really – the only time I’d recommend “upgrading” from S1 to S2 is if their signature makes them your end-all, favorite IEMs. Otherwise one is pretty much as good as the other, at least in terms of sound.


----------



## kamcok

ahhhong said:


> Reviewing the new audio tech IM series soon? the most bang of the buck earphone tis year could be the IM70. pretty impressive stuff


 
 I agree with this, bought the IM70 and was very very impressed. The clarity, bass quality and quantity was enough to put a big smile on my face 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 For about $110 it's a better option for people who wants the clarity of the RE-400 but with more bass imo.


----------



## drm870

kamcok said:


> I agree with this, bought the IM70 and was very very impressed. The clarity, bass quality and quantity was enough to put a big smile on my face
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 This is good to know, since it looks increasingly like the TDK BA200 may be being discontinued. (I debated buying them after reading Joker's impressions.)


----------



## Sinocelt

agentj said:


> Yeah, something like this HTC Bluetooth one


 
  
 This one had caught my eyes because of its big, apparently easy-to-feel buttons.


----------



## AgentJ

sinocelt said:


> This one had caught my eyes because of its big, apparently easy-to-feel buttons.


 
  
 It does look good, but I'll have to find an alternative if it's likely that it'll degrade sound quality.
  


ljokerl said:


> Not too different, a little bassier and with slightly more “withdrawn” lower mids and a bit more clarity and resolution all around.
> I haven't tried an APT-X bluetooth adapter yet. The cheap ones I have tried did degrade the sound.
> 41


 
  
 This is actually going to be my last question - would you say the JVCs are actually worth getting? 
  
 I was hoping to be able to resell the AM800s to a friend, and then getting the upgrade for £10, but then he went and bought some Beats -_-


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> This is actually going to be my last question - would you say the JVCs are actually worth getting?
> 
> I was hoping to be able to resell the AM800s to a friend, and then getting the upgrade for £10, but then he went and bought some Beats -_-


 
  
 Well you asked for something with a mic - the JVCs are definitely worth getting if you need a mic. Otherwise, considering you like the AM-800s, might as well just stick with those.


----------



## ljokerl

Part 2 of my CES 2014 impressions, featuring Audio-Technica, STAX, Beyerdynamic, and Polk Audio, is now posted at http://theheadphonelist.com/ces-2014-headphone-coverage-part-2-audio-technica-stax-beyerdynamic-and-more/
  
 TL;DR version
  
 **Audio-Technica*’s new Sonic Fuel sport earphones fit securely, sound good, and are priced right
 *The ATH-W1000X is among the most gorgeous headphones I've ever seen
 *The *STAX* booth provided some much-needed high fidelity after two days of overblown bass. The SR-009 especially blew me away. 
 **Beyerdynamic*’s Custom One Pro is a solidly-built option for bass fans
 **FiiO*’s X5 is an impressive piece of kit. E18 “Kunlun” Android DAC wouldn’t work with my Nexus 5
 **Polk Audio*’s new Heritage Collection features unique aesthetics and the Nue Voe BA earphones sounded promising
  
 Full version with pictures and such can be found here.


----------



## suman134

just got my xba-h1 , , and no they are not big , man xb90ex is big , not these , for now , nice isolation , good bass , i can feel the precision of a balanced armature and decay of a dynamic driver , three differences from xba-3 i instantly recognized is better and wider sound-stage , more bass presence but not as deep for now ( got it 30 mins ago ) , mids are more prominent .
  

  
 the new harder foam stuffing is really nice , and this time they are glued to the rubber entirely , and man , i love red , they look nice , i havent tried them till now . has a cable adjuster , i dont need it at all , and the new cable clip is far better , way easy to get the wire inside it and is way safer then the last gen cable clip . sony should have supplied it with a better pouch , but its okay . something like xb90ex would have done the trick though .
  

  
   see , they are not huge .


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> **Audio-Technica*’s new Sonic Fuel sport earphones fit securely, sound good, and are priced right
> *The ATH-W1000X is among the most gorgeous headphones I've ever seen


 

    did you tried the ckx9 ?


----------



## Sinocelt

ljokerl said:


> **Audio-Technica*’s new Sonic Fuel sport earphones fit securely, sound good, and are priced right


 
  
 Can the cable be worn over the ear?


----------



## eke2k6

ljokerl said:


> *The *STAX* booth provided some much-needed high fidelity after two days of overblown bass. The SR-009 especially blew me away.


 
  
 Now you see the reasoning behind the last line in my sig.


----------



## Amitl

does these seem fake or genuine?
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Original-Yamaha-EPH-100-Earphones-EPH100-/141109714277?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item20dacb5d65


----------



## IPoopFrootLoops

Spent a lot of time before joining Head fi browsing this comparison. Made many a purchase referencing this.


----------



## suman134

amitl said:


> does these seem fake or genuine?
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Original-Yamaha-EPH-100-Earphones-EPH100-/141109714277?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item20dacb5d65


 

        difficult to say . they do look genuine though .


----------



## ljokerl

The H1 looks like it might be pretty comfortable...
  


suman134 said:


> did you tried the ckx9 ?


 
  
 They didn't have one available but I was told that the bass gets increasingly heavy with the higher-end CKX models so I'm not sure I'd like it more than the 5, necessarily. The CKX5 is pretty punchy, probably CX250 or CX300 level.
  


sinocelt said:


> Can the cable be worn over the ear?


 
  
 Not comfortably, no. 
  


eke2k6 said:


> Now you see the reasoning behind the last line in my sig.


 
  
 Lol. Amen to that.
  


amitl said:


> does these seem fake or genuine?
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Original-Yamaha-EPH-100-Earphones-EPH100-/141109714277?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item20dacb5d65


 
  
 There have been reports of fake ones in this very thread. I wouldn't risk it, personally.
  
  


ipoopfrootloops said:


> Spent a lot of time before joining Head fi browsing this comparison. Made many a purchase referencing this.


 
  
  

 I'm happy to hear that


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> The H1 looks like it might be pretty comfortable...
> 
> They didn't have one available but I was told that the bass gets increasingly heavy with the higher-end CKX models so I'm not sure I'd like it more than the 5, necessarily. The CKX5 is pretty punchy, probably CX250 or CX300 level.


 
  
      yup , h1 is really comfortable and isolation is really nice , but the bass decay is a problem , had it burning in for last 14 hrs , havent heard them since then , i hope decay time improves . i know it cant be as good as a BA but 30% decrease will do , and the new isolation tips really reduces the booming bass , but im using the usual hybrid tips , after some 80-90 hrs i will switch to the isolation tips .
      and what will you say about the ckx5 , do they have good decay ?
      and i have a small request , and i might have asked for it a few weeks ago , but , do me a fidelio s1 and re-400 comparison , please .


----------



## AgentJ

ljokerl said:


> Well you asked for something with a mic - the JVCs are definitely worth getting if you need a mic. Otherwise, considering you like the AM-800s, might as well just stick with those.


 
  
 Well suddenly my AM800s have gone really quiet in the left ear. Not sure what really happened, I put them in my coat ocket, and cleaned them out and now it's like that.  Considering I got it from ebay, I'm probably gonna have the get the JVCs (and I found an app which will let me use the one button to control my phone nicely)


----------



## hwkaholic

I am far from what is considered to be an audiophile. However, I do enjoy the music I listen to to sound the best it can inside of my budget. (don't we all). Also, I am a research-a-holic and am driving myself insane trying to make a decision. I have read much of this thread and many of the reviews by the OP. 

My everyday on-ears are V-Moda M80s. I love these things and want to find something as close to the sound stage as these as possible in an IEM.

I recently purchased and received a pair of Denon AH-c300s. I love the sound and the cable. I greatly dislike the size, fit and volume control operation. So, needless to say, they are being returned. 

Here are my requirements:
-Price: < $150, but would prefer something under $100
-In-line mic and three-button control for use with iPhone
-A very sturdy/tangle free cable. (the cable on the C300 is probably one of the best I have seen/felt)
-Good bass response (I listen to mostly hip-hop, classic rock and alt-rock)
-something not too bulky and looks good

Those are my main requirements. Would appreciate a well balanced spectrum with clear mids and highs as well as good vocal clarity.

Hopefully that isn't too much to ask! 

Any recommendations are greatly appreciated and respected!!


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> yup , h1 is really comfortable and isolation is really nice , but the bass decay is a problem , had it burning in for last 14 hrs , havent heard them since then , i hope decay time improves . i know it cant be as good as a BA but 30% decrease will do , and the new isolation tips really reduces the booming bass , but im using the usual hybrid tips , after some 80-90 hrs i will switch to the isolation tips .
> and what will you say about the ckx5 , do they have good decay ?
> and i have a small request , and i might have asked for it a few weeks ago , but , do me a fidelio s1 and re-400 comparison , please .


 
  
 The CKX5 is pretty good, I wouldn't call it high end by any means but $40 for a sweat-resistant earphone with an engaging 
  
 S1 vs RE-400 comparison was a few pages back: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-308-iems-compared-ces-impressions-part-2-added-01-15-14-p-844/12600#post_10145763 
  


agentj said:


> Well suddenly my AM800s have gone really quiet in the left ear. Not sure what really happened, I put them in my coat ocket, and cleaned them out and now it's like that.  Considering I got it from ebay, I'm probably gonna have the get the JVCs (and I found an app which will let me use the one button to control my phone nicely)


 
  
 There's a number of Android apps that will do that. I use the JAYS headset controller.
  
  


hwkaholic said:


> I am far from what is considered to be an audiophile. However, I do enjoy the music I listen to to sound the best it can inside of my budget. (don't we all). Also, I am a research-a-holic and am driving myself insane trying to make a decision. I have read much of this thread and many of the reviews by the OP.
> 
> My everyday on-ears are V-Moda M80s. I love these things and want to find something as close to the sound stage as these as possible in an IEM.
> 
> ...


 

 I haven't tried the C300 but it looks pretty huge. I've recommended the Yamaha EPH-100 to fans of the M-80 in the past but it doesn't have controls. With controls it would probably have to be the RHA MA750i (it's a little heavy but not too bad thanks to over-the-ear fit). Next best thing would be the Shure SE215 + 3-button mic cable, which will also run over $100. Under $100 I'd go for the Velodyne vPulse. Not the most high-grade construction (especially compared to the RHA and Shure) but not bad for under $100 and it's comfortable in the ear.


----------



## suman134

hwkaholic said:


> I am far from what is considered to be an audiophile. However, I do enjoy the music I listen to to sound the best it can inside of my budget. (don't we all). Also, I am a research-a-holic and am driving myself insane trying to make a decision. I have read much of this thread and many of the reviews by the OP.
> 
> My everyday on-ears are V-Moda M80s. I love these things and want to find something as close to the sound stage as these as possible in an IEM.
> 
> ...


 
  
   image x7i and ue600vi ( my fav under $100 ) , cuz i cant see anything else with 3 button controller and have a good sq .


----------



## hwkaholic

Thanks joker!!! I had not seen the RHA MA750i before nor even heard of the brand. (And I even lived in the UK for a while). Showing my noobness there I suppose. 

Those might be exactly what I am looking for! I had a pair of Phillips a while back that looked very very similar in appearance and enjoyed their styling. 

After reading reviews and doing some research on them, seems like the way to go. They look amazing!! If they sound half as good as they look...I'm sure I will really enjoy them!

As far as the C300 goes, they sound amazing, at least to my ears. The bass is tight and not overwhelming. The highs and mids are well defined and clear. There is a bit of a muffling of the vocals in some songs, but not enough to be annoying. I just can't get over the size and the operation of the volume rocker. I knew when I ordered them that they were big, but they are bigger than I expected. There is nothing low profile about them, which in my opinion is why people go with and IEM in the first place. If I wanted something that large on my ears, I'd just stick to my m80.


----------



## AgentJ

I lied, this is my actually last question. I know that the JVCV FXD80 are pretty much a better version of my AM800s with the mic, but how are the Audio-Technica ATH-CKX7IS? I know they're not in the OP so I'm not sure if you've heard them before... 
  
 Actually, reviews seem to say that the 9IS are much better, and I cant really afford them. 
  
 Actually, I lied again. I'm slightly worried that the JVCs are gonna be heavy and not fit well. I'm not sure if I'm just being overcautious but are there any more alternatives at a sort of similar price? Otherwise I'll be ordering them soon.


----------



## bangdomarkin

Hey joker, I have a question and maybe you can give me an answer with solidity. Is there any headphone (full size or compact) you've tested that resembles the sound of Westone 4 with a good soundstage? The amount to be invested in it is at most U$300, maybe U$350. Thanks for listening!


----------



## suman134

agentj said:


> I lied, this is my actually last question. I know that the JVCV FXD80 are pretty much a better version of my AM800s with the mic, but how are the Audio-Technica ATH-CKX7IS? I know they're not in the OP so I'm not sure if you've heard them before...
> 
> Actually, reviews seem to say that the 9IS are much better, and I cant really afford them.
> 
> Actually, I lied again. I'm slightly worried that the JVCs are gonna be heavy and not fit well. I'm not sure if I'm just being overcautious but are there any more alternatives at a sort of similar price? Otherwise I'll be ordering them soon.


 
  
      i dont know whats wrong with ue600vi .


----------



## jhooVA

I've been looking for the same combo for a while now. I did get the 750i and the sound, particularly the soundstage, is really good.

The reason I sent it back was cuz my left year just didn't work with their setup (over ear with non memory hook). If you can make it work for you these are a fantastic find for what you need. 

I'm also considering the ath im70 if I can get a replacement cable with mic.


----------



## AgentJ

suman134 said:


> i dont know whats wrong with ue600vi .




I had forgotten about them considering that they're double the price of the JVCs. I've now found them a little cheaper (and the same price as the JVC if I buy used/refurb) which I could afford. 
I assume they're better but are they still V shaped?


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> I lied, this is my actually last question. I know that the JVCV FXD80 are pretty much a better version of my AM800s with the mic, but how are the Audio-Technica ATH-CKX7IS? I know they're not in the OP so I'm not sure if you've heard them before...
> 
> Actually, reviews seem to say that the 9IS are much better, and I cant really afford them.
> 
> Actually, I lied again. I'm slightly worried that the JVCs are gonna be heavy and not fit well. I'm not sure if I'm just being overcautious but are there any more alternatives at a sort of similar price? Otherwise I'll be ordering them soon.


 
  
 I haven't tried the CKX7 or CKX9 but I like the CKX5. Wouldn't put it above the FXD80 or AM-800 though. 
  


bangdomarkin said:


> Hey joker, I have a question and maybe you can give me an answer with solidity. Is there any headphone (full size or compact) you've tested that resembles the sound of Westone 4 with a good soundstage? The amount to be invested in it is at most U$300, maybe U$350. Thanks for listening!


 
  
 If you're going full-size and have an amp, the HD600 is the best all-rounder I've tried in that price range, personally, and has a balanced and spacious signature much like the W4.
  


agentj said:


> I had forgotten about them considering that they're double the price of the JVCs. I've now found them a little cheaper (and the same price as the JVC if I buy used/refurb) which I could afford.
> I assume they're better but are they still V shaped?


 
  
 The UE600 is not v-shaped at all. It's very balanced, even a bit mid-centric.


----------



## AgentJ

So are there any recommended alternatives to the FXD80 then? ;p

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk


----------



## suman134

agentj said:


> So are there any recommended alternatives to the FXD80 then? ;p
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk


 

   ue600vi is 67$ , fxd-80 is 70 , go for anything , eu600 is light , fdx 80 is a bit heavy , fxd-80 has better cable , but ue-600 is not bad . get anything of these two that meets your eye .


----------



## AgentJ

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'm in the UK, so the prices are slightly different. 
  
 The only reason I'm slightly reluctant to get the FDX80 are because they look pretty heavy, but if there arent many v shaped alternatives, then I'll go and take the plunge. 
  
 Also, I know that I've been told that simply increasing the bass with an EQ with balanced headphones could cause distortion, but would reducing the mids work? (so that I'd still get a v shape, but maybe less distortion?
  
 http://lifehacker.com/should-i-use-an-equalizer-when-i-listen-to-music-1488713937


----------



## MoonYeol

agentj said:


> Sorry, I forgot to mention that I'm in the UK, so the prices are slightly different.
> 
> The only reason I'm slightly reluctant to get the FDX80 are because they look pretty heavy, but if there arent many v shaped alternatives, then I'll go and take the plunge.
> 
> ...




You can avoid digital clipping and minimize loss of details by lowering levels knstead of raising. But your iems will still see an increased level of bass the same way because you're going to raise the volume instead. So it depends. Some EQ well, others don't


----------



## ljokerl

Posted part 3 of my CES 2014 impressions: http://theheadphonelist.com/ces-2014-headphone-coverage-part-3-audiofly-marshall-headphones-sennheiser-and-more/
  
 TL;DR version:
  
 * *AudioFly* had a new earphone line including two hybrid and two multi-BA models
 * The *AudioFly AF140* triple-driver hybrid and *AF180* quad-armature monitor both stood out in sound
 * *WeSC* and *Kicker* both had some new headphones but none caught my ear
 * *iLuv*, on the other hand, had some pretty decent-sounding cheap headphones
 * Zound Industries’ fashion-oriented *Molami* brand has a rather decent new headphone – the *Plica*
 * On the other hand the *Marshall Monitor* sounded a little too heavy on bass and light on treble
 * *Sennheiser*’s *Momentum* was the best portable headphone I tried at the show. The *Momentum On-Ear* impressed me less
 * The new* Sennheiser HD8 DJ* is pricy at $389 but is built like a tank and extremely versatile, with a punchy and dynamic sound signature
 * *Sony*’s new *Walkman NWZ-ZX1* audiophile DAP was, unfortunately, locked under glass
  
 Full version, as usual, can be found here.


----------



## tomscy2000

What was wrong with the AF160's bass? The AF180 is kind of interesting, considering how tiny it looks for a four-driver (is it any larger than the AF140/160?)


----------



## james444

agentj said:


> Yeah, something like this HTC Bluetooth one or maybe a wired one and a female-femalecoupler, although I'm not sure if it'd actually work.
> Would the difference in SQ be noticeable?


 


sinocelt said:


> This one had caught my eyes because of its big, apparently easy-to-feel buttons.


 
  
 From the Sony MW1 thread:
  


james444 said:


> Just a heads-up for those who're wondering about the HTC BH S600, I received it two days ago and it's going back where it came from. Tried it with several earpieces, and paired with my SGS3 the sound quality is a clear step down from the MW1 / HS3000 and significantly worse than a wired connection. Apparently ClieOS is right when he says that aptX alone doesn't guarantee great sound quality. Too bad, cause I actually liked its form factor and minimalist design very much.


----------



## ljokerl

tomscy2000 said:


> What was wrong with the AF160's bass? The AF180 is kind of interesting, considering how tiny it looks for a four-driver (is it any larger than the AF140/160?)


 

 It just didn't sound as effortless as the AF180. Looking back it may have just been missing that last bit of depth that gives the bass thump that solid "footing". 
  
 I think all four of the new models use the same housings (minus the detachable cable connectors on the AF160/180). In any case they are very close to each other in size.


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> It just didn't sound as effortless as the AF180. Looking back it may have just been missing that last bit of depth that gives the bass thump that solid "footing". I think all four of the new models use the same housings (minus the detachable cable connectors on the AF160/180). In any case they are very close to each other in size.


 

 I see. They seem to have elected to go for very small-sized drivers, in order to fit inside what looks to be pretty small housings (they appear to be no bigger than the TDK BA200?).


----------



## ljokerl

tomscy2000 said:


> I see. They seem to have elected to go for very small-sized drivers, in order to fit inside what looks to be pretty small housings (they appear to be no bigger than the TDK BA200?).


 
  
 A little bigger but still very small by quad driver standards. Here's a closeup from the show and an excerpt from the spec sheet showing the armatures:


----------



## MoonYeol

Feels like they really need some kind of USP or very good performance to sell something that looks way less sexy than the black/red W4 or the kind of tacky UE900 or any of the other quad/tri BA's. But interesting. I'm very interested in the top model from Audio Techn. Since the CK100Pro was very interesting and quite unique compared to a lot of the other in ears I've heard.


----------



## tomscy2000

ljokerl said:


> A little bigger but still very small by quad driver standards. Here's a closeup from the show and an excerpt from the spec sheet showing the armatures:


 
  
 Yeah, I've seen the tech sheet; looks a little better in real-world lighting, very low-key and not flashy.
  
 It'll certainly be interesting to compare it against the W40. The W40 has noticeably better ergonomic feel over the old 4/4R, so if the AF180 isn't any better in that category, then it'll lose out automatically due to its lesser reputation. AFAIK, the accessories aren't as well-appointed either. Westone now gives people both the non-mic and mic cables, right? Along with an improved Monitor Vault that seems to be less prone to breaking (the hinges on mine broke after two months). How do these Audiofly cables feel against the new EPIC cables (and UE's and Shure's, for that matter)?
  
 There's now a "glut" of four-driver universals on the marketplace. High-end models like the 846 and 334 aside, the Nuforce Primo 8 and Audiofly AF180 are both set to release soon, alongside the Westone W40 and Audio-Technica ATH-IM04 (which is strangely getting some hate, for whatever reason), not to mention the Noble 4.


----------



## Amitl

Joker...any plans on the Audio Technica ATH-IM70??


----------



## Johnny2ears

Hey Joker
  
 First of all, let me say thank you again! A year ago, following your advice i bought a MeElectronics Cw31 as substitute for my cx300, since i wanted something more "clean". I loved the CW31's. Great sound, good bass extent, good mids etc etc (comparing agains't my cx300 and agains't the Galaxy S4 headphones)the best i ever heard. unfortunatly i broke this, snaped the cord in half.
  
 Now i'm wondering about a replacement, since  you had recommended the Cw31, E30 and the M3, and considerig the same price range, i was now debating on whether i should get the M3 (still available for 60€ [80$]) or the Aurvana Live!.
  
 I loved the CW's, and i gues the only thing i would change a bit, would just have a tiny bit more bass...hum...impact? How can i say this, deep bloomy voices sounded good, but i wish they could have a bit more warminess to it. Not much more, just a tad.
  
 Do you have different sugestions than those 2? You're always testing new products, and maybe some new contender pops out thats really worth it. I know the Aurvana are no IEM, but since i know you tried them both and since i really come to respect all your hard work (btw still waiting for the Aurvana 2 review ) i trust your opinion greatly.
  
 Thanks again man. cheers


----------



## donedj

hi joker
 MA750i sounds promising but they look heavy and not comfortable. Are they good for using 4-5 hours/day?
  
 Thanks


----------



## Deviltooth

I've really enjoyed the CES coverage; it's definitely given me some new products to think about.
  
 Regarding Audiofly: I hope they've got their act together quality wise.  My girlfriend's AF56 had the housing split twice, the second time even glue couldn't save it.  Now they're marketing much more expensive IEMs so the quality control had better be leagues better.


----------



## nehcrow

Hey joker, any impressions on the Heaven V or other FAD models


----------



## ljokerl

moonyeol said:


> Feels like they really need some kind of USP or very good performance to sell something that looks way less sexy than the black/red W4 or the kind of tacky UE900 or any of the other quad/tri BA's. But interesting. I'm very interested in the top model from Audio Techn. Since the CK100Pro was very interesting and quite unique compared to a lot of the other in ears I've heard.


 
  
*disclaimer: my crappy photos make certain plastics look much worse than they do in reality.
 
I wouldn’t say the Audiofly stuff looks worse than the W4 up close. Maybe the gray one but not the dark red/blue ones.
 


tomscy2000 said:


> Yeah, I've seen the tech sheet; looks a little better in real-world lighting, very low-key and not flashy.
> 
> It'll certainly be interesting to compare it against the W40. The W40 has noticeably better ergonomic feel over the old 4/4R, so if the AF180 isn't any better in that category, then it'll lose out automatically due to its lesser reputation. AFAIK, the accessories aren't as well-appointed either. Westone now gives people both the non-mic and mic cables, right? Along with an improved Monitor Vault that seems to be less prone to breaking (the hinges on mine broke after two months). How do these Audiofly cables feel against the new EPIC cables (and UE's and Shure's, for that matter)?
> 
> There's now a "glut" of four-driver universals on the marketplace. High-end models like the 846 and 334 aside, the Nuforce Primo 8 and Audiofly AF180 are both set to release soon, alongside the Westone W40 and Audio-Technica ATH-IM04 (which is strangely getting some hate, for whatever reason), not to mention the Noble 4.


 
  
The W40 and UM Pro 30 looked great at the show, would love to compare those with the Audiofly sets head to head for sure.
 
I didn’t feel that the cables were lacking in any way but of course long-term use would be more telling. Curious if the cloth sheathing will kink or not.
  


amitl said:


> Joker...any plans on the Audio Technica ATH-IM70??


 

 
Not at this time.
 


johnny2ears said:


> Hey Joker
> 
> First of all, let me say thank you again! A year ago, following your advice i bought a MeElectronics Cw31 as substitute for my cx300, since i wanted something more "clean". I loved the CW31's. Great sound, good bass extent, good mids etc etc (comparing agains't my cx300 and agains't the Galaxy S4 headphones)the best i ever heard. unfortunatly i broke this, snaped the cord in half.
> 
> ...


 
  
 If you’re okay with headphones I have no reason not to recommend the CAL!. It’s not very portable but it’s a great headphone with a warm, impactful sound. Don’t like comparing headphones to IEMs though.
  


donedj said:


> hi joker
> MA750i sounds promising but they look heavy and not comfortable. Are they good for using 4-5 hours/day?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
Depends on your ears. They are more comfortable than I expected and I can wear them for 2-3 hours with no problem but longer than that might be problematic.
  


deviltooth said:


> I've really enjoyed the CES coverage;* it's definitely given me some new products to think about.*
> 
> Regarding Audiofly: I hope they've got their act together quality wise.  My girlfriend's AF56 had the housing split twice, the second time even glue couldn't save it.  Now they're marketing much more expensive IEMs so the quality control had better be leagues better.


 
  
 Same 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 
  
 That's too bad about the AF56 - I really hope the new line fares better.


----------



## jhooVA

donedj said:


> hi joker
> MA750i sounds promising but they look heavy and not comfortable. Are they good for using 4-5 hours/day?
> 
> Thanks


 
 Hey FYI...the Discovery thread is hyping up a cheapo iem - Xiaomi Piston 2.0 - with a ton off talk about how good their sound quality is.  Several well respected Head-fiers have compared to MA750 very positively.  
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/586909/the-discovery-thread-new-zero-audio-doppios-pg1197-kef-m200-pg835-philips-fidelio-s2-pg-724/19575#post_10182214


----------



## modulor

Joker, any plans/interests in checking out the HM700 + RE-400B combo?  Initial impressions seem good so far.  Even if the player itself is kind of basic and limited in features it apparently was tuned specifically with the RE-400 in mind and reportedly has a good amp section to drive the included balanced version.  I thought being a fan of the RE-400 it may be on your radar


----------



## ljokerl

Added RHA MA750. The overall ranking has been updated here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2B26) RHA MA750 / MA750i*
> 
> 
> Reviewed December 2014
> ...


 
  
  
  


modulor said:


> Joker, any plans/interests in checking out the HM700 + RE-400B combo?  Initial impressions seem good so far.  Even if the player itself is kind of basic and limited in features it apparently was tuned specifically with the RE-400 in mind and reportedly has a good amp section to drive the included balanced version.  I thought being a fan of the RE-400 it may be on your radar


 

  
 To be honest I hadn't heard of it until now. I still haven't been convinced that going balanced is worth it with IEMs, but it's certainly interesting if it improves the RE-400. I do use my RE-600 balanced with the HM-901 every once in a while - it's an excellent combination.


----------



## Shawn71

Hey joker: Nice review and comparisons....... Would you be able to find out the actual diameter of the dynamic drivers? All the rha model doesnt carry that info and just wondering whats the secrecy in that very basic info. I even enquired about this already with our fellow mate mark2410 as he reviewed a rha iem and he even didnt have a clue about it.........just like how b**e reveals external dimensions as tech specs for their cubes and AM bass modules.


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> The overall ranking has been updated here.


 
 I see you've been changing some scores to accommodate the newer additions on the list.
 It's a bit surprising to see that you've finally rated the ety er4s at least as high as its twfk competitors although I've got to ask what made you change your mind?


----------



## getclikinagas

ljokerl said:


> To be honest I hadn't heard of it until now. I still haven't been convinced that going balanced is worth it with IEMs, but it's certainly interesting if it improves the RE-400. I do use my RE-600 balanced with the HM-901 every once in a while - it's an excellent combination.


 
  
 I'll just leave this quote ....here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





clieos said:


> You can always sell the RE400B as BNIB item.
> 
> Actually I have heard both RE400 and RE600 on HM700, you will be surprised how well tuned RE400 is on HM700 and actually RE600 might be the one get sold.


----------



## ljokerl

shawn71 said:


> Hey joker: Nice review and comparisons....... Would you be able to find out the actual diameter of the dynamic drivers? All the rha model doesnt carry that info and just wondering whats the secrecy in that very basic info. I even enquired about this already with our fellow mate mark2410 as he reviewed a rha iem and he even didnt have a clue about it.........just like how b**e reveals external dimensions as tech specs for their cubes and AM bass modules.


 
  
 It never occurred to me to ask - I can't really learn anything about an earphone from its driver diameter.
  


kova4a said:


> I see you've been changing some scores to accommodate the newer additions on the list.
> It's a bit surprising to see that you've finally rated the ety er4s at least as high as its twfk competitors although I've got to ask what made you change your mind?


 
  
 That probably happened when the JH13 was added and everything else got bumped down. In any case I still use the ER4 all the time for comparisons so I may have felt it needed a bump against things occupying the lower 9.x range these days.


----------



## Johnny2ears

> If you’re okay with headphones I have no reason not to recommend the CAL!. It’s not very portable but it’s a great headphone with a warm, impactful sound. Don’t like comparing headphones to IEMs though.


 
 Yeah, i understand that, but since you have  larger experience, in terms of sond signature you can undoubtedly give a good opinion/advice. And in terms on IEM's, anything new worth to take a look in par of the M3 or Cw31's?
  
 Off-topic:In your opinion does the Cal 2 have a "worse" bass than cal 1? I've seen ppl here on forum  saying it has bigger soundstage, more confy, but some say the sound is not as good as...


----------



## imackler

Really intrigued by the InEar StageDiver 2... But from reading various reviews and impressions, there are comments regarding a warm sound and possibly a "veil." Should I take this to mean its sound signature is more like the Westone house sound than for example Etymotic or Vsonic? 
  
 Thanks!


----------



## steelglam

I’m on the hunt for a pair of earphones that I can finally settle with for a long time. I’ve been through a bunch of different ones over the past 5 years, and I end up tiring of each of them. It’s exhausting and frustrating.
  
 For a long time I was using Sansa players (Fuze and Clip+), but recently I’ve been using a FiiO X3, which I like better than the Sansa players.
  
 I’m thinking that if I describe which earphones I’ve been through and what I didn’t like about them, perhaps folks here that have experience with some of these may be able to point me to a particular pair that might suit me.
  
 Brainwavz M2: I found these to be decent and stuck with them for a while, but eventually was dissatisfied with the separation (seemed congested), timbre, and imaging. Perhaps my biggest problem with them, however, was the dimensionality of the instruments: everything seemed two-dimensional. This led to a perception of “fakeness,” and I didn’t find them to be sufficiently natural-sounding.
  
 HiFiMAN RE-0: These did not stay with me very long. I fully appreciated the clarity and precision, but they were much too bright, analytical, and thin-sounding for my taste.
  
 Meelectronics CC-51: These were the first ones that I really thought were going to stick around. Punchiness was excellent, and bass, clarity, and detail were good. But I eventually got tired of them for two main reasons. First, they weren’t open enough. Instruments didn’t seem to have enough air around them. And second, because the way they positioned things just sounded off to me. If I were to use a concert analogy, it felt like I was sitting about 30 rows from the stage. This was particularly the case with the midrange. I don’t know if this was due to the way they soundstaged things, because the punchy bass seemed more forward/dominant than the midrange, or because of the deficiencies in the airiness/openness department, but whatever the reason, I found myself straining to listen to the midrange and eventually got rid of them.
  
 Meelectronics A151: My first and only armature IEM. These stayed with me the least amount of time out of all of the IEMs I’ve tried. I really liked the midrange and intimacy, but it was too much midrange to the detriment of highs and bass. I came to view them as sounding like I was listening to an old transistor radio, even though the liquid and smooth midrange was attractive.
  
 Philips SHE3590: These were the second ones that I really thought were going to stick around. They seemed pretty balanced to my ears. In addition, the lower mids seemed to deliver sufficient warmth when called up on but not in an overwhelming fashion like the Vsonic GR99’s (see below); the bass and lower mids seemed sufficient but also controlled. The positioning was also good: they were not too forward sounding like the JVC HA-FXT90’s (see below), not too distant sounding like the Meelec CC51’s, and not too laidback sounding like the HiFiMAN RE0’s. Eventually, though, I was dissatisfied with the resolution, dynamics, and space/air around the instruments. Important details were absent and they just didn’t deliver the energy necessary to realistically convey the punk/metal/indie rock that I like probably more than any other genres. Imaging was decent, but instruments didn’t have enough air/space around them, which also sapped some of the energy from the music. Sibilance and graininess were also slight issues, though not too bad; not nearly as bad as the JVC HA-FXT90’s.
  
 Vsonic GR-99: These were a fun IEM. I was initially completely enraptured with these because they were so warm and smooth in the lower midrange. So much bass! And unlike the Meelec CC-51s, the mids were not pushed back too far in the soundstage. But eventually I desired more clarity. The bass is impressive tonally, but throws a veil over everything else. Ultimately, these were just too veiled and chesty for me, and I want something with more clarity. For what it’s worth, these mated better with my Sansa Clip+ than my Fii0 X3.
  
 JVC HA-FXT90: These were the latest ones that I tried, and also the most expensive. When I first tried them, I was immediately impressed with the openness, airiness, timbre, separation, imaging, and clarity. They best most of the other IEM’s that I’ve tried in those areas. And the energy…wow!  None of the other IEMs that I’ve tried have conveyed the energy of the punk/metal/indie rock music that I like as convincingly. But as much as I liked those qualities, these JVC’s are just too aggressive and bright. Unlike any other IEM I’ve had, I actually find myself being fatigued by these. I can only listen to them in small time periods, and some days my ears/brain just can’t handle them at all. They are also grainier and more revealing of sibilance than any other IEM that I’ve had, to the point of being distracting sometimes. I love the clarity of the JVC’s and hearing them clearly made me realize the inferiority of the Vsonic GR-99’s. But I also know that I want something with a bit more presence in the low end to warm up the sound when it requires it. Regarding the latter aspect, the Philips SHE3590’s come closest to getting this right; in comparison, the JVC’s do not do it enough and the Vsonic GR-99’s do it too much.
  
 I think if I were to sum things up, I would say that I’m searching for something that mainly combines aspects of the Philips SHE3590 and the JVC HA-FXT90, with perhaps a bit of the Vsonic GR-99 thrown in. In other words, I want something that: A.) Has the overall sound signature and soundstage placement of the Philips; B.) The clarity, timbre, separation, and openness of the JVC’s; C.) Conveys energy better than the Philips and more like the JVC’s, but not as aggressively as the JVC’s so that I don’t get fatigued (in other words, a slightly more tamed version of the JVC in the energy department); and D.) Has a bit of the warmth and non-graininess of the Vsonic GR-99. On the latter, though, I want to stress “just a bit” because the Vsonic's have way too much. In fact, the Philips may have enough of that warmth, though I wouldn’t mind just a tad more if possible. I can also deal with a small amount of graininess/sibilance like the Philips has (the JVC’s have way too much), but I do like the non-graininess of the Vsonic’s.
  
 My budget is a maximum of $150.
  
 Thanks for any advice/insight!
  
 Btw, if this is "too much" of a post for this thread, let me know and I will edit this post and start my own thread on the matter instead.


----------



## bhazard

Would love to see a ranking on the Xiaomi Piston 2.0 gold version. It's a $20 gem that I enjoy more than the RE-400.


----------



## Amitl

steelglam said:


> I’m on the hunt for a pair of earphones that I can finally settle with for a long time. I’ve been through a bunch of different ones over the past 5 years, and I end up tiring of each of them. It’s exhausting and frustrating.
> 
> For a long time I was using Sansa players (Fuze and Clip+), but recently I’ve been using a FiiO X3, which I like better than the Sansa players.
> 
> ...


 

 I Think that i'm now in a very similar situation as yours, and it does sound like we are after almost the same thing!
 Some of my IEMs sound very clear but too thin and harsh, others just dont have enough resolution.
 After reading a lot here, i can tell that i'm planning on the Yamaha EPH-100 for a long time now.


----------



## modulor

ljokerl said:


> To be honest I hadn't heard of it until now. I still haven't been convinced that going balanced is worth it with IEMs, but it's certainly interesting if it improves the RE-400. I do use my RE-600 balanced with the HM-901 every once in a while - it's an excellent combination.


 
 I just found out about it the other day, but it's apparently already for sale (the bundle goes for $250) - I share the same sentiment about balanced output but I just like the fact that it's amp is purpose built for the RE-400 essentially (and to a lesser extend the RE-600), that being my overall favorite IEM to date.  If it does in fact improve upon them, it may very well end up in my collection haha.  It was also confirmed that it is capable of being Rockbox'd, assuming they have the desire to do so with this model.


----------



## Muessig

Joker, I wonder if you can help me out.
  
 I currently have a pair of Sony MH1C's and while I like the general warm, fun sound you get from these the cable and the fit of them especially while on the move means I'm in the market for a set of IEM's that can meet my needs better.
  
 I need some IEM's that are comfortable for periods of extended use, so when riding a bike or walking or in noisier environments, so they need to not be microphonic but have fairly good isolation. I love the bass on the MH1C's, and the mids and highs have a fairly good balance, while the highs are never fatiguing. I mainly listen to Rock, Indie, Pop or easy listening music, so a warmer sound signature is preferable, with clear mids and highs. I'm a bit of a bass head in that I appreciate a full bodied bass that's tight and keeps you on your toes, immersed. I'm after a bit of a wider soundstage than the MH1C's can offer, too.
  
 My budget is up to about $100-150 dollars. I'm in the market to invest in a medium-range set of headphones that will last me a LOT of use, so the build quality and sound have to be up to scratch.
  
 Any ideas? I've been looking into the MEElectronics A161p but I'm not sure if there are better alternatives out there.


----------



## Ellis

Joker, thanks for the thread. It has to be the best roundup of IEMs out there 
  
 Based on the review here and others too, I picked up a pair of SteelSeries Flux In-Ears to replace my ageing Sennheiser CX500s. I much prefer the sound of the SteelSeries but I have a massive issue with the fit - I just can't get them to stay in my ears (which makes an in-ear monitor pretty useless ).
  
 I've tried all the included tip sizes, but none of them work for me. With my Sennheisers, I used the included double flange tips (the medium sized, I think) and they worked quite well. Are there any I can buy which would fit on my SteelSeries?
  
 Cheers
  
 p.s. apologies if this would be better off as a new thread, but I thought I'd try here first.


----------



## Za Warudo

The A161p's balanced signature might suit your music but their cable is rather thin and microphonic. Even worn with cable over ear there are still some microphonics. I'm not sure I would pay msrp for them but they were a no brainer when they were on sale for $40 a couple of months ago.


----------



## AgentJ

Wait, so the JVCs are the only real choice for me then?  (in terms of v shaped with mic for £30-50)


----------



## quartertone

The Meelectronics M-Duo would be a good option, it's relatively V-shaped but not harsh, has a mic and remote and excellent build quality. Costs 55 pounds on Amazon UK.


----------



## ljokerl

johnny2ears said:


> Yeah, i understand that, but since you have  larger experience, in terms of sond signature you can undoubtedly give a good opinion/advice. And in terms on IEM's, anything new worth to take a look in par of the M3 or Cw31's?
> 
> Off-topic:In your opinion does the Cal 2 have a "worse" bass than cal 1? I've seen ppl here on forum  saying it has bigger soundstage, more confy, but some say the sound is not as good as...


 
  
The Fidue A63 sounds quite promising so far as a reasonably-priced IEM with good mids/vocals: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-thoughts-tdk-ba200-brainwavz-r3-fidue-a63-a81-ear-earphones/
 
As for the CAL!2, I don’t know about “worse” but I feel it has a little more bass than the CAL!1, which some listeners probably won’t like.
 


imackler said:


> Really intrigued by the InEar StageDiver 2... But from reading various reviews and impressions, there are comments regarding a warm sound and possibly a "veil." Should I take this to mean its sound signature is more like the Westone house sound than for example Etymotic or Vsonic?
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 That’s somewhat fair – I wouldn’t say the SD-2 is veiled but it’s no Ety. Clarity is a little better than with the RE-400 and GR07 but not quite up there with an ER4S or VSonic VC1000. 
  


steelglam said:


> I’m on the hunt for a pair of earphones that I can finally settle with for a long time. I’ve been through a bunch of different ones over the past 5 years, and I end up tiring of each of them. It’s exhausting and frustrating.
> 
> For a long time I was using Sansa players (Fuze and Clip+), but recently I’ve been using a FiiO X3, which I like better than the Sansa players.
> 
> ...


 
  
 You seem to lean towards a v-shaped sound but a very particular one, that doesn’t have peaks in the ~5-8k range and doesn’t recess the mids very much. Unfortunately I’m not aware of anything that fits these requirements perfectly – I’m sure there’s something out there but everything I’ve tried so far that comes to mind (RHA MA750, Onkyo HF300, EPH-100, T-Peos H-100, etc, etc) can be knocked off the list for one reason or another. I almost feel like with your requirements you might be best off attacking a cheap and highly capable IEM like the 3580 (or better yet Sony MH1C) with a parametric equalizer.
  


modulor said:


> I just found out about it the other day, but it's apparently already for sale (the bundle goes for $250) - I share the same sentiment about balanced output but I just like the fact that it's amp is purpose built for the RE-400 essentially (and to a lesser extend the RE-600), that being my overall favorite IEM to date.  If it does in fact improve upon them, it may very well end up in my collection haha.  It was also confirmed that it is capable of being Rockbox'd, assuming they have the desire to do so with this model.


 
  
 A rockboxed HiFiMan DAP would be great. Looks like this one will fit in a pocket, too, which is a plus.
  


muessig said:


> Joker, I wonder if you can help me out.
> 
> I currently have a pair of Sony MH1C's and while I like the general warm, fun sound you get from these the cable and the fit of them especially while on the move means I'm in the market for a set of IEM's that can meet my needs better.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The A161P doesn’t have nearly as much bass as the MH1C. You might want to look into the Shure SE215 for the combination of build quality + no cable noise + good bass with nonfatiguing sound. It’s not as bassy as the MH1C but it’s not far behind, either, and the mids and highs are quite clear. It’s also built quite well.
  


ellis said:


> Joker, thanks for the thread. It has to be the best roundup of IEMs out there
> 
> Based on the review here and others too, I picked up a pair of SteelSeries Flux In-Ears to replace my ageing Sennheiser CX500s. I much prefer the sound of the SteelSeries but I have a massive issue with the fit - I just can't get them to stay in my ears (which makes an in-ear monitor pretty useless ).
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 Someone asked me about the same on THL here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/steelseries-flux-in-ear/#comment-2144 . You can see the comment chain there – I recommended they get the Klipsch Oval gel tips for the Flux and it seems to have worked out.
  


agentj said:


> Wait, so the JVCs are the only real choice for me then?  (in terms of v shaped with mic for £30-50)


 
  
 There’s a lot of v-shaped earphones out there but not many that are at least as good as the AM-800 in a similar price range and also have a mic and decent build quality.


----------



## Ellis

ljokerl said:


> Someone asked me about the same on THL here: [COLOR=800080]http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/steelseries-flux-in-ear/#comment-2144[/COLOR] . You can see the comment chain there – I recommended they get the Klipsch Oval gel tips for the Flux and it seems to have worked out.



Oh nice, thanks. Glad to know I'm not the only one - seems like the Flux silicon tips are just made out of some crappy silicon with no friction or something.

Do you have any idea which size I might like for the Klipsch tips? Are all mediums roughly equal? Annoyingly it seems the only way to buy them is to get several pairs of the same size.


----------



## Amitl

Joker...how do the id America Spark compare to the Yamaha EPH-100?
 i know it's been long since you reviewed the Spark...but if you remember, then thank you....


----------



## ozkan

ellis said:


> Oh nice, thanks. Glad to know I'm not the only one - seems like the Flux silicon tips are just made out of some crappy silicon with no friction or something.
> 
> Do you have any idea which size I might like for the Klipsch tips? Are all mediums roughly equal? Annoyingly it seems the only way to buy them is to get several pairs of the same size.


 
 They are roughly the same size as Klipsch oval tips.


----------



## drm870

I literally am getting custom silicone sleeves from 1964EARS for the Flux. Yes, I know that paying $100 for a $50 IEM seems crazy, but I really do like the Flux's sound. (Plus, I hadn't heard of the Klipsch oval tips fitting when I ordered them. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 )
  
 That said, 1964EARS have taken sleeves off their website since then (I ordered them in late December), so you'd have to go somewhere else for that option.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> You seem to lean towards a v-shaped sound but a very particular one, that doesn’t have peaks in the ~5-8k range and doesn’t recess the mids very much. Unfortunately I’m not aware of anything that fits these requirements perfectly – I’m sure there’s something out there but everything I’ve tried so far that comes to mind (RHA MA750, Onkyo HF300, EPH-100, T-Peos H-100, etc, etc) can be knocked off the list for one reason or another. I almost feel like with your requirements you might be best off attacking a cheap and highly capable IEM like the 3580 (or better yet Sony MH1C) with a parametric equalizer.


 
 Thanks for the reply and recommendations, ljokerl, and for putting together such an amazing thread.  Such an awesome resource for IEMs!
  
 A couple of things in response to your message.
  
 In your opinion, what do you think the Yamaha EPH-100's are missing out of what I am seeking?  I ask because another poster here also mentioned them in response to my message (thank you much Amitl!), which led me to read your review of them on the first page of the thread.  I had never read about them before, and from your description, they seemed like they might be a good match.
  
 I really like your idea of getting something like the Monoprice's or the Sony's and EQing them.  The only problem is that I'm now a big fan of the FiiO X3, which does not have an EQ at this point (only individual bass and treble controls).  FiiO may be implementing one with future firmware updates, but it's not clear when that will happen.
  
 Given that situation, I think I may want to try at least one more pair of higher-up IEMs before going with the cheaper + EQ option.  (When FiiO implements an EQ on the X3, I will definitely try that option.) My budget remains $150 max, and all of the ones you mentioned that came to mind are within my budget.


----------



## mechgamer123

Joker, I just wanted to say that I got a box from a fellow head-fier with some Aurisonics ASG-2s as well as V-Sonic GR07 Bass Editions, and I have to say the GR07 BEs are just about the ideal tonality for me, maybe I'd want something with slightly more forward vocals and a touch more air, but other than that, these are excellent. I kind of fixed the isolation issues I had when I had my GR07 MK2 by putting the stems of some Klipsch tips I cut up onto the stem of the GR07, and then attaching Meelec tri-flange tips I cut down to bi-flanges for comfort. They still don't isolate very well for me though. Any suggestions for something like the GR07 that also isolates better? Maybe the Fidue A81?


----------



## ljokerl

ellis said:


> Oh nice, thanks. Glad to know I'm not the only one - seems like the Flux silicon tips are just made out of some crappy silicon with no friction or something.
> 
> Do you have any idea which size I might like for the Klipsch tips? Are all mediums roughly equal? Annoyingly it seems the only way to buy them is to get several pairs of the same size.


 
  
 I only have medium Klipsch gels. I feel like the Klipsch gels run a little smaller than the stock SS tips on average but I don't have the other Klipsch gels to confirm.
  


amitl said:


> Joker...how do the id America Spark compare to the Yamaha EPH-100?
> i know it's been long since you reviewed the Spark...but if you remember, then thank you....


 
  
 The Spark is more v-shaped, with less deep bass and treble extension and mids that are not as rich and full.
  


drm870 said:


> I literally am getting custom silicone sleeves from 1964EARS for the Flux. Yes, I know that paying $100 for a $50 IEM seems crazy, but I really do like the Flux's sound. (Plus, I hadn't heard of the Klipsch oval tips fitting when I ordered them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
That’s a little crazy, alright . Hope they sound even better with a custom fit!
  


steelglam said:


> Thanks for the reply and recommendations, ljokerl, and for putting together such an amazing thread.  Such an awesome resource for IEMs!
> 
> A couple of things in response to your message.
> 
> ...


 
  
RE: the EPH-100 – it sounds to me like you’re after something leaner. The EPH-100 has a ton of bass, a pretty warm tone, and a unique treble character with the energy coming in pretty high up in the spectrum. It’s a quicker driver compared to the GR99 so it doesn’t have the VSonics’ issues, but considering that you’ve gravitated towards the CC51 and SHE3580 (aside from presentation) I think the tonal balance and thickness of the EPH-100 might be problematic for you.
 
P.S. Yes, those came to mind because they are in your budget 
 


mechgamer123 said:


> Joker, I just wanted to say that I got a box from a fellow head-fier with some Aurisonics ASG-2s as well as V-Sonic GR07 Bass Editions, and I have to say the GR07 BEs are just about the ideal tonality for me, maybe I'd want something with slightly more forward vocals and a touch more air, but other than that, these are excellent. I kind of fixed the isolation issues I had when I had my GR07 MK2 by putting the stems of some Klipsch tips I cut up onto the stem of the GR07, and then attaching Meelec tri-flange tips I cut down to bi-flanges for comfort. They still don't isolate very well for me though. Any suggestions for something like the GR07 that also isolates better? Maybe the Fidue A81?


 
  
 Honestly I'm not convinced the A81 is as good as the GR07 quite yet. Jury's still out on it though. I would say Phonak 232 with Comply tips but that costs quite a lot more and doesn't have more forward vocals. The Alclair Reference would be even better but its bass is more in line with the GR07 than the GR07BE.


----------



## drm870

To be honest, I'm partly doing this to get a sense as to whether I'd like how a CIEM feels in my ear. I know silicone sleeves are going to feel somewhat different than acrylic shells, but if I don't end up minding the feel I'm probably going to save up my money for a CIEM as my next major pruchase.


----------



## hwkaholic

I recently just bought some of the RHA 750s and have to say that their construction is very solid and materials are top notch. However, there is a couple things that I don't like about them. 

Cons
1. The cones could be a little longer. I feel like they don't get into my ear easily enough and have a tendency to have the metal housing rub against the inner cartilage of my ear causing my ear to become sore. This could just be my funky ears, but thought its worth mentioning. 
2. While the sound clarity is excellent, I feel that the mids are a little too pronounced and leave my ears with a ring in them even at mid to mid-high volume levels. 
3. The cable is of excellent quality, but perhaps a bit too long. I use my IEMs on the go and hate having to wrap my chord to conceal it when I like it tucked away. Could stand to have the chord 8-10" shorter in my opinion. 
4. I don't consider myself an avid basshead. But feel that the bass on these are lacking, unfortunately. The bass is exceptional through the ranges but not powerful enough to my liking. I listen to a lot of hip hop and rock and would like a little more on the low end if the spectrum to equal out the exaggerated mids. That said, listeners to jazz, country, female vocal rock or classical will adore these IEMs. 
5. The case that comes with these could have been a little more thought out. It isn't big enough for me to comfortably place the headphones in it and have the confidence that they aren't scrunched or could be possible damaged. These definitely deserve a hard case and I will likely buy one for them. 
6. The solid construction doesn't make these heavy. If anything, I wish the chord that goes over the ear was a little more rigid and form fitting. When wearing the cable inside/under a jacket or shirt it has a tendency to "ride up" or lift., so to speak, causing the ear pieces to become loose in my ears. 

Bottom line, I am going to give these a loooong day of listening to give them a better shot at what I want them to be and test them with a variety of genres. 

Design and looks wise, they are everything I want an IEM to be. I know I touched on the negatives more here, but joker hit all of the the positive quite well. 

Overall, the sound stage is very good. Vocals, guitar, horns and the mid range are dominant in the sound. I just wish the bass had a little more oomph to it on the low end. 

I'll report back after a while to see if some burn in has any effect on my findings so far. I'll also say I only have about 5-7 hours on them as of now.


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > Joker, I just wanted to say that I got a box from a fellow head-fier with some Aurisonics ASG-2s as well as V-Sonic GR07 Bass Editions, and I have to say the GR07 BEs are just about the ideal tonality for me, maybe I'd want something with slightly more forward vocals and a touch more air, but other than that, these are excellent. I kind of fixed the isolation issues I had when I had my GR07 MK2 by putting the stems of some Klipsch tips I cut up onto the stem of the GR07, and then attaching Meelec tri-flange tips I cut down to bi-flanges for comfort. They still don't isolate very well for me though. Any suggestions for something like the GR07 that also isolates better? Maybe the Fidue A81?
> ...


 
 Whoa, even though the A81 is almost twice as much as the GR07, you don't think it sounds quite as good?
 Does the Phonak 232 isolate very well though? Those ports on the back make it seem otherwise... And I know I've asked this before (against the GR07 and UE900), but how would you say the bass and upper midrange (female vocal area?) compares on the 1964 V3 to the GR07 BE?


----------



## Ellis

ozkan said:


> They are roughly the same size as Klipsch oval tips.



Thanks, see below.


drm870 said:


> I literally am getting custom silicone sleeves from 1964EARS for the Flux. Yes, I know that paying $100 for a $50 IEM seems crazy, but I really do like the Flux's sound. (Plus, I hadn't heard of the Klipsch oval tips fitting when I ordered them.   )
> 
> That said, 1964EARS have taken sleeves off their website since then (I ordered them in late December), so you'd have to go somewhere else for that option.



Yeah, that is a little crazy  I will try the Klipsch ovals first I think xD


ljokerl said:


> I only have medium Klipsch gels. I feel like the Klipsch gels run a little smaller than the stock SS tips on average but I don't have the other Klipsch gels to confirm.
> 
> 
> The Spark is more v-shaped, with less deep bass and treble extension and mids that are not as rich and full.
> ...



OK cheers, I think I will grab some mediums then.


----------



## Francisk

Mechgamer 123, the Phonak PFE232 isolates pretty well but not to Ety ER4PT's level of isolation. The PFE232 is very detailed on the top end and has a good and fast slam to percussive instruments. Low bass is presented very well with good body but not to the extent of sounding boomy. The ports on the earpiece is merely for cosmetic purpose.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> RE: the EPH-100 – it sounds to me like you’re after something leaner. The EPH-100 has a ton of bass, a pretty warm tone, and a unique treble character with the energy coming in pretty high up in the spectrum. It’s a quicker driver compared to the GR99 so it doesn’t have the VSonics’ issues, but considering that you’ve gravitated towards the CC51 and SHE3580 (aside from presentation) I think the tonal balance and thickness of the EPH-100 might be problematic for you.
> 
> P.S. Yes, those came to mind because they are in your budget


 
 Thanks, ljokerl.
  
 I actually don't think I have a problem with IEMs that have thicker note presentation.  In fact, I think a big part of the reason that the HiFiMAN Re-0 spent the least time in my possession out of all the IEMs that I've tried is because of the lean presentation (also they were too bright for my taste).  The note thickness was actually one of the things that I most liked about the Vsonic GR99's; what I didn't like about them was that things seemed too veiled (not sure if that was due to too much of a bass bump or the speed of the driver).
  
 I think the problems that I had with the CC51's were the presentation of the mids (too far back) and the lack of air.  The SHE3580's got the presentation of the mids and the tonal balance correct for my taste, but they just didn't resolve enough and were a bit lean.  This is where the JVC HA-FXT90's came in: they delivered a thicker note presentation (same goes for the GR99's) and got the clarity, resolution, airiness, speed, imaging, and expansiveness aspects correct for my taste.  When I first got the JVC's, it was eye opening what I had been missing with the less expensive models that I've tried.  But the tonal balance and forwardness of the JVC's is just off for my tastes; they make me fatigued. 
  
 If there was some way to combine the SHE3580's tonal balance and presentation of the mids with the above qualities that I like about JVC's, I think it would be pretty close to what I was after.


----------



## jhooVA

hwkaholic said:


> I recently just bought some of the RHA 750s and have to say that their construction is very solid and materials are top notch. However, there is a couple things that I don't like about them.
> 
> Cons
> 1. The cones could be a little longer. I feel like they don't get into my ear easily enough and have a tendency to have the metal housing rub against the inner cartilage of my ear causing my ear to become sore. This could just be my funky ears, but thought its worth mentioning.
> ...


 
 Completely agree with you about anything related to fit with these IEMs.  I had to send them back because of that as otherwise for the most part I thought they hit it out of the park. 
  
 Interesting you say that the mids are too pronounced while the bass is lacking.  I thought the mids were veiled and the bass plenty voluminous, and most reviewers seem to agree with that statement.  Not sure at all about the mids, but when it comes to bass, given your musical preference, perhaps it's mid-bass you are looking for and not necessarily sub-bass, which the MA750 have plenty of.  I think things will even out for you with some burn in.  It took about 25-30 hours for mine to really hit optimal SQ. 
  
 Good luck with the fit and keeping it in the ear.  If that works out for you, these seem to be a steal for SQ.


----------



## hwkaholic

jhoova said:


> Completely agree with you about anything related to fit with these IEMs.  I had to send them back because of that as otherwise for the most part I thought they hit it out of the park.
> 
> Interesting you say that the mids are too pronounced while the bass is lacking.  I thought the mids were veiled and the bass plenty voluminous, and most reviewers seem to agree with that statement.  Not sure at all about the mids, but when it comes to bass, given your musical preference, perhaps it's mid-bass you are looking for and not necessarily sub-bass, which the MA750 have plenty of.  I think things will even out for you with some burn in.  It took about 25-30 hours for mine to really hit optimal SQ.
> 
> Good luck with the fit and keeping it in the ear.  If that works out for you, these seem to be a steal for SQ.


 
  
 I am a self proclaimed non-audiophile and just your everyday Joe, so take that for what it's worth.  
  
 I have put about 5 hours of listening to various types of music with these today. From Led Zeppelin to Zac Brown Band to Avicii to Eminem each have performed better today.  I also switched to a pair of silicone tips from an older set of IEMs that I had and seem to be getting better bass.  I will say that after listening to them for the duration today that the my ears have maybe gotten more use to the comfort or the in ear portion.  However, the over ear portion of the chord is kind of annoying.  I really wish that it was more rigid and formed a little better to the contour of my ear.  I may try using cable heat shrink to firm it up a bit.  I just can't get past the fact that any time something hits the chord that the buds move in my ear. I have tried all of the tips provided and the same thing happens with each of them.  As I stated previously, I really want to like these!!  But the small annoyances such as overall comfort and the over ear cable may force me to send them back.


----------



## ljokerl

drm870 said:


> To be honest, I'm partly doing this to get a sense as to whether I'd like how a CIEM feels in my ear. I know silicone sleeves are going to feel somewhat different than acrylic shells, but if I don't end up minding the feel I'm probably going to save up my money for a CIEM as my next major pruchase.


 
  
That makes more sense.
 
It would be nice of the Flux had a more common nozzle diameter, so you could re-use those custom sleeves on other universal earphones.
 


hwkaholic said:


> I recently just bought some of the RHA 750s and have to say that their construction is very solid and materials are top notch. However, there is a couple things that I don't like about them.
> 
> Cons
> 1. The cones could be a little longer. I feel like they don't get into my ear easily enough and have a tendency to have the metal housing rub against the inner cartilage of my ear causing my ear to become sore. This could just be my funky ears, but thought its worth mentioning.
> ...


 
  
 It sounds like you’re not getting a good seal. The MA750 definitely has significantly more bass than mids – I would suggest trying all of the different eartips and inserting them deeper in your ear (hopefully the housing design won’t prevent you from doing this).
  


mechgamer123 said:


> Whoa, even though the A81 is almost twice as much as the GR07, you don't think it sounds quite as good?
> Does the Phonak 232 isolate very well though? Those ports on the back make it seem otherwise... And I know I've asked this before (against the GR07 and UE900), but how would you say the bass and upper midrange (female vocal area?) compares on the 1964 V3 to the GR07 BE?


 
  
There are a lot of earphones and headphones that cost more than the GR07 but don’t perform as well.
 
The vents on the PFE 232 are fake/decorative, With silicone tips its isolation is average-ish but with the Complys its pretty good.
 
The V3 has more mid-bass than the GR07BE and mids that are a bit more forward/present overall. The V3 lacks the sibilance of the GR07 though.


----------



## obsydion

Hi Joker!
 I’ve been lurking in this incredible thread for awhile now trying to learn the world of IEMs from scratch so I could ask for a recommendation without sounding like too much of an idiot.
  
 I currently own Audeo PFE 122 perfect fit (black filters) and use silicon tips over comply because the latter gets gummed up and I live in a cold environment that makes the foam tough as hell to mould. Also probably prefer shallow to mid insertion depth. I absolutely love them as my very first upgrade from stock Apple earphones. (I won’t go into the 2 x UE Super Fi 5vis that broke within a few months of getting them. Shoddy wiring and quality). I only run them off iPhones and iPods in the past and I don’t see myself going down the amplifier route in the near future so low impedance is key.
  
 Looking for a big upgrade and the natural progression would be Phonak PFE 232 but I’m not confident on warranty issues since they’re folding and I want to increase my horizons and go with another brand.
 Decided on CIEMs, budget <$500
  
 Music taste: alt-Rock, metal, movie scores, neo classical, ambient, jazz/blues/vocals, IDM. According to your list, a few CIEMs fall under that price range and are rated highly: 1964 V3, Alclair Reference, Clear Tune CT-200, Custom Music One/Two and (though universal) InEar SD-2s.
  
 That list runs the gamut of the number of BA drivers used so I guess it’s down to sound signature, value, service.
 I am quite intrigued by the silicon shells offered by Custom Art though  There’s a slim chance I may be in Singapore end of March and be able to demo some of the Custom Art stuff but the rest I may never get a chance to try. I would love any advice on the list I provided and most definitely any that aren’t in that list or are universals! Keep up the amazing work!!


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > Whoa, even though the A81 is almost twice as much as the GR07, you don't think it sounds quite as good?
> ...


 
 I guess I'm not too surprised. Just in terms of tonality when I compared the GR07 BEs I have here to the ASG-2, UE900, DN-1000 and VSD1Ses, I prefer the GR07 to all of them. It has the forward sounding vocals (both male and female), a nice bass boost (though it could have a bit more midbass for the closet basshead in me), and for whatever reason I don't hear the sibilance on this particular set of GR07 BEs that I remember on my GR07 MK2s I had last year. Maybe my ears are just broken though. Maybe it's also because I've pretty much stuck to the hybrids with foam in them though.
  
 I sort of figured out how to boost the mediocre isolation of the GR07s, I cut the stems off some old Klipsch tips and put them around the nozzle, then put some Meelectronics tri-flange tips cut down to bi-flange for more comfort on top of those. 
  
 Dang it, that's exactly what I wanted to hear in terms of tonality for the V3. I'm still arguing inside on whether or not to get CIEMs, considering the resale value would be terrible if I ever sold them and I'd have to reshell them to the tune of $250 from 1964ears every ~24 months (even less since I seem to be losing weight a bit right now)...


----------



## EveTan

mechgamer123 said:


> Dang it, that's exactly what I wanted to hear in terms of tonality for the V3. I'm still arguing inside on whether or not to get CIEMs, considering the resale value would be terrible if I ever sold them and I'd have to reshell them to the tune of $250 from 1964ears every ~24 months (even less since I seem to be losing weight a bit right now)...


 
 I know I've already told you before, but you could definitely get alot more "sound" with a $500 universal vs a $500 custom. I wouldn't get the V3 if I were you.


----------



## mechgamer123

evetan said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > Dang it, that's exactly what I wanted to hear in terms of tonality for the V3. I'm still arguing inside on whether or not to get CIEMs, considering the resale value would be terrible if I ever sold them and I'd have to reshell them to the tune of $250 from 1964ears every ~24 months (even less since I seem to be losing weight a bit right now)...
> ...


 
 I really don't want to get CIEMs either, frankly, but please tell me of a <$550 IEM that the same sound sig as the V3 and also isolates as well, because I haven't seen one.


----------



## EveTan

mechgamer123 said:


> I really don't want to get CIEMs either, frankly, but please tell me of a <$550 IEM that the same sound sig as the V3 and also isolates as well, because I haven't seen one.


 
 I can't answer the sound question, but if you have a finicky ear canal...well, I guess there's not much room unless you go custom. Isolation is largely on tips, so if you can't find a tip that suits you for isolation, you'll have to go for CIEMs. From my experience, acrylic CIEMs isolate as much as a good tip (like Ortofons for my ear canal), but if you can't get one with a certain tip, then just ride with the V3s.


----------



## Lempelig

Hi joker.
  
 I'm wondering if you can help me find a new IEM. I bought the AT CK10 after reading your review, and absolutely loved them, unfortunately I lost them and haven't found a replacement yet. The only thing I found missing in them were a bit more bass presence, but I wouldn't sacrifice the precision and speed for it though. Since I'm looking for something new, it might as well be an upgrade. Do you perhaps have a couple of recommendations, or a general path to look at? At this stage I'm looking at both universals and customs.
  
 Regards
  
 Edit: I mainly listen to metal, rock, classic rock, blues, singer songwriter and a bit of folk and country.


----------



## Pastapipo

Hello Joker,
  
 Thank you again for the great reviews!
 I ordered the vsd1s on your recommendation and I absolutely love them, especially the clarity, non-siblant highs and the smooth forward mids (guitars).
 Now I'm looking for another upgrade.
  
 What I'm searching for is:  the vsd1s with:
 1.) sub-bass instead of mid-bass.
 2.) a more spacious sound.
 3.) Better instrument separation.
  
 I listen mainly to Indie/rock music.
 What do you think comes the closes to my wishes with a budget of <100$. Maybe 150$ if its worth the "bang for buck", but lower is always better for a student  .
 Thank you!


----------



## soundblast75

ljokerl said:


> Added RHA MA750. The overall ranking has been updated here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Hey , it would have been great if you'd reviewed the SE846 on page 846, haha


----------



## Shawn71

soundblast75 said:


> Hey , it would have been great if you'd reviewed the SE846 on page 846, haha




+1»»» Nice pointing out.


----------



## aleksanderp

Hi joker, thanks very much for this great resource. I got the VSD1S and VC1000 based on your descriptions and am very happy with them.  The VSD1S is smooth and the VC1000 is very detailed.  I am wondering if something that fits the following description exists though:
  
 1. Has the speed and accuracy of VC1000's bass but with stronger impact.  Does something like this exist or does stronger impact always means slower bass?
 2. Wearing straight down as over-the-ear is not practical for my glasses.
  
 I also EQ the sound to my liking, are there any drawbacks to this approach vs trying multiple phones to get the desired sound signature?  Am I right in thinking that one cannot EQ the missing details but the balance of high/low etc can be EQed without much negative effect (assuming preamp is used to prevent digital clipping)?
  
 Thanks very much.


----------



## Mdraluck23

Just going to go with the quick fire questions, two of em for ya joker.
  
 What should I go to for a less fatiguing _slightly _"thicker" sounding R-50 in terms of universals, keeping price/performance in mind? Also, price no matter what's your favorite custom for such a taste?


----------



## Francisk

Hi joker, thanks for your reviews. Can you advise on which IEM that can retain the full sound signature of the Phonak PFE232 with the mid quality of the ETY ER4S and all this in one package with slightly smoother top end around a narrow 10khz bandwidth but retain anything above that frequency so that the airiness is not lost.


----------



## ljokerl

obsydion said:


> Hi Joker!
> I’ve been lurking in this incredible thread for awhile now trying to learn the world of IEMs from scratch so I could ask for a recommendation without sounding like too much of an idiot.
> 
> I currently own Audeo PFE 122 perfect fit (black filters) and use silicon tips over comply because the latter gets gummed up and I live in a cold environment that makes the foam tough as hell to mould. Also probably prefer shallow to mid insertion depth. I absolutely love them as my very first upgrade from stock Apple earphones. (I won’t go into the 2 x UE Super Fi 5vis that broke within a few months of getting them. Shoddy wiring and quality). I only run them off iPhones and iPods in the past and I don’t see myself going down the amplifier route in the near future so low impedance is key.
> ...


 
  
Well, assuming you prefer a shallow fit because your ear canals are easily irritated going custom may not be the best option. I suppose you can always as for a “comfort fit” when you’re getting your customs made and have them made a little more shallow.
 
Demoing is always a good idea – as you said they all differ in sound signature, even compared to your Phonaks. The Music One and SD-2 are lighter on treble and have a little more bass body. The Reference is a little more v-shaped and slightly withdrawn in the midrange, while the CT-200 is the opposite with prominent mids but some bass roll-off. The V3 is much bassier than the rest of these. The Music Two seems very promising but of course I haven’t tried it.
 


mechgamer123 said:


> I guess I'm not too surprised. Just in terms of tonality when I compared the GR07 BEs I have here to the ASG-2, UE900, DN-1000 and VSD1Ses, I prefer the GR07 to all of them. It has the forward sounding vocals (both male and female), a nice bass boost (though it could have a bit more midbass for the closet basshead in me), and for whatever reason I don't hear the sibilance on this particular set of GR07 BEs that I remember on my GR07 MK2s I had last year. Maybe my ears are just broken though. Maybe it's also because I've pretty much stuck to the hybrids with foam in them though.
> 
> I sort of figured out how to boost the mediocre isolation of the GR07s, I cut the stems off some old Klipsch tips and put them around the nozzle, then put some Meelectronics tri-flange tips cut down to bi-flange for more comfort on top of those.
> 
> Dang it, that's exactly what I wanted to hear in terms of tonality for the V3. I'm still arguing inside on whether or not to get CIEMs, considering the resale value would be terrible if I ever sold them and I'd have to reshell them to the tune of $250 from 1964ears every ~24 months (even less since I seem to be losing weight a bit right now)...


 
  
I would maybe suggest waiting until you’re at a more stable weight before getting customs, or getting a universal V3 now (does 1964 allow this?) and having it re-shelled later.
  


lempelig said:


> Hi joker.
> 
> I'm wondering if you can help me find a new IEM. I bought the AT CK10 after reading your review, and absolutely loved them, unfortunately I lost them and haven't found a replacement yet. The only thing I found missing in them were a bit more bass presence, but I wouldn't sacrifice the precision and speed for it though. Since I'm looking for something new, it might as well be an upgrade. Do you perhaps have a couple of recommendations, or a general path to look at? At this stage I'm looking at both universals and customs.
> 
> ...


 
  
Have you tried anything else in your search of a CK10 replacement?
 
I haven’t found a direct CK10 replacement yet except for the ~$1200 Hidition NT 6 but the ones I would look at in the lower price ranges are the VSonic VC1000 for a cheaper CK10 replacement and the 1964EARS V6-Stage as a sub-$1000 upgrade.
  


pastapipo said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> Thank you again for the great reviews!
> I ordered the vsd1s on your recommendation and I absolutely love them, especially the clarity, non-siblant highs and the smooth forward mids (guitars).
> ...


 
  
In my opinion the VSD1S is very hard to upgrade from under $100. The MOE-SS01 is a similarly-priced alternative but it has too much upper midrange in my opinion compared to the VSD1S. It does have good subbass and separation though. Another option is the Philips Fidelio S1 - it doesn't have the midbass of the VSonics so the deep bass appears more prominent, and overall it sounds almost as good as the GR07 IMO.
 
  


soundblast75 said:


> Hey , it would have been great if you'd reviewed the SE846 on page 846, haha


 
  
 Yes, I wish 
  


aleksanderp said:


> Hi joker, thanks very much for this great resource. I got the VSD1S and VC1000 based on your descriptions and am very happy with them.  The VSD1S is smooth and the VC1000 is very detailed.  I am wondering if something that fits the following description exists though:
> 
> 1. Has the speed and accuracy of VC1000's bass but with stronger impact.  Does something like this exist or does stronger impact always means slower bass?
> 2. Wearing straight down as over-the-ear is not practical for my glasses.
> ...


 
  
 In a way you will always be giving up a bit of bass speed for impact but an earphone can have more impact than the VC1000 without sounding slow or bloated - I don't think the Sony EX600 sounds bloated, for example, nor the UE900. 
  
 I don't see any drawbacks to EQing as long as you're not introducing clipping or distortion. You can actually get very good results with a 10-band EQ and an entry-level earphone with capable drivers and good end-to-end extension (e.g. Sony MH1C)
  


mdraluck23 said:


> Just going to go with the quick fire questions, two of em for ya joker.
> 
> What should I go to for a less fatiguing _slightly _"thicker" sounding R-50 in terms of universals, keeping price/performance in mind? Also, price no matter what's your favorite custom for such a taste?


 
  
In terms of fatigue, I always recommend switching away from the stock R-50 tips and maybe adding an impedance adapter as well. Anyway, as slightly smoother/thicker alternative there’s the ACS T15, VSonic GR01, Custom Art Music One (err.. customs), and Ortofon e-Q5. The UM Miracle would be my pick as far as higher-end customs go for a flat/balanced sound with better note thickness and no fatigue compared to the R-50.


----------



## mechgamer123

ljokerl said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > I guess I'm not too surprised. Just in terms of tonality when I compared the GR07 BEs I have here to the ASG-2, UE900, DN-1000 and VSD1Ses, I prefer the GR07 to all of them. It has the forward sounding vocals (both male and female), a nice bass boost (though it could have a bit more midbass for the closet basshead in me), and for whatever reason I don't hear the sibilance on this particular set of GR07 BEs that I remember on my GR07 MK2s I had last year. Maybe my ears are just broken though. Maybe it's also because I've pretty much stuck to the hybrids with foam in them though.
> ...


 
 I doubt that will happen soon, lol. Walking around college campus -> Lose weight. At home over the summer driving everywhere -> Gain weight.
 I don't believe they sell V3 universals. They do offer universals, but they're only for demoing. And at the tune of a $400 deposit, it wouldn't be worth it since they are only $450.


----------



## MoonYeol

mechgamer123 said:


> I doubt that will happen soon, lol. Walking around college campus -> Lose weight. At home over the summer driving everywhere -> Gain weight.
> I don't believe they sell V3 universals. They do offer universals, but they're only for demoing. And at the tune of a $400 deposit, it wouldn't be worth it since they are only $450.


 
  
 Lol. Start walking during the summer as well.


----------



## ljokerl

After some deliberation I updated my Earphone Buyer's Guide by Sound Signature with the RHA MA750 as an alternative to the Yamaha EPH-100 in the warm & smooth section. Been a while since I encountered something worth adding.


----------



## mechgamer123

moonyeol said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > I doubt that will happen soon, lol. Walking around college campus -> Lose weight. At home over the summer driving everywhere -> Gain weight.
> ...


 
 You know, that might just be a good idea!
 I don't know though, it's hot outside in the summer, and I'm lazy.
  
 On an unrelated note, how is the bass on the FA-4Es? I've heard from some people that is a dynamic driver type of impact as opposed to the weak bass on something like the UE-900. Is this true from your experience as well?


----------



## ericr

Mechgamer123,

If your budget allows, you might consider the earsonics SM64. Last year I had it, the W4, and 232 at the same time and the SM64 clearly came out on top. Joker gave them a good review. The bass hits deep & hard, quickly decays by about half and then sustains. To my ears it's a great combination of bass speed and fullness/richness. Lovely mids and non-sibilanct highs with some nice sparkle. Also important to me is the good detail and cohesiveness from bottom to top. I find them comfortable, too.

-E


----------



## MoonYeol

mechgamer123 said:


> moonyeol said:
> 
> 
> > mechgamer123 said:
> ...




More impact. Sliiightly tighter. Deeper. Less bloat. It's more focused.


----------



## jhooVA

ericr said:


> Mechgamer123,
> 
> If your budget allows, you might consider the earsonics SM64. Last year I had it, the W4, and 232 at the same time and the SM64 clearly came out on top. Joker gave them a good review. The bass hits deep & hard, quickly decays by about half and then sustains. To my ears it's a great combination of bass speed and fullness/richness. Lovely mids and non-sibilanct highs with some nice sparkle. Also important to me is the good detail and cohesiveness from bottom to top. I find them comfortable, too.
> 
> -E




Do these have an inline mic?

[COLOR=000000]In my opinion the VSD1S is very hard to upgrade from under $100. The MOE-SS01 is a similarly-priced alternative but it has too much upper midrange in my opinion compared to the VSD1S. It does have good subbass and separation though. Another option is the Philips Fidelio S1 - it doesn't have the midbass of the VSonics so the deep bass appears more prominent, and overall it sounds almost as good as the GR07 IMO.[/color]


If the Phillips S2 are available for around the same price as the S1 ~$10 more, is it worth the upgrade in sound? Is there an upgrade in sound with the S2?


----------



## Ellis

So I've been listening to music all morning with my SS Flux and Klipsch tips - it's a massive improvement over the stock tips. I've yet to test them properly (i.e. walking around outside) but I see no reason why they shouldn't be fine in all environments. It's just a shame that the stock tips seem so rubbish, because otherwise it's a great pair of IEMs for the price.
  
 Thanks for the recommendation Joker. I can recommend the same to anyone else having issues with the fit of the original tips.


----------



## ellis ip

yay ! finally got the heir audio 3.a.i


----------



## suman134

ellis ip said:


> yay ! finally got the heir audio 3.a.i


 
  
      how does it sound !!


----------



## cibibikeru

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> In that price range the Flux is probably your best bet. Personally I don't think it's notably smoother than the MH1C but it definitely has a bit less bass and a more accurate overall sound. The cable on the Flux isn't great but it's symmetric and can be used over-the-ear. It does have a mic though. Staying in the price range there's just not much that can compete with the MH1C, especially considering you like the signature. Moving up into the $100-$150 range there's more options but nothing I can think of that ticks ALL the boxes per your requirements.


 
  
 I bought the Flux and have been listening to them for a while, I like them more than MH1, Flux seems more balanced, mids and treble are more present but not disturbing. I've been reading a lot about iem and sound signatures, of all the IEMs I owned, I really loved the Brainwavz M1, the Vsonic GR04 Flagship (apart from sibilance), the Sony MH1 and now the Flux. I also listened to Shure SE215 but for 5min, really smooth except for not that present treble, soundstage . I like the full bodied sound, smooth, without anythig in particular to disturb your ears (harsh treble, sibilance, too much bass, too much mids, to much lower treble etc.).
  
 I guess that puts me somewhere between warm and smooth and balanced? Now I'm even considering an upgrade to the Flux.
  
 I read about the Fiio X3 DAP these days, is it worth 200$ as upgrade to the clip+ ? Would I hear a noticeable difference in SQ with the Steelseries Flux for example or do I have to also buy 100-200$ IEMs to hear something?


----------



## ellis ip

3.a.i not bad at all compare to w4 , i prefer the 3ai . bass is kind of like x10 but tighter and fast , soundstage a little bit smaller than w4 but surrounding is very similar , easy to drive , mids is like w4 , vocal not very close but not far , the only problem is the treble more smooth and laidback than w4 , make it not suitable for edm , but quite gd in rock and live performance , isolation better than w4 ,overall is kind of neutral but with very little bass boost , bass and mids detail good but for treble , a bit lack in detail


----------



## ljokerl

jhoova said:


> If the Phillips S2 are available for around the same price as the S1 ~$10 more, is it worth the upgrade in sound? Is there an upgrade in sound with the S2?


 
  
 I would go for the S2 then. Not so much for the sound (although I like the S2 a little more) but more because it has a nicer construction (mostly metal vs metal+plastic on the S1) and more eartips. Fit is very important with the S1/S2 - they are pretty picky about seal.
  


ellis said:


> So I've been listening to music all morning with my SS Flux and Klipsch tips - it's a massive improvement over the stock tips. I've yet to test them properly (i.e. walking around outside) but I see no reason why they shouldn't be fine in all environments. It's just a shame that the stock tips seem so rubbish, because otherwise it's a great pair of IEMs for the price.
> 
> Thanks for the recommendation Joker. I can recommend the same to anyone else having issues with the fit of the original tips.


 
  
 Glad to hear it! I hope others who have the same issue will come across this information 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. 
  


cibibikeru said:


> I bought the Flux and have been listening to them for a while, I like them more than MH1, Flux seems more balanced, mids and treble are more present but not disturbing. I've been reading a lot about iem and sound signatures, of all the IEMs I owned, I really loved the Brainwavz M1, the Vsonic GR04 Flagship (apart from sibilance), the Sony MH1 and now the Flux. I also listened to Shure SE215 but for 5min, really smooth except for not that present treble, soundstage . I like the full bodied sound, smooth, without anythig in particular to disturb your ears (harsh treble, sibilance, too much bass, too much mids, to much lower treble etc.).
> 
> I guess that puts me somewhere between warm and smooth and balanced? Now I'm even considering an upgrade to the Flux.
> 
> I read about the Fiio X3 DAP these days, is it worth 200$ as upgrade to the clip+ ? Would I hear a noticeable difference in SQ with the Steelseries Flux for example or do I have to also buy 100-200$ IEMs to hear something?


 
  
 I haven't tried the GR04 but I'm a big fan of the M1, MH1, and Flux. I don't consider the SE215 an upgrade over the Flux or MH1, personally.  It sounds like you enjoy a *slightly* warm signature. 
  
 I haven't tried the X3 at length but I doubt it's necessary for an entry-level dynamic IEM. A rockboxed clip+ works great as far as I'm concerned. The Flux is not very efficient but it's not picky when it comes to source. Some other IEMs are (BAs often more so than dynamics), but with the Flux as long as you get sufficient volume from your device you should be good.


----------



## Amitl

just how much of a sonic upgrade is the EPH-100 over the SE215?
 i can't decide between the two... what draws me about the SE215 is the design,
 and the EPH-100 sounds like it fits my sound preference exactly...


----------



## ericr

jhoova said:


> Do these have an inline mic?
> ...




No Mic/controls come with the SM64 - they do have replaceable cables with the standard two pin connectors.


----------



## ibizai9100

amazing thread, have helped me much.
 Joker - what about Astrotec AX7 and UE700?


----------



## ljokerl

ibizai9100 said:


> amazing thread, have helped me much.
> Joker - what about Astrotec AX7 and UE700?


 
  
 I'm not a fan of either compared to the similarly-priced VSonic VC1000 and modded Rock-It R-50.


----------



## Zelda

ljokerl said:


> I'm not a fan of either compared to the similarly-priced VSonic VC1000 and *modded *Rock-It R-50.


 
 what mod?


----------



## Mdraluck23

zelda said:


> what mod?


 
 Maybe after market tips? Only thing I've really heard of.


----------



## ljokerl

zelda said:


> what mod?


 
  
 For me Ety triple-flanges + an inline impedance adapter (64 ohms) really balances them out.


----------



## marcrom

Can someone recommend me earphones for workout? I have Dunu-DN900 but I am afraid I might break it if I'd use it when I am exercising. My budget is less than $20. Thank you


----------



## Shawn71

marcrom said:


> Can someone recommend me earphones for workout? I have Dunu-DN900 but I am afraid I might break it if I'd use it when I am exercising. My budget is less than $20. Thank you



meelectronics M6 older gens not the current as it is little over your budget.


----------



## ljokerl

The M6 would be my recommendation as well. Some of the colors are less than $20 on amazon: http://www.amazon.com/MEElectronics-Sport-Fi-Noise-Isolating-In-Ear-Headphones/dp/B0038W0K2U and you can find more cheap ones on ebay.


----------



## Zelda

mdraluck23 said:


> Maybe after market tips? Only thing I've really heard of.


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> For me Ety triple-flanges + an inline impedance adapter (64 ohms) really balances them out.


 
 thanks! that's easy. thought it was something more serious


----------



## Shawn71

Also the M6's silicon tips are great to try on with some of the good iems for better sq, isolation and fit than their stocks.........


----------



## Pastapipo

marcrom said:


> Can someone recommend me earphones for workout? I have Dunu-DN900 but I am afraid I might break it if I'd use it when I am exercising. My budget is less than $20. Thank you





How about the xiaomi pistons 2. http://www.ibuygou.com/p-original_xiaomi_piston_earphone_updated_version_brown-5708-usd.html
There is a great hype going on about them at the discovery thread. Haven't got them myself, but respected heafiers are praising them. 
I'm curious to how joker would rate them, but reading this thread makes it obvious there are far more iems in line waiting to being reviewed.


----------



## wysinawyg

Thanks ljokerl for the RHA MA750 review and this incredible gazzillion-IEM thread. It's my bible every time I look for IEMs.
  
 I've been using the ECCI PR401 and have no complaints with the sound signature, except I do want more isolation, a 3-button remote and hopefully more spacious presentation.
 I was considering the OM Audio Inearpeace and NOCS NS400 but couldn't find reviews to benchmark against the criteria in this thread, but now it looks like this RHA MA750i could be the ticket!
  
 A few questions:
  
 - are the guided-over-ear hooks removable (have never worn over-ear hooks before and don't know if it will be uncomfortable for me)
 - how would you say the MA750 is (or isn't) significantly different from the PR401 in terms of sound quality?
  
  
  
  
  
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> After some deliberation I updated my Earphone Buyer's Guide by Sound Signature with the RHA MA750 as an alternative to the Yamaha EPH-100 in the warm & smooth section. Been a while since I encountered something worth adding.


----------



## marcrom

shawn71 said:


> meelectronics M6 older gens not the current as it is little over your budget.




How do I know if the mee m6 is older? Thank you.


----------



## MoonYeol

marcrom said:


> shawn71 said:
> 
> 
> > meelectronics M6 older gens not the current as it is little over your budget.
> ...




Buy the one you can afford. If it's within your budget it's probably last gen.


----------



## Shawn71

marcrom said:


> How do I know if the mee m6 is older? Thank you.




This is how it looks like (pls click the amazon link).....the link has the blue version priced @ $16.xx right now.

 http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B008YDTRJU/ref=mp_s_a_1_5?qid=1390828755&sr=8-5&pi=AC_SX110_SY165_QL70

the next gen will have the "P" suffix (M6P) for mobile version and theres one more model called "S6P"which is the sports version with red shell.


----------



## Deviltooth

If you're buying the M6 you'd better like your music to have a lot of sloppy bass.  Personally I wasn't a fan.


----------



## garcsa

If you aren't in US:
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/MEElectronics-Over-the-Ear-Sports-Fi-M6-First-gernation-Headset-Bulk-Package-/130982442462?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item1e7f2975de
  
 'P' means - with microphone.
  
 http://www.meelec.com/category_s/426.htm


----------



## jant71

deviltooth said:


> If you're buying the M6 you'd better like your music to have a lot of sloppy bass.  Personally I wasn't a fan.


 

 Yep, I had the older one and it was decent but not sure how much the new one improved for today's market. I like the Moxpad X3/Soundsoul U10 better for a similar flush in ear that has better sound plus replaceable cable. Still a warm smooth enjoyable sig but closer to the VSD1 SQ level than the M6 was.


----------



## Mr Trev

So I decided to blow my budget and grab a pair of GR07BEs. Got em on sale for $139 Cdn, but this really was well above what I was planning on spending ($50-100). But since they were getting to much love I said to heck with it. Sounds ok so far. Actually way more bass than I was expecting, I can't even use the comply-type tips cause there is just too much bass there. I guess I've just gotten so used to my PFE111s. I suppose this is the difference between a BA and dynamic. To me an analogy would be that the PFE is like a really good stand mounted speaker, whereas the vsonic would be a floor stander. I'll need to spend more time with em before I can make a definitive opinion, but so far I haven't got that money well spent feeling like I did from the Phonaks.
  
 This brings me to a question. Has anybody else purchased these recently? I ask because I didn't get any hybrid tips with mine. I was wondering if it's because of the recent tiff with sony or something else. I still haven't heard from the guys I bought em from yet (that's my one complaint about Headphone Bar, kinda slack with the email). I'm not all that concerned, genuine sony's are under $10 if I really want them, and I might try some actual comply's (not sure if I can stretch my phonak tips to fit. I'll wait till the ones I'm using now are pretty much done so I don't trash a new pair).
 I also asked this over on the 07 thread, but no one's replied so I figured I'd ask here too.
 Cheers.
 BTW any thoughts about comply tip size. So far I've read everything from 200-500.


----------



## MoonYeol

From what I've read, Comply doesn't officially fit and actually I'd stay away from them. It's weird that you didn't get the Vsonic hybrids. Anyway, if you're going to spend $10 on tips, might as well buy a pair of MH1 (the cheap ones) and get the new hybrids AND a nice headset (even if you can't use them with most things without an adapter or recabling). I got a great sound with my GR07mkII and the MH1C hybrids.
  
 If you really want to use comply tips I think something like using the steam from a hybrid tip and stuffing it inside a larger comply tip like T400-500. You can kind of put the hybrid tip inside the comply tip, fold it inside out and make the silicone act as a sleeve over the nozzle of the GR07 if you want to. It actually works. It's an interesting way and you'll probably have to have them in front of you to understand what I mean.


----------



## Mr Trev

I'd still like to give actual complys a try. They are stupid comfy with my phonaks, and I find that the silicone are more prone to cable noise. I'm also hoping the real comply won't be so bassy since they are smaller and probaby won't fit so deep/tight (I don't really notice any huge diff in sound with the PFE, so it must be the vsonic foam right
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





) I have managed to fit the phonak large silicone onto the vsonic, but they do stick out a little farther and are kinda wobbly which make them even more susceptable noise.
  
 Even the packaging is different for most of the other pics that I've seen (including The Headphone Bar website). They came in the same type of box as the 07classics. If they didn't have the candy cable, I'd wonder if I didn't get the classics instead.
  
 Another thing...How does the vsonic security check work anyways. I can't read chinese and google translate just makes it worse
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. What number are you supposed to enter?


----------



## ljokerl

pastapipo said:


> How about the xiaomi pistons 2. http://www.ibuygou.com/p-original_xiaomi_piston_earphone_updated_version_brown-5708-usd.html
> There is a great hype going on about them at the discovery thread. Haven't got them myself, but respected heafiers are praising them.
> I'm curious to how joker would rate them, but reading this thread makes it obvious *there are far more iems in line waiting to being reviewed.*


 
  
 Ain't that the truth.
  


> Originally Posted by *wysinawyg* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Thanks ljokerl for the RHA MA750 review and this incredible gazzillion-IEM thread. It's my bible every time I look for IEMs.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The MA750 is warmer-sounding and significantly bassier than the PR401. It also has a little more upper midrange/lower treble presence but not enough to significantly differentiate it from the ECCI there. I haven't heard the ECCIs in a while but from memory the MA750 should be a little wider. The PR401's signature has a very mild v-shape that reminds me more of the LG Quadbeat. Like the Quadbeat it has an advantage over a lot of similarly-priced IEMs in soundstage size due to that particular signature. 
  
 The earhooks on the MA750 are definitely not removable. They can be re-shaped if necessary but they're there to stay. 
  
  


marcrom said:


> How do I know if the mee m6 is older? Thank you.


 
  
 Not sure how to do it for the black/clear ones but the other colors (white, blue, purple, etc) didn't exist until the current generation so you're always getting the newest ones with those colors. 
  


jant71 said:


> Yep, I had the older one and it was decent but not sure how much the new one improved for today's market. I like the Moxpad X3/Soundsoul U10 better for a similar flush in ear that has better sound plus replaceable cable. Still a warm smooth enjoyable sig but closer to the VSD1 SQ level than the M6 was.


 
  
 I have a purple current-get one and for $20 I think it's fine. It's not up to par with $50 VSonics but I can listen to it while walking my dog without turning back early.
  


mr trev said:


> So I decided to blow my budget and grab a pair of GR07BEs. Got em on sale for $139 Cdn, but this really was well above what I was planning on spending ($50-100). But since they were getting to much love I said to heck with it. Sounds ok so far. Actually way more bass than I was expecting, I can't even use the comply-type tips cause there is just too much bass there. I guess I've just gotten so used to my PFE111s. I suppose this is the difference between a BA and dynamic. To me an analogy would be that the PFE is like a really good stand mounted speaker, whereas the vsonic would be a floor stander. I'll need to spend more time with em before I can make a definitive opinion, but so far I haven't got that money well spent feeling like I did from the Phonaks.
> 
> This brings me to a question. Has anybody else purchased these recently? I ask because I didn't get any hybrid tips with mine. I was wondering if it's because of the recent tiff with sony or something else. I still haven't heard from the guys I bought em from yet (that's my one complaint about Headphone Bar, kinda slack with the email). I'm not all that concerned, genuine sony's are under $10 if I really want them, and I might try some actual comply's (not sure if I can stretch my phonak tips to fit. I'll wait till the ones I'm using now are pretty much done so I don't trash a new pair).
> I also asked this over on the 07 thread, but no one's replied so I figured I'd ask here too.
> ...


 
 
Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately?) my GR07s are both pretty old (my GR07 mkI had its 3rd birthday earlier this year). Not sure if they've been changed recently.
 
I personally never found a comply size that works properly but the only ones I have are *400s and *200s. Lately I've been using modified meelec triple-flanges with an adapter to make them fit on the GR07 nozzles.


----------



## Mr Trev

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately?) my GR07s are both pretty old (my GR07 mkI had its 3rd birthday earlier this year). Not sure if they've been changed recently.
> 
> I personally never found a comply size that works properly but the only ones I have are *400s and *200s. Lately I've been using modified meelec triple-flanges with an adapter to make them fit on the GR07 nozzles.


 
  
 The phonak tips are t130. Looking at them I can see they are a little smaller than the one vsonic had, but I might be able to stretch the inner tube enough to fit. According to you reviews the phonaks have a 13mm nozzle, and the 07 are 14mm so it might not be too much of a stretch (bad pun intended
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




). I'll just have to wait till the tips I'm using now are a little more worn down before I try and get them on, I don't want to destroy a new pair. At least the nozzle on the 07 is metal so I won't have to worry bout breaking that.
 Can you explain that adapter?
 Cheers.


----------



## suman134

mr trev said:


> The phonak tips are t130. Looking at them I can see they are a little smaller than the one vsonic had, but I might be able to stretch the inner tube enough to fit. According to you reviews the phonaks have a 13mm nozzle, and the 07 are 14mm so it might not be too much of a stretch (bad pun intended
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
       it cant be 13/14 mm nozzle man .


----------



## ljokerl

Posted the fourth and final part of my CES Headphone Impressions at http://theheadphonelist.com/ces-2014-headphone-coverage-part-4-scosche-meelectronics-german-maestro/ 
  
  
 Highlights from Part 4:
  

The technical details of *Scosche* headphones elude even their staff but some of the models sound pretty good
The *MEElectronics Atlas* looks good with full-headphone graphics and sounds good with deep bass and a mildly v-shaped signature
As it turns out, a Motörhead concert at 110dB is not conducive to headphone testing
*Nakamichi* wins the coveted “Worst in Show” award for the turdtastic *NK 600*
An upcoming *Ecko Unltd* full-size headphone may just be retro enough to work
*Razer*’s new made-for-music *Adaro* headphone line is worth a listen
*GermanMAESTRO* impresses with lightweight, yet ultra-durable headphones, especially the full-size *GMP 435 S*
  
  
 Full post can be found here
  


mr trev said:


> Can you explain that adapter?


 
  
 MEElec tips are too loose on the VSonic nozzles. Putting the cores of smaller tips on the VSonic nozzle first and then stretching the MEElec tips over allows them to fit securely. It's the same idea as the Monster Supertip adapters: http://www.head-fi.org/t/559919/monster-eartip-adapters-a-potential-yet-competent-solution


----------



## Mr Trev

suman134 said:


> it cant be 13/14 mm nozzle man .


 
not 13/14. I meant one pair (phonak) has a 13mm nozzle. The other (gr07) has a 14mm. I don't have a micrometer to confirm, but it makes sense to me...
  
  
 My bad.....it's actually 3mm vs. 4mm.


----------



## kova4a

Yeah, for some reason aside from the smallest meelec m6's tips the other ones are a bit loose but you can force them over the lower part of the nozzle and they fit securely but you do get a shallower insertion this way unless you're using tri-flanges. The VSD1's nozzles in comparison seem to be a hair thicker and hold some tips a bit better without adapters.


----------



## wysinawyg

Thanks ljokerl!
  
  
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> The MA750 is warmer-sounding and significantly bassier than the PR401. It also has a little more upper midrange/lower treble presence but not enough to significantly differentiate it from the ECCI there. I haven't heard the ECCIs in a while but from memory the MA750 should be a little wider. The PR401's signature has a very mild v-shape that reminds me more of the LG Quadbeat. Like the Quadbeat it has an advantage over a lot of similarly-priced IEMs in soundstage size due to that particular signature.
> 
> The earhooks on the MA750 are definitely not removable. They can be re-shaped if necessary but they're there to stay.


----------



## Rage038

My favorite headphones would be the Yamaha EPH-100 but I can't wear them because of the insertion depth. How do these compare to the RHA MA750. They are both classified as warm & sweet on your website.


----------



## Kani

Hi joker
  
 I am currently using klipsch image s4 and i am willing to upgrade to something with more bass
 I listen to hip hop (eminem) most of the time
 i am using fiio e10 as my amp and listen to music throught it most of the time
 After reading your reviews i came down to three iems

 Velodyne vPulse
 Nuforce NE-700X / NE-700M 
 HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2

 From what i read HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2 looks good for me
  
  
 I just wanted to know your recommendation for me at a $110 budget
 my main focus is bass like klipsch 4 but much better


----------



## suman134

kani said:


> Hi joker
> 
> I am currently using klipsch image s4 and i am willing to upgrade to something with more bass
> I listen to hip hop (eminem) most of the time
> ...


 
  
    if you are mainly after bass , deep sub bass & mid bass i will suggest xb90ex , plenty of bass to enjoy .


----------



## Mr Trev

Hey. If anybody is interested, I did manage to get my phonak comply tips to fit on my gr07bes. Since I can never leave well enough alone, I figured I'd give it a try. Took  a little finesse getting them started,but not nearly as bad as I thought it might be. How hard it'll be getting them off remains to be seen. Size wise the complys are the same as the vsonic ones, but the foam of the comply is softer, and doesn't expand as quick making them easier to put in. Sound wise I thought the vsonics were really bassy, but not so much the comply. Could be because of the softer foam. Or maybe I'm just imagining it
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Now I just need to find the sweet spot for the left nozzle.
 Cheers


----------



## MoonYeol

mr trev said:


> Hey. If anybody is interested, I did manage to get my phonak comply tips to fit on my gr07bes. Since I can never leave well enough alone, I figured I'd give it a try. Took  a little finesse getting them started,but not nearly as bad as I thought it might be. How hard it'll be getting them off remains to be seen. Size wise the complys are the same as the vsonic ones, but the foam of the comply is softer, and doesn't expand as quick making them easier to put in. Sound wise I thought the vsonics were really bassy, but not so much the comply. Could be because of the softer foam. Or maybe I'm just imagining it . Now I just need to find the sweet spot for the left nozzle.
> Cheers




Good for you! I think the comply tips you have are an older model, didn't you say T130? Haven't seen any other except the T-X00 lately so I guess they cut down on the different sizes or something. Anyway. Good they worked for you!


----------



## suman134

mr trev said:


> Hey. If anybody is interested, I did manage to get my phonak comply tips to fit on my gr07bes. Since I can never leave well enough alone, I figured I'd give it a try. Took  a little finesse getting them started,but not nearly as bad as I thought it might be. How hard it'll be getting them off remains to be seen. Size wise the complys are the same as the vsonic ones, but the foam of the comply is softer, and doesn't expand as quick making them easier to put in. Sound wise I thought the vsonics were really bassy, but not so much the comply. Could be because of the softer foam. Or maybe I'm just imagining it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
    no , complys do suppresses bass , it works really nice on my H1's bass , it was still slightly boomy even after 150hrs of burning , but with complies , now its tamed and has better decay .


----------



## Mr Trev

moonyeol said:


> Good for you! I think the comply tips you have are an older model, didn't you say T130? Haven't seen any other except the T-X00 lately so I guess they cut down on the different sizes or something. Anyway. Good they worked for you!


 
 the T130s are specifically for the phonak line of phones (at least I haven't seen any others that use them). They are only available in the 1 style too, which is fine for me. I'm gonna have to stock up now that I got 2 phones that can use them (and before they get discontinued too). Also cheaper to buy directly from comply, than from 3rd parties (comply $20 for 5 pairs, others $20 for 3 pairs).
 If I could only find out why I never got any hybrids all questions will be answered.
 Cheers


----------



## Mr Trev

suman134 said:


> no , complys do suppresses bass , it works really nice on my H1's bass , it was still slightly boomy even after 150hrs of burning , but with complies , now its tamed and has better decay .


 
 That's what I figured, except I really didn't notice a big difference between the comply and the silicone on the pfe. Plus to me the vsonic foamie seem to be even bassier than the vsonic silicones. Not actually muffled so I dont think the ends are getting closed off, just that the bass sounded more forward.
 Now with the complys the sound is more along the line of the pfe, but with some more bass impact/authority that I would expect from a dynamic driver. I had no real complaints bout the bass on the pfe, just wanted a little mo punch while still staying clean and tight.
 Cheers


----------



## suman134

mr trev said:


> That's what I figured, except I really didn't notice a big difference between the comply and the silicone on the pfe. Plus to me the vsonic foamie seem to be even bassier than the vsonic silicones. Not actually muffled so I dont think the ends are getting closed off, just that the bass sounded more forward.
> Now with the complys the sound is more along the line of the pfe, but with some more bass impact/authority that I would expect from a dynamic driver. I had no real complaints bout the bass on the pfe, just wanted a little mo punch while still staying clean and tight.
> Cheers


 
  
     exactly !!


----------



## Grayson73

Joker, since you've heard the VSD1/VSD1S, BA200 and Fidelio S1/S2, do you plan on putting them on your comparison table?


----------



## thesuperguy

Hey joker, I've seen your impression on the VSD1(S) and you seem to be quite fond of them. I would just like to know if there are any other earphones that are either better or worth considering in the $50 and under category. I know the VC02 is quite nice - do you have a preference between the 2?


----------



## Louis8ball

Please forgive me if you have already addressed this topic (I couldn't find anything by you on this), but what is your impression of:
  
*MEElectronics M-Duo *...
  
  
 Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

rage038 said:


> My favorite headphones would be the Yamaha EPH-100 but I can't wear them because of the insertion depth. How do these compare to the RHA MA750. They are both classified as warm & sweet on your website.


 
  
 Unfortunately the EPH-100 I reviewed was a loan and I don't have it anymore but I provided the best comparison I could from memory here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/rha-ma750-ma750i/#comment-2521
  


kani said:


> Hi joker
> 
> I am currently using klipsch image s4 and i am willing to upgrade to something with more bass
> I listen to hip hop (eminem) most of the time
> ...


 
  
 The Wooduo 2 has mostly deep bass (subbass) and I haven't heard anything with more deep bass than that. You can currently get it for <$80 on ebay and amazon - I haven't heard anything that can beat that for bass.
  


grayson73 said:


> Joker, since you've heard the VSD1/VSD1S, BA200 and Fidelio S1/S2, do you plan on putting them on your comparison table?


 
  
 Yeah, definitely. The problem/delay is not putting them in the table - it's writing up the full reviews to go with the ratings.
  


thesuperguy said:


> Hey joker, I've seen your impression on the VSD1(S) and you seem to be quite fond of them. I would just like to know if there are any other earphones that are either better or worth considering in the $50 and under category. I know the VC02 is quite nice - do you have a preference between the 2?


 
  
 I don't think there are any I would say are outright better than the VSD1S (unless they match your signature preferences better of course) but there are a lot that are similarly-priced that can at least compete with the VSonics - Sony MH1C, SteelSeries Flux, VC02, MOE-SS01, and the yet-to-be-reviewed Fidue A63. I prefer the VSD1(S) to the VC02 - it has a warmer and more full-bodied sound. Its bass has more impact but is a little softer of note. It's also more sensitive than the VC02. The VC02 on the other hand is thinner and brighter, with bass that is less impactful but a touch more detailed/textured. I find it to be a bit more balanced overall but also more "analytical" compared to the VSD1(S).
  
  


louis8ball said:


> Please forgive me if you have already addressed this topic (I couldn't find anything by you on this), but what is your impression of:
> 
> *MEElectronics M-Duo *...
> 
> ...


 
  
 I haven't heard them. They had them on display at CES this year but they didn't have a pair out to try.


----------



## thesuperguy

Thanks for the response. I am purchasing these for a friend who typically listens to things along the lines of mainstream "rockish" and pop music such as one direction (sigh) and one republic. They also enjoy the occasional alternative rock such as coldplay or muse so I am on the fence about whether I should be getting the VSD1 or VSD1S. This is admittedly their first venture into decent earphones so they really don't know best but they do say they enjoy a fair bit of bass.


----------



## vaed

Hey |joker|,

 I'm happy you're still keeping up here. I remember referencing your threads when I first joined head-fi. You were sort of a north star for me, and it's great to see that your passion still hasn't died out.

 I'm intrigued by the Custom Art Music Two, but as you haven't reviewed them obviously, I'll frame this inquiry in terms of the Music One.

 Right now I'm commuting with a pair of HD 25 Amperiors, and wanted something that didn't skin my ears by the end of the night. I know it's difficult to compare CIEMs to On-ears in general, but do you think, in a general sense, the Music One would be an upgrade? I find myself desiring a detailed yet warmish signature with a natural treble, so sound signature won't be an issue, I think. I'm just concerned if the small CIEM drivers are as/more capable than the Sennheiser's bigger drivers in terms of resolution and impact.

 If you feel more comfortable comparing to another IEM, I currently have a Brainwavz B2 in my possession for reference as well. These are great analytical IEMs, but too thin-bodied and the bass is a bit lean. I hope the Music Ones would retain their detail while providing more richness, body, and impact as well.
  
 I'm assuming both comfort and isolation are no-brainers here as well.
  
 EDIT: Almost forgot, will these be fine out of my Iphone 5? 
  
 Thanks so much.


----------



## ljokerl

thesuperguy said:


> Thanks for the response. I am purchasing these for a friend who typically listens to things along the lines of mainstream "rockish" and pop music such as one direction (sigh) and one republic. They also enjoy the occasional alternative rock such as coldplay or muse so I am on the fence about whether I should be getting the VSD1 or VSD1S. This is admittedly their first venture into decent earphones so they really don't know best but they do say they enjoy a fair bit of bass.


 
  
 The differences between them would be too small for a beginner to notice so I don't think you have to worry about that. Keep in mind these aren't basshead earphones - they have good impact but they're not at the level of something like a Beats Tour or Monster Turbine. 
  


vaed said:


> Hey |joker|,
> 
> I'm happy you're still keeping up here. I remember referencing your threads when I first joined head-fi. You were sort of a north star for me, and it's great to see that your passion still hasn't died out.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Impact - no. The small driver just can't move as much air as a headphone. Resolution - yes. The HD25 might appear to have a small advantage there thanks to its sharper/crisper treble but for a less bright IEM the Music One does very well.
  
 The Music One is definitely not as lean/thin/bright/clinical as the B2. It's not very critical of source either, possibly because there's no crossover. Not sure if this holds true for the Music Two because I think it's a dual-driver (can't remember for sure right now).


----------



## 177261

Why isn't the Etymotic Research ER4S listed beside the chart?
  
 Are they better overall than the SE 535?


----------



## ljokerl

christianh said:


> Why isn't the Etymotic Research ER4S listed beside the chart?
> 
> Are they better overall than the SE 535?


 
 
The ER4S is review number 2A1.
 
I think the Etys are more accurate overall than the SE535 but whether they are “better” will depend on your needs and wants. They differ in both sound signature and form factor by a fair amount.


----------



## goldendarko

Any chance of adding the Shure's SE846's too?


----------



## 177261

ljokerl said:


> The ER4S is review number 2A1.
> 
> I think the Etys are more accurate overall than the SE535 but whether they are “better” will depend on your needs and wants. They differ in both sound signature and form factor by a fair amount.


 
  
 Thanks for the reply!
  
 I want accurate transparent sound. Like a studio monitor. Also the SE535 are not as comfy as i would like. I have never gotten used to them even though i've had them for about 3 years now.


----------



## Francisk

I haven't tried the SE846 but I definitely prefer the Etymotic ER4S over the SE535 because I find the SE535's top end too veiled and the Ety's are flatter sounding even though the bass response of the Ety is not as extended as the SE535. Overall I find the Ety ER4S sound signature to be more accurate for my taste.


----------



## ljokerl

goldendarko said:


> Any chance of adding the Shure's SE846's too?


 
  
 Don't have one and Shure wasn't amenable to sending one out.
  


christianh said:


> Thanks for the reply!
> 
> I want accurate transparent sound. Like a studio monitor. Also the SE535 are not as comfy as i would like. I have never gotten used to them even though i've had them for about 3 years now.


 
  
 If the SE535s are uncomfortable for you because they (especially the cable connectors) rest against the outer ear, like they are for me, then the Etys will indeed be a better fit. They sound best with a deeper seal than the Shures, though. Sound-wise they are very transparent - like *Francisk *I find the to be more accurate and prefer their greater treble energy to that of the Shures.


----------



## goldendarko

ljokerl, ok thanks, insanely awesome thread by the way - i had to pipe up after seeing the work you put in to this.

Any idea on the durability of the Shure's (535's or 846's are the two I'm interted in) ? I plan on using them in the gym with a FIIO X5 when it's released in the States.


----------



## loomisjohnson

ljokerl:
 initially, let me congratulate you on your extremely incisive and well-written reviews. iwould also be remiss if i didn't note your thoughtful and courteous communications with other members--you were obviously raised right.
 if i may invoke your expertise:
 1. i'm curious to try a BA design and have hovered around buying the mee a161p, but get  a sense from others they may be bass-shy. (i listen to rock/bop and while not a basshead, like some low end impact--i'm currently enjoying a UE 500 and moshi vortex). would i be disappointed with the a161p? is there an oomphier BA in the same range?
 2. do you have any opinion on the beyer dtx501p, which is supposed to bear some resemblance to the dt1350? any recs for a small on-ear in the same range?
 cheers,
 lj


----------



## Kani

Thank you guys for the suggestions
  
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> The Wooduo 2 has mostly deep bass (subbass) and I haven't heard anything with more deep bass than that. You can currently get it for <$80 on ebay and amazon - I haven't heard anything that can beat that for bass.


 
  
 I found a good deal for a Wooduo 2 and ordered a set
 Thank you joker


----------



## vaed

ljokerl said:


> Impact - no. The small driver just can't move as much air as a headphone. Resolution - yes. The HD25 might appear to have a small advantage there thanks to its sharper/crisper treble but for a less bright IEM the Music One does very well.
> 
> The Music One is definitely not as lean/thin/bright/clinical as the B2. It's not very critical of source either, possibly because there's no crossover. Not sure if this holds true for the Music Two because I think it's a dual-driver (can't remember for sure right now).


 
 Thank you!
  
 After a little more digging, it seems that the Music One might not have as much attack as I want, as it seems to be a very smooth signature.
  
 I've been perusing the 1964 catalogue, in particular, the V3 and the V6-S. It looks like the V3 and M1 are completely different beasts in terms of signature, where the V3 is a musical but aggressive while the M1 is more reference and laid-back. The V6-S looks to be in another league entirely more akin to mid-level customs, with a reference sound with slightly tilted bass.
  
 I'm ultimately looking for something natural and fun, but not colored to the point of a fatiguing/tiresome signature over a period of time, and suitable for metal. Does it look like the V6-S is taking the cake?
  
 The V6-S seems like a no-brainer if I'm perceiving it correctly save the hefty price. The V3 is tempting with its cheaper price tag and musicality, but the perceived boominess is a little scary, especially when it comes to light-speed double bass on some death metal tracks, and its sibilance-proneness. The Music One (Two) is also valid because though it doesn't have the attack of the other two models, it has a fun, textured low-end and smoothened response that is safe for metal tracks.
  
 I suppose I'm just thinking out loud here, but would you say that the 6-S is worth the investment in this regard, or perhaps you'd like to point me towards some other customs/universals closer to the V3/Music One price point? I'm looking at customs mainly for the comfort, isolation, and aesthetic.


----------



## ljokerl

goldendarko said:


> ljokerl, ok thanks, insanely awesome thread by the way - i had to pipe up after seeing the work you put in to this.
> 
> Any idea on the durability of the Shure's (535's or 846's are the two I'm interted in) ? I plan on using them in the gym with a FIIO X5 when it's released in the States.


 
  
 Thank you 
  
 I think now that the cable connectors no longer fail (at least as far as I know), the Shure IEMs should be plenty reliable. However, I would caution against using a BA earphone at the gym - from what I've been told armatures are less resistant to moisture than dynamic drivers. In the case of hearing aids (which, granted, are meant to last many years) there are even special dryers you can buy to dry them out at night to prolong their lifespan. Long story short, if you sweat a lot you may want to avoid using a balanced armature IEM at the gym.
  
  


loomisjohnson said:


> ljokerl:
> initially, let me congratulate you on your extremely incisive and well-written reviews. iwould also be remiss if i didn't note your thoughtful and courteous communications with other members--you were obviously raised right.
> if i may invoke your expertise:
> 1. i'm curious to try a BA design and have hovered around buying the mee a161p, but get  a sense from others they may be bass-shy. (i listen to rock/bop and while not a basshead, like some low end impact--i'm currently enjoying a UE 500 and moshi vortex). would i be disappointed with the a161p? is there an oomphier BA in the same range?
> ...


 
  
 Thanks, that's certainly a very unique compliment 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 The A161P has good bass for a single BA earphone - better than most in both depth and punch. However, your UE500 has a lot more bass boost so if you're used to that, the A161P may not be the best option (or may just take some time to get used to). There are a few bassier BAs under $100 - the Phonak Perfect Bass 022 is a good one that really doesn't lack bass, for example.
  
 I haven't tried the DTX501P but last I checked the DT1350 was <$180 on amazon which is a great price, though I personally prefer the sound signatures of the Senn HD25 and V-Moda M-80. They're all about the same size. 
  


> Originally Posted by *Kani* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> I found a good deal for a Wooduo 2 and ordered a set
> Thank you joker


 
  





 hope you like them!


----------



## ljokerl

vaed said:


> After a little more digging, it seems that the Music One might not have as much attack as I want, as it seems to be a very smooth signature.
> 
> I've been perusing the 1964 catalogue, in particular, the V3 and the V6-S. It looks like the V3 and M1 are completely different beasts in terms of signature, where the V3 is a musical but aggressive while the M1 is more reference and laid-back. The V6-S looks to be in another league entirely more akin to mid-level customs, with a reference sound with slightly tilted bass.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I really couldn't find fault with the V6-Stage beyond the very mild sibilance I encountered on some tracks. For the price it's as good an earphone as I've heard. The V3 is too bassy for me personally and the Music One, good as it is, still has some limitations in bass and treble (which the dual-BA Music Two may remedy).


----------



## imackler

ljokerl, thanks again as always for the thread. 
  
 I'm looking for an iem that will just nail classical, especially string quartets and cello solos. For practicality, it should be a universal. What's your current recommendation in the under $500 class?


----------



## Buddhahacker

goldendarko said:


> ljokerl, ok thanks, insanely awesome thread by the way - i had to pipe up after seeing the work you put in to this.
> 
> Any idea on the durability of the Shure's (535's or 846's are the two I'm interted in) ? I plan on using them in the gym with a FIIO X5 when it's released in the States.


 
 The actual ear pieces should do fine but I'm experiencing issues keeping the 846's cables attached just using them at my desk.  The Shure's are isolating but depending on your gym I suspect a lot of noise will filter into your listening experience.  I found with the noise and blaring music my nano and ER4's do fine at the gym and they block out much of the noise. Personally, I wouldn't take nearly $2k of headgear to the gym.


----------



## goldendarko

True, but I'm not concerned about losing them or anything, just their durability for gym workouts, I don't sweap copiously either so I wouldn't think that should be too big of a concern.


----------



## sailorcire

> *3C3) Skullcandy Ink’d*





> *Pros: Easy to find, fairly inoffensive sound, reasonably comfortable and isolating*
> *Cons: Poor build quality, harsh treble, no L/R indicators*


 
  
 If you look at the back of them where there is some protection prior to going into the speaker, you will see a very tiny L and R on each one.
  
 If you get to the different plastic type then you have gone too far.


----------



## ljokerl

imackler said:


> ljokerl, thanks again as always for the thread.
> 
> I'm looking for an iem that will just nail classical, especially string quartets and cello solos. For practicality, it should be a universal. What's your current recommendation in the under $500 class?


 
  
 Unfortunately "nail" tends to mean different things to different people. For me a neutral IEM is best for classical so I would go for an Ety ER4S. If you like a warmer sound there are other options, like the StageDiver SD-2, but I think the ER4S is great.
  


sailorcire said:


> If you look at the back of them where there is some protection prior to going into the speaker, you will see a very tiny L and R on each one.
> 
> If you get to the different plastic type then you have gone too far.


 
  
 The Ink'd I reviewed was manufactured in 2008. They added L/R markings later. I should note that in the review one of these days.


----------



## DSF767

I have had my Monster Turbine Pro Coppers, I have had them for about 3 years and they have been great to me, I picked them up during one of the monster refurbished deals and got them for I think $99 which was a great deal on an IEM that have been great. 
  
 Now I wear these headphone commuting into Boston everyday on the train and then about a half mile walk from the train to work, over time they have slightly stared to show their age, the metal backing has started to come a little loose, the rubber on the strain relief has come apart (though the wire itself is still fine). 
  
 I always take good care of them and wrap them up and put them in their case after every use and as I have said I have gotten about 3 solid years of use so I cannot complain. 
  
 However I just have a feeling after dealing with many IEM's once the strain relief starts to go no matter how well you treat them they might not last, so I want to start thinking of some replacements.
  
 Now I love the natural sound that the pro coppers provide they have a great mid-range and have a very smooth sound, however the part where  find them lacking is on the low end bass, I am not looking for anything with super boomy bass but something with a slightly better low end sound then the coppers provide.
  
 from a build standpoint, I want something that has a good build quality that will be ok going through the wear and tear of a daily commute and be able to stand up to being used heavily, something I can count on and get a similar life span of my pro coppers. Also another thing I don't love about the Pro Coppers are they are heavy, I find myself frequently adjusting them in my ear as walking sometimes shakes them loose. 
  
 I also want something with a detachable cable (so I can replace cable making them more durable) that can be worn straight down as over the ears are a pain with glasses. Also if at all possible I would like if it had controls to play pause and skip controls but its not a requirement. 
  
 I would like to keep my budget in the $100 - $200 range.


----------



## ljokerl

dsf767 said:


> Now I love the natural sound that the pro coppers provide they have a great mid-range and have a very smooth sound, however the part where  find them lacking is on the low end bass, I am not looking for anything with super boomy bass but something with a slightly better low end sound then the coppers provide.
> 
> from a build standpoint, I want something that has a good build quality that will be ok going through the wear and tear of a daily commute and be able to stand up to being used heavily, something I can count on and get a similar life span of my pro coppers. Also another thing I don't love about the Pro Coppers are they are heavy, I find myself frequently adjusting them in my ear as walking sometimes shakes them loose.
> 
> ...


 
  
 As far as I know what you're looking for doesn't exist. More bass than the Coppers is not very common among higher-end earphones to start with, but cable-down earphones with detachable cables are even rarer (there's like 5 I can think of, and none fit your other requirements). As far as I know your options are:
  
 Yamaha EPH-100 - excellent bass and lightweight form factor but no detachable cable, and no mic/remote
 RHA MA750i - similar bass quantity to the Coppers and not too different in sound overall. Well-built and has a mic/remote but again no detachable cable and it's worn over-the-ear
 Dunu DN-1000 - has good bass but also is significantly brighter than the Coppers and the sets above so it may sound off coming from the Coppers, especially at higher volumes. Also no detachable cable, no remote, and it isn't any lighter in the ear than the Copper
 Onkyo IE-HF300 + whatever Onkyo's mic cable is called - the only set here with a detachable cable. Very lightweight but feels plasticky for a $100+ earphone. Punchy but has less deep bass than the Coppers and the sets above, and not as good overall sound quality. 
 HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2 - has a ton of bass (the only one with significantly more of it than the Turbines) but doesn't sound as natural overall. Also is the least well-built and again no detachable cables or mic/remote.


----------



## imackler

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately "nail" tends to mean different things to different people. For me a neutral IEM is best for classical so I would go for an Ety ER4S. If you like a warmer sound there are other options, like the StageDiver SD-2, but I think the ER4S is great.


 
  
 That's where I was headed...again. Thanks for the confirmation.


----------



## esanthosh

ljokerl,
  
 Thanks to your review of Noble 4S, I finally got my first Custom IEM, Noble 4C.
  
 It took me a while to insert and remove them at first, but I am getting used to it. My first few minutes with it reminded me so much about Hifiman IEMs. Though they did not wow me at first, they gradually grew on me over the course of a three hour long listening session. It fits my sound preferences really, really well. I _think_ 4C is one of the most balanced IEMs I have heard so far, may be the best. Excellent clarity, healthy (non-anemic, non-excessive) bass quantity, clear mid range with good note weight, smooth treble, spacious presentation, good separation and layering - all this along with such a smooth sound, it has everything I wanted in my first CIEM. More than the positives, I am relieved that it does not have any negatives that bother me. It has a delicate combination of several factors that make me like them. Thanks for leading me to this happy experience


----------



## ljokerl

esanthosh said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> Thanks to your review of Noble 4S, I finally got my first Custom IEM, Noble 4C.
> 
> It took me a while to insert and remove them at first, but I am getting used to it. My first few minutes with it reminded me so much about Hifiman IEMs. Though they did not wow me at first, they gradually grew on me over the course of a three hour long listening session. It fits my sound preferences really, really well. I _think_ 4C is one of the most balanced IEMs I have heard so far, may be the best. Excellent clarity, healthy (non-anemic, non-excessive) bass quantity, clear mid range with good note weight, smooth treble, spacious presentation, good separation and layering - all this along with such a smooth sound, it has everything I wanted in my first CIEM. More than the positives, I am relieved that it does not have any negatives that bother me. It has a delicate combination of several factors that make me like them. Thanks for leading me to this happy experience


 
  
 Great to hear 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Sounds like the acrylic version is as capable as the silicone one, which is good to hear. It's still pricy, but hopefully money well spent!
  
 P.S. would really be curious if the universal version is equally capable .


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> Great to hear
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Well, it's hard to say whether the universal version is as capable as the 4S without hearing the 4S but it's really good. I'm really enjoying it and have no problem picking it over the er4s or any of the twfk based iems I've heard (b2, ck10, gr01).


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> Well, it's hard to say whether the universal version is as capable as the 4S without hearing the 4S but it's really good. I'm really enjoying it and have no problem picking it over the er4s or any of the twfk based iems I've heard (b2, ck10, gr01).


 
  
 That sounds good, IIRC you do quite like the ER4.
  
 It looks like Noble kept the housings fairly small, too, which is a big plus with these types of universalized customs.


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> That sounds good, IIRC you do quite like the ER4.
> 
> It looks like Noble kept the housings fairly small, too, which is a big plus with these types of universalized customs.


 
 Yeah, I'm pretty happy with the N4, especially given how I jumped the gun and bought it before it was released purely based on your 4S review and hoping it's at least similar to it in performance. As far as the new design, I have no issues with the comfort but it is a bit on the thick side in comparison to 4ai, for instance, but it is more like a proper universal now with the screwed on faceplate and without the consistency issues of the handmade nozzles.


----------



## starfly

Hi ljokerl,
  
 I currently own the SE530 IEM and the cable is starting to crack. I've had it for almost 5 years now, so fine, time to replace it. I'm however looking for a more affordable IEM now, since I recently bought a good pair of headphones which I use for my more critical listening sessions. These IEMs will be mostly for commuting and exercising and otherwise casual use. So I'm looking in the price range of $100 - $200.
  
 For one, I'm looking for IEMs that isolate really well, as I like to be able to isolate myself fully from my surroundings when listening on a train / airplane. In terms of sound signature, when comparing to the SE530 I'm looking for a bit more treble extension, as the SE530 is quite rolled off. I like the presentation of the mids, but I could also live with mids that were slightly less forward and thick. And in terms of bass, I'm not a basshead, but I do like it when an IEM produces a decent amount of bass and can reach low into the sub-bass region, while still being pretty detailed. Definitely not looking for anything bloated. And in terms of soundstage, I'd definitely like a much wider soundstage than the SE530, with good layering and depth as well.
  
 I realize I probably can't have everything given the price range I'm looking at, but do you have any recommendations? I looked at your IEM list on your site but I'm really not sure what to pick.


----------



## Chude Mleko

ljokerl said:


> In that price range, purely for sound quality and with a mic, I like the Philips Fidelio S1 better than the A161P.
> Compared to the RE-400, the S1 has better bass depth and more bass overall. Its upper midrange and treble are more energetic whereas the RE-400 is smoother and more laid-back up top with a warmer overall tone. The S1 also has a wider soundstage than the RE-400.


 
 Hi *ljokerl*,
  
 I ordered S1 and listened to it for couple of days but I'm returning it. Unfortunately they didn't sound better than A161p to my ear. They have too much bass. It's OK for guitar, rock and metal music but jazz trios sound rather disappointing. I mean double bass and drums are all over piano notes for instance. Plus I felt smooth lower end made highs sound harsh at higher volume, trumpet especially sounds unpleasant.
 While sound stage does appear to be wider I felt instrument separation wasn't as good as in A161p. Plus A161p gives you so much more detail.
 Maybe I'm on BA side in BA vs DD battle? I don't know.
  
 Anyway, I'm back listening on A161p and I hope they will survive few more months but I still wander, where do I go when they die? The have the best sound I came across but poor build quality in comparison to other sets at that price point.
 Should I try etys HF2 next, or some dual driver BA? What would you consider an upgrade from A161p, with similar characteristic, preferably with mic, but I guess I might have to give up on mic at the end.
  
 i appreciate your response!


----------



## suman134

chude mleko said:


> Hi *ljokerl*,
> 
> I ordered S1 and listened to it for couple of days but I'm returning it. Unfortunately they didn't sound better than A161p to my ear. They have too much bass. It's OK for guitar, rock and metal music but jazz trios sound rather disappointing. I mean double bass and drums are all over piano notes for instance. Plus I felt smooth lower end made highs sound harsh at higher volume, trumpet especially sounds unpleasant.
> While sound stage does appear to be wider I felt instrument separation wasn't as good as in A161p. Plus A161p gives you so much more detail.
> ...


 
  
     hf2 will kill your bass , ruler flat bass , if you can do with that , go for hf2 any day , or you can opt for re-400 , rha ma-750 , in BA's you can go for gr-01 , ba-200 . if you are not looking for bass nor high , just clarity and separation , go for re-400 .


----------



## loomisjohnson

ljokerl:
 apologies if you've answered this already, but on your 1-10 quality scale, where would you put the philips fidelio s1/s2?
 many thanks,
 lj


----------



## Francisk

Chide Mleko, if you like balanced jazz trio sound I think you're going to like the Ety Hf2. If you prefer slightly better high frequency extension then go for Ety ER4PT instead. If you like a little fun sound signature with excellent detail and better bass extension but not bloated then go for Phonak PFE232. Jazz trio also sound very good with the PFE232 too and I find them to be very vers atile actually. It produces very nice sound with whatever I throw at it but if you prefer a more forward mid and a flatter sound signature then go for the Ety ER4PT instead. The PFE232 is going on sale at Amazon around $390 which is excellent value. It used to be priced at $600.


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> Yeah, I'm pretty happy with the N4, especially given how I jumped the gun and bought it before it was released purely based on your 4S review and hoping it's at least similar to it in performance. As far as the new design, I have no issues with the comfort but it is a bit on the thick side in comparison to 4ai, for instance, but it is more like a proper universal now with the screwed on faceplate and without the consistency issues of the handmade nozzles.


 
  
 That's good to hear. Thick is better than extra bits sticking into the side of your ear. 
  


starfly said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> I currently own the SE530 IEM and the cable is starting to crack. I've had it for almost 5 years now, so fine, time to replace it. I'm however looking for a more affordable IEM now, since I recently bought a good pair of headphones which I use for my more critical listening sessions. These IEMs will be mostly for commuting and exercising and otherwise casual use. So I'm looking in the price range of $100 - $200.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The HiFiMan RE-400 might be all you need. It has smooth but pretty well-extended treble, not lack of midrange presence and punchy, some bass roll-off but not really worse than the SE530. It doesn't have a particularly wide soundstage but like you said, can't really have everything.
  
 The VSonic GR07 does a little better in bass depth and has a wider soundstage but its treble might sound a bit sibilant coming from the SE530 and it doesn't have the greatest layering. Its isolation is also not quite as good as that of the RE-400 IMO. 
  
 The Creative In-Ear 3 is something I've always thought sounds like a Shure product but IMO it doesn't improve on the SE530 in any way.
  
 As a super-low-budget option you can also consider the SteelSeries Flux In-Ear. Again good isolation (though you may have to get some aftermarket eartips), excellent bass presence, and good end to end extension overall.
  
 Lastly, the Ety HF5 is the absolute best thing you can get for isolation and has good treble extension and a very balanced overall sound. Not as much bass presence as the SE530, though, and I don't think it has a soundstaging advantage over the SE530.
  
 P.S you might want to contact Shure - they have pretty good customer service and might cut you a discount on the 535.
  


chude mleko said:


> Hi *ljokerl*,
> 
> I ordered S1 and listened to it for couple of days but I'm returning it. Unfortunately they didn't sound better than A161p to my ear. They have too much bass. It's OK for guitar, rock and metal music but jazz trios sound rather disappointing. I mean double bass and drums are all over piano notes for instance. Plus I felt smooth lower end made highs sound harsh at higher volume, trumpet especially sounds unpleasant.
> While sound stage does appear to be wider I felt instrument separation wasn't as good as in A161p. Plus A161p gives you so much more detail.
> ...


 
  
 The A161P uses a Knowles ED driver. Since you like it so much maybe just stick with it - the Ety HF2 and ER4 both use variations of it. There are a couple of hybrid earphones that use it as well but I doubt you will like those. Dual BAs sound different and if you found the S1 harsh you'll want to be very careful venturing into that territory. The VSonic GR01 is the safest option among those IMO but it lacks a mic, is pricy, and isn't quite as durable as the cheaper VC1000 in my experience.
  


loomisjohnson said:


> ljokerl:
> apologies if you've answered this already, but on your 1-10 quality scale, where would you put the philips fidelio s1/s2?
> many thanks,
> lj


 

 8.9-ish. I like both of them better than the MA750, for example, but not as much as the GR07.


----------



## starfly

ljokerl said:


> The HiFiMan RE-400 might be all you need. It has smooth but pretty well-extended treble, not lack of midrange presence and punchy, some bass roll-off but not really worse than the SE530. It doesn't have a particularly wide soundstage but like you said, can't really have everything.
> 
> The VSonic GR07 does a little better in bass depth and has a wider soundstage but its treble might sound a bit sibilant coming from the SE530 and it doesn't have the greatest layering. Its isolation is also not quite as good as that of the RE-400 IMO.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks! I went ahead and ordered the RE-400. I did contact Shure for a trade-in, but they said I would first have to send in the SE530 and they couldn't tell me beforehand if they would just fix it or then offer me to buy a new SE535 at a discounted price; in other words, too much hassle for me. And the discounted SE535 probably still couldn't beat the RE-400 in terms of price.
  
 Edit: I also ordered the Yamaha EPH-100, will see which one I like more. Perhaps I might like the Yammie, to contrast my full-size Sony 7520 cans.


----------



## Chude Mleko

ljokerl said:


> The A161P uses a Knowles ED driver. Since you like it so much maybe just stick with it - the Ety HF2 and ER4 both use variations of it. There are a couple of hybrid earphones that use it as well but I doubt you will like those. Dual BAs sound different and if you found the S1 harsh you'll want to be very careful venturing into that territory. The VSonic GR01 is the safest option among those IMO but it lacks a mic, is pricy, and isn't quite as durable as the cheaper VC1000 in my experience.


 
 Thanks *ljokerl*,
  
 I think I'll try next one of these then: VC1000, Ety HF2 or ER-4PT (thanks Francisk). The latter is probably a bit too expensive for me. Have you compared HF2 and VC1000 before?


----------



## docked seaman

what iems do you reccomend for classical music (any price range) ?   thanks


----------



## oHUTCHYo

Joker please can you help me...

Can you reccomend a succesor to my Hippo VB? I'm on my second pair now but would like to move up a notch, circa £200 budget. I use my Hippo VB with the bassiest plate, so am looking for an IEM which really bangs hard on the lows similarly but also has better clarity/resolution/separation as my needs from an IEM progress and I grow more demanding of SQ.

My most expensive headphones to date have been the Sennheiser IE80, they didnt go as low as my Hippo VB and had that midbass hump Im not accustomed to from a V-shape profile Ive become accustomed to, but I did appreciate the better overall SQ. Ultimately however I sold them and stuck with the Hippo.

Any other suggestions I can research/try? My main genre is techno and house plus electronic acts such as Underworld, Chemical Brothers, Prodigy etc.

Thanks in advance 

Suggestions from Headfi have been Sony XB90EX, Denon C300, JVC FX200, JVC F700.


----------



## ozkan

Etymotic Er4s is good for classical music.


----------



## suman134

docked seaman said:


> what iems do you reccomend for classical music (any price range) ?   thanks


 
  
       re-400 .


----------



## Ivabign

Joker,
  
 I have a question for you....
  
 I bought, enjoyed, but ultimately sold my UE TF10's due to an inability to wear them anywhere else than sitting at my computer due to fit issues. I plunged in the UE pool again when there was a sale on UE900's figuring that the ergonomics were superior and the fit issues inherent in the TF10's would not replicate themselves. I guess I have really big canals as I struggle to get a consistent seal with even the biggest tips - no issues when stationary, but try to wear outside and move around? You get the idea.
  
 My question is whether a re-shell would be the way to go cost-wise and sound-wise - I only have $200 in on these and Fisher Hearing can mold them for around $110 shipped - but is there a straight custom for around the same $$ (or a hundred or so more) that you think would outperform a pair of re-shelled UE900's?
  
 Or would trying to replicate the sound I could expect from the 4BA custom version of the UE900 necessitate a larger investment in a straight custom? (or nothing that cheap will beat the UE so an investment of $500++ would be required)
  
 I owned a couple of sets of Heir CIEMS and loved the feel of a custom - they were the best fit of any headphone I have ever owned and if a couple of unforeseen bills hadn't cropped up, I would still own them.
  
 Sorry for being so wordy - congrats on 300!


----------



## davidcotton

ivabign said:


> Joker,
> 
> I have a question for you....
> 
> ...


 

 Thought about custom tips for them instead of a reshell?  As far as I know no one's done a ue900 yet.


----------



## Ivabign

davidcotton said:


> Thought about custom tips for them instead of a reshell?  As far as I know no one's done a ue900 yet.


 
 I corresponded with Fisher re: UE900 and they stated they could keep the MMX connectors (unsure if that is a plus or not) but they didn't seem to have an issue with a re-shell. I wondered about tips, but worry that they would be unwieldy - that is, sit way outside my ear and get in the way of glasses, hats, hair, etc....


----------



## suman134

ohutchyo said:


> Joker please can you help me...
> 
> Can you reccomend a succesor to my Hippo VB? I'm on my second pair now but would like to move up a notch, circa £200 budget. I use my Hippo VB with the bassiest plate, so am looking for an IEM which really bangs hard on the lows similarly but also has better clarity/resolution/separation as my needs from an IEM progress and I grow more demanding of SQ.
> 
> ...


 
  
     im not joker but i have a xb90ex and had auditioned c300 , c300 is 4 times pricy here , 90ex being $60 c300 is like $240 in india , c300 has better sq for sure and has more rumble in bass , a bit faster decay but 90ex is a true budget bass headphones and c300 is a grown version of 90ex , not a huge improvement over in the department of bass but not bad , amazon uk have them for 65 pounds , for that price if you can handle that huge profile ( bigger then 90es from every angle ) go for c300 , they have in-built iphone controller too .


----------



## ljokerl

starfly said:


> Thanks! I went ahead and ordered the RE-400. I did contact Shure for a trade-in, but they said I would first have to send in the SE530 and they couldn't tell me beforehand if they would just fix it or then offer me to buy a new SE535 at a discounted price; in other words, too much hassle for me. And the discounted SE535 probably still couldn't beat the RE-400 in terms of price.
> 
> Edit: I also ordered the Yamaha EPH-100, will see which one I like more. Perhaps I might like the Yammie, to contrast my full-size Sony 7520 cans.


 
  
 Probably not in terms of price - I would think they'd provide 50% off at most. 
  
 Hope you like the RE-400 and I would be curious if you get on well with the EPH-100 - it's a pretty different sound. 
  


chude mleko said:


> Thanks *ljokerl*,
> 
> I think I'll try next one of these then: VC1000, Ety HF2 or ER-4PT (thanks Francisk). The latter is probably a bit too expensive for me. Have you compared HF2 and VC1000 before?


 
  
 The reason I recommended the GR01 over the VC1000 is that it's smoother and a little warmer in tone. 
  
 The HF2 is flatter through the upper midrange than the VC1000 which IMO gives it slightly better clarity but it also sounds more "thin". The VC1000 has a bit more full-bodied sound (especially bass) but sounds a little brighter/more splashy in the treble region.
  
 By the way there's an S1/VC1000 comparison in the VC1000 review - might be useful: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/vsonic-vc1000/
  


docked seaman said:


> what iems do you reccomend for classical music (any price range) ?   thanks


 
  
 See previous page: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-309-iems-compared-ces-impressions-part-4-added-01-27-14-p-852/12810#post_10227049  . If you want to go up in price I recommend the Noble 4S.
  


ohutchyo said:


> Joker please can you help me...
> 
> Can you reccomend a succesor to my Hippo VB? I'm on my second pair now but would like to move up a notch, circa £200 budget. I use my Hippo VB with the bassiest plate, so am looking for an IEM which really bangs hard on the lows similarly but also has better clarity/resolution/separation as my needs from an IEM progress and I grow more demanding of SQ.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I haven't tried the sets you've been recommended except for the FX700. When I had it I thought it lost out to the FutureSonics Atrio for what you're after. The EPH-100 from Yamaha might be one to consider but I haven't heard the VB in a while so I'm not sure if its max setting had more subbass than the EPH-100 or not. The most (sub) bassy IEM I've tried is the Wooduo2 but I wouldn't call it an upgrade over the VB.
  


ivabign said:


> Joker,
> 
> I have a question for you....
> 
> ...


 

 I haven't heard many cheap customs but I doubt you'll find a better sound with a custom fit for $300-400 if you like the UE900's signature. For an upgrade in the same vein you'd have to go for like a Lime Ears LE3 or something on that level. For all I know there definitely could be something out there that would work for less but my experience with customs is pretty limited.


----------



## elbdogs

Hi Joker. I want to thank you for a great thread and blog. A couple of posts ago you mentioned an in line impedance adaptor. What is this, what does it do for you, and does it affect your ability to use smartphones as a source?


----------



## lolhart

First of all I wanted to say that this is a great thread and I’m sure a lot of people appreciate Joker’s work.  I was hoping I could get a recommendation for a new IEM.  For the last several years I have been using Etymotic’s ER-6s, which finally died a while ago.  I initially bought Etymotic’s ER-4PTs to replace them, but I found the bass lacking and the overall sound rather sterile.  I’m looking for an IEM with an energetic and lively sound.  I listen to a wide range of music, but especially pop, commercial dance and R&B.  The IEMs would mostly be for commuting and so isolation is very important, especially as I listen at low volumes.  I also want to use them directly from my phone without an amp.  I have tried the Shure SE415s, Westone 4Rs and Klipsch x10s.  I didn’t like the fit of the Shures and wasn’t blown away by the sound, found the Westone’s too smooth (like there was a veil) and there was something about the bass with the x10s I didn’t like.  Does anyone have any other suggestions?  Many thanks


----------



## MoonYeol

lolhart said:


> First of all I wanted to say that this is a great thread and I’m sure a lot of people appreciate Joker’s work.  I was hoping I could get a recommendation for a new IEM.  For the last several years I have been using Etymotic’s ER-6s, which finally died a while ago.  I initially bought Etymotic’s ER-4PTs to replace them, but I found the bass lacking and the overall sound rather sterile.  I’m looking for an IEM with an energetic and lively sound.  I listen to a wide range of music, but especially pop, commercial dance and R&B.  The IEMs would mostly be for commuting and so isolation is very important, especially as I listen at low volumes.  I also want to use them directly from my phone without an amp.  I have tried the Shure SE415s, Westone 4Rs and Klipsch x10s.  I didn’t like the fit of the Shures and wasn’t blown away by the sound, found the Westone’s too smooth (like there was a veil) and there was something about the bass with the x10s I didn’t like.  Does anyone have any other suggestions?  Many thanks


 
  
 If you're in EU it's rather easy to try the FA-4E from Thomann.


----------



## suman134

lolhart said:


> First of all I wanted to say that this is a great thread and I’m sure a lot of people appreciate Joker’s work.  I was hoping I could get a recommendation for a new IEM.  For the last several years I have been using Etymotic’s ER-6s, which finally died a while ago.  I initially bought Etymotic’s ER-4PTs to replace them, but I found the bass lacking and the overall sound rather sterile.  I’m looking for an IEM with an energetic and lively sound.  I listen to a wide range of music, but especially pop, commercial dance and R&B.  The IEMs would mostly be for commuting and so isolation is very important, especially as I listen at low volumes.  I also want to use them directly from my phone without an amp.  I have tried the Shure SE415s, Westone 4Rs and Klipsch x10s.  I didn’t like the fit of the Shures and wasn’t blown away by the sound, found the Westone’s too smooth (like there was a veil) and there was something about the bass with the x10s I didn’t like.  Does anyone have any other suggestions?  Many thanks


 

 ue-900 may be .


----------



## lolhart

Thank you for all the responses.
  
 Quote:


moonyeol said:


> If you're in EU it's rather easy to try the FA-4E from Thomann.


 
  
 I've briefly read some of the articles on head-fi and these sound interesting.  However, I'm a bit nervous about buying them blind at that price.  How is the isolation on the FA-4Es?
  


suman134 said:


> ue-900 may be .


 
  
 I was going to give these a try, but I've read a couple of comments that the bass is somewhat lacking.


----------



## starfly

ljokerl said:


> Probably not in terms of price - I would think they'd provide 50% off at most.
> 
> Hope you like the RE-400 and I would be curious if you get on well with the EPH-100 - it's a pretty different sound.


 
  
 So in what way do the RE-400 and EPH-100 differ exactly? I haven't read a direct comparison so far.
  
 Either way, thanks for your help so far!


----------



## lamboman

Hi all,
  
 Currently have a pair of Sony MH1Cs, they're cheap and cheerful (and sound extremely good for the price). However, there's a problem with the cable somewhere, and they keep cutting out (in addition to being a pain to wear due to the J-split).
  
 They sound OK but I'm finding that the bass dominates the overall presentation a little too much. Looking at something that has a similar warmth, but with slightly better balance and detail across the board. Mainly for hip-hop, rap, R&B, with the occasional bit of rock, pop, and acoustic.
  
 Budget: anything up to around £150.
 Must be durable, extremely comfortable, worn down (not over the ear) and preferably have controls for iOS devices. The MH1Cs also manage to sound quite natural, so I don't want anything that has an artificial veil to them (like some of the poorer models in the Sennheiser range). Also hate the mid-bass hump in IEMs like the Audio Technica CKS70.
  
 Was considering the Klipsch Image X10i at £99, however durability is a huge problem, and there are bound to be better choices out there now they're 6+ years old. Similar comfort would be great, though I know it'll be difficult to find. Many recommendations in this thread for the Yamaha EPH-100, but comfort doesn't seem to be quite as good.
  
 Any suggestions? Thanks in advance


----------



## reihead

Hello Joker,
  
 Two quick questions, both related to the V-Sonic GR07 BE
  
 1.  I lost one of the Earguides for my GR07 BE. I have search for earguides online and just a few site offer but on all of them are sold out.
 Any trick or recommendation to "emulate" the Earguides?
 Any cheap earphones (less than 20$) that comes with earguides I could use with my GR07?
  
 2. I love the sound of these earphones, definitely a good amount of bass for me. Now, what would be an upgrade without breaking the bank? I would like the same amount of bass and a little bit more of soundstage wouldn't hurt. It can be universal or custom, but I would prefer universal.
  
 Thank you, not only for this help but for all your effort on this valuable thread.


----------



## suman134

reihead said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> Two quick questions, both related to the V-Sonic GR07 BE
> 
> ...


 
  
 with out breaking your bank , an upgrade , no , you need at least $500+ for a substantial upgrade .


----------



## suman134

lamboman said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Currently have a pair of Sony MH1Cs, they're cheap and cheerful (and sound extremely good for the price). However, there's a problem with the cable somewhere, and they keep cutting out (in addition to being a pain to wear due to the J-split).
> 
> ...


 

  re-400 can do your work . if you can deal with flat bass , brainwavz b2 .


----------



## lamboman

suman134 said:


> re-400 can do your work . if you can deal with flat bass , brainwavz b2 .


 
 From what I've read both of those will be too bass-light for my liking, and possibly too analytical. I'm looking for something a bit more "musical", so to speak. Thanks for the suggestions anyway, shame as the B2 would appear to be an excellent choice if I had slightly different preferences!


----------



## FastAndClean

Lamboman - RHA MA 750


----------



## modulor

lamboman said:


> From what I've read both of those will be too bass-light for my liking, and possibly too analytical. I'm looking for something a bit more "musical", so to speak. Thanks for the suggestions anyway, shame as the B2 would appear to be an excellent choice if I had slightly different preferences!


 
 I'd probably suggest the EPH-100 (more $$$) or Flux (less $$$) (from personal experience both are better balanced than the MH1C) and would also suggest reading into the MA750 given it's recent review and it being priced in between the other two.


----------



## Coolsax

I'm sure its been answered but I didn't see if the first  couple of pages of the reviews.  I assuming that when you bold either worn down or over the ear in your reviews, the "bolded" option is the way you prefer or think works best for that particular iem, am i correct?


----------



## lamboman

fastandclean said:


> Lamboman - RHA MA 750


 
  Quote:


modulor said:


> I'd probably suggest the EPH-100 (more $$$) or Flux (less $$$) (from personal experience both are better balanced than the MH1C) and would also suggest reading into the MA750 given it's recent review and it being priced in between the other two.


 
  

 Thanks for these responses guys. Just a little more insight, to my ears the MH1C's mids are too recessed, and the top-end is lacking a bit. What I don't want his to go completely in the opposite direction and end up with a sibilant top-end. Bass quantity with the MH1Cs is OK, could do with being a little quicker.
  
@ljokerl, if you see this how would you compare these the MA750 and EPH-100 in terms of sound signature? I've read several of your comments as well as others on various sites and am now rather confused. Some have said that the MA750 has more recessed mids, less bass, is brighter sounding than the EPH-100. I know you don't like making comparisons of equipment when you don't have them on hand, however how would you compare them to each other, as well as the MH1C (mainly in terms of signature here)? Many thanks


----------



## ozkan

lamboman said:


> Thanks for these responses guys. Just a little more insight, to my ears the MH1C's mids are too recessed, and the top-end is lacking a bit. What I don't want his to go completely in the opposite direction and end up with a sibilant top-end. Bass quantity with the MH1Cs is OK, could do with being a little quicker.
> 
> @ljokerl, if you see this how would you compare these the MA750 and EPH-100 in terms of sound signature? I've read several of your comments as well as others on various sites and am now rather confused. Some have said that the MA750 has more recessed mids, less bass, is brighter sounding than the EPH-100. I know you don't like making comparisons of equipment when you don't have them on hand, however how would you compare them to each other, as well as the MH1C (mainly in terms of signature here)? Many thanks


 
  
 If you want your MH1Cs to be more quick and the treble more prominent, I recommend you to take the filters off and cut half of the sponge which is glued to the filters. It is safe as you can put the filters back on your MH1Cs. This is the cheapest way I guess to ugrade your MH1Cs


----------



## abhijollyguy

lamboman said:


> From what I've read both of those will be too bass-light for my liking, and possibly too analytical. I'm looking for something a bit more "musical", so to speak. Thanks for the suggestions anyway, shame as the B2 would appear to be an excellent choice if I had slightly different preferences!


 

 Analytical: B2
 Warm+smooth: RE-400 (though it doesn't lack any treble extension)
  
 RE-400 has very slightly more than neutral bass.


----------



## ljokerl

elbdogs said:


> Hi Joker. I want to thank you for a great thread and blog. A couple of posts ago you mentioned an in line impedance adaptor. What is this, what does it do for you, and does it affect your ability to use smartphones as a source?


 
  
It’s an inline resistor with a 3.5mm form factor. Typically between 50 and 100 Ohms. Mine is 64. On a very basic level it affects the impedance of your earphones and thus the way they respond to electrical current, more so for some models than others. With certain balanced armature earphones that have non-linear impedance (i.e. impedance that is different at different frequencies) it can change the sound quite noticeably, sometimes for the better. It’s not a panacea by any means, but I've noticed good results with certain IEMs with this one small addition.
 
Here's some on ebay:
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Etymotic-Headphones-Earphones-ER4P-ER4S-75-Ohm-Convertor-Cable-/271193304830?pt=US_MP3_Player_Cables_Adapters&hash=item3f24616efe
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Etymotic-ER4P-to-ER4S-3-5MM-plug-resistor-adaptor-/271363212964?pt=US_MP3_Player_Cables_Adapters&hash=item3f2e8206a4
  
If you have a headset these particular impedance adapters will stop you from using the mic/remote. It is certainly possible to make one with a pass-through channel for the mic/remote but I’ve never seen one like that.
 
 


lolhart said:


> First of all I wanted to say that this is a great thread and I’m sure a lot of people appreciate Joker’s work.  I was hoping I could get a recommendation for a new IEM.  For the last several years I have been using Etymotic’s ER-6s, which finally died a while ago.  I initially bought Etymotic’s ER-4PTs to replace them, but I found the bass lacking and the overall sound rather sterile.  I’m looking for an IEM with an energetic and lively sound.  I listen to a wide range of music, but especially pop, commercial dance and R&B.  The IEMs would mostly be for commuting and so isolation is very important, especially as I listen at low volumes.  I also want to use them directly from my phone without an amp.  I have tried the Shure SE415s, Westone 4Rs and Klipsch x10s.  I didn’t like the fit of the Shures and wasn’t blown away by the sound, found the Westone’s too smooth (like there was a veil) and there was something about the bass with the x10s I didn’t like.  Does anyone have any other suggestions?  Many thanks


 
  
Unfortunately the ER6 was before my time, though I’ve heard many great things about it.
 
You might like a TWFK-based set like the VSonic VC1000. Doesn’t have a whole lot of bass but it’s a very energetic and clear earphone. I don’t find it to be boring or sterile, personally, but it might be a little less exciting than what you're after. You may also like the VSonic GR07, which has more bass and again good treble presence, albeit with some unevenness. Coming from a set of Etys the mids may not be quite forward enough on the VSonics but otherwise they're a good halfway point between an analytical earphone and one that's so colored that it sounds "off". Isolation is not the greatest but decent. 
 
And a couple more unusual recommendations, though I suggest you read up on these a bit more - the Ortofon e-Q5 and FAD Heaven C. They're balanced-sounding earphones but not quite neutral, with excellent clarity to boot.
  


starfly said:


> So in what way do the RE-400 and EPH-100 differ exactly? I haven't read a direct comparison so far.
> 
> Either way, thanks for your help so far!


 
  
 I doubt you'll find a direct comparison of such different IEMs - people tend to compare like with like. The EPH-100 is way bassier than the RE-400, warmer, less emphasized in the mirdrange, and less smooth and refined up top, IMO.
  


lamboman said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Currently have a pair of Sony MH1Cs, they're cheap and cheerful (and sound extremely good for the price). However, there's a problem with the cable somewhere, and they keep cutting out (in addition to being a pain to wear due to the J-split).
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Flux recommendation above makes sense - I compared it to the MH1C here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/steelseries-flux-in-ear/ . There's a 1-button remote on it as well, and it's worn cable-down. Might need some aftermarket tips but it can be very comfortable. Not sure about long-term durability but they're cheap enough to replace.
  
 The EPH-100 is pretty comfy when you get used to it but of course no iOS controls. The MA750i from RHA is worn over-the-ear.
  


reihead said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> Two quick questions, both related to the V-Sonic GR07 BE
> 
> ...


 
  
 I can't seem to find any on ebay. Weird.
  
 If I were you I'd post a classified here on head-fi - plenty of IEMs come with cable guides and I'm sure lots of people have spares. 
  
 You can also get the ThinkSound: http://store.thinksound.com/product/active-ear-hook or V-Moda: http://v-moda.com/sport-earhooks/ guides. I prefer the fit of the Thinksound ones for comfort but I don't have them anymore to try with the VSonic cable. The V-Moda ones are more conventional in design and should fit pretty much any cable without issue.
  
 As for an upgrade, earphones I found to be in same vein as the GR07 BE would be the Alclair Reference (though its bass is GR07 and not GR07BE level), Phonak PFE 232, and Ultrasone IQ with impedance adapter. 
  


coolsax said:


> I'm sure its been answered but I didn't see if the first  couple of pages of the reviews.  I assuming that when you bold either worn down or over the ear in your reviews, the "bolded" option is the way you prefer or think works best for that particular iem, am i correct?


 
  
 Yep, that's right! I boldface the configuration I end up using.


----------



## nick n

I think Vmoda has some great looking earguides on their site still


----------



## marcrom

Can I use my relatively expensive IEM when I workoout without damaging it badly?


----------



## EPICFAILXD

Which sounds better- Dunu DN-1000 or Fischer DBA-02 MKII??


----------



## lamboman

ljokerl said:


> The Flux recommendation above makes sense - I compared it to the MH1C here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/steelseries-flux-in-ear/ . There's a 1-button remote on it as well, and it's worn cable-down. Might need some aftermarket tips but it can be very comfortable. Not sure about long-term durability but they're cheap enough to replace.
> The EPH-100 is pretty comfy when you get used to it but of course no iOS controls. The MA750i from RHA is worn over-the-ear.


 
 Thanks for the reply. Read a few reviews and it seems that durability in the long run with the Flux isn't great, and I'd want to spend a little more on a quality item that lasts.
  
 You've said in your previously that the EPH-100 is closer to the MH1C than the MA750. Is the MA750's mid-range slightly more forward than the EPH-100 and MH1C?
  
 Thanks!


----------



## suman134

marcrom said:


> Can I use my relatively expensive IEM when I workoout without damaging it badly?


 
  
     why take the risk ? get a cheaper sports phone cheapest is meelec m6 or a headphone like from philips sho series .
  
     or you can take the risk , just put the earphone cable under your clothes , can save it from some mishaps .


----------



## Shawn71

epicfailxd said:


> Which sounds better- Dunu DN-1000 or Fischer DBA-02 MKII??




DN1K sounds very good for its price against its contenders t-peos,akg' flagship....and its a triple hybrid compared to FA dba02's TWFK dual armature but built stronger than mkI. And DN1k's dynamic driver completes its fullness along with dual BA driver.


----------



## EPICFAILXD

shawn71 said:


> DN1K sounds very good for its price against its contenders t-peos,akg' flagship....and its a triple hybrid compared to FA dba02's TWFK dual armature but built stronger than mkI. And DN1k's dynamic driver completes its fullness along with dual BA driver.


 
 So the Dunu is better?


----------



## Shawn71

marcrom said:


> Can I use my relatively expensive IEM when I workoout without damaging it badly?




Rule of thumb: be very cautious . I would suggest you get cheapo over the ear IEM instead regular ones as it is less microphonics to nill and stay comfortably. Kevlar re-inforced cables are ok,but costs bit high. So best candidate is meelectronics M6, and you get more accessories too besides its sound and build.


----------



## brunk

I use my Ety ER-4S when working out and it works pretty good, especially the isolation. Cable microphonics is an issue, but there are ways to alleviate it.


----------



## Shawn71

epicfailxd said:


> So the Dunu is better?




Well i would say yes. Because it has an additional dynamic driver to take care of the bass department and different housing(metal) + the price is little over dba02 if you buy from mp4 with discount and coupon code. But at the same time dba02 is not a bad sounding dual ba iem either. It is one among first three of dual BA iems for excellent SQ, thats why FA gave the facelift to it with mkII (better bq than transparent plastic mkI). The o ther dual ba iem brands are UE,brainwavz, rockitsound, vsonic and astrotec. Finally, the same dual armature is tuned differently among these.


----------



## Telltale

Hi Joker,
  
 Firstly a huge thank you for everything you do. The thread is my go to resource and always open whenever I'm looking at IEMs. Also you're dedication with replying to people here and giving your advice is phenomenal so props to you.
  
 I've got some money going spare and I'm looking to get a new pair of earphones. I started with the GR06's which I adored. it may be that I conditioned myself to their sound signature but I loved the liquid smooth and forward mids they had and the overall balance. Unfortunately they were stolen and so I looked into getting a new pair of earphones: the VSD1S. They took a bit of getting used to compared to the GR06 but I've adjusted to them now.
  
 Compared to the GR06 the VSD1S wins out on a few things: the detail and extra kick in the bass is awesome, increased detail in the mids and highs, the more airy soundstage. They're certainly a much better IEM for when I'm listening to EDM/rap/dance music. However I find the analytical  V-shaped sound signature quite fatiguing and I really miss the luscious forward mids of the GR06. Vocals come across as very recessed with the VSD which has turned out to be a pet peeve of mine. I would easily lose myself in the sound of the GR06 whereas the VSD1 often feels a bit distant. 
  
 I've also had some usage with the JVC FXD60 which I found to be quite boring with very little kick to the bass, rolled off highs and a pretty boxed-in soundstage.
  
 As such I'm looking for a new IEM. Something warm, mid-centric and forward that might be considered an upgrade to the GR06 and complement the VSD1. I'm looking for something <£80 hopefully. These are the ones I've considered from reading about:
  
 Vsonic GR07 - Popular and originally what I was considering, however reading up it sounds like it's a bit closer to the VSD1 than the GR06 so the mids probably wouldn't be forward enough.
  
 SE215 - Many people view these as mid-centric and forward while still being solid in the bass department. The build quality and over-ear designs are positives too.
  
 MA750 - You recommend them as great warm sounding IEMs and the overall package is very appealing. I'd be a bit worried they're not quite the right sound signature I'm looking for, especially with the warm and forwardness of the mids.
  
 RE-400 - Again very well recommended and popular but I'd concerned that the fairly balanced sound signature isn't what I'm looking for and might be a bit fatiguing.
  
 Etymotic MC5/Ety Kids - Similar to above you describe them as overall very balanced but slightly mid-centric. They may not have the warm sound I'm looking for but the isolation and design are attractive features.
  
 Vsonic GR06 - Ofcourse if there's nothing that seems like a viable upgrade I'll probably be perfectly happy getting the GR06s again. Much cheaper too.
  
 Sorry for the lengthy post, any help would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## suman134

telltale said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Firstly a huge thank you for everything you do. The thread is my go to resource and always open whenever I'm looking at IEMs. Also you're dedication with replying to people here and giving your advice is phenomenal so props to you.
> 
> ...


 

   have you thought about eph-100 or image x10 ? they can be satisfying , and no one gets everything not even with orpheus 90 ( it used to cost a pair of kidney and a leg ) , you buy a nice phone closer to your likings and you make truce with its short comings .


----------



## Orel

Hey Joker, the AKG K323XS look interesting. You think you would have a chance to try these?


----------



## peter123

Someone was looking for earloops the other day:

http://m.ebay.com/itm?itemId=380468243568

Don't know about the quality but the seller is good, I've used him many times.


----------



## starfly

ljokerl said:


> I doubt you'll find a direct comparison of such different IEMs - people tend to compare like with like. The EPH-100 is way bassier than the RE-400, warmer, less emphasized in the mirdrange, and less smooth and refined up top, IMO.


 
  
 So I had already ordered the RE-400 and thought I'd return them, because from what I've been reading I figured the EPH-100 might be a bit closer to what I'm looking for than the RE-400. Just thought I'd miss out on the low end. So I sent an e-mail to the store owner and the guy calls me back within an hour and basically urges me to actually give them a listen and that I shouldn't worry about the return policy, that if I still don't like them after giving them a proper listening session I could still return them. Good guy!! He also told me to burn them in for 24 hours and try it with the included Comply tips. That's what I call great service!
  
 So I haven't burnt them in yet for 24 hours, but they've been playing music for most of the day and I decided to give them a try just now (actually listening to them right now). So far I have to say that they sound better than I expected. The sound is a bit clinical compared to my SE530, but otherwise the bass has much more presence than I was expecting. It probably misses that last bit of sub-bass that the SE530 can offer, but the mids and highs are quite clear. Not completely sure yet if I like their somewhat forward presentation (especially the mids), it's a little bit too much in my face so far. But I like all the detail it retrieves though. Otherwise, I can tell it's a tiny driver, the SE530 just sounds a bit 'bigger', but I guess that was to be expected given that actual physical size difference.
  
 So will burn them in more overnight and tomorrow during the day and will give them another spin tomorrow night. But so far, better than I was expecting. The EPH-100 is also on the way, but I probably won't be able to return those once I've tried them (from a different store) so I'm just gonna have to guess how they sound based on reviews of both IEMs.
  
 So far I've tried them with the big double-flange tips included, those are most comfortable and give me a good seal. Oh, and also I sometimes get the illusion that I'm not getting a good seal with the sound thinning out, but then I check and they're still sealed properly. Does this have to do with the wider soundstage compared to the SE530, which basically places all the instruments farther away from each other giving the impression of thinner/emptier sound?


----------



## 5fteleven

Hi Joker. A silly question, but out of the 309 iems do you find TDK EB900 as having the strongest bass? Also is koss spark plug (pathfinder) bassier?


----------



## reihead

peter123 said:


> Someone was looking for earloops the other day:
> 
> http://m.ebay.com/itm?itemId=380468243568
> 
> Don't know about the quality but the seller is good, I've used him many times.


 
  
 I'm that person, but the link you provided doesn't work, takes me to the homepage.
  
 Cheers


----------



## peter123

reihead said:


> I'm that person, but the link you provided doesn't work, takes me to the homepage.
> 
> Cheers


 
 Sorry about that, try this one instead 
  
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/High-quality-Earloop-Earhook-for-Earphones-Earbuds-Shirt-Clip-/380468243568?pt=US_Replacement_Parts_Tools&hash=item5895acac70


----------



## reihead

ljokerl said:


> ....
> 
> I can't seem to find any on ebay. Weird.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks joker, 
 What about regardless of the same SS? What would be an upgrade?


----------



## reihead

peter123 said:


> Sorry about that, try this one instead
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/High-quality-Earloop-Earhook-for-Earphones-Earbuds-Shirt-Clip-/380468243568?pt=US_Replacement_Parts_Tools&hash=item5895acac70


 
  
 Thanks, another member already pointed me to those. Seems the only option so far
 Cheers


----------



## peter123

reihead said:


> Thanks, another member already pointed me to those. Seems the only option so far
> Cheers


----------



## kova4a

reihead said:


> Thanks, another member already pointed me to those. Seems the only option so far
> Cheers


 
 Well, these are most likely the genuine Vsonic ones. I have like 6 pairs of vsonic earguides and the bigbargainonline ones seem to be exactly these. You can always order from China but you'll pay like 10 bucks for one pair and honestly the vsonic earguides are pretty sub-par and not worth paying that much. I'm 99% sure the ebay ones are the actual vsonic ones.


----------



## EPICFAILXD

Joker, do you think i should buy the Fischer DBA-02? I'm looking for an upgrade from my FXT90, and am looking for a balanced sound, so would it be an upgrade? If not, what would you recommend as an upgrade (max $200-250) Thanks


----------



## johanchandy

Joker, which one is more speaker like out of these two, re-400 or the gr07 BE? I wan't to get an Iem for portable use when I'm away from my modded q701's.


----------



## modulor

johanchandy said:


> Joker, which one is more speaker like out of these two, re-400 or the gr07 BE? I wan't to get an Iem for portable use when I'm away from my modded q701's.


 
 Tricky question...I think it's harder to compare IEMs to speakers than full sized open headphones.  As far as soundstage goes, the GR07s will have a wider, further back presentation, so that may be more in line with your Q701 (from memory).  I feel like depth/height is presented a bit better in the RE-400 though.  Comparatively, it seems more equal in each component of soundstage (more spherical to give a visual) vs the GR07 which has more width than depth/height.


----------



## starfly

For any of you guys wondering what the differences are between the Yamaha EPH-100 and HiFiMAN RE-400, check out this thread where @modulor posts his impressions of both (and also a bit of the Vsonic GR07) when he had all of them and was able to test them.
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/704091/hifiman-re-400-or-yamaha-eph-100


----------



## johanchandy

starfly said:


> For any of you guys wondering what the differences are between the Yamaha EPH-100 and HiFiMAN RE-400, check out this thread where @modulor posts his impressions of both (and also a bit of the Vsonic GR07) when he had all of them and was able to test them.
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/704091/hifiman-re-400-or-yamaha-eph-100


 
  


modulor said:


> Tricky question...I think it's harder to compare IEMs to speakers than full sized open headphones.  As far as soundstage goes, the GR07s will have a wider, further back presentation, so that may be more in line with your Q701 (from memory).  I feel like depth/height is presented a bit better in the RE-400 though.  Comparatively, it seems more equal in each component of soundstage (more spherical to give a visual) vs the GR07 which has more width than depth/height.


 
 @ Starfly- Thanks for that link, it was very helpful.
  
 @ Modular- Thats an amazing write up! The sibilance you describe in the gr07 BE has me leaning towards the Re-400. Is the sub bass in the re-400 really that subdued? Also how well does the re-400 do vocals? Which is the more technical iem?


----------



## modulor

johanchandy said:


> @ Starfly- Thanks for that link, it was very helpful.
> 
> @ Modular- Thats an amazing write up! The sibilance you describe in the gr07 BE has me leaning towards the Re-400. Is the sub bass in the re-400 really that subdued? Also how well does the re-400 do vocals? Which is the more technical iem?


 
 Yeah, regarding sibilance in general, it may not be quite as much a bad thing for everyone, but I just so happen to find myself more sensitive and the GR07s have a tendency to emphasize on it.  I'm not saying they add it in, but in recordings (mainly poorer mastered recordings) that tend to already have it, it seems exacerbated.  I wouldn't say the sub-bass is subdued per se, but it's not emphasized in any way...just a very flat response.  It may be perceived as subdued though depending on the track...as Starfly mentioned, bass heavy tracks sound good on their own in most instances, but the mid-range has a tendency to steal the show if there is more going on there.  You'll notice this in some rock tracks for example.  So far of all the IEMs I've tried, the RE-400 is my favorite for vocals and acoustic instruments...while it's not the bulk of what I'm listening to, it's becoming more common in my rotation because of the RE-400 and HE-500 haha.  I think they're very close technically speaking, but their signatures are a bit different.  I think the GR07 is technically better in bass overall, and is one of the best out there in terms of bass quality/texturing...but the RE-400 has more favorable mids and the treble is more suitable to my tastes.


----------



## johanchandy

modulor said:


> Yeah, regarding sibilance in general, it may not be quite as much a bad thing for everyone, but I just so happen to find myself more sensitive and the GR07s have a tendency to emphasize on it.  I'm not saying they add it in, but in recordings (mainly poorer mastered recordings) that tend to already have it, it seems exacerbated.  I wouldn't say the sub-bass is subdued per se, but it's not emphasized in any way...just a very flat response.  It may be perceived as subdued though depending on the track...as Starfly mentioned, bass heavy tracks sound good on their own in most instances, but the mid-range has a tendency to steal the show if there is more going on there.  You'll notice this in some rock tracks for example.  So far of all the IEMs I've tried, the RE-400 is my favorite for vocals and acoustic instruments...while it's not the bulk of what I'm listening to, it's becoming more common in my rotation because of the RE-400 and HE-500 haha.  I think they're very close technically speaking, but their signatures are a bit different.  I think the GR07 is technically better in bass overall, and is one of the best out there in terms of bass quality/texturing...but the RE-400 has more favorable mids and the treble is more suitable to my tastes.


 
 Thank you so much. I love how descriptive your posts are. The re-400 seems to be the one I was looking for


----------



## ljokerl

marcrom said:


> Can I use my relatively expensive IEM when I workoout without damaging it badly?


 
  
Depends on many factors including type of IEM. Lots of people here use higher-end IEMs at the gym. Personally I wouldn’t – there are plenty of sub-$100 sets I can enjoy just fine without worrying (much) about them. There are additional considerations with some earphones as well, like moisture potentially being detrimental to balanced armature drivers in the long run.
  


epicfailxd said:


> Which sounds better- Dunu DN-1000 or Fischer DBA-02 MKII??


 
  
 The question to ask would be whether you want a more accurate and balanced sound or a more lively and bassy one. Despite sharing one of their drivers they sound pretty different. DN-1000 review coming soon.
  


lamboman said:


> Thanks for the reply. Read a few reviews and it seems that durability in the long run with the Flux isn't great, and I'd want to spend a little more on a quality item that lasts.
> 
> You've said in your previously that the EPH-100 is closer to the MH1C than the MA750. Is the MA750's mid-range slightly more forward than the EPH-100 and MH1C?
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 I didn’t think so – see my comment here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/rha-ma750-ma750i/#comment-2534 . I found the MA750 a little less prominent in the midrange than the MH1C relative to the bass and treble (i.e. more v-shaped).
  


telltale said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Firstly a huge thank you for everything you do. The thread is my go to resource and always open whenever I'm looking at IEMs. Also you're dedication with replying to people here and giving your advice is phenomenal so props to you.
> 
> ...


 
  
I agree with your take on the GR07 and wouldn’t recommend them for forward mids. Same goes for the MA750. The Etykids and MC5 are probably too analytical – definitely more so than the RE-400.
 
The only ones worth considering, then, are the GR06, SE215, and RE-400. Personally I don’t find the SE215 to be mid-centric because of the heavier bass. I know Shure has a reputation for strong mids but I feel it’s earned more by their higher-end models.
 
The RE-400 is mid-centric but less so because the mids are pushed forward and more because the deep bass and treble are less prominent than something like the VSD1S and GR06. I like the RE-400’s midrange presentation, but again it’s a different type of sound. I wouldn’t worry about them being fatiguing, though – usually that’s caused by excessive bass and/or treble and there’s none of that with the RE-400.
 
The GR06, of course, you’re quite familiar with. There are a few other sets with strong mids, like the RBH EP1/EP2 that I reviewed recently, but you’d be hard-pressed to find them worth the extra $ over the GR06.
  


orel said:


> Hey Joker, the AKG K323XS look interesting. You think you would have a chance to try these?


 
  
Never heard of these until now. AKG’s marketing really leaves something to be desired here in the US. The last set I got from them was the K376 which is good but not great for $100+.
  


starfly said:


> So I had already ordered the RE-400 and thought I'd return them, because from what I've been reading I figured the EPH-100 might be a bit closer to what I'm looking for than the RE-400. Just thought I'd miss out on the low end. So I sent an e-mail to the store owner and the guy calls me back within an hour and basically urges me to actually give them a listen and that I shouldn't worry about the return policy, that if I still don't like them after giving them a proper listening session I could still return them. Good guy!! He also told me to burn them in for 24 hours and try it with the included Comply tips. That's what I call great service!
> 
> So I haven't burnt them in yet for 24 hours, but they've been playing music for most of the day and I decided to give them a try just now (actually listening to them right now). So far I have to say that they sound better than I expected. The sound is a bit clinical compared to my SE530, but otherwise the bass has much more presence than I was expecting. It probably misses that last bit of sub-bass that the SE530 can offer, but the mids and highs are quite clear. Not completely sure yet if I like their somewhat forward presentation (especially the mids), it's a little bit too much in my face so far. But I like all the detail it retrieves though. Otherwise, I can tell it's a tiny driver, the SE530 just sounds a bit 'bigger', but I guess that was to be expected given that actual physical size difference.
> 
> ...


 
  
That sounds about right RE: the RE-400. I like their small double-flange tips, personally.
 
I don’t think the soundstage should appear wider compared to the SE530 but the earphone might sound a little thinner overall because you’re hearing less deep bass and possibly more treble.
 


5fteleven said:


> Hi Joker. A silly question, but out of the 309 iems do you find TDK EB900 as having the strongest bass? Also is koss spark plug (pathfinder) bassier?


 
  
It’s certainly close, but not as heavy on subbass as the HiSound Wooduo or on mid-bass as the TFTA 1V. EB900 is definitely top 5 in overall bass quantity, though.
 
I haven’t tried the spark plug.
   


reihead said:


> Thanks joker,
> What about regardless of the same SS? What would be an upgrade?


 

 
That’s an even tougher question – I guess it depends on what direction you want move in in terms of sound. The GR07 is not easy to upgrade from, as many will undoubtedly attest to. If you want smoother, more accurate sound I would consider the StageDiver2 to be an appreciable upgrade, for example, but if you want both clarity and heavy bass it would have to be something like an IE 800 from Sennheiser. Quite a few of my customs make the GR07 sound bad in comparison as well, for example the 1964 V6-Stage.
 
 


epicfailxd said:


> Joker, do you think i should buy the Fischer DBA-02? I'm looking for an upgrade from my FXT90, and am looking for a balanced sound, so would it be an upgrade? If not, what would you recommend as an upgrade (max $200-250) Thanks


 
  
 Well, it’s certainly more balanced and accurate than the FXT90, but more "analytical" as well by quite a margin. Recently I have actually found myself preferring the VSonic VC1000 to the DBA-02 mkII for sound, and it’s a little cheaper as well. For a compromise, if you're worried about the DBA-02 or VC1000 being too far in the other direction the GR07 or even RE-400 might be a nice compromise. The RE-400 especially will offer a huge contrast to the FXT90 with its mid-focused sound.
  


johanchandy said:


> Joker, which one is more speaker like out of these two, re-400 or the gr07 BE? I wan't to get an Iem for portable use when I'm away from my modded q701's.


 
  
 Assuming you just want the one with the wider/more out-of-the-head soundstage, the GR07 BE, as *modulor* said, but there are many ways in which speakers differ from IEMs.
  


starfly said:


> For any of you guys wondering what the differences are between the Yamaha EPH-100 and HiFiMAN RE-400, check out this thread where @modulor posts his impressions of both (and also a bit of the Vsonic GR07) when he had all of them and was able to test them.
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/704091/hifiman-re-400-or-yamaha-eph-100


 
  
 Great read!


----------



## vaed

Hey |joker|,
  
 Been shuffling more and more between Universals and Customs, and now I'm honed in on the Earsonics SM64's. How do you feel they match up to the 1964 V3's and V6-s? I was thinking of having an intermediary step before going full baloney on the CIEM world. 
  
 One last thing; do you believe they're a clear upgrade from something like the Brainwavz B2/DBA and GR07 BE?
  
 Thanks!


----------



## suman134

vaed said:


> Hey |joker|,
> 
> Been shuffling more and more between Universals and Customs, and now I'm honed in on the Earsonics SM64's. How do you feel they match up to the 1964 V3's and V6-s? I was thinking of having an intermediary step before going full baloney on the CIEM world.
> 
> ...


 
  
     i dont think they are a clear upgrade to dba-2 , v6 stage can be a full upgrade .


----------



## ljokerl

vaed said:


> Hey |joker|,
> 
> Been shuffling more and more between Universals and Customs, and now I'm honed in on the Earsonics SM64's. How do you feel they match up to the 1964 V3's and V6-s? I was thinking of having an intermediary step before going full baloney on the CIEM world.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Pretty close to the V3, which is held back somewhat by its heavy bass, in overall SQ. However, I wouldn't call it an upgrade from the B2 and GR07BE because of its significantly warmer, more colored sound signature. The V6-Stage makes for a much better upgrade from the B2/DBA or GR07 because it's also quite neutral, just performs better on a technical level. There's an SM64 comparison in the V6-Stage review: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/1964ears-v6-stage/


----------



## Goombi

Hey |joker|!
  
 Thanks for putting this thread together 
  
 I recently lost my Audio Technica CKS-1000's in a snowstorm and wanted a <$100 option to replace them and went with the Sony XBA-C10's and XBA-1's to try.
  
 I was wondering if you could recommend me something like the XBA-C10's. I love the soundstage, clarity, upper-mids and highs, and the tightness of the bass even though it rolls off a bit. However, I am yearning for that impact of a bit more bass.
  
 I don't want anything bass heavy, but just because of the nature of the single armature, it just feels like even though the bass is there, I'm not getting the oomph from it.
  
 Requirements: 
 y-cable
 inline mic and remote (preferably with volume controls)
 straight down (I find it gets really finnicky with glasses for over-the-ear)
 < $150 
  
 Thanks!


----------



## vaed

ljokerl said:


> Pretty close to the V3, which is held back somewhat by its heavy bass, in overall SQ. However, I wouldn't call it an upgrade from the B2 and GR07BE because of its significantly warmer, more colored sound signature. The V6-Stage makes for a much better upgrade from the B2/DBA or GR07 because it's also quite neutral, just performs better on a technical level. There's an SM64 comparison in the V6-Stage review: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/1964ears-v6-stage/


 
  
 Ahh, thanks for that!
  
 When you have a great IEM you got for $100 and there's no clear upgrade except for a mid-range CIEM... #audiophileproblems


----------



## ljokerl

goombi said:


> Hey |joker|!
> 
> Thanks for putting this thread together
> 
> ...


 
  
 I've never tried the XBA-C10 and the XBA-1 only briefly at a show. Assuming the C10 sounds like most other good sub-$100 single BAs it's going to be tough to find an upgrade that fits all of your requirements. For example the GR07, my default recommendation for an accurate-sounding earphone that's not lacking in bass, fails on two counts for you (3 if you count price). 
  
 Sets I would recommend for the type of sound you're describing with headset functionality and a cable-down fit (keep in mind I haven't heard the C10): JVC HA-FRD80 and SteelSeries Flux In-Ear. The FRD80 might be a touch too bassy but the bass quality is quite good. The Flux has very nice bass that's far from excessive but might have a little less clarity than the C10 if the C10 can run with the likes of the MEElec A161 and Ultimate Ears 600. 
  


vaed said:


> Ahh, thanks for that!
> 
> When you have a great IEM you got for $100 and there's no clear upgrade except for a mid-range CIEM... #audiophileproblems


 
  
 True that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I find it especially applicable when it comes to well-rounded IEMs like the GR07.


----------



## 991 Carrera 4S

Hi ljokerl,
  
 could you please advise a reasonable upgrade-path (from lets say $50 to $1000+) for transparent/analytical/neutral (to slightly bright) sounding (C)IEMs?
  
 Many, many thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

991 carrera 4s said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> could you please advise a reasonable upgrade-path (from lets say $50 to $1000+) for transparent/analytical/neutral (to slightly bright) sounding (C)IEMs?
> 
> Many, many thanks.


 
  
 Interesting question. I would say:
  
 $50-100: *VSonic VC02* or Etymotic Research MC5, MEElec A161P if you want to jump into BA right away
 $100-200: Etymotic HF5 or Rock-It Sounds R-50/*VSonic VC1000*/Brainwavz B2
 $200+: *Etymotic ER4S*, j-Phonic K2 SP (if you're in Japan)
 Customs: 1964EARS V6-Stage (balanced), *JHAudio JH13 Pro* (bassier), Hidition NT 6 (brighter)
  
 I bolded my personal picks at each level.


----------



## Buddhahacker

ljokerl said:


> Interesting question. I would say:
> 
> $50-100: *VSonic VC02* or Etymotic Research MC5, MEElec A161P if you want to jump into BA right away
> $100-200: Etymotic HF5 or Rock-It Sounds R-50/*VSonic VC1000*/Brainwavz B2
> ...


 
 I would also include:
 $350-600: Westone 4, Shure 535 and Noble 4
 $600-900: Noble 6 (balanced), Shure 846(bass but with incredible control)


----------



## esanthosh

991 carrera 4s said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> could you please advise a reasonable upgrade-path (from lets say $50 to $1000+) for transparent/analytical/*neutral (to slightly bright)* sounding (C)IEMs?
> 
> Many, many thanks.


 
  
  


buddhahacker said:


> I would also include:
> $350-600: Westone 4, Shure 535 and Noble 4
> $600-900: Noble 6 (balanced), Shure 846(bass but with incredible control)


 
  
 I think ljokerl did not include them because *991 Carrera 4S * mentioned 'slightly brighter'.
  
 I have only tried SE535 (both CL and LTD-J versions) and currently own the Noble 4C (not the N4) among the IEMs you mentioned. I don't think either of them fit the 'slightly brighter' description.


----------



## FajroMangxanto

Joker, 
  
 I have the VSD1S and was wondering just how much of an upgrade the Fidue A63 was over it. The way you explained it mirrors what I'm looking for: clear, good vocals (especially for females), and a bit less bass. Is it worth buying or should I get something else? I'm willing to spend up to $100, don't want the re-400 due to quality issues, and also think I want something with bass that's maybe in between the two.


----------



## ljokerl

esanthosh said:


> I think ljokerl did not include them because *991 Carrera 4S * mentioned 'slightly brighter'.
> 
> I have only tried SE535 (both CL and LTD-J versions) and currently own the Noble 4C (not the N4) among the IEMs you mentioned. I don't think either of them fit the 'slightly brighter' description.


 
  
 Yeah, I thought my other picks like the VC1000, ER4S, JH13, V6-Stage, and NT6 were a better match for "neutral-to-bright"+ analytical than the Noble 4S/SE535/W4. All good earphones though.
  


fajromangxanto said:


> Joker,
> 
> I have the VSD1S and was wondering just how much of an upgrade the Fidue A63 was over it. The way you explained it mirrors what I'm looking for: clear, good vocals (especially for females), and a bit less bass. Is it worth buying or should I get something else? I'm willing to spend up to $100, don't want the re-400 due to quality issues, and also think I want something with bass that's maybe in between the two.


 
  
 It's hard to pick a winner between them because the signatures are different. The VSD1S is more v-shaped - it has more bass and sounds warmer and more full-bodied as a result. It also has brighter, more energetic treble and sounds more sibilant as a result.  The A63 has less bass, more mids, and better midrange clarity because it lacks the midrange recession and bass emphasis of the VSonics. I should be able to say more in a few days as I'll be starting work on my final review of the Fidue sets but so far I've quite liked what I heard out of the A63.


----------



## mechgamer123

Hi Joker, sorry to keep bugging you about the V3 but since Alex said they could make me a universal 1964 V3, I am considering them again. The only thing I'm worried about is the treble being too soft for my liking. Or, more specifically, how "clear" the V3 sounds.
 For reference, I thought the GR07 Bass Edition was had good clarity and good treble, except for the slight sibilance on some tracks. I thought the DN-1000 also had good clarity, but almost sounded a bit metallic to my ears. Same with the UE900 actually, but I'm guessing they both use the same filter on their TWFK drivers since they sounded pretty similar to me.
 I also thought the RHA MA750 and DUNU DN-23, ATH-CK100, Shure SE535 and SE846 I tried were a bit too soft in the treble and lacked clarity.
  
 Do you think I would be satisfied with the clarity on the V3?


----------



## FajroMangxanto

ljokerl said:


> It's hard to pick a winner between them because the signatures are different. The VSD1S is more v-shaped - it has more bass and sounds warmer and more full-bodied as a result. It also has brighter, more energetic treble and sounds more sibilant as a result.  The A63 has less bass, more mids, and better midrange clarity because it lacks the midrange recession and bass emphasis of the VSonics. I should be able to say more in a few days as I'll be starting work on my final review of the Fidue sets but so far I've quite liked what I heard out of the A63.


 
  
 Alright, cool! I'm really thinking these may be my next buy based on how you're describing them plus the fact that Fostex priced the Te-05s out of my price range. So I can't way for more details. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

mechgamer123 said:


> Hi Joker, sorry to keep bugging you about the V3 but since Alex said they could make me a universal 1964 V3, I am considering them again. The only thing I'm worried about is the treble being too soft for my liking. Or, more specifically, how "clear" the V3 sounds.
> For reference, I thought the GR07 Bass Edition was had good clarity and good treble, except for the slight sibilance on some tracks. I thought the DN-1000 also had good clarity, but almost sounded a bit metallic to my ears. Same with the UE900 actually, but I'm guessing they both use the same filter on their TWFK drivers since they sounded pretty similar to me.
> I also thought the RHA MA750 and DUNU DN-23, ATH-CK100, Shure SE535 and SE846 I tried were a bit too soft in the treble and lacked clarity.
> 
> Do you think I would be satisfied with the clarity on the V3?


 
  
  
 The V3 doesn't lack clarity or treble presence. It's not the brightest thing out there, and it is a little smoother than the GR07 and DN-1000, but it doesn't lose out to the GR07 in clarity. It just has lots more bass that - on occasion - can take away from the overall poise and cleanliness of its sound. 
  
 I compared the V3 to the DN-1000 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/dunu-dn-1000/
 And to the UE900 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/1964ears-1964-v3/


----------



## lamboman

Just to provide some very, very brief overview of my experience of the RHA MA750, Yamaha EPH-100, and Sony MH1C. This is virtually all from memory so I can't make fantastic comparisons, but on averages they should roughly be right. Mainly used R&B and hip-hop tracks on an iPhone 5S, so for different genres recommendations may be different:
  
*RHA MA750 - Only tried for a short while, so my pair weren't broken in. Once broken in they could change, but I think that the issues I had with them would still be present after break-in. *
 Very good bass extension. Goes very deep indeed. Not enough impact for my liking, it simply wasn't aggressive enough. Mids are very recessed, and lower treble is definitely accentuated. Overall quite a different sound signature to the other two, and not one that I like (reminds me of listening to an extremely compressed MP3). Enclosure was too big for me to get a long-lasting seal. Packaging was mediocre, but the build of the IEMs themselves was brilliant. Cable was lovely, accessories included were good, though the tips are definitely a little delicate and the case is a little rubbish (the zip is a single one that comes back round at the end, so you can actually zip it up unevenly). My advice for putting tips on, gently fold the bottom flanges back.
  
*Sony MH1C*
 My "old" IEM. Bass quantity is a tad too much, often drowned out the mids. Good extension, and relatively good detail but quite slow. Difficult to say whether mids were a tad recessed or the bass took over, but very similar to the EPH-100 in this respect. More treble, and overall more balanced compared to a pair of EPH-100s with less than an hour on them (I'd expect this to change), but due to a lack of detail in comparison you almost don't get this impression. They sound rather congested, busy, and less open compared to the EPH-100s (again, with under an hour on them). Packaging is of course minimal, but at least it wasn't a pain. Accessories are basic, but again, OEM part. Flat cable is sort of tangle prone, but easily unravelled. The uneven weighting means they constantly fall out, and you can't fit them over the ear because the remote (which as you'd imagine doesn't work with iOS devices) gets in the way.
  
*Yamaha EPH-100*
 Bloody awful packaging. Horrible sharp sealed plastic packaging to hold everything together (same as stuff you get from a hardware store) as opposed to a box (so once they're open, they're not going to be repackaged). The plastic tray to get the IEMs out of also requires a bit of a pull on the cable, unless you press through the back hard. Bass impact is great, and the bass in terms of quantity is a little less than the MH1C, but it's noticeably quicker. Definitely more agility and detail at the low-end. Mids appear to have more presence than the MH1Cs; it seems that there is better balance between the mids and low-end than the MH1C. Treble right now is more recessed (again, I would have thought this will change). However, as above, there is more detail, which actually gives the impression that there is more treble than there actually is (no bad thing). Cable is tangle prone, and rather thing - we'll see how it holds up, should be fine. Overall, sounds extremely similar to the MH1C, but has more detail, is more open, and is just easier to listen to. My only issue, as they're now discontinued, if they break, I have to hunt for another pair or look elsewhere!
  
 If you really like the MH1C but want an overall upgrade, I'd strongly suggest skipping the MA750s and jumping to the EPH-100s.


----------



## danimoca

Hi,
  
 I am looking for the most *natural* sounding IEM's up to 100€. I like warm(ish), but forward mids, good treble extension and presence but non fatigating (this is very important), and non accentuated bass, but still with some good impact (not boomy at all!).  My reference are the Blox M2c (earbuds, not IEM's, I know), and I would like some IEM's that sound the closest to the Blox's. 
  
 Would the GR07 be a good choice? If not, what would be?
  
 Thanks!


----------



## suman134

danimoca said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am looking for the most *natural* sounding IEM's up to 100€. I like warm(ish), but forward mids, good treble extension and presence but non fatigating (this is very important), and non accentuated bass, but still with some good impact (not boomy at all!).  My reference are the Blox M2c (earbuds, not IEM's, I know), and I would like some IEM's that sound the closest to the Blox's.
> 
> ...


 
  
     i think you should consider re-400 , its warm , forward mids , good extension , and non accentuated bass . never heard the blox .


----------



## danimoca

suman134 said:


> i think you should consider re-400 , its warm , forward mids , good extension , and non accentuated bass . never heard the blox .


 
 ClieOS told me the Blox were *fun and dynamic*, and that the RE-400 were very diferent... Before that I was also considering the RE-400


----------



## ljokerl

Well, your description definitely sounds like the RE-400 and not the GR07. When people say "fun" they typically mean big bass and/or a v-shaped signature, and you want the opposite.


----------



## danimoca

ljokerl said:


> Well, your description definitely sounds like the RE-400 and not the GR07. When people say "fun" they typically mean big bass and/or a v-shaped signature, and you want the opposite.


 
  
 That's why I was a bit confused when he said that. I find the Blox to have a rather natural sound, not a "fun" one. 
  
 I'm just a bit scared that the RE-400's don't deliver enough in terms of soundstage...


----------



## suman134

danimoca said:


> That's why I was a bit confused when he said that. I find the Blox to have a rather natural sound, not a "fun" one.
> 
> I'm just a bit scared that the RE-400's don't deliver enough in terms of soundstage...


 
   
      then you are looking for ue-600 , its fun enough for me , forward mids , sound stage is more then avg. but its not par with re-400 and likes . may not have that bass , but its good . i love them , better then anything under $80 , anything .


----------



## ozkan

danimoca said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am looking for the most *natural* sounding IEM's up to 100€. I like warm(ish), but forward mids, good treble extension and presence but non fatigating (this is very important), and non accentuated bass, but still with some good impact (not boomy at all!).  My reference are the Blox M2c (earbuds, not IEM's, I know), and I would like some IEM's that sound the closest to the Blox's.
> 
> ...


 
 You can also consider Etymotic HF5. I haven't heard Blox MC2 though.


----------



## lolhart

I just wanted to say thank you to Joker and everyone else who posted recommendations. I decided on the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XBs in the end. Pricey but I would recommend checking them out if you're looking for a detailed IEM with a slightly v-shaped sound signature.


----------



## danimoca

ozkan said:


> You can also consider Etymotic HF5. I haven't heard Blox MC2 though.


 
  
 I may be wrong, but from what I read about Etymotic's, they really don't seem to be what I'm looking for 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I want an entertaining but balanced (pending to the warm side) sound. Something that works with pretty much all genres


----------



## eke2k6

danimoca said:


> I may be wrong, but from what I read about Etymotic's, they really don't seem to be what I'm looking for
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 That's what I read about them too...until i tried them. Honestly, the HF5 can pull out some head-shaking bass when necessary. The problem is that the fit required to do so is painful. It needs to go into the "reference plane", something that isn't easy to do. If you hit that sweet spot, the HF5 is on of the best deals in audio. You get truly awesome sound, plus nearly unbeatable isolation.
  
 Don't fully dismiss it. If you can find one cheap on the forums, get it.


----------



## chubristic

Hello all!
 It's been a while since I've been here. I've always used on-ear or over-ear headphones. This will be my first IEM I'm looking to buy. I have been using HD 25-1 ii's, ATH M50's, Denon AHD 2000's. I love them all. I'm very attached to my HD 25-1 ii's cause I DJ with them. Now I'm looking for suggestions for IEMS. I took a look at the review for the RHA MA750 and they have me convinced right now. It says it's got pretty deep bass, but not "bass head" level, which would be suitable for me. Again, I'm just taking on suggestions right now. I mainly listen to electronic (trance, house, dnb, dubstep, etc). My budget is at most $200 USD ~120£. If there is an IEM just barely over that, but is really worth it, I will consider it. It's been a while since I've been on this board, so I'll do my best to understand the technical details you guys spew at me


----------



## Francisk

Honestly I've gotten very good bass response recently by pairing my Phonak PFE022 (grey filters) with my Centrance Hifi-M8's Bass EQ turned up 1 notch and that's exactly the sound I'm looking for. For bass heads I'd recommend 2 notches up. I'm also getting fantastic sound with the same Hifi-M8 setting on my Etymotic ER4S & Fischer Audio DBA02-MkII.


----------



## ljokerl

danimoca said:


> That's why I was a bit confused when he said that. I find the Blox to have a rather natural sound, not a "fun" one.
> 
> I'm just a bit scared that the RE-400's don't deliver enough in terms of soundstage...


 
  
 Not having heard the Blox I guess we’re all just stabbing in the dark based on the description you provided. To me it sounds like an RE-400.
  


lolhart said:


> I just wanted to say thank you to Joker and everyone else who posted recommendations. I decided on the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XBs in the end. Pricey but I would recommend checking them out if you're looking for a detailed IEM with a slightly v-shaped sound signature.


 
  
 Glad you’ve found something you like!
  


chubristic said:


> Hello all!
> It's been a while since I've been here. I've always used on-ear or over-ear headphones. This will be my first IEM I'm looking to buy. I have been using HD 25-1 ii's, ATH M50's, Denon AHD 2000's. I love them all. I'm very attached to my HD 25-1 ii's cause I DJ with them. Now I'm looking for suggestions for IEMS. I took a look at the review for the RHA MA750 and they have me convinced right now. It says it's got pretty deep bass, but not "bass head" level, which would be suitable for me. Again, I'm just taking on suggestions right now. I mainly listen to electronic (trance, house, dnb, dubstep, etc). My budget is at most $200 USD ~120£. If there is an IEM just barely over that, but is really worth it, I will consider it. It's been a while since I've been on this board, so I'll do my best to understand the technical details you guys spew at me


 
  
The MA750 should have more than enough bass even coming from an HD25. You could also consider the Dunu DN-1000, which is just over your budget. Review for it here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/dunu-dn-1000/ . I'm also a fan of the Yamaha EPH-100 for EDM, which would sound more like your D2k than HD25 from what I remember of the Denons.


----------



## b0000

Greetings. I'm looking for a smooth sounding iem, that has accentuated bass (preferably in the sub bass region) but not bass heavy, mid-centric, and non super smooth treble that isnt sibilant. Basically something that sounds smooth like the lcd2's. I've narrowed it down to the sm3, um3x, and maybe the westone 4. But i'm still unsure. I also cannot find any website that carries these earphones for a decent price (probably since they've been discontinued). Anyone know any sites that ship to the usa? Thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

b0000 said:


> Greetings. I'm looking for a smooth sounding iem, that has accentuated bass (preferably in the sub bass region) but not bass heavy, mid-centric, and non super smooth treble that isnt sibilant. Basically something that sounds smooth like the lcd2's. I've narrowed it down to the sm3, um3x, and maybe the westone 4. But i'm still unsure. I also cannot find any website that carries these earphones for a decent price (probably since they've been discontinued). Anyone know any sites that ship to the usa? Thanks in advance.


 
  
 Those are all discontinued - the current-gen replacements would be the SM64 (though it sounds different from the SM3), the Westone UM Pro 30, and the Westone 40. 
  
 Here's my reply for the last time someone asked for an LCD-2-sounding IEM:
  


			
				ljokerl said:
			
		

> Normally I recommend the Shure SE535 and Sony MDR-7550. However, I now think the StageDiver SD-2 is an excellent option as well.
> 
> Keep in mind that the LCD-2 will definitely have an advantage in bass "feel" - rumble and impact and all that - because it can move lots more air. To get that from an IEM you would need a significantly bassier one, like an SD-3. Of course then you are sacrificing some of the overall balance and poise of the SD-2 (and LCD-2). Point is, you'll always get more tactile bass from an LCD-2 than an IEM with similar tuning but if you compensate with a more bass-heavy IEM you'll probably have to sacrifice other things.


----------



## ljokerl

Added Dunu DN-1000
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2A31) Dunu DN-1000*
> 
> 
> Reviewed February 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## djvkool

ljokerl said:


> Added Dunu DN-1000
> 
> 
> The overall ranking has been updated here.


 
  
 Fantastic mate - completely agree, the superb DN1K is an absolute killer of an IEM
  
 Hopefully now with your stamp of approval, more and more people will buy it


----------



## chubristic

Thank you joker, I will look into the DN-1000 more now. The wide selection of earpieces also appeals to me. Another problem with IEMs I've had in the past was that I always had a hard time finding one that fit.


----------



## soundblast75

lolhart said:


> I've briefly read some of the articles on head-fi and these sound interesting.  However, I'm a bit nervous about buying them blind at that price.  How is the isolation on the FA-4Es?
> 
> 
> I was going to give these a try, but I've read a couple of comments that the bass is somewhat lacking.




I couldnt recommend these high enough. 
Imo they beat pretty much all the iem beeing duscusssed here and I've had them nearly all.isolation and comfort are preferable to me than a custom even.


----------



## b0000

ljokerl said:


> Those are all discontinued - the current-gen replacements would be the SM64 (though it sounds different from the SM3), the Westone UM Pro 30, and the Westone 40.




Thanks for the response! Which of those three has the smoothest sound signature with the least piercing treble that's perfect for dnb with good bass lines(least important), rock, and vocals? I definitely want to give westone or earsonics a try since they have such positive feedback.


----------



## thug behram

I'm looking for a $100-200 IEM for only rap/hip-hop

 - I own a DT 770 PRO 32 ohm, but I don't want to use it for portable reasons anymore
 - Want something more bassy and fun
 - Past headphones include ATH-M50, V-Moda M100. Bass level should be around the same as the M100
 - I have a portable amp but I prefer to drive them directly from my iPod Classic
 - I ordered the Monoprice 8320 for the timebeing, should get em sometime this week


 Basically I'm looking for an IEM with the closest sound signature to the V-Moda M100, any help?


----------



## Francisk

Thanks for the excellent Dunu DN-1000 review ljokerl. I'm now very tempted to get one however being an owner of the Phonak PFE232 which is pretty much V shaped, I'm wondering how does the DN-1000 compare. Is the mid frequency of the DN-1000 as recessed as the PFE232 which was the only drawback to the otherwise excellent PFE232. I'm sure the bass of the DN-1000 is deeper than the PFE232, but is the treble region as pesky occasionally? Will the DN-1000 be a good upgrade to the PFE232? I'm anxiously awaiting your opinion before taking the plunge. Thanks in advance.


----------



## zeppu08

thug behram said:


> "Basically I'm looking for an IEM with the closest sound signature to the V-Moda M100, any help?"




Same dilemma here.. Is the DN-1000 a great choice?


----------



## thug behram

zeppu08 said:


> Same dilemma here.. Is the DN-1000 a great choice?




I'm leaning at the Yamaha eph-100 at this point.


----------



## zeppu08

thug behram said:


> I'm leaning at the Yamaha eph-100 at this point.




Have you tried auditioning it? BTW whats your source?


----------



## thug behram

zeppu08 said:


> Have you tried auditioning it? BTW whats your source?




Naw haven't auditioned any iems yet. This will be for my portable setup so iPod classic and e07k if needed.


----------



## ljokerl

djvkool said:


> Fantastic mate - completely agree, the superb DN1K is an absolute killer of an IEM
> 
> Hopefully now with your stamp of approval, more and more people will buy it


 
  
 Thanks, I’m definitely not surprised that the DN-1000 has found numerous supporters! I haven’t heard some of the other mid-range hybrid IEMs out there but for me Dunu has raised the bar with these.
  


chubristic said:


> Thank you joker, I will look into the DN-1000 more now. The wide selection of earpieces also appeals to me. Another problem with IEMs I've had in the past was that I always had a hard time finding one that fit.


 
  
 Yeah, Dunu always does a good job with this sort of thing. There’s only so many ways you can wear an earphone with this design but lack of silicone tips won’t be an issue.
  


b0000 said:


> Thanks for the response! Which of those three has the smoothest sound signature with the least piercing treble that's perfect for dnb with good bass lines(least important), rock, and vocals? I definitely want to give westone or earsonics a try since they have such positive feedback.


 
  
They’re all pretty smooth. The SM3 probably has the least treble emphasis but also tends to sound a bit thick and “creamy” for my taste. The SM64 is better in that regard but also doesn’t really make me think of the LCD-2 when I listen to it. I suppose if I had to pick just one IEM between EarSonics and Westone per your requirements I’d go for the UM Pro 30 / UM3X.
  


thug behram said:


> I'm looking for a $100-200 IEM for only rap/hip-hop
> 
> - I own a DT 770 PRO 32 ohm, but I don't want to use it for portable reasons anymore
> - Want something more bassy and fun
> ...


 
 
I haven’t tried the M100 but for IEMs with plentiful bass in that price range I would recommend:
Yamaha EPH-100 – solid, deep bass, strong and warm mids, mostly smooth treble with a rise pretty high up
RHA MA750 – similarly solid bass but with a slightly more v-shaped signature – less mids and more emphasis in the lower treble – compared to the Yamaha
Dunu DN1000 – a bit less “bassy” in the conventional sense than the two sets above but still pretty powerful. Has a v-shaped signature but with on another level in terms of clarity thanks to the hybrid design.
 
The EPH-100 is what I’ve recommended in the past for V-Moda M-80 owners and everyone who’s gotten back to me has been happy with it.
  


francisk said:


> Thanks for the excellent Dunu DN-1000 review ljokerl. I'm now very tempted to get one however being an owner of the Phonak PFE232 which is pretty much V shaped, I'm wondering how does the DN-1000 compare. Is the mid frequency of the DN-1000 as recessed as the PFE232 which was the only drawback to the otherwise excellent PFE232. I'm sure the bass of the DN-1000 is deeper than the PFE232, but is the treble region as pesky occasionally? Will the DN-1000 be a good upgrade to the PFE232? I'm anxiously awaiting your opinion before taking the plunge. Thanks in advance.


 
  
 The DN-1000 is not as mid-recessed as the PFE232. Bass is not necessarily deeper (the PFE232 already extends pretty far down) but more impactful and full-bodied. The DN-1000 does not have perfectly smooth treble but its peaks occur in a different area of the treble compared to the Phonaks, so it may work better for you in that regard, too.


----------



## acud1985

Hi...i'm searching for a iem for jazz,vocal jazz and a little bit of rock 70/80 and pop..my budget is around 250/320$.. I saw Heir 4ai..is it a Good choice? Any help please?


----------



## thug behram

ljokerl said:


> Thanks, I’m definitely not surprised that the DN-1000 has found numerous supporters! I haven’t heard some of the other mid-range hybrid IEMs out there but for me Dunu has raised the bar with these.
> 
> 
> Yeah, Dunu always does a good job with this sort of thing. There’s only so many ways you can wear an earphone with this design but lack of silicone tips won’t be an issue.
> ...




Thanks a lot for the reply Joker.

Yeah atm I am leaning towards the yamaha. How would the following compare to the ones you listed: shure se215, wooduo 2, gr07 bass edition, nuforce 700m/x.

Also do you glasses wearers should stay away from around the ear designs and stick to straight down?


----------



## chubristic

So the availability of the DN-1000's are pretty limited where I'm currently at, I'll definitely try to get them once I am back in the states. For now, I got the RHA MA750i. Was really debating that with the EPH-100. Hopefully I made the right choice. The 3-year warranty is nice. The build quality looks strong, and knowing how I am, I can use sturdy IEMs. Though I really wanted to experience the isolation on both of them, based on joker's review, the eph-100 had better isolation. But I'm sure I'll be happy with what I ordered. It actually will arrive tomorrow, I'm excited 
  
 Also, question... IEMs don't really need to be "burned in" do they? Sorry, first IEM. And if I do need to, is there a certain technique? Play pink noise and white noise through it?


----------



## Francisk

Thanks for your reply joker, I might just take the plunge based on your comparison with the Phonak PFE232.


----------



## suman134

chubristic said:


> Also, question... IEMs don't really need to be "burned in" do they? Sorry, first IEM. And if I do need to, is there a certain technique? Play pink noise and white noise through it?


 
  
     just play your music , there has not been a particular method to burn in IEMs but you can do any thing , white noise is said to be the best , and i personally use white noise with frequencies , 20hz , 30hz and so on with frequency sweeps , like a 30 sec sweep of 20hz to 30khz .


----------



## steelglam

steelglam said:


> Thanks, ljokerl.
> 
> I actually don't think I have a problem with IEMs that have thicker note presentation.  In fact, I think a big part of the reason that the HiFiMAN Re-0 spent the least time in my possession out of all the IEMs that I've tried is because of the lean presentation (also they were too bright for my taste).  The note thickness was actually one of the things that I most liked about the Vsonic GR99's; what I didn't like about them was that things seemed too veiled (not sure if that was due to too much of a bass bump or the speed of the driver).
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi ljokerl,
  
 So, I was able to get a hold of a pair of EPH-100's and have listened to them for the past several weeks, and your prediction was definitely correct that these would not be for me.  I actually find myself having a fairly strong aversion to them.  I don't think I've ever had a pair of earphones where I felt a strong need to simultaneously decrease both the bass and treble.  I also found the imaging/presentation confusing, the speed too slow, and the dynamics lacking.  And instruments sound two-dimensional to my ears (like there is some detail in the instruments that is not being transferred).  All of this added up to a very unnatural sound to my ears.  I never thought that I would say this, but I actually prefer the Vsonic GR99's to the EPH-100's even though the veiled quality of the GR99's bothers me.  In other words, at least the GR99's present a coherent soundspace, convey the energy and dynamics better, and do not cause almost instantaneous fatigue.
  
 I find myself pining for the clarity, speed, detail, imaging, dynamics, airiness, and naturalness (in terms of the timbre and realism/three-dimensionality) of the JVC HA-FXT90's.  Are there any IEM's that have all of these qualities of the JVC's but with a little more bass presence (it always seemed to me that there was some missing information in the bass region of the JVC's) and a little less aggressiveness in the upper mids/lower treble region?  I think that would get very close to what I am looking for.  Budget is $200 or below (preferably $150 and below, but I might be able to stretch it).


----------



## ljokerl

acud1985 said:


> Hi...i'm searching for a iem for jazz,vocal jazz and a little bit of rock 70/80 and pop..my budget is around 250/320$.. I saw Heir 4ai..is it a Good choice? Any help please?


 
  
Never tried the 4ai. What type of sound are you looking for? If you’re not sure, my go-to recommendation is the VSonic GR07 or GR07 Bass Edition, or the HiFiMan RE-400. I feel that these are a good place to start while not spending very much money.
 


thug behram said:


> Thanks a lot for the reply Joker.
> 
> Yeah atm I am leaning towards the yamaha. How would the following compare to the ones you listed: shure se215, wooduo 2, gr07 bass edition, nuforce 700m/x.
> 
> Also do you glasses wearers should stay away from around the ear designs and stick to straight down?


 
  
 The SE215 lacks some of the dynamics and much of the treble reach of the Yamahas. The Wooduo2 sounds quite a bit more harsh. The GR07 BE is clearer and more balanced and accurate overall, but doesn’t have as much deep bass or warmth, and tends to be a little more sibilant. The NE700X has very intrusive bass in comparison.
  


chubristic said:


> So the availability of the DN-1000's are pretty limited where I'm currently at, I'll definitely try to get them once I am back in the states. For now, I got the RHA MA750i. Was really debating that with the EPH-100. Hopefully I made the right choice. The 3-year warranty is nice. The build quality looks strong, and knowing how I am, I can use sturdy IEMs. Though I really wanted to experience the isolation on both of them, based on joker's review, the eph-100 had better isolation. But I'm sure I'll be happy with what I ordered. It actually will arrive tomorrow, I'm excited
> 
> Also, question... IEMs don't really need to be "burned in" do they? Sorry, first IEM. And if I do need to, is there a certain technique? Play pink noise and white noise through it?


 
  
 Opinions on burn-in vary pretty widely. I don't want to make any claims as to whether it makes a difference but I don't think it's necessary to dedicate any exclusive time to it - just use and enjoy. 
  


monstermunch said:


> Ooh, you bitch! Bit harsh there Jokerman - 'toy' and 'cell phone' both used in the derogatory is a bit much, I feel. Have you been spoilt by your hoard?


 
  
 That's so old I don't even remember posting it. Back then I was probably using a 1st-gen Android phone that had the sound quality and output power of a tin can.
  


steelglam said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> So, I was able to get a hold of a pair of EPH-100's and have listened to them for the past several weeks, and your prediction was definitely correct that these would not be for me.  I actually find myself having a fairly strong aversion to them.  I don't think I've ever had a pair of earphones where I felt a strong need to simultaneously decrease both the bass and treble.  I also found the imaging/presentation confusing, the speed too slow, and the dynamics lacking.  And instruments sound two-dimensional to my ears (like there is some detail in the instruments that is not being transferred).  All of this added up to a very unnatural sound to my ears.  I never thought that I would say this, but I actually prefer the Vsonic GR99's to the EPH-100's even though the veiled quality of the GR99's bothers me.  In other words, at least the GR99's present a coherent soundspace, convey the energy and dynamics better, and do not cause almost instantaneous fatigue.
> 
> I find myself pining for the clarity, speed, detail, imaging, dynamics, airiness, and naturalness (in terms of the timbre and realism/three-dimensionality) of the JVC HA-FXT90's.  Are there any IEM's that have all of these qualities of the JVC's but with a little more bass presence (it always seemed to me that there was some missing information in the bass region of the JVC's) and a little less aggressiveness in the upper mids/lower treble region?  I think that would get very close to what I am looking for.  Budget is $200 or below (preferably $150 and below, but I might be able to stretch it).


 
  
The JVC triples that are based on the FXT90? I think I mentioned them before. There are two models and I’m not sure what the differences are between them but those who have asked me to review them always say that they are a smoother version of the FXT90 with more deep bass. Not sure to what degree that’s true but they do share 2 of 3 drivers with the FXT90.


----------



## thug behram

ljokerl said:


> The SE215 lacks some of the dynamics and much of the treble reach of the Yamahas. The Wooduo2 sounds quite a bit more harsh. The GR07 BE is clearer and more balanced and accurate overall, but doesn’t have as much deep bass or warmth, and tends to be a little more sibilant. The NE700X has very intrusive bass in comparison.


 

 The reasons I'm wary about the eph-m100 is because they don't look/seem that durable. I want them to last a good 3-4 years. They also cost around $200 in Canada, unless I buy from accessory jack or ebay sellers which aren't authorized. I'm not sure if they are worth it at that price point. Especially when the SE-215 costs only $99 and seems much more durable. Ah, decisions decisions.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> The JVC triples that are based on the FXT90? I think I mentioned them before. There are two models and I’m not sure what the differences are between them but those who have asked me to review them always say that they are a smoother version of the FXT90 with more deep bass. Not sure to what degree that’s true but they do share 2 of 3 drivers with the FXT90.


 
  
 I did a search based on this suggestion.  I think you may be referring to the JVC HA-FXZ100 and HA-FXZ200.  From the reviews, they sound enticing.


----------



## Shiryu

Hi guys,
  
 I have a small question regarding IEM and having already been well advised in the portable headphones thread, I'd like to try my luck at the IEM thread.
  
 As I am currently in the US, my old stock Apple Earbuds started acting up (left side being at 50% of the volume compared to the right side).
 This made me think of getting a decent pair of IEM for everyday use as well as during sporting (jogging, etc...).
  
 The only requirement for me is to have the same ease of use as Apple earbuds/earpods which means the remote with mic is a must (I have some IEMs without and work fine, but I am a sucker for the remote).
  
 Looking at all the suggestions, the M6P seemed to come out of the lot as a good pair for the price, but a lot of people seem to say that they might have become outdated at this point. If so, which ones should I look at?
 I'm with a tight budget (+/40$) as it's something just for on the road use next to my solid ATH-WS55 headphones that I love, so any comments are welcome.
  
*TL;DR version: Require IEMs with remote+mic (3 button). Are Meelectronics M6P outdated for everyday usage on a budget of 40$ (in the US currently) or still the best bang for your buck? Will these last?*
  
 Thanks guys!


----------



## elbdogs

shiryu said:


> *TL;DR version: Require IEMs with remote+mic (3 button). Are Meelectronics M6P outdated for everyday usage on a budget of 40$ (in the US currently) or still the best bang for your buck? Will these last?*
> 
> Thanks guys!




I just got a second generation m6p for jogging. The volume control is an analog slider. Don't know if this is a negative for you. Sliding it down will turn the volume off, but sliding it up will only max the volume to whatever level your device is set to. I run with my galaxy s4 but I tested it on an iPad 2. The pause/play button works. Two presses advances the music, a long press brings up Siri. It seems to be holding up well to the sweat on my runs. How long it will last? I don't know. For a Sport phone plus accessories, it's a pretty good bargain. It's an improvement over the stock buds in terms of sound and isolation. I'm not sure I would use this as an everyday phone (needs bass) but for running yes.


----------



## RochRx7

shiryu said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> *TL;DR version: Require IEMs with remote+mic (3 button). Are Meelectronics M6P outdated for everyday usage on a budget of 40$ (in the US currently) or still the best bang for your buck? Will these last?*
> 
> Thanks guys!


 
 I'd vote for the SoundMagic E10M.. sq is much better than the M6 in that price range.


----------



## raptor18

I'm so dying waiting for ljokerl to test the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XB. I read they are an upgrade to the UE900 which scores really really high on his list!! 
 The guys on the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XB thread told me they offered him to test their set but he's really busy. I can sooo understand that =).


----------



## Shiryu

elbdogs said:


> I just got a second generation m6p for jogging. The volume control is an analog slider. Don't know if this is a negative for you. Sliding it down will turn the volume off, but sliding it up will only max the volume to whatever level your device is set to. I run with my galaxy s4 but I tested it on an iPad 2. The pause/play button works. Two presses advances the music, a long press brings up Siri. It seems to be holding up well to the sweat on my runs. How long it will last? I don't know. For a Sport phone plus accessories, it's a pretty good bargain. It's an improvement over the stock buds in terms of sound and isolation. I'm not sure I would use this as an everyday phone (needs bass) but for running yes.


 
  
 How come they wouldn't be good for an everyday phone? According to ljokerl the bass is pretty big on them too and since my main genres are Electronica, Jazz and Indie, I think they might actually do the job? Thanks though for your input!
  


rochrx7 said:


> I'd vote for the SoundMagic E10M.. sq is much better than the M6 in that price range.


 
 They seem to go for 45$ on Amazon and some comments seem to say they're not that durable. So they're just a tad more expensive I suppose than the M6P.
 Are they really worth the up in price SQ-wise?
  
 Thanks for the reply! 
  
 Still looking for any other comments or alternatives as I'm gonna decide over this weekend before ordering a set of IEMs.


----------



## elbdogs

shiryu said:


> How come they wouldn't be good for an everyday phone? According to ljokerl the bass is pretty big on them too and since my main genres are Electronica, Jazz and Indie, I think they might actually do the job? Thanks though for your input!
> 
> They seem to go for 45$ on Amazon and some comments seem to say they're not that durable. So they're just a tad more expensive I suppose than the M6P.
> Are they really worth the up in price SQ-wise?
> ...


 
  
 Let me amend my no bass comments.  It's loud enough in the bass department (intro riff to  "Billie Jean")  but just not textured enough for my tastes (I like to listen to classical and enjoy cello deep notes) .  Good luck on your search!


----------



## SyCo87

Does the VC1000 have more clarity and more upfront mid (upper-mids[ie female vocals])?


----------



## z28dreams

What do people like for their favorite IEM < $40 that meet this criteria?
  
 1.  Mids that aren't too subdued  
 2.  Punchy bass but not overwhelming (The VSonic GR02's were WAYYYY too bassy for me)
 3.  Want good isolation.  (The M9 dual flange tips were great).
  
 Of the JVC Marshmallows, Meelectronics M9P, and GR02's, I'd probably say the Meelectronics were my favorite, but the mids/vocals felt muffled in a lot of songs.
  
 Ideally I guess I'd say I want something with a very slight/shallow "V" curve, but mostly neutral.  Just enough extra pop in the bass and highs to make them sound interesting, but not overwhelming.
  
 I'm considering: 
  
 Philips 3580
 JVC HAFX40
 Brainwavz M1
 Soundmagic E10
  
 Anything else?


----------



## suman134

z28dreams said:


> What do people like for their favorite IEM < $40 that meet this criteria?
> 
> 1.  Mids that aren't too subdued
> 2.  Punchy bass but not overwhelming (The VSonic GR02's were WAYYYY too bassy for me)
> ...


 
  
    if you can take the v-shaped sound go for hafx40 , they are really nice , nice bass , a less prominent mid and close to sibilant highs , if you want mids over everything else m1 has forward mids . skip the e10 , i find them not par with fx40 .


----------



## z28dreams

suman134 said:


> if you can take the v-shaped sound go for hafx40 , they are really nice , nice bass , a less prominent mid and close to sibilant highs , if you want mids over everything else m1 has forward mids . skip the e10 , i find them not par with fx40 .


 
  
 I'm worried that the tips on the FX40's won't seal in my ears enough since they appear to just be a single small tip.  Would I be able to use the M9's dual flange tips on them?


----------



## ljokerl

steelglam said:


> I did a search based on this suggestion.  I think you may be referring to the JVC HA-FXZ100 and HA-FXZ200.  From the reviews, they sound enticing.


 
  
 Yep, those are the ones I meant!
  


shiryu said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I have a small question regarding IEM and having already been well advised in the portable headphones thread, I'd like to try my luck at the IEM thread.
> 
> ...


 
  
 elbdogs is correct - there is no 3-button M6P as far as I know, only a 1-button with volume slider. I still have at least two M6s (might still have my 1st-gen one somewhere). Use them while running and with other dangerous (for IEMs) activities. Sound-wise they are no VSD1S but for $20 I can't say I feel they are lacking anything. I've never found the bass quantity on them lacking but the fit can be a little tricky at first. I think the stock tips have improved over the years - the bi-flanges that came with my newest set actually fit me pretty well. 
  
 The E10M does sound better but may not be as durable in the long run. It has a true 3-button control though. Ditto on the Ultimate Ears 500vi - the other sub $40 3-button set I would recommend for sound quality over the M6P, but not for construction.
  
  


raptor18 said:


> I'm so dying waiting for ljokerl to test the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XB. I read they are an upgrade to the UE900 which scores really really high on his list!!
> The guys on the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XB thread told me they offered him to test their set but he's really busy. I can sooo understand that =).


 
  
 I try not to commit to anything I won't be able to finish. I had the DN1k since September or so but it took me this long to write it up 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  


syco87 said:


> Does the VC1000 have more clarity and more upfront mid (upper-mids[ie female vocals])?


 
  
 Compared to what?
  


z28dreams said:


> What do people like for their favorite IEM < $40 that meet this criteria?
> 
> 1.  Mids that aren't too subdued
> 2.  Punchy bass but not overwhelming (The VSonic GR02's were WAYYYY too bassy for me)
> ...


 
  
 The E10 or 3580 would probably be my pick for punchy but not overly mid-recessed. They have less of a v-shape than the M9. I don't find the E10 to have great isolation, though, and the other set I would recommend (the LG Quadbeat) has that issue as well. 
  
 There's the SteelSeries Flux at $50 if you can stretch your budget - good isolation and fits your other needs. It's a very shallow v-shape in response.


----------



## d marc0

Hi Joker! 
  
 I'm about to pull the trigger on the Noble 4 but I just wanna ask one more thing before I do if you don't mind.
 I love the MH1 sound signature especially now that I've EQed the bass end to match Golden Ears' target.
 I've come to realise that I actually prefer a reference/neutral signature with a slight sub bass boost.
 Do you think I'll have to use the bass boost on my JDS labs C5 for me to enjoy the Noble 4?
  
 Thanks heaps!


----------



## kova4a

d marc0 said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> I'm about to pull the trigger on the Noble 4 but I just wanna ask one more thing before I do if you don't mind.
> I love the MH1 sound signature especially now that I've EQed the bass end to match Golden Ears' target.
> ...


 
 I don't think you'll dislike the N4's low end. Now the mh1's sub-bass is boosted in comparison and thus has more rumble but the N4 is tighter, faster and hits harder next to the more thumping sony. Anyway, you can always use the bass boost on your C5 but I think you won't find it that lacking.


----------



## d marc0

kova4a said:


> I don't think you'll dislike the N4's low end. Now the mh1's sub-bass is boosted in comparison and thus has more rumble but the N4 is tighter, faster and hits harder next to the more thumping sony. Anyway, you can always use the bass boost on your C5 but I think you won't find it that lacking.




Thanks for your inputs.


----------



## Kurdt-bada

raptor18 said:


> I'm so dying waiting for ljokerl to test the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XB. I read they are an upgrade to the UE900 which scores really really high on his list!!
> The guys on the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XB thread told me they offered him to test their set but he's really busy. I can sooo understand that =).


 
 they easily outscore every phone I've heard in their price range including the overrated sony ex1000 or sm3 v2 imo


----------



## vwinter

kurdt-bada said:


> they easily outscore every phone I've heard in their price range including the overrated sony ex1000 or sm3 v2 imo




I have an EX1000 on loan right now and overrated is not a term I would use anywhere near the EX1000. It has a natural timbre that the FA-4E XB can't even touch and is more dynamic imo, and has a wider range in the way it presents notes. The FA is likely the more detailed of the two, and has a less peaky treble, but there are aspects of the EX1000 that to my ears are far ahead enough that hearing them as overrated in general and compared to the FA-4E XB is a large overstatement if anything.

The FA-4E XB (annoying name to type ) is a really really really great phone, like I've said before, and I'm sure there are people that would prefer it over the EX1000 (discontinued). I just don't think it has the EX1000 magic and I would buy the EX1000 over the FAs any day of the week PERSONALLY, and twice on Sunday.

Fwiw, I think the Fischer Amps are the safer choice, given low profile, great sound quality, equally amazing comfort, still available, no wind noise haha, but stupid generic custom cable fat plug housing.


----------



## Kurdt-bada

well I have an ex1000 (375 euros due to headfi reviews) and are gathering dust in the case since the fa 4e arrive I don't even find them closer in performance.... I can tell timbre, bass and soundstage are a bit better in the ex1000 but in any other regard the fa 4e destroy them... specially in clarity, detail and separation which I feel They are much superior and I've spent two years with the sony ex1000 8 hours per day before the fa 4e arrived lol
  
 and there is another important thing if you feed the sony ex1000 with good recordings they shine but if not.... meanwhile the fa 4e can sound good 95% of the time with any source and I also can tell I almost listen to every genre of music except classical or mainstream garbage


----------



## vwinter

I'll give you clarity and detail, but separation I'd probably not give up so quickly. Where the FA-4E layer front to back for separation, the EX1000 do it with stereo separation, left to right:

I think the FAs do things that you find more important better and that's why the EX1000 isn't getting much use. Other people would find bass, timbre, and soundstage more
Important than detail and clarity and so the situation would be reversed.

I just don't know how you can say overrated when you think the EX1000 does some things better than the FA-4E XB. That's what I was saying really.


----------



## thug behram

ljokerl said:


> [COLOR=000000]I haven’t tried the M100 but for IEMs with plentiful bass in that price range I would recommend:[/color]
> 
> 
> [COLOR=000000]Yamaha EPH-100 – solid, deep bass, strong and warm mids, mostly smooth treble with a rise pretty high up[/color]
> ...




Thanks for the help joker I ended up buying a dn-1000.


----------



## Kurdt-bada

if separation correct if I'm wrong is the quality of an iem to pic any instrument apart from the others i can't see how the sony ex1000 can compete with the other ba iems I've heard in fact to me the sony ex 1000 instrument separation is one of their important weakness, but if you are a fan of great bass quality, big soundstage and natural sound maybe the sony ex1000 are for you but i find the fa 4e not that far to the ex1000 in that regards....


----------



## zeppu08

thug behram said:


> Thanks for the help joker I ended up buying a dn-1000.


 
  
  
 Do they sound or in any way like the m100s?


----------



## thug behram

zeppu08 said:


> Do they sound or in any way like the m100s?




Oh I won't receive them for a while but ill be sure to let you know.


----------



## zeppu08

thug behram said:


> Oh I won't receive them for a while but ill be sure to let you know.


 
  
 That would be really great! I myself is searching for the closes sound sig as of the m100! Will be waiting for your feedbacks.. 
  
 Cheers!


----------



## AgentJ

Finally have money to buy the JVC FRD80s that you recommended, but I had a quick afterthought that made me wanan come here and ask if you think they're ok to get from here. I guess the chances of it being fake are low, but you know how it goes - better safe than sorry 
  
 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/JVC-HA-FRD80ZE-Micro-HD-Earphones-Carbon-Nanotubes-Diaphragm-FREE-DELIVERY-/191069462205?ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:GB:1123


----------



## ljokerl

d marc0 said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> I'm about to pull the trigger on the Noble 4 but I just wanna ask one more thing before I do if you don't mind.
> I love the MH1 sound signature especially now that I've EQed the bass end to match Golden Ears' target.
> ...


 
  
 I haven't tried the 4 but my 4S does not have enhanced subbass - it dips down a bit compared to my Hidition NT 6 (which has slightly enhanced deep bass) for example. A hardware bass boost might help because in every other way it is a fantastic earphone.
  


agentj said:


> Finally have money to buy the JVC FRD80s that you recommended, but I had a quick afterthought that made me wanan come here and ask if you think they're ok to get from here. I guess the chances of it being fake are low, but you know how it goes - better safe than sorry
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/JVC-HA-FRD80ZE-Micro-HD-Earphones-Carbon-Nanotubes-Diaphragm-FREE-DELIVERY-/191069462205?ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:GB:1123


 
  
 I honestly have no clue if they're genuine or not.


----------



## SyCo87

Sorry joker, I was asking for a comparison between the VC1000 and the DUNU1000s in upper midrange (female vocals) and soundstage.


----------



## d marc0

Thanks joker!


----------



## AgentJ

ljokerl said:


> I honestly have no clue if they're genuine or not.




Just realised that Amazon and another American eBay seller sell them for double the price as that. Which probably means that the £30 ones are gonna be fake


----------



## jekostas

agentj said:


> Just realised that Amazon and another American eBay seller sell them for double the price as that. Which probably means that the £30 ones are gonna be fake


 
  
 Some of the electronics companies around here (like, the big chain stores not little off-the-wall places) sell the FRD80s for cheaper than that on sale.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> Yep, those are the ones I meant!


 
  
 So it appears that the JVC HA-FXZ100/200 are not particularly easy to acquire. 
  
 Hence, let me try a different angle.
  
 I love the fun, big, dynamic, energetic, and smooth qualities of the VSonic GR99's.  I like wearing these at the gym a lot, for instance, as the sound really draws me in, and is not fatiguing in the least.
  
 But for more critical listening, I'd like something with a bit more detail and airiness in the mids, as well as a bit less bass bleed over to the mids.  I don't mind the highs on these actually, I just want more out of the mids.  I like their warm quality, and I think the bass presence provides a good foundation for the sound.  I think the placement of things in the soundstage sounds right to my ears as well.  I just want less bass bleed over to the mids; a little more detail and clarity on things like electric guitars so that they have a bit more bite, crunch, and three-dimensionality; and a little less veil over the vocals (but not too much, just a slightly less amount...vocals seem to be the thing that I am most sensitive to these days in terms of peaks).
  
 Any thoughts on something that might work?


----------



## sbose

hi *joker*
 when will you add FIDUE A63 to your list of review ?
 from our last conversion it seems that a63 is best option for me so i am waiting for some final words from you.


----------



## ljokerl

syco87 said:


> Sorry joker, I was asking for a comparison between the VC1000 and the DUNU1000s in upper midrange (female vocals) and soundstage.


 
  
 The VC1000 has a more level sound signature with no midrange recession. Discounting the significantly more powerful bass of the Dunu set their performance is similar except that the VC1000 sounds a little smoother to me through the upper midrange and treble. Soundstaging likewise is similar but the VC1000 is never hindered by prominent bass, which affords it slightly better imaging in my experience. 
  


steelglam said:


> So it appears that the JVC HA-FXZ100/200 are not particularly easy to acquire.
> 
> Hence, let me try a different angle.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, I don't have any more recommendations for this.
  


sbose said:


> hi *joker*
> when will you add FIDUE A63 to your list of review ?
> from our last conversion it seems that a63 is best option for me so i am waiting for some final words from you.


 
  
 Should be one of the next ones up. Currently working on the HiSound BA100.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> Sorry, I don't have any more recommendations for this.


 
  
 OK, thanks.  I really appreciate all of the help, and the resource that you have provided.  It's been extremely valuable.  Things used to be easier on my ears in general, but as I've gotten older, I've become more sensitive to certain things.  It's been frustrating.  The trick for me is finding a balance between warmth and bass presence in the low end; detail, clarity, and dynamics in the midrange; and smoothness in the high end.  It's tough!
  
 I mentioned the Vsonic GR99's because I think they deliver what I'm looking for in the low and high end, so I was wondering if maybe one of the more expensive Vsonic's got the midrange right as well.
  
 I see a lot of mention of the HiFiMan RE-400's around here, and you give them a good review.  I was thinking of trying those as well.


----------



## nati8056

ljokerl said:


> The VC1000 has a more level sound signature with no midrange recession. Discounting the significantly more powerful bass of the Dunu set their performance is similar except that the VC1000 sounds a little smoother to me through the upper midrange and treble. Soundstaging likewise is similar but the VC1000 is never hindered by prominent bass, which affords it slightly better imaging in my experience.
> 
> 
> Sorry, I don't have any more recommendations for this.
> ...




Joker So if I understand you correctly the dunu not recommended for purchase by your opinion ,Whether the vc1000 sound better than dunu and cheaper.


----------



## goodvibes

Not at all what he said. It depends on if you like something with a bit extra or less bass that than what may be considered the perfect amount and even that's individually subjective. It doesn't matter if a cheaper thing is at qualitatively the same level if it's quantitative nature doesn't agree with you.


----------



## Shiryu

ljokerl said:


> elbdogs is correct - there is no 3-button M6P as far as I know, only a 1-button with volume slider. I still have at least two M6s (might still have my 1st-gen one somewhere). Use them while running and with other dangerous (for IEMs) activities. Sound-wise they are no VSD1S but for $20 I can't say I feel they are lacking anything. I've never found the bass quantity on them lacking but the fit can be a little tricky at first. I think the stock tips have improved over the years - the bi-flanges that came with my newest set actually fit me pretty well.
> 
> The E10M does sound better but may not be as durable in the long run. It has a true 3-button control though. Ditto on the Ultimate Ears 500vi - the other sub $40 3-button set I would recommend for sound quality over the M6P, but not for construction.


 
 Thanks! I went with the M6P eventually as I would be using them right now for working out and such and if I require good IEMs for other use, I'll stretch my budget and get something that has even better quality than both E10M and M6P when I'll be back in Europe. Might aswell take the opportunity to order Meelectronics as I'm in the States right now!
  
 I'll hopefully be happy with them even as I use them daily on commutes as such, we'll see! They'll probably be a (big?) improvement over the stock Apple Earbuds I was using daily.


----------



## z28dreams

ljokerl said:


> The E10 or 3580 would probably be my pick for punchy but not overly mid-recessed. They have less of a v-shape than the M9. I don't find the E10 to have great isolation, though, and the other set I would recommend (the LG Quadbeat) has that issue as well.
> 
> There's the SteelSeries Flux at $50 if you can stretch your budget - good isolation and fits your other needs. It's a very shallow v-shape in response.


 
  
 Do you think if I used the Meelectronics flange tips on the E10 I would achieve good isolation?
  
 Also, thoughts on the E10 vs. the Brainwavz M1?


----------



## za51

Hello Joker,
  
 I've heard great things about the RHA MA-750i. But I read a few reviews that say it doesn't handle classical or jazz well. Any thoughts on this? If so, what do you recommend around that price?
  
 Thanks!


----------



## Lukalop

Post Removed


----------



## Shinystar325

Thanks for broadening my horizon.


----------



## ljokerl

steelglam said:


> OK, thanks.  I really appreciate all of the help, and the resource that you have provided.  It's been extremely valuable.  Things used to be easier on my ears in general, but as I've gotten older, I've become more sensitive to certain things.  It's been frustrating.  The trick for me is finding a balance between warmth and bass presence in the low end; detail, clarity, and dynamics in the midrange; and smoothness in the high end.  It's tough!
> 
> I mentioned the Vsonic GR99's because I think they deliver what I'm looking for in the low and high end, so I was wondering if maybe one of the more expensive Vsonic's got the midrange right as well.
> 
> I see a lot of mention of the HiFiMan RE-400's around here, and you give them a good review.  I was thinking of trying those as well.


 
  
 The GR99 is very unique in VSonic's lineup - the darkest of the bunch with rather full-bodied sound. I don't think you want to look at VSonic for another GR99-like earphone.
  
  


goodvibes said:


> Not at all what he said. It depends on if you like something with a bit extra or less bass that than what may be considered the perfect amount and even that's individually subjective. It doesn't matter if a cheaper thing is at qualitatively the same level if it's quantitative nature doesn't agree with you.


 
  
 That's correct. Thanks for interpreting 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


shiryu said:


> Thanks! I went with the M6P eventually as I would be using them right now for working out and such and if I require good IEMs for other use, I'll stretch my budget and get something that has even better quality than both E10M and M6P when I'll be back in Europe. Might aswell take the opportunity to order Meelectronics as I'm in the States right now!
> 
> I'll hopefully be happy with them even as I use them daily on commutes as such, we'll see! They'll probably be a (big?) improvement over the stock Apple Earbuds I was using daily.


 
  
 If you have the old Apple earbuds it should be an improvement. Apple earpods, probably not so much. 
  


z28dreams said:


> Do you think if I used the Meelectronics flange tips on the E10 I would achieve good isolation?
> 
> Also, thoughts on the E10 vs. the Brainwavz M1?


 
  
 The M1 is more mid-centric, rolling off the bass compared to the E10 and having less treble energy as well. 
  


za51 said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> I've heard great things about the RHA MA-750i. But I read a few reviews that say it doesn't handle classical or jazz well. Any thoughts on this? If so, what do you recommend around that price?
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 I personally would want a more balanced-sounding earphone for those genres, or at least on with a little more midrange relative to the bass. Not a lot of options for that while still maintaining enhanced bass, though.


----------



## za51

> I personally would want a more balanced-sounding earphone for those genres, or at least on with a little more midrange relative to the bass. Not a lot of options for that while still maintaining enhanced bass, though.


 
  
 Thanks so much for your response! Do you have any suggestions around the price range of the MA-750i? Or do I have to go above $200?


----------



## Shiryu

ljokerl said:


> If you have the old Apple earbuds it should be an improvement. Apple earpods, probably not so much.


 
  
 Is that so? I have had both and felt the Earpods were obviously better than the earbuds. But it's the earbuds that gave up on me recently.
  
 Problem with the Earpods is that they've given up on me after ~1year of usage. Got them replaced but I really don't look forward to heavy usage of them, so the M6P should fit perfectly in that category! 
  
 Are you sure that Earpods and M6P have similar "qualities"? If you had to choose, which one would it be? It might be a bit of a dragged along question but I feel like it could be interesting to hear what a succesful reviewer thinks about it.


----------



## vaed

Hey |joker|,
  
 Would you categorize the SM64 and DUNU DN1K to be *approximately* the same sound signature? A certain website has the DN1k at $160USD, and the SM64's fun, bassy and energetic signature seems enticing, but it seems that the DN1K might be a better value.
  
 One thing that struck me in your SM64 review is that you said that it gets your "toes tapping" more than most earphones. I guess I'm trying to gauge that feeling you had against how you felt with the DN1K. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Thanks!


----------



## Amitl

is this review biased..?
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/705687/review-of-audio-technica-ath-im01-ath-im02-ath-im03-ath-im04-ath-im50-ath-im70


----------



## AndyQ

Hi Joker,
 your Multi-IEM review is really impressive and has helped me a lot choosing IEMs!
 Now I am on the hunt for new IEMs, till now I have owned the ie8, triple.fi v10 and ue900. I loved them all but I always missed some things in each of them.
 For me my ideal IEM (out of what I have heard) would have the treble of the ie8, the bass and sound stage of the triple.fi v10 and the midrange and detail of the ue900.
 I would be willing to go upwards of the 500$ mark if there is something that really matches this profile but prefer to stay under it.
 Out of the reviews I have read I think Westone 3 is the one that comes closer, is this correct? Do you have any recommendations?
 Thanks a lot!


----------



## tan1415

Joker:any chance of a custom one pro review? Essentially like your view on the sound and the impact of the tuning possibilities


----------



## johanchandy

ljokerl said:


> Assuming you just want the one with the wider/more out-of-the-head soundstage, the GR07 BE, as *modulor* said, but there are many ways in which speakers differ from IEMs.


 
 I was considering the GR07 BE but reading about the sibilance has scared me off but I could get it for a good price here(140 CAD). I am still torn, I am really interested in the re-400 after reading *modular's *recommendation. I would like your recommendation as well._ _I am looking for an iem with upfront vocals and highs that sparkle. I also prefer a thinner sound. Where the bass is concerned I greatly prefer quality and speed over quantity. Looking for the most detail for the price. Basically something close to neutral but with pronounced vocals. I hope you could recommend something within the 100-200$ range for me. The options I'm looking at are the HF5, re-400, gr07BE, vc1000 and the dunu DN-1000(Please add anything you feel would better suit my tastes). I also here the se215's are good if the cable is replaced by a Fiio one.
  
 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

za51 said:


> Thanks so much for your response! Do you have any suggestions around the price range of the MA-750i? Or do I have to go above $200?


 
  
 Are you willing to give up the enhanced bass? If so something like the RE-400 will do those genres pretty well. If not, maybe a GR07 Bass Edition.
  


shiryu said:


> Is that so? I have had both and felt the Earpods were obviously better than the earbuds. But it's the earbuds that gave up on me recently.
> 
> Problem with the Earpods is that they've given up on me after ~1year of usage. Got them replaced but I really don't look forward to heavy usage of them, so the M6P should fit perfectly in that category!
> 
> Are you sure that Earpods and M6P have similar "qualities"? If you had to choose, which one would it be? It might be a bit of a dragged along question but I feel like it could be interesting to hear what a succesful reviewer thinks about it.


 
  
 I didn't say that the M6P and Earpods sound similar, only that the M6P is not really an upgrade from the Earpods in sound quality. The M6 has a bassier, more v-shaped sound while the Earpods are pretty balanced, with a little too much upper midrange and rolled-off deep bass. 
  


vaed said:


> Hey |joker|,
> 
> Would you categorize the SM64 and DUNU DN1K to be *approximately* the same sound signature? A certain website has the DN1k at $160USD, and the SM64's fun, bassy and energetic signature seems enticing, but it seems that the DN1K might be a better value.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Wouldn't say they have a similar sound signature. They are certainly very different tonally - the SM64 warmer and darker by a margin. The DN1k has a little more bass impact, along with more treble energy, and definitely gets your toes tapping, but in a slightly different way.
  


andyq said:


> Hi Joker,
> your Multi-IEM review is really impressive and has helped me a lot choosing IEMs!
> Now I am on the hunt for new IEMs, till now I have owned the ie8, triple.fi v10 and ue900. I loved them all but I always missed some things in each of them.
> For me my ideal IEM (out of what I have heard) would have the treble of the ie8, the bass and sound stage of the triple.fi v10 and the midrange and detail of the ue900.
> ...


 
  
 The W3 has more mid-bass than the TF10 and more treble energy/less smoothness than the IE8. It's definitely not an earphone I'd have thought of given your requirements but then I don't really have a better suggestion.
  


tan1415 said:


> Joker:any chance of a custom one pro review? Essentially like your view on the sound and the impact of the tuning possibilities


 
  
 Replied in the portable headphone thread.


----------



## xEcuToR

Great review as always, have bought a couple of IEMs myself based on your reviews e.g Monoprice 8320 and Rockitsound R50. But I was wondering when are you going to add the Ocharaku line up to your list of reviews, you should at least do the Kaede and Kuro. 
  
 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

johanchandy said:


> I was considering the GR07 BE but reading about the sibilance has scared me off but I could get it for a good price here(140 CAD). I am still torn, I am really interested in the re-400 after reading *modular's *recommendation. I would like your recommendation as well._ _I am looking for an iem with upfront vocals and highs that sparkle. I also prefer a thinner sound. Where the bass is concerned I greatly prefer quality and speed over quantity. Looking for the most detail for the price. Basically something close to neutral but with pronounced vocals. I hope you could recommend something within the 100-200$ range for me. The options I'm looking at are the HF5, re-400, gr07BE, vc1000 and the dunu DN-1000(Please add anything you feel would better suit my tastes). I also here the se215's are good if the cable is replaced by a Fiio one.
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 Missed this post. I wouldn't pick the GR07BE for pronounced vocals or the SE215 for highs that sparkle (far from it). The DN-1000 isn't particularly neutral, either. The rest are all extremely solid options for neutral, detailed earphones with good mids and highs and controlled bass. The RE-400 is a little warmer and more full-bodied than the other two but doesn't have the treble sparkle of the VC1000 especially.  The VC1000 is a little more sparkly but IMO sounds very good and has surprisingly tame treble overall for what it is. 
  


xecutor said:


> Great review as always, have bought a couple of IEMs myself based on your reviews e.g Monoprice 8320 and Rockitsound R50. But I was wondering when are you going to add the Ocharaku line up to your list of reviews, you should at least do the Kaede and Kuro.
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 I have the Kuro (at least I think that's what it is) in the queue, but still a ways off from a full review. Will try to get some short impressions up soon.


----------



## OnlinePredator

The sound in the left ear of my Vsonic GR06 have stopped working(took more than a year for that to happen, which is a record), so I'm looking for a replacement/upgrade.
  
 Having had them for more than a year, I'm pretty sure I'm not an audiophile, as I still have no idea what any of the sound signatures(highs, mids, lows, balanced, warm and sweet, neutral, v-shaped etc.) mean, even after reading on it. I'm using the IEMs that came with my Galaxy S3(maybe you can review them as well) while I wait, and I don't think the GR06 sounds all that "better". I remember that was also my first impression of the GR06, I had been using earbuds(like the older Apple ones) before it, and I didn't really notice that much of a difference in sound quality. So am I not an audiophile, or were they not supposed to sound all that different, or am I deaf?
  
 One thing I DID like/notice about the GR06 was the isolation, which I liked, but sometimes still isn't enough. Since it got a 3.5/5, I'm looking for 4+/5.
  
 http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/?model_search=&headphone_price1=&headphone_price2=200&average_rating1=0&average_rating2=10&sound_rating1=0&sound_rating2=10&build_rating1=0&build_rating2=5&isolation_rating1=4&isolation_rating2=5&comfort_rating1=0&comfort_rating2=5&microphone_rating1=0&microphone_rating2=5&accessibility_rating1=0&accessibility_rating2=5
  
 With a budget of $200(although I'd obviously prefer to spend less), what do you recommend? To me, I'm leaning towards the RE-400. How does it compare to the GR06? Would you say it's a worthy upgrade?
  
 Also, a lot of your reviews aren't appearing on the first page, like GR06 and some of 2C, all of 1A, most of 1B.
  
 On a side note, I've been here since early 2011, and the TF10s have been in the "Upcoming Reviews" the entire time. But I guess people have lost interest since it's been discontinued and replaced by the UE 900s.


----------



## ozkan

onlinepredator said:


> The sound in the left ear of my Vsonic GR06 have stopped working(took more than a year for that to happen, which is a record), so I'm looking for a replacement/upgrade.
> 
> Having had them for more than a year, I'm pretty sure I'm not an audiophile, as I still have no idea what any of the sound signatures(highs, mids, lows, balanced, warm and sweet, neutral, v-shaped etc.) mean, even after reading on it. I'm using the IEMs that came with my Galaxy S3(maybe you can review them as well) while I wait, and I don't think the GR06 sounds all that "better". I remember that was also my first impression of the GR06, I had been using earbuds(like the older Apple ones) before it, and I didn't really notice that much of a difference in sound quality. So am I not an audiophile, or were they not supposed to sound all that different, or am I deaf?
> 
> ...


 
  
 If isolation is your priority then I can suggest Etymotic HF5 or Steelseries Flux which costs half the price of HF5s.
  
 http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/steelseries-flux-in-ear/


----------



## johanchandy

ljokerl said:


> Missed this post. I wouldn't pick the GR07BE for pronounced vocals or the SE215 for highs that sparkle (far from it). The DN-1000 isn't particularly neutral, either. The rest are all extremely solid options for neutral, detailed earphones with good mids and highs and controlled bass. The RE-400 is a little warmer and more full-bodied than the other two but doesn't have the treble sparkle of the VC1000 especially.  The VC1000 is a little more sparkly but IMO sounds very good and has surprisingly tame treble overall for what it is.


 
 This really narrows it down for me. A local store has the re-400 and hf5 for demo so I'm going to give them a listen after work. If I don't like them(I'm pretty sure I would though) I'll order the vc1000 off of ebay.
  
 Thanks again!


----------



## b0000

What are some good sites to buy earsonics from the USA? It seems like its overpriced directly from the earsonics website since it's in euros. I'm specifically looking at the sm64. What price should i expect to pay for them? The review says 399, but i cant find any at that price. Theyre all 499+


----------



## eccom

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!



Quote: 





onlinepredator said:


> The sound in the left ear of my Vsonic GR06 have stopped working(took more than a year for that to happen, which is a record), so I'm looking for a replacement/upgrade.
> 
> Having had them for more than a year, I'm pretty sure I'm not an audiophile, as I still have no idea what any of the sound signatures(highs, mids, lows, balanced, warm and sweet, neutral, v-shaped etc.) mean, even after reading on it. I'm using the IEMs that came with my Galaxy S3(maybe you can review them as well) while I wait, and I don't think the GR06 sounds all that "better". I remember that was also my first impression of the GR06, I had been using earbuds(like the older Apple ones) before it, and I didn't really notice that much of a difference in sound quality. So am I not an audiophile, or were they not supposed to sound all that different, or am I deaf?
> 
> ...


  


 The RE-400 is a clear step up in sound, though it feels more fragile. My Re-400 for example split down the middle of the earpiece and I had to glue it together again. For isolation the Re-400 is not even close to the etys with a deep fir on tri-flanges, the difference in isolation for me is large, in favour of the etys.


----------



## Rivalo

Hey, yesterday I bought the SteelSeries Flux In-ear (non-pro) after reading the review here. After some extensive listening I think I will return them.
 Coming from a stolen and discontinued Sennheiser model (CX870) the Sound quality is great. But I do not like the comfort.
 These buds only rely on suction/isolation: That means if I won't keep jamming my left piece into my ear canal it falls out. My older IEMs won't do this.
 I blame this on the microphone/button-combination hanging from your left-ear making the cable heavier (this really sucks) and on my seemingly different left ear canal.
 Also the 3-pole connector won't work on all devices. Maybe only phones support these connectors. But the Electronic Engineer who designed my abandoned Creative Zen wasn't prepared for this abomination of a connector. It won't even play music 
  
 Image for better explanation: 
 http://i.imgur.com/kkHdEgv.png
  
 So I'm thinking about a more expensive IEM: the Shure SE215. It's big, it will probably stay in my ears. And to wear this over-ear you won't have to turn your flimsy IEMs awkwardly upwards. 
 Now my question is how the sound quality matches up?
 The Flux = *(**8.2/10 Sound)* v.s The Shure* (**7.9/10 Sound)*
 And because the Shure is 2x the price of the Flux: are these scores given with also taking the price in account? It seems weird to me that a respectable audio company like Shure makes soundquality-wise worse IEMs than a Gamer peripheral companies first IEM.


----------



## lin0003

The SE215's sound quality is quite bad for the price IMO. It has awesome isolation though. 
  
 and Joker, if you get the chance do try out the Astrotec AX35. They sound awesome and are only around $80. I think they are better than the MA750 and DN-900 overall.


----------



## ljokerl

onlinepredator said:


> The sound in the left ear of my Vsonic GR06 have stopped working(took more than a year for that to happen, which is a record), so I'm looking for a replacement/upgrade.
> 
> Having had them for more than a year, I'm pretty sure I'm not an audiophile, as I still have no idea what any of the sound signatures(highs, mids, lows, balanced, warm and sweet, neutral, v-shaped etc.) mean, even after reading on it. I'm using the IEMs that came with my Galaxy S3(maybe you can review them as well) while I wait, and I don't think the GR06 sounds all that "better". I remember that was also my first impression of the GR06, I had been using earbuds(like the older Apple ones) before it, and I didn't really notice that much of a difference in sound quality. So am I not an audiophile, or were they not supposed to sound all that different, or am I deaf?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hmm... not sure what's going on there with the reviews not showing up. Good thing there's the offsite backup.
  
 The RE-400 might not have enough bass coming from the GR06 but otherwise is definitely better - clearer and more balanced, with more natural tone and less congestion. Not the option I would pick if you aren't noticing the difference between the GR06 and stock buds as it's an accuracy-oriented earphone. You might actually enjoy a bassier set - at the very least you'll definitely notice a difference between that and the Apple stock buds. The Klipsch X10 and Yamaha EPH-100 would be two I would recommend for the safe (bassy/warm) sound signature with great isolation and under $150. 
  
  
  


johanchandy said:


> This really narrows it down for me. A local store has the re-400 and hf5 for demo so I'm going to give them a listen after work. If I don't like them(I'm pretty sure I would though) I'll order the vc1000 off of ebay.
> 
> Thanks again!


 
  
 Always a good idea to demo stuff. Etys can be tough to get a seal with if you're not used to them - hopefully they'll provide you with some deep-sealing tips to demo them,
  


b0000 said:


> What are some good sites to buy earsonics from the USA? It seems like its overpriced directly from the earsonics website since it's in euros. I'm specifically looking at the sm64. What price should i expect to pay for them? The review says 399, but i cant find any at that price. Theyre all 499+


 
  
 Earphone solutions used to carry them at $399 but they seem to be gone now. The prices from EarSonics' website probably includes VAT (unless they have two sets of prices listed) which you wouldn't need to pay if you're in the US. Might want to shoot them an email to see what they have to say about that.
  


rivalo said:


> Hey, yesterday I bought the SteelSeries Flux In-ear (non-pro) after reading the review here. After some extensive listening I think I will return them.
> Coming from a stolen and discontinued Sennheiser model (CX870) the Sound quality is great. But I do not like the comfort.
> These buds only rely on suction/isolation: That means if I won't keep jamming my left piece into my ear canal it falls out. My older IEMs won't do this.
> I blame this on the microphone/button-combination hanging from your left-ear making the cable heavier (this really sucks) and on my seemingly different left ear canal.
> ...


 
  
 Sound scores are not weighted by price. The Flux sounds better to me, mostly having better treble energy and extension. It's a small difference, though.
  
 A couple of people have reported that the stock Flux tips gave them problems but the issue was resolved either with Comply foam or the Klipsch Oval Gel tips. Won't solve the issue with the connector, though - you'd need a TRRS adapter for that.


----------



## quartertone

I use the Flux with Sony hybrid tips, does the trick.


----------



## esteebin

quartertone said:


> I use the Flux with Sony hybrid tips, does the trick.



+1 I use medium (green base) and love it.
Seals better than stock tips. The stock large was too big and uncomfortable and the medium was too small and would easily slide off.


----------



## ljokerl

qyrus said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> First off I'd like to thank you for this thread. It's been a great help when I was shopping for IEM's (decided on the GR07BE's). With your recent review of the DN-1000 I'm wondering if you'd consider the Dunu's to be a big upgrade on the GR's?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Not a big upgrade, no, but a good alternative with a slightly different signature. There's a full GR07 BE - DN1k comparison in the review: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/dunu-dn-1000/


----------



## Mdraluck23

Deciding between B2's, VC1000's (~125) and a used pair of ER4S (~190) or similar. Anybody have thoughts? Comfort is huge, and I like to wear over ear... Not mandatory though. I had R-50's and want something similar, but a little smoother, just a touch. (maybe a slight bass quantity bump just a liiittleeeeee)


----------



## Endcode

mdraluck23 said:


> Deciding between B2's, VC1000's (~125) and a used pair of ER4S (~190) or similar. Anybody have thoughts? Comfort is huge, and I like to wear over ear... Not mandatory though. I had R-50's and want something similar, but a little smoother, just a touch. (maybe a slight bass quantity bump just a liiittleeeeee)


 
 I think the DBA-02 MKII would be worth looking into also


----------



## Mdraluck23

endcode said:


> I think the DBA-02 MKII would be worth looking into also


 
 As I understand the B2 is remarkably similar but at a different price?


----------



## Endcode

mdraluck23 said:


> As I understand the B2 is remarkably similar but at a different price?


 
  
 I only own the B2 so all I can do is speculate. The B2s, R-50, and MK II all use TWFK drivers, so keep that in mind too.


----------



## kova4a

mdraluck23 said:


> Deciding between B2's, VC1000's (~125) and a used pair of ER4S (~190) or similar. Anybody have thoughts? Comfort is huge, and I like to wear over ear... Not mandatory though. I had R-50's and want something similar, but a little smoother, just a touch. (maybe a slight bass quantity bump just a liiittleeeeee)


 
 I would go for the er4s coz for me it sounds better than any twfk-based iem I've tried. It does require deep insertion, so depending on your ears that can affect the comfort but something like the B2 with it's too angled nozzle is more uncomfortable IMO. The VC1000 and dba02 mk2 will probably be your best bet comfort-wise. As far as the sound, the dba02 mk2 and VC1000 should fit your requirements for slightly smoother and bassier sound than R50 coz neither the B2 nor er4s are more forgiving or have more bass than r-50


----------



## Mdraluck23

endcode said:


> I only own the B2 so all I can do is speculate. The B2s, R-50, and MK II all use TWFK drivers, so keep that in mind too.


 
 I know, and I like it, just looking for a different tuning I think.


----------



## MoonYeol

mdraluck23 said:


> endcode said:
> 
> 
> > I only own the B2 so all I can do is speculate. The B2s, R-50, and MK II all use TWFK drivers, so keep that in mind too.
> ...




Have you tried using an impedance adapter? Anything between 25-100 Ohms seems to work. Will give you slightly different results. Also try tip rolling a bit as R-50 stock tips are kind of a pain. I really enjoyed comply Ts-series with the R-50. I kind of miss them.


----------



## Mdraluck23

moonyeol said:


> Have you tried using an impedance adapter? Anything between 25-100 Ohms seems to work. Will give you slightly different results. Also try tip rolling a bit as R-50 stock tips are kind of a pain. I really enjoyed comply Ts-series with the R-50. I kind of miss them.


 
 That's exactly what I used. I never did use an adapter, but I did use them with my C&C BH2. Where can I acquire an impedance adapter? It's also worth noting that my R-50's look like this:
  
 At the moment. Got washered and Dryered. Never done that before, it was a bad move.
  
 I liked the R-50's a lot, but again, that harshness was there, I want something a little smoother and weightier. I don't want to lose out on accuracy/technical proficiency though.


----------



## bms44974

@ljokerl: I don't know how you keep up! With the number of times I have referred new users to this thread, perhaps it should be required reading for joining


----------



## vaed

Edit: nevermind.


----------



## PotatoEars

joker, have you tried the ckm500 little sibling, the ckm300? I'm wondering because you did review the 500 before didnt you?


----------



## awtryau89

Joker,
 I recently purchased the MA750s. While I think I have really found a good sounding set of IEMs for the money, they kill my ears. For some reason they end up resting on my lower lobe and just become painful. I wear mine on longer flights so they have to be comfortable. So now, I am looking for something with a similar sound signature. If I had to be picky, the 750s are a touch thicker than I like in the lower mids and I could stand for a touch more detail in the upper registers. I do like the sub bass though. Not a bass head but there is something about the elevation in this region that I really like. What would you recommend I look towards in the same price range. I'll figure out the comfort issue on my own. I just want sound recommendations.


----------



## Lukalop

What are IEMs like for gaming?


----------



## 991 Carrera 4S

ljokerl said:


> Interesting question. I would say:
> 
> $50-100: *VSonic VC02* or Etymotic Research MC5, MEElec A161P if you want to jump into BA right away
> $100-200: Etymotic HF5 or Rock-It Sounds R-50/*VSonic VC1000*/Brainwavz B2
> ...


 

 Big thanks. 
  
 What about Logitech UE700 and Fischer DBA-02 mkII, regarding their sound signature?


----------



## ozkan

awtryau89 said:


> Joker,
> I recently purchased the MA750s. While I think I have really found a good sounding set of IEMs for the money, they kill my ears. For some reason they end up resting on my lower lobe and just become painful. I wear mine on longer flights so they have to be comfortable. So now, I am looking for something with a similar sound signature. If I had to be picky, the 750s are a touch thicker than I like in the lower mids and I could stand for a touch more detail in the upper registers. I do like the sub bass though. Not a bass head but there is something about the elevation in this region that I really like. What would you recommend I look towards in the same price range. I'll figure out the comfort issue on my own. I just want sound recommendations.


 
  
 PFEs with grey filters might be a good choice for your criteria if you have a powerful source like X3.


----------



## Francisk

+1 ozkan... Phonak PFE012 with grey filters sounds amazing. Very hard to beat at that price.


----------



## ljokerl

mdraluck23 said:


> Deciding between B2's, VC1000's (~125) and a used pair of ER4S (~190) or similar. Anybody have thoughts? Comfort is huge, and I like to wear over ear... Not mandatory though. I had R-50's and want something similar, but a little smoother, just a touch. (maybe a slight bass quantity bump just a liiittleeeeee)


 
  
 GR01 might be a better option than the VC1000 for you - it's even less bright. Otherwise the VC1000 is currently my favorite of the TWFKs and of course the ER4S is a long-time favorite. It doesn't have harshness but it also doesn't really sound weightier than the R-50 the way the GR01 does.
  
 I've never really gotten good at wearing the Etys over the ear. The VC1000/GR01 can be a bit of a challenge too as they are pretty long but with a makeshift cable cinch I've managed to do so just fine - better than with the ER4S. ER4PT might be better at this since it has a softer twisted cable. 
  
  


bms44974 said:


> @ljokerl: *I don'**t know how you keep up!* With the number of times I have referred new users to this thread, perhaps it should be required reading for joining


 
  
 It's an uphill battle 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


potatoears said:


> joker, have you tried the ckm500 little sibling, the ckm300? I'm wondering because you did review the 500 before didnt you?


 
  
 I did review the CKM500 but haven't tried the CKM300.
  


awtryau89 said:


> Joker,
> I recently purchased the MA750s. While I think I have really found a good sounding set of IEMs for the money, they kill my ears. For some reason they end up resting on my lower lobe and just become painful. I wear mine on longer flights so they have to be comfortable. So now, I am looking for something with a similar sound signature. If I had to be picky, the 750s are a touch thicker than I like in the lower mids and I could stand for a touch more detail in the upper registers. I do like the sub bass though. Not a bass head but there is something about the elevation in this region that I really like. What would you recommend I look towards in the same price range. I'll figure out the comfort issue on my own. I just want sound recommendations.


 
  
 Hmm... seems like the earhook section might be too long for you and isn't "suspending" the earphones properly. Before you send them back you might want to try re-shaping that earhook so that it's smaller and keeps the earphones from touching the bottom of your outer ear. It can be re-shaped by first heating it up with a hair dryer.
  
 I think the Dunu DN-1000 would be a good match for you sound-wise but it's not a small earphone and is more expensive. It doesn't flare out like the MA750, though, so its fit might work better.
  
 EPH-100 can be a viable option as well - it's much smaller with at least as much deep bass as the MA750, more midrange presence, a little less lower treble energy but comes back in higher up and extends really well. 
  
 Couple more that might work - Klipsch X10 (super comfortable and good bass but always a little lacking in treble presence for me), VSonic GR07BE (on the pricy side and not as much subbass as MA750 by a chunk), and JVC FXT90 (more v-shaped than MA750 and has more mid-bass than subbass, but should be the cheapest of the bunch). 
  


lukalop said:


> What are IEMs like for gaming?


 
  
 Don't do much of that so hopefully someone else can answer. 
  


991 carrera 4s said:


> Big thanks.
> 
> What about Logitech UE700 and Fischer DBA-02 mkII, regarding their sound signature?


 
  
 Both use similar drivers and sound very similar to the cheaper B2 and VC1000 that I listed. There are a couple of others that use a similar setup, too, like the Nocs NS-800 and Phiaton PS200. No use listing them all.


----------



## georgelai57

I give up on IEMs. I've tried all sorts of tips and they all hurt after a very short while. Then the other day someone gave me a free Final Audio Design Adagio II which I believe is at the low end of its range and I am shocked. It's so comfortable. Based on my untrained ears is it because the Adagio seems to have a very short plastic tip? From what I can see of quite a lot of IEMs the plastic tip (or metal depending on the IEM of course) seems quite near the end of the rubber or silicone tip but in the case of the Adagio II it is a further distance away. Can more experienced IEM users enlighten me? This could be the start of my IEM search. Thanks.


----------



## casanova

Hi Joker,
  
 Maybe this has been asked before, but what are the songs you used for testing the iems ?
 Would you mind to share?
  
 To show my gratitude, here are the iems were purchased and to be purchased just based on your review :
 -Phonak pfe012 for myself ( Love it, But somehow, I have upgarded to Heir Audio 4.ai after 2years of using pfe012 )
 -Vsonic GR07 for my wife ( She really loves them, but sadly the right side of this iems has died )
 -Vsonic VC02 for my lil sister ( She likes it for the relaxing sound produced by these iems )
 -Vsonic GR06 for my lil brother ( He likes it, and now...  I have just placed an order Dunu DN1000 for him after reading your review ).
  
 From a happy thread follower.


----------



## drm870

ljokerl said:


> Don't do much of that so hopefully someone else can answer.


 
  
 MadLustEnvy might be a good person to ask about gaming-related questions.


----------



## Headnod

Hi,
  
 can you guys give me some recommendations? I´m looking for:
  
 - TONS of kickbass (low-mid and mid-bass). Everything under 50Hz will be dialed down via EQ, so sub-bass is no big deal but I wouldn`t complain either.
 - Suitable for long listening sessions: Mids and Highs shouldn`t be too agressive or overly analytic.
 - Good sound stage
 - Price ~50$
 - Compact case size if possible
  
 These caught my eye:
 - Signature Acoustics Elements C-12 (looks promising sound wise but the case might be a bit too big)
 - Sonic GR02 Bass Edition (Maybe not enough kickbass? And I saw some people complaining about the highs being a bit too harsh)
  
 I mostly listen to RHCP, all kinds of rock and pop.


----------



## suman134

headnod said:


> Hi,
> 
> can you guys give me some recommendations? I´m looking for:
> 
> ...


 
  
     i think you can consider ah-c100 , after 50 hrs of burning , they are close to your requirements . may be prefect . tons of good quality bass , nice sound stage , price is like $45 , compact case too with comply tips , and not the cheaper one , its a tx-400 , i have it , nice one , and has a mic with 3 control buttons . not heavy at all , and strong cable , joker had a bad experience with denon , he wont even try one .


----------



## Retrias

lukalop said:


> What are IEMs like for gaming?


 
 most professional player actually use 2-3 set of headphone at once, they hang the headset on their neck just for their microphone, wears IEM to hear commands and alerts from teammates , since they commonly use IEM from other manufacturer than their sponsor, they can cover it with the aforementioned headset , or if playing a noisy and open stage , noise isolation only headphones
  
 as for the difference between IEM and headphone, it will mostly be on smaller soundstage


----------



## AgentJ

Hey, I'm still here  and for some reason scared to actually go and buy the JVC FXD80. I remember you said you preferred the A161P - is that just because you like a more balanced sound?

I've sort of asked this question before, but would I be better off in any way if I were to spend a little more and get a more expensive headphone (preferably with a mic, not too bothered about 1 or 3 button) ?


----------



## ljokerl

georgelai57 said:


> I give up on IEMs. I've tried all sorts of tips and they all hurt after a very short while. Then the other day someone gave me a free Final Audio Design Adagio II which I believe is at the low end of its range and I am shocked. It's so comfortable. Based on my untrained ears is it because the Adagio seems to have a very short plastic tip? From what I can see of quite a lot of IEMs the plastic tip (or metal depending on the IEM of course) seems quite near the end of the rubber or silicone tip but in the case of the Adagio II it is a further distance away. Can more experienced IEM users enlighten me? This could be the start of my IEM search. Thanks.


 
  
 I have an Adagio III and I think it’s very comfortable, but more likely a combination of the really light weight (of both the earpieces and the cable) and the skinny design that doesn’t push against any part of the ear when worn. They also don’t need to be inserted very deeply, it appears.
  


casanova said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Maybe this has been asked before, but what are the songs you used for testing the iems ?
> Would you mind to share?
> ...


 
  
I have a folder of selected test tracks but they comprise maybe 20% of my listening during reviews. Most of the time I just have my collection on shuffle and end up swapping between the headphones I’m comparing back and forth across as many tracks as I need to get a good impression of sound differences.
 
That’s not to say I don’t have favorites – I posted some of my fave albums on InnerFidelity here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/more-less-vsonic-vsd1-and-vsd1s#comment-490645
 


headnod said:


> Hi,
> 
> can you guys give me some recommendations? I´m looking for:
> 
> ...


 
 
I would say Padacs Aksent but it seems to be out of stock. The GR02 BE may not have enough mid-bass and definitely can be a little harsh. ATH-CKM500 is better for what you’re after on both counts and looks to be around $55 on amazon. It’s still a little harsh but not as bad as the GR02 and has better overall sound quality.
 
C12 is also an option – not quite as good as the CKM500 or GR02 but it has lots of mid-bass and sounds okay overall. It comes with a very compact leather case so no problem there.
  


suman134 said:


> i think you can consider ah-c100 , after 50 hrs of burning , they are close to your requirements . may be prefect . tons of good quality bass , nice sound stage , price is like $45 , compact case too with comply tips , and not the cheaper one , its a tx-400 , i have it , nice one , and has a mic with 3 control buttons . not heavy at all , and strong cable , joker had a bad experience with denon , he wont even try one .


 
  
 That’s not entirely true – I just thought the C260 or whatever the last one I reviewed was, was crap. I would try another Denon IEM – just not going to go out and buy one.
  


agentj said:


> Hey, I'm still here
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yes, I liked the more balanced sound of the A161P.
  
 Spending more is always a personal choice. Above the price range you're looking at things like the Etymotic HF3 (for balanced sound) and RHA MA750 for bass-heavy sound.


----------



## georgelai57

Thanks ljokerl for the comments on the Adagio III.


----------



## Headnod

suman134 said:


> i think you can consider ah-c100 , after 50 hrs of burning , they are close to your requirements . may be prefect . tons of good quality bass , nice sound stage , price is like $45 , compact case too with comply tips , and not the cheaper one , its a tx-400 , i have it , nice one , and has a mic with 3 control buttons . not heavy at all , and strong cable , joker had a bad experience with denon , he wont even try one .


 

 I could only find the ah-c101 in my area and the price is at ~100$...
  
 So in general, which ones are the punchiest low-mid to mid-bass hitters on the market?


----------



## suman134

headnod said:


> I could only find the ah-c101 in my area and the price is at ~100$...
> 
> So in general, which ones are the punchiest low-mid to mid-bass hitters on the market?


 
  
    if you are after heavy loads of bass , c-12 can do mid bass , you can opt for c-101 , its the same thing , i find c-100 a bit balanced compared to cc51 .


----------



## listen4joy

hey will you review in the future the Noble Audio K10 i read that its the next big thing in the level of Roxanne JH13 or better i only imagine myself that if 4S get to the top of the chart what will k10 will do !!!


----------



## K.T.

marcrom said:


> Can I use my relatively expensive IEM when I workoout without damaging it badly?




In addition to physical duress, I'd be very concerned about the effects of sweat. The salts in sweat are very corrosive!

I personally would not use a pricey set of IEMs for working out. Rather, I'd get a less valuable set specifically for the gym.


----------



## AgentJ

ljokerl said:


> Spending more is always a personal choice. Above the price range you're looking at things like the Etymotic HF3 (for balanced sound) and RHA MA750 for bass-heavy sound.


 
  
 I shouldn't have asked that question because now I'm wondering if I should take the plunge and get the 750 although  they are 3x the price of the FXD80 even though they look better, and have 3x the warranty 
  
 I looked at your review for the 750 and I noticed that someone asked you to compare them to the FXD and you said the 750 overall have more bass, but are warmer.
  
 My question is what does that actually mean? In order to see what sound signatures I like I've been playing around with the EQ (although that probably wont do that good seeing as my headphones arent neutral) and I often find myself bumping the higher end (I guess it's more sparkly and brighter), as well as the areas around the 250-500Hz (I don't know hwo to describe it, but when I go back to normal, everything feels kinda empty), so I'm not sure what that means/
  
 If it's likely to help, my mate has just bought himself some A161Ps which I could have a listen to as well. 
  
 What types of music are warm headphones more suited to? 
  
 Thanks so much!


----------



## justinwei2

Hi, I'm new too the IEM side. I have decent bookshelf speakers and a sub for 2.1 system. I prefer a neutral sound, leaning towards the warmer side. I'm trying to decide between the Logitech UE 700 (Heard it has less silibance than the UE 700). Also considering the etymotic hf5, TDK ba200. Which one is better? I am open to other suggestions, but want Good fit, preferably compact fit , and decent looks.


----------



## ozkan

justinwei2 said:


> Hi, I'm new too the IEM side. I have decent bookshelf speakers and a sub for 2.1 system. I prefer a neutral sound, leaning towards the warmer side. I'm trying to decide between the Logitech UE 700 (Heard it has less silibance than the UE 700). Also considering the etymotic hf5, TDK ba200. Which one is better? I am open to other suggestions, but want Good fit, preferably compact fit , and decent looks.


 
 Tdk Ba200 is the warmest sounding IEM of your list.


----------



## justinwei2

How is the soundstage? Also how detailed is it compared to the ue700? How does the UE 700 compare to other twfk iems?


----------



## ljokerl

listen4joy said:


> hey will you review in the future the Noble Audio K10 i read that its the next big thing in the level of Roxanne JH13 or better i only imagine myself that if 4S get to the top of the chart what will k10 will do !!!


 
  
 I doubt I'll get a go at the K10. 
  


agentj said:


> I shouldn't have asked that question because now I'm wondering if I should take the plunge and get the 750 although  they are 3x the price of the FXD80 even though they look better, and have 3x the warranty
> 
> I looked at your review for the 750 and I noticed that someone asked you to compare them to the FXD and you said the 750 overall have more bass, but are warmer.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Warm is just a preference - many people think a warm tonal character sounds more natural, or at least more "rich". All other things equal a set with more bass will sound warmer than one with less bass. 
  
 Definitely have a listen to the A161P - it's pretty close to neutral and may give you a slightly better idea of what you do or don't like.
  


justinwei2 said:


> Hi, I'm new too the IEM side. I have decent bookshelf speakers and a sub for 2.1 system. I prefer a neutral sound, leaning towards the warmer side. I'm trying to decide between the Logitech UE 700 (Heard it has less silibance than the UE 700). Also considering the etymotic hf5, TDK ba200. Which one is better? I am open to other suggestions, but want Good fit, preferably compact fit , and decent looks.


 
  
 The UE700 and HF5 are not warm-leaning at all in my opinion. The BA200 is better for what you seem to be after, or even the sub-$100 RE-400 from HiFiMan.


----------



## Ikarios

Hey joker! Nice to see you're still truckin. As usual your reviews are fantastic and are quite comprehensive. I've used this thread a boatload of times as a gold standard when recommending IEMs to my friends who are just getting into higher quality headphones.
  
 My question for you - have you encountered anything that's basically an upgraded version of the RE262 (specifically, extension at both ends and detail in the treble)? I've skimmed over most of your sub-250 IEMs and didn't see anything that would do the trick, or looked large, awkward, and low on comfort. From what I can tell the RE-400 is what comes the closest, but it's more of a mix between the RE-ZERO and the RE-262. Any other alternatives? Thanks!


----------



## deco cat

Two fast questions for our gran visir ljokerl: what should be a sound rating for: 1) Xiaomi Piston 2.0 2) Apple Earpods (bundled with Iphone). Thanks.


----------



## Francisk

ljokerl, any chance of a review of the JH Audio Roxanne in the near future?


----------



## ljokerl

ikarios said:


> Hey joker! Nice to see you're still truckin. As usual your reviews are fantastic and are quite comprehensive. I've used this thread a boatload of times as a gold standard when recommending IEMs to my friends who are just getting into higher quality headphones.
> 
> My question for you - have you encountered anything that's basically an upgraded version of the RE262 (specifically, extension at both ends and detail in the treble)? I've skimmed over most of your sub-250 IEMs and didn't see anything that would do the trick, or looked large, awkward, and low on comfort. From what I can tell the RE-400 is what comes the closest, but it's more of a mix between the RE-ZERO and the RE-262. Any other alternatives? Thanks!


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 The RE-600 would be a slightly better option than the RE-400 for this, though it is loads more expensive. TDK BA200 is good for that slightly-warmer-than-neutral sound with good end-to-end extension. Sony MDR-7550 is good. too. Would call either a clear RE262 upgrade but they fit your reqs.
  


deco cat said:


> Two fast questions for our gran visir ljokerl: what should be a sound rating for: 1) Xiaomi Piston 2.0 2) Apple Earpods (bundled with Iphone). Thanks.


 
  
 I haven't tried the Piston.
  
 I have tried the earpods and thought the sound was a little worse than with the Monoprice 8320 so probably somewhere in the low 7.x range. 
  


francisk said:


> ljokerl, any chance of a review of the JH Audio Roxanne in the near future?


 
  
 JH Audio used to reply to my emails but doesn't anymore so... probably not.


----------



## Mdraluck23

Joker, my hero, any chance you've tried the new Audio Technica line? Specifically the IM02. 
  
 Or if anyone has comparisons to some of the TWFK's...


----------



## Francisk

No worries ljokerl...Too bad for JH Audio then...their loss. In fact I was so impressed with your review of the JH13 Pro that I went and test the universal version of JH13 pro (universal version is not for sale...demo purpose only). I'm so impressed that I'm about to take the plunge on a universal Roxanne (because JH Audio won't sell universal version of JH13 Pro) but was waiting for your "seal of approval" before taking the plunge. Too bad I can't test the universal Roxanne yet because JH Audio is so slow in responding to our local distributor so I guess I'll just put it on hold until I can test it. Apparently they're very slow in replying their emails...I was told. Not a very good sign for business.
  
 Then again, there's the Noble K10....


----------



## asadalavi1

Joker, how does the RHA MA750s bass compare to the Monster Turbine Pros?


----------



## ljokerl

mdraluck23 said:


> Joker, my hero, any chance you've tried the new Audio Technica line? Specifically the IM02.
> 
> Or if anyone has comparisons to some of the TWFK's...


 
  
 Sorry, the only new Audio-Technica release I've tried is the CKX5.
  


asadalavi1 said:


> Joker, how does the RHA MA750s bass compare to the Monster Turbine Pros?


 
  
 Pretty similar bass quantity and quality but the Turbines tend to smoother at the top so there's a tendency to listen to them at higher volumes, which of course increases the perceived bass impact.


----------



## rodweb

Joker, any CIEM you'd recommend for a VC1000 lover? Same signature but better technically..


----------



## awtryau89

ozkan said:


> PFEs with grey filters might be a good choice for your criteria if you have a powerful source like X3.


 
  
  


francisk said:


> +1 ozkan... Phonak PFE012 with grey filters sounds amazing. Very hard to beat at that price.


 
  
 Hard to believe I would get near the bass impact I am looking for out of these. Can this really be an option?


----------



## Ikarios

awtryau89 said:


> Hard to believe I would get near the bass impact I am looking for out of these. Can this really be an option?


 

 I've never heard the 750 but if the bass quantity is similar to Monster Turbines the Phonaks will not have anywhere near that amount of bass quantity. The Phonaks are a great all-rounder with a lot of good qualities, detail, and extension, but if you're looking for sub-bass quantity I don't think they'll fit your requirements, even with the bass filters.
  
 Before reading joker's recommendation for you I thought the Dunu DN1000 and Yamaha EPH-100 could both be good alternatives to the 750 sound signature, so points for me I guess for being on the same wavelength as joker.


----------



## awtryau89

ikarios said:


> I've never heard the 750 but if the bass quantity is similar to Monster Turbines the Phonaks will not have anywhere near that amount of bass quantity. The Phonaks are a great all-rounder with a lot of good qualities, detail, and extension, but if you're looking for sub-bass quantity I don't think they'll fit your requirements, even with the bass filters.
> 
> Before reading joker's recommendation for you I thought the Dunu DN1000 and Yamaha EPH-100 could both be good alternatives to the 750 sound signature, so points for me I guess for being on the same wavelength as joker.


 
 That was my thought as well. I forgot to add one caveat to my requirements a I have started this research over the weekend: I need iPhone Mic and controls. The Dunu and Yamaha are not going to get me those. This is turning out to be tougher than I thought.


----------



## Ikarios

awtryau89 said:


> That was my thought as well. I forgot to add one caveat to my requirements a I have started this research over the weekend: I need iPhone Mic and controls. The Dunu and Yamaha are not going to get me those. This is turning out to be tougher than I thought.


 
  
 If you are willing to sacrifice inherent subbass levels, you *could* try something like the Phonaks (which were extremely comfortable for me) and just boosting levels through an EQ or something like the Digizoid ZO. I'm not a fan of EQs myself but it's an option.


----------



## ljokerl

rodweb said:


> Joker, any CIEM you'd recommend for a VC1000 lover? Same signature but better technically..


 
  
 Nothing with exactly the same signature but I think a VC1000 fan would enjoy all of these:
  
 Noble 4S - more full-bodied and a touch smoothed-over in comparison to the VC1000 but very balanced overall with a more natural timbre
 JHA JH13 Pro - bassier than the VC1000 with a more exciting sound, but still extremely transparent and accurate
 Hidition NT6 - a little brighter than VC1000 but otherwise probably the most similar in note presentation - an extremely clear and detailed earphone
 UM Miracle - slightly more distanced in the midrange which makes the bass (est. deep bass) seem a little more prominent compared to the VC1000 and Noble 4S, but otherwise similar
 1964 V6-Stage - a bit more colored than the Miracle but not too different


----------



## ljokerl

Added brief impressions of a couple of new IEMs - the T-Peos Tank/Popular/Spider, Accidentally Extraordinary Bamboo, Meze 11 Deco, NarMoo R1M, Astrotec AX35, and Olasonic Flat-4 Nami. The full post can be found here.
  
The TL;DR version:
  

The *T-Peos Tank *and* Popular* are turning out to be pretty good $40 earphones, with the Tank being warmer and bassier and the Popular more neutral, but still with excellent bass. The newer *T-Peos Spider* is similar but so far seems to lose out slightly to the two other T-Peos sets. The Tank and Popular, and maybe the Spider, will get full reviews later on.
The *Accidentally Extraordinary Bamboo Earbuds* provide forward mids rarely found in entry-level IEMs but lack the clarity and refinement of the best entry-level sets. No full review for these.
The *Meze 11 Deco* looks very pretty but is too bassy for its own good and will not get a full review.
The *NarMoo R1M* features interchangeable tuning ports/screws that range from enhanced-bass to very bassy. In its most balanced configuration it sounds a little edgy but boasts good clarity and a formidable soundstage considering the $30 price tag. Worth a closer look later on.
The *Astrotec AX35* is a singe-BA/dynamic hybrid from Astrotec with a clear, slightly v-shaped signature. It sounds good and should be less polarizing than T-Peos' pricier H-100 hybrid, so it will get a full review.
The *Olasonic Flat-4 Nami* dual-dynamic monitors come with a high price tag and very unique sound signature - open-sounding and very clear, with tight bass, they are pretty bright and heavy on the treble. Best used at lower volumes, but they seem competitive so far and will most likely get a full review.
  
The not-so-brief version of these brief impressions can be found here.


----------



## roy_jones

ikarios said:


> Hey joker! Nice to see you're still truckin. As usual your reviews are fantastic and are quite comprehensive. I've used this thread a boatload of times as a gold standard when recommending IEMs to my friends who are just getting into higher quality headphones.
> 
> My question for you - have you encountered anything that's basically an upgraded version of the RE262 (specifically, extension at both ends and detail in the treble)? I've skimmed over most of your sub-250 IEMs and didn't see anything that would do the trick, or looked large, awkward, and low on comfort. From what I can tell the RE-400 is what comes the closest, but it's more of a mix between the RE-ZERO and the RE-262. Any other alternatives? Thanks!


 
  
 I've heard the TDK IE800 described as an improved RE262, for what it's worth.  I'm always pumping these IEMs as they're so cheap now and punch way above their weight.  I've been patiently waiting and hoping that one day Joker will get his hands on a pair.  People who own both the IE800 and the BA200 seem to be split on which they prefer and the BA200 is very well liked.


----------



## ozkan

ikarios said:


> Hey joker! Nice to see you're still truckin. As usual your reviews are fantastic and are quite comprehensive. I've used this thread a boatload of times as a gold standard when recommending IEMs to my friends who are just getting into higher quality headphones.
> 
> My question for you - have you encountered anything that's basically an upgraded version of the RE262 (specifically, extension at both ends and detail in the treble)? I've skimmed over most of your sub-250 IEMs and didn't see anything that would do the trick, or looked large, awkward, and low on comfort. From what I can tell the RE-400 is what comes the closest, but it's more of a mix between the RE-ZERO and the RE-262. Any other alternatives? Thanks!


 
  
 I can definetely say that RE400 is not an upgrade of RE262. Er4s and according to amazon reviews TDK IE800 is said to be an upgrade of RE262.


----------



## Ikarios

ozkan said:


> I can definetely say that RE400 is not an upgrade of RE262. Er4s and according to amazon reviews TDK IE800 is said to be an upgrade of RE262.


 
  
 I owned the Altec Lansing iM716 (supposedly very similar to ER4P/S) and it's not like the RE262 at all, I would say it's closer to an upgrade of the RE-0. The two TDK earphones are very interesting, although the IE800 looks to be unwieldy since I have small ears and ear canals, so I don't think that's an option. From what i've read it sounds like the BA200 is a more neutral earphone than the IE800, which is a bit more V-shaped, so that's fine. The BA200 is very high on my interest list at the moment.


----------



## drm870

To the guy who asked about the Xiaomi Pistons: They sound similar in quality to my SteelSeries Flux set to me. The Flux's, as configured with my custom silicone tips, have more bass than the Pistons, but IIRC they sounded similar to each other signature-wise with the stock tips. The Pistons seem to be slightly more resolving -- I don't have golden ears, but they sound noticeably less forgiving in terms of badly mastered tracks to my ears.
  
 The upside is that the Pistons cost less. The downside is that they have to be imported...and there apparently are a ton of fakes in circulation.


----------



## esteebin

drm870 said:


> To the guy who asked about the Xiaomi Pistons: They sound similar in quality to my SteelSeries Flux set to me. The Flux's, as configured with my custom silicone tips, have more bass than the Pistons, but IIRC they sounded similar to each other signature-wise with the stock tips. The Pistons seem to be slightly more resolving -- I don't have golden ears, but they sound noticeably less forgiving in terms of badly mastered tracks to my ears.
> 
> The upside is that the Pistons cost less. The downside is that they have to be imported...and there apparently are a ton of fakes in circulation.




No fake if purchased directly or ibuygou.com, an authorized seller. Most people were gambling on real/fake buying from different eBay sellers to save a few dollars.

Do you use stock tips on your pistons? If so they are crap and need to be replaced ASAP. I have both the Flux (purchased when they were half off and with Sony hybrid tips) and the Pistons (with Sennheiser double flange tips and filters removed) and the pistons had the stronger bass punch. 
To me, the better sound goes to the flux because of its balance and clearer vocals/mids. It's my preference.
The pistons are warm and sweet (U-shaped sound): fun with great lower and mid bass and nice treble.

Addendum: I'm curious about your Flux custom tips. Are they comply-like or something different?


----------



## slowpickr

Would love to see a Joker review of the Meelectronics M-Duo...


----------



## drm870

esteebin said:


> Do you use stock tips on your pistons? If so they are crap and need to be replaced ASAP.
> 
> Addendum: I'm curious about your Flux custom tips. Are they comply-like or something different?


 
  
 I'm using Logitech UE TF10 medium tips on the Pistons. Agreed on the stock tips.
  
 The custom tips I'm using are similar to these from ACS. I ordered them from 1964Ears right before they discontinued the option.


----------



## AgentJ

Quick question (for a friend) : 

Good looking IEMs for indie folk type pop under £30? 

Thinking GR02 (£23) or maybe some A161p (£30)?


----------



## chmod744

ljokerl said:


> Added brief impressions of a couple of new IEMs - the T-Peos Tank/Popular/Spider, Accidentally Extraordinary Bamboo, Meze 11 Deco, NarMoo R1M, Astrotec AX35, and Olasonic Flat-4 Nami. The full post can be found here.
> 
> 
> [*]The *NarMoo R1M* features interchangeable tuning ports/screws that range from enhanced-bass to very bassy. In its most balanced configuration it sounds a little edgy but boasts good clarity and a _formidable soundstage considering the $30 price tag_. Worth a closer look later on.



 


Out of the ~$50 and under iems you recommend in your buyers guide, which ones would you say have the best soundstage in terms of layering/depth and imaging/3D-ness? I'm looking to upgrade from my current she3580 and jvc fr201 (mic'd fx101) and have been considering mh1, steelseries flux, vsd1, gr02be, quadbeats, pistons, etc... and now these new NarMoos because your remark on its soundstage caught my attention.


----------



## ljokerl

slowpickr said:


> Would love to see a Joker review of the Meelectronics M-Duo...


 
  
 Saw it at CES but unfortunately didn't get to try it. Maybe someday...
  


agentj said:


> Quick question (for a friend) :
> 
> Good looking IEMs for indie folk type pop under £30?
> 
> Thinking GR02 (£23) or maybe some A161p (£30)?


 
  
 Lots of options for indie-pop type stuff, even the Soundmagic E10 sounds great with it. A161P is probably too neutral for casual listening (unless that is your friend's preferred signature). VSonic VSD1 or VSD1S would be a better option if you can find either in your budget - more accurate than GR02 but more "fun" than A161P and just excellent all around.
  


chmod744 said:


> Out of the ~$50 and under iems you recommend in your buyers guide, which ones would you say have the best soundstage in terms of layering/depth and imaging/3D-ness? I'm looking to upgrade from my current she3580 and jvc fr201 (mic'd fx101) and have been considering mh1, steelseries flux, vsd1, gr02be, quadbeats, pistons, etc... and now these new NarMoos because your remark on its soundstage caught my attention.


  
  
 Probably the MH1C specifically for all-around ability in presentation, especially if you take off a bit off the bass with EQ. The VSD1, Flux, and Quadbeats are all pretty wide but a little flat in terms of depth so they don't quite have that same well-rounded feel. The NarMoos sort of have this same issues but jury's still out on whether they're a step in front or a step behind these other ones.


----------



## chmod744

Thanks for the reply joker. Btw would the soundmagic e10 also have the same wide but flat issue with soundstage?


----------



## ljokerl

chmod744 said:


> Thanks for the reply joker. Btw would the soundmagic e10 also have the same wide but flat issue with soundstage?


 
  
 Yeah pretty much. I like the presentation of the E10, though - it's a little vague, but pretty airy-sounding.


----------



## Bananiq

Hi ljoker,
  
 Soundwise you rated DN-1000 same as Brainwavz B2. (9.2 SQ)
 I have B2 but I was thinking to upgrade to DN-1000 mainly due to dynamic driver capabilities - bass extension - is it really worth it? Is there anything that DN-1000 does really better than B2?
 Or I should ask: what is keeping the B2 to be on par with DN-1000?
  
  
 BTW: have you had chance to hear / review ATH-IM70 or Zero Audio Doppio?
  
 Thanks


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

Hi joker...

Have a couple of questions....

First of all i have the she3580s and they are indeed a fantastic value.... Although.... O would like to upgrade without ruining my wallet...
Until 100 euros wich iems do you recomend as great all rounders? I really like the sound sig of the philips but i also have the over ear momentums and a pair of hd25s eo something with a sound signature to any of these would be great.

I though of the rha ma750 and a couple of friends also recomended me the fidue a63 and tdk ba200.... Do any of these share a similar sound sig to what i have?

I listen to a wide variety of music but mostly indie, pop, rock and edm...

Sorry for the bother m8....


----------



## ljokerl

bananiq said:


> Hi ljoker,
> 
> Soundwise you rated DN-1000 same as Brainwavz B2. (9.2 SQ)
> I have B2 but I was thinking to upgrade to DN-1000 mainly due to dynamic driver capabilities - bass extension - is it really worth it? Is there anything that DN-1000 does really better than B2?
> ...


 
  
If you after bass extension then sure, it’s definitely worth it. The DN-1000 does big bass much better than the B2.
 
See here for one of the reasons I don’t think the DN-1000 won't be an upgrade over a good TWFK set for _all_ listeners: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-310-iems-compared-impressions-of-t-peos-narmoo-astrotec-olasonic-p-870-02-24-14/12960#post_10276305
 
In the end it really depends on your requirements. If you want deep, impactful bass the DN-1000 will blow the B2 away. If you want something that’s flat across the bass and midrange, the DN-1000 isn’t it.
 


pedro oliveira said:


> Hi joker...
> 
> Have a couple of questions....
> 
> ...


 
  
 I haven't spent much time with the Momentum but compared to the HD25 and SHE3580 the A63 and BA200 are quite different. The BA200 is warm but generally pretty balanced - it is more reminiscent of the Momentum than the other two. It may not be the most exciting sound for EDM but it's accurate and versatile.
  
 The A63 is mid-forward and pretty punchy. I like but I'm not sure it can compete with the BA200 in overall SQ. It is a lot cheaper though.
  
 The MA750 is bass-heavy and also warm, but less smooth than the BA200 and with a lot more bass power.
  
 They are all good earphones IMO, just different, but the BA200 is my fave of the bunch. If you don't mind a pretty balanced sound and can find the BA200 in that price range, go for it.


----------



## rodweb

ljokerl said:


> Nothing with exactly the same signature but I think a VC1000 fan would enjoy all of these:
> 
> Noble 4S - more full-bodied and a touch smoothed-over in comparison to the VC1000 but very balanced overall with a more natural timbre
> JHA JH13 Pro - bassier than the VC1000 with a more exciting sound, but still extremely transparent and accurate
> ...




Thanks for the input! 

What about the Westone 4? Will I find it an upgrade over the VC1000? Is there much difference on clarity and bass quantity between them? I suppose the W4 is better with the rest of the technicalities... 

My main use is going to be for modern pop/rock/metal - but I don't want too much bass like the DN-1000.

And thanks again for the help!


----------



## Francisk

Joker, how does the sound quality of JH13 Pro compare to Sennheiser HD600 or HD800? I know this is not a very fair comparison due to CIEM vs open headphones but in terms of neutral/natural good sound quality, which do you think is the winner here? I know for wide sound staging the open headphones are definitely winners here but what about sound quality? Thanks in advance.


----------



## audiobot

Will you be covering the Aurisonics Rockets when they become available next month? Curious to see where they land on your list.


----------



## ljokerl

rodweb said:


> Thanks for the input!
> 
> What about the Westone 4? Will I find it an upgrade over the VC1000? Is there much difference on clarity and bass quantity between them? I suppose the W4 is better with the rest of the technicalities...
> 
> ...


 
  
 Doubtful - if anything, the VC1000 has better clarity, albeit less bass and note thickness. More of a sidegrade than an upgrade, really. 
  


francisk said:


> Joker, how does the sound quality of JH13 Pro compare to Sennheiser HD600 or HD800? I know this is not a very fair comparison due to CIEM vs open headphones but in terms of neutral/natural good sound quality, which do you think is the winner here? I know for wide sound staging the open headphones are definitely winners here but what about sound quality? Thanks in advance.


 
  
 I only have extensive experience with the HD600. To me it is a neutral, slightly warm(ish), very smooth headphone. The JH13 is more exciting, with slightly hyped-up midbass and treble. I generally prefer IEMs for how easy they make it to discern fine detail but the HD600 is my favorite full-size headphone. I don't think either has a clear upper hand here. 
  


audiobot said:


> Will you be covering the Aurisonics Rockets when they become available next month? Curious to see where they land on your list.


 
  
 I'm not sure, I was supposed to review the other Aurisonics sets but they never materialized. We'll see.


----------



## Francisk

Thanks again for your views joker, I've been contemplating on a good pair of open headphones for a while now and I'll seriously look into the HD600.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> If you after bass extension then sure, it’s definitely worth it. The DN-1000 does big bass much better than the B2.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Thank you for the reply joker. 
Wich of them is more similar to the she3580 and hd25 then? I lile the balance of both.
Any other suggestions?


----------



## ljokerl

pedro oliveira said:


> Thank you for the reply joker.
> Wich of them is more similar to the she3580 and hd25 then? I lile the balance of both.
> Any other suggestions?


 
  
 Of those, the MA750. The Dunu DN-1000 is also quite good for a v-shaped HD25-ish sound .


----------



## Rush-n-crush

Hi, so i have been shipped 2 defective Beyerdynamic DT 990 pro 250. Feeling a lil burned and may try a IEM under 200 instead. Whats the differencec from those beyers or something equivalent vs a 200 and under IEM. I like bass, hip hop and will also be using it for heavy gaming/movies. Any suggestions? I have the vsonic vsd1 and found them to be amazing especially for only 50 but still want a higher grade IEM


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> Of those, the MA750. The Dunu DN-1000 is also quite good for a v-shaped HD25-ish sound .




Cool joker...  
Thanks.  

What do you think would be an upgrade the philips she3580? Something that sounds similar in terms of tonality and signature but 1 or 2 notches better....

I rrally like the philips.... They are cheap and they do everything pretty well from indie to tock to edm....

By the way.... Are you still thinking of making the review on the philips?


----------



## ljokerl

rush-n-crush said:


> Hi, so i have been shipped 2 defective Beyerdynamic DT 990 pro 250. Feeling a lil burned and may try a IEM under 200 instead. Whats the differencec from those beyers or something equivalent vs a 200 and under IEM. I like bass, hip hop and will also be using it for heavy gaming/movies. Any suggestions? I have the vsonic vsd1 and found them to be amazing especially for only 50 but still want a higher grade IEM


 
  
 If you like the VSD1 and are willing to spend $200 the GR07 Bass Edition and Dunu DN-1000 would be worth looking at as upgrades. 
  


pedro oliveira said:


> Cool joker...
> Thanks.
> 
> What do you think would be an upgrade the philips she3580? Something that sounds similar in terms of tonality and signature but 1 or 2 notches better....
> ...


 
  
 I still think the DN1k is a good upgrade even though it's brighter. The MA750 is darker like the 3580 but differs in other ways. For sound signature alone the closest would probably be the RBH EP1 (even though it has somewhat more forward mids) but it's not enough of an upgrade to justify its price tag compared to the Philips. 
  
 Yes, I still need to review the Philips at some point...


----------



## Rush-n-crush

ljokerl said:


> If you like the VSD1 and are willing to spend $200 the GR07 Bass Edition and Dunu DN-1000 would be worth looking at as upgrades.




Can only find those dunus on ebay not sure how i feel about that. What about the jvc ha fxt90? Only thing turning me away from the gro7 is vsonic saying the vsd1 is 80 percent of the gro7. For gaming purposes i need an iem with big Soundstage and 3d imaging. So many choices


----------



## tan1415

hi,
  
 Do yiou have a review on teh audio technica IM50?
 Seems perfect for me. And quite cheap online.


----------



## ozkan

tan1415 said:


> hi,
> 
> Do yiou have a review on teh audio technica IM50?
> Seems perfect for me. And quite cheap online.


 
  
 Sure, we have. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/705687/review-of-audio-technica-ath-im01-ath-im02-ath-im03-ath-im04-ath-im50-ath-im70


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> I still think the DN1k is a good upgrade even though it's brighter. The MA750 is darker like the 3580 but differs in other ways. For sound signature alone the closest would probably be the RBH EP1 (even though it has somewhat more forward mids) but it's not enough of an upgrade to justify its price tag compared to the Philips.
> 
> Yes, I still need to review the Philips at some point...


 
  

  
 Please do JOKER ALL MIGHTY!!!!!! XD
  
 They are damn good...... I think i am buying a couple more pairs just in case.....


----------



## tan1415

ozkan said:


> Sure, we have.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Read it. Excellent post.Only thing is...have bought all my iems after reading Jokers reviews. His reviews are very consequent and I trust them to fit my musical taste.
  
 For example he mention the IM50 as borderline bass heavy, while in other reviews its not a real bassheavy iem. So bit contradictory.


----------



## eccom

tan1415 said:


> Read it. Excellent post.Only thing is...have bought all my iems after reading Jokers reviews. His reviews are very consequent and I trust them to fit my musical taste.
> 
> For example he mention the IM50 as borderline bass heavy, while in other reviews its not a real bassheavy iem. So bit contradictory.


 

 Joker eraly on useds ety er4s and HF5 as reference, and considers that bass a neutral (as to my understanding). The HF5 is one of the IEMs I have that have the least bass, so it's all about figuring out where you are on the scale compared to his references. Other reviewers are good as well, but the bass level set to "referrence" is one of the consistent differences.


----------



## ozkan

tan1415 said:


> For example he mention the IM50 as borderline bass heavy, while in other reviews its not a real bassheavy iem. So bit contradictory.


 
  
 Yes, IM50 is not in the bass heavy category but it is not bass light either. It should be more than enough for non bass-heads. If you are looking for some serious bass head IEMs like IE8 or at least Philips 3580 then these are definitely not for you.


----------



## Ikarios

eccom said:


> Joker eraly on useds ety er4s and HF5 as reference, and considers that bass a neutral (as to my understanding). The HF5 is one of the IEMs I have that have the least bass, so it's all about figuring out where you are on the scale compared to his references. Other reviewers are good as well, but the bass level set to "referrence" is one of the consistent differences.


 
  
 But with Joker, he has written so many reviews and can compare to just about anything you've heard that you can get a good idea from what Joker writes about the sound signature of any other IEM. He also does a pretty good job of relating the price to the sound quality, and doesn't fall victim to "FOTM syndrome". That Audio-Technica review is nice and thorough, but after reading it I still have no idea what any of those sound like, and I had no idea if he was describing $50 IEMs or $800 IEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

rush-n-crush said:


> Can only find those dunus on ebay not sure how i feel about that. What about the jvc ha fxt90? Only thing turning me away from the gro7 is vsonic saying the vsd1 is 80 percent of the gro7. For gaming purposes i need an iem with big Soundstage and 3d imaging. So many choices


 
  
You can also get the DN-1000 from lendmeurears – they ship worldwide as far as I know.
 
The VSD1 doesn’t lag far behind the GR07 in performance. It also doesn’t lag far behind the FXT90. This is known as diminishing returns – you’ll always be paying more for that last bit of performance. Audio is not known for large incremental games per dollar spent, except at the low end or if your starting point is not very good (which is clearly not the case with the VSD1).
  


tan1415 said:


> hi,
> 
> Do yiou have a review on teh audio technica IM50?
> Seems perfect for me. And quite cheap online.


 
  
 I personally haven’t tried them. Need to finish the CKX5iS review before queuing up any more Audio-Technicas.
  


pedro oliveira said:


> Please do JOKER ALL MIGHTY!!!!!! XD
> 
> They are damn good...... I think i am buying a couple more pairs just in case.....


 
  
I got a spare recently as well when they were $6.99 on Groupon 



.


----------



## unknownguardian

hi joker. got a question. how would you describe the sound signature of noble 4c/s? is it closer to 1964v6(more neutral) or jh13pro(slightly bassier), or as what they put on the website "ideal pairing with vocal, acoustic, and classical music"?


----------



## ljokerl

unknownguardian said:


> hi joker. got a question. how would you describe the sound signature of noble 4c/s? is it closer to 1964v6(more neutral) or jh13pro(slightly bassier), or as what they put on the website "ideal pairing with vocal, acoustic, and classical music"?


 
  
 To me it's more neutral/slightly more mid-centric than those - the V6 and JH13 and especially the JH13 elevate the bass and treble a little compared to the 4S.


----------



## loomisjohnson

after many years as an audiogon-type  i started losing my enthusiasm for two-channel gear and started immersing myself in this head-fi realm. if i may, a few observations:
 1. this thread has had over 4m views, which (paris hilton sex tapes aside) has to be some sort of a record. the obsessive, erudite and genuinely worthwhile efforts of its author is a superhuman accomplishment on a par with the painting of the Sistine chapel or construction of the great wall.
 2. unlike the cranky old white guys who dominate other audio sites, there's a lot of diversity here. very cordial, as well--haven't seen any of the psycho-political bickering that inevitably kicks in on your peer pages. a good thing.
 3. likewise, aside from the obligatory bose-and-beats bashing, there's very little class warfare and snobbery going on here--people are just as sincere about the <$20 recs as they are about the fancy stuff.
 4. to which end, as many others have opined, the law of diminishing returns kicks in quicker in this field than elsewhere. since starting here, i've been gradually "upgrading" from the marked-down-on-amazon <$50 class to the highly touted $200 class--i'm surprised at how incrementally small the improvements have been and how, even with, say, the eph-100s or fxt90s in the drawer i still sometimes reach for the ($15)mee 9p or  ($25)portapros.
 cheers and have a great weekend


----------



## H T T

loomisjohnson said:


> 2. unlike the cranky old white guys


 
  
 Is that appropriate?


----------



## ljokerl

@loomisjohnson Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  


loomisjohnson said:


> 4. to which end, as many others have opined, the law of diminishing returns kicks in quicker in this field than elsewhere. since starting here, i've been gradually "upgrading" from the marked-down-on-amazon <$50 class to the highly touted $200 class--i'm surprised at how* incrementally small the improvements have been* and how, even with, say, the eph-100s or fxt90s in the drawer i still sometimes reach for the ($15)mee 9p or  ($25)portapros.
> cheers and have a great weekend


 
  
 And getting smaller - nowadays there are $50 sets that sound more similar to the $200 stuff than to the M9P. Good news for audio fans everywhere 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Rush-n-crush

ljokerl said:


> @loomisjohnson Thanks  .
> 
> 
> And getting smaller - nowadays there are $50 sets that sound more similar to the $200 stuff than to the M9P. Good news for audio fans everywhere  .




Making me regret those dunu dn-1000 i just ordered since i already own the vsd1. Maybe i can send those dunus back when they arrive


----------



## waynes world

loomisjohnson said:


> 4. to which end, as many others have opined, the law of diminishing returns kicks in quicker in this field than elsewhere. since starting here, i've been gradually "upgrading" from the marked-down-on-amazon <$50 class to the highly touted $200 class--i'm surprised at how incrementally small the improvements have been and how, even with, say, the eph-100s or fxt90s in the drawer i still sometimes reach for the ($15)mee 9p or  ($25)portapros.
> cheers and have a great weekend


 
  
 I hate my $15 ksc75's and $25 sportapros (ie portapros). And my $40 vsdle's and zero audio dx210's. They are a downer to my upgraditis. My other gear don't seem to appreciate them very much at all!


----------



## d marc0

rush-n-crush said:


> Making me regret those dunu dn-1000 i just ordered since i already own the vsd1. Maybe i can send those dunus back when they arrive




I doubt it... I still gotta find someone who doesn't like the DN-1000 purely because of sound. If you do it's more likely because of fit issues. It's my best purchase in 2013!


----------



## waynes world

d marc0 said:


> I doubt it... I still gotta find someone who doesn't like the DN-1000 purely because of sound. If you do it's more likely because of fit issues. It's my best purchase in 2013!


 
  
 The man speaketh! Btw, I do realize that the dn1k's are great and worth the money. Wish I had them! (much to the chagrin of my cheapo goodies lol)


----------



## d marc0

waynes world said:


> The man speaketh! Btw, I do realize that the dn1k's are great and worth the money. Wish I had them! (much to the chagrin of my cheapo goodies lol)




Hehe you do realize you got a few items I envy too don't you?


----------



## H20Fidelity

d marc0 said:


> I doubt it... I still gotta find someone who doesn't like the DN-1000 purely because of sound. If you do it's more likely because of fit issues.* It's my best purchase in 2013!*


 

 +1


----------



## ljokerl

^ and on that note, the Earphone Buyer's Guide has received a major 2014 overhaul.
  
 This includes addition of the *Dunu DN-1000*, *VSonic VSD1/S*, and *MOE-SS01*
  
 The following earphones have been retired from the Buyer's Guide: FutureSonics Atrio (discontinued). VSonic GR02 Bass Edition (replaced with VSonic VSD1), Astrotec AM-800 (replaced with MOE-SS01), VSonic VC02, MEElectronics A161P (seems to be discontinued)
  
 Pricing and links have been updated.


----------



## SyCo87

I just realized I joined here when the M6s were on top of the budget class headphones (with the M1 a more better and expensive choice). Now the Meelecs can't keep up with even the Monos, Phillip SHE which are a class ahead of them.


----------



## Mdraluck23

VC1000's are exactly what the doctor ordered, thanks ljokerl!


----------



## djvkool

ljokerl said:


> ^ and on that note, the Earphone Buyer's Guide has received a major 2014 overhaul.
> 
> This includes addition of the *Dunu DN-1000*, *VSonic VSD1/S*, and *MOE-SS01*
> 
> ...


 
  
 Superb stuff joker, as usual, good to see DN1k made it there...


----------



## AgentJ

Hey joker, 

Finally got my JVC FXD80, and they fit! How are they supposed to compare to the AM800? And do they need burn in or anything?

edit: the astrotecs are definitely lighter and slightly more comfortable, but the JVC seem a little harsh in the highs, is this normal?


----------



## loomisjohnson

granted, i'm new to these parts but it seems like the economics of upgraditis in the iem realm is hard to understand. in two channel audio, you can see how someone would "rationally" buy $5000 speakers which don't necessarily sound better than a $1500 pair--issues like aesthetics, design, brand prestige and collectibility are considerations. (likewise, lots of people buy $$$$ rolexes with full knowledge that a $200 seiko tells time just as well). with iems, however, aesthetics and prestige don't seem like major criteria--lots of pricier iems come from little-known manufacturers and don't look or feel much different than their lower-priced peers. which leads to the question: if today's $50 standouts are so good, will there be there any real market for the expensive stuff?


----------



## Rush-n-crush

loomisjohnson said:


> granted, i'm new to these parts but it seems like the economics of upgraditis in the iem realm is hard to understand. in two channel audio, you can see how someone would "rationally" buy $5000 speakers which don't necessarily sound better than a $1500 pair--issues like aesthetics, design, brand prestige and collectibility are considerations. (likewise, lots of people buy $$$$ rolexes with full knowledge that a $200 seiko tells time just as well). with iems, however, aesthetics and prestige don't seem like major criteria--lots of pricier iems come from little-known manufacturers and don't look or feel much different than their lower-priced peers. which leads to the question: if today's $50 standouts are so good, will there be there any real market for the expensive stuff?




Ill let you know soon enough. Have had vsd1 for 2 weeks dkn1 is on its way


----------



## kova4a

loomisjohnson said:


> granted, i'm new to these parts but it seems like the economics of upgraditis in the iem realm is hard to understand. in two channel audio, you can see how someone would "rationally" buy $5000 speakers which don't necessarily sound better than a $1500 pair--issues like aesthetics, design, brand prestige and collectibility are considerations. (likewise, lots of people buy $$$$ rolexes with full knowledge that a $200 seiko tells time just as well). with iems, however, aesthetics and prestige don't seem like major criteria--lots of pricier iems come from little-known manufacturers and don't look or feel much different than their lower-priced peers. which leads to the question: if today's $50 standouts are so good, will there be there any real market for the expensive stuff?


 
 IMO there'll always be a market for that stuff. It's still about not how it looks or feels but how it sounds. While there are $50 iems that sound very good in comparison to $100-200 ones that does't mean they an actually on-par with the best of them let alone on-par with the high-end stuff.  But there are diminishing returns and a $500 iem doesn't actually sound 10 times better than a $50 one. In the end it comes down to what is your budget and what are you willing to spend for sound quality. If one has the money to spare he'll go for the better sounding stuff and the expensive stuff is still the superior sounding. 
The good thing about the lower and mid-fi iem getting better and better is that people with limited funds can enjoy very good sound for very little money in comparison to what they could get a few years ago for the same amount.


----------



## ljokerl

syco87 said:


> I just realized I joined here when the M6s were on top of the budget class headphones (with the M1 a more better and expensive choice). Now the Meelecs can't keep up with even the Monos, Phillip SHE which are a class ahead of them.


 
  
 Funny thing is, I use my M6 more than any of those except maybe the Philips, which makes for a good benchmark. The M6 just fits so well and stays so securely in my ears, and I know it will survive if I get a little sweat on it or if the cable gets snagged.
  
 I tried replacing it with other sets as my active IEM but none have quite worked out. The Westove ADV was closest but I end up focusing on how crappy it sounds for $200. 
  


mdraluck23 said:


> VC1000's are exactly what the doctor ordered, thanks ljokerl!


 
  
 Glad you like them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


djvkool said:


> Superb stuff joker, as usual, good to see DN1k made it there...


 
  
 Thanks. The DN1k was bound to. I think it's the priciest thing there, which isn't saying much as I tried to keep it all reasonably-priced 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


agentj said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> Finally got my JVC FXD80, and they fit! How are they supposed to compare to the AM800? And do they need burn in or anything?
> 
> edit: the astrotecs are definitely lighter and slightly more comfortable, but the JVC seem a little harsh in the highs, is this normal?


 
  
 My pair was a used loaner. They should be about as bright as the Astrotecs but with significantly better bass reach and maybe slightly more withdrawn mids (if you're listening to them at a higher volume to compensate for this, that might explain the harshness; otherwise maybe they will benefit from break-in).


----------



## PanamaHat

Looking for the right upgrade for re-400's to use with my dx50.
 I listen to indie, hiphop, ambient, and edm. Big soundstage + slightlyyy boosted bass would be nice with decent overall clarity.
 I have a couple contenders:
  
 westone 4/4r/w40      very neutral, might be boring
 sony xba-h3              fun, sony treble..
 heir 4.ai                    tuned for jazz.. not sure if that's good or bad
 ath-im02                   excellent clarity, possibly sibilant
 noble 3                     might be the holy grail, maybe
  
 Not sure where to start 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Help me trim down my list please


----------



## 177261

I just lost my Shure 535's. So damn sad! Are there any equal good or better in-ears in it's price range? They have to be well known and with a good warranty coverage. Someone tipped me about the Westone but that brand doesn't sell in my country so i have to exlude it unfortunately.
  
 Thanks in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

panamahat said:


> Looking for the right upgrade for re-400's to use with my dx50.
> I listen to indie, hiphop, ambient, and edm. Big soundstage + slightlyyy boosted bass would be nice with decent overall clarity.
> I have a couple contenders:
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Westones are the only ones I've tried out of those. They do have a thicker sound (along with more bass impact) and slightly subdued upper mids in comparison but I doubt an RE-400 fan will find them boring.
  


christianh said:


> I just lost my Shure 535's. So damn sad! Are there any equal good or better in-ears in it's price range? They have to be well known and with a good warranty coverage. Someone tipped me about the Westone but that brand doesn't sell in my country so i have to exlude it unfortunately.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 
  
 Having to be a big brand really narrows it down. The Sony MDR-7550 sounds better than the SE535 to me with a not-too-different sound signature (balanced, a little warm, with smooth treble). TDK BA200 does too, and has a similar form factor. Otherwise you're probably stuck with having to get another pair of Shures.


----------



## ozkan

panamahat said:


> Looking for the right upgrade for re-400's to use with my dx50.
> I listen to indie, hiphop, ambient, and edm. Big soundstage + slightlyyy boosted bass would be nice with decent overall clarity.
> I have a couple contenders:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Ath IM02/50/70 don't have sibilance issue. Granted. Heir 4.ai has some sibilance issues. You may add Yamaha EPH-100 or Jvc Fxt90 to the list for your genres.


----------



## ellis ip

panamahat said:


> Looking for the right upgrade for re-400's to use with my dx50.
> I listen to indie, hiphop, ambient, and edm. Big soundstage + slightlyyy boosted bass would be nice with decent overall clarity.
> I have a couple contenders:
> 
> ...



actually i would look for the asg 1 or 3.a.i because ath im ba series or westone don't have enough bass for edm , im70 is ok for edm but the soundstage wasn't big enough , i try all of those , i finally pick the heir 3.a.i and change cable , it 's enough for me , but i start to look up for the westone um50 (i am so greedy XD) , arrived hongkong 1 week ago


----------



## nati8056

joker the dunu dn1000 and vc1000 is better then se535?
and what about se846?


----------



## ethanc

panamahat said:


> Looking for the right upgrade for re-400's to use with my dx50.
> I listen to indie, hiphop, ambient, and edm. Big soundstage + slightlyyy boosted bass would be nice with decent overall clarity.
> I have a couple contenders:
> 
> ...


 

 I personally don't think the 4.ai is tuned for jazz, rather, it has very smooth mid range which happens to synergize very nicely with jazz.  The non-S version (older version) is considered to be very neutral, with a hint of warmth, and very detailed. The S version, I heard, has bass boosted a little bit.


----------



## SyCo87

ljokerl said:


> Funny thing is, I use my M6 more than any of those except maybe the Philips, which makes for a good benchmark. The M6 just fits so well and stays so securely in my ears, and I know it will survive if I get a little sweat on it or if the cable gets snagged.
> 
> I tried replacing it with other sets as my active IEM but none have quite worked out. The Westove ADV was closest but I end up focusing on how crappy it sounds for $200.




Yeah the fit was really good in my opinion. Wish the ATHIM50s had their small housing. With that being said, I have no idea what happened to my clear pair. Might have to pick up another pair for jogging.


----------



## loomisjohnson

do they do blind listening tests in these parts? if so, it'd be interesting to see how many folks prefer, say, the $50 vsonics to the the $200 models.


----------



## kova4a

loomisjohnson said:


> do they do blind listening tests in these parts? if so, it'd be interesting to see how many folks prefer, say, the $50 vsonics to the the $200 models.


 
 It's not about looking at an iem and hearing it better just because you know it's more expensive.  But to answer your question I can tell apart even iems with smaller differences like the 3 vsonic VSD1 versions in a blind test let alone something higher-end.
 Anyway, I still don't get what are you looking for? I already told you - there are great cheap iems but there are still no iems in existence that cost $50 and will fool anyone who knows high-end sound in a blind comparison with a good $200 one. 
 Still as I said the cheap stuff is getting better and better and just a few years ago there were iems that cost 200 bucks and weren't as good as a bunch of the nowadays' sub-$100 ones, so who knows how much the low and mid-fi stuff will improve in the next few years - it's possible that at some point in the future they'll catch up but that time still hasn't come.


----------



## Lukalop

It has just occurred to me that even though the JH lineup have Freqphase, in reviews people have said that despite this the Fitear 334 (Togo however I want to get the MH custom version for better fit & isolation) is very comparable, despite them not using Freqphase technology. I assume that this means the BA drivers of the Fitears are superior and that once fitear implements Freqphase that they will be much better than JH's set. Is frequency phase patented by JH?

I also am leaning towards the SE-5 as apparently they can change the decay of the sound to make it sound more organic. But they are made of silicone, doesn't silicone tear easily and acrylic is a harder material do I would assume it is more durable.


----------



## Telltale

syco87 said:


> Yeah the fit was really good in my opinion. Wish the ATHIM50s had their small housing. With that being said, I have no idea what happened to my clear pair. Might have to pick up another pair for jogging.




Out of interest how are the IM50s for active use? I'm considering getting the IM70s but they do look a bit big and I'd want to use then for running and the gym.


----------



## ozkan

telltale said:


> Out of interest how are the IM50s for active use? I'm considering getting the IM70s but they do look a bit big and I'd want to use then for running and the gym.


 
 They are good for running. No problem.


----------



## ljokerl

nati8056 said:


> joker the dunu dn1000 and vc1000 is better then se535?
> and what about se846?


 
  
 I haven’t tried the SE846. I do like the VC1000 and DN-1000 very much, which I couldn’t say for the SE535, but they also have different sound signatures – the VC1000 brighter and more “analytical” and the DN-1000 brighter and more v-shaped.
  


syco87 said:


> Yeah the fit was really good in my opinion. Wish the ATHIM50s had their small housing. With that being said, I have no idea what happened to my clear pair. Might have to pick up another pair for jogging.


 
  
 I still have a 1st-gen maroon one from 2009 with the copper memory wire and microphonic cable 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


lukalop said:


> It has just occurred to me that even though the JH lineup have Freqphase, in reviews people have said that despite this the Fitear 334 (Togo however I want to get the MH custom version for better fit & isolation) is very comparable, despite them not using Freqphase technology. I assume that this means the BA drivers of the Fitears are superior and that once fitear implements Freqphase that they will be much better than JH's set. Is frequency phase patented by JH?
> 
> I also am leaning towards the SE-5 as apparently they can change the decay of the sound to make it sound more organic. But they are made of silicone, doesn't silicone tear easily and acrylic is a harder material do I would assume it is more durable.


  


Freqphase is just a marketing word JH Audio uses for having their IEMs (supposedly) phase-aligned. That’s not to say FitEar stuff is not phase-aligned in the first place, or even what sort of difference it makes in what we actually here. IMO it’s not a good idea to let marketing-speak convince you whether something is or isn’t worth buying. I personally think the TG334 has significant shortfalls in balance and finesse compared to the JH13 but I don't know (or think that it matters ) if what’s responsible for the difference is the "Freqphase" tweak.


----------



## Sabsjl

Was wondering what you guys think about the Earsonics sm64? Would like to know how it compares to the W40 and Se535? Trying to decide on getting a pair of IEMs around this price range.


----------



## nekromantik

Hi Joker
  
 Quick question, currently got Bassos and want to upgrade due to driver flex.
 Which IEMs you think will suit electronic music for under £80?
  
 Thanks


----------



## suman134

nekromantik said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Quick question, currently got Bassos and want to upgrade due to driver flex.
> Which IEMs you think will suit electronic music for under £80?
> ...


 
  
     try xba-h1 , ma-750 .


----------



## SyCo87

ljokerl said:


> I still have a 1st-gen maroon one from 2009 with the copper memory wire and microphonic cable :




Lol I remember I was too cheap to pay the extra money. Those were awesome. The clear ones look like secret service equipment compared to those Maroon ones. Magnificent color choice.


----------



## nekromantik

suman134 said:


> try xba-h1 , ma-750 .


 
  
 Thanks
 How are they compared with Audio Technica CKX9 or Phillips S1s?


----------



## suman134

nekromantik said:


> Thanks
> How are they compared with Audio Technica CKX9 or Phillips S1s?


 
  
     i have neither of these , but you can read about the rha ma-750 in the review segment . and about the h1 , has a lesser bass decay , nice mids , and blunt highs , beautifully musical sound , wont rate it high for its sq but for me its a 8.4 , wont feel slow to electronic music , i myself like electronic music and h1 is not bad at it , fuller bass , not much sub bass but mid bass is nice .


----------



## nekromantik

suman134 said:


> i have neither of these , but you can read about the rha ma-750 in the review segment . and about the h1 , has a lesser bass decay , nice mids , and blunt highs , beautifully musical sound , wont rate it high for its sq but for me its a 8.4 , wont feel slow to electronic music , i myself like electronic music and h1 is not bad at it , fuller bass , not much sub bass but mid bass is nice .


 
 Thanks


----------



## Sabsjl

sabsjl said:


> Was wondering what you guys think about the Earsonics sm64? Would like to know how it compares to the W40 and Se535? Trying to decide on getting a pair of IEMs around this price range.


 
 anyone?


----------



## 177261

ljokerl said:


> The Westones are the only ones I've tried out of those. They do have a thicker sound (along with more bass impact) and slightly subdued upper mids in comparison but I doubt an RE-400 fan will find them boring.
> 
> 
> Having to be a big brand really narrows it down. The Sony MDR-7550 sounds better than the SE535 to me with a not-too-different sound signature (balanced, a little warm, with smooth treble). TDK BA200 does too, and has a similar form factor. Otherwise you're probably stuck with having to get another pair of Shures.


 
  
 Thanks for the input! But those are scarse and i don't find any retailer nor etailer selling The Sonys in Sweden. I do find a retailer selling the TDK BA200. These are better than the 535's you say? Regarding the Shure SE535 it's nearly sold out everywhere here and i was thinking custom as an alternative. Is the 1964-V3 from 1964 Ears better than the Shure 535's? And the Westone W40 any thoughts of them? Im just after transparent neutral sound and no colouring on any range. The Shure 535, UE900, Sennheiser 8i, Etymotic Research ER-4PT, Klipsch X11i, Grado GR8 is the only ones with big availability here in Sweden.
  
 Thanks in advance!
  
 edit: ljokerl i just read that you didn't like the SE535 a few posts up. Are they bad?


----------



## hwkaholic

This might be the best thread ever of all thread that ever was!!

Just reporting back that I have given many more hours on my RHA 750 IEMs. They have become everything I had hoped and more! Bass response has enhanced with burn in and the clarity is excellent across the spectrum! My only gripe in the over ear piece. I wish they were a little more rigid or perhaps "formable".


----------



## Grayson73

nekromantik said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Quick question, currently got Bassos and want to upgrade due to driver flex.
> Which IEMs you think will suit electronic music for under £80?
> ...


 
 Zero Audio Tenore and Monster Gratitude are great for electronic music.  Have you heard the Fidelio S1?  I have the S2 and they are good for electronic music also.


----------



## nati8056

thanks joker


----------



## nekromantik

grayson73 said:


> Zero Audio Tenore and Monster Gratitude are great for electronic music.  Have you heard the Fidelio S1?  I have the S2 and they are good for electronic music also.


 
 Thanks. I can get the Gratitudes for £60 on ebay. Not heard the S1s. S2s are slightly over price range.
 You not heard the RHA MA750a?


----------



## peter123

Go with the Gratitude's, they are truly great with electronic music. That's a fair price as well


----------



## Grayson73

nekromantik said:


> Thanks. I can get the Gratitudes for £60 on ebay. Not heard the S1s. S2s are slightly over price range.
> You not heard the RHA MA750a?


 
 You asked about S1 so I thought you had them.
  
 No, I haven't heard MA750, but I'm sure someone has heard both MA750 and Gratitudes.  Ask on the Discovery thread.


----------



## nekromantik

grayson73 said:


> You asked about S1 so I thought you had them.
> 
> No, I haven't heard MA750, but I'm sure someone has heard both MA750 and Gratitudes.  Ask on the Discovery thread.


 
 I heard people say they are good so was wondering if you heard them,
 ok thanks will do


----------



## b0000

@joker or anyone else
 
so i got the um pro 30. But the sound signature isn't really to my liking. The bass is a bit bloated and bleeds into the lower mids, which i find is a bit too forward. the upper midrange could use a tiny bit more clarity as well.
 
Basically i'm looking for something mid centric, not shove-it-into-your-face forward with less midbass, and a bit more clarity, and no sibilance, and kind of warm. Something that sounds natural (transparent?) and on the warm side of neutral a la lcd2.
 
 
I'm guessing the shure se535 might be it, but in your review you say that it's bested by some newer offerings so im wondering what they may be. I'm guessing the sm64, since you say its still dark sounding, but can make claims to sonic balance. But I'm still unsure. My price range is still 400-500, but this time, no brand preference, though I'm leaning towards the sm64 if I can actually find someplace to buy them.(I already emailed earsonics about the vat tax)


----------



## ericr

sabsjl said:


> Was wondering what you guys think about the Earsonics sm64? Would like to know how it compares to the W40 and Se535? Trying to decide on getting a pair of IEMs around this price range.




Never heard the W40 or SE535, but I own both the W4R and the SM64 and clearly prefer the SM64. More and deeper sub-bass, no bass bleed into the mids, mids a bit more forward, with nice sparkle in the highs. Wider, slightly deeper, more realistic soundstage (wonderful with live recordings). The SM64 sound is very cohesive and coherent from the lowest to highest notes. 

Like the W4R, little to no sibilance and very easy to listen to for hours (no fatigue).


----------



## ljokerl

sabsjl said:


> Was wondering what you guys think about the Earsonics sm64? Would like to know how it compares to the W40 and Se535? Trying to decide on getting a pair of IEMs around this price range.


 
  
 I personally like the SM64. See review here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/earsonics-sm64/ . Really good if you like deep and powerful bass (it’s not a reference earphone) without veiling or loss in clarity/detail.  
  


nekromantik said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Quick question, currently got Bassos and want to upgrade due to driver flex.
> Which IEMs you think will suit electronic music for under £80?
> ...


 
  
 I haven’t tried any Zero Audio IEMs. Are the Yamaha EPH-100s in your budget? I know prices are often higher in the UK for the same gear. I really like the EPH-100 for EDM. The MA750s are good, too- they are a little slower than the EPH-100 from a bass perspective, but otherwise about as capable. 
  


christianh said:


> Thanks for the input! But those are scarse and i don't find any retailer nor etailer selling The Sonys in Sweden. I do find a retailer selling the TDK BA200. These are better than the 535's you say? Regarding the Shure SE535 it's nearly sold out everywhere here and i was thinking custom as an alternative. Is the 1964-V3 from 1964 Ears better than the Shure 535's? And the Westone W40 any thoughts of them? Im just after transparent neutral sound and no colouring on any range. The Shure 535, UE900, Sennheiser 8i, Etymotic Research ER-4PT, Klipsch X11i, Grado GR8 is the only ones with big availability here in Sweden.
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> edit: ljokerl i just read that you didn't like the SE535 a few posts up. Are they bad?


 
  
 I don’t mind the SE535 - it's not the IEM I’d personally buy in its price class, but if you enjoyed it I definitely wouldn't advise against it.
  
 The W40 has the same sound as the W4 reviewed in this thread. I like the W40, as well as the UE900 and ER-4PT. The UE900 is very balanced except for a little dip in the upper mids. It’s a little brighter than the SE535 but that didn’t bother me. The ER4 is more analytical - brighter, less bass body, and thinner overall. The X11i and Senn IE8i are definitely not neutral-sounding so probably not a good choice.
  
 The 1964-V3 is also not neutral-sounding - it's quite bassy and has an aggressive signature. Not a great SE535 upgrade. 
  


hwkaholic said:


> This might be the best thread ever of all thread that ever was!!
> 
> Just reporting back that I have given many more hours on my RHA 750 IEMs. They have become everything I had hoped and more! Bass response has enhanced with burn in and the clarity is excellent across the spectrum! My only gripe in the over ear piece. I wish they were a little more rigid or perhaps "formable".


 
  
Glad you like them!
 
FYI, the earhooks on the MA750 can be reshaped if you think that will help you get more comfortable – just heat them up with a hair dryer and carefully adjust their shape. Once they cool off they’ll take on the new shape you give them.
  


b0000 said:


> @joker or anyone else
> 
> so i got the um pro 30. But the sound signature isn't really to my liking. The bass is a bit bloated and bleeds into the lower mids, which i find is a bit too forward. the upper midrange could use a tiny bit more clarity as well.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, the SE535 would do it. It's a better LCD-2 match than the SM64. It's a little pricy though - IMO the TDK BA200, Sony MDR-7550, and even HiFiMan RE-400 are a better value for that type of sound, and the StageDiver SD-2 might be the holy grail if you're spending SE535 money.


----------



## nekromantik

ljokerl said:


> I haven’t tried any Zero Audio IEMs. Are the Yamaha EPH-100s in your budget? I know prices are often higher in the UK for the same gear. I really like the EPH-100 for EDM. The MA750s are good, too- they are a little slower than the EPH-100 from a bass perspective, but otherwise about as capable.


 
  
 Thanks 
  
 Yeah the EPH100 is out of my range sadly. Its the one IEM I know will be good as everyone agrees about that.
 Have you heard the Sony H1s?


----------



## Sabsjl

Hey joker. What about the sm64 compared to the 1964-v3? I'm thinking whether I should go grab customs instead.


----------



## ljokerl

nekromantik said:


> Thanks
> 
> Yeah the EPH100 is out of my range sadly. Its the one IEM I know will be good as everyone agrees about that.
> Have you heard the Sony H1s?


 
  
 I have not
  


sabsjl said:


> Hey joker. What about the sm64 compared to the 1964-v3? I'm thinking whether I should go grab customs instead.


 
  
 Different signatures - the SM64 is warmer and darker while the V3 is more v-shaped in comparison with more treble energy and sparkle. It also has more upper midrange presence (a good thing in my book) and more mid-bass presence (debatable benefit).


----------



## Sabsjl

ljokerl said:


> I have not
> 
> 
> Different signatures - the SM64 is warmer and darker while the V3 is more v-shaped in comparison with more treble energy and sparkle. It also has more upper midrange presence (a good thing in my book) and more mid-bass presence (debatable benefit).


 
  
 What about soundstage and clarity detail though? What do you think is best if I listen to mostly indie folk / accoustic stuff, and rock.


----------



## ljokerl

sabsjl said:


> What about soundstage and clarity detail though? What do you think is best if I listen to mostly indie folk / accoustic stuff, and rock.


 
  
 I personally prefer a more balanced sound with that type of music but if push came to shove the V3 would be my pick. The SM64 has a wider soundstage but the V3 has better depth/layering. Clarity is good on both but IMO the V3 has a slight upper hand in detail because its upper mids are more filled-in.


----------



## ookic

Hi! I was browsing the hot threads on Head-fi and saw a Xiaomi piston thread up around the #2 mark. I'm new to this site and don't know how this works, so is it just an FOTM? I can't find any reviews on it from you or ClieOS.
  
 (Same goes with the MartinLogan Mikros 90! The price looks so irresistible... and everyone on that thread says such good things about it... ;  -


----------



## Miedzcu

If is wrong place to put this message - forgive me, I am new. I have a question.It is a place somewhere where I can find a graph of the frequency response of Brainwavz M1? I have not found yet such a graph.


----------



## davidcotton

Hi Joker
  
 Just curious atm, which of the two 1964 ears the v6 and the v3 would you use for rock and metal straight out of an ipod classic?  Same question for the stagedivers 2 and 3.
  
 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

poopsockk said:


> Hi! I was browsing the hot threads on Head-fi and saw a Xiaomi piston thread up around the #2 mark. I'm new to this site and don't know how this works, so is it just an FOTM? I can't find any reviews on it from you or ClieOS.
> 
> (Same goes with the MartinLogan Mikros 90! The price looks so irresistible... and everyone on that thread says such good things about it... ;  -


 
  
 They’re pretty new and I haven’t personally tried them. I tried to get in touch with Xiaomi but I don’t speak Chinese so there’s a language barrier there.
  


miedzcu said:


> If is wrong place to put this message - forgive me, I am new. I have a question.It is a place somewhere where I can find a graph of the frequency response of Brainwavz M1? I have not found yet such a graph.


 
  
 I don’t think you’ll find one – they’re an old model and not too popular these days. The only place that *might* have one is goldenears but I’m not sure they’ve done any Brainwavz graphs. 
  


davidcotton said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Just curious atm, which of the two 1964 ears the v6 and the v3 would you use for rock and metal straight out of an ipod classic?  Same question for the stagedivers 2 and 3.
> 
> Thanks


 
  
The 1964-V6 (more balanced sound compared to the V3) and the StageDiver SD-2 (same reason).


----------



## Sabsjl

ljokerl said:


> I personally prefer a more balanced sound with that type of music but if push came to shove the V3 would be my pick. The SM64 has a wider soundstage but the V3 has better depth/layering. Clarity is good on both but IMO the V3 has a slight upper hand in detail because its upper mids are more filled-in.


 
 how about the Aurisonics ASG-2 vs the SM64?


----------



## Lukalop

If I took an acrylic IEM, say a JH13 Pro and shook it violently, would the sound tubes inside or anything break (assuming they were not connected to cables)?


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

*Upgrading from RE-400 ... shure SE535 LTD or InEar StageDriver 2? other?*
  
 This is a question for ljokerl or anyone familiar with the IEMs mentioned below, if you are kind to help me out on deciding the upgrade path to take.
  
 I have the RE-400 and also the Sony XBA-3i and I have been enjoying them for 1.5 years, but I am ready to upgrade to the next EIM with an clear improvement in SQ. Budget in the range of $400-$600 but I could go all the day to $1200. I am looking for a well balanced IEM that improves the sound signature of the RE-400 in the following areas (see below). Please note that most of te use will be on-the-go playing with iPhone 5 or future iphone 6 when I travel (don't link to carry amps, etc)
  
 1.- Improved soundstage: I like out of your head soundstage
 2.- Improved instrument separation and imaging: I love when the music has nuance to separate the instruments in 3D
 3.- Bigger bass slam, I don't necessarily need deep sub-bass but I love bass texture and impact without affecting other frequencies of the general tonality of the headphone
 4.- Extended highs, a bit more extended than the RE-400 but without going into the harsh and silvant highs, so needs to control the HF
 5.- Rapid dynamics (good PRaT): i listen to moderm music, mostly rock, indie, electronic, vocals, etc, so I need an IEM that can keep the fast pace as needed.
  
 Regarding the budget, I may consider even high end EIMs (e.g. Shure SE846) if everyone agrees that it is is a class clearly superior but I would rather try to be in the $400-$600 price range if feasible.
  
 I tested the Shure SE-535 Limited Edition (Red) and I liked it but it fails to have great highs. Still it is enjoyable juts feels overpriced for $550 in the USA.  Give the review from ljokerl on the InEar StageDriver 2, it seems that this IEM would be improving the RE in all the areas mentioned, but as I cannot test it, it is hard to make a decision.
  
 BTW, yesterday I had the chance to test the high end Shure SE846 and the AKG K3003i. I was utterly impressed by the Shure SE846 (with the white/bright filter on to enhance HF) more "real" sound that the AKG.  If it would be more comfortable I would have bought it on the spot. I was so impressed. The bass, kids are perfection, extremely well balanced EIM and very musical, more so that the AKG K3003i. 
  
 Thanks much for your advise.


----------



## suman134

mrguzmanwhite said:


> *Upgrading from RE-400 ... shure SE535 LTD or InEar StageDriver 2? other?*
> 
> This is a question for ljokerl or anyone familiar with the IEMs mentioned below, if you are kind to help me out on deciding the upgrade path to take.
> 
> ...


 

     that was exactly in my mind , i havent heard this but , yes , se846 as far as i know has a lower hunger for power with close to 15ohm , and imo its one of the best universal available in the market .


----------



## hobbyone

ljokerl said:


> They’re pretty new and I haven’t personally tried them. I tried to get in touch with Xiaomi but I don’t speak Chinese so there’s a language barrier there.


 
 Maybe you should buy it from your own money! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Which was the last IEM that you purchased, so it wasn't sent by the manufacturer or distributer?


----------



## steelglam

hobbyone said:


> Maybe you should buy it from your own money!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Wow.  Bite the hand that feeds much?
  
 You take what is by far the most extensive and quite possibly the most worthwhile IEM comparison in existence and crap all over it because of how they were obtained for trial listening?
  
 How in God's name would someone be able to compare 300+ IEM's for everyone if they had to purchase every last one of them on their own?  Sit back and ask yourself that question.
  
 I for one am thankful that ljokerl has a reputation as a solid, reliable, and objective reviewer of IEMs such that manufacturers are willing to send ones for trial listening.


----------



## suman134

hobbyone said:


> Maybe you should buy it from your own money!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
     its a bit hard man , if you like them so much , you should buy one , they have a nice feedback on them like being " better then any thing under $100 " , and i take these things with a spoon of salt , there is a review that says b&w c5 is one of the best iem you can buy , where is my salt bag .


----------



## Francisk

hobbyone said:


> Maybe you should buy it from your own money!
> 
> Which was the last IEM that you purchased, so it wasn't sent by the manufacturer or distributer?




Why should Joker purchase his own when he's helping the manufacturers to review and through that he's helping them. If I were one of the manufacturers I'll be more than glad to give Joker all my product so that he can introduce them to the whole world. To be honest I can't blame some people who are so jealous of Joker, I feel so sorry for them. You want to be treated like Joker then earn your respect and contribute like him.


----------



## Lukalop

Is it better to have hollow IEM shells or filled with acrylic as is tradition for fitear?
Also, what IEM had the best build quality. I often see IEMs in pictures with air bubbles in and they aren't polished. So far as far as I am concerned, fitear is the best at craftsmanship. The attention to detail is impeccable.


----------



## JuzModa

Is there a review for 535ltd??


----------



## ljokerl

sabsjl said:


> how about the Aurisonics ASG-2 vs the SM64?


 
  
 I haven't tried the ASG-2.
  


lukalop said:


> If I took an acrylic IEM, say a JH13 Pro and shook it violently, would the sound tubes inside or anything break (assuming they were not connected to cables)?


 
  
 Doubtful, these components don't weigh a whole lot so they should stay put, but I'm not going to try it. 
  


mrguzmanwhite said:


> *Upgrading from RE-400 ... shure SE535 LTD or InEar StageDriver 2? other?*
> 
> This is a question for ljokerl or anyone familiar with the IEMs mentioned below, if you are kind to help me out on deciding the upgrade path to take.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 I haven't tried the LTD edition of the SE535 but I was under the impression it should have improved highs compared to the regular SE535. 
 
Regarding the SD-2 vs RE-400, I don't really have anything to add to this bit from the SD-2 review:
 
 


> The SD-2 has a touch more bass than the RE-400, with the difference being more apparent in the subbass region. It is also clearer and slightly more resolving, and boasts more treble energy while still remaining extremely smooth and non-fatiguing, beating HiFiMan at their own game. The RE-400, on the other hand, has more forward mids and sounds a little too focused on its midrange. The soundstage of the RE-400 also appears a little too forward and flat next to the spacious and well-layered StageDiver.


 
 
Unfortunately I can’t comment on the SE846 as I haven’t tried it – that’s a real shame about the comfort if you really liked the sound. I do agree that the RE-400/SE535/SD-2 sound very different from the K3003 and the K3003 is not a good RE-400 upgrade.
  
  


hobbyone said:


> Maybe you should buy it from your own money!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Philips IEMs I bought last week.
  


lukalop said:


> Is it better to have hollow IEM shells or filled with acrylic as is tradition for fitear?
> Also, what IEM had the best build quality. I often see IEMs in pictures with air bubbles in and they aren't polished. So far as far as I am concerned, fitear is the best at craftsmanship. The attention to detail is impeccable.


 
  
You might want to ask average_joe this question - as far as I know none of my customs have a solid fill. Out of the CIEMs I have, the best cosmetic quality goes to Heir Audio and Noble. 
 


juzmoda said:


> Is there a review for 535ltd??


 
  
 I haven't tried them.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the HiSoundAudio BA100
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C61) HiSoundAudio BA100*
> 
> 
> Reviewed February 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall IEM ranking has been updated here.


----------



## suman134

i had higher hopes for ba100 , thanks for the review man .


----------



## suman134

i wonder if you have come across xba-c10 , they are really nice for $50  .


----------



## Nakanuku

Please please please please review Philips SHE3580....
 Im just soooooo curious about this earphone.
 I already have this earphone, i think it is good but not that good.. (i dont have good IEM to compare with)
  
 I want to buy iem with the price around $100, but I afraid that it will be worse than she3580 (Joe said it is even better than* ER-4P *which cost about $300)
  
 so pleasee review this earphone


----------



## MoonYeol

nakanuku said:


> Please please please please review Philips SHE3580....
> Im just soooooo curious about this earphone.
> I already have this earphone, i think it is good but not that good.. (i dont have good IEM to compare with)
> 
> ...




With heavy EQ I think.


----------



## suman134

nakanuku said:


> Please please please please review Philips SHE3580....
> Im just soooooo curious about this earphone.
> I already have this earphone, i think it is good but not that good.. (i dont have good IEM to compare with)
> 
> ...


 
  
     that is a hoax for me , she3580 is nothing but a good entry level phone , anything , anything like a ba does better then she 3580 . its not refined enough , not balanced enough , and its nothing against er-4p , its just that joe dont like er-p4 because of its lack of bass .


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> i had higher hopes for ba100 , thanks for the review man .


 
  
 It has promise and I may have been a touch harsh with the value score there at the current sub-$100 price, but some of the initial launch claims were a bit too lofty.
  


suman134 said:


> i wonder if you have come across xba-c10 , they are really nice for $50  .


 
  
 Never tried them. Wonder if they use a different driver from the XBA-1, which is priced similarly and sounded pretty decent.
  


nakanuku said:


> Please please please please review Philips SHE3580....
> Im just soooooo curious about this earphone.
> I already have this earphone, i think it is good but not that good.. (i dont have good IEM to compare with)
> 
> ...


 
  
 I think Joe listens to it with his custom equalizer settings which will give a very different experience than just using the stock configuration. Depending on what you're looking for in comparison, an upgrade to a stock 3580 can be as inexpensive as the $50 VSonic VC02.


----------



## Nakanuku

suman134 said:


> that is a hoax for me , she3580 is nothing but a good entry level phone , anything , anything like a ba does better then she 3580 . its not refined enough , not balanced enough , and its nothing against er-4p , its just that joe dont like er-p4 because of its lack of bass .


 
 But many other people also praise she 3580?
  
 Quote:


moonyeol said:


> With heavy EQ I think.


 
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> I think Joe listens to it with his custom equalizer settings which will give a very different experience than just using the stock configuration. Depending on what you're looking for in comparison, an upgrade to a stock 3580 can be as inexpensive as the $50 VSonic VC02.


 
  
 I have always used she3590 without any custom equalizer, this was mainly because joe said that his brother prefers the stock one (beside I am too lazy to use equalizer). That's why it will be very nice if you can review she 3580/90 (with and without EQ), i guess it will satisfy many members' curiosity 
  
 About your suggestion, how it compares to Vsonic VSD1S? It costs almost the same, and I like classical music.
 I'm also thinking about Sony MH1C, since it has many useful buttons. How far is the difference in the sound quality? Do you think the "buttons" worth the loss in sound quality?
  
 thanks!


----------



## suman134

nakanuku said:


>


 
  
     not me , if i have to chose between rp-hje120 or she3580 , i will go with rp-hje120 , she has stiffer cable , and bad microphonics and not as defined as hje120 , if a hje 120 can beat it , think what a vsd1 will do to it .
     and what is your requirement ? you want bass ? more mids ( 3580 is v shaped ) ? get the first upgrade like ha-fx40 for as less as 20$ and write back ( its heavily v shaped ) .


----------



## tan1415

ljokerl said:


> Added the HiSoundAudio BA100
> 
> 
> The overall IEM ranking has been updated here.


 
 Wow this is a first that my views on the IEM is so different from yours. Hisound has compared it as a multiple armature beater. So i compared it with the Qjays.
 To me it has pretty big with regard to (mid)bass...while the mids and treble was rather harsh. While the Qjays sounded more balanced and smoother.
 The thump was quite surprising for a BA iem tbh.
 Quite opposite to your views. Can Ia sk which tips you listened too? And how you connected it?


----------



## ljokerl

nakanuku said:


> About your suggestion, how it compares to Vsonic VSD1S? It costs almost the same, and I like classical music. I'm also thinking about Sony MH1C, since it has many useful buttons. How far is the difference in the sound quality? Do you think the "buttons" worth the loss in sound quality? thanks!


 
  
 It really depends on what you're after. The VC02 is brighter, clearer, and more balanced while the VSD1S has more bass and a more v-shaped sound signature. The MH1C is bassier, warmer, and smoother than both these. They are all about on-par with each other in sound quality, just different signatures. Keep in mind also that the MH1C remote only fully works with certain Sony Xperia devices. 
  


tan1415 said:


> Wow this is a first that my views on the IEM is so different from yours. Hisound has compared it as a multiple armature beater. So i compared it with the Qjays.
> To me it has pretty big with regard to (mid)bass...while the mids and treble was rather harsh. While the Qjays sounded more balanced and smoother.
> The thump was quite surprising for a BA iem tbh.
> Quite opposite to your views. Can Ia sk which tips you listened too? And how you connected it?


 
  
 I don't understand, are you saying the BA100 is better than the q-JAYS? I did note that the BA100 was harsh/edgy at the top and I really don't think it's nearly as good as a q-JAYS.
  
 I used the BA100 with generic single-flanges on the outer notch with several sources including the HM-901 with IEM card and Minibox card (my favorite).


----------



## Nakanuku

ljokerl said:


> It really depends on what you're after. The VC02 is brighter, clearer, and more balanced while the VSD1S has more bass and a more v-shaped sound signature. The MH1C is bassier, warmer, and smoother than both these. They are all about on-par with each other in sound quality, just different signatures. Keep in mind also that the MH1C remote only fully works with certain Sony Xperia devices.




I dont really understand those sound sinagtures,sorry for being so noob. Within that price range, can you just tell me which IEM is best for classical music,(symphony, violin, and especially piano, i love Chopin), anime songs, frank sinatra (songs that focus more on the voice of the singer, without heavy background music)

Thank you for the remainder, as I look up about it, Mh1c remote does not suit with my nexus 4.

Thanks!!


----------



## heart banger-97

Hi IjokerI!
 Have you heard Sennheiser CX 300 II ? Can you give me a brief comparison between that and Yamaha eph-50?
  
 Thanks


----------



## suman134

heart banger-97 said:


> Hi IjokerI!
> Have you heard Sennheiser CX 300 II ? Can you give me a brief comparison between that and Yamaha eph-50?
> 
> Thanks


 

 both are bad options ., if you are after bass you can go for ha-fx1x for as cheap as $10 or you can opt for ha-fx40 for $25 .


----------



## suman134

nakanuku said:


> I dont really understand those sound sinagtures,sorry for being so noob. Within that price range, can you just tell me which IEM is best for classical music,(symphony, violin, and especially piano, i love Chopin), anime songs, frank sinatra (songs that focus more on the voice of the singer, without heavy background music)
> 
> Thank you for the remainder, as I look up about it, Mh1c remote does not suit with my nexus 4.
> 
> Thanks!!


 

 you can go with vsd1/s , they are over ear .


----------



## suman134

joker , i wonder how much will you give the xba-1 for its sound quality .


----------



## Lukalop

Need to ask you all an important question. Nowadays technology wise, everything is evolving rapidly. Computers at least double their speed each year, get upgraded with better more efficient chips, as well as high resolution screens along with improved battery life. In 5 years from now they will be at least 32 times as fast as they are today (2*2*2*2*2=32) and there are likely to be even more advanced technological breakthroughs, maybe even holographic displays, who knows.

As for speakers, have we (as in manufacturers) yet to scratch the surface in terms of innovation and advancement i.e will audio equipment have improved in 5 years the same way computers will or have the concepts of acoustics in producing sound already been firmly grasped and there is only room left for minor improvement. Are advancements in sound dynamics incremental (i.e JH Freqphase) or is the relatively new Freqphase addition revolutionary? Plus, maybe IEMs or headphones are outperforming the other?

To summarise, are speakers constantly improving with time or have the limits of reproducing sound quality already been reached?


----------



## suman134

lukalop said:


> Need to ask you all an important question. Nowadays technology wise, everything is evolving rapidly. Computers at least double their speed each year, get upgraded with better more efficient chips, as well as high resolution screens along with improved battery life. In 5 years from now they will be at least 32 times as fast as they are today (2*2*2*2*2=32) and there are likely to be even more advanced technological breakthroughs, maybe even holographic displays, who knows.
> 
> As for speakers, have we (as in manufacturers) yet to scratch the surface in terms of innovation and advancement i.e will audio equipment have improved in 5 years the same way computers will or have the concepts of acoustics in producing sound already been firmly grasped and there is only room left for minor improvement. Are advancements in sound dynamics incremental (i.e JH Freqphase) or is the relatively new Freqphase addition revolutionary? Plus, maybe IEMs or headphones are outperforming the other?
> 
> To summarise, are speakers constantly improving with time or have the limits of reproducing sound quality already been reached?


 
  
      may be we dont have much space and may be we dont know how to set a better target , it will improve but not like computer's processing power ( is it multiplying like that ? ) ?


----------



## Lukalop

Mad headphone inventory bro! How old are you.


----------



## suman134

asking me ?


----------



## Lukalop

Yes, have you bought all of these:


sennheiser , cx 400 , cx 175 , cx200 , cx 270 , hd 449 , hd 408 , hd 203 , hd 238 , hd 201 , hd 280 , cx215 .
philips she 3680 , 3570 , 3580 , 3590 (2nos) , 9620 , 6000 , 9550 , 9700 , 9800 , she 8500 . shh4507 , shq1000 , she2640 , she 3500 . she 9850 (2 nos )
denon ahc-260 , denon ah-d320 , ah-c100 .
jbl tempo inear , j88 , j55 
jvc hafx 40 ( 2nos )
klipsch s3 , 
ultimate ears , 600 , 400/500 , 350 , 200 , 700 , 
sony xb21ex , xb41ex , xba-3 ( 2nos ) , ex220lp , mdr-ma100 , ex10lp , ex60lp , sony zx-700 , xb30ex , xb90ex . xb-400 .
meelec m9 , m6 , cw31 , cc51p , 
soundmagic e30 ( 2nos ) , pl21 , pl11 , es18 , es10 , e10 . pl50 .
cowon ce-1 . em1 
creative ep 630 , ep 600 . 
philips o'neill snug (sho8800) , and stretch ( sho 9560 ) . slh3000 , slh1000 . sho3300 , the bend .
panasonic rp-hje-120 , rp-hje-355 , rp-ht-030 . hje-240 . hje-140 , hje-123 .
pny midtown ,
audio technica ath-sj55 .
steel series siberia .
memorex eb300 , eb110 , 1e400 ( 3nos )
tdk mt300 .
shure srh-440 , sony XBA-H1 

sennheiser hd 380 pro

audiotechnica ath-m50

etymotic research er-4p

How are you affording all this?


----------



## suman134

lukalop said:


> Yes, have you bought all of these:
> 
> 
> sennheiser , cx 400 , cx 175 , cx200 , cx 270 , hd 449 , hd 408 , hd 203 , hd 238 , hd 201 , hd 280 , cx215 .
> ...


 

  i have no other passions and its difficult here in india , people , most of the people dont understand , they can buy clothes , my gf has 60-70 pair of clothes , all branded , but they cant take this , i like , in fact i cant live with out headphones , its just out of curiosity i brought these , my family is not aware of this , the day they will come to know about my spending , they will force me to get a better job .
  
  and im 25 .


----------



## ljokerl

nakanuku said:


> I dont really understand those sound sinagtures,sorry for being so noob. Within that price range, can you just tell me which IEM is best for classical music,(symphony, violin, and especially piano, i love Chopin), anime songs, frank sinatra (songs that focus more on the voice of the singer, without heavy background music)
> 
> Thank you for the remainder, as I look up about it, Mh1c remote does not suit with my nexus 4.
> 
> Thanks!!


 
  
 It's quite difficult to recommend an IEM going only my the music genres you listen to - even among listeners of a single genre there are different preferences. Example: some love the Etymotic ER4 for classical while others claim that it can't possibly reproduce the sound of a contrabass with sufficient authority.
  
 I think the VSonic VC02 would be a very good introduction to balanced sound, if you can deal with its somewhat annoying cables. 
  


heart banger-97 said:


> Hi IjokerI!
> Have you heard Sennheiser CX 300 II ? Can you give me a brief comparison between that and Yamaha eph-50?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 I haven't tried the mkII CX300. From what I understand it should be very similar to the old CX400, but I haven't tried that either.
  


suman134 said:


> joker , i wonder how much will you give the xba-1 for its sound quality .


 
  
 I only had a short audition with it and brought just my Meelec A161P and VSonic GR07 for comparisons, nothing in the $50 price range. I thought it sounded pretty good but not as good as either of those.


----------



## ozkan

nakanuku said:


> I dont really understand those sound sinagtures,sorry for being so noob. Within that price range, can you just tell me which IEM is best for classical music,(symphony, violin, and especially piano, i love Chopin), anime songs, frank sinatra (songs that focus more on the voice of the singer, without heavy background music)
> 
> Thank you for the remainder, as I look up about it, Mh1c remote does not suit with my nexus 4.
> 
> Thanks!!


 
 I recommend buying Audio Technica IM70 which focuses more on the vocals and has a special timbre on accoustic instruments.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> I only had a short audition with it and brought just my Meelec A161P and VSonic GR07 for comparisons, nothing in the $50 price range. I thought it sounded pretty good but not as good as either of those.


 
  
     obviously , xba-3 also dont compare to gr07 , i have a question , its not supposed to be here but , does ath m50 need an amp ?


----------



## higbvuyb

suman134 said:


> does ath m50 need an amp ?


 
 Generally no. It's pretty sensitive.


----------



## suman134

higbvuyb said:


> Generally no. It's pretty sensitive.


 
  
    thanks , after 15hrs , its not what i thought it would be , im gona pit it against srh440 and hd 380 pro .


----------



## Bobby S

Joker, just want to say thanks for all your dedication.
 This thread is probably the no.1 reference when it comes to buying IEMs all over the internet.
 We appreciate your work man!


----------



## Lukalop

Indeed


----------



## SebsG

What would be something good for electronic music, rap, hip hop, pop, generally popular/new songs?
I suffer from extreme buyers remorse, so I have yet to buy anything hi-fi in my time on the forum (less than 2 months). I can't event get a comfortable fit with IEM's, but then I bought a cheap pair of Sony 'phones and they had the hybrids on them... Needless to say, I loved the fit and kept the tips after they broke (dog...).
I've heard good things about the 8320's, GR06's, and R04's (regular/basic edition)
If you didn't really understand the music genres, my soundcloud is - 
https://soundcloud.com/sebsg 

Although, I have been posting much more electronic than vocals recently, but I still want something good for vocals
Another thing is, can someone explain the terms for soundstage? (Width, depth, height, etc)
From what I understand, another thing I want is depth in soundstage.

Budget? Less than $50 USD

Your Soon to be Head-Fi'er,
Sebs


----------



## Gandasaputra

ljokerl said:


> I only had a short audition with it and brought just my Meelec A161P and VSonic GR07 for comparisons, nothing in the $50 price range. I thought it sounded pretty good but not as good as either of those.


 
 XBA-1 costs like 20-25 bucks in amazon, sir! (includes the shipping). I love XBA-1...I am exalted with its combination of non-fatiguing,comfort, and isolation, when applied with V-moda medium tips.


----------



## ljokerl

bobby s said:


> Joker, just want to say thanks for all your dedication.
> This thread is probably the no.1 reference when it comes to buying IEMs all over the internet.
> We appreciate your work man!


 
  
 Thank you, glad the thread has been useful!
  


gandasaputra said:


> XBA-1 costs like 20-25 bucks in amazon, sir! (includes the shipping). I love XBA-1...I am exalted with its combination of non-fatiguing,comfort, and isolation, when applied with V-moda medium tips.


 
  
 Yeah, that's an impressively low price. Don't know of any cheaper BAs except maybe the Knowles SR-based Altec Lansing ones when they're on sale.


----------



## Lukalop

Are two pin connectors durable or is an mmcx connector preferable? I am concerned that they don't have a locking mechanism and may detach with sudden movement, I am not fond if the Roxanne's proprietary connector as it is harder to get aftermarket cables, if there are any. What are your thoughts?


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, that's an impressively low price. Don't know of any cheaper BAs except maybe the Knowles SR-based Altec Lansing ones when they're on sale.


 
 she 9850 was on sale here for $17 , i grabbed one .


----------



## scootsit

Weren't you looking for a pair of the standard Samsung iems? I have a pair that came with my S3, I can send them your way, if you want.


----------



## kova4a

suman134 said:


> she 9850 was on sale here for $17 , i grabbed one .


 
 That's a nice iem - I liked it a lot and for 17 bucks it's a steal


----------



## H20Fidelity

kova4a said:


> That's a nice iem - I liked it a lot and for 17 bucks it's a steal




I also quite enjoyed SHE9700, I went on a little obsession with them for a few days. Like anything head-fi related though it was short lived.


----------



## goodvibes

Hey Joker. I agree with your take on the BA100. If you still have them, give a quick listen with a a few of your double flange tips pushed all the way down. The right one can take them up a notch.


----------



## kova4a

h20fidelity said:


> I also quite enjoyed SHE9700, I went on a little obsession with them for a few days. Like anything head-fi related though it was short lived.


 
 Well, I honestly enjoyed the she9850 for quite a long period and I had a lot more expensive iems at the time. It was my gym iem for close to a year and the only reason I still don't own it is because I lent it to a friend and he lost it as usual. Anyway, she9850 is a pretty decent single BA iem - mid-centric, warm and sweet sounding with a bit of the shure house sound to it. It does lack some extension on both ends, especially the treble, which rolls off early and makes the sound slightly dark and low on sparkle but I would buy it any day of the week for 17 bucks.


----------



## suman134

kova4a said:


> Well, I honestly enjoyed the she9850 for quite a long period and I had a lot more expensive iems at the time. It was my gym iem for close to a year and the only reason I still don't own it is because I lent it to a friend and he lost it as usual. Anyway, she9850 is a pretty decent single BA iem - mid-centric, warm and sweet sounding with a bit of the shure house sound to it. It does lack some extension on both ends, especially the treble, which rolls off early and makes the sound slightly dark and low on sparkle but I would buy it any day of the week for 17 bucks.


 
  
       exactly , bass is nice , everything is fine but its just not refined , the ue 600 is more refined . better then pl50 though . comes with a nice carry pouch , cable is s a bit noisy though and it comes with a cable clip . these are my two .


----------



## kova4a

suman134 said:


> exactly , bass is nice , everything is fine but its just not refined , the ue 600 is more refined . better then pl50 though . comes with a nice carry pouch , cable is s a bit noisy though and it comes with a cable clip . these are my two .


 
 I remember mine came with a metal slide case and also comply t100 was included in the package 

 Definitely preferred the sound with comply tips or shure olives.


----------



## suman134

kova4a said:


> I remember mine came with a metal slide case and also comply t100 was included in the package
> 
> Definitely preferred the sound with comply tips or shure olives.


 

 i use olivers , you can see them on my " being used one " , i love them with comply . and yeah , i would have loved that metal case .


----------



## tan1415

ljokerl said:


> I don't understand, are you saying the BA100 is better than the q-JAYS? I did note that the BA100 was harsh/edgy at the top and I really don't think it's nearly as good as a q-JAYS.
> 
> I used the BA100 with generic single-flanges on the outer notch with several sources including the HM-901 with IEM card and Minibox card (my favorite).


 
  oops misread your review.To me the Qjays was way way better.  
 Have not compared them to other BA iem.


----------



## Lukalop

I know it's a big ask, but does anyone know of an IEM that compnd quallity competes with the STAX SR-009 sound quality wise, or have we yet to advance that far with BA drivers? Obviously soundstage will not be fair to compare, so excluding this, what IEMs out there come close to the SR-009 or possibly even best it?


----------



## modulor

lukalop said:


> I know it's a big ask, but does anyone know of an IEM that compnd quallity competes with the STAX SR-009 sound quality wise, or have we yet to advance that far with BA drivers? Obviously soundstage will not be fair to compare, so excluding this, what IEMs out there come close to the SR-009 or possibly even best it?


 
 I think the short answer is going to be no, however this is something that should be expected due to the inherent limitations of IEMs.  That doesn't mean there aren't some phenomenal sounding IEMs out there that best full sized headphones, nor does it meant that the SR-009 is the best sounding headphone in existence (subjective opinions will greatly differ from person to person).  A good place to start reading into this would be David Mahler's 'Battle of the Flagships' thread, where he discusses current and former flagship headphones and IEMs and pits them against one another:
  
http://www.head-fi.org/t/634201/battle-of-the-flagships-58-headphones-compared-update-audeze-lcd-2-revision-2-6-4-13
  
 The general consensus is that his impressions are relatively spot on, and I would say that is so for the most part for those on the list I've gotten to try.  There are a few that aren't technically flagships, so those are an additional point of reference.


----------



## ljokerl

lukalop said:


> Are two pin connectors durable or is an mmcx connector preferable? I am concerned that they don't have a locking mechanism and may detach with sudden movement, I am not fond if the Roxanne's proprietary connector as it is harder to get aftermarket cables, if there are any. What are your thoughts?


 
  
 I haven't had a problem with either type of connector except for the very early Shure units that had defective MMCX F-connectors. I've had both types detach under stress, which is better than if they didn't detach and the cable snapped instead. 
  


scootsit said:


> Weren't you looking for a pair of the standard Samsung iems? I have a pair that came with my S3, I can send them your way, if you want.


 
  
 If those are the white ones that Samsung also sells separately I wanted to give them a quick listen, yes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
  


goodvibes said:


> Hey Joker. I agree with your take on the BA100. If you still have them, give a quick listen with a a few of your double flange tips pushed all the way down. The right one can take them up a notch.


 
  
 That works for me to but not really better than the singles. I think the nozzle ending being so near the outlet of the bi-flanges doesn't work well with my ear canals. Maybe I'm trying to insert them too far..
  


lukalop said:


> I know it's a big ask, but does anyone know of an IEM that compnd quallity competes with the STAX SR-009 sound quality wise, or have we yet to advance that far with BA drivers? Obviously soundstage will not be fair to compare, so excluding this, what IEMs out there come close to the SR-009 or possibly even best it?


 
  
 I wish. Even the Stax IEMs sound pretty lackluster next to the SR-009.


----------



## scootsit

scootsit said:


> Weren't you looking for a pair of the standard Samsung iems? I have a pair that came with my S3, I can send them your way, if you want.




"If those are the white ones that Samsung also sells separately I wanted to give them a quick listen, yes " 


I think I still have your address, I'll send them off next week.


----------



## eke2k6

lukalop said:


> I know it's a big ask, but does anyone know of an IEM that compnd quallity competes with the STAX SR-009 sound quality wise, or have we yet to advance that far with BA drivers? Obviously soundstage will not be fair to compare, so excluding this, what IEMs out there come close to the SR-009 or possibly even best it?


 
  
 Like the others said, No. 
  
 But the Tralucent 1plus2 somewhat approximates the overall character of the SR-009. The Stax obviously transcends, but see if you can demo the 1plus2.


----------



## ljokerl

scootsit said:


> "If those are the white ones that Samsung also sells separately I wanted to give them a quick listen, yes
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks very much 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Might not do a full review but they seem like they're definitely at least worth hearing. Quite a few people have said that budget aftermarket IEMs aren't really an improvement over those. 
  


listenon said:


> Are you going to review the senn ie800s?


 
  
 I wrote one over at InnerFidelity here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor . Haven't had a chance to transfer it over to this thread yet.


----------



## MoonYeol

scootsit said:


> scootsit said:
> 
> 
> > Weren't you looking for a pair of the standard Samsung iems? I have a pair that came with my S3, I can send them your way, if you want.
> ...




The headset got reworked from GS3 to GS4. Just know that. The GS4 headset that's the DD one is ok but faaaar from the quality of MH1C. But the price comparison isn't really fair anyway. I think it sounds... well less crappy and decent at the price with comply tips (Ts400 stretched a bit or Ts500 should fit). They take away some of the harshness in the upper mids that I found kind of killed my ears. I think that Rin Choi stated that despite being marketed as having powerful bass, all you would hear was lower treble.

TLDR; GS3 was shipped with the old headset. GS4 ships with the dual dynamic one. To my ears it sounds ok with comply tips at the internet price but far from MH1C.


----------



## SebsG

What does warm and smooth/sweet mean?


----------



## Lukalop

Warm





sebsg said:


> What does warm and smooth/sweet mean?




Warm means there is an emphasis in the bass/mid-bass region. Smooth is the liquidity of the sound, rather to understand further as it is quite difficult to describe.

A roadworks drill would be classified as a very dry sound, as it alternates between two positions (up and down). This is similar to a speaker on a very basic level in that the speaker is also vibrating, however not between two places (in and out) but many points in between. The more levels (points in between) the smoother the sound. It is similar to how if you raise your hand above water and smack it as hard as you can, it is almost as if there are no levels in between, the hand moves (up to down) like with a road drill and creates a very sharp dry sound (although the water is wet, but that's not the point). If this is done slowly however it is like having more levels on a speaker diaphragm. And the sound is smooth as the hand slowly pushes the water in very much the same way a speaker does air.

I would advise to have a look at the definitions section here on head fi if you still don't understand, but for me an analogy always helps.


----------



## ljokerl

listenon said:


> I'm quite curious to see your number reviews Haha


 
  
 Sound-wise it's a little better than the Ultrasone IQ reviewed in this thread, but I was a little disappointed with the cable noise and the inability to wear them over-the-ear so they don't rank too high up the chart.
  


moonyeol said:


> The headset got reworked from GS3 to GS4. Just know that. The GS4 headset that's the DD one is ok but faaaar from the quality of MH1C. But the price comparison isn't really fair anyway. I think it sounds... well less crappy and decent at the price with comply tips (Ts400 stretched a bit or Ts500 should fit). They take away some of the harshness in the upper mids that I found kind of killed my ears. I think that Rin Choi stated that despite being marketed as having powerful bass, all you would hear was lower treble.
> 
> TLDR; GS3 was shipped with the old headset. GS4 ships with the dual dynamic one. To my ears it sounds ok with comply tips at the internet price but far from MH1C.


 
  
 Good to know! Still should make for a good starting point for GS3 owners seeking an upgrade.
  
  


sebsg said:


> What does warm and smooth/sweet mean?


 

  
 On a basic level, warm usually just means emphasized at the low end and smooth usually just refers to a lack of peaks in the frequency response or lack of grain, distortion, and "sharpness" which is what Lukalop's analogy is describing. Over time you stop thinking of the definitions of these terms and just "hear" them as the sum of their parts, which is actually pretty hard to describe (I won't try - maybe someone more literary-minded can).


----------



## Tamirci

Thanks for this most useful review thread.

I just wanted to know your suggestion for a true upgrade over TDK Ba200 and Ath im02.
İm02 sounds just the way I love but its fit is a little problem for me and so I am searching a better fitting iem (and better in every aspects) budget is around 600 usd.

Thanks

Ps: here is the original question

Though I love that Ath im02 sound, I know I'll move to a better one in the future.
How im02 sounds: Bright, clear, mid forward, spacious, fast and puchy, sufficent bass for even Dubstep on armatures.
Source: dx50

Anything you can recommend?


----------



## Lukalop

From what I understand so far, IEMs in the £1000 + region can effortlessly vastly outperform full sized headphones or even speakers for that matter. But how do the sub 500 compare? i.e W4R & SE535?


----------



## rawrster

vastly outperform? Where did you hear that from. I have yet to hear any custom that does that to any totl headphone.


----------



## suman134

lukalop said:


> From what I understand so far, IEMs in the £1000 + region can effortlessly vastly outperform full sized headphones or even speakers for that matter. But how do the sub 500 compare? i.e W4R & SE535?


 
  
     i too doubt that , out doing a hd600 is difficult , iems can only dream of that sound stage . and you cant compare iems with full headphones of upper mid range .


----------



## Lukalop

I know soundstage wise there is no comparison, but in other areas IEMs, especially CIEMs are strong contenders. BA drivers are notorious for their detail retrievel. I remember reading in a review on another website they were comparing Spiral Ear SE-5Way to an LCD-3 and said that it outperformed it in all areas with the exception of soundstage. Unless that was complete bs then it sounds like quite a feat considering the LCD-3 is Audeze's TOTL headphone, as is the SE-5Way though.


----------



## eccom

suman134 said:


> i too doubt that , out doing a hd600 is difficult , iems can only dream of that sound stage . and you cant compare iems with full headphones of upper mid range .




Now you're comparing open headphones to iems. A hd600 and an ie80 have a similar stage size to me. They both suck at isolation. 

A closed headphone with good isolation stages similar to my best closed iems. Bass impact aside - it's important to compare similar usage capability as well as technical ability.

Example: my re-400 gives more 3d staging than my focal spirit pro. Width is the same but the re-400 have more black space IMO.


----------



## Lukalop

Here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/594426/mini-review-audeze-lcd-3-vs-lcd-2-r2-sr-007-et-al
Search for where it talks about JH13. Just so you know, this wasn't the article I was referring to. Just happened to stumble upon this now.


----------



## eccom

lukalop said:


> Here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/594426/mini-review-audeze-lcd-3-vs-lcd-2-r2-sr-007-et-al
> Search for where it talks about JH13. Just so you know, this wasn't the article I was referring to. Just happened to stumble upon this now.


 
 Am I blind or searching wrong.... I find ony one paragraph where it mentions the jh13 and there is no comparison other that just motioning the CIEM?


----------



## Lukalop

I don't mean he compares it but just to prove a point that it was ranked among his favourite full sized headphones which shows it is a strong contender.


----------



## 177261

Inear Soundstage 2 or Shure SE535 which one? After a neutral sound with good mids.


----------



## opis

Hey Joker, your guide is amazing! I need help with some more sturdy IEM's though. I had Silver Bullets, loved the bang for the buck so much that when the first pair broke I bought a second pair but they broke as well after about a year. Thing is I have a fairly active lifestyle, I travel around and do climbing etc. So while the Bullets were great in their bracket they're just way too fragile for me. So I was wondering:
  
 Can you (or anyone else) recommend any IEM's that are more durable? I am thinking woven cord and a sturdy strain relief or something but I don't know anything about this stuff. I guess I am looking for 'Bullet' sound quality or better if possible.. I really appreciated their clarity and detail level, I listen to wacky, experimental progressive stuff in various genres from metal to jazz to electronic music and just love being able to hear every detail as well as feel the dimensions and space/room (sound stage?).
  
 Budget range is around $150 give or take $50.


----------



## ljokerl

tamirci said:


> Thanks for this most useful review thread.
> 
> I just wanted to know your suggestion for a true upgrade over TDK Ba200 and Ath im02.
> İm02 sounds just the way I love but its fit is a little problem for me and so I am searching a better fitting iem (and better in every aspects) budget is around 600 usd.
> ...


 
  
 I haven't tried the IM02 so I'm not sure what it sounds like. What are you looking for in comparison to the BA200?
  
 From reading your description it sounds like a Sony EX1000 but the fit on those doesn't work for everyone and they might be hard to find these days.
  


christianh said:


> Inear Soundstage 2 or Shure SE535 which one? After a neutral sound with good mids.


 
  
 Either I guess. The SD-2 is definitely a little warm of neutral but I like it quite a bit. 
  


opis said:


> Hey Joker, your guide is amazing! I need help with some more sturdy IEM's though. I had Silver Bullets, loved the bang for the buck so much that when the first pair broke I bought a second pair but they broke as well after about a year. Thing is I have a fairly active lifestyle, I travel around and do climbing etc. So while the Bullets were great in their bracket they're just way too fragile for me. So I was wondering:
> 
> Can you (or anyone else) recommend any IEM's that are more durable? I am thinking woven cord and a sturdy strain relief or something but I don't know anything about this stuff. I guess I am looking for 'Bullet' sound quality or better if possible.. I really appreciated their clarity and detail level, I listen to wacky, experimental progressive stuff in various genres from metal to jazz to electronic music and just love being able to hear every detail as well as feel the dimensions and space/room (sound stage?).
> 
> Budget range is around $150 give or take $50.


 
  
 Dunu earphones tend to be pretty tough and the DN1000 sounds very good. It's at the upper end of your price range though. 
  
 The JVC FXT90 was pretty well-made and reminds me of the Silver Bullet in some ways, but sounds better overall. It's $100-ish. 
  
 The Shure SE215 is not really an upgrade in sound quality compared to the Silver Bullet but it's well-made and has detachable cables so if something goes wrong with the cord (as it often does) you just replace the cord. Lastly, the ATH-CKM500 is comparable in sound (albeit quite a bit bassier than the Silver Bullet), cheaper, and should be pretty durable as well. 
  
 P.S. keep in mind that it might be more cost effective to replace a $60 IEM every year than to buy a $200 one and replace it after two years.


----------



## Lukalop

Is it possible to get an electrostatic IEM? I ask because the frequency response is apparently completely neutral. If not now maybe somewhere down the line?


----------



## SebsG

I think im gonna get the 9927's, they're just the 8320's in black right? They seem like the best option for me, but it's definitely gonna be an upgrade from my current iems because their cable is broken and I have to move it around to get sound. 

And thanks Joker for your defication to this thread.


----------



## esteebin

sebsg said:


> I think im gonna get the 9927's, they're just the 8320's in black right? They seem like the best option for me, but it's definitely gonna be an upgrade from my current iems because their cable is broken and I have to move it around to get sound.
> 
> And thanks Joker for your *defication* to this thread.


 
  
 Defication???
 I'll assume dedication...
  
 Anyways:
  
 What will you be upgrading from?

 Have you checked this?
http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-headphones-under-30/
  
 I got both the 9927 (previous choice for under $30) and the Panasonic RP-TCM125 (current) and both sound very good. My only problem with the 9927 is the comfort. The housing size was too big for my ear. The cable was tangle prone.
  
 The TCM125 has a mic and a single button, better cable and with 90 degree angle plug.


----------



## modulor

lukalop said:


> Is it possible to get an electrostatic IEM? I ask because the frequency response is apparently completely neutral. If not now maybe somewhere down the line?


 
 The only that exist to my knowledge are those from Stax, the SR-001, 002, and 003 which I believe are all still in production.  The SR-002 is the only one that comes with a portable amp and it is the latest in their 'in-ear' lineup so you may want to read up on them.  Of the reviews I've read and measurements I've seen, they are said to be soft on both ends, perhaps not the best extension...warm and smooth signature.  So, depending on what sound you're after they could be a good fit...but technically speaking it doesn't seem up to spec with modern dynamic and BA IEMs.  Those looking specifically for a e-stat sound, this is pretty much the only portable option.  Also note they are open back, so isolation is going to be pretty low.
  
http://www.headfonia.com/baby-stax-take-2-stax-sr-002/
  
 Also, there are some measurements out there on both the SR-002 and SR-003 on various reviewer sites.


----------



## SebsG

esteebin said:


> Defication???
> I'll assume dedication...
> 
> Anyways:
> ...



I'm upgrading from some cheap IEM's from iHip, they are gold and I believe are made of aluminum. And I looked at the differences between the 9927 and the TCM125, and the panasonics look compelling, but I think I'll still be getting the 9927's. But, hey. What's the worst that could happen? I lose $10, or I have something to sell/give to my friends. 

P.S. I did mean dedication  lol


----------



## ljokerl

kl500 said:


> Hisound BA100 is discounted in China to $16!! So, using Taobao agents, it could be purchased for about $25.
> http://s.taobao.com/search?initiative_id=staobaoz_20140312&js=1&q=ba100&stats_click=search_radio_all%3A1
> Value 10, isn't it?


 
  
 Sure that's a genuine HiSound unit and not a knockoff with dynamic drivers? That’s pretty cheap for a BA earphone in general, never mind one that’s not on the lowest rung of the BA ladder.
  


lukalop said:


> Is it possible to get an electrostatic IEM? I ask because the frequency response is apparently completely neutral. If not now maybe somewhere down the line?


 
  
 I tried out a set of STAX SR-003mkII IEMs at CES this year. They were pretty good and had a very airy sound but I wouldn't say they are miles ahead of conventional IEMs in a similar price range, See here: http://theheadphonelist.com/ces-2014-headphone-coverage-part-2-audio-technica-stax-beyerdynamic-and-more/ 
  


sebsg said:


> I think im gonna get the 9927's, they're just the 8320's in black right? They seem like the best option for me, but it's definitely gonna be an upgrade from my current iems because their cable is broken and I have to move it around to get sound.
> 
> And thanks Joker for your defication to this thread.


 
  
Funny typo.
 
Yes, the 9927 should be just a black version of the 8320.


----------



## Gandasaputra

esteebin said:


> Have you checked this?
> http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-headphones-under-30/


 
 The author should've asked joker to be part of the IEM testing 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 but if I were there, my vote's on Philips SHE3590 hands down.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a short introduction to Bluetooth audio technology here: http://theheadphonelist.com/wireless-fidelity-making-sense-bluetooth-headphone-technology/
  
 I tried doing a bit of research on Bluetooth headphones last week and couldn't find what I needed in one place. I spent a few days piecing it all together from various sources and eventually decided to pool all the info in what I hope is a digestible format. Perhaps it will help those who are as clueless as I was get up to speed on the technologies, challenges, and limitations of Bluetooth audio


----------



## HeadHoncho

Hey Joker,
  
 I had been using a pair of VSonic GR02 Bass Edition IEMs for near about 2 years, and I loved them. Then the biflange tips fell off somewhere and they weren't the same again, and then they gave up on me completely, and I got a set of HiSound Wooduo 2 as a replacement/apparent upgrade. They are good, but I really did not like them that much. The bass is good, but covers a lot of the other frequencies. So now I was in the process of researching and procuring another set of IEMs, and I had kind of shortlisted Sony MH1C and VSonic VSD1. If there are any other options you would recommend, I would be glad to hear about it. My budget is not much, max to max around 50-70$ range. My concerns/thoughts about the other 2 are:
  
 Sony MH1C - Not Officially available in India, but getting it on ebay India for INR 1200 (thats roughly 20$, so that brings a doubt to my mind, are they fake? they are probably imported/grey market items).
 VSonic VSD1 - Available for about INR 3500 (60$)
  
 Now I have learnt that the MH1C cable is Bad (if not fake that is), and that the VSD1 though good overall, the bass isn't That much.
  
 Can you give me a comparison of these 2 with GR02s and Wooduos? Will they really be an upgrade or just a replacement? Do you think the MH1C can be available for 20$?


----------



## Lukalop

A revolution may be on its way to change the audio scene:
http://www.technologyreview.com/view/512496/first-graphene-audio-speaker-easily-outperforms-traditional-designs/
http://www.extremetech.com/electronics/150646-berkeley-creates-the-first-graphene-earphones-and-unsurprisingly-theyre-awesome


----------



## Francisk

Yes it's truly a revolution but unfortunately they're only comparing it to an old Sennheiser MX400 which is a dynamic driver earbud. They should at least compare it with the current BA IEMs. I think it's still a long way to go before they truly refine it and be ready for the commercial market.


----------



## ljokerl

headhoncho said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I had been using a pair of VSonic GR02 Bass Edition IEMs for near about 2 years, and I loved them. Then the biflange tips fell off somewhere and they weren't the same again, and then they gave up on me completely, and I got a set of HiSound Wooduo 2 as a replacement/apparent upgrade. They are good, but I really did not like them that much. The bass is good, but covers a lot of the other frequencies. So now I was in the process of researching and procuring another set of IEMs, and I had kind of shortlisted Sony MH1C and VSonic VSD1. If there are any other options you would recommend, I would be glad to hear about it. My budget is not much, max to max around 50-70$ range. My concerns/thoughts about the other 2 are:
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Wooduo2 is something that's really only suitable for bassheads. The GR02 is bassier than the VSD1 by a margin, but the VSD1 is not lacking in bass compared to a flat/neutral sound. I quite like it.
  
 Is that $20 for a bulk-package MH1C? If so that's not too far off what the US prices were before they got very popular. It's a darker, warmer sound compared to the VSD1, for example, but hard not to recommend at this price even with the crap cable.
  
 PS you might also want to try a Philips SHE3580 or SHE3590 - they're very inexpensive and close to the GR02BE in sound quality.


----------



## Gandasaputra

ljokerl said:


> PS you might also want to try a Philips SHE3580 or SHE3590 - they're very inexpensive and close to the GR02BE in sound quality.


 
  
 +1000. For people who want cheap earphones with fun sound and still new to IEM stuff, SHE3590 is all they need. But, placing Sony's hybrid tips is a must because the stock's tips are as hard as bullets. The hybrid tips make it the most comfy IEM one ever have, although the isolation doesn't improve much IMO.
  
 Also note that it can be worn over the ear 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 it takes a practice.


----------



## garcsa

lukalop said:


> A revolution may be on its way to change the audio scene:
> http://www.technologyreview.com/view/512496/first-graphene-audio-speaker-easily-outperforms-traditional-designs/
> http://www.extremetech.com/electronics/150646-berkeley-creates-the-first-graphene-earphones-and-unsurprisingly-theyre-awesome


 
 yep! you're right, i remember , few decades ago when kevlar appears there was  some articles, how to make speaker diaphragms from it....    ( video: OLED no more just one decade... )


----------



## SebsG

My 9927's should be here tomorrow or satutday. 
I got two day shipping for like $4 extra


----------



## Amitl

i have a question regarding audio cabling in earphones.
 so the question is :
 i know that connecting a speaker/receiver setup with digital connection is better than analog.
 for example, hdmi is much better than the analog red/white connection.
 so, what about earphones?
 how does the 3.5mm connection fare with all this?
 why don't they make a digital standard for earphone connection?
 thank you


----------



## higbvuyb

amitl said:


> i have a question regarding audio cabling in earphones.
> so the question is :
> i know that connecting a speaker/receiver setup with digital connection is better than analog.
> for example, hdmi is much better than the analog red/white connection.
> ...


 
 Drivers only accept analog input, so somewhere along the chain, you need to convert it back to analog.
  
 If the earphones accepted a digital input, they'd require a Digital to Analog Converter (DAC) plus an amplifier built into the earphones. They would require a power input (to power the DAC and amp). That would add a lot to the bulk and expense of earphones.
  
 An earphone cable is not very long as cables go. So the potential for signal degradation is very low.


----------



## ljokerl

gandasaputra said:


> +1000. For people who want cheap earphones with fun sound and still new to IEM stuff, SHE3590 is all they need. But, placing Sony's hybrid tips is a must because the stock's tips are as hard as bullets. The hybrid tips make it the most comfy IEM one ever have, although the isolation doesn't improve much IMO.
> 
> Also note that it can be worn over the ear
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Meelec M6 double-flanges can improve isolation on those a little and don't sound half bad. I use them over-the-ear as well.


----------



## NIVEBL

how about shure se846?


----------



## ljokerl

nivebl said:


> how about shure se846?


 
  
 I haven't tried it.


----------



## opis

ljokerl said:


> I haven't tried the IM02 so I'm not sure what it sounds like. What are you looking for in comparison to the BA200?
> 
> From reading your description it sounds like a Sony EX1000 but the fit on those doesn't work for everyone and they might be hard to find these days.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks so much for the help. After looking around a bit I decided to order the Dunu dn1000 from mp4nation. I read there were reviews going both ways about them (mp4nation) but I took the chance (I live in Sweden and it's difficult to find any site that ship them here). I hope they dn1000's will be more resilient and durable and also looking forward to an upgrade in sound quality as well! Thanks, Peace


----------



## westinlennox

Hey all, I have been searching the web (and Head-Fi) for days, and cannot seem to find an answer to my question.  I was hoping someone here may be able to help.  I am no basshead, but I am looking into getting a pair of Etymotic HF-5s, and wanted to know how their bass response compared to that of a Grado can?  I know it is an apples-to-oranges question, as one is a set of IEMs and the other a full-sized headphone, but I would appreciate any help!  I have a set of SR225s that i love, and if the HF-5 can come close to even that level of bass, I will be happy. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Thanks in advance!


----------



## lesslikeme

westinlennox said:


> Hey all, I have been searching the web (and Head-Fi) for days, and cannot seem to find an answer to my question.  I was hoping someone here may be able to help.  I am no basshead, but I am looking into getting a pair of Etymotic HF-5s, and wanted to know how their bass response compared to that of a Grado can?  I know it is an apples-to-oranges question, as one is a set of IEMs and the other a full-sized headphone, but I would appreciate any help!  I have a set of SR225s that i love, and if the HF-5 can come close to even that level of bass, I will be happy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Take with a grain of salt - I find that SR80i have _slightly_ more mid-bass punch and Ety have bit more low-bass presence (looking at the Golden Ears measurments it shouldn't be the case really, but I'll pick HF5 over any day for something like this https://soundcloud.com/deorro/deorro-dechorro-original-mix)
 They are quite the same in terms of the low end, both lacking authority for certain genres


----------



## Amitl

higbvuyb said:


> Drivers only accept analog input, so somewhere along the chain, you need to convert it back to analog.
> 
> If the earphones accepted a digital input, they'd require a Digital to Analog Converter (DAC) plus an amplifier built into the earphones. They would require a power input (to power the DAC and amp). That would add a lot to the bulk and expense of earphones.
> 
> An earphone cable is not very long as cables go. So the potential for signal degradation is very low.


 

 Thank you!!


----------



## Amitl

has anyone here heard about the "Pono" thing going on?
 lots of fuss for it being an mp3 player that plays hi-res files (even though it's nothing new)
 i was wondering, my Samsung galaxy 1 plays 96khz/24bit flac files without any problem,
 does it mean i already have a hi-res player? 
 perhaps it can play the file but doesnt deliver the full sound range?


----------



## higbvuyb

amitl said:


> has anyone here heard about the "Pono" thing going on?
> lots of fuss for it being an mp3 player that plays hi-res files (even though it's nothing new)
> i was wondering, my Samsung galaxy 1 plays 96khz/24bit flac files without any problem,
> does it mean i already have a hi-res player?
> perhaps it can play the file but doesnt deliver the full sound range?


 
 The DAC in the phone probably doesn't work at 96/24. It's probably limited to something like 44.1/16. However, unless you are a bat, you won't hear a difference.


----------



## suman134

joker , would you rate xba-1 close to vsd1/s , how much will you give it for sound quality .


----------



## NIVEBL

ljokerl said:


> I haven't tried it.


 
 will you try it?


----------



## ljokerl

westinlennox said:


> Hey all, I have been searching the web (and Head-Fi) for days, and cannot seem to find an answer to my question.  I was hoping someone here may be able to help.  I am no basshead, but I am looking into getting a pair of Etymotic HF-5s, and wanted to know how their bass response compared to that of a Grado can?  I know it is an apples-to-oranges question, as one is a set of IEMs and the other a full-sized headphone, but I would appreciate any help!  I have a set of SR225s that i love, and if the HF-5 can come close to even that level of bass, I will be happy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 The 40+ mm drivers in the Grados can move a whole lot more air so it will have an advantage in visceral "impact" even if on paper they are evenly matched in bass quantity. Only way to know for sure whether flat bass from an IEM will do it for you is to try one. 
  


suman134 said:


> joker , would you rate xba-1 close to vsd1/s , how much will you give it for sound quality .


 
  
 I really didn't spend enough time with it to say. 
  


nivebl said:


> will you try it?


 
  
 I doubt it.


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Posted a short introduction to Bluetooth audio technology here: http://theheadphonelist.com/wireless-fidelity-making-sense-bluetooth-headphone-technology/
> 
> I tried doing a bit of research on Bluetooth headphones last week and couldn't find what I needed in one place. I spent a few days piecing it all together from various sources and eventually decided to pool all the info in what I hope is a digestible format. Perhaps it will help those who are as clueless as I was get up to speed on the technologies, challenges, and limitations of Bluetooth audio


 
  
 Great informative writeup, thanks! Hope that Sead Smailagic took the opportunity to send you a Sony SBH80.


----------



## Amitl

higbvuyb said:


> The DAC in the phone probably doesn't work at 96/24. It's probably limited to something like 44.1/16. However, unless you are a bat, you won't hear a difference.


 

 Thanks for commenting


----------



## goodvibes

ljokerl said:


> That works for me to but not really better than the singles. I think the nozzle ending being so near the outlet of the bi-flanges doesn't work well with my ear canals. Maybe I'm trying to insert them too far..


 
 Mine must be longer. I definitely agree about having some tip beyond the opening. Didn't like the tips that ended near the outlet either.


----------



## ljokerl

james444 said:


> Great informative writeup, thanks! Hope that Sead Smailagic took the opportunity to send you a Sony SBH80.


 
  
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Indeed he did: http://theheadphonelist.com/sony-sbh80-review-mh1c-goes-wireless/
  


goodvibes said:


> Mine must be longer. I definitely agree about having some tip beyond the opening. Didn't like the tips that ended near the outlet either.


 
  
 In playing with the nozzles I managed to rip one off :/ . A dab of superglue and its back to normal.


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Awesome! Having only used the SBH80 myself for a few days, I'm honestly impressed. Everything about it seems very well thought out. Except maybe for the travel case, that is. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Oh, and I had to smile about this one:
  


> More generally, I’m convinced that wireless is the future of portable audio ...


 


james444 said:


> Mark my words, the future of portable audio is wireless.


----------



## ljokerl

james444 said:


> Awesome! Having only used the SBH80 myself for a few days, I'm honestly impressed. Everything about it seems very well thought out. Except maybe for the travel case, that is.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Nice foresight there 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I realize now that my first Bluetooth set, the Sennheiser MM400, was a little early and the state of the technology back then resulted in a headphone that just couldn't justify its price. Things have definitely changed, especially on the pricing side.


----------



## HeadHoncho

ljokerl said:


> The Wooduo2 is something that's really only suitable for bassheads. The GR02 is bassier than the VSD1 by a margin, but the VSD1 is not lacking in bass compared to a flat/neutral sound. I quite like it.
> 
> Is that $20 for a bulk-package MH1C? If so that's not too far off what the US prices were before they got very popular. It's a darker, warmer sound compared to the VSD1, for example, but hard not to recommend at this price even with the crap cable.
> 
> PS you might also want to try a Philips SHE3580 or SHE3590 - they're very inexpensive and close to the GR02BE in sound quality.


 
  
 Will it make sense to get both the MH1C and the VSD1?


----------



## SebsG

I just got my 9927's. 
A quick word on them from someone who can't accurately use fancy audiophile terms.
Bass: Nice amount; not muddy, but not lacking.
Mids: Vocals sound fine, although, I prefer male voices on these a bit more than female voices.
Highs: Fine? Nothing peircing and unnatural sounding.
Soundstage: Difficult to describe without using terms that I don't know the meaning of. The soundstage sounds more open and unique than IEM's I've tried (not many).

A quick note- I amm actually hearing instruments that I had never heard before in songs that I know pretty well.

Caution: The words above are extremely subjective, so YMMV.

-Seb


----------



## Deviltooth

ljokerl said:


> Nice foresight there
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 One thing though, the Sony SBH80 is currently $100 on Amazon, the comparable (sound wise) MH1 is $15.
  
 The future may be wireless but that future will arrive more rapidly when the price differential closes.


----------



## vwinter

james444 said:


> Awesome! Having only used the SBH80 myself for a few days, I'm honestly impressed. Everything about it seems very well thought out. Except maybe for the travel case, that is.
> 
> Oh, and I had to smile about this one:







ljokerl said:


> Nice foresight there  . I realize now that my first Bluetooth set, the Sennheiser MM400, was a little early and the state of the technology back then resulted in a headphone that just couldn't justify its price. Things have definitely changed, especially on the pricing side.




Do you guys think that it's more the future of portable audio on the consumer side or on the more niche audiophile market side? 

I'm really asking because I'm guessing it would likely be very little time until someone goes "but you're limited to the [crappy] built in DAC and amp..."


----------



## ljokerl

headhoncho said:


> Will it make sense to get both the MH1C and the VSD1?


 
  
 Different sound signatures, so yes. Makes even more sense if you can return the one you like less.
  


deviltooth said:


> One thing though, the Sony SBH80 is currently $100 on Amazon, the comparable (sound wise) MH1 is $15.
> 
> The future may be wireless but that future will arrive more rapidly when the price differential closes.


 
  
 True, but to be fair the MH1 is more the exception than the rule. The US MSRP of a retail-packaged MH1C is $79.99 which isn't so far off the SBH80. In any case, wireless will never be as cheap as wired, but there's also some inherent convenience value in it, as well as compatibility, etc.
  
 For what it's worth, the $50 MEElectronics AF32 I tried last week sounds better than the $200 Sennheiser MM400 I've been using for years so even among conventional wireless cans the price/performance ratio seems to be improving as more players enter the market. Same thing that happened with in-ears five or six years ago.
  


vwinter said:


> Do you guys think that it's more the future of portable audio on the consumer side or on the more niche audiophile market side?
> 
> I'm really asking because I'm guessing it would likely be very little time until someone goes "but you're limited to the [crappy] built in DAC and amp..."


 
  
 If we're talking the top 1% who buy boutique universals and portable amps, probably not for a while. But the more general niche of people who care enough about sound quality to pick up a Triple.Fi 10 or IE80, I think so, at least if it can be demonstrated that you're not sacrificing a lot in the way of performance. 
  
 Regarding the built-in amp/DAC, IMO that's where Hi-Fi manufacturers can distinguish themselves by using decent quality components and optimizing the whole chain for their drivers. Imagine how much control over the sound it gives to someone who really knows what they are doing. It'll eliminate concerns like synergy and source matching as the designer of the headphone/earphone will be able to do all that work. Plus, there's the possibility of fine-tuning the sound or even providing different sound signatures via built-in DSP. All that's really needed is a transmission protocol that can support a sufficiently hi-res digital stream from the source to the headphone.
  
 Maybe Bluetooth won't be the answer, maybe the answer is some sort of point-to-point wireless. I guess we'll see when we get there.


----------



## james444

vwinter said:


> Do you guys think that it's more the future of portable audio on the consumer side or on the more niche audiophile market side?
> 
> I'm really asking because I'm guessing it would likely be very little time until someone goes "but you're limited to the [crappy] built in DAC and amp..."


 
  
 I don't think miniaturization will be a bottleneck in the long run. Just look at tiny USB DACs like the HRT microStreamer or Audioquest DragonFly and imagine similarly high-grade components in a neckband design like the SBH80's.
  
 The main reason why I think it will be more on the consumer side, is that audiophiles usually don't care much about convenience and usability, which are the main selling points for wireless audio. By some strange twisted logic, some even seem to think that inconvenience and bad usability are proof for a "no-compromise" design and the fact that the manufacturer in question focuses solely on sound quality. So, unless someone comes up with a genius idea on how transmitting an audio signal across a short stretch of air filters out unwanted jitter or something like that, I personally don't see wireless audio hitting the audiophile boutique market anytime soon.


----------



## UnityIsPower

I would love wireless iem that sounded like either GR07 V/BE or Tpeos H200's. Hows Bluetooth on battery drain these days?


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Fidue A63
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A84) Fidue A63*
> 
> 
> Reviewed March 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here
  


unityispower said:


> I would love wireless iem that sounded like either GR07 V/BE or Tpeos H200's. Hows Bluetooth on battery drain these days?


 
  
 Battery drain on the source? It's hard to eliminate all other factors but I haven't found it to make a big difference with my Nexus 5 or iPod Touch.


----------



## sbose

hi
 |joker| thanks for the A63 review. i brought the a63 after your recommendation.
 i just received it today and currently i am listening.
 sound signature is so easy that i can keep it for hours.
 when will you review the A81?


----------



## UnityIsPower

The source and the device itself but that's good to hear joker.


----------



## ljokerl

sbose said:


> hi
> |joker| thanks for the A63 review. i brought the a63 after your recommendation.
> i just received it today and currently i am listening.
> sound signature is so easy that i can keep it for hours.
> when will you review the A81?


 
  
The A81 sounds quite different - it’s bassier and has more of a v-shaped sound signature to it with brighter treble as well. I’m not as impressed with its value proposition as I am with the A63 so it’s low on the priority list for a review.
 


unityispower said:


> The source and the device itself but that's good to hear joker.


 
  
For wireless in-ears good battery life will be a challenge but with full-size or even portable headphones you can fit a nice and large battery in. I got a press release the other day for a full-size Bluetooth set advertised at 40 hours of playback per charge. Averaging 2 hours of use per day that’s almost 3 weeks without a charge. Crazy.


----------



## kuhchuk

ljokerl, I just wanted to thank you for your wonderful reviews.  I picked up a pair of Brainwavz M1's after reading a lot of your reviews, and you're absolutely right.  For the price, it is an incredible deal.


----------



## ljokerl

kuhchuk said:


> ljokerl, I just wanted to thank you for your wonderful reviews.  I picked up a pair of Brainwavz M1's after reading a lot of your reviews, and you're absolutely right.  For the price, it is an incredible deal.


 
  
 Thanks, glad you're enjoying the M1!


----------



## Cunnifferous

Hi Joker,
  
 Thanks for all the great reviews, it's a brilliant resource.
  
 I recently had the VSD1 and VSD1S but they both fell apart pretty quick, so I got the Astrotec AM-800 as a replacement. I found the VSD1S a little dark sounding, I prefer more sparkly treble, how do you think the AM-800 would compare? Also the bass quantity on both models was exactly to my liking, above neutral but not overbaring; although I found the delivery of bass to be a little soft (lacking that satisfying slam from a kick drum for example), How would you compare the AM-800 to the VSD1/S in this instance? I own the Vsonic R02 silver and while i like them, I find them a little bass light, do the AM-800 have more bass than these?Also, Astrotec seem to have released a number of new models in the sub $50 and sub $100 range, (AM-600, AM-900, AX30, AX35) any plans to review any of these?
  
 Thanks,


----------



## Lukalop

I have a question regarding sound signature, that I have already asked in a separate forum but am asking here for good measure.

When people say that the sound is neutral, what EXACTLY does this mean? I have heard the JH's are very neutral so I assume that means they hardly colour the sound, only to then hear some people don't like the JH13's because they have the JH 'house sound.' What on earth does that mean, if they're neutral then they should sound neutral. Does this mean to say all headphones that sound neutral carry the JH 'house sound.' At this point it seems like people are just inventing new words and phrases.. Confused :s


----------



## Cunnifferous

I'm no expert, but what I understand neutral to be is that no one part of the sound spectrum (bass, mid, treble) is emphasized over another.


----------



## kuhchuk

lukalop said:


> I have a question regarding sound signature, that I have already asked in a separate forum but am asking here for good measure.
> 
> When people say that the sound is neutral, what EXACTLY does this mean? I have heard the JH's are very neutral so I assume that means they hardly colour the sound, only to then hear some people don't like the JH13's because they have the JH 'house sound.' What on earth does that mean, if they're neutral then they should sound neutral. Does this mean to say all headphones that sound neutral carry the JH 'house sound.' At this point it seems like people are just inventing new words and phrases.. Confused :s


 
 When it comes to headphones being neutral, it does mean that there's minimal coloration.  When someone refers to a certain brand's "house sound," they're referring to that company's sound quality MO.  If a company's line of headphones tend to be close to neutral, then their house sound could be considered neutral.


----------



## ljokerl

cunnifferous said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Thanks for all the great reviews, it's a brilliant resource.
> 
> ...


 
 
The AM-800 will have more treble energy overall compared to the VSD1S but less bass impact. It’s a tradeoff, and on the whole it sounds like you might prefer the Astrotecs.
 
I have an Astrotec AX35 which so far seems pretty good. I’ll review it soon. I posted my initial thoughts on it here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-t-peos-accidentally-extraordinary-meze-narmoo-astrotec-olasonic-ear-earphones/
  


lukalop said:


> I have a question regarding sound signature, that I have already asked in a separate forum but am asking here for good measure.
> 
> When people say that the sound is neutral, what EXACTLY does this mean? I have heard the JH's are very neutral so I assume that means they hardly colour the sound, only to then hear some people don't like the JH13's because they have the JH 'house sound.' What on earth does that mean, if they're neutral then they should sound neutral. Does this mean to say all headphones that sound neutral carry the JH 'house sound.' At this point it seems like people are just inventing new words and phrases.. Confused :s


 
  
 In the very basic sense it’s as *Cunnifferous* said – no “extra” emphasis on any part of the spectrum. However, just what that actually means in terms of the sound entering your ear will vary based on who you ask. For example, Etymotic Research advocates the diffuse-field reference standard for earphones, which their own earphones match with something like a 90% accuracy. To many people Etymotic earphones do sound neutral, but others fine them bright or lacking in bass.
  
 Regarding the JH13, it's slightly off what I consider neutral as it has quite a bit of bass impact.


----------



## deco cat

No ratings for Vsonic VSD1/S?


----------



## shakra00

Best IEM around 150$ for my preference?

I listen to alot of Christina Aguilera & Jason Mraz type of music.

I also love bass so that means im a basshead? And I also like the vocals crisp.

What IEM would you recommend? I contacted a music store here and what they recommended were Rockit R50 and RE400.

I just bought a CX 300 II yesterday and I was kind of disappointed and underwhelmed although the bass is good, I felt like the voices are muddy so please help me choose an IEM that I will not regret within that price range. Thank you.

And please tell me whether the choice will be a significant upgrade from cx300ii to the one im looking for.


----------



## proedros

Hi Joker ,
  
 I have the following 3 iems , *RE-262 , RE-272 , EQ-5 *, and i was wondering what would you consider an upgrade over these 3

 I just tried the RE600 and i liked it a lot (it sounds like a vastly improved RE-262 with much better bass and better detail retrieval , but it seems kinda 'slow' compared to the 272/eq5 plus i don't think it's price justifies the small differences i hear when compared with the 272/eq5)

 what would you buy if you liked these 3 iems but wanted something EVEN better ? let's stay below 500$ for now

 Thanx


----------



## suman134

shakra00 said:


> Best IEM around 150$ for my preference?
> 
> I listen to alot of Christina Aguilera & Jason Mraz type of music.
> 
> ...


 
       cx-300 is an entry level phone , its no where close to r50 or re-400 , for you i think xba-h1 will do good , cuz r-50 and re 400 are way low on bass when compared to cx300 .
      im gona ask you same question , what is the thing you want ?
       by the way re-400 will be nice choice too .


----------



## shakra00

shakra00 said:


> Best IEM around 150$ for my preference?
> 
> I listen to alot of Christina Aguilera & Jason Mraz type of music.
> 
> ...




Need more input


----------



## Grayson73

shakra00 said:


> Need more input


 
 I don't think you'd like RE-400 if you like bass.  They were too bass light for me.
  
 At $150, I'd look at Dunu DN-1000, Zero Audio Carbo Doppio, KEF M200, Fostex TE-05


----------



## d marc0

proedros said:


> Hi Joker ,
> 
> I have the following 3 iems , *RE-262 , RE-272 , EQ-5* , and i was wondering what would you consider an upgrade over these 3
> 
> ...




I just reviewed the Noble 4 and it seems to fit all your requirements. You can also check joker's noble 4s review... They sound pretty similar.


----------



## ljokerl

deco cat said:


> No ratings for Vsonic VSD1/S?


 
  
 I reviewed it here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/more-less-vsonic-vsd1-and-vsd1s . In terms of sound quality, I rate it just a bit above the VC02 model. 
  


shakra00 said:


> Best IEM around 150$ for my preference?
> 
> I listen to alot of Christina Aguilera & Jason Mraz type of music.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The R-50 and RE-400 probably won't have enough bass for you, especially considering your music preferences. If you want solid bass and clear vocals the Yamaha EPH-100 would be my pick, but there are lots of other good options such as the JVC FXT90 and even RBH EP1.
  


proedros said:


> Hi Joker ,
> 
> I have the following 3 iems , *RE-262 , RE-272 , EQ-5 *, and i was wondering what would you consider an upgrade over these 3
> 
> ...


 
  
 I've only tried the Noble 4S and not the 4 or 4C but it's one of the only IEMs I could call an upgrade to the RE272.


----------



## ljokerl

Speaking of Noble, they've just announced some new reference products: http://theheadphonelist.com/noble-launches-fr-pr-variable-tuning-ear-monitors/


----------



## Francisk

That's good news Joker...I'm looking forward to your review of the new Noble Audio universals. Hope these make it to your top 10 if not top 5 list


----------



## nati8056

grayson73 said:


> I don't think you'd like RE-400 if you like bass.  They were too bass light for me.
> 
> At $150, I'd look at Dunu DN-1000, Zero Audio Carbo Doppio, KEF M200, Fostex TE-05




I have the dunu dn1000 (get it yestarday )and I think they do not have a lot of bass compared to se215
but the sound is great.


----------



## prawdziwysimone

Hi ljockerl,

Can You compare yamaha eph-100 and nuforce ne-700x? I know that a lot of people will say something like "eph is way better" but nuforce have a lot of good reviews in my country and nobody have booth so i really want to know Your opinion. I have soundmagic e10 now and looking upgrade. I usually listen Rock music, tons of RHCP and I would be grateful if You compare eph100 and ne700x separately in bass/mids/highs and soundstage

Cheers


----------



## steelglam

Any insight as to how the Sony MH1C and the Nuforce NE-700X compare to the Vsonic GR99?  I have the Vsonic, and the descriptions of the Sony and Nuforce sound similar to the Vsonic.  Would either be an upgrade over the Vsonic?  In particular, I'd be looking for something with a similar overall sound signature to the Vsonic but a bit better performance in the midrange (a bit more clear and a bit less veiled in the mids).
  
 Thanks in advance for any insight.


----------



## Lukalop

Does changing the type of metal a BA driver is made from affect the sound? (i.e aluminium vs titanium)


----------



## kh600rr

Hey guys, anyone using the Noble Audio K-10? If so how do you like them? Gonna be using it with the AK-240. It's between the Roxanne and the K-10. Just trying to get some honest opinions. Thanks...


----------



## ljokerl

prawdziwysimone said:


> Hi ljockerl,
> 
> Can You compare yamaha eph-100 and nuforce ne-700x? I know that a lot of people will say something like "eph is way better" but nuforce have a lot of good reviews in my country and nobody have booth so i really want to know Your opinion. I have soundmagic e10 now and looking upgrade. I usually listen Rock music, tons of RHCP and I would be grateful if You compare eph100 and ne700x separately in bass/mids/highs and soundstage
> 
> Cheers


 
  
 I do think the EPH-100 is better, though there's also a big price gap there. The bass on the NE-700X is loose compared to the EPH-100. That's going to the biggest difference - it sounds sluggish and excessive in comparison even though the EPH-100 doesn't really lag behind in depth and impact. The EPH-100 also has a stronger midrange and smoother upper mids, with a more well-layered presentation. 
  


steelglam said:


> Any insight as to how the Sony MH1C and the Nuforce NE-700X compare to the Vsonic GR99?  I have the Vsonic, and the descriptions of the Sony and Nuforce sound similar to the Vsonic.  Would either be an upgrade over the Vsonic?  In particular, I'd be looking for something with a similar overall sound signature to the Vsonic but a bit better performance in the midrange (a bit more clear and a bit less veiled in the mids).
> 
> Thanks in advance for any insight.


 
  
 The NE-700X has quite a bit more bass than the GR99. The MH1C is closer, but still bassier. It's also smoother than the GR99. However, if you're looking for more midrange presence and good, but not heavy, bass, you might want to consider the Fidue A63 instead in that price range. 
  


lukalop said:


> Does changing the type of metal a BA driver is made from affect the sound? (i.e aluminium vs titanium)


 
  
 Most likely yes but you'd have to ask a BA engineer to get a definitive answer.


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Posted a short introduction to Bluetooth audio technology here: http://theheadphonelist.com/wireless-fidelity-making-sense-bluetooth-headphone-technology/


 
  
 Hi Joker, care to share which CSR Bluetooth dongle with aptX support on Windows 7 x64 you're using? A friend of mine is having problems with the SBH80 and his laptop's inbuilt BT, so he wants to buy a dongle that's confirmed to work. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

james444 said:


> Hi Joker, care to share which CSR Bluetooth dongle with aptX support on Windows 7 x64 you're using? A friend of mine is having problems with the SBH80 and his laptop's inbuilt BT, so he wants to buy a dongle that's confirmed to work. Thanks!


 
  
 Mine's an Azio BTD-V400. It also uses the CSR Harmony software (which I prefer) in place of the standard Windows Bluetooth interface.


----------



## Lukalop

Does anyone know what material balanced armatures are made of (specifically)


----------



## kaixax555

lukalop said:


> Does anyone know what material balanced armatures are made of (specifically)




I believe it is made of similar materials as dynamic drivers, since most of its workings are still based on a dynamic driver

Except that they have a metal shell outside, which gives the BA a mostly "fixed" sound so the drivers can be combined to the desire of the manufacturer


----------



## z28dreams

Anyone care to recommend another IEM in the < $40 range that has just a small bit of of a V curve but not over the top?
  
 Basically something like the M9's with more mids.  Way less bass than the Vsonic GR02's.
  
 I just received the SoundMAGIC E10's, but they aren't quite what I'm looking for.  If anyone's interested they are for sale here:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/710777/fs-soundmagic-e10


----------



## UnityIsPower

ljokerl said:


> Speaking of Noble, they've just announced some new reference products: http://theheadphonelist.com/noble-launches-fr-pr-variable-tuning-ear-monitors/




I was sitting at the noble table and saw that iem during the SoCal meet. I sadly didn't try it but could have, bummer.


----------



## esteebin

z28dreams said:


> Anyone care to recommend another IEM in the < $40 range that has just a small bit of of a V curve but not over the top?
> 
> Basically something like the M9's with more mids.  Way less bass than the Vsonic GR02's.
> 
> ...


 
  
 If you can increase your budget to $50, the SteelSeries Flux in-ear and the VSonic VSD1S comes to mind. I have these two and they are great with nice bass and smooth treble. Mids/vocals are clear. I also have the VSD1 and the VSD1LimitedEdition and the VSD1S is the best out of the three.
  
 Others may recommend the Sony MH1C, but  have no experience with them.


----------



## ljokerl

z28dreams said:


> Anyone care to recommend another IEM in the < $40 range that has just a small bit of of a V curve but not over the top?
> 
> Basically something like the M9's with more mids.  Way less bass than the Vsonic GR02's.
> 
> ...


 
  
 What *esteebin *said - VSD1S is less bassy and more balanced than the GR02 with better overall sound quality. The Flux is more balanced still, but has a mild v-shape to it nonetheless. The MH1C doesn't qualify to be called v-shaped IMO - not enough rise at the top.
  
Curious as to why you didn't like the E10? They're pretty mildly v-shaped. 
  


unityispower said:


> I was sitting at the noble table and saw that iem during the SoCal meet. I sadly didn't try it but could have, bummer.


 
  
 Yeah I haven't been this curious to try a new universal in a while. Might be the vague but alluring descriptions of the sound...


----------



## Amitl

Hi all, i just received my VSonic VSD1S yesterday,
 have used them only once, but would like to share that already these are my
 favorite iems at the moment!
 i have the id America Spark, the Klipsch S4, Meelec CW31, Meelec A161P, LG Quadbeats 2 and Sony MH1C.
 of all these, i like the VSD1S most! and used it just once!
 the fit is so good, with the adjustable nozzle, its a lot more secure than a straight-barrel design, yet doesn't feel like a half-in-ear like the CW31 and is also more comfortable.
 the cable is great - yes, the MH1C is a lot less prone to tangling, and most of us know how terrible it is.
 what i like about the cable is how low-profile it is, it doesn't bounce around, its strong yet soft, and it
 doesn't deliver so much noise as my other iems.
 i read a lot about the treble being sibilant, but i was pleasently surprised.
 i was affraid i was gonn'a get a Klipsch-S4-sibilance, but it's miles away from that, not the case at all.
 very happy with my purchase, thanks joker for your review -- it's thanks to you that i bought them!


----------



## Spec C

Any plans to review the CA Music Two?


----------



## ljokerl

amitl said:


> Hi all, i just received my VSonic VSD1S yesterday,
> 
> 
> [...]


 
  
 Glad you like them! 
  


spec c said:


> Any plans to review the CA Music Two?


 
  
 Not at this time. I could possibly get my hands on them, just got a pretty full schedule.


----------



## listen4joy

I am curious about the Xioami Pistons 2.0 people said its the new SONY MH1C but better. and 2 other new iems that i am sure everybody wants to know about them
 T-PEOS H300
 and the upcoming DUNU-DN 2000
 curious about chart rankings and comprasion beetween them hope you can review 2 iems in the future and also the Xioami pistons


----------



## KuroTaka

Idk if its just me but the Fidue A63 reminds me of the Ie800


----------



## sbose

|joker|
 does signature acoustics C-12 and DN-1000 has the same bass level?
 compared to A63 and E30 can you describe the bass level of dn1k.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> The NE-700X has quite a bit more bass than the GR99. The MH1C is closer, but still bassier. It's also smoother than the GR99. However, if you're looking for more midrange presence and good, but not heavy, bass, you might want to consider the Fidue A63 instead in that price range.


 
  
 Thanks, ljokerl.  Based on your description, the Fidue definitely seems like it may be the most attractive option of the three.
  
 Do you think I would see a marked improvement by stepping up to something like the Dunu DN-1000?  I know that it's not in the same price range of the ones that I wrote about, but if it's significantly better than the Fidue, I would consider it.


----------



## BluePhoenixHD

Would anyone here be able to compare the ATH-Im70? It released in Japan, so not sure. =P I was considering getting either the Im70 or RE-400. Although, on some reviews they are saying that the 400 has some build quality issues. Just looking for comfortable, long periods of listening. Movies, Videos, Games, basically an all-rounder. Or should I save some money and go with the VSD1S?


----------



## Spec C

ljokerl said:


> Not at this time. I could possibly get my hands on them, just got a pretty full schedule.


 
 It is understandable.
  
 Have you heard the Noble 3c before?  I am currently trying to decide between the 1964 v3 and the Nobel 3c.  Would you happen to have a preference between the two?  I generally like a bit more "energetic/fun" sound, and don't need tremendous bass.
  
 Thanks so much, I can say we all appreciate the insight, and the resource you have provided in this thread.


----------



## ljokerl

listen4joy said:


> I am curious about the Xioami Pistons 2.0 people said its the new SONY MH1C but better. and 2 other new iems that i am sure everybody wants to know about them
> T-PEOS H300
> and the upcoming DUNU-DN 2000
> curious about chart rankings and comprasion beetween them hope you can review 2 iems in the future and also the Xioami pistons


 
  
 The DN-2000 I'm sure I'll cover eventually. Not sure about the other two. 
  


kurotaka said:


> Idk if its just me but the Fidue A63 reminds me of the Ie800


 
  
 The sound, or the looks?
  


sbose said:


> |joker|
> does signature acoustics C-12 and DN-1000 has the same bass level?
> compared to A63 and E30 can you describe the bass level of dn1k.


 
  
 No, the C12 is a lot more mid-bassy than the DN-1000. The DN1000 has lots more deep bass than both the A63 and E30 and about as much mid-bass as the A63, but more than E30.
  


steelglam said:


> Thanks, ljokerl.  Based on your description, the Fidue definitely seems like it may be the most attractive option of the three.
> 
> Do you think I would see a marked improvement by stepping up to something like the Dunu DN-1000?  I know that it's not in the same price range of the ones that I wrote about, but if it's significantly better than the Fidue, I would consider it.


 
  
 It also has a very different sound signature from the Fidue. It actually seems to me like the signature of the A63 might work better for you, but the DN-1000 has many advantages such as bass depth, clarity, treble extension and presence, and so on. As to whether it's worth it to spend more of your money, I can't really answer that one for you.
  


bluephoenixhd said:


> Would anyone here be able to compare the ATH-Im70? It released in Japan, so not sure. =P I was considering getting either the Im70 or RE-400. Although, on some reviews they are saying that the 400 has some build quality issues. Just looking for comfortable, long periods of listening. Movies, Videos, Games, basically an all-rounder. Or should I save some money and go with the VSD1S?


 
  
 Haven't tried it. If you are looking for a balanced and accurate IEM, the RE-400 is worth the premium over the VSD1S. Otherwise the VSD1S will do what you want. 
  


spec c said:


> It is understandable.
> 
> Have you heard the Noble 3c before?  I am currently trying to decide between the 1964 v3 and the Nobel 3c.  Would you happen to have a preference between the two?  I generally like a bit more "energetic/fun" sound, and don't need tremendous bass.
> 
> Thanks so much, I can say we all appreciate the insight, and the resource you have provided in this thread.


 
  
 Sorry, I have not tried the 3C.


----------



## KuroTaka

ljokerl said:


> The sound, or the looks?


 
 The looks, never actually heard the Fidue though. I do, however enjoy the IE 800. What would you rate it out of 10? I read your review on innerfidelity.


----------



## OliverBB

Hi Joker, could you or anyone compare the Thinksound ts02 and the Klipsch s4 (I have both) and how they compare to the Audio Technica CKM-500 (which I am currently interested in). The bass on the Thinksound's is probably the "bassiest" I would go on a headphone. From your review the CKM-500 is a more refined and upgrade to the Klipsch s4? 

Thanks for your (or anyone elses) help!


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> It also has a very different sound signature from the Fidue. It actually seems to me like the signature of the A63 might work better for you, but the DN-1000 has many advantages such as bass depth, clarity, treble extension and presence, and so on. As to whether it's worth it to spend more of your money, I can't really answer that one for you.


 
 Thanks, ljokerl.  What I meant regarding the pricing was whether or not the Dunu was a clear upgrade from the Fidue (hence, reflective of their price differences).  I know that these days some $50-75 IEM's can sound close in quality to some $100-150 IEMs, so I wasn't sure if that was the case with these two.  Given that they have different sound signatures, I see now that they are not an easy comparison.  Sorry, didn't mean to make it seem like I was asking you if I should find it worth it to spend more of my money.
  
 Of the IEMs that I've tried, I have liked the Vsonic GR-99 and the JVC HA-FXT90 the best, with the Philips SHE3590 being next in line but definitely behind the other two.  I recently had a pair of the JVC HA-FXZ100 and then accidentally left them on a train shortly after I got them, which has me bummed (and feeling stupid...first time I've ever lost a pair of headphones) and now seeking another new pair of IEMs.  They sounded pretty good as well in the short time period that I had them.
  
 Besides the Fidue and the Dunu, I would like to try the Hifiman Re-400's as well, but I've read so many accounts of build quality issues that I am kind of turned off by them.


----------



## Amitl

any know issues with the vsonic adjustable nozzle mechanism?
 i really feel like playing with it, finding the best spot, but i'm a bit worried
 about loosening it up


----------



## kova4a

amitl said:


> any know issues with the vsonic adjustable nozzle mechanism?
> i really feel like playing with it, finding the best spot, but i'm a bit worried
> about loosening it up


 
 Not with the VSD1/S. It is tighter than the older models, which tended to get quite easy to move but my VSD1s personally are still tight.


----------



## Mr Trev

amitl said:


> any know issues with the vsonic adjustable nozzle mechanism?
> i really feel like playing with it, finding the best spot, but i'm a bit worried
> about loosening it up


 
 Just got a pair of 07be in Jan. One ear piece was pretty tight, but the other was much looser. Not enough to flop around mind you, but enough to move it when just changing tips. Actually came in handy since I could adjust the one side after I put them on.


----------



## kova4a

mr trev said:


> Just got a pair of 07be in Jan. One ear piece was pretty tight, but the other was much looser. Not enough to flop around mind you, but enough to move it when just changing tips. Actually came in handy since I could adjust the one side after I put them on.


 
  
 In my experience gr07, gr06 and gr04 were all a mixed bag in that department - often one or both of the nozzles were pretty loose or got loose over time. All 3 version of VSD1 I have are a lot more consistent and tighter - sometimes a bit tighter than needed but months after haven't become loose. My gr04fe in comparison now moves even when I'm very careful and it's slightly annoying coz often the nozzles don't end up perfectly aligned in my ear.


----------



## Mr Trev

kova4a said:


> In my experience gr07, gr06 and gr04 were all a mixed bag in that department - often one or both of the nozzles were pretty loose or got loose over time. All 3 version of VSD1 I have are a lot more consistent and tighter - sometimes a bit tighter than needed but months after haven't become loose. My gr04fe in comparison now moves even when I'm very careful and it's slightly annoying coz often the nozzles don't end up perfectly aligned in my ear.


 
 It's not a problem (yet). But again unless I'm doing something grossly wrong, it doesn't really matter to me what direction the nozzles end up pointing. It all seems to fit/sound exactly the same. Maybe its the comply tips, maybe its just my freakish ears....


----------



## ljokerl

I don’t adjust the nozzles much either so my 2011 mkI GR07 is still tight on both sides.
  


kurotaka said:


> The looks, never actually heard the Fidue though. I do, however enjoy the IE 800. What would you rate it out of 10? I read your review on innerfidelity.


 
  
 It’s about on-par with (certainly not worse than) the Ultrasone IQ.
  


oliverbb said:


> Hi Joker, could you or anyone compare the Thinksound ts02 and the Klipsch s4 (I have both) and how they compare to the Audio Technica CKM-500 (which I am currently interested in). The bass on the Thinksound's is probably the "bassiest" I would go on a headphone. From your review the CKM-500 is a more refined and upgrade to the Klipsch s4?
> 
> Thanks for your (or anyone elses) help!


 
  
 The CKM500 has a more mid-bassy sound than the TS02 IMO. You might not like the bass quantity on it. It is an S4 upgrade nonetheless – just that most people upgrading from the S4 wouldn’t want less bass but are okay with more.
  


steelglam said:


> Thanks, ljokerl.  What I meant regarding the pricing was whether or not the Dunu was a clear upgrade from the Fidue (hence, reflective of their price differences).  I know that these days some $50-75 IEM's can sound close in quality to some $100-150 IEMs, so I wasn't sure if that was the case with these two.  Given that they have different sound signatures, I see now that they are not an easy comparison.  Sorry, didn't mean to make it seem like I was asking you if I should find it worth it to spend more of my money.
> 
> Of the IEMs that I've tried, I have liked the Vsonic GR-99 and the JVC HA-FXT90 the best, with the Philips SHE3590 being next in line but definitely behind the other two.  I recently had a pair of the JVC HA-FXZ100 and then accidentally left them on a train shortly after I got them, which has me bummed (and feeling stupid...first time I've ever lost a pair of headphones) and now seeking another new pair of IEMs.  They sounded pretty good as well in the short time period that I had them.
> 
> Besides the Fidue and the Dunu, I would like to try the Hifiman Re-400's as well, but I've read so many accounts of build quality issues that I am kind of turned off by them.


 
  
Yeah I got your meaning. The Dunu is better but also has a different sound signature – in terms of signature I felt like the A63 came closer to what you were requesting. The RE-400 is also different from those two - more like the A63 in terms of midrange-treble balance but less bassy than both the Fidue and the Dunu.


----------



## turbare

Hi Joker,
  
 If you've by chance listened to AKG's K550, what would you say is a similar sounding pair of IEM's?
 Under around 50-60; I know I won't get the same quality in this budget, but something similar sounding (neutral sound I believe?).
 Want to use them for running and such.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> [COLOR=454545]Yeah I got your meaning. The Dunu is better but also has a different sound signature – in terms of signature I felt like the A63 came closer to what you were requesting. The RE-400 is also different from those two - more like the A63 in terms of midrange-treble balance but less bassy than both the Fidue and the Dunu.  [/COLOR]




Thanks, ljokerl. Much appreciated. I think I'll probably try the Fidue at this point, then. Kind of sounds like it is a middle ground between the other two in terms of sound signature. I think I'd like to go for something less V-shaped than I normally do because I find myself desiring more mids these days, as long as there aren't any peaks. Perhaps I will try the Dunu later down the road.


----------



## ljokerl

turbare said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> If you've by chance listened to AKG's K550, what would you say is a similar sounding pair of IEM's?
> Under around 50-60; I know I won't get the same quality in this budget, but something similar sounding (neutral sound I believe?).
> Want to use them for running and such.


 
  
 I do have a K550. My recommendation for sound would be the VSonic VC02 but I don't think it's particularly well-suited for running. Maybe if you glue the detachable cables in place it would be alright. Other than that, the LG Quadbeat F420 would be a decent option, or the Ety MC5 if you're willing to live with less bass impact. None of these are designed for running and I'm not sure how the sweat resistance will be in the long run.
  


steelglam said:


> Thanks, ljokerl. Much appreciated. I think I'll probably try the Fidue at this point, then. Kind of sounds like it is a middle ground between the other two in terms of sound signature. I think I'd like to go for something less V-shaped than I normally do because I find myself desiring more mids these days, as long as there aren't any peaks. Perhaps I will try the Dunu later down the road.


 
  
 Hope you enjoy the A63!


----------



## laon

Any plan to review Ostry KC06 Joker?


----------



## turbare

ljokerl said:


> I do have a K550. My recommendation for sound would be the VSonic VC02 but I don't think it's particularly well-suited for running. Maybe if you glue the detachable cables in place it would be alright. Other than that, the LG Quadbeat F420 would be a decent option, or the Ety MC5 if you're willing to live with less bass impact. None of these are designed for running and I'm not sure how the sweat resistance will be in the long run.
> 
> 
> Hope you enjoy the A63!


 
 Thank you very much  ljokerl!


----------



## ljokerl

laon said:


> Any plan to review Ostry KC06 Joker?


 
  
 Likely, though not in the immediate future.


----------



## sbose

ljokerl said:


> Likely, though not in the immediate future.


 
 what are you currently working on ? 
 i see you have posted the tpos tank review.


----------



## ljokerl

sbose said:


> what are you currently working on ?
> i see you have posted the tpos tank review.


 
  
 Currently the Ocharaku/Olasonic Flat-4 Nami


----------



## SilverEars

Joker, I know the CK10 is one of your favorite IEMs, and arn't you curious if the IM0X series is better?  I'm looking forward to your reviews on the IM0X series.


----------



## Ikarios

Speaking of the AT IEMs, there's a lot of new interesting IEMs from audio-technica, like the CK100pro and of course the IM series. Hopefully Joker will get to them in due time, but between his full schedule and the relative scarcity of these new IEMs outside of Japan I'm not sure how hopeful we can be about the chances of these IEMs getting reviewed. Fingers crossed!


----------



## ljokerl

Definitely curious about the current crop of AT IEMs. Just need to finish up with the CKX5iS before tackling any more.


----------



## SilverEars

Your impressions of the CK-10 is dead on.  I agree with it 100%
  
 I've ordered the NT6, and hope to agree there too.


----------



## Tamirci

As having used ATH im-02 for over a month, I think I can answer your questions 'till the mighty one reviews


----------



## CyanBlues

I just recently purchased the Creative Aurvana In Ear 3 as a shot in the dark, but I'm finding them too mid forward for my tastes.  Any recommendations that have a bit more bass, less forward mids, and around the same highs for $30-$100?  Maybe something that sounds similar to the Sennheiser PX-100, if anyone has that to compare to.
  
 I listen to mostly ska punk/punk rock and various rock/metal, so I guess something balanced to warm/mildly v shaped would be good.  But I do know I don't like harsh and/or fatiguing highs.
  
 I'm currently eyeing these, Etymotic MC5, HiFiMan Re-400, Vsonic GR06, Shure SE215, Brainwavz M5, but am unsure which direction to try next.


----------



## snappyaxolotl

So, about that Triple.Fi 10 review that was requested a while back....


----------



## Don Lehrer

snappyaxolotl said:


> So, about that Triple.Fi 10 review that was requested a while back....


 
 +1


----------



## ljokerl

silverears said:


> Your impressions of the CK-10 is dead on.  I agree with it 100%
> 
> I've ordered the NT6, and hope to agree there too.


 
  
 I hope so too 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. To me it's the logical next step for a CK10 fan.
  


cyanblues said:


> I just recently purchased the Creative Aurvana In Ear 3 as a shot in the dark, but I'm finding them too mid forward for my tastes.  Any recommendations that have a bit more bass, less forward mids, and around the same highs for $30-$100?  Maybe something that sounds similar to the Sennheiser PX-100, if anyone has that to compare to.
> 
> I listen to mostly ska punk/punk rock and various rock/metal, so I guess something balanced to warm/mildly v shaped would be good.  But I do know I don't like harsh and/or fatiguing highs.
> 
> I'm currently eyeing these, Etymotic MC5, HiFiMan Re-400, Vsonic GR06, Shure SE215, Brainwavz M5, but am unsure which direction to try next.


 
  
 You're looking at some pretty mid-centric earphones for someone who's trying to avoid that. The SE215 is probably the best option for you out of those.  You might also consider the Phonak Perfect Bass if you can find it (it was still available on amazon last I checked) or the SteelSeries Flux if you can live with a bit more treble energy.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the T-Peos Tank
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A85) T-Peos Tank*
> 
> 
> Reviewed March 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## kamcok

ikarios said:


> Speaking of the AT IEMs, there's a lot of new interesting IEMs from audio-technica, like the CK100pro and of course the IM series. Hopefully Joker will get to them in due time, but between his full schedule and the relative scarcity of these new IEMs outside of Japan I'm not sure how hopeful we can be about the chances of these IEMs getting reviewed. Fingers crossed!


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> Definitely curious about the current crop of AT IEMs. Just need to finish up with the CKX5iS before tackling any more.


 
  
 Talking about new AT IEMs, they just announced a new line again, the CKR series. hahaha


----------



## Grayson73

snappyaxolotl said:


> So, about that Triple.Fi 10 review that was requested a while back....


 
 Joker sure has a lot going on.  I'm still waiting for the BA200, Fidelio S2, and VSD1/VSD1S to be added to the comparison table 
  
 Joker, have you heard the KEF M200?


----------



## modulor

grayson73 said:


> Joker sure has a lot going on.  I'm still waiting for the BA200, Fidelio S2, and VSD1/VSD1S to be added to the comparison table
> 
> Joker, have you heard the KEF M200?


 
 Also waiting for a more in-depth write up on the BA200 too, but no rush...I already know they're great


----------



## addsfsds

Hi headfiers!

 I'm waiting for the Fiio X5 (it will be my first DAP after the creative zen vision:M 60gb) and i still have my beloved phonaks PFE 122. I mainly listen to Rock (Muse, Beatles, Pink Floyd, Flaming Lips etc.) and Jazz (Pat Metheny Group, EST and other ACT artists) and i'm not a basshead. What should I look for to be an improvement from my PFEs? Price range is up to $250.
  
 Thanks!!


----------



## Ikarios

Given Joker's brief impressions of the BA200, the RE400 review, and having owned the BA200 for a little while, I would expect a 9.1 or maybe even a 9.2 from the BA200, which is pretty impressive given that I just sold mine for $80. Maybe I should have waited for his full review to come out to sell it


----------



## ozkan

addsfsds said:


> Hi headfiers!
> 
> I'm waiting for the Fiio X5 (it will be my first DAP after the creative zen vision:M 60gb) and i still have my beloved phonaks PFE 122. I mainly listen to Rock (Muse, Beatles, Pink Floyd, Flaming Lips etc.) and Jazz (Pat Metheny Group, EST and other ACT artists) and i'm not a basshead. What should I look for to be an improvement from my PFEs? Price range is up to $250.
> 
> Thanks!!


 
 I would recommend IM02 for a significant upgrade from PFE122.


----------



## CyanBlues

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> You're looking at some pretty mid-centric earphones for someone who's trying to avoid that. The SE215 is probably the best option for you out of those.  You might also consider the Phonak Perfect Bass if you can find it (it was still available on amazon last I checked) or the SteelSeries Flux if you can live with a bit more treble energy.


 
  
 I know, but I'm not entirely sure that the mids were actually too forward for me, or if if I just want more low end with them.  On some songs I rather liked the IE3 but others, mostly rock songs, left me feeling meh.  
  
 I was originally looking at the Flux but my current mp3 player and computer don't like TRRS plugs, so I decided to try something else.  But I just purchased a Sansa Clip+ so the Flux should work with that.  
  
 I think I will try the Shure SE215 and/or Steelseries Flux, and then decide if I'm barking up the wrong tree and go for something more V shaped.
  
 Thanks for the response.


----------



## ljokerl

kamcok said:


> Talking about new AT IEMs, they just announced a new line again, the CKR series. hahaha


 
  
I've given up on keeping up with their releases. I'm pretty sure AT has the most extensive headphone (especially IEM) lineup in the world. 
  


grayson73 said:


> Joker sure has a lot going on.  I'm still waiting for the BA200, Fidelio S2, and VSD1/VSD1S to be added to the comparison table
> 
> Joker, have you heard the KEF M200?


 
  
 I have not heard the M200. 
  


addsfsds said:


> Hi headfiers!
> 
> I'm waiting for the Fiio X5 (it will be my first DAP after the creative zen vision:M 60gb) and i still have my beloved phonaks PFE 122. I mainly listen to Rock (Muse, Beatles, Pink Floyd, Flaming Lips etc.) and Jazz (Pat Metheny Group, EST and other ACT artists) and i'm not a basshead. What should I look for to be an improvement from my PFEs? Price range is up to $250.
> 
> Thanks!!


 
  
 Replied to your question on the website
  


ikarios said:


> Given Joker's brief impressions of the BA200, the RE400 review, and having owned the BA200 for a little while, I would expect a 9.1 or maybe even a 9.2 from the BA200, which is pretty impressive given that I just sold mine for $80. Maybe I should have waited for his full review to come out to sell it


 
  
 Maybe 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I still can't believe some people got them for $25
  


cyanblues said:


> I know, but I'm not entirely sure that the mids were actually too forward for me, or if if I just want more low end with them.  On some songs I rather liked the IE3 but others, mostly rock songs, left me feeling meh.
> 
> I was originally looking at the Flux but my current mp3 player and computer don't like TRRS plugs, so I decided to try something else.  But I just purchased a Sansa Clip+ so the Flux should work with that.
> 
> ...


 
  
 For what it's worth, the Flux is more v-shaped than the SE215.


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hi joker, how's the t-peos d-202 compared to the t-peos tank? Which one is better? 

And have you tried the nuforce ne-600x ? How does it compare with the other two?


----------



## scorpio187

ljokerl, Is there any chance to review the Roxanne in the near future?


----------



## SilverEars

Joker, it would be awsome if the companies can provide lots of DAPs and sources to you for review.  I would be looking forward to your iem sources comparison.  What is your best source at the moment?


----------



## Amitl

what is it with all those flat-cable iems? instead of progressing, manufacturers are moving backwards?


----------



## MoonYeol

amitl said:


> what is it with all those flat-cable iems? instead of progressing, manufacturers are moving backwards?




Tangle a bit less than thinner cables. The main crowd seems to focus a lot on the 5 seconds it takes to unwind a pair of iems instead of the 2h of listening. But it looks kind of good and flashy if you're into the plasticky look instead of a classy, potentially pretentious braided cable with a wooden chin slider.


----------



## Lukalop

Have you auditioned the Roxanne's yet by any chance?


----------



## ljokerl

justgotlucky123 said:


> Hi joker, how's the t-peos d-202 compared to the t-peos tank? Which one is better?
> 
> And have you tried the nuforce ne-600x ? How does it compare with the other two?


 
  
 I only have the D200R - is that the same as the D202? If so based on only a few hours of listening I'd say I prefer it to the Tank. I haven't tried the NE-600X.
  


silverears said:


> Joker, it would be awsome if the companies can provide lots of DAPs and sources to you for review.  I would be looking forward to your iem sources comparison.  What is your best source at the moment?


 
  
 I use the HiFiMan HM-901 with IEM card. In terms of sound quality I have no complaints.
   


scorpio187 said:


> ljokerl, Is there any chance to review the Roxanne in the near future?


 
  



lukalop said:


> Have you auditioned the Roxanne's yet by any chance?


 
  
 I haven't tried the Roxanne but I may be able to get a loaner of the universal version in the near future.


----------



## Overkill Red

Joker, are there any plans to take a look at the Dita Audio 'Answer' IEMs?


----------



## ljokerl

overkill red said:


> Joker, are there any plans to take a look at the Dita Audio 'Answer' IEMs?


 
  
 I hadn't even heard of them until quite recently. No plans yet, maybe in the future.


----------



## padcat

Quick question: For well-recorded classical music, which of these VSonic earphones would present a 'closer to live' sound: The VC02, the VSD1 or the VSD1S?


----------



## ljokerl

padcat said:


> Quick question: For well-recorded classical music, which of these VSonic earphones would present a 'closer to live' sound: The VC02, the VSD1 or the VSD1S?


 
  
The VC02 is the most flat/neutral of the three if that’s what you’re after. I personally like the slightly fuller bass of the VSD1S – it doesn’t sound unnatural to me – but it’s not reference-flat for sure.


----------



## vwinter

Anyone know what the IEM depicted below is? It looks like a black glossy plastic pebble and a unique plug with a fat-ish glossy cable. I saw someone wearing it and was intrigued since it didn't have a logo. I'm guessing it was a universal... Just curious.


----------



## padcat

ljokerl said:


> The VC02 is the most flat/neutral of the three if that’s what you’re after. I personally like the slightly fuller bass of the VSD1S – it doesn’t sound unnatural to me – but it’s not reference-flat for sure.



 


Thank you for your answer. I'm going for the VC02.


----------



## PotatoEars

It looks like an Audio Technica IM in-ear.


vwinter said:


> Anyone know what the IEM depicted below is? It looks like a black glossy plastic pebble and a unique plug with a fat-ish glossy cable. I saw someone wearing it and was intrigued since it didn't have a logo. I'm guessing it was a universal... Just curious.


----------



## Anouk

Hi Ljokerl,
 I want to thank you immensely once more. I pereodically look over your comparison threads (and have a great deal of fun with them) and today i found the inear stagedivers which i otherwise would have never stumbled upon. I live in europe and a lot of the other products are often difficult to get (especially with added customs time shipping and taxes) but with the inear i got lucky. I am still carefully going over them versus the sm64 but i think the stagediver 3 will  win out.
 I had seen your reviews of the ie800 and the re600 on innerfidelity and i think you also mention hte model a few times int his thread. I was wondering when they will be added as their own entries?
 Also I saw you mention the westone es5 a few times. I am pretty interested in how it compares to the jh13 and if it will get its own entry too?
 I am pretty interested to see how the ie800 compares to other dynamics (dynamics are my favourite) like the inears but also to the top model from akg obviously.
 Thanks again for the great and continuing work! Its always a joy to see that new entries have been added and after all this time i really know what i am looking for and of your descriptions will match what i am looking for.
 Greetings, Anouk,


----------



## vwinter

potatoears said:


> It looks like an Audio Technica IM in-ear.




Looked into it and while it does a bit, it wasn't.
Here are the differences from the AT IM series:



The plug housing is huge. The cylinder extended past the edges if the dudes cellphone.

Please excuse the sloppy cellphone markup.

Thanks for trying!


----------



## getclikinagas

vwinter said:


> Anyone know what the IEM depicted below is? It looks like a black glossy plastic pebble and a unique plug with a fat-ish glossy cable. I saw someone wearing it and was intrigued since it didn't have a logo. I'm guessing it was a universal... Just curious.


  


  
  
  
 Red Giant Ossicle A03 perhaps.
 The plug looks similar too


----------



## esteebin

vwinter said:


> Anyone know what the IEM depicted below is? It looks like a black glossy plastic pebble and a unique plug with a fat-ish glossy cable. I saw someone wearing it and was intrigued since it didn't have a logo. I'm guessing it was a universal... Just curious.




That could be a number of IEMs. What came to mind are EarSonics. Or even Westone.

Edit: by the way, great drawing.


----------



## vwinter

getclikinagas said:


> Red Giant Ossicle A03 perhaps.
> The plug looks similar too




Nope. I actually tested the ossicle out haha. Cable is thicker than the plug. The plug housing is about as long as the plug and 3x the diameter. The outside part that someone can see when it's in the ear is flat except where it tapers in at the bottom a bit and the edges are a bit rounded. It's glossy black plastic that is reflective and no logo.

To be honest, except the most exact proportions, my rendering is reasonably accurate so if someone had seen it before, they would probably know off the bat.

Thanks for taking a shot!


----------



## kova4a

esteebin said:


> That could be a number of IEMs. What came to mind are EarSonics. Or even Westone.
> 
> Edit: by the way, great drawing.


 
 Nah, they don't use mmcx connectors. Judging by the connector and the plug it was probably a shure iem.


----------



## getclikinagas

vwinter said:


> Nope. I actually tested the ossicle out haha. Cable is thicker than the plug. The plug housing is about as long as the plug and 3x the diameter. *The outside part that someone can see when it's in the ear is flat *except where it tapers in at the bottom a bit and the edges are a bit rounded. It's glossy black plastic that is reflective and no logo.
> 
> To be honest, except the most exact proportions, my rendering is reasonably accurate so if someone had seen it before, they would probably know off the bat.
> 
> Thanks for taking a shot!


 
 Flat = Faceplate = Definitely Custom?


----------



## vwinter

esteebin said:


> That could be a number of IEMs. What came to mind are EarSonics. Or even Westone.
> 
> Edit: by the way, great drawing.




Haha thanks!

I don't think it's earsonics from what I've seen but I'll take a look. I've provided more description in responses above.

It's definitely not westone unless their new models are radically different in shape and design. Also, not a braided cable 




kova4a said:


> Nah, they don't use mmcx connectors. Judging by the connector and the plug it was probably a shure iem.




Nope housing is too boxy for the Shure style. Also, in case anyone is wondering, it's not translucent or transparent.




getclikinagas said:


> Flat = Faceplate = Definitely Custom?




I'm leaning toward but It didn't look like any custom I'd ever seen. It looked like a machined and designed body, one piece, rounded edges but flat sides. It wasn't a faceplate in the strictest sense and it actually tapered in at the bottom toward the ear, unlike most customs. And the housing where the plug is only extended about halfway as far as the bottom part.



Joker: let me know if you want me to take this to a separate thread. I just wanted to see if maybe you or one of the many that have seen a ton of IEMs here would recognize it before as something common before I started a stupid separate thread.


----------



## james444

vwinter said:


> Anyone know what the IEM depicted below is? It looks like a black glossy plastic pebble and a unique plug with a fat-ish glossy cable. I saw someone wearing it and was intrigued since it didn't have a logo. I'm guessing it was a universal... Just curious.


 
  
 Perhaps a StageDiver with black (aftermarket) cable? (x2 on great drawing)
  
 Edit: take a look at this post.


----------



## eke2k6

james444 said:


> Perhaps a StageDiver with black (aftermarket) cable? (x2 on great drawing)
> 
> Edit: take a look at this post.


 
  
 x2
  
 Is this your card?


----------



## ljokerl

vwinter said:


> Anyone know what the IEM depicted below is? It looks like a black glossy plastic pebble and a unique plug with a fat-ish glossy cable. I saw someone wearing it and was intrigued since it didn't have a logo. I'm guessing it was a universal... Just curious.


 
  
 Interesting. Honestly, not a clue... black ergonomic-fit IEMs makes me think Westone or Earsonics but those are more rounded except for the original SM2 (which uses a non-detachable braided cable). Doesn't really look like a StageDiver to me, especially the way (angle) the cable attaches to the housing.


----------



## 736iU

Hi, between the Phonak PFE 112 and the Vsonic VC1000, which would be the better option? I can't decide which one to get. 
  
 Thanks in advance


----------



## vwinter

james444 said:


> Perhaps a StageDiver with black (aftermarket) cable? (x2 on great drawing)
> 
> Edit: take a look at this post.




Thanks re: the drawing!

Nope, not the SD2. More... Industrial, less organic.

The SD2 very much looks like a pebble though. I'd say it was a bit less... substantial looking in material, less stone more nice plastic machined inorganic stone haha.




eke2k6 said:


> x2
> 
> Is this your card?




Nope. But that picture helped with making sure no.

Thanks too!




ljokerl said:


> Interesting. Honestly, not a clue... black ergonomic-fit IEMs makes me think Westone or Earsonics but those are more rounded except for the original SM2 (which uses a non-detachable braided cable). Doesn't really look like a StageDiver to me, especially the way (angle) the cable attaches to the housing.




Similar-ish to an original sm2 in all black, but slicker more well built looking. The shape of where the connector attaches to the body is the right proportion though. 

It's just interesting because it looked like a well built, likely pricy, IEM that I had not seen, in the US.

Probably a mix between a black Audio Technica IM line mixed with the original SM2, no logo.

Fit looked almost custom good on the guy if not for the universal touches in design.

I'm just very curious haha.


----------



## Gilly87

The plug and housing look like the old fixed-cable Westone universals, maybe with the logo rubbed off; cable doesn't sound right though.


----------



## ljokerl

It also looks like one of those VSonic concepts
  

  
  
  
  
  
  


736iu said:


> Hi, between the Phonak PFE 112 and the Vsonic VC1000, which would be the better option? I can't decide which one to get.
> 
> Thanks in advance


 
  
 Personally I'd go for the VC1000. I love the sound of these, and the price is right. The only thing that might tip it the other way is if you were more comfortable with the shallower fit of the Phonaks.


----------



## Harijs

Hi, Joker!
 Based on your reviews, I bought the VSD1s to friend, who was looking for a good budget IEM. I tried them and was really surprised.
 I like VSD1s more than my TF10!
 In comparison, I liked the more balanced, more natural sound, less V-shaped and airy sound  of the dinamic VSD1s, but the most important thing to me was that the VSD1s is more pleasant to listen to at higher volume. TF10 hights sounds too edgy/harsh (don't know the right description) to me at higher volume. VSD1s is less edgy, but still a bit.
 So, which dinamic IEM's would be an upgrade to VSD1s? Bass is important to me, notably deep sub-bass. Like, if In-Ears can reach the lowest lows. (If the record asks to)
 Thanks and sorry about my english.


----------



## SilverEars

Hi Joker, will you ever review the UE Reference Monitor?(forget it, looks like you reviewed the demo here  I had a chance to listen in on the demo at the NY meet yesterday, and I thought they were fantastic.
  
 Edit:looks like Joker reviewed a demo unit.


----------



## getclikinagas

silverears said:


> Hi Joker, will you ever review the UE Reference Monitor?(forget it, looks like you reviewed the demo here  I had a change to listen in on the demo at the NY meet yesterday, and I thought they were fantastic.
> 
> Edit:looks like Joker reviewed a demo unit.


 
 Here you go  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 http://theheadphonelist.com/short-impressions-ultimate-ears-reference-monitor-uerm-demo/


----------



## SilverEars

I hope I made the right decision with the NT6, since I ordered them already.  Reference Monitor demo was pretty amazing though.  If I didn't have NT6 on order, I would have ordered it from UE right on the spot.


----------



## Gilly87

:O Maybe I found them?


----------



## esteebin

gilly87 said:


> :O Maybe I found them?




Can you retake the pic? It appears to be out of focus. What IEM are those? Thanks


----------



## Lukalop

What is the most coherent IEM you have heard to date?


----------



## ljokerl

harijs said:


> Hi, Joker!
> Based on your reviews, I bought the VSD1s to friend, who was looking for a good budget IEM. I tried them and was really surprised.
> I like VSD1s more than my TF10!
> In comparison, I liked the more balanced, more natural sound, less V-shaped and airy sound  of the dinamic VSD1s, but the most important thing to me was that the VSD1s is more pleasant to listen to at higher volume. TF10 hights sounds too edgy/harsh (don't know the right description) to me at higher volume. VSD1s is less edgy, but still a bit.
> ...


 
  
 If the VSD1S had about the right bass quantity for you, the GR07 Bass Edition would be a logical next step - not a huge difference between them but the GR07 is a clearer and more refined still, with better bass control. If you want greater deep bass quantity then you'd probably want to look at something like a DN-1000 or RHA MA750. 
  


silverears said:


> Hi Joker, will you ever review the UE Reference Monitor?(forget it, looks like you reviewed the demo here  I had a chance to listen in on the demo at the NY meet yesterday, and I thought they were fantastic.


 
  
 I thought they were fantastic too.


----------



## ljokerl

lukalop said:


> What is the most coherent IEM you have heard to date?


 
  
 There's really no "most coherent". Most sets sound fine to me from a coherency standpoint, there are just a few that bug me. So I don't know... Ety ER4S?


----------



## Lukalop

I would assume JH's FP lineup to be amongst the best as they are touted as having frequency phase?


----------



## kova4a

It's not really a matter of fancy gimmicks or new tech - single drivers almost always have the upper hand in coherency. So in reality people usually complain about coherency with multi BA and hybrids.


----------



## rawrster

lukalop said:


> I would assume JH's FP lineup to be amongst the best as they are touted as having frequency phase?


 
  
 They certainly are the best iem I've ever heard. It really is more about preference at the level of the JH!3 FP


----------



## Gilly87

Its not my picture, ran across it doing google image search for black UM series; apparently its a UM1 or 2 painted black, cant remember which.
  
 Quote:


esteebin said:


> Can you retake the pic? It appears to be out of focus. What IEM are those? Thanks


----------



## Lukalop

Sorry to bother, where do I find the definitions forum?


----------



## modulor

lukalop said:


> Sorry to bother, where do I find the definitions forum?


 
 There is a 'Describing Sound' Glossary here if that's what you're looking for: http://www.head-fi.org/a/describing-sound-a-glossary


----------



## MDFMK

Looking for a new IEM to use with my phone, since that's likely to be my primary source for on the go listening from this point forward.  I really enjoy my JVC FXT90s, but they don't have a mic and while they sound quite fine running through the amp hooked to my PC, they sound a bit piercing and hot in the treble region on my Galaxy S3.  It takes heavy EQing to make them sound suitable.
  
 Would the RHA MA750 be a better fit, perhaps?  I've been eyeing those for a little while now.


----------



## ljokerl

mdfmk said:


> Looking for a new IEM to use with my phone, since that's likely to be my primary source for on the go listening from this point forward.  I really enjoy my JVC FXT90s, but they don't have a mic and while they sound quite fine running through the amp hooked to my PC, they sound a bit piercing and hot in the treble region on my Galaxy S3.  It takes heavy EQing to make them sound suitable.
> 
> Would the RHA MA750 be a better fit, perhaps?  I've been eyeing those for a little while now.


 
  
 Yeah, sounds like the MA750i would be a better fit for you - less overall treble energy than the FXT90. Less midrange presence, as well, but not in a bad way.
  
 The center button on the remote should work with the S3 even though the volume control won't.


----------



## Lukalop

A higher quality iTunes could be on its way this year, June infact!

http://feedly.com/e/TyH9RRKh


----------



## Francisk

Joker...is http://theheadphonelist.com/ down?


----------



## ljokerl

francisk said:


> Joker...is http://theheadphonelist.com/ down?


 
  
 Yes... there was a planned site upgrade (additional functionality) and something went wrong 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Resource use went through the roof. It is temporarily offline until the problem is resolved (hopefully that will happen today).


----------



## Francisk

Thanks for the update Joker


----------



## SilverEars

rawrster said:


> They certainly are the best iem I've ever heard. It really is more about preference at the level of the JH!3 FP


 
 rawrster, what is your favorite source and amp?


----------



## Gandasaputra

Tell you what, all earphones I bought according to joker's favorites have brought joy; earphones outside his recommendation like audio technica's ath-im70 and sony's xba-30 are complete disappointment (Except xiaomi piston!). In joker I trust!


----------



## Don Lehrer

gandasaputra said:


> In joker I trust!


 
 Amen!


----------



## ljokerl

gandasaputra said:


> Tell you what, all earphones I bought according to joker's favorites have brought joy; earphones outside his recommendation like audio technica's ath-im70 and sony's xba-30 are complete disappointment (Except xiaomi piston!). In joker I trust!


 
  
 I wasn't a fan of the XBA-3, even chose to pass on reviewing it. Glad my reviews have been useful!


----------



## BluePhoenixHD

Joker, May I ask if you heard the Astrotec Am-900's? I saw the Am-800 review and was looking around at pricing and found them.
  
 As for the Fidue, would there be any way to get rid of the sharp edges? Not sure how exactly as sand paper just seems to be a bad idea. =P


----------



## Gandasaputra

ljokerl said:


> I wasn't a fan of the XBA-3, even chose to pass on reviewing it. Glad my reviews have been useful!


 
 It is sad that anything beyond Sony's MH1 line are dookies. You should save your quality time and limit your review to 8-10 ranges earphones, sir! But it'd be entertaining if you could review some badly hyped earphones as well.


----------



## SilverEars

gandasaputra said:


> It is sad that anything beyond Sony's MH1 line are dookies. You should save your quality time and limit your review to 8-10 ranges earphones, sir! But it'd be entertaining if you could review some badly hyped earphones as well.


 
 I thought the EX-1000 was pretty amazing.  It sounded very open with wide stage and sounded detailed with great dynamics.


----------



## ljokerl

Website is back with partial functionality. Looks like it was also attacked by a spam bot - hundreds of fake accounts were created in the past 24h. New account creation has been disabled temporarily. 
  


gandasaputra said:


> It is sad that anything beyond Sony's MH1 line are dookies. You should save your quality time and limit your review to 8-10 ranges earphones, sir! But it'd be entertaining if you could review some badly hyped earphones as well.


 
  
 I quite liked the EX600 and EX1000 as well, though I think they've been dropped from the lineup.
  
 I do try to spend my time on things that are worth reviewing but my plan is to at least write up some brief impressions of things that don't get reviewed in full, either due to poor performance or whatever other reason. Those can be found here: http://theheadphonelist.com/category/brief-impressions/


----------



## SilverEars

I hope you get a hand on the V8 from 1964 ears to hear how well it does with the top contenders, although you reviewed the V6 already.  I'm thinnking V6 is more of your taste based on your impressions of UERM and JH13FP.  Guys at the 1964 thread told me V8 is like JH16 to JH13.


----------



## rawrster

silverears said:


> rawrster, what is your favorite source and amp?


 
  
 I'm probably not the best to ask about that. With portable audio I just use my phone these days. Many may not agree but I do find my phone good enough. There's very few out there that really does a good enough job for me in terms of good sound and good UI. The AK240 is nice but too expensive for portable audio so I don't see myself getting any higher anymore. However if I'm at home and want to use my iem's I have a Concero HP that I use for those situations.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Olasonic/Ocharaku Flat-4 Nami
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1B12) Olasonic Flat-4 Nami TH-F4N*
> 
> 
> Reviewed March 2014
> ...


 
  
  


silverears said:


> I hope you get a hand on the V8 from 1964 ears to hear how well it does with the top contenders, although you reviewed the V6 already.  I'm thinnking V6 is more of your taste based on your impressions of UERM and JH13FP.  Guys at the 1964 thread told me V8 is like JH16 to JH13.


 
  
 Maybe there'll be a V8-Stage in the future


----------



## mechgamer123

Joker, have you had the chance to listen to the Sony XBA-H3 yet? I got to try it out for a week and I really liked the sound signature, but the poor isolation and huge shells are holding me back from ordering one quite yet. I get the feeling I would always be wanting something with better isolation and whatnot.. I know I've posted a few times before asking for suggestions, but never had an IEM exactly in mind to describe the sound signature I was looking for, but now I've found it in the form of the H3. Any recommendations on sets with similar sound signatures that isolate better?


----------



## oostcoast

I'm looking for a cheap IEM to use for my travels. I've read the buyers guide for $50 earphones and the VSonic VSD1(S) and Thinksound MS01 are on my shortlist. My main headphone is a beyerdynamic DT770. How do these earphones compare to the sound characteristics of the DT? I love the sound of the DT so I want something that closely emulates its sound.


----------



## daniel_hokkaido

Hey Joker 
  
 Any thoughts on the NAMI as a compliment to my er4s? I was looking for something lusher for computer music which the etys make sound quite flat.


----------



## ljokerl

mechgamer123 said:


> Joker, have you had the chance to listen to the Sony XBA-H3 yet? I got to try it out for a week and I really liked the sound signature, but the poor isolation and huge shells are holding me back from ordering one quite yet. I get the feeling I would always be wanting something with better isolation and whatnot.. I know I've posted a few times before asking for suggestions, but never had an IEM exactly in mind to describe the sound signature I was looking for, but now I've found it in the form of the H3. Any recommendations on sets with similar sound signatures that isolate better?


 
  
 I haven’t tried it. Sounds like the ergonomics are similar to the old EX-series units.
  


oostcoast said:


> I'm looking for a cheap IEM to use for my travels. I've read the buyers guide for $50 earphones and the VSonic VSD1(S) and Thinksound MS01 are on my shortlist. My main headphone is a beyerdynamic DT770. How do these earphones compare to the sound characteristics of the DT? I love the sound of the DT so I want something that closely emulates its sound.


 
  
 It’s been a while since I’ve tried the DT770 (250ohm version). From what I remember of them the MS01 will likely be a little too warm and dark in comparison- the VSD1S should be a better match. But, I can’t say with certainty how close it will be since I don’t have access to a DT770.
  


daniel_hokkaido said:


> Hey Joker
> 
> Any thoughts on the NAMI as a compliment to my er4s? I was looking for something lusher for computer music which the etys make sound quite flat.


 
  
Might be too close in that respect, actually – the Nami has punchy bass but it’s not an earphone I would describe as “lush” – not enough upper bass/lower midrange bloom or note thickness for that. I would think you’d want a bigger contrast to your ER4S than the Nami if you just have the two earphones – at least something bassier like a Dunu DN-1k, or if you don't want more bass than the Olasonic simply a warmer-sounding earphone, like the MDR-7550.


----------



## james444

mechgamer123 said:


> Joker, have you had the chance to listen to the Sony XBA-H3 yet? I got to try it out for a week and I really liked the sound signature, *but the poor isolation and huge shells are holding me back from ordering one quite yet*. I get the feeling I would always be wanting something with better isolation and whatnot.. I know I've posted a few times before asking for suggestions, but never had an IEM exactly in mind to describe the sound signature I was looking for, but now I've found it in the form of the H3. Any recommendations on sets with similar sound signatures that isolate better?


 


mechgamer123 said:


> ... I ordered a set that will be here on Thursday.


 
  
 Well, your resistance didn't last long... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 As for something similar with better isolation, I found mids and treble pretty similar between the XBA-H3 and XBA-3. The latter are significantly smaller and isolate much better, but in turn you'll lose the dynamic driver's better bass extension and texture and the vented H3's huge and open soundstage.


----------



## Hank_Venture

The T-PEOS H-300 seem seriously nice, might be throwing that in to compete with the JVC FX-750.


----------



## Francisk

Joker, you did a good review on the Dunu DN-1000 and I'm looking forward to your DN-2000 review


----------



## ellis ip

joker , i finding a new iem , i have a few choice in my mind , final audio design VI , flat 4 sui , im03 , f111 which one is better


----------



## mechgamer123

james444 said:


> mechgamer123 said:
> 
> 
> > Joker, have you had the chance to listen to the Sony XBA-H3 yet? I got to try it out for a week and I really liked the sound signature, *but the poor isolation and huge shells are holding me back from ordering one quite yet*. I get the feeling I would always be wanting something with better isolation and whatnot.. I know I've posted a few times before asking for suggestions, but never had an IEM exactly in mind to describe the sound signature I was looking for, but now I've found it in the form of the H3. Any recommendations on sets with similar sound signatures that isolate better?
> ...


 
 Yep, thanks to the sale on Amazon.com, I said screw it and went for it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Haha, but the bass is one of the things I like about the H3; I still haven't heard an IEM that uses BAs for bass that provides the necessary punch I'm looking for.


----------



## ljokerl

hank_venture said:


> The T-PEOS H-300 seem seriously nice, might be throwing that in to compete with the JVC FX-750.


 
  
 I’m still exploring the lower bounds of the T-Peos lineup – haven’t tried the H-200 or H-300 yet.
  


francisk said:


> Joker, you did a good review on the Dunu DN-1000 and I'm looking forward to your DN-2000 review


 
  
I should have some early impressions of the DN-2000 ready soon. I quite like it!
  


ellis ip said:


> joker , i finding a new iem , i have a few choice in my mind , final audio design VI , flat 4 sui , im03 , f111 which one is better


 
  
 Sorry, haven't heard any of those.


----------



## ellis ip

so sad , i heard the fad VI , sui and im03 were really gd , you should try these , maybe i write the review later


----------



## TheTalbotHound

I thought the Nami was just a rebranded Flat 4 Sui.


----------



## donedj

Hi Joker
  
 Did you have the chance to try the new Philips SHE9710?
 If so what are your thoughts?
  
 I tried them and really loved them, for the price in Japan (around $20) I felt like they offer value of iems in the 100-200 range.


----------



## RochRx7

Still waiting on DN200000000000!!!!!! XD


----------



## ljokerl

thetalbothound said:


> I thought the Nami was just a rebranded Flat 4 Sui.


 
  
 I was under the impression that all of the Flat-4 sets are different - Sui, Nami, Kuro, etc - see the release thread here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/676902/ocharaku-flat4-nami-th-f4n
  


donedj said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Did you have the chance to try the new Philips SHE9710?
> If so what are your thoughts?
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, never even heard of it before.


----------



## suman134

does the brainwavz b2 needs an amp ? should i buy it , i already have an ety er-4p ?


----------



## suman134

and what about the new gr07 classic ? is this same as the first gr07 ?


----------



## airomjosh

suman134 said:


> and what about the new gr07 classic ? is this same as the first gr07 ?


 
 yes, they are the same but the classic are much cheaper and with different variants.


----------



## Lukalop

Why is it that CIEM manufacturers tend to sell their IEMs with inferior cables? If the cable contributes to the sound, wouldn't they want it to sound as best as possible?


----------



## PCWar

ljokerl said:


> I was under the impression that all of the Flat-4 sets are different - Sui, Nami, Kuro, etc - see the release thread here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/676902/ocharaku-flat4-nami-th-f4n
> 
> 
> Sorry, never even heard of it before.


 
  
 Hi Joker,
  
  
 I had the pleasure to listen to the Kaedes and now own the Kuros. Also, own the Sony EX1000. After reading your review of the Nami I'm more of the impression that each of the Ocharaku's iems do change in some aspects.
  
 The Kaedes were really a jewel I couldn't afford to keep. Althought I almost paid 3 times the price of the Sony EX1000 still did not expect them to sound that good. Noticeably deeper soundstage although just a tad narrower on the horizontal plane. They retained the same bass quality but leaner and a tad faster, with the extra quantity on the higher bass notes that highly contribute to their more fun sound signature. Sweeter mids although just a bit more behind compared to bass and treble, still more detailed. Extremely detailed and non-fatiguing on the highs. A good step forward from the already excellent highs of the EX1000. And last but not least, a timbre to die for even compared to the Sony's which are known for their excellence in this department.
  
 And finally the Kuros was even more unexpected. They are the closest iems I've found to the EX1000. In contrast to the Kaedes they had a deeper bottom end and curiously a more forward mid. Maybe the wooden part of the housing of the Kaedes contributes on pulling the mids. They keep the same soundstage depth while equaling this time the EX1000 on width; and that was unexpected. Upper mids/lower highs exhibit almost the same detail resolution to the Kaedes. I would comfortably say that the Kuros are 9.5/10 of the Kaedes and both a step above the Sonys.
  
 Having the Kuros and the Sony at the same time I feel the former is the technically better iem taking in consideration resolving capabilities, extension on both ends and soundstage representation. But, at the very last everything depends on personal taste.
  
 Have been waiting for long for a review of one of the Ocharaku's family of IEMs. Reading over the web was of the impression that the NAMIs were an Olasonic manufactured version of the Kuros and was expecting a higher rate on sound quality alone compared to the EX1000. By the way I still love the Sonys to the point that I purchased them for the second time after initially selling them.
  
 BTW, thank you for you huge contribution to this forum 
  
 Update:
 Re-purchased the Kaedes and most say that ear memory is not as good as I thought. In fact the Kaedes are a step ahead in resolution in every frequency range. Same soundstage but better instrument separation especially noticeable on the high frequencies. Better tonality, easily identifiable in acoustic instruments and warmer (more real) vocals.
  
 I would be very curious of a review from Joker. I guess it would be difficult for him to get a pair.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> does the brainwavz b2 needs an amp ? should i buy it , i already have an ety er-4p ?


 

 I wouldn't buy the Brainwavz if I already had an ER4P.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't buy the Brainwavz if I already had an ER4P.


 
  
     what about fidelio s2 ? i want something under $150 , with well extended spectrum , nice bass with speed and some punch , good mids , and present highs with some sound stage , you can say something like ue600 but with more detail and a bit more bass .
     im buying 2 , re-400 is all in , im getting it for sure , i just want one more . and it has to be available in usa .


----------



## Exesteils

suman134 said:


> what about fidelio s2 ? i want something under $150 , with well extended spectrum , nice bass with speed and some punch , good mids , and present highs with some sound stage , you can say something like ue600 but with more detail and a bit more bass .
> im buying 2 , re-400 is all in , im getting it for sure , i just want one more . and it has to be available in usa .




The S2 has nice speed, but it doesn't have a huge lot when it comes to bass amount. It does have everything else, very clear mids, and sparkling highs, with a large soundstage due to it being semi-open.

It doesn't need an amp, but it scales very well with one.


----------



## suman134

exesteils said:


> The S2 has nice speed, but it doesn't have a huge lot when it comes to bass amount. It does have everything else, very clear mids, and sparkling highs, with a large soundstage due to it being semi-open.
> 
> It doesn't need an amp, but it scales very well with one.


 
  
    i got no problem for spark , but i dont want peaks . have you tired ue600 , i just want some more detail and a bit more bass .


----------



## kova4a

Maybe joker can comment on the new Philips TX2 if he has already received them from Tyll.


----------



## heyodee

Can anyone comment on the Westone UM 30 Pro


----------



## Grayson73

suman134 said:


> what about fidelio s2 ? i want something under $150 , with well extended spectrum , nice bass with speed and some punch , good mids , and present highs with some sound stage , you can say something like ue600 but with more detail and a bit more bass .
> im buying 2 , re-400 is all in , im getting it for sure , i just want one more . and it has to be available in usa .


 
 I don't know how much bass the UE600 has, I would look at the Zero Audio Tenore and Ostry KC06.  You can get both from Amazon.com.  You can also get Ostry from Ebay, Penonaudio, or Shenzhenaudio


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> what about fidelio s2 ? i want something under $150 , with well extended spectrum , nice bass with speed and some punch , good mids , and present highs with some sound stage , you can say something like ue600 but with more detail and a bit more bass .
> im buying 2 , re-400 is all in , im getting it for sure , i just want one more . and it has to be available in usa .


 
  
 The S2 is fairly different from the B2 and ER4P for sure - greater bass impact (more along the lines of GR07 bass quantity) but definitely not a bass monster, not too much focus on the mids but no recession, and pretty prominent treble. The problem is that it's not as smooth as the UE600, either - few headphones are.
  


kova4a said:


> Maybe joker can comment on the new Philips TX2 if he has already received them from Tyll.


 
  
 Not here yet - Tyll is currently measuring a bunch of my IEMs. I imagine I'll get the TX1 and TX2 back with all the rest of them. 
  


heyodee said:


> Can anyone comment on the Westone UM 30 Pro


 
  
 I would be very surprised if it sounds any different from the old UM3X. I have the W10 and W40 from the new lineup and they sound like the old W1 and W4.


----------



## airomjosh

hi joker, i hope you can also review the KC06 and the upcoming KC06A.


----------



## waynes world

Oh, he will. He will.


----------



## Gandasaputra

ljokerl said:


> I would be very surprised if it sounds any different from the old UM3X. I have the W10 and W40 from the new lineup and they sound like the old W1 and W4.


 
 Thank Jesus that there's no significant difference between W40, and W4! I lost my hope when people affirmed that W40 had more bass and smoother treble.


----------



## ljokerl

airomjosh said:


> hi joker, i hope you can also review the KC06 and the upcoming KC06A.


 
  
 Yeah I'm curious about these as well.


----------



## svyr

- sub.


----------



## Lukalop

How well do IEMs, particularly high end CIEMs scale with full size DACs/Amps? Would it be dramatically different than a conventional phone output?


----------



## FastAndClean

lukalop said:


> How well do IEMs, particularly high end CIEMs scale with full size DACs/Amps? Would it be dramatically different than a conventional phone output?


 

 Yes, i listen my ortofon q5 with audioquest dragonfly v 1.2 and the sound is much more clear, with big soundstage and better instrument separation, with full size dac/amp combo the differences will be bigger i guess.


----------



## Lukalop

fastandclean said:


> Yes, i listen my ortofon q5 with audioquest dragonfly v 1.2 and the sound is much more clear, with big soundstage and better instrument separation, with full size dac/amp combo the differences will be bigger i guess.




Not so sure about the latter part. I have read people saying full size DACs can actually make the sound worse as they are not tailored to such low impedance speakers. Any noise floor in the system is easily distinguishable as BA drivers are sensitive, perhaps not so much with dynamic drivers however. Also I would be concerned about blowing the drivers if too much current was passed through them.


----------



## Lukalop

Anyone know who does the dedicated CIEM reviews?

http://theheadphonelist.com/custom-in-ear-monitors-reviews-list/


----------



## FastAndClean

average_joe


----------



## cibibikeru

cibibikeru said:


> > I bought the Flux and have been listening to them for a while, I like them more than MH1, Flux seems more balanced, mids and treble are more present but not disturbing. I've been reading a lot about iem and sound signatures, of all the IEMs I owned, I really loved the Brainwavz M1, the Vsonic GR04 Flagship (apart from sibilance), the Sony MH1 and now the Flux. I also listened to Shure SE215 but for 5min, really smooth except for not that present treble, good soundstage. I like the full bodied sound, smooth, without anythig in particular to disturb your ears (harsh treble, sibilance, too much bass, too much mids, to much lower treble etc.).
> > I guess that puts me somewhere between warm and smooth and balanced? Now I'm even considering an upgrade to the Flux.
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hi there, I've been listening to both MH1C and Flux, while I like the Flux for the better but not disturbing treble presence, when I plug in the MH1 I find it more spacious, I know that mode recessed mids/highs gives you the impression of more space but it's not just that, they sound more like headphones while the flux have tiny, localized sound when comparing. I looked at RHA-MA750 but "slight tendency to sound “tizzy”, especially at high volumes, thanks to the lower treble emphasis" I know exactly what that is (Brainwavz M4 if I remeber well had exactly that) and I don't want it. I was thinking in getting a pair of RE-400 given the fact I loved Brainwavz M1 in the past, but I'm afraid I won't like them, another choice would be Yamaha EPH100? Do you have any other recommendation? Thank you very much.


----------



## thug behram

Has anyone reshelled the dn-1000? 

Is this thread for universals only or for customs too? I'm looking for a budget bassy CIEM that can extend low. Any recs? Similar to the dn-1000 but less peaky highs?


----------



## SilverEars

thug behram said:


> Has anyone reshelled the dn-1000?
> 
> Is this thread for universals only or for customs too? I'm looking for a budget bassy CIEM that can extend low. Any recs? Similar to the dn-1000 but less peaky highs?


 
 I don't know if reshelling is a wise choice if the universals were tuned with certain intentions and that's the signature you prefer.  I saw a video of 1964 Ears development process and they measure the FR of their customs, not sure if any tuning is done if it's out of predicted response.


----------



## modulor

thug behram said:


> Has anyone reshelled the dn-1000?
> 
> Is this thread for universals only or for customs too? I'm looking for a budget bassy CIEM that can extend low. Any recs? Similar to the dn-1000 but less peaky highs?


 
 There are some customs on the list.  The only more budget friendly, bass-leaning model that comes to mind are the Alclair Duals XB @ $300 and there's also the Cosmic Ears BA3 which is about $400 (not including  ear impression and extra features costs).  I don't believe either of these models have been reviewed here though.  A reshell of the DN1000 may be tricky for most companies since it is a hybrid design and I've not heard of any hybrids being re-shelled yet.


----------



## ljokerl

cibibikeru said:


> Hi there, I've been listening to both MH1C and Flux, while I like the Flux for the better but not disturbing treble presence, when I plug in the MH1 I find it more spacious, I know that mode recessed mids/highs gives you the impression of more space but it's not just that, they sound more like headphones while the flux have tiny, localized sound when comparing. I looked at RHA-MA750 but "slight tendency to sound “tizzy”, especially at high volumes, thanks to the lower treble emphasis" I know exactly what that is (Brainwavz M4 if I remeber well had exactly that) and I don't want it. I was thinking in getting a pair of RE-400 given the fact I loved Brainwavz M1 in the past, but I'm afraid I won't like them, another choice would be Yamaha EPH100? Do you have any other recommendation? Thank you very much.


 
  
 Why do you think you won’t like the RE-400? If you are not hinged on having as much bass as the MH1 or Flux you should be alright. They don’t have the biggest soundstage though. Neither does the EPH-100, but the big bass and solid dynamics help it sound "bigger" than the RE-400. The MH1C is already pretty good in that regard so it’s tough to upgrade from it in soundstaging.
  


thug behram said:


> Has anyone reshelled the dn-1000?
> 
> Is this thread for universals only or for customs too? I'm looking for a budget bassy CIEM that can extend low. Any recs? Similar to the dn-1000 but less peaky highs?


 
  
 There are some customs. They are marked in green on the summary table here. However, the only budget custom I’ve tried that I could call bassy is the 1964-V3.


----------



## cibibikeru

ljokerl said:


> Why do you think you won’t like the RE-400? If you are not hinged on having as much bass as the MH1 or Flux you should be alright. They don’t have the biggest soundstage though. Neither does the EPH-100, but the big bass and solid dynamics help it sound "bigger" than the RE-400. The MH1C is already pretty good in that regard so it’s tough to upgrade from it in soundstaging.


 
 I don't want to upgrade in soundstaging, I am ok with flux (or better) sound and MH1 soundstage, I am ok with MH1 sound but different cable, that's why I bought Flux in the first place. Will eph100 be an upgrade in sound to the MH1?


----------



## daynek

Subbed


----------



## pkalra67

Vsd1 not in the charts?


----------



## ljokerl

cibibikeru said:


> I don't want to upgrade in soundstaging, I am ok with flux (or better) sound and MH1 soundstage, I am ok with MH1 sound but different cable, that's why I bought Flux in the first place. Will eph100 be an upgrade in sound to the MH1?


 
  
 There really needs to be a re-cabling service for the MH1..
  
 The EPH-100 is a little more colored than the MH1 but I do consider it an upgrade overall. 
  


pkalra67 said:


> Vsd1 not in the charts?


 
  
 Sorry, haven't had a chance to re-write the InnerFidelity review. Score-wise it's a little above the VC02 (which scored an 8.1 in sound) for me.


----------



## ljokerl

Some new product announcements from Fidue including a 3-way BA/dynamic hybrid earphone with detachable cables and a sub-$100 dual dynamic. 
  
 http://theheadphonelist.com/new-iems-fidue-announced-a71-dual-dynamic-a83-triple-hybrid/


----------



## d marc0

ljokerl said:


> [COLOR=333333]Some new product announcements from Fidue i[/COLOR][COLOR=333333]ncluding a 3-way BA/dynamic hybrid earphone with detachable cables and a sub-$100 dual dynamic. [/COLOR]
> 
> http://theheadphonelist.com/new-iems-fidue-announced-a71-dual-dynamic-a83-triple-hybrid/




I hope you get to review the hybrid joker, it'll be interesting to know how well fidue implements them.


----------



## garcsa

Hi Joker, one fast off topic question. Whats your opinion about sound quality of Cowon J3 when listening max. 1411kbs? 130 USD 32gb. My favorite IEM is EPH100 with classic rock files. Thanks!
 Keep on with your useful reviews!


----------



## shotgunshane

ljokerl said:


> There really needs to be a re-cabling service for the MH1..


 
  
 There is!
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/707182/sony-mh1-recabled-by-zmf


----------



## ljokerl

d marc0 said:


> I hope you get to review the hybrid joker, it'll be interesting to know how well fidue implements them.


 
  
 Yeah, I'm curious as well. Ergonomic form factor + detachable cables is definitely part of the way there to justifying the $350 price tag. 
  


garcsa said:


> Hi Joker, one fast off topic question. Whats your opinion about sound quality of Cowon J3 when listening max. 1411kbs? 130 USD 32gb. My favorite IEM is EPH100 with classic rock files. Thanks!
> Keep on with your useful reviews!


 
  
 One of my few complaints with the J3 is how it behaves with really hi-res files. The processor isn't fast enough for uncompressed WAV files for example, and I've had issues with some very high bitrate FLAC files. Other than that it's a solid DAP, maybe a touch on the cool side tonally (which is fine for the EPH-100) but at least it has a user-friendly interface compared to many of the "audiophile" players I've tried.
  


shotgunshane said:


> There is!
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/707182/sony-mh1-recabled-by-zmf


 
  
 Oh wow, that's good stuff. Considering it already includes the earphone and a new MH1C runs $50-60 nowadays, not a bad deal at $99.


----------



## garcsa

Big thanks to Mr. Piotr Granicki  aka piotrius-g for his help in my DIY project!
 Don't forget to visit Custom Art website for perfect silicone CIEM!
 http://www.thecustomart.com/


----------



## ljokerl

garcsa said:


> Big thanks to Mr. Piotr Granicki  aka piotrius-g for his help in my DIY project!
> Don't forget to visit Custom Art website for perfect silicone CIEM!
> http://www.thecustomart.com/


 
  
 Got excited when I saw a button for "universal". Not clickable, unfortunately.


----------



## NIVEBL

Joker,did you tried donguri keyaki?
 any impression?


----------



## acadia

No se846? Great post though thanks for efforts.


----------



## svyr

ljokerl said:


> Got excited when I saw a button for "universal". Not clickable, unfortunately.


mm nice to see Piotr will be doing universals?


----------



## Hank_Venture

I'm thankful for finding CA through this site, for a future CIEM they might just be the right buy for myself. Be interested to see what comes out on the Universal end.


----------



## SebsG

Any recommendations for a very comfortable, non-foam, tip? I have somy hybrids currently and the smalls just barely make a good seal, but the mediums are too big (they actually made my ear bleed at one point... OUCH!!) 
Also any upgrades for 8320's? Similar sound signature and a negative fit (like I would be able to sleep in them, so probably over-ear?) would be appreciated

-Seb


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> Any recommendations for a very comfortable, non-foam, tip? I have somy hybrids currently and the smalls just barely make a good seal, but the mediums are too big (they actually made my ear bleed at one point... OUCH!!)
> Also any upgrades for 8320's? Similar sound signature and a negative fit (like I would be able to sleep in them, so probably over-ear?) would be appreciated
> 
> -Seb


 
  
     over ear , wanna sleep on them , small ears , one thing comes to my mind , pl50 . one thing else can be ue500/400 .


----------



## Hank_Venture

As far as tips, I've been using Shure's triple flange since my first IEMs from 2008. I just haven't found anything for my ears that work as well, also my regular concert earplugs are the same design so I am very used to it.


----------



## steelglam

So I was going to go ahead and purchase the Fidue A63 earphones but have held off on doing so because I've recently been using my FiiO X3 player again and have decided to try and find a pair of earphones that mate well with it.  Many folks indicate that neutral headphones/earphones are the best match with the FiiO since the player itself isn't neutral and has a slightly warm tonal character.  I think my problem to date, then, may have been in trying mate warm or V-shaped IEMs with the FiiO and being disappointed.
  
 Lots of folks seem to use and like the HiFiMan RE-400's with the FiiO X3.  But I'm really concerned about all of the negative reviews regarding build quality of the RE-400's and how many folks experience the cable becoming detached within a year of owning them.  Is there another neutral IEM similar in price and performance quality to the RE-400's but of a higher build quality?  In terms of price, I'm thinking of something $150 or less.
  
 Thanks in advance.


----------



## Lukalop

Joker, when you are rating these IEMs are you taking price into account. I ask because you rated the Monster Turbine over 7.5 and JH13 a 10. So a jump of 1000$ gets you 2.5 improvement? I auditioned the Monster Turbine a while ago and didn't think it was that good. If the Monster Turbine cost 1099$ excluding audiologist fees would you still rate it at 7.5?! This is quite concerning.

Otherwise I do not see the point in spending heaps more for a marginal improvement in sound quality.


----------



## kova4a

lukalop said:


> Joker, when you are rating these IEMs are you taking price into account. I ask because you rated the Monster Turbine over 7.5 and JH13 a 10. So a jump of 1000$ gets you 2.5 improvement? I auditioned the Monster Turbine a while ago and didn't think it was that good. If the Monster Turbine cost 1099$ excluding audiologist fees would you still rate it at 7.5?! This is quite concerning.
> 
> Otherwise I do not see the point in spending heaps more for a marginal improvement in sound quality.


 
 Price is taken into account only into the value score. Also scores are subjective to some extent but first, diminishing returns are something that everybody who's been longer in this hobby acknowledges and second - a 2.5 jump in score might seem low to you on paper but it's not such a small difference when you jump from a mid-fi stuff to higher end. And finally, personal preference plays a big part in this hobby but joker tries to score the iems on overall sound and technical performance, so if you see a 10 it's because something is that good.


----------



## FastAndClean

ljokerl what is your favorite iem for listening to music, and what type of sound signature you prefer if you have to choose between - smooth and warm or analytical and bright?


----------



## ljokerl

nivebl said:


> Joker,did you tried donguri keyaki?
> any impression?


 
  
 I've heard of the company but haven't tried any of their products.
  


acadia said:


> No se846? Great post though thanks for efforts.


 
  
 Haven't had a chance to try it yet. Might get to borrow one soon.
  


svyr said:


> mm nice to see Piotr will be doing universals?


 
  
 Seems like a tease at this point.
  


sebsg said:


> Any recommendations for a very comfortable, non-foam, tip? I have somy hybrids currently and the smalls just barely make a good seal, but the mediums are too big (they actually made my ear bleed at one point... OUCH!!)
> Also any upgrades for 8320's? Similar sound signature and a negative fit (like I would be able to sleep in them, so probably over-ear?) would be appreciated
> 
> -Seb


 
  
 It might be the nozzle diameter/angle of the 8320 that's making certain tips uncomfortable for you, not the eartips themselves.
  
 For a clear, slightly mid-centric sound with an over-the-ear fit you'd probably need to go BA - under $100 this would probably be a UE600 or Dunu I3CS. A little less bass impact compared to the large dynamic driver of the 8320 but they'll have just as much bass depth and a more balanced overall sound.
  


steelglam said:


> So I was going to go ahead and purchase the Fidue A63 earphones but have held off on doing so because I've recently been using my FiiO X3 player again and have decided to try and find a pair of earphones that mate well with it.  Many folks indicate that neutral headphones/earphones are the best match with the FiiO since the player itself isn't neutral and has a slightly warm tonal character.  I think my problem to date, then, may have been in trying mate warm or V-shaped IEMs with the FiiO and being disappointed.
> 
> Lots of folks seem to use and like the HiFiMan RE-400's with the FiiO X3.  But I'm really concerned about all of the negative reviews regarding build quality of the RE-400's and how many folks experience the cable becoming detached within a year of owning them.  Is there another neutral IEM similar in price and performance quality to the RE-400's but of a higher build quality?  In terms of price, I'm thinking of something $150 or less.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
  
 Unfortunately I don't have an X3 but the A63 is a warm-sounding earphone, more so than the RE-400. The reason that the RE-400 remains popular is that there's nothing else quite like it at the price point. The RE-600 is built better but there's a $250 price gap. For neutral sets around $100 you can get an Ety HF5 or a TWFK-based set like the VSonic VC1000, but these tend to be a little brighter/less warm than HiFiMan earphones. I also thought the Brainwavz R3 wasn't far behind the RE-400 in performance and it seems well-built, but I couldn't get comfortable with the design.
  


lukalop said:


> Joker, when you are rating these IEMs are you taking price into account. I ask because you rated the Monster Turbine over 7.5 and JH13 a 10. So a jump of 1000$ gets you 2.5 improvement? I auditioned the Monster Turbine a while ago and didn't think it was that good. If the Monster Turbine cost 1099$ excluding audiologist fees would you still rate it at 7.5?! This is quite concerning.
> 
> Otherwise I do not see the point in spending heaps more for a marginal improvement in sound quality.


 
  
 What *kova4a *said. I'd like to think that if the Turbine was $10 or $1000 I'd have given it the same sound quality score. 
  
  


fastandclean said:


> ljokerl what is your favorite iem for listening to music, and what type of sound signature you prefer if you have to choose between - smooth and warm or analytical and bright?


 
  
 Neutral and smooth, preferably. I don't use any one particular IEM on my own time, usually switching between some of my benchmark sets when I'm not reviewing. I can be perfectly content with something as reasonably-priced as the Sony MH1C but typically it'll be a custom set like the Noble 4S or UM Miracle.


----------



## shotgunshane

The universal button on the Custom Art website is for custom tips/sleeves for universals.


----------



## svyr

shotgunshane said:


> The universal button on the Custom Art website is for custom tips/sleeves for universals.



ah. i for a second thought he'd do demo mold type universal silicon ones  
thanks for clarifying.


----------



## b0000

Deleted. wrong thread. I have way to many tabs open


----------



## SebsG

ljokerl said:


> It might be the nozzle diameter/angle of the 8320 that's making certain tips uncomfortable for you, not the eartips themselves.
> 
> For a clear, slightly mid-centric sound with an over-the-ear fit you'd probably need to go BA - under $100 this would probably be a UE600 or Dunu I3CS. A little less bass impact compared to the large dynamic driver of the 8320 but they'll have just as much bass depth and a more balanced overall sound.



Thanks for the input!! 
The UE600's are $45 on amazon right now so I think I'll go with them. The nozzle size does make sense, I never noticed just how big it was.

-Seb


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> Thanks for the input!!
> The UE600's are $45 on amazon right now so I think I'll go with them. The nozzle size does make sense, I never noticed just how big it was.
> 
> -Seb


 
  
     one of the best budget phone .


----------



## peter123

+1, the ue600 are a steal at $45!


----------



## ljokerl

shotgunshane said:


> The universal button on the Custom Art website is for custom tips/sleeves for universals.


 
  
 I guess that makes more sense than "*Custom* Art" making universal earphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I don't have an X3 but the A63 is a warm-sounding earphone, more so than the RE-400. The reason that the RE-400 remains popular is that there's nothing else quite like it at the price point. The RE-600 is built better but there's a $250 price gap. For neutral sets around $100 you can get an Ety HF5 or a TWFK-based set like the VSonic VC1000, but these tend to be a little brighter/less warm than HiFiMan earphones. I also thought the Brainwavz R3 wasn't far behind the RE-400 in performance and it seems well-built, but I couldn't get comfortable with the design.


 
 Thanks, ljokerl.
  
 I will look into these, especially the VC1000 and R3 since I know less about them.
  
 Someone also suggested the Vsonic GR07.  Would that fit the profile, and if so how would it compare to the others that you've discussed?


----------



## ozkan

Joker I recently bought Flux in-ears after I saw your review. I have to say that I did not like the sound after IM50. The sound is also on the low side eventhough I turn the volume all the way up. My question is Does flux need an amp to shine and is there a burn in period for these? Thanks


----------



## cylpol1

What would you guys prefer the ATH-CK90Pro or the DBA 02 mkii


----------



## garcsa

ljokerl said:


> I guess that makes more sense than "*Custom* Art" making universal earphones
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 http://thecustomart.com/formtips.php


----------



## hobbyone

I bought an IEM in an online store here in Hungary. I want to send the back within 8 days after purchase (Distance Selling Regulations). But the seller rejected this due to hygienic reasons. Is this ok?


----------



## asdfvtn

hobbyone said:


> I bought an IEM in an online store here in Hungary. I want to send the back within 8 days after purchase (Distance Selling Regulations). But the seller rejected this due to hygienic reasons. Is this ok?




It's pretty common to not accept returns here in Canada unless defective for headphones and earphones. I'd think it's ok.


----------



## garcsa

hobbyone said:


> I bought an IEM in an online store here in Hungary. I want to send the back within 8 days after purchase (Distance Selling Regulations). But the seller rejected this due to hygienic reasons. Is this ok?


 
 Hivatkozz a Nemzeti Fogyasztóvédelmi Hatóságra. Amúgy JOGOD VAN minden online vásárolt terméket visszaküldeni 8 napos határidővel. Írd ide melyik az a cég - tudják mások is. Üdv Csaba


----------



## ljokerl

steelglam said:


> Thanks, ljokerl.
> 
> I will look into these, especially the VC1000 and R3 since I know less about them.
> 
> Someone also suggested the Vsonic GR07.  Would that fit the profile, and if so how would it compare to the others that you've discussed?


 
  
 It's bassier than the other sets I mentioned and can be a little more sibilant up top as well. It still fits, I just wouldn't recommend it over the others for what you're after.
  


ozkan said:


> Joker I recently bought Flux in-ears after I saw your review. I have to say that I did not like the sound after IM50. The sound is also on the low side eventhough I turn the volume all the way up. My question is Does flux need an amp to shine and is there a burn in period for these? Thanks


 
  
 Can't say how they compare to the IM50 for me - I haven't heard anything new from Audio-Technica since the CKX5iS, which is good for the money but not ground-breaking.
  
 The Flux is less sensitive than a lot of other earphones but maximum volume seems excessive - I can't tolerate it much above 50% on the Cowon J3 for example. Shouldn't need an amp - dynamic driver, stable impedance, etc. 
  


cylpol1 said:


> What would you guys prefer the ATH-CK90Pro or the DBA 02 mkii


 
  
 At the most basic level that's a matter of whether you want something that sounds darker (CK90Pro) or brighter (DBA-02).
  


hobbyone said:


> I bought an IEM in an online store here in Hungary. I want to send the back within 8 days after purchase (Distance Selling Regulations). But the seller rejected this due to hygienic reasons. Is this ok?


 
  
 It should be up to the seller and the return policy they have posted. It's been a while since I've heard of a store disallowing earphone returns here in the States but it has happened.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> It's bassier than the other sets I mentioned and can be a little more sibilant up top as well. It still fits, I just wouldn't recommend it over the others for what you're after.


 
 Thanks, ljokerl.  I am especially less interested in the GR07 if it's more sibilant up top.
  
 From what I just learned, apparently the plug was improved on the RE-400's at some point so the cable shorting problem is no longer as common. So maybe I will try those after all.
  
 Regarding the Ety HF5 and the Vsonic VC1000, do they suffer any peakiness problems in the treble or upper mids?  I seem to be sensitive to those things these days. 
  
 Someone also suggested the PFE 111 or a used pair of the JVC FX700 in my price range.  I know that some JVC's are aggressive, though often balanced in their aggressiveness.


----------



## Pin

Joker, will you be reviewing the Dunu DN2000 and/or JVC HA-FX750 / 850 any time soon?
  
 I've had Monster Turbine Pro Coppers for years. Love them, but they have become increasingly fatiguing for me.
  
 Based on your reviews of their predecessors, which company's sound signature would you recommend?


----------



## takoyaki7

ATH-CK90Pro is strangely mysterious, ESPECIALLY the MK.II  
  There are basically no reviews of the MKII out there! 
 Tried them out a few times myself before and considered the purchase, but didn't 
 get a good enough impression, other than that bass was quite impactful for a dual-BA!


----------



## ljokerl

steelglam said:


> Thanks, ljokerl.  I am especially less interested in the GR07 if it's more sibilant up top.
> 
> From what I just learned, apparently the plug was improved on the RE-400's at some point so the cable shorting problem is no longer as common. So maybe I will try those after all.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The VC1000 is a little more peaky than the HF5. The RE-400 is still the safe choice in this regard.
  
 The FX700 sounds nothing like any of the other sets you're considering - it's quite bassy, and warmer than the others as well.
  


pin said:


> Joker, will you be reviewing the Dunu DN2000 and/or JVC HA-FX750 / 850 any time soon?
> 
> I've had Monster Turbine Pro Coppers for years. Love them, but they have become increasingly fatiguing for me.
> 
> Based on your reviews of their predecessors, which company's sound signature would you recommend?


 
  
 The DN-2000 definitely. Not sure about the JVCs.
  
 I've already tried the Dunu - it's a little smoother than the DN-1000 but still plenty bright. If I had to guess I'd guess the JVCs are warmer and bassier, possibly darker as well. No way to know without trying them, though.
  
  


takoyaki7 said:


> ATH-CK90Pro is strangely mysterious, ESPECIALLY the MK.II
> There are basically no reviews of the MKII out there!
> Tried them out a few times myself before and considered the purchase, but didn't
> get a good enough impression, other than that bass was quite impactful for a dual-BA!


 
  
 Japan-only, and I'm guessing not heavily marketed even in Japan. Still would love to try them some day, and the CK70.


----------



## ljokerl

Speaking of the DN-2000 - added impressions of the Noble 6, Dunu DN-2000, NuForce NE-600X, and T-Peos D200R & RICH200 In-Ear Earphones here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-noble-6-dunu-dn-2000-nuforce-t-peos-ear-earphones/


----------



## Pin

You are the man Joker! Have recommended this thread to many people over the years, keep it up!!
  
 The bass on my coppers seem overwhelming these days especially in the mid-bass range, not sure if they are getting old or if I am!!
  
 Have read from multiple head-fi reviewers that the woodie JVCs are bass cannons but that they are not fatiguing in the sense that the bass is there when you need it but don't take over the sound. Does your experience with the FX700 reflect this too?
  
 This might be a matter of my personal taste evolving over time. Will go and try out the DN2000 tonight and probably the HA-FX750 too.
  
 Thanks again Joker.
  
 Cheers,
 Pin


----------



## suman134

pin said:


> You are the man Joker! Have recommended this thread to many people over the years, keep it up!!
> 
> The bass on my coppers seem overwhelming these days especially in the mid-bass range, not sure if they are getting old or if I am!!
> 
> ...


 

 dont forget to share your impressions .


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> The VC1000 is a little more peaky than the HF5. The RE-400 is still the safe choice in this regard.
> 
> The FX700 sounds nothing like any of the other sets you're considering - it's quite bassy, and warmer than the others as well.


 
 Thanks, that's good to know.  Sounds like the RE-400 may be the best bet.  Hopefully they really have made improvements to deal with some of the build quality issues.  Thanks much, joker!


----------



## 1clearhead

Hello Joker,
  
 Will you be reviewing the Xiaomi Pistons 2.1 (or IF Edition) any time soon?
  
 There are many here eager to read your results on these. I truly can say they have an astonishing sound and performs way above there price. Others in "the xiaomi pistons thread" claim to compare them to $200 dollar plus IEM's (like the Dunu DN-1000).
  
 Please let us know what you think......


----------



## Pastapipo

1clearhead said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> Will you be reviewing the Xiaomi Pistons 2.1 (or IF Edition) any time soon?
> 
> ...




They're good, but nothing like 200+ dollar iems.
In my opinion the vsd1s are better. Don't hype the hype. Still curious what joker thinks of it though...


----------



## waynes world

pastapipo said:


> They're good, but nothing like 200+ dollar iems.
> In my opinion the vsd1s are better. Don't hype the hype. Still curious what joker thinks of it though...


 
  
 I can't wait for joker to try out the Ostry KC06. With a synergistic source, they are seriously kicking the butt of my vsd1 and vsd1le (not to mention others).


----------



## UnityIsPower

waynes world said:


> I can't wait for joker to try out the Ostry KC06. With a synergistic source, they are seriously kicking the butt of my vsd1 and vsd1le (not to mention others).




I endorse this mans message.


----------



## Solarium

I'm very happy with my current Westone 3's, but just found out that M***Drop just added the Ultimate Ears UE900's, which I have always been curious about.
  
 I know that sound wise, UE900's are more neutral with less of a V-shaped EQ than the W3's. How are the isolation and comfort? The W3's takes me about 30 seconds to put on, and while it gives very good sound isolation (using Comply P-series tips) it starts to hurt my ears after 4-5 hours or so. I hear that the UE900's are more comfortable, as they allow for a deeper insertion (the W3's tubby shape and short tips gives me some trouble regarding this), but how is the isolation using its own equivalent Comply tips?


----------



## thug behram

best aftermarket tips for the dunu dn-1000? lost one of my medium wide-bore grey ones


----------



## 1clearhead

pastapipo said:


> They're good, but nothing like 200+ dollar iems.
> In my opinion the vsd1s are better. Don't hype the hype. Still curious what joker thinks of it though...


 
 There's no hype from my part, just curiosity. Someone in "the xiaomi pistons thread" compared the Dunu DN-1000 with the Pistons and claimed more or less a draw. But, It would be good to hear "Jokers" thoughts on these, someone prone to evaluating IEM's for many years, now.
  
 Hey, on another note, can you let me know a little comparison between the "Pistons" vs "VSD1S"? -You might convince me to get a pair!


----------



## ljokerl

pin said:


> You are the man Joker! Have recommended this thread to many people over the years, keep it up!!
> 
> The bass on my coppers seem overwhelming these days especially in the mid-bass range, not sure if they are getting old or if I am!!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hmm.. I don't know about the new FX750 but I wouldn't recommend the FX700 to you. I'd go for something with quicker, less reverberant bass. The DN-1000/DN-2000 are pretty good in this regard. So are less bassy sets like the GR07 Bass Edition.
  


1clearhead said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> Will you be reviewing the Xiaomi Pistons 2.1 (or IF Edition) any time soon?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'm not sure about these. No concrete plans, but I'd like to try them in the future.
  


waynes world said:


> I can't wait for joker to try out the Ostry KC06. With a synergistic source, they are seriously kicking the butt of my vsd1 and vsd1le (not to mention others).


 
  
 Will do. They come highly recommended all around.
  


solarium said:


> I'm very happy with my current Westone 3's, but just found out that M***Drop just added the Ultimate Ears UE900's, which I have always been curious about.
> 
> I know that sound wise, UE900's are more neutral with less of a V-shaped EQ than the W3's. How are the isolation and comfort? The W3's takes me about 30 seconds to put on, and while it gives very good sound isolation (using Comply P-series tips) it starts to hurt my ears after 4-5 hours or so. I hear that the UE900's are more comfortable, as they allow for a deeper insertion (the W3's tubby shape and short tips gives me some trouble regarding this), but how is the isolation using its own equivalent Comply tips?


 
  
 Isolation would be about on-par with the Complys. As for comfort, I personally would never make 4-5 hours straight with either set. The W3 housings are, like you said, a little tubby whereas the UE900 has a larger footprint and presses against my outer ear a bit. I have the same problem with the Shure SE846. The new Westone housings (on the W40 and such) are shaped better for my ears.
  


thug behram said:


> best aftermarket tips for the dunu dn-1000? lost one of my medium wide-bore grey ones


 
  
 I'm using medium single-flanges from a meelec M6 but I don't think they're an improvement in sound over the gray tips. Just seal better in my ears and I haven't found anything better. Maybe someone else has other suggestions.


----------



## avlad

pastapipo said:


> They're good, but nothing like 200+ dollar iems.
> In my opinion the vsd1s are better. Don't hype the hype. Still curious what joker thinks of it though...


 
 I agree with that.


----------



## ljokerl

Added another budget set from T-Peos - the Popular.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A86) T-Peos Popular*
> 
> 
> Reviewed April 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## reihead

Joker which earphone is next on your desk to be reviewed?

Thanks


----------



## airomjosh

reihead said:


> Joker which earphone is next on your desk to be reviewed?
> 
> Thanks


 
 You can check the first page to get an idea. Joker, listed the IEMS for upcoming reviews at the bottom of that page.


----------



## Jetblack08

Joker... did you already review the T-Peos H-300 already? Also if the Noble4 C is a 9.9/10 according to your review, what would you give the universal version? Sorry if you feel this a stupid question.


----------



## pkalra67

I know there are lot of review requests. Is it by any chance possible to include Havi b3 pro 1 to include in your list of upcoming reviews?


----------



## svyr

waynes world said:


> I can't wait for joker to try out the Ostry KC06. With a synergistic source, they are seriously kicking the butt of my vsd1 and vsd1le (not to mention others).




I heard a pair today and they serious are as good as people say.


----------



## reihead

airomjosh said:


> You can check the first page to get an idea. Joker, listed the IEMS for upcoming reviews at the bottom of that page.


 
  
 Yeah, but is organized alphabetically, I would like to know which one is next.


----------



## thug behram

Are the bores the same width? What about Sony hybrids? Too narrow?


----------



## Grayson73

waynes world said:


> I can't wait for joker to try out the Ostry KC06. With a synergistic source, they are seriously kicking the butt of my vsd1 and vsd1le (not to mention others).


 
 +1.  Seems like the top <$100 are currently Ostry KC06, Zero Audio Tenore, Havi B3 Pro V1, Zero Audio Singolo.  Tenore thread has a lot of activity recently from new owners.


----------



## airomjosh

reihead said:


> Yeah, but is organized alphabetically, I would like to know which one is next.


 
 I have a feeling they're gonna be a hybrid IEM from China...


----------



## kaixax555

reihead said:


> Yeah, but is organized alphabetically, I would like to know which one is next.


 

 I think the list follows what is presented in ljokerl's and average_joe's TheHeadphoneList site
  
 So if it is to be believed... TDK BA200 would be next
  
 So glad that he made a review of the BA200, having been waiting for so long and I am finally able to see how ljokerl feels about it


----------



## Grayson73

kaixax555 said:


> I think the list follows what is presented in ljokerl's and average_joe's TheHeadphoneList site
> 
> So if it is to be believed... TDK BA200 would be next
> 
> So glad that he made a review of the BA200, having been waiting for so long and I am finally able to see how ljokerl feels about it


 
 Joker reviewed the BA200 last week; he just hasn't added it to the first page yet.
  
 http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/tdk-ba200/


----------



## UnityIsPower

svyr said:


> I heard a pair today and they serious are as good as people say.




Can't wait to read impressions on the KC06A! Given what's said about them and what I heard out of the current version.... I think these guys have potential to replace the GR07's as amazing bang per buck all rounders! I'm worried about the reception of their low end but maybe I just closet basshead :/

#SuchHappiness 
#BigWow


----------



## smashdroid

Would love to see a comparison between kc06, carbo tenore/basso and ath im50/70.


----------



## Change is Good

Anyone interested in trading/exchanging eartips?


----------



## 1clearhead

About the Xiaomi Pistons 2.1 (or IF Edition)......
  
 Has any one here ever buy any IEM's with* "beryllium diagrams"* like the Xiaomi Pistons? According to what I've read about the "pistons" they really bring out life-like vocals and instrument separation to, if not all music genders. And I can second that, since I own both the "2.1" and there "IF Edition". I personally think they're that good!
  
 So, if they're are any other IEM's with *"beryllium diagrams"* out there. *Please let me know*. I won't mind buying another one from a different brand.


----------



## airomjosh

1clearhead said:


> About the Xiaomi Pistons 2.1 (or IF Edition)......
> 
> Has any one here ever buy any IEM's with* "beryllium diagrams"* like the Xiaomi Pistons? According to what I've read about the "pistons" they really bring out life-like vocals and instrument separation to, if not all music genders. And I can second that, since I own both the "2.1" and there "IF Edition". I personally think they're that good!
> 
> So, if they're are any other IEM's with *"beryllium diagrams"* out there. *Please let me know*. I won't mind buying another one from a different brand.


 
 IMO, you dont need to buy an IEM with beryllium diagrams just to listen to life-like vocals and excellent instrument separation. Just get a pair of KC06 and youre good to go.


----------



## ljokerl

reihead said:


> Joker which earphone is next on your desk to be reviewed?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Next to be posted: TDK BA200
 Next to be reviewed: a dual-driver hybrid from China 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


jetblack08 said:


> Joker... did you already review the T-Peos H-300 already? Also if the Noble4 C is a 9.9/10 according to your review, what would you give the universal version? Sorry if you feel this a stupid question.


 
  
 I haven't tried either of T-Peos' flagships - the H-100 is as high as I've gotten up their product line. So far the D200R is my favorite in terms of bang/buck though.
  
 I haven't had a chance to compare the silicone custom Noble to the universal version. It was discussed at length after the 4S review was posted but it seems no one else has had the chance to try both, either. 
  


pkalra67 said:


> I know there are lot of review requests. Is it by any chance possible to include Havi b3 pro 1 to include in your list of upcoming reviews?


 
  
 No plans to try them at this time.
  


thug behram said:


> Are the bores the same width? What about Sony hybrids? Too narrow?


 
  
 On the DN-1000? The hybrids fit fine, I just prefer firmer tips with it. 
  


airomjosh said:


> I have a feeling they're gonna be a hybrid IEM from China...


 
  
 That's... impressive. If we ignore the BA200 review that's already finished, you are correct


----------



## 1clearhead

airomjosh said:


> IMO, you dont need to buy an IEM with beryllium diagrams just to listen to life-like vocals and excellent instrument separation. Just get a pair of KC06 and youre good to go.


 
 So, I assume you're saying you got the xiaomi pistons 2.1 or IF Editions to compare them with?
  
 Can you write a comparison and let us know the difference between both of them?
  
 We would love to hear your review.


----------



## Agharta

Hello Joker.

Can you clarify what portable music player(s) you use for reviewing IEMS?

In the opening thread post you say

On-the-go listening is done using a Cowon J3 and HiFiMan HM-901 portable players. A wide range of tracks in FLAC and mp3 file formats is used. Critical listening is done via an optical-fed iBasso D10 and the HiFiMan HM-901 using only WMA and Flac lossless files.

Is that still the case?

One might argue that neither of those devices are really very commonly used and certainly the J3 is not really on a par anymore with current devices.

On top of that, what settings do you use on these devices and what volume do you play music at? 

I ask this really because I personally use a Samsung S3 rooted with Boeffla Kernel and Viper 4 android DSP app. 

 In this scenario, how can I know how these IEMs you are reviewing will sound from my phone? 

No offence meant at all, but perhaps this thread might be a bit like the equivalent of watching cookery programmes when you don't own an oven.


----------



## thug behram

ljokerl said:


> On the DN-1000? The hybrids fit fine, I just prefer firmer tips with it.
> 
> 
> That's... impressive. If we ignore the BA200 review that's already finished, you are correct




I don't mean if they fit the DN-1000, I mean the bore size in respect to the driver? I find that tips with openings narrower than the driver causes harsh treble which is why I hate the stock white tip, but really like the Gray ones where the opening is as wide as the driver. For the tips you mentioned and the hybrid Sony's, how wide is the opening in comparison to the driver?


----------



## drm870

Joker: Any chance of you giving the 1964Ears V8 a listen somehow? The posts in the 1964Ears thread have led me to believe it could be a good competitor to the JH16...


----------



## SebsG

I ordered my UE600vi's today... best $45 ever spent. They are cheaper than the non-mic version


----------



## ljokerl

agharta said:


> Hello Joker.
> 
> Can you clarify what portable music player(s) you use for reviewing IEMS?
> 
> ...


 
  
I use all of the sources listed. Unless your DAP has something seriously wrong with it, like high output impedance at the headphone jack or a ridiculous noise floor (both of which were an issue with my old Android phone, for example) you should be getting sound that is close to what I can get with the HM-901 or one of the mini USB DACs. I personally don't think the HM-901 is miles ahead of a decent "mainstream" source like the iPhone 5 so again unless you're using something with a problem, the source as a variable is almost negligible compared to the actual differences between IEMs, or even different eartips. This is just my experience, but apparently I'm not the only one who feels this way - see here for example: www.head-fi.org/t/709479/multi-review-hifiman-hm901-fiio-x5-sony-zx1-hisound-studio-3rd-anv-iphone-4
 
Obviously if you use a DSP app or an equalizer results will vary.
  


thug behram said:


> I don't mean if they fit the DN-1000, I mean the bore size in respect to the driver? I find that tips with openings narrower than the driver causes harsh treble which is why I hate the stock white tip, but really like the Gray ones where the opening is as wide as the driver. For the tips you mentioned and the hybrid Sony's, how wide is the opening in comparison to the driver?


 
  
 Ah, no. In that case the stock gray tips are still better. The closest I have to the bore size of the gray tips in a size that fits tightly on the DN-1000 nozzle are the MEElec A161P tips, but they are thinner and more flexible/flimsy. 
  


drm870 said:


> Joker: Any chance of you giving the 1964Ears V8 a listen somehow? The posts in the 1964Ears thread have led me to believe it could be a good competitor to the JH16...


 
  
I’m not sure. Definitely no plans at this time but maybe in the future.
  


sebsg said:


> I ordered my UE600vi's today... best $45 ever spent. They are cheaper than the non-mic version


 
  
 Good deal


----------



## jcyxxx

Hi! joker!
 I have $1000 now and I want to buy a custom IEM for some Jpop like Asriel.
 So could you please give me some recommendation?
 Thanks a lot!

 ​ 
 
 ​


----------



## Joe Bloggs

agharta said:


> Hello Joker.
> 
> Can you clarify what portable music player(s) you use for reviewing IEMS?
> 
> ...




Well if you're using the Viper-DDC function in the latest Viper4Android version, results will depend a lot on how good the DDC profile is for your particular earphones... What are you using now?


----------



## imackler

Hey ljokerl, 
  
 I'm interested in the Noble 4S but maybe thinking about getting the Noble 4 for quick insertion, extraction, etc. at work. I think that the RE-400 and VC1000 can co-exist and between them cover lots of ground as an incredible budget duo...pretty much any music I'd personally listen too. (When I want something bassy, the RE-400 is good enough for me.) But if the 4S is the logical upgrade to the VC1000 (though I'd actually be looking at the 4), what do you think of as the universal upgrade to the RE-400? Maybe the SE535? I guess I'm wondering if I were looking at two universal upgrades, an upgrade to both RE-400 and VC1000, what would they be... Any thoughts, ramblings, etc. would be appreciated. 
  
 Thanks!


----------



## garcsa

agharta said:


> Hello Joker.
> 
> Can you clarify what portable music player(s) you use for reviewing IEMS?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Very good question. Let me share the  thought of Mr. Ivor Tiefenbrun (Linn Products Ltd) about the "front end": ".... Tiefenbrun also battled the thinking, since Edgar Villchur, that the loudspeakers were the most important, instead asserting primacy of "the front end", saying that the quality of sound of the source was key. ... " (Wikipedia) - and hundreds of articles from the past till today. Ok, not loudspeakers but IEMs (little loudspeakers....! ) . Welcome to the forum  *Agharta*!


----------



## rodweb

imackler said:


> Hey ljokerl,
> 
> I'm interested in the Noble 4S but maybe thinking about getting the Noble 4 for quick insertion, extraction, etc. at work. I think that the RE-400 and VC1000 can co-exist and between them cover lots of ground as an incredible budget duo...pretty much any music I'd personally listen too. (When I want something bassy, the RE-400 is good enough for me.) But if the 4S is the logical upgrade to the VC1000 (though I'd actually be looking at the 4), what do you think of as the universal upgrade to the RE-400? Maybe the SE535? I guess I'm wondering if I were looking at two universal upgrades, an upgrade to both RE-400 and VC1000, what would they be... Any thoughts, ramblings, etc. would be appreciated.
> 
> Thanks!



If you want an VC1000 with more bass, go for the DN1000  

I got the universal Noble 4 a while ago and find it lacking low end personally.


----------



## ljokerl

jcyxxx said:


> Hi! joker!
> I have $1000 now and I want to buy a custom IEM for some Jpop like Asriel.
> So could you please give me some recommendation?
> Thanks a lot!


 
  
 To be honest I've never listened to any Jpop in my life. Do you know what sort of sound signature you're looking for?
  


imackler said:


> Hey ljokerl,
> 
> I'm interested in the Noble 4S but maybe thinking about getting the Noble 4 for quick insertion, extraction, etc. at work. I think that the RE-400 and VC1000 can co-exist and between them cover lots of ground as an incredible budget duo...pretty much any music I'd personally listen too. (When I want something bassy, the RE-400 is good enough for me.) But if the 4S is the logical upgrade to the VC1000 (though I'd actually be looking at the 4), what do you think of as the universal upgrade to the RE-400? Maybe the SE535? I guess I'm wondering if I were looking at two universal upgrades, an upgrade to both RE-400 and VC1000, what would they be... Any thoughts, ramblings, etc. would be appreciated.
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 I would consider the 4S an upgrade to *both* the RE-400 and VC1000, though its signature is probably closer to the HiFiMan with the smoother splash-free treble and not particularly lean note presentation. That said, I'm not sure how the universal version compares but I would not be surprised if the greater contact area of the 4S gives it a more impactful low end compared to the universal version. I certainly don't think the custom lags behind the RE-400 in bass impact.
  
 If we discard the 4S and stick only to universals, I would maybe consider the StageDiver SD-2 as an RE-400 upgrade though I personally can't say it's worth the extra scratch over the HiFiMan. It mostly improves over the RE-400 in bass depth and soundstage size. The Dunu DN2000 seems promising as well so far but I need to spend more time with it, which is definitely on my to-do list.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

hmmm


----------



## getclikinagas

ljokerl said:


> If we discard the 4S and stick only to universals, I would maybe consider the StageDiver SD-2 as an RE-400 upgrade though I personally can't say it's worth the extra scratch over the HiFiMan. It mostly improves over the RE-400 in bass depth and soundstage size. *The Dunu DN2000 seems promising as well so far but I need to spend more time with it, which is definitely on my to-do list.*


 

  
 INteresting. Been waiting for a true all-round upgrade to the RE400 in terms of SQ and Value. Especially value, considering we usually end up in higher-than-expected $$$ territory for a 100$IEM upgrade.
 Wonder what your comparison list will be. RE400, SD2, DN1000, RE600, GR07MKII, Music One, SM64, MDR-7550..... It's all wrong isn't it? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Side-note: Why aren't any of the T-peos flagships making their way to you? Or the JVCs. Or the XBAs. 
 Side-note2: When is the UE-TF1 ...... ah, never mind 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 Threads like this make Head-fi the epic forum it is. You've earned a over thousand karmic-beers mate. Cheers


----------



## Agharta

joe bloggs said:


> Well if you're using the Viper-DDC function in the latest Viper4Android version, results will depend a lot on how good the DDC profile is for your particular earphones... What are you using now?




I use the Dolby Pro Logic irs in Convolver in Viper - makes my Brainwavz R3 iems really sing. 

There's sadly no DDC for the Brainwavz yet - any idea how I can request one? 

On the subject of DAPs, I have to say I used to have the Cowon J3 and while it's a nice little device, my S3 poos all over it in sound quality. 

I used to laugh at those using smartphones and EQ. What a fool I was.


----------



## ljokerl

getclikinagas said:


> INteresting. Been waiting for a true all-round upgrade to the RE400 in terms of SQ and Value. Especially value, considering we usually end up in higher-than-expected $$$ territory for a 100$IEM upgrade.
> Wonder what your comparison list will be. RE400, SD2, DN1000, RE600, GR07MKII, Music One, SM64, MDR-7550..... It's all wrong isn't it?
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Honestly, it's hard to expect anything priced 3x higher to beat the RE-400 in value. I know for sure I'll use the RE-400 and GR07 in DN2000 comparisons as those two live on my desk. Everything else is TBD but your list makes sense. Aside from standard benchmarks I usually try to pick sets with a somewhat similar signature priced both higher and lower, as well as similarly-priced sets that are not a signature match but otherwise comparable. 
  
 With unlimited time I could probably get my hands on most of the IEMs out there. As it stands, the queue is full enough. Perhaps I spend some time on sets that don't need to be reviewed but I've also starting setting aside unremarkable earphones without review. Not sure if that's a great move in the long run but it allows me to cover more of what I actually want to cover.


----------



## amzies01

Joker, I see you've reviewed the Earsonics SM3 v1. Have you heard the v2?.. . If you have, is there any notable difference between the two? Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

amzies01 said:


> Joker, I see you've reviewed the Earsonics SM3 v1. Have you heard the v2?.. . If you have, is there any notable difference between the two? Thanks.


 
  
 Nope, never got to try the v2. At the time when it came out, it was reported to be pretty similar to the v1 minus the less crappy housing.


----------



## jarrett

Does the RE-400 ever go on sale? I must pick-up a pair at some point. They sound like a great reference set to include with my GR07 and BA200.


----------



## ljokerl

jarrett said:


> Does the RE-400 ever go on sale? I must pick-up a pair at some point. They sound like a great reference set to include with my GR07 and BA200.


 
  
 I've only seen HiFiMan gear go on sale towards end-of-life so I wouldn't count on it. Best bet might be a used one here on the forums.


----------



## proedros

jarrett said:


> Does the RE-400 ever go on sale? I must pick-up a pair at some point. They sound like a great reference set to include with my GR07 and BA200.


 
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/716228/hifiman-re400b-iems-balanced-model-or-non-balanced-mode


----------



## 1clearhead

Hey Joker,
  
 I noticed you reviewed the Kanen KM-948 (4mm Driver Unit) and the JVC HA-FXC50 (5.5mm Driver Unit) on your IEM's thread. But, I finally found the successor of these two.
  
 The *Senmai SM-E9106*
  
*Pros:*
  
 1. Tips seal perfectly (no need to worry)
  
 2. It is vented across the back for great accuracy!
  
 3. 7mm Driver Unit -can easily be driven with any portable device
  
 I kid you not, they both fail in comparison. They have a beautiful sounding V shape!
  
*Note:* Needs to be burned for at least *80 *to* 100 hours* to get the accuracy stated above.
  
  
*Cons*:  The wires do feel a little thin. Must take extra care. Wire thickness similar to the Kanen and JVC.
  
 .....I hope you take a chance to review these more accurately and let us know the outcome.


----------



## 1clearhead

1clearhead said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I noticed you reviewed the Kanen KM-948 (4mm Driver Unit) and the JVC HA-FXC50 (5.5mm Driver Unit) on your IEM's thread. But, I finally found the successor of these two.
> 
> ...


 
 Oh? Where are my manners?
  
 You can get them and see pictures of them here:  http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Senmai-Earphone-Headphone-For-PC-Laptop-Compatible-with-3-5mm-Connecter-Sources-SM-E9106-Free-Shipping/1590870594.html


----------



## SebsG

Can anyone recommend me a portable headphone with a sound signature similar to that of the Monoprice 8320? Please under $100 and preferably decent looking.
This is for my friend and I'm looking at the KRK KNS6400.

-Seb


----------



## itsderpxd

looking for in-ears under $100, open to all recommendations. 
  
 I thought that I've read that Klipsh Image S4's are amazing.. but not sure if I should pull the trigger.


----------



## modulor

itsderpxd said:


> looking for in-ears under $100, open to all recommendations.
> 
> I thought that I've read that Klipsh Image S4's are amazing.. but not sure if I should pull the trigger.


 
 Depends on what signature you're after - this write-up by joker is a pretty helpful starting point to check out:
  
http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/


----------



## Duartisimo

*edit


----------



## suman134

itsderpxd said:


> looking for in-ears under $100, open to all recommendations.
> 
> I thought that I've read that Klipsh Image S4's are amazing.. but not sure if I should pull the trigger.


 
      if you are after bass , hisoundaudio wooduo will be a better choice . if you are after a v type sound sig , thinksound ms1 will be nice .


----------



## zeppu08

Hi Joker! 

Can you give me some iem suggestion? I want something for reference monitoring. Hifi grade but with a mid-fi budget.

Im looking something neutral but will not be boring, with a wide sound stage, has a punchy crisp bass but not that boomy that bleeds and cover the mids, has forward mids for vocals and sparkly highs but will not be sibilant, fatiguing and harsh. With Clear detailing, layering and has great separation.

Am I asking for too much? Lol..

Im looking into SM64, Westone 4r(as others suggested me), InEarStageDriver 2/3 for universal. Im also considering 1964 ears V3, V6, V6-S and V8 for customs.. 

Hope you can help me in this one.. And if ever can you rank all of my choices in terms of sound quality..

Thank you very much!


----------



## ljokerl

1clearhead said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I noticed you reviewed the Kanen KM-948 (4mm Driver Unit) and the JVC HA-FXC50 (5.5mm Driver Unit) on your IEM's thread. But, I finally found the successor of these two.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'm surprised a 7mm driver can be mounted at the tip of the earpiece. Hopefully it doesn't suffer from the same fit/comfort problems as the Fischer Audio Ceramique as a result!
  


sebsg said:


> Can anyone recommend me a portable headphone with a sound signature similar to that of the Monoprice 8320? Please under $100 and preferably decent looking.
> This is for my friend and I'm looking at the KRK KNS6400.
> 
> -Seb


 
  
 Haven't tried the KRK but the Sennheiser HD428 is a favorite of mine for neutral, non-harsh/bright sound under $100.
  


itsderpxd said:


> looking for in-ears under $100, open to all recommendations.
> 
> I thought that I've read that Klipsh Image S4's are amazing.. but not sure if I should pull the trigger.


 
  
 The S4 is pretty old, there are newer options even for the same type of sound that are cheaper and arguably better, such as the VSonic GR02 Bass Edition. Also, whether they're right for you really depends on the type of sound you're after - pretty much what *modulor* said.
  


duartisimo said:


> hey guys, i have trying to locate an opinion i read bout IEMs i cannot find that talks about sound degradation if one is to put them trough a balanced amp. I am about to buy an RSA Lightning and i was wondering if it's a good idea to do that.
> This seems to be THE IEM forum, so i guess this is the best place to ask for opinions on this matter.
> Are there any benefits in going balanced with an IEM?


 
  
 I don't believe there are, at least not that I can tell with the dynamic-driver balanced IEMs I've come across.
  


zeppu08 said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> Can you give me some iem suggestion? I want something for reference monitoring. Hifi grade but with a mid-fi budget.
> 
> ...


  

 Probably a little too much.
  
 The V3 will be too bassy, and the SD-3 might be as well. The V6-S is great if you can afford it - it does pretty much everything you want. Haven't tried the V6 or V8. The SM64, W4, and StageDivers 2 also check most of the boxes except the treble sparkle box - it's minimal with all three. The SM64 would probably be my pick between those if you don't mind the upper midrange dip on it, and the fact that it's not exactly neutral.


----------



## zeppu08

ljokerl said:


> The V3 will be too bassy, and the SD-3 might be as well. The V6-S is great if you can afford it - it does pretty much everything you want. Haven't tried the V6 or V8. The SM64, W4, and StageDivers 2 also check most of the boxes except the treble sparkle box - it's minimal with all three. The SM64 would probably be my pick between those if you don't mind the upper midrange dip on it, and the fact that it's not exactly neutral.




If you would pick between SM64 and V6-S, which do you think has the natural and balanced sounding or prefer all in all?

Thanks!


----------



## itsderpxd

From what I see in the review you did http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/, in terms of what type of signature, most likely warm and smooth or vshaped. I am wondering if the 10 dollar ones will suffice. I plan on using the in ears for doing homework at the library, casual walking and skateboarding.. 
  
 Lol while writing that post I've made my mind, 8 dollar phillips will suffice. Cost/performance ratio is very enticing.


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hello

I'm confused between the t-peos d200 models. The company has three kinds of them.
1. Flat cable with round housing
2. Flat cable with chipped housing
3. Round cable with round housing

Do all of them sound the same? 
I like the round cable with round housing but the only available on my local shop is the flat cable with round housing.


----------



## 1clearhead

ljokerl said:


> I'm surprised a 7mm driver can be mounted at the tip of the earpiece. Hopefully it doesn't suffer from the same fit/comfort problems as the Fischer Audio Ceramique as a result!
> 
> 
> Haven't tried the KRK but the Sennheiser HD428 is a favorite of mine for neutral, non-harsh/bright sound under $100.
> ...


 
  
 About: *Senmai SM-E9106*
  
 It actually seals perfectly!
  
 Nothing like the Kanen or JVC, where you actually have to maneuver and manage to get the sound and fit right.
  
 I notice that the diaphragm sits deeper into the housing and the nozzle extends out more. I believe this is why the tip creates an excellent seal and is very comfortable. And the very narrow passage at the tip creates excellent treble while maintaining tight and well behaved bass.
  
 I kid you, not! These are one of my top 5 in comfort and sound, as well!
  
 Hopefully, you could review and comment on these. You will pleasantly be surprised!


----------



## Grayson73

itsderpxd said:


> looking for in-ears under $100, open to all recommendations.
> 
> I thought that I've read that Klipsh Image S4's are amazing.. but not sure if I should pull the trigger.


 
 Ostry KC06, Havi B3 Pro 1, Zero Audio Carbo Tenore, Zero Audio Carbo Singolo, Audio Technica ATH-IM50


----------



## thug behram

Anyone try the newer dn-2000 tips on the dn-1000? Do any of em work better than the older ones?


----------



## jcyxxx

jcyxxx said:


> Hi! joker!
> I have $1000 now and I want to buy a custom IEM for some Jpop like Asriel.
> So could you please give me some recommendation?
> Thanks a lot!


 
  
 To be honest I've never listened to any Jpop in my life. Do you know what sort of sound signature you're looking for?
  
  
  
 I like CK100's female vocal.And I guess maybe it is the most suitable for me.But I want a CIEM........
 I admit I am a female vocal lover.So I just want something with the best female vocal play on it.
  





Forgive my poor English...Thanks!


----------



## SilverEars

jcyxxx said:


> To be honest I've never listened to any Jpop in my life. Do you know what sort of sound signature you're looking for?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 I have the CK10, and I think vocals are great with it also.  I too enjoy female vocals.  Although it's higher than your budget, I did enjoy the TG334 with female vocal recordings.  I know this is the iems forums, but if you haven't heard the HE-6 with female vocals, you should, with a proper amp, it will wow you.


----------



## ljokerl

zeppu08 said:


> If you would pick between SM64 and V6-S, which do you think has the natural and balanced sounding or prefer all in all?
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 V6-S, no question. 
  


itsderpxd said:


> From what I see in the review you did http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/, in terms of what type of signature, most likely warm and smooth or vshaped. I am wondering if the 10 dollar ones will suffice. I plan on using the in ears for doing homework at the library, casual walking and skateboarding..
> 
> Lol while writing that post I've made my mind, 8 dollar phillips will suffice. Cost/performance ratio is very enticing.


 
  
 The Philips are a great value and an excellent place to start. Certainly not a downgrade from the S4 in sound.
  


justgotlucky123 said:


> Hello
> 
> I'm confused between the t-peos d200 models. The company has three kinds of them.
> 1. Flat cable with round housing
> ...


 
  
 I can only comment on round housing + round cable D200. From what I understand it's a limited edition and tuned to be more balanced than the others. It's the one I have (D200R to be specific) and I like it quite a bit.
  


1clearhead said:


> About: *Senmai SM-E9106*
> 
> It actually seals perfectly!


 
  
 Good to know! I'll focus on working the Pistons and/or Ostry into my queue for now and maybe get a chance to try these in the future.
  


thug behram said:


> Anyone try the newer dn-2000 tips on the dn-1000? *Do any of em work better than the older ones?*


 
  
 Not for me.
  


jcyxxx said:


> I like CK100's female vocal.And I guess maybe it is the most suitable for me.But I want a CIEM........
> I admit I am a female vocal lover.So I just want something with the best female vocal play on it.
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hmm... that's a tough one because I haven't tried any customs that I would consider a CK100 signature match. The JH13 is a safe bet if you can afford it - it shines all around, including vocals. After that, I would say Noble 4S and UM Miracle. The 4S tonally sounds something like a HiFiMan or Etymotic earphone - not the same as a CK100, but definitely not weak on vocals.


----------



## pkalra67

Which one wins in SQ Philips 3590 or monoprice 8320?


----------



## 1clearhead

pkalra67 said:


> Which one wins in SQ Philips 3590 or monoprice 8320?


 
 I have managed to have the experiences with both. I can surely give you my take on these 2 IEM's. But, just to let you know I am limited with my experiences compared to Joker. My results could be subjective, but here we go!
  
 Out the box with their "original tips" intact and after their reasonable time on their burn-in period, monoprice had the advantage in SQ.
  
 But, I do have an old thread suggesting that if you were to change the Philips "medium tips" to the vsonic "sky-blue" medium tips the SQ will definitely beat out the monoprice and many other IEM's.
  
 To see more on this comparison please follow this link: http://www.head-fi.org/t/663657/philips-she3580-how-to-up-grade-your-philips-she3580-90-note-once-up-graded-theyre-hard-to-beat
  
 I hope after reading my suggestion and actually trying the difference, it'll give you the perfect results you might be looking for in "SQ".
  
 ....unfortunately, the same can not be said for the monoprice. Changing the tips on the monoprice doesn't result in much of a difference. But, not to say -they are still an incredible buy!
  
 So, the winner here in "SQ" could be the Philips she3580(90).....only if you're willing to change the tips, as suggested.
  
 Let me know if this worked for you.......bye now!


----------



## Bola 7

Joker, I want buy a JH13 Pro Freqphase, but I´m afraid of It sounds lean.  Does sounds it more thinner than Philips SHE3580? For me, the sonorous body of SHE3580 is appropriate.

 Could you also compare the JH13 Pro FP with SM3?

 I´m thinking of buy the JH Roxanne instead of JH13 Pro FP, but I don´t know if it's worth...

 Thank you!


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hello joker. What iem would you recommend that has good soundstage? I like a warm+sweet sound but soundstage is the top priority and isolation. My budget is limited to 70dollars. And I'm leaning towards t-peos d202(not the round cable), sony xba-1, meelec m9, tdk eb950. Or if you have any suggestions, that would be great. But i hope your suggestion are easy to find in the Philippines. Thanks!


----------



## pkalra67

1clearhead said:


> I have managed to have the experiences with both. I can surely give you my take on these 2 IEM's. But, just to let you know I am limited with my experiences compared to Joker. My results could be subjective, but here we go!
> 
> Out the box with their "original tips" intact and after their reasonable time on their burn-in period, monoprice had the advantage in SQ.
> 
> ...



Thanks for your valuable inputs.
I don't have vsonic eartips, tried on eBay with no luck.
So I think I will buy both.


----------



## 1clearhead

justgotlucky123 said:


> Hello joker. What iem would you recommend that has good soundstage? I like a warm+sweet sound but soundstage is the top priority and isolation. My budget is limited to 70dollars. And I'm leaning towards t-peos d202(not the round cable), sony xba-1, meelec m9, tdk eb950. Or if you have any suggestions, that would be great. But i hope your suggestion are easy to find in the Philippines. Thanks!


 
 From my experience and my opinion, it is extremely hard to beat the "Xiaomi Pistons 2.1, or IF Edition (same sound signature)" in the area of "soundstage".
  
 To me it beats the "Soundmagic PL30", which was considered one of the best for soundstage.
  
 The "Xiaomi Pistons" privides (1) better spatial clarity, (2) better enhanced bass, (3) and life-like details.
  
 Don't take my word for it, just try it! Only around $20 for the "2.1", and $25 for the "IF version".
  
 Unless you are willing to wait. Joker will be reviewing these in the near future. But, I'm pretty sure he can suggest many others from his list.
  
 .....just trying to help.


----------



## kova4a

1clearhead said:


> From my experience and my opinion, it is extremely hard to beat the "Xiaomi Pistons 2.1, or IF Edition (same sound signature)" in the area of "soundstage".
> 
> To me it beats the "Soundmagic PL30", which was considered one of the best for soundstage.
> 
> ...


 
 Really? The philips tx2 is 40 bucks and has quite a bit better soundstage than the pistons and not just size-wise.
  
 Btw, joker, did you get the tx1 and tx2 already?


----------



## 1clearhead

kova4a said:


> Really? The philips tx2 is 40 bucks and has quite a bit better soundstage than the pistons and not just size-wise.
> 
> Btw, joker, did you get the tx1 and tx2 already?


 
 So, I'm assumming you have the Pistons? OK, than can you give us some more details between the both of them.
  
 I'm very interested to know the difference. I never heard of these, so it might be interesting to know the details.
  
 Thanks, in advance!


----------



## kova4a

1clearhead said:


> So, I'm assumming you have the Pistons? OK, than can you give us some more details between the both of them.
> 
> I'm very interested to know the difference. I never heard of these, so it might be interesting to know the details.
> 
> Thanks, in advance!


 
 I actually did a couple of days ago http://www.head-fi.org/t/586909/the-discovery-thread-new-zero-audio-doppios-pg1197-kef-m200-pg835-philips-fidelio-s2-pg-724/24345#post_10520215


----------



## justgotlucky123

1clearhead said:


> From my experience and my opinion, it is extremely hard to beat the "Xiaomi Pistons 2.1, or IF Edition (same sound signature)" in the area of "soundstage".
> 
> To me it beats the "Soundmagic PL30", which was considered one of the best for soundstage.
> 
> ...


 
 the pistons are not locally available in my Philippines though 
 thanks anyway


----------



## 1clearhead

kova4a said:


> I actually did a couple of days ago http://www.head-fi.org/t/586909/the-discovery-thread-new-zero-audio-doppios-pg1197-kef-m200-pg835-philips-fidelio-s2-pg-724/24345#post_10520215


 
 Good review.
  
 But, I'll pobably wait from others who'd reviewed them before making a decision to buy it. No offense, but I haven't seen reviews for these anywhere, but only from a small review you provided. Pistons has a very long thread, not counting many other threads and websites.
  
 But, I'm sure if you give it to Jokers wish list, he will make it an effort to review it, soon.


----------



## kova4a

1clearhead said:


> Good review.
> 
> But, I'll pobably wait from others who'd reviewed them before making a decision to buy it. No offense, but I haven't seen reviews for these anywhere, but only from a small review you provided. Pistons has a very long thread, not counting many other threads and websites.
> 
> But, I'm sure if you give it to Jokers wish list, he will make it an effort to review it, soon.


 
 It's not a review - just a quick short comparison. Anyway, no offence taken. I know that joker will be receiving them soon or received them already and that's why I'm asking him - not because I need someone to tell me whether what I hear is right but for the other members like you coz I know people will be waiting for someone like joker to greenlight them.


----------



## suman134

just got my c10 today , nice phone , but not to the mark of xba-h1 , better then pl50 i must say , will give it 8.0 .
 i hope these are better then xba-1 .


----------



## SebsG

My ue600's should get here today. Now the wait..


----------



## pietcux

A friend of mine needs new iems for cycling. I know that it is dangerous, but he will use some anyways. So something that is not affected by wind and cable noise. Any recommendations?


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> My ue600's should get here today. Now the wait..


 

 these are the best budget phones to me .


----------



## suman134

what do you guys think about ath-ckx9 ?


----------



## 1clearhead

kova4a said:


> It's not a review - just a quick short comparison. Anyway, no offence taken. I know that joker will be receiving them soon or received them already and that's why I'm asking him - not because I need someone to tell me whether what I hear is right but for the other members like you coz I know people will be waiting for someone like joker to greenlight them.


 
 Well, I got ta' tell you.....they do have a good look to them. I took a look at several Chinese websites and it kind of reminded me of the "SoundMAGIC ES20" IEM's. It would be interesting to get these Philips just to compare both, since I do carry these in my batch of IEM's.
  
 They're very solid, too! With a pretty wide soundstage.
  
 I don't recall seeing these in Joker's list, though.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Here's a quick pick.....
  

  

  
 .....So many red lights, we're all waiting for the green.


----------



## suman134

1clearhead said:


> Well, I got ta' tell you.....they do have a good look to them. I took a look at several Chinese websites and it kind of reminded me of the "SoundMAGIC ES20" IEM's. It would be interesting to get these Philips just to compare both, since I do carry these in my batch of IEM's.
> 
> They're very solid, too! With a pretty wide soundstage.
> 
> ...


 

    i think you should try memorex ie400 , i picked 4 , at various prices , lowest being $8 .


----------



## suman134

suman134 said:


> i think you should try memorex ie400 , i picked 4 , at various prices , lowest being $8 .


 
  
        comes with a reinforced cable and comply t-400s too .


----------



## kova4a

1clearhead said:


> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 The new philips tx2 is definitely quite good. Also I have to say that for that short tx2/pistons comparison I used for a first time the Dr. Chesky's Ultimate Headphone Demonstration Disk and while in the past I have also used binaural albums for the soundstage part of my impressions, this album is definitely useful.


----------



## ozkan

pietcux said:


> A friend of mine needs new iems for cycling. I know that it is dangerous, but he will use some anyways. So something that is not affected by wind and cable noise. Any recommendations?


 
 Pfe112 is best for that purposes but your friend needs a powerful source to get the best of PFEs. The cheapest option may be a Philips 3590 if he/she likes a V shape sound.


----------



## SebsG

Joker.. <3 thank you 
 the UE600's are 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 <-- that good
 I am loving them so far and will continue to. 
 Also, idk why, but the cable on my right ear won't stay over. This always happens with IEM's and it's kinda frustrating when I'm trying to sleep. Any ideas as the the cause? Probably my ear shape.
  
 Sidenote: Are high volumes bad for the BA drivers? I want these to last a while so I am trying to baby them.
  
 -Seb


----------



## Francisk

SebsG, high volume is bad for your ears more so than drivers. You can replace your IEMs but you can't replace your ears


----------



## SebsG

francisk said:


> SebsG, high volume is bad for your ears more so than drivers. You can replace your IEMs but you can't replace your ears


 
 Lol, 50 - 75% is my max. I wanna know if that's bad. I should have specified what loud is for me


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> Lol, 50 - 75% is my max. I wanna know if that's bad. I should have specified what loud is for me


 
  
     for me ue 600 is loud enough , louder then 85% of my phones , only a few like she9850 , eb110 are louder then it .


----------



## ljokerl

pkalra67 said:


> Which one wins in SQ Philips 3590 or monoprice 8320?


 
  
 Depends on what you want – more mid-centric with punchy but not very emphasized bass – Monoprice.  Slightly v-shaped with a good amount of bass – the 3590. I tend to prefer the Philips.
  


bola 7 said:


> Joker, I want buy a JH13 Pro Freqphase, but I´m afraid of It sounds lean.  Does sounds it more thinner than Philips SHE3580? For me, the sonorous body of SHE3580 is appropriate.
> 
> Could you also compare the JH13 Pro FP with SM3?
> 
> ...


 
  
It is not leaner than the SHE3580 but it doesn’t have the lush fullness of the SM3, either. The SM3 has emphasis on the lower mids and lack of presence in the upper mids, which gives it that sound. The JH13 does not suffer from a lower midrange bias.
 
I haven’t had a chance to try the Roxanne yet.
 


justgotlucky123 said:


> Hello joker. What iem would you recommend that has good soundstage? I like a warm+sweet sound but soundstage is the top priority and isolation. My budget is limited to 70dollars. And I'm leaning towards t-peos d202(not the round cable), sony xba-1, meelec m9, tdk eb950. Or if you have any suggestions, that would be great. But i hope your suggestion are easy to find in the Philippines. Thanks!


 
  
Sony MH1C would probably be my pick for that type of sound. Isolation is not bad and it’s got a warm sound with good soundstaging. Not sure if it’s available in your region. The D-202 should be good as well if it's similar to my D200R, but I would still pick the MH1C over it for that type of sound.
  


kova4a said:


> Really? The philips tx2 is 40 bucks and has quite a bit better soundstage than the pistons and not just size-wise.
> 
> Btw, joker, did you get the tx1 and tx2 already?


 
  
 Yep, they’re very impressive (and quite similar to each other..). Very spacious, like you said. They'll be getting a full InnerFidelity piece. 
  


pietcux said:


> A friend of mine needs new iems for cycling. I know that it is dangerous, but he will use some anyways. So something that is not affected by wind and cable noise. Any recommendations?


 
  
 Depends on the price range – my go-to  is the meelec M6 at about $20-30. I've worn them for dozens of hours on a bike.
  


suman134 said:


> what do you guys think about ath-ckx9 ?


 
  
 I have the CKX5. Supposedly the higher-end CKX models are tuned for more bass. The CKX5 already has more than enough bass for me. I really like the fit of these, though, it’s very secure in the ear.
  


sebsg said:


> Also, idk why, but the cable on my right ear won't stay over. This always happens with IEM's and it's kinda frustrating when I'm trying to sleep. Any ideas as the the cause? Probably my ear shape.


 

 Using the cable cinch should help.
  


sebsg said:


> Sidenote: Are high volumes bad for the BA drivers? I want these to last a while so I am trying to baby them.


 
  
 If your volume is so loud that the armatures are distorting, probably. Otherwise it's worse for your ears than the earphones, like Francisk said.


----------



## suman134

> I have the CKX5. Supposedly the higher-end CKX models are tuned for more bass. The CKX5 already has more than enough bass for me. I really like the fit of these, though, it’s very secure in the ear.


 
  
       are you sure ? they use different driver , ckx5 is 8mm , ckx9 is 13 mm , still thanks .


----------



## Bola 7

ljokerl said:


> It is not leaner than the SHE3580 but it doesn’t have the lush fullness of the SM3, either. The SM3 has emphasis on the lower mids and lack of presence in the upper mids, which gives it that sound. The JH13 does not suffer from a lower midrange bias.
> 
> I haven’t had a chance to try the Roxanne yet.


 
  
 Is there chance to you try the JH Roxanne? I'm enquiring you because I can wait for your review.

 P.S.: Is JH13 Pro Freqphase Slightly v-shaped like Philips SHE3580?

 Thanks, Joker!


----------



## SebsG

Good to know. I'll keep it at 50% cuz I'm scared lol .


----------



## ronnel0918

Your recommendation between Westone 4R and Westone UM Pro 30, please. Thanks!


----------



## RochRx7

sebsg said:


> Joker.. <3 thank you
> the UE600's are
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Agree.. I'm having a hard time finding a full sized can or any other IEM that I've tried that comes close to the UE600's mids/comfort. If it had better extension on the low and high ends.. it would probably be the perfect IEM for me. Vocals are so smooth.. just.. can't get away from how good they are.


----------



## uncletim

Sorry! wrong thread!


----------



## uncletim

Looking for UIEMs in the $500USD range. I use an iBasso DX90 for travel at this point.
  
 I just returned the Earsonics SM64, really enjoyed these, just no treble sparkle. only other thing was just a tad tighter bass, but still can't complain.
  
 at home i use vintage Grado RS1 that i really enjoy. World music, Classical, Jazz, Folk, etc.
  
 a friend loaned me his Westone 4r for a night, and they are closer the the sig I am looking for, just not the magic of the SM64.
  
 I am looking at the Fischer Amps FA-4 E XB at the moment, honestly would rather get something that is more available here in USA if possible. for warranty repair would have to mail to Germany?
  
 Thanks for any ideas.


----------



## esteebin

http://www.meritline.com/meelectronics-a151p-balanced-armature-in-ear-headphone---p-125011.aspx
  
 Meritline selling Meelectronics A151p for $35 using code *MLCKX08ZNL1*
 Must log in to apply code


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> are you sure ? they use different driver , ckx5 is 8mm , ckx9 is 13 mm , still thanks .


 
  
 I was only talking about the sound profile - the larger drivers result in bassier sound.
  


bola 7 said:


> Is there chance to you try the JH Roxanne? I'm enquiring you because I can wait for your review.
> 
> P.S.: Is JH13 Pro Freqphase Slightly v-shaped like Philips SHE3580?
> 
> Thanks, Joker!


 
  
 I might get to try the universal version at some point after the next batch ships, but nothing definite.
  
 And yes, I would agree that the JH13 is slightly v-shaped but its midrange is not at all recessed-sounding.
  


ronnel0918 said:


> Your recommendation between Westone 4R and Westone UM Pro 30, please. Thanks!


 
  
 I personally preferred the W4 - its leaner and a little brighter, which makes it more balanced-sounding as a result despite it having perhaps a bit more bass emphasis.
  


mingus said:


> Looking for UIEMs in the $500USD range. I use an iBasso DX90 for travel at this point.
> 
> I just returned the Earsonics SM64, really enjoyed these, just no treble sparkle. only other thing was just a tad tighter bass, but still can't complain.
> 
> ...


 
  
 What did you find lacking with the W4R compared to the SM64? 
  
 Not familiar with the Fischer Amps.
  


esteebin said:


> http://www.meritline.com/meelectronics-a151p-balanced-armature-in-ear-headphone---p-125011.aspx
> 
> Meritline selling Meelectronics A151p for $35 using code *MLCKX08ZNL1*
> Must log in to apply code


 
  
 That's... impressively cheap for a BA earphone with a mic/remote. Beats the Astrotec and Rock-It Sounds models.


----------



## uncletim

ljokerl said:


> What did you find lacking with the W4R compared to the SM64?
> 
> Not familiar with the Fischer Amps.


 
 The SM64 was more musical to me, only the lack of sparkle stood in the way.


----------



## ljokerl

mingus said:


> The SM64 was more musical to me, only the lack of sparkle stood in the way.


 
  
  
 Your best bet would probably have been to tweak the SM64 via EQ. I haven't tried anything that mimics the SM64 through the bass and mids but just has more sparkle.


----------



## ericr

mingus said:


> The SM64 was more musical to me, only the lack of sparkle stood in the way.


 

 If you can reach up in price a bit more it might be worth considering a universal build of the V6-Stage.  I owned both the SM64 and W4 for over a year and almost always listened to the SM64 for the stronger bass and lack of veil in the mids.  Since my V6-Stage universals arrived a couple of months ago I've sold the W4 and used the SM64 maybe 2 or 3 times.  Compared to the SM64, the V6-Stage bass has a bit less emphasis but extends lower while also being tighter and better controlled. The mids are a bit more forward with excellent tonal accuracy (the piano sounds spot on), along with highs having greater extension and plenty of sparkle.  Like the SM64 the V6-Stage gives a cohesive and coherent presentation across the frequency spectrum for a very natural and realistic sound.  The level of detail presented by the V6-Stage is very noticeably ahead of the SM64 (or W4).  Joker rates the V6-Stage quite high and they regularly wow me!
  
 Last year 1964 Ears had a Memorial weekend sale that included the V6 (the Stage had not yet been released), so there may be a good opportunity in a few weeks to save some money on a fantastic set of headphones.


----------



## uncletim

ericr said:


> If you can reach up in price a bit more it might be worth considering a universal build of the V6-Stage.  I owned both the SM64 and W4 for over a year and almost always listened to the SM64 for the stronger bass and lack of veil in the mids.  Since my V6-Stage universals arrived a couple of months ago I've sold the W4 and used the SM64 maybe 2 or 3 times.  Compared to the SM64, the V6-Stage bass has a bit less emphasis but extends lower while also being tighter and better controlled. The mids are a bit more forward with excellent tonal accuracy (the piano sounds spot on), along with highs having greater extension and plenty of sparkle.  Like the SM64 the V6-Stage gives a cohesive and coherent presentation across the frequency spectrum for a very natural and realistic sound.  The level of detail presented by the V6-Stage is very noticeably ahead of the SM64 (or W4).  Joker rates the V6-Stage quite high and they regularly wow me!
> 
> Last year 1964 Ears had a Memorial weekend sale that included the V6 (the Stage had not yet been released), so there may be a good opportunity in a few weeks to save some money on a fantastic set of headphones.


 
 Sounds perfect. I didn't know they could be universal, I figured custom only. I wonder if the universals would be 4-5 weeks? I have a trip late June. Thanks again


----------



## suman134

ericr said:


> If you can reach up in price a bit more it might be worth considering a universal build of the V6-Stage.  I owned both the SM64 and W4 for over a year and almost always listened to the SM64 for the stronger bass and lack of veil in the mids.  Since my V6-Stage universals arrived a couple of months ago I've sold the W4 and used the SM64 maybe 2 or 3 times.  Compared to the SM64, the V6-Stage bass has a bit less emphasis but extends lower while also being tighter and better controlled. The mids are a bit more forward with excellent tonal accuracy (the piano sounds spot on), along with highs having greater extension and plenty of sparkle.  Like the SM64 the V6-Stage gives a cohesive and coherent presentation across the frequency spectrum for a very natural and realistic sound.  The level of detail presented by the V6-Stage is very noticeably ahead of the SM64 (or W4).  Joker rates the V6-Stage quite high and they regularly wow me!
> 
> Last year 1964 Ears had a Memorial weekend sale that included the V6 (the Stage had not yet been released), so there may be a good opportunity in a few weeks to save some money on a fantastic set of headphones.


 
  
     1964 ears have universals too ?


----------



## ericr

Yeah, I had no clue they would make them as universals until someone posted pictures of theirs in the 1964 Ears V6 thread.  When you place your order just put the word "Universal" in the comment section.
  
 My order went in the queue along with all of the others and took a bit over a month to get.  They offer a rush fee to move to the front of the line if time is more important than money (it's about a week from what I've read).
  
 They do sound great and getting to design how they look is pretty cool too.


----------



## Harijs

Joker, when will we finally see a full review of the UE Triple.Fi 10? 
 I believe, it would be so helpful for so many head-fiers, wouldn't it? Especially comparisons.
 Thanks for this great thread!


----------



## peter123

Is the Triple.Fi 10 still available? I thought I read somewhere that they're discontinued so I lost interest in them. If they're still available I'll check them out again.


----------



## saj2001ind

Guys anyone here having nad viso HP 50 headphone, can suggest me a similar sounding IEM specially for highs, I have hifiman re400, shure se215, etymotic hf5 and klipsch x7i, out of these I like hifiman re400 but highs and not at par with hp50

Sent from my SM-N900 using Tapatalk


----------



## Harijs

peter123 said:


> Is the Triple.Fi 10 still available? I thought I read somewhere that they're discontinued so I lost interest in them. If they're still available I'll check them out again.


 
 Probably, thousands of people still have the Triple.Fi 10 as their first and only hi-end IEM's...


----------



## momos

hey man please do a Chord & Major in ear review they looks good.. check it out..


----------



## peter123

If the Triple.Fi is indeed discontinued I see little value in giving priority to review it but fortunately it's not my call


----------



## Ivabign

ericr said:


> Yeah, I had no clue they would make them as universals until someone posted pictures of theirs in the 1964 Ears V6 thread.  When you place your order just put the word "Universal" in the comment section.
> 
> My order went in the queue along with all of the others and took a bit over a month to get.  They offer a rush fee to move to the front of the line if time is more important than money (it's about a week from what I've read).
> 
> They do sound great and getting to design how they look is pretty cool too.


 
 There is a $25 discount from list price on 1964 Ears Customs to go universal - and yes they take as long to make as customs because you get to design them (colors - artwork, etc..) like you would a custom. The rush fee (which increased from $99 to $199 recently) get them done in 6 business days. They come with the same 2 year warranty as their customs. I am enjoying my V8's. An 8 driver universal for $775 ($875 soon, as $899 is MSRP) was too good to pass up.


----------



## Don Lehrer

The triple fi 10 are indeed great and also discontinued, sadly. I like the sound and would like to see a review just to get a comparision with other great iems...


----------



## ljokerl

momos said:


> hey man please do a Chord & Major in ear review they looks good.. check it out..


 
  
 Never heard of them. Interesting designs.
  


peter123 said:


> If the Triple.Fi is indeed discontinued I see little value in giving priority to review it but fortunately it's not my call


 
  
 This is why I have neglected to give it one.


----------



## esteebin

Joker,
I recently got the Astrotec AX-35 a couple days ago as my first pair of Hybrid IEMs. From your short impressions you liked it enough to make a full review on it.
I was wondering if you can give a quick impression on it now that you've had it for quite a while and how it compares with other hybrids in its price range and up (specifically the DN-1000). What will I gain with the step up, and if it's worth it.
I tried different tips from Sony hybrid to VSonic (colorful) hybrids and their regular black silicone. I find the Sony and colorful VSonics to make the highs uncomfortable/annoying (maybe the smaller bore of the tips vs nozzle causes harmonics issues) and the VSonic black tips to be the best because it has similar bore size as stock but a little firmer.
Thanks.


----------



## momos

ljokerl said:


> Never heard of them. Interesting designs.


 
 ya,, me too never heard.. saw it few days ago.. do review if possible.. thanks man. cheers!


----------



## davidcotton

ericr said:


> If you can reach up in price a bit more it might be worth considering a universal build of the V6-Stage.  I owned both the SM64 and W4 for over a year and almost always listened to the SM64 for the stronger bass and lack of veil in the mids.  Since my V6-Stage universals arrived a couple of months ago I've sold the W4 and used the SM64 maybe 2 or 3 times.  Compared to the SM64, the V6-Stage bass has a bit less emphasis but extends lower while also being tighter and better controlled. The mids are a bit more forward with excellent tonal accuracy (the piano sounds spot on), along with highs having greater extension and plenty of sparkle.  Like the SM64 the V6-Stage gives a cohesive and coherent presentation across the frequency spectrum for a very natural and realistic sound.  The level of detail presented by the V6-Stage is very noticeably ahead of the SM64 (or W4).  Joker rates the V6-Stage quite high and they regularly wow me!
> 
> Last year 1964 Ears had a Memorial weekend sale that included the V6 (the Stage had not yet been released), so there may be a good opportunity in a few weeks to save some money on a fantastic set of headphones.


 
  
  


mingus said:


> Sounds perfect. I didn't know they could be universal, I figured custom only. I wonder if the universals would be 4-5 weeks? I have a trip late June. Thanks again


 
  
  


suman134 said:


> 1964 ears have universals too ?


 

 If you email and enquire about the universals they may send you a discount code for $25 off.  At least that's what they did with me.  It was only the fear of taxes (I'm in UK) that stopped me ordering a pair of v6 universals.  I still think about it from time to time.  Maybe if that Memorial day sale happens this year I might just pull the trigger then (or not).


----------



## altrunox

I would love if joker could take a look at the Xiaomi Piston and Moxpad X3


----------



## ljokerl

esteebin said:


> Joker,
> I recently got the Astrotec AX-35 a couple days ago as my first pair of Hybrid IEMs. From your short impressions you liked it enough to make a full review on it.
> I was wondering if you can give a quick impression on it now that you've had it for quite a while and how it compares with other hybrids in its price range and up (specifically the DN-1000). What will I gain with the step up, and if it's worth it.
> I tried different tips from Sony hybrid to VSonic (colorful) hybrids and their regular black silicone. I find the Sony and colorful VSonics to make the highs uncomfortable/annoying (maybe the smaller bore of the tips vs nozzle causes harmonics issues) and the VSonic black tips to be the best because it has similar bore size as stock but a little firmer.
> Thanks.


 
  
 It's the next review up for completion - should be done in a day or two. The touchy treble is one of its few flaws but on the whole I still think it's very good for $70-80. I'm using it with Comply T400s - they seem to dampen the treble peaks somewhat. Still, even at its best I don't think the AX-35 competes with the DN-1000 in bass (either quantity or quality) and clarity, and doesn't sound quite as natural in terms of note thickness and overall tonality.
  
 Granted, bass and clarity are the two things the DN-1000 does extremely well, but that's what makes it a worthwhile step up from the AX-35. The Astrotecs don't have the greatest bass depth and can't match the explosive, dynamic nature of the DN-1000's bass. Despite the relatively bright signature, the AX-35 also still can sound a little muddy in the midrange while the DN-1000 does not. 
  
  


altrunox said:


> I would love if joker could take a look at the Xiaomi Piston and Moxpad X3


 
  
 I plan to at least try the Piston.


----------



## esteebin

ljokerl said:


> It's the next review up for completion - should be done in a day or two. The touchy treble is one of its few flaws but on the whole I still think it's very good for $70-80. I'm using it with Comply T400s - they seem to dampen the treble peaks somewhat. Still, even at its best I don't think the AX-35 competes with the DN-1000 in bass (either quantity or quality) and clarity, and doesn't sound quite as natural in terms of note thickness and overall tonality.
> 
> Granted, bass and clarity are the two things the DN-1000 does extremely well, but that's what makes it a worthwhile step up from the AX-35. The Astrotecs don't have the greatest bass depth and can't match the explosive, dynamic nature of the DN-1000's bass. Despite the relatively bright signature, the AX-35 also still can sound a little muddy in the midrange while the DN-1000 does not.




Looking forward to it. I will be saving up for the DN-1k. The DN-2k is out of my budget, but I think I'll be happy with the 1k.


----------



## altrunox

ljokerl said:


> I plan to at least try the Piston.


 
  
 That would be great, i think they are kind of hyped....
 I was going to buy the Moxpad X3 but after reading your review about the MEelectronics i changed my mind...
  
 The M6 are all the same?
 This one ( http://www.ebay.com/itm/MEElectronics-Over-the-Ear-Sports-Fi-M6-First-gernation-Headset-Bulk-Package-/130982442462?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item1e7f2975de) have "first generation" and the others don`t, i don`t care about caring bag, box or others stuff, just need the earphones and the eartips...
  
 I`ll be waiting your answer to buy the clear one, they looks so great.
  
 --
  





 forget about it, they don`t ship to Brazil, and the others that ship are very expensive... i think i will stay with the Moxpad for now.
  
 And Joker btw, yours and ClieOS reviews are one of the most referred reviews on Brazil, keep the great job.


----------



## suman134

> Originally Posted by *davidcotton* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> If you email and enquire about the universals they may send you a discount code for $25 off.  At least that's what they did with me.  It was only the fear of taxes (I'm in UK) that stopped me ordering a pair of v6 universals.  I still think about it from time to time.  Maybe if that Memorial day sale happens this year I might just pull the trigger then (or not).


 
  
     yup , one has to worry about these import charges .


----------



## peter123

altrunox said:


> That would be great, i think they are kind of hyped....
> I was going to buy the Moxpad X3 but after reading your review about the MEelectronics i changed my mind...
> 
> The M6 are all the same?
> ...




For what it's worth I enjoy the Moxpad's more than the M6. If you can get the Moxpad's cheaper it's a better deal.

Then again the Piston's are much more enjoyable than the Moxpad's 

If you're going to use them for workout I'd recommend the Moxpad's though since they fit much better in the ear and isolate better. If you're just going to use them to enjoy music I'd get the Piston's.

Hope this helps.


----------



## altrunox

peter123 said:


> For what it's worth I enjoy the Moxpad's more than the M6. If you can get the Moxpad's cheaper it's a better deal.
> 
> Then again the Piston's are much more enjoyable than the Moxpad's
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thx for that, it really helped.
 For US$20,00 with free shipping the X3 should be a better choice, since i'll use it while i'm working to work.
 I'm just worried if they will last one year...
 Going to buy again


----------



## Headphonehelp

Hello everyone, I'm looking to buy in-ear headphones. I want them to be durable, have high sound quality and a good design (simple, black or white, nothing special). My price range is: $100-$150. Do you have any suggestions? I've been looking at the Atomic Floyd's Powerjax. I know that there sound quality isn't the best but I'm no sound expert so will I be able to notice a difference? My old earbuds are Apple's Earbuds, is the sound quality better in the Powerjax?
Thank you.


----------



## saj2001ind

check hifiman re400 for $99 its best neutral phones


----------



## UnityIsPower

saj2001ind said:


> check hifiman re400 for $99 its best neutral phones




Zero Audio Tenore?


----------



## Grayson73

unityispower said:


> Zero Audio Tenore?


 
 +1, although if his budget is $100-$150, he may want to look at Singolo and Doppio as well.


----------



## ljokerl

headphonehelp said:


> Hello everyone, I'm looking to buy in-ear headphones. I want them to be durable, have high sound quality and a good design (simple, black or white, nothing special). My price range is: $100-$150. Do you have any suggestions? I've been looking at the Atomic Floyd's Powerjax. I know that there sound quality isn't the best but I'm no sound expert so will I be able to notice a difference? My old earbuds are Apple's Earbuds, is the sound quality better in the Powerjax?
> Thank you.


 
  
 I don't know about the Powerjax but the RHA MA750 is right in that price range, durable, and sounds quite good so you won't have to wonder if you're getting your money's worth.


----------



## Headphonehelp

In the RHA MA750 I don't line that the cable goes overear so what do think about the RHA MA600I?


----------



## ljokerl

headphonehelp said:


> In the RHA MA750 I don't line that the cable goes overear so what do think about the RHA MA600I?


 
  
 It doesn't sound as good as the MA750 (bass is overwhelming) but it's still nicely built. I would probably be tempted to save a chunk of change and just get the MA350 over the MA600.
  
 The RBH EP1 is another set that's nicely built with a cable-down form factor and under $150. It's got a pretty plain aesthetic, too.


----------



## kcirle

Hello, this is my first post here in head-fi. I would just like to ask what in-ear  monitors would be a good upgrade from an ultimate ears 600? My budget is $100-150. I'm actually eyeing on shure se215, westone um 1 and sennheiser cx 985. I listen to a wide variety of music. I use samsung galaxy note 3 as a music player. Thank you!


----------



## ronaldo7messi10

JVC FX850 soon?


----------



## ozkan

kcirle said:


> Hello, this is my first post here in head-fi. I would just like to ask what in-ear  monitors would be a good upgrade from an ultimate ears 600? My budget is $100-150. I'm actually eyeing on shure se215, westone um 1 and sennheiser cx 985. I listen to a wide variety of music. I use samsung galaxy note 3 as a music player. Thank you!


 
  
 Audio Technica IM02 or even IM50 will be a good uprade from UE600 with their fuller sound.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I don't have an X3 but the A63 is a warm-sounding earphone, more so than the RE-400. The reason that the RE-400 remains popular is that there's nothing else quite like it at the price point. The RE-600 is built better but there's a $250 price gap. For neutral sets around $100 you can get an Ety HF5 or a TWFK-based set like the VSonic VC1000, but these tend to be a little brighter/less warm than HiFiMan earphones. I also thought the Brainwavz R3 wasn't far behind the RE-400 in performance and it seems well-built, but I couldn't get comfortable with the design.


 
 Hi joker,
  
 So I went ahead and purchased the RE-400 and am finding that I like them so far. Their particular take on the neutral character is attractive.  Thanks much for the recommendation. 
  
 That being said, I have two concerns that are making me think about the possibility of getting a second pair of IEMs to supplement the RE-400: 1.) The RE-400 have held up so far, but the build quality concerns are well-documented, and 2.) When I'm exercising at the gym (and even sometimes for regular listening when I'm in the mood), I like to have a slightly warmer sound.  But I would want something that also maintains excellent clarity through the midrange while adding some warmth.  As a counterpoint for comparison, the Vsonic GR-99 are too warm to the detriment of clarity in the midrange to my ears.
  
 With that in mind, I'm thinking maybe the Fidue A63 would be a nice supplement to the RE-400's for those occasions. That way I also get to run the RE-400's less hard, which hopefully will decrease the chances of build quality issues manifesting themselves.  I wouldn't want to spend more than $75 on the second pair given that I won't be using them as often, and the Fidue's are located in that price range.  Do you think the A63's are a good choice for this purpose?


----------



## Headphonehelp

ljokerl said:


> I don't know about the Powerjax but the RHA MA750 is right in that price range, durable, and sounds quite good so you won't have to wonder if you're getting your money's worth.


 Do you own the 750? Or do you know if I can wear the 750 regularly instead of the cable going over ear?


----------



## kcirle

ozkan said:


> Audio Technica IM02 or even IM50 will be a good uprade from UE600 with their fuller sound.


 
 Is the IM70 a better choice over all the items that I said? IM02 is quite expensive in amazon its already $200


----------



## ljokerl

kcirle said:


> Hello, this is my first post here in head-fi. I would just like to ask what in-ear  monitors would be a good upgrade from an ultimate ears 600? My budget is $100-150. I'm actually eyeing on shure se215, westone um 1 and sennheiser cx 985. I listen to a wide variety of music. I use samsung galaxy note 3 as a music player. Thank you!


 
  
 The UE 600 is a very formidable budget earphone. I'd listen to it over the SE215 or CX985 any day. If you want an upgrade from it and you like the balanced, accurate sound, the HiFiMan RE-400 is a good bet towards the lower end of that price range. The VSonic VC1000 would be a good one as well if you're okay with a slightly brighter - but very clear and resolving - sound.
  


ronaldo7messi10 said:


> JVC FX850 soon?


 
  
 No plans at this time.
  


steelglam said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> So I went ahead and purchased the RE-400 and am finding that I like them so far. Their particular take on the neutral character is attractive.  Thanks much for the recommendation.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I think you will still miss some clarity with the A63 if you're used to the RE-400 now. It's certainly an improvement over the GR99 in that regard, but it's more like halfway between the GR99 and RE-400. Still very good for $60-something, though. 
  
 By the way, I always am wary of recommending non-sports earphones for gym use because it is unclear how sweat-resistant they might be. If you don't sweat much obviously that's not a problem.
  


headphonehelp said:


> Do you own the 750? Or do you know if I can wear the 750 regularly instead of the cable going over ear?


 

 Yes, I have them and no, you can't wear them cable-down.


----------



## kcirle

ljokerl said:


> The UE 600 is a very formidable budget earphone. I'd listen to it over the SE215 or CX985 any day. If you want an upgrade from it and you like the balanced, accurate sound, the HiFiMan RE-400 is a good bet towards the lower end of that price range. The VSonic VC1000 would be a good one as well if you're okay with a slightly brighter - but very clear and resolving - sound.


 
 Thanks for the suggestion. One more question, how about the Audio technica IM50 or IM70? Do you think it will be a great upgrade? I've read that its sound quality is almost the same as the ath m50. Thank you again


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> I think you will still miss some clarity with the A63 if you're used to the RE-400 now. It's certainly an improvement over the GR99 in that regard, but it's more like halfway between the GR99 and RE-400. Still very good for $60-something, though.
> 
> By the way, I always am wary of recommending non-sports earphones for gym use because it is unclear how sweat-resistant they might be. If you don't sweat much obviously that's not a problem.


 
 Yes, I really like the clarity of the RE-400.  It's becoming increasingly apparent that the increased midrange clarity is what I was missing from all of the other IEMs that I've tried.  Well, I guess my Brainwavz M2 and ProAlpha had midrange clarity, but they also were more strident/peaky than the RE-400 and with a much more congested soundstage (i.e., less separation).
  
 If I will miss some clarity with the Fidue A63, do you think there is something that comes closer to the RE-400's midrange clarity that also contains the added warmth of the A63 for $75 or less?  I understand that I'm not going to get the same amount of clarity as the RE-400's, but I'm wondering if there is something a bit closer to the RE-400 than the A63.  Using your spectrum, if the A63 is like halfway between the GR99 and the RE400 in terms of midrange clarity, is there something that is between the A63 and the RE400?  Someone suggested the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore to me, but I don't think you've heard that one yet (from reading back through this thread).
  
 The sweating thing has never been an issue for me, so no worries on that front.  I've been using non-sport IEMs at the gym for years and have never had a problem.  Of course, now that I said that, I will probably develop a problem!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Seriously, though, I think it's smart to not use the RE-400 at the gym given the durability issues.


----------



## peter123

steelglam said:


> Yes, I really like the clarity of the RE-400.  It's becoming increasingly apparent that the increased midrange clarity is what I was missing from all of the other IEMs that I've tried.  Well, I guess my Brainwavz M2 and ProAlpha had midrange clarity, but they also were more strident/peaky than the RE-400 and with a much more congested soundstage (i.e., less separation).
> 
> If I will miss some clarity with the Fidue A63, do you think there is something that comes closer to the RE-400's midrange clarity that also contains the added warmth of the A63 for $75 or less?  I understand that I'm not going to get the same amount of clarity as the RE-400's, but I'm wondering if there is something a bit closer to the RE-400 than the A63.  Using your spectrum, if the A63 is like halfway between the GR99 and the RE400 in terms of midrange clarity, is there something that is between the A63 and the RE400?  Someone suggested the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore to me, but I don't think you've heard that one yet (from reading back through this thread).
> 
> The sweating thing has never been an issue for me, so no worries on that front.  I've been using non-sport IEMs at the gym for years and have never had a problem.  Of course, now that I said that, I will probably develop a problem!     Seriously, though, I think it's smart to not use the RE-400 at the gym given the durability issues.




Check out Ostry KC06. I'm sure someone in the KC06 thread can compare them to the RE-400 if you ask there.


----------



## SebsG

To all those who own or have experience with the UE600/700 IEM's,
What's so bad about the UE600/700 cable? I've heard some not-so-great comments about the longetivity of it. Any thoughts? Experience with it? I haven't had it for long, but it seems durable enough if I am cautious. 

Also, any general maintenance tips for the cables of headphones or IEM's? I find that many of my headphone cables short out so I have to replace the cables and it's annoying because of how often it happens. 

The nozzles of IEM's worry me as well. How can I maintained how much damage does earwax or debris in the nozzle cause? I always get scared when I see things in the nozzle and I don't want my earbuds to get damaged.

Thank you,
-Seb


----------



## steelglam

peter123 said:


> Check out Ostry KC06. I'm sure someone in the KC06 thread can compare them to the RE-400 if you ask there.


 
 Yeah, I had looked into those.  But they appear from the reviews to have even less warmth than the RE-400.  They appear to be forward in the upper mids/lower highs, which I don't want.


----------



## ozkan

kcirle said:


> Thanks for the suggestion. One more question, how about the Audio technica IM50 or IM70? Do you think it will be a great upgrade? I've read that its sound quality is almost the same as the ath m50. Thank you again


 

 I don't know about IM70 but I do have IM50 which is more fuller sounding than UE600s that I also have. IM50 have more body to the vocals and sounds more natural, the mids have more weight, and the bass has considerably more slam and hits harder. IM50 is slightly more mid-centric than UE600.
  
 I haven't listened to M50 so I can't say anything about it but I prefer IM50 over UE600 any day.


----------



## modulor

steelglam said:


> Yes, I really like the clarity of the RE-400.  It's becoming increasingly apparent that the increased midrange clarity is what I was missing from all of the other IEMs that I've tried.  Well, I guess my Brainwavz M2 and ProAlpha had midrange clarity, but they also were more strident/peaky than the RE-400 and with a much more congested soundstage (i.e., less separation).
> 
> If I will miss some clarity with the Fidue A63, do you think there is something that comes closer to the RE-400's midrange clarity that also contains the added warmth of the A63 for $75 or less?  I understand that I'm not going to get the same amount of clarity as the RE-400's, but I'm wondering if there is something a bit closer to the RE-400 than the A63.  Using your spectrum, if the A63 is like halfway between the GR99 and the RE400 in terms of midrange clarity, is there something that is between the A63 and the RE400?  *Someone suggested the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore to me, but I don't think you've heard that one yet (from reading back through this thread)*.
> 
> ...


 
 I actually just ordered these the other day and they should arrive sometime next week, so I'll be writing up a little comparison at some point.  People kept suggesting them in various threads so I had to see for myself


----------



## steelglam

modulor said:


> I actually just ordered these the other day and they should arrive sometime next week, so I'll be writing up a little comparison at some point.  People kept suggesting them in various threads so I had to see for myself


 

 Cool!  I look forward to your review and comparison!  Which will you be comparing them to: the RE-400 or the A63?


----------



## Grayson73

steelglam said:


> Yeah, I had looked into those.  But they appear from the reviews to have even less warmth than the RE-400.  They appear to be forward in the upper mids/lower highs, which I don't want.


 
 I have the Ostry KC06 on the way.  I expect them to be warmer than RE-400.


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> To all those who own or have experience with the UE600/700 IEM's,
> What's so bad about the UE600/700 cable? I've heard some not-so-great comments about the longetivity of it. Any thoughts? Experience with it? I haven't had it for long, but it seems durable enough if I am cautious.
> 
> Also, any general maintenance tips for the cables of headphones or IEM's? I find that many of my headphone cables short out so I have to replace the cables and it's annoying because of how often it happens.
> ...


 
  
       as they lack stress relievers , just dont stress at the joining points , dont stress the cable and it will be fine . they are okay , but not the best , the best cable till date i have seen is on xba-h1 .


----------



## modulor

steelglam said:


> Cool!  I look forward to your review and comparison!  Which will you be comparing them to: the RE-400 or the A63?


 
  
 Ya sorry not to clarify but will be with the RE-400 most likely, and also with the SteelSeries Flux which is similarly priced.


----------



## 0MoUsE0

Wow !
 This is a freaking big in-ear headphone data base !
 Thanks a lot !
 This helped me a lot in choosing IEMs
  
 It took me a long time to read......................


----------



## Headphonehelp

Hello agian,
I was looking at a-Jays Four. Does anyone know if they are any good? Durable, comfterable, Etc?


----------



## ljokerl

kcirle said:


> Thanks for the suggestion. One more question, how about the Audio technica IM50 or IM70? Do you think it will be a great upgrade? I've read that its sound quality is almost the same as the ath m50. Thank you again


 
  
 I personally haven't tried either of these new Audio-Technica IEMs. 
  


steelglam said:


> Yes, I really like the clarity of the RE-400.  It's becoming increasingly apparent that the increased midrange clarity is what I was missing from all of the other IEMs that I've tried.  Well, I guess my Brainwavz M2 and ProAlpha had midrange clarity, but they also were more strident/peaky than the RE-400 and with a much more congested soundstage (i.e., less separation).
> 
> If I will miss some clarity with the Fidue A63, do you think there is something that comes closer to the RE-400's midrange clarity that also contains the added warmth of the A63 for $75 or less?  I understand that I'm not going to get the same amount of clarity as the RE-400's, but I'm wondering if there is something a bit closer to the RE-400 than the A63.  Using your spectrum, if the A63 is like halfway between the GR99 and the RE400 in terms of midrange clarity, is there something that is between the A63 and the RE400?  Someone suggested the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore to me, but I don't think you've heard that one yet (from reading back through this thread).
> 
> ...


 
  
 Good question. I think the answer is no - the only way you could get RE-400-level clarity in that price range is with something that has brighter treble, but of course that can create its own problems. I'm thinking something along the lines of the LG Quadbeat F420, which is superbly good in the clarity department and costs very little, or the VSonic VC02. 
  
  


sebsg said:


> To all those who own or have experience with the UE600/700 IEM's,
> What's so bad about the UE600/700 cable? I've heard some not-so-great comments about the longetivity of it. Any thoughts? Experience with it? I haven't had it for long, but it seems durable enough if I am cautious.
> 
> Also, any general maintenance tips for the cables of headphones or IEM's? I find that many of my headphone cables short out so I have to replace the cables and it's annoying because of how often it happens.
> ...


 
  
 What suman134 said. It's not the worst cable and not the best. That sort of cable was pretty popular a few years back but other manufacturers have been moving towards thicker cables and cables made with harder materials on the outside. Of course the UE600/700 were originally released in 2008 or 2009 and the cable hasn't been changed.
  
 If you store your IEMs in a hard case when not in use and never pull on the cable for any reason they should last quite a while. A q-tip with a dab of peroxide does the trick for cleaning mesh filters. If your IEMs don't have filters you'll need a cleaning tool to scoop out any build-up.
  


0mouse0 said:


> Wow !
> This is a freaking big in-ear headphone data base !
> Thanks a lot !
> This helped me a lot in choosing IEMs
> ...


 
  
 Hopefully not the whole thing at once...
  


headphonehelp said:


> Hello agian,
> I was looking at a-Jays Four. Does anyone know if they are any good? Durable, comfterable, Etc?


 
  
 I personally haven't tried any new JAYS products since the t-JAYS, which were just OK.


----------



## steelglam

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> Good question. I think the answer is no - the only way you could get RE-400-level clarity in that price range is with something that has brighter treble, but of course that can create its own problems. I'm thinking something along the lines of the LG Quadbeat F420, which is superbly good in the clarity department and costs very little, or the VSonic VC02.


 
 Thanks, joker.  That's good to know.  Yeah, I am definitely not interested in a brighter set.
  
 I think I'll wait until I see some reviews comparing the suggested Zero Audio Carbo Tenore with the RE-400, and then make a decision whether to check those out or the Fidue A63.


----------



## martindagun

Hi.
  
 I'm in the process of upgrading my Meelectronics M9P second generation. 
  
 I was originally going to get the Vsonic VSD1's, however I can see the UE 600vi are pretty much the same price. You've mentioned they sound different. 
  
 Maybe you can help me out... I listen to Techno mainly (Deep, Dub, Acid, Ambient etc.), so pretty much no vocals.
  
 Looking to spend around $50, if you have any other recommendations that would be great.


----------



## suman134

martindagun said:


> Hi.
> 
> I'm in the process of upgrading my Meelectronics M9P second generation.
> 
> ...


 
  
      you can go for vsd1/s cuz they are more v shaped then ue600 , ue600 is fast but it lacks much bass or spark but its precise .


----------



## Harijs

martindagun said:


> Hi.
> 
> I'm in the process of upgrading my Meelectronics M9P second generation.
> 
> ...


 
 VSD1S is great for that kind of music. It can easy compete with my TF10.


----------



## ljokerl

martindagun said:


> Hi.
> 
> I'm in the process of upgrading my Meelectronics M9P second generation.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I agree with everyone else - the VSD1 or 1S will be a very good option for you. The UE600 is better at a few things but not the right choice here.


----------



## martindagun

Thanks for your help guys. Just ordered a pair


----------



## Wydz

Ostry KC06 or RE-400?


----------



## suman134

wydz said:


> Ostry KC06 or RE-400?


 
  
      re-400 for sure . and the package has improved too .


----------



## DannyBai

suman134 said:


> re-400 for sure . and the package has improved too .




Why?


----------



## cel4145

I know you liked the vPulse, joker, so I thought I'd call your attention to the Donscorpio Bass Colour:



Look familiar? 

Speculation on the Chinese/Asian brand thread is that these are the vPulse, only available for $35 shipped from Hong Kong. Donscorpio has indicated a relationship with Velodyne, so they may be the OEM. 

So far, no one has directly compared them yet. But they sound a lot to me like your review of the vPulse. Also, the accessories package looks like a lot like the vPulse as well:






If it's the same IEM, you could have a new king of bass best overall value in your $30-$60 tier


----------



## ZapX629

My VSD1S just crapped out on me (left driver went out
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




), and my GF's Brainwavz S1 were way too warm for me so I picked up a pair of Quadbeats (1) as a cheap pair of out and about IEMs. Popular consensus says that the stock tips aren't too hot, so I thought I'd ask if Joker or anyone else has a suggestion for some aftermarket tips. The nozzle looks pretty wide, so not sure what options there might be. Thanks, guys.


----------



## HeadphoneAddict

It's page 911 in this thread - is there an emergency?


----------



## Amitl

Joker, which portable player do you use?
 it seems weird to me, theres so many earphones out there, and so little portable players.
 most players are made by niche companies like Fiio.
 i use my smartphone, and im not interested in a hi-res player,
 but i was thinking maybe i'm seriously bottlenecking my experience because of the phone?
 (Samsung Galaxy S1)
 i read the Fiio X3 produces better audio the the iPhone (which means any other smartphone as well).
 also...why are these Astell&Kern players so expansive?...do they put gold inside??
 thanx...


----------



## Vartan

Love this thread_!!!!_


----------



## listen4joy

intresting.....
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/718900/the-ostry-kc06a-the-guy-who-surprises-with-sound-class-look-and-many-more-d
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/665111/zero-audio-zh-dx200-carbo-tenore-zh-dx210-carbo-basso-carbon-aluminium-iem-information-appreciation-and-impressions-thread
  
 new players here...


----------



## ljokerl

cel4145 said:


> I know you liked the vPulse, joker, so I thought I'd call your attention to the Donscorpio Bass Colour:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Could be an OEM vPulse, or a knock-off. No way to know without comparing them, really, but the price makes sense. IIRC the regular vPulse has been down to $40 or so on sale. 
  


zapx629 said:


> My VSD1S just crapped out on me (left driver went out
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 It's a pretty standard ~5.5mm nozzle - similar to the size used by Sennheiser, old UE products, MEElectronics, etc. You might consider just grabbing one of these if you're not sure what shape of tips normally works for you: http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_M11_Earphones_p/tipset10-m11-bk-mee.htm 
  


headphoneaddict said:


> *It's page 911 in this thread* - is there an emergency?


 
  
 Not for long 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


amitl said:


> Joker, which portable player do you use?
> it seems weird to me, theres so many earphones out there, and so little portable players.
> most players are made by niche companies like Fiio.
> i use my smartphone, and im not interested in a hi-res player,
> ...


 
  
 The HM-901 and my trusty Cowon J3, depending on how patient I'm feeling. I have music on my Nexus 5 but it's not quite as good as the J3 IMO. Still a big improvement over my last phone, which was an HTC.
  


vartan said:


> Love this thread_!!!!_


----------



## cel4145

ljokerl said:


> Could be an OEM vPulse, or a knock-off. No way to know without comparing them, really, but the price makes sense. IIRC the regular vPulse has been down to $40 or so on sale.




Your reviews have been very helpful to me, and so I'd be glad to buy you a pair and have it sent to you. I'm sure you could tell pretty quick. PM if you are interested.


----------



## Amitl

Joker, HM-901 vs Nexus 5 : how big is the difference?
 do you need 1000$ IEM to hear it, or is it crystal clear?
 thank you..


----------



## ljokerl

cel4145 said:


> Your reviews have been very helpful to me, and so I'd be glad to buy you a pair and have it sent to you. I'm sure you could tell pretty quick. PM if you are interested.


 
  
 Unfortunately I don't have my vPulse anymore - it was a loan that's been returned. Someone else will have to conduct this science test 
  


amitl said:


> Joker, HM-901 vs Nexus 5 : how big is the difference?
> do you need 1000$ IEM to hear it, or is it crystal clear?
> thank you..


 
  
 The Nexus 5 doesn't sound particularly great in the first place so there's a sizable gap. You can hear it with some BA-based and fairly transparent, like a VC1000, definitely don't need $1000 earphones. Nexus just doesn't have great detail or dynamics, which is my favorite IEMs to use with it are warmer-sounding, smoother ones where it doesn't matter. The Sony MH1C, for example, or more recently the NarMoo S1.


----------



## saj2001ind

Hi Guys,
  
 does anyone has both hifiman re400 and vsonic gr07 ? which one of these are more neutral and clean sounding...not too much bass head
  
 and which one of these will you recommend


----------



## getclikinagas

saj2001ind said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> does anyone has both hifiman re400 and vsonic gr07 ? which one of these are more neutral and clean sounding...not too much bass head
> 
> and which one of these will you recommend


 
 The RE400 thread has extensive comparisons of the two. Some quoted below :
  
  


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






modulor said:


> I've owned both, and they are very similar actually comparing them side by side.  You get a bit more impact with the BE though, which is pretty satisfying and they get your heart racing
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  


tom22 said:


> i actually own both the re400 and the vsonic gr07 BE now the be edition is more expensive but it does have the extra bass response (despite its name its nowhere near basshead category) its more than re400 by a bit but its mindblowingly fast and tight, the extra bass it has over the mk2 supposedly is on the midbass only otherwise identical
> 
> the mids are a bit pushed back (but just by a hair) i really didn't notice until i a/b them back and forth for a good 15 minutes of hard core concentrating. but otherwise beautiful and clear. the mid are similar to the re400s in that its lean sounding which helps with its transparency (not as transparent as the re400 because of the bass boost but still top notch).
> 
> ...


 


modulor said:


> In that price-range for that criteria there's the Vsonic GR07 Classic, which are currently $100.  They'll be a bit bassier and a bit more sparkly, but have a tendency to emphasize sibilance in recordings (I didn't like that trait myself but others are OK with it).  The Vsonic is still quite neutral, just slightly more forward bass and more sparkly treble, less forward mids than the RE-400 comparatively.  I'd call it a different flavor of neutral.  The GR07 tends to sound wider in soundstage, but not quite as deep as a result.  Since you like the presentation of the RE-400, my first recommendation would be the TDK BA200 but it has unfortunately been discontinued, so finding a new pair in that price range may be difficult.  Periodically they show up on Ebay/Amazon used in good condition for about $100-$120, but to get the best out of them you need a deeper fit and certain tips (foams, particularly Shure Olives work the best I find) so there's a bit more investment there.  On those, there is a bit more mid-bass and impact vs the RE-400 (though a tad less than the GR07) and a bit more sparkle with a slight tendency at exaggerating sibilance, but IMO less so than the GR07.  The BA200 tends to be the smoothest of the three, except for the treble region where the RE-400 wins out.  Plus, they are a bit fuller sounding than both RE-400 and GR07, thicker of note especially in the midrange.
> 
> Reviews:
> http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/hifiman-re-400-waterline/
> ...


 


modulor said:


> The RE-400 has really great treble IMO - it is no less extended than the GR07, but it is smoother and (at least to my ear) more natural and realistic sounding.  The GR07 has more sparkle and presence, but is peakier as a result and as you've probably read, more prone to sibilance.  The driver of the GR07 is quicker, and the bass is of higher quality and quantity overall which is more satisfying there, I just wish the treble wasn't so harsh at times.  I do prefer the mids of the RE-400 though.  Each IEM serves it's purpose in my collection, but I have been thinking of a way to acoustically dampen the treble of the GR07, which I hope would bring the mids a bit more forward.  We'll see
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## cel4145

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately I don't have my vPulse anymore - it was a loan that's been returned. Someone else will have to conduct this science test




Oh well. If you'd like to hear them anyway, I'd still be glad to buy you a pair of the Bass Colours.


----------



## Grayson73

listen4joy said:


> intresting.....
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/718900/the-ostry-kc06a-the-guy-who-surprises-with-sound-class-look-and-many-more-d
> 
> ...


 
 Agree.  Would love to hear Joker's take on Zero Audio (Tenore, Singolo, or Doppio) and Ostry (KC06 or KC06A).  I think they would rate highly.


----------



## Lukalop

A little irrelevant. I am perplexed as to why musicians always are seen wearing EarPods and beats buds when on stage they wear TOTL IEMs. I assumed going back to sub 50 headphones would sound horrible. Is this true?


----------



## modulor

lukalop said:


> A little irrelevant. I am perplexed as to why musicians always are seen wearing EarPods and beats buds when on stage they wear TOTL IEMs. I assumed going back to sub 50 headphones would sound horrible. Is this true?


 
 Marketing...it is perplexing to those who are informed lol but it makes sense, it's 100% marketing.


----------



## modulor

My ZA Tenore just came in, initial impressions are positive...more details to come of course when I've had some time to analyze and compare


----------



## drm870

lukalop said:


> A little irrelevant. I am perplexed as to why musicians always are seen wearing EarPods and beats buds when on stage they wear TOTL IEMs. I assumed going back to sub 50 headphones would sound horrible. Is this true?


 
  
 I read this commentary by Steve Guttenberg on his CNET blog a little while ago. My experience (with the musician friends I have) is that while his observations are generalizations, they're true more often than not.


----------



## rodweb

How the RE-262 sounds compared to the VC1000?


----------



## ookic

cel4145 said:


> I know you liked the vPulse, joker, so I thought I'd call your attention to the Donscorpio Bass Colour:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I sent donscorpio an e-mail a while ago and in broken english they said it is the same IEM with a diferent branding.
 There was a sale on the vpulse in march too, 50% off making it $45 so almost the same price. Haven't seen it on sale since, though.


----------



## cel4145

poopsockk said:


> I sent donscorpio an e-mail a while ago and in broken english they said it is the same IEM with a diferent branding.
> There was a sale on the vpulse in march too, 50% off making it $45 so almost the same price. Haven't seen it on sale since, though.




That's great to know. I think they are excellent headphones for $35.


----------



## ljokerl

saj2001ind said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> does anyone has both hifiman re400 and vsonic gr07 ? which one of these are more neutral and clean sounding...not too much bass head
> 
> and which one of these will you recommend


 
  
 Neither is for bassheads and both are very clean and clear. I tend to consider the RE-400 a tad more neutral, though.
  


cel4145 said:


> Oh well. If you'd like to hear them anyway, I'd still be glad to buy you a pair of the Bass Colours.


 
  
 Got a link to the manufacturer's site? They might just send one out. 
  


rodweb said:


> How the RE-262 sounds compared to the VC1000?


 
  
 Significantly less bright, not quite as clear, a little more warm and full-bodied. Very different takes on near-neutral sound. 
  


poopsockk said:


> I sent donscorpio an e-mail a while ago and in broken english they said it is the same IEM with a diferent branding.
> There was a sale on the vpulse in march too, 50% off making it $45 so almost the same price. Haven't seen it on sale since, though.


 
  
 Good to know!


----------



## cel4145

ljokerl said:


> Got a link to the manufacturer's site? They might just send one out.




http://www.s-donscorpio.com/

Scroll down to access much of their content. Kind of unusual home page build.


----------



## waynes world

modulor said:


> My ZA Tenore just came in, initial impressions are positive...more details to come of course when I've had some time to analyze and compare




Show me one person who hasn't had positive (or extremely positive!) impressions of the tenores! Hopefully I wont feel any differently when I get mine


----------



## ljokerl

cel4145 said:


> http://www.s-donscorpio.com/
> 
> Scroll down to access much of their content. Kind of unusual home page build.


 
  
 Thanks! It's actually quite a modern site for a Chinese OEM. They have nice-looking products.


----------



## cel4145

ljokerl said:


> Thanks! It's actually quite a modern site for a Chinese OEM. They have nice-looking products.




I have the Donscorpio Dolphins. They are nice headphones for $100. Pretty comfortable, OK build quality, and good sound. Bass impact is similar sub-bass emphasis like the Bass Colours. And they are small enough I find them to be portable for travel even they though don't fold up.


----------



## NIVEBL

any different between fi-ba-ss and akr02?


----------



## jbaker111

Hey Joker, do you think any IEM's have a similar sound signature to the HD600?


----------



## ljokerl

nivebl said:


> any different between fi-ba-ss and akr02?


 
  
 Never tried the AKR02 but you might want to ask james444 for an update to this: http://www.head-fi.org/t/503801/review-impressions-of-the-final-audio-design-fi-ba-ss-versus-the-sm3-fx700-and-e-q7/255#post_10202678 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


jbaker111 said:


> Hey Joker, do you think any IEM's have a similar sound signature to the HD600?


 
  
 Neutral to slightly warm? Sure, if you keep in mind that IEMs with a neutral signature have an inherent disadvantage in bass slam and soundstaging compared to similarly-tuned full-size cans. RE-400 would be a good place to start when looking for an HD600-like IEM, or the TDK BA200.


----------



## Cortlendt

Joker, any chance you that can compare Dunu Dn2000 to T-Peos H-300? I'm thinking to buy a hybrid IEM out of pure hype but cannot decide what is the most "decent" one out there. I'm mostly using VC1000 now.


----------



## suman134

is the ckx5 on par with t-peos tank or popular ?


----------



## ljokerl

cortlendt said:


> Joker, any chance you that can compare Dunu Dn2000 to T-Peos H-300? I'm thinking to buy a hybrid IEM out of pure hype but cannot decide what is the most "decent" one out there. I'm mostly using VC1000 now.


 
  
 Can't, on account of not having tried the H-300.
  


suman134 said:


> is the ckx5 on par with t-peos tank or popular ?


 
  
 Yeah, at least on-par with Popular. The CKX5's treble is a little smoother and clearer, and it has a wider presentation. However, the Popular is more dynamic and lively, and the bass is more impressive with greater slam and punch.


----------



## reihead

Joker, I'm a vsonic GR07BE user, never pulled the trigger on the dunu 1000 since it seems is not a clear upgrade, now I'm thinking to get the dunu 2000, do you think they are a clear upgrade to the vsonic?

Cheers


----------



## KimbaWLion

ljokerl said:


> Neutral to slightly warm? Sure, if you keep in mind that IEMs with a neutral signature have an inherent disadvantage in bass slam and soundstaging compared to similarly-tuned full-size cans. RE-400 would be a good place to start when looking for an HD600-like IEM, or the TDK BA200.


 

 I bought my BA-200 over a year ago back when Amazon had them at $120.00 GLAD I did! I never thought to compare them with my HD-600s. Now that you said that they come COMPARE to the HD-600's it's no wonder why I love my BA-200's so much! I also have a set of Senn IE-7s and while sounding different I am enjoying those a lot too!
  
*ljokerl: *To get much better sound IF I read correctly on your review I am looking at over $400 for a westone W40 or a custom IEM like the CT-200? I am just not sure its worth the extra money for marginally better sound. There are those that can drop the extra money like that but I can not. If I am going to spend in that range or more or even a little bit less it has to be a rather significant difference. Yes I know sound is relative but I can tell you, when I went to the BA-200s from say the AstroTec AM-800s it was a WOW moment and that that time it was $50 to $120!
 It is much harder for me to say which I like better of the IE7 vs. the BA-200 but that is different question... ( The Only 2 IEMs I own )


----------



## suman134

just got myself a hisound crystal , for just $24 , these are fabulous !! better then anything at this price !! just want to thank JOKER for this effort for people .


----------



## sbose

suman134 said:


> just got myself a hisound crystal , for just $24 , these are fabulous !! better then anything at this price !! just want to thank JOKER for this effort for people .


 
 where did you get the deal ?


----------



## suman134

sbose said:


> where did you get the deal ?


 

     would you believe it if i say , india , we had a few jhapad jhodu khapr todu deals , like xba-3 for $68 and she9850 for $17 .


----------



## Ardian

I want to upgrade in quality from my Shure SE 215 Special Edition.. With around the same price! What do you suggest me? RHA MA750 is an upgrade? I want something very natural with sub bass


----------



## ljokerl

reihead said:


> Joker, I'm a vsonic GR07BE user, never pulled the trigger on the dunu 1000 since it seems is not a clear upgrade, now I'm thinking to get the dunu 2000, do you think they are a clear upgrade to the vsonic?
> 
> Cheers


 
  
 Really depends on what type of improvement you're looking for. The DN-2000 has an advantage in bass depth and treble smoothness, the note presentation is a little thicker, and the soundstage is a little more even in depth and width. However, I don't think there's any improvement in clarity or bass control over the GR07BE.
  


kimbawlion said:


> I bought my BA-200 over a year ago back when Amazon had them at $120.00 GLAD I did! I never thought to compare them with my HD-600s. Now that you said that they come COMPARE to the HD-600's it's no wonder why I love my BA-200's so much! I also have a set of Senn IE-7s and while sounding different I am enjoying those a lot too!
> 
> *ljokerl: *To get much better sound IF I read correctly on your review I am looking at over $400 for a westone W40 or a custom IEM like the CT-200? I am just not sure its worth the extra money for marginally better sound. There are those that can drop the extra money like that but I can not. If I am going to spend in that range or more or even a little bit less it has to be a rather significant difference. Yes I know sound is relative but I can tell you, when I went to the BA-200s from say the AstroTec AM-800s it was a WOW moment and that that time it was $50 to $120!
> It is much harder for me to say which I like better of the IE7 vs. the BA-200 but that is different question... ( The Only 2 IEMs I own )


 
  
 It really depends on what type of improvement you're after. The W40 and CT-200 have some advantages over the BA200 but they also make some concessions. Foe example, the BA200 has more accurate and extended bass than both of those. Diminishing returns are in play here - the difference between the AM-800 and BA200 is indeed larger. 
  


suman134 said:


> just got myself a hisound crystal , for just $24 , these are fabulous !! better then anything at this price !! just want to thank JOKER for this effort for people .


 
  
 Very impressive price, I've always liked these. Definitely think they're on-par with the SE215 and others. 
  


ardian said:


> I want to upgrade in quality from my Shure SE 215 Special Edition.. With around the same price! What do you suggest me? RHA MA750 is an upgrade? I want something very natural with sub bass


 
  
 Really depends on what you're looking to improve on and what you're willing to give up. The MA750 has stronger, deeper bass than the SE215 and a nice, warm sound but it has a little less midrange prominence and a little more lower treble. The EPH-100 from Yamaha is another one priced similarly with fantastic subbass and warm overall sound.


----------



## PETEREK

Aww man, no TF10. I would like to see how they rank here.


----------



## Ardian

ljokerl said:


> Really depends on what you're looking to improve on and what you're willing to give up. The MA750 has stronger, deeper bass than the SE215 and a nice, warm sound but it has a little less midrange prominence and a little more lower treble. The EPH-100 from Yamaha is another one priced similarly with fantastic subbass and warm overall sound.



I need something more natural and detailed, like Martin Logan Mikros 90.. Per hapa the Mikros 70 could be the answer? Or something like RHA?

Thank you for the answer.


----------



## suman134

ardian said:


> I need something more natural and detailed, like Martin Logan Mikros 90.. Per hapa the Mikros 70 could be the answer? Or something like RHA?
> 
> Thank you for the answer.


 
  
       hmm , ety hf-5 .


----------



## ozkan

ardian said:


> I need something more natural and detailed, like Martin Logan Mikros 90.. Per hapa the Mikros 70 could be the answer? Or something like RHA?
> 
> Thank you for the answer.


 

  Depending on your budget, Etymotic HF5 or Er4s can be the answer.


----------



## Ardian

suman134 said:


> hmm , ety hf-5 .


 
  
  


ozkan said:


> Depending on your budget, Etymotic HF5 or Er4s can be the answer.


 
 Why Etymotic HF5? They look very beautiful and good quality build, but the sound? What's the main differences? They lack the bass like lot of people say or it's a problem of fit?
  
  
 P.S. my budget is 100€


----------



## ozkan

ardian said:


> Why Etymotic HF5? They look very beautiful and good quality build, but the sound? What's the main differences? They lack the bass like lot of people say or it's a problem of fit?
> 
> 
> P.S. my budget is 100€


 

 It is a problem fit. It is not bass-light by any means.


----------



## ljokerl

ardian said:


> I need something more natural and detailed, like Martin Logan Mikros 90.. Per hapa the Mikros 70 could be the answer? Or something like RHA?
> 
> Thank you for the answer.


 
  
 Not sure about the Martin Logan sets - haven't tried them. Bass-heavy earphones typically don't have the best detail, with some exceptions. Ultra-detailed sets like the Etys mentioned above won't have as much bass enhancement as a set of SE215s, never mind the MA750. Hybrid sets such as the Dunu DN-1000 can be the answer, but they're pricier.


----------



## xallarap

Would you recommend the JVC FXT90 for rock/metal? What other IEMs would you recommend under $100?


----------



## suman134

ardian said:


> Why Etymotic HF5? They look very beautiful and good quality build, but the sound? What's the main differences? They lack the bass like lot of people say or it's a problem of fit?
> 
> 
> P.S. my budget is 100€


 
  
       may be re-400 if fitting is a problem for you , boy is that phone ? it is indeed . but i liked hf5 too , yes low on bass , but details are going no where .


----------



## Airlight

So I have a question, hope it's not off topic.

 I have a set of Vsonic GR07 that I really really love, the review in this thread sealed the deal on those and I am really grateful for that.
  
 I am currently looking for a pair of over-ear headphones to complement the IEMs and give my poor ear canals the occasional break.
  
 I would describe the GR07 as very articulate throughout the frequency range. In particular I love how it reproduce and allow transients to really come through, aggressively so. They don't feel compressed or held back.
  
 Does anyone know of an over-ear headphone with a similar sound to the GR07s? Very dynamically articulate that can aggressively spit transients at you to the very top of the range, and a bit dry/fast, with a balanced overall FR (ie, not constantly bright-sounding, just able to reproduce bright drum peaks and such when called for? Preferably I would not want something that smooths the surface down and limits micro-articulation.
  
  
 Any tips from anyone would be very appreciated, hopefully others loving the GR07 might benefit from some similarly oriented full-sized cans aswell.


----------



## suman134

joker , what can be an upgrade to this hisound crystal .


----------



## kaixax555

airlight said:


> So I have a question, hope it's not off topic.
> 
> 
> I have a set of Vsonic GR07 that I really really love, the review in this thread sealed the deal on those and I am really grateful for that.
> ...




I listened to the GR07 many times, and I love the sound it produces. To me it sounds like a dynamic version of BA200 but with a slightly hotter treble and less forward mids. Balanced sounding with a bit of warmth and slightly hot (though mostly smooth) treble is the best way I can describe the GR07. I think a Sennheiser HD598 or HD600 should fit the bill pretty well


----------



## Airlight

Thanks for the reply!

 I've been looking at the HD600s and the Beyer DT880 since they seem quite ubiquitous. The HD600s really appeal to me with their detachable/replacable cables (along with seemingly every other component).


----------



## ljokerl

xallarap said:


> Would you recommend the JVC FXT90 for rock/metal? What other IEMs would you recommend under $100?


 
  
 I personally liked the FXT90 with my rock/metal library. There are lots of other options as well depending on what type of sound you like - the HiFiMan RE-400 for a more balanced/mid-centric sound, for example, or the VSonic VSD1S for something with punchy bass (but a bit less quantity than FXT90) and bright treble. 
  


airlight said:


> So I have a question, hope it's not off topic.
> 
> I have a set of Vsonic GR07 that I really really love, the review in this thread sealed the deal on those and I am really grateful for that.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I have limited experience with full-size cans but out of what I've heard the DT880/600 would seem to be the closest. I love the HD600 but it doesn't quite have that crisp and strong presence in the upper half of the frequency range that's at the core of the GR07's sound. 
  


suman134 said:


> joker , what can be an upgrade to this hisound crystal .


 
  
 Lots of things, depending on what's important to you - GR07 for bass quality and overall clarity, though it is brighter than the Crystal and the mids are a bit less forward. The TDK BA200 for smoothness and similar overall balance, though it gives up just a bit of bass impact to the Crystal. The Dunu DN-1000 or DN-2000 for more or both bass qty. and overall clarity. And so on.


----------



## Ardian

suman134 said:


> may be re-400 if fitting is a problem for you , boy is that phone ? it is indeed . but i liked hf5 too , yes low on bass , but details are going no where .


 
 The HF5 could be boring? I'm afraid that wouldn't be so engaging like the Shure SE215, or I'm wrong?


----------



## suman134

ardian said:


> The HF5 could be boring? I'm afraid that wouldn't be so engaging like the Shure SE215, or I'm wrong?


 
  
     it can be boring if bass thrills you , i think you said you want balance , and balanced ( pure balance , flat sq ) phones are low on bass hence can be boring . if you are after bass , rha-ma750 or eph-100 will do good . as you are not going over the price range , these are your options . re-400 too is low on bass , wont do bass like se215 . if you enjoy bass , go for ma750 or eph-100 .


----------



## ljokerl

(Finally) added the TDK BA200!
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2A32) TDK BA200*
> 
> 
> Reviewed April 2014
> ...


 

 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## ericr

Woot! Thanks Joker, for all your reviews and all your input & advice!!


----------



## ozkan

Joker, I'm waiting for your Audio Technica IM50 review. Just do it


----------



## jarrett

The BA200 are a superb set. Great tonal characteristics to complement the GR07.


----------



## kaixax555

Wow finally the review for the BA200 is out
So glad I made the purchase, it sounds superb to me

I listened to the GR07 a lot as well and I feel that it is like the dynamic version of the BA200, which I like


----------



## jant71

Nice BA200 review! Been keeping an eye on TDK as new stuff should be coming as most everything has been discontinued. Hoping for a triple driver or triple hybrid from them.


----------



## SebsG

Recommendations for a p.m.p.? Under $50 
And any recommended EQ's for IOS?


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> Recommendations for a p.m.p.? Under $50
> And any recommended EQ's for IOS?


 
 sansa clip zip .


----------



## KimbaWLion

ljokerl said:


> It really depends on what type of improvement you're after. The W40 and CT-200 have some advantages over the BA200 but they also make some concessions. Foe example, the BA200 has more accurate and extended bass than both of those. Diminishing returns are in play here - the difference between the AM-800 and BA200 is indeed larger.


 




  
*ljokerl:* Actually, I got the Astrotec AM-800s for my daughter's bf based off your review and the fact he only had $50 TOPS to spend, he was VERY pleased too! I got to hear them a lot and when the TDK BA-200s went on sale for the aforementioned $120 I snapped them up. That why I was able to reference them as to how large the difference is.


  
 As we all know, you especially, given ALL the IEMs etc. you have listened to, I have a question that will be your opinion, but many here value that opinion QUITE highly besides myself.
 I am an all around listener, from listening to TV shows, Classical, Progressive Rock, to even J-Pop because of all the anime I watch. I love CLEAR mids with solid bass that does NOT overwhelm me, I like it tight vs being a basshead. I like my musical instruments clear with being able to picture the sound stage. If you have ever heard Annie Haslam of Renaissance sing you know what kind of female singer I like to listen too.
 So for the 1 Million $$$ question, I am starting my savings fund for my next set of IEMS, what would be the lowest price of admission be for an IEM that does NOT make a compromise in the sound to be better than what I own. That will give me better bass, mids, highs, & a better sound stage etc. It does NOT have to be best, JUST better than what I have, with NO concessions as you put it.


  
 Yes, I know I can spend 1K+ on Custom IEMs etc. or even non custom ones, but I would rather not and to be honest, probably will never be able too! Is there anything say in the $500-$600 range? OR a little less or more?
 I know its a hard thing for you to answer as you can not really get into my head etc. BUT you have listened to so many IEMs, both universal AND custom that I totally trust you to be able to tell it to me like it is! I have bought my 2 sets of IEMs based what you have written and the price I was able to get them for and been totally happy. This will be a big deal for me given my up coming bills and life issues but save I shall and if takes me longer to get what I want, it's a goal to work for. I am hoping others will be interested too! I can't be the only one like this!  It's just so hard to pick and choose and there is no way for me to listen to them all so I am going to bet on you! No pressure here since I am fully aware its just your opinion, I just trust it implicitly! AND IF it has to be custom IEMS to get me there, from what I have read, I think the silicone ones are more comfortable, does that ring true?


  
*Thanks again for all your help, it has already saved me a LOT of grief with my choices! *


----------



## gadiletta

Hello at the moment, can you suggest best in ear below 70$ with very good bass to listen to commercial music?
 I have to replace my sennheiser cx 300, and if it's possible I would like to find it on amazon eu.
  
 Than you so much!


----------



## meat01

Thanks Joker!

Shouldn't the title of this thread say p. 915?


----------



## suman134

gadiletta said:


> Hello at the moment, can you suggest best in ear below 70$ with very good bass to listen to commercial music?
> I have to replace my sennheiser cx 300, and if it's possible I would like to find it on amazon eu.
> 
> Than you so much!


 
  
     denon ah-c300 .


----------



## ookic

sebsg said:


> Recommendations for a p.m.p.? Under $50
> And any recommended EQ's for IOS?


 

 Clip + and Clip Zip will always be the best at their price range, i prefer + as i have no need for photos but for those who do that's what the zip is for. Steer clear from the sport.
  
 For my EQ I use this thing i found on tumblr:


 probably not for audiophiles, but i think it's very fun-sounding!


----------



## Grayson73

You guys need to try Zero Audio Tenore, Ostry KC06 and KC06A.  At around $50-60, not expensive to try.  Be advised that they may jump many more expensive IEMs in Joker's list though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.  My guess is that they'd get > 9.0 for sound.


----------



## gadiletta

suman134 said:


> denon ah-c300 .


 

 It's more than 120$ on amazon eu, any alternatives?
 What about dunu trident?


----------



## gadiletta

gadiletta said:


> It's more than 120$ on amazon eu, any alternatives?
> What about dunu trident?
> I need in ear max 70/80$, good bass for iphone and with microphone.


----------



## SebsG

They aren't really bass heavy, but I listen to electronic music (all sub genres: house, dubstep, trap, hard style, etc.) and my UE600's are great for that IMO.


----------



## airomjosh

sebsg said:


> They aren't really bass heavy, but I listen to electronic music (all sub genres: house, dubstep, trap, hard style, etc.) and my UE600's are great for that IMO.


 
 If you can get the Don Scorpio Bass Colours ( an OEM of Velodyne Pulse), I think, they will satisfy you. They are only 35USD at ebay.


----------



## esteebin

airomjosh said:


> If you can get the Don Scorpio Bass Colours ( an OEM of Velodyne Pulse), I think, they will satisfy you. They are only 35USD at ebay.


 

http://slickdeals.net/permadeal/121252/velodyne---velodyne-headphone-sale-vbold-bluetooth-109-vquiet-nc-109-vpulse-in-ear
  
 vPulse currently $30 in the velodyne site by following a few steps (registering for newsletter for vPoints and code MAYVPULSE). Certain states will tax and it will be on the full price. So total with free (slow) shipping will be around $37-38.


----------



## cel4145

airomjosh said:


> If you can get the Don Scorpio Bass Colours ( an OEM of Velodyne Pulse), I think, they will satisfy you. They are only 35USD at ebay.




I will second the Bass Colours. 

My understanding is that bigbargainonline on ebay is Penon Audio, so there is also the option to order direct from their website


----------



## suman134

gadiletta said:


> It's more than 120$ on amazon eu, any alternatives?
> What about dunu trident?


 
           brainwavz m5 , meelec m duos , and hisound crystal .


----------



## ljokerl

ericr said:


> Woot! Thanks Joker, for all your reviews and all your input & advice!!


 
  
 Thank you for you support (and TDK BA200 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




) 
  


ozkan said:


> Joker, I'm waiting for your Audio Technica IM50 review. Just do it


 
  
 That darn CKX5iS is still in the way (queue). 
  


jant71 said:


> Nice BA200 review! Been keeping an eye on TDK as new stuff should be coming as most everything has been discontinued. Hoping for a triple driver or triple hybrid from them.


 
  
 That or they didn't find the sales of the current lineup (prior to the clearances) to meet expectations and gave up on the higher-end in-ear market. Hopefully that's not the case.
  
  


kimbawlion said:


> *ljokerl:* Actually, I got the Astrotec AM-800s for my daughter's bf based off your review and the fact he only had $50 TOPS to spend, he was VERY pleased too! I got to hear them a lot and when the TDK BA-200s went on sale for the aforementioned $120 I snapped them up. That why I was able to reference them as to how large the difference is.
> 
> As we all know, you especially, given ALL the IEMs etc. you have listened to, I have a question that will be your opinion, but many here value that opinion QUITE highly besides myself.
> I am an all around listener, from listening to TV shows, Classical, Progressive Rock, to even J-Pop because of all the anime I watch. I love CLEAR mids with solid bass that does NOT overwhelm me, I like it tight vs being a basshead. I like my musical instruments clear with being able to picture the sound stage. If you have ever heard Annie Haslam of Renaissance sing you know what kind of female singer I like to listen too.
> ...


 
  
 Honestly, nothing comes to mind in terms of an upgrade from the BA200 in every area of consequence with no absolutely concessions in the sub-$700 range. See, for example, the comparison to the Sony MDR-7550 in the BA200 review - I expected the 7550 to come out on top but really, each has some pros and cons. The same went for the more high-end universals I compared to the BA200 to - the Westone 40, for example, and the StageDiver SD-2.
  
 That's not to say it isn't out there - there might even be a few potential winners in my current queue - the Lear LUF-4F, for example, or the Perfect Seal SportBuds - but right now I can't confidently say either of them is it. 
  
  
  


gadiletta said:


> Hello at the moment, can you suggest best in ear below 70$ with very good bass to listen to commercial music?
> I have to replace my sennheiser cx 300, and if it's possible I would like to find it on amazon eu.
> 
> Than you so much!


 
  
 RHA MA350, Dunu DN-23, Audio-Technica ATH-CKM500 , Beyer DTX101 or DTX102. All have plenty of bass, though they all sound different from each other. DN-23 and the Beyers are closest to your CX300 in sound signature. At least a few should be available from your local amazon. 
  


meat01 said:


> Thanks Joker!
> 
> Shouldn't the title of this thread say p. 915?


 
  
 Whoops. Fixed page number.


----------



## Bola 7

ljokerl,

I don´t know if you´ll understand me, but I´ll try: There´s a common feature  that I hear in most BA earphone: a slightly plasticky character in the mids. For example, the TF10 has this character, but the SM3 doesn't have so much.

I would like to know: has the JH13 Freqphase this  characteristic?

Thank you very much!


----------



## ljokerl

bola 7 said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> I don´t know if you´ll understand me, but I´ll try: There´s a common feature  that I hear in most BA earphone: a slightly plasticky character in the mids. For example, the TF10 has this character, but the SM3 doesn't have so much.
> 
> ...


 
  
 There's quite a few differences between the mids of the TF10 and those of the SM3, but the JH13 sounds more similar to the former than the latter to my ears. They were tuned by the same person, after all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. If you want thick and lush mids, the JH13 just isn't it.


----------



## Bola 7

ljokerl,
  
 I think my comparison wasn't very good. It isn't a matter about sound signature, but it´s about characteristic of most BA earphones. The ATH-CK10 and Westone 4 have this a slightly plasticky character in the mids, but the GR07 and EX1000, like all dynamic IEM that I heard, don´t have that.

 My friend has the JH Roxanne. He told me that Roxanne is unique BA earphone that doesn´t have this a slightly plasticky character in the mids.

 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

bola 7 said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> I think my comparison wasn't very good. It isn't a matter about sound signature, but it´s about characteristic of most BA earphones. The ATH-CK10 and Westone 4 have this a slightly plasticky character in the mids, but the GR07 and EX1000, like all dynamic IEM that I heard, don´t have that.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I didn't mean the sound signature either - I meant the character of the mids specifically. If you're looking for something that sounds more like a dynamic driver or SM3, the JH13 isn't it.


----------



## KimbaWLion

> Honestly, nothing comes to mind in terms of an upgrade from the BA200 in every area of consequence with no absolutely concessions in the sub-$700 range. See, for example, the comparison to the Sony MDR-7550 in the BA200 review - I expected the 7550 to come out on top but really, each has some pros and cons. The same went for the more high-end universals I compared to the BA200 to - the Westone 40, for example, and the StageDiver SD-2.
> 
> 
> That's not to say it isn't out there - there might even be a few potential winners in my current queue - the Lear LUF-4F, for example, or the Perfect Seal SportBuds - but right now I can't confidently say either of them is it.


 
 Boy* ljokerl*,
  
 Your scaring me here... I spent a $120 and to get something TRULY better with no compromises its going to have to go NORTH of $700!  WOW...
 I was looking that Audioearz after I read you review of the 5x and 8x and it seems either the 6x or 7x may do the trick and I can always upgrade later to the 8x, its the customer service from them that has me intrigued and THAT means
 almost as much the IEMs themselves since things DO happen... 
 It at least gives me something to shoot for under $650-$800 and is made in America for easy refits and upgrades.
 Unless you have a better suggestion? Something in Silicon for comfort and isolation? Argh too much thinking here! 
  
 I like the Heir line up from your reviews but its just not a convenient to make corrections to etc. because of their locations.
 Oh well in your next batch as you said but Audioearz for now seems to be on the short list I think after reading, unless you can suggest better.
 The good thing is I have some time...


----------



## Cotnijoe

If youre interested in heir why not look at noble audio then?


----------



## KimbaWLion

cotnijoe said:


> If youre interested in heir why not look at noble audio then?


 

 Forgot about them to be honest given I was looking at a variety of things.This is because I tend to be price driven more than I should be be given the Dreamearz gets a lot of driver
 per $$$$, has an upgrade program etc. *ljokerl* gave them a pretty good review. You can buy a Custom Aud 6x for $665 vs the Noble Custom 4s for $999. Now Noble's NON custom IEMS seem to come in at much better pricing. Since *ljokerl* has heard both
 I wonder which he would favor the Custom Aud or the standard Noble...


----------



## kova4a

kimbawlion said:


> Forgot about them to be honest given I was looking at a variety of things.This is because I tend to be price driven more than I should be be given the Dreamearz gets a lot of driver
> per $$$$, has an upgrade program etc. *ljokerl* gave them a pretty good review. You can buy a Custom Aud 6x for $665 vs the Noble Custom 4s for $999. Now Noble's NON custom IEMS seem to come in at much better pricing. Since *ljokerl* has heard both
> I wonder which he would favor the Custom Aud or the standard Noble...


 
 Well, you can also go for an acrylic Noble ciem unless you're really set on getting a silicone one. Silicone ciems still have their limitations and a noble 4c will cost you $300 less


----------



## KimbaWLion

All these choices... Let's say I have ALL my pennies saved or I am a little bit away maybe a month or 2 maybe 3 at the most...
 As I looked at *ljokerl's* list, the Heir 8.a CIEM is at near the top of the list.
 Heir makes an IEM 5.0 5 driver for $599 that is SUPPOSE to  be very similar to their CIEM 8. Make you wonder how it truly sounds vs. the CIEM
 The Noble 4C is $699 as was pointed out.
 The Dreamearz Aud 6x CIEM is $665.




  
 There some others out there but for a start that is not a bad list to work from. As I want something to really beat out the BA-200s in all aspects.
*ljokerl *said you need to go NORTH of $700 to get such sound. I really don't want to go nuts but it is so hard buying something that you really have no way to hear first, that is as stated I know where I put my faith.
 Unless something is really super that I am missing in that price range, my guess it will be one of those 3, unless something is pointed out...
 I really can not find it in myself to spend more around that $700 and less is ALWAYS good and the Heir 5.0 MAY be the best compromise even though I am hesitant should something go wrong...


----------



## ljokerl

kimbawlion said:


> Boy* ljokerl*,
> 
> Your scaring me here... I spent a $120 and to get something TRULY better with no compromises its going to have to go NORTH of $700!  WOW...
> I was looking that Audioearz after I read you review of the 5x and 8x and it seems either the 6x or 7x may do the trick and I can always upgrade later to the 8x, its the customer service from them that has me intrigued and THAT means
> ...


 
  
 I should clarify that by no compromises I mean not even potential ones. For example, the 1964EARS V6-Stage is one of my favorite custom monitors with almost no notable weaknesses. However, its tuning is less bassy than that of the TDK BA200, so it might seem like the bass quantity is a compromise in comparison. It also has slightly more peaky treble - again, some people might even like that better, but compared to the BA200 it can be perceived as being a little less smooth. For me the V6-Stage is definitely an upgrade to the BA200 and I enjoy it significantly more, but even I can't say it's an all-around upgrade. 
  
 And, I have not reviewed any AudioEarz - you're probably thinking of average_joe's reviews.


----------



## evanatch

ljokerl,

I'm trying to decide on a CIEM as an upgrade to my Brainwavz B2 (or DBA-02 that you've reviewed, as it's essentially the same thing). I'd like something with a similar signature, but with a bit more authority in the lower register. I probably can't spend the money for a TOTL like the JH13, so I'm thinking something from 1964 - probably either the V6 or the V6S. How would you compare the V6S's signature to that of the B2? I'm worried about your reports of sibilance, as I've been using Comply tips with my B2 to slightly warm it up. I'm thinking the V6 might be a better option, as it's reported to have a smoother treble and more balanced signature overall. I'm curious to hear your thoughts on the V6S vs. the B2/DBA-02, though.

Thanks!


----------



## justgotlucky123

does anybody here knows how the dunu dn900 vs ostry kc06a vs t-peos h-100 compares ?


----------



## 1clearhead

Hello Joker,
  
 I know the Xiaomi Pistons are in your list to be reviewed at a later time and date. Hopefully, you could try ordering the *"IF Edition"* Pistons. This is basically a whole package -carry pouch, shirt clip, and a better single flange (tip) compared to the earlier versions.
  
 But, while you're waiting on that, hopefully this would be a surprise for you! I manage to pick-up 2 more "Original Pistons (H01)," or some may say 1.0 Pistons from a certified vendor here in China. These are the original silver pistons!
  
 If it's OK with you, I would like to *send you one* for your review board. By now, the first one's are extremely hard to come by. Since last year, xiaomi stop making these models. But, there's still plenty of old stock here in China!
  
 Difference between the old and new version:
  
 1. Old: Closed back                  New: Open back (ported)
  
 2. Old: Color -Silver                  New: Color -2.0, 2.1, Copper * /  *IF Version, Gold (or Silver on some)
  
 3. Old: Copper Diaphragm        New: Beryllium Diaphragm
  
 4. Old: Balanced (clear)            New: Full-bodied, very clear and airy
  
 This could be subjective.
  
 -Hopefully you could be the one to give us a better review.
  
 So, let me know if you're interested and I'll send you one, free-of-charge! Yup! Yours to keep!
  
 Ps. I don't work for them, I just love a good bargain when I see one. And thought you might want to add these to your collection, since I realizing you don't carry these on your list.
  
 -Hope your interested.


----------



## KimbaWLion

ljokerl said:


> I should clarify that by no compromises I mean not even potential ones. For example, the 1964EARS V6-Stage is one of my favorite custom monitors with almost no notable weaknesses. However, its tuning is less bassy than that of the TDK BA200, so it might seem like the bass quantity is a compromise in comparison. It also has slightly more peaky treble - again, some people might even like that better, but compared to the BA200 it can be perceived as being a little less smooth. For me the V6-Stage is definitely an upgrade to the BA200 and I enjoy it significantly more, but even I can't say it's an all-around upgrade.
> 
> 
> 
> And, I have not reviewed any AudioEarz - you're probably thinking of average_joe's reviews.


 

 I just went to the page before on the Noble 4S review and then to the AudioEarz review and carelessly did not notice the name change at the top. The last several reviews I had read were by you.
 I apologize for that error. Once I get involved reading and searching I get kind of involved and made the assumption without double checking.


  
 What makes it hard is funding is limited, most know how it is right? Daughter in college, medical bills, higher car insurance etc. etc.  I know or assume a lot of people are in the same boat.
 At least for me it has has now come to bang for the buck that has some of the wow factor given everything read hear recently. I had in my head from $120 for the BA-200s to $700 or less would get me there originally.
 As I found out very quickly from the experts here that I trust, that is JUST not going to be the case for all instances given my price range.


  
 I already have awesome full sized cans but I am out about a lot more and using them outside the house is just not going to happen for me.
 Some final thoughts and questions that of course have opinions but that is what makes this place, which is awesome!


  
 1. I am better of with a lower priced but more advanced IEM vs. a CIEM? The reason why I ask this is if you go to the Noble Audio page
     The Noble 5 is $650 if I go custom its becomes the 4C. The same thing goes with Heir who I initially eliminated for custom do my bad luck with
     things and sending back and forth to China just is not my thing because of that. I mean I can always pay to reshell with custom later right? Or do I give
     up too much buy not going custom. This is going to be my last pair for a very long time!


  
 2. Now it is really opinion time and I am driving myself nuts, call it a talent as I over think everything as I want the best for $$$, just like everybody else, JUST so many good things!
    Once I have question #1 resolved I can then make the choice of what to get. To be honest I had considered 1964ears awhile ago but just forgot as I was looking
    at other IEMs. So many to chose from and with *ljokerl *giving the thumbs up I can assured I will be happy. But I can now as the question directly. From reading here etc.
    it looks like it should come down to the 1964 v6 stage or maybe the Noble 4C given how neutral and balanced I have read it to be or even possible the Noble 5 standard IEM.
    Bass is NOT the be all in my world it has to be there and a I have to hear it tight and accurate and NOT overwhelming...


  
 As usual thanks for all the help and hopefully I can put this to bed and stop with all the questions!


----------



## ThickT

ljokerl,

 I am currently Looking for a balanced armature set of IEM's. I don't currently own any in my collection so I'm looking for one that is a perfect example of the BA implementation. 

My budget is 175 dollars. Right now I've been researching the xba 20 & 30, audeo pfe 132, and the TDK ba200. My preferred sound Sig is one that is relatively neutral with a bit of bass/mid-bass emphasis. 

Can you compare and contrast the ba200 and the pfe? Might you be able to reccomend me a proper BA set that will play nice with my all dynamic family??

*Edit* I'm not looking for a BA that sounds like a dynamic, just tend to dislike thin sounding sets. I just need the slightest coloration of fun sound. Thanks alot!


----------



## jant71

thickt said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> I am currently Looking for a balanced armature set of IEM's. I don't currently own any in my collection so I'm looking for one that is a perfect example of the BA implementation.
> 
> ...


 
 Check/read up on the Zero Audio Doppio. Should fit the bill nicely. Singolo possibly as well since they seem to be a fun sound.


----------



## Marleybob217

I'm looking forward to the hifiman RE-600 review!


----------



## ljokerl

evanatch said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> I'm trying to decide on a CIEM as an upgrade to my Brainwavz B2 (or DBA-02 that you've reviewed, as it's essentially the same thing). I'd like something with a similar signature, but with a bit more authority in the lower register. I probably can't spend the money for a TOTL like the JH13, so I'm thinking something from 1964 - probably either the V6 or the V6S. How would you compare the V6S's signature to that of the B2? I'm worried about your reports of sibilance, as I've been using Comply tips with my B2 to slightly warm it up. I'm thinking the V6 might be a better option, as it's reported to have a smoother treble and more balanced signature overall. I'm curious to hear your thoughts on the V6S vs. the B2/DBA-02, though.
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 I haven't tried the V6 but the V6-Stage would do it. The sibilance is very minor - it's really not any less forgiving than the B2/DBA-02 (with silicone tips, not Comply). I was comparing it to sets like the Miracle, JH13, etc. in the review. It already has a little more bass impact than the B2 - if the V6 is any bassier than that, might be too much of a step away from the accurate sound of the B2.
  


justgotlucky123 said:


> does anybody here knows how the dunu dn900 vs ostry kc06a vs t-peos h-100 compares ?


 
  
 I'm not a fan of the DN-900 - too muffled in the midrange. The H-100 has a very peculiar signature - bright and somewhat thin, but also with solid bass that has excellent depth. You might also consider the newer (and more inexpensive) Astrotec AX-35 if you're looking at hybrids: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/astrotec-ax-35/ . Haven't tried the KC06a.
  


1clearhead said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> I know the Xiaomi Pistons are in your list to be reviewed at a later time and date. Hopefully, you could try ordering the *"IF Edition"* Pistons. This is basically a whole package -carry pouch, shirt clip, and a better single flange (tip) compared to the earlier versions.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Happily, someone has already sent a Pistons over my way. It hasn't arrived yet but I believe it's a 2.0. I think it'll do for now as far as a review goes, but I really appreciate the info and of course the offer.
  
 Just curious, was the 1.0 discontinued when the new version came out or are they coexisting?
  


kimbawlion said:


> 1. I am better of with a lower priced but more advanced IEM vs. a CIEM? The reason why I ask this is if you go to the Noble Audio page
> The Noble 5 is $650 if I go custom its becomes the 4C. The same thing goes with Heir who I initially eliminated for custom do my bad luck with
> things and sending back and forth to China just is not my thing because of that. I mean I can always pay to reshell with custom later right? Or do I give
> up too much buy not going custom. This is going to be my last pair for a very long time!


 
  
 It's best not to generalize here and just take it on a case by case basis. I actually like my Noble 4S better than the similarly-priced Noble 6. See here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-noble-6-dunu-dn-2000-nuforce-t-peos-ear-earphones/
  


thickt said:


> ljokerl,
> 
> I am currently Looking for a balanced armature set of IEM's. I don't currently own any in my collection so I'm looking for one that is a perfect example of the BA implementation.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I would go for the BA200, if you can find one. It's the least cold/bright-sounding of those (except the XBA-20, which I haven't tried) and it has that little bit of coloration you seem to be after. The PFE132, aside from being discontinued as far as I know, is also more analytical.
  
  


marleybob217 said:


> I'm looking forward to the hifiman RE-600 review!


 

 I wrote one here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors


----------



## Marleybob217

ljokerl said:


> I wrote one here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors


 
 Thanks, I've read that one a while back now. Didn't know it was you 
  
 I was also wondering how you would rate their SQ. Since you gave the RE-400 a generous 9!


----------



## ljokerl

marleybob217 said:


> Thanks, I've read that one a while back now. Didn't know it was you
> 
> I was also wondering how you would rate their SQ. Since you gave the RE-400 a generous 9!


 
  
 Since they are so similar in SQ, no more than a 9.1 or 9.2.


----------



## 1clearhead

*Your reply

*Joker

Happily, someone has already sent a Pistons over my way. It hasn't arrived yet but I believe it's a 2.0. I think it'll do for now as far as a review goes, but I really appreciate the info and of course the offer.

Just curious, was the 1.0 discontinued when the new version came out or are they coexisting?


From me: -1clearhead

Just a reminder.....the tips on the "IF Edition" seals extremely well compared to the 2.0, and 2.1. .....just giving you a heads-up.

Actually, the 1.0 was the first "silver" pistons that gain popularity in China for their "well balanced and clear sound" and was catching on quick to other countries. And just as the hype started on the silver pistons the company decided to launch the 2.0 pistons (copper color pistons). With the beryllium diaphragms, the copper pistons provided a full-bodied and very clear sound that rivaled full-size headphones. So, I guess, the copper pistons was selling twice as fast for that matter and the company decided to retire the silver pistons last year. But, I'm still able to pick up the old stock from a certified vendor for xiaomi here in China. And they still are an incredible gem in sound and price!

So, if you're interested you will definitely have a rare opportunity to have these for free. You might find them interesting and decide to keep them in your collection. Nothing in return!

Besides you helped so many shoppers here. I think it's most appreciated and you deserve something in return.

Let me know....nothing to it! It's all good!


----------



## ljokerl

I'd be happy to try them, if only to A:B with the newer version and see where they fall in the grand scheme of things for SQ.


----------



## Marleybob217

ljokerl said:


> Since they are so similar in SQ, no more than a 9.1 or 9.2.


 
 Interesting, I should receive the RE-600 in the next couple of days.
  
 I also own the TDK BA200, am curious to see how these perform against each other as these have similar SQ ratings.


----------



## 1clearhead

ljokerl said:


> I'd be happy to try them, if only to A:B with the newer version and see where they fall in the grand scheme of things for SQ.


 
 Great! I'll gladly send them out sometime this week. I'll contact you before hand.


----------



## Ap616

Hey Joker,
  
 What would be a handful of iems that have a nearly identical sound signature to the Philips SHE-3580/90s up to $150 at different price points? With better detail and clarity, soundstage, separation, imaging, etc...
 I know it is V-shaped in general and this must seem like an odd question, but I was curious what you perceived as similar iems in all your extensive testing. Would iems such as the VSD1S, AM-800, AX-35, or HA-FXT90 be a super close sig but all around better?
  
 Thanks,
 Alex


----------



## ThickT

Would an audeo pfe 132 still sound analytical, but warm up good with a fiio e11 bass boost?


----------



## ljokerl

1clearhead said:


> Great! I'll gladly send them out sometime this week. I'll contact you before hand.


 
  
 Thanks, much appreciated 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


ap616 said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> What would be a handful of iems that have a nearly identical sound signature to the Philips SHE-3580/90s up to $150 at different price points? With better detail and clarity, soundstage, separation, imaging, etc...
> I know it is V-shaped in general and this must seem like an odd question, but I was curious what you perceived as similar iems in all your extensive testing. Would iems such as the VSD1S, AM-800, AX-35, or HA-FXT90 be a super close sig but all around better?
> ...


 
  
 As discussed over the past few pages, it's very hard to find an earphone that is all around better than another (as long as the starting point is a good performer, of course) - there are almost always some potential compromises to be made. The VSD1S, for example, is more sibilance-prone than the SHE3580, even though I still consider it an upgrade overall - better clarity, tighter bass, wider soundstage, etc. The AM-800 is substantially brighter than the SHE3850 and has noticeably less bass. The AX35 is also brighter and has less deep bass. The FXT90 is more mid-bassy. Out of these I would consider the FXT90 and VSD1S to be the best upgrades in terms of value for money. 
  


thickt said:


> Would an audeo pfe 132 still sound analytical, but warm up good with a fiio e11 bass boost?


 
  
 You'd have to ask someone who owns an E11 and a 132.


----------



## addsfsds

I don't own the E11 but i have the PFEs paired with my X5 and they sounds just great, still love them so much even after 4 years  But bass (with black filters) isn't their strength point as they are more analytical


----------



## ThickT

Yeah I do realize that they are analyitical. Just wondered if given a bass boost, would they warm up just a hair.


----------



## ozkan

thickt said:


> Yeah I do realize that they are analyitical. Just wondered if given a bass boost, would they warm up just a hair.


 
  
 Pfe has better bass than Logitech UE600 and extends more to sub-bass region. They will warm up if you pair them with a warm amp like C&C Bh2 or E12. Just keep in mind that PFEs need an amp to shine.


----------



## ThickT

Thank you ozkan. I've got an e11. Its rather warm so I assume I will be pleased.


----------



## thug behram

The foam tips that come with the DUNU DN-1000.. Are those Comply ones or their own brand? If they are complys, which model are they? If they aren't, what's the closest aftermarket tips that can be purchased.. and are they as good?

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## ljokerl

thug behram said:


> The foam tips that come with the DUNU DN-1000.. Are those Comply ones or their own brand? If they are complys, which model are they? If they aren't, what's the closest aftermarket tips that can be purchased.. and are they as good?
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


 
  
 They're not "real" Complys as far as I can tell. However, my Comply T400s fit on them fine. T500s might fit as a well - don't have any right now to test. I prefer Comply tips to the stock Dunu foamies. The Audio-Technica heat-activated foam tips also fit very well but are expensive at about $3/pair.


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hey joker, have you tried the t-peos h-100J ? How does it compare with t-peos h-100 ? And there is a new h-100 II ? Are the h-100 and h-100 II the same in sound?


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> As discussed over the past few pages, it's very hard to find an earphone that is all around better than another (as long as the starting point is a good performer, of course) - there are almost always some potential compromises to be made. The VSD1S, for example, is more sibilance-prone than the SHE3580, even though I still consider it an upgrade overall - better clarity, tighter bass, wider soundstage, etc. The AM-800 is substantially brighter than the SHE3850 and has noticeably less bass. The AX35 is also brighter and has less deep bass. The FXT90 is more mid-bassy. Out of these I would consider the FXT90 and VSD1S to be the best upgrades in terms of value for money.


 
 Wich tips do you guys recomend to improve the confort/fit/sound/isolation (the least important since the stock ones isolation is not that bad) for the philips she3580/90??
  
 To be honest i dont like the stock tips from the philips.... they are a bit too squishy, flabby(???)... since i bought the philips a year ago i have been using them with the tips from my brainwavz m5 (wich i hate... at least the tips are usefull.... XD ) but unfortunately i lost one of them recently (i use the medium size).....
  
 Any suggestions for good and also if possible cheap tips for the philips?
  
 Cheers.....


----------



## H20Fidelity

pedro oliveira said:


> Wich tips do you guys recomend to improve the confort/fit/sound/isolation (the least important since the stock ones isolation is not that bad) for the philips she3580/90??
> 
> To be honest i dont like the stock tips from the philips.... they are a bit too squishy, flabby(???)... since i bought the philips a year ago i have been using them with the tips from my brainwavz m5 (wich i hate... at least the tips are usefull.... XD ) but unfortunately i lost one of them recently (i use the medium size).....
> 
> ...


 


 I remember the stock tips on those Phillips SHE3580 they had terribly thin walls.

 I used to use these......

 http://shop.ebay.com.au/15shopgoods/m.html?_nkw=EP-Ex10A&_sacat=0&_trksid=p3911.m270.l1313&_sop=1&_odkw=&_osacat=0

 Until I left them at the dentist and someone stole them along with a Rockboxed Clip+ & 32GB card.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

h20fidelity said:


> I remember the stock tips on those Phillips SHE3580 they had terribly thin walls.
> 
> I used to use these......
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks m8.....they seem to be exactly what i want.... but unfortunatelly it seems they do not ship those to Portugal.... ;(
  
 Any other alternatives?


----------



## Ap616

Thanks for the reply Joker! I know I have said it before, but I appreciate all your hard work; also, I always enjoy reading your well-put-together reviews and the organization with the number ratings. Such a great help to the community!
  
 I agree that all iem's have their pros and cons, with give and take involved. Each being unique and good at some things(hopefully). I was wondering if they are any higher-end iems around $200 and below that remind you of the SHE3590s.
  
 Another question... and maybe a little loaded! I really like Dubstep, Electronic, and the like mostly, as well as Rock & Metal, Alternative, female vocals, and piano for a bit of background. How do the JVC HA-FXD80 and T-Peos H-100 compare to/differ from each other(are they fairly similar?) and those to the MA750, HA-FXT90, and DN-1000? In signature, degree of coolness or warmth, level of details/clarity/resolution, and separation & spaciousness specifically. Thanks again!


----------



## ljokerl

justgotlucky123 said:


> Hey joker, have you tried the t-peos h-100J ? How does it compare with t-peos h-100 ? And there is a new h-100 II ? Are the h-100 and h-100 II the same in sound?


 
  
 To be honest I didn't even know there were other versions. I've only tried the original H-100
  


pedro oliveira said:


> Wich tips do you guys recomend to improve the confort/fit/sound/isolation (the least important since the stock ones isolation is not that bad) for the philips she3580/90??
> 
> To be honest i dont like the stock tips from the philips.... they are a bit too squishy, flabby(???)... since i bought the philips a year ago i have been using them with the tips from my brainwavz m5 (wich i hate... at least the tips are usefull.... XD ) but unfortunately i lost one of them recently (i use the medium size).....
> 
> ...


 
  
 I use the single-flange tips from the MEElec M6. They're similar to the Philips tips in terms of sizing but they give me a better seal. The M6 double-flanges also work pretty well - I would suggest trying both if you can. 
  


ap616 said:


> Thanks for the reply Joker! I know I have said it before, but I appreciate all your hard work; also, I always enjoy reading your well-put-together reviews and the organization with the number ratings. Such a great help to the community!
> 
> I agree that all iem's have their pros and cons, with give and take involved. Each being unique and good at some things(hopefully). I was wondering if they are any higher-end iems around $200 and below that remind you of the SHE3590s.
> 
> Another question... and maybe a little loaded! I really like Dubstep, Electronic, and the like mostly, as well as Rock & Metal, Alternative, female vocals, and piano for a bit of background. How do the JVC HA-FXD80 and T-Peos H-100 compare to/differ from each other(are they fairly similar?) and those to the MA750, HA-FXT90, and DN-1000? In signature, degree of coolness or warmth, level of details/clarity/resolution, and separation & spaciousness specifically. Thanks again!


 
  
 Not loaded... just very long. It's much easier if you tell me what type of sound you're after in more detail than have me compare and contrast five different earphones in like 7 different categories. The DN-1000 would be my pick from those, if you can afford it. Sounds great with EDM while maintaining sufficient clarity and control for everything else.


----------



## Ap616

pedro oliveira said:


> Thanks m8.....they seem to be exactly what i want.... but unfortunatelly it seems they do not ship those to Portugal.... ;(
> 
> Any other alternatives?


 
  
 I just recently switched to Sony Hybrids, which is what the eBay link from H20Fidelity was to I believe. They work well with the 3580/90s for me. A little change in sound notable to me, a little more controlled I think, but not much in my opinion(I don't have a good nor experienced listening ear for evaluating sound though lol). They are even more comfortable, but have a little shallower fit for me while still good.
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-EPEX10A-BLK-Replacement-Earbuds/dp/B001RB24UA


----------



## suman134

should i pick the ue900 or the dunu dn1000 for the same price ? and to my indian folks , ue 900 is going for inr 12999 on snapdeal.com .


----------



## Ap616

I figured it was too long a Q. My bad. I have a some factual knowledge, but little to no experience.
 That's the question for me, do I "want to" afford it and would something else suit me more for my personal preference of which I'm not entirely sure. What would be second and third to the Dunus for EDM or my described sound below(I tried to do what I could... lol) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I'm not 100% sure exactly. Hopefully I can describe it without sounding oxymoronic, lol.
  
 I want a V-shaped signature with quite a bit of sub-bass impact and quantity, but not overly so, that is extended and textured. Not sure about how I like the mids. Treble that has some sparkle, but is not peaky or sibilant or too harsh as I am sensitive to treble. I want it to sound a little cool in tone if that will help reveal details and promote overall clarity. Fairly fun, but accurate enough it can reveal poor recordings. Great separation and an airy, out-of-the-head presentation would be nice.
 I might be tugging on both sides of the spectrum a bit, hopefully not much though.


----------



## H20Fidelity

pedro oliveira said:


> Thanks m8.....they seem to be exactly what i want.... but unfortunatelly it seems they do not ship those to Portugal.... ;(
> 
> Any other alternatives?


 


 Have a look here, see what you can find: http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR11.TRC1.A0.H0.Xear+tips&_nkw=ear+tips&_sacat=0&_from=R40


----------



## yoyowiggle

ljokerl (Mr. Joker Sir!)
  
 Thank you so much for all you have put into this. I think I personally have referred to it over a thousand times minimum.
  
 I purchased the RHA ma750i a while back and love it due to the fact it is built like a tank and works very well. The bass/sub bass is very amazing for an IEM. However, I am noticing that the midrange seems to be a overshadowed/recessed and not as clear as it could be. Seems warm/dark sometimes to me. 
  
 I was wondering if there is an IEM that has the same kind of controlled, articulate bass/sub bass but also has excellent mids and highs. I guess I want it all... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 Looking in the $150-300 range. 
  
 My full size phones are the 650 and NAD HP 50.
  
 Thanks!
  
 -Mike


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> should i pick the ue900 or the dunu dn1000 for the same price ? and to my indian folks , ue 900 is going for inr 12999 on snapdeal.com .


 
  
 Depends, do you want the bass and wow factor of the DN-1000 or the balance and poise of the UE900? $200 ish is a good price for the UE900 if genuine.
  


ap616 said:


> I figured it was too long a Q. My bad. I have a some factual knowledge, but little to no experience.
> That's the question for me, do I "want to" afford it and would something else suit me more for my personal preference of which I'm not entirely sure. What would be second and third to the Dunus for EDM or my described sound below(I tried to do what I could... lol)
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, a bit. Not too bad, though. The RHA MA750 for example has the right bass, treble, and presentation characteristics but it's not cool in tone and clarity/detail retrieval are not the best due to slight veiling of the midrange. The JVC FXD80 is the opposite - not as bassy and brighter/less forgiving overall, but tonally it sounds more like what you're describing. The DN-1000 is probably as close as it gets to a compromise here. The FXT90 and H-100 wouldn't really been any more suitable for your requirements than the MA750 and FXD80, respectively.
  


yoyowiggle said:


> ljokerl (Mr. Joker Sir!)
> 
> Thank you so much for all you have put into this. I think I personally have referred to it over a thousand times minimum.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Yamaha EPH-100 has a similar balance of bass quantity and quality that the MA750 has but its mids are not as recessed. It would be a good one to try. The DN-1000 has less bass but the mids are definitely clearer still. Beyond that, staying with the powerful bass/sub-bass theme, maybe one of the JVC Woodies? It might be possible to get an FX750 in that price range nowadays. I don't think those a great value compared to newer sets like the MA750 and EPH-100 but they're out there if you want to spend the $$.


----------



## 1clearhead

pedro oliveira said:


> Wich tips do you guys recomend to improve the confort/fit/sound/isolation (the least important since the stock ones isolation is not that bad) for the philips she3580/90??
> 
> To be honest i dont like the stock tips from the philips.... they are a bit too squishy, flabby(???)... since i bought the philips a year ago i have been using them with the tips from my brainwavz m5 (wich i hate... at least the tips are usefull.... XD ) but unfortunately i lost one of them recently (i use the medium size).....
> 
> ...


 
 You could also try checking out my short review on these at http://www.head-fi.org/t/663657/philips-she3580-how-to-up-grade-your-philips-she3580-90-note-once-up-graded-theyre-hard-to-beat. I do mention about the *"sky blue medium tips by vsonic"* which made a world of a difference for me.
  
 Today, they are still one of my top 10 favorites!
  
 Ps. -It is an old thread, but VSONIC still provides these tips. You can purchase them at any credible website that sells Chinese IEM's to the US or any other country, or maybe even amazon or ebay. Good luck!


----------



## bonfirehay

Philips SHE-3590 not in the list...


----------



## 1clearhead

bonfirehay said:


> Philips SHE-3590 not in the list...


 
 Actually they are pretty much in the same league as the 3580. So, yes they are in the same list. When it's written like this: Philips SHE-3580/90, what I really mean is that the tips supports the Philips SHE-3580 as well as the Philips SHE-3590.
  
 I hope this is what your statement is referring to.....


----------



## bonfirehay

I was talking about the master list of 316 IEMs


----------



## 1clearhead

bonfirehay said:


> I was talking about the master list of 316 IEMs


 
 Oooops, sorry! Thanks for quoting me on that.
  
 But, you're right he never posted them on his list. I do know he owns them. He highly speaks about them on several threads.


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, a bit. Not too bad, though. The RHA MA750 for example has the right bass, treble, and presentation characteristics but it's not cool in tone and clarity/detail retrieval are not the best due to slight veiling of the midrange. The JVC FXD80 is the opposite - not as bassy and brighter/less forgiving overall, but tonally it sounds more like what you're describing. The DN-1000 is probably as close as it gets to a compromise here. The FXT90 and H-100 wouldn't really been any more suitable for your requirements than the MA750 and FXD80, respectively.


 
  
 That helped me further clarify I feel! I don't think the RHAs are quite what I want then with the details & veiling(they are $120 as well, comparing to the HA-FXT90), and the H-100 is a little too overpriced compared to the HA-FXD80 in my opinion. Also, I don't think I can justify paying the $190-210 for the DN-1000s at this time, especially since I am going to get a nice pair of Mid-Fi open over-the-ear headphones soon that are more than that.
 The FXD80 are about $75 now and the FXT90 $82 on Amazon, which both seem like pretty good deals. How does the presentation and detail retrieval compare between the two? Also, what level bass impact do the FXD80s possess or is there an iem comparative that comes to mind for its bass? Thanks for the help, very informative as always!


----------



## SilverEars

Joker! Once again, I agree with your ranking and impressions.  I got my NT-6, and it's rediculous. It's so clear and detailed.  I didn't know CIEM could get this natural sounding!


----------



## ljokerl

bonfirehay said:


> Philips SHE-3590 not in the list...


 
  
 Haven't had a chance to add it but I do recommend it wholeheartedly. It's also in my buyer's guide: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/ 
  


ap616 said:


> The FXD80 are about $75 now and the FXT90 $82 on Amazon, which both seem like pretty good deals. How does the presentation and detail retrieval compare between the two? Also, what level bass impact do the FXD80s possess or is there an iem comparative that comes to mind for its bass? Thanks for the help, very informative as always!


 
  
 The FXD80 has good soundstage width but sounds a bit flat/lacking in depth next to the FXT90. Detail retrieval is comparable between them. 
  
 As for the FXD80's bass quantity, among the other sets you're considering it's north of the H-100 but south of the MA750.
  


silverears said:


> Joker! Once again, I agree with your ranking and impressions.  I got my NT-6, and it's rediculous. It's so clear and detailed.  I didn't know CIEM could get this natural sounding!


 
  
 Wow, another NT-6 owner! Glad to hear that, they really are very special.


----------



## bonfirehay

ljokerl said:


> Haven't had a chance to add it but I do recommend it wholeheartedly. It's also in my buyer's guide: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/


 
 Thank you, the guide is great.
 How much V shaped are the Philips SHE-3590 in comparison with CX-300?
 Because I own some CX-300 but never liked them..


----------



## Ap616

bonfirehay said:


> Thank you, the guide is great.
> How much V shaped are the Philips SHE-3590 in comparison with CX-300?
> Because I own some CX-300 but never liked them..


 

 Courtesy of Joe Bloggs' thread on the SHE3590.
  
  
  
 And here's a FR graph I found for the CX 300


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> The FXD80 has good soundstage width but sounds a bit flat/lacking in depth next to the FXT90. Detail retrieval is comparable between them.
> 
> As for the FXD80's bass quantity, among the other sets you're considering it's north of the H-100 but south of the MA750.


 
  
 One last question, is the FXT90 bass on par with the MA750 or below it but north of the FXD80?
  
 I think I want to try the FXD80 because of the tone and brightness, but the size of the microdrivers might bother my ears just a bit. Let's hope not. I think I must have smaller or oddly-shaped ears canals though. Being an indecisive overthinker does not help... haha
 I think I am going to go with the FXD80 anyway. I might try the FXT90 if they don't work though in the future. Thanks for your help Joker! I'll try to let you know how I like them. Greatly appreciated


----------



## ljokerl

bonfirehay said:


> Thank you, the guide is great.
> How much V shaped are the Philips SHE-3590 in comparison with CX-300?
> Because I own some CX-300 but never liked them..


 
  
 More v-shaped by a good amount. The CX300 isn't really v-shaped, just bloated and boomy because of all that mid-bass.
  


ap616 said:


> One last question, is the FXT90 bass on par with the MA750 or below it but north of the FXD80?
> 
> I think I want to try the FXD80 because of the tone and brightness, but the size of the microdrivers might bother my ears just a bit. Let's hope not. I think I must have smaller or oddly-shaped ears canals though. Being an indecisive overthinker does not help... haha
> I think I am going to go with the FXD80 anyway. I might try the FXT90 if they don't work though in the future. Thanks for your help Joker! I'll try to let you know how I like them. Greatly appreciated


 
  
 The FXT90 doesn't have the most subbass presence but its bass impact is closest to the MA750 and greater than with the FXD80.
  
 There was someone else recently who had the same concerns about the design of the FXD80 (coming from a non-microdriver earphone) but last I heard that worked out quite well.


----------



## zenstep

Hi there! This review is literally to extensive to read... I hope specific questions arent to much of a bother.. Ive been scouring the nets (a lot of head-fi) for the past few days regarding top tier (under 500$) universal IEMs that play well with bass heavy genres such as (trance, dubstep, drum & bass etc).
  
 Heres a basic list of what Ive been observing.. Although the iE80 has good reviews regarding bass response.. frankly im turned off by the idea of an adjustable "bass knob". It feels very gimmicky to me and suggests the product is very overpriced. Not to mention more moving parts = bad.
  
 Westone 4 freq response seems to be "dark"?.. but somewhat lacking in sub response from what ive heard despite its consistently high reviews.. so these are a maybe?... idk.
  
 I havent been able to get a clear review on the J-phonics regarding playback with EDM genres unfortunately so im in the dark there as well..
  
 The TDK's came highly reviewed on a inner fidelity review post but it was posted in 2011 which leads me to think its probably outdated considering the advances in the past 3 years.. 
  
 Westone 4             ($450)        4 BA
j-phonic K2 SP      ($400)        2 BA
 Sony EX 1000        ($500)       ?
 TDK BA200           ($250)        2 BA
 (Sennheiser) iE80($270)        1 Dynamic
  
 Im kind of exhausted researching this... Im ready to buy a pair of 500$ or less universal IEMs.. some guidance would really be appreciated.. im surprised there isnt a threat already covering this TBH.. Ive already learned a ton in the past few days about IEMs and now im at a seamingly infinite crossroads without any definitive help from anyone yet.
  
 SUMMARY: 500$ or less universal fit IEM (balanced armature or dynamic or hybrid) that plays best with bass centric EDM music.. not necessarily more bass (maybe more).. but focused also on bass clarity / punch and definition (which may constitute a freq response curve with accentuated lows around 40 hurtz and cuts around 330 hurtz). 
  
 Please help >.<
 zenstep@zenstep.com


----------



## skinnyq

Hello, I went over all your recommendations for the $30-$60 price range IEMs and gathered that your top picks are:
 Sony MH1C
 SteelSeries Flux In-Ear
 VSonic V02
  
 Unless there are other recommended earphones, which of these would you recommend to a person that appreciates very accurate
 sound but also enjoys noticeable bass?


----------



## ljokerl

zenstep said:


> The TDK's came highly reviewed on a inner fidelity review post but it was posted in 2011 which leads me to think its probably outdated considering the advances in the past 3 years..
> 
> Westone 4             ($450)        4 BA
> j-phonic K2 SP      ($400)        2 BA
> ...


 
  
 The j-Phonics aren't available outside of Japan anymore. The BA200 has been discontinued but it's still a very good earphone - I just added it to this review 10 days ago. The Westone 4 and EX1000 are older, anyway.
  
 The sets you're looking at are kind of all over the place. For example, the BA earphone with the best deep bass (IMO) - the EarSonics SM64 - isn't even on your list. The IE80 is bassier than all the other ones you're considering, too, and well-performing hybrids such as the Dunu DN-1000 and DN-2000 aren't on your list at all. I would definitely consider both of those for EDM if you want good bass bunch that's still short of the IE80 in quantity. 
  


skinnyq said:


> Hello, I went over all your recommendations for the $30-$60 price range IEMs and gathered that your top picks are:
> Sony MH1C
> SteelSeries Flux In-Ear
> VSonic V02
> ...


 
  
 I recommend the VSonic VSD1S over the VC02, especially with your requirements. It's the one I'd go for for accurate sound with a bit of added bass punch, unless you think its treble might be too much for you in which case I'd go with the Flux.


----------



## HeadHoncho

Hi Joker.
  
 I have extensively used the following earphones, all bought after referring this Epic thread of yours. (Except the first one)
 Creative EP 630 (Used for 3 years before one side gave up)
 Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition (Used for 2 years before 1 side gave up)
 HiSound Audio Wooduo 2 (Used for a few months before 1 side gave up)
 Sony MH1C (Currently in use)
 Vsonic VSD1 (Used for several months before... I misstepped on it and broke the housing...) (Chose VSD1 over VSD1S because of the supposedly enhanced bass)
  
 Out of all the above, despite hoping that the VSD1's would be an upgrade over the GR02 Bass Editions, I felt I enjoyed the GR02 BE more. The Wooduo 2 and MH1C, I don't know the exact term for this, I found a bit veiled in comparison, though I did still enjoy both the sets. And the VSD1 I found a bit lacking in bass, and more sibilant compared to the GR02 BE. I also found the Soundstage/3D Imaging of the GR02 BE more expansive. I don't know whether what I felt contradicts your opinion or not. Or it might just be the individual sets.
  
 I am continuing to use the Sony MH1Cs, but I have to start searching for another set again, this is turning out to be a very expensive hobby for me now... So, what would you recommend now for me? Something which I can procure in India (preferably something available at lendmeurears, mp4nation or hifinage (Indian retailer for Vsonic)). Budget will be not more than 50-60 USD.
  
 Help.
  
 And Thanks, for all your advice along the years.


----------



## zenstep

Joker thanks for your quick reply.. its so nice to have some backup on this subject ^-^
 I literally JUST realized you were the one who published the "Multi-IEM Review - 316 IEMs compared", did you write this and compare these yourself??? Its incredibly detailed.. very impressive. Is this list still relevant in 2014? I couldn't find a publishing date on it other than the post date in 2010.
  
 Ive recently checked out a new 3 BA system that is marketed with supposedly a huge amount of well controlled bass and a superb soundstage.. InEar StageDiver 3 (SD-3) [($600) 3 BA] however they appear to be slightly uncomfortable to wear and about 100$ out of my price range.. although they look better than any universal IEM i've ever seen, seeing as how they site low profile in your ear like a custom.. very cool. Should I extend my price range for these?
  
 This is an updated list of the IEMs on my mind, 
  
 EarSonics SM64                    ($450)        3 BA
 InEar StageDiver 3 (SD-3)    ($600)        3 BA
 Dunu DN-2000                       ($315)        2 BA 1 Dynamic
 (Sennheiser) iE80                  ($270)        1 Dynamic
 TDK BA200                             ($250)        2 BA
 InEar StageDiver 2 (SD-2)    ($450)        2 BA
  
 I hate to take up your time but would you mind comparing these or possibly giving me some others to think about? I think you know what Im after now and I'm still quite unsure which of these is best. Do the Dunu DN-2000's have replaceable ear tips? (could i use comply foam tips with them?). If you don't have the time perhaps you could just label them from best to worst for my particular needs? Im an audio engineer and composer.. primarily listening to bass centric EDM and i want some good walking around and sleeping in IEMs that deliver clear impactful bass. Ill be using my ipod and iphone built in amp (not that that matters within most universal IEMs seeing as the amp seems more then enough to power these).
  
 Thank you so much for your time.. 
  
 Best, 
  
 Zenstep


----------



## ljokerl

headhoncho said:


> Hi Joker.
> 
> I have extensively used the following earphones, all bought after referring this Epic thread of yours. (Except the first one)
> Creative EP 630 (Used for 3 years before one side gave up)
> ...


 
  
 Why not just get another GR02 BE? I haven't heard anything that sounds very similar to these but better - they are just bassier than the VSD1 and most of the other sets I recommend often these days, so I don't think there's anything more suitable for you in that price range. The ATH-CKM500 might be worth considering but its deep bass is not as prominent as that of the GR02.
  


zenstep said:


> Joker thanks for your quick reply.. its so nice to have some backup on this subject ^-^
> I literally JUST realized you were the one who published the "Multi-IEM Review - 316 IEMs compared", did you write this and compare these yourself??? Its incredibly detailed.. very impressive. Is this list still relevant in 2014? I couldn't find a publishing date on it other than the post date in 2010.
> 
> Ive recently checked out a new 3 BA system that is marketed with supposedly a huge amount of well controlled bass and a superb soundstage.. InEar StageDiver 3 (SD-3) [($600) 3 BA] however they appear to be slightly uncomfortable to wear and about 100$ out of my price range.. although they look better than any universal IEM i've ever seen, seeing as how they site low profile in your ear like a custom.. very cool. Should I extend my price range for these?
> ...


 
  
 Yes, I wrote this review. It's being updated ~weekly - see the title of the thread and the index with the review "add" dates. There's also an easier-to-navigate version here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/ 
  
 My StageDiver SD-3/SD-2 reviews are both included in this thread. The bass of the SD-3 is a little excessive for me and I preferred the SD-2. Both are approximately comparable to the EarSonics SM64, but the SM64 seems to be more along the lines of what you're looking for in terms of sound. It's also more comfortable than the regular SD-2/SD-3 (although there are new "small" versions of both StageDivers available that might be more comfortable than the regular ones). 
  
 Of course the DN-2000 has replaceable eartips - all universal earphones do. It comes with some foam tips in the package and you can use Complys with it as well (T400 size I think, might need to double-check). 

 Honestly, your requirements are generic enough that a lot of earphones can be said to fit them. I probably wouldn't get one of the more more flat-sounding ones (BA200, SD-2) for EDM but there's a good chance you'd enjoy those as well, so it's hard to rule them out. It would be easier if you'd already tried some more affordable sets to at least know what worked for you and what didn't. Anyway, it might be the "new toy" syndrome talking but I think the DN-2000 is as good a place to start as any, especially as it's considerably less expensive than the SM64 or SD-3.


----------



## HeadHoncho

ljokerl said:


> Why not just get another GR02 BE? I haven't heard anything that sounds very similar to these but better - they are just bassier than the VSD1 and most of the other sets I recommend often these days, so I don't think there's anything more suitable for you in that price range. The ATH-CKM500 might be worth considering but its deep bass is not as prominent as that of the GR02.


 
  
 Yes, that's what I'll probably end up doing, but I wanted to do my due diligence before I did that. What about some sets from Brainwavz/DUNU/Astrotec/VSD1S? Are there new VSDs launching soon in this price range? VSD 3/4/7/9, etc


----------



## zenstep

Joker I feel a lot closer to making a decision.. thanks for your time.
  
 Ill refer to your list if I have any more questions.
  
 Just one last thing, I saw your note about the SD-3s but the link you provided to the InEar site only briefly mentions the new "s" version on their website. I can't find any further links to purchase or view pics or anything from the site or any google searches ive done. Would you mind giving me a link to a purchase page? Im definitely missing something..
  
 It seems Ill either get the EarSonics SM64 or the SD-3 (the S version hopefully) maybe the Dunu.
  
 Thanks,
  
 Zenstep


----------



## Jozurr

Hi Joker,

 How do the TDK BA200 compare with the RHA MA750 and the MEELEC A161?


----------



## ljokerl

headhoncho said:


> Yes, that's what I'll probably end up doing, but I wanted to do my due diligence before I did that. What about some sets from Brainwavz/DUNU/Astrotec/VSD1S? Are there new VSDs launching soon in this price range? VSD 3/4/7/9, etc


 

 Like I said, nothing that sounds similar to the GR02 BE but better. The VSD1S is almost identical to the VSD1 in sound and I don't know anything about any new VSD earphones. 
  


zenstep said:


> Joker I feel a lot closer to making a decision.. thanks for your time.
> 
> Ill refer to your list if I have any more questions.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't have a link for the S. It's pretty new, you probably just need to contact InEar for purchase info/photos at this point. 
  


jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> How do the TDK BA200 compare with the RHA MA750 and the MEELEC A161?


 
  
 More similar to the A161 than the MA750. The MA750 sounds very different - warmer, bassier, more v-shaped, and also a little muffled in the midrange in comparison. The A161 is cooler in tone and more analytical, with some grain in the treble and less top-end extension compared to the BA200. The BA200 also has a little more body in the bass region.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted brief impressions of a couple new universal and custom-fit earphones here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-noble-fr-pr-perfect-seal-sportbud-silver-minerva-mi-performer-pro-mi-artist-pro/
  
 The post includes:
  

Noble FR & PR variable-tuning universals
Perfect Seal SportBud Silver half-shell custom earphones
Minerva Mi-Performer Pro and Mi-Artist Pro custom musicians' monitors


----------



## aleex

OK, I'm looking for a low/mid-priced IEM (<$60), preferably with remote (volume control and next track). I will mainly use them when I'm out running and working out. Any recommendations? 
 I've looked at Steelseries Flux In-ear, Etymotic Research ETY-Kids 5/3 and MEElectronics M6P.


----------



## ikjadoon

Hi, Joker (and anyone else who think they could help). I'm stuck in a three-way tie to replace my dead Ety HF5s:
  
 1. 1964EARS V3
 2. Alclair Reference
 3. Custom Art Music Ones
  
*How I narrowed it down to these three:*
  
 Regarding the HF5s, I loved their super-detailed and clear sound, as well as the amazing isolation. I disliked the weak bass in hip-hop/pop, microphonics in quiet settings, modest ear discomfort after long sessions, the occasional sibilance cropping up, as well as the "meh" soundstage (good left/right, but nothing really else).
  
 I listen to many different kinds of music: rock, pop, folk, piano, vocal, some hip-hop, and a touch of spoken word, so balanced IEMs seem like the best option. I listen for hours on end, so comfort is important; I also like to run with music, so microphonics are also important. My budget is $500 maximum because I listen on a Samsung Galaxy S4/laptop/desktop PC and am already in the diminishing returns price range.
  
 Taking these into consideration, I thought I should get the best entry-level custom IEM. These are the 3 highest sound-scoring custom IEMs under $500.
  
*My current dilemma:*
  
 The Alclair Reference seems to be the best option, except that they may accentuate sibilance. I abhor sibilance and the HF5's sibilance sometimes got to me. The Music One and V3 seemed to be similarly technically talented (9.2/9.4 sound score, compared to the 9.4 of the Reference) that didn't have sibilance. I liked the V3 because you noted it was more "musical" than the Reference. I love music that excites me and gets me tapping my feet. But, I don't like muddy bass (about as much as I hate sibilance) which you mention about the V3s in comparison to the Reference: even though the HF5s lacked bass impact, I appreciated the bass' cleanliness.
  
 So, then, I thought, OK, maybe the middle ground is the Custom One's: no sibilance and no muddy bass. But, it seems to be a little less technically talented than either the V3 and the Reference and I'm a bit hesitant about shipping costs to Poland for warranty and/or refit issues.
  
Where I need help: is the sibilance of the Reference worse than the V3's muddier bass? I realize I'm exaggerating their flaws here; these are two pretty great IEMs. I just want to make sure I spend my money in the best place.
  
 The Custom Art Music Two's seem like the answer, sans shipping costs, but I realize you haven't listened to them and its reviews are scarce, particularly by those with custom IEM experience.


----------



## lobraz

Wow ! I'm new here and it's an awesome comparison ! Thanks for this !


----------



## ljokerl

aleex said:


> OK, I'm looking for a low/mid-priced IEM (<$60), preferably with remote (volume control and next track). I will mainly use them when I'm out running and working out. Any recommendations?
> I've looked at Steelseries Flux In-ear, Etymotic Research ETY-Kids 5/3 and MEElectronics M6P.


 
  
 If you're using an Apple product, volume controls are easy enough (pretty much any 3-button remote will do) but if you're using Android, that really narrows down your options a lot. For working out I probably won't recommend the Flux or EtyKids - the former just not secure enough in the ear and the latter perhaps not comfortable enough with that deep seal.
  
 The M6P is a definitely good option. If you must have more accurate sound than the bassy M6P, I think you can find the A151P in your price range as well. It's only got a 1-button remote and isn't as bright as the Etykids but it's got a much more neutral sound than the M6P and the form factor is more suitable for active use. Not sure how the BA drivers will stand up to sweat so maybe not the best option if you expect it to last more than a year, though. 
  
  


ikjadoon said:


> Hi, Joker (and anyone else who think they could help). I'm stuck in a three-way tie to replace my dead Ety HF5s:
> 
> 1. 1964EARS V3
> 2. Alclair Reference
> ...


 
  
 Yes, the Reference is probably not the best option due to being more revealing of sibilance than the HF5, and the V3 is much, much bassier than the HF5. The Custom One is a "safer" choice in terms of sound signature but it doesn't have a whole lot more bass than the Etys so it might not be a drastic enough upgrade for you in that area. Obviously it does fix the other issues you have - comfort, cable noise, etc. 
  
 One more option you might want to consider is the Perfect Seal SportBud Silver, which I just covered here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-noble-fr-pr-perfect-seal-sportbud-silver-minerva-mi-performer-pro-mi-artist-pro/ . It comes from a US-based company and is about on-par with the Custom Art Music One in technical ability. In fact, it more strongly reminds me of the StageDiver SD-2, which if I'm not mistaken uses the same driver. Compared to the Music One you gain a little bass quantity (a good think with your requirements) and lose a little treble quality (not a good thing, but the difference is not night and day).
  


lobraz said:


> Wow ! I'm new here and it's an awesome comparison ! Thanks for this !


----------



## soundstige

I've given a lot of recommendations in the past but I feel really stuck in choosing something that's right for me. I'm looking for a neutral, analytical IEM with a lot of sound stage and, if it has to veer from being totally flat, a slight boost in the treble region. I'm looking to spend $200-300. I don't mind dynamic or BA drivers, but in the past I've found BAs the most enjoyable.
  
 The two best IEMs I've listened to are the Etymotic ER4S and the Brainwavz B2, for reference. I'm trying to get a step up from them to go with my ODAC+O2 combo.
  
 Thanks joker/everyone else!


----------



## SebsG

Get the IEM with the clearest, smoothest, and warmest Mids and then listen to any Ariana Grande or Shalira song.. omg eargasm much?


----------



## RochRx7

sebsg said:


> Get the IEM with the clearest, smoothest, and warmest Mids and then listen to any Ariana Grande or Shalira song.. omg eargasm much?


 
 which iem you talkin bout willis


----------



## suman134

soundstige said:


> I've given a lot of recommendations in the past but I feel really stuck in choosing something that's right for me. I'm looking for a neutral, analytical IEM with a lot of sound stage and, if it has to veer from being totally flat, a slight boost in the treble region. I'm looking to spend $200-300. I don't mind dynamic or BA drivers, but in the past I've found BAs the most enjoyable.
> 
> The two best IEMs I've listened to are the Etymotic ER4S and the Brainwavz B2, for reference. I'm trying to get a step up from them to go with my ODAC+O2 combo.
> 
> Thanks joker/everyone else!


 
  
     go ciem . sadly i have never tried anything better then er-4p , and then i havent tried many top end phones .


----------



## Bina

I'm sad to see Noble 6 will not get full review. Can you at least tell us, if you think this 6 driver IEM is on same level as other 1K IEMs and estimated score for sound?
  
 Thanks


----------



## msd94

Hi all, would like recommendations. i have a budget of around $100 USD, but it can go a little higher if it's truly worth it.
  
 i had the klipsch s4's for the past 3 years but recently lost them. while i was satisfied with them i realize there are better options.
  
 the genres i listen to most would probably be rap and rock, such as flipsyde, brother ali, common market, adelitas way.. but also artists like stevie wonder, gnarls barkley, etc. so i would really like a good all-around IEM.
  
  
 i'm looking for something comfortable (i listen up to 5 hours of music a day, usually half through my IEMS) with good sound isolation, preferably passive. obviously good sound quality is a must, as is durability, my s4's lasted 3 years and still aren't broken, just lost, i'm not sure how uncommon this is for higher quality IEMs but i would definitely want a pair to last at least a year if not more.


----------



## ljokerl

soundstige said:


> I've given a lot of recommendations in the past but I feel really stuck in choosing something that's right for me. I'm looking for a neutral, analytical IEM with a lot of sound stage and, if it has to veer from being totally flat, a slight boost in the treble region. I'm looking to spend $200-300. I don't mind dynamic or BA drivers, but in the past I've found BAs the most enjoyable.
> 
> The two best IEMs I've listened to are the Etymotic ER4S and the Brainwavz B2, for reference. I'm trying to get a step up from them to go with my ODAC+O2 combo.
> 
> Thanks joker/everyone else!


 
  
 I still haven't found anything I enjoy more than the ER4S and a few of the better TWFKs in that price range for balanced-to-slightly bright sound. However, if you can get your hands on it, maybe try the Sony EX1000 - it provides a slightly different take on the balanced/bright signature with a wider/more out-of-the-head presentation. The EX600 is also an option and should be less expensive, but possibly harder to get your hands on.
  


bina said:


> I'm sad to see Noble 6 will not get full review. Can you at least tell us, if you think this 6 driver IEM is on same level as other 1K IEMs and estimated score for sound?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 If you only consider universals it's not so bad but I thought the MH334 sounded better overall with a somewhat similar (but smoother) signature, and the less expensive StageDiver SD-3 was a close competitor as well. I would rank the 6 somewhere between those two, closer to the SD-3.
  


msd94 said:


> Hi all, would like recommendations. i have a budget of around $100 USD, but it can go a little higher if it's truly worth it.
> 
> i had the klipsch s4's for the past 3 years but recently lost them. while i was satisfied with them i realize there are better options.
> 
> ...


 
  
 RHA MA750s are nice and durable at around $110. They fit your requirements for sound and decent isolation but comfort will depend on your ears - for me they are fine but some have reported them to be too large. They are also worn cable-up.
  
 JVC HA-FXT90 is slightly less expensive but sounds about as good. It's more lightweight than the MA750 but still has a large footprint in the ear compared to the S4 thanks to its dual drivers.
  
 ATH-CKM500 has a shallower fit so you'll maybe give up a bit of isolation but it's quite comfortable and very inexpensive for the sound quality provided. 
  
 Sony MH1C would be the least expensive set I'd recommend. It's probably the safest choice in terms of comfort/noise isolation balance, though the cable can be annoying, and sound every bit as good as the CKM500 overall. There's a Bluetooth wireless version of these as well - the SBH80.


----------



## MoonYeol

msd94 said:


> Hi all, would like recommendations. i have a budget of around $100 USD, but it can go a little higher if it's truly worth it.
> 
> i had the klipsch s4's for the past 3 years but recently lost them. while i was satisfied with them i realize there are better options.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Maybe Vsonic GR07 Classic? Ok isolation, great comfort for most. Good sound quality. I just don't know how they stack up to the newer ones. I've been out of the game for a while, haven't bought any new iems for a while. But just looking at construction I still find that GR07 were among the most comfortable iems I've tried. Great warm-ish sound with good slightly-above-neutral bass with good organic drum sounds. Just a tendency to sound sibilant but usually not a problem. Kind of thinking about buying a new pair later just because the GR07 really changed my way of listening to music.


----------



## esteebin

msd94 said:


> Hi all, would like recommendations. i have a budget of around $100 USD, but it can go a little higher if it's truly worth it.
> 
> i had the klipsch s4's for the past 3 years but recently lost them. while i was satisfied with them i realize there are better options.
> 
> ...


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> RHA MA750s are nice and durable at around $110. They fit your requirements for sound and decent isolation but comfort will depend on your ears - for me they are fine but some have reported them to be too large. They are also worn cable-up.
> 
> JVC HA-FXT90 is slightly less expensive but sounds about as good. It's more lightweight than the MA750 but still has a large footprint in the ear compared to the S4 thanks to its dual drivers.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 How about the Yamaha EPH-100? strong bass, small form factor, good build quality. No mic/controls. $110 on Amazon.


----------



## SebsG

rochrx7 said:


> which iem you talkin bout willis



None in specific, but with me it's the UE600


----------



## SilverEars

ljokerl said:


> Yes, the Reference is probably not the best option due to being more revealing of sibilance than the HF5, and the *V3 is much, much bassier *than the HF5. The Custom One is a "safer" choice in terms of sound signature but it doesn't have a whole lot more bass than the Etys so it might not be a drastic enough upgrade for you in that area. Obviously it does fix the other issues you have - comfort, cable noise, etc.


 
 Once again, Mr. Joker's review lines up with mine, and joker's got to be the most honest and trustable reviewer on headfi.  You have to tread headfi carefully because you will run into lots of hype and possibly scammers posting that get's paid for only writing positive things.  Joker has much experience, low-fi to hi.
  
 Joker, I've noticed that NT-6 is sensitive to source.  NT-6 can be extremely clear and detail, or sound like any other iem depending on the source.  Have you tried several sources?  I found that if you match it with the right source, it would push out some unbelievable sound, dynamic imaging is ridiculous.  My top three sources are DX100, ODAC/O2 combo, and Fiio X5.  Maybe your ranking would go up even more if you try it with the right source?


----------



## Astropin

esteebin said:


> How about the Yamaha EPH-100? strong bass, small form factor, good build quality. No mic/controls. $110 on Amazon.




I think that is the best suggestion yet. The Yamaha's appear to be a clear favorite in this price range. Check out the EPH-100 thread.....it made me but a pair. Just deal with Amazon and not eBay on these; a lot of known fakes floating around on eBay.


----------



## 1clearhead

*Hello*
*Joker,*
  
 What's the best IEM I can purchase without going for broke?
  
*1.* I'm looking for tight and noticeable deep sub-bass (not necessarily a bass-head type)
  
*2.* Clear and liquid-like sounding mids'
  
*3.* Finally, clear and analytical treble (not dry)
  
*-A mild V shape is the idealistic sound I had in mind*
  
 .....I thought about the Dunu DN-1000 (triple driver hybrid), if paying in the $200 dollar range.
  
 But, I'm trying to shoot under $50 dollars (or only above $50 if any BA's are worth getting that could provide all of the above).
  
  
 -Some ideas would be great! Thanks in advance!


----------



## Retrias

ljoker , can you please put a suggestion , either here or on this thread
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/722687/iem-choice-upgrade
 on what I should upgrade my ie8 and ck100 into ? I am using the x5 as a source


----------



## SebsG

Well.. My ue600's.. Yea they broke. This has literally happened with the past 5 or 6 headphones I have purchased. It's a cable issue, like I twist and turn it and sound sometimes comes out, but the sound only cuts out on the right side, not the left. The only headphones I have still have working are my Monoprice 9927's (black version of the 8320) which have been throught the washer, dryer, dog bites, and literally drenched/submerged in coke for a few hours. Anybody know what can be the cause of the sound cutting out? I have been "babying" the ue600's as well so idk :/


----------



## kendric

Hi Joker. I had read your thread since 2011 and has managed to make fabulous purchases such as the MD Tributes then the Ortofon e-Q7 and finally the FX700. 

I am just curious if you have heard the current FX850s and your comments & impressions of them. Thanks in advance. Cheers!


----------



## esteebin

sebsg said:


> Well.. My ue600's.. Yea they broke. This has literally happened with the past 5 or 6 headphones I have purchased. It's a cable issue, like I twist and turn it and sound sometimes comes out, but the sound only cuts out on the right side, not the left. The only headphones I have still have working are my Monoprice 9927's (black version of the 8320) which have been throught the washer, dryer, dog bites, and literally drenched/submerged in coke for a few hours. Anybody know what can be the cause of the sound cutting out? I have been "babying" the ue600's as well so idk :/


 
  
 have you tried wiping the headphone plugs and use cotton swab to clean inside the headphone jack? There maybe oil or residue that is preventing a good contact.


----------



## davidcotton

Hi Joker
  
 I'm curious more than anything.  What would you think would be a good upgrade to the old westone 3?  I've heard westone 2 (great apart from a lack of bass)klipsch x10, tf10.  Was just looking for something a little more off the beaten path.
  
 Listen to Rock, metal and audiobooks.  The only thing is they must be excellent isolators as I use these at work (either out of a ipod classic or a sansa clip plus) to keep my self some what sane.
  
 No real budget but lower the better.
  
 I've gone through (in my head,no purchases) everything from the likes of the earsonics se6 universal, 1964 ears v6 universals (taxes put me off here) stagedivers 2 and 3 (afraid off too much bass in 3 and too little in 2), then I go nuts and start thinking about the unique melody mentor and roxanne (mentor unlikely and the roxanne just looks too big for my ears!).
  
 Thanks


----------



## 1clearhead

1clearhead said:


> *Hello*
> *Joker,*
> 
> What's the best IEM I can purchase without going for broke?
> ...


 
 (*Thank you for replying through a different thread....)
  
 Wow! Great to hear your helpful and supportive comments!
  
 It's ironic that out of the Vsonic that I carry the VSD1S is not in my collection.
  
 Now, I will make it my mission to add these to my collection.
  
 Many thanks! This will do!


----------



## SebsG

esteebin said:


> have you tried wiping the headphone plugs and use cotton swab to clean inside the headphone jack? There maybe oil or residue that is preventing a good contact.


Nope, and I already tried on multiple sources: phone, computer, etc
Edit: at the L-shaped plug, where the cable itself comes out, it seems a bit stretched/bent as if it was pulled out and then put back


----------



## huckfinn

Hi ljokerl,
 Thanks for all your advice!!
  
 I've been going through quite a few pages but I can't find anything that answer my issue: I quite enjoy the Momentum on ear and would like to find something similar in iems.....any suggestion (possibly at half the price of the MOE).
 I have and enjoy the Sony MH1c. Unfortunately they keep slipping off my ears which makes it a bit tricky to listen to....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Thanks again for your suggestions!


----------



## nicolo

Hi,
  
 I have the Hifiman RE-600 and love it. I am looking for another pair of universal IEMs. I prefer a balanced presentation with nice treble extension, good mid-range and deep accurate bass. Basically a slight V shaped sound signature.
 What would your recommendation be for universal IEMs below $600? Customs are not an option for me.


----------



## ljokerl

esteebin said:


> How about the Yamaha EPH-100? strong bass, small form factor, good build quality. No mic/controls. $110 on Amazon.


 
  
 Definitely a good option. Didn't realize they were down to $110. I'd be careful buying them on sale due to counterfeits but if it's sold by amazon it should be fine.
  


silverears said:


> Once again, Mr. Joker's review lines up with mine, and joker's got to be the most honest and trustable reviewer on headfi.  You have to tread headfi carefully because you will run into lots of hype and possibly scammers posting that get's paid for only writing positive things.  Joker has much experience, low-fi to hi.
> 
> Joker, I've noticed that NT-6 is sensitive to source.  NT-6 can be extremely clear and detail, or sound like any other iem depending on the source.  Have you tried several sources?  I found that if you match it with the right source, it would push out some unbelievable sound, dynamic imaging is ridiculous.  My top three sources are DX100, ODAC/O2 combo, and Fiio X5.  Maybe your ranking would go up even more if you try it with the right source?


 
  
 I don't know how much room for improvement there is on top of the HM-901 with IEM card - I've tried the AK120, DX50, X3 and didn't think either was better than the 901. Plus, there's not much room for growth in the NT-6's score anyway - it's 2nd overall 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


1clearhead said:


> *Hello*
> *Joker,*
> 
> What's the best IEM I can purchase without going for broke?
> ...


 
  
 My reply, for posterity:
  


> Sure, but that's a lot of stuff you want for $50. You'll have to compromise just a little bit - either with the VSonic VSD1S, which is v-shaped and very clear with crisp treble but doesn't have the best deep bass extension, or with the SteelSeries Flux, which is less v-shaped and has better bass extension, but lacks a little bit of midrange clarity and "liquid-ness" compared to the VSD1S.


 
  


retrias said:


> ljoker , can you please put a suggestion , either here or on this thread
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/722687/iem-choice-upgrade
> on what I should upgrade my ie8 and ck100 into ? I am using the x5 as a source


 
  
 I would say EarSonics SM64 based on those requirements. Not having tried the SD-3S (the new small version) I'm not sure how it fares in comfort but I've never had a problem wearing the EarSonics for hours. They tick the other boxes, too - good deep bass but not IE8 levels, warm sound, pretty easy-going overall considering it's a high-end BA monitor, and so on.
  


kendric said:


> Hi Joker. I had read your thread since 2011 and has managed to make fabulous purchases such as the MD Tributes then the Ortofon e-Q7 and finally the FX700.
> 
> I am just curious if you have heard the current FX850s and your comments & impressions of them. Thanks in advance. Cheers!


 
  
 Haven't had a chance to try these - the last new JVC release I got my hands on was the FXD80.
  


davidcotton said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> I'm curious more than anything.  What would you think would be a good upgrade to the old westone 3?  I've heard westone 2 (great apart from a lack of bass)klipsch x10, tf10.  Was just looking for something a little more off the beaten path.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The W3 is pretty unique in signature. The 1964-V3 and V6-Stage do come to mind, albeit with the same reservations you have about the StageDivers - the V6-Stage is pretty flat in the bass region (a-la SD-2) while the V3 is quite bass-heavy (but slightly more balanced than the SD-3 nonetheless). Could be a case where neither one hits your goldilocks zone. 
  
 The rarely-mentioned Ultrasone IQ reminded me of the W3 in many ways - strong bass, strong treble, some dryness/analytical tendencies in the mids and treble, not bright despite treble energy, and so on. With some simple mods it actually sounds very good. Ditto on the discontinued Phonak PFE 232 - it's very similar, and doesn't require modding, but isolation is a little worse and the mids never sound quite as good. 
  
 Two more cheap(er) options I would consider trying: GR07 BE and DN-1000. Neither really channels the W3 but they're strong performers, especially considering the cost. Isolation could be better but it's not terrible.
  


sebsg said:


> Nope, and I already tried on multiple sources: phone, computer, etc
> Edit: at the L-shaped plug, where the cable itself comes out, it seems a bit stretched/bent as if it was pulled out and then put back


 
  
 The internal wire is most likely broken. If you have a soldering iron you can fix this by snipping off a bit of the cable and putting on a new plug.
  


huckfinn said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> Thanks for all your advice!!
> 
> I've been going through quite a few pages but I can't find anything that answer my issue: I quite enjoy the Momentum on ear and would like to find something similar in iems.....any suggestion (possibly at half the price of the MOE).
> ...


 
  
 MH1C would have been my first choice in that price range. Have you considered just getting new eartips for it instead? Foam tips should solve your problem. 
  
 If you go up to ~100-150 in price, there are a few options such as the Yamaha EPH-100 (bassier, but not hugely so). The Shure SE215 is another option that's less expensive and similar in signature. The Phonak 012, if you can find it, would also be a solid choice - not as bassy as the EPH-100, SE215, or MH1C but still smooth and warm-sounding, and very good overall. Great fit and comfort, too.
  


nicolo said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have the Hifiman RE-600 and love it. I am looking for another pair of universal IEMs. I prefer a balanced presentation with nice treble extension, good mid-range and deep accurate bass. Basically a slight V shaped sound signature.
> What would your recommendation be for universal IEMs below $600? Customs are not an option for me.


 
  
 Couple of options I would read up on:
  
*Dunu DN-2000*: hybrid earphone with a less v-shaped signature compared to the cheaper DN-1000 but still no lack of bass impact or treble. Relatively inexpensive at ~$315 and would make for a good RE-600 compliment IMO
*EarSonics SM64*: has deep bass and a warm tone, with strong mids and slightly relaxed treble. Not quite v-shaped, but it's halfway there. It's warmer than the RE-600 and would make for an interesting change. The Westone W40 is not too different, but has less deep bass emphasis and slightly darker tone overall
*Lear LUF-4F*: v-shaped quad-BA earphone. Has more bass than RE-600 and bright, crisp, extended treble with lots of upper midrange energy. Mids sound clearer than W40 (for example) despite v-shaped signature. There are two other versions as well, one with more bass and one with more treble.
*Olasonic Flat-4 Nami*: very clear-sounding earphones with a mildly v-shaped signature. Very tight bass and even brighter than LUF-4F (closer to the LUF-4C, which has emphasized treble).


----------



## nicolo

ljokerl said:


> Couple of options I would read up on:
> 
> *Dunu DN-2000*: hybrid earphone with a less v-shaped signature compared to the cheaper DN-1000 but still no lack of bass impact or treble. Relatively inexpensive at ~$315 and would make for a good RE-600 compliment IMO
> *EarSonics SM64*: has deep bass and a warm tone, with strong mids and slightly relaxed treble. Not quite v-shaped, but it's halfway there. It's warmer than the RE-600 and would make for an interesting change. The Westone W40 is not too different, but has less deep bass emphasis and slightly darker tone overall
> ...


 
 Thanks for the response. The Earsonics sound interesting.
 On another note:Have you heard the Sennheiser IE800. A guy i know is asking for $650 for an almost new pair?


----------



## Retrias

ljokerl said:


> I would say EarSonics SM64 based on those requirements. Not having tried the SD-3S (the new small version) I'm not sure how it fares in comfort but I've never had a problem wearing the EarSonics for hours. They tick the other boxes, too - good deep bass but not IE8 levels, warm sound, pretty easy-going overall considering it's a high-end BA monitor, and so on.


 
 thanks for the answer joker , I tried the stagedivers , and I feel there is something cut off on the SD3, and somehow prefer the SD2. Didnt quite like the SM64 either, I think I should give the SDs another listen at the store , to find out which one of the two I like best. the comfort is pretty fine on the stagediver


----------



## huckfinn

> MH1C would have been my first choice in that price range. Have you considered just getting new eartips for it instead? Foam tips should solve your problem.
> 
> If you go up to ~100-150 in price, there are a few options such as the Yamaha EPH-100 (bassier, but not hugely so). The Shure SE215 is another option that's less expensive and similar in signature. The Phonak 012, if you can find it, would also be a solid choice - not as bassy as the EPH-100, SE215, or MH1C but still smooth and warm-sounding, and very good overall. Great fit and comfort, too.


 
 Many many thnx!
 I'll have a look into those.
  
 The problem with the MH1C is also, forgot to mention, that they "don't work" with my ALO RX. Unless I keep the little "button" pressed all the time.....no problem if I use the Leckerton UHA-6S.MKII though.....


----------



## MoonYeol

huckfinn said:


> > MH1C would have been my first choice in that price range. Have you considered just getting new eartips for it instead? Foam tips should solve your problem.
> >
> > If you go up to ~100-150 in price, there are a few options such as the Yamaha EPH-100 (bassier, but not hugely so). The Shure SE215 is another option that's less expensive and similar in signature. The Phonak 012, if you can find it, would also be a solid choice - not as bassy as the EPH-100, SE215, or MH1C but still smooth and warm-sounding, and very good overall. Great fit and comfort, too.
> 
> ...




Recable and try over ear? I always wore my MH1C over ear despite cable. I got better sound with a deeper fit. More controlled bass and clearer treble. If you really push them into your ears they should stay. The new hybrids are among the easiest to get a seal with that I've tried.


----------



## Ardian

Hi to all! 
  
 I need your help.
 I want a budget IEM that would be very very comfortable (weight light and tiny house), something also to sleep with! Having the microphone and with the better sound at less than 50$.
  
 I've seen something like Philips SHE 3595, very budget but I wonder if they have wood quality sound?
 The perfect IEM with these characteristics seems the Sony XBA-1 ip.. very good looking, budget and with a balanced armature!! 
  
 Do you have other suggestions?
  
 Thank you 
  
  
  
 P.S. I have the Martin Logan Mikros 90, Shure SE215 s.e. and the Sony MH1c. The best is ML90.


----------



## moedawg140

This is an epic multi-IEM review comparison thread, ljokerl!  I'm wondering, and please forgive me if something has changed, but I am wondering your thoughts on the Shure SE846, if you have gotten a chance to listen to them yet?  
  
 Thanks, and great job on all you do on Head-Fi!


----------



## SebsG

Anyone about an inexpensive recabling for the UE600vi?

 Also, for my friend, he wants an IEM (~$75 budget) that is "good for everything" does that exist?? Lol, but seriously, I think he would like a warm and smooth sounding IEM b/c he liked my 9927 and ue600. Also tank-like build quality is a must, especially the cables.

-Seb (I like "signing" after longer than average posts x'D)


----------



## davidcotton

ljokerl said:


> The W3 is pretty unique in signature. The 1964-V3 and V6-Stage do come to mind, albeit with the same reservations you have about the StageDivers - the V6-Stage is pretty flat in the bass region (a-la SD-2) while the V3 is quite bass-heavy (but slightly more balanced than the SD-3 nonetheless). Could be a case where neither one hits your goldilocks zone.
> 
> The rarely-mentioned Ultrasone IQ reminded me of the W3 in many ways - strong bass, strong treble, some dryness/analytical tendencies in the mids and treble, not bright despite treble energy, and so on. With some simple mods it actually sounds very good. Ditto on the discontinued Phonak PFE 232 - it's very similar, and doesn't require modding, but isolation is a little worse and the mids never sound quite as good.
> 
> Two more cheap(er) options I would consider trying: GR07 BE and DN-1000. Neither really channels the W3 but they're strong performers, especially considering the cost. Isolation could be better but it's not terrible.


 
 Thanks for that, seems that I tend towards unusual signatures.  Last iem I really liked was the venerable Sennheiser ie7.  Loved it apart from the isolation.  The main problem I have with the westone is the fit which can be a bit finnicky, even with the trufit tips now.  As usual, medium on the right is too big, whilst small is, yep too small!  When I mention isolation the least it has to do is to cut out people talking if possible.  With regards to 1964 ears, you mention the v6 stage, any reason to discount the 6 it'self?
  
 Thanks


----------



## MoonYeol

sebsg said:


> Anyone about an inexpensive recabling for the UE600vi?
> 
> Also, for my friend, he wants an IEM (~$75 budget) that is "good for everything" does that exist?? Lol, but seriously, I think he would like a warm and smooth sounding IEM b/c he liked my 9927 and ue600. Also tank-like build quality is a must, especially the cables.
> 
> -Seb (I like "signing" after longer than average posts x'D)




Built like a tank, smooth, warm. Sounds like MH1C. Though the cables are annoying as hell.


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> Anyone about an inexpensive recabling for the UE600vi?
> 
> Also, for my friend, he wants an IEM (~$75 budget) that is "good for everything" does that exist?? Lol, but seriously, I think he would like a warm and smooth sounding IEM b/c he liked my 9927 and ue600. Also tank-like build quality is a must, especially the cables.
> 
> -Seb (I like "signing" after longer than average posts x'D)


 

  no , but ue600 sounds like that , may be the xba-c10 ( lacks any kind of serous detail ). ety mc5 can do .


----------



## ljokerl

nicolo said:


> Thanks for the response. The Earsonics sound interesting.
> On another note:Have you heard the Sennheiser IE800. A guy i know is asking for $650 for an almost new pair?


 

 Yea, I reviewed it here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor . Beware that it has a lot of bass - more than the EarSonics and others.
  
  


huckfinn said:


> Many many thnx!
> I'll have a look into those.
> 
> The problem with the MH1C is also, forgot to mention, that they "don't work" with my ALO RX. Unless I keep the little "button" pressed all the time.....no problem if I use the Leckerton UHA-6S.MKII though.....


 
  
 Just needs one of these for the ALO. Using only the green end will solve the problem. 
  

  
  


ardian said:


> Hi to all!
> 
> I need your help.
> I want a budget IEM that would be very very comfortable (weight light and tiny house), something also to sleep with! Having the microphone and with the better sound at less than 50$.
> ...


 
  
 The SHE3595 is based on the 3580/3590, which are well-regarded. I quite like them. The XBA-1iP might be too long (in terms of housing length) to sleep with if you sleep in your side. Two more options you might consider (although they are not necessarily better than the Philips sound-wise) are the Brainwavz M5 (mic version) and the UE500vi. 
  


moedawg140 said:


> This is an epic multi-IEM review comparison thread, ljokerl!  I'm wondering, and please forgive me if something has changed, but I am wondering your thoughts on the Shure SE846, if you have gotten a chance to listen to them yet?
> 
> Thanks, and great job on all you do on Head-Fi!


 
  
 Yes, I have the SE846. Unfortunately it's enormous and not comfortable for more than 45 mins at a time so I haven't used it much. Sound is good but hasn't impressed me quite enough to suffer through the pain of using them.
  


sebsg said:


> Anyone about an inexpensive recabling for the UE600vi?
> 
> Also, for my friend, he wants an IEM (~$75 budget) that is "good for everything" does that exist?? Lol, but seriously, I think he would like a warm and smooth sounding IEM b/c he liked my 9927 and ue600. Also tank-like build quality is a must, especially the cables.
> 
> -Seb (I like "signing" after longer than average posts x'D)


 
  
 UE600 can be found in that budget oftentimes - good bet if he liked it. Another one to check out would be the Fidue A63 - it has more bass than the BA-based UE600 and the Monoprice, which makes the sound a little mainstream, but it's not bloated or muddy-sounding.
  


davidcotton said:


> Thanks for that, seems that I tend towards unusual signatures.  Last iem I really liked was the venerable Sennheiser ie7.  Loved it apart from the isolation.  The main problem I have with the westone is the fit which can be a bit finnicky, even with the trufit tips now.  As usual, medium on the right is too big, whilst small is, yep too small!  When I mention isolation the least it has to do is to cut out people talking if possible.  With regards to 1964 ears, you mention the v6 stage, any reason to discount the 6 it'self?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 I've only tried the -Stage version of the V6, unfortunately.


----------



## moedawg140

ljokerl said:


> Yea, I reviewed it here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor . Beware that it has a lot of bass - more than the EarSonics and others.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Thank you, ljokerl, for your quick reply, I appreciate it.  The Shure SE846's are pretty big, but comfort, and the audio it emits can be _drastically _improved if you invest in the Sensaphonics Custom Sleeves that are specifically made for the Shure SE846.  I own them, and they feel like I am literally wearing nothing, because the sleeves are the highest quality silicone, and the full shell mold they create of your ear impressions goes as far as the second bend of the ear canal and covers/envelops the incisura, and concha (cymba and cavum) parts of the ear, resulting in the ultimate in comfort (more comfortable than acrylic because of its more forgiving and molding properties).  I even have them in the Crystal Blue color, which won't discolor, unlike other clear (opaque) silicone sleeves (if your pH is such that will discolor the clear (opaque) color).  I can't send a link without the message being immediately sent to moderators on here, (I'm still new on here and don't have post pic or link-to rights yet) so you can just google "Sensaphonics Custom Sleeves for SE846".  I'm going to post a review of the Sensaphonics Custom Sleeves on the Shure SE846 Impressions Thread once I obtain rights to post pictures.  Give the custom sleeves a try, I think that if you do invest in them, you'll enjoy the Shure SE846 that much more.


----------



## nicolo

ljokerl said:


> Yea, I reviewed it here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor . Beware that it has a lot of bass - more than the EarSonics and others.


 
 Thanks for responding so quickly. Does the bass of the IE800's overwhelm the mids. Is the bass very exaggerated? Thanks in advance!!


----------



## ljokerl

nicolo said:


> Thanks for responding so quickly. Does the bass of the IE800's overwhelm the mids. Is the bass very exaggerated? Thanks in advance!!


 
  
 Exaggerated, yes, but the mids are not overwhelmed. A lesser earphone would struggle with the bass quantity of the IE800 but for the Sennheisers its only a minor handicap, so to speak.


----------



## garcsa

Cool guy  :
  
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qYbK7yC3tE
  





  
 " Its only a rock'n'roll but I like it! " 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
(maybe he's me.....?    
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


 )


----------



## z28dreams

What should I try next?
  
 Meelectronics M9P - Enjoyed how fun they sounded (V-shaped), but mids were very lacking
 Vsonic GR02 - hated these.  Way too harsh all around - treble was piercing and bass overwhelmed everything
 SoundMagic E10 - incredibly boring to me.  Sound kind of neutral and just don't do it for me.  I'd compare them to a $5 set of IEMs to my ears
 JVC Marshmallows - surprisingly really like the punch of the bass and overall sound, but it gets a bit crackly and highs aren't that clear
  
 Looking to keep these cheap (<$30) since reviews rarely match what I expect and I go through IEM's like crazy losing/breaking them.
  
 Philips SHE3580?  JVC HAFX40?  Something else?  These would be used for all genres.  I'd ideally like to have good mid-bass punch, forward mids, and highs that don't kill my ears with terrible piercing noises.


----------



## nicolo

ljokerl said:


> Exaggerated, yes, but the mids are not overwhelmed. A lesser earphone would struggle with the bass quantity of the IE800 but for the Sennheisers its only a minor handicap, so to speak.


 
  
 Thanks. I will be buying this then LOL. At $600 now, it's a sweet, sweet deal. Unfortunately the WIFE is going to be PISSED, after my splurge on other goodies like the Geek Pulse & Wave campaigns, LCD-X, Hifiman HE-560 recently. I must be a glutton for punishment. Good thing i stopped buying expensive scotch and consuming them straightaway.Bad thing is i replaced that with Headphone-itis. Good thing is that i could sell the IE800 and the other stuff at near/above cost in the future. Hopefully my awesome wife understands that!!


----------



## suman134

z28dreams said:


> What should I try next?
> 
> Meelectronics M9P - Enjoyed how fun they sounded (V-shaped), but mids were very lacking
> Vsonic GR02 - hated these.  Way too harsh all around - treble was piercing and bass overwhelmed everything
> ...


 
  
    brainwavz m1 , hisound crystal , not fx40 , its the sparkiest phone i have heard till date . ath ckx5 can be good and you can consider . if you  dont want sparks highs , hisound and pny midtwon 200 will do good , one more can be xba-c10 , now they are really cheap and even if these phones lack sound stage , its a good sounding phone for its price .


----------



## ozkan

z28dreams said:


> What should I try next?
> 
> Meelectronics M9P - Enjoyed how fun they sounded (V-shaped), but mids were very lacking
> Vsonic GR02 - hated these.  Way too harsh all around - treble was piercing and bass overwhelmed everything
> ...


 
 Xiaomi Piston 2.0/IF Edition can be what you are after. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You can buy from here


----------



## garcsa

z28dreams said:


> What should I try next?
> 
> Meelectronics M9P - Enjoyed how fun they sounded (V-shaped), but mids were very lacking
> Vsonic GR02 - hated these.  Way too harsh all around - treble was piercing and bass overwhelmed everything
> ...


 
 Dunu DN12!
  
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/DUNU-Trident-DN-12-DN12-In-Ear-Dynamic-Earbud-Earphone-Earpiece-/281316100893?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item417fbf0b1d


----------



## HeadHoncho

Hi Joker,
  
 Have you compared audio sources? By that I don't mean proper DAPs/DACs, etc. I mean a not-so-high-end-source, like a Sansa Clip+ vs a FiiO E6 being used with a phone, or just a standalone phone. Till now, I have mostly used my phone to listen to music (currently using a Sony Xperia). I can't afford to purchase a high end DAP/DAC, and also, don't feel like lugging around an additional piece of equipment in my pockets. Even leaving out the money/extra equipment thing, do you think sound quality wise a Sansa Clip+ will have any major advantage over a phone? I generally use 320kbps MP3 files and IEMs, no headphones.


----------



## ljokerl

z28dreams said:


> What should I try next?
> 
> Meelectronics M9P - Enjoyed how fun they sounded (V-shaped), but mids were very lacking
> Vsonic GR02 - hated these.  Way too harsh all around - treble was piercing and bass overwhelmed everything
> ...


 
  
 The FX40 is quite bright. The 3580 is a better match for what you want, except it doesn't have particularly forward mids. More so than the M9, but still not forward. The Dunu DN-12 Trident recommended above might be a pretty good option, too.
  


headhoncho said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Have you compared audio sources? By that I don't mean proper DAPs/DACs, etc. I mean a not-so-high-end-source, like a Sansa Clip+ vs a FiiO E6 being used with a phone, or just a standalone phone. Till now, I have mostly used my phone to listen to music (currently using a Sony Xperia). I can't afford to purchase a high end DAP/DAC, and also, don't feel like lugging around an additional piece of equipment in my pockets. Even leaving out the money/extra equipment thing, do you think sound quality wise a Sansa Clip+ will have any major advantage over a phone? I generally use 320kbps MP3 files and IEMs, no headphones.


 
  
 I don't have a Fiio E6 and phone audio quality varies quite a lot. iPhones are definitely comparable to a Clip+, for example, but my previous-generation HTC Android phone was pretty crap and my Clip+ was significantly better.


----------



## mark2410

lol, everytime i see this thread its grown like 20 pages.


----------



## AgentJ

Hey Joker - I'm back! 

I was doing fine with the JVC FXD80 (the mic version, it's either the FDR or the FRD) and I even upgraded my Bose OE1 to some Beyer DT770 which I've enjoyed listening with a lot. 

Only thing is that I somehow managed to lose the JVCs and I was then using my old AM800 - until I somehow managed to loosen the connection between the cable and one of the buds. 

I'm pretty happy getting another pair of the JVCs but I've noticed that a few of the previously recommended IEMs have been retired, so is there a replacement for them? I wouldn't mind spending a tad more but considering that I've just gone through £60's worth of IEM, I probably shouldn't spend too much 

If getting a pair without the mic will considerably increase value or sound quality, I might just go for that as well. 

Cheers again man! 



Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## suman134

agentj said:


> Hey Joker - I'm back!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
     a better value ? it will be hard but yes similarly price to sq phones that i can recommend are rha-ma750 , if you want some more balance re-400 , hf5 can be considered .


----------



## muhen

Hey ljokerl,
  
 I signed up to enter the Noble contest, but as a longtime lurker, I just wanted to thank you for all your help and reviews here!


----------



## SebsG

Whats a relatively inexpensive IEM ($50) that has good clarity, while also being fun?


----------



## AgentJ

sebsg said:


> Whats a relatively inexpensive IEM ($50) that has good clarity, while also being fun?


 
 I'd probably put a vote forward for the Vsonic GR02 or the VSD1/S. 
  


suman134 said:


> a better value ? it will be hard but yes similarly price to sq phones that i can recommend are rha-ma750 , if you want some more balance re-400 , hf5 can be considered .


 
  
 I had considered the MA750s before, but at £80, I cant really justify spending that much on them - although I've realised that the JVCs for £30 must be great deal then. My only complaint with the JVC was the slightly recessed mids, but I guess that would be something I'd have to live with (or maybe try to use an EQ) if it saves me £40 then. 
  
 edit: I hear that the FXT90 are a bit better - is this true, and would it be worth the extra £20?


----------



## vidzegg

Hello dear Ijokerl,  
Firstly, let me say that your work in this thread is of phenomenal importance and impact. I have come to rely on your reviews and depth of your insights becomes apparent to me when I read the review again after listening to the IEMs. I can only thank you for doing it for all of us. 
  
  
Now the brief story, I am a wannabe Audiophile for about 1 year. I tried MEElectronics A161p,  mostly based on your ratings last year and I really liked its clarity and sound signature( Clean quick bass,great mids) . It’s fragile cable gave up on me 3 months ago and I have been looking for a worthy replacement and upgrade. I tried  UE600 Vi because I was getting a really good deal (plus its sound was mid centric which I thought I liked, wanted to try dynamic driver etc) on it but was underwhelmed by its sound quality ( Low clarity, Bass is not enjoyable like clean bass of 161P). Your full review at innerfidelity.com mentions that it “measures better than it sounds” and I could not agree more, but I read that after buying. Finally, after reading around, I ordered highly respected Fischer Audio DBA-02 MkII with high expectations and while I agree that it’s very detailed and analytical, I learned that I do not like bright IEM’s and it was not musical enough for me. It was also somewhat difficult to get good volume out of my Samsung galaxy S3 with it so I returned it after a few days.
  
Now the conundrum, I don’t know which IEM to get next. My budget has significantly expanded to , say, up to $250  as I have realized that its important to get a good one. Based on the experiences above, my ideal IEM would have
  
1.       1) *Mids and bass centric signature* with *gentle treble*. ( I would give 60 % importance to mids, 40 % to Bass, would EQ the treble up if needed),  "Very very good bass with greatest possible  mids " would be the title of my sonic fantasy. No V- shaped signature for me.  
  
          2) As much  clarity and detail as I can muster for this kind of signature.
  
          3) Above average soundstage (161P was somewhat intimate and “in your heads” as you pointed out, that is the only thing that I did  not like about it… besides the build quality, of course).
  
          4)   Easy to drive with Samsung galaxy S3 (A161 > UE 600vi > DBA 02 mk II.
  
          5) High musicality ( Whatever that means) , I listen to Rock, soul and  pop, love a few vocalist. 
  
          6 )Built-in mic and remote, if possible, one button is good enough
  
  
I am not getting enough time to research and am thinking about reordering MEElectronics A161p as it meets most of my requirements. I am usually a silent lurker at the forum but it suddenly occurred to me that I could request your help like so many others.
I would really appreciate if you can give me a few options about IEM’s that are similar to 161P but may be considered an upgrade sonically.


----------



## suman134

sebsg said:


> Whats a relatively inexpensive IEM ($50) that has good clarity, while also being fun?


 
  
    i will go for ue600 , its fun but lacks some bass , but if you fun includes bigger bass , yes , vsd1/s will do good . or you can go for brainwavz s1 too .


agentj said:


> I'd probably put a vote forward for the Vsonic GR02 or the VSD1/S.
> 
> 
> I had considered the MA750s before, but at £80, I cant really justify spending that much on them - although I've realised that the JVCs for £30 must be great deal then. My only complaint with the JVC was the slightly recessed mids, but I guess that would be something I'd have to live with (or maybe try to use an EQ) if it saves me £40 then.
> ...


 
  
     to me fxt90 is better , not far far better but it suits my taste more then ma-750 . as i said you cant get value like that or value like ue600 for $44 or xba-3 for $70 , you can look for this kind of deals and will find it if lucky . just think like , if the JVCs improve with eq will the ma-750 wont ? will the eq patch the short comings ? if yes , it should be a nice deal , the best part of ma-750 is its package ( plenty of eartips to chose from , a huge hard case ) and its build , i will say its built like a tank .


----------



## Francisk

vidzegg said:


> Now the conundrum, I don’t know which IEM to get next. My budget has significantly expanded to , say, up to $250  as I have realized that its important to get a good one. Based on the experiences above, my ideal IEM would have
> 
> 1.       1) *Mids and bass centric signature* with *gentle treble*. ( I would give 60 % importance to mids, 40 % to Bass, would EQ the treble up if needed),  "Very very good bass with greatest possible  mids " would be the title of my sonic fantasy. No V- shaped signature for me.
> 
> ...


 
 Sounds more like a Vsonic GR07 Bass Edition which is going for $179 at Amazon


----------



## ljokerl

mark2410 said:


> lol, everytime i see this thread its grown like 20 pages.


 
  
 That just means you need to look in more often 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


agentj said:


> Hey Joker - I'm back!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 If the JVCs were my top pick for your requirements a month or two back, they still are - I haven't come across a direct replacement. 
  
 The FXT90 is certainly not as recessed in the midrange but I can't put a dollar value on that.
  


muhen said:


> Hey ljokerl,
> 
> I signed up to enter the Noble contest, but as a longtime lurker, I just wanted to thank you for all your help and reviews here!


 
  
 Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


sebsg said:


> Whats a relatively inexpensive IEM ($50) that has good clarity, while also being fun?


 
  
 My pick would be the VSD1S from VSonic.
  
  


vidzegg said:


> Hello dear Ijokerl,
> Firstly, let me say that your work in this thread is of phenomenal importance and impact. I have come to rely on your reviews and depth of your insights becomes apparent to me when I read the review again after listening to the IEMs. I can only thank you for doing it for all of us.
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 The IEMs I could recommend for that type of sound - HiFiMan and TDK primarily - lack the remote feature. It is also unclear how the dual-armature TDK will perform out of the S3 - in my experience phones and computers are better paired with more stable dynamic-driver or single armature earphones than with more demanding multi-armature earphones. This may be part of the problem you had with the Fischer set.
  
 In your case it's probably better to just go for another A161.


----------



## AgentJ

Hey Joker,

I can understand that putting a value in the differences between the FXD80 and FXT90 is hard and pretty subjective, but is the difference fairly noticeable? 

And are there many more differences between them? 

Cheers again! 

Edit: I've just had a look through the FXD80/70/60 thread (didn't know it mentioned the FXT90) and it seems like the differences aren't as big as I thought - and I didn't realise that burning them in would take over 100 hours. A few users also said that the mid-bass gets a bit better with burn in so I'll try to burn my new pair properly (I had maybe 50 hours of just normal listening on them) 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## suman134

vidzegg said:


> Hello dear Ijokerl,
> Firstly, let me say that your work in this thread is of phenomenal importance and impact. I have come to rely on your reviews and depth of your insights becomes apparent to me when I read the review again after listening to the IEMs. I can only thank you for doing it for all of us.
> 
> 
> ...


 
 only one phone comes to my mind , and even it cant fulfill all your criteria . xba-h3 can fulfill some (  not the best possible mids for sure , and you cant get the best mid at $250 ) . 2nd will be rha-ma750 .


----------



## garcsa

Hi there, Which IEMs are on this X3? Thanks!


----------



## eke2k6

It's a Sennheiser IE80.


----------



## garcsa

eke2k6 said:


> It's a Sennheiser IE80.


 
 Thanks, the guy on local online market place offers x3  with these IEMs for $200 .... I'll meet he tomorrow.....


----------



## eke2k6

garcsa said:


> Thanks, the guy on local online market place offers x3  with these IEMs for $200 .... I'll meet he tomorrow.....


 
  
 That's an interesting price. Make sure the IE80 isn't fake.


----------



## garcsa

eke2k6 said:


> That's an interesting price. Make sure the IE80 isn't fake.


 
 Really suspicious price. Yep, thanks.


----------



## vidzegg

> Now the conundrum, I don’t know which IEM to get next. My budget has significantly expanded to , say, up to $250  as I have realized that its important to get a good one. Based on the experiences above, my ideal IEM would have
> 
> 1.       1) *Mids and bass centric signature* with *gentle treble*. ( I would give 60 % importance to mids, 40 % to Bass, would EQ the treble up if needed),  "Very very good bass with greatest possible  mids " would be the title of my sonic fantasy. No V- shaped signature for me.
> 
> ...


 
  


francisk said:


> Sounds more like a Vsonic GR07 Bass Edition which is going for $179 at Amazon


 
  


ljokerl said:


> The IEMs I could recommend for that type of sound - HiFiMan and TDK primarily - lack the remote feature. It is also unclear how the dual-armature TDK will perform out of the S3 - in my experience phones and computers are better paired with more stable dynamic-driver or single armature earphones than with more demanding multi-armature earphones. This may be part of the problem you had with the Fischer set.
> 
> In your case it's probably better to just go for another A161.


 
  


suman134 said:


> only one phone comes to my mind , and even it cant fulfill all your criteria . xba-h3 can fulfill some (  not the best possible mids for sure , and you cant get the best mid at $250 ) . 2nd will be rha-ma750 .


 
  
  
 Thank you all for the helpful responses, I am looking into  GR07 BE and XBA- H3 and TDK BA-200
 MHA-750 has the dreaded  " slightly V shaped signature " in reviews... deal breaker... No prominent highs for me in foreseeable future.
  
 To give you an idea, my full size headphone is Sony MA 900 and I am  HD 650 aspirant....dark and warm signatures.. I am always fixated on mids/vocals  but am realizing the fun good bass can provide  and that I am very sensitive to sibilance ( BD DT 990, DBA-02 mk II).
  
 So  so-called criteria above can be revised as
  
 1) mid centric signature ( lush, thick, sweet, full sounding etc) with very very good bass ( punchy, clean, extending, deep etc)
  
 2) easy to drive on GS3 aka high sensitivity, low impedance
  
 3) Better than A161P as "upgrade" is the buzzword
  
  
 Everything else is secondary  and I can compromise on inline controls, comfort, microphonics, other sonic attributes etc
  
 Tentative budget is up to 250 $
  
 Can you please give me a few more recommendation with these less restrictive criteria?


----------



## Francisk

vidzegg said:


> Thank you all for the helpful responses, I am looking into  GR07 BE and XBA- H3 and TDK BA-200
> MHA-750 has the dreaded  " slightly V shaped signature " in reviews... deal breaker... No prominent highs for me in foreseeable future.
> 
> To give you an idea, my full size headphone is Sony MA 900 and I am  HD 650 aspirant....dark and warm signatures.. I am always fixated on mids/vocals  but am realizing the fun good bass can provide  and that I am very sensitive to sibilance ( BD DT 990, DBA-02 mk II).
> ...




Still sounds to me like the Vsonic GR07 BE which is very balanced sounding with nice extended bottom end (not bass head levels though) that does not leak into the mids. Mid presentation is nice and warm and highs which is not sibilant like the DBA02 MkII but very detailed.


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

How do you guys compare the GR07 BE to the JBL Synchros Reflect Non Bluetooth model. 

I want to know basically is the GR07 BE honestly worth the 100 dollars more over those JBL's. 

I'm looking for clear and detailed vocals like the Westone 2 supposedly has, more bass than the the S4, X Series by Klipsch. Not to too harsh on treble. 

I own the S4 by Klipsch and they are okay for 50 dollars but they are muddy with bass and can't really handle EQ tuning. 

I listen to Rap, Trap, Dubstep, Rock, Techno, Trance. 

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk


----------



## 1clearhead

*Hello Joker*,
  
 Have you ever heard of these? They go by the name "*Ivery IS-1*" (or *Liberty 1*). They're making waves here in China, so I happen to buy one for just 40 RMB (around $6 US dollars). They sound incredible and basically out did all my IEM's! It does need burn-in time to open up (store owner told me 50 or more hours), but WOW! Does it open up!
  
 1. Good build quality
 2. Details are extremely vivid and Analytical
 3. Vocals are breath-taking and realistic (not forward or laidback)
 4. Bass is quick, stable and clear. Incredible sub-bass (not boomy, knor bloated)
 5. Good soundstage –you can hear the different instruments and distinguish them
 6. Overall, extremely balanced!
  
 They also have a special switch (the first I've ever seen) for converting the signal to what ever source you're using (or reverse polarity for MIC and ground wire). So, basically you can use it for professional audio monitoring or your smart phone for incoming/outgoing calls. Incredible concept by this company!
  
 Take a look at some PIX and enjoy!
  




  
  




  
  
  
 Hope you enjoyed the pix as much as I did!
  
 Please let me know what's your thoughts......
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
*PS.* -They're are starting to sell to the US market from as low as $12 to $30 dollars! I'm sure they're not fakes for the moment, for they haven't gain a large reputation, as of yet towards the US market.


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I can understand that putting a value in the differences between the FXD80 and FXT90 is hard and pretty subjective, but is the difference fairly noticeable?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, you would definitely notice the differences in sound signature, but not so much in performance (i.e. FXT90 might have a little more quantity of mid-bass and midrange, but with similar quality).
  


vidzegg said:


> Thank you all for the helpful responses, I am looking into  GR07 BE and XBA- H3 and TDK BA-200
> MHA-750 has the dreaded  " slightly V shaped signature " in reviews... deal breaker... No prominent highs for me in foreseeable future.
> 
> To give you an idea, my full size headphone is Sony MA 900 and I am  HD 650 aspirant....dark and warm signatures.. I am always fixated on mids/vocals  but am realizing the fun good bass can provide  and that I am very sensitive to sibilance ( BD DT 990, DBA-02 mk II).
> ...


 
  
 TDK BA200 or potentially Sony MDR-7550 if you're okay with crap isolation and the odd fit. These are not bass-heavy earphones, but if you're okay with the bass from the A161 they should work for you. They both have a warmer, less analytical sound compared to the A161P but that seems to be what you're after.
  


lost dark soul said:


> How do you guys compare the GR07 BE to the JBL Synchros Reflect Non Bluetooth model.
> 
> I want to know basically is the GR07 BE honestly worth the 100 dollars more over those JBL's.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Never tried those JBLs. The last ones I did try (the J22) were crap. The GR07 BE does not have more bass than the S4, the S4 is pretty bassy even though it's not great quality bass. If you want lots of bass while maintaining quality and good mids, you're looking at something like the Yamaha EPH-100.
  


1clearhead said:


> *Hello Joker*,
> 
> Have you ever heard of these? They go by the name "*Ivery IS-1*" (or *Liberty 1*). They're making waves here in China, so I happen to buy one for just 40 RMB (around $6 US dollars). They sound incredible and basically out did all my IEM's! It does need burn-in time to open up (store owner told me 50 or more hours), but WOW! Does it open up!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Nope, never heard of them. That switch is very smart though! There's a few other manufacturers that offer a ground/mic reversal switch but it's always in the form of a separate adapter.


----------



## AgentJ

> Yeah, you would definitely notice the differences in sound signature, but not so much in performance (i.e. FXT90 might have a little more quantity of mid-bass and midrange, but with similar quality).


 
  
 What exactly are the differences in the sound signature?
  
 Also, is there an easy to way me to test out which sound signatures I like without buying lots of different headphones?


----------



## Grayson73

1clearhead said:


> *Hello Joker*,
> 
> Have you ever heard of these? They go by the name "*Ivery IS-1*" (or *Liberty 1*). They're making waves here in China, so I happen to buy one for just 40 RMB (around $6 US dollars).* They sound incredible and basically out did all my IEM's! *It does need burn-in time to open up (store owner told me 50 or more hours), but WOW! Does it open up!


 
 What IEMs did they out do?


----------



## ebrian

1clearhead said:


> Have you ever heard of these? They go by the name "Ivery IS-1" (or Liberty 1). They're making waves here in China, so I happen to buy one for just 40 RMB (around $6 US dollars). They sound incredible and basically out did all my IEM's! It does need burn-in time to open up (store owner told me 50 or more hours), but WOW! Does it open up!


 
  
 Those tips look like Heir tips.  This might be like paying $6 (aliexpress) for a set of Heir tips and a free IEM!


----------



## Amitl

Hi all, and mighty Joker 
 i have a couple of questions regarding the JVC HA-FXT90.
 i currently own the VSonic VSD1S, i love the sound and was wondering if the FXT90
 would be an upgrade.
 is the FXT90's bass more/less impactful the the VSD1S'?
 is the FXT90's treble harsher\more prone to sibilance\more fatiguing than the VSD1S'?
 is the FXT90's fit just like any other straight-barrel, or is it more secure?
 and how would the JVC's compare to the Meelec A161P...?
 Thanx!!


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> What exactly are the differences in the sound signature?
> 
> Also, is there an easy to way me to test out which sound signatures I like without buying lots of different headphones?


 
  
 They're similar in the sense that both can be called v-shaped, but other than that they're pretty different. The FXT90 is more mid-bassy but also has warmer/thicker/fuller mids by a good margin. The FXD80 is more focused on deep bass vs mid-bass and has thinner/more withdrawn mids by a good margin. It also has a more "wide and flat" soundstage whereas the FXT90 is more forward and has better depth. 
  
 There's an app that lets you use reference headphones and pre-set EQ settings to "try out" different other sound signatures. I believe it's curated by GoldenEars and you can find it on their site.
  


amitl said:


> Hi all, and mighty Joker
> i have a couple of questions regarding the JVC HA-FXT90.
> i currently own the VSonic VSD1S, i love the sound and was wondering if the FXT90
> would be an upgrade.
> ...


 
  
 The FXT90 has more mid/upper bass, which gives it a slightly warmer/fuller/less mid-recessed sound, but overall bass quantity is not very different from the VSD1S. I guess I would give the JVCs the nod for slightly more bass, from memory at least. The FXT90 also has its treble emphasis lower down compared to VSonic sets. I personally prefer this as it reduces sibilance, but it can make the JVCs sound a little harsh. The A161P is very different, much flatter through the bass region with no mid-bass hump, clearer, a little more grainy but not as sparkly or extended in the treble region.
  
 The FXT90 has an angled nozzle. For me the fit was fine even over longer stretches.


----------



## Taveren

I second the fit of the FXT90 is good even for long listening sessions.

Just want to say that I really like the FA Consonance for my bass fix. was wondering how come it has not been mentioned often.


----------



## SebsG

I've decided on Dunu Tridents for my next IEM


----------



## 1clearhead

grayson73 said:


> What IEMs did they out do?


 
 Just keep in mind…..in sound alone they outperformed all my gems.
 But, in no way I’m saying the quality itself is better and there soundstage is the best.
 That I personally give tops honors to the *“IF Edition” Xiaomi Pistons*.
 Think about it,
 1.      *Quality:* You can’t get any IEM with the materials this dishes out for the price; Alloy housing, beryllium diaphragm, Kevlar wires, fancy case, carry pouch, full smart phone controls (with exception to some), metal shirt clip, and don’t forget, the first to add scent (the smell of chocolate) to their storage case.
  
 2.      *Sound:* With the beryllium diaphragm, these IEM’s produce an incredible realistic soundstage with a full-bodied sound that competes with full-size headphones. Don’t take my word for it, take a look at “amazon” and see for yourself. The reviews are astonishing!
  
 3.      *Price:* Do the math…..Quality + Sound = Best price for your money!
 But, this is where I was surprised by the *Ivery IS-1* (Liberty 1’s).
 1.      *Quality:* Actually, pretty good! Considering the price I paid for them and what you get; Tough plastic/alloy housing, good stable and quality wires, MIC remote with the special converter switch (between any audio source and smart phones),...a first, I think?…..Small and comfortable enough to please many people from different walks of life.
  
 2.      *Sound:* I don’t know the quality of diaphragm these IEM’s carry, but the sound just blew me away! Best analytical and realistic sound I’ve heard, by far! Even though soundstage might not top the Pistons, the overall sound range just betters them! They are mildly V shaped giving you just the right high notes, vocals, and sub-bass tones, when needed.
  
 3.      *Price:* This is a no brainer! In sound alone, I wonder if these will give the *Dunu DN-1000* a run for their money! And I’m saying a lot of money!
 Ok. Now you know where I’m coming at when I’m saying…..in sound alone they outperformed all my gems.
 I currently own and it put to shame all these models…..in no particular order, just off my head.
 1.      Soundmagic E10
 2.      Soundmagic ES10
 3.      Soundmagic PL30
 4.      Soundmagic E30
 5.      Soundmagic ES20
 6.      Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition
 7.      Vsonic GR99
 8.      Meelectronics SP51
 9.      Soundmagic ES18
 10.  Monoprice 8320
 11.  Philips SHE3580/90
 12.  Senmai SM-E1014
 13.  Senmai SM-E9106
 14.  Moxpad X3
 15.  XKDUN CK-700
 16.  Razor PAX09
 17.  Xiaomi Pistons 1.0, 2.0, 2.1, IF Edition
 18.  Xiaomi Paperback Edition
 19.  Shure SE215
 20.  Sony MDR-EX083
 I still like all my IEM’s for their unique sound signatures, but these are currently my new number 1's.
 Finally, if you decide to get them, please keep in mind to burn, burn, burn -at least 60 hours or more to get the audiophile quality signature it provides. So, make sure not to judge there sound right out the box.
 -Hope this gives you an idea where the Ivery IS-1 (Liberty 1) stands!


----------



## vidzegg

francisk said:


> Still sounds to me like the Vsonic GR07 BE which is very balanced sounding with nice extended bottom end (not bass head levels though) that does not leak into the mids. Mid presentation is nice and warm and highs which is not sibilant like the DBA02 MkII but very detailed.


 
  
 Well, that leaves me in no doubt about your recommendation as I indulge in this mental self pleasuring exercise called looking for a headphone on head-fi  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 GR07 BE still  among the options. Negs are slight bulk, 40 ohm impedance out of GS3 ( I am fed on 16 ohm and 13 ohm IEMs ), lack of inline controls etc... Still pondering.
  
  


ljokerl said:


> TDK BA200 or potentially Sony MDR-7550 if you're okay with crap isolation and the odd fit. These are not bass-heavy earphones, but if you're okay with the bass from the A161 they should work for you. They both have a warmer, less analytical sound compared to the A161P but that seems to be what you're after.


 
  
 As much as I am thrilled every time by response from Legendary Ijokerl, my quibbling goes on 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Ruled out MDR 7550 a while ago for the reasons you pointed above. TDK BA 200 is very much on the radar but for the 32 ohm impedance. I really want something easy to drive. So, I used the find feature on page 1 of this  thread for 16 ohm headphones  ( my A161p was 16 ohm, UE 600vi was 13 ohm ,both very easy to drive from GS3, DBA-02 was 43 ohm, had to return it) and another option , namely *RHB- EP2* came up. Its slightly dark signature is tempting for me, and seemingly meets most of my needs including inline controls.
  
 Your rating for  its sound is 8.5 ( 8.7 for A161p and, 8.9 for RHA MA 750) although you noted that mids on EP2 are clearer than both RHA-MA 750 and GR07 -BE despite all these having strong bass presence but you preferred the latter IEMs overall. My signature preference is leading me to EP2 but not much info is available about it on this forum other than your in depth review and comparisons.
  
 I am just wondering if you can comment on RHB- EP2 as an upgrade from  A161p (level of details etc). I know that you are not sitting in this heap of IEMs, doing comparisons on demand and that I feel silly asking all these questions but anything you say is sort of window for me as to what to expect after buying these.
  
 BTW, I am ordering A161p anyway, but want to try another IEM. Should have listened when they said " sorry about your wallet"


----------



## kendric

z28dreams said:


> What should I try next?
> 
> Meelectronics M9P - Enjoyed how fun they sounded (V-shaped), but mids were very lacking
> Vsonic GR02 - hated these.  Way too harsh all around - treble was piercing and bass overwhelmed everything
> ...




Based on my impression, it would be a tough fight between the Xiaomi Pistons and the Philips depending on what you seek in your ideal sound.

Xiaomi Pistons are definitely more lush-sounding than the Philips and leans towards the warm side.

Philips 3580/3590 triumphs the pistons imo when it comes to transparency and its relative clarity. Though if you have lots of sibilant recordings or have an usual paranoia towards the highs then the Pistons would be a better choice.

I would pick the Philips over the Pistons myself based on my preferences. And they sit slightly more snugly in my ears than the Pistons do.


----------



## kendric

1clearhead said:


> Just keep in mind…..in sound alone they outperformed all my gems.
> 
> 
> But, in no way I’m saying the quality itself is better and there soundstage is the best.
> ...




Now you got me curious about ljokerl's comments on the Liberty-1.

Meanwhile until they are available in Singapore. 

I need to wait for my JH13FPs to arrive and I am looking at the Victor JVC FX850 combo with Silver Dragon / DHC Symbiote Fusion Hybrid Cables for universal setup.

Shouldn't have come back to head-fi and go busting off my wallets yet again.. =(


----------



## ljokerl

taveren said:


> I second the fit of the FXT90 is good even for long listening sessions.
> 
> Just want to say that I really like the FA Consonance for my bass fix. was wondering how come it has not been mentioned often.


 
  
 I personally don't recommend them often because of the shaky availability in the US. 
  


vidzegg said:


> As much as I am thrilled every time by response from Legendary Ijokerl, my quibbling goes on
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I wish the EP2 was a little less harsh in the upper midrange - that's the biggest gripe I had with it because overall it is a very solid earphone. That said, it's not neutral-sounding - certainly not as neutral as the A161P. It's a little too mid-bassy/bloated compared to the A161P and as a result a little more congested and less detailed.


----------



## 1clearhead

ebrian said:


> Those tips look like Heir tips.  This might be like paying $6 (aliexpress) for a set of Heir tips and a free IEM!


 
 I know it sounds crazy! I just happen to walk in for a second time at this Mom and Pop headphone shop near my company and listened to these from a -"have a try rack" of in-ear headphones and was blown away! I happen to try each IEM straight down the line and was completely startled with these. Honestly, if I can recall, some of them ranged $500 dollars, or more! This guy only carries the most wanted headphones and IEM's in his store. That's why I went back!
  
 Now, these weren't the cheapest, by far. I know cheap when I see it. For example there's a fine-line I draw; if the wires are any thinner then the Philips SHE3580 or the Soundmagic ES10 and the sound is not convincing? I won't buy it! Simple as that. But the Liberty 1 seemed to fit the bill; good wires (thicker than 3580 and ES10), housing contours to most, if not all different ear shape canals. And yes, you said it! Nice ear tips! Can you really say you get the IEM's for free? Who knows!
  
 Again, comparing to all the IEM's in this store -the sound on these just blew me away! And that converter switch just hyped it even more!


----------



## huckfinn

....sorry about this....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I didn't understand which iems you are referring to.....


----------



## laon

1clearhead said:


> I know it sounds crazy! I just happen to walk in for a second time at this Mom and Pop headphone shop near my company and listened to these from a -"have a try rack" of in-ear headphones and was blown away! I happen to try each IEM straight down the line and was completely startled with these. Honestly, if I can recall, some of them ranged $500 dollars, or more! This guy only carries the most wanted headphones and IEM's in his store. That's why I went back!
> 
> Now, these weren't the cheapest, by far. I know cheap when I see it. For example there's a fine-line I draw; if the wires are any thinner then the Philips SHE3580 or the Soundmagic ES10 and the sound is not convincing? I won't buy it! Simple as that. But the Liberty 1 seemed to fit the bill; good wires (thicker than 3580 and ES10), housing contours to most, if not all different ear shape canals. And yes, you said it! Nice ear tips! Can you really say you get the IEM's for free? Who knows!
> 
> Again, comparing to all the IEM's in this store -the sound on these just blew me away! And that converter switch just hyped it even more! :happy_face1:




Do you get all the size for the tips? Have you compared IV-1 to IV-4?


----------



## 1clearhead

Hey Joker,
  
 I picked-up an extra pair of *Ivery IS-1 (Liberty 1)* just for you to keep and review. I'll be sending them out soon to you!
  
 I know you must think I'm crazy, but hell if I let this one pass you bye! You'll probably be just as startled as I was when I heard them and was told the price. Unreal! I actually went their to see if they carried the Vsonic brand when I went their for a second time, which they don't, and actually stumbled upon these.
  
 These are my new number 1's budget IEM's, now!
  
 Ps. -I can send you the IF's with the Liberty's in the same package, if interested in the IF's.
  
  
 -Hope is all good with you.


----------



## 1clearhead

laon said:


> Do you get all the size for the tips? Have you compared IV-1 to IV-4?


 
 Yes. There is small (already on the IEM), medium, and large. The good thing is that you can swap tips from other IEM's for comfort and it still sounds incredible.
  
 I did compare it to IV-1 and IV-4 and Liberty 1's incredible sound wins, hands down! Even though, the IV-4 has all metal housing, it doesn't stop the Liberty 1's from outperforming them. I never tried it against the IV-2 or IV-3, though.
  
 But, the hype in China is about the Liberty 1's. So, it must be that good.


----------



## Pastapipo

1clearhead said:


> Yes. There is small (already on the IEM), medium, and large. The good thing is that you can swap tips from other IEM's for comfort and it still sounds incredible.
> 
> I did compare it to IV-1 and IV-4 and Liberty 1's incredible sound wins, hands down! Even though, the IV-4 has all metal housing, it doesn't stop the Liberty 1's from outperforming them. I never tried it against the IV-2 or IV-3, though.
> 
> But, the hype in China is about the Liberty 1's. So, it must be that good.


 
  
 I ordered one, I'll keep you guys posted on my impressions.


----------



## 1clearhead

pastapipo said:


> I ordered one, I'll keep you guys posted on my impressions.


 
 Sounds good! I love to hear second opinions! I know my ears don't deceive me, or call me crazy!
  
 Please let us know.....


----------



## 1clearhead

huckfinn said:


> ....sorry about this....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 If you're referring to my post, they are the Ivery IS-1 (or Liberty 1's).
  
 Here's some quick pix......


----------



## huckfinn

thanks


----------



## danikus

Really hope you will be able to review vsd3/vsd3s soon.


----------



## shockdoc

Looking forward to joker's impressions of the Liberty 1.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a review of the OPPO PM-1 headphones here: http://theheadphonelist.com/oppo-pm-1-review-comparisons-lcd-2-hd600-560/
  


1clearhead said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I picked-up an extra pair of *Ivery IS-1 (Liberty 1)* just for you to keep and review. I'll be sending them out soon to you!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks! I replied to your PM. Will see where the IS-1 falls, and maybe send them over the InnerFidelity for some measurements. 
  


danikus said:


> Really hope you will be able to review vsd3/vsd3s soon.


 
  
 I hope so too!


----------



## Love Music

Hi Joker,
  
 I am looking for an iem around the 200-250 USD price range. The current iem that I have and enjoy is the CK100 but I want to get something cheaper with a similarish signature so I can use outside without being too worried that I'll drop/loose them. My preferred signature is something that sounds clear and detailed with a forward midrange/vocals and a treble that has good extension and air without sounding sibilant. Something that is airier with a bigger soundstage than the CK100 is a plus. I can't really describe the bass I like (definitely not a bass head though) but I do like to feel the impact of the drums, guitar solos/riffs and acoustic guitar. The 7550 sounds like the ideal iem that I'm looking for but I am not sure about the isolation and comfort of those. Is there something else I should be looking at that fits my description?   
  
 Thanks.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

ljokerl said:


> Yes, I have the SE846. Unfortunately it's enormous and not comfortable for more than 45 mins at a time so I haven't used it much. Sound is good but hasn't impressed me quite enough to suffer through the pain of using them.


 
  
 This surprises me. The foam tips aggravated my ears like crazy at first (which appears to be my fault for jiggling them around after they'd "settled"). but I don't understand how the size of the whole housing is an issue. You're not sticking the entire unit in your ear.


----------



## 16570

I currently have the IE80 and am in love with the sound signature, sound stage and all that good stuff. However, I commute long distances everyday and would appreciate any extra isolation I can get. I've tried the IE80s with Comply foam tips and while they did isolate more, I found the bass to be significantly muddied.
  
 My question is, are there any universal IEMs at $400 to $500 that can give me the same kind of sound but with improved isolation? Thanks!


----------



## Skydog71

Just wanted to say thank you for all of the research - this was an interesting read.


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I am looking for an iem around the 200-250 USD price range. The current iem that I have and enjoy is the CK100 but I want to get something cheaper with a similarish signature so I can use outside without being too worried that I'll drop/loose them. My preferred signature is something that sounds clear and detailed with a forward midrange/vocals and a treble that has good extension and air without sounding sibilant. Something that is airier with a bigger soundstage than the CK100 is a plus. I can't really describe the bass I like (definitely not a bass head though) but I do like to feel the impact of the drums, guitar solos/riffs and acoustic guitar. The 7550 sounds like the ideal iem that I'm looking for but I am not sure about the isolation and comfort of those. Is there something else I should be looking at that fits my description?
> 
> Thanks.


 
  
 The 7550 is going to be less mid-forward and less bright than the CK100. The soundstage is nice and large, though, and sibilance is never a problem. Isolation is mediocre and the fit is atypical, but not uncomfortable once you get used to it. If you want a somewhat similar signature with the comfort and isolation of a BA earphone, the TDK BA200 is a good option. I compared the 7550 and BA200 in the BA200 review: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/tdk-ba200/ 
  
 On the real cheap side (nothing wrong with getting a disposable IEM if it sounds good to you), I would strongly recommend the UE600 and Fidue A63
  
  


someguydude said:


> This surprises me. The foam tips aggravated my ears like crazy at first (which appears to be my fault for jiggling them around after they'd "settled"). but I don't understand how the size of the whole housing is an issue. You're not sticking the entire unit in your ear.


 
  
 The housing is supposed to sit in your outer ear:
  

  


16570 said:


> I currently have the IE80 and am in love with the sound signature, sound stage and all that good stuff. However, I commute long distances everyday and would appreciate any extra isolation I can get. I've tried the IE80s with Comply foam tips and while they did isolate more, I found the bass to be significantly muddied.
> 
> My question is, are there any universal IEMs at $400 to $500 that can give me the same kind of sound but with improved isolation? Thanks!


 
  
 It depends on what aspects of the IE80's signature you want to keep and which you're willing move away from. There are a couple earphones with good isolation that also have strong bass and good (maybe not as wide as IE80, but good) soundstages. The ones that come to mind are the EarSonics SM64, 1964EARS V3, and the Yamaha EPH-100. The EPH-100 especially might make for a good commuting IEM in addition to your IE80, because it's relatively inexpensive and isolates really well.
  
 Between the other two, the 1964-V3 has a brighter, more v-shaped signature than the IE80 while the SM64 is not as bassy but less bright and smoother. It has a bit less presence in the upper midrange, though.
  
  
  


skydog71 said:


> Just wanted to say thank you for all of the research - this was an interesting read.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

ljokerl said:


> The housing is supposed to sit in your outer ear:


 
  
 Wow I must have gigantic ears because I didn't even think that's how that was. I just popped the things in and there was a ton of available space. Looking at the photo though, you're right. Still, super comfy on me once I stopped trying to ram the things into my brain.


----------



## ljokerl

someguydude said:


> Wow I must have gigantic ears because I didn't even think that's how that was. I just popped the things in and there was a ton of available space. Looking at the photo though, you're right. Still, super comfy on me once I stopped trying to ram the things into my brain.


 
  
 They look similar in my ears, but that rear end creates a pressure point after a little while. You can see the size (length) difference vs a more conventional "ergonomic" earphone (the Westone UM3X). The Shure is thicker, too.
  

  
 I'm sure for many people the Shures and Westones will be equally comfortable. Just wish I could say the same for myself.


----------



## SebsG

Just got my Dunu Tridents, they're really, well, amazing xD


----------



## ljokerl

sebsg said:


> Just got my Dunu Tridents, they're really, well, amazing xD


 
  
 Glad to hear that


----------



## 1clearhead

Hello
 Joker,
  
 I got a chance to AMP the *Liberty 1's* against the *Sennheiser HD800* at the headphone shop close to work.
  
 Would you believe to the store owner and my surprise the Liberty 1's was a little sweeter (or more vivid) in all areas of the sound spectrum?!
  
 We kept switching back and fourth and could not understand how these IEM's bettered the HD800!!!
  
 Try-out category was "classical music".
  
 This week I'll continue more testing when I get the chance. I'll keep you posted!
  
  
 Ps. -I did not know they made a separate carry case for these. The shop owner gave me one free! It has the "wing logo" of the Ivery company. I wish I would have known ahead of time, I would have thrown one in for you before shipping yours. Darn!
  
 ......Check your PM.


----------



## huckfinn

Hi,
 would these be the ones?:
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/IVERY-IS-1-Super-Bass-Stereo-Earphone-w-Remote-Mic-for-Smartphones-MP3-MP4-/350956780436?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item51b6a77b94
  
 (I hope it is not forbidden to post an ebay link.....)
  
 +
  are they comfortable to wear....is the cable microphonic (....as in Sony MH-1 ....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




).....??


----------



## HeadHoncho

1clearhead said:


> Hello
> Joker,
> 
> I got a chance to AMP the *Liberty 1's* against the *Sennheiser HD800* at the headphone shop close to work.
> ...


 
  
 Are you really throwing a 9$ earphone against The Headphone, a 1400$ Sennheiser HD800? And calling it better? Come on...


----------



## Francisk

Let's wait for 1clearhead's more elaborate review of the Liberty IS-1 to see if his head was clear of what he was comparing the IS-1 to


----------



## Taveren

sebsg said:


> Just got my Dunu Tridents, they're really, well, amazing xD




Oh man, you reminded me when I first stumbled into this hobby, the Dunu Tridents are awesome for the price, sq and build quality are hard to beat. 

Happy listening bro!


----------



## Pastapipo

headhoncho said:


> Are you really throwing a 9$ earphone against The Headphone, a 1400$ Sennheiser HD800? And calling it better? Come on...




Different People, different perception. But 9$ iems SQ wise better than one of the kings? I doubt it.
Anyway, im looking forward in recieving these iems and judge for myself. They must be good if clearhead is that positive about them


----------



## 1clearhead

huckfinn said:


> Hi,
> would these be the ones?:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/IVERY-IS-1-Super-Bass-Stereo-Earphone-w-Remote-Mic-for-Smartphones-MP3-MP4-/350956780436?pt=US_Headphones&hash=item51b6a77b94
> 
> ...


 
 It looks legit to me.
  
 But, watch out! I'm pretty sure other third-party fakers are starting to read this forum and might start making the fake ones in no time from China! So, get them now why you can!
  
 I thought Chinese don't fake there own products, but when they started faking the Xiaomi Pistons that changed my perspective on how I view products now. It doesn't matter what product it is, fakers will jump on any band wagon, even there own people!
  
 For the last comment.....I haven't had any micro phonics or wire problems, as of yet. The wire is made of heat resistant TPE, which sounds good to me. And they're extremely comfortable to me. I wear them hours at a time while working. That's pretty good, I say.


----------



## huckfinn

....thanks!
 +
 ...making  fake ones of a <10$ headphone???...


----------



## 1clearhead

headhoncho said:


> Are you really throwing a 9$ earphone against The Headphone, a 1400$ Sennheiser HD800? And calling it better? Come on...


 
 Trust me I hesitated to write about this experience today. *This is my reputation I'm throwing out their*. I don't joke around with what I hear.
  
 .....I was enjoying classical music through the HD800 at lunch time at a local headphone shop and figured, hey? Why don't I try my Liberty 1's on this high-end AMP to see how good they sound, amped-up! Never in the world did I think they would give the HD800 competition from my perspective. That was not my intention. But, I was actually starting to enjoy the Liberty 1's more! The violins and other instruments playing sounded more realistic to me. It actually sounded more vivid and precise. I don't want to elaborate anymore. This is just my opinion. I hope others in this forum receives theirs to give there second opinion. To me, I just didn't realize they were that good.
  
 Please, who ever gets them first, burn them in for at least 50 hours or more and get back with us. I don't want to feel like I'm the only odd-ball here.
  
 It could get very lonely with no support.


----------



## 1clearhead

huckfinn said:


> ....thanks!
> +
> ...making  fake ones of a <10$ headphone???...


 
 Oh, trust me the Pistons weren't that far off from that price.
  
 Third-party fakers would do anything to be part of the *gold-rush*!


----------



## garcsa

Let me repeat one of my post: "..... thought of Mr. Ivor Tiefenbrun (legendary Linn Products Ltd) about the "front end": ".... Tiefenbrun also battled the thinking, since Edgar Villchur, that the loudspeakers were the most important, instead asserting primacy of "the front end", saying that the quality of sound of the source was key. ... " (Wikipedia) - and hundreds of articles from the past till today. Ok, not loudspeakers but IEMs (little loudspeakers....! ) ..."


----------



## 1clearhead

francisk said:


> Let's wait for 1clearhead's more elaborate review of the Liberty IS-1 to see if his head was clear of what he was comparing the IS-1 to


 
 I'll do my best to do more comparisons this week. But, the best review will come from 'Joker'. I sent one out this week for him.
  
 What's so funny was, I wasn't their to compare headphones, but to just listen to my Liberty 1's through a good high-end headphone amp. This was the weirdest experience I had, by far with an IEM.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

Can we just stop with the burn-in nonsense? It's not real, and it's just turning into a quick excuse for when someone didn't like a given headphone. Companies would have to be friggin' idiots to ship products that require 50+ hours before they sound good.
  
 Also, I can't even explain how comically skeptical I am of a cheap eBay headphone ranking up with a flagship. It's not that I necessarily buy into the HD800 being "The Headphone" so much as I know well the upward slope of headphone quality and have made a rather consistent "X is better than Y is better than Z" hop along the spectrum, so the idea of some cheap eBay buds trumping a top-end strikes me as a case of, sad to say, a very indiscriminate ear that would have been best served not spending so much.


----------



## 1clearhead

garcsa said:


> Let me repeat one of my post: "..... thought of Mr. Ivor Tiefenbrun (legendary Linn Products Ltd) about the "front end": ".... Tiefenbrun also battled the thinking, since Edgar Villchur, that the loudspeakers were the most important, instead asserting primacy of "the front end", saying that the quality of sound of the source was key. ... " (Wikipedia) - and hundreds of articles from the past till today. Ok, not loudspeakers but IEMs (little loudspeakers....! ) ..."


 
 Wow! Interesting quote.


----------



## nehcrow

someguydude said:


> Can we just stop with the burn-in nonsense? It's not real, and it's just turning into a quick excuse for when someone didn't like a given headphone. Companies would have to be friggin' idiots to ship products that require 50+ hours before they sound good.
> 
> Also, I can't even explain how comically skeptical I am of a cheap eBay headphone ranking up with a flagship. It's not that I necessarily buy into the HD800 being "The Headphone" so much as I know well the upward slope of headphone quality and have made a rather consistent "X is better than Y is better than Z" hop along the spectrum, so the idea of some cheap eBay buds trumping a top-end strikes me as a case of, sad to say, a very indiscriminate ear that would have been best served not spending so much.


 
 +1000000
 Summed up my thoughts nicely


----------



## H20Fidelity

Considering I'd already spent far too much money tonight I'm going to test 1clearhead's theory for everyone.

 . Another $10 wasn't going to break me.



 I'll be highly disappointed if they don't impress me to HD800 levels......


----------



## 1clearhead

someguydude said:


> Can we just stop with the burn-in nonsense? It's not real, and it's just turning into a quick excuse for when someone didn't like a given headphone. Companies would have to be friggin' idiots to ship products that require 50+ hours before they sound good.
> 
> Also, I can't even explain how comically skeptical I am of a cheap eBay headphone ranking up with a flagship. It's not that I necessarily buy into the HD800 being "The Headphone" so much as I know well the upward slope of headphone quality and have made a rather consistent "X is better than Y is better than Z" hop along the spectrum, so the idea of some cheap eBay buds trumping a top-end strikes me as a case of, sad to say, a very indiscriminate ear that would have been best served not spending so much.


 
 The funny thing was that the Chinese store owner told me that Chinese companies that try to make a big splash here in China just wants to make enough money to broaden' there field. He told me that there pick of resources don't really matter to make the item, just as long as the item sells. So, in other words if the diaphragm used is of expensive material or cheap material doesn't make a difference in cost for them. He just wants to sell, sell, sell, while starting at a low selling price.
  
 So, if the diaphragm this company picked is of value, then let's just take advantage and enjoy it for the time being.
  
 Remember, a lot of the headphones materials are made in China.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

I think it's as good a time as any to repeat that ears are subjective things and music is a personal experience. No matter what the technical specifications say, you're not OBLIGATED to think any product is better than any other. It may be a little unsavory that a headphone made from countless man hours and resources doesn't sound as good to you as one that was knocked out of a Chinese factory over the weekend, but no one can MAKE you hear something you don't. If somehow the stars aligned so you just enjoy the bargain bin earphones best, well, so it goes.
  
 To play devil's advocate with myself though, I think it's also worth pointing out that we, as generally self-proclaimed audiophiles (whatever that term may mean) may often want people to hear the difference because there is so much more in higher end headphones than the cheaper ones simply cannot replicate. I'm sure for some it's a sense of validation or superiority, but I really want people to be able to experience superior sound and hear their music in a way they couldn't before. If someone tells me the earbuds they picked out of a cardboard box at Staples sound better than anything they've ever heard, it bums me out because it means they're just not hearing everything that makes the best, the best.
  
 Or maybe somehow some random company managed to turn a $10 earbud out that outperforms a $1400 full-size. Who knows.


----------



## 1clearhead

h20fidelity said:


> Considering I'd already spent far too much money tonight I'm going to test 1clearhead's theory for everyone.
> 
> . Another $10 wasn't going to break me.
> 
> ...


 
 Don't assume I'm talking by volume and power. I'm actually stating the vivid clarity in comparison. Don't want to overwhelm the little diaphragms with too much power.
  
 -Hope it works for you.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

1clearhead said:


> The funny thing was that the Chinese store owner told me that Chinese companies that try to make a big splash here in China just wants to make enough money to broaden' there field. He told me that there pick of resources don't really matter to make the item, just as long as the item sells. So, in other words if the diaphragm used is of expensive material or cheap material doesn't make a difference in cost for them. He just wants to sell, sell, sell, while starting at a low selling price.
> 
> So, if the diaphragm this company picked is of value, then let's just take advantage and enjoy it for the time being.
> 
> Remember, a lot of the headphones materials are made in China.


 
  
 Admittedly I didn't hear what the dude actually said, but those two statements don't follow. It sounds to me like he meant they don't give a damn what the materials are as long as they're cheap and can be put in a low-cost package. I heavily, heavily doubt that in China random merchants are getting their hands on premium materials at the same cost as the chaff, and that they'd be dumb enough to stick expensive stuff in a cheap package and sell it for less than they could. 
  
 My wheelings and dealings with "economy" companies have told me that what matters most to them is the bottom line. The resources don't matter because they just care about making as much as they can on the cheap. That doesn't mean that sometimes they happen to be working with premium quality components just by accident. It means you'll be lucky if your headphones aren't made out of printer paper.


----------



## HeadHoncho

1clearhead said:


> Trust me I hesitated to write about this experience today. *This is my reputation I'm throwing out their*. I don't joke around with what I hear.
> 
> .....I was enjoying classical music through the HD800 at lunch time at a local headphone shop and figured, hey? Why don't I try my Liberty 1's on this high-end AMP to see how good they sound, amped-up! Never in the world did I think they would give the HD800 competition from my perspective. That was not my intention. But, I was actually starting to enjoy the Liberty 1's more! The violins and other instruments playing sounded more realistic to me. It actually sounded more vivid and precise. I don't want to elaborate anymore. This is just my opinion. I hope others in this forum receives theirs to give there second opinion. To me, I just didn't realize they were that good.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hahahaha, I'v already ordered them on eBay... That same link which was posted here some posts back... Have 3 sets coming now, VSD3, VSD3S and now the IS-1.
  
 BUT, I do not have an amp, reading your posts, i'm beginning to think I probably won't get that good a result un amped... should've thought about that before ordering I think :-/
  
 Also, any one here from India? How long does it take for customs clearance? My VSD3S is stuck at Mumbai customs since Thursday...


----------



## 1clearhead

someguydude said:


> Admittedly I didn't hear what the dude actually said, but those two statements don't follow. It sounds to me like he meant they don't give a damn what the materials are as long as they're cheap and can be put in a low-cost package. I heavily, heavily doubt that in China random merchants are getting their hands on premium materials at the same cost as the chaff, and that they'd be dumb enough to stick expensive stuff in a cheap package and sell it for less than they could.
> 
> My wheelings and dealings with "economy" companies have told me that what matters most to them is the bottom line. The resources don't matter because they just care about making as much as they can on the cheap. That doesn't mean that sometimes they happen to be working with premium quality components just by accident. It means you'll be lucky if your headphones aren't made out of printer paper.


 
 Sorry if you didn't understand "dude", but Chinese companies can get expensive materials for less and sell it for what ever price they decide on here in China. And if they have the patents for it, whether legit, or not, and can sell there product to gain popularity and start selling overseas? Well? For them, it was all fair game.
  
 So, if the diaphragm being used in the housing is of high quality? Just enjoy it for what it is.


----------



## 1clearhead

someguydude said:


> Can we just stop with the burn-in nonsense? It's not real, and it's just turning into a quick excuse for when someone didn't like a given headphone. Companies would have to be friggin' idiots to ship products that require 50+ hours before they sound good.
> 
> Also, I can't even explain how comically skeptical I am of a cheap eBay headphone ranking up with a flagship. It's not that I necessarily buy into the HD800 being "The Headphone" so much as I know well the upward slope of headphone quality and have made a rather consistent "X is better than Y is better than Z" hop along the spectrum, so the idea of some cheap eBay buds trumping a top-end strikes me as a case of, sad to say, a very indiscriminate ear that would have been best served not spending so much.


 
 I hate to disappoint you "dude", but most headphones and IEM's do need burning time according to the manufacturer. Especially, the more expensive models. So, I assume you never bought headphones stating any of this process? Most diaphragms need a burn-in time because the inner voice coil needs a break-in period to even out the actual sound is going to produce.
  
 I hope this gives you some idea why most of us do believe and listen to the manufacturers instruction for this process.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

1clearhead said:


> I hate to disappoint you "dude", but most headphones and IEM's do need burning time according to the manufacturer. Especially, the more expensive models. So, I assume you never bought headphones stating any of this process? Most diaphragms need a burn-in time because the inner voice coil needs a break-in period to even out the actual sound is going to produce.
> 
> I hope this gives you some idea why most of us do believe and listen to the manufacturers instruction for this process.


 
  
 LOL sure. 
  
 http://blog.shure.com/shure-notes/inside-headphones-with-yuri-shulman-shure-engineer/
  


> Yuri Shulman This is more myth than fact.  Some people make the argument that the driver’s suspension could be a little unsettled when the headphones are brand new.
> 
> At Shure we don’t subscribe to that thinking – again, what could be true for some loudspeakers (where there can be a 100-hour or so burn-in period) doesn’t directly apply here.  It’s a matter of perception.  Shure headphones sound the same a year after using them as they did brand new.


 
  
 But no, I'm sure you know a lot more about headphones than him. 
  
 Wait, that's just one guy. What about... http://eu.audio-technica.com/en/support/questions/question.asp?id=239
  


> Headphones do not require ‘burning’ in, however over a period of time the sound of headphones naturally change by a _*very small margin*_.
> 
> To make these slight changes happen sooner you can play music through your headphones for 50+ hours at normal listening levels. This ‘burning in’ process can have the following effects:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hm. I'm confused...


----------



## Francisk

1clearhead said:


> I'll do my best to do more comparisons this week. But, the best review will come from 'Joker'. I sent one out this week for him.
> 
> What's so funny was, I wasn't their to compare headphones, but to just listen to my Liberty 1's through a good high-end headphone amp. This was the weirdest experience I had, by far with an IEM.


 
 Yes 1clearhead, you just caught my attention with a $10 IEM sounding better than a $1400 so I jumped on your hype train and just ordered the Ivery IS-1. Heck, what have I got to lose


----------



## peter123

@HeadHoncho

My VSD3s are stucked in my ears since this morning


----------



## Francisk

peter123 said:


> @HeadHoncho
> 
> My VSD3s are stucked in my ears since this morning


 
  
 I'm getting very jealous Peter....I'm still waiting for mine


----------



## 1clearhead

someguydude said:


> LOL sure.
> 
> http://blog.shure.com/shure-notes/inside-headphones-with-yuri-shulman-shure-engineer/
> 
> ...


 
 "Dude", I'm a sound engineer, and have been for many years. Don't glorify yourself on other companies or people's comments and blogs you read from. Some companies do burn-in before delivering there products so that the consumer won't have to.
  
 Sorry to turn the tide "dude".....you don't have to act confused.


----------



## suman134

someguydude said:


> LOL sure.
> 
> http://blog.shure.com/shure-notes/inside-headphones-with-yuri-shulman-shure-engineer/
> 
> ...


 
  
      what do they really mean by burning in , just play your music , it will burn .


----------



## Francisk

Aha....1clearhead.....so you're a sound engineer....we'd better trust your review then


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> The 7550 is going to be less mid-forward and less bright than the CK100. The soundstage is nice and large, though, and sibilance is never a problem. Isolation is mediocre and the fit is atypical, but not uncomfortable once you get used to it. If you want a somewhat similar signature with the comfort and isolation of a BA earphone, the TDK BA200 is a good option. I compared the 7550 and BA200 in the BA200 review: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/tdk-ba200/
> 
> On the real cheap side (nothing wrong with getting a disposable IEM if it sounds good to you), I would strongly recommend the UE600 and Fidue A63


 
 Just wondering how does the TDK BA200 compare to the E-Q7 and the UE900? I have the E-Q7 but have sold the UE900.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

1clearhead said:


> "Dude", I'm a sound engineer, and have been for many years. Don't glorify yourself on other companies or people's comments and blogs you read from. Some companies do burn-in before delivering there products so that the consumer won't have to.
> 
> Sorry to turn the tide "dude".....you don't have to act confused.


 
  
 Oh dang a sound engineer. I was wrong, that DOES make you more qualified than the engineers at Shure and Audio Technica. I guess they should fire their staff and hire you because you know better.
  
 I actually got challenged a while ago to find any headphone companies that tell their customers to burn in the products prior to listening. Couldn't find any.
  
 Moreover, if the companies do burn-in the drivers before delivering them (Audeze was the only one I'm aware of) then that means you don't have to, which negates the entire purpose of "they need burn-in first" anyway.
  
 The instant someone throws out job title, what that means is "I have no substantive arguments so I want you to just accept what I say because I said so". Sorry, I'm not razzle dazzled by job titles. And what exactly is your job? A sound engineer can be all kinds of things. What part of your job makes you an expert vis a vis the motor mechanics of headphone drivers?
  
 I mean, otherwise it'd be like you just threw that out in the hopes that I'd be impressed or intimidated.


----------



## SomeGuyDude

suman134 said:


> what do they really mean by burning in , just play your music , it will burn .


 
  
 The term "burning in" is a bit of a holdover from old loudspeakers which had big, heavy mechanical parts which, fresh off the assembly line, needed time before they could move smoothly. There was also the notion that without "burning in" the motors it would be easier to blow the speakers thanks to the parts being stiff. It's relatively antiquated now and exists chiefly as a placebo effect.
  
 Remember that this started by talking about giant speakers which required significant mechanical movement. Headphones are extremely tiny units, and IEMs even MORE so. They don't need burning in.
  
 http://www.wired.com/2013/11/tnhyui-earphone-burn-in/
  
 Just for a good read. There's psychological burn-in, but that's all. If I put two headphones on a table and made you guess which one had been burned in? Wouldn't happen. It's popped up in so many threads where someone got a new pair in the mail and were shocked, SHOCKED that their replacements sounded exactly like their old ones, which had been treated with a hundred hours of burn-in.
  
 At best we're talking about maybe an hour of motion just to get the parts loosened up. There's no science behind burn-in. Just conjecture and references to old technology.


----------



## HeadHoncho

peter123 said:


> @HeadHoncho
> 
> My VSD3s are stucked in my ears since this morning


 
  
 Awww man! Can you give some impressions about it? These are the first earphones I'v purchased purely on the reputation Vsonic has built up and haven't waited for Joker's review. I'm getting pretty agitated as to how they are going to sound... have been relying on my standby MH1C since my last pair of IEMs broke... can't bloody wait enough!


----------



## 1clearhead

suman134 said:


> what do they really mean by burning in , just play your music , it will burn .


 
 What it means is that the voice coil is stiff "when new" and needs to vibrate to the electrical current given to produce sound, and when it finally settles in the sound produced will eventually be the same every time.
  
 For example: I have my Ivery IS-1 I use everyday at work and the midrange-vocals opened-up since the day of purchase mainly because it took 50 or more hours to do so. Now, they vibrate with ease to produce the most out of my music.
  
 While, in the other hand, I have two more new "unboxed," which if I open and take a quick listen sounds very thin and lean with distant vocals because the voice coil hasn't been energized, or magnetized with electric current to provide a smooth flow.
  
 So, yes....play, play, play, at a moderate level until it manages to settle-in. You could also do so by listening to them. They will sound better as you use them down the road!
  
 Probably, within a week it'll settle-in.....only if your a constant user. But, if not, give it at least 2 weeks, at best!
  
 You'll like them more then you did when you first opened them out the box!
  
 I hope I made some sense of it.


----------



## peter123

@HeadHoncho
Initial expression is very good but I think it's a bit to early to say anything more yet. I'll try to post some early impressions in the dedicated thread later tonight.


----------



## 1clearhead

francisk said:


> Aha....1clearhead.....so you're a sound engineer....we'd better trust your review then


 
 Frankly, I did not want to mention that. *This is 'Jokers' thread and I respect him, dearly.*
  
 I'm still human, though. But thanks for your comments. I'm more of an audiophile specialist on high-end audio speakers.
  
 Joker would be a better expert than me in this realm. I would be considered more like his side-kick.


----------



## 1clearhead

someguydude said:


> The term "burning in" is a bit of a holdover from old loudspeakers which had big, heavy mechanical parts which, fresh off the assembly line, needed time before they could move smoothly. There was also the notion that without "burning in" the motors it would be easier to blow the speakers thanks to the parts being stiff. It's relatively antiquated now and exists chiefly as a placebo effect.
> 
> Remember that this started by talking about giant speakers which required significant mechanical movement. Headphones are extremely tiny units, and IEMs even MORE so. They don't need burning in.
> 
> ...


 
 Edited: Sorry, didn't mean to come off that way.....


----------



## Francisk

No worries 1clearhead...it's a free world and everyone has the right to their opinion and of course a lot of respect to Joker for his time and reviews that he has shared with fellow HeadFiers here


----------



## 1clearhead

francisk said:


> Yes 1clearhead, you just caught my attention with a $10 IEM sounding better than a $1400 so I jumped on your hype train and just ordered the Ivery IS-1. Heck, what have I got to lose


 
 It was just a coincidence bringing these 2 together.
  
 Did not know it was going to create such feedback. But, then again it is a David and Goliath type of scale.
  
 Please, let me know your comments after you had used them for some time.


----------



## Francisk

1clearhead said:


> It was just a coincidence bringing these 2 together.
> 
> Did not know it was going to create such feedback. But, then again it is a David and Goliath type of scale.
> 
> Please, let me know your comments after you had used them for some time.


 
  
 Yes 1clearhead, will let you know once I receive and use it for a while. Hell...I'm going to be very busy soon with VSD3S and Ivery IS-1 both arriving almost the same time


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> Just wondering how does the TDK BA200 compare to the E-Q7 and the UE900? I have the E-Q7 but have sold the UE900.


 
  
 It's been way too long since I've heard the e-Q7s... it's been discontinued for a long time. The UE900 is a little brighter and less warm than the BA200,and has a slightly more noticeable dip in the upper midrange, but overall they're not very different.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> It's been way too long since I've heard the e-Q7s... it's been discontinued for a long time. The UE900 is a little brighter and less warm than the BA200,and has a slightly more noticeable dip in the upper midrange, but overall they're not very different.


 
 Is the soundstage, layering and imaging comparable to them? If I remember correctly the UE900 seems to do quite well in this regard and also has a nice airy treble as well with good extension.


----------



## Chude Mleko

vidzegg said:


> I am not getting enough time to research and am thinking about reordering MEElectronics A161p as it meets most of my requirements. I am usually a silent lurker at the forum but it suddenly occurred to me that I could request your help like so many others.
> I would really appreciate if you can give me a few options about IEM’s that are similar to 161P but may be considered an upgrade sonically.


 
 Hi, I'd recommend VC1000. I loved my A161p for similar reasons as you describe, tried few other sets looking for improvements and didn't like them. After I heard VC1000 it became my favourite set. It sounds similar to A161p but overall better I'd say. Only downside it is a bit siblant, not too much thouhg. I learned to live without mic.


----------



## 1clearhead

Ha-ha!
  
 I had a Chinese colleague try my Liberty 1's this morning and she finally commented saying, and I quote "-It sounds too unreal!" I said, "-What do you mean?" She said, "-It sounds too clear and digital for me." 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 So, clearly she was not ready for this type of upgrade!
 How is that for a weird and interesting review?


----------



## huckfinn

Just a question, 1clearhead:
 I often find that headphones have quite a superior soundstage when compared to iems (true, I haven't tried many iems....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, so maybe this is the reason)
 like: Grados, Momentums, Denons have quite some soundstage...how do the Libertys stand concerning soundstage?
  
 Thanks!


----------



## 1clearhead

huckfinn said:


> Just a question, 1clearhead:
> I often find that headphones have quite a superior soundstage when compared to iems (true, I haven't tried many iems....
> 
> 
> ...


 
 That's a good question!
  
 While personally, I do compare them more with IEM's, they do sound pretty good in soundstage. You could hear the instruments as if you were their, plus the vocals are remarkably realistic.
  
 They are behind the Pistons in soundstage for that matter, but outshine them in their extended mid and treble range.
  
 They definitely do compare with the headphones you mentioned above, and so does the Pistons!


----------



## robakri

1clearhead said:


> Ha-ha!
> 
> I had a Chinese colleague try my Liberty 1's this morning and she finally commented saying, and I quote "-It sounds too unreal!" I said, "-What do you mean?" She said, "-It sounds too clear and digital for me."
> 
> ...


 
 I don't know, I'd almost translate that as that they might be too smooth sounding or somehow lacking detail. If she didn't like what she heard, we shouldn't twist her words into something "actually positive, she just wasn't ready" it is actually a bit insulting. If she is a colleague, is she then also a sound engineer?


----------



## 1clearhead

robakri said:


> I don't know, I'd almost translate that as that they might be too smooth sounding or somehow lacking detail. If she didn't like what she heard, we shouldn't twist her words into something "actually positive, she just wasn't ready" it is actually a bit insulting. If she is a colleague, is she then also a sound engineer?


 
 Funny you're twisting the story and acting like you know my colleague for years as I do. That's exactly what you're doing, twisting the story. I'm sorry it was a little insulting to you.
  
 .....And by the way, she went back to her dull sounding ear buds. So, my colleague and I knew exactly what she was saying.
  
 Reread the joke, you may laugh a little.


----------



## robakri

1clearhead said:


> Funny you're twisting the story and acting like you know my colleague for years as I do. That's exactly what you're doing, twisting the story. I'm sorry it was a little insulting to you.
> 
> .....And by the way, she went back to her dull sounding ear buds. So, my colleague and I knew exactly what she was saying.
> 
> Reread the joke, you may laugh a little.


 
 Sorry, didn't know she was your soulmate.
  
 Either way, I'll get to judge how I like them sometime in the future, ordered on ebay yesterday. It'll be fun to see if they top their similarly priced and wonderful monoprice 8320 which I was very impressed with when I first tried (haven't heard them for a while now). I can say without even hearing them or holding that they win in the ergonomics department at least.


----------



## vidzegg

chude mleko said:


> Hi, I'd recommend VC1000. I loved my A161p for similar reasons as you describe, tried few other sets looking for improvements and didn't like them. After I heard VC1000 it became my favourite set. It sounds similar to A161p but overall better I'd say. Only downside it is a bit siblant, not too much thouhg. I learned to live without mic.


 
  
 Thanks for responding.
  
 I did consider VC1000 but Impedance of 50 ohm kept me away ( also decided against GR01 , TDK BA 200  and GR07 BE for similar reasons ). I use my IEMs commuting with a GS3  and I don't use portable amp . After a bad experienced driving highly respected DBA-02 mkII, I am wary of anything above 20 ohm. I also made at least 1 button control a must feature recently since I want to " keep it my pants" during commute 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  
 So after spending too much time here, I have gone bananas and ordered A 161P and RBH EP2, If i don't like EP2, next option is RHA MA 750. All of them very easy to drive and with mic and controls.
  
 BTW, I also ordered Ivery-IS1 to test out an inexpensive V shaped signature given all the hoopla about it recently . Not much to  lose there.
  
 I am pretty sure that I have really screened this thread and made my choices but  I am always open to suggestions.


----------



## 1clearhead

robakri said:


> Sorry, didn't know she was your soulmate.
> 
> Either way, I'll get to judge how I like them sometime in the future, ordered on ebay yesterday. It'll be fun to see if they top their similarly priced and wonderful monoprice 8320 which I was very impressed with when I first tried (haven't heard them for a while now). I can say without even hearing them or holding that they win in the ergonomics department at least.


 
 I too own the monoprice since Jokers review several years back and I can't even begin to say how they just outshined my 8320's. Though, they dearly remain in my collection!
  
 In the ergonomics department, as you say, they are incredibly comfortable and will statisfy most, if not, all genders!
  
 Cheers! Hope you like them.


----------



## 1clearhead

Edited: Sorry for misleading others here......


----------



## jant71

I think that Joker should edit the thread title and change it to...
  
 Multi-IEM Review - 316 IEMs compared to the Ivery IS-1


----------



## 1clearhead

jant71 said:


> I think that Joker should edit the thread title and change it to...
> 
> Multi-IEM Review - 316 IEMs compared to the Ivery IS-1


 
 Edited: Sorry for overdoing 'Jokers' thread......I apologize.


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> Is the soundstage, layering and imaging comparable to them? If I remember correctly the UE900 seems to do quite well in this regard and also has a nice airy treble as well with good extension.


 
  
 Yes, the UE900 does all of those things very well. The BA200 lags a little in sheer expanse and its treble is not quite as present and extended, as one might expect from a warmer-sounding earphone.


----------



## nehcrow

1clearhead said:


> There's another review of the *Liberty 1's*, if interested on "Amazon".
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/In-Ear-Headphone-Remote-iPhone-Samsung/dp/B00KRDMKKI/ref=pd_rhf_se_p_tnr_2
> 
> It's all good!


 
 Dude, don't you think it's the wrong thread to do this?
 Make your own thread if you want to hype up a product
  
 Also it sounds like you wrote that review LOL


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the Astrotec AX-35
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C62) Astrotec AX-35*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## Chude Mleko

vidzegg said:


> I did consider VC1000 but Impedance of 50 ohm kept me away ( also decided against GR01 , TDK BA 200  and GR07 BE for similar reasons ). I use my IEMs commuting with a GS3  and I don't use portable amp . After a bad experienced driving highly respected DBA-02 mkII, I am wary of anything above 20 ohm. I also made at least 1 button control a must feature recently since I want to " keep it my pants" during commute
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 I should have mentioned that before. I'm commuting as well listening on GS2. With a good seal I never felt they lack power. In fact I don't think A161p were any louder but I can't be sure at this stage. Not significantly anyway. I realized as well I often have my phone in my hands reading or playing games. In fairness I barely talk over the phone while commuting though.
 Please let me know if you find earphones you like better than A161p. I was thinking ER-4PT would be next when vc1000 dies.


----------



## peter123

jant71 said:


> I think that Joker should edit the thread title and change it to...
> 
> Multi-IEM Review - 316 IEMs compared to the Ivery IS-1


 
  
 LOL!


ljokerl said:


> Added a review of the Astrotec AX-35
> 
> 
> The overall ranking has been updated here.


 
 Nice review as always 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Good to see some more love for the AX35.  I like them a lot and some simple modds will take them even further.
  
 Edit: My pair of the Ivery IS-1 is also on the way


----------



## 1clearhead

nehcrow said:


> Dude, don't you think it's the wrong thread to do this?
> Make your own thread if you want to hype up a product
> 
> Also it sounds like you wrote that review LOL


 
 Edited: .....apologize for misleading.


----------



## Shawn71

jant71 said:


> I think that Joker should edit the thread title and change it to...
> 
> Multi-IEM Review - 316 IEMs compared to the Ivery IS-1
> 
> :wink_face:




LoL.......at the same time appreciate bringing out this point,as it makes more sense. And the title deserves it,HENCEFORTH.. WHY? You See whenever someone shoots a question comparing one and the other(s) among the toys the he had reviewed, he would come back with an answer,out of the 317(as of now). Well the other thread he owns/drives on headphones too deserves the same.

Great Work |joker|


----------



## leogodoy

1clearhead this may sound offensive, but at this point I may have to ask if you have some vested interest in the success of this product. You clearly guaranteed some sales here.


----------



## 1clearhead

leogodoy said:


> @1clearhead this may sound offensive, but at this point I may have to ask if you have some vested interest in the success of this product. You clearly guaranteed some sales here.


 

 Really?
  
 I discovered a quality IEM that sounds insane for only what coffee and donuts go for, and you think I'm going to make money out of this hobby? Who are you fooling, yourself? I helped hype-up the Pistons thread because of the sound quality vs. price and found these gems at an even better price while searching for the VSONIC VDS1S, which happens to be Jokers suggestion for a mild V shape IEM. Then by coincidence, I crossed path with the Liberty 1's at a store.
  
 Look, I like to help people on a budget, when I can. That's all I do. And I like to tell my story when ever an IEM like this one or the Pistons for that matter crosses my path. I do not make money by making people happy when sharing my discoveries and comments.
  
 So many people "hype" good IEM's when they come along, and I'm no different. You can see it as you like, but I'm a hobbyist that enjoys good sounding headphones when I hear it.
  
 I hope this didn't sound too offensive for you. And whether I make money or not? No one has to answer to you, of course. Again, no offense....so no need to ask.
  
 Seriously? IEM's at this price.....I'm going to make money? I think you just offended yourself.


----------



## 1clearhead

shawn71 said:


> LoL.......at the same time appreciate bringing out this point,as it makes more sense. And the title deserves it well too,HENCEFORTH.. WHY? You See whenever someone shoots a question comparing one and the other(s) among the toys the he had reviewed, he would come back with an answer,out of the 317(as of now). Well the other thread he owns/drives on headphones too deserves the same.
> 
> Great Work |joker|


 

 Well? The good thing is we have Joker to review all our toys! He puts them into perspective and place.


----------



## Shawn71

1clearhead said:


> Well?




yeah its a typo and corrected..........


----------



## Niyologist

I heard that MEELEC are working on a Hybrid IEM, a Higher End BA IEM and a Higher End Dynamic IEMs and they are to be revealed by next year.


----------



## altrunox

1clearhead said:


> There's another review of the *Liberty 1's*, if interested on "Amazon".
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/In-Ear-Headphone-Remote-iPhone-Samsung/dp/B00KRDMKKI/ref=pd_rhf_se_p_tnr_2
> 
> It's all good!


 
 Have you tried others Ivery IEM?
  
 Shipping to Brazil is extremly slow so, maybe i will buy another one with IS-1...
  
  i loved the flat cable from the IV-3
 http://pt.aliexpress.com/item/IV-3-Fashion-Brand-In-Ear-Metal-Earphone-3-5mm-HiFi-Intelligent-Stereo-Headpone-Earbuds-For/1729716716.html
  
 and IS-4 looks sexy
 http://pt.aliexpress.com/item/High-Quality-ivery-is-4S-In-Ear-Headphones-Earphone-For-IPhone-IPod-Earphones-Headset-For-MP3/1756327172.html


----------



## leogodoy

1clearhead said:


> I hope this didn't sound too offensive for you. And whether I make money or not? No one has to answer to you, of course. Again, no offense....so no need to ask.
> 
> Seriously? IEM's at this price.....I'm going to make money? I think you just offended yourself.




No offense taken, as I said, I just had to ask. Hope everyone feels the same passion for this product, it would really change the game if what you describe is valid. I'm a journalist, so it's kind of my "hobby" being skeptical, and again, it was not my intention offending you.

I will wait for others to try this out because being from Brazil it would take forever for them to be delivered here.


----------



## garcsa

niyologist said:


> I heard that MEELEC are working on a Hybrid IEM, a Higher End BA IEM and a Higher End Dynamic IEMs and they are to be revealed by next year.


 
 I'm really curious !  Love the A161 , CC51 (  both discontinued) and of course M9, M6 .


----------



## altrunox

So i was looking for Ivery and found these seller -> http://www.aliexpress.com/store/group/4-Consumer-Electronics/507503_253017963.html
 If you buy US$29+ you get US$9 off 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I got 3 Ivery ( IS-1, IV-3, IV-1) and Awei ZT120i ( mostly because of its case ) for US$20,46 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 The seller looks trusty.


----------



## jant71

nehcrow said:


> Dude, don't you think it's the wrong thread to do this?
> Make your own thread if you want to hype up a product
> 
> Also it sounds like you wrote that review LOL


 
  
 That's what I was hinting at. Joker doesn't need the thread to be jacked/derailed. If one thinks something deserves it's own thread then, by all means, make one. Other-wise it's all good. I almost bought an Ivery IV-6(I think that was the one) with the titanium diaphragms.


----------



## Lost Dark Soul

I Currently have the Klipsch S4's. I also have a pair of JBL Synchros Reflect.


I'm currently looking for more Bass and Sub Bass, better vocals, and not as harsh Treble. Better Soundstage presence. Better quality overall.


My music consists of Rock, Rap, Electronic (Dubstep, Chillstep, Techno, Trance, Trap).


My Klipsch S4's are muddy with bass, and sound cracky at high volumes and are very harsh on the Treble to my ears.


My JBLs sound pretty good too. They have more detailed bass, better mids (vocals), Treble is about the same. Soundstage is better.


I'm trying to find something that will make the Bass and Sub Bass pop a little more for instance in Rock music like listening to Alice in Chains, Bullet For My Valentine, Avenged7Fold, Kiss, etc... I hear the bass guitar fine its just the kick drums lack with the Sub Bass feel and presence.


I was looking into the Sony MDR XBA-H1, MDR XB60/90EX, Klipsch X11, Vsonic GR07 BE.


I don't care for Hippo VB, JVC FXT90, Atrio MG7.


If you have any suggestions for others or if those I picked, can you enlighten me a little more and better direct my choice on a pair. Thanks In Advance.


Sent from my SM-N900T

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk


----------



## vidzegg

chude mleko said:


> I should have mentioned that before. I'm commuting as well listening on GS2. With a good seal I never felt they lack power. In fact I don't think A161p were any louder but I can't be sure at this stage. Not significantly anyway. I realized as well I often have my phone in my hands reading or playing games. In fairness I barely talk over the phone while commuting though.
> Please let me know if you find earphones you like better than A161p. I was thinking ER-4PT would be next when vc1000 dies.


 
  
 Interesting.... loudness on IEMs  I have used so far seemed to be proportional to their impedance. At 16 ohms ( A161p,UE 600 Vi) 60 to 70% volumes is loud enough for me. at 33 ohm ( stock Samsung buds) 90 to 100 % is needed for satisfactory output. DBA 2 at 43 ohm was not loud enough even at full volume . I concluded that GS3 can not handle anything above 32 ohms but may be there is more to it than that.
  
 Mic is not important for me too but play/pause/ next and previous track functionality with 1 button is ( Again a DBA-02 lesson), to quickly sift through songs.
  
 A161P's quick and enjoyable bass has set me on a path away from neutral and towards bass and mids heavy with gentle treble IEMs now so I am not looking for anything neutral anymore and that always rules out Etymotics.  I don't know if I can recommend anything to you given my recent sonic preferences but  I was also considering Earsonics  SM2 DLX (they were expensive and had no 1 button thingy), favorable review by Ijokerl.
  
 Sadly, not many IEMs meets my stringent criteria, so I am left with experimenting.


----------



## knives

vidzegg said:


> Interesting.... loudness on IEMs  I have used so far seemed to be proportional to their impedance. At 16 ohms ( A161p,UE 600 Vi) 60 to 70% volumes is loud enough for me. at 33 ohm ( stock Samsung buds) 90 to 100 % is needed for satisfactory output. DBA 2 at 43 ohm was not loud enough even at full volume . I concluded that GS3 can not handle anything above 32 ohms but may be there is more to it than that.
> 
> Mic is not important for me too but play/pause/ next and previous track functionality with 1 button is ( Again a DBA-02 lesson), to quickly sift through songs.
> 
> ...


 
 for loudness two things matter: impedance and sensitivity.
 The less is the impedance, you need less voltage to achieve more power.
 And the bigger is the sensitivity, you need less power to achieve more loudness.


----------



## kova4a

knives said:


> for loudness two things matter: impedance and sensitivity.
> The less is the impedance, you need less voltage to achieve more power.
> And the bigger is the sensitivity, you need less power to achieve more loudness.


 
 Nah, it's a bit more complicated than that. Yeah, generally high impedance headphones require more voltage but low impedance headphones require higher current and most of the time smartphones can provide the voltage but not the current needed. Also, just judging the efficiency based on the specifications of the headphones posted by the manufacturer is not exactly an accurate science, especially given that it's not like all headphones have linear impedance.
 In my experience, there has been stuff with circa 16 ohm impedance and high sensitivity that has been pretty hard to drive and stuff with high impedance that is very easy to drive etc. I'm often surprised by new stuff, its specs and the actual efficiency, so it's a bit of a generalization to conclude on the power needed only based on specs and urban legends about 30+ ohm stuff and how hard it is to drive with a smartphone.
  
 In regard to the a161p talk - it was actually something like 30 ohm as far as I remember and is actually one of the easiest to drive iems. It can get very loud very fast from pretty much any source but most iems aren't this sensitive and so efficient.


----------



## 1clearhead

shawn71 said:


> yeah its a typo and corrected..........


 
 Yeah, it's a typo and corrected, also.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
  
 Don't get off track buddy, this is a forum with bloggers from all over the world. Don't discriminate.
  
 So, if you're here to correct other people's spelling, you might as well be a teacher. No teachers needed here.


----------



## 1clearhead

jant71 said:


> That's what I was hinting at. Joker doesn't need the thread to be jacked/derailed. If one thinks something deserves it's own thread then, by all means, make one. Other-wise it's all good. I almost bought an Ivery IV-6(I think that was the one) with the titanium diaphragms.


 
@jant71
  
 Everyone on this forum brings ideas of IEM's discovered to Joker because he is a great analyst on breaking them down to the core. And that's all I did, give my impressions and ideas to what I think is a great IEM for the price. With that said, I am going to upload a new thread with my impressions of them.
  
 But, please be noted, 'Joker' will do the full rating on these. He's definitely the IEM expert here! His experience shows on his reviews!
  
 Ps. -I'm also interested in those IV-6.......Are you saying you didn't order them? I would have been interested on some feedback on those.


----------



## 1clearhead

leogodoy said:


> No offense taken, as I said, I just had to ask. Hope everyone feels the same passion for this product, it would really change the game if what you describe is valid. I'm a journalist, so it's kind of my "hobby" being skeptical, and again, it was not my intention offending you.
> 
> I will wait for others to try this out because being from Brazil it would take forever for them to be delivered here.


 
 I'm a hobbyist on new budget IEM's here in China. I just happen to bump into these while looking for the VSONIC VSD1S that 'Joker' suggested to me. I didn't mean to mislead, or upset people when I compared them to the HD800. It was just an experience I just wanted to share with others on this thread. People pay a lot of money for headphones like the HD800, and well worth it! So, honestly, I just fell in love with these.


----------



## 1clearhead

altrunox said:


> Have you tried others Ivery IEM?
> 
> Shipping to Brazil is extremly slow so, maybe i will buy another one with IS-1...
> 
> ...


 
 I only tried the IV-4, which were in the lines of sounding like Soundmagic E10, or E30. I'm hoping to try the others in the later future.
  
 My experience has only been with the IS-1 and IV-4.


----------



## 1clearhead

altrunox said:


> So i was looking for Ivery and found these seller -> http://www.aliexpress.com/store/group/4-Consumer-Electronics/507503_253017963.html
> If you buy US$29+ you get US$9 off
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Please give us some feedback on the IV-3 and IV-1 later on. Haven't heard these, yet.


----------



## Shawn71

1clearhead said:


> Yeah, it's a typo and corrected, also.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I made a typo and i had corrected it(MINE).....not someone's. You pointed out to me with "well?" so responded. Guess who's teacher here,SIR! Let it go.


----------



## 1clearhead

shawn71 said:


> I made a typo and i had corrected it(MINE).....not someone's. You pointed out to me with "well?" so responded. Guess who's teacher here,SIR! Let it go.


 
 I apologize for the miscommunication. I misunderstood your expression.
  
 -Dooley noted. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
 ......hopefully, I'm setting a thread for the Ivery IS-1 with my impressions of them *within the hour*. Joker will give details and ratings on them in the near future.


----------



## Niyologist

Does anyone think that the Havi B3 Pro I sounds similar to the Sennheiser IE80?


----------



## suman134

lost dark soul said:


> I Currently have the Klipsch S4's. I also have a pair of JBL Synchros Reflect.
> 
> 
> I'm currently looking for more Bass and Sub Bass, better vocals, and not as harsh Treble. Better Soundstage presence. Better quality overall.
> ...


 
  
      for a cheap option i will suggest the xb90ex , loads of bass , i mean flooded with bass , it just needs a hint of bass . never heard anything with more bass then this , gr07 be still has controlled but more refined bass. i will say , save some more and go for xba-h3 , you will get plenty of bass and lots of details too .
      never tried a image s4 or xb60ex though . but i believe xb90ex is not as muddy as s4 . if thats your problem , h1 or best as joker suggests , yamaha-eph100 should do .
      still for $60 i will go for xb90ex . for me its the basshead reference phone .


----------



## 1clearhead

@Joker
  
 Thanks in advance for your reviews on the Ivery IS-1 in the later future.
  
 Credits to you are mentioned at the end of my new thread for the Liberty 1's.


----------



## ljokerl

niyologist said:


> I heard that MEELEC are working on a Hybrid IEM, a Higher End BA IEM and a Higher End Dynamic IEMs and they are to be revealed by next year.


 


garcsa said:


> I'm really curious !  Love the A161 , CC51 (  both discontinued) and of course M9, M6 .


 
  
 Same here, still use the A161 to benchmark other IEMs all the time.
  


lost dark soul said:


> I Currently have the Klipsch S4's. I also have a pair of JBL Synchros Reflect.
> 
> 
> I'm currently looking for more Bass and Sub Bass, better vocals, and not as harsh Treble. Better Soundstage presence. Better quality overall.
> ...


 
  
 I haven't tried the JBLs but two other sub-bass heavy IEMs you should consider are the Yamaha EPH-100 and RHA MA750. I wouldn't bother with the GR07BE - despite the name it's not a very bassy earphone.
  


kova4a said:


> Nah, it's a bit more complicated than that. Yeah, generally high impedance headphones require more voltage but low impedance headphones require higher current and most of the time smartphones can provide the voltage but not the current needed. Also, just judging the efficiency based on the specifications of the headphones posted by the manufacturer is not exactly an accurate science, especially given that it's not like all headphones have linear impedance.
> In my experience, there has been stuff with circa 16 ohm impedance and high sensitivity that has been pretty hard to drive and stuff with high impedance that is very easy to drive etc. I'm often surprised by new stuff, its specs and the actual efficiency, so it's a bit of a generalization to conclude on the power needed only based on specs and urban legends about 30+ ohm stuff and how hard it is to drive with a smartphone.
> 
> In regard to the a161p talk - it was actually something like 30 ohm as far as I remember and is actually one of the easiest to drive iems. It can get very loud very fast from pretty much any source but most iems aren't this sensitive and so efficient.


 
  
 This was my experience with the A161P as well. Gets very loud, very quickly. 
  
 Impedance is 35ohms at 1k per InnerFidelity measurements, but definitely not linear.


----------



## Shawn71

1clearhead said:


> I apologize for the miscommunication. I misunderstood your expression.
> 
> -Dooley noted. :wink_face:
> 
> ...




easy! Not a problem.

And good that you finally made a good decision to open a new thread that you want to post your impression than hijacking a thread. Dont take it personal.


----------



## 1clearhead

shawn71 said:


> easy! Not a problem.
> 
> And good that you finally made a good decision to open a new thread that you want to post your impression than hijacking a thread. Dont take it personal.


 
 Non-taken'.
  
 Just commenting on some new gems for Joker.
  
 .....didn't know you were guarding his thread from hijackers. You caught me!!!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
 Is all good man....take it easy. All smiles!


----------



## suman134

1clearhead said:


> Non-taken'.
> 
> Just commenting on some new gems for Joker.
> 
> ...


 
   
    flooding some ones thread with your views sometimes feels annoying .


----------



## 1clearhead

suman134 said:


> flooding some ones thread with your views sometimes feels annoying .


 
 Wow, are you also writing because your sensitive?
  
 I already apologized on this thread. What else do you want? A cookie?
  
_-Go on with your business about IEM's. There's nothing else to say._
  
_I'm not trashing no one here and I already started my thread._
  
_Again, my apologies, -especially to Joker._


----------



## suman134

1clearhead said:


> Wow, are you also writing because your sensitive?
> 
> I already apologized on this thread. What else do you want? A cookie?
> 
> ...


 
  
      not sensitive about this , not me , others . im not complaining . why should i , if the thread starter is not bothered .


----------



## Shawn71

Edit=>Something happened weird with the editor. Updated couple of posts next......


----------



## Pastapipo

Joker,
  
 Thanks for your review on the MOE-SS01.
 I really like the overall clearness and the sound colour of the treble, what I don't like is the V shape.
 Now, you compared them to the Philips S1. 
 I would love a bit more subbass and a more neutral tone (less treble), but would this go at the cost of the clearness?
 Thanks in advance.


----------



## Shawn71

1clearhead said:


> .....didn't know you were guarding his thread from hijackers. You caught me!!!:eek:




 You really didnt know.....but Im guarding Fort Knox.


----------



## ljokerl

pastapipo said:


> Joker,
> 
> Thanks for your review on the MOE-SS01.
> I really like the overall clearness and the sound colour of the treble, what I don't like is the V shape.
> ...


 
  
 Boosting treble does result in the impression of greater clarity*, but in the case of SS01 vs Philips S1, the difference is negligible and once you spend time ear time with the S1 it won't sound less clear than the SS01 anymore. Also, while the S1 has greater subbass weight, keep in mind that it's not a very bassy earphone overall. It's only about on-par with the VSonic GR07 in overall bass quantity. 
  
 *That's not to say that a brighter earphone is always clearer than a darker-sounding one, but this is how, for example, the "Crystal Clear" BBE+ EQ setting works.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> Yes, the UE900 does all of those things very well. The BA200 lags a little in sheer expanse and its treble is not quite as present and extended, as one might expect from a warmer-sounding earphone.


 
 Thanks for your input Joker. It might work out actually since I like a more forward signature.


----------



## AgentJ

Hey Joker, one more quick question:

What's the best way to burn in some IEMs?


----------



## leogodoy

agentj said:


> Hey Joker, one more quick question:
> 
> What's the best way to burn in some IEMs?




The best way is not to. Check the Sound Science forum. There are lots of folks with different opinions, of course, but from what I understand there is no evidence IEMs benefit from burn in.


----------



## peter123

agentj said:


> Hey Joker, one more quick question:
> 
> What's the best way to burn in some IEMs?


 
 The best way to burn them in is to enjoy them


----------



## Wokei

peter123 said:


> The best way to burn them in is to enjoy them




+ 1 ...Peter ...matter of fact response and so true ....


----------



## Taveren

peter123 said:


> The best way to burn them in is to enjoy them


 
 +1, could not agree more


----------



## ozkan

agentj said:


> Hey Joker, one more quick question:
> 
> What's the best way to burn in some IEMs?


 
  
 Enjoy them while you can.


----------



## Amitl

i don't know what's wrong with me 
 the feel of an IEM is comfortable to me in the ear,
 i "need" the isolation it provides, and i love the sound of my IEM's.
 but i'm having such a hard time with the cables of all my IEM's !!
 they're all just so microphonic... even models which are considered low-cable-noise-models.
 and wearing them around the ear doesn't really eliminate it, only makes it a little bit better,
 but i still find it very annoying, doesnt really solve the problem like everyone says.
 i also hate how to cables are rubbing against my neck while wearing them around the ear.
 this is actually my main issue, the cables are just all over the front/sides of my neck
 when wearing them around the ear and i can't stand it.
 i have the VSonic VSD1S, Meelec A161P, Meelec CW31, id America Spark and Sony MHC1.
 i just don't know what to do.... (


----------



## getclikinagas

amitl said:


> i don't know what's wrong with me
> the feel of an IEM is comfortable to me in the ear,
> i "need" the isolation it provides, and i love the sound of my IEM's.
> but i'm having such a hard time with the cables of all my IEM's !!
> ...


 
 You...my friend....need these 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  

  
 http://earin.se/


----------



## AgentJ

leogodoy said:


> The best way is not to. Check the Sound Science forum. There are lots of folks with different opinions, of course, but from what I understand there is no evidence IEMs benefit from burn in.


 
  
 Oh right. I was mainly going on the idea in this thread that because my FXD80s use carbon nanotubes, that they require longer burning in.


----------



## leogodoy

agentj said:


> Oh right. I was mainly going on the idea in this thread that because my FXD80s use carbon nanotubes, that they require longer burning in.


 
  
 I've read the thread, I'd check this one as well. The FXD80 gets mentioned.


----------



## 1clearhead

peter123 said:


> The best way to burn them in is to enjoy them


 
 I definitely agree with you. Enjoy them why burning them in.
  
 I believe the diaphragms do settle in to a certain point to have a certain sound signature after time. So, do take the manual seriously if the company ask you to do so. Lots of IEM's first sound tiny or thin, but as time passes, they open up with either better midrange, treble, or even deeper bass.
  
_-Your ears know what they hear.  _


----------



## Pastapipo

ljokerl said:


> Boosting treble does result in the impression of greater clarity*, but in the case of SS01 vs Philips S1, the difference is negligible and once you spend time ear time with the S1 it won't sound less clear than the SS01 anymore. Also, while the S1 has greater subbass weight, keep in mind that it's not a very bassy earphone overall. It's only about on-par with the VSonic GR07 in overall bass quantity.
> 
> *That's not to say that a brighter earphone is always clearer than a darker-sounding one, but this is how, for example, the "Crystal Clear" BBE+ EQ setting works.




Thanks for the awnser! 
Clear is maybe not the correct term for what I mean. 
Out of the box, the Moe-ss01 sounds too bright and therefore spikey at times. 
But when I eq the highs down, the sound becomes absolutely fantastic, with excellent separation and layering. 
Thats what I mean with clear; "not muddy", while retaining a flat/dark signature. 
I cant use the eq on every device i own so the philips sound excellent for my taste, thanks joker!


----------



## Amitl

getclikinagas said:


> You...my friend....need these
> 
> 
> 
> ...




 Uh....maybe....


----------



## vidzegg

ljokerl said:


> I wish the EP2 was a little less harsh in the upper midrange - that's the biggest gripe I had with it because overall it is a very solid earphone. That said, it's not neutral-sounding - certainly not as neutral as the A161P. It's a little too mid-bassy/bloated compared to the A161P and as a result a little more congested and less detailed.


 
  
 Oh ljokerl, Lord of IEMs,
  
 I am repentant about  not listening to you and ordering RBH EP2 anyway  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 , thinking that it might suit my sonic preferences better but as usual, each word you said above is so so true. I even EQed the upper mid range to see how its sound improves. You really have touched that elusive realm of objectivity while being still confined by our essential subjectivity.
  
 EP2's detail and clarity lags behind even UE 600 which I thought was clearly already a step down from A161P. Bass is plenty but slowish, enjoyable but not much as A161P 's fast and punchy bass.
  
 Returned the EP2 while waiting for new A161P to arrive from Japan.
  
  
 Any IEMs that you  think have  similar bass *quality* to  A161P( to quote you " fast and resolving"  and "surprisingly punchy, even aggressive at times" ) and equal if not more in quantity ?? and also have no mid recession of any kind and equal or better clarity.
  
 I am asking this because I have now tried DBA-02mkII, UE 600vi and RBH EP2 and none has that kind of bass response.
  
 I would really welcome a few options.


----------



## 1clearhead

Fellow head-fier's, do you want to take a look at some reviews of the *IS-1 (Liberty's)* in China, by far?
  
 Take a look at some reviews from China's "amazon.cn" and "aliexpress.com".....
  
 1. http://www.amazon.cn/product-reviews/B00GLRTVIS/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
  
 2. http://www.amazon.cn/%E6%B5%B7%E7%BF%94-ivery-is-1%E5%B8%A6%E9%BA%A6%E7%BA%BF%E6%8E%A7%E8%80%B3%E6%9C%BA-%E9%9C%87%E6%92%BC%E4%BD%8E%E9%9F%B3%E7%8E%8B-%E5%85%BC%E5%AE%B9%E4%B8%80%E5%88%87%E6%99%BA%E8%83%BD%E6%89%8B%E6%9C%BA/product-reviews/B00DYO2AUW/ref=sr_1_1_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
  
 3. http://www.aliexpress.com/item/IS-1-New-2014-Brand-In-Ear-Earphone-with-Mic-Microphone-For-iPhone-5-Samsung-MP3/1723374386.html#feedback
  
 Note: Chinese people are very, and I mean VERY PICKY when buying products made from their own people because of QC (quality control).
  
 So, this is evidence of the IS-1's reviews making waves in China.
  
 .....need I say more?


----------



## Dynamoes1

Clearhead, I fully understand that you're excited by these IEM's and if they are as amazing as you say they are (HD800-amazing), then you deserve to be. However, it seems that you're almost trying to sell everyone the product. I can't help but get the feeling that this is a sort of advertising.
  
 What are you trying to accomplish here?


----------



## 1clearhead

dynamoes1 said:


> Clearhead, I fully understand that you're excited by these IEM's and if they are as amazing as you say they are (HD800-amazing), then you deserve to be. However, it seems that you're almost trying to sell everyone the product. I can't help but get the feeling that this is a sort of advertising.
> 
> What are you trying to accomplish here?


 
  
 -Just gave you a heads-up, that's all.....
  
 I don't make any money by being a hobbyist, if that's where you're getting at.
  
 I'm just excited about a low cost budget IEM that practically I'd never understand with the price vs. its weight in value. Hope you understand my excitement.
  
 So there's your answer.
  
 So, can I ask you? ......what are you trying to accomplish here?


----------



## kova4a

1clearhead said:


> So, can I ask you? ......what are you trying to accomplish here?


 
 Most likely to make you stop posting here. We get it - you're excited and want to share your excitement. Make one post here, contact joker and ask him whether he's willing to accept a unit for review, make a separate thread and hype as much as you want there. There's no need to make every other comment in this thread yours.
Just look the last 10 pages of this thread - half of the comments are yours and often several in a row instead of just using the EDIT button. Just go to the The discovery thread and share your discovery and hype there if you think that the separate thread you've created is not enough.
 No one is trying to stop you from sharing your experience and excitement but this is joker's review thread and people come here to read his reviews and seek his opinion - not to read other people's hype. Imagine what will happen to this thread if everyone who likes a certain iem comes here and starts posting few times a day how good that iem is.


----------



## esteebin

1clearhead said:


> .....need I say more?


 
  
 No. Please


1clearhead said:


> -Just gave you a heads-up, that's all.....
> 
> I don't make any money by being a hobbyist, if that's where you're getting at.
> 
> ...


 
  
 You've given many heads up. Maybe you should change your name to 1cloudyhead. You've brought the product to our attention, that's great! You've created a dedicated thread about it, amazing! People interested in the product will go to the thread, subscribe, ask questions, etc. But this, this is just annoying. If someone asks you on this thread about them, then fine, answer away. But to keep bringing it up, annoying.


----------



## 1clearhead

kova4a said:


> Most likely to make you stop posting here. We get it - you're excited and want to share your excitement. Make one post here, contact joker and ask him whether he's willing to accept a unit for review, make a separate thread and hype as much as you want there. There's no need to make every other comment in this thread yours.
> Just look the last 10 pages of this thread - half of the comments are yours and often several in a row instead of just using the EDIT button. Just go to the The discovery thread and share your discovery and hype there if you think that the separate thread you've created is not enough.
> No one is trying to stop you from sharing your experience and excitement but this is joker's review thread and people come here to read his reviews and seek his opinion - not to read other people's hype. Imagine what will happen to this thread if everyone who likes a certain iem comes here and starts posting few times a day how good that iem is.


 
  
 I apologize......absolutely right.
  


esteebin said:


> No. Please
> 
> You've given many heads up. Maybe you should change your name to 1cloudyhead. You've brought the product to our attention, that's great! You've created a dedicated thread about it, amazing! People interested in the product will go to the thread, subscribe, ask questions, etc. But this, this is just annoying. If someone asks you on this thread about them, then fine, answer away. But to keep bringing it up, annoying.


 
  
 Gladly noted, guys. I apologize.


----------



## 1clearhead

esteebin said:


> No. Please
> 
> You've given many heads up. Maybe you should change your name to 1cloudyhead. You've brought the product to our attention, that's great! You've created a dedicated thread about it, amazing! People interested in the product will go to the thread, subscribe, ask questions, etc. But this, this is just annoying. If someone asks you on this thread about them, then fine, answer away. But to keep bringing it up, annoying.


 
  


kova4a said:


> Most likely to make you stop posting here. We get it - you're excited and want to share your excitement. Make one post here, contact joker and ask him whether he's willing to accept a unit for review, make a separate thread and hype as much as you want there. There's no need to make every other comment in this thread yours.
> Just look the last 10 pages of this thread - half of the comments are yours and often several in a row instead of just using the EDIT button. Just go to the The discovery thread and share your discovery and hype there if you think that the separate thread you've created is not enough.
> No one is trying to stop you from sharing your experience and excitement but this is joker's review thread and people come here to read his reviews and seek his opinion - not to read other people's hype. Imagine what will happen to this thread if everyone who likes a certain iem comes here and starts posting few times a day how good that iem is.


 
  
 Sincere' apologize.


----------



## esteebin

alright. let's move on.


----------



## ljokerl

vidzegg said:


> Oh ljokerl, Lord of IEMs,
> 
> I am repentant about  not listening to you and ordering RBH EP2 anyway
> 
> ...


 
  
 That's an unfortunate experience, but I every new earphone heard is a step towards discovering what you can and can't tolerate 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 A good question about the A161P - what comes to mind are the "Heaven"-series earphones I've heard from Final Audio Design - Heaven A, Heaven C, Heaven S. The newer Heaven II seems promising as well but I haven't spent enough time with it yet to be sure. 
  
 Don't know if there are any other single-BA earphones on the market using the Knowles ED driver aside from the A161P and Etymotic's models. Most of the recent ones are hybrids that "ruin" the bass (as far as your requirements go) with an extra dynamic driver.


----------



## davidcotton

Hi Joker
  
 Just seen on your headphonelist site the brief reviews of the minerva range.  Was just wondering if the pro in silicone would be a worthwhile upgrade over the single driver mi1 (half shell) that I am using from the same company atm?  I find that it's ok for most things but obviously that single driver lacks grunt in the bass department (somewhat unsurprisingly!). 
  
 Cheers


----------



## shockdoc

Awesome thread. Even has it's very own bookmark on my desktop. Was wondering if it would be possible or desirable to have a list of IEM's that you are reviewing, planning to review or would like to review if someone would loan them or whatever. Maybe it's not feasible? Either way, thanks for all the hard work in doing this IjokerI.


----------



## ljokerl

davidcotton said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> Just seen on your headphonelist site the brief reviews of the minerva range.  Was just wondering if the pro in silicone would be a worthwhile upgrade over the single driver mi1 (half shell) that I am using from the same company atm?  I find that it's ok for most things but obviously that single driver lacks grunt in the bass department (somewhat unsurprisingly!).
> 
> Cheers


 
  
 Unfortunately I haven't had a chance to try the Minerva single-drivers. I don't know if this is helpful but I did find the Pro in silicone to be a good upgrade from the Custom Art Music One - maybe someone has compared those with the single-driver Minervas. I wouldn't say the duals have particularly high bass quantity, but they're not lacking in bass.
  


shockdoc said:


> Awesome thread. Even has it's very own bookmark on my desktop. Was wondering if it would be possible or desirable to have a list of IEM's that you are reviewing, planning to review or would like to review if someone would loan them or whatever. Maybe it's not feasible? Either way, thanks for all the hard work in doing this IjokerI.


 
  
 There's a list below the table on the front page. It's not complete, but it's a good start 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . I also have two on loan that will get a review - the 2.0 Pistons and the Sony XBA-H3.


----------



## shockdoc

I have some TDK IE800's (yeah I know discontinued) if you have any interest in reviewing them and comparing them to your recent review of the BA200.


----------



## ljokerl

shockdoc said:


> I have some TDK IE800's (yeah I know discontinued) if you have any interest in reviewing them and comparing them to your recent review of the BA200.


 
  
 I appreciate the offer but I don't think I can take on any additional reviews at this point and a discontinued item would indeed have a low priority.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the NarMoo R1M
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3B41) NarMoo R1M*
> 
> 
> Reviewed July 2013
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## suman134

can anyone compare the monster gratitude with any thing respectable or monster pro gold/copper .
 and the jbl synchros s200 .


----------



## shockdoc

ljokerl said:


> I appreciate the offer but I don't think I can take on any additional reviews at this point and a discontinued item would indeed have a low priority.


 

 No worries. Just thought since you only recently posted the BA200 (also discontinued) that you might want to contrast it to the IE800 since both are still around at a fairly significant discount. Anyone interested can read ClieOS's review of both here. http://www.head-fi.org/t/612728/review-tdk-life-in-records-eb950-ba100-ba200-and-st700-serious-business


----------



## ljokerl

shockdoc said:


> No worries. Just thought since you only recently posted the BA200 (also discontinued) that you might want to contrast it to the IE800 since both are still around at a fairly significant discount. Anyone interested can read ClieOS's review of both here. http://www.head-fi.org/t/612728/review-tdk-life-in-records-eb950-ba100-ba200-and-st700-serious-business


 
  
 The BA200 was just too good to skip over 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. It's a real shame that TDK is dropping all of their higher-end earphones.


----------



## freemind

Another great review, thank you Joker!
  
 I actually bought this a while ago, so far so good. NarMoo is doing a July 4th promotion (40% off, yes it's $18 for a set of R1M), was ended yesterday, but got an email just now from them saying, it's extended till the end of today. so for whose who might be interested in this model, you'd better be hurry 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, this is definitely a steal!


----------



## freemind

sorry forget the code: NM14JUL04


----------



## B9Scrambler

I picked up both the R1M and S1 a while back (S1 first). Both are solid IEMs at their standard price, and a great buy at the discounted rate.


----------



## deco cat

Vsonic VSD3/S in sight?


----------



## ljokerl

freemind said:


> Another great review, thank you Joker!
> 
> I actually bought this a while ago, so far so good. NarMoo is doing a July 4th promotion (40% off, yes it's $18 for a set of R1M), was ended yesterday, but got an email just now from them saying, it's extended till the end of today. so for whose who might be interested in this model, you'd better be hurry
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, that's a very nice price even without the sound tuning. The ability to add extra bass is just icing on the cake.
  


deco cat said:


> Vsonic VSD3/S in sight?


 
  
 Supposed to be on its way. Not sure when it will get to me but I'm excited to hear it.


----------



## Shawn71

ljokerl said:


> Supposed to be on its way. Not sure when it will get to me but I'm excited to hear it.




And we too are excited to see your post,on VSD3S......


----------



## suman134

is the brainwavz s5 inbound ?


----------



## giacomoba

Great job!!!! All are cool! when I need, I will let you know.


----------



## deco cat

ljokerl said:


> Supposed to be on its way. Not sure when it will get to me but I'm excited to hear it.


 
  
 From VSD3 thread in this forum:
  


> Sound tuned similar to these IEMs:
> VSD3 to Shure SE535
> VSD3S to W4R
> VSD5 to Sony EX1000


----------



## Shawn71

deco cat said:


> From VSD3 thread in this forum:
> 
> 
> :confused_face(1):




Well its posted a year ago based on Vsonic's announcements whatsoever......but its like VSD3/3S are both tuned to 4R'ish sound with VSD3 tuned w/more emphasis on bass,just like GR07-BE....And they are 535 Shell'ish with MMCX removable icables.....


----------



## Serville

Hi, I'm thinking of buying either:
 - VSonic GR02 Bass Edition
 - VSonic GR99
 - Steelseries Flux in-ear
  
 Which one will you recommend ?
 For comparison, I like the rather V-shaped Soundmagic E10 with impactful bass (but no bloat).   The strong punchy bass of E10 makes the sound more alive, at least for me.   So, I'm looking for another IEM with similar character.
 From the review, it's not clear whether GR02-BE  & Flux in Ear has the same impactful Low in comparison to E10.
 If I understand correctly, GR99 can match E10, while GR02-BE is less bassy then GR99.
 Question is how much less bassy is GR02-BE & Flux in-Ear  (to GR99 & E10) ?
 If I like the bass in E10, will I be dissapointed with GR02-BE  or Flux ?
 Is the Flux v-shaped like GR02-BE or E10 ?
  
 On a scale of 10-100%  with E10's bass considered taking 100% power, how will you rate GR02-BE & Flux-in-Ear ?
 Thanks


----------



## nehcrow

Hey joker, any plans to review the Altone200? Cheers


----------



## ZapX629

serville said:


> Hi, I'm thinking of buying either:
> - VSonic GR02 Bass Edition
> - VSonic GR99
> - Steelseries Flux in-ear
> ...


 
 I've never heard the E10's bass, but the VSD1 and VSD3 series are both generally seen as much better than the two Vsonics you've mentioned. I'd look at those along with the Flux, rather than the other two.


----------



## Xtron2112

Hiya. How do the RHA MA750 and Dunu DN1000 compare to the Vsd1 soundwise?


----------



## suman134

serville said:


> Hi, I'm thinking of buying either:
> - VSonic GR02 Bass Edition
> - VSonic GR99
> - Steelseries Flux in-ear
> ...


 
  
     if you enjoy V-shaped sound , ckx-5 and yes the vsonic vsd1 can be youe answer , vsd1 has plenty of bass , ckx has a hair less . both are nice sounding and a step up from e10 , but i think you should go for vsd1 .


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> is the brainwavz s5 inbound ?


 
  
 Nope... I haven't gotten around to reviewing Braniwavz' 2 previous releases yet. They're sitting on  a shelf somewhere. I really like the sound of the R3, just hard to wear it properly.
  


deco cat said:


> From VSD3 thread in this forum:


 
  
 I'll just judge for myself. I do expect that the VSD3 and VSD3S will sound similar with very minor details setting them apart.
  


serville said:


> Hi, I'm thinking of buying either:
> - VSonic GR02 Bass Edition
> - VSonic GR99
> - Steelseries Flux in-ear
> ...


 
  
 The GR02 BE has more bass than the E10. The GR99 is discontinued as far as I know and both the GR02 and GR99 are hard to recommend over VSonic's newer VSD1/VSD1S models. The Flux has less of a bass lift but better extension than the E10. If you want bass punch greater than or equal to the E10, don't get the Flux - it's probably too balanced for you. Get the VSD1 if you don't mind having more treble, or maybe the T-Peos D200R if you'd rather have a less v-shaped sound but still retain strong bass.
  


nehcrow said:


> Hey joker, any plans to review the Altone200? Cheers


 
  
 I should be able to get my hands on it in the near future.
  


xtron2112 said:


> Hiya. How do the RHA MA750 and Dunu DN1000 compare to the Vsd1 soundwise?


 
  
 Depends on what you're after.. the MA750 is warmer and bassier, with smoother mid/upper treble and more veiled mids. The DN-1000 is clearer and brighter, but also has better deep bass.


----------



## Xtron2112

How well do the MA750s handle faster and/more complex tracks compared to vsd1? (See my past posts to check my music tastes)


----------



## kendric

Hey Joker. Any plans to review the New Victor JVC FX850? Would be interesting to see you do a pit-off against FX700/Fitears TG334/Sennheiser IE800 and K3003!


----------



## Serville

suman134 said:


> if you enjoy V-shaped sound , ckx-5 and yes the vsonic vsd1 can be youe answer , vsd1 has plenty of bass , ckx has a hair less . both are nice sounding and a step up from e10 , but i think you should go for vsd1 .


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> The GR02 BE has more bass than the E10. The GR99 is discontinued as far as I know and both the GR02 and GR99 are hard to recommend over VSonic's newer VSD1/VSD1S models. The Flux has less of a bass lift but better extension than the E10. If you want bass punch greater than or equal to the E10, don't get the Flux - it's probably too balanced for you. Get the VSD1 if you don't mind having more treble, or maybe the T-Peos D200R if you'd rather have a less v-shaped sound but still retain strong bass.


 
  
 Thank you for the helpful answer.  After you mentioned about VSD1, I just realized that the price is hardly more expensive than GR02...only a few $ more which is totally fine with me. 
 I read the user reviews & impressions about VSD1 here, and  it sounds more convincing that it's the right one for me.
 I've been so tempted all this time to get VSonic because of their build quality reputation.  I love the cable better too than the Flux.
 The flux looks good (simple design), but I'm not so crazy about the flat cable, which ....at least for me....a little too big & stylish.  Looks more like I'm wearing a long string of linguini pasta on my ears.
 I guess I'm a little bit too conventional  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 I definitely go  with VSD1 now.  Been so excited with Vsonic, and now is the chance for me to satisfy my curiosity.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 Thank you very much.


----------



## ljokerl

xtron2112 said:


> How well do the MA750s handle faster and/more complex tracks compared to vsd1? (See my past posts to check my music tastes)


 
  
 Not any better. As you would expect, the heavier bass is not ideal for that. If you want resolution, the DN-1000 is a better choice. 
  


kendric said:


> Hey Joker. Any plans to review the New Victor JVC FX850? Would be interesting to see you do a pit-off against FX700/Fitears TG334/Sennheiser IE800 and K3003!


 
  
 No plans at this time. Don't have the FX700 anymore, anyway - it was a loan 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


serville said:


> Thank you for the helpful answer.  After you mentioned about VSD1, I just realized that the price is hardly more expensive than GR02...only a few $ more which is totally fine with me.
> I read the user reviews & impressions about VSD1 here, and  it sounds more convincing that it's the right one for me.
> I've been so tempted all this time to get VSonic because of their build quality reputation.  I love the cable better too than the Flux.
> The flux looks good (simple design), but I'm not so crazy about the flat cable, which ....at least for me....a little too big & stylish.  Looks more like I'm wearing a long string of linguini pasta on my ears.
> ...


 
  
 To be fair to the Flux, it is much less gaudy than most other flat-cabled earphones out there - the cable is fairly thin and flat black in color. I do think the VSD1 is a better option for you, though. VSonic all but made their older budget earphones obsolete with their latest couple of releases.


----------



## ZapX629

serville said:


> Thank you for the helpful answer.  After you mentioned about VSD1, I just realized that the price is hardly more expensive than GR02...only a few $ more which is totally fine with me.
> I read the user reviews & impressions about VSD1 here, and  it sounds more convincing that it's the right one for me.
> I've been so tempted all this time to get VSonic because of their build quality reputation.  I love the cable better too than the Flux.
> The flux looks good (simple design), but I'm not so crazy about the flat cable, which ....at least for me....a little too big & stylish.  Looks more like I'm wearing a long string of linguini pasta on my ears.
> ...


 
 Just so you know, the VSD3 series has better soundstage, instrument separation, and a bit more detail than the VSD1. No one is sure yet how the VSD1 and VSD3's bass compares (we've only heard the VSD3S which has more neutral, but a bit deeper bass), since there aren't any VSD3 reviews yet, but its price is not that much more than the VSD1 if you would be willing to wait until Lend Me Ur Ears or some other asian retailer gets more in. If you can't wait though, the VSD1 will still be a very nice upgrade.


----------



## Xtron2112

Between the MA750 and the DN1000, which one is more durable? I want to reduce the risk of them breaking like my vsd1.


----------



## Xtron2112

I dunno guys, the MA750 seems to win out in every category but sound signature. My concern is that it might be a downgrade soundwise from my vsd1.


----------



## sergiuo

Hey guys,
 Been on the market for some new IEMs for EDM music, mainly dnb, tech-house, psy, techno. I've made my research and I've narrowed down the list to Yamaha EPH-100 , shure se215, beyerdinamic DX 160ie and rha ma750. Maybe there are better options, sadly these are the only ones for which I could find recommendations for edm music. Perhaps you could help me choose one of these, not really sure which one would deliver the best sound. Thanks


----------



## YoloSwaggins

Hey guys, im new here and im interested in buying either the philips she3580/3590 or the monoprice 8320

I listen to a lot of EDM/ Progressive House etc, so i like a lot of bass in my music, does the philips she3580/3590 have a good bass and a nice over clear sound? And does it have a wider soundstage than the monoprice?

Im also open to suggestions


----------



## ZapX629

In that price range, I really like the 3590 for EDM, but I'm sure Joker can recommend you even more good options in that price bracket.


----------



## Ap616

sergiuo said:


> Hey guys,
> Been on the market for some new IEMs for EDM music, mainly dnb, tech-house, psy, techno. I've made my research and I've narrowed down the list to Yamaha EPH-100 , shure se215, beyerdinamic DX 160ie and rha ma750. Maybe there are better options, sadly these are the only ones for which I could find recommendations for edm music. Perhaps you could help me choose one of these, not really sure which one would deliver the best sound. Thanks


 
 Everybody seems to really enjoy the EPH-100s for EDM and the like. I had them for awhile, but sold them to my dad. The isolation is fantastic, and he uses them for mowing under over-the-ear mowing headphones. He EQs the EPH-100 like crazy though in the treble cause he is a bit of a treblehead... I didn't like the fit, but I'm in a small percentage on that I think. They were also too bassy for my taste which I wouldn't have guessed, and the scooped out highs that made them too smooth and un-bright were not for me. And my ears are somewhat treble sensitive oddly... 
  
 As far as I know(though I haven't heard the other three) the RHAs and Yamahas are techinically superior to the other two in the detail and clarity. The mids are more full & lush with the EPH-100 and more backseat on the MA750 supposedly. The RHAs are supposed to have more sparkle in the lower treble compared to the Yamahas.
  
 I really REALLY like and recommend the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore though I know people have had issues with them. I haven't at all thankfully! And for reference I mainly listen to EDM type music. They are just plain awesome in my opinion. Really smooth and full across the FR. Also cheaper than the EPHs and considerably more than the MA750s if that any consideration.


----------



## ljokerl

xtron2112 said:


> Between the MA750 and the DN1000, which one is more durable? I want to reduce the risk of them breaking like my vsd1.


 
  
 Hard to say for sure but I'd give the nod to the MA750.
  


sergiuo said:


> Hey guys,
> Been on the market for some new IEMs for EDM music, mainly dnb, tech-house, psy, techno. I've made my research and I've narrowed down the list to Yamaha EPH-100 , shure se215, beyerdinamic DX 160ie and rha ma750. Maybe there are better options, sadly these are the only ones for which I could find recommendations for edm music. Perhaps you could help me choose one of these, not really sure which one would deliver the best sound. Thanks


 
  
 I've only heard the DTX160iE at a show briefly, but my current pick for EDM is definitely the EPH-100. 
  


yoloswaggins said:


> Hey guys, im new here and im interested in buying either the philips she3580/3590 or the monoprice 8320
> 
> I listen to a lot of EDM/ Progressive House etc, so i like a lot of bass in my music, does the philips she3580/3590 have a good bass and a nice over clear sound? And does it have a wider soundstage than the monoprice?
> 
> Im also open to suggestions


 
  
 I would pick the Philips as well. They don't have the soundstage of the Monoprices but the signature will work better for EDM.


----------



## Grayson73

Joker posted the review of the Xiaomi Piston 2.0.  8.1 for sound for only $25!  The next one with 8.1 is VSonic VC02 at $49.
  
 http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/xiaomi-piston-2/


----------



## Pastapipo

Wow, 8.1.
 I tried them myself and found them to be too U shaped. Mids were totally recessed to my ears.
 The highs of the Pistons are natural and the best I've heard in a long time. The bass was to mid-bassy for me.
  
 I wouldn't give them a 8.1, but then again, I haven't heard anything near a percentage of iems joker has. He is the sole reason I started this hobby anyway. 
  
 BTW I tried the Ivery IS1 clearhead was hyping a while ago. There nothing special. Fine for the price paid, but far to bassy and veiled over the rest of the spectrum.


----------



## kova4a

I'm not really surprised by that Piston score. I expected it to score somewhere circa mh1 though to put things into perspective my first pairs of mh1c cost me $15 and the mh1 I got months into the hype still cost me like $25, so I can't just say "WOW, I have never heard anything like this for only 20 bucks".
 Of course, the Piston's hype got a little bit out of hand with stuff like being the best sub-$100 iem, being better than all vsonics and that probably raised some expectations a bit too high. 
 I personally wasn't too impressed but I acknowledged that I can imagine someone liking them a lot if that's the type of sound he's looking for. My main issue with them was the bass. which is exactly the opposite of what I like - slow, lacking control and proper attack.


----------



## ljokerl

pastapipo said:


> Wow, 8.1.
> I tried them myself and found them to be too U shaped. Mids were totally recessed to my ears.
> The highs of the Pistons are natural and the best I've heard in a long time. The bass was to mid-bassy for me.


 
  
 All true for the mids and bass, but still so very far ahead of average among sub-$50 IEMs (except maybe the bass bloat)
  


kova4a said:


> I'm not really surprised by that Piston score. I expected it to score somewhere circa mh1 though to put things into perspective my first pairs of mh1c cost me $15 and the mh1 I got months into the hype still cost me like $25, so I can't just say "WOW, I have never heard anything like this for only 20 bucks".
> Of course, the Piston's hype got a little bit out of hand with stuff like being the best sub-$100 iem, being better than all vsonics and that probably raised some expectations a bit too high.
> I personally wasn't too impressed but I acknowledged that I can imagine someone liking them a lot if that's the type of sound he's looking for. My main issue with them was the bass. which is exactly the opposite of what I like - slow, lacking control and proper attack.


 
  
 When writing the review that was pretty much my line of thinking - if only the sub-$25 MH1C supply on ebay hadn't run out, I would have been less impressed with the Pistons. I still prefer the MH1C, personally, but I think the Piston has more of a "wow" factor for the average listener.
  
 BTW, the DN-2000 comparison was actually prompted by someone sending a PM asking whether the Piston is better 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> When writing the review that was pretty much my line of thinking - if only the sub-$25 MH1C supply on ebay hadn't run out, I would have been less impressed with the Pistons. I still prefer the MH1C, personally, but I think the Piston has more of a "wow" factor for the average listener.
> 
> BTW, the DN-2000 comparison was actually prompted by someone sending a PM asking whether the Piston is better
> 
> ...


 
 Well, the thing is that here in Europe one can still get the sony for around $20 on amazon uk coming with the tips in two colors like the retail package. 
And now after all that hype and the Pistons selling for circa 30 I can't really be that impressed with them while the mh1 is still available and especially given that a month ago I got my vsd3s for $37. 
And yeah, as I said the hype got crazy with claims the Pistons were better than dn1k and other more expensive stuff and that's why I said some people have unrealistic expectations. Now, for someone who hasn't heard anything better they will be very impressive. And it will save them a lot of money in the long run coz I'm pretty sure there are a lot of people who have the Pistons and now due to the hype think they can only upgrade them if they spend north of 200 bucks, so they'll stick to them


----------



## Joe Bloggs

Hi joker, did you try the Xiaomi Pistons with Dirac HD on a Xiaomi phone?


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> Well, the thing is that here in Europe one can still get the sony for around $20 on amazon uk coming with the tips in two colors like the retail package.
> And now after all that hype and the Pistons selling for circa 30 I can't really be that impressed with them while the mh1 is still available and especially given that a month ago I got my vsd3s for $37.
> And yeah, as I said the hype got crazy with claims the Pistons were better than dn1k and other more expensive stuff and that's why I said some people have unrealistic expectations. Now, for someone who hasn't heard anything better they will be very impressive. And it will save them a lot of money in the long run coz I'm pretty sure there are a lot of people who have the Pistons and now due to the hype think they can only upgrade them if they spend north of 200 bucks, so they'll stick to them


 
  
 Doesn't seem to be limiting the number of higher-end options hitting the market, so that's fine by me. I see myself recommending the Pistons quite often though, especially as the PM I receive most often these days is "Recommend me a ($25/$30/$40/$50) earphone for EDM with lots of bass and crystal clear treble... bro"
  


joe bloggs said:


> Hi joker, did you try the Xiaomi Pistons with Dirac HD on a Xiaomi phone?


 
  
 Nope, sorry.


----------



## Grayson73

pastapipo said:


> Wow, 8.1.
> I tried them myself and found them to be too U shaped. Mids were totally recessed to my ears.
> The highs of the Pistons are natural and the best I've heard in a long time. The bass was to mid-bassy for me.
> 
> ...


 
 Did you remove the filters?  If not, give it a try.


----------



## kova4a

grayson73 said:


> Did you remove the filters?  If not, give it a try.


 
 If you're referring to the Pistons' foam I personally strongly advise against it.


----------



## Grayson73

kova4a said:


> If you're referring to the Pistons' foam I personally strongly advise against it.


 
 Most people have said that it's better without the foam.  It extends the treble and makes it more balanced.


----------



## kova4a

grayson73 said:


> Most people have said that it's better without the foam.  It extends the treble and makes it more balanced.


 
 Nah, it opens up slightly the sound and ruins the bass impact and the treble response. I guarantee you that if Tyll had measured the Pistons with the foams removed it would measure very bad in the 300Hz square wave and the impulse response graph.
 I also have to admit that while I assume why joker decided to go for the m6's tips for the Pistons aside from the better fit, I kinda question his choice coz the choice of tips for the Pistons is kinda hard and can change the final review in several places. For instance the M6's tips give probably the most acceptable bass for me from the Pistons - less boomy and out of control but they reduce the treble, especially the top extension, while using wider bore tips opens up the sound but make the bass softer and boomier but then you can't say the vsd1s sounds more spacious. Overall my personal choice will be the meelec rx12's tips or the brainwavz Delta's ones coz they are exactly the same.
 Anyway, just my 2 cents.


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> Nah, it opens up slightly the sound and ruins the bass impact and the treble response. I guarantee you that if Tyll had measured the Pistons with the foams removed it would measure very bad in the 300Hz square wave and the impulse response graph.
> I also have to admit that while I assume why joker decided to go for the m6's tips for the Pistons aside from the better fit, I kinda question his choice coz the choice of tips for the Pistons is kinda hard and can change the final review in several places. For instance the M6's tips give probably the most acceptable bass for me from the Pistons - less boomy and out of control but they reduce the treble, especially the top extension, while using wider bore tips opens up the sound but make the bass softer and boomier but then you can't say the vsd1s sounds more spacious. Overall my personal choice will be the meelec rx12's tips or the brainwavz Delta's ones coz they are exactly the same.
> Anyway, just my 2 cents.


 
  
 Right, with the tubby housings of the Pistons I was just happy to find a single-flange that was both comfortable/secure and not terribly boomy.


----------



## danikus

So, how much approximately does vsd3s score sound quality wise? My guess is 8.4


----------



## steelglam

Hi ljokerl,
  
 I read your review of the Xiaomi Piston 2 and am very interested in it.
  
 I'm wondering how it compares to the Fidue A63 overall.  I note that you said that it is not mid-forward like the Fidue nor as forgiving in the top-end, and that it doesn't lag behind the Fidue in terms of clarity.
  
 Compared to the Fidue, are the mids any more veiled in the Xiaomi?  Which is more detailed?  Which is more dynamic?  I assume the Xiaomi is warmer than the Fidue, but does that warmth make it a less quality performer in the midrange compared to the Fidue, or does it simply take the midrange clarity of the Fidue and add a bit of warmth and weight to the low-end without sacrificing any of the midrange clarity and detail of the Fidue?
  
 I like the Fidue, but I could use a bit more presence/weight in the bottom-end, as long as it doesn't sacrifice the midrange clarity and detail of the Fidue (which is the best part of the Fidue, in my opinion) and as long as the bass isn't too boomy.
  
 Thanks in advance for any thoughts that you have on the matter.


----------



## ljokerl

danikus said:


> So, how much approximately does vsd3s score sound quality wise? My guess is 8.4


 
  
 Haven't received it yet :/
  


steelglam said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> I read your review of the Xiaomi Piston 2 and am very interested in it.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, it's as you would expect - the A63 has tighter bass but also less of it, more forward mids, and smoother treble. The Piston sounds boomy in comparison but has better bass extension also. It's warmer and more full-bodied. A little more veiled, but not as much as you might expect from such a bassy earphone.
  
 Except for the bass, where the Piston loses a bit of refinement/control, I didn't think either had an advantage in detail, etc.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Haven't received it yet :/


 
  
    then what about vsd1 ?


----------



## threi

Sooo....Pistons over SHE3580?


----------



## suman134

threi said:


> Sooo....Pistons over SHE3580?


 
  
   simple ans short , if you leave the bass , yes .


----------



## DrunkenTiger

Best sub 40$ earbuds? Doesn't need to be very bassy.


----------



## ZapX629

drunkentiger said:


> Best sub 40$ earbuds? Doesn't need to be very bassy.


 
 I'd recommend VSD3S for $45.  They pretty much beat everything under $40 I've heard. If it has to be under $40, maybe VSD1S (my preference), Xiaomi Pistons, LG quadbeat (not much bass but very nice clarity for the price) from stuff I've listened to personally. There's a lot of nice stuff under $40. Depends what kind of sound you like.


----------



## ljokerl

threi said:


> Sooo....Pistons over SHE3580?


 
  
 Compared them the other day in the comments here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/xiaomi-piston-2/#comment-11553 \
  
 If you're okay with the extra bass (and extra bass bloat) of the Pistons and/or just prefer warmer and more full-bodied sound, the Xiaomi set wins out. Otherwise, the SHE3580 is the better option. SQ difference between them isn't very big. 
  
  


drunkentiger said:


> Best sub 40$ earbuds? Doesn't need to be very bassy.


 
  
 Lots of good options depending on what exactly you're after. LG QuadBeat recommended above is very nice for about $30. Punchy but not bass-heavy. Philips SHE3580 is pretty good with more bass, but not an overwhelming amount. The newer Philips TX1 fits the bill as well, especially if you like earphones that insert more shallowly into the ear.


----------



## DrunkenTiger

I recommended him those Xiaomi's, the gold colored ones. Thanks for the info, I'll let him know of those options too.


----------



## 370685

Are you planning to review the new Pioneer DJE-2000/DJE-1500 series any time soon?http://swingdjresources.com/pioneer-dje-2000-dje-1500/
 The DJE-1500 seems to be a better value.
  
 Thread:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/708529/pioneer-new-dj-in-ear-headphones-dje-2000-and-dje-1500


----------



## ljokerl

sorieno said:


> Are you planning to review the new Pioneer DJE-2000/DJE-1500 series any time soon?http://swingdjresources.com/pioneer-dje-2000-dje-1500/
> The DJE-1500 seems to be a better value.
> 
> Thread:
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/708529/pioneer-new-dj-in-ear-headphones-dje-2000-and-dje-1500


 
  
 The design looks nice but I haven't been very impressed with any Pioneer headphones in the past, so I haven't looked into testing these.


----------



## Grayson73

Joker, what SQ rating would you give VSD1/VSD1S?


----------



## ljokerl

grayson73 said:


> Joker, what SQ rating would you give VSD1/VSD1S?


 
  
 Same as Fidue A63/SS Flux, 8.2. While I personally prefer the signature of the VSD1S to these others, I can never decide which is better when A:Bing them (which I've done extensively).  I do think the VSD1S is better than the VSonic VC02 and GR06, though, which puts it above an 8.1.


----------



## reihead

Speaking of SQ rating, what would you give the Dunu DN-2000 ?


----------



## ljokerl

reihead said:


> Speaking of SQ rating, what would you give the Dunu DN-2000 ?


 
  
 Not entirely sure yet, but i do think it is better than the DN-1000, which puts it pretty high up there


----------



## insidedrive

Hello, how does the Onkyo IEMS compare with the Vsonic GR07 and TDK BA200 and which sweet do you prefer? Also what rating would you give it?


----------



## ljokerl

insidedrive said:


> Hello, how does the Onkyo IEMS compare with the Vsonic GR07 and TDK BA200 and which sweet do you prefer? Also what rating would you give it?


 
  
 The Onkyo HF300 is pretty good for $100 but I wouldn't put it in the same league as a GR07 or BA200. It's more on the level of the RBH EP1 - generally good, especially for the consumer market, but with some sonic flaws. I found it quite mid-bassy and warm compared to the GR07/BA200; it ends up sounding a little bloated and veiled. The Bass Edition of the GR07 is closer in bass impact but still quicker/tighter/more resolving, and clearer overall. Other aspects are comparable but because of this I wouldn't quite call the HF300 a top-tier earphone. Also, except for the cable connectors the construction feels a little cheap, but it's far from the worst for the price.


----------



## suman134

i know its annoying as we are asking about various phones , but do you have an assessment of xba-h3 ?


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> i know its annoying as we are asking about various phones , but do you have an assessment of xba-h3 ?


 
  
 Not quite yet, but it'll be up there in the 9.x range, around the Dunu DN-1000 and Westone W4/W40.


----------



## kakari

Which one is the best: Audio Technica IM50 or Yamaha EPH100 or Hifiman RE-400?
  
 I have only listened to the IM50 and felt it was quite balanced,  but leaning to the bassy side. The bass really goes deep. I have no way of listening to the other two, so I wish to ask for some advice. I listen mostly to pop.
  
 Is the EPH100 and RE-400 really worth $50 more than the IM50?


----------



## suman134

kakari said:


> Which one is the best: Audio Technica IM50 or Yamaha EPH100 or Hifiman RE-400?
> 
> I have only listened to the IM50 and felt it was quite balanced,  but leaning to the bassy side. The bass really goes deep. I have no way of listening to the other two, so I wish to ask for some advice. I listen mostly to pop.
> 
> Is the EPH100 and RE-400 really worth $50 more than the IM50?


 
  
     go for eph-100 , its worth it , you will enjoy it for sure , re-400 lacks bass , it dont lean towards any where , not at all towards bass .


----------



## kakari

suman134 said:


> go for eph-100 , its worth it , you will enjoy it for sure , re-400 lacks bass , it dont lean towards any where , not at all towards bass .


 

 I hear from quite a few reports that the build quality, specifically strain relief of the IEM, is pretty bad. Have you encounter a similar problem and what do you feel about the comfort? Thanks.


----------



## suman134

kakari said:


> I hear from quite a few reports that the build quality, specifically strain relief of the IEM, is pretty bad. Have you encounter a similar problem and what do you feel about the comfort? Thanks.


 

   no phone is safe with me sadly , yanking the cable and damaging the cable can be an issue , and the double flanges bother abit , but i have my cc51p tips that helps big time . single flanges are good . and about deeper fit , im good with it and used to it , now a days at times it feels odd if the fit is not deep enough .


----------



## ljokerl

kakari said:


> Which one is the best: Audio Technica IM50 or Yamaha EPH100 or Hifiman RE-400?
> 
> I have only listened to the IM50 and felt it was quite balanced,  but leaning to the bassy side. The bass really goes deep. I have no way of listening to the other two, so I wish to ask for some advice. I listen mostly to pop.
> 
> Is the EPH100 and RE-400 really worth $50 more than the IM50?


 
  
 I personally haven't tried the IM50. There's a huge difference in sound signature (esp. bass quantity) between the RE-400 and EPH-100, though, so you should figure out if you're after flat/somewhat mid-centric (RE-400) or warm and powerful, with very deep bass (EPH-100) before considering either.


----------



## kakari

ljokerl said:


> I personally haven't tried the IM50. There's a huge difference in sound signature (esp. bass quantity) between the RE-400 and EPH-100, though, so you should figure out if you're after flat/somewhat mid-centric (RE-400) or warm and powerful, with very deep bass (EPH-100) before considering either.


 

 Do all the IEMs that use the ~6mm microdrivers, such as the JVC FXD80 and Yamaha EPH100, have a more or less V-shape sound signature?


----------



## Ap616

kakari said:


> Do all the IEMs that use the ~6mm microdrivers, such as the JVC FXD80 and Yamaha EPH100, have a more or less V-shape sound signature?




No, not at all in my experience with both of these. I can say the EPH-100 are rich and warm and bassy. They have smooth forward mids as well but laid back treble, so they aren't v-shaped. 

The HA-FXD80 are v-shaped. The bass is nicely present and subbass oriented. The mids takes quite a step back and the upper treble is accentuated upon initial listen, but after many hours on them the highs are tamed a bit(but still accentuated) and mids come out to play more. They sound great to me if I want to listen to a different type of sound/signature than normal. 
Thanks for help in choosing them Joker!  I do quite enjoy them once I got some more comfortable tips than the stock ones that didn't seal well. Had to use the Auvio tips from Radioshack recommended on their thread.

Another micro driver earphone is the Zero Audio Carbo Tenores. They are relatively flat with a little bit enhanced bass and smooth but amazing treble. Haven't tried the IM-50 or RE-400. Hope this helps


----------



## ljokerl

^ Glad you like them!
  


kakari said:


> Do all the IEMs that use the ~6mm microdrivers, such as the JVC FXD80 and Yamaha EPH100, have a more or less V-shape sound signature?


 
  
 The SE215 from Shure uses a very small dynamic driver as well, and is not v-shaped, so it's hard to say there's a rule. Maybe a slight trend.


----------



## kakari

ljokerl said:


> ^ Glad you like them!
> 
> 
> The SE215 from Shure uses a very small dynamic driver as well, and is not v-shaped, so it's hard to say there's a rule. Maybe a slight trend.


 
 Just got my EPH-100 .
  
 My first impressions are that they are more trebley and less bassy than the SE215 and IM50. From my memory, bass quantity wise, IM50>SE215>EPH-100>FXD80. Bass quality wise, EPH-100>IM50=FXD80>SE215.
  
 While the EPH-100 doesn't reach as low as the IM50, there is still enough thump when bass is needed. The bass on the IM50 is just too much to handle for me to handle and can be quite tiring. The treble is a little laid back and smooth, lacks the "shine" and timbre of the JVC FXD80, but not enough to be called un-revealing. Sound signature is less V-shape than the FXD80. I would still consider the FXD80 to be more fun to listen, and the price is ~40% of the EPH-100.
  
 Overall, I am happy about the purchase on EPH-100. The aluminum enclosure looks really nice. If the treble is tuned more forward and have more "attack" on it, it would have been perfect.
  
 Thanks |Joker| for the recommendation~


----------



## ljokerl

kakari said:


> Just got my EPH-100 .
> 
> My first impressions are that they are more trebley and less bassy than the SE215 and IM50. From my memory, bass quantity wise, IM50>SE215>EPH-100>FXD80. Bass quality wise, EPH-100>IM50=FXD80>SE215.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Are you absolute sure they're genuine? Just asking. The unit I tested had plenty of bass, not lacking compared to the SE215 for sure. Treble is a little relaxed, yes. There's a peak somewhere in the upper treble but it's not enough to bring the overall energy back up :/


----------



## lahin

Hi joker,
 First, thanks a lot for you contribution to the community. It takes some real commitment to do what you do.
 I'm looking to buy a nice set of IEMs for about $125. I mostly listen to electronic music and melodic death metal. I currently have Vsonic GR02 bass editions and V-Moda crossfade LP2s. I'm not fully satisfied with the bass impact of the Vsonics, but I love my V-Modas. I'm currently looking at Yamaha EPH-100, RHA ma750i, ATH-IM50, and Shure SE215 LTD. I'm open to suggestions too. I'd really appreciate your advice. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

lahin said:


> Hi joker,
> First, thanks a lot for you contribution to the community. It takes some real commitment to do what you do.
> I'm looking to buy a nice set of IEMs for about $125. I mostly listen to electronic music and melodic death metal. I currently have Vsonic GR02 bass editions and V-Moda crossfade LP2s. I'm not fully satisfied with the bass impact of the Vsonics, but I love my V-Modas. I'm currently looking at Yamaha EPH-100, RHA ma750i, ATH-IM50, and Shure SE215 LTD. I'm open to suggestions too. I'd really appreciate your advice. Thanks!


 
  
 EPH-100 or MA750 are probably your best bet. They're not far apart in bass impact and overall sound quality but if you listen at lower volumes the EPH-100 is probably better because the mids are less recessed. There's also the RHA MA600, which is worse than the MA750 overall but has more bass than the 750 and most other earphones.


----------



## encoreAC

Would be nice to see some of asian hype phones included like Vsonic VSD3(S), Zero Audio Tenore/Basso and Ostry KC06(A)


----------



## altrunox

encoreac said:


> Would be nice to see some of asian hype phones included like Vsonic VSD3(S), Zero Audio Tenore/Basso and Ostry KC06(A)


 
 don't forget about the Havi B3 Pro 1.


----------



## lahin

Thanks joker. I think I'll be getting the EPH-100.


----------



## ljokerl

encoreac said:


> Would be nice to see some of asian hype phones included like Vsonic VSD3(S), Zero Audio Tenore/Basso and Ostry KC06(A)


 
  
 Xiaomi Piston also. Already covered that one. I do have a KC06 and will probably get to review the VSD3(S) as well.


----------



## suman134

guys get the she3900 , just got mine , for $9 , these are more like 3680 , not much v-shaped like she3590 , got rid of the excess bass too , and god , super pleased , looks really nice , and got 90 degree plug too , sound is a bit dark for now but i hope it will improve and from now i can say , bass got serious definition .


----------



## suman134

hey guys , just noticed this on the new she3900 .
  

  
   see , thats the new grill !! and you cant complain about L/R marking , too big to worry about .


----------



## pkalra67

suman134 said:


> hey guys , just noticed this on the new she3900 .
> 
> 
> 
> ...



How is the isolation? Is it better than on 3590? Are the eartips same on both?


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> hey guys , just noticed this on the new she3900 .
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Yeah thats the oval nozzle as the successful pan hje120s and current 3590s does have same .......


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> Yeah thats the oval nozzle as the successful pan hje120s and current 3590s does have same .......


 

 i have the 3590 , they dont have it .
 still , new for me , and isolation is okay , still better then 3580 .


----------



## Joe Bloggs

suman134 said:


> shawn71 said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah thats the oval nozzle as the successful pan hje120s and current 3590s does have same .......
> ...




People on my thread are reporting oval nozzles on some 3590 as well :blink: Mine doesn't have it either


----------



## shockdoc

Hope this isn't the wrong place to ask this. I follow this thread religiously and use it as a comparison for most of my IEM purchases. I'm looking for a budget IEM for my son in law. I would like decent sound (doesn't have to be spectacular as he's not an audiophile at all). More importantly he needs good isolation (wearing them on the train) and more than anything something that's durable, cables etc. as he's rough on his gear. I'd appreciate any recommendations. TIA


----------



## Grayson73

ljokerl said:


> Xiaomi Piston also. Already covered that one. I do have a KC06 and will probably get to review the VSD3(S) as well.


 
 Great!  Looking forward to KC06 review.  Agree with previous poster, Havi B3 Pro 1 and Zero Audio offerings (Tenore, Singolo, Doppio) have been getting a lot of hype.  Lately, also T-Peos Altone 200 and TTPOD T1E


----------



## ljokerl

joe bloggs said:


> People on my thread are reporting oval nozzles on some 3590 as well
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Round nozzles here as well.
  


shockdoc said:


> Hope this isn't the wrong place to ask this. I follow this thread religiously and use it as a comparison for most of my IEM purchases. I'm looking for a budget IEM for my son in law. I would like decent sound (doesn't have to be spectacular as he's not an audiophile at all). More importantly he needs good isolation (wearing them on the train) and more than anything something that's durable, cables etc. as he's rough on his gear. I'd appreciate any recommendations. TIA


 
  
 How "budget"? If it's $60-ish, that sounds like an Etymotic MC5 to me - the best isolation you'll get for the price, clear (non enhanced-bass) sound, reinforced cables. If you can go up to $100, the Shure SE215 would be a good choice - it has user-replaceable cables, which are a plus for longevity, and a bassier sound signature that's generally better-suited for non-audiophile users.


----------



## ljokerl

Almost forgot - fans of bass who write reviews should enter the Tekfusion Twinwoofers review giveaway (http://www.head-fi.org/t/727366/tekfusion-twinwoofers-in-ear-headphones-reviewers-needed) - they're among the bassiest units I've heard in a while


----------



## ZapX629

Yeah, I posted some pics of the new oval nozzles here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/561951/philips-she3580-iem-review-how-can-something-sound-so-good-for-10/870#post_10728549
  
 Looks like Philips are doing that for more models.


----------



## neo5468

Hey joker. Can you recommend any in ear headphones for running? For around 50€.


----------



## shockdoc

neo5468 said:


> Hey joker. Can you recommend any in ear headphones for running? For around 50€.


 
 I'm not IjokerI but I'm an avid runner and have tried quite a few different 'phones over the years. A good running IEM really depends on what you want out of it. Placement? Overear vs. straight down cables. Isolation? Some prefer to be able to hear a little of what's going on around them while others prefer as much isolation as possible (not recommended if you run near traffic). Sound sig. of course is very individual but many like a more "fun" signature for running and more bass since you likely won't hear a lot of detail over the noise of running and breathing heavily. Also microphonics is often a huge deal often for runners. Right at this moment my go to running 'phones are my TDK EB950's (unfortunately discontinued but may be able to find some around) and I'm reviewing a pair of Brainwavz S5's that I really really like for running (when worn the specific way I wear them they isolate really well and have little to no microphonics). Unfortunately they're a little more expensive than you're looking for. Hope I didn't intrude by offering my thoughts.


----------



## suman134

neo5468 said:


> Hey joker. Can you recommend any in ear headphones for running? For around 50€.


 

   go for ckx-9 or 7 , they have a sturdy fit , wont fall even if you run and have a good enough cable too . i have the ckx-9 and they sound good enough , and you can slightly hear your surrounding too . if you wear clothes , put the cable under them . or an arm band pouch will do wonders .


----------



## neo5468

shockdoc said:


> I'm not IjokerI but I'm an avid runner and have tried quite a few different 'phones over the years. A good running IEM really depends on what you want out of it. Placement? Overear vs. straight down cables. Isolation? Some prefer to be able to hear a little of what's going on around them while others prefer as much isolation as possible (not recommended if you run near traffic). Sound sig. of course is very individual but many like a more "fun" signature for running and more bass since you likely won't hear a lot of detail over the noise of running and breathing heavily. Also microphonics is often a huge deal often for runners. Right at this moment my go to running 'phones are my TDK EB950's (unfortunately discontinued but may be able to find some around) and I'm reviewing a pair of Brainwavz S5's that I really really like for running (when worn the specific way I wear them they isolate really well and have little to no microphonics). Unfortunately they're a little more expensive than you're looking for. Hope I didn't intrude by offering my thoughts.


 
  
  


suman134 said:


> go for ckx-9 or 7 , they have a sturdy fit , wont fall even if you run and have a good enough cable too . i have the ckx-9 and they sound good enough , and you can slightly hear your surrounding too . if you wear clothes , put the cable under them . or an arm band pouch will do wonders .


 
  
 Thanks both for feedback.


----------



## leogodoy

I am using a Meelec M6 following joker's recommendation. It sounds good and the fit and price are perfect for something that will wear and tear a lot during running.


----------



## ljokerl

neo5468 said:


> Hey joker. Can you recommend any in ear headphones for running? For around 50€.


 
  


leogodoy said:


> I am using a Meelec M6 following joker's recommendation. It sounds good and the fit and price are perfect for something that will wear and tear a lot during running.


 
  
 Yeah, this is still the one I recommend most often for sports. Pretty decent and priced to almost be disposable. The ATH-CKX series is good as well, just less disposable. They start at around $50 here in the US. The only other sweat-resistant set I've tried recently was the Westone Adventure Alpha and that was pretty disappointing.


----------



## neo5468

Damn ATH-CKX9 look so freaking sexy. The only store I can buy them from is amazon.de, for 80€. Is it really worth it over those cheap M6? I could't find those particular sets in joker's review list. You guys have any reliable reviews on them ?


----------



## suman134

neo5468 said:


> Damn ATH-CKX9 look so freaking sexy. The only store I can buy them from is amazon.de, for 80€. Is it really worth it over those cheap M6? I could't find those particular sets in joker's review list. You guys have any reliable reviews on them ?


 
  
    Ask me , i will say a big yess !! has far more details and these guys dont depend on cable guides to stay in place , they use wings and to me these are more sturdy and stable . but keep in mind that these are kind of huge , you know like a 16mm driver inside it ( which it has ) , so keeping the size in mind chose between ckx-9 or 7 . 7 is smaller and will fit a smaller ear but ckx-9 might not fit cuz the whole driver is supposed to be in side your ear .


----------



## ljokerl

neo5468 said:


> Damn ATH-CKX9 look so freaking sexy. The only store I can buy them from is amazon.de, for 80€. Is it really worth it over those cheap M6? I could't find those particular sets in joker's review list. You guys have any reliable reviews on them ?


 
  
 I have the cheaper CKX5 (which should be in your price range) and it's good. Has that typical audio-technica sound - plenty of bass, clear mids, crisp but slightly edgy treble. V-shaped sound, but not severely so. The CKX5 model is the smallest of the three and it's still pretty big, but definitely manageable. The rubber ear fin thing can be removed if necessary, though they look ugly without it.


----------



## jant71

neo5468 said:


> Hey joker. Can you recommend any in ear headphones for running? For around 50€.


 

 You'd probably want over the ear for running. AT has some new ones in that price range...http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=https://www.audio-technica.co.jp/atj/show_model.php%3FmodelId%3D2619&prev=/search%3Fq%3DATH-sport3%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3DV1n%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-USfficial
  
 For sale here for ~36.50 before shipping choice if you have a way to buy them...http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/NEOACS-37391
  
 M6 is okay but you might want better sound. CKX are made to stay in but don't really cure running microphonics like over the ear can. There should be other choices on Amazon if you are limited to it. Should be the Senn/addidas CX685 on there.


----------



## neo5468

jant71 said:


> You'd probably want over the ear for running. AT has some new ones in that price range...http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=https://www.audio-technica.co.jp/atj/show_model.php%3FmodelId%3D2619&prev=/search%3Fq%3DATH-sport3%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3DV1n%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-USfficial


 
  
 Those probably wont be available in Europe anytime soon. ATH-CKX5 seems like perfect buds for me, and they priced really good. The only thing i'm concerning about is how will the fit hold? I mean, because of those wings, I wont be able to wear them over the ear right ? How is the fit while running ? I never had any headphones with that kind of design before. Cheers for all the answers !


----------



## insidedrive

Hi Joker! Any initial impressions on the Ostry KC06?


----------



## kova4a

Btw, as I was going to give my Philips TX2 to my brother I decided I would buy a white pair for myself to replace it and ran into a whole bunch of $14 offers for the TX2 on ebay. I know for a fact that these are the exact same sellers who were selling it for $39 months ago, so I don't know what's going on. I picked a random seller with high reputation as the one I got my first pair from is one of the few who still has the standard price but I'll report when or if I receive my pair. Coz if it all turns out well a TX2 for 14 bucks will be an insane bargain.


----------



## ZapX629

Well, damn. I just bought an XBA-1 for 10 bucks, and I've got my VSD3S in my ears all the time these days. Are they better in any way than what I've got?


----------



## kova4a

zapx629 said:


> Well, damn. I just bought an XBA-1 for 10 bucks, and I've got my VSD3S in my ears all the time these days. Are they better in any way than what I've got?


 
 Well, easily better than xba-1. I found some unidentified tips in my collection that made it sound even more spacious and with a bit better separation than the other, so I personally slightly prefer it over Vsd1. As far as vsd3s, the tx2 bears some similarities with it but if this thing turns out to be legit the tx2 will be a third of vsd3s' price.And for people looking for something more neutral-ish that has a mic this would be a great bargain.


----------



## ZapX629

I agree, that's a steal. Hoping it turns out to be legit.


----------



## kova4a

zapx629 said:


> I agree, that's a steal. Hoping it turns out to be legit.


 
 Well, we'll have to wait to see. It's weird coz these aren't some new random sellers. These are the exact same sellers who were selling it for 40 bucks before and if you check their sales history you'll see that they sold pairs until a few wees ago for 40. The seller I chose has actually sold one white pair for $43 just 3 weeks ago, so as I said I have no idea what's happening.


----------



## neo5468

jant71 said:


> For sale here for ~36.50 before shipping choice if you have a way to buy them...http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/NEOACS-37391
> 
> M6 is okay but you might want better sound. CKX are made to stay in but don't really cure running microphonics like over the ear can. There should be other choices on Amazon if you are limited to it. Should be the Senn/addidas CX685 on there.


 
  
 I could get Sennheiser CX 685 or those new ATH-SPORT3 BK for around the same price ( 45 € ) . Hmm I was kinda settled for CKX5 already but now I really don't know anymore. And there aren't any reviews out for those new SPORT3 yet.


----------



## kova4a

Btw, the TX2 prices are all back up including for the one I bought.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 It's Sunday, so I haven't heard from the seller for an update on my order but if he doesn't cancel my order and actually sends me a tx2 all the people I advised to wait will be very mad at me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe they jusy had a 1-day only sale or something or just a pricing mistake but more than 4 sellers had the $14.09 and $14.11 price, so I don't know what happened.


----------



## Wokei

kova4a said:


> Btw, the TX2 prices are all back up including for the one I bought. It's Sunday, so I haven't heard from the seller for an update on my order but if he doesn't cancel my order and actually sends me a tx2 all the people I advised to wait will be very mad at me :rolleyes:  Maybe they jusy had a 1-day only sale or something or just a pricing mistake but more than 4 sellers had the $14.09 and $14.11 price, so I don't know what happened.




That's too bad ..no mad ...its cool  .....another 14$ saving ..kekekeke


----------



## MoonYeol

Sooo close to pulling the trigger this morning... damn.


----------



## kova4a

wokei said:


> That's too bad ..no mad ...its cool
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Well, this is open to interpretation .One might say that if you got one and it's legit you'll be saving $25. It's one of those glass half full or half empty things 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  This whole thing was kinda weird coz usually if it's just a limited amount discount you get something like crossed off list price, the amount you're saving below and the current discounted price and this had nothing like this. Anyway, technically I didn't stop anyone from buying one - just advised people not to rush even though I personally jumped the gun coz I figured for 14 bucks I'm not really risking much.


----------



## Wokei

kova4a said:


> Well, this is open to interpretation .One might say that if you got one and it's legit you'll be saving $25. It's one of those glass half full or half empty things :tongue_smile:   This whole thing was kinda weird coz usually if it's just a limited amount discount you get something like crossed off list price, the amount you're saving below and the current discounted price and this had nothing like this. Anyway, technically I didn't stop anyone from buying one - just advised people not to rush even though I personally jumped the gun coz I figured for 14 bucks I'm not really risking much.




Pls update us when they arrived ..thks


----------



## jant71

neo5468 said:


> I could get Sennheiser CX 685 or those new ATH-SPORT3 BK for around the same price ( 45 € ) . Hmm I was kinda settled for CKX5 already but now I really don't know anymore. And there aren't any reviews out for those new SPORT3 yet.


 
  
 Well I have the CKP200 which the Sport1 is the new model of. The CX685 in head to head has a better sound than the CKP200 but not a big difference. The Sport3 should be the best sounding of bunch plus a good case(waterproof) and the CKX5 again is not over the ear nor IPX rated. SonicFuel line is not the SonicSport line and not washable/sweat resistant and doesn't come with a clip like the Sport3 does. If they are really for running and sweating etc then those features should come in handy.
  
 AT is pretty reliable in their specs giving an indication of what they think performs better. The Sport3's 10-25,000 bests the CKX5's 15-22,000 plus AT is solid in providing improvement in newer models. A safe bet the current top sport model will sound better than the entry model of the Sonicfuel line. Besides over the ear killing more microphonics, the form factor more similar to the M6, Westone/Shure etc. should be better. Joker can chime in on which form factor is good for sports/active stuff.


----------



## suman134

jant71 said:


> Well I have the CKP200 which the Sport1 is the new model of. The CX685 in head to head has a better sound than the CKP200 but not a big difference. The Sport3 should be the best sounding of bunch plus a good case(waterproof) and the CKX5 again is not over the ear nor IPX rated. SonicFuel line is not the SonicSport line and not washable/sweat resistant and doesn't come with a clip like the Sport3 does. If they are really for running and sweating etc then those features should come in handy.
> 
> AT is pretty reliable in their specs giving an indication of what they think performs better. The Sport3's 10-25,000 bests the CKX5's 15-22,000 plus AT is solid in providing improvement in newer models. A safe bet the current top sport model will sound better than the entry model of the Sonicfuel line. Besides over the ear killing more microphonics, the form factor more similar to the M6, Westone/Shure etc. should be better. Joker can chime in on which form factor is good for sports/active stuff.


 

   where to buy this man , i will buy the sports 3 !! its so sexy !!


----------



## suman134

will buy from uk or usa , but not from japan , i cant understand what they have wrote .


----------



## neo5468

suman134 said:


> where to buy this man , i will buy the sports 3 !! its so sexy !!


 
 jant71 provided the link where to buy them:
  
 http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/NEOACS-37391
  
  
 You have shipping charge calculator below as well.
  
  
  


jant71 said:


> Well I have the CKP200 which the Sport1 is the new model of. The CX685 in head to head has a better sound than the CKP200 but not a big difference. The Sport3 should be the best sounding of bunch plus a good case(waterproof) and the CKX5 again is not over the ear nor IPX rated. SonicFuel line is not the SonicSport line and not washable/sweat resistant and doesn't come with a clip like the Sport3 does. If they are really for running and sweating etc then those features should come in handy.
> 
> AT is pretty reliable in their specs giving an indication of what they think performs better. The Sport3's 10-25,000 bests the CKX5's 15-22,000 plus AT is solid in providing improvement in newer models. A safe bet the current top sport model will sound better than the entry model of the Sonicfuel line. Besides over the ear killing more microphonics, the form factor more similar to the M6, Westone/Shure etc. should be better. Joker can chime in on which form factor is good for sports/active stuff.


 
  
 Yeah, I am strongly leaning towards those sport3 now, especially because you provided me some very strong points. Over the ear is better than fin (for microphonics), IPX certificate and they are smaller. Thanks again for your feedback.


----------



## suman134

me likey , i can understand this !! i will buy , let me see how much im left with .


----------



## jant71

neo5468 said:


> Yeah, I am strongly leaning towards those sport3 now, especially because you provided me some very strong points. Over the ear is better than fin (for microphonics), IPX certificate and they are smaller. Thanks again for your feedback.


 
  
 I think I'll grab a pair as well. Just listening to my CKP200's and they always seem to impress even vs. my reference Tenore, S5's and other higher level phones. Should still be that enjoyable listen with better SQ. AT has done well lately with an update to the house sound that is very fun and friendly and holds it's draw so you don't get tired of it. The case is nice as well esp. an outside pocket which, for me, will be usable.
  
 They are my current avatar also since they are quite easy on the eyes 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




! That doesn't hurt either!
 A new pic,from e-earphone japan, of them in the package now that they are in stock...


----------



## neo5468

jant71 said:


> I think I'll grab a pair as well. Just listening to my CKP200's and they always seem to impress even vs. my reference Tenore, S5's and other higher level phones. Should still be that enjoyable listen with better SQ. AT has done well lately with an update to the house sound that is very fun and friendly and holds it's draw so you don't get tired of it. The case is nice as well esp. an outside pocket which, for me, will be usable.
> 
> They are my current avatar also since they are quite easy on the eyes
> 
> ...


 
  
 They really do look good. This design is for over the ear only though, right? Can't be worn straight down ?


----------



## jant71

The housings would work flipped for straight down but the problem would be the ear guide portion which most likely limits them to over the ear.
  
 I, myself, am not too fond of the memory wire portion. I thought about the Sport2 since it is an odd 28ohm model and is also quite a handsome little person  that looks quite comfy/easy to fit.


 Tempting but you leave some SQ and the case on the table. Still take the 2 over the CKX5 as it has the clip, new quieter cord, waterproof rating, and a flusher fit. Still has the new 10mm driver and should at least match the CKX5 SQ if not be slightly better. This is also replacing the C-chip design of the older model(http://www.audio-technica.com/cms/headphones/a7b44679edb6aba6/index.html) which one would hope improved over it.


----------



## ljokerl

insidedrive said:


> Hi Joker! Any initial impressions on the Ostry KC06?


 
  
 That it's a bit harsh/uneven in the treble but otherwise very capable, especially considering the price.  
  


kova4a said:


> Btw, as I was going to give my Philips TX2 to my brother I decided I would buy a white pair for myself to replace it and ran into a whole bunch of $14 offers for the TX2 on ebay. I know for a fact that these are the exact same sellers who were selling it for $39 months ago, so I don't know what's going on. I picked a random seller with high reputation as the one I got my first pair from is one of the few who still has the standard price but I'll report when or if I receive my pair. Coz if it all turns out well a TX2 for 14 bucks will be an insane bargain.


 
  
 Might have been some sort of temporary pricing issue/error in a distributor feed, which would affect all sellers using the feed. My bet is it's a legit TX2, which is a hell of a deal (assuming it gets shipped out to you).


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> Might have been some sort of temporary pricing issue/error in a distributor feed, which would affect all sellers using the feed. My bet is it's a legit TX2, which is a hell of a deal (assuming it gets shipped out to you).


 
 Yeah, you're probably right. And I just got a refund from the seller and he cancelled the order saying that he has only one pair left and it's broken, which is obviously a blatant lie as he had listed more than 10 available and didn't sell any more, so most likely a pricing error.
 I just rolled with it and accepted the cancellation coz I'm not in the mood to argue with sellers who act like kids and feel the need to lie instead of just explaining the situation.


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> Yeah, you're probably right. And I just got a refund from the seller and he cancelled the order saying that he has only one pair left and it's broken, which is obviously a blatant lie as he had listed more than 10 available and didn't sell any more, so most likely a pricing error.
> I just rolled with it and accepted the cancellation coz I'm not in the mood to argue with sellers who act like kids and feel the need to lie instead of just explaining the situation.


 
  
 Makes sense, unfortunately. No deal of the year this time...


----------



## altrunox

ljokerl, after the Piston review I'll need to believe the hype and buy one to my sister 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 --
 Let's say if the Beyerdynamics DTX 71 iE is sold for around US$20, would it get a 10/10 in the value?
  
 I was looking to a Vivo IEM on Aliexpress (XE 800) and found another interesting one.







  
 This is the MMX 71 iE, it's a Vivo IEM designed by Beyerdynamic, like the XE800 is designed by Vsonic.
 The drivers looks to be almost the same as the DTX 71, only the sensitivy is different.
  
  
 And the name follows the beyerdynamic name, changing the DTX to MMX:
 DTX 101 iE = MMX 101 iE ( with mic.)
 DTX 71 iE = MMX 71 iE (with mic.)
  
 I bought one for US$15, because they were on sale, but they're easily find for US$20. I'm from Brazil so it'll take one or two months to arrive, but if you're interested in knowing anything about them, I can write something here after I get them.
  
 http://shop.vivo.com.cn/product-658.html


----------



## suman134

altrunox said:


> ljokerl, after the Piston review I'll need to believe the hype and buy one to my sister
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
    yup mate why not , let us know about it . i hope joker wont mind it .


----------



## cylpol1

Can someone suggest the most analytical and detailed in-ear headphone under 250


----------



## ZapX629

You could probably find Ety ER-4 for that price.


----------



## suman134

cylpol1 said:


> Can someone suggest the most analytical and detailed in-ear headphone under 250


 

 if you are on analytical , you can opt for , brainwavz b2 for cheap and er-4p for around 250 .


----------



## cylpol1

Anything else besides Etymotic. The sound is good but the deep insertion and lack of ambient awareness drives me away from it.


----------



## Ap616

Brainwavz B2 like suman said or Fischer Audio DBA-02 mkII might be Joker's recommendation.


----------



## ljokerl

altrunox said:


> ljokerl, after the Piston review I'll need to believe the hype and buy one to my sister
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 If genuine and as well-made as the DTX 71 I had, 10/10's fair. 
  


cylpol1 said:


> Anything else besides Etymotic. The sound is good but the deep insertion and lack of ambient awareness drives me away from it.


 
  
 In addition to what others have said, the Rock-It Sounds R-50 is a good bet. Or even the original Phonak PFE if you want even lower isolation. You can still find some on ebay.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a comparison of four triple-driver hybrid earphones - the Sony XBA-H3, Dunu DN-2000, Fidue A83, and T-Peos Altone200: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/ 
  
 The short version:
  


> The *Sony XBA-H3* is warm and smooth-sounding, with big bass that slightly veils the midrange. Treble quality is quite good, however, and it's got a nice, big sound. The design can hardly be called ergonomic but the earphones are lightweight and comfortable, and the detachable cable is of excellent quality.
> The *Dunu DN-2000* is an evolution of the DN-1000 model, with a more balanced sound, more refined treble, and slightly more spacious presentation. It strikes the best balance of bass, clarity, and neutrality for me, though it gives up a bit of coherence compared to the Sonys.
> The *Fidue A83* delivers the most balanced overall sound. Clarity is not quite as striking as it is with the more v-shaped Dunu and T-Peos, but it also has a rather out-of-the-head presentation going for it.
> The *T-Peos Altone200* is the least expensive of the bunch, a sub-$150 triple-driver hybrid. It has a more v-shaped signature. Bass is great but the mids sound a little more thin and withdrawn compared to the others. The lower treble tends to be a little hot but can be improved with foam tips. The Altone200 has a very basic, no-frills packaging presentation and construction, but it is also lightweight and comfortable, and very reasonably-priced.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Posted a comparison of four triple-driver hybrid earphones - the Sony XBA-H3, Dunu DN-2000, Fidue A83, and T-Peos Altone200: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/
> 
> The short version:


 
  
     this why i love you !!


----------



## Pastapipo

suman134 said:


> this why i love you !!




*we


----------



## suman134

i read it , i have a question too , how bad is the xba-h3's bass ? i mean how fast is the decay and how muddy or boomy it is ? for me the one excels in bass is hisound crystal , and thats the limit for me , wont take any thing slower of boomier then that for this price , i have some wooly muddy boomier phone like xb90ex , but its for $60 , and thats okay for its price .


----------



## altrunox

"The Altone200 from T-Peos is the most reasonably-priced triple-driver hybrid on the market, and definitely a bargain for the performance offered. *With clarity and detail resolution on par with the $1300 K3003*, the Altone200 is going to be a reference point for future generations of triple-driver hybrids."
  
 AKG people should be mad, super mad!


----------



## UnityIsPower

pastapipo said:


> *we



+1


----------



## cylpol1

Oh I had a question about the Phonak which was could you wear it straight down if you wear the left headphone in the right ear


----------



## cylpol1

Oh I had a question about the Phonak which was could you wear it straight down if you wear the left headphone in the right ear


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks, everyone!
  


suman134 said:


> i read it , i have a question too , how bad is the xba-h3's bass ? i mean how fast is the decay and how muddy or boomy it is ? for me the one excels in bass is hisound crystal , and thats the limit for me , wont take any thing slower of boomier then that for this price , i have some wooly muddy boomier phone like xb90ex , but its for $60 , and thats okay for its price .


 
  
 The Crystal has a huge advantage in the form lower bass quantity, and I agree - it does have very good quality bass overall. The H3 isn't as tight, but it's not far behind and the bass is a lot more powerful. 
  


cylpol1 said:


> Oh I had a question about the Phonak which was could you wear it straight down if you wear the left headphone in the right ear


 
  
 Yes, you can. Not sure what that does to the cable noise and such, and the fit definitely won't be as secure.


----------



## cylpol1

Will the sound be the same


----------



## suman134

cylpol1 said:


> Will the sound be the same


 
  
  i dont think it will degrade but instruments will be flipped .


----------



## cylpol1

If the fit is not the same does that mean the sound won't be either


----------



## suman134

cylpol1 said:


> If the fit is not the same does that mean the sound won't be either


 
  
   yes , if the fit is not good , if the seal is not there , sound will suffer . i dont think swapping channels will affect fit .


----------



## ljokerl

cylpol1 said:


> Will the sound be the same


 
  
 It really depends on whether your ear shape will allow an equally deep seal.


----------



## cylpol1

Have you tried it straight down


----------



## ljokerl

cylpol1 said:


> Have you tried it straight down


 
  
 No, I had no problem wearing them the right way. I did try the PFE232 down but the fit just wasn't as secure as cable-up.


----------



## cylpol1

Did you think the sound was the same when you wore the 232 down


----------



## audiobot

@Joker, I just recommended the team at Aurisonics to send u a review unit of the Rockets after they fulfill their shipping quota from kickstarter. It needs to be on that chart for all to marvel at. I soundly believe they top the CK10 (past owner) and a few customs on the merits of your scoring system. Keep up the good work.


----------



## vlenbo

audiobot said:


> @Joker, I just recommended the team at Aurisonics to send u a review unit of the Rockets after they fulfill their shipping quota from kickstarter. It needs to be on that chart for all to marvel at. I soundly believe they top the CK10 (past owner) and a few customs on the merits of your scoring system. Keep up the good work.


 
 Ahh, but do they beat the ckr series? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 (despite them being different sound signatures)
  
 I'm more curious on the altone vs rockets comparison though. Hopefully joker obtains one.
  
 Either way that aurosonic rocket is amazing, and definitely deserves to be reviewed someday.


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

vlenbo said:


> Ahh, but do they beat the ckr series?   (despite them being different sound signatures)
> 
> I'm more curious on the altone vs rockets comparison though. Hopefully joker obtains one.
> 
> Either way that aurosonic rocket is amazing, and definitely deserves to be reviewed someday.




Yes I am interested in this comparison also. I'd really like Joker to review the ath ckr series. Currently they are hands down my best IEM beating the likes of my UE900 too.


----------



## cylpol1

Did you think the sound was the same when you wore the 232 down


----------



## Mr Trev

Sorry to go a bit off topic, but I was hoping somebody with BA experience can solve a prob for me. I was listening to my PFE111s yesterday when the left channel suddenly dropped in vol. (bout half as loud as the right). First thing I did was change filters, no joy. I though since it was fairly hot and humid that maybe some moisture/sweat got in so I tossed them in a jar with a packet of silica. Still didn't help. While I was trrying to figure out what to do next, I cranked the volume waaay up, and after a bit of a click/pop the left channel was back to normal. Been playing fine since, but I was hoping someone could maybe explain what might have happened, and if its anything to worry about.
 Cheers


----------



## ljokerl

cylpol1 said:


> Did you think the sound was the same when you wore the 232 down


 
  
 I don't remember noticing a difference. I was using them with Complys.
  


audiobot said:


> @Joker, I just recommended the team at Aurisonics to send u a review unit of the Rockets after they fulfill their shipping quota from kickstarter. It needs to be on that chart for all to marvel at. I soundly believe they top the CK10 (past owner) and a few customs on the merits of your scoring system. Keep up the good work.


 
  
 Hah, thanks. Would be happy to try it. 
  
  


mr trev said:


> Sorry to go a bit off topic, but I was hoping somebody with BA experience can solve a prob for me. I was listening to my PFE111s yesterday when the left channel suddenly dropped in vol. (bout half as loud as the right). First thing I did was change filters, no joy. I though since it was fairly hot and humid that maybe some moisture/sweat got in so I tossed them in a jar with a packet of silica. Still didn't help. While I was trrying to figure out what to do next, I cranked the volume waaay up, and after a bit of a click/pop the left channel was back to normal. Been playing fine since, but I was hoping someone could maybe explain what might have happened, and if its anything to worry about.
> Cheers


 
  
 Definitely not a good sign. Sounds like a mechanical problem with the armature but I can't say I've ever experience the same.


----------



## Mr Trev

ljokerl said:


> Definitely not a good sign. Sounds like a mechanical problem with the armature but I can't say I've ever experience the same.


 
  
 Fraid that might be the case. I guess I'll have to start putting some cash aside for a replacement. Any suggestions for a replacement? Was thinking bout moving up to a dual/multi BA, but honestly I have no idea what benefits I could expect. The 232 is way out of my price range (esp. for a discontinued model), but been reading bout the r50 and am a little intrigued (the vc1000(?) too, but I find a dedicated over ear design fit me better than a straight tube). I do like the sound of the 111s with the grey filters with pretty much all music - they are a little bass light, but I would prefer too little bass than too much (and I also have gr07be to scratch that itch if need be).


----------



## cylpol1

Thanks for all your help


----------



## suman134

mr trev said:


> Fraid that might be the case. I guess I'll have to start putting some cash aside for a replacement. Any suggestions for a replacement? Was thinking bout moving up to a dual/multi BA, but honestly I have no idea what benefits I could expect. The 232 is way out of my price range (esp. for a discontinued model), but been reading bout the r50 and am a little intrigued (the vc1000(?) too, but I find a dedicated over ear design fit me better than a straight tube). I do like the sound of the 111s with the grey filters with pretty much all music - they are a little bass light, but I would prefer too little bass than too much (and I also have gr07be to scratch that itch if need be).


 
  
   you are not on bass right , you have a few options around $100 , to name , hf5 , re-400 , brainwavz b2 , keep in mind that these B2 BA ( most of the twin BAs ) drives have some peaky highs . i might not go for r50 but thats not bad , if you have no problem with a higher budget , mdr7550 is my top recommendation .


----------



## ljokerl

mr trev said:


> Fraid that might be the case. I guess I'll have to start putting some cash aside for a replacement. Any suggestions for a replacement? Was thinking bout moving up to a dual/multi BA, but honestly I have no idea what benefits I could expect. The 232 is way out of my price range (esp. for a discontinued model), but been reading bout the r50 and am a little intrigued (the vc1000(?) too, but I find a dedicated over ear design fit me better than a straight tube). I do like the sound of the 111s with the grey filters with pretty much all music - they are a little bass light, but I would prefer too little bass than too much (and I also have gr07be to scratch that itch if need be).


 
  
 The PFE is still pretty darn capable despite being old and single-BA. The list suman posted is good - Ety HF5 if you want neutral, B2 or R-50 if you're okay with a slightly brighter tone (VC1000 is my favorite of these but it's hard to find now). RE-400 if you want slightly warmer but still close to neutral and with no bass enhancement. I would add the TDK BA200 to that category as well. All of these can be worn over the ear though of course the BA200 and R-50 are the only ones designed for it.


----------



## Mr Trev

suman134 said:


> you are not on bass right , you have a few options around $100 , to name , hf5 , re-400 , brainwavz b2 , keep in mind that these B2 BA ( most of the twin BAs ) drives have some peaky highs . i might not go for r50 but thats not bad , if you have no problem with a higher budget , mdr7550 is my top recommendation .


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> The PFE is still pretty darn capable despite being old and single-BA. The list suman posted is good - Ety HF5 if you want neutral, B2 or R-50 if you're okay with a slightly brighter tone (VC1000 is my favorite of these but it's hard to find now). RE-400 if you want slightly warmer but still close to neutral and with no bass enhancement. I would add the TDK BA200 to that category as well. All of these can be worn over the ear though of course the BA200 and R-50 are the only ones designed for it.


 
  
 Thanks for the recommendations. If I do need to replace em, I will go with another BA set. Just bought my vsonic in Jan., so I have a decent enough dynamic for now. The one big thing I prefer my pfe over the vsonic is in the hi freq. The pfe are much smoother, and I find the vsonic can sound a little 'ringy' at times - so maybe the r50 might not be the best choice. Also looking at some of the ath-im0x phones.
 So far though the pfe have been going well. Got about 5-6 hrs now since my problem and they've been fine. When I did crank the vol, the pop they made wasn't really loud, or alarming, more akin to what you hear listening to vinyl. Dunno if the driver just got a little stuck or something, but as long as they keep going I'll continue to listen and enjoy.
 Cheers.


----------



## suman134

joker , i need some help , help me save $18 . so , i just brought a twinwoofer , is it worth it ? how much will you give it for SQ , cuz im thinking of a re fund . i dont think they worth it , got my replacement today , and havent heard them at all but still , should i keep it ? cuz to it , its slide , on the first one i had 2 hrs of burning and , nothing in the highs ( too smooth ) and veiled mids and blasting amount of bass was all i had , will this improve to some thing more potent ?


----------



## suman134

mr trev said:


> Thanks for the recommendations. If I do need to replace em, I will go with another BA set. Just bought my vsonic in Jan., so I have a decent enough dynamic for now. The one big thing I prefer my pfe over the vsonic is in the hi freq. The pfe are much smoother, and I find the vsonic can sound a little 'ringy' at times - so maybe the r50 might not be the best choice. Also looking at some of the ath-im0x phones.
> So far though the pfe have been going well. Got about 5-6 hrs now since my problem and they've been fine. When I did crank the vol, the pop they made wasn't really loud, or alarming, more akin to what you hear listening to vinyl. Dunno if the driver just got a little stuck or something, but as long as they keep going I'll continue to listen and enjoy.
> Cheers.


 
  
   i dont know any twin BA phone that is smooth (  may be vc1000 ) , but single BAs will do , why not another dynamic ? try re-400 , you cant tell that its a dynamic until you realize its pumping more air then a BA and is fairly smooth . i hope your pfe hold on , i had plans on them , just one to add to my collection , but they are obsolete now , tough luck and no chance to do better next time .
 Enjoy your PFE .


----------



## Mr Trev

suman134 said:


> i dont know any twin BA phone that is smooth (  may be vc1000 ) , but single BAs will do , why not another dynamic ? try re-400 , you cant tell that its a dynamic until you realize its pumping more air then a BA and is fairly smooth . i hope your pfe hold on , i had plans on them , just one to add to my collection , but they are obsolete now , tough luck and no chance to do better next time .
> Enjoy your PFE .


 
 Thanks again for the input. Honestly I figure that I should have at least 1 of each type (actually, I also own a pair of xba1 that I picked off Amazon for cheap). I really do hope my pfe do hold on for a long while since I'd have to say that they're my fav right now. As far as another pair of dynamics go, I'm getting pretty tempted by all the hype round the havi b3 (or maybe ath-im70). Hopefully Joker can manage to get some for a review one day.


----------



## peter123

@Mr Trev

The ue600 is also a great single ba. For me it outclasses the xba-1.

You should try the Havi


----------



## ljokerl

mr trev said:


> Thanks for the recommendations. If I do need to replace em, I will go with another BA set. Just bought my vsonic in Jan., so I have a decent enough dynamic for now. The one big thing I prefer my pfe over the vsonic is in the hi freq. The pfe are much smoother, and I find the vsonic can sound a little 'ringy' at times - so maybe the r50 might not be the best choice. Also looking at some of the ath-im0x phones.
> So far though the pfe have been going well. Got about 5-6 hrs now since my problem and they've been fine. When I did crank the vol, the pop they made wasn't really loud, or alarming, more akin to what you hear listening to vinyl. Dunno if the driver just got a little stuck or something, but as long as they keep going I'll continue to listen and enjoy.
> Cheers.


 
  
 I would definitely consider an Ety for nice BA-generated highs if the PFE gives up the ghost. Hopefully it won't though - it's a great earphone. With a $200 filter the PFE still falls in the top 10 in my ranking.
  


suman134 said:


> joker , i need some help , help me save $18 . so , i just brought a twinwoofer , is it worth it ? how much will you give it for SQ , cuz im thinking of a re fund . i dont think they worth it , got my replacement today , and havent heard them at all but still , should i keep it ? cuz to it , its slide , on the first one i had 2 hrs of burning and , nothing in the highs ( too smooth ) and veiled mids and blasting amount of bass was all i had , will this improve to some thing more potent ?


 
  
 Yeah, it's a basshead earphone at best. I compared it to the slightly less expensive NarMoo S1 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/narmoo-s1/ and came to pretty much the same conclusions.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, it's a basshead earphone at best. I compared it to the slightly less expensive NarMoo S1 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/narmoo-s1/ and came to pretty much the same conclusions.


 
  
   thanks , i think i should call for refund .


----------



## ljokerl

T-Peos D200R has been added. Planned review list on the front page has been partly updated.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A87) T-Peos D200R*
> 
> 
> Reviewed August 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## ruthieandjohn

quartertone said:


> The T-PEOS H-200 comes to mind, if you want to spend that much.


 

 A little old to respond to this quote of last December, but prompted by the fact that a review of another T-PEOS 200, the T-PEOS D200R, has been posted, and the fact that I have and LOVE the T-PEOS H-200 (3-way hybrid), I thought I'd post this in hopes of prompting a review of the T-PEOS H-200.  Like the AKG K3003i IEM, it has a dynamic bass driver and pair of balanced armatures for mid and high frequencies.  It ranges from $250 - $300, though not stocked by amazon.com.
  
 I have only three headphones that simultaneously provide subbass so strong as to be palpable, while providing top-notch transparency and speed.... the AKG K3003is, the HiFiMAN HE-500 over-ear headphones, and these T-PEOS H-200s.  Worth a look, in my opinion.


----------



## ljokerl

ruthieandjohn said:


> A little old to respond to this quote of last December, but prompted by the fact that a review of another T-PEOS 200, the T-PEOS D200R, has been posted, and the fact that I have and LOVE the T-PEOS H-200 (3-way hybrid), I thought I'd post this in hopes of prompting a review of the T-PEOS H-200.  Like the AKG K3003i IEM, it has a dynamic bass driver and pair of balanced armatures for mid and high frequencies.  It ranges from $250 - $300, though not stocked by amazon.com.
> 
> I have only three headphones that simultaneously provide subbass so strong as to be palpable, while providing top-notch transparency and speed.... the AKG K3003is, the HiFiMAN HE-500 over-ear headphones, and these T-PEOS H-200s.  Worth a look, in my opinion.


 
  
 I have the Altone200, which is T-Peos' newest triple-driver hybrid (1 dynamic + 2 BA) earphone. Best part is that it's only $145 or so currently. Posted some thoughts on it the other day here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

ljokerl said:


> I have the Altone200, which is T-Peos' newest triple-driver hybrid (1 dynamic + 2 BA) earphone. Best part is that it's only $145 or so currently. Posted some thoughts on it the other day here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/




"With clarity and detail resolution on par with the $1300 K3003, the Altone200 is going to be a reference point for future generations of triple-driver hybrids."

Quite the phone the altones are.


----------



## cylpol1

Does the pfe112 have micro-detailing


----------



## cylpol1

Which one is the original phonak pfe. Does that include this one http://www.earphonesolutions.com/pfe-122-phonak-full-edition-earphone.html


----------



## suman134

cylpol1 said:


> Does the pfe112 have micro-detailing


 
  
  never had an PFE , but i would like to believe though . its a good phone , and i believe its got micro details . why dont you try a hf5 .


----------



## theUKMrT

I use Wizard edition Noble N4's for my general portable listening but am looking for something to use with my iphone when I don't have my X5 stack with me. Must have inline volume control & budget under £100 ($170USD). Obviously I don't expect the same performance as the N4's at this price, but want something close to their very balanced sound - & I hate aggressive treble!

Am considering the RHA ma750i and Philips Fidelio S2, but any other suggestions would be very welcome.


----------



## nehcrow

theukmrt said:


> I use Wizard edition Noble N4's for my general portable listening but am looking for something to use with my iphone when I don't have my X5 stack with me. Must have inline volume control & budget under £100 ($170USD). Obviously I don't expect the same performance as the N4's at this price, but want something close to their very balanced sound - & I hate aggressive treble!
> 
> Am considering the RHA ma750i and Philips Fidelio S2, but any other suggestions would be very welcome.


 
 Altone200?


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

nehcrow said:


> Altone200?


 
 Agressive treble of the altones may not do it for him though


----------



## suman134

nehcrow said:


> Altone200?


 
  got no remote and he wants remote .
  


theukmrt said:


> I use Wizard edition Noble N4's for my general portable listening but am looking for something to use with my iphone when I don't have my X5 stack with me. Must have inline volume control & budget under £100 ($170USD). Obviously I don't expect the same performance as the N4's at this price, but want something close to their very balanced sound - & I hate aggressive treble!
> 
> Am considering the RHA ma750i and Philips Fidelio S2, but any other suggestions would be very welcome.


 
  
   ma-750 is good but wont call it much balanced i would like to suggest hf3 with 3 buttons & mic , may be ue900 if you can go over your limit .


----------



## theUKMrT

suman134 said:


> ma-750 is good but wont call it much balanced i would like to suggest hf3 with 3 buttons & mic , may be ue900 if you can go over your limit .




I don't mind a mild bass lift if that's what the ma750i is all about - provided the treble is reasonably smooth.
I had a UE900 & didn't care much for it - seemed dark & a bit lifeless - though always wondered if it was a dud as it didn't seemed to match the performance it's many fans say it has. Had a Klipsch x10i too which was excellent sounding, but ridiculously flimsy.

Hadn't considered the hf3, so many thanks for the tip - will investigate.


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

theukmrt said:


> I don't mind a mild bass lift if that's what the ma750i is all about - provided the treble is reasonably smooth.
> I had a UE900 & didn't care much for it - *seemed dark & a bit lifeless* - though always wondered if it was a dud as it didn't seemed to match the performance it's many fans say it has. Had a Klipsch x10i too which was excellent sounding, but ridiculously flimsy.
> 
> Hadn't considered the hf3, so many thanks for the tip - will investigate.


 
 You want fun,engaging,intimate, lively phone. Give ath ckr9 a try


----------



## suman134

theukmrt said:


> I don't mind a mild bass lift if that's what the ma750i is all about - provided the treble is reasonably smooth.
> I had a UE900 & didn't care much for it - seemed dark & a bit lifeless - though always wondered if it was a dud as it didn't seemed to match the performance it's many fans say it has. Had a Klipsch x10i too which was excellent sounding, but ridiculously flimsy.
> 
> Hadn't considered the hf3, so many thanks for the tip - will investigate.


 
  
    then i think ma-750 will do good .


----------



## cylpol1

I also want to get my first audiophile headphone preferably an armature one for under 200. Thank you in advance for your help.


----------



## ljokerl

syedz2ez4 said:


> "With clarity and detail resolution on par with the $1300 K3003, the Altone200 is going to be a reference point for future generations of triple-driver hybrids."
> 
> Quite the phone the altones are.


 
  
 Indeed. Some minor quirks here and there but can't fault that clarity.
  


cylpol1 said:


> Does the pfe112 have micro-detailing


 
  
 Yes
  


cylpol1 said:


> Which one is the original phonak pfe. Does that include this one http://www.earphonesolutions.com/pfe-122-phonak-full-edition-earphone.html


 
  
 Anything with a 1** model name is a regular PFE. The rest of the numbers just refer to colors and various types of inline remotes. For example the PFE 111 is the "basic" white PFE with no remote.
  


theukmrt said:


> I use Wizard edition Noble N4's for my general portable listening but am looking for something to use with my iphone when I don't have my X5 stack with me. Must have inline volume control & budget under £100 ($170USD). Obviously I don't expect the same performance as the N4's at this price, but want something close to their very balanced sound - & I hate aggressive treble!
> 
> Am considering the RHA ma750i and Philips Fidelio S2, but any other suggestions would be very welcome.


 
  
 The MA750i might be too bassy coming from a Noble, and not clear enough in the midrange. Treble should be fine but it's just not something I recommend for balanced sound. The Etys recommended above are a better bet - the HF3 has the Apple volume control on it. The FIdelio S2 doesn't have a volume control - its remote is just a 1-button. Another option would be the UE600vi - less expensive than the Etys and it's got a nice and smooth sound and superb performance for what should be not much money (they're about $60 here in the US).


----------



## Shawn71

cylpol1 said:


> I also want to get my first audiophile headphone preferably an armature one for under 200. Thank youin aadvance for your help.




Just balanced armature (BA) rite? As there are dynamic combined with BA called double hybrids(1BA+1dynamic) and triple hybrids(2BA+1dynamic).....that way its easy to recommend and you get what you want,exactly.


----------



## cylpol1

Sure hybrids could work


----------



## suman134

cylpol1 said:


> Sure hybrids could work


 
  
   most of the hybrids are not balanced , at least i dont know of any , and the only one with controls is xba-h3 .


----------



## Shawn71

cylpol1 said:


> Sure hybrids could work




Aye then, Altone200 priced $145(125+20 ems shipping) by T-Peos is the one for you. Pls see a user called syed's post that contain Joker's conclusion from his recent triple hybrids comparisons........in this same page(948) above.


----------



## Shawn71

And theres a tradeoff....like no mic/vol controls on these, (if you need) just like you wld expect from mid tiers & high ends IEMs,unless if its a detachable cable,like UE900 quad BAs for example.....


----------



## cylpol1

I decided getting the hf5


----------



## suman134

cylpol1 said:


> I decided getting the hf5 and I was wondering what size shure olives i should get for it


 
  
   hf3 , right , dont worry about the olives , i think mid size will fit good but , have i told you that these goes deep in the canal and with olives not that deep , large are too big for average users , still then you can squeeze it and put it inside , go for the size that you use with your other phones .


----------



## Uppopulla

I'm looking for smallish IEMs in the sub 100$ price point as my old CX 400's plug is on it's last legs. I bought DT 880 Pros a few months ago and fell in love with their sound but I'd like something a tad warmer for my portable phones. So far I've looked at the HiFiMan RE-400s. What other pairs should I consider?


----------



## Zelda

uppopulla said:


> I'm looking for smallish IEMs in the sub 100$ price point as my old CX 400's plug is on it's last legs. I bought DT 880 Pros a few months ago and fell in love with their sound but I'd like something a tad warmer for my portable phones. So far I've looked at the HiFiMan RE-400s. What other pairs should I consider?


 
 the good is a great option. 
 also the ZA Tenore.
  
 and if you want something micro-sized, there´s the Fidue A31s. super smallest thing


----------



## suman134

uppopulla said:


> I'm looking for smallish IEMs in the sub 100$ price point as my old CX 400's plug is on it's last legs. I bought DT 880 Pros a few months ago and fell in love with their sound but I'd like something a tad warmer for my portable phones. So far I've looked at the HiFiMan RE-400s. What other pairs should I consider?


 
  
    you should try the ue600 and yes re-400 sure . bu the main problem is that , these phones lack the mid bass that cx-400 has . if you want that bass ma-750 will do good .


----------



## theUKMrT

ljokerl said:


> The MA750i might be too bassy coming from a Noble, and not clear enough in the midrange. Treble should be fine but it's just not something I recommend for balanced sound. The Etys recommended above are a better bet - the HF3 has the Apple volume control on it. The FIdelio S2 doesn't have a volume control - its remote is just a 1-button. Another option would be the UE600vi - less expensive than the Etys and it's got a nice and smooth sound and superb performance for what should be not much money (they're about $60 here in the US).




Seems I need to investigate the Etys then... Etymotic provided my first introduction to 'proper' iems probably over a decade ago now. Can't remember the exact model, but I do remember being disappointed by them given the reception they were being given in the press at the time, & I wasn't enamoured of the ear-raping insertion depth required to get a good seal (though snipping off the 3rd flange helped). As it turned out they weren't too well made either so didn't last long. T'was a long time ago though, so perhaps they've improved things. Worth a try.

The UE600vi are currently super cheap here at the moment - largely due, it would seem, to the exceptionally high number of reports of the cable failing at the jack - a great shame since their sonic capabilities appear to be universally applauded.

Many thanks for your input Joker - the resource you provide with The Headphone List is astounding, & that you're willing to field such a huge variety of individual questions even more so.


----------



## suman134

theukmrt said:


> Seems I need to investigate the Etys then... Etymotic provided my first introduction to 'proper' iems probably over a decade ago now. Can't remember the exact model, but I do remember being disappointed by them given the reception they were being given in the press at the time, & I wasn't enamoured of the ear-raping insertion depth required to get a good seal (though snipping off the 3rd flange helped). As it turned out they weren't too well made either so didn't last long. T'was a long time ago though, so perhaps they've improved things. Worth a try.
> 
> The UE600vi are currently super cheap here at the moment - largely due, it would seem, to the exceptionally high number of reports of the cable failing at the jack - a great shame since their sonic capabilities appear to be universally applauded.
> 
> Many thanks for your input Joker - the resource you provide with The Headphone List is astounding, & that you're willing to field such a huge variety of individual questions even more so.


 
  
   get the shure olives .


----------



## ljokerl

uppopulla said:


> I'm looking for smallish IEMs in the sub 100$ price point as my old CX 400's plug is on it's last legs. I bought DT 880 Pros a few months ago and fell in love with their sound but I'd like something a tad warmer for my portable phones. So far I've looked at the HiFiMan RE-400s. What other pairs should I consider?


 
  
 RE-400 has the same "limitation" as the UE600 mentioned above, it's not a mid-bass heavy earphone. You can consider the HiSoundAudio Crystal and SteelSeries Flux for a little more bass in a similarly compact form factor. Both are still pretty balanced, but a bit bassier than the RE-400. 
  


theukmrt said:


> Seems I need to investigate the Etys then... Etymotic provided my first introduction to 'proper' iems probably over a decade ago now. Can't remember the exact model, but I do remember being disappointed by them given the reception they were being given in the press at the time, & I wasn't enamoured of the ear-raping insertion depth required to get a good seal (though snipping off the 3rd flange helped). As it turned out they weren't too well made either so didn't last long. T'was a long time ago though, so perhaps they've improved things. Worth a try.
> 
> The UE600vi are currently super cheap here at the moment - largely due, it would seem, to the exceptionally high number of reports of the cable failing at the jack - a great shame since their sonic capabilities appear to be universally applauded.
> 
> Many thanks for your input Joker - the resource you provide with The Headphone List is astounding, & that you're willing to field such a huge variety of individual questions even more so.


 
  
 They definitely didn't make the recommended insertion depth any shallower, but with foam tips they should be more than tolerable. 
  
 And thanks


----------



## Uppopulla

suman134 said:


> you should try the ue600 and yes re-400 sure . bu the main problem is that , these phones lack the mid bass that cx-400 has . if you want that bass ma-750 will do good .


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> RE-400 has the same "limitation" as the UE600 mentioned above, it's not a mid-bass heavy earphone. You can consider the HiSoundAudio Crystal and SteelSeries Flux for a little more bass in a similarly compact form factor. Both are still pretty balanced, but a bit bassier than the RE-400.


 
  
 On a scale of the aforementioned cx400<->DT880 Pro I'd like something firmly in the DT880 direction as the bass on the cx400 is way too boomy for me now. Are those sets less "in your face" than the cx400? I forgot to mention I'm not a fan of the single flang tips on my current phones so bi-flang tips would be preferable.


----------



## suman134

uppopulla said:


> On a scale of the aforementioned cx400<->DT880 Pro I'd like something firmly in the DT880 direction as the bass on the cx400 is way too boomy for me now. Are those sets less "in your face" than the cx400? I forgot to mention I'm not a fan of the single flang tips on my current phones so bi-flang tips would be preferable.


 
  
   its not in the face at all , and if you set out seeking bass on re-400 , you might get disappointed discovering that its not enough , but im okay with it , im not a genuine bass seeker . and sorry from my side , ma-750 is not compact , yes you can go for hisound golden crystal , they are really good . has the hit but not much , not as much as the regular crystal , not as less as re-400 , and overall sq is in between too , like may be 8.7 or 8.8 in jokers rating and they are really smaaaallll . like tiny . smaller then re-400 . or you may consider vc02 too , cheap $50 , got what you want too but a bit long .
   sadly no idea about the flux .
   and about double flange , i think re-400 has the best double flange , its big , not annoying and i love it .


----------



## ljokerl

uppopulla said:


> On a scale of the aforementioned cx400<->DT880 Pro I'd like something firmly in the DT880 direction as the bass on the cx400 is way too boomy for me now. Are those sets less "in your face" than the cx400? I forgot to mention I'm not a fan of the single flang tips on my current phones so bi-flang tips would be preferable.


 

 None of the mentioned sets (UE600, RE-400, Crystal, or Flux) have boomy bass. The Flux and Crystal have a little more while the RE-400 and UE600 have less, but the bass quality is good all around. 
  
 Only the RE-400 comes with bi-flange tips but you can get aftermarket ones for any of them. The Flux has the skinniest nozzles but the MEElec M6 bi-flanges work with it.


----------



## Uppopulla

ljokerl said:


> None of the mentioned sets (UE600, RE-400, Crystal, or Flux) have boomy bass. The Flux and Crystal have a little more while the RE-400 and UE600 have less, but the bass quality is good all around.
> 
> Only the RE-400 comes with bi-flange tips but you can get aftermarket ones for any of them. The Flux has the skinniest nozzles but the MEElec M6 bi-flanges work with it.


 
  
 Thanks. I'll go for the Flux and see if I like them. Should be a good choice based on your review and my experiences with Siberia v2.


----------



## suman134

uppopulla said:


> Thanks. I'll go for the Flux and see if I like them. Should be a good choice based on your review and my experiences with Siberia v2.


 
  
   siberias are good , i had the v1 and the v2 too , they sound really open and alive .


----------



## ljokerl

Updated the IEM Buyer's Guide with current prices, and added the dual-driver NarMoo S1 in the Basshead / sub-$50 section.
  


uppopulla said:


> Thanks. I'll go for the Flux and see if I like them. Should be a good choice based on your review and my experiences with Siberia v2.


 
  
 I think one of the reasons the Flux is not more popular is that the sensitivity is pretty low, but in practical terms it makes no difference except that you might have to raise your source volume a couple of notches compared to other IEMs.


----------



## Xtron2112

Two questions: How durable are the Altone? I don't expect Dunu or RHA durability, but I'd like IEM's that won't literally fall to pieces *glares at VSD1(s)*. Secondly, I know this is off topic, but is there a way to convert my ALAC iTunes collection to FLAC or mp3 and put it on my Android device(Nvidia Shield handheld)'s MicroSD card?


----------



## suman134

xtron2112 said:


> Two questions: How durable are the Altone? I don't expect Dunu or RHA durability, but I'd like IEM's that won't literally fall to pieces *glares at VSD1(s)*. Secondly, I know this is off topic, but is there a way to convert my ALAC iTunes collection to FLAC or mp3 and put it on my Android device(Nvidia Shield handheld)'s MicroSD card?


 
  
   you can , just google it , i use power mp3 wma converter .


----------



## adrianapeach49

Thinking of getting the RE-400's but when I looked them up I saw them being used with portable amps. Do they sound a lot better with one, or would they be ok from just my phone?


----------



## MoonYeol

adrianapeach49 said:


> Thinking of getting the RE-400's but when I looked them up I saw them being used with portable amps. Do they sound a lot better with one, or would they be ok from just my phone?




Most iems sound ok when driven by a phone. Some do accentuate the inherent weakness of the audio components but better smartphones do generally sound ok. I doubt that Re-400 are detailed enough to show any glaring faults in the source. If used on the go in noisy environments having external dacs/amps the difference will not be as apparent sonically as psychologically.

Just my two cents.

TLDR: Don't worry.


----------



## adrianapeach49

In that case they seem like a good fit. Thank you!


----------



## suman134

moonyeol said:


> Most iems sound ok when driven by a phone. Some do accentuate the inherent weakness of the audio components but better smartphones do generally sound ok. I doubt that Re-400 are detailed enough to show any glaring faults in the source. If used on the go in noisy environments having external dacs/amps the difference will not be as apparent sonically as psychologically.
> 
> Just my two cents.
> 
> TLDR: Don't worry.


 
  
   really ? you think re-400 are not detailed enough , i would put it like not demanding enough , they are really good enough , not as much as er-4p but really close . not like asg-2 though 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 , they are top end , not these .


----------



## suman134

hey , MoonYeol , can you compare me the ue900 with asg-2 ?


----------



## suman134

even if not necessary , just amped my re-400 and amping is good . has a bit more detail .


----------



## Uppopulla

ljokerl said:


> I think one of the reasons the Flux is not more popular is that the sensitivity is pretty low, but in practical terms it makes no difference except that you might have to raise your source volume a couple of notches compared to other IEMs.


 
  
 I feel the biggest issue is it's marketing and intended purpose. Unlike mice and keyboards, gaming headsets have a reputation of getting trashed when compared to similarly priced headphones. Even I was hesitant at first even though I was actually a little disappointed at how little difference there was between DT880 Pro unamped and my old Siberia v2. Sure, 880s sound better even unamped but that's not a "150$ better" even though one is a gaming headset and the other a borderline audiophile headphone. Then again I don't have exactly golden ears...


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> Updated the IEM Buyer's Guide with current prices, and added the dual-driver NarMoo S1 in the Basshead / sub-$50 section.
> 
> 
> I think one of the reasons the Flux is not more popular is that the sensitivity is pretty low, but in practical terms it makes no difference except that you might have to raise your source volume a couple of notches compared to other IEMs.


 
 Good work on the S1 review! I enjoyed reading about it and your take on it since I've read a few others impressions. And thanks for the price updates 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
 It's funny that the Yamaha EPH-100 was just $93 like two or three days ago. It was between $90 & $115 for quite sometime I think. Then just jumped back up to $150.
  
 I was wondering what would you give the Philips S1 and Philips SHE3580/90 in overall SQ? I know you're planning to do a review on HF sometime of the S1, though there's your S1/S2 review on InnerFidelity. I was just curious if the S1 was worth my time, although I am really really satisfied with my TTPOD T1-E right now.
  
 Thanks in advance! 
 and for all you do here on HF! Cheers!


----------



## suman134

yup . i would too like to know about the sq rating on fidelio s1 and s2 .


----------



## ljokerl

xtron2112 said:


> Two questions: How durable are the Altone? I don't expect Dunu or RHA durability, but I'd like IEM's that won't literally fall to pieces *glares at VSD1(s)*. Secondly, I know this is off topic, but is there a way to convert my ALAC iTunes collection to FLAC or mp3 and put it on my Android device(Nvidia Shield handheld)'s MicroSD card?


 
  
 Time will tell in regards to longevity but the initial build quality on the Altone seems fine. It's a pretty basic design, nothing fancy. Put it side by side with T-Peos' sub-$100 sets like the D200R and you won't immediately know which is the higher-end product. But that's fine - the D200R has been plenty durable. 
  


adrianapeach49 said:


> Thinking of getting the RE-400's but when I looked them up I saw them being used with portable amps. Do they sound a lot better with one, or would they be ok from just my phone?


 
  
 I don't know about the RE-400 but I can see why someone would use an amp when running BA or multi-BA earphone from a smartphone. The RE-400 should be fine unless there's some glaring issue with your phone's audio jack (e.g. my old HTC Desire had poor audio hardware and sensitive IEMs would hiss constantly).
  


uppopulla said:


> I feel the biggest issue is it's marketing and intended purpose. Unlike mice and keyboards, gaming headsets have a reputation of getting trashed when compared to similarly priced headphones. Even I was hesitant at first even though I was actually a little disappointed at how little difference there was between DT880 Pro unamped and my old Siberia v2. Sure, 880s sound better even unamped but that's not a "150$ better" even though one is a gaming headset and the other a borderline audiophile headphone. Then again I don't have exactly golden ears...


 
  
 That, too. 
  


ap616 said:


> Good work on the S1 review! I enjoyed reading about it and your take on it since I've read a few others impressions. And thanks for the price updates
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I have the Fidelio S1 rated at 8.9 right now, right below the RE-400. The smoother treble of the HiFiMan ultimately wins me over but the S1 is a great earphone for the money.
  
 3580 I have at 7.8, again very nice for the price. Super comfortable, too. I will do a 3590 review for InnerFidelity soon - needed a sub-$20 entry for the Wall of Fame there.


----------



## MikonJuice

ljokerl, to you, what is considered a satisfactory durability?
 My RE 0 survived for one year and a half, my RE 272 12 months and now my GR 07... 2 years.
 I truly believe that onlye the GR07 had moderate durability, while the others I consider awful.
 I must confess, though, that I probably have the iems in my ears at least 3 hours a day.


----------



## adrianapeach49

thank you for your help guys! I ordered them, they will be my first good quality ear buds so I'm sure they'll still sound great, and I like how small they are!


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> I have the Fidelio S1 rated at 8.9 right now, right below the RE-400. The smoother treble of the HiFiMan ultimately wins me over but the S1 is a great earphone for the money.
> 
> 3580 I have at 7.8, again very nice for the price. Super comfortable, too. I will do a 3590 review for InnerFidelity soon - needed a sub-$20 entry for the Wall of Fame there.


 
 Ok, cool. Thanks so much! I love my SHE3580/90 for the measly 9 bucks. Simply outstanding!
  
 When you say the S2 is marginally better than the S1, do you mean like 9.0 or 9.1ish? Cause I was wondering if the S2 warrants a recommendation at $111 on Amazon vs. the $83 for the S1. Or does the S1 still have a lot more value/better deal in your eyes at these prices as well? 
  
 Also, would you say the TX1/TX2 are good enough to get a review here on your HF thread as well, in due time I mean?


----------



## ljokerl

mikonjuice said:


> ljokerl, to you, what is considered a satisfactory durability?
> My RE 0 survived for one year and a half, my RE 272 12 months and now my GR 07... 2 years.
> I truly believe that onlye the GR07 had moderate durability, while the others I consider awful.
> I must confess, though, that I probably have the iems in my ears at least 3 hours a day.


 
  
 I think a year with heavy use is reasonable unless we're talking an unreasonably expensive product like a K3003 or something.
  
  


ap616 said:


> Ok, cool. Thanks so much! I love my SHE3580/90 for the measly 9 bucks. Simply outstanding!
> 
> When you say the S2 is marginally better than the S1, do you mean like 9.0 or 9.1ish? Cause I was wondering if the S2 warrants a recommendation at $111 on Amazon vs. the $83 for the S1. Or does the S1 still have a lot more value/better deal in your eyes at these prices as well?
> 
> Also, would you say the TX1/TX2 are good enough to get a review here on your HF thread as well, in due time I mean?


 
  
 Yep, that's exactly what I mean. It's hard to say at what point one becomes a better deal than the other - if you can afford the extra $30 for the S2 without a stretch, I would do it just to get the nicer construction with more metal bits. The extra Comply tips are a nice bonus as well. 
  
 The TX1 and TX2 are definitely worth adding here. Just not in a rush because I still prefer the VSonic VSD1S to the TX2 so I don't see the Philips knocking it off my own buyer's guide.


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> Yep, that's exactly what I mean. It's hard to say at what point one becomes a better deal than the other - if you can afford the extra $30 for the S2 without a stretch, I would do it just to get the nicer construction with more metal bits. The extra Comply tips are a nice bonus as well.
> 
> The TX1 and TX2 are definitely worth adding here. Just not in a rush because I still prefer the VSonic VSD1S to the TX2 so I don't see the Philips knocking it off my own buyer's guide.


 
 Ah, gotcha! I don't know if I could deal with the peaky treble around 5K & up making it less forgiving and hot. But otherwise the S1/S2 certainly have caught my eye. I feel Philips makes good stuff for the price though as of late.
 Interesting... thanks for the clarification and info. I'm really glad(and others too) you call it like you see it; well, I mean, tell it like you hear it I guess.
  
  
 One more comment/question, though I'm sure I'll have more in the future 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 
 I know you're checking out the KC06 right now. If you like/are fairly impressed with them for the price, hopefully you will consider checking out the TTPOD T1-E, Zero Audio Tenore, Havi B3 Pro 1, or even the KC06A(haven't heard it). I'd really be curious how they fared since they are all between $35 & $70 and maybe an 8.3 or higher on your scale, possibly up to a 8.9 or 9 for one of them. I don't know though, as I don't have your ears... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
 I don't know if others have brought them to your attention yet; if so, sorry to reiterate. Anyways, they are really great and compared positively over/to the VSD3S frequently, which is presumably better than the VSD1S. I know you still gotta hear the VSD3S sometime! I'd send you a VSD3S for testing if I had one if that's any concession. I could send you any or all of those first three though if you're interested to test. I know you're busy just like everyone else, and you've got reviews on the burner right now coming up. Just let me know if you want to or have time for them, and keep up the good work!


----------



## reihead

ljokerl said:


> I have the Fidelio S1 rated at 8.9 right now, right below the RE-400. The smoother treble of the HiFiMan ultimately wins me over but the S1 is a great earphone for the money.
> 
> 3580 I have at 7.8, again very nice for the price. Super comfortable, too. I will do a 3590 review for InnerFidelity soon - needed a sub-$20 entry for the Wall of Fame there.


 
  
 Any ratings (or pre-ratings) for the Altone200 and the Dunu 2000?


----------



## DrunkenTiger

Best hip hop earbuds 25-30$ from Amazon or something like that?


----------



## ZapX629

Pistons, probably.


----------



## ljokerl

ap616 said:


> Ah, gotcha! I don't know if I could deal with the peaky treble around 5K & up making it less forgiving and hot. But otherwise the S1/S2 certainly have caught my eye. I feel Philips makes good stuff for the price though as of late.
> Interesting... thanks for the clarification and info. I'm really glad(and others too) you call it like you see it; well, I mean, tell it like you hear it I guess.
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, aside from the Philips O'Neill earphones I have yet to be disappointed with one of their in-ears.
  
 I do like the KC06 and would like to try all of these other popular sets. The VSD3S is at the top of my list but I need to repost the VSD1/VSD1S reviews here first, and complete one for the newer GR07 Classic. By the time I get done with that there will be a new crop of popular budget IEMs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
  


reihead said:


> Any ratings (or pre-ratings) for the Altone200 and the Dunu 2000?


 
  
 “Pre-ratings”.. I like that. Let’s say in the 9.3-9.4 range for the Dunu and 9.1-ish for the Altone200. 
  


drunkentiger said:


> Best hip hop earbuds 25-30$ from Amazon or something like that?


 
  
 Yeah... Pistons would probably be your best bet. Just don't get the really cheap fake ones. You can also get a Sony MH1C on eBay for about $28.


----------



## Zelda

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, aside from the Philips O'Neill earphones I have yet to be disappointed with one of their in-ears.
> 
> I do like the KC06 and would like to try all of these other popular sets. The VSD3S is at the top of my list but I need to repost the VSD1/VSD1S reviews here first, and complete one for the *newer GR07 Classic*. By the time I get done with that there will be a new crop of popular budget IEMs
> 
> ...


 
 anything really new about those?


----------



## Exesteils

ljokerl said:


> I do like the KC06 and would like to try all of these other popular sets.
> 
> 
> “Pre-ratings”.. I like that. Let’s say in the 9.3-9.4 range for the Dunu and 9.1-ish for the Altone200.




If you like the Kc06's then the As would be similar but with a deeper bassline. That should give you a good idead

That's quite the feat considering the difference in price between the 2


----------



## ljokerl

zelda said:


> anything really new about those?


 
  
 The price 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Other than that, don't know yet. They're still en route. 
  


exesteils said:


> If you like the Kc06's then the As would be similar but with a deeper bassline. That should give you a good idead


 
  
 Good to know! So far I'm finding the bass of the KC06 satisfactory but if only the deep bass is raised with the KC06A that's not a bad thing.


----------



## suman134

hey joker , can you compare me the brainwavz r3 and re-400 , how much r3 will score on sq ?


----------



## Uppopulla

I gotta say Flux still managed to positively surprise me. First off, the soundstage seems unreal for someone who thought cx400s are decent IEMs. This is just what I was looking for: all around clear sound with good vocals, instrument separation and bass that doesn't conjure up "lows" where none are to be found (e.g. The Agonist's Lullabies-album) but especially electronic music has quite the punch. These are also way more comfortable than the Sennheisers both in terms of ear fit and the cable not constantly pressing against my ear cartilage when worn cable down. It even feels like the included pouch won't fall apart after a year. Thanks again ljokerl for the recommendation. I did notice these in your reviews but, as I said, the "50$ headset can't compete with *real* IEMs" -misbelief got the better of me.


----------



## reihead

ljokerl said:


> “Pre-ratings”.. I like that. Let’s say in the 9.3-9.4 range for the Dunu and 9.1-ish for the Altone200.


 
  
 Hope not to start a trend.
  
 Thank you very much, your rating system is very valuable for me.


----------



## Ap616

reihead said:


> Thank you very much, your rating system is very valuable for me.


 
 +1


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> hey joker , can you compare me the brainwavz r3 and re-400 , how much r3 will score on sq ?


 
  
 Not sure yet. I don't think the R3 is better than the RE-400... a little less mid-centric maybe, but also a bit dull on top.
  


uppopulla said:


> I gotta say Flux still managed to positively surprise me. First off, the soundstage seems unreal for someone who thought cx400s are decent IEMs. This is just what I was looking for: all around clear sound with good vocals, instrument separation and bass that doesn't conjure up "lows" where none are to be found (e.g. The Agonist's Lullabies-album) but especially electronic music has quite the punch. These are also way more comfortable than the Sennheisers both in terms of ear fit and the cable not constantly pressing against my ear cartilage when worn cable down. It even feels like the included pouch won't fall apart after a year. Thanks again ljokerl for the recommendation. I did notice these in your reviews but, as I said, the "50$ headset can't compete with *real* IEMs" -misbelief got the better of me.


 
  
 Don't know about the pouch, but I agree with the rest . Glad you're enjoying the Flux! 
  


reihead said:


> Hope not to start a trend.


 
  
 Not too worry, there's not many things I've heard in depth but haven't reviewed


----------



## pandaprox

Hey joker, I'm sorry of you've been asked before, but have you had the chance to try the vsonic VSD 3s?


----------



## ljokerl

pandaprox said:


> Hey joker, I'm sorry of you've been asked before, but have you had the chance to try the vsonic VSD 3s?


 
  
 No, not yet.


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, aside from the Philips O'Neill earphones I have yet to be disappointed with one of their in-ears.
> 
> I do like the KC06 and would like to try all of these other popular sets. The VSD3S is at the top of my list but I need to repost the VSD1/VSD1S reviews here first, and complete one for the newer GR07 Classic. By the time I get done with that there will be a new crop of popular budget IEMs
> 
> ...


 
 Well, I hope you get to them eventually because they are a little too good to pass up in my opinion haha. That said, I know FOTM comes and goes, but I think these are solid recommendations that could potentially make it into your buyer's guide on THL. I hope they match up against the ever increasing good budget iems that do come along and will still be around for you to test/review. The Ostrys and Vsonics are gunning for a review spot or two, but the Havi and TTPOD deserve one from you too in my opinion 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
 Also, on your 2014 EP Buyer's Guide by SS, I think it might be a minute, but helpful clarification for newcomers&searchers if you put the price of the GR07 BE in the heading of its little review portion along with the GR07 MK2 price, since the BE is $130 from LMUE Amazon in your link & the mkII is $160. Just something I thought of, if someone wanted the bass/version, but didn't click on the link... and thought they were $160 as well. Something like this:
  
*VSonic GR07 mkII ($160) / GR07 Bass Edition ($130)*– The second generation of VSonic’s dynamic-driver flagship retains all of the features that made the original a success – ergonomic housings, adjustable nozzles, great overall construction quality, and consistency across audio sources. It also has the same bio-cellulose dynamic driver producing a well-balanced sound with punchy bass and crisp treble. There are more of both highs and lows compared to the Etymotic HF5, but the GR07 is still pretty darn balanced, and plenty great-sounding. Those looking for a little more bass will enjoy the equally capable GR07 Bass Edition. Read full review: VSonic GR07 / VSonic GR07 Bass Edition

*Buy GR07 (amazon.com)* | *Buy GR07 Bass Edition (amazon.com)* / *(ebay.com)*


----------



## Bluess

Dear |Joker|, what do you think about T-peos H100j? Compare to H100?
Suppose i can get the H100j for 50$. Is it worth the price tag?


----------



## chillaxing

hey joker,  heres another "i need your help" post
  
 looking to get a pair for back up to my cx6/ie6.  First let me say that for 100$ for the cx6 was the best money i've spent on a pair of iems.  i bought these not knowing s***.  just bought them cause i needed a good pair of iso iem's and they were on sale at amazon.   The sound might not be the best but these things are built like tanks. i use these for work (outdoors), gym, under my helmet when i ride, dropped them, stepped on them, outdoor activities, etc, etc.  i literally tried to kill these things before the warranty was over.  not only did not die but they are still going strong almost 2 yrs after warranty.  With that being said i think i need a back up pair for these things.  So whats your recommendation?  I need form over function with these.  they need to be well built and sleek enough for me to do all the things that i need them for.  sound doesn't matter as long as they sound as good as my cx6.


----------



## ljokerl

ap616 said:


> Well, I hope you get to them eventually because they are a little too good to pass up in my opinion haha. That said, I know FOTM comes and goes, but I think these are solid recommendations that could potentially make it into your buyer's guide on THL. I hope they match up against the ever increasing good budget iems that do come along and will still be around for you to test/review. The Ostrys and Vsonics are gunning for a review spot or two, but the Havi and TTPOD deserve one from you too in my opinion
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 That's a good point, they used to be the same price and then I just never updated it. Fixed it now. Hopefully the GR07 classic can just replace the GR07 on there at $99.
  


bluess said:


> Dear |Joker|, what do you think about T-peos H100j? Compare to H100?
> Suppose i can get the H100j for 50$. Is it worth the price tag?


 
  
 Unfortunately the original H100 is the only version I've tried.
  


chillaxing said:


> hey joker,  heres another "i need your help" post
> 
> looking to get a pair for back up to my cx6/ie6.  First let me say that for 100$ for the cx6 was the best money i've spent on a pair of iems.  i bought these not knowing s***.  just bought them cause i needed a good pair of iso iem's and they were on sale at amazon.   The sound might not be the best but these things are built like tanks. i use these for work (outdoors), gym, under my helmet when i ride, dropped them, stepped on them, outdoor activities, etc, etc.  i literally tried to kill these things before the warranty was over.  not only did not die but they are still going strong almost 2 yrs after warranty.  With that being said i think i need a back up pair for these things.  So whats your recommendation?  I need form over function with these.  they need to be well built and sleek enough for me to do all the things that i need them for.  sound doesn't matter as long as they sound as good as my cx6.


 
  
 Shure SE215? Fairly low-profile, great isolation, very good built quality, and good sound. I still like the IE6 better for comfort but the SE215 has replaceable cables and sounds a little better from what I remember of the IE6.


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> That's a good point, they used to be the same price and then I just never updated it. Fixed it now. Hopefully the GR07 classic can just replace the GR07 on there at $99.


 
 Okidokie. Cool, I thought about that too; t'will be interesting if they are on par with the mk1, BE, & mk2 and very very similar. Hopefully so!
 Cause $99 or the 82 bucks they are at LMUE right now would be a steal.


----------



## Ap616

Also, I just wanted to say a few more little things on your buyer's guide as I like to test things and help with minor fixes. Sorry if it's a bother, I just want to help others too. I think they are beneficial updates. You can decide if you want to fix all or just some, but they should all be quick and helpful to others.
 From top of the guide to bottom:
  
 The HA-FX101 are now $13, very minor price update.
  
 The vPulse is no longer $70, but $45, so I think a pricing update would be helpful for that. That would put it below $50 for Basshead in categories, and there would only be the Wooduo by itself. That is just the only one out of the guide that seemingly needs a price update the most for buyers. All the others are pretty spot on.
  
 The preferred Dunu Trident link is an ended auction, so here is a one with Dunu Tridents from a search like your other eBay links for webpage consistency:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313.TR11.TRC1.A0.H0.XDunu+Trident&_nkw=Dunu+Trident&_sacat=0
  
 The Philips SHE3590 are now $9, very minor price update.
  
 Soundmagic E10 are now $32, minor price update.
  
 The VSD1S isn't available new on your Amazon link anymore. So I don't know if you wanna link it to LMUE with price update of $38 here: http://www.lendmeurears.com/vsd1s/
  
 The MOE-SS01 link to LMUE was broken since the new site update, though the eBay one still works. So here's the new one if you want to insert it in your guide: http://www.lendmeurears.com/moe-ss01/
  
 Philips S1 are now $84, minor price update but this one could fluctuate a little sooner unlike the others I think. Your call.
  
  
 That's it. Hope it helps some other people with decisions and convenience Oh, and thanks for your website; it's great!


----------



## chillaxing

ljokerl said:


> Shure SE215? Fairly low-profile, great isolation, very good built quality, and good sound. I still like the IE6 better for comfort but the SE215 has replaceable cables and sounds a little better from what I remember of the IE6.


 
 thanks but i think i need something that is around the same design as the ie6.  i need to be able to wear the cords straight down.  i dont mind going up to 150$ range. thanks
  
  
 yeah cx6 is still the most comfortable iem that i've tried.  wished they didn't discontinued it


----------



## ljokerl

ap616 said:


> Also, I just wanted to say a few more little things on your buyer's guide as I like to test things and help with minor fixes. Sorry if it's a bother, I just want to help others too. I think they are beneficial updates. You can decide if you want to fix all or just some, but they should all be quick and helpful to others.
> From top of the guide to bottom:
> 
> The HA-FX101 are now $13, very minor price update.
> ...


 
  
 Thanks... updated all of the broken links. The minor price changes I usually ignore, especially when they require re-organizing the guide, just because the prices fluctuate (and sometimes differ by color) and are hard to keep up with. Will keep an eye on the S1 and vPulse. The vPulse for example hasn't been at $45 for more than a week. It's only a few third-party amazon sellers with that price. Will see if it price holds or goes back up the $70ish it's been at for a couple of months once they sell out. If it stays at $45 I guess the RHA MA350 is going to get knocked out 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


chillaxing said:


> thanks but i think i need something that is around the same design as the ie6.  i need to be able to wear the cords straight down.  i dont mind going up to 150$ range. thanks
> 
> 
> yeah cx6 is still the most comfortable iem that i've tried.  wished they didn't discontinued it


 
  
 The IE6 was designed for over-the-ear wear, like the IE7/IE8:
  

  
 I don't have any experience with the CX6 but there's not many flush/ergonomic cable-down earphones out there. Your best bet might just be a small straight-barrel one, like a Yamaha EPH-100 or Sony MH1C or HiSound Crystal (if you insert the latter deep enough that it doesn't interfere with your helmet). Maybe the Audio-Technica CKM500, even. It fits more like an earbud with a nozzle, but isn't too big.
  
 Not sure why more manufacturers don't have flush-fitting cable-down earphones.


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> Thanks... updated all of the broken links. The minor price changes I usually ignore, especially when they require re-organizing the guide, just because the prices fluctuate (and sometimes differ by color) and are hard to keep up with. Will keep an eye on the S1 and vPulse. The vPulse for example hasn't been at $45 for more than a week. It's only a few third-party amazon sellers with that price. Will see if it price holds or goes back up the $70ish it's been at for a couple of months once they sell out. If it stays at $45 I guess the RHA MA350 is going to get knocked out




No problem man.
Ah, ok. Yeah, I figured you could pick out what was important. I just noticed the vPulse dropped a lot, and I saw there were about 3 sellers fulfilled by Amazon offering them for 45, 46, & $47. Then the one $69 seller at the bottom. About the colors, I could see that being a viable issue with them ranging from $33-57 for pink, black, or blue. 
Oh no, not the RHA! Lol just kidding.


----------



## jarrett

Is Amazon the best/only place to buy the Fidelio S1 from? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 Why does MEElectronics no longer list the A161?


----------



## kova4a

jarrett said:


> Why does MEElectronics no longer list the A161?


 
 Because the a161p was discontinued.


----------



## chillaxing

ljokerl said:


> The IE6 was designed for over-the-ear wear, like the IE7/IE8:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 yeah, the ie6/cx6 were meant to be worn around the ears.  But the design lets me wear it cable-down with no problems.
  
 maybe companies aren't making more sleek designed iem cause of the trend of hybrids and sticking big ass drivers in a casing the size of a tootsie roll.  So to the companies that might be reading this thread.  make something more ergonomical.  Sometimes i dont want things that are the size of my thumb sticking out of my ears. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 based on your pics and reviews.  i ordered the ma750, gr07 BE, and Altone200.  lets which ones are gonna get shipped back or sold on the FS/FT forum.  I';m already thinking that the altones might give me the most problems.  how did the altones feel to you?  where they protruding to far out?


----------



## ljokerl

ap616 said:


> No problem man.
> Ah, ok. Yeah, I figured you could pick out what was important. I just noticed the vPulse dropped a lot, and I saw there were about 3 sellers fulfilled by Amazon offering them for 45, 46, & $47. Then the one $69 seller at the bottom. About the colors, I could see that being a viable issue with them ranging from $33-57 for pink, black, or blue.
> Oh no, not the RHA! Lol just kidding.


 
  
 I appreciate it. Definitely need to keep an eye on the pricing.
  


jarrett said:


> Is Amazon the best/only place to buy the Fidelio S1 from?


 

  
 They're on ebay also but the prices aren't lower from what I've seen.
  


chillaxing said:


> yeah, the ie6/cx6 were meant to be worn around the ears.  But the design lets me wear it cable-down with no problems.
> 
> maybe companies aren't making more sleek designed iem cause of the trend of hybrids and sticking big ass drivers in a casing the size of a tootsie roll.  So to the companies that might be reading this thread.  make something more ergonomical.  Sometimes i dont want things that are the size of my thumb sticking out of my ears.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, the Altone200 is at least average-sized for an earphone of that type, if not a little longer. Don't think it will fit under a helmet.


----------



## Midgetguy

Hey ljokerl, I was wondering if you were going to be reviewing the VSonic VSD3S IEMs that came out not too long ago. I just ordered a pair and wanted to know if you were going to be doing a review of these in the near future. Love your IEM review list, definitely helped me out with picking up a new set of IEMs; ended up getting a set of VSonic GR06s and definitely have no regrets!


----------



## nauhid

Hi ljoker, 
 I m n avid fan n follower of ur thread.my hifiman re0 is gone.plse suggest me an able replacement to re0.i m much into this sound signature.i current own re zero,philips she3590(ur recommendation),t peos popular, soundmagic e10,senheisercx 400,hd 450.source cown j3, sansa clip+.plse sir help me with this.my budget is around $50. And sadly in india only vsonic,fidue n astrotec is available thru hifinage.i need an analytical iem sir but no sibilance on d treble side.
 Thnx,nauhid


----------



## suman134

nauhid said:


> Hi ljoker,
> I m n avid fan n follower of ur thread.my hifiman re0 is gone.plse suggest me an able replacement to re0.i m much into this sound signature.i current own re zero,philips she3590(ur recommendation),t peos popular, soundmagic e10,senheisercx 400,hd 450.source cown j3, sansa clip+.plse sir help me with this.my budget is around $50. And sadly in india only vsonic,fidue n astrotec is available thru hifinage.i need an analytical iem sir but no sibilance on d treble side.
> Thnx,nauhid


 
  
    may i ? vsonic r02 try karo its not sibilant at all . and if it cant replace the re0 its not worse then it too . But has more bass . agar bass thoda sa zyada chalega tou fidue 63 bhi aacha hai .


----------



## nauhid

http://www.head-fi.org/u/271457/suman134
 Sir, vsonic earphones r all fairly clear n resonant with punchy bass.i forgot to mention dat i hve heard fidue a63.prominent midrange.smooth treble.good.but i need a sound signature close to re0.i dnt mind a little lack of bass and a laidback mid .wat i really need is treble extension which is not far etched like uetriple fi10.i hear dat vsonic vc02 may b a good replacement.wat do u think


----------



## nauhid

suman134 said:


> may i ? vsonic r02 try karo its not sibilant at all . and if it cant replace the re0 its not worse then it too . But has more bass . agar bass thoda sa zyada chalega tou fidue 63 bhi aacha hai.
> 
> Sir, how is vsonic vc02


----------



## suman134

nauhid said:


> http://www.head-fi.org/u/271457/suman134
> Sir, vsonic earphones r all fairly clear n resonant with punchy bass.i forgot to mention dat i hve heard fidue a63.prominent midrange.smooth treble.good.but i need a sound signature close to re0.i dnt mind a little lack of bass and a laidback mid .wat i really need is treble extension which is not far etched like uetriple fi10.i hear dat vsonic vc02 may b a good replacement.wat do u think


 
  
    vc02 was in my mind but then i saw that you dont want much highs so i recommended fidue and r02 , and i got to say i love vc02 , if it was supposed to grow up , it will be a re-400 and thats a huge thing . dont think much , go for vc02 from snapdeal , they have a coupon of 250 which will bring the price close to 3100 inr .


----------



## nauhid

suman134 said:


> vc02 was in my mind but then i saw that you dont want much highs so i recommended fidue and r02 , and i got to say i love vc02 , if it was supposed to grow up , it will be a re-400 and thats a huge thing . dont think much , go for vc02 from snapdeal , they have a coupon of 250 which will bring the price close to 3100 inr .




Dat mins sir u r saying vc02 is sibilant.but sir fidue is not neutral .neither gr02 is.i read the review of mark n ljoker.but stuck up.


----------



## ljokerl

midgetguy said:


> Hey ljokerl, I was wondering if you were going to be reviewing the VSonic VSD3S IEMs that came out not too long ago. I just ordered a pair and wanted to know if you were going to be doing a review of these in the near future. Love your IEM review list, definitely helped me out with picking up a new set of IEMs; ended up getting a set of VSonic GR06s and definitely have no regrets!


 
  
 I do plan to review it but I probably won't get my hands on it for another month or two. I'm a couple of months behind on another VSonic write-up :/. 
  


nauhid said:


> Hi ljoker,
> I m n avid fan n follower of ur thread.my hifiman re0 is gone.plse suggest me an able replacement to re0.i m much into this sound signature.i current own re zero,philips she3590(ur recommendation),t peos popular, soundmagic e10,senheisercx 400,hd 450.source cown j3, sansa clip+.plse sir help me with this.my budget is around $50. And sadly in india only vsonic,fidue n astrotec is available thru hifinage.i need an analytical iem sir but no sibilance on d treble side.
> Thnx,nauhid


 
  
 VC02 is the closest in clarity, detail, etc but it might be too bright... it's certainly brighter and not as smooth as the RE0. Honestly, if there was such thing as a $50 RE0 it would be celebrated.
  
 The Astrotecs I've tried don't really fit the mold and the A63 is the only Fidue that comes close (and you've already tried it). VSonic's R02 Silver might be an option - it has the most neutral sound out of the smooth VSonic sets (which is pretty much three of them - R02 Silver, R02 PRO2, and GR99) but I never thought "wow, this is like a baby RE0" when listening to it. 
  
 I'm thinking LG Quadbeat F420 on ebay might be an option. It's still brighter than the RE0 but unlike the VC02 its brightness comes from the upper midrange and not the treble, which means less sibilance and more refinement up top. Still not an RE0, but it's good for the $30 it costs these days.


----------



## nauhid

[quote name="ljokerl" 


VC02 is the closest in clarity, detail, etc but it might be too bright... it's certainly brighter and not as smooth as the RE0. Honestly, if there was such thing as a $50 RE0 it would be celebrated.

The Astrotecs I've tried don't really fit the mold and the A63 is the only Fidue that comes close (and you've already tried it). VSonic's R02 Silver might be an option - it has the most neutral sound out of the smooth VSonic sets (which is pretty much three of them - R02 Silver, R02 PRO2, and GR99) but I never thought "wow, this is like a baby RE0" when listening to it. 

I'm thinking LG Quadbeat F420 on ebay might be an option. It's still brighter than the RE0 but unlike the VC02 its brightness comes from the upper midrange and not the treble, which means less sibilance and more refinement up top. Still not an RE0, but it's good for the $30 it costs these days. 
[/quote]

Sir,if i increase my budget to $80-$100 is dre anythng dat u wanna suggest me.i min in terms of neutrality.
Waiting avidly
Thnx nauhid


----------



## nauhid

ljokerl said:


> I do plan to review it but I probably won't get my hands on it for another month or two. I'm a couple of months behind on another VSonic write-up :/.
> 
> 
> VC02 is the closest in clarity, detail, etc but it might be too bright... it's certainly brighter and not as smooth as the RE0. Honestly, if there was such thing as a $50 RE0 it would be celebrated.
> ...




Sir,is r02 silver a little more refined n neutral than vc02.btw thnx for ur budget option of philips she 3590.its by far one of the best in budget category.
Waiting avidly
Thnx, nauhid


----------



## suman134

nauhid said:


> [quote name="ljokerl"
> 
> Sir,if i increase my budget to $80-$100 is dre anythng dat u wanna suggest me.i min in terms of neutrality.
> Waiting avidly
> Thnx nauhid


 
  
    Now you have hf5 . and this too is not like re0 , you can opt for re-400 though . but the price is over $100 here its like $120 . and hf5 is like $150 .


----------



## murano

nauhid said:


> Hi ljoker,
> I m n avid fan n follower of ur thread.my hifiman re0 is gone.plse suggest me an able replacement to re0.i m much into this sound signature.i current own re zero,philips she3590(ur recommendation),t peos popular, soundmagic e10,senheisercx 400,hd 450.source cown j3, sansa clip+.plse sir help me with this.my budget is around $50. And sadly in india only vsonic,fidue n astrotec is available thru hifinage.i need an analytical iem sir but no sibilance on d treble side.
> Thnx,nauhid


 
  
 Since you already own the RE-Zero, I'm wondering why you just don't use those.


----------



## ljokerl

nauhid said:


> Sir,if i increase my budget to $80-$100 is dre anythng dat u wanna suggest me.i min in terms of neutrality.
> Waiting avidly
> Thnx nauhid


 
  
 HiFiMan RE-400, Ultimate Ears 600, and Etymotic MC5
  


nauhid said:


> Sir,is r02 silver a little more refined n neutral than vc02.btw thnx for ur budget option of philips she 3590.its by far one of the best in budget category.
> Waiting avidly
> Thnx, nauhid


 
  
 No, but it is smoother in the treble and does a much better job of avoiding sibilance. 
  
 Glad you like 3590!


----------



## peter123

nauhid said:


> Sir,if i increase my budget to $80-$100 is dre anythng dat u wanna suggest me.i min in terms of neutrality.
> Waiting avidly
> Thnx nauhid


 
 You my friend need the Havi B3 Pro1 (original), in that budget you also have room for the Topping NX1 amp since I'm not sure that you're current sources has enough power for them


----------



## robakri

peter123 said:


> You my friend need the Havi B3 Pro1 (original), in that budget you also have room for the Topping NX1 amp since I'm not sure that you're current sources has enough power for them


 
 +1


----------



## suman134

peter123 said:


> You my friend need the Havi B3 Pro1 (original), in that budget you also have room for the Topping NX1 amp since I'm not sure that you're current sources has enough power for them


 

   not available here in india .


----------



## peter123

suman134 said:


> not available here in india .


 
 I was pretty sure LMUE shipped to India but I might have got that wrong.


----------



## suman134

peter123 said:


> I was pretty sure LMUE shipped to India but I might have got that wrong.


 

 they do ship but most of us dont like to pay 20% custom charges , and we do feel uneasy while buying from other countries . but still we buy , i have some imports .


----------



## peter123

suman134 said:


> they do ship but most of us dont like to pay 20% custom charges , and we do feel uneasy while buying from other countries . but still we buy , i have some imports .


 
 I understand, thank you for clarifying .


----------



## garcsa

Hi there! Fast off topic question - looking for a pair of silicone  eartips size "L"  for  JVC FXD 80. Anybody? Thanks


----------



## suman134

garcsa said:


> Hi there! Fast off topic question - looking for a pair of silicone  eartips size "L"  for  JVC FXD 80. Anybody? Thanks


 

  comply says any 500 series tip will fit .


----------



## garcsa

suman134 said:


> comply says any 500 series tip will fit .


 
 thanks, dont't like foamies.


----------



## suman134

garcsa said:


> thanks, dont't like foamies.


 

  then its going to be hard !! i think cc51 tips will fit .


----------



## garcsa

suman134 said:


> then its going to be hard !! i think cc51 tips will fit .


 
 yep, thats right! anybody for sale silicone for cc51, jvc or another iem with 6mm nozle . single flange. thanx. sile L


----------



## suman134

garcsa said:


> yep, thats right! anybody for sale silicone for cc51, jvc or another iem with 6mm nozle . single flange. thanx. sile L


 

  here you go bro !! just for you !!
  
 http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Original_Eartips_for_CC51_Earphones_p/tipset4-cc51cl-mee.htm
  
 it says in stock im not sure .


----------



## suman134

you will get one large though . and there is a black set too .


----------



## garcsa




----------



## suman134

garcsa said:


>


 

  cheers , have a good day !!


----------



## Ap616

suman134 said:


> then its going to be hard !! i think cc51 tips will fit .







garcsa said:


> yep, thats right! anybody for sale silicone for cc51, jvc or another iem with 6mm nozle . single flange. thanx. sile L







garcsa said:


>


 

I have Auvio medium and large tips from RadioShack for the FXD80, which work the best. They have a nice wide bore and are somewhat squishy. They work good, as the stock tips are uncomfortable and don't seal well for me.


----------



## sithjedi333

Hi Joker,
  
 I saw your Piston review on Innerfidelity, thanks for sharing that.
  
 I was wondering if you have any suggested EQ settings for a 10 band equalizer to get the sound closer to your liking.
  
 Thank you.


----------



## loomisjohnson

i'm sure it exists somewhere in these forums, but has anyone done a direct comparison between the astrotec ax-35 and the mee a161p? i'm a big fan of the a161p and looking to delve further into ba/hybrid without sacrificing a lot of low end. thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

sithjedi333 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I saw your Piston review on Innerfidelity, thanks for sharing that.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, I don't really bother with EQ these days. If I had to start somewhere it would be by evening out the mid-bass hump of the Pistons, I think that's their biggest weakness. There's a nice tutorial (IMO) here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/615417/how-to-equalize-your-headphones-advanced-tutorial-in-progress You might also want to check the long Piston discussion thread to see if anyone posted any experiences EQing them. 
  


loomisjohnson said:


> i'm sure it exists somewhere in these forums, but has anyone done a direct comparison between the astrotec ax-35 and the mee a161p? i'm a big fan of the a161p and looking to delve further into ba/hybrid without sacrificing a lot of low end. thanks in advance.


 
  
 Well, the AX-35 certainly doesn't sacrifice anything at the low end - it's actually bassier than the A161P. Its signature is more v-shaped, however, and the mids are recessed in comparison to the A161P. The A161P is more neutral and to me more natural in tone. Treble on the AX35 is brighter but not behind in quality. The AX-35 is also more spacious while the A161P is more forward.


----------



## garcsa

ap616 said:


> I have Auvio medium and large tips from RadioShack for the FXD80, which work the best. They have a nice wide bore and are somewhat squishy. They work good, as the stock tips are uncomfortable and don't seal well for me.


 
 some photos? pm please, thanks


----------



## Sauntere

Hi Joker,
  
 In your opinion what are the best sounding Dynamic driver IEMs you have ever heard. 
  
 I ask this because recently it became apparent to me that BA sets are tonally incorrect. Now i haven't listened to any of the top of the line BAs but all those i have heard sound wrong whilst the Dynamics sound much more true to the sound of real instruments and voices.
  
 I arrived at this conclusion after carefully listening (i mean really paying attention) to live music vs my stereo set up vs Dynamic driver IEMs vs BAs.
  
 Is this something you agree with as a general principle ? Or am i just listening to the wrong BAs ?
  
 When i say best Dynamic IEMs i mean in every  usual hifi sense. ie detail, resolving power, ambience bass detail, treble extension etc....  
  
 Thanks


----------



## suman134

sauntere said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> In your opinion what are the best sounding Dynamic driver IEMs you have ever heard.
> 
> ...


 
  
   to me there is no better dynamic then ex1000 or mdr7550 i have heard , the sense of space and separation is best from an dynamic . BA dont have that juice like dynamics but i havent heard much top of line BA phones .


----------



## ljokerl

sauntere said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> In your opinion what are the best sounding Dynamic driver IEMs you have ever heard.
> 
> ...


 
  
 You're not along with that opinion but I really think it's a matter of tuning as much as anything else. Some BA drivers just make it really hard to get the tonality right thanks to particular frequency response features (e.g. TWFK).
  
 I tend to like HiFiMan dynamics best for smooth, natural, realistic sound. The now-defunct RE272 is my favorite. I really like the biocellulose drivers in the high-end Sonys and VSonics but they tend to be a little strident (except for the 7550, but that one's a little on the warm side). I have also been recommended the new DITA earphones very strongly for what's supposed to be the best dynamic drivers have to offer (this coming from another HiFiMan fan), but I don't know if I'll have a chance to try them myself.


----------



## Sauntere

ljokerl said:


> You're not along with that opinion but I really think it's a matter of tuning as much as anything else. Some BA drivers just make it really hard to get the tonality right thanks to particular frequency response features (e.g. TWFK).
> 
> I tend to like HiFiMan dynamics best for smooth, natural, realistic sound. The now-defunct RE272 is my favorite. I really like the biocellulose drivers in the high-end Sonys and VSonics but they tend to be a little strident (except for the 7550, but that one's a little on the warm side). I have also been recommended the new DITA earphones very strongly for what's supposed to be the best dynamic drivers have to offer (this coming from another HiFiMan fan), but I don't know if I'll have a chance to try them myself.


 
  
 Thank you for taking the time to answer. I actually have the DITA The Answer myself and it was through comparing that set to the Noble N4 and Fitear F111 that really cemented the opinion i expressed above. So it seems for now at least i have as good as i can reasonably expect. I have never tried HiFiMan sets but from what you have said they probably won't represent an upgrade.
 If i ever get a chance to try without buying i certainly will.
  
 Thanks again.


----------



## ljokerl

sauntere said:


> Thank you for taking the time to answer. I actually have the DITA The Answer myself and it was through comparing that set to the Noble N4 and Fitear F111 that really cemented the opinion i expressed above. So it seems for now at least i have as good as i can reasonably expect. I have never tried HiFiMan sets but from what you have said they probably won't represent an upgrade.
> If i ever get a chance to try without buying i certainly will.
> 
> Thanks again.


 
  
 Doh.. should've looked at your signature. 
  
 Gotta love a nice clear, balanced dynamic-driver earphone.


----------



## FrozenBlade

Hi 
I would like to buy a new pair of earbuds and I'm considering buying one of these:
Soundmagic e10
Soundmagic e30
Vsonic vsd1
Vsonic vsd1s

Maybe you can advise me which one is better or if there is a better earbuds for this price point?

With thanks


----------



## suman134

frozenblade said:


> Hi
> I would like to buy a new pair of earbuds and I'm considering buying one of these:
> Soundmagic e10
> Soundmagic e30
> ...


 
  
   what are you looking for mate , e30 is the most bass lite phone in the list but clarity and detail is behind vsd1/s , and vsd1 is the bassiest of this list , but has more control deatil and clarity , i havent heard the 1s though , and if you want some balance you should go for 1s cuz the word has it that 1s has more balance , if you enjoy V shaped sig , go for vsd1 .


----------



## FrozenBlade

Thank you for helping.
I'm looking for an overall good earphones
I want it to have a good bass but it's not extremely important.
What you mean by "v shaped sig"?


----------



## suman134

frozenblade said:


> Thank you for helping.
> I'm looking for an overall good earphones
> I want it to have a good bass but it's not extremely important.
> What you mean by "v shaped sig"?


 

  by V i mean mids are not as prominent as bass and highs , if you are looking for a fun sounding phone , vsd1 will serve you well .


----------



## ZapX629

I would recommend to you the VSonic VSD3S over the VSD1. It's better in almost every way. TTPOD T1-E is another that people like these days. Both are around $50.


----------



## FrozenBlade

so basically both vsonic are better than soundmagic?
 whats the difference between vsd1 and vsd3s?
  
 thanks


----------



## suman134

frozenblade said:


> so basically both vsonic are better than soundmagic?
> whats the difference between vsd1 and vsd3s?
> 
> thanks


 

 keep no doubts .


----------



## peter123

I'm with @ZapX629, the vsd3s is an upgrade to the vsd1 in every way I can think of and since pricing is pretty much the same it should be a easy choice between the two.


----------



## ZapX629

frozenblade said:


> so basically both vsonic are better than soundmagic?
> whats the difference between vsd1 and vsd3s?
> 
> thanks


 
 The only place where the VSD1 is better is in the bass area. Not in quantity, but in tightness. However, VSD3S has deeper bass which you can feel more. VSD3 has better instrument separation, better soundstage and image, a bit more clarity and detail (with the stock tips), and overall better sound quality. I think it's a great all arounder headphone. It does all genres well and doesn't leave you wanting in anything I've tried. 
  
 My original comparisons are here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/669510/the-new-iem-of-vsonic-vsd-3s-impression-updated-by-smailbz/1695#post_10687161
  
 You can get the black version for $45 at PenonAudio right now.  http://penonaudio.com/VSONIC-VSD3S


----------



## kova4a

frozenblade said:


> so basically both vsonic are better than soundmagic?
> whats the difference between vsd1 and vsd3s?
> 
> thanks


 
 Definitely better than soundmagic. As far as the vsd1/s vs vsd3s - it's not a huge difference sq-wise. They have different presentation with the vsd3s sounding  more mellow and laid back and a bit softer on the bass impact. It is a bit more neutral though and overall is clearer and with better separation than vsd1s. The vsd1s does have a tighter bass with better impact and is warmer and fuller sounding. They are similar in the lower treble but the vsd3s extends better on top and has a lot more shimmer due to the peakiness in the upper treble.
 IMO the vsd3s while not heaps and bounds better is easily the better buy even only for the more spacious sound and better build quality. Also, the vsd1/s is currently being upgraded by vsonic and an updated version should be released in the coming months, so I don't think it's a good idea to buy one now.


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> Definitely better than soundmagic. As far as the vsd1/s vs vsd3s - it's not a huge difference sq-wise. They have different presentation with the vsd3s sounding  more mellow and laid back and a bit softer on the bass impact. It is a bit more neutral though and overall is clearer and with better separation than vsd1s. The vsd1s does have a tighter bass with better impact and is warmer and fuller sounding. They are similar in the lower treble but the vsd3s extends better on top and has a lot more shimmer due to the peakiness in the upper treble.
> IMO the vsd3s while not heaps and bounds better is easily the better buy even only for the more spacious sound and better build quality. Also, the vsd1/s is currently being upgraded by vsonic and an updated version should be released in the coming months, so I don't think it's a good idea to buy one now.


 
  
 First I've heard of an updated VSD1/S. Curious what the changes will be.


----------



## ZapX629

ljokerl said:


> First I've heard of an updated VSD1/S. Curious what the changes will be.


 
 It was talked about here. http://www.head-fi.org/t/669510/the-new-iem-of-vsonic-vsd-3s-impression-updated-by-smailbz/1770#post_10694195
  
 I wonder if the new VSD1 will sound different in any way.


----------



## Bintouch

Hi,
I fully agree with Suman & Kova regarding Vsd1, which I think is a good compromise if you don't have specific highend needs. As per my feeling, the Vsd3s are a bit more N-shaped Vs the Vsd1.
Yes, the Vsonic are better than the Soundmagic.
However, IMHO, if you want great iem (with medium-low budget) with a V-shaped performance like I love (good warm bass, nice highs and the mids a bit more backward) I would also suggest other iem tested... Like for instance Xiaomi Pistons 2 or the Ubsound Fighter aluminum. Then if you love a N-shaped sound, also the easy Dunu dn-12.
Cheers


----------



## Bintouch

Hi,
first of all, thanks & congrats for your deep and superb review since the start of this nice thread.
May you please give me some advice...?
As I've already shared on this forum, I really love V-shaped sound..
that said, I need to find a really v-shaped iem.. would you suggest this T-Pesos D200R?
I mean.. I'm also thinking about the Dunu dn-1000 (which are indeed more V-shaped than dn-2000)... than I've seen many reviews regarding the Altone..
But it's difficult to be sure you know... I love V sound but I don't want the bass cover the other frequencies like Beats and Bose..
So, any advice please?
Cheers


----------



## chillaxing

bintouch said:


> Hi,
> first of all, thanks & congrats for your deep and superb review since the start of this nice thread.
> May you please give me some advice...?
> As I've already shared on this forum, I really love V-shaped sound..
> ...


 
 if you like good quality and quantity bass try the ma750 too.  i just got a pair and all i got to say is wow.  the bass is at the edge of real basshead level without sacrificing much at the other end.   though it is on the warmer side.  another suggestion would probably be the eph-100 but haven't tried those yet.


----------



## Bintouch

Cheers mate


----------



## FrozenBlade

I just found xiaomi piston 2 on eBay for a much cheaper price
Is the piston really better than vsonic?


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> First I've heard of an updated VSD1/S. Curious what the changes will be.


 
  So far seems to be only cosmetic but of course the change in the housing and the cable could lead to some change in the sound. 

  
  
 Quote:


frozenblade said:


> I just found xiaomi piston 2 on eBay for a much cheaper price
> Is the piston really better than vsonic?


 
 There are fakes of the Pistons, so I wouldn't just buy from random sellers. There have been plenty of reports from people who decided to save some bucks and got burned with fakes. And IMO despite all the hype I personally would pick any vsonic model over the pistons.


----------



## ljokerl

zapx629 said:


> It was talked about here. http://www.head-fi.org/t/669510/the-new-iem-of-vsonic-vsd-3s-impression-updated-by-smailbz/1770#post_10694195
> 
> I wonder if the new VSD1 will sound different in any way.


 


> Originally Posted by *kova4a* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> So far seems to be only cosmetic but of course the change in the housing and the cable could lead to some change in the sound.


 

  
 Nice pic. They look great. Same or similar sound with an improved form factor would be a winner. 
  


bintouch said:


> Hi,
> first of all, thanks & congrats for your deep and superb review since the start of this nice thread.
> May you please give me some advice...?
> As I've already shared on this forum, I really love V-shaped sound..
> ...


 
  
 If you're aiming at that $30-50 range, the D200R has a more v-shaped sibling... the Rich200. It has more bass (still a little below DN-1000 level, but not by too much) and a little less midrange presence. These inexpensive T-Peos models all have very good bass quality, definitely no muddiness or veiling. Of course the DN-1000 is better overall but it's 6x more expensive.


----------



## Shawn71

frozenblade said:


> I just found xiaomi piston 2 on eBay for a much cheaper price
> Is the piston really better than vsonic?




To add kova's recommendation, pick vsd3S than vsd1/s/LE.....as its an easy to drive (any source like smartphone,ipods,tabs,etc) no amp required,better sounding than those in that price bracket,has removable cable.....and you will love it in all the department.....


----------



## Bintouch

Thank you Joker...
very nice and clear as always.
Cheers


----------



## Neospider

Hi,
 thanks for the great comparison.
 I would like some help deciding which IEMs to pick.
 I'm looking for balanced sound, does not have to be neutral, but hopefully not artificial. Use would be mostly rock, classic rock and TV/Movies.
 I have looked at Havi B3 pro - needs amp
  KC06 - not suitable for all types of music
 VSD3s - possibly too bassy, not enough clarity?
 Vivo XE800 - not much information on those
  
 They should be suitable for prolonged use.
 My best pick would probably be VSD3s. 
  
 Many thanks for any advice.


----------



## danimoca

Hi Joker! 
  
 First of all, just wanted to thank you for your absolutely astounding contribution to this forum. You reviews and advices really help a lot of people. 
  
 I currently have a pair of Hifiman RE-400's. I love them. I love their balance and detail. 
  
 However, I plan on buying something a bit higher end (so with the usual "upgrades", like more detail), with a bit more bass (not much more) but that still retains that balance. What are your advices up to about 250$?
  
 Again, thanks!


----------



## ZapX629

neospider said:


> Hi,
> thanks for the great comparison.
> I would like some help deciding which IEMs to pick.
> I'm looking for balanced sound, does not have to be neutral, but hopefully not artificial. Use would be mostly rock, classic rock and TV/Movies.
> ...


 
  
 I'm a big fan of the VSD3S. It's a balanced, slightly warm sound but isn't too bassy. It has a soft impact but is fairly well controlled and tight. It extends deep enough to feel some sub-bass. It's also very clear for a warmer type of signature due to its space and separation, though it doesn't seem like it's as clear or spacious as the Havis. For the genres you listed, you won't have a problem with it. I love them for everything in rock from Steely Dan to Arch Enemy. The XE800 are supposed to be based on the GR07, so that would probably be your best buy for the money (bhazard says they're GR07 quality at a VSD3 price), with the caveat that you have to get them through an agent, so they would take longer to reach you and you wouldn't get the warranty.


----------



## ljokerl

neospider said:


> Hi,
> thanks for the great comparison.
> I would like some help deciding which IEMs to pick.
> I'm looking for balanced sound, does not have to be neutral, but hopefully not artificial. Use would be mostly rock, classic rock and TV/Movies.
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, haven't tried the VSD3S, Havi B3, or the Vivo. I would throw in the UE600 at $50 as a good example of balanced, non-fatiguing sound. 
  


danimoca said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> First of all, just wanted to thank you for your absolutely astounding contribution to this forum. You reviews and advices really help a lot of people.
> 
> ...


 
  
 That sounds like a TDK BA200 to me. I compared it to the RE-400 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/tdk-ba200/ . I believe the BA200 has officially been discontinued but you can still find them on eBay and such. Another option is the Sony MDR-7550, but the BA200 is a better match IMO.


----------



## ziflingus

Hi,
 I currently listen mostly to RE0, which I absolutely love.
 I'm looking into buying another IEM, in the sub 200$ department, that would sound differently, looking for a bigger sound with more bass (I have a pair of brainwavz R1, which brought the idea of bigger sound into my life).
 Listening mostly out of unamped sources.
  
 Few options that I though of:
 - RHA MA750i
 - Sony XBA 40 
 - Rockit Sounds R-50
 - TDK BA200
 - VSONIC GR07 (is the classic color model good enough?)
  
 Any comments and/or suggestions would be happily accepted.
  
 Thanks


----------



## suman134

ziflingus said:


> Hi,
> I currently listen mostly to RE0, which I absolutely love.
> I'm looking into buying another IEM, in the sub 200$ department, that would sound differently, looking for a bigger sound with more bass (I have a pair of brainwavz R1, which brought the idea of bigger sound into my life).
> Listening mostly out of unamped sources.
> ...


 

   There is a R3 , which adds some more bass to the RE0 but not much , still this has a huge sound stage , might not have as much details like re-400 but is good enough . and are cheap at $130 . I can tell you that BA200 and R-50 are more flatter then you want , bass is like linear , MA-750 got bass and is good too . you should consider eph-100 if you are after bass .
 sadly im blank on xba40 , i have the xba3 which is not bass heavy but its good enough .


----------



## suman134

joker , can you compare me the ma-750 with R3  ? I have the R3 now , i like it but i wanna know if its worth getting the ma-750 .


----------



## ziflingus

suman134 said:


> There is a R3 , which adds some more bass to the RE0 but not much , still this has a huge sound stage , might not have as much details like re-400 but is good enough . and are cheap at [size=inherit]₪453.86 ($130)[/size] . I can tell you that BA200 and R-50 are more flatter then you want , bass is like linear , MA-750 got bass and is good too . you should consider eph-100 if you are after bass .
> sadly im blank on xba40 , i have the xba3 which is not bass heavy but its good enough .


 
 Do the MA750 have a BIG sound? I'm really impressed with their build quality, but fear they are more a basshead iem, rather than a balanced one with good bass.
  
 I did get to try the sony XBA H2, with my source (galaxy s4), and was really impressed by the sound.
 I wonder if XBA 40 could reproduce this experience.


----------



## suman134

ziflingus said:


> Do the MA750 have a BIG sound? I'm really impressed with their build quality, but fear they are more a basshead iem, rather than a balanced one with good bass.
> 
> I did get to try the sony XBA H2, with my source (galaxy s4), and was really impressed by the sound.
> I wonder if XBA 40 could reproduce this experience.


 

 no idea about the xba 40 or h2 , but ma-750 got bass , big enough . its not huge like xb90ex but big , i wonder of you can try a R3 , its more balanced with some bass , slightly more the re-400 , but i think you should go for dn-1000 would suit you more cuz it has lesser bass then ma-750 which is slow , not as fast as dn-1000 .


----------



## ziflingus

suman134 said:


> no idea about the xba 40 or h2 , but ma-750 got bass , big enough . its not huge like xb90ex but big , i wonder of you can try a R3 , its more balanced with some bass , slightly more the re-400 , but i think you should go for dn-1000 would suit you more cuz it has lesser bass then ma-750 which is slow , not as fast as dn-1000 .


 
  
 Hey Suman,
 Thanks for your help.
 - Is the build quality of the DN-1000 anywhere near MA750?
 - What is your impression of the sony xba 3? Is it driven easily by any source? Does it have a full sound with good bass response, and good detail?


----------



## suman134

ziflingus said:


> Hey Suman,
> Thanks for your help.
> - Is the build quality of the DN-1000 anywhere near MA750?
> - What is your impression of the sony xba 3? Is it driven easily by any source? Does it have a full sound with good bass response, and good detail?


 

  xba 3 got good bass but its not much and got really nice details , not as much as re-400 but close , i like it because of its speed and PRAT , its a warm natural and slightly V shaped sounding earphone . amping helps cuz it has a really low impedance rating which is 12 ohm , and as you know its low enough to use an amp but its not necessary . I use it with my J3 with out any amp .
  dn-1000 has no real build issues , its not built like a ma750 buts its really good .


----------



## dezane222

hi joker,

can you recommend me iem under $150.

bass is there, not big but also not lack ( must have more bass and rumble than B2&vc1000. coz i think they dont have rumble at all)

and good treble to complete.

the most important is it must have stellar stunning great mid and natural real sound. :bigsmile_face:

i listen to variety genre of music, especially jazz, vocal, accoustic, piano and guitar instrument (stacy kent, sara gazarek, jane monheit, alison krauss)

i consider re400 , tdk ba200 ,and fidelio s2. But i want to hear your recommendation


----------



## suman134

dezane222 said:


> hi joker,
> can you recommend me iem under $150.
> bass is there, not big but also not lack ( must have more bass and rumble than B2&vc1000. coz i think they dont have rumble at all)
> and good treble to complete.
> ...


 
  
  ba200 can fit the bill , not the re-400 , its has a small bass increment over b2 .


----------



## ljokerl

ziflingus said:


> Hi,
> I currently listen mostly to RE0, which I absolutely love.
> I'm looking into buying another IEM, in the sub 200$ department, that would sound differently, looking for a bigger sound with more bass (I have a pair of brainwavz R1, which brought the idea of bigger sound into my life).
> Listening mostly out of unamped sources.
> ...


 
  
 Those are all pretty different-sounding. I would say that for bass you'll want at a GR07 Bass Edition over a regular one. The BA200 and R-50 have less bass than these. The R-50 especially is not a good buy if you want an upgrade in bass quantity from the RE0.
  
 The MA750 has a lot more bass than the other sets you're considering, it's a borderline basshead earphone. Good in that context, but very different from an RE0.
  


suman134 said:


> joker , can you compare me the ma-750 with R3  ? I have the R3 now , i like it but i wanna know if its worth getting the ma-750 .


 
  
 The MA750 is bassier and warmer, with less forward mids and a bit more lower treble. The R3 is more balanced overall, with less bass enhancement, more forward mids, and smoother treble.
  


dezane222 said:


> hi joker,
> can you recommend me iem under $150.
> bass is there, not big but also not lack ( must have more bass and rumble than B2&vc1000. coz i think they dont have rumble at all)
> and good treble to complete.
> ...


 
  
 GR07 Bass Edition can be had for $130 or so nowadays. It has slightly more bass than even the Fidelio S2. The midrange is better on the BA200 IMO but I think the GR07 BE is a worthy compromise if you thought the B2/VC1000 didn't have any bass. The RE-400 is most likely not a good buy for what you want.


----------



## suman134

Thanks for the help , i think its not the one for me , may be the S2 .


----------



## ziflingus

ljokerl said:


> Those are all pretty different-sounding. I would say that for bass you'll want at a GR07 Bass Edition over a regular one. The BA200 and R-50 have less bass than these. The R-50 especially is not a good buy if you want an upgrade in bass quantity from the RE0.
> 
> The MA750 has a lot more bass than the other sets you're considering, it's a borderline basshead earphone. Good in that context, but very different from an RE0.
> 
> ...


 
 Hi ljokerl.
 Thanks so much for the reply, and for this amazing thread.
  
 - Can you comment regarding "sony-ish" sound with comparison to the main candidates above?
 - Should t-peos altone2000 should be considered in this category?


----------



## dezane222

sorry double post


----------



## dezane222

suman134 said:


> ba200 can fit the bill , not the re-400 , its has a small bass increment over b2 .


 
 thanks for reply
 i think i already like ba200 more than re400 
  


ljokerl said:


> Those are all pretty different-sounding. I would say that for bass you'll want at a GR07 Bass Edition over a regular one. The BA200 and R-50 have less bass than these. The R-50 especially is not a good buy if you want an upgrade in bass quantity from the RE0.
> 
> The MA750 has a lot more bass than the other sets you're considering, it's a borderline basshead earphone. Good in that context, but very different from an RE0.
> 
> ...


 
 thanks for the reply joker.
 i had gr07 classic. it very good sounding, the bass quality is great, and quantity is more than enough for me. but sold it because the mid/vocal not forward and lush enough for my taste.
 i dont mind trade a little decrease bass quantity of gr07 for increase quality&lush mid of ba200 
 do you think i will get more quality and lush mid from ba200 compared to gr07?


----------



## ljokerl

ziflingus said:


> Hi ljokerl.
> Thanks so much for the reply, and for this amazing thread.
> 
> - Can you comment regarding "sony-ish" sound with comparison to the main candidates above?
> - Should t-peos altone2000 should be considered in this category?


 
  
 I don't know what you mean by Sony-ish sound - Sony has a lot of headphones spanning different sound signatures. The Altone200 would be too much of a change from the RE0 IMO - just too v-shaped and bright. It's got a big sound, just not sure it's the signature you are looking for. 
  


dezane222 said:


> thanks for the reply joker.
> i had gr07 classic. it very good sounding, the bass quality is great, and quantity is more than enough for me. but sold it because the mid/vocal not forward and lush enough for my taste.
> i dont mind trade a little decrease bass quantity of gr07 for increase quality&lush mid of ba200
> do you think i will get more quality and lush mid from ba200 compared to gr07?


 
  
 Compared to the GR07 and Fidelio S2 the BA200 does focus on more on the mids. About the same as the RE-400, but the bass is a little deeper on the TDKs.


----------



## dezane222

> Compared to the GR07 and Fidelio S2 the BA200 does focus on more on the mids. About the same as the RE-400, but the bass is a little deeper on the TDKs.


 
 so it is ba200 i will buy 
 thanks joker


----------



## suman134

dezane222 said:


> so it is ba200 i will buy
> thanks joker


 

  told you .


----------



## queerquirks

how would the final audio design Heaven II and carbo zero Tenore compare to jvc fxt90? 
 Past sets owned include vsonic GR07 and ba200. 
  
 I prefer wide soundstage (gr07), clear and good mids (ba200, although a little too forward sounding for me while gr07 was too dry) and a sound that comes together musically (less analytical?). 
 Im not particular about bass so amount equivalent to the 2 sets are alright. Branwavz B2 and Rockit R-50 bass level are too little (owned and sold off).


----------



## ziflingus

Eventually, after too much time spent on reading headphone reviews, I decided to intuitively order a pair of ath-im70 (I have great faith in audio technica)
 Will report back when they get to me


----------



## ljokerl

queerquirks said:


> how would the final audio design Heaven II and carbo zero Tenore compare to jvc fxt90?
> Past sets owned include vsonic GR07 and ba200.
> 
> I prefer wide soundstage (gr07), clear and good mids (ba200, although a little too forward sounding for me while gr07 was too dry) and a sound that comes together musically (less analytical?).
> Im not particular about bass so amount equivalent to the 2 sets are alright. Branwavz B2 and Rockit R-50 bass level are too little (owned and sold off).


 
  
 The Heaven II is a lot flatter/more accurate/more analytical than the FXT90. It doesn't have the bass quantity of a GR07 and generally reminds me more of the B2 or R-50 than a GR07 or BA200. 
  


ziflingus said:


> Eventually, after too much time spent on reading headphone reviews, I decided to intuitively order a pair of ath-im70 (I have great faith in audio technica)
> Will report back when they get to me


 
  
 Enjoy!


----------



## AgentJ

Hey Joker!
  
 I've been pretty content with my DT770 and FRD80s, but I went on the Golden Ears site again and found that I actually quite liked the darker sounding sound clips (using my DT770). I know it's a little late to be realising this now, but to be honest I'm fine with the sound on the 770 (EQing helps a bit), its just vocals on the FRD80 sometimes sound a little unnatural. 
  
 When I first got my JVC XX and AM800 I was listening to a lot of crap, but since then I've started listening to a lot more house (deamau5, daft punk etc). For this, both my current headphones are good, but my problems are that I also listen to a lot of indie pop/alternative (passenger, chet faker, imagine dragons etc) 
  
 I've tried simply boosting the mid-bass on the FRDs to try and put some more emphasis on the vocals but it didn't really work out too well either :/
  
 Just wondering what my options would be if I were to consider upgrading (yet again ) to something more warm than the FRD80s, but still less than £50 if possible, and maybe with a mic if that's possible too?
  
 If it helps, I went back to the AM800s and I could definitely hear the difference in the mids, and really liked that. Actually that probably makes everything harder :/
  
 Thanks for the help though!
  
 edit: also, you mentioned this before, but I couldn't find it. Any help?
  


> There's an app that lets you use reference headphones and pre-set EQ settings to "try out" different other sound signatures. I believe it's curated by GoldenEars and you can find it on their site.


----------



## ruthieandjohn

Here's a write up in Accudio, by GoldenEars. 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/644688/the-accudio-app-by-golden-ears-a-headphone-revolution

You can get it on the iPhone App Store,


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> Hey Joker!
> 
> I've been pretty content with my DT770 and FRD80s, but I went on the Golden Ears site again and found that I actually quite liked the darker sounding sound clips (using my DT770). I know it's a little late to be realising this now, but to be honest I'm fine with the sound on the 770 (EQing helps a bit), its just vocals on the FRD80 sometimes sound a little unnatural.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I think the Sony MH1C is your best bet for warmer sound that's natural. It may not be as clear as the FRDs but it's got the right tonal character.
  
 And yes, Accudio is the app I was thinking of.


----------



## SyCo87

Two questions for you Joker, have you've listened to ATH-IM60, and if you did what's a good upgrade?

I love this IEM but, I'm just ready to upgrade and hear better if there's a good option out there with similar mids and more impactful bass.


----------



## suman134

syco87 said:


> Two questions for you Joker, have you've listened to ATH-IM60, and if you did what's a good upgrade?
> 
> I love this IEM but, I'm just ready to upgrade and hear better if there's a good option out there with similar mids and more impactful bass.


 
  
   is there a ath-im60 ? sorry if i have been in caves for few months .


----------



## AgentJ

I don't know if there's a price difference between here and over there, but the MH1C are really cheap at £12 (JVC were £30). Is that just a nice surprise or is there anything recommended slightly above that price? 

I know more money doesn't always equal better sound, but I thought it was worth asking.

edit:

I've had a look at the Accudio app, and it does look pretty good. Does anyone know of anything like that from Windows or Android?


----------



## ljokerl

syco87 said:


> Two questions for you Joker, have you've listened to ATH-IM60, and if you did what's a good upgrade?
> 
> I love this IEM but, I'm just ready to upgrade and hear better if there's a good option out there with similar mids and more impactful bass.


 
  
 I didn't know there even was an IM60...
  


agentj said:


> I don't know if there's a price difference between here and over there, but the MH1C are really cheap at £12 (JVC were £30). Is that just a nice surprise or is there anything recommended slightly above that price?
> 
> I know more money doesn't always equal better sound, but I thought it was worth asking.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'm used to the MH1C being $30-60. Sounds like you're just getting a good deal. 
  
 There was a store that allowed you to "sample" different headphones in the same way online but it was mostly full-size cans and for the life of me I can't remember the name. Maybe someone else knows what I'm talking about.


----------



## Pastapipo

agentj said:


> I don't know if there's a price difference between here and over there, but the MH1C are really cheap at £12 (JVC were £30). Is that just a nice surprise or is there anything recommended slightly above that price?


 
  
 Isn't that the MH1 instead of the MH1C?
 The difference is the cable, the MH1 needs a TRRS adapter to work with modern smartphones.


----------



## SyCo87

My mistake, I meant the IM50. Is there a good upgrade from that?


----------



## ajs6269

Has anyone done a comparison between the RE 400 and the OM Audio inearpeace??


----------



## james444

agentj said:


> I've had a look at the Accudio app, and it does look pretty good. Does anyone know of anything like that from Windows or Android?


 
  
V4A supports both Windows and Android and comes with a long list of phone presets.
  
 In case you're interested, here's a writeup on my own quite unexpected experience with V4A and one particular IEM, the Somic MH412.


----------



## AgentJ

Alright, so I'll proably get round to trying out the MH1C soon then. 
  
 For the meantime, would you recommend trying some other tips for the FXD80? Using Viper4Android and its EQ, I've actually found that using the EQ didn't make a mess of everything, and it's not actually too bad now 
  
 One more question - are the MH1C a warm set, or just warmer than the JVCs?


----------



## ljokerl

syco87 said:


> My mistake, I meant the IM50. Is there a good upgrade from that?


 
  
 Maybe someone who owns one can chime in here. I don't have one. 
  


agentj said:


> Alright, so I'll proably get round to trying out the MH1C soon then.
> 
> For the meantime, would you recommend trying some other tips for the FXD80? Using Viper4Android and its EQ, I've actually found that using the EQ didn't make a mess of everything, and it's not actually too bad now
> 
> One more question - are the MH1C a warm set, or just warmer than the JVCs?


 
  
 MH1Cs are a warm-sounding earphone.


----------



## suman134

syco87 said:


> My mistake, I meant the IM50. Is there a good upgrade from that?


 
  
  i think a ma-750 or brainwavz s5 will be a good upgrade . both have commanding bass like im50 , similar mids too .


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Xiaomi Piston 2. Also posted a review of the HiFiMan HE-560* *headphones here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-review/hifiman-560-review-new-benchmark/ 
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3B42) Xiaomi Piston 2*
> 
> 
> Added August 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## AgentJ

Sorry Joker, but my last question might have gotten buried under the surrounding words about EQing. 

Would you recommend any tips to try with the FRD80 to try to improve it somewhat?

Edit: having read the Xiaomi review, I'm not sure if that's a better option? Man, this is getting really difficult now


----------



## deco cat

Can't wait for the VSD3S review..


----------



## NewForce

ljokerl, Xiaomi Piston2 can be use for iPod, iPhone & iPad iOS devices too.
  
 The side with single button not only can be use to accept/end call. It can be also use to control app play, pause with 1-short click, next track with 2-short click, 1 track before with 3-short click. Long press the button can activate Siri. Me and my customers has tried and it really work all the 3 Apple iOS devices.
  
Xiaomi also claimed Piston2 SQ was better than Apple EarPods as it FR was tuned and comparable to Sennheiser CX300 and AKG K374.


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> Sorry Joker, but my last question might have gotten buried under the surrounding words about EQing.
> 
> Would you recommend any tips to try with the FRD80 to try to improve it somewhat?
> 
> Edit: having read the Xiaomi review, I'm not sure if that's a better option? Man, this is getting really difficult now


 
  
 I didn't get a major improvement with different tips on the JVC but I didn't try every tip out there. This would be a good question to ask in the FXD60/70/80 discussion thread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  


newforce said:


> ljokerl, Xiaomi Piston2 can be use for iPod, iPhone & iPad iOS devices too.
> 
> The side with single button not only can be use to accept/end call. It can be also use to control app play, pause with 1-short click, next track with 2-short click, 1 track before with 3-short click. Long press the button can activate Siri. Me and my customers has tried and it really work all the 3 Apple iOS devices.
> 
> Xiaomi also claimed Piston2 SQ was better than Apple EarPods as it FR was tuned and comparable to Sennheiser CX300 and AKG K374.


 
  
 Yes, one button works my iPod touch, same as a basic 1-button remote. Forgot to clarify in the review - thanks.


----------



## SyCo87

suman134 said:


> i think a ma-750 or brainwavz s5 will be a good upgrade . both have commanding bass like im50 , similar mids too .


Thanks man, will research both.


----------



## Ap616

agentj said:


> Sorry Joker, but my last question might have gotten buried under the surrounding words about EQing.
> 
> Would you recommend any tips to try with the FRD80 to try to improve it somewhat?
> 
> Edit: having read the Xiaomi review, I'm not sure if that's a better option? Man, this is getting really difficult now


 
 Auvio tips from Radioshack are the best for these(M or L) I hate the stock tips. Or TTPOD narrow bore white ones.


----------



## suman134

joker , can the inear stage driver 2 be easily driven by cowon j3 with out an amp ?


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> joker , can the inear stage driver 2 be easily driven by cowon j3 with out an amp ?


 
  
 Yes, it can. The J3 pairs well with warmer IEMs like the StageDiver, too.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> Yes, it can. The J3 pairs well with warmer IEMs like the StageDiver, too.


 
 Hi joker, sorry to bother....
  
 If i wanted to get a upgrade to the philips she3580 while maintaining the same type of sound what would you recomend me?
 I also like the sound of the hd25's and over ear momentums....
  
 Something not very expensive....
  
 I have been looking at these: xiaomi piston 2, v sonic vsd1 and vsd1s, vsd 3s, havi b3 pro 1 and the rha ma750i.....
  
Any of these resembles the sound of the philips but better?  Any other suggestions? Something good but not exceeding the 100 dollar mark.... actually the cheaper the better.... more iem's... XD
  
 I lsiten mostly to pop, rock, indie and a bit of edm...
  
Cheers....


----------



## ZapX629

Havis are excellent but need an amp, which would cost you more and wouldn't do the best with EDM since the bass isn't big. The RHA are more than 100, I believe. I would definitely get the VSD3S over the VSD1 as it's improved in most areas. The VSD3S has a similar sound signature, but the mids aren't as recessed and it has infinitely better sonic presentation than the Philips. If you love the Philips you'd love the 3S.
  
 (I feel bad every time I answer something in this thread because I don't want to hijack Joker's show, but I know he hasn't heard all of these yet; so my apologies to Joker if it bothers him).


pedro oliveira said:


> Hi joker, sorry to bother....
> 
> If i wanted to get a upgrade to the philips she3580 while maintaining the same type of sound what would you recomend me?
> I also like the sound of the hd25's and over ear momentums....
> ...


----------



## typhoon838

I'm surprised the Panasonic RPHJE120k isn't on here. They're insanely popular.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

Glad to know the highs are not too rolled off on the vsd3s and that nothing sounds muffled or too colored.... the mids are not to recessed as well? That only leaves the bass to discuss.... how boomier is the vsd3? Wich do you think is the best all rounder?
  
 Curious thing.... a couple of weeks ago i was moaning on a portuguese forum about loving the mometums but having to let them go due to the fit.... someone suggested me the weston 4r as the iem with the closest sound signature to the momentums (over ear)..... Dont know if you tried both the momentums and the westone's, but if you did.... do you agree with the statement? If yes, wich do you think is closer to the westone 4r and therefore the momentums type of sound, the 3 or the 3s?
  
 Cheers


----------



## ZapX629

I've only briefly listened to the Momentum at a hearable stand, and not nearly long enough to form an opinion. I haven't heard the 4r, but this is a video comparison: 
  

  
 Once Joker hears and tests out the VSD3 and 3S he can tell you more about it, but again, you're comparing a 4 BA IEM to a single dynamic driver that costs a great deal less. Don't expect it to kill the 4r, but the signature is supposed to be a pretty good reference.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

zapx629 said:


> I've only briefly listened to the Momentum at a hearable stand, and not nearly long enough to form an opinion. I haven't heard the 4r, but this is a video comparison:
> 
> 
> 
> Once Joker hears and tests out the VSD3 and 3S he can tell you more about it, but again, you're comparing a 4 BA IEM to a single dynamic driver that costs a great deal less. Don't expect it to kill the 4r, but the signature is supposed to be a pretty good reference.




 Of course not.... (regarding a cheap iem beating the westone....) XD
  
 But yes it seems that v sonic kind of nailed it wich seems promising... 
  
 What do you recomend as the better all rounder (if possible with the descriptions of what i am looking for in mind)? Wich to you are the pros and cons on the 3 and 3s? Is it true that they have different levels of sensitivity?


----------



## ZapX629

I haven't heard both, so I only know what others have said about the 3. The 3 seems to have less forward mids, more bass and hotter treble, and overall more aggressive sound (maybe due to less sensitivity). The 3S is a bit more balanced, with deeper, less boomy bass, slightly laid back mids, and a bit more forward upper mids and treble, overall more laid back. Again though, they aren't that different. You won't know the difference without comparing both side by side.


----------



## ljokerl

pedro oliveira said:


> Hi joker, sorry to bother....
> 
> If i wanted to get a upgrade to the philips she3580 while maintaining the same type of sound what would you recomend me?
> I also like the sound of the hd25's and over ear momentums....
> ...


 
  
 The Piston2 is a little more mid-bassy but otherwise a good option. The VSD1/S are pretty different - less bass (esp deep bass) and brighter. I really like the 1S, though. Good choice if you don't mind moving away from the 3580 sound sig a bit (a W4R signature is also not very similar to the Philips, but closer to the Momentum). 
  
 The RHA is not as bright as VSonics but has more lower treble presence than the Philips. Bass is better (more deep bass, less mid-bass) compared to the pistons but not sure I can recommend it given your preference for higher value/less cost. 
  
  


typhoon838 said:


> I'm surprised the Panasonic RPHJE120k isn't on here. They're insanely popular.


 
  
 I have two and they are both trash. One has overly boomy bass and the other is imbalanced by a large amount. Very bad QC/consistency from a sound standpoint.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> The Piston2 is a little more mid-bassy but otherwise a good option. The VSD1/S are pretty different - less bass (esp deep bass) and brighter. I really like the 1S, though. Good choice if you don't mind moving away from the 3580 sound sig a bit (a W4R signature is also not very similar to the Philips, but closer to the Momentum).
> 
> The RHA is not as bright as VSonics but has more lower treble presence than the Philips. Bass is better (more deep bass, less mid-bass) compared to the pistons but not sure I can recommend it given your preference for higher value/less cost.


 
 As i hd25, amperior, momentum over ear and philips she3580 (XD) love you think the vsonic vsd3s's will not suit my tastes?
 They are supposidely tuned with the westone 4r sound sig in mind.... i prefer not to adventure myseld with the 1S.... i am sure it sounds great but as and edm and rock listener i am not sure if the lack of bass like the one on the she3580, momentum or hd25 would suit me... i am not a basshead as you can see but from my headphones preferences you know i like a nice amount of deep, tight bass... 
  
 The havi b3 pro1 would be an option for me? From what i read they seem to be a bit leaner sounding.... dont know if i am wrong...


----------



## ljokerl

pedro oliveira said:


> As i hd25, amperior, momentum over ear and philips she3580 (XD) love you think the vsonic vsd3s's will not suit my tastes?
> They are supposidely tuned with the westone 4r sound sig in mind.... i prefer not to adventure myseld with the 1S.... i am sure it sounds great but as and edm and rock listener i am not sure if the lack of bass like the one on the she3580, momentum or hd25 would suit me... i am not a basshead as you can see but from my headphones preferences you know i like a nice amount of deep, tight bass...
> 
> The havi b3 pro1 would be an option for me? From what i read they seem to be a bit leaner sounding.... dont know if i am wrong...


 
  
 I don't have any experience with the VSD3S or Havi B3 so I really can't say. The Westone 4R does not have more bass than the VSD1S and not as much as your three current headphones.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> I don't have any experience with the VSD3S or Havi B3 so I really can't say. The Westone 4R does not have more bass than the VSD1S and not as much as your three current headphones.




Really? But i read the vsd3s had a tiny bit more bass than the philips she3580, so being based on the 4r i assumed the 1r had at least the same or more bass quantity and impact as the philips.... Maybe i understood wrong... But if this was true that would be good because the bass quantity, impact and tightness on the philips satisfys me for everything, even edm.....

By the way joker.... How does the xiaomii piston 2 compare with the she3580? Its a improvement or a sidegrade? Are they very different in terms of sound sig?


----------



## suman134

and guys at snapdeal you can grab an ah-d340 for a rupee under 3400 Rs . sorry !! wrong thread !!


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

suman134 said:


> and guys at snapdeal you can grab an ah-d340 for a rupee under 3400 Rs .


 
 Snapdeal is indian right suman? Do they ship to europe?


----------



## FrozenBlade

Hi
I would like to buy iem. I've been thinking about vsonic vsd1/s but I prefer iem that are not over ear. Do you guys have any suggestions for iem?
Would you recommend buying the piston v2.1?

Many thanks


----------



## suman134

pedro oliveira said:


> Snapdeal is indian right suman? Do they ship to europe?


 

  Yeahh , might not ship out side india . try mailing them .


----------



## esteebin

frozenblade said:


> Hi
> I would like to buy iem. I've been thinking about* vsonic vsd1/s but I prefer iem that are not over ear*. Do you guys have any suggestions for iem?
> Would you recommend buying the piston v2.1?
> 
> Many thanks


 
 VSD1's are originally intended for straight down wear, with option to wear around ear but L/R channels are swapped.Were you referring to VSD3's? Those are originally intended for around ear.


----------



## suman134

frozenblade said:


> Hi
> I would like to buy iem. I've been thinking about vsonic vsd1/s but I prefer iem that are not over ear. Do you guys have any suggestions for iem?
> Would you recommend buying the piston v2.1?
> 
> Many thanks


 

 you can wear them cable down too , easily , no need to swap channels .


----------



## Shawn71

frozenblade said:


> Hi
> I would like to buy iem. I've been thinking about vsonic vsd1/s but I prefer iem that are not over ear. Do you guys have any suggestions qfor iem?
> Would you recommend buying the piston v2.1?
> 
> Many thanks




Any specific reason for not choosing over the ear? Coz vsd3/S is an wonderful IEM for its price and sound and you can get used to it easily if you feel over the ear is un-comfortable....


----------



## ljokerl

pedro oliveira said:


> By the way joker.... How does the xiaomii piston 2 compare with the she3580? Its a improvement or a sidegrade? Are they very different in terms of sound sig?


 
  
 This was asked a day ago. I replied to this on the previous page.
  


frozenblade said:


> Hi
> I would like to buy iem. I've been thinking about vsonic vsd1/s but I prefer iem that are not over ear. Do you guys have any suggestions for iem?
> Would you recommend buying the piston v2.1?
> 
> Many thanks


 
  
 The VSD1/S is not over the ear... I prefer it to the Piston but they have different signatures. Piston is significantly warmer and bassier.


----------



## SyCo87

How is the RHA-750 compared to the JVC FXT90 and the Yamaha EPH-100 in mids? I know they are similar in sound as far as the bass being the focal point but, I want something full-bodied with good mids that don't get lost in the background.
  
 Leaning towards the RHA-750 because of the build quality, remote, and excellent customer support.


----------



## FrozenBlade

Thanks for your help
I prefer to wear iem the "normal" way
Unless the quality indeed justify paying the extra money and possible comfort issues
The price of vsd1/s is double of the priston price on ebay and vsd3/s costs some bucks more.
Does the priston and vsd1/s are equal in quality and the difference is only depends on taste?


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

Sorry joker.... So what iems would you recomend to someone who likes the hd25s and the momentum over ear?


----------



## sid12345678910

How would you compare the DUNU 1000/ 2000 to the Future Sonic Atrios MG7?

looking for an upgrade from the atrios, ,mainly a more flatter/neutral sound with a strong sub bass presence

same with the Philips Fidelio s1/s2?


----------



## ljokerl

syco87 said:


> How is the RHA-750 compared to the JVC FXT90 and the Yamaha EPH-100 in mids? I know they are similar in sound as far as the bass being the focal point but, I want something full-bodied with good mids that don't get lost in the background.
> 
> Leaning towards the RHA-750 because of the build quality, remote, and excellent customer support.


 
  
 I would skip the MA750 if you're concerned primarily about mids - the FXT90 and EPH-100 both have more prominent and capable midranges. The MA750 has the least midrange prominence and the most veiling of the three.
  


frozenblade said:


> Thanks for your help
> I prefer to wear iem the "normal" way
> Unless the quality indeed justify paying the extra money and possible comfort issues
> The price of vsd1/s is double of the priston price on ebay and vsd3/s costs some bucks more.
> Does the priston and vsd1/s are equal in quality and the difference is only depends on taste?


 
  
 The Piston and VSD1 have different sound signatures, yes. Performance-wise they're not too different so if you don't much care about tuning specifics and want to save a few bucks, the Pistons will work for you. 
  


pedro oliveira said:


> Sorry joker.... So what iems would you recomend to someone who likes the hd25s and the momentum over ear?


 
  
 The HD25s and Momentums don't exactly have the same sound signature so it's hard to say, but the Pistons should certainly be fine for what they cost. 
  


sid12345678910 said:


> How would you compare the DUNU 1000/ 2000 to the Future Sonic Atrios MG7?
> 
> looking for an upgrade from the atrios, ,mainly a more flatter/neutral sound with a strong sub bass presence
> 
> same with the Philips Fidelio s1/s2?


 
  
 They are both brighter than the Atrios by a good margin. Bass is not as dominant, but still punchy. Clarity is better.
  
 If you want a reference earphone with strong subbass the DN-1000 is the one I would get... the DN-2000 has less low end. Ditto on the S1/S2 - they are neutral, but far from heavy on bass/sub-bass.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> The HD25s and Momentums don't exactly have the same sound signature so it's hard to say, but the Pistons should certainly be fine for what they cost.


 
 ok..... then wich iem's would you recomend for hd25 lovers and wich for momentum lovers? 
  
 Cheers and sorry fot the nagging..... i love both these two headphones as you can tell...


----------



## murano

ajs6269 said:


> Has anyone done a comparison between the RE 400 and the OM Audio inearpeace??


 
  
 fwiw - The INEARPEACE tips seem to work pretty well with the RE-400.  I was having a difficult time finding tips for the RE-400 that were comfortable and produced a sound I was happy with.
  
 I'm still in the process of burning in my INEARPEACE.


----------



## ljokerl

pedro oliveira said:


> ok..... then wich iem's would you recomend for hd25 lovers and wich for momentum lovers?
> 
> Cheers and sorry fot the nagging..... i love both these two headphones as you can tell...


 

 In the sub-$150 bracket I would go GR07 Bass Edition for HD25 and EPH-100 for Momentum


----------



## suman134

murano said:


> fwiw - The INEARPEACE tips seem to work pretty well with the RE-400.  I was having a difficult time finding tips for the RE-400 that were comfortable and produced a sound I was happy with.
> 
> I'm still in the process of burning in my INEARPEACE.


 

  would like to have an impression .


----------



## DaDolce

Hi joker. Could you please help me to choose a good pair of iem? I listen most of the times to techno, Goa and electronic world music. So electronic mainly.
  
https://soundcloud.com/alter-ego-amsterdam/satori-in-between-worlds-alter for example.
  
 I already have some nice iems like mh1 and Fischer Audio Consonance. I don't listen to mh1 much though because of the horrible fit. It plops out of my ear all the time (well the fit is actually ok, but that cable makes it horrible to wear when I am moving).
  
 How is the MA750 for electronic music? or maybe the custom Arts music One? Music one is pretty expensive in comparison to the ma750 and i dont know if it's worth the price difference. If you have another idea that would be very welcome. Price range around 130 dollars. By the way...I like a bit more Bassy iems probably with a good kick.
  
 And could you maybe review some more Xears maybe? the XPA2Pro and the XWH700Pro seem like a steal with the KLANGFUZZIS promo. (from 150 euro's to 35 euro's).


----------



## suman134

dadolce said:


> Hi joker. Could you please help me to choose a good pair of iem? I listen most of the times to techno, Goa and electronic world music. So electronic mainly.
> 
> https://soundcloud.com/alter-ego-amsterdam/satori-in-between-worlds-alter for example.
> 
> ...


 
  
  wow !! im out of my credit limit or i would have got one of these , its as cheap as it can get .


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> In the sub-$150 bracket I would go GR07 Bass Edition for HD25 and EPH-100 for Momentum




Thank you very much J. 
Rha ma750 is on the same level as those 2? 

Cant wait for your review of the vsd3 and vsd3s... They seem great for 30 euros...


----------



## ljokerl

dadolce said:


> Hi joker. Could you please help me to choose a good pair of iem? I listen most of the times to techno, Goa and electronic world music. So electronic mainly.
> 
> https://soundcloud.com/alter-ego-amsterdam/satori-in-between-worlds-alter for example.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I wouldn't recommend the Music One if you like bassy earphones. If you can find it in your price range, the Yamaha EPH-100 would be my pick for Electronic music. Otherwise the MA750 is quite good. If you want to spend under $100, I'd recommend the Audio-Technica CKM500, Shure SE215 (for a smoother, more MH1-like sound), and even the Brainwavz S1. 
  
 Unfortunately I haven't tried the latest crop of Xears in-ears.
  


pedro oliveira said:


> Thank you very much J.
> Rha ma750 is on the same level as those 2?
> 
> Cant wait for your review of the vsd3 and vsd3s... They seem great for 30 euros...


 
  
 I prefer the GR07BE and EPH-100 to the MA750 but they're not far apart.


----------



## suman134

joker , can you compare me the dn-1000 with xba h3 ? all i want to know is which one has better clarity and details ?


----------



## DaDolce

Thnx Joker...Just ordered the EPH-100 for 99 dollars on Amazon. Seems like a good price ^^.
  
 I am very interested in the Xears too...Someone was claiming that the XWH700Pro was actually better then the Ortofon q5...so I will probably order those too...If u like I can lend them to you if you want to review them...maybe some others would be interested to read that too ^^


----------



## Pastapipo

The KLANGFUZZIS promo has been around for years.
 Although the service from the owner is top-notch, I would not get the Xears XPA2pro or XWH700PRO ever again. 
 I had both; excellent bass, superb 3D imaging, but the highs were oh so sibilant. I couldn't listen to them.
 see: http://www.head-fi.org/t/545450/xears-appreciation-thread-formerly-td-iii/945#post_9880328
  
 It's really sad, because I was in love with the Xears Xe200pro for 2 years. Great sound quality for the price, the soundstage and positioning of the Xears is their biggest strength though.
 I find the TTPOD T1E an upgrade to the Xe200pro since they've got the same L-shaped (high on bass, flat on other frequencies) sound signature, only the TTPOD is a lot clearer.
  
 No head-fier has tried their "Neu" versions, or their "4core hybrid", order those if you want to buy Xears and prove the community a great service by sharing your impressions


----------



## DaDolce

pastapipo said:


> The KLANGFUZZIS promo has been around for years.
> Although the service from the owner is top-notch, I would not get the Xears XPA2pro or XWH700PRO ever again.
> I had both; excellent bass, superb 3D imaging, but the highs were oh so sibilant. I couldn't listen to them.
> see: http://www.head-fi.org/t/545450/xears-appreciation-thread-formerly-td-iii/945#post_9880328
> ...


 
  
 I had read that thread already actually. I thought that was the thread someone said they were better then the q5 ^^. Hmmm your review told me you actually liked them for electronic music. Did it change after a while?


----------



## Pastapipo

dadolce said:


> I had read that thread already actually. I thought that was the thread someone said they were better then the q5 ^^. Hmmm your review told me you actually liked them for electronic music. Did it change after a while?


 
  
 Yes, when lowering the 4k frequency band, they were "acceptable". I liked them for tech house due to their bass and presentation, but the cymbals kept annoying me too much. Wouldn't recommend them.
  
 I wouldn't dare to go against Jokers advice since he has far, far more skill & experience than me, but personally I would pick the TTPOD T1E instead of the Audio-Technica CKM500 for electronic music. I found the CKM500 rather bright and the bass didn't dig deep enough for me (disclaimer: stocktips, short listen). I haven't heard the other IEMS he advices. Again, just my humble opinion.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> joker , can you compare me the dn-1000 with xba h3 ? all i want to know is which one has better clarity and details ?


 
  
 DN-1000 is brighter, clearer, more crisp, and more v-shaped overall. XBA-H3 is warmer, smoother, and thicker-sounding, It's more forgiving but still has very decent treble energy, just not as much as the Dunu, and sounds a hair more muffled overall. 
  


pastapipo said:


> I wouldn't dare to go against Jokers advice since he has far, far more skill & experience than me, but personally I would pick the TTPOD T1E instead of the Audio-Technica CKM500 for electronic music. I found the CKM500 rather bright and the bass didn't dig deep enough for me (disclaimer: stocktips, short listen). I haven't heard the other IEMS he advices. Again, just my humble opinion.


 
  
 I haven't heard the TTPOD. The CKM500 does roll off a little at the bottom end compared to something like the EPH-100 or RHA MA750.


----------



## DaDolce

I am a bit worried about the eph-100s I just ordered. On Amazon i'm reading lots of people have problems with the quality. It seems that the left ear stops working correctly after a while. Not one person, but several write the same thing. Some even have sent it back 4 times :S. Does this sound familiar here?


----------



## Pensel

I noticed that the Xiaomi Pistons where added into the list. You mentioned that we can get it from bigbargainonline at ebay? (via the link you gave): http://www.ebay.com/itm/380861393335
  
 He's a real legit seller? You got your Piston from this seller?
  
 Hope for a prompt reply so that I can make my order


----------



## kova4a

pensel said:


> I noticed that the Xiaomi Pistons where added into the list. You mentioned that we can get it from bigbargainonline at ebay? (via the link you gave): http://www.ebay.com/itm/380861393335
> 
> He's a real legit seller? You got your Piston from this seller?
> 
> Hope for a prompt reply so that I can make my order


 
 Yeah, legit seller - also http://penonaudio.com/Xiaomi-Piston-2.0-Earphones , which is the site of this exact ebay seller


----------



## Pensel

kova4a said:


> Yeah, legit seller - also http://penonaudio.com/Xiaomi-Piston-2.0-Earphones , which is the site of this exact ebay seller


 

 Thanks but I'm just curious, how do you know they're the same seller?
  
 If so, do you think I should get it from his ebay store or the website? Sorry for the trivial question, quite new in this


----------



## kova4a

pensel said:


> Thanks but I'm just curious, how do you know they're the same seller?
> 
> If so, do you think I should get it from his ebay store or the website? Sorry for the trivial question, quite new in this


 
 It's the same seller - it's a well-known fact. As far as where to buy it from, it's your choice. I've ordered from both places - the penonaudio prices have the shipping included, so you'll save like 99 cents if you order it straight from the site.


----------



## peter123

pensel said:


> Thanks but I'm just curious, how do you know they're the same seller?
> 
> 
> 
> If so, do you think I should get it from his ebay store or the website? Sorry for the trivial question, quite new in this




It's the same seller. They're very trusted around here and a lot of people (me included) use them regularly.

The seller makes more money if you buy from their own store (no eBay fees) so I tend to do that.

Edit; I must have forgotten to refresh the page. Well as you can see I support kova4a's answer.


----------



## chillaxing

hey joker, or to anyone else, need help again.  is there a iem that is has the same characteristics as the dn1000.  i love all the things about the dn1000 except the questionable cable quality thats been popping up for some people.  i treat my iems' pretty roughly thats why i dont think i can ever spend more that 200$ on a pair.  i tried the gr07be and ma750.  the gr07, even though has great clarity and detail, doesn't have enough bass and is to sibilance at times.  the ma750 has great bass but a little to dark for my taste.


----------



## Pensel

kova4a said:


> It's the same seller - it's a well-known fact. As far as where to buy it from, it's your choice. I've ordered from both places - the penonaudio prices have the shipping included, so you'll save like 99 cents if you order it straight from the site.


 
  


peter123 said:


> It's the same seller. They're very trusted around here and a lot of people (me included) use them regularly.
> 
> The seller makes more money if you buy from their own store (no eBay fees) so I tend to do that.
> 
> Edit; I must have forgotten to refresh the page. Well as you can see I support kova4a's answer.


 

 Thank you guys, I did more research and I noticed a lot of people are saying that the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore is much better than the Pistons. I might go for the Tenore instead.
  
 To the Topic Starter, any review on the Tenore? Thank you.


----------



## kova4a

pensel said:


> Thank you guys, I did more research and I noticed a lot of people are saying that the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore is much better than the Pistons. I might go for the Tenore instead.
> 
> To the Topic Starter, any review on the Tenore? Thank you.


 
 Well, I haven't heard the Tenore but personally I'm not a huge fan of the Tenore Pistons (sorry drinking too much again)and there is a whole bunch of iems I would pick any day of the week over it. And that's even not counting the bulky Piston's housing that isn't particularly comfortable and the short cable.


----------



## peter123

pensel said:


> Thank you guys, I did more research and I noticed a lot of people are saying that the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore is much better than the Pistons. I might go for the Tenore instead.
> 
> To the Topic Starter, any review on the Tenore? Thank you.




I'd agree that the Tenores are much better than the Pistons but all the QC issues makes it very hard to recommend them. They're also about double the price. You could check out the TTpod T1E as well. Similar sound signature as the Piston's but much more refined and the bass is better controlled.


----------



## ZapX629

Yeah there are a lot of good headphones in the Tenore price bracket. The T1E, VSD3, and KC06A are all things you'd want to check out if you want something with a bassier signature like the Pistons.


----------



## Pensel

peter123 said:


> I'd agree that the Tenores are much better than the Pistons but all the QC issues makes it very hard to recommend them. They're also about double the price. You could check out the TTpod T1E as well. Similar sound signature as the Piston's but much more refined and the bass is better controlled.


 
 Thanks!! Some Amazon reviews did point out some QC issues, I was quite disappointed to see them but I had to cancel my order 
  
 The T1E seems pretty good? One review wrote:
  
 "These TI-E are a great set of dual drivers....Imaging is sweet, build is quality, the price...too cheap...seriously, these should retail for around $150-$200. Once these get more exposure in the U.S., they will cost more...
 I have played all genres, various recording quality levels, and the dual dynamic drivers reproduce with authority. They are almost flat, in response, but the bass enhancement gives just enough bass that dub-step listeners would still buy these."
  
 http://www.amazon.com/TTPOD-Definition-Dynamic-Professional-Earphone/dp/B00L510RC4/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1409346500&sr=1-1&keywords=TTpod+T1E


zapx629 said:


> Yeah there are a lot of good headphones in the Tenore price bracket. The T1E, VSD3, and KC06A are all things you'd want to check out if you want something with a bassier signature like the Pistons.


 
 I currently have the Beyerdynamic XP2 earphones and I think it's alright but I found that it's lacking clarity like hell when compared to my friend's Sennheiser CX300 II by a lot!!

 So, I'd appreciate something that has good clarity and good midrange. I'm not exactly that picky haha but good details would be nice


----------



## ZapX629

pensel said:


> Thanks!! Some Amazon reviews did point out some QC issues, I was quite disappointed to see them but I had to cancel my order
> 
> The T1E seems pretty good? One review wrote:
> 
> ...


 
 T1E is a good call if you need a lot of bass. I haven't heard it personally yet so I can't say how clear it is. If you want more clarity with a bit less bass, I'd recommend the VSD3S. If you don't need a lot of bass and prefer clarity and mids overall, maybe the Ostry KC06. 
  
 What kind of music do you listen to mostly?


----------



## peter123

zapx629 said:


> T1E is a good call if you need a lot of bass. I haven't heard it personally yet so I can't say how clear it is.* If you want more clarity with a bit less bass, I'd recommend the VSD3S.*If you don't need a lot of bass and prefer clarity and mids overall, maybe the Ostry KC06.
> 
> What kind of music do you listen to mostly?




I totally agree on the bold part. I actually prefer the VSD3S over the T1E personally but the bass on the T1E is more similar to the Tenores. I don't really care much for the KC06.


----------



## ljokerl

chillaxing said:


> hey joker, or to anyone else, need help again.  is there a iem that is has the same characteristics as the dn1000.  i love all the things about the dn1000 except the questionable cable quality thats been popping up for some people.  i treat my iems' pretty roughly thats why i dont think i can ever spend more that 200$ on a pair.  i tried the gr07be and ma750.  the gr07, even though has great clarity and detail, doesn't have enough bass and is to sibilance at times.  the ma750 has great bass but a little to dark for my taste.


 
  
 Tough ask - the DN-1000 is a good value at $200 and it's not a very common tuning. You will probably like the sound sig of the JVC FXT90 more than the MA750 and GR07 but it's not going to reach DN-1000 performance. Other sets that are going to be more durable and keep up in sound quality are going to cost a fair bit more - ones that come to mind are the Fidue A83 (although it has a little less bass than the DN-1000), Westone 30, and 1964EARS V3. These have detachable cables, good build quality, clarity, and bass, but are also quite high up there in cost and still not a 100% match for the DN-1000 sound signature.


----------



## Pensel

Joker, I noticed you didn't include the Ostry KC06, Havi B3 Pro1 or the T1-E?

would love to know what you think about the KC06


----------



## ljokerl

pensel said:


> Joker, I noticed you didn't include the Ostry KC06, Havi B3 Pro1 or the T1-E?
> 
> would love to know what you think about the KC06


 
  
 I don't have any plans for the T1-E but I should have impressions of the KC06 and Havi B3 Pro1 soon.


----------



## Pensel

ljokerl said:


> I don't have any plans for the T1-E but I should have impressions of the KC06 and Havi B3 Pro1 soon.


 
 You have both earphones with you now and tested it already? =)
  
 Any initial impressions yet?  My finger is kinda itchy to pull the trigger on the KC06 already hahaha.
  
 Also considering Final Design Audio Heaven II (88 dollars) or JVC FXT90 (73 dollars)


----------



## chillaxing

ljokerl said:


> Tough ask - the DN-1000 is a good value at $200 and it's not a very common tuning. You will probably like the sound sig of the JVC FXT90 more than the MA750 and GR07 but it's not going to reach DN-1000 performance. Other sets that are going to be more durable and keep up in sound quality are going to cost a fair bit more - ones that come to mind are the Fidue A83 (although it has a little less bass than the DN-1000), Westone 30, and 1964EARS V3. These have detachable cables, good build quality, clarity, and bass, but are also quite high up there in cost and still not a 100% match for the DN-1000 sound signature.


 
 Funny that you suggested the fxt90.  After reading through your reviews and other's threads i'm really considering these.  
  
 yeah, for what dunu did with the dn1000 is a pretty incredible feat. Not great at one thing but good at everything.  A jack of all trades as you can say.  Not a lot can come close to what you get for the price.  well i guess until they fix the issue or the w30 comes down in price.  i'm gonna have to settle for something that sounds ok, to my ears at least.
  
 Its probably been said many times but i'll say it again.  I commend you for you do here and your own place.  If i ever meet you in the streets of LA.  I will buy you a cold one or whatever floats your boat.


----------



## ljokerl

pensel said:


> You have both earphones with you now and tested it already? =)
> 
> Any initial impressions yet?  My finger is kinda itchy to pull the trigger on the KC06 already hahaha.
> 
> Also considering Final Design Audio Heaven II (88 dollars) or JVC FXT90 (73 dollars)


 
  
 I've had the KC06 for a week or two but have been busy with other things, like the GR07 Classic. I like the midrange of the KC06 - there's a bump there that reminds me of the Fidue A63. It's not as warm as the Fidue and brighter/less smooth at the top, but the general mid-forwardness is there. Midrange presence is great and vocals are very clear and extremely intelligible. There's also plenty of sparkle. So far I'm not impressed with the bass, which is decent but lacks depth and doesn't sound very solid, or the soundstage depth, not that this is uncommon for budget earphones. 
  
 The Heaven II is flatter and more accurate than these and the FXT90 is significantly warmer and bassier. 
  


chillaxing said:


> Funny that you suggested the fxt90.  After reading through your reviews and other's threads i'm really considering these.
> 
> yeah, for what dunu did with the dn1000 is a pretty incredible feat. Not great at one thing but good at everything.  A jack of all trades as you can say.  Not a lot can come close to what you get for the price.  well i guess until they fix the issue or the w30 comes down in price.  i'm gonna have to settle for something that sounds ok, to my ears at least.
> 
> Its probably been said many times but i'll say it again.  I commend you for you do here and your own place.  If i ever meet you in the streets of LA.  I will buy you a cold one or whatever floats your boat.


----------



## ZapX629

I just got a GR07 Classic after finding the BE a tad too warm for me and I've been loving it. Thanks for the comparisons and good job on the warnings. I'm not sure if it's just sellers trying to get the most they can or if they're just going by the sticker on the box (the earlier run of Classics were mislabled as MKII on the box and warranty card) but people need to be aware of the proper value of these. Thanks again for all your efforts and I look forward to hearing your impressions of the newer crop of budget-fi products that came out in the past months.


----------



## Pensel

ljokerl said:


> I've had the KC06 for a week or two but have been busy with other things, like the GR07 Classic. I like the midrange of the KC06 - there's a bump there that reminds me of the Fidue A63. It's not as warm as the Fidue and brighter/less smooth at the top, but the general mid-forwardness is there. Midrange presence is great and vocals are very clear and extremely intelligible. There's also plenty of sparkle. So far I'm not impressed with the bass, which is decent but lacks depth and doesn't sound very solid, or the soundstage depth, not that this is uncommon for budget earphones.
> 
> The Heaven II is flatter and more accurate than these and the FXT90 is significantly warmer and bassier.


 
 Thanks!
  
 Please do excuse me as I'm totally a newbie in the audiophile world so I might not use correct terminology.
  
 The KC06 is V shaped? You did mention FXT90 is V shaped too in your website.
  
 I actually dislike high levels of treble because it sometimes pierces my ears? I have a pair of speakers that has treble control on it and when I increase it, I totally hate it. I did have a Allessandro MS1i before and the high notes really pierced my ears lol. I think this should be called sibilance?

 So V shaped earphones are not for me?
  
 I would love to have an earphone with really good mid range (vocals) and sound that feels really rich and thick. If this is called warm, then do you have any good recommendations? I like really good clarity but don't like high trebles so would the FXT90 still fit into my requirements? It's reasonably priced too!

 Or do you think I should get the Heaven II instead? My friend told me that the mid range and vocals are amazing!
  
 Or just top up for the Yamaha EPH-100


----------



## Ap616

pensel said:


> Thanks!
> 
> Please do excuse me as I'm totally a newbie in the audiophile world so I might not use correct terminology.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Instead of KC06 or FXT90, the T-1E is good too with surely smoother highs than either of those which have more energy and noticeable peaks from my understanding...


----------



## suman134

pensel said:


> Or do you think I should get the Heaven II instead? My friend told me that the mid range and vocals are amazing!


 
  
   heaven II is low on bass , a bit forward mids and smoother highs then even re-400 , i think its a good choice if you can do without much bass .


----------



## ljokerl

zapx629 said:


> I just got a GR07 Classic after finding the BE a tad too warm for me and I've been loving it. Thanks for the comparisons and good job on the warnings. I'm not sure if it's just sellers trying to get the most they can or if they're just going by the sticker on the box (the earlier run of Classics were mislabled as MKII on the box and warranty card) but people need to be aware of the proper value of these. Thanks again for all your efforts and I look forward to hearing your impressions of the newer crop of budget-fi products that came out in the past months.


 
  
 Hard to say whether ignorance or malice are to blame, but with the mislabeled boxes it's just too easy for consumers to pay more than they need to. 
  
  


pensel said:


> Thanks!
> 
> Please do excuse me as I'm totally a newbie in the audiophile world so I might not use correct terminology.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The KC06 is not at all v-shaped, it might actually be the opposite. Mids are pretty forward, although the treble is not lacking in presence either. It's not harsh, but if you're treble-sensitive I would probably avoid it, and would definitely avoid the Heaven II, which is a little less smooth, and most v-shaped earphones (v shape by definition means that there is some treble emphasis). There are tons of earphones that don't have bright treble at all, like the Fidue A63 and Sony MH1C, and would be totally safe from a harshness/sibilance standpoint.


----------



## Pensel

ljokerl said:


> Hard to say whether ignorance or malice are to blame, but with the mislabeled boxes it's just too easy for consumers to pay more than they need to.
> 
> 
> 
> The KC06 is not at all v-shaped, it might actually be the opposite. Mids are pretty forward, although the treble is not lacking in presence either. It's not harsh, but if you're treble-sensitive I would probably avoid it, and would definitely avoid the Heaven II, which is a little less smooth, and most v-shaped earphones (v shape by definition means that there is some treble emphasis). There are tons of earphones that don't have bright treble at all, like the Fidue A63 and Sony MH1C, and would be totally safe from a harshness/sibilance standpoint.


 

 Bright treble as in ear piercing high notes? I don't like that lol
  
 Is there a better alternative than the Fidue A63 or Sony MH1C? How about the Yamaha EPH-100? Would it be great for me? 
  
 Or any advice on FXT90 vs EPH 100?


----------



## ljokerl

pensel said:


> Bright treble as in ear piercing high notes? I don't like that lol
> 
> Is there a better alternative than the Fidue A63 or Sony MH1C? How about the Yamaha EPH-100? Would it be great for me?
> 
> Or any advice on FXT90 vs EPH 100?


 
  
 Different price range and not as smooth as the MH1C, but overall the EPH-100 should work. It doesn't have the treble boost of the FXT90.


----------



## jant71

Something Mr. Joker will surely want to try out... http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/audio-visual/headphones/eph-m200/?mode=model


----------



## proedros

Hi joker,
  
 have you tried the Astrotek AX-60 ? Any thoughts/impressions ?

 Thanx


----------



## ljokerl

jant71 said:


> Something Mr. Joker will surely want to try out... http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/audio-visual/headphones/eph-m200/?mode=model


 
  
 Yep... I want that. Any word on price? 
  


proedros said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> have you tried the Astrotek AX-60 ? Any thoughts/impressions ?
> 
> Thanx


 
  
 Had too google what it is, so no, unfortunately.


----------



## Pensel

jant71 said:


> Something Mr. Joker will surely want to try out... http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/audio-visual/headphones/eph-m200/?mode=model







ljokerl said:


> Yep... I want that. Any word on price?
> 
> 
> Had too google what it is, so no, unfortunately.




Holy cow. I just made an order for the eph 100 and the m200 comes out?? Should I cancel my order??


----------



## jant71

Seems to be taking the EPH-100's original slot at $149. Out in Japan already for about that price. N.A. price not mentioned yet. Also, a cheaper $99 M100 version w/o the Titanium tube. Interesting they went in the other direction from a microdriver to a 15mm.




  
  
 (credit to e-earphone.jp) The M200 and M100 alongside each other...


----------



## ljokerl

jant71 said:


> Seems to be taking the EPH-100's original slot at $149. Out in Japan already for about that price. N.A. price not mentioned yet. Also, a cheaper $99 M100 version w/o the Titanium tube. Interesting they went in the other direction from a microdriver to a 15mm.


 
  
 Right, especially considering that the EPH-100 didn't exactly get bad reviews. Seems like it might be a case of a parallel development rather than a direct replacement.


----------



## jant71

Just speculation but might just turn out that is the price they feel good with and all their top earphone models will come in at $149 to start and drop later regardless of design approach. Though Yamaha have had this type of design more than anything else for their in-ear models. Not surprised to see an evolution of that design. The M100 and M200 resemble the S1 and S2 quite a bit as well. The numbering scheme, pricing, the plastic used in the lower being replaced with metal parts in the higher model. Interesting to see how close they sound to each other as well; both S1/S2 vs. the Yamaha models, M100 vs. M200, and M200 vs. EPH-100. Quite intriguing!


----------



## altrunox

ljokerl which one do you think that isolates better, Philips TX2 or SoundMagic E10?
 My friend is looking for some IEM with mic (not interested in Pistons) and I guess this two should be a nice option for the price.


----------



## suman134

jant71 said:


> Seems to be taking the EPH-100's original slot at $149. Out in Japan already for about that price. N.A. price not mentioned yet. Also, a cheaper $99 M100 version w/o the Titanium tube. Interesting they went in the other direction from a microdriver to a 15mm.


 
  
  looks nice !!


----------



## ljokerl

Fingers crossed for a chance to try the M100 at some point.
  


altrunox said:


> ljokerl which one do you think that isolates better, Philips TX2 or SoundMagic E10?
> My friend is looking for some IEM with mic (not interested in Pistons) and I guess this two should be a nice option for the price.


 
  
 Neither, really - isolation is below average on both. I guess if pressed I would pick the E10 but if I were looking for a budget headset with mic and decent isolation I'd go for a T-Peos D200R or Rich200 (the latter of which has a signature not very different from the TX2).


----------



## bananalumpia

Hi guys, can you help me decide between the klipsh x7i, etymotic HF5, and 215-K? Is the detachables really that worth it? I listen to Hip-Hop most of the time, and a bit of EDM. If you guys have any other suggestion then I'm open ears. I don't need something SUPER bass heavy, but I need it to be there. I need the iphone controls, and I need it to be durable.


----------



## ljokerl

bananalumpia said:


> Hi guys, can you help me decide between the klipsh x7i, etymotic HF5, and 215-K? Is the detachables really that worth it? I listen to Hip-Hop most of the time, and a bit of EDM. If you guys have any other suggestion then I'm open ears. I don't need something SUPER bass heavy, but I need it to be there. I need the iphone controls, and I need it to be durable.


 
  
 I really doubt you want an earphone as flat as the HF5 for hip-hop and EDM. Haven't tried the X7i but the SE215 is a good pick if you need powerful but not overbearing bass and good build quality. Keep in mind the 3-button iPhone cable will cost you extra.


----------



## ZapX629

RHA MA-750i is $30 more, but sounds like it would fit your needs pretty well. 


bananalumpia said:


> Hi guys, can you help me decide between the klipsh x7i, etymotic HF5, and 215-K? Is the detachables really that worth it? I listen to Hip-Hop most of the time, and a bit of EDM. If you guys have any other suggestion then I'm open ears. I don't need something SUPER bass heavy, but I need it to be there. I need the iphone controls, and I need it to be durable.


----------



## bananalumpia

ljokerl said:


> I really doubt you want an earphone as flat as the HF5 for hip-hop and EDM. Haven't tried the X7i but the SE215 is a good pick if you need powerful but not overbearing bass and good build quality. Keep in mind the 3-button iPhone cable will cost you extra.


 
 Do you think the the deatchable cables are worth picking? It seems like a pretty good choice.


----------



## ZapX629

I'd also add, as I've heard several people say, that by today's standards the SE215 is quite overpriced and not a great value for the money. Add to that the $50 cable and you could do a lot better for the price.


----------



## altrunox

ljokerl you need to take a look on them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77wdu225HYg&feature=youtu.be


----------



## Pensel

altrunox said:


> ljokerl you need to take a look on them :etysmile:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77wdu225HYg&feature=youtu.be



I was wondering, is he a good reviewer?


----------



## ljokerl

bananalumpia said:


> Do you think the the deatchable cables are worth picking? It seems like a pretty good choice.


 
  
 I like detachable cables in general, but keep in mind that the market for replacement cables hasn't fully developed yet so there's not a whole lot of options for reasonably-priced replacements (this may change a year or two down the line, though). If you get the SE215 and have to buy a $40 replacement cable every year it'll be a while before it becomes worth it compared to buying, say, a $60 fixed-cable earphone every year instead. 
  
 However, a lot of the great-sounding earphones don't have a mic/remote option (especially a 3-button one for iPhones) so you're not exactly swimming in alternatives. 
  


zapx629 said:


> I'd also add, as I've heard several people say, that by today's standards the SE215 is quite overpriced and not a great value for the money. Add to that the $50 cable and you could do a lot better for the price.


 
  
 I guess that depends on whether you value any of the features of the SE215 besides its sound. For example the Sony MH1C sounds at least as good as the SE215 with a similar sound signature for well under $50, but its cable is a pain and the remote only works fully on Xperia devices.
  


altrunox said:


> ljokerl you need to take a look on them
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Coming soon


----------



## suman134

pensel said:


> I was wondering, is he a good reviewer?


 

 its a mixed bag , everyone has their own preferences , just look into as much as reviews you can , and you will have a idea of its sound characteristics and other things , for a instance he likes his se215 , but i dont , they are superly over priced , i like crystals from hisound more , others are head-fi constants , you are bound to like gr07 , ex1000 /7550 , and re-400 .


----------



## bananalumpia

review the x7i too! I'd love to hear your opinion them, they look really awesome, and I heard klipsch as a decent company and brand


----------



## listen4joy

i hear very good things about AWEI ES900i. a solid contender for monoprice. best one for 8$. iljoker should check it


----------



## altrunox

ljokerl said:


> Coming soon


 
  
 Will be looking for it
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 If my VSD3S is something near 60% of an 4R I would just get the VSD5 after Vsonic release it and then save money for a entry level CIEM.
 I'm a noob in this hobby but I really like my VSD3S sound signature.


----------



## suman134

altrunox said:


> Will be looking for it
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  these do totally worth the price . value for money phones for sure .


----------



## 1clearhead

*Hey Joker*,
  
 Pioneer finally got it right and came out with an incredibly balanced IEM here in mainland China.
  
 The *Pioneer SE-CL31*
  
 I just bought them 2 weeks ago and they sound identical to the *Grado SR80*.
  
 I bought the light gold on black wire set.
  
 Here are some pix......hope it goes on your review list!


----------



## james444

1clearhead said:


> *Hey Joker*,
> 
> Pioneer finally got it right and came out with an incredibly balanced IEM here in mainland China.
> 
> ...


 
  
 How do they compare to the Ivery IS-1?


----------



## Wokei

james444 said:


> How do they compare to the Ivery IS-1? :evil:




+


----------



## 1clearhead

james444 said:


> How do they compare to the Ivery IS-1?


 
  
  


wokei said:


> +


 
  
 One thing is Pioneer has a great reputation with high-end audio equipment, but for some reason IEM's were never there strong point (I think), until now. I read in article here in China on how long it took them to get the SE-CL31 perfectly balanced. I personally think they succeeded. Through "taobao" they're constantly rating 5 stars ever since they were released several months. Compared to my IS-1's is a toss-up! I personally like them both, IS-1's for there life-like vocals and sub-bass and the SE-CL31's for there soundstage and crisp sound reproduction.
  
 .....On another note, I have my Sidy DGS100's on the way to see how much better my collection can get.


----------



## peter123

1clearhead said:


> One thing is Pioneer has a great reputation with high-end audio equipment, but for some reason IEM's were never there strong point (I think), until now. I read in article here in China on how long it took them to get the SE-CL31 perfectly balanced. I personally think they succeeded. Through "taobao" they're constantly rating 5 stars ever since they were released several months. Compared to my IS-1's is a toss-up! I personally like them both, IS-1's for there life-like vocals and sub-bass and the SE-CL31's for there soundstage and crisp sound reproduction.
> 
> .....On another note, I have my Sidy DGS100's on the way to see how much better my collection can get.


 
 Is it perfectly balanced or does it sound identical to the Grado SR80?


----------



## 1clearhead

peter123 said:


> Is it perfectly balanced or does it sound identical to the Grado SR80?


 
  
 I say, both. Though the SR80 tends to edge more towards the bass side the SE-CL31's does sound identical, but does a better job controlling the bass where it never overlaps, but compliments the rest of the spectrum. You could say a cross between the SR80 and SR60, but mostly reminding me of the SR80's signature.


----------



## peter123

1clearhead said:


> I say, both. Though the SR80 tends to edge more towards the bass side the SE-CL31's does sound identical, but does a better job controlling the bass where it never overlaps, but compliments the rest of the spectrum. You could say a cross between the SR80 and SR60, but mostly reminding me of the SR80's signature.


 
 OK, none of those strikes me as particulary balanced so I guess we just hear things really different


----------



## jant71

1clearhead said:


> I say, both. Though the SR80 tends to edge more towards the bass side the SE-CL31's does sound identical, but does a better job controlling the bass where it never overlaps, but compliments the rest of the spectrum. You could say a cross between the SR80 and SR60, but mostly reminding me of the SR80's signature.


 
  
 You know that was a mistake  Why say identical instead of a lot like the Grado??
  
 Also a bit off on the IEM's as they work with Fostex Japan as OEM for quite a few of their models and have plenty of good in-ears. The CLX60(CLX40 in Japan) that I loaned Joker to review a while back is a perfect example. They have had a bad track record with portable phones esp. on-ears. Pioneer has hybrids now and they have used armatures for a few years and had sound tuning filters way back with the old CLX9. Most are solid offerings.
  
 I'll back you up as I'm sure it is a good earphone but not on the Grado thing as I haven't heard the CLX31 and it is probably better to let the Pioneer sit on it's own cause you will only get some backlash/disagreement equating one phone to another esp. an earphone to a headphone.


----------



## encoreAC

Hi Joker
  
 I am searching for an upgrade for my Sony MH1 with similar sound sig, but with a more precise Bass and overall sound quailty.
 I like it's warmness (could be less though), smoothness and relaxed treble paired with the thick Bass.
  
 Price should be under 350$. At the moment I have the FAD Heaven VI and JVX FX850 in mind.
  
 Any other suggestions? Thanks for the thread!


----------



## 1clearhead

peter123 said:


> OK, none of those strikes me as particulary balanced so I guess we just hear things really different


 
 Sorry, Pete. I meant when only comparing both.
  
 Of course I know the SR80 is mostly V shaped, but with the bass on the SE-CL31's keeping great balance to the rest of the their signature it portrays to resemble more of a balanced IEM. They have a pretty engaging and addictive sound. I hope 'Joker' gets to check them into his list of next reviews.


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

encoreac said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> I am searching for an upgrade for my Sony MH1 with similar sound sig, but with a more precise Bass and overall sound quailty.
> I like it's warmness (could be less though), smoothness and relaxed treble paired with the thick Bass.
> ...


 
 For 230$ I'd strongly suggest the ath ckr 9. You can audition them first if you can.


----------



## ljokerl

I'll be getting some of the ones that were requested most over the summer out of the way soon.
  


encoreac said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> I am searching for an upgrade for my Sony MH1 with similar sound sig, but with a more precise Bass and overall sound quailty.
> I like it's warmness (could be less though), smoothness and relaxed treble paired with the thick Bass.
> ...


 
  
 Can't really think of a perfect match of what you want out of the sets I have tried (no experience with the FX850 or Heaven VI). Sounds like a Brainwavz R3 or Sony MDR-7550 with the bass boosted closer to MH1C level. It seems most sets that have MH1C-quantity bass don't share its smoothness and vice versa. .


----------



## vwinter

encoreac said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> I am searching for an upgrade for my Sony MH1 with similar sound sig, but with a more precise Bass and overall sound quailty.
> I like it's warmness (could be less though), smoothness and relaxed treble paired with the thick Bass.
> ...




The FX850 has a lot of delicacy with a large and powerful bass presentation but it doesn't have relaxed treble like the MH1. Really a great IEM if used with a front vent mod to reduce bass presence IMO, but maybe not what you're looking for. Hope that helps a bit.


----------



## vlenbo

syedz2ez4 said:


> For 230$ I'd strongly suggest the ath ckr 9. You can audition them first if you can.




I second this.

The treble of the new ckr is relaxed yet defined.

The mids are forward but not sibilant.

The lows are beautiful, eargasmic even.

Not even basshead territory either, or at least not the direction where it overwhelms people.

Soundstaging is phenomenal and beats most iems I have in that regard. Not until I get the havis that is, lol.


----------



## Exesteils

vwinter said:


> The FX850 has a lot of delicacy with a large and powerful bass presentation but it doesn't have relaxed treble like the MH1. Really a great IEM if used with a front vent mod to reduce bass presence IMO, but maybe not what you're looking for. Hope that helps a bit.




This is true. The bass is amazing, but the 850's treble is clear and sometimes outright aggressive with certain tracks/sources.


----------



## james444

encoreac said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> I am searching for an upgrade for my Sony MH1 with similar sound sig, but with a more precise Bass and overall sound quailty.
> I like it's warmness (could be less though), smoothness and relaxed treble paired with the thick Bass.
> ...


 


vwinter said:


> The FX850 has a lot of delicacy with a large and powerful bass presentation but it doesn't have relaxed treble like the MH1. Really a great IEM if used with a front vent mod to reduce bass presence IMO, but maybe not what you're looking for. Hope that helps a bit.


 
  
 Agreed. I love the FX850 to bits, but "relaxed" isn't how I'd describe their treble lol. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 How about the Sony XBA-H3? They combine a warm / powerful low end with smooth / relaxed treble and can be easily modded to bring down bass level if desired.


----------



## Ap616

james444 said:


> Agreed. I love the FX850 to bits, but "relaxed" isn't how I'd describe their treble lol.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 That's what I was gonna/would suggest, though I haven't heard them.


----------



## Wokei

vlenbo said:


> I second this.
> 
> The treble of the new ckr is relaxed yet defined.
> 
> ...




+ agreed...though me don't own ckr9 but have listened to this snake oil by vlenbo..just joking...they are A1 in me book...lol


----------



## encoreAC

Wow thanks for all the suggestions. Really helped me out.
  
 The sound description of the ATH-CKR9 seems really good! I will look for information on the their thread.
 But shouldn't I go for the CKR10, they are still in my price range.
  
 The problem I have with all the Sony's is that they are looking so huge and thus rather uncomfortable for deep insertion and silly looking for occasional mobile use. (yeah i kinda appreciate a minimalistic design too.)
  
 Despite their more engaging treble I am still interested in the FX850 due to the fact how much love they get here and I like to switch between phones sometimes. ;D


----------



## peter123

1clearhead said:


> Sorry, Pete. I meant when only comparing both.
> 
> Of course I know the SR80 is mostly V shaped, but with the bass on the SE-CL31's keeping great balance to the rest of the their signature it portrays to resemble more of a balanced IEM. They have a pretty engaging and addictive sound. I hope 'Joker' gets to check them into his list of next reviews.


 
 Thanks for clarifying


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

vlenbo said:


> I second this.
> 
> The treble of the new ckr is relaxed yet defined.
> 
> ...


 
 Nicely put 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I didn't want to describe much of it again, been doing that a lot lately ahaha I just wished this guy could audition them to hear how amazing it is 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


encoreac said:


> Wow thanks for all the suggestions. Really helped me out.
> 
> The sound description of the ATH-CKR9 seems really good! I will look for information on the their thread.
> But shouldn't I go for the CKR10, they are still in my price range.
> ...


 
 Yes indeed the 10s are more expensive but not better. Its a different tuning with a lot bigger sounding and bigger bass. I prefered the 9s more because it has alot more air to vocals. The bass goes deep but faster compared to 10s. But this is my preference, if you like bigger bass and longer decays then perhaps the 10s or fx850 may do better for you as they are all great iem actually. I have auditioned the 10s and fx850, and fit and comfort for me goes to ckrs series. I do not know the prices of the fx850 now but last i checked they were about $400 and even more in my country. The fx850 is like twice the price of the ckr9s but i can assure you they don't sound twice better than the ckr9s. Differerent tuning so preference and needs is key here. Strongly suggest you audition them somewhere if you can, although i feel if you jump on any you'd be very happy.
 Cheers


----------



## ajs6269

What does "burning in" actually do? I have what I think are decent headphones (om audio, rha 750i and fidelio s2) and they all sounded decent straight from the box.


----------



## ZapX629

ajs6269 said:


> What does "burning in" actually do? I have what I think are decent headphones (om audio, rha 750i and fidelio s2) and they all sounded decent straight from the box.


 
 Not much. It's almost always just you getting used to the new sound, hearing something differently, having fresher or more fatigued ears, etc. Things change a little bit as they get used, but it's very minor.


----------



## ajs6269

Thank you!





zapx629 said:


> Not much. It's almost always just you getting used to the new sound, hearing something differently, having fresher or more fatigued ears, etc. Things change a little bit as they get used, but it's very minor.


----------



## ljokerl

vwinter said:


> The FX850 has a lot of delicacy with a large and powerful bass presentation but it doesn't have relaxed treble like the MH1. Really a great IEM if used with a front vent mod to reduce bass presence IMO, but maybe not what you're looking for. Hope that helps a bit.


 
  
 Sounds like how I'd describe the FX750. Also wouldn't recommend it in this case. 
  


james444 said:


> Agreed. I love the FX850 to bits, but "relaxed" isn't how I'd describe their treble lol.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Good call, totally forgot about these.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the NarMoo S1.
  
 The S1 has also been featured in the IEM Buyer's Guide by Sound Signature, in the "Basshead" section
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A88) NarMoo S1*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Sep 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## Hitesh

So I have been looking for IEMs with as low microphonics as possible and using theheadphonelist.com I have decided on Rock-it R50 but the problem they are a little out of my budget.
 Are there any similar IEM , around 30$ cheaper ?
 Preferences - Non-existing microphonics, Neutral sound


----------



## vlenbo

wokei said:


> + agreed...though me don't own ckr9 but *have listened to this snake oil by vlenbo*..just joking...they are A1 in me book...lol


 
 I'm sorry, I will convert that snake oil to pure virgin olive oil for you once I receive my Havi pro I. 
  
 I will make comparisons against both the snake oil (ckr9) and the olive oil (Havi pro I) in grand yet short detail in order for people to understand how both are awesome earphones.
  
 I will be biased against the havi pro, just make sure of that. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (jk, that won't happen).
  
  


hitesh said:


> So I have been looking for IEMs with as low microphonics as possible and using theheadphonelist.com I have decided on Rock-it R50 but the problem they are a little out of my budget.
> Are there any similar IEM , around 30$ cheaper ?
> Preferences - Non-existing microphonics, Neutral sound


 
 MAYBE a vsd3, ostry kc06, or the havi pro I.


----------



## Wokei

vlenbo said:


> I'm sorry, I will convert that snake oil to pure virgin olive oil for you once I receive my Havi pro I.
> 
> I will make comparisons against both the snake oil (ckr9) and the olive oil (Havi pro I) in grand yet short detail in order for people to understand how both are awesome earphones.
> 
> ...


 
 Pumped ...looking to this battle ......won't be stalking you buddy ....kekekeeee


----------



## ZapX629

vlenbo said:


> MAYBE a vsd3, ostry kc06, or the havi pro I.


 
 I wouldn't call the first two neutral, even though they're great sounding earphones. They're balanced but more of a warm sound. Dunno how the Havis sound but they'd need a good amp to sound great. Maybe a GR07 Classic, but that's only $20 less. You might be able to find a used R50 for cheaper if you wouldn't mind going that route.


----------



## ljokerl

hitesh said:


> So I have been looking for IEMs with as low microphonics as possible and using theheadphonelist.com I have decided on Rock-it R50 but the problem they are a little out of my budget.
> Are there any similar IEM , around 30$ cheaper ?
> Preferences - Non-existing microphonics, Neutral sound


 
  
 Unless you want to go used, UE600 is probably your best bet under $80. It's a little warmer than the R-50, but still quite neutral.


----------



## Hitesh

ljokerl said:


> Unless you want to go used, UE600 is probably your best bet under $80. It's a little warmer than the R-50, but still quite neutral.


 
 Do 600 and 600vi sound same ?
 http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Ultimate-600vi-Noise-Isolating-Headset/dp/B003YKG2UK
 50$! Nice


----------



## suman134

hitesh said:


> Do 600 and 600vi sound same ?
> http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Ultimate-600vi-Noise-Isolating-Headset/dp/B003YKG2UK
> 50$! Nice


 

  yup , they are same , with a mic and controller on one .


----------



## altrunox

The cheapest most balanced IEM acoording to ljokerl review's I guess is the Vsonic VC02, althought it's more than US$30.
  
 ---
  
 ljokerl, I'm planning in jumping in the "near US$100 IEM" category soon.
 My warm choice will probably be the RE-400, and in the future I may probably get the VSD7, since I liked a lot my VSD3S.
  
 But nowadays what do you think would be a better choice for a more balanced sound, the VC1000 or the GR07 Classic (the classic is priced almost the same as the VC1000 so it would be a fair comparison)?
 People seen to love a lot the GR07 and don't give a attention to the VC1000, but after reading all the comparisons between the VC1000 and others then I started to think that I would probably like the VC1000 more. You were even able to compare VC1000 with the Noble 4S, what I think is impressive....
  
 And why do you think the GR07 got almost all the attention?


----------



## suman134

altrunox said:


> The cheapest most balanced IEM acoording to ljokerl review's I guess is the Vsonic VC02, althought it's more than US$30.
> 
> ---
> 
> ...


 
  
  " as you like vsd3s you like bass , you sure you can do with smaller amount of bass ? if yes , vc1000 or say B2 are awesome options , and let me tell you , these phones are really flat , people like gr07 cuz its fun , more engaging with its highs and bass too . these got highs but will fall flat on bass front , these are made like that and if you want bass intact , lose these , re-400 has a bit bigger bass but not big enough . If you too want an engaging sound , i recommend gr07  "
  this is why gr07 got more attention .


----------



## altrunox

suman134 said:


> " as you like vsd3s you like bass , you sure you can do with smaller amount of bass ? if yes , vc1000 or say B2 are awesome options , and let me tell you , these phones are really flat , people like gr07 cuz its fun , more engaging with its highs and bass too . these got highs but will fall flat on bass front , these are made like that and if you want bass intact , lose these , re-400 has a bit bigger bass but not big enough . If you too want an engaging sound , i recommend gr07  "
> this is why gr07 got more attention .


 
 I think this answer my question. Maybe I would like the GR07 with more genres of music, althought I really want to get the VSD5 and VSD7 after Vsonic release them, so I would probably have two IEMs with almost the same sound (GR07 and VSD7). So VC1000 would be a better option.
  
 RE-400, VC1000, and in the future the VSD7 (VSD5 will do the job for now, since Vsonic should release it soon), I guess this three will cover all the music I like to listen for a reasonable price and good value.
  
 Thx everybody


----------



## kendric

ljokerl said:


> Sounds like how I'd describe the FX750. Also wouldn't recommend it in this case.
> 
> 
> Good call, totally forgot about these.




If you get the chance, try out the FX850s with aftermarket cables. My only experience is with TWag and my own 93spec so far.

With the TWag is becomes more quick and edgy whereas 93spec makes it sounds more lush with wider headroom and treble sparkle.

Those who I lent the combo to audition says that its the first time any DD Universals offers such a 'total package' which is similar or even bests any universal BA with the exception of those which tuning were too 'unique' to be compared to.

My JH13FPs is yet to be back from repair but it seems these are the only ones I heard which still bests the FX850+93SPEC in terms of midrange and vocal definitions - A tremendous feat for the pair which costs a lot lesser than the former.


----------



## B9Scrambler

Wow....surprised you found the NarMoo S1 to be a basshead IEM. I have both it and the R1M and find the R1M stomps all over them in the bass department (regardless of which tuning button is installed). Nice review though  Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

altrunox said:


> ljokerl, I'm planning in jumping in the "near US$100 IEM" category soon.
> My warm choice will probably be the RE-400, and in the future I may probably get the VSD7, since I liked a lot my VSD3S.
> 
> But nowadays what do you think would be a better choice for a more balanced sound, the VC1000 or the GR07 Classic (the classic is priced almost the same as the VC1000 so it would be a fair comparison)?
> ...


 
  
 The VC1000 IMO. I really like it for balanced/neutral sound. Not sure why it never got much attention - maybe because it was quite late in the game. There were at least a dozen similar-sounding earphones released before it, from the Audio-Technica CK10 and UE700 to the Brainwavz B2 and Rock-It R-50 (and even VSonic's own GR01). Hard to get excited about yet another, oh-so-slightly different option in the realm of sub-$200 dual BAs.
  


kendric said:


> If you get the chance, try out the FX850s with aftermarket cables. My only experience is with TWag and my own 93spec so far.
> 
> With the TWag is becomes more quick and edgy whereas 93spec makes it sounds more lush with wider headroom and treble sparkle.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Ah, so JVC added detachable cables to their flagship. Good stuff.
  


b9scrambler said:


> Wow....surprised you found the NarMoo S1 to be a basshead IEM. I have both it and the R1M and find the R1M stomps all over them in the bass department (regardless of which tuning button is installed). Nice review though  Thanks!


 
  
 Probably production differences between units. My S1 has more bass than my R1M on the silver setting:
 http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/NarMooS1.pdf
 http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/NarMooR1MSilverPorts.pdf
  
 With the black ports the R1M has tons of bass, though.


----------



## cylpol1

Hello, after buying the Etymotic hf5, I am looking for a completely different sound signature. I am looking for the widest soundstahe poossible iem that is bass oriented, but won't completely over power the mids and highs. An audiophile bass iem with the with the widest soundstage basically. My budget is under 150. Thank you for your help in advanced.


----------



## ZapX629

cylpol1 said:


> Hello, after buying the Etymotic hf5, I am look for a completely different sound signature. I am looking for the widest soundstage possible iem that is bass oriented, but won't completely power mids and highs. An audiophile bass iem with the widest soundstage basically. My budget is under 150. Thank you for your help in advanced,


 
 Reading your post, I immediately thought GR07 BE for bassy, but still a balanced, controlled, and detailed signature. Has the neutral and crisp tone of the GR07 with enough bass to satisfy EDM, metal, and Hip-hop fans. Not a true basshead IEM, but next to your Ety it will sound like one. This would be my recommendation as it's one I've spent a lot of time with. Soundstage is very wide and out of head for an IEM. You can get it from Amazon for $120.
  
 RHA MA750 ($120) and EPH-100 ($130) sound like they'd be something up your alley too, based on other peoples' accounts, but you'd have to let some others chime in on them since I haven't heard them.


----------



## martindagun

Can anyone recommend some cheap IEM that have a really good cable. Since my Vsonic VSD1's broke.
 These will just be used when riding, so want something under $20. How are the Meelec Sport-Fi M6?


----------



## suman134

martindagun said:


> Can anyone recommend some cheap IEM that have a really good cable. Since my Vsonic VSD1's broke.
> These will just be used when riding, so want something under $20. How are the Meelec Sport-Fi M6?


 

 hje -125 or she3900 . under or close to $10 and are nice too .


----------



## martindagun

suman134 said:


> hje -125 or she3900 . under or close to $10 and are nice too .


 
 How are the cables on them? I really would like something that would last a while.


----------



## peter123

martindagun said:


> Can anyone recommend some cheap IEM that have a really good cable. Since my Vsonic VSD1's broke.
> These will just be used when riding, so want something under $20. How are the Meelec Sport-Fi M6?


 
 KZ EDSE one of the best builds and cable I've ever seen on a IEM. Should not cost more than $15 and they sound really good as well.
  
 Edit: Actually less that $10 right now 
  
 http://www.aliexpress.com/item/KZ-ED2-professional-in-ear-headphones-Metal-heavy-bass-sound-quality-Music-headphones/2019520112.html
  
 ED2 = EDSE


----------



## suman134

martindagun said:


> How are the cables on them? I really would like something that would last a while.


 

 120 is not the strongest but its supple , 3900 is stronger but not like R3 , and peter123 has suggested a nice looking phone , cable looks good too , but if you can do with bigger phones , try finding a memorex ie400 , these guys a have externally braided cable .
 comes with a pair of comply too , for $12 a comply is like , use it with something else . and the sound is not bad too , but isolation is not the best for sure .
  
  http://www.amazon.com/Memorex-32020021328-Earphones-Discontinued-Manufacturer/dp/B007H69PVK


----------



## suman134

suman134 said:


> 120 is not the strongest but its supple , 3900 is stronger but not like R3 , and peter123 has suggested a nice looking phone , cable looks good too , but if you can do with bigger phones , try finding a memorex ie400 , these guys a have externally braided cable .
> comes with a pair of comply too , for $12 a comply is like , use it with something else . and the sound is not bad too , but isolation is not the best for sure .
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Memorex-32020021328-Earphones-Discontinued-Manufacturer/dp/B007H69PVK


 

  this one has a better picture .
  http://www.amazon.com/Memorex-IE400-Earbuds-Blue/dp/B009EO7BOQ/ref=pd_sim_sbs_e_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=0R8G5X5NY6HK9RH15G65


----------



## kendric

ljokerl said:


> Ah, so JVC added detachable cables to their flagship. Good stuff.




Yep! Its using an MMCX Connector (following the likes of UE900, Shure and the current Westones).

They also used a larger driver at 11mm for it!

I found that the FX850s generally responds very well partly due to the large 11mm Wooden Driver Unit.

Overall the midrange improved by quite the mileage coming from the FX700.

I believe you would rate these pretty high up on upgrade cables, stock cable sounds decent though I would imagine if FX700 is 9.3/10 the FX850 probably won get pass your 9.5/10 hallmark, with the right cable such as Stage93's 93spec I believe it would score a 9.6~9.8/10 in your scorebook! (^_^)


----------



## B9Scrambler

martindagun said:


> How are the cables on them? I really would like something that would last a while.


 The NarMoo R1M are built like a tank, sound good, and are quite cheap. They have a nice meaty cable (too much so for me) but feel like they will last a long time.


----------



## suman134

can some one tell me the difference between the " MI in ear " and piston 2 ?


----------



## ljokerl

cylpol1 said:


> Hello, after buying the Etymotic hf5, I am looking for a completely different sound signature. I am looking for the widest soundstahe poossible iem that is bass oriented, but won't completely over power the mids and highs. An audiophile bass iem with the with the widest soundstage basically. My budget is under 150. Thank you for your help in advanced.


 
  
ZapX629 beat me to it - the three that come to mind are the GR07 BE, MA750, and EPH-100. The GR07 BE is the most accurate of these (i.e least different from the HF5 in overall balance, but still different) and has the most "open" sound. The other two are bassier and warmer, but have more forward sound (especially the EPH-100), though both still have good width (and, in the case of the EPH-100, really good depth). 
  


martindagun said:


> Can anyone recommend some cheap IEM that have a really good cable. Since my Vsonic VSD1's broke.
> These will just be used when riding, so want something under $20. How are the Meelec Sport-Fi M6?


 
  
 I still have my M6 and M9 from 2009, both still work fine. The black M6 has a sturdy cable. 
  


kendric said:


> Yep! Its using an MMCX Connector (following the likes of UE900, Shure and the current Westones).
> 
> They also used a larger driver at 11mm for it!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sounds like something worth trying. Can't say I've been blown away by any universals lately. The best thing I've tried this year is probably the Dunu DN2k. 
  


suman134 said:


> can some one tell me the difference between the " MI in ear " and piston 2 ?


 
  
 "MI in-ear" is what the Piston is called in the Chinese domestic market, I believe (because Xiaomi is known as just "MI"). Not clear which version is being referred to but it should be easy to tell from pictures.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> "MI in-ear" is what the Piston is called in the Chinese domestic market, I believe (because Xiaomi is known as just "MI"). Not clear which version is being referred to but it should be easy to tell from pictures.


 
  
   how to tell the piston and piston2 apart ?


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> how to tell the piston and piston2 apart ?


 
  
 Piston2 has the gold housings and the big vent in the back.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Piston2 has the gold housings and the big vent in the back.


 
 thanks , it looks like a golden one , lets see . i will bother you once again when i will get these . till than , peace , may be .


----------



## cylpol1

Thanks for all your help guys


----------



## Terlain

Hi all,
  
 I'm new to this forum, and I joined to find help looking for new IEMs. I'm sure most people are tired of hearing this, but what are the cheapest bang-for-the-buck IEMs ($30 and under) that I can buy right now? There's so many IEM reviews on here, that I'm a bit overwhelmed, and I'm not sure what to choose. Sound quality is most important to me.
  
 I looked at some of the reviews and am considering these so far:
  
 KZ-ED2 ($12)
 Xiaomi - Piston 2 ($25)
 JVC - HAFX101 ($15)
 JVC - HAFX40 ($19)
 Philips - SHE3590 ($11)
  
 Which one of these would be the best pick? Or any other recommendations would be greatly appreciated.
  
 Also, about the KZ-ED2, is $12 a good price for it? Or do any of you know if the price will fall again? A few posts back, someone mentioned that it was going for less than $10.
  
 http://www.aliexpress.com/item/KZ-ED2-professional-in-ear-headphones-Metal-heavy-bass-sound-quality-Music-headphones/2019520112.html?PID=6146845&src=ale&URL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aliexpress.com%2Fitem%2FKZ-ED2-professional-in-ear-headphones-Metal-heavy-bass-sound-quality-Music-headphones%2F2019520112.html&cv=11032041&cn=null&tp1=xmrftfu4wjfo&tracelog=null&af=cj_6146845&vd=30
  
  
 Also, I just want to thank the person(s) that is responsible for all these reviews. I can't imagine how much time and work it took to put all this together. Cheers!


----------



## rated1975

Joker can you recommend a universal iem $100-200 which is balanced across the FR and neutral, primarily for classical music


----------



## suman134

terlain said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm new to this forum, and I joined to find help looking for new IEMs. I'm sure most people are tired of hearing this, but what are the cheapest bang-for-the-buck IEMs ($30 and under) that I can buy right now? There's so many IEM reviews on here, that I'm a bit overwhelmed, and I'm not sure what to choose. Sound quality is most important to me.
> 
> ...


 
   i think piston2 is the best of these .


----------



## KepinCemit

rated1975 said:


> Joker can you recommend a universal iem $100-200 which is balanced across the FR and neutral, primarily for classical music


 

 Not joker 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 but maybe you could consider HiFiman Re400 ? http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/hifiman-re-400-waterline/


----------



## suman134

rated1975 said:


> Joker can you recommend a universal iem $100-200 which is balanced across the FR and neutral, primarily for classical music


 
  
  i second that on re-400 , would like to add zero audio doppios and B2 too .


----------



## peter123

rated1975 said:


> Joker can you recommend a universal iem $100-200 which is balanced across the FR and neutral, primarily for classical music




Havi B3 Pro1, with that budget you can easily afford an amp for it if you don't have one already.


----------



## ljokerl

terlain said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm new to this forum, and I joined to find help looking for new IEMs. I'm sure most people are tired of hearing this, but what are the cheapest bang-for-the-buck IEMs ($30 and under) that I can buy right now? There's so many IEM reviews on here, that I'm a bit overwhelmed, and I'm not sure what to choose. Sound quality is most important to me.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I would go for the Pistons but I haven't tried the KZ. The Piston is a little on the bassy side but not as much as the JVC FX101. The 3590 is awesome if you are worried about bass bloat and want a little less bass, but IMO the Piston is tolerable for the price in that regard as well.
  


rated1975 said:


> Joker can you recommend a universal iem $100-200 which is balanced across the FR and neutral, primarily for classical music


 
  
 Sure, my picks would be TDK BA200, HiFiMan RE-400, Etymotic HF5, and VSonic VC1000. I arranged them from warmest to brightest but they're all quite neutral on the whole.


----------



## bluesnrock

ljokerl said:


> Sure, my picks would be TDK BA200, HiFiMan RE-400, Etymotic HF5, and VSonic VC1000. I arranged them from warmest to brightest but they're all quite neutral on the whole.



Hey, I'm looking for something similar. I listen to a lot of acoustic stuff and blues rock and Id like something relatively neutral but still strong in all aspects especially mids and highs. How does the GR07 Classic color compare to the IEMs you listed? Also vocals and instrument separation are important considerations


----------



## ljokerl

bluesnrock said:


> Hey, I'm looking for something similar. I listen to a lot of acoustic stuff and blues rock and Id like something relatively neutral but still strong in all aspects especially mids and highs. How does the GR07 Classic color compare to the IEMs you listed? Also vocals and instrument separation are important considerations


 
  
 GR07 is a little less strong in the midrange than the ones I listed and has a bit more bass. Doesn't sound like what you're after if your priority is on mids and highs. BA200 would be a better option.


----------



## Levanter

@ljokerl
 Any more in depth comparison btw 1964 V6 Stage vs JH13 Pro?
 In terms of clarity, details/micro details, imaging, soundstage, etc? Are the differences very subtle and only detectable through long hard scrutiny that one might feel that any differences are tricks playing in our mind?
 And for more versatile music genre, from Rock/Metal to Jazz/Classical and a bit of EDM tyoe, which fairs better?


----------



## Exesteils

levanter said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> Any more in depth comparison btw 1964 V6 Stage vs JH13 Pro?
> In terms of clarity, details/micro details, imaging, soundstage, etc? Are the differences very subtle and only detectable through long hard scrutiny that one might feel that any differences are tricks playing in our mind?
> And for more versatile music genre, from Rock/Metal to Jazz/Classical and a bit of EDM tyoe, which fairs better?




1964 V6 has significant midbass bloat, so it wouldn't do well with any of the genres that require clean, fast bass. The Noble 6 handles it much better, but of course, it costs a lot more


----------



## ljokerl

levanter said:


> @ljokerl
> Any more in depth comparison btw 1964 V6 Stage vs JH13 Pro?
> In terms of clarity, details/micro details, imaging, soundstage, etc? Are the differences very subtle and only detectable through long hard scrutiny that one might feel that any differences are tricks playing in our mind?
> And for more versatile music genre, from Rock/Metal to Jazz/Classical and a bit of EDM tyoe, which fairs better?


 
  
 Not a huge difference between them but the JH13 wins out mostly in treble quality and overall presentation/soundstaging. The V6-Stage has similar clarity but tends to have a little less bass impact and less forward mids. It is a little more sibilant as well. The JH13Pro has more prominent mids and more bass impact. Tonally it sounds slightly warmer than the V6 and is more rich and full-bodied overall, with a slightly more convincing and dynamic presentation. Its treble is smoother and a little more extended as well. If you can swing it, I'm pretty sure the JH13 will provide a better experience with your genres.


----------



## AgentJ

Was this the headphone comparison site you were on about? http://www.sonicsense.com/blog/headphone-shootouts/which-headphones-are-best-listen-here-for-yourself

I've tried using V4A and it worked really well with my FRD80 - helped me try to understand its sound signature more. Only thing is that it doesn't seem to make any difference to my 770 (I thought they'd be better to play around with, find my preferred sound). 

Reckon that could be due to the higher impedance? 

Also I know you've probably been asked many times, but are you planning on reviewing the VSonic VSD3(S)? 

Cheers again!


----------



## ljokerl

agentj said:


> Was this the headphone comparison site you were on about? http://www.sonicsense.com/blog/headphone-shootouts/which-headphones-are-best-listen-here-for-yourself
> 
> I've tried using V4A and it worked really well with my FRD80 - helped me try to understand its sound signature more. Only thing is that it doesn't seem to make any difference to my 770 (I thought they'd be better to play around with, find my preferred sound).
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yep, that's the one! Haven't played around with it too much (no IEMs on there) but it's a cool concept for sure. I think this works best when using a reference-flat/neutral in-ear like an Ety HF5 or something. The more "colored" your headphone, the more everything is going to sound the same. 
  
 I do plan to review the VSD3S - should have some impressions of that, the Havi B3 Pro1, and the Ostry KC06 posted in a couple of weeks.


----------



## altrunox

OMG, B3 Pro 1, KC06 and VSD3, let's see how's the winner 
 I bet on the VSD3 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 --
  
 BTW, my Vivo MMX 71 iE (AKA Beyerdynamic DTX 71 iE with smartphone controls) should finally arrive tomorrow, I'll try to give some impressions to compare with your DTX 71 iE review and check if they're the same. I don't think people would be as interested in it as the the Piston, due to the more flat and bass light sound signature of the Beyer, but I guess there's someone how would like it.


----------



## bluesnrock

ljokerl said:


> GR07 is a little less strong in the midrange than the ones I listed and has a bit more bass. Doesn't sound like what you're after if your priority is on mids and highs. BA200 would be a better option.


Thanks. It's true that bass isn't my chief concern. Where could I buy the ba200 at a reasonable price? The only place I know of is eBay and its from some random Israeli seller. I heard they were selling for 120 last year on Amazon but I can't find anything once again.


----------



## AgentJ

ljokerl said:


> I think this works best when using a reference-flat/neutral in-ear like an Ety HF5 or something. The more "colored" your headphone, the more everything is going to sound the same.


 
  
 That's a good point. I could probably try using the FRD80s with V4A (to get the neutral sound) and compare from there. Cheers!


----------



## dezane222

joker, can you recommend me iem that has greatest mid quality under $250 ?
 i listen to smooth jazz and vocal music


----------



## thug behram

Natural upgrade for the DN-1000?

I like the overall sound and detail. Things that could be improved are: comfort, soundstage, smoother treble.


----------



## Wokei

Question as usual ...have you heard TPeos H100ii ....any input would be appreciated ...thanks in advance


----------



## altrunox

ljokerl my MMX 71 iE finally arrived, I would say they`re nothing special, their sound remembered me a lot the SHE3570/SHE3590, would you agree?
 Althought for 20 buck I think they`re a good buy, the problem is that the Pistons are really better for almost the same price.
  


Spoiler: Pictures


----------



## 1clearhead

@joker
  
 I finally decided to buy a wooden IEM for best sound and looks; the Astrotec AM800. Would you think these has one of the best sounds by far in a wooden housing? I'm hoping I made the right choice.
  
*Is there a comparison with other wooden IEM's?*
  
 So far, they sound really good just as you described in your list of IEM's!


----------



## DrunkenTiger

Best earbuds for hip hop/soul/r and b at 100$ or under?


----------



## B9Scrambler

ljokerl said:


> Probably production differences between units. My S1 has more bass than my R1M on the silver setting:
> http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/NarMooS1.pdf
> http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/NarMooR1MSilverPorts.pdf
> 
> ...


 

 Sounds like a reasonable explanation, lol. There is another S1 in my household which I tried out today. A bit more bass, a boost in the treble, and not as smooth refined sounding as mine either. My housemate also bought the R1M when NarMoos last sale was on. I'll try them out to see how they compare to mine.
  
 Are you planning to review both the VSonic VSD3 and VSD3S, or just the 3S? Either way, I'm excited to read your upcoming reviews.


----------



## DaDolce

ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't recommend the Music One if you like bassy earphones. If you can find it in your price range, the Yamaha EPH-100 would be my pick for Electronic music. Otherwise the MA750 is quite good. If you want to spend under $100, I'd recommend the Audio-Technica CKM500, Shure SE215 (for a smoother, more MH1-like sound), and even the Brainwavz S1.
> 
> Unfortunately I haven't tried the latest crop of Xears in-ears.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hey Joker. My EPH-100 arrived yesterday! Only thing is I can't get a good fit. Seems my earcanals are too small 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Is there a way to overcome that? Maybe some other earpads? Or should I try to sell them and go for the RHA MA750 instead?


----------



## HairyHeadMara

dadolce said:


> Hey Joker. My EPH-100 arrived yesterday! Only thing is I can't get a good fit. Seems my earcanals are too small  . Is there a way to overcome that? Maybe some other earpads? Or should I try to sell them and go for the RHA MA750 instead?



Have you tried the smallest ear tips which come in the box yet? I had a similar problem when I first get my pair.


----------



## ZapX629

Yeah, I would think there would be a pair small enough to fit you in there. If not there are some aftermarket options.


----------



## DaDolce

dadolce said:


> Hey Joker. My EPH-100 arrived yesterday! Only thing is I can't get a good fit. Seems my earcanals are too small
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Tried that yes...I tried them all...I even wiggled with some of my Sony tips. I put one wich works perfect for me with my FA iems. But didnt work either...I see now that i only got 4 earpads...shouldn't there be 5? Could it be i have a fake one?


----------



## ZapX629

dadolce said:


> Tried that yes...I tried them all...I even wiggled with some of my Sony tips. I put one wich works perfect for me with my FA iems. But didnt work either...I see now that i only got 4 earpads...shouldn't there be 5? Could it be i have a fake one?


 
 I'm not sure how many tips come with it. Not sure about fakes either. Could be that the nozzle is too big for your ears, but that seems unlikely. Which other IEMs do you use? You could post a photo of how you wear them and how they fit and that might help.


----------



## Shawn71

dadolce said:


> Tried that yes...I tried them all...I even wiggled with some of my Sony tips. I put one wich works perfect for me with my FA iems. But didnt work either...I see now that i only got 4 earpads...shouldn't there be 5? Could it be i have a fake one?




If I were you, and suspect it could be fakes, I would post some pictures what I received (in its entirity) in -respective thread- for others to take a look, differentiate/confirm and advice......about its legitness. And try tip rollin for the fit issues, which in this case you had already tried with FA and sony's.....so pls post your reply what ZapX629 suggested...


----------



## TrueMage22

Hi to all! 
 I hope you will help me with my "original" issue. 
 I try to find earphones for my metalhead girlfriend. The problem is she have to small ear canal, someting about 4 mm in most thin part. So "common" earphones just don't fit. Can you, please, give me advice about specific models (with decent bass) which she can use?
 Thank you in advance!


----------



## DaDolce

zapx629 said:


> I'm not sure how many tips come with it. Not sure about fakes either. Could be that the nozzle is too big for your ears, but that seems unlikely. Which other IEMs do you use? You could post a photo of how you wear them and how they fit and that might help.


 
  
  


shawn71 said:


> If I were you, and suspect it could be fakes, I would post some pictures what I received (in its entirity) in -respective thread- for others to take a look, differentiate/confirm and advice......about its legitness. And try tip rollin for the fit issues, which in this case you had already tried with FA and sony's.....so pls post your reply what ZapX629 suggested...


 
 thnx for the advice guys. I will do this. I will try to post it tomorrow!


----------



## suman134

truemage22 said:


> Hi to all!
> I hope you will help me with my "original" issue.
> I try to find earphones for my metalhead girlfriend. The problem is she have to small ear canal, someting about 4 mm in most thin part. So "common" earphones just don't fit. Can you, please, give me advice about specific models (with decent bass) which she can use?
> Thank you in advance!


 

 se215 will do good and fits your bill perfectly . and the shure oliver foam tips will serve her better .


----------



## ZapX629

truemage22 said:


> Hi to all!
> I hope you will help me with my "original" issue.
> I try to find earphones for my metalhead girlfriend. The problem is she have to small ear canal, someting about 4 mm in most thin part. So "common" earphones just don't fit. Can you, please, give me advice about specific models (with decent bass) which she can use?
> Thank you in advance!


 
 That all depends on the budget, but there are lots of options with smaller nozzles.


----------



## peter123

suman134 said:


> se215 will do good and fits your bill perfectly . and the shure oliver foam tips will serve her better .




Hmm, aren't those tips huge? I could never get them to fit properly in my ears. I usually use small or medium tips.


----------



## suman134

peter123 said:


> Hmm, aren't those tips huge? I could never get them to fit properly in my ears. I usually use small or medium tips.


 
  
  small olivers can be squeezed to be put inside .


----------



## TrueMage22

suman134 said:


> se215 will do good and fits your bill perfectly . and the shure oliver foam tips will serve her better .


 
 Thank you very much, I'll look into this. 
  


zapx629 said:


> That all depends on the budget, but there are lots of options with smaller nozzles.


 
 I think 200$.


----------



## Shawn71

truemage22 said:


> Hi to all!
> I hope you will help me with my "original" issue.
> I try to find earphones for my metalhead girlfriend. The problem is she have to small ear canal, someting about 4 mm in most thin part. So "common" earphones just don't fit. Can you, please, give me advice about specific models (with decent bass) which she can use?
> Thank you in advance!







zapx629 said:


> That all depends on the budget, but there are lots of options with smaller nozzles.




to add, klipsch S4i & S5i has narrow nozzles and their oval tips fits well for small ears,ety kids is another option to look for (but less sensitivity) and soundMagic PL21 also another one that has narrow nozzle......you need to buy some time to research for your particular need than just ordering.....


----------



## TrueMage22

Unfortunately IEM are personal care, so we can't just go to shop and try some models. This is why I ask you.  
  
 P.S. Accordingly to this thread reviews, klipsch S4i and especially soundMagic PL21 have too bad sound but thank you anyway.


----------



## ZapX629

The GR07 has smaller nozzles and tips. My GF uses them fine with the stock tips and she's 5'0 and tiny. It also has an amazing sound quality to price ratio. If she needs more bass punch you could go for the Bass Edition. If you live in the US get them from here: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-gr07-bass-GR07-Edition/dp/B00KM4N83K/ref=pd_tcs_subst_e_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=1TH0M07GYTFAXTVJD0J2
  
 If you live elsewhere, get them from lendmeurears.com.


----------



## TrueMage22

zapx629 said:


> The GR07 has smaller nozzles and tips. My GF uses them fine with the stock tips and she's 5'0 and tiny. It also has an amazing sound quality to price ratio. If she needs more bass punch you could go for the Bass Edition. If you live in the US get them from here: http://www.amazon.com/VSONIC-gr07-bass-GR07-Edition/dp/B00KM4N83K/ref=pd_tcs_subst_e_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=1TH0M07GYTFAXTVJD0J2
> 
> If you live elsewhere, get them from lendmeurears.com.


 
 Hmm, nozzle size for Bass Edition is 4mm. Same measurement is ear canal. Any tips add 1-1,5mm and I'm afraid we'll fail with GR07.


----------



## TrueMage22

Hmm, the nozzle size of Bass Edition is 4mm. Ear canal have same measurement. Any tips add 1-1,5mm, so I'm afraid we'll fail with GR07.


----------



## ZapX629

FWIW, the GR07 comes with the smallest tips I've ever seen. If she can't squeeze these in comfortably I don't think anything is gonna work.


----------



## suman134

truemage22 said:


> Hmm, the nozzle size of Bass Edition is 4mm. Ear canal have same measurement. Any tips add 1-1,5mm, so I'm afraid we'll fail with GR07.


 

  you know , you should try foam tips , and is size and bass and some SQ are the biggest thing , i dont think there is any thing close to se215 and golden crystal .


----------



## TrueMage22

zapx629 said:


> FWIW, the GR07 comes with the smallest tips I've ever seen. If she can't squeeze these in comfortably I don't think anything is gonna work.


 
 Why? In this thread I see many models with 2.5mm nozzle size, so even with tips it does not exceed 4mm. Btw, what actually means 2.5mm nozzle size? With my Sennh ie6 I see nozzle have bigger edge for tip attachment I think. Is this 2.5mm relate to this bigger edge or not?
  
  


suman134 said:


> you know , you should try foam tips , and is size and bass and some SQ are the biggest thing , i dont think there is any thing close to se215 and golden crystal .


 
 It is quite interesting. So I can buy IEM and foam tips separately? Do you mean some memory foam tips or something else?


----------



## Shawn71

truemage22 said:


> Unfortunately IEM are personal care, so we can't just go to shop and try some models. This is why I ask you.
> 
> P.S. Accordingly to this thread reviews, klipsch S4i and especially soundMagic PL21 have too bad sound but thank you anyway.




Well there are few electronic shops/stores who keep the IEMs for customers to try like headphones,on display....again not common tho....thats why we come here and get some valuable inputs from others...

Yes both klipschs are not good sounding but pl21 is not bad for the price with angled nozzle and narrow bore..if you are on tight budget....agains its all come to our personal preferences....

Best way is to fix a budget and her sound preference then narrow down....like zapx629 quoted, there are options to choose that depends on your budget and sound preference.....


----------



## TrueMage22

shawn71 said:


> Best way is to fix a budget and her sound preference then narrow down....like zapx629 quoted, there are options to choose that depends on your budget and sound preference.....


 
 Yes, and I fixed budget a couple posts above (it is 200$) and her music preference is power/md/falk/viking metal, so good bass is necessary.


----------



## ljokerl

bluesnrock said:


> Thanks. It's true that bass isn't my chief concern. Where could I buy the ba200 at a reasonable price? The only place I know of is eBay and its from some random Israeli seller. I heard they were selling for 120 last year on Amazon but I can't find anything once again.


 
  
 I am not aware of BA200 counterfeits. TDK doesn't make them anymore which makes them tough to find anywhere near $120.
  


dezane222 said:


> joker, can you recommend me iem that has greatest mid quality under $250 ?
> i listen to smooth jazz and vocal music


 
  
 TDK BA200, HiFiMan RE-400, Ortofon e-Q5 should all be good. The e-Q5 is a bit brighter than the other two but still nice and smooth, with very clean mids. 
  


thug behram said:


> Natural upgrade for the DN-1000?
> 
> I like the overall sound and detail. Things that could be improved are: comfort, soundstage, smoother treble.


 
  
 The DN-2000 covers the soundstage and smoother treble, but sounds a little thinner and less bassy as well. The Sony XBA-H3 is even smoother, more full-bodied, and can be very comfortable despite its odd shape, but gives up a little clarity to the DN-1000 and DN-2000.
  


wokei said:


> Question as usual ...have you heard TPeos H100ii ....any input would be appreciated ...thanks in advance


 
  
 Have not tried the H100ii, only the original H100.
  


altrunox said:


> ljokerl my MMX 71 iE finally arrived, I would say they`re nothing special, their sound remembered me a lot the SHE3570/SHE3590, would you agree?
> Althought for 20 buck I think they`re a good buy, the problem is that the Pistons are really better for almost the same price.


 
  
 I think the 3580 and Piston 2 are both better than the "genuine" DTX/MMX71.
  


1clearhead said:


> @joker
> 
> I finally decided to buy a wooden IEM for best sound and looks; the Astrotec AM800. Would you think these has one of the best sounds by far in a wooden housing? I'm hoping I made the right choice.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The wooden IEMs I've tried since the AM-800 have all been rather bad (Meze 11 Deco, Accidentally Extraordinary Bamboo, Tekfusion Ecoofers). The AM-800 and Thinksound MS01 are still the best ones I've tried under $100. 
  


drunkentiger said:


> Best earbuds for hip hop/soul/r and b at 100$ or under?


 
  
 Lots of options... without any additional requirements the Piston2 would be quite good at $25. 
  


b9scrambler said:


> Sounds like a reasonable explanation, lol. There is another S1 in my household which I tried out today. A bit more bass, a boost in the treble, and not as smooth refined sounding as mine either. My housemate also bought the R1M when NarMoos last sale was on. I'll try them out to see how they compare to mine.
> 
> Are you planning to review both the VSonic VSD3 and VSD3S, or just the 3S? Either way, I'm excited to read your upcoming reviews.


 
  
 Just the VSD3S for now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  


truemage22 said:


> Hi to all!
> I hope you will help me with my "original" issue.
> I try to find earphones for my metalhead girlfriend. The problem is she have to small ear canal, someting about 4 mm in most thin part. So "common" earphones just don't fit. Can you, please, give me advice about specific models (with decent bass) which she can use?
> Thank you in advance!


 
  
  
 Unfortunately not all small IEMs come with small eartips. Klipsch Image X10s come to mind as something very friendly towards small ears / ear canals and with very solid bass. If you're in the US you can get them for $190 or so.


----------



## 1clearhead

ljokerl said:


> The wooden IEMs I've tried since the AM-800 have all been rather bad (Meze 11 Deco, Accidentally Extraordinary Bamboo, Tekfusion Ecoofers). The AM-800 and Thinksound MS01 are still the best ones I've tried under $100.


 
  
 Thanks Joker, that was promising to hear!
  
 I am very convinced with the sound signature and the looks of my AM800's. Best looking wooden IEM, by far!


----------



## TrueMage22

ljokerl said:


> Unfortunately not all small IEMs come with small eartips. Klipsch Image X10s come to mind as something very friendly towards small ears / ear canals and with very solid bass. If you're in the US you can get them for $190 or so.


 
 I don't see where I can burrow X10s.  I see X10i, just X10, X11, but not X10s.


----------



## suman134

truemage22 said:


> I don't see where I can burrow X10s.  I see X10i, just X10, X11, but not X10s.


 

 he meant x10s like x10i , x10 , there is no x10s at least i know of .


----------



## ljokerl

Yes, that's right. I was just using X10s as the plural of X10.


----------



## sbog4215

Wow Joker, this is a spectacular effort. And the result is just mind boggling. Thank you for putting the time into this. It has really made it easier for novice audiophiles like myself to join the group and really enjoy some quality headphones =) My last purchase (VSonic GR06) was heavily influenced by your research. I'm now looking to upgrade again =)

 I'm an avid trance fan that loves his bass and is looking to spend max $150. To and from university and at the gym. When entering the price range into your table and arranging by sound quality, I get the list below.
  

Brainwavz B2      9.2 $130VSonic VC1000      9.2 $125VSonic GR07 Bass Edition      9.1 $129Rock-It Sounds R-50 / R-50M1     9.1 $120HiFiMan RE-400 Waterline      9 $99
  
 Given my music tastes, would you recommend any of these (or maybe some not on the list) above the others? I have also read many good things about Yamaha EPH-100 but they are rated a little bit lower on your list. Really appreciate your help! Stefan


----------



## ZapX629

Yeah, I don't know where I'd be in this hobby without Joker and ClieOS and their awesome compendium of headphones.
  
 Of all those, the GR07BE is the only one that could be considered bassy. The others are neutral to analytical, which wouldn't be the best for trance and bass. The Yamaha you mentioned, as well as the RHA MA-750 (very durable and would be good in the gym) should be on your list as well, and I'm sure Joker can tell you which is best for your needs and recommend more good options.


----------



## ljokerl

sbog4215 said:


> Wow Joker, this is a spectacular effort. And the result is just mind boggling. Thank you for putting the time into this. It has really made it easier for novice audiophiles like myself to join the group and really enjoy some quality headphones =) My last purchase (VSonic GR06) was heavily influenced by your research. I'm now looking to upgrade again =)
> 
> I'm an avid trance fan that loves his bass and is looking to spend max $150. To and from university and at the gym. When entering the price range into your table and arranging by sound quality, I get the list below.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Great sound doesn't mean much if it's not the sound signature you are looking for. Preference definitely trumps performance at this level. ZapX629 is right - out of those, the GR07 BE is the only one that can be suitable for a bass fan, and even that barely trumps the GR06 when it comes to bass quantity. The EPH-100 is a different story - it's a great earphone for bass - very extended and powerful, but not lacking in other areas. I really like them for EDM and it seems like it would be more the right choice for you.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Great sound doesn't mean much if it's not the sound signature you are looking for. Preference definitely trumps performance at this level.


 

   exactly why i went for R3 over ma-750 . its kind of funny , i got my R3 for under $100 and asking on ma750 is $150 .


----------



## TrueMage22

Thank you very much, guys (especially to Joker)! I'll try to find X10 and pray it will fit to her ears properly.


----------



## sbog4215

ljokerl said:


> Great sound doesn't mean much if it's not the sound signature you are looking for. Preference definitely trumps performance at this level. ZapX629 is right - out of those, the GR07 BE is the only one that can be suitable for a bass fan, and even that barely trumps the GR06 when it comes to bass quantity. The EPH-100 is a different story - it's a great earphone for bass - very extended and powerful, but not lacking in other areas. I really like them for EDM and it seems like it would be more the right choice for you.


 

 Yea that's what I've been struggling with, this idea of sound quality vs. sound signature. How does one even objectively define sound quality? Overall balance? Does the fact that I love bass, by definition, mean that I prefer earphones that are less balanced? Hmm just some audio philosophical questions haha.

 Seems like I'll be getting the EPH-100 then. Thanks for your input, it's really appreciated. And I respect the fact that you're willing to help someone out even with purchasing lower-priced earphones =)


----------



## ZapX629

sbog4215 said:


> Yea that's what I've been struggling with, this idea of sound quality vs. sound signature. How does one even objectively define sound quality? Overall balance? Does the fact that I love bass, by definition, mean that I prefer earphones that are less balanced?


 
 Like Joker said, when you get to a certain tier, it's about your preferences vs others'. There are some headphones that can stand with things in other tiers and even beat them in certain instances. I can't speak for Joker, but while any rating is subjective, the objectivity comes from balancing pros and cons, strengths vs weaknesses, etc., then taking into account all the other little factors like imaging, layering, headstage, resolution, detail, and so on. For some people a weakness can be a strength and vice versa. 
  
 Don't feel like you aren't getting a great headphone just because it's a few tenths of a point lower. To have a great sound quality, a headphone usually has a more neutral or analytical sound. While it's sonically superb, this isn't going to make a fan of hip hop or EDM (unless it's leaner music like 80's dance stuff) very happy. Such a person would much rather have a funner sound, even if it sacrifices some clarity and detail. The fact that things like the EPH-100 and the MA-750 are so close to the others in quality is a testament to their value.


----------



## ljokerl

truemage22 said:


> Thank you very much, guys (especially to Joker)! I'll try to find X10 and pray it will fit to her ears properly.


 
  
 You'll be surprised by how small it is 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


sbog4215 said:


> Does the fact that I love bass, by definition, mean that I prefer earphones that are less balanced?


 
  
 Yes, pretty much.


----------



## Gandasaputra

After having the FXT90 for almost a year, I gotta admit I love these and agree with its "engaging" sound. My ears prefer FXT90 more and more to the Yamaha's EPH-100 whenever I play some rock / metal but I wish the FXT90 could have bit more rumble and boominess of the EPH-100.
  
 Furthermore, I'm impressed that FXT90 is few of earphones I have that is good on its own stock tips. I tried fitting it with Sony's MH1C tips and it sounded more livelier (and better in my opinion), like guitarists amping their guitars toward maximum volume. But, I ended up going back to the stocks because it fatigues quickly.
  
 Although I have no problem with its lack of deep-bass and rumble (or boominess), I've been wondering what is mid-bassy? As in mid-bass hump that you described in your review.


----------



## Pastapipo

1clearhead said:


> Thanks Joker, that was promising to hear!
> 
> I am very convinced with the sound signature and the looks of my AM800's. Best looking wooden IEM, by far!




Xears xe200pro? 
L-shaped and sq is behind the ttpod T1E. But its wooden...


----------



## chrisvan

I also bought astrotec AM800 based on the review here but i found them lacking in bass.
 1. The sound is clear and very bright as described but there is no deep bass to be felt or hear at all.
 2.They sound is very loud on my smartphone -- on the past i  have tried some Sony 16 ohm 100db + also the famous MH1 and the volume was really low, especially the mh1.
 3.My brother bought some cheap oem headphones from e bay for 5$  and while the are lacking clarity , the quantity of the bass surprised me , and the music was still very enjoyable.Loud too!
 4.So what i am looking are easy to drive headphones for my smartphone (16 ohm?) (105db and up?) ,sound like the astrotec but with way more bass...The _JVC_ HA-_FX1-3_ are they good for that? Also thinking about the  _Denon AH_-_C300_ ...


----------



## ozkan

gandasaputra said:


> After having the FXT90 for almost a year, I gotta admit I love these and agree with its "engaging" sound. My ears prefer FXT90 more and more to the Yamaha's EPH-100 whenever I play some rock / metal but I wish the FXT90 could have bit more rumble and boominess of the EPH-100.
> 
> Furthermore, I'm impressed that FXT90 is few of earphones I have that is good on its own stock tips. I tried fitting it with Sony's MH1C tips and it sounded more livelier (and better in my opinion), like guitarists amping their guitars toward maximum volume. But, I ended up going back to the stocks because it fatigues quickly.
> 
> Although I have no problem with its lack of deep-bass and rumble (or boominess), I've been wondering what is mid-bassy? As in mid-bass hump that you described in your review.


 
  You can try Philips 3590 tips if you want more rumble on your FXT-90.


----------



## 1clearhead

pastapipo said:


> Xears xe200pro?
> L-shaped and sq is behind the ttpod T1E. But its wooden...


 
  
 Thanks for the info.....
  
 I'll try searching some pictures.


----------



## suman134

chrisvan said:


> I also bought astrotec AM800 based on the review here but i found them lacking in bass.
> 1. The sound is clear and very bright as described but there is no deep bass to be felt or hear at all.
> 2.They sound is very loud on my smartphone -- on the past i  have tried some Sony 16 ohm 100db + also the famous MH1 and the volume was really low, especially the mh1.
> 3.My brother bought some cheap oem headphones from e bay for 5$  and while the are lacking clarity , the quantity of the bass surprised me , and the music was still very enjoyable.Loud too!
> 4.So what i am looking are easy to drive headphones for my smartphone (16 ohm?) (105db and up?) ,sound like the astrotec but with way more bass...The _JVC_ HA-_FX1-3_ are they good for that? Also thinking about the  _Denon AH_-_C300_ ...


 

  ma-750 sounds good for you and yes ah-c300 will fit your bill , but c300 are huge , bigger then ma750 , and its hard keeping them in if your ears are not big . if you are looking for cheaper options , fx1 and 3 are bass heavy too ,but at this price i would like to go for piston 2 not super bass heavy but enough and nice airy sound too .
  so long story short , if you can do over ear , ma750 if you cant , c300 , if you are low on budget then piston 2 .


----------



## ljokerl

Yeah, there's lots of sets with more bass than the AM-800 and high sensitivity. The Piston2 is certainly one of them. The Nuforce NE-600X is another, even bassier option and something I prefer to the JVC FX earphones.


----------



## B9Scrambler

Don't forget the Sony XB50 (the XB70 I assume will be even better). These puppies are easy to drive bass cannons.


----------



## 1clearhead

After reading everyone's suggestions and looking at several pictures online (for example, Xears xe200pro), I decided to stick with the Astrotec AM800. They sound very clear and detailed to the taste I was looking for. All I wanted was to add a beautiful wooden IEM to my collection. Buying it at around 200 RMB (roughly $30 US dollars) here in China was a pretty good deal.
  
 Thanks 'Joker', and others who gave suggestions.


----------



## blueangel2323

Hey Joker, you gave the In Ear StageDiver 2 and Westone 4 identical sound ratings (9.3/10). Would you be able to give a comparison between the two? I appreciate that you probably don't have both (or either) anymore. Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

blueangel2323 said:


> Hey Joker, you gave the In Ear StageDiver 2 and Westone 4 identical sound ratings (9.3/10). Would you be able to give a comparison between the two? I appreciate that you probably don't have both (or either) anymore. Thanks!


 
  
 I have the W40 now but it sounds pretty much the same as the W4. Still have the SD-2 as well. I use the W40 more because it's my main phone headset, but I like the sound of the SD-2 a little better. IMO the SD-2 is more balanced overall. The W40 has a bit of a bass hump and a darker sound overall. It's a little more impactful but the SD-2 has tighter, more level bass and is clearer. Mids (esp. upper mids) are more forward on the SD-2 and the upper mid/treble area is a touch brighter but never harsh.


----------



## blueangel2323

ljokerl said:


> I have the W40 now but it sounds pretty much the same as the W4. Still have the SD-2 as well. I use the W40 more because it's my main phone headset, but I like the sound of the SD-2 a little better. IMO the SD-2 is more balanced overall. The W40 has a bit of a bass hump and a darker sound overall. It's a little more impactful but the SD-2 has tighter, more level bass and is clearer. Mids (esp. upper mids) are more forward on the SD-2 and the upper mid/treble area is a touch brighter but never harsh.


 
 Thanks! Very helpful. I have an SD-2 on the way and from your description it sounds like I made the right decision - if the W40 is on the dark side then it's not for me (cue Star Wars jokes...). I don't mind bass emphasis as long as it stays down low, and I don't mind treble emphasis if it stays up high... but I like everything to be neutral between 200hz and 8k. Hopefully no 2-3k or 6-7k bumps on the SD-2 because I'm especially sensitive to those.


----------



## ookic

Is the astro AM 800 still a good iem?saw it got taken off the earphone sound signature list... i want one for listening to rock, stuff like dark side of the moon, hospice, madcap laughs, bloody valentine loveless, aeroplane over the sea... will it work for radiohead too? what about vsonicd1s?


----------



## peter123

poopsockk said:


> Is the astro AM 800 still a good iem?saw it got taken off the earphone sound signature list... i want one for listening to rock, stuff like dark side of the moon, hospice, madcap laughs, bloody valentine loveless, aeroplane over the sea... will it work for radiohead too? what about vsonicd1s?




I'd recommend the Vsonic vsd3s for that music and budget.


----------



## altrunox

Oh, my VSD3S is my number one rock audio equipment.
 I prefer then over my Superlux HD681 Evo, AKG K518, SHE3590 and the Pistons.
  
 I bet ljokerl already have them now.


----------



## ljokerl

blueangel2323 said:


> Thanks! Very helpful. I have an SD-2 on the way and from your description it sounds like I made the right decision - if the W40 is on the dark side then it's not for me (cue Star Wars jokes...). I don't mind bass emphasis as long as it stays down low, and I don't mind treble emphasis if it stays up high... but I like everything to be neutral between 200hz and 8k. Hopefully no 2-3k or 6-7k bumps on the SD-2 because I'm especially sensitive to those.


 
  
 Maybe on the one hand the Westone would have been safer - it has an upper midrange dip - but overall I do think the SD-2 sounds more natural in that range.
  


poopsockk said:


> Is the astro AM 800 still a good iem?saw it got taken off the earphone sound signature list... i want one for listening to rock, stuff like dark side of the moon, hospice, madcap laughs, bloody valentine loveless, aeroplane over the sea... will it work for radiohead too? what about vsonicd1s?


 
  
 The AM-800 is still a good earphone but I limit myself to only recommending three earphones per category and it got pushed out by the VSonic VSD1S, which I felt was better overall. Slightly different sound signatures, though - the VSD1S is warmer and had more bass impact while the AM-800 is brighter and a little more spacious.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Nuforce NE-600X to the IEM Buyer's guide in the Basshead/sub-$50 section, in place of the more expensive RHA MA350: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/


----------



## blueangel2323

ljokerl said:


> Maybe on the one hand the Westone would have been safer - it has an upper midrange dip - but overall I do think the SD-2 sounds more natural in that range.


 
  
 I wouldn't want an upper midrange dip though. I'm just sensitive to narrow peaks - I don't mind a slightly forward upper midrange, as long as the frequency response is smooth. In terms of the full sized headphones, the B&W P7 for example has forward upper mids and somewhat dry lower mids, but I still love their overall sound, although I do prefer the very slightly warm but still relatively neutral and very natural sounding midrange of my HD600. I do find that IEMs that aren't too clinical sounding usually err on the side of overly warm though.
  
 I should have the SD-2 next week. We shall see! Thanks again for your help.


----------



## B9Scrambler

ljokerl said:


> Just the VSD3S for now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Haha....can't wait for the review(s).
  
 Btw....I'm assuming these are not in the running, but were you ever planning to cover the Sony XB50/70 lineup? The XB50 are a pretty fun little behemoth, and affordable now that their price has plummeted throughout the year (from ~80 CAD to ~40-50 CAD...probably even cheaper online) to something more in line with their sound quality.


----------



## MiniMoose10

When can we expect the vsd3s review?


----------



## sbog4215

ljokerl said:


> Great sound doesn't mean much if it's not the sound signature you are looking for. Preference definitely trumps performance at this level. ZapX629 is right - out of those, the GR07 BE is the only one that can be suitable for a bass fan, and even that barely trumps the GR06 when it comes to bass quantity. The EPH-100 is a different story - it's a great earphone for bass - very extended and powerful, but not lacking in other areas. I really like them for EDM and it seems like it would be more the right choice for you.


 


 I ended up ordering the EPH-100 and they arrived today. You guys were right, I love them! Thanks for all your help =)


----------



## ZapX629

sbog4215 said:


> I ended up ordering the EPH-100 and they arrived today. You guys were right, I love them! Thanks for all your help =)


----------



## ljokerl

b9scrambler said:


> Haha....can't wait for the review(s).
> 
> Btw....I'm assuming these are not in the running, but were you ever planning to cover the Sony XB50/70 lineup? The XB50 are a pretty fun little behemoth, and affordable now that their price has plummeted throughout the year (from ~80 CAD to ~40-50 CAD...probably even cheaper online) to something more in line with their sound quality.


 
  
 I actually like Sony's XB headphones (at least the ones I've tried) so I wouldn't mind trying the in-ears in the future if I can find the time.
  


minimoose10 said:


> When can we expect the vsd3s review?


 
  
 Not sure, but I'll try to get some impressions up by the end of the month. 
  


sbog4215 said:


> I ended up ordering the EPH-100 and they arrived today. You guys were right, I love them! Thanks for all your help =)


 
  
 Glad to hear it!


----------



## aleex

The left phone on my JVC HA-FXD70's beginning to glitch. Sound is occassionally cut off. I really like them, so any tips on similar phones with prices ranging from $70 - $100? 
 Actually considered buying another pair but I might as well try something new while I'm at it. I've looked a bit at the FXD80 too.

 With similar, I mean in general: good build quality, good acessories (I could of course continue to use the FXD70's accessories with my new phones. I don't think I could use a pair of IEM's without a cable manager and clip from now on), cable not too short, snug fit in ear/good isolation (preferably there should be foam tips that work with them). 
  
Actually, similarity in sounds kind of comes last; I've really liked the clarity of the FXD70's, but certainly wouldn't mind more bass.


----------



## suman134

aleex said:


> The left phone on my JVC HA-FXD70's beginning to glitch. Sound is occassionally cut off. I really like them, so any tips on similar phones with prices ranging from $70 - $100?
> Actually considered buying another pair but I might as well try something new while I'm at it. I've looked a bit at the FXD80 too.
> 
> With similar, I mean in general: good build quality, good acessories (I could of course continue to use the FXD70's accessories with my new phones. I don't think I could use a pair of IEM's without a cable manager and clip from now on), cable not too short, snug fit in ear/good isolation (preferably there should be foam tips that work with them).
> ...


 
  
  there are many , but just randomly , xba-h1 fits you perfectly , good clip , awesome foam filled tips , i would have said ckx-9 but they lack cable clip and in the end , i would suggest re-400 , cable clip , nicely balanced ( you will miss the bass sadly ) , foam tips , zipper carry case .


----------



## cylpol1

What are some analytical earphones with wide soundstage under 200, or anything on the head-fi forums for under 120. Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

aleex said:


> The left phone on my JVC HA-FXD70's beginning to glitch. Sound is occassionally cut off. I really like them, so any tips on similar phones with prices ranging from $70 - $100?
> Actually considered buying another pair but I might as well try something new while I'm at it. I've looked a bit at the FXD80 too.
> 
> With similar, I mean in general: good build quality, good acessories (I could of course continue to use the FXD70's accessories with my new phones. I don't think I could use a pair of IEM's without a cable manager and clip from now on), cable not too short, snug fit in ear/good isolation (preferably there should be foam tips that work with them).
> ...


 
  
 Aside from the FXD80, maybe the FXT90? It has a somewhat different sound - warmer and more forward - but otherwise it fits the bill. Isolation is not amazing but it works, and there's a wide range of tips that fits on its more conventional nozzle. If you want to spend a little more, the MA750 from RHA has better deep bass and isolates a touch more, though it has to be worn over-the-ear.
  


cylpol1 said:


> What are some analytical earphones with wide soundstage under 200, or anything on the head-fi forums for under 120. Thank you.


 
  
 Rock-It sounds R-50, or Sony MDR-EX600 if you want to go dynamic.  Used - maybe Phiaton PS200, if you can find one.


----------



## suman134

cylpol1 said:


> What are some analytical earphones with wide soundstage under 200, or anything on the head-fi forums for under 120. Thank you.


 

  if you can do with the size , brainwavz R3 has really big sound stage .


----------



## hitme987

I got a Xiaomi Piston 2 for myself and the sound's great, but the only thing is that its very uncomfortable for my small ears.

 Sony MH1C with XS stock hybrid tips which used to give me the perfect fit over the ear.

 I tried a lot of different tips and also over the ear but no one's giving me a comfortable fit.

 I'd like to try some Comply tips, can anyone suggest which series would be good(S/T/Ts/TX/TsX) and which size would fit on piston 2? Budget not an issue, I just need a comfortable foam tip with good isolation . Also any other tips for better fit is appreciated
  
 Thanks!


----------



## ozkan

cylpol1 said:


> What are some analytical earphones with wide soundstage under 200, or anything on the head-fi forums for under 120. Thank you.


 
  
 Havi B3 Pro I has a wide soundstage and quite analytical but needs an amp to shine. If you can still find one, PFE 11X with grey filters is also a very good option.


----------



## zibra

What would be natural upgrade to quite old Hifiman RE ZERO? I love that quality, extended highs, resolution, crisp sound, clarity, upfront vocals without added thickness etc.
 I would like even better dynamics and little more bass ( must be great quality, dont like midbass bloat)
 I bet many users had RE ZERO - where to search something similiar but better? Im thinking only about universal iems. Cant tell price but it would be up to 250-300 USD and I could buy used ones.
 My Dac is LG G2 and Im waiting for Cayin C5.


----------



## KepinCemit

zibra said:


> What would be natural upgrade to quite old Hifiman RE ZERO? I love that quality, extended highs, resolution, crisp sound, clarity, upfront vocals without added thickness etc.
> I would like even better dynamics and little more bass ( must be great quality, dont like midbass bloat)
> I bet many users had RE ZERO - where to search something similiar but better? Im thinking only about universal iems. Cant tell price but it would be up to 250-300 USD and I could buy used ones.
> My Dac is LG G2 and Im waiting for Cayin C5.


 
  
 Re400 = rezero with a little more bass ? Havent tried rezero, but i love re400
  
 Heard Zero Audio Doppios are great for clarity too, but havent personally tried it yet.


----------



## zibra

And I havent tried RE400
 I got Tenores but found them little too dark for my tatses and little to much bass/ less clarity. Instruments sound sharper and more natural on re zero and I got better extension and dynamics on hifimans. Still running both from my LG G2 output. On the other hand Tenores are much more comfortable for me and I can get much better seal with it.


----------



## d marc0

Hi Joker,
  
 Do you have a written comparison between the Inear SD2 and Noble 4s? I was wondering which of the two has better sub bass extension, treble extension, and more neutral presentation overall.
 I have a feeling that I should've opted for the SD2 as my reference IEM... 
  
 Cheers mate!


----------



## ajs6269

I got the noble 3 universal iem on Thursday. They have exceeded my expectations as far as an upgrade to what I already have. They are very comfortable (once you find the right tips - they give you a bunch to choose from), light, no microphonics, etc.... As far as sound goes - I haven't taken them off all weekend.


----------



## suman134

zibra said:


> And I havent tried RE400
> I got Tenores but found them little too dark for my tatses and little to much bass/ less clarity. Instruments sound sharper and more natural on re zero and I got better extension and dynamics on hifimans. Still running both from my LG G2 output. On the other hand Tenores are much more comfortable for me and I can get much better seal with it.


 
  


kepincemit said:


> Re400 = rezero with a little more bass ? Havent tried rezero, but i love re400
> 
> Heard Zero Audio Doppios are great for clarity too, but havent personally tried it yet.


 
  
   i have both mate , but not the ZERO , i can tell is that re-400 has better sound stage and feels warmer too , doppio is darker and can distort with badly mastered tracks . i like both but i prefer re-400 cuz i like warmth but im using the doppio more , and i can tell you that is because its got more clarity and transparency , just a hair bit more . but then doppios are pricier , like $70 more .
  
 and doppios are a bit smoother up top . one or two spike , thats it . then re-400 have better package and stronger cable , just take a look at the accessories these come with .


----------



## ljokerl

Just wanted to say - those buying a Piston 2 should really be careful to avoid counterfeits. Just got a message from someone who got one and is disappointed with the sound. Turned out it cost $12 and is fake. The Piston 2 costs $15-16 in China, so it shouldn't be less than $20 stateside. Also, it only comes in one color - gold - despite what Amazon's mess of a product listing seems to indicate.
  


zibra said:


> What would be natural upgrade to quite old Hifiman RE ZERO? I love that quality, extended highs, resolution, crisp sound, clarity, upfront vocals without added thickness etc.
> I would like even better dynamics and little more bass ( must be great quality, dont like midbass bloat)
> I bet many users had RE ZERO - where to search something similiar but better? Im thinking only about universal iems. Cant tell price but it would be up to 250-300 USD and I could buy used ones.
> My Dac is LG G2 and Im waiting for Cayin C5.


 
  
 Aside from the RE-400 already mentioned, in that price range the TDK BA200 might be a good option for a hair more bass (if you can find one). I briefly compared it to the RE-400 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/tdk-ba200/ . Has a touch more low end and treble compared to HiFiMan sets, but not enough to throw off the tonality or sacrifice midrange quality. 
  


d marc0 said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Do you have a written comparison between the Inear SD2 and Noble 4s? I was wondering which of the two has better sub bass extension, treble extension, and more neutral presentation overall.
> I have a feeling that I should've opted for the SD2 as my reference IEM...
> ...


 
  
 I don't have a full comparison anywhere, but the SD-2 is actually warmer than what I consider neutral while the Noble 4 is pretty close. The StageDiver has very linear bass, no way to improve on the extension there, or up top for that matter. It just has a bit less treble energy than the Noble or an Ety or something. The Noble dips down a little in the subbass, but not significantly.


----------



## Pastapipo

ljokerl said:


> Just wanted to say - those buying a Piston 2 should really be careful to avoid counterfeits. Just got a message from someone who got one and is disappointed with the sound. Turned out it cost $12 and is fake. The Piston 2 costs $15-16 in China, so it shouldn't be less than $20 stateside. Also, it only comes in one color - gold - despite what Amazon's mess of a product listing seems to indicate.




Original Xiaomi Piston 2 for $19,99 

http://www.ibuygou.com/p-original_xiaomi_piston_earphone_updated_version_brown-5708.html

Valid until: 22 September 2014

Otherwise $25, but 100% legit.


----------



## ThickT

ozkan said:


> Havi B3 Pro I has a wide soundstage and quite analytical but needs an amp to shine. If you can still find one, PFE 11X with grey filters is also a very good option.




Yes the PFE are just amazingly natural sounding and very comfortable. I love my 132's more so than just about every other phone I've heard. Why can't anyone else seem to make a single BA that sounds as good?


----------



## ljokerl

pastapipo said:


> Original Xiaomi Piston 2 for $19,99
> 
> http://www.ibuygou.com/p-original_xiaomi_piston_earphone_updated_version_brown-5708.html
> 
> ...


 
  
 Good deal


----------



## ThickT

Joker, you ever hear any on ear cans that sound like the audio PFE's?


----------



## ozkan

thickt said:


> Yes the PFE are just amazingly natural sounding and very comfortable. I love my 132's more so than just about every other phone I've heard. Why can't anyone else seem to make a single BA that sounds as good?


 
  There is Ultimate Ears Super Fi5 (aka new UE600) which sounds as good as PFEs and in some areas better especially midrange detail.


----------



## ThickT

Ultimate ears you say?! Well well....looks like I must investigate those claims, sir...let's hope your not a silly goose.


----------



## ljokerl

thickt said:


> Joker, you ever hear any on ear cans that sound like the audio PFE's?


 
  
 No, not really. I haven't heard a good balanced/neutral on-ear on a long time.


----------



## ThickT

Well, rat-****! Man consider me on a mission. Anyone else know of any?


----------



## suman134

thickt said:


> Well, rat-****! Man consider me on a mission. Anyone else know of any?


 

  i would say the same , ue600 are that good . and these were selling for something under $50 , i dont know their prices now .


----------



## Baycode

thickt said:


> Well, rat-****! Man consider me on a mission. Anyone else know of any?




Havent heard the pfe's but if you want something neutral check the:
Havi B3 Pro1


----------



## ThickT

baycode said:


> Havent heard the pfe's but if you want something neutral check the:
> Havi B3 Pro1



Looking for on ears boys, not in ears. I appreciate the help


----------



## blueangel2323

ljokerl said:


> No, not really. I haven't heard a good balanced/neutral on-ear on a long time.


 
 Try KEF M500 for on-ear, or V-Moda XS for slightly warmer/bassier. Stepping up to over-ear, B&O H6 is amazingly neutral and still portable.


----------



## ThickT

Thank you blue angel


----------



## mullardpassion

ljokerl said:


> Just wanted to say - those buying a Piston 2 should really be careful to avoid counterfeits. Just got a message from someone who got one and is disappointed with the sound. Turned out it cost $12 and is fake. The Piston 2 costs $15-16 in China, so it shouldn't be less than $20 stateside. Also, it only comes in one color - gold - despite what Amazon's mess of a product listing seems to indicate.




I do think the pistons 2 are also available in silver since a few days with a white cable from penonaudio. A few members here already have ordered


----------



## altrunox

mullardpassion said:


> I do think the pistons 2 are also available in silver since a few days with a white cable from penonaudio. A few members here already have ordered


 
  
 Yes, there`s a silver and a pink/crystal one.
 Althought the silver 2 have a white box instead of the black one, and have bi flange tips instead of the big tips.









  
http://www.mi.com/huosai/roseCarmine
  
http://www.mi.com/item/1143500022


----------



## ljokerl

blueangel2323 said:


> Try KEF M500 for on-ear, or V-Moda XS for slightly warmer/bassier. Stepping up to over-ear, B&O H6 is amazingly neutral and still portable.


 
  
 Yeah, I've tried the XS briefly and didn't think it was quite neutral. The M500 and H6 seem promising. I thought the Phiaton MS430 may have been a nice compact one for neutral sound when I tried it at a show, but never got a chance for a longer listen. 
  


mullardpassion said:


> I do think the pistons 2 are also available in silver since a few days with a white cable from penonaudio. A few members here already have ordered


 
  
 Ah, good to know. The pink one with the crystal is just my style.


----------



## ThickT

Audeo PFE on ear equivalent is the beats solo2? (joking BTW)


----------



## suman134

altrunox said:


> Yes, there`s a silver and a pink/crystal one.
> Althought the silver 2 have a white box instead of the black one, and have bi flange tips instead of the big tips.
> 
> 
> ...


 
  these doesnt have vents , i dont know how these will sound .


----------



## blueangel2323

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, I've tried the XS briefly and didn't think it was quite neutral. The M500 and H6 seem promising. I thought the Phiaton MS430 may have been a nice compact one for neutral sound when I tried it at a show, but never got a chance for a longer listen.


 
 Yeah I wouldn't consider the XS neutral, but it's nicely balanced with nothing missing or severely recessed. The H6 is probably the most neutral closed headphone I've ever heard, along with the AKG550/551/545, although the latter may be too bulky for portable use.
  


thickt said:


> Audeo PFE on ear equivalent is the beats solo2? (joking BTW)


 
 The Solo2 is actually very nicely balanced, unlike its unbelievably dark predecessor. It's actually less bassy than the Momentum. The XS is more balanced than both though, with its better treble presence.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> these doesnt have vents , i dont know how these will sound .


 
  
 Good point. My Piston1 (no rear vent) is bassier and less refined than the Piston2.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Good point. My Piston1 (no rear vent) is bassier and less refined than the Piston2.


 
  
  that white one looks like a white piston 2 .


----------



## jant71

Some of us are fans of some of the accessories that JVC comes up with to include with their earphones whether it be a cord clip, spiral dot tips, or something like this. Now if you buy a JVCFX19 you'll get an interesting take on a cord wrap. They made one with a suction cup to attach itself to the back of a player or phone. Pretty great for those who like to wrap cords around the device. Comes in 10 colors as well, the FX19 that is.


----------



## ThickT

blueangel2323 said:


> Yeah I wouldn't consider the XS neutral, but it's nicely balanced with nothing missing or severely recessed. The H6 is probably the most neutral closed headphone I've ever heard, along with the AKG550/551/545, although the latter may be too bulky for portable use.
> 
> The Solo2 is actually very nicely balanced, unlike its unbelievably dark predecessor. It's actually less bassy than the Momentum. The XS is more balanced than both though, with its better treble presence.


I don't find the solo2 balanced in the slightest. I own them so I am not just going on in store impressions. Aside from the comfort, they are very lackluster sonically for $200. Just my opinion.


----------



## ljokerl

jant71 said:


> Some of us are fans of some of the accessories that JVC comes up with to include with their earphones whether it be a cord clip, spiral dot tips, or something like this. Now if you buy a JVCFX19 you'll get an interesting take on a cord wrap. They made one with a suction cup to attach itself to the back of a player or phone. Pretty great for those who like to wrap cords around the device. Comes in 10 colors as well, the FX19 that is.


 
  
 Good for JVC, trying to differentiate their budget earphones a little. Their new funny-looking waterproof ones are interesting too at $30 MSRP.


----------



## thug behram

which comply tips fit on the dn-1000?


----------



## Ellis

Sadly, the plug on my SteelSeries Flux In-Ears has given up and I now have an intermittent (but 90% broken) left channel. I'll check if they're in warranty, and may solder a new plug on if not, but I want something new anyway.

I like the sound signature of the Flux, which I guess would probably be described as warm, but not overly so? Either way, I've been looking at the RHA MA750s because they sound like a potentially good match, also with better build quality and a good selection of ear tips. Any thoughts?


----------



## cylpol1

Thank you for all your suggestions


----------



## ljokerl

thug behram said:


> which comply tips fit on the dn-1000?


 
  
 T-400 works fine
  


ellis said:


> Sadly, the plug on my SteelSeries Flux In-Ears has given up and I now have an intermittent (but 90% broken) left channel. I'll check if they're in warranty, and may solder a new plug on if not, but I want something new anyway.
> 
> I like the sound signature of the Flux, which I guess would probably be described as warm, but not overly so? Either way, I've been looking at the RHA MA750s because they sound like a potentially good match, also with better build quality and a good selection of ear tips. Any thoughts?


 
  
 The RHAs are good if you are okay with moving in the +bass direction sound-wise. The Flux, while indeed a little warm-sounding, is more balanced. The MA750 is warmer, bassier, a little less forward in the midrange, and more sensitive.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Brainwavz S1
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A89)** Brainwavz S1*
> 
> Reviewed August 2014
> 
> ...


----------



## suman134

joker , will you do the S5 ? i have done one , if someone wants to have a look at it .
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/brainwavz-s5-in-ear-headphones/reviews/11371


----------



## Ellis

ljokerl said:


> T-400 works fine
> 
> 
> The RHAs are good if you are okay with moving in the +bass direction sound-wise. The Flux, while indeed a little warm-sounding, is more balanced. The MA750 is warmer, bassier, a little less forward in the midrange, and more sensitive.



Hm, ok, thanks for the comparison. Do you have any other pairs that you think are worth considering? The GR07BE look potentially like a good match, but seem hard to find (at least in the UK) edit: no wonder, they're discontinued

I am in quite a rush since I don't have a spare pair and I usually use them for several hours a day, but maybe a better solution is to pick up something cheap and keep them as a backup, before jumping to something more expensive.

edit: decided to order the 750is from Amazon since I get Prime delivery and can always return them. We'll see 

One more thought: with an IEM at around that price, what is the chance that I'd benefit from an amplifier when using them with an Android phone (Nexus 4, currently)? I tend to use Google Play Music which I believe streams 320kbps MP3, so I don't think that should be an issue for portable listening.


----------



## turbare

Could anyone recommend some rather neutral IEM's with a J cable around $100? I'd rather lower than higher.


----------



## suman134

turbare said:


> Could anyone recommend some rather neutral headphones with a J cable around $100? I'd rather lower than higher.


 

  how much the denon ah-d340 are going for ? really balanced and close to natural , would have said srh440 but they have some bass issues which 340 dont have , still srh440 are really good .and hd449 will do good too . balanced and natural . and if you want bass too , go for ue6000 .


----------



## turbare

suman134 said:


> how much the denon ah-d340 are going for ? really balanced and close to natural , would have said srh440 but they have some bass issues which 340 dont have , still srh440 are really good .and hd449 will do good too . balanced and natural . and if you want bass too , go for ue6000 .


 
 I'm sorry I should have said IEM's, I've edited the post now


----------



## suman134

turbare said:


> I'm sorry I should have said IEM's, I've edited the post now


 
  
 never mind , you can be looking at hf5 and re-400 , and if you want bass , go for brainwavz S5 .


----------



## kova4a

suman134 said:


> never mind , you can be looking at hf5 and re-400 , and if you want bass , go for brainwavz S5 .


 
 He also said he wants an asymmetrical cable.


----------



## suman134

kova4a said:


> He also said he wants an asymmetrical cable.


 

  thats not possible . you too know that . i dont know of any at least . he should use a cable clip .


----------



## wolf230

turbare said:


> Could anyone recommend some rather neutral IEM's with a J cable around $100? I'd rather lower than higher.


 
  
 The only ones i know with J-Cable at that price are the Sony XBA-1ip


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> how much the denon ah-d340 are going for ? really balanced and close to natural , would have said srh440 but they have some bass issues which 340 dont have , still srh440 are really good .and hd449 will do good too . balanced and natural . and if you want bass too , go for ue6000 .




hd439 is bit better overall to 449 and also save $$.....


----------



## Shawn71

@ |joker| I expected to be a 7.4 rating in sound due to its harsh treble which inturn also kills its bass quality (otherwise clean V)....btw,may be you would have added the big 45deg jack and hulky Y splitter in cons.....


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> hd439 is bit better overall to 449 and also save $$.....


 

  449 is balanced , i like balance . have you tried hd449 with hd439 pads ?


----------



## ZapX629

ellis said:


> Hm, ok, thanks for the comparison. Do you have any other pairs that you think are worth considering? The GR07BE look potentially like a good match, but seem hard to find (at least in the UK) edit: no wonder, they're discontinued


 
 Just for clarification purposes, the GR07BE isn't discontinued and you can get them from Lendmeurears on both their amazon store and their website for the lowest price.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> 449 is balanced , i like balance . have you tried hd449 with hd439 pads ?




why? Doing so will change 449 SS?...


----------



## Ellis

zapx629 said:


> Just for clarification purposes, the GR07BE isn't discontinued and you can get them from Lendmeurears on both their amazon store and their website for the lowest price.



Ah, thanks. I can't find anything about UK shipping on their site though, which seems odd given how many other countries they ship to. I don't think they have an Amazon UK store.

The reason I thought they were discontinued was that, after looking around, it seemed to be the general conclusion once the GR07 Classic was released.


----------



## ZapX629

ellis said:


> Ah, thanks. I can't find anything about UK shipping on their site though, which seems odd given how many other countries they ship to. I don't think they have an Amazon UK store.


 
 I would assume it takes the same amount of time as elsewhere in Europe, about 3-4 days with DHL Express. Just letting you know in case you find the RHA not to be to your liking for some reason.


----------



## kova4a

ellis said:


> Ah, thanks. I can't find anything about UK shipping on their site though, which seems odd given how many other countries they ship to. I don't think they have an Amazon UK store.


 
 Lendmeurears ships to everywhere for free with registered mail. For EU it usually takes 7-14 days for the package to arrive.


----------



## Ellis

zapx629 said:


> I would assume it takes the same amount of time as elsewhere in Europe, about 3-4 days with DHL Express. Just letting you know in case you find the RHA not to be to your liking for some reason.





kova4a said:


> Lendmeurears ships to everywhere for free with registered mail. For EU it usually takes 7-14 days for the package to arrive.



Awesome, thanks for the information guys. I'm away this weekend which will involve a bit of travelling and provide a good chance to test the RHAs (hence the particular rush to order them... plus I can't go long without a pair of IEMs anyway ) so I imagine I'll know whether they're keepers or not by the time I'm back.


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> why? Doing so will change 449 SS?...


 

 improves bass for me , and less vibration .


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> joker , will you do the S5 ? i have done one , if someone wants to have a look at it .
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/products/brainwavz-s5-in-ear-headphones/reviews/11371


 
  
 No S5, the only other Brainwavz unit I have is the R3.
  


ellis said:


> One more thought: with an IEM at around that price, what is the chance that I'd benefit from an amplifier when using them with an Android phone (Nexus 4, currently)? I tend to use Google Play Music which I believe streams 320kbps MP3, so I don't think that should be an issue for portable listening.


 
  
 Unless your phone just lacks volume at the headphone jack, you won't need an amp for the MA750. 
  


turbare said:


> Could anyone recommend some rather neutral IEM's with a J cable around $100? I'd rather lower than higher.


 
  
 The Xears Revolution (XR120) is the only one I can think of. A little long in the tooth but you can still find them on the Xears site (might need a coupon code to bring the price down) and ebay.de
  


shawn71 said:


> @ |joker| I expected to be a 7.4 rating in sound due to its harsh treble which inturn also kills its bass quality (otherwise clean V)....btw,may be you would have added the big 45deg jack and hulky Y splitter in cons.....


 
  
 Really? I kind of like the plug. I generally prefer L-plugs but some of them don't fit in my phone case while this one is OK.


----------



## Shawn71

Yes I do love the L plug than the straights but this 45deg is little uneasy, but yeah the build at any point is truly awesome and built like a tank...otherwise. Klipsch S5i is no way close to its build and even better sounding than s5i, less than half the price of S5i Rugged....


----------



## Shawn71

Any plan on the M9 classic in your "TBR" list....truly still the budget king @ its $10 price tag.... 

 http://www.meelec.com/M9_Classic_In_Ear_Headphones_p/ep-m9-bk-ff.htm


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> Any plan on the M9 classic in your "TBR" list....truly still the budget king @ its $10 price tag....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  i dont think it better then es18 or even she3580 . i have the original M9 , its muddy and not so clear .


----------



## ljokerl

shawn71 said:


> Yes I do love the L plug than the straights but this 45deg is little uneasy, but yeah the build at any point is truly awesome and built like a tank...otherwise. Klipsch S5i is no way close to its build and even better sounding than s5i, less than half the price of S5i Rugged....


 
  
 Right, except for the mic option, the S4-II has nothing on these, either. 
  


shawn71 said:


> Any plan on the M9 classic in your "TBR" list....truly still the budget king @ its $10 price tag....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Never heard of it before but it looks like the very first M9 that I had... broke in 2009 or so and was replaced with a longer one. It actually was better-sounding than the ones that followed so who knows, maybe these can be competitive at $10.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Never heard of it before but it looks like the very first M9 that I had... broke in 2009 or so and was replaced with a longer one. It actually was better-sounding than the ones that followed so who knows, maybe these can be competitive at $10.


 
     interesting !!


----------



## Ellis

ljokerl said:


> Unless your phone just lacks volume at the headphone jack, you won't need an amp for the MA750.



Cheers, good to know.


----------



## Shawn71

ljokerl said:


> Right, except for the mic option, the S4-II has nothing on these, either.
> 
> 
> Never heard of it before but it looks like the very first M9 that I had... broke in 2009 or so and was replaced with a longer one. It actually was better-sounding than the ones that followed so who knows, maybe these can be competitive at $10.




They just launched and its 30% smaller than the originals...so there a change in SS,for sure....thats why I insisted....


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> i dont think it better then es18 or even she3580 . i have the original M9 , its muddy and not so clear .




ok....but overall as a package and sound for the price I paid its not that bad to me, especially 4+ years ago....give a shot while you bed,if not tried before....try with silver bi-flanges (balanced) as well and bwavz tips too.....


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> ok....but overall as a package and sound for the price I paid its not that bad to me, especially 4+ years ago....give a shot while you bed,if not tried before....try with silver bi-flanges (balanced) as well and bwavz tips too.....


 
  
   i will never say its bad , and this smaller one might sound different but i doubt it .


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> i will never say its bad , and this smaller one might sound different but i doubt it .




I thought you said M9 (the one you have) is not better than your ES18 & 3580s so quoted to try with diff tips and while bed.....and yeah the classic m9 will sound little different if not day/night.....


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> I thought you said M9 (the one you have) is not better than your ES18 & 3580s so quoted to try with diff tips and while bed.....and yeah the classic m9 will sound little different if not day/night.....


 
  
   i said not better then es18 or she 3580 , i never said its bad . i used to like these .


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> i said not better then es18 or she 3580 , i never said its bad . i used to like these .




:rolleyes: well you said its "muddy and not clear" (M9) so I quoted to try diff tips and try while bed (SLEEP) and never claimed you said bad about it either......And looks like you are taking into diff direction,so I just leave this topic....


----------



## ljokerl

Smaller chamber should have some effect on sound. From what I remember of the 2009 version, it wasn't as bassy as the later ones, so hopefully it is less muddy as well.


----------



## Shawn71

ljokerl said:


> Smaller chamber should have some effect on sound. From what I remember of the 2009 version, it wasn't as bassy as the later ones, so hopefully it is less muddy as well.




yeah...and im beginning to think it cld sound more like a single BA......lets wait and see....


----------



## aleex

ljokerl said:


> Aside from the FXD80, maybe the FXT90? It has a somewhat different sound - warmer and more forward - but otherwise it fits the bill. Isolation is not amazing but it works, and there's a wide range of tips that fits on its more conventional nozzle. If you want to spend a little more, the MA750 from RHA has better deep bass and isolates a touch more, though it has to be worn over-the-ear.


 
 Thanks for the suggestions, gonna check them out. I absolutely don't mind wearing them over the ear. In fact, I wore my FXD-70's that way because I found the the fit was better (although that's what my have caused them to start to glitch - maybe it put too much stress on the cable). I did forget to write that a huge plus would be if they had a remote for volume!
 EDIT: saw that MA750 had a version with remote. Found them at $120 in my own country so I'm definitely considering them!
  


suman134 said:


> there are many , but just randomly , xba-h1 fits you perfectly , good clip , awesome foam filled tips , i would have said ckx-9 but they lack cable clip and in the end , i would suggest re-400 , cable clip , nicely balanced ( you will miss the bass sadly ) , foam tips , zipper carry case .


 
 Thanks, gonna check them out.


----------



## ljokerl

aleex said:


> Thanks for the suggestions, gonna check them out. I absolutely don't mind wearing them over the ear. In fact, I wore my FXD-70's that way because I found the the fit was better (although that's what my have caused them to start to glitch - maybe it put too much stress on the cable). I did forget to write that a huge plus would be if they had a remote for volume!
> EDIT: saw that MA750 had a version with remote. Found them at $120 in my own country so I'm definitely considering them!
> 
> Thanks, gonna check them out.


 
  
 Yep, sounds like the MA750i is what you want. Just expect a significantly bassier and warmer sound compared to the FXDs.


----------



## shultzee

Can anyone recommend the best sounding sport iem's?  Mostly for bike riding.  I do have a pair of bose sport iems and they are just ok sounding.


----------



## shockdoc

shultzee said:


> Can anyone recommend the best sounding sport iem's?  Mostly for bike riding.  I do have a pair of bose sport iems and they are just ok sounding.


 

 Can you be a little more specific? Lots to consider when choosing an IEM for sports. How much noise isolation do you want/need? Is sweat or water resistance a major factor? Durability? Stay in place? For me the biggest problem is getting enough isolation that I can actually hear a good quality SQ while working out. For some that's moot because they want or need to hear things like approaching traffic for safety.


----------



## shultzee

Don't want total sound isolation as need to hear traffic. However if I am riding in a busy area I just leave one ear exposed to traffic sounds.
 Just looking to improve on sound quality from the bose but need something semi waterproof and durable.


----------



## shockdoc

shultzee said:


> Don't want total sound isolation as need to hear traffic. However if I am riding in a busy area I just leave one ear exposed to traffic sounds.
> Just looking to improve on sound quality from the bose but need something semi waterproof and durable.


 
 It will always be a difficult balance between isolation needs and SQ. Having said that there are some good offerings from Sennheiser and Meelectronics that might fit your needs. Durability is another thing altogether and often increases with price. In the end only you can determine what improved sound quality is to your ears and it's helpful if you have a store where you can audition many pairs of IEMs. Alternatively a place (Amazon?) with a liberal return policy can be invaluable.


----------



## peter123

shultzee said:


> Don't want total sound isolation as need to hear traffic. However if I am riding in a busy area I just leave one ear exposed to traffic sounds.
> Just looking to improve on sound quality from the bose but need something semi waterproof and durable.




Check out ATH-CKP500, great balanced sound and extremly good fit. They're water resistant so should be able to stand biking without problem. The sq on these are surprisingly good and you can find them really cheap on eBay.


----------



## proedros

Hi Joker,
  
 how come you haven;t tried/reviewed the *Hifiman RE-600 *? any chance of reviewing it in the near future ?

 great thread , keep up the good work


----------



## kova4a

proedros said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> how come you haven;t tried/reviewed the *Hifiman RE-600 *? any chance of reviewing it in the near future ?
> 
> great thread , keep up the good work


 
 He has http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors


----------



## ljokerl

shultzee said:


> Can anyone recommend the best sounding sport iem's?  Mostly for bike riding.  I do have a pair of bose sport iems and they are just ok sounding.


 
  
 The only sweat resistant/sports sets that I've found recommendable (with price in mind) are the MEElec M6s and the Audio-Technica CKX5 series. The CKX5 sounds better, though I prefer the fit of the M6. I've been disappointed with higher-end sweat-resistant earphones like the Westone Adv Alphas - it's hard to recommend a $200 sweat-resistant set when you can get better sound out of something that costs $50, and just replace it when it fails.


----------



## Spionner

Waiting for the havis and vsonic  excellent reviews "next lvl"


----------



## zubin111

Hi Joker, Just wanted to share something regarding the Xiaomi pistons 2.0. I jumped on the hype train and I am pretty much sure that is the real deal. However, i find the earphone a touch too boomy and very narrow spaced, cant hear it for more than 15 minutes. I think VSD1S is much clearer and bass has a clear kick compared to the pistons. Not sure if thats how is supposed to be or am i hearing something different but i can clearly see VSD1S far too much value compared to pistons.
Secondly, my JVC FXT90 plays heavenly on the Fiio X3 but whenever i plug into my phone (Nexus 4) it starts crackling and popping (I know its not driver flex). Its just this one only which does that otherwise VSD1S, pistons, DN1K plays just fine but does anyone have any idea why does FXT90 behave such badly with the N4?
Thanks again for all the help and great work!


----------



## Spionner

i'm definitely a noob but don't u think u maybe listening at to high volumes?? i use to do that, now i try to keep it at 60 to 68 db and my listening quality got super improved specially with amps in all my phones. Don't know why this come to me after reading your post but don't take me so serious i'm really starting in this.


----------



## ljokerl

zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker, Just wanted to share something regarding the Xiaomi pistons 2.0. I jumped on the hype train and I am pretty much sure that is the real deal. However, i find the earphone a touch too boomy and very narrow spaced, cant hear it for more than 15 minutes. I think VSD1S is much clearer and bass has a clear kick compared to the pistons. Not sure if thats how is supposed to be or am i hearing something different but i can clearly see VSD1S far too much value compared to pistons.
> Secondly, my JVC FXT90 plays heavenly on the Fiio X3 but whenever i plug into my phone (Nexus 4) it starts crackling and popping (I know its not driver flex). Its just this one only which does that otherwise VSD1S, pistons, DN1K plays just fine but does anyone have any idea why does FXT90 behave such badly with the N4?
> Thanks again for all the help and great work!


 
  
 No idea what your FXT90 is not liking in your Nexus. Sounds like some sort of clipping, which would indicate that it's a load that the Nexus can't handle for whatever reason.


----------



## zubin111

ljokerl said:


> No idea what your FXT90 is not liking in your Nexus. Sounds like some sort of clipping, which would indicate that it's a load that the Nexus can't handle for whatever reason.



 


Well i just tried listening it through and amp (Fiio E5) which i had lying around and it worked! it doesnt crackle now. Its strange but i am okay with this workaround.


----------



## ljokerl

zubin111 said:


> Well i just tried listening it through and amp (Fiio E5) which i had lying around and it worked! it doesnt crackle now. Its strange but i am okay with this workaround.


 
  
 Common workaround for phone issues. My previous Android phone had 50+ ohm impedance at the headphone jack, so I had to use an amp with a lot of BA earphones just to make them sound as the manufacturer intended.


----------



## blueangel2323

zubin111 said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > No idea what your FXT90 is not liking in your Nexus. Sounds like some sort of clipping, which would indicate that it's a load that the Nexus can't handle for whatever reason.
> ...


 


ljokerl said:


> Common workaround for phone issues. My previous Android phone had 50+ ohm impedance at the headphone jack, so I had to use an amp with a lot of BA earphones just to make them sound as the manufacturer intended.


 
  
 Do you have the latest firmware for your phone? My Galaxy S4 had the same oscillation problem which was fixed in a firmware update last year.
 http://www.jensign.com/S4Distortion/


----------



## Ellis

Very happy with the MA750i, all things considered. I usually really enjoy listening to my speaker setup when I'm at home but given that they're not currently positioned optimally and the soundstage on the 750s, I've found myself listening to them at home as well as when I'm out and about.

As for the bass, there is definitely a much larger bass presence compared to my previous SteelSeries Flux, however, I don't find the bass to appear on unwanted tracks, and I find it to be controlled enough that I really enjoy it, rather than feeling like it's muddying the overall sound.

My only concern now is the imminent release of the T10i 
They're more expensive, sure, but if they offer the RHA build quality with a sound signature that I also enjoy it's going to be pretty tempting. It's looking like they sound quite different to the 750s though, so not sure what to do there.


----------



## ld26

Hi, I'm looking for a budget pair of IEMs for classical music (around 50 euro). I want a big, airy soundstage with decent imaging. Bass is my least concern (I prefer a bass light pair). I currently own the Sennheiser MX985 earbuds. Very happy with these, except that I can barely hear any music in crowded areas. I don't use headphones outdoor often though. I don't feel the need to spend another 100+ euro on an IEM alternative.
  
 The Philips TX1 / TX2 sound like they'd fit the bill (I heard that they don't isolate very well but I can't imagine them do a worse job than the MX985). I can get the Fidelio S1 (used) though I'll have to stretch a bit. Would you guys recommend other pairs?


----------



## kova4a

ld26 said:


> Hi, I'm looking for a budget pair of IEMs for classical music (around 50 euro). I want a big, airy soundstage with decent imaging. Bass is my least concern (I prefer a bass light pair). I currently own the Sennheiser MX985 earbuds. Very happy with these, except that I can barely hear any music in crowded areas. I don't use headphones outdoor often though. I don't feel the need to spend another 100+ euro on an IEM alternative.
> 
> The Philips TX1 / TX2 sound like they'd fit the bill (I heard that they don't isolate very well but I can't imagine them do a worse job than the MX985). I can get the Fidelio S1 (used) though I'll have to stretch a bit. Would you guys recommend other pairs?


 
 Well, TX2 is quite spacious sounding, so if imaging and budget are your only concerns then you should be fine


----------



## peter123

ld26 said:


> Hi, I'm looking for a budget pair of IEMs for classical music (around 50 euro). I want a big, airy soundstage with decent imaging. Bass is my least concern (I prefer a bass light pair). I currently own the Sennheiser MX985 earbuds. Very happy with these, except that I can barely hear any music in crowded areas. I don't use headphones outdoor often though. I don't feel the need to spend another 100+ euro on an IEM alternative.
> 
> The Philips TX1 / TX2 sound like they'd fit the bill (I heard that they don't isolate very well but I can't imagine them do a worse job than the MX985). I can get the Fidelio S1 (used) though I'll have to stretch a bit. Would you guys recommend other pairs?




If you have an amp I'd recommend the Havi B3 Pro1, great soundstage width and best depth I've ever hears in an IEM.


----------



## ozkan

peter123 said:


> If you have an amp I'd recommend the Havi B3 Pro1, great soundstage width and best depth I've ever hears in an IEM.


 
 +1 on Havi's. Amazing soudstage and detail with an amp.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> The only sweat resistant/sports sets that I've found recommendable (with price in mind) are the MEElec M6s and the Audio-Technica CKX5 series. The CKX5 sounds better, though I prefer the fit of the M6. I've been disappointed with higher-end sweat-resistant earphones like the Westone Adv Alphas - it's hard to recommend a $200 sweat-resistant set when you can get better sound out of something that costs $50, and just replace it when it fails.




The Aurisonics Rockets might be your ticket 

Any plans for a review? Or would you be interested?


----------



## ljokerl

ellis said:


> As for the bass, there is definitely a much larger bass presence compared to my previous SteelSeries Flux, however, I don't find the bass to appear on unwanted tracks, and I find it to be controlled enough that I really enjoy it, rather than feeling like it's muddying the overall sound.


 
  
 That's the hallmark of decent-quality bass 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Glad you're enjoying them! 
  


ld26 said:


> Hi, I'm looking for a budget pair of IEMs for classical music (around 50 euro). I want a big, airy soundstage with decent imaging. Bass is my least concern (I prefer a bass light pair). I currently own the Sennheiser MX985 earbuds. Very happy with these, except that I can barely hear any music in crowded areas. I don't use headphones outdoor often though. I don't feel the need to spend another 100+ euro on an IEM alternative.
> 
> The Philips TX1 / TX2 sound like they'd fit the bill (I heard that they don't isolate very well but I can't imagine them do a worse job than the MX985). I can get the Fidelio S1 (used) though I'll have to stretch a bit. Would you guys recommend other pairs?


 
  
 The Philips do indeed have pretty mediocre isolation, but definitely better than earbuds. They do fit the bill, though the bass is not weak by any means.
  
 Depending on availability, the Astrotec AM-800 can be a less bassy alternative with an equally open presentation.
  
 If you'd rather have more isolation, the Ultimate Ears 600 would be a good one, but it might only be sub-$60 here in the US.
  


vwinter said:


> The Aurisonics Rockets might be your ticket
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 No plans, but definitely would be curious to check them out in the future.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the last entry-level T-Peos I plan to cover - the Rich200. Very similar performance to its sister earphone, the D200R, but with slightly different tuning. 
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A90) T-Peos Rich200*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Sep 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here


----------



## ld26

peter123 said:


> If you have an amp I'd recommend the Havi B3 Pro1, great soundstage width and best depth I've ever hears in an IEM.


 
  
 This seems like what I'm looking for. Unfortunately I don't have an amp. Not that I don't want to spend on a cheap amp. Since I need something for outdoor use (I have the HD558 plugged into my old Onkyo receiver for home use, and of course the MX985) , I don't like to carry an amp around with me.
  
 What would I lose out if I don't pair the Havi with an amp? Details, soundstage, or just volume?
  


ljokerl said:


> The Philips do indeed have pretty mediocre isolation, but definitely better than earbuds. They do fit the bill, though the bass is not weak by any means.


 
 How would you compare between the TX1, TX2, and S1? I read your reviews over at Inner Fidelity, but I'd like a quick summary if you don't mind. Are their soundstages of the same size and quality? I can use EQ to alter the sound to my liking, but I don't think I can do that to soundstage.


----------



## peter123

ld26 said:


> This seems like what I'm looking for. Unfortunately I don't have an amp. Not that I don't want to spend on a cheap amp. Since I need something for outdoor use (I have the HD558 plugged into my old Onkyo receiver for home use, and of course the MX985) , I don't like to carry an amp around with me.
> 
> *What would I lose out if I don't pair the Havi with an amp? Details, soundstage, or just volume?*
> 
> How would you compare between the TX1, TX2, and S1? I read your reviews over at Inner Fidelity, but I'd like a quick summary if you don't mind. Are their soundstages of the same size and quality? I can use EQ to alter the sound to my liking, but I don't think I can do that to soundstage.




Unfortunately you'll miss out on all of the things in bold without a amp. What source do you plan to use?

Tbh the B3's are superior to the TX2 in everything but bass quantity. The S2 (should sound more or less identical to the S1) is closer and it makes me think that the S1 would suit your needs better than the TX2.

The S2 are more balanced than the TX2 and also have a better soundstage.

Hope this helps.


----------



## ld26

peter123 said:


> Unfortunately you'll miss out on all of the things in bold without a amp. What source do you plan to use?
> 
> Tbh the B3's are superior to the TX2 in everything but bass quantity. The S2 (should sound more or less identical to the S1) is closer and it makes me think that the S1 would suit your needs better than the TX2.
> 
> ...


 
 I don't have a dedicated source. The audio straight out of my Moto G is decent enough for me.
  
 Will the B3's soundstage match those of the very best earbuds (like my MX985)?
  
 It's a shame the B3 seems like a perfect IEM for me, except for the amp requirement part. Maybe if the new B6 is even better, I'll consider getting it as well as an amp. I'll hold my breath till the B6 reviews 
  
 Thank you very much for your input. I appreciate.


----------



## ozkan

ld26 said:


> I don't have a dedicated source. The audio straight out of my Moto G is decent enough for me.
> 
> Will the B3's soundstage match those of the very best earbuds (like my MX985)?
> 
> ...




Moto G will not be enough to feed Havi B3. You'll need an amp for Havi but with an amp like Topping Nx1 it is truly amazing. Granted.


----------



## ljokerl

ld26 said:


> How would you compare between the TX1, TX2, and S1? I read your reviews over at Inner Fidelity, but I'd like a quick summary if you don't mind. Are their soundstages of the same size and quality? I can use EQ to alter the sound to my liking, but I don't think I can do that to soundstage.


 
  
 The S1 is less bassy and more balanced and refined; soundstage width is similar IMO but imaging is a little better with the Fidelios. Maybe a little harder to drive than the TX1/TX2, but it doesn't need an amp. Isolation is no better, unfortunately.


----------



## peter123

ozkan said:


> Moto G will not be enough to feed Havi B3. You'll need an amp for Havi but with an amp like Topping Nx1 it is truly amazing. Granted.




+1


----------



## Pastapipo

I find the isolation of the Philips S1 quite poor, so I never use them outdoors. The rest is magnificent, very balanced, little subbass hump.


----------



## Ellis

ljokerl said:


> That's the hallmark of decent-quality bass  . Glad you're enjoying them!



Indeed. Just trying to find the perfect tips now. I've been trying the included ones, and may pick up some Comply tips as well to try.


----------



## BlastAway

Dear joker, I am desperately in need of advise from you.

A few days ago I lost my beloved GR02 BE IEM. Loved the build quality and sound signature and really want that back. Which IEM would you advise me to replace it with?


----------



## ljokerl

blastaway said:


> Dear joker, I am desperately in need of advise from you.
> 
> A few days ago I lost my beloved GR02 BE IEM. Loved the build quality and sound signature and really want that back. Which IEM would you advise me to replace it with?


 
  
 If we’re talking about the same price point, another GR02BE is probably your best for similar sound. For a slightly more balanced tuning with better fidelity but still in a similar vein you also try VSonic’s VSD1S (~$50) or VSD3S (~$60). If you want to upgrade a little but with more bass-heavy sound you may consider the Brainwavz S1 or HiSound Wooduo2. Both are still v-shaped sounding and a little bassier than the GR02BE, but they retain the hallmarks of good clarity and properly extended bass. Higher-end than that, DN-1000 at ~$200.


----------



## BlastAway

ljokerl said:


> If we’re talking about the same price point, another GR02BE is probably your best for similar sound. For a slightly more balanced tuning with better fidelity but still in a similar vein you also try VSonic’s VSD1S (~$50) or VSD3S (~$60). If you want to upgrade a little but with more bass-heavy sound you may consider the Brainwavz S1 or HiSound Wooduo2. Both are still v-shaped sounding and a little bassier than the GR02BE, but they retain the hallmarks of good clarity and properly extended bass. Higher-end than that, DN-1000 at ~$200.



Thank you joker! 

Preferably I'd like to get another GR02BE but can't find any retailer still offering it. Would you perhaps know any website still offering it?

If not then at least I now know what to get as alternative. So again thank you for that joker!


----------



## ljokerl

blastaway said:


> Thank you joker!
> 
> Preferably I'd like to get another GR02BE but can't find any retailer still offering it. Would you perhaps know any website still offering it?
> 
> If not then at least I now know what to get as alternative. So again thank you for that joker!


 
  
Amazon still has them in stock. If you're outside the US, lendmeurears


----------



## Shawn71

blastaway said:


> Thank you joker!
> 
> Preferably I'd like to get another GR02BE but can't find any retailer still offering it. Would you perhaps know any website still offering it?
> 
> If not then at least I now know what to get as alternative. So again thank you for that joker!




lmue has it.....

 http://www.lendmeurears.com/gr02-bass-edition/


----------



## BlastAway

shawn71 said:


> lmue has it.....
> 
> http://www.lendmeurears.com/gr02-bass-edition/



Joker and Shawn thank you! Wasn't familiar with that website.

Googled my ass of here. Amazing, ordered it immediately.

Live in the Netherlands so this is perfect.


----------



## Blaalad12

Hi guys. Wondering if you can help me out  Iam currently looking into the fidue a83, dn 2000, and stage diver sd2. Iam not sure which would suit my taste if any though to be honest! I currently own tdk ba200 and iam not all that keen on them. They just sound a little boring to me but maybe ive just been spoiled by my full sized he 500s  Iam basically wanting something that would be considered an upgrade over the tdk ba200s . Something a bit more engaging , a nice oomph to the bass and great vocals. I appreciate a little treble extension also but i dont want the treble to be too bright as it can be a bit too much at high volume but rather smooth and crisp!
  
 Of the three iems i mentioned , I can get the dn 2000 the cheapest (€250) the fidue a83 is i think €270 and the stage diver sd2s are significantly more expensive at €360 which is a tad more then i want to spend but i would spend it if they were worth it


----------



## Hank_Venture

blaalad12 said:


> Hi guys. Wondering if you can help me out  Iam currently looking into the fidue a83, dn 2000, and stage diver sd2. Iam not sure which would suit my taste if any though to be honest! I currently own tdk ba200 and iam not all that keen on them. They just sound a little boring to me but maybe ive just been spoiled by my full sized he 500s  Iam basically wanting something that would be considered an upgrade over the tdk ba200s . Something a bit more engaging , a nice oomph to the bass and great vocals. I appreciate a little treble extension also but i dont want the treble to be too bright as it can be a bit too much at high volume but rather smooth and crisp!
> 
> Of the three iems i mentioned , I can get the dn 2000 the cheapest (€250) the fidue a83 is i think €270 and the stage diver sd2s are significantly more expensive at €360 which is a tad more then i want to spend but i would spend it if they were worth it


 
  
 I was a previous owner of the BA200 (My left side died out) and was actually a big fan, I thought they were a misfire when I initially purchased until I changed the tips to the Shure triple flange. I moved on to a JVC woodie pair but am actually receiving the Fidue A83 later today. I can give some impressions from what I remember of the BA200's at a later time. 
  
 The kicker for me these days is a removable cable, which I don't think the Dunu's have.


----------



## ozkan

blaalad12 said:


> Hi guys. Wondering if you can help me out  Iam currently looking into the fidue a83, dn 2000, and stage diver sd2. Iam not sure which would suit my taste if any though to be honest! I currently own tdk ba200 and iam not all that keen on them. They just sound a little boring to me but maybe ive just been spoiled by my full sized he 500s  Iam basically wanting something that would be considered an upgrade over the tdk ba200s . Something a bit more engaging , a nice oomph to the bass and great vocals. I appreciate a little treble extension also but i dont want the treble to be too bright as it can be a bit too much at high volume but rather smooth and crisp!
> 
> Of the three iems i mentioned , I can get the dn 2000 the cheapest (€250) the fidue a83 is i think €270 and the stage diver sd2s are significantly more expensive at €360 which is a tad more then i want to spend but i would spend it if they were worth it


 

Maybe IM50/70 for vocal godness.


----------



## ljokerl

blaalad12 said:


> Hi guys. Wondering if you can help me out  Iam currently looking into the fidue a83, dn 2000, and stage diver sd2. Iam not sure which would suit my taste if any though to be honest! I currently own tdk ba200 and iam not all that keen on them. They just sound a little boring to me but maybe ive just been spoiled by my full sized he 500s  Iam basically wanting something that would be considered an upgrade over the tdk ba200s . Something a bit more engaging , a nice oomph to the bass and great vocals. I appreciate a little treble extension also but i dont want the treble to be too bright as it can be a bit too much at high volume but rather smooth and crisp!
> 
> Of the three iems i mentioned , I can get the dn 2000 the cheapest (€250) the fidue a83 is i think €270 and the stage diver sd2s are significantly more expensive at €360 which is a tad more then i want to spend but i would spend it if they were worth it


 
  
 Out of those three, the SD-2 you can definitely forget about because it's pretty much a direct upgrade to the BA200 - similarly smooth, warm, not very colored sound. It's doubtful you will enjoy it. The DN-2000 is also tricky because it's a U-shaped earhone. It has a very nice subbass kick and fantastic clarity, but it also has moderately bright treble. The A83 would be my pick out of the three - not as accurate as BA200, but with a more lively sound that has some treble boost (still not as bright as DN-2000) and a bit of extra bass.


----------



## Blaalad12

ljokerl said:


>


 
 Cheers mate. Sounds like both are very similar , Given that the A83 has detachable cables and i like the look that little bit more i think iam leaning towards them  Lets hope i have made the right choice . If you have any other suggestions in around the same price as these but feel they would be even better then feel free to let me know


----------



## uncletim

I like my audio technica im03 a lot!


----------



## ljokerl

blaalad12 said:


> Cheers mate. Sounds like both are very similar , Given that the A83 has detachable cables and i like the look that little bit more i think iam leaning towards them  Lets hope i have made the right choice . If you have any other suggestions in around the same price as these but feel they would be even better then feel free to let me know


 
  
 The A83 is pretty unique at its price point. Enjoy!


----------



## SebsG

Just ordered an M6P, can't wait!


----------



## thug behram

Hey joker,

A while back I asked you for natural upgrade for DN-1000. You replied with dn-2000 and xba-h3. I've been interested in the h3 but I'm thinking of skipping it and go one step further. I find that I use my IEMs much more than full sized cans so I might as well upgrade a bit higher.

So I'm looking for:

- strong impactful bass
- v shaped
- sparkly treble but not sibilant
- spacious with large soundstage
- great detail and instrument separation

DN-1000 had most of these. But soundstage could be bigger and treble could be less sibilant and smoother.

So for max $500? Or is xba-h3 still the best?


----------



## ajs6269

thug behram said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> A while back I asked you for natural upgrade for DN-1000. You replied with dn-2000 and xba-h3. I've been interested in the h3 but I'm thinking of skipping it and go one step further. I find that I use my IEMs much more than full sized cans so I might as well upgrade a bit higher.
> 
> ...


I really like my noble 3 universals. They are $350.


----------



## ljokerl

thug behram said:


> Hey joker,
> 
> A while back I asked you for natural upgrade for DN-1000. You replied with dn-2000 and xba-h3. I've been interested in the h3 but I'm thinking of skipping it and go one step further. I find that I use my IEMs much more than full sized cans so I might as well upgrade a bit higher.
> 
> ...


 
  
 That sounds like the 1964-V3 to me, if you're interested in venturing into custom territory (though I think 1964ears might have universals as well now).
  
 The XBA-H3 is not really what I'd call v-shaped, though it fits the rest of the requirements pretty well. It just isn't very bright, but considering it's a universal and probably easy enough to return, worth trying before spending more IMO. The DN-2000 doesn't have the bass power of the XBA-H3 or even the DN-1000, which could be a deal breaker, but it is brighter than the H3 and a little smoother than the DN-1000.
  
 Not a lot of other higher-end earphones with signatures like these. Most are either less powerful at the low end than something like a DN-1000, not v-shaped, or not <$500 (K3003, Ultrasone IQ, Senn IE800).


----------



## ericr

My 1964 Ears V6-Stage is universal, so you would think they would do the same for a V3. Also, last I heard they gave a $25 discount code for universals if you contacted them before you order.


----------



## thug behram

ljokerl said:


> That sounds like the 1964-V3 to me, if you're interested in venturing into custom territory (though I think 1964ears might have universals as well now).
> 
> The XBA-H3 is not really what I'd call v-shaped, though it fits the rest of the requirements pretty well. It just isn't very bright, but considering it's a universal and probably easy enough to return, worth trying before spending more IMO. The DN-2000 doesn't have the bass power of the XBA-H3 or even the DN-1000, which could be a deal breaker, but it is brighter than the H3 and a little smoother than the DN-1000.
> 
> Not a lot of other higher-end earphones with signatures like these. Most are either less powerful at the low end than something like a DN-1000, not v-shaped, or not <$500 (K3003, Ultrasone IQ, Senn IE800).




V3 is mid forward, no? What about the Qi?

Xba-h3 isn't v-shaped? That's what the graphs look like. Also reviews keep bragging about the super tweeter.


----------



## Wilderbeast

Hi Joker,
  
 First of all - thank you for your IEM reviews. I've been using this thread as a resource since buying my first 'proper' earphones. I bought a pair of UM Miracles almost entirely on the strength of your review and have been enjoying them for over a year - I agree with every word of your praise for them.
  
 I would like to ask whether the JH13s are still your highest-regarded customs? Have you been listening to anything that has the potential to knock them off their perch in the near future?
  
 Thanks again for your excellent reviews.


----------



## ZapX629

Guys, I'm looking for an upgrade to the GR07 and GR07BE for ~$200 or less. Was waiting on the VSD7 but since it's unlikely to be released this year, I thought I'd ask around in here. I'd like to find something with equal or better SQ but with better imaging and deeper stage. Signature need not be one to one, but I prefer things with a natural tone, with good deep bass that is controlled and doesn't bleed, clear and present midrange, and treble that is detailed without being too harsh. Some things I've been considering are the DN-1000, Altone200, and CKR9. Are these good upgrades? Anything else I should look into?


----------



## Shawn71

My guess wld be a side grade for these kings under $200 tag,imho......


----------



## esteebin

Quote:


blastaway said:


> Joker and Shawn thank you! Wasn't familiar with that website.
> 
> Googled my ass of here. Amazing, ordered it immediately.
> 
> Live in the Netherlands so this is perfect.


 
  
  
 Just got an email from LMUE about some sales that ends OCT 12:
  
 Among them is VSonic GR02 BE for US$25.82/Euro20.50. Maybe contact them to see if they can refund the difference?


----------



## ljokerl

ericr said:


> My 1964 Ears V6-Stage is universal, so you would think they would do the same for a V3. Also, last I heard they gave a $25 discount code for universals if you contacted them before you order.


 
  
 Good to know!
  


thug behram said:


> V3 is mid forward, no? What about the Qi?
> 
> Xba-h3 isn't v-shaped? That's what the graphs look like. Also reviews keep bragging about the super tweeter.


 
  
 The V3 has strong mids but it has stronger bass and also some treble emphasis. It fits the v-shaped description better than the H3, which sounds fairly smooth to me. It’s really all a matter of degrees – if I was rating the hybrids on how v-shaped they sound I would probably say Unique Melody 3X (too v-shaped IMO) > DN-1000 > Altone200 > DN-2000 > H3, but then the H3 still has more of both bass and treble than something like a Shure SE535.
  
 Not sure what the Qi is but if you mean the Ultrasone, it's pretty v-shaped but requires some modding to reach peak performance. Hard to recommend over the V3 considering it's more expensive.
  


wilderbeast said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> First of all - thank you for your IEM reviews. I've been using this thread as a resource since buying my first 'proper' earphones. I bought a pair of UM Miracles almost entirely on the strength of your review and have been enjoying them for over a year - I agree with every word of your praise for them.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yes, I haven’t tried anything that has impressed me more than the JH13s yet. The best custom I have in review at the moment is the Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro, but it doesn’t look like it will best the JH13 (impressions coming in a week or so).
  


zapx629 said:


> Guys, I'm looking for an upgrade to the GR07 and GR07BE for ~$200 or less. Was waiting on the VSD7 but since it's unlikely to be released this year, I thought I'd ask around in here. I'd like to find something with equal or better SQ but with better imaging and deeper stage. Signature need not be one to one, but I prefer things with a natural tone, with good deep bass that is controlled and doesn't bleed, clear and present midrange, and treble that is detailed without being too harsh. Some things I've been considering are the DN-1000, Altone200, and CKR9. Are these good upgrades? Anything else I should look into?


 
  
 What *Shawn71 *said – in that price range with the GR07/GR07BE you’re really looking at a sidegrade with a different signature. The Altone200 and DN-1000 are both good if you want a more v-shaped sound than a GR07 (esp more bass) with similar overall performance. For me personally, the DN-1000 is a little too bassy and the Altone200 is a little too bright, so I still prefer the GR07 over them.


----------



## ZapX629

Alright, that actually helps a lot then. The GR07 is about as bright as I like my treble and the BE is about as big as I can handle my bass, so I guess I'm good in this price bracket. Thanks a lot for the info, Shawn and Joker.


----------



## vlenbo

zapx629 said:


> Alright, that actually helps a lot then. The GR07 is about as bright as I like my treble and the BE is about as big as I can handle my bass, so I guess I'm good in this price bracket. Thanks a lot for the info, Shawn and Joker.


 
 Also, the ckr9s are a mid forwarded in-ear, just like the ck10s. The treble may get hot for some, but it can also be lacking for others.
  
 For me, it almost hits the correct amount of quantity without being sibilant at all.
  
 And as you read, the imagery and the deepness of stage is what it actually has in its signature. The only way you can justify purchasing this in-ear or the other aforementioned ones is to, unfortunately, audition them.


----------



## ericr

*Quote: "Not sure what the Qi is ..."*

It's 1964 Ears' latest rendition of their Quad four driver CIEM.


----------



## ljokerl

ericr said:


> *Quote: "Not sure what the Qi is ..."*
> 
> It's 1964 Ears' latest rendition of their Quad four driver CIEM.


  

 Ah, got it.


----------



## martindagun

Looking at buying another pair of IEM's.
 Looking at spending $100-$150. Mainly listening at rock music, would like something with a bit more bass.
  
 Anyone have any good recommendations?


----------



## ZapX629

martindagun said:


> Looking at buying another pair of IEM's.
> Looking at spending $100-$150. Mainly listening at rock music, would like something with a bit more bass.
> 
> Anyone have any good recommendations?


 

 What do you have right now?
  
 In that area, my top preference is the GR07BE for rock music. RHA MA-750 and Yamaha EPH-100 are also good options if you want even more bass than that.


----------



## ljokerl

martindagun said:


> Looking at buying another pair of IEM's.
> Looking at spending $100-$150. Mainly listening at rock music, would like something with a bit more bass.
> 
> Anyone have any good recommendations?


 
  
  
 I guess that depends - a bit more bass than what?
  
 In that price range you can now get a GR07 Bass Edition, which will give you a pretty accurate sound with added bass. That would probably be my pick for something that's enhanced in the bass region for rock. Don't be fooled by the name, though, the GR07 BE is still far from a bass monster. If you want something that's actually pretty bassy, the RHA MA750 or Yamaha EPH-100 will do, but those have quite a lot of bass and actually don't have the best sound for rock for me.
  
 Edit: lol. I was 34 seconds late. What *ZapX629* said.


----------



## martindagun

zapx629 said:


> What do you have right now?
> 
> In that area, my top preference is the GR07BE for rock music. RHA MA-750 and Yamaha EPH-100 are also good options if you want even more bass than that.


 
 I have the Sennheiser CX300, so should be a big upgrade.
  
 Thanks for the replies.


----------



## yalper

ljokerl said:


> I guess that depends - a bit more bass than what?
> 
> In that price range you can now get a GR07 Bass Edition, which will give you a pretty accurate sound with added bass. That would probably be my pick for something that's enhanced in the bass region for rock. Don't be fooled by the name, though, the GR07 BE is still far from a bass monster. If you want something that's actually pretty bassy, the RHA MA750 or Yamaha EPH-100 will do, but those have quite a lot of bass and actually don't have the best sound for rock for me.
> 
> Edit: lol. I was 34 seconds late. What *ZapX629* said.


 
 Joker, head-fiers now able to read your mind, and type 34 secs faster than you LoL


----------



## ljokerl

martindagun said:


> I have the Sennheiser CX300, so should be a big upgrade.
> 
> Thanks for the replies.


 
  
 CX300 has a good amount of bass... if you want at least that quantity, the GR07 Bass Edition will probably be too lean. The other two should have enough, though.  
  


yalper said:


> Joker, head-fiers now able to read your mind, and type 34 secs faster than you LoL


 
  
 I'm happy to crowd-source all of my recommendations


----------



## Froggies

Hi, I am looking to get a pair of IEM, details as following:
 Music type: Instrumental, jazz, vocal
 Budget : up to $200
 Tried FAD Heaven II and I like it, any other suggestions? I was told of ATH-CKR9, TDK BA-200 and Havi B3 Pro1, any recommendations or better choices? Thanks


----------



## yalper

My best bet for $200 is 3 pairs of B3 Pro 1 if you have a good source,
 or B3 Pro 1 + Cayin C5 It's going to be about $240 then ..
  
 violin, sax, and vocals are phenomenal with B3 pro 1


----------



## vlenbo

yalper said:


> My best bet for $200 is 3 pairs of B3 Pro 1 if you have a good source,
> or B3 Pro 1 + Cayin C5 It's going to be about $240 then ..
> 
> violin, sax, and vocals are phenomenal with B3 pro 1



Or a ckr9 lol


----------



## Wokei

froggies said:


> Hi, I am looking to get a pair of IEM, details as following:
> Music type: Instrumental, jazz, vocal
> Budget : up to $200
> Tried FAD Heaven II and I like it, any other suggestions? I was told of ATH-CKR9, TDK BA-200 and Havi B3 Pro1, any recommendations or better choices? Thanks




HaviB3Pro1OldVersion...


----------



## HairyHeadMara

+1 on CKR9 especially now they are under $200 on Amazon JP


----------



## Carlsan

froggies said:


> Hi, I am looking to get a pair of IEM, details as following:
> Music type: Instrumental, jazz, vocal
> Budget : up to $200
> Tried FAD Heaven II and I like it, any other suggestions? I was told of ATH-CKR9, TDK BA-200 and Havi B3 Pro1, any recommendations or better choices? Thanks


 
  
 Owning all three I would go with the CKR9 myself, especially for instrumental and jazz, as it captures nice detail in the music.  Vocals are good as well.


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

froggies said:


> Hi, I am looking to get a pair of IEM, details as following:
> Music type: Instrumental, jazz, vocal
> Budget : up to $200
> Tried FAD Heaven II and I like it, any other suggestions? I was told of ATH-CKR9, TDK BA-200 and Havi B3 Pro1, any recommendations or better choices? Thanks


 
 If your budget is up to $200, I strongly suggest the ckr9s too. At that price nothing can beat it. If you like heaven ii, you'll like heaven vi more. And the ckr9s are at heaven vi level and even slightly better too.


----------



## ozkan

froggies said:


> Hi, I am looking to get a pair of IEM, details as following:
> Music type: Instrumental, jazz, vocal
> Budget : up to $200
> Tried FAD Heaven II and I like it, any other suggestions? I was told of ATH-CKR9, TDK BA-200 and Havi B3 Pro1, any recommendations or better choices? Thanks




I only haven't heard ckr9 from your list but I can recommend Havi B3 pro 1.


----------



## ljokerl

froggies said:


> Hi, I am looking to get a pair of IEM, details as following:
> Music type: Instrumental, jazz, vocal
> Budget : up to $200
> Tried FAD Heaven II and I like it, any other suggestions? I was told of ATH-CKR9, TDK BA-200 and Havi B3 Pro1, any recommendations or better choices? Thanks


 
  
 The BA200 is like a slightly warmer and noticeably smoother Heaven II. It's a good buy for jazz and vocal IMO.


----------



## Froggies

Thanks a lot guys,will read more about BA200 and CKR9


----------



## jailhouselounge

Hello, could someone help me decide between Sennheiser IE80 or Fidue A83 given that they are at about the same price. Which is technically "better" in your opinion? I listen to a wide variety of music o:


----------



## ljokerl

jailhouselounge said:


> Hello, could someone help me decide between Sennheiser IE80 or Fidue A83 given that they are at about the same price. Which is technically "better" in your opinion? I listen to a wide variety of music o:


 
  
 They're both good earphones - go for the IE80 if you prefer a bassier, warmer, smoother sound and the A83 if you'd rather have a more neutral, just a tad enhanced-bass sound with brighter treble. I'd probably consider the A83 more versatile overall.


----------



## Hank_Venture

jailhouselounge said:


> Hello, could someone help me decide between Sennheiser IE80 or Fidue A83 given that they are at about the same price. Which is technically "better" in your opinion? I listen to a wide variety of music o:


 
  
 I am a newer owner of the A83, I've loved it so far (Essentially replacing my FX-750 as a daily driver) as joker mentioned, it depends on the signature you're looking for. The cable on the Fidue is quite awesome by itself though.
  
 I also listen to a bunch of stuff and didn't want a one or two trick pony. Don't know how much the IE80 picks apart lesser quality tracks, the Fidue does a bit but not to an extent where it is an issue. The A83 (There is at least one mention of it) knows when to back off the bass on a track or when to pile it on.
  
 Source dependency and fit (The IE80 is likely a bit better for fit and isolation, due to the design) I have larger ear canals, so the Fidue wasn't an issue for me.


----------



## Froggies

Compared to TDK BA200 and Ath CKR9, how do FAD heaven IV perform, since the price is quite close? Thanks


----------



## blueangel2323

I auditioned the Westone 40 and UM30 Pro today and wasn't too impressed. The W40 was way too warm/dark in the mids, not enough deep bass, and treble was just a narrow spike. There also seemed to be a disconnect between the lower mids and treble (i.e. a dip in the upper mids/lower treble). The UM30 was a little better balanced except for also being too warm.
  
 I also heard the Shure 846 which sounded better. The stock sound signature still sounded a little off (but much less so than the Westone models) - after using EQ to decrease 400hz and bump up 14k it sounded quite decent.
  
 In all honesty, without any EQ, the Bose QC20i sounds better balanced than any of the above. It's far from perfect - peaks at around 3k and 6k, very little response above 10k, and the loss in resolution associated with double-amping and ANC - but pretty inoffensive overall, not disgustingly warm in the lower mids like most sets I've tried.
  
 My InEar SD-2 is pretty neutral, not overly warm, but the midrange is a bit honky due to a peak at around 3.5k.
  
 The search for the perfect IEM continues!


----------



## ljokerl

hank_venture said:


> I am a newer owner of the A83, I've loved it so far (Essentially replacing my FX-750 as a daily driver) as joker mentioned, it depends on the signature you're looking for. The cable on the Fidue is quite awesome by itself though.
> 
> I also listen to a bunch of stuff and didn't want a one or two trick pony. Don't know how much the IE80 picks apart lesser quality tracks, the Fidue does a bit but not to an extent where it is an issue. The A83 (There is at least one mention of it) knows when to back off the bass on a track or when to pile it on.
> 
> Source dependency and fit (The IE80 is likely a bit better for fit and isolation, due to the design) I have larger ear canals, so the Fidue wasn't an issue for me.


 
  
 The IE80 is pretty forgiving and the isolation is not that great. The A83 definitely holds its own on both counts.


----------



## pokenguyen

syedz2ez4 said:


> If your budget is up to $200, I strongly suggest the ckr9s too. At that price nothing can beat it. If you like heaven ii, you'll like heaven vi more. And the ckr9s are at heaven vi level and even slightly better too.


 
 Does CKR9 beats Havi B3 I in term of soundstage and imaging? I'm still amazed by how strange and 3D those Havi B3 Pro sound.


----------



## Exesteils

pokenguyen said:


> Does CKR9 beats Havi B3 I in term of soundstage and imaging? I'm still amazed by how strange and 3D those Havi B3 Pro sound.




Imaging is on par with the B3. Musically much better to my memory, treble was much better delivered, better extension in the bass too.


----------



## SyedZ2ez4

pokenguyen said:


> Does CKR9 beats Havi B3 I in term of soundstage and imaging? I'm still amazed by how strange and 3D those Havi B3 Pro sound.


 
 Yes like @Exesteils said the ckr9s has better musicality. For imaging they should be similar but both to me have very good separation. The ckrs are ahead with dynamics, bass,realism, more forward mids and vocals and better treble extension. But there is something that the B3s does better and that is the wideness in soundstage. On other hand the ckr9s istruments sounds nearer to you = more intimacy. So if you're really looking to have very wide ss then B3s should serve you well and its only 60$. But if you choose to spend around $200 then you cant go wrong with ckr9s either. To my preference I'd choose my ckr9s to dn1k and even dn2k any day.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a (not so brief) brief review of the VSonic VSD3S, Ostry KC06, and Havi B3 Pro I: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
  
 Great earphones - all three are going to get full reviews in due time.


----------



## altrunox

ljokerl said:


> Posted a (not so brief) brief review of the VSonic VSD3S, Ostry KC06, and Havi B3 Pro I: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
> 
> Great earphones - all three are going to get full reviews in due time.


 
  
 So, I have the VSD3S, B3 Pro1, SHE3570 (the same as the SHE3590), TTPOD T1-E(don`t know if you tried it already), Superlux HD681 Evo, AKG K518, had the Pistons 2.1... And my number one is the VSD3S, just love their sound signature.
 I don`t know if you know a lot of full-sizes headphones too but anyway...
  
 Gold question, Full-Size headphone with the VSD3S sound signature?


----------



## ZapX629

altrunox said:


> So, I have the VSD3S, B3 Pro1, SHE3570 (the same as the SHE3590), TTPOD T1-E(don`t know if you tried it already), Superlux HD681 Evo, AKG K518, had the Pistons 2.1... And my number one is the VSD3S, just love their sound signature.
> I don`t know if you know a lot of full-sizes headphones too but anyway...
> 
> Gold question, Full-Size headphone with the VSD3S sound signature?


 

 I found my Philips Citiscape Uptown to have a very similar sig, warm and detailed, but with a bit less bass and bigger soundstage.
  
  


ljokerl said:


> Posted a (not so brief) brief review of the VSonic VSD3S, Ostry KC06, and Havi B3 Pro I: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
> 
> Great earphones - all three are going to get full reviews in due time.


 
 Thanks for your efforts, as always. I haven't gotten my hands on the Havis, but I found your comparisons of the Ostry and the VSD3 to the GR07 spot on based on my own experiences.


----------



## 0b095

Hello
  
 Can you guys recommend me a 0-20$ headphone that has a mic. I will use it for pretty much everything except for listening to music. I prefer that I can find it on amazon.ca. Thank you!


----------



## ljokerl

altrunox said:


> So, I have the VSD3S, B3 Pro1, SHE3570 (the same as the SHE3590), TTPOD T1-E(don`t know if you tried it already), Superlux HD681 Evo, AKG K518, had the Pistons 2.1... And my number one is the VSD3S, just love their sound signature.
> I don`t know if you know a lot of full-sizes headphones too but anyway...
> 
> Gold question, Full-Size headphone with the VSD3S sound signature?


 
  
 Haven't heard a lot of full-size cans lately unless you consider the HiFiMan HE-560, which has fantastic deep bass and clarity 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
  


zapx629 said:


> Thanks for your efforts, as always. I haven't gotten my hands on the Havis, but I found your comparisons of the Ostry and the VSD3 to the GR07 spot on based on my own experiences.


 
  




  


0b095 said:


> Hello
> 
> Can you guys recommend me a 0-20$ headphone that has a mic. I will use it for pretty much everything except for listening to music. I prefer that I can find it on amazon.ca. Thank you!


 
  
 That's not much of a budget. Not sure about pricing Amazon.ca but I'd look into the Philips SHE3585 or SHE3595, JVC HA-FR201, Ultimate Ears 350vi/350vm, or maybe MEElectronics M6P or M9P. Here they can all be had for $25 or less with mic.


----------



## B9Scrambler

What about the Panasonic TCM125? IMO they one up the HJE120s in everything ('cept build quality...only slightly better) and also come with a mic. Despite a very similar design they seem to seal a million times better too. They do sit right at the 20 dollar mark, at least here in Ontario. Probably cheaper online.


----------



## Shawn71

ljokerl said:


> Posted a (not so brief) brief review of the VSonic VSD3S, Ostry KC06, and Havi B3 Pro I: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
> 
> Great earphones - all three are going to get full reviews in due time.




This is not a simple task to listen to and make a comparo of these 3 most well received IEMs (here @head-fi) themselves and with other IEMs as well,all @ one time.......but this is a pleasant surprise I wld say.....

And this aint brief either but detailed rather,imo.....as the write-up covered almost everything like build,accessories,price,links etc besides their sound....

And finally glad to see 3S has a bar raised among these 3....


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Posted a (not so brief) brief review of the VSonic VSD3S, Ostry KC06, and Havi B3 Pro I: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
> 
> Great earphones - all three are going to get full reviews in due time.


 

 can you do the vsd1 first ? please !!


----------



## ljokerl

shawn71 said:


> This is not a simple task to listen to and make a comparo of these 3 most well received IEMs (here @head-fi) themselves and with other IEMs as well,all @ one time.......but this is a pleasant surprise I wld say.....
> 
> And this aint brief either but detailed rather,imo.....as the write-up covered almost everything like build,accessories,price,links etc besides their sound....
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, it was GOING to be brief as I just wanted to get something up about them. Then I decided to anticipate some of the potential questions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


suman134 said:


> can you do the vsd1 first ? please !!


 
  
 Good point. That would make sense, wouldn't it


----------



## tan1415

Hi joker,
  
 Which would be better buy.
 Gr07 classic 60$ or a GR06 32$


----------



## ljokerl

tan1415 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> Which would be better buy.
> Gr07 classic 60$ or a GR06 32$


 
  
 I'd go with the GR07.


----------



## suman134

tan1415 said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> Which would be better buy.
> Gr07 classic 60$ or a GR06 32$


 
  
   me too , gr07 any day .


----------



## waynes world

ljokerl said:


> Posted a (not so brief) brief review of the VSonic VSD3S, Ostry KC06, and Havi B3 Pro I: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
> 
> Great earphones - all three are going to get full reviews in due time.




Thanks, that was great! And maybe you'll be able to throw in the kc06a's into the mix some day (I've heard lots of good stuff about them also).


----------



## ozkan

ljokerl said:


> Posted a (not so brief) brief review of the VSonic VSD3S, Ostry KC06, and Havi B3 Pro I: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
> 
> Great earphones - all three are going to get full reviews in due time.


 
  
 I hope you can throw ATH-IM50 into the mix one day.


----------



## Hoplite

No sennheiser cx-985? Maybe momentum iem as well


----------



## ljokerl

waynes world said:


> Thanks, that was great! And maybe you'll be able to throw in the kc06a's into the mix some day (I've heard lots of good stuff about them also).


 
  
 Seems like the next round should be KC06A / Havi B6 / VSD5S 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


ozkan said:


> I hope you can throw ATH-IM50 into the mix one day.


 
  
 Hope so too!
  


hoplite said:


> No sennheiser cx-985? Maybe momentum iem as well


 
  
 I should be able to add the Momentum shortly.


----------



## kova4a

ljokerl said:


> Seems like the next round should be KC06A / Havi B6 / VSD5*S*


 
 There won't be two versions of the vsd5 - only one, so no S this time


----------



## Hisoundfi

Hello to the infamous ljokerl, I'm a long time reader, first time poster on your famous thread. 

The budget fi world is in need of your golden ears in regards to the Sidy dgs100. It's a two way hybrid that is receiving mixed reviews. 

Some like it hot, some like it cold, some like it in a pot three weeks old... 

I am willing to send you my extra pair of them to you if you could once and for all settle this lol. 

IMHO, comparing them to my best gear (dnk, h3, altone200, gr07be, Havi, ect) I prefer the warm yet still very detailed and transparent signature over everything I have. Others say they are hearing bass bloat. I would like to hear your take on them, possibly willing to send you one of my pairs. 

If interested, pm me. 

Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

kova4a said:


> There won't be two versions of the vsd5 - only one, so no S this time


 
  
 Whoops, noted!
  


hisoundfi said:


> Hello to the infamous @ljokerl, I'm a long time reader, first time poster on your famous thread.
> 
> The budget fi world is in need of your golden ears in regards to the Sidy dgs100. It's a two way hybrid that is receiving mixed reviews.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Didn't realize I was *in*famous 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 I've never heard of this brand. Pretty filled up right now on stuff to review, but I'll keep them in mind. Thanks!


----------



## vlenbo

ljokerl said:


> Whoops, noted!
> 
> 
> Didn't realize I was infamous
> ...


 
 Thought it was just me who noticed that, lol.
  
  
 Must be your picky ears. Everyone shall now tremble at the fact that you will rate the other budget in-ears in overall sound at a 7.0/10. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (Which is highly unlikely, lol.)


----------



## Hisoundfi

ljokerl said:


> Whoops, noted!
> 
> 
> Didn't realize I was *in*famous :evil:
> ...


whoops, typo, darn auto correct! 

Sorry dude, you're not evil lol


----------



## Shawn71

vlenbo said:


> Thought it was just me who noticed that, lol.




No there are many like us lol......and btw,I split the word and read as "in famous"....he is in famous....lol


----------



## vlenbo

shawn71 said:


> No there are many like us lol......and btw,I split the word and read as "in famous"....he is in famous....lol


 
 I cannot deny that, then we are all in the fame.


----------



## ia1234

Which are more durable in your opinion, Hifiman RE-400 or Astrotec AX35? I'm currently considering new IEM and those are the main options right now. Does the RE-400 sound a lot better? They are significantly more expensive, and I wonder how much better they are. Please note I will be using them with Samsung Note 3 smartphone.


----------



## ljokerl

ia1234 said:


> Which are more durable in your opinion, Hifiman RE-400 or Astrotec AX35? I'm currently considering new IEM and those are the main options right now. Does the RE-400 sound a lot better? They are significantly more expensive, and I wonder how much better they are. Please note I will be using them with Samsung Note 3 smartphone.


 
  
 The AX35 should be more durable but they sound very different from the RE-400 - the RE-400 is much more balanced, with very level bass and extremely smooth treble. The AX35 has more bass punch, thinner and less strong mids, and brighter, harsher treble.


----------



## knives

How would you rate the Fidue A81 in sound quality? Do you believe they are at least on par with GR07BE?


----------



## suman134

knives said:


> How would you rate the Fidue A81 in sound quality? Do you believe they are at least on par with GR07BE?


 

  i might not the you asked , but , i think A81 are close , bit bassy and less energetic highs but awesome sound stage like R3 . i might like these over Gr07 because of the removable cable .


----------



## ljokerl

knives said:


> How would you rate the Fidue A81 in sound quality? Do you believe they are at least on par with GR07BE?


 
  
 I don't think they are - just not clear enough. On-par with Brainwavz R3, maybe, but they're also like 2x the price 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## blueangel2323

Joker, have you ever heard an IEM that's emphasized in the deep bass but is lean/dry (not warm) in the lower mids?


----------



## ozkan

blueangel2323 said:


> Joker, have you ever heard an IEM that's emphasized in the deep bass but is lean/dry (not warm) in the lower mids?


 
 I've heard one and it is Logitech UE600.


----------



## MikonJuice

Is the any iem that have the airness of the GR07, with the Dunu dk1000 soud signature?
 Maybe a more agressive treble then those two?
 Altone 200 would fit that description?

 Or I'll only find it in a plus $200 iem?


----------



## ljokerl

blueangel2323 said:


> Joker, have you ever heard an IEM that's emphasized in the deep bass but is lean/dry (not warm) in the lower mids?


 
  
 Interesting question. There definitely are a couple - three that come to mind are the T-Peos H-100, JVC HA-FXD80, and Dunu DN-2000. 
  


mikonjuice said:


> Is the any iem that have the airness of the GR07, with the Dunu dk1000 soud signature?
> Maybe a more agressive treble then those two?
> Altone 200 would fit that description?
> 
> Or I'll only find it in a plus $200 iem?


 
  
 DN-2000 would be my pick but it differs from the DN-1000 here and there. I compared them a little here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/ . The DN-2000 is still a significantly better match for the DN-1000's signature than the Altone200.


----------



## vwinter

blueangel2323 said:


> Joker, have you ever heard an IEM that's emphasized in the deep bass but is lean/dry (not warm) in the lower mids?




Not joker but that sounds like the Sennheiser IE800 might be worth a look.

You can also try your luck with the Zero Audio Tenore on the significantly cheaper side which might roll that way, but you never know with that one =(


----------



## suman134

vwinter said:


> Not joker but that sounds like the Sennheiser IE800 might be worth a look.
> 
> You can also try your luck with the Zero Audio Tenore on the significantly cheaper side which might roll that way, but you never know with that one =(


 
  
  in tenores bass is good but too little to consider it for bass at all , and sound stage is not good . re-400 has better sound stage .


----------



## vwinter

suman134 said:


> in tenores bass is good but too little to consider it for bass at all , and sound stage is not good . re-400 has better sound stage .




The problem is the production differences in the tenores. You can get a bass heavier one like I did, with a 6-8dB subbass boost, or you can get a relatively more neutral one.

I would argue that Tenore has just ok quality bass with great extension and a fine soundstage. The imaging within the soundstage on the other hand is meh and pretty flat and so are the dynamics.

Re-400 also probably has less bass than half the tenores  an definitely has no chance at a subbass emphasis, especially in comparison.


----------



## suman134

vwinter said:


> The problem is the production differences in the tenores. You can get a bass heavier one like I did, with a 6-8dB subbass boost, or you can get a relatively more neutral one.
> 
> I would argue that Tenore has just ok quality bass with great extension and a fine soundstage. The imaging within the soundstage on the other hand is meh and pretty flat and so are the dynamics.
> 
> ...


 

 i dont know about the differences but my tenore is bass light , liter than er-4p , and yes , re-400 dont have much sub bass but its good with extension and sound stage is commanding too .
  it seems like zero audio has some serious production issues .
 but for $50 these are good .


----------



## jamor

I hope you get to do an early review of the t10i joker.  would be interested to see if it's on par with the dunu dn-1000 or not.


----------



## ljokerl

jamor said:


> I hope you get to do an early review of the t10i joker.  would be interested to see if it's on par with the dunu dn-1000 or not.


 
  
 I do have one and it's not a DN-1000 competitor. So far it's sounding very warm and bassy on all of the tunings. Not a bad thing in itself - plenty of people like warm and bassy - but that also means the MA750 is a better match for the DN-1000 than the T10i is.


----------



## Retrias

suman134 said:


> in tenores bass is good but too little to consider it for bass at all , and sound stage is not good . re-400 has better sound stage .



might be interested in the doppios then


----------



## jamor

ljokerl said:


> I do have one and it's not a DN-1000 competitor. So far it's sounding very warm and bassy on all of the tunings. Not a bad thing in itself - plenty of people like warm and bassy - but that also means the MA750 is a better match for the DN-1000 than the T10i is.


 
  
 Oh nice!  I've had Klipsch S4s for several years now and ATH-M50s for less. The m50s are fine but Im looking to upgrade my IEM listening experience.  I was deciding on whether to get the DN-1000 now or wait for the T10i since they were the same price point and are potentially sleep-able (although this isn't important), but now it looks like they are very different.  I listen to variations of electronic (mostly this), jazz, classic rock, progressive bluegrass/jam.  I know you've said that dn-1000 aren't the best for jazz, but that is not my primary genre.  
  
 What do you think I would be happier with in terms of overall sound quality?


----------



## suman134

retrias said:


> might be interested in the doppios then


 
  
   i investigated into it and yes there are defective or different sounding teneros in the market and it can be that mine is defective too .


----------



## blueangel2323

ozkan said:


> I've heard one and it is Logitech UE600.


 
 Are you sure? The UE600 is rather mid-centric and very neutral in the bass.
  


ljokerl said:


> Interesting question. There definitely are a couple - three that come to mind are the T-Peos H-100, JVC HA-FXD80, and Dunu DN-2000.


 
  
 Thanks, I'll look into them. Unfortunately, warm and bassy is a very common sound signature, but not otherwise neutral with deep bass emphasis.
  


vwinter said:


> Not joker but that sounds like the Sennheiser IE800 might be worth a look.
> 
> You can also try your luck with the Zero Audio Tenore on the significantly cheaper side which might roll that way, but you never know with that one =(


 
 I did audition the IE800 and was reasonably impressed... notwithstanding the cost. The lower treble dip is a bit too pronounced though, and the rest of the treble a little too prominent in comparison, so it sounds rather off in the upper registers. Bass and mids sound excellent though.
  
 If quality control on the Tenore is that bad, I wouldn't want to take the risk....


----------



## ALuckyChance

Joker, I noticed that the JVC HA-FXD80 are about $50 on Amazon at the moment. They're rated pretty high sound-wise on your review list. Are they the best in that 40-60 dollar price range in sound quality, or you do prefer others?


----------



## Dynamoes1

Hey Joker,

You ranked the RHA MA750 as an 8.9 in sound and the Shure SE215 an 8. Yet, on theheadphonelist (on the SE215's review comments), you mentioned that the MA750 can't be seen as a straight upgrade to the SE215's.

Is the difference that massive in sound?


----------



## ljokerl

aluckychance said:


> Joker, I noticed that the JVC HA-FXD80 are about $50 on Amazon at the moment. They're rated pretty high sound-wise on your review list. Are they the best in that 40-60 dollar price range in sound quality, or you do prefer others?


 
  
 If you're asking about my personal preference, the FXD80 is not really my signature. It's too withdrawn in the lower midrange and not warm enough tonally. If I listened to more EDM type music it might be my favorite as it's really good for that, but I'd personally rather listen to a VSonic VSD3S, UE600, Ostry KC06, Sony MH1C, etc. 
  


dynamoes1 said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> You ranked the RHA MA750 as an 8.9 in sound and the Shure SE215 an 8. Yet, on theheadphonelist (on the SE215's review comments), you mentioned that the MA750 can't be seen as a straight upgrade to the SE215's.
> 
> Is the difference that massive in sound?


 
  
 The sound signatures are somewhat different - the SE215 is quite smooth and not THAT bassy whereas the MA750 is more v-shaped with somewhat laid-back mids and a little more upper midrange/lower treble presence. In order to call something a straight shot from the SE215 it would have to have the same sound sig.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Brainwavz R3 (rev.2)
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2B27) Brainwavz R3 (ver.2)*
> 
> 
> Reviewed September 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## Gandasaputra

I'm drooled with DN-2000 as I want to taste the spacious soundstage you described. But I'm having a dilemma of getting JVC's FX-750 as well because I have FXD80 and FXT90 and find the signature (V-shaped, no harshness nor sibilant in upper treble like cymbals and "tss" sound) matches my taste. How bright is the DN-2000? I just hope it isn't brighter than FXT-90 or GR07 or Westone W4 as I find their treble is at my limit.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the VSonic GR07 Classic to my IEM Buyer's Guide in place of the regular GR07. No point in overpaying. 
  


gandasaputra said:


> I'm drooled with DN-2000 as I want to taste the spacious soundstage you described. But I'm having a dilemma of getting JVC's FX-750 as well because I have FXD80 and FXT90 and find the signature (V-shaped, no harshness nor sibilant in upper treble like cymbals and "tss" sound) matches my taste. How bright is the DN-2000? I just hope it isn't brighter than FXT-90 or GR07 or Westone W4 as I find their treble is at my limit.


 
  
 No, not really brighter than GR07 overall but the treble emphasis is different in nature - with the GR07 the treble peaks come in lower down, which tends to make it a little unforgiving in terms of sibilance. The DN-2000 has its treble boost higher up (together with the subbass boost I guess that makes it "U"-shaped rather than V-shaped). I don't find the DN-2000 more fatiguing than the FXT90 or GR07 but that's because lower treble peaks generally bother me more. If you've tried a good TWFK-based earphone before (like an Audio-Technica CK10 or VSonic VC1000 or something) you'll have a pretty good idea of what to expect with the top end of the DN-2000.
  
 The FX750 is a lot warmer and bassier than the DN-2000, and plays it more "safe" in terms of treble.


----------



## Spartoi

Anyone have experience with the MDR-XB90EX and GR07 BE or EPH 100? Would the GR07 BE/EPH 100 be a worthy upgrade over the XB90EX? I have XB90EX but I don't like the way it fits so I'm looking at substitutes/better options.


----------



## ThickT

I've owned both, still have the gr07be. Their sound signatures are quite different to me and I would consider the gr07BE a nice upgrade regardless of the very obvious reduction in sub bass response compared to the xb90ex. 

The gr07be is a truly great phone for lots of genres and sounds great from sub bass to the treble. I will say though, once you've sampled the bass from the xb90ex, it will always beckon you. Even with my clear preference for the gr07be over the xb90ex, I still miss them. That bass head in me was blown away with the xb90ex...


----------



## trinilove

hello joker..i have the mh1c and the re400 for quite a while now and im on a lookout for a new phone.,i woud like to try the hybrids though..is there a phone that has the mids and highs of the RE 400 with a little more bass and not too distant from the listener like the MH1C?..thanks in advance


----------



## B9Scrambler

gandasaputra said:


> I'm drooled with DN-2000 as I want to taste the spacious soundstage you described. But I'm having a dilemma of getting JVC's FX-750 as well because I have FXD80 and FXT90 and find the signature (V-shaped, no harshness nor sibilant in upper treble like cymbals and "tss" sound) matches my taste. How bright is the DN-2000? I just hope it isn't brighter than FXT-90 or GR07 or Westone W4 as I find their treble is at my limit.




You don't get the rest sound with t's and s's on your T90s? That's the only thing I dislike about the two pairs I have. Could be my source....hope its my source, because otherwise they are such a great IEM. With a bit of minor eq, I find the FRD60 to be a nice upgrade/sidestep. Similar in every way, but a bit brighter and no tsssting.


----------



## ThickT

Yes I agree, my pair of fxt90's are also a little splashy in the upper mids/highs.


----------



## Gandasaputra

b9scrambler said:


> You don't get the rest sound with t's and s's on your T90s? That's the only thing I dislike about the two pairs I have. Could be my source....hope its my source, because otherwise they are such a great IEM. With a bit of minor eq, I find the FRD60 to be a nice upgrade/sidestep. Similar in every way, but a bit brighter and no tsssting.


 
 I use Sansa clip zip for the source, nothing else not even EQing. The T90 is bright in nature but it doesn't exhibit splashy cymbal sounds nor "T's" sound. Instead guitar sound is more emphasized, giving more exciting sound without tasting the sharp-painful cymbal sound but fatigues at same time if I cranked the volume up.
  
 If you're asking about splashy sound, the FXD80 is the example yet it's opposite to the FXT90 though (emphasized "Ts-tststs" but not so sharp and darn recessed cold midrange but better bass rumble). I guess my FXT90 had been burned for so long so the treble got tamed.


----------



## B9Scrambler

gandasaputra said:


> I use Sansa clip zip for the source, nothing else not even EQing. The T90 is bright in nature but it doesn't exhibit splashy cymbal sounds nor "T's" sound. Instead guitar sound is more emphasized, giving more exciting sound without tasting the sharp-painful cymbal sound but fatigues at same time if I cranked the volume up.
> 
> If you're asking about splashy sound, the FXD80 is the example yet it's opposite to the FXT90 though (emphasized "Ts-tststs" but not so sharp and darn recessed cold midrange but better bass rumble). I guess my FXT90 had been burned for so long so the treble got tamed.




I use a Nexus S (warm and bassy) and MotoG (cold and bright). The T90s definitely sound better out of the Nexus but even with eq I get that harsh edge on the treble  Oh well...I still love them. That's why I bought two  woot! Them and the FRD60 kick arse.


----------



## Gandasaputra

b9scrambler said:


> I use a Nexus S (warm and bassy) and MotoG (cold and bright). The T90s definitely sound better out of the Nexus but even with eq I get that harsh edge on the treble
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Yup I forgot to mention that edgy treble of the FXT90 but still I'm still loving it too...! FXT90 is the reason I'm loving JVC. Oh, I just plugged it to my Samsung S5 and holy crap, it's *darn great*; warmer, more pronounced bass, more spacious, slight less edgy, noticable separation than when its plugged onto the clip zip and that's without EQing. I gotta start using Samsung from now...maybe i should check on myself.


----------



## B9Scrambler

gandasaputra said:


> Yup I forgot to mention that edgy treble of the FXT90 but still I'm still loving it too...! FXT90 is the reason I'm loving JVC. Oh, I just plugged it to my Samsung S5 and holy crap, it's *darn great*; warm, more pronounced bass and better soundstage (less edgy IMO) and that's without EQing. I gotta start using Samsung from now...




I love the edgy treble too...hence why I have the T90, 1X, 3X, FRD60, FR201, S600, Riptidz...I like JVC...heh.


----------



## ljokerl

If anyone is interested in DIY impressions for custom IEMs, posted a brief article on the subject (written together with average_joe) here: http://theheadphonelist.com/ear-self-impressions-for-custom-in-ear-monitors-what-you-need-to-know/ 
  


trinilove said:


> hello joker..i have the mh1c and the re400 for quite a while now and im on a lookout for a new phone.,i woud like to try the hybrids though..is there a phone that has the mids and highs of the RE 400 with a little more bass and not too distant from the listener like the MH1C?..thanks in advance


 
  
 The hybrids I've tried tend to be a little v-shaped in response, often with brighter treble, which is not at all like the RE-400. The smoothest ones I've tried are the Sony XBA-H3 and Fidue A83. The A83 is closer to "RE-400 with more bass" (whereas the H3 is more like RE-400 with A LOT more bass). Presentation-wise they are both not as forward/intimate as the RE-400. I guess the A83 is probably better for what you're after than the H3.


----------



## kaixax555

trinilove said:


> hello joker..i have the mh1c and the re400 for quite a while now and im on a lookout for a new phone.,i woud like to try the hybrids though..is there a phone that has the mids and highs of the RE 400 with a little more bass and not too distant from the listener like the MH1C?..thanks in advance




I think the VSonic GR07 or TDK BA200 fits the bill well


----------



## ljokerl

kaixax555 said:


> I think the VSonic GR07 or TDK BA200 fits the bill well


 
  
 Not the hybrid part


----------



## Zenbun

Can you add the TTPOD T1-E please?


----------



## ljokerl

zenbun said:


> Can you add the TTPOD T1-E please?


 
  
 Might get a brief go with one pretty soon.


----------



## ia1234

Hey joker, I decided to get vsonic vsd3/s. Can you please tell me what are the differences between the two models? Some sort of head-to-head comparison would be great.


----------



## 1clearhead

hisoundfi said:


> whoops, typo, darn auto correct!
> 
> Sorry dude, you're not evil lol


 
  
 +1 .....I hope you get a chance to review the *Sidy DGS100*. This company is gaining a good reputation. I think they broke the standard of too bright, no mid-bass sound signature emphysis on hybrid technology and deserves a chance to be reviewed. And, who better qualified than you. I'm with 'Hisoundfi', and hope you give them a chance for review.
  
 We consider you the best ears in this field. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 We think you're evilly good!


----------



## ljokerl

ia1234 said:


> Hey joker, I decided to get vsonic vsd3/s. Can you please tell me what are the differences between the two models? Some sort of head-to-head comparison would be great.


 
  
 I don't have the VSD3, only the VSD3S. If my experience with the VSD1/VSD1S applies, the difference between them will be nearly impossible to tell unless you get both an A:B them extensively. 
  


1clearhead said:


> +1 .....I hope you get a chance to review the *Sidy DGS100*. This company is gaining a good reputation. I think they broke the standard of too bright, no mid-bass sound signature emphysis on hybrid technology and deserves a chance to be reviewed. And, who better qualified than you. I'm with 'Hisoundfi', and hope you give them a chance for review.
> 
> We consider you the best ears in this field.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I think I am getting some Sidy models but not sure which. I'm not managing to keep up with all of the Chinese brands anymore. There's like 5 new ones this week.


----------



## 1clearhead

ljokerl said:


> I don't have the VSD3, only the VSD3S. If my experience with the VSD1/VSD1S applies, the difference between them will be nearly impossible to tell unless you get both an A:B them extensively.
> 
> 
> I think I am getting some Sidy models but not sure which. I'm not managing to keep up with all of the Chinese brands anymore. There's like 5 new ones this week.


 
  
 It's true. It's so hard to keep up with them.
  
 As always excellent work!
  
 .....On another note: Hey? Your thread is about to hit 1000 comments!
 Congrats, in advance!


----------



## kova4a

1clearhead said:


> It's true. It's so hard to keep up with them.
> 
> As always excellent work!
> 
> ...


 
 More like 1000 pages, which is like 15k comments.


----------



## 1clearhead

kova4a said:


> More like 1000 pages, which is like 15k comments.


 
  
 I stand corrected.....pages it is!
  
 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

At least 2k of those comments are mine, probably more. That's a lot of hot air


----------



## Zenbun

ljokerl said:


> At least 2k of those comments are mine, probably more. That's a lot of hot air


 
 IEM GOD


----------



## DisCHORDDubstep

Are you planning to review any of the Knowledge Zenith IEM's by chance? 

http://www.mp4nation.net/knowledge-zenith-r3-linear-hifi-fever-iem-earphones 

http://www.mp4nation.net/knowledge-zenith-ed-special-edition-iem-professional-earphones


----------



## ljokerl

dischorddubstep said:


> Are you planning to review any of the Knowledge Zenith IEM's by chance?
> 
> http://www.mp4nation.net/knowledge-zenith-r3-linear-hifi-fever-iem-earphones
> 
> http://www.mp4nation.net/knowledge-zenith-ed-special-edition-iem-professional-earphones


 
  
 No plans to try these right now.


----------



## jamor

i picked up the MA-750i for $80 new


----------



## ljokerl

Posted a brief review of the Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro and Pro 330v2 models here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-custom-art-harmony-8-pro-pro-330-v2/ . Full write-ups to come later.


----------



## T.R.A.N.C.E.

ljokerl said:


> Posted a brief review of the Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro and Pro 330v2 models here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-custom-art-harmony-8-pro-pro-330-v2/ . Full write-ups to come later.


 
  
 Been waiting for the Harmony 8 Pro impressions! Its a shame there has been no comparisons between Harmony 8 and Harmony 8 Pro.
  
A comparison to the NT-6 would be nice, as both are treble extended. And a comparison to the only other silicone flagship, SE-5 Way would be good.


----------



## ljokerl

t.r.a.n.c.e. said:


> Been waiting for the Harmony 8 Pro impressions! Its a shame there has been no comparisons between Harmony 8 and Harmony 8 Pro.
> 
> A comparison to the NT-6 would be nice, as both are treble extended. And a comparison to the only other silicone flagship, SE-5 Way would be good.


 
  
 Don't have an SE 5-way but I'll definitely include an NT6 comparo in the final write-up. It has a brighter sound for sure - the Harmony 8 Pro is more neutral, like a UM Miracle.


----------



## sevendeuce72

I just wanted to say, I don't think I've ever seen a thread as dedicated as this. Thank you so much |joker|! You've helped me out big time.


----------



## DisCHORDDubstep

ljokerl said:


> No plans to try these right now.


ah well... They are the current big hype train in Chinese IEM's. Reviewers of them have said the piston 2 isn't as good as the KZ ED special edition. In fact, the KZ Hype train replaced the piston 2.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> Interesting question. There definitely are a couple - three that come to mind are the T-Peos H-100, JVC HA-FXD80, and Dunu DN-2000.
> 
> 
> DN-2000 would be my pick but it differs from the DN-1000 here and there. I compared them a little here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/ . The DN-2000 is still a significantly better match for the DN-1000's signature than the Altone200.


 
  
 Hi joker,
  
 Picking up on a response that you made last week to an inquiry from another poster about an IEM that emphasized deep bass but has drier (not warm) mids, I have a somewhat related question. 
  
 I recently picked up the Dunu DN-1000, and it's definitely come the closest yet to meeting what I am looking for in an IEM.  In particular, I like that the deep bass doesn't roll off excessively like a lot of midrange-focused IEMs, yet the mid-bass is also not overly warm and does not bleed too significantly into the other parts of the spectrum and throw a veil over everything.  I like that the mids are clear and clean, yet when deep bass is required in a particular track, it is there.  But my biggest complaint about the Dunu's are the highs.  They are often just a tad too sharp for my tastes.  Just a bit, though.  They're not nearly as bad in that department as others that I've tried (e.g., JVC HA-FXT90).  Tip and spacer rolling help (man are the Dunu's diverse!), and some combos get me to about 80+% of what I'm looking for, but none get it exactly right for my tastes.
  
 As an interesting contrast, I like the Hifiman RE-400's, but for certain recordings that require a deep bass presence, the RE-400's just don't cut it, and the mids are warm such that some days I desire more clarity.  I think the Dunu's do both clarity and bass better than the Hifiman's.
  
 So, my question to you: Is there an IEM that retails for $200 or less that basically has the sound characteristics of the Dunu DN-1000 with a bit less sharpness in the highs?  Most "neutral" headphones that I've listened to seem to roll off the deep bass, which I don't like.  If there are tones found in that region of the spectrum, I don't want them to be tapered.  I also like that despite being slightly v-shaped, the Dunu's deep bass never intrudes on the other parts of the spectrum, and the mids do not seem overly recessed or hollowed-out like some other v-shaped IEMs that I've heard.  But I don't mind a bit more tapering in the highs than what the Dunu offers.  I guess to sum it up, I'm looking for something that does not roll off the sub-bass frequencies, that is generally neutral and clear (i.e., not too warm) through the mid-bass and midrange, and that has good treble presence but slightly smoother than what the Dunu offers up top (so, I guess _slightly_ less than neutral in the highs).
  
 Anything come to mind?  Thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

sevendeuce72 said:


> I just wanted to say, I don't think I've ever seen a thread as dedicated as this. Thank you so much |joker|! You've helped me out big time.


 
  
 Glad the thread has been useful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


steelglam said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> Picking up on a response that you made last week to an inquiry from another poster about an IEM that emphasized deep bass but has drier (not warm) mids, I have a somewhat related question.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Your question certainly makes sense but considering the DN-1000 is one of the best sets I've tried in the sub-$200 and what you're looking for would be an upgrade, it's a tough ask.
  
 The closest I can think of to an IEM that has the bottom half of the DN-1000's sound but with smoother highs, and yet maintains very good clarity (maybe just a bit behind the Dunu) is the Sony XBA-H3, and the lowest I've seen those is at $250 or so. Ditto on the Fidue A83, which is also not as harsh up top as the DN-1000 but still has good bass (a little less deep bass than DN-1000/XBA-H3) and clarity (on-par with DN-1000).
  
 Everything that I've tried with that level of bass impact and depth in the <$200 bracket doesn't quite measure up to the DN-1000 in clarity, etc - things like the Yamaha EPH-100, RBH EP1, RHA MA750, and so on. Even the new RHA T10i can't keep up with the DN-1000 in clarity.


----------



## Inks

Use M-Duo small triflanges and the Dunu DN1000 become less sharp, another user also reported good results with the FXD tips, but those have to be bought from Japan. The longer the tip, the more the peaks are tamed.


----------



## steelglam

ljokerl said:


> Glad the thread has been useful
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks, joker.  So very helpful.  That is exactly the information that I was looking for. 
  
 The Dunu's are definitely the best IEM that I've heard so far, and I've been going back and forth in my head as to whether I just need to settle with them or try and seek out something that gets me that other 10-20% of what I'm looking for.  So I was wondering if it was an issue of there being another option in that price range that was similar to the Dunu but with a slightly different approach (a slightly less hot top end), or if instead I would need to upgrade to get what I was looking for.  Knowing that it's the latter is a big help, since it means that I'm going to stick with the DN-1000 for now.  And your suggestions for upgrades are super helpful because in the event that I have the upgrade bug and can expand my budget, I know exactly where to look.  I just found your four-way comparison of the Sony, Fidue, DN-2000, and T-Peos on headphonelist and was reading it extensively.  I will return to that if I decide to upgrade at some point.
  
 The other thing that's great about the Dunu is that I can use the various tips and spacers to fit my mood, to match what kind of sound that I'm seeking on a particular day.  I love how versatile it is.  I feel like it can be made to sound like almost four different types of headphones.  It's such a strong demonstration of how much tips and positioning in the ear affect the sound.
  
 Btw, I totally agree about how the Yamaha EPH-100's compare to the Dunu's.  I was really surprised by how much of a difference in clarity and quality (the latter is subjective, I know) there was between the Yamaha and the Dunu.  I thought the Yamaha's were going to be the ones when I read the description and tried them last year, but I was disappointed.  I feel like the Dunu's are a definite step up from the Yamaha.
  


inks said:


> Use M-Duo small triflanges and the Dunu DN1000 become less sharp, another user also reported good results with the FXD tips, but those have to be bought from Japan. The longer the tip, the more the peaks are tamed.


 
  
 Thanks for the suggestion.  I haven't tried the M-Duo's or FXD tips, but I have tried the several different biflanges offered with the Dunu, and I agree that the peaks are definitely more tame with a longer tip.  The downside is that it also comes with a loss of the bass response that I love about the Dunu.  This also speaks to the point that I made in my response to joker, that the Dunu's can really sound like multiple different types of IEMs depending on the tips (and spacers) used.  Anyways, what I am hunting for is something that does both (retains the Dunu bass that comes with single flanges but tames the highs), and as joker indicated, I would need to upgrade to get that.


----------



## Inks

FXD tips and M-Duo triflangles are more tapered and fit deeper so you'll likely not lose bass, but ymmv


----------



## ljokerl

steelglam said:


> Thanks, joker.  So very helpful.  That is exactly the information that I was looking for.
> 
> The Dunu's are definitely the best IEM that I've heard so far, and I've been going back and forth in my head as to whether I just need to settle with them or try and seek out something that gets me that other 10-20% of what I'm looking for.  So I was wondering if it was an issue of there being another option in that price range that was similar to the Dunu but with a slightly different approach (a slightly less hot top end), or if instead I would need to upgrade to get what I was looking for.  Knowing that it's the latter is a big help, since it means that I'm going to stick with the DN-1000 for now.  And your suggestions for upgrades are super helpful because in the event that I have the upgrade bug and can expand my budget, I know exactly where to look.  I just found your four-way comparison of the Sony, Fidue, DN-2000, and T-Peos on headphonelist and was reading it extensively.  I will return to that if I decide to upgrade at some point.
> 
> ...


 
  
 If you have the luxury of a decent EQ, I would play around with that as well. You might be able to get closer to your ideal with relatively minor tweaks (and of course without switching earphones).


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Nuforce NE-600X. Great value at the current <$15 as far as bass-heavy earphones go. 
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3C23) Nuforce NE-600X*
> 
> 
> Details: entry-level model from one of the companies that popularized budget in-ears on Head-Fi
> ...


 
  
 The most up-to-date IEM rankings can be found here.


----------



## Retrias

Joker have you heard of the UM3DD ?, If I want an upgrade for that at around 800 without going into customs , what would the suitable options? The Ie 800 treble is too high for me


----------



## steelglam

inks said:


> FXD tips and M-Duo triflangles are more tapered and fit deeper so you'll likely not lose bass, but ymmv


 
 OK, that's good to know.  I can see that the M-Duo tips can be purchased from Meelectronics' website, but do you know where JVC FXD tips can be purchased?
  


ljokerl said:


> If you have the luxury of a decent EQ, I would play around with that as well. You might be able to get closer to your ideal with relatively minor tweaks (and of course without switching earphones).


 
 Yeah, unfortunately I do not have a decent EQ.  I'm currently using them with mainly with a FiiO X3, and FiiO unfortunately has not implemented a workable EQ.  I can play around with the hardware bass and treble controls though.
  
 I also sometimes use them on a Rockboxed Sansa Clip+, though, so I can play around with the EQ settings there.  It's not my go-to device, though (except for exercise).
  
 Btw, I think the Hifiman RE-400 sound better on the Clip+ than the FiiO X3, but vice versa is true for the Dunu.  I wonder why that is.  I think the Clip+ has a flatter response curve (without tone controls engaged, of course) than the FiiO.


----------



## ZapX629

Just wanted to pass along that LMUE is having a great sale where you can get the GR07 for under $80, BE for $110, DN1k for $175, and DN2k for $280.


----------



## Francisk

zapx629 said:


> Just wanted to pass along that LMUE is having a great sale where you can get the GR07 for under $80, BE for $110, DN1k for $175, and DN2k for $280.




Truly a bargain


----------



## Retrias

ljokerl said:


> Is that the triple dynamic? Haven't tried that one - I do have their hybrid (3X? not sure what it's called) but it's a little too v-shaped for me.
> 
> 
> Appreciate the suggestions but pretty filled up on new IEMs at the moment.
> ...



yes it is , the triple dynamic with the tunable bass vents thats really hard to take off 
If I am looking for a universal in the 600-800 bracket , with strong powerful bass , forward mids and non sparkly but extending highs , which IEM do you reccomend me? I am basically looking for a straight upgrade to the likes of IE 8 and the UMPro30


----------



## ljokerl

retrias said:


> yes it is , the triple dynamic with the tunable bass vents thats really hard to take off
> If I am looking for a universal in the 600-800 bracket , with strong powerful bass , forward mids and non sparkly but extending highs , which IEM do you reccomend me? I am basically looking for a straight upgrade to the likes of IE 8 and the UMPro30


 
  
 Strong bass plus forward mids is pretty tough to pull off - usually cranking up the bass you either get some midrange recession (like the the unique melody hybrid) or some bloat in the lower midrange. Of the enhanced-bass non-"hyper high end" universals the Sony XBA-H3 might be the best I've tried in that regard, though it still has minimal bass bloat. Very good treble quality, though, and not a lot of midrange recession.
  
 The EarSonics SM64 is another - it is BA-based but the bass is deeper and more powerful than you may expect. There's more coloration to the sound, though.
  
 Of the really high end ones ($500+) the Sennheiser IE 800 has a ton of bass but the treble presentation can vary a good bit with fit (not a lot of eartip options, either) and I wouldn't call it non-sparkly. Great end-to-end extension, but I wouldn't suggest it unless you can try it beforehand.


----------



## Retrias

ljokerl said:


> Strong bass plus forward mids is pretty tough to pull off - usually cranking up the bass you either get some midrange recession (like the the unique melody hybrid) or some bloat in the lower midrange. Of the enhanced-bass non-"hyper high end" universals the Sony XBA-H3 might be the best I've tried in that regard, though it still has minimal bass bloat. Very good treble quality, though, and not a lot of midrange recession.
> 
> The EarSonics SM64 is another - it is BA-based but the bass is deeper and more powerful than you may expect. There's more coloration to the sound, though.
> 
> Of the really high end ones ($500+) the Sennheiser IE 800 has a ton of bass but the treble presentation can vary a good bit with fit (not a lot of eartip options, either) and I wouldn't call it non-sparkly. Great end-to-end extension, but I wouldn't suggest it unless you can try it beforehand.



the IE800 treble is a bit too hoot for me , I wouldnt mind encroaching the 800 bucks territory. I listened to a friends SEM6, and i feel its not that ''exciting" for its price , while the z5 sounds too v shaped for me


----------



## suman134

retrias said:


> the IE800 treble is a bit too hoot for me , I wouldnt mind encroaching the 800 bucks territory. I listened to a friends SEM6, and i feel its not that ''exciting" for its price , while the z5 sounds too v shaped for me


 
  
   you have tried the XBA-Z5 ? did you got a chance to listen others too ? im curious about the A2 and may be A3 .


----------



## Retrias

suman134 said:


> you have tried the XBA-Z5 ? did you got a chance to listen others too ? im curious about the A2 and may be A3 .



I listened to the Z7 , and the A 2 as well , cant speak much of the A2 though


----------



## suman134

retrias said:


> I listened to the Z7 , and the A 2 as well , cant speak much of the A2 though


 
   seems like im out of luck . i liked the A2 , i just cant import with our some impressions . I will wait .


----------



## starfly

Hi Joker,
  
 A question for you regarding the JH Audio JH13Pro (FreqPhase version) and the 1964ears V6-Stage (V6S).
  
 I'm currently demoing the V6S and think it's a great sounding IEM. A few weeks ago at CanJam, I also auditioned the JH13 and really liked what I heard. Too bad 1964ears wasn't there so I couldn't compare them back to back.
  
 I read your reviews on both, but I was wondering if you could do a quick direct comparison as I'm kinda on the fence between these two. In what way does the JH13 differ from the V6S in terms of sound signature (quality/quantity of bass, mids and highs) and sound stage? Which of the two would you call more detailed and which one would you say has a faster bass? Which one has more sub-bass? In what other ways do they differ? Do you think the price premium of the JH13 is worth it over the V6S, purely from a SQ perspective and the perspective of the overall experience when listening to music?
  
 Appreciate your input. Thanks!


----------



## Retrias

ljokerl would you reccomend me the Lears for my earlier question


----------



## Inks

steelglam said:


> OK, that's good to know.  I can see that the M-Duo tips can be purchased from Meelectronics' website, but do you know where JVC FXD tips can be purchased?
> 
> Yeah, unfortunately I do not have a decent EQ.  I'm currently using them with mainly with a FiiO X3, and FiiO unfortunately has not implemented a workable EQ.  I can play around with the hardware bass and treble controls though.
> 
> ...




Amazon.jp for the FXD tips


----------



## ljokerl

starfly said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> A question for you regarding the JH Audio JH13Pro (FreqPhase version) and the 1964ears V6-Stage (V6S).
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sure, did that here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-325-iems-compared-nuforce-ne-600x-added-10-30-14-p-990/14520#post_10863051 . Couldn't really split them on things like clarity and detail but I listed all the areas where I felt they differ noticeably. If you can afford the JH13, I still think it's a slightly better earphone, but if you're more comfortable with the V6-Stage price tag, it's not exactly a slouch in any way.
  


retrias said:


> ljokerl would you reccomend me the Lears for my earlier question


 
  
 The only Lears I've tried are the LUF-4 series: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/lear-luf-4-luf-4f-luf-4b-luf-4c/ . All three have a v-shaped sound sig.


----------



## Retrias

ljokerl said:


> Sure, did that here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/478568/multi-iem-review-325-iems-compared-nuforce-ne-600x-added-10-30-14-p-990/14520#post_10863051 . Couldn't really split them on things like clarity and detail but I listed all the areas where I felt they differ noticeably. If you can afford the JH13, I still think it's a slightly better earphone, but if you're more comfortable with the V6-Stage price tag, it's not exactly a slouch in any way.
> 
> 
> The only Lears I've tried are the LUF-4 series: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/lear-luf-4-luf-4f-luf-4b-luf-4c/ . All three have a v-shaped sound sig.



from your experience how reccessed the mids are compared to the ie800 ? or is the ie800 outright better ?


----------



## Soused

Hi Joker.  You don't seem to ever review earbuds. Why is that?   In my ever so humble opinion, my Sennheiser OMX980s destroy any IEM I've ever tried, including those costing 4 ot 5 times the value.
  
 As an overall concept, can IEMs ever really reproduce the sound of music as we hear it in the real world (i.e. in open space) versus the fidelity offered by headphones or even earbuds which sit around or on the ear rather than in it?  I somehow doubt it.  I understand the market for IEMs is massive and growing, because of the isolation factor when people are in public.  But I see a whole shedload of reviews here from people who seem to spend small fortunes on IEMs they then use indoors on their own.
  
 Is it all distorted?


----------



## Dinerenblanc

soused said:


> Hi Joker.  You don't seem to ever review earbuds. Why is that?   In my ever so humble opinion, my Sennheiser OMX980s destroy any IEM I've ever tried, including those costing 4 ot 5 times the value.
> 
> As an overall concept, can IEMs ever really reproduce the sound of music as we hear it in the real world (i.e. in open space) versus the fidelity offered by headphones or even earbuds which sit around or on the ear rather than in it?  I somehow doubt it.  I understand the market for IEMs is massive and growing, because of the isolation factor when people are in public.  But I see a whole shedload of reviews here from people who seem to spend small fortunes on IEMs they then use indoors on their own.
> 
> Is it all distorted?




I'm not Joker, but if by music in the real world you meant live music, that's not a fair comparison since what we listen to on our headphones are generally studio recorded. As many concert goers may know, the venue has a huge effect on the overall sound of a performance. Not to mention that most modern music sounds very different live. But can an IEM produce a recording of a live performance that makes you feel like you're actually there though? Most definitely yes.


----------



## MoonYeol

retrias said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > Is that the triple dynamic? Haven't tried that one - I do have their hybrid (3X? not sure what it's called) but it's a little too v-shaped for me.
> ...




Check out the ASG-2/2,5. Sounds like they could be a good match for you.


----------



## Soused

dinerenblanc said:


> I'm not Joker, but if by music in the real world you meant live music, that's not a fair comparison since what we listen to on our headphones are generally studio recorded. As many concert goers may know, the venue has a huge effect on the overall sound of a performance. Not to mention that most modern music sounds very different live. But can an IEM produce a recording of a live performance that makes you feel like you're actually there though? Most definitely yes.




No, I mean music when it's heard without something on your ears. Doesn't have to be live.


----------



## Dinerenblanc

Well, you can't heard every detail when you have ambient noise in the background, and the only way to block it out is if you have good sound isolation, something you can't get with ear buds.


----------



## Soused

dinerenblanc said:


> Well, you can't heard every detail when you have ambient noise in the background, and the only way to block it out is if you have good sound isolation, something you can't get with ear buds.




But ambient noise is part of how we hear.


----------



## Dinerenblanc

soused said:


> No, I mean music when it's heard without something on your ears. Doesn't have to be live.







soused said:


> But ambient noise is part of how we hear.



I'm talking about ambient noise that's not part of the music you're hearing. If you're trying to heard every bit of detail in a song, it'll only get in the way.


----------



## Soused

dinerenblanc said:


> I'm talking about ambient noise that's not part of the music you're hearing. If you're trying to heard every bit of detail in a song, it'll only get in the way.


 
  
 OK, I won't go on because I'll derail the thread, but hearing every last detail in a song should not be the ultimate aim, I don't think.  For me, I've never heard music sound as good as it has when it has travelled through the air into my ears from at least a few feet away. That means there is ambient sound mixed in with it by the time it hits my brain. So excuse my unscientific wording or even logic, but surely thats why open headphones sound better than closed and why even closed headphones sound better than IEMs?  Squeezing all the air out of the mix makes music sound different than it does either when heard it's live without speakers, live through speakers or recorded through speakers.
  
 Or am I completely insane?


----------



## Dinerenblanc

No, you just have different tastes, and there's nothing wrong with that.


----------



## B9Scrambler

dinerenblanc said:


> No, you just have different tastes, and there's nothing wrong with that.




Spot on good sir. I'm lucky enough to be tolerant of most head/earphones types and enjoy the variety of noisemakers available. As long as it sounds good to me, I don't care what the music comes from. 

My $3 J+- Wooden Ear buds are probably just flat out bad objectively, but I love em. The Sennheiser buds noted in my sig are awesome....completely different experience to iems, and that's a good thing. Variety is nice.


----------



## Dinerenblanc

b9scrambler said:


> Spot on good sir. I'm lucky enough to be tolerant of most head/earphones types and enjoy the variety of noisemakers available. As long as it sounds good to me, I don't care what the music comes from.
> 
> My $3 J+- Wooden Ear buds are probably just flat out bad objectively, but I love em. The Sennheiser buds noted in my sig are awesome....completely different experience to iems, and that's a good thing. Variety is nice.


 
 Precisely, I'm more than willing to dough out money for an IEM that suits my preferred signature, but I also like to have some other headphones that doesn't necessarily match my tastes on hand just to be able to change things up and appreciate a different type of sound every now and then.


----------



## ljokerl

retrias said:


> from your experience how reccessed the mids are compared to the ie800 ? or is the ie800 outright better ?


 
  
 More recessed lower mids than with the IE800, but strong upper mids on the Lears. I do think the IE800 sounds better overall. BTW, I prefer the form factor of the Lears to some of the weird design choices on the IE 800.


----------



## Retrias

ljokerl said:


> More recessed lower mids than with the IE800, but strong upper mids on the Lears. I do think the IE800 sounds better overall. BTW, I prefer the form factor of the Lears to some of the weird design choices on the IE 800.



thank you ljokerl, i will see if i can get an ordinary ready made lear 4 Bs and compared it to a loaner v6 stage or even the v6 (universal)


----------



## ajs6269

Nobel 3 universal iems
 A few months ago,I purchased a set of these. I haven't seen any reviews of these so I thought I'd give my impressions.
 Over the last 3 years, I have purchased quite a few sets of iems - trying to find a sound signature I liked (rationalize my addiction to buying headphones!) Sets I own include: RHA 450i, Steelseries flux, Fidelio S2, RHA750i, Om Audio inearpeace.... Although I like most of these, I wanted an upgrade and was initially considering the SE535, ER4S, and even a few custom sets too. Joker's enormously helpful headphone list led me to the Noble website. I called their customer service number and told them what I was looking for (versatility, portability, fun sound, detail, etc.) My wallet then jumped out of my pocket - my order was placed on a Tuesday and I received them on Thursday. 
 Inside the hard plastic box is the headphones, a large variety of tips, some rubber bands etc. I spent close to 2 weeks trying to figure out which tips worked best but wound up spending $10 at radio shack for some COMPLY S500 tips.
 It doesn't take much to drive these headphones - a click or two above 50% on my iPhone or iPod is an ideal listening volume for me. I didn't burn them in. I just plugged them in and started listening.
 Noble's website describes them as V-shaped. They probably are but its a much more subtle V than I am used to. The bass is powerful, controlled, deep - really deep! The mids are very apparent, natural, clear and refined. The highs are detailed, plenty of sizzle, rarely harsh - you hear it but don't notice it if that makes sense.... The soundstage is bigger than anything I have experienced - higher, lower and wider. I feel like I'm hearing the music rather than the song. To me, they have a voluptuous, muscular, yet gentle sound. everything seems to be happening while I listen but nothing is being the alpha or the distraction. I am extremely pleased with my investment.
  
 Here's a sample of what I enjoyed road-testing on these:
 "Live at Leeds" - The Who, "Ill Communication" - The Beastie Boys, "Apollo: Atmospheres and Soundtracks" - Brian Eno, "Panic in Babylon" - Lee "Scratch" Perry, "Kind of Blue" - Miles Davis, "Tchaikovsky: suites for orchestra 1-4" - USSR symphony orchestra conducted by Yevgeni Svetlanov, "Prairie Home Invasion" - Jello Biafra & Mojo Nixon, "Bursting Out" - Jethro Tull, "All things must pass" George Harrison, "Mr Love Pants" Ian Dury and the Blockheads....
 Basically everything has sounded spectacular from an iPhone or iPod with no amp.


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hello can anyone recommend me an upgrade from sony xba-10? I'm looking for something with the same sound signature (sort of slightly mid centric but warmish kind of tone) but has better/huge/good soundstage and better overall sound quality. I also want the same ergonomic fit of that in the xba-10. Something like the zero audio carbo tenore or yamaha eph-100 or sony mh1c size which can be deeply inserted due to small housings. My budget is less than $130. Thanks!


----------



## suman134

justgotlucky123 said:


> Hello can anyone recommend me an upgrade from sony xba-10? I'm looking for something with the same sound signature (sort of slightly mid centric but warmish kind of tone) but has better/huge/good soundstage and better overall sound quality. I also want the same ergonomic fit of that in the xba-10. Something like the zero audio carbo tenore or yamaha eph-100 or sony mh1c size which can be deeply inserted due to small housings. My budget is less than $130. Thanks!


 
  
    if you can do with out bass , re-400 is the one you should consider , or the HF-5 .


----------



## Amitl

Hi all,
 i've talked about it before but still looking for a "solution"...so
 i know it may sound whiny but i need advice :
 i have a problem with earphones, cant find a good fit.
 it's either i get annoyed by microphonics, or when wearing them around the
 ear i hate how the cables rub/wrap on my neck.
 for example, i love the Vsonic VSD1S, but when wearing them straight down
 i hate the microphonics, and when around the ear, i hate the cable on my neck.
 i was thinking, maybe if i get something like the VSD3S which is designed specifically
 for over-the-ear wear, it would be better?
 i think maybe if the y-splitter is further down the cable, maybe they wont wrap on my neck?
 thanx


----------



## suman134

amitl said:


> Hi all,
> i've talked about it before but still looking for a "solution"...so
> i know it may sound whiny but i need advice :
> i have a problem with earphones, cant find a good fit.
> ...


 
  
    get comply whoomps for your vsd1s . it can help with microphonics , and use the cable clip .


----------



## Nimbu

Joker, would you recommend the HiSoundAudio Crystal for electronic music? I currently own the HifiMan RE-400, however i find them to be a bit too neutral for my taste (also the lack of bass).
  
 I prefer a warm sound signature and am after something that has a similar size to the re-400s (i find them very comfortable).
  
 Would the crystals be a good match?


----------



## ljokerl

justgotlucky123 said:


> Hello can anyone recommend me an upgrade from sony xba-10? I'm looking for something with the same sound signature (sort of slightly mid centric but warmish kind of tone) but has better/huge/good soundstage and better overall sound quality. I also want the same ergonomic fit of that in the xba-10. Something like the zero audio carbo tenore or yamaha eph-100 or sony mh1c size which can be deeply inserted due to small housings. My budget is less than $130. Thanks!


 
  
 I've only heard the XBA-1 (not XBA-10) and even that not at much length. Based on that, the EPH-100 and MH1C won't really have the same signature. Two that come to mind for the kind of sound you are describing are the UE600 (not sure if form factor will work for you and how much of an upgrade it is) and the RE-400 like suman suggested. The RE-400 doesn't have a very large soundstage but it's a superb earphone for warmish sound for the price (currently on sale for $79).
  


amitl said:


> Hi all,
> i've talked about it before but still looking for a "solution"...so
> i know it may sound whiny but i need advice :
> i have a problem with earphones, cant find a good fit.
> ...


 
  
 Doubt the VSD3S will resolve your problem. Have you tried the cable-behind-back wear style? It's what I use when I'm active and I find it to be the best at keeping cables out of my way. In that case it does help to have a native over-the-ear IEM, but not 100% necessary. See the rightmost image here for illustration: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/ultimate-headphone-guide-articles-how-insert-ear-monitors 
  


nimbu said:


> Joker, would you recommend the HiSoundAudio Crystal for electronic music? I currently own the HifiMan RE-400, however i find them to be a bit too neutral for my taste (also the lack of bass).
> 
> I prefer a warm sound signature and am after something that has a similar size to the re-400s (i find them very comfortable).
> 
> Would the crystals be a good match?


 
  
 Yep, Crystals will do it although you will give up some of the smoothness and refinement of the RE-400, especially in the treble. Bass is very nice on the Crystals, without being overbearing (good if you've always wanted to just raise the RE-400 bass a little, not good if you think the RE-400 has no bass at all). The Shure SE215 has a fairly similar sound to the Crystal but with even more bass and more laid-back treble.


----------



## Nimbu

Thanks for the reply, Joker.
  
 The problem with the Shure design is that i prefer the cable down approach (hence why i'm trying to find a similar composition to the re-400). Listening to the re-400 is a joy (i really like the mids) - they are just a bit flat for electronic music.
  
 I previously owned the Brainwavz M2 (which i consider to be heavy with bass), so i'm kind of looking for a middle ground. I'll keep a look out for some Crystals.


----------



## Dinerenblanc

Hey Joker, would you kindly recommend a portable DAC/amp for the sensitive SE846? I've been looking at JDS Labs' C5D, but I was wondering if you have any suggestions. Thank you.


----------



## ozkan

nimbu said:


> Joker, would you recommend the HiSoundAudio Crystal for electronic music? I currently own the HifiMan RE-400, however i find them to be a bit too neutral for my taste (also the lack of bass).
> 
> I prefer a warm sound signature and am after something that has a similar size to the re-400s (i find them very comfortable).
> 
> Would the crystals be a good match?


 
  
 Try out the new RE-300. They are said to have more bass than any Hifiman IEMs yet to produced.


----------



## Nimbu

RE-300? I had a quick search, but couldn't find anything.


----------



## Nimbu

Actually just found them (news article on this site).


----------



## yalper

ozkan said:


> Try out the new RE-300. They are said to have more bass than any Hifiman IEMs yet to produced.


 
 You were thinking *joker* praises RE400 too much; and you recommend RE300 even without listening them.. It is very confusing bro


----------



## ozkan

yalper said:


> You were thinking *joker* praises RE400 too much; and you recommend RE300 even without listening them.. It is very confusing bro


 
  
 Haha ha who said that bro? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I didn't recommend RE-300. I just said "try out" them. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Anyway they are out of stock now.


----------



## Nimbu

I think i'll avoid HifiMan for my next purchase. They're a great brand, but i'm not really an audiophile.
  
 Thanks anyway though


----------



## ljokerl

nimbu said:


> Thanks for the reply, Joker.
> 
> The problem with the Shure design is that i prefer the cable down approach (hence why i'm trying to find a similar composition to the re-400). Listening to the re-400 is a joy (i really like the mids) - they are just a bit flat for electronic music.
> 
> I previously owned the Brainwavz M2 (which i consider to be heavy with bass), so i'm kind of looking for a middle ground. I'll keep a look out for some Crystals.


 
  
 The Crystal does nicely split the difference between the M2 and RE-400 in bass. Sounds like it would be a good fit for you. 
  


dinerenblanc said:


> Hey Joker, would you kindly recommend a portable DAC/amp for the sensitive SE846? I've been looking at JDS Labs' C5D, but I was wondering if you have any suggestions. Thank you.


 
  
 I don't think I've tried a single new portable amp this year so I'm not exactly up to date 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I just use a HiFiMan HM-901 when I'm not too lazy to carry it around, and the Cowon J3 or my Nexus 5 straight when I am.


----------



## Amitl

thanx a lot for the help Suman134 and Joker!!


----------



## Phosphenetre

Is there something, within 200 USD or so, that is either:
  
 1. A VSonic GR07 MkII with a fuller low-end and more realistic weight to bass instruments and low percussion, and a more refined, less splashy and peaky top-end?
 2. A HiFiMan RE-400 with a less docile treble, without necessarily being outright bright in the top-end, and with less fragile build quality?
  
 I owned the GR07 MkII and find the low-end lacking realistic weight and general fullness. The top-end can also get fatiguing, harsh and spitty, with its several resonances and peaks.
  
 I auditioned a HiFiMan RE-400 and loved pretty much everything about the sound except the top-end that was noticeably south of neutral, and tended to make a lot of mixes sound darker than they should. They're also frighteningly fragile - the owner of the pair I auditioned had his die on him two months later, and the forum is full of stories of the RE-400 falling apart rather easily.


----------



## soundstige

danielkrego said:


> 2. A HiFiMan RE-400 with a less docile treble, without necessarily being outright bright in the top-end, and with less fragile build quality?


 
  
 Yeah, the Aurisonics Rockets. Seriously. They're $249 unfortunately, but are exactly what you just described.


----------



## Phosphenetre

soundstige said:


> Yeah, the Aurisonics Rockets. Seriously. They're $249 unfortunately, but are exactly what you just described.


 
  
 Wow, never even heard of the Rockets. Where can I find more reviews and opinions?


----------



## soundstige

danielkrego said:


> Wow, never even heard of the Rockets. Where can I find more reviews and opinions?


 
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/694117/aurisonics-rockets-impressions-thread
  
 Many members are describing them as some of the best earphones they've ever heard. Lifetime warranty, solid metal housings, waterproof, the whole nine yards.


----------



## vwinter

soundstige said:


> http://www.head-fi.org/t/694117/aurisonics-rockets-impressions-thread
> 
> Many members are describing them as some of the best earphones they've ever heard. Lifetime warranty, solid metal housings, waterproof, the whole nine yards.




Pretty sure it's a 5 year warranty... Unless they changed it, which is far ahead of what other earphone companies offer anyway. I'm looking at you Sony with your 90 day insult.

Titanium housings  incredibly light.

But I'm not sure how much less docile the treble is than the RE-400. It's a pretty linear non-boosted treble, but it does have that 5-6k bumped edge to the sound in the lower treble.

Definitely one of my favorite earphones that I've heard at least.


----------



## MikonJuice

I was about to ask the trivial question "which iem would satisfy me between those ones...", but I got a little confused.
 To sum it up, my perfect sound signature would be the T-peos Altones 200, but, for some reason, I can't let go of my Dunu dk1000. The strangest thing  (for me)is: in terms of sound quality, they're on equal grounds, being the T-peos more musical and the treble being a little bit more forward and bright, right?
 So, my question is: is it possible, with a portable amp or DAC, to make the Dunus sound similar to my Altones?
 And so continues my doubts: how about my Gr07? Is it possible, through equalizing(I don't really know if this is the right verb), to make it more bass heavy and possibly have the midrange/treble to be thicker?
 And the final question: or should I forget about this, and just go for a iem that a lot of people say is the next step, the Fidue A83?


----------



## ljokerl

The other day average_joe posted a guest article from Tim Wickstrom of BA driver manufacturer Knowles on the evolution of sound. It provides a quick run-through of sound reproduction history leading up to this point and some of the advantages of BA technology, from the perspective of one of the world's largest manufacturers of balanced armature drivers. Anyone curious to read it can find it here: http://theheadphonelist.com/re-evolution-sound/ 
  


mikonjuice said:


> I was about to ask the trivial question "which iem would satisfy me between those ones...", but I got a little confused.
> To sum it up, my perfect sound signature would be the T-peos Altones 200, but, for some reason, I can't let go of my Dunu dk1000. The strangest thing  (for me)is: in terms of sound quality, they're on equal grounds, being the T-peos more musical and the treble being a little bit more forward and bright, right?
> So, my question is: is it possible, with a portable amp or DAC, to make the Dunus sound similar to my Altones?
> And so continues my doubts: how about my Gr07? Is it possible, through equalizing(I don't really know if this is the right verb), to make it more bass heavy and possibly have the midrange/treble to be thicker?
> And the final question: or should I forget about this, and just go for a iem that a lot of people say is the next step, the Fidue A83?


 
  
 Yes, that sounds about right. This is an Interesting question - I don't think an Amp or DAC will do it for you, and I don't really think the A83 is an upgrade more so than it is just a different signature. However, a good EQ might help you get one closer to the other - for example giving the DN-1000 a little less deep bass and adding some presence in the 2-4k range and maybe the upper treble should help you get closer to the Altone signature. The DN-1000 would make for a better starting point than the GR07, especially if you already have one.


----------



## Nimbu

danielkrego said:


> Is there something, within 200 USD or so, that is either:
> 
> 1. A VSonic GR07 MkII with a fuller low-end and more realistic weight to bass instruments and low percussion, and a more refined, less splashy and peaky top-end?
> 2. A HiFiMan RE-400 with a less docile treble, without necessarily being outright bright in the top-end, and with less fragile build quality?
> ...


 
  
 Not sure why the RE-400 has a bad reputation with build quality. I've had mine for more than a year and they are perfectly fine - I feel the build quality is above average.


----------



## suman134

nimbu said:


> Not sure why the RE-400 has a bad reputation with build quality. I've had mine for more than a year and they are perfectly fine - I feel the build quality is above average.


 
  
    me too , build on it is not bad at all , better than ue700 / 600 and try not putting it under stress , i like its build , supple cable and stress relievers .


----------



## ljokerl

Added the LEAR LUF-4F, LUF-4B, and LUF-4C quad-driver custom-made universal IEMs.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1B13) LEAR LUF-4 (LUF-4F / LUF-4B / LUF-4C)*
> 
> 
> Left:_ transparent purple shells/“metallic” faceplates; Center: transparent light blue shells/black “true texture” carbon fiber imitation faceplates; Right:__ opaque white shells/“illusion/imaginary color” pearlescent faceplates_
> ...


 
  
 The most up-to-date ranking can be found here.


----------



## yaz125

Hey Joker,
 Thanks for this such an amazing and extensive list of reviews!!
 I have a slight confusion. I have broken my recent pair of Fischer audio Consonance!!
 In the past I have owned soundmagic e10, id america spark and consonance to be the latest one.
 Can you suggest me similar sounding earphones -[*bass heavy ( punchy but not overpowering), above average soundstage, good clarity and excellent vocals]*

 I would really appreciate your help here.
 Looking forward to hear from you.

 Thanks


----------



## altrunox

yaz125 said:


> Hey Joker,
> Thanks for this such an amazing and extensive list of reviews!!
> I have a slight confusion. I have broken my recent pair of Fischer audio Consonance!!
> In the past I have owned soundmagic e10, id america spark and consonance to be the latest one.
> ...


 
  
 You forgot to say the most important thing...how much can you spend?


----------



## MikonJuice

suman134 said:


> me too , build on it is not bad at all , better than ue700 / 600 and try not putting it under stress , i like its build , supple cable and stress relievers .


 

 My 2 cents here: I had RE0 and Re262, and I felt the durability is really awful.
 The first one got on the one year mark, but the other... maybe 8 months at best. And only using them at home, that's why I felt it was lacking is this part.


----------



## ozkan

yaz125 said:


> Hey Joker,
> Thanks for this such an amazing and extensive list of reviews!!
> I have a slight confusion. I have broken my recent pair of Fischer audio Consonance!!
> In the past I have owned soundmagic e10, id america spark and consonance to be the latest one.
> ...


 
 Audio Technica IM50.


----------



## ljokerl

yaz125 said:


> Hey Joker,
> Thanks for this such an amazing and extensive list of reviews!!
> I have a slight confusion. I have broken my recent pair of Fischer audio Consonance!!
> In the past I have owned soundmagic e10, id america spark and consonance to be the latest one.
> ...


 
  
 If you like the consonance, which was somewhat v-shaped sound, I think the Brainwavz S1 would be a good replacement, or a VSonic VSD3S if you can give up a little bass and go with a brighter, clearer sound (that's still punchy). Beyond that probably depends on budget. JVC FXT90 maybe?


----------



## danikus

Hi Joker,
 Do you think that it is for real or a fake:
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Xiaomi-2nd-Generation-Piston-Earphone-Headset-W-Mic-for-3-5mm-jack-Smartphone-/371141792957?pt=Bluetooth_Wireless_Products&var=&hash=item5669c654bd
 At 7$ this may be the best deal in the history of IEMs)


----------



## Zenbun

danikus said:


> Hi Joker,
> Do you think that it is for real or a fake:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Xiaomi-2nd-Generation-Piston-Earphone-Headset-W-Mic-for-3-5mm-jack-Smartphone-/371141792957?pt=Bluetooth_Wireless_Products&var=&hash=item5669c654bd
> At 7$ this may be the best deal in the history of IEMs)


 

 There are a lot of fakes of these iems on ebay.


----------



## yaz125

Thanks Joker!!

 My budget is around £100(~150$). 
 Thanks for your help again. If anything else pops into your mind please suggest em as well.


----------



## yaz125

Around 100£ (~150$) mate


----------



## ljokerl

danikus said:


> Hi Joker,
> Do you think that it is for real or a fake:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Xiaomi-2nd-Generation-Piston-Earphone-Headset-W-Mic-for-3-5mm-jack-Smartphone-/371141792957?pt=Bluetooth_Wireless_Products&var=&hash=item5669c654bd
> At 7$ this may be the best deal in the history of IEMs)


 
  
 Probably counterfeit
  


yaz125 said:


> Around 100£ (~150$) mate


 
  
 RHA MA750 may be an option. Also since you're in the UK, the Rock Jaw Alfa Genus - with Silver filters it sounds a like like the Brainwavz S1 I recommended, but it also gives you two other sound options (the gold filters give a nice balanced sound... the black ones I'm not a fan of).


----------



## Zenbun

What do you do with all the spare IEMs you have around?


----------



## kloner

hi, what do you recommend for the best upgrade of yamaha eph-100?


----------



## nehcrow

Got your hands on any Aurisonics products mate?


----------



## ia1234

I'm looking for Mid-centric IEM for around 50 USD. Anything better in terms of build and sound quality than the Fidue A63?


----------



## ozkan

ia1234 said:


> I'm looking for Mid-centric IEM for around 50 USD. Anything better in terms of build and sound quality than the Fidue A63?


 
 Audio Technica IM50.


----------



## Gryphus0204

Hi Joker. Firstly i would like to say what an amazing job you did reviewing all those products. i'm looking to upgrade from my Gr07, and right now I'm stuck between either ther LUF-4 or the Noble 4(Universal). Which one would you pick over the 2? Also have you heard of the Fischer Amps FA4-XB? I've read some really promising stuff and they're quad BA as well. What would your recommendation be?


----------



## ZapX629

ia1234 said:


> I'm looking for Mid-centric IEM for around 50 USD. Anything better in terms of build and sound quality than the Fidue A63?


 
 I'll second the IM50. I don't know how it is against the Fidue, but it's on par with the VSD3S. VSD3S has better separation, but it's rather recessed in the midrange. Also, the Ostry KC06 is a nice, clear, mid-forward IEM. It goes for around $60, but you may be able to find it a bit cheaper. If you need more bass and a warmer tone, I'd go IM50. If you like it less warm and bassy, I'd try the Ostry.


----------



## ljokerl

zenbun said:


> What do you do with all the spare IEMs you have around?


 
  

  
  


kloner said:


> hi, what do you recommend for the best upgrade of yamaha eph-100?


 
  
 That's a tough one... with its particular signature (deep bass, warm tone, minor midrange recession, and fairly smooth up top) AND better all-around performance there's nothing I can think of except some customs - the Westone ES5 and Heir 8.A come to mind - and even those tend to have a little less bass overall. If you're okay with taking a cut somewhere - for example in bass quantity - and not expect an all-around upgrade there are other options. The Sony XBA-H3, for instance - it doesn't really have a clarity advantage on the EPH-100 but is an upgrade soundstaging and treble quality. 
  


nehcrow said:


> Got your hands on any Aurisonics products mate?


 
  
 I tried the original (mk1) ASG-1 but the performance wasn't great. Never managed to get my hands on an updated version or the ASG-2. 
  


ia1234 said:


> I'm looking for Mid-centric IEM for around 50 USD. Anything better in terms of build and sound quality than the Fidue A63?


 
  
 The Ostry KC06 that *ZapX629* mentioned is what comes to mind for sound (but not necessarily build). It has a brighter, clearer signature than the warm and smooth A63, but has a similar midrange focus. Costs $55-60.
  
 I compared them a little here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/ 
  


gryphus0204 said:


> Hi Joker. Firstly i would like to say what an amazing job you did reviewing all those products. i'm looking to upgrade from my Gr07, and right now I'm stuck between either ther LUF-4 or the Noble 4(Universal). Which one would you pick over the 2? Also have you heard of the Fischer Amps FA4-XB? I've read some really promising stuff and they're quad BA as well. What would your recommendation be?


 
  
 Unfortunately I haven't tried the Noble 4 universal but the custom one has a very different sound than the LUF-4 - very flat and smooth and relaxed. The LUF-4 has a more v-shaped signature with more aggressive bass and upper mids/treble. The GR07 actually falls between these two in sound signature so you're moving in different directions from it depending on which one you go with. 
  
 Haven't tried any Fischer Amps products.


----------



## Zenbun

ljokerl said:


>


 
 LOL I almost choked.
  
 Did you think to sale or give them away?


----------



## Ivabign

It is always a treat when Joker ads another review to the list - almost like opening a present. Thanks for your hard work.... and where's that TF10 review?


----------



## ljokerl

zenbun said:


> LOL I almost choked.
> 
> Did you think to sale or give them away?


 
  
 I wouldn't mind giving some of them away on facebook or whatnot but that requires time I don't really have, plus I have some reservations about giving away "pre-owned" earphones (which all of mine are). Most sets I have are just set aside for future comparisons. 
  


ivabign said:


> It is always a treat when Joker ads another review to the list - almost like opening a present. Thanks for your hard work.... and where's that TF10 review?


 
  
 Lost somewhere back in the 2000s 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


----------



## Exesteils

ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't mind giving some of them away on facebook or whatnot but that requires time I don't really have, plus I have some reservations about giving away "pre-owned" earphones (which all of mine are). Most sets I have are just set aside for future comparisons.
> 
> 
> Lost somewhere back in the 2000s  .




I wouldn't mind pre-owned pairs.


----------



## 1clearhead

Only 4 more to go for 1000!
  
 It will be funny if this accomplishment happens on Christmas, or New Years.


----------



## Phosphenetre

Joker, any plans to review the new multi-BA Audio Technicas soon? Or any brief impressions on them so far?


----------



## ljokerl

exesteils said:


> I wouldn't mind pre-owned pairs.


 
  
 Yeah I guess it wouldn't be a big issue for many if they are clearly labeled as such. Something to do on Facebook for major holidays I guess 
  


1clearhead said:


> Only 4 more to go for 1000!
> 
> It will be funny if this accomplishment happens on Christmas, or New Years.


 
  
 Shouldn't take that long. My estimate is 2 weeks. 
  


danielkrego said:


> Joker, any plans to review the new multi-BA Audio Technicas soon? Or any brief impressions on them so far?


 
  
 Unfortunately I don't have them and I don't think they're coming from InnerFidelity, either. Audio-Technica really doesn't market these models outside of Japan.


----------



## vlenbo

ljokerl said:


> Yeah I guess it wouldn't be a big issue for many if they are clearly labeled as such. Something to do on Facebook for major holidays I guess
> 
> 
> Shouldn't take that long. My estimate is 2 weeks.
> ...


 
 I truly hope they change that attitude. They kind of bother me and agitate me to the point where I want to slap them across the cheek for neglecting the market outside of Japan.


----------



## ljokerl

It's not unusual for companies to have region-specific products but in this particular case it's all the good stuff that seems to be Japan-exclusive


----------



## kloner

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






ljokerl said:


> That's a tough one... with its particular signature (deep bass, warm tone, minor midrange recession, and fairly smooth up top) AND better all-around performance there's nothing I can think of except some customs - the Westone ES5 and Heir 8.A come to mind - and even those tend to have a little less bass overall. If you're okay with taking a cut somewhere - for example in bass quantity - and not expect an all-around upgrade there are other options. The Sony XBA-H3, for instance - it doesn't really have a clarity advantage on the EPH-100 but is an upgrade soundstaging and treble quality.
> 
> 
> 
> ...







thanks joker for the respond, i can sacrifice some bass for the clarity and treble, thus the shure se535ltd or maybe the sony xba-A3 is a good upgrade?


----------



## ljokerl

kloner said:


> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 With the SE525 you're sacrificing a lot of bass - compared to an EPH-100 it's almost flat. Good earphone overall, just a radically different sound sig. 
  
 Not sure how the XBA-A3 compares to the XBA-H3 - maybe there's a comparison out there somewhere. I do think the H3 is a good earphone so assuming the A3 is better and not worse it should be good as well.


----------



## rawrster

ljokerl said:


> I wouldn't mind giving some of them away on facebook or whatnot but that requires time I don't really have, plus I have some reservations about giving away "pre-owned" earphones (which all of mine are). Most sets I have are just set aside for future comparisons.


 
  
 I guess I'll do you a huge favor at an inconvenience to me and take them off your hands...
  
  
 I'm curious but what do you think about the GR07 classic edition? I'm looking at getting a cheap iem for work that has a bit less isolation that your typical iem from Shure, Etymotic, etc. At$100 I was looking at those. Anything else to consider? I use the Brainwavz M2 but the cable coiling up and going all over the place is quite maddening.


----------



## Hoplite

Dont mean to push you Joker, but when is the review of in-ear momentum? Cant wait to see the scoresheet of it


----------



## ljokerl

rawrster said:


> I guess I'll do you a huge favor at an inconvenience to me and take them off your hands...
> 
> 
> I'm curious but what do you think about the GR07 classic edition? I'm looking at getting a cheap iem for work that has a bit less isolation that your typical iem from Shure, Etymotic, etc. At$100 I was looking at those. Anything else to consider? I use the Brainwavz M2 but the cable coiling up and going all over the place is quite maddening.


 
  
 It's a little different from my ~5-year old GR07 mkI but I can't say it's worse. Compared them here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-gr07-classic-plus-warning/ . For $99 it's great if you like the VSonic sound. The VSonic VSD3S is great as well considering it's only $45 or so: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/ . The Ostry KC06 mentioned there has great sound and mediocre isolation as well. 
  


hoplite said:


> Dont mean to push you Joker, but when is the review of in-ear momentum? Cant wait to see the scoresheet of it


 
  
 Sent it to InnerFidelity for measurements. Waiting to get it back to do the review


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Sent it to InnerFidelity for measurements. Waiting to get it back to do the review


 
   
     would love this review , i am thinking of getting it .


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> would love this review , i am thinking of getting it .


 
  
 At first listen it sounded nice but not _that_ nice. Then again, it's comfortable, not super expensive, and it does have the rare option of Android controls. Will see where the review takes me.


----------



## Inks

TTPOD T1E seems to be something that should be on here, it's quite popular and seems to feature a unique diaphragm and controlled channel matching. Haven't listened to mine yet, but looks promising.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> At first listen it sounded nice but not _that_ nice. Then again, it's comfortable, not super expensive, and it does have the rare option of Android controls. Will see where the review takes me.


 
    Yeah , thats what i liked about it , android controls and not too expensive . i hope its close to vsd 1 .


----------



## Shawn71

ljokerl said:


> At first listen it sounded nice but not _that_ nice. Then again, it's comfortable, not super expensive, and it does have the rare option of Android controls. Will see where the review takes me.




Elevated bass tho not a bass head boom....but like to see how its compared to original momentums tho.....


----------



## lilboozy

According to mike2410, the momentum in ears have comparable bass quantity to the ie8. How does that bass compare to the beats tour 2.0?


----------



## LastBluejay

Hi Joker - first time post-er long-time lurker here.  First I wanted to say a huge and sincere thanks for the amazing reviews and work you've done over the years.  Your recommendations have brought lots of listening enjoyment over the years and I really appreciate it.  Which brings me to my question - I've been slowly upgrading my IEMs over the years from the Meelectronics CW31 to the Meelec CC51p to the Sony MH1C and now I've been using the MDR-7550 for the past year and have really enjoyed it.  
  
 I was curious if anything comes to your mind as an upgrade to the 7550s?
  
 I *think* (although I'm not positive) that I enjoy warmer sounding earphones, but I think I'm basically looking for better imaging, soundstage, resolution, and clarity.  I'd say 50% of what I listen to is EDM but the rest varies from rock, pop, classical.  
  
 I'd be interested to hear your suggestions - custom or non-custom.  Thanks again for all your help.


----------



## ljokerl

inks said:


> TTPOD T1E seems to be something that should be on here, it's quite popular and seems to feature a unique diaphragm and controlled channel matching. Haven't listened to mine yet, but looks promising.


 
  
 Haven't tried it yet but it does look interesting. I remember thinking it was another version of the MOE SS01 / JVC FXT90 system when I first saw it but that doesn't seem to be the case. 
  


shawn71 said:


> Elevated bass tho not a bass head boom....


 
  
 This has been my impression so far as well.
  


lilboozy said:


> According to mike2410, the momentum in ears have comparable bass quantity to the ie8. How does that bass compare to the beats tour 2.0?


 
  
 The Tour has more mid-bass than pretty much anything, which really affects the overall sound. The IE8 is nowhere near as bloated. 
  


lastbluejay said:


> Hi Joker - first time post-er long-time lurker here.  First I wanted to say a huge and sincere thanks for the amazing reviews and work you've done over the years.  Your recommendations have brought lots of listening enjoyment over the years and I really appreciate it.  Which brings me to my question - I've been slowly upgrading my IEMs over the years from the Meelectronics CW31 to the Meelec CC51p to the Sony MH1C and now I've been using the MDR-7550 for the past year and have really enjoyed it.
> 
> I was curious if anything comes to your mind as an upgrade to the 7550s?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks, I appreciate that.
  
 What comes to mind in the universal form factor is the InEar StageDiver 2: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/inear-stagediver-2-sd-2-review/ . I think there's a custom version of it also, but I've only tried the universal. The AudioFly AF180 is promising but I haven't spent enough time with it yet to be sure and it's definitely not as smooth as the 7550 or SD-2.
  
 As for customs I have tried, as an upgrade you'd probably want at least a Custom Art Pro 330v2, and that's already $600-ish. Going up from there things get pretty expensive.


----------



## Inks

Also have you considered getting another B3 seeing as the pair you have is clearly defective? Some channel matching is fine but what Tyll measures is ridiculously bad...


----------



## Francisk

inks said:


> Also have you considered getting another B3 seeing as the pair you have is clearly defective? Some channel matching is fine but what Tyll measures is ridiculously bad...


 

 My Havi sure don't have the channel imbalance problem like the one Tyll tested.


----------



## PoRidge

I found a very interesting idea posted on the official forum of Lear, the company based in HK that brought us the luf4 in the latest review in this thread.
  
 This "custom removable nozzle" seems to come from the idea of custom tips like westone does(Lear also makes custom ear-tips) but created for ciems in mind. The universal/custom nozzles are interchangeable as seen from my screenshot.
  
 No further information yet, but I am really intrigued.


----------



## Hisoundfi

So, Hifiman has dropped the price of the RE400 down to $49. They are now the same price as the RE-300. Which one is the better buy If we want the best bass response and high resolution combo?


----------



## kova4a

hisoundfi said:


> So, Hifiman has dropped the price of the RE400 down to $49. They are now the same price as the RE-300. Which one is the better buy If we want the best bass response and high resolution combo?


 
 Huh? Where did you see $49 - it's $79.


----------



## getclikinagas

hisoundfi said:


> So, Hifiman has dropped the price of the RE400 down to $49. They are now the same price as the RE-300. Which one is the better buy If we want the best bass response and high resolution combo?


 
  
Coming Soon:
"Designed for music lovers on-the-go, HIFIMAN RE300h with Advanced OCC cabling sets the standard for others to follow."
  
 Wonder if this micless "h" version sounds different/better compared to the a/i version.
  
 Some initial impressions on the RE-300a/i : http://www.head-fi.org/t/738370/hifiman-re300a-re300i-inline-control-earphone-launched-49/30#post_11028596
  

  


kova4a said:


> Huh? Where did you see $49 - it's $79.


 
  
 Amazon


----------



## kova4a

Yeah, my bad as I went to head-direct to check the price


----------



## LastBluejay

ljokerl said:


> Thanks, I appreciate that.
> 
> What comes to mind in the universal form factor is the InEar StageDiver 2: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/inear-stagediver-2-sd-2-review/ . I think there's a custom version of it also, but I've only tried the universal. The AudioFly AF180 is promising but I haven't spent enough time with it yet to be sure and it's definitely not as smooth as the 7550 or SD-2.
> 
> As for customs I have tried, as an upgrade you'd probably want at least a Custom Art Pro 330v2, and that's already $600-ish. Going up from there things get pretty expensive.


 
  
 Ah, never even thought of the StageDivers.  Thanks joker - they look like a great next upgrade, can't wait to check them out.


----------



## yalper

inks said:


> Also have you considered getting another B3 seeing as the pair you have is clearly defective? Some channel matching is fine but what Tyll measures is ridiculously bad...


 
*Joker* are you sure your Havi B3 review sample is not a defective unit? many B3 owners are saying the measurement data is inconsistent with their units, including me..


----------



## ZapX629

The B3 is an IEM that changes with different tips as well, and has a lot of issues with fit, so it could be a case of not getting a proper reading due to that. I can hear a few slight channel imbalances when running a full sweep, but it's nothing on the levels of what Tyll's data looks like. Could also be quality control, but I know the majority of people have enjoyed them.


----------



## ljokerl

inks said:


> Also have you considered getting another B3 seeing as the pair you have is clearly defective? Some channel matching is fine but what Tyll measures is ridiculously bad...


 
  
 I did, and it was also imbalanced, just not as much (going by ear, didn't send it in) as the original unit Tyll measured. This was before the measurements were posted so I didn't know the severity of the imbalance of the first unit.
  
 I actually gave up after the second one, but then after the data went up another Head-Fier contacted me and offered a 3rd, which I should have on hand soon. 
  


poridge said:


> I found a very interesting idea posted on the official forum of Lear, the company based in HK that brought us the luf4 in the latest review in this thread.
> 
> This "custom removable nozzle" seems to come from the idea of custom tips like westone does(Lear also makes custom ear-tips) but created for ciems in mind. The universal/custom nozzles are interchangeable as seen from my screenshot.
> 
> No further information yet, but I am really intrigued.


 
  
 Wow, that's very interesting indeed. Never seen anything like it. I wonder what the advantage would be in terms of fit over having a universal nozzle + fitted custom eartip (Westone-style).
  
 This also opens it up to some sound tuning possibilities via different nozzle filters or maybe even different bore sizes both for universal and custom nozzles. Very interesting concept.  
  


yalper said:


> *Joker* are you sure your Havi B3 review sample is not a defective unit? many B3 owners are saying the measurement data is inconsistent with their units, including me..


 
  
 See my reply to Inks above. Wouldn't expect any two units to be imbalanced the exact same way (that would imply that there is an issue with the manufacturing process) but it does point to mediocre QC, perhaps. It's easy to miss mild imbalances by ear so who knows how many of the units out there are actually matched.


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> See my reply to Inks above. Wouldn't expect any two units to be imbalanced the exact same way (that would imply that there is an issue with the manufacturing process) but it does point to mediocre QC, perhaps. *It's easy to miss mild imbalances by ear so who knows how many of the units out there are actually matched.  *




This is very true in my experience with using music. Running a sine sweep on a set of earphones will show imbalances pretty well though, even smaller ones, but you also need to account for imbalances due to your ears for say earwax buildup changing resonances, etc.

Then you'd probably just have to decide if that's acceptable to you based on factors like how music sounds and probably how much you paid.


----------



## 1clearhead

@Joker,
  
 Thanks in advance!
  
 Your reviews help me to purchase several of my earphones and headphones, like my *Astrotec AM800* and my *Superlux HD668B *(over-head).
  
 I'm wondering if you ever tried the *Takstar TS-610* (or 600 in Silver), great full-size over-head monitor (closed) headphones with very clear vocals, well balanced and detachable cables. And, I'm refering to the "portable headphone list," sorry.
  
  
 On another note: *3 more to go!!! *
  
_-Prepare your pots and pans for some noise!  _


----------



## PoRidge

ljokerl said:


> Wow, that's very interesting indeed. Never seen anything like it. I wonder what the advantage would be in terms of fit over having a universal nozzle + fitted custom eartip (Westone-style).
> 
> This also opens it up to some sound tuning possibilities via different nozzle filters or maybe even different bore sizes both for universal and custom nozzles. Very interesting concept.


 
 Sound tuning by changing nozzles is not only a concept. A China based company, FLC, made flc8 a tunable iem by chaning nozzles, ports and dampers, etc. Using their patented parts that comes with the iem, users can make a total of 36 different tunings.
  


  
  
 For the designers to be confident enough to make their iem tunable, I think the basic sound qualities have to be top notch. Responses from Chinese forums seems pretty good. They even started a thread on the theories of how they can use those parts to tune the sound.
  
 Actually, I might be able to get you a pair if you have the time to review them. It could be time consuming though, unlike the LUF4 having only 3 variants, it has 5 recommended combinations.
  
 FYI, the flc8 is a 2ba+1dynamic configuration.


----------



## ljokerl

vwinter said:


> This is very true in my experience with using music. Running a sine sweep on a set of earphones will show imbalances pretty well though, even smaller ones, but you also need to account for imbalances due to your ears for say earwax buildup changing resonances, etc.
> 
> Then you'd probably just have to decide if that's acceptable to you based on factors like how music sounds and probably how much you paid.


 
  
 Linear sine sweeps make it extremely easy to tell, but it is a very tricky to gauge what is and isn't a significant deviation, especially as you get into the top end. 
  
 A "middle road" option is to put your source in mono mode (mix the channels together) but still use regular music tracks. I find that this is capable of pointing out significant imbalances but not as revealing of minor ones as the sweep method. 
  


1clearhead said:


> @Joker,
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> ...


 
  
 I've heard the brand name but I've never tried a Takstar product.
  


poridge said:


> Sound tuning by changing nozzles is not only a concept. A China based company, FLC, made flc8 a tunable iem by chaning nozzles, ports and dampers, etc. Using their patented parts that comes with the iem, users can make a total of 36 different tunings.
> 
> For the designers to be confident enough to make their iem tunable, I think the basic sound qualities have to be top notch. Responses from Chinese forums seems pretty good. They even started a thread on the theories of how they can use those parts to tune the sound.
> 
> ...


 
  
 There are many existing universal earphones where you can change nozzles and/or nozzle filters to modify the sound - RHA T10i, Rock Jaw Alfa Genus, and Torque t103z for instance. Just that none of them offer a "custom" nozzle option to turn the IEM into a CIEM.
  
 There are also a good number where you swap between ports to change the sound. I see the FLC8 as an extreme extension of these existing tunable designs. 
  
 I have an FLC8 but I haven't had a chance to play around with it yet. Like you said, it's a time investment. I'll see if Tyll @ InnerFidelity can measure all the different combinations, lol.


----------



## PoRidge

ljokerl said:


> I have an FLC8 but I haven't had a chance to play around with it yet. Like you said, it's a time investment. I'll see if Tyll @ InnerFidelity can measure all the different combinations, lol.


 
 Maybe I can get rid off my w4r and try one of those. Any plan to do a simple review on the FLC8?


----------



## ljokerl

poridge said:


> Maybe I can get rid off my w4r and try one of those. Any plan to do a simple review on the FLC8?


 
  
 I don't think a simple anything is possible with the FLC8


----------



## Retrias

joker have you heard of any of the rhapsodio products ?


----------



## zubin111

Hi Joker, cant thank enuf for the thread! Now moving to the question, my gear involves Fiio X3, Toppings NX1 along with Vsd1s, FXT90 and DN1K. Now Fxt sounds great with x3 so does dunu. I wanted to now try out a complementary earphone with some good quality bass (some EDM). I know all my collection is towards a slight V but still i feel sometimes it wouldnt harm to have a higher slamming earphone. I am intrigued by TTPOD T1-E as well as Havi B3, i understand that TTPOD suits the current requirement better but just as an option i would like a different signature. TTPOD because penonaudio ships to India, i am open to any other recommendation you have if it delivers to me and is not insanely expensive!


----------



## PoRidge

ljokerl said:


> I don't think a simple anything is possible with the FLC8


 
  
  
 Can you comment on the isolation and comfort of the FLC8? I have my eyes on InEar SD2, seems like a viable upgrade from GR07, but the price difference, LOL.


----------



## peter123

zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker, cant thank enuf for the thread! Now moving to the question, my gear involves Fiio X3, Toppings NX1 along with Vsd1s, FXT90 and DN1K. Now Fxt sounds great with x3 so does dunu. I wanted to now try out a complementary earphone with some good quality bass (some EDM). I know all my collection is towards a slight V but still i feel sometimes it wouldnt harm to have a higher slamming earphone. I am intrigued by TTPOD T1-E as well as Havi B3, i understand that TTPOD suits the current requirement better but just as an option i would like a different signature. TTPOD because penonaudio ships to India, i am open to any other recommendation you have if it delivers to me and is not insanely expensive!




If you're looking for more bass the Havi B3 would not be the best choice. The bass on the T1E is very good though. Don't get me wrong, I love the B3's but it's not a bassy IEM.


----------



## zubin111

peter123 said:


> If you're looking for more bass the Havi B3 would not be the best choice. The bass on the T1E is very good though. Don't get me wrong, I love the B3's but it's not a bassy IEM.


 
 Yes i am looking for some more slam and bass quality without any significant clarity deterioration. how is the soundstage of T1E?


----------



## peter123

zubin111 said:


> Yes i am looking for some more slam and bass quality without any significant clarity deterioration. how is the soundstage of T1E?




The soundstage width on the T1E is pretty good but it lacks in depth. For soundstage (especially depth) I've never heard anything better than the B3's from an IEM. The sub bass on the T1E is very good in quality but some users has wished for more quantity, for me it's enough though. The T1E's got less and better controlled midbass compared to my vsd1 but more (and better controlled) sub bass.


----------



## Tyll Hertsens

I think I need to say that imbalances in mid to low frequencies in my IEM measurements need to be considered somewhat suspect.  I try VERY hard to ensure a good tip seal in the ears of my head, but it's very hard to be certain. The dummies ear canals are usually somewhere between the medium and small size tips shipped with IEM products, and getting a seal is sometimes very difficult.  When I do see an imbalance (and it's very easy for me to see as I seat the tips with 30H square waves) I will try to reseat the tips, change the tips, sometimes switch the IEMs left for right to see if the imbalance moves (in which case it's likely an actual imbalance), I will sometimes measure the IEMs 3-5 times to try to get a good reading. One of the big problems is if the tip is slightly bigger than the ear canal, it will sometimes fold in the ear canal and make a small leak, which will effect the resulting measurement. 
  
 Bottom line: I try very hard to get good readings, but I'm pretty sure at times a measurement will slip through that's not an accurate reflection of the product. 
  
 At any rate, I just wanted to let y'all know that measured imbalances should be held a bit suspect. I do try very hard, but I think sometimes a bad measurement slips through.


----------



## Inks

Good to know, goes to show you that, that B3 was just bad. Not only is FR bad, distortion levels are through the roof. Seeing as how another measurement site also had s bad pair, Havi needs to work on their QC. I do believe most people are getting a fairly matched pair but I could be wrong....

It's like the Monoprice 9927/8320 all over again, Many poor pairs out there but also some matched ones, luck of that draw...but that has The excuse of being a 7$ product.


----------



## Hitesh

@joker 
  
 Have you listened to VSD3/VSD3S ? How would you rate them in microphonics ? 4? 4.5? 5?


----------



## getclikinagas

hitesh said:


> @joker
> 
> Have you listened to VSD3/VSD3S ? How would you rate them in microphonics ? 4? 4.5? 5?


 
 http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/#comment-38281
  
"As with the other over-the-ear VSonic models, cable noise is virtually nonexistent and noise isolation is pretty good – about on-par with the GR07."


----------



## Hitesh

Thanks !
 Didn't know joker had brief-reviewed those


----------



## ljokerl

retrias said:


> joker have you heard of any of the rhapsodio products ?


 
  
 I haven't. 
  


zubin111 said:


> Hi Joker, cant thank enuf for the thread! Now moving to the question, my gear involves Fiio X3, Toppings NX1 along with Vsd1s, FXT90 and DN1K. Now Fxt sounds great with x3 so does dunu. I wanted to now try out a complementary earphone with some good quality bass (some EDM). I know all my collection is towards a slight V but still i feel sometimes it wouldnt harm to have a higher slamming earphone. I am intrigued by TTPOD T1-E as well as Havi B3, i understand that TTPOD suits the current requirement better but just as an option i would like a different signature. TTPOD because penonaudio ships to India, i am open to any other recommendation you have if it delivers to me and is not insanely expensive!


 
  
 As someone said above, do not buy the Havi for bass. I haven't tried the TTPOD and my recommendations for bass-heavy earphones with quality that's at least on-par with the FXT90 tend to be more expensive and probably not as readily available - the RHA MA750 and Yamaha EPH-100, for instance. The TTPOD seems to be highly recommended and costs a lot less, so it may be worth a try just on that basis.
  


poridge said:


> Can you comment on the isolation and comfort of the FLC8? I have my eyes on InEar SD2, seems like a viable upgrade from GR07, but the price difference, LOL.


 
  
 I thought the comfort was great, no complaints at all. They're actually a little curious in that respect - it really seems you can wear them both cable-up and cable down depending on how you orient the detachable cable. Isolation seems to be average. 
  


tyll hertsens said:


> I think I need to say that imbalances in mid to low frequencies in my IEM measurements need to be considered somewhat suspect.  I try VERY hard to ensure a good tip seal in the ears of my head, but it's very hard to be certain. The dummies ear canals are usually somewhere between the medium and small size tips shipped with IEM products, and getting a seal is sometimes very difficult.  When I do see an imbalance (and it's very easy for me to see as I seat the tips with 30H square waves) I will try to reseat the tips, change the tips, sometimes switch the IEMs left for right to see if the imbalance moves (in which case it's likely an actual imbalance), I will sometimes measure the IEMs 3-5 times to try to get a good reading. One of the big problems is if the tip is slightly bigger than the ear canal, it will sometimes fold in the ear canal and make a small leak, which will effect the resulting measurement.
> 
> Bottom line: I try very hard to get good readings, but I'm pretty sure at times a measurement will slip through that's not an accurate reflection of the product.
> 
> At any rate, I just wanted to let y'all know that measured imbalances should be held a bit suspect. I do try very hard, but I think sometimes a bad measurement slips through.


 
  
 Thanks for the insight!
  
 And just for the record in this case it was an audible imbalance, too. 
  


inks said:


> Good to know, goes to show you that, that B3 was just bad. Not only is FR bad, distortion levels are through the roof. Seeing as how another measurement site also had s bad pair, *Havi needs to work on their QC*. I do believe most people are getting a fairly matched pair but I could be wrong....
> 
> It's like the Monoprice 9927/8320 all over again, Many poor pairs out there but also some matched ones, luck of that draw...but that has The excuse of being a 7$ product.


 
  
 I came to the same conclusion after two units. Have the third one on hand now, should be able to check it out this weekend.


----------



## Ap616

Yeah, the T1-E bests the EPH-100 for me. At least one or two others said the same. Almost there in clarity/refinement(maybe like somewhere between 8.2-8.7 on your scale, just a guess...) and a much more enjoyable signature. I find the Yammys too bassy and smooth up top though they are quite refined. I think the TTPOD has the better bass presentation and some more energy up top but not overly as well, which translates to more of an all-arounder for me.


----------



## bonitomio

Hi ljokerl and many thanks for all your diligence and how generously share your experience for our benefit.
 Just bought x2 pairs of Philips SHE3590 for use at gym and I am very happy with their clarity, comfort, fidelity and sound signature especially for the money!
 A great recommendation.
 Cheers


----------



## vladzakhar

Hi IJockerI, how you can compare the SQ and comfort of the Rockets compare to DN2K? Thank you.


----------



## PoRidge

Hi, joker. I found that the westone 2 or um2 has a frequency response somewhat similar to that of gr07 or SD2. Have you heard it? Could you give a simple comparison between the westone and the sd2?


----------



## ljokerl

bonitomio said:


> Hi ljokerl and many thanks for all your diligence and how generously share your experience for our benefit.
> Just bought x2 pairs of Philips SHE3590 for use at gym and I am very happy with their clarity, comfort, fidelity and sound signature especially for the money!
> A great recommendation.
> Cheers


 
  
 Glad you like them 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





!
  


vladzakhar said:


> Hi IJockerI, how you can compare the SQ and comfort of the Rockets compare to DN2K? Thank you.


 
  
 Never tried the Rockets
  


poridge said:


> Hi, joker. I found that the westone 2 or um2 has a frequency response somewhat similar to that of gr07 or SD2. Have you heard it? Could you give a simple comparison between the westone and the sd2?


 
  
 I've only heard the Westone 2 and that was a while ago, but I would agree that in terms of signature it's very similar to the SD-2. GR07 less so - it has a little more bass and some treble emphasis that isn't there with the W2 or SD-2.


----------



## TrueMage22

truemage22 said:


> Thank you very much, guys (especially to Joker)! I'll try to find X10 and pray it will fit to her ears properly.


 
 Finally got these IEMs, but seems like I got fake.


----------



## warrior1975

I love this thread. Joker, I can't imagine how much hard work you've done to put all of this together, but it's really nothing short of amazing. You've done an incredible job, and have probably helped more people than you thought possible. Just wanted to thank you, I truly enjoy reading this thread. So a big THANK YOU!!!


----------



## carfentanil

Maybe it's that I like buying things other than audio gear from time to time, but I am ENTIRELY (well maybe 98.75% to be honest...) content (although I should add, far from _satisfied_) with my XBA-H1. Clarity and energy are fair or better than fair, and it seems fairly stable from genre-to-genre with the 1,000 or so tracks I have on my iPhone playing on random. In short, I never get bored with its sound. Maybe with other things, but never the sound itself. It has the warm, lush feeling I got from lesser Sony models and cheap dynamics, with less to find fault with, across pretty much the whole spectrum. I could live with this IEM forever. I am thankful for, among other things, this very thread and some others like it, having piqued my eventual interest in hybrids - and also that I found a Sony that doesn't either let in _all_ of the wind noise or suffer so badly from house sound that it is painfully obvious (to my brass ears anyway...)
  
 I am content to the point, I wish I was buying an FX-1100 from JVC so that after a first impression, I could sent it to joker for review. The anticipation would make the eventual return even better! He once recommended the JVC woodies to me. Ahhh, if only I could bring it full-circle. I'll probably get a pair, after all. Something like this time of year, 2018. 
  
 Thanks go out to every member who has contributed to this forum - and this thread especially. You have, directly or indirectly, enriched my life through better sound, and I'm grateful this place exists as the excellent community that it is. My only regret is that I must spend a great deal of time _*on hiatus from Head-Fi*_, in order that I don't recklessly spend a great deal of money *because of Head-Fi *- and similar sites, because it takes more than [relative terms:]_great sound_ to stay alive. Fortunately for me and my loved ones, great sound has made living a little more like *thriving*.


----------



## ld26

Can anyone confirm that the bass of the Fidelio S1 gets much lighter after burning in? Not that I really care since I rather bass-light headphones. Awesome IEM.


----------



## Nimbu

Joker - you were right! I got a set of HisoundAudio Crystals last week and i really like the sound. They remind me of the Brainwavz in many ways (similar - fun,warm signature) but with added clarity (which is almost on par with the RE-400).
  
 Mids aren't as spectacular as the RE-400, however it makes up for it in the low end - which is what i wanted.
  
 They seem to be a good match for my music taste.
  
 Thanks.


----------



## Hisoundfi

Hey joker, which model of the LG quadbeat do you prefer? 

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Francisk

I love the Quadbeat (1) Special Edition....much much more than the Quadbeat (1) or Quadbeat 2 Special Edition. The Quadbeat (1) Special Edition is the most balanced performer out of all the Quadbeat series. However a good fit and seal is crucial for this baby to sing. For me, it's the included single flange tips....YMMV


----------



## recarcar

It's really an unfortunate situation with the CK100pros. They are extraordinary IEMs. They are amazingly cheap now used in Japan. Wish I would have known that no one would want to check these out when I got mine cause they are so affordable now! Amazing that one can get what seems to still be a TOTL IEM for about $200USD.


----------



## zibra

Sony MDR EX1000 vs In Ear SD-2 comparision please?
  
 1. Bass quality and quantity
 2. Mids - positioning, body
 3. highs - which is more natural, relaxed for long listening without harshness and added "fake" sparkle to music?
  
 Thank you.


----------



## Retrias

zibra said:


> Sony MDR EX1000 vs In Ear SD-2 comparision please?
> 
> 1. Bass quality and quantity
> 2. Mids - positioning, body
> ...



this is the japans version of EX 1000 from memory 
EX 1000 have better bass extension and quantity , only a little bit more on the quantity but there is quite alot on the extension, the SD2 imo is more natural and relaxed for long listening sessions , their mid is about the same


----------



## zibra

What about MDR7550? I actually got these iems but thought more people heard EX1000.
 All I know 7550 is more relaxed on highs than EX1000 bu what about SD2. That would be even better for me as I prefer highs from very cheap Tenores or even Sony Mh1.


----------



## PoRidge

retrias said:


> this is the japans version of EX 1000 from memory
> EX 1000 have better bass extension and quantity , only a little bit more on the quantity but there is quite alot on the extension, the SD2 imo is more natural and relaxed for long listening sessions , their mid is about the same


 
 I would say the SD2 has better extension in the low. SD2 is not worse than EXK on the treble, though it may make you feel it is lacking during a comparison. The EXK puts more emphasis on the high range of the frequency and feels much brighter than the SD2. SD2 is more relaxed and better for long listening. SD2 is very flat from the bass to the mids.


----------



## yalper

Joker congratulations for *1000*th page of your thread


----------



## goodvibes

Hear here.


----------



## altrunox

1k, congratz


----------



## zibra

poridge said:


> I would say the SD2 has better extension in the low. SD2 is not worse than EXK on the treble, though it may make you feel it is lacking during a comparison. The EXK puts more emphasis on the high range of the frequency and feels much brighter than the SD2. SD2 is more relaxed and better for long listening. SD2 is very flat from the bass to the mids.


 
 That could be my favourite as MDR7550 has for my ears tendency to sibilance but its not bright. Its not very annyoning but sometimes disturbing. 
So SD2 is sibilant free? I wonder whats with that bass as I get 2 different opinions
There is also smaller version with letter "S" - Is there no sonic difference due to different size of housing?


----------



## PoRidge

I did not notice a sound difference on the smaller housing, but I only had them on for a short time when I chose which size to get. I thought I needed an s, because I usually use smaller size ear-tips. Turned out the bigger one fits better. If you want one, try it first.

The sd2 is very smooth definitely. I am quite immune to sibilance, I can even stand the sibilance on EXK. So I think you might need someone else to judge. But if they are not sibilance free, I can't imagine what is.

For the bass, the extension is very good on both and should be the last you worry about. Bass quality of the SD2 is top class, but may lack a little bit impact. And it still doesn't taste the same as a dynamic, like EXK,GR07.



Congrat, joker. I am so happy to be on this page to celebrate.


----------



## Shawn71

He really is Grand......

So how does the sibilance of SD2 compared to GR07s.....Im sorry if you dont have one to compare......


----------



## PoRidge

shawn71 said:


> He really is Grand......
> 
> So how does the sibilance of SD2 compared to GR07s.....Im sorry if you dont have one to compare......




The EXK was from my firend, so I don't have exk and sd2 for side by side comparison. The comparison is done through using GR07 as the reference.

SD2 is sibilance free compared to the gr07, and maybe more natural. I like the treble of gr07 though.(only a personal preference)



joker, you made it 1000 and you have an EX1000 question on this page.


----------



## 1clearhead

Now if only we can live 1000 years! 
  
 >>> *Long live the Joker!*
*Congratulations!*


----------



## Shawn71

poridge said:


> The EXK was from my firend, so I don't have exk and sd2 for side by side comparison. The comparison is done through using GR07 as the reference.
> 
> SD2 is sibilance free compared to the gr07, and maybe more natural. I like the treble of gr07 though.(only a personal preference)
> 
> ...




K....thats nice!.....and lol, we still make joker tiresome even on 1000th page......hes off sunday.


----------



## james444

In before 1001. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
 Congrats!


----------



## joe it

Complimenti e grazie ancora 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




​


----------



## Zelda

Now we need a Multi IEM Review 1000 iems


----------



## dezane222

hi joker,
 i looking for an iem under $150 that has great clarity,lush,clean mid/vocal beside ba200 
 what iem will you recommend ?


----------



## cylpol1

Will you review the fxt200


----------



## ozkan

dezane222 said:


> hi joker,
> i looking for an iem under $150 that has great clarity,lush,clean mid/vocal beside ba200
> what iem will you recommend ?


 
  
 Audio Technica Ath-IM02 on amazon


----------



## ljokerl

Whoo! Thread hit 1000 pages as we were having a power outage for the first time in a couple of years, which meant music by candlelight and an early evening.
  
 Luckily power just came on so now I can thank you all for your kind wishes on this milestone, and of course for all of the support I've received through the years. This thread would have died out long ago without all of the feedback and the community spirit behind it, including support from the Head-Fi admins.
  
 Going back to bed now, but you guys have made my night
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


nimbu said:


> Joker - you were right! I got a set of HisoundAudio Crystals last week and i really like the sound. They remind me of the Brainwavz in many ways (similar - fun,warm signature) but with added clarity (which is almost on par with the RE-400).
> 
> Mids aren't as spectacular as the RE-400, however it makes up for it in the low end - which is what i wanted.
> 
> ...


 
  




  


hisoundfi said:


> Hey joker, which model of the LG quadbeat do you prefer?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


 
  
 I've only tried one - the F420. So that one, I guess.
  


zibra said:


> What about MDR7550? I actually got these iems but thought more people heard EX1000.
> All I know 7550 is more relaxed on highs than EX1000 bu what about SD2. That would be even better for me as I prefer highs from very cheap Tenores or even Sony Mh1.


 
  
 SD-2 and MDR-7550 are actually not very different at all in overall balance or tone. SD-2 is about as sibilance-free as it gets with a balanced sound so it should be a good option - there are a few sets that kill sibilance better, like the EarSonics SM3, HiFiMan RE-400/RE-600, and the MH1C you mentioned, but at that performance level and with a fairly balanced signature I'd say the SD-2 is your best option. It's certainly not as prone to it as the GR07 or EX1000.
  


dezane222 said:


> hi joker,
> i looking for an iem under $150 that has great clarity,lush,clean mid/vocal beside ba200
> what iem will you recommend ?


 
  
 Brainwavz R3 and HiFiMan RE-400
  


cylpol1 said:


> Will you review the fxt200


 
  
 Never even heard of it until now. Not in the cards for the time being.


----------



## zibra

I ordered SD-2 from Thommann as I have 30 days return guarantee.
 If it doesnt meet my expectations Ill try something different. Maybe SM3 or RE600 you just mentioned.


----------



## piotrus-g

ljokerl said:


> Whoo! Thread hit 1000 pages


 
 Congrats |joker|!


----------



## getclikinagas

Congrats ljokerl 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 1000 pages and 10000 posts! Way more than 10000 in fact. The first 7 posts in this thread have more than 400 posts crammed into it. 
 And the most important/impressive fact is that around 3000 of those posts are dedicated to help/suggestions.
  
 When Head-fiers are asked "What do you think of the legendary joker?", a follow-up question of "which one?" is inevitable 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
  
  
  
  
 A big thank you from all of us!


----------



## ljokerl

piotrus-g said:


> Congrats |joker|!


 
  
 Thank you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Forgot to mention that the global nature of this community never ceases to amaze me. 
  


getclikinagas said:


> Congrats ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I am beyond flattered


----------



## Hoplite

A grand well deserved


----------



## ozkan

Congrats Joker. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 RE300H is out with $49 price tag. Do you have plans to get your hands on them?  It seems it is the most bassier model of all RE series so far. Some members say it is on par with RE-ZERO and love child of RE400 and Havi B3. Would like to see your review soon.


----------



## Shawn71

ozkan said:


> Congrats Joker.
> 
> RE400H is out with $49 price tag. Do you have plans to get your hands on them?  It seems it is the most bassier model of all RE series so far. Some members say it is on par with RE-ZERO and love child of RE400 and Havi B3. Would like to see your review soon.




re300H..... love child of B3?:mad:


----------



## ozkan

shawn71 said:


> re300H.....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Ooops sorry I mean RE300H. I just corrected it.


----------



## rawrster

All these reviews and yet no tf10..


----------



## suman134

rawrster said:


> All these reviews and yet no tf10..


 

 no place for lost blood !!


----------



## proedros

all these people in here looking for a great iem under 200$

 Hifiman RE-600 is on sale as we speak with a 50% off its price , going for 199$ down from 399$

 bargain....


----------



## Chiho

proedros said:


> all these people in here looking for a great iem under 200$
> 
> 
> Hifiman RE-600 is on sale as we speak with a 50% off its price , going for 199$ down from 399$
> ...



Waiting for it...


----------



## ljokerl

ozkan said:


> Congrats Joker.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'm sure I'll have them on-hand eventually - maybe from InnerFidelity. Should be interesting!
  


rawrster said:


> All these reviews and yet no tf10..


 
  
 Clearly I've been slacking


----------



## OMGLadyGaga

I dont have much iem experience, but i do have a couple. GR07BE, Sony H3 and ummm i guess Pistons are my best ones. The rest are cheapies but goodies. I like the H-3 the best, i like it but dont love it. Its really big and its hard to put on and off in a relatively quick manner, and they dont sound great straight from my phone, they do A LOT better from better sources amped IMO, but i dont want to carry anything extra around. I like the soundstage of the H-3, like the heavy bass, the pistons have more i think and thats a bit too much so H-3 are just right for iem duty. The rest is fine and i like it quite a bit. So whats an upgrade or even a sidegrade that has comparable if not even better soundstaging and similar levels of heavy bass but better ergonomics and also driven better from a lowly Nexus 5 on the go. Maybe a dynamic like the IE80? Ive always wanted to try those. Anything else? I use the Pistons more just because they are easier to take on and off and are more portable but they do get unfomfortable, and SQ isnt spectacular but definitely very good for the price(i have 3 of them )


----------



## Retrias

Take this with a grain of salt , I am not exactly an expert on this hobby, to me dynamic driver bass is pretty unique , I found them better than BA drivers bass. I suppose you can get the Ie80s, the GR02 is pretty easy to drive as well


----------



## kendric

omgladygaga said:


> I dont have much iem experience, but i do have a couple. GR07BE, Sony H3 and ummm i guess Pistons are my best ones. The rest are cheapies but goodies. I like the H-3 the best, i like it but dont love it. Its really big and its hard to put on and off in a relatively quick manner, and they dont sound great straight from my phone, they do A LOT better from better sources amped IMO, but i dont want to carry anything extra around. I like the soundstage of the H-3, like the heavy bass, the pistons have more i think and thats a bit too much so H-3 are just right for iem duty. The rest is fine and i like it quite a bit. So whats an upgrade or even a sidegrade that has comparable if not even better soundstaging and similar levels of heavy bass but better ergonomics and also driven better from a lowly Nexus 5 on the go. Maybe a dynamic like the IE80? Ive always wanted to try those. Anything else? I use the Pistons more just because they are easier to take on and off and are more portable but they do get unfomfortable, and SQ isnt spectacular but definitely very good for the price(i have 3 of them )


 

 Somehow the FX850 came to my mind


----------



## OMGLadyGaga

kendric said:


> Somehow the FX850 came to my mind :etysmile:




Are those the fabled woodies? Didnt even think of those, i was thinking theyd be a little too v shaped no? Will try to read up on em thanks


----------



## Retrias

omgladygaga said:


> Are those the fabled woodies? Didnt even think of those, i was thinking theyd be a little too v shaped no? Will try to read up on em thanks



not really I wouldnt call them V shaped , they have this smooth treble , their mid wasnt that recessed either


----------



## vwinter

They're pretty V shaped IMO. But the midrange isn't really positioned back by the imaging (bypassing that "recessed" feeling). Rather, it's just lower in amplitude to the bass and treble. So it works.


----------



## zibra

omgladygaga said:


> I dont have much iem experience, but i do have a couple. GR07BE, Sony H3 and ummm i guess Pistons are my best ones. The rest are cheapies but goodies. I like the H-3 the best, i like it but dont love it. Its really big and its hard to put on and off in a relatively quick manner, and they dont sound great straight from my phone, they do A LOT better from better sources amped IMO, but i dont want to carry anything extra around. I like the soundstage of the H-3, like the heavy bass, the pistons have more i think and thats a bit too much so H-3 are just right for iem duty. The rest is fine and i like it quite a bit. So whats an upgrade or even a sidegrade that has comparable if not even better soundstaging and similar levels of heavy bass but better ergonomics and also driven better from a lowly Nexus 5 on the go. Maybe a dynamic like the IE80? Ive always wanted to try those. Anything else? I use the Pistons more just because they are easier to take on and off and are more portable but they do get unfomfortable, and SQ isnt spectacular but definitely very good for the price(i have 3 of them )


 
 For phone just get Tenores. Or just get DX90 - it was great pairing wit MDR7550, so youd like it with h3 also I believe.
 I also wanted someting for LG G2 but after hearing DX90...I almost convinced myself for buying it but already spent for In Ear SD2. If they dont beat MDR7550 a lot then Id jump into DX90 train...


----------



## ljokerl

omgladygaga said:


> I dont have much iem experience, but i do have a couple. GR07BE, Sony H3 and ummm i guess Pistons are my best ones. The rest are cheapies but goodies. I like the H-3 the best, i like it but dont love it. Its really big and its hard to put on and off in a relatively quick manner, and they dont sound great straight from my phone, they do A LOT better from better sources amped IMO, but i dont want to carry anything extra around. I like the soundstage of the H-3, like the heavy bass, the pistons have more i think and thats a bit too much so H-3 are just right for iem duty. The rest is fine and i like it quite a bit. So whats an upgrade or even a sidegrade that has comparable if not even better soundstaging and similar levels of heavy bass but better ergonomics and also driven better from a lowly Nexus 5 on the go. Maybe a dynamic like the IE80? Ive always wanted to try those. Anything else? I use the Pistons more just because they are easier to take on and off and are more portable but they do get unfomfortable, and SQ isnt spectacular but definitely very good for the price(i have 3 of them )


 
  
 I haven't tried as many of the really bassy earphones out there as I've tried other ones. The IE80 is certainly a good one if you don't find the over-the-ear form factor troublesome - it has the bass and it has the stability from various sources. The IE800 is more straightforward in fit (cable down vs over-the-ear), but of course a lot more expensive. I haven't tried the FX850 but my experience with the FX750 leads me to believe it might be a viable option as well. Very easy to use - just pop in and go - and the FX750 sounded very good already.


----------



## PoRidge

zibra said:


> For phone just get Tenores. Or just get DX90 - it was great pairing wit MDR7550, so youd like it with h3 also I believe.
> I also wanted someting for LG G2 but after hearing DX90...I almost convinced myself for buying it but already spent for In Ear SD2. If they dont beat MDR7550 a lot then Id jump into DX90 train...


 
 Currently using SD2 + DX90, it's a pretty completed portable solution for me. I don't want an amp for my portable rig.
  
 Has your SD2 arrived yet? I am eager to hear your opinion on SD2 and 7550.


----------



## zibra

poridge said:


> Currently using SD2 + DX90, it's a pretty completed portable solution for me. I don't want an amp for my portable rig.
> 
> Has your SD2 arrived yet? I am eager to hear your opinion on SD2 and 7550.




Today Ill receive it - cant wait to compare it to mdr7550. I also got audio technica ckr9 and tenores. I dont have dx90 but I want to audition it with all iems soon and compare to fiio x5.


----------



## Hisoundfi

Question for you sir... 

I don't want to dip my toes in the water anymore, and want to make a big splash in the pool of personal audio. 

I want the best! Looking at your list I've narrowed it down to 3 iems... 

JH13, JH16, and Kaiser 10

Which one would you prefer and why? 

If you have a link that would work too. 

Thanks in advance


----------



## yalper

hisoundfi said:


> Question for you sir...
> 
> I don't want to dip my toes in the water anymore, and want to make a big splash in the pool of personal audio.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I hope I will get K10 one day, and forget every purchase I have made before


----------



## jpguy

Can't decide between GR07 Classic and VC1000. Which one is more analytical, detailed and clear sounding iem?


----------



## kova4a

jpguy said:


> Can't decide between GR07 Classic and VC1000. Which one is more analytical, detailed and clear sounding iem?


 
 Well, if the gr07 classic is realy on par with the standard gr07 version then VC1000 will be the one. I do remember some people reporting issues with the build quality and the drivers but it might have been fixed by now. Just a heads up.


----------



## zibra

poridge said:


> Currently using SD2 + DX90, it's a pretty completed portable solution for me. I don't want an amp for my portable rig.
> 
> Has your SD2 arrived yet? I am eager to hear your opinion on SD2 and 7550.


 
 From initial listening I find SD2 overall better and more natural sounding wit better dynamics, precision and highs (fortunately). 7550 advantage is in that impressive soundstage and also mids are comparable - just SD2 got it more intimate. About bass I need to listen more carefully but SD2 got it even tighter and faster. Overall 7550 sounds generally "softer" and I dont like that tendency to sibilance at some vocals.
 Its early impression because Im listening from LG G2 and Im sure its not enough for both iems after hearing 7550 paired with DX90. Still thinking about it though but considering also lower priced options (X3, DX50)


----------



## Stereodude

What (C)IEM, is a cross between the Westone 4 and the HiFiMAN RE-600?


----------



## PoRidge

zibra said:


> From initial listening I find SD2 overall better and more natural sounding wit better dynamics, precision and highs (fortunately). 7550 advantage is in that impressive soundstage and also mids are comparable - just SD2 got it more intimate. About bass I need to listen more carefully but SD2 got it even tighter and faster. Overall 7550 sounds generally "softer" and I dont like that tendency to sibilance at some vocals.
> Its early impression because Im listening from LG G2 and Im sure its not enough for both iems after hearing 7550 paired with DX90. Still thinking about it though but considering also lower priced options (X3, DX50)


 
  
 I am happy that you like it. It's a very good package at that price range.


----------



## ljokerl

hisoundfi said:


> Question for you sir...
> 
> I don't want to dip my toes in the water anymore, and want to make a big splash in the pool of personal audio.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Unfortunately I've only tried the JH13 between those three (wish I had the others 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





). I can't recommend it enough, but I also can't provide a comparison against the JH16 or K10.
  


jpguy said:


> Can't decide between GR07 Classic and VC1000. Which one is more analytical, detailed and clear sounding iem?


 
  
 VC1000, definitely.
  


stereodude said:


> What (C)IEM, is a cross between the Westone 4 and the HiFiMAN RE-600?


 
  
 A cross in which way(s)? I.e. what are your desired traits from each?


----------



## Stereodude

ljokerl said:


> A cross in which way(s)? I.e. what are your desired traits from each?


 
  
 Well, something like a RE-600 with a little more mid bass and perhaps a tad less upper mids, which would make it like W4 with a bit less mid bass and a little more upper mids & treble.
  
 Ultimately, I'd love a (C)IEM that sounds like my HE-500s.


----------



## Tobias89

poridge said:


> Sound tuning by changing nozzles is not only a concept. A China based company, FLC, made flc8 a tunable iem by chaning nozzles, ports and dampers, etc. Using their patented parts that comes with the iem, users can make a total of 36 different tunings.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 This looks interesting, but I can't find any further information on this, not even an official website. Anyone has a lead on these?


----------



## PoRidge

tobias89 said:


> This looks interesting, but I can't find any further information on this, not even an official website. Anyone has a lead on these?


 
  
 They are a pretty small company so far, so I don't think they have an official website. They have done reshell and ciems for some time now in the Mainland China region on Taobao and focused on ba + dynamic hybrid iem. Their reshelled MG6s are pretty good though. I heard that some of the UE engineers went to this company after the Logitech acquisition.
  
 http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=41516418075
 This seller ships internationally. Maybe you can find someone on ebay selling them.
  
 If you want more pictures of flc8(I didn't find the English version and I doubt that they have the English one.)
 http://www.erji.net/read.php?tid=1722772


----------



## 1clearhead

tobias89 said:


> This looks interesting, but I can't find any further information on this, not even an official website. Anyone has a lead on these?


 
  
 The best I can do is show you an official Chinese website to view or purchase them......
http://tw.taobao.com/item/41427930959.htm?spm=a1z3o.7406521.0.0.LgVhRL


----------



## getclikinagas

tobias89 said:


> This looks interesting, but I can't find any further information on this, not even an official website. Anyone has a lead on these?


 
 LMUE (Lend me ur ears) has an introductory 17% off sale (Coupon: seasons17). So, hopefully we'll be seeing more of it
  
 http://www.lendmeurears.com/flc-8/


----------



## rated1975

Hi Joker, congratulations on 1000 pages!
Took your advice on the RE-400 for classical music thanks. They are great though I feel they are a little too warm for my taste, so can you recommend another iem up to $300 which is a little more v-shaped, as i feel i need something brighter and something with more weight in the low end. As an example, the RE-400's IMO arent convincing in the low end with cello. I also still highly value an iem with great midrange clarity, and something with a wider soundstage would also be welcomed. Would the VC-1000 fit the bill?


----------



## ozkan

rated1975 said:


> Hi Joker, congratulations on 1000 pages!
> Took your advice on the RE-400 for classical music thanks. They are great though I feel they are a little too warm for my taste, so can you recommend another iem up to $300 which is a little more v-shaped, as i feel i need something brighter and something with more weight in the low end. As an example, the RE-400's IMO arent convincing in the low end with cello. I also still highly value an iem with great midrange clarity, and something with a wider soundstage would also be welcomed. Would the VC-1000 fit the bill?




Fidue A83 or Havi B3 Pro 1


----------



## vwinter

Crazy question of the day:

Does anyone know if the GR07 Classic's sensitivity is 105dB/mW or 105dB/V?


----------



## jpguy

kova4a said:


> Well, if the gr07 classic is realy on par with the standard gr07 version then VC1000 will be the one. I do remember some people reporting issues with the build quality and the drivers but it might have been fixed by now. Just a heads up.


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> VC1000, definitely.


 
 ok, thanks. I got confused reading through VC1000 thread as some users were claiming it being far from analytical but rather fun/musical iem ( maybe when compared to other dual BA earphones)...anyway thanks for clearing that up..


----------



## jay567

rated1975 said:


> Hi Joker, congratulations on 1000 pages!
> Took your advice on the RE-400 for classical music thanks. They are great though I feel they are a little too warm for my taste, so can you recommend another iem up to $300 which is a little more v-shaped, as i feel i need something brighter and something with more weight in the low end. As an example, the RE-400's IMO arent convincing in the low end with cello. I also still highly value an iem with great midrange clarity, and something with a wider soundstage would also be welcomed. Would the VC-1000 fit the bill?


 
 Honestly a modded and an EQ'd HE400 is exactly that... Open soundstage, layered imaging, the bass impact and texture, the detailed and transparent mids, the sparkly highs, the overall fun sound... It isn't FOTM anymore and I know it isn't an IEM too but with the price of it nowadays, it's dumb to look over it in my opinion. HOWEVER, you need jergpads on them and EQ them a few dBs for them to sound amazing.


----------



## deathdemon

Thanks for the CK100 review! it's very interesting i will try it.


----------



## ljokerl

stereodude said:


> Well, something like a RE-600 with a little more mid bass and perhaps a tad less upper mids, which would make it like W4 with a bit less mid bass and a little more upper mids & treble.
> 
> Ultimately, I'd love a (C)IEM that sounds like my HE-500s.


 
  
 Nothing comes to mind as a perfect fit but some are close. Some universal options are the Fidue A83, StageDiver SD-2, UE900, TDK BA200, and Shure SE535. The A83 has the right bass balance but I feel like you'll miss some of the clarity of the RE-600's forward mids with its more v-shaped sig. The SD-2, UE900, BA200, and SE535 are flatter and don't really have a mid-bass hump in the way the Westones do. However, I did prefer their bass to the HiFiMan sets individually and they all have a little less upper midrange presence than the RE-600. Among these flatter-sounding one I feel like the UE900 might be the best fit for you, maybe just a touch bright overall but with the right amount of upper mids. The slightly warmer BA200 and SD-2 would be a close second. 
  
 With customs it's even harder to find a sig where the bass and upper mids/treble both fall between the RE-600 and W4 (maybe because I have far fewer customs to choose from than universals). The closest I can think of are the Westone ES5, Noble 4S, and Custom Art Pro 330v2. The ES5 is a good fit otherwise but too warm and bassy on the whole (though the bass quality is better than with the W4 so maybe that's fine). The Noble 4S bass is much more RE-600 than W4 in balance and power (meaning leaner than what you're after). The Custom Art Pro 330v2 has less upper mids, but it is still brighter overall than the RE-400/RE-600. 
  


rated1975 said:


> Hi Joker, congratulations on 1000 pages!
> Took your advice on the RE-400 for classical music thanks. They are great though I feel they are a little too warm for my taste, so can you recommend another iem up to $300 which is a little more v-shaped, as i feel i need something brighter and something with more weight in the low end. As an example, the RE-400's IMO arent convincing in the low end with cello. I also still highly value an iem with great midrange clarity, and something with a wider soundstage would also be welcomed. Would the VC-1000 fit the bill?


 
  
 VC1000 is too lean. A hybrid like the DUNU DN-2000 or the Fidue A83 recommended by *ozkan* would be a better way to go. 
  


vwinter said:


> Crazy question of the day:
> 
> Does anyone know if the GR07 Classic's sensitivity is 105dB/mW or 105dB/V?


 
  
 Unknowable for certain but most likely 105 dB/mW. Even with full-size cans it's rare to see db/V listed.


----------



## Jozurr

Hi Joker,
  
 What do you think would be a good natural upgrade to the RHA MA750 with a similar signature?
  
 Also, have you heard the funktion one speaker systems? can you recommend any iems/headphones which sound the closest to it?
  
 thanks


----------



## Stereodude

ljokerl said:


> Nothing comes to mind as a perfect fit but some are close. Some universal options are the Fidue A83, StageDiver SD-2, UE900, TDK BA200, and Shure SE535. The A83 has the right bass balance but I feel like you'll miss some of the clarity of the RE-600's forward mids with its more v-shaped sig. The SD-2, UE900, BA200, and SE535 are flatter and don't really have a mid-bass hump in the way the Westones do. However, I did prefer their bass to the HiFiMan sets individually and they all have a little less upper midrange presence than the RE-600. Among these flatter-sounding one I feel like the UE900 might be the best fit for you, maybe just a touch bright overall but with the right amount of upper mids. The slightly warmer BA200 and SD-2 would be a close second.
> 
> With customs it's even harder to find a sig where the bass and upper mids/treble both fall between the RE-600 and W4 (maybe because I have far fewer customs to choose from than universals). The closest I can think of are the Westone ES5, Noble 4S, and Custom Art Pro 330v2. The ES5 is a good fit otherwise but too warm and bassy on the whole (though the bass quality is better than with the W4 so maybe that's fine). The Noble 4S bass is much more RE-600 than W4 in balance and power (meaning leaner than what you're after). The Custom Art Pro 330v2 has less upper mids, but it is still brighter overall than the RE-400/RE-600.


 
  
 Thanks for taking the time to offer the suggestions.  Time to do some research!


----------



## vwinter

ljokerl said:


> Unknowable for certain but most likely 105 dB/mW. Even with full-size cans it's rare to see db/V listed.




Yea I would have guessed dB/mW. I do have/have had a few IEMs with specs listed in dB/V so it wasn't too easy an assumption for me. Thanks!


----------



## james444

omgladygaga said:


> I dont have much iem experience, but i do have a couple. GR07BE, Sony H3 and ummm i guess Pistons are my best ones. The rest are cheapies but goodies. I like the H-3 the best, i like it but dont love it. Its really big and its hard to put on and off in a relatively quick manner, and they dont sound great straight from my phone, they do A LOT better from better sources amped IMO, but i dont want to carry anything extra around. I like the soundstage of the H-3, like the heavy bass, the pistons have more i think and thats a bit too much so H-3 are just right for iem duty. The rest is fine and i like it quite a bit. So whats an upgrade or even a sidegrade that has comparable if not even better soundstaging and similar levels of heavy bass but better ergonomics and also driven better from a lowly Nexus 5 on the go. Maybe a dynamic like the IE80? Ive always wanted to try those. Anything else? I use the Pistons more just because they are easier to take on and off and are more portable but they do get unfomfortable, and SQ isnt spectacular but definitely very good for the price(i have 3 of them )


 


kendric said:


> Somehow the FX850 came to my mind


 


omgladygaga said:


> Are those the fabled woodies? Didnt even think of those, i was thinking theyd be a little too v shaped no? Will try to read up on em thanks


 


vwinter said:


> They're pretty V shaped IMO. But the midrange isn't really positioned back by the imaging (bypassing that "recessed" feeling). Rather, it's just lower in amplitude to the bass and treble. So it works.


 


ljokerl said:


> I haven't tried as many of the really bassy earphones out there as I've tried other ones. The IE80 is certainly a good one if you don't find the over-the-ear form factor troublesome - it has the bass and it has the stability from various sources. The IE800 is more straightforward in fit (cable down vs over-the-ear), but of course a lot more expensive. I haven't tried the FX850 but my experience with the FX750 leads me to believe it might be a viable option as well. Very easy to use - just pop in and go - and the FX750 sounded very good already.


 
  
 Another vote for the FX850. Unless you're sensitive to forward treble, that is, since the JVCs treble is significantly less laid-back than the H3's. As for the FX750, they're very similar, but the FX850 have slightly better mids presence. Granted, they're still v-shaped, but like vwinter said, it fits in with the imaging and somehow works.
  
 There's also an easy mod to attenuate the JVC's bass if desired (don't worry, still plenty of it left  and give their mids even more room to shine.


----------



## waynes world

james444 said:


> Another vote for the FX850. *Unless you're sensitive to forward treble, that is,* since the JVCs treble is significantly less laid-back than the H3's. As for the FX750, they're very similar, but the FX850 have slightly better mids presence. Granted, they're still v-shaped, but like vwinter said, it fits in with the imaging and somehow works.
> 
> There's also an easy mod to attenuate the JVC's bass if desired (don't worry, still plenty of it left  and give their mids even more room to shine.


 
  
 Forward, but not harsh, metallic or sibilant, correct?


----------



## james444

waynes world said:


> Forward, but not harsh, metallic or sibilant, correct?


 
  
 Correct, it's excellent quality treble in my book, just not nearly as polite as the H3's.


----------



## OMGLadyGaga

james444 said:


> Another vote for the FX850. Unless you're sensitive to forward treble, that is, since the JVCs treble is significantly less laid-back than the H3's. As for the FX750, they're very similar, but the FX850 have slightly better mids presence. Granted, they're still v-shaped, but like vwinter said, it fits in with the imaging and somehow works.
> 
> There's also an easy mod to attenuate the JVC's bass if desired (don't worry, still plenty of it left  and give their mids even more room to shine.


 

Cool. I ordered the FX850 and ie80. Will return the loser. The GR07 and RHA750 are too bright for me so we'll see how these fair . Thanks


----------



## james444

omgladygaga said:


> Cool. I ordered the FX850 and ie80. Will return the loser. The GR07 and RHA750 are too bright for me so we'll see how these fair . Thanks




Good decision. Imo the IE80 are not quite at eye level with the FX850 overall, but their treble is more in line with what you like on your H3 and their design is very well thought out for mobile use.


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

Hello everyone and specialy to the great "ljokerl". I need your kind assistance.
  
 I have been a happy user of the RE-400 and the Ety ER4P for a while and I am ready to upgrade, the question is what to get. I share with you the areas I would like to improve over these excellent IEMs and I am appreciative for your guidance of an IEM for a budget of up to $1,000 (not customs for the moment, just universals) that matches the following criteria as much as possible.
  
 In regards with overall "tonality" both the RE-400 and the Etys are perfect for my taste so the overall tonality of the newIEM shall be similar.
  
 For guidance on what I like I also have the non-IEMs like Beyer T70p (love the clarity but too sibilant with many recordings), the AKG 550 (love this headphone overall, but lacks some magic) and the grado PS500e (love this one but it is peculiar as it doesn't sound great with all music, maybe too edgy sometimes) and the Beoplay H6 (I love this HP, fantastic all-terrain headphone that plays well all kinds of music, nice balance of clarity and musicality). One HP I hated is the new Sony Z7 that I found muddy, super slow, super bassy and overall extremely unbalanced, dark, and boring. I returned it after a week of trying it.
  
 I listen to many types of music, the only thing I don't listen too much is HipHop and country. For the rest I listen to all other genres but mainly Indie, alternative. electronica, americana, punk, rock and then jazz and classical.
  
*Treble:* I love the treble of the Ety ER4P, so I like the new IEM to match it. Importantly the Ety ER4P is extended but smooth, and will never bother with sibilance. I hate sibilance but I love extended highs and smooth detailed airy high frequencies.
  
*Bass: *I like better bass presence than the Ety ER4P and the RE-400. I am not a bashed, so the bass has to be extended, with good sub bass but never ever affecting clarity of mids and the overall tonality of the sound. I hate dark thick headphones, I love clarity. I hate slow headphones I love fast headphones with good PRaT. I love fast and "solid" bass, with good extension and never affecting the mids. I hate muddy bass. I love sub-bass but only when the music calls for it.
  
*Mids:* natural sounding, not too aggressive but not retracted, balanced with the other frequencies ranges. I love the mids of the Ety ER4P, so the new IEM has to at least be as good as the Etys. I love that the vocals are present and natural, not hidden behind the instruments.
  
*Soundstage: *both the RE-400 and Ethys are limited in soundstage. I like a bit more out of the head soundstage, but natural sounding with enough presence to not feel distant, but neither has to be on your face in between the ears. A good balanace of feeling that the music is around you but still connected with you. I don't like sound that appears to be too distant, not like watching a concert from the 50th row, more like watching from the 5th row.
  
*Imaging: *I like good imaging and good instrument separation, but shall respect the musicality even of bad recordings. I don't like an IEM that is so technically advanced that reveals all the bad things of recordings so that only great recordings play well. It has to play fine with most music.
  
*Clarity: *I love the clarity of the Etys and I don't want to give up clarity while maintaining and even enhancing the "musicality". I don't like sterile analytical, I like musical sound but very clear.
  
*Cohesivity: *the sound has to be natural cohesive. Unfortunately I find many HP where even when the parts (frequency ranges) are fine they don't integrate well overall and sound artificial. It as to sound as music, like a good HiFi speaker.
  
 I considered to purchase the InEar StageDiver 2 as it seems that ljokerl has mentioned that it will be a good upgrade over the RE-400, but it seems that it is not in stock at ALO audio, unfortunately. Other IEMs that I am considering are the B&W C5 Series 2, the Weston W60 or W40, the Senheiser IE800, the Shure SE840 or the NuForce Primo8 or some of the new universals from Noble audio. The problem is that I cannot demo these IEMs before purchase so I will have to make a call based on your guidance. Of course I don't need to be limited to these IEMs if you have a different advise or recommendation I will be appreciative.
  
 Thank you in advance.


----------



## yalper

mrguzmanwhite said:


> Hello everyone and specialy to the great "ljokerl". I need your kind assistance.
> 
> I have been a happy user of the RE-400 and the Ety ER4P for a while and I am ready to upgrade, the question is what to get. I share with you the areas I would like to improve over these excellent IEMs and I am appreciative for your guidance of an IEM for a budget of up to $1,000 (not customs for the moment, just universals) that matches the following criteria as much as possible.
> 
> ...


 
 you need to give Havi B3 a try, with sony hybrid tips, and an amp 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 it is a huge upgrade from RE400 and ticks all of your needs.


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

yalper said:


> you need to give Havi B3 a try, with sony hybrid tips, and an amp
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Thank you, never heard of the Havi B3 before but in browsing quickly the forums it seems people really describe a very inexpensive jewel in the crowded field of below $100 IEMs. Very inexpensive if it really has reference SQ levels. I drive my IEM out of the iPhone, it is very inconvenient for me to carry along another amp just to drive the IEM as I use it a lot for the gym. Is the Havi B3 Ok when using an iPhone 5? If you advise for an inexpensive amp that is easy to carry, which one would you advise?
  
 Are there counterfeits of the Havi B3 to be aware off ... is it safe to purchase it directly from Amazon.com in the USA?


----------



## zibra

mrguzmanwhite said:


> Hello everyone and specialy to the great "ljokerl". I need your kind assistance.
> 
> I have been a happy user of the RE-400 and the Ety ER4P for a while and I am ready to upgrade, the question is what to get. I share with you the areas I would like to improve over these excellent IEMs and I am appreciative for your guidance of an IEM for a budget of up to $1,000 (not customs for the moment, just universals) that matches the following criteria as much as possible.
> 
> ...


 
 I strongly recommend SD-2. Its absolutely phenomenal iem wit great balance and weight of sound. For my taste its tuning is perfect for long listening especially with small tips. Also comfort and build is top notch.


----------



## proedros

Hi Joker ,
  
 have you tried the RE-600 ? any plans on doing a full review here ?

 regards.


----------



## ZapX629

proedros said:


> Hi Joker ,
> 
> have you tried the RE-600 ? any plans on doing a full review here ?
> 
> regards.


 

 He did one here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

zibra said:


> I strongly recommend SD-2. Its absolutely phenomenal iem wit great balance and weight of sound. For my taste its tuning is perfect for long listening especially with small tips. Also comfort and build is top notch.


 

 Thank you very much. I assume with "SD-2" you mean stage diver-2? I
  
 am trying to purchase it but ALO Audio en the USA don't have it at this stage ... very unfortunate. Do you know other vendors to get it from in the USA?


----------



## ljokerl

jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> What do you think would be a good natural upgrade to the RHA MA750 with a similar signature?
> 
> ...


 
  
 The FX850 the way james444 described it (below) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





. Otherwise, not sure. Maybe the Dunu DN-1000 if you don't mind moving slightly in a more v-shaped, less smooth direction, or the Sony XBA-H3 for a smoother and more refined (but arguably less clear compared to the Dunu) sound. 
  
  


james444 said:


> Another vote for the FX850. Unless you're sensitive to forward treble, that is, since the JVCs treble is significantly less laid-back than the H3's. As for the FX750, they're very similar, but the FX850 have slightly better mids presence. Granted, they're still v-shaped, but like vwinter said, it fits in with the imaging and somehow works.
> 
> There's also an easy mod to attenuate the JVC's bass if desired (don't worry, still plenty of it left  and give their mids even more room to shine.


 
  
 Good stuff, FX850 sounds like a winner.
  


omgladygaga said:


> Cool. I ordered the FX850 and ie80. Will return the loser.


 
  
 Curious which one that'll be.
  


mrguzmanwhite said:


> Hello everyone and specialy to the great "ljokerl". I need your kind assistance.
> 
> I have been a happy user of the RE-400 and the Ety ER4P for a while and I am ready to upgrade, the question is what to get. I share with you the areas I would like to improve over these excellent IEMs and I am appreciative for your guidance of an IEM for a budget of up to $1,000 (not customs for the moment, just universals) that matches the following criteria as much as possible.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Interesting requirements. Not sure I have the solution for you but as a fellow HiFiMan/Etymotic fan I can help you narrow the field.
  
 First off, while I haven't tried all of the models you are considering, I haven't found anything to be a full-on upgrade to the ER4 without compromises (especially in the bass qty vs clarity tradeoff). There are more options in customs than universals that do a good job with this, but still not all of them.
  
 Now to thin the field a bit...
  
 The W40 definitely isn't it - it just doesn't have the same sort of sonic balance. Too much mid-bass and not enough upper mid presence compared to an RE-400 or Ety. The IE800 probably isn't it - it's a rather bassy thing and ends up sounding somewhat v-shaped. It's not really mid-recessed in a bad way, but compared to what you're used to there's a fair chance you'll find it both overwhelmingly bassy and a little unforgiving. The C5 is definitely not it but I can't speak for the Series 2. Maybe it's a 50%+ improvement on the old one.
  
 The SD-2 MIGHT work but its signature is definitely more RE-400 than ER4, meaning it's more on the smooth and warm-ish side than strictly neutral and analytical. It doesn't have any coherence or cohesiveness issues and it's just a nice-sounding earphone with noticeable improvements on the RE-400 here and there, but not a 100% match for what you want. The TDK BA200 is a viable budget/mainstream alternative to the SD-2, with similar caveats.
  
 A couple of others come to mind but all with their own reservations:
  
 The DUNU DN-2000 may be the closest I've heard to a good "analytical" IEM with a sizable bass lift. But again, you do give up some clarity in parts of the spectrum compared to a strictly flat earphone and the very top end is tuned a little brighter.
  
 The Audiofly AF180 seems very promising so far and is a little clearer than even the SD-2, but it has a clarity-adding peak somewhere in the treble just like the DN-2000 which might cause issues coming from an ultra-smooth RE-400. Need to spend more time with this one to form a more conclusive opinion.
  
  


proedros said:


> Hi Joker ,
> 
> have you tried the RE-600 ? any plans on doing a full review here ?
> 
> regards.


 
  
ZapX629 provided the link. I do need to re-write all of my innerfidelity reviews and re-post them here; just haven't found time to do it.


----------



## zibra

mrguzmanwhite said:


> Thank you very much. I assume with "SD-2" you mean stage diver-2? I
> 
> am trying to purchase it but ALO Audio en the USA don't have it at this stage ... very unfortunate. Do you know other vendors to get it from in the USA?


 
 Oh I dont know where to buy it in USA right now but I would still insist on trying it because:
  
 these or on cheaper side of iems you mentioned
 build quality and comfort
 very coherent sound from bottom to top
  
 I got best results with small tips - best sound and comfort.
 Based on my experience with big headpones and few iems I think listening for analytical purposes would be boring and annoying after some time. I prepefer much more natural sound, quite flat but engaging because of clarity, weight, dynamics and impact.
 Just try it at least and give it few days to accomodate your brain to "new sound". Dont compare iems every 15 minutes.
 If you wont like it thats ok but you could then describe even better what you need from your next "end of game" iem 
  
 One more thing - whats your DAP? Rmember ljokerl is making comparisions on Cowon J3 and hifiman 901 if theres no changes. Anyways if you liked what you heard it should be even better on good DAP.


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

> There are more options in customs than universals that do a good job with this, but still not all of them.
> 
> Now to thin the field a bit...
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thank you very much ljokerl, I appreciate your feedback, it is very useful. I guess you have narrowed to two options, the DUNU DN-2000 or the Audiofly AF180 but you are still not fully convinced. You mentioned that there are more options with customs, which custom IEM would you recommend me to get? Maybe it is time for me to go customs


----------



## hagge

joker, WOW! Im impressed, good job!


 


I'm dont know very much about iems and I've realized there is a lot of nice audiphiles in this forum and therefor I'm asking you guys for som help. I've read some of the tread but to be honest, Its a lot of reading!


 


I'm looking for a pair of iems in the *pricerange of 40-80$*. Im going to use them for my Iphone when I walk and take the bus, therefor they need to have a *good isolation*. Besides that ofc: *good sound and comfortable*  Extra plus if they're new on the market or provided by a well-known brand.


 


Very thankfull for all the help I can get!


----------



## PoRidge

tobias89 said:


> This looks interesting, but I can't find any further information on this, not even an official website. Anyone has a lead on these?


 
  
  
 I contacted them. They say the official website is coming up soon and there will be a big announcement too. Don't know how big it will be though.


----------



## TrueMage22

Can anyone, please, advice me the safe source for Klipsch x10 buying? I got one pair on ebay but it was fake.


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

zibra said:


> One more thing - whats your DAP? Rmember ljokerl is making comparisions on Cowon J3 and hifiman 901 if theres no changes. Anyways if you liked what you heard it should be even better on good DAP.


 
 Thank you for the advise. For IEMs I always used then on the go with my iPhone. I don't have a DAP, don't feel like they are needed and it is a hassle to take. So the SQvhas to be good from the iPhone. At home I use amps and DACs, but at home I use over ear HP!


----------



## nick n

ljokerl said:


> Interesting requirements. Not sure I have the solution for you but as a fellow HiFiMan/Etymotic fan I can help you narrow the field.
> 
> First off, while I haven't tried all of the models you are considering, I haven't found anything to be a full-on upgrade to the ER4 without compromises (especially in the bass qty vs clarity tradeoff). There are more options in customs than universals that do a good job with this, but still not all of them.
> 
> ...


 
 Joker : Aside from large soundstage , doesn't J-Phonic K2 SP ( also the M2 I assume ) come reasonably close to that large list of requirements?


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hello joker. Which has better soundstage? Brainwavz m3 or fidue a63? Have you ever tried the ostry kc06a yet? Which of the three i mentioned is the best sounding if i want a good soundstage?


----------



## ljokerl

zibra said:


> Oh I dont know where to buy it in USA right now but I would still insist on trying it because:


 
  
 Otojoy is the official distributor AFAIK: http://otojoyiem.com 
  
 Not sure about their marketing, though. "Fits almost perfectly into any ear" sounds like a negative to me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  


mrguzmanwhite said:


> Thank you very much ljokerl, I appreciate your feedback, it is very useful. I guess you have narrowed to two options, the DUNU DN-2000 or the Audiofly AF180 but you are still not fully convinced. You mentioned that there are more options with customs, which custom IEM would you recommend me to get? Maybe it is time for me to go customs


 
  
 Custom Art Pro330v2 comes to mind at the mid-range end of things. At the higher end, Noble 4S and maybe the UM Miracle as well. 
  


hagge said:


> joker, WOW! Im impressed, good job!
> 
> I'm dont know very much about iems and I've realized there is a lot of nice audiphiles in this forum and therefor I'm asking you guys for som help. I've read some of the tread but to be honest, Its a lot of reading!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Lots of options depending on the sort of sound tuning you're after. The champ for isolation is the Etymotic Research MC5 (also comes in some headset versions if you need a mic - MC2 and MC3). Very neutral and accurate sound on those, some would say not exciting or bassy enough but great if you value balance and clarity. Fit might take a bit of getting used to but shouldn't be a problem after a week or two, especially if you value the noise isolation. 
  
 If you'd rather give up a bit of isolation for a more consumer-oriented sound, the JVC HA-FXD80 and SteelSeries Flux could be solid options (the latter being a bit more comfortable but also "quieter" (easily compensated for) and not as clear . 
  
 An option with a bassier sound than the Etymotics but still very good isolation would be the HiSound Audio Crystal, though it fails your well-known brand requirement.
  


truemage22 said:


> Can anyone, please, advice me the safe source for Klipsch x10 buying? I got one pair on ebay but it was fake.


 
  
 Amazon should be okay but they'll cost you a pretty penny: http://www.amazon.com/Klipsch-Noise-Isolating-Earphone-Discontinued-Manufacturer/dp/B000WAHFBK 
  


nick n said:


> Joker : Aside from large soundstage , doesn't J-Phonic K2 SP ( also the M2 I assume ) come reasonably close to that large list of requirements?


 
  
 Yes, but it's quite difficult to get outside of Japan. 
  


justgotlucky123 said:


> Hello joker. Which has better soundstage? Brainwavz m3 or fidue a63? Have you ever tried the ostry kc06a yet? Which of the three i mentioned is the best sounding if i want a good soundstage?


 
  
 Not 100% sure as it's been a while since I've heard the M3, but my gut feel is the M3 and A63 are similar in that regard. Haven't tried the KC06A but my experience with the KC06 leads me to believe that it will have a larger soundstage than the A63/M3.


----------



## Ruben123

Hello Joker
I have a Q for you. User Hisoundfi recommended me the Soundmagic E30s and I think he's right, but since you know so many IEMs... Id like you opinion.
Looking for best details and a balanced sound for $20-40. I love my Monoprices, so Im looking for an upgrade which somehow sounds the same. I listen classical mostly and dont really bother about bass, micrrophonics and isolation. What do you say?


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

ljokerl said:


> Custom Art Pro330v2 comes to mind at the mid-range end of things. At the higher end, Noble 4S and maybe the UM Miracle as well.


 
 Thank you a lot. I think there is a universal version of the Noble 4S that you rated so high in your reviews. At the Noble audio website I can see they have a Noble 4, that I assume is identical in SQ and signature to the Noble 4S or 4C. If this is the case it may be a very compelling option for a mid range/cost IEM with top level SQ and a neutral balanced presentation, as an improvement to the RE-400 and the Ety ER4P. It seems that the Noble 4 is $450 while the 4S is $999, there is so much difference that perhaps thera re more changes and it is just not the equal between universal and custom.
  
 Does anyone know if the Noble 4 is the universal version of the Noble 4S and have the same SQ?
  
 Both are described as identically at the Noble site
  
 From Noble audio on the Noble 4  and Noble 4S: 





> The Noble 4 is a neutral sounding product designed to appeal to those who desire a flatter frequency response. An update from the Wizard’s original four-driver design, the Noble 4 lacks the controversial dip in the high frequency region. The smooth, flat, sound makes for an ideal pairing with vocal, acoustic, and classical music.


 
  
 If they are the same I may just get the universal Noble 4 now ...


----------



## kova4a

mrguzmanwhite said:


> Thank you a lot. I think there is a universal version of the Noble 4S that you rated so high in your reviews. At the Noble audio website I can see they have a Noble 4, that I assume is identical in SQ and signature to the Noble 4S or 4C. If this is the case it may be a very compelling option for a mid range/cost IEM with top level SQ and a neutral balanced presentation, as an improvement to the RE-400 and the Ety ER4P. It seems that the Noble 4 is $450 while the 4S is $999, there is so much difference that perhaps thera re more changes and it is just not the equal between universal and custom.
> 
> Does anyone know if the Noble 4 is the universal version of the Noble 4S and have the same SQ?
> 
> ...


 
 They have the exact same internals without any difference if you wonder whether the custom versions are more special inside. Of course, ciems are harder to make and customize so this raises the price, especially silicone ones like the 4S. Haven't heard the 4S but they shouldn't be too far apart aside from isolation and fit, which of course can affect the sound to some degree. Anyway, the universal version is pretty good and with the 15% Black Friday discount is a very good buy if one is looking for balanced and neutral sound.


----------



## ljokerl

ruben123 said:


> Hello Joker
> I have a Q for you. User Hisoundfi recommended me the Soundmagic E30s and I think he's right, but since you know so many IEMs... Id like you opinion.
> Looking for best details and a balanced sound for $20-40. I love my Monoprices, so Im looking for an upgrade which somehow sounds the same. I listen classical mostly and dont really bother about bass, micrrophonics and isolation. What do you say?


 
  
 I am not sure the E30 is an upgrade from the Monoprice in performance so much as it is a slightly different take on a balanced sound. However, it does have a nicer form factor and you'll likely enjoy using it a whole lot more.
  


mrguzmanwhite said:


> Thank you a lot. I think there is a universal version of the Noble 4S that you rated so high in your reviews. At the Noble audio website I can see they have a Noble 4, that I assume is identical in SQ and signature to the Noble 4S or 4C. If this is the case it may be a very compelling option for a mid range/cost IEM with top level SQ and a neutral balanced presentation, as an improvement to the RE-400 and the Ety ER4P. It seems that the Noble 4 is $450 while the 4S is $999, there is so much difference that perhaps thera re more changes and it is just not the equal between universal and custom.
> 
> Does anyone know if the Noble 4 is the universal version of the Noble 4S and have the same SQ?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I haven't tried the universal Noble 4 myself. I did try the 6 but it has a very different sound signature that won't work for you.


----------



## Ruben123

ljokerl said:


> I am not sure the E30 is an upgrade from the Monoprice in performance so much as it is a slightly different take on a balanced sound. However, it does have a nicer form factor and you'll likely enjoy using it a whole lot more.
> 
> 
> I haven't tried the universal Noble 4 myself. I did try the 6 but it has a very different sound signature that won't work for you.


 

 Thanks a lot. I know the Monoprices have bass in quantity but not in quality, and the treble's not the best. Do the Soundmagics fix those parts and with more detail? Do you have other recommendations in that price catagory? Predecessor PL30 maybe at $10 lower for example?


----------



## hitme987

Actually looking to buy a DAC+ an IEM + a over ear. ljokerl already suggested to get M50X so will try to see a price drop this BF and buy one.
  
 Regarding my audio preference, I add up a bit of bass to my piston v2.1 and its close to what I like to hear. Loved UE6000 in cancelling mode(without any bass boost) and it suited me perfectly though was very much uncomfortable & had to return it.

 For IEM looking between GR 07 classic and GR07 Bass Edition, though inclined on buying BE

 Looking up on FiiO E7K as a DAC primarily to boost bass with desktop as a source. So, E7K+ M50X and GR07 BE would be good enough for me? Or should I take FiiO E11? Thanks!


----------



## DPCyric

Hi Joker! Can you suggest a new IEM for me? I picked up a pair of Velodyne V-Pulse last year and loved the sound but hated their build quality. I listen to a lot of Suicide Commando, KMFDM and Nine Inch Nails and really enjoyed the bass in the V-Pulse. I have several other headphone and IEMs a set of Astro A50's which sound great for heavy music, a pair of Yamaha 500 which are all around just amazing and a couple more cans and IEMs. None of those have that unique sound the Velodynes had for Industrial music and I would like to find a better pair of IEMs that do and I also wouldnt mind a suggestion for some Over-Ears that sound like that. Thanks for the help!

Edit: I would like to stick in the sub-$200 price range unless there is something in tje $300-$350 price range that you think would blow my mind!


----------



## ljokerl

ruben123 said:


> Thanks a lot. I know *the Monoprices have bass in quantity but not in quality*, and the treble's not the best. Do the Soundmagics fix those parts and with more detail? Do you have other recommendations in that price catagory? Predecessor PL30 maybe at $10 lower for example?


 
  
 They just lack extension - the E30 improves on that and has smoother treble. But if you're used to the more mid-focused sound of the Monoprice now, you might find that lacking with the Soundmagics. For the price and with balanced sound they're still one of the better options, though.
  


hitme987 said:


> Actually looking to buy a DAC+ an IEM + a over ear. ljokerl already suggested to get M50X so will try to see a price drop this BF and buy one.
> 
> Regarding my audio preference, I add up a bit of bass to my piston v2.1 and its close to what I like to hear. Loved UE6000 in cancelling mode(without any bass boost) and it suited me perfectly though was very much uncomfortable & had to return it.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Even the GR07 BE is not as bassy as a Piston, especially a Piston with added bass. It's a great earphone, just that "bass edition" is a bit of a misnomer except when compared to the regular GR07. However, it sounds like you're moving in a more neutral direction with your setup so maybe it is the right choice. Plus, not sure about the E11, but the E7 has some bass boost functionality.


----------



## ljokerl

dpcyric said:


> Hi Joker! Can you suggest a new IEM for me? I picked up a pair of Velodyne V-Pulse last year and loved the sound but hated their build quality. I listen to a lot of Suicide Commando, KMFDM and Nine Inch Nails and really enjoyed the bass in the V-Pulse. I have several other headphone and IEMs a set of Astro A50's which sound great for heavy music, a pair of Yamaha 500 which are all around just amazing and a couple more cans and IEMs. None of those have that unique sound the Velodynes had for Industrial music and I would like to find a better pair of IEMs that do and I also wouldnt mind a suggestion for some Over-Ears that sound like that. Thanks for the help!
> 
> Edit: I would like to stick in the sub-$200 price range unless there is something in tje $300-$350 price range that you think would blow my mind!


 
  
 HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2 would be a good one. It's "only" $100-ish but has what is probably the most deep bass among all the IEMs I've tried. Build quality is not amazing by any means but there's nothing that sounds quite like it if you like sub-bass-oriented sound signatures like that of the vPulse.


----------



## hitme987

ljokerl said:


> Even the GR07 BE is not as bassy as a Piston, especially a Piston with added bass. It's a great earphone, just that "bass edition" is a bit of a misnomer except when compared to the regular GR07. However, it sounds like you're moving in a more neutral direction with your setup so maybe it is the right choice. Plus, not sure about the E11, but the E7 has some bass boost functionality.


 
 Thanks. Now, stuck on GR07 classic or GR07 BE, is it worth spending 30$ more for BE? From what I've read, Classic is 98% close to GR07 signature & your review says +1/+2 boost on lows for BE . GR07 classic is @ 77$, GR07 BE is @ 107$ now at BF Lendmeurears store

 Bought FiiO E17 just now @ 87$, looking to pair with it, which one of those would be ideal for me? I think E17 got a good bass boost setting. Thanks!


----------



## DPCyric

ljokerl said:


> HiSoundAudio Wooduo 2 would be a good one. It's "only" $100-ish but has what is probably the most deep bass among all the IEMs I've tried. Build quality is not amazing by any means but there's nothing that sounds quite like it if you like sub-bass-oriented sound signatures like that of the vPulse.




Thanks! I was had hoped to find something a bit higher priced and sturdier but I will check these out. I love the sub-bass oriented sound signature for my industrial music and working out so I guess I shouldnt spend too much on IEM's just for those purposes since my Yamaha's and A50's cover my other sound needs well. I might pick up a pair of Yamaha EPH-100SL's as well they look nice


----------



## ljokerl

hitme987 said:


> Thanks. Now, stuck on GR07 classic or GR07 BE, is it worth spending 30$ more for BE? From what I've read, Classic is 98% close to GR07 signature & your review says +1/+2 boost on lows for BE . GR07 classic is @ 77$, GR07 BE is @ 107$ now at BF Lendmeurears store
> 
> Bought FiiO E17 just now @ 87$, looking to pair with it, which one of those would be ideal for me? I think E17 got a good bass boost setting. Thanks!


 
  
 I would go for the BE - it's a small different between them but I'm quite sure you'll like the BE better between the two.
  
 Never tried the E17 - my experience with the Fiio line "tops out" with the E7.
  
   
 Quote:


dpcyric said:


> Thanks! I was had hoped to find something a bit higher priced and sturdier but I will check these out. I love the sub-bass oriented sound signature for my industrial music and working out so I guess I shouldnt spend too much on IEM's just for those purposes since my Yamaha's and A50's cover my other sound needs well. I might pick up a pair of Yamaha EPH-100SL's as well they look nice


 
  
 The EPH-100 would be my second choice but the Wooduo has a leaner, more crisp sound that I think is a better match for the vPulse. If you can get both, by all means do! EPH-100 is fantastic for genres like hip-hop, EDM, top40, etc, but for rock & metal I'd rather use the HiSound.


----------



## MrGuzmanWhite

ljokerl said:


> I haven't tried the universal Noble 4 myself. I did try the 6 but it has a very different sound signature that won't work for you.


 
 Thank you ljokerl. I asked the team at Noble about the IEM Noble 4 to confirm is it is the same as the Noble 4s/c and they confirmed it is the universal version. Based on your enthusiastic review of the Noble 4s, and your comparisons with the HE-400 and Ety ER4P, two headphones I have and enjoy a lot, I went and ordered a Noble 4 universal. I hope this is the next step up for me. I will report back once I get the Noble 4 and can compare with the HE-400 and Ety ER4P.
  
 Thank you again for your kind assistance during the section process!


----------



## FightBrothers

Hey joker
 did you hear about the recently released jvc fxt100 and fxt200?


----------



## suman134

can someone give me some feedback on jvc FXZ200.


----------



## Phosphenetre

Hello ljokerl and everyone else on this thread,
  
 I'm looking to gift a friend a pair of IEMs for her birthday. I have a budget of about *50 USD*. Criteria are:
  

*Fairly balanced sound*, or a 'warm and smooth' signature, without losing much treble presence and air. Don't want something V-shaped. Something balanced and with good presence across the frequency range, without being too exaggerated in any area. Should not have an anaemic low-end, but shouldn't be bloated or basshead either. For reference, the HiFiMan RE-400 fits my sonic criteria, but the build quality is too poor for me to feel confident about gifting it to someone.
*Clarity and resolution* is important, doesn't need to be outstanding, but definitely 'great', to the extent that one can achieve within this budget.
*Build quality *- this gift needs to last. For reference, I consider the HiFiMan RE-400 to be poorly built, and the VSonic GR07 and VSD3S (FIXED cable) to be fairly good.
Something not prone to overexposing sibilance. This strikes off the VSonic VSD1S, for example.
*Isolation* should be at least above average.
  
 Suggestions and options?


----------



## Ap616

danielkrego said:


> Hello ljokerl and everyone else on this thread,
> 
> I'm looking to gift a friend a pair of IEMs for her birthday. I have a budget of about *50 USD*. Criteria are:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hmm, how about something like the TTPOD T1-E, Ostry KC06, or Fidue A63? 
$35, $48, $60
  
 I'd say those are good options. Ostry KC06 would maybe be good minus subpar isolation, but it seems built well. The T-1E, which I have, is a little bass oriented, though still very good for the price! But it can have a little quality problems, at least mine and a couple others' did. A63 might be a better choice. Supposedly midcentric, with good bass presence and smooth but fairly detailed treble.


----------



## ozkan

danielkrego said:


> Hello ljokerl and everyone else on this thread,
> 
> I'm looking to gift a friend a pair of IEMs for her birthday. I have a budget of about *50 USD*. Criteria are:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Soundmagic E10 or RE300H (not sure about the build quality) could meet those criterias.


----------



## Phosphenetre

ap616 said:


> Hmm, how about something like the TTPOD T1-E, Ostry KC06, or Fidue A63?
> $35, $48, $60
> 
> I'd say those are good options. Ostry KC06 would maybe be good minus subpar isolation, but it seems built well. The T-1E, which I have, is a little bass oriented, though still very good for the price! But it can have a little quality problems, at least mine and a couple others' did. A63 might be a better choice. Supposedly midcentric, with good bass presence and smooth but fairly detailed treble.


 
  
  


ozkan said:


> Soundmagic E10 or RE300H (not sure about the build quality) could meet those criterias.


 
  
 Thanks for the suggestions. The Ostry is out because of the isolation, yes. Heard about QC issues with the TTPOD, so that's not a serious contender to me. I'll look closer at the Fidue A63, though, thank you for that suggestions.
  
 I've used the E10 and wasn't very impressed at all, but the RE300H could be just the ticket, if the build quality sufficiently convinces me. Time to head over to its thread.
  
 Any opinions on how the SteelSeries Flux IEM (not the Flux Pro) fits my requirements?


----------



## Ap616

danielkrego said:


> Thanks for the suggestions. The Ostry is out because of the isolation, yes. Heard about QC issues with the TTPOD, so that's not a serious contender to me. I'll look closer at the Fidue A63, though, thank you for that suggestions.
> 
> I've used the E10 and wasn't very impressed at all, but the RE300H could be just the ticket, if the build quality sufficiently convinces me. Time to head over to its thread.
> 
> Any opinions on how the SteelSeries Flux IEM (not the Flux Pro) fits my requirements?




HouseofDoom had problems with his RE300h strain relief. Twister said they were pretty warm and bassy too. 
Mocked had some trouble with durability on his Steelseries Flux, and I've read about a few durability issues so I didn't recommend that.


----------



## 408388

Hey ljokerl & others 
  
 My Sony XBA 1s are on their last legs, right phone needs constant wiggling to start working (had to resolder cable). To replace them I've been looking at:
  

Sony MH1C, £11.48
Monoprice 9927, £4.78
Philips SHE3590, £5.95
  
 As I would like to spend only £10/15, although I could stretch to £20/25 if the benefits were worth it.
  
*My music taste:* I listen to rock and metal, ranging from Pink Floyd and Muse to Mastodon, Gojira, and very intricate and heavy stuff like The Faceless, Animals As Leaders, Meshuggah, Sikth, etc. 
  
*Preferred sound signature: *I'm looking for something analytical, or in the least balanced or mid. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but for my tastes I think analytical will be best because overpowering bass drowns out the intricacy of the guitars, whilst too much treble can make guitars very tiresome to listen to. Mid is the least worst in this case, although analytical would still be best.
  
 I'd like lots of clarity and detail as this can really pick out the intricacies in solos. My XBA 1s did this well but weren't so good in other areas; they distorted easily and the treble could be harsh. 
  
*Questions/ Other points:*
  

Which of the 3 above are most suited to rock/metal?
Are any of them actually better than my XBAs?
Are there any other IEMs at this price point you would recommend over the above (Piston 2s aren't an option as there's no reliable UK sellers)?
If there are any far better IEMs for only a little bit more, I'd appreciate it if you could point them out so I can decide if I want to spend a bit more.
I don't mind EQing, so if any of these are considerably better after EQ I'd be grateful if you could point that out.
Will the MH1C work fine on my Samsung Galaxy SIII without an adapter, as I've heard some bad things about these so if someone could clear that up for that'd be great.
I'm very confused about how the 9927s really compare to the MH1Cs, as both have a very strong following. If someone could point out which is definitively the "best" after EQing and modding I'd appreciate this. 
  
 Thanks very much


----------



## ozkan

enssorcel said:


> Hey ljokerl & others
> 
> My Sony XBA 1s are on their last legs, right phone needs constant wiggling to start working (had to resolder cable). To replace them I've been looking at:
> 
> ...


 
  
 None of them can be suggested as they are too warm and slow for rock/metal imo. You will loose some midrange clarity because of that warmish sound. I would recommend Vsonic VC02 instead which is on the neutral side.


----------



## 408388

ozkan said:


> None of them can be suggested as they are too warm and slow for rock/metal imo. You will loose some midrange clarity because of that warmish sound. I would recommend Vsonic VC02 instead which is on the neutral side.


 
 Thanks, these look really good but I can't find any Vsonic earphones anywhere in the UK, and I'm not sure if I want to risk getting them from Hong Kong from eBay, especially as for £28.99 they're a bit more than I'd like to spend. Maybe from a reputable UK seller I would but I can't find any which sucks. 
  
 You pointed out speed which I forgot to mention too... I think this is definitely important for the more complex metal songs. I could probably compromise midrange for warmth if speed was up to scratch, as I could try to EQ the bass down a tad (if this is untrue feel free to have a go at my n00b knowledge), so are you saying none of those are fast enough, and if so what other options are there other than VSonic (unless you think the Hong Kong sellers on eBay are OK)?
  
 Thank you very much for your help once again.


----------



## ZapX629

I would recommend the VSD1S. It has a very similar quality to the GR07 with almost as good bass speed and sounds excellent for the price. I'm a fan of progressive and power metal and they sound absolutely wonderful with these genres. You can get them here: http://www.lendmeurears.com/vsonic/?setCurrencyId=3. Prices are in Euro, but you can check out with paypal and it will convert to your currency. Right now you can get these at a steal of a price at £18
  


enssorcel said:


> Thanks, these look really good but I can't find any Vsonic earphones anywhere in the UK, and I'm not sure if I want to risk getting them from Hong Kong from eBay, especially as for £28.99 they're a bit more than I'd like to spend. Maybe from a reputable UK seller I would but I can't find any which sucks.
> 
> You pointed out speed which I forgot to mention too... I think this is definitely important for the more complex metal songs. I could probably compromise midrange for warmth if speed was up to scratch, as I could try to EQ the bass down a tad (if this is untrue feel free to have a go at my n00b knowledge), so are you saying none of those are fast enough, and if so what other options are there other than VSonic (unless you think the Hong Kong sellers on eBay are OK)?
> 
> Thank you very much for your help once again.


----------



## trinilove

hey joker..im torn between RE 600 and FIDUE a83..i listen to a rock,metal,jazzvocals and pop...which of the 2 iems would fit the bill?..btw i prefer a balanced signature and dont consider myself as a basshead...TIA


----------



## 408388

zapx629 said:


> I would recommend the VSD1S. It has a very similar quality to the GR07 with almost as good bass speed and sounds excellent for the price. I'm a fan of progressive and power metal and they sound absolutely wonderful with these genres. You can get them here: http://www.lendmeurears.com/vsonic/?setCurrencyId=3. Prices are in Euro, but you can check out with paypal and it will convert to your currency. Right now you can get these at a steal of a price at £18




Thank you for your help, I hope it doesn't seem like I'm being difficult but as I'm only 16 I can't pay with PayPal and I'm not too sure about buying from Singapore either, especially considering the PayPal situation. My parents wouldn't order for me either. They look fantastic as they'd only come to £24 but I don't think it's viable. Sorry if it seems like I'm dismissing your suggestions, I am in fact extremely grateful for you helping me. Is there no option other than Vsonic for the UK? I can't find anything as balanced and fast for the same price...


----------



## ZapX629

enssorcel said:


> Thank you for your help, I hope it doesn't seem like I'm being difficult but as I'm only 16 I can't pay with PayPal and I'm not too sure about buying from Singapore either, especially considering the PayPal situation. My parents wouldn't order for me either. They look fantastic as they'd only come to £24 but I don't think it's viable. Sorry if it seems like I'm dismissing your suggestions, I am in fact extremely grateful for you helping me. Is there no option other than Vsonic for the UK? I can't find anything as balanced and fast for the same price...


 

 It's not a problem at all. Everyone has a different situation so you have to work with what you've got. Would amazon UK be a viable option? I'm sure there's some good stuff to be had there.


----------



## 408388

zapx629 said:


> It's not a problem at all. Everyone has a different situation so you have to work with what you've got. Would amazon UK be a viable option? I'm sure there's some good stuff to be had there.




I can use Amazon.co.uk as I've got a debit card. I'm not sure about amazon.com if that's what you mean, as Vsonic items are only on .com and not the co.uk site.


----------



## ljokerl

mrguzmanwhite said:


> Thank you ljokerl. I asked the team at Noble about the IEM Noble 4 to confirm is it is the same as the Noble 4s/c and they confirmed it is the universal version. Based on your enthusiastic review of the Noble 4s, and your comparisons with the HE-400 and Ety ER4P, two headphones I have and enjoy a lot, I went and ordered a Noble 4 universal. I hope this is the next step up for me. I will report back once I get the Noble 4 and can compare with the HE-400 and Ety ER4P.
> 
> Thank you again for your kind assistance during the section process!


 
  
 Enjoy!
  


fightbrothers said:


> Hey joker
> did you hear about the recently released jvc fxt100 and fxt200?


 
  
 No, I'm not familiar with these.
  


danielkrego said:


> Hello ljokerl and everyone else on this thread,
> 
> I'm looking to gift a friend a pair of IEMs for her birthday. I have a budget of about *50 USD*. Criteria are:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Interesting dilemma that eliminates most of the things I normally recommend. The Flux doesn't have the durability you want; the VSonic units are not smooth enough; and so on.
  
 If you can increase your budget slightly, the Fidue A63 *Ap616* recommended can be a good option though I have some reservations about its fit as far as giving it as a gift goes (the housings have some sharp edges). Isolation is about average but not bad.
  
 Here are some others that come to mind:
 Etymotic Reseach MC5 - surprisingly may just be your best bet. Very good isolation, strong build, balanced and clean sound, smooth, etc.
 VSonic R02 Silver - maybe a bit cheap-looking bit it has better build quality than other similarly-priced VSonics and is not sibilant, though it does have a somewhat mid/upper mid-centric sound. Not v-shaped at all, though.
 MEElec A151 - balanced/warm-ish BA sound. Not the best air and treble presence but not bad. Maybe a little riskier in the bass department as it's a little low compared to something like the A63, but not bad.
 Rock-It Sounds R-20 - very similar to the MEElec above, just a different form factor.
 Brainwavz M2 - blast from the past, but can currently be had for a very good price. The sound is on the warm side but it does meet your requirements.
  
  


enssorcel said:


> Hey ljokerl & others
> 
> My Sony XBA 1s are on their last legs, right phone needs constant wiggling to start working (had to resolder cable). To replace them I've been looking at:
> 
> ...


 
  
 That's a very tight budget and I am not sure any of the three low-budget sets you're considering will do it for you coming from the XBA-1. You'll have to relax some of your requirements if you want to get away with spending so little. The MH1C is probably the best of the bunch but its sound is on the warm side and not a great match for what you seem to want in terms of sound signature. However it does have very smooth treble so in that respect it'll be an upgrade. One other low-end set you can check out is the LG Quadbeat F420 - it's not as warm as the MH1C and has mostly comparable performance. Not sure if it's available to you but historically it's been priced at about $25-28.


----------



## ljokerl

trinilove said:


> hey joker..im torn between RE 600 and FIDUE a83..i listen to a rock,metal,jazzvocals and pop...which of the 2 iems would fit the bill?..btw i prefer a balanced signature and dont consider myself as a basshead...TIA


 
  
 I would pick the RE-600, especially if it's still on the $199 special.


----------



## ZapX629

enssorcel said:


> I can use Amazon.co.uk as I've got a debit card. I'm not sure about amazon.com if that's what you mean, as Vsonic items are only on .com and not the co.uk site.


 

 Well, if you have a debit card, you can use that with paypal. If you don't want to do that though the Brainwavz Delta are an intriguing option in your budget. I haven't heard them myself but they're supposedly a very good option with a balanced sound and good separation with clear mids. Available here: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Brainwavz-Delta-IEM-Earphones-Black/dp/B00FSA8VQ2/


----------



## 408388

ljokerl said:


> That's a very tight budget and I am not sure any of the three low-budget sets you're considering will do it for you coming from the XBA-1. You'll have to relax some of your requirements if you want to get away with spending so little. The MH1C is probably the best of the bunch but its sound is on the warm side and not a great match for what you seem to want in terms of sound signature. However it does have very smooth treble so in that respect it'll be an upgrade. One other low-end set you can check out is the LG Quadbeat F420 - it's not as warm as the MH1C and has mostly comparable performance. Not sure if it's available to you but historically it's been priced at about $25-28.



That's a shame, I did wonder if I wasn't restricting myself too much but due to the rave reviews and following of the MH1 and Monos I thought perhaps they'd be good enough for my needs. Unfortunately the only UK supplier of the LGs I can find doesn't have them in stock yet.

The reason I was bring so tight is due to it being near christmas, I've never spent more than around £25 on earphones during the rest of the year. If I were to increase my budget, maybe to £30+ (£35/40 would definitely be pushing it) is there anything you can recommend or are my requirements still impossible unless with much more epensive IEMs? I know for exmaple that Etymotic kids or MC5 are available for £36 - £43. Thank you for your help and pointing out my budget problem.



zapx629 said:


> Well, if you have a debit card, you can use that with paypal. If you don't want to do that though the Brainwavz Delta are an intriguing option in your budget. I haven't heard them myself but they're supposedly a very good option with a balanced sound and good separation with clear mids. Available here: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Brainwavz-Delta-IEM-Earphones-Black/dp/B00FSA8VQ2/



I could use PayPal but it's supposed to be for 18+, if something went wrong due to the long distance shipping or something and I had to take it up with PayPal I'm not sure how much conviction I'd have considering I wouldn't be adhering to their terms myself. Maybe I'm being too safe but that's how I see it. 

The Deltas look good, I read a very positive review of them on the /r/heaphones board on Reddit too. I can't really see there being many better options in my price range to be honest... Bearing in mind what I've said above do you think it would be worth saving up for something slightly pricier, such as the Etys (unless you know of something better)?


----------



## Vlad17

Just made an accout here at Head-Fi to thank ljokerl for this thread and everybody who posted in it.
  
 I've been reading it carefully for the past year and a half and I must be honest, I discovered it by mistake, but it has now made me apreciate sound more than I can say. I've bought my first pair of IEM two months ago (HiFiMan RE-400) and since then I'm just the happiest when listening to them. I discover new sound every day, it's awesome.
  
 I also have a question for whomever wants to answer, I'm thinking about a pair for my gf, something cheap but great, and i've heard only good things about the Havi B3 Pro I. Without a portable amp, how will her smartphone behave with the pair?


----------



## ozkan

vlad17 said:


> Just made an accout here at Head-Fi to thank ljokerl for this thread and everybody who posted in it.
> 
> I've been reading it carefully for the past year and a half and I must be honest, I discovered it by mistake, but it has now made me apreciate sound more than I can say. I've bought my first pair of IEM two months ago (HiFiMan RE-400) and since then I'm just the happiest when listening to them. I discover new sound every day, it's awesome.
> 
> I also have a question for whomever wants to answer, I'm thinking about a pair for my gf, something cheap but great, and i've heard only good things about the Havi B3 Pro I. Without a portable amp, how will her smartphone behave with the pair?


 
  
 I don't recommend Havi B3 without an amp. You should better get RE300H if she is on the phone and not a serious audiophile.


----------



## ljokerl

enssorcel said:


> That's a shame, I did wonder if I wasn't restricting myself too much but due to the rave reviews and following of the MH1 and Monos I thought perhaps they'd be good enough for my needs. Unfortunately the only UK supplier of the LGs I can find doesn't have them in stock yet.
> 
> The reason I was bring so tight is due to it being near christmas, I've never spent more than around £25 on earphones during the rest of the year. If I were to increase my budget, maybe to £30+ (£35/40 would definitely be pushing it) is there anything you can recommend or are my requirements still impossible unless with much more epensive IEMs? I know for exmaple that Etymotic kids or MC5 are available for £36 - £43. Thank you for your help and pointing out my budget problem.
> I could use PayPal but it's supposed to be for 18+, if something went wrong due to the long distance shipping or something and I had to take it up with PayPal I'm not sure how much conviction I'd have considering I wouldn't be adhering to their terms myself. Maybe I'm being too safe but that's how I see it.


 
  
 Yeah, the MC5 would be a very good one but even your updated budget is a bit tight for it. All the other things I would recommend won't be available from your local dealers so you'll run into the same issues with paying/processing/shipping as with the inexpensive VSonics. 
  
 I guess in that case what I'd do is go with the MH1 (make sure it's the right version for you device and/or you have the appropriate adapter) and lower the bass via EQ to try and balance it out.
  


vlad17 said:


> Just made an accout here at Head-Fi to thank ljokerl for this thread and everybody who posted in it.
> 
> I've been reading it carefully for the past year and a half and I must be honest, I discovered it by mistake, but it has now made me apreciate sound more than I can say. I've bought my first pair of IEM two months ago (HiFiMan RE-400) and since then I'm just the happiest when listening to them. I discover new sound every day, it's awesome.
> 
> I also have a question for whomever wants to answer, I'm thinking about a pair for my gf, something cheap but great, and i've heard only good things about the Havi B3 Pro I. Without a portable amp, how will her smartphone behave with the pair?


 
  
 Thanks, that's awesome to hear. 
  
 There's lots of options for inexpensive but great earphones depending on requirements. I've really been enjoying the VSonic VSD3S lately (and it comes in some funky colors if she's into that), as well as the Ostry KC06 and of course "budget" staples such as the Xiaomi Piston 2 and Philips SHE3590.


----------



## 408388

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, the MC5 would be a very good one but even your updated budget is a bit tight for it. All the other things I would recommend won't be available from your local dealers so you'll run into the same issues with paying/processing/shipping as with the inexpensive VSonics.
> 
> I guess in that case what I'd do is go with the MH1 (make sure it's the right version for you device and/or you have the appropriate adapter) and lower the bass via EQ to try and balance it out.




Yeah I really don't want to spend that much and I can't see the price coming down. I've managed to find some UE600s for well within my budget however, only £20 refurbed, so will these be better than the XBA 1 and MH1? Your review here gives them almost as high score as the RE-400 and much more than the Etys, but the actual tone of the review didn't sound as positive as the score, perhaps as you were comparing them to more high end IEMs. Basicaly would UE600s be my best bet at this price or are they no better than ehat I've got? Thanks for all your help, this should definitely be my final question!


----------



## ljokerl

enssorcel said:


> Yeah I really don't want to spend that much and I can't see the price coming down. I've managed to find some UE600s for well within my budget however, only £20 refurbed, so will these be better than the XBA 1 and MH1? Your review here gives them almost as high score as the RE-400 and much more than the Etys, but the actual tone of the review didn't sound as positive as the score, perhaps as you were comparing them to more high end IEMs. Basicaly would UE600s be my best bet at this price or are they no better than ehat I've got? Thanks for all your help, this should definitely be my final question!


 


 Well, their mid-centric sound isn't perfect for rock & metal but for the price they are probably as good as it gets. However, I would urge caution with refurbs - the 600s aren't exactly known for durability and with (presumably) no warranty you'll just have to be really careful with them.


----------



## 408388

ljokerl said:


> Well, their mid-centric sound isn't perfect for rock & metal but for the price they are probably as good as it gets. However, I would urge caution with refurbs - the 600s aren't exactly known for durability and with (presumably) no warranty you'll just have to be really careful with them.


 
 That's true, perhaps they're not really worth it, it looks like from all the info you've given me that for metal I'll have to save up for something more expensive. Otherwise I'll go with the advice to get some MH1Cs and mod them like crazy to bring the bass down, or some Brainwavz Delta, although the MH1C are looking best to me so far. Your help has been invaluable, thank you for sharing such a wealth of knowledge with the community


----------



## kova4a

enssorcel said:


> That's true, perhaps they're not really worth it, it looks like from all the info you've given me that for metal I'll have to save up for something more expensive. Otherwise I'll go with the advice to get some MH1Cs and mod them like crazy to bring the bass down, or some Brainwavz Delta, although the MH1C are looking best to me so far. Your help has been invaluable, thank you for sharing such a wealth of knowledge with the community


 
 Well, mh1 is pretty cheap in uk but there is quite the audible difference in the bass department between my mh1c and mh1. Brainwavz Delta is fairly balanced and neutral sounding but the bass lacks some body and depth but at least is not boomy and slow as mh1/c. You do have to take the bad mh1/c cable into consideration and also my first mh1c had bad driver flex and the left piece developed imbalance in a matter of weeks. You can also pick the brainwavz S0 from mp4nation today at 25 bucks, which is a pretty good price. It has its drawbacks but overall is a pretty solid performer and has great build quality and I would rate it around vsonic vsd1/s level even slightly higher.


----------



## Amitl

i just ordered the Sony mdr-ex650.....anyone had an experience with them here?


----------



## Spartoi

@ljokerl
  
 Any chance of Yamaha EPH-200 review? 
  
 I ordered the EPH-200 since they're on sale at Amazon. Anyone know how the RHA MA750i compares to them?


----------



## jay567

Hi Joker, just read your review of the HE560 and it was a nice read. Thanks for it!
  
 Whilst reading though, I kept on thinking to myself what your impressions of the coloured HE400 would be. Have you ever had an opportunity to hear those cans before? Also, because the JH13 are the top of your IEM list, do they match the sound quality of the HE560 please?


----------



## ljokerl

spartoi said:


> @ljokerl
> 
> Any chance of Yamaha EPH-200 review?
> 
> I ordered the EPH-200 since they're on sale at Amazon. Anyone know how the RHA MA750i compares to them?


 
  
  
 Not familiar with them but certainly something I'd want to try given my liking for the EPH-100
  


jay567 said:


> Hi Joker, just read your review of the HE560 and it was a nice read. Thanks for it!
> 
> Whilst reading though, I kept on thinking to myself what your impressions of the coloured HE400 would be. Have you ever had an opportunity to hear those cans before? Also, because the JH13 are the top of your IEM list, do they match the sound quality of the HE560 please?


 
  
 Never tried the HE-400.
  
 I don't really like comparing IEMs to cans but considering the HE-560 is a headphone and the JH13 is an IEM, and each form factor carries its own pros and cons, I would say they are on-par. If you put a gun to my head and forced me to pick one, it would probably be the JH13, but I'm also generally biased towards IEMs as I use them 90% of the time.


----------



## DrunkenTiger

Best hip hop buds, 50$~
 Currently using these for reference: Sony MDRXB60EX 
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-MDRXB60EX-Headphones-Discontinued-Manufacturer/dp/B009A6CZ12/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t
  
 Needs to be from amazon, thanks 
 Already have the JVC FXD 80 too


----------



## ljokerl

Added new IEM review - Tekfusion Twinwoofers
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A91) **Tekfusion Twinwoofers*
> 
> 
> Reviewed October 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here


----------



## ljokerl

drunkentiger said:


> Best hip hop buds, 50$~
> Currently using these for reference: Sony MDRXB60EX
> http://www.amazon.com/Sony-MDRXB60EX-Headphones-Discontinued-Manufacturer/dp/B009A6CZ12/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'd try the Narmoo S1 if you like your hip-hop bass-heavy.


----------



## james444

spartoi said:


> Any chance of Yamaha EPH-200 review?


 


ljokerl said:


> Not familiar with them but certainly something I'd want to try given my liking for the EPH-100


 
  
 Interesting, they went from 6mm drivers on the EPH-100 to 15mm drivers on the EPH-200. They'll probably sound quite different.


----------



## suman134

i didn't like the twin woofer much, they are okay, but bolted bass and turned down highs means its not for me. and being an indian i bought it for $18, not bad but nothing exciting. i will go for woo duo or meelec m-duo instead.


----------



## thug behram

Weird comparison but how does v-moda m80 compare to dunu dn-1000


----------



## 408388

kova4a said:


> Well, mh1 is pretty cheap in uk but there is quite the audible difference in the bass department between my mh1c and mh1. Brainwavz Delta is fairly balanced and neutral sounding but the bass lacks some body and depth but at least is not boomy and slow as mh1/c. You do have to take the bad mh1/c cable into consideration and also my first mh1c had bad driver flex and the left piece developed imbalance in a matter of weeks. You can also pick the brainwavz S0 from mp4nation today at 25 bucks, which is a pretty good price. It has its drawbacks but overall is a pretty solid performer and has great build quality and I would rate it around vsonic vsd1/s level even slightly higher.




Interesting, the speed may have to be my first priority for my budget considering a flat analytical sound costs too much. S0 cost tons more over here for some reason which is annoying, but I'll definitely bear them in mind if I can afford them. Thanks for your help


----------



## kova4a

enssorcel said:


> Interesting, the speed may have to be my first priority for my budget considering a flat analytical sound costs too much. S0 cost tons more over here for some reason which is annoying, but I'll definitely bear them in mind if I can afford them. Thanks for your help


 
 Well, S0 Is not really flat and analytical. [size=12.8000001907349px]It's clearer than mh1 and the pistons due to its drier presentation but [/size]it's still laid back and a bit on the dark side and a bit grainy. But at $25 with free shipping (actually $23.75 as you can use the fb2012fiver code to knock off another 5%) it's pretty good given the complete package and its build quality. It's hard to really give you a good recommendation for what you're looking for with such a limited budget coz even though budget iems are getting better and better 10-15 pounds is still quite low for a flat, accurate, very detailed and fast iem.


----------



## ozkan

enssorcel said:


> Interesting, the speed may have to be my first priority for my budget considering a flat analytical sound costs too much. S0 cost tons more over here for some reason which is annoying, but I'll definitely bear them in mind if I can afford them. Thanks for your help


 
  
 This Lg QB2 is also fast and accurate. You can buy from here.


----------



## ljokerl

james444 said:


> Interesting, they went from 6mm drivers on the EPH-100 to 15mm drivers on the EPH-200. They'll probably sound quite different.


 
  
 Agreed. Totally different form factor too. 
  


suman134 said:


> i didn't like the twin woofer much, they are okay, but bolted bass and turned down highs means its not for me. and being an indian i bought it for $18, not bad but nothing exciting. i will go for woo duo or meelec m-duo instead.


 
  
 I figured the cheaper overseas prices is what might make them more compelling. There are better options here in the US as well. Narmoo S1 is about $32 on Amazon.
  


thug behram said:


> Weird comparison but how does v-moda m80 compare to dunu dn-1000


 
  
 Similar bass profile, less mids, more treble for a brighter and more v-shaped sound overall.


----------



## Ruben123

So... posted a few times already here, now have done some hours research and I have come up with some earphones and I'd like to know at which I have to keep an eye open. 
  
 Looking for the highest detail, most neutral (or natural?!) sound with quite some width. Sound isolation is not needed, build quality a bit more important. Guess I can get a fit with most IEMs. Will be used with FLAC/ Vinyl on Sansa Clip+, 8 Ohm Galaxy i9000 Voodoo, Behringer 50 Ohm soundcard and an unknown, guess 100-ish Ohm, Technics Amp (vinyl). Sansa and Samsung used 90% of the time, Technics amp and Behringer both 5%.
 Higher impedance OR not greatly influenced by higher impedance IEMs are a pre.    
 Listening to classical music and looking for an upgrade for the Monoprice IEMs, with sort of same sound.
 I will not be buying another IEM in few years; this would really be the best I can afford and well, I should not need to look for an upgrade.
  
 Not looking for 90% of the quality for 50% of the price, 95% is different though. So, the cheaper the better, but I do not want to buy an IEM at $25 feeling to need to upgrade any time.
  
 I live in the Netherlands so Amazon and Wallmart etc are not really an option, eBay, DX etc are.
  
 I found:
  
 VSONIC R02 at $29
 VSONIC VC02 at $50 (typical, twice as expensive, but also ´much´ better?)
MEElectronics A151 at $50, which are BA and are more prone to SQ affected by impedance mismatch I thought...
 Astrotech AM-90 at $40 which seem to be very identical to the MEElectronics. Also BA and 25 Ohm
 Etymotic Research ETY-Kids, seem to be ´it´, 300 Ohms (yeah) and analytical sound. Maybe not too good for classical due to its sound though.
  
 Last but not least, the well loved Soundmagic E30 (and maybe PL-50). 12 Ohms and unknown how prone they are to impedance mismatch. $32 for the E30 and $50 for the PL-50.
  
 Other recommendations are welcome too. Budget is really $35 max with those $50 hoping that they would become cheaper sometimes and only wanting to buy such one when it is really much better.
  
 Thanks for taking your most valued time.


----------



## suman134

ruben123 said:


> So... posted a few times already here, now have done some hours research and I have come up with some earphones and I'd like to know at which I have to keep an eye open.
> 
> Looking for the highest detail, most neutral (or natural?!) sound with quite some width. Sound isolation is not needed, build quality a bit more important. Guess I can get a fit with most IEMs. Will be used with FLAC/ Vinyl on Sansa Clip+, 8 Ohm Galaxy i9000 Voodoo, Behringer 50 Ohm soundcard and an unknown, guess 100-ish Ohm, Technics Amp (vinyl). Sansa and Samsung used 90% of the time, Technics amp and Behringer both 5%.
> Higher impedance OR not greatly influenced by higher impedance IEMs are a pre.
> ...


 

    my vote is for VC02. most detailed of the lot, and build is nice too.


----------



## ozkan

suman134 said:


> my vote is for VC02. most detailed of the lot, and build is nice too.


 
  
 +1. If you baby your IEMs and don't play with the cable too much VC02 will serve you for a long time. That's not to say they are fragile but the connectors loose their tightness if you remove the cables too often.


----------



## Shawn71

ozkan said:


> +1. If you baby your IEMs and don't play with the cable too much VC02 will serve you for a long time. That's not to say they are fragile but the connectors loose their tightness if you remove the cables too often.




and the earpiece(s) stay put in the ear(s) when you shove-out after listening....sometimes or most.


----------



## Shawn71

ruben123 said:


> So... posted a few times already here, now have done some hours research and I have come up with some earphones and I'd like to know at which I have to keep an eye open.
> 
> Looking for the highest detail, most neutral (or natural?!) sound with quite some width. Sound isolation is not needed, build quality a bit more important. Guess I can get a fit with most IEMs. Will be used with FLAC/ Vinyl on Sansa Clip+, 8 Ohm Galaxy i9000 Voodoo, Behringer 50 Ohm soundcard and an unknown, guess 100-ish Ohm, Technics Amp (vinyl). Sansa and Samsung used 90% of the time, Technics amp and Behringer both 5%.
> Higher impedance OR not greatly influenced by higher impedance IEMs are a pre.
> ...




I wld say HiFiman RE-400 (waterline).....its bit costlier to your budget but it has everything you lookin for.....the fit,sound,build,excellent propreitary tips for good isolation......currently its on $79 sale @ head-direct.com......and they can ship with very cheap intl express as well ($10?) .......pls check with them.


----------



## Ruben123

Thanks for your responses. My budget of $35 is not strechable to $79 Im afraid  student's life is hard... money wise
So it seems I have to look closely at the VC02s. The 16 Ohm impedance is not the best thing I read though...

Found some curves! Theyre quite flat at most impedances


----------



## atistatic

Can you recommend me a high end, Flat, wide soundstage and detailed CIEM?


----------



## peter123

ruben123 said:


> Thanks for your responses. My budget of $35 is not strechable to $79 Im afraid  student's life is hard... money wise
> So it seems I have to look closely at the VC02s. The 16 Ohm impedance is not the best thing I read though...
> 
> Found some curves! Theyre quite flat at most impedances




Keep in mind that both your phone and the Clip+ might struggle if you choose too hard to drive IEM's.


----------



## ljokerl

ruben123 said:


> So... posted a few times already here, now have done some hours research and I have come up with some earphones and I'd like to know at which I have to keep an eye open.
> 
> Looking for the highest detail, most neutral (or natural?!) sound with quite some width. Sound isolation is not needed, build quality a bit more important. Guess I can get a fit with most IEMs. Will be used with FLAC/ Vinyl on Sansa Clip+, 8 Ohm Galaxy i9000 Voodoo, Behringer 50 Ohm soundcard and an unknown, guess 100-ish Ohm, Technics Amp (vinyl). Sansa and Samsung used 90% of the time, Technics amp and Behringer both 5%.
> Higher impedance OR not greatly influenced by higher impedance IEMs are a pre.
> ...


 
  
 There's a little more to impedance than just the manufacturer-supplied value. Two IEMs can be listed at 16 ohms, but one might have a flat impedance curve that has no (or minimal) impedance interactions with sources, whereas the other might have a roller coaster of a curve that results in very odd behavior with some sources.
  
 Anyway, I've got to be honest, $35-50 is not a huge budget  for a long-term IEM investment that's also an upgrade to one of the best budget earphones around. Out of the ones you are looking at the Ety Kids might be the best option if you don't mind being "volume limited" on your portable sources by the high impedance. Otherwise I'd go E30 or VC02 for slightly different sound sigs. The E30 isn't necessarily an upgrade to an 8320 in sound, but it is a much more ergonomic earphone. The VC02, as others have said, has touchy connectors.
  
 My real recommendation would actually be to consider the Ostry KC06 instead. Just saw it at mp4nation for $50 after coupon this morning . It's a very sensitive earphone but I still think its performance is a better fit for what you want than the others you're considering. You just might hear a little hiss with those sources of yours that are not optimized for earphones (but definitely will be fine with the Clip+). 
  


atistatic said:


> Can you recommend me a high end, Flat, wide soundstage and detailed CIEM?


 
  
 Hidition NT6 (http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/hidition-nt-6/) and Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro (http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-custom-art-harmony-8-pro-pro-330-v2/)


----------



## Vlad17

Sending my HiFiMan RE-400 pair to be replaced. Need some help.
  
 What to choose from these three - Creative Aurvana In-Ear 2, Sony MDR-EX450 or Audio-Technica CKX5iS - for listening untill I get my earphones back? Which is the closest to the performance of the RE-400?


----------



## suman134

vlad17 said:


> Sending my HiFiMan RE-400 pair to be replaced. Need some help.
> 
> What to choose from these three - Creative Aurvana In-Ear 2, Sony MDR-EX450 or Audio-Technica CKX5iS - for listening untill I get my earphones back? Which is the closest to the performance of the RE-400?


 

 in-ear 2, you can go for ue600 too.


----------



## Shawn71

vlad17 said:


> Sending my HiFiMan RE-400 pair to be replaced. Need some help.
> 
> What to choose from these three - Creative Aurvana In-Ear 2, Sony MDR-EX450 or Audio-Technica CKX5iS - for listening untill I get my earphones back? Which is the closest to the performance of the RE-400?




may be CA 2...due to its BA sound,but not very close to 400s level as they are strong in mids and sweet highs but CA 2 cld be airy in comparison....sony might be bassy.


----------



## Vlad17

I was mainly thinking about the Creative Aurvana 2 also, but thought the other two might offer some surprises. After some more digging on google I think not.
  
 Might get my hands on the Xiomi Piston 2, but not sure if the guy who's selling them is true or not about them being original.
  
 Thanks for the replies.


----------



## suman134

vlad17 said:


> I was mainly thinking about the Creative Aurvana 2 also, but thought the other two might offer some surprises. After some more digging on google I think not.
> 
> Might get my hands on the Xiomi Piston 2, but not sure if the guy who's selling them is true or not about them being original.
> 
> Thanks for the replies.


 
  
   piston is good but its not as clean as re-400, and is bassy too. see if you can get a she9850 for cheap, these are really close to re-400.


----------



## Spartoi

What are the best IEMs under $200 with a mic? Just a list would be nice, but I'd prefer any non-basshead IEM (I like bass, but not overpowering). I currently have the RHA 750i but I'm looking for an upgrade. I was looking at the RHA T10i but it seems they are more bass-oriented.


----------



## Ruben123

ljokerl said:


> There's a little more to impedance than just the manufacturer-supplied value. Two IEMs can be listed at 16 ohms, but one might have a flat impedance curve that has no (or minimal) impedance interactions with sources, whereas the other might have a roller coaster of a curve that results in very odd behavior with some sources.
> 
> Anyway, I've got to be honest, $35-50 is not a huge budget  for a long-term IEM investment that's also an upgrade to one of the best budget earphones around. Out of the ones you are looking at the Ety Kids might be the best option if you don't mind being "volume limited" on your portable sources by the high impedance. Otherwise I'd go E30 or VC02 for slightly different sound sigs. The E30 isn't necessarily an upgrade to an 8320 in sound, but it is a much more ergonomic earphone. The VC02, as others have said, has touchy connectors.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 So you recommend Ety Kids, VC02 or KC06. KC06s seem also to be quite flat at the impedance curve which is nice. Thanks!


----------



## jrcarboleda

Hello, i'm sorry if this is not applicable here but I'll post it anyway.. What is the best earphone with mic and controls for a cellphone.. @ $150 ?


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hey joker, brainwavz m3 vs fidue a63... Which of the two is better overall ?


----------



## Shawn71

jrcarboleda said:


> Hello, i'm sorry if this is not applicable here but I'll post it anyway.. What is the best earphone with mic and controls for a cellphone.. @ $150 ?




Any particular preference? Like universal mic or Android or Windows or BB or Apple compatible ones that has vol cobtrols......


----------



## suman134

spartoi said:


> What are the best IEMs under $200 with a mic? Just a list would be nice, but I'd prefer any non-basshead IEM (I like bass, but not overpowering). I currently have the RHA 750i but I'm looking for an upgrade. I was looking at the RHA T10i but it seems they are more bass-oriented.


 
  xba-30ip , do westones come with mic? if yes then w20 will be nice, or the hf2, wont be an upgrade but cant recall one with better Sq and MIC.
  just realized that , there is rockit r50 with mic. its a nice one.


----------



## suman134

jrcarboleda said:


> Hello, i'm sorry if this is not applicable here but I'll post it anyway.. What is the best earphone with mic and controls for a cellphone.. @ $150 ?


 

  want bass? ma-750, if no than HF2/HF3 and r50.


----------



## Snipars

Any chances on a review on the Senheisser In ear momentum?


----------



## ZapX629

snipars said:


> Any chances on a review on the Senheisser In ear momentum?


 

 He's already on it.


----------



## jrcarboleda

shawn71 said:


> Any particular preference? Like universal mic or Android or Windows or BB or Apple compatible ones that has vol cobtrols......




Thanks man its for my dad.. He doesn't have a particular preference.. He told me he'd use it for a celphone and an ipod.. But since he's in a noisy environment I told him to buy etymotic hfs..



suman134 said:


> want bass? ma-750, if no than HF2/HF3 and r50.




Hf2/hf3 would suit my preference.. Thanks.


----------



## thesuperguy

Hey Joker, I have been considering purchasing a moderately priced entry level pair of IEMs for my girlfriend for Christmas, and I've laid my eyes on the VSD3S for quite some time. I'm just wondering how they might compare to other earphones in the same 50ish dollars price range. Perhaps a score on your 10 point scale regarding sound quality would be nice too. Just note that she doesn't really have any preferences towards sound signatures, because she doesn't really listen to music through earphones anyways. So she doesn't have a bias towards overly bassy music or your typical consumer earphones.


----------



## Shawn71

thesuperguy said:


> Hey Joker, I have been considering purchasing a moderately priced entry level pair of IEMs for my girlfriend for Christmas, and I've laid my eyes on the VSD3S for quite some time. I'm just wondering how they might compare to other earphones in the same 50ish dollars price range. Perhaps a score on your 10 point scale regarding sound quality would be nice too. Just note that she doesn't really have any preferences towards sound signatures, because she doesn't really listen to music through earphones anyways. So she doesn't have a bias towards overly bassy music or your typical consumer earphones.




This might give you some idea.....

 http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/


----------



## ljokerl

So many questions already answered 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


vlad17 said:


> Sending my HiFiMan RE-400 pair to be replaced. Need some help.
> 
> What to choose from these three - Creative Aurvana In-Ear 2, Sony MDR-EX450 or Audio-Technica CKX5iS - for listening untill I get my earphones back? Which is the closest to the performance of the RE-400?


 
  
 Can't comment on the other two but don't get the CKX5iS. It has a very typical "Audio Technica mid-range earphone" sound with strong bass and edgy treble. Not a very refined sound and not a good match for the RE-400.
  


spartoi said:


> What are the best IEMs under $200 with a mic? Just a list would be nice, but I'd prefer any non-basshead IEM (I like bass, but not overpowering). I currently have the RHA 750i but I'm looking for an upgrade. I was looking at the RHA T10i but it seems they are more bass-oriented.


 
  
 The 750i is one of the better ones already. For a more balanced/analytical-sounding compliment/contrast, Etymotic HF2/HF3 or Rockit R-50M would be good options, as* suman *said.
  


justgotlucky123 said:


> Hey joker, brainwavz m3 vs fidue a63... Which of the two is better overall ?


 
  
 Depends on what you're looking for, they're about on-par. I'd probably pick the less expensive A63 myself - it's a little more colored but not in a bad way - warm tone, punchy bass, pretty smooth overall.


----------



## pablobaluba

My Vsonic GR07BE start dying...I start to hear some crackling - when I move or touch the cable, the crackling becomes more obvious.
  
 I'm interested to know if there are IEMs with similar sound signature out there or should I try to recable them (and where). From all the IEMs I heard I love the GR07BE, their details and soundstage is so specail, while the bass is good and layered. Honestly I would prefer to keep them if a re-cable is possible, but if there are any other IEMs out there with similar sound, I'd be interested.

 Thanks in advance!


----------



## 1clearhead

pablobaluba said:


> My Vsonic GR07BE start dying...I start to hear some crackling - when I move or touch the cable, the crackling becomes more obvious.
> 
> I'm interested to know if there are IEMs with similar sound signature out there or should I try to recable them (and where). From all the IEMs I heard I love the GR07BE, their details and soundstage is so specail, while the bass is good and layered. Honestly I would prefer to keep them if a re-cable is possible, but if there are any other IEMs out there with similar sound, I'd be interested.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 
  
 I'm hoping someone will second my opinions on these.....the SADES SA608.
  
 They make gaming headphones, but they came out with there first original named IEM's. They have a very natural deep bass/sub-bass and life like mids and very vivid details.
  
 Take a look.....
http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.1.yw8dQ9&id=42284755569&ns=1&abbucket=17#detail


----------



## FastAndClean




----------



## ZapX629

pablobaluba said:


> My Vsonic GR07BE start dying...I start to hear some crackling - when I move or touch the cable, the crackling becomes more obvious.
> 
> I'm interested to know if there are IEMs with similar sound signature out there or should I try to recable them (and where). From all the IEMs I heard I love the GR07BE, their details and soundstage is so specail, while the bass is good and layered. Honestly I would prefer to keep them if a re-cable is possible, but if there are any other IEMs out there with similar sound, I'd be interested.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 

 What's your budget for them? The ATH CKR9 is the only thing I've heard under $200 with better bass response. The mids are more forward than the GR07BE, but the texture, detail, and response of the bass is even better. Very lean and crisp. You'll also get more depth and height than the GR07 offers, as well as better imaging and separation. I've seen some people who have recabled them but haven't really read any impressions of them.


----------



## ljokerl

pablobaluba said:


> My Vsonic GR07BE start dying...I start to hear some crackling - when I move or touch the cable, the crackling becomes more obvious.
> 
> I'm interested to know if there are IEMs with similar sound signature out there or should I try to recable them (and where). From all the IEMs I heard I love the GR07BE, their details and soundstage is so specail, while the bass is good and layered. Honestly I would prefer to keep them if a re-cable is possible, but if there are any other IEMs out there with similar sound, I'd be interested.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


 
  
 If you can find a cost-effective way to recable them in your area, by all means I think you should do so. I haven't tried the CKR9 so I can't say there's anything in the price range that can do what the GR07 BE does equally well (or better). 
  


fastandclean said:


>




  
 Very cool - thanks for sharing! What I'm more surprised by is how similar the look is to the Munitio Bullet earphones. I guess I never thought about what an actual casing would look like if turned into an IEM, but it looks like Munitio almost nailed it.


----------



## 408388

ozkan said:


> This Lg QB2 is also fast and accurate. You can buy from here.




Would you say these are better than the MH1C then? There's so much loyalty towards one or the other I can't tell which is actually better. Thanks


----------



## ozkan

enssorcel said:


> Would you say these are better than the MH1C then? There's so much loyalty towards one or the other I can't tell which is actually better. Thanks


 
  
 Yes, they sound better than MH1C to my ears, more accurate and balanced if slightly a bit mid-forward. MH1C has too much bass than Lg QB2. The cable is also much better on QB2.


----------



## getclikinagas

enssorcel said:


> Would you say these are better than the MH1C then? There's so much loyalty towards one or the other I can't tell which is actually better. Thanks


 
 I have both (QB2 and MH1C). In the general sense, the QB2 is slightly V shaped with treble emphasis and the MH1C is a slight V shape with more bass emphasis.
  
 Head to head in each category:
  
 Comfort and build: Both have very good build quality (MH1C is slighlty better). The narrow flat Y cable on the QB2 is excellent, average microphonics. The flat J cable on the MH1C will make you want to hang yourself with it. The QB2 has a flatter and wider houding with the nozzle at an angle, MH1C has a slim longer barrel. Fit is subjective. Accessories are equally sparse.
  
*Bass*:
 MH1C has oodles more sub-bass. Midbass quantity is also at a similar level. Fo the quantity it is chucking out the quality is quite good (but not to my taste). Vent mods will tighten the bass and make it feel more controlled.
 QB2 has a midbass hump which is still lesser than the MH1C and sometimes(depending on the genre) does not fit well with the otherwise superb response. Sub-bass quantity is much lower than the MH1C but extends and shows up when called upon. Whether the sub bass quantity is sufficient or not will depend on your preference. Midbass quantity is definitely sufficient for most genres, though it lacks a little control.
  
*Mids*: 
Notes carry nice weight and warmth on the MH1C and is more lush. Both are fairly accurate. Mid-bass spills a bit into the lower mids. The mids are very good but cannot hope to shine/be-prominent because of that bass. The QB2 is also slightly recessed in the mids(mid-bass slightly interferes), more so because of the prominent treble.
  
*Treble: *
MH1C is smooth, forgiving and natural. Is edgy at times but not bothersome. 
QB2 is a clarity oriented phone and sports prominent treble. But, it "never" gets sibilant especially when you expect it to. Even with that 8k peak.
  
*TL;DR*: Both are emphasized on opposite ends of the spectrum. MH1C is bass heavy in comparison. QB2 is relatively more neutral with prominent treble but the midbass lift does inject some punch and warmth. The cable is beyond terrible on the MH1C. Treble is very good on both albeit for different reasons.
If neutral and analytical is your aim, the QB2 comes closer (after a midbass EQ cut)
If warm and natural is your aim, the MH1C will come closer (after vent mods)
  
 Personal biased opinion: I love both but the QB2 slightly edges out the MH1C for me.
 The cable and heavy bass (even after the mod) were the cons with the MH1C. The occasional midbass eccentricity and slightly recessed mids are cons.on the QB2.
  
 THis is of course a broad description. If you want to know anything specific, let me know.


----------



## 408388

ozkan said:


> Yes, they sound better than MH1C to my ears, more accurate and balanced if slightly a bit mid-forward. MH1C has too much bass than Lg QB2. The cable is also much better on QB2.


 
  
 I don't really want lots of bass so it sounds like GB2 are better in that case. I don't think mid forward is too big a problem.


getclikinagas said:


> I have both (QB2 and MH1C). In the general sense, the QB2 is slightly V shaped with treble emphasis and the MH1C is a slight V shape with more bass emphasis.
> 
> Head to head in each category:
> 
> ...


 
  
 That was a pretty detailed answer, thanks very much  I take it they're your top budget pair then? How good are they for prog metal, as this is what I usually listen to; if you think there's a better IEM for that genre then please say. Thanks again


----------



## ozkan

enssorcel said:


> I don't really want lots of bass so it sounds like GB2 are better in that case. I don't think mid forward is too big a problem.
> 
> That was a pretty detailed answer, thanks very much  I take it they're your top budget pair then? How good are they for prog metal, as this is what I usually listen to; if you think there's a better IEM for that genre then please say. Thanks again


 
  
 For progressive metal I would pick QB2.


----------



## waynes world

Hi @ljokerl! Here's to hoping that you get a chance to review the $79 dual dynamic Fidue A71. They are getting quite the buzz here (and imo they definitely deserve it). Thanks!


----------



## Francisk

I personally find the QB1 Special Edition better than the QB2, low-mids are more controlled. TTpod T1E is also nice and hopefully joker has the time to review it soon.


----------



## getclikinagas

enssorcel said:


> I don't really want lots of bass so it sounds like GB2 are better in that case. I don't think mid forward is too big a problem.
> 
> That was a pretty detailed answer, thanks very much  I take it they're your top budget pair then? How good are they for prog metal, as this is what I usually listen to; if you think there's a better IEM for that genre then please say. Thanks again


 
 Well. yes and no. The QB2 shares equal listening time with my Vsonic VSD1S. I have the Ostry KC06 coming in(which I got for 30$), and I'm hoping it will become my go-to budget IEM.
  
 I only listen to a couple of prog rock songs.A little Dream theatre here, a little Opeth there. I fired up "Pull me under" (wow, it's been a while), and it sounded very nice with my QB2. I think I prefer the bass on the VSD1S but the rest of the range sounded slightly better on the QB2 (which sounded airier). That song doesn't extend much into the treble danger zones, and thereby evaded the 10k peak which could cause sibilance on the VSD1S. The mids were just a tad more accurate and natural on the VSD1S, but sounded more recessed on this song, which made me prefer the QB2.
  
 Gun to my head I'd choose the QB2 for metal. Mainly because the safety of never sibilant treble coupled with decent performance across the slight V range is alluring.
  
 I haven't hear other budget IEMs that I would choose over the QB2 for prog metal. There very well maybe. Maybe others with more experience can chime in. 
  
 In general: Always build on your experience with your last IEM(unless you are actively looking to try new flavors). Figure out what you like/don't like about them and read up as many impressions as possible to see if those boxes are checked. After all, it is the consensus that matters.
 The QB2 will be quite a departure from your XBA1 in terms of sound signature, extension and presence. But it could be a trial that may change your perspective and make your third IEM purchase a better decided one.


----------



## ljokerl

getclikinagas said:


> The flat J cable on the MH1C will make you want to hang yourself with it.


 
  
 Lol. Ain't that the truth.
  


waynes world said:


> Hi @ljokerl! Here's to hoping that you get a chance to review the $79 dual dynamic Fidue A71. They are getting quite the buzz here (and imo they definitely deserve it). Thanks!


 
  
 I will review these. They're quite promising although so far I've only compared them to the much more expensive A83 and liked those better


----------



## waynes world

ljokerl said:


> I will review these. They're quite promising although so far I've only compared them to the much more expensive A83 and liked those better


 
  
 Excellent, and fair enough! I haven't tried the A83's, but I was surprised to read of some people enjoying the A71's more than the A83's. Fwiw, I only thought the A71's were "really good" out of the box, but after some burn in (brain, iem, or otherwise lol) they then became _really_ impressive for me.
  
 Having said all of that, I am very much looking forward to your more detailed impressions!


----------



## joel96

Awesome work, |joker|!
 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1eEBb1DqtW9QoKKG4zgqmMLDkH4nQiV5-Za7DBM2Kaxk/edit#gid=159867385
 I made a spreadsheet based off of most of |joker|'s sub-$300 reviews at or above the nine rating in the sound category, and from the round-up sticky in the Help section of head-fi. I'm probably going to get either the VC1000 (as opposed to the GR07 Bass Edition, which are exactly the same price on VSonic's site), the JVC Ha-fx700, or the Ortofon e-Q5. 
 I picked those three within a budget of less than $200 because I'm aiming for accuracy, detail, and balance. The bass, mids, and highs should produce the correct volume without overwhelming each other or being too quiet; should have instrument separation; clarity (ie not harsh, muddy, or warm); exact reproduction of the attack and decay of the source audio (not thin, tinny, or liquid). That's my best guess at using those terms, it's how I translated them in the above spreadsheet from audiophile-ese into novice-ish. 
 My hf5's Y-split had a break, and I prefer not to render them completely non-functional; I'm bad at fixes, therefore, I decided to sell them. I bring it up because I wanted to mention that I decided not to buy another pair of HF5 due to the microphonics. The short length of the cable at 4'. Even though it's four feet, it's not long enough to wear them with a PC desktop on the floor. The Ortofon is 4', the FX700 is 2'6", and the VC1000 is 4'3". It's not enough to make or break the choice, but I'd still prefer replaceable cables at lengths equivalent to some OTEs. I figure if I'm going to buy IEMs with a stress-inducing cable, might as well be nicer ones than the HF5s. If there are female-to-male 1/8" cables that won't cause too much harm to quality at the entry to intermediate price level, I might start a spreadsheet for those as well, if anyone knows some to start me off with. :/


----------



## throwaway9500

I currently have the Ultimate Ears 900, but the wire keeps on giving away and I have to return them every 4-5 months. I like the headphones, but am tired of being without them for two to three weeks at a time everytime the wire/headphones go out. Are the Custom Art Music Ones a good replacement? I also find the UE900s to be uncomfortable after a while. Any thoughts?
  
 Thanks


----------



## MoonYeol

Fail quote from mobile...

Poster above. Check out FA-4E XB. There is a thread.


----------



## Retrias

moonyeol said:


> Fail quote from mobile...
> 
> Poster above. Check out FA-4E XB. There is a thread.


 

 people reccomend me the FA-4E XB as well , however I literally cant try it since nobody actually sell them in my country . I guess I would have to find someone who have it in singapore or something


----------



## Jozurr

Hi Joker,
  
 Can you please tell me how the UE900s will compare to the RHA MA750 sound and comfort wise? Would these be a sizable upgrade?
  
 Thanks


----------



## CoiL

My subjective input about T-Peos Popular... 


> ...bass quality to go from _great_ to _outstanding_. The earphones are still not bass-light by any stretch – bass impact is only a hair below the VSonic VSD1S, for example, and greater than with the Astrotec AM-800 and the dual-driver MOE-SS01. Despite this, bass control is excellent, resulting one of the best bass quality/quantity ratios I’ve heard among budget earphones.


 
 I underlined those parts which I do not agree. Popular has V-shaped soundstage and they are quite bassy. Piston V2.1 is definitely better choice by SQ. 
  
 Tested with Aune T1 and iBasso DX50 (check profile for details). Also with some smartphones.
  
 IMO


----------



## dukespecial

I created a recommendation thread but got no replies. This seems like a better place to ask anyway 
  
 I have a budget of around $100 to upgrade my CKM500.
  
 Right now I am close to buying the Havi B3 Pro 1 and a Topping NX1. Is this a good upgrade or am I better off with a different pair?
  
 Any pointers greatly appreciated as don't know much about IEMs.


----------



## suman134

dukespecial said:


> I created a recommendation thread but got no replies. This seems like a better place to ask anyway
> 
> I have a budget of around $100 to upgrade my CKM500.
> 
> ...


 
  
   you can go for re-400, if you want balance or eph-100 if you want some bass, never heard the ckm-500 so i am firing in the dark.


----------



## dukespecial

Thanks I will check out the re-400 now as well. This has got to be one of the most crowded markets out there.


----------



## ozkan

dukespecial said:


> I created a recommendation thread but got no replies. This seems like a better place to ask anyway
> 
> I have a budget of around $100 to upgrade my CKM500.
> 
> ...


 
  
 You'd better wait for the Havi B6 like some of us as well. It will supposedly be launched next month I guess.


----------



## ZapX629

dukespecial said:


> I created a recommendation thread but got no replies. This seems like a better place to ask anyway
> 
> I have a budget of around $100 to upgrade my CKM500.
> 
> ...


 

 For $100 there are a lot of nice options to upgrade. I found the CKM500 to be almost nasally and very veiled, so any of these would be a nice update. 
  
 For more neutral sound with nice textures, the GR07 Classic is what I'd suggest. If you'd like a more fun sound with nice, natural midrange, I recommend the ATH-IM70. The NX1 and Havi combo might be good for you as well, but other than soundstage, I preferred the GR07 to it. Plus, as said above, the B6 is just around the corner.


----------



## ljokerl

joel96 said:


> Awesome work, |joker|!
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1eEBb1DqtW9QoKKG4zgqmMLDkH4nQiV5-Za7DBM2Kaxk/edit#gid=159867385
> I made a spreadsheet based off of most of |joker|'s sub-$300 reviews at or above the nine rating in the sound category, and from the round-up sticky in the Help section of head-fi. I'm probably going to get either the VC1000 (as opposed to the GR07 Bass Edition, which are exactly the same price on VSonic's site), the JVC Ha-fx700, or the Ortofon e-Q5.
> I picked those three within a budget of less than $200 because I'm aiming for accuracy, detail, and balance. The bass, mids, and highs should produce the correct volume without overwhelming each other or being too quiet; should have instrument separation; clarity (ie not harsh, muddy, or warm); exact reproduction of the attack and decay of the source audio (not thin, tinny, or liquid). That's my best guess at using those terms, it's how I translated them in the above spreadsheet from audiophile-ese into novice-ish.
> My hf5's Y-split had a break, and I prefer not to render them completely non-functional; I'm bad at fixes, therefore, I decided to sell them. I bring it up because I wanted to mention that I decided not to buy another pair of HF5 due to the microphonics. The short length of the cable at 4'. Even though it's four feet, it's not long enough to wear them with a PC desktop on the floor. The Ortofon is 4', the FX700 is 2'6", and the VC1000 is 4'3". It's not enough to make or break the choice, but I'd still prefer replaceable cables at lengths equivalent to some OTEs. I figure if I'm going to buy IEMs with a stress-inducing cable, might as well be nicer ones than the HF5s. If there are female-to-male 1/8" cables that won't cause too much harm to quality at the entry to intermediate price level, I might start a spreadsheet for those as well, if anyone knows some to start me off with. :/


 
  
 I don't know if I would get the FX700 for "accuracy". It's just not that balanced. VC1000 and e-Q5 are good options though.
  
 3.9 - 4.2 ft is about the standard for IEM cables unless you get something with a detachable cord in which case you can find a  longer replacement cord. Custom IEM manufacturers generally stock both 48 and 64-inch variants. 
  


jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Can you please tell me how the UE900s will compare to the RHA MA750 sound and comfort wise? Would these be a sizable upgrade?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Very different earphones. If you want accuracy and balance, the UE900 is a sizable upgrade with much flatter and more accurate sound. If you like the bass enhancement and warmer, more colored signature of the RHA, then they'll be a downgrade. Comfort could go either way depending on your ears. The UE900 shape isn't perfect for me, so I personally would rather use the MA750. 
  


coil said:


> My subjective input about T-Peos Popular...
> I underlined those parts which I do not agree. Popular has V-shaped soundstage and they are quite bassy. Piston V2.1 is definitely better choice by SQ.
> 
> Tested with Aune T1 and iBasso DX50 (check profile for details). Also with some smartphones.
> ...


 
  
 I did rate the Piston higher for sound quality, but the Popular review was written/published first. 
  


dukespecial said:


> I created a recommendation thread but got no replies. This seems like a better place to ask anyway
> 
> I have a budget of around $100 to upgrade my CKM500.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The B3 Pro 1 is rather different-sounding from the more v-shaped CKM500. It's technically better, but it's also hard to call it an upgrade because it's tuned differently. I discussed its sound a little here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/ . The CKM500 is definitely more v-shaped, with more of a mid-bass hump and harsher treble.


----------



## Jozurr

ljokerl said:


> Very different earphones. If you want accuracy and balance, the UE900 is a sizable upgrade with much flatter and more accurate sound. If you like the bass enhancement and warmer, more colored signature of the RHA, then they'll be a downgrade. Comfort could go either way depending on your ears. The UE900 shape isn't perfect for me, so I personally would rather use the MA750.


 
  
 I see. Another option I currently have is to get the Sennheiser IE80 for about $230. I want to upgrade from the MA750. I've enjoyed my journey as follows .. Brainwavz M1 > MH1C > MA750 > xxxx?
  
 Im ok with having a little bit more treble as long as its not sharp or sibilant.


----------



## suman134

jozurr said:


> I see. Another option I currently have is to get the Sennheiser IE80 for about $230. I want to upgrade from the MA750. I've enjoyed my journey as follows .. Brainwavz M1 > MH1C > MA750 > xxxx?
> 
> Im ok with having a little bit more treble as long as its not sharp or sibilant.


 
  
  dn-1000, abit sparky but good, you want bass right? why dont you try the t10i.


----------



## dukespecial

Thanks for all of the replies, I definitely agree that the CKM500 has a harsh treble and definitely one of the reasons I want to change. They also seem to struggle with certain genres as well.
  
 After checking out all the recommendations I just need to choose from the below now:
  
JVC HA-FXT90
Havi B3 Pro 1 + Topping NX1
GR07
 ATH-IM70
  
Again thanks for the advice, all of those comments on the comparison by Joker helped too!


----------



## xtwargodtx

Don't f





dukespecial said:


> Thanks for all of the replies, I definitely agree that the CKM500 has a harsh treble and definitely one of the reasons I want to change. They also seem to struggle with certain genres as well.
> 
> After checking out all the recommendations I just need to choose from the below now:
> 
> ...


 don't forget about the the sidy/bgvp dgs 100 or fidue a71


----------



## ZapX629

dukespecial said:


> Thanks for all of the replies, I definitely agree that the CKM500 has a harsh treble and definitely one of the reasons I want to change. They also seem to struggle with certain genres as well.
> 
> After checking out all the recommendations I just need to choose from the below now:
> 
> ...


 

 If the treble was too harsh for you on the CKM500, I would probably stay away from the FXT90. It's superbly detailed, but I find it very harsh to listen to, and this is coming from someone who likes a bright treble. GR07 is a bit more tolerable, but it's still hot up top. I love it once I get used to it, but it can be rather harsh on first listen. The Havi can vary quite a bit as the drivers are almost always mismatched. This is probably what gives it its echoey, large soundstage. It's odd in that it's technically (that is to say measurably) very poor, but when you actually listen to it, it sounds pretty great. Some find it very smooth and others find it strident. The IM70 is smooth as silk up top so no worries there. It also has the best midrange of the group. Everything sounds natural and balanced with nothing being offensive. The bass may be too big for some, and I wanted a bit more in the treble, but for the price they're amazing value.


----------



## dukespecial

xtwargodtx said:


> Don't f
> don't forget about the the sidy/bgvp dgs 100 or fidue a71


 
  
 Thanks but I am going to narrow it down now 


zapx629 said:


> If the treble was too harsh for you on the CKM500, I would probably stay away from the FXT90. It's superbly detailed, but I find it very harsh to listen to, and this is coming from someone who likes a bright treble. GR07 is a bit more tolerable, but it's still hot up top. I love it once I get used to it, but it can be rather harsh on first listen. The Havi can vary quite a bit as the drivers are almost always mismatched. This is probably what gives it its echoey, large soundstage. It's odd in that it's technically (that is to say measurably) very poor, but when you actually listen to it, it sounds pretty great. Some find it very smooth and others find it strident. The IM70 is smooth as silk up top so no worries there. It also has the best midrange of the group. Everything sounds natural and balanced with nothing being offensive. The bass may be too big for some, and I wanted a bit more in the treble, but for the price they're amazing value.


 
  
 I'll remove the FXT90, with the comments on the IM70 it is definitely sounding like the way to go. The IM70 wouldn't require the Topping NX1 would they to drive them just as good not amped? As otherwise I would have to settle with the Havis.


----------



## xtwargodtx

dukespecial said:


> Thanks but I am going to narrow it down now
> 
> I'll remove the FXT90, with the comments on the IM70 it is definitely sounding like the way to go. The IM70 wouldn't require the Topping NX1 would they to drive them just as good not amped? As otherwise I would have to settle with the Havis.


 if I remember correctly don't the havi's have balance issues?


----------



## peter123

dukespecial said:


> Thanks but I am going to narrow it down now
> 
> I'll remove the FXT90, with the comments on the IM70 it is definitely sounding like the way to go. The IM70 wouldn't require the Topping NX1 would they to drive them just as good not amped? As otherwise I would have to settle with the Havis.




No you don't need an amp for the IM70's.

I've got the Havi's as well and must say that I do prefer them by a small margin over the IM70. 

Given the fact that you don't need an amp for the IM70's and they've got more bass and in that way might be a better allrounder (comes down to preference) you might want to chose them for convince.


----------



## dukespecial

xtwargodtx said:


> if I remember correctly don't the havi's have balance issues?


 
  
 From what I have read on here I did not see this mentioned, if anyone else has any further insight into this it would be great.


peter123 said:


> No you don't need an amp for the IM70's.
> 
> I've got the Havi's as well and must say that I do prefer them by a small margin over the IM70.
> 
> Given the fact that you don't need an amp for the IM70's and they've got more bass and in that way might be a better allrounder (comes down to preference) you might want to chose them for convince.


 
  
 Thanks I thought that may be the case. I will just be using them with my RMBP and iPhone for the time being so IM70 as you say for convenience may be the better bet.


----------



## ozkan

+1 on IM70. A great value.


----------



## Za Warudo

Hey, |joker|, do you have any suggestions for an IEM around $100 or less with an inline mic and a relatively balanced sound?  My friend is looking to buy one to use with his iphone.  I thought about the Senn Momentum iem but it seems to be too bassy.


----------



## ozkan

za warudo said:


> Hey, |joker|, do you have any suggestions for an IEM around $100 or less with an inline mic and a relatively balanced sound?  My friend is looking to buy one to use with his iphone.  I thought about the Senn Momentum iem but it seems to be too bassy.




Logitech UE600vi. :rolleyes:


----------



## ozkan

dukespecial said:


> From what I have read on here I did not see this mentioned, if anyone else has any further insight into this it would be great.
> 
> Thanks I thought that may be the case. I will just be using them with my RMBP and iPhone for the time being so IM70 as you say for convenience may be the better bet.




Actually IM70 and Havi B3 have different sound signatures. I find vocals more natural, full and a bit forward on IM70. On the other hand, Havi has more extention on bass and treble. If vocals are your priority, you should better go for IM70. For accoustics and classics I would choose Havi over IM70 anytime.


----------



## dukespecial

ozkan said:


> Actually IM70 and Havi B3 have different sound signatures. I find vocals more natural, full and a bit forward on IM70. On the other hand, Havi has more extention on bass and treble. If vocals are your priority, you should better go for IM70. For accoustics and classics I would choose Havi over IM70 anytime.


 

 Just when I think I have decided! 
  
 I listen to classical a lot and the likes of Rodrigo y Gabriela. I also love my vocals however especially Coeur de Pirate so this is quite a difficult call to make.


----------



## ZapX629

dukespecial said:


> Just when I think I have decided!
> 
> I listen to classical a lot and the likes of Rodrigo y Gabriela. I also love my vocals however especially Coeur de Pirate so this is quite a difficult call to make.


 

 I actually think the IM70 does classical quite well for being a warmer, mid-forward IEM. Also has great sense of depth and height. The soundstage overall isn't as wide as the B3, but it does have a nice 3D presentation and, in my opinion, a more cohesive image. My B3 in particular was very unbalanced in the mid range and while the sense of space was superb, it didn't come across as very natural sounding with acoustic instruments. If it helps, this is the kind of thing that I absolutely love with the IM70. 
  
​


----------



## dukespecial

Thanks that helps a lot. Still close between the two but at least it is down to two now and I just need to think which genre I want to have the edge.
  
 Appreciate all the feedback everyone has given, feel like I have a better understanding of IEMs now as well.


----------



## peter123

dukespecial said:


> Thanks that helps a lot. Still close between the two but at least it is down to two now and I just need to think which genre I want to have the edge.
> 
> Appreciate all the feedback everyone has given, feel like I have a better understanding of IEMs now as well.




I'll mess everything up for you saying that I find the B3's more natural and having better depth 

They're both very good IEM's though!


----------



## dukespecial

Haha yeah sounds like I can't go wrong with whichever one I get at this point!! At least this will be the last decision I will have to make on IEMs in a long while!


----------



## peter123

dukespecial said:


> Haha yeah sounds like I can't go wrong with whichever one I get at this point!! At least this will be the last decision I will have to make on IEMs in a long while!




That's true, you can't go wrong with any of them so I'm sure you'll be happy whichever you choose.


----------



## ZapX629

dukespecial said:


> Haha yeah sounds like I can't go wrong with whichever one I get at this point!! At least this will be the last decision I will have to make on IEMs in a long while!


 

 It really comes down to whether you want warm and rich, or more analytical and neutral. Coming from the CKM500 either one will be a sizable upgrade.


----------



## mdiogofs

Coming from the CKM500 you will not like the B3. Very diferent signature, you'll miss the fun factor and find the treble somehow cold. You should get the non detachable cable VSD3S. It's a very complete and versatile IEM.
And I love the B3. But I also have VSD3S. You can live with only a moderate warm IEM, but not with only an almost cold IEM. The B3 is not suitable for many genres. It doesn't party with a rock track like the VSD3S does.


----------



## peter123

mdiogofs said:


> Coming from the CKM500 you will not like the B3. Very diferent signature, you'll miss the fun factor and find the treble somehow cold. You should get the non detachable cable VSD3S. It's a very complete and versatile IEM.
> And I love the B3. But I also have VSD3S. You can live with only a moderate warm IEM, but not with only an almost cold IEM. The B3 is not suitable for many genres. It doesn't party with a rock track like the VSD3S does.




Is it correct that it's the B3's you find cold?


----------



## ozkan

peter123 said:


> Is it correct that it's the B3's you find cold?


 
  
 I'm confused too. It should be nothing but cold.


----------



## mdiogofs

Yes, in comparison. ZapX629 says most of it:


zapx629 said:


> It really comes down to whether you want warm and rich, or more analytical and neutral. Coming from the CKM500 either one will be a sizable upgrade.




As treble coldness I mean aggressive and almost harsh. Some refer to this as hot but to me, the sound like that feels cold almost like ice. Somehow analytic, cynical and not emotional.

For instance, I don't like FiiO E6 with the B3 because it enhances the treble a bit, and overall clarity and definition. So I find it somehow harsh and "cold" in a way that I start to not enjoying the sound.

Anyone tried the "aftermarket" Vsonic small nozzle foam tips with the B3? Great match I believe, the most advantage I feel is that it adds sub bass. And doesn't loose much of the highs. These http://penonaudio.com/VSONIC-Soft-Foam-EarTips?search=tips


----------



## ZapX629

Well, to be fair, I found the Havi quite cold in comparison to the GR07. To me it had an analytical bent that was extremely clear and detailed but not as warm and musical. Please note, when I say cold, I don't mean it as a negative as in with a person being cold vs. warm. It's just a way to describe the quality of the sound. I got a sort of cold, clinical clarity rather than a warm, organic detail, if that makes sense. I think it probably depends a lot on what amp you're pairing it with as well.


----------



## mdiogofs

I believe most of this coldness in the B3 is because it lacks sub bass. So with this tips I mentioned it gains some sub bass and overall sound warmth. Looks like a different IEM to me. It's more "fun". And somehow the sound gained some body and musicality. I'm very very happy with this tips 

And BTW, I believe if @dukespecial prefer soundstage the VSD3S is better with it's V snapped sound. If he prefers forward voice perception, and consequently louder and more noticeable, I believe the IM70 is better. Overall VSD3S is more versatile, less intrusive and signature fatigating. Having voices upfront and intimate can get tiring after a while. For some people it's too intrusive.


----------



## Shawn71

xtwargodtx said:


> if I remember correctly don't the havi's have balance issues?




Apart from channel imbalance the fit is NOT for everyone......


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> Apart from channel imbalance the fit is NOT for everyone......


 

  i just wonder if these havi's are really that good or its more of an hype, cuz i think UE600 which is currently priced under $50 can give these a run for their money.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> i just wonder if these havi's are really that good or its more of an hype,




Well,its just fit issue thats one of its huge drawback,I think, I pointed out,so do you call it as "hype"? :rolleyes:


----------



## ZapX629

suman134 said:


> i just wonder if these havi's are really that good or its more of an hype, cuz i think UE600 which is currently priced under $50 can give these a run for their money.


 

 It's really good and it's not just hype, but it's weird in that it's really unbalanced and has this odd reverberant soundstage. It ends up sounding really good for the price, it definitely wasn't expertly tuned or anything.


----------



## peter123

mdiogofs said:


> I believe most of this coldness in the B3 is because it lacks sub bass. So with this tips I mentioned it gains some sub bass and overall sound warmth. Looks like a different IEM to me. It's more "fun". And somehow the sound gained some body and musicality. I'm very very happy with this tips
> 
> And BTW, I believe if @dukespecial prefer soundstage the VSD3S is better with it's V snapped sound. If he prefers forward voice perception, and consequently louder and more noticeable, I believe the IM70 is better. Overall VSD3S is more versatile, less intrusive and signature fatigating. Having voices upfront and intimate can get tiring after a while. For some people it's too intrusive.




I guess we just have to agree to disagree. The B3's to my ears are slightly on the warm side and I find them warmer than the IM70's. Less bass yes but still warmer.




suman134 said:


> i just wonder if these havi's are really that good or its more of an hype, cuz i think UE600 which is currently priced under $50 can give these a run for their money.




I also enjoy the ue600's a lot but to my ears the B3's are superior in every way, YMMV.

As for fit it's always individual, I find the B3's more comfortable than the IM70's, others don't.

VSD3S is also a good suggestion though..........


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> Well,its just fit issue thats one of its huge drawback,I think, I pointed out,so do you call it as "hype"?


 
  
   i just wanted to know, i wondered about its credibility.


----------



## peter123

suman134 said:


> i just wanted to know, i wondered about its credibility.




Yes I understand and I'm only one person but the old B3 thread had a lot of love for them before it got closed. Fwiw they're still on to of my ranking after a year and a lot of new challengers in my collection during this time.


----------



## Wokei

peter123 said:


> Yes I understand and I'm only one person but the old B3 thread had a lot of love for them before it got closed. Fwiw they're still on to of my ranking after a year and a lot of new challengers in my collection during this time.




You're not alone...


----------



## Baycode

peter123 said:


> Yes I understand and I'm only one person but the old B3 thread had a lot of love for them before it got closed. Fwiw they're still on to of my ranking after a year and a lot of new challengers in my collection during this time.




+1


----------



## mdiogofs

peter123 said:


> I guess we just have to agree to disagree. The B3's to my ears are slightly on the warm side and I find them warmer than the IM70's. Less bass yes but still warmer.


 
  
 Yeah i believe they're a little coloured...Not very neutral and with not a natural timbre. So, the perception can be as a little warm, you have a point.
  
 About the fit, get foams. Squeeze the foam, put into the ear and let the foam work it's form. Then the IEM is hold by the foam and can't hardly be feel in the ear, very confortable.
  
 The B3 is not about measures, it's about how it sounds unique and especial with it's flaws


----------



## ozkan

suman134 said:


> i just wonder if these havi's are really that good or its more of an hype, cuz i think UE600 which is currently priced under $50 can give these a run for their money.


 
  
 No, they can't and they aren't hype. UE600 can not hold a candle to Havis. UE600 is no where the Havi B3. Havi B3 is that good!


----------



## peter123

mdiogofs said:


> Yeah i believe they're a little coloured...Not very neutral and with not a natural timbre. So, the perception can be as a little warm, you have a point.
> 
> About the fit, get foams. Squeeze the foam, put into the ear and let the foam work it's form. Then the IEM is hold by the foam and can't hardly be feel in the ear, very confortable.
> 
> *The B3 is not about measures, it's about how it sounds unique and especial with it's flaws *




Well it might come as a surprise but I 100% agree on the bold part 

You're talking about these tips right?



Unfortunately they're to big to stick in my ears and I'm not able to find them in any other size. Might be good for most people not using xs or s sized tips normally though.


----------



## suman134

got it guys, keep calm.


----------



## Shawn71

peter123 said:


> Well it might come as a surprise but I 100% agree on the bold part
> 
> You're talking about these tips right?
> 
> ...




Yeah thats the vsonic's and Yes you are correct,they are big to my ears too.....reason it expands so quickly before I actuall compress and squeeze in.....:mad:


----------



## suman134

but i think joker thinks B3pro is not better then ue600. it might be different but not better.


----------



## peter123

suman134 said:


> but i think joker thinks B3pro is not better then ue600. it might be different but not better.




That's possible and I'm certainly not going to claim that I know better than him. I'm just telling how I feel about them and to my ears the B3's are on a different level


----------



## Dobrescu George

i have been reading this thread for a while... i am wondering between ie800, ultrasone iq, 1plus2 and akg k3003. The best seems 1plus2, but i cannot seem to buy it anymore, it is not produced anymore. akg k3003 seems just a very very overpriced iem from all points of view...
  
 i am left to choose between ie800 and ultrasone iq. i enjoy lots of sounstage, treble, recesed mids, and tight bass [i hate too much bass, like sennheiser ie8]..
  
 ie800 doesn't seem to be around here at all...
 Does the iq have a treble roll off, which would make them sound. plastic.metallic.withoutsoundstage.cheap?...
 what is everyone thinking that would be better between ie800 and iq?


----------



## suman134

peter123 said:


> That's possible and I'm certainly not going to claim that I know better than him. I'm just telling how I feel about them and to my ears the B3's are on a different level


 

 i understand that, there are phones that suits us better then others.


----------



## xtwargodtx

Are the gr06 any good compared to the re-300h or Zero Audio Bassoo? I'm really considering the gr06 because of jokers review and the accessory kit it comes with.


----------



## Niyologist

Can anyone help me get the best deal for $80? I need great earphones that have a huge sense of space and great detail retrieval with bass. Also, the build needs to be good. Is the IM70 any good?


----------



## peter123

niyologist said:


> Can anyone help me get the best deal for $80? I need great earphones that have a huge sense of space and great detail retrieval with bass. Also, the build needs to be good. Is the IM70 any good?




Yes, the im70's are a good option for what you're looking for.


----------



## ZapX629

niyologist said:


> Can anyone help me get the best deal for $80? I need great earphones that have a huge sense of space and great detail retrieval with bass. Also, the build needs to be good. Is the IM70 any good?


 

 +1 on the IM70. For $80 with good stage and separation and good bass, I think that's your best bet. You can check out the review in my sig to see more of my impressions.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted impressions of the 1964EARS ADEL A12: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-1964ears-1964-adel-a12/ . Very promising so far, quite possibly a new benchmark.
  
 Edit: whoa, 10,000th post. 
  


jozurr said:


> I see. Another option I currently have is to get the Sennheiser IE80 for about $230. I want to upgrade from the MA750. I've enjoyed my journey as follows .. Brainwavz M1 > MH1C > MA750 > xxxx?
> 
> Im ok with having a little bit more treble as long as its not sharp or sibilant.


 
  
 I don't know if the IE80 is really an upgrade from the MA750 more so than just a different flavor of similarly enhanced-bass sound. The DN-1000 that suman134 recommended may well be a better option in the same price range, especially if you don't mind a brighter sound.
  
  


dukespecial said:


> Thanks for all of the replies, I definitely agree that the CKM500 has a harsh treble and definitely one of the reasons I want to change. They also seem to struggle with certain genres as well.
> 
> After checking out all the recommendations I just need to choose from the below now:
> 
> ...


 
  
 A little late to the party on this but as others have said the FXT90 and GR07 might not be the best options if you're specifically after smoother treble. 
  


za warudo said:


> Hey, |joker|, do you have any suggestions for an IEM around $100 or less with an inline mic and a relatively balanced sound?  My friend is looking to buy one to use with his iphone.  I thought about the Senn Momentum iem but it seems to be too bassy.


 
  
 Momenutm is definitely on the bassy side. The UE600vi *ozkan* suggested is quite good. You can also look at the HiFIMan RE-400i, Etymotic MC3, or even the mic version of the Rock Jaw Alfa Genus (with the gold filters it's quite well-balanced). 
  
  


dobrescu george said:


> i have been reading this thread for a while... i am wondering between ie800, ultrasone iq, 1plus2 and akg k3003. The best seems 1plus2, but i cannot seem to buy it anymore, it is not produced anymore. akg k3003 seems just a very very overpriced iem from all points of view...
> 
> i am left to choose between ie800 and ultrasone iq. i enjoy lots of sounstage, treble, recesed mids, and tight bass [i hate too much bass, like sennheiser ie8]..
> 
> ...


 
  
 IE 800 and IQ are not really great value, either. Each has its own concessions. The IE800 may well be too bassy for you but is otherwise pretty good-sounding; the IQ takes some playing around with to sound right and is at best on-par with the IE800. For the v-shaped sound you're describing you may be better off with something less expensive like a LEAR LUF4. 
  


xtwargodtx said:


> Are the gr06 any good compared to the re-300h or Zero Audio Bassoo? I'm really considering the gr06 because of jokers review and the accessory kit it comes with.


 
  
 These days I would go for the VSD3/S over the GR06 unless you really like the GR06 form factor. So far I prefer the VSD3S to the RE-300h.


----------



## Dobrescu George

the thing i want is the best soundstage with a more bright than warm sound... i enjoy the best of soundstage, like i actually enjoyed hd800 a lot. something similar? i thought that iq, ie800 or k3003 should be good enough.. i found some place where i can make customs, but it is an only in romania thing, and i have zero ideea how they sound. they told me that they can reshell anything, for ~150$..   http://www.ultimatesound.ro
  
 something like dual driver custom costs as much as a pair of ie80 new. they allow some tuning..
  
 it doesn't seem like anyone on headfi heared of them...
  
 so, considering only the best soundstage, with the best treble, what would be the best iem?... [price doesn't matter as much as value for price]


----------



## ericr

How about the A10 from the 1964 ADEL Kickstarter? Joker just did a quick review of their A12 on theheadphonelist.com and said it had the best soundstage of the BA IEMs he has tried.

http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-1964ears-1964-adel-a12/

The A10 is to have more of a reference sound, where the A12 is towards the warm side.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1043330169/realloud-technology-that-saves-your-hearing-and-yo

The Kickstarter only has about 6 hours left!


----------



## ljokerl

dobrescu george said:


> the thing i want is the best soundstage with a more bright than warm sound... i enjoy the best of soundstage, like i actually enjoyed hd800 a lot. something similar? i thought that iq, ie800 or k3003 should be good enough.. i found some place where i can make customs, but it is an only in romania thing, and i have zero ideea how they sound. they told me that they can reshell anything, for ~150$..   http://www.ultimatesound.ro
> 
> something like dual driver custom costs as much as a pair of ie80 new. they allow some tuning..
> 
> ...


 
  
 Never heard of that CIEM manufacturer. Don't think they are known outside of Romania. 
  
 Thinking that if you're sticking to universals, the Sony MDR-EX1000 (assuming you can find one) may be a better option for a brighter, wider sound. It's certainly a better match for that type of sig than the IE 800 or IQ.


----------



## Dobrescu George

ljokerl said:


> Never heard of that CIEM manufacturer. Don't think they are known outside of Romania.
> 
> Thinking that if you're sticking to universals, the Sony MDR-EX1000 (assuming you can find one) may be a better option for a brighter, wider sound. It's certainly a better match for that type of sig than the IE 800 or IQ.


 
 i could not fiind any..
  
 thanks a lot for devoting some of your time to helping me..
  
 so, you seem to not want to talk about akg k3003, i like ideea of an not natural, but exaggerated soundstage, even if sounds are not where they should be naturally. i would be ok with the ideea. but i feel like k3003 is more of a bad value for the money?..
  
 on the first page, you seemed to like ultrasone iq, like they were almos akg k3003.. this is also a reason for me to stop and ask what if i can get something like k3003 at a price which would be almost half.... if not, would you reccomend k3003, as i don't seem to fiind anything else which would match the word soundstage?...
  
 as far as CIEMs would go, i don't want to complicate things, like buying from someone who is not from my country.VAT is 24%.
  
 i want the soundstage to be like the sounds coming from as far as possible, making it easy to discover new sounds and such. about sq, i am not sure, i just hate having too much bass, like ie8 from sennheiser treble i like to be easier to be heared, even if this leads to sibilance, and harsh treble. as i said, i am searching for something that comes as close as possible to the general signature of something in between hd800 and ultrasone signature dj.
  
 i must mention that i have been reading most of the reviews of the iems that were on the first page, and, i can say that i want amazing soundstage, and the opposite of dark signature. i have this problem with ie8, and other headphones/iems that i tried, except hd800, when a vocal is shout, or is loud, it distorts, like, the sound you hear from the radio when it is between channels. specially bad with piano..


----------



## ljokerl

dobrescu george said:


> so, you seem to not want to talk about akg k3003, i like ideea of an not natural, but exaggerated soundstage, even if sounds are not where they should be naturally. i would be ok with the ideea. but i feel like k3003 is more of a bad value for the money?..
> 
> on the first page, you seemed to like ultrasone iq, like they were almos akg k3003.. this is also a reason for me to stop and ask what if i can get something like k3003 at a price which would be almost half.... if not, would you reccomend k3003, as i don't seem to fiind anything else which would match the word soundstage?...
> 
> ...


 
  
 You dismissed the K3003 right away as a poor value, and I can't really argue with that because it's $1300, but at the same time I don't think the IQ or IE800 really have the soundstage you're looking for. Even the K3003 doesn't really have as wide a presentation as an EX1000, so I am thinking with value for money factored in there might be better options. For instance, I thought that Dunu's hybrid answer to the K3003, the DN-2000, was actually a bit more spacious and it's about 1/4 the price. I posted a brief overview of it here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/


----------



## Dobrescu George

ljokerl said:


> You dismissed the K3003 right away as a poor value, and I can't really argue with that because it's $1300, but at the same time I don't think the IQ or IE800 really have the soundstage you're looking for. Even the K3003 doesn't really have as wide a presentation as an EX1000, so I am thinking with value for money factored in there might be better options. For instance, I thought that Dunu's hybrid answer to the K3003, the DN-2000, was actually a bit more spacious and it's about 1/4 the price. I posted a brief overview of it here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-dunu-dn-2000-fidue-a83-t-peos-altone200-sony-xba-h3-triple-driver-hybrids-compared/


 
 from your post it would seem like dn2000 is not as bright soundsing as k3003 is, and it is not as good sounding in rest, but it is a very nice iem for that price..
  
 dn2000 is not available in my country either, and it would seem that it is going to be a hassle to buy one, not to mention that i am going to pay around 500$ for one, because of taxes... 
 i was trying to buy something from my country because of this, but if dn2000 beats k3003 in all aspects, and it is a cheaper version, then i might go for it..
 it is not much of a problem how much it costs, but how good it sounds for the price. i want to buy the best sound possible, but the aspect of soundstage and treble has a more importance for me, when looking for headphones. also, i am searching for a thight bass. questions would be more like k3003 worth it's price? better sound exists for my tastes? what would be the price of that one?
  
 thanks for all your help, i am just the type that makes up his mind a little harder..


----------



## David.M

ljoker.

 I really appreciate this thread.  I remember lurking those rainy nights and reading all about the iems that i wanted and was always glad to see a nice detailed summary of everything listed.
  
  
 So I've been using the Visang-R02's for quite a long time, and i love em, but they unfortunately got misplaced and now i need a new pair of iem's !
  
  
 What is something better/similar to the visang-r02, with same similar qualities, full body vocals, decent/all-rounder explosive and quality bass/great soundstage and separation,  but maybe a little warmer too.
  
 I can stretch my budget to $80 if needed.


----------



## ZapX629

david.m said:


> ljoker.
> 
> I really appreciate this thread.  I remember lurking those rainy nights and reading all about the iems that i wanted and was always glad to see a nice detailed summary of everything listed.
> 
> ...


 

 Having not heard the R02, but going by your suggestions, my recommendation at $80 is the ATH-IM70. It has natural, forward vocals and warm, full signature with excellent separation and imaging as well as great depth and height in a very 3D presentation. The little brother IM50 ($50-60) is a great call as well, just not quite as good at imaging/separation and lacks a bit of the balance of the IM70.
  
 The VSD3S is a good IEM that I'd recommend as well, though the vocal range is rather recessed and the upper treble is rather peaky. I also wouldn't say it has the best build quality. It does have very good stage and separation though as well as a warm quality. The KC06 might be a little too bass light for an allrounder and the soundstage is very two dimensional. It does tick your box of good vocals and separation though. 
  
 Hope that helps.


----------



## Amitl

Sony advertises the SBH80 as having balanced armature drivers.....i'm confused


----------



## ljokerl

david.m said:


> ljoker.
> 
> I really appreciate this thread.  I remember lurking those rainy nights and reading all about the iems that i wanted and was always glad to see a nice detailed summary of everything listed.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Couple of solid options - for absolute sound quality your best bet may be the Sony MH1C. The cable is a pain in the neck but the sound is quite special - warm, smooth, punchy, yet spacious and not real veiled. Fidue A63 is another I'd consider - not as much bass (especially deep bass) as the MH1C but it's still tonally warm and has a more mid/vocal-centric sound with a pretty good soundstage. Another one in the same vein but a little more balanced and not as punchy or clear would be the ViSang VS-K1, which has a lot of similarities to your R02.
  
 If you just want to go a ways warmer and bassier, I'd also consider the Dunu DN-23. About as warm as it gets in the price range without sound like crap. 
  
  


amitl said:


> Sony advertises the SBH80 as having balanced armature drivers.....i'm confused


 
  
 Not BA. It's the MH1C driver.


----------



## Niyologist

How is the build quality on the Having B3 Pro I?


----------



## Wokei

niyologist said:


> How is the build quality on the Having B3 Pro I?




Imho ....good


----------



## Niyologist

@Wokei: Is it almost as good as the Ostry KC06?


----------



## Wokei

They are equally good...though the cable on Havi are but on the heavy side


----------



## ZapX629

Yeah, havi cable is really bad, but the build seems solid enough and even good, as Chinese IEMs go. Ostry is better built in my eyes, but sound isn't as good.


----------



## Niyologist

Then I shall go for the Havi B3 Pro I.


----------



## CoiL

If You are anywhere near liking slightly enhanced bass, then avoid B3 Pro1. They do sound very good but bass department is littlebit too weak/laid back and gives no emotion. Tried lot of tips with those and couldn`t get bass right. And cable is quite pain in the as: .
 Otherwise great build quality and SQ. Don`t know about Pro2 but they should have more bass. 
  
 IMO


----------



## encoreAC

coil said:


> If You are anywhere near liking slightly enhanced bass, then avoid B3 Pro1. They do sound very good but bass department is littlebit too weak/laid back and gives no emotion. Tried lot of tips with those and couldn`t get bass right. And cable is quite pain in the as: .
> Otherwise great build quality and SQ. Don`t know about Pro2 but they should have more bass.
> 
> IMO


 
 I agree, the fit can be really tricky too. The sound-sig is on the neutral-bright side. But still way better than the KC06A imho.


----------



## waynes world

ljokerl said:


> Posted impressions of the 1964EARS ADEL A12: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-review-1964ears-1964-adel-a12/ . Very promising so far, quite possibly a new benchmark.




Wow, great write-up! I wish that I never read it because I don't need to know about iems like that, but nevertheless, good stuff


----------



## Gandasaputra

Can't wait to hear Joker's opinion bout EPH-M200; it sounds pleasant and intimate to me except it takes time to get used with the fit. It's like comparing W3 to W4; the W4 is smoother than its predecessor. I paid $100 for it ( now it went back to its retail price,$150) and find the bend-able titanium tube is questionable.


----------



## Dobrescu George

i have been reading reviews for the last days, about dunu, and other iems... most people seem to think that akg k3003 is still in another league than the rest of the iems i was searching for, considering that i am not so much into customs...
  
 the thing is that if the value would not have been so bad, i just feel that i pay more than i am going to get.
  
 [the price is way to much, even if they are the absolute best universals, still they cost  the same as my ultimate laptop, which has a i7, gtx970, ram memory, hard disk, ips display... they are certainly cheaper to build and man, i just cannot explain to myself spending so much on just a iem, but if it is the best..]
  
 what if i am to ask, differently, without considering my tastes, the ear usually adapts, what is the absolute best sounding universal IEM out there?
 and what is the best universal iem out there that has a lot of soundstage?
  
 [general sound, everything to sound at it's best possible]
  
  
 i am sorry for being so insistent with my questions.. i have been reading the entire k3003 thread and 1plus2 threads, and now i am more confused than i was before.


----------



## kendric

dobrescu george said:


> i have been reading reviews for the last days, about dunu, and other iems... most people seem to think that akg k3003 is still in another league than the rest of the iems i was searching for, considering that i am not so much into customs...
> 
> the thing is that if the value would not have been so bad, i just feel that i pay more than i am going to get.
> 
> ...




If you want something that doesn't do anything wrong even at top tier level and something that you want to keep it for a really long time, even if it might not wow you on initial listening-

-you might want to check out Dita Truth Edition also - The owners of them might be able to provide you their 2 cents.


----------



## MoonYeol

dobrescu george said:


> i have been reading reviews for the last days, about dunu, and other iems... most people seem to think that akg k3003 is still in another league than the rest of the iems i was searching for, considering that i am not so much into customs...
> 
> the thing is that if the value would not have been so bad, i just feel that i pay more than i am going to get.
> 
> ...




I'd say that if you want the best sound, somewhere you'd want to spend money on a source, quality music, maybe cables if you're into that. So buying just k3003, dita truth or 1plus2 or another iem and driving it out of your smartphone or on board sound card will most likely not give you the best results. So I'd suggest maybe spending 50% of your iems cost on other equipment to compliment your iems.


----------



## ljokerl

waynes world said:


> Wow, great write-up! *I wish that I never read it because I don't need to know about iems like that,* but nevertheless, good stuff


 
  
 Know exactly how you feel - I have the same thoughts every time I get to try the STAX SR-009 demo 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


gandasaputra said:


> Can't wait to hear Joker's opinion bout EPH-M200; it sounds pleasant and intimate to me except it takes time to get used with the fit. It's like comparing W3 to W4; the W4 is smoother than its predecessor. I paid $100 for it ( now it went back to its retail price,$150) and find the bend-able titanium tube is questionable.


 
  
 Hmm... didn't realize this but do the nozzles actually pivot like the Audio-Technica CKX earphones? Those use a ball joint but it seems to be a similar concept:
  

  
  


dobrescu george said:


> i have been reading reviews for the last days, about dunu, and other iems... most people seem to think that akg k3003 is still in another league than the rest of the iems i was searching for, considering that i am not so much into customs...
> 
> the thing is that if the value would not have been so bad, i just feel that i pay more than i am going to get.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I personally don't have any additional recommendations than what's already been discussed - the only new "top tier" universal on my horizon is the Sony XBA-Z5, but I haven't tried it yet. Everything I've been told about the DITA unit mentioned above has been very positive, but I haven't had a chance to try it and probably won't in the near future.


----------



## Gandasaputra

ljokerl said:


> Hmm... didn't realize this but do the nozzles actually pivot like the Audio-Technica CKX earphones? Those use a ball joint but it seems to be a similar concept:


 
  
 Actually they're not quite pivot-able like the GR07 or the audio technica's. According to the advertise, the nozzle is supposed to be flexible but it's stiff and don't move much.


----------



## Dobrescu George

thanks for the help!
  
 i have a nice source, fiio x5 for now, and i am going to upgrade in the future, to either fiio x7, ak240 or chord hugo..


----------



## ljokerl

gandasaputra said:


> Actually they're not quite pivot-able like the GR07 or the audio technica's. According to the advertise, the nozzle is supposed to be flexible but it's stiff and don't move much.


 
  
 Got it. In that case I'm not sure how much utility it carries...


----------



## Amitl

i'm really interested in the design of the Sony SBH80 / LG Tone+... i wonder
 why good sounding wireless in-ears is a new thing when the technology exists for quite a long time.
 do you guys think we should see more in-ears with similar design in the near future?
 i was almost going to order the SBH80, but i'm such a picky person, i always have complaints
 and i fear the specific design woudlnt stay put behind my neck.
 i wish Sony would go for a more LG Tone+ design, and make the earpiece more MDR EX650 design :S


----------



## ljokerl

amitl said:


> i'm really interested in the design of the Sony SBH80 / LG Tone+... i wonder
> why good sounding wireless in-ears is a new thing when the technology exists for quite a long time.
> do you guys think we should see more in-ears with similar design in the near future?
> i was almost going to order the SBH80, but i'm such a picky person, i always have complaints
> ...


 
  
 I think the wireless in-ear market is a very inviting one right now but it seems like there are a lot of challenges with the compact designs. I'm sure more and more companies will enter the market (heck, even RBH is going for a wireless in-ear) and more and more will deliver a decent product, but it might not be the first-gen effort. Still, more choices is always better as long as there's some way of sifting through the options.


----------



## james444

amitl said:


> i'm really interested in the design of the Sony SBH80 / LG Tone+... i wonder
> why good sounding wireless in-ears is a new thing when the technology exists for quite a long time.
> do you guys think we should see more in-ears with similar design in the near future?
> i was almost going to order the SBH80, but i'm such a picky person, i always have complaints
> ...


 
  
 I tried the SBH80 for a few days and thought its design was pretty well thought out for typical commuting purposes, i.e. mostly stationary use and short stretches of walking. I wouldn't recommend it for high activity purposes though.
  
 Surprisingly, it turned out my biggest gripe was that it's rather cumbersome to stow away when not needed.


----------



## Boffy

Hey Joker, thanks for the great reviews. I currently have an InEar LivePro 2, which is the custom version of InEar StageDiver 2. I am looking for an upgrade, but I want pretty much the exact same sound signature as SD-2. I want an IEM that is neutral from the bass to the highs, just like the SD-2. I listen to a lot of female vocals, so a tiny little emphasis/forwardness on the upper mids would be great. I also have a lot of badly recorded/mastered music files such as Kpop and Jpop, so an IEM with good treble but is forgiving would be fantastic, again just like the SD-2.
  
 I am currently eyeing on the Unique Melody Miracle and the Noble 4S. Do you think these are a fair upgrade compared to the SD-2 without much change in the overall sound signature? Thanks once again.


----------



## Gandasaputra

Hello Joker, how'd you think about the midrange and soundstage of the DN-2000? After my experience with EPH-M200 ( and parted away with it), I learn that my ears are sensitive to forwarded mid-range ( or bloat) and too intimate soundstage. I just hope that DN-2000 isn't like that since it has been my interest to get my 1st hybrid earphones.


----------



## Niyologist

A couple of questions about the Havi B3 Pro I. 1) Does the Havi B3 Pro I have channel imbalance for all of the units? 2) How is the fit for small/medium ears? I don't want to make a mistake on buying the Havi B3 Pro I tonight.


----------



## Merkurio

I bought a pair of Sennheiser IE 800s two days ago, which didn't still arrive, but I'm quite excited since they will be my first top-notch IEMs. In fact, my last ones were a modest CX 281s (which I really enjoyed and sadly I lost) and a Monster N-Ergys, so the gap should be huge. 
  
 Just for curiosity, joker, which of the three "mainstream" top-notch universals do you prefer? I mean Shure SE846, AKG K3003i and Senns IE 800, pros and cons of all of them (and also between each other) would be nice, too.
  
 Thanks for your splendid reviews once again. I have to confess that I got interested in the portable Hi-Fi audio mainly by you.


----------



## ljokerl

boffy said:


> Hey Joker, thanks for the great reviews. I currently have an InEar LivePro 2, which is the custom version of InEar StageDiver 2. I am looking for an upgrade, but I want pretty much the exact same sound signature as SD-2. I want an IEM that is neutral from the bass to the highs, just like the SD-2. I listen to a lot of female vocals, so a tiny little emphasis/forwardness on the upper mids would be great. I also have a lot of badly recorded/mastered music files such as Kpop and Jpop, so an IEM with good treble but is forgiving would be fantastic, again just like the SD-2.
> 
> I am currently eyeing on the Unique Melody Miracle and the Noble 4S. Do you think these are a fair upgrade compared to the SD-2 without much change in the overall sound signature? Thanks once again.


 
  
 Hmm... good question. The Noble 4S and UM Miracle are slightly different takes on neutral sound than the SD-2. The SD-2 tends to be a little darker than neutral to my ear, in part due to that forgiving treble you're talking about. The Miracle leans a bit in the opposite direction. I still think it' quite smooth, but it's definitely brighter, to the point where I wouldn't call it forgiving.
  
 The 4S is more of a compromise between the Miracle and SD-2. It has a brighter sound with less of an upper midrange recession than the SD-2, but is still smoother and more relaxed than the Miracle. It has a little more midrange emphasis than the Miracle, too, though it lacks some of the bass depth and punch. Still sounds like it's a better match for what you want.
  
  
  


gandasaputra said:


> Hello Joker, how'd you think about the midrange and soundstage of the DN-2000? After my experience with EPH-M200 ( and parted away with it), I learn that my ears are sensitive to forwarded mid-range ( or bloat) and too intimate soundstage. I just hope that DN-2000 isn't like that since it has been my interest to get my 1st hybrid earphones.


 
  
 The mids of the DN-2000 are not forward. Maybe even a bit recessed - I'd say it has a mildly v-shaped signature. No problems with the soundstage, either - it's pretty wide as mildly v-shaped earphones tend to be.
  


niyologist said:


> A couple of questions about the Havi B3 Pro I. 1) Does the Havi B3 Pro I have channel imbalance for all of the units? 2) How is the fit for small/medium ears? I don't want to make a mistake on buying the Havi B3 Pro I tonight.


 
  
 Well, if every unit was imbalanced I imagine their earphones wouldn't be as popular as they are. I haven't had great luck with them, but I seem to be in the minority and I also think I'm more sensitive to imbalances than most. 
  
 Ergonomics-wise they are quite good - no worse than a Shure or a VSonic or something. 
  


merkurio said:


> I bought a pair of Sennheiser IE 800s two days ago, which didn't still arrive, but I'm quite excited since they will be my first top-notch IEMs. In fact, my last ones were a modest CX 281s (which I really enjoyed and sadly I lost) and a Monster N-Ergys, so the gap should be huge.
> 
> Just for curiosity, joker, which of the three "mainstream" top-notch universals do you prefer? I mean Shure SE846, AKG K3003i and Senns IE 800, pros and cons of all of them (and also between each other) would be nice, too.
> 
> Thanks for your splendid reviews once again. I have to confess that I got interested in the portable Hi-Fi audio mainly by you.


 
  
  
 Wow, I'm very flattered to hear that 
  
 As for universals - I'd have to say it's the K3003. My ears don't agree with the SE846 (it's quite large) and I do prefer the AKGs to the IE 800, Ultrasone IQ, and the less expensive universal crop like your Westones and UEs and whatnot.


----------



## ljokerl

If anyone wants a chance at a free NarMoo R1M, we're giving some away: http://theheadphonelist.com/the-great-narmoo-r1m-giveaway/ . Sadly the R1M is not a K3003, but still a fun variable-tuning earphone.


----------



## B9Scrambler

ljokerl said:


> If anyone wants a chance at a free NarMoo R1M, we're giving some away: http://theheadphonelist.com/the-great-narmoo-r1m-giveaway/ . Sadly the R1M is not a K3003, but still a fun variable-tuning earphone.




Awesome! I love my NarMoos (both models). Can't wait for the next one.


----------



## Dobrescu George

i am very curious, as there is a very good sale for ie800, with a nice price, how do they compare, soundstage, and treble to k3003.


----------



## Merkurio

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Wow, I'm very flattered to hear that
> As for universals - I'd have to say it's the K3003. My ears don't agree with the SE846 (it's quite large) and I do prefer the AKGs to the IE 800, Ultrasone IQ, and the less expensive universal crop like your Westones and UEs and whatnot.


 
  
 Interesting, seems like the AKGs are very competent despite the high price (as other hybrid IEMs).
  
 Do you prefer the IE 800 to the SE846 as well? Specially for classical/instrumental, which are my main generes. I asked because I could have gotten the Shures instead, but I decided to the Sennheisers due the "dynamical" capabilities.
  
 I hope to see your review of the IE 800s here (apart of InnerFidelity). 
  
 Greetings!


----------



## ljokerl

dobrescu george said:


> i am very curious, as there is a very good sale for ie800, with a nice price, how do they compare, soundstage, and treble to k3003.


 
  
 Due to some of the tuning solutions implemented in the IE800 I think it may have more variance in the treble region for listeners than most IEMs. I personally found it a little thin and splashy. The K3003 is not exactly a hallmark of smoothness what with the TWFK driver and all, but it's not splashy or tizzy (and you also have the three tuning ports, which affect treble most strongly, to play with). Soundstaging is a close call. I would probably still give the nod to the K3003 because the bass of the IE 800 can be a little more intrusive, which isn't great for soundstaging. 
  
 My comment here has a little more info on the subject of the IE 800's treble: http://www.innerfidelity.com/comment/488906#comment-488906 
  
  


merkurio said:


> Interesting, seems like the AKGs are very competent despite the high price (as other hybrid IEMs).
> 
> Do you prefer the IE 800 to the SE846 as well? Specially for classical/instrumental, which are my main generes. I asked because I could have gotten the Shures instead, but I decided to the Sennheisers due the "dynamical" capabilities.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't really want to comment on the sound of the Shures as I really hated the fit and it's very possible I didn't hear them at their best. Don't want to steer anyone away from what could potentially be a good earphone for them. It just wasn't for me.


----------



## Love Music

Hello Joker,
  
 I was just wondering how good the isolation is on the Sony mdr-7550/EX800ST? Would other people be able to tell what your listening to if they sat close to you? How is the timbre, imaging, bass, soundstage and vocals on these? I tend to prefer iem's with intimate/airy vocals, excellent imaging where you can pin point where everything are, excellent timbre, speed and bass (I don't like a lot of bass but I feel you do need an adequate amount of bass sometimes for some instruments to sound realistic like acoustic/electric guitars etc. So I like quality more than quantity).  
  
 Do you think they suit my preferences? Thanks.


----------



## Dobrescu George

ljokerl said:


> Due to some of the tuning solutions implemented in the IE800 I think it may have more variance in the treble region for listeners than most IEMs. I personally found it a little thin and splashy. The K3003 is not exactly a hallmark of smoothness what with the TWFK driver and all, but it's not splashy or tizzy (and you also have the three tuning ports, which affect treble most strongly, to play with). Soundstaging is a close call. I would probably still give the nod to the K3003 because the bass of the IE 800 can be a little more intrusive, which isn't great for soundstaging.
> 
> My comment here has a little more info on the subject of the IE 800's treble: http://www.innerfidelity.com/comment/488906#comment-488906
> 
> ...


 
 did not know about that comment... what i still don't know, is if ie800 has more treble? my actual rig has.. let's say that the treble is louder than the rest of the music. and i love it. this is why i am debating between ie800 and k3003. i want as much treble as possible, even more the very high end of treble 12-20khz.


----------



## kendric

dobrescu george said:


> did not know about that comment... what i still don't know, is if ie800 has more treble? my actual rig has.. let's say that the treble is louder than the rest of the music. and i love it. this is why i am debating between ie800 and k3003. i want as much treble as possible, even more the very high end of treble 12-20khz.


 

 How about getting an audition the K3003 without applying any of its nozzle filter then let us know if its enough for ya?


----------



## Gandasaputra

No offense, If you live in US, I can just simply send you XBA-30 for free (so I won't get charged for international shipping) ; remove the filter out and you'll have the treble you'd need


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> I was just wondering how good the isolation is on the Sony mdr-7550/EX800ST? Would other people be able to tell what your listening to if they sat close to you? How is the timbre, imaging, bass, soundstage and vocals on these? I tend to prefer iem's with intimate/airy vocals, excellent imaging where you can pin point where everything are, excellent timbre, speed and bass (I don't like a lot of bass but I feel you do need an adequate amount of bass sometimes for some instruments to sound realistic like acoustic/electric guitars etc. So I like quality more than quantity).
> 
> Do you think they suit my preferences? Thanks.


 
  
 7550 has the same isolation as the MDR-EX600/EX1000 reviewed in this thread. It doesn't really leak sound, but it lets a good amount of external noise in. It's actually similar to the EX1000 in performance, too, but with a warmer, smoother, slightly less clear and detailed but arguably more tonally natural sound. I don't think they sound very intimate (in the sense that they are pretty spacious) but the mids are not recessed and other than that they fit your requirements quite well. 
  


dobrescu george said:


> did not know about that comment... what i still don't know, is if ie800 has more treble? my actual rig has.. let's say that the treble is louder than the rest of the music. and i love it. this is why i am debating between ie800 and k3003. i want as much treble as possible, even more the very high end of treble 12-20khz.


 
  
 Ah, most of the time people asking about treble are worried about having too much. In that case the IE800 would be good for you, but a K3003 with +treble filters (or, as kendric said, no filters at all) would be even better,
  
 I can also recommend the Lear LUF-4C: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/lear-luf-4-luf-4f-luf-4b-luf-4c/ 
  


kendric said:


> How about getting an audition the K3003 without applying any of its nozzle filter then let us know if its enough for ya?


 

 Haha. Yes, this will definitely do it.


----------



## Dobrescu George

why?..
  
 nah, i am just liking to have enough treble 
  
 sorry, i am from Romania. Cannot get an audition with k3003 nor most IEMs in here. i can somewhat get an audition with ie800 after the holydays. i will get an audition of ie800 then, i just wanted what to expect from k3003 to be after ie800.
 one of the first things i have to do after the holidays are over, is to buy myself a new iem. this is why i am studying so much what to buy.
  
 at first i just wanted ultrasone iq, then ie800, then k3003. it just want to make sure that i spend around 1300$ correctly, at it will be almost impossible to return with the laws in my country.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> 7550 has the same isolation as the MDR-EX600/EX1000 reviewed in this thread. It doesn't really leak sound, but it lets a good amount of external noise in. It's actually similar to the EX1000 in performance, too, but with a warmer, smoother, slightly less clear and detailed but arguably more tonally natural sound. I don't think they sound very intimate (in the sense that they are pretty spacious) but the mids are not recessed and other than that they fit your requirements quite well.


 
 Do they have one the best soundstages in an iem? I heard they had similar soundstage size to headphones. Also do the vocals sound thin? I tend to prefer a rich/warmish sound, but don't sound very dark or congested and have full sounding vocals. With excellent soundstage size as well.


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> Do they have one the best soundstages in an iem? I heard they had similar soundstage size to headphones. Also do the vocals sound thin? I tend to prefer a rich/warmish sound, but don't sound very dark or congested and have full sounding vocals. With excellent soundstage size as well.


 
  
  
 They're certainly up there in soundstage size for an IEM. The 7550 is warmer than the other two and might be a better match for what you're after, both tonally and in note thickness, but the extra treble of the EX1000 gives it a slight edge in airiness and soundstaging. In either case they're neither thin nor thick-sounding, really. If you compare them to a set of Beats Tours 2.0s or an RHA T10i both will sound thin, but if you compare them a VSonic VC1000 or Rock-It R-50 they'll sound thicker.


----------



## MuzicLife

Hi Joker,
  
 Amazing reviews on all the IEMS, I became a bit addicted reading them (read about over 100 already). Currently I am looking for a sub $100 IEM with amazing bass hits but also able to have amazing vocals. I love listening to instrumentals of a hip-hop beat but I also love hearing amazing vocals. I have narrowed it down (but still is a pretty long list) from ATH-IM50, JVC FXD80, ATH-CKM500, UE 600, to the MEElectronics M-Duo. I have been recommended RE-400's but I just don't find its warm signature pleasant enough to wow me. I am looking for an IEM that will create a sparkle in my eyes when the beat drops or when the female vocalists sing their notes. I really want an IEM that has the thumping bass but not too bloated. Basically think of a song with Adele singing with a hip-hop beat in the background. Also, please do recommend any IEM you think is better even if it is no on my list. I will go as high as $100 preferably not to, but if it is worth the price I shall!
  
 Thanks for everything you've done!


----------



## ZapX629

muziclife said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> Amazing reviews on all the IEMS, I became a bit addicted reading them (read about over 100 already). Currently I am looking for a sub $100 IEM with amazing bass hits but also able to have amazing vocals. I love listening to instrumentals of a hip-hop beat but I also love hearing amazing vocals. I have narrowed it down (but still is a pretty long list) from ATH-IM50, JVC FXD80, ATH-CKM500, to the MEElectronics M-Duo. I have been recommended RE-400's but I just don't find its warm signature pleasant enough to wow me. I am looking for an IEM that will create a sparkle in my eyes when the beat drops or when the female vocalists sing their notes. I really want an IEM that has the thumping bass but not too bloated. Basically think of a song with Adele singing with a hip-hop beat in the background.
> 
> Thanks for everything you've done!


 

 IM50 or IM70 is exactly what you want. Add some wide bore tips to open up the treble and you're golden.


----------



## MuzicLife

zapx629 said:


> IM50 or IM70 is exactly what you want. Add some wide bore tips to open up the treble and you're golden.


 
 I have heard of amazing reviews for the IM50 but I was skeptical after hearing reviews out of this forum saying that it doesn't have enough bass or what not. Also, the IM50 has a stronger bass than IM70 correct? Do you recommend getting rid of the filter for a better sound? Thanks.


----------



## ZapX629

muziclife said:


> I have heard of amazing reviews for the IM50 but I was skeptical after hearing reviews out of this forum saying that it doesn't have enough bass or what not. Also, the IM50 has a stronger bass than IM70 correct? Do you recommend getting rid of the filter for a better sound? Thanks.


 

 IM70 has a bit bigger and better bass. IM70 is also a bit deeper in the bass and more refined overall. I didn't find the filter mod helped at all, but I know one person who swears by it. The best modification you can make is using some wider tips. Graphs don't tell the whole story, but here's what the IM50 (top) and IM70 (bottom) measure like. I find it to be mostly accurate with my ears.


----------



## MuzicLife

zapx629 said:


> IM70 has a bit bigger and better bass. IM70 is also a bit deeper in the bass and more refined overall. I didn't find the filter mod helped at all, but I know one person who swears by it. The best modification you can make is using some wider tips. Graphs don't tell the whole story, but here's what the IM50 (top) and IM70 (bottom) measure like. I find it to be mostly accurate with my ears.


 
 Wow those charts are pretty amazing and convincing as well! Currently Is paying an extra $50 for IM70 over the IM50 really worth it? I've heard they are very similar so I am a bit doubtful. I am leaning towards getting the ATH-IM50 the most but I have heard that they aren't that durable. It is also quite cheap, sitting at $50 as well. If there is anything that is recommended over this I will be sure to give it a look. The Sony MHC1 and the CKM500 both look amazing as many people suggested it has very deep and strong bass. How would the MHC1/CKM500 compare to the IM50? I have around a week or so to decide so I will keep researching


----------



## ZapX629

muziclife said:


> Wow those charts are pretty amazing and convincing as well! Currently Is paying an extra $50 for IM70 over the IM50 really worth it? I've heard they are very similar so I am a bit doubtful. I am leaning towards getting the ATH-IM50 the most but I have heard that they aren't that durable. It is also quite cheap, sitting at $50 as well. If there is anything that is recommended over this I will be sure to give it a look. I have around a week or so to decide so I will keep researching


 

 I wouldn't pay an extra $50 for the IM70, though it is worth $100. Not sure why the 70 has gone up so much in price. When I got both they were only $25 apart. I'm a bit shocked to hear you've heard they aren't durable, because they're both built like tanks and have strong cables that can be replaced. You'd have to really abuse these things to break them. sure why the 70 has gone up so much in price.


----------



## MuzicLife

zapx629 said:


> I wouldn't pay an extra $50 for the IM70, though it is worth $100. Not sure why the 70 has gone up so much in price. When I got both they were only $25 apart. I'm a bit shocked to hear you've heard they aren't durable, because they're both built like tanks and have strong cables that can be replaced. You'd have to really abuse these things to break them. sure why the 70 has gone up so much in price.


 
 Amazon is currently selling the IM50 for around 65 but cdJapan is only selling it for $50. What are your opinions on the Sony MHC1, CKM500, or any IEMs that have amazing bass qualities compared to the IM50? There are so many IEMs that have such great reviews I am a bit overwhelmed haha. I've been reading posts and threads all day and I am still inconclusive on my decision. Would be great if you could give me your personal opinions for the IEMS that could possible be better than the IM50. Thanks.


----------



## ZapX629

muziclife said:


> Amazon is currently selling the IM50 for around 65 but cdJapan is only selling it for $50. What are your opinions on the Sony MHC1, CKM500, or any IEMs that have amazing bass qualities compared to the IM50? There are so many IEMs that have such great reviews I am a bit overwhelmed haha. I've been reading posts and threads all day and I am still inconclusive on my decision. Would be great if you could give me your personal opinions for the IEMS that could possible be better than the IM50. Thanks.


 

 I've only heard the MH1 briefly, and while the sound quality is nice for R&B, I found them too warm for my liking and the cable is quite difficult. The CKM500 is not as good in my opinion and wouldn't give you the same bass response as the IM50. It has a very grainy treble and a nasally, congested feeling. The IM50 is on the level of the VSD3S and Ostry KC06. I wouldn't recommend the VSD3S since the vocals may be too recessed for you. The KC06 might be to your liking, but it isn't the biggest bass and the sound is very two dimensional. None of the things I've personally heard have the same bass and vocals as the IM series under $100. The Fidue A71 has been getting some love lately and I believe it's a mid forward sound, but I haven't heard it myself.


----------



## ozkan

muziclife said:


> Amazon is currently selling the IM50 for around 65 but cdJapan is only selling it for $50. What are your opinions on the Sony MHC1, CKM500, or any IEMs that have amazing bass qualities compared to the IM50? There are so many IEMs that have such great reviews I am a bit overwhelmed haha. I've been reading posts and threads all day and I am still inconclusive on my decision. Would be great if you could give me your personal opinions for the IEMS that could possible be better than the IM50. Thanks.


 
  
 I've also found the IM70 better than IM50 in almost every aspect except maybe mid-bass presence. From what I remember IM50 has bigger and boomier bass but IM70 can reach lower and doesn't have in your face presentation like IM50. I can also hear more details with IM70s that I didn't with IM50s.


muziclife said:


> I have heard of amazing reviews for the IM50 but I was skeptical after hearing reviews out of this forum saying that it doesn't have enough bass or what not. Also, the IM50 has a stronger bass than IM70 correct? Do you recommend getting rid of the filter for a better sound? Thanks.


 
  
 It has more than enough bass for sure and it is me who recommended the filter mod to anyone who finds it not detailed and slow in bass attack. You can try the filter mod by yourself and see if it really helps or not. If you think the mod is not necessary put back on the filters. That is it. It worked for me and for some members here as far as I know.


----------



## MuzicLife

ozkan said:


> I've also found the IM70 better than IM50 in almost every aspect except maybe mid-bass presence. From what I remember IM50 has bigger and boomier bass but IM70 can reach lower and doesn't have in your face presentation like IM50. I can also hear more details with IM70s that I didn't with IM50s.
> 
> It has more than enough bass for sure and it is me who recommended the filter mod to anyone who finds it not detailed and slow in bass attack. You can try the filter mod by yourself and see if it really helps or not. If you think the mod is not necessary put back on the filters. That is it. It worked for me and for some members here as far as I know.


 
 I have quite small ears and I've heard IM50 are really big, would this be a problem?


----------



## suman134

ozkan said:


> I've also found the IM70 better than IM50 in almost every aspect except maybe mid-bass presence. From what I remember IM50 has bigger and boomier bass but IM70 can reach lower and doesn't have in your face presentation like IM50. I can also hear more details with IM70s that I didn't with IM50s.
> 
> It has more than enough bass for sure and it is me who recommended the filter mod to anyone who finds it not detailed and slow in bass attack. You can try the filter mod by yourself and see if it really helps or not. If you think the mod is not necessary put back on the filters. That is it. It worked for me and for some members here as far as I know.


 
  i have a few question too, which one has better highs? and is the mid bass on im-70 bad? i want fast but good bass, and which one has more sub bass? i have seen people saying im-70 is not good with male vocals, how true is that.


----------



## ZapX629

muziclife said:


> I have quite small ears and I've heard IM50 are really big, would this be a problem?


 
 Yes, if your ears are small they might be uncomfortable. What are some larger IEMs you have for comparison?


----------



## MuzicLife

zapx629 said:


> Yes, if your ears are small they might be uncomfortable. What are some larger IEMs you have for comparison?


 
 I don't have any large IEMs, if I do end up purchasing the IM50 they will be the first IEM that goes up on my ears. I usually wear my IEM down so I am kind of nervous.


----------



## DrunkenTiger

zapx629 said:


> IM50 or IM70 is exactly what you want. Add some wide bore tips to open up the treble and you're golden.


 
 What's the difference between the two, the IM70 isn't reasonably priced on Amazon atm, the IM50 is but I don't mind paying a bit more when the IM70 price goes down.


----------



## MuzicLife

Alright I've decided to take a leap of faith and purchase the ATH-IM50, thanks for your inputs.


----------



## ozkan

suman134 said:


> i have a few question too, which one has better highs? and is the mid bass on im-70 bad? i want fast but good bass, and which one has more sub bass? i have seen people saying im-70 is not good with male vocals, how true is that.




The highs are better on IM70 by a small margin. No, mid bass is not bad by any means only a bit leaner on IM70 while it is stronger on IM50. IM70 has better sub-bass. Both IM50/70 are good at male vocals as far as I can tell.




drunkentiger said:


> What's the difference between the two, the IM70 isn't reasonably priced on Amazon atm, the IM50 is but I don't mind paying a bit more when the IM70 price goes down.




IM50 has bigger bass and more upfront mids than IM70. On the other hand IM70 has more sub bass rumble and balanced than IM50. Overall IM70 is more refined and sounds a bit more spacious.


----------



## ZapX629

drunkentiger said:


> What's the difference between the two, the IM70 isn't reasonably priced on Amazon atm, the IM50 is but I don't mind paying a bit more when the IM70 price goes down.


 

 From earlier posts:
  


> Yeah, the IM70 handles faster and busier better, but the IM50 is great for just putting in and enjoying music or going on a run/walk. For me, the soundstage, speed, and separation, the overall refinement, is worth the extra 25 bucks for the 70, but I feel like for many people the IM50 will do everything they need. That "feel good" quality of the IM50 is what made me grab the 70 in the first place. They're both really great phones.


 
  


> Been playing with both all night and it's really easy to tell the two of them are siblings. The IM50 has a narrower and shallower stage, and less separation and layering. IM70 has a more refined and balanced quality. In terms of signature, it sounds like the IM50 has less control in the bass and low mids, while the IM70 is boomy, but holds it all together down there a bit better. The mids are kind of forward in general on the IM50 while the IM70 has more of a dip in the low mids and features the mid mids (lol) and high mids. Treble sparkles a little more on the IM50, but that may just be the lack of filters doing that. The treble of the IM70 is more balanced with the rest of the spectrum and not quite as sparkly, though the sparkle is still very present. Also, FYI, I'm using the Auvio hybrids from radio shack, and they sound great. I'll post if I find a better tip while rolling.


----------



## suman134

one last question, is the im-50 worth $80? or should i get the im-70 for $112? yeah its expensive here.


----------



## MuzicLife

suman134 said:


> one last question, is the im-50 worth $80? or should i get the im-70 for $112? yeah its expensive here.


 
 cdJapan is selling them for $50 and from what I've heard the IM70 isn't worth the extra 50.


----------



## DrunkenTiger

^thanks! I think I might go for the IM70 after Christmas season.
 About the Auvio tips, those are the best silicon tips? I really have not dabbled in using non stock tips with any of my IEMs
 How are the sony hybrid eartips, might just bulk order all these xD


----------



## MuzicLife

drunkentiger said:


> ^thanks! I think I might go for the IM70 after Christmas season.
> About the Auvio tips, those are the best silicon tips? I really have not dabbled in using non stock tips with any of my IEMs
> How are the sony hybrid eartips, might just bulk order all these xD


 
 Bore wide tips were recommended and not the tips that curve into a small hole.


----------



## ZapX629

muziclife said:


> cdJapan is selling them for $50 and from what I've heard the IM70 isn't worth the extra 50.


 

 I think $100 for IM70 is a fair price, but you could find it around $85 not long ago. I have no clue why they've gone up. As far as IM50 being worth $80, I don't think they are. _Maybe_ $70, but that's the most I'd pay for them. $50-60 is more fair value. You can find both used on head-fi for very good prices, but I'm sure you'd rather have new.


----------



## suman134

zapx629 said:


> I think $100 for IM70 is a fair price, but you could find it around $85 not long ago. I have no clue why they've gone up. As far as IM50 being worth $80, I don't think they are. _Maybe_ $70, but that's the most I'd pay for them. $50-60 is more fair value. You can find both used on head-fi for very good prices, but I'm sure you'd rather have new.


 

  thanks, i think i will skip these, since i am getting the KEF m200. i was more then curious about these.


----------



## ZapX629

suman134 said:


> thanks, i think i will skip these, since i am getting the KEF m200. i was more then curious about these.


 

 Yeah, I definitely wouldn't pay IM70 prices for the IM50. I've heard great things about those M200s if you can get a good fit. Hope you enjoy them.


----------



## suman134

zapx629 said:


> Yeah, I definitely wouldn't pay IM70 prices for the IM50. I've heard great things about those M200s if you can get a good fit. Hope you enjoy them.


 

  me too, fingers crossed.


----------



## 1clearhead

Merry Christmas Joker and followers!


----------



## ljokerl

Thanks, and Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to all! 
  
 Added a review of the variable-tuning Rock Jaw Alfa Genus while I'm at it. 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C63) Rock Jaw Alfa Genus*
> 
> 
> Details: Variable-tuning earphone from England-based Rock Jaw
> ...


 
  
 The IEM ranking has been updated here.


----------



## Dobrescu George

this one seems like it would be a contender to k3003, the unique melody 3x... how does it compare?...


----------



## ljokerl

dobrescu george said:


> this one seems like it would be a contender to k3003, the unique melody 3x... how does it compare?...


 
  
 It's a little too v-shaped IMO. Makes even the DUNU DN-1000 sound balanced in comparison.


----------



## MuzicLife

Hey Joker, do you mind reviewing the ATH-IM50 and the IM70? Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

muziclife said:


> Hey Joker, do you mind reviewing the ATH-IM50 and the IM70? Thanks!


 
  
 Wish it was that easy but I don't have either earphone nor spare time. I stopped updating the review queue on the front page of this thread because I don't think anyone really looks at it, but there are so many new and interesting earphones on the market every week that it's impossible to keep up.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Wish it was that easy but I don't have either earphone nor spare time. I stopped updating the review queue on the front page of this thread because I don't think anyone really looks at it, but there are so many new and interesting earphones on the market every week that it's impossible to keep up.


 

  We totally understand. there are new earphone every week, and its not always possible to give them time.


----------



## MuzicLife

ljokerl said:


> Wish it was that easy but I don't have either earphone nor spare time. I stopped updating the review queue on the front page of this thread because I don't think anyone really looks at it, but there are so many new and interesting earphones on the market every week that it's impossible to keep up.


 
 Ahh, my apologies! I understand.


----------



## sid12345678910

Hey ljokerl 

  

 (This is coming from an Future Sonic Atrio Owner)
 I just listened to both the Dunu DN-1K and Dn-2k and I hated them mainly because they sounded super harsh and painful (too much treble) at my listing level although the midrange was all right, it was too recessed on both of them IMO, Bass was great on both but I did prefer the 1K over the 2k in terms of bass presence.

 I tired many more and yet didn’t like them at all (SE535, K3003, UE900, FX800, Fidelio S2, IE800)

 But luckily I did enjoy a few (Unique Melody Merlin, XBA 4, XBA 3, XBA H3 and the new XBA A3) but all of them have waaay to much mid-bass (Except the UM they are just too expensive and have a bit too much treble for me)

 I am mainly looking for IEM’s that sound similar to my Philips Fidelio X1’s
 Anything you can recommend?


----------



## encoreAC

Sony MH1 jk ;D


----------



## suman134

sid12345678910 said:


> Hey ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  I am not a huge expert like joker, but i can suggest rha-ma750, which has bass, not much mid bass ( for me xba-3 has controlled bass and dont have much mid bass too), or you should try single BAs if you can do with lesser bass , like FAD heaven 2.


----------



## Gandasaputra

sid12345678910 said:


> Hey ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 You say Dunu DN-2000 super harsh and XBA-3 is not? That's contradictory. From treble-sensitive listener like myself, the Dunu is bright but don't have that upper high harshness, metallic tinge, nor tooth-aching sibilance of the XBA-3, which I thought the worst IEM I've had. Maybe the Dunu can be harsh when cranked the volume all way up but it's pleasant at lower volume, while the XBA-3 is already disturbing when played at low volume so you might rather just not listen to it. Oh, I've got the DN-2000 and darn, I find these earphones has no weakness, in my opinion. The only thing that matters is the weight of the earphones, which is comparable to V-Moda's vibrato. I can't wait to hear Joker's full impression bout it


----------



## adrift02

Hey ljokerl,

Curious if you could provide an upgrade recommendation based on the info below:
-I'm coming from the RE-400. I love the sound signature: the balanced sig with slightly warm/forward mids, very detailed highs with no sibilance (sibilance is a deal breaker). The lack of low end was my only gripe, but it wasn't a big deal and I could boost it as needed with my X11.
-I tried the IE80 and am sending it back. The soundstage was impressive. The highs were very detailed and not too harsh with the right tips (they were too harsh/sibilant with stock tips). The bass was fine, maybe too pronounced but ok. I would have kept them if not for -- the mid range wasn't there for me. I'm not sure if they fall into v-shaped category, but the mids just felt too recessed coming from the RE-400. I tried to love them, but couldn't get over the mids.
-I currently have the RE-600. It immediately sounded good to me coming from the RE-400, but have a couple issues. First, the highs aren't as detailed. It's not a deal breaker but compared to both the 400 and IE80 it's a bit disappointing. The mids are fantastic. Same pronounced vocals I love, fuller than the 400 with slightly better soundstage. Low end is fine, though honestly the 400 once again is slightly better in sub bass (I think...sounds slightly tighter maybe, though obviously less overall). Dont get me wrong, I like the 600s (better than the 400s overall), but for $100 more I didn't expect as much of a trade off.

So, any suggestions? I obviously don't need a ton of bass, don't like a v-shaped sig (if anything prefer forward mids), and can't stand sibilance. I was thinking the DN-2000's may be a fit, but based on your feedback earlier regarding the highs being slightly harsh/sibilant at times I stayed away.

Thanks! By the way -- price range max at ~$350


----------



## ljokerl

sid12345678910 said:


> Hey ljokerl
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Not having tried the Fidelio X1 and not hating any of the sets you hated, I'm not sure I can be of any help. I'm trying to think of smooth/non-bright earphones that have enhanced sub-bass but not mid-bass and I'm coming up short. EarSonics SM64 is probably the closest, but it's not exactly a bass monster.
  


gandasaputra said:


> You say Dunu DN-2000 super harsh and XBA-3 is not? That's contradictory. From treble-sensitive listener like myself, the Dunu is bright but don't have that upper high harshness, metallic tinge, nor tooth-aching sibilance of the XBA-3, which I thought the worst IEM I've had. Maybe the Dunu can be harsh when cranked the volume all way up but it's pleasant at lower volume, while the XBA-3 is already disturbing when played at low volume so you might rather just not listen to it. Oh, I've got the DN-2000 and darn, I find these earphones has no weakness, in my opinion. The only thing that matters is the weight of the earphones, which is comparable to V-Moda's vibrato. I can't wait to hear Joker's full impression bout it


 
  
 Never liked the XBA-3 but the DN-2000 is excellent for what it is, minus the size/weight. 
  


adrift02 said:


> Hey ljokerl,
> 
> Curious if you could provide an upgrade recommendation based on the info below:
> -I'm coming from the RE-400. I love the sound signature: the balanced sig with slightly warm/forward mids, very detailed highs with no sibilance (sibilance is a deal breaker). The lack of low end was my only gripe, but it wasn't a big deal and I could boost it as needed with my X11.
> ...


 
  
 DN-2000 is a little v/u-shaped, probably not a great fit for you.
  
 Minus the bass, which is no more powerful than with the RE-400/RE-600, you'd really like the old RE272 that HiFiMan discontinued. 
  
 The RE-600 is something I don't usually recommend as it's just not enough of an upgrade over the RE-400. With that said, however, they are both top-tier earphones, so finding an upgrade from them both will be tough.
  
 Someone recently asked a similar comment but emphasizing bass as far as RE-400 upgrades go. I ended up recommending the TDK BA200, StageDiver SD-2, and Custom Art Music one: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/hifiman-re-400-waterline/#comment-52516 . I still think they might be good options here - you get the balance, you get a bit more bass, and you get smooth, refined treble as well. Maybe not better than the RE-400 in treble refinement, but again it's tough to find an all-around upgrade to the HiFiMan without giving something up.


----------



## ozkan

adrift02 said:


> Hey ljokerl,
> 
> Curious if you could provide an upgrade recommendation based on the info below:
> -I'm coming from the RE-400. I love the sound signature: the balanced sig with slightly warm/forward mids, very detailed highs with no sibilance (sibilance is a deal breaker). The lack of low end was my only gripe, but it wasn't a big deal and I could boost it as needed with my X11.
> ...




If you prefer forward and detailed mids with a good amount of thickness you should try IM70 which I love for its vocal presentation too. I find it as an upgrade to RE400 overall.


----------



## sid12345678910

gandasaputra said:


> You say Dunu DN-2000 super harsh and XBA-3 is not? That's contradictory. From treble-sensitive listener like myself, the Dunu is bright but don't have that upper high harshness, metallic tinge, nor tooth-aching sibilance of the XBA-3, which I thought the worst IEM I've had. Maybe the Dunu can be harsh when cranked the volume all way up but it's pleasant at lower volume, while the XBA-3 is already disturbing when played at low volume so you might rather just not listen to it. Oh, I've got the DN-2000 and darn, I find these earphones has no weakness, in my opinion. The only thing that matters is the weight of the earphones, which is comparable to V-Moda's vibrato. I can't wait to hear Joker's full impression bout it :etysmile:




I know this I looked at the fr chart for both Iems, Still strangely I found all the sony Iems just better 

I did try the xba 4 and heard a bad metallic sounding treble (I think there's too much emphasis on the 16k region ) this is why I prefer the xba 3 over the xba 4 as the xba 3 didn't have this trait

It seems I prefer a sound singintuer that has deep bass with good amount of presence and a small amount of midbass with a flat midrange and darkish treble or a neutral one

"hmmm mediate on this I will"-yoda


----------



## howdy

@joker, what are your thoughts for the RE600, is there a big enough difference to warrant the 100 price from the RE400? I'm really looking at getting the RE600. I have the GR07be and a few people here think the RE600 is an upgrade from the 07be. I would be using them strictly for my DX90.


----------



## getclikinagas

howdy said:


> @joker, what are your thoughts for the RE600, is there a big enough difference to warrant the 100 price from the RE400? I'm really looking at getting the RE600. I have the GR07be and a few people here think the RE600 is an upgrade from the 07be. I would be using them strictly for my DX90.


 
 Howdy howdy!
  

*Take a look at ljokerl's review of the RE400 and RE600 where he compares the two.*
 http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors-page-2
  

*Regarding sound rating difference between the two:*
 http://theheadphonelist.com/#comment-32761


> A sidegrade more or less, depending on what exactly you’re looking for. I thought the RE-600 performed quite similarly to the RE-400 so I wouldn’t rate them more than 0.1-0.2 apart. See review here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors-page-2


 
  

*Considering the price drop to 199$*
 http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/hifiman-re-400-waterline/#comment-52516


> I just don’t think it’s that different from the RE-400. $199 is a decent price but the performance gap is not very big. Combine that with a sound signature that’s also quite similar to the RE-400 and you’ll just not see as much of a change either way as with the others. See here for sound comparison: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/hifiman-re-400-waterline-and-re-600-songbird-dynamic-ear-monitors-page-2


 
  

*For people who already own the RE400:*
 http://theheadphonelist.com/deal-alert-hifiman-re-400-free-shipping-head-direct-com/#comment-39055


> If you didn’t already have the RE-400, I would be tempted to recommend the RE-600 at that price. However, as an upgrade to an RE-400 you already have, it just doesn’t make that much sense. It’s a good signature for your taste, just not majorly different from the RE-400 (see my InnerFidelity review of both for a comparison).


 
  
 Follow the links to understand the context of the question (if required)


----------



## proedros

howdy said:


> @joker, what are your thoughts for the RE600, is there a big enough difference to warrant the 100 price from the RE400? I'm really looking at getting the RE600. I have the GR07be and a few people here think the RE600 is an upgrade from the 07be. *I would be using them strictly for my DX90.*


 
  
 the dx90 makes a very nice pair with the RE-600 , it is my combo as well. you will dig it.


----------



## proedros

.


----------



## howdy

getclikinagas said:


> Howdy howdy!
> 
> 
> *Take a look at ljokerl's review of the RE400 and RE600 where he compares the two.*
> ...



Thanks for all of the insight. I think I will actually just stick with my Vsonic as it seems like they are similar.


----------



## ljokerl

^ That's more thorough than I could be


----------



## proedros

joker,
  
 looks like someone likes your opinion quite a lot....
  
*http://www.best-in-ear-headphones.net/akg-k3003-k3003i-review/*


----------



## billybob_jcv

Just in case you want to try to file a complaint:

Domain Name: BEST-IN-EAR-HEADPHONES.NET
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URL of the ICANN WHOIS Data Problem Reporting System:
http://wdprs.internic.net/


----------



## MoonYeol

proedros said:


> joker,
> 
> looks like someone likes your opinion quite a lot....
> 
> *http://www.best-in-ear-headphones.net/akg-k3003-k3003i-review/*




That's rewritten in less than adequate English right? I don't think it's as much of an infringement as it's just plain tasteless. Just had a quick peek at it and I've read maybe 100-150 of the reviews here but didn't quite recognize the language use.


----------



## ljokerl

proedros said:


> joker,
> 
> looks like someone likes your opinion quite a lot....
> 
> *http://www.best-in-ear-headphones.net/akg-k3003-k3003i-review/*


 
  
 Thanks, seen that site before. I think what they do is run my review through an automated translator to another language and then back to English. This changes the wording and grammar to some lower form of the language, but it preserves the gist of it (and apparently the SEO potential). It's also not technically a copy of my content but rather a paraphrase, which makes copyright more hazy.
  
 They make money off people stumbling on the site via search and clicking the Amazon affiliate link at the bottom. 

 Pretty smart, actually.
  


billybob_jcv said:


> Just in case you want to try to file a complaint:


 
  
 Thanks. Figures that it's overseas - much harder to get to. I have an idea for getting rid of it but for now let's just not give them any traffic 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


moonyeol said:


> That's rewritten in less than adequate English right? I don't think it's as much of an infringement as it's just plain tasteless. Just had a quick peek at it and I've read maybe 100-150 of the reviews here but didn't quite recognize the language use.


 
  
 See above for how I think it's done. Probably falls into a gray area where it won't be automatically considered infringement.


----------



## blast0id

I need some help... I originally bought brainwavz b2's and they were great until one ear failed, so I got an RMA and sent them off for warranty, well I couldn't stand generics for very long so I ordered some rha ma-750s and and those were great until the cords (above the Y started to come apart and bare wires were exposed (I work with some solvents and other chemicals that this particular cord did not like one bit), I stopped wearing them so as not to do any permanent damage, so my question is, who or where can I send these things to be serviced, I asked RHA but because I didn't purchase from authorized retailer, they aren't covered under warranty (I knew that when I purchased them) but they also won't allow me to even pay them to rewire them, so I need someone who can rewire them for me... they (RHA) also wouldn't give me a referral, is there such a person/place that can/will rewire my RHA MA750s? if so, who?


----------



## howdy

blast0id said:


> I need some help... I originally bought brainwavz b2's and they were great until one ear failed, so I got an RMA and sent them off for warranty, well I couldn't stand generics for very long so I ordered some rha ma-750s and and those were great until the cords (above the Y started to come apart and bare wires were exposed (I work with some solvents and other chemicals that this particular cord did not like one bit), I stopped wearing them so as not to do any permanent damage, so my question is, who or where can I send these things to be serviced, I asked RHA but because I didn't purchase from authorized retailer, they aren't covered under warranty (I knew that when I purchased them) but they also won't allow me to even pay them to rewire them, so I need someone who can rewire them for me... they (RHA) also wouldn't give me a referral, is there such a person/place that can/will rewire my RHA MA750s? if so, who?


 

 Looks like you need to invest in some IEMs where the cable is replaceable.


----------



## blast0id

howdy said:


> Looks like you need to invest in some IEMs where the cable is replaceable.


 
 yarp!


----------



## adrift02

ljokerl said:


> DN-2000 is a little v/u-shaped, probably not a great fit for you.
> 
> Minus the bass, which is no more powerful than with the RE-400/RE-600, you'd really like the old RE272 that HiFiMan discontinued.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks for recommendations! Since the SD-2 and Music One both seem to be more $300, I'm looking closely at the BA200. My concern there is the treble spike and claims of sibilance. I'm pretty sensitive to it and wondering if it's worse than average. I don't expect something as forgiving as the RE-400, and can probably mitigate a small amount with different tips, but if it's pronounced I might just stick with the RE-600.


ozkan said:


> If you prefer forward and detailed mids with a good amount of thickness you should try IM70 which I love for its vocal presentation too. I find it as an upgrade to RE400 overall.


 
 This sounds like another good option. Can you share a bit more detail comparing them directly to the RE-400? If that's already been done somewhere I'd be happy to jump to the link.


----------



## ljokerl

blast0id said:


> I need some help... I originally bought brainwavz b2's and they were great until one ear failed, so I got an RMA and sent them off for warranty, well I couldn't stand generics for very long so I ordered some rha ma-750s and and those were great until the cords (above the Y started to come apart and bare wires were exposed (I work with some solvents and other chemicals that this particular cord did not like one bit), I stopped wearing them so as not to do any permanent damage, so my question is, who or where can I send these things to be serviced, I asked RHA but because I didn't purchase from authorized retailer, they aren't covered under warranty (I knew that when I purchased them) but they also won't allow me to even pay them to rewire them, so I need someone who can rewire them for me... they (RHA) also wouldn't give me a referral, is there such a person/place that can/will rewire my RHA MA750s? if so, who?


 
  
 There was a company that did recables and even installed detachable cable sockets on IEMs but the name eludes me at the moment. Maybe someone else can remember. 
  


adrift02 said:


> Thanks for recommendations! Since the SD-2 and Music One both seem to be more $300, I'm looking closely at the BA200. My concern there is the treble spike and claims of sibilance. I'm pretty sensitive to it and wondering if it's worse than average. I don't expect something as forgiving as the RE-400, and can probably mitigate a small amount with different tips, but if it's pronounced I might just stick with the RE-600.


 
  
 I think the BA200 is better than average in that regard, just not as good as the RE-400 (which is way better than average) or Music One/SD-2 (again, way better than average)


----------



## getclikinagas

blast0id said:


> I need some help... I originally bought brainwavz b2's and they were great until one ear failed, so I got an RMA and sent them off for warranty, well I couldn't stand generics for very long so I ordered some rha ma-750s and and those were great until the cords (above the Y started to come apart and bare wires were exposed (I work with some solvents and other chemicals that this particular cord did not like one bit), I stopped wearing them so as not to do any permanent damage, so my question is, who or where can I send these things to be serviced, I asked RHA but because I didn't purchase from authorized retailer, they aren't covered under warranty (I knew that when I purchased them) but they also won't allow me to even pay them to rewire them, so I need someone who can rewire them for me... they (RHA) also wouldn't give me a referral, is there such a person/place that can/will rewire my RHA MA750s? if so, who?


 
 Welcome to Head-fi!
  
 Take a look at 
 BTG Audio : http://www.btg-audio.com/
 Vesper Audio : http://vesperaudio.com/
  
 They have a few options. So get in touch with them to determine what would be the best option in your case.
  
 Edit: BTG audio have a feedback thread on Head-fi. http://www.head-fi.org/t/587586/btg-audio/165
 Some have been reporting that the turn around time is 8 weeks at times. Just thought you should know of the thread


----------



## Shawn71

getclikinagas said:


> Welcome to Head-fi!
> 
> Take a look at
> BTG Audio : http://www.btg-audio.com/
> ...




Think vesper too might take some in transit due to RF (EU) if not for workmanship......but not like that long for sure.....but if hes from CONUS btg is best,imo.


----------



## germanturkey

joker, quick question: Hidition NT6 is a more refined, slightly more forward mid, more bass presence ATH-CK10?  I'm finally (about) ready to take the plunge.


----------



## cylpol1

Hey guys I am looking for a new iem.I am looking for the sound signature that is clear and mostly accurate with a little weight on the bottom. One of the biggest things is a wide or nice soundstage. Most of the earphones in my $150 price range are nice BAs that give a really flat signature and not as nice of a soundstage or overly treble peaky. I am open to any drive or iem that covers these criteria, and I would prefer for it to be able to worn down. My range $150. Thanks for your help. For reference I have had the ckr9 which have been great so anything similar to them would be great thanks.


----------



## blast0id

ljokerl said:


> There was a company that did recables and even installed detachable cable sockets on IEMs but the name eludes me at the moment. Maybe someone else can remember.
> 
> 
> I think the BA200 is better than average in that regard, just not as good as the RE-400 (which is way better than average) or Music One/SD-2 (again, way better than average)


 
  
  


getclikinagas said:


> Welcome to Head-fi!
> 
> Take a look at
> BTG Audio : http://www.btg-audio.com/
> ...


 
 Thanks for the info you guys! will check them out and see what's going to be the best fit. =)
  


shawn71 said:


> Think vesper too might take some in transit due to RF (EU) if not for workmanship......but not like that long for sure.....but if hes from CONUS btg is best,imo.


 
 I'm from Florida, USA... so are you saying I should go with BTG? Where exactly is Vesper located? I'm not opposed to paying a little more for quicker turn around even if that means sending it overseas...


----------



## ljokerl

Happy New Year, everyone!
  


getclikinagas said:


> Welcome to Head-fi!
> 
> Take a look at
> BTG Audio : http://www.btg-audio.com/
> ...


 
  
 BTG is what I was thinking of.
  


germanturkey said:


> joker, quick question: Hidition NT6 is a more refined, slightly more forward mid, more bass presence ATH-CK10?  I'm finally (about) ready to take the plunge.


 
  
 Refined, yes. Better bass, yes. Forward mids - not so much. The NT6 is generally not an intimate-sounding earphone. Probably can't be called laid-back, but it's not more forward than the CK10 (which has a smaller soundstage overall) in the midrange. 
  


cylpol1 said:


> Hey guys I am looking for a new iem.I am looking for the sound signature that is clear and mostly accurate with a little weight on the bottom. One of the biggest things is a wide or nice soundstage. Most of the earphones in my $150 price range are nice BAs that give a really flat signature and not as nice of a soundstage or overly treble peaky. I am open to any drive or iem that covers these criteria, and I would prefer for it to be able to worn down. My range $150. Thanks for your help. For reference I have had the ckr9 which have been great so anything similar to them would be great thanks.


 
  
 In my experience the better accurate-sounding options in that price range will fall generally into two categories - flat/flat-ish IEMs that don't have that bit of extra bass you want (e.g. Ety HF5, UE600s, VSonic VC1000, even HiFiMan RE-400s although those are a little warmer and don't have as wide a soundstage) and sets that are near-neutral with a bit of extra bass but also have some upper mid and/or treble emphasis - these are your VSonic GR07s, Philips Fidelio S2, etc. These tend to have a wider presentation but can be a little peaky. Depends on your tolerance whether you'll like them or not. I personally find the S2 quite easily tolerable, and they can be worn cable-down. There's also the Brainwavz R3, which is very smooth, but it may work better cable-up than cable-down and only has a little more bass than the RE-400. I haven't tried the CKR9, so I can't say how these compare.


----------



## james444

cylpol1 said:


> Hey guys I am looking for a new iem.I am looking for the sound signature that is clear and mostly accurate with a little weight on the bottom. One of the biggest things is a wide or nice soundstage. Most of the earphones in my $150 price range are nice BAs that give a really flat signature and not as nice of a soundstage or overly treble peaky. I am open to any drive or iem that covers these criteria, and I would prefer for it to be able to worn down. My range $150. Thanks for your help. For reference I have had the ckr9 which have been great so anything similar to them would be great thanks.


 
  
 KEF M200 will check all your boxes, but their earhanger design can be challenging for some.


----------



## 177261

Finding my Shure 535 a bit uncomfortable in longer runs are there any similar buds with same sound (albeit i am more after a natural uncolored flat sound, towards resolving, analytical) and same time being as durable they are?
  
 I have been looking at the InEar StageDiver 2 (SD-2). What is the difference between them and the Shure 535? Pos and cons.
  
 Thanks for any tips!


----------



## shultzee

christianh said:


> Finding my Shure 535 a bit uncomfortable in longer runs are there any similar buds with same sound (albeit i am more after a natural uncolored flat sound, towards resolving, analytical) and same time being as durable they are?
> 
> I have been looking at the InEar StageDiver 2 (SD-2). What is the difference between them and the Shure 535? Pos and cons.
> 
> Thanks for any tips!


 

 I had the same problem with the 535's.  Loved the sound but returned them


----------



## ljokerl

christianh said:


> Finding my Shure 535 a bit uncomfortable in longer runs are there any similar buds with same sound (albeit i am more after a natural uncolored flat sound, towards resolving, analytical) and same time being as durable they are?
> 
> I have been looking at the InEar StageDiver 2 (SD-2). What is the difference between them and the Shure 535? Pos and cons.
> 
> Thanks for any tips!


 
  
 The SD-2 is not exactly a paragon of comfort. There's a smaller version (SD-2S) but I haven't tried it. Should be more comfortable though.
  
 One of the SD-2's biggest strengths is its excellent end-to-end extension - compared to the SE535 it has a little more extension and overall presence and energy up top and the bass loses less steam down below, too. Makes it sound a little less mid-centric/focused. Don't think it has any cons vs the SE535. Maybe that it's a bit more dry and grainy, but not harsh by any means. 
  
 The TDK BA200 may also be a good alternative for a lot less $$, though it's not quite as solidly made and doesn't have detachable cables. It lacks the bass/treble reach of the SD-2 (sounds more like the SE535 in that regard) but still has more treble energy (and a little more potential for sibilance) than the Shure. Much better value, though, in my opinion.


----------



## ronnel0918

Hi ljokerl,
  
 Can you suggest a universal fit IEM (detachable cable) that is close to V6-Stage in sound signature that is below $500? I am currently on the hunt for Westone W40 but I am not sure if it's to my liking.
  
 Thanks!


----------



## davidcotton

ronnel0918 said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> Can you suggest a universal fit IEM (detachable cable) that is close to V6-Stage in sound signature that is below $500? I am currently on the hunt for Westone W40 but I am not sure if it's to my liking.
> 
> Thanks!


 

 Might have to save a little more but 1964 ears do a universal version of their models.  You'll have to email and ask them.


----------



## ronnel0918

davidcotton said:


> Might have to save a little more but 1964 ears do a universal version of their models.  You'll have to email and ask them.


 
 Yes, I did email them and they gave me a $25 discount for the universal version of V6-Stage.
  
 I actually planned to get the ADEL U6 from their Kickstarter program but at that time I don't have the money to buy it. Actually until now, just looking for alternatives.
  
 So far these are my options. Planning to get one in e-earphone.jp as it is cheaper:
  
 - ATH-IM03 (26,200 yen -- around US$218)
 - FX850 (26,670 yen -- around US$222)
 - FX1100 (46,570 yen -- around US$387)
 - Westone W30 (34,200 yen -- around US$284)
 - Westone W40 (44,350 yen for brand new, 31,700 yen for used -- around US$369 for brand new, around US$264 for used)
 - SE535LTD-J (46,210 yen -- around US$384)
  
 They actually fall below US$400. I think it is more feasible for me compared with below US$500.
  
 Fit is also one of the things I consider since I have small ears. I also thought of ATH-IM70 since it is much cheaper (10,670 yen -- around US$89) but according to some the housing is too big. I haven't tried one yet, though.
  
  
_*Edit:*_
  
 Personally, I like to get that used Westone W40 for US$264. It's really a good deal if you'd ask me. Got to have to check the overall package though for any inconsistencies/defects. I am just waiting for people's feedbacks and impressions. Maybe they have something to say.


----------



## Levanter

@ljokerI
  
 Any idea when we'll see the full review with updated rankings for the 1964 A12?


----------



## ljokerl

ronnel0918 said:


> Hi ljokerl,
> 
> Can you suggest a universal fit IEM (detachable cable) that is close to V6-Stage in sound signature that is below $500? I am currently on the hunt for Westone W40 but I am not sure if it's to my liking.
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 No, the W40 is too dark and has too much mid-bass to be a V6-Stage alternative. A good TWFK-based set like the VSonic VC1000 will be a better match for the V6-Stage tuning. If you want detachable cables, the UE900 is a better option, though one that's not necessarily comfortable in smaller ears. Or the Sony MDR-EX1000 or EX600. 
  
 I haven't tried the IM03, FX850, or FX1100.
  
  


levanter said:


> @ljokerI
> 
> Any idea when we'll see the full review with updated rankings for the 1964 A12?


 
  
 Don't have new ADEL modules yet so probably not for a while. I really want the tuning of the modules to be finalized before even starting work on a full review - otherwise it'll be a mess.


----------



## kloner

Hi joker, what do you think about upgrading piston 2 to shure se425?


----------



## james444

Quote:


ronnel0918 said:


> Yes, I did email them and they gave me a $25 discount for the universal version of V6-Stage.
> 
> I actually planned to get the ADEL U6 from their Kickstarter program but at that time I don't have the money to buy it. Actually until now, just looking for alternatives.
> 
> ...


 


ljokerl said:


> No, the W40 is too dark and has too much mid-bass to be a V6-Stage alternative. A good TWFK-based set like the VSonic VC1000 will be a better match for the V6-Stage tuning. If you want detachable cables, the UE900 is a better option, though one that's not necessarily comfortable in smaller ears. Or the Sony MDR-EX1000 or EX600.
> 
> I haven't tried the IM03, FX850, or FX1100.


 
  
 Haven't heard the V6-Stage. But based on Joker's description and comparisons, I'd say scratch the JVCs from the list unless you plan to use EQ or do the mod. Both the FX850 and FX1100 have terrific potential, but are tuned decidedly too bassy for your requirements in stock form.
  
 Also, they're pretty large, so small ears might pose a problem.


----------



## ronnel0918

ljokerl said:


> No, the W40 is too dark and has too much mid-bass to be a V6-Stage alternative. A good TWFK-based set like the VSonic VC1000 will be a better match for the V6-Stage tuning. If you want detachable cables, the UE900 is a better option, though one that's not necessarily comfortable in smaller ears. Or the Sony MDR-EX1000 or EX600.
> 
> I haven't tried the IM03, FX850, or FX1100.
> 
> -snipped-


 
  


james444 said:


> Quote:
> 
> Haven't heard the V6-Stage. But based on Joker's description and comparisons, I'd say scratch the JVCs from the list unless you plan to use EQ or do the mod. Both the FX850 and FX1100 have terrific potential, but are tuned decidedly too bassy for your requirements in stock form.
> 
> Also, they're pretty large, so small ears might pose a problem.


 
  
 Thanks ljokerl and james444! I also like to include the Noble K10 as a reference since I have heard good praises for this one. jelt2359 also says the W40 is the one closest to K10 so I guess I am off to Westone W40, for now.
  
 Will surely NOT include the JVCs since almost everyone says to cross that off on my list.


----------



## proedros

ronnel0918 said:


> * jelt2359 also says the W40 is the one closest to K10*


 
  
  
 and i am superman 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 w40 must be wasted money , but hype is a biatch


----------



## Gandasaputra

After comparing W4 with the DN-2000 quite a while, I noted that the W4 had more mid-bass than the DN-2000, and more sweeter, of course. Am I right?


----------



## ronnel0918

proedros said:


> and i am superman
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hahaha! I know, I know. Don't worry, I am taking the reviews/impressions/feedbacks with a pinchful of salt. Just waiting for others to chime in. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 
  
 Actually Spyro, on the other hand, recommends Westone W30 over W40 (of course he has his reason. Please don't shoot me.). How's that working for me?


----------



## Dobrescu George

my sennheiser ie8 is out... right driver does not work anymore, only slight sound coming from it... it is not the cable but the driver... i am going to buy some new iem soon.. 
 i am still set on buying akg k3003.. i have only seen 2 other options that could ever come close, but i have a pretty hard time fiinding comparations, and making anything out of them... it would be k10 universal, and roxanne universal. i am pretty sure that k3003 is a better option for me though..


----------



## Mr-Mike

davidcotton said:


> Might have to save a little more but 1964 ears do a universal version of their models.  You'll have to email and ask them.


 

 If I may slip a question here as I am new. David's statement above is like a revelation to me. I didn't think of taking a high-end custom and 'downgrading' them (so to speak) to a universal style. What a great idea for my needs. I posted a "Shortlist" question hoping for some guidance in another forum (no need to trouble yourselves), but again, a universal 1964 V6 Stage has instant appeal to me and with the flexibility, I could always pass them along if they're not for me.
  
 Can I ask, aside from fit and perhaps isolation, would any of the sound qualities be sacrificed by such a 'modification'? Alternative recommendations welcome of course.
  
 Of course I will give them a call but I would love to get some input from this gang of hardcore purists.
  
 Thank you!
  
 Mike


----------



## blast0id

mr-mike said:


> If I may slip a question here as I am new. David's statement above is like a revelation to me. I didn't think of taking a high-end custom and 'downgrading' them (so to speak) to a universal style. What a great idea for my needs. I posted a "Shortlist" question hoping for some guidance in another forum (no need to trouble yourselves), but again, a universal 1964 V6 Stage has instant appeal to me and with the flexibility, I could always pass them along if they're not for me.
> 
> Can I ask, aside from fit and perhaps isolation, would any of the sound qualities be sacrificed by such a 'modification'? Alternative recommendations welcome of course.
> 
> ...


 
 I'm not expert here, but I would think doing so, without great research into housing design, would be akin to taking a Ferrari engine and putting it into a Passat... you're going to lose everything else that makes that Ferrari a Ferrari...


----------



## james444

mr-mike said:


> If I may slip a question here as I am new. David's statement above is like a revelation to me. I didn't think of taking a high-end custom and 'downgrading' them (so to speak) to a universal style. What a great idea for my needs. I posted a "Shortlist" question hoping for some guidance in another forum (no need to trouble yourselves), but again, a universal 1964 V6 Stage has instant appeal to me and with the flexibility, I could always pass them along if they're not for me.
> 
> Can I ask, aside from fit and perhaps isolation, would any of the sound qualities be sacrificed by such a 'modification'? Alternative recommendations welcome of course.
> 
> ...


 


blast0id said:


> I'm not expert here, but I would think doing so, without great research into housing design, would be akin to taking a Ferrari engine and putting it into a Passat... you're going to lose everything else that makes that Ferrari a Ferrari...


 
  
 I'd say it depends on how it's done. Many manufacturers have universal demo-units of their customs, and from my own experience plus what I've been gathering from others, some of them sound very close to the full-custom version.
  
 I personally own a custom and universal version of the UERM, which sound and measure very similar to each other.


----------



## SilverEars

> *(1A7) Hidition NT 6*
> 
> Sound *(9.9/10)* – Hidition’s lineup is notable for having not one but two six-driver flagships – the NT 6, which features a 4-way passive crossover, and the NT 6-PRO, which adds another crossover point for a 5-way setup. The PRO model promises enhanced bass, while the vanilla NT 6 is said to be more neutral.
> 
> ...


 
 I haven't read your review on the NT-6 until now, and I pretty much agree with what is said after owning them for awhile.  You seem to describe it like it is.  I think this is the second time agreeing with your review after the CK-10.  This thread is probably the most reliable source of info on iems.
  
 I think you may have listened to V1.  From what you describe I can imagine the V1's FR. I do have the V2 though, so it's more relaxed in treble and in the sub bass.


----------



## ljokerl

kloner said:


> Hi joker, what do you think about upgrading piston 2 to shure se425?


 
  
 Well, it will be an upgrade but the Piston is warm and bassy (and v-shaped) whereas the SE425 (last I heard it... which was a while ago) is pretty balanced. The Shures will give you a much more clear and accurate sound but they just haven't got much in common with the Piston 2.
  


james444 said:


> Quote:
> 
> Haven't heard the V6-Stage. But based on Joker's description and comparisons, I'd say scratch the JVCs from the list unless you plan to use EQ or do the mod. Both the FX850 and FX1100 have terrific potential, but are tuned decidedly too bassy for your requirements in stock form.
> 
> Also, they're pretty large, so small ears might pose a problem.


 
  
 This also makes sense based on my experience with the FX700.
  


mr-mike said:


> If I may slip a question here as I am new. David's statement above is like a revelation to me. I didn't think of taking a high-end custom and 'downgrading' them (so to speak) to a universal style. What a great idea for my needs. I posted a "Shortlist" question hoping for some guidance in another forum (no need to trouble yourselves), but again, a universal 1964 V6 Stage has instant appeal to me and with the flexibility, I could always pass them along if they're not for me.
> 
> Can I ask, aside from fit and perhaps isolation, would any of the sound qualities be sacrificed by such a 'modification'? Alternative recommendations welcome of course.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I haven't had a chance to try both the universal and custom version of the same IEM as james has, but I would imagine that any differences present with the 1964s would not be night-and-day. I've tried some awful universal demos and I've tried some great ones, so it really comes down to who's making them, and based off what. Considering it's the same manufacturer making the universal version in this case, there's a good chance they're competitive. Maybe instead of Ferrari vs Passat with Ferrari engine, it's more like Ferrari vs Ferrari with the ergonomics, suspension, and gear ratios set up just for you (for better or worse). 
  


silverears said:


> I haven't read your review on the NT-6 until now, and I pretty much agree with what is said after owning them for awhile.  You seem to describe it like it is.  I think this is the second time agreeing with your review after the CK-10.  This thread is probably the most reliable source of info on iems.
> 
> I think you may have listened to V1.  From what you describe I can imagine the V1's FR. I do have the V2 though, so it's more relaxed in treble and in the sub bass.


 
  
 Thanks!
  
I think I had my pair for maybe 3-4 months prior to the review first being posted in May of 2013. So they're probably a January-February 2013 revision, whichever that would be.


----------



## PaperMatter

Hey guys! Hoping you guys could help me find an iem that relates to the HD558 in terms of sound signature. I know an iem within this price range (~100usd) won't have no where near the same level of soundstage so hoping for more just an overall companion to the HD558. Thanks.


----------



## encoreAC

papermatter said:


> Hey guys! Hoping you guys could help me find an iem that relates to the HD558 in terms of sound signature. I know an iem within this price range (~100usd) won't have no where near the same level of soundstage so hoping for more just an overall companion to the HD558. Thanks.


 
 My first guess would be the Shure se215.


----------



## PaperMatter

encoreac said:


> My first guess would be the Shure se215.



Really? I owned the se215s and I felt that they were way too dark. The mids and build quality were the only thing I liked about them. I was hoping for a more neutral with a hint of warmth for this iem.


----------



## encoreAC

papermatter said:


> Really? I owned the se215s and I felt that they were way too dark. The mids and build quality were the only thing I liked about them. I was hoping for a more neutral with a hint of warmth for this iem.


 
 Zero Audio Tenore would be perfect then.
  
 Did you have a good seal with the se215? The Shure should have a pretty impactfull bass although enhanced by quite a bit. Mids can appear to be veiled.
  
 The Tenore are more neutral sounding with good sub-bass, clear mids and tamed highs.


----------



## blast0id

ljokerl said:


> Maybe instead of Ferrari vs Passat with Ferrari engine, it's more like Ferrari vs Ferrari with the ergonomics, suspension, and gear ratios set up just for you (for better or worse).


 
 Yeah, I'm def. no expert, but that's probably a better analogy, with the caveat that the universal is made by the same brand as the custom...


----------



## PaperMatter

encoreac said:


> Zero Audio Tenore would be perfect then.
> 
> Did you have a good seal with the se215? The Shure should have a pretty impactfull bass although enhanced by quite a bit. Mids can appear to be veiled.
> 
> The Tenore are more neutral sounding with good sub-bass, clear mids and tamed highs.


 
 The Tenore seems like an awesome choice but the only thing holding me back, after a couple minutes of research, is the QC issues.  Is the build that bad? I tend to be a little reckless with my iems unfortunately.


----------



## encoreAC

papermatter said:


> The Tenore seems like an awesome choice but the only thing holding me back, after a couple minutes of research, is the QC issues.  Is the build that bad? I tend to be a little reckless with my iems unfortunately.


 
  
 It's been long since anyone reported issues with them and I think it only happens only rarely nowadays. I can't even remember the last time somebody had issues. The cables are looking very fragile, but I treat my pair like dirt since almost a year and they are still going strong. Great mobility, they are tiny and isolate well.
  
 They are actually my most used phone right now. They really needed some time to open-up though.


----------



## PaperMatter

encoreac said:


> It's been long since anyone reported issues with them and I think it only happens only rarely nowadays. I can't even remember the last time somebody had issues. The cables are looking very fragile, but I treat my pair like dirt since almost a year and they are still going strong. Great mobility, they are tiny and isolate well.
> 
> They are actually my most used phone right now. They really needed some time to open-up though.


 
 That was really my only concern.  Thanks for the help friend. Ill be purchasing them tomorrow.


----------



## encoreAC

papermatter said:


> That was really my only concern.  Thanks for the help friend. Ill be purchasing them tomorrow.


 
  
 Good luck! They are amazing.


----------



## james444

papermatter said:


> The Tenore seems like an awesome choice but the only thing holding me back, after a couple minutes of research, is the QC issues.  Is the build that bad? I tend to be a little reckless with my iems unfortunately.


 


james444 said:


> AFAIK there are three possible issues:
> 
> - FR anomalies (most frequently: too much bass): due to variations in the driver's back vent damping. Major issue, needs invasive mod to fix.
> - Cable sheath coming off at the strain relief: minor issue (imo, since cable itself isn't affected). Simply glue the sheath back on.
> - TTS (sudden volume drop in one or both channels): likely due to moisture condensation. Replace the filter mesh with a small piece of cotton wool.


 
  
 The Tenores are awesome IEMs for the price and the issues #2 and #3 can easily be dealt with. #1 should be apparent out-of-box if it happens, though I'm not sure whether it would be covered by warranty.
  
 I believe most of those who bought the Tenores have been happy with them. One guy even sold his K3003 after he got his Tenores (you know who you are . Apart from the strain relief issue, build quality is ime pretty good. But there are undoubtedly certain risks involved and it's up to you to decide whether you want to take them.


----------



## encoreAC

james444 said:


> The Tenores are awesome IEMs for the price and the issues #2 and #3 can easily be dealt with. #1 should be apparent out-of-box if it happens, though I'm not sure whether it would be covered by warranty.
> 
> I believe most of those who bought the Tenores have been happy with them. One guy even sold his K3003 after he got his Tenores (you know who you are . Apart from the strain relief issue, build quality is ime pretty good. But there are undoubtedly certain risks involved and it's up to you to decide whether you want to take them.


 
  
 it's been long since the last time people got faulty pairs afaik and there were zero reports of these faults on reddit when there was a hype-train there a few months ago. Most reports on flawed pairs were on headfi more than 1 year ago.
  
 Maybe ZA sorted it out?


----------



## james444

encoreac said:


> it's been long since the last time people got faulty pairs afaik and there were zero reports of these faults on reddit when there was a hype-train there a few months ago. Most reports on flawed pairs were on headfi more than 1 year ago.
> 
> Maybe ZA sorted it out?


 
  
 "Maybe" isn't the best concept to base recommendations on.


----------



## 177261

ljokerl said:


> The SD-2 is not exactly a paragon of comfort. There's a smaller version (SD-2S) but I haven't tried it. Should be more comfortable though.
> 
> One of the SD-2's biggest strengths is its excellent end-to-end extension - compared to the SE535 it has a little more extension and overall presence and energy up top and the bass loses less steam down below, too. Makes it sound a little less mid-centric/focused. Don't think it has any cons vs the SE535. Maybe that it's a bit more dry and grainy, but not harsh by any means.
> 
> The TDK BA200 may also be a good alternative for a lot less $$, though it's not quite as solidly made and doesn't have detachable cables. It lacks the bass/treble reach of the SD-2 (sounds more like the SE535 in that regard) but still has more treble energy (and a little more potential for sibilance) than the Shure. Much better value, though, in my opinion.


 
 Thanks ljokerl!
  
 You're always at helping hand!


----------



## Mr-Mike

ljokerl said:


> I haven't had a chance to try both the universal and custom version of the same IEM as james has, but I would imagine that any differences present with the 1964s would not be night-and-day. I've tried some awful universal demos and I've tried some great ones, so it really comes down to who's making them, and based off what. Considering it's the same manufacturer making the universal version in this case, there's a good chance they're competitive. Maybe instead of Ferrari vs Passat with Ferrari engine, it's more like Ferrari vs Ferrari with the ergonomics, suspension, and gear ratios set up just for you (for better or worse).


 
  
 blastoid, james, joker – thanks for taking the time and providing input, very much appreciated!
  
 blastoid: I shared this sentiment thinking that the sound tube (or channel) shape and length logically play an important role in producing the final sound result. Thanks for your thought!
  
 james: awesome and interesting real-world experience, how fortunate for me! Thank you so much for sharing!
  
 joker (the man): that analogy is excellent. I am a bit of a car guy. When it comes to ‘tuning’ suspension etc, the benefits are certainly noticeable at the track especially. However, a great platform is always great. I value your opinion, thanks for chiming in!
  
 Since I don't get the feeling I am committing a blasphemy, I am going to pursue this ‘universal downgrade’ path a little further and also call JH. I can’t help but be attracted to the JH11 Pro as well…  I would go straight to their 13 or 16 models but that’s just a tad too excessive for me to justify. I have to draw a line somewhere. Assuming JH and 1964 can both make a universal version, do you think the JH11 would be worth the additional cash in universal form?
  
 I will let the group know what I find out.
  
  
 Thanks again gents!


----------



## davidcotton

mr-mike said:


> If I may slip a question here as I am new. David's statement above is like a revelation to me. I didn't think of taking a high-end custom and 'downgrading' them (so to speak) to a universal style. What a great idea for my needs. I posted a "Shortlist" question hoping for some guidance in another forum (no need to trouble yourselves), but again, a universal 1964 V6 Stage has instant appeal to me and with the flexibility, I could always pass them along if they're not for me.
> 
> Can I ask, aside from fit and perhaps isolation, would any of the sound qualities be sacrificed by such a 'modification'? Alternative recommendations welcome of course.
> 
> ...


 
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/519457/1964-ears/6375#post_11152091
  
 Those are a good shot of 1964 ears universal.


----------



## Mr-Mike

davidcotton said:


> http://www.head-fi.org/t/519457/1964-ears/6375#post_11152091
> 
> Those are a good shot of 1964 ears universal.


 

 I appreciate that David. There is so much info here it would take months to sift through. Also, because of you I am now considering the universal offerings from Noble and JH (K10, Roxanne), and that's not a good thing - lol.
  
 I gleaned that the V6-Stage is that much better than say the UE900s to justify the price, can the same be said for going from the V6-S to $1K+ variants noted above?  Thoughts greatly appreciated. I would like to get 'whatever' ordered in the next day or so.
  
 Cheers!


----------



## Mr-Mike

For the record the universal fit for the 1964 V6-Stage is May/June. The earlier releases went to the KickStarter funders. I believe something to that effect was mentioned previously. In case interested, the ADEL technology versions (10 & 12 drivers) should hit the market sooner and are customs.
  
 -Mike


----------



## Zenbun

Looking forward a review of the TTPOD T2 and comparison to other hybrids.


----------



## Mr-Mike

Gentlemen, sorry for becoming a nuisance but I would really love a some opinions as I am thoroughly impatient about getting a new IEM and timing constraints from the manufacturers has somewhat forced my selection strategy. My choice is pretty much the following unless I decide to wait.
  
 JH Roxanne @ $1300~ (can ship now)
 Nobel Nobel 6 @ $1000~ (can ship in a about a week)
  
 Which one would you choose?


----------



## Francisk

mr-mike said:


> Gentlemen, sorry for becoming a nuisance but I would really love a some opinions as I am thoroughly impatient about getting a new IEM and timing constraints from the manufacturers has somewhat forced my selection strategy. My choice is pretty much the following unless I decide to wait.
> 
> JH Roxanne @ $1300~ (can ship now)
> Nobel Nobel 6 @ $1000~ (can ship in a about a week)
> ...


 
 You should also consider the new JH Audio Angie which is priced about the same as Noble 6.


----------



## Rush-n-crush

Just bought the im70
  
 still a good choice?


----------



## ozkan

rush-n-crush said:


> Just bought the im70
> 
> still a good choice?




Congrats on your order! Yes, they are still a good choice.


----------



## Mr-Mike

francisk said:


> You should also consider the new JH Audio Angie which is priced about the same as Noble 6.


 

 Saw that but wasn't aware it was shipping any time soon, or which vendor has them


----------



## ljokerl

mr-mike said:


> I appreciate that David. There is so much info here it would take months to sift through. Also, because of you I am now considering the universal offerings from Noble and JH (K10, Roxanne), and that's not a good thing - lol.
> 
> I gleaned that the V6-Stage is that much better than say the UE900s to justify the price, can the same be said for going from the V6-S to $1K+ variants noted above?  Thoughts greatly appreciated. I would like to get 'whatever' ordered in the next day or so.
> 
> Cheers!


 
  
 IME the gap is bigger going down from the V6-Stage to a UE900 than going up to a JH13 or something. The V6-Stage only has one or two little things holding it back from being exactly on-par with the better $1k+ sets I've tried.


----------



## ericr

mr-mike said:


> For the record the universal fit for the 1964 V6-Stage is May/June. The earlier releases went to the KickStarter funders. I believe something to that effect was mentioned previously. In case interested, the ADEL technology versions (10 & 12 drivers) should hit the market sooner and are customs.
> 
> -Mike




To be a bit more accurate, it is the new U6 which is a manufactured universal (poly-carbonate shell - IIRC) with the same drivers & crossover as the V6-Stage and the ADEL technology that isn't available until May/June (after Kickstarter shipments).

You can order the V6-Stage (a hand crafted custom IEM with an acrylic shell) in universal form (AKA a demo) today. The 1964 website shows current build time as 4-8 weeks and based on recent reports it seems orders are currently being delivered closer to 4 weeks than 8. If your wallet > patience you can also pay a rush fee and take delivery in a week or so.


----------



## ericr

mr-mike said:


> ...
> JH Roxanne @ $1300~ (can ship now)
> Nobel Nobel 6 @ $1000~ (can ship in a about a week)
> 
> Which one would you choose?




FWIW, for about the last year the V6-Stage universal has been my primary headphone of choice. While I've not heard the Roxanne, last summer I had 4 days with the full Noble line-up. The K10 was excellent. Full, warmish and very easy to listen to, yet with good extension low and high and no sacrifice of detail - effortless is what comes to mind. On the other hand, I was more than pleased with how the V6-Stage held up against the K10, truly giving it a run for the money. Other than the K10, to my ears the V6-Stage clearly bested the entire Noble line-up. So much so, I would rate the K10 as first place, the V6-Stage as an easy second place, nothing in third place, the N6 in fourth, N8 fifth, and so on down the line-up.


----------



## jelt2359

ericr said:


> FWIW, for about the last year the V6-Stage universal has been my primary headphone of choice. While I've not heard the Roxanne, last summer I had 4 days with the full Noble line-up. The K10 was excellent. Full, warmish and very easy to listen to, yet with good extension low and high and no sacrifice of detail - effortless is what comes to mind. On the other hand, I was more than pleased with how the V6-Stage held up against the K10, truly giving it a run for the money. Other than the K10, to my ears the V6-Stage clearly bested the entire Noble line-up. So much so, I would rate the K10 as first place, the V6-Stage as an easy second place, nothing in third place, the N6 in fourth, N8 fifth, and so on down the line-up.




+1. For technical merits I have V6S and N6 tied; but in terms of personal preference, your rankings are quite similar to mine.


----------



## Mr-Mike

ljokerl said:


> IME the gap is bigger going down from the V6-Stage to a UE900 than going up to a JH13 or something. The V6-Stage only has one or two little things holding it back from being exactly on-par with the better $1k+ sets I've tried.


 
  
  


ericr said:


> To be a bit more accurate, it is the new U6 which is a manufactured universal (poly-carbonate shell - IIRC) with the same drivers & crossover as the V6-Stage and the ADEL technology that isn't available until May/June (after Kickstarter shipments).
> 
> You can order the V6-Stage (a hand crafted custom IEM with an acrylic shell) in universal form (AKA a demo) today. The 1964 website shows current build time as 4-8 weeks and based on recent reports it seems orders are currently being delivered closer to 4 weeks than 8. If your wallet > patience you can also pay a rush fee and take delivery in a week or so.


 
  
  


ericr said:


> FWIW, for about the last year the V6-Stage universal has been my primary headphone of choice. While I've not heard the Roxanne, last summer I had 4 days with the full Noble line-up. The K10 was excellent. Full, warmish and very easy to listen to, yet with good extension low and high and no sacrifice of detail - effortless is what comes to mind. On the other hand, I was more than pleased with how the V6-Stage held up against the K10, truly giving it a run for the money. Other than the K10, to my ears the V6-Stage clearly bested the entire Noble line-up. So much so, I would rate the K10 as first place, the V6-Stage as an easy second place, nothing in third place, the N6 in fourth, N8 fifth, and so on down the line-up.


 
  
  


jelt2359 said:


> +1. For technical merits I have V6S and N6 tied; but in terms of personal preference, your rankings are quite similar to mine.


 
  
 Gentlemen thank you all very, very much!  I feel I finally have the answer I needed/wanted. Rushing the V6-Stage seems like a no-brainer for me now. I will call them later today. The K10, though for many holding the apex slot, is just too hard to justify @ $1500 for the level of improvement over the Stage. The Roxanne @ ~1200 was a bit closer but still a leap, and with other concerns.
  
 Also,  a special thanks to the mods for allowing my queries to occupy this thread.
  
 I am stoked!  Now you guys can carry on with your regularly scheduled programming...  I will chime in if I come across anything interesting in my quest.
  
 Take care all, you guys 'rock'!! [no pun intended]
  
 -Mike


----------



## davidcotton

mr-mike said:


> Gentlemen thank you all very, very much!  I feel I finally have the answer I needed/wanted. Rushing the V6-Stage seems like a no-brainer for me now. I will call them later today. The K10, though for many holding the apex slot, is just too hard to justify @ $1500 for the level of improvement over the Stage. The Roxanne @ ~1200 was a bit closer but still a leap, and with other concerns.
> 
> Also,  a special thanks to the mods for allowing my queries to occupy this thread.
> 
> ...


 

 Heh, now you know why the standard headfi greeting is "welcome to headfi, sorry about your wallet    The only reason I have not tried 1964 Ears (universal or custom) is the fact that being uk based I would have to pay extra on top in taxes


----------



## Mr-Mike

davidcotton said:


> Heh, now you know why the standard headfi greeting is "welcome to headfi, sorry about your wallet    The only reason I have not tried 1964 Ears (universal or custom) is the fact that being uk based I would have to pay extra on top in taxes


 
  
 Right ?!!
  
 Order placed and rushed. Holy smokes, $926! In retrospect I am not so sure that I am so grateful to you folks and Head-Fi  - lol.  I should have them in just over a week. In the meantime, I am relieved I can stop reading reviews   
  
 David, if you ever need a middle-man, drop me a pm.
  
 Cheers!


----------



## davidcotton

mr-mike said:


> Right ?!!
> 
> Order placed and rushed. Holy smokes, $926! In retrospect I am not so sure that I am so grateful to you folks and Head-Fi  - lol.  I should have them in just over a week. In the meantime, I am relieved I can stop reading reviews
> 
> ...


 

 Thanks.
  
 I kind of wish that company's did a half way point between rush and normal.  Quicker maybe


----------



## Grayson73

Joker, if you get a chance, you should have a listen to something from Zero Audio.  They are masterfully tuned.  Duoza, Tenore, Doppio, Singolo, Basso (too much bass for my taste).


----------



## mdiogofs

Where from can you buy products from Zero Audio?


----------



## ljokerl

grayson73 said:


> Joker, if you get a chance, you should have a listen to something from Zero Audio.  They are masterfully tuned.  Duoza, Tenore, Doppio, Singolo, Basso (too much bass for my taste).


 
  
 I sent them an email or two back when I had some room in my schedule but it didn't work out. Maybe someday.


----------



## suman134

i have the doppio, its really nice. strictly balanced and fairly neutral.


----------



## james444

mdiogofs said:


> Where from can you buy products from Zero Audio?


 
  
 There are lot's of Amazon marketplace sellers for these:
  
 Tenore: link
 Basso: link
 Doppio: link


----------



## vwinter

james444 said:


> There are lot's of Amazon marketplace sellers for these:
> 
> Tenore: link
> Basso: link
> Doppio: link




Good prices on the Tenore right now.


----------



## mdiogofs

How much do they cost before?


----------



## vwinter

It was generally about $55 after shipping costs from more reputable sellers on amazon when I got mine (I paid $49 with prime shipping when they had it). Now it's in the high 30's with free shipping (but most or all seem to be shipping from japan so expect about ~2 weeks for delivery). That's like 30% cheaper, so what I would call good prices. In the 30-40 range is close to retail prices in japan iirc.

Cheaper than using a forwarding service atm.


----------



## Ike1985

Guys I am saving up for a pair of JH13 FP's in the near future.  It'll be my first audiophile purchase, I'm going for the best right off the bat because I don't want to buy another pair for a very long time or feel like something better is out there.  Eventually I want to get a DAP & Amp to pair with them.  I don't mind buying used in the for sale section-in fact I prefer to save a few bucks that way. 
  
 I am looking to spend a maximum of $800 on a DAP and $200 on an AMP. (AK120's can be had for $800 at times in the for sale section)
  
 Can you guys recommend a DAP/AMP combo for the JH13FP's? (Must play 24bit 192khz)
  
 Is an amp even necessary for them?


----------



## mdiogofs

^ It's your choice. But things are not that matematicaly. How do you know you like them if it's your first "audiophile" purchase? How do you know what sound signature you like best?
  
 For instance, I'm buying some under $50, $100, $150 IEMs to know exactly what I want before I jump to something more "pro" and expensive.


----------



## suman134

mdiogofs said:


> ^ It's your choice. But things are not that matematicaly. How do you know you like them if it's your first "audiophile" purchase? How do you know what sound signature you like best?
> 
> For instance, I'm buying some under $50, $100, $150 IEMs to know exactly what I want before I jump to something more "pro" and expensive.


 

  nice reply.


----------



## Ike1985

mdiogofs said:


> ^ It's your choice. But things are not that matematicaly. How do you know you like them if it's your first "audiophile" purchase? How do you know what sound signature you like best?
> 
> For instance, I'm buying some under $50, $100, $150 IEMs to know exactly what I want before I jump to something more "pro" and expensive.


 
  
 That's precisely it, I dont' want to be spending $100 here, $200 there, I'd rather just pick what is considered the best than waste money dancing around trying to figure out what I want.  I have bought some RE400's and RE0 in the past, but I don't really consider those audiophile level iems.  I previously owned an ipod that was rockboxed.  I don't consider that an audiophile purchase either. 
  
 I know that the sound signature I prefer is something along these lines: good instrument separation, big sound stage, treble slightly over bass but also enjoy a good bass-dominant metal song. Probably somewhere between a V and U shape. 
  
 Im demoing some IEMs later in the year when it's my turn (demo tour), if the JH13's had a demo tour I'd be happy to test them but I don't see how I can do that as I can't find any to demo.
  
 My only concern would be the bass, since I listen to a lot of metal and prefer treble over bass, however that's what equalizers are for.


----------



## Mr-Mike

mdiogofs said:


> ^ It's your choice. But things are not that matematicaly. How do you know you like them if it's your first "audiophile" purchase? How do you know what sound signature you like best?
> 
> For instance, I'm buying some under $50, $100, $150 IEMs to know exactly what I want before I jump to something more "pro" and expensive.


 

 Guess I am guilty of the same. There's no mystery behind the relationship between quality, engineering and price. At the higher-end, we are almost assured we will love the results and be very impressed. The added insight garnered from researching sites like this makes the outcome even more reliable.
  
 Either way, I don't see how you can compare a lesser items sound signature to that of a top shelf unit. You may not like a strong bass profile in a low-end item, but love it in a high-end variant. For me, it's research and always buy the best quality you can afford. You simply can't go wrong.
  
 At least Ike is going the extra distance and maximizing his investment, I will just be using a smartphone source - lol.


----------



## Ike1985

I am acquiring very very slowly lol, I anticipate I will have all 3 (dac/amp/iem) by mid 2016.  Plus there's always something new around the corner, I anticipate ALOT coming out in 2015, so prices for older items should go down accordingly as new models are released


----------



## Ike1985

mr-mike said:


> Guess I am guilty of the same. There's no mystery behind the relationship between quality, engineering and price. At the higher-end, we are almost assured we will love the results and be very impressed. The added insight garnered from researching sites like this makes the outcome even more reliable.
> 
> Either way, I don't see how you can compare a lesser items sound signature to that of a top shelf unit. You may not like a strong bass profile in a low-end item, but love it in a high-end variant. For me, it's research and always buy the best quality you can afford. You simply can't go wrong.
> 
> At least Ike is going the extra distance and maximizing his investment, I will just be using a smartphone source - lol.


 
  
 I do a TON of research before I buy anything, I've spent months researching iems.


----------



## mdiogofs

But my point is just that without experience one can't really understand what the reviewers and users giving impressions are saying. For instance, if I have an IEM A and a IEM B, if people are comparing other IEM C with A and B, I understand what they say much better instead if I didn't have IEM A and B. And there's some "giant killers" with cost not much and maybe sound about 75/80% than top tier IEM.

And there is the hobby thing. It's fun to somehow walk the road that other experienced headfiers have crossed 

But I get you, you just something very good and that's it, enjoying it.


----------



## garcsa

Je Suis Charlie.


----------



## HeartSongs

Well said.. Ultimately sound signature preferences are personal but what I have found is that the quality of the sound source is important. Currently, I am using the ibasso DX90 Which is really a fantastic piece of equipment. As a friend said to me when I started this journey into the audiophile world...it is an endless search for that special sound and gear and our pockets will hurt because of it but will be highly pleasurable along the way


----------



## cylpol1

Hi guys I have been looking for an iem for another person and they wanted something life the etmoytic hf5. Anything that resembles the clarity and detail with overall great resolution he would be interested in it. The sound signature doesn't matter as much as the clarity. Something that will introduce him into higher end audio would be great for a budget of 150 or under. Something that resembles a single armature earphone sound would be great but it can have any driver and would like for it to be worn down and not over the ear. Thanks guys


----------



## ljokerl

ike1985 said:


> Guys I am saving up for a pair of JH13 FP's in the near future.  It'll be my first audiophile purchase, I'm going for the best right off the bat because I don't want to buy another pair for a very long time or feel like something better is out there.  Eventually I want to get a DAP & Amp to pair with them.  I don't mind buying used in the for sale section-in fact I prefer to save a few bucks that way.
> 
> I am looking to spend a maximum of $800 on a DAP and $200 on an AMP. (AK120's can be had for $800 at times in the for sale section)
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't have much experience with modern hi-fi DAPs/Amps, but they don't need an amp when used with the one I do have (HiFiMan 901 with IEM card). I imagine other decent DAPs are similarly capable of driving them. 
  


cylpol1 said:


> Hi guys I have been looking for an iem for another person and they wanted something life the etmoytic hf5. Anything that resembles the clarity and detail with overall great resolution he would be interested in it. The sound signature doesn't matter as much as the clarity. Something that will introduce him into higher end audio would be great for a budget of 150 or under. Something that resembles a single armature earphone sound would be great but it can have any driver and would like for it to be worn down and not over the ear. Thanks guys


 
  
 Why not the HF5? It's in that price range. 
  
 The VSonic VC1000 would be an alternative. Maybe even a T-Peos H-100 if a v-shaped sound is okay.


----------



## james444

cylpol1 said:


> Hi guys I have been looking for an iem for another person and they wanted something life the etmoytic hf5. Anything that resembles the clarity and detail with overall great resolution he would be interested in it. The sound signature doesn't matter as much as the clarity. Something that will introduce him into higher end audio would be great for a budget of 150 or under. Something that resembles a single armature earphone sound would be great but it can have any driver and would like for it to be worn down and not over the ear. Thanks guys


 
  
 You just described the Dunu Titan 1. Seriously.
  
 Edit: unless they need good isolation.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the bass monster JVC Xtreme Xplosives HA-FR301
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A92) JVC Xtreme Xplosives HA-FR301*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## daveyostrow

ljokerl said:


> Added a review of the bass monster JVC Xtreme Xplosives HA-FR301
> 
> 
> The overall ranking has been updated here.




Joker, its the JVC FX3X you want to review. Bass is something else on those...


----------



## B9Scrambler

daveyostrow said:


> Joker, its the JVC FX3X you want to review. Bass is something else on those...




Yeah, I would like to see Joker cover the FX3X. I was under the impression the FR301 was just the FX1X with a mic, similar to the FX101 and FR201.


----------



## ljokerl

daveyostrow said:


> Joker, its the JVC FX3X you want to review. Bass is something else on those...


 
  
 I've had all the bass I can handle with the FR301, Beats Tour 2.0, and RHA T10i 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Speaking of JVC XX, there's a new one coming out this year, the XX Elation (couldn't find a more decent pic):


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Wow they look so shiny, I almost had to put sunglasses on.

JVC seem to love their shiny plastics.


----------



## suman134

Joker, can you compare the mdr-7550 and ex-1000 or dn-2000.


----------



## ljokerl

lifted andreas said:


> Wow they look so shiny, I almost had to put sunglasses on.
> 
> JVC seem to love their shiny plastics.


 
  
 That violet color is a higher-priced limited edition, too.
  


suman134 said:


> Joker, can you compare the mdr-7550 and ex-1000 or dn-2000.


 
  
 Easier with the EX1000 because they're so similar. The 7550 is basically the EX-1000 minus some upper mid/treble presence. It's warmer and smoother while the EX1000 is brighter and carries more treble energy. The EX1000 has a bit more intelligibility and the presentation is more airy, but of course it's more prone to harshness as well.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> Easier with the EX1000 because they're so similar. The 7550 is basically the EX-1000 minus some upper mid/treble presence. It's warmer and smoother while the EX1000 is brighter and carries more treble energy. The EX1000 has a bit more intelligibility and the presentation is more airy, but of course it's more prone to harshness as well.


 
  
    Which one has more clarity and details to it. will the 7550 get 9.2 or its really close to ex1000.


----------



## Rpg2

What a coincidence! I was about ask if the Sony 7550 review would be out soon and there just happens to be a recent comparison of it and the ex1000. This is wonderful because I'm debating between the GR07 Bass Edition or the 7550/EX800.

The 7550 seems like a great value for $200 off amazon (as the ex800) and being very similar to the more expensive ex1000 in comparison the ex600.


----------



## suman134

rpg2 said:


> What a coincidence! I was about ask if the Sony 7550 review would be out soon and there just happens to be a recent comparison of it and the ex1000. This is wonderful because I'm debating between the GR07 Bass Edition or the 7550/EX800.
> 
> The 7550 seems like a great value for $200 off amazon (as the ex800) and being very similar to the more expensive ex1000 in comparison the ex600.


 

  me too, i am looking at gr07 classic, and i wonder if 7550 worth it cuz after 30% taxes its close to $300 or so. and i hope these are equal to ex-1000 in SQ.


----------



## Rpg2

suman134 said:


> me too, i am looking at gr07 classic, and i wonder if 7550 worth it cuz after 30% taxes its close to $300 or so. and i hope these are equal to ex-1000 in SQ.




I know they are very similar after going through a lot of 7550 threads. Its as Joker said, smoother and warmer. The EX1000 definitely has more treble and slightly sibilant on some songs. Soundstage is also a bit smaller I think. It could be possible for you to save on tax by ordering EX800 off eBay. There's a chance you won't be taxed as they would he imported from Japan but I'm not sure how your situation applies. 

For me, I'm trying to decide between GR07 BE and 7550 specifically which one has the better sound stage, airyness, and more musical without being fatiguing. I'm coming from a PFE122 and am hoping for the best upgrade.


----------



## pablobaluba

What is the usual recommended upgrade from GR07 BE?
  
 I have this pair for 2 years and I simply love the sound. Everything is so detailed, bass is good, for me they are (almost) perfect. Everything sounds good on them. However, I'm wondering what IEMs would be an upgrade over these? I'm talking about a next normal step, not like 1200USD IEMs. I listen mostly to EDM, Electronic, HipHop.


----------



## Grayson73

ljokerl said:


> I sent them an email or two back when I had some room in my schedule but it didn't work out. Maybe someday.


 
  
 That's too bad.  The recently released Zero Audio Duoza is getting some serious praise.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

grayson73 said:


> That's too bad.  The recently released Zero Audio Duoza is getting some serious praise.




He should just buy some and sell them on after review. They are only £60 after all.


----------



## altrunox

Or someone could send one 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 ZA is that kind of japanese company that don't care for the rest of the world...


----------



## anduril

@ljokerl - are you interested in being dropshipped some Knowledge Zenith IEMs to be reviewed (probably ED Special Edition or ED8)? Not right now, rather when the discount comes again.


----------



## suman134

grayson73 said:


> That's too bad.  The recently released Zero Audio Duoza is getting some serious praise.


 
  
 May be hype, cant say how they are judging, not saying that they cant be that good but i some times wonder if they are considering micro details or not. You can mimic signatures and get cohesive too but getting into micro details will tell you the real story.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> Which one has more clarity and details to it. will the 7550 get 9.2 or its really close to ex1000.


 
  
 The EX1000 is still better in that regard. In clarity and detail the 7550 is similar to the TDK BA200, which has a similar signature. The BA200 may even be a touch more resolving - can't remember right now. 
  


rpg2 said:


> I know they are very similar after going through a lot of 7550 threads. Its as Joker said, smoother and warmer. The EX1000 definitely has more treble and slightly sibilant on some songs. Soundstage is also a bit smaller I think. It could be possible for you to save on tax by ordering EX800 off eBay. There's a chance you won't be taxed as they would he imported from Japan but I'm not sure how your situation applies.
> 
> For me, I'm trying to decide between GR07 BE and 7550 specifically which one has the better sound stage, airyness, and more musical without being fatiguing. I'm coming from a PFE122 and am hoping for the best upgrade.


 
  
 With low fatigue as a factor definitely the 7550. It's a lot smoother. 
  


pablobaluba said:


> What is the usual recommended upgrade from GR07 BE?
> 
> I have this pair for 2 years and I simply love the sound. Everything is so detailed, bass is good, for me they are (almost) perfect. Everything sounds good on them. However, I'm wondering what IEMs would be an upgrade over these? I'm talking about a next normal step, not like 1200USD IEMs. I listen mostly to EDM, Electronic, HipHop.


 
  
 Without specifics on what you want to see different from your GR07 and what you're willing to give up for it there really isn't one. When you get to that level straight upgrades in every way are more an exception than the rule. For example I think the DUNU DN-2000 is a little better overall, mainly due to having better bass depth/extension and soundstaging with less sibilance, but in things like clarity and bass control it's only on-par with the GR07/GR07BE and not an improvement. 
  
 Many of my recent reviews of higher-end IEMs have an extensive comparison to the GR07 or GR07 BE so you can get a feel for what you're gaining and what you're giving up.
  


lifted andreas said:


> He should just buy some and sell them on after review. They are only £60 after all.


 


anduril said:


> @ljokerl - are you interested in being dropshipped some Knowledge Zenith IEMs to be reviewed (probably ED Special Edition or ED8)? Not right now, rather when the discount comes again.


 
  
 No, sorry - this would put too much pressure on me in terms of getting stuff posted. I have 50+ IEMs all awaiting review right now and I doubt I'll even be getting through all of those.


----------



## anduril

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl*
> 
> Quote:
> 
> ...


 
 Bad luck.
 If the situation changes, let me know please  I love how those IEMs sound and I would love to know how they compare to the ones tested.


----------



## howdy

So I'm having issues deciding on which IEM to get, first the Hifiman RE600 or the Dunu Alpha 1. I want good strong bass but not over emphasize and fluid soundinsounding highs good mids well you get the point. It has to be between these as they are priced similar Andi don't want any over IEMs. So Joker or anyone else with expierence with these i would like your input!


----------



## ljokerl

anduril said:


> Bad luck.
> If the situation changes, let me know please  I love how those IEMs sound and I would love to know how they compare to the ones tested.


 
  
 Sure, thanks!
  


howdy said:


> So I'm having issues deciding on which IEM to get, first the Hifiman RE600 or the Dunu Alpha 1. I want good strong bass but not over emphasize and fluid soundinsounding highs good mids well you get the point. It has to be between these as they are priced similar Andi don't want any over IEMs. So Joker or anyone else with expierence with these i would like your input!


 
  
 Don't think I can be of my help here as I'm not at all familiar with the Alpha 1. Wasn't aware it existed until I googled it just now.


----------



## Dobrescu George

Hy!
 I need a somewhat cheap IEM for when i travel to work. As i keep delaying the purchase of akg k3003, because i keep having other things to buy, i was wondering, what iems under 100$ can provide me with a very good sound. I will be using them 2-3 hourse a day, mostly for travel, in pretty noisy envoirment.
  
 I want : soundstage, more treble, more bass, preferably U shaped signature. i love details, and want something very very detailed.
  
 I cannot fiind any iem, and i cannot buy from outside what i am able to fiind, because the package cannot be delivered, and i must stop my work for one day to go to pick it up from security, in a totally another city.
  
 i am able to purchase : Yamaha EPH-100, Steelseries Flux in ear, AKG k374, hifiman re400, every entry level sennheiser and most entry level audio tehnica, most entry level denons, some jbl models and that would be it. I would spend even 200$ if it is worth it. just, i would loke to not go at 200$ as i would only use these for a limited time, and only when i travel.
  
 if i can be better with, i can also buy under 200$ full headphones if there are better ideeas.
  
 i want to hear recommandations, if possible!


----------



## suman134

dobrescu george said:


> Hy!
> I need a somewhat cheap IEM for when i travel to work. As i keep delaying the purchase of akg k3003, because i keep having other things to buy, i was wondering, what iems under 100$ can provide me with a very good sound. I will be using them 2-3 hourse a day, mostly for travel, in pretty noisy envoirment.
> 
> I want : soundstage, more treble, more bass, preferably U shaped signature. i love details, and want something very very detailed.
> ...


 
  
 If you can do $200 you should go for dn-1000, will meet all of your needs and you might not want to give them up, and if you do, sell it to me. Re-400 wont get you bass, flux is not detailed enough, GR07 BE can be considered but still its not bassy enough. And if you have to chose from these, go for eph-100.
 By the way, where are you from?


----------



## Dobrescu George

suman134 said:


> If you can do $200 you should go for dn-1000, will meet all of your needs and you might not want to give them up, and if you do, sell it to me. Re-400 wont get you bass, flux is not detailed enough, GR07 BE can be considered but still its not bassy enough. And if you have to chose from these, go for eph-100.
> By the way, where are you from?


 
 Romania, cannot go for dunu, i would had if it was possible.  i know that they are better. short, if i order from another country, it get delivered to security center, and i have to pick it up from there. it is at 100KM distance, in another city, and it would cost me a lot to pick them up. it can almost double the cost.
  
 so, on my list, remains eph100, akg k374, and, akg k350.. low end senn.. seems that i can also get low end in ear beyerdynamic.. for example, ortofon eq5 would cost me 300$.. i am wondering what else i can get.. there are a little more models that i can get, but i read joker's entire reviews, and i could not come to better soundstage, and price. i also am trying to spend as less as possible, as i am going to upgrade to akg k3003.
  
 EDIT:: i also accept, that if this is the situation, i am better not buying anything and waiting, but i hoped that i could get something nice before it comes to that
  
 EDIT2:: short, i want soundstage, nice treble, no clipping, lots of micro details, bass to be existent, but not too much.
  
 I am looking at yamaha eph100, steelseries flux in ear, akg k374, sony mh1c, creative in ear 2 aurvana, sony xbah3, and re400, all sennheiser entry level, some audio tehnica entry level, and some denon entry level iem. if not any of these can bring me what i want, i want you to tell me, i will wait for when i have enough money to get k3003.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

@skerry2006aj EPH100 would be suitable. You should also look at Zero Audio Duoza.


----------



## Dobrescu George

after two days of continous research.. i think that i am going to keep money until i buy either dunu dn2000, ultrasone iq, or t-peos h300, and either way i am going to try k3003 just to be sure that i have the top of audio possible.
  
 the main ideea for me would be that i want to have the best audio possible, but for when i go outside i might not want to take something like k3003 with me, in say, rainy days, or cold or hot days... 
  
 until then, i will keep searching. thanks for help.
  
 until then, i will either wait, or get my full cans outside, even though i am kind of afraid of pollution and himidity and cold damaging the drivers.


----------



## reihead

pablobaluba said:


> What is the usual recommended upgrade from GR07 BE?
> 
> I have this pair for 2 years and I simply love the sound. Everything is so detailed, bass is good, for me they are (almost) perfect. Everything sounds good on them. However, I'm wondering what IEMs would be an upgrade over these? I'm talking about a next normal step, not like 1200USD IEMs. I listen mostly to EDM, Electronic, HipHop.




 I was a GR07 BE user for over a year, I loved them, few months ago decided to go for the fidue A83, very happy with my decision, they have more and better bass, so it will suit for music taste.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

@joker You are amazing mate.
  
 Just want to share a story... I remember around 2+ years ago I can here asking what I should get as my next IEM and you recommended me the Yamaha EPH-100 (the little micro-driver) amongst 2 others (Ortofon EQ-5 + something else). I looked at them and immediately decided to go for the Yamaha as you said they would be best for Trance music. Then I sold them on about 6 months later after realising the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore were quite good, however recently I started missing the punchy and full sound of the EPH-100. So....
  
 Now, a massive amount of time later... I have bought my second pair of EPH-100 and started enjoying them all over again. I think it should be crowned best single micro-driver IEM in the world, currently (in your list)!


----------



## kova4a

lifted andreas said:


> I think it should be crowned best single micro-driver IEM in the world, currently (in your list)!
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> ...


 
 I kinda doubt that not only because I wasn't mighty impressed with the eph-100 but also because you forget that there are higher-end iems withsingle microdrivers like the aurisonic rockets for instance,


----------



## pablobaluba

reihead said:


> I was a GR07 BE user for over a year, I loved them, few months ago decided to go for the fidue A83, very happy with my decision, they have more and better bass, so it will suit for music taste.


 
 Thanks for the suggestion. This model looks really interesting I must say! I wasn't aware of this model until know. I have to read some more reviews about them, although I didn't find too many until now.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

kova4a said:


> I kinda doubt that not only because I wasn't mighty impressed with the eph-100 but also because you forget that there are higher-end iems withsingle microdrivers like the aurisonic rockets for instance,




True, perhaps I should have added "it's still the best single micro-driver, in that price range".


----------



## reihead

pablobaluba said:


> Thanks for the suggestion. This model looks really interesting I must say! I wasn't aware of this model until know. I have to read some more reviews about them, although I didn't find too many until now.


 
  
 You can find Joker's review here http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/fidue-a83/
  
 If that does the trick and you can use amazon USA, they are now $259.95


----------



## Dobrescu George

anyone around here tried using normal ear silence plugs as complys?... comply is pretty expensive for me, as i live pretty far, and i was wondering if i could get better by just buying medicinal ear plugs that are made out of foam.
  
 i am good now that i repaired my ie8. they were just dirty... now... 
  
 i am back on track to buy the best iem in the world... the main contenter is akg k3003, followed by dunu dn2000. the price is as such that i might get dn 2000 before, because they are way cheaper than k3003.
 i read about dita truth, jh roxane, ie800 and few others, but still k3003 seems the absolute best i can get.


----------



## soundstige

dobrescu george said:


> anyone around here tried using normal ear silence plugs as complys?... comply is pretty expensive for me, as i live pretty far, and i was wondering if i could get better by just buying medicinal ear plugs that are made out of foam.
> 
> i am good now that i repaired my ie8. they were just dirty... now...
> 
> ...


 
  
 I would suggest looking into the JH13 in addition to/instead of the K3003.


----------



## ljokerl

dobrescu george said:


> Hy!
> I need a somewhat cheap IEM for when i travel to work. As i keep delaying the purchase of akg k3003, because i keep having other things to buy, i was wondering, what iems under 100$ can provide me with a very good sound. I will be using them 2-3 hourse a day, mostly for travel, in pretty noisy envoirment.
> 
> I want : soundstage, more treble, more bass, preferably U shaped signature. i love details, and want something very very detailed.
> ...


 
  
 How much is a Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear? It's a V/U-shaped sig with good bass and treble, and a very decent value at $100 (US price).
  
  


lifted andreas said:


> @joker You are amazing mate.
> 
> Just want to share a story... I remember around 2+ years ago I can here asking what I should get as my next IEM and you recommended me the Yamaha EPH-100 (the little micro-driver) amongst 2 others (Ortofon EQ-5 + something else). I looked at them and immediately decided to go for the Yamaha as you said they would be best for Trance music. Then I sold them on about 6 months later after realising the Zero Audio Carbo Tenore were quite good, however recently I started missing the punchy and full sound of the EPH-100. So....
> 
> Now, a massive amount of time later... I have bought my second pair of EPH-100 and started enjoying them all over again. I think it should be crowned best single micro-driver IEM in the world, currently (in your list)!


 
  
 Glad you like them! Haven't tried the Rockets but in that price range and for bass-heavy sound they're still among my favorites two years later.


----------



## Shawn71

dobrescu george said:


> anyone around here tried using normal ear silence plugs as complys?... comply is pretty expensive for me, as i live pretty far, and i was wondering if i could get better by just buying medicinal ear plugs that are made out of foam.




Get the 3M ,hearos,macks safety earplugs from cvs or amazon or ebay and get the 3-4mm cheap disposable punch biopsy tool.....


----------



## typhoon838

So what I'm looking for would be something similar to the NarMoo S1,but with more treble detail. I need these to be fantastic for rock and metal music. Not get overwhelmed easily by "crowded" music. I'm thinking a hybrid IEM would be best. I tried the DN1000 and am still considering keeping them, but they don't sound like enough of an improvement over the NarMoos to warrant the $170 upcharge. Similar sound but cheaper would be great. 

I've also tried the HAFXT90. I expected so much out of them but they just sounded weird. Not enough subbass and something in the low highs or upper mids was too forward. 

Any suggestions?


----------



## ljokerl

typhoon838 said:


> So what I'm looking for would be something similar to the NarMoo S1,but with more treble detail. I need these to be fantastic for rock and metal music. Not get overwhelmed easily by "crowded" music. I'm thinking a hybrid IEM would be best. I tried the DN1000 and am still considering keeping them, but they don't sound like enough of an improvement over the NarMoos to warrant the $170 upcharge. Similar sound but cheaper would be great.
> 
> I've also tried the HAFXT90. I expected so much out of them but they just sounded weird. Not enough subbass and something in the low highs or upper mids was too forward.
> 
> Any suggestions?


 
  
 Diminishing returns and all that..
  
 The DN-1000 is about the most difference you can get from the S1 with that sound signature so if that didn't sound significant enough, I doubt anything will. You can spend $60 on Brainwavz S1 or $100 on an S5 pr Rock Jaw Alfa Genus and get a smaller upgrade from the NarMoo, if that's more your budget, but they won't perform at the level of the DN-1000.


----------



## ericr

soundstige said:


> I would suggest looking into the JH13 in addition to/instead of the K3003.




The 1964 Ears V6-Stage would be worth looking into as well. IIRC Joker rates them above the 3003. They also cost considerably less and can be ordered as universals (no need for ear impressions or refit issues).

Another IIRC: the cable on the 3003 is not replaceable, correct?


----------



## thug behram

The cable on my dn-1000 tore apart. I'm gonna get it replaced through warranty and then sell it.

Looking for a replacement. Up to $300ish. Warm or slightly V-shaped, nice bass. Removable cable is a must.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

ljokerl said:


> Glad you like them! Haven't tried the Rockets but in that price range and for bass-heavy sound they're still among my favorites two years later.




Wow so nice to hear that they are still desired by others. I kinda wish more people pay3d attention to them, as the EPH100 are a pair of very versatile micro drivers.


----------



## Dobrescu George

After another two weeks of experimenting, to understand what i really like in music, i understood that i like bass, like normal but very very clear mids, like soundstage, micro and macro details.
  
 to mention, i like the sound of ie8 with tape over bass adjusting thingy, with double flange medium tips. That sound is perfect, the mids are no longer laid back, the soundstage is exactly how much it should be, like it is where i want it to be, very immersive, but yet the music extends to a certain distance around me, like a studio room, or more, the treble is not lacking nor sibilant, nor harsh, it is nice, and the bass is exactly how it should have been, no more 100 hz region bump, no more bloated bass, it has the force in the sub bass region, but it is not overwhelming anymore, but i feel like it is a lot of bass, compared to a neutral signature. the bass adjusting thingy are set at minimum. also the speparation is so perfect, every note from every instrument is it's own, even in very very complicated music, like, say, wintersun. the instruments are extremely different, and i love this.
  
 the only reason i feel that i need a new iem is because even though ie8 sound just so amazing at this time, i have the money to buy, and i know that there is something better out there. also i would love to know if there is a combination of iems to buy to have some spare iems. i would also love to have triple flange with what i buy, but it is not entirely necessary.
  
 For me seems that i want to buy the iem that has the ultimate SQ possible, and i want it to have everything, to be clear, to have soundstage, to have treble, to have microdetails, and to have visceral bass on bass oriented music, and to have nice separation. a very good iem, that is expensive and is worth the money. 
  
 EDIT:: i just digget up a pair of yamaha eph 30, they are still usable, and out of my fiio x5, they sound nice. i would clearly consider there the best around 30$ one can get. with ie8 small foam, they get forward mids, bass is there, clarity is good for the price, compared to ie8 they sound very veiled and muffled, but they cost 1/6 the price. after much thought, they are still worth it.
 they do not retrieve all instruments, not immerse you, not sound like everything really happends, cymbals can barley be heared, micro details are not there, veiled, but still are worth the price tag. they are not sibilant almost at all. they do not clip, they are extremely small and confortable. with eq they can be dream iems at 30$..
 switching to ie8 is almost like taking three layers of clothing off ears. and three 100$ bills of your wallet, compared.
 to mention, just to know, with silicone tips they create suction between the ear membrane and driver, they hurt the ear, and sound bad bad bad.
  
 would akg k3003 still fill the bill, or?


----------



## proedros

dobrescu george said:


> After another two weeks of experimenting, to understand what i really like in music, i understood that i like bass, like normal but very very clear mids, like soundstage, micro and macro details.
> 
> to mention, i like the sound of ie8 with tape over bass adjusting thingy, with double flange medium tips. That sound is perfect, the mids are no longer laid back, the soundstage is exactly how much it should be, like it is where i want it to be, very immersive, but yet the music extends to a certain distance around me, like a studio room, or more, the treble is not lacking nor sibilant, nor harsh, it is nice, and the bass is exactly how it should have been, no more 100 hz region bump, no more bloated bass, it has the force in the sub bass region, but it is not overwhelming anymore, but i feel like it is a lot of bass, compared to a neutral signature. the bass adjusting thingy are set at minimum. also the speparation is so perfect, every note from every instrument is it's own, even in very very complicated music, like, say, wintersun. the instruments are extremely different, and i love this.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 there will never be an 'ultimate SQ possible' iem , the point is finding an iem that satifies your listening needs

 i have noticed you have been circling arounf the K3003 for quite some time , i think you should try it and satisfy your curiosity and you will know for sure whether it's the one you want 

 i just got mine  (will post my impressions on the K3003 thread) but in short i really like it , it is a very good iem although like all TOTL iems out there you don't get an iem that is 2-3 times better than an iem that costs 1/2 or 1/3 of the K3003 price (law of diminishing results stand for all expensive iems , and the cheaper mid-price iems have raised their game quite a lot lately)

 i am a music junkie , so paying 700$ for it feels like a gift and an investment more than anything else - i'd rather spent money on a great iem rather than on alcohol or clothes , as i feel that money spent on iems are oney well spent.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

dobrescu george said:


> After another two weeks of experimenting, to understand what i really like in music, i understood that i like bass, like normal but very very clear mids, like soundstage, micro and macro details.
> 
> to mention, i like the sound of ie8 with tape over bass adjusting thingy, with double flange medium tips. That sound is perfect, the mids are no longer laid back, the soundstage is exactly how much it should be, like it is where i want it to be, very immersive, but yet the music extends to a certain distance around me, like a studio room, or more, the treble is not lacking nor sibilant, nor harsh, it is nice, and the bass is exactly how it should have been, no more 100 hz region bump, no more bloated bass, it has the force in the sub bass region, but it is not overwhelming anymore, but i feel like it is a lot of bass, compared to a neutral signature. the bass adjusting thingy are set at minimum. also the speparation is so perfect, every note from every instrument is it's own, even in very very complicated music, like, say, wintersun. the instruments are extremely different, and i love this.
> 
> ...




You said yourself that your EPH30 sounds good to you, why dont you get 2 level upgrade and buy the EPH100? 

They are on sale at the moment:

www.audioaffair.co.uk/yamaha-eph100-earphones


----------



## encoreAC

lifted andreas said:


> You said yourself that your EPH30 sounds good to you, why dont you get 2 level upgrade and buy the EPH100?
> 
> They are on sale at the moment:
> 
> www.audioaffair.co.uk/yamaha-eph100-earphones


 
  
 EPH100 vs DUOZA , what do you think?


----------



## HarryCheng

Thanks a lot to |joker| for all the reviews
  
 I wonder how much time he spends on each iem
  
 I guess he spends a really long time for each
  
 looking forward to some newer models like the ATH IM series


----------



## Dobrescu George

lifted andreas said:


> You said yourself that your EPH30 sounds good to you, why dont you get 2 level upgrade and buy the EPH100?
> 
> They are on sale at the moment:
> 
> www.audioaffair.co.uk/yamaha-eph100-earphones


 
 ie8 sounds better than eph30 for example. i stopped searching for entry level or mid end, i want to search and buy the end game iem for me, right now. the contenders, as far as i understand are jh13, jh roxanne, akg k3003, ie800, FitEar To Go! 334, dunu dn2000.
 i wanted to ask what has the best confort too. akg k3003 seems like a nice choice, but after trying eph 30 and being able to insert them very deep, i feel like i might enjoy deep insertion, even though, the first thing for me is SQ. what has the best sq, i can pretty much enjoy any sq as long as it is the best [meaning the most clear, detailed, best soundstage etc.]
  
 i managed, after a lot of thought to put in words what i am searching for! yay!
  
 i want the iem that is the most clear, has best micro details, good soundstage, best details, best clarity, best separation between instruments, makes music sound the most... good. i don't care for how the signature is, i can acomodate any signature in a few minutes, and i will. i just want it to have everything, and to be the best of the best in clarity. as long as it has bass, has mids has treble, and everything is there, i don't care what is more expressed, i love all parts of music, i want it to sound like taking the last veil off, and make the music the most vivid.


----------



## shultzee

proedros said:


> there will never be an 'ultimate SQ possible' iem , the point is finding an iem that satifies your listening needs
> 
> i have noticed you have been circling arounf the K3003 for quite some time , i think you should try it and satisfy your curiosity and you will know for sure whether it's the one you want
> 
> ...


 

 I like that last paragraph.  I feel the same way.    I also say...give me my flowers now , not when I am dead.


----------



## proedros

shultzee said:


> I like that last paragraph.  I feel the same way.    I also say...give me my flowers now , not when I am dead.


 
  
 i like your last phrase , the 'YOLO' term seems to resonate with me much more these last few months after a death in the family.

 we only live once, so let's buy the best iems we can while we are alive and kicking (and hearing well i might add)


----------



## shultzee

proedros said:


> i like your last phrase , the 'YOLO' term seems to resonate with me much more these last few months after a death in the family.
> 
> we only live once, so let's buy the best iems we can while we are alive and kicking (and hearing well i might add)


----------



## ljokerl

thug behram said:


> The cable on my dn-1000 tore apart. I'm gonna get it replaced through warranty and then sell it.
> 
> Looking for a replacement. Up to $300ish. Warm or slightly V-shaped, nice bass. Removable cable is a must.


 
  
 Not a lot of options with detachable cords in that price range... maybe Fidue A83? The Sony XBA-H3 drops below $300 also, though I don't know what the story is with detachable cables for that. For the Fidue any MMCX cable should work. 
  


harrycheng said:


> Thanks a lot to |joker| for all the reviews
> 
> I wonder how much time he spends on each iem
> 
> ...


 
  
 Anywhere from a few days to a few weeks per.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

encoreac said:


> EPH100 vs DUOZA , what do you think?




EPH100 for me all the way, even though I haven't heard the Douzas yet. 

It's just that my ears like deep insertion IEMs and Douza wouldn't be good for that. 




dobrescu george said:


> ie8 sounds better than eph30 for example. i stopped searching for entry level or mid end, i want to search and buy the end game iem for me, right now. the contenders, as far as i understand are jh13, jh roxanne, akg k3003, ie800, FitEar To Go! 334, dunu dn2000.
> 
> i wanted to ask what has the best confort too. akg k3003 seems like a nice choice, but after trying eph 30 and being able to insert them very deep, i feel like i might enjoy deep insertion, even though, the first thing for me is SQ. what has the best sq, i can pretty much enjoy any sq as long as it is the best [meaning the most clear, detailed, best soundstage etc.]
> 
> ...




Hmm sounds like you want to find the perfect iem lol. This might not happen until you try and buy some.


----------



## Dobrescu George

lifted andreas said:


> EPH100 for me all the way, even though I haven't heard the Douzas yet.
> 
> It's just that my ears like deep insertion IEMs and Douza wouldn't be good for that.
> Hmm sounds like you want to find the perfect iem lol. This might not happen until you try and buy some.


 
 i can only try sennheiser ie800, and i can only buy ie800 and akg k3003 and be able to return them.
  
 for anything else i can only buy, without returning, because of waiting policies for international shipping. so long story short, anything else but ie800 and k3003, i will have to keep even if it is not for me, this is why i am so reluctant to start buying iems, and research a lot. i think that i going to buy dunu dn2000 either way, because joker said that it sounds amazing, but universal versions of customs are expensive, and if there is the risk of me not liking them, and i will be forced to keep them either way. it is not a smart way of doing buisness with that one. if i will ever have a trip to a place where i can test more, i will, and more than sure i will stop asking and just buy what i truly desire.
  
 but with all seriousness, i can accept any type of sound, as long as it hass every are right, bass mids and treble, and it is the most detailed, and has the best soundstage. i think that these are the most important aspects


----------



## sandrojpsantos

Hi, hello joker, you really have things running here. But it is so much that after so much reading I have to ask .
  
 I am after my first IEM's, I do manly entertainment, and the reason for getting ones is for tablet and 3ds audio play. My budget gets around 30 dollars with a fair room for working it around. The main problem is that since I am in portugal, europe, I don't seem to get half of the brands you have on your reviews, so I'm kinda forced down on the most popular ones like, sony, philips, akg, senheiser, pioneer and stuff (with some exceptions on amazon uk).
  
 My main cans are the beyerdynamic dt 770 pro 80ohm I think they are the perfect ones for my use and earings and I do love the isolation, it is something important to me, and my main focus is gaming and sound quality (more for the neutral sound but with that kick for entertainment).
  
 So what do you (joker) or you guys can recommend?
  
 I almost buy a philips she3590 and also looked at the akg k321, but I figured it would be first to ask here first.
  
 Hope you or everyone can help me out.
  
 Thank you all in advance .
  
 EDIT: I also care a lot about comfort and cables, giving preference to flat or braided ones.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

dobrescu george said:


> i can only try sennheiser ie800, and i can only buy ie800 and akg k3003 and be able to return them.
> 
> for anything else i can only buy, without returning, because of waiting policies for international shipping. so long story short, anything else but ie800 and k3003, i will have to keep even if it is not for me, this is why i am so reluctant to start buying iems, and research a lot. i think that i going to buy dunu dn2000 either way, because joker said that it sounds amazing, but universal versions of customs are expensive, and if there is the risk of me not liking them, and i will be forced to keep them either way. it is not a smart way of doing buisness with that one. if i will ever have a trip to a place where i can test more, i will, and more than sure i will stop asking and just buy what i truly desire.
> 
> but with all seriousness, i can accept any type of sound, as long as it hass every are right, bass mids and treble, and it is the most detailed, and has the best soundstage. i think that these are the most important aspects




I guess another option for you is try and sell on. That's what a lot of people do. 

I lost count of how many IEMs I've gone through like that.


----------



## Dobrescu George

i tested today... as far as iems go, i only got to tested ie800, as an expensive thing... it was very very sibilant and harsh. the treble was sounding all SSSSS i don't know why... it was powered from an x5 only. From chord hugo, the problem did not exist, and the sound was fuller. i am thinking if i should buy ie800 with chord hugo for an end game setup/.


----------



## rantrile

I would be interested in an opinion of experienced members: why there are no iems that provide listening experience same as audio systems with subwoofer that are installed in cars?

And, what iems would be closest to that?


----------



## Dobrescu George

rantrile said:


> I would be interested in an opinion of experienced members: why there are no iems that provide listening experience same as audio systems with subwoofer that are installed in cars?
> 
> And, what iems would be closest to that?


 
 bass canons. ie80. they are sure to get you more than the sub bass you want... anyways, they should be the most audiophile ones. 
  
 EDIT: there is a bassheads thread around, ask there. you can get pretty much a list of what has the bass like that. if you want audiophile quality, ie8/ie80 are the safest bet.
  
 EDIT2:: @ljokerl : how do you compare the bass on k3003 to the bass on ie800. i mean, ie800 had visceral bass, more and more precise than i ever expected, the sound was almost perfect, just a little sibilant. would you still recommend k3003 as being better?..


----------



## Lifted Andreas

dobrescu george said:


> i tested today... as far as iems go, i only got to tested ie800, as an expensive thing... it was very very sibilant and harsh. the treble was sounding all SSSSS i don't know why... it was powered from an x5 only. From chord hugo, the problem did not exist, and the sound was fuller. i am thinking if i should buy ie800 with chord hugo for an end game setup/.




Wow that's rather weird, I've got an x3 and it never creates sibilance on any of my IEMs/HPs.


----------



## Dobrescu George

lifted andreas said:


> Wow that's rather weird, I've got an x3 and it never creates sibilance on any of my IEMs/HPs.


 
 neither does mine. only with that ie800 i tried there. maybe i tried with the wrong recording.


----------



## ljokerl

sandrojpsantos said:


> Hi, hello joker, you really have things running here. But it is so much that after so much reading I have to ask .
> 
> I am after my first IEM's, I do manly entertainment, and the reason for getting ones is for tablet and 3ds audio play. My budget gets around 30 dollars with a fair room for working it around. The main problem is that since I am in portugal, europe, I don't seem to get half of the brands you have on your reviews, so I'm kinda forced down on the most popular ones like, sony, philips, akg, senheiser, pioneer and stuff (with some exceptions on amazon uk).
> 
> ...


 
  
 $30 is not much of a budget and you haven't really laid out any sound quality requirements so I guess you can't really go wrong with the SHE3590. It doesn't have flat or braided cables but for how inexpensive it is I don't think you can hold that against it.
  


rantrile said:


> I would be interested in an opinion of experienced members: why there are no iems that provide listening experience same as audio systems with subwoofer that are installed in cars?
> 
> And, what iems would be closest to that?


 
  
 You mean a ton of bass? There's plenty of IEMs that provide that - the Beats by Dre Tour 2.0, for example, or the JVC HA-FR301.
  


dobrescu george said:


> EDIT2:: @ljokerl : how do you compare the bass on k3003 to the bass on ie800. i mean, ie800 had visceral bass, more and more precise than i ever expected, the sound was almost perfect, just a little sibilant. would you still recommend k3003 as being better?..


 
  
 IMO the IE800 has noticeably more bass than the K3003 (which is not lacking in bass by any means, but just isn't as enhanced). 
  
 As noted in my IE800 review (http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/sennheiser-ie-800-dynamic-ear-monitor-page-2), I thought the treble of the K3003 was more natural.


----------



## sandrojpsantos

ljokerl said:


> $30 is not much of a budget and you haven't really laid out any sound quality requirements so I guess you can't really go wrong with the SHE3590. It doesn't have flat or braided cables but for how inexpensive it is I don't think you can hold that against it.


 
 Thank you so much for the info, I will certainly end up buying them then . For my first IEM it seems ok enough, and as I have the dt 770 as main, this will be just for out of home portability.
  
 But btw just for future reference (I might end up liking to much of the IEM's lol), what would be a good reasonably budget/IEM's for media/game playing? and what sound signature is best for that, in your opinion? (I saw your buying guide, but the sound signature is a bit new to me. I guess the dt770 are basshead but I don't feel like they are very bassy, they seem just to have the perfect amount of it for my uses. Also, I liked the nuforce 600x and brainwavz m1 but I just can get them for like 55$ each lol).


----------



## Dobrescu George

then i think that this is going to be the last question, @ljokerl is it worth to go for k3003 instead of ie800, if i already have ie8, and kind of enjoy the soundstage and clarity of ie8? i mean, i really wanted soundstage, and it is as you speak, ie800 seem to have a more narrow soundstage than ie8... i want to ask this straight, if i enjoyed ie800 something when i tested, but i kind of hated the tips should i just buy k3003, and use it with ie8 tips? [as far as i know they should have the same size for nozzle] [i really enjoy ie8 with double flange tips] 
 i want to know your thoughts on this, and i am sorry for keeping bothering you, i know that you are a busy person, specially with your knowledge, but i really wanted to know an expert's opinion.
  
 EDIT1: the ie800 had a too short cable, it was very hard to wear them over the ear; i listen to all generas, but mainly metal; i wear iems over the ear;


----------



## proedros

dobrescu george said:


> then i think that this is going to be the last question, @ljokerl is it worth to go for k3003 instead of ie800, if i already have ie8, and kind of enjoy the soundstage and clarity of ie8? i mean, i really wanted soundstage, and it is as you speak, ie800 seem to have a more narrow soundstage than ie8... i want to ask this straight, if i enjoyed ie800 something when i tested, but i kind of hated the tips should i just buy k3003, and use it with ie8 tips? [as far as i know they should have the same size for nozzle] [i really enjoy ie8 with double flange tips]
> i want to know your thoughts on this, and i am sorry for keeping bothering you, i know that you are a busy person, specially with your knowledge, but i really wanted to know an expert's opinion.
> 
> EDIT1: the ie800 had a too short cable, it was very hard to wear them over the ear; i listen to all generas, but mainly metal;* i wear iems over the ear; *


 
  
 dude , go and do the test drive between K3 and IE800 with that person from Bucharest who offered to help you - you are like a hamster trapped in an ever-spinning wheel for weeks now

 go.try.them.both.

 go.


----------



## rantrile

ljokerl said:


> You mean a ton of bass? There's plenty of IEMs that provide that - the Beats by Dre Tour 2.0, for example, or the JVC HA-FR301.




I mean the whole listening experience and similar sound quality with subbwass, airy presentation, and I also need remote for iphone. 
Any recommendations?


----------



## Dobrescu George

proedros said:


> dude , go and do the test drive between K3 and IE800 with that person from Bucharest who offered to help you - you are like a hamster trapped in an ever-spinning wheel for weeks now
> 
> go.try.them.both.
> 
> go.


 
 you ideea is not bad, but from my program it is not possible right now... if it will be possible, i will in the near future...
  
 btw, i have taken another decision. i am going to buy SH k3003, ie800, and probably ultrasone iq, if i will fiind and be able to, because, you know, i love spending less, getting more.


----------



## ljokerl

sandrojpsantos said:


> Thank you so much for the info, I will certainly end up buying them then . For my first IEM it seems ok enough, and as I have the dt 770 as main, this will be just for out of home portability.
> 
> But btw just for future reference (I might end up liking to much of the IEM's lol), what would be a good reasonably budget/IEM's for media/game playing? and what sound signature is best for that, in your opinion? (I saw your buying guide, but the sound signature is a bit new to me. I guess the dt770 are basshead but I don't feel like they are very bassy, they seem just to have the perfect amount of it for my uses. Also, I liked the nuforce 600x and brainwavz m1 but I just can get them for like 55$ each lol).


 
  
 In the absence of specific sound sig requirements I would say a KC06 from Ostry would be a good one at ~$60. Very clear sound, bit of bass punch, good vocal intelligiblity and wide presentation. The NE-600X will give you lots of bass (great if you like bass-heavy earphones) but for $55 it's not really worth it. The M1 has a more mid-centric sig that's better-suited for music than other multimedia. 
  


dobrescu george said:


> then i think that this is going to be the last question, @ljokerl is it worth to go for k3003 instead of ie800, if i already have ie8, and kind of enjoy the soundstage and clarity of ie8? i mean, i really wanted soundstage, and it is as you speak, ie800 seem to have a more narrow soundstage than ie8... i want to ask this straight, if i enjoyed ie800 something when i tested, but i kind of hated the tips should i just buy k3003, and use it with ie8 tips? [as far as i know they should have the same size for nozzle] [i really enjoy ie8 with double flange tips]
> i want to know your thoughts on this, and i am sorry for keeping bothering you, i know that you are a busy person, specially with your knowledge, but i really wanted to know an expert's opinion.
> 
> EDIT1: the ie800 had a too short cable, it was very hard to wear them over the ear; i listen to all generas, but mainly metal; i wear iems over the ear;


 
  
 You don't have the option of changing tips or lengthening the cable above the y-split for over-the-ear wear with the IE800. With the K3003 those things aren't a concern, and you can use some bi-flange tips. Not all tips will stay securely on the K3003 nozzle because it lacks a notch, but there's still quite a few options compared to the IE800.
  


rantrile said:


> I mean the whole listening experience and similar sound quality with subbwass, airy presentation, and I also need remote for iphone.
> Any recommendations?


 
  
 RHA T10i, maybe? I'm not a fan of having so much bass in an earphone that it affects other aspects of its performance, but it does have a remote and the presentation is decent.


----------



## Jim McC

What would be a good IEM for movies? Good bass, clear dialog, comfortable. Budget about $30. Thanks.


----------



## esteebin

jim mcc said:


> What would be a good IEM for movies? Good bass, clear dialog, comfortable. Budget about $30. Thanks.




SteelSeries flux were low as $10 (originally $50 currently $43 on Amazon)over Christmas. Great bass, clear vocals, smooth treble that extends pretty well. Has a single button for play/pause/call/hang up and a mic.

6mm micro driver means housing is small, I can lay on my side while wearing these with no problems. Isolates really well too.


----------



## Jim McC

esteebin said:


> SteelSeries flux were low as $10 (originally $50 currently $43 on Amazon)over Christmas. Great bass, clear vocals, smooth treble that extends pretty well. Has a single button for play/pause/call/hang up and a mic.
> 
> 6mm micro driver means housing is small, I can lay on my side while wearing these with no problems. Isolates really well too.


 
  
 Thanks. I forgot to say that I don't want/need a mic, volume control or anything else.


----------



## AgentJ

About to take a plunge and get the Ostry KC06A. I was told they're a bit better built than the VSD3 and perhaps a bit better sounding? I'm more certain on a v shaped sound with a tad more warm in the vocals than the FXD80, hoping these will be my best bet, 
  
 Just wanted to get another opinion before I hit the confirm button


----------



## slowpickr

agentj said:


> About to take a plunge and get the Ostry KC06A. I was told they're a bit better built than the VSD3 and perhaps a bit better sounding? I'm more certain on a v shaped sound with a tad more warm in the vocals than the FXD80, hoping these will be my best bet,
> 
> Just wanted to get another opinion before I hit the confirm button




Get the Ostrys. I had the VSD3S's a while back and the KC06As stomped them.


----------



## waynes world

agentj said:


> About to take a plunge and get the Ostry KC06A. I was told they're a bit better built than the VSD3 and perhaps a bit better sounding? I'm more certain on a v shaped sound with a tad more warm in the vocals than the FXD80, hoping these will be my best bet,
> 
> Just wanted to get another opinion before I hit the confirm button


 
  
 Hit it. The kc06a's rock.


----------



## AgentJ

slowpickr said:


> Get the Ostrys. I had the VSD3S's a while back and the KC06As stomped them.


 
  
  


waynes world said:


> Hit it. The kc06a's rock.


 
  
 Well I'm gonna be £50 poorer now, Thanks guys!! I'll report back once they get here (delivery from Hong Kong -_-)


----------



## sandrojpsantos

ljokerl said:


> In the absence of specific sound sig requirements I would say a KC06 from Ostry would be a good one at ~$60. Very clear sound, bit of bass punch, good vocal intelligiblity and wide presentation. The NE-600X will give you lots of bass (great if you like bass-heavy earphones) but for $55 it's not really worth it. The M1 has a more mid-centric sig that's better-suited for music than other multimedia.


 
 Thank you really much Joker, you sure are a big help around here .
  
 And I was in trouble about getting some brands to ship to portugal but I came across your recommended shop - lend me your years and now I can actually extend my wishlist. I might end up a little and get the ostry as you suggest as my firsts . I am really happy.
  
 So just to end this questions, as I was considering many IEMs I came accross two that I would like to know if you will be giving word soon about them. The sennheiser cx3.00 and the vsonic vsd3(find your upcoming review things  ). Will you be getting reviews of those? have you tried them already?
  
 Wish you all the best, I'll be sure to post when I get my first ones


----------



## ljokerl

jim mcc said:


> What would be a good IEM for movies? Good bass, clear dialog, comfortable. Budget about $30. Thanks.


 
  
 One of the ~$30 T-Peos sets, maybe. The D200R would be the best option but it is hard to find. The Popular is $30 at mp4nation. Soundmagic sets are good too - both the E10 and E30. 
  


sandrojpsantos said:


> Thank you really much Joker, you sure are a big help around here .
> 
> And I was in trouble about getting some brands to ship to portugal but I came across your recommended shop - lend me your years and now I can actually extend my wishlist. I might end up a little and get the ostry as you suggest as my firsts . I am really happy.
> 
> ...


 
  
 No plans to try the 3.00 but I have reviewed the VSD3 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/


----------



## sandrojpsantos

ljokerl said:


> No plans to try the 3.00 but I have reviewed the VSD3 here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/


 
 Ok, perfect enough . Really glad I could read this brief (super detailed) impression/review on those. I'll be waiting for the full final word on these to pull the trigger lol. I resolve to invest a bit more and now I put down the choice to three candidates, the ostry kc06, the vsd3s non detachable cable and astrotec am-800 (not sure if it is on the same league but for now I suppose it is). Sure your final reviews will made me decide well for .
  
 Thank you a lot for your help and understandings. I am really getting excited for my first IEM's (I was a cans only dude) .


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the Fidue A83
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1C23) Fidue A83*
> 
> 
> Reviewed Dec 2014
> ...


 
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.


----------



## encoreAC

ljokerl said:


> Added a review of the Fidue A83
> 
> 
> The overall ranking has been updated here.


 
 Thanks for the review, it's really a great help!


----------



## EricHawaii

Typically foam tips boost the bass a little (better isolation) and curb the treble.  Are you saying that with other tips (i.e. not the Comply/Short Double Flanges) that the sound was too bright?  Or was there more treble un-evenness?
  
 Just trying to understand more about the comment "Treble quality is tip dependent"


----------



## ljokerl

encoreac said:


> Thanks for the review, it's really a great help!


 
  







erichawaii said:


> Typically foam tips boost the bass a little (better isolation) and curb the treble.  Are you saying that with other tips (i.e. not the Comply/Short Double Flanges) that the sound was too bright?  *Or was there more treble un-evenness?*


 
  
 Yes, this. Different eartips do modify treble response slightly and it took some playing around with tips for me to find the maximum smoothness.


----------



## weijunz

The fidue looks so cool!!!


----------



## mrs1986

Question, between some Weston's UM1 used and a pair of shure se215 new, which would you choose? The difference in price is 15 more the shures I'm afraid of it sizes... For reference the monoprice 8something ones are big for me...

Edit: sorry monoprice 108320 those are, I don't like how they sound not a bit, and the fit is horrible... The case is, rare shaped...

Edit2: I'm actually hearing to them right now and the sound is not that bad... Its been a couple of days that i dont hear my q701s and im quite new to this world ( been here for a lot but didnt have money for anything  ) so im not super extremely familiarized with the sound... However, these are not a bit of comfortable and the seal is bad, and i think i can hear one of the sides sound louder than the other (i think)


----------



## brencho

Hey Joker,
  
 I was wondering what you thought about an IEM to pair with the UE900s. i was leaning towards the shure 535 since they can be found for a more decent price these days and i could possibly cable swap with the UE900s, or even the fidue a83 you just reviewed. but i've also always been tempted to try westone 4rs or some westone phone. any ideas?
  
 thanks!!


----------



## brencho

i'll add westone w40s to the list of possible options, which i hear can be found for quite a discount... anyway, thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

mrs1986 said:


> Question, between some Weston's UM1 used and a pair of shure se215 new, which would you choose? The difference in price is 15 more the shures I'm afraid of it sizes... For reference the monoprice 8something ones are big for me...
> 
> Edit: sorry monoprice 108320 those are, I don't like how they sound not a bit, and the fit is horrible... The case is, rare shaped...
> 
> ...


 
  
 Not sure what the UM1s sound like - don't have one. The SE215 is a good earphone but not super small. The Westone 10 (which I do have) is a lot more compact and comfortable, but I prefer the sound of the Shures.  
  


brencho said:


> Hey Joker,
> 
> I was wondering what you thought about an IEM to pair with the UE900s. i was leaning towards the shure 535 since they can be found for a more decent price these days and i could possibly cable swap with the UE900s, or even the fidue a83 you just reviewed. but i've also always been tempted to try westone 4rs or some westone phone. any ideas?
> 
> thanks!!


 
  
 If you're looking for a contrast, the W40 or A83 would be better than the 535. They're all good earphones, so it really depends on what you're after.


----------



## mrs1986

ljokerl said:


> Not sure what the UM1s sound like - don't have one. The SE215 is a good earphone but not super small. The Westone 10 (which I do have) is a lot more compact and comfortable, but I prefer the sound of the Shures.




And would the re400 be better than the shures? I mean, about durability, that what concerns me the more...


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> And would the re400 be better than the shures? I mean, about durability, that what concerns me the more...


 

 Waterline has durability issues, so dont count on it. If you want durability go for shures or ma-750.
 You know re-400 has a different sig compared to se215 right?
  
 Ooops, you are looking for small earphones. Try considering the golden crystals or the crystal.


----------



## bimmer100

I ended up getting a pair of Fidue A83's and absolutely have no regrets whatsoever.

Well, I may end up getting another pair of IEM's with a mic and control to go with my iPhone. Not a big deal but it would be nice. Considered a primo8, but may want to get something budget minded for that type of setup. Senneheiser momentum IEM. Not amazing, but cheaper. Any other suggestions?


----------



## H20Fidelity

bimmer100 said:


> I ended up getting a pair of Fidue A83's and absolutely have no regrets whatsoever.
> 
> Well, I may end up getting another pair of IEM's with a mic and control to go with my iPhone. Not a big deal but it would be nice. Considered a primo8, but may want to get something budget minded for that type of setup. Senneheiser momentum IEM. Not amazing, but cheaper. Any other suggestions?


 

  
 The Fidue A83 actually use Shure connectors, any aftermarket Shure cable will fit no problem.
  
 Something like this with mic / control cable would work.
  
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Replacement-cable-with-Remote-Mic-connect-iphone-to-SHURE-SE535-SE425-SE315-215-/311127232040?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4870a0ce28


----------



## bimmer100

That's good to know. I figured the connectors were standard in some way. Except the over ear design of the a83 is fairly unique right? The angle connectors and bendable wire around the ear? I wonder if some cables like that exist that are comparable quality to what came with them. The cable that came with the a83 looks really expensive. Haha.
It would be nice if they had an option to have an inline remote cable that is extra.


----------



## mrs1986

suman134 said:


> Waterline has durability issues, so dont count on it. If you want durability go for shures or ma-750.
> You know re-400 has a different sig compared to se215 right?
> 
> Ooops, you are looking for small earphones. Try considering the golden crystals or the crystal.



Thanks for the suggestions, I can't seem to find them in US? I don't want to wait a month to get the iems... My DX50 is soon to arrive so I want them asap...

About the re400 that's what I was afraid of, too many people claiming build issues...

The brainwavz M1 would be a good choice? Some reviews says that the sound is similar to the re400...

I have the q701 so I want something similar sounding, with cheap iems limitations of course...


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> Thanks for the suggestions, I can't seem to find them in US? I don't want to wait a month to get the iems... My DX50 is soon to arrive so I want them asap...
> 
> About the re400 that's what I was afraid of, too many people claiming build issues...
> 
> ...


 

 Really?  M1 is not that detailed, similar signature but thats it. Why dont you try the Re-400, its not that bad, you just have to take care. You might like to consider the Gr07 too. And if you are on budget go for M1, its good.


----------



## mrs1986

suman134 said:


> Really?  M1 is not that detailed, similar signature but thats it. Why dont you try the Re-400, its not that bad, you just have to take care. You might like to consider the Gr07 too. And if you are on budget go for M1, its good.



The classic gr07 is equally great? For 20 difference over the re400?


----------



## brencho

ljokerl said:


> If you're looking for a contrast, the W40 or A83 would be better than the 535. They're all good earphones, so it really depends on what you're after.


 
 Thanks for the advice! I might just stick to the UE900s I have for now and use the money for other more immediate upgrades. If you have time to get into it, how do the W40 and A83 sound similar / different from the UE900s? I'm guessing the W40 will be 'bassier' in some way, and the A83 maybe more mid forward and warm? cheers!


----------



## suman134

mrs1986 said:


> The classic gr07 is equally great? For 20 difference over the re400?


 

 yes, Go for GR-07 classic, less sibilant version of GR.


----------



## ljokerl

bimmer100 said:


> That's good to know. I figured the connectors were standard in some way. Except the over ear design of the a83 is fairly unique right? The angle connectors and bendable wire around the ear? I wonder if some cables like that exist that are comparable quality to what came with them. The cable that came with the a83 looks really expensive. Haha.
> It would be nice if they had an option to have an inline remote cable that is extra.


 
  
 Anything with memory wire will give you a similarly secure fit and some cables do have similar angled connectors, like these Shure ones: http://www.amazon.com/Shure-CBL-M-K-EFS-Three-Button-Control/dp/B0043241X8 . You just need to use the cable cinch to keep the cord in place since it lacks memory wire. I'm sure there's more out there, too. 
  


brencho said:


> Thanks for the advice! I might just stick to the UE900s I have for now and use the money for other more immediate upgrades. If you have time to get into it, how do the W40 and A83 sound similar / different from the UE900s? I'm guessing the W40 will be 'bassier' in some way, and the A83 maybe more mid forward and warm? cheers!


 
  
 W40 is not quite as clear, more mid-bassy, and also darker, but still pretty balanced overall (more so than the A83). The A83 has even more bass and a more v-shaped sound that's a bit less forgiving. It's more clear and spacious than the W40, though.


----------



## audiorapture

ljokerl:a quick note/  I still refer back to your thread all the time, especially when I want to make a choice for an iem:  thanks again for all that you did and still do...you have saved me lots of time & money--all the best to you and yours-


----------



## ozziecook

ljokel:
 amazing reviews and insights. Good grief that's a comprehensive list! I'm new to this site and higher end listening so you'll have to forgive some of my phraseology. Don't know if this the right place but wondering if you can help with advice on an iem. 
 Looking for something warm, lush, forgiving...but relatively detailed, good separation without being harsh on treble. Also after a big soundstage, good 3D, imaging.  Are those aspects contradictory? Am I asking too much? Don't we all? 
 Not sure if the Fidue fits the bill. I have a few in ears (including Rockjaw Alpha Genus,  Soundmagic, RHA which i know are quite low end) and nothing quite hits the spot yet.  I've ordered the Havi B3 for the 'massive soundstage' aspect (tho I see you don't entirely agree with that) but not convinced it gets to the warmth/lush aspect, from what I've read. The Brainwavz R3 sounds in the warm/lush area especially for the price but is it good enough? Happy to pay for what i need - well up to £300 ($500) plus if worth it and it puts an end to the search. But would rather spend less if poss, obv. Earsonics SM64 or SM3 might do trick (?) but expensive...or Westone UM3X (bought a W30 but sent back). 
 Your advice (or anyone else's) much appreciated. Thanks.


----------



## ljokerl

audiorapture said:


> ljokerl:a quick note/  I still refer back to your thread all the time, especially when I want to make a choice for an iem:  thanks again for all that you did and still do...you have saved me lots of time & money--all the best to you and yours-


 
  
 Thanks, I appreciate that 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


ozziecook said:


> ljokel:
> amazing reviews and insights. Good grief that's a comprehensive list! I'm new to this site and higher end listening so you'll have to forgive some of my phraseology. Don't know if this the right place but wondering if you can help with advice on an iem.
> Looking for something warm, lush, forgiving...but relatively detailed, good separation without being harsh on treble. Also after a big soundstage, good 3D, imaging.  Are those aspects contradictory? Am I asking too much? Don't we all?
> Not sure if the Fidue fits the bill. I have a few in ears (including Rockjaw Alpha Genus,  Soundmagic, RHA which i know are quite low end) and nothing quite hits the spot yet.  I've ordered the Havi B3 for the 'massive soundstage' aspect (tho I see you don't entirely agree with that) but not convinced it gets to the warmth/lush aspect, from what I've read. The Brainwavz R3 sounds in the warm/lush area especially for the price but is it good enough? Happy to pay for what i need - well up to £300 ($500) plus if worth it and it puts an end to the search. But would rather spend less if poss, obv. Earsonics SM64 or SM3 might do trick (?) but expensive...or Westone UM3X (bought a W30 but sent back).
> Your advice (or anyone else's) much appreciated. Thanks.


 
  
 What you're asking for certainly exists, but there's also multiple variations on each of the things you want. For example, two earphones can both be described as be spacious and lush, but one may be extremely lush (thick, rich, whatever) and somewhat spacious, and the other may be very spacious and slightly warm. Both would fit your requirements as you've put them forth, but sound different from each other, and one may certainly appeal to you more than the other.
  
 The Fidue is a pretty good one for what you want. I don't know if I would call it forgiving but it's not explicitly harsh, just has a good amount of treble energy. Likewise, it's a little on the warm side but I'm not sure it qualifies to be called "lush". The R3 is obviously a lot less spendy and it does make for a very good relatively balanced-sounding earphone with a warm-ish tilt, but it is not the most detailed earphone out there and not "lush" the way an SM3 or UM3X might be.
  
 I guess three more that come to my mind are:
  
 StageDiver SD-2 - one of the few balanced, high-end, smoother-sounding earphones with a slightly warm tilt. Might be a tad too neutral and not emphasized enough in the lows
 EarSonics SM64 - has a dip in the upper midrange you may not expect and is not quite as full-bodied as the SM3 (which itself has other downsides), but otherwise quite good for what you want 
 Sony XBA-H3 - slightly looser bass than the above sets, but also greater quantity. Smoother overall than the A83 and a little warmer as well, but still maintains the other qualities quite well. Seems like a solid choice to me.


----------



## ozziecook

Great. Thanks for the advice. Might look into the Sonys. Seem to stick out a little way so not so good for sleeping perhaps.


----------



## encoreAC

Hello Joker,
 After long-thought considerations I finally decided to step to an higher price-range class in order to find the most suitable phone for me. I would be really grateful if you spare some time to help me with this decision.
  
 I am copy and pasting from another thread, since I don't want to write the same thing over, I like the format, I hope you don't mind it:
  
*Budget *- ~400€
*Source *- FiiO e07k
*Requirements for Isolation *- prefer high, I want to be mobile with them, but I can deal with a little bit less too.
*Preferred Type of Headphone* - IEM
*Preferred tonal balance* - balanced-warm, thick, yet clear mids, don't mind lots of well-defined bass, well extended flat treble response
*Past headphones* - UM3X, Shure 420: both too flat sounding; Havi B3 p1: not enough bass, bass was great with bass-boost though, midrange is too thin and cold sounding; KC06A: Soundstage-depth too low, a little bit too cold, I like the overall frequency repsonse; Tenore: treble extension was not good enough, I like the warmth.

*Preferred Music - *prefer an all-rounder for female vocals(!), ballads, pop, classic, instrumental music

*Location* - Germany
  
 I am most interested in the SM64 at the moment,what do you think?
  
 Here I also want to take the opportunity to thank you for your fantastic effort here in this thread and on your reviews, it is really the best and most reliable resource for IEMs on the internet by far!


----------



## suman134

encoreac said:


> Hello Joker,
> After long-thought considerations I finally decided to step to an higher price-range class in order to find the most suitable phone for me. I would be really grateful if you spare some time to help me with this decision.
> 
> I am copy and pasting from another thread, since I don't want to write the same thing over, I like the format, I hope you don't mind it:
> ...


 
  
 I was going to suggest the sm64, which you are already considering, i think it will be the best.


----------



## ljokerl

ozziecook said:


> Great. Thanks for the advice. Might look into the Sonys. Seem to stick out a little way so not so good for sleeping perhaps.


 
  
 No, no chance of sleeping in them - not on your side, at least. 
  


encoreac said:


> Hello Joker,
> After long-thought considerations I finally decided to step to an higher price-range class in order to find the most suitable phone for me. I would be really grateful if you spare some time to help me with this decision.
> 
> I am copy and pasting from another thread, since I don't want to write the same thing over, I like the format, I hope you don't mind it:
> ...


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 It does sound like the SM64 is your best option. Can't fault the bass on it and the mids are very good aside from a slight upper mid dip (the opposite of a KC06 in that respect). Also, the top end is not flat in the sense of an SD-2 or even HiFiMan RE272, but it's refined and not harsh. There aren't many warmer-sounding IEMs with outright flat treble.
  
 My other recommendation would be the Sony XBA-H3 - it has smoother and more refined highs and a thicker, more full-bodied sound but gives up some of the clarity and bass control of the SM64.


----------



## encoreAC

ljokerl said:


> No, no chance of sleeping in them - not on your side, at least.
> 
> 
> Thanks!
> ...


 
  
 Thank you for your answer Joker,
  
 I actually enjoy the upper-mid raise of my KC06A, I wonder if this will annoy me on the SM64. Did you review the v2 of the SM64? The v2 are supposed to be warmer with less treble than the v1. The housing of the Sony seem very bulky too me, I would prefer to avoid that.
  
 People also recommended me the Shure 535, what do you think how they compare to the SM64 especially the midrange?


----------



## ozziecook

I guess I should be sleeping with my wife more than my IEMs 
I'm reconsidering the Sonys. Btw I'm pairing an X3 with C5 amp and using Betron IEMs for now. Don't know if you have Betrons over there but they get very good reviews on Amazon UK here. Embarrassed to say they cost me £5.99!
They do a surprisingly good job as it goes (better than the RockJaws anyway). I think there must be a manufacturing factor at play here when it comes to individual phones, at certain levels at least, as i had another pair of Betrons and they were poor. 
Anyway - back to, broadly speaking, the quest for richness/lushness, detail and deep soundstaging, What do you think about the JVC Fx-850? Sounds like they have a special timbre about them when it comes to stringed and woodwind instruments - which sounds interesting. 
Thanks again for your time. Tell me where to get off if necessary cos we all have lives beyond phones, do we not.


----------



## Love Music

Hello Joker,
  
 I'm looking for an iem that is warm, rich, full bodied, lush but not bass heavy so that it does not affect the clarity of the midrange, since I want the mids/vocals to be crystal clear and forward/full. I also like good details and a slight brightness in the upper mids/treble, with good extension but never harsh/sibilant and still forgiving. In terms of presentation I like a wide and tall soundstage with airy vocals and excellent separation, speed and 3D imaging.
  
 Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

encoreac said:


> Thank you for your answer Joker,
> 
> I actually enjoy the upper-mid raise of my KC06A, I wonder if this will annoy me on the SM64. Did you review the v2 of the SM64? The v2 are supposed to be warmer with less treble than the v1. The housing of the Sony seem very bulky too me, I would prefer to avoid that.
> 
> People also recommended me the Shure 535, what do you think how they compare to the SM64 especially the midrange?


 
  
 I believe it was the original SM64 but I'm not sure at this point - it's been quite a while. The SE535 is a respectable earphone with very nice mids, it just never really blew me away. Also, if you found the UM3X too flat (especially in the bass region) the SE535 really won't do it for you.
  


ozziecook said:


> I guess I should be sleeping with my wife more than my IEMs
> I'm reconsidering the Sonys. Btw I'm pairing an X3 with C5 amp and using Betron IEMs for now. Don't know if you have Betrons over there but they get very good reviews on Amazon UK here. Embarrassed to say they cost me £5.99!
> They do a surprisingly good job as it goes (better than the RockJaws anyway). I think there must be a manufacturing factor at play here when it comes to individual phones, at certain levels at least, as i had another pair of Betrons and they were poor.
> Anyway - back to, broadly speaking, the quest for richness/lushness, detail and deep soundstaging, What do you think about the JVC Fx-850? Sounds like they have a special timbre about them when it comes to stringed and woodwind instruments - which sounds interesting.
> Thanks again for your time. Tell me where to get off if necessary cos we all have lives beyond phones, do we not.


 
  
 No experience with the FX850. The last JVC FX-series set I tried (FX700) was a little more v-shaped and less forgiving than the XBA-H3 and SM64, and didn't have the bass quality of the SM64, either. 
  


love music said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> I'm looking for an iem that is warm, rich, full bodied, lush but not bass heavy so that it does not affect the clarity of the midrange, since I want the mids/vocals to be crystal clear and forward/full. I also like good details and a slight brightness in the upper mids/treble, with good extension but never harsh/sibilant and still forgiving. In terms of presentation I like a wide and tall soundstage with airy vocals and excellent separation, speed and 3D imaging.
> 
> Thank you.


 
  
 Warm tone usually comes with some degree of bass enhancement and/or treble reduction - an earphone that has flat bass and some brightness in the upper mids/treble likely won't sound warm. Likewise, earphones with any amount of boost in the upper mids/treble will not be nearly as forgiving as those with a dip there. 
  
  
 All that said, your requirements read to me like a Unique Melody Miracle.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> Warm tone usually comes with some degree of bass enhancement and/or treble reduction - an earphone that has flat bass and some brightness in the upper mids/treble likely won't sound warm. Likewise, earphones with any amount of boost in the upper mids/treble will not be nearly as forgiving as those with a dip there.
> 
> 
> All that said, your requirements read to me like a Unique Melody Miracle.


 
 I see. I forgot to mention that my budget is around $400.


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> I see. I forgot to mention that my budget is around $400.


 
  
 ATH-CK100 is the closest I can think of but they don't make that anymore. Other than that - beats me..


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> ATH-CK100 is the closest I can think of but they don't make that anymore. Other than that - beats me..


 
 Funnily, I actually have the CK100...
  
 What do you think it's a cheaper alternative to the Fitear togo 334 with around the same level of performance?


----------



## ericr

love music said:


> Funnily, I actually have the CK100...
> 
> What do you think it's a cheaper alternative to the Fitear togo 334 with around the same level of performance?




Maybe the 1964Ears V6-Stage made in universal fit would get you close (if you can stretch your budget).


----------



## thug behram

Joker,

Planning to review the ATH-IM lineup? They look great on paper.


----------



## shultzee

ericr said:


> Maybe the 1964Ears V6-Stage made in universal fit would get you close (if you can stretch your budget).


 

 I just don't see anywhere on the 1964 site where the V6 universals can be ordered?  Is there a secret to this


----------



## jelt2359

V6 discontinued. V6S, you just contact them and say you want a universal demo version.


----------



## ericr

Many have received a $25 discount code for universals as well, so ask about that if you email them.

Also there is a comment field at the end of the online order form and I entered something like "Universal fit (no impressions)".


----------



## wgrish7

Any opinions on the new MEElectronics M6 PRO?
 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

thug behram said:


> Joker,
> 
> Planning to review the ATH-IM lineup? They look great on paper.


 
  
 Tried the IM50 briefly and thought it was quite good, but no plans to get a pair in for full review at this time.
  


wgrish7 said:


> Any opinions on the new MEElectronics M6 PRO?
> Thanks


 
  
 Never tried it. Surprised I didn't notice it at CES but I guess it looks like a regular M6.


----------



## spacemanspliff

Any opinions on the best iem around $50? My JVCs are dieing on me as I type.


----------



## jant71

spacemanspliff said:


> Any opinions on the best iem around $50? My JVCs are dieing on me as I type.


 
 What JVC do you have atm?? I would say to check out the new JVC that are on the way. The FR100X, slated for March, are a few weeks away.  Street price will be $50 or probably even less at some places.
 http://av.jvc.com/product.jsp?modelId=MODL029466&pathId=162&page=2&styleId=V


----------



## spacemanspliff

jant71 said:


> What JVC do you have atm?? I would say to check out the new JVC that are on the way. The FR100X, slated for March, are a few weeks away.  Street price will be $50 or probably even less at some places.
> http://av.jvc.com/product.jsp?modelId=MODL029466&pathId=162&page=2&styleId=V


 
 The older version of those. They have the XX branded on them. I paid $7 for them on clearance at kmart lol. I need something sooner though. I have lost the left channel.


----------



## Dobrescu George

some creative in ear, or steel series... i am not sure if on that budget you can fiind any creative aurvana in ear, or some steel series flux or something similar...


----------



## spacemanspliff

dobrescu george said:


> some creative in ear, or steel series... i am not sure if on that budget you can fiind any creative aurvana in ear, or some steel series flux or something similar...


 
 Thanks but I will kill those in short order. I need pretty sturdy wiring. Perhaps I need to look at workout iems.


----------



## Dobrescu George

then, sennheiser cx200 are a little harder to break
  
 sennheiser cx 300-II precision are good sounding and pretty durable. cheap also...
  
 Akg k374 are nice, probably even sennheiser ie4 can fit in your budget. i have no ideea what they cost for you, in europe sennheiser tends to be cheaper, and other brands more expensive...
  
 these 4 should fir in your money, sound pretty nice and are pretty durable... these come to my mind, there are far better probably..


----------



## jekostas

Great thread as always, Joker
  
 What should I be looking at if I wanted a straight shot upgrade from the JVC FXT90?  Nothing wrong with mine, just getting the upgrade itch.


----------



## suman134

spacemanspliff said:


> Any opinions on the best iem around $50? My JVCs are dieing on me as I type.


 

  Get the im-50 if its close to $50 or the ttpod-t1 or even the vsd3. you will be happy.


----------



## xtwargodtx

spacemanspliff said:


> Any opinions on the best iem around $50? My JVCs are dieing on me as I type.


ttpod t1-e's really amazing for the price I got them for $42 cad they have one of the most surreal mids I've listened to


----------



## ljokerl

spacemanspliff said:


> Any opinions on the best iem around $50? My JVCs are dieing on me as I type.


 
  
 If durability is very important and you want to stick with a bass-heavy sound, maybe the RHA MA350? Not the best or most accurate-sounding set, but it hits those two requirements very well.
  


jekostas said:


> Great thread as always, Joker
> 
> What should I be looking at if I wanted a straight shot upgrade from the JVC FXT90?  Nothing wrong with mine, just getting the upgrade itch.


 
  
 I've always thought the 1964EARS 1964-V3 was a good upgrade from those JVCs


----------



## quartertone

Any plans to test the FX850?


----------



## Poimandres

How about the Shure 846?


----------



## spacemanspliff

What about simply durable? i really just listen to podcasts. I would like a right angle plug too. Thanks. Headfiers are amazingly helpful as always.


----------



## suman134

spacemanspliff said:


> What about simply durable? i really just listen to podcasts. I would like a right angle plug too. Thanks. Headfiers are amazingly helpful as always.


 

  Just durable? You can try the S0, nice cable, metal body too.


----------



## Dobrescu George

I have a question, @ljokerl , What are the best universals, in the best soundstage, the largest soundstage, to have bass, best details, and best treble extension?.. Simple, i want just the best that can be universals, considering these factors.
  
  
  
  
  


spacemanspliff said:


> What about simply durable? i really just listen to podcasts. I would like a right angle plug too. Thanks. Headfiers are amazingly helpful as always.


 
 how do you think that you wear them mostly? 
 Like @suman134 said, s0 are very sturdy, also SS are sturdy... 
 Sennheiser ocx685i are more durable.. sennheiser cx3.00 are pretty hard to break... pioneer se e721 should be good too...
  
 i use mye ie8 for working out... they are durable, but cost aroun 300$...


----------



## Love Music

ericr said:


> Maybe the 1964Ears V6-Stage made in universal fit would get you close (if you can stretch your budget).


 
 Thanks for the suggestion but it is over my budget unfortunately. I''ll just wait and see what Joker thinks will be a cheaper togo 334 alternative with around the same performance.


----------



## howdy

quartertone said:


> Any plans to test the FX850?



 


+++++1


----------



## proedros

dobrescu george said:


> I have a question, @ljokerl , What are the best universals, in the best soundstage, the largest soundstage, to have bass, best details, and best treble extension?.. Simple, i want just the best that can be universals, considering these factors.


 
  
 skerry , i am starting to believe you are simply trolling us , asking the same questions again and again and again 2 months now 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 just buy one TOTL iem , and if you don't like it sell it , buy another one - repeat the procedure
  
 there is no such thing as 'the best' - there is only 'the one you like more' and this you will find out by buying/trying out iems
  
 start buying pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee


----------



## encoreAC

proedros said:


> skerry , i am starting to believe you are simply trolling us , asking the same questions again and again and again 2 months now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 I agree...


----------



## shultzee

proedros said:


> skerry , i am starting to believe you are simply trolling us , asking the same questions again and again and again 2 months now
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Kind of like wash, rinse, repeat.....


----------



## Dobrescu George

well... i asked a different question every single time... but oh well... i was searching for a different signature every single time i was asking for help... because i am still discovering what type of signature i like.. 
  
 why would you answer not nice to a person that asks a question more than one time?
  
 most people feel the need for assurance in what they do.. i just like to read and hear people's thoughts... i am going to buy, if i keep my mind like this, probably all the universal flagships, ultrasone iq, ie800 and k3003, i am wondering if there is an universal version of a custom, or something that i cannot fiind in romania that is better than these ones
  
 sorry for being so persistent, and i apologize for being anoying and asking the same things over and over again...


----------



## encoreAC

dobrescu george said:


> well... i asked a different question every single time... but oh well... i was searching for a different signature every single time i was asking for help... because i am still discovering what type of signature i like..
> 
> why would you answer not nice to a person that asks a question more than one time?
> 
> ...


 
 Just get the JVC-FX850 and save the rest of your money for college or something. Jumping on these giants is not always good.


----------



## AUDIOBREEDER

encoreac said:


> Just get the JVC-FX850 and save the rest of your money for college or something. Jumping on these giants is not always good.


 
 How do these compare with Sony EX1000?


----------



## Bluess

audiobreeder said:


> How do these compare with Sony EX1000?



A seller I know claimed the Ex1000 and fx850 have the same signature, the ex1k has better soundfield while the fx850 is more fun


----------



## Koolpep

bluess said:


> A seller I know claimed the Ex1000 and fx850 have the same signature, the ex1k has better soundfield while the fx850 is more fun




I own the JVC and heard a friends ex1000. The JVC ha so much more low end impact. Soundstage is indeed a bit bigger on the sony. Sound signature wise I am not so sure of calling them the same. The JVC is definitively fun and refined but I might give the Sony the detail advantage but sonic memory over a few weeks is not really reliable....after hearing the Sony I am not tempted to replace the JVC with them. Hope that helps.


----------



## ljokerl

quartertone said:


> Any plans to test the FX850?


 
  
 Not at this time.
  


poimandres said:


> How about the Shure 846?


 
  
 Have it, hate the size. Hurts my ears after 30 mins or so. Don't think I can be fair evaluating the sound of it for that reason so I haven't used it much.
  


spacemanspliff said:


> What about simply durable? i really just listen to podcasts. I would like a right angle plug too. Thanks. Headfiers are amazingly helpful as always.


 

 Philips O'Neill Tread 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


love music said:


> Thanks for the suggestion but it is over my budget unfortunately. I''ll just wait and see what Joker thinks will be a cheaper togo 334 alternative with around the same performance.


 
  
 Hmm... maybe EarSonics SM3 or even SM2? Although the TG334 does not sound like what you were asking for previously - it doesn't exactly have treble sparkle - the opposite, actually.


----------



## ozziecook

Help for Skerry:
I just received my FX850's this morning. Only played them a little while but highly recommend them if you love big sounds, with deep and luscious timbre on string and wind instruments. Seem to envelop you in warm tones. 
There seems enough detail too on the mids and highs...and the soundstage and separation is plenty good enough for me. The closest i've heard to a headphone in an IEM. At the moment I haven't noticed any difference in size of soundstage between these and the Havi's. In fact the 850s for me sound bigger just because they seem to envelop you more. They're very male v more female sounding Havi's. Yes they're coloured. But hey so what if you enjoy them. Just a bit of b/g hiss using my C5/X3 pairing which is mildly irritating. So far so good at least. Good value but not heard the ie8, 800's and all the big boys etc to compare.


----------



## spacemanspliff

suman134 said:


> Just durable? You can try the S0, nice cable, metal body too.




Sorry. What is the so?


----------



## ricciox

xiaomi piston 2 or soundmagic E10 which do you recommend?


----------



## peter123

spacemanspliff said:


> Sorry. What is the so?




Brainwavz S0, and I agree it's very solid built and sounds great.


----------



## spacemanspliff

ok. Been wanting to try brainwavz.


----------



## jamor

Hello Joker.  How are you doing?
  
 I have the RHA ma750 and most people including yourself (I believe) would consider them a warm headphone.  I myself find them to be a little bit bright even compared to my ATH-M50s which I prefer.  But at louder volumes the ma750s hurt my ears.
  
 Since I seem to be very sensitive to brightness (treble/highs?), would you suggest any IEM brands that are even warmer like the M50s?  
  
 I love bass and lows so that isn't something I have an issue with.  
  
 If I reduce around EQ 6k - 14k it is a lot easier for me to listen to.


----------



## sokre

I m in the market for new iem.
  
 Budget is 200euro.
  
 I need durable iem for sports (gym and running).
 I d like good isolation, and overall great sound (I have Sennheiser HD600 that i like but since these get no use I ll probably sell them and fund new iems). I dont like bassy phones, balanced is key word. Neutral would be best.
 I currently have AKG K323XS that are great, but I dont know how long these are going to last (have these 6 months)
  
 Comfort is a must, as is good build quality (that is pretty imortant, I d like detachable cable since that is what i destroy first).
 Amp requirement is a big NO (I have fiio e11k that I love but it would be trouble to run with it)
 I was thinking ie80 (but am affraid of lots of fakes), but I am open to other suggestions. 
  
 Used is also an option.


----------



## Dynamoes1

Shure earphones are excellent for build and for fit (top notch). The SE215's aren't anywhere near neutral though, although when you're really running hard don't really seem like something I would want. The extra bit of low end is helpful, especially for motivation. The 215's are what I use and they are perfect for me. Plus, detachable cable. You get used to the sound eventually anyways


----------



## suman134

spacemanspliff said:


> ok. Been wanting to try brainwavz.


 

  If you are open to it, S0 is the best one to start with from brainwavz.


----------



## ljokerl

ricciox said:


> xiaomi piston 2 or soundmagic E10 which do you recommend?


 
  
 I generally prefer the Piston but it depends on what you're after. For warmer sound with heavier bass the Piston2 is a much better match but for more neutral sound with not as much bass depth/punch or warmth, the E10 is better.
  


jamor said:


> Hello Joker.  How are you doing?
> 
> I have the RHA ma750 and most people including yourself (I believe) would consider them a warm headphone.  I myself find them to be a little bit bright even compared to my ATH-M50s which I prefer.  But at louder volumes the ma750s hurt my ears.
> 
> ...


 
  
 That or you're not getting a very good seal with them, which tends to increase perceived treble presence in that range.
  
 There are a few earphones that are bass-heavy but significantly more smooth than the MA750. These are the ones that come to mind:
  
 Beats by Dre Tour 2.0 (pretty decent basshead earphones with very smooth treble)
 UBSOUND Fighter (similar to the Beats, just cheaper and a bit less refined)
 Sony MH1C (not as much bass as the above two but very smooth and more accurate overall)
 NHT SuperBuds (these are bass monsters, even next to the Beats, but they are quite smooth)
  


sokre said:


> I m in the market for new iem.
> 
> Budget is 200euro.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Detachable cables really limits your options. Westone W10 has them and is both more comfortable and more neutral than the SE215. Neither is sweatproof as far as I know. The Westone ADV Alpha is sweat-resistant but it sounds pretty bad with too much of a bass tilt. The IE8/IE80 is not very neutral, either.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> Hmm... maybe EarSonics SM3 or even SM2? Although the TG334 does not sound like what you were asking for previously - it doesn't exactly have treble sparkle - the opposite, actually.


 
 As long as it's not overly dark I think I should be fine. My main criteria is warm/rich/full, forward/clear/full airy mids/vocals and big soundstage. I remember trying the SM3 for a brief moment and found vocals to be really thick/dense and seemed to lose out on clarity because of this. Although I never got a good fit and I only tried it for a very short period of time so i'm not quite sure. Do you think the XBA A3 meets my criteria? Does it sound similar to the TG334?


----------



## sokre

@ljokerl Tnx
  
 But I wouldnt mind spending a bit more (shure se215 are $99).
 up to $300 
 So Shure 535 used are round $300, IE80 (used go for under $200), westone maybe, or should I skip it all and save for custom iem?
  
 Any experience with Custom Art Music One?
 Silicone custom iem (so for sports these shoud be much better than acrylic). 
 These are from Poland, so I would avoid customs and taxes since I m in EU too.
  
 It would be a bit above my budget (basic model is 189euro, detachable cable 225, but I don t know how much does it cost to get my ear impressions done and where)
  
 One more thing.
 I have HD600 Sennheiser and I really like them. Dont know if there is anything in my price range that is as good (doesnt have to be the same sound signature, just I wouldnt like to buy much inferior IEMs)


----------



## Wildcatsare1

@ljokerl, thanks for a great Thread!!!

Tried out the Alclair CIEMS yesterday, great products, ended up going with the RSM over the Reference, the extra driver made a small but very noticeable difference on the extremes.

Couple of questions, first, are you going to review Alclair's RSM? Given your review on the Reference, I really think you would love them. Second, what are your thoughts on aftermarket cables? Thanks!


----------



## esteebin

ljokerl said:


> There are a few earphones that are bass-heavy but significantly more smooth than the MA750. These are the ones that come to mind:
> 
> Beats by Dre Tour 2.0 (pretty decent basshead earphones with very smooth treble)
> UBSOUND Fighter (similar to the Beats, just cheaper and a bit less refined)
> ...




This is the first time I'm hearing of the NHT SuperBuds. Do you have a review coming up? Thanks.


----------



## mdiogofs

sokre said:


> @ljokerl
> Tnx
> 
> But I wouldnt mind spending a bit more (shure se215 are $99).
> ...




Stagediver SD-2?


----------



## jamor

ljokerl said:


> There are a few earphones that are bass-heavy but significantly more smooth than the MA750. These are the ones that come to mind:
> 
> Beats by Dre Tour 2.0 (pretty decent basshead earphones with very smooth treble)
> UBSOUND Fighter (similar to the Beats, just cheaper and a bit less refined)
> ...


 
  
 I'm really liking the NHT Superbuds i think I might get those thanks


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> As long as it's not overly dark I think I should be fine. My main criteria is warm/rich/full, forward/clear/full airy mids/vocals and big soundstage. I remember trying the SM3 for a brief moment and found vocals to be really thick/dense and seemed to lose out on clarity because of this. Although I never got a good fit and I only tried it for a very short period of time so i'm not quite sure. Do you think the XBA A3 meets my criteria? Does it sound similar to the TG334?


 
  
 No experience with the XBA-A3.
  


sokre said:


> @ljokerl Tnx
> 
> But I wouldnt mind spending a bit more (shure se215 are $99).
> up to $300
> ...


 
  
 My Custom Art Music One review is on the 1st page of this thread. It's a very good earphone for the money. 
  


wildcatsare1 said:


> @ljokerl, thanks for a great Thread!!!
> 
> Tried out the Alclair CIEMS yesterday, great products, ended up going with the RSM over the Reference, the extra driver made a small but very noticeable difference on the extremes.
> 
> Couple of questions, first, are you going to review Alclair's RSM? Given your review on the Reference, I really think you would love them. Second, what are your thoughts on aftermarket cables? Thanks!


 
  
 I had an RSM at one point. Sent it back for a refit and never got it back. Oh well.
  
 As for aftermarket cables, I personally am not a fan. I know some people tout night and day differences between different cables but that has not been my experience. 
  


esteebin said:


> This is the first time I'm hearing of the NHT SuperBuds. Do you have a review coming up? Thanks.


 
  
 Yep, hopefully later this month. They're really bass-heavy (and also just generally heavy...) but pretty good otherwise. Were even better at the $50 introductory price...
  


mdiogofs said:


> Stagediver SD-2?


 
  
 Good match for sound but I don't think they can be had for <$300


----------



## Wildcatsare1

^Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

Updated my IEM Buyer's Guide by sound signature here: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/
  
 New additions for 2015 include the DUNU DN-2000, Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear, Ostry KC06, and VSonic VSD3S. The older VSonic VSD1S has been removed.


----------



## esteebin

For those interested in the NHT SuperBuds, http://www.nhthifi.com/ has a 20% off sale President's day only.
  
 Coupon code is $uperbud$
  
 Edit: too bad the sale is not as good as the $50 introductory price...


----------



## Ap616

ljokerl said:


> Updated my IEM Buyer's Guide by sound signature here: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/
> 
> New additions for 2015 include the DUNU DN-2000, Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear, Ostry KC06, and VSonic VSD3S. The older VSonic VSD1S has been removed.


 
 I think the TTPOD T1-E should be on there at $30, joker. It would be right at home in the Warm and Smooth category, or possibly V-shaped. Good work on the updates; keep at it!


----------



## Inks

I'll say the stuff Joker is missing that are really good deals are
  
 T1E
 Zero Audio Tenore
 KEF M200
 ATH-IM50/70 [for their build mostly but sound is solid]
  
 and perhaps the Titan 1 and Zero Audio Duoza


----------



## ljokerl

inks said:


> I'll say the stuff Joker is missing that are really good deals are
> 
> T1E
> Zero Audio Tenore
> ...


 
  
 Thanks. The only one of these I have here is the Titan 1 but mine's imbalanced and the treble sounds a little off. Otherwise quite decent.
  
 Agreed on the IM50, which is the only other one of these I've tried.


----------



## Inks

Well as you can tell I haven't tried the Titans or Duozas, so can't say those for sure, just seem to be getting quite positive feedback, but you never know with new products.
  
 I have tried the rest and I would say the Tenores are the best sounding of the bunch but also the ones with the worst strain reliefs and cable in terms of durability.


----------



## waynes world

inks said:


> Well as you can tell I haven't tried the Titans or Duozas, so can't say those for sure, just seem to be getting quite positive feedback, but you never know with new products.
> 
> I have tried the rest and I would say the Tenores are the best sounding of the bunch but also the ones with the worst strain reliefs and cable in terms of durability.




Yup, you need to try the douza's.


----------



## ZapX629

waynes world said:


> Yup, you need to try the douza's.


 

 And the Audio Technica CKR9/10 which belong up there with the likes of the DN2000 et al.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the UBSOUND Fighter
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C64) UBSOUND Fighter*
> 
> 
> Added Feb 2015
> ...


 
  
 The latest IEM ranking can be found here.


----------



## lilboozy

@joker base quantity wise do the Apple Earpods have less or more bass than the Momentum In Ears?


----------



## ForeverSymphony

What about the Meelectronics M6 Pro? Quite a step up from the OG M6's, detachable cables, plenty of accessories, respectable build quality and after some burn in, quite a nice sound for the price ($50), thanks ljokerl.


----------



## ljokerl

lilboozy said:


> @joker base quantity wise do the Apple Earpods have less or more bass than the Momentum In Ears?


 
  
 Less. The Momentum is pretty bassy - not a bass monster, but I don't think anyone will find it lacking. 
  


foreversymphony said:


> What about the Meelectronics M6 Pro? Quite a step up from the OG M6's, detachable cables, plenty of accessories, respectable build quality and after some burn in, quite a nice sound for the price ($50), thanks ljokerl.


 
  
 Not sure - I didn't try them at CES when I tried their new Pinnacle so no idea how they sound. The feature set is impressive for $50.


----------



## gearofwar

What a great thread; I have been owning JH13FP but up to this point, i do have to admit there are higher-end models, would be great to see if you could review Noble Kaiser 10 , Roxanne..


----------



## heart banger-97

Hello @joker , I'm thinking about a side grade to my w4r. An iem which is more suitable for my taste.
 I've read your review of A83 and I liked it very much. You have compared it with w40. Do those comparisons between w40 and a83 hold true between w4r and a83?
  
 I want an iem which has a little more air in its treble (currently I'm using sony hybrid tip with my w4r. w4r with silicon tips is way more veil) and a little more engaging and aggressive. vocals are great currently.  A little less bass is rewarding too.
  
  
 Thank you for your help.


----------



## ljokerl

gearofwar said:


> What a great thread; I have been owning JH13FP but up to this point, i do have to admit there are higher-end models, would be great to see if you could review Noble Kaiser 10 , Roxanne..


 
  
 Yeah don't we all wish we could try both of those 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  


heart banger-97 said:


> Hello @joker , I'm thinking about a side grade to my w4r. An iem which is more suitable for my taste.
> I've read your review of A83 and I liked it very much. You have compared it with w40. Do those comparisons between w40 and a83 hold true between w4r and a83?
> 
> I want an iem which has a little more air in its treble (currently I'm using sony hybrid tip with my w4r. w4r with silicon tips is way more veil) and a little more engaging and aggressive. vocals are great currently.  A little less bass is rewarding too.
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, I don't find the W40 to be more than minutely different from the W4/W4R. The comparison should hold up fine.
  
 One thing the A83 doesn't have is less bass than the W40 - it's actually a little punchier. It's also a little less midrange-focused than the W40 - not lacking in presence, but not something I'd call vocal-centric. Otherwise seems like the A83 is quite a good fit for what you're after.


----------



## Eynaz

Hello joker!
 Thank you for this, what you created here has already helped me a lot!
  
 But since I don't really have any experience with IEM's I wanted to ask someone who does: 
 I'm looking for an iem of under 150$, but since there is such a huge variety of different headphones, which seem to be quite similiar I absolutely don't know which headphones I should pick. 
  
 I mostly listen to electronical music, especially Deep House. So I'm actually looking for an iem with a strong base, they should be clear though. Also I like listening to Rock, so I guess the headphones should also do well with faster music.  
  
 The isolation and the microphonics should be good because I'll use them on the way a lot and I prefer to wear them straight down. 
  
 Some help would be really nice.


----------



## ljokerl

eynaz said:


> Hello joker!
> Thank you for this, what you created here has already helped me a lot!
> 
> But since I don't really have any experience with IEM's I wanted to ask someone who does:
> ...


 
  
 The Yamaha EPH-100 would be my pick. Sound signature works really well for electronic music and is still versatile enough for other genres, excellent isolation, and microphonics are good as well.


----------



## BlackJackSound

ljokerl said:


> Added a review of the UBSOUND Fighter




Fascinating review Mr. Joker, very rich in details. I bought the Fighter iems directly from the Ubsound website in December and, to be honest, I'm really satisfied with their build and sound quality. I've got many iems and I generally use them with an iPod touch or an iBasso dx-50. I just finished the burn-in period of around 50 hours, even though they only reccomend 15 on the user guide. I would say that I mostly agree with your great review, except maybe the perception of the bass frequences and the related soundstage. I mean I found them a bit more v-shaped rather than basshead, with detailed Highs, deep and textured Bass and warm Mids a bit backwarded. But the bass never hides the other frequencies in my opinion. For example, I found the Beats you mentioned really basshead, but not the Fighter.. maybe it's just my perception? My most frequent setup is the Fighter together with the dx-50 listening to dance music. Also I found an official video on their video gallery website on Ubsound.com and it seems they talk about a v-shaped signature instead of basshead (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CyQNmfCrHt0). What do you think about that? Do you think the Fighter are actually basshead and not v-shaped at all? thx BJS


----------



## BlackJackSound

ljokerl said:


> Added a review of the UBSOUND Fighter




Fascinating review Mr. Joker, very rich in details. I bought the Fighter iems directly from the Ubsound website in December and, to be honest, I'm really satisfied with their build and sound quality. I've got many iems and I generally use them with an iPod touch or an iBasso dx-50. I just finished the burn-in period of around 50 hours, even though they only reccomend 15 on the user guide. I would say that I mostly agree with your great review, except maybe the perception of the bass frequences and the related soundstage. I mean I found them a bit more v-shaped rather than basshead, with detailed Highs, deep and textured Bass and warm Mids a bit backwarded. But the bass never hides the other frequencies in my opinion. For example, I found the Beats you mentioned really basshead, but not the Fighter.. maybe it's just my perception? My most frequent setup is the Fighter together with the dx-50 listening to dance music. Also I found an official video on the video gallery of the Ubsound website and it seems they talk about a v-shaped signature instead of basshead. What do you think about that? Do you think the Fighter are actually basshead and not v-shaped at all? thx BJS


----------



## jamor

Im starting to really love my RHA ma750s.  The bass is incredible.  I turn down the 5k hz range a little bit or turn on -hip hop- EQ which does something similar and they sound rich and fun without being too bright since my ears are so sensitive to that range (while still retaining plenty of detail and punch in the upper register).
  
 But im seeing a lot of reviewrs for different headphones mention they have the same problem as me with many headphones so Im glad its not just me.  We have dog like hearing I guess.  I've always noticed that high frequency noises from TVs and other things bothered me a lot more than other people that didn't even notice.  Fire trucks and ambulances also hurt my ears pretty bad i feel like im the only one that has to cover my ears.


----------



## Uberclocked

Has anyone here tried the Jlab J6?


----------



## ljokerl

jamor said:


> Im starting to really love my RHA ma750s.  The bass is incredible.  I turn down the 5k hz range a little bit or turn on -hip hop- EQ which does something similar and they sound rich and fun without being too bright since my ears are so sensitive to that range (while still retaining plenty of detail and punch in the upper register).
> 
> But im seeing a lot of reviewrs for different headphones mention they have the same problem as me with many headphones so Im glad its not just me.  We have dog like hearing I guess.  I've always noticed that high frequency noises from TVs and other things bothered me a lot more than other people that didn't even notice.  Fire trucks and ambulances also hurt my ears pretty bad i feel like im the only one that has to cover my ears.


 
  
 Very true, some are definitely more sensitive than others to this sort of thing. To be fair, however, the MA750 has some emphasis in the 4-6k range that a lot of other bass-heavy IEMs don't have. See here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/ReadHeathAcousticsMA750.pdf . I think that's what causes the slight tizz I heard on it as well.
  
 Compare for instance to the UBSOUND mentioned in the post above yours, which sounds smooth in that region: http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/UBSoundFighter.pdf
  
 Or the Beats Tour 2, which also sounds very smooth (but somewhat muddy): http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/BeatsTour2014First.pdf


----------



## Dynamoes1

I am mostly into Rock. The things I'm looking for in my next pair of IEM's is build quality/ergonomics (highest priority) and instrument separation (is that called imaging, not sure on the terms). I have about 200$ to spend and I'm coming from the RE-400's, which I was worried about the build, and the SE215's, where it has an ideal fit and build but the sound makes me want more. What would you recommend?


----------



## ljokerl

dynamoes1 said:


> I am mostly into Rock. The things I'm looking for in my next pair of IEM's is build quality/ergonomics (highest priority) and instrument separation (is that called imaging, not sure on the terms). I have about 200$ to spend and I'm coming from the RE-400's, which I was worried about the build, and the SE215's, where it has an ideal fit and build but the sound makes me want more. What would you recommend?


 
  
 Three come to mind:
 TDK BA200 - pretty good build and excellent ergonomics. Sounds is similar to the RE-400 with some improvements here and there
 VSonic GR07 - similarly good build and good ergonomics but with a bit more bass punch and less laid-back treble with a bit of sibilance
 Phonak PFE 112 - another set that's extremely comfortable and decently well-made, but with a flatter sound profile than the VSonics and a less warm/more bright one than the TDKs


----------



## BlackJackSound

ljokerl said:


> Compare for instance to the UBSOUND mentioned in the post above yours, which sounds smooth in that region: http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/UBSoundFighter.pdf
> 
> Or the Beats Tour 2, which also sounds very smooth (but somewhat muddy): http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/BeatsTour2014First.pdf




Hello Mr. Joker,
as I've seen you didn't reply directly to my question/post regarding the Ubsound Fighter signature, please consider that my post was only a personal point of view, but obviously I fully believe in your perception instead of mine, due to your undisputed huge esperience 
Probably my devices and the music I used, were not enough to test them clearly. Thx.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

blackjacksound said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > Compare for instance to the UBSOUND mentioned in the post above yours, which sounds smooth in that region: http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/UBSoundFighter.pdf
> ...




Smooth doesn't mean glossed over or not detailed


----------



## Wildcatsare1

I am really enjoying the Dunu Titans and Zero Audio Duozas, both with Comply TX200's, great, modestly priced IEM's!!!!


----------



## waynes world

wildcatsare1 said:


> I am really enjoying the Dunu Titans and Zero Audio Duozas, both with Comply TX200's, great, modestly priced IEM's!!!!


 
  
 Yup, you speak the truth!


----------



## ayao

Hello Joker!
  
 I was wondering if you have had the time to listen to the FLC-8's, and if you can provide any general impressions. I haven't really found much information about these earphones despite the fact that there are already some measurements on Innerfidelity. Do the drivers perform on the same level/tier as the DN-2000? How's the soundstage?
  
 Thanks for the hard work you've put into this thread! I've gone from Meelec to 1964Ears in the past four years because of your reviews =)


----------



## ALuckyChance

My VSD3S broke after 3 months of use. I loved the weird-looking things, but the treble was just way too much for me and I had to equalize it down considerably on my mp3 player. Everything else about it sound-wise I thoroughly enjoyed.
  
 Is there an IEM around the VSD3S's price that eases down on the highs, is maybe a bit sturdier in construction, and still sounds great?


----------



## encoreAC

aluckychance said:


> My VSD3S broke after 3 months of use. I loved the weird-looking things, but the treble was just too much for me and I had to equalize it down considerably on my mp3 player.
> 
> Is there an IEM around that price that eases down on the highs, is maybe a bit sturdier in construction, and still sounds great?


 
 Ostry KC06A


----------



## jam3s121

could anyone recommend $40-$65 iem well suited for gym use?
  
 I find that over ear cables are not really comfortable for my ears, nor are ear hooks. I like how bose/jbl have those iems with ear anchors but I demo'd the jbl reflect and found them lacking.
  
 Preferably with balanced sound or slight bass emphasis but nothing bright or high treble. capable of using foam tips be ncie also.


----------



## suman134

jam3s121 said:


> could anyone recommend $40-$65 iem well suited for gym use?
> 
> I find that over ear cables are not really comfortable for my ears, nor are ear hooks. I like how bose/jbl have those iems with ear anchors but I demo'd the jbl reflect and found them lacking.
> 
> Preferably with balanced sound or slight bass emphasis but nothing bright or high treble. capable of using foam tips be ncie also.


 

  I dont think you will get what you want at this price, the closest i can think of is the Ath-ckx5. Or else you can try the Brainwavz S0, nice build and will last you long in the gym.


----------



## ljokerl

ayao said:


> Hello Joker!
> 
> I was wondering if you have had the time to listen to the FLC-8's, and if you can provide any general impressions. I haven't really found much information about these earphones despite the fact that there are already some measurements on Innerfidelity. Do the drivers perform on the same level/tier as the DN-2000? How's the soundstage?
> 
> Thanks for the hard work you've put into this thread! I've gone from Meelec to 1964Ears in the past four years because of your reviews =)


 
  
 No, I haven't had a chance to use them. I sent them off for measurements and just got them back recently. 
  


aluckychance said:


> My VSD3S broke after 3 months of use. I loved the weird-looking things, but the treble was just way too much for me and I had to equalize it down considerably on my mp3 player. Everything else about it sound-wise I thoroughly enjoyed.
> 
> Is there an IEM around the VSD3S's price that eases down on the highs, is maybe a bit sturdier in construction, and still sounds great?


 
  
 Sorry, the VSD3S is quite possibly the best I've heard in its class and what you're asking for would be a straight up upgrade, at the same price. That would be one amazing IEM, though.
  


jam3s121 said:


> could anyone recommend $40-$65 iem well suited for gym use?
> 
> I find that over ear cables are not really comfortable for my ears, nor are ear hooks. I like how bose/jbl have those iems with ear anchors but I demo'd the jbl reflect and found them lacking.
> 
> Preferably with balanced sound or slight bass emphasis but nothing bright or high treble. capable of using foam tips be ncie also.


 
  
 The ATH-CKX5 has those ear fittings and works rather well for active use but it has a v-shaped sound with plenty of bass and somewhat edgy treble (nothing offensive, but not what I'd call smooth). Not a lot of other sports earphones with a cable-down fit out there. If you relax the earfin/sports requirement then you have some options, such as the Rock-It R-20, ViSang VS-K1, Brainwavz M1, etc., but without earfins they may not be all that secure in the ear during active use, and sweat resistance is questionable.


----------



## ALuckyChance

ljokerl said:


> Sorry, the VSD3S is quite possibly the best I've heard in its class and what you're asking for would be a straight up upgrade, at the same price. That would be one amazing IEM, though.


 
 At what price point would I be able to get what I'm wanting?


----------



## ozkan

aluckychance said:


> My VSD3S broke after 3 months of use. I loved the weird-looking things, but the treble was just way too much for me and I had to equalize it down considerably on my mp3 player. Everything else about it sound-wise I thoroughly enjoyed.
> 
> Is there an IEM around the VSD3S's price that eases down on the highs, is maybe a bit sturdier in construction, and still sounds great?


 
  
 If you will be ok with a bit mid-forward sound, check the IM50 which is around the same price. It is also sturdier than VSD3S.


----------



## jam3s121

ljokerl said:


> No, I haven't had a chance to use them. I sent them off for measurements and just got them back recently.
> 
> 
> Sorry, the VSD3S is quite possibly the best I've heard in its class and what you're asking for would be a straight up upgrade, at the same price. That would be one amazing IEM, though.
> ...


 

 I don't necessary need the earfins, just something durable for the gym that is warm or balanced that can be worn cable down. I can probably do over the ear but if they have hooks or some kind of bendable plastic that keeps it in place it bothers my ears when they get stuck between my glasses.


----------



## B9Scrambler

jam3s121 said:


> I don't necessary need the earfins, just something durable for the gym that is warm or balanced that can be worn cable down. I can probably do over the ear but if they have hooks or some kind of bendable plastic that keeps it in place it bothers my ears when they get stuck between my glasses.


 

 Sony AS800AP! Under-appreciated little iem. They're waterproof as well.


----------



## ljokerl

aluckychance said:


> At what price point would I be able to get what I'm wanting?


 
  
  
 If you can give up a bit of bass boost and some ergonomics, the Brianwavz R3 may be a good one. Very smooth treble. Usually runs $130 but has been down to $90-ish. With a little less clarity and somewhat duller treble, but arguably even better build than the R3, the Shure SE215 is an option as well.
  
  
 Most of the other ones I would recommend for that sort of sound within a reasonable price range will not beat the construction of the VSonics (e.g. SteelSeries Flux and Flux Pro, Fischer Silver Bullet, Phonak 022)


----------



## suman134

Joker, have you tried the VSD5?


----------



## bonfirehay

Can you review Koss "The Plug" foam tip IEM, particularly in terms of sound isolation? 
  
 http://www.koss.com/en/products/headphones/earbuds/PLUG__Plug_In-Ear_Headphone


----------



## suman134

bonfirehay said:


> Can you review Koss "The Plug" foam tip IEM, particularly in terms of sound isolation?
> 
> http://www.koss.com/en/products/headphones/earbuds/PLUG__Plug_In-Ear_Headphone


 

  I am not being rude but I dont think he as much time for these. Busy man he is with plenty to take care of.


----------



## bonfirehay

suman134 said:


> I am not being rude but I dont think he as much time for these. Busy man he is with plenty to take care of.


 
  
 You presume that because these are not expensive?


----------



## B9Scrambler

bonfirehay said:


> You presume that because these are not expensive?




Maybe that plus they are quite old? I've been intrigued by them but never bought a pair...


----------



## suman134

bonfirehay said:


> You presume that because these are not expensive?


 
  
  Nope, its nothing like that. Indeed he dont have much time for more. He has plenty of earphones pending to be reviewed.


----------



## suman134

b9scrambler said:


> Maybe that plus they are quite old? I've been intrigued by them but never bought a pair...


 

  I can tell you that they are bassy, i presume these are similar to my long lost pathfinder. Isolation was good but i think any phone will isolate good with Comply tips.


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> Joker, have you tried the VSD5?


 
  
 No, not yet, but I'll probably get one soon. Still have to post full write-ups of the VSD3, VSD3S, and GR07 Classic...
  


bonfirehay said:


> Can you review Koss "The Plug" foam tip IEM, particularly in terms of sound isolation?
> 
> http://www.koss.com/en/products/headphones/earbuds/PLUG__Plug_In-Ear_Headphone


 
  
 I've tried these before but it's been a while - they've been around forever in various flavors. Didn't think the sound was particularly noteworthy and at the time JVC Marshmallows (FX33 or FX34) were better low budget foam-tipped IEMs. I haven't seen much talk of the newest Marshmallows (FX36?) so who knows what's better now.


----------



## suman134

ljokerl said:


> No, not yet, but I'll probably get one soon. Still have to post full write-ups of the VSD3, VSD3S, and GR07 Classic...






 


 Does the classic has equal amount of details as the bass edition? will it get 9.0 or 9.1, whats the difference between vsd3 and vsd3s


----------



## gearofwar

Hi Joker, it seems you are the only here having both JH13FP and HE-560. Would you mind giving me a comparison between them? i'm planning to get HE-560 and wonder if it's an upgrade. Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

suman134 said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > No, not yet, but I'll probably get one soon. Still have to post full write-ups of the VSD3, VSD3S, and GR07 Classic...
> ...


 
  
 It has some minute differences from my old (2010) GR07 but I can't say it's worse so it won't get a different score.
  
 I sent the VSD3 to InnerFidelity for measurements right away - will listen to it when I get it back. 
  


gearofwar said:


> Hi Joker, it seems you are the only here having both JH13FP and HE-560. Would you mind giving me a comparison between them? i'm planning to get HE-560 and wonder if it's an upgrade. Thanks


 
  
 I don't like comparing IEMs to headphones, partly because they just don't give the same experience especially in bass and soundstaging, and partly because I tend to prefer IEMs these days in general. I wouldn't say the HE-560 is an upgrade to the JH13, but it's a rather open-ended question. If you say where you're looking for improvement on the JH13 I may be able to give a more specific answer to whether or not the HE-560 is what you're after.


----------



## gearofwar

ljokerl said:


> I don't like comparing IEMs to headphones, partly because they just don't give the same experience especially in bass and soundstaging, and partly because I tend to prefer IEMs these days in general. I wouldn't say the HE-560 is an upgrade to the JH13, but it's a rather open-ended question. If you say where you're looking for improvement on the JH13 I may be able to give a more specific answer to whether or not the HE-560 is what you're after.


 
 I would like hear your thoughts on this. I do believe CIEM on high-end level could compete in many ways, let's minus that soundstaging thing that headphone has upper hand, I really care more about bass extension, treble, or detail retrieval.
 What would be an upgrade to JH13 in your thought?


----------



## Ardian

Do you know which one is the best between Sennheiser Momentum in ear and Sony EX650? 
Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

gearofwar said:


> I would like hear your thoughts on this. I do believe CIEM on high-end level could compete in many ways, let's minus that soundstaging thing that headphone has upper hand, I really care more about bass extension, treble, or detail retrieval.
> What would be an upgrade to JH13 in your thought?


 
  
 Bass extension is probably on-par objectively but the JH13 has a slight mid-bass boost that can steal attention away from the deep bass, whereas the HE-560 sounds extremely level, so I'd say the HiFiMan has an advantage there. Detail retrieval is awesome on both but I tend to have an easier time hearing fine detail with IEMs so for me this would go to the JH13. Treble - again the HE-560 is flatter and also smoother to my ears.
  


ardian said:


> Do you know which one is the best between Sennheiser Momentum in ear and Sony EX650?
> Thank you.


 
  
 Not sure as I haven't tried the EX650, but if it's anything like the EX600 it will be more balanced and neutral than the v-shaped, somewhat bassy Momentum In-Ear.


----------



## ljokerl

DUNU DN-2000 review added.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1C24) DUNU DN-2000*
> 
> 
> Brief: Second-generation hybrid earphone from DUNU
> ...


 
  
 The overall IEM ranking has been updated here


----------



## richbass

Great review of DN-2K my friend. Now, you must review JVC FX850 and Sony Z5


----------



## Shawn71

Excellent review, and "satisfying comparison" w/GR07 CE (to me  ).......(coz its just that I have from that list 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





) and this review right in time just before the launch of DN2Kj........


----------



## Dobrescu George

considering the price point, sennheiser ie8/ie80 would had been worthy of a comparation.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Hi ljokerl(or anyone with reccomendations, really), 

First off, I'm very very new to better quality of headphones and this community in general. I own a Cx300ii and a HD449(which was honestly dissapointing), and I'm looking at buying another earbud/iem. I prefer wearing my earbuds "normally". I don't wear my CX300ii over the ear, but there have been many many good impressions on the VSD3S, which appears to be an iem that people wear over the ear. My price range is about at the VSD3S, around 65 and below. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance


----------



## Shawn71

trying2learn said:


> Hi ljokerl(or anyone with reccomendations, really),
> 
> First off, I'm very very new to better quality of headphones and this community in general. I own a Cx300ii and a HD449(which was honestly dissapointing), and I'm looking at buying another earbud/iem. I prefer wearing my earbuds "normally". I don't wear my CX300ii over the ear, but there have been many many good impressions on the VSD3S, which appears to be an iem that people wear over the ear. My price range is about at the VSD3S, around 65 and below. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance


 

 Whats your music preference/Genres that you listen to most? that might help others to suggest you close to best with your budget of US$65 tp suit your taste.......And earbuds does'nt isolate much, so IEMs(earphones) are good, for fit,different tip rolling (stock,comply,aftermarket tips for ex to achieve/experiment the sound you want,besides isolation......


----------



## Trying2Learn

I have comfort complys on my CX300ii. And I listen to a little pop, some R&B, but I'd say my taste for music is relatively wide. Bass is nice but I wouldn't give up too much of mid range and high. I got that correct, right? Like sometimes some bassy iems give up some mid and high? Or is it just high? But if it means anything to you, despite me liking bass, I'd still take the VSD3S than VSD3, based on description.


----------



## eyal1983

I really like my Etymotic Research MK5 (59$)
 It has a much better sound than the RE-400 waterline, with similar sig. to the ER4, but a little less treble and slightly more bass. 
  
 You should check it


----------



## Trying2Learn

eyal1983 said:


> I really like my Etymotic Research MK5 (59$)
> It has a much better sound than the RE-400 waterline, with similar sig. to the ER4, but a little less treble and slightly more bass.
> 
> You should check it


Thank you for the suggestion!


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Thank you for the suggestion!


 

  I think you will like the VSD3/s, more. I dont think MK5 has enough detail, i havent tried them but i dont think ETY will push something nicely detailed At this price.


----------



## ljokerl

richbass said:


> Great review of DN-2K my friend. Now, you must review JVC FX850 and Sony Z5


 
  
 No promises on the FX850 but I do have a Z5 . Sounding a little bloated so far for $700, but nice as a warm, borderline basshead IEM.
  


shawn71 said:


> Excellent review, and "satisfying comparison" w/GR07 CE (to me  ).......(coz its just that I have from that list
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks.. I'm excited for the DN-2000J myself. I think the size and weight of the DN-2000 will eliminate it as an option for some people, which is a shame. 
  


trying2learn said:


> Hi ljokerl(or anyone with reccomendations, really),
> 
> First off, I'm very very new to better quality of headphones and this community in general. I own a Cx300ii and a HD449(which was honestly dissapointing), and I'm looking at buying another earbud/iem. I prefer wearing my earbuds "normally". I don't wear my CX300ii over the ear, but there have been many many good impressions on the VSD3S, which appears to be an iem that people wear over the ear. My price range is about at the VSD3S, around 65 and below. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance


 
  
 IMO the VSD3S is one of the better-sounding options in that price range (and you would probably get used to wearing earphones cable-up given time) but there's also quite a few decent options for cable down in that price range - Ostry KC06, Sony MH1C, HiFiMan RE-300, etc. The KC06 is the closest of these to VSD3S performance IMO. A little more focused on the midrange and it won't be as bassy as your CX300, but overall a very nice option for $60. Also might fit the same Complys you're using now on your CX300.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> I think you will like the VSD3/s, more. I dont think MK5 has enough detail, i havent tried them but i dont think ETY will push something nicely detailed At this price.


 
 +1. yeah and 3S have strong bass too......Think he already did some ground work and its VSD3S than VSD3 on his mind too.....


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> +1. yeah and 3S have strong bass too......Think he already did some ground work and its VSD3S than VSD3 on his mind too.....


 

 I am getting the VSD5. I hope its good too.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> I am getting the VSD5. I hope its good too.


 
 I knew you wld end up buying VSD5 over GR07 (that hint  ) ......but giving you another hint, that VSD2 planned to release mar 18th ML china and April globally, price ~us$40......


----------



## Shawn71

If anyone interested, Meelec S6P is on sale thru 03/18 for $19.99 using coupon "SPRINGS6P" with free US shipping and $2.95 OFF intl shipping.......
  
 http://www.meelec.com/Sport_Fi_S6P_Earphone_Workout_Package_p/ep-sf6p-rdbk-mee.htm (grn/blk too)


----------



## Trying2Learn

Thanks all for your comments and suggestions! I see why people love this community already. Looks like I'm gunna go for VSD3S! Now im indecisive about which cables to get(fixed silver plated, detachable copper, detachable silver plated), the three of those in ascending price order.


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Thanks all for your comments and suggestions! I see why people love this community already. Looks like I'm gunna go for VSD3S! Now im indecisive about which cables to get(fixed silver plated, detachable copper, detachable silver plated), the three of those in ascending price order.


 

  Go for Fixed silver. Vsonic is not best with detachable cables. Gets you the silver cable for cheap.


----------



## Jozurr

Hi Joker,
  
 What do you think is a logical upgrade to the RHA MA750?


----------



## suman134

jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> What do you think is a logical upgrade to the RHA MA750?


 
  
 I am not joker but i think Inear stage driver 3 can be seen as one.


----------



## Wildcatsare1

Got my Alclair RSM Quads yesterday, they are incredible, clarity, balance, head stage better than many of my open cans, WOW!!!


----------



## ljokerl

jozurr said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> What do you think is a logical upgrade to the RHA MA750?


 
  
 Upgrade in what way? I.e. what are you looking to retain from the MA750, what are you looking to upgrade, and what are you willing to give up if necessary?
  


wildcatsare1 said:


> Got my Alclair RSM Quads yesterday, they are incredible, clarity, balance, head stage better than many of my open cans, WOW!!!


 
  
 Awesome, I've only tried them briefly but I thought they were quite nice as an upgrade to my Reference. Glad you like them!


----------



## Jozurr

ljokerl said:


> Upgrade in what way? I.e. what are you looking to retain from the MA750, what are you looking to upgrade, and what are you willing to give up if necessary?


 
  
 Upgrade the overall SQ (clarity, timbre, bass quality, soundstage) while retaining the same sound signature. Would like a bigger soundstage if possible. Willing to give up a very slight amount of bass if I have to.
  
 Thanks


----------



## l00l

Thanks for this thread, great starting point!
  
 I am currently looking for new IEMs and want to upgrade from my Sennheiser CX300ii.
 Looking for a good amount of punchy bass, present mids/vocals and no hissing/screeching highs (unlike Beyer DT990 pro). A little stage would be nice as well.
 I will mainly use the IEMs on the go, hence isolation and a comfortable fit are very important. Build quality and durability are too.
  
 I listen to all music genres (rap to classic) and will also use them for movies and sports. Mainly music tough. Will be plugged mainly into my iphone and ipad.
  
 Now, after going through the list of reviewed IMEs and willing to spend max. € 100, I came away researching the following models. All seem to have different flaws based on the reviews and posts I read:
  
 - Brainwavez M2 (did´t do much research yet)
 - Steel Series Pro (did´t do much research yet)
 - Yamaha EPH-M100 (plastic, sound not impressive based on some reviews, maybe not a good value?)
 - RHA MA750 (uncomfortable treble, not well suited for smaller ears)
 - Beyer DTX 102 (bad build quality, cable noise)
 - Sound Magic E10S (not very durable, cheaply built)
  
 Since I can´t make my mind up which IME to get, could anybody please help me decide which ones would fit best based on my needs? If I should consider other models in the same price range I will gladly do that.
  
 grateful for any comments.
  
 thank you!!!


----------



## suman134

l00l said:


> Thanks for this thread, great starting point!
> 
> I am currently looking for new IEMs and want to upgrade from my Sennheiser CX300ii.
> Looking for a good amount of punchy bass, present mids/vocals and no hissing/screeching highs (unlike Beyer DT990 pro). A little stage would be nice as well.
> ...


 

  IT is as complicated as you make it. Let me suggest you the S0, brainwavz S0, will suit you better. Cheap too. Nicely fits your bill.


----------



## williclarkam

Guys, could you please help me out here?
  
 between "DUNU DN-2000" / "Sony XBAH3" / "FIDUE A83" / "Audio Technica ATH-IM03" which one would you choose?
 I listen to music only on the Streets, so comfort is very important, and then Isolation. (and All kind of genres)
  
 Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 Thanks a lot guys.


----------



## thug behram

williclarkam said:


> Guys, could you please help me out here?
> 
> between "DUNU DN-2000" / "Sony XBAH3" / "FIDUE A83" / "Audio Technica ATH-IM03" which one would you choose?
> I listen to music only on the Streets, so comfort is very important, and then Isolation. (and All kind of genres)
> ...


 
 H3 is gonna be too big and annoying for street IMO


----------



## suman134

williclarkam said:


> Guys, could you please help me out here?
> 
> between "DUNU DN-2000" / "Sony XBAH3" / "FIDUE A83" / "Audio Technica ATH-IM03" which one would you choose?
> I listen to music only on the Streets, so comfort is very important, and then Isolation. (and All kind of genres)
> ...


 

  Dn2k will do better, comfort is no problem, and isolation is good too. Others can have fit issues.


----------



## l00l

suman134 said:


> IT is as complicated as you make it. Let me suggest you the S0, brainwavz S0, will suit you better. Cheap too. Nicely fits your bill.




Thanks, I will look into them. They are a lil hard to get tough in Europe. 

Any other suggestions? I was also looking into IEMs that sound similar to the Sennheiser HD 598 since I really liked those for music. But all recommendations are out of my price range.


----------



## BubbaDubBub

Joker, how would you compare the sound signature of the FLC 8 in its neutral setting, to the DUNU DN-2000? How do they compare SQ wise?
 What are the differences in size, as i'm afraid that the DUNU are too large for a comfortable fit in my ear.


----------



## Wildcatsare1

ljokerl said:


> Upgrade in what way? I.e. what are you looking to retain from the MA750, what are you looking to upgrade, and what are you willing to give up if necessary?
> 
> 
> Awesome, I've only tried them briefly but I thought they were quite nice as an upgrade to my Reference. Glad you like them!




Joker, thanks it was The Headphone List that led me to Alclair. When I tried out the universal Reference and RSM, loved them both. The RSM really steps up the bass and soundstage, the center fill is excellent, along with imiging.

Cannot wait to hear Marc's new 8 driver unit!!! Thanks again!


----------



## james444

l00l said:


> Thanks, I will look into them. *They are a lil hard to get tough in Europe*.


 
  
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Brainwavz-BWAVZ-S0-S0-In-Ear-Earphones-Black/dp/B00PACTGXA


----------



## l00l

Continental Europe, Germany to be specific  Can't get em off amazon. Anyways, I will research them and maybe import.


----------



## james444

l00l said:


> Continental Europe, Germany to be specific
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 They ship to Germany for £4.76.


----------



## l00l

Are there any others worth recommending?


----------



## suman134

l00l said:


> Are there any others worth recommending?


 

  I think you can try the hisoundaudio crystals too. I dont know if you can get these from where you are but worth considering. Why not VSD3? it can do good too. In your budget too. Cant say about durability though on these two, The reason i suggested the S0 was because of its build quality, SQ is good but build is awesome. These are good but those cables are not like S0. If you can take care of the cable these are good. I think Vsd3 has a okay cable. Crystals are slightly thinner.


----------



## ljokerl

jozurr said:


> Upgrade the overall SQ (clarity, timbre, bass quality, soundstage) while retaining the same sound signature. Would like a bigger soundstage if possible. Willing to give up a very slight amount of bass if I have to.
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Hmm..  Fidue A83, maybe? It maintains some bass emphasis (not as much as the MA750 of course) and has impressive clarity and soundstage. Biggest difference would probably be in the upper midrange where the MA750 has more emphasis (the A83 has a little more emphasis higher up).
  


williclarkam said:


> Guys, could you please help me out here?
> 
> between "DUNU DN-2000" / "Sony XBAH3" / "FIDUE A83" / "Audio Technica ATH-IM03" which one would you choose?
> I listen to music only on the Streets, so comfort is very important, and then Isolation. (and All kind of genres)
> ...


 
  
 Not sure about the IM03 but among the rest I'd choose the DN-2000. Better isolation and the most versatile sound. 
  


bubbadubbub said:


> Joker, how would you compare the sound signature of the FLC 8 in its neutral setting, to the DUNU DN-2000? How do they compare SQ wise?
> What are the differences in size, as i'm afraid that the DUNU are too large for a comfortable fit in my ear.


 
  
 They're not too different - the FLC is on the same level in terms of performance, just not tuned quite the same. DN-2000 is a little more v-shaped.. has more bass depth and impact and a bit more combined upper mid + treble energy. FLC8 has more midrange presence/less recession. Reminds me a little more of an AudioFly AF180 with extra bass. 
  
 It's difficult to compare the size to the DUNU because the shape is completely different, but the FLC is definitely lighter and for me very comfortable. It's more of an ergonomic form factor like a Shure or Westone unit, except with fatter nozzles that aren't angled. 
  
 It is also technically possible to wear the FLC8 cable down, at least in my ears. Can't say the same for your average Shure or Westone. 
  


wildcatsare1 said:


> Joker, thanks it was The Headphone List that led me to Alclair. When I tried out the universal Reference and RSM, loved them both. The RSM really steps up the bass and soundstage, the center fill is excellent, along with imiging.
> 
> Cannot wait to hear Marc's new 8 driver unit!!! Thanks again!


 
  
 I guess I skipped the full review of the RSM, but maybe I'll get to try the 8.


----------



## l00l

suman134 said:


> I think you can try the hisoundaudio crystals too. I dont know if you can get these from where you are but worth considering. Why not VSD3? it can do good too. In your budget too. Cant say about durability though on these two, The reason i suggested the S0 was because of its build quality, SQ is good but build is awesome. These are good but those cables are not like S0. If you can take care of the cable these are good. I think Vsd3 has a okay cable. Crystals are slightly thinner.


 
  
 Thanks. 
  
 The way I do these things usually is to get the best product I can within my budget or a lilttle over it. This time however there seems to be no clear cut, no second toughts "best IEM under € 100". At least I have not come across one.


----------



## BubbaDubBub

Thanks for the reply! But may I ask how the soundstage of the FLC differ between the DUNU as well? Would you reccomend the FLC over the DUNU, and how would overall SQ be rated for the FLC on your 10 scale?


----------



## suman134

l00l said:


> Thanks.
> 
> The way I do these things usually is to get the best product I can within my budget or a lilttle over it. This time however there seems to be no clear cut, no second toughts "best IEM under € 100". At least I have not come across one.



 


If you want the best iem under 100, let me tell you its impossible to beat the GR07. But, it might not fulfill your needs. Keep no doubt about that. I am not going there because i think you might need some more bass. And for rough use, thicker cable is better.


----------



## nehcrow

suman134 said:


> l00l said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks.
> ...


 
 GR07*BE*
 I'd say is better than the GR07 MK2/Classic


----------



## suman134

nehcrow said:


> GR07*BE*
> I'd say is better than the GR07 MK2/Classic


 
  
 Might get over 100 euro.


----------



## l00l

Yes. And again, hard to get!
  
 I think I will go with the Philips TX2BK. They get good to great reviews, are durable, good sound with punchy bass and even have a mic and nice design.
  
 I am a little concerned about how they will fit into my smaller ears, and somebody even suggested they don´t sound well with iPhones but I feel like if I don´t pull the trigger on them I will never get rid of my Sennheisers


----------



## suman134

l00l said:


> Yes. And again, hard to get!
> 
> I think I will go with the Philips TX2BK. They get good to great reviews, are durable, good sound with punchy bass and even have a mic and nice design.
> 
> I am a little concerned about how they will fit into my smaller ears, and somebody even suggested they don´t sound well with iPhones but I feel like if I don´t pull the trigger on them I will never get rid of my Sennheisers


 
  
 Hmm, get one.


----------



## l00l

I did. Will report on my impressions.


----------



## ljokerl

bubbadubbub said:


> Thanks for the reply! But may I ask how the soundstage of the FLC differ between the DUNU as well? Would you reccomend the FLC over the DUNU, and how would overall SQ be rated for the FLC on your 10 scale?


 
  
 Not much difference on any of those counts. If you like a mildly v/u-shaped sound signature and don't mind its size, I say get the DUNU. If you want a lighter and potentially more comfortable earphone with detachable cables, more neutral performance out of the box, and more flexibility in terms of sound, get the FLC8.


----------



## heart banger-97

Hello IjokerI,
 a quick question. Do you think that she3590 is more prone to sibilance than gr07 or gr07 bass edition? Which one has more treble quantity?
  
 Thanks


----------



## garcsa

Don't afraid from GR07 sibilance! Yes it's prone to it , but really different way than the non biocellulose drivers ones.


----------



## ozkan

garcsa said:


> Don't afraid from GR07 sibilance! Yes it's prone to it , but really different way than the non biocellulose drivers ones.




Really? I think sibilance is the worst thing in an IEM and distracting from enjoying any kind of sound. I just can not stand it and saying don't be afraid is not any good for people who is sensitive to that.


----------



## ozkan

heart banger-97 said:


> Hello IjokerI,
> a quick question. Do you think that she3590 is more prone to sibilance than gr07 or gr07 bass edition? Which one has more treble quantity?
> Thanks




Definitely GR07 is more prone to sibilance than 3590 which has hotter, more sweet treble. GR07 has more treble quantity.


----------



## omastic

ozkan said:


> Really? I think sibilance is the worst thing in an IEM and distracting from enjoying any kind of sound. I just can not stand it and saying don't be afraid is not any good for people who is sensitive to that.


 
 I agree. It is one thing that absolutely kills an iem for me no matter how good everything else is. However, when it comes to GR07, it depends on which version we are talking about. I found the MK2 and BE to be fairly sibilant while the Classic was very, very smooth. Smoother than the Dunu DN1000 which I owned at the same time. It took me by surprise actually.


----------



## suman134

omastic said:


> I agree. It is one thing that absolutely kills an iem for me no matter how good everything else is. However, when it comes to GR07, it depends on which version we are talking about. I found the MK2 and BE to be fairly sibilant while the Classic was very, very smooth. Smoother than the Dunu DN1000 which I owned at the same time. It took me by surprise actually.


 

  Wow!! I think i should get one of those classics, or should i wait for the special edition. Confused.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> Wow!! I think i should get one of those classics, or should i wait for the special edition. Confused.




But not the level of waterline smooth.......


----------



## BubbaDubBub

Thanks again, as always, for the reply joker! I think, I'm leaning more towards the FLC, as the customization options seems very appealing, especially if I don't find the treble sparkly enough. Which leads me to my next question, what is your favorite configuration with the FLC, and how does it compare to other earphones? (Fidue A83, T-Peos Altone 200, Vsonic GR07) And does the removable cable on the FLC use standard MMCX connectors as well, and does it fit flush within your ear? I apologize for the many questions, it's just that there's very little information on the FLC 8, and you know more about it than anyone I'm aware of.


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> But not the level of waterline smooth.......


 

  Waterline is waterline, a beauty.


----------



## garcsa

ozkan said:


> Really? I think sibilance is the worst thing in an IEM and distracting from enjoying any kind of sound. I just can not stand it and saying don't be afraid is not any good for people who is sensitive to that.


 
 Agree. Said that because I got mine Classic before some week ago , and I'm really sensitive about sibilance, too. It's a great thing if somebody can describe how some iem sounds, but you'll never know what is real difference between sibilance and sibilance if you'll don't try.


----------



## ljokerl

heart banger-97 said:


> Hello IjokerI,
> a quick question. Do you think that she3590 is more prone to sibilance than gr07 or gr07 bass edition? Which one has more treble quantity?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 No, the 3590 is less sibilance-prone. The 3590 is somewhat v-shaped but I've never found its treble to be very strong.
  


bubbadubbub said:


> Thanks again, as always, for the reply joker! I think, I'm leaning more towards the FLC, as the customization options seems very appealing, especially if I don't find the treble sparkly enough. Which leads me to my next question, what is your favorite configuration with the FLC, and how does it compare to other earphones? (Fidue A83, T-Peos Altone 200, Vsonic GR07) And does the removable cable on the FLC use standard MMCX connectors as well, and does it fit flush within your ear? I apologize for the many questions, it's just that there's very little information on the FLC 8, and you know more about it than anyone I'm aware of.


 
  
 I haven't tried all the combinations but the "neutral" is nice and the "vocal" is quite fun (reminds me of the old Audio-Technica CK100 somewhat). It can be fairly bright or v-shaped, too, the latter I think on the rap (?) setting. 
  
  
 I haven't written up full comparisons yet but those are coming with the review. The FLC8 seems to be on-par with the high-end top-tiers like the DN-2000 and AudioFly AF180 and StageDiver SD-2. It's hard to compare it to specific earphones on the spot because the signature is variable. 
  
 The cable, sadly, is a 2-pin, not MMCX. It's semi-proprietary with a recessed connector on the cable side (much like the VSonic VC02). It fits somewhat flush in my ears but not like a GR07 because the detachable cable connector is big and the nozzle is longer and fatter compared to the GR07. The upside is that unlike the GR07 it can be worn cable-down fairly easily (easier still if you invert the absolute polarity by flipping both connectors around).


----------



## BubbaDubBub

Thanks again, and I hope to see the full review soon! (It must be quite longer than average) Do you think the FLC provides the most value, because of its flexibility (in terms of features)? It seems like a great value.(Besides the fact I can't seem to find where one would purchase a replacement cable.)


----------



## omastic

suman134 said:


> Wow!! I think i should get one of those classics, or should i wait for the special edition. Confused.


 
 It could well have been my particular pair. I read some time back in one of the GR07 thread that someone has 4 sets of classic edition and each sounds slightly different from one another, with one of the differences being smoothness in the highs.


----------



## suman134

omastic said:


> It could well have been my particular pair. I read some time back in one of the GR07 thread that someone has 4 sets of classic edition and each sounds slightly different from one another, with one of the differences being smoothness in the highs.


 

  Hmmm, lets wait.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Does anyone know how the Sony XBA 1IP's are? I'm wondering how they match up to VSD3S. XBA are calanced armatures, but what type of driver does VSD3S use?


----------



## Shawn71

Single Dynamic.....


----------



## Trying2Learn

And how would that match up to the XBA 1IP's single ba?


----------



## Shawn71

omastic said:


> I read some time back in one of the GR07 thread that someone has 4 sets of classic edition and each sounds slightly different from one another, with one of the differences being smoothness in the highs.


 
 the user is @Airlight......but now he is down to 3 pairs of CE.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> Hmmm, lets wait.


 

 You got my hint right......


----------



## Shawn71

trying2learn said:


> And how would that match up to the XBA 1IP's single ba?


 

 Well, being a single BA there might be more of airy,bass lite to beautiful bass and nice SS,clarity......reckon others to chime in as well....


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Does anyone know how the Sony XBA 1IP's are? I'm wondering how they match up to VSD3S. XBA are calanced armatures, but what type of driver does VSD3S use?


 

  Sound stage is bad, bad dynamics, details are good but cant even beat my she9850, bass is okay, but i dont like it. Its forced and feels Hard, not soft. I like it soft Just like ue600.


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> You got my hint right......


 

  I hope this special edition with Vsd9 driver is good and will be available soon.


----------



## ljokerl

bubbadubbub said:


> Thanks again, and I hope to see the full review soon! (It must be quite longer than average) Do you think the FLC provides the most value, because of its flexibility (in terms of features)? It seems like a great value.(Besides the fact I can't seem to find where one would purchase a replacement cable.)


 
  
 To be honest I hadn't checked what it costs until now, but it looks like under $350, which is very reasonable. It's good out of the box but especially great for someone who likes tinkering. 
  


omastic said:


> It could well have been my particular pair. I read some time back in one of the GR07 thread that someone has 4 sets of classic edition and each sounds slightly different from one another, with one of the differences being smoothness in the highs.


 
  
 May explain why mine still has about as much in the way of sibilance as my GR07 BE.


----------



## CommanerKeen

My GR06 just died on me(well,half died so far),anything to recommend that would sound similar under 100$(Canadian)? Mostly listening to rock


----------



## Trying2Learn

Does anyone know how to make the wires stay in the ear guides better?


----------



## Trying2Learn

I'm wondering how do the UE600vi stack up against VSD3S? I am kinda hesitant to go over the ear type of wearing so I am looking for alternatives but if the VSD3S really is the best for that price, I will go with it. Also, should I be expecting a HUGE difference from my current Cx300ii and the VSD3S? Thanks


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> I'm wondering how do the UE600vi stack up against VSD3S? I am kinda hesitant to go over the ear type of wearing so I am looking for alternatives but if the VSD3S really is the best for that price, I will go with it. Also, should I be expecting a HUGE difference from my current Cx300ii and the VSD3S? Thanks


 

  Yes,
 Vsd3s can be a huge step up from CX300II. Dont go for UE600 if you want bass similar to your CX, 600 is good if you want much balance. Mid forward sound with less sparky but still exciting highs. Vsonics can be sibilant.


----------



## ljokerl

commanerkeen said:


> My GR06 just died on me(well,half died so far),anything to recommend that would sound similar under 100$(Canadian)? Mostly listening to rock


 
  
 If you liked the GR06 in general and don't mind something with a little less midrange emphasis, the VSonic VSD3S would be a good buy. Or the GR07 Classic. Lots of other options out there as well if you'd like to try something more radically different in terms of sound sig. 
  


trying2learn said:


> Does anyone know how to make the wires stay in the ear guides better?


 
  
 If you mean generic over-the-ear cable guides, I've done this by wrapping thin strips of tape around the ends of the guide (where the cable has the most tendency to slip out).


----------



## Trying2Learn

Will it be more sibilant than my Cx300ii?


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Will it be more sibilant than my Cx300ii?


 

 CX300II? sibilant? really? yes, Vsd3/s can be sibilant.


----------



## CommanerKeen

ljokerl said:


> If you liked the GR06 in general and don't mind something with a little less midrange emphasis, the VSonic VSD3S would be a good buy. Or the GR07 Classic. Lots of other options out there as well if you'd like to try something more radically different in terms of sound sig.


 
 Loved the sound of the GR06,that's why I wanted something similar! Wish I could fit the GR07 in my budget


----------



## ljokerl

commanerkeen said:


> Loved the sound of the GR06,that's why I wanted something similar! Wish I could fit the GR07 in my budget


 
  
 Darn, I keep thinking CAD is still 1:1 with USD. Forgot about that. 
  
 VSD3S is still plenty good value at $45 or so.


----------



## Trying2Learn

1. Canadian to US is actually closer to 1.2 - 1, USD worth more but yeah theyre pretty close. 

2. Would a Fiio E6 make a difference with CX300ii, VSD3S, or Senn 449? Would it be just loudness, or actually sound quality? I am wondering if it will make any of them sound better, and if it is worth it. 

3. I have a BMW 335i with the audio package, and I use AUX to AUX on it, would Aux - E6 - Phone configuration make the car's audio system sound any better? Perhaps it already has amp dac stuff inside? I dont know. 

4. If I want to heat shrink on the VSD3S for strain relief, is a lighter safe for the cables if I keep the flame moving? How long would it take for the tube to shrink?

Thanks all!


----------



## ljokerl

trying2learn said:


> 1. Canadian to US is actually closer to 1.2 - 1, USD worth more but yeah theyre pretty close.
> 
> 2. Would a Fiio E6 make a difference with CX300ii, VSD3S, or Senn 449? Would it be just loudness, or actually sound quality? I am wondering if it will make any of them sound better, and if it is worth it.
> 
> ...


 
  
 2. Not with an iPhone
 3. No, You're adding another amplifier between the two you already have in the signal path (car and phone), 
 4. Use a hair dryer or heat gun (or sugru or something).


----------



## Trying2Learn

ljokerl said:


> 2. Not with an iPhone
> 3. No, You're adding another amplifier between the two you already have in the signal path (car and phone),
> 4. Use a hair dryer or heat gun (or sugru or something).



Thank you! I will try to remember


----------



## Shawn71

trying2learn said:


> 1. Canadian to US is actually closer to 1.2 - 1, USD worth more but yeah theyre pretty close.
> 
> 2. Would a Fiio E6 make a difference with CX300ii, VSD3S, or Senn 449? Would it be just loudness, or actually sound quality? I am wondering if it will make any of them sound better, and if it is worth it.
> 
> ...


 

 2) VSD3S does'nt need an amp and are are very good driving raw. I have 429 and heard 449 (loan from my friend) 429 sounded great than 449 using my E11 & E12 but OK with E06 for its price and size, not bad.
  
 3) no. AUX IN does'nt have the DAC functionality in cars/SUV....it an one of the external INPUT (AUXILLIARY) to the car stereo's AMP section. so if you connect an AMP between your source and car's AUX IN there's a 2 stage amplification (3 stages if used HO,and 2 stages if LOD used) which might result in distortion and more coloration and cld damage the speakers if they are very sensitive. So its not needed. but yes you can connect an AMP.
  
 If you have an idevice you can buy a LOD cable and connect directly to AUX IN,best way,no AMP needed......
  
 4) Yes a lighter can be used or a candle for that matter.you have to experiment for timing.


----------



## Trying2Learn

shawn71 said:


> 2) VSD3S does'nt need an amp and are are very good driving raw. I have 429 and heard 449 (loan from my friend) 429 sounded great than 449 using my E11 & E12 but OK with E06 for its price and size, not bad.
> 
> 3) no. AUX IN does'nt have the DAC functionality in cars/SUV....it an one of the external INPUT (AUXILLIARY) to the car stereo's AMP section. so if you connect an AMP between your source and car's AUX IN there's a 2 stage amplification (3 stages if used HO,and 2 stages if LOD used) which might result in distortion and more coloration and cld damage the speakers if they are very sensitive. So its not needed. but yes you can connect an AMP.
> 
> ...



Hmm to be honest, I almost regret my purchase of the 449. Good thing they werent too expensive. I plug it in to my Iphone 6, maybe with amp it will be better?


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Hmm to be honest, I almost regret my purchase of the 449. Good thing they werent too expensive. I plug it in to my Iphone 6, maybe with amp it will be better?


 

  Yes.


----------



## rattledaddy

Joker and Headfis, 
  
 Thanks for all you work and dedication to this thread!!!   
 I am looking for my first pair of CIEMs.  A long time owner and lover of the ER4P/S iems, I seek all the goodnees of the ER4s (detail, clarity, resolution, accuracy and neutrality) but with a more 3D presentation or expanded soundstage.   A bit more kick / bass impact would be cool too.   I'd be willing to swap a wee bit of the analytics for the other attributes. My mobile rig is currently the iBasso  DX90 and the ER4Ps.    I listen to all genres but mostly Prog, Roots, Blue Note Jazz, Classic Rock, Soul, Alt/Indy, Electronica, and Acoustic (bluegrass-celtic, old time).  No mp3s.   The Custom Art Music One/Twos looked interesting as you compared them to the ER4s.   Thoughts??.  What else should be on the evaluation list?   FWIW i use my ETYs in the studio when mixing/mastering/engineering.     Thanks!!


----------



## Wildcatsare1

rattledaddy said:


> Joker and Headfis,
> 
> Thanks for all you work and dedication to this thread!!!
> I am looking for my first pair of CIEMs.  A long time owner and lover of the ER4P/S iems, I seek all the goodnees of the ER4s (detail, clarity, resolution, accuracy and neutrality) but with a more 3D presentation or expanded soundstage.   A bit more kick / bass impact would be cool too.   I'd be willing to swap a wee bit of the analytics for the other attributes. My mobile rig is currently the iBasso  DX90 and the ER4Ps.    I listen to all genres but mostly Prog, Roots, Blue Note Jazz, Classic Rock, Soul, Alt/Indy, Electronica, and Acoustic (bluegrass-celtic, old time).  No mp3s.   The Custom Art Music One/Twos looked interesting as you compared them to the ER4s.   Thoughts??.  What else should be on the evaluation list?   FWIW i use my ETYs in the studio when mixing/mastering/engineering.     Thanks!!




I don't have Jocker's experience, but I think you would absolutely love the Alclair RSM Quads! They were developed for engineers, mixers, and musicians who wanted a stage reference. Neutrel, clarity, phenomenal soundstage, it actually rivals my over-ears in imiging and head-stage. Their Reference received excellent reviews by Joker and Average Joe. PM if you would like further information.


----------



## rattledaddy

Thanks Wildcats! I read the reviews of the reference and thought it a possible. I'll check out the Quad.


----------



## Wildcatsare1

^Rattledaddy, listening to mine, watching March Madness, as I type this post. I am truly amazed everytime I put them in, Jason Molina's "Ghost" is in the room playing.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Just ordered a fixed cable Red/Blue VSD3S! Thanks for all the suggestions. Current expectations are that it will be SIGNIFICANTLY better than my CX300ii, and I hope so. Based on a lot of reviews, it sure seems like it. Thanks again!


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Just ordered a fixed cable Red/Blue VSD3S! Thanks for all the suggestions. Current expectations are that it will be SIGNIFICANTLY better than my CX300ii, and I hope so. Based on a lot of reviews, it sure seems like it. Thanks again!


 

 It is a big step up from cx300II. Keep no doubt.


----------



## Trying2Learn

This is definitely the wrong post but I'm looking for a good bluetooth speaker under 150? Any suggestions? Sorry cause its the wrong post. Maybe a link would help too! Thanks.


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> This is definitely the wrong post but I'm looking for a good bluetooth speaker under 150? Any suggestions? Sorry cause its the wrong post. Maybe a link would help too! Thanks.


 

 There is one from philips, namled like br1 or bx1 something. its good. You can go for some bose too, i dont recall the name but it was just not loud enough. Still its sound was acceptable. I clearly am is not a bluetooth guy.


----------



## B9Scrambler

trying2learn said:


> This is definitely the wrong post but I'm looking for a good bluetooth speaker under 150? Any suggestions? Sorry cause its the wrong post. Maybe a link would help too! Thanks.




I haven't tried them outside of a store, but the Logitech UE Boom speaker is apparently quite good for the price. I think they sit right around that 150 mark. Those might be worth some additional research.


----------



## ljokerl

rattledaddy said:


> Joker and Headfis,
> 
> Thanks for all you work and dedication to this thread!!!
> I am looking for my first pair of CIEMs.  A long time owner and lover of the ER4P/S iems, I seek all the goodnees of the ER4s (detail, clarity, resolution, accuracy and neutrality) but with a more 3D presentation or expanded soundstage.   A bit more kick / bass impact would be cool too.   I'd be willing to swap a wee bit of the analytics for the other attributes. My mobile rig is currently the iBasso  DX90 and the ER4Ps.    I listen to all genres but mostly Prog, Roots, Blue Note Jazz, Classic Rock, Soul, Alt/Indy, Electronica, and Acoustic (bluegrass-celtic, old time).  No mp3s.   The Custom Art Music One/Twos looked interesting as you compared them to the ER4s.   Thoughts??.  What else should be on the evaluation list?   FWIW i use my ETYs in the studio when mixing/mastering/engineering.     Thanks!!


 
  
 Depending on your budget I'd also consider the Custom Art Pro 330v2 and 1964EARS V6-Stage. Both are around the same price as the RSM and perform a little better than the cheaper Alclair Reference. The V6 Stage is a little more v-shaped while the Pro 330 is a little lighter on the top end. With the Music One I feel like you will miss some of the resolution of the ER4S even though you'll get some more bass in the tradeoff (I compared these to the pro 330 v2 here). Haven't tried the music two.
  


trying2learn said:


> This is definitely the wrong post but I'm looking for a good bluetooth speaker under 150? Any suggestions? Sorry cause its the wrong post. Maybe a link would help too! Thanks.


 
  
 Can't recommend a good one as Ive only tried a few, but I can say don't buy the Nokia Play 360. It has great reviews but I've tried $40 PC speakers that sound better. The little Jambox and Sony SRSX3 both sound better to me, but I doubt they're the best under $150.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Prob going with the Philips Fidelio P8


----------



## Trying2Learn

I plan to use heat shrink on the VSD3S so I don't cry in 3 weeks. If I use a lighter or heat gun, will eithe tof then do any damage to the cables or wires?


----------



## rattledaddy

Thanks Joker... 

I'll have a look at those models. One follow up question... Are you referring to the RSM Quad $600 usd,or the Aliclair Reference which is less $ when you say both the 330v and the V6 Stags are better? 

Thanks again.


----------



## ljokerl

rattledaddy said:


> Thanks Joker...
> 
> I'll have a look at those models. One follow up question... Are you referring to the RSM Quad $600 usd,or the Aliclair Reference which is less $ when you say both the 330v and the V6 Stags are better?
> 
> Thanks again.


 
  
 I mean the Reference - it's the only Alclair model I've reviewed.


----------



## Drumkick

Hey Joker, I've been reading up a lot lately on <$50 IEM's and am having trouble deciding. I'm stuck between the Xiaomi Piston 2, the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition, the Symphonized NRG (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00T55FQ4G/ref=gno_cart_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2X0F4F8T5BV34), and the Brainwavz Delta (http://www.amazon.com/Brainwavz-Silver-Earphones-Microphone-Smartphones/dp/B00L30EFKM/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1427151008&sr=1-2&keywords=brainwavz). I'm looking for something with a durable build and comfortable that will work well with running and general everyday use. Do you have any recommendations between those four? Thanks in advance!


----------



## ljokerl

drumkick said:


> Hey Joker, I've been reading up a lot lately on <$50 IEM's and am having trouble deciding. I'm stuck between the Xiaomi Piston 2, the Vsonic GR02 Bass Edition, the Symphonized NRG (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00T55FQ4G/ref=gno_cart_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2X0F4F8T5BV34), and the Brainwavz Delta (http://www.amazon.com/Brainwavz-Silver-Earphones-Microphone-Smartphones/dp/B00L30EFKM/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1427151008&sr=1-2&keywords=brainwavz). I'm looking for something with a durable build and comfortable that will work well with running and general everyday use. Do you have any recommendations between those four? Thanks in advance!


 
  
  
 I can only comment on the Piston and GR02 BE. I've never tried the Delta and the Symphonized NRG unit I tried sounded pretty bad... giving it the benefit of the doubt and saying it was defective. Between the GR02 and Piston I'd go for the piston for sound unless your two primary criteria are bass control and clarity, which the GR02 does better. The GR02 is better-built, however, and neither is really designed for sports use (both lack sweat resistance and a "sport" fit). If you want a somewhat similar IEM with a sportier design, the Audio-Technica CKX5 is pretty good.


----------



## Drumkick

ljokerl said:


> I can only comment on the Piston and GR02 BE. I've never tried the Delta and the Symphonized NRG unit I tried sounded pretty bad... giving it the benefit of the doubt and saying it was defective. Between the GR02 and Piston I'd go for the piston for sound unless your two primary criteria are bass control and clarity, which the GR02 does better. The GR02 is better-built, however, and neither is really designed for sports use (both lack sweat resistance and a "sport" fit). If you want a somewhat similar IEM with a sportier design, the Audio-Technica CKX5 is pretty good.


 
 Thanks for the advice! I ended up getting the piston and found a pair of meelectronics sport-fi m6 on sale so I'll just use those for sports when I need them


----------



## ER4S

Hi Joker,
  
 First of all, thanks for all this stuff! This topic always helped me out for both choosing and learning..
  
 I want to ask about ER4S. Have you ever used/tried different sources with ER4S? What do you think about ER4S' reaction to different sources?
  
 One more question: (just wonder) is there any option for "real" upgrade from ER4S in any price range?
  
 Thanks in advance!


----------



## Trying2Learn

Anyone else wondering why Vsonic is giving the AN16, a GR06 with GR07 driver with the purchase of a VSD2/S? Seems wonderous


----------



## ljokerl

er4s said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> First of all, thanks for all this stuff! This topic always helped me out for both choosing and learning..
> 
> ...


 
  
 ER4S is not so much sensitive to source as having a decent amount of voltage available to drive it. But I've rarely heard any issues aside from volume - even the Sansa Clip does okay if you don't need things loud. 
  
 As for an upgrade - if you mean a concession-less one that improves on the ER4S in every way, then no. But if we don't expect the upgrade to do everything better then there's plenty, like the 1964 V6-Stage for instance. At the very least it's an improvement in soundstage depth and imaging as well as bass impact, depth, and realism.


----------



## garcsa

trying2learn said:


> Anyone else wondering why Vsonic is giving the AN16, a GR06 with GR07 driver with the purchase of a VSD2/S? Seems wonderous


 
 Some kind of sales promotion IMHO.


----------



## omastic

trying2learn said:


> Anyone else wondering why Vsonic is giving the AN16, a GR06 with GR07 driver with the purchase of a VSD2/S? Seems wonderous


 
 They probably had a huge amount of GR06 shell and GR07 drivers left over in their warehouse somewhere.


----------



## jant71

omastic said:


> They probably had a huge amount of GR06 shell and GR07 drivers left over in their warehouse somewhere.


 
  
 I think they made a GR06 flagship version or something and never put it out. It was too good at the time compared to the GR07 and GR04 flagship etc. so they shelved it. Now they have a use for it. Not looking to sell it against the Classic either so bundle them with something new and sell many units of it. May not sell that well, the VSD2, after the 3 and 5 came before it but with the AN16 bundled it can come out after those and have even better sales than the previous two started out with. Very clever strategy.
  
 Does kind of fit. The only single version Vsonic GR?? No flagship version, silver cable version, bass version of the GR06 at a time when they did such with the GR02, GR04, GR07, and even GR99. Huh, huh?? See it now. Pretty much a $99 GR07 classic back then. Would've hurt the GR07 sales back at the time once the word got out  Had to be locked away. Till now!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Anyway, that's my theory and I'm sticking to it!


----------



## suman134

jant71 said:


> I think they made a GR06 flagship version or something and never put it out. It was too good at the time compared to the GR07 and GR04 flagship etc. so they shelved it. Now they have a use for it. Not looking to sell it against the Classic either so bundle them with something new and sell many units of it. May not sell that well, the VSD2, after the 3 and 5 came before it but with the AN16 bundled it can come out after those and have even better sales than the previous two started out with. Very clever strategy.
> 
> Does kind of fit. The only single version Vsonic GR?? No flagship version, silver cable version, bass version of the GR06 at a time when they did such with the GR02, GR04, GR07, and even GR99. Huh, huh?? See it now. Pretty much a $99 GR07 classic back then. Would've hurt the GR07 sales back at the time once the word got out  Had to be locked away. Till now!!!
> 
> ...


 

  Interesting!! I would like to believe, but still we are just speculating. But its slightly justifying.


----------



## Trying2Learn

The housing of the VSD3S are pretty big so how do i get the right size of heat shrink for the wire over the housing?


----------



## ljokerl

Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear added. The overall ranking has been updated here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C65) Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear*
> 
> 
> Added March 2015
> ...


----------



## Trying2Learn

Ok so the VSD3S came in and 3 things hit me in the face at once. Great Design. They look really, really, good. But, none of the tips really give a good fit. Also, the freaking sibilance! The sibilance the sibilance you guys talked about and I'v read up on it but still, jeez. Its really a great iem imo, but the sibilance is annoying as heck! The fits aren't amazing for me either :/. But the sound quality and design truely is amazing. Pros and Cons, nothing is perfect I suppose.


----------



## waynes world

trying2learn said:


> Ok so the VSD3S came in and 3 things hit me in the face at once. Great Design. They look really, really, good. But, none of the tips really give a good fit. Also, the freaking sibilance! The sibilance the sibilance you guys talked about and I'v read up on it but still, jeez. Its really a great iem imo, but the sibilance is annoying as heck! The fits aren't amazing for me either :/. But the sound quality and design truely is amazing. *Pros and Cons, nothing is perfect I suppose.*


 
  
 Nothing except the Dunu Titan1's! Kidding (well, not really lol).


----------



## Trying2Learn

waynes world said:


> Nothing except the Dunu Titan1's! Kidding (well, not really lol).


But they look tacky!


----------



## waynes world

trying2learn said:


> But they look tacky!


 
  
 I think that once you'd get them in your hands, you'd stop feeling that way about them. They are built very well, are fairly small, and they fit in the ear in such a way that they don't fall out. Also, the cable is one of the best cables I've seen. And best of all, they sound *very* good. Plenty of testimony here:
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/744083/dunu-titan-1-titanium-coated-diaphragm-half-in-ear-earphones


----------



## Xacxac

Hi Joker, first of all thanks for this amazing comprehensive thread & your website. I use them extensively to look for my first CIEM and I found some CIEMs in my budget range: JH5, Alclair Reference, 1964-v3. I listen to mainly jazz/blues vocal & alternative rock. I like clear, neutral to a lil bit warm vocal (but not overly Shure-like liquid), airy highs (I listen to live performances -airy sounds helps a lot- but I know CIEMs can't be compared to open headphones), neutral fast detailed bass. I can't stand to thin mid & vocal & bloated bass. My equalizer would be 'W' shaped or treble booster when listening with a flat IEM. Which one will satisfy my needs best?


----------



## ljokerl

xacxac said:


> Hi Joker, first of all thanks for this amazing comprehensive thread & your website. I use them extensively to look for my first CIEM and I found some CIEMs in my budget range: JH5, Alclair Reference, 1964-v3. I listen to mainly jazz/blues vocal & alternative rock. I like clear, neutral to a lil bit warm vocal (but not overly Shure-like liquid), airy highs (I listen to live performances -airy sounds helps a lot- but I know CIEMs can't be compared to open headphones), neutral fast detailed bass. I can't stand to thin mid & vocal & bloated bass. My equalizer would be 'W' shaped or treble booster when listening with a flat IEM. Which one will satisfy my needs best?


 
  
 No experience with the JH5 here, unfortunately, but the V3 and Reference both fit your requirements. I thought the Reference would be a better fit for you initially, being the flatter, more neutral (still very mildly warm) earphone with no lack of treble presence and slightly dry mids. However, your last statement about applying a W-shaped EQ to neutral earphones makes me think the bassier, more aggressive V3 may still be viable. I guess it depends on how much of a W-curve you are used to, because the V3 doesn't pull any punches when it comes to bass impact or treble energy. On paper the Reference is still the safer choice for what you're asking, but I'd be tempted to go for the more fun V3.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Foam tips on the VSD3S ensure a good fit and takes out a lot of sibilance! More than satisfied! Thanks for all the advise all


----------



## Xacxac

ljokerl said:


> No experience with the JH5 here, unfortunately, but the V3 and Reference both fit your requirements. I thought the Reference would be a better fit for you initially, being the flatter, more neutral (still very mildly warm) earphone with no lack of treble presence and slightly dry mids. However, your last statement about applying a W-shaped EQ to neutral earphones makes me think the bassier, *more aggressive V3* may still be viable. I guess it depends on how much of a W-curve you are used to, because the *V3 doesn't pull any punches when it comes to bass impact or treble energy*. On paper the Reference is still the safer choice for what you're asking, but I'd be tempted to go for the more fun V3.


 

 I don't get how could V3 sounds aggressive while doesn't have any impacts. Could you elaborate this? I prefer bass impact, then quality, and quantity (I never be a basshead).
  
 Anyone has experience with JH5 mid? I heard that mid is (very?) recessed, not much in 500-1000 Hz region.


----------



## Joe Bloggs

xacxac said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > No experience with the JH5 here, unfortunately, but the V3 and Reference both fit your requirements. I thought the Reference would be a better fit for you initially, being the flatter, more neutral (still very mildly warm) earphone with no lack of treble presence and slightly dry mids. However, your last statement about applying a W-shaped EQ to neutral earphones makes me think the bassier, *more aggressive V3* may still be viable. I guess it depends on how much of a W-curve you are used to, because the *V3 doesn't pull any punches when it comes to bass impact or treble energy*. On paper the Reference is still the safer choice for what you're asking, but I'd be tempted to go for the more fun V3.
> ...




"Doesn't pull any punches" means it punches with full force ("pulling" a punch means not actually hitting someone with a punch (pulling back at the last moment))


----------



## Xacxac

joe bloggs said:


> "Doesn't pull any punches" means it punches with full force ("pulling" a punch means not actually hitting someone with a punch (pulling back at the last moment))


 

 Sorry, my bad English. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Thank you for the explanation. So V3s are impactful CIEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

trying2learn said:


> Foam tips on the VSD3S ensure a good fit and takes out a lot of sibilance! More than satisfied! Thanks for all the advise all


 
  
 Glad you're enjoying them!
  


joe bloggs said:


> "Doesn't pull any punches" means it punches with full force ("pulling" a punch means not actually hitting someone with a punch (pulling back at the last moment))


 
  
 Thanks 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


xacxac said:


> Sorry, my bad English.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yes, they are


----------



## Xacxac

xacxac said:


> Sorry, my bad English.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> Yes, they are


 
  
 Alright, so now I have to choose between "impactful but a lil bit congested" vs "spacious but flat". Too bad I live far from their HQ so I can't listen to them beforehand. Thank you for all answers!


----------



## SLO7_MACHIN3

I'm looking for a smooth/warm and detailed iem for around $50, since my Sunrise Xcape cable broke. I'm thinking maybe VSonic R02 or Ostry KC06, but i don't know. Maybe i should get a cheap $25 or do i need to spend $100 to get a better iem than the Xcape?


----------



## ZapX629

slo7_machin3 said:


> I'm looking for a smooth/warm and detailed iem for around $50, since my Sunrise Xcape cable broke. I'm thinking maybe VSonic R02 or Ostry KC06, but i don't know. Maybe i should get a cheap $25 or do i need to spend $100 to get a better iem than the Xcape?


 

 ATH IM50 would be my pick. VSD3 would be a good one too, but with lesser build quality and less smooth.


----------



## ljokerl

slo7_machin3 said:


> I'm looking for a smooth/warm and detailed iem for around $50, since my Sunrise Xcape cable broke. I'm thinking maybe VSonic R02 or Ostry KC06, but i don't know. Maybe i should get a cheap $25 or do i need to spend $100 to get a better iem than the Xcape?


 
  
 R02 has the right signature but I think you can do better for the price with the Sony MH1C. It's bassier and not better than the Xcape, but for the money it's very good. 
  
 For $50 you could go with the SteelSeries Flux In-Ear or better yet the Phonak Perfect Bass (which can currently be had for just $40). Can't tell you if it's better than the IM50 or not since I've only heard those briefly, but certainly very competitive for the price.


----------



## suman134

slo7_machin3 said:


> I'm looking for a smooth/warm and detailed iem for around $50, since my Sunrise Xcape cable broke. I'm thinking maybe VSonic R02 or Ostry KC06, but i don't know. Maybe i should get a cheap $25 or do i need to spend $100 to get a better iem than the Xcape?


 

 If you liked the Sw xcape, I will spend $80, get the re-400 unless you are going ninja on them.


----------



## SLO7_MACHIN3

ljokerl said:


> R02 has the right signature but I think you can do better for the price with the Sony MH1C. It's bassier and not better than the Xcape, but for the money it's very good.
> 
> For $50 you could go with the SteelSeries Flux In-Ear or better yet the Phonak Perfect Bass (which can currently be had for just $40). Can't tell you if it's better than the IM50 or not since I've only heard those briefly, but certainly very competitive for the price.


 
  
 I'm still seeing if i'm ordering from inside europe or asia so the prices vary, but usd-eur exchange is not very good for us europeans so i might buy inside EU. I also have a person in Canada that can bring them to me.
  
 I want small and comfortable so I know they fit right , and will be wearing them straight down.
  
 My issue is: earbuds tend to fall from my ears, that's why i bought my first iem some 10 years ago and haven't used earbuds since, but I grew to dislike the sometimes claustrophobic isolation and emptiness feeling IEM provide walking in the street and public transporation, so i wanted to try earbuds. Almost bought Yuin pk3 but wasn't sure they would fit, so orderer the dasetn pk3. Now the sunrise cable broke, and since i've using them the past 5 or 6 years i want something new and different soundwise.
  
 What about the Brainwavz S1? I like the idea of putting them on a pocket and not worry about getting tangled cables, and they seem durable. Maybe a bit too V sound sig?


suman134 said:


> If you liked the Sw xcape, I will spend $80, get the re-400 unless you are going ninja on them.


 
  
 The Re400 are maybe a little out of what i want to spend.
  
  
  
 My list so far:

 Brainwavz S1
 Phonak 012
 Vsonic R02
 Vsonic VC02
 Moe Audio MOE-SS01
 Meelectronic a151
 Hisoundaudio Crystal
 Astrotec ax-35
 HiSoundAudio BA100
 Dunu DN-22 Detonator
 OSTRY KC06
 Fidue A63
  
  
 In "short" what i'm looking for: Smooth/warm and detailed mids and top end, i want to hear the vocals and instruments, soundstage and separation. Not a basshead and don't listen much to hard music such as electronic trance, techno ,death/black metal , etc so not insterested in bass quantity but quality and control


----------



## ElcomeSoft

*sigh* 
  
 The day has come where my Brainwavz B2's have gone the journey. The left monitor has just gone silent and no amount of cable wiggling can illicit any sort of response.
  
 Yes, they were harsh and sibiliant and difficult to tame in some tracks even with a clean output, decent DAC and EQ'ing... but I enjoyed them despite all of that... and I only paid £65 (Now the only pair I can find is over £165).
  
 Even my other old favourite, the Hifiman RE-ZERO appears to have gone the way of the dinosaur and vanished from the marketplace so I'm on the hunt for a new pair of phones.
  
 Early considerations: (Price and availability checks pending)
  
*Hifiman RE-400A (£55)* - Is in the same balanced group as the DBA-02 as per the Joker guide by sound signature.
*VSonic GR07 Classic (£66 Vs. £76 for Mk II)* - Like the RE-400 but a step up *- Wondering about the GR07 Mk II which I'm seeing also*
*Brainwavz R3* *(£80)* - From the review here, sounds like it'll hit most of the marks that my B2 hit albeit not quite as good... and have the added bonus of lower sibilance/harshness
  
*4th Edit:* The RE-400's, from reading much of the Joker Bible, seem to be more of what I want than the other two.


----------



## esteebin

slo7_machin3 said:


> I'm still seeing if i'm ordering from inside europe or asia so the prices vary, but usd-eur exchange is not very good for us europeans so i might buy inside EU. I also have a person in Canada that can bring them to me.
> 
> I want small and comfortable so I know they fit right , and will be wearing them straight down.
> 
> ...



You should try Yurbuds enhancers on earbuds. It'll keep them in your ears. $10 for 2 pairs through the Yurbuds site. Amazon and eBay listings will have them at $15 for ONE pair. I have them on my Blox BE3 and BE7 and love the openness of earbuds with secure fit. Added bonus is that it retains the bass lost from not directly going into the ear canal.


----------



## ljokerl

slo7_machin3 said:


> What about the Brainwavz S1? I like the idea of putting them on a pocket and not worry about getting tangled cables, and they seem durable. *Maybe a bit too V sound sig?*


 
  
 Yes, much more so than what you're asking for. 
  
  


elcomesoft said:


> *sigh*
> 
> The day has come where my Brainwavz B2's have gone the journey. The left monitor has just gone silent and no amount of cable wiggling can illicit any sort of response.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Considering that you liked the RE-ZERO and don't mind having a less bright and revealing earphone than the B2, I would agree that the RE-400 is a better option than the others you're considering. 
  
 The R3 is quite similar to the RE-400 (more so than the B2) but I think it moves in the wrong direction from the RE-400 for what you want - towards a warmer, less resolving sound.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

ljokerl said:


> Considering that you liked the RE-ZERO and don't mind having a less bright and revealing earphone than the B2, I would agree that the RE-400 is a better option than the others you're considering.
> 
> The R3 is quite similar to the RE-400 (more so than the B2) but I think it moves in the wrong direction from the RE-400 for what you want - towards a warmer, less resolving sound.


 
  
 Thanks |joker| once again for your guide and advice. I've put a support ticket in to MP4Nation to see if I'm still in warranty and see if they can do anything for me.
  
 The two RE-400's I can see are £55-60 and are both overseas which means I may get thumped by tax and handling charges when they come into the UK. Or I could pay about £80 from a UK vendor and have no additional charges but that takes them into the GR07 classic and R3 price ranges. Might find an eBay seller that uses their awful Global Seller Programme to pre-pay import charges and save me some hassle.
  
 What tips are recommended for the RE-400's?
  
 PS: must remember to return my Topping NX2. The Amp/DAC seems to be unshielded which makes it unsuitable to pair with my Note 3 so it's got to go the journey despite providing a significant boost to the audio end product of my B2's.
  
 PPS: I would probably be best off pairing an RE-400 with an HM-700 (£175 wwith the RE-400B but stock expected late April) as a PAP but price and capacity wise the Fiio X1 (£60 inc atm) really has my vote. Considering these prices I might just grab an X1 and the RE-400's.


----------



## SLO7_MACHIN3

ljokerl said:


> Yes, much more so than what you're asking for.


 
  
 Maybe i'll go for them, i also want something different sounding from the Xcape. Was going to pull the trigger on the Fidue A63 but i'm afraid they won't fit and i have to return them. What do you recommend that can be worn straight down and are comfortable and durable?
 The Phonak 012 discount does seem pretty tempting but with shipping to canada or europe plus customs it will probably be too expensive.
  
 Ive narrowed down to this list with prices:
  
 Brainwavz S1                     50 
 Brainwavz M1                    35
 Fidue A63                         55 
 Dunu Trident                     28 
 astrotec am90                   38
 Brainwavz s0                     46 
 Fidue A63                         55 
 Fischer Audio silver bullet    43 
 Dunu DN-22 Detonator        40 
 Vsonic VSD1/S                  40
  
 Leaning towards the vsonic, dunu and astrotec


----------



## rovopio

ljokerl said:


> Glad you're enjoying them!
> 
> 
> Thanks
> ...


 
  
 hi ljokerl...
  
 i'd like to ask for pointers... my budget is $200 down. my current IEM is the altone200. the altone200 is just a little too bright for my inner ear. I really like them but, my inner ear recently developed a sensitivity pain to high frequency sounds so... the altone200 is on it's way out.
  
 the past couple of of hours googling lead me to FAD Heaven V. I think i know i will like this IEM but, reports say it's quite a bit microphonic (more than most), and that's a bit of a no-no with my needs of commuting and jogging.
  
 I checked out rha ma750 and your review of it, from what i read, the rolled-off treble would suit my "inner ear needs" so-to-speak, but i dislike the bass. I'm more of a _grado or planar _kind of person. a lean, tight, punchy bass is fun, but bloated, fat, round, and too much bass is a no-no.
  
 So here i am asking you, the seasoned IEM listener, is there any iem $200 down that is less, less hot than t-peos altone200, but not too bassy as the ma750...?
 My secondary importance is how the IEM renders female vocals too. The better the IEM render female vocals, the better...
  
  
 regards and thank you in advance...


----------



## ZapX629

rovopio said:


> hi ljokerl...
> 
> i'd like to ask for pointers... my budget is $200 down. my current IEM is the altone200. the altone200 is just a little too bright for my inner ear. I really like them but, my inner ear recently developed a sensitivity pain to high frequency sounds so... the altone200 is on it's way out.
> 
> ...


 

 I know Joker really likes the TDK BA200 and from what he says about them, they seem like a good fit for you if you can find them.


----------



## ljokerl

elcomesoft said:


> Thanks |joker| once again for your guide and advice. I've put a support ticket in to MP4Nation to see if I'm still in warranty and see if they can do anything for me.
> 
> The two RE-400's I can see are £55-60 and are both overseas which means I may get thumped by tax and handling charges when they come into the UK. Or I could pay about £80 from a UK vendor and have no additional charges but that takes them into the GR07 classic and R3 price ranges. Might find an eBay seller that uses their awful Global Seller Programme to pre-pay import charges and save me some hassle.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I actually like the small RE-400 double-flanges. Also have used them with some Meelec M6 tips and Complys, but I wouldn't recommend buying any extra tips outright - not until you've tried the stock tips and any others you have sitting around. 
  


slo7_machin3 said:


> Maybe i'll go for them, i also want something different sounding from the Xcape. Was going to pull the trigger on the Fidue A63 but i'm afraid they won't fit and i have to return them. What do you recommend that can be worn straight down and are comfortable and durable?
> The Phonak 012 discount does seem pretty tempting but with shipping to canada or europe plus customs it will probably be too expensive.
> 
> Ive narrowed down to this list with prices:
> ...


 
  
 The Silver Bullet is probably the closest to what you're asking for.  A63 might work in terms of sound but comfort can be tricky. Most of the rest are either bass-light, harsh, or bloated compared to the Xcape. VSD1S is good if you can deal with mild sibilance (which the Xcape doesn't have).
  


rovopio said:


> hi ljokerl...
> 
> i'd like to ask for pointers... my budget is $200 down. my current IEM is the altone200. the altone200 is just a little too bright for my inner ear. I really like them but, my inner ear recently developed a sensitivity pain to high frequency sounds so... the altone200 is on it's way out.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yes, BA200 would be a good one for smooth sound. Bass is very flat compared to the Altone and MA750 and it's much smoother overall. HiFiMan RE-400 is another less expensive and more readily available option for level bass and very smooth sound.
  
 There's also the Klipsch X10 if you want more bass (closer to T-Peos bass level than to flat) and are willing to live with some treble roll-off. I personally prefer the more neutral HiFiMan and TDK, but coming from the Altone you might miss some of that enhanced bass with those two.


----------



## rovopio

ljokerl said:


> I actually like the small RE-400 double-flanges. Also have used them with some Meelec M6 tips and Complys, but I wouldn't recommend buying any extra tips outright - not until you've tried the stock tips and any others you have sitting around.
> 
> 
> The Silver Bullet is probably the closest to what you're asking for.  A63 might work in terms of sound but comfort can be tricky. Most of the rest are either bass-light, harsh, or bloated compared to the Xcape. VSD1S is good if you can deal with mild sibilance (which the Xcape doesn't have).
> ...


 
  
 i just googled, ba200 couldn't be found where i live, found a used klipsch x10 but nobody sells it new... how about im01 and heaven IV or V and gr8e... have you heard final audio offerings?
 i'm putting aside the re-400 recommendation for now because, as good as HFM offerings are, i got burned in the past by them so they are not high on my buy list...


----------



## suman134

rovopio said:


> i just googled, ba200 couldn't be found where i live, found a used klipsch x10 but nobody sells it new... how about im01 and heaven IV or V and gr8e... have you heard final audio offerings?
> i'm putting aside the re-400 recommendation for now because, as good as HFM offerings are, i got burned in the past by them so they are not high on my buy list...


 

  You got burned? You can go for Heaven IV or V. they are a bit expensive i think. Heaven II is cheap.


----------



## SLO7_MACHIN3

ljokerl said:


> The Silver Bullet is probably the closest to what you're asking for.  A63 might work in terms of sound but comfort can be tricky. Most of the rest are either bass-light, harsh, or bloated compared to the Xcape. VSD1S is good if you can deal with mild sibilance (which the Xcape doesn't have).


 
  
 I don't mind bass lightness, but harshness is another story, I'm too used to the Pro 900 being that way. The Astrotec are the only pair i could find and i've got some curiosity about armature drivers. It's between these three then.
 I'll forget about what i said i wanted, maybe the Xcape already has those qualities since i've had no other iem to compare to, so the goal is something different. They've served me very well the 5.5 years I owned them, and luckily very well chosen at the time.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

ljokerl said:


> I actually like the small RE-400 double-flanges. Also have used them with some Meelec M6 tips and Complys, but I wouldn't recommend buying any extra tips outright - not until you've tried the stock tips and any others you have sitting around.


 
  
 Thanks again, |jjoker|.
  
 I've got plenty of tips left over from my Brainwavz B2's, old Meelec  tips from my Dad and triple flange Ety's. Might also have some Sony Hybrids left too. Plenty of choice.
  
 At the end of the day I went for a pair of RE--400A's and a Fiio X1. About 2 thirds of the price of a 32Gb HM-700 and RE-400B bundle and expandable if I want a larger MicroSD. 
  
 Might not be everyone's choice but working within a budget and sound signature is a challenge unique to every individual.


----------



## domq422

I've been going through all of the reviews for the IEM below $100 for about an hour now. I can't believe how extensive it is, man, seriously, bravo. But considering it's from a few years ago, I have some info to go by, but possibly not the most accurate. I had the VSD3S's but I washed them in the washer machine and now they've stopped working. I really really loved the way they sounded and the style of them. Considering I have a budget of about $35 - $50 should I just stick to the VSD3S's? I was very interested in the style of Etymotic's IEM and I was just wondering some alternatives I could maybe look at that have good sound signature for my price range? 
  
 You have such good info, man, It'd be amazing if you could just provide me with some info when you get the chance. Thank you! 
  
 Ps. Maybe a piece of useful info. I work at a best buy, and upon checking some employee discount prices, I can grab the Klipsch R6 for about $36 apposed to the retail of about $80. would that be a better choice? I know for a fact I can get some great sound for that price range as well. 
  
 Thanks again!


----------



## Shawn71

domq422 said:


> I've been going through all of the reviews for the IEM below $100 for about an hour now. I can't believe how extensive it is, man, seriously, bravo. But considering it's from a few years ago, I have some info to go by, but possibly not the most accurate. I had the VSD3S's but I washed them in the washer machine and now they've stopped working. I really really loved the way they sounded and the style of them. Considering I have a budget of about $35 - $50 should I just stick to the VSD3S's? I was very interested in the style of Etymotic's IEM and I was just wondering some alternatives I could maybe look at that have good sound signature for my price range?
> 
> You have such good info, man, It'd be amazing if you could just provide me with some info when you get the chance. Thank you!
> 
> ...


 

 If you can buy some time you may want to wait & see how the new VSD2/2S impressions (which have the price tag of $45) are coming out,cld be little better than VSD3 series but little below the level of VSD5?.....just sayin.
  
 http://penonaudio.com/VSONIC-VSD2S


----------



## ljokerl

rovopio said:


> i just googled, ba200 couldn't be found where i live, found a used klipsch x10 but nobody sells it new... how about im01 and heaven IV or V and gr8e... have you heard final audio offerings?
> i'm putting aside the re-400 recommendation for now because, as good as HFM offerings are, i got burned in the past by them so they are not high on my buy list...


 
  
 X10 was officially replaced with the X11, but here in the US X10 is still cheaper. Not familiar with the IM01 or Final Audios aside from the Heaven S/A/C (which are discontinued, I think) and the Heaven II, which is probably brighter than what you're looking for. I didn't find it to be too harsh, but it's not an especially smooth earphone. I guess you can also consider Ultimate Ears 600 and SteelSeries Flux In-Ear PRO if available. The UE600 provides a more mid-centric sound while the Flux In-Ear Pro is a bit warmer a-la BA200.
  


slo7_machin3 said:


> I don't mind bass lightness, but harshness is another story, I'm too used to the Pro 900 being that way. The Astrotec are the only pair i could find and i've got some curiosity about armature drivers. It's between these three then.
> I'll forget about what i said i wanted, maybe the Xcape already has those qualities since i've had no other iem to compare to, so the goal is something different. They've served me very well the 5.5 years I owned them, and luckily very well chosen at the time.


 
  
 To avoid harshness, then, I would go A63 or Astrotec. They're both quite smooth. The AM-90 is overall flatter and more neutral, though it doesn't have the best extension. The A63 is more colored overall and has more robust bass and some emphasis in the midrange as well. If you want to try BA, the AM-90 is as good a first step as any.
  


elcomesoft said:


> Might not be everyone's choice but* working within a budget and sound signature is a challenge unique to every individual.*


 
  
 Yeah, tell me about it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


domq422 said:


> I've been going through all of the reviews for the IEM below $100 for about an hour now. I can't believe how extensive it is, man, seriously, bravo. But considering it's from a few years ago, I have some info to go by, but possibly not the most accurate. I had the VSD3S's but I washed them in the washer machine and now they've stopped working. I really really loved the way they sounded and the style of them. Considering I have a budget of about $35 - $50 should I just stick to the VSD3S's? I was very interested in the style of Etymotic's IEM and I was just wondering some alternatives I could maybe look at that have good sound signature for my price range?
> 
> You have such good info, man, It'd be amazing if you could just provide me with some info when you get the chance. Thank you!
> 
> ...


 
  
 This thread has new reviews added all the time, but it can be a little long and convoluted to read through so I also keep a "best of the best" buyer's guide here that's always up to date with my latest recommendations 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. 
  
 The Etymotic IEM you'll get for $50 or so will be good as a change from your VSonics, but it won't be better than the VSD3. Not sure what will - I haven't tried the R6 and most of the IEMs I'd rate on par tend to be pricier - the Ostry KC06, for instance, and the Havi B3 PRO I. With a hard $50 budget I'd personally get another VSonic - either the VSD3S or one of the new ones coming out that Shawn71 mentioned.


----------



## rovopio

thanks mate! appreciate it


----------



## listen4joy

hope you can review JVC HA-FX850 in the future.


----------



## domq422

shawn71 said:


> If you can buy some time you may want to wait & see how the new VSD2/2S impressions (which have the price tag of $45) are coming out,cld be little better than VSD3 series but little below the level of VSD5?.....just sayin.
> 
> http://penonaudio.com/VSONIC-VSD2S




Good point. I've been hearing some good things about the VSD2 in some of the forums so far. They are the same price pretty much, and I know the 2's are a lot newer considering they were just released... I haven't come across one yet but a VSD3S and a VSD2S comparison would be amazing.


----------



## domq422

This thread has new reviews added all the time, but it can be a little long and convoluted to read through so I also keep a "best of the best" buyer's guide here that's always up to date with my latest recommendations  . 

The Etymotic IEM you'll get for $50 or so will be good as a change from your VSonics, but it won't be better than the VSD3. Not sure what will - I haven't tried the R6 and most of the IEMs I'd rate on par tend to be pricier - the Ostry KC06, for instance, and the Havi B3 PRO I. With a hard $50 budget I'd personally get another VSonic - either the VSD3S or one of the new ones coming out that Shawn71 mentioned.
[/quote]

I appreciate the heads up about the website. That's for sure going to come in handy when I'm ready to re-enter the 100+ market. Thanks for all your help bro. Btw, your initial 355 reviews are pretty amazing, thanks for the hours of interesting reading haha


----------



## Trying2Learn

I see hybrid IEMs have something like 2 BA and one dynamic like T2 and there are Non-hybrid IEMs with dual dynamic, so is there a hybrid IEM with dual dynamic and single BA?


----------



## cota0429

Joker, I had the JVC-HA-FXD80 and they were stolen. I need something with a universal mic. I loved these and want something better same clarity just a bit more bass...any suggestions?


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> I see hybrid IEMs have something like 2 BA and one dynamic like T2 and there are Non-hybrid IEMs with dual dynamic, so is there a hybrid IEM with dual dynamic and single BA?


 

  I dont think there is one, if there is one, its not universal.


----------



## Shawn71

trying2learn said:


> I see hybrid IEMs have something like 2 BA and one dynamic like T2 and there are Non-hybrid IEMs with dual dynamic, so is there a hybrid IEM with dual dynamic and single BA?


 

 Yes, it's T-PEOS H-150......


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> Yes, it's T-PEOS H-150......


 

 Yesss!! how can it skip my mind!!


----------



## rovopio

trying2learn said:


> I see hybrid IEMs have something like 2 BA and one dynamic like T2 and there are Non-hybrid IEMs with dual dynamic, so is there a hybrid IEM with dual dynamic and single BA?



 


that's a nice username, trying to learn...


----------



## ljokerl

domq422 said:


> I appreciate the heads up about the website. That's for sure going to come in handy when I'm ready to re-enter the 100+ market. Thanks for all your help bro. Btw, your initial 355 reviews are pretty amazing, thanks for the hours of interesting reading haha


 
  





  


trying2learn said:


> I see hybrid IEMs have something like 2 BA and one dynamic like T2 and there are Non-hybrid IEMs with dual dynamic, so is there a hybrid IEM with dual dynamic and single BA?


  
 There's the LEAR LUF-BD4.2, which has 4x BA and 2x dynamic drivers.
  




cota0429 said:


> Joker, I had the JVC-HA-FXD80 and they were stolen. I need something with a universal mic. I loved these and want something better same clarity just a bit more bass...any suggestions?


 
  
 Mic requirement makes it tough... maybe RBH EP2? Has a warmer, bassier sound that's a fair departure from the FXD80, but thanks to pretty forward mids it maintains very decent clarity. Otherwise... Ultrasone IQ I guess.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Fiio X1 and RE-400A's on the way... 32Gb microSD that I use in my phone will find it's new home in my X1.
  
 However!!!
  
 Ebay... Seller has an HM-700 and RE-400 bundle. Likely to be the RE-400B's and it's a 16Gb player going for £111 at the moment.
  
 Mind is flipflopping over grabbing the 16Gb HM-700/RE-400B combo and trying it Vs. the Fiio X1 once I get everything in
  
 So much fun/torture, isn't it?


----------



## ElcomeSoft

ljokerl said:


> Considering that you liked the RE-ZERO and don't mind having a less bright and revealing earphone than the B2, I would agree that the RE-400 is a better option than the others you're considering.
> 
> The R3 is quite similar to the RE-400 (more so than the B2) but I think it moves in the wrong direction from the RE-400 for what you want - towards a warmer, less resolving sound.




Just received me RE-400 last night. Have them an hour in my ears and just based on that single hour of listening they absolutely flatten my B2's, being superior in multiple different areas. I think I'm just excited to be using something closer to my own sound signature preference and being back in the land of dynamic drivers where there's a bit more feel to music... but I left these "burning in" overnight at standard listening volume with my full 32gb wide and varied music selection so things can only get better.

The Fiio X1 is on its way too, stuck at one of the black holes of the UK postal service. Hopefully that will arrive soon and I have no doubts that as an output device that it will make a mockery of my Note 3 even with the 192 kbps mp3 tracks (thank you online music stores) I have in my collection.


----------



## ljokerl

elcomesoft said:


> Just received me RE-400 last night. Have them an hour in my ears and just based on that single hour of listening they absolutely flatten my B2's, being superior in multiple different areas. I think I'm just excited to be using something closer to my own sound signature preference and being back in the land of dynamic drivers where there's a bit more feel to music... but I left these "burning in" overnight at standard listening volume with my full 32gb wide and varied music selection so things can only get better.
> 
> The Fiio X1 is on its way too, stuck at one of the black holes of the UK postal service. Hopefully that will arrive soon and I have no doubts that as an output device that it will make a mockery of my Note 3 even with the 192 kbps mp3 tracks (thank you online music stores) I have in my collection.


 
  





. That's a great feeling. Nothing like finding a good signature match for your tastes, music, & gear!


----------



## ElcomeSoft

ljokerl said:


> . That's a great feeling. Nothing like finding a good signature match for your tastes, music, & gear!


 
  
 X1 arrived in the post tonight <3
  
 My RE-400's are still only on ~15-20 hours use at tops so far but things can only get better as far as they're concerned.
  
 I've never had a standalone player since 2004 and this is such a nice piece of kit which cost me £62 inc delivery from MP4Nation Vs. £90+ from any other UK source. Granted, I had a decent sized MicroSD card from my phone so that wasn't an issue anyway.
  
 Difference isn't staggering or mindblowing. Without a reasonable set of earphones I doubt that much of a difference would be heard. There's much less hiss when silent/quiet parts are being played. More complicated tracks feel untangled, each layer of music more defined in it's own right, finding 6 or 7 strands where 3 or 4 might have been heard before.
  
 Busy looking at hdtracks.co.uk and balking at that huge price tag on 192/24 tracks


----------



## wes1099

I can't decide between the Soundmagic E30 and Brainwavz M5. What do you guys think I should get? I am also open to other suggestions in the same price range.


----------



## ZapX629

wes1099 said:


> I can't decide between the Soundmagic E30 and Brainwavz M5. What do you guys think I should get? I am also open to other suggestions in the same price range.


 

 What's your budget and for what kind of music or purpose are they going to be used?


----------



## wes1099

zapx629 said:


> What's your budget and for what kind of music or purpose are they going to be used?


 
 Preferably no more than $40-$50. I am aiming for best value for money. I listen to various electronic genres and I play PC games were sound is very important. I can't exactly take my HD558's to LAN events because they are open back, so I use IEM's unless I am at home.
  
 EDIT: Just saw the ATH-IM50's. They seem like a good contender.


----------



## ZapX629

wes1099 said:


> Preferably no more than $40-$50. I am aiming for best value for money. I listen to various electronic genres and I play PC games were sound is very important. I can't exactly take my HD558's to LAN events because they are open back, so I use IEM's unless I am at home.
> 
> EDIT: Just saw the ATH-IM50's. They seem like a good contender.


 

 IM50 is my personal fave at that price. Durable and great sounding.


----------



## WhatToChoose

You could check out the MEElectronics M6 pros, those are excellent for their price.


----------



## ljokerl

wes1099 said:


> I can't decide between the Soundmagic E30 and Brainwavz M5. What do you guys think I should get? I am also open to other suggestions in the same price range.


 
  
 Between those two, E30 (unless noise isolation is a priority), but as others have said you've got quite a few options in that price range.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the enhanced-bass Gorilla Ears GX-4b CIEMs.
  
 The overall ranking has been updated here.
  
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1A15) Gorilla Ears GX-4b*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## fzr100098

Would love to see a Gorilla/Earwerkz Omega comparison - they actually look very similar


----------



## shotgunshane

fzr100098 said:


> Would love to see a Gorilla/Earwerkz Omega comparison - they actually look very similar




That's just the faceplate that's similar. Everything else is different from driver count, to crossovers to Omega resonnance chambers.


----------



## BB 808

ljokerl said:


> Hmm..  Fidue A83, maybe? It maintains some bass emphasis (not as much as the MA750 of course) and has impressive clarity and soundstage. Biggest difference would probably be in the upper midrange where the MA750 has more emphasis (the A83 has a little more emphasis higher up).
> 
> 
> Not sure about the IM03 but among the rest I'd choose the DN-2000. Better isolation and the most versatile sound.
> ...


 
 I was leaning toward the AF180, but when your FLC8 review came out I went ahead and bought it.  I LOVE IT!  I used the default balanced setting for about 6 hours and I was impressed with the balance and detail - similar to my ER4S, but with more bass.  Then I tried your preferred setting with the red sub bass port and shiver me timbers matey!  Warm and smooth like my SE530, but with sub bass that rumbles deeper and highs that are clearer.  Thank you _|joker|_


----------



## ljokerl

bb 808 said:


> I was leaning toward the AF180, but when your FLC8 review came out I went ahead and bought it.  I LOVE IT!  I used the default balanced setting for about 6 hours and I was impressed with the balance and detail - similar to my ER4S, but with more bass.  Then I tried your preferred setting with the red sub bass port and shiver me timbers matey!  Warm and smooth like my SE530, but with sub bass that rumbles deeper and highs that are clearer.  Thank you _|joker|_


 
  
 Very glad to hear it! I spent 6+ months with the FLC8 to make sure what I was getting out of it wasn't a fluke, but it's definitely one of best combinations of _fun_ and _accurate_ among the IEMs I've got in my collection. 
  
 Happy listening!


----------



## WhatToChoose

I know reviews cover exterior build quality, cable durability, etc. 

Is there any info on longevity of IEMs? I have heard of cheap IEMs (for example, sennheiser cx300s II) lasting for up to 4 years, and expensive IEMs (sennheiser ie80, dje1500s for example) failing quickly. Surely there must be info on this, because this would be the quality control aspect of the company, but can't really be observed by the consumer. 

I am just curious, I am fairly sure that most last a long time.


----------



## AlanHell

This review covers more than I know about the industry~~~~
 WOW!


----------



## wes1099

What iem do you guys think is best value for money? Right now I am looking at getting ath-im50's or maybe soundmagic e30's.my budget is $50


----------



## ozkan

wes1099 said:


> What iem do you guys think is best value for money? Right now I am looking at getting ath-im50's or maybe soundmagic e30's.my budget is $50


 
  
 IM50 and Tenore


----------



## Koolpep

ozkan said:


> IM50 and Tenore


 

 +1 this though I prefer the Carbo Basso versus Tenore....but you can't go wrong with all these.


----------



## ozkan

koolpep said:


> +1 this though I prefer the Carbo Basso versus Tenore....but you can't go wrong with all these.


 
  
 Why do you prefer the Basso? What is the difference between them?


----------



## Koolpep

ozkan said:


> Why do you prefer the Basso? What is the difference between them?




A tad more bass than the tenore while sacrificing only a bit of detail does it for me....

They are very similar but I like that bit more impactful lower end on this earphone.

Cheers,
K


----------



## ljokerl

whattochoose said:


> I know reviews cover exterior build quality, cable durability, etc.
> 
> Is there any info on longevity of IEMs? I have heard of cheap IEMs (for example, sennheiser cx300s II) lasting for up to 4 years, and expensive IEMs (sennheiser ie80, dje1500s for example) failing quickly. Surely there must be info on this, because this would be the quality control aspect of the company, but can't really be observed by the consumer.
> 
> I am just curious, I am fairly sure that most last a long time.


 
  
 My two cents on this -
  
 This would be great into to have but there's so many variables that it would be a massive effort to keep everything straight. Two users can have vastly different experiences with the same IEM based on their use pattern, environment, etc., not to mention potential production and QC differences between different batches of the same earphone. Other considerations would include things like counterfeits - for instance, chances are fake Senn IE8s don't last as long as real ones.
  
 In order to have truly meaningful stats you would need to have a huge pool of independent users who take similar care of their gear. In the real world we can expect that the average $20 Skullcandy earbuds get treated worse than a $500 Westone W40, and $40 Sony buds are, on average, purchased by less knowledgeable users than $40 VSonics.
  
 This would be very hard to achieve with the sheer number of different earphones out there - especially getting data for more niche sets, as well as for the latest and greatest (and untested), that tends to be the most popular on Head-Fi. 
  
 For now the best we have for this sort of thing - and this is only useful months or years after release - is consumer review trends on websites like Amazon. Yes, these can be manipulated and yes, a lot of those reviewers lack the kind of knowledge of headphone products most Head-Fiers have (which results in some reviews being user error or easily fixed problems), but average trends for simple things like "earpiece failed after 3 months" can probably be trusted. 
  
 I typically adjust my build quality ratings if I keep getting consistent reports of similar failures, but this is quite rare. I think the last set this happened with was the SteelSeries Flux, which turned out to have a somewhat weak cable (my own two units still work fine, though). This info didn't surface until 6+ months after I reviewed it (and 1 1/2 years after it was originally released) and even then I wouldn't have got wind of it if it hadn't been one of my recommended sets in the price range.


----------



## wes1099

I'm stuck between the Carbo tenore, ath-im50, and maybe TTPod T1. I want to be able to fit them under ear muffs, and I am not sure if the tenore is too long for that. Other than shape/size, what are the differences?


----------



## WhatToChoose

Ah, that makes sense. Looks like that would be much more difficult than I previously thought, since all of the owners would have to be consciously aware of their IEMs throughout their duration. Thank you for the detailed response!

I usually look up info that could hint towards early failure (for example, the Hifiman re300h looked quite impressive on paper, but in the thread it was reported to have strain reliefs glued on, which came off easily). I ended up buying the most durable IEMs I could find, assum8ng they were built equally well on the inside lol

PS: The amount of times I have referenced your multi IEM review is unreal, excellent work!


----------



## ljokerl

whattochoose said:


> Ah, that makes sense. Looks like that would be much more difficult than I previously thought, since all of the owners would have to be consciously aware of their IEMs throughout their duration. Thank you for the detailed response!
> 
> I usually look up info that could hint towards early failure (for example, the Hifiman re300h looked quite impressive on paper, but in the thread it was reported to have strain reliefs glued on, which came off easily). I ended up buying the most durable IEMs I could find, assum8ng they were built equally well on the inside lol
> 
> PS: The amount of times I have referenced your multi IEM review is unreal, excellent work!


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 I wish there was a little warning chime I'd get when there's consistent reports of a large proportion of a particular earphone model failing with no fix from the manufacturer, but unfortunately that's not the case.


----------



## VeXun

I am using a pair of etymotic research hf5 iems and love the sound but want more detail and sound stage without them being big, I like to sleep with headphones in and lay on my side which I do fine with these but I want more detail and soundstage. I use an iPhone 6+ with a fiio e07k amp. Any suggestions the cheaper the better


----------



## ozkan

vexun said:


> I am using a pair of etymotic research hf5 iems and love the sound but want more detail and sound stage without them being big, I like to sleep with headphones in and lay on my side which I do fine with these but I want more detail and soundstage. I use an iPhone 6+ with a fiio e07k amp. Any suggestions the cheaper the better


 
  
 Zero Audio Tenore.


----------



## suman134

vexun said:


> I am using a pair of etymotic research hf5 iems and love the sound but want more detail and sound stage without them being big, I like to sleep with headphones in and lay on my side which I do fine with these but I want more detail and soundstage. I use an iPhone 6+ with a fiio e07k amp. Any suggestions the cheaper the better


 

 i think you can sleep with VSD5 and are detailed enough with better sound stage too.


----------



## RochRx7

Joker!! GOAT!
  
 Is there a moderately priced CIEM that has a similar signature to the Dunu DN2000's?
  
 I love everything about the DN2k's.. just hate the comfort and heft. Maybe a little more extension in the treble as well. 
  
 $350-$500 range. 1964 Ears? Noble? I'm not sure--this is my first attempt looking into CIEMs. <3


----------



## Trying2Learn

How bad is the GR07 BE sibilance? Anything near that of a VSD3S? Gr07 BE looks like a good step up from my vsd3s, but not for a while, cuz I only got the vsd3s pretty recently.


----------



## ljokerl

Quote:


vexun said:


> I am using a pair of etymotic research hf5 iems and love the sound but want more detail and sound stage without them being big, I like to sleep with headphones in and lay on my side which I do fine with these but I want more detail and soundstage. I use an iPhone 6+ with a fiio e07k amp. Any suggestions the cheaper the better


  


 Hard to beat the HF5 for detail in that price range. Soundstage is easier. If you're looking to maximize value your best bet IMO would be a nice dual-BA (TWFK) based set. If you're aiming for HF5 price range (<$120) it would probably be a lightly used VSonic VC1000 or UE700. For sleeping the tiny UE700 is better, but not sure if the cable will hold up to sleeping duty. 
  


rochrx7 said:


> Joker!! GOAT!
> 
> Is there a moderately priced CIEM that has a similar signature to the Dunu DN2000's?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Nothing that I'm familiar with is a perfect match. The 1964-V3 is closest - it's one of the very few CIEMs in my collection with bass that is enhanced enough to match the Dunu (in fact, I think it's a touch more mid-bassy, and warmer as well) and has slightly V/U-shaped overall signature. Not sure how it compares to the Nobles in that price range - I only have the Noble 4S.
  


trying2learn said:


> How bad is the GR07 BE sibilance? Anything near that of a VSD3S? Gr07 BE looks like a good step up from my vsd3s, but not for a while, cuz I only got the vsd3s pretty recently.


 
  
 Yes, similar to the VSD3S.


----------



## krad54

Hey guys, I'm a long-time lurker and I'd like to say that you guys are great for helping with headphone research. Right now I'm looking to upgrade from my Klipsch Image S4s to a better pair of IEMs. I tested the RHA T10is, which had great build quality, but just seemed to be missing something as far as sound went. I'm looking for a pair of warm, bassy IEMs less than $250. Any ideas? I've heard great things about the SE215s, but I'm not sure if they're enough of a step-up from the S4s to be worth it.


----------



## WhatToChoose

Hehe, I have used all three of those (S4, T10, and se215)
  
 S4: Amazing when I had it, but build quality and microphonics were horrible
 T10: Currently my absolute favorite IEMs at the moment. Amazing build quality, and paired with the samsung S5 eartips they really shine
 Se215: Excellent build quality, isolation, fit, and comfort. Sadly, the sound isn't all that it's hyped to be. The sound lacks in sub-bass impact and highs, which REALLY take down its clarity. They are very warm however, but unfortunately the sound was way too muddy for my tastes. Their limited editions take care of the sub bass I believe, but not the muddiness.
  
 Based off of my research, here are my suggestions:
 Audio Technica ATH-IM70 & IM50
 Fidue A71
 Pioneer DJE-1500s
 Hisoundaudo wooduo 2 (for basshead)
 RHA MA750s (not particularly for modern pop style music)
  
 I know you said you didn't like the T10 sound, but would you be able to explain? I am using them with the samsung S5 large eartips, and they are absolutely beautiful sounding. I have also listened to the Westone W3s, and comparatively, those were not exciting. Very excellent in their own right, but lacked impact and energy.
  
 Good luck in your search! I am sure ljokerl's headphone list would help you immensely as well, on his site!
  
 One last thing....Wecome to Head-Fi! And sorry about your wallet


----------



## krad54

I think my issue with the T10is may have stemmed from their eartips. I have big ear canals and currently use the large comply tips with my S4s, but none of the included RHA tips were large. I looked at the guide, and, in the price range, the custom art headphones seemed to be the best, but I'd figured I'd ask you guys just to get some other opinions. I may end up giving the T10s another shot though. Do you know if the T10is and the T10s have any difference other than the mic? I have an Android, so the in-line controls and mic often don't work.
  
 Thanks for the help!


----------



## WhatToChoose

I have not tested the T10is honestly (I got the T10s since I never use mics haha)
  
 But the T10s do come with large eartips, 2 pairs of each size actually. The insertion depth is quite deep compared to the S4s I think, perhaps you could see if that was the problem?
  
 And I have never used customs personally, so I don't quite have an opinion on them However, based off of ljokerl's review they seem like an excellent value! I didn't get customs only because the molding process is a bit tedious, and I don't have the time as a college student. They also need to be remolded every few years from what I have read. But those are the only downsides, and if you want to try them I would say go for it!


----------



## krad54

I only tried the silicone tips, so they may not have been quite as nice and grippy as the foam tips. And that's what was turning me off the customs. Being a college student myself, I just don't have the time, especially since traffic is crazy where I live, so I'd rather not go through that process.


----------



## WhatToChoose

Ah, I gotcha! Based on what I read it could take over a month (Like with the Noble customs, a highly reputable brand)
  
 I use silicon tips (very hard to get a consistent fit IMO)
  
 The included foam tips with the T10s didn't seem to do it for me, they didn't act as I expected. Perhaps they might be better with complies?


----------



## suman134

krad54 said:


> Hey guys, I'm a long-time lurker and I'd like to say that you guys are great for helping with headphone research. Right now I'm looking to upgrade from my Klipsch Image S4s to a better pair of IEMs. I tested the RHA T10is, which had great build quality, but just seemed to be missing something as far as sound went. I'm looking for a pair of warm, bassy IEMs less than $250. Any ideas? I've heard great things about the SE215s, but I'm not sure if they're enough of a step-up from the S4s to be worth it.


 

   If you liked those S4 highs, which can get harsh and sibilant, you should go for VSD5, It wont be that much bassy, but far better, you can consider VSD3 for some more bass. If you are looking for a different signature with some bass emphasis, i think IM-50 will be nice.
  
   But if you can do $250, why not go for the DN-1k. Bassy, superb quality , fantastic detailing and will be a few steps over S4. But if you do that, you will have to give it some time, time to adjust to that amount of details unless you have some thing similar.


----------



## krad54

suman134 said:


> If you liked those S4 highs, which can get harsh and sibilant, you should go for VSD5, It wont be that much bassy, but far better, you can consider VSD3 for some more bass. If you are looking for a different signature with some bass emphasis, i think IM-50 will be nice.
> 
> But if you can do $250, why not go for the DN-1k. Bassy, superb quality , fantastic detailing and will be a few steps over S4. But if you do that, you will have to give it some time, time to adjust to that amount of details unless you have some thing similar.


 

 By the DN-1ks, do you mean the Dunu DN-1000s? They're around $180 on Amazon, so I'm guessing that's a good deal then. How do you think they stack up to the T10s and, while we're at it, the GR07-BEs? All three are in the same price range and, while the T10s definitely seem to pull ahead in build quality, I'm not sure how they stack up to the two sound-wise. I've seen a lot of really mixed reviews on the T10s, and, since I haven't tried them with a proper set of tips, I don't have a 100% solid answer on the sound.


----------



## suman134

krad54 said:


> By the DN-1ks, do you mean the Dunu DN-1000s? They're around $180 on Amazon, so I'm guessing that's a good deal then. How do you think they stack up to the T10s and, while we're at it, the GR07-BEs? All three are in the same price range and, while the T10s definitely seem to pull ahead in build quality, I'm not sure how they stack up to the two sound-wise. I've seen a lot of really mixed reviews on the T10s, and, since I haven't tried them with a proper set of tips, I don't have a 100% solid answer on the sound.


 
  I dont know much about T10s, Never been exposed to them, but i can tell you that they have their ups and downs, i have seen people who are not much happy with its performance, But Dn-1000 is superb, hard to find a guy who dislikes them (not those who havent tried), Same goes for the GR07 but one can complain about its Bass still being enough for bass lovers, bur DN-1k has bigger bass to bosst.
  
  Out of these 3 i will go for Dn-1k any day, i love balance, but i will still take it because its bass is fast, decay is good.


----------



## ljokerl

krad54 said:


> Hey guys, I'm a long-time lurker and I'd like to say that you guys are great for helping with headphone research. Right now I'm looking to upgrade from my Klipsch Image S4s to a better pair of IEMs. I tested the RHA T10is, which had great build quality, but just seemed to be missing something as far as sound went. I'm looking for a pair of warm, bassy IEMs less than $250. Any ideas? I've heard great things about the SE215s, but I'm not sure if they're enough of a step-up from the S4s to be worth it.


 
  
 The RHA MA750 may not have as much bass as the T10, but is a more well-rounded and arguably more natural-sounding warm IEM. It is also quite good value - better than the T10 IMO. The Yamaha EPH-100 would be my other recommendation.
  
 The DN-1000 would also be a very good option - a little less bassy and brighter, but not far removed from the v-shaped tuning of the S4.
  
 The T10s have more bass, and if you need that level of enhancement you may not find anything better, but I personally prefer the sets above.


----------



## krad54

ljokerl said:


> The RHA MA750 may not have as much bass as the T10, but is a more well-rounded and arguably more natural-sounding warm IEM. It is also quite good value - better than the T10 IMO. The Yamaha EPH-100 would be my other recommendation.
> 
> The DN-1000 would also be a very good option - a little less bassy and brighter, but not far removed from the v-shaped tuning of the S4.
> 
> The T10s have more bass, and if you need that level of enhancement you may not find anything better, but I personally prefer the sets above.




I know they go a bit over the price range I quoted, but how do the dn-2ks compare with the dn-1ks?


----------



## oldschool

Any plans on reviewing the EarSonics Velvet? I see you compared them with the Gorilla GX-4b


----------



## ljokerl

krad54 said:


> I know they go a bit over the price range I quoted, but how do the dn-2ks compare with the dn-1ks?


 
  
 In this case probably not a better fit for you than the DN-1000s. I compared them here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/dunu-dn-2000/
  


oldschool said:


> Any plans on reviewing the EarSonics Velvet? I see you compared them with the Gorilla GX-4b


 
  
 Yep, that review is in the works!


----------



## getclikinagas

oldschool said:


> Any plans on reviewing the EarSonics Velvet? I see you compared them with the Gorilla GX-4b


 


ljokerl said:


> Yep, that review is in the works!


 
  
 Awesome.

@oldschool average_joe has recently posted a very good review of the Velvet, in case you've missed it.
 http://theheadphonelist.com/ciem_review/earsonics-velvet-in-ear-monitor-review/


----------



## oldschool

getclikinagas said:


> Awesome.
> 
> @oldschool average_joe has recently posted a very good review of the Velvet, in case you've missed it.
> http://theheadphonelist.com/ciem_review/earsonics-velvet-in-ear-monitor-review/


 
  
 Thanks, I know, I am also interested in ljokerl's review for the sake of consistently comparing Velvet with the SM64 across all features


----------



## missalaire

Has anyone tried the Shure SE215 limited edition and the SE315? Currently have an order with Massdrop for the SE215 LE, but I'm wondering if it'd be worth getting the SE315 for just a little bit more.


----------



## suman134

missalaire said:


> Has anyone tried the Shure SE215 limited edition and the SE315? Currently have an order with Massdrop for the SE215 LE, but I'm wondering if it'd be worth getting the SE315 for just a little bit more.


 

  If you want bass then no, Se215 is bassy and has enough rumble, 315 is good too but its slightly more balanced, with more details to it. If you are after Sq you should go for 315 but it tends to distort at extreme volume.


----------



## suman134

P.S.  when i pair it with My AP001, it distorts, else its fine.


----------



## missalaire

suman134 said:


> If you want bass then no, Se215 is bassy and has enough rumble, 315 is good too but its slightly more balanced, with more details to it. If you are after Sq you should go for 315 but it tends to distort at extreme volume.


 
 Good to know. Think I'll just stick to the SE215s. Thanks!


----------



## Trying2Learn

So I'm burning in my vsd3s and all over I hear something around 250 hours. Is this 250 accumulated, or 250 hours STRAIGHT? If I do 250 hours of pink noise straight is that OK? Or will it damage the drivers or something?


----------



## Trying2Learn

Also, what is all the fuss about "good" pink noise and pink noise generators? Aren't there millions of youtube pink noise videos? Im using the ten hour one and now im scared its just static...


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> So I'm burning in my vsd3s and all over I hear something around 250 hours. Is this 250 accumulated, or 250 hours STRAIGHT? If I do 250 hours of pink noise straight is that OK? Or will it damage the drivers or something?


 

  No no, not straight, do it in 8-10 hours sessions, moderate volume, mix it with pink and white noise, give some break in between, i dont think it needs 250 hours, 100 should do it, or just listen to your music. It will burn itself.
  Reviewers need processes like these, some times they dont have much time and have multiple phone in their hand and they do it often, not you, just listen to your music, why leave a new earphone alone. Use it as you should and burn it while you are asleep.


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Also, what is all the fuss about "good" pink noise and pink noise generators? Aren't there millions of youtube pink noise videos? Im using the ten hour one and now im scared its just static...


 

  Dont bother about these noises, just play your usual music, make a small playlist of different genre you listen and play them in a loop for burning. But still you can obtain some white and pink noise wav files, just loop it, dont have to be 10 hrs long.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Thanks all for the info and fast reply


----------



## krad54

ljokerl said:


> In this case probably not a better fit for you than the DN-1000s. I compared them here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/dunu-dn-2000/
> 
> 
> Yep, that review is in the works!


 

 Sorry to keep flooding the thread with questions, but how do the Sennheiser IE8s/IE80s stack up against the DUNUs overall? The reason I'm asking is that both are around my budget and Sennheiser is just a more recognizable audio brand for me. Also the IE8s are some of the highest rated headphones in the in-ear category on the site. Amazon has 5 in stock, and I plan on buying whatever I get from Amazon, since I have a gift card.
  
 -Krad


----------



## Trying2Learn

How do the RHA MA750i compare to the VSD3S? I would actually like a T10i but its a little out of my budget.


----------



## ljokerl

krad54 said:


> Sorry to keep flooding the thread with questions, but how do the Sennheiser IE8s/IE80s stack up against the DUNUs overall? The reason I'm asking is that both are around my budget and Sennheiser is just a more recognizable audio brand for me. Also the IE8s are some of the highest rated headphones in the in-ear category on the site. Amazon has 5 in stock, and I plan on buying whatever I get from Amazon, since I have a gift card.
> 
> -Krad


 
  
 The Sennheisers have been around a lot longer and there was much, much less competition when they were introduced, so they had time to build up a huge following. They're a warmer, smoother sort of earphone versus the brighter, livelier DN-1000s. The Senns are fine if you need a major brand, but they don't really offer anything over a cheaper RHA MA750i or Yamaha EPH-100 in terms of sound, and aren't very similar to the DN-1000. 
  


trying2learn said:


> How do the RHA MA750i compare to the VSD3S? I would actually like a T10i but its a little out of my budget.


 
  
 The MA750 is warmer, bassier, and smoother than the VSD3S, at the expense of being a bit more bloated and less crisp. It still sounds pretty natural, though, especially the smoother highs. The T10i is even bassier than that, which is one of the reasons I prefer the MA750.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Would you consider the Ma750 a direct upgrade from the VSD3S? Im just lurking around not because i am dissatisfied with the VSD3S, i love them, but it kinda became a pursuit of perfection! *wallet emptying intensifies* 
I like the bass quality and quantity, and the highs. I guess I like V shaped IEM's. Any suggestions for an upgrade from Vsd3s? This is not in the immediate future so things like the Havi B6(what happened to that thread) could be a viable option too.


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Would you consider the Ma750 a direct upgrade from the VSD3S? Im just lurking around not because i am dissatisfied with the VSD3S, i love them, but it kinda became a pursuit of perfection! *wallet emptying intensifies*
> I like the bass quality and quantity, and the highs. I guess I like V shaped IEM's. Any suggestions for an upgrade from Vsd3s? This is not in the immediate future so things like the Havi B6(what happened to that thread) could be a viable option too.


 

  No, not the havi, look over this price range, Try looking at the DN-1k. It can be an upgrade to VSD3S.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Havi B6 Pirate isnt expected to be an upgrade to vsd3s? Isnt there a dual dynamic version as well? It should be out soon I should think(and hope) because it got delayed from Jan 2015, right? and now its May. And if my wallet was big enough for Dunu 1k i might as well go a bit further for T10, based on reviews on both of them(bass+ and filters are cool!) To me, the T10's really are aesthetically breathtaking while I feel like the Vsd3s look better than the Dunu 1k. Not that its about aesthetics, of course.


----------



## suman134

trying2learn said:


> Havi B6 Pirate isnt expected to be an upgrade to vsd3s? Isnt there a dual dynamic version as well? It should be out soon I should think(and hope) because it got delayed from Jan 2015, right? and now its May. And if my wallet was big enough for Dunu 1k i might as well go a bit further for T10, based on reviews on both of them(bass+ and filters are cool!) To me, the T10's really are aesthetically breathtaking while I feel like the Vsd3s look better than the Dunu 1k. Not that its about aesthetics, of course.


 

  Who knows how the B6 will be, bass was lean on B3 and it can be the same here. And tuning faults cant be ignored. If you are after bass and nothing else bothers you then T10 is good. Filter or no filter, T10 as far as i know is not worth my money.


----------



## ljokerl

trying2learn said:


> Would you consider the Ma750 a direct upgrade from the VSD3S?


 
  
 No, in my mind to be called a direct upgrade over something else an earphone should have the same/pretty similar sound signature.


----------



## compoopers

Would love to see your impressions of the new Xiaomi Piston 3 as compared to the 2!


----------



## ljokerl

compoopers said:


> Would love to see your impressions of the new Xiaomi Piston 3 as compared to the 2!


 
  
 In two words, "less bassy" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





.
  
 Review coming soon.


----------



## ljokerl

Speaking of bassy, NHT SuperBuds review has been added.
  
 The most up-to-date IEM ranking can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2B66) NHT SuperBuds*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Click

ljokerl said:


> In two words, "less bassy"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 How about "much improved"


----------



## Sound Eq

what a list amazing info


----------



## goldtuba

Once again, thank you for the great source of information.  This time I actually have a question.  I recently bought the Hifiman RE600 when the price dropped to $200.  I absolutely love the sound, but I hate the build quality.  I've also always preferred "over the ear" to "cable down" style.  Even with this preference, I still listen to the RE600 much more than my Westone 4.  Is there anything that sounds close, but is in the "over the ear" style?  Staying in the $400 price range is ideal, but if you have any suggestions that are significantly more I might be willing to spend "end game" money.  Thank you very much for your time.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Has anyone tried the CIEMs by Null Audio? Specifically the ones they teamed up with Advanced Acousticwerks? I'm kind of looking into CIEM's preferably under $200 or around 200 which is a pretty shallow pond(and wallet). Thanks!


----------



## ozkan

goldtuba said:


> Once again, thank you for the great source of information.  This time I actually have a question.  I recently bought the Hifiman RE600 when the price dropped to $200.  I absolutely love the sound, but I hate the build quality.  I've also always preferred "over the ear" to "cable down" style.  Even with this preference, I still listen to the RE600 much more than my Westone 4.  Is there anything that sounds close, but is in the "over the ear" style?  Staying in the $400 price range is ideal, but if you have any suggestions that are significantly more I might be willing to spend "end game" money.  Thank you very much for your time.


 
  
 Why don't you wear RE600 cable up if you really like its sound? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 You can use an ear guide.


----------



## ljokerl

goldtuba said:


> Once again, thank you for the great source of information.  This time I actually have a question.  I recently bought the Hifiman RE600 when the price dropped to $200.  I absolutely love the sound, but I hate the build quality.  I've also always preferred "over the ear" to "cable down" style.  Even with this preference, I still listen to the RE600 much more than my Westone 4.  Is there anything that sounds close, but is in the "over the ear" style?  Staying in the $400 price range is ideal, but if you have any suggestions that are significantly more I might be willing to spend "end game" money.  Thank you very much for your time.


 
  
 Yeah, what ozkan said. You won't find anything closer to the RE-600 than the RE-600, especially at that price point, and they can be worn cable-up with a bit of effort.
  
 If you want a native over-the-ear IEM, I guess you could try finding a TDK BA200. Beyond that, you start diverging into alternatives with slightly warmer/smoother signatures (e.g. Sony MDR-7550, StageDiver SD-2, maybe even Custom Art Music One), and those with slightly brighter signatures like your Ultimate Ears 900s, Custom Art Pro 330v2s, Noble 4 customs, and so on.


----------



## goldtuba

ozkan said:


> Why don't you wear RE600 cable up if you really like its sound?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 I do wear it cable up, but the small size and weight make it difficult to keep it in my ear.  The only time that I use these are when I am out and about or walking my dog.  I don't think that I can keep any IEM in my ear when I'm walking her, but that's an entirely different problem.  Maybe I just need to invest in some ear guides.  I do plan on getting it recabled as the stock cable is already falling apart. Do you have any suggestions for cable guides or will any that I find work about the same?


----------



## ljokerl

goldtuba said:


> I do wear it cable up, but the small size and weight make it difficult to keep it in my ear.  The only time that I use these are when I am out and about or walking my dog.  I don't think that I can keep any IEM in my ear when I'm walking her, but that's an entirely different problem.  Maybe I just need to invest in some ear guides.  I do plan on getting it recabled as the stock cable is already falling apart. Do you have any suggestions for cable guides or will any that I find work about the same?


 
  
 I would try to find thicker cable guides... the thin ones with pressure points put extra strain on the cable. The pair that I got with my MEElec A161P works pretty well - I think these are them: http://www.meelec.com/MEElectronics_Over_the_Ear_Cable_Guides_p/ep-cableguide-bk.htm


----------



## RochRx7

Good workout IEMs? $100? 
  
 Something warm, slighty subdued treble.. EDMbased music.
  
 Shure SE215? 
 MEE M6 sport?
 Jaybirds Bluebuds X?
 Soundmagic E30?
 Xaomi Pistons 2.1?


----------



## ozkan

rochrx7 said:


> Good workout IEMs? $100?
> 
> Something warm, slighty subdued treble.. EDMbased music.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Pistons has emphasized bass and treble. I would recommend looking into IM50 or Hifiman RE300 for gym/workout purposes. IM50 is brilliant for EDM based music.


----------



## ZapX629

ozkan said:


> Pistons has emphasized bass and treble. I would recommend looking into IM50 or Hifiman RE300 for gym/workout purposes. IM50 is brilliant for EDM based music.


 

 Would second the IM50. My go to workout IEM. Warm, mid forward, smooth, but detailed treble.


----------



## Shawn71

rochrx7 said:


> Good workout IEMs? $100?
> 
> Something warm, slighty subdued treble.. EDMbased music.
> 
> ...


 

 MEelec M6/M6 sport - perfect budget WO IEM (even for side sleep) with kick arse bass, but bit more treble energy,equally.....The fit is not an issue at all with the supplied M stock tips (universal tips that fits snug most IEMs) along with bi & tri- flanges and built-in memory wire.....
  
 edit=> take a look on M6 PRO as well....


----------



## big-country

I've followed this thread for some time, and have referenced back to it time and time again before blind buying a set of IEMs, great job man truly an in depth wealth of knowledge 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Right now I'm currently in the market for a set of IEMs for playing video games at a competitive level. I run with a set of full size cans, but at times I like to be able to do other things whilst in a gaming session or be able to have a conversation with those around me or enjoy music or a movie in the background. What I would be looking for is something with great detail whoring and positional ques, of course comfort would be a factor as well. Budget is open as long as I would be getting what I paid for in the end. Thank you in advance for any insight and help provided


----------



## marlonmarabe

please review the sony xba-a2 when you have the chance. the audio community should know about it. the best under 300$ iem in my books


----------



## Trying2Learn

Sorry for bringing it up again, but nothing on the Null Audio entry level ceim?


----------



## ljokerl

rochrx7 said:


> Good workout IEMs? $100?
> 
> Something warm, slighty subdued treble.. EDMbased music.
> 
> ...


 
  
   
 

 Out of these definitely SE215 for performance. M6 is good and works well for EDM but as Shawn71 said treble is not that subdued. Might be a better value for workouts at $20 if you're going to abuse them, though. Replacment M6 is cheaper than a replacement Shure cable.
  


big-country said:


> I've followed this thread for some time, and have referenced back to it time and time again before blind buying a set of IEMs, great job man truly an in depth wealth of knowledge
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't know anything about gaming with IEMs so I'm probably not the right person to ask. Not sure how IEMs will help your goal of interacting with others - a good IEM will isolate more outside noise than a full-size can.
  
 With that said, you can get good detail and imaging with a relatively inexpensive IEM - VSonic VSD3S for instance, or better yet the Havi B3 PRO I. 
  


trying2learn said:


> Sorry for bringing it up again, but nothing on the Null Audio entry level ceim?


 
  
 I am not familiar with this brand.


----------



## Dynamoes1

I've been working out with the SE215's for some time now and they're great. Great for blocking out noise but especially if you have foam tips, if you workout with someone then you'll struggle to hear them even with music off. However for sweat resistance and how well they stay in while running (very hard running at that), I've been impressed. I'd recommend.


----------



## RochRx7

In regards to the workout IEM question in the $100 range for EDM.
  
 Purely out of curiosity.. what headphones (on-ear and over-ear) fall into this category in the $100-$200 range? 
  
 I would think:
  
 UE6000
 Beyer COP
 Momentums On&Over-Ears
 VModa M80
 Anything else?


----------



## ljokerl

rochrx7 said:


> In regards to the workout IEM question in the $100 range for EDM.
> 
> Purely out of curiosity.. what headphones (on-ear and over-ear) fall into this category in the $100-$200 range?
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't know what qualifies an on/over-ear headphone for workout but I like the HD25 with EDM, personally. It's got a mildly v-shaped sig that works well. Other all-around good headphones with a bass emphasis should work fine, too - I generally like all of the ones you've listed.


----------



## ayaflo

Hi Joker,
  
 I am trying to make a decision between 2 iems. 
  
 I have an offer standing for the Audio Technica CK100 PRO for $200 and a Dunu DN1000 for $100. 
  
 I have had many TWFK sets & one Shure SE-535, find myself preferring an analytical sound. 
  
 Which among the 2 would you suggest?
  
 Thanks,


----------



## ozkan

ayaflo said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I am trying to make a decision between 2 iems.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I would suggest CK100PRO since DN1000 is not a neutral IEM with some emphasis on bass and treble. They aren't analytical but more on the fun side.


----------



## WhatToChoose

With reference to Se215, it does have excellent build quality, but not sure about sweat resistance and SQ.

Had it for 3 years, right earbud had been intermittently working. Took it off and there was some corrosion in the mmcx connector....weird stuff.

Also the the sound was ok, about 6/10, but didn't give enough energy for the music I believe. Too muddy. Though to their credit they do stay in your ear excellently, and are very comfortable. 

Unless you do not care for treble energy, I would look elsewhere. 
Perhaps the RHA MA750s, or the DJE1500s. Definitely need a dynamic driver for workout though, unless you do bench presses to Mozart....might be interesting actually...


----------



## suman134

ayaflo said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I am trying to make a decision between 2 iems.
> 
> ...


 

  Same here, CK100 pro, DN-1k is good but its balance is not up to the mark, You had the Titan right, It was slightly V shaped, and DUNU is a bit more in the V. Its not bad or anything but loses some kudos just because of it, Other wise for $100, its analytical enough, And for perceived details ans analyzing, Its slightly below 100 Pro. Just because of its slight bass bolt.
 Chose any, you wont be disappointed unless you want balance, cuz for balance DN-1k is not recommended. If you ask me, i will go for CK100 Pro.


----------



## korzena

I am thinking of upgrading my beloved Westone 3 with an even better IEM. I would like something similar sounding to my Westones or LCD headphones (e.g. LCD-X). The next iem should be musical, have great tone, great resolution and higher overall sound quality than W3.
  
 Could you suggest me something up to $700?


----------



## ljokerl

ayaflo said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> I am trying to make a decision between 2 iems.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I don't have any experience with the CK100 PRO. The DN-1000 can be thought of as a v-shaped, enhanced-bass earphone with a rather exciting sound signature, but it can also be considered an analytical earphone similar to the TWFK-based Brainwavz B2 or ATH-CK10, but with an added subwoofer. Of course the bass won't be as flat and fast on the DN-1000 as those BA monitors, but the upper part of the frequency spectrum isn't very different. 
  
  
   


korzena said:


> I am thinking of upgrading my beloved Westone 3 with an even better IEM. I would like something similar sounding to my Westones or LCD headphones (e.g. LCD-X). The next iem should be musical, have great tone, great resolution and higher overall sound quality than W3.
> 
> Could you suggest me something up to $700?


 

  
 Hmm.. the Audeze headphones don't really sound much like a Westone 3 (the ones I've had are warmer and smoother, with none of that v-shaped character of the Westones). 
  
 You can consider the StageDiver SD-2 for a more balanced sound, it's always reminded me to the LCD-2 in some ways. Won't have the bass hump of the Westones, but it's not missing bass. A Sony MDR-7550 is pretty good as well, though it's a little more dry. 
  
 With the budget there might be something in the custom market to look at as well, but I can't think of anything that's as smooth as an Audeze, not hugely bassy, and not potentially sacrificing clarity some compared to the brighter W3.


----------



## signmeuptoo

I just left my iPhone for a Samsung Galaxy S5, and I'm in love, but there seems to be hardly any Android *phone* IEMs, replete with mic and buttons. can anyone recommend some between 40 and 80 bucks?  I'm not a bass head.  I'm in my late 50's, so my hearing isn't the best and I want those airy highs and good sound stage.  Also: the last5 IEMs I've owned the cords failed internally, anything that will last daily use, I'm not abusive!


----------



## esteebin

signmeuptoo said:


> I just left my iPhone for a Samsung Galaxy S5, and I'm in love, but there seems to be hardly any Android *phone* IEMs, replete with mic and buttons. can anyone recommend some between 40 and 80 bucks?  I'm not a bass head.  I'm in my late 50's, so my hearing isn't the best and I want those airy highs and good sound stage.  Also: the last5 IEMs I've owned the cords failed internally, anything that will last daily use, I'm not abusive!




Xiaomi Piston 3. It's a Chinese brand that is for Android complete with volume buttons and the play/call button. Can be had for less than $20. Reviews say it's more balanced than the 2nd version (which I have). 

Sennheiser has the Momentum in ear (they have separate iOS and Android versions) but costs $99


----------



## korzena

> Hmm.. the Audeze headphones don't really sound much like a Westone 3 (the ones I've had are warmer and smoother, with none of that v-shaped character of the Westones).
> 
> You can consider the StageDiver SD-2 for a more balanced sound, it's always reminded me to the LCD-2 in some ways. Won't have the bass hump of the Westones, but it's not missing bass. A Sony MDR-7550 is pretty good as well, though it's a little more dry.
> 
> With the budget there might be something in the custom market to look at as well, but I can't think of anything that's as smooth as an Audeze, not hugely bassy, and not potentially sacrificing clarity some compared to the brighter W3.


 
 Thanks for the reply.
 Actually you're are right, Audeze and Westone 3 are different sounding headphones. But I like the sound of both and would be happy to find an IEM which is Audeze-like or an IEM that is enhancing Westone 3's sound especially by increasing its resolution.


----------



## ljokerl

signmeuptoo said:


> I just left my iPhone for a Samsung Galaxy S5, and I'm in love, but there seems to be hardly any Android *phone* IEMs, replete with mic and buttons. can anyone recommend some between 40 and 80 bucks?  I'm not a bass head.  I'm in my late 50's, so my hearing isn't the best and I want those airy highs and good sound stage.  Also: the last5 IEMs I've owned the cords failed internally, anything that will last daily use, I'm not abusive!


 
  
 Yep, Xiaomi Piston 2 or 3 if you want buttons (plural). Both have 3-button Android remotes (I actually prefer the remote on the Piston 2 because the buttons are a bit easier to use without looking). Both sound really good, too - the Piston 3 is indeed more balanced while the 2 is on the warmer and bassier side. Not super airy, but in that price range and with a 3-button Android remote it doesn't get any better than these two.


----------



## JamesBr

signmeuptoo said:


> I just left my iPhone for a Samsung Galaxy S5, and I'm in love, but there seems to be hardly any Android *phone* IEMs, replete with mic and buttons. can anyone recommend some between 40 and 80 bucks?  I'm not a bass head.  I'm in my late 50's, so my hearing isn't the best and I want those airy highs and good sound stage.  Also: the last5 IEMs I've owned the cords failed internally, anything that will last daily use, I'm not abusive!


 
  
 You're one of the rare that goes from Iphone to Android  I use TTpod good stuff!


----------



## warrior1975

jamesbr said:


> You're one of the rare that goes from Iphone to Android I use TTpod good stuff!




There are a few of us here!


----------



## garcsa

Hi joker, Ladies  & Gentleman and Mr. Ozzy Osbourne,
 One of my favorite IEM is GR07 Classic, I'm looking for something similar with some 2-3 dB more on 20-30 Hz and without sibilance (or less prone to it). Are there something  I'd like...? Limit is $250 (ok 300...). Peace out!


----------



## ljokerl

garcsa said:


> Hi joker, Ladies  & Gentleman and Mr. Ozzy Osbourne,
> One of my favorite IEM is GR07 Classic, I'm looking for something similar with some 2-3 dB more on 20-30 Hz and without sibilance (or less prone to it). Are there something  I'd like...? Limit is $250 (ok 300...). Peace out!


 
  
 That's a tough one. The Philips Fidelio S2 might be an option as that is about how I would describe it - with a good fit (which can be a bit challenging as it's a shallow-sealing earphone) it has similar deep bass and a hair less mid-bass than the GR07 Bass Edition (which is right in line with your bass requirement) and takes off some of the sibilance of the GR07s (at the expense of a bit more upper midrange lift).
  
 With a slightly less literal interpretation you have some other options. The Dunu DN-2000, for instance - its sound is overall more U-shaped than that of the VSonic, but with the right combination of tips and spacers you can get sibilance well below GR07 levels and the sub-bass is more powerful.


----------



## garcsa

ljokerl said:


> That's a tough one. The Philips Fidelio S2 might be an option as that is about how I would describe it - with a good fit (which can be a bit challenging as it's a shallow-sealing earphone) it has similar deep bass and a hair less mid-bass than the GR07 Bass Edition (which is right in line with your bass requirement) and takes off some of the sibilance of the GR07s (at the expense of a bit more upper midrange lift).
> 
> With a slightly less literal interpretation you have some other options. The Dunu DN-2000, for instance - its sound is overall more U-shaped than that of the VSonic, but with the right combination of tips and spacers you can get sibilance well below GR07 levels and the sub-bass is more powerful.


 
 Yep, the DN2000 was on my list, just wait would you mention it ... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 . Thanks.


----------



## ZapX629

garcsa said:


> Hi joker, Ladies  & Gentleman and Mr. Ozzy Osbourne,
> One of my favorite IEM is GR07 Classic, I'm looking for something similar with some 2-3 dB more on 20-30 Hz and without sibilance (or less prone to it). Are there something  I'd like...? Limit is $250 (ok 300...). Peace out!


 

 I think you'd like the CKR9 from Audio Technica. It's a very similar overall sound to the GR07, but with more subbass, less sibilance, and a much improved soundstage. The midrange is more forward as well making them a bit less recessed than the GR07 (not that I ever had issue with the GR07's detailed mids). The CKR9 was that GR07 on steroids that I was looking for and I'm still blown away by the resolution, depth, control, and detail that I hear when I listen to it.


----------



## signmeuptoo

jamesbr said:


> You're one of the rare that goes from Iphone to Android I use TTpod good stuff!


 

 I suppose we're not THAT rare, especially with phones like the new Samsung S6 Edge (I'm using an S5) with build quality on part or better than Apple's.  I'm a function over form person, though, which is why I was so unhappy with my iPhone 4s.  I've loving the S5, the sound quality is better, the sound quality is not AS good as my Cowon D2, but very close to it, but I need some IEMs to explore things.  I listen to Fusion, Rock, Progressive, Alternative Rock, Jazz, Symphony, World, and some other stuff.  I have some hearing loss but I'm still able to tell the difference between crappy and good stuff (I used to be a lead guitarist and damaged my hearing somewhat).


----------



## signmeuptoo

ljokerl said:


> Yep, Xiaomi Piston 2 or 3 if you want buttons (plural). Both have 3-button Android remotes (I actually prefer the remote on the Piston 2 because the buttons are a bit easier to use without looking). Both sound really good, too - the Piston 3 is indeed more balanced while the 2 is on the warmer and bassier side. Not super airy, but in that price range and with a 3-button Android remote it doesn't get any better than these two.


 

 Are the Xiaomi's fairly durable?  Sadly, the only Earphones that have lasted any amount of time that I've had were the stock Apple iPhone junkers, I just recently did the cord in on them, and just in the hick of time I've gotten a new phone.   Why can't they make these things with stronger cords?  And why so few Android IEMs?


----------



## suman134

signmeuptoo said:


> Are the Xiaomi's fairly durable?  Sadly, the only Earphones that have lasted any amount of time that I've had were the stock Apple iPhone junkers, I just recently did the cord in on them, and just in the hick of time I've gotten a new phone.   Why can't they make these things with stronger cords?  And why so few Android IEMs?


 

 Most of the apple compatible earphones will work with android, but you will only be picking/ending calls and playing/pausing music with the central button, if its a one button thing, then its exactly same.


----------



## suman134

You can pick philips headsets, which are universally compatible.


----------



## signmeuptoo

I wonder why somebody hasn't made an adapter (is it possible) for Apple compatible phones to work with Android?


----------



## garcsa

zapx629 said:


> I think you'd like the CKR9 from Audio Technica. It's a very similar overall sound to the GR07, but with more subbass, less sibilance, and a much improved soundstage. The midrange is more forward as well making them a bit less recessed than the GR07 (not that I ever had issue with the GR07's detailed mids). The CKR9 was that GR07 on steroids that I was looking for and I'm still blown away by the resolution, depth, control, and detail that I hear when I listen to it.


 
 Thanks ZapX629! Sounds interesting ... possible to try


----------



## Trying2Learn

I've decided I'll just spend a bunch (compared to my current $55 VSD3S) and go with a very entry level CIEM for around 250-300 ish but now the T20 pops up? Some Sony BA's and Dunu's caught my eye as well. Much more strong choices in that price range :/


----------



## JamesBr

signmeuptoo said:


> I wonder why somebody hasn't made an adapter (is it possible) for Apple compatible phones to work with Android?


 
  
 It has been done already a quick google search and you'll find a lot of options!


----------



## InnovatedMind

Thank you for this amazing resource, Joker. So much hard work!!

Do you have any plans on reviewing the Sony XBA-A3?


----------



## UnityIsPower

@ljokerl any news you might have on wireless iem's around GR07BE/Rockets/DN1000 in performance?


----------



## ljokerl

innovatedmind said:


> Thank you for this amazing resource, Joker. So much hard work!!
> 
> Do you have any plans on reviewing the Sony XBA-A3?


 
  
 No A3. I have the XBA-Z5 but it's more of a basshead IEM so I'm not sure I will review it. Not something I'd buy for $700, personally. 
  


unityispower said:


> @ljokerl any news you might have on wireless iem's around GR07BE/Rockets/DN1000 in performance?


 
  
 Haven't tried anything like that. The best wireless IEM I have is the Sony SBH80, but that basically sounds like the Sony MH1C.


----------



## jjacq

This might be not the right thread but I'm curious if you guys know of an IEM that sounds similar to the Angie that's around or below that price. Preferably a universal!


----------



## Wildcatsare1

jjacq said:


> This might be not the right thread but I'm curious if you guys know of an IEM that sounds similar to the Angie that's around or below that price. Preferably a universal!


 

 Not a Universal, but one of the best CIEMs I have heard, at a really great price, the Alclair RSMs.


----------



## Penghao

Hi Joker!
  
 Thank you so much for the kick-ass reviews. I am looking for an upgrade ciem to replace my TF10. I'm a big fan of that type of analytical sound signature, just wondering how is the Alclair Reference falls into this category? Other than that, what are some other ciems have the similar sound signature close to TF10. Or I should say like a super ungrade version of TF10. Thanks!!!
  
 Bty, have ever reviewed some other first-tier ciems like UM Mentor, UM Mason, ES60, JH Angie, JH Layla, UE18, Ambient Acoustics AM10. Really, really looking forward to see those if possible.   : )


----------



## ljokerl

penghao said:


> Hi Joker!
> 
> Thank you so much for the kick-ass reviews. I am looking for an upgrade ciem to replace my TF10. I'm a big fan of that type of analytical sound signature, just wondering how is the Alclair Reference falls into this category? Other than that, what are some other ciems have the similar sound signature close to TF10. Or I should say like a super ungrade version of TF10. Thanks!!!
> 
> Bty, have ever reviewed some other first-tier ciems like UM Mentor, UM Mason, ES60, JH Angie, JH Layla, UE18, Ambient Acoustics AM10. Really, really looking forward to see those if possible.   : )


 
  
 All of the top-tier IEMs I currently have are reviewed in this thread with the exception of the Heir Audio 8.A, Westone ES5, and Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro. 
  
 For analytical, slightly v-shaped sound the Reference would be a good choice if you're limited to that price range. If you're open to spending more I would also look at the 1964EARS V6-Stage. More $$ than that - the Custom Art Harmony 8 Pro or even the JHAudio JH13.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the Brainwavz S0. The latest ranking including the S0 can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A92) Brainwavz S0*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2015
> ...


----------



## jekostas

This might be a bit of an odd question but how would the Ortofon EQ-5 compare to the JVC FXT90?  I know the sonic signatures aren't a perfect match but with the yen so low the Ortofon is dropping to a price where I would seriously consider it.  I also don't have anything else in that tier of headphone that you've reviewed.


----------



## ljokerl

jekostas said:


> This might be a bit of an odd question but how would the Ortofon EQ-5 compare to the JVC FXT90?  I know the sonic signatures aren't a perfect match but with the yen so low the Ortofon is dropping to a price where I would seriously consider it.  I also don't have anything else in that tier of headphone that you've reviewed.


 
  
 Yeah, they're not similar. Ortofons are pretty well-balanced, maybe a touch warmer than neutral but not significantly so. Very good earphones if you're in that situation where you don't want much of a bass boost OR a super flat sound. The FXT90 has a more conventional "v-shaped" sound tuning with enhanced bass and sparkly treble, and a more forward presentation as well compared to the more spacious e-Q5.


----------



## jekostas

Thanks for the reply, however let's try this again since I just managed to break my favourite earphones (OM Audio Inearpeace).
  
 I'd like smooth, detailed but with a decent bass kick.  I can probably budget up to $150, since that would be the approximate cost of just buying another pair.  Thoughts?  I'd like a bit more bass than something like the RE-400, for example.


----------



## suman134

jekostas said:


> Thanks for the reply, however let's try this again since I just managed to break my favourite earphones (OM Audio Inearpeace).
> 
> I'd like smooth, detailed but with a decent bass kick.  I can probably budget up to $150, since that would be the approximate cost of just buying another pair.  Thoughts?  I'd like a bit more bass than something like the RE-400, for example.


 

  The new Fidue A73 can be considered.


----------



## ljokerl

jekostas said:


> Thanks for the reply, however let's try this again since I just managed to break my favourite earphones (OM Audio Inearpeace).
> 
> I'd like smooth, detailed but with a decent bass kick.  I can probably budget up to $150, since that would be the approximate cost of just buying another pair.  Thoughts?  I'd like a bit more bass than something like the RE-400, for example.


 
  
 Most dynamics and some BAs will have more bass than the RE-400, so you're in luck there. The smooth treble while maintaining detail is the hard part - you have sets like the RHA MA750, which by virtue of being rather bassy end up losing some detail in the midrange compared to the RE-400 and other flatter earphones. And then you have sets like the GR07BE, which have both the bass kick and the clarity/detail, but aren't particularly smooth.
  
 Your options are to try something like the Yamaha EPH-100, which is similar to the MA750 in some ways but gets less clarity penalties from its bass, or to go with a mid-range set like a Sony MH1C, which has the right sound sig and could just use a little more bass control and clarity to compete with high-end earphones. But in some cases having the right sound sig is worth it.
  
 Now, these are all fairly boosted at the low end. If you just want a bit more bass than the RE-400, you have the Brainwavz R3 (literally just a bit bassier)


----------



## ozkan

jekostas said:


> Thanks for the reply, however let's try this again since I just managed to break my favourite earphones (OM Audio Inearpeace).
> 
> I'd like smooth, detailed but with a decent bass kick.  I can probably budget up to $150, since that would be the approximate cost of just buying another pair.  Thoughts?  I'd like a bit more bass than something like the RE-400, for example.


 
  
 Etymotic MK5 if you don't mind the long term comfort issues.


----------



## nati8056

The dunu dn1000 not work good for me less than a year, I do not hear in right earphone.
 Someone could recommend me eqrphone  that is good upgrading for dunu dn1000?, I want headphones with a strong structure and I wanted something with a lot of bass like dunu but better quality bass and more natural than dunu dn1000.
  
 Sorry for the non-English-Good
  
 until 250$


----------



## ZapX629

jekostas said:


> Thanks for the reply, however let's try this again since I just managed to break my favourite earphones (OM Audio Inearpeace).
> 
> I'd like smooth, detailed but with a decent bass kick.  I can probably budget up to $150, since that would be the approximate cost of just buying another pair.  Thoughts?  I'd like a bit more bass than something like the RE-400, for example.


 

 ATH-IM70 would be my choice. If you can handle a more analytical treble, I'd recommend the CKR9, but if you want smooth, detailed, with a full low end IM70 is your guy.


----------



## ZapX629

nati8056 said:


> The dunu dn1000 not work good for me less than a year, I do not hear in right earphone.
> Someone could recommend me eqrphone  that is good upgrading for dunu dn1000?, I want headphones with a strong structure and I wanted something with a lot of bass like dunu but better quality bass and more natural than dunu dn1000.
> 
> Sorry for the non-English-Good
> ...


 

 CKR10?


----------



## Raketen

Derp, deleted.


----------



## jekostas

Thanks for the suggestions y'all.  Time to do some reading.


----------



## nati8056

nati8056 said:


> The dunu dn1000 not work good for me less than a year, I do not hear in right earphone.
> Someone could recommend me eqrphone  that is good upgrading for dunu dn1000?, I want headphones with a strong structure and I wanted something with a lot of bass like dunu but better quality bass and more natural than dunu dn1000.
> 
> Sorry for the non-English-Good
> ...


 
 what do you say about Custom Art Music One the bass it is high and better qouality than dunu dn1000?


----------



## JamesBr

zapx629 said:


> Enhanced Bass Hi-Fi Noise Isolating Earphones - Black ATH-IM70 would be my choice. If you can handle a more analytical treble, I'd recommend the CKR9, but if you want smooth, detailed, with a full low end IM70 is your guy.


 
  
 When you suggest the ATH-IM70, do you concider the budget? I didn't see so many at this price ...( new)


----------



## ZapX629

jamesbr said:


> When you suggest the ATH-IM70, do you concider the budget? I didn't see so many at this price ...( new)


 

 There's not much I've heard under $150 that's better than the IM70 with its durability. There are some that sound better or as good, but far less durable. They're under or around $100.


----------



## jekostas

jamesbr said:


> When you suggest the ATH-IM70, do you concider the budget? I didn't see so many at this price ...( new)


 
  
 They're $100 shipped on Amazon, so well within my budget


----------



## ZapX629

nati8056 said:


> what do you say about Custom Art Music One the bass it is high and better qouality than dunu dn1000?


 
 Haven't heard those, so couldn't say, but I'm sure Joker will let you know.


----------



## nati8056

thanks i'l wait for joker.
 i think between Custom Art Music One or vc1000,joker gived them 9.2 sound quality like dunu dn1000.
 i want alot of bass,but the vc1000 Much cheaper So maybe worthwhile for me to get used to it.


----------



## jekostas

nati8056 said:


> thanks i'l wait for joker.
> i think between Custom Art Music One or vc1000,joker gived them 9.2 sound quality like dunu dn1000.
> i want alot of bass,but the vc1000 Much cheaper So maybe worthwhile for me to get used to it.


 
  
 You definitely aren't going to get a lot of bass out of the VC1000, as it's a TWFK-based dual balanced armature headphone.


----------



## ljokerl

nati8056 said:


> what do you say about Custom Art Music One the bass it is high and better qouality than dunu dn1000?


 
  


jekostas said:


> You definitely aren't going to get a lot of bass out of the VC1000, as it's a TWFK-based dual balanced armature headphone.


 
  
 Both the Music One and VC1000 have much less bass than a DN-1000.


----------



## suman134

nati8056 said:


> thanks i'l wait for joker.
> i think between Custom Art Music One or vc1000,joker gived them 9.2 sound quality like dunu dn1000.
> i want alot of bass,but the vc1000 Much cheaper So maybe worthwhile for me to get used to it.


 
  


nati8056 said:


> thanks i'l wait for joker.
> i think between Custom Art Music One or vc1000,joker gived them 9.2 sound quality like dunu dn1000.
> i want alot of bass,but the vc1000 Much cheaper So maybe worthwhile for me to get used to it.


 
  Go for the DN-1k, VC1000 is really bass lite.
  


jamesbr said:


> When you suggest the ATH-IM70, do you concider the budget? I didn't see so many at this price ...( new)


 
   
  You my friend go for Fidue A73 or Titan-1 if you can do with lesser isolation.


----------



## nati8056

I have the dunu dn-k and destroyed 's so fast and so I do not want to buy them again.
 And dunu dn-k has a lot of bass and excellent sound quality but the bass did not sound quality as I like and is not comfortable.
 Someone could recommend something good and comfortable?


----------



## murano

jekostas said:


> Thanks for the reply, however let's try this again since I just managed to break my favourite earphones (OM Audio Inearpeace).
> 
> I'd like smooth, detailed but with a decent bass kick.  I can probably budget up to $150, since that would be the approximate cost of just buying another pair.  Thoughts?  I'd like a bit more bass than something like the RE-400, for example.


 
  
 If you happen to have the RE-400, you might want to try using the Inearpeace tips on them because they noticeably improve bass without losing treble.  For me the difference was being unimpressed with the RE-400, to transforming them into one of my all-time favorites


----------



## suman134

nati8056 said:


> I have the dunu dn-k and destroyed 's so fast and so I do not want to buy them again.
> And dunu dn-k has a lot of bass and excellent sound quality but the bass did not sound quality as I like and is not comfortable.
> Someone could recommend something good and comfortable?


 

  Seems like i miss-read you.


----------



## Toom

I had the Brainwavz S5 and couldnt get on with their treble.


----------



## suman134

toom said:


> I had the Brainwavz S5 and couldnt get on with their treble.


 

  A bit splashy? or too less for you.


----------



## Toom

suman134 said:


> A bit splashy? or too less for you.


 
  
 Splish splashy,  Sounded artificial.


----------



## suman134

toom said:


> Splish splashy,  Sounded artificial.


 
 You are looking for a new earphone.


----------



## Toom

suman134 said:


> You are looking for a new earphone.


 
  
 I have the Flare Audio R2A on pledge.


----------



## suman134

toom said:


> I have the Flare Audio R2A on pledge.


 

  Okay!! do share your impression with us.


----------



## jincuteguy

How come you guys don't have the Aurisonics ASG-2.5 on this list?


----------



## RochRx7

jincuteguy said:


> How come you guys don't have the Aurisonics ASG-2.5 on this list?


 
  
 Buy a pair for Joker and send it to him for review?


----------



## UnityIsPower

rochrx7 said:


> Buy a pair for Joker and send it to him for review?




The answer to all our problems :3


----------



## jincuteguy

Trying to decide between Senn IE800 and Aurisonics ASG-2.5, which one u guys think?


----------



## suman134

jincuteguy said:


> Trying to decide between Senn IE800 and Aurisonics ASG-2.5, which one u guys think?


 

 I will go for the ASG. IE800 is good bit its lacking some fullness with the mids.


----------



## jincuteguy

suman134 said:


> I will go for the ASG. IE800 is good bit its lacking some fullness with the mids.


 
 Thx for the recommendation.  So ASG-2.5 it is.  But how is the bass of the IE800 compare to the ASG-2.5?


----------



## suman134

jincuteguy said:


> Thx for the recommendation.  So ASG-2.5 it is.  But how is the bass of the IE800 compare to the ASG-2.5?


 

  To my ears, IE800's bass is slightly boomy with similarly good extension. But ASG is more precise.


----------



## ljokerl

nati8056 said:


> I have the dunu dn-k and destroyed 's so fast and so I do not want to buy them again.
> And dunu dn-k has a lot of bass and excellent sound quality but the bass did not sound quality as I like and is not comfortable.
> Someone could recommend something good and comfortable?


 
  
 Bass not tight enough on the DN-1000? If that's the case probably going to have to either give up some bass quantity in exchange for quality/tightness (e.g. GR07 BE or Philips Fidelio S2) or spend more $$ than the DN-1000 costs (e.g. DN-2000, FLC Technology FLC8, and so on).


----------



## DreamKing

Wrote a review and made a product page for the Perfect Seal SportBud Silver: http://www.head-fi.org/products/perfect-seal-sportbud-silver/reviews/13284
  
 Owned since December 4th, 2014, $250.
  
 Bang-for-buck CIEM from a little known company to the audiophile circles but experienced in the industry for making custom in-ear monitors for musicians / the music industry. Highly recommended if you listen to mostly popular music genres but can work for anything to my ears.


----------



## nati8056

ljokerl said:


> Bass not tight enough on the DN-1000? If that's the case probably going to have to either give up some bass quantity in exchange for quality/tightness (e.g. GR07 BE or Philips Fidelio S2) or spend more $$ than the DN-1000 costs (e.g. DN-2000, FLC Technology FLC8, and so on).


 
 thenk you very much for you reply.
 gr07 you give 9.1 sound quality and dunu dn-k 9.2,I do not want to lose sound quality.
 the Technology FLC8 seems very nice ,but expensive so I think or buy back the dunu dn-k or save some money and I'll buy in the future the FLC8.
  
 By the way what do you say about XBA H3 ,IE 8  ,or perfect seal sporbud? People advised me about them and I'm a little confused


----------



## coastal1

I just got the Sennheiser In Ear Momentum for $100 and like them.  Went on a short (3mi) run this morning and they worked fine - I didn't love the feel of the tips provided when I first put them in but got used to them and they stayed in fine, and trying other tips would be cheap.  Like the sound signature.  
  
 However, I don't know much about IEMs and was wondering how much of a jump in sq I could get if I stretched my budget as I noticed the IE8 is down to $200 on Amazon.  I'm open to other options besides the IE8, that price just caught my eye.  Also interested in the Dunn DN-1000 based on reviews, driver, and in the price range I may be looking at.
  
 Not a basshead, but I like the good bass the In Ear Momentums provide.  I could sacrifice a little bass for warmth/smoothness.  I don't want something that's on the bright end of the spectrum.
  
 I will use these for moderate exercise so comfort, durability/good warranty is important (would need to check to see if Senns great warranty applies to the discontinued IE8 if I go that route).  I like Apple compatibility for volume control and track skipping but not absolutely essential as I won't use the mic -- I realize the ie8i is $260 and could be willing to go up to that price, but that would be the most and would prefer to keep around $200 given they will be used in part for moderate exercise.
  
 Any input is appreciated, particularly if you get a big jump in sq going from $100 to ~$200 in IEMs, or if you really need to go up higher to get substantial improvements


----------



## jincuteguy

Anyone knows where can I order the Universal version of the JH Audio Roxxane? I only see the Custom one. thx.


----------



## suman134

nati8056 said:


> By the way what do you say about XBA H3 ,IE 8  ,or perfect seal sporbud? People advised me about them and I'm a little confused


 
   Not H3 look for A3, it has better tighter bass and slightly more spark too.


----------



## JamesBr

jincuteguy said:


> Anyone knows where can I order the Universal version of the JH Audio Roxxane? I only see the Custom one. thx.


 
  
 Check this out; http://www.moon-audio.com/jh-audio-sirens-series-roxanne-universal-iem.html


----------



## jincuteguy

Is Moon Audio the only place that I can order it? Is there any local dealers / stores in San Diego, CA area that have JH  Audio IEMs I can test them out? thx.


----------



## cruizin caleb

Joker, have you tried the Audio Technica ATH-IM02 (or the newish AT series of IEMs)? I'm looking for something to replace my old Brainwavz B2, and most of the TWFK based IEMs are discontinued, but it seems that the ATH-IM02 is a similarly tuned IEM – wondering if you've tried it...


----------



## ljokerl

nati8056 said:


> thenk you very much for you reply.
> gr07 you give 9.1 sound quality and dunu dn-k 9.2,I do not want to lose sound quality.
> the Technology FLC8 seems very nice ,but expensive so I think or buy back the dunu dn-k or save some money and I'll buy in the future the FLC8.
> 
> By the way what do you say about XBA H3 ,IE 8  ,or perfect seal sporbud? People advised me about them and I'm a little confused


 
  
 The earphones fitting your needs/sound preferences is much more important than some number assigned to the earphones by a random headphone geek on the interwebs 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 If the GR07's sound seems like it will resolve the issues you have with the DN-1000, it may be an upgrade for you (but perhaps not for someone else).
  
 The H3 and IE8 have more boomy bass than the DN-1000, so probably not an upgrade in this case. The SportBud has good bass quality but lower quantity (closer to GR07 than DN-1000). Again, if you are willing to give up some bass quantity for quality you have more options than if you want to maintain bass enhancement similar to the DN-1000.
  


coastal1 said:


> I just got the Sennheiser In Ear Momentum for $100 and like them.  Went on a short (3mi) run this morning and they worked fine - I didn't love the feel of the tips provided when I first put them in but got used to them and they stayed in fine, and trying other tips would be cheap.  Like the sound signature.
> 
> However, I don't know much about IEMs and was wondering how much of a jump in sq I could get if I stretched my budget as I noticed the IE8 is down to $200 on Amazon.  I'm open to other options besides the IE8, that price just caught my eye.  Also interested in the Dunn DN-1000 based on reviews, driver, and in the price range I may be looking at.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Momentum is a pretty good earphone - you're more likely to get a jump by simply finding a sound tuning you enjoy more than something that's strictly better by some arbitrary measure. It does seem like the IE8 will fit your needs better, being warmer and smoother than the Momentum in-ear. The DN-1000 won't give you that, which means it won't be an upgrade in this case. I tend to like the Yamaha EPH-100 better than the IE8, but there's no headset version of that and I wouldn't use it for sports due to lack of replaceable cable and (probably) any sort of sweat resistance. 
  


cruizin caleb said:


> Joker, have you tried the Audio Technica ATH-IM02 (or the newish AT series of IEMs)? I'm looking for something to replace my old Brainwavz B2, and most of the TWFK based IEMs are discontinued, but it seems that the ATH-IM02 is a similarly tuned IEM – wondering if you've tried it...


 
  
 Only the IM50 briefly, and I own the CKX5. Neither is a CK10 successor


----------



## ZapX629

ljokerl said:


> Only the IM50 briefly, and I own the CKX5. Neither is a CK10 successor


 
 I wish AT would let you hear their CKR series now that they're available in the US. They're pretty amazing.


----------



## jincuteguy

So if you buy the JH16 from Moon Audio here: http://www.moon-audio.com/jh16-pro-custom-in-ear-monitors.html
 Do you have to send in your impressions? Or it's already been custom and Moon audio is just selling it as is?


----------



## getclikinagas

jincuteguy said:


> So if you buy the JH16 from Moon Audio here: http://www.moon-audio.com/jh16-pro-custom-in-ear-monitors.html
> Do you have to send in your impressions? Or it's already been custom and Moon audio is just selling it as is?


 

 You will be required to send in your ear impressions. The IEM shell will be custom moulded to fit your ear canals.
 You can customize the shell color/artwork and it's opacity.


----------



## Shawn71

nati8056 said:


> thenk you very much for you reply.
> gr07 you give 9.1 sound quality and dunu dn-k 9.2,I do not want to lose sound quality.
> the Technology *FLC8 seems very nice ,but expensive* so I think or buy back the dunu dn-k or save some money and I'll buy in the future the FLC8.
> 
> By the way what do you say about XBA H3 ,IE 8  ,or perfect seal sporbud? People advised me about them and I'm a little confused


 
 I wldn't call it as expensive, with 36 different sound tuning .....you will be thrown at a "confused state" to figure out/narrow down the sound*s* that suits you, as you will discover /  end up having multiple preferred sounds (to your taste) with those tunings....
  
 so, given it's price tag it's relatively cheap to the similar priced "fixed sound" triple hybrid IEMs....oh btw, the RC is a nice + and to double it further, it's a tf10 compatible....


----------



## cruizin caleb

ljokerl said:


> Only the IM50 briefly, and I own the CKX5. Neither is a CK10 successor


 
  
 Ah, I was thinking of the ATH-IM02 as that is supposedly a bright and detail-oriented DBA IEM. The IM50 and IM70 are both dynamic driver IEMs, whereas the IM01 is a single BA, IM02 is a dual BA, IM03 triple BA, IM04 quadruple BA. So I'd think the IM0x would be a whole different game than the IMx0. Here's the review I'm going off of – I think I'll take the plunge for myself with the IM02.


----------



## shotgunshane

The IM02 is sparkly in treble but it really has no sonic relation to the ck10 imo. It has a lot more bass and much more tame treble in direct comparison. The IM02 is a very nice sounding iem but has more in common with perhaps the Westonre w3 than the ck10. Unfortunaltely there isn't a ck10 successor that I've heard and there may never be one...


----------



## ljokerl

zapx629 said:


> I wish AT would let you hear their CKR series now that they're available in the US. They're pretty amazing.


 
  
 Hmm.. that's good news if they're officially carried by AT USA.
  


shotgunshane said:


> The IM02 is sparkly in treble but it really has no sonic relation to the ck10 imo. It has a lot more bass and much more tame treble in direct comparison. The IM02 is a very nice sounding iem but has more in common with perhaps the Westonre w3 than the ck10. Unfortunaltely there isn't a ck10 successor that I've heard and there may never be one...


 


 Hidition NT 6 if you have $1400 laying around


----------



## nati8056

Thank you joker and guys, I think the problem is the headphone cable
 Is it possible to replace the cable of my headphones dunu dn-k?
 If so, how do I do it?
  
 (Headphone cable of dunu dn-k is very poor , So I understand a score of 5 on the build does not relate to their bad cable, I prefer a weaker construction headphones with cable stronger)


----------



## deadich

OP, havent you tried the philips fidelio s2? I've read some great things about them, you get 2 different comply tips with them, seems sweet. costs the same as the momentum in ears where i live.
  
 obviously you've tried them cus you mention them several times, but you didnt review them. What do you think, fidelio s2 vs momentum in ear? 
  
 if anyone else tried them i'd love to hear your opinions too


----------



## BB 808

deadich said:


> OP, havent you tried the philips fidelio s2? I've read some great things about them, you get 2 different comply tips with them, seems sweet. costs the same as the momentum in ears where i live.
> 
> obviously you've tried them cus you mention them several times, but you didnt review them. What do you think, fidelio s2 vs momentum in ear?
> 
> if anyone else tried them i'd love to hear your opinions too



|joker| review of S2 is here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/philips-fidelio-s1-and-s2-ear-headphones


----------



## audiobot

Hey Joker, will u ever get around to reviewing a pair of Aurisonics Rockets? U can borrow Tyll's if u have to 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



 I already got shotgunshane and james444's opinion on them (the other 2 senpais). It would be much appreciated if u can place them on that lovely board of urs.


----------



## JamesBr

nati8056 said:


> Thank you joker and guys, I think the problem is the headphone cable
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 If you find more info on the mather please let us know, you are not the only one with these problems!


----------



## ljokerl

deadich said:


> OP, havent you tried the philips fidelio s2? I've read some great things about them, you get 2 different comply tips with them, seems sweet. costs the same as the momentum in ears where i live.
> 
> obviously you've tried them cus you mention them several times, but you didnt review them. What do you think, fidelio s2 vs momentum in ear?
> 
> if anyone else tried them i'd love to hear your opinions too


 
  
*thx1000* posted the link. For accuracy and neutrlaity - S2. For a bassier, more v-shaped sound signature - Momentum in-ear.
  


audiobot said:


> Hey Joker, will u ever get around to reviewing a pair of Aurisonics Rockets? U can borrow Tyll's if u have to
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yes, I just got Tyll's pair. Not sure if I will review them here or on InnerFidelity yet, but I'll get one put up.


----------



## deadich

holy crap, i just found this site when researching reshelling http://www.inearcentral.com/
  
 They have custom IEM's for 150 bucks INCLUDING mold. You get the professional kit just like an audiologist uses but you do it yourself, thats why its so cheap. Also has some more expensive once, triple hybrids for around 300 bucks. DIY-kit is extra nice for me cus i live in sweden so its a little difficult to find people who do molds.
  
 After watching a few videos of audiologists doing these molds i feel like it would be easy to do it at home, either myself or get someone else to do it.
  
  
  
 Btw do anyone have experience with reshelling their iems? Would it be worth to reshell my shure 535's for 119 bucks?  I wonder if they would sound better than the entry level 150 dollar custom.


ljokerl said:


> *thx1000* posted the link. For accuracy and neutrlaity - S2. For a bassier, more v-shaped sound signature - Momentum in-ear.
> 
> 
> Yes, I just got Tyll's pair. Not sure if I will review them here or on InnerFidelity yet, but I'll get one put up.


 
 thx man. The s2's seem nice but the semi open design kinda worries me. i like good isolation and i like iems that go deep.


----------



## Xtron2112

Hey all,

It's been awhile since I,ve posted, and I need help to make a list of IEMs with detachable cables that suit my musical tastes (see past posts). Any help would be welcome.


----------



## jincuteguy

xtron2112 said:


> Hey all,
> 
> It's been awhile since I,ve posted, and I need help to make a list of IEMs with detachable cables that suit my musical tastes (see past posts). Any help would be welcome.


 
  
 Yea I'm looking forwoard for that list too, been trying to  get a good bass high quality with detachable cable IEMs


----------



## suman134

xtron2112 said:


> Hey all,
> 
> It's been awhile since I,ve posted, and I need help to make a list of IEMs with detachable cables that suit my musical tastes (see past posts). Any help would be welcome.


 

  I am too lazy to look back, would you mind repeating? And what is your budget?


----------



## Xtron2112

(Yes, Metallica, Dream Theater, Queen, Led Zeppelin, Queensryche, Styx, Journey, Beatles, Pink Floyd, Rush, Nine Inch Nails, Mastodon, Alice in Chains, Soundgarden, Dillinger Esc. Plan and many more.)

$250-500


----------



## suman134

xtron2112 said:


> (Yes, Metallica, Dream Theater, Queen, Led Zeppelin, Queensryche, Styx, Journey, Beatles, Pink Floyd, Rush, Nine Inch Nails, Mastodon, Alice in Chains, Soundgarden, Dillinger Esc. Plan and many more.)
> 
> $250-500


 

  Mostly Rock i think, you will enjoy a bit of V shaped signature, i think Inear Stagedriver 3 or SM64 will do good for you. You will like the FLC-8 too, but you will have to tune it to your preference.
  
  Out of these i will say, go for the FLC-8 as it has a widely available universally found cable and it has awesome no. of possible tunings.


----------



## oldschool

Hi joker,
  
 Until that Velvet review is eventually ready - do you think moving from SM64 to Velvet is worth the cost?
  
 I am looking for a bit more bass (although the SM64 is quite okay) and more loudness (SM64 has terribly high impedance for a portable IEM). 
  
 I am concerned about the fit and comfort, as the Velvet seems bulkier, and also some users reported more sibilance with the Velvet.
  
 Will appreciate your thoughts on this until a full review is ready


----------



## getclikinagas

oldschool said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> Until that Velvet review is eventually ready - do you think moving from SM64 to Velvet is worth the cost?
> 
> ...


 

 Pssst...
 http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/earsonics-velvet-in-ear-earphone-review/


----------



## oldschool

getclikinagas said:


> Pssst...
> http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/earsonics-velvet-in-ear-earphone-review/


 
  
 Ah, thanks!


----------



## Xtron2112

suman134 said:


> Mostly Rock i think, you will enjoy a bit of V shaped signature, i think Inear Stagedriver 3 or SM64 will do good for you. You will like the FLC-8 too, but you will have to tune it to your preference.
> 
> Out of these i will say, go for the FLC-8 as it has a widely available universally found cable and it has awesome no. of possible tunings.


 
Thanks a lot! Next up, anyone have CIEM recommendations for tge same music and price bracket?


----------



## jincuteguy

Anyone knows a good professional Audiologist that do a lot of Impressions for Custom IEMs in the San Diego, CA area? any infos would be appreciated.


----------



## Xtron2112

xtron2112 said:


> Thanks a lot! Next up, anyone have CIEM recommendations for tge same music and price bracket?







jincuteguy said:


> Anyone knows a good professional Audiologist that do a lot of Impressions for Custom IEMs in the San Diego, CA area? any infos would be appreciated.


Speaking of which, If I go ciem, i need a suitable audiologist in North Carolina.


----------



## jincuteguy

xtron2112 said:


> Speaking of which, If I go ciem, i need a suitable audiologist in North Carolina.


 
  
 Yea I need a good audiologist for CIEM in the San Diego , CA area if anyone knows, thx a lot. Seems like no one lives in San Diego


----------



## BB 808

jincuteguy said:


> Yea I need a good audiologist for CIEM in the San Diego , CA area if anyone knows, thx a lot. Seems like no one lives in San Diego



Yeah I don't live in San Diego but I did a Google search and clicked on a link for Yelp and this might help you: http://m.yelp.com/search?find_desc=Audiologist&find_loc=San+Diego%2C+CA


----------



## ljokerl

deadich said:


> holy crap, i just found this site when researching reshelling http://www.inearcentral.com/
> 
> They have custom IEM's for 150 bucks INCLUDING mold. You get the professional kit just like an audiologist uses but you do it yourself, thats why its so cheap. Also has some more expensive once, triple hybrids for around 300 bucks. DIY-kit is extra nice for me cus i live in sweden so its a little difficult to find people who do molds.
> 
> After watching a few videos of audiologists doing these molds i feel like it would be easy to do it at home, either myself or get someone else to do it.


 
  
 I don't know anything about this company but impressions are definitely something you can do yourself if you are careful- see here: http://theheadphonelist.com/ear-self-impressions-for-custom-in-ear-monitors-what-you-need-to-know/ 
  


jincuteguy said:


> Yea I'm looking forwoard for that list too, been trying to  get a good bass high quality with detachable cable IEMs


 
  
 Quite a few options for enhanced-bass earphones with detachable cables among universal-fit IEMs: EarSonics Velvet, InEar StageDiver SD-3, Ultrasone IQ, Sony XBA-Z5, Sony XBA-H3, Fidue A83, Sennheiser IE80 etc. Plus some I haven't tried, like the JVC FX850.
  


oldschool said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> Until that Velvet review is eventually ready - do you think moving from SM64 to Velvet is worth the cost?
> 
> ...


 
  
getclikinagas provided the review link but to answer your questions - yes to more bass, yes to more loudness, yes to more sibilance potential, but this is because the SM64 has a dip in the upper midrange that really shouldn't be there for better overall accuracy. The Velvet is not a sibilant IEM.
  
 Comfort is more of a personal thing. I prefer the SM64 because the housings are more rounded, but the Velvet is not at all uncomfortable. Its footprint in the ear is significantly smaller than a Shure SE846 or FitEar TG334. 

 



xtron2112 said:


> Thanks a lot! Next up, anyone have CIEM recommendations for tge same music and price bracket?


 
  
 1964EARS 1964-V3
  


jincuteguy said:


> Anyone knows a good professional Audiologist that do a lot of Impressions for Custom IEMs in the San Diego, CA area? any infos would be appreciated.


 
  
 Back when I had professional impressions done I had good luck calling up audiologists in Westone's dealer network and just asking how much a la carte impressions cost. Figured that Westone dealers at least had some experience with custom IEM impressions.
  
 http://www.westoneaudio.com/index.php/about-us/find-a-dealer.html


----------



## Xtron2112

ljokerl said:


> I don't know anything about this company but impressions are definitely something you can do yourself if you are careful- see here: http://theheadphonelist.com/ear-self-impressions-for-custom-in-ear-monitors-what-you-need-to-know/
> 
> 
> Quite a few options for enhanced-bass earphones with detachable cables among universal-fit IEMs: EarSonics Velvet, InEar StageDiver SD-3, Ultrasone IQ, Sony XBA-Z5, Sony XBA-H3, Fidue A83, Sennheiser IE80 etc. Plus some I haven't tried, like the JVC FX850.
> ...


Thanks for the tip joker!


----------



## oldschool

ljokerl said:


> getclikinagas provided the review link but to answer your questions - yes to more bass, yes to more loudness, yes to more sibilance potential, but this is because the SM64 has a dip in the upper midrange that really shouldn't be there for better overall accuracy. The Velvet is not a sibilant IEM.
> 
> Comfort is more of a personal thing. I prefer the SM64 because the housings are more rounded, but the Velvet is not at all uncomfortable. Its footprint in the ear is significantly smaller than a Shure SE846 or FitEar TG334.


 
  
 Thank you for your reply! I never had issues with the angular housing of the SM3, so I guess I'd better start saving for the Velvet


----------



## jincuteguy

ljokerl said:


> I don't know anything about this company but impressions are definitely something you can do yourself if you are careful- see here: http://theheadphonelist.com/ear-self-impressions-for-custom-in-ear-monitors-what-you-need-to-know/
> 
> 
> Quite a few options for enhanced-bass earphones with detachable cables among universal-fit IEMs: EarSonics Velvet, InEar StageDiver SD-3, Ultrasone IQ, Sony XBA-Z5, Sony XBA-H3, Fidue A83, Sennheiser IE80 etc. Plus some I haven't tried, like the JVC FX850.
> ...


 
  
 Yea but which one has more experience and professional? It only shows a list of Audiologists.


----------



## ayao

deadich said:


> holy crap, i just found this site when researching reshelling http://www.inearcentral.com/


 
 inearcustom.com redirects to inearcentral.com, so if they're the same I would advise some caution. You can read http://www.head-fi.org/t/741026/iem-customs-reshell-inearz-vs-inearcentral-my-experience and http://www.head-fi.org/t/643894/inearcustom-cheapest-re-shell-ever/480 to see why. (see what the last and third last posters got banned for)


----------



## ljokerl

jincuteguy said:


> Yea but which one has more experience and professional? It only shows a list of Audiologists.


 
  
 Don't have that information - my point was that it's very likely that audiologists in Westone's dealer network are more experienced when it comes to custom IEM impressions than random ones you'd find in the yellow pages.


----------



## JamesBr

getclikinagas said:


> Pssst...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Lol good stuff thx!


----------



## oventurini

ljokerl said:


> The FX850 the way james444 described it (below)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Hi, I have exactly the same issue as MrGuzmanWhite. I have had the pleasure to use the ER4 for many years, had them customised with silicone and I would love to find a CIEM that is superior, both in clarity and adding perhaps a touch of bass. I see all these fancy IEM coming in the market with more and more driver every year and I don't have a chance to try them. I am wondering: can they beat my ER4 legendary clarity? Or shall i stick to this great classic despite its flaws (cable noise when I am moving, odd shape, average confort).
 Do you have now a different opinion after the recent arrival of new CIEM on the market?  
 Noble 4S? 
 Unique Melody Miracle?
 Hidition New Tears-6 Pro?
 Spiral Ear SE 5?
 ...
 all IEMs that i will never have a chance to try: it is too complicate. And that is what makes this quest so difficult.
 thank you so much for your feedback on this.


----------



## kova4a

oventurini said:


> Hi, I have exactly the same issue as MrGuzmanWhite. I have had the pleasure to use the ER4 for many years, had them customised with silicone and I would love to find a CIEM that is superior, both in clarity and adding perhaps a touch of bass. I see all these fancy IEM coming in the market with more and more driver every year and I don't have a chance to try them. I am wondering: can they beat my ER4 legendary clarity? Or shall i stick to this great classic despite its flaws (cable noise when I am moving, odd shape, average confort).
> Do you have now a different opinion after the recent arrival of new CIEM on the market?
> Noble 4S?
> Unique Melody Miracle?
> ...


 
 Well, that's the thing - it's hard to find an ety replacement without going a bit in another direction. Clarity-wise the er4 is top notch, so an improvement on that means going for boosted treble to simulate better clarity with a brighter sound. A more prominent low end than the er4's will also affect the clarity.
 Newer high-end stuff can give you more pros over the er4 than just clarity though - like better dynamics, layering, more natural and versatile sound, more realistic note thickness etc. Personally, I like the Noble 4 better but it gives up some clarity in comparison to the er4s in exchange for a smoother and a bit warmer and more organic take on analytical sound.
 But if you like the ety and clarity is your main priority you might just stick to it.


----------



## suman134

kova4a said:


> Well, that's the thing - it's hard to find an ety replacement without going a bit in another direction. Clarity-wise the er4 is top notch, so an improvement on that means going for boosted treble to simulate better clarity with a brighter sound. A more prominent low end than the er4's will also affect the clarity.
> Newer high-end stuff can give you more pros over the er4 than just clarity though - like better dynamics, layering, more natural and versatile sound, more realistic note thickness etc. Personally, I like the Noble 4 better but it gives up some clarity in comparison to the er4s in exchange for a smoother and a bit warmer and more organic take on analytical sound.
> But if you like the ety and clarity is your main priority you might just stick to it.


 

  That's true, I wonder what if ETY comes with a DUAL BA earphone!!! ER-8 series micro, i will pat $500 for it. With out bothering about any feedback or any word from anyone, i just simply wont care for what others are saying and will jump on an ETY ER-8p. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			







  
  Once a ETY fan, everything else feels lacking something (Universals, not customs).


----------



## ljokerl

oventurini said:


> Hi, I have exactly the same issue as MrGuzmanWhite. I have had the pleasure to use the ER4 for many years, had them customised with silicone and I would love to find a CIEM that is superior, both in clarity and adding perhaps a touch of bass. I see all these fancy IEM coming in the market with more and more driver every year and I don't have a chance to try them. I am wondering: can they beat my ER4 legendary clarity? Or shall i stick to this great classic despite its flaws (cable noise when I am moving, odd shape, average confort).
> Do you have now a different opinion after the recent arrival of new CIEM on the market?
> Noble 4S?
> Unique Melody Miracle?
> ...


 
  
 Couldn't have said it better than *kova4a *- that has been my experience with the CIEMs you've listed (SE5 aside - haven't tried those) and others. Of course that's not to say you won't like one of them better than the ER4 overall. Just don't expect an ER4 sound signature with better clarity.


----------



## jincuteguy

Sorry for asking you guys this but for all Custom IEMs, there is "NO" tip attached to the earpiece canal right?  I know Universal IEM has these silicone, foam, gel tips that you have to attach to the earpiece.


----------



## unknownguardian

jincuteguy said:


> Sorry for asking you guys this but for all Custom IEMs, there is "NO" tip attached to the earpiece canal right?  I know Universal IEM has these silicone, foam, gel tips that you have to attach to the earpiece.




not that i know of.


----------



## ozkan

oventurini said:


> Hi, I have exactly the same issue as MrGuzmanWhite. I have had the pleasure to use the ER4 for many years, had them customised with silicone and I would love to find a CIEM that is superior, both in clarity and adding perhaps a touch of bass. I see all these fancy IEM coming in the market with more and more driver every year and I don't have a chance to try them. I am wondering: can they beat my ER4 legendary clarity? Or shall i stick to this great classic despite its flaws (cable noise when I am moving, odd shape, average confort).
> Do you have now a different opinion after the recent arrival of new CIEM on the market?
> Noble 4S?
> Unique Melody Miracle?
> ...


 
  
 It surely doesn't have the same clarity but very close with more bass. I would suggest checking the new Ety MK5.


----------



## oventurini

Exactly! The others go with 6, 8 10 drivers... and Ety sticks to their old mono driver and yet they are still hard to beat from what I can understand.


----------



## oventurini

Thanks Ozkan, I checked but the MK5 are a 1/5 of the price of the ER4. and from the same manufacturer. So unless Etymotic has gone mad, I can't see this as an upgrade to my ER4.


----------



## ozkan

oventurini said:


> Thanks Ozkan, I checked but the MK5 are a 1/5 of the price of the ER4. and from the same manufacturer. So unless Etymotic has gone mad, I can't see this as an upgrade to my ER4.


 
  
 Not an upgrade but a sidegrade I think. The treble extension would be better on ER4 and the bass would be better on MK5.
 Only Hidition NT6 for $1200 would be an upgrade I guess.


----------



## jincuteguy

unknownguardian said:


> not that i know of.


 
  
 What do you mean?


----------



## ljokerl

jincuteguy said:


> Sorry for asking you guys this but for all Custom IEMs, there is "NO" tip attached to the earpiece canal right?  I know Universal IEM has these silicone, foam, gel tips that you have to attach to the earpiece.


 
  
 That is correct.
  
 Except for this one crazy prototype I saw once that let you remove the custom tip and put a universal one in its place. Can't remember whose crazy idea that was.


----------



## deadich

OP, if i were to buy my first customs which ones would you recommend? I dont need to buy the absolutely cheapest, maybe up to 400-600 bucks, or a little more if the benefit is big enough. Obviously wouldnt mind if i can get something thats really good for less money.
  
 there's a lot of ciems in the reviews and they mostly seem to get around the same scores. limes maybe? you scored them high. or is it worth going for more drivers?


----------



## suman134

ozkan said:


> Not an upgrade but a sidegrade I think. The treble extension would be better on ER4 and the bass would be better on MK5.
> Only Hidition NT6 for $1200 would be an upgrade I guess.


 
  
   Not detailed enough, bigger bass but but extension? nope, ER-4 is far better.


----------



## ozkan

suman134 said:


> Not detailed enough, bigger bass but but extension? nope, ER-4 is far better.


 
  
 Have you heard it?


----------



## suman134

ozkan said:


> Have you heard it?


 
  Auditioned it briefly, Better than MC5 but can not be compared with ER-4 series micro. Sadly ER-4 is really flat and lacks excitement which MK5 is better at, has more impact for sure, but lacking some details.


----------



## ozkan

suman134 said:


> Auditioned it briefly, Better than MC5 but can not be compared with ER-4 series micro. Sadly ER-4 is really flat and lacks excitement which MK5 is better at, has more impact for sure, but lacking some details.


 
  
 That's why I said it is more of a side grade. More excitement and fun which is slightly missing in ER-4 series  But with the right tips such as Shure olive tips they become more detailed. The price is a joke for MK5.


----------



## suman134

ozkan said:


> That's why I said it is more of a side grade. More excitement and fun which is slightly missing in ER-4 series  But with the right tips such as Shure olive tips they become more detailed. The price is a joke for MK5.


 

  MK5 is priced nicely for sure. ER-4 is seriously analytical, detailed and precise, MK5 is more for the youth.
 Shure olivers are good but i find them a bit too soft in hot conditions, They tend to lose shape at 38-40 degree C.
 Indeed ER-4 is for dead serious analytical listening.
  
  Then i really think an ER8-S/P/B (seems unlikely) With two BA and a bit more bass will rock this this world. A bit more layering, slightly thicker note and a bigger stage will shake the community.


----------



## jincuteguy

Is this the Sony Hybrid silicone tips that u guys talking about? 
  
 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/594779-REG/Sony_EPEX10A_BLK_EP_EX10A_Replacement_Eartips_for.html


----------



## headdict

Deleted - wrong thread.


----------



## ozkan

suman134 said:


> MK5 is priced nicely for sure. ER-4 is seriously analytical, detailed and precise, MK5 is more for the youth.
> Shure olivers are good but i find them a bit too soft in hot conditions, They tend to lose shape at 38-40 degree C.
> Indeed ER-4 is for dead serious analytical listening.
> 
> Then i really think an ER8-S/P/B (seems unlikely) With two BA and a bit more bass will rock this this world. A bit more layering, slightly thicker note and a bigger stage will shake the community.


 
  
 I don't think they are only for young people. At least I'm at the end of my 30s who finds them to be quite precise and detailed instead of fun. Maybe you can call them fun and precise and detailed. They still have Ety house sound.


----------



## ljokerl

deadich said:


> OP, if i were to buy my first customs which ones would you recommend? I dont need to buy the absolutely cheapest, maybe up to 400-600 bucks, or a little more if the benefit is big enough. Obviously wouldnt mind if i can get something thats really good for less money.
> 
> there's a lot of ciems in the reviews and they mostly seem to get around the same scores. limes maybe? you scored them high. or is it worth going for more drivers?


 
  
 Really depends on what you're looking for. I tend to prefer neutral sound + silicone shells so for me it would be the Custom Art Pro 330v2 (brief writeup here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-custom-art-harmony-8-pro-pro-330-v2/) or an extra $100 to go 1964EARS V6-Stage (and I'd give up the silicone shells for that). But, if I was looking for a more "fun" sound with some extra bass I'd pick the 1964EARS V3.
  


jincuteguy said:


> Is this the Sony Hybrid silicone tips that u guys talking about?
> 
> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/594779-REG/Sony_EPEX10A_BLK_EP_EX10A_Replacement_Eartips_for.html


 
  
 Those are sony hybrids.


----------



## jincuteguy

ljokerl said:


> Really depends on what you're looking for. I tend to prefer neutral sound + silicone shells so for me it would be the Custom Art Pro 330v2 (brief writeup here: http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-custom-art-harmony-8-pro-pro-330-v2/) or an extra $100 to go 1964EARS V6-Stage (and I'd give up the silicone shells for that). But, if I was looking for a more "fun" sound with some extra bass I'd pick the 1964EARS V3.
> 
> 
> Those are sony hybrids.


 
 If I get those Comply Foam tips, will I lose the sound quality a bit for using Foam tips vs silicone tips? thx.
  
 Also, all those Custom IEMs don't use those tips, so they're the best for sound reproduction right? I guess thas't why they're more expensive.


----------



## suman134

ozkan said:


> I don't think they are only for young people. At least I'm at the end of my 30s who finds them to be quite precise and detailed instead of fun. Maybe you can call them fun and precise and detailed. They still have Ety house sound.


 
   
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





, I meant will appeal more to those who want some more excitement. They do, ety will never make an earphone with pounding bass and no details.


----------



## Shawn71

jincuteguy said:


> If I get those Comply Foam tips, will I lose the sound quality a bit for using Foam tips vs silicone tips? thx.
> 
> Also, all those Custom IEMs don't use those tips, so they're the best for sound reproduction right? I guess thas't why they're more expensive.


 

 I hope you already have your answer, self justified 
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/748473/spinfit-eartips-thread-the-cheapest-audio-upgrade/285#post_11688046
  
 Yes, the customs don't use any sort of tips for fitment...... and sound isolation,yes they are 99.999% better if not all are the best (as a rare case, very few might get mis-fit but that's ok)....
  
 Why they are expensive?not because of their distinct sound re-production but well, here's an rough figure,
  
 1)it all starts from taking impressions of ears, using any two form of either self impressions using kit (cheaper) or thru certified audiologist network (costlier).
 2)then comes the shipping part (ear impressions) to the mfr.
 3)some mfr offers digitization of our impressions (at an additional cost) for archive purpose in the future,if we needed.
 4)then comes the building part of the CIEMs using the material we chose (cost vary),fitting the drivers (addl cost by some mfr if we chose to add one or two to their default offering),tuning and final touches/finishes if we chose prints on the shells, again addl cost involved. (pt4 is more labor intensive,as our CIEM molds get their shapes both in sound and physical form and most of our money spent here )
 5) and finally sending the finished ones to us, addl s/h cost involved if speedy is what you chose.
  
 so you do the math....


----------



## jincuteguy

Are these the Sony Hybrid tip clones? http://www.ebay.com/itm/12pcs-S-M-L-White-Hybrid-Replacement-Eartips-buds-for-Sony-XBA-MDR-DR-Series-/321143145148?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac59f82bc
  
 If so, are they as good as the real Sony hybrid tips? I was gonna buy these clones but hold off.
  
 Anyone know where I can buy the real Sony Hybrid tips (white color)?


----------



## slowpickr

jincuteguy said:


> Are these the Sony Hybrid tip clones? http://www.ebay.com/itm/12pcs-S-M-L-White-Hybrid-Replacement-Eartips-buds-for-Sony-XBA-MDR-DR-Series-/321143145148?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac59f82bc
> 
> If so, are they as good as the real Sony hybrid tips? I was gonna buy these clones but hold off.
> 
> Anyone know where I can buy the real Sony Hybrid tips (white color)?


 
 At that price, I'd just get the real thing.  B&H has them in stock for $8.
  
 Edit: didn't notice that white was the desired color.  I guess ebay is the best bet.


----------



## jincuteguy

slowpickr said:


> At that price, I'd just get the real thing.  B&H has them in stock for $8.
> 
> Edit: didn't notice that white was the desired color.  I guess ebay is the best bet.


 
  
 But besides the price differences, is there anything wrong with the "clone" ones?


----------



## suman134

jincuteguy said:


> But besides the price differences, is there anything wrong with the "clone" ones?


 

  Clones are made of poor material. Not bad but not as good as the real one.


----------



## jincuteguy

Ok thx, do you know what is the nozzle size? I have the ASG-2.5 IEM, and i think it has a large nozzle.  So I don't know if these sony hybrid tips will feat.  Does it say anywhere for the nozzle size for these Sony Hybrid tips (clone or not)


----------



## suman134

Let me tell you the real difference, when you stretch the Original sony hybrid, it manages itself over larger nozzles, but the fake ones are torn apart. I think sony has 3mm nozzle and can adopt to 4.5mm with some effort.


----------



## jincuteguy

suman134 said:


> Let me tell you the real difference, when you stretch the Original sony hybrid, it manages itself over larger nozzles, but the fake ones are torn apart. I think sony has 3mm nozzle and can adopt to 4.5mm with some effort.


 
 That's it? So the sound quality and seal is the same?


----------



## suman134

jincuteguy said:


> That's it? So the sound quality and seal is the same?


 

  Fake ones use bad and harder material for the core, so you know, how it should affect SQ.


----------



## suman134

Seal is same.


----------



## Shawn71

jincuteguy said:


> That's it? So the sound quality and seal is the same?


 

 Dude,friendly advice, just get the Original ones......
  
 edit=> if you can afford on the originals, else giv a shot on those budget ones (clones).....just like what/how we experiment and share with the needy.....tips play a very important role when it comes to IEMs if not glamorous....


----------



## jincuteguy

shawn71 said:


> Dude,friendly advice, just get the Original ones......
> 
> edit=> if you can afford on the originals, else giv a shot on those budget ones (clones).....just like what/how we experiment and share with the needy.....tips play a very important role when it comes to IEMs if not glamorous....


 
 WEll I just ordered the real ones from B&H Photo, but they're black and i dont like black.  I want the white ones, but they don't have the real white ones.  Only the clone ones have White color.  So that's why if anyone experiences the clone ones before .  
  
 Yea I know tips are very important for an IEM, that's why im trying to find the perfect one.  I like Silicone the most because they give the best sound reproduction and don't alter the sound like Foam or Gel tips.  But the issue with Silicone tips is that they get dirty very easy when they're dry.  
  
 Like they attracted dirt really easy if you look at your silicone tips closely.
  
 So im trying to find a silicone tip that is like the Sony Hybrid cause they seem don't get dirty that easy compare to most "Clear" see through Silicone tips.


----------



## headdict

jincuteguy said:


> WEll I just ordered the real ones from B&H Photo, but they're black and i dont like black.  I want the white ones, but they don't have the real white ones.  Only the clone ones have White color.  So that's why if anyone experiences the clone ones before .


 
 You can order white ones from amazon while supplies last. According to them, they have been discontinued by the manufacturer.


----------



## Shawn71

jincuteguy said:


> WEll I just ordered the real ones from B&H Photo, but they're black and *i dont like black*.  I want the white ones, but they don't have the real white ones.  Only the clone ones have White color.  So that's why if anyone experiences the clone ones before .
> 
> Yea I know tips are very important for an IEM, that's why im trying to find the perfect one.  I like Silicone the most because they give the best sound reproduction and don't alter the sound like Foam or Gel tips.  But the issue with Silicone tips is that they get dirty very easy when they're dry.
> 
> ...


 

*I see*....I suggest you buy the clones (white) too as they are dirt cheap and very affordable to try. for yourself....btw, it's the dark color you immediately notice it has the dust and doesn't mean the originals don't collect but if your ears have enough wax to discharge on it....jk. yeah the lint roller is trustworthy


----------



## jincuteguy

shawn71 said:


> *I see*....I suggest you buy the clones (white) too as they are dirt cheap and very affordable to try. for yourself....btw, it's the dark color you immediately notice it has the dust and doesn't mean the originals don't collect but if your ears have enough wax to discharge on it....jk. yeah the lint roller is trustworthy


 
  
 Yea the thing is I don't know if they will fit with my Aurisonics ASG-2.5 nozzle or not, cause the ASG-2.5 has a pretty big nozzle diameter.


----------



## Grayson73

Joker, I saw that you tried the Soundmagic E80.  What is it comparable to of the IEMs you've reviewed?


----------



## ljokerl

grayson73 said:


> Joker, I saw that you tried the Soundmagic E80.  What is it comparable to of the IEMs you've reviewed?


 
  
 I only tried it briefly and it seemed like an evolution of the E10 to me. Maybe my brain was playing tricks on me just because it's a soundmagic. The only other thing I had with me was the GR07, and it wasn't as neutral as that.


----------



## shotgunshane

The E80 is a good bit brighter/sharper than the E10 to me but the bass and mids are much more neutral and really well done. It'll come down to your preference for treble imo. Unfortunately I wasn't crazy about the E80 treble tuning. I say unfortunately because everything else is so good. 

The E50 seems like the direct upgrade to the E10 to me. A hair brighter with tighter, faster bass that might be a hair less in quantity. But all certainly have the Soundmagic house sound imo.


----------



## trodor83

Hi Joker, many thanks for your hard work! I've got a few questions if you've got the time:
Is the Piston 3 review coming out anytime soon? My old Monoprice 8320 are slowly disintegrating, and since I've been quite happy with their sound profile (when not altered by the horrible seal), I figure I should be looking at something in the balanced category for replacement/upgrade. As I'm currently low on cash, I need something cheap to get me through the next few months and I've been hearing good things about the new Pistons. How balanced they really are though, and how would you compare the two? I'm aware there isn't much of a choice of cheap flat(ish) iems, and remote/microphone is also a plus for me. Of course, if anyone has a different suggestion under, say, 50$, I'm all ears!


----------



## ljokerl

trodor83 said:


> Hi Joker, many thanks for your hard work! I've got a few questions if you've got the time:
> Is the Piston 3 review coming out anytime soon? My old Monoprice 8320 are slowly disintegrating, and since I've been quite happy with their sound profile (when not altered by the horrible seal), I figure I should be looking at something in the balanced category for replacement/upgrade. As I'm currently low on cash, I need something cheap to get me through the next few months and I've been hearing good things about the new Pistons. How balanced they really are though, and how would you compare the two? I'm aware there isn't much of a choice of cheap flat(ish) iems, and remote/microphone is also a plus for me. Of course, if anyone has a different suggestion under, say, 50$, I'm all ears!


 
  
 Should be the next one posted on THL 
  
 The Piston 3 is kind of the opposite of  the 8320 when it comes to relatively balanced IEMs. The 8320 is much more mid-centric and has slightly rolled-off deep bass and not real bright highs. The Piston 3 is... none of those things, really. I do think the Piston is the better earphone, but it's not at all a straight-shot upgrade from the 8320 due to how differently it is tuned. 
  
 I can't really think of a straight 8320 upgrade within budget - most things are either more v-shaped like the Piston 3, or just a lot bassier. Closest thing is probably the VSonic R02 Silver, and that's 2x the price of the Piston 3 and lacks the remote. The Piston is just a killer value - definitely worth a shot if you don't think you will hate its sound sig.


----------



## JamesBr

jincuteguy said:


> But besides the price differences, is there anything wrong with the "clone" ones?


 
  
 The other thing to check is the warranty ( besides quality and price) not sure they will offer the same ...


----------



## suman134

jamesbr said:


> The other thing to check is the warranty ( besides quality and price) not sure they will offer the same ...


 
  Warranty with eartips? i will never claim for something like that.


----------



## trodor83

Thanks, I will definitely try the Pistons then. By the way, would I be right in concluding from your answer that 8320 vs Pistons3 signature differences would be a bit like re400 vs Gr07?





ljokerl said:


> Should be the next one posted on THL
> 
> The Piston 3 is kind of the opposite of  the 8320 when it comes to relatively balanced IEMs. The 8320 is much more mid-centric and has slightly rolled-off deep bass and not real bright highs. The Piston 3 is... none of those things, really. I do think the Piston is the better earphone, but it's not at all a straight-shot upgrade from the 8320 due to how differently it is tuned.
> 
> I can't really think of a straight 8320 upgrade within budget - most things are either more v-shaped like the Piston 3, or just a lot bassier. Closest thing is probably the VSonic R02 Silver, and that's 2x the price of the Piston 3 and lacks the remote. The Piston is just a killer value - definitely worth a shot if you don't think you will hate its sound sig.


----------



## ljokerl

trodor83 said:


> Thanks, I will definitely try the Pistons then. By the way, would I be right in concluding from your answer that 8320 vs Pistons3 signature differences would be a bit like re400 vs Gr07?


 
  
 Yes, just a bit more extreme. The RE-400 and GR07 are each closer to "flat" than the 8320 and Piston 3.


----------



## trodor83

ljokerl said:


> Yes, just a bit more extreme. The RE-400 and GR07 are each closer to "flat" than the 8320 and Piston 3.




Thank you, that's all I really needed to know!


----------



## grimr3aper

Hey guys im looking to buy my first quality set of IEM. looking to spend around $100.
 Looking for good all around IEM. i would be listening to EDM House Hiphop Rock.
 I would be using them with my Note 4 so a mic would be great and my macbook pro


----------



## suman134

grimr3aper said:


> Hey guys im looking to buy my first quality set of IEM. looking to spend around $100.
> Looking for good all around IEM. i would be listening to EDM House Hiphop Rock.
> I would be using them with my Note 4 so a mic would be great and my macbook pro


 
  I think on a audiophile pov, E80s will be, it will suit all genera, if you like smoother highs and more bass, opt for E50s, going for like $50, and are good.
  
 Or add some more and go for A73, they are said to me awesome.


----------



## ljokerl

grimr3aper said:


> Hey guys im looking to buy my first quality set of IEM. looking to spend around $100.
> Looking for good all around IEM. i would be listening to EDM House Hiphop Rock.
> I would be using them with my Note 4 so a mic would be great and my macbook pro


 
  
  
 Ultimately it depends on the kind of sound you are looking for. If you like some enhanced bass, you can go Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear G (the Android version). Something balanced - HiFiMan RE-400a. Something in between - Philips Fidelio S2.


----------



## ClassicalViola

The Flare Audio R2A / R2PRO have been receiving a lot of praise and unbelievably positive reviews recently (since the launch and success of the company's Kickstarter campaign). It would be great if Flare Audio could consider sending ljokerl review units so that these IEMs can be compared to almost everything else in the market. Maybe ljokerl can approach Flare Audio to arrange something? They probably don't know about ljokerl or many of the other IEM reviewers since they are new to the IEM scene.


----------



## Halonoonan

Looking at getting some nice IEM. I currently use HiFiMan He 400 as my home set. I'm looking for something' with some bass (not necessarily basshead) and some clarity and soundstage. I listen to mostly rock, metal and some live stuff.i had come across the DUNU DN 1000? Anything better than this. What about the Fidue A73?
Whatever I get will likely just be played through my iPhone 6 mainly
Thanks.


----------



## ZapX629

halonoonan said:


> Looking at getting some nice IEM. I currently use HiFiMan He 400 as my home set. I'm looking for something' with some bass (not necessarily basshead) and some clarity and soundstage. I listen to mostly rock, metal and some live stuff.i had come across the DUNU DN 1000? Anything better than this. What about the Fidue A73?
> Whatever I get will likely just be played through my iPhone 6 mainly
> Thanks.


 

 CKR9 would be a great option to look at alongside the DN1000.


----------



## ljokerl

classicalviola said:


> The Flare Audio R2A / R2PRO have been receiving a lot of praise and unbelievably positive reviews recently (since the launch and success of the company's Kickstarter campaign). It would be great if Flare Audio could consider sending ljokerl review units so that these IEMs can be compared to almost everything else in the market. Maybe ljokerl can approach Flare Audio to arrange something? They probably don't know about ljokerl or many of the other IEM reviewers since they are new to the IEM scene.


 
  
 I've heard of these a few times now - just haven't had time to look into them yet. As always, there are dozens of new IEMs on the market this spring and summer, and I haven't gotten around to posting reviews of all my favorites yet.
  
  
  
  


halonoonan said:


> Looking at getting some nice IEM. I currently use HiFiMan He 400 as my home set. I'm looking for something' with some bass (not necessarily basshead) and some clarity and soundstage. I listen to mostly rock, metal and some live stuff.i had come across the DUNU DN 1000? Anything better than this. What about the Fidue A73?
> Whatever I get will likely just be played through my iPhone 6 mainly
> Thanks.


 
  
 Depends on budget and preferred sound signature. At $200 and for v-shaped (boosted bass and highs) sound I don't have anything better than the DN-1000 to recommend. However, if you wanted to spend less, or more, or had a different preference for the tuning of your earphones, the DN-1000 may not be the one. For instance the VSonic GR07 Bass Edition will give you a more balanced sound with better midrange quality than the DN-1000, but will still have good bass punch. As is often the case, the tradeoff is that you lose some of the DN-1000's bass response.


----------



## Mike43110

My GR07 mk2s are on their last legs (the cable is coming out of the IEMs 0_o) and I was thinking of getting an upgrade with replaceable cables.
  
 I read your FLC8 review and thought it was very interesting!
  
 Seeing as how it was your review of the GR07 that brought me to having to get it (my wallet hates you and my ears love you  ) I thought I may as well bug this thread for advice in if the FLC8 would suit somebody coming from the GR07 (my headphones are Sennheiser Momentum v1s <3 if that helps understand what I like - trying to help random people with tiny bits of info to go in is the easiest thing in the world )


----------



## ozkan

mike43110 said:


> My GR07 mk2s are on their last legs (the cable is coming out of the IEMs 0_o) and I was thinking of getting an upgrade with replaceable cables.
> 
> I read your FLC8 review and thought it was very interesting!
> 
> Seeing as how it was your review of the GR07 that brought me to having to get it (my wallet hates you and my ears love you  ) I thought I may as well bug this thread for advice in if the FLC8 would suit somebody coming from the GR07 (my headphones are Sennheiser Momentum v1s <3 if that helps understand what I like - trying to help random people with tiny bits of info to go in is the easiest thing in the world )


 
  I would suggest CKR9.


----------



## Mike43110

ozkan said:


> I would suggest CKR9.


 
 I love the concept! A shame the cables aren't detachable...


----------



## ljokerl

mike43110 said:


> My GR07 mk2s are on their last legs (the cable is coming out of the IEMs 0_o) and I was thinking of getting an upgrade with replaceable cables.
> 
> I read your FLC8 review and thought it was very interesting!
> 
> Seeing as how it was your review of the GR07 that brought me to having to get it (my wallet hates you and my ears love you  ) I thought I may as well bug this thread for advice in if the FLC8 would suit somebody coming from the GR07 (my headphones are Sennheiser Momentum v1s <3 if that helps understand what I like - trying to help random people with tiny bits of info to go in is the easiest thing in the world )


 
  
 The A:B comparison I included in that review for the GR07 Classic still holds for the older GR07: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/flc-technology-flc8/ - it'll give you a more v-shaped sound with more powerful bass and slightly brighter treble than the GR07. I consider it an upgrade, but it kind of moves in the opposite direction from the GR07 than the warmer and smoother Momentum.


----------



## Mike43110

ljokerl said:


> The A:B comparison I included in that review for the GR07 Classic still holds for the older GR07: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/flc-technology-flc8/ - it'll give you a more v-shaped sound with more powerful bass and slightly brighter treble than the GR07. I consider it an upgrade, but it kind of moves in the opposite direction from the GR07 than the warmer and smoother Momentum.


 
  
 Thanks! The GR07 series had quite a bit of variability even between the same model! I remember the mk2 I RMA'd and the mk2 I got back sounded different. I did figure out why though. There was glue or something in the vents which changed the presentation. I spent a lot of time fiddling with the vents trying to find the spot where I was the happiest. Which is why the FLC8 intrigued me​! I want to try and make my own ports for the thing and see if shape could make an interesting influence (i.e. find the right shape to).
  
 Thanks for the info though. It does sound like the direction I wanted to move in - after reading the comparison on your website (which is an amazing resource!). I actually like a diverse set of sounds. My HD555s are still loved and used regularly - which have a far FAR lower bass quantity than the Momentums.
  
 Just have to say - LOVE the website. Far easier to use than the old thread which I used to read religiously.


----------



## ljokerl

mike43110 said:


> Thanks! The GR07 series had quite a bit of variability even between the same model! I remember the mk2 I RMA'd and the mk2 I got back sounded different. I did figure out why though. There was glue or something in the vents which changed the presentation. I spent a lot of time fiddling with the vents trying to find the spot where I was the happiest. Which is why the FLC8 intrigued me​! I want to try and make my own ports for the thing and see if shape could make an interesting influence (i.e. find the right shape to).
> 
> Thanks for the info though. It does sound like the direction I wanted to move in - after reading the comparison on your website (which is an amazing resource!). I actually like a diverse set of sounds. My HD555s are still loved and used regularly - which have a far FAR lower bass quantity than the Momentums.
> 
> Just have to say - LOVE the website. Far easier to use than the old thread which I used to read religiously.


 
  
 That's true, and the Classic definitely sounds a bit different from the old GR07, but when you compare it to something fairly different like the FLC8, the gap between different GR07s becomes pretty much negligible. I don't think you could A:B two different GR07 with the FLC8 and come to significantly different conclusions.


----------



## Mike43110

ljokerl said:


> That's true, and the Classic definitely sounds a bit different from the old GR07, but when you compare it to something fairly different like the FLC8, the gap between different GR07s becomes pretty much negligible. I don't think you could A:B two different GR07 with the FLC8 and come to significantly different conclusions.


 

 Well - my FLC8's arrived today!

 What a pleasant surprise! I think I saw somewhere the gold filter was improved. Mine came with grey-grey-gold installed. I fell in love with them already! I started A-B'ing them with my Momentum and found that red-grey-gold worked as an interesting alternative to the Momentum. The boosted mids don't sound unnatural at all and it feels "musical"  to my ears.​
  
 I have too much work to do to do a proper analysis but I am really happy with them! I just wish I had a tip between the smallest and second smallest but interestingly I get similar sound with some boosted bass out of the GR07's flanged tip (An utter pain to get on but worth it while still being slightly large). Tips and insertion depth played a large role in the sound I found. YMMV but personally I am happy as it can keep up with the Momentums which is all I really wanted.
  
 Though now I need an open-dynamic to replace my HD555's  My poor wallet must understand that I can't accept that the Momentum with a far darker sound resolves finer details better (Hifiman 400s here I come - why did I ever come to headfi...)
  
 Just wanted to say thanks! Now off to tinker again and find another setup with an interesting sound signature on the FLC8s... (3 fairly different but good ones so far!)


----------



## ljokerl

mike43110 said:


> Well - my FLC8's arrived today!
> 
> What a pleasant surprise! I think I saw somewhere the gold filter was improved. Mine came with grey-grey-gold installed. I fell in love with them already! I started A-B'ing them with my Momentum and found that red-grey-gold worked as an interesting alternative to the Momentum. The boosted mids don't sound unnatural at all and it feels "musical"  to my ears.​
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sounds like you did get a newer version because mine came with the gray-gray-dark gray configuration out of the box. Glad you're liking them so far! It really does take a while to properly "discover" and explore this IEM but it should be an enjoyable process.


----------



## Ymer

Hello there!

What would you recommend as the best for classical and vocal unamped? Etys still king?

Thanks!


----------



## suman134

ymer said:


> Hello there!
> 
> What would you recommend as the best for classical and vocal unamped? Etys still king?
> 
> Thanks!


 

  I think so.


----------



## ClassicalViola

ymer said:


> Hello there!
> 
> What would you recommend as the best for classical and vocal unamped? Etys still king?
> 
> Thanks!


 
 It really depends. Let your own ears be the judge (that is, if you have the chance to audition any of the earphones). While the Etys are well-known for their detailed presentation, some might find them lacking warmth or the natural timbre for classical music. It's a matter of taste.


----------



## ljokerl

ymer said:


> Hello there!
> 
> What would you recommend as the best for classical and vocal unamped? Etys still king?
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 I agree with ClassicalViola - it really depends on the type of sound you want our of your earphones. An Ety like the HF5 or ER4PT will give you an extremely clear and detailed sound, which generally is a good thing for classical music and for vocals, but I have no doubt that others prefer something else for the same genres - more bass, more mids, more warmth - whatever. Ultimately it depends on the individual listener.


----------



## Penghao

Hi Joker. I really like the sound signature of Klipsch x10. It makes me feel like actually listening to music, not the earphone itself. Now I want to upgrade to CIEM, just wondering what are the models that maybe have the same signature like x10. Hope u can help out, thanks a lot   : )


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review for the FLC Tech FLC 8.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1C25) FLC Technology FLC 8*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2015
> ...


 
  
  


penghao said:


> Hi Joker. I really like the sound signature of Klipsch x10. It makes me feel like actually listening to music, not the earphone itself. Now I want to upgrade to CIEM, just wondering what are the models that maybe have the same signature like x10. Hope u can help out, thanks a lot   : )


 
  
 The X10 is characterized for me by its enhanced bass and rolled-off treble. I don't have any CIEMs with that sound signature, but the closest I have would be the Gorilla Ears GX-4B


----------



## Rpg2

A very thorough review with good comparisons! Thank you for writing it up! Your reviews have been incredibly valuable in research on IEM purchases throughout the years. I still remember when there were only 60 or so IEMs when I stumbled upon this thread, and it just keeps growing!

 The FLC8 remind me of the Phonak PFE and Sleek Audio SA6. Variable tunings are always a pleasant addition to IEM designs, and this one can even have open/closed vents or ports to alter presentation and sound stage. The FLC8 are very tempting and should prove a great value to most buyers with the 2-3 base sound signatures. Your graph of the multiple configurations is very interesting and make for a good reference.

 Based off of your advice from a while back, I ended up getting a pair of Sony MDR-7550 over GR07s and they're wonderful except for the lack of treble sparkle for my tastes. I've been debating between buying a pair of used EX-1000 from the Head-Fi market place or if saving up for the FLC8 would be a better choice since it's a dynamic driver IEM design vs a hybrid triple driver and variable IEM design. Hybrid driver designs are foreign to me, but do they translate into improvements over single driver ones? What are your thoughts between EX-1000 and FLC8 as a better purchase? The EX-1000 can be bought for about $200 to $250 used instead of $400 new so their value rating of 8 could be considered higher.


----------



## suman134

Hey guys, do have a look at my SoundMAGIC E50 review if you are interested.
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/soundmagic-e50-e50s/reviews/13512
  
 Thanks.


----------



## ronnel0918

Good day!
  
 I need your suggestions with the following:
  
 - mid-centric IEM (I love vocals and acoustic. Best for live recordings.). Not recessed.
 - a good low-end (rumbling, punchy bass) is also appreciated but mids is the priority.
 - not necessarily neutral which can become boring sometimes. A fun-sounding IEM with emphasis on the mids is great!
 - sparkly highs (TF10!!!)
 - not fatiguing
  
 Price range is US$350-US$450.
  
 Thank you!


----------



## thesuperguy

Hi Joker,
  
 After my RE262s decided to disintegrate on me (don't ask), I am on the lookout for a new pair of mid-centric IEMs to replace the 262s. My eye is currently set on the RE600s since it seems like an appropriate successor to the RE262, not to mention it is 50% of its original starting price at $200. I would just like to know if there are any other mid-centric IEMs I might want to consider around the price range of $200. I would also like to ask if the RE600s does enough to be worth its $200 price since in your innerfidelity review, you mentioned that the RE400 is just so good that it wasn't necessarily worth paying 4 times the price for the RE600. What about now?


----------



## DopeMusic

Hello everyone, I am writing on behalf of a friend who was going to spend around 200 € for a basshead IEM (he wanted the bass, for instance, similar to those of the beats but I discouraged this type of headphones)  as it listens to a lot of electronic music. What would you recommend?


----------



## ljokerl

rpg2 said:


> A very thorough review with good comparisons! Thank you for writing it up! Your reviews have been incredibly valuable in research on IEM purchases throughout the years. I still remember when there were only 60 or so IEMs when I stumbled upon this thread, and it just keeps growing!
> 
> The FLC8 remind me of the Phonak PFE and Sleek Audio SA6. Variable tunings are always a pleasant addition to IEM designs, and this one can even have open/closed vents or ports to alter presentation and sound stage. The FLC8 are very tempting and should prove a great value to most buyers with the 2-3 base sound signatures. Your graph of the multiple configurations is very interesting and make for a good reference.
> 
> Based off of your advice from a while back, I ended up getting a pair of Sony MDR-7550 over GR07s and they're wonderful except for the lack of treble sparkle for my tastes. I've been debating between buying a pair of used EX-1000 from the Head-Fi market place or if saving up for the FLC8 would be a better choice since it's a dynamic driver IEM design vs a hybrid triple driver and variable IEM design. Hybrid driver designs are foreign to me, but do they translate into improvements over single driver ones? What are your thoughts between EX-1000 and FLC8 as a better purchase? The EX-1000 can be bought for about $200 to $250 used instead of $400 new so their value rating of 8 could be considered higher.


 
  
 Thanks! This was probably the most time-consuming review to date (or at least since the AKG K3003). Very complex product, but that's part of its appeal.
  
 For what you want I'd try to find an EX1000. The EX1000 is kind of a mix of the better traits of the MDR-7550 and GR07, and is more in line with what you want. The FLC8 starts off at a disadvantage in terms of sound signature (again, compared to what you want) and while it can get there with tweaking, I personally would take the easy route with the Sony.
  
 There's no guaranteed performance benefit to having two or more drivers in whatever configuration over a single dynamic driver design - it all comes down to implementation. However, there's all sorts of single-driver earphones out there while hybrids tend to all be high-end, so on average hybrids are indeed better. But, if you were to limit your survey to, say, only top-tier/flagship single-driver earphones, the results would be very different. There might well be more a larger number of excellent dynamics on the market right now than hybrids.
  


ronnel0918 said:


> Good day!
> 
> I need your suggestions with the following:
> 
> ...


 
  
 Bit of a tough ask since you want some enhancement in the midrange, bass, and treble - usually you see one recessed to bring forward the other two. Some tunings of the FLC Tech FLC8 will do this but IMO those aren't its most natural-sounding tunings. But that's in the eye (ear?) of the beholder, so it may be worth trying. Most of the other fun-sounding IEMs with mid emphasis that I'm familiar with come from lower price tiers - e.g. the Ostry KC06, which has the sound signature you want but is just $60 or so.
  
 1964EARS 1964-V3 would be better than the FLC8 if you're open to customs, but it's a bit out of budget.
  


thesuperguy said:


> Hi Joker,
> 
> After my RE262s decided to disintegrate on me (don't ask), I am on the lookout for a new pair of mid-centric IEMs to replace the 262s. My eye is currently set on the RE600s since it seems like an appropriate successor to the RE262, not to mention it is 50% of its original starting price at $200. I would just like to know if there are any other mid-centric IEMs I might want to consider around the price range of $200. I would also like to ask if the RE600s does enough to be worth its $200 price since in your innerfidelity review, you mentioned that the RE400 is just so good that it wasn't necessarily worth paying 4 times the price for the RE600. What about now?


 
  
 I'd still go RE-400 personally - $120 is still a big price gap. The other model I recommend in that price range as an RE262 replacement, the TDK BA200, is getting very hard to find 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.
  


dopemusic said:


> Hello everyone, I am writing on behalf of a friend who was going to spend around 200 € for a basshead IEM (he wanted the bass, for instance, similar to those of the beats but I discouraged this type of headphones)  as it listens to a lot of electronic music. What would you recommend?


 
  
 NHT SuperBuds. Beats-level bass without the stigma. Tons of bass. Monstrous bass.
  
 Also, I think that the Beats Tour 2.0 is actually pretty decent when bass quantity is a priority. Not great value for money by any means, but if you factor in the comfort and the headset functionality they do beat the SuperBuds and the other true basshead IEMs I've tried in that price range.


----------



## Ardian

I have to buy a IEM that is the most identical of my headphones Sony MDR-1A. I need a mic, for this I'm thinking about these IEMs:

Sennheiser momentum In ear
Sony EX650
RHA MA750i

Which one is the best?
The sony are the cheapest and I think the smallest one!!!
Senn Momentum seems very powerful with bass, and RHA with best built and accessorized (but bulkiest).

Thank you


----------



## mzso

Which IEMs should I look at if I want something that matches my superlux hd660-s and Maxell Retro DJ's sound quality.
 I think the Maxell actually sounds better because it doesn't start to buzz with really deep sounds.
 Although I want something balanced/neutral sound. (I actually dislike the Maxell's deep oriented character and compensate via equalizer)


----------



## JamesBr

dopemusic said:


> Hello everyone, I am writing on behalf of a friend who was going to spend around 200 € for a basshead IEM (he wanted the bass, for instance, similar to those of the beats but I discouraged this type of headphones)  as it listens to a lot of electronic music. What would you recommend?


 
  
 I think a lot would go nuts if you decided to go with beats


----------



## suman134

dopemusic said:


> Hello everyone, I am writing on behalf of a friend who was going to spend around 200 € for a basshead IEM (he wanted the bass, for instance, similar to those of the beats but I discouraged this type of headphones)  as it listens to a lot of electronic music. What would you recommend?



 


 I will say, go for XB90EX!!


----------



## ljokerl

ardian said:


> I have to buy a IEM that is the most identical of my headphones Sony MDR-1A. I need a mic, for this I'm thinking about these IEMs:
> 
> Sennheiser momentum In ear
> Sony EX650
> ...


 
  
 I have no clue what the MDR-1A sounds like (or the Sony for that matter) so I can't say which IEM sounds most similar. The MA750 and Momentum are very good earphones that sound moderately different from each other. I tend to prefer the smoother MA750i.
  


mzso said:


> Which IEMs should I look at if I want something that matches my superlux hd660-s and Maxell Retro DJ's sound quality.
> I think the Maxell actually sounds better because it doesn't start to buzz with really deep sounds.
> Although I want something balanced/neutral sound. (I actually dislike the Maxell's deep oriented character and compensate via equalizer)


 
  
 Same as above, no experience with those headphones so I can't make any recommendations based on that, but if you're looking for balanced/neutral IEMs there's tons of options in every price range. I recommended some here: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/#balanced


----------



## mzso

ljokerl said:


> Same as above, no experience with those headphones so I can't make any recommendations based on that, but if you're looking for balanced/neutral IEMs there's tons of options in every price range. I recommended some here: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/#balanced


 
 I've been eyeing the Soundmagic PL50, does that not fit in the balanced category?


----------



## Mattyhew

Have you tried (or plan to try) any of RHA's other offerings such as the T10s or T20s?
  
 (Bought a pair of FLC8s based on your review, cant wait from them to arrive)


----------



## ozkan

mzso said:


> I've been eyeing the Soundmagic PL50, does that not fit in the balanced category?


 
  
 PL50 falls into mid-centric category.


----------



## ljokerl

mattyhew said:


> Have you tried (or plan to try) any of RHA's other offerings such as the T10s or T20s?
> 
> (Bought a pair of FLC8s based on your review, cant wait from them to arrive)


 
  
 The T10 wasn't to my liking so it didn't get a review. The T20 is at InnerFidelity for measurements, but I should be doing a review of that one after I get it back.


----------



## mzso

ozkan said:


> PL50 falls into mid-centric category.


 
  
 Huh. I missed that.


----------



## jyc777

Thank you so much for this detailed comprehensive review, def. helped me chose my IEM and I learned a lot in the process!


----------



## blast0id

FLC Technology FLC 8 was a great review! Thanks for all the amazing input!


----------



## Xinn3r

Joker, have you had any chance to listen to the FXT-100 or 200?
  
 Interested in how it rates against the FXT-90 which is still my favorite IEM to this day.


----------



## jant71

xinn3r said:


> Joker, have you had any chance to listen to the FXT-100 or 200?
> 
> Interested in how it rates against the FXT-90 which is still my favorite IEM to this day.


 
  
 After much research and spending time with my new Xuelin 770C and testing with my JVC Elation, I ordered an FXT200LTD. I will review them but I don't have them yet. They will ship after the holiday.
  
 I know from the Elation and someone who already has the FXT100 the treble is no longer peaky  and subdued compared to the 90 and it is mid-forward and has a faster decay so not much better in terms of performance though it is more detailed but it doesn't seem to have the it factor of the FXT90. FXT200LTD is known as needing amp a bit more and also being a "not for everyone" phone that one should try if they can first. this leaves the FXT200 which is said to take the slight technical improvements the 100 brings over the 90 and  take it a nice notch up being higher resolution and more transparent.
  
 I'm assuming the 200 will need the Spiral dots removed if they do indeed stunt treble a bit as I have read. FXT90 tips are the old treble enhancing tips like on my Elation that tune slightly to a V. Won't know till I get the FXT200 if this really the case in my opinion. My theory is though it is nice to include the Spiral dot tips with them, the FXT's are 26,000 rated on the high side. Fine to subdue a bit of the Woody treble since the FX750/850 which are 40,000 and 45,000 rated and have the extra treble to lose. The reports of the subdued treble is most likely to the dots absorbing it's edge and softening it.
  
 I did find a rating where the FXT200 is rated a tier above the FX750 and up with the CKR9 and 10 and just below the 850.
  
 My prediction is that if you have the FXT90 tips you are good to get the FXT200 provided you know want a bit of audiophile added to that sound. Wait and see if I am right or not in how it behaves. Though I have never heard the FXT90 so no comparison directly though I know from the multitude of impressions what they sound like. I can only say if the FXT200 will like a more audiophile version of that impression(hi-res, not as V and slightly quicker and not quite as thick) or not. We already know the new enhancements have really improved the speed and transients so they will not have the decay and mid-bass presence down low like the FXT90 does.


----------



## ljokerl

I haven't tried them myself but that^ seems reasonable. Wouldn't mind an FXT90 follow-up/upgrade. Unfortunately JVC just keeps sending me more Xtreme Xplosives...


----------



## tomnyamkun

Hi Joker !
 Thank you for your work for reviewing all the IEM here!
  
 Just wondering, have you heard the earwerkz supra?
  
 I'm considering to buy a neutral-ish iem around $400, I've been eye-ing on noble 4, stage diver 2 or the supra right now.
 Or maybe to take the plunge for CIEM (Custom art music 1 or alclair reference).
  
 It's great that there are so many choice in the market right now, but now I'm paralysed  with choice


----------



## maxjstern

tomnyamkun said:


> Hi Joker !
> Thank you for your work for reviewing all the IEM here!
> 
> Just wondering, have you heard the earwerkz supra?
> ...


 
 If you can get it cheap, you will be more satisfied with the Noble 4, it is in another leaque than your other options. Universal or custom version, which one would you choose concerning the Noble 4?


----------



## tomnyamkun

maxjstern said:


> If you can get it cheap, you will be more satisfied with the Noble 4, it is in another leaque than your other options. Universal or custom version, which one would you choose concerning the Noble 4?


 
  
 I could only afford the universal version


----------



## maxjstern

tomnyamkun said:


> I could only afford the universal version


 
 Then go with it, as it has more resell value than a custom and plays in another leaque than the other mentioned IEMs.
  
 But be aware, universals stand and fall with tips!


----------



## WhatToChoose

Wonderfully helpful thread

Anyone got suggestions for an IEM $600 or less with detachable cables, substantial bass, excellent soundstage, clear sound, and durability? 

I have so far looked at:
InEar stagedriver 2&3 - people say it is too dark?
Earsonics sm64 - questionable build quality from some reviews
Nuforce Primo 8 - stellar mids but sound m8ght not work with EDM according to reviews

Still looking, if there are any that match this description but are a bit over $600 too I would happily consided them! Looking for an end-all here...(pls nobody say $2.5k JH's D


----------



## maxjstern

whattochoose said:


> Wonderfully helpful thread
> 
> Anyone got suggestions for an IEM $600 or less with detachable cables, substantial bass, excellent soundstage, clear sound, and durability?
> 
> ...


 
 The Inear SD3 has much bass than the SD2, so it would fit your preference. Both models have some kind of a balanced sound, atleast the SD2, as the SD3 has a bass boost, but it is not a bleeding one.
  
 A consideration would be the Aurisonics ASG-1Plus, the build quality is said to be excellent(handcrafted in the USA) and the ASG-Line is said to have a lot of rumble and bass and detachable cables.


----------



## maxjstern

*more


----------



## shultzee

whattochoose said:


> Wonderfully helpful thread
> 
> Anyone got suggestions for an IEM $600 or less with detachable cables, substantial bass, excellent soundstage, clear sound, and durability?
> 
> ...


 

 Definetley give the Westone UM Pro 50 a test drive.  Ticks all your box's.  Can be bought new right at $500.00  .   I was shocked how good it is for the money.


----------



## oldschool

whattochoose said:


> Wonderfully helpful thread
> 
> Anyone got suggestions for an IEM $600 or less with detachable cables, substantial bass, excellent soundstage, clear sound, and durability?
> 
> ...


 
  
 The build quality of the SM64 has improved. Only the first batch was said to have issues and that was a long time ago.
  
 On a side note - how about the Velvet? Ticks all boxes and can be had new for $600.


----------



## WhatToChoose

@maxjstern Thanks for your opinion! I really like the build quality of the stagedrivers, and I think they would work well. Would you happen to know what kind of warranty they have (I dont quite recall seeing one on their website)? I prefer IEMs with at least a 2 year warranty, since compared to a 1 year one it says so.ething about the manufacturer's confidence in their product. They look excellent though! Also, I have heard great things about the Aurisonics. I'll look into that as well

@shultzee

Westone w50 you say? Another option....I will check some reviews. I had the W3s before, and they were decent, but at the time I didn't know they were power hungry, since they produced a lackluster sound from my clip. Very well made though, so I have no doubt the w50s are the same. Thank you for your opinion!

@oldschool

Ah, that's great to know! It is looking like the sm64 will win, but I'm not liking that measly 1 year warranty....argh
I have looked at the velvet, and found mixed reviews. Some say they are bass delights while being excellent, while others say they don't sound very good (bass club thread were the ones who said this). I will check them out more though, thank you!

I really appreciate your opinions guys. Looks like my lost grew instead of shrinking....


----------



## shultzee

whattochoose said:


> @maxjstern Thanks for your opinion! I really like the build quality of the stagedrivers, and I think they would work well. Would you happen to know what kind of warranty they have (I dont quite recall seeing one on their website)? I prefer IEMs with at least a 2 year warranty, since compared to a 1 year one it says so.ething about the manufacturer's confidence in their product. They look excellent though! Also, I have heard great things about the Aurisonics. I'll look into that as well
> 
> @shultzee
> 
> ...


 
 No   not the Westone w50 ..  Westone UM 50 Pro    different animal.  Its their pro series for onstage performing.   You can drive them easily off a iPhone .


----------



## maxjstern

whattochoose said:


> @maxjstern Thanks for your opinion! I really like the build quality of the stagedrivers, and I think they would work well. Would you happen to know what kind of warranty they have (I dont quite recall seeing one on their website)? I prefer IEMs with at least a 2 year warranty, since compared to a 1 year one it says so.ething about the manufacturer's confidence in their product. They look excellent though! Also, I have heard great things about the Aurisonics. I'll look into that as well
> 
> @shultzeeh


 
 If you can get them(the stagedivers) from Thomann(a renowned seller from Germany) you even get a 3-year warranty(a specialty from the seller). Otherwise I can´t tell you more about the warranty, but I know that the support service is very good, so I recommend writing them.


----------



## oldschool

whattochoose said:


> I had the W3s before, and they were decent, but at the time I didn't know they were power hungry, since they produced a lackluster sound from my clip. Very well made though, so I have no doubt the w50s are the same. Thank you for your opinion!


 
  
 Btw - expect the same with the SM64. Their impedance is 98 ohm and they need a powerful DAC. Definitely not for the Clip (and especially the Sport, which can't be Rockboxed for what I know), unless you'd listen to music that is super loud, like DR6 and below.


----------



## ericr

@WhatToChoose

Worthy of consideration from 1964 Ears: V3 and Qi.

They will make them universal (no ear impressions needed) upon request.


----------



## ljokerl

tomnyamkun said:


> Hi Joker !
> Thank you for your work for reviewing all the IEM here!
> 
> Just wondering, have you heard the earwerkz supra?
> ...


 
  
 No, I haven't tried the Supra.
  
 SD-2 is good, a bit on the warm/dark side compared to my custom Noble 4S (which I consider more neutral overall) but very smooth and pleasant. The Alclair Reference is a bit more v-shaped overall. Unless you can go to the next level of Custom Art (Pro330v2) I would stick with universals in that price range for neutral sound. 
  
  


whattochoose said:


> Wonderfully helpful thread
> 
> Anyone got suggestions for an IEM $600 or less with detachable cables, substantial bass, excellent soundstage, clear sound, and durability?
> 
> ...


 
  
 Substantial bass means not the SD-2 and probably not the SM64... SM64 has very good bass but I wouldn't call it bass-heavy. SD-3 more so but there are other options. Not sure about the Primo 8.
  
 The bassiest set I've heard in that price range with detachable cords is the Sony XBA-Z5. It has OK clarity considering how enhanced its bass is, but overall I prefer the ES Velvet which someone else mentioned already. Better clarity, almost as much bass, and conventional replaceable cables.


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Wouldn't mind an FXT90 follow-up/upgrade. Unfortunately *JVC just keeps sending me more Xtreme Xplosives...*


 
  
 They seem to know your secret desires.


----------



## jant71

james444 said:


> They seem to know your secret desires.


 
 Joker the basshead! Keep that on the DL
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


ljokerl said:


> I haven't tried them myself but that^ seems reasonable. Wouldn't mind an FXT90 follow-up/upgrade. Unfortunately JVC just keeps sending me more Xtreme Xplosives...


 

 Are they sending you the FR100X? The Elation is XX done right. Still pretty much a basshead phone but done right. The treble is polite and not peaky. The bass is also even handed and not obtrusive. Mids are only a slight bit U in the mix and quite enjoyable. With my 770C on Jazz and the bright HO they are actually not a basshead phone anymore and I was not unhappy to sell my E80 and buy the FXT200 as an upgrade(in my estimation) with more character; perhaps a more unique presentation.
  
 I remember the E80 impressions from CES and they didn't seem that great but I realized when I bought them how much you need to ditch the stock tips to make them shine. The E80 and Titan 1 are both excellent phones but I like the Elation better than the DUNU(both in SQ overall and sound sig) and as much as the E80(E80 is better than the other two). I'll probably buy another E80 later on in the gold but, atm, I used those funds to buy something that would perform really well plus bring that engaging quality that takes you to a special place. E80 take you to excellent SQ land with a nice lower bass and mid-high treble focus but they don't have the Elation's sweet mids/vocals nor is their treble and bass hook as tasty as my modded PS20's which fall in between the JVC and E80.
  
 My FXT apparently are in Jamaica, NY so I should have them for the weekend 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 which was not looking good since the Monday Japanese holiday made it seem like I might have to wait till Monday next to get them.
  
 Also got this so I can resurrect my Kanen thread


----------



## kova4a

jant71 said:


> Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Hmm, that Kanen looks like a Sennheiser ie7 clone.


----------



## jant71

Yep, like the Kanen KM-902 which is said to be decent for around $4. Not sure if the KDJ model that also was suppose to use it was ever actually available. Kanen only use the IE6 and IE7 housings. The S30 is supposedly a rugged little sports type phone good as a knock-around/sports/bad weather job. Pretty much just got them to have a little fun as I have a Philips SDHQ5200 so those requirements are fillfilled outside of some isolation and a small size where the S30 can come in handy at times if decent enough sounding. If anything I get to bump the Kanen thread, see if they made something a bit better than before. Good to not worry about destroying or losing cause they can be had for $4.80 shipped


----------



## WhatToChoose

Thanks for all your opinions guys, very insightful! It seems like the Earsonics velvets are getting quite a bit of recommendations. I especially like their changeable tuning. I will look into these more, hopefully they have sufficient quality and warranty and such. I also checked out the 1964 ears Qi. These seem nice as well, but not too many reviews praising their sound to the level that others get praised. Also looking at Noble, they are definitely on the radar....


----------



## ljokerl

james444 said:


> They seem to know your secret desires.


 
  
  
 They should know that the XX IEMs are just not bassy enough for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  


jant71 said:


> Joker the basshead! Keep that on the DL
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yes, I'm happy with the Elation so far. Seems to be smoother than my old FX101/FR301 (harshness is my biggest issue with those). 
  
 +1 on that being an IE7 clone. Not a bad thing, those were always comfy for me, assuming Kanen got the nozzle angle right.


----------



## tomnyamkun

Thanks all for the reply !
 I'll do some more research


----------



## CommunistJason

Which IEM should i choose the Macaw GT100S or HiFiMAN RE 400? Any other suggestions in the price range would also be appreciated.


----------



## suman134

communistjason said:


> Which IEM should i choose the Macaw GT100S or HiFiMAN RE 400? Any other suggestions in the price range would also be appreciated.


 
  
    Would be a nice comparison never the less, but would you take the RE-400 over the Macaw? If you have to chose one, go with you heart.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> Would be a nice comparison never the less, but would you take the RE-400 over the Macaw? *If you have to chose one, go with you heart.*


 
 Nah, go with your ears....
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


 jk! yeah I doubt Macaw wld be on par with waterlines, albeit it has tuning nozzles and there will be bass, BQ aside.


----------



## suman134

shawn71 said:


> Nah, go with your ears....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 What to do, people feel bad when they dont go with what they want and fell that they were right from unreliable sources? Sometimes one have to be diplomatic.
  
 Cuz if you take my word, i still dont think an earphone under $100 can beat RE-400, still you have to take your ears where your signature meets.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Cant tell a bass head to love RE-400.


----------



## Shawn71

suman134 said:


> What to do, people feel bad when they dont go with what they want and fell that they were right from unreliable sources? Sometimes one have to be diplomatic.
> 
> *Cuz if you take my word, i still dont think an earphone under $100 can beat RE-400,* still you have to take your ears where your signature meets.
> 
> ...


 





 yep that's what I meant......but yeah may be under $79, with their current RRP? just add an amp (E11) to the chain? voila!!! Boom.


----------



## DecentLevi

Hello guys, I'm posting here in hopes to get a suggestion for an IEM. After 500+ postings on head-fi, this is surprisingly my first post about IEMs. So maybe somebody can help me to 'come out of the closet' with IEMs... or even if the thread owner @ljokerl would chime in, I would be super tickled!
  
 Last year I had studied the first half of this thread for sub $60 IEMs, and bought both the Soundmagic E30 and Maximo iMetal iM-590. Of these, I found the E30 to be too dark / muddy, and I like the iMetal, but one of the channels died and it sounded a tad too claustrophobic.
  
So here is what I'm looking for: An IEM *under $250-ish*, *bullet or tube shape*, that has fairly neutral FR, good clarity and punch. By bullet / tube shape, I like these as opposed to the full IEM 'hearing aid' type so it's much faster to put in / take out. And more on the sound signature I'm looking for: I like a decent amount of clarity / instrument separation / detail (yet not super analytical), and I like the frequency response to be fairly flat but maybe _slightly _V-shaped is OK - natural bass response but nothing even remotely resembling 'bass heavy' of 'basshead'; - closer to neutral.
  
For reference with full size 'cans, I love the sound of the Senn. HD 650 and Stax SR-009, I like the DT 880, but am not into the Audeze LCD2 or Ether headphones sound which seem too 'dark' for me. 
Thanks in advance!


----------



## getclikinagas

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, I'm posting here in hopes to get a suggestion for an IEM. After 500+ postings on head-fi, this is surprisingly my first post about IEMs. So maybe somebody can help me to 'come out of the closet' with IEMs... or even if the thread owner @ljokerl would chime in, I would be super tickled!
> 
> Last year I had studied the first half of this thread for sub $60 IEMs, and bought both the Soundmagic E30 and Maximo iMetal iM-590. Of these, I found the E30 to be too dark / muddy, and I like the iMetal, but one of the channels died and it sounded a tad too claustrophobic.
> 
> ...


 
 Hi @DecentLevi. Out of the IEMs I have heard(not many), the following two IEMs come close to what you are looking for.

*Category**Requirement**DUNU Titan 1*​*HiFiMAN RE400*​PriceUnder 250$~115$​~79$​Form factorBullet or tube shapeHalf in-ear; cable down​Very small, tube shape; cable down​Clarity, DetailDecent amountVery clear, highly detailed, Upfront with detail, attention grabbing.​Transparent Midrange, forgiving highs, very tight bass, more laid back with details but present nonetheless​Instrument separationDecent amountVery natural sonic space, imaging, placement is natural, sound-stage wider than taller,​Layering is excellent and separation is very good, sound-stage is average without sounding congested,​Sound signatureFairly flat but maybe slightly V-shapedSlight V shape, emphasis begins in upper midrange and increases slightly into the highs, no clear bass hump, extends deep. Organic comes to mind.​Warm lilt to a Neutral signature, Slightly forward midrange, laid back treble, tight bass that extends deep but loses some presence in sub-bass.​BassNatural bass responseBass takes advantage of airiness, right amount of decay to sound organic, in the slight V- bass levels climbs a little into lower midrange but not distracting​Beautifully crafted mid-bass but loses some natural feel due to low sub-bass presence​Reference Love -Senn. HD 650 and Stax SR-009
Like - DT880, Maximo iMetal iM-590
Not into - LCD2/Ether/Soundmagic E30
Sadly have not heard any of your reference IEMs/HPs enough to give you a comparison.​Sadly have not heard any of your references IEMs/HPs enough to give you a comparison.​
  
 My experience above 150$ is limited, so there may be better options for you around the 250$ mark.
 There is a lot of experience here to tap into, and I am sure people(including ljokerl) will help you soon. Best of luck with your first third IEM purchase
  
 PS: Try to get an audition of the DUNU Titan 1. It comes close to your criteria. The half in ear design may seem off-putting but I find it easy to put-in/take-out. Let me know if you have any further questions.


----------



## DecentLevi

Hello, thanks for your helpful response. I'm not sure about the DUNU Titan 1 because of its' shape. From experience it seems as if deep-insertion can give a better sound, but this one looks like it may not go in deep enough. And what are those vent holes on it?
  
 For the RE-400 this seems nice, but I've not been a fan of the general Hifiman 'house sound' from their full size 'cans, except for the HE-6 which was phenomenal. By any chance would you be able to post which full size headphone the RE-400 sounds most similar to - Hifiman or any brand? Thanks, and I still hope LjokerL can jump in on this too


----------



## suman134

decentlevi said:


> Hello, thanks for your helpful response. I'm not sure about the DUNU Titan 1 because of its' shape. From experience it seems as if deep-insertion can give a better sound, but this one looks like it may not go in deep enough. And what are those vent holes on it?
> 
> For the RE-400 this seems nice, but I've not been a fan of the general Hifiman 'house sound' from their full size 'cans, except for the HE-6 which was phenomenal. By any chance would you be able to post which full size headphone the RE-400 sounds most similar to - Hifiman or any brand? Thanks, and I still hope LjokerL can jump in on this too


 

  There are not many in this price range, and those you will find will be either super flat like ER-4 series, ortofons and Doppio or will be V shaped like Dn-1000 and XBA-H3. But there are a few you can consider.
   I dont know if its available at your convenience or not but flare audio R2 is an awesome sounding earphone, another one will be Fidue A83, be careful of its shape though, best i can think of is FLC-8!! Even if its a bit over your budget, its worth it. I fancy owning one of this FLC-8 earphones myself.
  
  Then i think if you enjoy some bass, you will like DN-2000 too. Not overly analytical.
  
  I think Joker can shed more light on this.


----------



## Toom

Oi oi Joker. Will you be checking out the new Soundmagic E80?


----------



## Za Warudo

Hi Joker, what top tier CIEM has a similar neutral signature as the RE400, maybe with just a tad more lower bass.


----------



## getclikinagas

decentlevi said:


> Hello, thanks for your helpful response. I'm not sure about the DUNU Titan 1 because of its' shape. From experience it seems as if deep-insertion can give a better sound, but this one looks like it may not go in deep enough. And what are those vent holes on it?
> 
> For the RE-400 this seems nice, but I've not been a fan of the general Hifiman 'house sound' from their full size 'cans, except for the HE-6 which was phenomenal. By any chance would you be able to post which full size headphone the RE-400 sounds most similar to - Hifiman or any brand? Thanks, and I still hope LjokerL can jump in on this too


 
  
 "Deeper fit" does not necessarily translate to "better sound". A good seal is definitely more important.
  
 The vent holes serve to relieve air pressure around the diaphragm. Vents are usually placed on either side of the driver and can reduce the damping effect. Pressure(or lack of pressure change) inside the IEM shell will resist large movements and cause the driver to return to default(null) position. 
 They affect bass and can extend soundstage width. This of course comes with with a trade-off : Isolation.
  
 Manufacturers try to strike a good balance of bass quantity, tightness, isolation and soundstage when designing IEMs with vents.
  
 The principles are similar to Open back Headphones and Closed back Headphones and Headphones with Semi-open designs.
  
 PS: Venting is not the only way to acheive good soundstage width. Custom IEMs are completely sealed and yet manage to reproduce a spacious stage.
  
 PS2: Unfortunately I have not had the pleasure of hearing any HiFiMAN headphones so I will not be able to compare the RE400.


----------



## Xacxac

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, I'm posting here in hopes to get a suggestion for an IEM. After 500+ postings on head-fi, this is surprisingly my first post about IEMs. So maybe somebody can help me to 'come out of the closet' with IEMs... or even if the thread owner @ljokerl would chime in, I would be super tickled!
> 
> Last year I had studied the first half of this thread for sub $60 IEMs, and bought both the Soundmagic E30 and Maximo iMetal iM-590. Of these, I found the E30 to be too dark / muddy, and I like the iMetal, but one of the channels died and it sounded a tad too claustrophobic.
> 
> ...


 

 I've heard both of HD650 & SR-009 and I wasn't really surprised. They're too neutral/laid back/clean; boring for me. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I've never heard any Audeze tho. However, I have a pair of RE-400 and I think its sound signature quite similar to HD-650. RE-400 (and any <$250 IEMs) are far from SR-009 (well, the price...). I bought RE-400 because of amazing price/performance ratio. I think the biggest downside of RE-400 after listening HD-650 will be soundstage. RE-400 can't compete with open full size like HD650. Dunu 1000 (and 2000 for a lil bit more $) got good reviews too. They're quite V-shaped.
  
 I'm agree with getclickinagas. Some IEMs are made for deep insertion, some are shallow insertion. RE-400 is made for deep insertion, but it is so small so it doesn't bother me.
  
 I live in Santa Clara & I'd be happy to let you hear RE-400 if you're interested. Btw, I'm not selling it.


----------



## Shawn71

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, I'm posting here in hopes to get a suggestion for an IEM. After 500+ postings on head-fi, this is surprisingly my first post about IEMs. So maybe somebody can help me to 'come out of the closet' with IEMs... or even if the thread owner @ljokerl would chime in, I would be super tickled!
> 
> Last year I had studied the first half of this thread for sub $60 IEMs, and bought both the Soundmagic E30 and Maximo iMetal iM-590. Of these, I found the E30 to be too dark / muddy, and I like the iMetal, but one of the channels died and it sounded a tad too claustrophobic.
> 
> ...


 

 T-PEOS Altone 200 triple hybrids cld be a better choice.....for your bolded and underlined texts.


----------



## ljokerl

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, I'm posting here in hopes to get a suggestion for an IEM. After 500+ postings on head-fi, this is surprisingly my first post about IEMs. So maybe somebody can help me to 'come out of the closet' with IEMs... or even if the thread owner @ljokerl would chime in, I would be super tickled!
> 
> Last year I had studied the first half of this thread for sub $60 IEMs, and bought both the Soundmagic E30 and Maximo iMetal iM-590. Of these, I found the E30 to be too dark / muddy, and I like the iMetal, but one of the channels died and it sounded a tad too claustrophobic.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
 Someone mentioned Ortofon which is the first thing I thought of as well. The e-Q5 is right in that price range and has a bullet housing and nice balanced sound without being overly analytical. Runner up in that regard would probably be the VSonic GR01, but if bass punch is a factor and you're trying to go less analytical, I don't think I'd pick the VSonic over the Ortofon. 
  
 The requirement for a straight housing eliminates most of the dynamic-driver options in that price range (like VSonics and Philips Fidelios) but leaves the Sony MDR-EX600 (sort of). These can be difficult to find and have a weird housing shape, but in the end they do fit like a "straight" housing and have great sound for what you're after. Most in-ears will have a soundstage more like the Maximos, a little in-the-head compared to full-size cans, but the EX600 is one of the exceptions to this. 
  
 In my short time with them so far the Aurisonics Rockets are promising as well, but I haven't had them long enough to say anything definitive. Just throwing them out there because I'm sure there's already a ton of Rockets reviews out there.
  


toom said:


> Oi oi Joker. Will you be checking out the new Soundmagic E80?


 
  
 Probably, but not right this moment. Came across a couple of good earphones lately that deserve full write-ups, starting with the Rockets mentioned above. 
  


za warudo said:


> Hi Joker, what top tier CIEM has a similar neutral signature as the RE400, maybe with just a tad more lower bass.


 
  
 From the ones I have, the Noble 4S reminds me most of the RE-400 (neutral-leaning-warm tone, very smooth, nothing getting in the way of the midrange, etc) and the direction I'd want the RE-400 sound to go. Comparison here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/noble-4s/


----------



## proedros

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, I'm posting here in hopes to get a suggestion for an IEM. After 500+ postings on head-fi, this is surprisingly my first post about IEMs. So maybe somebody can help me to 'come out of the closet' with IEMs... or even if the thread owner @ljokerl would chime in, I would be super tickled!
> 
> Last year I had studied the first half of this thread for sub $60 IEMs, and bought both the Soundmagic E30 and Maximo iMetal iM-590. Of these, I found the E30 to be too dark / muddy, and I like the iMetal, but one of the channels died and it sounded a tad too claustrophobic.
> 
> ...


 
  
  
@joker mentioned them and i support them as well , get the eq-5

 i just saw @shotgunshane selling his like-new pair for just 125$ , a great price imo
  
 punchy (but not bloated) bass , good sweet(but not thick) mids and airy sparkly (but not sibilant) highs

 a no brainer for what you ask if you wanna stay below 200$

 as for the re400 , i had it and i found it very mediocre (imo) and sold it, eq5 is way better plus it is bullet-style as you want

 for 125$ , the eq-5 simply shouts to you 'buy me now'


----------



## Shawn71

musicacoustics have them for $148!.....
  
 http://www.musicaacoustics.com/#!ortofon/c168n


----------



## alert426

Wow good information! Thanks!


----------



## DecentLevi

Thanks much guys, I'm interested in the Ortofon EQ 5, seems to tick all my boxes. Another popular in-ear man on HeadFi also seems to highly recommend the Atomic Floyd Darts, based on my sound preferences. Any of you tried their Super Darts Titanium, Super Darts or Mini Darts?
  
 He also recommends Shure SE425. Does anyone have any experience with these? But I wonder about the ease of quickly putting in / taking out


----------



## maxjstern

decentlevi said:


> Thanks much guys, I'm interested in the Ortofon EQ 5, seems to tick all my boxes. Another popular in-ear man on HeadFi also seems to highly recommend the Atomic Floyd Darts, based on my sound preferences. Any of you tried their Super Darts Titanium, Super Darts or Mini Darts?
> 
> He also recommends Shure SE425. Does anyone have any experience with these? But I wonder about the ease of quickly putting in / taking out


 
 The Atomic Floyds are said to be very V-Shaped, that means: Dynamic driver rumbling bass + balanced armature driver sparkling highs...
  
 The Shures are generally very comfortable once they fit, it is quite a technique on its own to insert them, Shure themselves released some tutorials.
 The SE425 is said to be fairly neutral with dry and lean bass, some find it to be a bit too less... I once ran a test on their website which earphones suits me best, I ticked rock music, ect..., the SE425 was the result....


----------



## ljokerl

decentlevi said:


> Thanks much guys, I'm interested in the Ortofon EQ 5, seems to tick all my boxes. Another popular in-ear man on HeadFi also seems to highly recommend the Atomic Floyd Darts, based on my sound preferences. Any of you tried their Super Darts Titanium, Super Darts or Mini Darts?
> 
> He also recommends Shure SE425. Does anyone have any experience with these? But I wonder about the ease of quickly putting in / taking out


 
  
 In my experience you generally don't want a hybrid earphone like the Dart if you're looking for balanced/neutral sound. Of the 20-30 hybrid earphones I've tried I don't think any have fit that description.


----------



## jant71

ljokerl said:


> They should know that the XX IEMs are just not bassy enough for me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 Okay, two related things on those two earphones. I got the Kanen and they are actually a bit better than the Elation esp. in the clarity dept. Great little value even though the IE7 housing is not my easiest to fit since it is shallow and the memory wire adds to the learning curve at the beginning. All is good with a little practice and the right tips(TF10 grays). Big, airy, pretty quick and a bit of a V but not that much. They do present like the IE7 does due to the housing as far as stage height, depth, and width. I've bought the VSD2S/AN16 combo and the e80 for $52 but the Kanen are the best value phones of late for me. They did show up with only the generic bi-flanges on them and no S/M/L singles.
  
 Now, the Elation being the walking phone in my sports arsenal were already beaten by the Philips SHQ5200(think waterproof SHP5401 for sports) in the SQ dept. Something had to be done 
  
 I peeled of the front screens. They are peel and stick so I put them on some wax paper. Now they do the things they say on the box such as quick and solid bass(jabs tighter but harder). A bit bigger and more open since they aren't blanketed over and they are brighter but still not peaky like JVC of old. I look in and see that the driver is metal capped(a center dome and 2mm holes on the perimeter) so their signature comes from that and not the filter screens which just seem to be there to turn them into an "XX". Since they are  still encased I doubt I'll put replacement screens on and just leave them. Still bassy but not basshead.
  
 Really jumped them up a level since they are freer, quicker, clearer which shows their detail and what they highlight in their signature even more so now. I recommend the mod for them to be both better and an all-rounder.


----------



## wolf230

jant71 said:


> Okay, two related things on those two earphones. I got the Kanen and they are actually a bit better than the Elation esp. in the clarity dept. Great little value even though the IE7 housing is not my easiest to fit since it is shallow and the memory wire adds to the learning curve at the beginning. All is good with a little practice and the right tips(TF10 grays). Big, airy, pretty quick and a bit of a V but not that much. They do present like the IE7 does due to the housing as far as stage height, depth, and width. I've bought the VSD2S/AN16 combo and the e80 for $52 but the Kanen are the best value phones of late for me. They did show up with only the generic bi-flanges on them and no S/M/L singles.
> 
> Now, the Elation being the walking phone in my sports arsenal were already beaten by the Philips SHQ5200(think waterproof SHP5401 for sports) in the SQ dept. Something had to be done
> 
> ...


 
 Sorry dude,
  
 i'm interested into buy Kanen as a running rough iem, and i love bass (actually i use a Meelec M6, but they do not convices me); you will reccomed these to me?
  
 Thanks a lot
  
 Edit: In addition ANYONE can reccomend me a good sport IEM (possibly sweatproof or at least very robust) with Mic with a Bassy/Warm/V-L Shaped Signature? 
 THANKS more and more


----------



## B9Scrambler

wolf230 said:


> Sorry dude,
> 
> i'm interested into buy Kanen as a running rough iem, and i love bass (actually i use a Meelec M6, but they do not convices me); you will reccomed these to me?
> 
> ...




You sir should check out the Sony AS800AP. A great iem in its own right, that also happens to be sport focused. Waterproof, durable, comfortable, have a mic, lots of bass (without sacrificing everything else). Love the things.  They come highly recommended from me, especially since they meet all of your criteria.


----------



## wolf230

b9scrambler said:


> You sir should check out the Sony AS800AP. A great iem in its own right, that also happens to be sport focused. Waterproof, durable, comfortable, have a mic, lots of bass (without sacrificing everything else). Love the things.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 Thanks Scrambler,
  
 I've never heard about these Sony, but they perfect fit my needs. Thanks a lot!


----------



## esteebin

wolf230 said:


> Sorry dude,
> 
> i'm interested into buy Kanen as a running rough iem, and i love bass (actually i use a Meelec M6, but they do not convices me); you will reccomed these to me?
> 
> ...




Westone Adventure Series Beta $50 on eBay seller: Beachcamera

Along with your requirements, it also has detachable cable, and can be worn cable down or up around ears.
I don't have this personally but could be another to consider.


----------



## ljokerl

esteebin said:


> Westone Adventure Series Beta $50 on eBay seller: Beachcamera
> 
> Along with your requirements, it also has detachable cable, and can be worn cable down or up around ears.
> I don't have this personally but could be another to consider.


 
  
 The Alpha was the one I thought of. If the Beta sounds similar, should be a great fit as well.


----------



## DecentLevi

The word's out, but in case you didn't didn't hear there's a front-page review of the Aurisonics Rockets:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/aurisonics-rockets-solo-precision-micro-dynamic-noise-isolating-in-ear-headphones/reviews/13628


----------



## 1TrickPony

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, I'm posting here in hopes to get a suggestion for an IEM. After 500+ postings on head-fi, this is surprisingly my first post about IEMs. So maybe somebody can help me to 'come out of the closet' with IEMs... or even if the thread owner @ljokerl
> would chime in, I would be super tickled!
> 
> Last year I had studied the first half of this thread for sub $60 IEMs, and bought both the [COLOR=222222]Soundmagic E30 and[/COLOR][COLOR=222222] Maximo iMetal iM-590. Of these, I found the E30 to be too dark / muddy, and I like the iMetal, but one of the channels died and it sounded a tad too claustrophobic.[/COLOR]
> ...




Hopefully I'm not to late to the party. I'll vouch for the Titans. Listening to Asbloodrunsblack and some Meshuggah with these and the guitar chugs and cymbals just simply shine. I remember getting that "tight band"sound.

Edit: there's a Paulus mod available that lowers leakage and tunes the bass using medical tape to block 1-3 portholes.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Fidue A31s, an IEM that places comfort above all else.
  
 As always, the most up-to-date IEM ranking can be found here
  
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3B43) Fidue A31s*
> 
> 
> Reviewed May 2015
> ...


----------



## DecentLevi

Your reviews are done in an outstanding way, @ljokerl - also I have a question for you or others.
  
 OK I took your advice and ordered the e-Q5 earphones - shipped all the way from Japan for me, but I'm sad to say these just aren't my sound. I posted my impressions here. I think I may have described my sound preferences wrong. By balanced / neutral sound I don't mean all the way to the extreme flatness of balanced armature's or like the Fischer FA-003 cans, but maybe about 1/2 way closer towards the v-sahped sound of, say... Momentums.
  
 I found the e-Q5 sounded muddy / non detailed / non punchy, rolled off highs & lows and basically inverted soundstage.
  
 I am basically looking for the opposite sound: detailed, impactful, good bass & treble extension and somewhat analytical would be great.
  
 I'm leaning towards the suggestion for a T-PEOS Altone 200, or Shure SE 425. Do you think that would suit me well or are there any other suggestions? I need it around $300 but don't necessarily need straight-housing, just as long as it's really easy to insert / remove. THANKS!


----------



## suman134

decentlevi said:


> Your reviews are done in an outstanding way, @ljokerl - also I have a question for you or others.
> 
> OK I took your advice and ordered the e-Q5 earphones - shipped all the way from Japan for me, but I'm sad to say these just aren't my sound. I posted my impressions here. I think I may have described my sound preferences wrong. By balanced / neutral sound I don't mean all the way to the extreme flatness of balanced armature's or like the Fischer FA-003 cans, but maybe about 1/2 way closer towards the v-sahped sound of, say... Momentums.
> 
> ...


 

  I told you to go for DN-2k, but you were keen on EQ5. hmmh. Go for Altone maybe. You will like that if you are okay with a V shaped sound. I dont know why you were sold the idea of EQ5, cuz Titan-1 would have done better than it for you.


----------



## suman134

Why not go for the DN-2000J for $50 more, cuz as far as i know, its the best you will ever get for under $500.


----------



## 1TrickPony

suman134 said:


> I told you to go for DN-2k, but you were keen on EQ5. hmmh. Go for Altone maybe. You will like that if you are okay with a V shaped sound. I dont know why you were sold the idea of EQ5, cuz Titan-1 would have done better than it for you.




I own both Titans and DN2000. I'll say this off the bat, the dn2000 took some time to tame the sibilance (tips, dap eq,etc.) I can only imagine how that's gonna be with the J version since it's tilted towards the high frequency. 

The DN2000 is more W Shaped where the b Titans are more V, although the mids aren't necessarily recessed. You might wanna look into the fidue a73 but some guys there just pitch it too forcefully.


----------



## BB 808

suman134 said:


> Why not go for the DN-2000J for $50 more, cuz as far as i know, its the best you will ever get for under $500.



Although I haven't heard the DN-2000J, I think the FLC-8 is the best universal IEM under $500.


----------



## suman134

bb 808 said:


> Although I haven't heard the DN-2000J, I think the FLC-8 is the best universal IEM under $500.



 That is debatable but i think 2000j is better.


----------



## suman134

1trickpony said:


> I own both Titans and DN2000. I'll say this off the bat, the dn2000 took some time to tame the sibilance (tips, dap eq,etc.) I can only imagine how that's gonna be with the J version since it's tilted towards the high frequency.
> 
> The DN2000 is more W Shaped where the b Titans are more V, although the mids aren't necessarily recessed. You might wanna look into the fidue a73 but some guys there just pitch it too forcefully.




 He is considering the Altone 200 which is simlar or worse with sibilance and has sparky highs like Titan-1, i don't think he will enjoy the A73 as it lacks much energy up top , coming from a not so good experience with EQ5.


----------



## ozkan

decentlevi said:


> Your reviews are done in an outstanding way, @ljokerl - also I have a question for you or others.
> 
> OK I took your advice and ordered the e-Q5 earphones - shipped all the way from Japan for me, but I'm sad to say these just aren't my sound. I posted my impressions here. I think I may have described my sound preferences wrong. By balanced / neutral sound I don't mean all the way to the extreme flatness of balanced armature's or like the Fischer FA-003 cans, but maybe about 1/2 way closer towards the v-sahped sound of, say... Momentums.
> 
> ...


 
  
 May I suggest CKR9 or CKRltd?


----------



## ZapX629

ozkan said:


> May I suggest CKR9 or CKRltd?


 

 Yeah, that'd be my suggestion. Fits everything you're looking for. CKR9 is only $150 now.


----------



## davidcotton

Just a note to say that AMP3 in the uk are giving away fidue a31 with each order over £100.00.  Which is kinda nice of them.


----------



## ljokerl

davidcotton said:


> Just a note to say that AMP3 in the uk are giving away fidue a31 with each order over £100.00.  Which is kinda nice of them.


 
  
 No better price than free, and these are actually much more useful than your average budget IEM because you can sleep in them (and there's a mic/remote as well).


----------



## peter123

ozkan said:


> May I suggest CKR9 or CKRltd?



Yes you may 



zapx629 said:


> Yeah, that'd be my suggestion. Fits everything you're looking for. CKR9 is only $150 now.



+1


----------



## DecentLevi

Hello folks thanks for your suggestions. I'm going with the Dunu DN-2000J, as per experienced users it seems very refined / detailed / punchy and is straight-housing.


----------



## altrunox

ey mr. ljokerl, it has been a while since I have read some stuff here, so sorry if others dudes already asked for it...
 Any plans for the Vsonic VSD5?


----------



## james444

decentlevi said:


> Hello folks thanks for your suggestions. I'm going with the Dunu DN-2000J, as per experienced users it seems very refined / detailed / punchy and is straight-housing.




Looking forward to your impressions. They're excellent IEMs, yet going by your e-Q5 review and posted preferences, I personally wouldn't have recommended them in your case.


----------



## ljokerl

altrunox said:


> ey mr. ljokerl, it has been a while since I have read some stuff here, so sorry if others dudes already asked for it...
> Any plans for the Vsonic VSD5?


 
  
 Yes, definitely. In the fall.


----------



## Selenium

Looking forward to your VSD5 review. Rad earphone.


----------



## jincuteguy

Anyone interested in getting a pair of ASG-2.5? send me a PM.


----------



## hqssui

@ljokerl, After reading your Ultimate Ears SF5EB review, I have bought a used one off ebay and is enjoying them tremendously, especially the clarity and the punchy bass, thanks you. I prefer it over all the other bassy IEMs I have (Hippo VB, Wooduo, XB90EX etc).  Can you please recommend any other newer IEMs (sub $200) with very similar SQ which can replace this? Is NHT superbuds a good choice?


----------



## ljokerl

hqssui said:


> @ljokerl, After reading your Ultimate Ears SF5EB review, I have bought a used one off ebay and is enjoying them tremendously, especially the clarity and the punchy bass, thanks you. I prefer it over all the other bassy IEMs I have (Hippo VB, Wooduo, XB90EX etc).  Can you please recommend any other newer IEMs (sub $200) with very similar SQ which can replace this? Is NHT superbuds a good choice?


 
  
 I'm afraid I haven't heard anything quite like the SF5EB. The NHT SuperBuds are much more "conventionally" bassy, meaning they have a warm, thick, somewhat muddy sound outside of the bass range a-la Beats Tour 2.0 IEMs. I suppose it would take a hybrid, but the hybrids I've tried aren't tuned for as much bass. The closest would be the Sony XBA-Z5, but that's well over $200.


----------



## hqssui

ljokerl said:


> I'm afraid I haven't heard anything quite like the SF5EB. The NHT SuperBuds are much more "conventionally" bassy, meaning they have a warm, thick, somewhat muddy sound outside of the bass range a-la Beats Tour 2.0 IEMs. I suppose it would take a hybrid, but the hybrids I've tried aren't tuned for as much bass. The closest would be the Sony XBA-Z5, but that's well over $200.


 
  
 Thanks ljokerl ...


----------



## NimbleRabit

Hi joker, 

I'm looking for something pretty specific, and hoping you might have a recommendation. I've been browsing the thread for hours now but I'm still not sure what iem to get! 

I'm trying to find some headphones with that fit these criteria:
Warm sound signature, smooth treble (bassy but not V shaped). 
Small housing. 
Over ear design (meant to be worn with cable around ears). 
Cable that doesn't tangle too badly. 
Good isolation. 

Basically the form factor of the Audio Technica CK10, or as close to that as possible, but with a warmer, more "fun" sound signature.


----------



## ljokerl

nimblerabit said:


> Hi joker,
> 
> I'm looking for something pretty specific, and hoping you might have a recommendation. I've been browsing the thread for hours now but I'm still not sure what iem to get!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Not sure which price range you're aiming for, but based on the CK10 comparison I am guessing mid- or top-tier. For example the Fidue A31s (the latest set added to this thread) has pretty much the exact CK10 form factor with a warm and very smooth sound signature and fits the rest of your requirements very well. However, it's a fairly inexpensive mid-tier IEM and has appropriate performance.

 If you're looking at higher performance tiers, a bit of compromise will be needed. For example, the Yamaha EPH-100 sounds much better and is very compact, but the fit is fairly different from the CK10 (wide nozzle, which holds the driver and allows the housing to be compact) and the cable is just a normal cable. The Klipsch X10/X11, while not shaped specifically for over-the-ear fit, can also be viable option. Smooth, bassy, very comfortable, good isolation, and so forth.
  
 Can't think of anything with the appropriate sound signature but on a higher performance level and with the CK10 form factor. For example a Sony XBA-H3 has the right sound, but the form factor couldn't be more wrong...


----------



## DecentLevi

Hello all, I have a brief theory about what may be a universal problem with IEMs / earphones:
  
 In all the IEMs I can ever remember taking with me on the go, it seems that with all of them, there is a phenomenon where *the bass disappears while out in the open*. I mean like on the street or in a train / bus, etc., it's as if all lower frequencies that were there when I tested the setup in a quiet room, become... evaporated. And I'm talking about the same exact rig with the same tips, ear-seal, music, etc.
  
 I'm thinking maybe it has something to do with the way larger headphones project the low frequencies as a result of vibration between the can and the head / outer ears, versus the way IEMs project a bass from within the ear canal. But that doesn't explain why the bass an most IEMs I've tried generally seems 'afraid of the outdoors' so to speak.
  
 Another thing I've noticed which seems to be universal is about silicone ear-tips: *It seems that all silicone tips leak a lot of wind-noise* in, especially while riding a bicycle I always hear a steady  stream of wind gusts. So what about the SpinFit type of eartips: do these generally seem to block out the wind better than the average silicone tip?
  
 Also feel free to check out my recent review of the Dunu 200J's that I now own (it's both love and hate)


----------



## NimbleRabit

ljokerl said:


> Not sure which price range you're aiming for, but based on the CK10 comparison I am guessing mid- or top-tier. For example the Fidue A31s (the latest set added to this thread) has pretty much the exact CK10 form factor with a warm and very smooth sound signature and fits the rest of your requirements very well. However, it's a fairly inexpensive mid-tier IEM and has appropriate performance.
> 
> 
> If you're looking at higher performance tiers, a bit of compromise will be needed. For example, the Yamaha EPH-100 sounds much better and is very compact, but the fit is fairly different from the CK10 (wide nozzle, which holds the driver and allows the housing to be compact) and the cable is just a normal cable. The Klipsch X10/X11, while not shaped specifically for over-the-ear fit, can also be viable option. Smooth, bassy, very comfortable, good isolation, and so forth.
> ...




Funny you mention the XBA-H3, I was strongly considering that one despite it not fitting my preferences in form factor. Perhaps I'll get more than one, a small compact travel IEM and another nicer one. 

Anyways,thanks for the recommendations! I'm going to give it some more thought, maybe pick up a few options to try out. The Yamaha may be perfect if I find it comfortable.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Zipbuds PRO, a surprisingly great-sounding budget IEM with a gimmicky zipper...
  
 The most up to date IEM ranking can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A94) Zipbuds PRO*
> 
> 
> Added August 2015
> ...


----------



## B9Scrambler

The ZIPBUDS come off as a bit of a surprise. Nice one Joker! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 PS. If you ever have the opportunity, be sure to check out the JVC HA-FXH30. I think they're Japan-only atm, but my gawd are they nice!


----------



## Harijs

Ok, another cheap IEM review...
 Who else is waiting for some newest flagship reviews?


----------



## getclikinagas

harijs said:


> Ok, another cheap IEM review...
> Who else is waiting for some newest flagship reviews?


 
*Fidue A83*
 UBSOUND Fighter
*DUNU DN-2000*
 Sennheiser Momentum
*Gorilla Ears GX-4b*
 NHT Superbuds
 Brainwavz S0
*FLC Tech FLC 8*
 Fidue A31s
 Zipbuds PRO
  
 4 out of the last 10 reviews are Flagship or near flagship level. Healthy mix I'd say.
 Too many flagships are bad for your health.....probably not


----------



## race2c

Hi ljokerl - In the past few weeks, I have been debating getting a new set of IEMs.
  
 What do you recommend for the following details:
  

Budget: $120 USD (less is always nice though)
Location: USA
Isolation/Comfort are key due to airplane travel (35 flights anticipated this year) and work (split office with another person)
Mainly use Spotify (extreme for downloaded content and extreme/high on streaming) and some other HQ content saved on devices
Source(s): Samsung S5 (main); Nexus 7 (secondary); Sometimes use FiiO E18 Kunlun for Amp/DAC
Common Music: Hard Rock (Shinedown, Seether, etc); Texas/Red Dirt Country; Some Techno/House; Classic Rock; Some rap/hip-hop; a bit of everything.
Music Style: I like bass, nothing over the top/muddy, but I do like feeling it (similar to M6/M6P). Other than that, I am pretty flexible on sound signature.
  
 Current line-up of headphones: ATH-iM50 (main IEM); Soundmagic PL50s (extra); Meelectronics M6/M6P (gym/extra); Meelectronics M9P (extra set at work)


----------



## noobnorwegian

Hi *ljokerl*, could you try to describe the difference between the *ZipbudsPro* and *Soundmagic E10*?
 Have not seen any comparisons between these two IEMs.


----------



## ljokerl

b9scrambler said:


> The ZIPBUDS come off as a bit of a surprise. Nice one Joker!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yeah, I was equally surprised. I was expecting to have to give them a pass as I have with most other "mainstream" IEMs in this price range. 
  
 Nice JVCs - looks like the latest evolution of the micro-HD line, which I've always liked quite a lot. I'm also very much enjoying the new JVC XX Elation in-ears, especially compared to the previous-gen XX models. Huge IEMs, but the sound is rather tame for an XX model, which is fine by me. 
  
  


getclikinagas said:


> *Fidue A83*
> UBSOUND Fighter
> *DUNU DN-2000*
> Sennheiser Momentum
> ...


 
  
  




  
 Also, the next one up is a $700 BA monitor.
  
  


race2c said:


> Hi ljokerl - In the past few weeks, I have been debating getting a new set of IEMs.
> 
> What do you recommend for the following details:
> 
> ...


 
  
 With that budget the obvious choice is the Shure SE215 for killer isolation and nice bass without being excessive. Second best would be a HiSound Crystal, which is arguably more comfortable but not as versatile as the Shures and a little less of a match for M6 bass levels. 
  
 Two higher-end options I would recommend if you can find a unit in your price range: Yamaha EPH-100 and Klipsch Image X10 or X11. The former is a great-sounding IEM with good isolation and would be a great addition to your collection IMO. The latter is a decent-sounding (better than SE215, not as good as EPH-100) but insanely small and comfortable earphone. The most comfortable of the bunch, but typically the most expensive as well, and you're better off buying this one new for the warranty. 
  


noobnorwegian said:


> Hi *ljokerl*, could you try to describe the difference between the *ZipbudsPro* and *Soundmagic E10*?
> Have not seen any comparisons between these two IEMs.


 
  
 The Zipbuds have a significantly more exaggerated "V-shaped" sound signature. The bass is more impactful compared to the more balanced E10 and the highs are more energetic. The E10 has an advantage in presentation and sounds more neutral, smooth, and relaxed while the Zipbuds are more punchy, crisp, clear, and exciting.


----------



## race2c

ljokerl said:


> With that budget the obvious choice is the Shure SE215 for killer isolation and nice bass without being excessive. Second best would be a HiSound Crystal, which is arguably more comfortable but not as versatile as the Shures and a little less of a match for M6 bass levels.
> 
> Two higher-end options I would recommend if you can find a unit in your price range: Yamaha EPH-100 and Klipsch Image X10 or X11. The former is a great-sounding IEM with good isolation and would be a great addition to your collection IMO. The latter is a decent-sounding (better than SE215, not as good as EPH-100) but insanely small and comfortable earphone. The most comfortable of the bunch, but typically the most expensive as well, and you're better off buying this one new for the warranty.


 
 Thanks for the response ljokerl.
  
 I am thinking about the EPH-100 per your suggestion. Based upon your review on headphonelist, did you experience (or anticipate) any problems with nozzle size due to smaller ear canals?


----------



## ljokerl

race2c said:


> Thanks for the response ljokerl.
> 
> I am thinking about the EPH-100 per your suggestion. Based upon your review on headphonelist, did you experience (or anticipate) any problems with nozzle size due to smaller ear canals?


 
  
 They do have larger-than-average nozzles but it seems they fit most people - it's quite rare for someone to come back and say they didn't fit. It'll come down to individual anatomy of course, but if you're generally using medium or larger tips with your other IEMs chances are you'll be okay.


----------



## B9Scrambler

ljokerl said:


> Nice JVCs - looks like the latest evolution of the micro-HD line, which I've always liked quite a lot. I'm also very much enjoying the new JVC XX Elation in-ears, especially compared to the previous then XX models. Huge IEMs, but the sound is rather tame for an XX model, which is fine by me.




I have the FRD60 and FXT90 and the FXH30 is a welcome improvement over both of those. Can't speak for the FRD80

The Elations sound like a great buy. I picked up the FR202 recently. Build quality is pretty blah compared to the older 201, but JVC did a great job of cleaning up their over abundant treble.

Actually, that seems to be something JVC has done a good job of with all the current gen products of theirs I've tried.


----------



## slowpickr

b9scrambler said:


> I have the FRD60 and FXT90 and the FXH30 is a welcome improvement over both of those. Can't speak for the FRD80
> 
> The Elations sound like a great buy. I picked up the FR202 recently. Build quality is pretty blah compared to the older 201, but JVC did a great job of cleaning up their over abundant treble.
> 
> Actually, that seems to be something JVC has done a good job of with all the current gen products of theirs I've tried.


 
  
 Ok Scrambler.  I'm making a note in my record book... "B9Scrambler likes JVC."


----------



## Sesameopen

Guys I'm in the market for a new IEM, but for me there aren't really any good balanced armature earphones. I came from a DBA-02 and I can't seem to find any similar ones, because the dealbreaker for me is that I have to wear them straight down, and half of all earphones in the world must be worn over-ear. I don't know why I don't really like dynamic.
  
 Any ideas? I was looking at the Fischer Audio TBA-04 and the Sony XBA 40's. The TBA-04's don't seem to be available in a lot of places.
  

 GG.


----------



## ozkan

sesameopen said:


> Guys I'm in the market for a new IEM, but for me there aren't really any good balanced armature earphones. I came from a DBA-02 and I can't seem to find any similar ones, because the dealbreaker for me is that I have to wear them straight down, and half of all earphones in the world must be worn over-ear. I don't know why I don't really like dynamic.
> 
> Any ideas? I was looking at the Fischer Audio TBA-04 and the Sony XBA 40's. The TBA-04's don't seem to be available in a lot of places.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Etymotic ER4-PT


----------



## Sesameopen

ozkan said:


> Etymotic ER4-PT


 

 Oh yeah why didn't I think of that. I've heard that it can get really "sharp sounding" and screechy (sorry for my lack of audiophile terms), and I mainly listen to classical. Do you think this might be a problem?


----------



## ozkan

sesameopen said:


> Oh yeah why didn't I think of that. I've heard that it can get really "sharp sounding" and screechy (sorry for my lack of audiophile terms), and I mainly listen to classical. Do you think this might be a problem?


 
  
 Absolutely no. They aren't stretchy if you get a good fit and match with a warm source. Classical is one of the main purposes of ER4-PT  And I don't think they will be more sharp in treble than your DBA-02. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 
  
 I strongly recommend using Shure Olive tips with them.


----------



## B9Scrambler

slowpickr said:


> Ok Scrambler.  I'm making a note in my record book... "B9Scrambler likes JVC."




I sure do. Not hiding that fact. Keep in mind thought that it makes me extra critical of them. Minor issues are major disappointments since I know they are capable of making great products.


----------



## Sesameopen

ozkan said:


> Absolutely no. They aren't stretchy if you get a good fit and match with a warm source. Classical is one of the main purposes of ER4-PT  And I don't think they will be more sharp in treble than your DBA-02.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 One thing, whats the difference between the ER4-S and PT? It seems to only be the tuning, but for me the ER4 S are around $20 cheaper.


----------



## suman134

sesameopen said:


> One thing, whats the difference between the ER4-S and PT? It seems to only be the tuning, but for me the ER4 S are around $20 cheaper.


 

  PT comes with a ER-4S converter, its not tuning not any thing, its just the impedance that is different. With PT you get a 4S for just $20 more.


----------



## ljokerl

b9scrambler said:


> I have the FRD60 and FXT90 and the FXH30 is a welcome improvement over both of those. Can't speak for the FRD80
> 
> The Elations sound like a great buy. I picked up the FR202 recently. Build quality is pretty blah compared to the older 201, but JVC did a great job of cleaning up their over abundant treble.
> 
> Actually, that seems to be something JVC has done a good job of with all the current gen products of theirs I've tried.


 
  
 Right, that definitely agrees with my experience with the XX Elation compared to the old FR301, FX1X, FX101.
  


sesameopen said:


> Guys I'm in the market for a new IEM, but for me there aren't really any good balanced armature earphones. I came from a DBA-02 and I can't seem to find any similar ones, because the dealbreaker for me is that I have to wear them straight down, and half of all earphones in the world must be worn over-ear. I don't know why I don't really like dynamic.
> 
> Any ideas? I was looking at the Fischer Audio TBA-04 and the Sony XBA 40's. The TBA-04's don't seem to be available in a lot of places.
> 
> ...


 
  
 It's too bad all of the TWFKs from that generation seem to be gone - all of the DBA-02 clones, the VSonic VC1000, UE700, Phiaton PS200, etc etc. With that in mind the Etymotic ER4 would've been my recommendation as well. There's also the new q-jays, which still use a TWFK as far as I know and look really great. Unfortunately I haven't tried them and they are very pricey.
  


sesameopen said:


> Oh yeah why didn't I think of that. I've heard that it can get really "sharp sounding" and screechy (sorry for my lack of audiophile terms), and I mainly listen to classical. Do you think this might be a problem?


 
  
 As ozkan said this is not something to worry about coming from the DBA-02 as long as you're getting a good seal.


----------



## Sesameopen

ljokerl said:


> It's too bad all of the TWFKs from that generation seem to be gone - all of the DBA-02 clones, the VSonic VC1000, UE700, Phiaton PS200, etc etc. With that in mind the Etymotic ER4 would've been my recommendation as well. There's also the new q-jays, which still use a TWFK as far as I know and look really great. Unfortunately I haven't tried them and they are very pricey.


 
  
 I searched up the Q-Jays and found a decent used deal on ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/q-jays-In-Ear-only-Headphones-Black-/391230730725?hash=item5b172b31e5
  
 What do you think? Should I jump on these?


----------



## ozkan

sesameopen said:


> I searched up the Q-Jays and found a decent used deal on ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/q-jays-In-Ear-only-Headphones-Black-/391230730725?hash=item5b172b31e5
> 
> What do you think? Should I jump on these?


 
  
 His reputaion seems very good. No negative feedbacks yet. So you can buy imo.


----------



## race2c

Hi ljokerl - As you previously mentioned, the EPH-100 has a larger nozzle which may be a consideration for those with smaller ear canals. I potentially have smaller ear canals as my ATH-IM50s become uncomfortable after a period of time. In that case, would you say go with the X10/X11?


----------



## ljokerl

sesameopen said:


> I searched up the Q-Jays and found a decent used deal on ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/q-jays-In-Ear-only-Headphones-Black-/391230730725?hash=item5b172b31e5
> 
> What do you think? Should I jump on these?


 
  
 In the absence of new TWFK IEMs on the market it's a good deal. I would only do it if you're very careful with your IEMs, though, since you'll have no warranty.
  


race2c said:


> Hi ljokerl - As you previously mentioned, the EPH-100 has a larger nozzle which may be a consideration for those with smaller ear canals. I potentially have smaller ear canals as my ATH-IM50s become uncomfortable after a period of time. In that case, would you say go with the X10/X11?


 
  
 Yes, the X10/X11 (and Klipsch's "oval gel" tips) are perfect for small ear canals.


----------



## jddesigned

Joker hopefully you can help point me in the right direction please.
  
 I need an IEM for when I'm at the golf course practicing
  
 Under $100, but would prefer cheaper the better
  
 Must have:
 Fabric Cable - I wear down my back under shirt and regular cables stick when I'm sweaty (I had fabric cables on a prior set and they worked magic)
  
 Wish list:
 Slightly longer cable if it's possible
 Better than average isolation
 Slightly smaller, perhaps deep fit - my right ear is a bitch to get thing to stay in, even Comply tips are awkward with shallow insert models
 Something you consider on the durable side
 Straight connector
  
 Sound:
 Fun
 Bassier - more towards a V (but I do crave a warm quality sound)
 Nothing that too bright/sibilant 
 On the bigger side sound stage
 Nothing that will overly expose any really poor recordings
 Can wear for hours on end
  
 This will be played straight off my Sansa Fuze  (small, light and fits in pants pocket). 
  
 I recently tried JVC XX 202's and man those were fun but maybe a little over the top in bass, treble was actually pleasant. The housings on these were huge and really hurt after a while.


----------



## ljokerl

jddesigned said:


> Joker hopefully you can help point me in the right direction please.
> 
> I need an IEM for when I'm at the golf course practicing
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, I don't have many fabric-corded earphones, and most of the ones I do have don't sound very good. Case in point, the only earphone in my current queue with fabric cords is the House of Marley Smile Jamaica, which won't be getting a full review. So the pickings are going to be very slim by the time you get around to even considering sound quality. The few I can think of that at the very least have enhanced bass and decent construction:
  
 RHA MA350 - Good overall value and sound quality for the price; odd shape of the housings may not work for you; least smooth-sounding of the three
 Paradigm Shift E3m - earpieces are light and not too big, but have some sharp edges; mediocre sound
 NHT SuperBuds - very bass-heavy (but also very smooth) sound and very large housings; angled plug


----------



## james444

sesameopen said:


> Guys I'm in the market for a new IEM, but for me there aren't really any good balanced armature earphones. I came from a DBA-02 and I can't seem to find any similar ones, because the dealbreaker for me is that I have to wear them straight down, and half of all earphones in the world must be worn over-ear. I don't know why I don't really like dynamic.


 


ljokerl said:


> It's too bad all of the TWFKs from that generation seem to be gone - all of the DBA-02 clones, the VSonic VC1000, *UE700*, Phiaton PS200, etc etc.


 
  
@Sesameopen: I still have UE700s in a drawer somewhere that don't get any use. PM me if you want them, I'll send them to you for free (I may not have the tips any more though).


----------



## suman134

james444 said:


> @Sesameopen: I still have UE700s in a drawer somewhere that don't get any use. PM me if you want them, I'll send them to you for free (I may not have the tips any more though).


 

  Me me!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I too want it if for free!!! I will pay shipping.


----------



## james444

suman134 said:


> Me me!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Ermm, according to your headphone inventory, you already have a pair! Along with about 100 other IEMs... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  


Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!


----------



## xtwargodtx

Yeah i'd be great if i could get the ue 700's. I'll pay for shipping too


----------



## Uberclocked

xtwargodtx said:


> Yeah i'd be great if i could get the ue 700's. I'll pay for shipping too


 
 Hold on, is James giving away free iems?  Gimme a sec.
  
 Guys I'm in the market for a new IEM, but for me there aren't really any good balanced armature earphones. I came from a Jlab J6 and I can't seem to find any similar ones, because the dealbreaker for me is that I they're not shiny enough, and half of all earphones in the world aren't matte. I don't know why I don't really like dynamic.
  
 It's too bad all of the Final Audios from that generation seem to be gone - all of the *FI-BA-SS*es (we don't have to bother with the other junk).


----------



## bretemm

I'm limited to using IEMs because of something medical, 
Are there any 4 pin IEM? what's a great pair of IEM in the $100, $200, $300, $500 range? 
Are the klipsch X11 good? 

I use Schiit Audio


----------



## Uberclocked

bretemm said:


> I'm limited to using IEMs because of something medical,
> Are there any 4 pin IEM? what's a great pair of IEM in the $100, $200, $300, $500 range?
> Are the klipsch X11 good?
> 
> I use Schiit Audio


 
 Can you use CIEMs or are you limited to universal?


----------



## suman134

james444 said:


> Ermm, according to your headphone inventory, you already have a pair! Along with about 100 other IEMs...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  I was blown by my emotions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, i had an UE700, it broke. I think @Sesameopen should have it. I pull out!!


----------



## james444

xtwargodtx said:


> Yeah i'd be great if i could get the ue 700's. I'll pay for shipping too


 
  
 Sorry, just one old pair of UE700s and it's already gone.


----------



## bretemm

Sure I could get ciems, but, would a universal be just as good? 
Thanks 





uberclocked said:


> Can you use CIEMs or are you limited to universal?


----------



## ljokerl

bretemm said:


> I'm limited to using IEMs because of something medical,
> Are there any 4 pin IEM? what's a great pair of IEM in the $100, $200, $300, $500 range?
> Are the klipsch X11 good?
> 
> I use Schiit Audio


 
  
 4 pin meaning balanced, but with a 3.5mm connector? The only ones I have like that are some HiFiMan sets.
  
 Connectors aside, there's a ton of good IEMs in every price range. Ultimately it depends on what you're looking for in terms of sound tuning, design, and features. Sometimes a particular set of requirements will have many IEMs that could be a good fit. Other times I'll struggle to think of even one (like this question from yesterday).
  
 I have some of my favorites in terms of value for money listed here: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/


----------



## bretemm

Thank you, 
Well I mainly listen to rock and indie rock and like "space or area" to my music as well as detail 





ljokerl said:


> 4 pin meaning balanced, but with a 3.5mm connector? The only ones I have like that are some HiFiMan sets.
> 
> Connectors aside, there's a ton of good IEMs in every price range. Ultimately it depends on what you're looking for in terms of sound tuning, design, and features. Sometimes a particular set of requirements will have many IEMs that could be a good fit. Other times I'll struggle to think of even one (like this question from yesterday).
> 
> I have some of my favorites in terms of value for money listed here: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/


----------



## Uberclocked

bretemm said:


> Sure I could get ciems, but, would a universal be just as good?
> Thanks


 
 If you need isolation, you'll have to stick to universals, but the deals on customs are pretty nice. You'll have to get them reshelled, which will take some time and money, but you should take a look at the head-fi classifieds.
 E.G. 1964 Ears V6 @ $300: http://www.head-fi.org/t/778853/1964-ears-v6-priced-for-a-quick-sale


----------



## BubbaDubBub

Joker, how do you feel the DUNU Titan 1 stands compared to the DN 2000 in terms of overall sound quality and soundstage? I ask this because to my knowledge they both deliver a very similar sound signature, and some believe the Titan 1 to surpass the DN 2000 in certain aspects.


----------



## BubbaDubBub

I would also like to know what your thoughts are on the RE 600 in terms of SQ and value, since the introduction of newer iem's in its price range.


----------



## ljokerl

bubbadubbub said:


> Joker, how do you feel the DUNU Titan 1 stands compared to the DN 2000 in terms of overall sound quality and soundstage? I ask this because to my knowledge they both deliver a very similar sound signature, and some believe the Titan 1 to surpass the DN 2000 in certain aspects.


 
  
 I don't feel these IEMs have the same sound signature based on my listening so far and I can't say one is better than the other in all cases. The DN-2000 has a v/u-shaped sound signature with bass emphasis that increases towards the sub-bass region (it definitely has more sub bass than the Titan 1, and I feel like it usually has more bass overall) and more recessed mids. The Titan 1 is maybe a tiny bit v-shaped but I struggle to think of it as mid-recessed because there's so much presence in the upper midrange. It's pretty bright because there's a lot of energy in the upper mid and treble region, but not particularly harsh. Kind of reminds me of the Ostry KC06 in that way. 
  
 If you're looking for a more v-shaped sound, the DN-2000 is definitely better. If you're looking for more balance, and maybe are worried about the pricier model's bass being too heavy or mids being too recessed (and also don't care about noise isolation), the Titan 1 may well be better than the pricier model. As for soundstage, I think they're both well above average. The DN-2000 benefits from its u-shaped tuning while the Titan 1 seems to just naturally have an airy and pretty open soundstage. I haven't reviewed the Titan 1 in full yet but if you put a gun to my head right now and made me pick one purely for soundstaging I'd probably pick the Titan. 
  


bubbadubbub said:


> I would also like to know what your thoughts are on the RE 600 in terms of SQ and value, since the introduction of newer iem's in its price range.


 
  
 I've never really recommended the RE-600 over the less expensive RE-400 in the first place so just on that basis I don't think it's value is that high. There are IEMs near $200 that I prefer to the RE-600, such as the TDK BA200.


----------



## BubbaDubBub

Thanks! Do you find the Titan to deliver on sound quality rivaling the DN 2000 as well? An estimation on your x/10 scale would help. (Even if its subjective)


----------



## ljokerl

bubbadubbub said:


> Thanks! Do you find the Titan to deliver on sound quality rivaling the DN 2000 as well? An estimation on your x/10 scale would help. (Even if its subjective)


 
  
 The Titan 1 is competitive with the DN-2000 keeping in mind the tuning differences.
  
 I know I wouldn't rank the Titan below the Philips Fidelio S1, which puts it at an 8.9/10 or higher. There's a lot of other stuff on this (high) performance tier that I'm playing around with right now - the Audio-Technica IM02, Aurisonics Rockets, potentially the RHA T20 and LIFE in-ear, and some others. Need more time and A:Bs to get all of them straight in my head.


----------



## 1TrickPony

ljokerl said:


> The Titan 1 is competitive with the DN-2000 keeping in mind the tuning differences.
> 
> I know I wouldn't rank the Titan below the Philips Fidelio S1, which puts it at an 8.9/10 or higher. There's a lot of other stuff on this (high) performance tier that I'm playing around with right now - the Audio-Technica IM02, Aurisonics Rockets, potentially the RHA T20 and LIFE in-ear, and some others. Need more time and A:Bs to get all of them straight in my head.




Exciting times! I too thought that the Titans could give the dn2000 a run for its money! I must admit though that the smooth mids and superb separation/layering of the dn2000 is hard to top.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Joker, if you have a chance to get hold of some new Micro driver JVC FXH30s I'd be very interested to read your views on them.


----------



## bretemm

Has anyone used the "Schiit Valhalla2"? What IEM would be good to use with it?


----------



## ljokerl

lifted andreas said:


> Joker, if you have a chance to get hold of some new Micro driver JVC FXH30s I'd be very interested to read your views on them.


 
  
 Yeah, these were just recommended a page or two back. As a big fan of JVC microdriver IEMs, I'll keep an eye out for them.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, these were just recommended a page or two back. As a big fan of JVC microdriver IEMs, I'll keep an eye out for them.




I thought you were mate. 

Hopefully I should be ordering some on the 1st, if I do and whenever I get them I'll post some views here.


----------



## kendric

Joker have you ever tried the Legend Omega? I have a hunch that you're going to love them a lot! At least i know my Omegas are getting much, much more playtime than my JH13!


----------



## ljokerl

kendric said:


> Joker have you ever tried the Legend Omega? I have a hunch that you're going to love them a lot! At least i know my Omegas are getting much, much more playtime than my JH13!


 
  
 Is that an Earwerkz model? I never found time to try the Legend R, which I regret. If this is a new one I will make time for it.


----------



## kendric

ljokerl said:


> Is that an Earwerkz model? I never found time to try the Legend R, which I regret. If this is a new one I will make time for it.




Yes it is a variant of Legend R that utilizes a unique Onyx Chamber that serves as a sort of dampener for the LOWs for natural, taut bass. 

And i have to say it works really well, the texturing is mind-blowing and goes really low, yet has actually lesser mid bass hump compared to the JH13s and JH16s

Overall it's one of if not the best Bass reproduction (along with the nicely forward midrange) that i have heard from a BA-setup. =)


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Order placed for the new micro driver JVC FXH30. 

Really looking forward to hearing these, hope you manage to get hold of some soon too joker. 

This is where I bought mine:

http://www.valuebasket.com/en_GB/JVC-HA-FXH30-Titanium-Micro-HD-Headset-(Black)/mainproduct/view/17723-AA-BK


----------



## jant71

Since they are not JVC USA the only way he will get one to review is when you loan them to him 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Hoping JVC does decide to do an offshoot American version, ala the FXC80, again with one of the FXH's. The FXD's never came here in any form either original or reworked for the American market. I liked the bigger housing idea they did there but the Tri-shape was not quite the right way to fit very well. A better shape and the new better behaved treble and JVC USA could have a really good earphone. FXC80 has been it till now and the blah-tastic FX300. Be nice if they gave USA something but they are stingy bastards infavor of the home crowd. Sony hybrids wouldn't be here if it was JVC, AT wouldn't have the CKR9 and 10 selling here if they were JVC. Lucky we got the HAS-400 and the FX40. Hopefully they decide to rise up above the Elation and the $60 earphone level and thinking(wrongly) we are the Xtreme Xplosives crowd as ~75% of there models are XX's here.
  
 Give us something good and it will sell here!!


----------



## bretemm

Should these be good specta for a High impedance, low sensitivity, even phase response IEM?

KLIPSCH X7i 
KG 623X7 full-range, balanced-armature drivers 
10Hz - 19Hz frequency response (+_-dB) 
110dB sensitivity 
50 ohms impedance

I'm stuck with IEMs and I got a tube amp from Schiit Audio


----------



## ljokerl

kendric said:


> Yes it is a variant of Legend R that utilizes a unique Onyx Chamber that serves as a sort of dampener for the LOWs for natural, taut bass.
> 
> And i have to say it works really well, the texturing is mind-blowing and goes really low, yet has actually lesser mid bass hump compared to the JH13s and JH16s
> 
> Overall it's one of if not the best Bass reproduction (along with the nicely forward midrange) that i have heard from a BA-setup. =)


 
  
 Sounds good to me - I have heard how detailed BA bass can sound when it's properly extended without the mid-bass hump of the JH13s (Hidition NT 6, for example) and it's glorious. 
  


jant71 said:


> Since they are not JVC USA the only way he will get one to review is when you loan them to him
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Totally agree. Also, Audio-Technica still doesn't give us _that_ much of the good stuff ever since they pulled the CK10, CK90Pro, and CK100 off the US market way back when.
  


bretemm said:


> Should these be good specta for a High impedance, low sensitivity, even phase response IEM?
> 
> KLIPSCH X7i
> KG 623X7 full-range, balanced-armature drivers
> ...


 
  
 Armatures rarely have even phase response. Typically you want a high-impedance dynamic driver for something like this. Say, a Havi B3 PRO I or maybe a Philips Fidelio S1. Or an Etymotic EK5 if you want to be extreme.


----------



## bretemm

Ok, so with eather klipsch or RHA, would they have one that meets that? Or possibly Shure? 





ljokerl said:


> Sounds good to me - I have heard how detailed BA bass can sound when it's properly extended without the mid-bass hump of the JH13s (Hidition NT 6, for example) and it's glorious.
> 
> 
> Totally agree. Also, Audio-Technica still doesn't give us _that_ much of the good stuff ever since they pulled the CK10, CK90Pro, and CK100 off the US market way back when.
> ...


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Any chance of a quick JVC Spiral Dot tips review? 

I'm gonna but some coz everyone seems to be raving about them.


----------



## ozkan

lifted andreas said:


> Any chance of a quick JVC Spiral Dot tips review?
> 
> I'm gonna but some coz everyone seems to be raving about them.


 
  
 They enhance the bass response, tone down the treble a bit  and constrict the soundstage as far as I could detect. However they are very soft and comfortable.


----------



## bretemm

My Schiit Valhalla2 shipped today, now I need to figure out what the best IEM will be for tubes 





ljokerl said:


> Sounds good to me - I have heard how detailed BA bass can sound when it's properly extended without the mid-bass hump of the JH13s (Hidition NT 6, for example) and it's glorious.
> 
> 
> Totally agree. Also, Audio-Technica still doesn't give us _that_ much of the good stuff ever since they pulled the CK10, CK90Pro, and CK100 off the US market way back when.
> ...


----------



## PoRidge

|joker|, planning on doing a review on the vsd5? or a quick comparison with the re400(has been my reference for budget iem). heard from somewhere that it's refefenced after the exk, curious if it lives up to that.


----------



## ljokerl

bretemm said:


> Ok, so with eather klipsch or RHA, would they have one that meets that? Or possibly Shure?


 
  
 Shure only has one dynamic driver model and it's pretty sensitive. So are RHA and Klipsch earphones, at least those I've tried. However, that doesn't mean they'll be a poor match for your setup, just that they don't meet the requirements you previously posted. I personally think the MA750 from RHA is very source-independent, and a very nice IEM overall. 
  


poridge said:


> |joker|, planning on doing a review on the vsd5? or a quick comparison with the re400(has been my reference for budget iem). heard from somewhere that it's refefenced after the exk, curious if it lives up to that.


 
  
 Yes, the VSD5 is in the queue. So far it just reminds me of the other VSonic IEMs... they definitely have a "house" sound to them.


----------



## bretemm

Thank you, I'm still not sure what to get without going with customs 





ljokerl said:


> Shure only has one dynamic driver model and it's pretty sensitive. So are RHA and Klipsch earphones, at least those I've tried. However, that doesn't mean they'll be a poor match for your setup, just that they don't meet the requirements you previously posted. I personally think the MA750 from RHA is very source-independent, and a very nice IEM overall.
> 
> 
> Yes, the VSD5 is in the queue. So far it just reminds me of the other VSonic IEMs... they definitely have a "house" sound to them.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the EarSonics Velvet.
  
 As always, the most up to date IEM ranking can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1A16) EarSonics Velvet*
> 
> 
> Added September 2015
> ...


----------



## garcsa

Hi there, anybody recognise these silicone tips, on the left (on the right Comply T400 large)? Do not remember from where they are. Thanks.


----------



## Zelda

garcsa said:


> Hi there, anybody recognise these silicone tips, on the left (on the right Comply T400 large)? Do not remember from where they are. Thanks.


 
 look like the old Hifiman tips that were included with the old models 0, zero, 272 ,etc
 here
 http://www.inearmatters.net/2010/09/review-hifiman-re-zero-time-to.html


----------



## B9Scrambler

garcsa said:


> Hi there, anybody recognise these silicone tips, on the left (on the right Comply T400 large)? Do not remember from where they are. Thanks.


 

 Those looks similar to the tips that came with the Dunu Titan 1. Wide bore, small opening for the nozzle....hmmm.


----------



## GN-0015

It does look like old Hifiman tips. I still have my tips that came with the RE-0, looks exactly the same.


----------



## bretemm

I might be going with the klipsch x7i or x11i for my Schiit Valhalla2, 
Bolth I think are 50ohms, 
I'm going to be first using my valhalla as a pass through untill I get better IEMs to handle it. 
Or, could the rha t11i be good?


----------



## suman134

Totally looks like Titan-1 tips.


----------



## garcsa

suman134 said:


> Totally looks like Titan-1 tips.


 
  


gn-0015 said:


> It does look like old Hifiman tips. I still have my tips that came with the RE-0, looks exactly the same.


 
  


b9scrambler said:


> Those looks similar to the tips that came with the Dunu Titan 1. Wide bore, small opening for the nozzle....hmmm.


 
  


zelda said:


> look like the old Hifiman tips that were included with the old models 0, zero, 272 ,etc
> here
> http://www.inearmatters.net/2010/09/review-hifiman-re-zero-time-to.html


 
  Thanks guys, yep these are from Dunu Trident, "stolen" by my son.


----------



## JamesBr

ljokerl said:


> Added the EarSonics Velvet.
> 
> As always, the most up to date IEM ranking can be found here.


 
 Didn't know about http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/ 
 Excellent link! thanks


----------



## DimitriTrush

ljokerl said:


> Added the EarSonics Velvet.
> 
> As always, the most up to date IEM ranking can be found here.


 
 Congratulations, Ijokerl, It is a nice review as always very interesting to read.
 question. Was this review based on Crystal Clear Edition of Black?


----------



## Uberclocked

dimitritrush said:


> Congratulations, Ijokerl, It is a nice review as always very interesting to read.
> question. Was this review based on Crystal Clear Edition of Black?


 
 If you can't see the picture of the Velvets in his review for some reason, they're black.


----------



## DimitriTrush

It is very strange the review was made using black version.
 the black version is long discontinued due to shell issues back in November of 2014.
 And even though manufacture claiming there are no sonical differences between the two versions,
 most of people are noticing the Crystal clear edition slightly different to Black (in better ways!)


----------



## avens

Hi. I'm looking for IEMs to use with my phone (cba to carry a separate device in my pocket), while in the subway (rather noisy place) and that will be loose inside my jacket (no extra care). I'm not a basshead by any means, do require a bit of isolation and I'm concerned about having at least decent comfort (can't stand the triple flanges of Etymotic). Also I don't really care about having Android controls.
  
 I auditioned the GR07 (not the Bass Edition since they didn't have it), and while I liked them I wanted to know if there's anything better, that wouldn't be an overkill for just using them with the phone.
  
 I tried the DUNU 1000 and 2000 as well, finding both to be really nice, but they do not isolate that well and are a bit heavy (not a major concern in that case). Could consider them regardless, especially the 1000's as I preferred the sound signature.
  
 I also tested the RE-600 with double flanges, but I think even those wouldn't be optimal for a IEM to just carry around and walk. Still could still use them tho if there isn't anything with one flange that doesn't have enough isolation for the job.
  
 Which would you recommend? Doesn't necessarily have to be one of those listed.
  
 On a second and separate note, the alternative could be something higher end, but with the condition that the IEMs have detachable/swappable cables. That way I wouldn't have a $400-$500 product that is relying on a cable. Also, I don't see myself using Customs, as that would be too much of a hassle. A quick search lead me to the Shure 535, but is there anything else I should consider?
  
 Thirdly, in theheadphonelist.com is there any way to sort IEMs by value? At least a list of the 9.5 to 10/10 would be nice.
  
 Thanks a lot.
  
 edit: BTW my current headphones are the HD600 (office) and the PM-3 (home), while in the subway I use the Piston 2's. The Pistons don't isolate at all and the bass boost is quite noticeable, which I don't like. Never used the Android controls.


----------



## WhatToChoose

avens said:


> Hi. I'm looking for IEMs to use with my phone (cba to carry a separate device in my pocket), while in the subway (rather noisy place) and that will be loose inside my jacket (no extra care). I'm not a basshead by any means, do require a bit of isolation and I'm concerned about having at least decent comfort (can't stand the triple flanges of Etymotic). Also I don't really care about having Android controls.
> 
> I auditioned the GR07 (not the Bass Edition since they didn't have it), and while I liked them I wanted to know if there's anything better, that wouldn't be an overkill for just using them with the phone.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Hello there,
  
 I have used theheadphonelist for IEMs countless times (Ended up getting an IEM not on the list ironically haha). But to sort the value from 9.5 to 10, (if you mean Average Rating), just change the range in the Min and Max boxes to 9.5 and 10 respectively, and you'll find your range. Though I can tell you that they are all customs.
  
 Based off of personal experience, if your price range is $400-500, I would highly recommend the Noble 3Us (two reviews if you want to check them out). Their design is a bit odd at first, but once you get the hand of it (with the foam tips), they isolate better than shures, and they sound stellar through basic sources (tested with Macbook pro retina 13", Sansa Clip Sport, and Samsung Galaxy S5) due to their high sensitivity.
  
 They have detachable cables (2 pin, which I personally think are better than mmcx), exellent built quality (very solid plastic housings), extremely comfortable (very lightweight, well designed ergonomic shape), and of course, very clear and enjoyable sound. The only possible downside I can think of is that if you have very very small ears, then it might cause you some comfort issues (though I can't imagine these being uncomfortable at all). Other than that, I would recommend these for you.
  
 To give you an idea of the isolation, with a moderately paced song playing at half volume on the Sansa clip (about equivalent to 3 squares on macbook), I could not hear a lawnmower at all (tested with both commercial and ride on and walk behind lawnmowers). I think the isolation should suffice. And no, unlike the Etymotics, these do not violate the deepest depths of your ears. Insertion depth is comparable to shure.


----------



## BB 808

To sort that list click on the column header that you want to sort. You can also use the filters on the left side to narrow down your search.

For example I filtered "sound" rating 9.4 or higher, then sorted by price. Read the review many times and then bought the FLC8.

Good luck in your quest.


----------



## avens

Thanks.
  
 BTW, by "sorting by value" I don't mean by price. In his reviews |joker| always adds a value for money category, that isn't listed in the chart. For example, http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/vsonic-gr07/
  
 edit: Those are a 9.5/10 in "Value" (value for the money). The idea is sorting all the IEMs on that list by "Value", instead of having to browse one by one. If not, at least have a list of all the "Recommended THL 2014" IEMs.


----------



## BB 808

avens said:


> Thanks.
> 
> BTW, by "sorting by value" I don't mean by price. In his reviews |joker| always adds a value for money category, that isn't listed in the chart. For example, http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/vsonic-gr07/



Yep, you are correct. Mr. |joker| rated the value of the FLC8 as 9/10. What I was looking for was the best "sound" I could get for the best "price". On that list, the highest sound ratings for universal IEMs is 9.4 and 9.5 with prices ranging from $318 all the way up to $1349. To my thinking, the sound/price ratio of the FLC8 is the best VALUE on the list.

The FLC8 sounds great to me, combining the best features of my ER4S (details and clarity) and my SE530 (sweet mids) into one tidy package. Thanks to |joker| for corresponding with me and answering my questions before and after I bought the FLC8.


----------



## encoreAC

wrong thread...


----------



## avens

I have another question. In the case I get a mid to high end IEM, lets say $300+, in addition to having decent isolation I would want to have the option of replacing the cable to use one with an incorporated mic, as I'm planning to go on a trip in the upcoming years.
  
 I mean, the idea is having the option of swapping to a cable like that. I rarely to never use the mic while at my home town, so 99.9% of the time I'll be using the regular cable without a mic, but having the option would be a nice plus when living abroad.
  
 From what I understand I could get any IEM with detachable cables that uses a MMCX connection, then buy a Shure cable for example. Is that correct? Also, are there 2-pin cables that include a mic?


----------



## ljokerl

dimitritrush said:


> Congratulations, Ijokerl, It is a nice review as always very interesting to read.
> question. Was this review based on Crystal Clear Edition of Black?


 
  
 Black. In this case I reviewed whatever EarSonics deemed fit to send out. 
  


avens said:


> Hi. I'm looking for IEMs to use with my phone (cba to carry a separate device in my pocket), while in the subway (rather noisy place) and that will be loose inside my jacket (no extra care). I'm not a basshead by any means, do require a bit of isolation and I'm concerned about having at least decent comfort (can't stand the triple flanges of Etymotic). Also I don't really care about having Android controls.
> 
> I auditioned the GR07 (not the Bass Edition since they didn't have it), and while I liked them I wanted to know if there's anything better, that wouldn't be an overkill for just using them with the phone.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The GR07 is something you can't easily beat for ~$100 if you like the sound signature. The FLC8 someone else recommended is a good step up if you also want detachable cables, and its sound can be modified using the tuning system. However, its isolation is similar to the GR07/DN-1000 level (rather than Etymotic), but you can switch to a foam tip to try and maximize it without adding flanges. Foam tips are generally a good idea for isolation when double/triple-flanges are undesirable.
  


avens said:


> Thanks.
> 
> BTW, by "sorting by value" I don't mean by price. In his reviews |joker| always adds a value for money category, that isn't listed in the chart. For example, http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/vsonic-gr07/
> 
> edit: Those are a 9.5/10 in "Value" (value for the money). The idea is sorting all the IEMs on that list by "Value", instead of having to browse one by one. If not, at least have a list of all the "Recommended THL 2014" IEMs.


 
  
 To be honest I don't really want the "value" category to be the decision-maker for people because it's the most subjective of the bunch. I'd rather you use a combination of the other categories to make a list of IEMs to look at and later see the value rating alongside the paragraph explaining it, or use one of the buyer's guides.
  
 An IEM might not be the best buy in its category by any means but still get a high value score if it offers something unique and valuable for a certain set of users (e.g. the extremely small size and comfort of the Fidue A31s). Something that sounds way better than the A31s may well have a lower value rating if it doesn't offer anything unique and still isn't one of the best-performing sets in its category for sound. Lastly, I don't update the value scores later on, so an IEM I covered in 2010 may still have a high value "score" but better options may have come along since, which you will see when you sort by other criteria or look at the guides. 
  
 The ability to view all the "Recommended" picks (not by a particular year, though) will be added soon. 
  


avens said:


> I have another question. In the case I get a mid to high end IEM, lets say $300+, in addition to having decent isolation I would want to have the option of replacing the cable to use one with an incorporated mic, as I'm planning to go on a trip in the upcoming years.
> 
> I mean, the idea is having the option of swapping to a cable like that. I rarely to never use the mic while at my home town, so 99.9% of the time I'll be using the regular cable without a mic, but having the option would be a nice plus when living abroad.
> 
> From what I understand I could get any IEM with detachable cables that uses a MMCX connection, then buy a Shure cable for example. Is that correct? Also, are there 2-pin cables that include a mic?


 
  
 Yes, as long as the IEM is compatible with the Shure MMCX connector. The MMCX pin itself is the same but some manufacturers use a bulky connector or have the receptacle modified somehow. For example, the AudioFly IEMs have a special design for the plastic bit around the connector so not all MMCX cables will work. Westone also has recessed connectors and their cables aren't a good match for other IEMs.
  
 The Shure cables work well with IEMs that have an unmodified MMCX connector like the Ultrasone IQ and Fidue A83.
  
 The only two-pin I know of with a mic is the JH Audio one.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the Xiaomi Piston 3 earphones.
  
 The IEM ranking has been updated. 
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3B44) Xiaomi Piston 3*
> 
> 
> Reviewed June 2015
> ...


----------



## B9Scrambler

Another great review Joker!  The Piston 3 are a great inexpensive in-ear indeed. Alongside the KZ ED10, it's the best 8 bucks (I got a good deal) I've spent in portable audio.


----------



## SpherE22

Joker, you should really take a look at the duozas from zero audio. They rock!


----------



## PoRidge

i might really need your help, |joker|… do you have experience with the Fischer Amps FA-4E XB? i cannot find any retail store that has this brand. a short impression will be good enough for me. most of the comparisons i found prefer it to StageDiver 3 and it's cheaper too. does it has the fit and isolation close to the SD3?(it's top notch in universal fit in my book)


----------



## PoRidge

ljokerl said:


> The only two-pin I know of with a mic is the JH Audio one.




i remember in-ear the german company has two-pin with mic. saw it somewhere on thomann.de


----------



## ljokerl

b9scrambler said:


> Another great review Joker!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 I still remember when the majority opinion on Head-Fi was that you can't get a worthwhile earphone for under $50. How things change...
  


poridge said:


> i might really need your help, |joker|… do you have experience with the Fischer Amps FA-4E XB? i cannot find any retail store that has this brand. a short impression will be good enough for me. most of the comparisons i found prefer it to StageDiver 3 and it's cheaper too. does it has the fit and isolation close to the SD3?(it's top notch in universal fit in my book)


 
  
 Sorry, never tried a Fischer Amps product.


----------



## Taowolf51

I'm surprised to see the Carbo Tenores aren't here, they're a surprisingly nice headphone! Similar level of value you find in the Piston, but more of a balanced (slightly dark) sound. Great when it comes to comfort as well.


----------



## SpherE22

taowolf51 said:


> I'm surprised to see the Carbo Tenores aren't here, they're a surprisingly nice headphone! Similar level of value you find in the Piston, but more of a balanced (slightly dark) sound. Great when it comes to comfort as well.


 when it comes to zero audio products the first thing i picture in my mind is a flimsy built pair that sounds amazing. Thin micrphonic cable and driver flexing.


----------



## jant71

ljokerl said:


> I still remember when the majority opinion on Head-Fi was that you can't get a worthwhile earphone for under $50. How things change...


 
  
 Buuuut, back then people "in the know" just grabbed a Cyclone PR1 Pro.


----------



## rymd

jant71 said:


> Buuuut, back then people "in the know" just grabbed a Cyclone PR1 Pro.


 
  
 wow, haven't seen that name in a while. the nostalgia.. that's where I started my journey after reading one of joker's original reviews 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 insane how it gets beaten up by IEMs like 1/5 its price now, after just a few years


----------



## PoRidge

ljokerl said:


> Sorry, never tried a Fischer Amps product.




well, thay are planning on a Rhapsody series release soon. maybe there will be a chance.


----------



## ljokerl

rymd said:


> wow, haven't seen that name in a while. the nostalgia..


 
  
 +1. I still have my pair somewhere.


----------



## shinbojan

Can we expect DN-2000j reviewed soon  ?
 I am trying to decide if I should buy that one or Music One.


----------



## Grayson73

taowolf51 said:


> I'm surprised to see the Carbo Tenores aren't here, they're a surprisingly nice headphone! Similar level of value you find in the Piston, but more of a balanced (slightly dark) sound. Great when it comes to comfort as well.


 
 Agree, would love to see a Zero Audio product reviewed


----------



## SpherE22

grayson73 said:


> Agree, would love to see a Zero Audio product reviewed


 

 Aaaaand just as I was planning to reply to this my duoza's got snagged on a door knob and the cables fell apart........


----------



## Taowolf51

sphere22 said:


> Aaaaand just as I was planning to reply to this my duoza's got snagged on a door knob and the cables fell apart........


 
  
 I don't really know how people run into such trouble with cables, I've never had cables break or fail on me.


----------



## DecentLevi

After trying about 10 small straight-housing IEMs, the expired Maximo iMetal IM-590 blows them all to $&%^ (IMO). The thing is, one driver has died. I'm assuming it's a short out somewhere in the wire that leads to the driver, as is normally the case for this problem in the headphone world.  Is there anybody who can recommend some place that can repair IEM cables? Thanks


----------



## JamesBr

sphere22 said:


> Joker, you should really take a look at the duozas from zero audio. They rock!


 
 I know about them but a review wont hurt!


----------



## james444

decentlevi said:


> After trying about 10 small straight-housing IEMs, the expired Maximo iMetal IM-590 blows them all to $&%^ (IMO). The thing is, one driver has died. I'm assuming it's a short out somewhere in the wire that leads to the driver, as is normally the case for this problem in the headphone world.  Is there anybody who can recommend some place that can repair IEM cables? Thanks


 
  
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MAXIMO-iMetal-IP-595-Isolation-Earphones-Headphones-Earbuds-Remote-Mic-iPhone-/191389611987?
  
 (It's the remote version though)


----------



## Lifted Andreas

b9scrambler said:


> Another great review Joker!  The Piston 3 are a great inexpensive in-ear indeed. Alongside the KZ ED10, it's the best 8 bucks (I got a good deal) I've spent in portable audio.




Omg tell me where you got them pls. I want some piston 3 love too xD


----------



## Lifted Andreas

sphere22 said:


> when it comes to zero audio products the first thing i picture in my mind is a flimsy built pair that sounds amazing. Thin micrphonic cable and driver flexing.




Flimsy? What do you do with your earphones?

I've had my Tenores for nearly 3 years and they haven't missed a beat, quite literally. I find them to be very good build quality actually.


----------



## Toom

lifted andreas said:


> Flimsy? What do you do with your earphones?
> 
> I've had my Tenores for nearly 3 years and they haven't missed a beat, quite literally. I find them to be very good build quality actually.


 
  
 They do look like they'd fall apart if you breathed on them.


----------



## ljokerl

shinbojan said:


> Can we expect DN-2000j reviewed soon  ?
> I am trying to decide if I should buy that one or Music One.


 
  
 They're very different earphones, I don't think my review will be very helpful with this. I certainly wouldn't compare them head to head.
  
 If you want smooth and balanced, near-reference sound, get the Music One. If you want something colored and energetic, with a v-shaped sound signature, then the DUNU is better.
  


james444 said:


> http://www.ebay.com/itm/MAXIMO-iMetal-IP-595-Isolation-Earphones-Headphones-Earbuds-Remote-Mic-iPhone-/191389611987?
> 
> (It's the remote version though)


 
  
 That's much safer than getting a repair done..


----------



## Lifted Andreas

toom said:


> They do look like they'd fall apart if you breathed on them.




They look fragile yeah, especially the cables. However, carbon fibre is one of the strongest materials in the world and on the housings it shows.


----------



## Toom

lifted andreas said:


> They look fragile yeah, especially the cables. However, carbon is one of the strongest materials in the world and on the housings it shows.




And yet I am made of carbon but weak as anything. Go figure.


----------



## krelianx

ljokerl said:


> They're very different earphones, I don't think my review will be very helpful with this. I certainly wouldn't compare them head to head.
> 
> If you want smooth and balanced, near-reference sound, get the Music One. If you want something colored and energetic, with a v-shaped sound signature, then the DUNU is better.
> 
> ...




Joker, another mem thought you could help me here. 

Been reading the whole thread, but I am a bit on the fence. My re-400s broke, and I have a pair of vsd3s with a removable cable, which are very fun and robust but whose build I am just very suspicious of (the left earpiece is already finnicky). I want to buy something sturdy, with great soundstage, and smooth balanced presentation and extension. 

I have been wondering about the S1, S2, and the new Sennheiser Momentums. I would love to see some comparisons between these three, and/or the re-400s or vsd3s.


----------



## suman134

krelianx said:


> Joker, another mem thought you could help me here.
> 
> Been reading the whole thread, but I am a bit on the fence. My re-400s broke, and I have a pair of vsd3s with a removable cable, which are very fun and robust but whose build I am just very suspicious of (the left earpiece is already finnicky). I want to buy something sturdy, with great soundstage, and smooth balanced presentation and extension.
> 
> I have been wondering about the S1, S2, and the new Sennheiser Momentums. I would love to see some comparisons between these three, and/or the re-400s or vsd3s.


 

 If you are not after bass, you should have a look at Brainwavz R3. It has every thing else you want, sturdy build, smooth balanced presentation with extension too.


----------



## d marc0

suman134 said:


> If you are not after bass, you should have a look at Brainwavz R3. It has every thing else you want, sturdy build, smooth balanced presentation with extension too.




+1 2years in this hobby and I still keep the R3. Sturdy, unique, balanced sound, and extended on both ends of the spectrum.


----------



## ljokerl

krelianx said:


> Joker, another mem thought you could help me here.
> 
> Been reading the whole thread, but I am a bit on the fence. My re-400s broke, and I have a pair of vsd3s with a removable cable, which are very fun and robust but whose build I am just very suspicious of (the left earpiece is already finnicky). I want to buy something sturdy, with great soundstage, and smooth balanced presentation and extension.
> 
> I have been wondering about the S1, S2, and the new Sennheiser Momentums. I would love to see some comparisons between these three, and/or the re-400s or vsd3s.


 
  
 Yeah, I wouldn't tag any of those three as particularly "smooth" and I don't think the Momentum is very balanced, either. The Brainwavz R3 recommended above is a very nice option, sounds almost like an RE-400 and has a rather heavy-duty build. If you really want to go indestructible with similar sound there's also the Aurisonics Rockets, but those are quite a bit pricier.


----------



## krelianx

Thanks Joker. What about the Trinity Delta? I've been hearing some amazing things about those


----------



## peter123

krelianx said:


> Thanks Joker. What about the Trinity Delta? I've been hearing some amazing things about those




If you're looking for a balanced sound I wouldn't go down that route......


----------



## suman134

krelianx said:


> Thanks Joker. What about the Trinity Delta? I've been hearing some amazing things about those


 

  I think you should consider E80 instead.


----------



## Phosphenetre

Hi ljokerl, my past three IEM purchases have been chiefly motivated by your recommendations and I've never been disappointed, so here I am again!
  
 My last IEM was the  VSonic VSD3S, which died on me last week. I'll be brief and to the point - I'm essentially looking for an IEM like the VSD3S but less V-shaped and with more neutral mids. A touch more refined treble would be great too. I'll be using these with portable sources like my phone. Isolation is important (at least VSD3S-level of isolation).
  
 I'm a musician and a music producer, so neutrality is something I'll always look for.
  
 My budget is 200 USD, max. I'd also REALLY appreciate if you could throw in a second recommendation for an option in the same price range as the VSD3S, too (roughly 60-70 dollars), just in case I decide a cheaper IEM is good enough for my outdoor listening.
  
 Please help me!


----------



## ZapX629

danielkrego said:


> Hi ljokerl, my past three IEM purchases have been chiefly motivated by your recommendations and I've never been disappointed, so here I am again!
> 
> My last IEM was the  VSonic VSD3S, which died on me last week. I'll be brief and to the point - I'm essentially looking for an IEM like the VSD3S but less V-shaped and with more neutral mids. A touch more refined treble would be great too. I'll be using these with portable sources like my phone. Isolation is important (at least VSD3S-level of isolation).
> 
> ...


 

 Sounds like you'd like the GR07.


----------



## Phosphenetre

zapx629 said:


> Sounds like you'd like the GR07.


 
  
 I owned the GR07 MkII, before the VSD3S. Now I don't know if I had a bad pair or not, but the mid-bass seemed really hollow to me, from what I remember now. I found the VSD3S easier to EQ to more-or-less neutral land, on the other hand.
  
 I'd prefer to not buy the VSD3S or GR07 again, just in the interest of trying something new. Thanks for the reply, though!


----------



## ZapX629

danielkrego said:


> I owned the GR07 MkII, before the VSD3S. Now I don't know if I had a bad pair or not, but the mid-bass seemed really hollow to me, from what I remember now. I found the VSD3S easier to EQ to more-or-less neutral land, on the other hand.
> 
> I'd prefer to not buy the VSD3S or GR07 again, just in the interest of trying something new. Thanks for the reply, though!


 

 Well, as I just said in another thread, the CKR9 you're looking at is the best IEM I've heard under $150. And it's not really even close.


----------



## Phosphenetre

zapx629 said:


> Well, as I just said in another thread, the CKR9 you're looking at is the best IEM I've heard under $150. And it's not really even close.


 
  
 The CKR9 (and the CKR9 LTD) just caught my attention yesterday, so while they both look promising, I'm still not confident about the idea of picking them up. Would you say the CKR9 (and/or the LTD) is more neutral and accurate overall than the GR07?


----------



## ozkan

danielkrego said:


> The CKR9 (and the CKR9 LTD) just caught my attention yesterday, so while they both look promising, I'm still not confident about the idea of picking them up. Would you say the CKR9 (and/or the LTD) is more neutral and accurate overall than the GR07?


 
  
 Yes, they are more accurate than GR07 for sure. I own CKR9 and GR07 cannot come close in overall refinement.


----------



## Phosphenetre

ozkan said:


> Yes, they are more accurate than GR07 for sure. I own CKR9 and GR07 cannot come close in overall refinement.


 
  
 That's great, do you have any experience with the CKR9 LTD? I'm interested in the more neutral (but not bass-light or thin-bodied) of the two.


----------



## ljokerl

krelianx said:


> Thanks Joker. What about the Trinity Delta? I've been hearing some amazing things about those


 
  
 Not familiar with these.
  


danielkrego said:


> Hi ljokerl, my past three IEM purchases have been chiefly motivated by your recommendations and I've never been disappointed, so here I am again!
> 
> My last IEM was the  VSonic VSD3S, which died on me last week. I'll be brief and to the point - I'm essentially looking for an IEM like the VSD3S but less V-shaped and with more neutral mids. A touch more refined treble would be great too. I'll be using these with portable sources like my phone. Isolation is important (at least VSD3S-level of isolation).
> 
> ...


 
  
 GR07 would have been my first choice also. My favorite alternative (Philips Fidelio S2) hasn't got very good isolation. The other sets I like in that price range don't really resemble the VSD3S too much in sound tuning but you could go for something way more neutral, like the Audio-Technica ATH-IM02. I've been enjoying these quite a lot lately and they isolate well.
  
 I don't have any non-VSonic alternatives to the VSD3S under $70, either. It's one of the best IEMs I have in that price range, and certainly the only one that sounds like a VSD3S. The two sets I like enough to recommend as alternatives even if they don't sound much like a VSD3S, the Ostry KC06 and Philips TX2, both have poor(er) isolation.


----------



## ozkan

danielkrego said:


> That's great, do you have any experience with the CKR9 LTD? I'm interested in the more neutral (but not bass-light or thin-bodied) of the two.


 
  
 No, I don't but from the impressions so far CKR9 should be most neutral sounding of the batch.


----------



## Phosphenetre

ljokerl said:


> Not familiar with these.
> 
> 
> GR07 would have been my first choice also. My favorite alternative (Philips Fidelio S2) hasn't got very good isolation. The other sets I like in that price range don't really resemble the VSD3S too much in sound tuning but you could go for something way more neutral, like the Audio-Technica ATH-IM02. I've been enjoying these quite a lot lately and they isolate well.
> ...


 
  
 Thanks for your reply, joker. I should clarify, I am NOT looking for something that necessarily resembles the VSD3S, at all. I was just using it as my most familiar/recent IEM reference point, sonically.
  
 Essentially, the main thing I didn't like about the VSD3S was the midrange recession/V-shaped profile, and also the slightly overbearing low-end, from time to time.
  
 Do you have any more recommendations now? I'll look at the IM02, thanks.


----------



## suman134

danielkrego said:


> Thanks for your reply, joker. I should clarify, I am NOT looking for something that necessarily resembles the VSD3S, at all. I was just using it as my most familiar/recent IEM reference point, sonically.
> 
> Essentially, the main thing I didn't like about the VSD3S was the midrange recession/V-shaped profile, and also the slightly overbearing low-end, from time to time.
> 
> Do you have any more recommendations now? I'll look at the IM02, thanks.


 

  Im-02 if you can handle analytical sound, Im-02 is not going tot be as bassy as VSD3S.
  
  You should look at DUNU DN-1000 or Vsonic GR07 instead i think.


----------



## Phosphenetre

suman134 said:


> Im-02 if you can handle analytical sound, Im-02 is not going tot be as bassy as VSD3S.
> 
> You should look at DUNU DN-1000 or Vsonic GR07 instead i think.


 
  
 I did in fact find the VSD3S a bit excessive in the low-end, and EQd my player accordingly, with a gentle dip in the mid-bass mostly. I'm worried that the IM02 might fall too far towards 'lacking body/weight/fullness' of sound, which to me is not a sign of a truly neutral IEM or headphone.


----------



## ozkan

danielkrego said:


> I did in fact find the VSD3S a bit excessive in the low-end, and EQd my player accordingly, with a gentle dip in the mid-bass mostly. I'm worried that the IM02 might fall too far towards 'lacking body/weight/fullness' of sound, which to me is not a sign of a truly neutral IEM or headphone.


 
  
 CKR9 might be your best bet my friend. They are neutral and have weight/ body/fullness to them. Did I say earlier that they have the best bass I've heard in an IEM? Yes, they
 are.
  
 But if you have small ears, stay away because they are a bit on the big side and you may have some comfort issues.


----------



## suman134

ozkan said:


> CKR9 might be your best bet my friend. They are neutral and have weight/ body/fullness to them. Did I say earlier that they have the best bass I've heard in an IEM? Yes, they are.


 

  Im not sure about how detailed they are against IM-02. As he is willing to cut the bass down.


----------



## ozkan

suman134 said:


> Im not sure about how detailed they are against IM-02. As he is willing to cut the bass down.


 
  
 Oh sorry! I missed that. Then I would suggest IM02 as well. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 
  
 There are also Macaw GT100S and Soundmagic E80 that you might check.


----------



## suman134

ozkan said:


> Oh sorry! I missed that. Then I would suggest IM02 as well.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

  E80 should be nice.


----------



## PoRidge

i got the dba 02 amd the im 02 around the same time and think that the im 02 still has a bit colouration in the mid range. for neutral and isolation, the dba 02 is also a good choice, but may lack some body and bass quality comparing to the dynamic driver ckr9.


----------



## Phosphenetre

poridge said:


> i got the dba 02 amd the im 02 around the same time and think that the im 02 still has a bit colouration in the mid range. for neutral and isolation, the dba 02 is also a good choice, but may lack some body and bass quality comparing to the dynamic driver ckr9.




I've considered the DBA-02 on and off for years, in fact. It's always been the fear of lacking realistic, natural weight and body in the bottom end that I've been worried about.


----------



## PoRidge

then a dynamic like ckr9 would not be a miss imo or maybe you should try them out once you narrow it down to only two or three.


----------



## Phosphenetre

poridge said:


> then a dynamic like ckr9 would not be a miss imo or maybe you should try them out once you narrow it down to only two or three.


 
  
 I was quite excited about the CKR9/CKR9 LTD, but now I'm feeling unsure about the fit and isolation. Several people around the forum have remarked that it's hit or miss, and I'm not in a position or location where returns would be easy.


----------



## ZapX629

danielkrego said:


> I was quite excited about the CKR9/CKR9 LTD, but now I'm feeling unsure about the fit and isolation. Several people around the forum have remarked that it's hit or miss, and I'm not in a position or location where returns would be easy.


 

 How much isolation are we talking about? If you need it to block out crowd noise and walking around, it's great. If you're working in a loud factory or something like that, maybe not.


----------



## Phosphenetre

zapx629 said:


> How much isolation are we talking about? If you need it to block out crowd noise and walking around, it's great. If you're working in a loud factory or something like that, maybe not.


 
  
 I can only think in terms of my experience with previous IEMs I've owned, so I'd say about the level of a VSonic VSD3S or GR07 would be good enough. I use IEMs mostly while travelling, so that's transport like trains, buses and cars in city traffic, and with sufficiently loud music, airplanes.
  
 Also, how reliable is the fit? I'm very worried about buying these and then finding that they don't fit me securely or deeply enough.


----------



## ZapX629

danielkrego said:


> I can only think in terms of my experience with previous IEMs I've owned, so I'd say about the level of a VSonic VSD3S or GR07 would be good enough. I use IEMs mostly while travelling, so that's transport like trains, buses and cars in city traffic, and with sufficiently loud music, airplanes.
> 
> Also, how reliable is the fit? I'm very worried about buying these and then finding that they don't fit me securely or deeply enough.


 

 They're no worse than the GR07 or VSD3S in my usage. As far as fit goes, I've never had any problems with them and wear them for hours at a time. They're a little big, but if you can wear the VSD3S comfortably I don't see them being any issue at all.
  
 As far as CKR9 vs IM02 in my experience with each, the CKR9 wins in terms of bass detail and fullness, subbass depth, 3D soundstage, realism, depth, separation and layering. The IM02 gets the nod in air and details, but the difference detail between the two is minimal. Also gets a plus for detachable cables, but lacks a 3D stage, ie. it's very wide, but without the depth and height of the CKR9. The CKR9 is a more realistic sound, where the IM02 is more similar to the GR07 type of sound.


----------



## ozkan

zapx629 said:


> They're no worse than the GR07 or VSD3S in my usage. As far as fit goes, I've never had any problems with them and wear them for hours at a time. They're a little big, but if you can wear the VSD3S comfortably I don't see them being any issue at all.
> 
> As far as CKR9 vs IM02 in my experience with each, the CKR9 wins in terms of bass detail and fullness, subbass depth, 3D soundstage, realism, depth, separation and layering. The IM02 gets the nod in air and details, but the difference detail between the two is minimal. Also gets a plus for detachable cables, but lacks a 3D stage, ie. it's very wide, but without the depth and height of the CKR9. The CKR9 is a more realistic sound, where the IM02 is more similar to the GR07 type of sound.




Agreed on IM02 comparison.


----------



## DecentLevi

Hello guys, just wanting to send out a pointer that I've discovered about the hobby.
  
 So I finally got a good sound out of my Vsonic VC02 earphones today... and it wasn't from the 'stock' eartips. After trying no less than 25 tips of various materials, brands, shapes & sizes, I was able to 'revive' an earphone that was about to be a gonner. This earphone went from sounding mid-centric with rolled off high & lows, sibilant, claustrophobic and lacking in detail to the opposite: reasonably good hi/low extension, acceptable stage and quite detailed - and now with upper mids & treble that are lush and sweet.
  
 Granted this is an expired earphone, but my point is this: *always save your eartips - even if you hate your IEM enough to smash it with a bat*... That's right, hoard them tips and be proud! Take my example. I already tried 5-6 brands of tips at home but it wasn't until I got some ancient tips out of my out-of-state storage that were meant for another IEM and chanced on this pairing that I realised this synergy. And most of the time it seems tips are universally compatible - if it's too small you can usually force it on; if it's too big you may be able to push it back far enough to stay on. Saving *tips *is the way to get the right *fit*, and un*found*ed good *sound*. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
       
_(stock on left versus the fluke fit on the right)_​  
 BTW, feel free to send me a PM if you're interested to know where to buy these IEMS, as there is still one seller offering them. Also if anybody happens to know where I can get more of these specific tips (on the right), please let me know, as this is my only pair and is by far the best fit / sound with my ears.


----------



## ljokerl

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, just wanting to send out a pointer that I've discovered about the hobby.
> 
> So I finally got a good sound out of my Vsonic VC02 earphones today... and it wasn't from the 'stock' eartips. After trying no less than 25 tips of various materials, brands, shapes & sizes, I was able to 'revive' an earphone that was about to be a gonner. This earphone went from sounding mid-centric with rolled off high & lows, sibilant, claustrophobic and lacking in detail to the opposite: reasonably good hi/low extension, acceptable stage and quite detailed - and now with upper mids & treble that are lush and sweet.
> 
> ...


 
  
 You'd figure most people on Head-Fi keep their tips. I know I have a big, loosely organized box. Not familiar with that particular shape, though.


----------



## Toom

ljokerl said:


> You'd figure most people on Head-Fi keep their tips. I know I have a big, loosely organized box. Not familiar with that particular shape, though.




Your box of tips is probably bigger than my house.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the Alpha & Delta AD01 from Lendmeurears
  
 The most up-to-date ranking can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C67) Alpha & Delta AD01*
> 
> 
> Original Review July 2015
> ...


----------



## DopeMusic

Hello everyone, I was looking for something that sounds like Mrice E100/Baldoor (which I think is fantastic for the quality / price ratio) but that isolates more from outside noise! What do you recommend (possibly detachble cable)? Sorry for the english


----------



## ljokerl

dopemusic said:


> Hello everyone, I was looking for something that sounds like Mrice E100/Baldoor (which I think is fantastic for the quality / price ratio) but that isolates more from outside noise! What do you recommend (possibly detachble cable)? Sorry for the english


 
  
 Not sure what those are (or are comparable to). Perhaps someone else has something to recommend.


----------



## JamesBr

suman134 said:


> E80 should be nice.


 
  
 Sould, would and are hehe


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Philips Fidelio S1 and S2 reviews. These have been a long time coming. 
  
 As always, the most up-to-date summary table can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2C68) Philips Fidelio S1*
> 
> 
> Reviewed July 2015
> ...


 
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2B28) Philips Fidelio S2*
> 
> Reviewed July 2015
> 
> ...


----------



## Toom

Do the Trinity Deltas.  Sublime IEMs.


----------



## krelianx

Aye Joker, would love to see your take on these.


----------



## bretemm

What IEM would be good to use with a tube amp + dac? I use Schiit audio Valhalla2 (I'm limited to only IEMs) I mainly listen to indie rock and Classic rock


----------



## cocolinho

bretemm said:


> What IEM would be good to use with a tube amp + dac? I use Schiit audio Valhalla2 (I'm limited to only IEMs) I mainly listen to indie rock and Classic rock


 
 I would say none because of the high impedance output of the Val2 designed to sound best with high impedance headphones such as HDxxx
 Pick an amp with an impedance output close to 0 and you don't need to much power too to avoid channel imbalance at very low volume.


----------



## bretemm

Ok, well it does have low gain. 
Is a high or low impedance Better? 
I did find a HiFiMan iem that's close to 200ohms 





cocolinho said:


> I would say none because of the high impedance output of the Val2 designed to sound best with high impedance headphones such as HDxxx
> Pick an amp with an impedance output close to 0 and you don't need to much power too to avoid channel imbalance at very low volume.


----------



## peter123

bretemm said:


> Ok, well it does have low gain.
> Is a high or low impedance Better?
> I did find a HiFiMan iem that's close to 200ohms




You could check out the Havi B3Pro1. I don't know the details on your Schiit so do some Google fu and see what you find. I'm pretty sure you'll be able to avoid hiss with them at the least. 

They're seriously good sounding as well.


----------



## bretemm

Thank you 





peter123 said:


> You could check out the Havi B3Pro1. I don't know the details on your Schiit so do some Google fu and see what you find. I'm pretty sure you'll be able to avoid hiss with them at the least.
> 
> They're seriously good sounding as well.


----------



## ljokerl

Noted about the Trinity Audio.
  


peter123 said:


> You could check out the Havi B3Pro1. I don't know the details on your Schiit so do some Google fu and see what you find. I'm pretty sure you'll be able to avoid hiss with them at the least.
> 
> They're seriously good sounding as well.


 

 Yes, the B3 Pro I should be among the best you can get for this. One other set I've recommended in this type of situation is the Etymotic EK5, which is rated at like 300 Ohms.


----------



## garcsa

toom said:


> Do the Trinity Deltas.  Sublime IEMs.


 
 +1


----------



## DopeMusic

Please let you do a review of MEElectronics M6 Pro!!


----------



## Tom22

For those interested: I recently received 3 new earphones from Fischer that is to be released in Late October- November 2015. 
  
 here is a link to the thread and videos:
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/783656/fischer-audios-october-2015-omega-release-ace-spark-twin#post_11980823


----------



## bretemm

Inbetween the klipsch x11i and Shure se425, 
Do more drives mean better? 
The klipsch has 2 drivers vs Shures 3 drivers 

I think I might get the x11i over the shure and westone w30 or w40


----------



## ljokerl

dopemusic said:


> Please let you do a review of MEElectronics M6 Pro!!


 

  
 Was waiting for their new flagship IEM but not sure when those are coming out. If never materialize I'll check out the M6 PRO.
  


tom22 said:


> For those interested: I recently received 3 new earphones from Fischer that is to be released in Late October- November 2015.
> 
> here is a link to the thread and videos:
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/783656/fischer-audios-october-2015-omega-release-ace-spark-twin#post_11980823


 
  
 Darn, what about the DBA-02 mkIII? Their dynamics are nice but their old BA sets were killer. 
  


bretemm said:


> Inbetween the klipsch x11i and Shure se425,
> Do more drives mean better?
> The klipsch has 2 drivers vs Shures 3 drivers
> 
> I think I might get the x11i over the shure and westone w30 or w40


 
  
 Pretty sure the X11 only has one driver per side (2 total... but that's not the way they're normally counted). SE425s are dual-drivers. For Shure it's the 2nd digit of the model number that signifies the number of drivers. 
  
 Generally speaking there's no guarantee that more drivers equals better sound. It all comes down to acoustic design and implementation. In this case there's a significant tuning difference as well - the X11 is warm earphone with enhanced bass. The SE425, if I remember correctly, is relatively neutral/balanced. It's been a while since I've heard one of those.


----------



## bretemm

Ok, 
I mainly listen to indie and Classic rock, I do like some bass tho, so would the x11i be better? Comfort always comes up with Shure zany it didn't seem good. 





ljokerl said:


> Was waiting for their new flagship IEM but not sure when those are coming out. If never materialize I'll check out the M6 PRO.
> 
> 
> Darn, what about the DBA-02 mkIII? Their dynamics are nice but their old BA sets were killer.
> ...


----------



## Julieann

I'd love some advice on a suitable upgrade to my old Klipsch S4i's, I've had them a few years and have been mostly happy with them, i find them fine with easy listening classical and electronic music, but they seem to lose it playing rock, and they can be quite unpleasant.

I'm looking for something that is not too bass heavy and not too warm, I think I'm looking for something quite neutral and open (I don't know the proper technical terms)

I don't mind if they are just in ears or if they have to go over and around the ear, having an inline remote for the iPhone would be great, but not essential ( they will be used solely with the iPhone)

I have listened to a couple, the B&O H3, which I thought were a little bit warm, but quite easy to listen to, the build quality for the price seemed a bit poor though, and the RHA 10i, initially I thought there were not so nice, they seemed very bright, but after listening to them again a few times I found them not so bad.

I'm limited on brands as I'm on holiday and want to spend my remaining holiday money, options seem to be RHA, Shure, sennheiser, Philips, Sony, Westone, but I might be able to track down some other mainstream brands.

Budget will be up to $250 (USD), but I'd be happy to spend less if I could get a significant sound upgrade for less.

Thanks for reading, any suggestions appreciated 

Julie


----------



## WhatToChoose

I believe I can help you out. I started my journey with with the S4s a few years ago (and I thought $75 was expensive...HA! Head Fi proved me wrong). I'll try to help you out based off of my experiences. My trip by the way was Klipsch S4 -> Shure se215 -> Westone 3 -> MEElectronics M6 Pro -> RHA T10 -> Noble 3U so far.
  
 I would recommend that you don't get the se215s or the W3s if you enjoy classical and electronic. se215s have some of the worst sub bass extension, bad clarity, and poorly extended highs with no sparkle. Mids are decent at best. Westone 3s are excellent detailed IEMs, but they somehow managed to clearly deliver the music with no sense of enjoyment whatsoever. It is more of a "that was a really clean listen" than "that song was SICK" if that makes sense.
  
 For under $250, I would suggest checking out RHA T10s (as you already have), Vsonic gr07, sennheiser ie80, DJE 1500s, and ATH CKR9. Other people will be able to give you more recommendations.
  
 Honestly though, I highly doubt anyone has found an IEM under $200 that they are satisfied with (and I mean legitimately satisfied with).  You'd have to hit at least $400 I think in order to find an IEM that has no caveats at all.
  
 Oh yeah, welcome to Head-Fi, and sorry about your wallet 
  


julieann said:


> I'd love some advice on a suitable upgrade to my old Klipsch S4i's, I've had them a few years and have been mostly happy with them, i find them fine with easy listening classical and electronic music, but they seem to lose it playing rock, and they can be quite unpleasant.
> 
> I'm looking for something that is not too bass heavy and not too warm, I think I'm looking for something quite neutral and open (I don't know the proper technical terms)
> 
> ...


----------



## bretemm

Are the Klipsch x11i worth $350? Or would the klipsch x7i $200 be good? 
I have a valhalla2 and bifrost that I'm wanting better IEMs for


----------



## WhatToChoose

They are only $250 on Amazon I believe. And reviews for the X7i don't look so hot.
  
 My experience with Klipsch IEMs has been enjoyable sound but unreliable and poor build quality. Even if you get it discounted at $250, that might not even be worth it if they only last a month.


----------



## Julieann

whattochoose said:


> I believe I can help you out. I started my journey with with the S4s a few years ago (and I thought $75 was expensive...HA! Head Fi proved me wrong). I'll try to help you out based off of my experiences. My trip by the way was Klipsch S4 -> Shure se215 -> Westone 3 -> MEElectronics M6 Pro -> RHA T10 -> Noble 3U so far.
> 
> I would recommend that you don't get the se215s or the W3s if you enjoy classical and electronic. se215s have some of the worst sub bass extension, bad clarity, and poorly extended highs with no sparkle. Mids are decent at best. Westone 3s are excellent detailed IEMs, but they somehow managed to clearly deliver the music with no sense of enjoyment whatsoever. It is more of a "that was a really clean listen" than "that song was SICK" if that makes sense.
> 
> ...




Thanks for the reply, you've given me lots to think about, can you comment on the Shure 425 and RHA T20, they are just about within budget.


----------



## bretemm

Thank you, well, what would be a good iem? I've been looking at westone or Shure butnim not sure. 





whattochoose said:


> They are only $250 on Amazon I believe. And reviews for the X7i don't look so hot.
> 
> My experience with Klipsch IEMs has been enjoyable sound but unreliable and poor build quality. Even if you get it discounted at $250, that might not even be worth it if they only last a month.


----------



## ljokerl

bretemm said:


> Ok,
> I mainly listen to indie and Classic rock, I do like some bass tho, so would the x11i be better? Comfort always comes up with Shure zany it didn't seem good.


 
  
 Can't beat the Klipsch for comfort but there's quite a few IEMs that fit your requirements for sound, since they're pretty loose, including. The X11 should be okay - it's not technically perfect but a good easy-listening IEM with very smooth sound, and of course is very comfortable. 
  


julieann said:


> I'd love some advice on a suitable upgrade to my old Klipsch S4i's, I've had them a few years and have been mostly happy with them, i find them fine with easy listening classical and electronic music, but they seem to lose it playing rock, and they can be quite unpleasant.
> 
> I'm looking for something that is not too bass heavy and not too warm, I think I'm looking for something quite neutral and open (I don't know the proper technical terms)
> 
> ...


 

 I'm not a fan of the RHA T10 but the newer T20 is quite good for a more neutral sound. Build quality is very good as with all RHA gear and the sound can be adjusted (very slightly) using their interchangeable filters. It's a good buy if build quality is a strong factor in your decision. 
  
 From the other brands you listed, Philips has the Fidelio S2 that's a very good neutral earphone and much less expensive. It's brighter than the sets you're used to but if the harsh treble of the S4 wasn't totally offensive, then the S2 will be fine. 
  
 Sony has the MDR-7550 (aka EX800ST), a very smooth, easy-listening earphone with a slightly warm sound (a-la Shure SE535, which you won't find in that price range). It's from Sony's professional product line though so it might be harder to find than their consumer-grade earphones.  
  
 The closest from Westone will be the W20 and that's more than $250.  
  
 Other sets I'd check on - the Aurisonics Rockets, which are right at $250 here in the US and have a very clear and easy-going sound, and maybe the VSonic GR07 Classic or GR07 Bass Edition if you have the ability to import earphones from Asia. They will be much less expensive and very capable in their own right.


----------



## cpper

Hello everyone 
 I want to buy some new in-ear earphones, and am looking for decent bass and sound quality. There's no reason to tell you my price range because just a few earphones are available here, and the prices are a lot higher than in the US.
  
 I think I'm gonna choose between these three:
  

JVC HA FX1X
Sennheiser cx300 II
Sony MDR EX450
  
  
 I'm a little confused regarding the JVC's, because of the newer FX101 model, which is also available here. Some reports, like this one state the 101's are a lot better, and some, such as this or this(scroll down) say the older are the better.
  
 Any help would be appreciated


----------



## Tom22

ljokerl said:


> Was waiting for their new flagship IEM but not sure when those are coming out. If never materialize I'll check out the M6 PRO.
> 
> 
> Darn, what about the DBA-02 mkIII? Their dynamics are nice but their old BA sets were killer.
> ...


 
  agreed, 
  
  i was quite hoping to hear some news on the dba 02 mkIII. its on the website, but no word anywhere... =( only pictures and specs to tease us........ 
 Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Can't beat the Klipsch for comfort but there's quite a few IEMs that fit your requirements for sound, since they're pretty loose, including. The X11 should be okay - it's not technically perfect but a good easy-listening IEM with very smooth sound, and of course is very comfortable.
> 
> 
> I'm not a fan of the RHA T10 but the newer T20 is quite good for a more neutral sound. Build quality is very good as with all RHA gear and the sound can be adjusted (very slightly) using their interchangeable filters. It's a good buy if build quality is a strong factor in your decision.
> ...


 
  


julieann said:


> Thanks for the reply, you've given me lots to think about, can you comment on the Shure 425 and RHA T20, they are just about within budget.


 
 i agree with @ljokerl the t20s are a great option if you need something nearly bullet proof as far as earphones go. lots of goodies and accessories and the interchangeable filter isn't a gimmick, i found it quite fun to play around with the slightly different tuning with the various filters...
  
 and they sound much much better then the t10s imo, i reviewed those two recently on my profile (maybe it can be of some help to you) i also compared them head to head if you need a sort of frame of reference.
  
 but then again... i'm geeky like that... soooo


----------



## bretemm

Thank you, 
Actually I think I might go with the Torque t096z, they have a 150ohms and 80 or 90 sensitivity, and cost less then the klipsch x11i 





cpper said:


> Hello everyone
> I want to buy some new in-ear earphones, and am looking for decent bass and sound quality. There's no reason to tell you my price range because just a few earphones are available here, and the prices are a lot higher than in the US.
> 
> I think I'm gonna choose between these three:
> ...


----------



## bretemm

I quoted someone els insted of you haha 





tom22 said:


> i agree with @ljokerl
> the t20s are a great option if you need something nearly bullet proof as far as earphones go. lots of goodies and accessories and the interchangeable filter isn't a gimmick, i found it quite fun to play around with the slightly different tuning with the various filters...
> 
> and they sound much much better then the t10s imo, i reviewed those two recently on my profile (maybe it can be of some help to you) i also compared them head to head if you need a sort of frame of reference.
> ...


----------



## Tom22

cpper said:


> Hello everyone
> I want to buy some new in-ear earphones, and am looking for decent bass and sound quality. There's no reason to tell you my price range because just a few earphones are available here, and the prices are a lot higher than in the US.
> 
> I think I'm gonna choose between these three:
> ...


 

 if your interested in the cx 300 II your better off going for their latest update in the cx 3.00
  
 its super comfy with the angled nozzle and soft silicone eartips (plus it has a tiny footprint)
  
 also the cable is better made and not thin and "thready"


----------



## shinbojan

Do they sound better than cx300II? I am not satisfied with mine and would like to upgrade during the business trip I have this week. These are my options and prices in €:
 - Fidelio S2 (100)
 - Fiio EX1 (100)
 - HifiMan400 (100)
 - Final Audio Design Heaven IV (170)
 - GRADO GR8 (200)
 - Shure SE535 (400)
  
 I will be using them while working, so I guess that the S2 and EX1 are off the table. 
 Is it worth buying Shure SE535, or should I wait for new Dunu models?


----------



## kova4a

shinbojan said:


> Do they sound better than cx300II? I am not satisfied with mine and would like to upgrade during the business trip I have this week. These are my options and prices in €:
> - Fidelio S2 (100)
> - Fiio EX1 (100)
> - HifiMan400 (100)
> ...


 
 Those prices aren't exactly great. The se535 is definitely no worth it a 400 euro. It used to e just overpriced but nowadays this price even in usd is ridiculous given the competition. Btw, if paeople are set on not buying outside of EU, they can still order from http://headphoniaks.com/gb/ , which are Spain based. Prices are the usueal EU deal - usd numbers turned straigh into euro but at least there is a bit better choice.


----------



## DopeMusic

Hello to everyone, I wanted to know, in terms of isolation and sound quality (mind you I have the Sennheiser HD598), which would you recommend between:
 - MEElectronics M6 Pro
 - Shure SE215
 - Westone UM PRO10
 - Westone W 10.
 And if you can explain to me the difference between the two Westone!


----------



## gearofwar

Will there be any chances for XBA-Z5 review? thanks


----------



## ljokerl

cpper said:


> Hello everyone
> I want to buy some new in-ear earphones, and am looking for decent bass and sound quality. There's no reason to tell you my price range because just a few earphones are available here, and the prices are a lot higher than in the US.
> 
> I think I'm gonna choose between these three:
> ...


 
  
 I'm one of those who prefers the FX101 to the FX1X. If you like heavy bass these are way better than the CX300-II, which are warm but not that bassy. Not sure about the EX450.
  
  


gearofwar said:


> Will there be any chances for XBA-Z5 review? thanks


 
  
 I have one but I don't know if I want to review it - it's in that awkward category of high-end basshead IEMs and just doesn't sound that good for how expensive it is. Not sure when I would recommend someone spend $700 on it.


----------



## WhatToChoose

dopemusic said:


> Hello to everyone, I wanted to know, in terms of isolation and sound quality (mind you I have the Sennheiser HD598), which would you recommend between:
> - MEElectronics M6 Pro
> - Shure SE215
> - Westone UM PRO10
> ...


 
  
 Isolation:
 Shure se215 >= Westone W10/UM10 (only if the westone's are equipped with their foam tips) > M6 Pro
  
 Sound quality: I can't comment on the Westone W10s/UM10s, but I can say that the se215s have the worst SQ of the bunch. No sub bass, and poor highs. Mids are decent at best.
  
 M6 Pro > se215 (I would say the M6 pro has a thinner, airier sound, with larger soundstage and better separation, but somewhat bass-light. Shure is ALL midbass and mids, everything else is quite poor and muddy.)
  
 Again, no clue about the W10s, but I think some reviews explain them quite well. I can tell you that single balanced armature IEMs do suffer from distortion quite easily, especially at this price.
  
 Build quality from all of these is excellent, with the shures on top (heavy cable though), followed by westone, then M6 Pro (Westone cable is slightly better than M6 Pro). Hope this helped!


----------



## Migun

Hello everyone !

 I don't know if this is the best place, but I need some advice.
  
 My IM50 are starting to fail in one side (the problem is in the connection of the earphone and the cable, new cable won't resolve) and I would like to buy something better (and more reliable, they started failing within 9 months).
  
 My history with IEM has been with CX 300 (dead), the IM50 and the Pistons 2 (as backup).
  
 The only thing I ask, is to be available in Europe on a reliable seller (that gives the EU 2 year warranty).
  
 Are the CKX9 comparable, what about Sennheiser CX 5 ?

 Thank you !


----------



## gearofwar

ljokerl said:


> I have one but I don't know if I want to review it - it's in that awkward category of high-end basshead IEMs and just doesn't sound that good for how expensive it is. Not sure when I would recommend someone spend $700 on it.


 
 How would you compare it to JH13FP?  I have a friend, he has Z5 and seems to praise it alot, consider it better than alot of iem and hp. We never had a chance to try or compare ours. Thanks in advance.


----------



## ljokerl

migun said:


> Hello everyone !
> 
> I don't know if this is the best place, but I need some advice.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I enjoyed the IM50 very briefly and thought it had a nicely balanced, smooth sound. I don't have a CKX9 but I have a CKX5, which is more in-line with the tuning of a Piston 2 than an IM50. The higher-end CKX models are meant to be even more bass-heavy than my CKX5. If you're looking to stay with a more IM50-like sound then you're probably looking for something more balanced, like a Philips Fidelio S2 (hopefully available in the EU, Philips being a European company). There's also RHA, with a 3-year warranty, but their more balanced T20 model is rather pricey. The ~$120 MA750i is quite a good all-rounder, though, if a bit bass-heavy a-la Piston 2.
  


gearofwar said:


> How would you compare it to JH13FP?  I have a friend, he has Z5 and seems to praise it alot, consider it better than alot of iem and hp. We never had a chance to try or compare ours. Thanks in advance.


 
  
 They're not really comparable - the JH13FP is a relatively balanced earphone, some coloration but not much more than something like a GR07 or Sony EX1000. The Z5 is warm and very bassy. The only custom I have that's reminiscent of that type of sound signature is the enhanced-bass quad from Gorilla Ears (the GX-4b: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/gorilla-ears-gx-4b/), and even then the Z5 is bassier, warmer, darker, and not as clear. Compared to the JH13 there's a night and day difference in balance and overall clarity, but again they're really not competitors. If someone were looking for a high-end custom that sounds more like the Z5, the Westone ES5 or Heir 8.A would be better options signature-wise.


----------



## gearofwar

ljokerl said:


> They're not really comparable - the JH13FP is a relatively balanced earphone, some coloration but not much more than something like a GR07 or Sony EX1000. The Z5 is warm and very bassy. The only custom I have that's reminiscent of that type of sound signature is the enhanced-bass quad from Gorilla Ears (the GX-4b: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/gorilla-ears-gx-4b/), and even then the Z5 is bassier, warmer, darker, and not as clear. Compared to the JH13 there's a night and day difference in balance and overall clarity, but again they're really not competitors. If someone were looking for a high-end custom that sounds more like the Z5, the Westone ES5 or Heir 8.A would be better options signature-wise.


 
 Thanks for reply. If I get it right, JH13FP has better detail and texture?
 Do you use aftermarket cable? would you recommend an upgrade cable for JH13? I currently have Ted Litz silver cable, i dont know if there is anything else better for it


----------



## ljokerl

gearofwar said:


> Thanks for reply. If I get it right, JH13FP has better detail and texture?
> Do you use aftermarket cable? would you recommend an upgrade cable for JH13? I currently have Ted Litz silver cable, i dont know if there is anything else better for it


 
  
 Yes, by a good margin. Heavy bass is just not that conducive to overall detailing.
  
 Sorry, aftermarket cables aren't really my thing.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the HiFiMan RE300h below. 
  
 The most up-to-date IEM ranking can be found here.
  


> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> *(3A95) **HiFiMan RE300h*
> 
> ...


----------



## boybandista

I'm currently looking for a replacement for my RE-400, which unfortunately has given up on me. As I always wear them over-the-ear, the wire near the strain relief broke off. Of course it had to be because of that poorly designed stain relief.
  
 From your list, it seems that the Brainwavz B2 and Rockit R-50 are some of the IEMs which offer the most bang-for-buck in terms of sound. However, the build quality on these two seems questionable. Any chance that there is a universal IEM with a similar sound but better build quality and removable cables, without doubling the price? 
  
 I'm also eyeing the Aurisonics Rocket with its tank-like build (though no removable cables). My concern though is Aurisonic's sound sig, which from what I've read is really "dark". Would you put it along the likes of the HD650 (which I really liked)? Or something even darker?


----------



## iamxLn

hey joker any plans to do the fidue a73?


----------



## krelianx

boybandista said:


> I'm currently looking for a replacement for my RE-400, which unfortunately has given up on me. As I always wear them over-the-ear, the wire near the strain relief broke off. Of course it had to be because of that poorly designed stain relief.
> 
> From your list, it seems that the Brainwavz B2 and Rockit R-50 are some of the IEMs which offer the most bang-for-buck in terms of sound. However, the build quality on these two seems questionable. Any chance that there is a universal IEM with a similar sound but better build quality and removable cables, without doubling the price?
> 
> I'm also eyeing the Aurisonics Rocket with its tank-like build (though no removable cables). My concern though is Aurisonic's sound sig, which from what I've read is really "dark". Would you put it along the likes of the HD650 (which I really liked)? Or something even darker?


 


 I cannot recommend the Trinity Deltas enough.


----------



## peter123

krelianx said:


> I cannot recommend the Trinity Deltas enough.


 
 The Delta's soundsignature is not exactly in line whith the ones he's looking at.


----------



## krelianx

peter123 said:


> The Delta's soundsignature is not exactly in line whith the ones he's looking at.


 
 Ah, true. Also, they are not really an over-the-ear design.


----------



## peter123

krelianx said:


> Ah, true. Also, they are not really an over-the-ear design.


 
 They can be, I use mine over the ears


----------



## PoRidge

hi, joker. i am looking for an upgrade in ciem. i have experienced the custom advantage through a reshell and want to try a product designed to be custom. from the your reviews the 1964 v6 stage and the miracle should be quite similar in sound signature, yet having a 350 difference in price. i might as well spend that 300 on a better player(i am buying a new one anyway). with the um site down for such a long time and the increase in price to 1049, would it be better to consider the jh13 instead? or just be happy with v6s? thanks


----------



## Behzad Rassa

Hi Joker,
  
 Thnx for all the work. I want to buy a new iem which is an upgrade to my Fischer Audio Consonance. I have some very nice iems which are reviewd good here, but i really like the thick and full sound of the consonance with my edm music.
 I already have the following iems:
  
 Pistons  2 and 3
 Yamaha EPH 100
 Sony mhc1
 JVC HA fx 101
 FA Consonance
  
 I thought the eph100 would be a nice upgrade, but i have fitting problems with those. I cant get a good seal and i have tried lots of tips. I have smaller ear canals and iems with a big nozzle are a no go sadly enough. even if they fit, i dun like them because they are not comfortable.
  
 Can you suggest an upgrade to the FA consonance. specially a full and thick sound with good bass and smaller nozzzles please?


----------



## Ellis

I'm sending back my RHA MA750i for repair, but thinking of selling the replacement once it arrives, and picking up something with a different sound signature.
  
 I feel like the 750 is pretty warm and quite V-shaped, and I'd be willing to give up the relaxed sound and the bass in favour of something more neutral. My desktop headphones are the Sennheiser HD 600, and that's currently my favourite sound. So what's the IEM equivelant?
  
 The Etymotic HF5 seems quite appealing - seems like the sound I'm looking for, apparently has legendary isolation (a big plus for me), can have custom eartips made for it, and is fairly comparable in price to the 750i. I do enjoy the build quality, warranty, and customer service of RHA, so another pair feels like a nice option, but I've heard varying reports about the T20 (and the T10 doesn't sound like my cup of tea). Some say that it's very neutral, others say that it's a natural upgrade from the 750, which I would not consider to be very neutral.
  
 Any other suggestions or thoughts on the above?
  
 Thanks


----------



## ljokerl

boybandista said:


> I'm currently looking for a replacement for my RE-400, which unfortunately has given up on me. As I always wear them over-the-ear, the wire near the strain relief broke off. Of course it had to be because of that poorly designed stain relief.
> 
> From your list, it seems that the Brainwavz B2 and Rockit R-50 are some of the IEMs which offer the most bang-for-buck in terms of sound. However, the build quality on these two seems questionable. Any chance that there is a universal IEM with a similar sound but better build quality and removable cables, without doubling the price?
> 
> I'm also eyeing the Aurisonics Rocket with its tank-like build (though no removable cables). My concern though is Aurisonic's sound sig, which from what I've read is really "dark". Would you put it along the likes of the HD650 (which I really liked)? Or something even darker?


 
  
 The Audio-Technica ATH-IM02 is a balanced-sounding BA earphone with detachable cables. Not double the price of a B2/R-50, either. It has a pretty flat sound more akin to the B2/R-50 (or better yet, the Audio-Technica CK90PRO) than to the RE-400.
  
 The Aurisonics Rockets are more similar to the RE-400. They really don't sound dark to me, but they have very smooth and slightly laid-back treble and relatively forward mids. The HD650 sounds warmer in comparison - the Rockets really aren't very warm, just somewhat mid-focused and smoothed-out in the treble. 
  


iamxln said:


> hey joker any plans to do the fidue a73?


 
  
 Yes, eventually. I already have a pair but it's currently over at InnerFidelity for measurements.
  


poridge said:


> hi, joker. i am looking for an upgrade in ciem. i have experienced the custom advantage through a reshell and want to try a product designed to be custom. from the your reviews the 1964 v6 stage and the miracle should be quite similar in sound signature, yet having a 350 difference in price. i might as well spend that 300 on a better player(i am buying a new one anyway). with the um site down for such a long time and the increase in price to 1049, would it be better to consider the jh13 instead? or just be happy with v6s? thanks


 
  
 They're slightly different in sound presentation, with the V6-Stage being more laid-back and quite well-balanced like the Miracle, and the JH Audios being more aggressive and forward. If you're interested in the Miracle it certainly makes more sense to save $350 and go with the V6-Stage than spend the extra cash on the JH13. 
  


ellis said:


> I'm sending back my RHA MA750i for repair, but thinking of selling the replacement once it arrives, and picking up something with a different sound signature.
> 
> I feel like the 750 is pretty warm and quite V-shaped, and I'd be willing to give up the relaxed sound and the bass in favour of something more neutral. My desktop headphones are the Sennheiser HD 600, and that's currently my favourite sound. So what's the IEM equivelant?
> 
> ...


 
  
 The T20 is just not a neutral earphone. It's way more neutral than the T10, which is a good start, but it has fairly heavy bass and somewhat emphasized highs (less so on the +Bass setting, but then you get even more bass). I do agree that it's a nice upgrade to the MA750, but in terms of overall balance it can't touch the HF5. Plus, Etymotic customer service is nothing to frown at either - they've always done right by me. 
  
 Keep in mind that a BA IEM like the HF5 won't sound as smooth and full-bodied as the HD600, but as long as you go into it with an open mind I think you'll enjoy it. The HD600 is one of my all-time favorite full-size headphones and I've always liked the BA-based Etymotics, so there's a good chance you'll like them too. You do have lots of other options in the current market, but Etys are worth experiencing.


----------



## Behzad Rassa

HI Joker,
  
 thnx for all the work man. Can you maybe help me out with choosing a new iem pls? I already have several nice ones but i would like to have an upgrade to my Fischer Audio Consonance. I really like the full and thick sound of those for edm music.
 I already have the following iems:
  
 Pistons 2 and 3
 Sony MHC1
 Ha Fx101
 EPH 100
 and the FA Consonance offcourse
  
 I thought the eph100 would be a nice upgrade but i have fitting problems with those...I have tried lots of tips, but i cant get a good seal..iems with big nozzles are a no go for me because of my small ear canal i think. Could you please sugest a good upgrade for the consonance?
 Specially something with a nice full and thick sound with good bass extension for edm music.


----------



## james444

boybandista said:


> I'm also eyeing the Aurisonics Rocket with its tank-like build (though no removable cables). My concern though is Aurisonic's sound sig, which from what I've read is really "dark". Would you put it along the likes of the HD650 (which I really liked)? Or something even darker?


 


ljokerl said:


> The Aurisonics Rockets are more similar to the RE-400. They really don't sound dark to me, but they have very smooth and slightly laid-back treble and relatively forward mids. The HD650 sounds warmer in comparison - the Rockets really aren't very warm, just somewhat mid-focused and smoothed-out in the treble.


 
  
 I agree on the Rockets being slightly mid-focused, but not particularly warm or dark.
  
 As for an IEM equivalent of the HD650, I recently heard the Radius HP-NHR21 which I quite liked, and they somewhat reminded me of the Senns.


----------



## jant71

X2, the Rockets are pretty straight laced and not really warm nor cold. It is the exception to the warmer Aurisonic house signature.
  
 Maybe the Radius TWF would make a good Senn-like options, perhaps the TWF31. Not too dark or warm and yet balanced with a piezo in there for the highs??


----------



## ljokerl

behzad rassa said:


> HI Joker,
> 
> thnx for all the work man. Can you maybe help me out with choosing a new iem pls? I already have several nice ones but i would like to have an upgrade to my Fischer Audio Consonance. I really like the full and thick sound of those for edm music.
> I already have the following iems:
> ...


 
  
 Hmm... more conventional form factor than EPH-100 with a sound somewhat like the thick and dark-ish consonance but better overall quality. That's a tough one but what comes to mind is the Alpha & Delta AD01. It's not a bass monster by any means and doesn't match the Fischer's sound sig that well, but it'll fit nicely in with what you have and is the best upgrade to the Consonance I can think of with a conventional form factor.


----------



## Ellis

ljokerl said:


> The Audio-Technica ATH-IM02 is a balanced-sounding BA earphone with detachable cables. Not double the price of a B2/R-50, either. It has a pretty flat sound more akin to the B2/R-50 (or better yet, the Audio-Technica CK90PRO) than to the RE-400.
> 
> The Aurisonics Rockets are more similar to the RE-400. They really don't sound dark to me, but they have very smooth and slightly laid-back treble and relatively forward mids. The HD650 sounds warmer in comparison - the Rockets really aren't very warm, just somewhat mid-focused and smoothed-out in the treble.
> 
> ...


 
 Awesome, thanks. Sounds like the T20 would be nice, but not what I'm looking for right now if they are close to the MA750's sound signature, rather than being balanced. It seems like RHA are doing a lot right but still not managing to cater to people wanting a nice balanced IEM. Maybe the T30 
  
 I will definitely pick up the HF5 then. Sounds like a 'must listen' pair. I've not had a BA earphone before, though I would never expect an IEM to sound as good in every regard as the HD 600. When you say that a BA IEM won't sound as smooth and full-bodied, are you using that to talk about any IEM, or saying that dynamics (or perhaps multiple-armatures?) would be a better option in that regard? I thought most high-end IEMs used BA drivers but I might be remembering wrong there.


----------



## Zelda

ljokerl said:


> The Audio-Technica ATH-IM02 is a balanced-sounding BA earphone with detachable cables. Not double the price of a B2/R-50, either. It has a pretty flat sound more akin to the B2/R-50 (or better yet, the Audio-Technica CK90PRO) than to the RE-400.


 
 how you find it compared to the CK10?


----------



## ljokerl

ellis said:


> Awesome, thanks. Sounds like the T20 would be nice, but not what I'm looking for right now if they are close to the MA750's sound signature, rather than being balanced. It seems like RHA are doing a lot right but still not managing to cater to people wanting a nice balanced IEM. Maybe the T30
> 
> I will definitely pick up the HF5 then. Sounds like a 'must listen' pair. I've not had a BA earphone before, though I would never expect an IEM to sound as good in every regard as the HD 600. When you say that a BA IEM won't sound as smooth and full-bodied, are you using that to talk about any IEM, or saying that dynamics (or perhaps multiple-armatures?) would be a better option in that regard? I thought most high-end IEMs used BA drivers but I might be remembering wrong there.


 
  
 I actually meant specifically single armature IEMs like the HF5. It's a generalization with exceptions like most, and do keep in mind there are pros and cons to having a leaner or thicker presentation, so it's not necessarily a bad thing.
  


zelda said:


> how you find it compared to the CK10?


 
  
 Very balanced but darker/not as bright and a little thicker than the CK10. It's more similar to the CK90PRO of the same generation than the CK10.


----------



## bretemm

I just got the Klipsch X11i and they sound great with my Valhalla2/Bifrost DS, I'm already noticing more details and a stereo sound.


----------



## Ellis

ljokerl said:


> I actually meant specifically single armature IEMs like the HF5. It's a generalization with exceptions like most, and do keep in mind there are pros and cons to having a leaner or thicker presentation, so it's not necessarily a bad thing.
> 
> 
> Very balanced but darker/not as bright and a little thicker than the CK10. It's more similar to the CK90PRO of the same generation than the CK10.


 
 Ah okay, I think that was going to be my best guess for what you meant 
  
 Well, it certainly sounds like they're worth trying at the price. Sadly, they don't seem to be sold in many places in the UK. etymoticdirect.co.uk lists them as out of stock (I'd rather get the straight HF5 than the HF2, which is in stock) but I e-mailed them to ask if they have an ETA. Otherwise, it looks like I'd have to pay a signficant amount more, or get them shipped from Japan


----------



## boybandista

ljokerl said:


> The Audio-Technica ATH-IM02 is a balanced-sounding BA earphone with detachable cables. Not double the price of a B2/R-50, either. It has a pretty flat sound more akin to the B2/R-50 (or better yet, the Audio-Technica CK90PRO) than to the RE-400.
> 
> The Aurisonics Rockets are more similar to the RE-400. They really don't sound dark to me, but they have very smooth and slightly laid-back treble and relatively forward mids. The HD650 sounds warmer in comparison - the Rockets really aren't very warm, just somewhat mid-focused and smoothed-out in the treble.


 
  
  


jant71 said:


> X2, the Rockets are pretty straight laced and not really warm nor cold. It is the exception to the warmer Aurisonic house signature.
> 
> Maybe the Radius TWF would make a good Senn-like options, perhaps the TWF31. Not too dark or warm and yet balanced with a piezo in there for the highs??


 
  
 Dammit, just checked the retail price of IM-02s here in our country and was surprised that it's priced at ~$350 USD. For reference, the Aurisonics Rockets and Kicker are locally priced at US $260, B2 at US $140, RE-600 at US $230 and RE-400 at US $95. It seems AT sets are steeply priced here.
  
 At $350, I might as well get a Sony XBA-A3 a Dunu DN-2000 (though they are more of "fun" sounding). Would you agree?


----------



## bretemm

Has anyone used the x11i? Are they good with bass?


----------



## PoRidge

ljokerl said:


> The Audio-Technica ATH-IM02 is a balanced-sounding BA earphone with detachable cables. Not double the price of a B2/R-50, either. It has a pretty flat sound more akin to the B2/R-50 (or better yet, the Audio-Technica CK90PRO) than to the RE-400.




do you think the im-02 is slightly coloured with female vocals sound better. male voices sound younger and some of its details gets smoothed over. or it may be just my unit not burned in?


----------



## jant71

boybandista said:


> Dammit, just checked the retail price of IM-02s here in our country and was surprised that it's priced at ~$350 USD. For reference, the Aurisonics Rockets and Kicker are locally priced at US $260, B2 at US $140, RE-600 at US $230 and RE-400 at US $95. It seems AT sets are steeply priced here.
> 
> At $350, I might as well get a Sony XBA-A3 a Dunu DN-2000 (though they are more of "fun" sounding). Would you agree?


 

 Get the Sony A2 because the A3 might have too much bass and not enough balance. The A2 is the more balanced one and Shenzen audio sells them for $190 shipped worldwide if that is an option. http://www.shenzhenaudio.com/sony-xba-a2-hi-res-hybrid-3-way-driver-system-stereo-audio-earphone.html
  
 Or maybe the latest XBA for closer to the IM and B2...http://www.accessoryjack.com/sony-xba-300ap-balanced-armature-in-ear-headphones-black.html


----------



## omastic

jant71 said:


> Get the Sony A2 because the A3 might have too much bass and not enough balance. The A2 is the more balanced one and Shenzen audio sells them for $190 shipped worldwide if that is an option. http://www.shenzhenaudio.com/sony-xba-a2-hi-res-hybrid-3-way-driver-system-stereo-audio-earphone.html
> 
> Or maybe the latest XBA for closer to the IM and B2...http://www.accessoryjack.com/sony-xba-300ap-balanced-armature-in-ear-headphones-black.html


 
 That is not true. A2 has significantly more bass and a warmer sound compared to the A3. None of the sony iems are particularly well balanced in terms of neutrality IMO, but people are saying the new XBA 300 has reduced the bass presence of A3 while retaining the very good mids and highs so that might be a better option.


----------



## ljokerl

boybandista said:


> Dammit, just checked the retail price of IM-02s here in our country and was surprised that it's priced at ~$350 USD. For reference, the Aurisonics Rockets and Kicker are locally priced at US $260, B2 at US $140, RE-600 at US $230 and RE-400 at US $95. It seems AT sets are steeply priced here.
> 
> At $350, I might as well get a Sony XBA-A3 a Dunu DN-2000 (though they are more of "fun" sounding). Would you agree?


 
  
 That is quite steep. IM02 and DN-2000 are not exactly competitors due to different sound tuning, but either way I'd have trouble putting up $350 for the IM02 when the B2 is available at $140. Prices are very different in the US.
  


bretemm said:


> Has anyone used the x11i? Are they good with bass?


 
  
 They just sounded like an X10 (which has plenty of bass for a BA) to me. No changes to the tuning as far as I know.
  


poridge said:


> do you think the im-02 is slightly coloured with female vocals sound better. male voices sound younger and some of its details gets smoothed over. or it may be just my unit not burned in?


 
  
 I don't know how to put it in terms of vocal "age" but the IM02 is a little darker compared to more conventional analytical IEMs like an Ety ER4 or a Brainwavz B2.


----------



## boybandista

ljokerl said:


> That is quite steep. IM02 and DN-2000 are not exactly competitors due to different sound tuning, but either way I'd have trouble putting up $350 for the IM02 when the B2 is available at $140. Prices are very different in the US.
> 
> 
> I don't know how to put it in terms of vocal "age" but the IM02 is a little darker compared to more conventional analytical IEMs like an Ety ER4 or a Brainwavz B2.


 
  
 With my search for "bang-for-buck" IEMs, I've stumbled upon a local store which offers the VSonic GR07 @ USD 120 and FLC 8S (which you've praised highly in your review) @ USD 320. 
  
 I'd take it that the GR07 is more of a sidegrade than an upgrade from the RE-400, right?
  
 And the 8S, while being more than double the price of the B2, I guess makes up with the better build quality, removable cables, and of course, better overall sound presentation. I guess I'll live with a V- or U-shaped sound sig that the 8S might have, as I have my HD600 for more "reference" listening sessions.
  
 I guess between the two, I'll just get the 8S and be done with this IEM search craze.


----------



## krelianx

boybandista said:


> With my search for "bang-for-buck" IEMs, I've stumbled upon a local store which offers the VSonic GR07 @ USD 120 and FLC 8S (which you've praised highly in your review) @ USD 320.
> 
> I'd take it that the GR07 is more of a sidegrade than an upgrade from the RE-400, right?
> 
> ...




I have owned both the re400s and the gr07s. I would say the vsonics are an upgrade. I think the re-400s are the most overrated iems ever. They have excellent mids, and very controlled treble. But they are very narrow in soundstage, congested, lacking clarity and resolution, and above all they havea pitiful lack of bass. 

The gr07 are a bit less refined in the mids and on top but they are substantially more bassy, with better impact, more forward sound, wider soundstage, and clearer. I didnt realize how underwhelming the re-400s really were for long.


----------



## ljokerl

boybandista said:


> With my search for "bang-for-buck" IEMs, I've stumbled upon a local store which offers the VSonic GR07 @ USD 120 and FLC 8S (which you've praised highly in your review) @ USD 320.
> 
> I'd take it that the GR07 is more of a sidegrade than an upgrade from the RE-400, right?
> 
> ...


 
  
 It really depends on what you're looking for. I tend to prefer the GR07 to the RE-400 but they have different strengths and weaknesses. Either way, the FLC8 is a better upgrade and a good buy at that price. It will be more v/u-shaped than the HD600, RE-400, and B2, but you can vary the severity with the tuning filters.


----------



## rymd

jant71 said:


> X2, the Rockets are pretty straight laced and not really warm nor cold. It is the exception to the warmer Aurisonic house signature.
> 
> Maybe the Radius TWF would make a good Senn-like options, perhaps the TWF31. Not too dark or warm and yet balanced with a piezo in there for the highs??


 
  
 woooahoh there's a TWF-31? Have you actually heard it? I can't find anything about it with search.


----------



## bolmeteus

Do you  have plans on reviewing the VE Dukes anytime soon? I have it and for the price it sounded remarkable! It is a birght and sensitive IEM, but you can try it with different tips and get the sound you like.


----------



## ljokerl

bolmeteus said:


> Do you  have plans on reviewing the VE Dukes anytime soon? I have it and for the price it sounded remarkable! It is a birght and sensitive IEM, but you can try it with different tips and get the sound you like.


 
  
 Yeah, but currently I've sent it to InnerFidelity for measurements. It sounded a little bright to me as well.


----------



## bolmeteus

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, but currently I've sent it to InnerFidelity for measurements. It sounded a little bright to me as well.




Okay, waiting eagerly for your opinions on it. Also, the VE Zen2.0 are on the horizon, even though I don't think this thread covers it.


----------



## whiteknave2

Hi there,
  
 Besides the obligatory new members post, this is my first real post here.
  
 I apologize in advance for the length.
  
 I don't know if any of you are familiar with "The Piano Guys," but their song titled "Cello Song" is a beautiful bit 'o music. As the name implies there's a plethora of cellos, and other stringed instruments that build and soar throughout the piece.
  
 Why did I bother mentioning this?
  
 Through my HD 598s there's a fullness and warmth present in every brush of bow on string (here's my man card), and a sweet sort of clarity that manages to be heard even through the Sen Veil. Owing to their open back design there's a great amount of airiness / separation and treble that just sort of "sings." Oh and the sound stage, wow.
  
 I'm looking for an IEM (price: sub $200*) that can deliver a similar sound signature.
  
 I own a set of Havi B3 Pro 1s (I run them amped through a NX 1) and while I am blown away by what they manage in terms of sound stage and quality they just "feel" too. . .dry? Almost too clean and analytical maybe? They lack that BIG lush and liquid fullness that I'd like to have. THIN! There we go, the note presentation is on the lean and thin side. Again, great IEMs, and not even just "for the price." They just aren't doing it for me.
  
 I know there are some compromises to be made between a set of full over the ear cans and a pair of iems. I'm willing to make them - just not at the expense of the over all desired sound sig.
  
 If it helps these are some of the genres I listen to (with a few examples to boot!):
  
 Acapella - (Straight No Chasers "The Nutcracker," Pentatonix "Mary Did You Know?")
 Contemporary instrumental and classical
 Acoustic
 Female vocals - (example: Sarah Mclachlans' cover of "Blackbird," Mama Cass "Dream a Little Dream, etc. . .")
 Crooners - (Sinatra, Martin, Crosby, Como. . .)
 Some Rock and Alt - (From Floyd to The Cure, from Cheap Trick to C.C.R, from Weezer to Imagine Dragons. . .)
 Soft Rock - Neil Diamond,* America, The Grassroots. . .
  
_As for the asterisks (ahem) in order:_
  
*1.)* The dollar amount I'm willing to spend can be adjusted a bit as necessitated
  
*2.) *Yes, Neil Diamond. Don't judge. You listen to him too.
  
 The End
  
 - Nate
  
*PS: *If this post was all over the place. . .I'm a new father. Translation: WHAT IS THIS _*SLEEP*_ THING YOU SPEAK OF!?!?


----------



## AstralStorm

In case someone is curious about Philips Fidelio S2 as I were, they're quite great, if splashy.
 However, it turns out it's all only in frequency response - relatively easy to follow even on a limited EQ.
 Fixing this issue also vastly improves soundstage, opening it up.
  
 The fit as with all half-in ear designs is tricky... oh, and they work the best in my experience with Sony MHC1 medium soft silicone tips, probably also other Sony Hybrid tips. These tame the tubby bass and reduce the splash somewhat - probably due to narrower nozzle.
 Both of included Comply kill the air and plain don't fit well at the required shallow insertion depth for me - they can rotate and then the foam obstructs the nozzle.
  
 I found that these very much want a good amplifier, or they get splashier and less controlled. Plus the lack of efficiency requires driving portable device outputs nearly to maximum.
 The in-line microphone produces very nice quality sound, it is relatively directional, but could be slightly more efficient. Cable noise is well handled.
  
 The most interesting thing I found is that these have some kind of minijack that produces a lot less channel crosstalk than most everything I tried. Crossfeed is highly recommended.
  
 They can easily compete with the likes of Hifiman RE-400 and RE-600, unless you're allergic to fit - and I think win even without correction. With the right tips, the originally tubby bass becomes pretty controlled and not at all warm, just the right quantity. It's a bit rounder than what orthos produce, but otherwise very high quality. Detailing is precise and on point, no smoothing over flaws.
  
 Here's a correction chart, remarkably simple:


----------



## ljokerl

bolmeteus said:


> Okay, waiting eagerly for your opinions on it. Also, the VE Zen2.0 are on the horizon, even though I don't think this thread covers it.


 
  
 Yeah, I'll do the VE Duke but not the earbuds.
  


whiteknave2 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> Besides the obligatory new members post, this is my first real post here.
> 
> ...


 
  
 You don't even need to spend a lot, really. I would get the opposite of the Havi B3 (as far as balanced-sounding IEMs go) - the HiFiMan RE-400. It's still very neutral but just mid-focused enough to sound fluid and musical rather than dry and analytical. The RE600 is also within your budget and actually fits your description a little better than the RE-400, but the difference is so marginal that I wouldn't bother.


----------



## joooe

Hi. Newbie here.
Just a quick question. Are the in ear Yamaha EPH-100 still a good choice? Or are there other options in the same price range and sound characteristics?
Thanks.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

joooe said:


> Hi. Newbie here.
> Just a quick question. Are the in ear Yamaha EPH-100 still a good choice? Or are there other options in the same price range and sound characteristics?
> Thanks.




Yep still my every day daily driver. Awesome IEM for electronic music.


----------



## naddm

@AstralStorm,
 Thanks for correction chart, it sure did remove the harshness.


----------



## Ymer

Hey there,

Would you say the ER4S still remain the #1 choice for classical music (symphonies, vocal, piano, opera)?

I want real bad to get rid of that sensation that no matter the volume, it's never loud enough. I also really value soundstaging.

Thank you!


----------



## Tom22

ljokerl said:


> Yeah, I'll do the VE Duke but not the earbuds.
> 
> 
> You don't even need to spend a lot, really. I would get the opposite of the Havi B3 (as far as balanced-sounding IEMs go) - the HiFiMan RE-400. It's still very neutral but just mid-focused enough to sound fluid and musical rather than dry and analytical. The RE600 is also within your budget and actually fits your description a little better than the RE-400, but the difference is so marginal that I wouldn't bother.


 
  
  


whiteknave2 said:


> Hi there,
> 
> Besides the obligatory new members post, this is my first real post here.
> 
> ...


 
  
  I would agree with @ljokerl maybe another alternative is the brainwavz r3? I would put them right up there with the re400 (its certainly much more reliable (construction wise) with the thicker cables (almost rope-like) and the robust metal housing.
  
 sound signature wise I would say its slightly bassier > re400. with a slight warmer tilt as a result.
  
 it has a wider soundstage, then the somewhat smaller presentation on the re400
  
 but the biggest issue may come from fit (it has a rather odd design), with thick and long nozzles, so they may not fit everyone comfortably
  
 also the heavy and long cables may detract some users as well.


----------



## ericr

ymer said:


> Hey there,
> 
> Would you say the ER4S still remain the #1 choice for classical music (symphonies, vocal, piano, opera)?
> 
> ...




64 Audio (formerly 1964 Ears) with ADEL technology.


----------



## PoRidge

ericr said:


> 64 Audio (formerly 1964 Ears) with ADEL technology.




will the adel tech sacrifice isolation ?


----------



## PotatoEars

Question, are the GR06's still being produced or something? Some sites says they discontinued it (LendmeURears has refurb but... refurb), and some still have stock(Penonaudio, by the way...). Can anyone confirm this? I would like to buy brand new GR06 cuz I'm really afraid of used hahaha
  
 Cheers


----------



## whiteknave2

Tom, and Joker

First: Holy Goodness! You both actually read that jumbled up mess of a post?! You two are far more patient than most. 

Second: Thank you for taking the time and consideration to recommend both the RE400 and the R3. I'll start with the former and go from there 

Again, thank you.

- Nate

Ps: Now I only need to find the right dynamic sort of sound signature for movie watching.


----------



## kova4a

potatoears said:


> Question, are the GR06's still being produced or something? Some sites says they discontinued it (LendmeURears has refurb but... refurb), and some still have stock(Penonaudio, by the way...). Can anyone confirm this? I would like to buy brand new GR06 cuz I'm really afraid of used hahaha
> 
> Cheers


 
 Yeah, gr06 has been discontinued for a couple of years or so.


----------



## ljokerl

joooe said:


> Hi. Newbie here.
> Just a quick question. Are the in ear Yamaha EPH-100 still a good choice? Or are there other options in the same price range and sound characteristics?
> Thanks.


 
  
 Yep, still highly recommended as far as I'm concerned: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/ 
  


ymer said:


> Hey there,
> 
> Would you say the ER4S still remain the #1 choice for classical music (symphonies, vocal, piano, opera)?
> 
> ...


 
  
 TBH that sounds like you'd prefer something with more of a loudness EQ curve, say an FLC Technology FLC8. Not as neutral as an ER4S, but it won't have that slightly flat (dynamics-wise) feel of the Etys that you seem to dislike. 
  


tom22 said:


> I would agree with @ljokerl maybe another alternative is the brainwavz r3? I would put them right up there with the re400 (its certainly much more reliable (construction wise) with the thicker cables (almost rope-like) and the robust metal housing.
> 
> sound signature wise I would say its slightly bassier > re400. with a slight warmer tilt as a result.
> 
> ...


 
  
 R3 is always a good RE-400 alternative. This is pretty much exactly my take on it; I only shy away from recommending it more often due to the tricky fit and slightly higher price.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the Popclik Evolo, an inexpensive IEM designed for the Latin American market. 
  
 The most up-to-date IEM ranking can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3B45) Popclik Evolo*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## imackler

I went ahead and got the ATH-IM02, based on your recommendation. I was initially disappointed with the amount of hiss I had, both from my Sansa Clip+ and my E07K. Both have relatively low output impedance; the Clip is 1 and the E07K is .3. But today I tried it through my Magni 2 and the background was totally black; the output impedance is only .2. I've been really enjoying them. Fit, comfort and isolation are fantastic...and the sound is quite balanced. Cymbals seem a little too splashy, but that would be the only thing I've been able to express any complaint about so far. Except the hiss! 
  
 Do you have any recommendations in the under $200 realm for portable amps or dac/amp combos (even daps) that are black with sensitive iems like the ATH-IM02? I thought the E07K would have been fine. At 32 ohms, I'm not sure why the ATH-IM02 is acting this way.


----------



## hitme987

Hey joker! Good to see you still active from such a long time. Your last suggestion was spot on for me and truly loved the audiophile experience till date!

 I am using a Vsonic GR07 Bass Edition as per your suggestion, though the bass is less for my liking, I add up +8db bass in my Fiio X3 player and the bass is perfect for my liking with so much amazing instrument separation and detailing (PS have a Fiio E11 amp to boost too but prefer x3 boost is good enough)
  
 Recently my GR07 BE is starting to break, giving disturbance while twisting cable/headphone jack, looks like cable is deteriorating.
  
 I would like to buy a new IEM with budget around 250$. So, what do you think would be a good upgrade to GR07 BE? I would love to have the same signature (added bass would be good too considering it doesn't impact other factors much). Or do you prefer me to buy another GR07 BE?
  
 Shall I up my budget and go for Ultimate Ears 900S?

 Thanks again and hats off to your contribution to the community.

 Regards!


----------



## peter123

hitme987 said:


> Hey joker! Good to see you still active from such a long time. Your last suggestion was spot on for me and truly loved the audiophile experience till date!
> 
> 
> I am using a Vsonic GR07 Bass Edition as per your suggestion, though the bass is less for my liking, I add up +8db bass in my Fiio X3 player and the bass is perfect for my liking with so much amazing instrument separation and detailing (PS have a Fiio E11 amp to boost too but prefer x3 boost is good enough)
> ...




Funny thing, I was just listening to the BE's on the X3 when reading your post 

I put the bass up to +8 and here's what I was thinking:

Although I'm certainty no |joker| I'd strongly suggest that you check out the LZ A2's. They sound exactly like what you're loking for just with even deeper sub-bass.

http://www.head-fi.org/t/786210/new-3-way-hybrid-ba-dd-iem-lz-a2-including-dd-a1


----------



## ljokerl

imackler said:


> I went ahead and got the ATH-IM02, based on your recommendation. I was initially disappointed with the amount of hiss I had, both from my Sansa Clip+ and my E07K. Both have relatively low output impedance; the Clip is 1 and the E07K is .3. But today I tried it through my Magni 2 and the background was totally black; the output impedance is only .2. I've been really enjoying them. Fit, comfort and isolation are fantastic...and the sound is quite balanced. Cymbals seem a little too splashy, but that would be the only thing I've been able to express any complaint about so far. Except the hiss!
> 
> Do you have any recommendations in the under $200 realm for portable amps or dac/amp combos (even daps) that are black with sensitive iems like the ATH-IM02? I thought the E07K would have been fine. At 32 ohms, I'm not sure why the ATH-IM02 is acting this way.


 
  
 Hiss is not necessarily proportional to output impedance. My OPPO has a higher output impedance (around 1 Ohm I believe) and it's pretty silent. 
  
 I don't have any audiophile DAPs or decent amps in the $200 range, unfortunately. Just some old Sansa and Cowon players. Maybe someone else can recommend something with a very low noise floor for sensitive BA in-ears. 
  


hitme987 said:


> Hey joker! Good to see you still active from such a long time. Your last suggestion was spot on for me and truly loved the audiophile experience till date!
> 
> I am using a Vsonic GR07 Bass Edition as per your suggestion, though the bass is less for my liking, I add up +8db bass in my Fiio X3 player and the bass is perfect for my liking with so much amazing instrument separation and detailing (PS have a Fiio E11 amp to boost too but prefer x3 boost is good enough)
> 
> ...


 
  
 The UE900 has less bass than a GR07 BE, so it doesn't seem to be what you're looking for. You don't really have a ton of options under $250 that will have at least as much bass as a GR07 BE and don't yield to the GR07s significantly in some other way. Sound is a cohesive thing, so adding bass is never "free" - it affects other aspects of the sound. The DUNU DN-1000 may be an option - I think aside from overall balance (mids are more recessed) and maybe soundstage width it doesn't have disadvantages vs the GR07 BE. It also has a little more bass (mostly sub-bass). Otherwise I'd just go for another GR07 BE.


----------



## ozkan

hitme987 said:


> Hey joker! Good to see you still active from such a long time. Your last suggestion was spot on for me and truly loved the audiophile experience till date!
> 
> 
> I am using a Vsonic GR07 Bass Edition as per your suggestion, though the bass is less for my liking, I add up +8db bass in my Fiio X3 player and the bass is perfect for my liking with so much amazing instrument separation and detailing (PS have a Fiio E11 amp to boost too but prefer x3 boost is good enough)
> ...




Audio Technica ATH-CKR9 may fit the bill.


----------



## listen4joy

hey ljokerl will you review the Dunu DN2000J?


----------



## derrickmarvel

ozkan said:


> Audio Technica ATH-CKR9 may fit the bill.


 

 I've seen CKR9 being recommend a lot for those looking to replace their R07 and since I found one (used) for a good price, I'm contemplating of getting it. But from the looks of it, the fit might be finicky or stuff. Also, I prefer to wear it over the ear. What's your opinion about the fit / comfort?


----------



## ozkan

derrickmarvel said:


> I've seen CKR9 being recommend a lot for those looking to replace their R07 and since I found one (used) for a good price, I'm contemplating of getting it. But from the looks of it, the fit might be finicky or stuff. Also, I prefer to wear it over the ear. What's your opinion about the fit / comfort?




You cannot wear it over the ear style unfortunately but it doesn't have fit problems unless you have very small ears.The fit is not finicky by any means.


----------



## ljokerl

listen4joy said:


> hey ljokerl will you review the Dunu DN2000J?


 
  
 Yeah but honestly I don't know what the big deal is compared to the regular DN-2000 so it hasn't been too high up on my priority list. I think the Titan 1 is a more important earphone since it is a more unique sound tuning that fills an interesting market niche.


----------



## d marc0

imackler said:


> I went ahead and got the ATH-IM02, based on your recommendation. I was initially disappointed with the amount of hiss I had, both from my Sansa Clip+ and my E07K. Both have relatively low output impedance; the Clip is 1 and the E07K is .3. But today I tried it through my Magni 2 and the background was totally black; the output impedance is only .2. I've been really enjoying them. Fit, comfort and isolation are fantastic...and the sound is quite balanced. Cymbals seem a little too splashy, but that would be the only thing I've been able to express any complaint about so far. Except the hiss!
> 
> Do you have any recommendations in the under $200 realm for portable amps or dac/amp combos (even daps) that are black with sensitive iems like the ATH-IM02? I thought the E07K would have been fine. At 32 ohms, I'm not sure why the ATH-IM02 is acting this way.




Jds labs c5 is great for sensitive Ba IEMs. Not necessarily pitch black but heaps better than most amps. Have used it with SD2, Noble 4, Savant, t-peos h200/300, FAD IV, XBA1/3, and the likes... No excessive hiss issues.


----------



## garcsa

Win MEElec M6     https://www.facebook.com/355696204638100/photos/a.365338800340507.1073741828.355696204638100/454420834765636/?type=3


----------



## Za Warudo

Hi Joker, a friend needs a IEM partly for running.  It needs to have good isolation, in-line mic and iphone controls, and be under $80.  I'm guessing it needs to be fairly comfortable, durable, and be able to worn over ear.  I've looked at some choices that fall under the criteria, which include:
  
 UE600vi
 trinity hyperion or techne
 A151p 2nd gen
 RE400i
 Etymotic er7/mc3
 Fidue a65
  
 Do you think any of these are a good fit, or have any better recommendations?  Thanks!


----------



## Shawn71

za warudo said:


> Hi Joker, a friend needs a IEM partly for running.  It needs to have good isolation, in-line mic and iphone controls, and be under $80.  I'm guessing it needs to be fairly comfortable, durable, and be able to worn over ear.  I've looked at some choices that fall under the criteria, which include:
> 
> UE600vi
> 
> ...




And you just cant go wrong recommending the one which is just above your query(post) either looking at your criteria......just add a suffix P to it.
it.


----------



## peter123

za warudo said:


> Hi Joker, a friend needs a IEM partly for running.  It needs to have good isolation, in-line mic and iphone controls, and be under $80.  I'm guessing it needs to be fairly comfortable, durable, and be able to worn over ear.  I've looked at some choices that fall under the criteria, which include:
> 
> UE600vi
> 
> ...




I personally enjoy IEM's with quite good bass presence when working out. If you feel the same you could probably remove the UE600, a151p and RE400 from the list. Although they're all great their bass presence is not very good.

Since you're in the US I'd suggest checking out the Phonak Audeo PFE012 that can be had for ridiculously low price for what it delivers these days. Although they're far from bass cannons they've got more presence than the IEM's I've mentioned above in addition to great fit, isolation and overall sound.


----------



## esteebin

za warudo said:


> Hi Joker, a friend needs a IEM partly for running.  It needs to have good isolation, in-line mic and iphone controls, and be under $80.  I'm guessing it needs to be fairly comfortable, durable, and be able to worn over ear.  I've looked at some choices that fall under the criteria, which include:
> 
> UE600vi
> 
> ...



Westone Adventure Series Beta can be had for $40 on buydig.com
They have great isolation, nice strong bass, can be worn cable down or up, water resistant, AWACS reflective cable for night running, detachable cable, mic with 3-buttons (for idevice). I use it mostly at work in a biotech research lab and need to keep only one in ear because I need to hear machines and coworkers. The ADV beta is overbuilt for my specific purpose but the ability to manipulate volume/play/pause without taking out my iPod touch under the lab coat is a plus. The cable is on the longer side which is good when routing under the shirt and into a pants pocket.


----------



## vipervick

Ok metal heads, I need your help. I love my M-Duo's for IEM's, but their structural design is flawed. Where the cord enters the earbud cavity is reinforced by a rubber grommet. The grommet only has a groove that pops into the body, it's not solid. After using them every day, the grommet is loose.  
  
 I wear them under my motorcycle helmet, therefore I need good noise isolation. I've tried 2 different replacements now and they both failed horribly. The wind buffeting my helmet creates a lot of noise. I do have T-400 foam tips that seem to help.
  
*Requirements*
 1. Good isolation
 2. Fast and tight bass - Metal music
 3. Fit under a helmet
 4. Solid construction
 5. Less than $100


----------



## ozkan

vipervick said:


> Ok metal heads, I need your help. I love my M-Duo's for IEM's, but their structural design is flawed. Where the cord enters the earbud cavity is reinforced by a rubber grommet. The grommet only has a groove that pops into the body, it's not solid. After using them every day, the grommet is loose.
> 
> I wear them under my motorcycle helmet, therefore I need good noise isolation. I've tried 2 different replacements now and they both failed horribly. The wind buffeting my helmet creates a lot of noise. I do have T-400 foam tips that seem to help.
> 
> ...




May I suggest Etymotic MK5? It fits all your criterias.


----------



## vipervick

ozkan said:


> May I suggest Etymotic MK5? It fits all your criterias.


 
 Good call, I'll have to check those out. Thanks!


----------



## Sweden

vipervick said:


> Ok metal heads, I need your help. I love my M-Duo's for IEM's, but their structural design is flawed. Where the cord enters the earbud cavity is reinforced by a rubber grommet. The grommet only has a groove that pops into the body, it's not solid. After using them every day, the grommet is loose.
> 
> I wear them under my motorcycle helmet, therefore I need good noise isolation. I've tried 2 different replacements now and they both failed horribly. The wind buffeting my helmet creates a lot of noise. I do have T-400 foam tips that seem to help.
> 
> ...


 
  
 JVC FXD70 with a deep over ear fit and these cheap eartips http://www.ebay.com/itm/black-Large-Medium-Small-Size-Memory-Foam-Tips-Eartips-for-most-earbuds-/171968149823?hash=item280a19b93f:g:~uwAAOSwAYtWKvFm
 Deep bass is above neutral but fast and controlled. The drivers are capable of some fantastic speed, clarity and detail for this price and still have a very exciting sound. Great for metal.
 Amazing build quality and really good isolation. Really deep fit though.


----------



## thug behram

My DUNU DN-1000 broke. Looking to replace. Can spend up to $500 but would rather not.

I like v-shaped sound with nice instrument separation and soundstage. 

The Fostex TH600/900 is the perfect full-size sound Sig for me.

Any recommendation?


----------



## Koolpep

thug behram said:


> My DUNU DN-1000 broke. Looking to replace. Can spend up to $500 but would rather not.
> 
> I like v-shaped sound with nice instrument separation and soundstage.
> 
> ...


 

 JVC HA-FX850 comes closest to TH900 to my ears.
  
 Cheers,
 K


----------



## nati8056

Hey Joker
I have earphones Dunu dn 1000, and I really like the sound quality and bass ( I'll be honest ן prefer deeper bass But that's not what bothered me most).
I do not like the isolation of dunu, because it is not good When I was on the bus and it is uncomfortable earphones in the ear.

Could you please recommend me a good earphones like dunu dn1000 but comfort and good isolation?
Budget from 100 $ to 300 $
(I do not want custom earphones)


Thank you!


----------



## garcsa

Happy Holidays!
  
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/331714726620?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649
  
 Try. Cheap. Worth. Let me say ---> Best.


----------



## nati8056

garcsa said:


> Happy Holidays!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



 



I can use them for the dudu Dn1000?


----------



## garcsa

Yep , DN 1000s Nozzle Diameter  is 5mm.
 Also you can use the spacer rings with Mandarines.
 Enjoy music!
  
 Free MEE M6 Clear:
  
 https://www.facebook.com/355696204638100/photos/a.365338800340507.1073741828.355696204638100/454420834765636/?type=3&theater
  
 Peace out!


----------



## iamxLn

Hey joker, can we expect an updated buyers guide by sound signature or is the list still accurate and a work in progress? It's incredibly helpful!


----------



## bretemm

What would a good IEM to use with a Fiio x1? I have the Klipsch x11i at 50ohms, but, 
They need more power and by itself the x1 dosnt seem to do too well, 
I'm now using a some klipsch at 15 ohms and it sounds better, but not as-detailed- as the x11i. 
Thanks


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Hope you can get hold of some First Harmonic IEB6, looking for warm to seeing your views on it.


----------



## Benik3

Hello guys, I'm here again 
  
 I'm searching for some IEM for my girlfriend 
 I would like some headphones with strong, deep and precise bas (she is "bass head"  ) but of course also with nice mids and highs (because she also like details in the songs  ).
  
 I have MOE-SS01, but they are too "sharp" and low bass for her. I have also Xiaomi pistons v3. The bass are relatively good, but the mids sound little "shaded" (without details).
  
 I would like something with price under 40$, but if it will be really worth, I will go higher...
  
 Any tips?
 Thanks a lot!


----------



## ozkan

benik3 said:


> Hello guys, I'm here again
> 
> I'm searching for some IEM for my girlfriend
> I would like some headphones with strong, deep and precise bas (she is "bass head"  ) but of course also with nice mids and highs (because she also like details in the songs  ).
> ...




I'd suggest looking into Rock Zircon. 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/780859/rock-zircon-mula-iem-impressions-thread

http://m.aliexpress.com/item/32497600045.html


----------



## Benik3

They looks nice.
 Only disadvantage is, that I can't by it directly in my country and from Amazon it says delivery dec21-jan7 so It's not sure if they come before Christmas :/


----------



## Lifted Andreas

benik3 said:


> They looks nice.
> Only disadvantage is, that I can't by it directly in my country and from Amazon it says delivery dec21-jan7 so It's not sure if they come before Christmas :/




You can't buy from AliExpress??


----------



## Benik3

I can. But from aliexpress it's at least 14days. And these days before Christmas it will be probably more...


----------



## ozkan

benik3 said:


> I can. But from aliexpress it's at least 14days. And these days before Christmas it will be probably more...




Where do you live?


----------



## Benik3

ozkan said:


> Where do you live?


 

 Czech Republic


----------



## ozkan

benik3 said:


> Czech Republic




You may ask for HongKong registered mail post. That would be faster than China registered mail I guess.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

benik3 said:


> I can. But from aliexpress it's at least 14days. And these days before Christmas it will be probably more...




Yeah you have to be prepared to wait a long time if you buy anything from AliExpress. Unless you wanna pay a massive amount of money for quick shipping. 




ozkan said:


> You may ask for HongKong registered mail post. That would be faster than China registered mail I guess.




Yeah it should be faster but only by a few days.


----------



## ljokerl

za warudo said:


> Hi Joker, a friend needs a IEM partly for running.  It needs to have good isolation, in-line mic and iphone controls, and be under $80.  I'm guessing it needs to be fairly comfortable, durable, and be able to worn over ear.  I've looked at some choices that fall under the criteria, which include:
> 
> UE600vi
> trinity hyperion or techne
> ...


 
  
 I tend to recommend sweat-resistant earphones for this. Balanced armatures are not known to take sweat that well. The Westones someone recommended above seem like they would be a good choice. I was unimpressed with the sound of the Adventure Alpha I've tried but back then they were well over $100. The Betas should be a better value.
  
 My personal go-to for this is the Audio-Technica ATH-CKX5iS but you can't wear it over the ear. And the MEElectronics M6 but it sounds like you're looking to spend more than $20.
  


vipervick said:


> Ok metal heads, I need your help. I love my M-Duo's for IEM's, but their structural design is flawed. Where the cord enters the earbud cavity is reinforced by a rubber grommet. The grommet only has a groove that pops into the body, it's not solid. After using them every day, the grommet is loose.
> 
> I wear them under my motorcycle helmet, therefore I need good noise isolation. I've tried 2 different replacements now and they both failed horribly. The wind buffeting my helmet creates a lot of noise. I do have T-400 foam tips that seem to help.
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Etymotics someone recommended previously seem like a good choice but make sure their housings aren't too long to fit under your helmet. They do stick out a bit when you wear them. Can't beat the isolation, though, and as long as you don't mind a balanced/accurate sound that's hard to beat as well.
  


thug behram said:


> My DUNU DN-1000 broke. Looking to replace. Can spend up to $500 but would rather not.
> 
> I like v-shaped sound with nice instrument separation and soundstage.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Not familiar with the Fostex, unfortunately. My favorite upgrade to the DN-1000 at the moment is the FLC Technologies FLC8. Its sound (in my preferred setting, but it's a tunable IEM) is more balanced but still v-shaped overall and the separation is great. It's also lighter/more comfortable than the DN-1000 and has replaceable cables. Hard to beat for the price.
  


nati8056 said:


> Hey Joker
> I have earphones Dunu dn 1000, and I really like the sound quality and bass ( I'll be honest ן prefer deeper bass But that's not what bothered me most).
> I do not like the isolation of dunu, because it is not good When I was on the bus and it is uncomfortable earphones in the ear.
> 
> ...


 
  
 For some reason bass-heavy earphones with great isolation aren't that common. Most of the high-end ones tend to be shallow-fit designs (e.g. Sennheiser, JVC, Sony).
  
 The Yamaha EPH-100 may be worth trying. It's at the bottom end of your price range but it isolates better than the vast majority of bass-heavy in-ears I've tried and it's hard to beat the bass depth it produces. 
  


iamxln said:


> Hey joker, can we expect an updated buyers guide by sound signature or is the list still accurate and a work in progress? It's incredibly helpful!


 
  
 I've been hard at work on a new guide for this holiday season, just haven't had the time to format/post it. It'll go live within the next few days 
  
 After that I will also update the main guide appropriately (i.e. by adding all the relevant items form the new guide)
  


benik3 said:


> Hello guys, I'm here again
> 
> I'm searching for some IEM for my girlfriend
> I would like some headphones with strong, deep and precise bas (she is "bass head"  ) but of course also with nice mids and highs (because she also like details in the songs  ).
> ...


 
  
 It's very hard to find a bassier earphone that also has better mids than the Piston 3 and all for under $40 (and available overseas). Maybe the Philips SHE3580/3590? They're unexciting but relatively common and the signature should be more suitable compared to the P3. The Nuforce NE-600X is an even better choice for this but it's probably not available to you locally.


----------



## Benik3

ljokerl said:


> It's very hard to find a bassier earphone that also has better mids than the Piston 3 and all for under $40 (and available overseas). Maybe the Philips SHE3580/3590? They're unexciting but relatively common and the signature should be more suitable compared to the P3. The Nuforce NE-600X is an even better choice for this but it's probably not available to you locally.


 
 Thanks for the reply!
  
 I found the NuFroce here in Czech, so I will go with them. They looks nice 
  
 Thank you very much


----------



## ljokerl

benik3 said:


> Thanks for the reply!
> 
> I found the NuFroce here in Czech, so I will go with them. They looks nice
> 
> Thank you very much


 
  
 That's surprising, I always had Nuforce pegged for a more niche US brand.
  
 Hope they do the trick!


----------



## nati8056

"
Originally Posted by ljokerl
For some reason bass-heavy earphones with great isolation aren't that common. Most of the high-end ones tend to be shallow-fit designs (e.g. Sennheiser, JVC, Sony).
 
The Yamaha EPH-100 may be worth trying. It's at the bottom end of your price range but it isolates better than the vast majority of bass-heavy in-ears I've tried and it's hard to beat the bass depth it produces.
"

Thanks for the your answer,
the Yamaha EPH-100 is it right for me? After all it doesnt the same league of dunu dnk.
I do not want to lose sound quality and the v-shaped that I like in dunu dnk, and just to get good insolation and bass.
I think to go for FLC8 As you have written are very high quality sound and go fot upgrate the dunu dnk, my question if i get better insolation than Dunu? Even a little?

Where can I buy a FLC8 on reliable store of $318 Like you wrote on the site?
and for FLC8 I need a amplifier?


sorry for my english.


----------



## vapman

XB90EX fit me great, have great comfort and A+++++ bass. they're actually surprisingly comfy given the size and isolate excellently.
  
 I have some comply TS200 tips on my XB90EX for extra isolation.


----------



## Trying2Learn

I don't know how the clarity of the Fidue A73 compares to the Dunu 1K, or the sound signature, as I have never tried the 1K, but I find the A73 isolate sufficiently. If you don't want to spend too much, the Fidue A73 may not be an upgrade, but it seems to offer good fit. The A73 is a hybrid Iem, does anyone know if that BA means it isolates better than a dynamic driver Iem? I'm really loving the A73. Joker, you've got to review them!


----------



## AznInvasion138

Hey joker! As always great stuff, tt's been a while since I was last on the forums and need some help replacing my Klipsch X10. I've had them for the past 3-4 years and they've performed really well for me. I like how they were very comfortable and had good punchy bass. Ideally i would like to find something that is also comfortable with a warm signature, bass is a must and preferably worn down as I take them on and off quite often. Price range is anywhere between $200 - $500. Not sure if I want to go to the CIEM route yet so that might be out of the question. I've previously had UE TF10, Monster Miles Davis, JVC FXZ200, and my full sized headphones are Denon D5000. Any recommendations would definitely be appreciated. Thanks!


----------



## derrickmarvel

J, I found this used ba200 for like usd 93 but Modded with 1500ohm filter. how do you think it will affect the sound? Also, is ba200 soundstage like lesser than r50's? super thanks. Others input are greatly welcome too.


----------



## ljokerl

nati8056 said:


> "
> Originally Posted by ljokerl
> For some reason bass-heavy earphones with great isolation aren't that common. Most of the high-end ones tend to be shallow-fit designs (e.g. Sennheiser, JVC, Sony).
> 
> ...


 
  
 The FLC8 is not that bass-heavy, nor does it isolate better than the DN-1000. It's a very good earphone and an excellent buy, but it doesn't fit your needs as stated. 
  
 You can buy it from lendmeurears.com
  


azninvasion138 said:


> Hey joker! As always great stuff, tt's been a while since I was last on the forums and need some help replacing my Klipsch X10. I've had them for the past 3-4 years and they've performed really well for me. I like how they were very comfortable and had good punchy bass. Ideally i would like to find something that is also comfortable with a warm signature, bass is a must and preferably worn down as I take them on and off quite often. Price range is anywhere between $200 - $500. Not sure if I want to go to the CIEM route yet so that might be out of the question. I've previously had UE TF10, Monster Miles Davis, JVC FXZ200, and my full sized headphones are Denon D5000. Any recommendations would definitely be appreciated. Thanks!


 
  
 To maximize comfort AND noise isolation with that particular sound signature you can't really do better than those Klipschs. You can consider the Yamaha EPH-100 but comfort is a maybe - for me it's very comfortable but it is larger than the X10 so that won't be the case for someone with narrower ear canals.
  
 Pretty much everything else I'm familiar with either isolates less than the X10, is much larger/less comfortable, or has less bass/warmth than the X10. Closest sets other than the EPH-100 I've tried that fit all three requirements are the Earsonics Velvet (too expensive) and Shure SE215 (doesn't sound better than the X10 and not necessarily more comfortable than the EPH-100). Neither can be worn cable-down, either. 
  


derrickmarvel said:


> J, I found this used ba200 for like usd 93 but Modded with 1500ohm filter. how do you think it will affect the sound? Also, is ba200 soundstage like lesser than r50's? super thanks. Others input are greatly welcome too.


 
  
 I wouldn't buy someone else's experiment unless it can be reverted to stock.
  
 The R-50 has an unusually wide soundstage but the BA200 is hardly a slouch - in stock form you may lose a little width compared to the R-50, but gain in imaging. I'd say it's a fair trade.


----------



## AznInvasion138

ljokerl said:


> To maximize comfort AND noise isolation with that particular sound signature you can't really do better than those Klipschs. You can consider the Yamaha EPH-100 but comfort is a maybe - for me it's very comfortable but it is larger than the X10 so that won't be the case for someone with narrower ear canals.
> 
> Pretty much everything else I'm familiar with either isolates less than the X10, is much larger/less comfortable, or has less bass/warmth than the X10. Closest sets other than the EPH-100 I've tried that fit all three requirements are the Earsonics Velvet (too expensive) and Shure SE215 (doesn't sound better than the X10 and not necessarily more comfortable than the EPH-100). Neither can be worn cable-down, either.


 
  
 Thanks for the response Joker! I know it's quite impossible to find something that is exactly the same isolation and comfort of the X10, could you recommend something that has a similar sound signature (warm, with a nice thumpy bass and forward mids smooth highs) that doesn't need the comfort or isolation of the X10?
  
 I have been looking at the Sennheiser IE800 for the longest time and was wondering if you had any experience with them? Also the JVC FX line popped into my head as I remembered they had one of the best bass signatures out there but the isolation wasn't the greatest? Let me know what you think!


----------



## nati8056

hi joker 
I see the headphones Yamaha EPH100 you recommended to me it really cheap (only $50 ) question whether it genuine?
And the reactions of the people in ebay say they have no bass at all!!!

see the Most relevant reviews>

http://www.ebay.com/itm/100-Genuine-Yamaha-EPH100-EPH-100-Stereo-Professional-Earphone-Headphone-Silver-/151895052685?hash=item235da6918d:g:I-wAAOSwEetV8qNf#rwid


----------



## ljokerl

wasaki said:


> I can't see where is the flare r2 PRO will stand btw these IEMs .
> 
> can I ask you JOKER. what did you think of in imaging , 3d heeadstage and vocals :
> could you rank them please :
> ...


 
  
 Out of those I've only tied the AF180 and the T20 and they sound nothing alike. So you really need to narrow it down based on what type of sound you want (balanced, bassy, bright, etc) before making a decision that could cost you $500. I would pick the AF180 for vocals and the $299 price is very nice if it comes with a warranty. However, it's not a bright earphone - the upper midrange is actually a bit subdued, almost smoothed-over, so if you don't like that sort of thing I wouldn't pick it but for me it's a very nice, smooth, level sound. 
  


azninvasion138 said:


> Thanks for the response Joker! I know it's quite impossible to find something that is exactly the same isolation and comfort of the X10, could you recommend something that has a similar sound signature (warm, with a nice thumpy bass and forward mids smooth highs) that doesn't need the comfort or isolation of the X10?
> 
> I have been looking at the Sennheiser IE800 for the longest time and was wondering if you had any experience with them? Also the JVC FX line popped into my head as I remembered they had one of the best bass signatures out there but the isolation wasn't the greatest? Let me know what you think!


 
  
 The IE800 can sound pretty v-shaped, it's a very different signature from the X10. It's a very good IEM, but not the first thing that comes to mind for forward mids and smooth highs. The FX700 is sort of the same way, and the bass is a little more dominant (especially compared to the X10, which isn't hugely bassy). If you want more bass than the X10, then yes, these are definitely worth considers.
  
 Otherwise I'd probably go IE8/IE80 over the IE800/FX700 for the signature you want. Two other things that come to mind are the warmer-sounding multi-BA monsters like the EarSonics SM64 (and Velvet if you can get a great deal on it) and Westone UM PRO 30 (or UM3X).
  
  


nati8056 said:


> hi joker
> I see the headphones Yamaha EPH100 you recommended to me it really cheap (only $50 ) question whether it genuine?
> And the reactions of the people in ebay say they have no bass at all!!!
> 
> ...


 
  
 There have been reports of counterfeit ones. I wouldn't risk it.

 With that said, a good number of IEM reviews online complain about lack of bass because a good percentage of the general public doesn't know how to wear IEMs properly.


----------



## iJay

I am looking for an IEM equivalent to Koss Porta Pros. They are the perfect sensitivity for my sources; Alien and iPod 5.5gen., and I like their tonality. Price point less than $150 ideally but that isn't a firm number. I currently have Senn IE4 and they hiss! Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

wasaki said:


> I like sound to be very rich with vocals ,very good bass  ,airy ,sparkle highs with huge headstage
> is there any iem has Immense stereo image ,Excellent balance and life like detail
> sound  natural like lcd 3 ?
> about AF180 can you compare them to ciem noble k 10 ? what's the diff. btw these two ?


 
  
 I don't have an LCD-3 or a Noble K10. You can find my full AF180 review on InnerFidelity, though: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/audiofly-af180-ear-monitor-reviewed#WgxC36rHiFbDJiQp.97
  


ijay said:


> I am looking for an IEM equivalent to Koss Porta Pros. They are the perfect sensitivity for my sources; Alien and iPod 5.5gen., and I like their tonality. Price point less than $150 ideally but that isn't a firm number. I currently have Senn IE4 and they hiss! Thanks!


 
  
 Someone asked this fairly recently. I think we settled on the Philips Fidelio S1/S2 and Havi B3 Pro I being good options to avoid hiss with such sources. They're a little more neutral compared to the warmer PortaPros, but not vastly different, and hiss shouldn't be a problem at all.


----------



## ljokerl

New IEM Buyer's Guide is posted for the holidays: http://theheadphonelist.com/2015-holiday-buyers-guide-the-most-gift-worthy-earphones-for-audiophiles-and-music-lovers/
  
 Tried to tackle a few of the more common recommendation requests received around this time in addition to the usual sound recommendations. A few previews of reviews still to come in there as well.


----------



## MikePortnoy

For audiophiles who want to get an affordable entry level custom monitor, my Eartech Triple Driver review has been posted:
  
http://www.head-fi.org/products/eartech-music-triple-driver-custom-molded-in-ear-musician-monitors-headphones/reviews/14773


----------



## PoRidge

ljokerl said:


> New IEM Buyer's Guide is posted for the holidays: http://theheadphonelist.com/2015-holiday-buyers-guide-the-most-gift-worthy-earphones-for-audiophiles-and-music-lovers/
> 
> Tried to tackle a few of the more common recommendation requests received around this time in addition to the usual sound recommendations. A few previews of reviews still to come in there as well.




thank you joker, i am just looking for a gift for christmas.


----------



## vipervick

ljokerl said:


> The Etymotics someone recommended previously seem like a good choice but make sure their housings aren't too long to fit under your helmet. They do stick out a bit when you wear them. Can't beat the isolation, though, and as long as you don't mind a balanced/accurate sound that's hard to beat as well.


 
  
 I tried triple flanges on my MEE Audio M-Duo's, but every damn time I took them out, the flanges stayed in my ear canal.... I needed to carry tweezers just to get them out!!!


----------



## kova4a

vipervick said:


> I tried triple flanges on my MEE Audio M-Duo's, but every damn time I took them out, the flanges stayed in my ear canal.... I needed to carry tweezers just to get them out!!!


 
 This doesn't happen with etymotic and you can use other tips if you worry about the tri-flanges but they are a tight fit and don't come off unless you want to


----------



## ljokerl

Last new review for the year - the crowd-funded dual-BA LIFE Headphones.
  
 As usual, the most up-to-date rating list can be found here.
  
 Happy holidays, everyone!
  


ljokerl said:


> *(1C26) LIFE Headphones*
> 
> 
> Added December 2015
> ...


----------



## nati8056

> nati8056 said:
> 
> 
> > hi joker
> ...


 
  
  
 Thank joker
 So Where are you recommend me buy the Ep1000?


----------



## ljokerl

Happy New Year, everyone! We're among the last to hit midnight here in California, but hopefully everyone has had a great night!
  


nati8056 said:


> Thank joker
> So Where are you recommend me buy the Ep1000?


 
  
 On Amazon (from Amazon.com and not a 3rd party seller, if possible). Stores with an offline presence should be fine too if they carry it (e.g. B&H)


----------



## RebeccaSugar

Wow!
  
 I've never seen so many reviews in one page.
  
 It looks like you're the Ult*IEM*ate reviewer!


----------



## justgotlucky123

Hey joker. Will you be reviewing the fidue a65? Or have you heard it already? If so, how does it compare to the fidue a63 or xiaomi pistons 2?


----------



## DecentLevi

I'm surprised it seems the word hasn't been spreading here about the VE monk earphones... $5 earbuds that seem to push far above their pricepoint. Here's some positive impressions on it. I would get them, if I could find a way to increase the isolation.


----------



## Lifted Andreas

nati8056 said:


> Thank joker
> 
> So Where are you recommend me buy the Ep1000?




Buy from AudioAffair.co.uk


They are authorised Yamaha retailer and ship worldwide with 2 year warranty!


----------



## nati8056

joker I think I'm giving up the isolation of headphones and I want something good like dunu dn1000 or better.

My headphones dunu d1000 destroyed today, and I think, or go back to dunu dn1000 or something better but i want bass and sound quality like dunu dn1000

I am debating whether to buy back the dunu dn1000 or having something better like dunu dn2000 or fcl8s. 

_and Because the cable of Dunu dn 1000 is torn me quickly, I prefer headphones with a strong cable what do you say about sony xba a3?_


Also I'm very undecided whether to go for the flc8s because of the good reviews. But really eph100 suitable to my needs, but I'm afraid not to lose the best and treble sound I had in dn1000 maybe make me not love God eph100


----------



## bretemm

Which I'd better? 
Sennheiser IE60 or RHA t20? 

There the same in price, 

I mainly listen to class rock and indie rock. I'm mainly using my fiio X1 now and accessionaly a ipod


----------



## Tom22

lifted andreas said:


> Buy from AudioAffair.co.uk
> 
> 
> They are authorised Yamaha retailer and ship worldwide with 2 year warranty!


 
 if your interested in nice bass with a full warm midrange maybe check out the Nuforce NE800M? it comes with a remote for smartphone calls with carbon fibre and bass earpieces
  
 i recently uploaded a review of them here:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/nuforce-ne800m/reviews/14981


----------



## ezekiel77

Just dropping by to say thanks, ljokerl for introducing the FLC8 in your review last year. I bought them based on your review and the novelty of a tunable IEM with a jawdropping 36 sigs. The updated FLC8S is finally picking up steam in Headfi, with a very active thread spearheaded by a few tours.


----------



## PoRidge

what will the 350th iem be? eagerly waiting.


----------



## Gandasaputra

I hope it'd be the JVC's HA-FXZ100/200. I'd hope that would be your 350th earphone (Note: But it is only available in Japan).


----------



## Love Music

Joker, I was thinking of buying the sm3 but was wondering if they stand up to newer universals in the same price range since they've been out for quite some time now. Is there anything sort of similar that performs better with similar sound and around the same price? (mid forward, wide soundstage, good bass, detailed and warm).


----------



## ljokerl

justgotlucky123 said:


> Hey joker. Will you be reviewing the fidue a65? Or have you heard it already? If so, how does it compare to the fidue a63 or xiaomi pistons 2?


 
  

 I have one, sent to InnerFidelity for measurements. But based on initial listening I thought it sounded like a slightly improved A63. Same basic signature, not more v-shaped like the Piston 2.
  


nati8056 said:


> joker I think I'm giving up the isolation of headphones and I want something good like dunu dn1000 or better.
> 
> My headphones dunu d1000 destroyed today, and I think, or go back to dunu dn1000 or something better but i want bass and sound quality like dunu dn1000
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sorry, this is very difficult to decipher, not sure I got the question right. If you like the bass quantity of the DN-1000, the DN-2000 and FLC8 may not be bassy enough. In most other ways they are better, but I always recommend the DN-1000 over them when enhanced bass is a strong priority.
  
 The EPH-100 gets you the bass, but it doesn't really keep up with the overall clarity and detailing of something like the DN-1000 or DN-2000 or FLC8. The XBA-H3 (haven't tried the XBA-A3) is more similar to the Yamahas in tuning but closer to the DN-1000 in overall performance. 
  


bretemm said:


> Which I'd better?
> Sennheiser IE60 or RHA t20?
> 
> There the same in price,
> ...


 
  
 I would take the T20 over the IE60 any day, but if you want a smoother, warmer sound or are very sensitive to upper mids/lower treble emphasis, that would be a reason to pick the Sennheisers. 
  


ezekiel77 said:


> Just dropping by to say thanks, ljokerl for introducing the FLC8 in your review last year. I bought them based on your review and the novelty of a tunable IEM with a jawdropping 36 sigs. The updated FLC8S is finally picking up steam in Headfi, with a very active thread spearheaded by a few tours.


 
  
 Hah, very glad to hear that! Still think these are very special IEMs, just wish they had wider availability.
  


poridge said:


> what will the 350th iem be? eagerly waiting.


 
  
 Unfortunately it won't be much of a surprise since I have already posted 355 or so reviews to TheHeadphoneList.
  


love music said:


> Joker, I was thinking of buying the sm3 but was wondering if they stand up to newer universals in the same price range since they've been out for quite some time now. Is there anything sort of similar that performs better with similar sound and around the same price? (mid forward, wide soundstage, good bass, detailed and warm).


 
  
 No, if you're looking for that sound signature the SM3 is still great. The SM64 is more capable and more accurate but it loses some of the SM3's uniqueness and that exact sound signature. And I haven't tried anything that I could say is an EarSonics substitute.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> No, if you're looking for that sound signature the SM3 is still great. The SM64 is more capable and more accurate but it loses some of the SM3's uniqueness and that exact sound signature. And I haven't tried anything that I could say is an EarSonics substitute.


 
 I see. Have you ever heard of the ATH-CKR9 before?  I kind of want a sound sig like that too, but an improved version and something over the ear and comfortable like the SM3 V2's.
  
 Thank you for your help.


----------



## ozkan

love music said:


> I see. Have you ever heard of the ATH-CK9 before?  I kind of want a sound sig like that too, but an improved version and something over the ear and comfortable like the SM3 V2's.
> 
> Thank you for your help.




CK9 or CKR9?


----------



## Love Music

ozkan said:


> CK9 or CKR9?


 
 Oh, my misake. I meant CKR9.


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> I see. Have you ever heard of the ATH-CKR9 before?  I kind of want a sound sig like that too, but an improved version and something over the ear and comfortable like the SM3 V2's.
> 
> Thank you for your help.


 
  
 No, I'm quite behind on Audio-Technica dynamics.


----------



## Love Music

ljokerl said:


> No, I'm quite behind on Audio-Technica dynamics.



I see. What about the IM series? Have you heard of the IM03? How does it compare with the sm3?


----------



## vipervick

So, it's really pissing me off. I put Comply small foam tips on my Piston 3's and the right foam tip keeps sticking in my ear when I pull the IEM out. How can I fix this?


----------



## Shawn71

vipervick said:


> So, it's really pissing me off. I put Comply small foam tips on my Piston 3's and the right foam tip keeps sticking in my ear when I pull the IEM out. How can I fix this?
> e=";




Replace with the M tips....


----------



## H20Fidelity

Before removal try pulling the IEM lightly 'downwards' to break the seal before sliding them out.


----------



## vipervick

shawn71 said:


> Replace with the M tips....


 
 I just ordered the P series. They said they have a smaller circumference so they fit tighter on the notch. They are also longer for better insertion. Boing!
  
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00RRD7XJE?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00


----------



## ljokerl

love music said:


> I see. What about the IM series? Have you heard of the IM03? How does it compare with the sm3?


 
  
 Only the IM02


----------



## listen4joy

iljoker you should review this new iem from MEE, they always has good products for price.
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/t/794787/mee-audio-pinnacle-p1-new-199-dynamic-driver-flagship


----------



## ozkan

Joker, please get your hands on the Audio Technica's new ATH-E series.


----------



## ljokerl

listen4joy said:


> iljoker you should review this new iem from MEE, they always has good products for price.
> 
> http://www.head-fi.org/t/794787/mee-audio-pinnacle-p1-new-199-dynamic-driver-flagship


 
  
 It looks like I'll maybe get one of these from InnerFidelity... 
  


ozkan said:


> Joker, please get your hands on the Audio Technica's new ATH-E series.


 
  
 Never seen those before. Do want.


----------



## Raketen

ozkan said:


> Joker, please get your hands on the Audio Technica's new ATH-E series.


 

if these can give me a sound similar to IM02 but in a shell that actually fits my ears I can't give Audio Technica my money fast enough 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 Just the other day was thinking of getting some of the old CK90Pro after reading Tomscy's comparison of the two on cymbacavum.
  
 Ah, nvm, no dual BA, only in 1xBA, 3xBA and ckr9 style dynamic... though driver count doesnt say that much, hopefully one will be close.


----------



## ljokerl

Added the RHA T20.
  
 As always, the most up-to-date IEM ranking can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(2A33) RHA T20 / T20i*
> 
> 
> Reviewed November 2015
> ...


----------



## ezekiel77

Very detailed comparos this time around, another good read.


----------



## PoRidge

wow,i was looking forward to your 350th review and this is really like a gift to me. i am right now searching for a pair of warmer iems to compliment my mostly analytical collections and the t20 is up my list. thank you joker, this review is just what i need.


----------



## vipervick

I'm looking at Etymotic for isolation. I listen exclusively to Metal and wear them under a motorcycle helmet.
  
 What is the difference between the MK5, HF5, and ER4, other than price?


----------



## soundstige

vipervick said:


> I'm looking at Etymotic for isolation. I listen exclusively to Metal and wear them under a motorcycle helmet.
> 
> What is the difference between the MK5, HF5, and ER4, other than price?


 
  
 The best way I can explain it is:
  

*ER4* is Etymotic's premier series, around $299. They offer higher detail retrieval, imaging, sound stage depth and width, etc., than any of their other IEM lines. In the ER4 line, there's:
*ER4P*, which is the ER4 driver with no additional electronics, has a smooth mid-centric sound
*ER4S*, which is the ER4 driver with added resistors, has a flat sound which Etymotic describes as "the most accurate"
*ER4B*, which is the ER4 driver with added resistors and capacitors, has a flat-to-treble enhanced sound which Etymotic describes as best suited for binaural recordings
  

*HF series* is Etymotic's mid-tier series, around $129. Many claim they are the same drivers as ER4P but without the stringent quality control that goes in the ER4, and a different shell which leads to slightly different sound. There is no definitive proof they use the same driver. I can confirm the HF series sounds like a considerably less-detailed ER4P. All HF series (HF4, HF5, etc.) sound the same and just use different cables.
  
*MC series* is Etymotic's premier dynamic series, though still aimed at the mid-range price, around $79. They are not very popular and seem like they're going to be discontinued eventually. They sound mostly like ER4P, though not as good IMO as HF series.
  
*MK series* is Etymotic's budget dynamic series, priced around $59. They are a very new product for the company. In my listening, they are tuned very much like the ER4S, with a flatter response giving more treble and decent bass response, whereas all others (ER4P, HF5, MC5, etc.) that I've heard are tuned for a more mid-centric sound like the ER4P.
  
 I wouldn't say any of them scream "awesome for metal" as they all go for a drier, more analytical soundscape, though the ER4 series is basically excellent at everything in absolute terms, aside from sub-bass response. Basically I would say there are better ways you could spend $299 than getting the ER4P exclusively for metal; but, not too many better ways to spend $299 getting the ER4P for a wide variety of music.
  
 Also, all of them have barrels that are over an inch long and protrude about 1/2" out of the ear. Not the best choice for helmet-wear. I would strongly recommend something with over-ear design and a shell that's formed to the general shape of the concha.
  
 I know I've given you this recommendation before, but I would definitely suggest the *MEE Audio P1* for metal and helmet use, far ahead of the Etymotic ER4 (which I still love dearly).


----------



## ericr

*Three-Hundred-Fifty*

Joker!
Joker!
Joker!
Joker!


About 10,000 of us say: THANK YOU!


----------



## Lifted Andreas

Would love to read your take on the new OnePlus Icons.


----------



## ljokerl

ezekiel77 said:


> Very detailed comparos this time around, another good read.


 


poridge said:


> wow,i was looking forward to your 350th review and this is really like a gift to me. i am right now searching for a pair of warmer iems to compliment my mostly analytical collections and the t20 is up my list. thank you joker, this review is just what i need.


 


ericr said:


> *Three-Hundred-Fifty*
> 
> Joker!
> Joker!
> ...


 
  
 Thanks, everyone! Had to skip a few to make the T20 #350, but it's an interesting IEM to be sure.
  
  


vipervick said:


> I'm looking at Etymotic for isolation. I listen exclusively to Metal and wear them under a motorcycle helmet.
> 
> What is the difference between the MK5, HF5, and ER4, other than price?


 
  
soundstige's post is great - way more detailed than mine would have been. I don't have much to add except that I too would not recommend getting an Ety for under-helmet use - with the long housings and angled strain relief they're really not the ideal shape. in addition to what soundstige recommended, I think the Aurisonics Rockets, or even a Yamaha EPH-100, would be a better choice if cable-up/ergonomic earphones aren't your thing. These IEMs isolate very well (not Ety-level, but close) and they don't stick as far out of the ear if you wear them deep enough.
  


lifted andreas said:


> Would love to read your take on the new OnePlus Icons.


 
  
 Great, another phone maker enters the fray


----------



## Raketen

Maybe Earsonics S-em2 ifi for motorcycle helmet... idk how they sound (have oop SM1) but Earsonics "clamshell" style is one of few IEM shapes that fit flush inside my ears... add some westone or comply foams & pretty good isolation too. Could get a linum cable if over-ear is a bother... almost like they're not there... on second thought, maybe removable cable isn't a great idea if sweat-prone.


----------



## vipervick

soundstige said:


> The best way I can explain it is:
> 
> 
> *ER4* is Etymotic's premier series, around $299. They offer higher detail retrieval, imaging, sound stage depth and width, etc., than any of their other IEM lines. In the ER4 line, there's:
> ...


 
 Wow, very detailed. Thank you so much.


----------



## Podster

Awesome work Joker, to call you a contributor is really an understatement!
  
 Cheers


----------



## Vidal

Hi Joker
  
 I actually found your site with realising your were on here as well. Many thanks for your reviews, on the back of your recommendations I've broadened my horizons to kit that isn't universally available in the UK.  I bought a few V-Sonics and even a JVC set and been pleased with the performance of all, especially the V-Sonic VC1000.
  
 I hope you'll get chance to give us your view on the Eightball and Flare Audio IEMs at some point.
  
 Thanks for all the hardwork


----------



## peter123

Congratulations on 350, very very respectful!

I was wondering if you've posted impressions on the Aurisonics Rockets somewhere? I've tried searching but couldn't find any.....


----------



## Lifted Andreas

ljokerl said:


> Thanks, everyone! Had to skip a few to make the T20 #350, but it's an interesting IEM to be sure.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




But but, they haven't fallen off mate. The icons are pretty special


----------



## Mojo777

The T20 just landed. What a great set of monitors. Digging Black Keys right now


----------



## bolmeteus

350 IEM reviews in ONE thread! Congratulations @ljokerl!


----------



## JDMJEramy

Thanks for posting!


----------



## ljokerl

podster said:


> Awesome work Joker, to call you a contributor is really an understatement!
> 
> Cheers


 
  
 Thanks, I appreciate that!
  


vidal said:


> Hi Joker
> 
> I actually found your site with realising your were on here as well. Many thanks for your reviews, on the back of your recommendations I've broadened my horizons to kit that isn't universally available in the UK.  I bought a few V-Sonics and even a JVC set and been pleased with the performance of all, especially the V-Sonic VC1000.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Seems the VC1000, while gone, is not forgotten!
  
 I treasure mine greatly - it's one of the all-time best values in the IEM world if you ask me. 
  


peter123 said:


> Congratulations on 350, very very respectful!
> 
> I was wondering if you've posted impressions on the Aurisonics Rockets somewhere? I've tried searching but couldn't find any.....


 
  
 They're scattered here and there but I haven't posted the full review yet. I completed one for InnerFidelity but ran into some issues when it came time to publish.
  
 Anyway, I'm still working on re-writing it for posting here.
  
 I like the Rockets a lot though, and included them in my most recent buyer's guide.. twice: http://theheadphonelist.com/2015-holiday-buyers-guide-the-most-gift-worthy-earphones-for-audiophiles-and-music-lovers/


----------



## peter123

ljokerl said:


> They're scattered here and there but I haven't posted the full review yet. I completed one for InnerFidelity but ran into some issues when it came time to publish.
> 
> Anyway, I'm still working on re-writing it for posting here.
> 
> I like the Rockets a lot though, and included them in my most recent buyer's guide.. twice: http://theheadphonelist.com/2015-holiday-buyers-guide-the-most-gift-worthy-earphones-for-audiophiles-and-music-lovers/


 
 Thanks Joker! My own pair arrived extremely fast so I've already had a copuple of days with them and my impressions equals yours: Great balanced sound, excellent built and comfort in addition to the IP65 water resistance. These will most certainly see a lot of use from me.


----------



## leovince

this thread is very difficult to backread


----------



## peter123

leovince said:


> this thread is very difficult to backread




Of course it is. It's over a thousand page's and moving towards 17,000 posts how could it not be.

If you're interested in the reviews the first post gives an excellent overview in my opinion......


----------



## leovince

peter123 said:


> Of course it is. It's over a thousand page's and moving towards 17,000 posts how could it not be.
> 
> If you're interested in the reviews the first post gives an excellent overview in my opinion......


 
 yeah right.


----------



## peter123

leovince said:


> this thread is very difficult to backread




What's that supposed to mean?

In my opinion I find it very rude to come in here as a new member and start to criticize one of the biggest contributions to this community......


----------



## leovince

peter123 said:


> What's that supposed to mean?
> 
> In my opinion I find it very rude to come in here as a new member and start to criticize one of the biggest contributions to this community......


 
 It didn't mean anything. I just said that because as a newbie, I find it hard to back read.


----------



## Podster

peter123 said:


> What's that supposed to mean?
> 
> In my opinion I find it very rude to come in here as a new member and start to criticize one of the biggest contributions to this community......


 

 Kids, I swear


----------



## Tom22

ljokerl said:


> Thanks, I appreciate that!
> 
> 
> Seems the VC1000, while gone, is not forgotten!
> ...


 
  


peter123 said:


> Thanks Joker! My own pair arrived extremely fast so I've already had a copuple of days with them and my impressions equals yours: Great balanced sound, excellent built and comfort in addition to the IP65 water resistance. These will most certainly see a lot of use from me.


 
  
 they certainly look compact but they are listed as under the "durability" section
  
 and seeing the abuse from I think it was a youtube video and such and from tyll's video too they look pretty sturdy
  
 but my question is the lack of strain relief in the housing (there is NONE) and being that they are a straight barrel housing, they cable will most definitely angle downwards (from the weight of the cable and jack and all)
  
 any concerns in regards to this area?
  
 also I've seen pictures that there isn't a LIP on the nozzle/housing, and heard incidents of the eartip being lodged in the ear. =( this was one of the reasons I was hesitant on the dunu 1000s


----------



## ljokerl

There's also an alternative way to navigate the front page of this thread: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/ developed because it was getting too unwieldy.
  


peter123 said:


> Thanks Joker! My own pair arrived extremely fast so I've already had a copuple of days with them and my impressions equals yours: Great balanced sound, excellent built and comfort in addition to the IP65 water resistance. These will most certainly see a lot of use from me.


 
  
 They've become my sole travel IEM - very small footprint in my luggage, very high isolation (stock tips or Comply T200s), durable build, and a generally smooth and pleasant sound well-suited for all sorts of use. Plus the sensitivity is low enough that they work decently well with in-flight multimedia systems. It's like they were made for travel


----------



## peter123

ljokerl said:


> They've become my sole travel IEM - very small footprint in my luggage, very high isolation (stock tips or Comply T200s), durable build, and a generally smooth and pleasant sound well-suited for all sorts of use. Plus the sensitivity is low enough that they work decently well with in-flight multimedia systems. It's like they were made for travel


 
 Yes, I do quite a bit of travelling myself and that was my intended use when I bought them. I've always had problems wearing IEM's on flights du to the cabin preasure, we'll see if the Rockets are any different in that regard. I'm going to be on an 11 hour flight from London to LA in a month time so that will be the ultimate test 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
 The day I picked them up from the post office I was on my way to the gym so I used them there for the first time and I'm quite sure that they'll be my regular gym/working out IEM as well. Yes I do lovew them


----------



## Raketen

tom22 said:


> but my question is the lack of strain relief in the housing (there is NONE) and being that they are a straight barrel housing, they cable will most definitely angle downwards (from the weight of the cable and jack and all)
> 
> also I've seen pictures that there isn't a LIP on the nozzle/housing, and heard incidents of the eartip being lodged in the ear. =( this was one of the reasons I was hesitant on the dunu 1000s


 
  
 There is strain relief, just is inside the housing, the cable is stiff enough it doesn't bend that sharply without applied pressure, nor prone to kinks at the cable entrance (has a thickish clear plastic coating that seems to help). I always use it with a shirt clip though. Can wear them over-ear with the antiloop as well. If still a concern, could reinforce it yourself with some heatshrink I guess?
  
 The housing has a detent for retaining tips- the problem has more to do with the sureseal tips, which live up to their name- its a soft pvc type material that almost sticks to the skin, forming a really strong seal and they can pull off inside the ear (this happens even when I use them on other inears with flared nozzle edges)- can also use most large nozzle style tips with these I think- I use JVC tips sometimes (coincidentally I like the aurisonics tips on jvc fxt90 a lot).


----------



## getclikinagas

peter123 said:


> ljokerl said:
> 
> 
> > They've become my sole travel IEM - very small footprint in my luggage, very high isolation (stock tips or Comply T200s), durable build, and a generally smooth and pleasant sound well-suited for all sorts of use. Plus the sensitivity is low enough that they work decently well with in-flight multimedia systems. It's like they were made for travel
> ...


 

 You guys are killing me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. First ljokerl hints that it *just may be* an upgrade to my beloved RE400. Then eke rides off into the setting sun with his "endgame IEM" And now all these reports on how it's all manners of perfect.
   
With the Fender acquisition, are the rockets "discontinued"? Only accessories through the Aurisonics site and no mention of the rockets on the fender site.


----------



## peter123

raketen said:


> There is strain relief, just is inside the housing, the cable is stiff enough it doesn't bend that sharply without applied pressure, nor prone to kinks at the cable entrance (has a thickish clear plastic coating that seems to help). I always use it with a shirt clip though. Can wear them over-ear with the antiloop as well. If still a concern, could reinforce it yourself with some heatshrink I guess?
> 
> The housing has a detent for retaining tips- the problem has more to do with the sureseal tips, which live up to their name- its a soft pvc type material that almost sticks to the skin, forming a really strong seal and they can pull off inside the ear (this happens even when I use them on other inears with flared nozzle edges)- can also use most large nozzle style tips with these I think- I use JVC tips sometimes (coincidentally I like the aurisonics tips on jvc fxt90 a lot).


 
 For some reason I missed the post from @Tom22 but this is a great post and I agree with everything in it. I'm actually wearing them over the ear without the antiloop without any problem but I'll try with them as well..........
  


getclikinagas said:


> You guys are killing me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 LOL! There's always the next thing 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 I'm actually not sure what will be kept by Fender and what's not but I'll guess/hope that more information will be available soon.


----------



## Trying2Learn

350 iems... Thats crazy, especially at the level of detail you review at. I got into Head-fi and the audio rabbit hole through this thread  a thank you from me and also "why u do dis" from the wallet. By the way, definitely try the Fidue A73 sometime.


----------



## Trying2Learn

In Joker's buying guide, under warm and smooth, it goes from the EPH-100 for $100 to the Earsonics Velvet which is like $700. I'm looking for something with a price more like $200? What are my options?


----------



## ljokerl

trying2learn said:


> 350 iems... Thats crazy, especially at the level of detail you review at. I got into Head-fi and the audio rabbit hole through this thread
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks!
  
 I have an A73, just need to spend more time with it. Fidue is really hitting a nice stride with their <$150 IEMs recently.
  


trying2learn said:


> In Joker's buying guide, under warm and smooth, it goes from the EPH-100 for $100 to the Earsonics Velvet which is like $700. I'm looking for something with a price more like $200? What are my options?


 
  
 I was never able to find a direct EPH-100 upgrade in that price range. Sony XBA-H3 is the closest I can think of, and that rarely drops below $250 (and also comes with some usability caveats thanks to its form factor vs the EPH-100).


----------



## james444

trying2learn said:


> In Joker's buying guide, under warm and smooth, it goes from the EPH-100 for $100 to the Earsonics Velvet which is like $700. I'm looking for something with a price more like $200? What are my options?




Flare Audio R2A and Radius HP-NHR21 come to mind...


----------



## ezekiel77

trying2learn said:


> In Joker's buying guide, under warm and smooth, it goes from the EPH-100 for $100 to the Earsonics Velvet which is like $700. I'm looking for something with a price more like $200? What are my options?




You can consider the ATH-CKR9 or ATH-IM70.


----------



## 1TrickPony

Anyone here had any luck comparing the rockets with say dunu titan-3?
If anything I can say the titan 3s are quite resolving in the mids and perhaps less smooth and more inclined towards energy. I haven't seen any Mid centric/focused iem shootout, bet that'd be fun!


----------



## Raketen

OK I have a request for some suggestions: Basically looking for a BA version of the Aurisonics Rockets, specifically in terms of toughness and very small size, preferably with an unfatiguing easy/smooth signature and low volume listening. ATM best candidates look like Jays Q-Jays and etymotic hf-2/5- but I'm not sure either of these has the smooth/non-fatiguing aspect. Audiofly and Shure looked like prospects sound-wise but also a little on the large size.


----------



## desutruction

How does XBA-A3 compare against Fidue A83? I'm trying to figure out the price I should pay for secondhand IEMs (gonna post for offers in a local group)
  
 Westone 4R 
 FLC8S
 Logitech UE900s 
 NuForce Primo 8 
 Shure SE535
 Fidue A83 
 Westone Pro 30/UM3xRC 
 Sennheiser IE8/IE80
 Oriveti Primacy 
 Sony XBA-A3
  
 Anything else I should consider? (Criteria for this is ~$500 with detachable cables)


----------



## PoRidge

desutruction said:


> How does XBA-A3 compare against Fidue A83? I'm trying to figure out the price I should pay for secondhand IEMs (gonna post for offers in a local group)
> 
> Westone 4R
> 
> ...




inear stagediver
campfire audio orion
mee p1
noble savent
audiofly


----------



## Trying2Learn

poridge said:


> inear stagediver
> campfire audio orion
> mee p1
> noble savent
> audiofly


Ooo nice P1 add in. I've been eyeing that. Hype train is going strong on that thread!


----------



## Waqar

trying2learn said:


> Ooo nice P1 add in. I've been eyeing that. Hype train is going strong on that thread!




Listening too them right now, and in my opninion belive the hype


----------



## PoRidge

waqar said:


> Listening too them right now, and in my opninion belive the hype




wondering how it compares to the flc8s. also the flc is also competitive at that price range.


----------



## Waqar

poridge said:


> wondering how it compares to the flc8s. also the flc is also competitive at that price range.




The fl8s cost 349$ at lendmeurears, the P1 costs 199$ there is a 150$ different. I have not heard the fl8s, i was gonna buy them but after i recived my P1 i did not felt the need for another iem cause i am soo satisfied with these out of my Fiio x7 i think that other iems in this price range would be a sidegrade then a direct upgrade at this moment but that is just my opinion not based on actul comparisons between these two. But if the fl8s sounds better then the P1 are they 150$ better and the fact that the P1 has a single dynamic driver makes me a little biased towards the P1 cause i like well enginered and tuned dynamic drivers. But there is no doubt the fl8s has the options for tuning the sound to youre liking is a great option and the people in the fl8s thread seems happy with the fl8s. But there is a user in the p1 thread that wrote that the p1 gets more eartime over the P1 but that could maybe the honemoon period or that he prefers the tonality of the P1 or it just could be alot of other factors. But i would loved to. Listen the fl8s so i can figure this myself. This is a question i would like someone could answer indepht


----------



## Raketen

Wonder if MEE will do a 'premium' BA iem too.


----------



## PoRidge

the only thing i hate about the p1 is the mmcx connector, but it could well be the first mmcx in my collection.


----------



## Waqar

poridge said:


> the only thing i hate about the p1 is the mmcx connector, but it could well be the first mmcx in my collection.




Yeah the connecter has me worried, i belive my fidue a83 had similar connector and it quit on me early on. Had to send it back to China for repairs. But the two years warranty on the P1 gives me a little peace of mind but i am still worried that the connector can go bad. I am thinking about using some tape or glue so it wont spin around that may extend its life?


----------



## Trying2Learn

Do your cables die, or the socket? MMCX cables aren't too expensive.


----------



## Waqar

trying2learn said:


> Do your cables die, or the socket? MMCX cables aren't too expensive.




It was the socket.


----------



## Trying2Learn

waqar said:


> It was the socket.


That's weird, cause the A83 socket doesnt allow for spinning, right?


----------



## Waqar

trying2learn said:


> That's weird, cause the A83 socket doesnt allow for spinning, right?





I dont remember that it was spinning or not been a long time, and barely used them. My Pinnacle p1 does spin so i asumed the a83 did the same.


----------



## Trying2Learn

waqar said:


> I dont remember that it was spinning or not been a long time, and barely used them. My Pinnacle p1 does spin so i asumed the a83 did the same.


"The detachable cables utilize MMCX connectors modified to stop them from rotating, which is something I found slightly annoying with a few other MMCX earphones such as the Shure SE535. Fidue does this using an extra pin on the outside of the connector. This results in the A83′s cable being incompatible with other MMCX earphones, but other manufacturers’ cables will still work with the A83." It seems like if you used the stock cable, it didnt rotate.


----------



## Waqar

trying2learn said:


> "The detachable cables utilize MMCX connectors modified to stop them from rotating, which is something I found slightly annoying with a few other MMCX earphones such as the Shure SE535. Fidue does this using an extra pin on the outside of the connector. This results in the A83′s cable being incompatible with other MMCX earphones, but other manufacturers’ cables will still work with the A83." It seems like if you used the stock cable, it didnt rotate.




Yes now i remember they did not rotate cause of the extra pin.


----------



## bretemm

I'm looking for a step up IEM from my Klipsch x11i,
Which iem in my list would be better? 
I'm going to be getting a FIIO x5ii or a Astell&kern DAP latter on. I mainly listen to indie rock and classic rock. 
I have the klipsch x11i as my main iem. 
I'm now looking at:

RHA t20i, 
JH Audio 
Noble Audio (3,4, or5)
Or
Astell&kern Rossie 

Thanks


----------



## thug behram

hi joker and others in this thread:

 - thoughts on the dunu dn-2000j? i couldn't find a review on it
 - what source do you guys use for iems? which DAP, which amp, etc.
 - is there a TRUE upgrade to the DN-1000, something that builds on the same sound signature?


----------



## Podster

thug behram said:


> hi joker and others in this thread:
> 
> - thoughts on the dunu dn-2000j? i couldn't find a review on it
> - what source do you guys use for iems? which DAP, which amp, etc.
> - is there a TRUE upgrade to the DN-1000, something that builds on the same sound signature?


 

 Here's a nice 2000J review for you
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/dunu-dn-2000j/reviews/13243


----------



## ljokerl

raketen said:


> OK I have a request for some suggestions: Basically looking for a BA version of the Aurisonics Rockets, specifically in terms of toughness and very small size, preferably with an unfatiguing easy/smooth signature and low volume listening. ATM best candidates look like Jays Q-Jays and etymotic hf-2/5- but I'm not sure either of these has the smooth/non-fatiguing aspect. Audiofly and Shure looked like prospects sound-wise but also a little on the large size.


 
  
 Rockets build quality is really on another level compared even to something like an HF5. Some of the old-school TWFK earphones (e.g. mainly the Audio-Technica CK10 and maybe the NOCS NS800 or the new q-JAYS) are the only small BAs I'd put on the same level for build quality, but those never sound as smooth as the Rockets.
  


bretemm said:


> I'm looking for a step up IEM from my Klipsch x11i,
> Which iem in my list would be better?
> I'm going to be getting a FIIO x5ii or a Astell&kern DAP latter on. I mainly listen to indie rock and classic rock.
> I have the klipsch x11i as my main iem.
> ...


 
  
 The RHA T20i and Noble 4 (the only ones on your list I've tried) aren't very similar to the X11i, so it's hard to call either a step up. The X11i has some bass enhancement and pretty relaxed highs. The T20i is more v-shaped and the Noble 4 is much flatter.
  


thug behram said:


> hi joker and others in this thread:
> 
> - thoughts on the dunu dn-2000j? i couldn't find a review on it
> - what source do you guys use for iems? which DAP, which amp, etc.
> - is there a TRUE upgrade to the DN-1000, something that builds on the same sound signature?


 
  
 1) I chose to skip the DN-2000J but there's plenty of reviews out there on it.
 2) Depends on who you ask - there's tons of possible (good) setups. I keep things simple with an Android phone + OPPO HA-2
 3) Depends on what you want improved. Something with an identical sound signature wouldn't really be different from the DN-1000. Sets like the DN-2000, FLC8, K3003, etc improve on it in meaningful ways while maintaining a slightly v-shaped profile.


----------



## Trying2Learn

My cousin is looking into a sub $50 iem, and he's looking for something with boosted bass. I recommended the VSD3S and he liked it but it went through the washer and didn't survive(which he was bummed about because his Earpods had survived many) and doesn't want to get another one for that reason. What are his options?


----------



## vapman

trying2learn said:


> My cousin is looking into a sub $50 iem, and he's looking for something with boosted bass. I recommended the VSD3S and he liked it but it went through the washer and didn't survive(which he was bummed about because his Earpods had survived many) and doesn't want to get another one for that reason. What are his options?


 

 The Bass IEM thread has some good recommendations, but not many under $50.
  
 KZ has some great offerings in the sub $30-40 price range with really nice bass but I always use an amp. there is a thread here just for KZ IEMs.


----------



## ozkan

trying2learn said:


> My cousin is looking into a sub $50 iem, and he's looking for something with boosted bass. I recommended the VSD3S and he liked it but it went through the washer and didn't survive(which he was bummed about because his Earpods had survived many) and doesn't want to get another one for that reason. What are his options?




Philips SHE3590, DIY IE800, **** UE. 

http://m.aliexpress.com/item/32489941823.html?tracelog=storedetail2mobilesitedetail

http://m.aliexpress.com/item/32506518312.html?productSubject=subject&detailNewVersion=2&adminSeq=224701538&productId=32506518312&productId=32506518312&shopNumber=1825606&tracelog=wwwdetail2mobilesitedetail


----------



## kosky

Hello, i would like ask you an opinion about some iems, since i am relatively new with iems i am a bit afraid of buying one by my only knowledge even because i do not have much to spend.. I am searching for a 400$ or less iem (or better a ciem) to couple with my ibasso dx80. Since now i found a lot of people talking good about custom art one and two or shure se525 and se425 or also kef m200.. i am used listen to elettronic music with huge bass and subbass or classical (less frequently though)
 I would be really thankful to everyone that will help me in any way


----------



## Joe Bloggs

ozkan said:


> trying2learn said:
> 
> 
> > My cousin is looking into a sub $50 iem, and he's looking for something with boosted bass. I recommended the VSD3S and he liked it but it went through the washer and didn't survive(which he was bummed about because his Earpods had survived many) and doesn't want to get another one for that reason. What are his options?
> ...




I can vouch that the Philips do survive being put through the washer! :tongue_smile:


----------



## supplehope

kosky said:


> Hello, i would like ask you an opinion about some iems, since i am relatively new with iems i am a bit afraid of buying one by my only knowledge even because i do not have much to spend.. I am searching for a 400$ or less iem (or better a ciem) to couple with my ibasso dx80. Since now i found a lot of people talking good about custom art one and two or shure se525 and se425 or also kef m200.. i am used listen to elettronic music with huge bass and subbass or classical (less frequently though)
> 
> I would be really thankful to everyone that will help me in any way




You may want to consider the Oriveti Primacy.
The FLC8s are also one of the most popular IEMs around that price range.
These two are only ones that I have tried and think of for your budget for now.


----------



## Shawn71

trying2learn said:


> My cousin is looking into a sub $50 iem, and he's looking for something with boosted bass. I recommended the VSD3S and he liked it but it went through the washer and didn't survive(which he was bummed about because his Earpods had survived many) and doesn't want to get another one for that reason. What are his options?




It seems he looking more into build quality than sound,to me..... he better be certain theres no earphones inside any clothes/bag before tossing them for a wash, if sound is also a primary reason and there are tons of choices in the sub$50 price bracket that you are lookin for.

Just like @vapman recommended, KZ is the first that comes to my mind,as they have most of their line-up under $15 with very reasonable build quality and -no complaint- sound offerings for their price being offered (different sound to meet different needs). If you stretch your budget a little further, you once again have more than handful offerings from easy earphones,tennmak etcetra to name (from aliexpress) , just like what @ozkan quoted,besides the very budget buddy she3590 (overall as a package, like sound isolation,price,form-factor)

Otoh, you may also want to take a look on "chinese/asian" thread (crowded) as well,here in head-fi where many could point you in right direction. Vsonic vsd2 series,piston 2,ostry kc06 are also some good candidates to consider,imo, if vsd3s sounded good to your cousin.

Edit: He...


----------



## B9Scrambler

Trying2Learn For a durable, good sounding iem that won't break the bank the RHA S500 should definitely be considered. It's a little colder sounding than the VSD3s but still has some good bass. One of the best iems in its price range imo.


----------



## ColonelBucket8

What about superlux hd381?


----------



## ljokerl

trying2learn said:


> My cousin is looking into a sub $50 iem, and he's looking for something with boosted bass. I recommended the VSD3S and he liked it but it went through the washer and didn't survive(which he was bummed about because his Earpods had survived many) and doesn't want to get another one for that reason. What are his options?


 
  
 It's hard to say how any particular IEM will do in the washer... I doubt it's a design criteria for manufacturers, especially those focused on the Head-Fi/audiophile market. There's a handful of water-resistant IEMs out there that would probably be more durable in this regard than average (e.g. the Mee M6 and Audio-Technica CKX5), and many more "regular" IEMs that may or may not outlast a VSD1S. I'm partial to the Xiaomi Piston 2 as an inexpensive, bass-boosted in-ear.
  


kosky said:


> Hello, i would like ask you an opinion about some iems, since i am relatively new with iems i am a bit afraid of buying one by my only knowledge even because i do not have much to spend.. I am searching for a 400$ or less iem (or better a ciem) to couple with my ibasso dx80. Since now i found a lot of people talking good about custom art one and two or shure se525 and se425 or also kef m200.. i am used listen to elettronic music with huge bass and subbass or classical (less frequently though)
> I would be really thankful to everyone that will help me in any way


 
  
 Tons of options out there in this price range but not all will be equally good for what you want. The SE535 and SE425 have little to no bass enhancement, for example, so they may not be what you're after. 
  
 Someone mentioned the FLC Technology FLC8 and I do think that's a good option here. In its enhanced-bass configuration(s) it has deep bass with more impact compared to something like an SE535/SE425, but still not overwhelmingly bass-heavy. It's about as Hi-Fi as enhanced-bass earphones in this price range get. Plus, it gives you the option of tweaking the sound tuning for better balance when you're listening to classical (or for any other reason).


----------



## Raketen

Quote:


ljokerl said:


> Someone mentioned the FLC Technology FLC8 and I do think that's a good option here. In its enhanced-bass configuration(s) it has deep bass with more impact compared to something like an SE535/SE425, but still not overwhelmingly bass-heavy. It's about as Hi-Fi as enhanced-bass earphones in this price range get. Plus, it gives you the option of tweaking the sound tuning for better balance when you're listening to classical (or for any other reason).v


 
 HBB actually just added the FLC8s to his basshead iem list http://www.head-fi.org/t/761433/the-best-iems-for-bass-are-the-iem-bass-club
 And pretty much all of the top 10 list is within that budget if you include used Aurisonics- I thought the 2.5s were very enjoyable for electronica, fx850 were one of my favorites for classical.
 I have not heard but Sony 800/7550 might also be good for classical since it is closely related to ex1000 which is my favorite.


----------



## kosky

Thank you so much, i was a little undecided about what to get, i was really about to buy gr07 then i reconsidered the FLC8S  I think i'll get them, i trust your experiences since i am a bit new with iems 
 Thank you again you have been so kind to me!
  


raketen said:


> HBB actually just added the FLC8s to his basshead iem list http://www.head-fi.org/t/761433/the-best-iems-for-bass-are-the-iem-bass-club
> And pretty much all of the top 10 list is within that budget if you include used Aurisonics- I thought the 2.5s were very enjoyable for electronica, fx850 were one of my favorites for classical.
> I have not heard but Sony 800/7550 might also be good for classical since it is closely related to ex1000 which is my favorite.


 
  
  


ljokerl said:


> It's hard to say how any particular IEM will do in the washer... I doubt it's a design criteria for manufacturers, especially those focused on the Head-Fi/audiophile market. There's a handful of water-resistant IEMs out there that would probably be more durable in this regard than average (e.g. the Mee M6 and Audio-Technica CKX5), and many more "regular" IEMs that may or may not outlast a VSD1S. I'm partial to the Xiaomi Piston 2 as an inexpensive, bass-boosted in-ear.
> 
> 
> Tons of options out there in this price range but not all will be equally good for what you want. The SE535 and SE425 have little to no bass enhancement, for example, so they may not be what you're after.
> ...


----------



## robm321

I had the FLC8s, sold them. Heard the GR07, and found the Pinnacle P1s better. Just my $.02.


----------



## tommo21

I have both Gr07 and Flc8s. Flc8s is far far better than GR07.


----------



## kylezo

So, I have been away for a long time, maybe two years? (About 7k posts in this thread, anyway, hah). I am looking for a new pair of iems and I'm just wondering how much the landscape has changed since I was experimenting last. I had a pair of Atrio M5s (MG7) which I loved, also owned FXT90s. I especially loved the lush presentation of the FXT90s, the dual dynamic driver setup was amazing for the price point. 

I was looking at another pair of them actually, but I figured I'm in a great position to experiment a bit right now. Budget is $100-$200us. So I was looking at: GR07, DBA-02 (/Brainwavz B2), HiFi RE400, ER-4S, RE272/262 R-50. I tend to prefer musicality and soundstage in my iems, I have no problem fussing with tips to get the right fit/isolation. I think that's part of why I loved the FXT90s so much, they had incredible dynamics for such a cheap option, and dual dynamic drivers, what the heck. I'm not super averse to a somewhat biased signature, but I was very attracted to something a bit more analytical, which is why so many options. 

Anyways, the point of this is, have any new players come along that I should look into? I am happy to continue looking at all the old options I was considering years ago but I figure it's been a while, I'm sure something has changed since then! So glad this thread is still alive and joker is going strong  love the new site and form by the way! It's amazing. The amount of content is unreal dude! You are a national head fi treasure.


----------



## desutruction

iirc FXT90 = dual dynamic


----------



## kylezo

You are correct and you caught it before I did haha. I went back to correct it and saw your post


----------



## ngoshawk

kylezo said:


> So, I have been away for a long time, maybe two years? (About 7k posts in this thread, anyway, hah). I am looking for a new pair of iems and I'm just wondering how much the landscape has changed since I was experimenting last. I had a pair of Atrio M5s (MG7) which I loved, also owned FXT90s. I especially loved the lush presentation of the FXT90s, the dual dynamic driver setup was amazing for the price point.
> 
> I was looking at another pair of them actually, but I figured I'm in a great position to experiment a bit right now. Budget is $100-$200us. So I was looking at: GR07, DBA-02 (/Brainwavz B2), HiFi RE400, ER-4S, RE272/262 R-50. I tend to prefer musicality and soundstage in my iems, I have no problem fussing with tips to get the right fit/isolation. I think that's part of why I loved the FXT90s so much, they had incredible dynamics for such a cheap option, and dual dynamic drivers, what the heck. I'm not super averse to a somewhat biased signature, but I was very attracted to something a bit more analytical, which is why so many options.
> 
> Anyways, the point of this is, have any new players come along that I should look into? I am happy to continue looking at all the old options I was considering years ago but I figure it's been a while, I'm sure something has changed since then! So glad this thread is still alive and joker is going strong  love the new site and form by the way! It's amazing. The amount of content is unreal dude! You are a national head fi treasure.




The MEE Audio Pinnacle P1 has come along, and rate really well. I'm eyeing a pair on the MEE website right now...


----------



## 1clearhead

@joker
  
 Would you be reviewing the *Campfire Audio Jupiter*'s anytime, soon? It would be interesting to know how well they rate among the best in your list.
 .....350, way to go!!!


----------



## Nick-firestorm

Looking for an upgrade on my SE215 - mostly between Custom Art Music One and something more expensive, like the Ei.3 or Westone 4R etc.
  
 Is the Music One a direct and worthwhile upgrade? Is Ei.3 a much better choice?
  
 Thanks


----------



## Trying2Learn

b9scrambler said:


> Trying2Learn For a durable, good sounding iem that won't break the bank the RHA S500 should definitely be considered. It's a little colder sounding than the VSD3s but still has some good bass. One of the best iems in its price range imo.


I just recommended that a week ago! He decided to go with it


----------



## kylezo

ngoshawk said:


> The MEE Audio Pinnacle P1 has come along, and rate really well. I'm eyeing a pair on the MEE website right now...




I have heard good things, but usually just people saying "I hear good things". Anyone actually heard them/compare to any of my iems of interest?


----------



## B9Scrambler

trying2learn said:


> I just recommended that a week ago! He decided to go with it




Awesome


----------



## ngoshawk

kylezo said:


> I have heard good things, but usually just people saying "I hear good things". Anyone actually heard them/compare to any of my iems of interest?




Here's the thread:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/794787/mee-audio-pinnacle-p1-new-199-dynamic-driver-flagship/0_30


----------



## kylezo

Thanks, I read the entire thread, all 487 posts, believe it or not. Seems encouraging but then the only 2 full reviews here were paid for by MEE which is discouraging. That said, the P1 does seem to check just about all the boxes I'm looking for - maybe less fun and V shaped than my past but I was also considering ER4S for a while and maybe going more analytical, so it may be just what I want (lots of praise on the soundstage and separation which is a big plus).


----------



## robm321

The P1s are the real deal. The reviews are legit. I echo them and paid full price (no one paid me anything, unfortunately). The ER4S are still something that everyone should own at some point. I'll never sell mine, but the P1s are really a game changer at $200. Quite surprising, actually. 
  
 That said, both the ER4S and P1 require an amp to sound their best. They do well out of a phone, but I wouldn't buy them if that is how you will use them regularly.


----------



## B9Scrambler

kylezo said:


> Thanks, I read the entire thread, all 487 posts, believe it or not. Seems encouraging but then the only 2 full reviews here were paid for by MEE which is discouraging.




What a "nice" way to completely discredit those well-known and trusted reviewers, and their work. Being provided review samples does not immediately mean they are being paid off. What thread are you in right now? Do you really think all of those iems were purchased? Might as well just discount everything you read. *shrug*


----------



## Acheron717

My beloved Xiaomi Piston 2's are starting to fall apart. i was wondering if anyone had a recommendation for a set of sub $50 IEMs with a similar sound signature?


----------



## ngoshawk

acheron717 said:


> My beloved Xiaomi Piston 2's are starting to fall apart. i was wondering if anyone had a recommendation for a set of sub $50 IEMs with a similar sound signature?




Not sure if they have similar sound signature (sorry), but I would highly recommend the MEE m6 Pros, for less than $50. Until I purchased a more expensive pair, these were my go to pair. And if I need a throw-around pair, the m6 Pros are it. Slightly bright trebles, brought under control with an EQ. Decent bass, very good soundstage and separation.

I like them a lot.


----------



## starcraft2

If you had to choose a new pair of dinamic drivers or hibrid what would you pick??


----------



## 1TrickPony

starcraft2 said:


> If you had to choose a new pair of dinamic drivers or hibrid what would you pick??




It's all inn the way they are tuned.that's an art by itself


----------



## queerquirks

Whats a good upgrade to the gr07 classics with similar sound signature, i do like my mids and bass but not when it's too forward like the ba200. 
 I do like the ue900/s sound but not sold locally in my country and I am not willing to take the risk on the phones considering their rep for rmas. 
 As a side note, I tried the meelec pinnacle p1 (not my preferred sig) but it's really great for detail oriented, non fatigue treble with thinner and very smooth mids. 
  
 Budget wise maybe 150-200usd?


----------



## ezekiel77

queerquirks said:


> Whats a good upgrade to the gr07 classics with similar sound signature, i do like my mids and bass but not when it's too forward like the ba200.
> I do like the ue900/s sound but not sold locally in my country and I am not willing to take the risk on the phones considering their rep for rmas.
> As a side note, I tried the meelec pinnacle p1 (not my preferred sig) but it's really great for detail oriented, non fatigue treble with thinner and very smooth mids.
> 
> Budget wise maybe 150-200usd?


 
  
 Only one I can think of as a total step up is the FLC8, but it's substantially more than USD200 I'm afraid.


----------



## queerquirks

ezekiel77 said:


> Only one I can think of as a total step up is the FLC8, but it's substantially more than USD200 I'm afraid.


 
 Ah yes, that was an iem I tested but the bass was abit too much for me when I tried the balanced filter. I'll try the "trebly" version and decide again. 
 I would prefer to set at my budget but if something great gets recommended, I would most definitely consider it.


----------



## djteo333

I'm currently trying the DUNU 2000's and I really like the soundstage, imaging and separation.  Is there a headphone that has those qualities but more bass impact, close to basshead levels, preferably one that you wear straight down?/
  
 Instead of keeping the dn2000 and buying a budget basshead phones, I would prefer an all in one combo, let's say around $500 price point.


----------



## 1TrickPony

djteo333 said:


> I'm currently trying the DUNU 2000's and I really like the soundstage, imaging and separation.  Is there a headphone that has those qualities but more bass impact, close to basshead levels, preferably one that you wear straight down?/
> 
> 
> 
> Instead of keeping the dn2000 and buying a budget basshead phones, I would prefer an all in one combo, let's say around $500 price point.




The new flc8s or the Dunu dn1000.


----------



## vapman

Having heard none of them myself I might recommend the FLC8 if you want an all arounder with the ability to be basshead.
  
 Hawaiibadboy put them on the top 10 basshead IEM list so you know they're capable of legitimately being basshead. see his review video if you have not yet IMO.
  
 There isn't much else in that range I know if that you can make it be either no bass or basshead.


----------



## FlyingFungus

ngoshawk said:


> The MEE Audio Pinnacle P1 has come along, and rate really well. I'm eyeing a pair on the MEE website right now...


 

 I'm considering a pair myself. It's between this, the Sennheiser IE80 or something Audio Technica (I'm currently using a pair of sub $100 Noise Cancelling and I really enjoy their sound, but I'd rather save them for travelling instead of work).


----------



## Podster

ezekiel77 said:


> Only one I can think of as a total step up is the FLC8, but it's substantially more than USD200 I'm afraid.


 

 the S model is $349.00, I'm enjoying their tour stop right now and they are KILLER
	

	
	
		
		

		
			






 I can sure see/hear why the CIEM crowd loves them


----------



## Raketen

Shuffle and e6? nifty budget combo there..


----------



## Podster

raketen said:


> Shuffle and e6? nifty budget combo there..


 

 Actually Brainwavz AP001
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Using JDS mini ic, very compactamundo


----------



## Mr Trev

podster said:


> the S model is $349.00, I'm enjoying their tour stop right now and they are KILLER
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 awesome mini-stack! (stackette?)


----------



## 1TrickPony

Nice stack


----------



## Podster

1trickpony said:


> Nice stack


 

 THX Guys, funny thing is I could buy 5 of the stacks for what the FLC's cost
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 But they sure sound sweet on this little stack ( excuse me Mr. T, Stackette)


----------



## ezekiel77

podster said:


> the S model is $349.00, I'm enjoying their tour stop right now and they are KILLER
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 See? Everyone loves them.


----------



## ljokerl

kylezo said:


> So, I have been away for a long time, maybe two years? (About 7k posts in this thread, anyway, hah). I am looking for a new pair of iems and I'm just wondering how much the landscape has changed since I was experimenting last. I had a pair of Atrio M5s (MG7) which I loved, also owned FXT90s. I especially loved the lush presentation of the FXT90s, the dual dynamic driver setup was amazing for the price point.
> 
> I was looking at another pair of them actually, but I figured I'm in a great position to experiment a bit right now. Budget is $100-$200us. So I was looking at: GR07, DBA-02 (/Brainwavz B2), HiFi RE400, ER-4S, RE272/262 R-50. I tend to prefer musicality and soundstage in my iems, I have no problem fussing with tips to get the right fit/isolation. I think that's part of why I loved the FXT90s so much, they had incredible dynamics for such a cheap option, and dual dynamic drivers, what the heck. I'm not super averse to a somewhat biased signature, but I was very attracted to something a bit more analytical, which is why so many options.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Some of those sets you're considering are discontinued and will be very difficult to find. And the rest mostly have a flat/balanced sound sig, which your Atrios and FXT90s do not.
  
 At $200 for dynamic sound you might as well look into the DUNU DN-1000. It's got a closer balance to the FXT90 and while the soundstage isn't huge, it's a solid triple-driver hybrid earphone for the price and quite difficult to beat for a moderately enhanced-bass, v-shaped sound.
  
 There are other options you can consider, such as the Yamaha EPH-100/RHA MA750 (warmer-sounding IEMs with good dynamics), Audio-Technica IM02 (for a newer IEM with flatter sound), and maybe even the DUNU Titan 1 for a totally out of left field option (poor isolation on these, but a surprisingly "fun" colored sound with a wide soundstage and more analytical presentation compared to the FXT90).
  


1clearhead said:


> @joker
> 
> Would you be reviewing the *Campfire Audio Jupiter*'s anytime, soon? It would be interesting to know how well they rate among the best in your list.
> .....350, way to go!!!


 
  
 I've never even heard of these before :/
  


nick-firestorm said:


> Looking for an upgrade on my SE215 - mostly between Custom Art Music One and something more expensive, like the Ei.3 or Westone 4R etc.
> 
> Is the Music One a direct and worthwhile upgrade? Is Ei.3 a much better choice?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Music One is not exactly a direct upgrade to the SE215 simply because the sound tuning is different. It's a much more balanced and accurate IEM than the bassier, somewhat treble-shy Shures. That said, if you're looking for fidelity it's a big step up - better than the W4R for sure. 

 Haven't tried the Ei.3.
  


acheron717 said:


> My beloved Xiaomi Piston 2's are starting to fall apart. i was wondering if anyone had a recommendation for a set of sub $50 IEMs with a similar sound signature?


 
  
 Another Piston 2 would be the closest, but if you don't mind something a bit different but still warm, bassy, and quite smooth, you can try the Sony MH1C (if you can find one).
  


starcraft2 said:


> If you had to choose a new pair of dinamic drivers or hibrid what would you pick??


 
  
 Depends on the earphones - the driver configuration simply can't tell you all that much about the tuning or performance.
  


queerquirks said:


> Whats a good upgrade to the gr07 classics with similar sound signature, i do like my mids and bass but not when it's too forward like the ba200.
> I do like the ue900/s sound but not sold locally in my country and I am not willing to take the risk on the phones considering their rep for rmas.
> As a side note, I tried the meelec pinnacle p1 (not my preferred sig) but it's really great for detail oriented, non fatigue treble with thinner and very smooth mids.
> 
> Budget wise maybe 150-200usd?


 
  
 I've also mostly recommended the FLC8 for this - not the exact same signature as the GR07 but a noticeable improvement in many ways over the hard-to-upgrade-from VSonics.
  
 If you liked the UE900 you might consider the ATH-IM02 as a cheaper alternative, but I don't think it's as close to a GR07 upgrade as the FLC8. It's very nice balanced earphone, though, and less mid-forward than the BA200.
  
 There are also a few GR07 alternatives that aren't necessarily upgrades, but can be considered equally good performers and may provide a sound signature you like better - for instance the Philips Fidelio S2.


----------



## kylezo

ljokerl said:


> Some of those sets you're considering are discontinued and will be very difficult to find. And the rest mostly have a flat/balanced sound sig, which your Atrios and FXT90s do not.
> 
> At $200 for dynamic sound you might as well look into the DUNU DN-1000. It's got a closer balance to the FXT90 and while the soundstage isn't huge, it's a solid triple-driver hybrid earphone for the price and quite difficult to beat for a moderately enhanced-bass, v-shaped sound.
> 
> There are other options you can consider, such as the Yamaha EPH-100/RHA MA750 (warmer-sounding IEMs with good dynamics), Audio-Technica IM02 (for a newer IEM with flatter sound), and maybe even the DUNU Titan 1 for a totally out of left field option (poor isolation on these, but a surprisingly "fun" colored sound with a wide soundstage and more analytical presentation compared to the FXT90).


 
  
 I think your rec. for the DN-1000 is spot on, I was looking at just that set - but ended up purchasing MEE Pinnacle P1. Hasn't arrived (or shipped yet) but I'm excited, lots of good feedback. You are right, I was starting to look for a more analytical sound by the end of my search, I think the P1 will fit in between those 2 sigs quite well, we shall see.


----------



## queerquirks

ljokerl said:


> I've also mostly recommended the FLC8 for this - not the exact same signature as the GR07 but a noticeable improvement in many ways over the hard-to-upgrade-from VSonics.
> 
> If you liked the UE900 you might consider the ATH-IM02 as a cheaper alternative, but I don't think it's as close to a GR07 upgrade as the FLC8. It's very nice balanced earphone, though, and less mid-forward than the BA200.
> 
> There are also a few GR07 alternatives that aren't necessarily upgrades, but can be considered equally good performers and may provide a sound signature you like better - for instance the Philips Fidelio S2.


 
 Awesome, shall give the im02 a shot, tried the im70 and the fit just seemed awkward which seemed to be made worse by the ear hooks.
  
 Anybody has an opinion on the Lear LHF AE1-B? Only found reviews for the AE1- D version


----------



## 1clearhead

Hello Joker,
  
 The *Campfire Audio Jupiter* sound brilliant and currently my favorite after listening to them on a long term audition!
  
 Here's a link to their websites and other reviews.
  
http://campfireaudio.com/jupiter/
  
http://www.aloaudio.com/campfire-audio-jupiter
  
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/show-newport-2015-campfire-audio#bJS2PAC2iZpJexmZ.97
  
 Made in the USA.
  
  
 PS. As a family man, I can't afford them, so they'll stay on my wish list for now.


----------



## darksilent

I'm looking for some iems that have a natural sound and a wide soundstage. My main iems are W10s right now and I like the them but sometimes would just like a little more bass. Was looking at the im02, anyone have any other recommendations?
  
 Budget wise in around the same bracket: $100-$200


----------



## ljokerl

kylezo said:


> I think your rec. for the DN-1000 is spot on, I was looking at just that set - but ended up purchasing MEE Pinnacle P1. Hasn't arrived (or shipped yet) but I'm excited, lots of good feedback. You are right, I was starting to look for a more analytical sound by the end of my search, I think the P1 will fit in between those 2 sigs quite well, we shall see.


 
  
 That seems like a good compromise. I really hope to spend some time with the P1 soon.
  


1clearhead said:


> Hello Joker,
> 
> The *Campfire Audio Jupiter* sound brilliant and currently my favorite after listening to them on a long term audition!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Sure looks solid. Interesting, the way they describe their "resonator" and its effect on treble sounds an awful lot like the way MEE describes the P1's "diffuser". Similar solutions?
  


darksilent said:


> I'm looking for some iems that have a natural sound and a wide soundstage. My main iems are W10s right now and I like the them but sometimes would just like a little more bass. Was looking at the im02, anyone have any other recommendations?
> 
> Budget wise in around the same bracket: $100-$200


 
  
 The IM02 doesn't really have more bass than the W10. Its low end extension/depth is a little better but in terms of actual impact/punch it's about equal to a W10. Even something like a Philips Fidelio S2 or GR07 Bass Edition would be better for a balance of slightly punchier bass + a wide presentation.


----------



## darksilent

ljokerl said:


> The IM02 doesn't really have more bass than the W10. Its low end extension/depth is a little better but in terms of actual impact/punch it's about equal to a W10. Even something like a Philips Fidelio S2 or GR07 Bass Edition would be better for a balance of slightly punchier bass + a wide presentation.


 
  
 Thanks for the help joker, I'm going to look into the Fidelio S2.


----------



## ljokerl

Added a review of the JVC XX Elation HA-FR100X
  
 As always, the most up-to-date IEM ranking can be found here: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A96) **JVC XX Elation HA-FR100X*
> 
> 
> Reviewed October 2015
> ...


----------



## dakanao

What earphone do you recommend that is a thin straight barrel design with a balanced sound signature and excellent clarity, while still being relatively forgiving with lesser recordings?


----------



## vipervick

dakanao said:


> What earphone do you recommend that is a thin straight barrel design with a balanced sound signature and excellent clarity, while still being relatively forgiving with lesser recordings?


 
 I can vouch for the Etymotic Research MK5. Thin, straight design and very balanced. However, I find it extremely light on bass. I'm a metal-head and enjoy my steel-toe boot to the head sound!
  
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00OQG7IC2


----------



## dakanao

vipervick said:


> I can vouch for the Etymotic Research MK5. Thin, straight design and very balanced. However, I find it extremely light on bass. I'm a metal-head and enjoy my steel-toe boot to the head sound!
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00OQG7IC2


 
 Does it have good treble extension and sparkle?


----------



## vipervick

dakanao said:


> Does it have good treble extension and sparkle?


 
 I'm not really sure what you are talking about. I've heard the terms, but most of my music kicks in the low to mid ranges. I've never had a problem with treble. Cymbals and guitar solos sound good on the MK5.


----------



## Podster

dakanao said:


> What earphone do you recommend that is a thin straight barrel design with a balanced sound signature and excellent clarity, while still being relatively forgiving with lesser recordings?


 

 My vote would be Aurisonic Rockets


----------



## dakanao

podster said:


> My vote would be Aurisonic Rockets


 
 Do they have smooth, extended treble with good sparkle?


----------



## Podster

dakanao said:


> Do they have smooth, extended treble with good sparkle?


 

 For me they do but we do all hear things differently. YMMV Maybe some other Rocket owners can chime in here?


----------



## Tom22

hey guys so i have been away for a long time! 
  
 been busy with life and other commitments but i thought what better way to get back to the game, then with an unboxing of the Famous VSonic VSD3S btw i compared them in the video to the old versions *(VSD3s), GR07BE, VSD5*
  
  
 no.... its not what your thinking.... This is the 2016 or GEN 2 model of the VSD3s!
  
 with a different tuning and different cable! THANK GOD FOR THE L SHAPE JACK! 
  
 anywayss! enjoy!!!


----------



## NewWaveAudio

Could you do a review of the Xiaomi hybrid


----------



## hallom

I would definitely be interested too!


----------



## NewWaveAudio

hallom said:


> I would definitely be interested too!



I actually already have them and I love them. Had also bought another set of Piston 3 with them. Gave them to my girlfriend


----------



## ljokerl

dakanao said:


> What earphone do you recommend that is a thin straight barrel design with a balanced sound signature and excellent clarity, while still being relatively forgiving with lesser recordings?


 
  
 The Aurisonics Rockets were the first set I thought of as well. It's definitely more smooth than sparkly, but it's very forgiving as a result and clarity is excellent.
  
 If you prefer to err on the side of brighter treble, I think the ACS T15 would be my pick. A little less forgiving, but overall leaner and flatter than the Rockets by a small margin.
  


newwaveaudio said:


> Could you do a review of the Xiaomi hybrid


 
  
 Yes, it's coming.


----------



## Raketen

.


----------



## Koolpep

ljokerl said:


> The Aurisonics Rockets were the first set I thought of as well. It's definitely more smooth than sparkly, but it's very forgiving as a result and clarity is excellent.
> 
> If you prefer to err on the side of brighter treble, I think the ACS T15 would be my pick. A little less forgiving, but overall leaner and flatter than the Rockets by a small margin.
> 
> ...


 

 If you are interested in a pair of Aurisonic rockets, I know a shop that still has them (5 pairs) - they ship internationally and are very reliable, purchased a few times from them.
  
 Cheers.


----------



## srslee

Joker, I saw in a previous post long long ago, you'd said that you'd 'gotten' into psytrance. what IEMs would you recommend around $50 for someone who listens to mostly psytrance? I currently have the Xiaomi Piston 3s and am considering RE300h or NarMoo S1. I'm not really considering Vsonic because I strongly prefer wearing my IEMs straight down. Many, many thanks!


----------



## ryanjsoo

Hey Ljokerl, have you heard the Westone W30? I picked up a set in NY and wrote a review of them quite recently, they`re much improved compared to the W3`s and, in my testing, similar in technical proficiency to the W40. Would really be interested in your take on them, looking forward to that xiaomi hybrid review too!


----------



## ljokerl

srslee said:


> Joker, I saw in a previous post long long ago, you'd said that you'd 'gotten' into psytrance. what IEMs would you recommend around $50 for someone who listens to mostly psytrance? I currently have the Xiaomi Piston 3s and am considering RE300h or NarMoo S1. I'm not really considering Vsonic because I strongly prefer wearing my IEMs straight down. Many, many thanks!


 

 I tend to prefer a more v-shaped sound, which means S1 over the RE300h. Not sure it's the exact one I'd pick, though - coming from the Piston 3 it'll sound quite bassy and not all that clear. Great if you've been looking for more impact compared to your Piston 3, but it might be a little disappointing on the fidelity front.
  


ryanjsoo said:


> Hey Ljokerl, have you heard the Westone W30? I picked up a set in NY and wrote a review of them quite recently, they`re much improved compared to the W3`s and, in my testing, similar in technical proficiency to the W40. Would really be interested in your take on them, looking forward to that xiaomi hybrid review too!


 
  
 Weirdly, I was only sent a W10 and W40 which are not really improved over the preceding models. I've heard good things about the W30, though - perhaps I'll get my hands on a pair at some point.


----------



## CingKrab

Hi Ljokerl:
  
 What are your opinions on the Etyomtic ER-6 (not i)?  As they've been discontinued ages ago, it's impossible to find any reviews that compare to present day IEMs.  They're the only IEMs I've got so I'm wondering how they stack up in comparison nowadays.
  
 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

cingkrab said:


> Hi Ljokerl:
> 
> What are your opinions on the Etyomtic ER-6 (not i)?  As they've been discontinued ages ago, it's impossible to find any reviews that compare to present day IEMs.  They're the only IEMs I've got so I'm wondering how they stack up in comparison nowadays.
> 
> Thanks!


 
  
 ER6 was before my time. I've heard great things about them but they were discontinued by the time I started really paying attention to the IEM market.


----------



## Raketen

cingkrab said:


> Hi Ljokerl:
> 
> What are your opinions on the Etyomtic ER-6 (not i)?  As they've been discontinued ages ago, it's impossible to find any reviews that compare to present day IEMs.  They're the only IEMs I've got so I'm wondering how they stack up in comparison nowadays.
> 
> Thanks!


 

 My first non-earbud inear, impressed yours are still holding up!
 Unfortunately can't compare either, accidentally left mine in a hotel 6 or 7 years ago 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




 Etymotic seem to make stuff that stands the test of time, though (at least by earphone standards the ER4 must qualify as immortal).


----------



## CingKrab

> Originally Posted by *ljokerl* /img/forum/go_quote.gif
> 
> ER6 was before my time. I've heard great things about them but they were discontinued by the time I started really paying attention to the IEM market.


 
  
  


raketen said:


> My first non-earbud inear, impressed yours are still holding up!
> Unfortunately can't compare either, accidentally left mine in a hotel 6 or 7 years ago
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Thanks for the feedback guys.  Mine's been fairly lightly used so it's not been abused too much.  I guess I'll give some lower end dynamics a try maybe (or a dual/triple/quad BA for kicks)?


----------



## Harijs

cingkrab said:


> Hi Ljokerl:
> 
> What are your opinions on the Etyomtic ER-6 (not i)?  As they've been discontinued ages ago, it's impossible to find any reviews that compare to present day IEMs.  They're the only IEMs I've got so I'm wondering how they stack up in comparison nowadays.
> 
> Thanks!


 
 Etymotic ER-6i was the IEM that brought me in the audiophile world...


----------



## ljokerl

Yeah, the ER6i was one of my first proper IEMs, too. I bought those and the Shure E4 in the same week. Ended up keeping the Etys...
  
 Also, added a new review for the Pump Audio Earphones - very impressive basshead IEMs for $50.
  
 As always, the most up-to-date version of the rating table can be found here.
  


ljokerl said:


> *(3A97) Pump Audio Earphones*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## danimoca

First, I must start by thanking you for your contribution to this forum. It really means a lot to all of us 
  
 The reason I am posting here is that I am extremely confused right now. Since I stared my journey here on HeadFi I bought several IEM's. The more "important" ones were:
  
 - Phonak Audeo 012
 - Havi B3 Pro 1
 - Hifiman RE400
 - Fiio EX1
  
 My main goal was to find the perfect one, of course. Unfourtunately, none of them really got to it, for diferent reasons. 
  
 The *Phonak's *were my first truly great IEM. They were balanced and non fatiguing. They were MASSIVELY comfortable. However, they did lack a bit in the bass and I hated the filter system. I still have them, they still work. But the filter's are gone.
  
 The *Havi's*, for me, were a true revelation. I know some people don't find them that special, but I adored that soundstage, that "analog" type sound. Unfortunately, they weren't that comfortable and the they just broke after a few months. 
  
 The *RE400*'s were very good, no doubt. But they sounded a bit "closed-in" after the Havi's. And the build quality was very bad. They broke, also.
  
 The *Fiio's *I just simply don't like how they sound. Period. I know so many people do, but to me they sound extremely thin and fatiguing. The midrange is thin and not very present. Yes, the soundstage is huge, the bass is very good and they are very comfortable, but the rest to me is a NO.
  
 I've allways staid in that ~100€ mark.
  
 So, now I have up to 200€ to spend. What can I get in that price range that offers me:
 - Good comfort (doesn't need to be the best)
 - A balanced or natural sound, with normal to forward mid-rage, tight bass (normal to decent quantity) and not sibilant or fatiguing highs. (Note that I am extremely sensitive to highs).


----------



## 1TrickPony

danimoca said:


> First, I must start by thanking you for your contribution to this forum. It really means a lot to all of us
> 
> The reason I am posting here is that I am extremely confused right now. Since I stared my journey here on HeadFi I bought several IEM's. The more "important" ones were:
> 
> ...





Maybe he might suggest the Aurisonics Rockets...provided they are still available...

He compared them to the re400 (which I did like upon hearing), but the cables are better made and some members here refer to the rockets as their end game. Good luck.


----------



## Raketen

1trickpony said:


> Maybe he might suggest the Aurisonics Rockets...provided they are still available...
> 
> He compared them to the re400 (which I did like upon hearing), but the cables are better made and some members here refer to the rockets as their end game. Good luck.


 

 It's weird, even though I don't particularly love the Rockets, they are probably the most easily recommendable headphone I have owned... always find myself rec'ing them when they fit the budget.


----------



## peter123

1trickpony said:


> Maybe he might suggest the Aurisonics Rockets...provided they are still available...
> 
> He compared them to the re400 (which I did like upon hearing), but the cables are better made and some members here refer to the rockets as their end game. Good luck.




+1, the Rockets was the first thing I thought of when reading that post. 

He/she will probably have to get them second hand though since they're discontinued by now......


----------



## Podster

1trickpony said:


> Maybe he might suggest the Aurisonics Rockets...provided they are still available...
> 
> He compared them to the re400 (which I did like upon hearing), but the cables are better made and some members here refer to the rockets as their end game. Good luck.


 

 Excellent suggestion 1Trick, seems a natural progression iem to those that they have owned, I personally love me some Rockets
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 As Peter has stated you will be hard pressed to find a new pair now but hopefully Fender won't let this fine little iem fall off their map once they start production under their name
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





 All this Rocket talk has inspired me to reveal my true identity


----------



## 1TrickPony

podster said:


> Excellent suggestion 1Trick, seems a natural progression iem to those that they have owned, I personally love me some Rockets As Peter has stated you will be hard pressed to find a new pair now but hopefully Fender won't let this fine little iem fall off their map once they start production under their name:wink_face:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Lol. Just doing my job as a fellow member here.That said, I did miss the boat. Hopefully Joker could enlighten me by comparing the Rockets with the Dn2000.

( I'm currently listening to the Flc8s...and yeah, it's got one of the nicest balance of everything I've heard so far) ))))))


----------



## Podster

1trickpony said:


> Lol. Just doing my job as a fellow member here.That said, I did miss the boat. Hopefully Joker could enlighten me by comparing the Rockets with the Dn2000.
> 
> ( I'm currently listening to the Flc8s...and yeah, it's got one of the nicest balance of everything I've heard so far)
> 
> ...


 

 Nothing wrong with the FLC8s AFAIC
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 For the price they don't have much competition (at least for now but other Chinese Custom IEM builders are hot on the trail as well as Bob over at Trinity)
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 TBH and IMO the Rockets, FLC8s and Trinity Master 6's will be one heck of a triple threat in anyone's iem arsenal


----------



## davidcotton

danimoca said:


> First, I must start by thanking you for your contribution to this forum. It really means a lot to all of us
> 
> The reason I am posting here is that I am extremely confused right now. Since I stared my journey here on HeadFi I bought several IEM's. The more "important" ones were:
> 
> ...


 

 Wonder if the Custom Art Music One's might be a good fit here?  Of course wait time and impressions would need to be factored in.


----------



## danimoca

Thank you all for your answers!

The Custom Art One's are really relly tempting from Joker's review...
However, with all the options I see on their site (replacable cable, shipping, the molds I have to make...), they very easily go to 250€ or more... I dont know...


----------



## ljokerl

raketen said:


> It's weird, even though I don't particularly love the Rockets, they are probably the most easily recommendable headphone I have owned... always find myself rec'ing them when they fit the budget.


 
  
 This is very true, and I think it's because they have no real drawbacks. The bass is not missing, the mids are not recessed, the highs are smooth. Build quality is great, comfort is great, isolation is great, etc, etc. If more IEMs were like that, things would be so much easier - I wouldn't have to include 2-3 different caveats with every recommendation. 
  


danimoca said:


> Thank you all for your answers!
> 
> The Custom Art One's are really relly tempting from Joker's review...
> However, with all the options I see on their site (replacable cable, shipping, the molds I have to make...), they very easily go to 250€ or more... I dont know...


 
  
 Music One is still pretty killer value. Doesn't really give you more bass than the PFE but otherwise it's a great balanced-sounding earphone for the price. The issue is that in this price range earphones with more bass emphasis tend to either sound more muffled or have more treble emphasis along with the bass boost, which results in harsher, brighter sound. It doesn't seem like either of those will be acceptable to you, so sticking with balanced earphones is probably the way to go even if you're not getting much of an increase in bass qty.
  
 For universals, the Rockets that everyone recommended are very good, if you can find a pair. Ditto on the TDK BA200 - I think you would really like its sound, but it's very tough to find one. Among more current models, the Audio-Technica IM02 might be an option, though compared to the PFE and Havi it might still sound a little too intimate, a-la RE-400. The sound is good, though - balanced, smooth, maybe a touch darker than you're used to but far from bothersome.


----------



## ngoshawk

danimoca said:


> First, I must start by thanking you for your contribution to this forum. It really means a lot to all of us
> 
> The reason I am posting here is that I am extremely confused right now. Since I stared my journey here on HeadFi I bought several IEM's. The more "important" ones were:
> 
> ...




My two cents (YMMV), and limited listening, the MEE Audio Pinnacle P1's are an excellent choice. They are my first "mid/hi-fi" iem, and I can't ever see going higher (unless someone will me $...). 

The P1's have excellent sound quality overall, very wide soundstage, and a brilliant neutral sound, tempered with a warmth which makes me very happy. Check out the reviews, for more info. That said, the P1's are quite often compared to the Rockets, and it is very close. I would love to hear a pair of the Rockets, too....Good luck! Cheers.


----------



## ezekiel77

danimoca said:


> So, now I have up to 200€ to spend. What can I get in that price range that offers me:
> - Good comfort (doesn't need to be the best)
> - A balanced or natural sound, with normal to forward mid-rage, tight bass (normal to decent quantity) and not sibilant or fatiguing highs. (Note that I am extremely sensitive to highs).


 
  
 I have listened to 3 out the 4 IEMs mentioned (except the Phonaks), and mostly concur with your findings. (Except I think Havi's bass is a bit flat).
  
 Like ngoshawk said above, I think the MEE Audio Pinnacle P1 should be your next step. They are excellent and punch way, way above their price. Handles smooth and detailed effortlessly, with a big, airy soundstage. I think it trades blows with the FLC8, which costs ~$350 and got a 9.4 sound from joker.


----------



## ljokerl

Bit off an off-topic, but does anyone recognize this logo? Someone asked what these are on facebook and it's been bugging me. Looks so very familiar. 
  

  


ezekiel77 said:


> I have listened to 3 out the 4 IEMs mentioned (except the Phonaks), and mostly concur with your findings. (Except I think Havi's bass is a bit flat).
> 
> Like ngoshawk said above, I think the MEE Audio Pinnacle P1 should be your next step. They are excellent and punch way, way above their price. Handles smooth and detailed effortlessly, with a big, airy soundstage. I think it trades blows with the FLC8, which costs ~$350 and got a 9.4 sound from joker.


 
  
 Love me some FLC8, would be amazing to have something with at least somewhat comparable capability to recommend at $200.


----------



## Wokei

ljokerl said:


> Bit off an off-topic, but does anyone recognize this logo? Someone asked what these are on facebook and it's been bugging me. Looks so very familiar.





me humble opinion ...*NAKAMICHI* ....


----------



## endia

ljokerl said:


> Bit off an off-topic, but does anyone recognize this logo? Someone asked what these are on facebook and it's been bugging me. Looks so very familiar.


 
 it is Nakamichi..


----------



## ljokerl

wokei said:


> me humble opinion ...*NAKAMICHI* ....


 
  


endia said:


> it is Nakamichi..


 
  
 Yep, that's the one! Almost forgot Nakamichi makes headphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
  
 Much appreciated!


----------



## 1TrickPony

Joker, could you provide a brief comparison between the rockets, pinnacle p1 and the dn2000?


----------



## mrstrangeguy

Hi Joker, can you please compare the sound sig of the RE600 to the CK10, thanks.


----------



## proedros

mrstrangeguy said:


> Hi Joker, can you please compare the sound sig of the RE600 to the CK10, thanks.


 
  
 i had re600 and still own ck10 , what do you want to know about them ?


----------



## mrstrangeguy

proedros said:


> i had re600 and still own ck10 , what do you want to know about them ?


 
 Just comparisons regarding sound signature, speed, soundstage, texture,


----------



## proedros

mrstrangeguy said:


> Just comparisons regarding sound signature, speed, soundstage, texture,


 
  
 ck10 is very clean/lean/detailed/fast
  
 zero 'fat', some peple have mentioned sibilance issues , i think it's a very neutral iem with very strong highs 
  
 re600 is more mild , balanced , more robust bass and sweet mids , but highs not so sparkly

 i can not remember soundstage as i owned it 2 years ago , it is a very pleasing iem 
  
  
 both are very different from each other , so you can own both i guess
  
 i have kept ck10 as my mid-tier iem , fr 200$ it is an amazing iem
  
 plus it is way better build than the flimsy re600 , ck10 is build like a japanese samurai , great build quality
  
 ck10 has superior highs/speed/detail retrieval/build quality
 re600 has better bass , more enveloping mids , more laid back sound , and the build is flimsy


----------



## ljokerl

1trickpony said:


> Joker, could you provide a brief comparison between the rockets, pinnacle p1 and the dn2000?


 
  
 Rockets are the most mid-focused, with extended but not very emphasized bass and very smooth treble. The DN-2000 is the opposite - mids are a bit laid-back while the bass is boosted progressively as you go down into the sub-bass region and the highs are relatively bright for an overall V/U-shaped sound. 
  
 The P1 is something I've only listened to a little bit so far but it seems to be somewhere in the middle - theres a small bump in the bass but not nearly as much sub-bass lift as the DN-2000, and the treble is more prominent than Rockets but not as bright as the DUNU. It seems the P1 is still a hair v-shaped, but just not as boosted in the lower bass and upper treble as the DN-2000. I don't think end-to-end extension is going to be one of its strong suits like it is for the DN-2000, but overall it might be more recommendable than the DUNU because the treble should be a bit less polarizing. 
  


mrstrangeguy said:


> Just comparisons regarding sound signature, speed, soundstage, texture,


 
  
 The comparison *proedros *provided is excellent. I'll add that the CK10 generally has a wider, more spacious soundstage while HiFiMan sets including the RE-600 tend to be "closer" to the listener in terms of presentation and just not as spacious and spread out overall.


----------



## 1TrickPony

ljokerl said:


> Rockets are the most mid-focused, with extended but not very emphasized bass and very smooth treble. The DN-2000 is the opposite - mids are a bit laid-back while the bass is boosted progressively as you go down into the sub-bass region and the highs are relatively bright for an overall V/U-shaped sound.
> 
> The P1 is something I've only listened to a little bit so far but it seems to be somewhere in the middle - theres a small bump in the bass but not nearly as much sub-bass lift as the DN-2000, and the treble is more prominent than Rockets but not as bright as the DUNU. It seems the P1 is still a hair v-shaped, but just not as boosted in the lower bass and upper treble as the DN-2000. I don't think end-to-end extension is going to be one of its strong suits like it is for the DN-2000, but overall it might be more recommendable than the DUNU because the treble should be a bit less polarizing.
> 
> ...




Thank you so much! If you could recommend an iem with highs that are akin (not necessarily to the exact same level) to the Flc8s and that does wonderfully with female vocals,I would certainly appreciate it!


----------



## Nriku

Hi there!
After forgotting my mp3 in the gym and not recovering it (mad.gif), I need to buy a new IEM. This is my history in IEMs, chronologically:
1. Creative EP-630: my first one, a big jump from the standard earbuds, I can not review them by comparison.
2. Sennheiser CX 400 II. Sooo comfortable, rich sound althought they broke from the connector twice in 3 years (one covered in warranty).
3. Sony MDR-EX310. Not bad, but worse sound than the Sennheiser, specially because of the cable noise. Confort is also worse.
4. Xiaomi Piston 3. Least confortable of all, although sound is surprisingly good.
"5". My father owns a Soundmagic E10 and I found them too bassy and sometimes silibant (to much V factor?)

I listen to all kind of music, specially rock, dance and classical music.
Which IEM should I buy for less than 50€, here in Spain?

I have seen this models:
- Sennheiser CX 275 S (similar to cx 300?).
- Vsonic Vsd3 or Vsd3s (which are the differences?)
- Hifiman RE 400. I found an spanish website that is selling this earbuds (android version) for 69€, plus 25% of value points, so the real cost is 52€.
- Shure Se215, I see that it pretty well-know and the one in China that costs about 30€.
- Zero Audio Carbone.

From those ones which one would you choose?
Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

1trickpony said:


> Thank you so much! If you could recommend an iem with highs that are akin (not necessarily to the exact same level) to the Flc8s and that does wonderfully with female vocals,I would certainly appreciate it!


 
  
 Depends on which direction you want to go with your vocals. If you just want something a little more forward and energetic, then a DUNU Titan 1 could be sufficient. If you want much smoother sound, something like an Aurisonics Rockets would be great. And so on...


----------



## ZileXa

Love this review topic! I have been going through the sections up to Tier 2C (up to $100). Unfortunately everytime I found the best IEM for me, I discovered it has either been discontinued or does not have a mic so I can't take calls.
 I hate holding my phone on my ear when calling. Someone who appreciates good IEMs wouldn't want to make phone calls like that. So I need one with a mic.
  
 My end choice was the SoundMagic E30. Unfortunately I discovered it does not have a mic. The E10 did have a mic. The PL50 also does not have a mic 
 My goal: a sub-€80 (euros that is) IEM with microphone with the absolute best comfort possible (small ears/sensitive cartilage). I don't care much for isolation since I am on the bicycle a lot. I prefer to hear when a motorized vehicle is going for a near-kill.
  
 I hope anyone could spare a minute to give me some advise.


----------



## ljokerl

zilexa said:


> Love this review topic! I have been going through the sections up to Tier 2C (up to $100). Unfortunately everytime I found the best IEM for me, I discovered it has either been discontinued or does not have a mic so I can't take calls.
> I hate holding my phone on my ear when calling. Someone who appreciates good IEMs wouldn't want to make phone calls like that. So I need one with a mic.
> 
> My end choice was the SoundMagic E30. Unfortunately I discovered it does not have a mic. The E10 did have a mic. The PL50 also does not have a mic
> ...


 
  
 Honestly, you may want to bite the bullet on sound quality and just get the Fidue A31s. Dirt cheap, tiny, and have a mic. One of the most comfortable IEMs I have, especially if you spend another $15 to throw some foam tips on them. Or a Xiaomi Piston 3 - it's not nearly as small but it's quite ergonomic and doesn't sit very deep in the ear. Lower isolation, too. There's a slightly larger alternative to these in the Philips TX1 or TX2 as well. I believe both have mics.
  
 Otherwise your best bet might be a small conventional-fit IEMs such as the HiFiMan RE-400i (or whatever the mic version is called).


----------



## B9Scrambler

Here is my review of the QKZ W1 Pro! This is a little budget cheapo that I would love to see come across your plate @ljokerl


----------



## Wokei

Looking for a dual headphone hanger ...check out my review 

http://www.head-fi.org/products/brainwavz-truss-the-all-metal-under-desk-dual-headphone-hanger-stand-mount/reviews/15899


----------



## garcsa

Try these.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Memory-Foam-Eartips-For-3-5mm-nozzle-Vsonic-GR07-MANDARINES-3-5-/331671578252?


----------



## Ymer

Are these compatible with the Vsonic VSD1S? I can't get a very good seal/fit with the included tips.

Thanks!




garcsa said:


> Try these.  :wink_face:
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Memory-Foam-Eartips-For-3-5mm-nozzle-Vsonic-GR07-MANDARINES-3-5-/331671578252?


----------



## garcsa

ymer said:


> Are these compatible with the Vsonic VSD1S? I can't get a very good seal/fit with the included tips.
> 
> Thanks!


 
 Yep!


----------



## Eguardos

Shure Se215 vs alpha delta ad01 in terms of sound unamped


----------



## AudiOw

Hi there. Looking for in-ear headphones for the LG G5. What options are there that can deliver quality music, yet have a microphone for phone calls and in the budget of around 150$?


----------



## audiobot

Hey there joker. Is there a particular reason why the Aurisonic Rockets are not on the rating chart? I feel after all the great reviews from venerable listeners, including yourself, it should have its place there among the rest. This chart is easily one of the most influential entry-level sources on the net. My curiosity as to how it matches up to the CK10 on ur numerical chart will never go away. IMO, these two iems are the best P4P universals ever made. I promise this to be the last time I ask


----------



## Podster

audiobot said:


> Hey there joker. Is there a particular reason why the Aurisonic Rockets are not on the rating chart? I feel after all the great reviews from venerable listeners, including yourself, it should have its place there among the rest. This chart is easily one of the most influential entry-level sources on the net. My curiosity as to how it matches up to the CK10 on ur numerical chart will never go away. IMO, these two iems are the best P4P universals ever made. I promise this to be the last time I ask


 

 I love me Rockets


----------



## audiobot

podster said:


> I love me Rockets


 

 I love em too mannnnnnn. Hahaha.


----------



## Niyologist

Any affordable CIEMs sold in the US?


----------



## ezekiel77

niyologist said:


> Any affordable CIEMs sold in the US?


 
  
 CustomArt Music One is about $200. Based in Poland but they ship worldwide.
  
 The American CIEMs (JH, Noble, 64 Audio)typically start from $500 onwards.


----------



## Niyologist

ezekiel77 said:


> CustomArt Music One is about $200. Based on Poland but they ship worldwide.
> 
> The American CIEMs (JH, Noble, 64 Audio)typically start from $500 onwards.




Thanks.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Anyone have experience with the Musicmaker TK11 and TK12(also called HCK A2)? It has a beautiful red color and its an affordable hybrid. Surprised it rarely gets any coverage. Apparently it has a 5 driver hybrid older brother too.


----------



## Trying2Learn

audiow said:


> Hi there. Looking for in-ear headphones for the LG G5. What options are there that can deliver quality music, yet have a microphone for phone calls and in the budget of around 150$?


If you like a well behaved V shaped signature, the Fidue A73 looks like a good choice. It's much more shallow of a V shape than the letter looks like, and has nice clarity through out the spectrum while retaining an addicting bass. Can't put them down


----------



## Koolpep

trying2learn said:


> Anyone have experience with the Musicmaker TK11 and TK12(also called HCK A2)? It has a beautiful red color and its an affordable hybrid. Surprised it rarely gets any coverage. Apparently it has a 5 driver hybrid older brother too.




They have their own thread my friend:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/796505/musicmaker-tk12-appreciation-impressions-thread-dual-ba-and-dd-hybrid/795?utm_campaign=subscription&utm_source=subscription_immediate&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=website&utm_source=sendgrid.com&utm_medium=email#post_12597914


----------



## ljokerl

audiobot said:


> Hey there joker. Is there a particular reason why the Aurisonic Rockets are not on the rating chart? I feel after all the great reviews from venerable listeners, including yourself, it should have its place there among the rest. This chart is easily one of the most influential entry-level sources on the net. My curiosity as to how it matches up to the CK10 on ur numerical chart will never go away. IMO, these two iems are the best P4P universals ever made. I promise this to be the last time I ask


 
  
 I reviewed the Rockets for InnerFidelity here: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/lovely-ride-aurisonics-rocket 
  
 It'll be a little while before I can re-post the review elsewhere. I like a lot though.


----------



## Tom22

Joker's review of the Momentum in Ear is spot on!
  
 They are a great pair for on the go!
  
 For those interested in my take of the Momentum In Ears:
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/sennheiser-momentum-in-ear/reviews/16132


----------



## Raketen

tom22 said:


> Joker's review of the Momentum in Ear is spot on!
> 
> They are a great pair for on the go!
> 
> ...


 

 Great review as always 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 not enough reviews do the "try to roll the cable into a ball test" lol.


----------



## sdwlrd

@ljokerl, thank you for the awesome compendium 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. I am looking for a cheap pair of earphones for casual use, my priorities are good sub bass (can do with minimal mid bass), decent detail retrieval and soundstage. I know it is nearly impossible to get them all in a pair of cheap earphones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, but between the Piston 3s and Xiaomi Hybrids which one do you think is a better choice?


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

tom22 said:


> Joker's review of the Momentum in Ear is spot on!
> 
> They are a great pair for on the go!
> 
> ...




Wich of these would you guys recomend for a hd25/amperior, momentum (over ear) lover:

Rha ma750
Sennheiser momentum in ear
Yamaha eph 100
Shure se215
Sennheiser cx5.00

?


----------



## ljokerl

tom22 said:


> Joker's review of the Momentum in Ear is spot on!
> 
> They are a great pair for on the go!
> 
> ...


 
  




  


sdwlrd said:


> @ljokerl, thank you for the awesome compendium
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Replied at http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/xiaomi-piston-3-in-ear-earphones-review/#comment-129677
  


pedro oliveira said:


> Wich of these would you guys recomend for a hd25/amperior, momentum (over ear) lover:
> 
> Rha ma750
> Sennheiser momentum in ear
> ...


 
  
 I'd go MA750 personally, Momentum as a close second. The Momentum In-Ear is tuned more like the HD25 than the Momentum Over-Ear, being more v-shaped and less smooth. The MA750 is more of a mix of the two, and just really quite good overall.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> Replied at http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/xiaomi-piston-3-in-ear-earphones-review/#comment-129677
> 
> 
> I'd go MA750 personally, Momentum as a close second. The Momentum In-Ear is tuned more like the HD25 than the Momentum Over-Ear, being more v-shaped and less smooth. The MA750 is more of a mix of the two, and just really quite good overall.




Thank you very much for the reply ljokerl... 

What about the eph100 and se215? Are they very far away from the momentum (over ear) and hd25 sound signatures?

The shures i am not so excited to get but i was actually thinking of trying the momentum in ear, the rha ma750 and the eph100 and keep the one i like the most.... Or 2 of them... Or all....


----------



## Raketen

eph100 is rather different from hd25, much more of a warm type of sound


----------



## wes1099

SE215 vs RHA750 vs ATH-E40, which do you guys think I should go for? Also, are there any other IEM's in that price range (~$100) that I should consider?


----------



## Tom22

ljokerl said:


> Replied at http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/xiaomi-piston-3-in-ear-earphones-review/#comment-129677
> 
> 
> I'd go MA750 personally, Momentum as a close second. The Momentum In-Ear is tuned more like the HD25 than the Momentum Over-Ear, being more v-shaped and less smooth. The MA750 is more of a mix of the two, and just really quite good overall.





Thanks friend!

I think they give a lot of options for smartphone users purely due to the ios and android configurations.

The fun sound is just icing on the cake.


However i wasnt a huge fan of the red and black versions


----------



## ngoshawk

wes1099 said:


> SE215 vs RHA750 vs ATH-E40, which do you guys think I should go for? Also, are there any other IEM's in that price range (~$100) that I should consider?




Sorry no experience with any except the MA750, which I really like. Before my Pinnacle P1's, the RHA's were my best IEM. Now that I have the CA Nova, I will probably "will" the P1 to my son, and keep the MA750 as my "alternate IEM"....says something about the sound quality, I hope. Just a full, fun sound, not too bright (but they are forward, slightly), good rich bass, but not overwhelming, good soundstage and separation. Clarity is quite good.

The MA750 is just a really fun, quality sounding IEM. And, I purchased mine as a scratch-n-dent on Amazon, for $61/shipped...woohoo!

Hope this helps.


----------



## Shawn71

ngoshawk said:


> Sorry no experience with any except the MA750, which I really like. Before my Pinnacle P1's, the RHA's were my best IEM. Now that I have the CA Nova, I will probably "will" the P1 to my son, and keep the MA750 as my "alternate IEM"....says something about the sound quality, I hope. Just a full, fun sound, not too bright (but they are forward, slightly), good rich bass, but not overwhelming, good soundstage and separation. Clarity is quite good.
> 
> The MA750 is just a really fun, quality sounding IEM. And, I purchased mine as a scratch-n-dent on Amazon, for $61/shipped...woohoo!
> 
> Hope this helps.




+1.....I wld choose 750,if I were to, tho I never owned any of these 3, nor tried them-tbh. The 750 is built like a tank as well alongside its sq!


----------



## wes1099

ngoshawk said:


> Sorry no experience with any except the MA750, which I really like. Before my Pinnacle P1's, the RHA's were my best IEM. Now that I have the CA Nova, I will probably "will" the P1 to my son, and keep the MA750 as my "alternate IEM"....says something about the sound quality, I hope. Just a full, fun sound, not too bright (but they are forward, slightly), good rich bass, but not overwhelming, good soundstage and separation. Clarity is quite good.
> 
> The MA750 is just a really fun, quality sounding IEM. And, I purchased mine as a scratch-n-dent on Amazon, for $61/shipped...woohoo!
> 
> Hope this helps.


 
 Cool. Thanks for the info! From that description of the sound it sounds like I would like them.


----------



## wes1099

Does anyone know how the RHA T10 compares to the RHA MA750?


----------



## ljokerl

pedro oliveira said:


> Thank you very much for the reply ljokerl...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 The Shures are probably the weakest link here, their dry and somewhat more mid-forward sound with rolled-off treble is less similar to the Sennheisers. The EPH-100 is a warmer, bassier MA750 alternative as someone mentioned above. I think the two are about on-par, but the MA750 is again more akin to your current headphones. 
  
 Since these IEMs aren't too far apart from each other, if you have the option to try all three (wouldn't bother with the SE215 in this case) that would be an awesome way to figure out which variant of the warm, fun, enhanced-bass sound fits you best. 
  


wes1099 said:


> Does anyone know how the RHA T10 compares to the RHA MA750?


 
  
 The T10 is a basshead (or borderline basshead) IEM that's not an upgrade to the MA750 in overall sound quality. Unless you're only interested in bass I'd skip it.


----------



## Pedro Oliveira

ljokerl said:


> The Shures are probably the weakest link here, their dry and somewhat more mid-forward sound with rolled-off treble is less similar to the Sennheisers. The EPH-100 is a warmer, bassier MA750 alternative as someone mentioned above. I think the two are about on-par, but the MA750 is again more akin to your current headphones.
> 
> Since these IEMs aren't too far apart from each other, if you have the option to try all three (wouldn't bother with the SE215 in this case) that would be an awesome way to figure out which variant of the warm, fun, enhanced-bass sound fits you best.
> 
> ...




Thank you very much once again ljokerl.... But just to finish... Would you say that between the ma750, momemtum and eph 100, the sennheisers are the weaker in terms of sound quality and overall?
I am mostlu tempted on the rhad and the yamas and i am about yo order both.... Just waiting gor the yamas to be available again....

Meanwhile i goy a pair of mh1c om ebay... They should arrive tomorrow.... Hoe do these compare to the other 3 i mentiomed? Cheers...


----------



## riposte

Wrong post thread. I will move my post, sorry


----------



## ljokerl

pedro oliveira said:


> Thank you very much once again ljokerl.... But just to finish... Would you say that between the ma750, momemtum and eph 100, the sennheisers are the weaker in terms of sound quality and overall?
> I am mostlu tempted on the rhad and the yamas and i am about yo order both.... Just waiting gor the yamas to be available again....
> 
> Meanwhile i goy a pair of mh1c om ebay... They should arrive tomorrow.... Hoe do these compare to the other 3 i mentiomed? Cheers...


 
  
  
 Ultimately it depends on the exact sound signature one is after - for some listeners the Momentum In-Ear can surpass the other two. For me it does not - I think the relative scores say as much: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone-list/


----------



## Vidal

Hi Joker, do you have any plans to add some of the better regarded Chinese IEMs and earbuds to the list?
  
 Stuff like the VE Monks, Rock Zircon, VJJB K4S etc. I'd love to see how these compare with the mainstream brands.


----------



## ljokerl

Posted impressions of the Bragi Dash "true wireless" IEMs at http://theheadphonelist.com/bragi-dash-impressions-the-first-true-wireless-iem-offers-glimpses-of-the-future/ 
  


vidal said:


> Hi Joker, do you have any plans to add some of the better regarded Chinese IEMs and earbuds to the list?
> 
> Stuff like the VE Monks, Rock Zircon, VJJB K4S etc. I'd love to see how these compare with the mainstream brands.


 
  
 IEMs are always interesting but I don't always get my hands on stuff from the smaller/newer companies. I have a set of VE IEMs but nothing from the other two. The IEMs are okay, not sure if worth a full review. 
  
 Earbuds don't like my ears (or vice versa) so I won't be adding any of those. They'd be handicapped in the list by their (lack of) isolation, too.


----------



## Vidal

Understood, hopefully one of the manufacturers/distributors will see this and send you a pair to review.
  
 I'm the same as you with the Earbuds, I find them uncomfortable after a while, I think I have small ears. However, I did feel the Monks had something about them when I got them seated right.


----------



## danimoca

Hey joker!
  
 After some recommendations from you, I managed to find a pair of used Aurisonics Rockets and bought them.
  
 After coming from the RE400's, they are excellent, with a touch more bass and a bit more soundstage. An even more natural sound, overall. 
  
 Thank you! 
  
 I hope this isn't that oftfopic, but I am now planning to buy a pair of new headphones for home use. After owning Sennheiser 598's, which I liked but didn't love, the HD600's are the most probable one's to buy.
  
 My question: do you think the 600's are of similar sound signature to the Rocket's? 
  
 Thanks!


----------



## ljokerl

vidal said:


> Understood, hopefully one of the manufacturers/distributors will see this and send you a pair to review.
> 
> I'm the same as you with the Earbuds, I find them uncomfortable after a while, I think I have small ears. However, I did feel the Monks had something about them when I got them seated right.


 
  
 Perhaps someday. Unfortunately I can't review everything that comes across my desk so it's probably tough for some companies to justify sending me something on the off chance I might cover it. 
  


danimoca said:


> Hey joker!
> 
> After some recommendations from you, I managed to find a pair of used Aurisonics Rockets and bought them.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Awesome, glad you're enjoying the Rockets!
  
 I personally really like the HD600, much more so than any of the HD59x models. They are similar to the Rockets in the sense of being quite balanced with no part of the frequency spectrum boosted and very smooth sound, but it's still IEM vs headphone and the signature match is not exact. I think you'll like them, though.


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Posted impressions of the Bragi Dash "true wireless" IEMs at http://theheadphonelist.com/bragi-dash-impressions-the-first-true-wireless-iem-offers-glimpses-of-the-future/


 
  
 Great review, had it for a week or so and agree wholeheartedly. Still, it's probably the best fully wireless choice out there at the moment, due to its use of NFMI for L/R connection, while others like the Earin and VerveOnes (which rely solely on bluetooth) suffer from frequent connection issues and dropouts on the right earpiece.


----------



## danimoca

ljokerl said:


> Perhaps someday. Unfortunately I can't review everything that comes across my desk so it's probably tough for some companies to justify sending me something on the off chance I might cover it.
> 
> 
> Awesome, glad you're enjoying the Rockets!
> ...


 
  
 Then I might actually go for them. Seems like a nice "complement" to the Rockets 
  
 Thanks again!


----------



## thesuperguy

Speaking of the aurisonics, Joker, you had actually recommended the rockets as a successor to the RE400 and or RE262 but I was too broke at the time to bite the... well, rockets.
  
 I was just wondering what you might recommend nowadays as an upgrade now that the aurisonics have been discontinued. At this point, I don't really care if its an IEM or headphones but I'm just a fan of anything that is balanced with a midrange focus. I loved the musicality and silky smooth midrange of the RE262s, and the RE400 I tried were very impressive as well. The only thing stopping me from purchasing the RE400s are the numerous complaints about their build quality and I personally experienced my RE262s falling apart. Any suggestions?


----------



## z28dreams

Any suggestion for an IEM with really good mids and < $50?
  
 I was seeking some that have a more mild V (have the soundmagic E10 and steelseries flux).  They have enough bass/highs for me, but are still a bit lacking in the mids for my preference.


----------



## bms44974

Looking forward to reviews of Etymotic ER4sr and ER4xr 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 Cheers... Brian


----------



## Zelda

z28dreams said:


> Any suggestion for an IEM with really good mids and < $50?
> 
> I was seeking some that have a more mild V (have the soundmagic E10 and steelseries flux).  They have enough bass/highs for me, but are still a bit lacking in the mids for my preference.


 
 Soundmagic E50, or if you can go a bit higher than $50, then Fidue A65, Ostry KC06A,


----------



## ozkan

z28dreams said:


> Any suggestion for an IEM with really good mids and < $50?
> 
> I was seeking some that have a more mild V (have the soundmagic E10 and steelseries flux).  They have enough bass/highs for me, but are still a bit lacking in the mids for my preference.




Audio Technica ATH-IM50 has very good organic mids. However it may sound a bit upfront after E10 and Flux. I had the Flux once a while and I've always found the mids recessed and undetailed on them.


----------



## damex

hi,
 what would be the good all-rounder with nice soft cable (or with ability to get one later) without microphonics for like 500$ or less?
 is there something that can compete with desktop 200$ full-size cans? like dt770 (despite all that hate toward beyerdynamic... i love that cans and own 3 versions of them!)? maybe with higher price tag?
  
 i have shure 215ltd and using them when isolation is necessary. otherwise i am sticking to fiio ex1/dunu titan1. after getting fiio ex1 - it feels like shure 215ltd sound is really bad.
  
 feels like shure 215ltd sound not as good as iem sound can be (lets compare to fiio ex1, but they're semi-open), cable sucks - fiio cable sucks and stock cable sucks. amount of isolation they have is enough but... microphonics killing me


----------



## jusrw97

I've been looking for a good pair of IEMs under $150, but I can stretch to $200. I have the SE215 and the Westone UM Pro 20, but I haven't been that thrilled with them lately. I want something that goes well with alternative rock and pop with a hint of EDM. I've been looking at a few of them from your list, but it's a lot to compare. I'll be using these for walking around, studying and general listening. Which do you recommend?

Thank you.


----------



## ljokerl

james444 said:


> Great review, had it for a week or so and agree wholeheartedly. Still, it's probably the best fully wireless choice out there at the moment, due to its use of NFMI for L/R connection, while others like the Earin and VerveOnes (which rely solely on bluetooth) suffer from frequent connection issues and dropouts on the right earpiece.


 
  
 Thanks, and good info! I did kind of assume that the Dash is as good as it currently gets, mostly due to Earin and the other alternatives being trashed even by mainstream media.

 Seems like there's a good dozen or so more "true wireless" sets in the pipeline besides the Samsung ones, most of them to be crowdfunded. I'm curious enough to try and get my hands on a few. 
  
  


thesuperguy said:


> Speaking of the aurisonics, Joker, you had actually recommended the rockets as a successor to the RE400 and or RE262 but I was too broke at the time to bite the... well, rockets.
> 
> I was just wondering what you might recommend nowadays as an upgrade now that the aurisonics have been discontinued. At this point, I don't really care if its an IEM or headphones but I'm just a fan of anything that is balanced with a midrange focus. I loved the musicality and silky smooth midrange of the RE262s, and the RE400 I tried were very impressive as well. The only thing stopping me from purchasing the RE400s are the numerous complaints about their build quality and I personally experienced my RE262s falling apart. Any suggestions?


 
  
 The Rockets were really great for this, and between them and a few other sets disappearing, I don't really have a good alternative besides all the sets you normally see recommended for balanced/mid-centric sound such as the Shure SE535. I do have an RE-400 alternative with better build quality - the Brainwavz R3 - but that has its own quirks, mostly the weird fit.
  
 By the way, it's my understanding that the Rockets should be re-released at some point in the future.
  


z28dreams said:


> Any suggestion for an IEM with really good mids and < $50?
> 
> I was seeking some that have a more mild V (have the soundmagic E10 and steelseries flux).  They have enough bass/highs for me, but are still a bit lacking in the mids for my preference.


 
  
 The Ostry KC06 that Zelda also mentioned is my usual recommendation for this. It's a somewhat unusual earphone but would be a nice option for just boosting upper midrange presence over the E10 and Flux. If you also want your lower mids more forward and full-bodied, you'd need a warmer-sounding set such as the HiFiMan RE-400 or Brainwavz R3, and these are a little pricier. The Fidue A65 and ATH-IM50 that were recommended may be good lower-priced alternatives but I'm not too familiar with these models - only tried each of them briefly.
  


bms44974 said:


> Looking forward to reviews of Etymotic ER4sr and ER4xr
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Very, very interested in these... 
  


damex said:


> hi,
> what would be the good all-rounder with nice soft cable (or with ability to get one later) without microphonics for like 500$ or less?
> is there something that can compete with desktop 200$ full-size cans? like dt770 (despite all that hate toward beyerdynamic... i love that cans and own 3 versions of them!)? maybe with higher price tag?
> 
> ...


 
  
 The softest cable I have is probably on my Custom Art Music One. Sounds great, too, but it's a custom-fit IEM. Otherwise you can get good cables with the Sennheiser IE80 and pretty much any non-sport Westones. These are all going to sound different from the Fiio/Titan 1 but still more natural than the SE215. Don't think any of them provide the absolute top tier of SQ that IEMs are capable of, but with cable quality factored in I can't think of anything better.
  


jusrw97 said:


> I've been looking for a good pair of IEMs under $150, but I can stretch to $200. I have the SE215 and the Westone UM Pro 20, but I haven't been that thrilled with them lately. I want something that goes well with alternative rock and pop with a hint of EDM. I've been looking at a few of them from your list, but it's a lot to compare. I'll be using these for walking around, studying and general listening. Which do you recommend?
> 
> Thank you.


 
  
 I usually recommend the Yamaha EPH-100 or RHA MA750 for this. These are both dynamic, somewhat colored-sounding and just generally "fun" to listen to. They'll be a very good alternative to your monitors. If you're used to over-ear fit the MA750 will be more trouble-free.


----------



## james444

ljokerl said:


> Thanks, and good info! I did kind of assume that the Dash is as good as it currently gets, mostly due to Earin and the other alternatives being trashed even by mainstream media.
> 
> Seems like there's a good dozen or so more "true wireless" sets in the pipeline besides the Samsung ones, most of them to be crowdfunded. I'm curious enough to try and get my hands on a few.


 
  
 Btw, for those interested in this topic, here's an interesting and informed blog to follow:
http://www.nickhunn.com/hearables-at-the-mobile-world-congress/


----------



## KarelCrossways

Well Done!!!!


----------



## nitolrahman

What is the most mid centric iem around 200$?


----------



## ezekiel77

nitolrahman said:


> What is the most mid centric iem around 200$?


 
  
 Try Aurisonics Rockets.


----------



## nitolrahman

ezekiel77 said:


> Try Aurisonics Rockets.


 
 But the Aurisonics Rockets are discontinued. Are there anything else?


----------



## Trying2Learn

nitolrahman said:


> But the Aurisonics Rockets are discontinued. Are there anything else?


I want to say Pinnacle P1?? But that's just based on the very few forum pages I read on it so take it with a grain of salt. The P1 comes to mind because it seems the Rockets are often compared to the P1. Can someone with the P1 chime in? I'm also looking for a mid-centric $200 IEM.


----------



## ezekiel77

trying2learn said:


> I want to say Pinnacle P1?? But that's just based on the very few forum pages I read on it so take it with a grain of salt. The P1 comes to mind because it seems the Rockets are often compared to the P1. Can someone with the P1 chime in? I'm also looking for a mid-centric $200 IEM.


 
  
 Having owned a P1 before I can say it's not mid-centric. It's more a smooth and relaxed IEM with no particular emphasis, very big soundstage, and stupendous build quality and accessories. It's the first IEM that comes to mind in the $200 category, but it's definitely not mid-centric to my ears. Its lack of vocal sweetness was one of the reasons I've sold it.
  
 The obvious mid-centric choice is the SE535, but yea it costs double.


----------



## warrior1975

I agree with that assessment of the P1. Def
Definitely not midcentric, but very well rounded.


----------



## B-Dawk20

Hey guys, i just cant seem to come to a decision. I am looking for a flat as can be UIEM for $200-400 but I cant seem to make a choice. Every time i think i have it nailed down, I get worries about the extension or maybe the treble being too hot. Though most of my music is pop based, I just really desire a flat sound while not sounding enemic. Maybe im just asking for too much in the price range haha. That and there are a few I would of pulled the trigger on but are discontinued. So far I only got the Ety ER4P-T on deck.


----------



## ezekiel77

b-dawk20 said:


> Hey guys, i just cant seem to come to a decision. I am looking for a flat as can be UIEM for $200-400 but I cant seem to make a choice. Every time i think i have it nailed down, I get worries about the extension or maybe the treble being too hot. Though most of my music is pop based, I just really desire a flat sound while not sounding enemic. Maybe im just asking for too much in the price range haha. That and there are a few I would of pulled the trigger on but are discontinued. So far I only got the Ety ER4P-T on deck.


 
  
 I think the Earsonics SM64 has a pretty good neutral sig.


----------



## Raketen

b-dawk20 said:


> Hey guys, i just cant seem to come to a decision. I am looking for a flat as can be UIEM for $200-400 but I cant seem to make a choice. Every time i think i have it nailed down, I get worries about the extension or maybe the treble being too hot. Though most of my music is pop based, I just really desire a flat sound while not sounding enemic. Maybe im just asking for too much in the price range haha. That and there are a few I would of pulled the trigger on but are discontinued. So far I only got the Ety ER4P-T on deck.


 


 Depends on your notion of 'treble being too hot' but Jays Q-Jays might be a good fit for that.


----------



## peter123

nitolrahman said:


> But the Aurisonics Rockets are discontinued. Are there anything else?




If you're comfortable buying from Taobao the Super Audio 6 driver is really good with a signature reminding quite a bit about the Rockets and 1Plus :

http://m.intl.taobao.com/detail/detail.html?id=523860580368&wp_m=double_goods_6744510589&wp_pk=shop/index_845842348_1039905&from=inshop&wp_app=weapp


----------



## B-Dawk20

raketen said:


> Depends on your notion of 'treble being too hot' but Jays Q-Jays might be a good fit for that.


 
  
 The DT990's treble is "too hot" for me. My amp really helps calm that down but lord, I can only listen to them for so long. The most "flat" headphone I've had the pleasure of listening to is the 009 but thats $5000 worth of glory and I won't ask for that lol.


----------



## Raketen

b-dawk20 said:


> The DT990's treble is "too hot" for me. My amp really helps calm that down but lord, I can only listen to them for so long. The most "flat" headphone I've had the pleasure of listening to is the 009 but thats $5000 worth of glory and I won't ask for that lol.


 


 Only heard the 990s a little- Q-Jays do have a bit of a treble peak (I think Brooko's review had a graph) but IIRC not so drastic, nor v-shaped as they have relatively full sounding mids and only maybe slghtly elevated bass- some people note sibilance I think depending on how they fit (prone to this w/ iems myself)- for me this is solved with the foam tips (includes medium comply set).

 IMO it's a nice take on 'neutralish, but engaging'.

 Ezekiel mentioned Earsonics which might not be a bad idea either-  I haven't heard the sm64 in particular but have used two others and they seem to have that kind of sound down- perhaps with some different emphases depending on the model (the pseudo-graphs on their website seems to be reasonably indicative for my current model at least).

 ICYMI- Etymotics actually recently introduced two new ER4 models, including one with a small boost in bass... maybe those could be better for pop?


----------



## B-Dawk20

raketen said:


> Only heard the 990s a little- Q-Jays do have a bit of a treble peak (I think Brooko's review had a graph) but IIRC not so drastic, nor v-shaped as they have relatively full sounding mids and only maybe slghtly elevated bass- some people note sibilance I think depending on how they fit (prone to this w/ iems myself)- for me this is solved with the foam tips (includes medium comply set).
> 
> IMO it's a nice take on 'neutralish, but engaging'.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I'm looking at the two new Etys specifically so far. They really do sound down my line. I don't necessarily _need_ a bass boost but maybe my concern about is indicative of the fact that I should?  The neutralish but engaging seems like I'd like it, but I think I'm so obsessed with getting a neutral unforgiving sound as opposed to anything fun...though I have to be honest, I don't know what if I'll like it! It's just what I want I suppose.


----------



## Raketen

b-dawk20 said:


> I'm looking at the two new Etys specifically so far. They really do sound down my line. I don't necessarily _need_ a bass boost but maybe my concern about is indicative of the fact that I should?  The neutralish but engaging seems like I'd like it, but I think I'm so obsessed with getting a neutral unforgiving sound as opposed to anything fun...though I have to be honest, I don't know what if I'll like it! It's just what I want I suppose.


 


 I think a somewhat forgiving sound can be advantageous with pop music since it encompases such a wide range of styles and mixing. Unfortunately I haven't used the ER4 so no idea where they stand with respect to my notions- there seem to be many different ways to view & approach neutrality (as exhibited by the different target curves and such). I like having a couple different options to choose from depending on my mood... the worst choice of all 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 ATH-IM02 maybe another option, in my memory a bit more detailed/analytical-ish than the Q-Jays while maintaining a certain degree of smoothness (though Q-jays seem to respond to EQ in that range the few times I've messed around w/ it), but more source picky (and an awkward fit for some).

 Sony ex1000 (personal favorite IEM) possibly? It's a brighter/treble-leaning IEM with really well extended but non-enchanced bass... though I've never directly compared it with Q-Jays (or IM02 when I had those).

 I haven't used these but along similar lines of discussion have seen Campfire Audio's Orion & Nova, ATH-E70 and Mee Pinnacle mentioned a fair amount lately.


----------



## B-Dawk20

raketen said:


> I think a somewhat forgiving sound can be advantageous with pop music since it encompases such a wide range of styles and mixing. Unfortunately I haven't used the ER4 so no idea where they stand with respect to my notions- there seem to be many different ways to view & approach neutrality (as exhibited by the different target curves and such). I like having a couple different options to choose from depending on my mood... the worst choice of all
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 Definitely advantageous. I am a pop leaning listener and most of my headphones, well, I'll say all have a range of forgiveness to allow that type of music to not sound unappealing in a sense. That being said, in recognizing that none of my headphones do offer this, I do have a desire to go towards the least accommodating sound I can find because I want to explore that range of audio as a personal thing, more than trying to find something just for my enjoyment of the music. Maybe that sounds weird but it's my thought process currently. But anyway, thank you for all your help and the recommendations you have given.


----------



## ezekiel77

b-dawk20 said:


> Definitely advantageous. I am a pop leaning listener and most of my headphones, well, I'll say all have a range of forgiveness to allow that type of music to not sound unappealing in a sense. That being said, in recognizing that none of my headphones do offer this, I do have a desire to go towards the least accommodating sound I can find because I want to explore that range of audio as a personal thing, more than trying to find something just for my enjoyment of the music. Maybe that sounds weird but it's my thought process currently. But anyway, thank you for all your help and the recommendations you have given.


 
  
 I can only think of the UERM/UERR as "ruler flat" but I have a few friends that enjoy them immensely. It's custom-only, but I've also been considering one as a "palette cleanser".
  
 Otherwise, as Raketen has said, the EX1000 (or its cheaper little brother EX800ST) should do fine as well. Very popular stage/studio monitors in Japan.


----------



## B-Dawk20

Ended up buying the ER4S. I hope I like it!


----------



## vipervick

b-dawk20 said:


> Ended up buying the ER4S. I hope I like it!


 
 I have the ER MK5, but find them anemic without some gain, EQ and bass boost. However, the isolation is awesome. I ride a motorcycle an hour each way to/from work and the experience is quite good. This is for extreme metal though.


----------



## Trying2Learn

Generally, what does higher gain to do the sound aside from higher amplitude?


----------



## headdict

trying2learn said:


> Generally, what does higher gain to do the sound aside from higher amplitude?


 

 Higher noise floor? This is certainly of no concern when listening to extreme metal on a motorcycle. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



  
 Some amps have variable output impedance depending on the gain setting. That may affect the sound with (relatively) low impedance IEMs.


----------



## Trying2Learn

headdict said:


> Higher noise floor? This is certainly of no concern when listening to extreme metal on a motorcycle.
> 
> Some amps have variable output impedance depending on the gain setting. That may affect the sound with (relatively) low impedance IEMs.


Higher amplitude refers to higher volume


----------



## headdict

trying2learn said:


> Higher amplitude refers to higher volume


 

 Sure. What I *meant* to say is that a higher noise floor may contribute to a slightly different perception of how IEMs (or whatever) sound. This is the main reason why I would never use a higher gain than necessary. But then, for the additional noise to be audible, you would have to use a rather sensitive IEM with high-dynamic music in a silent environment. So that would certainly not be the use case vipervick described.
  
 In a nutshell higher gain means higher amplitude. Any side effects on the sound are most of the time either inaudible or detrimental.


----------



## B-Dawk20

vipervick said:


> I have the ER MK5, but find them anemic without some gain, EQ and bass boost. However, the isolation is awesome. I ride a motorcycle an hour each way to/from work and the experience is quite good. This is for extreme metal though.




I actually returned them. The sound was indeed really anemic. It worked for very particular songs but overall it wasn't pleasurable. They also gave me a headache because of the deep insertion I think. I'm not sure where to go from here. I might just go for a more full bodied IEM like the Dunu 2000


----------



## dakanao

b-dawk20 said:


> I actually returned them. The sound was indeed really anemic. It worked for very particular songs but overall it wasn't pleasurable. They also gave me a headache because of the deep insertion I think. I'm not sure where to go from here. I might just go for a more full bodied IEM like the Dunu 2000


I can recommend the Aurisons rockets with Comply T-500 tips placed in reverse


----------



## vaed

Hello |joker|!
  
 I'm looking at my first CIEM, around ~$500. I've fallen in love with the clarity of my Brainwavz B2's, but also the fun of my Vsonic GR07's. Ergo, I value clarity across the spectrum with a mild v-shape for a bit of excitement. Reading through your CIEM reviews, it seems like Alclair Reference ticks many of these boxes. Would you have any other recommendations I should consider (willing to up my budget if it's worth it!)?


----------



## infer

dakanao said:


> b-dawk20 said:
> 
> 
> > I actually returned them. The sound was indeed really anemic. It worked for very particular songs but overall it wasn't pleasurable. They also gave me a headache because of the deep insertion I think. I'm not sure where to go from here. I might just go for a more full bodied IEM like the Dunu 2000
> ...


 
 T-400 should work better (I have them both). It has thinner plastic barrel material and a bigger diameter hole. The Rockets bore is large and you may also get more open sound.


----------



## davidcotton

I work in a noisy factory type office area.  Lots of machinery going all day.  Can wear iems (not headphones as need to wear glasses due to vdu work).  Anything better than the shure 215's at the moment for isolation and cable over ear wear?  Had a pair way back when but they were part of the faulty batch at the start so got a refund on moved on.  In the uk so would prefer amazon or amp3.  Listen mainly to rock and audiobooks out of a ipod touch gen 3 64gig (yes I know, not allowed cameras so that rules out the 6th gen sadly).  Budget up to £300.  I've actually got a pair of Empire Ear's supras in custom form, but they are having to go back for a refit hence the request.  Was looking at the shures as a budget pair to tide me over and just wondered if there was anything newer, better for similar money?
  
 Thanks


----------



## bms44974

@davidcotton: Etymotic ER4 (sr or xr depending on your listening preference) provides exceptional isolation and solid SQ. The cable can be adapted for over-the-ear.
  
 Cheers... Brian


----------



## davidcotton

bms44974 said:


> @davidcotton: Etymotic ER4 (sr or xr depending on your listening preference) provides exceptional isolation and solid SQ. The cable can be adapted for over-the-ear.
> 
> Cheers... Brian


 

 Thanks, not entirely keen on that level of "ear rape" as it's been called though.  I do need to be somewhat aware of what's going on (particularly as I am half blind on one side, always fun that one with iems on and someone comes up to talk to me when standing on the right!).


----------



## ljokerl

vaed said:


> Hello |joker|!
> 
> I'm looking at my first CIEM, around ~$500. I've fallen in love with the clarity of my Brainwavz B2's, but also the fun of my Vsonic GR07's. Ergo, I value clarity across the spectrum with a mild v-shape for a bit of excitement. Reading through your CIEM reviews, it seems like Alclair Reference ticks many of these boxes. Would you have any other recommendations I should consider (willing to up my budget if it's worth it!)?


 
  
 Yep, the Alclair Reference is by far the best match for the GR07 among the reasonably affordable custom IEMs I've tried. Clarity isn't its focus like it is with the B2, but it's no slouch when it comes down to it.
  
 As for upgrades, unfortunately 1964 discontinued the V6-Stage so the next tier with that sound signature among what I've heard now starts at $900 or so - a much more sizable investment. 
  


davidcotton said:


> I work in a noisy factory type office area.  Lots of machinery going all day.  Can wear iems (not headphones as need to wear glasses due to vdu work).  Anything better than the shure 215's at the moment for isolation and cable over ear wear?  Had a pair way back when but they were part of the faulty batch at the start so got a refund on moved on.  In the uk so would prefer amazon or amp3.  Listen mainly to rock and audiobooks out of a ipod touch gen 3 64gig (yes I know, not allowed cameras so that rules out the 6th gen sadly).  Budget up to £300.  I've actually got a pair of Empire Ear's supras in custom form, but they are having to go back for a refit hence the request.  Was looking at the shures as a budget pair to tide me over and just wondered if there was anything newer, better for similar money?
> 
> Thanks


 
  
 Etymotic would have been my recommendation as well. Barring that, might as well just go with the SE215 again. Inexpensive, sturdy, and it seems like the isolation level fits your needs.


----------



## vaed

ljokerl said:


> Yep, the Alclair Reference is by far the best match for the GR07 among the reasonably affordable custom IEMs I've tried. Clarity isn't its focus like it is with the B2, but it's no slouch when it comes down to it.
> 
> As for upgrades, unfortunately 1964 discontinued the V6-Stage so the next tier with that sound signature among what I've heard now starts at $900 or so - a much more sizable investment.


 
 Thanks!
  
 I've been speaking with AJ from Alclair and we started talking about the Spire, their new 6-driver.
  
 Shot-in-the-dark:you haven't gotten a chance to listen to these, have you? They're supposedly a reference headphone with a bit of a bump in the low and high end, which sounds like what I'm looking for. They're $900 (as you mentioned ), but i'm willing to save up if the phone is right. 
  
 However, I've gotten my hands on a JH 13v2 demo, and it's making this decision even more complicated... (spoiler: it sounds fantastic!)


----------



## ljokerl

vaed said:


> Thanks!
> 
> I've been speaking with AJ from Alclair and we started talking about the Spire, their new 6-driver.
> 
> ...


 
  
 I haven't tried them myself but I asked someone familiar with the Alclair lineup and the Spire is supposedly a more stage-oriented sound with extra bass compared to the Reference and the new Studio4.
  
 Demos, while not perfect, are probably the safest way to decide on a custom earphone TBH.


----------



## vaed

ljokerl said:


> I haven't tried them myself but I asked someone familiar with the Alclair lineup and the Spire is supposedly a more stage-oriented sound with extra bass compared to the Reference and the new Studio4.
> 
> Demos, while not perfect, are probably the safest way to decide on a custom earphone TBH.


 
 I actually have a question about this.
  
 These JH13 demos came with silicone and foam eartips. Changing these tips changes the sound pretty substantially. The foam tips tame the highs quite a bit and warm the signature up a bit, whereas the silicone make the highs a bit sibilant and takes some body away from the sound. I'm a little worried about how the actual sound will turn out when they're turned into CIEMs. I've been told by JH that it's more to do with the fit than anything, ergo, whatever tips fit best will be the most representative of the sound, but it's really hard to tell, as both types of tips seal fairly well IMO, though obviously the foam ones conform a bit more to the inside of my ear.
  
  
 Do you have any insights on this conundrum?


----------



## tissot

Hey to the great people of HeadFi. 
 My trusty gym/on the go Beyerdynamic DTX102 decided to breakdown after 2 years just week before I'm leaving for a longer trip.
 I actually very much enjoyed the DTX102 vshaped sound signature for the use I had them. It seems like the DX120 DX160 don't follow on the DTX102/101 footsteps there. 
  
 So anybody here have a suggestion for a IEM under 80 euros I could get in my hands in a weeks time here in Northern Europe with similar sound signature to DTX102? I've done my research here, but anything hasn't jump on me. Especially from my usual IEM brands of Denon, Beyerdynamic and Sony.


----------



## ljokerl

vaed said:


> I actually have a question about this.
> 
> These JH13 demos came with silicone and foam eartips. Changing these tips changes the sound pretty substantially. The foam tips tame the highs quite a bit and warm the signature up a bit, whereas the silicone make the highs a bit sibilant and takes some body away from the sound. I'm a little worried about how the actual sound will turn out when they're turned into CIEMs. I've been told by JH that it's more to do with the fit than anything, ergo, whatever tips fit best will be the most representative of the sound, but it's really hard to tell, as both types of tips seal fairly well IMO, though obviously the foam ones conform a bit more to the inside of my ear.
> 
> ...


 
  
 In my experience custom earphone demos give you x% similarity to the real (custom-fit) thing (where x is different for every manufacturer/model), but still generally differ more than the what you can normally make up by tip rolling.
  
 As far as I'm concerned JH Audio's answer is true in the sense that whatever differences you hear between different tips, as long as they seal well, are still negligible in the context of a custom demo.
  
 Hope that makes sense, I know it's not a very helpful answer. 
  
  


tissot said:


> Hey to the great people of HeadFi.
> My trusty gym/on the go Beyerdynamic DTX102 decided to breakdown after 2 years just week before I'm leaving for a longer trip.
> I actually very much enjoyed the DTX102 vshaped sound signature for the use I had them. It seems like the DX120 DX160 don't follow on the DTX102/101 footsteps there.
> 
> So anybody here have a suggestion for a IEM under 80 euros I could get in my hands in a weeks time here in Northern Europe with similar sound signature to DTX102? I've done my research here, but anything hasn't jump on me. Especially from my usual IEM brands of Denon, Beyerdynamic and Sony.


 
  
 If ordering online/importing is an option, the Alpha & Delta AD01 is a very strong contender among v-shaped IEMs in that price range. The JVC HA-FXT90 is another.
  
 If you prefer to stick with a product that is available globally, the Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear is a good one.


----------



## tissot

Thank you very much for the suggestions! Alpha & Delta AD01 especially looks mighty interesting, but I can't take the risk of importing them to EU with the time constraint I'm in.
Actually decided to buy new pair of DTX 102 that I know I can get by Friday.


----------



## Zenophix

-


----------



## Ckhurana

Hello all,
  
 I need advice for an IEM as below -
  
 1) *Usage* - Desk (Laptop) and Active use (along with my Sansa clip + Note 3 for a run / gym);
  
 2) *Preferable Fit *- something which loops behind the ear;
  
 3) *Music Genre* - Old school Trance and EDM (Paul van Dyk etc.); Occasional Rock (U2, Linkin Park, Metallica, etc..); Instrumental Soundtracks (Hans Zimmer and so on...) so pretty much anything except hip hop beats or the occasional Rap song
  
 4) *Sounds like?* - Well, I have had the Brainwavz M2 earlier. They have been AWESOME but now the wires are frayed and *I need a Mic + volume remote for android *as well.
 So I would love something which although sounds accurate but still has a better than average (maybe a bit boomy?) bass.
  
 I also have the Piston 3 but honestly they suck when compared to the M2.
  
 Also, I ordered the "*sennheiser-ocx-686g-sports*" a couple of weeks back but had to return as they were only scoring in bass but with terrible lows and a harsh / sharp treble!
 (sorry if my audio knowledge is limited, tried to be as clear as I could!)
  
 4) *Budget* - Max *$100* (preferably under!)
  
 5) *Android* - So remote with volume and Mic are needed.
  
*Now on the forum, I have been suggested the below by some helpful folks - *

MEE M6 PRO (great but mixed reviews here on head-fi)
Tennmak pros (thanks @toddy0191)
  
 Although I haven't come across any actual reviews on Tennmak as the  M6s' (amazon.com ones are all paid!!), still the Tennmak seems like a good enough deal.
  
 (I am in India, I have my brother coming from USA in a couple of weeks' time; would appreciate any quick replies so I can order and get them shipped in time (both the above choices are on Amazon).
  
 Anyways, I just wanted to get some quick advise (/ encouragement!) and run this though before pulling the trigger!
  
 Many Thanks!
 Chetan


----------



## Zelda

ckhurana said:


> Hello all,
> 
> I need advice for an IEM as below -
> 
> ...


 
 AAW Nebula One seems to match all of that.


----------



## Ckhurana

Hello. Thanks for that. Have you personally tried it? Any reviews you can suggest please. At 99 a pop, any other choices? 

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk


----------



## Ckhurana

Also can they be driven off the note 3 or the sansa clip (unamped)? 

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk


----------



## agentsquish

Wow! massive thread. i was combing thru all the iems on theheadphonelist and im a bit overwhelmed. looking for a great bass iem for = or < 100. something with good sub bass that doesnt sacrifice the mids & highs


----------



## Shahab Khan

A very nice thread you have. It is a joy to see it after so many years.
  
 I bought my first pair of so called hi-fi IEMs "Future sonic m5" from reviews based on here. which started this whole thing for me. I later on bought Beyers dt770 and superlux 668b as well.
  
 I am about to purchase an other suitable IEM for my needs because i find the treble on the M5's to be a tad sharp and a bit fatiguing for me, But i do love the bass on those though.
  
 What will you recommend for a good pair of IEMs preferably under 100$, budget can be stretched to 150$ if sound wise it is considerably better.
  
 I like smooth or non fatiguing highs, a bit bassy sound signature with tight deep punchy bass but not too much to ruin the sound and with good mid bass as well. I listen to almost any music but mostly Rap, Hip-Hop, Electro, Trance, and some pop.   
  
 A sturdy build quality and an inline mic or remote would be a plus point. Not a necessity though.
  
 P.S: Considering i am from a third world country, I can not demo any IEMs in my country, Once i get the approval from your experience on which IEM to buy, only then will i be able to pull a trigger on it with my eyes closed. 
  
 Regards,
 Shab


----------



## ljokerl

agentsquish said:


> Wow! massive thread. i was combing thru all the iems on theheadphonelist and im a bit overwhelmed. looking for a great bass iem for = or < 100. something with good sub bass that doesnt sacrifice the mids & highs


 
  
 EPH-100 from Yamaha if you're prioritizing bass quality (and overall sound quality) over sheer boost/bassiness.
  
 If you just want the bass cranked up as high as possible, the Pump Audio Earphones do a good job. Next best thing would be a Beats Tour 2.0 or Velodyne vPulse.
  


shahab khan said:


> A very nice thread you have. It is a joy to see it after so many years.
> 
> I bought my first pair of so called hi-fi IEMs "Future sonic m5" from reviews based on here. which started this whole thing for me. I later on bought Beyers dt770 and superlux 668b as well.
> 
> ...


 
  
 Yamaha EPH-100 - non-fatiguing, great-quality deep bass, works very well for hip-hop and EDM-type genres. Would be my pick for sure.
  
 RHA MA750 would give you better build quality and a mic/remote (if you get the MA750i) but has a little more upper midrange presence than the Yamaha. It's not harsh by any means but just a little less "safe" from a sound quality standpoint per your requirements.
  
 If neither of those is available, you can consider the Shure SE215 (can also be outfitted with a mic cable later). It's very non-fatiguing but I find it a fairly dull listen compared to the two above.


----------



## Semak

Hey everyone, 

 My daughter just broke my IE80's 
  
 Time for me to look for some replacements.
  
 I loved the sound on my IE80's and I am not agains getting the same again, but its been 3 years since i last looked and so am out of the loop a bit.
  
 I enjoy a neutral sound and a wide soundstage. A detachable cable would be preferable as an in-line mic is a necessaty.
  
 Budget is around $250?
  
 Can anyone offer any suggestions?

 Thanks


----------



## Amitl

Hey everyone,
Just wanted to share my way of wearing my IEM. 
I do it with the my Sony mdr-ex650, unfortunately it rarely works with others because it requires a good long distance between the y-splitter and the phones. Also a cable cinch is a must. So there it is, i just slide the cinch all the way up to the phones and place my head between the cinch and the y-splitter, then release the cinch a bit. The cinch ends up behind my neck while the splitter at the front. Very secure, no microphonics!


----------



## bretemm

RHA just came out with a XLR iem and a amp for it. 
I have a sound question, 
Is there a noticeable difference between XLR and regular headphone jack IEMs? 

I am looking at also Shire, senheiser, Noble and JH Audio.


----------



## Niyologist

I'm looking for something up to $250 that's better than the DUNU DN2000. In terms of detail retrieval and deep bass with a large 3D Soundstage. Any suggestions?


----------



## Raketen

niyologist said:


> I'm looking for something up to $250 that's better than the DUNU DN2000. In terms of detail retrieval and deep bass with a large 3D Soundstage. Any suggestions?




Was going to suggest fx850 but it is a bit midbassy & idk 2000 only 2000J.

maye something on these lists will suit your needs: http://www.head-fi.org/t/761433/head-fi-basshead-iem-thread-lists-page-1


----------



## apaar123

Has anyone tried fiio x1 or RHA s500 or audio technica path anc23?


----------



## B9Scrambler

apaar123 said:


> Has anyone tried fiio x1 or RHA s500 or audio technica path anc23?


 
 I've got the Dunu Titan 1 which the X1 is based on, and the S500i. If you have questions about either I might be able to help out.


----------



## apaar123

How will you rate them?


----------



## apaar123

Has anyone tried beyerdynamic DX 160 or sound magic e 80?


----------



## apaar123

Hz





ljokerl said:


> (000) Short Take: Comparison by numbers
> 
> 
> To summarize, I've taken all of the data and calculated numerical averages of all of the scores for each earphone.
> ...


have you tried fiio ex1 or ath anc23 or beyerdynamic dx160?


----------



## peter123

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!






apaar123 said:


>


 
  


 Nice quote


----------



## 1TrickPony

niyologist said:


> I'm looking for something up to $250 that's better than the DUNU DN2000. In terms of detail retrieval and deep bass with a large 3D Soundstage. Any suggestions?



Got my bets on a Pm4 by trinity audio. Maybe I can give a comparison on top my head when I do get mine. A used Flc8s might get you those except in my experience with its seal, bass quantity was rather underwhelming...


----------



## ljokerl

1trickpony said:


> Got my bets on a Pm4 by trinity audio. Maybe I can give a comparison on top my head when I do get mine. A used Flc8s might get you those except in my experience with its seal, bass quantity was rather underwhelming...


 
  
 FLC8 was my thought as well but specifically for these three criteria it's hard to call it a DN-2000 upgrade. It can be a little more balanced than the DN-2000 which helps even out the soundstage, but then you also don't get the sub-bass of the DUNU.
  
 Pretty much everything else I have in that price range is a step down from the DN-2000 in one or more of the criteria.


----------



## apaar123

Guys has anyone tried fiio ex1 hifiman re400 and audio technica ath anc23?


----------



## NewWaveAudio

You should add some KZ iems


----------



## ibuckeye

Hi @ljokerl !
  
 First, I'm amazed that this is still alive. You're superhuman! A huge thank you for continuing to help the community! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




  
 I have long been a fan of Hifiman IEMs, and took your advice a couple times in the past when looking for new IEMs. Well, after years of using them I'm finally at a point where the build quality issues have trumped sound quality. I'm ready to look at other brands, and would appreciate your help.
  
 For background, I have owned the RE0, RE-ZERO, RE-262, and RE-400. Everything but the RE-262s have failed on me. If I were to rank their sound, it would be: RE-400 >>> RE-ZERO > RE0 > RE-262
  
 I did try the VSonic GR2s a few years ago, and didn't like the sibilance or the extra bass in comparison to the RE-400. The R-50s seem to be discontinued and I've been out of the loop on new product offerings in the last 2 years.
  
 Any recommendations on something in the $100-$200 range that sounds similar to RE-400/RE-ZERO and has better durability? Also, any good BAs to consider or should I stick to dynamic drivers in my search?
  
 Thanks!


----------



## LouisLoh

Please recommend an MMCX enabled IEM that can withstand workouts.


----------



## Raketen

louisloh said:


> Please recommend an MMCX enabled IEM that can withstand workouts.




I can't speak to it but I believe the Trinity Atlas is designed for sport and has MMCX connectors.

Does MMCX work well for your workouts? I always worry I sweat too much for removable cables, unless it were something like the Q-Jays threaded SMMCX connectors or the old sony EX connectors.


----------



## ljokerl

ibuckeye said:


> Hi @ljokerl !
> 
> First, I'm amazed that this is still alive. You're superhuman! A huge thank you for continuing to help the community!
> 
> ...


 
  
 Aurisonics Rockets are great for this but they're disappearing from the market. If you can find a used set around $200, that would be your best bet.
  
 Both BAs and dynamics from other brands are rarely tuned to sound like HiFiMan IEMs, but I don't have anything against BAs generally speaking. As a side note, keep in mind that different HiFiMan IEMs are still going to sound more similar to each other than they will to other sets.
  
 Anyway, the BA IEMs that arguably work best here are also long discontinued (TDK BA200s). Your closest current alternative out of what I've tried under $200 is the ATH-IM02. But I still think the Rockets are a better match - they manage to better capture the delicate, somewhat mid-centric, smooth-but-not-overly-dull sound that makes HiFiMan IEMs so special. 
  
  
  
  


louisloh said:


> Please recommend an MMCX enabled IEM that can withstand workouts.


 
  
 Shure SE215 has a good reputation for this but it's not designed specifically for sports like the Trinity Atlas and the Westone Adventure Series Alpha. I haven't tried the Atlas though, and I don't think the Westone Alpha sounds very good.


----------



## Raketen

I haven't heard the HiFiman IEM but if you think Rockets suit that situation, Zero Audio Doppio might be an ok BA substitute in the $100-200 range, though it's a bit brighter than the rockets & not as pleasing presentation as the IM02 IIRC (also depending on tips used a fair bit). I have read the Singolo is a bit warmer/closer to the Tenore... but again not sure how that stacks against hifiman directly. actually nvm, didn't notice the part about durability... not bad build but not super confident in it either.


----------



## vapman

I'm listening to this conversation as I always regretted not grabbing some of the Rockets while they were available...


----------



## B9Scrambler

vapman said:


> I'm listening to this conversation as I always regretted not grabbing some of the Rockets while they were available...


 
  
 My understanding is that Fender is planning to bring them back virtually unchanged, so you might still be able to try them out. At least, that was the word in the Aurisonics thread around the time to acquisition was announced.


----------



## ibuckeye

ljokerl said:


> Aurisonics Rockets are great for this but they're disappearing from the market. If you can find a used set around $200, that would be your best bet.
> 
> Both BAs and dynamics from other brands are rarely tuned to sound like HiFiMan IEMs, but I don't have anything against BAs generally speaking. As a side note, keep in mind that different HiFiMan IEMs are still going to sound more similar to each other than they will to other sets.
> 
> Anyway, the BA IEMs that arguably work best here are also long discontinued (TDK BA200s). Your closest current alternative out of what I've tried under $200 is the ATH-IM02. But I still think the Rockets are a better match - they manage to better capture the delicate, somewhat mid-centric, smooth-but-not-overly-dull sound that makes HiFiMan IEMs so special.


 
  
 I was afraid you'd say that. Caved and ordered another (my third) pair of RE-400s for now while I look for a good pair of Rockets. My first pair lasted nearly three years, so I definitely lucked out and for $79 I figured they might be worth another shot.
  
 Damn you Hifiman, why do your products sound so damn good but break even after babying them???
  
 I also noticed that the RE-0s have been re-released as RE-00. Did you get a chance to hear them? Any thoughts on how they compare to the IMO very analytical originals?


----------



## drm870

Hey Joker, I posted this on your website on the Xiaomi Hybrid Earphones review page, but I'm posting it here too now. (It's become a bit time sensitive -- long story):
  


> So…since you haven’t published the full review of the 1More Triple Driver yet, but you mention it is this review, I will ask you this here: how does the 1More Triple Driver stack up to the Dunu DN-1000? I need a replacement for the latter model earphone, but it looks like supply on online stores is drying up. Any thoughts?


 
  
 Thanks!


----------



## MoleInOne

Hi Heaf-Fi, 
  
 Long-time lurker - I dip in when every few years when I need to replace my IEM's. 
  
 Will keep this short - I need your help!
  
 I have been a long, long fanboy of the Fischer Audio Consonances IEM, and it was actually how I came about finding Head-Fi. I must have gone through about 4/5 pairs since 2010/11 having found them so 'fun' to listen to. They generally held up well (had a couple nicked), but loved their range and heavy bass throb.  
  
 My most recent pair have now given in the left channel, and unfortunately they seem a rare item now. I think it's time to try something new. In what's an increasingly saturated market, could someone please point me to something that they can attest to sounding similar, and ideally for a similar amount (<$50). My tastes vary, but range from IDM, rock, to jazz/bop. 
  
 I've tried the KZ HDS1, which are decent but comparatively a bit lacking. Also have KZ ED10's en route via the long boat from China, praying these will do the job. Sadly the old Fischer Audio thread has dried up a bit, so it's why I'm hopeful someone might be able to point me in the right direction. 
  
 Grateful to anyone that can help. Thanks!
  
 *Mods, please feel free to move this post to a more relevant thread if necessary.


----------



## Ckhurana

Guys..
  
 Just got the Tenmak PRO shipped from China, blown away!
  
 They are awesome! Great bass, great build and great fit  Thanks for all those who suggested it!
  
 Only Gripe... no volume buttons.. so a question... *would this work? *
  
 Let me know please!
  
 Thanks,
 Ckhurana


----------



## ngoshawk

ckhurana said:


> Guys..
> 
> Just got the Tenmak PRO shipped from China, blown away!
> 
> ...




I really, really enjoy the Tennmak Pro. As for the cable, I think it would work if the connections match. Worth a try!


----------



## fonkepala

ngoshawk said:


> I really, really enjoy the Tennmak Pro. As for the cable, I think it would work if the connections match. Worth a try!


 
  
 I could be mistaken, but are the Tennmak Pros exact copies of Shure SE215?


----------



## ngoshawk

fonkepala said:


> I could be mistaken, but are the Tennmak Pros exact copies of Shure SE215?




That is what some have said. I have not heard the SE215's, though.


----------



## fonkepala

ngoshawk said:


> That is what some have said. I have not heard the SE215's, though.


 
  
 Ok. They do look really similar though, except for maybe the cable connectors. 
  
 Would appreciate if someone could chime in regarding how the Tennmark Pro sound...is it similar to SE215?


----------



## John Q Lin

Hi guys, I'm new to the IEM game, I just got the Shure SE215 for $80, what do you guys reconmmand for upgrades to it.


----------



## Ckhurana

fonkepala said:


> Ok. They do look really similar though, except for maybe the cable connectors.
> 
> Would appreciate if someone could chime in regarding how the Tennmark Pro sound...is it similar to SE215?


 
 I have tried a friend's Shure 215s. The Tennmak (although priced around 21-25$, depending on where you get them from), offer a sound stage which is quite different.
 He had to burn in the Shure's for quite some time, but the TM Pros sounded great right out of the box.
  
 Also, AFAIK, the Shure's are single micro driver but the Tennmak are dual drivers (hence more and cleaner bass).
  
 For me they are as good (or even better) in SQ and build quality.
  
 You can find some reviews on the Tennmak here on head-fi as well.
  
 Thanks,
 CK


----------



## fonkepala

ckhurana said:


> I have tried a friend's Shure 215s. The Tennmak (although priced around 21-25$, depending on where you get them from), offer a sound stage which is quite different.
> He had to burn in the Shure's for quite some time, but the TM Pros sounded great right out of the box.
> 
> Also, AFAIK, the Shure's are single micro driver but the Tennmak are dual drivers (hence more and cleaner bass).
> ...


 
  
 Thanks for the input @Ckhurana . Interesting, will have to give the Tennmak Pro a try then. Where's the best place to get them..AliExpress?
  
 The SE215's bass is already enough for me, quite 'bloomy' & overwhelming sometimes. So if the dual drivers on the Tennmak Pro is able to give cleaner & more well controlled bass, then that's excellent.


----------



## fonkepala

john q lin said:


> Hi guys, I'm new to the IEM game, I just got the Shure SE215 for $80, what do you guys reconmmand for upgrades to it.


 
  
 Try the MeeAudio Pinnacle P1.


----------



## peter123

fonkepala said:


> Thanks for the input @Ckhurana
> . Interesting, will have to give the Tennmak Pro a try then. Where's the best place to get them..AliExpress?
> 
> The SE215's bass is already enough for me, quite 'bloomy' & overwhelming sometimes. So if the dual drivers on the Tennmak Pro is able to give cleaner & more well controlled bass, then that's excellent.




My guess is that the bass on the Tennmak will be of better quality and the subbass on the SE215 doesn't reach very low (albeit mid bass is too much for me to on them) so the Tennmak will probably have deeper bass as well. 

Anyway my Pros should be here in about a week so I'd guess we'll know for sure then


----------



## fonkepala

peter123 said:


> My guess is that the bass on the Tennmak will be of better quality and the subbass on the SE215 doesn't reach very low (albeit mid bass is too much for me to on them) so the Tennmak will probably have deeper bass as well.
> 
> Anyway my Pros should be here in about a week so I'd guess we'll know for sure then


 
  
 Great! Would appreciate if you could let us know your initial impression of the Tennmak Pro once yours arrive. I'm most interested in the shape & size of the earpiece housing. If they're 100% identical to the SE215 then my ears won't be too happy with them, but if they sound way better than the SE215 then maybe I'll take a risk on 'em.


----------



## peter123

fonkepala said:


> Great! Would appreciate if you could let us know your initial impression of the Tennmak Pro once yours arrive. I'm most interested in the shape & size of the earpiece housing. If they're 100% identical to the SE215 then my ears won't be too happy with them, but if they sound way better than the SE215 then maybe I'll take a risk on 'em.




I sure will. The SE215 is not my cup of tea either and I've heard plenty of sub $50 Asia IEM's that outperform them for my preferences so I believe that the Tennmak could be able to do so as well.

Not much to complain about on the build quality and ergonomics on the SE215 though.


----------



## Podster

fonkepala said:


> Thanks for the input @Ckhurana . Interesting, will have to give the Tennmak Pro a try then. Where's the best place to get them..AliExpress?
> 
> The SE215's bass is already enough for me, quite 'bloomy' & overwhelming sometimes. So if the dual drivers on the Tennmak Pro is able to give cleaner & more well controlled bass, then that's excellent.


 

 I kind of like my SE215's with a couple of my sources but what fixed the bass for me was silver plated copper
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Probably will pick up the Tennmak Pro but waiting to hear Peter's impressions 1st
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 (Not to mention I need another iem like and Eskimo needs a bag of ice)


----------



## fonkepala

podster said:


> I kind of like my SE215's with a couple of my sources but what fixed the bass for me was silver plated copper
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
  
 May I know where you got the silver cable upgrade for the SE215?
  
 Likewise on the Tennmak Pro, eagerly waiting Peter's review on it.


----------



## Trying2Learn

ngoshawk said:


> That is what some have said. I have not heard the SE215's, though.


Does that mean sonically? Because the tennmak is a dual dynamic


----------



## ngoshawk

trying2learn said:


> Does that mean sonically? Because the tennmak is a dual dynamic




Sorry, I can't help you. I have never heard the SE215's. I do really like the Tennmak Pro sound. Just an overall pleasant sound with enough bass/mid/treble to satisfy me. Very good soundstage, too.


----------



## Hun7er

Hi,
  
 I have read a lot of review but can't decide which is the more neutral (not v shaped please) IEM under 400 dollars ?


----------



## fonkepala

ngoshawk said:


> Sorry, I can't help you. I have never heard the SE215's. I do really like the Tennmak Pro sound. Just an overall pleasant sound with enough bass/mid/treble to satisfy me. Very good soundstage, too.




Awesome! Where'd you get the Tennmak Pro from.. AliE or Gearbest?


----------



## ngoshawk

fonkepala said:


> Awesome! Where'd you get the Tennmak Pro from.. AliE or Gearbest?




AliE


----------



## bms44974

hun7er said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have read a lot of review but can't decide which is the more neutral (not v shaped please) IEM under 400 dollars ?


 
 I am very impressed with the new Etymotic ER4SR ($350). They have reference-quality neutral response and some of the best isolation available.
  
 Cheers... Brian


----------



## John Q Lin

Hi, ladies and gentleman. I'm extremely new to the IEM game. I'm in need of advice. 

I have the SE215 on ordered, and considering getting the stuff below. SE215 will be my first "good" in ear headphone. 

Etymotic Research MC5
Logitech UE 900s
SoundMAGIC E10
Etymotic Research HF5
VSONIC GR07 and bass edition
thinksound rain
1MORE Triple Driver

What do you all think will be a good complement to the SE215?

Thanks Guys


----------



## bms44974

john q lin said:


> Hi, ladies and gentleman. I'm extremely new to the IEM game. I'm in need of advice.
> 
> I have the SE215 on ordered, and considering getting the stuff below. SE215 will be my first "good" in ear headphone.
> 
> ...


 

 You can scratch the MC5 off the list since the HF5 is much better (IMHO). You might also consider the Ety HF3. It's the same as the HF5 with an in-line microphone for your phone.
  
 Cheers... Brian


----------



## suman134

john q lin said:


> Hi, ladies and gentleman. I'm extremely new to the IEM game. I'm in need of advice.
> 
> I have the SE215 on ordered, and considering getting the stuff below. SE215 will be my first "good" in ear headphone.
> 
> ...


 

   Drop nothing from the list. And yes, HF-5/3 will be a nice compliment.


----------



## John Q Lin

So, you recommend them all? In terms of sound quality how would you rank them.

Thanks again 



suman134 said:


> john q lin said:
> 
> 
> > Hi, ladies and gentleman. I'm extremely new to the IEM game. I'm in need of advice.
> ...


----------



## suman134

john q lin said:


> So, you recommend them all? In terms of sound quality how would you rank them.
> 
> Thanks again


 

  Top to low, better one first:-
  
  1. UE900 ( get the Q-jays)
  2. GR07 bass edition ( nope cant be replaced)
  3. ETY HF5/3 ( neither can this be, but hisound HA2 is good)
  4. one more triple ( kind of lost in the mix, doesnt have anything special that one of these earphones cant do)
  5. ETY MC 5
  6. thinksound rain
  7. E10 ( drop this one probably and get the E50, or for pure bass Hisound WooDuo)
  
  There is one you can add though, the mighty RE-400.


----------



## ezekiel77

john q lin said:


> Hi, ladies and gentleman. I'm extremely new to the IEM game. I'm in need of advice.


 
  
 GR07 regular gets my vote. Good balance, bass layering and awesome detail for its price. Bass edition is more mainstream but regular is the better all-rounder. Sometimes the greatness of a monitor is measured by how much you miss it after it's gone. The GR07 has that effect on me.


----------



## apaar123

can anyone compare fiio ex1 and hifiman re400 please?


----------



## Shawn71

apaar123 said:


> can anyone compare fiio ex1 and hifiman re400 please?




EX1 and Dunu Titan 1 are same except for the cable and their respective logo embossed on the back....so,may be the following link might give you some insight.

 http://www.head-fi.org/products/dunu-titan-1-titanium-coated-diaphragm-earphones/reviews/12537

Btw, the re400 cable is not that good in comparison and short-live albeit good babying,imo......And mind you, both are titan-ium coated diaphragm and the EX1's are larger and semi open against vented,very small shells of re400s.


----------



## marcusdb

Hello, I was hoping to get some recommendations for some new universal IEMs. I'm looking for something with a slight boost in the bass area and a boost in the treble area. I guess this sounds like a typical v-shaped sound signature except, except I would also like a boost in the lower highs so that vocals sound very clear and detailed. I made a graph to better describe the sound:
  


 Does anybody know of any universal IEMs with a sound similar to this? I would prefer something that takes Shure / Westone tips. Thanks in advance.


----------



## Raketen

marcusdb said:


> Hello, I was hoping to get some recommendations for some new universal IEMs. I'm looking for something with a slight boost in the bass area and a boost in the treble area. I guess this sounds like a typical v-shaped sound signature except, except I would also like a boost in the lower highs so that vocals sound very clear and detailed. I made a graph to better describe the sound:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




IDK if that is "v-shaped" necessarily, particularly if your focus is vocals... Graphs are so variable, differing equipment and compenastion curves etc... for instance I I think I have seen graphs of more " neutral " oriented Q-Jays or ER4XR ( https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/4hg6c4/etymotic_er4xr_frequency_response/ ) that look kind of like that, or treble leaning EX1000 ( http://i.imgur.com/58vfR.jpg ) or v-shaped JVC ( http://en.goldenears.net/51365 ) or " u-shaped " like Dunu 2000J ( https://cymbacavum.com/2015/06/13/gojira-or-how-the-dunu-dn-2000j-changed-my-mind-about-hybrid-iems/3/ )

I have the Q-Jays, suspect they may not have enough bass per your preference, but vocals sound clear plus still have some body, and they fit Shure foams (personally find foams necessary w/ them thanks to that 6-7k peak and my shallow fit ears causing some sibilance issues, though I find the included foams a little more effective at this).


----------



## John Q Lin

From my research, I found the UE900 has really bad build quality. So, It's off the list. Can anyone here confirm that or care to common. 

Here is what I like to add to my collection in the future. I've not have the change to listen to any of them. What are you guys opinions on those below.

I like all kinds of music, from classical to rap, metal. 

 Klipsch Image X10 
 MEE audio Pinnacle P1
 RHA MA750i
 VSONIC GR07 Bass Edition 
 Etymotic Research ER4S

Thanks in advance for all the inputs.


----------



## fonkepala

john q lin said:


> From my research, I found the UE900 has really bad build quality. So, It's off the list. Can anyone here confirm that or care to common.
> 
> Here is what I like to add to my collection in the future. I've not have the change to listen to any of them. What are you guys opinions on those below.
> 
> ...




I'm no expert, but I've heard good things about numbers 2 to 4. I noticed that you've asked this exact same question before, either here or in another thread. What's best for YOU may not be the best for someone else. So there comes a time in this hobby that you just have to take a leap of faith and pull the trigger on a product that looks promising. Just try it, if you don't like it then perhaps it can be sold off or returned. Of course, do due diligence and do some prior research. I believe there's a lot of reviews written already for numbers 2-4, and perhaps 1 as well. 

I do own a Pinnacle P1, and for me currently it's the best IEM I have, I like it greatly. Some people haven't gotten along well with it, however...so as with almost anything else in this hobby, YMMV.


----------



## ljokerl

apaar123 said:


> can anyone compare fiio ex1 and hifiman re400 please?


 
  
The Titan 1 is both brighter and bassier, resulting in a more v-shaped sound signature and more colored tone. RE-400 is a little mid-centric in comparison but is overall more neutral, as well as smoother and more forgiving through the upper midrange and treble. The Titan 1 tends to be clearer and more dynamic, and has a wider, airier presentation.
  


john q lin said:


> From my research, I found the UE900 has really bad build quality. So, It's off the list. Can anyone here confirm that or care to common.
> 
> Here is what I like to add to my collection in the future. I've not have the change to listen to any of them. What are you guys opinions on those below.
> 
> ...


 
  
 My advice: spend some time with your first purchase (the SE215) so you can get a solid understanding of your likes and dislikes. It'll be much easier to choose a set once you have a data point for IEM sound with your SE215. It also helps to listen to other mid-high end sets every chance you get so that you can hone in on your "ideal" sound (or multiple preferred sound signatures for each genres/purpose, if that's the case).
  
 Of course if you just want to try different things, you can put a collection together from a list but I tend to think it's better to build it up piece by piece.


----------



## John Q Lin

ljokerl said:


> apaar123 said:
> 
> 
> > can anyone compare fiio ex1 and hifiman re400 please?
> ...



I like bass and mids. I have the m100, hd600, x2, thx00, he500 as my full size headphones. I just brought a RHA MA750i from ebay.


----------



## gambit50

Searching for a cheap pair of IEM w mic. I have a good pair but don't want to abuse them travelling or whatever plus the cable is short. Sub $30 probably but can be $5, I don't care. Not being picky at this price point but if there is one with a good amount of bass that is not all torn up that might be best.
 Difficult to search for 'with mic' so sorry for this.
 Also, could use a cheap extension for my other IEMs. Any input appreciated. I am lazy about this one.
  
 Cheers


----------



## Tom22

john q lin said:


> I like bass and mids. I have the m100, hd600, x2, thx00, he500 as my full size headphones. I just brought a RHA MA750i from ebay.




Based on what u have u seem to favor bass and treble. 

It seems from the m100 and rha ma750 x2,purchase

But bass and mids?

Nuforce ne800m? 

A bit more balanced klipsch x7? Laid back treble


----------



## adrift02

Hi joker -- I believe you've proposed the AF180 and SD-2 as viable upgrades from the RE-400, but can you give me a comparison or pro/con between the two in that context?
  
 I tried to jump "up" from the RE-400 a while ago, but ended up going back to it (had to solder a new jack) after trying a few different IEMs, RE-600 included. Just really loved the mids/vocals -- how they're a bit warm and forward -- along with high-end detail and lack of sibilance.
  
 Any thoughts would be appreciated. If it matters, I'm running an Oppo HA-2SE.


----------



## John Q Lin

So I got the RHA MA750i, I like it. should i just go for the t20. is there other alternative to it Joker? Thanks


----------



## John Q Lin

fk it, so I found the T20 for under $150 and I jumped in. how much of a upgrade is the t20 compare to the ma750 and se215. Thanks guys


----------



## xtwargodtx

Does anyone have any recommendations for iem's around $50 cad? My Vsonic VSD3S just died and im looking to get something around the same SQ. Also i really would like them to have an around the ear design. I am currently thinking maybe the Meeaduio M6Pro?


----------



## ljokerl

gambit50 said:


> Searching for a cheap pair of IEM w mic. I have a good pair but don't want to abuse them travelling or whatever plus the cable is short. Sub $30 probably but can be $5, I don't care. Not being picky at this price point but if there is one with a good amount of bass that is not all torn up that might be best.
> Difficult to search for 'with mic' so sorry for this.
> Also, could use a cheap extension for my other IEMs. Any input appreciated. I am lazy about this one.
> 
> Cheers


 
  
 Philips SHE3595. Plenty of bass, and the sound quality will probably surprise you (in a good way) for the $15 price.
  


adrift02 said:


> Hi joker -- I believe you've proposed the AF180 and SD-2 as viable upgrades from the RE-400, but can you give me a comparison or pro/con between the two in that context?
> 
> I tried to jump "up" from the RE-400 a while ago, but ended up going back to it (had to solder a new jack) after trying a few different IEMs, RE-600 included. Just really loved the mids/vocals -- how they're a bit warm and forward -- along with high-end detail and lack of sibilance.
> 
> Any thoughts would be appreciated. If it matters, I'm running an Oppo HA-2SE.


 
  
 AF180 and SD-2 will both be less similar to the RE-400 than the RE-600 is, so if you're not open to changing up the sound tuning a bit I probably wouldn't bother.
  
 AF180 doesn't have a mid-forward sound and is a little more energetic in the upper treble than HiFiMan sets tend to be.
  
 SD-2 is more mid-centric, but also a little on the darker side of things while also not really having a smoothness advantage over the RE-400 as you may expect. If you're going to try the SD-2 you might as well consider the Audio-Technica IM02 - its tuning is very similar to SD-2 but it's much less expensive. 
  


xtwargodtx said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for iem's around $50 cad? My Vsonic VSD3S just died and im looking to get something around the same SQ. Also i really would like them to have an around the ear design. I am currently thinking maybe the Meeaduio M6Pro?


 
  
 The best match would probably be another VSonic, very hard to beat them in that price range for that type of sound AND with an over-the-ear cord routing among what I've tried (which does not include M6 PRO).


----------



## fonkepala

xtwargodtx said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for iem's around $50 cad? My Vsonic VSD3S just died and im looking to get something around the same SQ. Also i really would like them to have an around the ear design. I am currently thinking maybe the Meeaduio M6Pro?


 
  
 I've tried the M6 Pro and they sound great for the price. Comfort & the included accessories are great as well (2 detachable cables, lots of tips, etc). They are not basshead IEM's though, if anything they can be considered bright. If you don't mind that, I say go for it. However, I've never tried the VSD3S so not sure what your preferred sound signature is.


----------



## xtwargodtx

fonkepala said:


> I've tried the M6 Pro and they sound great for the price. Comfort & the included accessories are great as well (2 detachable cables, lots of tips, etc). They are not basshead IEM's though, if anything they can be considered bright. If you don't mind that, I say go for it. However, I've never tried the VSD3S so not sure what your preferred sound signature is.


 I usually go for a warmer sound cuz I listen to r&b most of the time


----------



## xtwargodtx

ljokerl said:


> Philips SHE3595. Plenty of bass, and the sound quality will probably surprise you (in a good way) for the $15 price.
> 
> 
> AF180 and SD-2 will both be less similar to the RE-400 than the RE-600 is, so if you're not open to changing up the sound tuning a bit I probably wouldn't bother.
> ...


 would you have a recommendation on something more durable? The strain relief was the thing that failed on my vsonics so I'm not too sure I would want to buy them again


----------



## gambit50

@ljoker1, thanks, mate. Ordered a pair for half retail so difficult to be disappointed. Just hope they don't die quickly for no reason.


----------



## John Q Lin

Hi joker, i love the T20, the bass was amazing. What should I get next. Thanks uncle J.


----------



## Raketen

xtwargodtx said:


> I usually go for a warmer sound cuz I listen to r&b most of the time





xtwargodtx said:


> would you have a recommendation on something more durable? The strain relief was the thing that failed on my vsonics so I'm not too sure I would want to buy them again




FYI Just saw a mention that the VSD3S is $30 on massdrop atm. 

zero Audio Carbo Tenore is a warmish inear, word is the build quality isn't great (didn't have them long enough to tell). Can wear them behind the ear but they don't have memory wire.


----------



## taxidrivr

been on the hunt for a pair of IEMs ~$100-200 (some less), found way a lot of choices; found the following met my needs in one way or another. inline remote is unnecessary, also do not like over-ear fitment. 
  
 MEE Audio Pinnacle P1
 Klipsch x12i
 Sony xba-h1
 Jvc FX850
 Yamaha EPH-100
 Etymotic hf5
  
  
 anything else to consider? fwiw, my go-to over-ear headphones are Sony MDR-V6's have been very happy with them (balanced, flat), just need a more portable set. aware of fakes online, hope to avoid and buy form reliable/trustworthy store.
  
 appreciate any help!


----------



## John Q Lin

HI guys I already have the RHA ma750 and T20i. By away I absolutely loved the T20i, it's my best iem.
Should I look into the list below. Or pass. Any suggestions would help.

Thank you. 

VSonic GR07 Bass Edition.              
EtymoticER4S.                         
Hifimanre400.                          
Philip fidelio S1/S2                    
HiFiManRE262.                          
Dunu DN-1000/2000.              
Sennheiser Momentum In-Ear.


----------



## Shawn71

john q lin said:


> HI guys I already have the RHA ma750 and T20i. By away I absolutely loved the T20i, it's my best iem.
> Should I look into the list below. Or pass. Any suggestions would help.
> 
> Thank you.
> ...




Dunu's will be a step above from where you are coming from,imo.....GR07 and RE400 cables will let you down over time but they are wonderful monitors for the price.

Let others pour their opinions as well.....


----------



## cylpol1

Looking for a new item. Wondering if people can give me suggestions. Looking for either ba or hybrid, preferably ba. Replaceable cable a plus but not necessary. Not interested in shure. My range is 200-250 thank you.


----------



## ezekiel77

cylpol1 said:


> Looking for a new item. Wondering if people can give me suggestions. Looking for either ba or hybrid, preferably ba. Replaceable cable a plus but not necessary. Not interested in shure. My range is 200-250 thank you.




ATH-IM02 fits the criteria, what what would your preferred sound sig be? The IM02 is detailed but might lack bass for some.


----------



## cylpol1

ezekiel77 said:


> ATH-IM02 fits the criteria, what what would your preferred sound sig be? The IM02 is detailed but might lack bass for some.


 I actually have them


----------



## malifact

Hello, I was hoping to get some recommendations for a universal IEM with very high isolation.  I’ve done a lot of research and there is nothing that has my preferred sound signature and so I’d like something balanced/neutral that responds well to EQ.  Isolation is the priority.  I’m not looking to spend more than £100 ($125 USD), as I don’t want to spend a lot on something that I have to EQ.  However, I can go over that amount. Already looked into the Etymotic ER-4 (too expensive). Also, no CIEM recommendations please. Thanks in advance for your suggestions.


----------



## Shawn71

malifact said:


> Hello, I was hoping to get some recommendations for a universal IEM with very high isolation.  I’ve done a lot of research and there is nothing that has my preferred sound signature and so I’d like something balanced/neutral that responds well to EQ.  Isolation is the priority.  I’m not looking to spend more than £100 ($125 USD), as I don’t want to spend a lot on something that I have to EQ.  However, I can go over that amount. Already looked into the Etymotic ER-4 (too expensive). Also, no CIEM recommendations please. Thanks in advance for your suggestions.


First thing strike my mind is ety's hf5 that cld fit you in every aspect that you lookin for,especially isolation top priority.....current running price is $129! Some might not be comfortable with triple flanges/deep insertion tho,just a point to remember,"trade-off', for best sound isolation.


----------



## malifact

shawn71 said:


> First thing strike my mind is ety's hf5 that cld fit you in every aspect that you lookin for,especially isolation top priority.....current running price is $129! Some might not be comfortable with triple flanges/deep insertion tho,just a point to remember,"trade-off', for best sound isolation.


 
  
 Thanks, I do have some experience with the Etymotic range and was hoping for something else. I don't usually mind deep insertion, but the Etymotics don't seem to play nice with my ears.
  
 I should add that probably a v-shaped sound is probably more suitable than balanced, as the sound I am aiming for with EQ is closer to v-shaped than balanced.  For those who are familiar with Poweramp, it is similar to the Techno preset


----------



## loomisjohnson

malifact said:


> Hello, I was hoping to get some recommendations for a universal IEM with very high isolation.  I’ve done a lot of research and there is nothing that has my preferred sound signature and so I’d like something balanced/neutral that responds well to EQ.  Isolation is the priority.  I’m not looking to spend more than £100 ($125 USD), as I don’t want to spend a lot on something that I have to EQ.  However, I can go over that amount. Already looked into the Etymotic ER-4 (too expensive). Also, no CIEM recommendations please. Thanks in advance for your suggestions.
 

 the bosshifi b3 is a wooden chinese hybrid which isolates extremely well and has a generally balanced signature with a ton of detail. You can get it for $35 on Amazon. folks are necessarily skeptical that it can't be very good if it's that inexpensive, bu to my ears it genuinely outperforms a lot of the much pricier players touted on this forum.


----------



## Mattyj6969

Hi Guys,

I ordered the k10's on the 13th of October and sent my impressions on the 14th from the uk, how long should it be to receive the email from the labs in Japan? The post office notified me they were received in America on the 24th. Also as I've placed my order in between the transition between the original k10 and the oncore will I still receive the originals?

Regards

Matt

Oops sorry posted in the wrong thread please ingnore this post.


----------



## Hi-Fi'er

I think Trinity Audio needs to be included.


----------



## B9Scrambler

If you're looking for a very good, bright earphone, the Finder X1_ should be on your shortlist to try.
  
 http://www.head-fi.org/products/echobox-audio-finder-x1/reviews/17372
  
  ​           ​  ​ _


----------



## Tic-Tac

Anyone reviewed ActionPie VJJB-V1S ? I'm very curious about these. Also, I'm looking for Apple Earbuds shape like because those have the perfect fit for my ears but they don't sound so good unfortunately...


----------



## Mdraluck23

ljokerl what's your pick for a modern VC1000? Similar price range or a bit cheaper but that's the sound signature I'm after.


----------



## John Q Lin

What do you guys think about the Noble drop on massdrop.


----------



## ezekiel77

john q lin said:


> What do you guys think about the Noble drop on massdrop.


 
  
 I've heard the Savant and it was a bit too flat/reference for my tastes. Hope the MD edition makes it more accessible. I've listened to Savant and K10 in a meet, and it's an unfair to even compare lol.


----------



## battleaxe

Do you think you can also review the Beyerdynamic Byron wired, and Audio-technica -CKX9iS, which are going for under $50 now?


----------



## John Q Lin

what do you guys think about the westone 30 iem on massdrop, i currently have the t20i, and joined the drop on the noble drop, is the westone30 better than both.
thank you in advance.


----------



## JediMa70

I got today my HIFIMAN re 400 Waterline , they are just amazing, I love the clear and nice soud plus they came in a double box with a nice rigid carry bag and extra earplugs, It's impressive the quality of these IEMs at this price!!


----------



## JonnyRocket

Subscribed


----------



## Trying2Learn

Unfortunately, my Fidue A73 did not survive the washing machine and I am left with 2 Monk + and a Pinnacle P1 both of which I dont want to bring around while walking to school as the former doesn't isolate enough and the latter is quite heavy and the cable is clunky as well. Anyways, I'm looking for an iem around 100 that is relevant today. Is the GR07 classics still relevant? I'm looking at the 1More Triple Driver as well, any other great value iems around $100?


----------



## moneywoes

so what are the cheapest IEMs that have a working volume control added?


----------



## moneywoes

so what are the cheapest IEMs that have a working volume control added?


----------



## Zelda

moneywoes said:


> so what are the cheapest IEMs that have a working volume control added?


 
 maybe A&D D2M from Lendmeurears. also sound pretty great


----------



## EAPOCS

Hi, any special recommendations for someone searching for a step up from Xiaomi Piston 3 and Sony Mh1 earphones up to 100$/€.
  
 Shouldn't be too analytical, a bit on the warm side would be nice. I quite like the sound profile of the Piston 3.
 Definitely not searching for some bass heavy inears.
  
 I like listening to electro music stuff, but also I do like listening to classical music played on piano, guitar, viola and so on.
 So, clarity with the treble is a must.
  
 FiiO EX1 plastic version is sold for 63€.
 Any comment on these earphones, decent upgrade?


----------



## Zelda

eapocs said:


> Hi, any special recommendations for someone searching for a step up from Xiaomi Piston 3 and Sony Mh1 earphones up to 100$/€.
> 
> Shouldn't be too analytical, a bit on the warm side would be nice. I quite like the sound profile of the Piston 3.
> Definitely not searching for some bass heavy inears.
> ...


 
 Titan 1 / Ex1 is a good option. 
 or you may want to consider the Titan 5


----------



## EAPOCS

Any alternatives to those, but with better isolation?
  
 Have read they have really bad isolation and thus will leak noise to the outside world very well.


----------



## LeConducteur

Any IEM's for portable and desktop use ? 
 - over the ear IEM
 - non-cheap build quality
 - really good isolation
 - Sound: bass punchy (sub bass tight), wide soundstage (instrument seperation=imaging ?), non-hollow (vocals/mid shall not be recessed) , natural and detailled 
 - budget: under 350$


----------



## ngoshawk

xtwargodtx said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for iem's around $50 cad? My Vsonic VSD3S just died and im looking to get something around the same SQ. Also i really would like them to have an around the ear design. I am currently thinking maybe the Meeaduio M6Pro?




Sorry, late to this discussion. I have the M6 Pro. It was my first foray back into Head-Fi. I really like them and use the M6 at the gym all the time. However, since then I have purchased many many more expensive IEM's and only use the M6 Pro's for working out. They are a bit too bright for my taste, but I still like them.

An alternative I found which I REALLY like is the Tennmak Pro. More bass (not necessarily better), portable, decent sound stage, and half the price of my M6 Pro. I now split my gym time between the two, leaning more towards the Tennmak. That said, I have not heard the VSonic which you use, but have heard much good info about them.

Good luck, if you haven't already chosen! And congrats if you did!


----------



## DecentLevi

Hello guys, I'm really in need of a brief suggestion on IEMs please. I need some decent IEMs for working at a factory that are very isolating and clean sounding. The form factor I'm looking for would be long & narrow like the photos below, allowing for 'deep inseretion' for better isolation / ease of taking in/out. The sound signature I'm looking for is crisp, linear/transparent, and if possible at least somewhat detailed & sweet.
  
 I've tried the ER4-P a good 10 years ago, but I must have not gotten the tips sorted out because I never seemed to get good sound out of them. I'm thinking to try their MK5 Isolator earphones - these look nice and affordable, but I don't know any trustable reviews. I've gotten a few of your suggestions before such as the Vsonic VC02 last year, only to discover the sound to be quite lacking in detail and have it fall apart.

  
  
@ljokerl or anyone please let me know which one are recommended like this. Thanks!...


----------



## loomisjohnson

decentlevi said:


> Hello guys, I'm really in need of a brief suggestion on IEMs please. I need some decent IEMs for working at a factory that are very isolating and clean sounding. The form factor I'm looking for would be long & narrow like the photos below, allowing for 'deep inseretion' for better isolation / ease of taking in/out. The sound signature I'm looking for is crisp, linear/transparent, and if possible at least somewhat detailed & sweet.
> 
> I've tried the ER4-P a good 10 years ago, but I must have not gotten the tips sorted out because I never seemed to get good sound out of them. I'm thinking to try their MK5 Isolator earphones - these look nice and affordable, but I don't know any trustable reviews. I've gotten a few of your suggestions before such as the Vsonic VC02 last year, only to discover the sound to be quite lacking in detail and have it fall apart.
> 
> ...


 
 klipsch x5, x10


----------



## John Q Lin

what do you guys think about the LZ A4 IEM on massdrop.com. compare to the Noble X and T20i. 

I'm still a noob on IEMs. currently I have the RHA T20i as my go to IEM, and got the Noble X massdrop on the way. 

What IEMs should I be looking into? any suggestion would be great.

Thanks.


----------



## DecentLevi

loomisjohnson said:


> klipsch x5, x10


 

 Thanks, I ordered the Klipsch x5, and Spin Fit tips for hopefully better isolation than the included tips


----------



## loomisjohnson

decentlevi said:


> Thanks, I ordered the Klipsch x5, and Spin Fit tips for hopefully better isolation than the included tips


 

 great--let us know your impressions. personally, i've had good luck with comply-type foams, which seal well and attenuate the bass--the x5 actually have good lowend impact for a single ba


----------



## DecentLevi

Will do, however all of the Balanced Armature earphones I've tried before were too muddy / lifeless for my preferences so don't be surprised if I don't like it. Just thought I'd give the Klipsch X5 a chance anyway based on the reviews. Yeah I've been a Comply man for IEMs, but this time wanted to give a try to different type of aftermarket tips.


----------



## Raketen

decentlevi said:


> Will do, however all of the Balanced Armature earphones I've tried before were too muddy / lifeless for my preferences so don't be surprised if I don't like it. Just thought I'd give the Klipsch X5 a chance anyway based on the reviews. Yeah I've been a Comply man for IEMs, but this time wanted to give a try to different type of aftermarket tips.




I think it is hard to beat Etymotic triple-flange tip IEMs for total isolation though, I used the ER6 at work for a long time. If you strugle with them perhaps you could try custom tips? Ety have a specific service for this but there are some companies like Snugs that can make for most IEM.


----------



## EAPOCS

How do the Titan 1 / Ex1 compare to the SoundMagic E80?


----------



## DecentLevi

@loomisjohnson and anyone
  
 Incoming today were my Klipsch x5 earphones. Packaging was good, build quality of earphones are good, except the cable is so thin it leads me to believe better fidelity could be missing... and the ladder point would be my overall synopsis of the sound: something is undoubtedly lacking - in a massive way.
  
 To start out with the positives, the voicing is OK and it's non-fatiguing. Other than that, as is my experience with all balanced armatur's, it's super muddy/swampy with an enormous void where the details should be, meaning that the mid-bass is very dominant, the treble both acutely recessed and rolled off early, the dynamics are lacking impact, and the speed is far slower than natural. These earbuds were not responsive to EQ'ing of the high frequencies above 4khz, therefore don't seem to have the capacity to reproduce high frequencies more than in a very nuance / passive way. The soundstage is at least if not below iPod earbuds, and the dynamics are definitely short of those free earbuds as well. Bass definition is sub-bar at best, hence my description as muddy/swampy, leaving you with no more than a very artificial sounding one-note bass response.
  
 Testing was done with my FiiO X5 DAP using well mastered lossless songs of various genres that I'm very familiar with, in both H / L gain modes. I tried the provided double flange, and medium / large silicon tips and made sure to insert deepy for optimal seal / sound. Despite the above awful review, I will still give these a fair chance at work because the very dark and non-fatiguing sound may be suitable for long hours in a noisy environment. Overall though I would rate the usefulness of these earbuds to be not good enough for anything such as casual walks / commute or at home listening, but only OK for a noisy industrial type of setting. The free Samsung / iPhone earbuds have undoubdedly better details and dynamics, but at least these have better isolation.
  
 I'd put the overall performance at around 5% as good as my $3k home hi-fi headphone rig, and would not classify these as "audiophile" earphones in any way. The closest sound signature these seem to resemble from a large headphone would be vaguely similar the Fischer Audio FA-003. Still however I'll give these a chance with my incoming Spinfit eartips. Needless to say, I'm closing the books on balanced armature drivers as this is the 3rd such B.A. earphone I've listened to which has had nearly identical results as low performers. Personally I would say balanced armetures is a flawed technology that is not suitable for sound reproduction - as far as I have heard at least.


----------



## B9Scrambler

DecentLevi If the Klipsche doesn't work out, and it sounds like it won't, return it and give the new Brainwavz B100 a good. They're far from lacking detail and extension (both ends).


----------



## DecentLevi

Thanks however my experience has been that most IEMs don't fit in my ears, with a possible exception of universal fit, and that was my main reason I was seeking a long straight form earphone


----------



## Raketen

.


----------



## lordsinister

Hello All and Happy New Year!
  
@ljokerl, @twister6, @Brooko and others - While most probably haven't listen to the Superlux HD668B, for anyone who has, are you able to list any IEM that can deliver the same level of sound and yes I know I'm comparing an IEM to a full can?  I paid $67 CDN for the HD668B and have falling in love with the overall sound but none of my recent IEMs (almost 5 times $) are able to match it's capabilities but hoping the LZ A4 or Trinity PM6 are able to.  The only IEM that comes a bit close is the Trinity Delta II with purple damped filters but lacks some of the excitement and details / textures.
  
 Current IEMS:
 Trinity Audio PM4, Delta I and II
 Dunu DN2000 and Titan I
 Teos Altone200 and H-150
 Zero Audio DUOZA (ZH-DWX10)
  
 Coming soon:
 Trinity Audio PM6 and new Master
 LZ A4
  
 Anyways, just throwing this out there just in case you came across an IEM to blew you away in comparison on a full size can.
  
 Many thanks.


----------



## loomisjohnson

decentlevi said:


> @loomisjohnson and anyone
> 
> Incoming today were my Klipsch x5 earphones. Packaging was good, build quality of earphones are good, except the cable is so thin it leads me to believe better fidelity could be missing... and the ladder point would be my overall synopsis of the sound: something is undoubtedly lacking - in a massive way.
> 
> ...


 

 i'm sorry these didn't work out for you. after reading your impressions i pulled out my pair to refresh mine and while we all hear things differently, i just don't hear the swampy/muddy quality. they are warmish, but to my ears the bass is fairly etched and quick and they have good overall clarity. i agree the high end isn't very extended or enhanced--they're quite midrange focused--which could be the lack of dynamics you refer to.  correspondingly, they don't get strident or fatiguging. in any case, i hoe you can exchange them for something more to your liking.


----------



## B9Scrambler

decentlevi said:


> Thanks however my experience has been that most IEMs don't fit in my ears, with a possible exception of universal fit, and that was my main reason I was seeking a long straight form earphone


 
  
 I understand, but the housings are quite compact and they have a very long, thin nozzle. They also weigh next to nothing. Ergonomics are pretty impressive in my experience. But, I get they don't fit within the form factor you're looking for. Still might be worth consideration anyway.


----------



## DecentLevi

@loomisjohnson thanks for your help but those Klipsch X5 IEM's just aren't for me. I gave them a fair chance for a second day at work, with a pair of large Spin Fit tips. Surprisingly these did increase the treble clarity and dynamics somewhat, but I still found these so muddy / boomy / non-detailed that I couldn't even stand to listen for longer than 45 minutes, even in a noisy factory setting. I'm certain I had a snug fit, but sometimes the sound was so lackluster that I couldn't even understand vocals from those.
  
 OTOH I still have my RHA S500, which are less than 1/3rd the price with clarity, dynamics and overall resolution enormously better, not to mention greatly superior build / cable quality. I may recommend you to try those instead. I was looking elsewhere in hopes that I could get something with better isolation since all the bass was being drowned out by the background noise (even with large Comply foam tips), so on 2nd thought I wouldn't mind a recommendation for a long narrow shaped earphone - or universal fit - that is somewhat bass heavy yet detailed / clear and well isolating...


----------



## moneywoes

what would you guys say is the most I have to spend to get something with volume control + a mic? I look at the piston 3 but its gone everywhere


----------



## Raketen

moneywoes said:


> what would you guys say is the most I have to spend to get something with volume control + a mic? I look at the piston 3 but its gone everywhere




Probably 10-15usd? If you don't need isolation, VE Monk+ w/ 3 button mic is $10

Some of the rec's from Joker's guide have 1-buttons at least: http://theheadphonelist.com/earphone-buyers-guide/
I've never used these but lots of budget options here some probably have mics : https://audiobudget.com/leaderboard.php


----------



## Old_Snake

leconducteur said:


> Any IEM's for portable and desktop use ?
> - over the ear IEM
> - non-cheap build quality
> - really good isolation
> ...




Give the RHA T20 a listen.


----------



## dakanao

What are some IEMs under $100 that have a great and easy fit, with a balanced, natural sound sig?
  
 I have the KC06 right now, and while I'm perfectly happy with it's sound, the right piece keeps falling out of my ear due to a bad fit.


----------



## Jill

dakanao said:


> What are some IEMs under $100 that have a great and easy fit, with a balanced, natural sound sig?
> 
> I have the KC06 right now, and while I'm perfectly happy with it's sound, the right piece keeps falling out of my ear due to a bad fit.


 
  
 Zero Audio Carbo Tenore
  
https://smile.amazon.com/AUDIO-ear-stereo-headphone-Tenore-ZH-DX200-CT/dp/B0093VVP0Q/
  
 Also available on eBay.


----------



## MidFiMoney

dakanao said:


> What are some IEMs under $100 that have a great and easy fit, with a balanced, natural sound sig?
> 
> I have the KC06 right now, and while I'm perfectly happy with it's sound, the right piece keeps falling out of my ear due to a bad fit.


 
 VSonic GR07
  
 Make sure you get the 2016 version.


----------



## timber

I'm looking for a sub $500 IEM.  I will be using these unamped out of my Pixel as well as out of my MacBook Air.
 Musical tastes include acoustic, pop, rap, r&b.
 I have a pair of DT770 80ohm and while I like the sound signature, I wish they had a little more thump on the bottom end.
  
 Recently bought a pair of Shure SE535LTD-J since Shure 's IEMs fit comfortably.  LOVE the sparkly mids, but they are a little light on the low end.
 Are there other options I should be considering before keeping these?


----------



## John Q Lin

What are the best IEMs in term of value.


----------



## B9Scrambler

john q lin said:


> What are the best IEMs in term of value.


 
  
 Ooooo....that's a loaded question, haha.


----------



## ngoshawk

timber said:


> I'm looking for a sub $500 IEM.  I will be using these unamped out of my Pixel as well as out of my MacBook Air.
> Musical tastes include acoustic, pop, rap, r&b.
> I have a pair of DT770 80ohm and while I like the sound signature, I wish they had a little more thump on the bottom end.
> 
> ...




I have had (and still do) good luck with both the FLC8S and the Vibro Labs Aria. The FLC8S are significantly under $500, and a refurbished Aria can be had for less, too. New they are $499.

The FLC8S filter system is quite good, and I enjoy a filter system with good bass. The Aria is a fuller sound with good tight bass, which MIGHT not reach as far down by which I like more.

And these opinions can be taken with a grain....I like both quite a bit, savor good bass, and an excellent sound signature; while not having an overwhelming treble.

Hope this helps.


----------



## 1TrickPony

b9scrambler said:


> Ooooo....that's a loaded question, haha.





he did refer to the plural form. have him look into everything!top ten lists!


----------



## ezekiel77

timber said:


> I'm looking for a sub $500 IEM.  I will be using these unamped out of my Pixel as well as out of my MacBook Air.
> Musical tastes include acoustic, pop, rap, r&b.


 
  
 +1 for FLC8S, I've had one and adored the comfort, sound and configurability. Some niggles might be, easy to lose tuning parts, and niche potantially hard to find replacement cables.
  
 Other mid-fi darlings at the moment include iBasso IT03 and the LZA4, but I haven't heard either.


----------



## ElcomeSoft

Considering spending about £150 hard limit on earphones to replace my third dead pair of B2's. 

With Comply's and minor EQ'ing taming the highs and sibilance of the B2's on my Fiio X1, they were a great pair of earphones matched with my most played genres (rock/metal/pop/not bass heavy electronic/violin-heavy pieces).

My RE-400's and RE-00's don't really cut it, even though they are both competent and enjoyable in their own right.

The immediate standouts are older models like the TripleFi 10 and the Dunu DN-1000 which come in around £130 but I've intentionally stayed away from here to avoid being tempted into "better than the B2" bug so I'm lacking in 'modern' IEM knowledge.

As most of my IEM's end up failing at the cable end so the famous TF10 does sound alluring and I think that I've biased myself towards them for that reason.

I'd also consider getting my B2's cable repaired or replaced but don't know of any UK business that would have the experience to do this kind of thing... Plus it sounds quite expensive too.


----------



## Raketen

elcomesoft said:


> Considering spending about £150 hard limit on earphones to replace my third dead pair of B2's.
> 
> With Comply's and minor EQ'ing taming the highs and sibilance of the B2's on my Fiio X1, they were a great pair of earphones matched with my most played genres (rock/metal/pop/not bass heavy electronic/violin-heavy pieces).
> 
> ...




I'd say qJays (similar design to B2 but with excellent build quality and modular cable) but with the pound being down maybe not an option at the moment. Audio Technica IM02 are great if you don't mind big shells (I did). 

Seems like there are tons of options in this price range these days though... actually Brainwavz just started making BA iems again- I guess the B200 would be the B2 successor but thye also have the B100 and B150 http://www.head-fi.org/t/831015/brainwavz-b200-dual-armature-iem


----------



## ElcomeSoft

raketen said:


> With the £ down these might not be an option for this budget at the moment but Jays qJays? I also use Complys or Olives with these to prevent sibilance. Like B2 they are dual-BA, have excellent build quality and detachable cable.
> 
> More affordably the Audio Technica IM02 if your ears dont' mind bigger shells (personally found them rather uncomfortable). Also dual-bA also detachable cable.
> 
> ...




Thanks for the response.

The Ath IM02's are hovering at £175 and Q-jays are £220+ over here, both definitely out of my 'budget'.

Got them both saved in my list to keep an eye on anyway.


----------



## Raketen

elcomesoft said:


> Thanks for the response.
> 
> The Ath IM02's are hovering at £175 and Q-jays are £220+ over here, both definitely out of my 'budget'.
> 
> Got them both saved in my list to keep an eye on anyway.




Oh sorry then.... actually just edited my post, mentioned Brainwavz are making new b2 followup series B100-200.
Zero Audio Doppio are quite decent Dual-BA as well, only 120 us, though the cable is fixed and doesn't inspire confidence (didn't have them long enough to find out).


----------



## ElcomeSoft

raketen said:


> Oh sorry then.... actually just edited my post, mentioned Brainwavz are making new b2 followup series B100-200.
> Zero Audio Doppio are quite decent Dual-BA as well, only 120 us, though the cable is fixed and doesn't inspire confidence (didn't have them long enough to find out).


 
  
 Thanks again. The B200 is sitting on the Brainwavz Site at £146.
  
 Time to scout around for reviews/previews then prices. Immediate check seems to suggest that the B200 isn't the B2 replacement, and that Brainwavz have another set of monitors up their sleeves.
  
 I love and hate research


----------



## damobananna

Whats the gos on the in ear sd4s?
 thought I might find something here but no love at all?


----------



## Zenbun (Apr 27, 2017)

Is there any IEM that's not fatiguing, and excel in electronic, female vocals and metal in the 100-150 USD range?

1more triple? one of the RHAs? Anything else?


----------



## damobananna

Zenbun said:


> Is there any IEM that's not fatiguing, and excel in electronic, female vocals and metal in the 100-150 USD range?
> 
> 1more triple? one of the RHAs? Anything else?



gro7 yo


----------



## Zenbun

damobananna said:


> gro7 yo


I don't like VSonic sound signature, their highs are piercing and you can't listen to them for more than an hour.


----------



## damobananna

you burn them in?


----------



## Zenbun

damobananna said:


> you burn them in?



I have the GR06, even after years of use they're still like that, I read that's the sound signature of all the VSonics.


----------



## kova4a

Zenbun said:


> Is there any IEM that's not fatiguing, and excel in electronic, female vocals and metal in the 100-150 USD range?
> 
> 1more triple? one of the RHAs? Anything else?


Brainwavz R3


----------



## B9Scrambler

Fish


Zenbun said:


> Is there any IEM that's not fatiguing, and excel in electronic, female vocals and metal in the 100-150 USD range?
> 
> 1more triple? one of the RHAs? Anything else?



Fischer Audio Dubliz Enhanced. Might be a little tame in the treble but you can up that easily enough.

https://www.head-fi.org/f/threads/fischer-audio-dubliz-enhanced-ready-to-dual-review.845661/


----------



## Zenbun

kova4a said:


> Brainwavz R3


Looks like its discontiued.



B9Scrambler said:


> Fish
> 
> 
> Fischer Audio Dubliz Enhanced. Might be a little tame in the treble but you can up that easily enough.
> ...



How do they compare with the 1more triple and RHA 750?


----------



## B9Scrambler

No idea as I haven't heard either, but there are eight comparisons at the end of that first post. Maybe one of them would work? I'm guessing the Audbos K3 comparo would be the most relevant based on the reviews I've read of the 1more and 750.


----------



## Ramkrish0404

Can you please help me narrow down on an IEM from the below list? 
Am looking for more natural sound stage IEM in max $100 range(the below list includes the cheaper ones too).

1. Shure SE215
2. Sennheiser Momentum M2 IEi 
3.  Audio Technica Sonic Fuel ATH-CKX9iS
4. Byron Wired Premium In-Ear
5. Meze 12 Classics GunMetal premium high fidelity wooden earphones IEM's 
6. soundmagic e10s
7. MEE Audio M6 Pro 
8. Xiaomi Piston 3
9. zero audio tenores
10. Kz ATE


----------



## Ver JJ

Ramkrish0404 said:


> Can you please help me narrow down on an IEM from the below list?
> Am looking for more natural sound stage IEM in max $100 range(the below list includes the cheaper ones too).



Why not consider etymotic research earphones, they are somewhat neutral with somewhat lack of bass like the HF5.


----------



## B9Scrambler

Ramkrish0404 said:


> Can you please help me narrow down on an IEM from the below list?
> Am looking for more natural sound stage IEM in max $100 range(the below list includes the cheaper ones too).
> 
> 1. Shure SE215
> ...



If you're open to or able to consider other options, definitely look into the TFZ Exclusive King. Large soundstage with great imaging, separation, etc. Only heard a few from that list, but the 12 Classics and ATE are solid earphones. If you wanted to save a few bucks the 11 Neo is a good one too. Very similar to the 12 Classics in overall sound signature and quality.


----------



## damobananna

westone has a new single ba out too


----------



## John Q Lin

FLC8S vs LZA4 vs RHA T20 vs Massdrop x Noble vs VSonic GR07 bass edition
how would you all rank them in term of sound quality? and which has the same sound sig?
Thanks in Advance for all the inputs


----------



## ruffruff

Hi Guys,

I am currently using ATH-IM03 with reference copper line 2.5mm adapter to DP-X1A. Any suitable recommended IEM upgrades? Price is not of a concern now as this will be a long term goal till my IM03 is dead.

Thanks in advance!


----------



## gearofwar

ruffruff said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I am currently using ATH-IM03 with reference copper line 2.5mm adapter to DP-X1A. Any suitable recommended IEM upgrades? Price is not of a concern now as this will be a long term goal till my IM03 is dead.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


considering you want to keep dpxa and that ath iem, get PWaudio 1960 4 wires, top cable now


----------



## ruffruff

gearofwar said:


> considering you want to keep dpxa and that ath iem, get PWaudio 1960 4 wires, top cable now



thanks for the recommendation. I don't think i will spend on another cable for IM03 now. It's been with me for a few years now, not sure how long will it further last. So, i am planning for the next IEM upgrade.


----------



## ezekiel77

ruffruff said:


> thanks for the recommendation. I don't think i will spend on another cable for IM03 now. It's been with me for a few years now, not sure how long will it further last. So, i am planning for the next IEM upgrade.



It's been awhile since I've heard IM03, I remember it being a bit warm with nice mids and smooth treble. An upgrade for this, my best guess would be 64 Audio A12 bcos it has roughly the same signature but about two tiers higher.

What do you think @PinkyPowers? Would A12 fit the bill or do you have any suggestions?


----------



## PinkyPowers

ezekiel77 said:


> It's been awhile since I've heard IM03, I remember it being a bit warm with nice mids and smooth treble. An upgrade for this, my best guess would be 64 Audio A12 bcos it has roughly the same signature but about two tiers higher.
> 
> What do you think @PinkyPowers? Would A12 fit the bill or do you have any suggestions?



It's also two tiers warmer, so it might not be what he's looking for. The Rhapsodio Solar is closer, I've always felt.


----------



## ruffruff

ezekiel77 said:


> It's been awhile since I've heard IM03, I remember it being a bit warm with nice mids and smooth treble. An upgrade for this, my best guess would be 64 Audio A12 bcos it has roughly the same signature but about two tiers higher.
> 
> What do you think @PinkyPowers? Would A12 fit the bill or do you have any suggestions?





PinkyPowers said:


> It's also two tiers warmer, so it might not be what he's looking for. The Rhapsodio Solar is closer, I've always felt.



Thanks guys for the recommendation. Based on the reviews, both of them indeed are within my liking. I love natural and warm sound signature with smooth treble. Hopefully both are available in Singapore so that I can do a test drive.


----------



## Raketen (Jul 21, 2017)

ruffruff said:


> Thanks guys for the recommendation. Based on the reviews, both of them indeed are within my liking. I love natural and warm sound signature with smooth treble. Hopefully both are available in Singapore so that I can do a test drive.



IDK IM03 and I wouldn't make these suggestions if you couldn't demo, but:

If lucky enough to come across some Aurisonics Rockets.
Maybe not "warm", but I like Earsonics ES2's smooth, spacious sound.
Tricky to fit which can cause some peaky treble, but with the right tips/source the Panasonic RP-HDE10-S is really pleasant for that type of sound IMO.

ICYMI, since the IM03 Audio Technica has also released series with the E70, and the LS300 which also have 3xBA drivers.


----------



## FunkDrummer

The E40's are super great IEM's for the price! You get dual push pull drivers for under $100 dollars!


----------



## mmedeiro

Hey guys, Im looking to move on from my Sen IE80s. I'm looking for a similar sound signature but with more mid bass punch. I'm looking to spend in the 250 to 350 region. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## Raketen

mmedeiro said:


> Hey guys, Im looking to move on from my Sen IE80s. I'm looking for a similar sound signature but with more mid bass punch. I'm looking to spend in the 250 to 350 region. Any help would be greatly appreciated.



More midbass than the ie80? That's a scary thought! Midbassiest headphone I've ever used, at least...


----------



## damobananna (Aug 10, 2017)

aurisonics asg2
lovly iems with tunable bass huge soundstage and lush vocal perfect apart from the treble lacks a tiny bit of energy at least 3 times as good as the ie8's


----------



## listen4joy

as the site design has changed its look like many good foolks left the site, the thread not like they used to be, many less replies and news about new stuff and reviews, its looks like 
*ljokerl has gone and left the site too, if it so it so shame he help so many people out there including me, i hope he come back and do reviews about new stuff.*


----------



## BB 808

It's been a while since |joker| has posted here but you can always check out his website


----------



## Raketen

listen4joy said:


> as the site design has changed its look like many good foolks left the site, the thread not like they used to be, many less replies and news about new stuff and reviews, its looks like
> *ljokerl has gone and left the site too, if it so it so shame he help so many people out there including me, i hope he come back and do reviews about new stuff.*



I think he his still reviewing occasionally - posted a review of the Earsonics ES3 on theheadphonelist a few months ago: http://theheadphonelist.com/headphone_review/earsonics-es3-in-ear-earphone-review/


----------



## PinkyPowers

Joker still runs the site, and is active with the Facebook page and still takes review requests from manufacturers and passes them on to us authors. But he isn't reviewing much right now, and that's a large reason why me and Ryan were brought on.


----------



## Wyville

PinkyPowers said:


> Joker still runs the site, and is active with the Facebook page and still takes review requests from manufacturers and passes them on to us authors. But he isn't reviewing much right now, and that's a large reason why me and Ryan were brought on.


And you are both doing an amazing job, producing a large number of complementary, quality reviews! 

BTW, The Dodocool 3D tag-team reviews were hilarious when you read Ryan's review and yours back-to-back. Really showed off Ryan's particular reviewing talents and Pinky's complete lack of patience with cheap rubbish.


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## gazzington

I have just bought a cayin n3 for work and am seeking earbuds under £150 to listen to mainly classic rock. Anybody know what earplugs have good synergy with the cayin?


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## wolfxomg

I don't see him replying since March of 2017, I hope he does that soon, Many people's lives are better thanks to him, Every IEM I bought was based off his reviews and take on the product & always found that the way he describes them, Perfection.


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## John Q Lin

Hi guys what would you recommend to use in a gym. I busted my rha 750i while in the gym. Don't want to use t20 for the gym. What ear buds are the cheapest solution


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## loomisjohnson

John Q Lin said:


> Hi guys what would you recommend to use in a gym. I busted my rha 750i while in the gym. Don't want to use t20 for the gym. What ear buds are the cheapest solution


memt x5 or kz zs3


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## BB 808

John Q Lin said:


> Hi guys what would you recommend to use in a gym. I busted my rha 750i while in the gym. Don't want to use t20 for the gym. What ear buds are the cheapest solution


Venture Electronics Monk $5


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## suman134

John Q Lin said:


> Hi guys what would you recommend to use in a gym. I busted my rha 750i while in the gym. Don't want to use t20 for the gym. What ear buds are the cheapest solution


Go with KZ ZS5, ZS3 or something with removable cables on cheap. If you want to maintain decency I will say go for TFZ Series 4 or mee audio M7 pro if you can spend around $150, M7 pro comes with two cables.


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## John Q Lin

Hi Guys I just purchased this from Amazon for about $11, Is it any good?

1MORE E1009-SV Piston Fit In-Ear Headphones 
*Link*
https://www.amazon.com/1MORE-E1009-...I0YS/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8&th=1

I've also purchased 
*MEE Audio M6 PRO* For $20

*I plan to use them for workouts and beaters. What do you guys think of those two? I'm still very new to earphones, did I purchased crap?*


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## John Q Lin

LZ4A vs Pinnacle 1 vs Noble X massdrop Vs RHA t20 anyone? how would you rank them?


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## ngoshawk

John Q Lin said:


> Hi Guys I just purchased this from Amazon for about $11, Is it any good?
> 
> 1MORE E1009-SV Piston Fit In-Ear Headphones
> *Link*
> ...


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## John Q Lin

I have the noble x mass drop and rha t20, how would the UE900S compare?


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## John Q Lin (Nov 29, 2017)

I have the noble x massdrop, rha t20, UE900S. How does the hifiman re400, re600, 1more trip, 1more quad driver, pinnacle px1 compare? Anyone care to common thanks


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## ivo001

Hi, I was looking at your Headphonelist website.
Are the scores in the Multi-IEM comparison list still accurate, or are they outdated as some reviews are from 2012/2013?
While looking for <$100 IEM the JVC HA-FXT90 seems to be decent, and is listed as $78.
However when I check Ebay, it looks to be available for just $25? Are these fakes? Are these considered now that great anymore compared to 2017 products in the same price range? Is this a crazy deal?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/JVC-HA-FXT...hash=item3add6c402am5loWYrf9gyehH_SVuPEuHg


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## Arkady Duntov

ivo001 said:


> Hi, I was looking at your Headphonelist website.
> Are the scores in the Multi-IEM comparison list still accurate, or are they outdated as some reviews are from 2012/2013?
> While looking for <$100 IEM the JVC HA-FXT90 seems to be decent, and is listed as $78.
> However when I check Ebay, it looks to be available for just $25? Are these fakes? Are these considered now that great anymore compared to 2017 products in the same price range? Is this a crazy deal?
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/JVC-HA-FXT...hash=item3add6c402am5loWYrf9gyehH_SVuPEuHg



Joker has a great review list, but I don't believe he's still maintaining it.

I can't speak to the JVC HA-FXT90, however.


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## DopeMusic

Hello everyone, I'm willing to buy an in-ear spending € 100, maximum 150€. Could anyone recommend something that is perhaps available on Amazon? (Italy) At the moment I own the Sennheiser HD 598 that I love. I would need something more portable and above all give me a good isolation from external noise!
I hope someone can help me, I thank you in advance.


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## Zelda

what kind of sound you're looking for?


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## PinkyPowers

DopeMusic said:


> Hello everyone, I'm willing to buy an in-ear spending € 100, maximum 150€. Could anyone recommend something that is perhaps available on Amazon? (Italy) At the moment I own the Sennheiser HD 598 that I love. I would need something more portable and above all give me a good isolation from external noise!
> I hope someone can help me, I thank you in advance.



Best IEM I've heard in your price range is the iBasso IT01. A marvel of soundstage, detail, and clarity. With good, deep, satisfying bass.


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## Lifted Andreas

DopeMusic said:


> Hello everyone, I'm willing to buy an in-ear spending € 100, maximum 150€. Could anyone recommend something that is perhaps available on Amazon? (Italy) At the moment I own the Sennheiser HD 598 that I love. I would need something more portable and above all give me a good isolation from external noise!
> I hope someone can help me, I thank you in advance.





PinkyPowers said:


> Best IEM I've heard in your price range is the iBasso IT01. A marvel of soundstage, detail, and clarity. With good, deep, satisfying bass.



+1

iBasso It01 is a banging choice.


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## headdict

DopeMusic said:


> Hello everyone, I'm willing to buy an in-ear spending € 100, maximum 150€. Could anyone recommend something that is perhaps available on Amazon? (Italy) At the moment I own the Sennheiser HD 598 that I love. I would need something more portable and *above all give me a good isolation from external noise!*
> I hope someone can help me, I thank you in advance.


How about Etymotic? Did you check joker's 2016 buyer's guide?


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## deco cat

How about KZ?


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## youngbbx

Does anyone still own a Sound Magic E30? I'm looking for a replacement IEM with a similar sound signature. Please help!


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## gryphon1911

DopeMusic said:


> Hello everyone, I'm willing to buy an in-ear spending € 100, maximum 150€. Could anyone recommend something that is perhaps available on Amazon? (Italy) At the moment I own the Sennheiser HD 598 that I love. I would need something more portable and above all give me a good isolation from external noise!
> I hope someone can help me, I thank you in advance.



I just picked up a pair of RHA MA750 Wireless for USD $117, which is roughly 104 Euros.   They were tinny and shallow sounding with the default and spin tips, but once I put in the Comply tips - golden!!  Not as bright as my Dunu DN-2000J with Comply tips, but pretty close.  I would say that the mids and highs a little laid back and the bass is present but not bass-heady.

12 hour battery life is nice to have a well on the MA750's.
https://www.amazon.com/RHA-MA750-Wireless-Earphones-Ear/dp/B074QKN9YL


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## Hannah25 (Apr 17, 2019)

Joker still runs the site, and is active with the Facebook page and still takes review requests from manufacturers and passes them on to us authors. But he isn't reviewing much right now, and that's a large reason why me and Ryan were brought on.


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## D3Seeker

Finally caved to my long standing curiosity and purchased the UE 500 (also because I wanted to stop abusing my IM-70 in the gym lol)

What can I say? Well to me they are infuriatingly flat. Very speaker like with an interestingly wide soundstage. Everything seems to have room to do it's thing, to a point. Highs feel meh, nearly simulated. Same with bass. It's there, semi on point and punchy-esq? It's almost like they don't actually play in their frequency range, as though everything is mid squashed, or so wide and far apart on stage that everything sorta dulls to me. Just no energy.


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## suman134

D3Seeker said:


> Finally caved to my long standing curiosity and purchased the UE 500 (also because I wanted to stop abusing my IM-70 in the gym lol)
> 
> What can I say? Well to me they are infuriatingly flat. Very speaker like with an interestingly wide soundstage. Everything seems to have room to do it's thing, to a point. Highs feel meh, nearly simulated. Same with bass. It's there, semi on point and punchy-esq? It's almost like they don't actually play in their frequency range, as though everything is mid squashed, or so wide and far apart on stage that everything sorta dulls to me. Just no energy.


You were expecting plenty out of a 7 years old IEM. Going for something like the TRN V30 or TFZ T2 would have made more sense.


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## suman134

D3Seeker said:


> Finally caved to my long standing curiosity and purchased the UE 500 (also because I wanted to stop abusing my IM-70 in the gym lol)
> 
> What can I say? Well to me they are infuriatingly flat. Very speaker like with an interestingly wide soundstage. Everything seems to have room to do it's thing, to a point. Highs feel meh, nearly simulated. Same with bass. It's there, semi on point and punchy-esq? It's almost like they don't actually play in their frequency range, as though everything is mid squashed, or so wide and far apart on stage that everything sorta dulls to me. Just no energy.


You were expecting plenty out of a 7 years old IEM. Going for something like the TRN V30 or TFZ T2 would have made more sense.


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## Joe Bloggs

D3Seeker said:


> Finally caved to my long standing curiosity and purchased the UE 500 (also because I wanted to stop abusing my IM-70 in the gym lol)
> 
> What can I say? Well to me they are infuriatingly flat. Very speaker like with an interestingly wide soundstage. Everything seems to have room to do it's thing, to a point. Highs feel meh, nearly simulated. Same with bass. It's there, semi on point and punchy-esq? It's almost like they don't actually play in their frequency range, as though everything is mid squashed, or so wide and far apart on stage that everything sorta dulls to me. Just no energy.


Sounds like everything will become perfect if you turn the volume up a few or a few dozen notches.


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## D3Seeker

Joe Bloggs said:


> Sounds like everything will become perfect if you turn the volume up a few or a few dozen notches.


I was thinking this lol, but no dice. Just loud and lifeless


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## vipervick

Have anyone tried the XD200 Multi Driver Deep Bass Noise Isolating Professional Earbuds? I got them free from The Modern Almanac, only paid shipping. My gut tells me you get what you pay for. However, they sounded decent if a bit weird upon arrival. I have them on my computer at home right now pushing pink noise. I figure a day or so of burn in could help. The fit is strange, as they don't come with any replacement tips. If feels as if they don't go all the way into the ear canal. And the sound was weird. It made recordings sound "live". I'm listening to FLAC on a FiiO x7 ii. I'm a headphone noob, so I really don't know what I'm hearing. I'll revisit when it's been on for a day or 2. 

Also, I listen to so much good stuff that I don't have 1 good song that I compare headphones to. I need one. 

XD200


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## D3Seeker

You know what I also noticed.... the ue500 gets very coongested. If you listen to anything that goes beyond the basic ensemble (symphonic death metals in my case) the drivers fumble. They just cant keep up  with all that's going on. Things tend till pop in even at times. Thank goodness these are gym throw aways (and out of production lol) the ue days are gone.


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## sd1239

where is joker now ??? look like he is gone ????


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## GreenJay

sd1239 said:


> where is joker now ??? look like he is gone ????


Yes.This list and his contribution to the headphonelist site were so valuable for us.. Where is he now? @ClieOS and others are still around.


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## Aguilareric

Does anyone know if the flc8s is still a good investment for today's standards of iems


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## Fat Larry (Sep 26, 2020)

GreenJay said:


> Yes.This list and his contribution to the headphonelist site were so valuable for us.. Where is he now? @ClieOS and others are still around.



This is a necro move but this thread came up in search just did and well... obviously he's moved on. Jokers stuff was invaluable to me early on, i can't remember how i found it but it was his lists that pointed me towards the GR07 and got me going on this IEM thing that's provided years of listening enjoyment, deepened my relationship with music and made travel and work a million times better.  

I just had a look at his quick reference for iems under $50 and it's looking quite out of date imo. There are many more interesting options available at the moment.


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## Vrqwe

prompt the most natural / with the most natural tone transmission in-ear monitors up to $ 300


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## dakanao

Vrqwe said:


> prompt the most natural / with the most natural tone transmission in-ear monitors up to $ 300


Aurisonics Rockets with reversed Comply T eartips if you don’t mind a flat bass, Final E5000 with reversed Comply eartips if you like a balanced sound with some bass emphasis.


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## sd1239

Fat Larry said:


> This is a necro move but this thread came up in search just did and well... obviously he's moved on. Jokers stuff was invaluable to me early on, i can't remember how i found it but it was his lists that pointed me towards the GR07 and got me going on this IEM thing that's provided years of listening enjoyment, deepened my relationship with music and made travel and work a million times better.
> 
> I just had a look at his quick reference for iems under $50 and it's looking quite out of date imo. There are many more interesting options available at the moment.


But so sad he didnt even make a sound on web anymore


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## NymPHONOmaniac (Jul 21, 2021)

Fat Larry said:


> This is a necro move but this thread came up in search just did and well... obviously he's moved on. Jokers stuff was invaluable to me early on, i can't remember how i found it but it was his lists that pointed me towards the GR07 and got me going on this IEM thing that's provided years of listening enjoyment, deepened my relationship with music and made travel and work a million times better.
> 
> I just had a look at his quick reference for iems under $50 and it's looking quite out of date imo. There are many more interesting options available at the moment.


burial.
just saying.
and HZsound Heart Mirrror if you want to try the best sub-100$ iem that as been around since 1 year.


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## efejoao

dakanao said:


> Aurisonics Rockets with reversed Comply T eartips if you don’t mind a flat bass, Final E5000 with reversed Comply eartips if you like a balanced sound with some bass emphasis.


I prefer the Drop JVC HA-FDX1. In my opinion, and with the right source (SP1K), is the most natural thing I ever heard for the price (under $300)


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## dakanao

efejoao said:


> I prefer the Drop JVC HA-FDX1. In my opinion, and with the right source (SP1K), is the most natural thing I ever heard for the price (under $300)


Have you heard Aurisonics Rockets or the E5000?


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## Joe Bloggs

Fat Larry said:


> This is a necro move but this thread came up in search just did and well... obviously he's moved on. Jokers stuff was invaluable to me early on, i can't remember how i found it but it was his lists that pointed me towards the GR07 and got me going on this IEM thing that's provided years of listening enjoyment, deepened my relationship with music and made travel and work a million times better.
> 
> I just had a look at his quick reference for iems under $50 and it's looking quite out of date imo. There are many more interesting options available at the moment.


I just wonder if they're more interesting today because they're more talked about today, or because they actually sound better


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## 1clearhead

I just went back to check on several classic IEM's on 'Joker's' list. Until today, his list is still reliable. 
Cheers, old friend! 

-Clear


----------



## ss2625

1clearhead said:


> I just went back to check on several classic IEM's on 'Joker's' list. Until today, his list is still reliable.
> Cheers, old friend!
> 
> -Clear


i used his list a lot back in the day too. cheers to him indeed!


----------



## sd1239

this problem is 
is he still alive ????


----------



## yeboyi

Is this Joker?


----------



## gazzington

A joker come back would be awesome


----------



## ss2625

gazzington said:


> A joker come back would be awesome


It would be indeed


----------



## Joe Bloggs

yeboyi said:


> Is this Joker?



who?  Moondrop official?  Or someone in the video?


----------



## yeboyi

Joe Bloggs said:


> who?  Moondrop official?  Or someone in the video?


The guy at 4:14


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## Joe Bloggs

yeboyi said:


> The guy at 4:14


ljokerl's real name didn't read anything like Chinese to me


----------



## yeboyi

Joe Bloggs said:


> ljokerl's real name didn't read anything like Chinese to me


Is he from west ?


----------



## james444

yeboyi said:


> Is he from west ?


https://www.androidpolice.com/2010/...casts+-+Android+Police )&utm_content=FaceBook


----------



## Joe Bloggs

james444 said:


> https://www.androidpolice.com/2010/11/08/for-audiophiles-sub-100-mobile-headset-earbuds-mic-review-round-up-meelectronics-earbuds-giveaway-5x-pairs-200-value/? utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+AndroidPolice+(Android+News,+Reviews, +Applications,+Games,+Phones,+Devices,+Tips,+Hacks,+Videos,+Podcasts+-+Android+Police )&utm_content=FaceBook


Yep, Mikhail Lifshits.  I remember wondering what his surname actually stood for 😅


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